>
      > Folks,
      > This is where it is
      >
      http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/Articles%20Manuals%20etc/_8-19-2005/
      > Thanks
      > Nico
      >
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: <BertBerry1(at)aol.com>
      > To: 
      > Subject: Commander-List: 500B OCTOBER 1983 PILOT REPORT
      >
      >
      > >
      > > I just sent Nico the October 1983 Private Pilot Report on the 500B, so
      be
      > > looking for it.
      > >
      > > Thanks again Nico.
      > >
      > > Bert
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Re: 500B OCTOBER 1983 PILOT REPORT
Date: 
Aug 19, 2005
      
      
      I just read Kevin Murphy's article on the 500B and it is a wonder it made it
      past the editor's desk, in my not-always-humble opinion. Wasn't he supposed
      to write about the 500B and not his struggles with getting his ME-rating? Or
      his passion for singles? Or how his Cessna 210 beats a King Air? Is it even
      wise to do a ME-rating in a complex twin? I don't think so. It sure sounds
      like a more intelligent course of action to wind up the fans of an Apache or
      Duchess to get the gist of the thing before strapping something like a 500B
      onto one's cheeks.
      
      Even though his account was meant to be humorous, it doesn't help that he
      wrote allowing the airspeed to drop below VMC would cause the plane to drop
      out of the sky. ("... plummeting to earth without so much as a
      bye-the-bye.") Didn't his instructor demonstrate that, in a single engine
      configuration, the engine that kills you is the live one and throttling back
      on the live engine is a distinct (not necessarily desirable) option when
      having to fly close to VMC?
      
      I have a question for you guys who have more experience than I in these
      matters. Kevin wrote that above a certain altitude the 500B would spin
      before stalling (in SE config) but at a lower altitude it would stall before
      spinning. (I never liked referring to loss of control due to loss of VMC as
      spinning. Spinning an aircraft is caused by a distinct aerodynamic
      configuration, regardless of the number or type of engines.) Now, if we
      consider that the altitudes he speaks of here are between about 18,000' and
      sea level, how would that small layer of atmosphere cause the aerodynamic
      properties of the airframe to change that much? Surely, if an IAS (pressure)
      at sea level mandates a certain behavior of the airfoil, it would hardly
      change if that same IAS (pressure) is achieved at, say, 8,000'. The
      groundspeed would change, we know that, but the aerodynamic behavior? I
      don't get it.
      
      If he implied that the higher altitude would reduce the power, and therefore
      the effect, of the live engine causing a lower VMC at higher altitudes, I
      would agree, but then his language and, so it appears, his understanding of
      the mechanics of the phenomenon is lacking. On page 5, he said this, "A bit
      lower in altitude, the Commander will stall before it starts spinning..."
      That doesn't sound like he's referring to the engine's diminishing
      horsepower at higher altitudes.
      
      Anyway, if you throw a pair of hair-dryers into the nacelles, everything he
      said about this in his article is out the door. Am I missing something?
      
      Oh, one more thing. The takeoff procedure his instructor demonstrated, by
      pulling back on the stick before the takeoff run, so that the AC can rotate
      spontaneously, should surely increase the takeoff run because of the induced
      drag. I always favored my Commander's ability to remain neutral until a
      deliberate rotation is executed, because, so I believe, it accelerates in a
      much cleaner configuration. What say you?
      
      Thanks
      Nico
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: <BertBerry1(at)aol.com>
      Subject: Commander-List: 500B OCTOBER 1983 PILOT REPORT
      
      
      >
      > I just sent Nico the October 1983 Private Pilot Report on the 500B, so be
      > looking for it.
      >
      > Thanks again Nico.
      >
      > Bert
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Lowell Girod" <dongirod(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
500B OCTOBER 1983 PILOT REPORT
Date: 
Aug 19, 2005
      
      
      Nico;
      
      As I recall, when we were training or needed a stall speed, we went to the
      book and plugged in density altitude and gross weight, the chart would then
      give us a stall/stick shaker speed which was 10 Kts. above stall.  As for
      the take off maneuver, I always thought that is why you called out V1,
      go/no go speed for a balanced runway and Vr, as I recall was to rotate at
      one half degree per second until the desired angle on the flight director
      was achieved to maintain the second segment climb airspeed.  I think if
      holding the yoke back would have been the most desirable way to takeoff,
      the Boeing test pilots would have described that in the book, especially
      when performance is so critical.
      
      Did I remember that correct Jim & Bilbo.?  Sure hope this isn't a rating
      ride oral!
      
      Don
      
      
      > [Original Message]
      > From: nico css <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
      > To: 
      > Date: 8/19/2005 8:32:00 PM
      > Subject: Re: Commander-List: 500B OCTOBER 1983 PILOT REPORT
      >
      
      >
      > I just read Kevin Murphy's article on the 500B and it is a wonder it made
      it
      > past the editor's desk, in my not-always-humble opinion. Wasn't he
      supposed
      > to write about the 500B and not his struggles with getting his ME-rating?
      Or
      > his passion for singles? Or how his Cessna 210 beats a King Air? Is it
      even
      > wise to do a ME-rating in a complex twin? I don't think so. It sure sounds
      > like a more intelligent course of action to wind up the fans of an Apache
      or
      > Duchess to get the gist of the thing before strapping something like a
      500B
      > onto one's cheeks.
      >
      > Even though his account was meant to be humorous, it doesn't help that he
      > wrote allowing the airspeed to drop below VMC would cause the plane to
      drop
      > out of the sky. ("... plummeting to earth without so much as a
      > bye-the-bye.") Didn't his instructor demonstrate that, in a single engine
      > configuration, the engine that kills you is the live one and throttling
      back
      > on the live engine is a distinct (not necessarily desirable) option when
      > having to fly close to VMC?
      >
      > I have a question for you guys who have more experience than I in these
      > matters. Kevin wrote that above a certain altitude the 500B would spin
      > before stalling (in SE config) but at a lower altitude it would stall
      before
      > spinning. (I never liked referring to loss of control due to loss of VMC
      as
      > spinning. Spinning an aircraft is caused by a distinct aerodynamic
      > configuration, regardless of the number or type of engines.) Now, if we
      > consider that the altitudes he speaks of here are between about 18,000'
      and
      > sea level, how would that small layer of atmosphere cause the aerodynamic
      > properties of the airframe to change that much? Surely, if an IAS
      (pressure)
      > at sea level mandates a certain behavior of the airfoil, it would hardly
      > change if that same IAS (pressure) is achieved at, say, 8,000'. The
      > groundspeed would change, we know that, but the aerodynamic behavior? I
      > don't get it.
      >
      > If he implied that the higher altitude would reduce the power, and
      therefore
      > the effect, of the live engine causing a lower VMC at higher altitudes, I
      > would agree, but then his language and, so it appears, his understanding
      of
      > the mechanics of the phenomenon is lacking. On page 5, he said this, "A
      bit
      > lower in altitude, the Commander will stall before it starts spinning..."
      > That doesn't sound like he's referring to the engine's diminishing
      > horsepower at higher altitudes.
      >
      > Anyway, if you throw a pair of hair-dryers into the nacelles, everything
      he
      > said about this in his article is out the door. Am I missing something?
      >
      > Oh, one more thing. The takeoff procedure his instructor demonstrated, by
      > pulling back on the stick before the takeoff run, so that the AC can
      rotate
      > spontaneously, should surely increase the takeoff run because of the
      induced
      > drag. I always favored my Commander's ability to remain neutral until a
      > deliberate rotation is executed, because, so I believe, it accelerates in
      a
      > much cleaner configuration. What say you?
      >
      > Thanks
      > Nico
      >
      >
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: <BertBerry1(at)aol.com>
      > To: 
      > Subject: Commander-List: 500B OCTOBER 1983 PILOT REPORT
      >
      >
      > >
      > > I just sent Nico the October 1983 Private Pilot Report on the 500B, so
      be
      > > looking for it.
      > >
      > > Thanks again Nico.
      > >
      > > Bert
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Aug 19, 2005
Subject: 
Re: 500B OCTOBER 1983 PILOT REPORT
      
      
      In a message dated 19-Aug-05 17:32:52 Pacific Daylight Time, 
      nico(at)cybersuperstore.com writes:
      I always favored my Commander's ability to remain neutral until a
      deliberate rotation is executed, because, so I believe, it accelerates in a
      much cleaner configuration. What say you?
      
      Nico,  
      
      Thanks for putting up the article -- and thanks for putting up with such a 
      nit wit article.
      
      Mr. Murhpy is confused about Vmc and spinning and stalls and altitudes -- at 
      least that's what impression my quick glance at his article gave me.
      
      As to takeoff procedures, I actually taught short field takeoff with the yoke 
      held approximately 1/2 way back to have neutral elevator at the start of the 
      roll.
      
      Pre flight, I'd have my client sit in the airplane, pull back (it's heavy 
      with zero airspeed!) while I watched his elevator from outside until it was 
      streamlined and I'd shout to him, "There!  Learn that placement!"
      
      During acceleration, the elevator would become light and the trick was to 
      keep the same streamlined position -- not to pull back for the same back pressure
      
      feel --  until rotation speed.  
      
      This technique did yield the best acceleration, shortest ground roll and 
      climb out transition.  Part of it is stream lining of the elevator and thus 
      reduced drag, but part of it is from keeping the Commander from "pearl diving"
      due 
      to its natural 1 degree negative angle of attack in its ground stance.
      
      Just for fun, a rough field technique on a 680 E or F is:  Full up elevator, 
      release brakes and unstick in a few seconds!  Weeeeeeeeee! (now get the nose 
      down and accelerate to save your life!)
      
      Wing Commander Gordon
      
      
      Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 20, 2005
From: 
W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: 
Re: Aviation Converters and Calculators
      
      
      Tom,
      
      Three time table works pretty well, "close enough for Government work", as 
      they say.
      
      Three degrees is 320 ft a mile, even if you ignore the 20, it's close, give 
      or take a bit for the threshold elevation (say the African high veldt, or 
      Leadville) and the actual glideslope. If you use Jeppesen, there are some 
      very useful tables in the "Tables and Codes" tab.
      
      Another useful rule of thumb, particularly useful on a non precision 
      approach, especially on a "black hole" approach is for Rate of Descent:
      
      "Half the groundspeed plus 50"
      
      Ergo: Groudspeed say 120 kt. therefor "half" = "60" + 50 = 650 fpm for a 3 
      degree descent.
      
      Works on everything from my 500A through to the B747-438, in my experience.
      
      Cheers,
      Bill Hamilton
      
      
      At 00:22 20/08/2005, you wrote:
      >
      >
      >Nice assortment of conversions, one thing missing was a
      >slope/distant/altitude calculator.
      >i.e. how many miles back will I intercept the glide slope at this altitude?
      >I used to know it but I can't find a reference to this common calculation
      >and I can't remember my geometry formula.
      >
      >Tom F.
      >C-GISS
      CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet Services 
      and Warbirds.Net. & .
      This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It 
      is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are 
      not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of 
      this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege 
      attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the 
      mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error, please 
      notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Subject: 
Re: Aviation Converters and Calculators
Date: 
Aug 20, 2005
      
      
      Thanks very much Bill, some of that seems familiar I will get current on
      those.
      
      Tom F.
      C-GISS
      
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "W J R HAMILTON" <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Aviation Converters and Calculators
      
      
      
      >
      > Tom,
      >
      > Three time table works pretty well, "close enough for Government work", as
      > they say.
      >
      > Three degrees is 320 ft a mile, even if you ignore the 20, it's close,
      give
      > or take a bit for the threshold elevation (say the African high veldt, or
      > Leadville) and the actual glideslope. If you use Jeppesen, there are some
      > very useful tables in the "Tables and Codes" tab.
      >
      > Another useful rule of thumb, particularly useful on a non precision
      > approach, especially on a "black hole" approach is for Rate of Descent:
      >
      > "Half the groundspeed plus 50"
      >
      > Ergo: Groudspeed say 120 kt. therefor "half" = "60" + 50 = 650 fpm for a 3
      > degree descent.
      >
      > Works on everything from my 500A through to the B747-438, in my
      experience.
      >
      > Cheers,
      > Bill Hamilton
      >
      >
      > At 00:22 20/08/2005, you wrote:
      > >
      > >
      > >Nice assortment of conversions, one thing missing was a
      > >slope/distant/altitude calculator.
      > >i.e. how many miles back will I intercept the glide slope at this
      altitude?
      > >I used to know it but I can't find a reference to this common calculation
      > >and I can't remember my geometry formula.
      > >
      > >Tom F.
      > >C-GISS
      > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      > W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet
      Services
      > and Warbirds.Net. & .
      > This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It
      > is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are
      > not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of
      > this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege
      > attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the
      > mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error,
      please
      > notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      > Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
Date: 
Aug 20, 2005
Subject: 
Re: 500B OCTOBER 1983 PILOT REPORT
      
      
      In a message dated 8/19/2005 9:01:31 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,  
      CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM writes:
      
      Just for  fun, a rough field technique on a 680 E or F is:  Full up elevator, 
      
      release brakes and unstick in a few seconds! 
      
      
      Yep, and you had better have the thing already pointed where you want it to  
      go, because in about 4 seconds , it will be  there!!!
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 20, 2005
From: 
Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
Subject: 
exhaust noise
      
      
      I seem to recall that a Commander owner was going to perform some 
      experiments in an attempt to quite their exhaust noise down.  As an 
      owner of an augmentor-tube tube airplane which makes quite a bit of 
      noise (IMO a beautiful sound) I'd be very interested in the results of 
      any experiments.  We're beginning to get some complaints at our airport 
      and would like to be proactive in this area.
      thanks
      Chris
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
Re: exhaust noise
Date: 
Aug 20, 2005
      
      
      It was a delegate from down under I think.
      
      bilbo
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Chris Schuermann" <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
      Subject: Commander-List: exhaust noise
      
      
      > 
      > I seem to recall that a Commander owner was going to perform some 
      > experiments in an attempt to quite their exhaust noise down.  As an 
      > owner of an augmentor-tube tube airplane which makes quite a bit of 
      > noise (IMO a beautiful sound) I'd be very interested in the results of 
      > any experiments.  We're beginning to get some complaints at our airport 
      > and would like to be proactive in this area.
      > thanks
      > Chris
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Andrew & Bridget Watson" <andrew.bridget(at)telus.net>
Subject: 
Tom Fisher: Blue Twin Commander at Abbotsford
Date: 
Aug 20, 2005
      
      
      Tom,
      
      At the Abbotsford airshow on Sunday, I saw a really nice blue Twin 
      Commander. Didn't get close to it as the kids were dragging me off to see 
      other less important aircraft, like the stealth fighter, for example. :- )
      
      Was the Twin Commander yours? It looked really nice. Wish I'd got a good 
      look at it.
      
      Best Regards,
      Andrew 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Re: 500B OCTOBER 1983 PILOT REPORT
Date: 
Aug 20, 2005
      
      
      Yes, I received them thanks. I will be scanning them up asap.
      Nico
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: 500B OCTOBER 1983 PILOT REPORT
      
      
      >
      > Nico,
      >
      > Thanks again for hosting these.
      >
      > Did you get the UPS box with two articles in it?
      >
      > Moe
      > N680RR
      > 680F(p)
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
      > To: 
      > Subject: Re: Commander-List: 500B OCTOBER 1983 PILOT REPORT
      >
      >
      > 
      > >
      > > Folks,
      > > This is where it is
      > >
      >
      http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/Articles%20Manuals%20etc/_8-19-2005/
      > > Thanks
      > > Nico
      > >
      > > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > > From: <BertBerry1(at)aol.com>
      > > To: 
      > > Subject: Commander-List: 500B OCTOBER 1983 PILOT REPORT
      > >
      > >
      > > >
      > > > I just sent Nico the October 1983 Private Pilot Report on the 500B, so
      > be
      > > > looking for it.
      > > >
      > > > Thanks again Nico.
      > > >
      > > > Bert
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Subject: 
Re: Tom Fisher: Blue Twin Commander at Abbotsford
Date: 
Aug 20, 2005
      
      
      No, unfortunately the week before I blew a seal in a hydraulic pump and
      pumped $800.00 worth of hydraulic fluid overboard.
      Sent the pump for overhaul  I will have it Monday.
      I did not see a Commander on the field except for the 690's that belong to
      the fire fighting company Conair
      
      Tom F.
      C-GISS
      
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Andrew & Bridget Watson" <andrew.bridget(at)telus.net>
      Subject: Commander-List: Tom Fisher: Blue Twin Commander at Abbotsford
      
      
      
      >
      > Tom,
      >
      > At the Abbotsford airshow on Sunday, I saw a really nice blue Twin
      > Commander. Didn't get close to it as the kids were dragging me off to see
      > other less important aircraft, like the stealth fighter, for example. :- )
      >
      > Was the Twin Commander yours? It looked really nice. Wish I'd got a good
      > look at it.
      >
      > Best Regards,
      > Andrew
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 21, 2005
From: 
rnjthompson(at)aol.com
Subject: 
Re: exhaust noise
      
      
      Chris,
      Yes it is me who IF I EVER GET OUT OF TAIWAN will endeavour to bring one to the
      flyin.It basically consists 
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
      Subject: Commander-List: exhaust noise
      
      
      I seem to recall that a Commander owner was going to perform some 
      experiments in an attempt to quite their exhaust noise down.  As an 
      owner of an augmentor-tube tube airplane which makes quite a bit of 
      noise (IMO a beautiful sound) I'd be very interested in the results of 
      any experiments.  We're beginning to get some complaints at our airport 
      and would like to be proactive in this area.
      thanks
      Chris
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 21, 2005
From: 
rnjthompson(at)aol.com
Subject: 
Re: exhaust noise
      
      
      Hi Chris,
      I will try this again as I seem to have sent the last one unfinished. The thing
      is a tube about 4 in long going ito a taper of about 14 in long with a 1/2 in
      hole at the end. From the point going forward there are 3/8 holes in three triangular
      patterns going about 6 in.(the final number of holes is still to be determined)
      This entier cone has three vanes radiating outwards that are welded
      to the cone and bolted to the augmentor tube. Each vane is about 8 in long and
      has a tab on the trailing edge (to cause turbulence in the aug.The front at
      the parrallel tube extends forward of the firewall and covers the stacks.I have
      made all the patterns etc and only need to cut the tin. I used .030 304 grade
      stainless sheet. I will bring a prototype to the flyin. I am also going to adapt
      it to fit a T Bone.
      
      Regards
      Richard
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
      Subject: Commander-List: exhaust noise
      
      
      I seem to recall that a Commander owner was going to perform some 
      experiments in an attempt to quite their exhaust noise down.  As an 
      owner of an augmentor-tube tube airplane which makes quite a bit of 
      noise (IMO a beautiful sound) I'd be very interested in the results of 
      any experiments.  We're beginning to get some complaints at our airport 
      and would like to be proactive in this area.
      thanks
      Chris
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 21, 2005
From: 
Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
Subject: 
Re: exhaust noise
      
      
      rnjthompson(at)aol.com wrote:
      > Hi Chris,
      >  The thing is a tube about 4 in long going ito a taper
      
      Hi Richard.
      I've studied the "Swiss muffler" that seems to be pretty popular in 
      Europe, but I don't think it will work for my needs.  They use it on 
      O-200's and smaller and I'm pretty sure my 540's will tear it up quickly.
      Your description is very interesting, but I can't quite envision the 
      details.  How did you come up with that design?  Clearly there is a lot 
      of thought put into it.  Have you tested it and how is it working so 
      far?  Do you have any drawings/pictures/etc you could share?
      
      Thanks,
      Chris
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
Re: exhaust noise
Date: 
Aug 21, 2005
      
      
      I was having a little problem with the picture in my head too.:>)
      
      
      bilbo
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Chris Schuermann" <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: exhaust noise
      
      
      > 
      > 
      > rnjthompson(at)aol.com wrote:
      >> Hi Chris,
      >>  The thing is a tube about 4 in long going ito a taper
      > 
      > Hi Richard.
      > I've studied the "Swiss muffler" that seems to be pretty popular in 
      > Europe, but I don't think it will work for my needs.  They use it on 
      > O-200's and smaller and I'm pretty sure my 540's will tear it up quickly.
      > Your description is very interesting, but I can't quite envision the 
      > details.  How did you come up with that design?  Clearly there is a lot 
      > of thought put into it.  Have you tested it and how is it working so 
      > far?  Do you have any drawings/pictures/etc you could share?
      > 
      > Thanks,
      > Chris
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 21, 2005
From: 
Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
Subject: 
Re: exhaust noise
      
      
      Bill Bow wrote:
      > I was having a little problem with the picture in my head too.:>)
      
      yeah, but the voices are loud and clear! :-)
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 22, 2005
From: 
rjhinm(at)atlantic.net
Subject: 
commander flyin
      
      
      I would like to attend the next commander flyin if I can get the necessary
      details. Thanks
      
      Ron Hinman
      rjhinm(at)earthlink.net
      352-307-8809 fax
      352-427-7272 cell
      
      
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________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"steve2" <steve2(at)sover.net>
Subject: 
Hypothetical Vacuum Question, No not Electrolux
Date: 
Aug 22, 2005
      
      
      Folks,
      
      I don't know how similar the vacuum systems are between the earlier and 
      later airframes, but I've got a question for the group....
      
      I've had two occasions in the past year and a half when I've lost a good 
      vacuum driven HSI on our 500B, with no indication on the gauges that 
      anything was wrong with vacuum. Upon starting up the next time, its fine.
      
      The instrument bench checks good (a Century NSD-360). All vacuum lines are 
      new or recent. The problem has occured both before and after some major 
      panel work for new avionics. All lines and hoses behind the instrument panel 
      have been replaced. A needle tap was inserted into the line behind the 
      instrument, and there was normal vacuum during a ground run.
      
      The HSI has a heading flag to indicate loss of vacuum or electric power that 
      works fine.
      
      At one time, according to the service manual, the Commander's instruments 
      had their own seperate intake and filter. Now pilot and co-pilot instruments 
      are ganged into two individual lines leading to the nose compartment and one 
      common filter. They have been like this for many years.... The new avionics 
      had us remove two vacuum instruments, so the 'load' is less, but I still 
      lost the HSI the other day.
      
      I have noticed one of the lines slightly flattened in the nose compartment, 
      just prior to entry into the filter.
      
      I'm thinking it is possible to have a flattened line suck closed and the 
      regulators compensate so much so that a gauge indicates normal suction, but 
      with little or no flow through that side.
      
      The question to the group would be to what degree can a vacuum system have 
      its flow reduced before the regulators can no longer compensate? Or is it 
      possible with our system to have no flow, yet have a normal vacuum 
      indication?
      
      I'd be interested to know what people think.
      
      Thanks,
      
      Steve 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 22, 2005
From: 
Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
Subject: 
Re: Hypothetical Vacuum Question, No not Electrolux
      
      
      steve2 wrote:
      > The question to the group would be to what degree can a vacuum system have 
      > its flow reduced before the regulators can no longer compensate? Or is it 
      > possible with our system to have no flow, yet have a normal vacuum 
      > indication?
      
      I'd say you've probably found the problem.  You can certainly pinch off 
      the filter side and have a normal vacuum reading.  The regulator just 
      opens up to let outside air be sucked into the pump.  If the lines are 
      visibly "flattened" that should be a good sign that they're collapsing 
      in use.  May not even be the correct type of hose.  If they're 
      collapsing between the gyro and the filter, that is a sign that the 
      filter is plugged up.  They can look great but still substantially limit 
      flow.
      
      chris
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"MASON CHEVAILLIER" <KAMALA(at)msn.com>
              "BILL WILSON" ,
              "BROOKE D HARLOW" ,
              "carol haskins" ,
              "CLOUDCRAFT" ,
              "commander-list" ,
              "DAN BRUHL" ,
              "diane yoder" ,
              "fbailey" ,
              "GINGER HIGGINBOTHAM" ,
              "ISSAC MANNING" ,
              "Jay Decker" 
Subject: 
Fw: Cellphones
Date: 
Aug 22, 2005
              0.14 FROM_NO_LOWER          From address has no lower-case characters
      
      
      Message
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Christopher Naso<mailto:chris.naso(at)gmail.com>
      Subject: FW: Cellphones
      
      
      From: Dan Swarthout [mailto:dswarthout(at)coakleywilliams.com]
      Subject: Cellphones
      
      
      FYI -
      
      
      > >JUST A REMINDER... 31 days from today, cell  phone
      > >numbers are being released to telemarketing  companies
      > >and you will start to receive sale calls.YOU WILL BE CHARGED  FOR
      > >THESE CALLS...
      > >
      > >To prevent this, call the  following number from your
      > >cell phone: 888/382-1222. It is the National  DO NOT
      > >CALL list. It will only take a minute of your time. It blocks  your
      > >number for five (5) years.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
Re: Fw: Cellphones
Date: 
Aug 22, 2005
      
      
      Not exactly  http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/cell411.asp
      
      bilbo
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "MASON CHEVAILLIER" <KAMALA(at)msn.com>
      ; "BILL WILSON" ; 
      "BROOKE D HARLOW" ; "carol haskins" 
      ; "CLOUDCRAFT" ; "commander-list" 
      ; "DAN BRUHL" ; "diane 
      yoder" ; "fbailey" ; "GINGER 
      HIGGINBOTHAM" ; "ISSAC MANNING" 
      ; "Jay Decker" 
      Subject: Commander-List: Fw: Cellphones
      
      
      >
      > Message
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: Christopher Naso<mailto:chris.naso(at)gmail.com>
      > To: 'Austin Champion' ; 'George 
      > Chevaillier' ; 
      > billratliffIV(at)hotmail.com ; 
      > chasehagin(at)aol.com ; 
      > willthethrill(at)mail.utexas.edu ; 
      > 'Myles King' ; 'Palmer, 
      > Stephanie' ; 'Jason 
      > Palmer' ; 'Jenniann 
      > Colon' ; 'Caleb 
      > Miller' ; 
      > dpnaso(at)aol.com
      > Subject: FW: Cellphones
      >
      >
      > From: Dan Swarthout [mailto:dswarthout(at)coakleywilliams.com]
      > To: 'Brendan Foley (bfoley14(at)hotmail.com)'; 
      > 'Calie Brennan 
      > (calie(at)drinkmorewater.com)'; 'Chris 
      > Heuberger (cheuberg(at)vt.edu)'; 'Chris Naso 
      > (cnaso00(at)mail.utexas.edu)'; 'Cinderblock 
      > (joseph.sufczynski(at)gmail.com)'; 
      > 'Dave Braggins 
      > (DBraggins(at)accredhome.com)'; 'Joey 
      > Winkler (winklerjrw(at)yahoo.com)'; 'Matt 
      > Gravy (Matthew.Garvey(at)puma.com)'; 
      > 'Mickey Rayburn 
      > (mick.rayburn@whiting-turner.com)'; 
      > 'Mike Clark (clarky002647(at)yahoo.com)'; 
      > 'Mike McTavish (mctmct15(at)aol.com)'; 'Mike 
      > Swarthout (mswarthout(at)jinfonet.com)'; 
      > 'Pat Dowd (pdowd2(at)hotmail.com)'; 'Pat 
      > Zimmerman (patzimm!
      > _15(at)yahoo.com)'; 'Patrick Cosgrove 
      > (Pcosgrove(at)jonesnet.com)'; 'Sam Moore 
      > (cpsfinest(at)msn.com)'; 'Thomas Jackman 
      > (tom.jackman(at)cbre.com)'
      > Subject: Cellphones
      >
      >
      > FYI -
      >
      >
      >> >JUST A REMINDER... 31 days from today, cell  phone
      >> >numbers are being released to telemarketing  companies
      >> >and you will start to receive sale calls.YOU WILL BE CHARGED  FOR
      >> >THESE CALLS...
      >> >
      >> >To prevent this, call the  following number from your
      >> >cell phone: 888/382-1222. It is the National  DO NOT
      >> >CALL list. It will only take a minute of your time. It blocks  your
      >> >number for five (5) years.
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"MASON CHEVAILLIER" <KAMALA(at)msn.com>
Subject: 
Re: Fw: Cellphones
Date: 
Aug 22, 2005
      
      
      bb, oh well we tried. mason
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Bill Bow<mailto:bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
        To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
        Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 3:28 PM
        Subject: Re: Commander-List: Fw: Cellphones
      
      
        Not exactly  http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/cell411.asp>
      
        bilbo
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "MASON CHEVAILLIER" <KAMALA(at)msn.com<mailto:KAMALA(at)msn.com>>
        To: "B J YOUNG" >; "BILL MUNRO"
        >; "BILL WILSON" >;
        "BROOKE D HARLOW" >; "carol haskins"
        >; "CLOUDCRAFT" >; "commander-list"
        >; "DAN BRUHL" >; "diane
        yoder" >; "fbailey" >; "GINGER
        HIGGINBOTHAM" >; "ISSAC MANNING"
        >; "Jay Decker" >
        Subject: Commander-List: Fw: Cellphones
      
      
        >
        > Message
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: Christopher Naso<mailto:chris.naso(at)gmail.com<mailto:chris.naso(at)gmail.com>>
        > To: 'Austin Champion'> ; 'George
        > Chevaillier'> ;
        > billratliffIV(at)hotmail.com> ;
        > chasehagin(at)aol.com> ;
        > willthethrill(at)mail.utexas.edu> ;
        > 'Myles King'> ; 'Palmer,
        > Stephanie'> ; 'Jason
        > Palmer'> ; 'Jenniann
        > Colon'> ; 'Caleb
        > Miller'> ;
        > dpnaso(at)aol.com>
        > Subject: FW: Cellphones
        >
        >
        > From: Dan Swarthout [mailto:dswarthout(at)coakleywilliams.com]
        > To: 'Brendan Foley (bfoley14(at)hotmail.com)'>;
        > 'Calie Brennan
        > (calie(at)drinkmorewater.com)'>; 'Chris
        > Heuberger (cheuberg(at)vt.edu)'>; 'Chris Naso
        > (cnaso00(at)mail.utexas.edu)'>; 'Cinderblock
        > (joseph.sufczynski(at)gmail.com)'>;
        > 'Dave Braggins
        > (DBraggins(at)accredhome.com)'>; 'Joey
        > Winkler (winklerjrw(at)yahoo.com)'>; 'Matt
        > Gravy (Matthew.Garvey(at)puma.com)'>;
        > 'Mickey Rayburn
        > (mick.rayburn@whiting-turner.com)'>;
        > 'Mike Clark (clarky002647(at)yahoo.com)'>;
        > 'Mike McTavish (mctmct15(at)aol.com)'>; 'Mike
        > Swarthout (mswarthout(at)jinfonet.com)'>;
        > 'Pat Dowd (pdowd2(at)hotmail.com)'>; 'Pat
        > Zimmerman (patzimm!
        > _15(at)yahoo.com)'>; 'Patrick Cosgrove
        > (Pcosgrove(at)jonesnet.com)'>; 'Sam Moore
        > (cpsfinest(at)msn.com)'>; 'Thomas Jackman
        > (tom.jackman(at)cbre.com)'>
        > Subject: Cellphones
        >
        >
        > FYI -
        >
        >
        >> >JUST A REMINDER... 31 days from today, cell  phone
        >> >numbers are being released to telemarketing  companies
        >> >and you will start to receive sale calls.YOU WILL BE CHARGED  FOR
        >> >THESE CALLS...
        >> >
        >> >To prevent this, call the  following number from your
        >> >cell phone: 888/382-1222. It is the National  DO NOT
        >> >CALL list. It will only take a minute of your time. It blocks  your
        >> >number for five (5) years.
        >
        >
        >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
BertBerry1(at)aol.com
Date: 
Aug 22, 2005
Subject: 
1965 Flight Magazine
      
      
      New stuff on the way to Nico. 
      
      Bert
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Re: 1965 Flight Magazine
Date: 
Aug 23, 2005
      
      
      Folks,
      I published Bert's latest and the first episode of the History of Aero
      Commanders that Moe sent to be scanned. I will redo a few pages such as 01
      and 06 and then scan in the second episode tomorrow or so. Why the quality
      of some came out poorer than the others is unknow. Check the link below and
      go to History of Aero Commanders or Articles Manuals and click on _8-2-2005
      for Bert's latest.
      Thanks
      Nico
      
      http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: <BertBerry1(at)aol.com>
      Subject: Commander-List: 1965 Flight Magazine
      
      
      >
      > New stuff on the way to Nico.
      >
      > Bert
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
Date: 
Aug 23, 2005
Subject: 
Re: commander flyin
      
      
      Ron, 
      
      Attached is the information about the Fly-In and a registration form.   Let 
      me know if you have any problems receiving and/or opening them.  Look  forward
      
      to seeing you at the Fly-In. 
      
      Capt Jim Bob
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ron" <pakrak(at)charter.net>
Subject: 
Re: Aero Commander For Sale
Date: 
Aug 24, 2005
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "jlyle" <jlyle(at)thomsonaviation.com>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Aero Commander For Sale
      
      
      >
      > Hi all'
      > I have dedcided to sell my Aero Commander after much work and restoration.
      > Please look at the photo's to see results of several years of effort.
      > I believe it to be the best example of a 520 available.
      > 5838 TT
      > 612 SMOH Left with New Top
      > 196 SMOH Right-
      > 125 since New Props and Hubs (no AD's)
      > Great New Panel with Garmin 430, S-tec AutoPilot, Annnunciator lights and
      much more.
      > New paint and recent interior
      > Compete spec sheet and photo's at www.thomsonaviation.com
      > Will entertain any reasonable offer and consider partial trade for small
      single engine.
      > It flies great and will make someone a great aircraft.
      > Thanks,
      > James Lyle
      > N11L
      > 706-799-2602 cell
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ron" <pakrak(at)charter.net>
Subject: 
Re: Continental engine notes
Date: 
Aug 24, 2005
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Chris Schuermann" <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
      Subject: Commander-List: Continental engine notes
      
      
      >
      > Okay, several folks have asked me if there's any specific items that
      > might help make decisions about when and how to overhaul Continental
      > engines.
      >
      > Two BIG items are the case and crank.
      > Most Continental owners (I hope) already know that the factory changed
      > the method used to make cranks.  They were having a bit of trouble with
      > cranks breaking.  The new process is refered to as VAR (vaccum arc
      > remelt).  If you have a non-VAR crank, it is required to be replaced
      > with a VAR crank any time the case is split!  This is an important note
      > - if you have to open the case for any reason - even on a low time
      > engine - the crank must be replaced.  Did I mention that they're rather
      > expensive?  Keep that in mind if you're looking at buying an airplane
      > that doesn't have the new crank - you never know what might happen that
      > would require an early split.  A minor prop strike requires an internal
      > inspection for example.
      >
      > There have been four (I believe) revisions of the 6 cylinder Continental
      > case assembly.  If you have a first generation case, consider it a
      > throw-away item at overhaul.  They had a LOT of problems with those
      > cases cracking.  I've seen airplanes with cylinders laying in the bottom
      > of the cowling with part of the case still attached.  Only the absolute
      > cheapest shops would consider re-using a phase I case at overhaul.  THe
      > phase III/VI cases can be identified by bumps along the upper spine of
      > the case where the bolts go through.  These are the heavier cases which
      > are most desirable.  They also have a Teledyne logo at the rear of the
      > case - behind the right rear cylinder if memory serves.
      >
      > Here's where the decision making part comes in.  IF you happen to have
      > an engine with an early case and/or a non-VAR crank, you'll almost
      > certainly want to send it in for a factory re-man.  When Continental
      > receives such an engine for overhaul, they toss the case and crank in
      > the junk pile and you get a new case and crank at no additional cost
      > (this will change as some point no doubt).  Generally, going for a
      > factory re-man is very cost effective in this case as a field overhauler
      > would have to purchase a new or servicable crank and case. (and I
      > personally hate getting "servicable" parts since I never know what
      > happend to cause them to end up on the market and NOT in an engine).
      >
      >
      > Hope I havn't make everyone paranoid now with all this engine talk! :-)
      >
      > Chris
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ron" <pakrak(at)charter.net>
Subject: 
Re: Aero Commander For Sale
Date: 
Aug 24, 2005
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "jlyle" <jlyle(at)thomsonaviation.com>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Aero Commander For Sale
      
      
      >
      > Hi all'
      > I have dedcided to sell my Aero Commander after much work and restoration.
      > Please look at the photo's to see results of several years of effort.
      > I believe it to be the best example of a 520 available.
      > 5838 TT
      > 612 SMOH Left with New Top
      > 196 SMOH Right-
      > 125 since New Props and Hubs (no AD's)
      > Great New Panel with Garmin 430, S-tec AutoPilot, Annnunciator lights and
      much more.
      > New paint and recent interior
      > Compete spec sheet and photo's at www.thomsonaviation.com
      > Will entertain any reasonable offer and consider partial trade for small
      single engine.
      > It flies great and will make someone a great aircraft.
      > Thanks,
      > James Lyle
      > N11L
      > 706-799-2602 cell
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ron" <pakrak(at)charter.net>
Subject: 
Re: Continental engine notes
Date: 
Aug 24, 2005
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Chris Schuermann" <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
      Subject: Commander-List: Continental engine notes
      
      
      >
      > Okay, several folks have asked me if there's any specific items that
      > might help make decisions about when and how to overhaul Continental
      > engines.
      >
      > Two BIG items are the case and crank.
      > Most Continental owners (I hope) already know that the factory changed
      > the method used to make cranks.  They were having a bit of trouble with
      > cranks breaking.  The new process is refered to as VAR (vaccum arc
      > remelt).  If you have a non-VAR crank, it is required to be replaced
      > with a VAR crank any time the case is split!  This is an important note
      > - if you have to open the case for any reason - even on a low time
      > engine - the crank must be replaced.  Did I mention that they're rather
      > expensive?  Keep that in mind if you're looking at buying an airplane
      > that doesn't have the new crank - you never know what might happen that
      > would require an early split.  A minor prop strike requires an internal
      > inspection for example.
      >
      > There have been four (I believe) revisions of the 6 cylinder Continental
      > case assembly.  If you have a first generation case, consider it a
      > throw-away item at overhaul.  They had a LOT of problems with those
      > cases cracking.  I've seen airplanes with cylinders laying in the bottom
      > of the cowling with part of the case still attached.  Only the absolute
      > cheapest shops would consider re-using a phase I case at overhaul.  THe
      > phase III/VI cases can be identified by bumps along the upper spine of
      > the case where the bolts go through.  These are the heavier cases which
      > are most desirable.  They also have a Teledyne logo at the rear of the
      > case - behind the right rear cylinder if memory serves.
      >
      > Here's where the decision making part comes in.  IF you happen to have
      > an engine with an early case and/or a non-VAR crank, you'll almost
      > certainly want to send it in for a factory re-man.  When Continental
      > receives such an engine for overhaul, they toss the case and crank in
      > the junk pile and you get a new case and crank at no additional cost
      > (this will change as some point no doubt).  Generally, going for a
      > factory re-man is very cost effective in this case as a field overhauler
      > would have to purchase a new or servicable crank and case. (and I
      > personally hate getting "servicable" parts since I never know what
      > happend to cause them to end up on the market and NOT in an engine).
      >
      >
      > Hope I havn't make everyone paranoid now with all this engine talk! :-)
      >
      > Chris
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ron" <pakrak(at)charter.net>
Subject: 
Re: Continental engine notes
Date: 
Aug 24, 2005
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Chris Schuermann" <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
      Subject: Commander-List: Continental engine notes
      
      
      >
      > Okay, several folks have asked me if there's any specific items that
      > might help make decisions about when and how to overhaul Continental
      > engines.
      >
      > Two BIG items are the case and crank.
      > Most Continental owners (I hope) already know that the factory changed
      > the method used to make cranks.  They were having a bit of trouble with
      > cranks breaking.  The new process is refered to as VAR (vaccum arc
      > remelt).  If you have a non-VAR crank, it is required to be replaced
      > with a VAR crank any time the case is split!  This is an important note
      > - if you have to open the case for any reason - even on a low time
      > engine - the crank must be replaced.  Did I mention that they're rather
      > expensive?  Keep that in mind if you're looking at buying an airplane
      > that doesn't have the new crank - you never know what might happen that
      > would require an early split.  A minor prop strike requires an internal
      > inspection for example.
      >
      > There have been four (I believe) revisions of the 6 cylinder Continental
      > case assembly.  If you have a first generation case, consider it a
      > throw-away item at overhaul.  They had a LOT of problems with those
      > cases cracking.  I've seen airplanes with cylinders laying in the bottom
      > of the cowling with part of the case still attached.  Only the absolute
      > cheapest shops would consider re-using a phase I case at overhaul.  THe
      > phase III/VI cases can be identified by bumps along the upper spine of
      > the case where the bolts go through.  These are the heavier cases which
      > are most desirable.  They also have a Teledyne logo at the rear of the
      > case - behind the right rear cylinder if memory serves.
      >
      > Here's where the decision making part comes in.  IF you happen to have
      > an engine with an early case and/or a non-VAR crank, you'll almost
      > certainly want to send it in for a factory re-man.  When Continental
      > receives such an engine for overhaul, they toss the case and crank in
      > the junk pile and you get a new case and crank at no additional cost
      > (this will change as some point no doubt).  Generally, going for a
      > factory re-man is very cost effective in this case as a field overhauler
      > would have to purchase a new or servicable crank and case. (and I
      > personally hate getting "servicable" parts since I never know what
      > happend to cause them to end up on the market and NOT in an engine).
      >
      >
      > Hope I havn't make everyone paranoid now with all this engine talk! :-)
      >
      > Chris
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
COMMANDER560(at)cs.com
Date: 
Aug 25, 2005
Subject: 
Re: Aero Commander For Sale
      
      
      says no aircraft for sale at your website
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 25, 2005
From: 
Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
Subject: 
Re: Continental engine notes
      
      
      Ron wrote:
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: "Chris Schuermann" <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
      > To: 
      > Subject: Commander-List: Continental engine notes
      
      Okay... quit messing with my mind!
      I wasn't even awake yet and I see all these emails from ages ago.... 
      Thought I was loosing my marbles....
      Chris
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"MASON CHEVAILLIER" <KAMALA(at)msn.com>
              "barry.collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>,
              "BILL MUNRO" ,
              "BILL WILSON" ,
              "BROOKE D HARLOW" ,
              "candice" ,
              "CLOUDCRAFT" ,
              "commander-list" ,
              "DAN BRUHL" 
Subject: 
Fw: STS-114 Pictures
Date: 
Aug 25, 2005
      
      
      FW: STS-114 Pictures
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Avtec2<mailto:avtec2(at)bellsouth.net>
      Subject: Fw: STS-114 Pictures
      
      
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: FB<mailto:cdr680(at)cfl.rr.com>
      Subject: Fw: STS-114 Pictures
      
      
      Shuttle photos from STS 114.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ben Baltrusaitis" <ben(at)gmpexpress.net>
Subject: 
GO-480
Date: 
Aug 25, 2005
      
      
      Hi Guys,
      Is it getting difficult to find parts for the GO-480?
      What about for the 680E GSO-480?
      Thanks!
      Ben
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Avtec2" <avtec2(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: 
Re: GO-480
Date: 
Aug 25, 2005
      
      
      No Problem on parts or engines for either engine
      Harry
      321 267-3141
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Ben Baltrusaitis" <ben(at)gmpexpress.net>
      Subject: Commander-List: GO-480
      
      
      > 
      >
      > Hi Guys,
      > Is it getting difficult to find parts for the GO-480?
      > What about for the 680E GSO-480?
      > Thanks!
      > Ben
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"jmenchetti(at)cantv.net" <jmenchetti(at)cantv.net>
Subject: 
Re: GO-480
Date: 
Aug 25, 2005
      
      
      Hello Sir, i have 2 gso-480 that came of my 1956 aero commander 680, also i
      have the props and spinners, plus the main langind gear and the nose gear,
      all the original avionics, yokes and panel, crew seats and sofa, and
      interior plastics, let me know if i can be of any help
      
      best regards
      
      
      ----------- Mensaje Original --------------
      
      De: Ben Baltrusaitis [ben(at)gmpexpress.net]
      Para: Aero Commander list [commander-list(at)matronics.com]
      Asunto: Commander-List: GO-480
      Fecha: 25/08/2005 10:38:58
      Mensaje:
      
      
      
      Hi Guys,
      Is it getting difficult to find parts for the GO-480?
      What about for the 680E GSO-480?
      Thanks!
      Ben
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Pilot stories
Date: 
Aug 26, 2005
      
      
      Folks,
      There is an interesting story about Bill Weaver and his Blackbird breakup
      over New Mexico - click on the link below and then Pilotories.
      There are some navy pics too - click on navypics.
      
      Take a look.
      Thanks
      Nico
      
      http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
              "Yanknbank2002" 
Subject: 
Re: Commander Article
Date: 
Aug 26, 2005
      
      
      We received a nice article on the -10 Commanders from yanknbank2002(at)yahoo.com.au.
      Hmmm. I wonder who that would be? I see he's a member of the Real Aussie Air
      Force.
      Thanks anyway, Yanknbank.
      
      It has been published in http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/Articles%20Manuals%20etc/_8-26-2005/
      
      Thanks
      Nico
      
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Yanknbank2002
        To: nico(at)cybersuperstore.com
        Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 9:36 AM
        Subject: Commander Article
      
      
        See the attachment
      
      
        Messenger 7.0: Make free PC-to-PC calls to your friends overseas. You could win
      a holiday to see them! 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ben Baltrusaitis" <ben(at)gmpexpress.net>
Subject: 
sale reported
Date: 
Aug 28, 2005
      
      
      Does anybody know the deal with the 680Es in Okalahoma? There are 7 aircraft listed
      in the state and 6 have "sale reported" on the FAA site.
      Ben
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 28, 2005
From: 
rjhinm(at)atlantic.net
Subject: 
Morris Kendrick
      
      
      I would like to contact Morris about a twin commander project (rebuild). Any
      help with finding a phone number would be greatly appreciated.
      Thanks
      Ron Hinman (Eastern Airlines retired)
      rjhinm(at)earthlink.net
      352-427-7272
      
      This message was sent through Atlantic.Net Webmail.                           
      
      Sick of pop-up ads and climbing prices?                                       
      
      Visit www.atlantic.net to get pure Internet for $19.95/mo.                      
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com>
Subject: 
Re: Morris Kendrick
Date: 
Aug 28, 2005
      
      
      Hi Ron,
      
      Morris can be reached at 321-403-8813. That's his cell number and the best
      way to reach him.
      
      /John
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: <rjhinm(at)atlantic.net>
      Subject: Commander-List: Morris Kendrick
      
      
      >
      >
      > I would like to contact Morris about a twin commander project (rebuild).
      Any
      > help with finding a phone number would be greatly appreciated.
      > Thanks
      > Ron Hinman (Eastern Airlines retired)
      > rjhinm(at)earthlink.net
      > 352-427-7272
      >
      > This message was sent through Atlantic.Net Webmail.
      > Sick of pop-up ads and climbing prices?
      > Visit www.atlantic.net to get pure Internet for $19.95/mo.
      >
      >
      > __________ NOD32 1.1201 (20050825) Information __________
      >
      > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
      > http://www.eset.com
      >
      >
      > __________ NOD32 1.1201 (20050825) Information __________
      >
      > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
      > http://www.eset.com
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Randy Dettmer, AIA" <rcdettmer(at)charter.net>
              "Commander-List Digest List" 
Subject: 
Morris Kendrick
Date: 
Aug 28, 2005
      
      
      Here is Morris' cell phone number - 321 403 8813.   It's the best way to
      contact him.  I'll be dropping off my 680F tomorrow (Monday) at SCK
      (Stockton, CA) for Morris to do the annual.
      
      Good luck with the project.
      
      Randy Dettmer
      680F / N6253X
      
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
      rjhinm(at)atlantic.net
      Subject: Commander-List: Morris Kendrick
      
      
      I would like to contact Morris about a twin commander project (rebuild). Any
      help with finding a phone number would be greatly appreciated.
      Thanks
      Ron Hinman (Eastern Airlines retired)
      rjhinm(at)earthlink.net
      352-427-7272
      
      This message was sent through Atlantic.Net Webmail.
      Sick of pop-up ads and climbing prices?
      Visit www.atlantic.net to get pure Internet for $19.95/mo.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com>
Subject: 
Re: Morris Kendrick
Date: 
Aug 28, 2005
      
      
      Hey Randy, how you getting back to SBP? I may pop down to visit my
      brother....need a ride?
      
      /J
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Randy Dettmer, AIA" <rcdettmer(at)charter.net>
      
      Subject: RE: Commander-List: Morris Kendrick
      
      
      
      >
      > Here is Morris' cell phone number - 321 403 8813.   It's the best way to
      > contact him.  I'll be dropping off my 680F tomorrow (Monday) at SCK
      > (Stockton, CA) for Morris to do the annual.
      >
      > Good luck with the project.
      >
      > Randy Dettmer
      > 680F / N6253X
      >
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
      > [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
      > rjhinm(at)atlantic.net
      > To: Commander-List Digest List
      > Subject: Commander-List: Morris Kendrick
      >
      >
      > I would like to contact Morris about a twin commander project (rebuild).
      Any
      > help with finding a phone number would be greatly appreciated.
      > Thanks
      > Ron Hinman (Eastern Airlines retired)
      > rjhinm(at)earthlink.net
      > 352-427-7272
      >
      > This message was sent through Atlantic.Net Webmail.
      > Sick of pop-up ads and climbing prices?
      > Visit www.atlantic.net to get pure Internet for $19.95/mo.
      >
      >
      > __________ NOD32 1.1201 (20050825) Information __________
      >
      > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
      > http://www.eset.com
      >
      >
      > __________ NOD32 1.1201 (20050825) Information __________
      >
      > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
      > http://www.eset.com
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Randy Dettmer, AIA" <rcdettmer(at)charter.net>
Subject: 
Morris Kendrick
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Hi John,
      Yes, I would love a ride back to SBP..!!  I will be arriving at SCK around
      10:30AM.  I had planned to drive a rental car home, but would happily cancel
      that in favor of a Commander ride.  If I don;t hear from you this morning,
      I'll give you a call (if I can find your phone number...)
      
      Thanks,
      
      Randy
      805 541 4864 / 805 459 0806 cell
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of John
      Vormbaum
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Morris Kendrick
      
      
      Hey Randy, how you getting back to SBP? I may pop down to visit my
      brother....need a ride?
      
      /J
      
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Randy Dettmer, AIA" <rcdettmer(at)charter.net>
      
      Subject: RE: Commander-List: Morris Kendrick
      
      
      
      >
      > Here is Morris' cell phone number - 321 403 8813.   It's the best way to
      > contact him.  I'll be dropping off my 680F tomorrow (Monday) at SCK
      > (Stockton, CA) for Morris to do the annual.
      >
      > Good luck with the project.
      >
      > Randy Dettmer
      > 680F / N6253X
      >
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
      > [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
      > rjhinm(at)atlantic.net
      > To: Commander-List Digest List
      > Subject: Commander-List: Morris Kendrick
      >
      >
      > I would like to contact Morris about a twin commander project (rebuild).
      Any
      > help with finding a phone number would be greatly appreciated.
      > Thanks
      > Ron Hinman (Eastern Airlines retired)
      > rjhinm(at)earthlink.net
      > 352-427-7272
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ben Baltrusaitis" <ben(at)gmpexpress.net>
Subject: 
grass strip length
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Hi Guys,
      How short of an unobstructed grass strip are you willing to land on, assuming reasonable
      temperature and a few hundred under gross?
      Please tell me what you fly.
      
      I'm looking to buy a Twin Commander in the spring and have been set on a 680E for
      a long time. Now I'm wondering if one of the others may be better for me. I
      have been flying on some really short grass airports and would like to continue
      that with my Aero Commander. I will be flying with no more than 150 gals fuel,
      4-6 people, limited baggage.
      It looks to me like the 680 may be the best choice, but with fuel prices, a 560
      may be smarter. What are your opinions?
      Thanks!!
      I hope everyone in the South is safe!
      Ben-PA
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 
Re: Commander Article
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Nico (and others),
      
      The new, August 2005 issue of Twin & Turbine Magazine has a good article
      concerning a soon to be STC environmental control system.  Do you have it,
      can someone email it to you, or shall I mail it to you to post.
      
      Thanks
      
      Moe
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
      
      Subject: Commander-List: Re: Commander Article
      
      
      
      >
      > We received a nice article on the -10 Commanders from
      yanknbank2002(at)yahoo.com.au. Hmmm. I wonder who that would be? I see he's a
      member of the Real Aussie Air Force.
      > Thanks anyway, Yanknbank.
      >
      > It has been published in
      http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/Articles%20Manuals%20etc/_8-26-2005/
      >
      > Thanks
      > Nico
      >
      >   ----- Original Message -----
      >   From: Yanknbank2002
      >   To: nico(at)cybersuperstore.com
      >   Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 9:36 AM
      >   Subject: Commander Article
      >
      >
      >   See the attachment
      >
      >
      >   Messenger 7.0: Make free PC-to-PC calls to your friends overseas. You
      could win a holiday to see them!
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 
Re: Commander Article
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Fellow Commander drivers,
      
      Am considering getting rid of the stock "Frankenstein" voltage regulators on
      my 680F(p).  Any suggestions?
      
      Regards,
      
      Moe Mills
      N680RR
      680F(p)
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
      
      Subject: Commander-List: Re: Commander Article
      
      
      
      >
      > We received a nice article on the -10 Commanders from
      yanknbank2002(at)yahoo.com.au. Hmmm. I wonder who that would be? I see he's a
      member of the Real Aussie Air Force.
      > Thanks anyway, Yanknbank.
      >
      > It has been published in
      http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/Articles%20Manuals%20etc/_8-26-2005/
      >
      > Thanks
      > Nico
      >
      >   ----- Original Message -----
      >   From: Yanknbank2002
      >   To: nico(at)cybersuperstore.com
      >   Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 9:36 AM
      >   Subject: Commander Article
      >
      >
      >   See the attachment
      >
      >
      >   Messenger 7.0: Make free PC-to-PC calls to your friends overseas. You
      could win a holiday to see them!
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
Subject: 
Voltage Regulators
      
      
      A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics 
      developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage regulators to replace
      
      the Frankenstine units.
      
      I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his AC-500-B.
      
      If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues of 
      the Flight Group News that featured these.
      
      Wing Commander Gordon
      
      PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      
      Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
Re: Commander Article
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Air conditioner?
      
      bilbo
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Re: Commander Article
      
      
      >
      > Nico (and others),
      >
      > The new, August 2005 issue of Twin & Turbine Magazine has a good article
      > concerning a soon to be STC environmental control system.  Do you have it,
      > can someone email it to you, or shall I mail it to you to post.
      >
      > Thanks
      >
      > Moe
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
      > To: ; "Yanknbank2002"
      > 
      > Subject: Commander-List: Re: Commander Article
      >
      >
      > 
      >>
      >> We received a nice article on the -10 Commanders from
      > yanknbank2002(at)yahoo.com.au. Hmmm. I wonder who that would be? I see he's a
      > member of the Real Aussie Air Force.
      >> Thanks anyway, Yanknbank.
      >>
      >> It has been published in
      > http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/Articles%20Manuals%20etc/_8-26-2005/
      >>
      >> Thanks
      >> Nico
      >>
      >>   ----- Original Message -----
      >>   From: Yanknbank2002
      >>   To: nico(at)cybersuperstore.com
      >>   Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 9:36 AM
      >>   Subject: Commander Article
      >>
      >>
      >>   See the attachment
      >>
      >>
      >>   Messenger 7.0: Make free PC-to-PC calls to your friends overseas. You
      > could win a holiday to see them!
      >>
      >>
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Re: Commander Article
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      If you mail it to me, I will scan it up and post it. Did you see the
      articles about the history of Commanders that I scanned and posted? If so,
      please comment on the format and quality. I didn't scan them into a pdf
      file.
      
      Thanks
       Nico
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Re: Commander Article
      
      
      >
      > Nico (and others),
      >
      > The new, August 2005 issue of Twin & Turbine Magazine has a good article
      > concerning a soon to be STC environmental control system.  Do you have it,
      > can someone email it to you, or shall I mail it to you to post.
      >
      > Thanks
      >
      > Moe
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
      > To: ; "Yanknbank2002"
      > 
      > Subject: Commander-List: Re: Commander Article
      >
      >
      > 
      > >
      > > We received a nice article on the -10 Commanders from
      > yanknbank2002(at)yahoo.com.au. Hmmm. I wonder who that would be? I see he's a
      > member of the Real Aussie Air Force.
      > > Thanks anyway, Yanknbank.
      > >
      > > It has been published in
      >
      http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/Articles%20Manuals%20etc/_8-26-2005/
      > >
      > > Thanks
      > > Nico
      > >
      > >   ----- Original Message -----
      > >   From: Yanknbank2002
      > >   To: nico(at)cybersuperstore.com
      > >   Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 9:36 AM
      > >   Subject: Commander Article
      > >
      > >
      > >   See the attachment
      > >
      > >
      > >   Messenger 7.0: Make free PC-to-PC calls to your friends overseas. You
      > could win a holiday to see them!
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Don't Lucas do some good ones?
      
      BC (UK)
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: <CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM>
      Subject: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      |
      | A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      | developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage regulators to
      
      replace
      | the Frankenstine units.
      |
      | I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his AC-500-B.
      |
      | If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues of
      | the Flight Group News that featured these.
      |
      | Wing Commander Gordon
      |
      | PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      |
      | Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      |
      |
      |
      |
      |
      |
      | 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
BobsV35B(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      In a message dated 8/29/2005 4:27:41 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
      CloudCraft(at)aol.com writes:
      
      If you  can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues of 
      the  Flight Group News that featured these.
      
      Wing Commander  Gordon
      
      
      Try: _http://www.zeftronics.com_ (http://www.zeftronics.com)  
      
      Happy  Skies,
      
      Old Bob
      AKA
      Bob Siegfried
      Ancient Aviator
      Stearman  N3977A
      Brookeridge Air Park LL22
      Downers Grove, IL 60516
      630  985-8503
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
      
      
      Ben,
      
      Not one to give advice ... but one to spend other people's money at the drop 
      of a hat, here are some things to consider:
      
      The power and long blades of a 680-E can not be beat for short field 
      performance.
      
      The long blades of a 680-E do offer less ground clearance, but if it's grass 
      and not gravel, I'd say "no danger!"
      
      I've operated 500 series and 680 series in dirt, grass and almost sand and 
      they're just great.  
      
      Pot holes and rocks with wreck any airplane, regardless.
      
      You haven't told us your field elevation and hottest day you'll be flying off 
      it and what your approach and departure path looks like ("obstacle clearance 
      plane," if you want to speak as if it were a major airport) so get back to us 
      with that info and the Group will have lots of free opinions and advice, worth
      
      every penny, guaranteed.
      
      Wing Commander Gordon
      
      Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Lucas, you mean the "Prince of Darkness".
      
      bilbo
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      > <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >
      > Don't Lucas do some good ones?
      >
      > BC (UK)
      >
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: <CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM>
      > To: 
      > Subject: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      >
      >
      > |
      > | A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      > | developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage 
      > regulators to
      > replace
      > | the Frankenstine units.
      > |
      > | I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his AC-500-B.
      > |
      > | If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues 
      > of
      > | the Flight Group News that featured these.
      > |
      > | Wing Commander Gordon
      > |
      > | PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      > |
      > | Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      > |
      > |
      > |
      > |
      > |
      > |
      > |
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)charter.net>
Subject: 
grass strip length
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Ben,
      I have a 500A and fly mostly off field elevations of 700'. I routinely have
      flown in and out of 2200' strips at gross with out any problems. Commanders
      are good short field, high altitude, as well as one of the most comfortable
      planes and one of the best flying airplanes you will ever find. They are all
      good. I have owned mine since 01APR81 and it has gotten me out of any
      trouble I could get it into.
      Jim Addington
      N444BD
      jtaddington(at)charter.net
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Ben
      Baltrusaitis
      Subject: Commander-List: grass strip length
      
      
      
      
      Hi Guys,
      How short of an unobstructed grass strip are you willing to land on,
      assuming reasonable temperature and a few hundred under gross?
      Please tell me what you fly.
      
      I'm looking to buy a Twin Commander in the spring and have been set on a
      680E for a long time. Now I'm wondering if one of the others may be better
      for me. I have been flying on some really short grass airports and would
      like to continue that with my Aero Commander. I will be flying with no more
      than 150 gals fuel, 4-6 people, limited baggage.
      It looks to me like the 680 may be the best choice, but with fuel prices, a
      560 may be smarter. What are your opinions?
      Thanks!!
      I hope everyone in the South is safe!
      Ben-PA
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      In a message dated 29-Aug-05 14:33:48 Pacific Daylight Time, 
      barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk writes:
      <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      
      Don't Lucas do some good ones?
      
      BC (UK)
      >
      >
      Lucas, Sir Barry?
      
      Where's that British sense of public shame?
      
      Wing Commander Gordon
      
      
      Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      They're the ones!
      
      BC (UK)
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      | 
      | Lucas, you mean the "Prince of Darkness".
      | 
      | bilbo
      | ----- Original Message ----- 
      | From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      | To: 
      | Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      | 
      | 
      | > <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      | >
      | > Don't Lucas do some good ones?
      | >
      | > BC (UK)
      | >
      | > ----- Original Message ----- 
      | > From: <CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM>
      | > To: 
      | > Subject: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      | >
      | >
      | > |
      | > | A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      | > | developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage 
      | > regulators to
      | > replace
      | > | the Frankenstine units.
      | > |
      | > | I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his AC-500-B.
      | > |
      | > | If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues 
      | > of
      | > | the Flight Group News that featured these.
      | > |
      | > | Wing Commander Gordon
      | > |
      | > | PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      | > |
      | > | Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      | > |
      | > |
      | > |
      | > |
      | > |
      | > |
      | > |
      | >
      | >
      | > 
      | 
      | 
      | 
      | 
      | 
      | 
      |
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ben Baltrusaitis" <ben(at)gmpexpress.net>
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Thanks, Wing Commander Gordon!
      The fields I fly from now are grass and in the Northeast, so elevation is less
      than 2000 ft. and mostly under 1000. Summer temperatures here are usually cool
      in the morning 60-70 F., however, this summer was an exception. Most of the grass
      runways have 30 foot or less obstructions-several unobstructed.
      I do plan to go West and get in some wilderness under-the-wing camping. I've never
      been to Idaho or Wyoming.
      I've been looking at the specs that Chris compiled on the Twin Commander Flight
      Group site and it says there that the 680 will beat the 680E off the ground and
      the 560 will beat the 680.
      I appreciate the advice.
      Ben-PA
      
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: CloudCraft(at)aol.com
        To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
        Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 5:32 PM
        Subject: Re: Commander-List: grass strip length
      
      
        Ben,
      
        Not one to give advice ... but one to spend other people's money at the drop
        of a hat, here are some things to consider:
      
        The power and long blades of a 680-E can not be beat for short field
        performance.
      
        The long blades of a 680-E do offer less ground clearance, but if it's grass
        and not gravel, I'd say "no danger!"
      
        I've operated 500 series and 680 series in dirt, grass and almost sand and
        they're just great. 
      
        Pot holes and rocks with wreck any airplane, regardless.
      
        You haven't told us your field elevation and hottest day you'll be flying off
        it and what your approach and departure path looks like ("obstacle clearance
        plane," if you want to speak as if it were a major airport) so get back to us
        with that info and the Group will have lots of free opinions and advice, worth
        every penny, guaranteed.
      
        Wing Commander Gordon
      
        Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Sorry guys, I have already had a Jag and a Triumph that had Lucas
      electronics.  However, I must admit that improvements may have been
      made....my Phillips TV doesn't wonder from station to station like the
      Phillips radio did in the Jag.
      
      Moe
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      >
      > Lucas, you mean the "Prince of Darkness".
      >
      > bilbo
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      > To: 
      > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      >
      >
      > > <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      > >
      > > Don't Lucas do some good ones?
      > >
      > > BC (UK)
      > >
      > > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > > From: <CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM>
      > > To: 
      > > Subject: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      > >
      > >
      > > |
      > > | A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      > > | developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage
      > > regulators to
      > > replace
      > > | the Frankenstine units.
      > > |
      > > | I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his
      AC-500-B.
      > > |
      > > | If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive
      issues
      > > of
      > > | the Flight Group News that featured these.
      > > |
      > > | Wing Commander Gordon
      > > |
      > > | PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      > > |
      > > | Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      > > |
      > > |
      > > |
      > > |
      > > |
      > > |
      > > |
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
      
      
      In a message dated 29-Aug-05 15:07:26 Pacific Daylight Time, 
      ben(at)gmpexpress.net writes:
      it says there that the 680 will beat the 680E off the ground and the 560 will 
      beat the 680.
      I'd take the extended wing (the "E" in 680E) any day over the short wing ... 
      as long as I'm spending your money ... for the increased lift and handling 
      characteristics at the low speed range. (as in stall characteristics)
      
      A 560 beating a 680?  Ummmmmmm ... maybe in the world of brochures but I 
      doubt that would be the case in the field.
      
      There's little substitute for power.  Or, as one of my mentors told me, "the 
      only thing that compensates for lack of brains is lots of thrust and lots of 
      fuel."
      
      (He was flying Gulfstreams for a major construction firm in Alaska in the 
      1970s.)
      
      At the risk of public outrage, I'd say if you developed some expertise in the 
      680-E, you could work off 2000 feet.  Less, maybe, but I wouldn't ever say 
      that on a public email net, would I?  Your mileage may vary. 
      
      If you're grass strip is 2500+ feet, you'll be very comfortable, quite soon.
      
      Keep in mind, you'd better have a flat clearance plane in the event of going 
      one engine inoperative.  I hate to state the obvious, but I am forced to.  If 
      you ever had one engine inoperative, or a hydraulic abnormal, go land at a big
      
      airport and get a ride home.
      
      Obviously, if you're going to go camping under the wing in Idaho or Wyoming, 
      your runway requirement is going up.  How much?  Can't tell you without the 
      AFM, which I don't have.
      
      Wing Commander Gordon
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Just as a note, a sea level warm 25 degree day take-off  with no wind @ 8500
      Lbs. in my Mr.RPM 680FLP takes all of 2500 feet (and you better fly around
      that 50' obstacle).
      
      I don't think the engines/controls are tuned/rigged properly but I have
      nothing to compare it to.
      
      Tom F.
      C-GISS
      
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Ben Baltrusaitis" <ben(at)gmpexpress.net>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: grass strip length
      
      
      
      >
      > Thanks, Wing Commander Gordon!
      > The fields I fly from now are grass and in the Northeast, so elevation is
      less than 2000 ft. and mostly under 1000. Summer temperatures here are
      usually cool in the morning 60-70 F., however, this summer was an exception.
      Most of the grass runways have 30 foot or less obstructions-several
      unobstructed.
      > I do plan to go West and get in some wilderness under-the-wing camping.
      I've never been to Idaho or Wyoming.
      > I've been looking at the specs that Chris compiled on the Twin Commander
      Flight Group site and it says there that the 680 will beat the 680E off the
      ground and the 560 will beat the 680.
      > I appreciate the advice.
      > Ben-PA
      >
      >   ----- Original Message -----
      >   From: CloudCraft(at)aol.com
      >   To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
      >   Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 5:32 PM
      >   Subject: Re: Commander-List: grass strip length
      >
      >
      >   Ben,
      >
      >   Not one to give advice ... but one to spend other people's money at the
      drop
      >   of a hat, here are some things to consider:
      >
      >   The power and long blades of a 680-E can not be beat for short field
      >   performance.
      >
      >   The long blades of a 680-E do offer less ground clearance, but if it's
      grass
      >   and not gravel, I'd say "no danger!"
      >
      >   I've operated 500 series and 680 series in dirt, grass and almost sand
      and
      >   they're just great.
      >
      >   Pot holes and rocks with wreck any airplane, regardless.
      >
      >   You haven't told us your field elevation and hottest day you'll be
      flying off
      >   it and what your approach and departure path looks like ("obstacle
      clearance
      >   plane," if you want to speak as if it were a major airport) so get back
      to us
      >   with that info and the Group will have lots of free opinions and advice,
      worth
      >   every penny, guaranteed.
      >
      >   Wing Commander Gordon
      >
      >   Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      I remember my father's MkIV and then the 420G, the heater could be turned on
      or off (nothing in between), for a high-end car I thought that was pretty
      miserable and the electric's were always a problem.
      
      Tom F.
      C-GISS
      
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      >
      > Sorry guys, I have already had a Jag and a Triumph that had Lucas
      > electronics.  However, I must admit that improvements may have been
      > made....my Phillips TV doesn't wonder from station to station like the
      > Phillips radio did in the Jag.
      >
      > Moe
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
      > To: 
      > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      >
      >
      
      > >
      > > Lucas, you mean the "Prince of Darkness".
      > >
      > > bilbo
      > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      > > To: 
      > > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      > >
      > >
      > > > <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      > > >
      > > > Don't Lucas do some good ones?
      > > >
      > > > BC (UK)
      > > >
      > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > From: <CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM>
      > > > To: 
      > > > Subject: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > |
      > > > | A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called
      Zeftronics
      > > > | developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage
      > > > regulators to
      > > > replace
      > > > | the Frankenstine units.
      > > > |
      > > > | I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his
      > AC-500-B.
      > > > |
      > > > | If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive
      > issues
      > > > of
      > > > | the Flight Group News that featured these.
      > > > |
      > > > | Wing Commander Gordon
      > > > |
      > > > | PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      > > > |
      > > > | Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      > > > |
      > > > |
      > > > |
      > > > |
      > > > |
      > > > |
      > > > |
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Steven" <steve2(at)sover.net>
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Ben,
      
      I can't think of a light twin I'd rather be in than a Commander for short 
      field. Did get my multi in a Robertson equiped Aztruck, though. Not as cute 
      as an Apache and kinda full-figured but gets the short field job done pretty 
      good and hauls a load. Faster than I would have figured too....
      
      If you're not new to twins, don't read any further and I apologize in 
      advance.... The following would not be appropriate, as I'm sure you well 
      know it.
      
      
      Landing short is no problem and you CAN haul these things (any light twin) 
      off 'really short fields', but do you really want to as a steady diet? I'm 
      thinking grass fields means a lot of pleasant summer time flights in 
      high-density altitude conditions. Yuck. If you're 'stepping-up' to twins, 
      there are a couple excellent references I keep around and reread myself 
      fairly often. Cavet Emptor, but if multi-engine flying is new to you, the 
      following links might illustrate some of the operational problems with light 
      twins and short fields.
      
      Interested in what the other fellows think.
      
      I've been taught from some time back to go for the speed early, and 
      decelerate to Vx when you lose an engine .... Can't do that short field. 
      Got to have the presence of mind to shut the good engine down and crash 
      straight-ahead rather than push it and end up upside-down in heap. Sounds 
      easy, but in practice we don't do so well and a lot of us end up in the 
      heap.
      
      http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182040-1.html
      
      http://www.iflypete.com/documents/Always_Leave.html
      
      Steve
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Ben Baltrusaitis" <ben(at)gmpexpress.net>
      Subject: Commander-List: grass strip length
      
      
      > 
      >
      > Hi Guys,
      > How short of an unobstructed grass strip are you willing to land on, 
      > assuming reasonable temperature and a few hundred under gross?
      > Please tell me what you fly.
      >
      > I'm looking to buy a Twin Commander in the spring and have been set on a 
      > 680E for a long time. Now I'm wondering if one of the others may be better 
      > for me. I have been flying on some really short grass airports and would 
      > like to continue that with my Aero Commander. I will be flying with no 
      > more than 150 gals fuel, 4-6 people, limited baggage.
      > It looks to me like the 680 may be the best choice, but with fuel prices, 
      > a 560 may be smarter. What are your opinions?
      > Thanks!!
      > I hope everyone in the South is safe!
      > Ben-PA
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
N560WM(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
      
      
      My 560F has no problems loaded with lobsters from  X01
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Ben Baltrusaitis" <ben(at)gmpexpress.net>
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Thanks for the links, Steve, I'm stepping up to a twin and find the information
      most valuable.
      Ben
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Don Girod" <dongirod(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Ben;
      
      I fly a 560E and when I had my annual a few years ago,  I flew into a 2800 
      ft. grass strip.  I could land and take off in just over half the length, 2 
      on board with about 150 gal. of fuel on board, warm spring day, 1000 ft. 
      elevation. (Atlanta).  In fact there used to be a video of me taking off 
      from that strip.  However I will say that when operating normally I rotate 
      at 90 kts. but when on a short field I rotate and approach at 70 kts.  90 
      kts is my single engine speed, if I don't need to fly below it, why sit 
      myself up for the extra work.  I don't believe it would be a problem at the 
      slower speeds, but would probably not be able to hold a heading while 
      controlling the airplane until I got my speed up to 90 kts.  Just my 
      thoughts.
      
      Don
      
      
      > 
      >
      > Hi Guys,
      > How short of an unobstructed grass strip are you willing to land on, 
      > assuming reasonable temperature and a few hundred under gross?
      > Please tell me what you fly.
      >
      > I'm looking to buy a Twin Commander in the spring and have been set on a 
      > 680E for a long time. Now I'm wondering if one of the others may be better 
      > for me. I have been flying on some really short grass airports and would 
      > like to continue that with my Aero Commander. I will be flying with no 
      > more than 150 gals fuel, 4-6 people, limited baggage.
      > It looks to me like the 680 may be the best choice, but with fuel prices, 
      > a 560 may be smarter. What are your opinions?
      > Thanks!!
      > I hope everyone in the South is safe!
      > Ben-PA
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Dennis Polito" <28bravo(at)comcast.net>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Look in Trade A Plane for Zefftronics. The regulators you need are 
      manufactured by them and they are GREAT replacements for the old open frame 
      units originally installed. They are all solid state and have been trouble 
      free since installation.
      
      Dennis Polito
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: <CloudCraft(at)aol.com>
      Subject: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      >
      > A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      > developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage regulators 
      > to replace
      > the Frankenstine units.
      >
      > I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his AC-500-B.
      >
      > If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues of
      > the Flight Group News that featured these.
      >
      > Wing Commander Gordon
      >
      > PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      >
      > Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"tylor.hall" <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: 
grass strip length
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      I got a demonstration from Morris in a 500B at sea level.  There were the
      two of us and about half fuel.  He had me watch the 1000 foot mark and we
      were off before it.
      
      I have also gone out of a 7600 elevation and 70 degrees with full fuel and
      at gross and used 5000' to get off the ground.  It did climb ok after I got
      the gear and flaps up.
      
      Density Altitude can make a big difference.  If you have never flown out of
      high altitudes, allow lots of extra runway to start with and learn what it
      will do.
      
      At the TCFG meeting in Hillsboro, OR they showed a movie of landing up the
      side of a mountain like in the movie Air America.  It showed what can be
      done.  I would not try it.
      
      Happy flying.
      Tylor Hall
      
      
      Ben;
      
      I fly a 560E and when I had my annual a few years ago,  I flew into a 2800
      ft. grass strip.  I could land and take off in just over half the length, 2
      on board with about 150 gal. of fuel on board, warm spring day, 1000 ft.
      elevation. (Atlanta).  In fact there used to be a video of me taking off
      from that strip.  However I will say that when operating normally I rotate
      at 90 kts. but when on a short field I rotate and approach at 70 kts.  90
      kts is my single engine speed, if I don't need to fly below it, why sit
      myself up for the extra work.  I don't believe it would be a problem at the
      slower speeds, but would probably not be able to hold a heading while
      controlling the airplane until I got my speed up to 90 kts.  Just my
      thoughts.
      
      Don
      
      
      > 
      >
      > Hi Guys,
      > How short of an unobstructed grass strip are you willing to land on,
      > assuming reasonable temperature and a few hundred under gross?
      > Please tell me what you fly.
      >
      > I'm looking to buy a Twin Commander in the spring and have been set on a
      > 680E for a long time. Now I'm wondering if one of the others may be better
      > for me. I have been flying on some really short grass airports and would
      > like to continue that with my Aero Commander. I will be flying with no
      > more than 150 gals fuel, 4-6 people, limited baggage.
      > It looks to me like the 680 may be the best choice, but with fuel prices,
      > a 560 may be smarter. What are your opinions?
      > Thanks!!
      > I hope everyone in the South is safe!
      > Ben-PA
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
Date: 
Aug 29, 2005
      
      
      Admittedly, my straight 500 was a bit lazy when the density altitude rose
      above 7 or 8,000 feet, which a Commander with a couple of blowers could fix.
      I used to land on the side of a mountain close to a construction site and
      got quite a kick out of flying fellow pilots into that strip. It couldn't
      have been more than 1,000' long at about 3,000 agl, but it sloped up
      aggressively making the virtual runway length much longer. Gear and flaps
      down with only a mountain side filling the windscreen couldn't get much
      reaction from non-flying pax, but folks who had some stick time got two
      moments of reality: landing and when we took off again. We always had flying
      pax in awe at the Commander once we were airborne. Less than a 1,000' is not
      much when you line up to take off.
      
      I have video where I took off from Inhaca, an island off the east coast of
      Mozambique with nine people on board (mercy flight) with diving weight
      belts, O2 bottles and gear. It was no joke but the Commander performed like
      a star. I will post the video in the near future. A Baron 55 couldn't take
      its regular load out of the strip on the island and time/ daylight was
      running out in an African/communist country. Those folks had to get out with
      us or they could be lost forever. The 500 did the job so well that all of
      the excess pax got back into the Commander after we cleared customs and
      immigration at Maputo with a 10,000' runway. No Baron for them. HAHAHA. We
      were a jolly bunch, I must say, laughing at the Baron, singing the accolades
      of the Commander. Most of these guys were fighter jocks in the air force
      with plenty of French Mirage time.
      
      Ben, you cannot go wrong with any Commander. Go fly a couple of them and get
      the one that makes the most sense for you. Listen to the folks on this list
      who have flown more variations of the Commander than most and you cannot go
      wrong. There will come a time when another plane would respond, "you wanna
      do WHAT?" while a Commander would just say, "Sure, let's go."
      
      Having said that, Commanders do command respect, both on the ramp and in the
      left-seat. See here
      http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Accidents/AeroCommanderStalled.jpg
      what I mean.
      
      Nico
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "tylor.hall" <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
      Subject: RE: Commander-List: grass strip length
      
      
      
      >
      >
      > I got a demonstration from Morris in a 500B at sea level.  There were the
      > two of us and about half fuel.  He had me watch the 1000 foot mark and we
      > were off before it.
      >
      > I have also gone out of a 7600 elevation and 70 degrees with full fuel and
      > at gross and used 5000' to get off the ground.  It did climb ok after I
      got
      > the gear and flaps up.
      >
      > Density Altitude can make a big difference.  If you have never flown out
      of
      > high altitudes, allow lots of extra runway to start with and learn what it
      > will do.
      >
      > At the TCFG meeting in Hillsboro, OR they showed a movie of landing up the
      > side of a mountain like in the movie Air America.  It showed what can be
      > done.  I would not try it.
      >
      > Happy flying.
      > Tylor Hall
      >
      >
      > Ben;
      >
      > I fly a 560E and when I had my annual a few years ago,  I flew into a 2800
      > ft. grass strip.  I could land and take off in just over half the length,
      2
      > on board with about 150 gal. of fuel on board, warm spring day, 1000 ft.
      > elevation. (Atlanta).  In fact there used to be a video of me taking off
      > from that strip.  However I will say that when operating normally I rotate
      > at 90 kts. but when on a short field I rotate and approach at 70 kts.  90
      > kts is my single engine speed, if I don't need to fly below it, why sit
      > myself up for the extra work.  I don't believe it would be a problem at
      the
      > slower speeds, but would probably not be able to hold a heading while
      > controlling the airplane until I got my speed up to 90 kts.  Just my
      > thoughts.
      >
      > Don
      >
      >
      > > 
      > >
      > > Hi Guys,
      > > How short of an unobstructed grass strip are you willing to land on,
      > > assuming reasonable temperature and a few hundred under gross?
      > > Please tell me what you fly.
      > >
      > > I'm looking to buy a Twin Commander in the spring and have been set on a
      > > 680E for a long time. Now I'm wondering if one of the others may be
      better
      > > for me. I have been flying on some really short grass airports and would
      > > like to continue that with my Aero Commander. I will be flying with no
      > > more than 150 gals fuel, 4-6 people, limited baggage.
      > > It looks to me like the 680 may be the best choice, but with fuel
      prices,
      > > a 560 may be smarter. What are your opinions?
      > > Thanks!!
      > > I hope everyone in the South is safe!
      > > Ben-PA
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Jim Crunkleton" <crunk12(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
Date: 
Aug 30, 2005
      
      
      Ben,
      Joe Shepherd and I have been operating a 560F off of a 2000' grass strip for 
      years. (Elev 925') No Problem!
      However........when the density altitude starts climbing, we do restrict the 
      gross weight. (You can tell a big difference at a 1000' @ 90 degrees.)
      We've also operated a 520, and 680E from the same strip.
      My personal preferences:
      520---Not an issue
      560---Not an issue
      560E---Not an issue
      560A HC---Not an issue
      560F---Watch density altitude/limit gross weight
      680E---See above
      680F---See above (Do-able but no room for error)
      The remaining models---Consider an Aztruck
      Commander Gordon is spot on concerning 2nd segment climb, as you don't want 
      to be turning around a tree after losing an engine.
      You are not be operating off of a balanced field, so expect NOT to stop on 
      the field if you lose an engine near Vmc. (It does make every takeoff 
      exciting!)
      The method Joe and I use is to remain on the ground until attaining Vmc. 
      (Chanting, "Engines Don't Fail Me Now" during the takeoff roll and climb out 
      also seems to help!)
      Another consideration when operating off of grass is field condition, i.e., 
      dew, rain and depth of grass. We elect NOT to operate our aircraft during 
      periods of dew, rain or high grass.
      I'm sure it probably can be done, but being an old-fart retired airline 
      pilot with 25,000+ hours I've decided that my heart can't take the 
      excitement. (Definitely OLD, definitely not Bold.)  :-)
      You mentioned flying out west. If this is part of your 'mission' I would 
      strongly suggest something with superchargers for the higher altitude 
      airports, i.e., a 680E.
      Before making a decision it would be prudent to review the single engine 
      service ceilings of the various aircraft you might have in mind. (It would 
      be a real bitch to find the single engine service ceiling is 8500' when the 
      terrain is 9500' where you find yourself---Bummer!)
      Hope I've been some help.
      Jim Crunkleton 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"MASON CHEVAILLIER" <KAMALA(at)msn.com>
              "BROOKE D HARLOW" ,
              "candice" ,
              "carol haskins" ,
              "commander-list" ,
              "DAN BRUHL" ,
              "Fearn Mastin" ,
              "FEDERICO M VELEZ A" 
Subject: 
Fw: Too Cool  a Story Not To Send.......
Date: 
Aug 30, 2005
              0.14 FROM_NO_LOWER          From address has no lower-case characters
      
      
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Kay Farman<mailto:kaydickson(at)charter.net>
      Subject: Fw: Too Cool a Story Not To Send.......
      
      
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Jane Lancaster<mailto:jrlancaster(at)yahoo.com>
      Subject: Too Cool a Story Not To Send.......
      
      
      Subject: Irish Luck - Remember to send it back!
      
      
      I want this back. It DOES work.
      
      
      His name was Fleming, and he was a poor Scottish farmer. One day, while trying
      to make a living for his family, he heard a cry for help coming from a nearby
      bog. He dropped his tools and ran to the bog.
      
      There, mired to his waist in black muck, was a terrified boy, screaming and struggling
      to free himself. Farmer Fleming saved the lad from what could have been
      a slow and terrifying death.
      
      The next day, a fancy carriage pulled up to the Scotsman's sparse surroundings.
      An elegantly dressed nobleman stepped out and introduced himself as the father
      of the boy Farmer Fleming had saved.
      
      "I want to repay you," said the nobleman. "You saved my son's life."
      
      "No, I can't accept payment for what I did," the Scottish farmer replied waving
      off the offer. At that moment, the farmer's own son came to the door of the family
      hovel.
      
      "Is that your son?" the nobleman asked.
      
      "Yes," the farmer replied proudly.
      
      "I'll make you a deal. Let me provide him with the level of education my own son
      will enjoy. If the lad is anything like his father, he'll no doubt grow to be
      a man we both will be proud of." And that he did.
      
      Farmer Fleming's son attended the very best schools and in time, graduated from
      St. Mary's Hospital Medical School in London, and went on to become known throughout
      the world as the noted Sir Alexander Fleming, the discoverer of Penicillin.
      
      Years afterward, the same nobleman's son who was saved from the bog was stricken
      with pneumonia.
      
      What saved his life this time? Penicillin.
      
      The name of the nobleman? Lord Randolph Churchill. His son's name?
      
      Sir Winston Churchill.
      
      Someone once said: What goes around comes around.
      
      Work like you don't need the money.
      
      Love like you've never been hurt.
      
      Dance like nobody's watching.
      
      Sing like nobody's listening.
      
      Live like it's Heaven on Earth.
      
      It's National Friendship Week. Send this to
      
      everyone you consider A FRIEND.
      
      Pass this on, and brighten someone's day.
      
      AN IRISH FR! IENDSHIP WISH: You had better send
      
      this back!! Good Luck!
      
      I hope it works...
      
      May there always be work for your hands to do;
      
      May your purse always hold a coin or two;
      
      May the sun always shine on your windowpane;
      
      May a rainbow be certain to follow each rain;
      
      May the hand of a friend always be near you;
      
      May God fill your heart with gladness to cheer you.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 30, 2005
From: 
Brock Lorber <blorber(at)vegasfc.com>
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
      
      
      Jim Crunkleton wrote:
      
      >520---Not an issue
      >560---Not an issue
      >560E---Not an issue
      >560A HC---Not an issue
      >560F---Watch density altitude/limit gross weight
      >680E---See above
      >680F---See above (Do-able but no room for error)
      >The remaining models---Consider an Aztruck
      >
      >  
      >
      Thanks, Jim.  Before seeing this, I was thinking one of two scenarios 
      was happening:
      
      a - The Commander list had banded together to play a big joke on me (or 
      scramble the few brain cells I had left), or
      
      b - N400CH is missing an engine and/or dragging a plow.
      
      I'm pretty sure both engines are attached and as strong as they can get 
      and I (usually) unhook the tug before taking the runway, so I had the BS 
      flag at half mast!  While the 680FL(P) has impressed me with its 
      short-field capabilities, they are nothing to write home about with any 
      load past pilot and a half a gallon of gas or so.
      
      Darn extra seats.  I'd really complain if I couldn't get them up over 
      200 knots.
      
      Brock Lorber
      N400CH
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Aug 30, 2005
      
      
      Gentlemen:
      
      Thanks very much for the replies.  Perhaps I should have mentioned that I
      have 100 amp generators on the 680F(p), and Zeftronics only has 50 amp
      voltage regulators.  This came as a surprise to me so I called their tech
      assistance lady and she confirmed it.  Any other suggestions?
      
      Regards,
      
      Moe
      N680RR
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: <BobsV35B(at)aol.com>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      >
      >
      > In a message dated 8/29/2005 4:27:41 P.M. Central Standard Time,
      > CloudCraft(at)aol.com writes:
      >
      > If you  can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues
      of
      > the  Flight Group News that featured these.
      >
      > Wing Commander  Gordon
      >
      >
      > Try: _http://www.zeftronics.com_ (http://www.zeftronics.com)
      >
      > Happy  Skies,
      >
      > Old Bob
      > AKA
      > Bob Siegfried
      > Ancient Aviator
      > Stearman  N3977A
      > Brookeridge Air Park LL22
      > Downers Grove, IL 60516
      > 630  985-8503
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Larry Wokral" <l.wokral(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: 
Zefftronics Regulators
Date: 
Aug 30, 2005
      
      
      >Am considering getting rid of the stock "Frankenstein" voltage regulators
      on
      my 680F(p).  Any suggestions?
      
      >Look in Trade A Plane for Zefftronics. The regulators you need are
      manufactured by them and they are GREAT replacements for the old open frame
      units originally installed. They are all solid state and have been trouble
      free since installation.
      
      I, too, have the Zefftronics solid state system installed on my 500B. I had
      the Merlyn folks install it during my Merlyn 320 turbo engine conversion. It
      completely replaces the stock one, and I have never had any trouble with it.
      Sorry, I don't remember the cost because it was mixed in with the engine
      conversion where I was spending BIG money. I also had their smaller solid
      state regulator on my Cardinal RG for many years with the same perfect
      result. It is over voltage protected and self resets.
      
      Larry Wokral
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Larry Wokral" <l.wokral(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: 
Short Grass Strips
Date: 
Aug 30, 2005
      
      
      >How short of an unobstructed grass strip are you willing to land on,
      assuming reasonable
      temperature and a few hundred under gross?
      Please tell me what you fly.
      
      I have been practicing high performance, short field takeoffs and landings
      in my Merlyn 320 converted 500B in preparation for taking it into my new
      1,200' sloped sod strip (close to 2,000' flat land equivalency with no
      departure obstructions). My local paved field is 3,642' in elevation. On
      density altitude days where it is closer to 5,000' in elevation and with
      just me and 100 gallons of fuel aboard, I've been getting off in about 900',
      and always under 1,000'. I start by holding brakes until getting 38" MP,
      increasing to 42" MP on the roll, and rotating by 70 KIAS. I pick up VYse
      speed after breaking ground quickly. As Morris suggested to me once, I've
      even tried holding the brakes until reaching the full 42" and then rotating
      at 65 KIAS and holding it there for the initial climb. That was
      exhilarating! The stall horn was sounding during initial rotation, but the
      plane kept its climb and accelerated with a little lessening of back
      pressure on the yoke. I really believe that it would easily operate out of
      short, unobstructed grass strips.
      
      Of course I have read the articles on multi engine takeoff speed safety
      techniques and was trained on making every attempt at reaching blue line
      before rotation or gaining it ASAP after rotation. None the less, these
      planes will give great short field performance when needed. Using a short
      field technique doesn't prevent you from gaining blue line speed immediately
      after breaking ground and clearing the obstacle. I readily admit that I am
      new at flying Aerocommanders. I would really love to have one of you really
      experienced Commander drivers fly this thing at this edge of the envelope
      just to help verify or determine its full capabilities.
      
      Larry Wokral
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Aug 30, 2005
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
      
      
      In a message dated 30-Aug-05 07:35:52 Pacific Daylight Time, 
      blorber(at)vegasfc.com writes:
      a - The Commander list had banded together to play a big joke on me (or 
      scramble the few brain cells I had left), or
      
      b - N400CH is missing an engine and/or dragging a plow.
      
      I'm pretty sure both engines are attached and as strong as they can get 
      and I (usually) unhook the tug before taking the runway, so I had the BS 
      flag at half mast!  While the 680FL(P) has impressed me with its 
      short-field capabilities, they are nothing to write home about with any 
      load past pilot and a half a gallon of gas or so.
      >
      >
      
      As much as we enjoy conspiring to blow your mind, Brock, we didn't this time.
      
      The (sad) fact of the RPM-FLP is that the 400 hp just doesn't get through the 
      props and turn into thrust like the original model's engine & prop 
      combination.
      
      Mr RPM did demonstrate the short field / high DENALT capability to some 
      missionaries by taking off at gross weight from Big Bear, California (L35) on a
      
      warm day -- but -- he loaded the aircraft with aft most C.G., which he says is
      
      the key to short field work in the long body Commander.
      
      Are you sure you unhooked the tug?  I heard you on frequency a while ago and 
      I remember ATC asking if you were a flight of two.
      
      Back to the original question, Ben -- if you can find a 680-E, you'll have as 
      good a short field Commander as you can get, both for East Coast and Rocky 
      Mountain regions.  Barry Hancock who is in the Group is selling his.  Get in 
      touch with him.
      
      Wing Commander Gordon
      
      
      Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 31, 2005
From: 
W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      Folks,
      I can testify to the Zeftronics, I have them in the 500A.
      Neither the previous two owners, nor I have had a problem.
      Cheers,
      Bill Hamilton
      
      
      At 07:23 30/08/2005, you wrote:
      >
      >A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      >developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage regulators 
      >to replace
      >the Frankenstine units.
      >
      >I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his AC-500-B.
      >
      >If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues of
      >the Flight Group News that featured these.
      >
      >Wing Commander Gordon
      >
      >PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      >
      >Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      >
      >
      
      
      CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet Services 
      and Warbirds.Net. & .
      This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It 
      is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are 
      not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of 
      this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege 
      attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the 
      mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error, please 
      notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Aug 31, 2005
From: 
W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      Barry,
      Lucas ???
      The reason poms drink warm bear, they've got Lucas Fridge's.
      Have you seen the Jaguar Clubs t-shirt, with a caricature of the old Joseph 
      Lucas and Sons logo
      In the double circle it says "Joseph Lucas --- Prince of Darkness".
      The deep dark secret, they not Lucas electrical systems in Jaguars, they 
      are all work on smoke, its not a battery, it's a smoke reservoir, and the 
      proof of this theorem, every time the smoke leaks out, the car stops.
      My two bob's worth on Lucas.
      Cheers,
      Bill Hamilton.
      
      also a proprietor of a Mk11 3.8 Coombs and an XK-6C, all now with Bosch.
      
      
      At 07:30 30/08/2005, you wrote:
      ><barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >
      >Don't Lucas do some good ones?
      >
      >BC (UK)
      >
      >----- Original Message -----
      >From: <CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM>
      >To: 
      >Subject: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      >
      >
      >|
      >| A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      >| developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage 
      >regulators to
      >replace
      >| the Frankenstine units.
      >|
      >| I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his AC-500-B.
      >|
      >| If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues of
      >| the Flight Group News that featured these.
      >|
      >| Wing Commander Gordon
      >|
      >| PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      >|
      >| Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >
      >
      
      
      CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet Services 
      and Warbirds.Net. & .
      This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It 
      is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are 
      not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of 
      this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege 
      attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the 
      mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error, please 
      notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
YOURTCFG(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Aug 31, 2005
Subject: 
Re: grass strip length
      
      
      In a message dated 8/29/2005 3:07:26 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,  
      ben(at)gmpexpress.net writes:
      
      it says  there that the 680 will beat the 680E
      
      
      HELO BEN.
      
              I own a 680E.  I also  fly and have flown every short bodied piston 
      type, except the 520, 560 and  680F.  I fly my 680E from a 2600 ft strip and 
      can use 1/2.  any day,  any load.  Book figures aside, the 680E will outperform
      
      all other short  bodied Commanders except the 680F.  Part of the difference in
      
      performance  numbers is the gross weight the airplanes are certified at.  For 
      instance,  the 680 has a gross weight 500lbs less that the 680E.  The 560E is 
      thousand  pounds less, same airframe.  Since TO performance is basically a 
      "drag  race" to see who can accelerate to take off speed first, the 500 pound 
      penalty  the 680E carries skews the true numbers.  Same weight, same day, the 
      680E  will blow the doors off all of them, except maybe the "F" (and I have  
      empirical knowable)
          That said, the 680E is probably not the  perfect Commander.  Almost any 
      of it's flat naccelled brethren will out run  it on 20% less fuel.  Performance
      
      is a ballancing act.  If you want  the very best short field, the 680E is the 
      one.  If you want a great  balance of performance, maybe another model will 
      fit your needs better.
          BTY, I was born and raised flying the Idaho back  country.  A Commander 
      works great!!  I used to love flying into  Johnson Creek or Garden Valley with
      
      my 560A.  All those harry chested  Cessna 180 and 206 guys couldn't believe 
      their eyes when the Commander came  around the corner.  It looked like an 
      airliner!!  Good luck, choose  wisely.  jb.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Aug 31, 2005
      
      
      Bill,
      
      How many amps are the generators on your 500A?  Problem is, they advise that
      their voltage regulators will handle a maximum of 50 amps, whereas, my plane
      has 100 amp generators.
      
      Thanx!
      
      Moe
      N680RR
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "W J R HAMILTON" <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      
      >
      > Folks,
      > I can testify to the Zeftronics, I have them in the 500A.
      > Neither the previous two owners, nor I have had a problem.
      > Cheers,
      > Bill Hamilton
      >
      >
      > At 07:23 30/08/2005, you wrote:
      > >
      > >A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      > >developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage
      regulators
      > >to replace
      > >the Frankenstine units.
      > >
      > >I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his AC-500-B.
      > >
      > >If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues
      of
      > >the Flight Group News that featured these.
      > >
      > >Wing Commander Gordon
      > >
      > >PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      > >
      > >Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      > W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet
      Services
      > and Warbirds.Net. & .
      > This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It
      > is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are
      > not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of
      > this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege
      > attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the
      > mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error,
      please
      > notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      > Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Randy Dettmer, AIA" <rcdettmer(at)charter.net>
Subject: 
Fly-in Preview
Date: 
Aug 31, 2005
      
      
      Hello Commanderland..!!
      Just wanted to share a neat "sneak peek" at the venue for the Fly-in coming
      up next month.  I dropped off my 680F at Morris Kernick's hangar in Stockton
      (SCK) on Monday for it's annual, and John Vormbaum volunteered to give me a
      lift in his 500B back home to San Luis Obispo (SBP).  But first, we stopped
      in Marina (near Monterey) to pick up JimBob, who was down doing some
      pre-flyin planning.  It was great to see the location for the Fly-in...lots
      of ramp space, very nice meeting room, and facilities at the old Fort Ord
      army base.  It's going to be a great event.
      
      It was really nice to see JB and his wife, and to share a great Commander
      ride in John's 500B.
      
      Looking forward to seeing many of you at the fly-in.  JB says that he's only
      got a handful of sign-ups so far.  Let's get with the program, and get your
      reservations turned in..!!
      
      See you all next month.
      
      Randy Dettmer
      680F / N6253X
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 01, 2005
From: 
W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: 
Voltage Regulators
      
      
      Moe,
      I will double check next time I am out at the hangar, also the P/N of the 
      regulators.
      Cheers,
      Bill Hamilton.
      
      
      At 02:46 1/09/2005, you wrote:
      >
      >Bill,
      >
      >How many amps are the generators on your 500A?  Problem is, they advise that
      >their voltage regulators will handle a maximum of 50 amps, whereas, my plane
      >has 100 amp generators.
      >
      >Thanx!
      >
      >Moe
      >N680RR
      >----- Original Message -----
      >From: "W J R HAMILTON" <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
      >To: 
      >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      >
      >
      >
      > >
      > > Folks,
      > > I can testify to the Zeftronics, I have them in the 500A.
      > > Neither the previous two owners, nor I have had a problem.
      > > Cheers,
      > > Bill Hamilton
      > >
      > >
      > > At 07:23 30/08/2005, you wrote:
      > > >
      > > >A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      > > >developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage
      >regulators
      > > >to replace
      > > >the Frankenstine units.
      > > >
      > > >I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his AC-500-B.
      > > >
      > > >If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues
      >of
      > > >the Flight Group News that featured these.
      > > >
      > > >Wing Commander Gordon
      > > >
      > > >PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      > > >
      > > >Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      > > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      > > W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet
      >Services
      > > and Warbirds.Net. & .
      > > This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It
      > > is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are
      > > not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of
      > > this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege
      > > attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the
      > > mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error,
      >please
      > > notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      > > Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      
      
      CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet Services 
      and Warbirds.Net. & .
      This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It 
      is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are 
      not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of 
      this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege 
      attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the 
      mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error, please 
      notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"tylor.hall" <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: 
Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Aug 31, 2005
      
      
      Moe,
      Gary Gadberry at Air Center owns the STC for the A/C units in Twin
      Commanders and part of the kit is 90 AMP Alternators to carry the extra
      load.  I do not know if the alternator mod is an STC by its self.  You may
      want to call them to see which regulator they use as part of the STC.
      Tylor Hall
      
      
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      Bill,
      
      How many amps are the generators on your 500A?  Problem is, they advise that
      their voltage regulators will handle a maximum of 50 amps, whereas, my plane
      has 100 amp generators.
      
      Thanx!
      
      Moe
      N680RR
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "W J R HAMILTON" <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      
      >
      > Folks,
      > I can testify to the Zeftronics, I have them in the 500A.
      > Neither the previous two owners, nor I have had a problem.
      > Cheers,
      > Bill Hamilton
      >
      >
      > At 07:23 30/08/2005, you wrote:
      > >
      > >A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      > >developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage
      regulators
      > >to replace
      > >the Frankenstine units.
      > >
      > >I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his AC-500-B.
      > >
      > >If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues
      of
      > >the Flight Group News that featured these.
      > >
      > >Wing Commander Gordon
      > >
      > >PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      > >
      > >Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      > W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet
      Services
      > and Warbirds.Net. & .
      > This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It
      > is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are
      > not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of
      > this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege
      > attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the
      > mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error,
      please
      > notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      > Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
YOURTCFG(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Sep 01, 2005
Subject: 
FLY-IN!!!!!!!!!!
      
      
      HI KIDS.
      
              Well, the time is  short!!  I about three weeks the TCFG will be 
      meeting in Marina CA.  (OAR)  Sue and I just returned form there making the last
      
      minute  arrangements.  This year may be the best ever.  We have great  speakers
      
      lined up on great subjects.  There will be important news.   Like, Andrew 
      Towner is in the final stages of establishing a first class piston  Commander 
      training facility, complete with a Commander flight  training device.  The 
      software for the trainer has already been  written and he planes to use a cabin
      
      section from a real Commander.   They will also be able to provide "real" training
      
      in the company Shrike.   This is amazing good news, so plan to attend and get 
      all the straight  skinny.  
          We will be meeting in a nice room at the Marina  airport office.  We have 
      a TV, VCR overhead and power point  capabilities.  It will be a great place 
      to lean about  Commanders. 
          The awards dinner and auction is being held  at Gilberts Seafood 
      Restraint with a not to be missed view of Monterey  Bay!!
          We have a great fly-out planned.  On Friday,  John Vormbaum will be 
      leading us to Columbia CA to a small "Gold rush town" for  lunch.  On Saturday,
      the 
      ladies will have a day of shopping in Carmel Ca  while the "boys" talk 
      Commanders.
          There will be tons of great food and Commanders,  Commanders, Commanders.
          The sign up is bigger that usual for this time so  if you are planning to 
      attend (and you should be planning to attend, lest why  would you be on this 
      chat list), get your registration info in NOW!!
          Enterprise rent-a-car will be delivering cars to  the Marina airport and 
      they can be dropped there after the  event.  Make you reservation through the 
      Seaside Ca office.  Be sure  to ask for the TCFG rate.  We have set up a 
      corporate account to get a  discount.
          If you have never been to a TCFG fly-in, you  don't know what you are 
      missing.  If you love Commanders, own a Commander,  think you might buy a 
      Commander or just want to have a great time around great  people and great airplanes,
      
      register today and we will see you there!!  Jim  Metzger (capt jimbob) 
      Director, Twin Commander Flight  Group  
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com>
Subject: 
Re: FLY-IN!!!!!!!!!!
Date: 
Sep 01, 2005
      
      
      Commandermen & Ladies,
      
      I have to voice my support for the upcoming flyin. Captain Jimbob & Captain
      Suebob have done an amazing amount of legwork to make sure that this event
      will be the best yet. Marina is a great facility; tons of ramp space, a
      quality meeting room, a location near fantastic sightseeing, eating,
      shopping & relaxing, and a chance for a great "poker run" in our airplanes.
      I for one can't wait until a formation of Commanders descends on
      Columbia---that should be a sight to see! We'll have a chance to shop & eat
      in an authentic CA Gold Rush town that is literally a 10 minute walk from
      the airfield.
      
      It's also a huge benefit to have some of the senior Commander brains
      attending, including the Towners, Jimbob, Morris, Sir Barry (you WILL be
      here, right Barry?) and hopefully a surprise guest whose last name is
      synonymous with Aero Commander. I know there are some great talks
      planned....it's a chance to learn something new about these wonderful
      airplanes, which is what happens for me every time these people congregate.
      
      Having made the trip to Dayton & Kansas City myself, I'm really hoping some
      of you easterners & southerners will put in a little effort to come see the
      Monterey Bay during the best time of year to visit.
      
      Also, if anyone has the "jones", I may try to squeeze in a round of golf at
      one of the famous 17 Mile Drive golf courses on Sunday after (I'm assuming)
      the early departure of our esteemed visitors. If you want to play, let me
      know and I will get a group set up.
      
      So make SURE you attend this year.....because next year, avgas could be $6 a
      gallon at the rate we're going!
      
      /John
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: <YOURTCFG(at)aol.com>
      Subject: Commander-List: FLY-IN!!!!!!!!!!
      
      
      >
      > HI KIDS.
      >
      >         Well, the time is  short!!  I about three weeks the TCFG will be
      > meeting in Marina CA.  (OAR)  Sue and I just returned form there making
      the last
      > minute  arrangements.  This year may be the best ever.  We have great
      speakers
      > lined up on great subjects.  There will be important news.   Like, Andrew
      > Towner is in the final stages of establishing a first class piston
      Commander
      > training facility, complete with a Commander flight  training device.  The
      > software for the trainer has already been  written and he planes to use a
      cabin
      > section from a real Commander.   They will also be able to provide "real"
      training
      > in the company Shrike.   This is amazing good news, so plan to attend and
      get
      > all the straight  skinny.
      >     We will be meeting in a nice room at the Marina  airport office.  We
      have
      > a TV, VCR overhead and power point  capabilities.  It will be a great
      place
      > to lean about  Commanders.
      >     The awards dinner and auction is being held  at Gilberts Seafood
      > Restraint with a not to be missed view of Monterey  Bay!!
      >     We have a great fly-out planned.  On Friday,  John Vormbaum will be
      > leading us to Columbia CA to a small "Gold rush town" for  lunch.  On
      Saturday, the
      > ladies will have a day of shopping in Carmel Ca  while the "boys" talk
      > Commanders.
      >     There will be tons of great food and Commanders,  Commanders,
      Commanders.
      >     The sign up is bigger that usual for this time so  if you are planning
      to
      > attend (and you should be planning to attend, lest why  would you be on
      this
      > chat list), get your registration info in NOW!!
      >     Enterprise rent-a-car will be delivering cars to  the Marina airport
      and
      > they can be dropped there after the  event.  Make you reservation through
      the
      > Seaside Ca office.  Be sure  to ask for the TCFG rate.  We have set up a
      > corporate account to get a  discount.
      >     If you have never been to a TCFG fly-in, you  don't know what you are
      > missing.  If you love Commanders, own a Commander,  think you might buy a
      > Commander or just want to have a great time around great  people and great
      airplanes,
      > register today and we will see you there!!  Jim  Metzger (capt jimbob)
      > Director, Twin Commander Flight  Group
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Howard Windham" <buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com>
Subject: 
FLY-IN!!!!!!!!!!
Date: 
Sep 01, 2005
      
      
      Jimbob, registration is in the mail for Kerry and myself.  Would never let
      you down. 
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
      YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
      Subject: Commander-List: FLY-IN!!!!!!!!!!
      
      
      HI KIDS.
      
              Well, the time is  short!!  I about three weeks the TCFG will be
      meeting in Marina CA.  (OAR)  Sue and I just returned form there making the
      last minute  arrangements.  This year may be the best ever.  We have great
      speakers 
      lined up on great subjects.  There will be important news.   Like, Andrew 
      Towner is in the final stages of establishing a first class piston
      Commander training facility, complete with a Commander flight  training
      device.  The software for the trainer has already been  written and he
      planes to use a cabin 
      section from a real Commander.   They will also be able to provide "real"
      training 
      in the company Shrike.   This is amazing good news, so plan to attend and
      get 
      all the straight  skinny.  
          We will be meeting in a nice room at the Marina  airport office.  We
      have a TV, VCR overhead and power point  capabilities.  It will be a great
      place to lean about  Commanders. 
          The awards dinner and auction is being held  at Gilberts Seafood
      Restraint with a not to be missed view of Monterey  Bay!!
          We have a great fly-out planned.  On Friday,  John Vormbaum will be
      leading us to Columbia CA to a small "Gold rush town" for  lunch.  On
      Saturday, the ladies will have a day of shopping in Carmel Ca  while the
      "boys" talk Commanders.
          There will be tons of great food and Commanders,  Commanders,
      Commanders.
          The sign up is bigger that usual for this time so  if you are planning
      to attend (and you should be planning to attend, lest why  would you be on
      this chat list), get your registration info in NOW!!
          Enterprise rent-a-car will be delivering cars to  the Marina airport and
      they can be dropped there after the  event.  Make you reservation through
      the Seaside Ca office.  Be sure  to ask for the TCFG rate.  We have set up a
      corporate account to get a  discount.
          If you have never been to a TCFG fly-in, you  don't know what you are
      missing.  If you love Commanders, own a Commander,  think you might buy a
      Commander or just want to have a great time around great  people and great
      airplanes, register today and we will see you there!!  Jim  Metzger (capt
      jimbob) Director, Twin Commander Flight  Group  
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"MASON CHEVAILLIER" <KAMALA(at)msn.com>
              "barry.collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>,
              "BILL MUNRO" ,
              "BILL WILSON" ,
              "BROOKE D HARLOW" ,
              "candice" ,
              "carol haskins" ,
              "CLOUDCRAFT" ,
              "commander-list" ,
              "DAN BRUHL" 
Subject: 
Fw: Breath Taking Photos-worth opening to see..
Date: 
Sep 01, 2005
      
      
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Lindsay Carver<mailto:rockergurl8301(at)hotmail.com>
      Subject: FW: Breath Taking Photos-worth opening to see..
      
      
        From: "Kevin Thaxton" <kthaxton(at)lesliegp.com<mailto:kthaxton(at)lesliegp.com>>
        To: "'Jenny Stallsmith'" ,"'marquita,"'marquita> ricketts'" ,"'Mary,"'Mary> Zelnik'" ,"'Michael,"'Michael> Hale'" ,"'Stephanie,"'Stephanie> Byer'" ,"'Lindsay,"'Lindsay> Carver'" ,,>
        CC: "'Becky Bender'" >
        Subject: FW: Breath Taking Photos-worth opening to see..
        Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 11:10:48 -0400
      
      
        Kevin Thaxton
        The Leslie Group
        5060 Parkcenter Ave Suite B
        Dublin, Ohio 43017
        Direct: 614-760-8705
        Main: 614-760-0701
        Fax: 614-760-0705
        Cell: 614-309-1597
      
      
        From: Elaina Leslie [mailto:eleslie(at)lesliegp.com]
        Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 10:30 AM
        To: kendall(at)mlarchs.com; Joan Mooney; Kevin Thaxton; Kit Redman; 'Carole Mauro'; 'Susan Hayden'
        Subject: FW: Breath Taking Photos-worth opening to see..
      
      
        From: Laura Creske [mailto:lcreske(at)columbuskw.com]
        Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 9:18 AM
        To: BDTman(at)aol.com; 'Elaina Leslie'; 'Coleman, Rosemary'; 'Lisa Nichols'; dlemley(at)columbuskw.com; 'Judy Jensen'; tracy_franckhauser(at)bankone.com
        Subject: FW: Breath Taking Photos-worth opening to see..
      
      
        These pictures are beautiful!!! Enjoy!!
      
      
        From: Marilyn Kramer [mailto:mkramer(at)columbuskw.com]
        Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:50 AM
        To: SHARON SULLIVAN; MICHELE KUDLA; LAURA CRESKE; Jackie Ingersoll; BETH MORTON
        Subject: FW: Breath Taking Photos-worth opening to see..
      
      
        -----Original Message-----
        From: Whitcraft, Barbara [mailto:barbara.whitcraft(at)realliving.com]
        Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:29 AM
        To: mkramer(at)columbuskw.com; Lephart, Margaret; Zborovsky, Linda; Baker, Mary
      Jo
        Cc: sonja_whitcraft(at)yahoo.com
        Subject: FW: Breath Taking Photos-worth opening to see..
      
      
        From: BLSnyder [mailto:BLSnyde(at)columbus.rr.com]
        Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2005 12:04 PM
        To: Dayna Hale; kathy roudabush; Kim Branch-Harris; Lisa Lyons
        Subject: FW: Breath Taking Photos-worth opening to see..
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Sep 01, 2005
      
      
      Bill,
      
      Thank you very much!
      
      Moe
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "W J R HAMILTON" <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
      Subject: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      
      >
      > Moe,
      > I will double check next time I am out at the hangar, also the P/N of the
      > regulators.
      > Cheers,
      > Bill Hamilton.
      >
      >
      > At 02:46 1/09/2005, you wrote:
      > >
      > >Bill,
      > >
      > >How many amps are the generators on your 500A?  Problem is, they advise
      that
      > >their voltage regulators will handle a maximum of 50 amps, whereas, my
      plane
      > >has 100 amp generators.
      > >
      > >Thanx!
      > >
      > >Moe
      > >N680RR
      > >----- Original Message -----
      > >From: "W J R HAMILTON" <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
      > >To: 
      > >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > >
      > > > Folks,
      > > > I can testify to the Zeftronics, I have them in the 500A.
      > > > Neither the previous two owners, nor I have had a problem.
      > > > Cheers,
      > > > Bill Hamilton
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > At 07:23 30/08/2005, you wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > >A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      > > > >developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage
      > >regulators
      > > > >to replace
      > > > >the Frankenstine units.
      > > > >
      > > > >I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his
      AC-500-B.
      > > > >
      > > > >If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive
      issues
      > >of
      > > > >the Flight Group News that featured these.
      > > > >
      > > > >Wing Commander Gordon
      > > > >
      > > > >PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      > > > >
      > > > >Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      > > > W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet
      > >Services
      > > > and Warbirds.Net. & .
      > > > This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee.
      It
      > > > is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you
      are
      > > > not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying
      of
      > > > this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal
      privilege
      > > > attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the
      > > > mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error,
      > >please
      > > > notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      > > > Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      > W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet
      Services
      > and Warbirds.Net. & .
      > This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It
      > is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are
      > not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of
      > this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege
      > attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the
      > mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error,
      please
      > notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      > Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
YOURTCFG(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Sep 01, 2005
Subject: 
Re: FLY-IN!!!!!!!!!!
      
      
      In a message dated 9/1/2005 5:37:29 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,  
      buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com writes:
      
      Jimbob,  registration is in the mail for Kerry and myself.  Would never let
      you  down
      
      
      THANKS!!  See you soon.  jb
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com>
Subject: 
Re: FLY-IN!!!!!!!!!!
Date: 
Sep 01, 2005
      
      
      Buddy, I was hoping you'd show! Excellent!
      
      /John
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Howard Windham" <buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com>
      Subject: RE: Commander-List: FLY-IN!!!!!!!!!!
      
      
      
      >
      > Jimbob, registration is in the mail for Kerry and myself.  Would never let
      > you down.
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
      > [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
      > YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
      > To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
      > Subject: Commander-List: FLY-IN!!!!!!!!!!
      >
      >
      > HI KIDS.
      >
      >         Well, the time is  short!!  I about three weeks the TCFG will be
      > meeting in Marina CA.  (OAR)  Sue and I just returned form there making
      the
      > last minute  arrangements.  This year may be the best ever.  We have great
      > speakers
      > lined up on great subjects.  There will be important news.   Like, Andrew
      > Towner is in the final stages of establishing a first class piston
      > Commander training facility, complete with a Commander flight  training
      > device.  The software for the trainer has already been  written and he
      > planes to use a cabin
      > section from a real Commander.   They will also be able to provide "real"
      > training
      > in the company Shrike.   This is amazing good news, so plan to attend and
      > get
      > all the straight  skinny.
      >     We will be meeting in a nice room at the Marina  airport office.  We
      > have a TV, VCR overhead and power point  capabilities.  It will be a great
      > place to lean about  Commanders.
      >     The awards dinner and auction is being held  at Gilberts Seafood
      > Restraint with a not to be missed view of Monterey  Bay!!
      >     We have a great fly-out planned.  On Friday,  John Vormbaum will be
      > leading us to Columbia CA to a small "Gold rush town" for  lunch.  On
      > Saturday, the ladies will have a day of shopping in Carmel Ca  while the
      > "boys" talk Commanders.
      >     There will be tons of great food and Commanders,  Commanders,
      > Commanders.
      >     The sign up is bigger that usual for this time so  if you are planning
      > to attend (and you should be planning to attend, lest why  would you be on
      > this chat list), get your registration info in NOW!!
      >     Enterprise rent-a-car will be delivering cars to  the Marina airport
      and
      > they can be dropped there after the  event.  Make you reservation through
      > the Seaside Ca office.  Be sure  to ask for the TCFG rate.  We have set up
      a
      > corporate account to get a  discount.
      >     If you have never been to a TCFG fly-in, you  don't know what you are
      > missing.  If you love Commanders, own a Commander,  think you might buy a
      > Commander or just want to have a great time around great  people and great
      > airplanes, register today and we will see you there!!  Jim  Metzger (capt
      > jimbob) Director, Twin Commander Flight  Group
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Larry Wokral" <l.wokral(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: 
Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Sep 01, 2005
      
      
      >How many amps are the generators on your 500A?  Problem is, they advise
      that
      their voltage regulators will handle a maximum of 50 amps, whereas, my plane
      has 100 amp generators.
      
      The Zefftronics system on my 500B handles my 70 amp alternators without a
      problem. I'm really not sure what they are actually rated for. Perhaps you
      should call Hugh Evans at Merlyn Products who worked it all out with the
      manufacturer to see how he did it.
      
      Larry Wokral
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Sep 03, 2005
      
      
      I deleted a message from aviation(at)aol.com (or something like that) without
      reading it. Please resent. I don't want to appear non-responsive.
      Nico
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Larry Wokral" <l.wokral(at)ix.netcom.com>
      Subject: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      
      >
      > >How many amps are the generators on your 500A?  Problem is, they advise
      > that
      > their voltage regulators will handle a maximum of 50 amps, whereas, my
      plane
      > has 100 amp generators.
      >
      > The Zefftronics system on my 500B handles my 70 amp alternators without a
      > problem. I'm really not sure what they are actually rated for. Perhaps you
      > should call Hugh Evans at Merlyn Products who worked it all out with the
      > manufacturer to see how he did it.
      >
      > Larry Wokral
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 04, 2005
From: 
W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: 
Voltage Regulators
      
      
      Moe,
      My 500A is really original, 50 amp. generators, so old that brushes are 
      hard to come by, except where truck parts are sold, the actual origin of 
      the generator is an AC-Delco truck unit.
      Despite the pre historic 618M-2 Collins VHF - 2 off, 51V-4A Collins ADF by 
      2, one old Collins VOR/ILS 51R-8A/51V-5 , marker etc plus King 
      Transponder,DME and interphone, battery charge etc doesn't seem to have 
      ever been a problem.
      Cheers,
      Bill Hamilton
      
      
      At 14:56 1/09/2005, you wrote:
      >
      >Moe,
      >Gary Gadberry at Air Center owns the STC for the A/C units in Twin
      >Commanders and part of the kit is 90 AMP Alternators to carry the extra
      >load.  I do not know if the alternator mod is an STC by its self.  You may
      >want to call them to see which regulator they use as part of the STC.
      >Tylor Hall
      >
      >
      >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      >
      >
      >Bill,
      >
      >How many amps are the generators on your 500A?  Problem is, they advise that
      >their voltage regulators will handle a maximum of 50 amps, whereas, my plane
      >has 100 amp generators.
      >
      >Thanx!
      >
      >Moe
      >N680RR
      >----- Original Message -----
      >From: "W J R HAMILTON" <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
      >To: 
      >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      >
      >
      >
      > >
      > > Folks,
      > > I can testify to the Zeftronics, I have them in the 500A.
      > > Neither the previous two owners, nor I have had a problem.
      > > Cheers,
      > > Bill Hamilton
      > >
      > >
      > > At 07:23 30/08/2005, you wrote:
      > > >
      > > >A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      > > >developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage
      >regulators
      > > >to replace
      > > >the Frankenstine units.
      > > >
      > > >I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his AC-500-B.
      > > >
      > > >If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive issues
      >of
      > > >the Flight Group News that featured these.
      > > >
      > > >Wing Commander Gordon
      > > >
      > > >PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      > > >
      > > >Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      > > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      > > W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet
      >Services
      > > and Warbirds.Net. & .
      > > This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It
      > > is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are
      > > not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of
      > > this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege
      > > attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the
      > > mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error,
      >please
      > > notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      > > Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      
      
      CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet Services 
      and Warbirds.Net. & .
      This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It 
      is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are 
      not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of 
      this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege 
      attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the 
      mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error, please 
      notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Sep 04, 2005
Subject: 
Old Panels
      
      
      Mr. Hamilton,
      
      Could you do us a favor and photograph your panel?
      
      I was thinking the other day about the double edged sword that is being swung 
      in the Commander world.
      
      Lots of panels are being upgraded with Buck Rogers avionics, but nobody is 
      dedicated to preserving any specimens of the originals.
      
      It would be great to gather up some original panel photos and I'm sure lots 
      of the owners on this list have some "Before and After" series.
      
      Maybe Nico, the Patron Saint of On-Line Commander Archival Material, would 
      host them.
      
      Wing Commander Gordon
      
      Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
YOURTCFG(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Sep 04, 2005
Subject: 
Fly-In Registration
      
      
      For those of you who haven't received a Fly-In registration or misplaced  it, 
      attached is the form in a Word document that you can download and  print.  
      
      Looking forward to seeing everyone later this month. 
      
      Capt. Jim Bob
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
CloudCraft(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Sep 04, 2005
Subject: 
CQ Dennis Polito
      
      
      CQ CQ CQ Dennis Piloto
      
      Please call me.
      
      702-496-9112
      
      Over.
      
      Wing Commander Gordon
      
      Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Re: Old Panels
Date: 
Sep 04, 2005
      
      
      Sure. Let me have them and I will host them.
      Nico
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: <CloudCraft(at)aol.com>
      Subject: Commander-List: Old Panels
      
      
      >
      > Mr. Hamilton,
      >
      > Could you do us a favor and photograph your panel?
      >
      > I was thinking the other day about the double edged sword that is being
      swung
      > in the Commander world.
      >
      > Lots of panels are being upgraded with Buck Rogers avionics, but nobody is
      > dedicated to preserving any specimens of the originals.
      >
      > It would be great to gather up some original panel photos and I'm sure
      lots
      > of the owners on this list have some "Before and After" series.
      >
      > Maybe Nico, the Patron Saint of On-Line Commander Archival Material, would
      > host them.
      >
      > Wing Commander Gordon
      >
      > Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"jmenchetti(at)cantv.net" <jmenchetti(at)cantv.net>
Subject: 
Old Panels, my 680F panel
Date: 
Sep 05, 2005
      
      
      Dear gentlemen, here are some pics of my 680f panel, before having a
      facelift
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
Barry Hancock <radialpower(at)cox.net>
Subject: 
Re: fly-in
Date: 
Sep 05, 2005
      
      
      >
      > For those of you who haven't received a Fly-In registration or 
      > misplaced  it,
      > attached is the form in a Word document that you can download and  
      > print.
      >
      >
      Remember this site strips all attachments....
      
      Cheers,
      
      Barry
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
CloudCraft(at)aol.com
Date: 
Sep 05, 2005
Subject: 
Re: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      
      
      Now THAT is a classic panel!  Thank you, Sir.
      
      You all do realize that soon there will be a generation of pilots who will 
      not recognize most of the instruments shown here.
      
      Wing Commander Gordon
      
      Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"tylor.hall" <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: 
Old Panels, my 680F panel
Date: 
Sep 05, 2005
      
      
      Keith,
      I have collected a number of panel photos.  Some are before and after
      photos.
      I have N2001M before and after photos.
      I will send them to Nico to post.
      
      I just check the www.aerocommander.com web site and the distance calculator
      and hotel information is for last year.
      Tylor Hall
      
      
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      
      
      Now THAT is a classic panel!  Thank you, Sir.
      
      You all do realize that soon there will be a generation of pilots who will
      not recognize most of the instruments shown here.
      
      Wing Commander Gordon
      
      Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Re: Old Panels, my 680F panel
Date: 
Sep 05, 2005
      
      
      N2001M's panel has been posted to
      http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/
      Click on "Panels" and "N2001M". I created a special folder for panels to
      reduce the clutter in case there are some other folks who would want to have
      their panels published. Currently there is a folder for each Commander for
      which I have pictures. If you feel it would be better to merely include the
      panel photos within the Commander's folder instead of separately under a
      "Panels" folder, let me know. Your feedback would be appreciated. Then,
      perhaps, Mason could send us pictures of the rest of his Commander.
      
      Thanks
      Nico
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "tylor.hall" <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
      Subject: RE: Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      
      
      
      >
      > Keith,
      > I have collected a number of panel photos.  Some are before and after
      > photos.
      > I have N2001M before and after photos.
      > I will send them to Nico to post.
      >
      > I just check the www.aerocommander.com web site and the distance
      calculator
      > and hotel information is for last year.
      > Tylor Hall
      >
      >
      > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      >
      >
      > Now THAT is a classic panel!  Thank you, Sir.
      >
      > You all do realize that soon there will be a generation of pilots who will
      > not recognize most of the instruments shown here.
      >
      > Wing Commander Gordon
      >
      > Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
Date: 
Sep 05, 2005
Subject: 
Re: fly-in
      
      
      Thanks for the reminder.  If anyone needs a registration form, let me  know 
      and I'll send to your individual email. 
      
      jb
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
Re: Old Panels, my 680F panel
Date: 
Sep 05, 2005
      
      
      I didn't realize there were pictures from the "Unofficial Redneck Commander 
      Flying, Pensacola" there.  One of the few times mine was running.
      
      bilbo
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      
      
      > 
      >
      > N2001M's panel has been posted to
      > http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/
      > Click on "Panels" and "N2001M". I created a special folder for panels to
      > reduce the clutter in case there are some other folks who would want to 
      > have
      > their panels published. Currently there is a folder for each Commander for
      > which I have pictures. If you feel it would be better to merely include 
      > the
      > panel photos within the Commander's folder instead of separately under a
      > "Panels" folder, let me know. Your feedback would be appreciated. Then,
      > perhaps, Mason could send us pictures of the rest of his Commander.
      >
      > Thanks
      > Nico
      >
      >
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: "tylor.hall" <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
      > To: ; 
      > Subject: RE: Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      >
      >
      > 
      >>
      >> Keith,
      >> I have collected a number of panel photos.  Some are before and after
      >> photos.
      >> I have N2001M before and after photos.
      >> I will send them to Nico to post.
      >>
      >> I just check the www.aerocommander.com web site and the distance
      > calculator
      >> and hotel information is for last year.
      >> Tylor Hall
      >>
      >>
      >> Subject: Re: Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      >>
      >>
      >> Now THAT is a classic panel!  Thank you, Sir.
      >>
      >> You all do realize that soon there will be a generation of pilots who 
      >> will
      >> not recognize most of the instruments shown here.
      >>
      >> Wing Commander Gordon
      >>
      >> Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      >>
      >>
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Re: Old Panels, my 680F panel
Date: 
Sep 05, 2005
      
      
      The collection is slowly growing and, as time passes, it will become quite a
      memory jerker. It would be nice if I could get some narratives that go with
      the pictures. Then one can see, read and enjoy the experiences again.
      Nico
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      
      
      >
      > I didn't realize there were pictures from the "Unofficial Redneck
      Commander
      > Flying, Pensacola" there.  One of the few times mine was running.
      >
      > bilbo
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
      > To: 
      > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      >
      >
      > > 
      > >
      > > N2001M's panel has been posted to
      > > http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/
      > > Click on "Panels" and "N2001M". I created a special folder for panels to
      > > reduce the clutter in case there are some other folks who would want to
      > > have
      > > their panels published. Currently there is a folder for each Commander
      for
      > > which I have pictures. If you feel it would be better to merely include
      > > the
      > > panel photos within the Commander's folder instead of separately under a
      > > "Panels" folder, let me know. Your feedback would be appreciated. Then,
      > > perhaps, Mason could send us pictures of the rest of his Commander.
      > >
      > > Thanks
      > > Nico
      > >
      > >
      > > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > > From: "tylor.hall" <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
      > > To: ; 
      > > Subject: RE: Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      > >
      > >
      > > 
      > >>
      > >> Keith,
      > >> I have collected a number of panel photos.  Some are before and after
      > >> photos.
      > >> I have N2001M before and after photos.
      > >> I will send them to Nico to post.
      > >>
      > >> I just check the www.aerocommander.com web site and the distance
      > > calculator
      > >> and hotel information is for last year.
      > >> Tylor Hall
      > >>
      > >>
      > >> Subject: Re: Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      > >>
      > >>
      > >> Now THAT is a classic panel!  Thank you, Sir.
      > >>
      > >> You all do realize that soon there will be a generation of pilots who
      > >> will
      > >> not recognize most of the instruments shown here.
      > >>
      > >> Wing Commander Gordon
      > >>
      > >> Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      > >>
      > >>
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
              "Jerry Sprayberry" 
Subject: 
Re: Before and After Panel
Date: 
Sep 05, 2005
      
      
      Jerry,
      It has been published at http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/ click on N198JW and then on the .html file. You may ignore the images folder - it just contains the images that are in the .html file. This is an example of images that come with commentaries - it looks a lot nicer, don't you think? So, if you guys would go through the images and send me the commentaries, I will repost them in this format.
      
      I reposted N2001M's panel under its registration number; I will remove the "Panels"
      folder later. Click on N2001M to view.
      Thanks
      Nico
      
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Jerry Sprayberry
        To: nico(at)cybersuperstore.com
        Sent: Monday, September 05, 2005 4:30 PM
        Subject: Before and After Panel
      
      
        Hi Nico:
      
        These are N198JW Panels Before and after. It is a 680F(p) Commander, that ended
      up with a Garmin 530, 430, Transponder and Audio Panel. Collins FD105 FD, Shaden
      Fuel Flow & Altitude Alerter.
      
        Thanks for posting.
      
        Jerry Sprayberry 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Re: 680FL-1794
Date: 
Sep 05, 2005
      
      
      Tylor,
      They are in
      http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/ and click on Commanders in Chile.
      Thanks
      Nico
      
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: tylor.hall
        To: Nico van Niekerk
        Sent: Monday, September 05, 2005 7:38 PM
        Subject: 680FL-1794
      
      
        Nico,
      
        680FL SN 1794 is a Mr RPM conversion that has lived in Chile for many years.
      It is one of 4 that are down there hauling boxes for a living.
      
        What is very different is the STC'ed large baggage door and clamshell opening
      main door.
      
      
        The STC is owned by Central Air, but they only did one conversion.
      
      
        The last photo shows the sister ships that are down there.
      
      
        Tylor Hall
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Re: 680FL-1794
Date: 
Sep 05, 2005
      
      
      Tylor,
      They are in
      http://www.teletuition.org/documents/Aviation/Aero%20Commanders/ and click on Commanders in Chile.
      Thanks
      Nico
      
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: tylor.hall
        To: Nico van Niekerk
        Sent: Monday, September 05, 2005 7:38 PM
        Subject: 680FL-1794
      
      
        Nico,
      
        680FL SN 1794 is a Mr RPM conversion that has lived in Chile for many years.
      It is one of 4 that are down there hauling boxes for a living.
      
        What is very different is the STC'ed large baggage door and clamshell opening
      main door.
      
      
        The STC is owned by Central Air, but they only did one conversion.
      
      
        The last photo shows the sister ships that are down there.
      
      
        Tylor Hall
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Randy Dettmer, AIA" <rcdettmer(at)charter.net>
Subject: 
Fly-in Reservations
Date: 
Sep 06, 2005
      
      
      Hello JimBob,
      Please let us know again what hotels you have coordinated with for the
      fly-in.  I would like to make my reservations for room and rental car.
      
      Looking forward to all the fun..!!  (I probably will arrive on Friday
      evening, since I am teaching a class at Cal Poly University this quarter
      that goes through Friday afternoon...darn)
      
      Thanks for all your hard work Jim..!!
      
      Randy D.
      680F / N6253X
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 
Re: Voltage Regulators
Date: 
Sep 06, 2005
      
      
      Bill,
      
      Thanx for the comments.  I am very hesitant to get rid of my 100 amp
      generators just so I can run different voltage regulators.  In the next few
      days I will call Gary Gadberry and see what he has to offer.
      
      Regards,
      
      Moe
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "W J R HAMILTON" <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
      Subject: RE: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      
      >
      > Moe,
      > My 500A is really original, 50 amp. generators, so old that brushes are
      > hard to come by, except where truck parts are sold, the actual origin of
      > the generator is an AC-Delco truck unit.
      > Despite the pre historic 618M-2 Collins VHF - 2 off, 51V-4A Collins ADF by
      > 2, one old Collins VOR/ILS 51R-8A/51V-5 , marker etc plus King
      > Transponder,DME and interphone, battery charge etc doesn't seem to have
      > ever been a problem.
      > Cheers,
      > Bill Hamilton
      >
      >
      > At 14:56 1/09/2005, you wrote:
      
      > >
      > >Moe,
      > >Gary Gadberry at Air Center owns the STC for the A/C units in Twin
      > >Commanders and part of the kit is 90 AMP Alternators to carry the extra
      > >load.  I do not know if the alternator mod is an STC by its self.  You
      may
      > >want to call them to see which regulator they use as part of the STC.
      > >Tylor Hall
      > >
      > >
      > >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      > >
      > >
      > >Bill,
      > >
      > >How many amps are the generators on your 500A?  Problem is, they advise
      that
      > >their voltage regulators will handle a maximum of 50 amps, whereas, my
      plane
      > >has 100 amp generators.
      > >
      > >Thanx!
      > >
      > >Moe
      > >N680RR
      > >----- Original Message -----
      > >From: "W J R HAMILTON" <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
      > >To: 
      > >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > >
      > > > Folks,
      > > > I can testify to the Zeftronics, I have them in the 500A.
      > > > Neither the previous two owners, nor I have had a problem.
      > > > Cheers,
      > > > Bill Hamilton
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > At 07:23 30/08/2005, you wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > >A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      > > > >developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage
      > >regulators
      > > > >to replace
      > > > >the Frankenstine units.
      > > > >
      > > > >I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his
      AC-500-B.
      > > > >
      > > > >If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive
      issues
      > >of
      > > > >the Flight Group News that featured these.
      > > > >
      > > > >Wing Commander Gordon
      > > > >
      > > > >PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      > > > >
      > > > >Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      > > > W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet
      > >Services
      > > > and Warbirds.Net. & .
      > > > This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee.
      It
      > > > is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you
      are
      > > > not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying
      of
      > > > this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal
      privilege
      > > > attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the
      > > > mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error,
      > >please
      > > > notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      > > > Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      > W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet
      Services
      > and Warbirds.Net. & .
      > This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It
      > is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are
      > not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of
      > this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege
      > attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the
      > mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error,
      please
      > notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      > Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 06, 2005
From: 
todd(at)hindmarsh.us
Subject: 
Old Panels, my 680F panel
      
      
      The attachments don't go through on the list.
      
      > -------- Original Message --------
      > Subject: [SPAM] Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      > From: "jmenchetti(at)cantv.net" <jmenchetti(at)cantv.net>
      > Date: Mon, September 05, 2005 4:58 am
      > To: CloudCraft(at)aol.com, commander-list(at)matronics.com
      > 
      > 
      > Dear gentlemen, here are some pics of my 680f panel, before having a
      > facelift
      > 
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
Date: 
Sep 06, 2005
Subject: 
Re: Fly-in Reservations
      
      
      Hi Randy, 
      
      Unfortunately, after 5 weeks of  negotiation we were unable to secure a group 
      rate that would be better than what  you could get on your own (via phone 
      call, travel site, travel agency).  It  was an unbelievable experience -- they
      
      wanted more for a group rate  ($149+) than the standard "rack" rate (~$114) and
      
      would have required  us to pay for any unused rooms.  Understandably, we 
      finally gave up and are  letting members book their own.  So would suggest you
      book 
      through your  favorite site (like travelocity), through a travel agent or see 
      a list of hotels  on the following link:
      
      _http://beachcalifornia.travelhero.com/index.cfm/id/139491/aid/68/city/MARINA/
      index.html_ 
      (http://beachcalifornia.travelhero.com/index.cfm/id/139491/aid/68/city/MARINA/index.html) .   It will probably bring up Holiday Inn, but  click 
      on the Marina tab for a list of other hotels.   
      Marina's rates are high for 2-3 star hotels.   So, if you're looking for a 
      better deal and don't mind a little commute (5-15  miles) better rates can be 
      found in Seaside (~5 miles) or Salinas (~10-15  miles).   
      Enterprise Rent-a-Car in Seaside will give our  members a corporate rate.  
      Call Laura Haaker or Sara Jacobsen at  831-372-4200 and let them know you are 
      with the Twin Commander Flight Group  (TCFG) and what time you will need your 
      car and they will pick you up at the  airport and shuttle you to their office to
      
      pick one up.   
      Let me  know if you need any additional information.  We're looking forward 
      to  seeing everyone.  
      Best  Regards, 
      Mrs.  Jim Bob
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
Date: 
Sep 06, 2005
Subject: 
TCFG Newsletter
      
      
      Hi everyone, 
      
      Hope you all enjoyed the long weekend and sent the summer out in  style.  The 
      latest issue of the Flight Group News was mailed today and  includes the 
      following information: 
      
          *   Fly-In Information 
          *   How to get a Pressure Carb Manual  
          *   Using a Checklist  
          *   Safety Alert 
          *   Commanderland News 
          *   Great Article on Modernizing a Shrike 
      Also, if you haven't gotten back to us with updates for the TCFG Directory  
      (both personal information and vendor information), please do so ASAP as we 
      will  start printing around September 12th and won't be able to make changes 
      after  that.  The Directory will be given out to TCFG Members at the Fly-In and
      
      mailed to the members not in attendance after the Fly-In.  
      
      Also, at this year's Fly-In we will be offering members who bring their  
      airplanes a free "walk around" tech inspection by a panel of experts (there will
      
      be a charge for non members).  
      
      If you're not a member you can join at _www.aerocommander.com_ 
      (http://www.aerocommander.com)  or can contact us  directly for a membership form. 
      
      Capt Jim Bob 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: 
Fly_in
Date: 
Sep 06, 2005
      
      
      Hi Guys,
      
      Well, I'm booked into the Comfort Inn, on Reservation Road, Marina for the 
      Fly-In.
      
      Anyone else booked in there?
      
      Really looking forward to seeing some new faces and meeting up with some old 
      ones!
      
      Also looking forward to seeing some new paint jobs (one which was long 
      overdue!!).
      
      Sincere Best Regards,
      Barry
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 06, 2005
From: 
Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: 
Matronics Web Server Upgrade Today Tuesday 09/06/05 5pm
      PDT
      
      
      Dear Listers,
      
      I will be taking the Matronics Web Server down for a few hours today, 
      Tuesday September 6 2005 for a chassis upgrade.  Archive browsing and 
      searching along with subscription services will be unavailable for 
      be processed normally during the upgrade.  Please check the Matronics 
      System Status Page for updates (although this page resides on the web 
      server and won't be available during the upgrade):
      
               http://www.matronics.com/SystemStatus/
      
      Matt Dralle
      Matronics Email List Admin.
      
      
      Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
      925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
      http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 06, 2005
From: 
John Towner <johntowner(at)centralairsouthwest.com>
Subject: 
Re: Fly_in
      
      
      *Barry,*
      
      We will try to book too at the Comfort Inn at Marina.  We wish everyone 
      could stay at the same place but hopefully all will workout.
      
      PS-Andrew has been working on buildfing a Commander simulator for us, 
      attached is a picture from the prototype we thought you might enjoy.  
      Are you going to bring N4007H? and we hope all is well with her.
      
      *YOUR FRIENDS,
      
      Andrew & John Towner*
      
      Barry Collman wrote:
      
      >
      >Hi Guys,
      >
      >Well, I'm booked into the Comfort Inn, on Reservation Road, Marina for the 
      >Fly-In.
      >
      >Anyone else booked in there?
      >
      >Really looking forward to seeing some new faces and meeting up with some old 
      >ones!
      >
      >Also looking forward to seeing some new paint jobs (one which was long 
      >overdue!!).
      >
      >Sincere Best Regards,
      >Barry
      >
      >
      >  
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Randy Dettmer, AIA" <rcdettmer(at)charter.net>
Subject: 
Fly_in
Date: 
Sep 06, 2005
      
      
      Kip and I are booked at the Comfort Inn too.  Looking forward to seeing you
      guys Friday afternoon or evening.
      
      Randy D.
      
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of John
      Towner
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Fly_in
      
      
      
      
      *Barry,*
      
      We will try to book too at the Comfort Inn at Marina.  We wish everyone
      could stay at the same place but hopefully all will workout.
      
      PS-Andrew has been working on buildfing a Commander simulator for us,
      attached is a picture from the prototype we thought you might enjoy.
      Are you going to bring N4007H? and we hope all is well with her.
      
      *YOUR FRIENDS,
      
      Andrew & John Towner*
      
      Barry Collman wrote:
      
      <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >
      >Hi Guys,
      >
      >Well, I'm booked into the Comfort Inn, on Reservation Road, Marina for the
      >Fly-In.
      >
      >Anyone else booked in there?
      >
      >Really looking forward to seeing some new faces and meeting up with some
      old
      >ones!
      >
      >Also looking forward to seeing some new paint jobs (one which was long
      >overdue!!).
      >
      >Sincere Best Regards,
      >Barry
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 
Website
Date: 
Sep 06, 2005
      
      
      We are now manufacturing this www.nicsysco.com so if you have important data on your computer and fear you might lose it if your equipment fails, let me know. Even though the website is pitched to the business owner, data on one's home computer or laptop is equally important and expensive to replace.
      
      Thanks
      Nico
      
      PS. Sorry about this shameless plug.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Tommy Mathieu" <tmathieu(at)msn.com>
Subject: 
Info on service bulletin & AD
Date: 
Sep 06, 2005
              7.50 BARRACUDA_HEADER_FP56  RBL: Blacklist bl.spamcop
                              [Blocked - see <http://www.spamcop.net/bl.shtml?64.4.51.220>]
      
      
      I have an AD I need to take care of on a Shrike Commander I own. I just
      bought the plane a year ago and AD 940419 is due. It is an ultrasound on the
      wing spar. One is due yearly and another approximately every 36 months. Both
      are currently due. Can anyone give me any information on the most reasonable
      place to have this performed and its approximate cost? I would greatly
      appreciate any assistance you can provide. The airplane is based in North
      Louisiana.
      
      Sincerely,
      
      Tommy Mathieu, member
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
<dfalik(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: 
Aircraft Heaters
Date: 
Sep 06, 2005
      
      
      I had the heater installed one month ago as they are in "my back yard".
      It has worked beautifully "as advertised".  Thanks for the heads up and
      recommendation as the existing Janitrol unit had never worked correctly.
      Don
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Moe
      Subject: Commander-List: Aircraft Heaters
      
      
      Fellow Commander Drivers:
      
      You might want to add to your parts source list for heaters:
      
      C & D Associates
      302 Post Road
      Buchanan, MI 49107 (Niles Michigan Airport 3TC)
      Phone 269.695.7469
      FAX 269.695.6004
      www.aircraftheater.com
      
      For less than the price of a stock overhaul, they will install a brand
      new C & D unit that has a TBO of 2,000 hours.  For the pressurized
      models it works completely independent of the troublesome B/C
      environmental control.  It also does not use the stock combustion air
      fan and its assorted paraphernalia.  It comes with its own single knob
      off/ on temp control switch.  They also rebuild stock heaters (but
      why?).
      
      I went back last week and had them install one, and although I have used
      it only a couple of hours I am very favorably impressed.
      
      Moe
      N680RR
      680F(p)
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"jmenchetti(at)cantv.net" <jmenchetti(at)cantv.net>
Subject: 
used simmonds 580SU
Date: 
Sep 07, 2005
      
      
      Dear Gentlemen, im looking for 2 simmonds 580SU units, in to be overhauled
      condition, many thanks
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 
Re: Aircraft Heaters
Date: 
Sep 07, 2005
      
      
      Don,
      
      Glad that you have had the same great good results that I have enjoyed.
      
      Moe
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: <dfalik(at)sbcglobal.net>
      Subject: RE: Commander-List: Aircraft Heaters
      
      
      > 
      > I had the heater installed one month ago as they are in "my back yard".
      > It has worked beautifully "as advertised".  Thanks for the heads up and
      > recommendation as the existing Janitrol unit had never worked correctly.
      > Don
      > 
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
      > [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Moe
      > To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
      > Subject: Commander-List: Aircraft Heaters
      > 
      > 
      > Fellow Commander Drivers:
      > 
      > You might want to add to your parts source list for heaters:
      > 
      > C & D Associates
      > 302 Post Road
      > Buchanan, MI 49107 (Niles Michigan Airport 3TC)
      > Phone 269.695.7469
      > FAX 269.695.6004
      > www.aircraftheater.com
      > 
      > For less than the price of a stock overhaul, they will install a brand
      > new C & D unit that has a TBO of 2,000 hours.  For the pressurized
      > models it works completely independent of the troublesome B/C
      > environmental control.  It also does not use the stock combustion air
      > fan and its assorted paraphernalia.  It comes with its own single knob
      > off/ on temp control switch.  They also rebuild stock heaters (but
      > why?).
      > 
      > I went back last week and had them install one, and although I have used
      > it only a couple of hours I am very favorably impressed.
      > 
      > Moe
      > N680RR
      > 680F(p)
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 07, 2005
From: 
Dan Farmer <daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 
Re: Commander-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 09/06/05
      
      
      Hi fellow "Commanderers"
      I hope we are not the only ones staying at the H. Inn on the registration.  The
      gal gave us a AAA rate but we are coming early the 21rst to look around the area.
      
      
      Unfortunately 69U is getting two new cranks and won't be there.
      
      dan farmer
      
      Commander-List Digest Server  wrote:
      *
      
      ==================================================
      Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
      ==================================================
      
      Today's complete Commander-List Digest can also be found in either of the 
      two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted 
      in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes 
      and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version 
      of the Commander-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor 
      such as Notepad or with a web browser. 
      
      HTML Version:
      
      http://www.matronics.com/digest/commander-list/Digest.Commander-List.2005-09-06.html
      
      Text Version:
      
      http://www.matronics.com/digest/commander-list/Digest.Commander-List.2005-09-06.txt
      
      
      ================================================
      EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
      ================================================
      
      
      Commander-List Digest Archive
      ---
      Total Messages Posted Tue 09/06/05: 12
      
      
      Today's Message Index:
      ----------------------
      
      1. 06:44 AM - Fly-in Reservations (Randy Dettmer, AIA)
      2. 07:11 AM - Re: Voltage Regulators (Moe)
      3. 09:49 AM - Re: Old Panels, my 680F panel (todd(at)hindmarsh.us)
      4. 11:23 AM - Re: Fly-in Reservations (YOURTCFG(at)aol.com)
      5. 11:30 AM - TCFG Newsletter (YOURTCFG(at)aol.com)
      6. 02:00 PM - Fly_in (Barry Collman)
      Dralle)
      8. 05:21 PM - Re: Fly_in (John Towner)
      9. 05:49 PM - Re: Fly_in (Randy Dettmer, AIA)
      10. 06:20 PM - Website (nico css)
      11. 08:52 PM - Info on service bulletin & AD (Tommy Mathieu)
      12. 09:01 PM - Re: Aircraft Heaters ()
      
      
      ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________
      
      
      From: "Randy Dettmer, AIA" 
      Subject: Commander-List: Fly-in Reservations
      
      
      Hello JimBob,
      Please let us know again what hotels you have coordinated with for the
      fly-in. I would like to make my reservations for room and rental car.
      
      Looking forward to all the fun..!! (I probably will arrive on Friday
      evening, since I am teaching a class at Cal Poly University this quarter
      that goes through Friday afternoon...darn)
      
      Thanks for all your hard work Jim..!!
      
      Randy D.
      680F / N6253X
      
      
      ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________
      
      
      From: "Moe" 
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      Bill,
      
      Thanx for the comments. I am very hesitant to get rid of my 100 amp
      generators just so I can run different voltage regulators. In the next few
      days I will call Gary Gadberry and see what he has to offer.
      
      Regards,
      
      Moe
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "W J R HAMILTON" 
      Subject: RE: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      
      
      >
      > Moe,
      > My 500A is really original, 50 amp. generators, so old that brushes are
      > hard to come by, except where truck parts are sold, the actual origin of
      > the generator is an AC-Delco truck unit.
      > Despite the pre historic 618M-2 Collins VHF - 2 off, 51V-4A Collins ADF by
      > 2, one old Collins VOR/ILS 51R-8A/51V-5 , marker etc plus King
      > Transponder,DME and interphone, battery charge etc doesn't seem to have
      > ever been a problem.
      > Cheers,
      > Bill Hamilton
      >
      >
      > At 14:56 1/09/2005, you wrote:
      
      > >
      > >Moe,
      > >Gary Gadberry at Air Center owns the STC for the A/C units in Twin
      > >Commanders and part of the kit is 90 AMP Alternators to carry the extra
      > >load. I do not know if the alternator mod is an STC by its self. You
      may
      > >want to call them to see which regulator they use as part of the STC.
      > >Tylor Hall
      > >
      > >
      > >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      > >
      > >
      > >Bill,
      > >
      > >How many amps are the generators on your 500A? Problem is, they advise
      that
      > >their voltage regulators will handle a maximum of 50 amps, whereas, my
      plane
      > >has 100 amp generators.
      > >
      > >Thanx!
      > >
      > >Moe
      > >N680RR
      > >----- Original Message -----
      > >From: "W J R HAMILTON" 
      > >To: 
      > >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Voltage Regulators
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > >
      > > > Folks,
      > > > I can testify to the Zeftronics, I have them in the 500A.
      > > > Neither the previous two owners, nor I have had a problem.
      > > > Cheers,
      > > > Bill Hamilton
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > At 07:23 30/08/2005, you wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > >A bazillion years ago (1997, to be exact) a company called Zeftronics
      > > > >developed and mounted in an Aero Commander, solid state voltage
      > >regulators
      > > > >to replace
      > > > >the Frankenstine units.
      > > > >
      > > > >I believe Dennis Polito installed some a few years ago in his
      AC-500-B.
      > > > >
      > > > >If you can't Google it, let me know and I'll try to find archive
      issues
      > >of
      > > > >the Flight Group News that featured these.
      > > > >
      > > > >Wing Commander Gordon
      > > > >
      > > > >PS: Is it pronounced "Frankenstine" or "Frankensteen?"
      > > > >
      > > > >Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      > > > W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet
      > >Services
      > > > and Warbirds.Net. & .
      > > > This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee.
      It
      > > > is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you
      are
      > > > not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying
      of
      > > > this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal
      privilege
      > > > attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the
      > > > mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error,
      > >please
      > > > notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      > > > Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
      > W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet
      Services
      > and Warbirds.Net. & .
      > This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It
      > is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are
      > not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of
      > this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege
      > attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the
      > mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error,
      please
      > notify us immediately to Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
      > Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
      >
      >
      
      
      ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________
      
      
      From: todd(at)hindmarsh.us
      Subject: RE: Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      
      
      The attachments don't go through on the list.
      
      > -------- Original Message --------
      > Subject: [SPAM] Commander-List: Old Panels, my 680F panel
      > From: "jmenchetti(at)cantv.net" 
      > Date: Mon, September 05, 2005 4:58 am
      > To: CloudCraft(at)aol.com, commander-list(at)matronics.com
      > 
      > 
      > Dear gentlemen, here are some pics of my 680f panel, before having a
      > facelift
      > 
      > 
      
      
      ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________
      
      
      From: YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Fly-in Reservations
      
      
      Hi Randy, 
      
      Unfortunately, after 5 weeks of negotiation we were unable to secure a group 
      rate that would be better than what you could get on your own (via phone 
      call, travel site, travel agency). It was an unbelievable experience -- they
      
      wanted more for a group rate ($149+) than the standard "rack" rate (~$114) and
      
      would have required us to pay for any unused rooms. Understandably, we 
      finally gave up and are letting members book their own. So would suggest you
      book 
      through your favorite site (like travelocity), through a travel agent or see 
      a list of hotels on the following link:
      
      _http://beachcalifornia.travelhero.com/index.cfm/id/139491/aid/68/city/MARINA/
      index.html_ 
      (http://beachcalifornia.travelhero.com/index.cfm/id/139491/aid/68/city/MARINA/index.html) . It will probably bring up Holiday Inn, but click 
      on the Marina tab for a list of other hotels. 
      Marina's rates are high for 2-3 star hotels. So, if you're looking for a 
      better deal and don't mind a little commute (5-15 miles) better rates can be 
      found in Seaside (~5 miles) or Salinas (~10-15 miles). 
      Enterprise Rent-a-Car in Seaside will give our members a corporate rate. 
      Call Laura Haaker or Sara Jacobsen at 831-372-4200 and let them know you are 
      with the Twin Commander Flight Group (TCFG) and what time you will need your 
      car and they will pick you up at the airport and shuttle you to their office to
      
      pick one up. 
      Let me know if you need any additional information. We're looking forward 
      to seeing everyone. 
      Best Regards, 
      Mrs. Jim Bob
      
      
      ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________
      
      
      From: YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
      Subject: Commander-List: TCFG Newsletter
      
      
      Hi everyone, 
      
      Hope you all enjoyed the long weekend and sent the summer out in style. The 
      latest issue of the Flight Group News was mailed today and includes the 
      following information: 
      
      * Fly-In Information 
      * How to get a Pressure Carb Manual 
      * Using a Checklist 
      * Safety Alert 
      * Commanderland News 
      * Great Article on Modernizing a Shrike 
      Also, if you haven't gotten back to us with updates for the TCFG Directory 
      (both personal information and vendor information), please do so ASAP as we 
      will start printing around September 12th and won't be able to make changes 
      after that. The Directory will be given out to TCFG Members at the Fly-In and
      
      mailed to the members not in attendance after the Fly-In. 
      
      Also, at this year's Fly-In we will be offering members who bring their 
      airplanes a free "walk around" tech inspection by a panel of experts (there will
      
      be a charge for non members). 
      
      If you're not a member you can join at _www.aerocommander.com_ 
      (http://www.aerocommander.com) or can contact us directly for a membership form. 
      
      Capt Jim Bob 
      
      
      ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________
      
      
      From: "Barry Collman" 
      Subject: Commander-List: Fly_in
      
      
      Hi Guys,
      
      Well, I'm booked into the Comfort Inn, on Reservation Road, Marina for the 
      Fly-In.
      
      Anyone else booked in there?
      
      Really looking forward to seeing some new faces and meeting up with some old 
      ones!
      
      Also looking forward to seeing some new paint jobs (one which was long 
      overdue!!).
      
      Sincere Best Regards,
      Barry
      
      
      ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________
      
      
      From: Matt Dralle 
      Subject: Commander-List: Matronics Web Server Upgrade Today Tuesday 09/06/05 5pm
      PDT
      
      
      Dear Listers,
      
      I will be taking the Matronics Web Server down for a few hours today, 
      Tuesday September 6 2005 for a chassis upgrade. Archive browsing and 
      searching along with subscription services will be unavailable for 
      be processed normally during the upgrade. Please check the Matronics 
      System Status Page for updates (although this page resides on the web 
      server and won't be available during the upgrade):
      
      http://www.matronics.com/SystemStatus/
      
      Matt Dralle
      Matronics Email List Admin.
      
      
      Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
      925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
      http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
      
      
      ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________
      
      
      From: John Towner 
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Fly_in
      
      
      *Barry,*
      
      We will try to book too at the Comfort Inn at Marina. We wish everyone 
      could stay at the same place but hopefully all will workout.
      
      PS-Andrew has been working on buildfing a Commander simulator for us, 
      attached is a picture from the prototype we thought you might enjoy. 
      Are you going to bring N4007H? and we hope all is well with her.
      
      *YOUR FRIENDS,
      
      Andrew & John Towner*
      
      Barry Collman wrote:
      
      >
      >Hi Guys,
      >
      >Well, I'm booked into the Comfort Inn, on Reservation Road, Marina for the 
      >Fly-In.
      >
      >Anyone else booked in there?
      >
      >Really looking forward to seeing some new faces and meeting up with some old 
      >ones!
      >
      >Also looking forward to seeing some new paint jobs (one which was long 
      >overdue!!).
      >
      >Sincere Best Regards,
      >Barry
      >
      >
      > 
      >
      
      
      ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________
      
      
      From: "Randy Dettmer, AIA" 
      Subject: RE: Commander-List: Fly_in
      
      
      Kip and I are booked at the Comfort Inn too. Looking forward to seeing you
      guys Friday afternoon or evening.
      
      Randy D.
      
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of John
      Towner
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Fly_in
      
      
      *Barry,*
      
      We will try to book too at the Comfort Inn at Marina. We wish everyone
      could stay at the same place but hopefully all will workout.
      
      PS-Andrew has been working on buildfing a Commander simulator for us,
      attached is a picture from the prototype we thought you might enjoy.
      Are you going to bring N4007H? and we hope all is well with her.
      
      *YOUR FRIENDS,
      
      Andrew & John Towner*
      
      Barry Collman wrote:
      
      
      >
      >Hi Guys,
      >
      >Well, I'm booked into the Comfort Inn, on Reservation Road, Marina for the
      >Fly-In.
      >
      >Anyone else booked in there?
      >
      >Really looking forward to seeing some new faces and meeting up with some
      old
      >ones!
      >
      >Also looking forward to seeing some new paint jobs (one which was long
      >overdue!!).
      >
      >Sincere Best Regards,
      >Barry
      >
      >
      
      
      ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________
      
      
      From: "nico css" 
      Subject: Commander-List: Website
      
      
      We are now manufacturing this www.nicsysco.com so if you have important data on your computer and fear you might lose it if your equipment fails, let me know. Even though the website is pitched to the business owner, data on one's home computer or laptop is equally important and expensive to replace.
      
      Thanks
      Nico
      
      PS. Sorry about this shameless plug.
      
      
      ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________
      
      
      From: "Tommy Mathieu" 
      Subject: Commander-List: Info on service bulletin & AD
      7.50 BARRACUDA_HEADER_FP56 RBL: Blacklist bl.spamcop
      [Blocked - see ]
      
      
      I have an AD I need to take care of on a Shrike Commander I own. I just
      bought the plane a year ago and AD 940419 is due. It is an ultrasound on the
      wing spar. One is due yearly and another approximately every 36 months. Both
      are currently due. Can anyone give me any information on the most reasonable
      place to have this performed and its approximate cost? I would greatly
      appreciate any assistance you can provide. The airplane is based in North
      Louisiana.
      
      Sincerely,
      
      Tommy Mathieu, member
      
      
      ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________
      
      
      From: 
      Subject: RE: Commander-List: Aircraft Heaters
      
      
      I had the heater installed one month ago as they are in "my back yard".
      It has worked beautifully "as advertised". Thanks for the heads up and
      recommendation as the existing Janitrol unit had never worked correctly.
      Don
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
      [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Moe
      Subject: Commander-List: Aircraft Heaters
      
      
      Fellow Commander Drivers:
      
      You might want to add to your parts source list for heaters:
      
      C & D Associates
      302 Post Road
      Buchanan, MI 49107 (Niles Michigan Airport 3TC)
      Phone 269.695.7469
      FAX 269.695.6004
      www.aircraftheater.com
      
      For less than the price of a stock overhaul, they will install a brand
      new C & D unit that has a TBO of 2,000 hours. For the pressurized
      models it works completely independent of the troublesome B/C
      environmental control. It also does not use the stock combustion air
      fan and its assorted paraphernalia. It comes with its own single knob
      off/ on temp control switch. They also rebuild stock heaters (but
      why?).
      
      I went back last week and had them install one, and although I have used
      it only a couple of hours I am very favorably impressed.
      
      Moe
      N680RR
      680F(p)
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: 
Re: Fly_in
Date: 
Sep 08, 2005
      
      
      Hi John,
      
      Well, it looks as though there might be a few of us booked into the Comfort Inn,
      
      which will be good. I'm still getting things ready to take with me, but N5007H
      
      will not be making the trip!
      
      Wow! That simulator looks pretty neat. Andrew must have put a long time into 
      that project and must be a very talented young man.
      
      Looking forward to seeing you both again,
      Best Regards,
      Barry
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "John Towner" <johntowner(at)centralairsouthwest.com>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Fly_in
      
      
      
      |
      | *Barry,*
      |
      | We will try to book too at the Comfort Inn at Marina.  We wish everyone
      | could stay at the same place but hopefully all will workout.
      |
      | PS-Andrew has been working on building a Commander simulator for us,
      | attached is a picture from the prototype we thought you might enjoy.
      | Are you going to bring N4007H? and we hope all is well with her.
      |
      | *YOUR FRIENDS,
      |
      | Andrew & John Towner*
      |
      | Barry Collman wrote:
      |
      <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      | >
      | >Hi Guys,
      | >
      | >Well, I'm booked into the Comfort Inn, on Reservation Road, Marina for the
      | >Fly-In.
      | >
      | >Anyone else booked in there?
      | >
      | >Really looking forward to seeing some new faces and meeting up with some old
      | >ones!
      | >
      | >Also looking forward to seeing some new paint jobs (one which was long
      | >overdue!!).
      | >
      | >Sincere Best Regards,
      | >Barry
      | >
      | >
      | >
      | >
      |
      |
      |
      |
      |
      |
      | 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 
Re: Fly_in
From: 
"Bert Berry" <bertberry1(at)aol.com>
Date: 
Sep 08, 2005
      
      
      Yesterday I was in New Orleans helping with rescue efforts when I heard the familiar
      sound of a twin commander.  Just wondering if it was any of you.  The sun
      was in my eyes but it looked like it was red.
      
      Man what a mess this place is.
      
      
      Bert
      -----Original Message-----
      From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 11:16:42 
      To:
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Fly_in
      
      
      Hi John,
      
      Well, it looks as though there might be a few of us booked into the Comfort Inn,
      
      which will be good. I'm still getting things ready to take with me, but N5007H
      
      will not be making the trip!
      
      Wow! That simulator looks pretty neat. Andrew must have put a long time into 
      that project and must be a very talented young man.
      
      Looking forward to seeing you both again,
      Best Regards,
      Barry
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "John Towner" <johntowner(at)centralairsouthwest.com>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Fly_in
      
      
      
      |
      | *Barry,*
      |
      | We will try to book too at the Comfort Inn at Marina.  We wish everyone
      | could stay at the same place but hopefully all will workout.
      |
      | PS-Andrew has been working on building a Commander simulator for us,
      | attached is a picture from the prototype we thought you might enjoy.
      | Are you going to bring N4007H? and we hope all is well with her.
      |
      | *YOUR FRIENDS,
      |
      | Andrew & John Towner*
      |
      | Barry Collman wrote:
      |
      <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      | >
      | >Hi Guys,
      | >
      | >Well, I'm booked into the Comfort Inn, on Reservation Road, Marina for the
      | >Fly-In.
      | >
      | >Anyone else booked in there?
      | >
      | >Really looking forward to seeing some new faces and meeting up with some old
      | >ones!
      | >
      | >Also looking forward to seeing some new paint jobs (one which was long
      | >overdue!!).
      | >
      | >Sincere Best Regards,
      | >Barry
      | >
      | >
      | >
      | >
      |
      |
      |
      |
      |
      |
      | 
      
      
      bertberry1(at)aol.com
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: 
Hurricane Katrina
Date: 
Sep 08, 2005
      
      
      Hi All,
      
      Bert's posting just now has prompted me to do something I should have done last
      
      week and that is to see whether any of our members were caught up in the 
      hurricane.
      
      If so, I trust they are all OK.
      
      Is there anyone we 'should' have heard from in that area? Perhaps a 'usual' 
      poster of messages who hasn't been heard from?
      
      Best Regards,
      Barry C (UK) 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
RRamm52(at)cs.com
Date: 
Sep 08, 2005
Subject: 
Re: Hurricane Katrina
      
      
      Hi, Barry
      I'm writing this with genset running...aircraft are safe, area is not....the 
      560A, 2774B??, I believe, the one with the rumored mismatched engines, was on 
      the ramp at Picayune, Ms, and was blown sideway's and collapsed the left and 
      nose gear. I flew her about 6 weeks ago and she was a good one. I made the lady
      
      a fair offer and she turned it down. I believe it has no insurance. A sad 
      waste of a good commander.
      Don't know detailed damage. Steve and I were in the bonanza on a fly over of 
      our hurricane area. Cheers,
      Rob, Slidell, La.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: 
Re: Hurricane Katrina
Date: 
Sep 08, 2005
      
      
      Hi Rob,
      
      Glad you're OK.
      
      Yes, it's always sad to see the demise of a good Commander. N2774B was a 560A 
      (s/n 274), converted to a 560A(HC) in September 1967. This was indeed the 
      Commander with mismatched engines. GO-480-D1A one side and GO-480-G1B6 the other
      
      side. I saw it at Arlington, Washington about 3 years ago.
      
      Best Regards,
      Barry
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: <RRamm52(at)cs.com>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Hurricane Katrina
      
      
      |
      | Hi, Barry
      | I'm writing this with genset running...aircraft are safe, area is not....the
      | 560A, 2774B??, I believe, the one with the rumored mismatched engines, was on
      | the ramp at Picayune, Ms, and was blown sideway's and collapsed the left and
      | nose gear. I flew her about 6 weeks ago and she was a good one. I made the 
      lady
      | a fair offer and she turned it down. I believe it has no insurance. A sad
      | waste of a good commander.
      | Don't know detailed damage. Steve and I were in the bonanza on a fly over of
      | our hurricane area. Cheers,
      | Rob, Slidell, La.
      |
      |
      |
      |
      |
      |
      | 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
CloudCraft(at)aol.com
Date: 
Sep 08, 2005
Subject: 
Fwd: Status Report from Milt Concannon
      
      
      For those of you who know Dr. Milt Concannon (most recently of AC-685 N414C), 
      here is his status.
      
      Wing Commander Gordon
      
      Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      
      From: "Milt" <rocket(at)swmrmc.org>
      Subject: Re: Status Report
      Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 12:25:05 -0500
       RPD=4.00.0003;
       RPDID=303030312E30413039303230352E34333230374236372E303031352D422D4D3936762F49374B305A4157444C546645354F3975413D3D;
       ENG=IBF; TS=20050908180117; CAT=NONE; CON=NONE;
      
      
      Airplane family and house are OK. Lost my hangar, barns, many trees and condo on
      the coast (sat photo attached ) is toast.
      
      We are lucky compared to most.
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: CloudCraft(at)aol.com
        To: N395V(at)direcway.com
        Sent: Thursday, September 08, 2005 11:33 AM
        Subject: Status Report
      
      
        Dr. Milt,
      
        Are you / your airplane OK down there?
      
        Wing Commander Gordon
      
        Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      
      
      
      
      
      
      Airplane family and house are OK. Lost my hangar, barns, many
      trees and condo on the coast (sat photo attached ) is toast.
      
      We are lucky compared to most.
      
        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From:
        CloudCraft(at)aol.com 
        To: N395V(at)direcway.com 
        Sent: Thursday, September 08, 2005=2011:33
        AM
        Subject: Status Report
      
      
        Dr. Milt,
      
        Are you / your airplane OK down
        there?
      
        Wing Commander Gordon
      
        Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so
        elsewhere.
      
      
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________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 09, 2005
From: 
<rlegg(at)austarnet.com.au>
Subject: 
Re: Hurricane Katrina
      
      
      Hey Barry and all,
      
      I wonder how our old mate Milt Concannon faired in the Hurricane?
      
      Last time I checked he was living in Gulfport which was pretty heavily hit.
      
      Does anyone know how he is?
      
      Cheers from Oz
      
      Russell
      
      
      --- Original message ----
      >Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 15:06:10 +0100
      >From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>  
      >Subject: Commander-List: Hurricane Katrina  
      >To: 
      >
      barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >
      >Hi All,
      >
      >Bert's posting just now has prompted me to do something I should have 
      done last 
      >week and that is to see whether any of our members were caught up in 
      the 
      >hurricane.
      >
      >If so, I trust they are all OK.
      >
      >Is there anyone we 'should' have heard from in that area? Perhaps a 
      'usual' 
      >poster of messages who hasn't been heard from?
      >
      >Best Regards,
      >Barry C (UK) 
      >
      >
      ===============
      ===============
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 09, 2005
From: 
<rlegg(at)austarnet.com.au>  Milt Concannon
Subject: 
Re: Fwd: Status Report from
       Milt Concannon
      
      
      Many thanks Keith for letting us know that Milt is ok!
      
      Cheers
      
      Russell
      
      
      ---- Original message ----
      >Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 14:14:28 EDT
      >From: CloudCraft(at)aol.com  
      >Subject: Commander-List: Fwd: Status Report from Milt Concannon  
      >To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
      >
      >
      >For those of you who know Dr. Milt Concannon (most recently of AC-685 
      N414C), 
      >here is his status.
      >
      >Wing Commander Gordon
      >
      >Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      >
      >From: "Milt" <rocket(at)swmrmc.org>
      >To: CloudCraft(at)aol.com
      >Subject: Re: Status Report
      >Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 12:25:05 -0500
      > RPD=4.00.0003;
      > RPDID303030312E30413039303230352E34333230374236372E303031352D422D4
      D3936762F49374B305A4157444C546645354F3975413D3D;
      > ENG=IBF; TS=20050908180117; CAT=NONE; CON=NONE;
      >
      >
      >Airplane family and house are OK. Lost my hangar, barns, many trees 
      and condo on the coast (sat photo attached ) is toast.
      >
      >We are lucky compared to most.
      >  ----- Original Message -----
      >  From: CloudCraft(at)aol.com
      >  To: N395V(at)direcway.com
      >  Sent: Thursday, September 08, 2005 11:33 AM
      >  Subject: Status Report
      >
      >
      >  Dr. Milt,
      >
      >  Are you / your airplane OK down there?
      >
      >  Wing Commander Gordon
      >
      >  Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >Airplane family and house are OK. Lost my hangar, barns, many
      >trees and condo on the coast (sat photo attached ) is toast.
      >
      >We are lucky compared to most.
      >
      >  ----- Original Message ----- 
      >  From:
      >  CloudCraft(at)aol.com 
      >  To: N395V(at)direcway.com 
      >  Sent: Thursday, September 08, 2005=2011:33
      >  AM
      >  Subject: Status Report
      >
      >
      >  Dr. Milt,
      >
      >  Are you / your airplane OK down
      >  there?
      >
      >  Wing Commander Gordon
      >
      >  Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so
      >  elsewhere.
      >
      >
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      FQROnlqEIx2JOKgitTJJMBKqq4wAw6e2auG0e0ZkRF
      ---- Message was truncated ----
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 08, 2005
From: 
Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
Subject: 
Re: Hurricane Katrina
      
      
      rlegg(at)austarnet.com.au wrote:
      > I wonder how our old mate Milt Concannon faired in the Hurricane?
      
      Poor Milt (and family) have had a pretty rough time - though not as bad 
      as others have had.  They have been without power or water until today 
      and Milt has been on call at the hospital around the clock now since the 
      big blow.  Just talked to him a few minutes ago and he's sounding pretty 
      worn out.  Multiple trips to the hospital every night would kinda do 
      that to a person and it certainly gives me a renewed appreciation for 
      the professionals of the medical industry.  I think he's just really 
      happy that he can finally have a hot shower and a cup of coffee!  The 
      good news is that they suffered only minor damage to their house.  Did 
      loose several other buildings including the hangar.  Fortunately, he'd 
      moved his airplane over to Jim Crunkleton's place in atlanta before the 
      storm hit, so it's safe-n-sound.
      
      Chris
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 08, 2005
From: 
Dan Farmer <daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 
CAR RENTAL
              commander-list-digest(at)matronics.com
      
      
      Hi Everyone;
      
      I just finished renting a car through www.expedia.com and for the 21rst through the 25th the total taxes and all from sjc airport is $135 for a Dodge neon, unlimited milage.  It was about $80 cheaper than next.
      
      dan farmer
      ps. i do not get a commission:-))
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
Date: 
Sep 08, 2005
Subject: 
Re: Hurricane Katrina
      
      
      In a message dated 9/8/2005 5:58:17 P.M. Pacific Standard Time,  
      cschuerm(at)cox.net writes:
      
      > I  wonder how our old mate Milt Concannon faired in the  Hurricane?
      
      
      Great to hear Milt is OK.  I sure miss him in our group!!   jb
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
<kevincoons(at)cavucompanies.net>
Subject: 
Capt. JimBob Please send an invite to the fly-in to
Date: 
Sep 09, 2005
      
      
      JB,
      
      In San Jose, CA there is a 500B Merlyn 290 Conversion owned by Vladimir
      Rivkin. I believe N698RR based at the Reid Hillview Airport. I was speaking
      with Vladimir about 6 weeks ago and he has interest in attending, his
      airplane is for sale (upgrading apparently). I told him I would try to have
      the details of the Fly-in sent to him. 
      
      I do not have his address, only a phone number. Maybe you can get some
      information to him.
      
      Phone Number - 408-568-6886
      
      See you in a few weeks.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
YOURTCFG(at)AOL.COM
Date: 
Sep 09, 2005
Subject: 
Re: Capt. JimBob Please send an invite to the fly-in to
      
      
      In a message dated 9/9/2005 3:28:53 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,  
      kevincoons(at)cavucompanies.net writes:
      
      I do not  have his address, only a phone number. Maybe you can get some
      information  to him
      
      
      I will cal him today, thanks!!  jb
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
<avtec2(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: 
Re: used simmonds 580SU
Date: 
Sep 09, 2005
      
      
      I Have two complete units
      Thay may be useable ASIS
      Price $1,000.00 Each
      Harry Merritt
      321 267-3141
      > 
      > From: "jmenchetti(at)cantv.net" <jmenchetti(at)cantv.net>
      > Date: 2005/09/07 Wed AM 09:02:38 EDT
      > To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
      > Subject: Commander-List: used simmonds 580SU
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Dear Gentlemen, im looking for 2 simmonds 580SU units, in to be overhauled
      > condition, many thanks
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 
showmen
Date: 
Sep 09, 2005
      
      
      Sorry this is non Commander.
      I must have been living under a rock for the last month and a half.  I was shocked
      to find out yesterday that Bobby Yonkin and Jimmy Franklin, two of the all
      time greats were killed in mid July.  What a shame.
      So few in that sport quit while they can.
      
      bilbo
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 
Queen Air Question
Date: 
Sep 09, 2005
      
      
      Commander Folks,
      
      This is not a Commander question, however, I need a fast answer.
      
      It is my understanding that one of the branches of the US Military purchased some
      Queen Airs that had the IGSO 540-B1A engines in them.  Does anyone know the
      Military designation of the airplane?
      
      Much Thanks!
      
      Moe
      N680RR
      680F(p)
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: 
Re: Queen Air Question
Date: 
Sep 09, 2005
      
      
      Hi Moe,
      
      The Beech 65 Queen Air was initially designated the L-23F, later U-8F. However,
      
      these had IGSO-480 series engines.
      
      The Beech 65-80 and 65-A80 Queen Air had the IGSO-540 series, but I'm not sure
      
      if the military had this variant.
      
      Best Regards,
      Barry
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      Subject: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      
      
      |
      | Commander Folks,
      |
      | This is not a Commander question, however, I need a fast answer.
      |
      | It is my understanding that one of the branches of the US Military purchased
      
      some Queen Airs that had the IGSO 540-B1A engines in them.  Does anyone know the
      
      Military designation of the airplane?
      |
      | Much Thanks!
      |
      | Moe
      | N680RR
      | 680F(p)
      |
      |
      |
      |
      |
      |
      | 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"MASON Chevaillier" <kamala(at)msn.com>
Subject: 
Re: Queen Air Question
Date: 
Sep 10, 2005
      
      
      i had one with the excaliber conversion .  io 720 s.  it was u-8. mason
      
      
      >From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >Reply-To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
      >To: 
      >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 21:42:18 +0100
      >
      ><barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >
      >Hi Moe,
      >
      >The Beech 65 Queen Air was initially designated the L-23F, later U-8F. 
      >However,
      >these had IGSO-480 series engines.
      >
      >The Beech 65-80 and 65-A80 Queen Air had the IGSO-540 series, but I'm not 
      >sure
      >if the military had this variant.
      >
      >Best Regards,
      >Barry
      >
      >----- Original Message -----
      >From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      >To: 
      >Subject: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >
      >
      >|
      >| Commander Folks,
      >|
      >| This is not a Commander question, however, I need a fast answer.
      >|
      >| It is my understanding that one of the branches of the US Military 
      >purchased
      >some Queen Airs that had the IGSO 540-B1A engines in them.  Does anyone 
      >know the
      >Military designation of the airplane?
      >|
      >| Much Thanks!
      >|
      >| Moe
      >| N680RR
      >| 680F(p)
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: 
VH-EXD
Date: 
Sep 10, 2005
      
      
      Hi Russell,
      
      I don't seem to have recorded this before, but 500U-1639-3, VH-EXD is reported
      
      in Air-Britain News (July issue) to be inside the Australian Aviation Heritage
      
      Centre at Winnellie, Northern Territory. The marks were cancelled on 22Oct90.
      
      I've got a bit behind with my database up-dating, so if you've told me of this
      
      before, I offer my sincere apologies.
      
      If it's news, then that's great!
      
      Can you 'remind' me of the ones left to hunt down?
      
      Sincere Best Regards,
      Barry 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 10, 2005
From: 
John Towner <johntowner(at)centralairsouthwest.com>
Subject: 
[Fwd: [Fwd: Hello]]
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 10, 2005
From: 
John Towner <johntowner(at)centralairsouthwest.com>
Subject: 
[Fwd: Hello]
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"MASON Chevaillier" <kamala(at)msn.com>
Subject: 
Re: Fly_in
Date: 
Sep 10, 2005
      
      
      bb,  angel flight america is flying supplies from largo vista, tx to slidell 
      airport (ads) a hangar there.  if they  need the stuff i can load my truck 
      and trailer (3000lbs +) and make a run.  better than too many trips by air.  
      please check and let me know if needed. mason  817-517-4977
      
      
      >From: "Bert Berry" <bertberry1(at)aol.com>
      >Reply-To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
      >To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
      >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Fly_in
      >Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 13:24:15 +0000 GMT
      >
      >
      >Yesterday I was in New Orleans helping with rescue efforts when I heard the 
      >familiar sound of a twin commander.  Just wondering if it was any of you.  
      >The sun was in my eyes but it looked like it was red.
      >
      >Man what a mess this place is.
      >
      >
      >Bert
      >-----Original Message-----
      >From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 11:16:42
      >To:
      >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Fly_in
      >
      ><barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >
      >Hi John,
      >
      >Well, it looks as though there might be a few of us booked into the Comfort 
      >Inn,
      >which will be good. I'm still getting things ready to take with me, but 
      >N5007H
      >will not be making the trip!
      >
      >Wow! That simulator looks pretty neat. Andrew must have put a long time 
      >into
      >that project and must be a very talented young man.
      >
      >Looking forward to seeing you both again,
      >Best Regards,
      >Barry
      >
      >----- Original Message -----
      >From: "John Towner" <johntowner(at)centralairsouthwest.com>
      >To: 
      >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Fly_in
      >
      >
      >
      >|
      >| *Barry,*
      >|
      >| We will try to book too at the Comfort Inn at Marina.  We wish everyone
      >| could stay at the same place but hopefully all will workout.
      >|
      >| PS-Andrew has been working on building a Commander simulator for us,
      >| attached is a picture from the prototype we thought you might enjoy.
      >| Are you going to bring N4007H? and we hope all is well with her.
      >|
      >| *YOUR FRIENDS,
      >|
      >| Andrew & John Towner*
      >|
      >| Barry Collman wrote:
      >|
      ><barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >| >
      >| >Hi Guys,
      >| >
      >| >Well, I'm booked into the Comfort Inn, on Reservation Road, Marina for 
      >the
      >| >Fly-In.
      >| >
      >| >Anyone else booked in there?
      >| >
      >| >Really looking forward to seeing some new faces and meeting up with some 
      >old
      >| >ones!
      >| >
      >| >Also looking forward to seeing some new paint jobs (one which was long
      >| >overdue!!).
      >| >
      >| >Sincere Best Regards,
      >| >Barry
      >| >
      >| >
      >| >
      >| >
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >
      >
      >bertberry1(at)aol.com
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 12, 2005
From: 
<rlegg(at)austarnet.com.au>
Subject: 
Re: VH-EXD
      
      
      Hi Barry,
      
      Great to hear from you!
      
      Coincidentally, was about to email you re finally getting closure on 680E 
      VH-EXU. The story is sad but my source is impeccable! He has checked his 
      diaries and confirmed that EXU was cut up for scrap and removed from 
      Jandakot Airport (fire dump area) during August 1991. Do you remember 
      the week I spent in Perth trying to track it back in 2001 (I guess I was 10 
      years late!). Please update your database.
      
      Yes we have known about VH-EXD and it is displayed in the heritage 
      centre. After withdrawal from Coastwatch service the c/n plate was 
      removed (to never fly again!), so somewhere in the future this may pose a 
      problem for identification!
      
      Sister 500U VH-EXK is the missing aircraft. It was withdrawn from use 
      about the same time and supposedly parked at Townsville Airport. (I did 
      recieve one report that it was noted at Perth, Jandakot but I believe this 
      was incorrect). Both EXK and 680F VH-ELH were parked at Townsville and 
      removed (still no word on when or where they went).
      
      Unfortunately it looks like I will be a scratching this year for the flyin...:-(
      I will really miss catching up with youself and all my great pals. Please say 
      a special hello to John and Andrew T, Buddy and Mr & Mrs Jimbob!
      I think that Richard will be getting along this year.
      
      Have a great time and I would really appreciate a list of participating 
      Commanders when you get time. How are you getting to Marina (via 
      Washougal)?
      
      How is the book coming along...remember I would be pleased to proof the 
      Ozzie stuff!
      
      Cheers and regards
      
      Russell
      
      >From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>  
      >Subject: Commander-List: VH-EXD  
      >To: 
      >
      barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >
      >Hi Russell,
      >
      >I don't seem to have recorded this before, but 500U-1639-3, VH-EXD is 
      reported 
      >in Air-Britain News (July issue) to be inside the Australian Aviation 
      Heritage 
      >Centre at Winnellie, Northern Territory. The marks were cancelled on 
      22Oct90.
      >
      >I've got a bit behind with my database up-dating, so if you've told me of 
      this 
      >before, I offer my sincere apologies.
      >
      >If it's news, then that's great!
      >
      >Can you 'remind' me of the ones left to hunt down?
      >
      >Sincere Best Regards,
      >Barry 
      >
      >
      ===============
      ===============
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 
Re: [Fwd: [Fwd: Hello]]
Date: 
Sep 12, 2005
      
      
      John,
      
      Received two emails from you, however there was no message?
      
      Moe
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "John Towner" <johntowner(at)centralairsouthwest.com>
      Subject: Commander-List: [Fwd: [Fwd: Hello]]
      
      
      
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 
Re: Queen Air Question
Date: 
Sep 12, 2005
      
      
      Barry,
      
      Thanks for the information. Any ideas on how I might find out if the 65-80
      or 65-A80 were ever used by the US Military?
      
      Confidentially, (as you may have suspected) I am on a mission to get
      information on the Simmonds fuel pumps.  If the US Military ever used this
      engine, a repair manual was made and can be traced if the aircraft
      designation is known.  The information on the flow bench used by the
      military to test the Simmonds unit by the military has been located, so one
      can only assume that a manual was written explaining how to rebuild the
      injector and flow it on the above mentioned flow bench.
      
      As usual, the companies that had the super cheap prices on the lens did not
      have it in stock and could not guarantee a delivery date, so I will have the
      lens with me next week, however the cost including UPS freight will be a
      grand total of $ 482.14.  Hope this is OK.
      
      Best regards,
      
      Moe
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      
      
      <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >
      > Hi Moe,
      >
      > The Beech 65 Queen Air was initially designated the L-23F, later U-8F.
      However,
      > these had IGSO-480 series engines.
      >
      > The Beech 65-80 and 65-A80 Queen Air had the IGSO-540 series, but I'm not
      sure
      > if the military had this variant.
      >
      > Best Regards,
      > Barry
      >
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      > To: 
      > Subject: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >
      >
      > |
      > | Commander Folks,
      > |
      > | This is not a Commander question, however, I need a fast answer.
      > |
      > | It is my understanding that one of the branches of the US Military
      purchased
      > some Queen Airs that had the IGSO 540-B1A engines in them.  Does anyone
      know the
      > Military designation of the airplane?
      > |
      > | Much Thanks!
      > |
      > | Moe
      > | N680RR
      > | 680F(p)
      > |
      > |
      > |
      > |
      > |
      > |
      > |
      >
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: 
Re: Queen Air Question
Date: 
Sep 12, 2005
      
      
      Hi Moe,
      
      Give me a day or two and I'll try and find out. I know the US Army had Queen 
      Airs, but I'm not sure of the Model.
      
      I'll get back to you as soon as I can.
      
      Very Best Regards,
      Barry
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      
      
      |
      | Barry,
      |
      | Thanks for the information. Any ideas on how I might find out if the 65-80
      | or 65-A80 were ever used by the US Military?
      |
      | Confidentially, (as you may have suspected) I am on a mission to get
      | information on the Simmonds fuel pumps.  If the US Military ever used this
      | engine, a repair manual was made and can be traced if the aircraft
      | designation is known.  The information on the flow bench used by the
      | military to test the Simmonds unit by the military has been located, so one
      | can only assume that a manual was written explaining how to rebuild the
      | injector and flow it on the above mentioned flow bench.
      |
      | As usual, the companies that had the super cheap prices on the lens did not
      | have it in stock and could not guarantee a delivery date, so I will have the
      | lens with me next week, however the cost including UPS freight will be a
      | grand total of $ 482.14.  Hope this is OK.
      |
      | Best regards,
      |
      | Moe
      | ----- Original Message ----- 
      | From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      | To: 
      | Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      |
      |
      | <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      | >
      | > Hi Moe,
      | >
      | > The Beech 65 Queen Air was initially designated the L-23F, later U-8F.
      | However,
      | > these had IGSO-480 series engines.
      | >
      | > The Beech 65-80 and 65-A80 Queen Air had the IGSO-540 series, but I'm not
      | sure
      | > if the military had this variant.
      | >
      | > Best Regards,
      | > Barry
      | >
      | > ----- Original Message ----- 
      | > From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      | > To: 
      | > Subject: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      | >
      | >
      | > |
      | > | Commander Folks,
      | > |
      | > | This is not a Commander question, however, I need a fast answer.
      | > |
      | > | It is my understanding that one of the branches of the US Military
      | purchased
      | > some Queen Airs that had the IGSO 540-B1A engines in them.  Does anyone
      | know the
      | > Military designation of the airplane?
      | > |
      | > | Much Thanks!
      | > |
      | > | Moe
      | > | N680RR
      | > | 680F(p)
      | > |
      | > |
      | > |
      | > |
      | > |
      | > |
      | > |
      | >
      | >
      |
      |
      |
      |
      |
      |
      | 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: 
Sep 12, 2005
From: 
John Towner <johntowner(at)centralairsouthwest.com>
Subject: 
Re: Queen Air Question
      
      
      *Barry & Moe,*
      
      I know the Army has and still uses the BE-65 Queen Air and the modded 
      ones have 8 cyl Lycoming direct drive engines on them.  Several years 
      ago we looked into using this engine I think it is called IO-720, for 
      the 2 680FL's we use to have because the GSIO-540's that were on them 
      gave us so much trouble.  We never did do the mod and ended up selling 
      the aircraft
      
      *YOUR FRIEND,
      
      John Towner *
      
      Barry Collman wrote:
      
      >
      >Hi Moe,
      >
      >Give me a day or two and I'll try and find out. I know the US Army had Queen 
      >Airs, but I'm not sure of the Model.
      >
      >I'll get back to you as soon as I can.
      >
      >Very Best Regards,
      >Barry
      >
      >
      >----- Original Message ----- 
      >From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      >To: 
      >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >
      >
      >|
      >| Barry,
      >|
      >| Thanks for the information. Any ideas on how I might find out if the 65-80
      >| or 65-A80 were ever used by the US Military?
      >|
      >| Confidentially, (as you may have suspected) I am on a mission to get
      >| information on the Simmonds fuel pumps.  If the US Military ever used this
      >| engine, a repair manual was made and can be traced if the aircraft
      >| designation is known.  The information on the flow bench used by the
      >| military to test the Simmonds unit by the military has been located, so one
      >| can only assume that a manual was written explaining how to rebuild the
      >| injector and flow it on the above mentioned flow bench.
      >|
      >| As usual, the companies that had the super cheap prices on the lens did not
      >| have it in stock and could not guarantee a delivery date, so I will have the
      >| lens with me next week, however the cost including UPS freight will be a
      >| grand total of $ 482.14.  Hope this is OK.
      >|
      >| Best regards,
      >|
      >| Moe
      >| ----- Original Message ----- 
      >| From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >| To: 
      >| Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >|
      >|
      >| <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >| >
      >| > Hi Moe,
      >| >
      >| > The Beech 65 Queen Air was initially designated the L-23F, later U-8F.
      >| However,
      >| > these had IGSO-480 series engines.
      >| >
      >| > The Beech 65-80 and 65-A80 Queen Air had the IGSO-540 series, but I'm not
      >| sure
      >| > if the military had this variant.
      >| >
      >| > Best Regards,
      >| > Barry
      >| >
      >| > ----- Original Message ----- 
      >| > From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      >| > To: 
      >| > Subject: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >| >
      >| >
      >| > |
      >| > | Commander Folks,
      >| > |
      >| > | This is not a Commander question, however, I need a fast answer.
      >| > |
      >| > | It is my understanding that one of the branches of the US Military
      >| purchased
      >| > some Queen Airs that had the IGSO 540-B1A engines in them.  Does anyone
      >| know the
      >| > Military designation of the airplane?
      >| > |
      >| > | Much Thanks!
      >| > |
      >| > | Moe
      >| > | N680RR
      >| > | 680F(p)
      >| > |
      >| > |
      >| > |
      >| > |
      >| > |
      >| > |
      >| > |
      >| >
      >| >
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >|
      >| 
      >
      >
      >  
      >
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
Date: 
Sep 13, 2005
Subject: 
Fly-In
      
      
      WHERE DID THE SUMMER GO????  
      
      The Fly-In is next week so if you're planning on attending you need to make  
      your hotel reservations as rooms are filling up fast and the price is going  
      up.  If the price in Marina is too high for your wallet (some hotels are  now 
      charging over $150/night) we would recommend nearby Seaside (~ 5 miles and  
      there's a nice Howard Johnson's in the $80 range) or Salinas (~12 miles with  
      many hotels in the $70-90 range).  
      
      Also if you have not sent in your registration and are planning to attend,  
      PLEASE let us know via email or phone call the number & names in your party  so
      
      we can have name tags prepared and more importantly an accurate count for  
      food (especially the dinner). 
      
      We look forward to seeing you all there and having a great time!
      
      jb
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Kristian Meszaros" <krmesza(at)attglobal.net>
              "Commander-List Digest List" 
Subject: 
Re: Commander-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 09/12/05
Date: 
Sep 13, 2005
              INNOCENT GLOBAL 0.0000 1.0000 -4.4912
      
      
      Somehow I remember that the 65-80 series, all of them, had Bendix RSA fuel 
      injectors, not the Simmonds units. They were IGSO540 A1A or A1D Lycs, 380 
      hp, but not Simmonds equipped. The engines were slightly shorter overall, 
      but higher, as the FCU was mounted in an updraft config.
      
      Rehards
      
      Kris
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "Commander-List Digest Server" <commander-list-digest(at)matronics.com>
      Subject: Commander-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 09/12/05
      
      
      > *
      >
      > ==================================================
      >   Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
      > ==================================================
      >
      > Today's complete Commander-List Digest can also be found in either of the
      > two Web Links listed below.  The .html file includes the Digest formatted
      > in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
      > and Message Navigation.  The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
      > of the Commander-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
      > such as Notepad or with a web browser.
      >
      > HTML Version:
      >
      > 
      > http://www.matronics.com/digest/commander-list/Digest.Commander-List.2005-09-12.html
      >
      > Text Version:
      >
      > 
      > http://www.matronics.com/digest/commander-list/Digest.Commander-List.2005-09-12.txt
      >
      >
      > ================================================
      >   EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
      > ================================================
      >
      >
      >                           Commander-List Digest Archive
      >                                      ---
      >                     Total Messages Posted Mon 09/12/05: 4
      >
      >
      > Today's Message Index:
      > ----------------------
      >
      >     1. 07:02 AM - Re: [Fw: [Fw: Hello]]  (Moe)
      >     2. 03:11 PM - Re: Queen Air Question  (Moe)
      >     3. 03:16 PM - Re: Queen Air Question  (Barry Collman)
      >     4. 03:45 PM - Re: Queen Air Question  (John Towner)
      >
      >
      > ________________________________  Message 1 
      > _____________________________________
      >
      >
      > From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      > Subject: Re: Commander-List: [Fwd: [Fwd: Hello]]
      >
      >
      > John,
      >
      > Received two emails from you, however there was no message?
      >
      > Moe
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: "John Towner" <johntowner(at)centralairsouthwest.com>
      > Subject: Commander-List: [Fwd: [Fwd: Hello]]
      >
      >
      > 
      >>
      >>
      >
      >
      > ________________________________  Message 2 
      > _____________________________________
      >
      >
      > From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >
      >
      > Barry,
      >
      > Thanks for the information. Any ideas on how I might find out if the 65-80
      > or 65-A80 were ever used by the US Military?
      >
      > Confidentially, (as you may have suspected) I am on a mission to get
      > information on the Simmonds fuel pumps.  If the US Military ever used this
      > engine, a repair manual was made and can be traced if the aircraft
      > designation is known.  The information on the flow bench used by the
      > military to test the Simmonds unit by the military has been located, so 
      > one
      > can only assume that a manual was written explaining how to rebuild the
      > injector and flow it on the above mentioned flow bench.
      >
      > As usual, the companies that had the super cheap prices on the lens did 
      > not
      > have it in stock and could not guarantee a delivery date, so I will have 
      > the
      > lens with me next week, however the cost including UPS freight will be a
      > grand total of $ 482.14.  Hope this is OK.
      >
      > Best regards,
      >
      > Moe
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >
      >
      > <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >>
      >> Hi Moe,
      >>
      >> The Beech 65 Queen Air was initially designated the L-23F, later U-8F.
      > However,
      >> these had IGSO-480 series engines.
      >>
      >> The Beech 65-80 and 65-A80 Queen Air had the IGSO-540 series, but I'm not
      > sure
      >> if the military had this variant.
      >>
      >> Best Regards,
      >> Barry
      >>
      >> ----- Original Message ----- 
      >> From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      >> To: 
      >> Subject: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >>
      >>
      > purchased
      >> some Queen Airs that had the IGSO 540-B1A engines in them.  Does anyone
      > know the
      >> Military designation of the airplane?
      >>
      >>
      >
      >
      > ________________________________  Message 3 
      > _____________________________________
      >
      >
      > From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >
      > <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >
      > Hi Moe,
      >
      > Give me a day or two and I'll try and find out. I know the US Army had 
      > Queen
      > Airs, but I'm not sure of the Model.
      >
      > I'll get back to you as soon as I can.
      >
      > Very Best Regards,
      > Barry
      >
      >
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >
      >
      > |
      > | Barry,
      > |
      > | Thanks for the information. Any ideas on how I might find out if the 
      > 65-80
      > | or 65-A80 were ever used by the US Military?
      > |
      > | Confidentially, (as you may have suspected) I am on a mission to get
      > | information on the Simmonds fuel pumps.  If the US Military ever used 
      > this
      > | engine, a repair manual was made and can be traced if the aircraft
      > | designation is known.  The information on the flow bench used by the
      > | military to test the Simmonds unit by the military has been located, so 
      > one
      > | can only assume that a manual was written explaining how to rebuild the
      > | injector and flow it on the above mentioned flow bench.
      > |
      > | As usual, the companies that had the super cheap prices on the lens did 
      > not
      > | have it in stock and could not guarantee a delivery date, so I will have 
      > the
      > | lens with me next week, however the cost including UPS freight will be a
      > | grand total of $ 482.14.  Hope this is OK.
      > |
      > | Best regards,
      > |
      > | Moe
      > | ----- Original Message ----- 
      > | From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      > | To: 
      > | Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      > |
      > |
      > | <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      > | >
      > | > Hi Moe,
      > | >
      > | > The Beech 65 Queen Air was initially designated the L-23F, later U-8F.
      > | However,
      > | > these had IGSO-480 series engines.
      > | >
      > | > The Beech 65-80 and 65-A80 Queen Air had the IGSO-540 series, but I'm 
      > not
      > | sure
      > | > if the military had this variant.
      > | >
      > | > Best Regards,
      > | > Barry
      > | >
      > | > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > | > From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      > | > To: 
      > | > Subject: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      > | >
      > | >
      > | > |
      > | > | Commander Folks,
      > | > |
      > | > | This is not a Commander question, however, I need a fast answer.
      > | > |
      > | > | It is my understanding that one of the branches of the US Military
      > | purchased
      > | > some Queen Airs that had the IGSO 540-B1A engines in them.  Does 
      > anyone
      > | know the
      > | > Military designation of the airplane?
      > | > |
      > | > | Much Thanks!
      > | > |
      > | > | Moe
      > | > | N680RR
      > | > | 680F(p)
      > | > |
      > | > |
      > | > |
      > | > |
      > | > |
      > | > |
      > | > |
      > | >
      > | >
      > |
      > |
      > |
      > |
      > |
      > |
      > |
      >
      >
      > ________________________________  Message 4 
      > _____________________________________
      >
      >
      > From: John Towner <johntowner(at)centralairsouthwest.com>
      > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >
      > 
      >
      > *Barry & Moe,*
      >
      > I know the Army has and still uses the BE-65 Queen Air and the modded
      > ones have 8 cyl Lycoming direct drive engines on them.  Several years
      > ago we looked into using this engine I think it is called IO-720, for
      > the 2 680FL's we use to have because the GSIO-540's that were on them
      > gave us so much trouble.  We never did do the mod and ended up selling
      > the aircraft
      >
      > *YOUR FRIEND,
      >
      > John Towner *
      >
      > Barry Collman wrote:
      >
      >><barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >>
      >>Hi Moe,
      >>
      >>Give me a day or two and I'll try and find out. I know the US Army had 
      >>Queen
      >>Airs, but I'm not sure of the Model.
      >>
      >>I'll get back to you as soon as I can.
      >>
      >>Very Best Regards,
      >>Barry
      >>
      >>
      >>----- Original Message ----- 
      >>From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      >>To: 
      >>Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >>
      >>
      >>|
      >>| Barry,
      >>|
      >>| Thanks for the information. Any ideas on how I might find out if the 
      >>65-80
      >>| or 65-A80 were ever used by the US Military?
      >>|
      >>| Confidentially, (as you may have suspected) I am on a mission to get
      >>| information on the Simmonds fuel pumps.  If the US Military ever used 
      >>this
      >>| engine, a repair manual was made and can be traced if the aircraft
      >>| designation is known.  The information on the flow bench used by the
      >>| military to test the Simmonds unit by the military has been located, so 
      >>one
      >>| can only assume that a manual was written explaining how to rebuild the
      >>| injector and flow it on the above mentioned flow bench.
      >>|
      >>| As usual, the companies that had the super cheap prices on the lens did 
      >>not
      >>| have it in stock and could not guarantee a delivery date, so I will have 
      >>the
      >>| lens with me next week, however the cost including UPS freight will be a
      >>| grand total of $ 482.14.  Hope this is OK.
      >>|
      >>| Best regards,
      >>|
      >>| Moe
      >>| ----- Original Message ----- 
      >>| From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >>| To: 
      >>| Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >>|
      >>|
      >>| <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
      >>| >
      >>| > Hi Moe,
      >>| >
      >>| > The Beech 65 Queen Air was initially designated the L-23F, later U-8F.
      >>| However,
      >>| > these had IGSO-480 series engines.
      >>| >
      >>| > The Beech 65-80 and 65-A80 Queen Air had the IGSO-540 series, but I'm 
      >>not
      >>| sure
      >>| > if the military had this variant.
      >>| >
      >>| > Best Regards,
      >>| > Barry
      >>| >
      >>| > ----- Original Message ----- 
      >>| > From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
      >>| > To: 
      >>| > Subject: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
      >>| >
      >>| >
      >>| > |
      >>| > | Commander Folks,
      >>| > |
      >>| > | This is not a Commander question, however, I need a fast answer.
      >>| > |
      >>| > | It is my understanding that one of the branches of the US Military
      >>| purchased
      >>| > some Queen Airs that had the IGSO 540-B1A engines in them.  Does 
      >>anyone
      >>| know the
      >>| > Military designation of the airplane?
      >>| > |
      >>| > | Much Thanks!
      >>| > |
      >>| > | Moe
      >>| > | N680RR
      >>| > | 680F(p)
      >>| > |
      >>| > |
      >>| > |
      >>| > |
      >>| > |
      >>| > |
      >>| > |
      >>| >
      >>| >
      >>|
      >>|
      >>|
      >>|
      >>|
      >>|
      >>|
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >
      >
      > 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"tylor.hall" <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: 
1961 500B up for auction
Date: 
Sep 13, 2005
      
      
      I found this on Trade-a-plane today.
      Sir Berry, do you have any information on N620DR?
      Tylor Hall
      
      
      1961 STRIKE 500B Aero Commander, N620DR, A/C sn 1115-66, TTA unknown, last
      annual unknown, recorder Semanco International, Ltd., Charlotte, NC 28129.
      Mr. Dan Seman, President. Title search recorded liens #1 Gem City Aviation
      BBA, Aztec Executive Flight, Kennesaw, GA, 30144. #2 Rockhill Bank and
      Trust, Rockhill, SC 29731. Inglewood Aviation, Inc., (IAI), is soliciting
      bids on aircraft described above. Bids in US dollars will be accepted on an
      as is, where is, bases until 4:00 pm Eastern Daylight Savings Time, Friday,
      September 23, 2005 Inglewood Aviation Inc. holds a lien against the airplane
      for $31,290.17 which will be extinguished via this public sale. The winning
      bidder will be notified promptly. Satisfactory financial arrangements must
      be made within (48) hours of notification or bid may be voided. Aircraft may
      be inspected by appointment. Contact Inglewood Aviation, Inc., NC/(704)
      983-1915 or (704) 983-1917. inglewood(at)vnet.net
      <http://www.trade-a-plane.com/protected/cgi-bin/selleremail.pl?id=729935&ses
      =696e676c65776f6f6440766e65742e6e6574&srch=%26maxads%3D25%26atcode%3DB%26web
      class%3D10030%26browse%3Ddetail%26opage%3Dclsfd_boolean_B%26sessionid%3D8147
      5831%26start%3D1>  Aircraft is located at Albermarle Stanley County Airport,
      Albermarle, NC. Bids may be mailed to: Inglewood Aviation, Inc., P.O. Box
      1720, Albermarle, NC 28002. (VUJ) Minimum bid of $31,290.17.
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
"Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: 
Re: 1961 500B up for auction
Date: 
Sep 14, 2005
      
      
      Hi Tylor,
      
      Well, firstly the serial number is wrong. The correct s/n is 1116-66.
      
      First Certificated in October 1961, it was placed in the Experimental-R&D 
      category between April and August 1962 for testing of a Federal ITT F-400 
      Autopilot which set-up received STC SA70CE.
      
      Rajay Turbochargers were installed under STCs SE6WE and SA529WE in June 1965 and
      
      a 'Miller' nose under STC SA585SW in October 1972.
      
      As N789S, it was damaged on February 9th 1988 at Pueblo Memorial Airport, when
      
      the right MLG collapsed on rollout. Aircraft veered off the runway and hit a 
      snowbank. Repairs were signed-off as effected on May 17th 1989.
      
      It was owned by Aircenter Inc from January 1997 to November 1997, so probably 
      has all the "Shrike" mods. I doubt if a gun/bomb/rocket package was ever 
      installed - it is certainly not a "Strike" Commander!
      
      Nothing much else to comment on!
      
      Very Best Regards,
      Barry
      
      
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: "tylor.hall" <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
      Subject: Commander-List: 1961 500B up for auction
      
      
      |
      | I found this on Trade-a-plane today.
      | Sir Berry, do you have any information on N620DR?
      | Tylor Hall
      |
      |
      | 1961 STRIKE 500B Aero Commander, N620DR, A/C sn 1115-66, TTA unknown, last
      | annual unknown, recorder Semanco International, Ltd., Charlotte, NC 28129.
      | Mr. Dan Seman, President. Title search recorded liens #1 Gem City Aviation
      | BBA, Aztec Executive Flight, Kennesaw, GA, 30144. #2 Rockhill Bank and
      | Trust, Rockhill, SC 29731. Inglewood Aviation, Inc., (IAI), is soliciting
      | bids on aircraft described above. Bids in US dollars will be accepted on an
      | as is, where is, bases until 4:00 pm Eastern Daylight Savings Time, Friday,
      | September 23, 2005 Inglewood Aviation Inc. holds a lien against the airplane
      | for $31,290.17 which will be extinguished via this public sale. The winning
      | bidder will be notified promptly. Satisfactory financial arrangements must
      | be made within (48) hours of notification or bid may be voided. Aircraft may
      | be inspected by appointment. Contact Inglewood Aviation, Inc., NC/(704)
      | 983-1915 or (704) 983-1917. inglewood(at)vnet.net
      | <http://www.trade-a-plane.com/protected/cgi-bin/selleremail.pl?id=729935&ses
      | =696e676c65776f6f6440766e65742e6e6574&srch=%26maxads%3D25%26atcode%3DB%26web
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      |
      | 
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: 
<avtec2(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: 
Re: Commander-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 09/12/05
Date: 
Sep 15, 2005
      
      
        The IGSO-480A1A6 Had Simmons, Not the same as Simmons on the IGSO540B1A or
      B1C.
        The IGSO-480A1E6 has the bendix RS10 fuel injector,
        Harry
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Kristian Meszaros" <krmesza(at)attglobal.net>
        To: ; "Commander-List Digest List"
      
        Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2005 6:43 PM
        Subject: Commander-List: Re: Commander-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 09/12/05
      
      
      
        >
        > Somehow I remember that the 65-80 series, all of them, had Bendix RSA
      fuel
        > injectors, not the Simmonds units. They were IGSO540 A1A or A1D Lycs,
      380
        > hp, but not Simmonds equipped. The engines were slightly shorter
      overall,
        > but higher, as the FCU was mounted in an updraft config.
        >
        > Rehards
        >
        > Kris
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: "Commander-List Digest Server"
      
        > To: "Commander-List Digest List" 
        > Subject: Commander-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 09/12/05
        >
        >
        > > *
        > >
        > > ==================================================
        > >   Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
        > > ==================================================
        > >
        > > Today's complete Commander-List Digest can also be found in either of
      the
        > > two Web Links listed below.  The .html file includes the Digest
      formatted
        > > in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked
      Indexes
        > > and Message Navigation.  The .txt file includes the plain ASCII
      version
        > > of the Commander-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text
      editor
        > > such as Notepad or with a web browser.
        > >
        > > HTML Version:
        > >
        > >
        > >
      http://www.matronics.com/digest/commander-list/Digest.Commander-List.2005-09
      -12.html
        > >
        > > Text Version:
        > >
        > >
        > >
      http://www.matronics.com/digest/commander-list/Digest.Commander-List.2005-09
      -12.txt
        > >
        > >
        > > ================================================
        > >   EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
        > > ================================================
        > >
        > >
        > >                           Commander-List Digest Archive
        > >                                      ---
        > >                     Total Messages Posted Mon 09/12/05: 4
        > >
        > >
        > > Today's Message Index:
        > > ----------------------
        > >
        > >     1. 07:02 AM - Re: [Fw: [Fw: Hello]]  (Moe)
        > >     2. 03:11 PM - Re: Queen Air Question  (Moe)
        > >     3. 03:16 PM - Re: Queen Air Question  (Barry Collman)
        > >     4. 03:45 PM - Re: Queen Air Question  (John Towner)
        > >
        > >
        > > ________________________________  Message 1
        > > _____________________________________
        > >
        > >
        > > From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
        > > Subject: Re: Commander-List: [Fwd: [Fwd: Hello]]
        > >
        > >
        > > John,
        > >
        > > Received two emails from you, however there was no message?
        > >
        > > Moe
        > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > From: "John Towner" <johntowner(at)centralairsouthwest.com>
        > > Subject: Commander-List: [Fwd: [Fwd: Hello]]
        > >
        > >
        > > 
        > >>
        > >>
        > >
        > >
        > > ________________________________  Message 2
        > > _____________________________________
        > >
        > >
        > > From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
        > > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
        > >
        > >
        > > Barry,
        > >
        > > Thanks for the information. Any ideas on how I might find out if the
      65-80
        > > or 65-A80 were ever used by the US Military?
        > >
        > > Confidentially, (as you may have suspected) I am on a mission to get
        > > information on the Simmonds fuel pumps.  If the US Military ever used
      this
        > > engine, a repair manual was made and can be traced if the aircraft
        > > designation is known.  The information on the flow bench used by the
        > > military to test the Simmonds unit by the military has been located,
      so
        > > one
        > > can only assume that a manual was written explaining how to rebuild
      the
        > > injector and flow it on the above mentioned flow bench.
        > >
        > > As usual, the companies that had the super cheap prices on the lens
      did
        > > not
        > > have it in stock and could not guarantee a delivery date, so I will
      have
        > > the
        > > lens with me next week, however the cost including UPS freight will be
      a
        > > grand total of $ 482.14.  Hope this is OK.
        > >
        > > Best regards,
        > >
        > > Moe
        > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
        > > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
        > >
        > >
        > > <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
        > >>
        > >> Hi Moe,
        > >>
        > >> The Beech 65 Queen Air was initially designated the L-23F, later
      U-8F.
        > > However,
        > >> these had IGSO-480 series engines.
        > >>
        > >> The Beech 65-80 and 65-A80 Queen Air had the IGSO-540 series, but I'm
      not
        > > sure
        > >> if the military had this variant.
        > >>
        > >> Best Regards,
        > >> Barry
        > >>
        > >> ----- Original Message -----
        > >> From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
        > >> To: 
        > >> Subject: Commander-List: Queen Air Question
        > >>
        > >>
        > > purchased
        > >> some Queen Airs that had the IGSO 540-B1A engines in them.  Does
      anyone
        > > know the
        > >> Military designation of the airplane?
        > >>
        > >>
        > >
        > >
        > > ________________________________  Message 3
        > > _____________________________________

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August 19, 2005 - September 15, 2005

Commander-Archive.digest.vol-br

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