Commander-Archive.digest.vol-cd

July 24, 2006 - August 26, 2006



      are a Microsoft Windows user) for a two week time period. 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Try it; What have you got to lose! 
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > Best Regards,
      > David Fowler
      > Director of Sales
      > Pulmonetic Systems / Viasys Healthcare
      > 1-888-756-3188, Direct phone
      > 1-321-427-7699, CELL
      > 1-321-768-6935, Direct FAX
      > davidpaulfowler(at)aol.com
      > www.pulmonetic.com 
      > Main Telephone: 1-800-754-1914, or 1-763-398-8300
      > Customer Service, option one, or 1-763-398-8403, FAX
      > 
      > Attached Message
      > 
      > 
      > From:
      > 
      > Jeff Olseth 
      > 
      > 
      > To:
      > 
      > als(at)stricklermedical.com; ALBlokland(at)aol.com; ABoone768(at)hotmail.com; 
      Anthony 
      Curro ; 
      bizzyallthetime(at)tampabay.rr.com; Bill 
      Carmouche <bcarmouche@medical-dynamics-inc.com>; Bill Deal 
      ; 
      Tuft444(at)aol.com; BSmith(at)dicapcredit.com; cmarion(at)pulmonetic.com; 
      Cindy.Holliday(at)med.va.gov; CoraBartolo(at)yahoo.com; Dave Crum 
      ; 
      David Paul Fowler ; denise_elson(at)yahoo.com; 
      edsal64(at)aol.com; CarnesG(at)allkids.org; jlnjeff(at)aol.com; 
      hickey(at)myocor.com; 
      joeejester(at)att.net
      > 
      > 
      > Subject:
      > 
      > FW: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      > 
      > Date:
      > 
      > 
      > It's worth a minute to see if this really works. 
      > 
      > Maybe just a market survey but the $ potential will cause me to take a 
      few 
      minutes to forward.
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > Jeff
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > From: JonasUrba(at)aol.com [mailto:JonasUrba(at)aol.com] 
      > Sent: Saturday, June 24, 2006 6:39 PM
      > To: CAREMEDRES(at)aol.com
      > Subject: Fwd: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > Attached Message
      > 
      > 
      > From:
      > 
      > Maximino(Max) Melendez 
      > 
      > 
      > To:
      > 
      > Wieslawa "Vee" Rozynski ; Tony Soto 
      ; 
      Theresa "Butchie" Torres ; Tata melendez 
      ; Sujhey Fernandez ; 
      spiritowl05(at)bellsouth.net; spiritowl(at)comcast.net; Sllabanowski(at)aol.com; 
      sarah-erase(at)snet.net; Sandra y Heri Gonzalez ; 
      Richard 
      "Rich" Lebron ; Reynold J. Melendez 
      ; 
      Reyes, Gabina ; Rena Melendez-Griggs 
      ; Rafy Hernandez ; Pedro"Papy" 
      Soto 
      ; Patricia A Melendez ; Nohelia 
      "Resto" 
      Melendez ; NANCYBFL56(at)aol.com; 
      McTwins00(at)aol.com; Mary 
      Roman ; mariay7(at)juno.com; Luz H Melendez 
      ; Lorraine "Lori" Cruz ; 
      Lillian 
      Nash- Melendez ; JonasUrba(at)aol.com; Jodi Motyka 
      ; Jexaira Marie Melendez ; II 
      KEMP 
      ; Hernan Ricardo Castillo 
      ; 
      Helen Saez Melendez ; Felix & Susie Berrios 
      ; eayala022(at)comcast.net; Dianne Mcguigan 
      ; Diana "GOD Daughter" Gonzalez 
      ; Daniel "Danny" Pagan ; 
      DaCruz,Alexia 
      M ; Cindy D Solano Melendez 
      ; 
      Carlos "Jero" Rosario ; BernieBean(at)aol.com; Benko, 
      Andrew 
      ; Benjamin "Bengie" Perez 
      ; April 
      Michaud ; Antonio Tony Soto-Melendez 
      ; Angel "Pito" Fernandez 
      ; 
      Andrew C Benko-CT Home ; Andres Felipe Alvarez 
      Londo=C3=B1o 
      ; Alberto Emanuel Hernadez 
      
      > 
      > 
      > Subject:
      > 
      > Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      > 
      > Date:
      > 
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > 
      > From: Melendez, Maximino 
        
      
      > 
      > To: mmelendez(at)MottCorp.com 
        
      
      > 
      > Cc: mmelendez9(at)tampabay.rr.com 
        
      
      > 
      > Sent: Friday, June 23, 2006 7:21 PM
      > 
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > This was on the 9:00 o'clock news the other night and this works
      > 
      > 
      > THIS TOOK TWO PAGES OF THE TUESDAY USATODAY - IT IS FOR REAL 
      > 
      > Subject: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! 
      > 
      > 
      > This thing is for real. Rest assured AOL and Intel will follow through 
      with 
      their promises for fear of facing a multimillion-dollar class action 
      suit 
      similar to the one filed by PepsiCo against General Electric not too 
      long ago. 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Dear Friends; Please do not take this for a junk letter. Bill Gates 
      sharing 
      his fortune. If you ignore this, You will repent later. Microsoft and 
      AOL are 
      now the largest Internet companies and in an effort to make sure that 
      Internet 
      Explorer remains the most widely used program, Microsoft and AOL are 
      running an 
      e-mail beta test. 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > When you forward this e-mail to friends, Microsoft can and will track 
      it ( If 
      you are a Microsoft Windows user) ?For a two weeks time period. 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > For every person that you forward this e-mail to, Microsoft will pay 
      you 
      $245.00 For every person that you sent it to that forwards it on, 
      Microsoft will 
      pay you $243.00 and ! for every third person that receives it, You will 
      be paid 
      $241.00. Within two weeks, Microsoft will contact you for your address 
      and then 
      send you a check. 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Regards. Charles S Bailey General Manager Field Operations 
      > 1-800-842-2332 Ext. 1085 or 904-1085 or RNX 
      > 292-1085 Charles_Bailey(at)csx.com Charles_bailey(at)csx.com 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > I thought this was a scam myself, But two weeks after receiving this 
      e-mail 
      and forwarding it on. Microsoft contacted me for my address and within 
      days, I 
      receive a check for $24,800.00. You need to respond before the beta 
      testing is 
      over. If anyone can afford this, Bill gates is the man. 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > It's all marketing expense to him. Please forward this to as many 
      people as 
      possible. You are bound to get at least $10,000.00. We're not going to 
      help them 
      out with their e-mail beta test without getting a little something for 
      our time. 
      My brother's girlfriend got in on this a few months ago. When I went to 
      visit 
      him for the Baylor /UT game. She showed me her check. It was for the sum 
      of 
      $4,324.44 and was stamped "Paid in full" 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Like I said before, I know the law, and this is for real. 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Intel and AOL are now discussing a merger which would make them the 
      largest 
      Internet company and in an effort make sure that AOL remains the most 
      widely 
      used program, Intel and AOL are running an e-mail beta test. 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > When you forward this e-mail to friends, Intel can and will track it ( 
      if you 
      are a Microsoft Windows user) for a two week time period. 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Try it; What have you got to lose! 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > Yahoo! Mail
      <http://pa.yahoo.com/*http:/us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=39174/*http:/photomail.
      mail.yahoo.com> 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      >  <http://www.aim.com/fun/mail/> Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- 
      2 GB of 
      storage and industry-leading spam and email virus protection.
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      >  
      <http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100122638x1081283466x1074645346/aol?redir=
      http://www.aim.com/fun/mail/> 
      Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- 2 GB of storage and 
      industry-leading spam 
      and email virus protection.
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > 
      > From: Charles Finlay 
        
      > 
      > To: burgdorf(at)charter.net 
        
      ; todd@tac-data.com   
      ; 
      cunninghamcjma(at)sbcglobal.net 
        
      ; sdinges66(at)sbcglobal.net 
        
      ; sweetspot16(at)charter.net 
        
      ; shello73(at)aol.com   ; 
      
      muckloans(at)charter.net 
        ; 
      tkneigh(at)charter.net 
        ; 
      janenesbit(at)ddsme.org 
        ; 
      mreime(at)charter.net   
      ; 
      kickit3(at)norcom2000.com 
        
      ; inutmegu2(at)yahoo.com 
        ; 
      walksoc18(at)aol.com   
      > 
      > Sent: Thursday, June 22, 2006 3:16 PM
      > 
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > From: "Schield, Lynn M. (USAILS)" <Lynn.Schield(at)usdoj.gov 
       
      >
      > To: ajbarton(at)hometel.com 
       
      , "Amanda L. Dressler"  
      >, "Garland, Angeline L."  
      >, asand(at)hotmail.com  
      , 
      Charles Finlay  
      >, conlisch(at)hotmail.com 
       , 
      dpsand(at)htc.net  , 
      dm2mitan7(at)peaknet.net 
       , 
      firehs5(at)msn.com  , 
      fjhovis(at)aol.com  , 
      jmyron(at)MILitho.COM  
      , 
      Jeff.Strahlem(at)ssa.gov 
       , 
      JHauser(at)GoJetAirlines.com 
       
      , sandheinrich(at)hotmail.com 
       
      , jmyron(at)austin.rr.com 
       , 
      Julie Ranostaj  
      >, bigdog(at)ezeeweb.com 
       , 
      maryjo.warnecke(at)scott.af.mil 
       
      , Mezofamily(at)empowering.com 
       
      , MezoFamily(at)empowering.com 
       
      , lanx10fire(at)yahoo.com 
       , 
      lanx10fire(at)charter.net 
       
      , massagesbymisty(at)yahoo.com 
       
      , sgore(at)sonnenschein.com 
       
      , Stefanie Marlin  
      >, sbclark7(at)swbell.net 
       , 
      Susan.Erwin(at)upbna.com 
       , 
      tlbohnemeier(at)usa.net 
       , 
      ZuLuErwin927(at)aol.com 
       
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2006 08:34:30 -0500
      > 
      > =C3=AF=C2=BB=C2 
      > 
      > Go to the bottom and you won't have to go through all the forwarded 
      e-mails.  
      I don't feel I have anything to lose by sending this.  If you don't want 
      to be 
      bothered, please just delete it.
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > From: Skillings, Esther A. (USAILS) 
      > Sent: Friday, June 16, 2006 9:23 AM
      > To: Barbara.Brehmer(at)charter.net; Betty Davis-Nelson 
      (badgirlstreak(at)yahoo.com); 
      bobbymask(at)sbcglobal.net; Colette.Knobeloch(at)upbna.com; Frank Genadio 
      [genadiof001(at)hawaii.rr.com]; Jameans311(at)aol.com; 
      (jmoutria_09(at)yahoo.com); 
      dalecksr(at)hotmail.com; linette59(at)charter.net; RLSkillings(at)KilianCorp.com; 
      
      pepe12(at)aol.com; Tammy Walker (tlw65(at)msn.com); lmingus(at)cusa.canon.com; 
      Carr, 
      Sandra E. (USAILS); Daly, Thomas M. (USAILS); Hudson, Jennifer (USAILS); 
      
      Klostermann, Linda M. (USAILS); Lanciault, Maria L. (USAILS); 
      Littlefair, Jamie 
      L. (USAILS); Lloyd, Rich H. (USAILS); McMannis, Tammy (USAILS); 
      Netemeyer, Ryan 
      C. (USAILS); Richter, Theresa A. (USAILS); Ripperda, Beverly A. 
      (USAILS); 
      Rodick, Catherine. M. (USAILS); Schield, Lynn M. (USAILS); Scott, Angela 
      
      (USAILS); Silva, Natalie (USAILS); Smith, Kathy L. (USAILS); Swanston, 
      Julie 
      (USAILS)
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      > Go to the bottom and you won't have to go through all the forwarded 
      e-mails.  
      I don't feel I have anything to lose by sending this.  If you don't want 
      to, 
      please just delete it.
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > From: Lanciault, Maria L. (USAILS) 
      > Sent: Friday, June 16, 2006 9:10 AM
      > To: Carr, Sandra E. (USAILS); Durborow, Deirdre A. (USAILS); Hudson, 
      Jennifer 
      (USAILS); McMannis, Tammy (USAILS); Netemeyer, Ryan C. (USAILS); 
      Richter, 
      Theresa A. (USAILS); Rodick, Catherine. M. (USAILS); Schield, Lynn M. 
      (USAILS); 
      Schuyler, Monica L. (USAILS); Scott, Angela (USAILS); Silva, Natalie 
      (USAILS); 
      Skillings, Esther A. (USAILS); Smith, Kathy L. (USAILS); Swanston, Julie 
      
      (USAILS); Titterington, Wanda L. (USAILS); Voss, Joyce A. (USAILS); 
      Watt, Peggy 
      J. (USAILS); Weber, Mary M. (USAILS)
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > From: Tara Lanciault [mailto:taraml516(at)yahoo.com] 
      > Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 10:35 AM
      > To: Jillian Adkins; Kate Altenhofer; Abby Barnett; Tricia Beelman; Pam 
      
      Borusiewich; Sean Devereaux; Jen Ferguson; Eve Fitzgerald; Jennifer 
      Foster; 
      Stephanie Franklin; Stephanie Fujarski; Danielle Jenkerson; Dominic 
      Lampasi; 
      Chris Lanciault; Justine Lanciault; Lanciault, Maria L. (USAILS); Sarah 
      Linneman; Jenny Lipa; Denny Maher; Kelley Maher; Michelle Oglesby; Gina 
      Oldani; 
      Tara Purtle; Mary Rademaker; Ericka Schmidt; Krissi Wertenberger; 
      Melissa 
      Wingerter; Julie Woodside
      > Subject: Fwd: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > kbkcheer6(at)aim.com wrote: 
      > 
      > Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2006 22:57:31 -0400
      > From: kbkcheer6(at)aim.com
      > Subject: Fwd: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > To: tmkalkbrenner1s(at)semo.edu>, taraml516(at)yahoo.com, 
      sportey09(at)swbell.net,
      > snyderfn(at)aol.com, franklinstephanie(at)sbcglobal.net
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: sarah kalkbrenner <sarahnowens1129@sbcglobalnet>
      > To: amanda cravens ; Brandy ; 
      kristy 
      owens ; cari kalkbrenner ; 
      christopher kalkbrenner ; cicely mitchell 
      ; derrick robinson 
      ; 
      Kasey Horn ; Jenn Martin 
      ; 
      lindy gleason ; julie 
      ; 
      Kristine Kalkbrenner ; mike mccoy 
      ; 
      Melody McCrea <melody.mccrea@eads-nadefense.com>; lisa snyder 
      ; emily baras 
      > Subject: Fwd: FW: Fwd: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! 
      ASAP
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Note: forwarded message attached. 
      > 
      > Attached Message
      > 
      > 
      > From:
      > 
      > Cicely Mitchell 
      > 
      > 
      > To:
      > 
      > lon pulley ; jeniferchinn11(at)aol.com; ROBERT 
      JENKINS 
      ; Ali Moseia Jenkins ; 
      Ken 
      Duncan ; Humphrey King 
      ; 
      sarah kalkbrenner ; Dee Robinson 
      ; Jamelah Chinn ; 
      Chandra 
      Peebles 
      > 
      > 
      > Subject:
      > 
      > Fwd: FW: Fwd: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      > 
      > Date:
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Note: forwarded message attached. 
      > 
      > Attached Message
      > 
      > 
      > From:
      > 
      > Ali Jenkins 
      > 
      > 
      > To:
      > 
      > joe diaz <joed@roberts-companies.com>; Jay Johnson 
      <jayj@roberts-companies.com>; 
      Cicely Mitchell ; Mike Roberts Jr. 
      <mvrjr@roberts-companies.com>
      > 
      > 
      > Subject:
      > 
      > Fwd: FW: Fwd: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      > 
      > Date:
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Note: forwarded message attached.
      > 
      > Ali Jenkins 
      > 
      > __________________________________________________
      > 
      > Attached Message
      > 
      > 
      > From:
      > 
      > Gia Gleenio 
      > 
      > 
      > To:
      > 
      > livingsingles(at)yahoo.com; vashermanpark(at)sbcglobal.net; 
      oneofkings(at)aol.com; 
      stacyewest(at)hotmail.com; pmlathon(at)aol.com; Michelle.Greer(at)waldenu.edu; 
      markchambers29(at)hotmail.com; kndl(at)tmail.com; josephpalm(at)sbcglobal.net; 
      joeyhollins(at)sbcglobal.net; CEEZWORLD924(at)YAHOO.COM; 
      claudeoallen(at)yahoo.com; 
      williamch07(at)hotmail.com; cgsb6f(at)umsl.edu; AMcCaskill(at)chesterfield.mo.us; 
      
      alimoseia(at)yahoo.com; solodog26(at)yahoo.com
      > 
      > 
      > Subject:
      > 
      > FW: Fwd: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      > 
      > Date:
      > 
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Make room for the future: 
      > 
      > It is up to You to make room for the future, rather than trying to 
      forestall 
      it with old thinking or habits. 
      > 
      > Face the road ahead with a courageous willingness to respond to 
      tranformational energies without any resistance to what you are facing. 
      > 
      > if you earnestly do this, then no force will be able to overcome you. 
      > 
      > Gia 
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > From:  Andrew Rosenthal <andrewrosenthal@sbcglobalnet>
      > To:  Gia Gleenio <girlbookworm.@hotmail.com>, Gia 
      , 
      Trish Stubbs , Jay Heckman , 
      
      Rainbow844 , Linda carter 
      , 
      Chandler , Norma Conley , 
      Bill 
      Craft , "Billk(at)gracestl.org" , 
      Alison 
      , Dena , FRAN PERRY 
      
      > Subject:  Fwd: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > Date:  Tue, 30 May 2006 10:51:53 -0700 (PDT)
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Note: forwarded message attached. 
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > Attached Message
      > 
      > 
      > From:
      > 
      > robin boswell 
      > 
      > 
      > To:
      > 
      > tony ; shane trusty ; allen 
      wilke 
      ; Donald willliams ; Sandesh 
      shetty 
      ; tammie showmaker ; 
      Harrison 
      Somefun ; jim stepp ; 
      jeff 
      swafford ; George teacher ; 
      Shirley 
      Thiele ; gretchen thurlkill 
      ; 
      jack page ; anoop parambil 
      ; 
      anoop pc ; Jimmy Peterson ; 
      ben q 
      ; Benjamin Quaynor ; ronald 
      ; Andrew Rosenthal 
      ; 
      prafulla sahoo ; Mike sargenti 
      ; 
      Stephen kozlovich ; bob lykins 
      ; 
      Kevin Margrabe ; Ron Mcglaughlin 
      ; michael.s metzger 
      ; Anne 
      Gooch ; Dale Gooch ; 
      chazz 
      hamlin ; jack howard ; reggie 
      jennings 
      ; john ; kevin 
      ; kevin ; david 
      ; roy 
      diamond ; michael dosset 
      ; 
      ASSASU EMMANUEL ; tamara everit 
      ; 
      bereket Goitom ; bob ; 
      tabitha 
      boswell ; tim allen ; Tim allen 
      ; ALBERT BAKER ; darrell 
      baldwin 
      ; s 2000 ; adel 
      ; chuck ; jerry clifton 
      
      ; Billy Guy 
      ; 
      richard porter 
      > 
      > 
      > Subject:
      > 
      > Fwd: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      > 
      > Date:
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > Note: forwarded message attached. 
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > Feel free to call! Free PC-to-PC calls. Low rates on PC-to-Phone. Get 
      Yahoo! 
      Messenger with Voice 
      <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail_us/taglines/postman10/*http:/us.rd.yahoo.com
      /evt=39663/*http:/messenger.yahoo.com>  
      
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > Sneak preview the all-new Yahoo.com 
      <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=40762/*http:/www.yahoo.com/preview> 
       It's not radically different. Just radically better. 
      > 
      > Attached Message
      > 
      > 
      > From:
      > 
      > Matt & Tammie 
      > 
      > 
      > To:
      > 
      > robin boswell 
      > 
      > 
      > Subject:
      > 
      > Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      > 
      > Date:
      > 
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > 
      > From: erindanmic(at)peoplepc.com 
      > 
      > To: jeffandsherrie(at)insightbb.com ; gjgriner(at)yahoo.com ; Norma 
      Showmaker ; 
      James Rhew ; tammie showmaker ; jeanna showmaker ; mona lawrence ; 
      snacuff(at)yahoo.com 
      > 
      > Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 8:10 AM
      > 
      > Subject: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > 
      > From: Matt & Tammie 
      > 
      > To: michelle 
      > 
      > Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 2:58 PM
      > 
      > Subject: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > 
      > From: Patricia Louque 
      > 
      > To: Brandi Hohensee ; Birdsong, Freda L CAR ; Allison D. Broussard ; 
      Alison 
      Stone 
      > 
      > Cc: Zito, Debbie CAR ; Karcher, Theresa A CAR ; Jimmy Demouy ; james 
      cornelius 
      jr. ; Charlette David 
      > 
      > Sent: Monday, May 08, 2006 8:11 AM
      > 
      > Subject: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > 
      > From: Suzanne Leblanc 
      > 
      > To: Suzanne Leblanc 
      > 
      > Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 6:27 PM
      > 
      > Subject: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > Here goes
      > 
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > 
      > From: Spectrum Learning 
      > 
      > To: 'Spectrum Learning' 
      > 
      > Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 11:42 AM
      > 
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > I will not hold my breath on this one, but what have I got to lose.  
      If you 
      read below, you=C3=83=C2=A2=C3=A2?=C2=AC=C3=A2?=C2=A2ll see 
      =C3=83=C2=A2=C3=A2?=C2=AC=C3=A2?? we might all get rich!  Ha Ha!
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > Cristi Kinchen
      > 
      > Spectrum Learning, LLC
      > 
      > Office:  (225) 751-7548    Cell:  (225) 892-3296
      > 
      > 4928 Legend Drive
      > 
      > Baton Rouge, LA 70817
      > 
      >  <http://www.spectrumlearning.org/> www.spectrumlearning.org
      > 
      > cristi(at)spectrumlearning.org
      > 
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: The Priests [mailto:rcpriest(at)cox.net] 
      > Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 9:57 AM
      > To: 'Patsy Priest'; 'Rube, Jeanne D'; manzullo(at)bellsouth.net; 
      scottculotta(at)cox.net; jajmaddox(at)cox.net; emilywarder(at)cox.net; 'Stephen 
      Gaudin'; 
      'Raquel'; 'MIKE MURY'; 'Jody Caraccioli'; 'Spectrum Learning'; 'Shane 
      Haag'; 
      odivittorio(at)pnlending.com; 'Christy Davis'; cgilbert(at)pnlending.com; 
      dpitarro(at)pnlending.com; 'Kimberly DiVittorio'; Frank & Donna DiVittorio; 
      'roy 
      divittorio'; 'Wendy Magill'; 'Jennifer Davidson'; garyandlizj(at)cox.net; 
      jta(at)bswllp.com; dedibert(at)hotmail.com; anitaevans(at)cox.net; 'Aime Duhe'; 
      dawn.iueli(at)dps.state.la.us; gmoore(at)stjamesplace.com; 
      raneyland(at)ebrschools.com; 
      avon(at)i-55.com; lisroberts4(at)cox.net; 'the'; 
      joanie.wilson(at)dps.state.la.us; 
      laurel.wilson(at)lpsb.org; 'The Berry's'; thecraigs(at)i-ccg.com
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > My accountant forwarded me this 
      message=C3=83=C2=A2=C3=A2?=C2=AC=C3=A2?=C2=9DI figured I would forward 
      it on 
      and if I get a quick check(ha ha ha!), 
      I=C3=83=C2=A2=C3=A2?=C2=AC=C3=A2?=C2=A2ll be sure to let you know.  I 
      won=C3=83=C2=A2=C3=A2?=C2=AC=C3=A2?=C2=A2t hold my breath though.
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: Wanda M [mailto:wandam(at)garretycpa.com] 
      > Sent: Thursday, May 04, 2006 11:08 AM
      > To: bfpace(at)mailcomm.com
      > Cc: pondsnmore(at)yahoo.com; chasjoo(at)bellsouth.net; Charles Padgett; 
      chocf1223(at)aol.com; drcarver64(at)cox.net; candjschmitt(at)cox.net; 
      fieldmh(at)bellsouth.net; Mark Marionneaux; padgett247(at)cox.net; Rick & 
      Caroline 
      Priest; gumbo(at)gatorhook.com; Tiffany; cattlemen(at)msn.com
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > From: Mitch [mailto:mchauvin(at)garretycpa.com] 
      > Sent: Thursday, May 04, 2006 10:53 AM
      > To: afalcon3(at)cox.net; achauvin2(at)aol.com; 'Anna Herrera'; 'Raborn, 
      Angel'; 
      'Andy Sale'; Aron.Tendler(at)uchospitals.edu; 'bruce grizzaffi'; 
      bfaucheaux(at)cretinhomes.com; bgarrety(at)garretycpa.com; 'Candace Pearce'; 
      Ccccajun76(at)aol.com; 'Chris Dettman'; 'Charles Laenger'; 'Carla Schmitt'; 
      
      'Christy Tate'; dmc(at)psci.net; ErinF1(at)garretycpa.com; 
      garretycpa(at)yahoo.com; 'Gary 
      & Mary Garrety_DuPuis'; garrety(at)garretycpa.com; 'heather pearce'; 'Jamie 
      P'; 
      'Janet Johannsen'; johnd(at)garretycpa.com; 'Jonathan C. Parker'; 'Kristi 
      Marchiafava'; 'Lisa Cox'; lesadelayne(at)cox.net; 'Mitch'; 
      PCSONG(at)HOTMAIL.COM; 
      'Patti Kempf'; smileymitchel(at)aol.com; shawngruenig(at)aol.com; 'Trey & 
      Aimee 
      Bellue'; toni.thompson(at)shawgp.com; 'Wanda M'; waynedavis(at)garretycpa.com; 
      
      XtreamTks(at)aol.com
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > Mitchel E. Chauvin
      > 
      > 225-291-7011 office
      > 
      > 225-292-4511 fax
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > IRS Circular 230 Disclaimer:
      > 
      > Pursuant to Treasury guidelines, any tax advice contained in this 
      communication (or any attachment) does not constitute a formal opinion.  
      
      Accordingly, any tax advice contained in this communication (or any 
      attachment) 
      is not intended or written to be used, and cannot be used by any 
      taxpayer, for 
      the purpose of avoiding penalties that may be asserted by the Internal 
      Revenue 
      Service.
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE:  
      > 
      > This email transmission is solely for the use of the intended 
      recipient and 
      may contain information that is privileged confidential or otherwise 
      exempt from 
      disclosure under applicable law.  If you are not the intended recipient, 
      you are 
      hereby notified that any disclosures, distribution or action taken or 
      omitted in 
      reliance on it is strictly prohibited.  If you receive this information 
      in 
      error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original 
      transmission.
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > From: Bonnie Brister [mailto:bonniebr(at)bellsouth.net] 
      > Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2006 8:49 PM
      > To: Anna Kathryne Kronenberger; Bridget Boudreaux; Carla Harris; 
      catherine 
      spooner; cccaulfield(at)bellsouth.net; Cindy Bolin; Cynthia Bailey; Jackie 
      Creaghan; jennifer champagne; Jenny Jessen; Kathy Kelly; Kristen 
      Simpson; 
      Kristie Kline; momnbilly; mskaynelson(at)aol.com; N C Pavone; Naz Butcher; 
      PC 
      Bigelow; reneesnp(at)bellsouth.net; Robert Marx; saramarie(at)rushmore.com; 
      Stacey 
      Whittemore; susancolelilly(at)comcast.net; TOM RATKOVICH ALLISON RATKOVICH; 
      Tricia; 
      Vicky Kelly
      > Subject: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > 
      > From: Dana Webster 
      > 
      > To: TRACIE MORROW ; Terri Davis ; Shelly Smith ; Sarah Tomalin ; Sandy 
      Holberg 
      ; Rhonda Henson ; Rhonda Brown ; Marcy English ; Lea Kerns ; Kena Martin 
      ; Kay 
      Nelson ; Jennifer Barr ; Jennifer Barr ; Donna Osborne ; 
      okiegordonfan(at)hotmail.com 
      
      > 
      > Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2006 8:13 AM
      > 
      > Subject: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > 
      > From: linda maag 
      > 
      > To: Wayne ; ailto:Stephaniedibona(at)charter.net"> 
      <http://us.f602.mail.yahoo.com/ym/mStef%3c/A%3e%20;%20%3cA%20title=Stry
      ldy(at)aol.com%20%20%20href=> 
      Rita ; Les ; Jimmy ; Jim ; Deb 
      > 
      > Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2006 10:48 PM
      > 
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: keokiana1(at)netzero.net [mailto:keokiana1(at)netzero.net]
      > Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2006 9:44 PM
      > To: anaboy44(at)hotmail.com; cgonsalves6(at)aol.com; 
      jrmansfield(at)fiberpipe.net; 
      putty(at)hawaii.com; danana(at)hawaii.com; mommane(at)yahoo.com; 
      joanblurton(at)earthlink.net; 
      deapana1(at)yahoo.com; hawaiianhoney76(at)hotmail.com; 
      fagarang-ohana(at)verizon.net; 
      YCHAVEZ(at)stx.rr.com
      > Subject: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      > 
      > 
      > ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > 
      > From: mmaguilar(at)micron.com 
      > 
      > To: addyrodriguez4975@hotmailcom ; derricklopez(at)micron.com ; 
      elopez(at)micron.com ; MAYBRAY(at)peoplepc.com ; tllofton(at)spectek.com 
      > 
      > Sent: Friday, March 31, 2006 6:39 PM
      > 
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > From: Cande Gomez [mailto:CandeG(at)FHSID.COM] 
      > Sent: Friday, March 31, 2006 11:44 AM
      > To: mmaguilar; Margarita Sanchez; Villarreal, Elva - Reg4; becky 
      aguilar; 
      Frances Castillo; Laura Fall; Judy Delimont; Esmeralda Salinas; Josie 
      Torres; 
      Josefa Martinez
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > From: Antonia Simental 
      > Sent: Friday, March 31, 2006 11:37 AM
      > To: Rosalia Nava; Terri Hunter; Thelma Gutierrez; Cheri Webster; Cande 
      Gomez; 
      Vianey Hernandez; warren_2865(at)hotmail.com; Augustina Villasenor; Debbie 
      Allred; 
      Esmeralda Salinas; Josie Torres
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > From: Beatrice Reyes 
      > Sent: Friday, March 31, 2006 11:31 AM
      > To: Kara Lively; Kari Brose; Brian Bizik; Barbara Alden; Patty Brown; 
      Frances 
      Castillo; mbr(at)cableone.net; Laura Fall; warren_2865(at)hotmail.com:; Adam 
      G. Hodges
      > Cc: Antonia Simental; Rosa Trevizo
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > From: john greene [mailto:fishcityusa(at)cableone.net] 
      > Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 11:33 PM
      > To: amos0103(at)netzero.net; Andrew Spencer; Becky Garel; 
      Bobandshirley1(at)cs.com; 
      Buffy M. Robinson; Dave Webber; DONALD LESLIE MYERS; Fred; Jackie 
      Richardson; 
      Jacque Strevey; jacread(at)cableone.net; Jean DeRoest; Jeff; Jim Greene; 
      Jimmy w 
      Greene; John Kaminski; kindra; Launa Ford; leslye; Linda and Ron Howard; 
      Lori 
      Thurman; Margaret Caskey; Marissa; meanlilmama23(at)yahoo.com; 
      Mestew2(at)aol.com; 
      mike & Kathy; Misty Nicholas; Ms MICHELLE MARTINEZ; nekka medina; 
      Sabrina; 
      Sandy; Shirley Goff; sterfish; sweet1nkc(at)aol.com
      > Subject: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2006 15:26:45 +0000 
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > Kimberly Terrell
      > 
      > Disburser
      > 
      > Morris Hardwick Schneider
      > 
      > Attorneys at Law
      > 
      > 1701-A  Ellington Rd
      > 
      > Conyers, Ga  30013
      > 
      > 770-760-9601 phone
      > 
      > 770-922-5399 fax
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      > 
      > From: Grant [mailto:nan2125(at)charter.net]
      > Sent: Tue 3/14/2006 6:00 AM
      > To: Sharon Sanders; Sandra Reagan; Melissa Smith; Hanie; Diane Askew; 
      Dana; 
      Cosuelo Griffin; Brigitte Partin; Barbara Ellenberger
      > Subject: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      > Have you seen this?
      > 
      > Sherrie Grant - Bertholf
      > 
      > ----- Original Message ----- 
      > 
      > From: William Drossman 
      > 
      > To: wdrossman(at)cfl.rr.com 
      > 
      > Sent: Friday, March 10, 2006 10:27 PM
      > 
      > Subject: FW: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: ronald costello [mailto:bigrondino(at)msn.com] 
      > Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 7:13 PM
      > To: 5star LCDLC; cheryl; christina hartenstine; evgenia72001; Freedom 
      Alliance; gabidinc smoke; Gail Malloy; gloria; I. B.; IrishLace45; Joy 
      Kaleta; 
      Navarrette, Ruben; redhead
      > Subject: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >  Oh well, what have we got to lose??
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >   
      >  
      > 
      > Subject: Fw: PLEEEEEEASE READ!!!! it was on the news! ASAP
      > 
      >  
      > 
      >   _____  
      > 
      >  
      <http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100122638x1081283466x1074645346/aol?redir=
      http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eaol%2Ecom> 
      and IM. 
      > 
      > 
      > 
      
      ------=____1152108500874_2g10xp0x=a
      Content-Type: text/plain;
          name="_AVG certification_.txt"
      Content-Disposition: attachment;
          filename="_AVG certification_.txt"
      
      Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
      
      
      ------=____1152108500874_2g10xp0x=a
      Content-Type: text/plain;
          name="_AVG certification_.txt"
      Content-Disposition: attachment;
          filename="_AVG certification_.txt"
      
      Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
      
      
      ------=____1152108500874_2g10xp0x=a--
      
      --part1_579.1a8ce.31dd86f3_boundary--
      
      --0-450669789-1152145264=:61263--
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Date: Jul 24, 2006
Subject: Commander pics and stuff
Steve, Please try it now and let me know if you have success or not. Thanks Nico -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of steve Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 12:58 PM Nico, Is your teletuition site for commander pics and documents up? I have tried to access it a few times this morning and get a return saying my credentials are not correct for access. Steve Gilson ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "steve" <steveg(at)nternet.com>
Date: Jul 24, 2006
Subject: Commander pics and stuff
Nico, 5 x 5. Among a few documents I was looking for I was hoping to also see a few pics of Bruce C's 4186B. Bruce, if you have not done so, please send some pictures to Nico's list. Thanks, Steve G. -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of nico css Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 8:05 PM Steve, Please try it now and let me know if you have success or not. Thanks Nico -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of steve Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 12:58 PM Nico, Is your teletuition site for commander pics and documents up? I have tried to access it a few times this morning and get a return saying my credentials are not correct for access. Steve Gilson ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com>
Date: Jul 24, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
Steve, Perhaps Chris Schuermann is reading this....he was the guy who restored Bruce's 520 to its original (beautiful) condition, and he used to have a great photo diary on the web. Perhaps it still exists somewhere and he'll chime in. Although I too would love to see some recent pics of her while under Bruce's care :-). /J ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 7:05 PM > > Nico, > > 5 x 5. Among a few documents I was looking for I was hoping to also see a > few pics of Bruce C's 4186B. > > Bruce, if you have not done so, please send some pictures to Nico's list. > > Thanks, > Steve G. > > -----Original Message----- > [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of nico css > Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 8:05 PM > > > > Steve, > Please try it now and let me know if you have success or not. > Thanks > Nico > > > -----Original Message----- > [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of steve > Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 12:58 PM > > > Nico, > > Is your teletuition site for commander pics and documents up? I have > tried > to access it a few times this morning and get a return saying my > credentials > are not correct for access. > > Steve Gilson > > > __________ NOD32 1.1676 (20060724) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ NOD32 1.1676 (20060724) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Commander 1000 N54GA,#96066
Folks, A good friend of mine has been seriously looking at this aircraft to bring to Perth, Australia. I saw the aircraft at the AOPA Expo at Palm Springs in 10/2002, it seem like this would have been just after it was extensively refurbished by Eagle Creak Aviation. Any relevant information that we should know would be appreciated, particularly history. Needless to say, it will be subject to a very thorough pre-buy, I understand the aircraft is presently with Eagle Creak in Indiana. Who would be professionally and geographically recommended to do the inspection and documents /logs verification? If anybody wants to contact me direct, or . Cheers, Bill Hamilton 500A ZK-DCF, Sydney, Australia. CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet Services and Warbirds.Net. & . This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately to: Australia 61 (0)408 876 526 Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "" <br549phil(at)mindspring.com>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Next interesting Question: Cleveland Brakes for
I spoke with S-Tec and Century afew years ago about adding the 560F to their STCs. S-Tec had zero interest but Century said if I wanted to leave the plane at the factory for a couple of weeks and pay for the flight testing they would certify the 2000 on it. The old L2 just aint what it used to be. Phil Stubbs > [Original Message] > From: Bruce Campbell <brcamp(at)windows.microsoft.com> > To: > Date: 7/24/2006 6:19:01 PM > Subject: RE: Commander-List: Next interesting Question: Cleveland Brakes for > > > I called Century a number of times over the past year. They have not > said no, but never said yes, either. > > I'd very much like to get the 2000. Maybe they'll get it sorted out. > > Bruce > > -----Original Message----- > [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bruce > Campbell > Sent: Monday, July 24, 2006 9:15 AM > for > > > > > 4186B doesn't have new paint yet, but we'll get there. I've assembled > aluminum rails, foam and cloth for a new interior. The front seats have > been replaced (I still have the old one, but ... ) with 500s seat which > are more comfortable, take less room, and, oh yea, don't break your back > in an accident (not that I expect on of those, but) when used with > shoulder harnesses. (I've built up about 250 hours in the period of time > I've had her. Not great, but what I could do. I'd like to do better in > the near future. Now that I'm in a better position financially I should > be able to). The seats have fixed shoulder harnesses, but with the new > ones it makes sense to put inertial reels in. > > BTW, COMCOASTGUARDDIST13 loves the plane. I've carried the admiral and > members of his staff as far as Eastern Montana in it, as well as > patrolling the US border looking for Bad Guys around the San Juan > Islands and out the Straits of Juan de Fuca (that's pronounced Fooo-ka, > not the other way). (Found some, too. I could tell you about it, but > I'd have to shoot you afterwards). Yep, flying around the beautiful > green islands, over the blue water at 500 feet (not lower, noooo sir) on > a nice day. It's a dirty job, but someone has to do it. > > Last annual I replaced the bolts and spacers holding the main gear on, > and a few hydraulic lines which looked original and were leaking. The > result was the taxi behaviour was transformed. I track's nice and > straight at any speed now. > > The engines are the same, still. The original one is getting close > enough to TBO that I need to think about having them both done. The > Lycoming rep at EAA Arlington had some good suggestions, but in the > meantime, the engines just soldier on. > > I've replaced all of the cracked/patched panels on the cowling with new > units of the appropriate gauge (The panels miked out at 0.032, and the > drawings had then at 0.040, probably why they cracked), leaving me the > actual cowls to look at (later). One of the nice things about being in > Boeing land is that there are lots of shop who can laser cut an exact > duplicate of a panel suing the original as a pattern. > > If I had my wishes fulfilled by the Airplane Fairy I'd wish for: > > 1. An autopilot > 2. Cleveland Brakes > 3. Alternators > 4. An engine(s) overhaul or replacement. > 5. Deice boots/hot plate (this is, after all the Great White North). > > OH, yeah, paint. I got a soda blaster and intend to paint 86B with > JetGlo as soon as I can find a place to do it and have the sheet metal > work sorted out (cowlings). I've tried a test section at 25 psi, and > though it was tedious work, the result looked like brand new metal, with > even the steel wool marks from the original painting preserved, but all > 27 or so coats of paint removed cleanly. I have a place lined up to > serve as a blast/paint booth (I think). > > I went long, but, oh well, you asked. Good to hear from you. > > > Bruce > > > -----Original Message----- > [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris > Schuermann > Sent: Saturday, July 22, 2006 5:41 AM > for > > > > > Bruce Campbell wrote: > > Bruce Campbell > > > > AC52 N4186B > > Hiya Bruce! > So, how's old 86B doing these days? Just wondering how many hours > you've put on her, if you're still running the same engines, and if > you've done anything significant (paint, etc?). Hope she's treating you > > well and that you're taking good care of her. I think she's one of the > very few 520's still flying these days. > > cheers, > Chris > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ray Mansfield" <hcourier(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Tach generator cable needed
Clear DayHello, I fly an Aero Commander 680 FLP with the Mr. RPM Conversion. The R/engine RPM gage went to zero on landing last week. Maintenance just told me that the speedometer type cable between the accessory housing of the engine and the tach generator has split. The options are go digital or find a new cable. According to Mr. RPM, there are no such cables to be had through normal channels. Sooo...I'm back to asking for help from everyone on this Aero Commander website. Does anyone have such a part, or knows where I can get such a part. I don't have a part number, but I could get it if needed. Please contact me by email at hcourier(at)cox.net. with availability and price information. Thank you, Ray Mansfield Destin, FL ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Re: Tach generator cable needed
Clear DayI wish Arnold Blankenship monitored this site as he might learn a lot about his clients requirements. Tom F. C-GISS 680FLP (Mr.RPM) ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Mansfield To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 10:41 AM Subject: Commander-List: Tach generator cable needed Hello, I fly an Aero Commander 680 FLP with the Mr. RPM Conversion. The R/engine RPM gage went to zero on landing last week. Maintenance just told me that the speedometer type cable between the accessory housing of the engine and the tach generator has split. The options are go digital or find a new cable. According to Mr. RPM, there are no such cables to be had through normal channels. Sooo...I'm back to asking for help from everyone on this Aero Commander website. Does anyone have such a part, or knows where I can get such a part. I don't have a part number, but I could get it if needed. Please contact me by email at hcourier(at)cox.net. with availability and price information. Thank you, Ray Mansfield Destin, FL ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Re: Part numbers
I'll check the springs I have and see how much corrosion, if any, they have. Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Re: Autopilots: Some news...
520 is not listed on any of the Century auto pilot STC's. The only models listed are flat nacelle aircraft. Bill Leff ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Re: Tach generator cable needed
How long is the cable? The T6 Texan used the same setup. I'll check with my supplier to see if any are available. Bill Leff 937-369-3334 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Andrew & Bridget Watson <andrew.bridget(at)telus.net>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: PLEEZ READ message sent out earlier in the week from Mason's
e-mail account Mason, I'm betting you never intentionally sent out that message, right? Because I apparently inadvertantly sent out that message too... only I deleted it after reading it. Likewise the second note saying it was a hoax also was e- mailed to people in my address book. Opening the message seems to trigger a mass-mailing without the 'sender' being aware of it. Forwarding it or replying to it replicates the trigger. I suspect it is a means of getting addresses for spam. There is embedded code in the note which registers the receiving e-mail address as a valid address in a database somewhere out on the 'net. I've done a virus scan and spyware scan, and am now clean. And yes, I use the latest version of Norton, but this one seemed to have a way around it. A scan using Spyware Doctor found it and deleted it. Regards, Andrew ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "mike floyd" <floydgm(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Tach generator cable needed
Here try this for a new custom made tach cable We have a couple in stock that were made by ACS work fine. http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/inpages/tachcables.php Mike Commander NW ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "mike floyd" <floydgm(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Re: Tach generator cable needed
I am most certain that if you were to give Arnold Blankenship a phone call he would do his level best to help you out. He has never failed me! Most times his help is immediate, other times it takes him a while to come up to speed on the MR RPM products. I have nothing but respect for Arnold. Mike Commander NW ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <dfalik(at)sbcglobal.net>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Tach generator cable needed
Ditto on Arnold as he has done the last 2 annuals on my 500S allowing my mechanic to assist. Don -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of mike floyd Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 9:58 PM I am most certain that if you were to give Arnold Blankenship a phone call he would do his level best to help you out. He has never failed me! Most times his help is immediate, other times it takes him a while to come up to speed on the MR RPM products. I have nothing but respect for Arnold. Mike Commander NW ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "mike floyd" <floydgm(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: N634CT MR RPM Turbo System
Hey all in Commander Land, N634CT now sports the MR RPM 500S turbocharger conversion too. Test flying we requested 25,000 but ATC would only allowed 23,000, at cruise power settings TAS was 220. Single engine climb, at METO power, climbing through 20,000 at Vyse. Maintained 500 fpm. LH eng hit CHT temp limit there. Take off weight 6720 lb. For a little 500S with 290 HP a side it's a hot rod. Mike Commander NW ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ray Mansfield" <hcourier(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Re: Tach generator cable needed
Thanks Mike. Do you have Arnold Blankenship's phone number. A number of folks mentioned him but no phone number. Ray M. ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 8:58 PM > > I am most certain that if you were to give Arnold Blankenship a phone call > he would do his level best to help you out. He has never failed me! Most > times his help is immediate, other times it takes him a while to come up > to speed on the MR RPM products. I have nothing but respect for Arnold. > > Mike > Commander NW > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "mike floyd" <floydgm(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Re: N634CT MR RPM Turbo System
Thanks John, We have had CT for 3 years now came out of Ruerto Rico. All we had to do to make her a good ship is change the lower spar cap, replace both engine mounts, hang two new engines, install a new panel with new radios, and convert her to turbos. The paint was already pretty good. Mike Commander NW ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "mike floyd" <floydgm(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Re: Tach generator cable needed
Here You Go Ray, Arnold Blankenship Firetruck Aviation 931-729-0007 Mike Commander NW ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: Re: N634CT MR RPM Turbo System
LOL, yep, that's the airplane I flew...shortly after it returned from Puerto Rico and still had a little bit of time before the annual. I did a night IFR flight in it, and 30 min. into the flight, the whole panel went dark on me. That was followed 5 min. later by a blown hose & ensuing complete hydraulic failure. Got the gear down & locked and landed at a nearby field. Typical Commander, the "emergency" was a non-event. Ended up having to ferry it back to Hayward the next day with the gear down & locked, it took a little while :-). Glad to hear you've done all that work. I love seeing these airplanes restored & put back to work the way they should be! Cheers, /John ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 10:14 PM > > Thanks John, > We have had CT for 3 years now came out of Ruerto Rico. All we had to do > to make her a good ship is change the lower spar cap, replace both engine > mounts, hang two new engines, install a new panel with new radios, and > convert her to turbos. The paint was already pretty good. > > Mike > Commander NW > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > __________ NOD32 1.1677 (20060724) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ NOD32 1.1677 (20060724) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Date: Jul 25, 2006
Subject: N634CT MR RPM Turbo System
John- Hopefully I'll be able to add to your pleasure by sending around pictures of an almost fully restored N414C next month... All new avionics, new autopilot, one new engine, two overhauled props, new interior, new external lighting... To quote another poster: "The paint is still in good shape tho." Robert -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Vormbaum Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 22:30 --> LOL, yep, that's the airplane I flew...shortly after it returned from Puerto Rico and still had a little bit of time before the annual. I did a night IFR flight in it, and 30 min. into the flight, the whole panel went dark on me. That was followed 5 min. later by a blown hose & ensuing complete hydraulic failure. Got the gear down & locked and landed at a nearby field. Typical Commander, the "emergency" was a non-event. Ended up having to ferry it back to Hayward the next day with the gear down & locked, it took a little while :-). Glad to hear you've done all that work. I love seeing these airplanes restored & put back to work the way they should be! Cheers, /John ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 10:14 PM > > Thanks John, > We have had CT for 3 years now came out of Ruerto Rico. All we had to do > to make her a good ship is change the lower spar cap, replace both engine > mounts, hang two new engines, install a new panel with new radios, and > convert her to turbos. The paint was already pretty good. > > Mike > Commander NW > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > __________ NOD32 1.1677 (20060724) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ NOD32 1.1677 (20060724) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > __________ NOD32 1.1678 (20060725) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "N395V" <n395v(at)hughes.net>
Date: Jul 26, 2006
Subject: Re: N634CT MR RPM Turbo System
It is good to know N414C is being refurbished. It really hurt to watch my old 560 go on e bay for pennies because of corrosion. I suspectr it now powers 2 airboats and is a parts source for others. -------- Milt N395V F1 Rocket Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=49893#49893 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ray Mansfield" <hcourier(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 26, 2006
Subject: Re: Tach generator cable needed
Thanks Mike, I'm going to call Arnold shortly. Have had a number of good ideas from folks. RM ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2006 12:07 AM > > Here You Go Ray, > Arnold Blankenship Firetruck Aviation 931-729-0007 > > Mike > Commander NW > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ray Mansfield" <hcourier(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 26, 2006
Subject: Re: Tach generator cable needed
Hi Mike, Got in touch with Arnold, but he doesn't have any tach cables and is having difficulty locating one for another plane. I contacted Aircraft Spruce and they can custom make such cables but there's a 6 week lead time involved. You noted in your email that you "have a couple in stock...". Does that mean in stock for sale or in stock for your needs. If you have one for sale we are interested and would like to buy one. Let me know the status in that regard. Am also going to contact Mason Chevaillier as he said he may know someone. Ray Mansfield ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 7:01 PM > > Here try this for a new custom made tach cable > We have a couple in stock that were made by ACS work fine. > > http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/inpages/tachcables.php > > Mike > Commander NW > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 26, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
John Vormbaum wrote: > Perhaps it still exists somewhere and > he'll chime in. You're too kind with your description John. I never did really get to finish that project sadly. I'm tickled that she's in good hands and that Bruce is both flying and improving along the way! I dredged through the web site, and some of the pics are still available at: http://www.aerocommander.com/Myresto/index.html I HAVE, however, been able to finish my current steed. Isn't a commander, but she's sure a sweetie: http://members.cox.net/cschuerm/ cheers Chris ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Brock Lorber <blorber(at)southwestcirrus.com>
Date: Jul 26, 2006
Subject: Re: N634CT MR RPM Turbo System [bcc][faked-from]
John Vormbaum wrote: >220ktas? Awesome! > > 220 ktas? Unbelievable! I'll take some of the under action. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "steve2" <steve2(at)sover.net>
Date: Jul 27, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
What a beautiful job you've made of 'Pugly'. Old round airplanes look best with old style paint schemes. That airplane looks like a nice place to spend some time. Steve ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2006 8:25 PM > > > > John Vormbaum wrote: >> Perhaps it still exists somewhere and >> he'll chime in. > > You're too kind with your description John. I never did really get to > finish that project sadly. I'm tickled that she's in good hands and > that Bruce is both flying and improving along the way! I dredged > through the web site, and some of the pics are still available at: > http://www.aerocommander.com/Myresto/index.html > > I HAVE, however, been able to finish my current steed. Isn't a > commander, but she's sure a sweetie: > http://members.cox.net/cschuerm/ > > > cheers > Chris > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Donnie Rose <aquadiver99(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 27, 2006
Subject: Re: Autopilots: Some news...
What STC's are listed for the 500B? --- BillLeff1(at)aol.com wrote: > 520 is not listed on any of the Century auto pilot > STC's. The only models > listed are flat nacelle aircraft. > > Bill Leff > Donnie Rose 205/492-8444 __________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Donnie Rose <aquadiver99(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 27, 2006
Subject: Re: Gust Lock
Thank you Bill, Oshkosh was great and She did well! --- BillLeff1(at)aol.com wrote: > Put a Laundry Line Clothes Pin on toyr throttle. > When you line up on the > runway always check your "Controls Free and Compass > agrees with runway > heading" as yor last check. > > Bill Leff > Donnie Rose 205/492-8444 __________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 27, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
steve2 wrote: > What a beautiful job you've made of 'Pugly'. Thanks Steve! I spent months debating over different paint schemes before coming up with that one. It's a difficult airplane to put an attactive paint job on for sure. I've really enjoyed this airplane a lot more than I thought I would. It's just a wonderful airplane to fly. Big, roomy, stable, and very docile. cheers, Chris ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "steve" <steveg(at)nternet.com>
Date: Jul 27, 2006
Subject: Oskosh ATC
If some of you have forgotten you can go to http://www.liveatc.net/feedindex.php and listen to Oskosh. It becomes a real hoot to listen to some of the best controllers control non-stop dozens of aircraft at the same time. Steve G ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Date: Jul 27, 2006
Subject: Re: Part numbers
I now need the big oil cooler and my parts book is at the hanger so if anyone knows of a source please advise. Time is of the essence as I am trying to make the Abbotsford airshow August 11. Once again thanks. Tom F. C-GISS 680FLP (Mr.RPM) ----- Original Message ----- From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 11:07 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Part numbers I'll check the springs I have and see how much corrosion, if any, they have. Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
Gentelmen, I have been informed that my Ray Jay turbo chargers need replacement due to cracks on the hot side which are beyond limits. Are there any Ray Jay's out there? Tom F. C-GISS 680FLP (Mr.RPM) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Re: Part numbers
If you would check for the large oil cooler and Ray Jays too! Tom F. C-GISS 680FLP (Mr.RPM) ----- Original Message ----- From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 11:07 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Part numbers I'll check the springs I have and see how much corrosion, if any, they have. Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "mike floyd" <floydgm(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
Talk to Gary Main at Main Turbos: Main Turbo Systems 800-847-8815 234 Cotta CT. Visalia CA. 93292 He will fix you up. Mike Commander NW ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
Gary has my turbos now, $5,400.00 is generating these inquiries as this was an unexpected expense and I need to find an alternate solution. By the way, do these Ray Jay's have "blankets" on them? The engineers say yes, the original owner says no. Can't find them in the Mr.RPM drawings. Tom F. C-GISS 680FLP (Mr.RPM) ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 8:30 AM > > Talk to Gary Main at Main Turbos: > > Main Turbo Systems 800-847-8815 > 234 Cotta CT. > Visalia CA. 93292 > > He will fix you up. > > Mike > Commander NW > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "mike floyd" <floydgm(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
Yes they do have blankets, I do not have the P/N with me I am in Anchorage right now headed to Barrow today. The only other solution to the turbos are new from Kelly Aerospace purchased through Aviall or API. Only problem with that is a 6 to 8 week lead time. Main Turbos can do an overhaul and turn them usually in a day, off the top of my head though that is probably the $5400 you are talking about. Mike Commander NW ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
Tom, call Morris 321-403-8813 and he'll give you the name of the company in southern California that mfr's them. I got a new set (4!) a couple of years ago for a bargain, only $2,500 each. And it took 2 trips, as the first set had the wrong wheels in them and would suck when you added "boost". I could get the MP to drop 4" by closing the wastegates. /John ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 8:03 AM > > > Gentelmen, > > I have been informed that my Ray Jay turbo chargers need replacement due > to cracks on the hot side which are beyond limits. Are there any Ray > Jay's out there? > > Tom F. > C-GISS > 680FLP (Mr.RPM) > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > > > __________ NOD32 1.1682 (20060727) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ NOD32 1.1682 (20060727) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
Tom Fisher wrote: > I have been informed that my Ray Jay turbo chargers need replacement Tom, When I did the engine on my Viking, I went with new rayjays. I was told that there had been a number of improvments made by the current mfgr that eliminated some of the problems as well as a new bearing design which gave much longer life. The cost wasn't much more than a complete overhaul if memory serves. FYI, the new carbon bearings will leak a bit on the new units until they seat in. I had some puddles under the exhaust stacks for about the first 30 hours or so, then things dried up nicely and they performed flawlessly from that point on. Chris ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Commander pics and stuff
Chris- Is this leaking behavior normal for all turbos? Robert -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris Schuermann Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 12:21 --> Tom Fisher wrote: > I have been informed that my Ray Jay turbo chargers need replacement Tom, When I did the engine on my Viking, I went with new rayjays. I was told that there had been a number of improvments made by the current mfgr that eliminated some of the problems as well as a new bearing design which gave much longer life. The cost wasn't much more than a complete overhaul if memory serves. FYI, the new carbon bearings will leak a bit on the new units until they seat in. I had some puddles under the exhaust stacks for about the first 30 hours or so, then things dried up nicely and they performed flawlessly from that point on. Chris __________ NOD32 1.1683 (20060728) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bruce Campbell" <brcamp(at)windows.microsoft.com>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Commander pics and stuff
Do you know if the current manufacturer of RayJays retained the STCs? Is there one for the 520? Who is the current manufacturer, anyway? Bruce Campbell -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris Schuermann Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 12:21 PM Tom Fisher wrote: > I have been informed that my Ray Jay turbo chargers need replacement Tom, When I did the engine on my Viking, I went with new rayjays. I was told that there had been a number of improvments made by the current mfgr that eliminated some of the problems as well as a new bearing design which gave much longer life. The cost wasn't much more than a complete overhaul if memory serves. FYI, the new carbon bearings will leak a bit on the new units until they seat in. I had some puddles under the exhaust stacks for about the first 30 hours or so, then things dried up nicely and they performed flawlessly from that point on. Chris ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
Robert S. Randazzo wrote: > Is this leaking behavior normal for all turbos? I honestly can't say about other brands. A tech guy at Consolidated provided that information when I called and inquired about the leakage on the new RayJays. He said that they'd redesigned the bearing assembly using some new carbon-based material that had to seat in just like a new set of piston rings. Before that, it was considered "bad" if you had bearing leakage at all - a sign of bearing seal failure. Don't know if everyone in the industry has changed or not. chris ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Chris Schuermann <cschuerm(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
Bruce Campbell wrote: > Do you know if the current manufacturer of RayJays retained the STCs? Is > there one for the 520? Who is the current manufacturer, anyway? Bruce, The current manufacturer is now Kelly Aerospace. If memory serves, they bought them from Consolidated who bought out Rayjay. Along the way, some of the STCs were sold off. I have a vague recollection that "Wind Dancer" ended up with the Commander related STCs. The principal of that company used to be on this list, but I'm drawing a blank on his name (sorry). They used to have a web site at: www.winddancer.aero but it seems to be gone now. You might contact Kelly at: http://www.kellyaerospace.com/turbos.html Cheers, Chris ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bruce Campbell" <brcamp(at)windows.microsoft.com>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Commander pics and stuff
Bad news about Wind Dancer. It was owned by eent.com, who does have a web site. When I called, the message discussed "the involuntary order of chapter 11" which was filed. Airnav no longer mentions wind dancer aviation. Oh well.. So what happens to an STC when the owner disappears? It would seem sad for all of those STCs to disappear with them. Bruce -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris Schuermann Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 1:24 PM Bruce Campbell wrote: > Do you know if the current manufacturer of RayJays retained the STCs? Is > there one for the 520? Who is the current manufacturer, anyway? Bruce, The current manufacturer is now Kelly Aerospace. If memory serves, they bought them from Consolidated who bought out Rayjay. Along the way, some of the STCs were sold off. I have a vague recollection that "Wind Dancer" ended up with the Commander related STCs. The principal of that company used to be on this list, but I'm drawing a blank on his name (sorry). They used to have a web site at: www.winddancer.aero but it seems to be gone now. You might contact Kelly at: http://www.kellyaerospace.com/turbos.html Cheers, Chris ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "mike floyd" <floydgm(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Commander pics and stuff
The holder of the Commander STC's is now MR RPM LLC Firetruck Aviation Centerville TN. Arnold Blankenship. Mike Commander NW ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
Unfortunately 30 - 60 day lead time. Tom F. ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 12:20 PM > > > > Tom Fisher wrote: >> I have been informed that my Ray Jay turbo chargers need replacement > > > Tom, > When I did the engine on my Viking, I went with new rayjays. I was told > that there had been a number of improvments made by the current mfgr > that eliminated some of the problems as well as a new bearing design > which gave much longer life. The cost wasn't much more than a complete > overhaul if memory serves. FYI, the new carbon bearings will leak a bit > on the new units until they seat in. I had some puddles under the > exhaust stacks for about the first 30 hours or so, then things dried up > nicely and they performed flawlessly from that point on. > > Chris > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Date: Jul 28, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
I got a price from "Wind Dancer" and it was almost twice than Kelly's. Tom F. ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 1:24 PM > > > > Bruce Campbell wrote: >> Do you know if the current manufacturer of RayJays retained the STCs? Is >> there one for the 520? Who is the current manufacturer, anyway? > > Bruce, > The current manufacturer is now Kelly Aerospace. If memory serves, they > bought them from Consolidated who bought out Rayjay. Along the way, > some of the STCs were sold off. I have a vague recollection that "Wind > Dancer" ended up with the Commander related STCs. The principal of that > company used to be on this list, but I'm drawing a blank on his name > (sorry). They used to have a web site at: > www.winddancer.aero but it seems to be gone now. > > You might contact Kelly at: > http://www.kellyaerospace.com/turbos.html > > Cheers, > Chris ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tylor Hall <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
Date: Jul 30, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
Bruce, Winddancer had all the Rajay STC. Kelly Aero Space kept the manufacturing rights because that is what they do. EENT sold off the FBO and then sold the STC to several different people. EENT did not pay for the MR RPM as agreed and Dick took his STC back. I think there was an STC for 560 commanders, but the drawings were incomplete. I do not believe there was one for the 520. Firetruck Aviation now has the Commander Rajay STC and Mr RPM STC. Tylor Hall On Jul 28, 2006, at 2:51 PM, Bruce Campbell wrote: > > > Bad news about Wind Dancer. It was owned by eent.com, who does have a > web site. When I called, the message discussed "the involuntary > order of > chapter 11" which was filed. > > Airnav no longer mentions wind dancer aviation. > > Oh well.. So what happens to an STC when the owner disappears? It > would > seem sad for all of those STCs to disappear with them. > > Bruce > > > -----Original Message----- > [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris > Schuermann > Sent: Friday, July 28, 2006 1:24 PM > > > > > Bruce Campbell wrote: >> Do you know if the current manufacturer of RayJays retained the STCs? > Is >> there one for the 520? Who is the current manufacturer, anyway? > > Bruce, > The current manufacturer is now Kelly Aerospace. If memory serves, > they > > bought them from Consolidated who bought out Rayjay. Along the way, > some of the STCs were sold off. I have a vague recollection that > "Wind > Dancer" ended up with the Commander related STCs. The principal of > that > > company used to be on this list, but I'm drawing a blank on his name > (sorry). They used to have a web site at: > www.winddancer.aero but it seems to be gone now. > > You might contact Kelly at: > http://www.kellyaerospace.com/turbos.html > > Cheers, > Chris > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Date: Jul 30, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
I am in desperate need of two Ray Jay turbo chargers. The hot side on each one are cracked beyond limits and I am looking at 60 day delivery from Kelly. Any out there? Tom F. C-GISS 680FLP (Mr.RPM) ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2006 6:53 AM > > > Bruce, > Winddancer had all the Rajay STC. Kelly Aero Space kept the > manufacturing rights because that is what they do. > EENT sold off the FBO and then sold the STC to several different people. > EENT did not pay for the MR RPM as agreed and Dick took his STC back. > I think there was an STC for 560 commanders, but the drawings were > incomplete. I do not believe there was one for the 520. > Firetruck Aviation now has the Commander Rajay STC and Mr RPM STC. > Tylor Hall > > > On Jul 28, 2006, at 2:51 PM, Bruce Campbell wrote: > >> >> >> Bad news about Wind Dancer. It was owned by eent.com, who does have a >> web site. When I called, the message discussed "the involuntary order of >> chapter 11" which was filed. >> >> Airnav no longer mentions wind dancer aviation. >> >> Oh well.. So what happens to an STC when the owner disappears? It would >> seem sad for all of those STCs to disappear with them. >> >> Bruce ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Long body commanders?
Commanders- I've been asked to performa a small research project related to the autopilot that we are working to have STC'd for the commander fleet, and I've been asked for a few fleet numbers. I need some help as follows: -> Which of the 680 series commanders are long-body airplanes like the 685/690, etc? -> Anyone have handy numbers as to how many of the long-body 680 and 685 airplanes are still active in service? -> Anyone have handy numbers as to how many 690 - 1000 series commanders are in service? Thanks, guys... I am working to convince the firm that they really should look to incorporate the entire commander line in their STC efforts so that we can have access to a new, lightweight digital autopilot for all commanders... I'll keep you posted on my efforts. Robert Randazzo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ray Mansfield" <hcourier(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Re: Long body commanders?
I fly a 680 FLP which is the long body. RM ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 11:37 AM > > > Commanders- > > I've been asked to performa a small research project related to the > autopilot that we are working to have STC'd for the commander fleet, and > I've been asked for a few fleet numbers. I need some help as follows: > > -> Which of the 680 series commanders are long-body airplanes like the > 685/690, etc? > > -> Anyone have handy numbers as to how many of the long-body 680 and 685 > airplanes are still active in service? > > -> Anyone have handy numbers as to how many 690 - 1000 series commanders > are > in service? > > Thanks, guys... > > I am working to convince the firm that they really should look to > incorporate the entire commander line in their STC efforts so that we can > have access to a new, lightweight digital autopilot for all commanders... > I'll keep you posted on my efforts. > > Robert Randazzo > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: WINGFLYER1(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Re: Long body commanders?
Please consider the straight 680 commander in your STC's Thanks Gil Walker wingflyer1(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CloudCraft(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Re: Long body commanders?
In a message dated 31-Jul-06 09:42:58 Pacific Daylight Time, rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com writes: Which of the 680 series commanders are long-body airplanes like the 685/690, etc? Robert, Sir Barry will undoubtedly have the stats on how many of each airframe are in service. As for models of long bodies, I'll toss out the following: AC-680FL AC-680FL(P) AC-680T,V,W (turbine) AC-681 (turbine model) AC-685 AC-690, A,B,C,D (turbine) AC-695, A,B (turbine) They're all underType Certificate 2A4: (TCDS 2A4 Rev 46 Twin Commander Aircraft Corporation I think the bottom line is the potential market for the long bodies and that equals number on airframes with old Bendix/Motorola or Collins autopilot systems. Good luck and thanks for blazing the trail. Wing Commander Gordon ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Re: Long body commanders?
Hi Robert, The Wing Commander obviously listed all the long-body Commanders. My database shows the following numbers of each of those Models. The first figure is those on the US Register and to the best of my knowledge, still 'active'. It might be prudent to use say 90/95% of these figures to allow for those that are not 'active' in the true sense of the word. The second figure is for those registered elsewhere in the World. It might be prudent to use say 85/90% of these figures, as it is very difficult to get good information from certain areas, such as South America. Piston Models: 680FL - 38 / 34 680FLP - 10 / 5 685 - 29 / 12 Turbine Models: 680T - 2 / 0 680V - 20 / 9 680W - 13 / 8 681 - 18 / 26 690 - 17 / 34 690A - 102 / 89 690B - 121 / 73 690C - 55 / 50 690D - 13 / 18 695 - 29 / 43 695A - 33 / 50 695B - 10 / 3 Before anyone says "Not right, matey", these figures include Models converted to another Model. So, although only 8 695B's were built, my figures include another 6 that were converted from 695A. Similarly, the 680T figure is low as many were converted to 680V. Regrettably, I will be unable to accept any legal liability if these figures are proved to be wrong. In any event, "her indoors" has all the money ;-) Very Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 5:37 PM | | Commanders- | | I've been asked to performa a small research project related to the | autopilot that we are working to have STC'd for the commander fleet, and | I've been asked for a few fleet numbers. I need some help as follows: | | -> Which of the 680 series commanders are long-body airplanes like the | 685/690, etc? | | -> Anyone have handy numbers as to how many of the long-body 680 and 685 | airplanes are still active in service? | | -> Anyone have handy numbers as to how many 690 - 1000 series commanders are | in service? | | Thanks, guys... | | I am working to convince the firm that they really should look to | incorporate the entire commander line in their STC efforts so that we can | have access to a new, lightweight digital autopilot for all commanders... | I'll keep you posted on my efforts. | | Robert Randazzo | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KenWHyde(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Re: Long body commanders?
Barry, Wondering if you have published a list of the 500 series Commanders as you have here for the 680's? Thanks, Ken Hyde ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Long body commanders?
WCG- My "ultimate goal" is to convince them that it is worth covering the entire commander line. Right now we have an agreement in principle to produce a "on-time STC" to allow the AP-3C installation in the 685.... I'm working to convince them that there is a long-sighted approach to this that involves both ends of the commander fleet.... It's an argument that I have to make in stages... Rob _____ [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of WINGFLYER1(at)aol.com Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 09:50 Please consider the straight 680 commander in your STC's Thanks Gil Walker wingflyer1(at)aol.com __________ NOD32 1.1685 (20060731) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CloudCraft(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Re: Long body commanders?
In a message dated 31-Jul-06 12:49:32 Pacific Daylight Time, rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com writes: It's an argument that I have to make in stages... Agreed. You may want to entice them with the idea that the AC-685 is really the same airframe as the AC-690 series and that's got to be an attractive market for them. The Collins AP-105s aren't dead yet, but they'll be as hard to support as the Bendix/Motorola M4 series in another 10 years. Wing Commander Gordon ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Re: Long body commanders?
Hi Ken, OK - here's a listing of the short-body Commanders, with the same caveats as the earlier list! These, of course, are all piston Models: 500 - 43 / 10 500A - 30 / 9 (Including the Colemill "Super 300") 500B - 108 / 35 (Including those converted from 500A) 500S - 93 / 141 500U - 8 / 24 520 - 50 / 7 560 - 26 / 4 560A - 21 / 4 560A(HC) - 11 / 3 560E - 32 / 7 560F - 25 / 15 680 - 64 / 22 680E - 43 / 11 680F - 23 / 21 680F(P) - 17 / 5 720 - 3 / 0 A summary of these and the previous figures is: Piston Models - 684 / 374 Turbine Models - 433 / 403 Total - 1117 / 777 (1,894 still 'active' from a total built of 3,170) If the FAA Register database is checked for these figures, the likelihood is they will not be the same. The reason is that many are still showing on the "current" FAA Register, but were in fact exported many years ago, or have been withdrawn from service or destroyed, but the 'N' number has never been cancelled. Very Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: KenWHyde(at)aol.com To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 8:12 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Long body commanders? Barry, Wondering if you have published a list of the 500 series Commanders as you have here for the 680's? Thanks, Ken Hyde ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Long body commanders?
Gordon- Before the heads of Chelton Aviation were killed in their accident- they had apparently received 34 orders for this autopilot in 690 series airplanes... They were planning to use our airplane to get the STC accomplished, so we're using the 690 as a lever to get the 685 and 680(long body) series covered as well. Interestingly enough, the only reason why we didn't have the STC filed before their accident was because they originally spec'd out the installation based on a short body 680... We had to send back the correct data/drawings/pictures for the installation to have them approved by their engineering people for the long body airplane. We were (literally) waiting on a signature only- and those poor fellows had a run of bad luck. So those drawings and data exist- and with any luck we'll be able to convince the DAS facility that they can act on them. If this can be my contribution to the community- then I'll be quite happy... and then i'll spend the rest of my time tooling around in N414C enjoying my new autopilot. ;-) Robert Randazzo _____ [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of CloudCraft(at)aol.com Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 12:53 In a message dated 31-Jul-06 12:49:32 Pacific Daylight Time, rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com writes: It's an argument that I have to make in stages... Agreed. You may want to entice them with the idea that the AC-685 is really the same airframe as the AC-690 series and that's got to be an attractive market for them. The Collins AP-105s aren't dead yet, but they'll be as hard to support as the Bendix/Motorola M4 series in another 10 years. Wing Commander Gordon __________ NOD32 1.1685 (20060731) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Long body commanders?
Bob, How were they killed? I googled and couldn't find an aviation accident that involved Chelton employees. Let me know. Thanks Nico _____ [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S. Randazzo Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 1:29 PM Gordon- Before the heads of Chelton Aviation were killed in their accident- they had apparently received 34 orders for this autopilot in 690 series airplanes... They were planning to use our airplane to get the STC accomplished, so we're using the 690 as a lever to get the 685 and 680(long body) series covered as well. Interestingly enough, the only reason why we didn't have the STC filed before their accident was because they originally spec'd out the installation based on a short body 680... We had to send back the correct data/drawings/pictures for the installation to have them approved by their engineering people for the long body airplane. We were (literally) waiting on a signature only- and those poor fellows had a run of bad luck. So those drawings and data exist- and with any luck we'll be able to convince the DAS facility that they can act on them. If this can be my contribution to the community- then I'll be quite happy... and then i'll spend the rest of my time tooling around in N414C enjoying my new autopilot. ;-) Robert Randazzo _____ [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of CloudCraft(at)aol.com Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 12:53 In a message dated 31-Jul-06 12:49:32 Pacific Daylight Time, rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com writes: It's an argument that I have to make in stages... Agreed. You may want to entice them with the idea that the AC-685 is really the same airframe as the AC-690 series and that's got to be an attractive market for them. The Collins AP-105s aren't dead yet, but they'll be as hard to support as the Bendix/Motorola M4 series in another 10 years. Wing Commander Gordon __________ NOD32 1.1685 (20060731) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Long body commanders?
Nico- NTSB link to this accident report: http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id 060502X00496 <http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id 060502X00496&key=1> &key=1 Apparently they were on a personal flight... Robert _____ [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of nico css Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 14:01 Bob, How were they killed? I googled and couldn't find an aviation accident that involved Chelton employees. Let me know. Thanks Nico _____ [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S. Randazzo Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 1:29 PM Gordon- Before the heads of Chelton Aviation were killed in their accident- they had apparently received 34 orders for this autopilot in 690 series airplanes... They were planning to use our airplane to get the STC accomplished, so we're using the 690 as a lever to get the 685 and 680(long body) series covered as well. Interestingly enough, the only reason why we didn't have the STC filed before their accident was because they originally spec'd out the installation based on a short body 680... We had to send back the correct data/drawings/pictures for the installation to have them approved by their engineering people for the long body airplane. We were (literally) waiting on a signature only- and those poor fellows had a run of bad luck. So those drawings and data exist- and with any luck we'll be able to convince the DAS facility that they can act on them. If this can be my contribution to the community- then I'll be quite happy... and then i'll spend the rest of my time tooling around in N414C enjoying my new autopilot. ;-) Robert Randazzo _____ [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of CloudCraft(at)aol.com Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 12:53 In a message dated 31-Jul-06 12:49:32 Pacific Daylight Time, rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com writes: It's an argument that I have to make in stages... Agreed. You may want to entice them with the idea that the AC-685 is really the same airframe as the AC-690 series and that's got to be an attractive market for them. The Collins AP-105s aren't dead yet, but they'll be as hard to support as the Bendix/Motorola M4 series in another 10 years. Wing Commander Gordon __________ NOD32 1.1685 (20060731) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com __________ NOD32 1.1685 (20060731) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Re: Long body commanders?
Gents, Another problem with the FAA data is that some (including mine) 680F(p) models are actually listed as 680F models. Pressurization was an "add on option" not a completely different model. Moe N680RR 680F(p) ----- Original Message ----- From: Barry Collman To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 1:20 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Long body commanders? Hi Ken, OK - here's a listing of the short-body Commanders, with the same caveats as the earlier list! These, of course, are all piston Models: 500 - 43 / 10 500A - 30 / 9 (Including the Colemill "Super 300") 500B - 108 / 35 (Including those converted from 500A) 500S - 93 / 141 500U - 8 / 24 520 - 50 / 7 560 - 26 / 4 560A - 21 / 4 560A(HC) - 11 / 3 560E - 32 / 7 560F - 25 / 15 680 - 64 / 22 680E - 43 / 11 680F - 23 / 21 680F(P) - 17 / 5 720 - 3 / 0 A summary of these and the previous figures is: Piston Models - 684 / 374 Turbine Models - 433 / 403 Total - 1117 / 777 (1,894 still 'active' from a total built of 3,170) If the FAA Register database is checked for these figures, the likelihood is they will not be the same. The reason is that many are still showing on the "current" FAA Register, but were in fact exported many years ago, or have been withdrawn from service or destroyed, but the 'N' number has never been cancelled. Very Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: KenWHyde(at)aol.com To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 8:12 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Long body commanders? Barry, Wondering if you have published a list of the 500 series Commanders as you have here for the 680's? Thanks, Ken Hyde ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Re: Long body commanders?
Hi Moe, Yes, of course, that's right. The good folk at the FAA are sometimes prone to not pigeon-holing things in the correct place. Another 'jumble' is with the "Aero Commander 500 S" (FAA MMS code 0141107) and the "Rockwell International 500-S" (FAA MMS code 7630410) where instead of a split at a certain serial number, it seems anything goes into either one of these, regardless of the entity it was manufactured under. Sometimes, in their defence, they are often fed 'duff' info in the first place though! (Not in your case, of course!!) I'm not having a go at the FAA here, as they've always been helpful over and above the call of duty to me and have had the patience of a Saint sometimes!! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: Moe To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 11:17 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Long body commanders? Gents, Another problem with the FAA data is that some (including mine) 680F(p) models are actually listed as 680F models. Pressurization was an "add on option" not a completely different model. Moe N680RR 680F(p) ----- Original Message ----- From: Barry Collman To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 1:20 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Long body commanders? Hi Ken, OK - here's a listing of the short-body Commanders, with the same caveats as the earlier list! These, of course, are all piston Models: 500 - 43 / 10 500A - 30 / 9 (Including the Colemill "Super 300") 500B - 108 / 35 (Including those converted from 500A) 500S - 93 / 141 500U - 8 / 24 520 - 50 / 7 560 - 26 / 4 560A - 21 / 4 560A(HC) - 11 / 3 560E - 32 / 7 560F - 25 / 15 680 - 64 / 22 680E - 43 / 11 680F - 23 / 21 680F(P) - 17 / 5 720 - 3 / 0 A summary of these and the previous figures is: Piston Models - 684 / 374 Turbine Models - 433 / 403 Total - 1117 / 777 (1,894 still 'active' from a total built of 3,170) If the FAA Register database is checked for these figures, the likelihood is they will not be the same. The reason is that many are still showing on the "current" FAA Register, but were in fact exported many years ago, or have been withdrawn from service or destroyed, but the 'N' number has never been cancelled. Very Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: KenWHyde(at)aol.com To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 8:12 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Long body commanders? Barry, Wondering if you have published a list of the 500 series Commanders as you have here for the 680's? Thanks, Ken Hyde ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: Matronics Email List Web Server Upgrade Tonight...
Dear Listers, This evening I will be upgrading the Matronics Web Server hardware to a new Quad-processor 2.8Ghz Xeon system (yes, 4-physical CPUs!) with an Ultra 320 SCSI Raid 5 disk system and 5GB of DDR2 RAM. As with the older system, the new system will be running the latest version of Redhat Linux. Most of the software configuration work is already done for the migration, but I still have to sync all of the archive and forum data from the old system to the new system. I am anticipating about 2 to 3 hours of downtime for me to fully make the transition, although it could be considerable less if everything goes according to plan. The Matronics Webserver will be *UNavailable* from the Internet during the work, and you will receive a time-out if you try to connect during the upgrade. Email List Distribution will be *available* during the upgrade of the Web Server, and List message distribution will function as normal. This represents a significant performance upgrade for the Matronics Web Server and you should notice nicely improved searching and surfing performance following the upgrade! Best regards, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Date: Jul 31, 2006
Subject: A minor courtesy to one another
Commanders- As a courtesy to one another, if you happen to have a system filtering your email, please ensure that it is set up to receive email from this list. It's growing a bit tiring to receive email back from the hundreds of various email filtering scheme's asking me to confirm that I've sent email that has been captured and is being held prisoner because you don't want to receive junk mail. If you signed up for this list- then make sure you get your mail without further input from your fellow list participants! Robert Randazzo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KenWHyde(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 01, 2006
Subject: Re: Long body commanders?
Thanks Barry ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Aug 01, 2006
Subject: Sad news
I just heard this an hour ago. http://www.adn.com/news/alaska/story/8028559p-7921763c.html bilbo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tommy Mathieu" <tmathieu(at)MSN.COM>
Date: Aug 02, 2006
Subject: Message regarding autopilot
I have an old Bendix autopilot on my 500 Shrike. It has been giving us trouble while trying to hold the heading bug or in the Nav function. Anyone have a suggestion as to who might be best qualified to troubleshoot this system. Also, if you were going to upgrade, which system would you go with and what should I expect to spend on such a system. Any help would be tremendously appreciated. Sincerely, Tommy Mathieu ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David Owens" <dowens(at)aerialviewpoint.com>
Date: Aug 02, 2006
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
Autopilot Central... Go to http://www.sparksaviationcenter.com/indexauto.htm David Owens Aerial Viewpoint N14AV AC-500A-Colemill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CloudCraft(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 02, 2006
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
In a message dated 02-Aug-06 14:06:43 Pacific Daylight Time, tmathieu(at)MSN.COM writes: I have an old Bendix autopilot on my 500 Shrike. It has been giving us trouble while trying to hold the heading bug or in the Nav function. Anyone have a suggestion as to who might be best qualified to troubleshoot this system. Also, if you were going to upgrade, which system would you go with and what should I expect to spend on such a system. Any help would be tremendously appreciated. Tommy, You didn't say which old Bendix A/P you have -- is it an M4 series? If so, make sure your "TURN" command knob is in the center detent. It's a very subtle detent and if it's out, it cancels HDG mode or NAV mode. See the "TURN" knob below. Next, check your ROLL trim. On some A/P control heads, if this is pulled out, it can cancel or interfere with HDG mode. This also has a detent, so see if you can find it and start engaging HDG or NAV mode from that point. If either of those checks don't get you happy, take the airplane to Autopilots Central in Tulsa, OK. That may be far away from you, but I don't know of anyone left who understands the Bendix/Motorola M4s. There are some trim pots than can be adjusted for ROLL or NAV track and that's best done in flight with the autopilot technician turning set screws while you keep the airplane safe. It may be that you need a circuit board replaced. Autopilot Central should have them, or, can trouble shoot components if need be. It may be that you need the autopilot replaced and I trust if that's so, several TCFG members will check in with their recommendations on modern systems. Good luck! Wing Commander Gordon ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "MASON Chevaillier" <kamala(at)MSN.COM>
Date: Aug 02, 2006
Subject: Message regarding autopilot
tm, re auto pilot refer to century flight systems in mineral wells tx. system 2000 works real well. mason >From: "Tommy Mathieu" <tmathieu(at)msn.com> >Reply-To: commander-list(at)matronics.com >To: >Subject: Commander-List: Message regarding autopilot >Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 16:02:42 -0500 > >I have an old Bendix autopilot on my 500 Shrike. It has been giving us >trouble while trying to hold the heading bug or in the Nav function. Anyone >have a suggestion as to who might be best qualified to troubleshoot this >system. Also, if you were going to upgrade, which system would you go with >and what should I expect to spend on such a system. Any help would be >tremendously appreciated. > >Sincerely, > >Tommy Mathieu > ><< image001.jpg >> ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ray Mansfield" <hcourier(at)cox.net>
Date: Aug 02, 2006
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
Hi Tommy, I have an old Bendix M4 in the Aero Commander I fly and it was not working about a year ago. I knew a man in Ferandina Beach, FL who did avionics and I asked him about it. He said, "I've been working on the M4 since 1961 when they came out and have many parts around". So I sent him the controller and black box. He fixed it and it works great now. It's very steady and except for a few minor quirks (nothing bothersome) it's great. He has all the test equipment for it too. He's not doing as much avionics work as he use to but he might work on it if your are not in a hurry. I've got another Bendix at his shop...so mine comes first,...ha! ha! Send me your email address and I'll give you his particulars, address, phone number, etc. I don't know if he's looking for a lot of business these days. He's doing more corporate flying now than he use to. Ray Mansfield hcourier(at)cox.net ----- Original Message ----- From: Tommy Mathieu To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 4:02 PM Subject: Commander-List: Message regarding autopilot I have an old Bendix autopilot on my 500 Shrike. It has been giving us trouble while trying to hold the heading bug or in the Nav function. Anyone have a suggestion as to who might be best qualified to troubleshoot this system. Also, if you were going to upgrade, which system would you go with and what should I expect to spend on such a system. Any help would be tremendously appreciated. Sincerely, Tommy Mathieu ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <dfalik(at)sbcglobal.net>
Date: Aug 02, 2006
Subject: Message regarding autopilot
When I purchased my 500 Shrike I had an S-tec 60-2 installed and it was a used one. It cost around 12,500 once it was said and done. -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ray Mansfield Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 5:50 PM Hi Tommy, I have an old Bendix M4 in the Aero Commander I fly and it was not working about a year ago. I knew a man in Ferandina Beach, FL who did avionics and I asked him about it. He said, "I've been working on the M4 since 1961 when they came out and have many parts around". So I sent him the controller and black box. He fixed it and it works great now. It's very steady and except for a few minor quirks (nothing bothersome) it's great. He has all the test equipment for it too. He's not doing as much avionics work as he use to but he might work on it if your are not in a hurry. I've got another Bendix at his shop...so mine comes first,...ha! ha! Send me your email address and I'll give you his particulars, address, phone number, etc. I don't know if he's looking for a lot of business these days. He's doing more corporate flying now than he use to. Ray Mansfield hcourier(at)cox.net ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 4:02 PM I have an old Bendix autopilot on my 500 Shrike. It has been giving us trouble while trying to hold the heading bug or in the Nav function. Anyone have a suggestion as to who might be best qualified to troubleshoot this system. Also, if you were going to upgrade, which system would you go with and what should I expect to spend on such a system. Any help would be tremendously appreciated. Sincerely, Tommy Mathieu ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tommy Mathieu" <tmathieu(at)MSN.COM>
Date: Aug 03, 2006
Subject: Message regarding autopilot
Thank you all so much for the input. We have an appointment set up with Autopilot Central in Tulsa. I also copied the instructions you gave for troubleshooting the system. I cannot thank you all enough. It is greatly appreciated! Sincerely, Tommy Mathieu ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Date: Aug 03, 2006
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot image001.jpg [2/2]
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found --- A message with no text/plain MIME section was received. The entire body of the message was removed. Please resend the email using Plain Text formatting. HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section in their client's default configuration. If you're using HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text". --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found --- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Date: Aug 03, 2006
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot image001.jpg [1/2]
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found --- A message with no text/plain MIME section was received. The entire body of the message was removed. Please resend the email using Plain Text formatting. HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section in their client's default configuration. If you're using HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text". --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found --- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BertBerry1(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 03, 2006
Subject: SN 432-1005 N2100M 680- THE END
I spoke to the owner this morning and he said that this 680 had a cracked spar, so they took it a part and are selling off the parts. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1956-aero-commander-nose-section-with-most-inst ruments_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ26442QQihZ017QQitemZ270014785511QQrdZ1 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: WINGFLYER1(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 03, 2006
Subject: Re: SN 432-1005 N2100M 680- THE END
Bert, How can I get in touch with the owner.I need some 680 parts. Thanks Gil Walker E-mail _Wingflyer1(at)aol.com_ (mailto:Wingflyer1(at)aol.com) Phone 615-373-5703 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Aug 03, 2006
Subject: Turbo Commander
There is still now sign of the Commander Northwest's Turbo Commander the went missing near Anchorage AK with 3 SOB. http://www.adn.com/news/alaska/aviation/story/8025106p-7918257c.html bilbo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David Owens" <dowens(at)aerialviewpoint.com>
Date: Aug 03, 2006
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
They have worked well for us, and will use them again... Good Luck! David Owens Aerial Viewpoint N14AV AC-500A-Colemill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: bertberry1(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 03, 2006
Subject: Re: SN 432-1005 N2100M 680- THE END
Here you go Sir, 203-564-3190 -----Original Message----- Sent: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 9:56 AM Bert, How can I get in touch with the owner.I need some 680 parts. Thanks Gil Walker E-mail Wingflyer1(at)aol.com Phone 615-373-5703 ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Nancy Gilliam" <amg3636(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Aug 03, 2006
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
For what it is worth, The avionics guy at my airport has some old autopilot parts. Don't know what brand or details. Heres contact info.Sandhills Avionics , Jeff Kraudelt, 910-947-1760.or Sandhills(at)PlaneWerks.com Roland Gilliam >From: Ray Mansfield <hcourier(at)cox.net> >Reply-To: commander-list(at)matronics.com >To: commander-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Message regarding autopilot >Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 16:50:27 -0500 > >Hi Tommy, > > I have an old Bendix M4 in the Aero Commander I fly and it was not >working about a year ago. I knew a man in Ferandina Beach, FL who did >avionics and I asked him about it. He said, "I've been working on the M4 >since 1961 when they came out and have many parts around". So I sent him >the controller and black box. He fixed it and it works great now. It's >very steady and except for a few minor quirks (nothing bothersome) it's >great. He has all the test equipment for it too. > > He's not doing as much avionics work as he use to but he might work on >it if your are not in a hurry. I've got another Bendix at his shop...so >mine comes first,...ha! ha! > > Send me your email address and I'll give you his particulars, address, >phone number, etc. I don't know if he's looking for a lot of business >these days. He's doing more corporate flying now than he use to. > >Ray Mansfield >hcourier(at)cox.net > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Tommy Mathieu > To: commander-list(at)matronics.com > Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 4:02 PM > Subject: Commander-List: Message regarding autopilot > > > I have an old Bendix autopilot on my 500 Shrike. It has been giving us >trouble while trying to hold the heading bug or in the Nav function. Anyone >have a suggestion as to who might be best qualified to troubleshoot this >system. Also, if you were going to upgrade, which system would you go with >and what should I expect to spend on such a system. Any help would be >tremendously appreciated. > > Sincerely, > > Tommy Mathieu ><< image001.jpg >> _________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Moe" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Date: Aug 04, 2006
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
Gents: Regarding the M1 Autopilots. Jack Chappell (Phone 951.371.7513) should have quite a few parts for the M1 and some servo testers that he got from me a while back. I also have the complete shop manuel with fold out diagrams ect. that I bought from Mark Thompson a while back. I beleive that I paid $ 250.00 for it. If anyone needs it I will sell it to you for a GREATLY reduced price. Regards, Moe N680RR 680F(p) ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2006 5:22 PM > > For what it is worth, > > The avionics guy at my airport has some old autopilot parts. Don't know what > brand or details. Heres contact info.Sandhills Avionics , Jeff Kraudelt, > 910-947-1760.or Sandhills(at)PlaneWerks.com > > Roland Gilliam > > > >From: Ray Mansfield <hcourier(at)cox.net> > >Reply-To: commander-list(at)matronics.com > >To: commander-list(at)matronics.com > >Subject: Re: Commander-List: Message regarding autopilot > >Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 16:50:27 -0500 > > > >Hi Tommy, > > > > I have an old Bendix M4 in the Aero Commander I fly and it was not > >working about a year ago. I knew a man in Ferandina Beach, FL who did > >avionics and I asked him about it. He said, "I've been working on the M4 > >since 1961 when they came out and have many parts around". So I sent him > >the controller and black box. He fixed it and it works great now. It's > >very steady and except for a few minor quirks (nothing bothersome) it's > >great. He has all the test equipment for it too. > > > > He's not doing as much avionics work as he use to but he might work on > >it if your are not in a hurry. I've got another Bendix at his shop...so > >mine comes first,...ha! ha! > > > > Send me your email address and I'll give you his particulars, address, > >phone number, etc. I don't know if he's looking for a lot of business > >these days. He's doing more corporate flying now than he use to. > > > >Ray Mansfield > >hcourier(at)cox.net > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Tommy Mathieu > > To: commander-list(at)matronics.com > > Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 4:02 PM > > Subject: Commander-List: Message regarding autopilot > > > > > > I have an old Bendix autopilot on my 500 Shrike. It has been giving us > >trouble while trying to hold the heading bug or in the Nav function. Anyone > >have a suggestion as to who might be best qualified to troubleshoot this > >system. Also, if you were going to upgrade, which system would you go with > >and what should I expect to spend on such a system. Any help would be > >tremendously appreciated. > > > > Sincerely, > > > > Tommy Mathieu > ><< image001.jpg >> > > _________________________________________________________________ > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <avtec2(at)bellsouth.net>
Date: Aug 04, 2006
Subject: Re: Autopilots: Some news...
I Have every part you need fot a 680 I think Harry 321 267-3141 ----- Original Message ----- From: WINGFLYER1(at)aol.com To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, July 21, 2006 3:34 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Autopilots: Some news... I fly a 680 and would be interested in an approved auto-pilot ( up dated version) Gil ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 06, 2006
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: New Incoming Message Size Limit Implemented...
Dear Listers, Due to a number of requests to limit the size of incoming posts to the Lists because of the recently added enclosure feature, I have add a new filter that will limit the total size of any given message posted to the List. I have initially set the limit to 2MB and we'll see how everyone likes that. If a member attempts to post a message that is greater than the set limit, they will receive an email back indicating that their message wasn't posted to the List and why. Also included in the message will be the current size limit and how large their message was. Some might say that 2MB is still too large, but its a place to start... Best regards, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ________________________________________________________________________________
From: WINGFLYER1(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 07, 2006
Subject: Re: Autopilots: Some news...
Harry, Do you have a complete auto pilot system? If so what kind and how much?Thanks Gil ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <avtec2(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Autopilots: Some news...
Date: Aug 07, 2006
Yes A Britton B-3 and it came out of a 680 ( I have Two ) one was overhauled about a year and haft ago. Complete ( Boxes Servo's connectors Harry $ 750 for all including shipping to you. ----- Original Message ----- From: WINGFLYER1(at)aol.com To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 10:20 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Autopilots: Some news... Harry, Do you have a complete auto pilot system? If so what kind and how much?Thanks Gil ________________________________________________________________________________
From: WINGFLYER1(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 07, 2006
Subject: Re: Autopilots: Some news...
Harry, I am not familliar with the Brittian B-3. Can you tell me if it is three axis , coupled or what its capable of doing. Thanks Gil ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <avtec2(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Autopilots: Some news...
Date: Aug 07, 2006
Yes has alt hold, Connects to the nav / localizer and glige slope. Call me and i will tell you about the autopilots Harry 321 267-3141 ----- Original Message ----- From: WINGFLYER1(at)aol.com To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, August 07, 2006 2:43 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Autopilots: Some news... Harry, I am not familliar with the Brittian B-3. Can you tell me if it is three axis , coupled or what its capable of doing. Thanks Gil ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "css nico" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: Nice flying sequences
Date: Aug 07, 2006
Enjoy! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMR_F4B5H4Y&NR http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4f_0CX6Dqhc&NR Super Bug: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Xo5GY4kDXg&NR http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEGF150eWOU&mode=related&search ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 09, 2006
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
Avionics Inc. at LUK Cincinnati does great M-4 work. He has been working on them for years and does not just suggest "replace it. In my opinion I would not replace an M-4 with any of these new autopilots unless I could not fix it. I would love to have one in my 560F but I can not get the paperwork! Bill Leff ________________________________________________________________________________
From: YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 10, 2006
Subject: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Hi Gang, The TCFG Flyin and Convention is about 6 weeks away and I hope all of you are planning on attending. The event will be held at Commander Aero's facilities on the Wright Brothers Airport in Miamisburg, Ohio (near Dayton). Plan to come early and tour the historic aviation sites of Dayton. Our Hosts, Commander Aero have put together a great program for us including a visit to the Air Force Museum, a fly out to Eagle creek Airport and visit to Indianapolis Motor Speedway Museum, plus a line-up of speakers. The cost is only $150 and includes admission to all of the seminars (museum admission costs will be extra), dinner on three nights, continental breakfast on three mornings and lunch. Registration packets are on the way to current TCFG members. If you are not a current member, let us know and we would be happy to send you the information. Hotel Reservations: A Block of rooms has been reserved at the Hampton Inn & Suites for this event at the following rates: Standard Room $79.00 Suite $94.00 Phone Number: (937)743-2121 When making reservations let them know that you are with the Twin Commander Flight Group (TCFG). In order to receive this rate rooms must be booked no later than September 1st. After that the rooms will be released for general booking at regular rates. Rental Cars: Both Enterprise and Hertz service Wright Brothers Airport. Enterprise can deliver a car to the airport and Commander Aero can complete the paperwork, thereby avoiding any delays in picking up and returning your car. If booking through Enterprise please let them know your estimated time of arrival and that you would like the paperwork left with Commander Aero. Enterprise 937-291-6370 Hertz 937-438-0175 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: skyhawkc-172(at)comcast.net
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
Date: Aug 11, 2006
Any thoughts on a Britten B4 autpilot, we have one that is currently inoperative. Thanks guys... Brent Mueller - N224HA -------------- Original message -------------- From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com Avionics Inc. at LUK Cincinnati does great M-4 work. He has been working on them for years and does not just suggest "replace it. In my opinion I would not replace an M-4 with any of these new autopilots unless I could not fix it. I would love to have one in my 560F but I can not get the paperwork! Bill Leff
Any thoughts on a Britten B4 autpilot, we have one that is currently inoperative.
Thanks guys...
Brent Mueller - N224HA
 
Avionics Inc. at LUK Cincinnati does great M-4 work. He has been working on them for years and does not just suggest "replace it.
 
In my opinion I would not replace an M-4 with any of these new autopilots unless I could not fix it.
 
I would love to have one in my 560F but I can not get the paperwork!
 
Bill Leff
 
 
________________________________________________________________________________
From: buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 12, 2006
I know I have been a bad member for not communicating lately, or since Bud 1 went to Honduras. With a tear in my eye. I would like to attend if you will have me. If so please forward a package and the cost and I will make plans. It will be good to see Commanders again, even though I ain't got one. YOURTCFG(at)aol.com writes: > > Hi Gang, > The TCFG Flyin and Convention is about 6 weeks away and I hope all of you > are planning on attending. The event will be held at Commander Aero's > facilities on the Wright Brothers Airport in Miamisburg, Ohio (near Dayton). Plan to > come early and tour the historic aviation sites of Dayton. > Our Hosts, Commander Aero have put together a great program for us including > a visit to the Air Force Museum, a fly out to Eagle creek Airport and > visit to Indianapolis Motor Speedway Museum, plus a line-up of speakers. > The cost is only $150 and includes admission to all of the seminars (museum > admission costs will be extra), dinner on three nights, continental breakfast on > three mornings and lunch. > Registration packets are on the way to current TCFG members. If you are not > a current member, let us know and we would be happy to send you the > information. > Hotel Reservations: A Block of rooms has been reserved at the Hampton Inn & > Suites for this event at the following rates: > Standard Room $79.00 > Suite $94.00 > Phone Number: (937)743-2121 > When making reservations let them know that you are with the Twin Commander > Flight Group (TCFG). In order to receive this rate rooms must be booked no > later than September 1st. After that the rooms will be released for general > booking at regular rates. > Rental Cars: Both Enterprise and Hertz service Wright Brothers Airport. > Enterprise can deliver a car to the airport and Commander Aero can complete > the paperwork, thereby avoiding any delays in picking up and returning your > car. If booking through Enterprise please let them know your estimated time > of arrival and that you would like the paperwork left with Commander Aero. > Enterprise 937-291-6370 > Hertz 937-438-0175 > H.W."Buddy" Windham President Cycon Enterprises, Inc. Excalibur Contracting, Inc. The Windham Companies, Inc. L&B Investors, LLC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tylor Hall <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 12, 2006
Buddy, Good to hear you will be coming. What is the Dates of the fly-in?? It was not on Jim-Bob's announcement. Tylor Hall On Aug 12, 2006, at 8:52 AM, buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com wrote: > > I know I have been a bad member for not communicating lately, or > since Bud 1 went to Honduras. With a tear in my eye. > I would like to attend if you will have me. > If so please forward a package and the cost and I will make plans. > It will be good to see Commanders again, even though I ain't got one. > > > YOURTCFG(at)aol.com writes: >> Hi Gang, The TCFG Flyin and Convention is about 6 weeks away and >> I hope all of you are planning on attending. The event will be >> held at Commander Aero's facilities on the Wright Brothers >> Airport in Miamisburg, Ohio (near Dayton). Plan to come early and >> tour the historic aviation sites of Dayton. Our Hosts, >> Commander Aero have put together a great program for us including >> a visit to the Air Force Museum, a fly out to Eagle creek >> Airport and visit to Indianapolis Motor Speedway Museum, plus a >> line-up of speakers. The cost is only $150 and includes >> admission to all of the seminars (museum admission costs will be >> extra), dinner on three nights, continental breakfast on three >> mornings and lunch. Registration packets are on the way to >> current TCFG members. If you are not a current member, let us >> know and we would be happy to send you the information. Hotel >> Reservations: A Block of rooms has been reserved at the Hampton >> Inn & Suites for this event at the following rates: Standard >> Room $79.00 >> Suite $94.00 Phone >> Number: (937)743-2121 When making reservations let them >> know that you are with the Twin Commander Flight Group (TCFG). >> In order to receive this rate rooms must be booked no later than >> September 1st. After that the rooms will be released for >> general booking at regular rates. Rental Cars: Both Enterprise >> and Hertz service Wright Brothers Airport. Enterprise can >> deliver a car to the airport and Commander Aero can complete the >> paperwork, thereby avoiding any delays in picking up and >> returning your car. If booking through Enterprise please let >> them know your estimated time of arrival and that you would like >> the paperwork left with Commander Aero. >> Enterprise 937-291-6370 >> Hertz 937-438-0175 > > > H.W."Buddy" Windham > President > Cycon Enterprises, Inc. > Excalibur Contracting, Inc. > The Windham Companies, Inc. > L&B Investors, LLC > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 12, 2006
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Dates of the Fly-In are September 21-24, 2006. Hope to see you there. jb ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 12, 2006
Buddy, like I tell you every year, your attendance is MANDATORY! /John ----- Original Message ----- From: <buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com> Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2006 7:52 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention > > I know I have been a bad member for not communicating lately, or > since Bud 1 went to Honduras. With a tear in my eye. > I would like to attend if you will have me. > If so please forward a package and the cost and I will make plans. > It will be good to see Commanders again, even though I ain't got one. > > > YOURTCFG(at)aol.com writes: >> Hi Gang, The TCFG Flyin and Convention is about 6 weeks away and I >> hope all of you are planning on attending. The event will be held at >> Commander Aero's facilities on the Wright Brothers Airport in >> Miamisburg, Ohio (near Dayton). Plan to come early and tour the >> historic aviation sites of Dayton. Our Hosts, Commander Aero have put >> together a great program for us including a visit to the Air Force >> Museum, a fly out to Eagle creek Airport and visit to Indianapolis >> Motor Speedway Museum, plus a line-up of speakers. The cost is only >> $150 and includes admission to all of the seminars (museum admission >> costs will be extra), dinner on three nights, continental breakfast on >> three mornings and lunch. Registration packets are on the way to >> current TCFG members. If you are not a current member, let us know and >> we would be happy to send you the information. Hotel Reservations: A >> Block of rooms has been reserved at the Hampton Inn & Suites for this >> event at the following rates: Standard Room >> $79.00 Suite $94.00 Phone Number: >> (937)743-2121 When making reservations let them know that you are with >> the Twin Commander Flight Group (TCFG). In order to receive this rate >> rooms must be booked no later than September 1st. After that the rooms >> will be released for general booking at regular rates. Rental Cars: >> Both Enterprise and Hertz service Wright Brothers Airport. Enterprise >> can deliver a car to the airport and Commander Aero can complete the >> paperwork, thereby avoiding any delays in picking up and returning your >> car. If booking through Enterprise please let them know your estimated >> time of arrival and that you would like the paperwork left with >> Commander Aero. Enterprise 937-291-6370 >> Hertz 937-438-0175 > > > H.W."Buddy" Windham > President > Cycon Enterprises, Inc. > Excalibur Contracting, Inc. > The Windham Companies, Inc. > L&B Investors, LLC > > > __________ NOD32 1.1702 (20060811) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ NOD32 1.1702 (20060811) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tylor Hall <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: RE: AOPA Palm Springs
Date: Aug 12, 2006
Does any one know about a Shrike GR3 that will be on display by CDG LLC at the AOPA show in Palm Springs in Nov? Tylor Hall ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 12, 2006
It's nice to hear from you again, Buddy. bilbo -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2006 10:52 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention I know I have been a bad member for not communicating lately, or since Bud 1 went to Honduras. With a tear in my eye. I would like to attend if you will have me. If so please forward a package and the cost and I will make plans. It will be good to see Commanders again, even though I ain't got one. YOURTCFG(at)aol.com writes: > > Hi Gang, > The TCFG Flyin and Convention is about 6 weeks away and I hope all of you > are planning on attending. The event will be held at Commander Aero's > facilities on the Wright Brothers Airport in Miamisburg, Ohio (near Dayton). Plan to > come early and tour the historic aviation sites of Dayton. > Our Hosts, Commander Aero have put together a great program for us including > a visit to the Air Force Museum, a fly out to Eagle creek Airport and > visit to Indianapolis Motor Speedway Museum, plus a line-up of speakers. > The cost is only $150 and includes admission to all of the seminars (museum > admission costs will be extra), dinner on three nights, continental breakfast on > three mornings and lunch. > Registration packets are on the way to current TCFG members. If you are not > a current member, let us know and we would be happy to send you the > information. > Hotel Reservations: A Block of rooms has been reserved at the Hampton Inn & > Suites for this event at the following rates: > Standard Room $79.00 > Suite $94.00 > Phone Number: (937)743-2121 > When making reservations let them know that you are with the Twin Commander > Flight Group (TCFG). In order to receive this rate rooms must be booked no > later than September 1st. After that the rooms will be released for general > booking at regular rates. > Rental Cars: Both Enterprise and Hertz service Wright Brothers Airport. > Enterprise can deliver a car to the airport and Commander Aero can complete > the paperwork, thereby avoiding any delays in picking up and returning your > car. If booking through Enterprise please let them know your estimated time > of arrival and that you would like the paperwork left with Commander Aero. > Enterprise 937-291-6370 > Hertz 937-438-0175 > H.W."Buddy" Windham President Cycon Enterprises, Inc. Excalibur Contracting, Inc. The Windham Companies, Inc. L&B Investors, LLC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <rlegg(at)austarnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 13, 2006
Isn't it time we reviewed the status of 'bad' members??? ---- Original message ---- >Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 07:52:07 -0700 >From: buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com >Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention >To: commander-list(at)matronics.com > buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com > >I know I have been a bad member for not communicating lately, or >since Bud 1 went to Honduras. With a tear in my eye. > >I would like to attend if you will have me. > >If so please forward a package and the cost and I will make plans. > >It will be good to see Commanders again, even though I ain't got one. > > > > > > >YOURTCFG(at)aol.com writes: > >> >> Hi Gang, >> The TCFG Flyin and Convention is about 6 weeks away and I hope all of you >> are planning on attending. The event will be held at Commander Aero's >> facilities on the Wright Brothers Airport in Miamisburg, Ohio (near Dayton). Plan to >> come early and tour the historic aviation sites of Dayton. >> Our Hosts, Commander Aero have put together a great program for us including >> a visit to the Air Force Museum, a fly out to Eagle creek Airport and >> visit to Indianapolis Motor Speedway Museum, plus a line- up of speakers. >> The cost is only $150 and includes admission to all of the seminars (museum >> admission costs will be extra), dinner on three nights, continental breakfast on >> three mornings and lunch. >> Registration packets are on the way to current TCFG members. If you are not >> a current member, let us know and we would be happy to send you the >> information. >> Hotel Reservations: A Block of rooms has been reserved at the Hampton Inn & >> Suites for this event at the following rates: >> Standard Room $79.00 >> Suite $94.00 >> Phone Number: (937)743-2121 >> When making reservations let them know that you are with the Twin Commander >> Flight Group (TCFG). In order to receive this rate rooms must be booked no >> later than September 1st. After that the rooms will be released for general >> booking at regular rates. >> Rental Cars: Both Enterprise and Hertz service Wright Brothers Airport. >> Enterprise can deliver a car to the airport and Commander Aero can complete >> the paperwork, thereby avoiding any delays in picking up and returning your >> car. If booking through Enterprise please let them know your estimated time >> of arrival and that you would like the paperwork left with Commander Aero. >> Enterprise 937-291-6370 >> Hertz 937-438-0175 >> > > > >H.W."Buddy" Windham >President >Cycon Enterprises, Inc. >Excalibur Contracting, Inc. >The Windham Companies, Inc. >L&B Investors, LLC > > >_- ======================================== ================== List >_- ======================================== ================== >_- ======================================== ================== Forums! >_- ======================================== ================== >_- ======================================== ================== >_- ======================================== ================== > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 12, 2006
see you there. John Vormbaum writes: > > Buddy, like I tell you every year, your attendance is MANDATORY! > > > /John > > ----- Original Message ----- From: <buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com> > To: > Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2006 7:52 AM > Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention > > >> >> I know I have been a bad member for not communicating lately, or >> since Bud 1 went to Honduras. With a tear in my eye. >> I would like to attend if you will have me. >> If so please forward a package and the cost and I will make plans. >> It will be good to see Commanders again, even though I ain't got one. >> >> >> >> >> >> YOURTCFG(at)aol.com writes: >>> Hi Gang, The TCFG Flyin and Convention is about 6 weeks away and I >>> hope all of you are planning on attending. The event will be held at >>> Commander Aero's facilities on the Wright Brothers Airport in >>> Miamisburg, Ohio (near Dayton). Plan to come early and tour the >>> historic aviation sites of Dayton. Our Hosts, Commander Aero have put >>> together a great program for us including a visit to the Air Force >>> Museum, a fly out to Eagle creek Airport and visit to Indianapolis >>> Motor Speedway Museum, plus a line-up of speakers. The cost is only >>> $150 and includes admission to all of the seminars (museum admission >>> costs will be extra), dinner on three nights, continental breakfast on >>> three mornings and lunch. Registration packets are on the way to >>> current TCFG members. If you are not a current member, let us know >>> and we would be happy to send you the information. Hotel Reservations: >>> A Block of rooms has been reserved at the Hampton Inn & Suites for >>> this event at the following rates: Standard Room $79.00 Suite >>> $94.00 Phone Number: (937)743-2121 When >>> making reservations let them know that you are with the Twin Commander >>> Flight Group (TCFG). In order to receive this rate rooms must be >>> booked no later than September 1st. After that the rooms will be >>> released for general booking at regular rates. Rental Cars: Both >>> Enterprise and Hertz service Wright Brothers Airport. Enterprise can >>> deliver a car to the airport and Commander Aero can complete the >>> paperwork, thereby avoiding any delays in picking up and returning your >>> car. If booking through Enterprise please let them know your >>> estimated time of arrival and that you would like the paperwork left >>> with Commander Aero. Enterprise >>> 937-291-6370 Hertz 937-438-0175 >> >> >> >> H.W."Buddy" Windham >> President >> Cycon Enterprises, Inc. >> Excalibur Contracting, Inc. >> The Windham Companies, Inc. >> L&B Investors, LLC >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> __________ NOD32 1.1702 (20060811) Information __________ >> >> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >> __________ NOD32 1.1702 (20060811) Information __________ >> >> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >> http://www.eset.com >> >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > H.W."Buddy" Windham President Cycon Enterprises, Inc. Excalibur Contracting, Inc. The Windham Companies, Inc. L&B Investors, LLC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 12, 2006
Still alive despite the FAA's death diagonis. I know I mispelled it, but what the hell. Bill Bow writes: > > It's nice to hear from you again, Buddy. > > bilbo > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of > buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com > Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2006 10:52 AM > To: commander-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention > > > I know I have been a bad member for not communicating lately, or > since Bud 1 went to Honduras. With a tear in my eye. > > I would like to attend if you will have me. > > If so please forward a package and the cost and I will make plans. > > It will be good to see Commanders again, even though I ain't got one. > > > > > > > YOURTCFG(at)aol.com writes: > >> >> Hi Gang, >> The TCFG Flyin and Convention is about 6 weeks away and I hope all of you > >> are planning on attending. The event will be held at Commander Aero's >> facilities on the Wright Brothers Airport in Miamisburg, Ohio (near > Dayton). Plan to >> come early and tour the historic aviation sites of Dayton. >> Our Hosts, Commander Aero have put together a great program for us > including >> a visit to the Air Force Museum, a fly out to Eagle creek Airport and > >> visit to Indianapolis Motor Speedway Museum, plus a line-up of > speakers. >> The cost is only $150 and includes admission to all of the seminars > (museum >> admission costs will be extra), dinner on three nights, continental > breakfast on >> three mornings and lunch. >> Registration packets are on the way to current TCFG members. If you are > not >> a current member, let us know and we would be happy to send you the >> information. >> Hotel Reservations: A Block of rooms has been reserved at the Hampton > Inn & >> Suites for this event at the following rates: >> Standard Room $79.00 >> Suite $94.00 >> Phone Number: (937)743-2121 >> When making reservations let them know that you are with the Twin > Commander >> Flight Group (TCFG). In order to receive this rate rooms must be booked > no >> later than September 1st. After that the rooms will be released for > general >> booking at regular rates. >> Rental Cars: Both Enterprise and Hertz service Wright Brothers > Airport. >> Enterprise can deliver a car to the airport and Commander Aero can > complete >> the paperwork, thereby avoiding any delays in picking up and returning > your >> car. If booking through Enterprise please let them know your estimated > time >> of arrival and that you would like the paperwork left with Commander > Aero. >> Enterprise 937-291-6370 >> Hertz 937-438-0175 >> > > > > H.W."Buddy" Windham > President > Cycon Enterprises, Inc. > Excalibur Contracting, Inc. > The Windham Companies, Inc. > L&B Investors, LLC > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > H.W."Buddy" Windham President Cycon Enterprises, Inc. Excalibur Contracting, Inc. The Windham Companies, Inc. L&B Investors, LLC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 12, 2006
Absolutely..............My Kerry send here regards. See miss's her shopping mate. I take it you are still comming. Richard called me last week and brought me up to speed on his and Jax's current status. Seem's Richard is still living the good life, working on his corvette, but not the commander. When he does finally finish we will have to travel to OZ to witness the grand event. rlegg(at)austarnet.com.au writes: > > Isn't it time we reviewed the status of 'bad' members??? > > > ---- Original message ---- >>Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 07:52:07 -0700 >>From: buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com >>Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention >>To: commander-list(at)matronics.com >> > buddy(at)cyconenterprises.com >> >>I know I have been a bad member for not communicating > lately, or >>since Bud 1 went to Honduras. With a tear in my eye. >> >>I would like to attend if you will have me. >> >>If so please forward a package and the cost and I will make > plans. >> >>It will be good to see Commanders again, even though I ain't > got one. >> >> >> >> >> >> >>YOURTCFG(at)aol.com writes: >> >>> >>> Hi Gang, >>> The TCFG Flyin and Convention is about 6 weeks away and > I hope all of you >>> are planning on attending. The event will be held at > Commander Aero's >>> facilities on the Wright Brothers Airport in Miamisburg, Ohio > (near Dayton). Plan to >>> come early and tour the historic aviation sites of Dayton. >>> Our Hosts, Commander Aero have put together a great > program for us including >>> a visit to the Air Force Museum, a fly out to Eagle creek > Airport and >>> visit to Indianapolis Motor Speedway Museum, plus a line- > up of speakers. >>> The cost is only $150 and includes admission to all of the > seminars (museum >>> admission costs will be extra), dinner on three nights, > continental breakfast on >>> three mornings and lunch. >>> Registration packets are on the way to current TCFG > members. If you are not >>> a current member, let us know and we would be happy to > send you the >>> information. >>> Hotel Reservations: A Block of rooms has been reserved > at the Hampton Inn & >>> Suites for this event at the following rates: >>> Standard Room $79.00 >>> Suite $94.00 >>> Phone Number: (937)743-2121 >>> When making reservations let them know that you are with > the Twin Commander >>> Flight Group (TCFG). In order to receive this rate rooms > must be booked no >>> later than September 1st. After that the rooms will be > released for general >>> booking at regular rates. >>> Rental Cars: Both Enterprise and Hertz service Wright > Brothers Airport. >>> Enterprise can deliver a car to the airport and Commander > Aero can complete >>> the paperwork, thereby avoiding any delays in picking up > and returning your >>> car. If booking through Enterprise please let them know > your estimated time >>> of arrival and that you would like the paperwork left with > Commander Aero. >>> Enterprise 937-291-6370 >>> Hertz 937-438-0175 >>> >> >> >> >>H.W."Buddy" Windham >>President >>Cycon Enterprises, Inc. >>Excalibur Contracting, Inc. >>The Windham Companies, Inc. >>L&B Investors, LLC >> >> >> >> >>_- > ======================================== > ================== > List >>_- > ======================================== > ================== >>_- > ======================================== > ================== > Forums! >>_- > ======================================== > ================== >>_- > ======================================== > ================== >>_- > ======================================== > ================== >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > > > > > > > > H.W."Buddy" Windham President Cycon Enterprises, Inc. Excalibur Contracting, Inc. The Windham Companies, Inc. L&B Investors, LLC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "" <br549phil(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
Date: Aug 14, 2006
Hi Bill, I still have an L2 which works a bit. What do you have in yours? I'd like to replace it. Phil Stubbs ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: 8/10/2006 12:04:28 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Message regarding autopilot Avionics Inc. at LUK Cincinnati does great M-4 work. He has been working on them for years and does not just suggest "replace it. In my opinion I would not replace an M-4 with any of these new autopilots unless I could not fix it. I would love to have one in my 560F but I can not get the paperwork! Bill Leff ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Subject: Tri-Islander
Date: Aug 16, 2006
Gentlemen, A friend of mine is looking for a Tri-Islander, can anyone steer me/him to a source for them? Tom F. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tylor Hall <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Tri-Islander
Date: Aug 16, 2006
Tom,, http://www.skyquestinternational.com/aircraft.asp SkyQuest seems to deal in commuter aircraft. They have three Islanders on their listing, but they are twins. They may know where some are. Tylor Hall On Aug 16, 2006, at 9:11 AM, Tom Fisher wrote: > > > Gentlemen, > > A friend of mine is looking for a Tri-Islander, can anyone steer me/ > him to a source for them? > > Tom F. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: Tri-Islander
Date: Aug 16, 2006
Tom, I remember quite a few Trislanders operated in South Africa and Mozambique some years ago. Perhaps looking into their registries will give you an indication. I have the SA civil aircraft registry somewhere; will send it to you this afternoon. Gotogonow. Thanks Nico -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom Fisher Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2006 8:12 AM Subject: Commander-List: Tri-Islander Gentlemen, A friend of mine is looking for a Tri-Islander, can anyone steer me/him to a source for them? Tom F. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2006
Subject: Re: Tri-Islander
From: "Deneal Schilmeister (iMac)" <deneals(at)sbcglobal.net>
On 8/16/06 10:11 AM, "Tom Fisher" wrote: > Gentlemen, > > A friend of mine is looking for a Tri-Islander, can anyone steer me/him to a > source for them? > > Tom F. If he is so intent on self-flagellation, he should look into a Heron with the original Gipsy Major Mk-10 4's. (just kidding... Find one with the Lyc conversion) -- Deneal Schilmeister ATP Learjet St. Louis, Missouri USA http://homepage.mac.com/deneals ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Tri-Islander
Date: Aug 16, 2006
Hey, There's 2 Herons on the cargo side in Honolulu but I think they still have the Rangers on them. They are not flat engines. Probably REALLY cheap, too. bilbo If he is so intent on self-flagellation, he should look into a Heron with the original Gipsy Major Mk-10 4's. (just kidding... Find one with the Lyc conversion) -- Deneal Schilmeister ATP Learjet St. Louis, Missouri USA http://homepage.mac.com/deneals ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2006
From: W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: Tri-Islander
Tom, I have always thought that it should be expressed as Trial-Slander, claiming to be an aeroplane. If the Tri-Islander is the answer, what was the question??? A fellow Australian, Desmond Norman (Brittain-Norman) has a lot to answer for. Cheers, Bill Hamilton At 01:11 AM 17/08/2006, you wrote: > > >Gentlemen, > >A friend of mine is looking for a Tri-Islander, can anyone steer >me/him to a source for them? > >Tom F. > > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet Services and Warbirds.Net. & . This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately to: Australia 61 (0)408 876 526 Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2006
From: W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: Tri-Islander
Deneal, I think you will find the Heron has DH Gipsy Queens, a very different engine to the Gipsy Major, which was, in fact, a Renault engine built under license, although all the Gipsy Majors built under licence by Wright and GM were converted to SAE threads, to confuse the issue, genuine DH built Gipsy's retained the original metric threads. As far as I know, the Queens were a DH design, 6 cylinder, and in various outputs from 220HP through to something like 340HP, but don't quote me, it's been a long time since I towed banners in an amazing Mk 1 Groundgripper, the Percival Prentice, or the DH Dragon Rapide with Queen 2's. I did my original AC checkout in a 560 about the same time as I was flying both the above semi-lethal devices, as you might imagine it was somewhat of a revelation to fly my first Aero Commander. When my wife asked me how long I had been think about buying the 500A on retirement from full time flying, the instant answer was " since about 1962" (when I first flew Chris DeBeer's 560) Cheers, Bill H. At 02:26 AM 17/08/2006, you wrote: > > >On 8/16/06 10:11 AM, "Tom Fisher" wrote: > > > Gentlemen, > > > > A friend of mine is looking for a Tri-Islander, can anyone steer > me/him to a > > source for them? > > > > Tom F. > >If he is so intent on self-flagellation, he should look into a Heron with >the original Gipsy Major Mk-10 4's. >(just kidding... Find one with the Lyc conversion) > > >-- >Deneal Schilmeister ATP Learjet >St. Louis, Missouri USA > >http://homepage.mac.com/deneals > > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet Services and Warbirds.Net. & . This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately to: Australia 61 (0)408 876 526 Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2006
From: W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Tri-Islander
Bilbo, Given the fatigue and corrosion problems in Herons, about all they are good for now is a Museum or the scrap heap. Cheers, Bill Hamilton At 03:43 AM 17/08/2006, you wrote: > >Hey, > >There's 2 Herons on the cargo side in Honolulu but I think they still have >the Rangers on them. They are not flat engines. Probably REALLY cheap, >too. > >bilbo > > >If he is so intent on self-flagellation, he should look into a Heron with >the original Gipsy Major Mk-10 4's. >(just kidding... Find one with the Lyc conversion) > > >-- >Deneal Schilmeister ATP Learjet >St. Louis, Missouri USA > >http://homepage.mac.com/deneals > > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet Services and Warbirds.Net. & . This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately to: Australia 61 (0)408 876 526 Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: skyhawkc-172(at)comcast.net
Subject: Tri-Islander
Date: Aug 17, 2006
FYI-twincommanderflyer.com site is up for dibs. Never new this was such a very small community. My mistake...: ) It is expensive to run, & needs work. Any one interested in making it into whatever they want let me know. I'll allow any Commander owner or enthusiest to take the site and run with it. I no longer have any interest in it for now. Anyone with any interest, I'll let you take it over and I will foot the bill for the sake of such a wonderful flying machine. Just hate to see any Commander stuff go away for ever. If no interest from anyone, I will terminate the site. Thanks for listening... My very best regards to all Brent Mueller N224HA 560E -------------- Original message -------------- From: W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au> Bilbo, Given the fatigue and corrosion problems in Herons, about all they are good for now is a Museum or the scrap heap. Cheers, Bill Hamilton At 03:43 AM 17/08/2006, you wrote: Hey, There's 2 Herons on the cargo side in Honolulu but I think they still have the Rangers on them. They are not flat engines. Probably REALLY cheap, too. bilbo If he is so intent on self-flagellation, he should look into a Heron with the original Gipsy Major Mk-10 4's. (just kidding... Find one with the Lyc conversion) -- Deneal Schilmeister ATP Learjet St. Louis, Missouri USA http://homepage.mac.com/deneals Commander-List Email Forum - http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List - NEW MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - http://forums.matronics.com - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI - http://wiki.matronics.com - List Contribution Web Site - -Matt Dralle, List Admin. http://www.matronics.com/contribution CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet Services and Warbirds.Net. & . This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately to: Australia 61 (0)408 876 526 Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.
FYI-twincommanderflyer.com site is up for dibs.  Never new this was such a very small community. My mistake...: )   It is expensive to run,  & needs work.  Any one interested in making it into whatever they want let me know.  I'll allow any Commander owner or enthusiest to take the site and run with it.  I no longer have any interest in it for now.  Anyone with any interest, I'll let you take it over and I will foot the bill for the sake of such a wonderful flying machine.  Just hate to see any Commander stuff go away for ever.  If no interest from anyone, I will terminate the site.
 
Thanks for listening...
My very best regards to all
Brent Mueller N224HA 560E
 
Bilbo,
Given the fatigue and corrosion problems in Herons, about all they are good for now is a Museum or the scrap heap.
Cheers,
Bill Hamilton



At 03:43 AM 17/08/2006, you wrote:
--> Commander-List message posted by: "Bill Bow" <bowing74@earthlink.net>

Hey,

There's 2 Herons on the cargo side in Honolulu but I think they still have
the Rangers on them.  They are not flat engines.  Probably REALLY cheap,
too.

bilbo


If he is so intent on self-flagellation, he should look into a Heron with
the original Gipsy Major Mk-10 4's.
(just kidding... Find one with the Lyc conversion)

 
--
Deneal Schilmeister ATP Learjet
St. Louis, Missouri   USA

http://homepage.mac.com/deneals







Commander-List Email Forum -
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
- NEW MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
http://forums.matronics.com
- NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
http://wiki.matronics.com
- List Contribution Web Site -
-Ma tt Dra lle, List Admin.
http://www.matronics.com/contribution>














CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE
W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet Services and Warbirds.Net. & <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>.
This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately to:
 Australia 61 (0)408 876 526
Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do.


      
      
      

      
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Hi All, If I'm able to attend this year's event, I'd like to ask whether anyone is going home on the Sunday (September 24th) via, or within driving distance of, Oklahoma City. If so, are they willing to drop me off there as talking freight? I will, of course, be more than willing to make a contribution towards the fuel costs. I would like to know whether this is a viable option, as I can then book all my flights accordingly. My getting there seems to be contingent on being allowed to take my camera equipment on board the flights as hand luggage, following the events of last week. Somehow, I don't think being forced to having them flown in the baggage hold is sensible, as they will then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. Very Best Regards, Barry ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
From: "N395V" <n395v(at)hughes.net>
Date: Aug 18, 2006
> then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. > > ARRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!! I feel your pain. My Daughter is getting married in London next month and trying to get there with everything important intact is seeming impossible at this point. -------- Milt N395V F1 Rocket Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=55484#55484 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2006
From: "Jim Hasler" <jhasler(at)gte.net>
Subject: History of 500A wing spar problems.
I was wondering if anyone could help me with current or historic information on the Aero commander 500A in reference to problems with the wing spar. I have N 800AC which I have been working to get airworthy for the last few years and was down to one last problem. I had a fuel leak which you could smell in the aft cabin. When they pulled the center fuel bladder out to repair or replace they found the wing spar in my plane to be 50% deteriorated. Are there any ADs or service advisories which would have covered this problem in the past? Where can I get replacement parts? Thanks, Jim ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Moe - Ross Racing Pistons" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Hi Barry, I should be leaving Dayton fairly early Sunday morning, and would be delighted to drop you off in Oakie City. This would be a good fuel stop for me, as I go back to Los Angeles. For many years I have had a "thing" about carry on luggage, and seldom take anything on the plane with me. Often I travel with a lot of hardware that couldn't go into the cabin in "the old days". If everything is well packed it travels quite well. I use the same basic technique that we use here at the piston factory.well packed but it should be quick and simple to unpack and repack by the airport inspectors. Foam can be easily cut with an electric knife to make excellent computer, cell phone, and camera packing structures. Regards, Moe _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:31 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi All, If I'm able to attend this year's event, I'd like to ask whether anyone is going home on the Sunday (September 24th) via, or within driving distance of, Oklahoma City. If so, are they willing to drop me off there as talking freight? I will, of course, be more than willing to make a contribution towards the fuel costs. I would like to know whether this is a viable option, as I can then book all my flights accordingly. My getting there seems to be contingent on being allowed to take my camera equipment on board the flights as hand luggage, following the events of last week. Somehow, I don't think being forced to having them flown in the baggage hold is sensible, as they will then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. Very Best Regards, Barry ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2006
From: cloudcraft(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Sir Barry, Do you have specialized camera equipment, or, can your photography needs be met by borrowing, say, a digital camera from someone here in the Colonies? If so, then all you have to do is worry about liquids and gels, right? Wing Commander Gordon -----Original Message----- From: barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk Sent: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 2:31 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention My getting there seems to be contingent on being allowed to take my camera equipment on board the flights as hand luggage, following the events of last week. Somehow, I don't think being forced to having them flown in the baggage hold is sensible, as they will then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. Very Best Regards, Barry ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BertBerry1(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Barry, Just a suggestion, I have sent my camera equipment FEDEX several times with no problems at all. Bert ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Hi Milt, I know, what a right pain travelling is becoming nowadays, but that is the object of "their" exercise I suppose. Hope all goes well! Very Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: "N395V" <n395v(at)hughes.net> Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 1:25 PM Subject: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention | | | > then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. | > | > | | | | ARRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!! | | I feel your pain. | | My Daughter is getting married in London next month and trying to get there with everything important intact is seeming impossible at this point. | | -------- | Milt | N395V | F1 Rocket | | | | | Read this topic online here: | | http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=55484#55484 | | | | | | | | | | | | | ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Hi Moe, If you are absolutely certain that you are not going out of your way to drop me off, that will be simply great! There's quite a good restaurant at Wiley Post (KPWA), so I can treat you (both?) to a spot of late breakfast or lunch! It's literally a few yards walk from the FBO there. Let me know how much you need as the fuel contribution, and I'll make sure I bring enough pieces of the spendable paper! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: Moe - Ross Racing Pistons To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:05 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Barry, I should be leaving Dayton fairly early Sunday morning, and would be delighted to drop you off in Oakie City. This would be a good fuel stop for me, as I go back to Los Angeles. For many years I have had a "thing" about carry on luggage, and seldom take anything on the plane with me. Often I travel with a lot of hardware that couldn't go into the cabin in "the old days". If everything is well packed it travels quite well. I use the same basic technique that we use here at the piston factory.well packed but it should be quick and simple to unpack and repack by the airport inspectors. Foam can be easily cut with an electric knife to make excellent computer, cell phone, and camera packing structures. Regards, Moe ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:31 AM To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi All, If I'm able to attend this year's event, I'd like to ask whether anyone is going home on the Sunday (September 24th) via, or within driving distance of, Oklahoma City. If so, are they willing to drop me off there as talking freight? I will, of course, be more than willing to make a contribution towards the fuel costs. I would like to know whether this is a viable option, as I can then book all my flights accordingly. My getting there seems to be contingent on being allowed to take my camera equipment on board the flights as hand luggage, following the events of last week. Somehow, I don't think being forced to having them flown in the baggage hold is sensible, as they will then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. Very Best Regards, Barry ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Milt! She's not marring "ONE OF THEM", is she? Bilbo :>)))) -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of N395V Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:25 AM Subject: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention > then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. > > ARRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!! I feel your pain. My Daughter is getting married in London next month and trying to get there with everything important intact is seeming impossible at this point. -------- Milt N395V F1 Rocket Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=55484#55484 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David Owens" <dowens(at)aerialviewpoint.com>
Subject: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems.
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Go to http://www.commander-aero.com/sparinspections.htm AND... good luck. David Owens Aerial Viewpoint N14AV AC-500A-Colemill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David Owens" <dowens(at)aerialviewpoint.com>
Subject: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems.
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Spar inspection & spar replacement Gary Kromer 888.881.5580 / 937.684.2894 (m) David Owens Aerial Viewpoint N14AV AC-500A-Colemill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Hi Bert, That's an idea. I'll pursue it if the airlines aren't going to play ball. Very Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: BertBerry1(at)aol.com To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 3:26 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Barry, Just a suggestion, I have sent my camera equipment FEDEX several times with no problems at all. Bert ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Hi Bill, I don't think an American will mar an Englishmen. Mind you, marrying one is a different kettle of fish! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net> Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 4:03 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention | | Milt! | | She's not marring "ONE OF THEM", is she? | | Bilbo :>)))) | | -----Original Message----- | From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com | [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of N395V | Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:25 AM | To: commander-list(at)matronics.com | Subject: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention | | | | > then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. | > | > | | | | ARRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!! | | I feel your pain. | | My Daughter is getting married in London next month and trying to get there | with everything important intact is seeming impossible at this point. | | -------- | Milt | N395V | F1 Rocket | | | | | Read this topic online here: | | http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=55484#55484 | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
That takes care of the damage aspect but it will no doubt attract more thieves. When I worked overseas I lost many items going back and forth. Unless I fly myself....I don't go. Tom F. ----- Original Message ----- From: Moe - Ross Racing Pistons To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 6:05 AM Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Barry, I should be leaving Dayton fairly early Sunday morning, and would be delighted to drop you off in Oakie City. This would be a good fuel stop for me, as I go back to Los Angeles. For many years I have had a "thing" about carry on luggage, and seldom take anything on the plane with me. Often I travel with a lot of hardware that couldn't go into the cabin in "the old days". If everything is well packed it travels quite well. I use the same basic technique that we use here at the piston factory.well packed but it should be quick and simple to unpack and repack by the airport inspectors. Foam can be easily cut with an electric knife to make excellent computer, cell phone, and camera packing structures. Regards, Moe ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:31 AM To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi All, If I'm able to attend this year's event, I'd like to ask whether anyone is going home on the Sunday (September 24th) via, or within driving distance of, Oklahoma City. If so, are they willing to drop me off there as talking freight? I will, of course, be more than willing to make a contribution towards the fuel costs. I would like to know whether this is a viable option, as I can then book all my flights accordingly. My getting there seems to be contingent on being allowed to take my camera equipment on board the flights as hand luggage, following the events of last week. Somehow, I don't think being forced to having them flown in the baggage hold is sensible, as they will then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. Very Best Regards, Barry ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
I was wondering who would pick up on that. -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:13 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk> Hi Bill, I don't think an American will mar an Englishmen. Mind you, marrying one is a different kettle of fish! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net> Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 4:03 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention | | Milt! | | She's not marring "ONE OF THEM", is she? | | Bilbo :>)))) | | -----Original Message----- | From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com | [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of N395V | Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:25 AM | To: commander-list(at)matronics.com | Subject: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention | | | | > then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. | > | > | | | | ARRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!! | | I feel your pain. | | My Daughter is getting married in London next month and trying to get there | with everything important intact is seeming impossible at this point. | | -------- | Milt | N395V | F1 Rocket | | | | | Read this topic online here: | | http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=55484#55484 | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Hi Keith, Well, there are two camera bodies (1 x film, 1x digital), 4 lenses (2 for each camera) and a digital camcorder. Plus, of course, all the needed accessories. I hope to pack into this bag as well a 'Navman' GPS for the cars I'll be renting plus an Archos AV700 (stores videos, photos & music). After the Fly-In, I'll be spending a week or so in Oklahoma City. Anyone want me to pass on their Best Regards to the folks at the FAA? No, OK so that's one thing less to worry about then! So, it's that lot plus the liquids & gels then!!! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: cloudcraft(at)aol.com To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 3:16 PM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Sir Barry, Do you have specialized camera equipment, or, can your photography needs be met by borrowing, say, a digital camera from someone here in the Colonies? If so, then all you have to do is worry about liquids and gels, right? Wing Commander Gordon -----Original Message----- From: barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 2:31 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention My getting there seems to be contingent on being allowed to take my camera equipment on board the flights as hand luggage, following the events of last week. Somehow, I don't think being forced to having them flown in the baggage hold is sensible, as they will then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. Very Best Regards, Barry ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Subject: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
JB, Could you send me a package? Nico van Niekerk, PO BOX 4221, Thousand Oaks, CA 91359 Thanks Nico _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of YOURTCFG(at)aol.com Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2006 10:25 AM Subject: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Gang, The TCFG Flyin and Convention is about 6 weeks away and I hope all of you are planning on attending. The event will be held at Commander Aero's facilities on the Wright Brothers Airport in Miamisburg, Ohio (near Dayton). Plan to come early and tour the historic aviation sites of Dayton. Our Hosts, Commander Aero have put together a great program for us including a visit to the Air Force Museum, a fly out to Eagle creek Airport and visit to Indianapolis Motor Speedway Museum, plus a line-up of speakers. The cost is only $150 and includes admission to all of the seminars (museum admission costs will be extra), dinner on three nights, continental breakfast on three mornings and lunch. Registration packets are on the way to current TCFG members. If you are not a current member, let us know and we would be happy to send you the information. Hotel Reservations: A Block of rooms has been reserved at the Hampton Inn & Suites for this event at the following rates: Standard Room $79.00 Suite $94.00 Phone Number: (937)743-2121 When making reservations let them know that you are with the Twin Commander Flight Group (TCFG). In order to receive this rate rooms must be booked no later than September 1st. After that the rooms will be released for general booking at regular rates. Rental Cars: Both Enterprise and Hertz service Wright Brothers Airport. Enterprise can deliver a car to the airport and Commander Aero can complete the paperwork, thereby avoiding any delays in picking up and returning your car. If booking through Enterprise please let them know your estimated time of arrival and that you would like the paperwork left with Commander Aero. Enterprise 937-291-6370 Hertz 937-438-0175 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Moe - Ross Racing Pistons" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Tom, The trick is to carry worthless stuff.. Moe _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom Fisher Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:21 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention That takes care of the damage aspect but it will no doubt attract more thieves. When I worked overseas I lost many items going back and forth. Unless I fly myself....I don't go. Tom F. ----- Original Message ----- From: Moe - Ross Racing <mailto:moe(at)rosspistons.com> Pistons Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 6:05 AM Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Barry, I should be leaving Dayton fairly early Sunday morning, and would be delighted to drop you off in Oakie City. This would be a good fuel stop for me, as I go back to Los Angeles. For many years I have had a "thing" about carry on luggage, and seldom take anything on the plane with me. Often I travel with a lot of hardware that couldn't go into the cabin in "the old days". If everything is well packed it travels quite well. I use the same basic technique that we use here at the piston factory.well packed but it should be quick and simple to unpack and repack by the airport inspectors. Foam can be easily cut with an electric knife to make excellent computer, cell phone, and camera packing structures. Regards, Moe _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:31 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi All, If I'm able to attend this year's event, I'd like to ask whether anyone is going home on the Sunday (September 24th) via, or within driving distance of, Oklahoma City. If so, are they willing to drop me off there as talking freight? I will, of course, be more than willing to make a contribution towards the fuel costs. I would like to know whether this is a viable option, as I can then book all my flights accordingly. My getting there seems to be contingent on being allowed to take my camera equipment on board the flights as hand luggage, following the events of last week. Somehow, I don't think being forced to having them flown in the baggage hold is sensible, as they will then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. Very Best Regards, Barry ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Moe - Ross Racing Pistons" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Barry, I would not even consider letting you buy gas, and besides you bought lunch the last time in Jolly Old England. Regards, Moe _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:02 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Moe, If you are absolutely certain that you are not going out of your way to drop me off, that will be simply great! There's quite a good restaurant at Wiley Post (KPWA), so I can treat you (both?) to a spot of late breakfast or lunch! It's literally a few yards walk from the FBO there. Let me know how much you need as the fuel contribution, and I'll make sure I bring enough pieces of the spendable paper! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: Moe - Ross Racing <mailto:moe(at)rosspistons.com> Pistons Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:05 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Barry, I should be leaving Dayton fairly early Sunday morning, and would be delighted to drop you off in Oakie City. This would be a good fuel stop for me, as I go back to Los Angeles. For many years I have had a "thing" about carry on luggage, and seldom take anything on the plane with me. Often I travel with a lot of hardware that couldn't go into the cabin in "the old days". If everything is well packed it travels quite well. I use the same basic technique that we use here at the piston factory.well packed but it should be quick and simple to unpack and repack by the airport inspectors. Foam can be easily cut with an electric knife to make excellent computer, cell phone, and camera packing structures. Regards, Moe _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:31 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi All, If I'm able to attend this year's event, I'd like to ask whether anyone is going home on the Sunday (September 24th) via, or within driving distance of, Oklahoma City. If so, are they willing to drop me off there as talking freight? I will, of course, be more than willing to make a contribution towards the fuel costs. I would like to know whether this is a viable option, as I can then book all my flights accordingly. My getting there seems to be contingent on being allowed to take my camera equipment on board the flights as hand luggage, following the events of last week. Somehow, I don't think being forced to having them flown in the baggage hold is sensible, as they will then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. Very Best Regards, Barry ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Delighted not to disappoint! bilbo -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of nico css Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 11:23 AM Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention I was wondering who would pick up on that. -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:13 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk> Hi Bill, I don't think an American will mar an Englishmen. Mind you, marrying one is a different kettle of fish! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net> Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 4:03 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention | | Milt! | | She's not marring "ONE OF THEM", is she? | | Bilbo :>)))) | | -----Original Message----- | From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com | [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of N395V | Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:25 AM | To: commander-list(at)matronics.com | Subject: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention | | | | > then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. | > | > | | | | ARRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!! | | I feel your pain. | | My Daughter is getting married in London next month and trying to get there | with everything important intact is seeming impossible at this point. | | -------- | Milt | N395V | F1 Rocket | | | | | Read this topic online here: | | http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=55484#55484 | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 18, 2006
Hey Milt, Is he calling your daughter a kettle? Bilbo:>))) -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 11:13 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk> Hi Bill, I don't think an American will mar an Englishmen. Mind you, marrying one is a different kettle of fish! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net> Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 4:03 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention | | Milt! | | She's not marring "ONE OF THEM", is she? | | Bilbo :>)))) | | -----Original Message----- | From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com | [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of N395V | Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:25 AM | To: commander-list(at)matronics.com | Subject: Commander-List: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention | | | | > then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. | > | > | | | | ARRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!! | | I feel your pain. | | My Daughter is getting married in London next month and trying to get there | with everything important intact is seeming impossible at this point. | | -------- | Milt | N395V | F1 Rocket | | | | | Read this topic online here: | | http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=55484#55484 | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 20, 2006
From: W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems.
Jim, There are others far more knowledgeable than me on this subject, but if the have a look on the Australian Civil Aviation Safety Authority (CASA) web site (www.casa.gov.au) you will find a whole history of the wing spar problems. The guts if the problem was that spar extrusions were cold bent and not stress relieved. Australia published (some quite lunatic) hard spar lives for almost all GA aircraft, for a 500A in normal serviceable condition, with the AD required spar strap, the life is unlimited. In some ( not AC) aircraft, it can be as low as 8000 hours. Regards, Bill Hamilton At 11:04 PM 18/08/2006, you wrote: > >I was wondering if anyone could help me with current or historic >information on the Aero commander 500A in reference to problems with >the wing spar. >I have N 800AC which I have been working to get airworthy for the >last few years and was down to one last problem. I had a fuel leak >which you could smell in the aft cabin. When they pulled the center >fuel bladder out to repair or replace they found the wing spar in my >plane to be 50% deteriorated. > >Are there any ADs or service advisories which would have covered >this problem in the past? >Where can I get replacement parts? > >Thanks, >Jim > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
From: "N395V" <n395v(at)hughes.net>
Date: Aug 20, 2006
bowing74(at)earthlink.net wrote: > Milt! > > She's not marring "ONE OF THEM", is she? > > Bilbo :>)))) > > -- Alas yes, Me poor Irish ancestors be rollin in their graves................................ At least he has money . Time to take back the lands the British stole from us. -------- Milt N395V F1 Rocket Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=55938#55938 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 21, 2006
From: W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems.
Jim, Some info. If I can find an actual link, I will send it, in the meantime, try Google: [2] Swift SJ (1995) =91The Aero Commander Chronicle=92. Proceedings of the 18th Symposium of the International Committee on Aeronautical Fatigue, EMAS, Melbourne, Australia, pages 507 ' 530. [3] Swift SJ (1999) =91Gnats and Camels ' 30 Years of Regulating Structural Fatigue in Light Aircraft=92. Proceedings of the 20th Symposium of the International Committee on Aeronautical Fatigue, Bellevue, Washington, USA, pages 685 ' 708. Regards, Bill Hamilton At 11:04 PM 18/08/2006, you wrote: > >I was wondering if anyone could help me with >current or historic information on the Aero >commander 500A in reference to problems with the wing spar. >I have N 800AC which I have been working to get >airworthy for the last few years and was down to >one last problem. I had a fuel leak which you >could smell in the aft cabin. When they pulled >the center fuel bladder out to repair or replace >they found the wing spar in my plane to be 50% deteriorated. > >Are there any ADs or service advisories which >would have covered this problem in the past? >Where can I get replacement parts? > >Thanks, >Jim > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 21, 2006
From: W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems.
Jim, Try this, I was looking everywhere but the obvious place, I was talking to Swift today, it doesn't altogether surprise me he rides a bicycle. http://www.casa.gov.au/airworth/papers/aerocommander.pdf Cheers, Bill Hamilton At 11:04 PM 18/08/2006, you wrote: > >I was wondering if anyone could help me with current or historic >information on the Aero commander 500A in reference to problems with >the wing spar. >I have N 800AC which I have been working to get airworthy for the >last few years and was down to one last problem. I had a fuel leak >which you could smell in the aft cabin. When they pulled the center >fuel bladder out to repair or replace they found the wing spar in my >plane to be 50% deteriorated. > >Are there any ADs or service advisories which would have covered >this problem in the past? >Where can I get replacement parts? > >Thanks, >Jim > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "" <br549phil(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems.
Date: Aug 21, 2006
Excellent infromation. Thanks Phil Stubbs ----- Original Message ----- From: W J R HAMILTON Sent: 8/21/2006 8:41:57 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: History of 500A wing spar problems. Jim, Try this, I was looking everywhere but the obvious place, I was talking to Swift today, it doesn't altogether surprise me he rides a bicycle. http://www.casa.gov.au/airworth/papers/aerocommander.pdf Cheers, Bill Hamilton At 11:04 PM 18/08/2006, you wrote: I was wondering if anyone could help me with current or historic information on the Aero commander 500A in reference to problems with the wing spar. I have N 800AC which I have been working to get airworthy for the last few years and was down to one last problem. I had a fuel leak which you could smell in the aft cabin. When they pulled the center fuel bladder out to repair or replace they found the wing spar in my plane to be 50% deteriorated. Are there any ADs or service advisories which would have covered this problem in the past? Where can I get replacement parts? Thanks, Jim ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Subject: History of 500A wing spar problems.
Date: Aug 21, 2006
I think i'm going to take up walking... Rob _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of br549phil(at)mindspring.com Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 11:39 Subject: Re: Commander-List: History of 500A wing spar problems. Excellent infromation. Thanks Phil Stubbs ----- Original Message ----- From: W J R HAMILTON <mailto:wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au> Sent: 8/21/2006 8:41:57 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: History of 500A wing spar problems. Jim, Try this, I was looking everywhere but the obvious place, I was talking to Swift today, it doesn't altogether surprise me he rides a bicycle. http://www.casa.gov.au/airworth/papers/aerocommander.pdf Cheers, Bill Hamilton At 11:04 PM 18/08/2006, you wrote: I was wondering if anyone could help me with current or historic information on the Aero commander 500A in reference to problems with the wing spar. I have N 800AC which I have been working to get airworthy for the last few years and was down to one last problem. I had a fuel leak which you could smell in the aft cabin. When they pulled the center fuel bladder out to repair or replace they found the wing spar in my plane to be 50% deteriorated. Are there any ADs or service advisories which would have covered this problem in the past? Where can I get replacement parts? Thanks, Jim __________ NOD32 1.1717 (20060821) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems.
From: "N395V" <n395v(at)hughes.net>
Date: Aug 21, 2006
I'm sooooooooo0o confused. My impression when I first got into commanders was only 2 planes had had spar failure. 1 allegedly had pre existing spar damage in a hangar door accident that was poorly repaired and the other was 2 tennagers high on Marijuana trying to imitate Bob Hoover. Were there really 24 in flight failures????? -------- Milt N395V F1 Rocket Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56152#56152 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Subject: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems.
Date: Aug 21, 2006
Milt- I thought there had been a few more- but that they were mostly low-level work aircraft subject to pretty high stress loads as a routine part of their operation. Apparently this isn't the case. This makes me worry... N414C had that hard landing incident in 2001(?)... Was any consideration given to the strain placed on the wing spar in that incident? Crikey... Time for more costly inspections? Rob -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of N395V Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 13:57 Subject: Commander-List: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. I'm sooooooooo0o confused. My impression when I first got into commanders was only 2 planes had had spar failure. 1 allegedly had pre existing spar damage in a hangar door accident that was poorly repaired and the other was 2 tennagers high on Marijuana trying to imitate Bob Hoover. Were there really 24 in flight failures????? -------- Milt N395V F1 Rocket Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56152#56152 __________ NOD32 1.1718 (20060821) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com>
Subject: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems.
Date: Aug 21, 2006
Milt, I haven't decided how much credit to grant these reports. I've heard varying stories, including one that the chief investigator was on a crusade against Commander for some bizarre personal reasons. I also have heard that some of the accidents ascribed to spar failure did involve a "spar failure"....when the spar hit the ground at 170kts, it failed. I also think that the airplanes down under were operated in a harsher environment, in a more heavy-handed or less well (factory) supported fashion (this may be erroneous on my part). Regardless, the AD's & SB's are in place, and if the airplanes are so bad, why have spar failures dropped to zero? When's the last time we had spar issues in the flight group? There've been NONE in the almost 8 years I've been participating. I've got 18,000+ hours on my airframe and my spar is fine. /John ----- Original Message ----- From: "N395V" <n395v(at)hughes.net> Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 1:57 PM Subject: Commander-List: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. > > I'm sooooooooo0o confused. > > My impression when I first got into commanders was only 2 planes had had > spar failure. 1 allegedly had pre existing spar damage in a hangar door > accident that was poorly repaired and the other was 2 tennagers high on > Marijuana trying to imitate Bob Hoover. > > Were there really 24 in flight failures????? > > -------- > Milt > N395V > F1 Rocket > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56152#56152 > > > __________ NOD32 1.1717 (20060821) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ NOD32 1.1717 (20060821) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems.
From: "N395V" <n395v(at)hughes.net>
Date: Aug 21, 2006
I believe ALL spar failures have been corrosion related. N414C has had 1 if not 2 AD mandated inspections since the landing and has passed without difficulty. Also note from the commander aero website that those aircraft affected (based on repetetive inspections of the fleet) are few and far between. To my knowledge since the AD there have been no failures. Drink beer get some nooki and don't worry. [Laughing] -------- Milt N395V F1 Rocket Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56178#56178 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Subject: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems.
Date: Aug 21, 2006
Milt- I'll have to settle for just the beer. First child shows up any day now- so The Mr.s isn't much in the mood for nooki. ;-) Just got the new cabinets for N414C back from the cabinet maker. Nice mahogany finish (not real- but looks great). Redesigned them to suit my needs a bit better- flight manuals/docs within easy reach, an ice drawer capable of holding a 6 pack of coke and ice (reachable from the cockpit, of course!) and two nice, roomy storage bins for any food stuffs the wife might wish to bring along.... Still wending our way through the autopilot certification process... It's holding up progress a bit- but the short term game plan is to get her flying again by end of september. You are correct- 2 spar AD inspections and nothing noted. Third one is due next year. No doubt I'll be seeking advice from this group on where to take her. Rob -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of N395V Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 16:20 Subject: Commander-List: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. I believe ALL spar failures have been corrosion related. N414C has had 1 if not 2 AD mandated inspections since the landing and has passed without difficulty. Also note from the commander aero website that those aircraft affected (based on repetetive inspections of the fleet) are few and far between. To my knowledge since the AD there have been no failures. Drink beer get some nooki and don't worry. [Laughing] -------- Milt N395V F1 Rocket Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56178#56178 __________ NOD32 1.1718 (20060821) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 22, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
The Mr. RPM I did in 1976 had the blankets on each turbo. That would be N400CH now. Bill Leff ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 22, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander pics and stuff
You can get the information you need, via the Freedom of information Act, from the region that certified the STC if the owner does not exists any more. Bill Leff ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 22, 2006
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
I had a Collins AP-102E. Nobody can fix it. There is one test set in the world! and it is in Asia!! I am currently installing a Century III witch is approved for the 560F Bill Leff ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 22, 2006
From: Dan Farmer <daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Commander-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 08/21/06
Oddly enough I am in Toykyo reading about spar problems in all commanders. Google "Aero Commander" on the first page is a hit on "wikipedia" then a article on adey murphey's crash click one of the links and it takes you to the sj swift report. dan farmer Commander-List Digest Server wrote: * ================================================= Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive ================================================= Today's complete Commander-List Digest can also be found in either of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version of the Commander-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser. HTML Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/commander-list/Digest.Commander-List.2006-08-21.html Text Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/commander-list/Digest.Commander-List.2006-08-21.txt =============================================== EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive =============================================== ---------------------------------------------------------- Commander-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 08/21/06: 12 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:05 AM - Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. (W J R HAMILTON) 2. 05:32 AM - Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. (W J R HAMILTON) 3. 11:40 AM - Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. () 4. 12:52 PM - Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. (Robert S. Randazzo) 5. 01:58 PM - Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. (N395V) 6. 02:34 PM - Re: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. (Robert S. Randazzo) 7. 02:36 PM - Re: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. (John Vormbaum) 8. 04:20 PM - Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. (N395V) 9. 06:12 PM - Re: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. (Robert S. Randazzo) 10. 09:36 PM - Re: Commander pics and stuff (BillLeff1(at)aol.com) 11. 09:48 PM - Re: Commander pics and stuff (BillLeff1(at)aol.com) 12. 10:41 PM - Re: Message regarding autopilot (BillLeff1(at)aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ From: W J R HAMILTON Subject: Re: Commander-List: History of 500A wing spar problems. Jim, Some info. If I can find an actual link, I will send it, in the meantime, try Google: [2] Swift SJ (1995) =91The Aero Commander Chronicle=92. Proceedings of the 18th Symposium of the International Committee on Aeronautical Fatigue, EMAS, Melbourne, Australia, pages 507 ' 530. [3] Swift SJ (1999) =91Gnats and Camels ' 30 Years of Regulating Structural Fatigue in Light Aircraft=92. Proceedings of the 20th Symposium of the International Committee on Aeronautical Fatigue, Bellevue, Washington, USA, pages 685 ' 708. Regards, Bill Hamilton At 11:04 PM 18/08/2006, you wrote: > >I was wondering if anyone could help me with >current or historic information on the Aero >commander 500A in reference to problems with the wing spar. >I have N 800AC which I have been working to get >airworthy for the last few years and was down to >one last problem. I had a fuel leak which you >could smell in the aft cabin. When they pulled >the center fuel bladder out to repair or replace >they found the wing spar in my plane to be 50% deteriorated. > >Are there any ADs or service advisories which >would have covered this problem in the past? >Where can I get replacement parts? > >Thanks, >Jim > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ From: W J R HAMILTON Subject: Re: Commander-List: History of 500A wing spar problems. Jim, Try this, I was looking everywhere but the obvious place, I was talking to Swift today, it doesn't altogether surprise me he rides a bicycle. http://www.casa.gov.au/airworth/papers/aerocommander.pdf Cheers, Bill Hamilton At 11:04 PM 18/08/2006, you wrote: > >I was wondering if anyone could help me with current or historic >information on the Aero commander 500A in reference to problems with >the wing spar. >I have N 800AC which I have been working to get airworthy for the >last few years and was down to one last problem. I had a fuel leak >which you could smell in the aft cabin. When they pulled the center >fuel bladder out to repair or replace they found the wing spar in my >plane to be 50% deteriorated. > >Are there any ADs or service advisories which would have covered >this problem in the past? >Where can I get replacement parts? > >Thanks, >Jim > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ From: "" Subject: Re: Commander-List: History of 500A wing spar problems. Excellent infromation. Thanks Phil Stubbs ----- Original Message ----- From: W J R HAMILTON Sent: 8/21/2006 8:41:57 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: History of 500A wing spar problems. Jim, Try this, I was looking everywhere but the obvious place, I was talking to Swift today, it doesn't altogether surprise me he rides a bicycle. http://www.casa.gov.au/airworth/papers/aerocommander.pdf Cheers, Bill Hamilton At 11:04 PM 18/08/2006, you wrote: I was wondering if anyone could help me with current or historic information on the Aero commander 500A in reference to problems with the wing spar. I have N 800AC which I have been working to get airworthy for the last few years and was down to one last problem. I had a fuel leak which you could smell in the aft cabin. When they pulled the center fuel bladder out to repair or replace they found the wing spar in my plane to be 50% deteriorated. Are there any ADs or service advisories which would have covered this problem in the past? Where can I get replacement parts? Thanks, Jim ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ From: "Robert S. Randazzo" Subject: RE: Commander-List: History of 500A wing spar problems. I think i'm going to take up walking... Rob _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of br549phil(at)mindspring.com Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 11:39 Subject: Re: Commander-List: History of 500A wing spar problems. Excellent infromation. Thanks Phil Stubbs ----- Original Message ----- From: W J R HAMILTON Sent: 8/21/2006 8:41:57 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: History of 500A wing spar problems. Jim, Try this, I was looking everywhere but the obvious place, I was talking to Swift today, it doesn't altogether surprise me he rides a bicycle. http://www.casa.gov.au/airworth/papers/aerocommander.pdf Cheers, Bill Hamilton At 11:04 PM 18/08/2006, you wrote: I was wondering if anyone could help me with current or historic information on the Aero commander 500A in reference to problems with the wing spar. I have N 800AC which I have been working to get airworthy for the last few years and was down to one last problem. I had a fuel leak which you could smell in the aft cabin. When they pulled the center fuel bladder out to repair or replace they found the wing spar in my plane to be 50% deteriorated. Are there any ADs or service advisories which would have covered this problem in the past? Where can I get replacement parts? Thanks, Jim __________ NOD32 1.1717 (20060821) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Subject: Commander-List: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. From: "N395V" I'm sooooooooo0o confused. My impression when I first got into commanders was only 2 planes had had spar failure. 1 allegedly had pre existing spar damage in a hangar door accident that was poorly repaired and the other was 2 tennagers high on Marijuana trying to imitate Bob Hoover. Were there really 24 in flight failures????? -------- Milt N395V F1 Rocket Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56152#56152 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ From: "Robert S. Randazzo" Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. Milt- I thought there had been a few more- but that they were mostly low-level work aircraft subject to pretty high stress loads as a routine part of their operation. Apparently this isn't the case. This makes me worry... N414C had that hard landing incident in 2001(?)... Was any consideration given to the strain placed on the wing spar in that incident? Crikey... Time for more costly inspections? Rob -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of N395V Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 13:57 Subject: Commander-List: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. I'm sooooooooo0o confused. My impression when I first got into commanders was only 2 planes had had spar failure. 1 allegedly had pre existing spar damage in a hangar door accident that was poorly repaired and the other was 2 tennagers high on Marijuana trying to imitate Bob Hoover. Were there really 24 in flight failures????? -------- Milt N395V F1 Rocket Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56152#56152 __________ NOD32 1.1718 (20060821) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ From: "John Vormbaum" Subject: Re: Commander-List: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. Milt, I haven't decided how much credit to grant these reports. I've heard varying stories, including one that the chief investigator was on a crusade against Commander for some bizarre personal reasons. I also have heard that some of the accidents ascribed to spar failure did involve a "spar failure"....when the spar hit the ground at 170kts, it failed. I also think that the airplanes down under were operated in a harsher environment, in a more heavy-handed or less well (factory) supported fashion (this may be erroneous on my part). Regardless, the AD's & SB's are in place, and if the airplanes are so bad, why have spar failures dropped to zero? When's the last time we had spar issues in the flight group? There've been NONE in the almost 8 years I've been participating. I've got 18,000+ hours on my airframe and my spar is fine. /John ----- Original Message ----- From: "N395V" Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 1:57 PM Subject: Commander-List: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. > > I'm sooooooooo0o confused. > > My impression when I first got into commanders was only 2 planes had had > spar failure. 1 allegedly had pre existing spar damage in a hangar door > accident that was poorly repaired and the other was 2 tennagers high on > Marijuana trying to imitate Bob Hoover. > > Were there really 24 in flight failures????? > > -------- > Milt > N395V > F1 Rocket > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56152#56152 > > > __________ NOD32 1.1717 (20060821) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ NOD32 1.1717 (20060821) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Subject: Commander-List: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. From: "N395V" I believe ALL spar failures have been corrosion related. N414C has had 1 if not 2 AD mandated inspections since the landing and has passed without difficulty. Also note from the commander aero website that those aircraft affected (based on repetetive inspections of the fleet) are few and far between. To my knowledge since the AD there have been no failures. Drink beer get some nooki and don't worry. [Laughing] -------- Milt N395V F1 Rocket Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56178#56178 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ From: "Robert S. Randazzo" Subject: RE: Commander-List: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. Milt- I'll have to settle for just the beer. First child shows up any day now- so The Mr.s isn't much in the mood for nooki. ;-) Just got the new cabinets for N414C back from the cabinet maker. Nice mahogany finish (not real- but looks great). Redesigned them to suit my needs a bit better- flight manuals/docs within easy reach, an ice drawer capable of holding a 6 pack of coke and ice (reachable from the cockpit, of course!) and two nice, roomy storage bins for any food stuffs the wife might wish to bring along.... Still wending our way through the autopilot certification process... It's holding up progress a bit- but the short term game plan is to get her flying again by end of september. You are correct- 2 spar AD inspections and nothing noted. Third one is due next year. No doubt I'll be seeking advice from this group on where to take her. Rob -----Original Message----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of N395V Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 16:20 Subject: Commander-List: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. I believe ALL spar failures have been corrosion related. N414C has had 1 if not 2 AD mandated inspections since the landing and has passed without difficulty. Also note from the commander aero website that those aircraft affected (based on repetetive inspections of the fleet) are few and far between. To my knowledge since the AD there have been no failures. Drink beer get some nooki and don't worry. [Laughing] -------- Milt N395V F1 Rocket Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56178#56178 __________ NOD32 1.1718 (20060821) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: Commander pics and stuff The Mr. RPM I did in 1976 had the blankets on each turbo. That would be N400CH now. Bill Leff ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: Commander pics and stuff You can get the information you need, via the Freedom of information Act, from the region that certified the STC if the owner does not exists any more. Bill Leff ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: Message regarding autopilot I had a Collins AP-102E. Nobody can fix it. There is one test set in the world! and it is in Asia!! I am currently installing a Century III witch is approved for the 560F Bill Leff --------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "" <br549phil(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
Date: Aug 22, 2006
Hi Bill, Just found out the Chelton AP-3c is STCd for the 560F. I'm exploring that but was wondering if you got your CIII from salvage 560F or what? Phil Stubbs ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: 8/22/2006 1:46:53 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: Message regarding autopilot I had a Collins AP-102E. Nobody can fix it. There is one test set in the world! and it is in Asia!! I am currently installing a Century III witch is approved for the 560F Bill Leff ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tylor Hall <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
Date: Aug 22, 2006
Phil, I just looked on the Chelton web site and no Aero Commanders were listed. What models have they added? Any thing on a 680E? Tylor Hall On Aug 22, 2006, at 1:39 PM, "" wrote: > Hi Bill, > Just found out the Chelton AP-3c is STCd for the 560F. I'm > exploring that but was wondering if you got your CIII from salvage > 560F or what? > > > Phil Stubbs > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: commander-list(at)matronics.com > Sent: 8/22/2006 1:46:53 AM > Subject: Re: Commander-List: Message regarding autopilot > > I had a Collins AP-102E. Nobody can fix it. There is one test set > in the world! and it is in Asia!! > > I am currently installing a Century III witch is approved for the 560F > > Bill Leff > <> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "" <br549phil(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: SA10439SC.pdf
Date: Aug 22, 2006
http://www.airweb.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgSTC.nsf/0/2ff5206c961ea963862570990050e72a/$FILE/SA10439SC.pdf Tylor, Here is the link to the STC. Don't know how I missed it in the earlier searches. Unfortunately, Chelton is in the process of moving their ops from TX to OK and are not shipping for about 90 days. After four years whats another few days. SA10439SC covers 560F, 680, 680E, 680F, 720 Phil Stubbs ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tylor Hall <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: SA10439SC.pdf
Date: Aug 22, 2006
Phil, That is interesting. It includes round and flat nacelle commanders, but does not included the 500A,B, U, S or the 560, 520??? But it should not be hard to add the other since they have some of both. No long body commanders? I hear it is a good unit. and the cost is reasonable. Tylor Hall On Aug 22, 2006, at 7:44 PM, "" wrote: > > http://www.airweb.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgSTC.nsf/ > 0/2ff5206c961ea963862570990050e72a/$FILE/SA10439SC.pdf > > Tylor, > Here is the link to the STC. Don't know how I missed it in the > earlier searches. > Unfortunately, Chelton is in the process of moving their ops from > TX to OK and are not shipping for about 90 days. After four years > whats another few days. > SA10439SC covers 560F, 680, 680E, 680F, 720 > Phil Stubbs > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Subject: SA10439SC.pdf
Date: Aug 22, 2006
Tylor- I've been working with Chelton Aviation Corp (now Wulfsberg) since December of last year when a CAC rep suggested they would be interested to use our airplane as the testbed for their STC on the 685 and long body commanders. Unfortunately, he and one other CAC employee were killed in an accident in April so CAC was rolled up under a sister company, Wulfsberg- and the story has been less than positive since that time. We are working very hard to get the STC completed- but I cannot honestly tell you that Wulfsberg is being very helpful and instead they have foisted us off on a DER that can't get enough information from them to move the process along. Currently we are sitting with an un-certified AP-3C in our commander that cannot be returned to flight because we the promises that have been made to us are not being followed through with. I'm trying everything I can to prevent this from going to litigation- but..... it's looking more and more likely. Rob _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tylor Hall Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 18:52 Subject: Re: Commander-List: SA10439SC.pdf Phil, That is interesting. It includes round and flat nacelle commanders, but does not included the 500A,B, U, S or the 560, 520??? But it should not be hard to add the other since they have some of both. No long body commanders? I hear it is a good unit. and the cost is reasonable. Tylor Hall On Aug 22, 2006, at 7:44 PM, "" wrote: http://www.airweb.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgSTC.nsf/0/2ff520 6c961ea963862570990050e72a/$FILE/SA10439SC.pdf Tylor, Here is the link to the STC. Don't know how I missed it in the earlier searches. Unfortunately, Chelton is in the process of moving their ops from TX to OK and are not shipping for about 90 days. After four years whats another few days. SA10439SC covers 560F, 680, 680E, 680F, 720 Phil Stubbs onics.com/Navigator?Commander-List ntribution __________ NOD32 1.1720 (20060822) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 23, 2006
From: W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: History of 500A wing spar problems.
Folks, I'm not kidding, Steve Swift from CASA really does ride a bicycle, I'll bet he isn't too happy riding the railroad, wheels and tracks fatigue, bridges crack, even the odd cave roof falls in when the rupture modulus of the local mountain is exceeded. What we all have to understand is that "life" is the problem, it's a sexually transmitted terminal disease. I knew about all this, and still bought my 500A. Cheers, Bill Hamilton At 05:49 AM 22/08/2006, you wrote: >I think i'm going to take up walking... > >Rob > > >---------- >From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of >br549phil(at)mindspring.com >Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 11:39 >To: commander-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: Commander-List: History of 500A wing spar problems. > >Excellent infromation. >Thanks > >Phil Stubbs > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: <mailto:wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>W J R HAMILTON >To: commander-list(at)matronics.com >Sent: 8/21/2006 8:41:57 AM >Subject: Re: Commander-List: History of 500A wing spar problems. > >Jim, >Try this, I was looking everywhere but the obvious place, I was >talking to Swift today, it doesn't altogether surprise me he rides a bicycle. >http://www.casa.gov.au/airworth/papers/aerocommander.pdf >Cheers, >Bill Hamilton > > >At 11:04 PM 18/08/2006, you wrote: >> >>I was wondering if anyone could help me with current or historic >>information on the Aero commander 500A in reference to problems >>with the wing spar. >>I have N 800AC which I have been working to get airworthy for the >>last few years and was down to one last problem. I had a fuel leak >>which you could smell in the aft cabin. When they pulled the center >>fuel bladder out to repair or replace they found the wing spar in >>my plane to be 50% deteriorated. >> >>Are there any ADs or service advisories which would have covered >>this problem in the past? >>Where can I get replacement parts? >> >>Thanks, >>Jim >> > > >ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List > > >__________ NOD32 1.1717 (20060821) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. ><http://www.eset.com>http://www.eset.com > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 23, 2006
From: W J R HAMILTON <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems.
Folks, To keep things in perspective, if you examine the databases, world wide, FOR ALL TYPES, it make interesting reading. Another US type that features prominently is the Beech 18, but the total number of in-flight failures of DeHavilland built aircraft is interesting, from the Chipmunk, through the Dove and Heron, and finally the Trident jet --- not necessarily in flight failures ---- but picked up in routine maintenance. With the Aero Commanders, the problem was/is the cold bent extrusions ---- but ----- with the AD's up to date, and properly conducted inspections----- RE. Australian experience, the local experts are a company called General Aviation Maintenance, Steve Nott, and you should see the wonderful aeroplanes that come out of his hangar (his is a Renaissance centre), and I have lost count of how many various 500B/S etc and 690 he actually owns and operates in his own right, or leases to other operators, somebody recently quoted 20+. Again to keep things in perspective, despite the "apparent" record, the majority of aircraft owned and operated by DCA/DoA/CAA were Aero Commander, variously small fleets of 560E, through 695. As I said in a previous message, I knew all this, and still bought ZK-DCF, I do have some corrosion rectification to do, but it is all in the lap joints or the ribbed skins. Cheers, Bill Hamilton At 07:35 AM 22/08/2006, you wrote: > >Milt, > >I haven't decided how much credit to grant these reports. I've heard >varying stories, including one that the chief investigator was on a >crusade against Commander for some bizarre personal reasons. I also >have heard that some of the accidents ascribed to spar failure did >involve a "spar failure"....when the spar hit the ground at 170kts, it failed. > >I also think that the airplanes down under were operated in a >harsher environment, in a more heavy-handed or less well (factory) >supported fashion (this may be erroneous on my part). > >Regardless, the AD's & SB's are in place, and if the airplanes are >so bad, why have spar failures dropped to zero? When's the last time >we had spar issues in the flight group? There've been NONE in the >almost 8 years I've been participating. I've got 18,000+ hours on my >airframe and my spar is fine. > >/John > >----- Original Message ----- From: "N395V" <n395v(at)hughes.net> >To: >Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 1:57 PM >Subject: Commander-List: Re: History of 500A wing spar problems. > > >> >>I'm sooooooooo0o confused. >> >>My impression when I first got into commanders was only 2 planes >>had had spar failure. 1 allegedly had pre existing spar damage in a >>hangar door accident that was poorly repaired and the other was 2 >>tennagers high on Marijuana trying to imitate Bob Hoover. >> >>Were there really 24 in flight failures????? >> >>-------- >>Milt >>N395V >>F1 Rocket >> >> >> >> >>Read this topic online here: >> >>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56152#56152 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>__________ NOD32 1.1717 (20060821) Information __________ >> >>This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >>http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >>__________ NOD32 1.1717 (20060821) Information __________ >> >>This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >>http://www.eset.com >> > > CONFIDENTIALITY & PRIVILEGE NOTICE W.J.R.Hamilton,Glenalmond Group Companies,Fighter Flights Internet Services and Warbirds.Net. & . This message is intended for and should only be used by the addressee. It is confidential and may contain legally privileged information.If you are not the intended recipient any use distribution,disclosure or copying of this message is strictly prohibited.Confidentiality and legal privilege attached to this communication are not waived or lost by reason of the mistaken delivery to you.If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately to: Australia 61 (0)408 876 526 Dolores capitis non fero. Eos do. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BillLeff1(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 24, 2006
Subject: Re: Message regarding autopilot
I got most of the parts from a Shrike that it was removed from. I have all the paperwork and drawings. It is available from Century. Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "steve2" <steve2(at)sover.net>
Subject: Commander Wing Spars
Date: Aug 24, 2006
My Dad and I have always been fascinated by the Commander wing spars. It's an interesting story whose final chapter is perhaps not written. In the early years it wasn't corrosion, and I'm not so sure about the cold-bend theory, though it sounds plausible. (The cap was cold-bent?) The spar caps are radiused and this I thought was a major issue. The outer station that broke on the bathtubs wasn't in an area that was cold bent, right? Not being an engineer however, I'm not contributing to factual information by speculating. After 41 years and 9000 hours, some of it aerial survey work, we just went through our 500B wings at annual to give a thorough inspection to tighten and replace some smoking rivets on the top and bottom caps in various locations along the spar. About a year ago my Dad jotted down some notes to send to Barry Collman, with my dad still trying to learn more about the origins of the spar problem. I've read the Aussie reports, and heard a lot of speculation. I suspect there is someone out there that knows a hell of a lot more, but I thought I would include some edited messages that add another perspective, not of an engineer but of an old survey pilot. If nothing else it makes for a little good reading..... I've deleted anything of a personal nature. We don't operate or abuse aircraft anything like these guys did...... It was their job. What follows are a couple notes my Dad jotted down. Barry, I know my Dad enjoyed recollecting them after all these years. Steve >>>>>>>> I know the 680E family perhaps as well as anyone, having flown several of them to just short of eventual destruction, in low altitude (read 100 [that's one hundred] feet in all sorts of mountainous terrain, all over the world. Most of them had pods, booms and other assorted gadgets stuck on, and sticking out of them. I made the papers (in the US) from time to time, as local reporters dubbed the machines as "mystery ships." In fact we were doing commercial aero-magnetic surveys for multi-national corporations, and were not at liberty to talk about the work. The lower spar caps at stations 22 (for sure) and 144 (if I remember correctly) were deadly, and the planetary gear cases (77:120) on the GSO 480's (model B1A6) would come apart at the most inopportune moments. We actually launched a starboard propeller into the Red Sea - followed by having the Shah of Iran - Mohammed Rhezza Palavi - (spelled wrong, I'm sure) give us a brand new engine, a spare for his own 680-E. The dynamic counterweights on the crankshafts forced an interesting convention of pulling the mixtures instead of retarding the throttles, as to keep the iron wedges from breaking their positioning pins and tearing the entire engine to pieces - which happened frequently in survey service until we developed a trick. We used the pressurized air from the centrifugal blower to maintain compression, so that no instantaneous reversal of torque would result from the necessary termination of power. We had to keep the machine within 100 ft. of the down-slope of a cliff as we went to 'fine-bite', and threw out flaps & gear to retard the predictable increase in airspeed on the way down. It was kind of weird, needing to adjust the throttles to manage manifold pressure as altitude changed - while the engines were not even running. On the plus side, we never threw another counterweight. When the descent was done and power was again required, one simply pushed the mixture controls forward, and the noise came back. That's really about as exciting as the exercise ever got. It scared the hell out of visiting pilots, but there was really nothing to it. If there was a down-side, it was quite disconcerting to hear the creaks and clinks as the dimensions of the engines changed with the frightening rate of temperature drop that resulted from an absence of combustion - with no change in manifold pressure or RPM. Imagine - 48 inches at 3,800 RPM with no airspeed and the cylinder head temps pegged - while struggling to clear a peak; followed by a quick pitch down to maybe -30 degrees, pull the mixtures, all the rest, and then be entertained by the cylinder head temp needles hanging a quick left, and racing for their pegs. Interesting times. We were quite pleased to get 600 hours without a catastrophic failure. Notwithstanding, we usually ran them til they folded up anyway. Work time was premium - engines were (in terms of production time) cheap, and we operated (in the States) in the Restricted category. We always had spares crated and ready to ship. I ordered one to a job site in Nevada, thinking the port side was about finished. Two days later, the right one mulched the front gear assembly. Guess where we hung the spare (using a tow truck in the desert)? I know; sounds like baloney - but Steven has all the pictures. The port one ran (poorly) another hundred or so hours til we finally got back to ISP (home base). We changed that one before it caved in. I have a ton of this anecdotal and documented junk if you're interested. Steven has my full collection of slides, enough to bore anyone's spouse to death. Steven - Referring to the time I let our neighbor Tom Kanas first try a takeoff - perhaps you can scan or photocopy for Barry the M&D I sent to FAA after the starboard control yoke on 41C parted company from the elevator control rod. Our survival, you'll recall, generated a revision to several NTSB probable cause findings - changing them from pilot error, to component failure. You may recall they grounded the whole fleet while we convinced them that the factory spec for rigging the eye-end at the forward bell crank was wrong. Ron >>>>>>>> This is CF-ULD (nee N1005S) when I was operating it out of Palu, on Sulawesi, Indonesia, in around 1969. It started life as a 560, and I think it was our company that hung the GSO 480's on it to make it into a "680E". It had gone to our sister Company, Lockwood Survey Corporation Limited - in Toronto. There were few enough qualified survey pilots in those days, that we hardly paid attention to which company had what assignment. This was a former WWII Japanese fighter base with a bumpy 1,000 meter dirt strip. We always went out over gross (273 gallons in 17 cells, plus all the survey stuff - and this one had a big Doppler dish on the belly). The lower cap eventually fractured at station 22 on the port side (we dye checked both sides after every mission). After stripping the thing to the bones, I ferried it to Singapore, the closest factory authorized Commander repair station. The company elected to do the civilian (FAA approved) spar mod as opposed to the heavier - much more expensive survey mod. My colleague Bill Moriarty, some months later, ferried the machine to Brazil. My understanding is that the company had sold it to the Brazilian government. Last I heard, the excited new pilot came zooming low down the Amazon and did a pull-up to impress his friends - as the story goes; everything went up (momentarily) except the left wing. End of story - as I know it. I flew the other two collectively for probably a couple thousand hours and could bore a knot off a tree with the stories. I ferried 06S to the Factory with a cracked lower cap, and worked with engineer Jerry Germin (not sure of the spelling) to lend a survey pilot's perspective to the crafting of what became known as the survey mod. I do not know what became of 06S as I left the Company to form AeroGraphics Corp. (I put my money where my mouth was), and shortly thereafter LIA went out of business. You probably know that John Bratton (with his wife aboard) had the misfortune of going into the ocean off Anchorage with 41C. That was the best of our Commanders, and by far my favorite. Prior to Long Island Airways, I flew N9368R in local airline service for Stanley Pell (Commander Airlines, Inc.) The business was purchased by an 'enthusiast' named Sheldon Bash, and I was tasked to train Herb Baugh, who was Sheldon's primary instructor, to be the company's pilot. I recall that Herbie - at various times - put a bunch of wrinkles in the tin and shortened the life of a pair of beautiful engines (that Stanley babied) with his inability to stop pushing the throttles so as not to overboost on takeoff. When you spotted 06S at Luton, it was probably being ferried back from Saudi Arabia by Bill Moriarty, having completed several hundred thousand line miles of low level aero-magnetic survey. Finally: The name Doug Jacob does ring a bell, but in all honesty, I can't say that I remember why. Now that you've resurrected all these memories, it may come to me. Could it be that he was flying DC-3s for Bouraq? If so, then I do remember him. Kind regards, Ron >>>>>>>> I am curious. How much do you know about the flaw in the spar, and is info on that subject of interest, or available? The fact that it got into production the way it was made is, in my opinion, quite stupid. Could the idiotic radii in the lower cap at stations 22 and the lesser width in between have been the result of an ''oops" when they found they couldn't get the rear seat back erect (that was the prevailing myth)? It's always bothered me that the machine got into production with that obvious and deadly 'soft spot.' It was said that Bob Hoover's later aerobatic performances in the new design were a factory sponsored effort to overcome the bad rep that resulted from all the fractures (and, tragically, failures). Can you shed any light? Thanx, Ron >>>>>>>> Having lived with that anomaly daily for a good number of years, I like many of my contemporaries became quite intimately familiar with the physical realities of that particular weakness. I guess I'm somewhat over sensitive compared to many long-time Commander pilots, as we worked the hell out of the machines, and the two that were not somewhat 'babied' (that one being S/N 789-52) each developed fractures at sta. 22 during the time that I was operating them - one (S/N 605), at my hands. Having participated (in the role of 'seasoned' pilot and only for ideas, advice and commentary) at the factory in the crafting of the long strap 'survey-mod' applied to S/N 385-67 after ferrying it there (yet another almost funny story), I may be able to contribute to your efforts. How can it be that this major factory reconstruction event appears not to be recorded in your compilation (not a challenge, but rather a curiosity about the paper trail)? If you can find out how it came to be, I'd really like to know about it. Indeed - as I sit here, I'm kind of surprised that I don't. Have you seen the lower cap as it enters - passes through - and then leaves the fuselage? It looks like the afterthought of an imbecile ("Duh, we need more room at the back of the cabin. Let's cut away that metal bar, back to the flat part."). They did it again, out in the nacelles. That's part of what the survey mod was about. The fracture that develops in the radius at station 22 essentially severs the lower spar cap. That lower cap carries - under tension load - the weight of the airplane. The upper cap transmits the force of the tension back toward the longitudinal axis, as an approximately equal compression load on itself. In the entire wingspan, the spot where the tension load is at its' peak, is the place where they cut a radius into the metal that carries that load. The web (two vertically oriented plates of .060) holds the separation between upper and lower caps, providing the geometry to make all this work. Absent an external strap under the cap to bridge the fracture (and thereby take on the entire tension load) - the wing WILL break away from the airframe. The web will be simply torn in half like a piece of paper. Pease note: They were all strapped. That's why most of the fractures were not catastrophic. Look at any wing root just aft of the upper right corner of the cabin door. If the laminated .060 straps extend into the nacelle, then that's the survey mod - and its' ugly. Of all the many types of airplane I spent a lot of hours flying: Given its complexity, sophistication and its magnificent performance, operating and handling characteristics, none was overall as satisfying to me as the 680E. I dearly loved that breed of machine. I suspect that I have an experiential anecdote to cover most of the screwy things that could (indeed - did) go wrong while flying these machines. My family has given up on my ever writing a book about all this - with Steven, I think, being the last holdout. I look forward to your comments. With kind regards, Ron ________________________________________________________________________________
From: YOURTCFG(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 24, 2006
Subject: Re: Commander Wing Spars
I would be interested in a copy, maybe for the newsletter?? Thanks jb ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 25, 2006
Hi Moe, I've just booked my flights and the hotel in Dayton, plus I've reserved a car from Enterprise. I am arriving in Dayton a day or two early, as I am going to meet Greg Wartinger to have a look through some of the 'stuff' that Dick collected over the years. So, I thought that I can drive you around and you won't need to rent a car. If Lynn needs a car, I'm sure Enterprise will be able to add her, or your name, as a driver. I'm hoping to bring my Navman 'in-car' portable GPS system with me (provided I can load the map software OK!), so we shouldn't get lost!! If you think that'll work OK, let me know. And, I think it's only fair that I make some kind of contribution towards the fuel. I haven't checked a map of the US, but my feeling is that by dropping me off in Oklahoma City, you are taking yourself away from the route you would have normally taken. That makes me feel rather guilty and I will not be able to sleep at nights. Lunch is one thing, gallons & gallons of fuel is another!! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: Moe - Ross Racing Pistons To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:16 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Barry, I would not even consider letting you buy gas, and besides you bought lunch the last time in Jolly Old England. Regards, Moe ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:02 AM To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Moe, If you are absolutely certain that you are not going out of your way to drop me off, that will be simply great! There's quite a good restaurant at Wiley Post (KPWA), so I can treat you (both?) to a spot of late breakfast or lunch! It's literally a few yards walk from the FBO there. Let me know how much you need as the fuel contribution, and I'll make sure I bring enough pieces of the spendable paper! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: Moe - Ross Racing Pistons To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:05 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Barry, I should be leaving Dayton fairly early Sunday morning, and would be delighted to drop you off in Oakie City. This would be a good fuel stop for me, as I go back to Los Angeles. For many years I have had a "thing" about carry on luggage, and seldom take anything on the plane with me. Often I travel with a lot of hardware that couldn't go into the cabin in "the old days". If everything is well packed it travels quite well. I use the same basic technique that we use here at the piston factory.well packed but it should be quick and simple to unpack and repack by the airport inspectors. Foam can be easily cut with an electric knife to make excellent computer, cell phone, and camera packing structures. Regards, Moe ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:31 AM To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi All, If I'm able to attend this year's event, I'd like to ask whether anyone is going home on the Sunday (September 24th) via, or within driving distance of, Oklahoma City. If so, are they willing to drop me off there as talking freight? I will, of course, be more than willing to make a contribution towards the fuel costs. I would like to know whether this is a viable option, as I can then book all my flights accordingly. My getting there seems to be contingent on being allowed to take my camera equipment on board the flights as hand luggage, following the events of last week. Somehow, I don't think being forced to having them flown in the baggage hold is sensible, as they will then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. Very Best Regards, Barry ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "steve2" <steve2(at)sover.net>
Subject: It's about time.
Date: Aug 25, 2006
This just in from a friend. Don't know about where you all fly, but this has been getting out of hand in the northeast. It's about time. Steve The inane practice of using the phrase "any traffic please advise" has become so wide spread that the FAA has finally included a "do not do this" in the latest version of the AIM. You will find the following quote at paragraph 4-1-9 G 1 in the latest version of the AIM: Self-announce is a procedure whereby pilots broadcast their position or intended flight activity or ground operation on the designated CTAF. This procedure is used primarily at airports which do not have an FSS on the airport. The self-announce procedure should also be used if a pilot is unable to communicate with the FSS on the designated CTAF. Pilots stating, "Traffic in the area, please advise" is not a recognized Self-Announce Position and/or Intention phrase and should not be used under any condition. If you do not have a current copy of the AIM, you can reference one online at: http://www.faa.gov/ATPUBS/AIM/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Subject: It's about time.
Date: Aug 25, 2006
Steve- Amen. Having recently transferred from the airline side to the GA side- I'm simply astounded at the idiocy I see taking place at uncontrolled fields and it is frequently accompanied by that very "please advise" call. From guys who take off INTO OPPOSING TRAFFIC in order to save themselves 4 minutes of taxi time and 30 seconds of flight time, to guys who land straight-in while calling out their position and expecting those in the pattern to see-and-avoid. Makes me wish the warbird carried guns. Manually Applied Natural Selection. RSR _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of steve2 Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 07:33 Subject: Commander-List: It's about time. This just in from a friend. Don't know about where you all fly, but this has been getting out of hand in the northeast. It's about time. Steve The inane practice of using the phrase "any traffic please advise" has become so wide spread that the FAA has finally included a "do not do this" in the latest version of the AIM. You will find the following quote at paragraph 4-1-9 G 1 in the latest version of the AIM: Self-announce is a procedure whereby pilots broadcast their position or intended flight activity or ground operation on the designated CTAF. This procedure is used primarily at airports which do not have an FSS on the airport. The self-announce procedure should also be used if a pilot is unable to communicate with the FSS on the designated CTAF. Pilots stating, "Traffic in the area, please advise" is not a recognized Self-Announce Position and/or Intention phrase and should not be used under any condition. If you do not have a current copy of the AIM, you can reference one online at: <http://www.faa.gov/ATPUBS/AIM/> http://www.faa.gov/ATPUBS/AIM/ __________ NOD32 1.1725 (20060825) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Moe - Ross Racing Pistons" <moe(at)rosspistons.com>
Subject: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 25, 2006
Hi Barry, This sounds just great. I will be happy to ride around with you and save on the rental car! We are not quite sure of Linn's plans just yet. She has to be in Minnesota for business at about this time. She may drive down, or possibly will not show. For the time being, we are not pre-registering her. Presumably you will be staying at the Hampton Inn, as per the email of August 10th? Currently, plans are for me to arrive Thursday, September 21, around noon, although this may change. Let's stop bickering about the fuel. Best regards, Moe _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 5:51 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Moe, I've just booked my flights and the hotel in Dayton, plus I've reserved a car from Enterprise. I am arriving in Dayton a day or two early, as I am going to meet Greg Wartinger to have a look through some of the 'stuff' that Dick collected over the years. So, I thought that I can drive you around and you won't need to rent a car. If Lynn needs a car, I'm sure Enterprise will be able to add her, or your name, as a driver. I'm hoping to bring my Navman 'in-car' portable GPS system with me (provided I can load the map software OK!), so we shouldn't get lost!! If you think that'll work OK, let me know. And, I think it's only fair that I make some kind of contribution towards the fuel. I haven't checked a map of the US, but my feeling is that by dropping me off in Oklahoma City, you are taking yourself away from the route you would have normally taken. That makes me feel rather guilty and I will not be able to sleep at nights. Lunch is one thing, gallons & gallons of fuel is another!! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: Moe - Ross Racing <mailto:moe(at)rosspistons.com> Pistons Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:16 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Barry, I would not even consider letting you buy gas, and besides you bought lunch the last time in Jolly Old England. Regards, Moe _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:02 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Moe, If you are absolutely certain that you are not going out of your way to drop me off, that will be simply great! There's quite a good restaurant at Wiley Post (KPWA), so I can treat you (both?) to a spot of late breakfast or lunch! It's literally a few yards walk from the FBO there. Let me know how much you need as the fuel contribution, and I'll make sure I bring enough pieces of the spendable paper! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: Moe - Ross Racing <mailto:moe(at)rosspistons.com> Pistons Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:05 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Barry, I should be leaving Dayton fairly early Sunday morning, and would be delighted to drop you off in Oakie City. This would be a good fuel stop for me, as I go back to Los Angeles. For many years I have had a "thing" about carry on luggage, and seldom take anything on the plane with me. Often I travel with a lot of hardware that couldn't go into the cabin in "the old days". If everything is well packed it travels quite well. I use the same basic technique that we use here at the piston factory.well packed but it should be quick and simple to unpack and repack by the airport inspectors. Foam can be easily cut with an electric knife to make excellent computer, cell phone, and camera packing structures. Regards, Moe _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:31 AM Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi All, If I'm able to attend this year's event, I'd like to ask whether anyone is going home on the Sunday (September 24th) via, or within driving distance of, Oklahoma City. If so, are they willing to drop me off there as talking freight? I will, of course, be more than willing to make a contribution towards the fuel costs. I would like to know whether this is a viable option, as I can then book all my flights accordingly. My getting there seems to be contingent on being allowed to take my camera equipment on board the flights as hand luggage, following the events of last week. Somehow, I don't think being forced to having them flown in the baggage hold is sensible, as they will then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. Very Best Regards, Barry ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 25, 2006
From: Dan Farmer <daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Goodyear brakes
There is a set of Goodyear brakes on ebay. Search aero commander. dan farmer --------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com>
Subject: Commander Wing Spars
Date: Aug 25, 2006
Steve- Neat post, sir! It sounds like it would be some fun to sit with your dad over a few (beers/cokes/lemon-aids) and hear about some of that aerial work.... Thanks for posting... Rob _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of steve2 Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 07:23 Subject: Commander-List: Commander Wing Spars My Dad and I have always been fascinated by the Commander wing spars. It's an interesting story whose final chapter is perhaps not written. In the early years it wasn't corrosion, and I'm not so sure about the cold-bend theory, though it sounds plausible. (The cap was cold-bent?) The spar caps are radiused and this I thought was a major issue. The outer station that broke on the bathtubs wasn't in an area that was cold bent, right? Not being an engineer however, I'm not contributing to factual information by speculating. After 41 years and 9000 hours, some of it aerial survey work, we just went through our 500B wings at annual to give a thorough inspection to tighten and replace some smoking rivets on the top and bottom caps in various locations along the spar. About a year ago my Dad jotted down some notes to send to Barry Collman, with my dad still trying to learn more about the origins of the spar problem. I've read the Aussie reports, and heard a lot of speculation. I suspect there is someone out there that knows a hell of a lot more, but I thought I would include some edited messages that add another perspective, not of an engineer but of an old survey pilot. If nothing else it makes for a little good reading..... I've deleted anything of a personal nature. We don't operate or abuse aircraft anything like these guys did...... It was their job. What follows are a couple notes my Dad jotted down. Barry, I know my Dad enjoyed recollecting them after all these years. Steve >>>>>>>> I know the 680E family perhaps as well as anyone, having flown several of them to just short of eventual destruction, in low altitude (read 100 [that's one hundred] feet in all sorts of mountainous terrain, all over the world. Most of them had pods, booms and other assorted gadgets stuck on, and sticking out of them. I made the papers (in the US) from time to time, as local reporters dubbed the machines as "mystery ships." In fact we were doing commercial aero-magnetic surveys for multi-national corporations, and were not at liberty to talk about the work. The lower spar caps at stations 22 (for sure) and 144 (if I remember correctly) were deadly, and the planetary gear cases (77:120) on the GSO 480's (model B1A6) would come apart at the most inopportune moments. We actually launched a starboard propeller into the Red Sea - followed by having the Shah of Iran - Mohammed Rhezza Palavi - (spelled wrong, I'm sure) give us a brand new engine, a spare for his own 680-E. The dynamic counterweights on the crankshafts forced an interesting convention of pulling the mixtures instead of retarding the throttles, as to keep the iron wedges from breaking their positioning pins and tearing the entire engine to pieces - which happened frequently in survey service until we developed a trick. We used the pressurized air from the centrifugal blower to maintain compression, so that no instantaneous reversal of torque would result from the necessary termination of power. We had to keep the machine within 100 ft. of the down-slope of a cliff as we went to 'fine-bite', and threw out flaps & gear to retard the predictable increase in airspeed on the way down. It was kind of weird, needing to adjust the throttles to manage manifold pressure as altitude changed - while the engines were not even running. On the plus side, we never threw another counterweight. When the descent was done and power was again required, one simply pushed the mixture controls forward, and the noise came back. That's really about as exciting as the exercise ever got. It scared the hell out of visiting pilots, but there was really nothing to it. If there was a down-side, it was quite disconcerting to hear the creaks and clinks as the dimensions of the engines changed with the frightening rate of temperature drop that resulted from an absence of combustion - with no change in manifold pressure or RPM. Imagine - 48 inches at 3,800 RPM with no airspeed and the cylinder head temps pegged - while struggling to clear a peak; followed by a quick pitch down to maybe -30 degrees, pull the mixtures, all the rest, and then be entertained by the cylinder head temp needles hanging a quick left, and racing for their pegs. Interesting times. We were quite pleased to get 600 hours without a catastrophic failure. Notwithstanding, we usually ran them til they folded up anyway. Work time was premium - engines were (in terms of production time) cheap, and we operated (in the States) in the Restricted category. We always had spares crated and ready to ship. I ordered one to a job site in Nevada, thinking the port side was about finished. Two days later, the right one mulched the front gear assembly. Guess where we hung the spare (using a tow truck in the desert)? I know; sounds like baloney - but Steven has all the pictures. The port one ran (poorly) another hundred or so hours til we finally got back to ISP (home base). We changed that one before it caved in. I have a ton of this anecdotal and documented junk if you're interested. Steven has my full collection of slides, enough to bore anyone's spouse to death. Steven - Referring to the time I let our neighbor Tom Kanas first try a takeoff - perhaps you can scan or photocopy for Barry the M&D I sent to FAA after the starboard control yoke on 41C parted company from the elevator control rod. Our survival, you'll recall, generated a revision to several NTSB probable cause findings - changing them from pilot error, to component failure. You may recall they grounded the whole fleet while we convinced them that the factory spec for rigging the eye-end at the forward bell crank was wrong. Ron >>>>>>>> This is CF-ULD (nee N1005S) when I was operating it out of Palu, on Sulawesi, Indonesia, in around 1969. It started life as a 560, and I think it was our company that hung the GSO 480's on it to make it into a "680E". It had gone to our sister Company, Lockwood Survey Corporation Limited - in Toronto. There were few enough qualified survey pilots in those days, that we hardly paid attention to which company had what assignment. This was a former WWII Japanese fighter base with a bumpy 1,000 meter dirt strip. We always went out over gross (273 gallons in 17 cells, plus all the survey stuff - and this one had a big Doppler dish on the belly). The lower cap eventually fractured at station 22 on the port side (we dye checked both sides after every mission). After stripping the thing to the bones, I ferried it to Singapore, the closest factory authorized Commander repair station. The company elected to do the civilian (FAA approved) spar mod as opposed to the heavier - much more expensive survey mod. My colleague Bill Moriarty, some months later, ferried the machine to Brazil. My understanding is that the company had sold it to the Brazilian government. Last I heard, the excited new pilot came zooming low down the Amazon and did a pull-up to impress his friends - as the story goes; everything went up (momentarily) except the left wing. End of story - as I know it. I flew the other two collectively for probably a couple thousand hours and could bore a knot off a tree with the stories. I ferried 06S to the Factory with a cracked lower cap, and worked with engineer Jerry Germin (not sure of the spelling) to lend a survey pilot's perspective to the crafting of what became known as the survey mod. I do not know what became of 06S as I left the Company to form AeroGraphics Corp. (I put my money where my mouth was), and shortly thereafter LIA went out of business. You probably know that John Bratton (with his wife aboard) had the misfortune of going into the ocean off Anchorage with 41C. That was the best of our Commanders, and by far my favorite. Prior to Long Island Airways, I flew N9368R in local airline service for Stanley Pell (Commander Airlines, Inc.) The business was purchased by an 'enthusiast' named Sheldon Bash, and I was tasked to train Herb Baugh, who was Sheldon's primary instructor, to be the company's pilot. I recall that Herbie - at various times - put a bunch of wrinkles in the tin and shortened the life of a pair of beautiful engines (that Stanley babied) with his inability to stop pushing the throttles so as not to overboost on takeoff. When you spotted 06S at Luton, it was probably being ferried back from Saudi Arabia by Bill Moriarty, having completed several hundred thousand line miles of low level aero-magnetic survey. Finally: The name Doug Jacob does ring a bell, but in all honesty, I can't say that I remember why. Now that you've resurrected all these memories, it may come to me. Could it be that he was flying DC-3s for Bouraq? If so, then I do remember him. Kind regards, Ron >>>>>>>> I am curious. How much do you know about the flaw in the spar, and is info on that subject of interest, or available? The fact that it got into production the way it was made is, in my opinion, quite stupid. Could the idiotic radii in the lower cap at stations 22 and the lesser width in between have been the result of an ''oops" when they found they couldn't get the rear seat back erect (that was the prevailing myth)? It's always bothered me that the machine got into production with that obvious and deadly 'soft spot.' It was said that Bob Hoover's later aerobatic performances in the new design were a factory sponsored effort to overcome the bad rep that resulted from all the fractures (and, tragically, failures). Can you shed any light? Thanx, Ron >>>>>>>> Having lived with that anomaly daily for a good number of years, I like many of my contemporaries became quite intimately familiar with the physical realities of that particular weakness. I guess I'm somewhat over sensitive compared to many long-time Commander pilots, as we worked the hell out of the machines, and the two that were not somewhat 'babied' (that one being S/N 789-52) each developed fractures at sta. 22 during the time that I was operating them - one (S/N 605), at my hands. Having participated (in the role of 'seasoned' pilot and only for ideas, advice and commentary) at the factory in the crafting of the long strap 'survey-mod' applied to S/N 385-67 after ferrying it there (yet another almost funny story), I may be able to contribute to your efforts. How can it be that this major factory reconstruction event appears not to be recorded in your compilation (not a challenge, but rather a curiosity about the paper trail)? If you can find out how it came to be, I'd really like to know about it. Indeed - as I sit here, I'm kind of surprised that I don't. Have you seen the lower cap as it enters - passes through - and then leaves the fuselage? It looks like the afterthought of an imbecile ("Duh, we need more room at the back of the cabin. Let's cut away that metal bar, back to the flat part."). They did it again, out in the nacelles. That's part of what the survey mod was about. The fracture that develops in the radius at station 22 essentially severs the lower spar cap. That lower cap carries - under tension load - the weight of the airplane. The upper cap transmits the force of the tension back toward the longitudinal axis, as an approximately equal compression load on itself. In the entire wingspan, the spot where the tension load is at its' peak, is the place where they cut a radius into the metal that carries that load. The web (two vertically oriented plates of .060) holds the separation between upper and lower caps, providing the geometry to make all this work. Absent an external strap under the cap to bridge the fracture (and thereby take on the entire tension load) - the wing WILL break away from the airframe. The web will be simply torn in half like a piece of paper. Pease note: They were all strapped. That's why most of the fractures were not catastrophic. Look at any wing root just aft of the upper right corner of the cabin door. If the laminated .060 straps extend into the nacelle, then that's the survey mod - and its' ugly. Of all the many types of airplane I spent a lot of hours flying: Given its complexity, sophistication and its magnificent performance, operating and handling characteristics, none was overall as satisfying to me as the 680E. I dearly loved that breed of machine. I suspect that I have an experiential anecdote to cover most of the screwy things that could (indeed - did) go wrong while flying these machines. My family has given up on my ever writing a book about all this - with Steven, I think, being the last holdout. I look forward to your comments. With kind regards, Ron __________ NOD32 1.1723 (20060824) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk>
Subject: Re: 2006 Fly-In and Convention
Date: Aug 26, 2006
Hi Moe, Sounds good! Yes, I've reserved a room at the Hampton Inns. Looking forward to seeing you again, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: Moe - Ross Racing Pistons To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 9:41 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Barry, This sounds just great. I will be happy to ride around with you and save on the rental car! We are not quite sure of Linn's plans just yet. She has to be in Minnesota for business at about this time. She may drive down, or possibly will not show. For the time being, we are not pre-registering her. Presumably you will be staying at the Hampton Inn, as per the email of August 10th? Currently, plans are for me to arrive Thursday, September 21, around noon, although this may change. Let's stop bickering about the fuel. Best regards, Moe ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 5:51 AM To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Moe, I've just booked my flights and the hotel in Dayton, plus I've reserved a car from Enterprise. I am arriving in Dayton a day or two early, as I am going to meet Greg Wartinger to have a look through some of the 'stuff' that Dick collected over the years. So, I thought that I can drive you around and you won't need to rent a car. If Lynn needs a car, I'm sure Enterprise will be able to add her, or your name, as a driver. I'm hoping to bring my Navman 'in-car' portable GPS system with me (provided I can load the map software OK!), so we shouldn't get lost!! If you think that'll work OK, let me know. And, I think it's only fair that I make some kind of contribution towards the fuel. I haven't checked a map of the US, but my feeling is that by dropping me off in Oklahoma City, you are taking yourself away from the route you would have normally taken. That makes me feel rather guilty and I will not be able to sleep at nights. Lunch is one thing, gallons & gallons of fuel is another!! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: Moe - Ross Racing Pistons To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:16 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Barry, I would not even consider letting you buy gas, and besides you bought lunch the last time in Jolly Old England. Regards, Moe ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 8:02 AM To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Moe, If you are absolutely certain that you are not going out of your way to drop me off, that will be simply great! There's quite a good restaurant at Wiley Post (KPWA), so I can treat you (both?) to a spot of late breakfast or lunch! It's literally a few yards walk from the FBO there. Let me know how much you need as the fuel contribution, and I'll make sure I bring enough pieces of the spendable paper! Sincere Best Regards, Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: Moe - Ross Racing Pistons To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:05 PM Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi Barry, I should be leaving Dayton fairly early Sunday morning, and would be delighted to drop you off in Oakie City. This would be a good fuel stop for me, as I go back to Los Angeles. For many years I have had a "thing" about carry on luggage, and seldom take anything on the plane with me. Often I travel with a lot of hardware that couldn't go into the cabin in "the old days". If everything is well packed it travels quite well. I use the same basic technique that we use here at the piston factory.well packed but it should be quick and simple to unpack and repack by the airport inspectors. Foam can be easily cut with an electric knife to make excellent computer, cell phone, and camera packing structures. Regards, Moe ------------------------------------------------------------------------- - From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Collman Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 2:31 AM To: commander-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: Commander-List: 2006 Fly-In and Convention Hi All, If I'm able to attend this year's event, I'd like to ask whether anyone is going home on the Sunday (September 24th) via, or within driving distance of, Oklahoma City. If so, are they willing to drop me off there as talking freight? I will, of course, be more than willing to make a contribution towards the fuel costs. I would like to know whether this is a viable option, as I can then book all my flights accordingly. My getting there seems to be contingent on being allowed to take my camera equipment on board the flights as hand luggage, following the events of last week. Somehow, I don't think being forced to having them flown in the baggage hold is sensible, as they will then run the risk of going missing, being pilfered, or damaged. Very Best Regards, Barry ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Bow" <bowing74(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Goodyear brakes
Date: Aug 26, 2006
I didn't know you could sell them. bilbo _____ From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dan Farmer Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 10:19 PM Subject: Commander-List: Goodyear brakes There is a set of Goodyear brakes on ebay. Search aero commander. dan farmer _____ <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=42974/*http:/www.yahoo.com/preview> out. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 26, 2006
From: Dave Phifer <dave(at)phifersystems.com>
Subject: Paint schemes
With all the (depressing) talk about wings spars, how 'bout something more fun. I am looking at having my newly acquired 500B painted and have been scouring the internet looking at paint schemes. I am looking for something "clean", i.e., not too wild as the plane will be used for business travel. I'm having trouble finding one that says, "that's it."


July 24, 2006 - August 26, 2006

Commander-Archive.digest.vol-cd