Commander-Archive.digest.vol-di
March 23, 2009 - April 28, 2009
Somebody knows where I can get one at a reasonable price
Yhanks
--------
Andrew P Geraghty
Corona CA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=235397#235397
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve at Col-East" <steve2(at)sover.net> |
| Subject: | Great Day, Great Photos |
Hey Commander gang,
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is one of
those guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of
airliners for sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells
photos on the web and to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did
something I had been meaning to do for a long time. We were able to pick
him up outside Boston and take him with us for a day. I was glad to do
it, and we had a nice surprise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New
Hampshire, but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance, which I
think he enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut, where a
friendly Piaggio crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close
to. (These things have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island, we
dropped down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the
VFR corridor, passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their
arrivals, and passing all of the other famous landmarks like Coney
Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano
Bridge into New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess,
with some of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of
Lower Manhattan looking east, midtown, uptown, the Intrepid Museum. (A
national tradegy the Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They
should have been put right back up again.) Very busy with helicopter
traffic. Really busy. (I always forget the copter guys use the Lincoln
and Holland Tunnels for callout positions. Whose idea was that? How do
you locate a *&^%$& tunnel from the air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx, so I had to
call up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey
location. Gave Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington
Bridge, and a tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to
intercept our line to the northeast and sneak under departing LGA
traffic, and then back to Worcester to drop Dan off, and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember how
to do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put your
cursor in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <andrew.bridget(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Great Day, Great Photos |
You're right, Steve: great pictures! Wow! Thanks for posting.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com> |
| Subject: | Great Day, Great Photos |
Steve,
Tell Shaun's bro that those are great pics! You're making me miss my
homeland..I grew up on the north shore of Long Island and I still love NY
and visit every summer. NYC is an incredible place! It sure looks like you
had picture perfect weather too. Plus, as a Commander pilot I never get
tired of "spinner shots". How many times have I looked out my window and
seen myself reflected in the spinner, and just had to give myself a Thumbs
Up (check out that handsome devil lucky enough to fly this bad@ss piece of
machinery!).
I find it amusing that NY pilots use tunnels as landmarks. If that isn't
NY-pilot elitism, I don't know what is. New Yorkers are all the same.
Doesn't matter if you drive a hot dog stand, a cab or an aircraft.
As far as the Piaggio P-180 (the "flying Catfish"), I've heard that it is a
very nice-flying airplane. I've also heard that if you can see the end of
the runway, it's not nearly long enough. Even on a cold day. Oh well,
airplanes are always give-and-take. They sure are fast for a prop plane.
/J
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve at
Col-East
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:09 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Hey Commander gang,
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is one of
those guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of airliners
for sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells photos on the web
and to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did something I had been
meaning to do for a long time. We were able to pick him up outside Boston
and take him with us for a day. I was glad to do it, and we had a nice
surprise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New
Hampshire, but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance, which I think
he enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut, where a friendly Piaggio
crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close to. (These things
have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island, we dropped
down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the VFR corridor,
passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their arrivals, and passing
all of the other famous landmarks like Coney Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano Bridge
into New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess, with some
of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of Lower Manhattan
looking east, midtown, uptown, the Intrepid Museum. (A national tradegy the
Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They should have been put right
back up again.) Very busy with helicopter traffic. Really busy. (I always
forget the copter guys use the Lincoln and Holland Tunnels for callout
positions. Whose idea was that? How do you locate a *&^%$& tunnel from the
air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx, so I had to call
up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey location. Gave
Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington Bridge, and a
tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to intercept our line to the
northeast and sneak under departing LGA traffic, and then back to Worcester
to drop Dan off, and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember how to
do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put your cursor
in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
| Subject: | Great Day, Great Photos |
Great story, Steve. Thanks
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve at
Col-East
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:09 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Hey Commander gang,
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is one of
those guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of airliners
for sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells photos on the web
and to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did something I had been
meaning to do for a long time. We were able to pick him up outside Boston
and take him with us for a day. I was glad to do it, and we had a nice
surprise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New
Hampshire, but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance, which I think
he enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut, where a friendly Piaggio
crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close to. (These things
have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island, we dropped
down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the VFR corridor,
passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their arrivals, and passing
all of the other famous landmarks like Coney Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano Bridge
into New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess, with some
of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of Lower Manhattan
looking east, midtown, uptown, the Intrepid Museum. (A national tradegy the
Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They should have been put right
back up again.) Very busy with helicopter traffic. Really busy. (I always
forget the copter guys use the Lincoln and Holland Tunnels for callout
positions. Whose idea was that? How do you locate a *&^%$& tunnel from the
air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx, so I had to call
up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey location. Gave
Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington Bridge, and a
tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to intercept our line to the
northeast and sneak under departing LGA traffic, and then back to Worcester
to drop Dan off, and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember how to
do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put your cursor
in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
| Subject: | Great Day, Great Photos |
John,
I was wondering about the maintenance remark concerning the Piaggio's. I
stopped at our local watering hole (Camarillo, CA) the other day and saw the
local Piaggio being serviced. There were a lot of folks around the 180
working things here and dabbing things there to get it ready for the next
flight. Maybe someone on the list would know if it's really such a good
option to a jet. I have taken a fancy to the Premier because of its speed,
but, as you said, there are always tradeoffs.
Nico
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Vormbaum
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 9:50 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Steve,
Tell Shaun's bro that those are great pics! You're making me miss my
homeland..I grew up on the north shore of Long Island and I still love NY
and visit every summer. NYC is an incredible place! It sure looks like you
had picture perfect weather too. Plus, as a Commander pilot I never get
tired of "spinner shots". How many times have I looked out my window and
seen myself reflected in the spinner, and just had to give myself a Thumbs
Up (check out that handsome devil lucky enough to fly this bad@ss piece of
machinery!).
I find it amusing that NY pilots use tunnels as landmarks. If that isn't
NY-pilot elitism, I don't know what is. New Yorkers are all the same.
Doesn't matter if you drive a hot dog stand, a cab or an aircraft.
As far as the Piaggio P-180 (the "flying Catfish"), I've heard that it is a
very nice-flying airplane. I've also heard that if you can see the end of
the runway, it's not nearly long enough. Even on a cold day. Oh well,
airplanes are always give-and-take. They sure are fast for a prop plane.
/J
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve at
Col-East
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:09 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Hey Commander gang,
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is one of
those guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of airliners
for sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells photos on the web
and to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did something I had been
meaning to do for a long time. We were able to pick him up outside Boston
and take him with us for a day. I was glad to do it, and we had a nice
surprise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New
Hampshire, but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance, which I think
he enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut, where a friendly Piaggio
crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close to. (These things
have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island, we dropped
down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the VFR corridor,
passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their arrivals, and passing
all of the other famous landmarks like Coney Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano Bridge
into New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess, with some
of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of Lower Manhattan
looking east, midtown, uptown, the Intrepid Museum. (A national tradegy the
Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They should have been put right
back up again.) Very busy with helicopter traffic. Really busy. (I always
forget the copter guys use the Lincoln and Holland Tunnels for callout
positions. Whose idea was that? How do you locate a *&^%$& tunnel from the
air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx, so I had to call
up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey location. Gave
Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington Bridge, and a
tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to intercept our line to the
northeast and sneak under departing LGA traffic, and then back to Worcester
to drop Dan off, and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember how to
do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put your cursor
in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve W" <steve2(at)sover.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Great Day, Great Photos |
Nico, Col-East is next door to Turboprops East. They are a regional King
Air fix-it shop, but they picked up a regional franchise for Piaggio
repair and maintenance. Some of the fellas went over to Italy for
training. There seems to be some things that are peculiar about the
aircraft's maintenance, but I've become somewhat familiar with the
comings and goings of particular aircraft, and they don't seem to be
hanger queens. I wouldn't base my buying decision on that information!
The surfaces of the thing are faired with compound to keep it slick.
During maintenenance some of that needs to be redone.
They seemed really weird at first, but after being inside one (both the
front and the back), it looks like a really nice place to be (great
visibility), and the crews I spoke with really liked it. One of the
pilots comes in out of Westchester(?) that I believe used to fly for
John Towner. He'll wander over from time to time to again get up close
to a 500B.
The pusher props have a unique crackle in the pattern, and they do
approach pretty fast, but even with our displaced threshold (3000
something useable) and hills in the way, they do ok.
Over 400 knots!
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: nico css
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2009 1:25 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
John,
I was wondering about the maintenance remark concerning the Piaggio's.
I stopped at our local watering hole (Camarillo, CA) the other day and
saw the local Piaggio being serviced. There were a lot of folks around
the 180 working things here and dabbing things there to get it ready for
the next flight. Maybe someone on the list would know if it's really
such a good option to a jet. I have taken a fancy to the Premier because
of its speed, but, as you said, there are always tradeoffs.
Nico
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Vormbaum
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 9:50 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Steve,
Tell Shaun's bro that those are great pics! You're making me miss my
homeland..I grew up on the north shore of Long Island and I still love
NY and visit every summer. NYC is an incredible place! It sure looks
like you had picture perfect weather too. Plus, as a Commander pilot I
never get tired of "spinner shots". How many times have I looked out my
window and seen myself reflected in the spinner, and just had to give
myself a Thumbs Up (check out that handsome devil lucky enough to fly
this bad@ss piece of machinery!).
I find it amusing that NY pilots use tunnels as landmarks. If that
isn't NY-pilot elitism, I don't know what is. New Yorkers are all the
same. Doesn't matter if you drive a hot dog stand, a cab or an aircraft.
As far as the Piaggio P-180 (the "flying Catfish"), I've heard that it
is a very nice-flying airplane. I've also heard that if you can see the
end of the runway, it's not nearly long enough. Even on a cold day. Oh
well, airplanes are always give-and-take. They sure are fast for a prop
plane.
/J
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve at
Col-East
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:09 AM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Hey Commander gang,
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is one
of those guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of
airliners for sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells
photos on the web and to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did
something I had been meaning to do for a long time. We were able to pick
him up outside Boston and take him with us for a day. I was glad to do
it, and we had a nice surprise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New
Hampshire, but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance, which I
think he enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut, where a
friendly Piaggio crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close
to. (These things have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island, we
dropped down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the
VFR corridor, passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their
arrivals, and passing all of the other famous landmarks like Coney
Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano
Bridge into New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess,
with some of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of
Lower Manhattan looking east, midtown, uptown, the Intrepid Museum. (A
national tradegy the Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They
should have been put right back up again.) Very busy with helicopter
traffic. Really busy. (I always forget the copter guys use the Lincoln
and Holland Tunnels for callout positions. Whose idea was that? How do
you locate a *&^%$& tunnel from the air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx, so I had to
call up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey
location. Gave Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington
Bridge, and a tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to
intercept our line to the northeast and sneak under departing LGA
traffic, and then back to Worcester to drop Dan off, and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember
how to do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put
your cursor in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhttp://forums.matronics.
comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve W" <steve2(at)sover.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Great Day, Great Photos |
Glad folks liked the pictures.
Hi John! It is an awesome place, isn't it! Back when the LIRR was
running diesels on the southern line, as kids we'd jump on a train and
ride in to go listen to jazz or spend time doing whatever it was we did.
I remember riding between the cars on the way home watching the scenery
flash by in the dark. Or maybe take the old '67 Cougar or Diplomat
(ex-police!) through the Queens-Midtown tunnel and mash the peddle to
the floor to hear the secondaries howl. Two weeks ago I drove the
pick-em up truck down from Vermont to Brooklyn to visit a jazz musician
friend. I still love the place. When I called up Lagaurdia tower to get
their fax number, the controller yelled to his buddy "Hey Tony, what's
our fax number?" Perfect...... You're right on about New Yorkers from
and around the City. (It is nice going home to my Vermont hilltop.)
I moved from the south shore to the north, out to Rocky Point before
leaving LI. A friend there still sails out of Mt. Sinai Harbor (another
mapping pilot). Still love the north shore, used to have a little Fiat
X1/9, perfect for those roads with it's raging 1.5 liter engine. I could
walk down to the cliffs and watch nor'easters blow in.
John if you come out east, do visit.
While in the air I told Dan about Commander 'spinner shots'. From every
point of the globe there are those shots. Out of all the photos, I
thought #25 was the best one. Dan is going to post that one to
Airliners.net and he thinks it will be popular.
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: John Vormbaum
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2009 12:49 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Steve,
Tell Shaun's bro that those are great pics! You're making me miss my
homeland..I grew up on the north shore of Long Island and I still love
NY and visit every summer. NYC is an incredible place! It sure looks
like you had picture perfect weather too. Plus, as a Commander pilot I
never get tired of "spinner shots". How many times have I looked out my
window and seen myself reflected in the spinner, and just had to give
myself a Thumbs Up (check out that handsome devil lucky enough to fly
this bad@ss piece of machinery!).
I find it amusing that NY pilots use tunnels as landmarks. If that
isn't NY-pilot elitism, I don't know what is. New Yorkers are all the
same. Doesn't matter if you drive a hot dog stand, a cab or an aircraft.
As far as the Piaggio P-180 (the "flying Catfish"), I've heard that it
is a very nice-flying airplane. I've also heard that if you can see the
end of the runway, it's not nearly long enough. Even on a cold day. Oh
well, airplanes are always give-and-take. They sure are fast for a prop
plane.
/J
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve at
Col-East
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:09 AM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Hey Commander gang,
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is one
of those guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of
airliners for sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells
photos on the web and to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did
something I had been meaning to do for a long time. We were able to pick
him up outside Boston and take him with us for a day. I was glad to do
it, and we had a nice surprise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New
Hampshire, but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance, which I
think he enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut, where a
friendly Piaggio crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close
to. (These things have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island, we
dropped down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the
VFR corridor, passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their
arrivals, and passing all of the other famous landmarks like Coney
Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano
Bridge into New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess,
with some of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of
Lower Manhattan looking east, midtown, uptown, the Intrepid Museum. (A
national tradegy the Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They
should have been put right back up again.) Very busy with helicopter
traffic. Really busy. (I always forget the copter guys use the Lincoln
and Holland Tunnels for callout positions. Whose idea was that? How do
you locate a *&^%$& tunnel from the air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx, so I had to
call up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey
location. Gave Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington
Bridge, and a tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to
intercept our line to the northeast and sneak under departing LGA
traffic, and then back to Worcester to drop Dan off, and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember
how to do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put
your cursor in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhttp://forums.matronics.
comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com> |
| Subject: | Great Day, Great Photos |
We still have beach property on the north shore...in fact, I married my wife
there. LI is an awesome place, from April to October. The rest of the year
I'm happy to stay here in CA.
I'll definitely ring you up when I'm there. I've been meaning to fly my 500B
out there, maybe this will be the year....
/J
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve W
Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2009 4:38 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Glad folks liked the pictures.
Hi John! It is an awesome place, isn't it! Back when the LIRR was running
diesels on the southern line, as kids we'd jump on a train and ride in to go
listen to jazz or spend time doing whatever it was we did. I remember riding
between the cars on the way home watching the scenery flash by in the dark.
Or maybe take the old '67 Cougar or Diplomat (ex-police!) through the
Queens-Midtown tunnel and mash the peddle to the floor to hear the
secondaries howl. Two weeks ago I drove the pick-em up truck down from
Vermont to Brooklyn to visit a jazz musician friend. I still love the place.
When I called up Lagaurdia tower to get their fax number, the controller
yelled to his buddy "Hey Tony, what's our fax number?" Perfect...... You're
right on about New Yorkers from and around the City. (It is nice going home
to my Vermont hilltop.)
I moved from the south shore to the north, out to Rocky Point before leaving
LI. A friend there still sails out of Mt. Sinai Harbor (another mapping
pilot). Still love the north shore, used to have a little Fiat X1/9, perfect
for those roads with it's raging 1.5 liter engine. I could walk down to the
cliffs and watch nor'easters blow in.
John if you come out east, do visit.
While in the air I told Dan about Commander 'spinner shots'. From every
point of the globe there are those shots. Out of all the photos, I thought
#25 was the best one. Dan is going to post that one to Airliners.net and he
thinks it will be popular.
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: John Vormbaum <mailto:john(at)vormbaum.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2009 12:49 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Steve,
Tell Shaun's bro that those are great pics! You're making me miss my
homeland..I grew up on the north shore of Long Island and I still love NY
and visit every summer. NYC is an incredible place! It sure looks like you
had picture perfect weather too. Plus, as a Commander pilot I never get
tired of "spinner shots". How many times have I looked out my window and
seen myself reflected in the spinner, and just had to give myself a Thumbs
Up (check out that handsome devil lucky enough to fly this bad@ss piece of
machinery!).
I find it amusing that NY pilots use tunnels as landmarks. If that isn't
NY-pilot elitism, I don't know what is. New Yorkers are all the same.
Doesn't matter if you drive a hot dog stand, a cab or an aircraft.
As far as the Piaggio P-180 (the "flying Catfish"), I've heard that it is a
very nice-flying airplane. I've also heard that if you can see the end of
the runway, it's not nearly long enough. Even on a cold day. Oh well,
airplanes are always give-and-take. They sure are fast for a prop plane.
/J
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve at
Col-East
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:09 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Hey Commander gang,
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is one of
those guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of airliners
for sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells photos on the web
and to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did something I had been
meaning to do for a long time. We were able to pick him up outside Boston
and take him with us for a day. I was glad to do it, and we had a nice
surprise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New
Hampshire, but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance, which I think
he enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut, where a friendly Piaggio
crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close to. (These things
have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island, we dropped
down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the VFR corridor,
passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their arrivals, and passing
all of the other famous landmarks like Coney Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano Bridge
into New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess, with some
of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of Lower Manhattan
looking east, midtown, uptown, the Intrepid Museum. (A national tradegy the
Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They should have been put right
back up again.) Very busy with helicopter traffic. Really busy. (I always
forget the copter guys use the Lincoln and Holland Tunnels for callout
positions. Whose idea was that? How do you locate a *&^%$& tunnel from the
air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx, so I had to call
up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey location. Gave
Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington Bridge, and a
tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to intercept our line to the
northeast and sneak under departing LGA traffic, and then back to Worcester
to drop Dan off, and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember how to
do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put your cursor
in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "L D GIROD" <dongirod(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Great Day, Great Photos |
I pulled up the Piaggio's P-180 II, web page and it stated it needed
less than 3000 feet for takeoff and landing, not as good as my
Commander, but not bad for a plane that grosses at 12K., will climb to
41K and go 400Kts. Saw everything but a price tag. Probably a reason!
Don
----- Original Message -----
From: nico css
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2009 1:25 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
John,
I was wondering about the maintenance remark concerning the Piaggio's.
I stopped at our local watering hole (Camarillo, CA) the other day and
saw the local Piaggio being serviced. There were a lot of folks around
the 180 working things here and dabbing things there to get it ready for
the next flight. Maybe someone on the list would know if it's really
such a good option to a jet. I have taken a fancy to the Premier because
of its speed, but, as you said, there are always tradeoffs.
Nico
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Vormbaum
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 9:50 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Steve,
Tell Shaun's bro that those are great pics! You're making me miss my
homeland..I grew up on the north shore of Long Island and I still love
NY and visit every summer. NYC is an incredible place! It sure looks
like you had picture perfect weather too. Plus, as a Commander pilot I
never get tired of "spinner shots". How many times have I looked out my
window and seen myself reflected in the spinner, and just had to give
myself a Thumbs Up (check out that handsome devil lucky enough to fly
this bad@ss piece of machinery!).
I find it amusing that NY pilots use tunnels as landmarks. If that
isn't NY-pilot elitism, I don't know what is. New Yorkers are all the
same. Doesn't matter if you drive a hot dog stand, a cab or an aircraft.
As far as the Piaggio P-180 (the "flying Catfish"), I've heard that it
is a very nice-flying airplane. I've also heard that if you can see the
end of the runway, it's not nearly long enough. Even on a cold day. Oh
well, airplanes are always give-and-take. They sure are fast for a prop
plane.
/J
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve at
Col-East
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:09 AM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Hey Commander gang,
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is one
of those guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of
airliners for sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells
photos on the web and to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did
something I had been meaning to do for a long time. We were able to pick
him up outside Boston and take him with us for a day. I was glad to do
it, and we had a nice surprise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New
Hampshire, but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance, which I
think he enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut, where a
friendly Piaggio crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close
to. (These things have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island, we
dropped down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the
VFR corridor, passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their
arrivals, and passing all of the other famous landmarks like Coney
Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano
Bridge into New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess,
with some of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of
Lower Manhattan looking east, midtown, uptown, the Intrepid Museum. (A
national tradegy the Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They
should have been put right back up again.) Very busy with helicopter
traffic. Really busy. (I always forget the copter guys use the Lincoln
and Holland Tunnels for callout positions. Whose idea was that? How do
you locate a *&^%$& tunnel from the air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx, so I had to
call up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey
location. Gave Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington
Bridge, and a tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to
intercept our line to the northeast and sneak under departing LGA
traffic, and then back to Worcester to drop Dan off, and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember
how to do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put
your cursor in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhttp://forums.matronics.
comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Donnie Rose <aquadiver99(at)yahoo.com> |
Anyone have- an overhauled manifold pressure gauge for trade? Mine has a
sticky needle.=0A=0Athanks=0A=0A-=0ADonnie Rose =0A205/492-8444=0A=0A=0A
=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
| Subject: | He cannot be serious. Let's negotiate... |
<http://www.tangle.com/view_video.php?viewkey=0861ff3eabea1ceb73e4>
http://www.tangle.com/view_video.php?viewkey=0861ff3eabea1ceb73e4
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Moe-rosspistons" <moe-rosspistons(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Great Day, Great Photos |
Steve,
Thanks for posting the photos. My wife, Linn, particularly enjoyed
them. One of her former husbands was the Base Commander of Fort
Hamilton back in the early 90's and she lived in quarters one, which can
be seen in the lower left portion of the Ft. Hamilton photo. Later she
moved to Bay Ridge (Brooklyn) and had a condo that faced Wall Street
across the water.
The quality of the photos is outstanding.
Best regards,
Moe
N680RR
Proud Holder of The Golden Pedal Award.
From: Steve at Col-East
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:08 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Hey Commander gang,
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is one of
those guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of
airliners for sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells
photos on the web and to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did
something I had been meaning to do for a long time. We were able to pick
him up outside Boston and take him with us for a day. I was glad to do
it, and we had a nice surprise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New
Hampshire, but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance, which I
think he enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut, where a
friendly Piaggio crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close
to. (These things have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island, we
dropped down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the
VFR corridor, passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their
arrivals, and passing all of the other famous landmarks like Coney
Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano
Bridge into New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess,
with some of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of
Lower Manhattan looking east, midtown, uptown, the Intrepid Museum. (A
national tradegy the Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They
should have been put right back up again.) Very busy with helicopter
traffic. Really busy. (I always forget the copter guys use the Lincoln
and Holland Tunnels for callout positions. Whose idea was that? How do
you locate a *&^%$& tunnel from the air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx, so I had to
call up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey
location. Gave Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington
Bridge, and a tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to
intercept our line to the northeast and sneak under departing LGA
traffic, and then back to Worcester to drop Dan off, and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember how
to do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put your
cursor in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Moe-rosspistons" <moe-rosspistons(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Great Day, Great Photos |
John,
You are right on with your comments about admiring yourself in the
spinners on the Commander. This weekend I will be flying back to Los
Angeles and I am going over to L19 today to polish the spinners on
N680RR,
Regards,
Moe Mills
N680RR
680Fp
Proud Holder of The Golden Pedal Award
From: John Vormbaum
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 9:49 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Steve,
Tell Shaun's bro that those are great pics! You're making me miss my
homeland..I grew up on the north shore of Long Island and I still love
NY and visit every summer. NYC is an incredible place! It sure looks
like you had picture perfect weather too. Plus, as a Commander pilot I
never get tired of "spinner shots". How many times have I looked out my
window and seen myself reflected in the spinner, and just had to give
myself a Thumbs Up (check out that handsome devil lucky enough to fly
this bad@ss piece of machinery!).
I find it amusing that NY pilots use tunnels as landmarks. If that isn't
NY-pilot elitism, I don't know what is. New Yorkers are all the same.
Doesn't matter if you drive a hot dog stand, a cab or an aircraft.
As far as the Piaggio P-180 (the "flying Catfish"), I've heard that it
is a very nice-flying airplane. I've also heard that if you can see the
end of the runway, it's not nearly long enough. Even on a cold day. Oh
well, airplanes are always give-and-take. They sure are fast for a prop
plane.
/J
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve at
Col-East
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:09 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Hey Commander gang,
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is one of
those guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of
airliners for sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells
photos on the web and to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did
something I had been meaning to do for a long time. We were able to pick
him up outside Boston and take him with us for a day. I was glad to do
it, and we had a nice surprise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New
Hampshire, but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance, which I
think he enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut, where a
friendly Piaggio crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close
to. (These things have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island, we
dropped down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the
VFR corridor, passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their
arrivals, and passing all of the other famous landmarks like Coney
Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano
Bridge into New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess,
with some of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of
Lower Manhattan looking east, midtown, uptown, the Intrepid Museum. (A
national tradegy the Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They
should have been put right back up again.) Very busy with helicopter
traffic. Really busy. (I always forget the copter guys use the Lincoln
and Holland Tunnels for callout positions. Whose idea was that? How do
you locate a *&^%$& tunnel from the air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx, so I had to
call up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey
location. Gave Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington
Bridge, and a tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to
intercept our line to the northeast and sneak under departing LGA
traffic, and then back to Worcester to drop Dan off, and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember how
to do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put your
cursor in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhttp://forums.matronics.
comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MASON CHEVAILLIER <kamala(at)MSN.COM> |
| Subject: | Great Day, Great Photos |
mm=2C what do you do to polish your spinners? gmc
From: moe-rosspistons(at)hotmail.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Great Day=2C Great Photos
Date: Wed=2C 25 Mar 2009 05:11:03 -0700
John=2C
You are right on with your comments about admiring yourself in the spinners
on the Commander. This weekend I will be flying back to Los Angeles and I
am going over to L19 today to polish the spinners on N680RR=2C
Regards=2C
Moe Mills
N680RR
680Fp
Proud Holder of The Golden Pedal Award
From: John Vormbaum
Sent: Monday=2C March 23=2C 2009 9:49 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Great Day=2C Great Photos
Steve=2C
Tell Shaun=92s bro that those are great pics! You=92re making me miss my ho
meland=85.I grew up on the north shore of Long Island and I still love NY a
nd visit every summer. NYC is an incredible place! It sure looks like you h
ad picture perfect weather too. Plus=2C as a Commander pilot I never get ti
red of =93spinner shots=94. How many times have I looked out my window and
seen myself reflected in the spinner=2C and just had to give myself a Thumb
s Up (check out that handsome devil lucky enough to fly this bad@ss piece o
f machinery!).
I find it amusing that NY pilots use tunnels as landmarks. If that isn=92t
NY-pilot elitism=2C I don=92t know what is. New Yorkers are all the same. D
oesn=92t matter if you drive a hot dog stand=2C a cab or an aircraft.
As far as the Piaggio P-180 (the =93flying Catfish=94)=2C I=92ve heard that
it is a very nice-flying airplane. I=92ve also heard that if you can see t
he end of the runway=2C it=92s not nearly long enough. Even on a cold day.
Oh well=2C airplanes are always give-and-take. They sure are fast for a pro
p plane.
/J
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-lis
t-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve at Col-East
Sent: Monday=2C March 23=2C 2009 7:09 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Great Day=2C Great Photos
Hey Commander gang=2C
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is one of th
ose guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of airliners for
sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells photos on the web a
nd to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did something I had been me
aning to do for a long time. We were able to pick him up outside Boston and
take him with us for a day. I was glad to do it=2C and we had a nice surpr
ise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New Hampsh
ire=2C but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance=2C which I think h
e enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut=2C where a friendly Piagg
io crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close to. (These thing
s have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island=2C we droppe
d down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the VFR corrido
r=2C passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their arrivals=2C and pa
ssing all of the other famous landmarks like Coney Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano Bridge i
nto New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess=2C with some
of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of Lower Manhatt
an looking east=2C midtown=2C uptown=2C the Intrepid Museum. (A national tr
adegy the Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They should have been
put right back up again.) Very busy with helicopter traffic. Really busy.
(I always forget the copter guys use the Lincoln and Holland Tunnels for ca
llout positions. Whose idea was that? How do you locate a *&^%$& tunnel fro
m the air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx=2C so I had to cal
l up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey location. G
ave Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington Bridge=2C and
a tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to intercept our line to
the northeast and sneak under departing LGA traffic=2C and then back to Wor
cester to drop Dan off=2C and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember how to
do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put your curs
or in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhttp://forums.matronics
.comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matro
nics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Great Day, Great Photos |
Hi Guys,
On the subject of spinner shots, I took one (from the r/h seat!) when
Capt JimBob flew me from the Fly-In at Kansas City in September 2004.
I happened to look at it again a few days ago and was staggered to see
that 65,835 distinct hits have been notched up.
This means that nearly 66,000 different people have not just look at the
thumbnail image, but have clicked to get a "Large" format view.
You guys can help bump the number up more by searching on "N222JS" or
"Photo ID 0902631".
I'll be checking daily guys, so don't let me down.
Use your PC, ones at work, at your neighbors - *anywhere* ;-)
Best Regards,
Barry
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
From: moe-rosspistons(at)hotmail.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 05:11:03 -0700
John,
You are right on with your comments about admiring yourself in the
spinners on the Commander. This weekend I will be flying back to Los
Angeles and I am going over to L19 today to polish the spinners on
N680RR,
Regards,
Moe Mills
N680RR
680Fp
Proud Holder of The Golden Pedal Award
From: John Vormbaum
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 9:49 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Steve,
Tell Shaun=92s bro that those are great pics! You=92re making me miss
my homeland=85.I grew up on the north shore of Long Island and I still
love NY and visit every summer. NYC is an incredible place! It sure
looks like you had picture perfect weather too. Plus, as a Commander
pilot I never get tired of =93spinner shots=94. How many times have I
looked out my window and seen myself reflected in the spinner, and just
had to give myself a Thumbs Up (check out that handsome devil lucky
enough to fly this bad@ss piece of machinery!).
I find it amusing that NY pilots use tunnels as landmarks. If that
isn=92t NY-pilot elitism, I don=92t know what is. New Yorkers are all
the same. Doesn=92t matter if you drive a hot dog stand, a cab or an
aircraft.
As far as the Piaggio P-180 (the =93flying Catfish=94), I=92ve heard
that it is a very nice-flying airplane. I=92ve also heard that if you
can see the end of the runway, it=92s not nearly long enough. Even on a
cold day. Oh well, airplanes are always give-and-take. They sure are
fast for a prop plane.
/J
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve at
Col-East
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:09 AM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Hey Commander gang,
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is one
of those guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of
airliners for sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells
photos on the web and to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did
something I had been meaning to do for a long time. We were able to pick
him up outside Boston and take him with us for a day. I was glad to do
it, and we had a nice surprise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New
Hampshire, but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance, which I
think he enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut, where a
friendly Piaggio crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close
to. (These things have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island, we
dropped down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the
VFR corridor, passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their
arrivals, and passing all of the other famous landmarks like Coney
Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano
Bridge into New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess,
with some of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of
Lower Manhattan looking east, midtown, uptown, the Intrepid Museum. (A
national tradegy the Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They
should have been put right back up again.) Very busy with helicopter
traffic. Really busy. (I always forget the copter guys use the Lincoln
and Holland Tunnels for callout positions. Whose idea was that? How do
you locate a *&^%$& tunnel from the air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx, so I had to
call up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey
location. Gave Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington
Bridge, and a tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to
intercept our line to the northeast and sneak under departing LGA
traffic, and then back to Worcester to drop Dan off, and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember
how to do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put
your cursor in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhttp://forums.matronics.
comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
st">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
ronics.com
ww.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve W" <steve2(at)sover.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Great Day, Great Photos |
Got a link?
By the way...... Barry do you scour the big aircraft 'photo' sites from
time to time for Commanders? I looked a couple days ago to see if Dan
might have posted his, and saw a couple 2008 photos of Commanders in
Iran.
Real glad folks enjoyed those photos.
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: Barry Collman
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 12:12 PM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Hi Guys,
On the subject of spinner shots, I took one (from the r/h seat!) when
Capt JimBob flew me from the Fly-In at Kansas City in September 2004.
I happened to look at it again a few days ago and was staggered to see
that 65,835 distinct hits have been notched up.
This means that nearly 66,000 different people have not just look at
the thumbnail image, but have clicked to get a "Large" format view.
You guys can help bump the number up more by searching on "N222JS" or
"Photo ID 0902631".
I'll be checking daily guys, so don't let me down.
Use your PC, ones at work, at your neighbors - *anywhere* ;-)
Best Regards,
Barry
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: moe-rosspistons(at)hotmail.com
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 05:11:03 -0700
John,
You are right on with your comments about admiring yourself in the
spinners on the Commander. This weekend I will be flying back to Los
Angeles and I am going over to L19 today to polish the spinners on
N680RR,
Regards,
Moe Mills
N680RR
680Fp
Proud Holder of The Golden Pedal Award
From: John Vormbaum
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 9:49 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Steve,
Tell Shaun=92s bro that those are great pics! You=92re making me
miss my homeland=85.I grew up on the north shore of Long Island and I
still love NY and visit every summer. NYC is an incredible place! It
sure looks like you had picture perfect weather too. Plus, as a
Commander pilot I never get tired of =93spinner shots=94. How many times
have I looked out my window and seen myself reflected in the spinner,
and just had to give myself a Thumbs Up (check out that handsome devil
lucky enough to fly this bad@ss piece of machinery!).
I find it amusing that NY pilots use tunnels as landmarks. If that
isn=92t NY-pilot elitism, I don=92t know what is. New Yorkers are all
the same. Doesn=92t matter if you drive a hot dog stand, a cab or an
aircraft.
As far as the Piaggio P-180 (the =93flying Catfish=94), I=92ve heard
that it is a very nice-flying airplane. I=92ve also heard that if you
can see the end of the runway, it=92s not nearly long enough. Even on a
cold day. Oh well, airplanes are always give-and-take. They sure are
fast for a prop plane.
/J
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve at
Col-East
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 7:09 AM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Commander-List: Great Day, Great Photos
Hey Commander gang,
Shaun our cameraman has a brother just crazy over aircraft. He is
one of those guys sitting out at the end of runways taking pictures of
airliners for sites like airliners.net. He's now published and sells
photos on the web and to corporate flight departments. Saturday we did
something I had been meaning to do for a long time. We were able to pick
him up outside Boston and take him with us for a day. I was glad to do
it, and we had a nice surprise for him.
We started with some fairly boring work between Rhode Island and New
Hampshire, but we were working with a Boston Bravo clearance, which I
think he enjoyed. We pit-stopped for fuel in Connecticut, where a
friendly Piaggio crew let Dan aboard an aircraft he hadn't been up close
to. (These things have grown on me. Maintenance looks horrendous.)
Left CT and headed south for Long Island. South of Fire Island, we
dropped down to 500 feet and drove all the way to the entrance of the
VFR corridor, passing a couple miles south of JFK and under their
arrivals, and passing all of the other famous landmarks like Coney
Island.
Jumped back up to 1100 feet and headed up north over the Verrazano
Bridge into New York Harbor. Dan ripped off hundreds of photos I guess,
with some of them some real keepers. Classic Commander spinner shot of
Lower Manhattan looking east, midtown, uptown, the Intrepid Museum. (A
national tradegy the Twin Towers are still a hole in the ground. They
should have been put right back up again.) Very busy with helicopter
traffic. Really busy. (I always forget the copter guys use the Lincoln
and Holland Tunnels for callout positions. Whose idea was that? How do
you locate a *&^%$& tunnel from the air?)
We had a real job with vertical photography in the Bronx, so I had
to call up LaGuardia to negotiate access to our precoordinated survey
location. Gave Dan the opportunity for a pass over the George Washington
Bridge, and a tight U-turn over the Hudson back over the GWB to
intercept our line to the northeast and sneak under departing LGA
traffic, and then back to Worcester to drop Dan off, and finally home.
The point of all this (besides being pleasantly surprised I remember
how to do it) is that Dan took some great photos of the day. If you put
your cursor in the photo you can view a much larger version.
http://dvincent.smugmug.com/gallery/7686534_q6ayC#496531070_yB3mp
Steve
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhttp://forums.matronics.
comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
st">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
ronics.com
ww.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: He cannot be serious. Let's negotiate... |
| From: | Robert Feldtman <bobf(at)feldtman.com> |
Nico - thanks I needed this to send to a skeptic. I learned enought Arabic
in Saudi in 1982 whilst doing surgery there to understand enough word to say
the English translation is pretty close. We have a really big problem here
at the top. nuff said.
bobf
2009/3/25 nico css
> *http://www.tangle.com/view_video.php?viewkey=0861ff3eabea1ceb73e4*>
> * *
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <andrew.bridget(at)telus.net> |
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation related, so
forgive me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older 121.5 MHz
ELTs work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I understand they are
(or supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading and transmit an
emergency signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by the
Cospas-Sarsat satellite system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the ELTs
transmit an identifying code? If so, what is it? The airplane's
registration? Next, how do the search teams - say the good people at
CASARA - locate the downed aircraft? Would the signal be picked up by
an ADF, for example, and triangulated to pinpoint a search location? Tom
Fisher, would you be able to help here? How does a CASARA search get
organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody manning the frequency?
What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
| Subject: | dead stick landing - not bad |
http://www.patricksaviation.com/videos/SUPERGT/3384/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
Writing another book, Andrew?
By the way, we never got a copy of your previous one featuring Commanders.
I'd like to buy one if I know where to find it.
Thanks
Nico
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 8:27 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation related, so
forgive me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older 121.5 MHz
ELTs work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I understand they are (or
supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading and transmit an emergency
signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by the Cospas-Sarsat satellite
system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the ELTs transmit an identifying
code? If so, what is it? The airplane's registration? Next, how do the
search teams - say the good people at CASARA - locate the downed aircraft?
Would the signal be picked up by an ADF, for example, and triangulated to
pinpoint a search location? Tom Fisher, would you be able to help here? How
does a CASARA search get organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody
manning the frequency? What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <andrew.bridget(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 121.5 MHz ELT |
Actually, yes. Two books, in fact - "God's Orphan", which is our journey
in adopting our daughter from China, and "Dragon in the Sky", a sequel
to "Where Vultures Roost". The question first came up in a discussion
with a colleague, and when I wrote this last night I thought that maybe
I should include such an event in "Dragon in the Sky" . Or maybe not.
We'll see.
Re where to get the book from, you can order it online from Barnes &
Noble or the publisher (Publish America), or I can send you a signed
copy. I have a few books here; I usually charge $30 which includes
postage, so it works out about the same as the other booksellers once
you add in postage.
Barnes & Noble
http://books.barnesandnoble.com/search/results.aspx?WRD=where+vultures+
roost
Publish America: http://www.publishamerica.com/shopping/index.htm then
type in "Where Vultures Roost" in the search area.
For some reason or another Amazon lists the book, but I can't see where
you can click to order it, apart from going to outside sellers.
God bless,
Andrew
----- Original Message -----
From: nico css
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 6:51 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Writing another book, Andrew?
By the way, we never got a copy of your previous one featuring
Commanders. I'd like to buy one if I know where to find it.
Thanks
Nico
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 8:27 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation related, so
forgive me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older 121.5
MHz ELTs work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I understand they
are (or supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading and transmit an
emergency signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by the
Cospas-Sarsat satellite system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the ELTs
transmit an identifying code? If so, what is it? The airplane's
registration? Next, how do the search teams - say the good people at
CASARA - locate the downed aircraft? Would the signal be picked up by
an ADF, for example, and triangulated to pinpoint a search location? Tom
Fisher, would you be able to help here? How does a CASARA search get
organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody manning the frequency?
What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bruce Campbell <brcamp(at)windows.microsoft.com> |
The 121.5 ELT isn't associated (much) with SARSAT, which monitors 406 MHz.
The 121.5 antenna would have been too big to launch. The signal isn't in a
range that ADFs (who top out at 30 mhz) can get. Essentially the ELT prod
uces a low power signal, line of sight which can be triangulated by flight
service stations (when they existed) via their VHF DF systems (when they ha
d them) or heard by a search pilot flying essentially overhead, or at most
within a few miles.
The removal of virtually all of the infrastructure to find a 121.5 (or 243)
ELT signal is why they are being replaced by the 406 Mhz ELTs, which both
(can) give a GPS position in their standard signal and are picked up by SA
RSAT
Bruce
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-lis
t-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 7:18 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Actually, yes. Two books, in fact - "God's Orphan", which is our journey in
adopting our daughter from China, and "Dragon in the Sky", a sequel to "Wh
ere Vultures Roost". The question first came up in a discussion with a coll
eague, and when I wrote this last night I thought that maybe I should inclu
de such an event in "Dragon in the Sky" . Or maybe not. We'll see.
Re where to get the book from, you can order it online from Barnes & Noble
or the publisher (Publish America), or I can send you a signed copy. I have
a few books here; I usually charge $30 which includes postage, so it works
out about the same as the other booksellers once you add in postage.
Barnes & Noble http://books.barnesandnoble.com/search/results.aspx?WRD=wh
ere+vultures+roost
Publish America: http://www.publishamerica.com/shopping/index.htm then type
in "Where Vultures Roost" in the search area.
For some reason or another Amazon lists the book, but I can't see where you
can click to order it, apart from going to outside sellers.
God bless,
Andrew
----- Original Message -----
From: nico css<mailto:nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 6:51 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Writing another book, Andrew?
By the way, we never got a copy of your previous one featuring Commanders.
I'd like to buy one if I know where to find it.
Thanks
Nico
________________________________
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com<mailto:owner-commander-list
-server(at)matronics.com> [mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] O
n Behalf Of andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 8:27 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation related, so forgi
ve me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older 121.5 MHz EL
Ts work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I understand they are (or
supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading and transmit an emergency
signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by the Cospas-Sarsat satellite
system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the ELTs transmit an identifying co
de? If so, what is it? The airplane's registration? Next, how do the search
teams - say the good people at CASARA - locate the downed aircraft? Would
the signal be picked up by an ADF, for example, and triangulated to pinpoi
nt a search location? Tom Fisher, would you be able to help here? How does
a CASARA search get organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody mannin
g the frequency? What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matro
nics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matro
nics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve at Col-East" <steve2(at)sover.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 121.5 MHz ELT |
The worst part of carrying an ELT (at least in the States) is that in
the event of an accident the Civil Air Patrol might find you.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 8:27 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation related, so
forgive me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older 121.5
MHz ELTs work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I understand they
are (or supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading and transmit an
emergency signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by the
Cospas-Sarsat satellite system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the ELTs
transmit an identifying code? If so, what is it? The airplane's
registration? Next, how do the search teams - say the good people at
CASARA - locate the downed aircraft? Would the signal be picked up by
an ADF, for example, and triangulated to pinpoint a search location? Tom
Fisher, would you be able to help here? How does a CASARA search get
organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody manning the frequency?
What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom Fisher" <tfisher(at)commandergroup.bc.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: 121.5 MHz ELT |
As the Commander of CASARA for the South West of British Columbia I
should have some knowledge about the subject in this area, I just wish
that the some intelligent decisions were being made by those who shut
down the monitoring of 121.5.
In the past any 121.5 signal picked up by SARSAT system would be
monitored on the ground. The position of the ELT signal would be
narrowed down to a smaller area with each pass of the many satellites.
The nearest SAR group would then be notified and search aircraft would
be dispatched.
In Canada, British Columbia, the local Military Joint Rescue
Coordination Centre in Victoria would be notified of the presence of the
ELT signal, they in turn would notify the CASARA Commander for that area
(there are six areas in the Province) of British Columbia and depending
on it's approximate location (50 to 300 mile radius) would request
dispatching whatever resources it called for, usually a vehicle to a
nuisance ELT at an airport otherwise one or two aircraft with special
homing equipment, (I have the equipment installed on my 680FLP), Search
Pilot, Navigator and possibly one or two Spotters all within an hour.
If we can hear it, we can locate it although in mountainous terrain
there are a lot of reflective issues to deal with as well as power lines
propagating the signal along that corridor.
When an ELT is triggered either manually or with the "G" switch it just
starts transmitting (and should not be turned off), it does not transmit
any data regarding the source of the signal so all ELT's are hunted down
with all dispatch until we know what the source is.
Things are different now as 121.5 is no longer being monitored even
though less than 20% of the general aviation aircraft in North American
have the new 406 ELT installed. Worst yet these 406 units must be
registered and a lot are not, if it is registered then your tail number
name contact names and numbers will all be available to SAR. When you
buy a 406 ELT buy one that has an integrated GPS that will get search
teams into a 10 nm area. There is still a 121.5 signal emanating from
the 406 ELT's for local homing (still required) but it is half the
strength of the original 121.5 ELT's.
Between the lines of asterisks below is a notice from NOAA SARSAT
regarding 406 ELT's it is scary to say the least, I sure as hope all you
guys have that third radio installed just to listen to 121.5.
I hope this covers most of your questions.
Tom
C-GISS
680 FLP (Mr.RPM)
*************************************************************************
**************
Termination of Satellite Monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELT's. - ARE YOU READY?
Notice Number: NOTC1518
Termination of satellite monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELTs will happen in
under a month. Are you ready?
On 1 February 2009, the International Cospas-Sarsat [1] [1]
Organization (U.S. included) will terminate processing of distress
signals emitted by 121.5 MHz Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs).
Pilots flying aircraft equipped with 121.5 MHz ELTs after that date will
have to depend on pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations
monitoring 121.5 to hear and report distress alert signals, transmitted
from a possible crash site.
Protect each other.
Currently only 12-15% of the registered aircraft in the United States
are flying with 406 MHz ELTs. This means that there is at least an 85%
chance that an aircraft in an accident will only transmit a 121.5 MHz
signal, thus remaining silent to the satellites. It will be up to other
pilots monitoring the 121.5 MHz frequency in the cockpit to alert Search
and Rescue authorities to accidents involving 121.5. When you fly, look
out for your fellow pilots and when possible monitor 121.5 MHz.
If a 121.5 MHz ELT is heard on guard, report to the nearest air traffic
control tower, the time and location of when you first detect the ELT,
when it is the loudest and when it drops off your radio. Listening and
reporting may well be the difference that saves a life.
Protect yourself.
Cospas-Sarsat System (U.S. included) has been and will continue
processing emergency signals transmitted by 406 MHz ELTs. These 5 Watt
digital beacons transmit a much stronger signal, are more accurate,
verifiable and traceable to the registered beacon owner (406 MHz ELTs
must be registered by the owner in accordance with Federal
Communications Commission (FCC) regulation at
www.beaconregistration.noaa.gov). Registration allows the search and
rescue authorities to contact the beacon owner, or his or her designated
alternate by telephone to determine if a real emergency exists.
Therefore, a simple telephone call often solves a 406 MHz alerts without
launching costly and limited search and rescue resources, which would
have to be done for a 121.5 MHz alert. For these reasons, the search and
rescue community is encouraging aircraft owners to consider retrofit of
406 MHz ELTs or at a minimum, consider the purchase of a handheld 406
MHz Personal Locator Beacon (PLB) which can be carried in the cockpit
while continuing to maintain a fixed 121.5 MHz ELT mounted in the
aircraft's tail. Protect yourself and your passengers and Get the Fix.
Switch to 406.
Remember, after February 1, 2009, the world-wide Cospas-Sarsat
satellite system will no longer process 121.5 MHz alert signals. Pilots
involved in aircraft accidents in remote areas will have to depend on
pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations to hear emergency
ELT distress signals. For further information concerning the
termination of 121.5 MHz data processing visit www.sarsat.noaa.govor
contact Switchto406(at)noaa.gov with any questions.
Address SARSAT inquiries to:
NOAA SARSAT
NSOF. E/SP3
4231 SuitlandRoad
Suitland, MD 20746
Phone: 301.817.4515
Toll free: 888.212.7283
Fax: 301.817.4565
*************************************************************************
**************
----- Original Message -----
From: andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 8:26 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation related, so
forgive me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older 121.5
MHz ELTs work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I understand they
are (or supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading and transmit an
emergency signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by the
Cospas-Sarsat satellite system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the ELTs
transmit an identifying code? If so, what is it? The airplane's
registration? Next, how do the search teams - say the good people at
CASARA - locate the downed aircraft? Would the signal be picked up by
an ADF, for example, and triangulated to pinpoint a search location? Tom
Fisher, would you be able to help here? How does a CASARA search get
organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody manning the frequency?
What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bruce Campbell <brcamp(at)windows.microsoft.com> |
I did CAP search in Northern California for some years, and generally a 12
1.5 ELT signal didn't go very far in the sierra and siskyous (maybe only he
arable directly above). The mode of finding it was generally to fly a ser
ies of spiral search patterns on a grid until someone heard it, then look
for the highest volume with AGC off on the radio. It was a time consumin
g, and often as not futile process. Even when the signal could be pinpo
inted, in the days before GPS it was only indicated by a DR with possibly (
but not often) some VOR bearings to go by. A 10 nm radius would have been
wonderful. Of course the ELTs going off on some ramp were relatively easy
to find, but still not quick or easy.
For what its worth, AmeriKing's 406 ELT lists about $850. It may be a good
idea to budget for an upgrade, as I will be doing.
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-lis
t-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom Fisher
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 12:44 PM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
As the Commander of CASARA for the South West of British Columbia I should
have some knowledge about the subject in this area, I just wish that the so
me intelligent decisions were being made by those who shut down the monitor
ing of 121.5.
In the past any 121.5 signal picked up by SARSAT system would be monitored
on the ground. The position of the ELT signal would be narrowed down to a
smaller area with each pass of the many satellites. The nearest SAR group
would then be notified and search aircraft would be dispatched.
In Canada, British Columbia, the local Military Joint Rescue Coordination C
entre in Victoria would be notified of the presence of the ELT signal, they
in turn would notify the CASARA Commander for that area (there are six are
as in the Province) of British Columbia and depending on it's approximate l
ocation (50 to 300 mile radius) would request dispatching whatever resource
s it called for, usually a vehicle to a nuisance ELT at an airport otherwis
e one or two aircraft with special homing equipment, (I have the equipment
installed on my 680FLP), Search Pilot, Navigator and possibly one or two Sp
otters all within an hour.
If we can hear it, we can locate it although in mountainous terrain there a
re a lot of reflective issues to deal with as well as power lines propagati
ng the signal along that corridor.
When an ELT is triggered either manually or with the "G" switch it just sta
rts transmitting (and should not be turned off), it does not transmit any d
ata regarding the source of the signal so all ELT's are hunted down with al
l dispatch until we know what the source is.
Things are different now as 121.5 is no longer being monitored even though
less than 20% of the general aviation aircraft in North American have the n
ew 406 ELT installed. Worst yet these 406 units must be registered and a l
ot are not, if it is registered then your tail number name contact names an
d numbers will all be available to SAR. When you buy a 406 ELT buy one tha
t has an integrated GPS that will get search teams into a 10 nm area. Ther
e is still a 121.5 signal emanating from the 406 ELT's for local homing (st
ill required) but it is half the strength of the original 121.5 ELT's.
Between the lines of asterisks below is a notice from NOAA SARSAT regarding
406 ELT's it is scary to say the least, I sure as hope all you guys have t
hat third radio installed just to listen to 121.5.
I hope this covers most of your questions.
Tom
C-GISS
680 FLP (Mr.RPM)
***************************************************************************
************
Termination of Satellite Monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELT's. - ARE YOU READY?
Notice Number: NOTC1518
Termination of satellite monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELTs will happen in under
a month. Are you ready?
On 1 February 2009, the International Cospas-Sarsat [1] [1] Organization (U
.S. included) will terminate processing of distress signals emitted by 121.
5 MHz Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs). Pilots flying aircraft equippe
d with 121.5 MHz ELTs after that date will have to depend on pilots of over
flying aircraft and or ground stations monitoring 121.5 to hear and report
distress alert signals, transmitted from a possible crash site.
Protect each other...
Currently only 12-15% of the registered aircraft in the United States are
flying with 406 MHz ELTs. This means that there is at least an 85% chance
that an aircraft in an accident will only transmit a 121.5 MHz signal, thus
remaining silent to the satellites. It will be up to other pilots monitor
ing the 121.5 MHz frequency in the cockpit to alert Search and Rescue autho
rities to accidents involving 121.5. When you fly, look out for your fello
w pilots and when possible monitor 121.5 MHz.
If a 121.5 MHz ELT is heard on guard, report to the nearest air traffic con
trol tower, the time and location of when you first detect the ELT, when it
is the loudest and when it drops off your radio. Listening and reporting
may well be the difference that saves a life.
Protect yourself...
Cospas-Sarsat System (U.S. included) has been and will continue processing
emergency signals transmitted by 406 MHz ELTs. These 5 Watt digital beacons
transmit a much stronger signal, are more accurate, verifiable and traceab
le to the registered beacon owner (406 MHz ELTs must be registered by the o
wner in accordance with Federal Communications Commission (FCC) regulation
at www.beaconregistration.noaa.gov). Registration allows the search and res
cue authorities to contact the beacon owner, or his or her designated alter
nate by telephone to determine if a real emergency exists. Therefore, a sim
ple telephone call often solves a 406 MHz alerts without launching costly a
nd limited search and rescue resources, which would have to be done for a 1
21.5 MHz alert. For these reasons, the search and rescue community is encou
raging aircraft owners to consider retrofit of 406 MHz ELTs or at a minimum
, consider the purchase of a handheld 406 MHz Personal Locator Beacon (PLB)
which can be carried in the cockpit while continuing to maintain a fixed 1
21.5 MHz ELT mounted in the aircraft's tail. Protect yourself and your pas
sengers and Get the Fix... Switch to 406.
Remember, after February 1, 2009, the world-wide Cospas-Sarsat satellite sy
stem will no longer process 121.5 MHz alert signals. Pilots involved in air
craft accidents in remote areas will have to depend on pilots of over flyin
g aircraft and or ground stations to hear emergency ELT distress signals.
For further information concerning the termination of 121.5 MHz data proces
sing visit www.sarsat.noaa.gov<http://www.sarsat.noaa.gov/>or contact Switc
hto406(at)noaa.gov with any questions.
Address SARSAT inquiries to:
NOAA SARSAT
NSOF. E/SP3
4231 SuitlandRoad
Suitland, MD 20746
Phone: 301.817.4515
Toll free: 888.212.7283
Fax: 301.817.4565
***************************************************************************
************
----- Original Message -----
From: andrew.bridget(at)telus.net<mailto:andrew.bridget(at)telus.net>
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 8:26 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation related, so forgi
ve me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older 121.5 MHz EL
Ts work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I understand they are (or
supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading and transmit an emergency
signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by the Cospas-Sarsat satellite
system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the ELTs transmit an identifying co
de? If so, what is it? The airplane's registration? Next, how do the search
teams - say the good people at CASARA - locate the downed aircraft? Would
the signal be picked up by an ADF, for example, and triangulated to pinpoi
nt a search location? Tom Fisher, would you be able to help here? How does
a CASARA search get organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody mannin
g the frequency? What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matro
nics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <andrew.bridget(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 121.5 MHz ELT |
Thank you, Tom and Bruce... Does each ELT have a unique signal (maybe in
Morse)? Or is it just an unbroken transmit signal?
----- Original Message -----
From: Bruce Campbell
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:01 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
I did CAP search in Northern California for some years, and generally
a 121.5 ELT signal didn't go very far in the sierra and siskyous (maybe
only hearable directly above). The mode of finding it was generally to
fly a series of spiral search patterns on a grid until someone heard
it, then look for the highest volume with AGC off on the radio. It was
a time consuming, and often as not futile process. Even when the
signal could be pinpointed, in the days before GPS it was only indicated
by a DR with possibly (but not often) some VOR bearings to go by. A 10
nm radius would have been wonderful. Of course the ELTs going off on
some ramp were relatively easy to find, but still not quick or easy.
For what its worth, AmeriKing's 406 ELT lists about $850. It may be a
good idea to budget for an upgrade, as I will be doing.
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom
Fisher
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 12:44 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
As the Commander of CASARA for the South West of British Columbia I
should have some knowledge about the subject in this area, I just wish
that the some intelligent decisions were being made by those who shut
down the monitoring of 121.5.
In the past any 121.5 signal picked up by SARSAT system would be
monitored on the ground. The position of the ELT signal would be
narrowed down to a smaller area with each pass of the many satellites.
The nearest SAR group would then be notified and search aircraft would
be dispatched.
In Canada, British Columbia, the local Military Joint Rescue
Coordination Centre in Victoria would be notified of the presence of the
ELT signal, they in turn would notify the CASARA Commander for that area
(there are six areas in the Province) of British Columbia and depending
on it's approximate location (50 to 300 mile radius) would request
dispatching whatever resources it called for, usually a vehicle to a
nuisance ELT at an airport otherwise one or two aircraft with special
homing equipment, (I have the equipment installed on my 680FLP), Search
Pilot, Navigator and possibly one or two Spotters all within an hour.
If we can hear it, we can locate it although in mountainous terrain
there are a lot of reflective issues to deal with as well as power lines
propagating the signal along that corridor.
When an ELT is triggered either manually or with the "G" switch it
just starts transmitting (and should not be turned off), it does not
transmit any data regarding the source of the signal so all ELT's are
hunted down with all dispatch until we know what the source is.
Things are different now as 121.5 is no longer being monitored even
though less than 20% of the general aviation aircraft in North American
have the new 406 ELT installed. Worst yet these 406 units must be
registered and a lot are not, if it is registered then your tail number
name contact names and numbers will all be available to SAR. When you
buy a 406 ELT buy one that has an integrated GPS that will get search
teams into a 10 nm area. There is still a 121.5 signal emanating from
the 406 ELT's for local homing (still required) but it is half the
strength of the original 121.5 ELT's.
Between the lines of asterisks below is a notice from NOAA SARSAT
regarding 406 ELT's it is scary to say the least, I sure as hope all you
guys have that third radio installed just to listen to 121.5.
I hope this covers most of your questions.
Tom
C-GISS
680 FLP (Mr.RPM)
*************************************************************************
**************
Termination of Satellite Monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELT's. - ARE YOU
READY?
Notice Number: NOTC1518
Termination of satellite monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELTs will happen in
under a month. Are you ready?
On 1 February 2009, the International Cospas-Sarsat [1] [1]
Organization (U.S. included) will terminate processing of distress
signals emitted by 121.5 MHz Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs).
Pilots flying aircraft equipped with 121.5 MHz ELTs after that date will
have to depend on pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations
monitoring 121.5 to hear and report distress alert signals, transmitted
from a possible crash site.
Protect each other.
Currently only 12-15% of the registered aircraft in the United States
are flying with 406 MHz ELTs. This means that there is at least an 85%
chance that an aircraft in an accident will only transmit a 121.5 MHz
signal, thus remaining silent to the satellites. It will be up to other
pilots monitoring the 121.5 MHz frequency in the cockpit to alert Search
and Rescue authorities to accidents involving 121.5. When you fly, look
out for your fellow pilots and when possible monitor 121.5 MHz.
If a 121.5 MHz ELT is heard on guard, report to the nearest air
traffic control tower, the time and location of when you first detect
the ELT, when it is the loudest and when it drops off your radio.
Listening and reporting may well be the difference that saves a life.
Protect yourself.
Cospas-Sarsat System (U.S. included) has been and will continue
processing emergency signals transmitted by 406 MHz ELTs. These 5 Watt
digital beacons transmit a much stronger signal, are more accurate,
verifiable and traceable to the registered beacon owner (406 MHz ELTs
must be registered by the owner in accordance with Federal
Communications Commission (FCC) regulation at
www.beaconregistration.noaa.gov). Registration allows the search and
rescue authorities to contact the beacon owner, or his or her designated
alternate by telephone to determine if a real emergency exists.
Therefore, a simple telephone call often solves a 406 MHz alerts without
launching costly and limited search and rescue resources, which would
have to be done for a 121.5 MHz alert. For these reasons, the search and
rescue community is encouraging aircraft owners to consider retrofit of
406 MHz ELTs or at a minimum, consider the purchase of a handheld 406
MHz Personal Locator Beacon (PLB) which can be carried in the cockpit
while continuing to maintain a fixed 121.5 MHz ELT mounted in the
aircraft's tail. Protect yourself and your passengers and Get the Fix.
Switch to 406.
Remember, after February 1, 2009, the world-wide Cospas-Sarsat
satellite system will no longer process 121.5 MHz alert signals. Pilots
involved in aircraft accidents in remote areas will have to depend on
pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations to hear emergency
ELT distress signals. For further information concerning the
termination of 121.5 MHz data processing visit www.sarsat.noaa.govor
contact Switchto406(at)noaa.gov with any questions.
Address SARSAT inquiries to:
NOAA SARSAT
NSOF. E/SP3
4231 SuitlandRoad
Suitland, MD 20746
Phone: 301.817.4515
Toll free: 888.212.7283
Fax: 301.817.4565
*************************************************************************
**************
----- Original Message -----
From: andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 8:26 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation related,
so forgive me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older 121.5
MHz ELTs work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I understand they
are (or supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading and transmit an
emergency signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by the
Cospas-Sarsat satellite system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the ELTs
transmit an identifying code? If so, what is it? The airplane's
registration? Next, how do the search teams - say the good people at
CASARA - locate the downed aircraft? Would the signal be picked up by
an ADF, for example, and triangulated to pinpoint a search location? Tom
Fisher, would you be able to help here? How does a CASARA search get
organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody manning the frequency?
What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhref="http://forums.matronics.com">h
ttp://forums.matronics.comhref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">
http://www.matronics.com/c ; - The Commander-List Emai Search &
Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat,
FAQ,http://www.matro==================
=http://forums.matronics.comhttp://www.matronics.com/con
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bruce Campbell <brcamp(at)windows.microsoft.com> |
The 121.5 just squeals. The 406 will give all kinds of info, including you
r id (which can be related to contact and alternate contact info) and GPS
position.
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-lis
t-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:21 PM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Thank you, Tom and Bruce... Does each ELT have a unique signal (maybe in Mo
rse)? Or is it just an unbroken transmit signal?
----- Original Message -----
From: Bruce Campbell<mailto:brcamp(at)windows.microsoft.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:01 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
I did CAP search in Northern California for some years, and generally a 12
1.5 ELT signal didn't go very far in the sierra and siskyous (maybe only he
arable directly above). The mode of finding it was generally to fly a ser
ies of spiral search patterns on a grid until someone heard it, then look
for the highest volume with AGC off on the radio. It was a time consumin
g, and often as not futile process. Even when the signal could be pinpo
inted, in the days before GPS it was only indicated by a DR with possibly (
but not often) some VOR bearings to go by. A 10 nm radius would have been
wonderful. Of course the ELTs going off on some ramp were relatively easy
to find, but still not quick or easy.
For what its worth, AmeriKing's 406 ELT lists about $850. It may be a good
idea to budget for an upgrade, as I will be doing.
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-lis
t-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom Fisher
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 12:44 PM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
As the Commander of CASARA for the South West of British Columbia I should
have some knowledge about the subject in this area, I just wish that the so
me intelligent decisions were being made by those who shut down the monitor
ing of 121.5.
In the past any 121.5 signal picked up by SARSAT system would be monitored
on the ground. The position of the ELT signal would be narrowed down to a
smaller area with each pass of the many satellites. The nearest SAR group
would then be notified and search aircraft would be dispatched.
In Canada, British Columbia, the local Military Joint Rescue Coordination C
entre in Victoria would be notified of the presence of the ELT signal, they
in turn would notify the CASARA Commander for that area (there are six are
as in the Province) of British Columbia and depending on it's approximate l
ocation (50 to 300 mile radius) would request dispatching whatever resource
s it called for, usually a vehicle to a nuisance ELT at an airport otherwis
e one or two aircraft with special homing equipment, (I have the equipment
installed on my 680FLP), Search Pilot, Navigator and possibly one or two Sp
otters all within an hour.
If we can hear it, we can locate it although in mountainous terrain there a
re a lot of reflective issues to deal with as well as power lines propagati
ng the signal along that corridor.
When an ELT is triggered either manually or with the "G" switch it just sta
rts transmitting (and should not be turned off), it does not transmit any d
ata regarding the source of the signal so all ELT's are hunted down with al
l dispatch until we know what the source is.
Things are different now as 121.5 is no longer being monitored even though
less than 20% of the general aviation aircraft in North American have the n
ew 406 ELT installed. Worst yet these 406 units must be registered and a l
ot are not, if it is registered then your tail number name contact names an
d numbers will all be available to SAR. When you buy a 406 ELT buy one tha
t has an integrated GPS that will get search teams into a 10 nm area. Ther
e is still a 121.5 signal emanating from the 406 ELT's for local homing (st
ill required) but it is half the strength of the original 121.5 ELT's.
Between the lines of asterisks below is a notice from NOAA SARSAT regarding
406 ELT's it is scary to say the least, I sure as hope all you guys have t
hat third radio installed just to listen to 121.5.
I hope this covers most of your questions.
Tom
C-GISS
680 FLP (Mr.RPM)
***************************************************************************
************
Termination of Satellite Monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELT's. - ARE YOU READY?
Notice Number: NOTC1518
Termination of satellite monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELTs will happen in under
a month. Are you ready?
On 1 February 2009, the International Cospas-Sarsat [1] [1] Organization (U
.S. included) will terminate processing of distress signals emitted by 121.
5 MHz Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs). Pilots flying aircraft equippe
d with 121.5 MHz ELTs after that date will have to depend on pilots of over
flying aircraft and or ground stations monitoring 121.5 to hear and report
distress alert signals, transmitted from a possible crash site.
Protect each other...
Currently only 12-15% of the registered aircraft in the United States are
flying with 406 MHz ELTs. This means that there is at least an 85% chance
that an aircraft in an accident will only transmit a 121.5 MHz signal, thus
remaining silent to the satellites. It will be up to other pilots monitor
ing the 121.5 MHz frequency in the cockpit to alert Search and Rescue autho
rities to accidents involving 121.5. When you fly, look out for your fello
w pilots and when possible monitor 121.5 MHz.
If a 121.5 MHz ELT is heard on guard, report to the nearest air traffic con
trol tower, the time and location of when you first detect the ELT, when it
is the loudest and when it drops off your radio. Listening and reporting
may well be the difference that saves a life.
Protect yourself...
Cospas-Sarsat System (U.S. included) has been and will continue processing
emergency signals transmitted by 406 MHz ELTs. These 5 Watt digital beacons
transmit a much stronger signal, are more accurate, verifiable and traceab
le to the registered beacon owner (406 MHz ELTs must be registered by the o
wner in accordance with Federal Communications Commission (FCC) regulation
at www.beaconregistration.noaa.gov). Registration allows the search and res
cue authorities to contact the beacon owner, or his or her designated alter
nate by telephone to determine if a real emergency exists. Therefore, a sim
ple telephone call often solves a 406 MHz alerts without launching costly a
nd limited search and rescue resources, which would have to be done for a 1
21.5 MHz alert. For these reasons, the search and rescue community is encou
raging aircraft owners to consider retrofit of 406 MHz ELTs or at a minimum
, consider the purchase of a handheld 406 MHz Personal Locator Beacon (PLB)
which can be carried in the cockpit while continuing to maintain a fixed 1
21.5 MHz ELT mounted in the aircraft's tail. Protect yourself and your pas
sengers and Get the Fix... Switch to 406.
Remember, after February 1, 2009, the world-wide Cospas-Sarsat satellite sy
stem will no longer process 121.5 MHz alert signals. Pilots involved in air
craft accidents in remote areas will have to depend on pilots of over flyin
g aircraft and or ground stations to hear emergency ELT distress signals.
For further information concerning the termination of 121.5 MHz data proces
sing visit www.sarsat.noaa.gov<http://www.sarsat.noaa.gov/>or contact Switc
hto406(at)noaa.gov with any questions.
Address SARSAT inquiries to:
NOAA SARSAT
NSOF. E/SP3
4231 SuitlandRoad
Suitland, MD 20746
Phone: 301.817.4515
Toll free: 888.212.7283
Fax: 301.817.4565
***************************************************************************
************
----- Original Message -----
From: andrew.bridget(at)telus.net<mailto:andrew.bridget(at)telus.net>
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 8:26 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation related, so forgi
ve me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older 121.5 MHz EL
Ts work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I understand they are (or
supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading and transmit an emergency
signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by the Cospas-Sarsat satellite
system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the ELTs transmit an identifying co
de? If so, what is it? The airplane's registration? Next, how do the search
teams - say the good people at CASARA - locate the downed aircraft? Would
the signal be picked up by an ADF, for example, and triangulated to pinpoi
nt a search location? Tom Fisher, would you be able to help here? How does
a CASARA search get organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody mannin
g the frequency? What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matro
nics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
; - The Commander-List Emai Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat,
FAQ,
________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <andrew.bridget(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 121.5 MHz ELT |
Great! Thanks.
----- Original Message -----
From: Bruce Campbell
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:37 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
The 121.5 just squeals. The 406 will give all kinds of info,
including your id (which can be related to contact and alternate contact
info) and GPS position.
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:21 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Thank you, Tom and Bruce... Does each ELT have a unique signal (maybe
in Morse)? Or is it just an unbroken transmit signal?
----- Original Message -----
From: Bruce Campbell
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:01 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
I did CAP search in Northern California for some years, and
generally a 121.5 ELT signal didn't go very far in the sierra and
siskyous (maybe only hearable directly above). The mode of finding it
was generally to fly a series of spiral search patterns on a grid until
someone heard it, then look for the highest volume with AGC off on the
radio. It was a time consuming, and often as not futile process.
Even when the signal could be pinpointed, in the days before GPS it was
only indicated by a DR with possibly (but not often) some VOR bearings
to go by. A 10 nm radius would have been wonderful. Of course the
ELTs going off on some ramp were relatively easy to find, but still not
quick or easy.
For what its worth, AmeriKing's 406 ELT lists about $850. It may be
a good idea to budget for an upgrade, as I will be doing.
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom
Fisher
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 12:44 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
As the Commander of CASARA for the South West of British Columbia I
should have some knowledge about the subject in this area, I just wish
that the some intelligent decisions were being made by those who shut
down the monitoring of 121.5.
In the past any 121.5 signal picked up by SARSAT system would be
monitored on the ground. The position of the ELT signal would be
narrowed down to a smaller area with each pass of the many satellites.
The nearest SAR group would then be notified and search aircraft would
be dispatched.
In Canada, British Columbia, the local Military Joint Rescue
Coordination Centre in Victoria would be notified of the presence of the
ELT signal, they in turn would notify the CASARA Commander for that area
(there are six areas in the Province) of British Columbia and depending
on it's approximate location (50 to 300 mile radius) would request
dispatching whatever resources it called for, usually a vehicle to a
nuisance ELT at an airport otherwise one or two aircraft with special
homing equipment, (I have the equipment installed on my 680FLP), Search
Pilot, Navigator and possibly one or two Spotters all within an hour.
If we can hear it, we can locate it although in mountainous terrain
there are a lot of reflective issues to deal with as well as power lines
propagating the signal along that corridor.
When an ELT is triggered either manually or with the "G" switch it
just starts transmitting (and should not be turned off), it does not
transmit any data regarding the source of the signal so all ELT's are
hunted down with all dispatch until we know what the source is.
Things are different now as 121.5 is no longer being monitored even
though less than 20% of the general aviation aircraft in North American
have the new 406 ELT installed. Worst yet these 406 units must be
registered and a lot are not, if it is registered then your tail number
name contact names and numbers will all be available to SAR. When you
buy a 406 ELT buy one that has an integrated GPS that will get search
teams into a 10 nm area. There is still a 121.5 signal emanating from
the 406 ELT's for local homing (still required) but it is half the
strength of the original 121.5 ELT's.
Between the lines of asterisks below is a notice from NOAA SARSAT
regarding 406 ELT's it is scary to say the least, I sure as hope all you
guys have that third radio installed just to listen to 121.5.
I hope this covers most of your questions.
Tom
C-GISS
680 FLP (Mr.RPM)
*************************************************************************
**************
Termination of Satellite Monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELT's. - ARE YOU
READY?
Notice Number: NOTC1518
Termination of satellite monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELTs will happen in
under a month. Are you ready?
On 1 February 2009, the International Cospas-Sarsat [1] [1]
Organization (U.S. included) will terminate processing of distress
signals emitted by 121.5 MHz Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs).
Pilots flying aircraft equipped with 121.5 MHz ELTs after that date will
have to depend on pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations
monitoring 121.5 to hear and report distress alert signals, transmitted
from a possible crash site.
Protect each other.
Currently only 12-15% of the registered aircraft in the United
States are flying with 406 MHz ELTs. This means that there is at least
an 85% chance that an aircraft in an accident will only transmit a 121.5
MHz signal, thus remaining silent to the satellites. It will be up to
other pilots monitoring the 121.5 MHz frequency in the cockpit to alert
Search and Rescue authorities to accidents involving 121.5. When you
fly, look out for your fellow pilots and when possible monitor 121.5
MHz.
If a 121.5 MHz ELT is heard on guard, report to the nearest air
traffic control tower, the time and location of when you first detect
the ELT, when it is the loudest and when it drops off your radio.
Listening and reporting may well be the difference that saves a life.
Protect yourself.
Cospas-Sarsat System (U.S. included) has been and will continue
processing emergency signals transmitted by 406 MHz ELTs. These 5 Watt
digital beacons transmit a much stronger signal, are more accurate,
verifiable and traceable to the registered beacon owner (406 MHz ELTs
must be registered by the owner in accordance with Federal
Communications Commission (FCC) regulation at
www.beaconregistration.noaa.gov). Registration allows the search and
rescue authorities to contact the beacon owner, or his or her designated
alternate by telephone to determine if a real emergency exists.
Therefore, a simple telephone call often solves a 406 MHz alerts without
launching costly and limited search and rescue resources, which would
have to be done for a 121.5 MHz alert. For these reasons, the search and
rescue community is encouraging aircraft owners to consider retrofit of
406 MHz ELTs or at a minimum, consider the purchase of a handheld 406
MHz Personal Locator Beacon (PLB) which can be carried in the cockpit
while continuing to maintain a fixed 121.5 MHz ELT mounted in the
aircraft's tail. Protect yourself and your passengers and Get the Fix.
Switch to 406.
Remember, after February 1, 2009, the world-wide Cospas-Sarsat
satellite system will no longer process 121.5 MHz alert signals. Pilots
involved in aircraft accidents in remote areas will have to depend on
pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations to hear emergency
ELT distress signals. For further information concerning the
termination of 121.5 MHz data processing visit www.sarsat.noaa.govor
contact Switchto406(at)noaa.gov with any questions.
Address SARSAT inquiries to:
NOAA SARSAT
NSOF. E/SP3
4231 SuitlandRoad
Suitland, MD 20746
Phone: 301.817.4515
Toll free: 888.212.7283
Fax: 301.817.4565
*************************************************************************
**************
----- Original Message -----
From: andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 8:26 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation related,
so forgive me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older
121.5 MHz ELTs work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I
understand they are (or supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading
and transmit an emergency signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by
the Cospas-Sarsat satellite system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the
ELTs transmit an identifying code? If so, what is it? The airplane's
registration? Next, how do the search teams - say the good people at
CASARA - locate the downed aircraft? Would the signal be picked up by
an ADF, for example, and triangulated to pinpoint a search location? Tom
Fisher, would you be able to help here? How does a CASARA search get
organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody manning the frequency?
What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhref="http://forums.matronics.com">h
ttp://forums.matronics.comhref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">
http://www.matronics.com/c ; - The Commander-List Emai Search &
Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "L D GIROD" <dongirod(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 121.5 MHz ELT |
Andrew;
The way I remember it, sometimes when flying commercially, we would get
a call from ATC asking us if we were receiving ELT signal, we would
just dial in 121.5 and listen. If we did receive it, they would ask us
to let them know if it was getting louder or fainter, and to let them
know when we lost the signal. I guess this would give them some
triangulation to pin point the location, often it was on a parked
airplane on the airport, but sometimes was a legit signal.
Don
----- Original Message -----
From: andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 4:20 PM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Thank you, Tom and Bruce... Does each ELT have a unique signal (maybe
in Morse)? Or is it just an unbroken transmit signal?
----- Original Message -----
From: Bruce Campbell
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:01 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
I did CAP search in Northern California for some years, and
generally a 121.5 ELT signal didn't go very far in the sierra and
siskyous (maybe only hearable directly above). The mode of finding it
was generally to fly a series of spiral search patterns on a grid until
someone heard it, then look for the highest volume with AGC off on the
radio. It was a time consuming, and often as not futile process.
Even when the signal could be pinpointed, in the days before GPS it was
only indicated by a DR with possibly (but not often) some VOR bearings
to go by. A 10 nm radius would have been wonderful. Of course the
ELTs going off on some ramp were relatively easy to find, but still not
quick or easy.
For what its worth, AmeriKing's 406 ELT lists about $850. It may be
a good idea to budget for an upgrade, as I will be doing.
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom
Fisher
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 12:44 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
As the Commander of CASARA for the South West of British Columbia I
should have some knowledge about the subject in this area, I just wish
that the some intelligent decisions were being made by those who shut
down the monitoring of 121.5.
In the past any 121.5 signal picked up by SARSAT system would be
monitored on the ground. The position of the ELT signal would be
narrowed down to a smaller area with each pass of the many satellites.
The nearest SAR group would then be notified and search aircraft would
be dispatched.
In Canada, British Columbia, the local Military Joint Rescue
Coordination Centre in Victoria would be notified of the presence of the
ELT signal, they in turn would notify the CASARA Commander for that area
(there are six areas in the Province) of British Columbia and depending
on it's approximate location (50 to 300 mile radius) would request
dispatching whatever resources it called for, usually a vehicle to a
nuisance ELT at an airport otherwise one or two aircraft with special
homing equipment, (I have the equipment installed on my 680FLP), Search
Pilot, Navigator and possibly one or two Spotters all within an hour.
If we can hear it, we can locate it although in mountainous terrain
there are a lot of reflective issues to deal with as well as power lines
propagating the signal along that corridor.
When an ELT is triggered either manually or with the "G" switch it
just starts transmitting (and should not be turned off), it does not
transmit any data regarding the source of the signal so all ELT's are
hunted down with all dispatch until we know what the source is.
Things are different now as 121.5 is no longer being monitored even
though less than 20% of the general aviation aircraft in North American
have the new 406 ELT installed. Worst yet these 406 units must be
registered and a lot are not, if it is registered then your tail number
name contact names and numbers will all be available to SAR. When you
buy a 406 ELT buy one that has an integrated GPS that will get search
teams into a 10 nm area. There is still a 121.5 signal emanating from
the 406 ELT's for local homing (still required) but it is half the
strength of the original 121.5 ELT's.
Between the lines of asterisks below is a notice from NOAA SARSAT
regarding 406 ELT's it is scary to say the least, I sure as hope all you
guys have that third radio installed just to listen to 121.5.
I hope this covers most of your questions.
Tom
C-GISS
680 FLP (Mr.RPM)
*************************************************************************
**************
Termination of Satellite Monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELT's. - ARE YOU
READY?
Notice Number: NOTC1518
Termination of satellite monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELTs will happen in
under a month. Are you ready?
On 1 February 2009, the International Cospas-Sarsat [1] [1]
Organization (U.S. included) will terminate processing of distress
signals emitted by 121.5 MHz Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs).
Pilots flying aircraft equipped with 121.5 MHz ELTs after that date will
have to depend on pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations
monitoring 121.5 to hear and report distress alert signals, transmitted
from a possible crash site.
Protect each other.
Currently only 12-15% of the registered aircraft in the United
States are flying with 406 MHz ELTs. This means that there is at least
an 85% chance that an aircraft in an accident will only transmit a 121.5
MHz signal, thus remaining silent to the satellites. It will be up to
other pilots monitoring the 121.5 MHz frequency in the cockpit to alert
Search and Rescue authorities to accidents involving 121.5. When you
fly, look out for your fellow pilots and when possible monitor 121.5
MHz.
If a 121.5 MHz ELT is heard on guard, report to the nearest air
traffic control tower, the time and location of when you first detect
the ELT, when it is the loudest and when it drops off your radio.
Listening and reporting may well be the difference that saves a life.
Protect yourself.
Cospas-Sarsat System (U.S. included) has been and will continue
processing emergency signals transmitted by 406 MHz ELTs. These 5 Watt
digital beacons transmit a much stronger signal, are more accurate,
verifiable and traceable to the registered beacon owner (406 MHz ELTs
must be registered by the owner in accordance with Federal
Communications Commission (FCC) regulation at
www.beaconregistration.noaa.gov). Registration allows the search and
rescue authorities to contact the beacon owner, or his or her designated
alternate by telephone to determine if a real emergency exists.
Therefore, a simple telephone call often solves a 406 MHz alerts without
launching costly and limited search and rescue resources, which would
have to be done for a 121.5 MHz alert. For these reasons, the search and
rescue community is encouraging aircraft owners to consider retrofit of
406 MHz ELTs or at a minimum, consider the purchase of a handheld 406
MHz Personal Locator Beacon (PLB) which can be carried in the cockpit
while continuing to maintain a fixed 121.5 MHz ELT mounted in the
aircraft's tail. Protect yourself and your passengers and Get the Fix.
Switch to 406.
Remember, after February 1, 2009, the world-wide Cospas-Sarsat
satellite system will no longer process 121.5 MHz alert signals. Pilots
involved in aircraft accidents in remote areas will have to depend on
pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations to hear emergency
ELT distress signals. For further information concerning the
termination of 121.5 MHz data processing visit www.sarsat.noaa.govor
contact Switchto406(at)noaa.gov with any questions.
Address SARSAT inquiries to:
NOAA SARSAT
NSOF. E/SP3
4231 SuitlandRoad
Suitland, MD 20746
Phone: 301.817.4515
Toll free: 888.212.7283
Fax: 301.817.4565
*************************************************************************
**************
----- Original Message -----
From: andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 8:26 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation related,
so forgive me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older
121.5 MHz ELTs work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I
understand they are (or supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading
and transmit an emergency signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by
the Cospas-Sarsat satellite system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the
ELTs transmit an identifying code? If so, what is it? The airplane's
registration? Next, how do the search teams - say the good people at
CASARA - locate the downed aircraft? Would the signal be picked up by
an ADF, for example, and triangulated to pinpoint a search location? Tom
Fisher, would you be able to help here? How does a CASARA search get
organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody manning the frequency?
What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhref="http://forums.matronics.com">h
ttp://forums.matronics.comhref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">
http://www.matronics.com/c ; - The Commander-List Emai Search &
Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat,
FAQ,http://forums.matronics.comhttp://www.matronics.com/con
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "L D GIROD" <dongirod(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 121.5 MHz ELT |
Andrew;
It is kind of a warble, like a capacitor charging and discharging..
----- Original Message -----
From: andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 4:50 PM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Great! Thanks.
----- Original Message -----
From: Bruce Campbell
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:37 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
The 121.5 just squeals. The 406 will give all kinds of info,
including your id (which can be related to contact and alternate contact
info) and GPS position.
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:21 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Thank you, Tom and Bruce... Does each ELT have a unique signal
(maybe in Morse)? Or is it just an unbroken transmit signal?
----- Original Message -----
From: Bruce Campbell
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:01 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
I did CAP search in Northern California for some years, and
generally a 121.5 ELT signal didn't go very far in the sierra and
siskyous (maybe only hearable directly above). The mode of finding it
was generally to fly a series of spiral search patterns on a grid until
someone heard it, then look for the highest volume with AGC off on the
radio. It was a time consuming, and often as not futile process.
Even when the signal could be pinpointed, in the days before GPS it was
only indicated by a DR with possibly (but not often) some VOR bearings
to go by. A 10 nm radius would have been wonderful. Of course the
ELTs going off on some ramp were relatively easy to find, but still not
quick or easy.
For what its worth, AmeriKing's 406 ELT lists about $850. It may
be a good idea to budget for an upgrade, as I will be doing.
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom
Fisher
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 12:44 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
As the Commander of CASARA for the South West of British Columbia
I should have some knowledge about the subject in this area, I just wish
that the some intelligent decisions were being made by those who shut
down the monitoring of 121.5.
In the past any 121.5 signal picked up by SARSAT system would be
monitored on the ground. The position of the ELT signal would be
narrowed down to a smaller area with each pass of the many satellites.
The nearest SAR group would then be notified and search aircraft would
be dispatched.
In Canada, British Columbia, the local Military Joint Rescue
Coordination Centre in Victoria would be notified of the presence of the
ELT signal, they in turn would notify the CASARA Commander for that area
(there are six areas in the Province) of British Columbia and depending
on it's approximate location (50 to 300 mile radius) would request
dispatching whatever resources it called for, usually a vehicle to a
nuisance ELT at an airport otherwise one or two aircraft with special
homing equipment, (I have the equipment installed on my 680FLP), Search
Pilot, Navigator and possibly one or two Spotters all within an hour.
If we can hear it, we can locate it although in mountainous
terrain there are a lot of reflective issues to deal with as well as
power lines propagating the signal along that corridor.
When an ELT is triggered either manually or with the "G" switch it
just starts transmitting (and should not be turned off), it does not
transmit any data regarding the source of the signal so all ELT's are
hunted down with all dispatch until we know what the source is.
Things are different now as 121.5 is no longer being monitored
even though less than 20% of the general aviation aircraft in North
American have the new 406 ELT installed. Worst yet these 406 units must
be registered and a lot are not, if it is registered then your tail
number name contact names and numbers will all be available to SAR.
When you buy a 406 ELT buy one that has an integrated GPS that will get
search teams into a 10 nm area. There is still a 121.5 signal emanating
from the 406 ELT's for local homing (still required) but it is half the
strength of the original 121.5 ELT's.
Between the lines of asterisks below is a notice from NOAA SARSAT
regarding 406 ELT's it is scary to say the least, I sure as hope all you
guys have that third radio installed just to listen to 121.5.
I hope this covers most of your questions.
Tom
C-GISS
680 FLP (Mr.RPM)
*************************************************************************
**************
Termination of Satellite Monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELT's. - ARE YOU
READY?
Notice Number: NOTC1518
Termination of satellite monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELTs will happen
in under a month. Are you ready?
On 1 February 2009, the International Cospas-Sarsat [1] [1]
Organization (U.S. included) will terminate processing of distress
signals emitted by 121.5 MHz Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs).
Pilots flying aircraft equipped with 121.5 MHz ELTs after that date will
have to depend on pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations
monitoring 121.5 to hear and report distress alert signals, transmitted
from a possible crash site.
Protect each other.
Currently only 12-15% of the registered aircraft in the United
States are flying with 406 MHz ELTs. This means that there is at least
an 85% chance that an aircraft in an accident will only transmit a 121.5
MHz signal, thus remaining silent to the satellites. It will be up to
other pilots monitoring the 121.5 MHz frequency in the cockpit to alert
Search and Rescue authorities to accidents involving 121.5. When you
fly, look out for your fellow pilots and when possible monitor 121.5
MHz.
If a 121.5 MHz ELT is heard on guard, report to the nearest air
traffic control tower, the time and location of when you first detect
the ELT, when it is the loudest and when it drops off your radio.
Listening and reporting may well be the difference that saves a life.
Protect yourself.
Cospas-Sarsat System (U.S. included) has been and will continue
processing emergency signals transmitted by 406 MHz ELTs. These 5 Watt
digital beacons transmit a much stronger signal, are more accurate,
verifiable and traceable to the registered beacon owner (406 MHz ELTs
must be registered by the owner in accordance with Federal
Communications Commission (FCC) regulation at
www.beaconregistration.noaa.gov). Registration allows the search and
rescue authorities to contact the beacon owner, or his or her designated
alternate by telephone to determine if a real emergency exists.
Therefore, a simple telephone call often solves a 406 MHz alerts without
launching costly and limited search and rescue resources, which would
have to be done for a 121.5 MHz alert. For these reasons, the search and
rescue community is encouraging aircraft owners to consider retrofit of
406 MHz ELTs or at a minimum, consider the purchase of a handheld 406
MHz Personal Locator Beacon (PLB) which can be carried in the cockpit
while continuing to maintain a fixed 121.5 MHz ELT mounted in the
aircraft's tail. Protect yourself and your passengers and Get the Fix.
Switch to 406.
Remember, after February 1, 2009, the world-wide Cospas-Sarsat
satellite system will no longer process 121.5 MHz alert signals. Pilots
involved in aircraft accidents in remote areas will have to depend on
pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations to hear emergency
ELT distress signals. For further information concerning the
termination of 121.5 MHz data processing visit www.sarsat.noaa.govor
contact Switchto406(at)noaa.gov with any questions.
Address SARSAT inquiries to:
NOAA SARSAT
NSOF. E/SP3
4231 SuitlandRoad
Suitland, MD 20746
Phone: 301.817.4515
Toll free: 888.212.7283
Fax: 301.817.4565
*************************************************************************
**************
----- Original Message -----
From: andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 8:26 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation
related, so forgive me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older
121.5 MHz ELTs work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I
understand they are (or supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading
and transmit an emergency signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by
the Cospas-Sarsat satellite system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the
ELTs transmit an identifying code? If so, what is it? The airplane's
registration? Next, how do the search teams - say the good people at
CASARA - locate the downed aircraft? Would the signal be picked up by
an ADF, for example, and triangulated to pinpoint a search location? Tom
Fisher, would you be able to help here? How does a CASARA search get
organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody manning the frequency?
What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhref="http://forums.matronics.com">h
ttp://forums.matronics.comhref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">
http://www.matronics.com/c ; - The Commander-List Emai Search &
Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <andrew.bridget(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 121.5 MHz ELT |
Thanks, Don!
----- Original Message -----
From: L D GIROD
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 2:06 PM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Andrew;
The way I remember it, sometimes when flying commercially, we would
get a call from ATC asking us if we were receiving ELT signal, we would
just dial in 121.5 and listen. If we did receive it, they would ask us
to let them know if it was getting louder or fainter, and to let them
know when we lost the signal. I guess this would give them some
triangulation to pin point the location, often it was on a parked
airplane on the airport, but sometimes was a legit signal.
Don
----- Original Message -----
From: andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 4:20 PM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Thank you, Tom and Bruce... Does each ELT have a unique signal
(maybe in Morse)? Or is it just an unbroken transmit signal?
----- Original Message -----
From: Bruce Campbell
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 1:01 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
I did CAP search in Northern California for some years, and
generally a 121.5 ELT signal didn't go very far in the sierra and
siskyous (maybe only hearable directly above). The mode of finding it
was generally to fly a series of spiral search patterns on a grid until
someone heard it, then look for the highest volume with AGC off on the
radio. It was a time consuming, and often as not futile process.
Even when the signal could be pinpointed, in the days before GPS it was
only indicated by a DR with possibly (but not often) some VOR bearings
to go by. A 10 nm radius would have been wonderful. Of course the
ELTs going off on some ramp were relatively easy to find, but still not
quick or easy.
For what its worth, AmeriKing's 406 ELT lists about $850. It may
be a good idea to budget for an upgrade, as I will be doing.
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom
Fisher
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 12:44 PM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
As the Commander of CASARA for the South West of British Columbia
I should have some knowledge about the subject in this area, I just wish
that the some intelligent decisions were being made by those who shut
down the monitoring of 121.5.
In the past any 121.5 signal picked up by SARSAT system would be
monitored on the ground. The position of the ELT signal would be
narrowed down to a smaller area with each pass of the many satellites.
The nearest SAR group would then be notified and search aircraft would
be dispatched.
In Canada, British Columbia, the local Military Joint Rescue
Coordination Centre in Victoria would be notified of the presence of the
ELT signal, they in turn would notify the CASARA Commander for that area
(there are six areas in the Province) of British Columbia and depending
on it's approximate location (50 to 300 mile radius) would request
dispatching whatever resources it called for, usually a vehicle to a
nuisance ELT at an airport otherwise one or two aircraft with special
homing equipment, (I have the equipment installed on my 680FLP), Search
Pilot, Navigator and possibly one or two Spotters all within an hour.
If we can hear it, we can locate it although in mountainous
terrain there are a lot of reflective issues to deal with as well as
power lines propagating the signal along that corridor.
When an ELT is triggered either manually or with the "G" switch it
just starts transmitting (and should not be turned off), it does not
transmit any data regarding the source of the signal so all ELT's are
hunted down with all dispatch until we know what the source is.
Things are different now as 121.5 is no longer being monitored
even though less than 20% of the general aviation aircraft in North
American have the new 406 ELT installed. Worst yet these 406 units must
be registered and a lot are not, if it is registered then your tail
number name contact names and numbers will all be available to SAR.
When you buy a 406 ELT buy one that has an integrated GPS that will get
search teams into a 10 nm area. There is still a 121.5 signal emanating
from the 406 ELT's for local homing (still required) but it is half the
strength of the original 121.5 ELT's.
Between the lines of asterisks below is a notice from NOAA SARSAT
regarding 406 ELT's it is scary to say the least, I sure as hope all you
guys have that third radio installed just to listen to 121.5.
I hope this covers most of your questions.
Tom
C-GISS
680 FLP (Mr.RPM)
*************************************************************************
**************
Termination of Satellite Monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELT's. - ARE YOU
READY?
Notice Number: NOTC1518
Termination of satellite monitoring of 121.5 MHz ELTs will happen
in under a month. Are you ready?
On 1 February 2009, the International Cospas-Sarsat [1] [1]
Organization (U.S. included) will terminate processing of distress
signals emitted by 121.5 MHz Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELTs).
Pilots flying aircraft equipped with 121.5 MHz ELTs after that date will
have to depend on pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations
monitoring 121.5 to hear and report distress alert signals, transmitted
from a possible crash site.
Protect each other.
Currently only 12-15% of the registered aircraft in the United
States are flying with 406 MHz ELTs. This means that there is at least
an 85% chance that an aircraft in an accident will only transmit a 121.5
MHz signal, thus remaining silent to the satellites. It will be up to
other pilots monitoring the 121.5 MHz frequency in the cockpit to alert
Search and Rescue authorities to accidents involving 121.5. When you
fly, look out for your fellow pilots and when possible monitor 121.5
MHz.
If a 121.5 MHz ELT is heard on guard, report to the nearest air
traffic control tower, the time and location of when you first detect
the ELT, when it is the loudest and when it drops off your radio.
Listening and reporting may well be the difference that saves a life.
Protect yourself.
Cospas-Sarsat System (U.S. included) has been and will continue
processing emergency signals transmitted by 406 MHz ELTs. These 5 Watt
digital beacons transmit a much stronger signal, are more accurate,
verifiable and traceable to the registered beacon owner (406 MHz ELTs
must be registered by the owner in accordance with Federal
Communications Commission (FCC) regulation at
www.beaconregistration.noaa.gov). Registration allows the search and
rescue authorities to contact the beacon owner, or his or her designated
alternate by telephone to determine if a real emergency exists.
Therefore, a simple telephone call often solves a 406 MHz alerts without
launching costly and limited search and rescue resources, which would
have to be done for a 121.5 MHz alert. For these reasons, the search and
rescue community is encouraging aircraft owners to consider retrofit of
406 MHz ELTs or at a minimum, consider the purchase of a handheld 406
MHz Personal Locator Beacon (PLB) which can be carried in the cockpit
while continuing to maintain a fixed 121.5 MHz ELT mounted in the
aircraft's tail. Protect yourself and your passengers and Get the Fix.
Switch to 406.
Remember, after February 1, 2009, the world-wide Cospas-Sarsat
satellite system will no longer process 121.5 MHz alert signals. Pilots
involved in aircraft accidents in remote areas will have to depend on
pilots of over flying aircraft and or ground stations to hear emergency
ELT distress signals. For further information concerning the
termination of 121.5 MHz data processing visit www.sarsat.noaa.govor
contact Switchto406(at)noaa.gov with any questions.
Address SARSAT inquiries to:
NOAA SARSAT
NSOF. E/SP3
4231 SuitlandRoad
Suitland, MD 20746
Phone: 301.817.4515
Toll free: 888.212.7283
Fax: 301.817.4565
*************************************************************************
**************
----- Original Message -----
From: andrew.bridget(at)telus.net
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 8:26 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 121.5 MHz ELT
Good evening folks,
This is not really a Commander topic per se, but aviation
related, so forgive me for posting non-Commander topics here. :-)
Can anyone give me a very high-level overview of how the older
121.5 MHz ELTs work in saving lives and facilitating rescue? I
understand they are (or supposed to be) activated at a certain G loading
and transmit an emergency signal on 121.5 MHz, which is/was monitored by
the Cospas-Sarsat satellite system. But which ELT was triggered? Do the
ELTs transmit an identifying code? If so, what is it? The airplane's
registration? Next, how do the search teams - say the good people at
CASARA - locate the downed aircraft? Would the signal be picked up by
an ADF, for example, and triangulated to pinpoint a search location? Tom
Fisher, would you be able to help here? How does a CASARA search get
organised? Who advises CASARA? Is there somebody manning the frequency?
What happened pre-Cospas-Sarsat?
Thanks for your help,
Regards,
Andrew
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhref="http://forums.matronics.com">h
ttp://forums.matronics.comhref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">
http://www.matronics.com/c ; - The Commander-List Emai Search &
Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,http://www.matronics.com/con
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | willis robison <drwer2(at)yahoo.com> |
Range is always a good topic.
-
What is the best range for the 500S, 560 and 680 series?- (We know the pu
blished range)
-
Has anyone ever ferried to or from-Hawaii- and the mainland?
-
thanks.
-
WER=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JBOBSTER(at)aol.com |
Commander Gordon has ferried to Hawaii (and beyond)
Jim C
Seattle
**************Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for $10 or
less. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Donnie Rose <aquadiver99(at)yahoo.com> |
=0A-=0ADonnie Rose =0A205/492-8444=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Forwarded Message
----=0AFrom: Donnie Rose <aquadiver99(at)yahoo.com>=0ATo: commander-list@matro
nics.com=0ASent: Tuesday, March 24, 2009 2:19:30 PM=0ASubject: gauge=0A=0A
=0AAnyone have- an overhauled manifold pressure gauge for trade? Mine has
a sticky needle.=0A=0Athanks=0A=0A-=0ADonnie Rose =0A205/492-8444=0A=0A
=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Donnie Rose <aquadiver99(at)yahoo.com> |
Hey there, anyone know the cheapest place to get Cleveland brake pads?=0Ath
anks again,=0A-=0ADonnie Rose =0A205/492-8444=0A=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Keith S. Gordon" <cloudcraft(at)aol.com> |
The idea of optimized LRC (Long Range Cruise) and the reality of operating way
overweight to make the world's longest over-water route in a piston twin do not
intersect.
On the AC-680FL that I ferried to PHNL and then on to NSTU via Kiribati I had to
use 65% power to keep the airplane in level flight.? After about the 4th hour,
Indicated Air Speed began to build and I after I drifted up to 6000' I? reduced
power to maintain a constant IAS -- but this is not as accurate as flying
constant Mach as an airspeed indicator is not an airdata instrument and my IAS
could vary for ambient temperature.
Without splitting hairs, it worked.
I also leaned to lean of peak by EGT with a an eye towards cylinder head temperatures
-- but at 65% power I couldn't have done any thermal damage to the engine.?
It was a psychological thing, really, and I'm still undergoing treatment.
It was a long time ago.?? Take a look at the story that's published on www.aerocommander.com and you'll get some details.?? Some of the information will apply to the non-geared engined models as well.
http://www.aerocommander.com/tales.asp?m=08&lid=01&mtitle=Tales
It's a fun trip if you do it -- but as I'm fond of saying, the difference between
an adventure and a disaster is the proper equipment.
Wing Commander Gordon
Life is not simple anywhere. Probably less so elsewhere.
-----Original Message-----
From: willis robison <drwer2(at)yahoo.com>
Sent: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 5:56 pm
Subject: Commander-List: Hawaii
Range is always a good topic.
?
What is the best range for the 500S, 560 and 680 series?? (We know the published
range)
?
Has anyone ever ferried to or from?Hawaii? and the mainland?
?
thanks.
?
WER
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Roland Gilliam <amg3636(at)hotmail.com> |
Have you tried Harry Merritt?? I think his email has changed from the one I
have.
Roland Gilliam AC500 6291B
Date: Fri=2C 27 Mar 2009 18:54:39 -0700
From: aquadiver99(at)yahoo.com
Subject: Commander-List: Fw: gauge
Donnie Rose
205/492-8444
----- Forwarded Message ----
From: Donnie Rose <aquadiver99(at)yahoo.com>
Sent: Tuesday=2C March 24=2C 2009 2:19:30 PM
Subject: gauge
Anyone have an overhauled manifold pressure gauge for trade? Mine has a st
icky needle.
thanks
Donnie Rose
205/492-8444
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live=99 SkyDrive: Get 25 GB of free online storage.
http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_skydrive_032009
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve W" <steve2(at)sover.net> |
Don't know if my response will be helpful at all, but.... I've mentioned
our running lean of peak with the GAMI injectors on our 500B. Mark, the
prez of the company, experimented with a lot of different settings, and
I'd played some too.
Doing long lines of block flying Mark got total fuel flow down to a
reliable 21.5gph total at 22" and 2150rpm. (If the heat was on it would
be more.) This generated a fairly consistent 150 something knots in the
lower altitudes, usually plus a couple knots. If I remember right
(probably don't) by the wiz wheel this was about 55 percent power, but
that's not the whole story. Actual power may have been lower as we were
running more lean than 50 or 75 degrees.
Being younger or more impatient I'd push the handles up to put back some
of the power lost from leaning.
I've now had the pleasure of running a couple engines now with Mark,
four or five hundred hours past TBO (1400 hr engines) and the top ends
all retired with high seventies or eighty compression. I don't want to
hurt their business, but we just rebuilt a Penn Yann engine at 900 hours
(very dissapointing!) and the cylinder shop said the jugs were like new.
(That was like bringing home a good report card!) A couple engine builds
back we did have a set of chrome jugs loose the choke at the top of the
cylinder, but this too was somewhere around 1800 hours (or 19).
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: willis robison
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 8:56 PM
Subject: Commander-List: Hawaii
Range is always a good topic.
What is the best range for the 500S, 560 and 680 series? (We
know the published range)
Has anyone ever ferried to or from Hawaii and the mainland?
thanks.
WER
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
1400 TBO on a 500B? What kind of engines were they?
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve W
Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2009 5:30 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Hawaii
Don't know if my response will be helpful at all, but.... I've mentioned our
running lean of peak with the GAMI injectors on our 500B. Mark, the prez of
the company, experimented with a lot of different settings, and I'd played
some too.
Doing long lines of block flying Mark got total fuel flow down to a reliable
21.5gph total at 22" and 2150rpm. (If the heat was on it would be more.)
This generated a fairly consistent 150 something knots in the lower
altitudes, usually plus a couple knots. If I remember right (probably don't)
by the wiz wheel this was about 55 percent power, but that's not the whole
story. Actual power may have been lower as we were running more lean than 50
or 75 degrees.
Being younger or more impatient I'd push the handles up to put back some of
the power lost from leaning.
I've now had the pleasure of running a couple engines now with Mark, four or
five hundred hours past TBO (1400 hr engines) and the top ends all retired
with high seventies or eighty compression. I don't want to hurt their
business, but we just rebuilt a Penn Yann engine at 900 hours (very
dissapointing!) and the cylinder shop said the jugs were like new. (That was
like bringing home a good report card!) A couple engine builds back we did
have a set of chrome jugs loose the choke at the top of the cylinder, but
this too was somewhere around 1800 hours (or 19).
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: willis robison <mailto:drwer2(at)yahoo.com>
Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 8:56 PM
Subject: Commander-List: Hawaii
Range is always a good topic.
What is the best range for the 500S, 560 and 680 series? (We know the
published range)
Has anyone ever ferried to or from Hawaii and the mainland?
thanks.
WER
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve W" <steve2(at)sover.net> |
Nico,
The old narrow deck IO-540's on the 500B have a 1400 hour TBO. The wide
deck engines have the longer TBO.
Looking at the cases of the narrow deck and the wear of internal
components, we've been comfortable with somewhere around the 18 or 19
hundred hours we're getting, but I'm not sure we would go longer.
This last Penn Yann engine developed a leak between the case halves at
900 or so hours that leaked out a cylinder stud, one that spans the
case. There was obvious fretting of the case and the main bearings
looked funky for only 900 hours. We're not happy about that. We're going
to balance the props to try to keep the internal stresses and vibes at a
minimum.
I would guess Central Air must have these engines down to a science.
You can upgrade to later wide deck IO-540's, but I'm pretty sure that
has to be both sides at the same time, which is a little pricey. You can
only surface the mating halves a couple times. The old cases aren't
being made anymore and are starting to get scarce.
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: nico css
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2009 9:10 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Hawaii
1400 TBO on a 500B? What kind of engines were they?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve W
Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2009 5:30 AM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Hawaii
Don't know if my response will be helpful at all, but.... I've
mentioned our running lean of peak with the GAMI injectors on our 500B.
Mark, the prez of the company, experimented with a lot of different
settings, and I'd played some too.
Doing long lines of block flying Mark got total fuel flow down to a
reliable 21.5gph total at 22" and 2150rpm. (If the heat was on it would
be more.) This generated a fairly consistent 150 something knots in the
lower altitudes, usually plus a couple knots. If I remember right
(probably don't) by the wiz wheel this was about 55 percent power, but
that's not the whole story. Actual power may have been lower as we were
running more lean than 50 or 75 degrees.
Being younger or more impatient I'd push the handles up to put back
some of the power lost from leaning.
I've now had the pleasure of running a couple engines now with Mark,
four or five hundred hours past TBO (1400 hr engines) and the top ends
all retired with high seventies or eighty compression. I don't want to
hurt their business, but we just rebuilt a Penn Yann engine at 900 hours
(very dissapointing!) and the cylinder shop said the jugs were like new.
(That was like bringing home a good report card!) A couple engine builds
back we did have a set of chrome jugs loose the choke at the top of the
cylinder, but this too was somewhere around 1800 hours (or 19).
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: willis robison
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 8:56 PM
Subject: Commander-List: Hawaii
Range is always a good topic.
What is the best range for the 500S, 560 and 680 series? (We
know the published range)
Has anyone ever ferried to or from Hawaii and the mainland?
thanks.
WER
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com> |
My narrow deck engines on my 500B have a 1600 hour TB
O. I didn't know that there were some with only a 140
0 hour TBO.
-----Original Message-----
From: "Steve W" <steve2(at)sover.net>
Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 09:45:05
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Hawaii
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Harry Merritt" <avtectwo(at)cfl.rr.com> |
The original engines had 7/16" exhaust valves and 1,200 HRS TBO, with
1/2" exhaust valves went to 1,400 HRS,
the E ingine has piston oilers ans a 1,600 TBO
----- Original Message -----
From: John Vormbaum
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2009 1:05 PM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Hawaii
My narrow deck engines on my 500B have a 1600 hour TBO. I didn't know
that there were some with only a 1400 hour TBO.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: "Steve W"
Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 09:45:05 -0400
To:
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Hawaii
Nico,
The old narrow deck IO-540's on the = 500B have a 1400 hour
TBO. The wide deck engines have the longer TBO.
Looking at the cases of the narrow deck = and the wear of
internal components, we've been comfortable with somewhere = around
the 18 or 19 hundred hours we're getting, but I'm not sure we would
go longer.
This last Penn Yann engine developed a = leak between the case
halves at 900 or so hours that leaked out a cylinder stud, one =
that spans the case. There was obvious fretting of the case and the
main = bearings looked funky for only 900 hours. We're not happy
about that. We're going = to balance the props to try to keep the
internal stresses and vibes at a minimum.
I would guess Central Air must have = these engines down to a
science.
You can upgrade to later wide deck = IO-540's, but I'm pretty
sure that has to be both sides at the same time, which is a =
little pricey. You can only surface the mating halves a couple
times. The old = cases aren't being made anymore and are starting
to get scarce.
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: nico css
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com=
Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2009 = 9:10 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: = Hawaii
1400 TBO on a 500B? What kind of engines were = they?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
From: owner-commander= -list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
=Steve W
Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2009 5:30 AM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Hawaii
Don't know if my response will be = helpful at all, but....
I've mentioned our running lean of peak with the GAMI = injectors on
our 500B. Mark, the prez of the company, experimented with a lot of
= different settings, and I'd played some too.
Doing long lines of block flying Mark = got total fuel flow
down to a reliable 21.5gph total at 22" and 2150rpm. (If the =
heat was on it would be more.) This generated a fairly consistent
150 something knots in the lower altitudes, usually plus a couple
= knots. If I remember right (probably don't) by the wiz wheel
this was about 55 = percent power, but that's not the whole
story. Actual power may have been = lower as we were running more
lean than 50 or 75 degrees.
Being younger or more impatient I'd = push the handles up to
put back some of the power lost from = leaning.
I've now had the pleasure of running = a couple engines now
with Mark, four or five hundred hours past TBO (1400 hr =
engines) and the top ends all retired with high seventies or eighty
= compression. I don't want to hurt their business, but we just
rebuilt a Penn Yann = engine at 900 hours (very dissapointing!)
and the cylinder shop said the jugs = were like new. (That was
like bringing home a good report card!) A couple engine builds back
we did have a set of chrome jugs loose the = choke at the top of
the cylinder, but this too was somewhere around 1800 hours = (or
19).
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: willis = robison
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com=
Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 = 8:56 PM
Subject: Commander-List: = Hawaii
Range is always a good topic.
What is the best range for the 500S, 560 and 680 = series?
(We know the published range)
Has anyone ever ferried to or from Hawaii and = the
mainland?
thanks.
WER
href=3D"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.=
matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href=3D"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href=3D"http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.co=
m/c
href=3D"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.=
matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href=3D"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href=3D"http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.co=
m/c
href=3D"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.m
at= ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href=3D"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href=3D"http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com
/c=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D =B7=9B~=89=ED=B2,=DE=03p=F6r=89h=AC
=D3M}=A7=03p=A2=EAz=B9=C1=CA=AE'=03
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com> |
Harry, thanks for the explanation. 10 years of Commander
ownership and I'm still learning things about these airplan
es on a regular basis!
-----Original Message-----
From: "Harry Merritt" <avtectwo(at)cfl.rr.com>
Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 16:30:25
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Hawaii
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)verizon.net> |
Don't feel bad, I got my 500A 01APR1981 and am still learning things too.
Jim A
N444BD
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John
Vormbaum
Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2009 3:42 PM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Hawaii
From: John = Vormbaum
nico css
Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2009 = 9:10 = AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: = = Hawaii
1400 TBO on a = 500B? What kind of engines were = they?
_____
From: owner-co= mmander= -list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
=Steve W
Sent: Saturday, March 28, 2009 5:30 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Hawaii
Don't know if my response will be = = helpful at all, but.... I've
mentioned our running lean of peak with = the GAMI = injectors on
our 500B. Mark, the prez of the company, = experimented with a lot
of = different settings, and I'd played some = too.
Doing long lines of block flying = Mark = got total fuel flow down
to a reliable 21.5gph total at 22" and = 2150rpm. (If the = heat
was on it would be more.) This generated a fairly = consistent 150
something knots in the lower altitudes, usually plus a = couple =
knots. If I remember right (probably don't) by the wiz wheel = this
was about 55 = percent power, but that's not the whole story.
Actual power may have been = lower as we were running more lean
than 50 or = 75 degrees.
Being younger or more impatient = I'd = push the handles up to put
back some of the power lost from = leaning.
I've now had the pleasure of = running = a couple engines now with
Mark, four or five hundred hours past = TBO (1400 hr = engines)
and the top ends all retired with high = seventies or eighty
compression. I don't want to hurt their business, but we = just rebuilt
a Penn Yann = engine at 900 hours (very dissapointing!) and the
cylinder shop said the jugs = were like new. (That was like
bringing = home a good report card!) A couple engine builds back we
did have a = set of chrome jugs loose the = choke at the top of
the cylinder, but = this too was somewhere around 1800 hours = (or
19).
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: willis = robison
Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 = 8:56 = PM
Subject: Commander-List: = Hawaii
Range is always a good topic.
What is the best range for the 500S, 560 and 680 = series? (We
know the published range)
Has anyone ever ferried to or from Hawaii = and = the mainland?
thanks.
WER
= href=3D"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://ww
w.= matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href=3D"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com=
href=3D"http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.
co= m/c
= href=3D"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://ww
w.= matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href=3D"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com=
href=3D"http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.
co= m/c
= href=3D"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://ww
w.mat= ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href=3D"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com=
href=3D"http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.
com/c=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
href='3D"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List"'>http://www
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
href='3D"http://forums.matronics.com"'>http://forums.matronics.com
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
href='3D"http://www.matronics.com/contribution"'>http://www.matronics.c
om/contribution
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D
=B7=9B~=89=ED=B2,=DE=03p=F6r=89h=AC
=D3M}=A7=03p=A2=EAz=B9=C1=CA=AE'=03
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Moe-rosspistons" <moe-rosspistons(at)hotmail.com> |
Donnie,
Aircraft Spruce has always been the cheapest for Cleveland parts that I
have found.
Moe Mills
N680RR
Proud Holder of The Golden Pedal Award
From: Donnie Rose
Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 6:55 PM
Subject: Commander-List: brakes
Hey there, anyone know the cheapest place to get Cleveland brake pads?
thanks again,
Donnie Rose
205/492-8444
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com |
| Subject: | FW: 50 years of Math |
=0A=0A=0A =0A =0A=0A =0A=0A =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A- I am sorry I could
not help myself with this.- Blame who you will but unfortunately this is
the truth in todays world.- I personally just love the NEA.
=0A=0A - =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A =0A=0A =0A=0A=0A=0A =0A=0A-
=0A=0A =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ASubject: FW: 50 years of=0AMath =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
=0A=0A - =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A- =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A - =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
- =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A-
=0A=0A=0A =0A =0A =0A - =0A =0A =0A =0A - =0A =0A =0A -
=0A =0A Subject: 50=0A years of Math =0A =0A - =0A =0A =0A =0A
Fifty-Years of -Math 1959 - 2009-(in the-=0A USA-)
=0A
=0A Last week I purchased a burger at Burger King for $1.58. The counter g
irl=0A took my $ 2 and I was digging for my change when I pulled 8 cents f
rom my=0A pocket and gave it to her. She stood there, holding the nickel a
nd 3 pennies,=0A while looking at the screen on her register. I sensed her
discomfort and=0A tried to tell her to just give me two quarters , but sh
e hailed the manager=0A for help. While he tried to explain the transactio
n to her, she stood there=0A and cried. Why do I tell you this? -Because
of the evolution in teaching math since=0A the 1950s:
=0A
=0A 1. Teaching Math In 1950s
=0A A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production
is 4/5=0A of the price. What is his profit ?
=0A
=0A 2. Teaching Math In 1960s =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A A logger sells
a truckload of lumber for=0A $100. His cost of production is 4/5 of the p
rice, or $80. What is his profit?
=0A
=0A 3. Teaching Math In 1970s
=0A A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production
is $80.=0A Did he make a profit?
=0A
=0A 4.. Teaching Math In 1980s
=0A A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production
is $80=0A and his profit is $20. Your assignment: Underline the number 20.
=0A
=0A 5. Teaching Math In 1990s
=0A A logger cuts down a beautiful forest because he is selfish and incons
iderate=0A and cares nothing for the habitat of animals or the preservatio
n of our=0A woodlands. He does this so he can make a profit of $20. What d
o you think of=0A this way of making a living? Topic for class participati
on after answering=0A the question: How did the birds and squirrels feel a
s the logger cut down=0A their homes? (There are no wrong answers, and if
you feel like crying, it's=0A ok. )
=0A
=0A 6. Teaching Math In 2009
=0A Un hachero vende una carretada de maderapara $100. El costo de la=0A
producciones es $80. Cuanto dinero ha hecho? =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A
=0A =0A =0A =0A - =0A =0A - =0A =0A =0A =0A Feeling the=0A
pinch at the grocery store? Make meals for under $10. =0A - =0A =0A
=0A=0A=0A - =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A size=2 width="100%" align=center>=0A
=0A=0A=0A
=0AChecked by AVG - www.avg.com
09=0A07:16:00 =0A=0A=0A=0A =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: FW: 50 years of Math |
Hi Dan,
It is indead the trooth.
It's allso the same with the English languidge.
Noboddie kares any more.
Best Regards,
Barry
----- Original Message -----
From: daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com
To: commander-list-digest(at)matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 4:33 PM
Subject: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
I am sorry I could not help myself with this. Blame who you
will but unfortunately this is the truth in todays world. I personally
just love the NEA.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: FW: 50 years of Math
Subject: 50 years of Math
Fifty Years of Math 1959 - 2009 (in the USA )
Last week I purchased a burger at Burger King for
$1.58. The counter girl took my $ 2 and I was digging for my change when
I pulled 8 cents from my pocket and gave it to her. She stood there,
holding the nickel and 3 pennies, while looking at the screen on her
register. I sensed her discomfort and tried to tell her to just give me
two quarters , but she hailed the manager for help. While he tried to
explain the transaction to her, she stood there and cried. Why do I tell
you this? Because of the evolution in teaching math since the 1950s:
1. Teaching Math In 1950s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His
cost of production is 4/5 of the price. What is his profit ?
2. Teaching Math In 1960s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His
cost of production is 4/5 of the price, or $80. What is his profit?
3. Teaching Math In 1970s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His
cost of production is $80. Did he make a profit?
4.. Teaching Math In 1980s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His
cost of production is $80 and his profit is $20. Your assignment:
Underline the number 20.
5. Teaching Math In 1990s
A logger cuts down a beautiful forest because he is
selfish and inconsiderate and cares nothing for the habitat of animals
or the preservation of our woodlands. He does this so he can make a
profit of $20. What do you think of this way of making a living? Topic
for class participation after answering the question: How did the birds
and squirrels feel as the logger cut down their homes? (There are no
wrong answers, and if you feel like crying, it's ok. )
6. Teaching Math In 2009
Un hachero vende una carretada de maderapara $100.
El costo de la producciones es $80. Cuanto dinero ha hecho?
----------------------------------------------------------------
Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make meals for
under $10.
size=2 width="100%" align=center>
===========
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Donnie Rose <aquadiver99(at)yahoo.com> |
OK, thanks Moe=0A-=0ADonnie Rose =0A205/492-8444=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A_______
_________________________=0AFrom: Moe-rosspistons <moe-rosspistons@hotmail.
com>=0ATo: commander-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 10:3
0:20 AM=0ASubject: Re: Commander-List: brakes=0A=0A=0ADonnie,=0A-=0AAircr
aft Spruce has always been the cheapest for Cleveland parts that I have fou
nd.=0A-=0AMoe Mills=0AN680RR=0AProud Holder of The Golden Pedal Award=0A
=0A=0AFrom: Donnie Rose =0ASent: Friday, March 27, 2009 6:55 PM=0ATo: comma
nder-list(at)matronics.com =0ASubject: Commander-List: brakes=0A=0AHey there,
anyone know the cheapest place to get Cleveland brake pads?=0Athanks again,
=0A-=0ADonnie Rose =0A205/492-8444=0A=0A=0A=0A=0Ahref="http://www.matro
nics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Comma
nder-Listhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
=0Ahref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/
======================0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | FW: 50 years of Math |
You picked right up on that.... Jim A
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry
Collman
Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 11:15 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
Hi Dan,
It is indead the trooth.
It's allso the same with the English languidge.
Noboddie kares any more.
Best Regards,
Barry
----- Original Message -----
From: daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com
Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 4:33 PM
Subject: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
I am sorry I could not help myself with this. Blame who you will but
unfortunately this is the truth in todays world. I personally just love the
NEA.
_____
Subject: FW: 50 years of Math
Subject: 50 years of Math
<http://us.mc828.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rob@Fifty> Fifty Years of
Math 1959 - 2009 (in the USA )
Last week I purchased a burger at Burger King for $1.58. The counter girl
took my $ 2 and I was digging for my change when I pulled 8 cents from my
pocket and gave it to her. She stood there, holding the nickel and 3
pennies, while looking at the screen on her register. I sensed her
discomfort and tried to tell her to just give me two quarters , but she
hailed the manager for help. While he tried to explain the transaction to
her, she stood there and cried. Why do I tell you this? Because of the
evolution in teaching math since the 1950s:
1. Teaching Math In 1950s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5
of the price. What is his profit ?
2. Teaching Math In 1960s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5
of the price, or $80. What is his profit?
3. Teaching Math In 1970s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is
$80. Did he make a profit?
4.. Teaching Math In 1980s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is $80
and his profit is $20. Your assignment: Underline the number 20.
5. Teaching Math In 1990s
A logger cuts down a beautiful forest because he is selfish and
inconsiderate and cares nothing for the habitat of animals or the
preservation of our woodlands. He does this so he can make a profit of $20.
What do you think of this way of making a living? Topic for class
participation after answering the question: How did the birds and squirrels
feel as the logger cut down their homes? (There are no wrong answers, and if
you feel like crying, it's ok. )
6. Teaching Math In 2009
Un hachero vende una carretada de maderapara $100. El costo de la
producciones es $80. Cuanto dinero ha hecho?
_____
Feeling the pinch at the grocery store?
<http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000002> Make meals for
under $10.
size=2 width="100%" align=center>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: FW: 50 years of Math |
Well, what I understand is that in future, there'll be just one question
on each Exam paper.
"What grade would you like to receive?"
Tick box "A", "B", or "C".
Barry C.
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Addington
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 8:40 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
You picked right up on that.... Jim A
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry
Collman
Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 11:15 AM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
Hi Dan,
It is indead the trooth.
It's allso the same with the English languidge.
Noboddie kares any more.
Best Regards,
Barry
----- Original Message -----
From: daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com
To: commander-list-digest(at)matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 4:33 PM
Subject: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
I am sorry I could not help myself with this. Blame who you
will but unfortunately this is the truth in todays world. I personally
just love the NEA.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: FW: 50 years of Math
Subject: 50 years of Math
Fifty Years of Math 1959 - 2009 (in the USA )
Last week I purchased a burger at Burger King for
$1.58. The counter girl took my $ 2 and I was digging for my change when
I pulled 8 cents from my pocket and gave it to her. She stood there,
holding the nickel and 3 pennies, while looking at the screen on her
register. I sensed her discomfort and tried to tell her to just give me
two quarters , but she hailed the manager for help. While he tried to
explain the transaction to her, she stood there and cried. Why do I tell
you this? Because of the evolution in teaching math since the 1950s:
1. Teaching Math In 1950s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His
cost of production is 4/5 of the price. What is his profit ?
2. Teaching Math In 1960s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His
cost of production is 4/5 of the price, or $80. What is his profit?
3. Teaching Math In 1970s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His
cost of production is $80. Did he make a profit?
4.. Teaching Math In 1980s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His
cost of production is $80 and his profit is $20. Your assignment:
Underline the number 20.
5. Teaching Math In 1990s
A logger cuts down a beautiful forest because he is
selfish and inconsiderate and cares nothing for the habitat of animals
or the preservation of our woodlands. He does this so he can make a
profit of $20. What do you think of this way of making a living? Topic
for class participation after answering the question: How did the birds
and squirrels feel as the logger cut down their homes? (There are no
wrong answers, and if you feel like crying, it's ok. )
6. Teaching Math In 2009
Un hachero vende una carretada de maderapara $100.
El costo de la producciones es $80. Cuanto dinero ha hecho?
----------------------------------------------------------------
Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make meals for
under $10.
size=2 width="100%" align=center>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List Web
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
ontribution ===========
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | FW: 50 years of Math |
I believe it. Jim A
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry
Collman
Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 2:47 PM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
Well, what I understand is that in future, there'll be just one question on
each Exam paper.
"What grade would you like to receive?"
Tick box "A", "B", or "C".
Barry C.
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim <mailto:jtaddington(at)verizon.net> Addington
Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 8:40 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
You picked right up on that.... Jim A
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry
Collman
Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 11:15 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
Hi Dan,
It is indead the trooth.
It's allso the same with the English languidge.
Noboddie kares any more.
Best Regards,
Barry
----- Original Message -----
From: daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com
Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 4:33 PM
Subject: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
I am sorry I could not help myself with this. Blame who you will but
unfortunately this is the truth in todays world. I personally just love the
NEA.
_____
Subject: FW: 50 years of Math
Subject: 50 years of Math
<http://us.mc828.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rob@Fifty> Fifty Years of
Math 1959 - 2009 (in the USA )
Last week I purchased a burger at Burger King for $1.58. The counter girl
took my $ 2 and I was digging for my change when I pulled 8 cents from my
pocket and gave it to her. She stood there, holding the nickel and 3
pennies, while looking at the screen on her register. I sensed her
discomfort and tried to tell her to just give me two quarters , but she
hailed the manager for help. While he tried to explain the transaction to
her, she stood there and cried. Why do I tell you this? Because of the
evolution in teaching math since the 1950s:
1. Teaching Math In 1950s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5
of the price. What is his profit ?
2. Teaching Math In 1960s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5
of the price, or $80. What is his profit?
3. Teaching Math In 1970s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is
$80. Did he make a profit?
4.. Teaching Math In 1980s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is $80
and his profit is $20. Your assignment: Underline the number 20.
5. Teaching Math In 1990s
A logger cuts down a beautiful forest because he is selfish and
inconsiderate and cares nothing for the habitat of animals or the
preservation of our woodlands. He does this so he can make a profit of $20.
What do you think of this way of making a living? Topic for class
participation after answering the question: How did the birds and squirrels
feel as the logger cut down their homes? (There are no wrong answers, and if
you feel like crying, it's ok. )
6. Teaching Math In 2009
Un hachero vende una carretada de maderapara $100. El costo de la
producciones es $80. Cuanto dinero ha hecho?
_____
Feeling the pinch at the grocery store?
<http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000002> Make meals for
under $10.
size=2 width="100%" align=center>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List Web
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contri
bution ===========
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
| Subject: | FW: 50 years of Math |
We are paying the price for it today - and we are not done paying for it by
a long shot.
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com
Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 8:33 AM
Subject: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
I am sorry I could not help myself with this. Blame who you will but
unfortunately this is the truth in todays world. I personally just love the
NEA.
_____
Subject: FW: 50 years of Math
Subject: 50 years of Math
<http://us.mc828.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rob@Fifty> Fifty Years of
Math 1959 - 2009 (in the USA )
Last week I purchased a burger at Burger King for $1.58. The counter girl
took my $ 2 and I was digging for my change when I pulled 8 cents from my
pocket and gave it to her. She stood there, holding the nickel and 3
pennies, while looking at the screen on her register. I sensed her
discomfort and tried to tell her to just give me two quarters , but she
hailed the manager for help. While he tried to explain the transaction to
her, she stood there and cried. Why do I tell you this? Because of the
evolution in teaching math since the 1950s:
1. Teaching Math In 1950s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5
of the price. What is his profit ?
2. Teaching Math In 1960s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5
of the price, or $80. What is his profit?
3. Teaching Math In 1970s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is
$80. Did he make a profit?
4.. Teaching Math In 1980s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is $80
and his profit is $20. Your assignment: Underline the number 20.
5. Teaching Math In 1990s
A logger cuts down a beautiful forest because he is selfish and
inconsiderate and cares nothing for the habitat of animals or the
preservation of our woodlands. He does this so he can make a profit of $20.
What do you think of this way of making a living? Topic for class
participation after answering the question: How did the birds and squirrels
feel as the logger cut down their homes? (There are no wrong answers, and if
you feel like crying, it's ok. )
6. Teaching Math In 2009
Un hachero vende una carretada de maderapara $100. El costo de la
producciones es $80. Cuanto dinero ha hecho?
_____
Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make meals for under
<http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000002> $10.
size=2 width="100%" align=center>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
| Subject: | FW: 50 years of Math |
This kind of education doesn't come cheap but it's always available.
A not necessarily well-prepared student sat in his life science classroom,
staring at a question on the final exam paper. The question directed: "Give
four advantages of breast milk."
What to write? He sighed, and began to scribble whatever came into his head,
hoping for the best:
1. No need to boil.
2. Never goes sour.
3. Available whenever necessary.
So far so good - maybe. But the exam demanded a fourth answer. Again,,,,
what to write? Once more, he sighed. He frowned. He scowled, then sighed
again. Suddenly, he brightened. He grabbed his pen, and triumphantly, he
scribbled his definitive answer:
4. Available in attractive containers of varying sizes.
He received an A.
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com
Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 8:33 AM
Subject: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
I am sorry I could not help myself with this. Blame who you will but
unfortunately this is the truth in todays world. I personally just love the
NEA.
_____
Subject: FW: 50 years of Math
Subject: 50 years of Math
<http://us.mc828.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rob@Fifty> Fifty Years of
Math 1959 - 2009 (in the USA )
Last week I purchased a burger at Burger King for $1.58. The counter girl
took my $ 2 and I was digging for my change when I pulled 8 cents from my
pocket and gave it to her. She stood there, holding the nickel and 3
pennies, while looking at the screen on her register. I sensed her
discomfort and tried to tell her to just give me two quarters , but she
hailed the manager for help. While he tried to explain the transaction to
her, she stood there and cried. Why do I tell you this? Because of the
evolution in teaching math since the 1950s:
1. Teaching Math In 1950s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5
of the price. What is his profit ?
2. Teaching Math In 1960s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5
of the price, or $80. What is his profit?
3. Teaching Math In 1970s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is
$80. Did he make a profit?
4.. Teaching Math In 1980s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is $80
and his profit is $20. Your assignment: Underline the number 20.
5. Teaching Math In 1990s
A logger cuts down a beautiful forest because he is selfish and
inconsiderate and cares nothing for the habitat of animals or the
preservation of our woodlands. He does this so he can make a profit of $20.
What do you think of this way of making a living? Topic for class
participation after answering the question: How did the birds and squirrels
feel as the logger cut down their homes? (There are no wrong answers, and if
you feel like crying, it's ok. )
6. Teaching Math In 2009
Un hachero vende una carretada de maderapara $100. El costo de la
producciones es $80. Cuanto dinero ha hecho?
_____
Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make meals for under
<http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000002> $10.
size=2 width="100%" align=center>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com> |
| Subject: | S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
Commanders-
Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when pressing
the A/P disconnect switch.
I'm spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is announced
at about 5,000db... just to make sure you notice it.
I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot- it
quietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it
disconnects in flight on it's own for some reason? EA301?
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
Robert,
My 500A was the one that S-Tec used for the STC after I hounded them for
three years. I had them install the 65 with all the whistles and bells and I
also was used to big iron where there was a warning when it disconnected.
That has been my only disappointment in that autopilot. I looked at my map
that was on a clip board and accidently laid it on the disconnect switch. We
were at night IFR and it started to drift off before I caught what had
happened. I have thought about putting a small cup under the switch so that
would not happen again but have not done it yet because I have not been able
to fly much in the last two years. A friend of mine drew out the plans for
putting trim and disconnect switches on the right side but have not done
that either. It has been a really good autopilot.
Jim Addington
500A
N444BD
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S.
Randazzo
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 12:15 AM
Subject: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Commanders-
Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when pressing
the A/P disconnect switch.
I'm spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is announced
at about 5,000db... just to make sure you notice it.
I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot- it
quietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it
disconnects in flight on it's own for some reason? EA301?
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
| From: | Robert Feldtman <bobf(at)feldtman.com> |
Assuming you are referring to the red disconnect switch on the yoke (horns)
-- I'd be cautious about putting anything that makes a quick disconnect
delayed in any fashion. Once on my turboprop commander, by myself, night
time, tired after a weekend of AF Reserve duty at Carswell, very busy (ATC
-
go fast to the OM at Hobby!)) I got very busy over the OM, and was flying
the autopilot coupled ILS approach - the elevator command went fairly
rapidly nose up as I lowered gear, and pulled back turboprop power to fligh
t
idle to slow down - it slowed down faster than I realized, and the AP
command was to stay on the glideslope, which meant go up, pitch up.
fortunately, I was aware and on top of it and was able to smoothly kill the
autopilot with the red quick dissconect on the yoke as I nosed it over a
little and added power. Any delay in doing that with a switch override -
could cause someone to have to fight the autopilot (which one COULD do - bu
t
t would be unusally hard push).... so I'd be careful changing out the quick
disconnect.
I didn't stall - but it scared me ( I was IMC during this - broke out
shortly later) - will be good to see what the big iron guys have to say
about this.
As a flight surgeon, it made me review what "my" limits should be in flying
IMC when tired, at night and single pilot. Something everyone should think
about.
bobf
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 9:21 AM, Jim Addington wro
te:
> Robert,
>
> My 500A was the one that S-Tec used for the STC after I hounded them for
> three years. I had them install the 65 with all the whistles and bells an
d I
> also was used to big iron where there was a warning when it disconnected.
> That has been my only disappointment in that autopilot. I looked at my ma
p
> that was on a clip board and accidently laid it on the disconnect switch.
We
> were at night IFR and it started to drift off before I caught what had
> happened. I have thought about putting a small cup under the switch so th
at
> would not happen again but have not done it yet because I have not been a
ble
> to fly much in the last two years. A friend of mine drew out the plans fo
r
> putting trim and disconnect switches on the right side but have not done
> that either. It has been a really good autopilot.
>
> Jim Addington
>
> 500A
>
> N444BD
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Robert S.
> Randazzo
> *Sent:* Monday, March 30, 2009 12:15 AM
> *To:* commander-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
>
>
> Commanders-
>
>
> Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
>
>
> At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when pressing
> the A/P disconnect switch.
>
>
> I=92m spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is annou
nced
> at about 5,000db... just to make sure you notice it=85
>
>
> I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot- it
> quietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it
> disconnects in flight on it=92s own for some reason? EA301?
>
>
> Robert S. Randazzo
>
> N414C
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * - The Commander-List Email Forum -*
>
> **
>
> **
>
> *--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List*
>
> **
>
> * - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -*
>
> * - List Contribution Web Site -*
>
> * -Matt Dralle, List Admin.*
>
> **
>
> * *
>
> *
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MASON CHEVAILLIER <kamala(at)MSN.COM> |
| Subject: | S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
the century 2000 system in 70QT has the warning on first click or turbulanc
e disconnect. noise off w/ second click. gmc
Date: Mon=2C 30 Mar 2009 10:08:16 -0500
Subject: Re: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
From: bobf(at)feldtman.com
Assuming you are referring to the red disconnect switch on the yoke (horns)
-- I'd be cautious about putting anything that makes a quick disconnect de
layed in any fashion. Once on my turboprop commander=2C by myself=2C night
time=2C tired after a weekend of AF Reserve duty at Carswell=2C very busy (
ATC - go fast to the OM at Hobby!)) I got very busy over the OM=2C and was
flying the autopilot coupled ILS approach - the elevator command went fairl
y rapidly nose up as I lowered gear=2C and pulled back turboprop power to f
light idle to slow down - it slowed down faster than I realized=2C and the
AP command was to stay on the glideslope=2C which meant go up=2C pitch up.
fortunately=2C I was aware and on top of it and was able to smoothly kill t
he autopilot with the red quick dissconect on the yoke as I nosed it over a
little and added power. Any delay in doing that with a switch override - c
ould cause someone to have to fight the autopilot (which one COULD do - but
t would be unusally hard push).... so I'd be careful changing out the quic
k disconnect.
I didn't stall - but it scared me ( I was IMC during this - broke out short
ly later) - will be good to see what the big iron guys have to say about th
is.
As a flight surgeon=2C it made me review what "my" limits should be in flyi
ng IMC when tired=2C at night and single pilot. Something everyone should t
hink about.
bobf
On Mon=2C Mar 30=2C 2009 at 9:21 AM=2C Jim Addington wrote:
Robert=2C
My 500A was the one that S-Tec used for the STC after I hounded them for th
ree years. I had them install the 65 with all the whistles and bells and I
also was used to big iron where there was a warning when it disconnected. T
hat has been my only disappointment in that autopilot. I looked at my map t
hat was on a clip board and accidently laid it on the disconnect switch. We
were at night IFR and it started to drift off before I caught what had hap
pened. I have thought about putting a small cup under the switch so that wo
uld not happen again but have not done it yet because I have not been able
to fly much in the last two years. A friend of mine drew out the plans for
putting trim and disconnect switches on the right side but have not done th
at either. It has been a really good autopilot.
Jim Addington
500A
N444BD
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-lis
t-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S. Randazzo
Sent: Monday=2C March 30=2C 2009 12:15 AM
Subject: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Commanders-
Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when pressing t
he A/P disconnect switch.
I=92m spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is announc
ed at about 5=2C000db... just to make sure you notice it=85
I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot- it qu
ietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it disconne
cts in flight on it=92s own for some reason? EA301?
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
- The Commander-List Email Forum ---> http://www.matronics.com/
Navigator?Commander-List - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
- List Contribution Web Site - -Matt Dralle
=2C List Admin.
" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
ttp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
I was not going to change the switch, just put an upside down cap under it
so I can get to it but it would be protected from being accidently punched.
The L-1011 accident in FL many years ago is why the airlines went to the
warning. I have been surprised that the light plane auto pilots don't have
that. What did you fly in the AF Reserve? To tell you how old I am I flew
the B-47 and will have had my license 50 years the 24 of this month. I flew
for Delta for almost 33 years. My medical is in jeopardy though. They have
had it for four months and finally sent me a letter that it was going to the
neurologist. At least they have not said no yet. I had 9 different Drs.
check me from stem to stern and found nothing so I think it was what I
thought all along. I had been under a lot of stress with my wife's death and
we had painted the house inside and put down new carpet. The smells is what
I think was my problem because I have not had it since.
Jim
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
Feldtman
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 10:08 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Assuming you are referring to the red disconnect switch on the yoke (horns)
-- I'd be cautious about putting anything that makes a quick disconnect
delayed in any fashion. Once on my turboprop commander, by myself, night
time, tired after a weekend of AF Reserve duty at Carswell, very busy (ATC -
go fast to the OM at Hobby!)) I got very busy over the OM, and was flying
the autopilot coupled ILS approach - the elevator command went fairly
rapidly nose up as I lowered gear, and pulled back turboprop power to flight
idle to slow down - it slowed down faster than I realized, and the AP
command was to stay on the glideslope, which meant go up, pitch up.
fortunately, I was aware and on top of it and was able to smoothly kill the
autopilot with the red quick dissconect on the yoke as I nosed it over a
little and added power. Any delay in doing that with a switch override -
could cause someone to have to fight the autopilot (which one COULD do - but
t would be unusally hard push).... so I'd be careful changing out the quick
disconnect.
I didn't stall - but it scared me ( I was IMC during this - broke out
shortly later) - will be good to see what the big iron guys have to say
about this.
As a flight surgeon, it made me review what "my" limits should be in flying
IMC when tired, at night and single pilot. Something everyone should think
about.
bobf
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 9:21 AM, Jim Addington
wrote:
Robert,
My 500A was the one that S-Tec used for the STC after I hounded them for
three years. I had them install the 65 with all the whistles and bells and I
also was used to big iron where there was a warning when it disconnected.
That has been my only disappointment in that autopilot. I looked at my map
that was on a clip board and accidently laid it on the disconnect switch. We
were at night IFR and it started to drift off before I caught what had
happened. I have thought about putting a small cup under the switch so that
would not happen again but have not done it yet because I have not been able
to fly much in the last two years. A friend of mine drew out the plans for
putting trim and disconnect switches on the right side but have not done
that either. It has been a really good autopilot.
Jim Addington
500A
N444BD
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S.
Randazzo
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 12:15 AM
Subject: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Commanders-
Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when pressing
the A/P disconnect switch.
I'm spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is announced
at about 5,000db... just to make sure you notice it.
I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot- it
quietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it
disconnects in flight on it's own for some reason? EA301?
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
- The Commander-List Email Forum -
--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
- List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
ttp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
That is the way it should be, that is the way the airliners are and it works
great. Jim
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of MASON
CHEVAILLIER
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 10:28 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
the century 2000 system in 70QT has the warning on first click or turbulance
disconnect. noise off w/ second click. gmc
_____
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 10:08:16 -0500
Subject: Re: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
From: bobf(at)feldtman.com
Assuming you are referring to the red disconnect switch on the yoke (horns)
-- I'd be cautious about putting anything that makes a quick disconnect
delayed in any fashion. Once on my turboprop commander, by myself, night
time, tired after a weekend of AF Reserve duty at Carswell, very busy (ATC -
go fast to the OM at Hobby!)) I got very busy over the OM, and was flying
the autopilot coupled ILS approach - the elevator command went fairly
rapidly nose up as I lowered gear, and pulled back turboprop power to flight
idle to slow down - it slowed down faster than I realized, and the AP
command was to stay on the glideslope, which meant go up, pitch up.
fortunately, I was aware and on top of it and was able to smoothly kill the
autopilot with the red quick dissconect on the yoke as I nosed it over a
little and added power. Any delay in doing that with a switch override -
could cause someone to have to fight the autopilot (which one COULD do - but
t would be unusally hard push).... so I'd be careful changing out the quick
disconnect.
I didn't stall - but it scared me ( I was IMC during this - broke out
shortly later) - will be good to see what the big iron guys have to say
about this.
As a flight surgeon, it made me review what "my" limits should be in flying
IMC when tired, at night and single pilot. Something everyone should think
about.
bobf
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 9:21 AM, Jim Addington
wrote:
Robert,
My 500A was the one that S-Tec used for the STC after I hounded them for
three years. I had them install the 65 with all the whistles and bells and I
also was used to big iron where there was a warning when it disconnected.
That has been my only disappointment in that autopilot. I looked at my map
that was on a clip board and accidently laid it on the disconnect switch. We
were at night IFR and it started to drift off before I caught what had
happened. I have thought about putting a small cup under the switch so that
would not happen again but have not done it yet because I have not been able
to fly much in the last two years. A friend of mine drew out the plans for
putting trim and disconnect switches on the right side but have not done
that either. It has been a really good autopilot.
Jim Addington
500A
N444BD
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S.
Randazzo
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 12:15 AM
Subject: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Commanders-
Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when pressing
the A/P disconnect switch.
I'm spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is announced
at about 5,000db... just to make sure you notice it.
I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot- it
quietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it
disconnects in flight on it's own for some reason? EA301?
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
- The Commander-List Email Forum -
--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
- List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
ttp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
st">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
ronics.com
ww.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "L D GIROD" <dongirod(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
Jim;
I think the L-1011 accident was because the autopilot on the L-1011 had
'control wheel steering', the crew pushed forward on the yoke trying to
check or change a gear light, and put enough pressure on the yoke to
start a very slow, 50 FPM as I recall decent. Since it was a manual
input the airplane thought that was what was desired and the 250 ft.
altitude warning was bypassed. They went back and rewired that command.
As I understand it, the auto pilot was never disengaged. That and some
non normal terminology from ATC, such as "Eastern, everything OK"
instead of asking why they had left their assigned altitude. As normal,
it was a series of mistakes that let to a tragic accident.
Don
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Addington
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 11:39 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
I was not going to change the switch, just put an upside down cap
under it so I can get to it but it would be protected from being
accidently punched. The L-1011 accident in FL many years ago is why the
airlines went to the warning. I have been surprised that the light plane
auto pilots don't have that. What did you fly in the AF Reserve? To tell
you how old I am I flew the B-47 and will have had my license 50 years
the 24 of this month. I flew for Delta for almost 33 years. My medical
is in jeopardy though. They have had it for four months and finally sent
me a letter that it was going to the neurologist. At least they have not
said no yet. I had 9 different Drs. check me from stem to stern and
found nothing so I think it was what I thought all along. I had been
under a lot of stress with my wife's death and we had painted the house
inside and put down new carpet. The smells is what I think was my
problem because I have not had it since.
Jim
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
Feldtman
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 10:08 AM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Assuming you are referring to the red disconnect switch on the yoke
(horns) -- I'd be cautious about putting anything that makes a quick
disconnect delayed in any fashion. Once on my turboprop commander, by
myself, night time, tired after a weekend of AF Reserve duty at
Carswell, very busy (ATC - go fast to the OM at Hobby!)) I got very busy
over the OM, and was flying the autopilot coupled ILS approach - the
elevator command went fairly rapidly nose up as I lowered gear, and
pulled back turboprop power to flight idle to slow down - it slowed down
faster than I realized, and the AP command was to stay on the
glideslope, which meant go up, pitch up. fortunately, I was aware and on
top of it and was able to smoothly kill the autopilot with the red quick
dissconect on the yoke as I nosed it over a little and added power. Any
delay in doing that with a switch override - could cause someone to have
to fight the autopilot (which one COULD do - but t would be unusally
hard push).... so I'd be careful changing out the quick disconnect.
I didn't stall - but it scared me ( I was IMC during this - broke out
shortly later) - will be good to see what the big iron guys have to say
about this.
As a flight surgeon, it made me review what "my" limits should be in
flying IMC when tired, at night and single pilot. Something everyone
should think about.
bobf
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 9:21 AM, Jim Addington
wrote:
Robert,
My 500A was the one that S-Tec used for the STC after I hounded them
for three years. I had them install the 65 with all the whistles and
bells and I also was used to big iron where there was a warning when it
disconnected. That has been my only disappointment in that autopilot. I
looked at my map that was on a clip board and accidently laid it on the
disconnect switch. We were at night IFR and it started to drift off
before I caught what had happened. I have thought about putting a small
cup under the switch so that would not happen again but have not done it
yet because I have not been able to fly much in the last two years. A
friend of mine drew out the plans for putting trim and disconnect
switches on the right side but have not done that either. It has been a
really good autopilot.
Jim Addington
500A
N444BD
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
S. Randazzo
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 12:15 AM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Commanders-
Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when
pressing the A/P disconnect switch.
I'm spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is
announced at about 5,000db... just to make sure you notice it.
I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot-
it quietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it
disconnects in flight on it's own for some reason? EA301?
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
- The Commander-List Email Forum --->
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List -
MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - - List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin. "
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listttp://
forums.matronics.com_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
- The Commander-List Email Forum --->
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List -
MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - - List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
You could very well be right. I flew the L-1011 but retired 12 years ago and
can't remember where I laid my pen down two minutes ago any more. Jim
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of L D GIROD
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 11:59 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Jim;
I think the L-1011 accident was because the autopilot on the L-1011 had
'control wheel steering', the crew pushed forward on the yoke trying to
check or change a gear light, and put enough pressure on the yoke to start a
very slow, 50 FPM as I recall decent. Since it was a manual input the
airplane thought that was what was desired and the 250 ft. altitude warning
was bypassed. They went back and rewired that command. As I understand it,
the auto pilot was never disengaged. That and some non normal terminology
from ATC, such as "Eastern, everything OK" instead of asking why they had
left their assigned altitude. As normal, it was a series of mistakes that
let to a tragic accident.
Don
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim <mailto:jtaddington(at)verizon.net> Addington
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 11:39 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
I was not going to change the switch, just put an upside down cap under it
so I can get to it but it would be protected from being accidently punched.
The L-1011 accident in FL many years ago is why the airlines went to the
warning. I have been surprised that the light plane auto pilots don't have
that. What did you fly in the AF Reserve? To tell you how old I am I flew
the B-47 and will have had my license 50 years the 24 of this month. I flew
for Delta for almost 33 years. My medical is in jeopardy though. They have
had it for four months and finally sent me a letter that it was going to the
neurologist. At least they have not said no yet. I had 9 different Drs.
check me from stem to stern and found nothing so I think it was what I
thought all along. I had been under a lot of stress with my wife's death and
we had painted the house inside and put down new carpet. The smells is what
I think was my problem because I have not had it since.
Jim
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
Feldtman
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 10:08 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Assuming you are referring to the red disconnect switch on the yoke (horns)
-- I'd be cautious about putting anything that makes a quick disconnect
delayed in any fashion. Once on my turboprop commander, by myself, night
time, tired after a weekend of AF Reserve duty at Carswell, very busy (ATC -
go fast to the OM at Hobby!)) I got very busy over the OM, and was flying
the autopilot coupled ILS approach - the elevator command went fairly
rapidly nose up as I lowered gear, and pulled back turboprop power to flight
idle to slow down - it slowed down faster than I realized, and the AP
command was to stay on the glideslope, which meant go up, pitch up.
fortunately, I was aware and on top of it and was able to smoothly kill the
autopilot with the red quick dissconect on the yoke as I nosed it over a
little and added power. Any delay in doing that with a switch override -
could cause someone to have to fight the autopilot (which one COULD do - but
t would be unusally hard push).... so I'd be careful changing out the quick
disconnect.
I didn't stall - but it scared me ( I was IMC during this - broke out
shortly later) - will be good to see what the big iron guys have to say
about this.
As a flight surgeon, it made me review what "my" limits should be in flying
IMC when tired, at night and single pilot. Something everyone should think
about.
bobf
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 9:21 AM, Jim Addington
wrote:
Robert,
My 500A was the one that S-Tec used for the STC after I hounded them for
three years. I had them install the 65 with all the whistles and bells and I
also was used to big iron where there was a warning when it disconnected.
That has been my only disappointment in that autopilot. I looked at my map
that was on a clip board and accidently laid it on the disconnect switch. We
were at night IFR and it started to drift off before I caught what had
happened. I have thought about putting a small cup under the switch so that
would not happen again but have not done it yet because I have not been able
to fly much in the last two years. A friend of mine drew out the plans for
putting trim and disconnect switches on the right side but have not done
that either. It has been a really good autopilot.
Jim Addington
500A
N444BD
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S.
Randazzo
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 12:15 AM
Subject: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Commanders-
Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when pressing
the A/P disconnect switch.
I'm spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is announced
at about 5,000db... just to make sure you notice it.
I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot- it
quietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it
disconnects in flight on it's own for some reason? EA301?
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
- The Commander-List Email Forum -
--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
- List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
ttp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
- The Commander-List Email Forum -
<>--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
- List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
| From: | Robert Feldtman <bobf(at)feldtman.com> |
I flew a stethoscope and scalpel.... along with being a flight surgeon in
some airplanes and helicopters but could never log "stick time: :):) Back
in the good ol' days of medicine, it allowed me the ability to have a
turbo-commander - at 70 gals per hour/ but no longer! Lucky to have a
glastar that burns 7 gals per hour/
Larry Pullen and Tom LeBootllier are good buddies of mine from Delta who
have flown my commanders when we have gone fishing. They've long lost their
medicals due to heart problems. but we stay in touch.
bobf
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 10:39 AM, Jim Addington wr
ote:
> I was not going to change the switch, just put an upside down cap under
> it so I can get to it but it would be protected from being accidently
> punched. The L-1011 accident in FL many years ago is why the airlines wen
t
> to the warning. I have been surprised that the light plane auto pilots do
n=92t
> have that. What did you fly in the AF Reserve? To tell you how old I am I
> flew the B-47 and will have had my license 50 years the 24 of this month.
I
> flew for Delta for almost 33 years. My medical is in jeopardy though. The
y
> have had it for four months and finally sent me a letter that it was goin
g
> to the neurologist. At least they have not said no yet. I had 9 different
> Drs. check me from stem to stern and found nothing so I think it was what
> I thought all along. I had been under a lot of stress with my wife=92s de
ath
> and we had painted the house inside and put down new carpet. The smells i
s
> what I think was my problem because I have not had it since.
>
> Jim
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Robert Feldtman
> *Sent:* Monday, March 30, 2009 10:08 AM
> *To:* commander-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
>
>
> Assuming you are referring to the red disconnect switch on the yoke (horn
s)
> -- I'd be cautious about putting anything that makes a quick disconnect
> delayed in any fashion. Once on my turboprop commander, by myself, night
> time, tired after a weekend of AF Reserve duty at Carswell, very busy (AT
C -
> go fast to the OM at Hobby!)) I got very busy over the OM, and was flying
> the autopilot coupled ILS approach - the elevator command went fairly
> rapidly nose up as I lowered gear, and pulled back turboprop power to fli
ght
> idle to slow down - it slowed down faster than I realized, and the AP
> command was to stay on the glideslope, which meant go up, pitch up.
> fortunately, I was aware and on top of it and was able to smoothly kill t
he
> autopilot with the red quick dissconect on the yoke as I nosed it over a
> little and added power. Any delay in doing that with a switch override -
> could cause someone to have to fight the autopilot (which one COULD do -
but
> t would be unusally hard push).... so I'd be careful changing out the qui
ck
> disconnect.
>
>
> I didn't stall - but it scared me ( I was IMC during this - broke out
> shortly later) - will be good to see what the big iron guys have to say
> about this.
>
>
> As a flight surgeon, it made me review what "my" limits should be in flyi
ng
> IMC when tired, at night and single pilot. Something everyone should thin
k
> about.
>
>
> bobf
>
> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 9:21 AM, Jim Addington
> wrote:
>
> Robert,
>
> My 500A was the one that S-Tec used for the STC after I hounded them for
> three years. I had them install the 65 with all the whistles and bells an
d I
> also was used to big iron where there was a warning when it disconnected.
> That has been my only disappointment in that autopilot. I looked at my ma
p
> that was on a clip board and accidently laid it on the disconnect switch.
We
> were at night IFR and it started to drift off before I caught what had
> happened. I have thought about putting a small cup under the switch so th
at
> would not happen again but have not done it yet because I have not been a
ble
> to fly much in the last two years. A friend of mine drew out the plans fo
r
> putting trim and disconnect switches on the right side but have not done
> that either. It has been a really good autopilot.
>
> Jim Addington
>
> 500A
>
> N444BD
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Robert S.
> Randazzo
> *Sent:* Monday, March 30, 2009 12:15 AM
> *To:* commander-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
>
>
> Commanders-
>
>
> Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
>
>
> At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when pressing
> the A/P disconnect switch.
>
>
> I=92m spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is annou
nced
> at about 5,000db... just to make sure you notice it=85
>
>
> I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot- it
> quietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it
> disconnects in flight on it=92s own for some reason? EA301?
>
>
> Robert S. Randazzo
>
> N414C
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * - The Commander-List Email Forum -*
>
> *--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List*
>
> * - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -*
>
> * - List Contribution Web Site -*
>
> * -Matt Dralle, List Admin.*
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> *" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List*
>
> *ttp://forums.matronics.com*
>
> *_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
>
> * *
>
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * - The Commander-List Email Forum -*
>
> **
>
> **
>
> *--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List*
>
> **
>
> * - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -*
>
> * - List Contribution Web Site -*
>
> * -Matt Dralle, List Admin.*
>
> **
>
> * *
>
> *
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
I took my physical for the AF at Carswell and went through the altitude
chamber there too. This was in 1959. I almost forgot I got a B-36 ride there
too. I live in Denton and got on the 100th BW list and found out the
navigator we had on the crew at Pease AFB lives in Arlington and I joined
the QB's and ran in to t he Ops Officer of one of the squadrons lives in
Dallas. I had not seen either of them since 1963.
Jim
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
Feldtman
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 5:52 PM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
I flew a stethoscope and scalpel.... along with being a flight surgeon in
some airplanes and helicopters but could never log "stick time: :):) Back
in the good ol' days of medicine, it allowed me the ability to have a
turbo-commander - at 70 gals per hour/ but no longer! Lucky to have a
glastar that burns 7 gals per hour/
Larry Pullen and Tom LeBootllier are good buddies of mine from Delta who
have flown my commanders when we have gone fishing. They've long lost their
medicals due to heart problems. but we stay in touch.
bobf
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 10:39 AM, Jim Addington
wrote:
I was not going to change the switch, just put an upside down cap under it
so I can get to it but it would be protected from being accidently punched.
The L-1011 accident in FL many years ago is why the airlines went to the
warning. I have been surprised that the light plane auto pilots don't have
that. What did you fly in the AF Reserve? To tell you how old I am I flew
the B-47 and will have had my license 50 years the 24 of this month. I flew
for Delta for almost 33 years. My medical is in jeopardy though. They have
had it for four months and finally sent me a letter that it was going to the
neurologist. At least they have not said no yet. I had 9 different Drs.
check me from stem to stern and found nothing so I think it was what I
thought all along. I had been under a lot of stress with my wife's death and
we had painted the house inside and put down new carpet. The smells is what
I think was my problem because I have not had it since.
Jim
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert
Feldtman
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 10:08 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Assuming you are referring to the red disconnect switch on the yoke (horns)
-- I'd be cautious about putting anything that makes a quick disconnect
delayed in any fashion. Once on my turboprop commander, by myself, night
time, tired after a weekend of AF Reserve duty at Carswell, very busy (ATC -
go fast to the OM at Hobby!)) I got very busy over the OM, and was flying
the autopilot coupled ILS approach - the elevator command went fairly
rapidly nose up as I lowered gear, and pulled back turboprop power to flight
idle to slow down - it slowed down faster than I realized, and the AP
command was to stay on the glideslope, which meant go up, pitch up.
fortunately, I was aware and on top of it and was able to smoothly kill the
autopilot with the red quick dissconect on the yoke as I nosed it over a
little and added power. Any delay in doing that with a switch override -
could cause someone to have to fight the autopilot (which one COULD do - but
t would be unusally hard push).... so I'd be careful changing out the quick
disconnect.
I didn't stall - but it scared me ( I was IMC during this - broke out
shortly later) - will be good to see what the big iron guys have to say
about this.
As a flight surgeon, it made me review what "my" limits should be in flying
IMC when tired, at night and single pilot. Something everyone should think
about.
bobf
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 9:21 AM, Jim Addington
wrote:
Robert,
My 500A was the one that S-Tec used for the STC after I hounded them for
three years. I had them install the 65 with all the whistles and bells and I
also was used to big iron where there was a warning when it disconnected.
That has been my only disappointment in that autopilot. I looked at my map
that was on a clip board and accidently laid it on the disconnect switch. We
were at night IFR and it started to drift off before I caught what had
happened. I have thought about putting a small cup under the switch so that
would not happen again but have not done it yet because I have not been able
to fly much in the last two years. A friend of mine drew out the plans for
putting trim and disconnect switches on the right side but have not done
that either. It has been a really good autopilot.
Jim Addington
500A
N444BD
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S.
Randazzo
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 12:15 AM
Subject: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Commanders-
Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when pressing
the A/P disconnect switch.
I'm spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is announced
at about 5,000db... just to make sure you notice it.
I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot- it
quietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it
disconnects in flight on it's own for some reason? EA301?
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
- The Commander-List Email Forum -
--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
- List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
ttp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
- The Commander-List Email Forum -
--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
- List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
| From: | Robert Feldtman <bobf(at)feldtman.com> |
my off line email is bobf(at)feldtman.com
bobf
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 6:58 PM, Jim Addington wro
te:
> I took my physical for the AF at Carswell and went through the altitude
> chamber there too. This was in 1959. I almost forgot I got a B-36 ride th
ere
> too. I live in Denton and got on the 100th BW list and found out the
> navigator we had on the crew at Pease AFB lives in Arlington and I joined
> the QB=92s and ran in to t he Ops Officer of one of the squadrons lives i
n
> Dallas. I had not seen either of them since 1963.
>
> Jim
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Robert Feldtman
> *Sent:* Monday, March 30, 2009 5:52 PM
>
> *To:* commander-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
>
>
> I flew a stethoscope and scalpel.... along with being a flight surgeon in
> some airplanes and helicopters but could never log "stick time: :):) Bac
k
> in the good ol' days of medicine, it allowed me the ability to have a
> turbo-commander - at 70 gals per hour/ but no longer! Lucky to have a
> glastar that burns 7 gals per hour/
>
> Larry Pullen and Tom LeBootllier are good buddies of mine from Delta who
> have flown my commanders when we have gone fishing. They've long lost the
ir
> medicals due to heart problems. but we stay in touch.
>
> bobf
>
> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 10:39 AM, Jim Addington
> wrote:
>
> I was not going to change the switch, just put an upside down cap under i
t
> so I can get to it but it would be protected from being accidently punche
d.
> The L-1011 accident in FL many years ago is why the airlines went to the
> warning. I have been surprised that the light plane auto pilots don=92t h
ave
> that. What did you fly in the AF Reserve? To tell you how old I am I flew
> the B-47 and will have had my license 50 years the 24 of this month. I fl
ew
> for Delta for almost 33 years. My medical is in jeopardy though. They hav
e
> had it for four months and finally sent me a letter that it was going to
the
> neurologist. At least they have not said no yet. I had 9 different Drs.
> check me from stem to stern and found nothing so I think it was what I
> thought all along. I had been under a lot of stress with my wife=92s deat
h and
> we had painted the house inside and put down new carpet. The smells is wh
at
> I think was my problem because I have not had it since.
>
> Jim
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Robert Feldtman
> *Sent:* Monday, March 30, 2009 10:08 AM
>
>
> *To:* commander-list(at)matronics.com
>
> *Subject:* Re: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
>
>
> Assuming you are referring to the red disconnect switch on the yoke (horn
s)
> -- I'd be cautious about putting anything that makes a quick disconnect
> delayed in any fashion. Once on my turboprop commander, by myself, night
> time, tired after a weekend of AF Reserve duty at Carswell, very busy (AT
C -
> go fast to the OM at Hobby!)) I got very busy over the OM, and was flying
> the autopilot coupled ILS approach - the elevator command went fairly
> rapidly nose up as I lowered gear, and pulled back turboprop power to fli
ght
> idle to slow down - it slowed down faster than I realized, and the AP
> command was to stay on the glideslope, which meant go up, pitch up.
> fortunately, I was aware and on top of it and was able to smoothly kill t
he
> autopilot with the red quick dissconect on the yoke as I nosed it over a
> little and added power. Any delay in doing that with a switch override -
> could cause someone to have to fight the autopilot (which one COULD do -
but
> t would be unusally hard push).... so I'd be careful changing out the qui
ck
> disconnect.
>
>
> I didn't stall - but it scared me ( I was IMC during this - broke out
> shortly later) - will be good to see what the big iron guys have to say
> about this.
>
>
> As a flight surgeon, it made me review what "my" limits should be in flyi
ng
> IMC when tired, at night and single pilot. Something everyone should thin
k
> about.
>
>
> bobf
>
> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 9:21 AM, Jim Addington
> wrote:
>
> Robert,
>
> My 500A was the one that S-Tec used for the STC after I hounded them for
> three years. I had them install the 65 with all the whistles and bells an
d I
> also was used to big iron where there was a warning when it disconnected.
> That has been my only disappointment in that autopilot. I looked at my ma
p
> that was on a clip board and accidently laid it on the disconnect switch.
We
> were at night IFR and it started to drift off before I caught what had
> happened. I have thought about putting a small cup under the switch so th
at
> would not happen again but have not done it yet because I have not been a
ble
> to fly much in the last two years. A friend of mine drew out the plans fo
r
> putting trim and disconnect switches on the right side but have not done
> that either. It has been a really good autopilot.
>
> Jim Addington
>
> 500A
>
> N444BD
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Robert S.
> Randazzo
> *Sent:* Monday, March 30, 2009 12:15 AM
> *To:* commander-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
>
>
> Commanders-
>
>
> Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
>
>
> At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when pressing
> the A/P disconnect switch.
>
>
> I=92m spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is annou
nced
> at about 5,000db... just to make sure you notice it=85
>
>
> I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot- it
> quietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it
> disconnects in flight on it=92s own for some reason? EA301?
>
>
> Robert S. Randazzo
>
> N414C
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * - The Commander-List Email Forum -*
>
> *--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List*
>
> * - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -*
>
> * - List Contribution Web Site -*
>
> * -Matt Dralle, List Admin.*
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> *" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List*
>
> *ttp://forums.matronics.com*
>
> *_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
>
> * *
>
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * - The Commander-List Email Forum -*
>
> *--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List*
>
> * - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -*
>
> * - List Contribution Web Site -*
>
> * -Matt Dralle, List Admin.*
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> *" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List*
>
> * *
>
> *tp://forums.matronics.com*
>
> *_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
>
> * *
>
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * - The Commander-List Email Forum -*
>
> **
>
> **
>
> *--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List*
>
> **
>
> * - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -*
>
> * - List Contribution Web Site -*
>
> * -Matt Dralle, List Admin.*
>
> **
>
> * *
>
> *
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com> |
| Subject: | S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
Jim-
Thanks- I suspected this would be the case. In the pin diagrams there is
mention of wires for an aural warning, but nobody at S-Tec could tell us
why- or how to implement them in the installation. I suspect it was part of
the design that was never implemented.
So far I'm really enjoying the 65 autopilot. It's an older design that is
missing some of the VNAV/LPV capabilities of the newer digital autopilots-
but most of the transports I've flown didn't have those capabilities either-
so I'll probably not miss them. And then there's the old decision making
theory that while flying myself around single pilot- I probably shouldn't
put myself into a position to need those capabilities. ;-)
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim
Addington
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 7:21 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Robert,
My 500A was the one that S-Tec used for the STC after I hounded them for
three years. I had them install the 65 with all the whistles and bells and I
also was used to big iron where there was a warning when it disconnected.
That has been my only disappointment in that autopilot. I looked at my map
that was on a clip board and accidently laid it on the disconnect switch. We
were at night IFR and it started to drift off before I caught what had
happened. I have thought about putting a small cup under the switch so that
would not happen again but have not done it yet because I have not been able
to fly much in the last two years. A friend of mine drew out the plans for
putting trim and disconnect switches on the right side but have not done
that either. It has been a really good autopilot.
Jim Addington
500A
N444BD
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S.
Randazzo
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 12:15 AM
Subject: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Commanders-
Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when pressing
the A/P disconnect switch.
I'm spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is announced
at about 5,000db... just to make sure you notice it.
I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot- it
quietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it
disconnects in flight on it's own for some reason? EA301?
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
- The Commander-List Email Forum -
--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
- List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dan Farmer <daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com> |
Robert,
I have an S tec 65 and I do not have an aural warning either.- I will try
to check my manual for the AP to see.-
dan f
=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
| From: | "Deneal Schilmeister (MacbookPro)" <deneals(at)deneals.com> |
When Robert first posed this question, I thought oh yeah, the Lears I flew
(part 25 cert) had aural warnings.
Then I remembered that the brand new Cessna 421C I flew in 1978 had aural
warnings as well. So its not a Part 23 vs 25 thing I guess.
--
Deneal Schilmeister
911 Imperial Pt
Manchester, MO 63021-6934
(636) 825-2335 home
(314) 956-3344 cell
deneals(at)deneals.com
http://deneals.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning? |
It has been so long since I flew IFR that I would not dare try it unless it
was a high ceiling. I have filled that square. If I don't get my medical
back I may have to sell the plane anyway.
Jim
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S.
Randazzo
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 7:39 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Jim-
Thanks- I suspected this would be the case. In the pin diagrams there is
mention of wires for an aural warning, but nobody at S-Tec could tell us
why- or how to implement them in the installation. I suspect it was part of
the design that was never implemented.
So far I'm really enjoying the 65 autopilot. It's an older design that is
missing some of the VNAV/LPV capabilities of the newer digital autopilots-
but most of the transports I've flown didn't have those capabilities either-
so I'll probably not miss them. And then there's the old decision making
theory that while flying myself around single pilot- I probably shouldn't
put myself into a position to need those capabilities. ;-)
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim
Addington
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 7:21 AM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Robert,
My 500A was the one that S-Tec used for the STC after I hounded them for
three years. I had them install the 65 with all the whistles and bells and I
also was used to big iron where there was a warning when it disconnected.
That has been my only disappointment in that autopilot. I looked at my map
that was on a clip board and accidently laid it on the disconnect switch. We
were at night IFR and it started to drift off before I caught what had
happened. I have thought about putting a small cup under the switch so that
would not happen again but have not done it yet because I have not been able
to fly much in the last two years. A friend of mine drew out the plans for
putting trim and disconnect switches on the right side but have not done
that either. It has been a really good autopilot.
Jim Addington
500A
N444BD
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S.
Randazzo
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 12:15 AM
Subject: Commander-List: S-Tec A/P Disconnect Warning?
Commanders-
Anyone here have much experience with the S-Tec System 65 autopilot?
At issue is whether or not there should be an aural warning when pressing
the A/P disconnect switch.
I'm spoiled by all the transport time where the A/P disconnect is announced
at about 5,000db... just to make sure you notice it.
I find it strange that when I hit the disco button on this autopilot- it
quietly releases the airplane without so much as a peep. What if it
disconnects in flight on it's own for some reason? EA301?
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
- The Commander-List Email Forum -
--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
- List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au |
Donnie,
Last time I needed disks and pads, an internet search produced several suppliers
cheaper than Spruce, particularly the disks.
Sorry I don't have a note of who -- and the invoice is long filed.
Cheers,
Bill Hamilton
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Moe-rosspistons wrote:
>
> Donnie,
>
> Aircraft Spruce has always been the cheapest for Cleveland parts that I
> have found.
>
> Moe Mills
> N680RR
> Proud Holder of The Golden Pedal Award
>
>
> From: Donnie Rose
> Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 6:55 PM
> To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Commander-List: brakes
>
>
> Hey there, anyone know the cheapest place to get Cleveland brake pads?
> thanks again,
>
> Donnie Rose
> 205/492-8444
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Moe-rosspistons" <moe-rosspistons(at)hotmail.com> |
Bill,
Thanks for this. Given the airport that I fly out of now, and that my
landing weight is usually well over 7,000 pounds I am really hard on the
brakes.
Regards,
Moe
N680RR
Proud Holder of The Golden Pedal Award
--------------------------------------------------
From: <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>
Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2009 4:29 AM
Subject: Re: Re: Commander-List: brakes
>
>
> Donnie,
> Last time I needed disks and pads, an internet search produced several
> suppliers cheaper than Spruce, particularly the disks.
> Sorry I don't have a note of who -- and the invoice is long filed.
> Cheers,
> Bill Hamilton
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Moe-rosspistons wrote:
>>
>> Donnie,
>>
>> Aircraft Spruce has always been the cheapest for Cleveland parts that I
>> have found.
>>
>> Moe Mills
>> N680RR
>> Proud Holder of The Golden Pedal Award
>>
>>
>> From: Donnie Rose
>> Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 6:55 PM
>> To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
>> Subject: Commander-List: brakes
>>
>>
>> Hey there, anyone know the cheapest place to get Cleveland brake pads?
>> thanks again,
>>
>> Donnie Rose
>> 205/492-8444
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Commander needed for a Museum |
Hi Guys,
I've been contacted by a Mr W Warren, who is the Curator of the CAN-AM
Museum in Huntsville, Ontario, Canada.
He is looking to acquire "a large early Commander in any condition
located anywhere for sale etc.", for the Museum.
If anyone can offer suggestions of suitable candidates, please let me
know.
Ideally, the "N" number or Serial Number and location will be good info
to start with, and enable us to follow up the lead.
Very Best Regards,
Barry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tylor Hall <tylor.hall(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Commander needed for a Museum |
Berry,
There is a 680 in Caldwell, ID. It has engines and props off a Queen
Air.
The props have value, the engines do not fit the airframe but it has
flown with them.
It has no interior and only two seats.
Tylor Hall
On Mar 31, 2009, at 8:45 AM, Barry Collman wrote:
> Hi Guys,
>
> I've been contacted by a Mr W Warren, who is the Curator of the CAN-
> AM Museum in Huntsville, Ontario, Canada.
>
> He is looking to acquire "a large early Commander in any condition
> located anywhere for sale etc.", for the Museum.
>
> If anyone can offer suggestions of suitable candidates, please let
> me know.
> Ideally, the "N" number or Serial Number and location will be good
> info to start with, and enable us to follow up the lead.
>
> Very Best Regards,
> Barry
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Donnie Rose <aquadiver99(at)yahoo.com> |
Thank you Bill and good flying.=0A-=0ADonnie Rose =0A205/492-8444=0A=0A
=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: Moe-rosspistons <moe-r
osspistons(at)hotmail.com>=0ATo: commander-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Tuesday,
March 31, 2009 8:40:47 AM=0ASubject: Re: Re: Commander-List: brakes=0A=0A-
mail.com>=0A=0ABill,=0A=0AThanks for this.- Given the airport that I fly
out of now, and that my =0Alanding weight is usually well over 7,000 pounds
I am really hard on the =0Abrakes.=0ARegards,=0A=0AMoe=0AN680RR=0AProud Ho
lder of The Golden Pedal Award=0A=0A=0A------------------------------------
--------------=0AFrom: <wjrhamilton(at)optusnet.com.au>=0ASent: Tuesday, March
31, 2009 4:29 AM=0ATo: =0ASubject: Re: Re: C
ton(at)optusnet.com.au=0A>=0A>=0A> Donnie,=0A> Last time I needed disks and pa
ds, an internet search produced several =0A> suppliers cheaper than Spruce,
particularly the disks.=0A> Sorry I don't have a note of who -- and the in
voice is long filed.=0A> Cheers,=0A> Bill Hamilton=0A>=0A> ----------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------=0A>> Moe-rosspistons wrote:=0A>>=0A>> Donnie,=0A>>=0A>> Aircraft Spruc
e has always been the cheapest for Cleveland parts that I=0A>> have found.
=0A>>=0A>> Moe Mills=0A>> N680RR=0A>> Proud Holder of The Golden Pedal Awar
d=0A>>=0A>>=0A>> From: Donnie Rose=0A>> Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 6:55 P
M=0A>> To: commander-list(at)matronics.com=0A>> Subject: Commander-List: brake
s=0A>>=0A>>=0A>> Hey there, anyone know the cheapest place to get Cleveland
brake pads?=0A>> thanks again,=0A>>=0A>> Donnie Rose=0A>> 205/492-8444=0A>
=========================0A
=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | 2009 TCFG Fly-In |
| From: | yourtcfg(at)aol.com |
We're excited to announce that we have scheduled this year=99s TCFG Fl
y-In at a time and place to coincide with the Reno Air Races, September 17-2
0th.=C2- We have made arrangements to host the event at the Carson City Ne
vada Airport which is only 28 miles from Reno.=C2-
=C2-
Our thought was to arrive on Wednesday, have seminars on Thursday and Friday
with the Awards dinner being Friday night as well.=C2- This would leave S
aturday and Sunday open for you to attend the races.=C2- If there is enoug
h interest in attending the races we will check into group transportation.
=C2- Since this is a departure from our normal schedule, we would love to
hear what you think.=C2- Please drop us an e-mail or give us a call to giv
e us your ideas.=C2-
The best deal for attending the races would be box seating on the flight lin
e which can be arranged for groups of 10-15 (may need two boxes) at the cost
of $300 per person=C2-which includes parking, pit passes and admission fo
r both days.=C2-=C2-These go fast so we will need to hear from you withi
n the next 30 days in order to=C2-secure reservations -- the sooner the be
tter.=C2-=C2-Once we make reservations there will be no refunds.=C2-
Also, John Towner has made arrangements for us to visit Hoover in the Pit.
=C2-=C2-Wow, what a great opportunity!!!
=C2-
You=99ll want to come early to explore the area as there is a lot to d
o and see.=C2- Some ideas for excursions include the Nevada Railroad Museu
m, the Kit Ca
rson trail, Virginia City or Lake Tahoe, play one of several golf courses or
try your luck at the casinos.=C2- Whatever your fancy, there is something
for you in this area.=C2-
=C2-
We=99re in the final stages of negotiation for a block of hotel rooms
and will let you know as soon as it has been finalized.=C2-
=C2-
We believe this could be one our best attended event ever.=C2- Looking for
ward to seeing all of you at this event.=C2-
Jim & Sue
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: FW: 50 years of Math |
| From: | yourtcfg(at)aol.com |
AMEN, AMEN, AMEN, AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?
And the want a better contract with
more taxpayer dollars, after all, it is for the chiiiiildern!!? jb
-----Original Message-----
From: daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com
Sent: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 8:33 am
Subject: Commander-List: FW: 50 years of Math
? I am sorry I could not help myself with this.? Blame who you will but unfortunately
this is the truth in todays world.? I personally just love the NEA.
?
?
Subject: FW: 50 years of Math
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
Subject: 50 years of Math
?
Fifty?Years of ?Math 1959 - 2009?(in the? USA?)
Last week I purchased a burger at Burger King for $1.58. The counter girl took
my $ 2 and I was digging for my change when I pulled 8 cents from my pocket and
gave it to her. She stood there, holding the nickel and 3 pennies, while looking
at the screen on her register. I sensed her discomfort and tried to tell
her to just give me two quarters , but she hailed the manager for help. While
he tried to explain the transaction to her, she stood there and cried. Why do
I tell you this? ?Because of the evolution in teaching math since the 1950s:
1. Teaching Math In 1950s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5 of
the price. What is his profit ?
2. Teaching Math In 1960s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5 of
the price, or $80. What is his profit?
3. Teaching Math In 1970s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is $80. Did
he make a profit?
4.. Teaching Math In 1980s
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is $80 and
his profit is $20. Your assignment: Underline the number 20.
5. Teaching Math In 1990s
A logger cuts down a beautiful forest because he is selfish and inconsiderate and
cares nothing for the habitat of animals or the preservation of our woodlands.
He does this so he can make a profit of $20. What do you think of this way
of making a living? Topic for class participation after answering the question:
How did the birds and squirrels feel as the logger cut down their homes? (There
are no wrong answers, and if you feel like crying, it's ok. )
6. Teaching Math In 2009
Un hachero vende una carretada de maderapara $100. El costo de la producciones
es $80. Cuanto dinero ha hecho?
?
?
Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make meals for under $10.
?
?
size=2 width="100%" align=center>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
| Subject: | 2009 TCFG Fly-In |
Shall I put this information on the website already?
Nico
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
yourtcfg(at)aol.com
Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2009 1:10 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 2009 TCFG Fly-In
We're excited to announce that we have scheduled this year's TCFG Fly-In at
a time and place to coincide with the Reno Air Races, September 17-20th. We
have made arrangements to host the event at the Carson City Nevada Airport
which is only 28 miles from Reno.
Our thought was to arrive on Wednesday, have seminars on Thursday and Friday
with the Awards dinner being Friday night as well. This would leave
Saturday and Sunday open for you to attend the races. If there is enough
interest in attending the races we will check into group transportation.
Since this is a departure from our normal schedule, we would love to hear
what you think. Please drop us an e-mail or give us a call to give us your
ideas.
The best deal for attending the races would be box seating on the flight
line which can be arranged for groups of 10-15 (may need two boxes) at the
cost of $300 per person which includes parking, pit passes and admission for
both days. These go fast so we will need to hear from you within the next
30 days in order to secure reservations -- the sooner the better. Once we
make reservations there will be no refunds.
Also, John Towner has made arrangements for us to visit Hoover in the Pit.
Wow, what a great opportunity!!!
You'll want to come early to explore the area as there is a lot to do and
see. Some ideas for excursions include the Nevada Railroad Museum, the Kit
Carson trail, Virginia City or Lake Tahoe, play one of several golf courses
or try your luck at the casinos. Whatever your fancy, there is something
for you in this area.
We're in the final stages of negotiation for a block of hotel rooms and will
let you know as soon as it has been finalized.
We believe this could be one our best attended event ever. Looking forward
to seeing all of you at this event.
Jim & Sue
_____
The Average US Credit Score is 692. See
p:%2F%2Fwww.freecreditreport.com%2Fpm%2Fdefault.aspx%3Fsc%3D668072%26hmpgID%
3D62%26bcd%3DAprilAvgfooterNO62> Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 2009 TCFG Fly-In |
| From: | yourtcfg(at)aol.com |
Yes Please.=C2- We'll have more details to add later obviously, but will b
e good to get the initial information out.
Thanks Nico!!!
~jb
-----Original Message-----
From: nico css <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Sent: Sun, 5 Apr 2009 1:47 pm
Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2009 TCFG Fly-In
Shall I put this information on the website already?
Nico
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-commander-list
-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of yourtcfg(at)aol.com
Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2009 1:10 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 2009 TCFG Fly-In
We're excited to announce that we have scheduled this year=99s TCFG Fl
y-In at a time and place to coincide with the Reno Air Races, September 17-2
0th.=C2- We have made arrangements to host the event at the Carson City Ne
vada Airport which is only 28 miles from Reno.=C2-
=C2-
Our thought was to arrive on Wednesday, have seminars on Thursday and Friday
with the Awards dinner being Friday night as well.=C2- This would leave S
aturday and Sunday open for you to attend the races.=C2- If there is enoug
h interest in attending the races we will check into group transportation.
=C2- Since this is a departure from our normal schedule, we would love to
hear what you think.=C2- Please drop us an e-mail or give us a call to giv
e us your ideas.=C2-
The best deal for attending the races would be box seating on the flight lin
e which can be arranged for groups of 10-15 (may need two boxes
) at the cost of $300 per person=C2-which includes parking, pit passes and
admission for both days.=C2-=C2-These go fast so we will need to hear f
rom you within the next 30 days in order to=C2-secure reservations -- the
sooner the better.=C2-=C2-Once we make reservations there will be no ref
unds.=C2-
Also, John Towner has made arrangements for us to visit Hoover in the Pit.
=C2-=C2-Wow, what a great opportunity!!!
=C2-
You=99ll want to come early to explore the area as there is a lot to d
o and see.=C2- Some ideas for excursions include the Nevada Railroad Museu
m, the Kit Carson trail, Virginia City or Lake Tahoe, play one of several go
lf courses or try your luck at the casinos.=C2- Whatever your fancy, there
is something for you in this area.=C2-
=C2-
We=99re in the final stages of negotiation for a block of hotel rooms
and will let you know as soon as it has been finalized.=C2-
=C2-
We believe this could be one our best attended event ever.=C2- Looking for
ward to seeing all of you at this event.=C2-
Jim & Sue
The Average US Credit Score is 692. See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps!
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List"http://www.matro
nics.com/Navigator?Commander-List href="http://forums.matronics.com"http:/
/forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution"http://w
ww.matronics.com/c
==
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Moe-rosspistons" <moe-rosspistons(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 2009 TCFG Fly-In |
JB,
Good stuff! We will be there.
Moe Mills
N680RR
From: yourtcfg(at)aol.com
Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2009 1:10 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 2009 TCFG Fly-In
We're excited to announce that we have scheduled this year=99s
TCFG Fly-In at a time and place to coincide with the Reno Air Races,
September 17-20th. We have made arrangements to host the event at the
Carson City Nevada Airport which is only 28 miles from Reno.
Our thought was to arrive on Wednesday, have seminars on Thursday and
Friday with the Awards dinner being Friday night as well. This would
leave Saturday and Sunday open for you to attend the races. If there is
enough interest in attending the races we will check into group
transportation. Since this is a departure from our normal schedule, we
would love to hear what you think. Please drop us an e-mail or give us
a call to give us your ideas.
The best deal for attending the races would be box seating on the flight
line which can be arranged for groups of 10-15 (may need two boxes) at
the cost of $300 per person which includes parking, pit passes and
admission for both days. These go fast so we will need to hear from you
within the next 30 days in order to secure reservations -- the sooner
the better. Once we make reservations there will be no refunds.
Also, John Towner has made arrangements for us to visit Hoover in the
Pit. Wow, what a great opportunity!!!
You=99ll want to come early to explore the area as there is a lot
to do and see. Some ideas for excursions include the Nevada Railroad
Museum, the Kit Carson trail, Virginia City or Lake Tahoe, play one of
several golf courses or try your luck at the casinos. Whatever your
fancy, there is something for you in this area.
We=99re in the final stages of negotiation for a block of hotel
rooms and will let you know as soon as it has been finalized.
We believe this could be one our best attended event ever. Looking
forward to seeing all of you at this event.
Jim & Sue
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
The Average US Credit Score is 692. See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WINGFLYER1(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: 2009 TCFG Fly-In |
Sounds like fun. Gil Walker
**************Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for $10 or
less. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com> |
| Subject: | 2009 TCFG Fly-In |
You guys are conspiring to keep me from flying N414C.
Had to sit out the last two fly-in=99s because of overhaul work-
and now that I have a flyable bird you guys bring the party to me. J I
might have to make the 30nm flight just to say I flew in.
We=99ll be racing T-6 #8 =9CGrace 8=9D at the air
races as usual- so we can probably coordinate some hospitality in the
pit area for those coming up for the TCFG fly-in.
Let me know if there is any interest.
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
yourtcfg(at)aol.com
Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2009 1:10 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 2009 TCFG Fly-In
We're excited to announce that we have scheduled this year=99s
TCFG Fly-In at a time and place to coincide with the Reno Air Races,
September 17-20th. We have made arrangements to host the event at the
Carson City Nevada Airport which is only 28 miles from Reno.
Our thought was to arrive on Wednesday, have seminars on Thursday and
Friday with the Awards dinner being Friday night as well. This would
leave Saturday and Sunday open for you to attend the races. If there is
enough interest in attending the races we will check into group
transportation. Since this is a departure from our normal schedule, we
would love to hear what you think. Please drop us an e-mail or give us
a call to give us your ideas.
The best deal for attending the races would be box seating on the flight
line which can be arranged for groups of 10-15 (may need two boxes) at
the cost of $300 per personwhich includes parking, pit passes and
admission for both days. These go fast so we will need to hear from you
within the next 30 days in order to secure reservations -- the sooner
the better. Once we make reservations there will be no refunds.
Also, John Towner has made arrangements for us to visit Hoover in the
Pit. Wow, what a great opportunity!!!
You=99ll want to come early to explore the area as there is a lot
to do and see. Some ideas for excursions include the Nevada Railroad
Museum, the Kit Carson trail, Virginia City or Lake Tahoe, play one of
several golf courses or try your luck at the casinos. Whatever your
fancy, there is something for you in this area.
We=99re in the final stages of negotiation for a block of hotel
rooms and will let you know as soon as it has been finalized.
We believe this could be one our best attended event ever. Looking
forward to seeing all of you at this event.
Jim & Sue
_____
The Average US Credit Score is 692. See
http:%2F%2Fwww.freecreditreport.com%2Fpm%2Fdefault.aspx%3Fsc%3D668072%26h
mpgID%3D62%26bcd%3DAprilAvgfooterNO62> Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Vormbaum" <john(at)vormbaum.com> |
| Subject: | 2009 TCFG Fly-In |
Robert, there's always the chance my overhaul won't be done....so you can
fly down to PAO and pick me up :-). At least you know a fellow Commander
pilot is (usually) good for gas money!
/John
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S.
Randazzo
Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2009 7:34 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: 2009 TCFG Fly-In
You guys are conspiring to keep me from flying N414C.
Had to sit out the last two fly-in's because of overhaul work- and now that
I have a flyable bird you guys bring the party to me. J I might have to
make the 30nm flight just to say I flew in..
We'll be racing T-6 #8 "Grace 8" at the air races as usual- so we can
probably coordinate some hospitality in the pit area for those coming up for
the TCFG fly-in.
Let me know if there is any interest.
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
yourtcfg(at)aol.com
Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2009 1:10 PM
Subject: Commander-List: 2009 TCFG Fly-In
We're excited to announce that we have scheduled this year's TCFG Fly-In at
a time and place to coincide with the Reno Air Races, September 17-20th. We
have made arrangements to host the event at the Carson City Nevada Airport
which is only 28 miles from Reno.
Our thought was to arrive on Wednesday, have seminars on Thursday and Friday
with the Awards dinner being Friday night as well. This would leave
Saturday and Sunday open for you to attend the races. If there is enough
interest in attending the races we will check into group transportation.
Since this is a departure from our normal schedule, we would love to hear
what you think. Please drop us an e-mail or give us a call to give us your
ideas.
The best deal for attending the races would be box seating on the flight
line which can be arranged for groups of 10-15 (may need two boxes) at the
cost of $300 per personwhich includes parking, pit passes and admission for
both days. These go fast so we will need to hear from you within the next
30 days in order to secure reservations -- the sooner the better. Once we
make reservations there will be no refunds.
Also, John Towner has made arrangements for us to visit Hoover in the Pit.
Wow, what a great opportunity!!!
You'll want to come early to explore the area as there is a lot to do and
see. Some ideas for excursions include the Nevada Railroad Museum, the Kit
Carson trail, Virginia City or Lake Tahoe, play one of several golf courses
or try your luck at the casinos. Whatever your fancy, there is something
for you in this area.
We're in the final stages of negotiation for a block of hotel rooms and will
let you know as soon as it has been finalized.
We believe this could be one our best attended event ever. Looking forward
to seeing all of you at this event.
Jim & Sue
_____
The Average US Credit Score is 692. See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps!
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 2009 TCFG Fly-In |
| From: | Russell Legg <rlegg(at)austarnet.com.au> |
Hi Jim & Sue,
Reno and Carson City sound great...thanks for letting us know...should be
able to do the dates.
Cheers from Oz
Russell
On 6/4/09 5:40 AM, "yourtcfg(at)aol.com" wrote:
> We're excited to announce that we have scheduled this year=B9s TCFG Fly-In
at a
> time and place to coincide with the Reno Air Races, September 17-20th. W
e
> have made arrangements to host the event at the Carson City Nevada Airpor
t
> which is only 28 miles from Reno.
>
> Our thought was to arrive on Wednesday, have seminars on Thursday and Fri
day
> with the Awards dinner being Friday night as well. This would leave Satu
rday
> and Sunday open for you to attend the races. If there is enough interest
in
> attending the races we will check into group transportation. Since this
is a
> departure from our normal schedule, we would love to hear what you think.
> Please drop us an e-mail or give us a call to give us your ideas.
>
> The best deal for attending the races would be box seating on the flight
line
> which can be arranged for groups of 10-15 (may need two boxes) at the cos
t of
> $300 per person which includes parking, pit passes and admission for both
> days. These go fast so we will need to hear from you within the next 30
days
> in order to secure reservations -- the sooner the better. Once we make
> reservations there will be no refunds.
>
> Also, John Towner has made arrangements for us to visit Hoover in the Pit
.
> Wow, what a great opportunity!!!
>
> You=B9ll want to come early to explore the area as there is a lot to do and
see.
> Some ideas for excursions include the Nevada Railroad Museum, the Kit Car
son
> trail, Virginia City or Lake Tahoe, play one of several golf courses or t
ry
> your luck at the casinos. Whatever your fancy, there is something for yo
u in
> this area.
>
> We=B9re in the final stages of negotiation for a block of hotel rooms and w
ill
> let you know as soon as it has been finalized.
>
> We believe this could be one our best attended event ever. Looking forwa
rd to
> seeing all of you at this event.
>
> Jim & Sue
>
>
> The Average US Credit Score is 692. See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps!
http:
> %2F%2Fwww.freecreditreport.com%2Fpm%2Fdefault.aspx%3Fsc%3D668072%26hmpgID
%3D62
> %26bcd%3DAprilAvgfooterNO62>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dan Farmer <daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com> |
Count on Teresa and I for a couple.- As for transportation we could all c
rowd into a couple commanders and enter the airshow, just like the rodeo wh
ere they put 30 kids in a VW. - After I was taught by the second best com
mander pilot I am ready to put 69U in the races.
By the way I came across an interesting site for those of you that want a m
ore modern engine for your commander. http://www.mistral-engines.com-
dan f
=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MASON CHEVAILLIER <kamala(at)MSN.COM> |
| Subject: | 2009 TCFG Fly-In |
jm=2C please to include N70QT. tnx gmc
Subject: Commander-List: 2009 TCFG Fly-In
Date: Sun=2C 5 Apr 2009 16:10:06 -0400
From: yourtcfg(at)aol.com
We're excited to announce that we have scheduled this year=92s TCFG Fly-In
at a time and place to coincide with the Reno Air Races=2C September 17-20t
h. We have made arrangements to host the event at the Carson City Nevada A
irport which is only 28 miles from Reno.
Our thought was to arrive on Wednesday=2C have seminars on Thursday and Fri
day with the Awards dinner being Friday night as well. This would leave Sa
turday and Sunday open for you to attend the races. If there is enough int
erest in attending the races we will check into group transportation. Sinc
e this is a departure from our normal schedule=2C we would love to hear wha
t you think. Please drop us an e-mail or give us a call to give us your id
eas.
The best deal for attending the races would be box seating on the flight li
ne which can be arranged for groups of 10-15 (may need two boxes) at the co
st of $300 per person which includes parking=2C pit passes and admission fo
r both days. These go fast so we will need to hear from you within the nex
t 30 days in order to secure reservations -- the sooner the better. Once w
e make reservations there will be no refunds.
Also=2C John Towner has made arrangements for us to visit Hoover in the Pit
. Wow=2C what a great opportunity!!!
You=92ll want to come early to explore the area as there is a lot to do and
see. Some ideas for excursions include the Nevada Railroad Museum=2C the
Kit Carson trail=2C Virginia City or Lake Tahoe=2C play one of several golf
courses or try your luck at the casinos. Whatever your fancy=2C there is
something for you in this area.
We=92re in the final stages of negotiation for a block of hotel rooms and w
ill let you know as soon as it has been finalized.
We believe this could be one our best attended event ever. Looking forward
to seeing all of you at this event.
Jim & Sue
The Average US Credit Score is 692. See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | FUEL BOOST PUMP 500B |
| From: | lloyd SILVERMAN <lloydsss(at)gmail.com> |
*ANYONE KNOW WHERE TO OBTAIN PARTS FOR ADEL FUEL BOOST PUMP #55895 FOR 500B,
OR A REPLACEMENT THAT WONT BANKRUPT ME. THANKS, LLOYD SILVERMAN*
--
LLOYD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | FUEL BOOST PUMP 500B |
You might want to talk to John Towner. If I remember right he has a mod that
is a big improvement for the boost pump.
Jim Addington
N444BD
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of lloyd
SILVERMAN
Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2009 9:36 PM
Subject: Commander-List: FUEL BOOST PUMP 500B
ANYONE KNOW WHERE TO OBTAIN PARTS FOR ADEL FUEL BOOST PUMP #55895 FOR 500B,
OR A REPLACEMENT THAT WONT BANKRUPT ME. THANKS, LLOYD SILVERMAN
--
LLOYD
________________________________________________________________________________
Hi JimBob!
Quite a while since I sent one of these updates, but nothing much has
been happening!
Here's few new Owners & Addresses:
520-93, N4186B
Bruce Campbell has changed address to 804 216th PL (Place?) NE.,
Sammamish, Washington, 98074-6809
His 520 was hit by a fuel truck at Seattle-Boeing Field on 15Mar07 and I
thought it had been declared a write-off?
680E-777-49, N8445C
Now with Jody S Maddox, PO Box 246, Paterson, Washington, 99345-0246
HIs 'phone number is possibly 206 887 4829
There's some kind of problem with the FAA paperwok though - they list it
as "Registration Pending".
He also has had 680E-380 (a converted 680) N6863S since March 1993, but
this one is still listed by the FAA as domiciled at Ridgefield WA as
they need a physical address rather than the PO Box number he quoted on
his Application for Registration.
At one time, he also owned 680FLP-1483-8, N136HL, from February 1993 to
October 1994.
680E-802-57, N8468C
Now with Barron Thomas Southwest Inc., with a convenience address at
3511 Silverside Road, Suite 102, Wilmington, Delaware
Very Best Regards,
Barry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scottmain2003(at)aol.com |
Anyone know if this airframe still around. They closed a hangar in PMP and
I ended up with a box of papers for that N#. Will forward if the owner is
interested.
Scott
**************The Average US Credit Score is 692. See Yours in Just 2 Easy
Steps!
mpgID%3D62%26bcd%3DAprilAvgfooterNO62)
________________________________________________________________________________
Hi Scott,
This is a 680FL, Serial Number 1739-141 and as far as I know, it's still
around.
Current Owner is:
Sanborn Map Company Inc
(Attention of John A Copple or David A Brostuen)
1935 Jamboree Drive
Suite 100
Colorado Springs
Colorado 80920-5358
Telephone number is 719 593 0093.
Email address is coloradosprings(at)sanborn.com
CEO/Secretary is Ms Mary A Wild.
I think they have 3 other Commanders too.
I'm sure they will be very grateful to receive the paperwork you found
at Pompano Beach.
Best Regards,
Barry Collman
----- Original Message -----
From: Scottmain2003(at)aol.com
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2009 4:15 PM
Subject: Commander-List: N4998e
Anyone know if this airframe still around. They closed a hangar in PMP
and I ended up with a box of papers for that N#. Will forward if the
owner is interested.
Scott
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
The Average US
Credit9x1201450100/aol?redir=http:%2F%2Fwww.freecreditreport.com%2Fpm%2
Fdefault.aspx%3Fsc%3D668072%26hmpgID%3D62%26bcd%3DAprilAvgfooterNO62>
See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BertBerry1(at)aol.com |
Its still around, belongs to a mapping company, Sanborn I think. Saw it
in Colorado a few weeks ago.
Bert
In a message dated 4/13/2009 10:36:17 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
Scottmain2003(at)aol.com writes:
Anyone know if this airframe still around. They closed a hangar in PMP and
I ended up with a box of papers for that N#. Will forward if the owner is
interested.
Scott
____________________________________
The Average US
Credit9x1201450100/aol?redir=http:%2F%2Fwww.freecreditreport.com%2Fpm%2Fdefault.aspx%3Fsc%3D668072%26hmpgID%3D62%26bcd%3DAprilAvgfooterN
O62> See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps!
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List)
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution)
**************Access 350+ FREE radio stations anytime from anywhere on the
web. Get the Radio Toolbar!
(http://toolbar.aol.com/aolradio/download.html?ncid=emlweusdown00000035&ncid=emlcntusdown00000002)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | COMMANDER MEETING ARIZONA |
| From: | yourtcfg(at)aol.com |
HI KIDS.
Just a reminder that the Commander factory will be holding their "University" next
month.? I plan to attend.? There will be several other TCFG members present
and i hope to see you there.? As you know, Jim Mathison recently and the new
owners will be there.? Contact Twin Commander to register.? jm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bruce Campbell <brcamp(at)windows.microsoft.com> |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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve at Col-East" <steve2(at)sover.net> |
And it could still be yours.
http://www.wingwalkers.com/classified/index.php?a=2&b=6233
http://www.airport-data.com/aircraft/N4998E.html
----- Original Message -----
From: Barry Collman
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2009 11:55 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: N4998e
Hi Scott,
This is a 680FL, Serial Number 1739-141 and as far as I know, it's
still around.
Current Owner is:
Sanborn Map Company Inc
(Attention of John A Copple or David A Brostuen)
1935 Jamboree Drive
Suite 100
Colorado Springs
Colorado 80920-5358
Telephone number is 719 593 0093.
Email address is coloradosprings(at)sanborn.com
CEO/Secretary is Ms Mary A Wild.
I think they have 3 other Commanders too.
I'm sure they will be very grateful to receive the paperwork you found
at Pompano Beach.
Best Regards,
Barry Collman
----- Original Message -----
From: Scottmain2003(at)aol.com
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2009 4:15 PM
Subject: Commander-List: N4998e
Anyone know if this airframe still around. They closed a hangar in
PMP and I ended up with a box of papers for that N#. Will forward if the
owner is interested.
Scott
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
The Average US
Credit9x1201450100/aol?redir=http:%2F%2Fwww.freecreditreport.com%2Fpm%2
Fdefault.aspx%3Fsc%3D668072%26hmpgID%3D62%26bcd%3DAprilAvgfooterNO62>
See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps!
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve at Col-East" <steve2(at)sover.net> |
I thought I remembered seeing this one being for sale maybe a year ago.
Had a camera hole....
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: Barry Collman
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2009 11:55 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: N4998e
Hi Scott,
This is a 680FL, Serial Number 1739-141 and as far as I know, it's
still around.
Current Owner is:
Sanborn Map Company Inc
(Attention of John A Copple or David A Brostuen)
1935 Jamboree Drive
Suite 100
Colorado Springs
Colorado 80920-5358
Telephone number is 719 593 0093.
Email address is coloradosprings(at)sanborn.com
CEO/Secretary is Ms Mary A Wild.
I think they have 3 other Commanders too.
I'm sure they will be very grateful to receive the paperwork you found
at Pompano Beach.
Best Regards,
Barry Collman
----- Original Message -----
From: Scottmain2003(at)aol.com
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2009 4:15 PM
Subject: Commander-List: N4998e
Anyone know if this airframe still around. They closed a hangar in
PMP and I ended up with a box of papers for that N#. Will forward if the
owner is interested.
Scott
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
The Average US
Credit9x1201450100/aol?redir=http:%2F%2Fwww.freecreditreport.com%2Fpm%2
Fdefault.aspx%3Fsc%3D668072%26hmpgID%3D62%26bcd%3DAprilAvgfooterNO62>
See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps!
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris <cschuerm(at)cox.net> |
Bruce Campbell wrote:
>
> Yup. 4186B is still dead. We havent gotten reimbursed by the (self
> insured) county yet, of course.
>
Man, that sucks! Sorry to hear that Bruce....
What happened? You have any pix?
chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | COMMANDER MEETING IN ARIZONA |
| From: | yourtcfg(at)aol.com |
HI KIDS
I don't know what happened to the last post, but here it is again.? I am planning
to attend the factory flyin in Scottsdale AZ this may.? Several other TCFG
members will be there.? I hope to see al of you there as well.? As you know, Jim
Mathison sold Twin Commander and this will be an opportunity to meet the new
owners.? Go to Twincommander.com to register.? See ya there.? jb
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: COMMANDER MEETING IN ARIZONA |
Hi JimBob,
Something strange is happening!
I could read your email through my "Mailwasher" program, while the email
was waiting on the server of the ISP I use.
However, when I downloaded the email to my PC, it appears blank in
Outlook Express.
No doubt one of our computer geeks can highlight what the problem is!
Very Best Regards,
Barry
----- Original Message -----
From: yourtcfg(at)aol.com
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2009 4:38 PM
Subject: Commander-List: COMMANDER MEETING IN ARIZONA
HI KIDS
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Commander Meeting in Arizona |
| From: | yourtcfg(at)aol.com |
Hi Kids,
I don't know what happened to the last post, but here it is again.? I am planning
to attend the factory flyin in Scottsdale AZ this may.? Several other TCFG
members will be there.? I hope to see all of you there as well.? As you know,
Jim Matheson sold Twin Commander and this will be an opportunity to meet the new
owners.? Go to Twincommander.com to register.? See ya there.? jb
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Donnie Rose <aquadiver99(at)yahoo.com> |
Do any of you fine laddies (and lasses) know where a decent price on Clevel
and pads are (066-09000)?? I have found only outrageous prices. Also, anyon
e using Dresser retreads and what do you think.=0A=0ABest regards,=0A-=0A
Donnie Rose =0A205/492-8444=0A=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wiliam Boelte" <n55bz(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Commander Meeting in Arizona |
N670CB and its new family will be there also.
----- Original Message -----
From: yourtcfg(at)aol.com
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, 14 April, 2009 14:13
Subject: Commander-List: Commander Meeting in Arizona
Hi Kids,
I don't know what happened to the last post, but here it is again. I
am planning to attend the factory flyin in Scottsdale AZ this may.
Several other TCFG members will be there. I hope to see all of you
there as well. As you know, Jim Matheson sold Twin Commander and this
will be an opportunity to meet the new owners. Go to Twincommander.com
to register. See ya there. jb
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wiliam Boelte" <n55bz(at)cox.net> |
Used Desser retreads on the Commander, Stearman and Baron. Love them.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: Donnie Rose
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, 14 April, 2009 14:54
Subject: Commander-List: brakes
Do any of you fine laddies (and lasses) know where a decent price on
Cleveland pads are (066-09000)?? I have found only outrageous prices.
Also, anyone using Dresser retreads and what do you think.
Best regards,
Donnie Rose
205/492-8444
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Donnie Rose <aquadiver99(at)yahoo.com> |
Thanks Bill=0A-=0ADonnie Rose =0A205/492-8444=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A__________
______________________=0AFrom: Wiliam Boelte <n55bz(at)cox.net>=0ATo: commande
r-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Tuesday, April 14, 2009 3:22:31 PM=0ASubject:
Re: Commander-List: brakes=0A=0A=0AUsed Desser retreads on the Commander, S
tearman and Baron. Love them.=0A-=0ABill=0A----- Original Message -----
=0AFrom: Donnie Rose =0ATo: commander-list(at)matronics.com =0ASent: Tuesday,
14 April, 2009 14:54=0ASubject: Commander-List: brakes=0A=0ADo any of you f
ine laddies (and lasses) know where a decent price on Cleveland pads are (0
66-09000)?? I have found only outrageous prices. Also, anyone using Dresser
retreads and what do you think.=0A=0ABest regards,=0A-=0ADonnie Rose =0A
205/492-8444=0A=0A=0A=0A=0Ahref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Comma
nder-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-Listhref="http://
forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com=0Ahref="http://www.matr
===============0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: COMMANDER MEETING IN ARIZONA |
| From: | Russell Legg <rlegg(at)austarnet.com.au> |
Hey Jimbob,
All we got was =B3HI KIDS=B2 down here in Oz!!
It is always nice to get an email from =B3Dad=B2!
Please resend.
Cheers from Oz
Russell
On 15/4/09 1:25 AM, "Barry Collman" <barry.collman@air-britain.co.uk> wrote
:
> Hi JimBob,
>
> Something strange is happening!
> I could read your email through my "Mailwasher" program, while the email
was
> waiting on the server of the ISP I use.
> However, when I downloaded the email to my PC, it appears blank in Outloo
k
> Express.
>
> No doubt one of our computer geeks can highlight what the problem is!
>
> Very Best Regards,
> Barry
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>
>> From: yourtcfg(at)aol.com
>>
>> To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
>>
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2009 4:38 PM
>>
>> Subject: Commander-List: COMMANDER MEETING IN ARIZONA
>>
>>
>> HI KIDS
>>
>>
>> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matr
onics
>> .com/Navigator?Commander-List
>> color=#000000>http://forums.matronics.com
>>
> color=#000000>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
| Subject: | FW: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson) |
_____
HUMMINGBIRD LANE
This is something I have never seen before, or ever even heard of. This
woman lives in a Hummingbird fly zone. As they migrated, about 20 of them
were in her yard. She took the little red dish, filled it with sugar water
and this is the result.
The woman is Abagail Alfano of Pine, Louisiana - she has been studying them
daily and one morning put the cup from the feeder, with water in it, in her
hand; as they had gotten used to her standing by the feeder they came over
to her hand. She says in touching they are as light as a feather. Abagail
also said, 'if she had known her husband was taking pictures she would have
put on makeup.'
Pretty neat, huh?
These pictures are amazing. I do hope that the pictures travel through
cyber space successfully! Send to your Friends and Family ......
=
_____
_____
_____
_____
Windows LiveT: Keep your life in sync. Check it out.
<http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_allup_1a_explore_042009>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Peter Bichier <pbichie(at)UTNet.UToledo.Edu> |
| Subject: | Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson) |
Thanks Nico to pass those along,
I was just conducting bird census on coffee plantations in Chiapas
(So.Mex-Guatemala border) on the pacific slope a few weeks ago, and
Ruby-throated Hummingbirds where all over that landscape. In the
winter they get a few local flowers but they also hawk for insects and
I've also seen them "stealing" insects caught on spider webs.
Amazing little birds (2-6 grams) that hatch throughout NE America and
winters mostly in Central America all the way to Panama. At least if
you bump into those on your plane it won't be as bad as a Canada Geese
that can weigh up to 30 lbs...
They haven't made it yet to NW Ohio yet!
waiting impatiently for spring and warmer weather,
a tropical guy,
p.
On Apr 17, 2009, at 12:37 AM, nico css wrote:
>
> HUMMINGBIRD LANE
>
> This is something I have never seen before, or ever even heard of.
> This woman lives in a Hummingbird fly zone. As they migrated, about
> 20 of them were in her yard. She took the little red dish, filled
> it with sugar water and this is the result.
> The woman is Abagail Alfano of Pine, Louisiana - she has been
> studying them daily and one morning put the cup from the feeder,
> with water in it, in her hand; as they had gotten used to her
> standing by the feeder they came over to her hand. She says in
> touching they are as light as a feather. Abagail also said, 'if she
> had known her husband was taking pictures she would have put on
> makeup.'
>
>
>
>
>
> Windows Live=99: Keep your life in sync. Check it out.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve W" <steve2(at)sover.net> |
| Subject: | Re: FW: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson) |
Nico,
Most amazing is to see those little buggers all together at one time in
that photo. They are hugely territorial around here and drive off others
from a feeder. They are great fun to watch.
I still don't understand how such a tiny high-strung critter can keep
itself fed with enough energy to migrate. But someone Monarch
butterflies make it to Mexico across the Gulf....
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: nico css
To: 'Johanna' ; 'nicolene'
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 12:37 AM
Subject: Commander-List: FW: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson)
--------------------------------------------------------------
HUMMINGBIRD LANE
This is something I have never seen
before, or ever even heard of. This woman lives in a Hummingbird fly
zone. As they migrated, about 20 of them were in her yard. She took the
little red dish, filled it with sugar water and this is the result.
The woman is Abagail Alfano of Pine,
Louisiana - she has been studying them daily and one morning put the
cup from the feeder, with water in it, in her hand; as they had gotten
used to her standing by the feeder they came over to her hand. She says
in touching they are as light as a feather. Abagail also said, 'if she
had known her husband was taking pictures she would have put on
makeup.'
Pretty neat, huh?
These pictures are amazing. I do hope
that the pictures travel through cyber space successfully! Send to your
Friends and Family ......
=
--------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Windows LiveT: Keep your life in sync. Check it out.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
| Subject: | Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson) |
I sent these pictures to the folks because they are such a wonder (not that
a part of nature is not), almost impossible that they could fly, but yet,
they are making up for their odd construction by flapping their wings
faster. I believe it's up to 80 beats per second.
Not to start a fight, but how did they evolve from a single cell? Male and
female, different in a precise manner coming forth from the same pool, yet
perfectly compatible and arriving on the scene at the same moment in time to
procreate. If they missed each other by a few weeks, they wouldn't have
survived. It boggles the mind.
Thanks for sharing, Peter.
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peter
Bichier
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 9:52 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson)
Thanks Nico to pass those along,
I was just conducting bird census on coffee plantations in Chiapas
(So.Mex-Guatemala border) on the pacific slope a few weeks ago, and
Ruby-throated Hummingbirds where all over that landscape. In the winter they
get a few local flowers but they also hawk for insects and I've also seen
them "stealing" insects caught on spider webs.
Amazing little birds (2-6 grams) that hatch throughout NE America and
winters mostly in Central America all the way to Panama. At least if you
bump into those on your plane it won't be as bad as a Canada Geese that can
weigh up to 30 lbs...
They haven't made it yet to NW Ohio yet!
waiting impatiently for spring and warmer weather,
a tropical guy,
p.
On Apr 17, 2009, at 12:37 AM, nico css wrote:
HUMMINGBIRD LANE
This is something I have never seen before, or ever even heard of. This
woman lives in a Hummingbird fly zone. As they migrated, about 20 of them
were in her yard. She took the little red dish, filled it with sugar water
and this is the result.
The woman is Abagail Alfano of Pine, Louisiana - she has been studying them
daily and one morning put the cup from the feeder, with water in it, in her
hand; as they had gotten used to her standing by the feeder they came over
to her hand. She says in touching they are as light as a feather. Abagail
also said, 'if she had known her husband was taking pictures she would have
put on makeup.'
_____
_____
_____
_____
Windows LiveT: Keep your life in sync. Check it out.
<http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_allup_1a_explore_042009>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
| Subject: | Pirates and Easter09 |
I cannot vouch for this story's veracity. I didn't edit it either, it's as
received.
This is the first-hand account from a good friend's son onboard the USS
Boxer.
Subject: How did YOU spend Easter!?
I spent mine watching some pirates get spattered off the coast of Somalia!
Jargon key located at the bottom.
I've been taking notes on facts and (well noted) speculation and rumors.
What I know is on the eleventh of April, 2009 at 1600 two C17 cargo planes
flew over Boxer and out of the back four parachutes emerged.
Then came the boats! Four very fast 1300 hp SWCC boats with radar and guns!
After those were safely extracted th e personnel and SEALs jumped.
About 95 people in all arrived in the water near Boxer, Swam to the ship and
entered the well-deck.
I spoke with some of the SEALs in the hangar bay where the are staging their
gear for the time being. He was rearranging his gear and talking to a
younger looking Ops guy with shoulder-length hair and a feeble semblance of
a beard. I struck up a conversation with them and they're really friendly
the older SEAL finished with his bag and reached for a rifle case casually
unzipped it and pulled out a Mark 416 a highly specialized carbine and as he
explained "it's basically an M -4, but made by H&K so it's better!"
"visible and non-visible lasers, colapsable stock. It's nice."
"And is that an advanced armament suppressor?" I asked.
"yeah that just makes it sound better, and the ladies love it!"
I asked him if it's the coolest job in the navy.
"well I haven't ever flown an F-18 off a carrier, but yeah, pretty much!"
"you guys don't wear any insignia."
"We don't wear it, but we're still in the Navy."
"I know that but what's with that?"
"Well I'm a Chief, and he is a second-class"
"oh, ok"
"So, Chief, did you come in as a SEAL?"
"yep, you don't have to be formal, tha t's why we don't wear it. It gets in
the way and besides, we know who's in charge."
"well I have to get back to watch."
"OK, any time you see us over hear and just want to chat and shoot the shit,
feel free!"
"Cool, thanks"
"any time"
I also found out from the CPO that the guys flew in from VB on C17's and
that took 18 hours!
They parachuted into the ocean! That's' cool as hell!
At 2100 on Saturday we were headed for the area where the USS Bainbridge
(DDG 96) was already in position several hundred miles east off of Somalia's
coast.
And on Sunday there were so many parts of our engine that were broken from
traveling at flank speed (full Bendix) that we stopped the shaft engaged the
jacking gear, pinned the gear and tagged out the m----------r! I spent three
watches fabricating parts, helping replace sight-flow indicators on journal
bearings and running around the ship.
On Easter Sunday night, at around 1530 I was making my hourly rounds through
the hangar bay and heard four distant rifle reports and knew exactly what
happened. There was an orange capsule being towed by Bainbridge.
Two SEAL snipers laying prone on the fantail with Barrett .50 cal rifles
pointed at the small craft.
CAPT. Richard Phillips of Vermont was swim ming toward the RHIB sitting
close to the lifeboat.
When the Navy said that we want to see proof of life the good captain jumped
into the water and started to draw fire from the pirates. The Snipers fired.
I had to return to my watch station and at close of business I assumed my
next watch: CNN's Live broa dcast of speculation and grievous b------t! I
have t decipher all of this crap for you.
At 2300 Africa time the Maersk Alabama safely docked in Mombasa, Kenya and
the crew was debriefed by the FBI for some reason.
Captain Phillips was Logged onboard Boxer at 1836 and one skinny, short,
pitiful-looking (and never in a million year is he sixteen) pirate, who was
escorted, handcuffed despite the wounds, wearing blacked out ski goggles,
through the hangar bay by like 20 marines and MA's.
He has asked for amnesty. He'll probably get a UN Trial for international
piracy.
( I witness all of this and have to wonder: hasn't copyright protection gone
just a little too far? I mean, why are we killing folks over some illegal
DVDs?)
"We always laugh and joke about pirates onboard and don't realize that this
is one of the world's most serious crimes!"
-Me, four hours ago.
Monday, APR 13, 2009.
At 0930 USS Boxer sits of the coast of Somalia and the Bainbridge is at her
stern on the port side in tow, the life boat containing three lifeless
pirates dispatched into oblivion by the best sharpshooters the world around.
The corpses are transferred unde r the heaviest morgue security I've seen
since President Ford's funeral to the USS Boxer's chilled holding facility.
At 1000 the lifeboat from Alabama is hoisted onto Boxer's flight deck by the
local crane.
I was there when the boat arrived onboard. Standing next to some chopper
refueling buddies and joking about the incident.
"Hey, what's orange, full of blood and hanging from a crane?"
"What?"
"That boat that some pirates got smoked in."
Probably the most interesting Easter I've ever spent!
Looking closely at the boat, I see four large bullet holes on the STB side
where "justice" entered the pirate's mind's, some brain matter sloshed
around in the boat.
I was told before I left San Diego that I would hate the Boxer, I tell you
now, I wouldn't rather be on any other ship.
Broken parts and all I like it.
1025 "Maersk Alabama, Departing." is heard over the 1MC.
The name of the ship is used to describe the Captain as he is at the top of
the command.
Personal speculation and trusted brass scuttlebutt says that our AOR has
shifted from the gulf of Aden where there aren't any pirates, to where we
sit now.
16 ships and 200 hostages from various countries still remain stranded.
Not for long, I predict.
As always, kee ping it real on the high seas with the US Navy,
MMFN McCaskey, Will (MP-Aft) USS Boxer, Somalia
KEY:
SWCC, special warfare combatant crewman, brown water
H&K, Heckler and Koch, famous german weapon's designer's world renound for
their popular .45 cal USP (universal service pistol)
And other highly precise firearms.
CPO, Chief Petty Officer, USN, E7
VB, Virginia Beach, Virginia, East coast headquarters of Special Warfare.
DDG, Guided Missile Destroyer
Flank, the fastest speed the ship can travel, equal to about 35 knots
RHIB, (rib) Rigid-hulled inflatable boat
STB, Starboard (right)
1MC, numeric designation for the main announcing circuit used on U.S. Navy
vessels.
AOR, Area Of Responsibily, the confines within which we roam.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve W" <steve2(at)sover.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson) |
Nico if I bring this post back to flying, will that stop us from being
WAY too far off topic?
I don't think creationism or evolution offer an adequate explanation of
the mysteries around us.
Nico if you have a couple minutes, look up the 'Hummingbird Moth'. I
don't know if you have these critters around you area, but they are
fascninating. It is an insect that has evolved (whoops) to appear almost
identical in form and function as a Hummingbird. It is incredible to
watch these creatures at work. Their behavior, their flight pattern, if
you didn't know any better you would be absolutely convinced it was a
bird. It's such an amazing creation (oops) that either side could see at
work evidence of a dogmatic point of view.
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: nico css
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 10:05 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson)
I sent these pictures to the folks because they are such a wonder (not
that a part of nature is not), almost impossible that they could fly,
but yet, they are making up for their odd construction by flapping their
wings faster. I believe it's up to 80 beats per second.
Not to start a fight, but how did they evolve from a single cell? Male
and female, different in a precise manner coming forth from the same
pool, yet perfectly compatible and arriving on the scene at the same
moment in time to procreate. If they missed each other by a few weeks,
they wouldn't have survived. It boggles the mind.
Thanks for sharing, Peter.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peter
Bichier
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 9:52 AM
To: commander-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Commander-List: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson)
Thanks Nico to pass those along,
I was just conducting bird census on coffee plantations in Chiapas
(So.Mex-Guatemala border) on the pacific slope a few weeks ago, and
Ruby-throated Hummingbirds where all over that landscape. In the winter
they get a few local flowers but they also hawk for insects and I've
also seen them "stealing" insects caught on spider webs.
Amazing little birds (2-6 grams) that hatch throughout NE America and
winters mostly in Central America all the way to Panama. At least if you
bump into those on your plane it won't be as bad as a Canada Geese that
can weigh up to 30 lbs...
They haven't made it yet to NW Ohio yet!
waiting impatiently for spring and warmer weather,
a tropical guy,
p.
On Apr 17, 2009, at 12:37 AM, nico css wrote:
HUMMINGBIRD LANE
This is something I have never seen
before, or ever even heard of. This woman lives in a Hummingbird fly
zone. As they migrated, about 20 of them were in her yard. She took the
little red dish, filled it with sugar water and this is the result.
The woman is Abagail Alfano of Pine,
Louisiana - she has been studying them daily and one morning put the
cup from the feeder, with water in it, in her hand; as they had gotten
used to her standing by the feeder they came over to her hand. She says
in touching they are as light as a feather. Abagail also said, 'if she
had known her husband was taking pictures she would have put on
makeup.'
------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
Windows LiveT: Keep your life in sync. Check it out.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
| Subject: | Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson) |
Steve, you cheated. You took a rational position!
:-)
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve W
Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2009 5:57 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson)
Nico if I bring this post back to flying, will that stop us from being WAY
too far off topic?
I don't think creationism or evolution offer an adequate explanation of the
mysteries around us.
Nico if you have a couple minutes, look up the 'Hummingbird Moth'. I don't
know if you have these critters around you area, but they are fascninating.
It is an insect that has evolved (whoops) to appear almost identical in form
and function as a Hummingbird. It is incredible to watch these creatures at
work. Their behavior, their flight pattern, if you didn't know any better
you would be absolutely convinced it was a bird. It's such an amazing
creation (oops) that either side could see at work evidence of a dogmatic
point of view.
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: nico <mailto:nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> css
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 10:05 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson)
I sent these pictures to the folks because they are such a wonder (not that
a part of nature is not), almost impossible that they could fly, but yet,
they are making up for their odd construction by flapping their wings
faster. I believe it's up to 80 beats per second.
Not to start a fight, but how did they evolve from a single cell? Male and
female, different in a precise manner coming forth from the same pool, yet
perfectly compatible and arriving on the scene at the same moment in time to
procreate. If they missed each other by a few weeks, they wouldn't have
survived. It boggles the mind.
Thanks for sharing, Peter.
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peter
Bichier
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 9:52 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson)
Thanks Nico to pass those along,
I was just conducting bird census on coffee plantations in Chiapas
(So.Mex-Guatemala border) on the pacific slope a few weeks ago, and
Ruby-throated Hummingbirds where all over that landscape. In the winter they
get a few local flowers but they also hawk for insects and I've also seen
them "stealing" insects caught on spider webs.
Amazing little birds (2-6 grams) that hatch throughout NE America and
winters mostly in Central America all the way to Panama. At least if you
bump into those on your plane it won't be as bad as a Canada Geese that can
weigh up to 30 lbs...
They haven't made it yet to NW Ohio yet!
waiting impatiently for spring and warmer weather,
a tropical guy,
p.
On Apr 17, 2009, at 12:37 AM, nico css wrote:
HUMMINGBIRD LANE
This is something I have never seen before, or ever even heard of. This
woman lives in a Hummingbird fly zone. As they migrated, about 20 of them
were in her yard. She took the little red dish, filled it with sugar water
and this is the result.
The woman is Abagail Alfano of Pine, Louisiana - she has been studying them
daily and one morning put the cup from the feeder, with water in it, in her
hand; as they had gotten used to her standing by the feeder they came over
to her hand. She says in touching they are as light as a feather. Abagail
also said, 'if she had known her husband was taking pictures she would have
put on makeup.'
_____
_____
_____
_____
Windows LiveT: Keep your life in sync. Check it out.
<http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_allup_1a_explore_042009>
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com> |
| Subject: | Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson) |
Steve
Although you risked the ire of half the list by mentioning evolution, the
other half for mentioning creation- you played the ball nicely up the
middle by doing so in reference some something that flies.
Well played.
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve W
Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2009 5:57 AM
Subject: Re: Commander-List: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson)
Nico if I bring this post back to flying, will that stop us from being WAY
too far off topic?
I don't think creationism or evolution offer an adequate explanation of the
mysteries around us.
Nico if you have a couple minutes, look up the 'Hummingbird Moth'. I don't
know if you have these critters around you area, but they are fascninating.
It is an insect that has evolved (whoops) to appear almost identical in form
and function as a Hummingbird. It is incredible to watch these creatures at
work. Their behavior, their flight pattern, if you didn't know any better
you would be absolutely convinced it was a bird. It's such an amazing
creation (oops) that either side could see at work evidence of a dogmatic
point of view.
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: nico css <mailto:nico(at)cybersuperstore.com>
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 10:05 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson)
I sent these pictures to the folks because they are such a wonder (not that
a part of nature is not), almost impossible that they could fly, but yet,
they are making up for their odd construction by flapping their wings
faster. I believe it's up to 80 beats per second.
Not to start a fight, but how did they evolve from a single cell? Male and
female, different in a precise manner coming forth from the same pool, yet
perfectly compatible and arriving on the scene at the same moment in time to
procreate. If they missed each other by a few weeks, they wouldn't have
survived. It boggles the mind.
Thanks for sharing, Peter.
_____
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peter
Bichier
Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 9:52 AM
Subject: Commander-List: Hummingbird Lane (from Brandon Thompson)
Thanks Nico to pass those along,
I was just conducting bird census on coffee plantations in Chiapas
(So.Mex-Guatemala border) on the pacific slope a few weeks ago, and
Ruby-throated Hummingbirds where all over that landscape. In the winter they
get a few local flowers but they also hawk for insects and I've also seen
them "stealing" insects caught on spider webs.
Amazing little birds (2-6 grams) that hatch throughout NE America and
winters mostly in Central America all the way to Panama. At least if you
bump into those on your plane it won't be as bad as a Canada Geese that can
weigh up to 30 lbs...
They haven't made it yet to NW Ohio yet!
waiting impatiently for spring and warmer weather,
a tropical guy,
p.
On Apr 17, 2009, at 12:37 AM, nico css wrote:
HUMMINGBIRD LANE
This is something I have never seen before, or ever even heard of. This
woman lives in a Hummingbird fly zone. As they migrated, about 20 of them
were in her yard. She took the little red dish, filled it with sugar water
and this is the result.
The woman is Abagail Alfano of Pine, Louisiana - she has been studying them
daily and one morning put the cup from the feeder, with water in it, in her
hand; as they had gotten used to her standing by the feeder they came over
to her hand. She says in touching they are as light as a feather. Abagail
also said, 'if she had known her husband was taking pictures she would have
put on makeup.'
_____
_____
_____
_____
Windows LiveT: Keep your life in sync. Check it out.
<http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_allup_1a_explore_042009>
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Commander-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Commander-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dan Farmer <daniellfarmer(at)yahoo.com> |
Nico,
If you still have the site available would you email it to daniellfarmer@ya
hoo.com .- It does not come through on the commander site for me.-
thanks,
dan f
=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
| Subject: | FW: Fwd: FW: True Warriors... |
Look carefully at the B-17 and note how shot up it is - one engine dead,
tail, horizontal stabilizer and nose shot up.. It was ready to fall out of
the sky. (This is a painting done by an artist from the description of both
pilots many years later.) Then realize that there is a German ME-109 fighter
flying next to it. Now read the story below. I think you'll be
surprised.....
1
Charlie Brown was a B-17 Flying Fortress pilot with the 379th Bomber Group
at Kimbolton, England. His B-17 was called 'Ye Old Pub' and was in a
terrible state, having been hit by flak and fighters. The compass was
damaged and they were flying deeper over enemy territory instead of heading
home to Kimbolton.
After flying the B-17 over an enemy airfield, a German pilot named Franz
Steigler was ordered to take off and shoot down the B-17. When he got near
the B-17, he could not believe his eyes. In his words, he 'had never seen a
plane in such a bad state'. The tail and rear section was severely damaged,
and the tail gunner wounded. The top gunner was all over the top of the
fuselage. The nose was smashed and there were holes everywhere.
Despite having ammunition, Franz flew to the side of the B-17 and looked at
Charlie Brown, the pilot. Brown was scared and struggling to control his
damaged and blood-stained plane.
BF-109 pilot Franz Stigler B-17 pilot
Charlie Brown.
2 2
Aware that they had no idea where they were going, Franz waved at Charlie to
turn 180 degrees. Franz escorted and guided the stricken plane to, and
slightly over, the North Sea towards England. He then saluted Charlie Brown
and turned away, back to Europe. When Franz landed he told the CO that the
plane had been shot down over the sea, and never told the truth to anybody.
Charlie Brown and the remains of his crew told all at their briefing, but
were ordered never to talk about it.
More than 40 years later, Charlie Brown wanted to find the Luftwaffe pilot
who saved the crew. After years of research, Franz was found. He had never
talked about the incident, not even at post-war reunions.
They met in the USA at a 379th Bomber Group reunion, together with 25 people
who are alive now - all because Franz never fired his guns that day.
(L-R) German Ace Franz Stigler, artist Ernie Boyett, and B-17 pilot Charlie
Brown.
3
When asked why he didn't shoot them down, Stigler later said, "I didn't have
the heart to finish those brave men. I flew beside them for a long time.
They were trying desperately to get home and I was going to let them do
that. I could not have shot at them. It would have been the same as
shooting at a man in a parachute."
Both men died in 2008.
This is a true story <http://www.snopes.com/military/charliebrown.asp>
http://www.snopes.com/military/charliebrown.asp
THIS WAS BACK IN THE DAYS WHEN THERE WAS HONOR IN BEING A WARRIOR...THEY
PROUDLY WORE UNIFORMS, AND THEY DIDN'T HIDE IN AMBUSH INSIDE A MOSQUE, OR
BEHIND WOMEN AND CHILDREN, NOR DID THEY USE MENTALLY RETARDED WOMEN AS
SUICIDE BOMBERS TO TARGET AND KILL INNOCENT CIVILIANS...HOW TIMES HAVE
CHANGED......
<http://www.incredimail.com/index.asp?id=109094&rui=104675938> FREE
Animations for your email - by IncrediMail! Click Here!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve W" <steve2(at)sover.net> |
| Subject: | Re: FW: Fwd: FW: True Warriors... |
Nico, What a great story.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Deneal Schilmeister (MacbookPro)" <deneals(at)deneals.com> |
CNN Video, starring our own Bill Leff
<http://tinyurl.com/9v426>
--
Deneal Schilmeister
http://deneals.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Funny CNN video |
| From: | "Deneal Schilmeister (MacbookPro)" <deneals(at)deneals.com> |
On 4/27/09 6:25 AM, "Deneal Schilmeister (MacbookPro)"
wrote:
> CNN Video, starring our own Bill Leff
>
> <http://tinyurl.com/9v426>
>
>
> --
> Deneal Schilmeister
>
> http://deneals.com
Oops... Try this link:
<http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/offbeat/2009/04/22/moos.you.landed.where.c
nn>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)verizon.net> |
I think you all will enjoy this one especially you older pilots.
Jim Addington
N444BD
http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/votw/VideoOfTheWeek_LearningToFly_1953_19960
9-1.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brock Lorber" <blorber(at)southwestcirrus.com> |
Understanding, courtesy, AND airplane knowledge? Sheesh! What kind of
superhuman beings taught aviation back then?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com on behalf of Jim
Addington
Sent: Mon 4/27/2009 12:33 PM
Subject: Commander-List:
I think you all will enjoy this one especially you older pilots.
Jim Addington
N444BD
http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/votw/VideoOfTheWeek_LearningToFly_1953_19
960
9-1.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Funny CNN video |
| From: | "Peter Bichier" <pbichie(at)UTNet.UToledo.Edu> |
That is a funny video, now where is our star in there?
The T6 in Wisconsin would be my guess...
172 RG? great landing! could have feathered the prop just before and would have
saved a buck or two...
207 on the soccer field? (hard to believe these guys made it... yes I know you
can land a 207 on a short field but...)
unless our friend really lucked out on its trip to the UK...
anyway, it seem to me all these pilots have something in common: once they got
themselves into an emergency, they did pretty good to get out of those situations!
thanks for sharing,
--------
560 Dreamer
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241551#241551
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Addington" <jtaddington(at)verizon.net> |
That was back when the nose wheel was back on the tail and you had to fly it
from the chocks and all the way back to the chocks. Those planes would look
when you looked and would sometimes look when you did not. They sure were
fun though.
Jim Addington
N444BD
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brock Lorber
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 3:24 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List:
Understanding, courtesy, AND airplane knowledge? Sheesh! What kind of
superhuman beings taught aviation back then?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com on behalf of Jim Addington
Sent: Mon 4/27/2009 12:33 PM
Subject: Commander-List:
I think you all will enjoy this one especially you older pilots.
Jim Addington
N444BD
http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/votw/VideoOfTheWeek_LearningToFly_1953_19960
9-1.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert S. Randazzo" <rsrandazzo(at)precisionmanuals.com> |
Jim-
For those of us who still fly'em- they still are fun!
Once I discovered tailwheel- there was no looking back.
Oh- there's a joke in there someplace... never looking back? Never
mind....
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C <- nosehweel in the front
N4RC <- nosewheel in the back
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim
Addington
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 7:43 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List:
That was back when the nose wheel was back on the tail and you had to fly it
from the chocks and all the way back to the chocks. Those planes would look
when you looked and would sometimes look when you did not. They sure were
fun though.
Jim Addington
N444BD
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Brock Lorber
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 3:24 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List:
Understanding, courtesy, AND airplane knowledge? Sheesh! What kind of
superhuman beings taught aviation back then?
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com on behalf of Jim Addington
Sent: Mon 4/27/2009 12:33 PM
Subject: Commander-List:
I think you all will enjoy this one especially you older pilots.
Jim Addington
N444BD
http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/votw/VideoOfTheWeek_LearningToFly_1953_19960
9-1.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "nico css" <nico(at)cybersuperstore.com> |
The only time nose-wheeled planes nose-over is when the pilot drops it on
its nose.
:-)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert S.
Randazzo
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 8:30 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List:
-->
Jim-
For those of us who still fly'em- they still are fun!
Once I discovered tailwheel- there was no looking back.
Oh- there's a joke in there someplace... never looking back? Never
mind....
Robert S. Randazzo
N414C <- nosehweel in the front
N4RC <- nosewheel in the back
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-commander-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim
Addington
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 7:43 PM
Subject: RE: Commander-List:
That was back when the nose wheel was back on the tail and you had to fly it
from the chocks and all the way back to the chocks. Those planes would look
March 23, 2009 - April 28, 2009
Commander-Archive.digest.vol-di