Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-aa
March 07, 1996 - August 19, 1996
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
Hi Everyone...
I did not keep a record of my posts during the period of time the mail
server was down. I think there were about 3 that didn't get sent.
Progress on the MK III (about 85%) is slower (mostly being small details).
I have about half my plane back from the paint shop and it looks great.
They are doing a fine job. The right wing and vert. stab. have been
permanently mounted. The nose cone has been bolted to the frame and basic
instrument frame and front including instruments have been hinged to the
cone. I have yet to make and mount the side brackets for the hinged frame
to mount to and the glare shield that will be attached to those brackets.
We have had some "cold for Texas" weather push down on us so I will stay out
of the garage a few days.
Yesterday, I ordered an ELT. Wag Aero had one for around $185 powered by
"D" cells. The best price I had seen before was around $200 to 210. I also
ordered a Skysport 7 joule strobe for $49. I am thinking about building my
headsets and intercom from kits supplied by RST. Does anyone have any first
hand knowledge of the RST products?
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (80%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
http://www.flash.net/~striplic Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
(under construction)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kirtland, Charles H." <KIRTLACH(at)pdc02.sch.ge.com> |
Group,
I have a friend that has recently completed a Firestar II and is concerned
about the accuracy of his ASI. I have bench-checked the accuracy of three
local flyer s ASIs using the method outlined in February s "Experimenter"
magazine, namely using a manometer tube and calculations of dynamic air
pressure. All three check OK and read the same on the bench. In flight we
all have different readings, my guess being due to static pressure
differences. The readings are all high as compared to GPS readings.
Our assumption on the Firestar II is that the mostly-enclosed cockpit
creates a negative static pressure in the pod and is causing the higher
speed reading. The other two ULs that fly with the Firestar (a Spitfire and
a Tierra II) have similar high readings. My questions is (maybe Dennis ?) -
exactly where on the Firestar II should a static pickup be mounted so that
correct airspeed readings are obtained and how is the static pickup made?
Also, in general for any aircraft, just how do you go about finding this
correct static pressure place and know that the pressure is a true static
pressure?
Thanks.
Charlie Kirtland
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Weber (DVNS)" <bweber(at)micom.com> |
Since building a Kolb requires drilling a few thousand holes, most of the
for 1/8" rivets, anything that makes this task easier is worth looking
at. I was having trouble getting the holes precisely where I wanted them,
even after using a snap punch. Then I found Black and Decker drill bits.
These bits have what they call a bullet tip, a tiny starting point that
just fits into the tiny depression made by the snap punch. Now the holes
go exactly where I want them.
As you all know by now, the 1/8" rivets do not fit into a 1/8" hole so
you need a #30 drill bit. Black and Decker does not make the bullet tip
bit in numbered sizes (as far as I know). So now I keep a #30 bit in my
cordless drill. After drilling with the corded drill and the 1/8" Black and
Decker bit, I run the #30 drill through the holes to enlarge them
enough for the rivets.
Happy drilling.
_-_ _,, ,,
-/ ) ; ||
||_< \\/\/\ _-_ ||/|, _-_ ,._-_ bweber(at)micom.com
|| \\ || | | || \\ || || || \\ ||
;/--|| || | | ||/ || |' ||/ || Keep the shiny
_--_-' \\/\\/ \\,/ \\/ \\,/ \\, side up
(
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | T bracket for EGT probes |
Hi Everyone...
I remembered one of the messages that got lost. Everyone seems to be making
a coil (like coil springs) out of the EGT prob wires. I needed a way to
secure the ends of those coils to keep them away from the muffler and the
side of the engine and secure the connections to the wire that runs up to
the instrument panel. I made a T shaped bracket out of the thick scrap
Lexan. One side of the cross bar of the T is longer than the other. I tie
wrapped the probe ends along with the extension wires through holes drilled
into the cross bars so that the coils float freely. I bent the vertical
stem of the T in order to attach it to the steel tube of the fuselage with a
couple of screw up type hose clamps. Now all the wires are secure and will
stay in place.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (85%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
http://www.flash.net/~striplic Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
(under construction)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cavuontop(at)aol.com |
The RST stuff that I have seen is quite good. I am told that there are only
two suppliers for the speakers and microphones that all of the headset
manufacturers use from dave clark on down. Dave Clark also makes a plastic
helmet that a headset will fit into. It is a real neat product that they
don't advertise, but any dave clark style headset will work with it. Its
kind of nice because you don't have to have a dedicated helmet for kolb
flying and a separate eadset for GA flying. Like all of the dave clark
products it is obscenely expensive.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cavuontop(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: ASI Calibration |
I used a blade style pitot static pickup from a piper cherokee. I got it at
lakeland for $20 because the pitot heat part was broken. I just yanked out
the heating element anyway. I mounted it underneath the nose cone of my mark
3 at the back edge of the fiberglass. It looks pretty nice, and the nose
skid will protect it in case of a nose over. Unfortunately I can't tell you
how it works because I haven't flown yet.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | evoice(at)morse.acton.com (Doug Prange) |
| Subject: | Graphics Suppliers |
Does anyone have a source for custom and/or stock vinyl graphics and pin
striping for aircraft applications?
Doug Prange
Mark III Builder
Lincoln, Nebraska
evoice(at)acton.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <Joe.Kohler(at)top.monad.net> manderson(at)monad.net |
| Subject: | Joe's FS II "completion", weight and balance |
The Kolb is finished. Well, more or less. I haven't run the engine. Need to
wait for the snow to melt and the ground to dry to get it outdoors. It took
approximately the allotted 400 hours, minus the "think time."
I completed the weight and balance and the FS II is certainly fat at 355 pounds:
this for a FS II with the fatter tires, heavier (but not streamlined) lift
struts, brakes, 503 DC, aileron counterweghts, oil injection tank w oil, two
coats Polytone on bottom and three on top (no silver), two fuel tanks, and BRS
in wing chute for 750 gross. It is amazing how all this adds up. I guessed 325
would be my max weight, but I was off a bit.
I'm not sure I want to get rid of any of the options I have, though I wonder
about the two carbs and sort of wished I'd gotten the SC version. The brakes
seem a little heavier than I think they could be, the aileron counter weights
weigh just about as much as the ailerons, the mounting system for the chute
seems a little heavy, and of course the oil injection adds about 5 lbs. Single
carb w/o oil injection would save 10 pounds I would guess, and there would be no
splitters and a lot less cables.
The CG appears to be way back there at .35 (.37 max) with a 180 lb pilot (I'm a
little fat too). I don't see that there is anything that can be done about the
CG either. I'm curious how other FS II's are coming out weight wise and CG
wise.
The internal BRS fits nicely, but the mount seems heavy. I bet the cannister
version is actually lighter.
I finally got my EIS (engine instrument system) from Grand Rapids (Gregg) and I
like it as much as I thought I would. In addition to all the engine instrument
stuff, it has a fuel gauge input, altimeter, and vertical speed indicator.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Instrument Panel |
Hi Everyone,
I have to admit that it looks good, but the extended shock mounted
instrument panel is extra work. Most of it went together real fast and easy
until I got to the glare shield. I used the .025 sheet of aluminum supplied
by Kolb for the sheer web of the wing gap seal (and needed every bit of the
width of it). I built a shelf lip of fiberglass to attach the curved upper
rear edge to give it a good curved support. The most difficult part is
being sure you have a uniform gap between the glare shield and the edges of
the instrument panel. The side braces were made from scrap pieces of Lexan
from the windshield and a short piece of aluminum angle. The hinged bottom
frame was made from aluminum angle with Lexan braces. All in all, I am glad
I spent the extra time.
Mounting the ELT on the side of the fuselage tube under the fuel tanks after
cover was not difficult. There was adequate but blind clearance for drilling
and riveting the bracket.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (90%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
http://www.flash.net/~striplic Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
(under construction)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Just about finished! |
Hi Everyone...
I completely finished the instrument panel and it and the glare shield are
all painted flat black... looks pretty good. I used some slit black tubing
to protect me from the sharp edge of the glare shield that projects about 1"
in front of the panel.
In installed a piece of Lexan over the carpet on the floor up by the rudder
peddles so that scrubbing heals can slide as well as not wear out the
carpet. The Lexan also holds the carpet in place.
I have attached all the decals, numbers and placards and re-assembled and
riveted the canopy, doors, arm rest and bow tubes.
I made a kill switch bracket for the dual igniton to tie wrap to the notch
on the frame opposite the flap handle notch. I can't reach the instrument
panel strapped in with the shoulder harness.
My son is getting me a capacitor and a few electrical connectors and stuff
to finish up the wiring in the engine area.
I am still undecided about the radios. I was thinking about making up some
RST kits for headphones/mic and for an intercom. I suppose I will mount the
CB on a Lexan plate behind the pilot seat and use feel-a-vision for
operation and the stock dynamic mic. I think I can combine the speaker
output with proper resistors along with the ICOM through the intercom. I
was thinking of making some kind of between-the-legs bracket for my ICOM so
that I can see the face plate for operation. The intercom will probably fit
beside or on the opposite side of the same plate as the CB. I will need to
buy a PTT switch (and a Y splitter for both to transmit on the ICOM) and
headset adaptor for the ICOM.
It rained today. We've been in a severe draught. Bless the rain. I was
going to pick up my other main wing at the high school paint shop today, but
maybe tomorrow it will be clear. As soon as I get both wings back, I can
get to work on the wing gap seal. I also had a local cushion shop make up
some cushions that are ready to pick up. I hope they will look nice and fit
properly.
I am looking forward to Sun 'n Fun and possibly meeting some of you there.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (90%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
http://www.flash.net/~striplic Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
(under construction)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <Joe.Kohler(at)top.monad.net> manderson(at)monad.net |
I read Cliff's message regarding radio mounting. I thought about it quite a bit
for my FS II and finally decided to mount it to the side of the fuselage
trusswork tubing that rises diagonally to connect the bottom to the top longeron
just in just forward of the seat on the left side. I used a couple of Adel
clamps (those rubber covered aluminum clamps) that went around the 3/8" tubing
and then attached to the accessory ICOM mounting bracket. The radio thus rests
at a slightly inclined angle, and is not in the way, but is easy to read and
tune from the pilots seat. I don't know if this would work on a Mark III.
By the way, I used also used these clamps to attach the wiring harness in
several places, and to anchor the pitot tubing to the top of the cowl so it
wouldn't dangle into the rudder pedals.
I also used two pairs of clamps to stand off the primer bulb from the fuse
tubing between the top longeron and the engine mount: a pair of 1" clamps on
each end of the bulb connected to a pair of 1/2" clamps on the fuse tubing.
Works great.
Does the typical ID plate that has the builders name, serial number, model,
address etc. suffice also as the drug interdiction plate and is this usually
mounted on the fuse tube just in front of the tailfeathers or do I need two
separate plates? Can the "EXPERIMENTAL" be stuck on the inside of the sides of
the fuselage fabric in the cockpit area, ie, behind the trusses, so it is
visable from outside the cockpit without messing up the aesthetics by sticking
it on the outside?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
Hi Everyone...
I found another use for the hand hold I put into the wing tips of both main
wings. When wrestling with the tail to lift it or move it right or left
when the plane is folded, the hand holds make it possible to actually lift
the tail by the wing tips without breaking your back stooping down to pick
up the tail wheel underneath the tail surfaces.
The Second Chantz chute went into the cavity above the pilot's head very
nicely. I have yet to rig the rip cord but it should not present a problem.
The seats I had made locally by a cushion fabrication company (2.5" bottom X
1.25" back) fit like a glove and really finish off the interior and match
the yellow paint perfectly. If anyone is interested, they cost me $25 each.
They made mine from a paper pattern and they have many colors in stock to
chose from.
The instrument panel is finished, hung and wired/plumbed and looks nice all
in flat black.
If there is any builder out there who is just getting started, I have some
left over supplies that might be helpful, mostly for free, but some at a
reduced price. Things that I bought like paint (almost a gallon each of red
& yellow), reducer, calibrated iron, finishing tapes, rib tape, anti-chafe
tape, Polytac (1 full can), Stits fabric, snap punch, patterns, builders log
& hints, etc. Some of the stuff I consider extra materials sent to me by
Kolb I am returning to them if they want it (extra tubing, rivets, bolts,
nuts, etc). E-mail if you are interested.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (95%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
http://www.flash.net/~striplic Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
(under construction)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
Dennis S.
I don't know if you can be of any help on the new requirement by the FAA to
submit a PROGRAM LETTER which is specific and meets the requirements of FAR
21.193 for experimental certification. The program letter must outline what
flight characteristics, including the range or altitudes, airspeeds,
aircraft maneuvers, and gross weight / c.g. configurations you plan on
conducting to show that the aircraft controllability, maneuverability and
stability is satisfactory and meets the requirements of FAR 91.319(b).
If anyone has given you a copy of one they prepared, I would be appreciative
of a copy to get an idea of exactly what the FAA wants. I am sending this
out to the Kolb list as well so maybe somebody out there has a handle on
this mumbo- jumbo (at least to me) request. Thanks to everyone - someone!
I tentatively weighed my plane... Uh-Oh!!! It is a bit fat... not the
typical 430. All those little modifications and a bi-color paint job DO add
up... to around 470 (not counting any fluids or radios).
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (95%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
http://www.flash.net/~striplic Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
(under construction)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cavuontop(at)aol.com |
Where did you get the notion you need a program letter for a kolb? As I
understand it that only applies to experimental exhibition category aircraft.
I am going to Lakeland in a 14 passenger russian biplane, an AN-2. That
airplane is in experimental exhibition category four and requires a program
letter to go anywhere. The normal 51% homebuilt is in the experimental
category. The only thing you are constrained by is the operating
restrictions issued to you by the FSDO. If this is something new I'd like to
know about it. Please post details,
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <Joe.Kohler(at)top.monad.net> manderson(at)monad.net |
Cliff, regarding the program letter, I spoke with a fellow from the FAA today
about getting my experimental certificate and I asked him about the Program
Letter. He said it is required for Experimental - Exhibition and Research. It
is not required for Experimental - Amature Built, which I'm sure is what you
will be doing.
My FS II is Ag Cat yellow and Pontiac red. What were your reds and yellows.
Mine was also fat at 355 lbs vs. expected 325 and I didn't really add anything
extra and kept the paint to a minimum. My CG was at the rear limit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Inspection by another builder |
Hi Everyone...
I really think that having another builder (if you are fortunate enough to
have one living nearby) look at your handywork as you progress is a very
good idea. George A. has looked at mine several times (as well as a local
EAA designee) and made some very good suggestions and pointed out some
potential safety hazards. He was by yesterday and I spent part of today
correcting some of his observations... actually only a couple of things.
I bought some McGueir's Wax (the 3rd part of the 3 part system) and I plan
to give the Polytone a protective coat. I tried it on a small area and it
does a good job. It is not a polish, but it does protect and it is easy to
apply.
I am fastening my hoses and wires under the nose cone with tie wraps that I
epoxyed to the inner surface of the cone. So far it seems to be working,
but it is a pain to hold them in place long enough for the epoxy to
harden... several minutes seems like an hour.
I have heard from several sources that the "program letter" is not required
for amateur built "experimental" certification. I will call the FAA office
tomorrow and confirm for myself that that is correct. Sorry I caused a
minor stir.
It was nice to see the Kolb on Kitplanes magazine this month.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (95%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
http://www.flash.net/~striplic Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
(under construction)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
Last wknd I pulled the wheels off to (again) see if I could
determine why my left main wobbles so badly out of balance.
I was also concerned that it looked like the inner tube was
pulling around, straining the valve stem away from its hole
thru the wheel rim. My particular setup is 6" Azusa aluminum
wheels with large tundra tires (18" outside diam) including
inner tubes. The larger, heavier tires obviously worsen any
inbalance (more mass, bigger radius=more centrifugal force).
Although I'm not sure, i think my left main wheel isn't quite
round, causing the out-of-balance wobble as the wheel spins
after take-off ...a pain in the butt w/ no brakes to stop it.
The main reason I'm posting, however, is what I found about my
tubes pulling around inside the tires. This must be caused by
the low tire pressure (4-5 psi), as that is what happens if
you walk a bike home after getting a flat tire. On one side
the tube had worked around enf to start the valve stem cracking
away from the tube. Just a little more and I would have been
trying out 0 psi on that side, possibly causing trouble on
a take-off or landing. This happened in only about 30 hours
of operation. It was also part of the wheel inbalance problem
on one side as enf of the tube had pulled around to make that
side the heavy side of the wheel.
I'll try two fixes simultaneously, in addition to having replaced the
one tube. One, I'll clean the tube and inside of the tire, and swab
a little fan-belt stick goo inside as I put the tube/tire back on.
Two, if I see the stem start to tilt over time, I'll simply rotate left
and right mains, and let the same action that causes the problem work
the tubes back.
Happy landings!
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o Kolb Firestar KXP
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | FS-2 back "seat" |
Greetings,
I'm considering the Kolb FireStar-2 and wonder just how usable the rear
seat is. It sure looks small in the photos. If you have one, can you
actually use it?
Thanks,
Russell Duffy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | evoice(at)acton.com (Doug Prange) |
I have made the throttle stop for my Mark III per the Kolb drawings from
.032 aluminum.
This arrangement seems too flimsy and bends without much effort.
Before I permanently rivet this in place does anyone have suggestions of a
different design or maybe heavier material?
Doug Prange
Mark III Builder
Lincoln, Nebraska
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
>I have made the throttle stop for my Mark III per the Kolb drawings from
>.032 aluminum.
>
>This arrangement seems too flimsy and bends without much effort.
>
>Before I permanently rivet this in place does anyone have suggestions of a
>different design or maybe heavier material?
>
>Doug Prange
>Mark III Builder
>Lincoln, Nebraska
>
Doug & All...
I made a forarm rest out of 1 X 4 redwood house trim held in place by two U
(curved part on bottom - nuts on top) brackets around the torque tube
collars front and back. I shaped the board to look kinda like a baseball
bat (to allow more rib room). I backed the board under the U brackets with
small steel plates to take pressure off the board and keep it from spliting.
The throttle comes up through a slot in the board and the slot privides the
idle and full throttle stops. Works fine and looks good.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (95%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
http://www.flash.net/~striplic Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
(under construction)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Terry Williams <terry(at)is.com> |
| Subject: | Kolb list: Lurker questions |
I am also considering a Kolb. My leaning is toward the MarkIII.
However, the Firestar looks just as fun.
My questions concern a couple of things.
1. What are some of your personal feelings toward one or the
other? (Firestar vs. MarkIII)
2. Does having a back seat passenger in a FirestarII reduce
the fuel load from 10 to 5 gals? I guess that I am asking about the
space available. Not necessarily the useful load.
3. Is anyone on the list in the Minneapolis/St. Paul area?
Please respond to me directly at: terry_williams(at)is.com
I will summarize my responses if you like.
tw
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Omelchuck <jason(at)acuityinc.com> |
| Subject: | FW: Wheels and tires |
----------
From: Jason Omelchuck
Subject: Kolb-List: Wheels and tires
Date: Thursday, April 04, 1996 7:03AM
I am just about to order kits 2 and 3 for the Mark III and know that I want
the hydraulic brake package. I think that I also want larger tires than
come with this package, and that is where I get confused. What is the
diameter of the tires that come with this package? I know that the wheels
are 6x6, but when I look in the aircraft spruce catalog the only 2 tires I
see are 6x6 in different ply ratings and 15x6x6. How do I know the diameter
of these tires? Kolb also quoted me about $50 dollars less for the kit
without the tires, but in the catalog the cheapest tires are about $110 with
tubes each. Is there some other place to buy tires that is cheeper than
aircraft tires? What load rating do I need, the foot note in the book says
the load ratings are MAXIMUM loads. How much load can a 1000# aircraft put
on a tire when landing? I would also appreciate any input on what I might
gain and loose by putting larger tires on my airplane. What kind of
surfaces can the stock tires handle, soft sand, gravel bars, plowed fields?
Thanks: Jason
Omelchuck
Portland OR- still searching for any kolb builder locally
jason(at)acuityinc.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Gerken GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM" <GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM> |
Subject:Tail, elevator hinges
Now that I have the tail rigged and everything hinged onto it, I am
(the hinges are temporarily attached with 5 or 6 sheet metal screws, each)
wondering how smooth it works normally. Everything seems to be in line
amazingly well, there doesn't seem to be any jerkiness of the elevator
as it moves, and the horizontal stabilizers don't move at all as I move
the elvators up and down. The thing that bothers me a little is that it
has a slight resistance to movement and creaking sounds come from the hinges.
When I get the bracing wires taunt the resistance is highest and creaking
sounds worst. I realize that after painting and final ass'y I can spray
on some lube and some of this will clear up.
I am interested to hear how other builders felt about the elevator hinge
operation at this stage of the plane. I have considered calling Dennis
and asking if he would OK a design change if I was to put four feet of
hinge on each side instead of the two one-foot pcs. Anyone thought about
this, considering the importance of this control?
Any suggestions, related ideas, etc appreciated.
Are there any other Kolb builders in MN?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George McCullough <airman1(at)ix.netcom.com> |
Hello all,
This is the first time for me on the Kolb list. Are there any Kolb
Mark III or Firefly builders in the New England area? I'm from NH and would
like to talk/visit with any builders or pilots.
Some folks say Kolbs are labor intensive. Any comments on the Kolb
kits ??
I did have an opportunity to see the Kolb lineup in April/95 at
Sun-N-Fun. I was particularly intrigued by the Part 103 capability of the
Firefly. I'm looking at 103 ultralights due to a possible medical problems
but my heart is torn between the RANS S-12 Airaille and the Kolb Mark III,
followed by the Firefly if Plan A falls through.
--
|
___________| George McCullough
/ / | PATCO '81
/ O / | Boston ARTCC
_____/ /| / __ UL & RANS Airaille
/ _\_| / / \ wannabee
\_____/__\_/___________________/____\
/ \
/
O
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George McCullough <airman1(at)ix.netcom.com> |
who is on Kolb list ?
--
|
___________| George McCullough
/ / | PATCO '81
/ O / | Boston ARTCC
_____/ /| / __ UL & RANS Airaille
/ _\_| / / \ wannabee
\_____/__\_/___________________/____\
/ \
/
O
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George McCullough <airman1(at)ix.netcom.com> |
Which list am I on ?
--
|
___________| George McCullough
/ / | PATCO '81
/ O / | Boston ARTCC
_____/ /| / __ UL & RANS Airaille
/ _\_| / / \ wannabee
\_____/__\_/___________________/____\
/ \
/
O
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Meeting each other |
Hi All...
I tried this last year with a little success (met a couple of guys), but
what the heck, why not again. If anyone is going to Sun 'N Fun, most
everyone will be there on Monday morning and over at the UL area at least by
11 AM. Why not try to stop by the Kolb tent (logical spot) between 11 and
12 that morning. We might be able to put some faces on each other and maybe
swap some stories. Anyway, my son (Jeff) and I will try to be there during
that hour and will be going up to strangers saying "Duh! Are you an internet
kolb list person?" I might make a little sign to put on my hat to save me
that imbarrassment. Anyway, hope to be able to meet you then.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (95%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
http://www.flash.net/~striplic Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
(under construction)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jerryb(at)jmd.ods.com |
I bought a FireFly and have since sold it to a friend due to change in
my work schedule. Having seen him work on it, its not really that that
bad. Takes a little time but most things that are good or worth
anything take time.
The Kolb is not a couple weekend project and for that matter neither is
the Rans. Myself I prefer and am more comfortable with the engineering
on the Kolb. While everything on the Rans functions (so did the Edsel
when it was new), I am a little more concerned about durability of some
of the solutions used. Some things seem to be a little cheap and dirty.
While they may not cause any major problem, its going to consume time
and money to keep fixing it or will let you down at the worst possible
place and time. As far as dealing with Kolb, they have been excellent.
They made some commitments as condition of my purchasing the kit. They
have lived up to everything they said they would do.
In fairness to Rans I can't speak for them since I haven't had any
direct dealing with them. The planes themselves seem to fly well and
most owners seem satisfied. One thing is the Kolb holds its resale
value and are easy to sell should you ever desire to. Include that in
your comparison. I feel Kolbs estimate for construction time to be
fairly accurate for most people that don't have to analyze or reengineer
things to death. Just remember time showing your project doesn't
count....as my friend is finding. But damn, he sure is having fun with
it while he's building.
______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________
Subject: Kolb-List: Firefly
Date: 4/5/96 4:22 PM
Hello all,
This is the first time for me on the Kolb list. Are there any Kolb
Mark III or Firefly builders in the New England area? I'm from NH and
would like to talk/visit with any builders or pilots.
Some folks say Kolbs are labor intensive. Any comments on the Kolb
kits ??
I did have an opportunity to see the Kolb lineup in April/95 at
Sun-N-Fun. I was particularly intrigued by the Part 103 capability of
the Firefly. I'm looking at 103 ultralights due to a possible medical
problems but my heart is torn between the RANS S-12 Airaille and the
Kolb Mark III, followed by the Firefly if Plan A falls through.
--
|
___________| George McCullough
/ / | PATCO '81
/ O / | Boston ARTCC
_____/ /| / __ UL & RANS Airaille
/ _\_| / / \ wannabee
\_____/__\_/___________________/____\
/ \
/
O
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Stafford <stafford(at)lr.net> |
I am interested in buying a new or used ultralight or homebuilt. I am totally
uninitiated except that I used to work for Piper in Vero Beach, FL and got my
private ticket while employed there. That was in the sixties and I have not flown
much since that time except commercially.
Anyone who would like to give me advice on how to proceed and conserve resources
will be greatly appreciated. Thanx.
Jim Stafford
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <Joe.Kohler(at)top.monad.net> manderson(at)monad.net |
| Subject: | Rear seat, IVO, EIS |
I have just completed a FS II. I think the rear seat is just a jump seat just
as Kolb says. I am 5-9, 180 pounds, and I fit in it, but me and another me
would put the plane a little over the gross weight of 750. I would think it
would be fine for an occasional passenger, but I guess if you really want to
have passengers a MK III would be a lot better. I mostly want to fly the plane
solo so have installed a daypack in place of the rear set, but plan to register
it as a 2-place just in case. You can carry 10 gallons of fuel with or without
the back seat.
Well, I finally fired the plane up, and I want to tell those who haven't
experienced it, that the the engine ran as smooth as silk with the IVO. Even at
low RPM the engine seemed almost to be suspended on an air cushion on top of the
wing. Except for the buffeting of the tail by the prop blast there was almost
no vibration of the airframe.
I used oil injection augmented as recommended by 100-1 Penzoil in the gas and
was also amazed at the lack of oil fumes or residue. There was almost not smoke
and after the breaking almost no oil on the prop or the plane.
Finally, the EIS engine monitoring system was great. When I went to full power
the red warning light came on immediately, which caused me to freak until I
noticed I had exceeded my limit of 6500 RPM. I need to raise this limit to 6600
and also put a little pitch into the IVO.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <Joe.Kohler(at)top.monad.net> manderson(at)monad.net |
| Subject: | Kolb builder in NH, Kolb vs other UL types |
Hi George and others in New England,
My name is Joe Kohler. I live in Alstead, NH which is about 10 mi north of
Keene. I have just completed a Kolb FS II. It is a fairly labor intensive kit.
I built mine over the winter. I spent just about 400 hours, but it was a lot
of fun.
I like the Kolb because it has a real wing built around a main tubular
spar vs. the ladder type wing common to other ultralights. I think this is a
more durable arrangement and I suspect the airfoil may be a little better with
real ribs. The Kolb seems to be very rugged. The people at Kolb were great,
though I didn't need a great deal of help cause the plane was straighforward to
build. I also like it because it is reputed to perform very well.
I considered the Firefly, but decided on the FS II because of the 503 dual
ignition, oil injection engine and the greater
wing area which requires a little less HP to keep in the air (hence the engine
doesn't need to work as hard), plus the ability to add things like brakes. I
think there is a good chance they may go to the self-certifying medical from
what I have read. I'm planning to get an N-number for mine and fly it this
summer. Please feel free to arrange a visit if you would like.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | evoice(at)acton.com (Doug Prange) |
I've attached the cables to the rudder of my Mark III and now need to swage
to the rudder pedal tangs.
My concern is that without any means of adjustment after the cables have
been cut and attached, chances are the rudder pedals will be out of
alignment when the rudder is in the neutral position or the rudder will be
out of alignment when the pedals are in line with each other and there will
be no way to make corrections.
Any suggestions or is this theory incorrect?
Doug Prange
Mark III Builder
Lincoln, Nebraska
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rabbruzz(at)unlinfo.unl.edu (ray abbruzzese) |
Hello Doug,
In my FireStar and in Mark's FS II there are turnbuckles installed in
the rudder cables just aft of the joystick. These allow for getting
the length exactly right and also allow some adjustments to the cables
as they slowly stretch out over time. I thought these turnbuckles were
standard equipment in all Kolbs but maybe not in the Mark III. They
did come with my kit and also with Mark's kit and their installation
was explained in the manual. You may want to check them out.
I am sorry I have not made it out to your house to check on your
project yet but I will be there sooner or later. Mark and I were going
to come out last week but I had to go to St. Louis. When are you
usually around ?
And one final note. The USUA club in Omaha is coming down to my
airport this Sat. (April 13) for a competition. Flying should be going
on from 9am until at least 5pm. You should come on out and see the
guys ! The airport is at 112th and Holdrege. Hope to see you there !
See you in the sky !!!
Ray Abbruzzese E-mail at: rabbruzz(at)unlinfo.unl.edu
Lincoln, Nebraska, USA
Kolb FireStar Owner/Pilot
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
Hi Everyone...
There is a new BFI in the north Texas area...a quick commercial for a very
good friend of mine, George Askenasy, of RITE FLIGHT.
Anyone in the Dallas or Ft. Worth Area who is interested in taking lessons
in a beautiful completely equiped Kolb Mark III USUA trainer should contact
George at (817) 478-6922 or 5318 Jessica Ct, Mansfield, Tx. 76063. He has a
custom built enclosed trailer and can travel to you if necessary.
Thanks!
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (95%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
http://www.flash.net/~striplic Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
(under construction)
________________________________________________________________________________
Pilots-N-Wannabees
| From: | David Hempy <hempy(at)ket.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Nylon tie fasteners (was Re: Inspection by another builder) |
builders list:
>I am fastening my hoses and wires under the nose cone with tie wraps that I
>epoxyed to the inner surface of the cone. So far it seems to be working,
>but it is a pain to hold them in place long enough for the epoxy to
>harden... several minutes seems like an hour.
I got some really nifty fasteners from Mendelson's. It's a 1" x 1" square
of nylon with a peel-off adhesive pad on the bottom. On the top, there is a
raised area that you can slide a nylon tie under. The raised section is a
saddle, perfect for seating hose and such. You can cut off your nylon tie
without disturbing the mount at all. Here's a crude picture:
Side:
//=_ _=\\
// ======== \\
// |HOLE| \\
==============================
<------------ 1" ------------>
Top:
==============================
| |
| | | |
| | | |
| ============ |
| ----| |---- |
| | | |
| ----| |---- |
| ============ |
| | | |
| | | |
| |
==============================
<------------ 1" ------------>
Okay, these pictures were probably a waste of time and bandwidth, but what
the heck. They cost a few pennies, so I ordered a hundred.
-dave
--
David Hempy Distance Learning applications programmer
Kentucky Educational Television
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder Cable |
On Mon, 8 Apr 1996, Doug Prange wrote:
> I've attached the cables to the rudder of my Mark III and now need to swage
> to the rudder pedal tangs.
>
> My concern is that without any means of adjustment after the cables have
> been cut and attached, chances are the rudder pedals will be out of
> alignment when the rudder is in the neutral position or the rudder will be
> out of alignment when the pedals are in line with each other and there will
> be no way to make corrections.
>
> Any suggestions or is this theory incorrect?
Doug,
I had no problem w/ this on my firestar. I swaged the cables to the
rudder horns first, then fitted them to the rudder pedals, using
electrician's wire tie-bolts to hold them in place for checking
before swaging. The other thing to check for is simply that the rudder
pedals are more or less 90 degrees to the frame (i think a bit less is
better unless you're v. tall).
As things turned out i think my left pedal is down about 3/8" in the
neutral position. But, your feet don't realize this -- at least
mine don't.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | H O Malone Petition to FAA |
| From: | vic(at)dcomp.com (Vic Worthington) |
-- [ From: Victor M. Worthington * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] --
Mr. Malone has petitioned the FAA requesting an interim solution to the
weight limitation problem for single place craft while FAA and ARAC work
toward a permanent solution to the problem. This petition does not seek to
change part 103, only to address the problem of the so call "fat" ultralight
. We need to show the FAA that the ultralight community is united on this
issue.
Please write to the Administrator of the FAA and tell him that you support
Mr. Malone's petition.
The address is:
Mr. David R. Hinson
Administrator
Federal Aviation Administration
800 Independence Avenue
Washington, DC 20591
If you have already been contacted about the petition, I apologize for
clogging up your mail box.
Vic Worthington vic(at)dcomp.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Terry Williams <terry@ouijibo> |
| Subject: | More questions about a Mk III |
I am looking at the info pack at the Mk III and I am curious about
a couple of things.
Does the position of the throttle bother you?
Is it difficult to fly in this configuration?
I get the feeling that it may seem like trying to ride a bike
Has anyone looked into alternate mounting locations?
Would it be too uncomfortable to mount the throttle on the left
side wall?
Looks like your left leg might rub against it.
Is the flap lever difficult as well?
My impression is that flap actuation could cause quite a
wobble because you are either switching hands or crossing
over much like the throttle. If you have ever flown an old
Mooney with the big manual gear lever you probably understand
where I am coming from.
tw
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | an old subject: UL vs GA |
Last week while on vacation visiting my folks, I went for a C-150
ride with my Dad at a local FBO. People say liability costs are
the reason General Aviation is all but dead. Now I know another
reason; it just isn't as fun as ULing.
Some lowlights of the 1 hour flight:
1. wait 20 minutes for the gas attendant to come out to fill the
tanks (actually to 2/3 each so as not to go over gross wt).
2. power on at beginning of take-off roll, then fold your arms
and wait ... Oh, is this acceleration? I wasn't sure. Climb
out at 400-500 fpm (yawn).
3. forward visibility: Sucks. since the C-150 (100 hp Continental)
is such a dog, cruise w/ 2 people always feels like we're trying to
climb (standard wt, standard atmosphere, sea level). We sink if less
than 2200 rpm and this isn't too far down from max rpm. So, it's
impossible to see anything much closer than the horizon over the nose.
This is kind of scary on take-off cuz you can't see any possible
Em landing spots ahead of you. At least there are side windows
4. The ground is thy enemy. In ULs, 500-1000 ft AGL is frequently
adequate safety, as an engine out means a Em landing on a dirt
road or field at 25 mph. In a C-150, it's 45 mph in a heavier
plane -- and this is about as small as GA gets. This and the
fact that the plane barely climbs means we get up to 2500 feet
to safely drive around. b o r i n g
5. Stiff (boring) controls. My dad gave me the controls, but there
was nothing to do. I guess this is so you can do a cross country and
experience the poor visibility from too high up for longer periods.
One might argue that GA gives you long x-c capability. But the rental
cost is too high so we're reluctant to do it anyway.
Concession: Ok, i'm Cessna bashing, and using one of the lowest
performance planes to do it. I spose a ride in a Long-Eze or Glasair
would sway my thinking considerably? Even a C-152 would be slightly
better, and there are some other very respectable GA planes. But for
all of us ULers who want to just have some flying fun, trust me, we're
in the right place.
By the wknd i got home to my fine feathered Kolb Firestar, and went
out for some *real* flying. Did some serious 90-100 degree wing-overs
(where i could actually feel the airplane), engine off glide from 2500'
agl, landed on a gentle hill *full* of poppies, buzzed right on the deck
(illegal in GA), etc. I thought it would really only be fair if I posted
a warning in the local airport office to newcomers that they check out
ULs before getting too deep into GA.
flame at will...
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CurtBelshe(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: an old subject: UL vs GA |
There is a big difference between transportation and recreation.
I am fortunate to have had the chance to do both. I think a more
reasonable comparison of UL to light plane is the same as
you see with the sailing difference between a sunfish and
a cabin cruiser. The sunfish is quick on its feet, has fast
reactions, and is just a kick to sail. The cabin cruiser is
slow and sluggish but DRY! For day sailing I would pick the
sunfish. But on a four day coastal run, give me the comfort
of the cabin cruiser. They both have their place. I know many
people who think X-country in a UL is great. I owned a Kolb
Ultrastar for many years but I carefully picked out the days that
I would fly any long (more than 50 miles) trips. I never took a
trip of over 100 miles without ground support. Of course that
was in the days when forced landing due to engine outage was
very common. The ULII engines were kinda of touchy. Plug fowling
was very common. However, I have never even considered ground
support for a trip in a 172. 300 mile trips in drippy weather, no
problem. There is a big difference between recreational flying
and flying for transportation.
curt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Benny <benny(at)soda.csua.berkeley.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: an old subject: UL vs GA |
The Cessna does what it was desgined to. Try flying IFR in an ultralight.
You want fun? Fly a Pitts or a Super Decathlon or a Suhkoi. Those are FUN!
>
>Last week while on vacation visiting my folks, I went for a C-150
>ride with my Dad at a local FBO. People say liability costs are
>the reason General Aviation is all but dead. Now I know another
>reason; it just isn't as fun as ULing.
>
>Some lowlights of the 1 hour flight:
>1. wait 20 minutes for the gas attendant to come out to fill the
> tanks (actually to 2/3 each so as not to go over gross wt).
>
>2. power on at beginning of take-off roll, then fold your arms
> and wait ... Oh, is this acceleration? I wasn't sure. Climb
> out at 400-500 fpm (yawn).
>
>3. forward visibility: Sucks. since the C-150 (100 hp Continental)
> is such a dog, cruise w/ 2 people always feels like we're trying to
> climb (standard wt, standard atmosphere, sea level). We sink if less
> than 2200 rpm and this isn't too far down from max rpm. So, it's
> impossible to see anything much closer than the horizon over the nose.
> This is kind of scary on take-off cuz you can't see any possible
> Em landing spots ahead of you. At least there are side windows
>
>4. The ground is thy enemy. In ULs, 500-1000 ft AGL is frequently
> adequate safety, as an engine out means a Em landing on a dirt
> road or field at 25 mph. In a C-150, it's 45 mph in a heavier
> plane -- and this is about as small as GA gets. This and the
> fact that the plane barely climbs means we get up to 2500 feet
> to safely drive around. b o r i n g
>
>5. Stiff (boring) controls. My dad gave me the controls, but there
> was nothing to do. I guess this is so you can do a cross country and
> experience the poor visibility from too high up for longer periods.
> One might argue that GA gives you long x-c capability. But the rental
> cost is too high so we're reluctant to do it anyway.
>
>Concession: Ok, i'm Cessna bashing, and using one of the lowest
>performance planes to do it. I spose a ride in a Long-Eze or Glasair
>would sway my thinking considerably? Even a C-152 would be slightly
>better, and there are some other very respectable GA planes. But for
>all of us ULers who want to just have some flying fun, trust me, we're
>in the right place.
>
>By the wknd i got home to my fine feathered Kolb Firestar, and went
>out for some *real* flying. Did some serious 90-100 degree wing-overs
>(where i could actually feel the airplane), engine off glide from 2500'
>agl, landed on a gentle hill *full* of poppies, buzzed right on the deck
>(illegal in GA), etc. I thought it would really only be fair if I posted
>a warning in the local airport office to newcomers that they check out
>ULs before getting too deep into GA.
>
>flame at will...
>
> --------|--------
> Ben Ransom (*)
> UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
> Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
> http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
> (916) 752-1834
>
>
>
___ ___ ___
_____ / /\ /__/\ /__/\ ___
/ /::\ / /:/_ \ \:\ \ \:\ /__/|
/ /:/\:\ / /:/ /\ \ \:\ \ \:\ | |:|
/ /:/~/::\ / /:/ /:/_ _____\__\:\ _____\__\:\ | |:|
/__/:/ /:/\:| /__/:/ /:/ /\ /__/::::::::\ /__/::::::::\ __|__|:|
\ \:\/:/~/:/ \ \:\/:/ /:/ \ \:\~~\~~\/ \ \:\~~\~~\/ /__/::::\
\ \::/ /:/ \ \::/ /:/ \ \:\ ~~~ \ \:\ ~~~ ~\~~\:\
\ \:\/:/ \ \:\/:/ \ \:\ \ \:\ \ \:\
\ \::/ \ \::/ \ \:\ \ \:\ \__\/
\__\/ \__\/ \__\/ \__\/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don Ashley <dashley(at)tenet.edu> |
Kolb , ul
| Subject: | Re: an old subject: UL vs GA |
Maybe the gyroplane guys say the same thing when comparing gp's to ul's.
On Tue, 9 Apr 1996, Benny wrote:
> The Cessna does what it was desgined to. Try flying IFR in an ultralight.
> You want fun? Fly a Pitts or a Super Decathlon or a Suhkoi. Those are FUN!
>
> >
> >Last week while on vacation visiting my folks, I went for a C-150
> >ride with my Dad at a local FBO. People say liability costs are
> >the reason General Aviation is all but dead. Now I know another
> >reason; it just isn't as fun as ULing.
> >
> >Some lowlights of the 1 hour flight:
> >1. wait 20 minutes for the gas attendant to come out to fill the
> > tanks (actually to 2/3 each so as not to go over gross wt).
> >
> >2. power on at beginning of take-off roll, then fold your arms
> > and wait ... Oh, is this acceleration? I wasn't sure. Climb
> > out at 400-500 fpm (yawn).
> >
> >3. forward visibility: Sucks. since the C-150 (100 hp Continental)
> > is such a dog, cruise w/ 2 people always feels like we're trying to
> > climb (standard wt, standard atmosphere, sea level). We sink if less
> > than 2200 rpm and this isn't too far down from max rpm. So, it's
> > impossible to see anything much closer than the horizon over the nose.
> > This is kind of scary on take-off cuz you can't see any possible
> > Em landing spots ahead of you. At least there are side windows
> >
> >4. The ground is thy enemy. In ULs, 500-1000 ft AGL is frequently
> > adequate safety, as an engine out means a Em landing on a dirt
> > road or field at 25 mph. In a C-150, it's 45 mph in a heavier
> > plane -- and this is about as small as GA gets. This and the
> > fact that the plane barely climbs means we get up to 2500 feet
> > to safely drive around. b o r i n g
> >
> >5. Stiff (boring) controls. My dad gave me the controls, but there
> > was nothing to do. I guess this is so you can do a cross country and
> > experience the poor visibility from too high up for longer periods.
> > One might argue that GA gives you long x-c capability. But the rental
> > cost is too high so we're reluctant to do it anyway.
> >
> >Concession: Ok, i'm Cessna bashing, and using one of the lowest
> >performance planes to do it. I spose a ride in a Long-Eze or Glasair
> >would sway my thinking considerably? Even a C-152 would be slightly
> >better, and there are some other very respectable GA planes. But for
> >all of us ULers who want to just have some flying fun, trust me, we're
> >in the right place.
> >
> >By the wknd i got home to my fine feathered Kolb Firestar, and went
> >out for some *real* flying. Did some serious 90-100 degree wing-overs
> >(where i could actually feel the airplane), engine off glide from 2500'
> >agl, landed on a gentle hill *full* of poppies, buzzed right on the deck
> >(illegal in GA), etc. I thought it would really only be fair if I posted
> >a warning in the local airport office to newcomers that they check out
> >ULs before getting too deep into GA.
> >
> >flame at will...
> >
> > --------|--------
> > Ben Ransom (*)
> > UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
> > Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
> > http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
> > (916) 752-1834
> >
> >
> >
>
> ___ ___ ___
> _____ / /\ /__/\ /__/\ ___
> / /::\ / /:/_ \ \:\ \ \:\ /__/|
> / /:/\:\ / /:/ /\ \ \:\ \ \:\ | |:|
> / /:/~/::\ / /:/ /:/_ _____\__\:\ _____\__\:\ | |:|
> /__/:/ /:/\:| /__/:/ /:/ /\ /__/::::::::\ /__/::::::::\ __|__|:|
> \ \:\/:/~/:/ \ \:\/:/ /:/ \ \:\~~\~~\/ \ \:\~~\~~\/ /__/::::\
> \ \::/ /:/ \ \::/ /:/ \ \:\ ~~~ \ \:\ ~~~ ~\~~\:\
> \ \:\/:/ \ \:\/:/ \ \:\ \ \:\ \ \:\
> \ \::/ \ \::/ \ \:\ \ \:\ \__\/
> \__\/ \__\/ \__\/ \__\/
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don Ashley <dashley(at)tenet.edu> |
Kolb , ul
| Subject: | Re: an old subject: UL vs GA |
Glider enthusiasts say the same thing when comparing g's with powered craft.
Then there's the balloonists and the jumpers.
Who is the 'real' authority on the best thrill?
On Tue, 9 Apr 1996, Benny wrote:
> The Cessna does what it was desgined to. Try flying IFR in an ultralight.
> You want fun? Fly a Pitts or a Super Decathlon or a Suhkoi. Those are FUN!
>
> >
> >Last week while on vacation visiting my folks, I went for a C-150
> >ride with my Dad at a local FBO. People say liability costs are
> >the reason General Aviation is all but dead. Now I know another
> >reason; it just isn't as fun as ULing.
> >
> >Some lowlights of the 1 hour flight:
> >1. wait 20 minutes for the gas attendant to come out to fill the
> > tanks (actually to 2/3 each so as not to go over gross wt).
> >
> >2. power on at beginning of take-off roll, then fold your arms
> > and wait ... Oh, is this acceleration? I wasn't sure. Climb
> > out at 400-500 fpm (yawn).
> >
> >3. forward visibility: Sucks. since the C-150 (100 hp Continental)
> > is such a dog, cruise w/ 2 people always feels like we're trying to
> > climb (standard wt, standard atmosphere, sea level). We sink if less
> > than 2200 rpm and this isn't too far down from max rpm. So, it's
> > impossible to see anything much closer than the horizon over the nose.
> > This is kind of scary on take-off cuz you can't see any possible
> > Em landing spots ahead of you. At least there are side windows
> >
> >4. The ground is thy enemy. In ULs, 500-1000 ft AGL is frequently
> > adequate safety, as an engine out means a Em landing on a dirt
> > road or field at 25 mph. In a C-150, it's 45 mph in a heavier
> > plane -- and this is about as small as GA gets. This and the
> > fact that the plane barely climbs means we get up to 2500 feet
> > to safely drive around. b o r i n g
> >
> >5. Stiff (boring) controls. My dad gave me the controls, but there
> > was nothing to do. I guess this is so you can do a cross country and
> > experience the poor visibility from too high up for longer periods.
> > One might argue that GA gives you long x-c capability. But the rental
> > cost is too high so we're reluctant to do it anyway.
> >
> >Concession: Ok, i'm Cessna bashing, and using one of the lowest
> >performance planes to do it. I spose a ride in a Long-Eze or Glasair
> >would sway my thinking considerably? Even a C-152 would be slightly
> >better, and there are some other very respectable GA planes. But for
> >all of us ULers who want to just have some flying fun, trust me, we're
> >in the right place.
> >
> >By the wknd i got home to my fine feathered Kolb Firestar, and went
> >out for some *real* flying. Did some serious 90-100 degree wing-overs
> >(where i could actually feel the airplane), engine off glide from 2500'
> >agl, landed on a gentle hill *full* of poppies, buzzed right on the deck
> >(illegal in GA), etc. I thought it would really only be fair if I posted
> >a warning in the local airport office to newcomers that they check out
> >ULs before getting too deep into GA.
> >
> >flame at will...
> >
> > --------|--------
> > Ben Ransom (*)
> > UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
> > Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
> > http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
> > (916) 752-1834
> >
> >
> >
>
> ___ ___ ___
> _____ / /\ /__/\ /__/\ ___
> / /::\ / /:/_ \ \:\ \ \:\ /__/|
> / /:/\:\ / /:/ /\ \ \:\ \ \:\ | |:|
> / /:/~/::\ / /:/ /:/_ _____\__\:\ _____\__\:\ | |:|
> /__/:/ /:/\:| /__/:/ /:/ /\ /__/::::::::\ /__/::::::::\ __|__|:|
> \ \:\/:/~/:/ \ \:\/:/ /:/ \ \:\~~\~~\/ \ \:\~~\~~\/ /__/::::\
> \ \::/ /:/ \ \::/ /:/ \ \:\ ~~~ \ \:\ ~~~ ~\~~\:\
> \ \:\/:/ \ \:\/:/ \ \:\ \ \:\ \ \:\
> \ \::/ \ \::/ \ \:\ \ \:\ \__\/
> \__\/ \__\/ \__\/ \__\/
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Terry Williams <terry(at)is.com> |
| Subject: | Re: an old subject: UL vs GA |
---Don wrote---
Who is the 'real' authority on the best thrill?
Probably bungy jumpers, extreme skiers, the guy sitting in the
right seat during Hoover's engine out manuevers, Alan Shepard, Bill
Gates when his company went public.
Oh yes, and some men who are in the delivery room during the birth
of their first child. ;)
tw
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chuck(at)aixdev.kronos.com (Chuck Cullen) |
Terry wrote:
>>
>> ---Don wrote---
>> Who is the 'real' authority on the best thrill?
>
> Probably bungy jumpers, extreme skiers, the guy sitting in the
> right seat during Hoover's engine out manuevers, Alan Shepard, Bill
> Gates when his company went public.
>
> Oh yes, and some men who are in the delivery room during the birth
> of their first child. ;)
Alan Shepard is one cool pilot. No doubt about it.
I think Neil Armstrong qualifys as an authority on best thrill.
Heart rate at 160, touch down at Tranquillity Base with
10 seconds of fuel left. Sounds pretty thrilling to me.
And yes, I would agree, watching your child being born is about
as big a thrill as there is.
am a member of, Chapter 279, puts on a pancake breakfast the
3d Sunday of every month from April till October. We have one coming
up April 21. Starts around 8 AM till whenever.
Come see our Kolb III. It will probably not be flying by the 21st but
it's getting close.
Our Chapter is based at Cranland Airport in Hanson, MA, USA.
It's somewhat hard to find the dirt road in to the airport area but
it's off of Route 58 in Hanson about a mile south of Rt. 27.
Look for the airport symbol on a sign on the opposite side of the
road from the airport road.
Of course, you can fly in also. Cranland is on the sectional charts
about 30 nm south of Boston.
If the wheather is good there will probably be all kinds of planes
flying in. We've had 50+ planes fly in for some of there breakfasts.
Ex military, experimental, UL's, aerobatic, you name it.
Rich Desmond, if he were willing to answer any questions from the
Kolb Internet group about 279's Kolb III, or aircraft in general,
and he said sure. Rich is a former A&P and has directed much of
the construction of the Chapter's Kolb. Rich said the easiest way
to contact him is through his AOL account at desmor(at)aol.com.
Hope to meet some people from this Kolb group on the 21st!
chuck
chuck(at)kronos.com
Chuck Cullen
Kronos Inc.
400 Fifth Ave.
Waltham, MA 02154
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Omelchuck <jason(at)acuityinc.com> |
| Subject: | Vertical Stabalizer |
I built my vertical stab some months ago and am now installing it on to the
tail boom. It would seem that the steel ring is not at a right angle to the
tubes that go on either side of the tail boom. I made sure that the boom
was cut square on the end. Is there an offset built into the vertical
stabalizer to compensate for slipstream off the propeller. I thought that
maybe one of the tubes that slips over the steel part was not on straight
but both top and bottom tubes want to point the same direction by about a
inch to one side when the steel ring is flush with the end of the fuse tube.
I can compensate by putting the steel ring on "crooked" but I just wanted
to make sure it is not built with an offset.
Thoughts on GA verses Ultralights:
When talking thrills, does the person who passes out on a glass elevator
EXPIERENCE less of a thrill than the person who bungee jumps. A thrill is
judged by the expierence not by the what the act is that causes the thrill.
The thing we need to be careful of is not to speak with disrespect of other
peoples "thrills" especially when they are so closely tied to our own. It
is a real disapointment to fly into an airport in a licensed homebuilt ,
which looks like an ultralight and be told by someone that ultralights are
not welcome here. I have flown gyros, ultralights (back in the early 80's)
and general aviation aircraft and loved every moment because my feet were
not on the ground.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Gerken GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM" <GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM> |
Subject:Rib flanges to main
Dennis may be unavailable today, I'd like to be able to work this weekend,
What do you guys think about this?
=========================================================================4000002137
From: Jim Gerken GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM GERKEN at RCHVMX
Subject:Spaces between rib flanges and bottom of main spar
After following the recommended riveting sequence in the Manual (top back,
top front, next-down back, next-down front, etc), I have arrived at the
bottom two rivets and found that on some of the ribs there is now space
between the rib flange and the main spar. (I have been putting the rivets
thru the flanges about 3/16 from the free edge.) I measured what looks
like the worst of the spaces and it measures .070". Is this going to fly?
Thanks
=========================================================================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: flange to main spar gap |
On Fri, 12 Apr 1996, Jim Gerken GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM wrote:
> Subject:Rib flanges to main
> Dennis may be unavailable today, I'd like to be able to work this weekend,
> What do you guys think about this?
> =========================================================================4000002137
> Date: 12 April 1996, 08:16:25 CDT
> From: Jim Gerken GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM GERKEN at RCHVMX
> To: dlsouder at aol.com
> Subject:Spaces between rib flanges and bottom of main spar
> After following the recommended riveting sequence in the Manual (top back,
> top front, next-down back, next-down front, etc), I have arrived at the
> bottom two rivets and found that on some of the ribs there is now space
> between the rib flange and the main spar. (I have been putting the rivets
> thru the flanges about 3/16 from the free edge.) I measured what looks
> like the worst of the spaces and it measures .070". Is this going to fly?
>
> Thanks
> =========================================================================
I don't recall much gap on any of mine (Firestar). Also, if it were me,
I'd prefer to get Dennis' read on this instead of anybody elses. Try
(if you can't reach D.S.) to find another part of the plane to work on.
Also, Dennis is sometimes available and open to support calls on
Saturday mornings. Email me if you need that phone number.
One other tidbit: I syringed in some epoxy in the thin gap between all
my rib flanges and main spar. I did this not for direct structural
purposes, but rather to take the long term vibration load off the 8
rivets. I'm sure there was v. little gap and negligable weight
added by this. I think the bond was v. good and it might even
have helped structurally just in terms of reducing the stress
concentrations at the rivet points. I've checked in there over
time (i had installed inspection ports) and it has not gotten brittle.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tgr(at)rmii.com (thomas g. rampton) |
| Subject: | Re: flange to main spar gap |
>I syringed in some epoxy in the thin gap between all
>my rib flanges and main spar. I did this not for direct structural
>purposes, but rather to take the long term vibration load off the 8
>rivets.
There was a wise man in Colorado who routinely worked on older GA airplanes,
and on my Piper Tripacer when I owned it. There was one substance never to
be without, and one of its uses was exactly this--relief of vibrational
effects on sheet metal.
Propeller spinners for Tripacers (and probably for every other airplane that
has one) were quite expense, and the sheet metal tended to crack outward
from the several rivets.
Dave suggested that I put Shoe-Goo around those rivets, on the inside of the
spinner. This was not structural at all, but it certainly prevented those
cracks from forming in the sheet aluminum.
I used it elsewhere too--where I once had to repair cooling baffles at the
front of the engine. I fabricated a piece of sheet aluminum to do what I
wanted, and I had to rivet it to the existing baffling. I used enough rivets
to make it strong enough just from that, but I also put a layer of Shoe-Goo
between the two pieces of aluminum that were held together by the rivets.
Nothing I make is gonna fatigue-crack if I can help it!
My Shoo-Goo came from K-Mart, but I'm sure you can buy it at any such store.
Last I knew, there was a Shoe-Goo II. It's really for fixing the bottoms of
sneakers, but if it works for airplanes, then it works! It remains more
flexible than epoxy.
I did finally fix a shoe with it. I had sneakers on which one sole was
almost off. Several years ago, I put a goodly amount of Shoe-Goo in there,
squished the sole back on, and it is still fixed.
Tom Rampton
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Adrio Taucer <adrio(at)capitalnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: More questions about a Mk III |
>I am looking at the info pack at the Mk III and I am curious about
>a couple of things.
>
>Does the position of the throttle bother you?
>Is it difficult to fly in this configuration?
>Has anyone looked into alternate mounting locations?
>Would it be too uncomfortable to mount the throttle on the left
>side wall?
> Looks like your left leg might rub against it.
>
>Is the flap lever difficult as well?
> My impression is that flap actuation could cause quite a
> wobble because you are either switching hands or crossing
> over much like the throttle. If you have ever flown an old
> Mooney with the big manual gear lever you probably understand
> where I am coming from.
>
I had the same question. What I was wondering was if anyone has or has
considered mounting two control sticks in the conventional between the legs
position (one for each person) and leave all the other controls as they are
in the center. Would this increase weight/complexity too much?
Adrio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George McCullough <airman1(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Locate a kolb builder |
Hello all,
I've been enjoying the responses I've recieved from the members
of the kolb list on my first query.
One member of the list Tapela(at)aol.com is building a Mark III and
extended a gracious invitation to visit. I'm not sure my response is
getting to him ? Do any of you remember a vehicle to do a reverse search
from E-Mail to street address ?? I came across it once and cannot find
it now ?
--
|
___________| George McCullough
/ / | PATCO '81
/ O / | Boston ARTCC
_____/ /| / __ UL & RANS Airaille
/ _\_| / / \ wannabee
\_____/__\_/___________________/____\
/ \
/
O
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <Joe.Kohler(at)top.monad.net> manderson(at)monad.net |
| Subject: | Setting the IVOPROP |
When I broke in my engine on my Firestar II a couple of weeks ago I noticed that
at full throttle the 503 would exceed the maximum RPM of 6600. I am using a 62"
three blade IVO initially set at "neutral" pitch (I think). I assume I should
add some pitch to my IVO (a seemingly great product with very poor
instructions).
Do I turn the adjuster clockwise to increase the pitch? Any idea of how many
turns from neutral? What static RPM at full throttle should I aim for to (1)
maximize climb performance, (2) to maximize cruise, (3) for all around good
performance, fuel economy, engine life, etc.
Does anyone have any experience with this combination?
Thanks, Joe Kohler
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 96 14:02:54 UT From: GARY MEEKS <GARYWMEEKS(at)msn.com>
...clipped
>time of the crash. They (George & Bill) were only up about 25 feet when the
>engine died and the nose went up and George pushed forward on the stick (with
>no response) and then pulled back on the stick (with no response). The plane
>then took a nose dive, and about 10 feet off the ground, the engine kicked
>back in and plunged them into the ground. The only thing that the media was
Gary, thanks v. much for your post!
At first upon reading this I simply wondered, "why the heck did nothing
happen when George pushed forward on the stick?". Engine out combined
with simultaneous mechanical failure of the controls just can't happen.
But, as you know, control surfaces -- especially the elevator -- are very
soft in a stall. I would guess that possibly the plane immediately went
into a stall, and with no prop wash across the elevator, forward stick
was relatively ineffective in the short time it takes to fall 25 feet
from a starting point of fairly slow flight speed (typical of climbout).
Here's another reason I'm guessing they inadvertantly stalled:
Just 2 weeks ago I practiced a full engine off landing in my Kolb Firestar
and was reminded how much more forward stick pressure is required with
the engine stopped (compared to a normal engine idle glide). It wasn't
at all hard for me to get the nose down, but I wasn't in a high pitch, full
throttle, slow flight mode when I entered this practice engine out.
This need for extra forward stick is caused by the high thrust line of
the engine on Kolbs (except for Ultrastars) as well as many other ULs.
More exactly, it is caused by the high thrust line suddenly *changing*
to only drag from the stopped prop when the engine quits.
This is a solid reminder to me, and I hope to others that we'd best
keep a good margin of speed on takeoff, and to memorize NOSE DOWN at
the *slightest* hint of engine trouble on take-off.
My sincere condolences to Bill's family, and George, I hope you have a
speedy and healthy recovery. Even if I'm wrong about my interpretation
of what happened, I have learned something from your experience.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C. van Eyk Grobler" <cgrobler(at)skipjack.bluecrab.org> |
Could anyone please tell me if the Kolb Starfire 11 is considered to be
an ultralight, or does it have to be registered as an Experimental
Aircraft? Van
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
On Mon, 15 Apr 1996, C. van Eyk Grobler wrote:
> Could anyone please tell me if the Kolb Starfire 11 is considered to be
> an ultralight, or does it have to be registered as an Experimental
> Aircraft? Van
Note, it is a Firestar, not starfire.
Legally, it is not an UL. It cannot be built under 254 lbs. As well, the
rear jump seat is illegal under FAR103 as soon as somebody sits in it.
I think, but am not sure, that the Firestar I can be built under 254 if
you use the rotax 277 (28 hp), and it is almost the same frame as the II.
(same thing tho', you couldn't carry a passenger, legally or otherwise)
The Firefly is similar to the Firestar, but offers the dbl benefit of
being able to be built under 254 lbs AND use the rotax 447.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brent Crosby <brent(at)lardav.com> |
| Subject: | FireFly Speed/Drag |
Kolb list:
I read in an article or in the Kolb literature
that the second strut on the FireFly is to add
more drag, so the level flight top speed is not
exceeded on paper. Other "features" such as the
winshield and really long chord were were
designed with high drag in mind.
It seems to me that it would be easier to limit
the level flight top speed with a different prop
(lower angle) and the RPM limit of the engine.
I do understand that Kolb was trying tho keep
the full horsepower of the 447, so a real simple
fix like a smaller carburetor or smaller prop is
out.
>From my limited experience with soaring, I have
really come to think of drag as the enemy, and
have a hard time understanding when someone
would actually is trying to increase it.
Could someone enlighten me? Would the low pitch
prop idea work?
-Thanks
Brent A. Crosby
(Please reply to "brent_crosby(at)lardav.com", which is not
necessarily the "reply to" address that our mailer gives
to your mailer.-BAC)
+-----------------------------------------------------------+
| Brent A. Crosby |LARSON-DAVIS main office: |
| LARSON-DAVIS |LARSON-DAVIS |
| 15611 East Washington Road |820 North 1681 West |
| Valleyford, WA 99036 |Provo, UT 84601 |
| | |
| voice: (509) 291-3344 | voice: (801) 375-0177 |
| fax: (509) 291-3345 | fax: (801) 375-0182 |
| email: brent_crosby(at)lardav.com | bbs: (801) 375-0191 |
+-----------------------------------------------------------+
| visit our home page at http://www.lardav.com |
+-----------------------------------------------------------+
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: FireFly Speed/Drag |
On Mon, 15 Apr 1996, Brent Crosby wrote:
> Kolb list:
>
> I read in an article or in the Kolb literature
> that the second strut on the FireFly is to add
> more drag, so the level flight top speed is not
> exceeded on paper. Other "features" such as the
> winshield and really long chord were were
> designed with high drag in mind.
>
> It seems to me that it would be easier to limit
> the level flight top speed with a different prop
> (lower angle) and the RPM limit of the engine.
>
> I do understand that Kolb was trying tho keep
> the full horsepower of the 447, so a real simple
> fix like a smaller carburetor or smaller prop is
> out.
>
> >From my limited experience with soaring, I have
> really come to think of drag as the enemy, and
> have a hard time understanding when someone
> would actually is trying to increase it.
>
> Could someone enlighten me? Would the low pitch
> prop idea work?
>
> -Thanks
> Brent A. Crosby
Brent,
I believe your suggestion for a flatter pitch prop is good except that
the engine would overspeed. I would guess this could be prevented with
some sort of rpm limiter (electronic ?) add-on to the engine.
Although drag is no friend of most airplanes (perhaps an exception for
aerobatic types), the FAA allows some pretty nice freedoms IF we can
build a plane under 254 lbs and under 63mph. Therefore, with a tax
analogy close at hand (from the tax fun i had the last couple days), the
Firefly design is like legal tax avoidance -- any legal "paper" allowance
is taken for drag that will de-rate the airplane. The need to use FAR 103
"paper" drag numbers (loopholes?), is partly because, with a short wing
span, the Firefly would have comparatively little parasitic and induced
drag (as well as less wing weight). In short, I bet the plane performs
better in the air than it does on paper. The paper version *must* add
up to FAR 103, though, or the whole design concept is lost.
BTW, I don't mean to imply that calculated drag or other performance
parameters are just bunk. I'm suggesting that the FAR nomograms must
have some slop, and that if the design is always on the performance
side of the slop, the plane could be better in real life than an average
(or poor) nomogram airplane.
Anybody know about electronic rpm limiters? I bet it might be a
relatively simple off-the-shelf adaptation, and -- like Brent said --
a better idea than adding drag (real or paper).
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <Joe.Kohler(at)top.monad.net> manderson(at)monad.net |
| Subject: | Vibration isolation |
I've been reading the mail regarding vibration isolation. I used 3-M structural
adhesive between almost all of the parts I rivited together, eg., between the
ribs and the leading edges of the tail surfaces and the ailerons. This is great
stuff, the same thing that AVID and KITFOX use to ATTACH the wood ribs to the
leading edge spar tube. It is a fairly flexible epoxy and it is viscous enough
that a little dab pretty much stays put between the rib and whatever. I cleaned
the surfaces with acetone and roughed them a little with scotch-brite. I didn't
use this where the wing ribs slide over the spar cause I had to use oil to get
them to slide on and I figured I couldn't get the oil off. However, I think it
really vibration proofs the control surfaces, which are of course very critical.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | NEW Kolb "Slingshot"! |
Greetings,
Just got back from Sun-N-fun where I bought the first Kolb Slingshot.
It's a brand new high performance version of the FireStar-2 with clipped
wings, a new much improved enclosure, and stronger landing gear. It
currently uses either the 503 or 582 engine and will in the future be
able to use the 618 and 912. The price is about $1000 higher than the
FireStar but includes several standard features that were options before
(2 place $216, full enclosure $295, streamlined lift struts (?) $150)
As I understand it, the wing now uses the 6" spar tube and 8 full ribs
per wing. The landing gear is a larger tube that turns down to about
vertical at the wheels. It looks to be a little wider stance too. The
enclosure is quite different. Everything from about the rear of the old
front enclosure is now enclosed and includes a window on each side for
the passenger. The fuselage sides appear to be about 6 inches taller
than the current FireStar but the top 6" of the right side folds down
for easier entry. The canopy is a large rigid one piece design (similar
to the two on the Mark 3). It hinges on the left side and reaches
completely over to the right when closed. The rear of the canopy is
about 6 inches higher than before. There is now a curved plexiglas
piece that fills in between the wings that extends up to mate to the
taller rear of the canopy. This gives the pilot- headroom aplenty. I
was sold the instant I sat in it. I'll post a picture on a web page
when I get them processed so you can see what all this incoherent babble
really looks like. Fortunately my wife took a couple of pictures while I
was sitting in the plane. Sadly, I never got any other pictures. They
took the plane out to fly it while I was talking to them, and it never
came back. It seems there was a photo shoot for one of the magazines
scheduled at another field that afternoon. The airshow started about 30
minutes after the Slingshot departed and the storms started before the
airshow was finished. We left about 6pm and the weather was still
hopeless.
Hope you enjoy the long and overly excited post. I don't work for or
represent Kolb in any way. I'm just a happy new builder.
Some specs from the Sun-N-Fun handout:
Wing span: 22 ft
Wing area: 110 sq./ft
Wing loading: 7.7 lb./sq.ft. @ gross wt.
Length: 19 ft. (same folded)
Height is 82" (same folded, see note- that I can't seem to find)
Width folded: 75"
Weight (empty): 345 lb. minimum
Gross weight: 850 lb.
Load factor +4, -2 Limit Load
Fuel capacity: 10 gal
Vne: 125 mph
Stall speed: 39 mph @ gross weight
Other features: Flaperons, full enclosure with rigid hinged canopy,
pull start
from seated position in aircraft.
T.O. Distance: ENGINE SOLO DUAL
503 150 ft 250 ft
582 100 ft 175 ft
Climb Rate: 503 1000 fpm 650 fpm
582 1300 fpm 800 fpm
Top Speed: 503 90 mph
582 100 mph
Cruise Speed: 503 78 mph
582 87 mph
Sligshot #1
Russell Duffy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: NEW Kolb "Slingshot"! |
Sligshot #1
Way to go Russell!
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | General building questions |
Greetings,
Since I have 6-8 weeks to wait for my Slingshot kit to arrive, I thought
I would ask a general question. What is everyone doing about primer for
the tubing in the structure? Do most people prime it or leave it bare?
Do you attempt to prime the inside of the tubing? Is the aluminum tube
alclad? I'll probably pay to have the fuselage powder coated. That
looks like a very worthwhile option.
Thanks,
Rusty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | evoice(at)acton.com (Doug Prange) |
| Subject: | General building questions |
Greetings,
Since I have 6-8 weeks to wait for my Slingshot kit to arrive, I thought I
would ask a general question. What is everyone doing about primer for the
tubing in the structure? Do most people prime it or leave it bare? Do you
attempt to prime the inside of the tubing? Is the aluminum tube alclad?
I'll probably pay to have the fuselage powder coated. That looks like a
very worthwhile option.
Thanks,
Rusty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | evoice(at)acton.com (Doug Prange) |
| Subject: | Mark III Trim cable |
I have routed the trim cable on my Mark III under the "H" tube and under the
elevator bell crank up to the spring assembly and have temporarily snugged
things up before swaging the cable.
The cable rubs the bottom of the bell crank so I moved it to the top side
where it rubs the top. Also the cable rubs the bottom of the "H" tube going
either way.
Is the fact that it rubs on a part of the structure anything to be concerned
about and which way is the recommended route?
Also, should the tension be relieved from the springs when the elevators are
in the neutral position which puts slack in the cable with the stick all the
way back, or should the tension be relieved when the stick is all the way back?
Doug
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cavuontop(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Mark III Trim cable |
I had the same problem with the trim cable rubbing everything. The double
spring assembly also rubbed against the throttle or your leg on mine. So I
made a big stink about it to dennis. He has redesigned the entire area. It
involves a new elevator bell crank and no more long cable running back to the
tail. The beta version of the new system has been tested by Dan the factory
pilot who says it works fine. I am supposed to get the new set up after the
guys get back from lakeland.
Call Dennis and ask him for a drawing of the new set up.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
Greetings,
While I'm waiting for the my Slingshot kit, I figured I would start
working on a web page for it. I plan to keep my building log and photos
on the web page for all to see (how slowly I work). Of course, the only
thing on the page now is the 2 pictures that my wife took of me sitting
in the factory plane at Sun-N-Fun. The pictures give a fairly good look
at the new enclosure. Once I get going on the building process (about
June ??), the page should get more interesting.
Rusty - Slingshot #1
Navarre, FL
http://www.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George McCullough <airman1(at)ix.netcom.com> |
This is a test message. I'mm having problems with another
ultralight list and can't figure if it's me or what ??
--
|
^ ___________|
/ / | ^
/ 0 / |
_____/ /| / __ __________________
/ _\_| / ^ /GM\ /George McCullough |
\_____/__\_/______________/____\______/ PATCO'81 BOS ARTCC|
/ \ \ (603)889-8707 |
/ o \RANS/KOLB wannabee|
O
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don Ramsey <dramsey(at)ro.com> |
George, I got your Kolb post just fine. I'll send this message to you as a
Kolb-wide post and repeat it as a private message so you can see if you're
getting both posts. Sorry for the extra message to everyone. Please forgive.
-- Don
>This is a test message. I'mm having problems with another
>ultralight list and can't figure if it's me or what ??
>--
> |
> ^ ___________|
> / / | ^
> / 0 / |
> _____/ /| / __ __________________
>/ _\_| / ^ /GM\ /George McCullough |
>\_____/__\_/______________/____\______/ PATCO'81 BOS ARTCC|
> / \ \ (603)889-8707 |
> / o \RANS/KOLB wannabee|
> O
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Cloughley <71564.1257(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Ultrastar Floats |
I fly a Kolb Ultrastar out of Essex Skypark, MD (NE of Baltimore). I'm
thinking about putting floats on my Ultrastar to take advantage of the
Chesapeake but I know nothing about ultralight floats. I'm wondering if anyone
has any experience or advice for me. Who makes them? Approx cost? How do the
floats effect flying performance? Do they make floats that have retractable
wheels? Thanks, Bill.
________________________________________________________________________________
Dear Kolb enthusiasts,
I am considering the purchase of a FireFly and would appreciate information
any of you could share with me in reference to this neat little airplane, in
particular to its flight handling since I have not been able to get any
reviews up to now. I had the opportunity to see it at Sun 'n Fun and really
liked it. I also had the opportunity to chat with the Kolb people but would
like to hear from the users out there.
I live in the Miami, Fl area and would like to get in touch with anyone
familiar with the FireFly or with the Kolb aircraft in general.
I really appreciate the feedback,
Christian Martin.
________________________________________________________________________________
**** trial license expired ****) with SMTP id AAA378
| From: | Robert Kearbey <kearbey(at)cnc.net> |
I am a new MarkIII builder. We have our tail feathers built and are
getting ready to start on the wings.
My problem is that I can't find where to get Polytone paint. No paint
store here in town knows anything about it. I need to get some now
because I need to paint the steel part of the tail post. I am sure
there are those of you out there who can give me a phone number or
address.
Would appreciate an e-mail return from somebody.
Thanks
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim <JAMES(at)CSI.compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | Craig's Wish (fwd) |
Craig Shirgold is a 7 year old boy who lives in Keene, NH. He is dying
from an inoperable brain tumor. He made a wish to Children's Wish
Foundation that he wants one million 'Get Well' cards sent to him by Aug
15, so he can make the World Book of Records before he dies. Cards can be
made or bought. PLEASE send the cards to the following address:
Craig Shirgold
c/o Children Wish Foundation
32 Perimeter Center East
Atlanta, Georgia 30346
Thank you.
PLEASE BOTH FORWARD THIS MESSAGE AND MOST IMPORTANTLY SEND A CARD TO CRAIG.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Michael E. Goldstein" <goldstn(at)polaris.umpi.maine.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Craig's Wish (fwd) |
I'm pretty sure that you should NOT do this. Craig long ago
recovered from his illness, guiness banned the postcard category and
the hospital still suffers from having to deal with all the
postcards...
>Craig Shirgold is a 7 year old boy who lives in Keene, NH. He is dying
>from an inoperable brain tumor. He made a wish to Children's Wish
>Foundation that he wants one million 'Get Well' cards sent to him by Aug
>15, so he can make the World Book of Records before he dies. Cards can be
>made or bought. PLEASE send the cards to the following address:
>
>Craig Shirgold
>c/o Children Wish Foundation
>32 Perimeter Center East
>Atlanta, Georgia 30346
>
>
>Thank you.
>
>PLEASE BOTH FORWARD THIS MESSAGE AND MOST IMPORTANTLY SEND A CARD TO CRAIG.
>
>
Michael E. Goldstein goldstn(at)maine.maine.edu
207-768-9630 goldstn(at)polaris.umpi.maine.edu
Computer Services University of Maine at PI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jstripli(at)hpmail2.fwrdc.rtsg.mot.com (Jeff Stripling) |
| Subject: | Re: Craig's wish |
Earlier, Jim said:
>
> Craig Shirgold is a 7 year old boy who lives in Keene, NH. He is dying
> from an inoperable brain tumor. He made a wish to Children's Wish
> Foundation that he wants one million 'Get Well' cards sent to him by Aug
> 15, so he can make the World Book of Records before he dies. Cards can be
> made or bought. PLEASE send the cards to the following address:
>
> Craig Shirgold
> c/o Children Wish Foundation
> 32 Perimeter Center East
> Atlanta, Georgia 30346
This is a common urban legend. Craig Shergold is a real person,
living in England. He *did* set the record for most number of
cards received in 1990 at age 10. Even better, he recovered from his
cancer and is now in his mid-teens.
Years later, the email requesting cards for him continues to
circulate...
For more information, check out:
http://www.wish.org/wish/craig.html
Or dial:
1-800-215-1333, extension 184
--
Jeff Stripling | /\/\ M O T O R O L A
jstripli(at)mot.com | / \ Advanced Cellular Products Group
(817) 245-6002 | Texas Products Division
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | evoice(at)acton.com (Doug Prange) |
>To: kearbey(at)cnc.net
>From: evoice(at)acton.com (Doug Prange)
>Subject: Re: Paint
>
>Robert:
>
>I highly recommend R & R Aircraft Supply.
>
>You can buy all the Poly Fibre Aircraft Coatings at a number of other
suppliers around the country but from personal experience Randy at R & R has
been great to work with.
>
>He offers a discount to Kolb builders and is always available to answer
questions about covering or finishing and believe me it's well worth it to
establish a good relationship with someone who knows their stuff.
>
>Phone (616) 683-2594
>
>Be prepared for a good hit from UPS for hazardous material charges.
>
>There's no way around it!
>
>Tell Randy I sent you if you don't mind.(there's nothing in it for me
except to have Randy know that all his patience pays off)
>
>Doug Prange
>Mark III Builder 65%
>Lincoln, Nebraska
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CurtBelshe(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Please help. |
Contact the Light Aircraft Flyers Association (LAFA).
They have owners of Kolb products, a well organized
club in the Miami area, a ultralight airport, instructors,
and all the help you need to get started.
They even have a 24 hour Hot-line: 305-460 3356
This is a great ultralight organization. Too bad there
isn't a group like this in every city. If there was,
ultralight flying would be much more popular.
curt
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clouse(at)olywa.net (Michael Clouse) |
Just subscibed to this group,are there any dealers/flight schools
in the NW USA Oregon or Washington?
Thanks, Mike
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
On Wed, 24 Apr 1996, Robert Kearbey wrote:
> I am a new MarkIII builder. We have our tail feathers built and are
> getting ready to start on the wings.
> My problem is that I can't find where to get Polytone paint. No paint
> store here in town knows anything about it. I need to get some now
> because I need to paint the steel part of the tail post. I am sure
> there are those of you out there who can give me a phone number or
> address.
> Would appreciate an e-mail return from somebody.
Just posting to add my recommendation to Randy @ R&R (616)683-2594.
Also, about 1-2 yrs ago, I posted about problems I had in spraying
polytone, with getting some areas of high sheen and others not so
high. Somebody gave back a *really good* bunch of advice, discussing
reasons behind all this, and which paint guns were good too. I
seem to have lost that post, so if anybody has it or the original
spray wizard is still in this list, a repost would be most appreciated.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | stei0302(at)jane.cs.fredonia.edu (Jon N. Steiger) |
| Subject: | Re: KOLB Dealers?? |
>
>Just subscibed to this group,are there any dealers/flight schools
>in the NW USA Oregon or Washington?
>
Nope... No such animal... Kolb keeps its prices down by not
supporting a dealer network. You may be able to find a flight
school that uses Kolbs though. I'd check the list of ASC, EAA,
and USUA instructors in your area. Call them and find out
what they use...
Good luck!
-Jon-
.------------------------------------------------------------------------------.
| Jon Steiger: DoD# 1038, EAA #518210, USUA# A46209, NMA# 117376, KotWitDoDFAQ
|
| stei0302@cs.fredonia.edu && http://www.cs.fredonia.edu/~stei0302/ |
| '96 Dakota SLT V-8, '91 FZR600R /* Just another mangy hacker */
|
`------------------------------------------------------------------------------'
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Ivo vs wood props |
Greetings,
In wood vs metal prop debates, I've heard that one of the negative
features of wood is that you have to keep retorquing the bolts
frequently. What does Ivo recommend? do you just bolt it on and forget
it, or do you retorque every X number of hours?
Are there any negatives to the Ivo props other than the higher cost?
Rusty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LBPD09A(at)prodigy.com (MRS MARIAN E VITTINGHOFF) |
| Subject: | firefly & firestar with rotax 277 |
Hi,
I am new to all of this so please forgive any breaches in ettiquet.
1. Is anyone building the Firefly with the 277 rotax?
2. Is anyone building the Firestar-1 with the rotax 277 as a legal UL?
3. Does anyone have experience with other light weight engines on
these airframes?
Thanks for your time . Karl
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Franklin Hurst <fhurst(at)ecsis.net> |
| Subject: | RE: Ivo vs wood props |
Russel I know a guy who had a wood prop that ran through
a rain shower one day and it splintered his prop.Granted he
should'nt been in the light shower but he had no where to go
and my Ivo prop has metal leading edges to prevent this from happening.
Still ,as with any prop ,under that much load & vibration they should be
retightened every so often.I retightened mine abought every 30 hrs. or so.
----------
From: Russell Duffy[SMTP:rad(at)gulf.net]
Sent: Saturday, April 27, 1996 12:06 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Ivo vs wood props
Greetings,
In wood vs metal prop debates, I've heard that one of the negative
features of wood is that you have to keep retorquing the bolts
frequently. What does Ivo recommend? do you just bolt it on and forget
it, or do you retorque every X number of hours?
Are there any negatives to the Ivo props other than the higher cost?
Rusty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Ivo vs wood props |
On Sat, 27 Apr 1996, Russell Duffy wrote:
> Greetings,
> In wood vs metal prop debates, I've heard that one of the negative
> features of wood is that you have to keep retorquing the bolts
> frequently. What does Ivo recommend? do you just bolt it on and forget
> it, or do you retorque every X number of hours?
>
> Are there any negatives to the Ivo props other than the higher cost?
I use a Warp, which cost ~460 instead of 200 for a wood prop. Here's
what I think the advantages are:
1. carbon fiber is *MUCH* tougher and resiliant to gravel, bugs, rain, etc.
I too know of ULers who have used up a wood prop in one short
dash home thru rain. Carbon fiber is tough enough even without
the metal leading edge tape -- unless for something like amphibious
use.
2. lighter mass means less wear on gearbox. As well, stronger material
allows greater freedom in airfoil and planform design.
3. ground adjustable gives choice for cruise or climb preference
(1/2 hour adjustment and retorque time on the Warp 2-blade)
4. carbon is not porous and subject to moisture absorption. Therefore
changes in balance due to moisture are not a problem.
5. There is some credence to the argument that designed-in flex (i.e.
twist) of the carbon prop yields an automatic "almost constant speed"
feature. That is, at low airspeed (of the airplane) and maximum
engine power, the air forces on the prop twist it to flatter pitch.
Conversely, at higher speed and lower power, this twist force is
unloaded giving you a higher (cruise) pitch. I know of somebody
who changed from wood to Warp and saw this to be true. I have
no wood experience to compare to.
6. if you ever change to a slightly different power engine, you
can use the same prop w/ different pitch.
7. It makes Cessna drivers jealous. :)
I see no disadvantages except for initial cost. (BTW, damage to wood
props in rain is much less severe if you throttle back and fly home
slowly.)
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Ivo vs wood props |
On Sat, 27 Apr 1996, Russell Duffy wrote:
> Greetings,
> In wood vs metal prop debates, I've heard that one of the negative
> features of wood is that you have to keep retorquing the bolts
> frequently. What does Ivo recommend? do you just bolt it on and forget
> it, or do you retorque every X number of hours?
>
> Are there any negatives to the Ivo props other than the higher cost?
Oops. forgot to mention the bit about retorquing. On carbon props this
may depend on the type of hub. It seems logical that non-porous material
hubs would require less re-torquing. However, if you are frequently
changing prop pitch, well then I guess you are frequently retorquing.
Retorquing a wood fixed-pitch prop should be trivial. Retorquing an
adjustable pitch prop/hub is slightly more of a hassle cuz the pitch
of the two (or 3) blades nudges around as you torque up. When i change
pitch of my Warp prop, I'm rarely lucky enf for the pitches to be within
my preferred tolerance on the first try. (I allow about 10 minutes (1/5
of a degree) difference between the two blades, and this is the best
you can get *because* of the tendency for them to move while torquing.)
Because of this I've sometimes gotten lucky and reset pitch in 15 minutes.
Other times I've fought the damn thing for 45 minutes. But by now i've
gotten to a pitch i like and haven't changed for several months.
Happy pitching, propping, torqueing, etc. Who cares, at least it's
playing w/ your toys. :)
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | How about Warp vs. Ivo Props? |
Thanks to Ben for all the great info about Warp drive props. I'm pretty
well convinced that I will not be using wood.
Now I'm curious about the difference between Ivo and Warp props. It
seems to me that the Ivo has all the same advantages over wood as the
Warp Drive prop. It does lack the Warp's "almost constant speed"
feature, but it's quite a bit cheaper. Kolb charges $255 (extra over
the $195 wood prop price) for the Ivo 3 blade and $485 (again extra) for
the Warp Drive 3-blade (they don't appear to offer the 2-blade Ivo for
the Slingshot).
Your comments about torquing and pitch change brought up some
interesting questions. I'm not familiar with the Warp drive prop. Do
you set the pitch for each blade individually? It sounds like you must
have to unbolt the prop to do it. The newer quick adjust Ivo prop seems
to be about as easy as you can get. One center bolt adjust all the
blades simultaneously and you don't touch the mounting bolts at all. The
potential problem would be that the blades might not be exactly the same
pitch, and there doesn't seem to be anything you can do about it. Maybe
they're matched at the factory, but what if you have to replace one?
One other neat potential benefit of the Ivo 3-blade is that you can
re-configure it as a 2 blade. If one blade got damage while away from
home, you MIGHT be able to switch to 2 blade mode, add pitch, and
carefully get back home.
Thanks for the info. I'm just trying to put my idle time to good use
while I wait for my kit. It's not like I'M spending Sunday on the
computer when I have a perfectly good plane to fly :-)
Russell Duffy
(Slingshot / Serial # SS-003) What happened to #1 ???
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: How about Warp vs. Ivo Props? |
On Sun, 28 Apr 1996, Russell Duffy wrote:
> Thanks to Ben for all the great info about Warp drive props. I'm pretty
> well convinced that I will not be using wood.
>
> Now I'm curious about the difference between Ivo and Warp props. It
> seems to me that the Ivo has all the same advantages over wood as the
> Warp Drive prop. It does lack the Warp's "almost constant speed"
> feature, but it's quite a bit cheaper. Kolb charges $255 (extra over
> the $195 wood prop price) for the Ivo 3 blade and $485 (again extra) for
> the Warp Drive 3-blade (they don't appear to offer the 2-blade Ivo for
> the Slingshot).
>
> Your comments about torquing and pitch change brought up some
> interesting questions. I'm not familiar with the Warp drive prop. Do
> you set the pitch for each blade individually? It sounds like you must
> have to unbolt the prop to do it. The newer quick adjust Ivo prop seems
> to be about as easy as you can get. One center bolt adjust all the
> blades simultaneously and you don't touch the mounting bolts at all. The
> potential problem would be that the blades might not be exactly the same
> pitch, and there doesn't seem to be anything you can do about it. Maybe
> they're matched at the factory, but what if you have to replace one?
> One other neat potential benefit of the Ivo 3-blade is that you can
> re-configure it as a 2 blade. If one blade got damage while away from
> home, you MIGHT be able to switch to 2 blade mode, add pitch, and
> carefully get back home.
>
> Thanks for the info. I'm just trying to put my idle time to good use
> while I wait for my kit. It's not like I'M spending Sunday on the
> computer when I have a perfectly good plane to fly :-)
>
Sounds like great features and price on the IVO. I don't know about
performance comparisons between warp and ivo. I'm not sure what the
IVO is made out of. Is it the IVO that flexes *a lot* (in the forward/
backward direction, perpendicular to blade length)? I don't know
if this means anything about performance, but you might want to chk
if the material is tough enf to withstand the rain damage type thing.
When I bought mine I felt price, performance, and features favored Warp.
But of course things can change. Also, I was able to use the efficiency
of the 2-blade (compared to 3-blade).
As for the warp, the blades are matched only in that they are from the
same mold, and serial numbered at the factory (probably for weight and
plan form records). If one should need replacement, you could get
an identical one from Warp. Yes, you do set the pitch of each blade
individually, using a bubble protractor. It is easy, except for the
tendency for things to change as you torque up as I mentioned in my
earlier post.
BTW, we're grounded out here in CA. Winds were 25 mph, gusting to 50
all wknd. Dang! It has tapered off, but now there's that inconvenience
of going to work.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Ransom <mlransom(at)ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Ivo vs wood props |
>Greetings,
>
>In wood vs metal prop debates, I've heard that one of the negative
>features of wood is that you have to keep retorquing the bolts
>frequently. What does Ivo recommend? do you just bolt it on and forget
>it, or do you retorque every X number of hours?
A potential caution here about prop bolt tightening, and also about my level
of expertise in what I'm about to write:
The mechanic that last worked on my engine (an A&P, but who I've since
decided was an idiot) cautioned me not to overtorque the prop bolts. The
reasoning is that moisture causes expansion, which in turn could overstress
the bolts, or maybe it was just that it could cause dimples in the wood
under the squash plate. It that's true, it could be possible that
constantly re-torqueing the bolts too much could be causing deeper dimples
in each cycle of torquing/flying. Could someone with knowlege in this area
comment on this?
I know that, even tho coated with a moisture "proof" coating, wooden probs
do absorb and give off moisture in response to changing humidity. This was
probably the major technical problem with the one-bladed Everel prop. Since
the counterballance was metal and the blade wooden, it was frequently going
out of ballance due to small changes in length (and weight) caused by
changes in moisture content. It has occurred to me that with advent of
metal and composite props, there may be reason for a re-introduction of the
one-bladed prop. The article in Experimenter stated that it was particuarly
well suited to aircraft in the 40 horsepower range--that's us. Anybody know
of any 1-blade props being marketed now?
.....................................................................
Mike Ransom internet: mlransom(at)ucdavis.edu (916) 752-8810
Programmer/Analyst, Dept of Agronomy & Range Science
University of California, Davis, U.S.A.
.....................................................................
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Ransom <mlransom(at)ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Ivo vs wood props |
>Are there any negatives to the Ivo props other than the higher cost?
>
>Rusty
Sorry, got carried away with the one-bladed prop treatise and forgot the
following comment I wanted to make:
I'm going with wood, in spite of my brother's great experience with the WARP
prop and the great reports we've heard about it. My reason is that I fly an
UltraStar. The prop is close to the ground and has nothing between it and
the ground to break the ground vortex that tends to suck grit up into the
prop. Also, the props are sometimes broken by striking the ground--I
suppose on rough ground or horrific bounces. I figured I would be breaking
or wearing out my prop at some point.
You have another option, not mentioned previously, and that is to get a prop
with a plastic leading edge. Culver Props will install a urethane leading
edge on a new prop for just $45 extra, and I've seen it advertised from prop
repair places too. I suppose you could keep repeating the process, tho
judging from the aged one I've got on my plane, it looks like it's probably
pretty durable.
Also, a note about the stainless steel L.E. on the Ivo. The prop of the
plane I took instruction in had a really badly dinged up L.E. strip, so I
can definitely attest to the fact that it's not ding proof. I don't know
what caused the damage, rocks, gravel or rain, but it had really taken a
beating.
Finally, I heard one story about a fiberglass prop (unknown manufacturer)
where the pilot noticed some little lines on his prop during one pre-flight
and then on closer inspection, found that it was a crack and that there were
in fact *many* cracks in the prop. Being the only such story I've heard, I
wouldn't let that sway me away from a fiberglass prop--just saying it might
be a good idea to inspect f/g props *very* carefully once in a while.
.....................................................................
Mike Ransom internet: mlransom(at)ucdavis.edu (916) 752-8810
Programmer/Analyst, Dept of Agronomy & Range Science
University of California, Davis, U.S.A.
.....................................................................
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Kearbey <kearbey(at)cnc.net> |
| Subject: | cabling and props |
Fellow builders,
I am sure someone can tell me what the best way to cut the 3/32
cable. I have tried several things but it always frays. Makes it
very difficult to put through the nico things!!!
Next, I am building a MarkIII. Tail feathers are done and just getting
ready to start the wings.
At the Rotax seminar I went to put on by Mike stratham from
california Power Systems I spoke with him about the electric
variable pitch prop. I wonder if anybody is using it?? He said it
works best for aircraft that cruise at 100 or better but thought
that there might be some advantage on the MarkIII also. Hope
somebody has one and can contribute.
Robert Kearbey D.D.S.
916-533-3262
Oroville, Ca. 9596
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "O'Grady, T.J." <ogradyak(at)aonline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: cabling and props |
Robert Kearbey wrote:
>
> Fellow builders,
>
> I am sure someone can tell me what the best way to cut the 3/32
> cable. I have tried several things but it always frays. Makes it
> very difficult to put through the nico things!!!
>
>
> Robert Kearbey D.D.S.
> 916-533-3262
> Oroville, Ca. 9596
Tape around the cable before cutting helps. Perhaps the neatest
trick is one of the little die grinders (sort of like a Dremel tool,
but bigger) and a narrow abrasive cut-off disc.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: cabling and props |
Robert Kearbey wrote:
>
> Fellow builders,
>
> I am sure someone can tell me what the best way to cut the 3/32
> cable. I have tried several things but it always frays. Makes it
> very difficult to put through the nico things!!!
>
> Next, I am building a MarkIII. Tail feathers are done and just getting
> ready to start the wings.
>
> At the Rotax seminar I went to put on by Mike stratham from
> california Power Systems I spoke with him about the electric
> variable pitch prop. I wonder if anybody is using it?? He said it
> works best for aircraft that cruise at 100 or better but thought
> that there might be some advantage on the MarkIII also. Hope
> somebody has one and can contribute.
>
> Robert Kearbey D.D.S.
> 916-533-3262
> Oroville, Ca. 9596I've found that a wrap of tape (mistic tape,etc.) around the
cable and
then cutting through the center of the wrap with an emory wheel on your
moto-tool will give you a clean, almost frayless cable end.
John Wells
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bennett, Steve" <steve.bennett(at)northstarcmc.com> |
| Subject: | RE: cabling and props |
>>I am sure someone can tell me what the best way to cut the 3/32
>>cable. I have tried several things but it always frays. Makes it
>>very difficult to put through the nico things!!!
I found the best way to cut those cables was to use a cold chisel. I
took a small one (about a half-inch), set the cable on something solid
like a vise or anvil, and then one quick blow with a hammer would very
neatly chop the cable with absolutely no fraying or untwisting of the
strands.
-Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Kearbey <kearbey(at)cnc.net> |
Another question to all you experienced Kolb builders.
Is it best to paint the whole plain together or to paint it piece
at a time and then re-assemble? More specifically, what about
painting the tail boom with all tail feathers attached?
Bob Kearbey
Oroville, Ca.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Weber (DVNS)" <bweber(at)micom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: cabling and props |
On Tue, 30 Apr 1996, Robert Kearbey wrote:
> Fellow builders,
>
> I am sure someone can tell me what the best way to cut the 3/32
> cable. I have tried several things but it always frays. Makes it
> very difficult to put through the nico things!!!
Wrap the cable with electrical tape about 1/2" on both sides of where you
want the cut. Then use a Dremel moto-tool with a fine cutting wheel. Make
sure the cable is rock steady while you are cutting. No fraying.
_-_ _,, ,,
-/ ) ; ||
||_< \\/\/\ _-_ ||/|, _-_ ,._-_ bweber(at)micom.com
|| \\ || | | || \\ || || || \\ ||
;/--|| || | | ||/ || |' ||/ || Keep the shiny
_--_-' \\/\\/ \\,/ \\/ \\,/ \\, side up
(
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
On Wed, 1 May 1996, Robert Kearbey wrote:
> Another question to all you experienced Kolb builders.
>
> Is it best to paint the whole plain together or to paint it piece
> at a time and then re-assemble? More specifically, what about
> painting the tail boom with all tail feathers attached?
>
hello Bob,
I'm just down the road (in Davis) from you. Nice to see another Kolb
in the area as there aren't all that many so far. I built and fly
a Firestar KXP.
On cables: I tried tape but ended up wetting a little solder in the
area to cut. I used a little flux and butane torch; not too hot.
Don't use wimpy dikes; sharp, hardened and big (aaaaarrr! aaaarrr!) with
a quick squeeze works best.
On painting: I painted most of my stuff separately and I think it
added considerably to the amount of time i put into the whole project.
I would think it best to prime the steel parts early just to keep them
from getting corroded, but then hold off as much as possible on
painting individual parts. Some areas, like the vertical stabilizer
to fuselage joint might be just a little difficult for the paint gun
to get to, but should be do-able. Another consideration is access
to the spray equipment. If you borrow or rent, it is another reason
to do as much as possible at one time.
Gotta throw in the reminder; if you epoxy primed anything, paint will
not stick to it unless you scuff sand it.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mail Delivery Subsystem <MAILER-DAEMON(at)acton.com> (by way of evoice(at)acton.com |
(Doug Prange))
| Subject: | Returned mail: User unknown |
This is a MIME-encapsulated message
--GAA07457.830950845/acton.com
from root@localhost
----- The following addresses have delivery notifications -----
(unrecoverable error)
----- Transcript of session follows -----
... while talking to mailhost.community.net.:
>>> RCPT To:
<<< 550 ... User unknown
550 ... User unknown
--GAA07457.830950845/acton.com
Reporting-MTA: dns; acton.com
Arrival-Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 06:40:11 -0500 (CDT)
Final-Recipient: RFC822; kearbey(at)cnc.net
Action: failed
Remote-MTA: DNS; mailhost.community.net
Diagnostic-Code: SMTP; 550 ... User unknown
Last-Attempt-Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 06:40:44 -0500 (CDT)
--GAA07457.830950845/acton.com
Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 06:40:11 -0500 (CDT)
From: evoice(at)acton.com (Doug Prange)
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: cabling and props
A GOOD PAIR OF SMALL VICE GRIPS (use the original) HAVE A WIRE CUTTING AREA
INSIDE THE JAWS.
EXPERIMENT A LITTLE WITH THE ADJUSTMENT AND THEY'LL WORK GREAT.
>I am sure someone can tell me what the best way to cut the 3/32
>cable. I have tried several things but it always frays. Makes it
>very difficult to put through the nico things!!!
--GAA07457.830950845/acton.com--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Kearbey <kearbey(at)cnc.net> (by way of evoice(at)acton.com (Doug Prange)) |
| Subject: | cabling and props |
Fellow builders,
I am sure someone can tell me what the best way to cut the 3/32
cable. I have tried several things but it always frays. Makes it
very difficult to put through the nico things!!!
THE CUTTING JAWS ON A SMALL VICE-GRIPS WOEK GREAT.
BUY THE ORIGINAL.....DON'T ACCEPT THE CHEAP IMITATION!
Doug Prange
Mark III Builder 65%
Lincoln, Nebraska
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | skip(at)netline.net (skip staub) |
| Subject: | Re: cabling and props |
>I am sure someone can tell me what the best way to cut the 3/32
>cable. I have tried several things but it always frays. Makes it
>very difficult to put through the nico things!!!
A way that does an excellent job cutting aircraft cable that I've used for
many years:
Wrap the cable with a layer or two of masking tape where the cut is to be
made. Then cut the cable (slowly) with a Dremel tool and one of their thin
cutting disks. It'll make about as pretty a cut as you could want.
Skip Staub
1984 Ultrastar
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Cloughley <71564.1257(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Ballistic Parachute |
Anyone ever mounted a ballistic parachute, specifically a BRS-5, on an
Ultrastar? The instructions that came with the BRS-5 aren't very helpful on
exact placement. Looking for some guidance on placement of the canister and
primary loop.
Bill Cloughley
1984 Ultrastar
Essex Skypark, Maryland
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Firestar II rear seat |
I know the Firestart isn't a real two seater but how practical is it really
to take someone up on the rear seat. Is it like stuffing a person inside a
car trunk to go for a ride or is it actually an enjoyable experience?.
I am getting a Firestar II with the second seat option so that I can take my
wife up once in a very while. She's not a big woman but neither is she
petite. Can a 150 pound adult really fit in this seat and enjoy the flight?.
Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dirk Harms-Merbitz <dirk(at)power.net> |
| Subject: | Where would I be able to buy parachute silk or similar? |
On 2 May 1996, Bill Cloughley wrote:
> Anyone ever mounted a ballistic parachute, specifically a BRS-5, on an
> Ultrastar? The instructions that came with the BRS-5 aren't very helpful on
> exact placement. Looking for some guidance on placement of the canister and
> primary loop.
>
> Bill Cloughley
> 1984 Ultrastar
> Essex Skypark, Maryland
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CCHIEPPA(at)umassd.edu |
Hello Kolb People,
Well I to tried several tools to cut stainless steel cable and was about
to settle for a pair of Sears electrical pliers, that was until John found
quite by accident the perfect tool. ( What works the fastest and best, I
think is a tool that shears the cable as opposed to the extra work of
soldering the cutting area, using tape or wire & cable ties then attacking
it with everything but the kitchen sink to get that nice clean cut !) I found
no name or # on the tool, it is about 6 " lond and was made in Japan. I can
tell you when you see it you will know right away that your cutting headaches
are over. Ya know the old saying "Right Tool For The Right Job ?" Works most
of the time in my shop here in New Bedford MA.
Charles Chieppa
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dr. Thomas A. W. Pijnenburg" <prodes(at)ibw.com.ni> |
please any ultrafan on the internet;
who can get me an address of the hirth engine factory in germany.
I am grounded because I can't get spare parts for my Behlen trike with
Hirth engine (2702)
I would be very grateful for any reaction
thomas pijnenburg
thomas(at)ibw.com.ni
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | FireStar building photos |
Greetings,
Through the miracle of e-mail, and the generosity of Mike Holland, I've
been receiving some of his FireStar building photos. Since I've got
some space on the server, and plenty of time to kill before my
Slingshot kit gets here, I posted them on my web page. I'll be adding
more as I get them.
Enjoy,
Rusty
http://www.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | FSKolbJT(at)aol.com |
thank you to all who showed interest in my flame-covered firestar at
sun-n-fun. would like to hear from someone with their suggestions and
impressions. :) wildfire
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eugene Zimmerman <ehz(at)cpcnet.com> |
Hello, everybody
Untill now I've simply been lurking and enjoying all the exchange going on
here. The thing that brought me up was Ben Ransom's comment about cutting
cables.
Ben wrote,
" On cables: I tried tape but ended up wetting a little solder in the
area to cut. I used a little flux and butane torch; not too hot.
Don't use wimpy dikes; sharp, hardened and big (aaaaarrr! aaaarrr!) with
a quick squeeze works best."
I agree with the part about the dikes but I have a concern about the use of
any kind of heat on a controle cable.
Let me explain. I fly a Mark II, and also a Fire Star. Both of these planes
I purshased and rebuilt after severe damage by a previous owner. The MarkII
was severely damaged in an engine out situtation and the the Fire Star was
severely damaged in a hanger roof collapse. About a year after rebuilding
the Mark II I was taking off at a local ultralight event I suddenly lost
rudder control due to a torn cable on take off in rather strong cross wind
conditions. What an exciting situation! What I discovered later was that
when doing the rebuild job I did some welding near by the cable pulleys and
must have gotten the cables a little too hot. I thought I had sheilded them
but it does not take much to destroy the temper in the fine strands that
make up the cable. By a visible inspection everything seemed OK but one day
all of a sudden it broke. There is no way an uncompromised cable is going to
tear like that. Boy was I glad it was a rudder cable and not an evelator
cable. Since that experience I never use any cable that has come close to
being heated ever!
About props, I use Ivo Props on both planes and would never go back to wood.
I have one electric and one manual pitch change. Both are two blades.
I appreciate and respect the comments of you both Ben and Mike Ransom and
love the pictures of your planes on your home page.
Happy Flying, Eugene
PS Been flying Ultralights since 1979 so I'm a kinda oldtimer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: props & cables |
On Mon, 6 May 1996, Eugene Zimmerman wrote:
> Hello, everybody
> Untill now I've simply been lurking and enjoying all the exchange going on
> here. The thing that brought me up was Ben Ransom's comment about cutting
> cables.
> Ben wrote,
>> " On cables: I tried tape but ended up wetting a little solder in the
>> area to cut. I used a little flux and butane torch; not too hot.
>> Don't use wimpy dikes; sharp, hardened and big (aaaaarrr! aaaarrr!) with
>> a quick squeeze works best."
>
> I agree with the part about the dikes but I have a concern about the use of
> any kind of heat on a controle cable.
...clipped
> cable. Since that experience I never use any cable that has come close to
> being heated ever!
Eugene, your point is well taken. I kind of pictured the possibiliyt of
somebody getting a cable really hot as i wrote that suggestion.
To clarify, I really only got the cable hot enf to melt electrical solder,
and only in the short area (1/2"? ) that ends up looped back for the
swage, and therefore is only the end part of the cable under the swage.
This part ends up at least 2" down from the thimble, and of course is
on the untensioned part. I agree that a totally careless job here could
make this a seriously flawed method. In the end, the sharp hefty dikes is
perhaps the most important part.
BTW, I checked out most of the pictures put up by Rusty of Mike Holland's
Firestar build photos. They really are GREAT! It was almost kind of
funny seeing a yellow firestar come together, as it looked so much like
my own! I've got a few build photos scanned too, and will add them to
my web page soon.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eugene Zimmerman <ehz(at)cpcnet.com> |
Hello, Kolb enthusiasts
This is my response to the questions about how I like my Ivo props. My first
Ivo was a standard 66" two blade for the Mark II. It has a 582 engine. I
was really impressed with the ability to change pitch by simply changing the
shims and was happy to be able to fine tune to my personal preference. I was
also impressed with the durability. No more repairing of erosion of the
leading edges from dirt, bugs or rain like was necessary with all the wood
props I've had on various planes before. My preference is to maximize
efficiency at cruise rather than climb out performance. All Kolbs I have
seen have more than enough climb out performance already. I can maintain a
level comfortable 50-55 m p h with the engine turning a mere 4000 rpm. But
just out of curiosity I also tried the flatter climb pitch. Whoa ! Does
that ever make it sit on it's tail and climb like a homesick angel ! I also
experimented with 2 verses 3 blade configuration and found that I prefer
the higher pitch two blade for low rpm cruise efficiency. The 3 blade is
somewhat smoother in flight but the extra weight of the 3 blade causes more
torsional grief for the gear box on slow idle.
My second Ivo was for the Fire Star which has a 377 engine. Because of my
experience with first Ivo I decided to get the electric in flight
adjustable prop. It is a 60" two blade. The performance I discovered is
somewhat different than what I was initially expecting. While the effect of
pitch change to rpm is very similar to the Mark II the effect on efficiency
is very different. This I discovered is due to the 377 engine's much
narrower rpm power band. The 582 has much better low end performance while
the 377 engine has a more specific and higher rpm efficiency peak. The
result I discovered, is to use the electric pitch change to keep the rpm in
this narrow band at all power setting like a constant speed prop for best
efficiency. The pitch changes are nearly opposite my first expectations.
Rather than change to a greater pitch for a low power cruise which does
lower engine rpm, it is much better to keep the engine in it's higher rpm
efficient power band. My 377 uses much more fuel to maintain 50-55 mph
level flight at 4000 rpm than it does at 5500-6000 rpm. So when I increase
power I increase pitch, when I decrease power I decrease pitch to maintain
this rpm range. I expect that each engine prop combination has it's own
unique characteristics.
Do I like my electric Ivo? You bet. There may be a better engine combo
and I may try it on the 582 some time.
These are simply my personal observations and experiences.
Eugene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
Greetings,
As I sit here waiting for my kit to arrive, I got curious about a few
things.
1- What provision for trim is included in the standard Kolb package (if
any)? Is there a functional, in-flight adjustable elevator trim
included or available for the FireStar/Slingshot?
2- Since the Slingshot will have flaperons, has anybody experimented
with a "reflex" flap position to increase cruise speed?
3- Has anyone tried mounting the throttle on the stick? Since I'm left
handed, I don't want it mounted in the normal left side location. On
the Slingshot, the right side of the fuselage folds down which might
complicate mounting it on the right side, plus it would be in the way
when getting in and out of the plane.
Thanks for your input. If any of this is well covered in the manual,
you can just tell me to stop being impatient and wait. I CAN wait, but
I WON'T stop being impatient :-)
Rusty
http://www.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Gerken GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM" <GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM> |
| Subject: | Props, HINTS file |
PROPS... Eugene, thanks for the info! Interesting stuff about
Ivo prop/Rotax 582 combo. I read that the Ivo needs some kind of
extension. Is that because it flexes more than wood or Warp brand?
So you would be spacing it back further to clear the wing??
Your Ivo- it changes the pitch by turning some internal-to-the-blades
rods to flex the blades, right? And is it electric? How smoothly does
this work? How many hours of operation do you have on it?
Eugene, you said the three-blade made the idle pretty rough on the
gearbox. Were you using a "B" box? I wonder if this would be less
noticable on the "C" box with damper...
Some of you guys are probably using the Warp. I don't think they have
an in-flight variable pitch prop available, I wonder if it is in the
plans for Warp? Has anyone compared the performance of the ground
adjustable Warp to a fixed pitch Ivo? I lean toward the higher carbon
fiber numbers (stiffer blades) of the Warp, but understand the Ivos
are smooth as glass. Have I asked enough questions yet?
I definitly will buy some kind of composite prop when my MkIII is
ready for an engine. I have purchased and "used up" four wood props
on previous (ultralight) planes and was not satisfied with the
lifespan. Eventually I bought a three-blade Ultra-prop. Remember
that one? Some kind of composite blades, ground adjustable in
full-degree increments with blocks bolted thru an aluminum-reinforced
hub. It was very heavy compared to wood, and the performance wasn't
really any better (in fact it had no twist), but it lived thru anything
I threw at it. Just wiped off the bugs & grass once in a while.
ANOTHER SUBJECT...
As I read the answers to the question about cutting cable, I realized
the vast untapped wealth of secrets, tips, shortcuts, procedures, etc.
that this group collectively has. I am wondering if we could pull it
all together, maybe by subject, into a sort of HINTS FILE FOR THE
KOLB BUILDER. Natural additions to this would be the cable cutting
techniques, probably the Black and Decker bullet drills, etc. If any
of us had designed (or cobbled up) special little fixtures that
cut assembly time or improved accuracy, they would be candidates also.
Someone mentioned they remember an excellent note concerning spray
painting, this would be great to have in the HINTS file. Another one
would be experiences with prop/engine combinations.
The reason I am asking is it seems I am doing a good job on my kit
so far, and understanding things quite well, but I know many of you are
miles ahead of me on your kits and even flying, and you know tips that
would help me and others. The problem is I don't know what to ask to
jog loose the information. Each of us know what neat little tricks
we've come up with. Should we try to put something together?
I am not sure how we would proceed, and that may be a question for
the provider of this communication path. Does anyone have more
ideas about implementing this sort of thing?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jstripli(at)hpmail2.fwrdc.rtsg.mot.com (Jeff Stripling) |
| Subject: | Re: Props, HINTS file |
Earlier, Jim Gerken GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM said:
>
> I am not sure how we would proceed, and that may be a question for
> the provider of this communication path. Does anyone have more
> ideas about implementing this sort of thing?
Sounds like a FAQ, or Frequently Asked Questions list.
If it was a text file, I could house it here and you would retrive
it via a get command to the majordomo program.
A better solution IMHO would be an HTML-based list resident somewhere
on the Web. This would give you an online resource separate from
the list.
I don't have any web space available to the outside world. Perhaps
someone would like to volunteer to maintain the list: accepting
inputs from others, collecting the list & writing the HTML, and
finally hosting it on some public web space.
--
Jeff Stripling | /\/\ M O T O R O L A
jstripli(at)mot.com | / \ Advanced Cellular Products Group
(817) 245-6002 | Texas Products Division
________________________________________________________________________________
Pilots-N-Wannabees
| From: | David Hempy <hempy(at)ket.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Props, HINTS file |
KOLB list:
> <...>
> ANOTHER SUBJECT...
> As I read the answers to the question about cutting cable, I realized
>the vast untapped wealth of secrets, tips, shortcuts, procedures, etc.
>that this group collectively has. I am wondering if we could pull it
>all together, maybe by subject, into a sort of HINTS FILE FOR THE
>KOLB BUILDER.
> <...>
> I am not sure how we would proceed, and that may be a question for
>the provider of this communication path. Does anyone have more
>ideas about implementing this sort of thing?
> <...>
Jim,
I maintain a collection of posts to both this list and the ultralight-flight
mailing list. My mail reader, Eudora, makes it very easy to maintain
extremely usable heirarchy of information.
As I read a piece of mail that contains lasting, useful info, I hit
something like:
Transfer | Ultralight | Flying | Instruction
or:
Transfer | Ultralight | Planes | Make | Kolb
This involves no more than a half dozen keystrokes, which I can do in my
sleep at this point. With some four seconds invested in each message (after
reading it, or course) I have a substantial archive built up. I am
currently working on publishing the archive on the web... look for it in the
next few weeks.
I don't have a particularly large area on Kolbs. I encourage anyone on the
Kolb list with a polite mail reader to build a more Kolb-o-centric database.
Shortcomings include:
o I have to process each message individually. (Not too bad, as
ultralights are my passion!)
o I place messages into entirely subjective categories, and I can't easily
place a message under two categories (i.e. Instruction *and* Aerobatics)
o I'm not aware of a easy way to turn the archive into a nice, heirarchial
web page. It's going to be pretty vanilla text pages. But it's the content
that matters, anyway, right? I will be posting the files in Eudora's file
format, which is mostly straight text. It would be really cool if I can set
it up that users can use Eudora, or possibly other mailers, to peruse the
archive. I don't know if this will work out or not. I'd love to hear from
anyone with related experience.
o I don't differentiate between posts to the Kolb list and the Ultralight
list. Oh, well.
I'm eager to receive suggestions on how this tool can be most useful.
-dave
--
David Hempy Distance Learning applications programmer
Kentucky Educational Television
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | FSKolbJT(at)aol.com |
HELLO:
My flameded firestar did not qualify to be entered into competition due
to not having the required minimum of 10 hours airframe time but did qualify
for Craftmanship Award which I was honored to receive. If anyone has any
questions about how or why I did something - let me know.
I also do covering on general aviation aircraft. Any questions on
aircraft covering or materials or hints on painting - drop a line.
JOHN
(WILDFIRE)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | stei0302(at)cs.fredonia.edu (Jon N. Steiger) |
>
>HELLO:
> My flameded firestar did not qualify to be entered into competition due
>to not having the required minimum of 10 hours airframe time but did qualify
>for Craftmanship Award which I was honored to receive. If anyone has any
>questions about how or why I did something - let me know.
> I also do covering on general aviation aircraft. Any questions on
>aircraft covering or materials or hints on painting - drop a line.
>
You wouldn't happen to have a (or a few) picture(s) of it, would you?
I'd really like to take a look at it, and I can always use another picture
for the UL Home Page! :)
-Jon-
.------------------------------------------------------------------------------.
| Jon Steiger: DoD# 1038, EAA #518210, USUA# A46209, NMA# 117376, KotWitDoDFAQ
|
| stei0302@cs.fredonia.edu && http://www.cs.fredonia.edu/~stei0302/ |
| '96 Dakota SLT V-8 Club Cab, '91 FZR600R /* Just another mangy hacker */
|
`------------------------------------------------------------------------------'
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Aircraft parts suppliers |
Hi, me again:
I just ordered a LEAF catalog and the Rotax info-pak that they sell. I
might order a couple other catalogs to have on hand as well. Who seems
to have the best selection and prices for our needs? Got any favorites?
Thanks,
Rusty (still got awhile to wait- sigh)
http://www.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <Joe.Kohler(at)top.monad.net> manderson(at)monad.net |
I've noticed there are some new Kolb builders, so I thought I would repeat some
building tips I sent through a few months ago. I've added a cable cutting tip
since that has been a frequent topic lately.
Here are some ideas and suggestions derived from my enjoyable FS II building
process. They come with the standard disclaimer: use at your own risk, and
verify with the factory if you have any questions.
1. A miter box saw with a metal blade (available from Northern Hydraulics -
1-800-533-5545) is an excellent tool for cutting tubing.
2. A pneumatic riviter, also available from Northern, is very handy and costs
only about $60.
3. Duct tape works great for holding parts prior to riviting, e.g., in holding
the ribs against the front and rear spars. You can adjust the position if
needed and then drill right through the duct tape, which will keep the drill bit
from skipping.
4. Cleco's (a sort of temporary rivit available from aircraft supply shops)
work well to attach parts prior to riviting.
5. If you obtain a 5/16 th tubing bender the trailing edge of the elevator and
ailerons can be made in a single piece with nice radiused corners.
6. When attaching the lower front triangular gussets to the vertical
stabilizer, note that some rivits are to be omitted until the stabilizer is
attached to the fuselage tube during final assembly. Do not drill holes for
these rivits until then.
7. Don't prime the ends of the steel drag strut ends, elevator horns, or lift
strut ends that are to be located inside aluminum tubes because the primer will
only have to be sanded off in order for the tubes to fit. It might be a good
idea to grease these before inserting them to prevent corrosion.
8 . It may be necessary to gently tap the steel elevator horns into the leading
edge tube of the elevator in order to get them in far enough to obtain the 1/2"
gap between the horizontal stabilizer and the fuselage tube. The protruding
ends of these fittings are slightly out of round, which will cause the leading
edge of the elevator tube to become slightly out of round where they are tapped
in.
9. The AN4-12A bolt that fastens the aluminum tailwheen bar to the lower tube
of the bottom vertical stabilizer should be located about an inch in back of the
forward end of the bar (I think)(as opposed to near when the bar exits the tube
because a hole there would tend to weaken it.
10. A few drops of motor oil dripped into the inside of the H-section used in
the wings and fuselage may reduce internal corrosion.
11. On page 24 of the manual, the second sentence should end "...a shorter tube
to be placed on the inside bottom of the wing tube" ( I think) ( as opposed to
inside top).
12. The two ribs located over the H-section portion of the spar should be slid
into position before the H-section is rivited.
13. Before riveting the front spar to the ribs near the inboard end of the
wing, install the inboard rib nose (you can't get it on once the LE is rivited
on).
14. When installing elevator and rudder hinges, make sure hinges are not
installed "upside down" in terms of the location of the hinge pin. Study plans
carefully. Put in a couple #6 screws and check the up and down movement before
drilling the remaining zillion holes.
15. If you drill out several rivits and feel the holes have become too large
you could replace the 1/8 inch rivits with 5/32 rivits.
16. Before covering, the application of adhesive tape over rivits that will be
directly under and in contact with the covering, and also over where rivits
attach to leading edge tubes, may smooth and sharp transitions and protect the
dacron from abrasion from below.
17. Before covering wings apply Polytak to the wings ribs and let dry. After
fabric is applied and heat shrunk rub MEK through the fabric and it will stick
the fabric to the ribs. Then apply the tape and fabric rivits.
18. A dab of 3-M structural adhesive applied between gussets and tubes, and
between ribs and tubes may provide extra security and resistance to vibration
and spread loads very uniformly. It's certainly not necessary but it can't hurt
either. Clean parts first with acetone.
19. A good way to cut control cable is to lay the cable on a steel object like
an anvil or 5 lb. hammer, and give it a whack with a sharp 1/2" wide cold
chisel. Cuts off cleanly.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Aviation Laboratories <avl(at)nol.net> |
| Subject: | Linkage to Kolb Aircraft Home Page |
Dear Webmaster:
I was inquiring about the possibility of your home page having a link to
our
home page. Our company is Aviation Laboratories, which specializes in
several different aviation parts and services.
Our URL is: http://www.avlab.com
Our Description:
Aviation Laboratories provides aviation parts, aviation products &
general aviation
services. FBO's, LearJet, Citation, Gulfstream, and Falcon operators
utilize oil and
hydraulic analysis, rotables, and aviation parts location services.
Your generousity will be appreciated and we will return the same
opportunity
when you reply to our request.
I am requesting a small description of your company for your listing on
our page.
If you have any questions or comments, please call me at (713) 864-6677
ext.
217 or e-mail me.
Thank you for your time.
Sincerely
Duc Nguyen
Webmaster
Aviation Laboratories
*****************************************************************
Duc K. M. Nguyen Phone: (713) 864-6677
Director of the Internet (800) 256-6876
Aviation Laboratories Fax: (713) 864-6990
http://www.avlab.com E-mail: avl@nol.net
*****************************************************************
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Trailer\transportation |
Need info on what is the best method of transporting a Mark III.
Airport is 6 mi. away. Do not want to spend $ on hanger space or tie down.
Can certain existing trailers be modified, such as a boat trailer?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rael(at)usa.net (Mike Rael) |
| Subject: | Re: Linkage to Kolb Aircraft Home Page |
Just for everyone's information, I have responded to this individual about
his request.
If anyone new to the list does not know, I maintain the Kolb Aircraft home
page, located at http://www.usa.net/~rael/kolb/index.html. Check it out
and give me your feedback.
I admit I haven't added much to the Web page lately, but I hope to add some
new material in the next few months, including building tips as suggested
in some earlier posts.
I'm building a Mark III and hope to have photos of my progress on the Web
before too long.
--
Mike Rael
rael(at)usa.net
http://www.usa.net/~rael
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tgr(at)rmii.com (thomas g. rampton) |
| Subject: | Re: Trailer\transportation |
>Need info on what is the best method of transporting a Mark III.
>Airport is 6 mi. away. Do not want to spend $ on hanger space or tie down.
>Can certain existing trailers be modified, such as a boat trailer?
>
Yeah,
Ditto all this, except mine will become a Firestar after I get the rest of
the pop rivets in place. My airport is just a little farther, and hangar
rent is prohibitive. The wind can scream here, so it isn't going to be tied
outside.
But since I'm also into river-running, I need to come up with a trailer to
serve both functions: A flat bed for my raft, which is 17' long and wider
than the folded Kolb, and low enough that I'll be able to get my Kolb up
onto it. Enough structure that there's some protection from the wind at
freeway speeds (which are now even faster than the Kolb will fly).
Maybe I can't easily do this, but I'm gonna try. And if I do succeed, I'll
post a picture of it on my home page--which isn't there yet because I need
to figure that out too.
Tom
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Trailer\transportation |
On Wed, 15 May 1996, thomas g. rampton wrote:
> >Need info on what is the best method of transporting a Mark III.
> >Airport is 6 mi. away. Do not want to spend $ on hanger space or tie down.
> >Can certain existing trailers be modified, such as a boat trailer?
> >
>
> Yeah,
>
> Ditto all this, except mine will become a Firestar after I get the rest of
> the pop rivets in place. My airport is just a little farther, and hangar
> rent is prohibitive. The wind can scream here, so it isn't going to be tied
> outside.
>
> But since I'm also into river-running, I need to come up with a trailer to
> serve both functions: A flat bed for my raft, which is 17' long and wider
> than the folded Kolb, and low enough that I'll be able to get my Kolb up
> onto it. Enough structure that there's some protection from the wind at
> freeway speeds (which are now even faster than the Kolb will fly).
>
> Maybe I can't easily do this, but I'm gonna try. And if I do succeed, I'll
> post a picture of it on my home page--which isn't there yet because I need
> to figure that out too.
>
I think my trailer is close to what you're talking about. See
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom/trailer.html I don't routinely
do freeway stuff cuz my airport is close. I've done it though, and
55-60 is okay, but more gets too nerve racking.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Two Place Kolb Wanted |
To All...
A fellow by the name of Paul Wells is interested in purchasing a two place
Kolb and asked that I mention it to the list for him as he has no internet
access. He lives out in the country south of Ft. Worth, Tx. and wants a two
place design that is foldable. He is an experienced welder and wants to
build a trailer to keep it in at the local airport or possibly at home. He
said he prefered one already built, but would certainly consider one under
construction. If anyone is interested, below is his address and phone.
Paul Wells (817) 293-6080
10128 Crowley Rd.
Crowley, Tx. 76036
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (95%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
http://www.flash.net/~striplic Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
(under construction)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | elklotz(at)fnet.friendlynet.com |
| Subject: | Covering the Mark #3 fuselage |
Fellow Kolb Builders,
I need any input that you all would like to share!!
I'm covering my fuselage and would like to inclose it completely as
the instructions suggest. It seems that I must install the gas tanks,
gas lines and misc. stuff before covering and painting. I would like
to paint before installing anything that can wait till then.
Are there any options that I may be over looking?
Plus are there any suggestions to which I-comm is best?
Last, are there any prefered locations for the power supply box and the
strob light power supply box. (I guess any wiring ideas in general
would be a good help.)
Thanks
Emerson L. Klotz
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Single vs. dual carbs |
Greetings,
Since I have nothing better to do than obsess over details while I'm
waiting for my Slingshot kit, I was curious about multiple carbs. Rotax
sells the 503 engine with either single (46 HP) or dual carbs (50 HP).
I'm assuming that the cruise power can be the same with either
arrangement, but the climb power will be affected slightly. It looks to
me like the power difference isn't worth the extra trouble of having 2
carbs. Check my logic below and let me know what you think.
The advantages as I see it:
Single: lighter (2-3 pounds)
cheaper ($100)
simpler- less to install and cause trouble
(linkage, oil line, fuel line, carb itself)
Dual: More climb power (4 HP/ 8%)
Any comments would be appreciated.
Russell Duffy
http://www.gulf.net/~rad
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | skip(at)netline.net (skip staub) |
| Subject: | Re: Single vs. dual carbs |
Russell,
>It looks to
>me like the power difference isn't worth the extra trouble of having 2
>carbs. Check my logic below and let me know what you think.
I tend to agree with your logic. Keeping it simple will pay dividends in
the long run.
If you want to climb and cruise faster the dual carb option will make little
difference.
Skip
1984 Ultrastar
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brandon Kearbey <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
| Subject: | Throttle configurations |
Hello all,
My father and I are building a MarkIII. We have finished kit 1 and are
now waiting for kit 2 & 3. By looking at the throttle configuration it
seems to be a little akward. I saw an advertisement for a dual throttle
configuration somewhere and now I can't find it. I would like to hear
some input on a couple of questions that my father and I have.
1. How easy is the standard configuration to use?
2. Does anyone know where to get the dual throttle conversion and is it
really needed?
3. Has anyone thought of using an on-stick throttle control like a
motorcycle throttle?
Your input is greatly appreciated.
Brandon Kearbey
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Single vs. dual carbs |
On Thu, 16 May 1996, Russell Duffy wrote:
> Greetings,
>
> Since I have nothing better to do than obsess over details while I'm
> waiting for my Slingshot kit, I was curious about multiple carbs. Rotax
> sells the 503 engine with either single (46 HP) or dual carbs (50 HP).
> I'm assuming that the cruise power can be the same with either
> arrangement, but the climb power will be affected slightly. It looks to
> me like the power difference isn't worth the extra trouble of having 2
> carbs. Check my logic below and let me know what you think.
>
> The advantages as I see it:
>
> Single: lighter (2-3 pounds)
> cheaper ($100)
> simpler- less to install and cause trouble
> (linkage, oil line, fuel line, carb itself)
>
> Dual: More climb power (4 HP/ 8%)
Rusty,
I've heard that dual carbs would use more fuel, but this may be a
blanket assumption. I'd be curious of the real answer. If there
were fuel savings, this is also a strong plus for single carb. I've also
thought that the 503 dual carb is rated at 52 HP. When you consider
the incremental gain of 6 HP for only 2.5 lbs, it is one of the best
bargains around. (As a comparison, a 447 SC is 40HP at 79 lbs -- with
carb, exhaust, and gearbox -- about 2 lbs/HP!)
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
I have found some web sites were I was able to see some pictures of the
Firestar (or other kolb aircraft) under construction. I would appreciate any
input as to any web sites were construction tips or pictures can be found.
Also, is there a way to download old messages sent through this mail list, if
they are somehow stored. I would immagine there is a lot I could learn from
reading old messages.
Thanks,
Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Single vs. dual carbs |
Ben Ransom wrote:
> Rusty,
> I've heard that dual carbs would use more fuel, but this may be a
> blanket assumption. I'd be curious of the real answer. If there
> were fuel savings, this is also a strong plus for single carb. I've also
> thought that the 503 dual carb is rated at 52 HP. When you consider
> the incremental gain of 6 HP for only 2.5 lbs, it is one of the best
> bargains around. (As a comparison, a 447 SC is 40HP at 79 lbs -- with
> carb, exhaust, and gearbox -- about 2 lbs/HP!)
>
> --------|--------
> Ben Ransom (*)
> UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
> Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
> http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
> (916) 752-1834
Ben,
I've seen the 503 dual rated at 52 HP but I can't remember where. All the
shiny Rotax info sheets I have list it as 50 HP. I"m also thinking the
same people who claimed 52 HP for the dual, rated the single at 48 HP.
Unless I hear differently, I guess I've got to trust what's on the Rotax
info sheets.
As for the fuel issue, I would expect that the dual carb setup would have
the same or slightly less fuel flow than the single carb when producing the
same HP. It should be just a bit more efficient I think. Of course, at
full throttle, the dual will use more fuel because it's producing more
power.
The other question is redundancy. What happens when one of your dual carbs
bellies-up during a flight (no fuel flow, flooding, air leak.. take your
pick)? I don't think a single healthy cylinder could supply enough power
to keep the plane aloft but it would certainly give you more options for a
landing. How long would the engine run before the dead cylinder seized up?
Is safety a good reason for dual carbs?
The other good point I can see for duals, is that you can optimize the
settings for each cylinder. I'm not sure it's necessary, but it seems like
you could (maybe that's how you get 52 HP, hee hee).
The dual would be the easiest to get since I know that Kolb will supply it.
It might turn out to be the best way to go.
Thanks for any additional thoughts you might have.
Rusty (Ordered the kit 5 weeks ago today)
http://www.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wild(at)nwcsd.nw.att.com |
Does anyone on the list know where I can obtain a material known as
"Poly Board Stiffners". This is a material that looks like white plastic
cardboard. I has been used as a backing for fabric on aircraft interiors.
I have located a company in PA. which uses this material for aircraft
upholstery. It comes in 4' x 6' sheets at a cost of $12.00 each.
I would like to located a source for the material closer to home
(North Central Illinois).
Rich
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Download tips. |
Chis,
The only pages I know of are:
Mine:
http://www.gulf.net/~rad/
Ben Ransom's:
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
Kolb:
http://www.usa.net/~rael/kolb/index.html
The closest thing to building tips I've seen is on Ben's page with his
building photos. If anyone knows of any other sites, please post them
to the list because I would certainly be interested too.
I don't know of an archive unless someone has kept one personally.
Again, if there is one, I'd like to know also.
Good luck,
Rusty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Single vs. dual carbs |
Note: This is a resend. I originally sent it last night, but never saw it
on the list. Sorry if it's a duplicate.
Ben Ransom wrote:
> Rusty,
> I've heard that dual carbs would use more fuel, but this may be a
> blanket assumption. I'd be curious of the real answer. If there
> were fuel savings, this is also a strong plus for single carb. I've also
> thought that the 503 dual carb is rated at 52 HP. When you consider
> the incremental gain of 6 HP for only 2.5 lbs, it is one of the best
> bargains around. (As a comparison, a 447 SC is 40HP at 79 lbs -- with
> carb, exhaust, and gearbox -- about 2 lbs/HP!)
>
> --------|--------
> Ben Ransom (*)
> UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
> Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
> http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
> (916) 752-1834
Ben,
I've seen the 503 dual rated at 52 HP but I can't remember where. All the
shiny Rotax info sheets I have list it as 50 HP. I"m also thinking the
same people who claimed 52 HP for the dual, rated the single at 48 HP.
Unless I hear differently, I guess I've got to trust what's on the Rotax
info sheets.
As for the fuel issue, I would expect that the dual carb setup would have
the same or slightly less fuel flow than the single carb when producing the
same HP. It should be just a bit more efficient I think. Of course, at
full throttle, the dual will use more fuel because it's producing more
power.
The other question is redundancy. What happens when one of your dual carbs
bellies-up during a flight (no fuel flow, flooding, air leak.. take your
pick)? I don't think a single healthy cylinder could supply enough power
to keep the plane aloft but it would certainly give you more options for a
landing. How long would the engine run before the dead cylinder seized up?
Is safety a good reason for dual carbs?
The other good point I can see for duals, is that you can optimize the
settings for each cylinder. I'm not sure it's necessary, but it seems like
you could (maybe that's how you get 52 HP, hee hee).
The dual would be the easiest to get since I know that Kolb will supply it.
It might turn out to be the best way to go.
Thanks for any additional thoughts you might have.
Rusty (Ordered the kit 5 weeks ago today)
http://www.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Download tips |
Note: This is a resend. I originally sent it last night, but never
saw it on the list. Sorry if it's a duplicate.
Chis,
The only pages I know of are:
Mine:
http://www.gulf.net/~rad/
Ben Ransom's:
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
Kolb:
http://www.usa.net/~rael/kolb/index.html
The closest thing to building tips I've seen is on Ben's page with his
building photos. If anyone knows of any other sites, please post them
to the list because I would certainly be interested too.
I don't know of an archive unless someone has kept one personally.
Again, if there is one, I'd like to know also.
Good luck,
Rusty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jstripli(at)hpmail2.fwrdc.rtsg.mot.com (Jeff Stripling) |
| Subject: | Re: Download tips |
Earlier, Russell Duffy said:
>
> I don't know of an archive unless someone has kept one personally.
> Again, if there is one, I'd like to know also.
To retreive a list of previous month's digests, send email to
majordomo(at)ftw.mot.com and include this line in the body of your email:
index kolb
This will return a list of files. Each file represents one month's
worth of traffic. To get a file, again address mail to
majordomo(at)ftw.mot.com and include this line in your mail:
get kolb kolb.YYMM
Where YY represents the last two digits of the year and MM represents
the two digits of the month, with a leading zero for months 1-9. For
example, to get all postings for March, 1996, you would send:
get kolb kolb.9603
You must be a member of the list to get files.
List digests are available from March, 1996 to the present...
--
Jeff Stripling | /\/\ M O T O R O L A
jstripli(at)mot.com | / \ Advanced Cellular Products Group
(817) 245-6002 | Texas Products Division
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | FSKolbJT(at)aol.com |
Skip :
Detailed instructions would be hard to give out over the net. Need to know
in detail what you've done and how far you've gone before I can help you any
farther. Please let me know how I can get in touch with you so I can be of
further assistance.
John ( wildfire )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Curtis West <ccwest(at)intermind.net> |
Hi all,
I=B9m almost ready to order a FireStar II and will be constructing it
in a standard two car (19=B9W x 23=B9L) garage. I would like to get
some suggestions from the other builders of FireStar=B9s, regarding the
the minimum size workbench needed (width & length), and the tools &
equipment needed that would help me save time, and do a more accurate
and cleaner job. I know that a small Drill Press would come in handy,
but how small? I seen a small Black&Decker DPress at Wal-Mart ($175),
that had what looked like to be a 10=B2 x 1O=B2 work surface. Would
this be too small? Reading through past postings, others have mentioned
things like hot glue guns, miter boxes, etc...
Any and all suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
Curtis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tool & Equip |
>Hi all,
>
>I=B9m almost ready to order a FireStar II and will be constructing it in a
standard two car (19=B9W x 23=B9L) garage. I would like to get some=
suggestions
from the other builders of FireStar=B9s, regarding the the minimum size
workbench needed (width & length), and the tools & equipment needed that
would help me save time, and do a more accurate and cleaner job. I know that
a small Drill Press would come in handy, but how small? I seen a small
Black&Decker DPress at Wal-Mart ($175), that had what looked like to be a
10=B2 x 1O=B2 work surface. Would this be too small? Reading through past
postings, others have mentioned things like hot glue guns, miter boxes,=
etc...
>
>Any and all suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>
>Curtis
>
My workbench was just a standard 4 X 8 sheet of particle board (thick enough
to be really flat and level). I built a frame for it making it a table at
the height that suited me. It worked just fine in building all of the parts
requiring a flat/level surface. The long tubes for the ailerons and flaps
had to be supported off the table but that was no problem.
I found I did not miss having a drill press at all. I found that the 6"
grinder/wire brush combo was absolutely necessary. You definitely need a
vice and various clamps come in handy. I used a lot of duct tape and
masking tape to temporarily hold things together. I used a couple hundred
sheet metal screws (poor man's clecos). An electric screwdriver is helpful.
I used a hand rivet puller and got by just fine (good exercise and a four
letter vocabulary enhancer). I found a Dremel tool (especialy the cut off
wheels) very handy for many jobs.
I wish that I had purchased spray painting equipment, but got around that by
imposing on a friend to apply the epoxy chromate and Polytone on the
fuselage boom, fiberglass and other aluminum trim parts, having the local
high school paint shop paint the flying surfaces and sponge rolling the
fuselage Stits cover myself. I would recommend having the fuselage cage and
steel parts powder coated (I did not and wish I had). I recommend buying
the ribs already made by Kolb.
I had a 3 car garage to use and while I did much of the construction in
about the space of 1.5 cars, occasionally I expanded to the full 2 car area.
I built a simple pipe rack on one wall to sort the various sizes and
thicknesses. You have to find places to store finished parts and supplies.
I used space under beds, in closets & in the attic.
I had a wonderful time building everything... with maybe the possible
exception of having to tweak (to make fit perfectly) all of the false ribs.
Have fun...
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (98%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
Cliff,
The tool info was interesting, thanks for passing that along to the
list.
Your signature says 98% for the MK III. How about teasing us all with a
progress report. Just what remains to be done at 98%?
Thanks,
Russell Duffy (waiting 6 weeks tomorrow)
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad
(slightly new address, old one still works)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
>Your signature says 98% for the MK III. How about teasing us all with a
>progress report. Just what remains to be done at 98%?
Russell & All...
I need to finish the back half of the wing gap seal. I have trimmed around
the engine, but the bracing, hold down, springs, and muffler heat sink need
to be added.
I need to install the ELT antenna.
I need to fix leaks of antifreeze seeping from under head bolts in the area
where the radiator and oil tank brackets are attached. I understand you can
use a little high temp RTV on top of and below the bracket to fix this type
of leak.
I need to break-in the engine.
I need to have it inspected by the FAA.
I need a 3rd class physical and a bi-annual (including several hours of dual
for this very rusty pilot and several more hours of practice). I also would
like to get some dual time in a MK III.
I need to find an airport and hanger in my area.
I need to build or buy a trailer (but that is another whole subject).
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (98%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Tool & Equip |
Curtiss,
I'd agree with Cliff that a drill press isn't all that necessary. I
only used mine a few times and the hand drill would have been fine
too. For my tool purchashing, I bought a compressor and paint gun,
and a hand rivet tool ...that's about it. Kind of a wierd thing,
I used my radial arm saw quite a bit to cut out the AL gussets.
This requires care obviously, as you can imagine the saw grabbing
the AL and then perhaps your fingers. But if you use a fine
tooth ChroMoly blade, hold the stock firmly, and go kind of slow,
you'll get easy and beautifully straight-edged gussets. A bench vice
is pretty handy and of course a riveter and decent file are bread
and butter items. I also made use of some pieces of hard wood dowel
( ~3/4" diam) and also hardwood 1x2 stock. I used these as forms to
press or hammer curves into the few gusset pieces that have curves.
Also, one comment on workbenches. Mine is/was 4x8 foot, but one of the
nice things about it is that the frame underneath is recessed to only
~3 feet wide -- making room for your feet. This allows you to stand
right up to the table surface without constantly bending over. A wider
workbench isn't worth much cuz you can't reach the other side anyway.
Lastly, for shrinking the fabric you'll need an iron and the little
bi-metal calibrating thermometer. I think almost any iron would do,
but keep an eye out for a rummage sale extra, cuz whatever you use will
for evermore have polytac goo stuck to it. I also bought a hobby size
(for model airplane) iron which was v. useful for heating small areas.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jerryb(at)jmd.ods.com |
| Subject: | Re: Tool & Equip |
A table made out of a sheet of plywood works nice. Build a 2x4 frame
and a couple of cross members to keep it flat. As tools go, the Kolb
doesn't require a lot of tools, but like any project some tools make
the job easier. A bench combo belt/disk sander is very handy and used
a lot. (Delta makes one, Sears also sells one but my friend killed
his in short order, had to take it back and replaced it with the Delta
which he has been happy with since.) Regarding the pop rivet tool,
you will want a hand version, but in the end I really think you'll
want an air powered puller ($50-$60). Most peoples hands can't take
the hand puller for long. Again my friend thought he could, finally
went out bit the bullet and bought a air compressor and a air powered
puller. Their available from Harbor Freight or Northern Hydraulic
Northern cost just a little most but they ship faster and are a good
company.
You will need a hand drill, a variable speed is best to control
starting the holes and not running the bit across the metal which can
lead to cracks. A good prick punch, Stanley has a yellow handled one
don't waste you money on the clones, they don't work that well. Get
the one made by General ($12-16). He cuts tubing on a table saw with
a metal blade. Seems to work. You may also want a pin punch they
diameter of the mandrel of the rivets to drill out the mandrel if
necessary.
Black and Decker makes a drill bit called a bullet tip. They work
good for starting holes. For rivets, always drill your holes under
size (.125 or 1/8"), then enlarge them with the correct size (#30
drill) when your sure the holes are in the right place.
Another tip is do not mark on aluminum with pencil, use fine point
felt tip markers. Pencil lines have been known to develop cracks.
While some people will say they done it, when you get to the aircraft
industry they don't for that reason. Two good ones are Pilot and a
German produced one. The German pens have reddish pink body.
Sharpies don't seem to work well for long marking on aluminum for some
reason.
Here's another. You have to form many flat ends on aluminum tubing,
get 2 short pieces of aluminum angle stock (shim it to the correct
thickness if necessary) put it in the jaws of a vice. You then
squeeze the tubing until you bottom out on the thickness established
by the angle stock you have placed in the vice jaws. Work great, same
thickness every time.
Last thing you need is a deburring tool to deburr the holes you drill.
You can use a larger size drill, or there are tools available
strictly for that purpose. While working on my RV-6, I made a device
which holds a standards aircraft deburring bit. It has hex on one end
and a 1/4-28 thread on the other to accept a bit. You put it into a
battery powered screwdriver like the B&D super twist. The slower 120
RPM unit works the best since the ideal is to deburr not remove so
much metal you counter sink. It saves a lot of time. I loaned mine
to my friend, now I can't get it back he likes it so much.
You probably will want a good pair of sheet metal (tin) snips. They
make a aluminum model (light weight) which come in either 12 or 14".
I suggest you get the 14 inch long model as it is easier on your
hands, takes less effort. They work well and make a nice smooth cut.
Many aircraft metal tools are available from a company called Avery
Enterprises located in the Dallas/Fortworth Texas area. They're a
great outfit to deal with and supply tools to many of the RV aircraft
builders. If you need anything further info, send a email to
jerryb(at)ods.com Good luck and have fun.
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Kolb-List: Tool & Equip
Date: 5/25/96 5:53 PM
Hi all,
I=B9m almost ready to order a FireStar II and will be constructing it =
in a standard two car (19=B9W x 23=B9L) garage. I would like to get =
some suggestions from the other builders of FireStar=B9s, regarding the =
the minimum size workbench needed (width & length), and the tools & =
equipment needed that would help me save time, and do a more accurate =
and cleaner job. I know that a small Drill Press would come in handy, =
but how small? I seen a small Black&Decker DPress at Wal-Mart ($175), =
that had what looked like to be a 10=B2 x 1O=B2 work surface. Would =
this be too small? Reading through past postings, others have mentioned =
things like hot glue guns, miter boxes, etc...
Any and all suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
Curtis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JLBAKER40(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Tool & Equip |
>I used my radial arm saw quite a bit to cut out the AL gussets.
>This requires care obviously, as you can imagine the saw grabbing
>the AL and then perhaps your fingers. But if you use a fine
>tooth ChroMoly blade, hold the stock firmly, and go kind of slow,
>you'll get easy and beautifully straight-edged gussets.
Ah...just so. Except I used the radial arm saw and a metal abrasive cut-off
wheel for the tubes. The trick is to have the tube resting against the back
fence and position the wheel centered or just slightly forward over the tube
and use the elevation feature to lower the wheel through the tube. Square cut
and a light spin on the grinder for the outside and a quick turn of the
deburring tool to get the inside edge of the tube.
As for work tables....try getting a solid-core door from a
building/supply...various widths and lengths. Then get a folding legs set and
attach to the bottom. Seems to me I only spent $25 on the table and you can
fold up the legs and store it.
Jim Baker
Oklahoma City
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Tool & Equip |
On Tue, 28 May 1996 JLBAKER40(at)aol.com wrote:
> >you'll get easy and beautifully straight-edged gussets.
>
> Ah...just so. Except I used the radial arm saw and a metal abrasive cut-off
> wheel for the tubes. The trick is to have the tube resting against the back
> fence and position the wheel centered or just slightly forward over the tube
> and use the elevation feature to lower the wheel through the tube. Square cut
> and a light spin on the grinder for the outside and a quick turn of the
> deburring tool to get the inside edge of the tube.
>
> As for work tables....try getting a solid-core door from a
> building/supply...various widths and lengths. Then get a folding legs set and
> attach to the bottom. Seems to me I only spent $25 on the table and you can
> fold up the legs and store it.
>
Ah ...just so again. Folding it up when you're finished is nice cuz you'll
need the room to store your airplane! I ended up cutting away 1 foot from
the width of mine when I got to this point. :)
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jerryb(at)jmd.ods.com |
| Subject: | Re[2]: Tool & Equip |
In place of buying legs for the table referenced previously, invest in
saw horses. After you complete the tail parts, you reuse for doing
the wings. I bought a couple sets of the metal Hirsh saw horses.
Note they come in 24 or 30 inch high. The 30 works best for table
applications.
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Tool & Equip
Date: 5/28/96 9:49 PM
>I used my radial arm saw quite a bit to cut out the AL gussets.
>This requires care obviously, as you can imagine the saw grabbing
>the AL and then perhaps your fingers. But if you use a fine
>tooth ChroMoly blade, hold the stock firmly, and go kind of slow,
>you'll get easy and beautifully straight-edged gussets.
Ah...just so. Except I used the radial arm saw and a metal abrasive cut-off
wheel for the tubes. The trick is to have the tube resting against the back
fence and position the wheel centered or just slightly forward over the tube
and use the elevation feature to lower the wheel through the tube. Square cut
and a light spin on the grinder for the outside and a quick turn of the
deburring tool to get the inside edge of the tube.
As for work tables....try getting a solid-core door from a
building/supply...various widths and lengths. Then get a folding legs set and
attach to the bottom. Seems to me I only spent $25 on the table and you can
fold up the legs and store it.
Jim Baker
Oklahoma City
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Curtis West <ccwest(at)intermind.net> |
Kolb List,
Much thanks to all who responed to my post. It has saved me both time
and money. I was going to build another workbench (4x14) for the wing
assembly, in addition to my already (3x8) bench. But it sounds like a
sturdy and level 4x8 surface will do fine. I purchased some of the
tools/equipment that were reccomended, but have be unable to locate a
snap puch yet.
Thanks Again..
Curtis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bkearbey" <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
| Subject: | Benjamin: Pictures? |
Hello Benjaman,
About 2 weeks ago you said that you said you would send us
pictures of the dual throttle conversion that your son made. We are
getting down to that point and was wondering if you sent the pictures
or still are intending to. I would appreciate it very much.
Thanks again,
Brandon Kearbey
| - - - -
Kolb []-| - - - -
Mark III .====== | - - - ___ "MarkIII"
(sort of). /| / | Brandon Kearbey
. / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us
. \_______/ |---------/-----|
(_____________//--------------\^
/ o
( )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "jt(at)falcon.is" <jt(at)falcon.is> |
| Subject: | Re: Re[2]: Tool & Equip |
Please stop sending me mail on this KOLB thing, I don't know why I'm
getting this stuff and I am certainly not interested, thanks.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | FSKolbJT(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | skip(at)netline.net - fabric repair |
Skip :
Suggestion : use an artist's pallette knife ( available in most art supply
stores ) to remove all paint and tape in a 2 inch wide band directly on top
of the rib where your fabric now ends. There should be approximately 1 inch
of clean fabric on each side of the rib. Remove the rivits which hold the
fabric in place by drilling them out with a 1/8 " diameter high speed drill
bit. Attach new, clean fabric on top of the old fabric with polytack. ( I
would suggest pinking the edges of old and new material for better adhesion )
You should now have a 2 " glued overlap of fabric at the rib. Stretch out
the new fabric and attach to the wing structure in accordance with Stits
instruction manual and Kolb's. When the new material is in place and the
polytack is completely dry, shrink the new fabric in the normal way. This
will tighten old and new material alike. Reinstall rivits and 2" reinforcing
tape over rib and complete the repair as if it were new construction.
7175972212
John
( wildfire )
PS:
GOOD LUCK!
Holler if you need any help:)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | username(at)Aldus.NorthNet.org |
I have a physical problem whick involves getting in and out of
confined spaces.ie, struts, guy wires and stuff low to the ground. I
went to an Ultralite meet held at Happy Valley airstrip last June
18th. Most of the crafts seem impossible to me. Looked at a Buccaneer
but the space to drag legs in seemed difficult. There were several
Kolbs there but wasn't able to contact owners.Are there any Kolbs in
or near northern New York that I could try to sit in?
As I am having difficulty using Netscape Mail, could anyone reply via
....tryon(at)aol.com....
Thanks,
Paul Tryon
PO Box 11
Keene Valley, NY 12943
(518) 576-9876
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mark(at)sun.sws.uiuc.edu (Mark Anliker) |
| Subject: | demo ride in FS-II wanted |
I'm a prospective buyer for a Kolb FS-II or Slingshot kit and am looking to
get a ride in one before purchasing. I would like to locate someone near
east-central Illinois (I'm in Champaign-Urbana) who would be willing and
able make this a reality. Thanks in advance. Please reply to:
mark(at)sun.sws.uiuc.edu or phone (217) 684-2357.
________________________________________________________________________________
Have not received a lot of mail or in fact any on Kolb products. These
aircraft are to me the most interesting and look forward to any and all Kolb
info from builder, prospective builders and flyers. Thanks Jack, prospective
Mark III buyer/flyer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | rls862(at)aol.com Kolb MarkIII |
Hello,
My name is Randy and I am interested in building a Mark III and would
like to visit a local builder. I am located in the Chicago area. I would
appreciate any help. Also does anyone have plans for a dual stick version.
Thanks,
Randy
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Starting construction |
Since there is not much mail going back and forth I guess Ill add a little
progress report on my FS II.
I finally got most of Kit #1 (I had a little bit of trouble with the
shipping), but Barbara, Dennis and Mike have been wonderful, and very patient
I should say, at helping me solve this problem.
I am currently building an 8 x 4 table which I plan to level and anchor to
my garage floor so that the parts are hopefully built straight. Let me tell
you, if you add all the hours you spend tinkering with things that are needed
to build an airplane and add it to the time actually spent building, WOW. In
any case, it is an enjoyable experience. I hope to have the table ready today
and start construction of the ribs tomorrow.
A question: I noticed that my ribs stampings (the ones that slide over the
main spar) are bowed (if a side of the stamping is held flush over a flat
surface, the opposite end bows up from the flat surface about 3/4). Dennis
told me that this is still OK but I would like to get some feedback from you
guys as to how to deal with this when time comes to rivet them to the rib.
Will this cause bowing of the rib?; Should I try to get them somewhat
straight before building the rib?. I did notice that once they slide on the
spar tube they do get better but what about during rib construction?.
Also, Cmon, write some more out there. I check the mail list every day
hoping to read something and its been pretty quiet lately. I also noticed
that John Brooks of NC added a picture of his FS in the June issue of the EAA
Sport Aviation magazine. Way to go John.
Christian
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Building question & Mail for Christian :-) |
Hello again,
Since I don't have a manual yet, I've got another one of those nagging
questions to ask.
I've been told that it's "better" to align the wings to the fuselage
cage prior to covering the wings. Is this a requirement, or does it
just make it easier/safer to do the alignment. Has anyone covered
the wings prior to receiving the fuselage kit? I'm trying to resolve
the amount of time I can stay busy with kits 1 & 2 prior to needing kit
3. Note that I'm assuming the Slingshot construction will be similar to
the FireStar.
Thanks,
Rusty (Slingshot sn- SS-003)
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Slingshot Update |
Greetings,
Well, I got a letter from Dennis today. The current outlook for
availability of the first 2 kits is about mid July. It's about a month
longer than I expected but not unreasonable. I'm naturally a little
disappointed, but not upset about it. From what he said, it sounds like
they're pleased with the flight testing of the proto-type. I sure wish
I could afford more power than a 503. Perhaps I'll use the extra month
to continue investigating (unauthorized) alternatives.
Rusty
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bkearbey" <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
Hello Benjamin,
I wrote a letter to you earlier about the pictures of the dual
throttle configuration. I hate to bother you again about it but I
would like to know if you are still planning to send the pictures.
If anyone knows of the company that designs the dual throttle
configuration for the Mark III. I saw an add for it in UL flying
magazine but I cannot seem to find it know. It was specific for the
Mark III.
Also, anyone that has a Mark III with the normal configuration, is
the configuration hard or unconfortable to use?
Thanks again,
Brandon Kearbey
| - - - -
Kolb []-| - - - -
Mark III .====== | - - - ___ "MarkIII"
(sort of). /| / | Brandon Kearbey
. / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us
. \_______/ |---------/-----|
(_____________//--------------\^
/ o
( )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: bowed flanges & wing alignment |
ABOUT BOWED RIB-TO-SPAR FLANGES:
Christian, I don't remember much of any bowing to my flanges.
I would think that when you make each rib, that pressing and
riveting the flange to the rib tubes -- which are on a flat jig --
will result in taking out the bow. Your ribs may spring slightly
when you pull them from the jig, but you will know that they were
drilled and riveted flat. Later, when you slide them onto the spar,
you will nudge each rib so that it is aligned fore and aft, and is
90 degrees to the spar as checked with a T-square. See my photo:
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom/build/7wingfr.html
for a couple more tips on fastening ribs to spar.
WING ALIGNMENT:
Rusty, I meant to get back to you again in our little exchange about
covering the wings before alignment to the cage. You mentioned someone
else's concern about needing to drill and bolt the rear wing attachment
to the drag strut column, which needs to be done before covering.
I drilled and bolted mine precisely per plans, without checking to
verify that my wings would come into alignment. (The FS KXP plans made
no mention about allowing for wing alignment with this hole placement;
rather, the plans simply dimension how far out the rear attach fitting
is to be from the root rib surface. )
So, if you carefully put the fitting in the right place, you could cover
the wing before alignment. In fact, during wing alignment, you have
enough variables (incidence to each other, incidence to the fuselage,
sweep-back (0), dihedral, consideration of averaging out any slight
(1/4") droops or rises in leading and trailing edges of both wings),
that also contending with free moving rear attach fittings seems like
another complication. (See
on alignment.) As a precaution, it would be smart to verify that each
root rib is not warped, as everything coming into alignment depends on
a flat root rib. (The chances of a warped root rib are nearly nill.)
Lastly, in my typically verbose beating of any subject, I would add that
covering the wing before alignment will primarily just make the wing a
little harder to move around since all of the handles (spars, etc) are
covered up. Moral of the story: if the rear fitting is sticking out
the right amount, covering before alignment will be fine.
Happy building and flying everybody.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Curtis West <ccwest(at)intermind.net> |
Hello All,
Ordered the FireStar II (w/o 2nd seat) a couple days ago. Went for the
finished ribs, breaks, large wheels & tires, heavy duty landing gear
and, powder coating of the cage & small parts. Countng the days, almost
a week already.
Anyone know what kind of (basic) instrument panel comes with the kit if
any?
Curtis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
Way to go Curtis! It's my understanding that no instruments are
included normally. They offer a basic package for $450 and a more
complete package for $750. The info you got (I assume) from Kolb should
have all that in it. I can send you a copy of the instrument info if
you get in a bind.
Counting the weeks :-(
Rusty
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Instrument Panel |
| From: | Curtis West <ccwest(at)intermind.net> |
Yes, I know about the 'Custom Instrumetn Panel' package. What I meant
in that last post was; is their some sort of basic panel provided in
the kit, one that you would have to cut the holes in and install your
own instruments? It you take the Custom Panel package and subtract the
std. instrument package at $450, you wind up paying $300 for the panel
alone.
Curtis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Instrument Panel |
Curtis,
Though I'm not an expert on the subject, I believe that you cut your
instrument holes in the rear surface of the fiberglass nose cone (pod
??). Mike Holland sent a couple of good building pictures that show the
mounting of his instruments. They're on my web page as #42 and #43.
Enjoy,
Rusty
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Instrument Panel |
| From: | Curtis West <ccwest(at)intermind.net> |
Bob wrote;
>Curtis, A little unclear of what your asking,but we just installed our
> instrument panel tonight. We purchased our gauges from skysports and
>installed them in a left over piece of aluminum. We cut the aluminum to the
>same shape as the fiberglass panel. Then we cut out the fiberglass to
>install the panel with all the gauges.
Ok, in the FireStar info package, in the options section, they list a
"Instrument Panel, instruments and wiring harness assembly" for $750,
above that is listed a "Standard package: ASI, Altimeter, Tach/EGT,
Hour Meter" for $450. So, does the FS come standard with some sort of
panel in which to put your own instruments, or does one have to pay
$750 for a panel with instruments, or $300 for a panel with out
instruments (750 - 450).
>We cut the aluminum to the same shape as the fiberglass panel. Then we cut
out
>the fiberglass to install the panel with all the gauges.
Did this 'Fiberglass Panel' come stand with Kit#2, or did you have to
pay extra?
>We got this tip from another kolb
>owner. The reason for this is the gauges are hard to get to the back of.
This
>way you take out how ever many screws you mounted the panel with and along
>come all the gauges. Hope this might help. Bob
Good tip! If it does cost $300 for an empty panel, I think I could
fashion one out plexiglass stock and use this tip.
Curtis
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Instrument Panel |
| From: | Curtis West <ccwest(at)intermind.net> |
Rusty wrote;
>Though I'm not an expert on the subject, I believe that you cut your
>instrument holes in the rear surface of the fiberglass nose cone (pod
>??). Mike Holland sent a couple of good building pictures that show the
>mounting of his instruments. They're on my web page as #42 and #43.
Yes, this is the panel I was referring to. Does on have to pay extra
for this panel, or does it come with Kit#2?
Mike, could you set me straight on this?
Curtis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Instruments, compass |
When I bought my firestar kxp kit 4 years ago, the standard kit
came w/ no instruments. I bought a dual CHT, an EGT/Tach, and an ASI
all for just under $300 from LEAF. Cutting the holes in the fiberglass
nose pod was easy, and access to the rear of the instruments is not
all too bad. I figure I'll cut off the panel face and replace with a
removable one if I ever decide to reconfigure my instrument placement.
I guess Kolb may be offering instrument packages as options, and
I'm sure Barbara at Kolb could easily provide accurate information
as to waht you get.
QUESTION: Any suggestions for a compass? My first compass was an
auto store cheapy. I mounted it to the panel, but that turned out
to be too close to the steel frame, so the compass was worthless
in that position. I'm thinking that other compasses may be of good enf
quality that they can be mounted on the panel without totally messing
the deviation up beyond reliable adjustment. (I now use a handheld
backpacking compass, and standard IFR (I Follow Roads).)
Someday I look forward to climbing to 10,000 feet and ceremoniously
throwing my old junk compass overboard. Or, maybe dropping it on
a strafing run at an oncoming freight train. :)
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Gerken GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM" <GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM> |
| Subject: | Radiator for the 582 on MK3, and winter cabin heat. |
Where are you guys mounting your radiators? Is anyone trying a small
automotive (honda or ?) type, mounting it behind the cabin below the wing?
I think I read somewhere that this was an option. I am not only trying to
avoid the six hundred dollar bill for the rotax twin radiator, but I am
thinking that with the radiator below the wing and behind the cabin it may
be posible to duct in some heat. Or maybe I would tap into the system to
feed a second small radiator mounted in the nose. Any thoughts, experiences?
I know I want it light and simple, but it seems like winter is the longer
part of the year around here (Minnesota).
I have also seen ads for the muffler-duct heat system (like volks bugs had).
Anyone using such a thing?
Progress update: After 200 hours all the flight surfaces are complete
minus fabric covering. I have used the "bent tube at trailing edge" of
all control surfaces using the 5/16" tubing, as shown on page 42 of my
Builder's Manual. This definitely added to the total time.
I am now waiting for the fuselage cage kit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Curtis West <ccwest(at)intermind.net> |
Hello All,
Mike Holland & James Baker answered my question about the inst. panel.
It is part of the nose cone on the FireStar models. Note: (for any new
readers) instruments not included, But buy the looks of Mike Holland's
build photo's (#42 & 43) their's plenty of space for a decent set of
instruments.
For those who haven't seen Mike's Holland's or Ben Ransom's build
photo's, check out Russell Duffy's home page;
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/ and feast your eyes on some great
looking FireStars.
Curtis
(day 6)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Radiator for the 582 on MK3, and winter cabin heat. |
Jim and all...
Down here in Texas I am not interested in more heat... That's a joke guys.
I bought the Rotax twin radiator pack because I know very little about
engines and cooling plumbing and wanted a tried, safe, effective system. I
did find out that the brackets for the Rotax radiator and oil tank fit under
the head stud nuts and coolant water will come up those shafts and leak out
around the head studs if the mating metal surfaces are not just so so with
each other. That is what happened in my case. Most people I talked to
about this said not to worry that it would seal itself shortly after the
first run in becuase of the sealing properties of the antifreeze.
I didn't want it to leak at all and asked the Rotax person at LEAF at
Sun'nFun this spring what would be the solution. He said to first drain
down the radiator to below the head level, then apply some high temp RTV
around the base of the stud (after making sure the area is completely dry of
water by cleaning with Acetone) then put the bracket in place (maybe a very
little more RTV on top of the bracket in the center around the stud) then
torquing down according to Rotax before the RTV sets up. I have not done
this yet, but am about to in the next few days.
I also had to lengthen the U hose connecting the lower ports of the two
radiators using 90 degree elbows (2) and short stubs (2) of radiator hose.
I have seen other installations where that did not seem to be a problem. I
thought in my case that the hose was in a slight bind.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (98%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Edge distance and cutting aluminum |
Dear friends,
I have been scrtching my head about two things:
1) I made my first rib and have noticed that the edge distance between the
rivets and the edge of the gussets has to be low (I'm using about 3/16 in.
but that forces me to slant the drill bit some to properly catch the 5/16
tubing). What edge distance are you guys using on the rib gussets?.
2) I'm cutting the gussets using large straight metal snips but when the
small 1.5 x 1 in gusstes are cut, the curling of the metal is quite
noticeable. Any ideas on cutting aluminum (short of a band saw because I
don't have one)?. Anyone close to the Miami, Fl area with a bench shear that
I could use to cut the gussets?.
Thanks,
Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kw012393(at)one.net |
WANTED: ENCLOSED TRAILER SUITABLE FOR TRANSPORTING AND STORING A KOLB
FIRESTAR (SINGLE PLACE ULTRALIGHT).
NEEDED IMMEDIATELY.
PLEASE REPLY TO PHIL AT:
kw012393(at)one.net
Note that the "0" in the email address is a zero and NOT the letter "o".
Please state condition/age/price/additional info about trailer.
Thank you!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Factory powder coating |
Greetings,
I'm trying to decide whether I want to order the factory powder coating
on my upcoming Slingshot fuselage cage. Has anyone actually received
one of the factory jobs? I'm concerned that somewhere in the shipping
and construction process, it will get scratched up enough that I'll have
to do some touch-up work on it anyway. Does this seem like a reasonable
concern?
Rusty
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Curtis West <ccwest(at)intermind.net> |
Rusty wrote;
>I'm trying to decide whether I want to order the factory powder coating
>on my upcoming Slingshot fuselage cage. Has anyone actually received
>one of the factory jobs? I'm concerned that somewhere in the shipping
>and construction process, it will get scratched up enough that I'll have
>to do some touch-up work on it anyway. Does this seem like a reasonable
>concern?
"Reasonable concern?" Yes, I'm glad you brought this up. Haven't
ordered kit#3 yet, but will be getting it coated when I do. I'll call
Barbra this week and ask about it. Can the coating material be touched
up easily?
Curtis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Factory powder coating |
> I'm trying to decide whether I want to order the factory powder coating
> on my upcoming Slingshot fuselage cage. Has anyone actually received
> one of the factory jobs? I'm concerned that somewhere in the shipping
> and construction process, it will get scratched up enough that I'll have
> to do some touch-up work on it anyway. Does this seem like a reasonable
> concern?
Other than scratching, you might also consider whether you want to weld
on any other little fittings. This is usually too hard to predict, and
I think it might be easy to add something that you later regret. But, if
you have something pretty solid in mind as to what you want, waiting on
powder coating till after welding on your own fittings would be better.
Rusty, you had talked about putting the throttle somewhere else. You
could do this and grind off the standard left side fitting. As an aside
to the powder coating issue, I would advise against mounting the throttle
on the stick.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Edge distance and cutting aluminum |
On Sun, 16 Jun 1996 CMEng1(at)aol.com wrote:
> I have been scrtching my head about two things:
>
> 1) I made my first rib and have noticed that the edge distance between the
> rivets and the edge of the gussets has to be low (I'm using about 3/16 in.
> but that forces me to slant the drill bit some to properly catch the 5/16
> tubing). What edge distance are you guys using on the rib gussets?.
Sorry, i don't recall exact distance. But I can see from a photo, that with
the rivet in, the top of the rivet head is about 1/32" from the edge of
the gusset. I didn't put any angle on my holes to get this.
> 2) I'm cutting the gussets using large straight metal snips but when the
> small 1.5 x 1 in gusstes are cut, the curling of the metal is quite
> noticeable. Any ideas on cutting aluminum (short of a band saw because I
> don't have one)?. Anyone close to the Miami, Fl area with a bench shear that
> I could use to cut the gussets?.
I used a radial arm saw with a standard fine tooth blade to cut all my gussets
and this worked well.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Weber (DVNS)" <bweber(at)micom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Factory powder coating |
On Sun, 16 Jun 1996, Russell Duffy wrote:
> Greetings,
>
> I'm trying to decide whether I want to order the factory powder coating
> on my upcoming Slingshot fuselage cage. Has anyone actually received
> one of the factory jobs? I'm concerned that somewhere in the shipping
> and construction process, it will get scratched up enough that I'll have
> to do some touch-up work on it anyway. Does this seem like a reasonable
> concern?
Powder coating is pretty tough and any touch-ups should be rather easy.
However, if there is a local powder coating facility, I would most likely
want to have it done there. My cost to do it that way was about $100 less
than Kolb charges. Also, you have to choose your color before shipping. I
don't know what colors Kolb offers, since they did not have this service
when I purchased my kit. But the local powder coating facility has
thousands of colors available and from what I saw, had perfect matches
for all the colors available from Stits.
_-_ _,, ,,
-/ ) ; ||
||_< \\/\/\ _-_ ||/|, _-_ ,._-_ bweber(at)micom.com
|| \\ || | | || \\ || || || \\ ||
;/--|| || | | ||/ || |' ||/ || Keep the shiny
_--_-' \\/\\/ \\,/ \\/ \\,/ \\, side up
(
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Ransom <mlransom(at)ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Test Flight, Firestar: Wow! |
Ben let myself and our father test fly his Firestar this weekend. What a
plane!
With the 447, my climb rate at 50 mph was probably better than my
Ultrastar's maximum, and nearly at my Ultrastar's top speed to boot. The
most noticable difference, however, was the comfort level. (Maybe a
windscreen isn't that bad an idea after all!) In my Ultrastar, anything
over 45 seems really windy and I'm generally content to buzz around at that
speed (vmax with my slightly anemic engine is about 58 mph).
The noise level was a 100% improvement over my Ultrastar. I think that's
probably mostly the result of a quieter muffler on the Rotax, but also due
to the engine position up and behind the wing. Ben mentioned something
about the enclosure behind the head helping with propeller noise too. In my
Ultrastar, I'd say that 75% of the noise comes from the engine; in the FS,
I'd say that there's less than half the noise overall, and that it's about
75% from the prop. By comparison, it seems like you're only using half the
RPM, and the propellor sound is emmensely more satisfying than a screaming
engine. Visibility in my Ultrastar is still better though, especially to
the rear.
Being concerned and cautious about the high thrust line, I found myself
climbing out at an angle resulting in about 45-50 mph. I guess it just
didn't seem right that anyone should be allowed to climb out any steeper
than that! I found the high thrust line to be no problem whatsoever, and
that's coming from a plane (the Ultrastar) with a middle to low thrust line.
The only place that it was particularly noticable was in idle-power descent,
where I had to keep adjusting the stick forward from the position my
instincts were telling me. Slips were about 3 times more effective--which
probably means that I'm probably just flying sideways in the Ultrastar.
My father, Roger, flew the plane beautifully, except for one big plop from
about 4 feet up on his second landing or so, which did a good job of proving
the landing gear to me (Roger's over 200 pounds). (I think Ben got the
heavy duty gear--correct me if I'm wrong--and big soft tires). That landing
might have been about as hard as the time I broke my Ultrastar's gear. I
guess my dad had the classic problem that transitioning GA pilots have:
flaring too high and then losing all your speed before getting down close to
the ground.
Ben had Roger take a refresher lesson in a Quicksilver on the way up here.
Roger had completed ultralight lessons a couple of years ago and has been
renting spam cans since. Another problem he had was getting down.
Quicksilvers have only about a 6:1 glide ratio (yuk!), and he wasn't used to
the much cleaner Kolb (hooray!) Roger's landings when we went back in the
afternoon were consistently near-perfect. He said the taildragger
configuation wasn't a problem at all, even though the last taildragger he
flew much was in the early 50's (his PT-19).
Mike Ransom | Davis, Calif., USA
|
---================================================---
/O\
-====o====-
/-----\
mlransom(at)ucdavis.edu || || Kolb UltraStar
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Factory powder coating |
Ben Ransom wrote:
> Other than scratching, you might also consider whether you want to weld
> on any other little fittings. This is usually too hard to predict, and
> I think it might be easy to add something that you later regret. But, if
> you have something pretty solid in mind as to what you want, waiting on
> powder coating till after welding on your own fittings would be better.
>
> Rusty, you had talked about putting the throttle somewhere else. You
> could do this and grind off the standard left side fitting. As an aside
> to the powder coating issue, I would advise against mounting the throttle
> on the stick.
Ben,
Yes the throttle issue is the other problem for me. I'm currently planning
to ask Kolb to include the throttle fittings that they would normally weld
in place. Maybe I can weld them in a better (for me) location. I still
have thoughts about putting the throttle on the stick in one way or
another,
but I'd prefer a fixed right hand location. One thing's for sure, I can't
really decide where I want it until I plant my behind in the seat during
construction. I may skip the powder coating and just prime and paint the
thing. Sure it'll be REALLY unpleasant, but it's cheaper and I know it'll
match the rest of the plane. More to think about.
Rusty (8 weeks down, 4 to go)
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | happy father's day |
I had posted this to Rusty after some other net-chat, and thought
the rest of you Kolb-ites might enjoy ...
I hadn't intended it as a father's day thing, but my parents were coming
to town this weekend and I got my dad up in my plane. Oh what a feeling!
My dad has maybe about 1200 hrs, most of it 40 years ago in B-25s.
He's now current in the low-end Cessnas and flies maybe 2 hours a month.
He also took about 4 hours in USUA training 2 years ago. So anyway,
I figure he's maybe a little rusty in type. I made him stop by on the way
up from So. Cal and get a couple times around the pattern with my old BFI.
Hearing about how that went, I'm glad I did require the familiarization.
He related that the instructor said after the 4th landing ..."well, you
had that one pretty much the whole way in." (gulp)
Getting into my Firestar, my dad did a little bit of taxiing, one higher
speed taxi down the runway, then said he'd go for it. I had given him
all the particulars and suggested his first pass be an approach and 5-10'
agl pass. He couldn't get the darn thing down and passed over at 100'.
He told me later he couldn't see the altimeter either, and that's why he
climbed to what looked like a 1200'agl pattern. He was also "used to"
the Quicksilver w/ 2 aboard, which sinks badly compared to our fine Kolbs.
So, he came back around with a real 5 ft pass, although bobbling a little
w/ over-control. Then he came around again and flared out with 20' of
altitude left in spite of my major emphasis on this -- i didn't crowd
his brain w/ a lot of fluff, honest. I bit my lip and the plane hung
on till about 5-6' and dropped in. The landing gear sucked up the drop
and he went around and did it again. ...ouch, but successful in the
traditional sense (he walked away).
We went home for some mid-day family obligations and returned later to
see if maybe he had thought thru the correct method enf to pull it off
a little nicer. Much to my relief, he had. He went around 4 or 5 times
and made perfect landings each time. Yahoo!
In all, with everything my dad has helped me with and inspired in me, it
was one of the most gratifying moments I've ever experienced.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Rivet edge distance |
Thanks for the replies in reference to the rivet edge distance. Being an A&P
mechanic and structural engineer with too much work in FAA blessed machines
it is a little hard for me to get used to using less than 2*Diameter for edge
distance but it is true that this ribs look definitely overkill. Still, 1/8"
edge distance sounds like too little so I'll try a compromise between 3/16
and 1/8. Any comments?.
In reference to the powder coating, this is my experience:
I am helping a friend build a Kitfox Series V and he got all his fuselage and
parts powder coated. The finish is nice and it definitely saves a lot of work
even if you have to retouch some small areas. The only problem is that powder
coating tends to be thick (very) and though and if you have parts that slide
into others (such as control horns) and they are powder coated it is going to
be a lot of work remove the coating. My recommendation is to get powder
coating in the large components (fuselage cage, tail boom, etc.) but not on
the small parts, unless Kolb masks the areas were this parts slide into
others. The small parts I would just epoxy prime.
Christian.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Curtis West <ccwest(at)intermind.net> |
Received my FireStar's builders manual and drawings today. After
reading page 1 "Introductory Remarks", and reviewing the drawings and
instructions for the Horizontal Stabilizer, I realized that large phone
bills would be a part of life for the next 10 months or so. When the
Introductory Remarks state; "... The plans are not perfect, but they do
provide sufficient information for the average builder to complete his
airplane.", I knew I'd be in for a long build time.
I thought it would be more of a step-by-step process. So much for
wishful thinking. The intructions for building the horizontal
stabilizer only take up 1/3 of a page. One paragraph, which is only one
sentence long states "Don't forget to install the internal sleeve in
each horizontal stabilizer." Does this mean their are more instructions
forth comming? You can't forget something you didn't know before hand!
Curtis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kw012393(at)one.net |
I have purchased a Kolb Firestar from a friend who built it in 1988. It's
in great shape and flies wonderfully. Engine is Rotax 377. I weigh 190
lbs. (and at 6'3" it's a cozy cockpit).
Can you advise me on the following data:
1) speed for best rate of climb
2) speed for best angle of climb
3) speed for best angle of glide (furthest distance covered in glide)
4) heighth, width, length of the Firestar with wings folded (data needed for
possible trailer purchase)
5) what is recommended liftoff speed
6) what is recommended climbout speed
7) what is recommended speed on final approach near threshold
These may sound like dumb questions, but, hey, I gotta start somewhere! And
who better to ask than a Kolb fan!
Thanks for any help you can render.
--Phil in Cincinnati at kw012393(at)one.net note: (that first "0" is a zero)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Gerken GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM" <GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM> |
| Subject: | First Shipment (Curtis) |
Curtis, there are some places in the plans where things could be better
explained. And there are contradictory directions in the plans and the
drawings. And there are outdated things sprinkled in for your convenience.
BUT, you will learn to interpret them and call when necessary, and append here
as often as you wish (but Dennis at Kolb is the real authority). And if you
take the time to read the entire Manual at least twice (without the wife
talking to you, or the kids playing on your lap), you will find most of the
answers to your questions. The drawings are really quite good, and deserve
an hour's study each. Look at them long and hard until you can't find a single
detail that you don't clearly understand, BEFORE starting to build. I find it
is especially important to read ahead and understand it all because the plane's
structure is simple but very dependent on a few basics.
The first part you build may not come out as well as you would like (my
stabilizers could be better), but you will improve your techniques with each
one and your second Kolb will be perfect ;*).
The folks at Kolb are always very helpful to me when I call them for help!
I reached Dennis one day on a Saturday at 6 pm his time, and he cheerfully
answered my questions. Have fun and take your time, your enthusiasm has to
last 500 hours.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | stei0302(at)cs.fredonia.edu (Jon N. Steiger) |
| Subject: | Re: First Shipment (Curtis) |
Just out of curiosity, are we talking about a manual that comes with
the Kolb kit, or a manual which would be used to build a Kolb from plans?
I'm not sure if Kolb even offers plans, so maybe this is a stupid
question. :)
The reason I ask is because I had assumed that the instructions that
come with the kit would be fairly straightforward... Open and shut...
"Do this, then this, and this" and you have a Kolb, not "Do something
like this, and then that, and something similar to this" and you have
something which resembles a Kolb...
I plan to buy and build a FireFly. I have absolutely no experience
with aircraft construction, but I was assured by various folks that
it is fairly easy. Seeing this conversation hasn't exactly been
a confidence booster, if you know what I mean... :)
-Jon-
.------------------------------------------------------------------------------.
| Jon Steiger: DoD# 1038, EAA #518210, USUA# A46209, NMA# 117376, KotWitDoDFAQ
|
| stei0302@cs.fredonia.edu && http://www.cs.fredonia.edu/~stei0302/ |
| '96 Dakota SLT V-8 Club Cab, '91 FZR600R /* Just another mangy hacker */
|
`------------------------------------------------------------------------------'
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jerryb(at)jmd.ods.com |
| Subject: | Re[2]: First Shipment (Curtis) |
What I seen is you need to spend a little time studying the plans. If you
building the FireFLy there is a discrepency betwwen two drawing on the wall
thichness for 7/8" dia. tubing on the Horizontal Stab. When they made the
FireFly drawing they copied the FireStar drawing and missed changing a note on
one drawing. Over all the plans for the FireFly are pretty good. The only
thing I wish I have was a little better detail of the steel parts. I talked to
Dennis about this and I was told they were working on making detail drawing of
the parts for identification purposes. That would help a bunch. Even if you
drill a hole in the wrong place most things can be repaired using the correct
method. There's a lot of help around you that you may not realize. Get
connected with you local EAA chapter. Take avantage of it. Well its 3 am in
the morning and my typing is getting very poor. Time to wrap it up and head for
home.
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: First Shipment (Curtis)
Date: 6/18/96 9:52 PM
Just out of curiosity, are we talking about a manual that comes with
the Kolb kit, or a manual which would be used to build a Kolb from plans?
I'm not sure if Kolb even offers plans, so maybe this is a stupid
question. :)
The reason I ask is because I had assumed that the instructions that
come with the kit would be fairly straightforward... Open and shut...
"Do this, then this, and this" and you have a Kolb, not "Do something
like this, and then that, and something similar to this" and you have
something which resembles a Kolb...
I plan to buy and build a FireFly. I have absolutely no experience
with aircraft construction, but I was assured by various folks that
it is fairly easy. Seeing this conversation hasn't exactly been
a confidence booster, if you know what I mean... :)
-Jon-
.------------------------------------------------------------------------------.
| Jon Steiger: DoD# 1038, EAA #518210, USUA# A46209, NMA# 117376, KotWitDoDFAQ
|
| stei0302@cs.fredonia.edu && http://www.cs.fredonia.edu/~stei0302/ |
| '96 Dakota SLT V-8 Club Cab, '91 FZR600R /* Just another mangy hacker */
|
`------------------------------------------------------------------------------'
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | arnia(at)iav.is (Arni Arnason) |
Hi out there
I am new in this ultralight business as well on this postlist.
I am planing to spend the winter build me one of thoese ultra kit plane
(yes, winter is on its way).
To start with I need some addresses. Can any body give me address (post o=
r
email) address for some of the companies which make those kit panes.
I have two questions:
Is it a god idea to buy a used one?
And by the way, I know some are better then others, which are better than
others?
Is anybody on the list who lives in Spain?? (I'm going to Spain next mon=
th
and it would be nice to have a look.)
You may email to me direct (arnia(at)iav.is) or to the
postlist..............:-)))))))
Thank you all
/ \ =96=96
=C1rni =C1rnason / =96=96\/=96/ =96\ /\
=CDslenskir A=F0alverktalar / =96=96 \/=96 \ / =96\ /=96=96\
235 Keflav=EDkurflugv=F6llur / 0 \=96=96 @ =96\/=96=96=96 \
S=EDmi: 421-4200 / | Date: | Jun 19, 1996 |
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: First Shipment |
On Tue, 18 Jun 1996, Curtis West wrote:
> Received my FireStar's builders manual and drawings today. After
> reading page 1 "Introductory Remarks", and reviewing the drawings and
> instructions for the Horizontal Stabilizer, I realized that large phone
> bills would be a part of life for the next 10 months or so. When the
> Introductory Remarks state; "... The plans are not perfect, but they do
> provide sufficient information for the average builder to complete his
> airplane.", I knew I'd be in for a long build time.
>
> I thought it would be more of a step-by-step process. So much for
> wishful thinking. The intructions for building the horizontal
> stabilizer only take up 1/3 of a page. One paragraph, which is only one
> sentence long states "Don't forget to install the internal sleeve in
> each horizontal stabilizer." Does this mean their are more instructions
> forth comming? You can't forget something you didn't know before hand!
Having a little bit of the "uh-oh" when you really feast your eyes on
the plans book and drawings is probably normal. After all, you've generally
been picturing the finished plane, not the plans. I thought the plans were
clear enough. I had one initial question after my first look thru them
and called Kolb to make sure there were no revisions that I should have
and might not know to ask for. I was assured that all was correct, and
it was.
The Plans book is not a rigidly prescriptive step by step read.
It is more of a guide to the drawings (blueprints), and I thought the
combination of plans book and drawings was very clear. At something like
80 pages, the plans book isn't exactly a meager bunch of vague fluff.
All of the material types, dimensions, holes, bolts, nuts, etc are
clearly identified on the drawings. You just have to take the materials
and make them into what is shown on the drawings, one part at a time.
It ain't that hard! I don't think you really want to see instructions
that say "insert bolt 453 thru hole 2001, etc..." That would produce
many more errors than accurate drawings and a requirment for the builder
to use and/or learn some basic skills in reading the blueprints.
And like others have said, Dennis is easy to get ahold of and always
considerate for any question you might have. All that, combined with
this list server, and you have a lot of resources. I'll finish by saying
that if you think your first or second stabilizer really stinks and you
haven't yet gotten a nicely riveted joint, pack it up and sell it. Nobody
should make a crappy airplane.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: FIRESTAR DATA |
On Tue, 18 Jun 1996 kw012393(at)one.net wrote:
> Can you advise me on the following data:
Note: I'm responding for a standard Firestar KXP.
-Ben
>
> 1) speed for best rate of climb
high 40s
> 2) speed for best angle of climb
low 40s
> 3) speed for best angle of glide (furthest distance covered in glide)
high 40s
> 4) heighth, width, length of the Firestar with wings folded (data needed for
> possible trailer purchase)
approx 5.5 ft to top of engine, 5.5 ft wide at prop (wheel track is about 5'),
length is 21.5 w/ wings folded, I think. (Length is shorter w/ wings up.)
>
> 5) what is recommended liftoff speed
I'd recommend 30 ...or forget it, as it will fly itself off.
> 6) what is recommended climbout speed
I'd recommend 40 - 45. Listen to that engine awfully carefully below 40
on climb out.
> 7) what is recommended speed on final approach near threshold
45 on approach, 40 threshold, hold off till it touches down just under 30.
>
Some of us on this list debated about "best" approach speeds once before.
These are my recommended numbers. Also, I've not done enf accurate
testing on best climb rates,angles, etc to be very sure of these, but
it's a start.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RSCRacing(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | tailwheel, elevators |
Does anyone have a measurement either in degrees or inches of up elevator. We
set ours up per builders manual but was just wondering about how much up
elevator there should be. Also is there any reason you should not drill and
bolt the tail wheel assembly to the lower vertical stabilizer. The manual
says to epoxy it in place. Just seems it would be better to drill and bolt
it. By the way after a year and a half of on and off working on our firestar
2 its finally ready to start taxiing. Thanks for any info. Bob.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | pgorton(at)ozemail.com.au |
| Subject: | KOLB Manual and Drawings |
Fellow KOLBers,
just when you thought we Aussies had gone to sleep for our winter, here we are,
after months of lurking!
Curtis and Jim's comments on the Kolb manuals and drawings deserve a little
extra comment. Jim is spot on - it works!
Folks, when it costs $2 per minute, we don't call ANYBODY without good reason!
A
quick fax or email to Dennis does make one feel more confident, but it adds to
the time deniis has to spend away from his real work - designing more great
planes.
With both wings complete, and all the tail feathers done, I am proud to say we
haven't ever had to call Dennis at Kolb. Sure, we made a couple of bits twice,
and there a few "gotchas' in the plans, but it can be done, and done
convincingly without worrying the factory.
Just read the delightfully brief passage in the book usually along the lines of
"just get on and do it!", and you will find that it is all amazingly logical and
straightforward. Particularly worrying is the "just put the H section in the
wing tube and rivet it" - but it really does go like that, and it works.
Certainly Curtis, you WONT have to spend ages before you see your bird start to
appear before your very eyes.
Some of the other manufacturers' manuals look better, have glossy pictures and
so on, but they actually tell you too much info some times.
Enjoy - the building is something to be anticipated - not dreaded!
Now, if we just get time to complete the covering...
best wishes
Pete Gorton FSII bisi pty ltd
17 Dunstan Parade, Port Melbourne 3207 AUSTRALIA
61-3-9645 2116, fx 61-3-9645 2143, mobile # 0419 601 579
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kw012393(at)one.net |
| Subject: | three questions about folding wings |
I have purchased a used Firestar. The airfield we were using has been sold
so I must move to a different place. The only hangar space requires my
folding the wings.
Questions:
1) Does anyone have a nifty idea for being able to move the Kolb with the
wings folded back? Since the boom tube is inaccesable with the wings in
this position, it is difficult to maneuver the plane to get it into a tight
space. Anyone have plans for some sort of hand dolly, or whatever?
2) Also, (and I just tried this for the first time two days ago), what's the
trick to fastening the folded wings into the brackets at the bottom of the
vertical stabilizer? Even Wilt Chamberlain couldn't reach those brackets.
Is it necessary to stand the plane on its nose and do it from the bottom?
3) Can a Kolb be folded/unfolded with only ONE person doing the work?
Anyone with the detailed knowledge of how to do this, please let me know.
I'll be very appreciative.
The literature says from trailer to fully ready to fly in 8 minutes with no
tools. Granted, I'm a novice and very inexperienced at this, but that
length of time seems a wee bit optimistic.
Help!
Thanks, guys and gals, for any assistance you can render.
-Phil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JLBAKER40(at)worldnet.att.net (James Baker) |
| Subject: | Kolb MK 2 for sale... |
Entered on behalf of the owner:
Kolb Mk 2, freshly rebuilt Rotax 503 DC (crank, pistons, rings), basic
instrument set, intercom, 8 in wheels, full swivel tail wheel, dual brakes,
dual throttle, 10 gal fuel tank. Asking $14500.00. Fred Kimmel 405-288-6107
Oklahoma City.
Cheers.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Manual & Drawings |
| From: | Curtis West <ccwest(at)intermind.net> |
Pete wrote;
>Certainly Curtis, you WONT have to spend ages before you see your bird
>start to appear before your very eyes.
Ages not, but a year at least yes! Being a first time builder, I plan on
taken my time to do a better the average build.
>Some of the other manufacturers' manuals look better, have glossy pictures
>and so on, but they actually tell you too much info some times.
At first look, I was suprised to see how terse the manual was, but
after
hours of reading it, and following along with the drawings, things are
looking better. It was not what I expected through.
>
>Enjoy - the building is something to be anticipated - not dreaded!
Dreaded NOT! I very much look forward to building this plane, and know
that
I will enjoy it.
Later
Curits
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: three questions about folding wings |
>I have purchased a used Firestar. The airfield we were using has been sold
>so I must move to a different place. The only hangar space requires my
>folding the wings.
>
>Questions:
>
>1) Does anyone have a nifty idea for being able to move the Kolb with the
>wings folded back? Since the boom tube is inaccesable with the wings in
>this position, it is difficult to maneuver the plane to get it into a tight
>space. Anyone have plans for some sort of hand dolly, or whatever?
I have seen a nice tail wheel dolly at Sun'n Fun. It was very simple and
cradled the tail wheel and pivoted left and right. I made hand holds in the
ends of the wing tips of each wing and use those holes to lift and move my
tail by the wings when folded.
>2) Also, (and I just tried this for the first time two days ago), what's the
>trick to fastening the folded wings into the brackets at the bottom of the
>vertical stabilizer? Even Wilt Chamberlain couldn't reach those brackets.
>Is it necessary to stand the plane on its nose and do it from the bottom?
Braze pieces of welding rods to the clips so that you can insert them from a
distance.
>3) Can a Kolb be folded/unfolded with only ONE person doing the work?
>Anyone with the detailed knowledge of how to do this, please let me know.
>I'll be very appreciative.
I can do it with difficulty by resting the wing on my shoulder while
positioning the lift strut, but I do not feel very secure (especially if it
is breezy). I have heard of some guys fashioning a tripod or bipod to help
hold the wing up and in position while fitting the lift strut.
>The literature says from trailer to fully ready to fly in 8 minutes with no
>tools. Granted, I'm a novice and very inexperienced at this, but that
>length of time seems a wee bit optimistic.
Haste makes waste sometimes. When I find myself rushing, I tend to make
mistakes... like the day I forgot to disconnect the ailerons and flaps
before trying to fold the wings. It could have been a BIG crunch if I had
not caught myself at the last minute.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (98%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: First Shipment (Curtis) |
>I plan to buy and build a FireFly. I have absolutely no experience
>with aircraft construction, but I was assured by various folks that
>it is fairly easy. Seeing this conversation hasn't exactly been
>a confidence booster, if you know what I mean... :)
>
> -Jon-
Jon and All...
Don't be dismayed. When your "kit" first arrives and you see that pile of
tubes you think to yourself... my God, what did I get myself into. I sat
myself down and...
I first read everything cover to cover and studied all the drawings to
understand the entire overall structure before beginning. After reading and
looking at the drawings a time or two (some areas several times), most
structures and mechanics began to take shape in my mind. I made sure I
understood everything generally before I began.
Once that was accomplished, I made steady and easy progress with
construction part by part and enjoyed all of the building process. I may
have called Kolb twice with a question. I finished in the time estimated
(less than 500 hrs) with no fancy tools.
Would I do it again??? Definitely YES! The Kolb is a super design and
really easy to build.
I am watching a guy building a Firefly who lives near me. He is making good
progress and having a ball. I suggest buying the pre-built ribs. Building
them might get a bit monotonous.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (98%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: three questions about folding wings |
On Sun, 23 Jun 1996 kw012393(at)one.net wrote:
> 2) Also, (and I just tried this for the first time two days ago), what's the
> trick to fastening the folded wings into the brackets at the bottom of the
yep, brazed welding rod or 1/8" piano wire is what i use and see others
have done as well.
> 3) Can a Kolb be folded/unfolded with only ONE person doing the work?
> Anyone with the detailed knowledge of how to do this, please let me know.
> I'll be very appreciative.
Yes. This is how i do it ALL the time and this is how i PREFER it. By
myself, I move fluidly thru the process and it's easier than directing
traffic. I'm not sure what to describe, as it seems like there is no
place where you need help. If it is windy, having someone available to
help keep parts from blowing over is required. However, I usually
assemble and disassemble behind some hangars -- a habit formed because
ULs were at first unwelcome at my airport -- and 20 mph winds on the
runway are not a problem to me. I can't see using a tri or bipod; this
is one more piece of junk to haul around, something else to place in
the right position, and probably entails a method more inviting to a
wing blowing away during assembly.
here's some detail...
1. Pin the lift strut to the cage.
2. I then swing out the wing from folded position and rest it on my
jacket or a rag to protect the outside corner from the pavement.
- i made some 2"x5" AL plates which i hang on the main cage bulkhead
against the cage and the pavement.
3. Pin the spar to the cage. It is helpful to be able to push the plane
backward, holding up the inboard front of the wing until the holes
come into alignment. The outboard end of the wing is still resting
on my jacket and by nudging the plane backward I haven't had to
drag the outboard end of the wing forward for pin alignment.
4. Standing in front of the wing, I lift it up, along with the outside
end of the lift strut. (I often hike up the lift strut w/ my foot,
just cuz it's easier to lift the wing w/ both hands.) For clarity
to those who haven't done this, the wing is swinging up from its 2
attach points at the root -- the U joint and spar_to_cage pin just
inserted (in step 3).
Holding the wing w/ one hand, I place the lift strut into position
and rest some of the wing weight onto it so that it won't move.
Then wiggle things slightly and insert the pin. For me, the position
of the hole and bolt at the end of the lift strut worked out perfectly
as I'll attempt to show in ascii below....
___________
|
liftstrut O (0 0
|
__________ \
the 2 bolts on the wing tang
Basically, I was able to file a little divit in the end of the lift
strut, shown by the "(". The divit rests against the bottom bolt of
the wing tang, at a position very close to pin alignment. Resting a
little wing weight on this divet also keeps the lift strut from falling
while I wiggle it slightly for the pin to align. BTW, this divet was
almost an accident, as the dimensions (from great plans) essentially
made this a coincidence; the divet is *very* slight and an afterthought.
>
> The literature says from trailer to fully ready to fly in 8 minutes with no
> tools. Granted, I'm a novice and very inexperienced at this, but that
> length of time seems a wee bit optimistic.
>
8 minutes is do-able, but not practical. You must, in reality, factor in
untie-ing from the trailer, folding out ramps, talking to others, sipping
your coffee, being careful, packing some goodies, and then do a pre-flight.
NO other vendor offers a plane that keeps the airplane assembly phase to 8
minutes, solo! And to boot, it is one of the strongest, best performing
airplanes you can find. For me, honest engine, it is usually 45 minutes
from airport arrival to engine start, and 30 minutes from engine off to
leaving for home.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o Firestar KXP
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JHanks(at)sisna.com (Jeff Hanks) |
| Subject: | Lots of questions |
I'm 6'6". Will I fit allright in a Mark 3 Kolb? Are there folks who have
Mark 3's for sale somewhere?
The aircraft looks simple and beautiful but why is there a build time of
500 hours? It does not seem like there would be that much required.
Are the kits mostly prefabricated and how much experience do I need to
build one?
By the way I did build an Avid flyer about 3 years ago with my father in law.
I would appreciate receiving mail from Mark 3 owners and builders and your
views and advice on some of my questions.
Thanks in advance,
Jeff Hanks
web: http://www.sisna.com/tlcmanti
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bkearbey" <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
| Subject: | Re: Lots of questions |
Hello Jeff,
My Father and I are currently building a Kolb Mark III together. We
are nearly done and should have it flying in a couple of weeks. It
has been a lot of fun and a great learning experience.
> I'm 6'6". Will I fit allright in a Mark 3 Kolb? Are there folks
> who have Mark 3's for sale somewhere?
I can't answer your first question seeing that I am only 5'7". I
have seen a Kolb for sale in a "Trade a Plane" type magazine. It was
going for about $18.000. That is the only one that I have seen but I
bet there are others out there.
> The aircraft looks simple and beautiful but why is there a build
> time of 500 hours? It does not seem like there would be that much
> required.
Its a build time of 300-500. If you have good basic shop skills and
a knowledge for that type of stuff it will be on the lower end of the
building time. Details like covering and painting take a while but
are not to extremely monotonous.
> Are the kits mostly prefabricated and how much experience do I need
> to build one? By the way I did build an Avid flyer about 3 years ago
> with my father in law.
No, the kits are not. All the welding is done for you (such as the
whole cage.) It comes as pipes pretty much. At first there is no
hint of it being an airplane but it moves rather quickly. You can
order the wing ribs already built. This saves time and I recommend
it.
> I would appreciate receiving mail from Mark 3 owners and builders
> and your views and advice on some of my questions. Thanks in
> advance, Jeff Hanks
I hope I helped out. Now I have some questions for those that are
already flying the kolb mark III:
I would like to know the operating speeds such as
Vne--never exceed
Vfe--maximum flaps extended.
Vx--best angle of climb
Vy--best rate of climb
Thanks for your help,
Brandon Kearbey
| - - - -
Kolb []-| - - - -
Mark III .====== | - - - ___ "MarkIII"
(sort of). /| / | Brandon Kearbey
. / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us
. \_______/ |---------/-----|
(_____________//--------------\^
/ o
( )
________________________________________________________________________________
Dear Kolb Friends,
I am in the process of cutting all gussets and brackets I need for my
Firestar II out of the 0.032 alluminum sheet and found that the bracket "D",
the one that holds the cross-bracing on the stabilizers, is shown as being 6
inches long. I does seem a little out of proportion (too long). I tried
calling Kolb but got no answer (today is Saturday). Anyone out there has gone
trough this already and talked to Kolb about this.
Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Brackets "D" |
| From: | Curtis West <ccwest(at)intermind.net> |
>I am in the process of cutting all gussets and brackets I need for my
>Firestar II out of the 0.032 alluminum sheet and found that the bracket "D",
>the one that holds the cross-bracing on the stabilizers, is shown as being 6
>inches long. I does seem a little out of proportion (too long). I tried
>calling Kolb but got no answer (today is Saturday). Anyone out there has
gone
>trough this already and talked to Kolb about this.
>
>Chris
Chris,
I noticed that also and e-mailed Dennis for the correct dim. Here's
part of his response;
"... The 1/2" is correct, the width is 2" and the length 1-1/2". Start
off
with a 2" x 2" square and bend 1/2"...".
How long did it take you to receive your first kit? I've been waiting
about
3 weeks now.
Happy building
Curtis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "N.B. Del More" <Admin(at)bailin.com> |
I'm about to install a pair of balloon tires on my MKIII, anyone have any
suggestions concerning the installation of these?
I've heard of occassional problems related to rotation of the tube within
the tire etc. and would seriously like to avoid any unpleasant surprises.
Recommended air pressure??
I'm using the Matco aluminium wheels with disc brakes.
Also, on another note, what are other builders doing to reduce or prevent
airframe corrosion?
Thanks
Noel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RSCRacing(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Weight & Balance |
Well just finished our weight & balance. Worked out good for my dad who
weighs 185, but myself at 152 is not with in the limits. It works out to be
38.7% aft cg. If anyone who has ran in to this has any suggestions on how
much weight to add, where to add it and what kind of weight to use would make
it a little easier. Also is the 38.7% aft cg that far out of specs.
By the way, tomorrow, which is Sunday, we are going to take it out to our
field and break in the engine and start taxiing. Its been a long time waiting
but should be well worth the time spent building it. Thanks for any info.
Bob.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Weight & Balance |
| From: | Curtis West <ccwest(at)intermind.net> |
>Well just finished our weight & balance. Worked out good for my dad who
>weighs 185, but myself at 152 is not with in the limits. It works out to be
>38.7% aft cg. If anyone who has ran in to this has any suggestions on how
>much weight to add, where to add it and what kind of weight to use would
make
>it a little easier. Also is the 38.7% aft cg that far out of specs.
> By the way, tomorrow, which is Sunday, we are going to take it out to our
>field and break in the engine and start taxiing. Its been a long time
waiting
>but should be well worth the time spent building it. Thanks for any info.
Bob,
In the Kolb Book it mentioned something about the FS w/503 being a
little tail heavy
with a pilot weighing less then 160 lb. (i think). I considered using
bag's of shot
laid out on the floorpan just forward of the pilot seat. I guess this
would have to
be done when the FS is seating on the scales. Just add your weight
material and work
the numbers for computing CG.
My 2 cents
Curtis
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Rear diagonal bracing on the Firestar II rib. |
I noticed that in all photos I see of the Firestar II wing without fabric
there is an aditional diagonal 5/16" bracing, on all ribs, that go from the
bottom of the rear 4" vertical bracing to the top-front of the aluminum plate
just behind it. My drawings don't show this tubing. As shown on the drawings,
there is only 4 diagonal bracings in each rib (two in front of the spar and
two on the rear). Has anyone noticed this?. How are the ribs that come
pre-built from the Kolb?.
Also, if anyone has noticed other inconsistencies in the drawings (such as
the one on the dimmensions of the "D" bracket on the stabilizers), could you
tell me about them?. I'm beginning to worry a little that if I don't catch
one I'll end up ruining a component on the airplane.
Chris.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | arnia(at)iav.is (Arni Arnason) |
Hi Kolb fans
One question:
I am going to Spain later this month so are there any Kolb builders in Sp=
ain?
/ \ =96=96
Arni Arnason / =96=96\/=96/ =96\ /\
Selbraut 12 / =96=96 \/=96 \ / =96\ /=96=96\
170 Seltjarnarnes / 0 \=96=96 @ =96\/=96=96=96 \
Iceland / | Date: | Jul 01, 1996 |
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Balloon Tires |
On Sat, 29 Jun 1996, N.B. Del More wrote:
> I'm about to install a pair of balloon tires on my MKIII, anyone have any
> suggestions concerning the installation of these?
>
> I've heard of occassional problems related to rotation of the tube within
> the tire etc. and would seriously like to avoid any unpleasant surprises.
>
I think i'm the one that reported a problem w/ the tube working around inside
the tire. This is happening only on one of my wheels, a wheel that is
defective in that the rim is not concentric w/ the center hole. I need to
replace the damn wheel. I'm now on my second tube and it is working itself
around to pull the valve stem just like the first, and I need to move it
before it goes too far. My good wheel causes no problems.
Tire pressure: ~4.5 psi for my single place Firestar kxp. You won't need
much more at all on a 2 place Kolb.
> I'm using the Matco aluminium wheels with disc brakes.
>
> Also, on another note, what are other builders doing to reduce or prevent
> airframe corrosion?
I bet just keeping it hangared or garaged makes most of the difference,
assuming your frame was cleaned and primed well in the first place.
Mine's not old enf to show corrosion anyway. As an added item, i put
in 2 inspection ports on each wing -- one on the root and one at the
lift+drag+main_spar joint. I figured in addition to being able to
look inside, I could also open up to vent the wing if i ever had any
condensation inside. Inspection ports can be put in during initial
covering or later as an add-on. I got mine from Aircraft Spruce for
dirt cheap ($1 ea?) As another anti-corrosion effort, i had dipped all
my rivets in rustoleum before setting, as well as dabbed them w/ epoxy
before covering. (rustoleum is easy cuz it won't "go off" during your
overall build time).
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Weight & Balance |
> >it a little easier. Also is the 38.7% aft cg that far out of specs.
> > By the way, tomorrow, which is Sunday, we are going to take it out to our
> >field and break in the engine and start taxiing. Its been a long time
> Bob,
>
>Curtis West wrote:
> bag's of shot
> laid out on the floorpan just forward of the pilot seat. I guess this
I would try to put the ballast as far forward as possible, e.g. in the
nose pod. That provides the longest moment, and therefore requires the
least amount of added weight. At least get some of the weight in the
nose pod.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Combs <klc157(at)psu.edu> |
| Subject: | Directions to Kolb in Pheonixville, PA |
Hello to Kolb enthusiasts',
Can anyone provide me with the directions to the Kolb Co. here in PA? Is
it possible to take a ride in a Firestar at the facility?
Thanks
Kevin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | SlingShot (non)update |
Greetings,
In case anyone was curious, the SlingShot is still in the non-project
stage. Yesterday was 10 weeks since I ordered the plane at Sun-N-Fun
and so far, no word of delivery. At this point, I'm still hoping to
have it here (first 2 kits) by the end of July. The idle time is making
me do crazy things like looking for alternate engines. Yep, Dennis
should love some of the engines I'm looking at :-)
Rusty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Kearbey <kearbey(at)cnc.net> |
To all who read this!
My sons and I are about 98% finished with our MarkIII. Just have one
question.
The rudder cables rub where they enter the top of tube. Tube alignment
with fuselage cage is as it should be. I may tape a little piece of
rubber on the inside of the tube so that the cables won't chafe. Has
anybody had or seen this problem?
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
Greetings,
Still killing time waiting for the kit and debating options. I'm pretty
much planning to use one of the in-flight adjustable Ivo props on a
503 in the Slingshot, and I'm curious about how much advantage it will
give (maybe Dennis will tell us since they were planning to test one).
If you have a flying plane, can you tell me what rpm you see at you best
climb rate? I would need to know which engine you're using too in order
to look up the power curve.
Thanks in advance,
Rusty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Beeler <fbeeler(at)usit.net> |
| Subject: | Kolb Slingshot Questions |
My name is Frank Beeler from Knoxville Tennessee. I have been looking for
a project to replace the Moni Motorglider I completed a few years ago. I
have a few questions and request for all you KOLBER'S out there so here
it goes.
1. I was unable to make it to Sun&Fun this year but have seen some
articles on the Kolb Slingshot. If any of you were able to look this
aircraft over I would like to hear what you thought about it. I have
received Kolb's info pack and video but because the plane is so new
there was little information and no video on the Slingshot. If you
have pictures (binary) you could attach that would be great.
2. Have any builders purchase the Quick-Build option. If so were you
pleased with the craftsmanship and do you feel it was worth the
money.
3. Does anyone have a Kolb project underway that is within a few hours
drive of Knoxville? If so I would like to make arrangements for a
visit if possible.
I have enjoyed being on the E-mail list and learning more about the Kolb
Aircraft. I get the impression most of you are pleased with building and
flying your aircraft. Thanks in advance for any information or advice. By
the way there is a new home page just getting started on the Moni
Motorglider at http://ourworld.compuserve.com/hompages/CEmmons/ my Moni
(N364TB) is the yellow Tri-gear in the group photo.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Beeler <fbeeler(at)usit.net> |
| Subject: | Kolb Slingshot Questions |
My name is Frank Beeler from Knoxville Tennessee. I have been looking for
a project to replace the Moni Motorglider I completed a few years age. I
have a few questions and request for all you Kolbers out there so here it
goes.
1. I was unable to make it to Sun & Fun this year but have seen some
articles on the Kolb Slingshot. If any of you were able to look this
aircraft over i would like th hear what you thought about it. I have
received Kolb's info pack and video but the plane is so new there was
really little information and no video on the Slingshot. If you have
pictures (binary) you could attach that would be great.
2. Have any builders purchased the Quick-Build option? If so were you
pleased with the craftsmanship and do you feel it was worth the
money?
3. Does anyone have a Kolb project underway that is within a few hours
drive of Knoxville? If so I would like to make arrangements for a
visit if possible.
I have enjoyed being on the E-mail list and learning more about the Kolb
line of Aircraft. I get the impression most of you are pleased with
building and flying your aircraft. Thanks in advance for any information
or advice. By the way there is a new home page just getting started on
the Moni Motorglider. If your would like to visit at
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/hompages/CEmmons/ my Moni(N364TB) is the
yellow tri-gear in the group photo.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | byersj(at)hanscom.af.mil |
| Subject: | Kolb Builder's Advice |
Howdy,
My name is Jim and I'm looking to build a Kolb FIreFly or FireStar. I was
hoping some of you might offer some advice on which to build and if you know
where I might be able to find an uncompleted kit for sale. My main concern is
whether I should worry about keeping my aircraft a legal ultralight or not, in
order to be able to sell it easily in the future.
Thanks much,
Jim
J H Byers
byersj(at)radium.hanscom.af.mil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chuck(at)aixdev.kronos.com (Chuck Cullen) |
EAA Chap. 279's Kolb MkIII is nearly completed.
I do not know all the details of what is left to do.
Last time I saw it 2 weeks ago all I could tell was it needed seats.
Some club members started grumbling that it would never be finished.
Our EAA tech. counselor, and 2 or 3 experienced builders finally
got together to decide which one of them will do what to get the thing
in the air.
I think there might be a maximum number of people you can use for a
specific project.
The Mythical Man Month theory applied to aircraft construction.
One thing the group asked me to help with is to see if I could get examples
of checklists for preflight, takeoff and landing from the inet Kolb group.
The president of our flying club said he thought Kolb used to supply
checklists but not anymore.
I checked old email and I don't see much.
In addition to normal prefilght items ( such as "kick tires" and "make
sure control surfaces are not hooked up backwards" ) I would be
interested in any Kolb specific info.
For example, in previous email, Michael Ranson said one of his prefilght
items is to empty his pockets. If something falls out of a pocket, it
could get sucked into the pusher prop.
Maybe the checklists could be the start of a Kolb group FAQ.
So, whatever anybody would like to contribute, thanks in advance.
chuck
chuck(at)kronos.com
Chuck Cullen
Kronos Inc.
400 Fifth Ave.
Waltham, MA 02154
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Omelchuck <jason(at)acuityinc.com> |
| Subject: | Non stock landing gear |
I noticed in the last issue of Kit Planes there were several Kolbs and
one MKIII had a landing gear that was taller than the stock Kolb (at
least the gear I received). I was wondering if there is any type of
heavy duty landing gear or any other gear configuration for the MKIII
that anyone has used, manufactured or purchased. If so I would be
grateful for some information.
Thanks;Jason Omelchuck
jason(at)acuityinc.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | Slingshot Ramblings |
Greetings All,
I talked to Dennis today and he told me that I have to quit telling
people that he doesn't really exist (an off-line joke I've had with a
few people) :-) He also mentioned that the e-mail messages he's sent me
keep bouncing. It seems the Kolb list, for reasons I can't explain,
shows a very incorrect "reply to" address on my messages. Does anyone
else have that proplem? Please note the correct address on my signature
file.
The Slingshot news is good and bad. It sounds like the fuselage is
coming along ahead of schedule, but the wing/tail kit is slightly
behind. With any luck, my first kit will be ready before Oshkosh. I
guess I'll just have to mope around the house and annoy my wife for
awhile longer.
Dennis sounds quite pleased with the flight characteristics of the
Slingshot. I'll be in Pennsylvania for a week in mid August so I plan
to try out that back seat, and get those pictures I missed at Sun-N-Fun.
I also found out that Dan's a CFI and gives tailwheel training in the
MK-3. I plan to try to get my tailwheel endorsement during the week I'm
up there. This will all work out well for me. I would normally be
stuck visiting my in-laws and now I have the perfect excuse to disappear
for a few days :-)
--
Russell Duffy
rad(at)gulf.net
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
| Subject: | e-mail test only (sorry) |
Sorry to waste everyones electrons. I think I found MY mistake
regarding the incorrect "reply to" address. I seem to have messed up my
mail configuration a few weeks ago. This is a test to make sure it's
correct now.
--
Russell Duffy
rad(at)gulf.net
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bkearbey" <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
Hello All,
I have a few questions that I have asked before but I have not
recieved any reply to. We are getting very close to finishing our
Mark III. Everything is painted and now we just have to attach the
nose cone, hook up the instruments and some other minor details.
Where the rudder cables enter the forward part of the fuse. tube, the
cables rub on the top of the tube. Has anyone else had this problem
and what did you do to fix it?
Could someone give me the speeds for the Mark III, such as Vne, Vfe,
stall speed 1+2 persons ect.?
I would really appreciate a response.
Thank you
Brandon Kearbey
| - - - -
Kolb []-| - - - -
Mark III .====== | - - - ___ "MarkIII"
(sort of). /| / | Brandon Kearbey
. / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us
. \_______/ |---------/-----|
(_____________//--------------\^
/ o
( )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Weber (DVNS)" <bweber(at)micom.com> |
Just getting back to catching up on my mail. This came in on the Kolb
list but I thought my response should go to the UL list as well.
On Mon, 8 Jul 1996, Chuck Cullen wrote:
> EAA Chap. 279's Kolb MkIII is nearly completed.
> ............................
> One thing the group asked me to help with is to see if I could get examples
> of checklists for preflight, takeoff and landing from the inet Kolb group.
> The president of our flying club said he thought Kolb used to supply
> checklists but not anymore.
If you are nearing completion of a UL, run (don't walk) to the FAA
document storage site at:
http://152.123.186.6/CIRCDIR.HTM
First download the free Adobe viewer which you will need to view/print
the documents which are mostly in .PDF format. Then take the link to
miscellaneous advisory circulars and download the Advisory Circular:
AC90-89A Amateur-Built Aircraft and Ultralight Flight Testing Handbook.
There is a wealth of information covering what you should do during the
first 50 hours of flight time on your new plane.
There are other Advisory Circulars here as well, including indexes by
title and number. But I could not find the (in)famous AC 103-7 on-line.
_-_ _,, ,,
-/ ) ; ||
||_< \\/\/\ _-_ ||/|, _-_ ,._-_ bweber(at)micom.com
|| \\ || | | || \\ || || || \\ ||
;/--|| || | | ||/ || |' ||/ || Keep the shiny
_--_-' \\/\\/ \\,/ \\/ \\,/ \\, side up
(
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
Hello again,
I seem to be the one filling everyones mailbox these days. Sure
wouldn't mind seeing building updates from some of your projects (hint).
I decided that if I can scrape the money together for a parachute
without pushing the project back too far, I'll get a BRS chute for the
Slingshot. The recent events here in Pensacola haven't been too
aviation friendly. In fact, the F-16 crash was about 3/4 mile from my
parents house.
My question concerns the pusher configuration of the Kolbs. Are you
required to shut down the engine and wait for the prop to stop before
deploying the chute? Will the lines survive a prop strike (wood,
composite, etc ??)? I would think you want to stop the prop if
possible, but don't think it would be reasonable to expect in some
cases. The opening speed limit of the chute would be a factor too. If
I have to wait an extra 5-10 seconds in full plummet mode, speed might
exceed the chutes limits. What would be your procedure in an emergency?
Thanks for enduring more of my time wasting questions.
--
Russell Duffy
rad(at)gulf.net
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HB!HB1!MHansen(at)hbi.attmail.com (Hansen, Mark) |
----------
From: bkearbey
Subject: Kolb-List: Questions
Date: Wednesday, July 10, 1996 19:08PM
Hello,
My name is Mark Hansen, I have a friend with the same
problem. He came to look at my twinstar but they are not the same.
I have not seen an answer to this. If anyone knows what to do please
send me a note.
Thanks
Mark Hansen
Internet!hb!hb1!mhansen(at)hbi.attmail.com
---------------------------------------------------
Hello All,
I have a few questions that I have asked before but I have not
recieved any reply to. We are getting very close to finishing our
Mark III. Everything is painted and now we just have to attach the
nose cone, hook up the instruments and some other minor details.
Where the rudder cables enter the forward part of the fuse. tube, the
cables rub on the top of the tube. Has anyone else had this problem
and what did you do to fix it?
Thank you
Brandon Kearbey
bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Omelchuck <jason(at)acuityinc.com> |
About rubbing control cables, I have not gotten to that point of my
airplane yet but I would think that there are a couple of things you
might do. First try calling or E-Mailing Dennis at Kolb
(dlsouder(at)aol.com). The rudder horn might have to be lowered on the
rudder ( I realize this is not trivial if it has been drilled) this may
or may not work being as it is the wrong end. Put some kind of plastic
rub block to hold it off the tube, this would be the simplest but would
probably have to be changed regularly. Cut and weld the stands for the
fairleads shorter. If it doesn't rub badly maybe you could have a
custom fairlead made with the hole off center towards the bottom?
My airplane is starting to look like an airplane, I am rigging the wings
tomorrow and with the limited space I have it should be a challenge.
The fuselage will be just outside a garage door, one wing will be in the
garage, one wing will be down the driveway and the tail will be sticking
through a open gate. I really envy the people with the pictures on
Russels web page that have a space large enough to hold a completed
airplane, sure would make it allot easier. I am Planning on putting a
subaru engine on my plane, the bottom line is I do not like flying under
two stroke power (I have yet to find someone with 200 or more hours that
hasn't had a engine failure) and paying $6000 for a two stroke engine is
not something I can bring myself to do, and paying $10,000 for a rotax
912 is something I cannot afford to do. I am hoping to have my engine
come in at around 150lbs with reduction and am not planning on putting
any electrical or starter on it, we will have to see how well that plan
pans out. Because I am doing my own engine my first flight should be
around the end of next summer.
Any ideas or suggestions are always welcome, Happy flying.
jason(at)acuityinc.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matthias Petry <midwestengines(at)globalnet.co.uk> |
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////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////////////////////
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matthias Petry <midwestengines(at)globalnet.co.uk> |
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EAAADAAAAAEAAAD+////AAAAAAoAAAD/////////////////////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////c
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don <poppld(at)tdbank.ca> |
We have been flighing the Mark III we completed last
summer and now with 80 hours on the 912 engine are questioning
the noise level in the cabin. The cabin is completely enclosed
and yet the noise is so loud that when we radio the airport
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | evoice(at)acton.com (Doug Prange) |
Photos of some Mark III's I've seen have what looks like black edging around
the lexan windshield and doors.
Does anyone have a source for this stuff?
Also, similar material for the edge of of the nose cone?
Doug Prange
Mark III Builder ~85%
Lincoln, Nebraska
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
Jason,
I looked into the Subaru engine and it looked like it would be closer to
200 pounds to me (EA-81 w/drive, wet). This probably did include the
electrics though. If you aren't already on the Subaru mailing list, let
me know and I'll send you the signup info. I was on it, but got off
when I decided the engine wouldn't work for my Slingshot project. I
tend to agree about the 2-stroke situation even though I have no
experience with them. I can't find a suitable substitute, so it looks
like I'll be using the 503. I have, however, heard mostly good things
about it. One question about the lack of a starter, won't it be a
little tough hand proping an engine on the Kolb? Good luck with the
rigging and thanks for the update.
--
Russell Duffy
rad(at)gulf.net
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Gone for a little while |
To all...
I will be out of touch for a few days while my wife and I are moving. We
are downsizing to an apartment. It is not easy leaving a nice big home we
still love, but we are only two people now with both kids grown and gone.
The time is right.
I found a home for the Kolb at Aero-country airport near McKinney, Tx. It
is about 30 miles from the apartment. Now that it is at an airport, I have
no excuse to keep from flying. Hopefully that will happen when the pilot
gets himself ready.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (98%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chuckc(at)aixdev.kronos.com (Chuck Cullen) |
| Subject: | re: BRS parachutes |
> From: Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net>
> Subject: BRS parachutes
>
> Are you required to shut down the engine and wait for the prop to stop
> before deploying the chute?
No.
If you are in a situation where you actually have to fire the chute,
you should fire it as soon as you can and then shut down the engine.
I suspect you usually don't have to worry about shutting down the engine.
My guess is that when most ballistic chutes have been fired from
an aircraft with an engine, the engine was not running at the time.
Does anybody have any statistics? I supposed BRS does.
Remember this thought provoking comment from Jason Omelchuck:
> the bottom line is I do not like flying under two stroke power
> (I have yet to find someone with 200 or more hours that
> hasn't had a engine failure)
> Will the lines survive a prop strike (wood, composite, etc ??)?
Yes.
> If I have to wait an extra 5-10 seconds in full plummet mode, speed might
> exceed the chutes limits. What would be your procedure in an emergency?
A ballistic chute opens in about 2 seconds.
I don't think a Kolb can exceed the chutes limits.
If they can handle a C152 they can handle a Kolb.
I would like to conduct a little survey.
The flying club I am a member of does not want to put
a ballistic chute on the Kolb Mk III we're building.
Some of the members have experienced engine out emergency landings
in other types of experimental aircraft.
The most recent was a club member flying a Avid who had a gas leak,
ran out of gas, and landed on the grass median of I90 in upstate New York.
The police fined him $100.
I am wondering what percentage of Kolb's (all types) now flying
do not have a ballistic chute.
If you want to email me any info you have, I will summarize the results.
Any other opinions you want to add are welcome and I will try
to summarize them as well.
On another subject, thanks to Bill Weber for the info about the
FAA advisory papers on the web.
There is a ton of additional info there also.
The web address is www.faa.com (The IP number Bill gave works too).
chuck
chuck(at)kronos.com
Chuck Cullen
Kronos Inc.
400 Fifth Ave.
Waltham, MA 02154
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dirksen(at)fcs.net (Dirksens) |
| Subject: | Re: 2 vs 4, again. |
Jason Omelchuck wrote:
I am Planning on putting a
>subaru engine on my plane, the bottom line is I do not like flying under
>two stroke power (I have yet to find someone with 200 or more hours that
>hasn't had a engine failure) and paying $6000 for a two stroke engine is
>not something I can bring myself to do, and paying $10,000 for a rotax
>912 is something I cannot afford to do. jason(at)acuityinc.com
Jason, I flew about 300 hours getting, and then enjoying a private ticket
back in 1978 to 1981. I had two total engine out "dead stick" (misnomer)
landings. The first was in a Piper 140, my third dual flight. 200 ft in
the air, quiet.
Instructor took it, stuck the nose abruptly DOWN, pulled full flaps and we
rolled out with the nose against the fence at the end of the runway overrun
area. No problem. Never found out what stopped the Lycoming. Everything
appeared OK when the mechanic checked it out. He started it up after the
inspection, flew it around for awhile. We continued our lesson. ??
Later on an aerobatic instructor and I emptied our wing tanks through dry
and leaking gaskets in a Fairchild PT-19. We were practicing inverted
turns. 3500 ft and 11 miles out, quiet. Because he knew what he was
doing, we made it home. No problem.
I'm taking dual now at the Perris CA ultralight center in Quicksilvers with
the Rotax 2-strokes. There are a LOT of 2-strokes there and a LOT of
activity. I hear no horror stories there. Engine problems are always
traceable to operation procedures and maintenance mistakes or omissions, at
least in the stories told here. I am NOT recommending that you fly a
two-stroke but do study carefully the weight penalty you'll pay for the 4
banger. To me one of the biggest rewards of flying light aircraft is a LOW
wing loading. I'd rather be responsible for my own maintenance and
operation, then be able to land at a TRUE 27mph, than have the questionably
superior reliability of a non-certificated four stroke, but have to dead
stick in with higher airspeed because of the higher wingloading.
Putting either the Piper or the Fairchild down off the runway would have
been a mess because of the airspeed required to fly (not fall) in.
Each to his own. For me Light is Right!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: 2 vs 4, again. |
> Jason Omelchuck wrote:
> I am Planning on putting a
> >subaru engine on my plane, the bottom line is I do not like flying under
> >two stroke power (I have yet to find someone with 200 or more hours that
> >hasn't had a engine failure) and paying $6000 for a two stroke engine is
> >not something I can bring myself to do, and paying $10,000 for a rotax
> >912 is something I cannot afford to do. jason(at)acuityinc.com
On Sat, 20 Jul 1996, Dirksens wrote:
>
> Jason, I flew about 300 hours getting, and then enjoying a private ticket
> back in 1978 to 1981. I had two total engine out "dead stick" (misnomer)
> landings. The first was in a Piper 140, my third dual flight. 200 ft in
> the air, quiet.
> Instructor took it, stuck the nose abruptly DOWN, pulled full flaps and we
> rolled out with the nose against the fence at the end of the runway overrun
> area. No problem. Never found out what stopped the Lycoming. Everything
> appeared OK when the mechanic checked it out. He started it up after the
> inspection, flew it around for awhile. We continued our lesson. ??
>
> Later on an aerobatic instructor and I emptied our wing tanks through dry
> and leaking gaskets in a Fairchild PT-19. We were practicing inverted
> turns. 3500 ft and 11 miles out, quiet. Because he knew what he was
> doing, we made it home. No problem.
>
> I'm taking dual now at the Perris CA ultralight center in Quicksilvers with
> the Rotax 2-strokes. There are a LOT of 2-strokes there and a LOT of
> activity. I hear no horror stories there. Engine problems are always
> traceable to operation procedures and maintenance mistakes or omissions, at
> least in the stories told here. I am NOT recommending that you fly a
> two-stroke but do study carefully the weight penalty you'll pay for the 4
> banger. To me one of the biggest rewards of flying light aircraft is a LOW
> wing loading. I'd rather be responsible for my own maintenance and
> operation, then be able to land at a TRUE 27mph, than have the questionably
> superior reliability of a non-certificated four stroke, but have to dead
> stick in with higher airspeed because of the higher wingloading.
>
> Putting either the Piper or the Fairchild down off the runway would have
> been a mess because of the airspeed required to fly (not fall) in.
>
> Each to his own. For me Light is Right!
>
This is one of the best, most complete pieces of advice I've ever seen
on a given subject on the internet. Light IS Right; ability to land
slow means an awful lot, and a decent climb rate at even at cruise power
setting isn't bad either.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chuckc(at)aixdev.kronos.com (Chuck Cullen) |
| Subject: | ballistic chutes |
In my last post to the Kolb group I said that in an emergency situation
I thought it was preferable to fire a ballistic chute before
shutting down a pusher prop engine.
I assumed that, when flying a Kolb, you may not have much time to
fire a ballistic chute since Kolb's are often flown at low altitudes,
or you have trouble at takeoff like the accident in Florida, etc.
Therefore, it would be preferable to get the chute out as soon as possible
and then stop the engine as the second step of the procedure.
Maybe not.
I received a response from someone who knew of an accident in Maryland, USA,
where the pusher prop UL had a structural failure and the ballistic chute
got cought in the prop. The crash was fatal.
Then I sent BRS email via their web page and following is the response
I received.
> From: BRSchute(at)aol.com
> best to turn off engine first if possible. On a pusher aircraft you
> have much more of a chance of a parachute getting into the prop than a
> tractor type airplane. During a deployment the parachute will go downwind
> even if it's fired straight up. Make sure the rocket and chute are not aimed
> at the prop arc. Aim the recovery system (if top mounted) as upright as
> possible to avoid the prop, the chute will still go to the back but the
> rocket will have a chance to clear the prop and take the parachute to full
> line extention leaving the kevlar bridle to take a prop strike not the
> parachute or it's nylon lines. The kevlar bridle can take a prop strike, but
> still turn off the motor. Please remember to install the recovery system as
> directed by the manufacture.
>
> Gregg Ellsworth
> BRS
chuck
chuck(at)kronos.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Gerken GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM" <GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM> |
| Subject: | Status, 2 questions...Mark III |
All controls are now connected and working well (no fabric covering yet).
Seats/belts are in, floor pan in (decided to make front half of pan removable
for brake service). Installed streamline material onto lift struts last
night. The struts look great powdercoated. Question #1: How many of you
are using or planning to use the jury strut? The plans make it sound kind of
optional. The strutslook so nice and strong I hate to add the ugly little
jury strut 8-) .
Question #2: I also have the problem of the rudder cables dragging on the
front end of the fuselage tube just behind the fairleads. What are we doing
about this? A friend suggested I have a couple custom fairleads made with
very small or offset center holes. If I had a lathe I would do this. Are
there any other solutions in use? Has anyone asked Dennis yet?
Overall, the plane is coming together quite well. I added up my hours
so far and came up with 297.5. I still haven't started the gap seal, and
like I said above have not done any covering. Most of my steel parts are
primed and painted. All cables are made and controls working well. Gear
is on, brakes need to be plumbed (probably after covering). Also have not
put in the wing fold storage brackets yet, waiting till I have a bag of
water softener salt (80 lbs) to simulate the engine weight. I built the
aileron stops out of Lexan, per suggestion from Dennis. They bolt on with
the rod-end bolts at the rear of the fuselage and stop against the fuse tube.
They work well and look good (and don't need painting!). There are probably
planes built in fewer hours than mine, but I have (and will continue to) go
back and rework anything that doesn't suit me until it is satisfactory.
This attitude has produced a better plane for me, as I have re-built things
several times in some cases and almost everything is meeting spec now.
I think I have good timing, with OshKosh next week. My plane will be ready
to dissassemble to cover and paint the week after OshKosh, so if I see any
good ideas or other solutions while I am there, it is not too late.
See you there!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Omelchuck <jason(at)acuityinc.com> |
| Subject: | RE: Status, 2 questions...Mark III |
I'm not really sure what you are referring to when you say "streamline
material" my struts are streamline aluminum by themselves. I received a
news letter about a year ago from Kolb and they mentioned that the 1inch
by .058 tube around the end fittings should be extended the whole length
of the strut and if you did this and were flying at gross weights in
the 800lb range the jury strut was not needed. There have been other
postings about the cables rubbing but I do not know the solutions (if
any) that were provided by Kolb.
>----------
>From: Jim Gerken
>GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM[SMTP:GERKEN(at)RCHVMX.VNET.IBM.COM@acuityinc.com
>]
>Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 1996 6:27AM
>To: kolb(at)hpmail2.ftw.mot.com
>Subject: Status, 2 questions...Mark III
>
> All controls are now connected and working well (no fabric covering
>yet).
>Seats/belts are in, floor pan in (decided to make front half of pan
>removable
>for brake service). Installed streamline material onto lift struts
>last
>night. The struts look great powdercoated. Question #1: How many of
>you
>are using or planning to use the jury strut? The plans make it sound
>kind of
>optional. The strutslook so nice and strong I hate to add the ugly
>little
>jury strut 8-) .
> Question #2: I also have the problem of the rudder cables dragging
>on the
>front end of the fuselage tube just behind the fairleads. What are we
>doing
>about this? A friend suggested I have a couple custom fairleads made
>with
>very small or offset center holes. If I had a lathe I would do this.
>Are
>there any other solutions in use? Has anyone asked Dennis yet?
> Overall, the plane is coming together quite well. I added up my
>hours
>so far and came up with 297.5. I still haven't started the gap seal,
>and
>like I said above have not done any covering. Most of my steel parts
>are
>primed and painted. All cables are made and controls working well.
>Gear
>is on, brakes need to be plumbed (probably after covering). Also have
>not
>put in the wing fold storage brackets yet, waiting till I have a bag of
>water softener salt (80 lbs) to simulate the engine weight. I built
>the
>aileron stops out of Lexan, per suggestion from Dennis. They bolt on
>with
>the rod-end bolts at the rear of the fuselage and stop against the fuse
>tube.
>They work well and look good (and don't need painting!). There are
>probably
>planes built in fewer hours than mine, but I have (and will continue
>to) go
>back and rework anything that doesn't suit me until it is satisfactory.
>This attitude has produced a better plane for me, as I have re-built
>things
>several times in some cases and almost everything is meeting spec now.
>I think I have good timing, with OshKosh next week. My plane will be
>ready
>to dissassemble to cover and paint the week after OshKosh, so if I see
>any
>good ideas or other solutions while I am there, it is not too late.
> See you there!
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hank Fritze <HFritze(at)wow.com> |
| Subject: | One vs two carbs on two-cycle engines |
Let me add to the recent discussion on one vs two carbs on two-cycle engines. The
result of adding the second carb is improved engine reliability. In 1989 I
conducted a survey of two-cycle aircraft engines. The results were published
in the September issue of the Experimenter and subsequently in Kitplanes. Engines
with a carburetor per cylinder ran significantly longer before failure than
did manifolded engines. In fact, none of the dual carb Rotax 503's reported
had failed whereas a significant number of the single carb units had failed. And
they had comperable operating times.
My own Rotax 503 DC, mounted in a B1-RD ultralight, ran 307 hours before the rear
rod big end bearing failed and the engine quit. At that time the total complete
overhaul cost was $1000. It included the replacement of all moving parts,
except for the flywheel, with new parts.
If it weren't for the two-cycle aircraft engine, we would be flying 600 lb empty
weight aircraft like the J3 cub.
I'm putting a Rotax 503 DC DI in my Firestar II. I will include a dual EGT in the
instrumentation whose primary purpose is to initially set the carburation.
I have yet to hear of an engine saved by its instrumentation after the initial
setup.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bkearbey" <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
Hello,
I was working on the doors today and I tried to keep the hinges as
straight as possible to prevent binding. When I put the wire back
into the hinges I found it quite difficult to do. Once it was in,
though, the door worked perfectly. My question: does anyone else
have the problem with this hinge wire being difficult to remove and
replace?
Thanks
Brandon Kearbey
| - - - -
Kolb []-| - - - -
Mark III .====== | - - - ___ "HERB"
N52BK . /| / | Brandon Kearbey
99% . / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.
. \_______/ |-----------/-----| butte.k12.ca.us
(_____________//----------------\^
/ o
( )Http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1041
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JLBAKER40(at)worldnet.att.net (Jim Baker) |
| Subject: | Trailer....maybe? |
I may have a deal for someone on a damaged trailer that I used for my Kolb
FS2. Here's the sad story. Had a thunderstorm blow the trailer over and
since it was insured, got the estimate to repair and it was about the same
price as I quoted as cost. Right now it's not pretty but can be fixed up and
is still road-worthy. The insurance guys are going to buy me a new "same-as"
trailer and will probably want to wholesale or scrap the damaged one. So,
here is your chance to speak up if you need a useable trailer (they'd
probably go for about $500 or less if it was offered to them). Specs are as
follows (I built it so it wasn't too pretty to start with):
Frame is 2 in x 3 in box steel welded and triangulated with members of the
same size. Length is about 32 ft interior and perhaps 38-39 ft total. The
cage is made of 1 in x 3 in box steel, also triangulated. The sides are
.032 aluminum sheet and the top is .062 aluminum sheet. The front of the
enclosure slopes forward and wraps downward to form an aero wedge (hard to
explain). The sheet has some small tears and is wrinkled (well, more like
waved) in some places.
The dimensions are 7 ft wide by 7 ft tall. Floor to ceiling is about 6 ft
10 in. The rear doors might have to be removed as they took some damage on
the skins but the door frames look OK.
There are four D-ring anchors in the floor for the main gear tiedown and I
have welded two steel eye bolts in the ceiling to support the tail. I used a
WIDE nylon tow strap wrapped several times around the fuse tube and used
carabiners on the ends of the strap to latch into the eye bolts. Works
nicely and keeps everything riding smoothly.
There are two axles, one 2000# and one 3000#. Tounge weight is about 180#.
Hitch is 2 in ball. Tires are the small trailer type to keep the floor
height close to the ground for loading ease.
If interested, let me know and I'll see if the insurance guys want to deal
(or wait, for that matter). As for me, 12 weeks to get the new beast.
Cheers,
Jim Baker
Oklahoma City
405-733-3823
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bkearbey" <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
| Subject: | re: BRS parachutes |
Hello all,
> I would like to conduct a little survey.
> The flying club I am a member of does not want to put
> a ballistic chute on the Kolb Mk III we're building.
> Some of the members have experienced engine out emergency landings
> in other types of experimental aircraft. The most recent was a club
> member flying a Avid who had a gas leak, ran out of gas, and landed
> on the grass median of I90 in upstate New York. The police fined him
> $100. I am wondering what percentage of Kolb's (all types) now
> flying do not have a ballistic chute. If you want to email me any
> info you have, I will summarize the results. Any other opinions you
> want to add are welcome and I will try to summarize them as well.
We decided not to put a chute on our kolb. Nor do we have one on our
quiksilver. If your engine goes out I would much rather have control
of the aircraft than let it float down. We also do not fly over an
area where we cannot land reasonably safe without an engine. I
wouldn't want to fly in a plane that I questioned its structural integrity
either so why should I put a chute on it? I know there are pros and cons.
One con is the cost of the chute and then the repacking. Thats my 2
cents and info for your survey.
Brandon Kearbey
| - - - -
Kolb []-| - - - -
Mark III .====== | - - - ___ "HERB"
N52BK . /| / | Brandon Kearbey
99% . / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.
. \_______/ |-----------/-----| butte.k12.ca.us
(_____________//----------------\^
/ o
( )Http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1041
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | stei0302(at)cs.fredonia.edu (Jon N. Steiger) |
| Subject: | re: BRS parachutes |
>
>We decided not to put a chute on our kolb. Nor do we have one on our
>quiksilver. If your engine goes out I would much rather have control
>of the aircraft than let it float down. We also do not fly over an
>area where we cannot land reasonably safe without an engine. I
>wouldn't want to fly in a plane that I questioned its structural integrity
>either so why should I put a chute on it? I know there are pros and cons.
>One con is the cost of the chute and then the repacking. Thats my 2
>cents and info for your survey.
>
(Please note: When I say "you" in the following paragraph, I am referring
to the collective "you" (including myself), and not Brandon specifically.)
I definitely agree that if it is at all possible, it is much more
preferable to fly a controlled forced landing than to become a passenger
with no control whatsoever. If you always fly where you have a potential
landing spot, a 'chute becomes less of a priority. Unfortunately, some people
live in areas where this is not always possible 100% of the time.
However, it is possible that a structural failure can occur in
flight. It may not have anything to do with the quality of the aircraft
but rather extreme weather conditions and/or unintentional high g-force
loading, or a mid-air collision.
Of course, careful flight planning, good judgement, and alert piloting
can eliminate or at the least, drastically reduce those factors.
Consider that the vast majority of GA aircraft don't have chutes, and
still the fatality rate of flying is much lower than for other travel
or recreational activities.
I equate chutes to states without motorcycle helmet laws. You can ride
with or without the helmet, your prerogative. You could probably ride
for a long time (if not your whole life) without any injuries, but it only
takes one incident, and when (if) that happens, you'd be mighty sorry you
weren't wearing that helmet.
Most GA aircraft are too fast and heavy to make a chute practical.
Ultralights have an option that most aircraft don't! Personally, I
will take the 'chute, and hope I never need to use it. Nothing
would make me happier than to "waste" that money. $1,000-$1,500 sounds
like a lot of money, (and it is, for me anyway), but, I immagine it
would sound very small indeed when mother earth is spiraling up to meet
your soon to be ex-body...
-Jon-
.------------------------------------------------------------------------------.
| Jon Steiger: DoD# 1038, EAA #518210, USUA# A46209, NMA# 117376, KotWitDoDFAQ
|
| stei0302@cs.fredonia.edu && http://www.cs.fredonia.edu/~stei0302/ |
| '96 Dakota SLT V-8 Club Cab, '91 FZR600R /* Just another mangy hacker */
|
`------------------------------------------------------------------------------'
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Stinnette <datawhiz(at)netdoor.com> |
I feel the same as Herb about the chute. If I had a choice of flying my
aircraft into tennis court uncontrolled or into a football field
controled but without power.... well you can guess the answer.
Todd:)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jmbrink(at)ix.netcom.com (J. Brinkmoeller ) |
| Subject: | Firestare II Building Comments |
I have been reading the E-mail supplied by my friend Mark Brinkmoeller
regarding the Kolb builders group. After summing up the comments so
far over the last few months, I would like to add some hints to you
all. I just
completed a Firestar II including a three color paint job in 286 hours
and without a divorce.
1) Study the drawings and manual as Kolb suggests. Begin acquiring
tools and organizing your work place. Try and work on your project on
a regular basis to retain cohesion.
2) Definitely invest in an air compressor, pneumatic riveter, and spray
gun. All these are hot items of the used tool market so you shouldn't
have trouble selling them after the project is finishes.
3) Definitely invest in the pro-made rib option.
4) Make copies of the plans for all gussets and rubber cement them to
the aluminum sheet stock supplied. Take the layout to a sheet metal
shop and have them cut on a shear. All my gussets were done for $20.00
and all we
re perfect. You can also gang drill them at the same time.
5) Cut a 3' x 4' piece of plywood or foil insulation and take all your
hardware packages to it with the nomenclature facing out. Catagorize
washers, nuts, bolts, etc. in rows.
6) I rigged up a 1750 rpm motor with a 8" abrasive discs at one end and
a abrasive flapper wheel at the other to cut, grind, debur and polish
parts all in one tool in one location on the workbench.
7) For multi hole drilling of parts such as hinges and tubes, make
your layout on masking tape then transfer the tape to the part for
center punching and drilling. This method is especially handy on 5"
round tubes and f
illings.
8) Before painting fuselage tube, mask of 3/4" on each end to avoid
adding to the already tight o.d. This will eliminate sanding it back
off when you need to fit and refit things.
9) When rigging the wings I used 4 plumbers levels taped to the midway
point of the leading and trailing edges of the wings near the lift
strut locations. Then mason's lines on the horizontal planes and back
to the verti
cal stabilizer. You then have all dimensions covered at one time to
make corrections in the rigging.
10) Fabric cover the aileron tubes all the way to the inboard ends so
the gap seal will have a more compatible surface to adhere to.
11) I am building a trailer at present and may pass on some info on
that if it's worth it.
I hope some of these items are helpful. Now all I need to do is learn
to fly the machine.
Sincerely,
Jim Schantz
Lodi, Wisconsin
608-592-3543
(Comments and replies will reach me through jmbrink(at)ix.netcom.com)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | FIRE FLY FOR SALE |
| From: | clarkww9rwx(at)juno.com (clark m wockner) |
HI Guys and Gals:
A change in my plans Will allow someone to Jump
three months ahead of everyone else when trying to
buy AND BUILD a Kolb fire fly !!!
I have the following for sale .
Kolb Fire Fly-- Kit #1-- Wings and Tail Kit. Vertical stab completed,
Horizontal stab completed, Rudder and
elevators completed.
Kit #3 Airframe kit. Fuselage and remainder
brake option. Fuselage and all 4130 parts painted
All plans and manuals with addendums.
Can be inspected and picked up at Watseka,
Illinois
5,600 Dollars
Tell all of your
friends
THANKS
CLARK WOCKNER
1200 W. SMITH ST.
WATSEKA , ILL 60970
PH# (815) 432-3507
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clarkww9rwx(at)juno.com (clark m wockner) |
HI Again:
About one week ago someone wanted a fire fly. I did not save the
e-mail message. Does any one know who it was and would you give me his
E mail address??
THANKS
CLARK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bkearbey" <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
Hello,
I have used some stuff called "Marine-Tex" for putting in the pitot
tube and some other things in the fiberglass nose fairing. The stuff
works well and dries very strong. It is also sandable. I have found
it useful for several applications such as the pitot tube in. You
can get it at a boat supply store. Its just a tip it you choose to
use it.
Brandon Kearbey
| - - - -
Kolb []-| - - - -
Mark III .====== | - - - ___ "HERB"
N52BK . /| / | Brandon Kearbey
99% . / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.
. \_______/ |-----------/-----| butte.k12.ca.us
(_____________//----------------\^
/ o
( )Http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1041
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bkearbey" <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
What is the best way to clean dust and other things of the lexan
without scratching it?
| - - - -
Kolb []-| - - - -
Mark III .====== | - - - ___ "HERB"
N52BK . /| / | Brandon Kearbey
99% . / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.
. \_______/ |-----------/-----| butte.k12.ca.us
(_____________//----------------\^
/ o
( )Http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1041
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tgr(at)rmii.com (thomas g. rampton) |
>What is the best way to clean dust and other things of the lexan
>without scratching it?
On glider canopies, on airplane plastic windows, we used a commercial
cleaning compound and *Bounty* paper towels.
On my plastic (but coated) glasses, I've used ordinary Windex and that same
brand of paper towel--on advice from my optometrist. For the latter, I keep
the Bounty towels, torn to a convenient size, scrupulously clean in a
zip-lock bag, since dust on the towel would be like sandpaper.
The Bounty brand is said to be the only paper towel soft enough not to
scratch the plastic. I suppose it would work for lexan. I don't think I'd
get carried away with rubbing, however.
Others use soft cloths, and this is probably better yet, *if* the cloth is
clean. You can also buy cleaner made for this purpose. Forgot the brand. Old
fashioned soap and water, and a cloth, are probably best to get off most of
the stuff first, taking care not to scratch the plastic. Other ideas will
probably be forthcoming.
Grit on the window probably includes much feldspar and quartz--hardnesses 6
and 7 on the Moh scale. Window plastic is what? Maybe 3 at most? Don't rub
the grit against the plastic!
Tom Rampton
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chuckc(at)aixdev.kronos.com (Chuck Cullen) |
I use something called Rainx and paper towels on my car windshield.
It cleans off dirt and leaves some sort of plastic coating on the
windshield so rain runs off easily.
I almost don't need the windshield wipers anymore.
You have to wipe this stuff on about once a month.
I'm pretty sure it will work well on Lexan also.
chuck(at)kronos.com
________________________________________________________________________________
by SERV05.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979)
id <01I7OAMPVK4M001HGM(at)SERV05.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for kolb(at)hpmail2.ftw.mot.com;
| From: | abm(at)SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Andy McCall) |
| Subject: | take me off the auto. mail list |
how do I cancel the mail being directed to my address re:Kolb?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | skip(at)netline.net (skip staub) |
Chuck,
>I use something called Rainx and paper towels on my car windshield.
>It cleans off dirt and leaves some sort of plastic coating on the
>windshield so rain runs off easily.
In the "for what it's worth" category --- There are some plastics that Rainx
has ruined. Several motorcycle people have made mention of the fact that their
windshields were ruined when they used Rainx. Honda Goldwing windscreens
particularly come to mind and only some of them. That being the case, you may
wish to test it on a small windshield section to start.
Don't have to clean the windshield of my Ultrastar. :)
Regards,
Skip
Skip
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bkearbey" <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
> I use something called Rainx and paper towels on my car windshield.
> It cleans off dirt and leaves some sort of plastic coating on the
> windshield so rain runs off easily. I almost don't need the
> windshield wipers anymore. You have to wipe this stuff on about once
> a month. I'm pretty sure it will work well on Lexan also.
Yes I use that on my car also, but will it keep dust off. I think I
might try some on some scrap pieces to make sure nothing happens!
Thanks for idea,
Brandon Kearbey
Kolb | - - - -
Mark III []-| - - - -
N52BK .====== | - - - ___ "HERB"
99% done . /| / | Brandon Kearbey
. / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.
. \_______/ |-----------/-----| butte.k12.ca.us
(_____________//----------------\^
/ o
( )Http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1041
Kolb | - - - -
Mark III []-| - - - -
N52BK .====== | - - - ___ "HERB"
99% done . /| / | Brandon Kearbey
. / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.
. \_______/ |-----------/-----| butte.k12.ca.us
(_____________//----------------\^
/ o
( )Http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1041
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LTaylorCB(at)aol.com |
Try a product called Protect All. It is used mainly by RV and Aircraft
industry. Was orginally developed for aircraft and since gone to RV and
cycles.
Has UV blockers, anti-static type dust repellent and was originally made for
aircraft windshields. I know you can buy it at large RV supply stores. If
you have any questions about it call the company @ 800 322-4491 or 714
635-4491.
I found out about Protect All several years ago and used it on my RV,
glasses, car, monitor screen, etc etc. Use only a very small amount at a
time. It makes things very slick!!!! .... and seems to last a long time.
I hope some day to be using it on my Kolb. I am new to UL so have
enjoyed reading info on aol. Hope to find used Firestar some day.
Larrry Taylor LTaylor CB(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
Hi Kolb builders/flyers:
The list is a little sleepy so i thought I'd toss in a little bit of my
doings. A couple weeks ago I went flying for a good part of Saturday
and Sunday. On the way back into my home area I saw a large disked
field with 3 dust devils churning up in the afternoon heat. I'm in
the Sacramento valley, and this afternoon was about 105, which is not
uncommon. Having toyed w/ thermals a little in the past, i headed right
for the biggest of the dust devils. I entered it at 1000'AGL and backed
off to 3400 rpm, and circled at 35-40mph. I stayed here quite awhile,
maybe about 5-8 minutes. Although not spectacular, i continually gained
altitude, and decided i'd had enough at 3000'. Interestingly, I noticed
that there were a lot of swallows that seemed to be riding the thermal
as well.
Another fun thing i did was a variation on an exercise given to me during
my early UL training. That is, to fly the plane at minimum flying speed
right along the runway, usually with wheels skipping about half the time.
The challenge exercises all 4 control inputs: rudder,elevator,aileron,
and throttle. The variation, which was partly just luck, was that I
got the tailwheel to ride smoothly along the strip for several seconds
without the mains touching. This is impossible if it is a little gusty,
because you obviously can't predict the changing wind. But it's possible
in steady air and nets the same satisfaction as doing a tight 360 turn
and hitting your prop wash as you come around. (Be advised i'm not
suggesting anyone do dramatic high incidence angle wheel stands.)
Last weekend i did some maintenance stuff. The main thing i went after
is the where the wing attaches at the rear U-joints to the fuselage.
On pre-flights i had noticed that the castle nuts were not quite tight
enough, allowing the rear of the wing to click up or down -- not much
(1/8"?) -- but enought to seem sloppy. I think paint had worn off the
U-joint since new, creating the looseness. I took the wings and U-joints
off, which was good to do just on general inspection principles. I then
thinned down a new set of washers for the U-joints to a thickness
that allows the U-joint castle nuts to be tightened to the perfect tightness
AND have the cotter pin meet its hole. I also greased areas where the
paint had worn off.
happy landings everybody.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o Firestar KXP
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
Greetings all,
Thanks for refueling my enthusiasm Ben. Monday will be 16 weeks of
waiting for my SlingShot kit :-( I am, however, organizing a small
commando raid on the factory to at least visit my kit. It will happen
the week of the 12th when I'm up in PA serving a one week in-law
sentence. I just found out that I'm going to be scheduled for 4 weeks
in Cleveland for training on a new machine we just sold. This should
happen in the next 3-4 months just to agrivate my building schedule.
There's even the possibility of another 5 week training class too. At
least new equipment is job security.
In other news, I got an info pack on Hirth engines the other day. On,
paper, they have a few advantages over the Rotax. Unfortunately, some
of those are unverified, and there are also some disadvantages. To me,
Rotax wins the 50 HP contest, but if I were looking for a 65 HP engine
(which I wish I could), the Hirth looks pretty good. Of course my
favorite is their 4 cyl, 110 HP that weighs only 109 lbs. If I had
$6500 to buy one, Dennis would have much cause for concern :-)
Has anybody ever considered using a boat fuel tank? I really don't like
the idea of using two 5 gal tanks together in the plane. I've been
looking into finding a single tank to take their place and perhaps even
add to the 10 gal capacity some. Boat tanks seem to come in quite a
variety of styles, shapes, and capacities. At this point it's just
something I'm considering.
Another thing I'm thinking about, is making a small storage locker in
the nose of the plane. If I can use one of the metal panel extensions
like what Kolb sells in their "custom instrument" package, I'll have
some free space behind the fiberglass panel that can be closed in. I
wonder if I can attach the metal instrument panel with a full length
hinge at the bottom and a couple of quick release attachments at the
top. This would allow the panel to hinge forward allowing access to the
storage compartment via a hole in the fiberglass instrument panel (like
a glove compartment). This would kill two birds with one (elaborate)
stone. First, I would have an out-of-the-way place to keep some misc
items like a quart of oil, tie-downs, small canopy cover, a few tools,
etc. Second, these items would be located far forward of the CG. I've
been warned already that I either need to gain weight, or put something
heavy in the nose. This would make productive use of the weight shift.
I need to get the CG reasonably forward if I hope to carry more than 10
gal of fuel, and I have a good friend who weighs 20 lbs less than me
(I'm 165, he's Stickman). I logged many hours in the Grumman that he
recently sold and would like to return the favor since he's now
planeless.
Have fun with those dust devils.
--
Russell Duffy
rad(at)gulf.net
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Olendorf(at)aol.com |
Hi all,
I am almost afraid to ask this question since I think I know the answer. I
recently purchased a 1989 Firestar and have been flying it quite a bit. I
had noticed that just under the engine recoil starter on the main steel tube
of the fuselage is a dent of some sort. Also the tube itself seems to be
bent a little. It almost looks like a kink that happened in the tube when
the tube got bent. I looked at the blueprints and it did not show this tube.
I have to assume that this happened from a hard landing which caused the
weight of the engine to bend the tube, but it would seem to me to be
strongest part of the plane and I can't imagine that being the case. I have
been told by a new firestar builder that the dent is not there on his plane.
Can anyone shed some light on this one?
===============================
Scott Olendorf / Kolb Firestar
Schenectady, NY
===============================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
On Sun, 4 Aug 1996 Olendorf(at)aol.com wrote:
> I am almost afraid to ask this question since I think I know the answer. I
> recently purchased a 1989 Firestar and have been flying it quite a bit. I
> had noticed that just under the engine recoil starter on the main steel tube
> of the fuselage is a dent of some sort. Also the tube itself seems to be
> bent a little. It almost looks like a kink that happened in the tube when
> the tube got bent. I looked at the blueprints and it did not show this tube.
>
> I have to assume that this happened from a hard landing which caused the
> weight of the engine to bend the tube, but it would seem to me to be
> strongest part of the plane and I can't imagine that being the case. I have
> been told by a new firestar builder that the dent is not there on his plane.
Hi Scott,
Sorry to say but you are right, that tube should be straight. It is hard
for me to imagine that it would bend from a hard landing unless the engine
was something from maybe a Buick. I've seen a firestar that crash landed
(power failure over lousy terrain), which tore off the landing gear,
also tearing out and forward the ring which holds the front end of the
fuselage tube, and bending other tubes in the lower aft part of the cage.
I didn't look specifically at the top center tube, but i don't think it
was harmed. I had also seen a firestar that landed 15 feet above the
ground and was a mess from the nose back, and that tube was straight on
this one too. (That plane, by the way, was being sold as parts but was
rebuilt by a "keep-em-flyin RC" type in only 4 months and it flies all
the time now.)
I would say that you need more clues, and, unfortunately you may
find them. In other words, it would be very difficult for this to
be the only part of the frame to be damaged in any type of mishap.
I'd look the whole frame over with a very good eye for splices, rewelds,
cracked paint at joints, bends,etc. Even if the center tube is totally
airworthy, it is cause to look for other possible demons. The one way
i can see this tube getting bent with no other damage, is if maybe the
engine was dropped on it from at least a couple feet up, or perhaps if
the frame was dropped upside down during transport.
Sorry for the bad news, but almost anything is repairable, and hopefully
you will find that everything that needed repair on yours has been
done well.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rabbruzz(at)unlinfo.unl.edu (Ray Abbruzzese) |
>Hi all,
>
>I am almost afraid to ask this question since I think I know the answer.
Yes, you do. I would be afraid, also.
>I
>recently purchased a 1989 Firestar and have been flying it quite a bit. I
>had noticed that just under the engine recoil starter on the main steel tube
>of the fuselage is a dent of some sort. Also the tube itself seems to be
>bent a little. It almost looks like a kink that happened in the tube when
>the tube got bent. I looked at the blueprints and it did not show this tube.
My 1988 FireStar does not have the bend. It is as straight as an arrow.
>
>I have to assume that this happened from a hard landing which caused the
>weight of the engine to bend the tube, but it would seem to me to be
>strongest part of the plane and I can't imagine that being the case.
Imagine again. A VERY HARD landing could do it (such as a stall from 8 - 10
feet AGL) or someone may have simply dropped an engine on it while changing
engines. I also have a question: what size engine are you using ? FireStars
of that time were ONLY made for the Rotax 377 and there was MUCH
reinforcement that HAD to be done to the airframe in order to fly it with a
Rotax 447, 503, 582, etc. If you have a bigger engine than it was designed
for that MAY be the reason for the "dent". More horsepower = more thrust
bent airframe ???? In any case, I would STRONGLY URGE you to NOT fly it
again until you KNOW EXACTLY what is going on and why and have corrected it.
Dennis Souder (chief engineer and owner of Kolb Manufacturing) is on this
list and I am sure he will help you with this. I talked with several Kolb
people at OshKosh yesterday so he may not answer for a little while as the
"big show" does not end until Wednesday, but please do not fly it until you
have fixed what is wrong. Then again, what do I know ? I'm just one of those
mangy television engineers.
>I have
>been told by a new firestar builder that the dent is not there on his plane.
>
>Can anyone shed some light on this one?
>
>
>===============================
>Scott Olendorf / Kolb Firestar
>Schenectady, NY
>===============================
>
>
I hope this helps.
Ray Abbruzzese E-Mail at: rabbruzz(at)unlinfo.unl.edu
Lincoln, Nebraska, USA
Standard Disclaimer: These are my opinions and you all know about opinions
(they are like butts, everybody has one). I could be wrong and I probably
am. Just please do not sue me.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jason Omelchuck <jason(at)acuityinc.com> |
Depending on where this dent is you can guess on how it was caused. If
it was caused from overstressing the dent would be on the compression
side ie on the bottom if it were a hard landing or a prop strike on the
up side of the rotation. If it is dented on top my guess would be
somebody dropped something on it or maybe a prop strike on the down side
of the propeller. You definitely need to talk to Dennis at Kolb before
you fly any more. The other thing you need to do is follow and examine
every tube welded to this piece to see if it has bent or pulled anything
else out of line, keep in mind that it might not be the part directly
attached to the bent part, but a tube two or three down the line that
was deformed because of the stresses imposed. I recently had a accident
where an uncovered wing was dropped and the trailing edge dented. It
was amazing how much stuff got tweaked because of the slight dent and
bend in that section of tubing. Call the person who sold you the plane
and ask if they know how it happened, if it truly was a landing hard
enough to bend the tube some other parts were probably overstressed
also.
>----------
>From:
> Olendorf(at)aol.com@acuityinc.com[SMTP:Olendorf(at)aol.com@acuityinc.com]
>Sent: Sunday, August 04, 1996 7:59PM
>To: kolb(at)hpmail2.ftw.mot.com
>Subject: 89 Firestar
>
>Hi all,
>
>I am almost afraid to ask this question since I think I know the
>answer. I
>recently purchased a 1989 Firestar and have been flying it quite a bit.
> I
>had noticed that just under the engine recoil starter on the main steel
>tube
>of the fuselage is a dent of some sort. Also the tube itself seems to
>be
>bent a little. It almost looks like a kink that happened in the tube
>when
>the tube got bent. I looked at the blueprints and it did not show this
>tube.
>
>I have to assume that this happened from a hard landing which caused
>the
>weight of the engine to bend the tube, but it would seem to me to be
>strongest part of the plane and I can't imagine that being the case. I
>have
>been told by a new firestar builder that the dent is not there on his
>plane.
>
>Can anyone shed some light on this one?
>
>
>===============================
>Scott Olendorf / Kolb Firestar
>Schenectady, NY
>===============================
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bkearbey" <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
Hello all,
I went out and bought some of that Protect All that had been
mentioned earlier and used it on the windshield and gap seal. The
stuff works great! It really cleans the glass well. I would
recommend it for cleaning the lexan.
Brandon Kearbey
Kolb | - - - -
Mark III []-| - - - -
N52BK .====== | - - - ___ "HERB"
99% done . /| / | Brandon Kearbey
. / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.
. \_______/ |-----------/-----| butte.k12.ca.us
(_____________//----------------\^
/ o
( )Http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1041
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CAL <calvin(at)peoples.net> |
I'm getting ready to paint the metal parts on my firestar II. I've
been reading through the poly fiber manual, and they say use only Aero-thane
paint and there epoxy primer. I can get Dupont polyurethane (Imron) paint
and epoxy primer at cost, which would be a big savings compared to the cost
of Aero-thane. Has anybody ever used a paint other than Aero-thane? Will it
work?
Cal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HFritze(at)redstone.net (Hank Fritze) |
Just a couple of suggestions to Kolb builders:
When rigging the wings to the cage on Kolb airplanes, if the distance
from the center of the main spar carry thru to the the main spar clevis
pins are equal and the distance from the main spar clevis pins to the
lift strut clevis pins on the wings are the same and the distance from
the the main spar clevis pins and the lift strut clevis pins on the cage
are the same both vertically and diagonally, the length of the lift
struts must be the same.
My measurements were within 1/8" and yet, even though the wings were
level span-wise, my lift strut length meaurements differed by 1/2." I
was using a 3 foot carpenters level always in the same direction with a
lot of iteration.
An analysis of possible errors showed that the 1/2" difference could be
accounted for within the reading error of the level and the plumb bob!
The moral of the story is: trust a tape measure more than an ordinary
level. I made my lift struts the same length.
Another tip. don't drill the main spar clevis pin holes full size at the
same time or you will end up with a sloppy fit. Drill 1/8" first thru
all members (both fuselage tangs and the wing tang), then final drill
each separately. I actually predrilled the fuselage tang holes and
drilled the wing tang last.
HFritze
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don Ramsey <dramsey(at)ro.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing rigging |
When I was growing up, my father made a level using a length of garden
hose with glass tubes stuck in the ends. He filled the hose up with water
and you could see the water level(s) through the glass tubes. It seems to
me that you could use a similar level for doing things like getting your
wings level from the center out to the tip. If this is old hat to everyone,
forgive me for pointing out the obvious. I have yet to start building
anything, let alone a Mark III like I intend to end up with...
-- Don
(snip)
>Just a couple of suggestions to Kolb builders:
>An analysis of possible errors showed that the 1/2" difference could be
>accounted for within the reading error of the level and the plumb bob!
>The moral of the story is: trust a tape measure more than an ordinary
>level. I made my lift struts the same length.
(snip)
>
>HFritze
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
On Wed, 7 Aug 1996, CAL wrote:
> I'm getting ready to paint the metal parts on my firestar II. I've
> been reading through the poly fiber manual, and they say use only Aero-thane
> paint and there epoxy primer. I can get Dupont polyurethane (Imron) paint
> and epoxy primer at cost, which would be a big savings compared to the cost
> of Aero-thane. Has anybody ever used a paint other than Aero-thane? Will it
> work?
When I faced this I was told that epoxy primers are not much different.
One distinction however, is the chromate epoxies that are sold for aircraft
priming. I guess these offer superior corrosion resistance, especially
(or maybe only) for aluminum parts. I can't even remember what I used,
but I think it was from a local auto and crop duster paint supplier.
I trusted the vendor and went with his recommendation. As for Dupont,
I would think that's top quality stuff. The Avid or Kitfox show plane
is Imron as are many non-fabric homebuilts. For me, I used Stits
Polytone so didn't have to deal with the very stringent safety and
quality requirements of polyurethane.
Have fun.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
>On Wed, 7 Aug 1996, CAL wrote:
>> I'm getting ready to paint the metal parts on my firestar II. I've
>> been reading through the poly fiber manual, and they say use only Aero-thane
>> paint and there epoxy primer. I can get Dupont polyurethane (Imron) paint
>> and epoxy primer at cost, which would be a big savings compared to the cost
>> of Aero-thane. Has anybody ever used a paint other than Aerothane? Will it
>> work?
I am kind of a "duh" as concerns paint and painting, but I can tell you of
the experiences I have heard about or had happen on my project as concerns
the Stits products. If anyone out there knows better, please correct me.
Their Polytone system went on my plane just as the Stits manuel said it
would. Some guys had trouble with adhesion over the epoxy chromate if they
did not get the Polytone or Aerothane sprayed on before the epoxy got dry
(like within 30 minutes) or did not sand the surface (or sand it well
enough) of the epoxy chromate if allowed to cure before applicaton. I used
the overspray before completely dry method on all of the painted metal parts
I could. Sure is easier than sanding and I think made a better bond anyway.
I even tried rolling on the Polytone with the fine celled foam rollers now
available. It saved me from having to tape and mask off all of the inside
areas of the plane that I did not want to get overspray on. It worked
nicely on the fuselage fabric. You can only tell that it was rolled by
looking at the light transmitted through to the inside while looking from
the inside. You can see the roll lines. From the outside, the lines are
not visible.
Something I tried that will NOT work is rolling on the Polyspray. It leaves
tiny bubbles that do not pop and they dry to a rough surface.
I also used the reducer that evaporates slower. I was told that it is the
same as adding retarder to the more volatile formula. That saved me some
money and it gave me a nice shiny finish.
Questions I would ask myself about the Imron. Is the epoxy primer dissolved
by the Polytack cement used in application of the Polyfiber cloth?
(probably not) That can make an unholy mess when applying the fabric. Is
the Imron flexible enough to not crack and peel on the fabric surface? Talk
about ruining your day. Did you watch the Stits video showing how some
polyurothanes cracked and peeled off the fabric? You may also consider the
flamability of the Imron. In the video, there was a lot of time spent in
comparative burn tests. Check it out. Supposedly Aerothane has that
quality. I am not sure about Imron. I put Imron on a fiberglass Quickie I
built and it was beautiful and durable, but that was a hard surface you
can't punch your finger into.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (98%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Kearbey <kearbey(at)cnc.net> |
| Subject: | Weight & Balance |
Hello all you happy Kolb builders.
Our MarkIII is 99 9/10 finished!! But we did the weight and balance
today. Even with 25 lbs. of shot in the nose and a 150 lb pilot the cg
was still at 33%! I talked with a couple of Kolb pilots at Arlington Air
show and they said that one had to put weight in the nose of all Kolbs to
be pitch stable.
My questions are:
To those flying MarkIII's, where is your particular cg and do you put
weight in the nose?
Is it really stable at 33% or not? Should I fly it at 33% knowing it
will only get better as the fuel burns off or should I stuff more weight
in the nose. Of course, I could always get longer battery cables, I
suppose, and stuff the battery in the nose. I don't really like that idea
though!
I hope Dennis is listening and will respond to me (us). I hope that some
of you have experience with this and can comment also.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Heydasch <Heydaschr(at)worldnet.att.net> |
>
> I'm getting ready to paint the metal parts on my firestar II. I've
>been reading through the poly fiber manual, and they say use only Aero-thane
>paint and there epoxy primer. I can get Dupont polyurethane (Imron) paint
>and epoxy primer at cost, which would be a big savings compared to the cost
>of Aero-thane. Has anybody ever used a paint other than Aero-thane? Will it
>work?
>Cal
>
>
Hi Cal:
I am just about ready to order a Firestar 11 kit and I'm not an expert but I
have done a little reading on kitbuilding. In his book, "Kitplane
Construction", the author does not recommend mixing processes in any manner.
There is a possibility that the chemicals used in the Dupont product would
not be compatible with the Stitts chemicals if you went with the Stitts
covering process. Personally, I will go with Stitts all the way.
Good luck with your project!
Bob Heydasch
HeydaschR(at)worldnet.att.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Weight & Balance |
Bob and all...
I think the tendency toward aft CG (esp. solo) has been known for some time.
Pardon me if I am wrong and correct me if so but (from memory) in the
literature of the construction manuel doesn't it say that the design weight
was for a 180 lb pilot (and I assume the same weight for the passenger) and
that if you are light (say 150 more or less) that you should (or might have
to) carry some nose ballast (especially single place & full tanks)?. I am
sure all side-by-side designs with the seating in front of the normal CG
range and fuel behind it have the same tendency to be tail heavy in some
loading configurations.
I talked about this with Homer Kolb last year before I started construction
and asked him if cutting off up to 3.5" to 4" of fuselage tube (which I had
read that others had done and which I did) would be OK to possibly help that
situation. I am 155 lbs. and was concerned about the aft CG. Elsewhere in
the literature (a newsletter I think, but I am not sure) I read that
shortening the fuselage tube could cause instability in flight
characteristics and perhaps was not a good idea. I certainly did not want
that to happen. Mr. Kolb indicated to me that it would be OK to shorten the
fuselage up to that amount, but probably no more. No one wants to add
unnecessary weight to their plane, but at least the payload of the Kolb will
allow for the added ballast. I hope I will not have to add it to mine. I
have done preliminary weight and balance and I think that I will be within
limits. The lack of "C" gear box ("B" box instead) and electric start (each
behind the CG) helps in my case.
In addition to shortening the fuselage, I also clipped the wing tip bow the
same distance so that folded the wings would not stick out beyond the tail,
but that is a whole 'nother story.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (98%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Weber (DVNS)" <bweber(at)micom.com> |
On Wed, 7 Aug 1996, CAL wrote:
>
> I'm getting ready to paint the metal parts on my firestar II. I've
> been reading through the poly fiber manual, and they say use only Aero-thane
> paint and there epoxy primer. I can get Dupont polyurethane (Imron) paint
> and epoxy primer at cost, which would be a big savings compared to the cost
> of Aero-thane. Has anybody ever used a paint other than Aero-thane? Will it
> work?
> Cal
I strongly urge you to look into powder coating for all uncovered
metal parts, especially the fuselage cage. I painted about half the steel
parts myself before finding out about powder coating and wish I had found
out about it sooner. It came to about $250 for everything. Considering
all the time involved in cleaning, mounting, spraying etc, the choice was
a no-brainer. The shop had thousands of colors available and there was no
problem matching the Stits color I chose. I did do the tail boom myself
because it is fairly easy and transporting it to the powder coating shop
was problematic.
I would expect the Dupont products to work well. Just do as the manual
suggests and make sure it won't be hurt by the fabric glue before you
proceed very far. For best results, spray the color coat while the primer is
still tacky.
_-_ _,, ,,
-/ ) ; ||
||_< \\/\/\ _-_ ||/|, _-_ ,._-_ bweber(at)micom.com
|| \\ || | | || \\ || || || \\ ||
;/--|| || | | ||/ || |' ||/ || Keep the shiny
_--_-' \\/\\/ \\,/ \\/ \\,/ \\, side up
(
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Subject: Re: Weight & Balance |
Bob and all...
I think the tendency toward aft CG (esp. solo) has been known for some time.
Pardon me if I am wrong and correct me if so but (from memory) in the
literature of the construction manuel doesn't it say that the design weight
was for a 180 lb pilot (and I assume the same weight for the passenger) and
that if you are light (say 150 more or less) that you should (or might have
to) carry some nose ballast (especially single place & full tanks)?. I am
sure all side-by-side designs with the seating in front of the normal CG
range and fuel behind it have the same tendency to be tail heavy in some
loading configurations.
I talked about this with Homer Kolb last year before I started construction
and asked him if cutting off up to 3.5" to 4" of fuselage tube (which I had
read that others had done and which I did) would be OK to possibly help that
situation. I am 155 lbs. and was concerned about the aft CG. Elsewhere in
the literature (a newsletter I think, but I am not sure) I read that
shortening the fuselage tube could cause instability in flight
characteristics and perhaps was not a good idea. I certainly did not want
that to happen. Mr. Kolb indicated to me that it would be OK to shorten the
fuselage up to that amount, but probably no more. No one wants to add
unnecessary weight to their plane, but at least the payload of the Kolb will
allow for the added ballast. I hope I will not have to add it to mine. I
have done preliminary weight and balance and I think that I will be within
limits. The lack of "C" gear box ("B" box instead) and electric start (each
behind the CG) helps in my case.
In addition to shortening the fuselage, I also clipped the wing tip bow the
same distance so that folded the wings would not stick out beyond the tail,
but that is a whole 'nother story.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (98%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (98%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Weight & Balance |
To Brandon and all...
I know that Kolb put a 912 on theirs and what did they have to do to
>make it flyable?
Except for the added weight ballast (not sure how much, but it was attached
to the forward most part of the fuselage frame up in the nose cone) I don't
think they did anything else.
I know you talked about shortening the boom a
>couple of inches but that is a little late to do now!
...(actually it was 4") and I might add - certainly un-necessary and also
not recommended by Kolb.
Our concerns are
>if the plane is easily flyable at 33%. This 33% was with a 150 lb pilot
> and 25 lbs in the nose.
I just pulled out Page 42 of the Kolb manual and it states the percent CG
range should be: greater than 20% and less than 37%. I have heard or read
elsewhere (recorded as pencil notes in my manual margin) that the aft
conservative range is 35%. If your's is 33% (150 lb pilot solo, full fuel +
25 lbs in the nose), isn't that well within range at maximum aft loading
including nose ballast?
Why not give Kolb a call and discuss it with Dennis. While you have him on
the phone, ask him about the 912 installation and what they did if anything
except add nose ballast.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (98%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cliff & Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Weight & Balance |
Brandon and all...
>Well, we are just down to the details! Going over every inch
>tightening and adjusting. We are very close! It'll be about 400
>hrs. and we are just approaching 4 months since kit 1 arrived.
Wow! What progress!!!
In the excitement of the first few hours, don't forget the guys here on the
list. It would be great to hear reports of your first flights.
You may already have this advisory circular by the FAA, but if not get the
AC-90-89 Amateur-Build Aircraft Flight Testing Handbook.
Later,
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling He - Kolb MK III builder (98%) - N582CC
striplic(at)flash.net She - Dallas Re-Max residential real estate
Both - R/V travel enthusiasts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HFritze(at)redstone.net (Hank Fritze) |
| Subject: | Weight and balance |
I'm building a Firestar II. I got out the old "Airplane Aerodynamics"
book by Daniel O. Dommasch et al (fourth edition 1967, Pitman
Publishing). On page 446 in the chapter on "Longitudinal Stability and
Control" is a formula for calculating the Neutral Point of an aircraft.
This is the point where the longitudinal stability is neutral (fixed
controls).
For the Firestar II the calculated Neutral Point is at 37% of the mean
aerodynamic chord (about 23 inches of the 62 inch average chord).
This calculation was based on the following values:
Wing lift curve slope = 0.1
Taper ratio = 1.0
Aspect ratio = 5.3
Chord = 5.17 ft
Tail length = 12.8 ft (quarter chord of wing to hinge line of H-tail.
Wing area = 142 sq ft
H-tail area = 18.4 sq ft
The 37% calculated value compares nicely with Kolb's recommendation for
max aft cg.
Things that make n.p. worse: lowering aspect ratio (clipping wings),
shortening tail length, decreasing H-tail area.
Cordially
H Fritze
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Weight & Balance |
I shortened my fuselage by 3.5" for the w&b issue, as I am 150-155.
As I recall, this 3.5" moment arm pretty much offsets the 180-155
difference in pilot weight. My operating CG comes out something
like 4% points away from the aft limit. (Firestar KXP w/ 447). To
me, a 3.5" shorter fuselage meant better W&B for me, and if anything,
just a slightly more zippy tail control ...sounds kinda fun.
I haven't flown any other Firestars so can't compare stability, but I
can say that mine has no stability problems. Kinda wish i had made my
wings 3.5" shorter too, as that space would be very handy in my garage
to squeeze around the back of my plane. At the time i was unwilling
to tamper with the wings, as i felt that would be a different airplane.
3.5" off of each means a 7" shorter wing span and different wing ends,
both of which are fairly important in stall/spin characteristics). If
anybody else has shortened the wings on any of the Kolbs, it would be
good to hear about perfermance characterstics.
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
One more thing ...
Obviously, the advice to shorten the fuse' tube is late for anyone
99.9% finished.
The practical, possibly too obvious thing to do is simply to put
a seat pad behind your back, moving your 150 lb bod forward 3". I'd
do that before adding more ballast to the nose.
Or ...what about using a 3 foot Iron pitot tube and helium in the tail
feathers? :)
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kw012393(at)one.net |
I've had to move to a different airport (due to our former field closing -
after 70 years!) and the Firestar is now in an open T-hangar with no door.
It's now uncovered, but I would like to keep it covered (due to blowing
rain, bird "bombs", etc.)
Does anyone know of a cover cut specifically for the Firestar (so I can
eliminate the plastic tarpaulin routine)?
I will be very grateful to know the manufacturer, phone number, or whatever,
if such a covering system exists.
Thanks for any help you can give!
Happy landings,
Phil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kw012393(at)one.net |
Does anyone know of a cover cut specifically for the Firestar (so I can
eliminate the plastic tarpaulin routine)?
I've had to move to a different airport (due to our former field closing -
after 70 years!) and the Firestar is now in an open T-hangar with no door.
It's now uncovered, but I would like to keep it covered (due to blowing
rain, bird "bombs", etc.)
I will be very grateful to know the manufacturer, phone number, or whatever,
if such a covering system exists.
Thanks for any help you can give!
Happy landings,
Phil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DLSOUDER(at)aol.com |
To Kolb Builders,
When we installed the 912 we simply added some weight (about (20 lb.) in the
nose and went flying. We then started removing the weight gradually and
wound up eventually removing it all. We thus wound up with a C.G. at 40%
with our flight instructor (who weighs about 170 lb.). To our amazement the
Mark-III still stalls fairly well. This is how we are currently flying our
own Mark-III.
The Mark-III has been certified in England and they tested the C.G. as far
back as 39% and found that it still had adequate stall characteristics.
At 35-37%, all Kolb aircraft have good stall characteristics.
Even though we know the C.G. can be further back than 35%, we will be
officially leaving it at 35%, the margin is to absorb a certain amount of
scale error.
Eventually we will be exploring even more aft C.G. conditions. Our large
chord wing and large tail volume, would seem to help in handling a more aft
C.G. condition.
If anyone has any further questions on C.G. please feel free to ask.
Sincerely,
Dennis L. Souder
President, Kolb Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CAL <calvin(at)peoples.net> |
I was at oshkosh this year and I saw firestar II there, (the
guy did a beautiful job) that had electric trim on the rudder and the
elevator. Has any one here put them on? Do you think it's needed?
Oh yeah, I painted my metal parts with Imron I'll let you know what happens
when I cover it.
Cal,
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bkearbey" <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
> I saw a picture in EAA Experimenter where the piano wire was placed
> in the chuck of a hand held electric drill & I guess, drilled into
> the hinge. Seems like it would work. Let us know if you try it.
Yes, I tried it but I was taking out the wire. It worked very well.
Thanks for the tip whoever put it up a few weeks ago.
Kolb | - - - -
Mark III []-| - - - -
N52BK .====== | - - - ___ "HERB"
99% done . /| / | Brandon Kearbey
. / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.
. \_______/ |-----------/-----| butte.k12.ca.us
(_____________//----------------\^
/ o
( )Http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1041
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | andy <harley(at)gte.net> |
Hi all, new to your list, new to building ultralight aircraft,
FireFly is to arive today.
Any comments? or help?
Have built full scale before.
Jeff FL.
harley(at)gte.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | andy <harley(at)gte.net> |
Hi all, Jeff here.
Can anyone offer advice on painting the frame,type paint,primer?
Not being cheep here but there are lots of good paints.
Thanks harley(at)gte.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | stei0302(at)cs.fredonia.edu (Jon N. Steiger) |
>
>Hi all, new to your list, new to building ultralight aircraft,
>FireFly is to arive today.
> Any comments? or help?
Great! Another FireFly builder! :)
(Well, I'm not a FireFly builder yet, but I hope to be soon.) :)
At Oshkosh this year, I finally got to sit in the FireFly and get
a good look at it in the flesh. I like it even more now... :)
Its a good thing I was already determined to build this kit, because
between that and the ride I got with Dan in the Mark III, I'd have a
hard time convincing myself not to go for it. :)
Anyway, after seeing the FireFly, I had a few questions, most of which
I thought of after I left Oshkosh and most of which I have forgotten
by now. :) They keep cropping up though, so maybe I'll write them
down or something...
I noticed that the instrument panel is on the small side. There's not
a whole lot of room there, but I noticed that SkySports sells an instrument
that is about 3" (I think) which is a combination of 3 or of 4 instruments
in one. (You choose the instruments, and they custom build it) I was
thinking that this might be great for EGT, CHT, fuel, and perhaps VSI
(if possible). That would free up a whole lot of room so that I can make
the more important instruments bigger, and in more prominent positions.
Anybody tried those combo instruments?
On a related note, I'm having a hard time trying to keep my
"instrument wish list" small... I'm betting that there isn't a whole lot
of leeway for adding a bunch of heavy instruments. I do plan on using
the BRS, so I'll potentially have a few extra pounds to play with there...
What are the rest of you putting in your panels? My current
plan is to have the altimeter and airspeed to be the biggest, and in
positions where they can be easily read. EGT and CHT can be considerably
smaller. I noticed that Kolb had the hourmeter on the engine, so that'll
save space there. I think that does it for the "required" instruments.
I'd like to have a fuel meter, though that isn't absolutely a must, just
a nice convenience. Same goes for VSI. (hey, its Kolb! I want to know
how fast I'm climbing!) ;) I guess I can just use the altimeter and my
watch. :) Then there's the slip indicators, G-meters... See? There
I go again! :) A compass would probably be a good idea though...
As you can tell, I'm still pretty deep in the process of figuring out
what I want to do... I guess I don't really have to worry about this
stuff until it is pretty much done, but I would like to have an idea
of what I'm building, and not making up stuff at the last minute..
(I still have no idea what the paint job is going to look like. I have
no doubt that deciding that will be the most difficult part of the entire
building process.) :) Speaking of which... Where can I get samples
of the Stits colors available? (Not the actual paint, just a sheet
with the color names, a patch of color, and maybe a part # or something)
Does such a thing exist?
Speaking of paint (and I guess this is related to another thread on
the Kolb list), does anyone know what Kolb used to paint the metal
parts of the FireFly? Whatever it was, it looked (and felt) great!
I think I've tortured everyone enough... I'll just stop here. :)
-Jon-
.------------------------------------------------------------------------------.
| Jon Steiger: DoD# 1038, EAA #518210, USUA# A46209, NMA# 117376, KotWitDoDFAQ
|
| stei0302@cs.fredonia.edu && http://www.cs.fredonia.edu/~stei0302/ |
| '96 Dakota SLT V-8 Club Cab, '91 FZR600R /* Just another mangy hacker */
|
`------------------------------------------------------------------------------'
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | InteracSol(at)aol.com |
> I noticed that the instrument panel is on the small side. There's not
>a whole lot of room there, but I noticed that SkySports sells an instrument
>that is about 3" (I think) which is a combination of 3 or of 4 instruments
>in one. (You choose the instruments, and they custom build it) I was
>thinking that this might be great for EGT, CHT, fuel, and perhaps VSI
>(if possible). That would free up a whole lot of room so that I can make
>the more important instruments bigger, and in more prominent positions.
>Anybody tried those combo instruments?
Jon, check out the EIS and SuperEIS from Grand Rapids Technology
(multi-function displays designed especially for two-cycles). Also, Westach
makes 3- and 4-instrument combinations in virtually any configuration.
Westach: 707-938-2121 (ask for Roger Westberg), GRT: 616-531-4893 (ask for
Greg Toman). Incidentally, these instruments and about 400 more are in an
instrument panel layout software program called Panel Planner; for more info
call me at 208-323-8724.
Gordon Pratt
Panel Planner Software
Interactive Solutions, Inc.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "bkearbey" <bkearbey(at)bcoe.butte.k12.ca.us> |
Hello,
> I noticed that the instrument panel is on the small side. There's
> not
> a whole lot of room there, but I noticed that SkySports sells an
> instrument that is about 3" (I think) which is a combination of 3 or
> of 4 instruments in one. (You choose the instruments, and they
> custom build it) I was thinking that this might be great for EGT,
> CHT, fuel, and perhaps VSI (if possible). That would free up a
> whole lot of room so that I can make the more important instruments
> bigger, and in more prominent positions. Anybody tried those combo
> instruments?
Yes, we put the EIS in our Kolb and it works well. Other instruments
that we put in are, Altimeter, Airspeed, Comm Radio, intercom. a
Hobbs meter is included in the EIS so that is not necessary. You
must be careful though. Even though things fit on the panel doesn't
mean that there is enough foot room. Just plan things out first.
> Where can I get samples of the Stits colors available? (Not the
> actual paint, just a sheet with the color names, a patch of color,
> and maybe a part # or something) Does such a thing exist?
You can contact Poly fiber and get a color scheme. We got one from
them. Sorry, I don't have the number but I bet someone here can give
it out.
Brandon Kearbey
Kolb | - - - -
Mark III []-| - - - -
N52BK .====== | - - - ___ "HERB"
99% done . /| / | Brandon Kearbey
. / | / | bkearbey(at)ben.bcoe.
. \_______/ |-----------/-----| butte.k12.ca.us
(_____________//----------------\^
/ o
( )Http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/1041
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Franklin Hurst <fhurst(at)ecsis.net> |
Andy,I would suggest powder-coating all the metal
parts I could. We powder coat our motorcycle frames
and it really work's well,it is very tough & is harder
to chip than paint! It also comes in about as many
different colors as paint.
Franklin Hurst
fhurst(at)ecsis.net
----------
From: andy[SMTP:harley(at)gte.net]
Sent: Friday, August 16, 1996 7:17 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: paint
<>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
>Jon wrote:
> What are the rest of you putting in your panels? My current
> plan is to have the altimeter and airspeed to be the biggest, and in
> positions where they can be easily read. EGT and CHT can be considerably
> smaller. I noticed that Kolb had the hourmeter on the engine, so that'll
> save space there. I think that does it for the "required" instruments.
> I'd like to have a fuel meter, though that isn't absolutely a must, just
> a nice convenience. Same goes for VSI. (hey, its Kolb! I want to know
> how fast I'm climbing!) ;) I guess I can just use the altimeter and my
> watch. :) Then there's the slip indicators, G-meters... See? There
> I go again! :) A compass would probably be a good idea though...
>
Remember, the Firefly is supposed to be FAR103. As you suggested, more
than basic instruments and you might run out of weight, as well
as room. At least most of the instruments are plastic featherweight
anyway. For my money, i'm happy with the traditional instruments over
the more expensive Grand Rapids stuff (okay, i'm a cheapskate). I've
heard complaints regarding the traditionals compared to Grand Rap, but
find the traditional quite adequate.
My preference puts Airspeed 1st for visibility, and all other instruments
(cht/egt, rpm, altimeter) can just be in logical, available space.
In fact, I would classify altimeter as optional; nice to have but
definetly optional. I'd buy a good compass before an altimeter. In fact
i don't have a good compass; the one i had was too easily influenced by
the nearby frame and impossible to calibrate. (any recommendations?)
As for slip indicator, you could gluegun a 5" length of yarn to the
windscreen. ...works well, and pretty light :] My preference on
instruments for a UL are to stick with the minimums for safety, and
develop that other almost forgotten one -- the seat of your pants.
> building process.) :) Speaking of which... Where can I get samples
> of the Stits colors available? (Not the actual paint, just a sheet
> with the color names, a patch of color, and maybe a part # or something)
I thought that that color chart maybe came with the kit? If not you can
call a Stits dealer: Randy@ R&R (616)683-2594 (MI)
-have fun!
--------|--------
Ben Ransom (*)
UCD Mechanical Engineering Dept. o o
Email: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
http://mae.engr.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
(916) 752-1834
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russell Duffy <rad(at)gulf.net> |
Gretings all,
The weather wasn't as good as I had hoped last week when I was in PA, so
I didn't make it over to visit Kolb. I was afraid that I wouldn't get to
do all the flying that I needed to get my tailwheel endorsement, and I
had some computer duties to take care of at the in-laws house, so I
really couldn't justify the 10 hour round trip from where I was.
It looks like I'll be going to Cleveland for 4 weeks starting Sept 9th.
I talked to Dennis today and it sounds like they could probably get me
the first kit just before I leave, but the fuselage won't be ready until
about the time I get back in October. By mutual agreement, we decided
to wait until I get back and hopefully the full kit will be about ready
to ship. I hate going to these training schools in Cleveland anyway, and
it would be that much worse if I knew that my kit was sitting in the
garage while I was gone. Hopefully, I'll get the whole thing toward the
end of October and can actually start building.
Dennis, if the plans and builders manual is finished, I'd love to get
them before I leave so I can study in the hotel (for 4 loooong weeks).
--
Russell Duffy
rad(at)gulf.net
http://www.pcola.gulf.net/~rad/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | elklotz(at)fnet.friendlynet.com |
| Subject: | Mark 3 weight and balance |
Fellow Mark 3 builders,
Just finished doing a weight and balance on my fat little bird.
I went with the Rotax 582 with "c" gear box,72" 3 blade Ivoprop,BRS
under the fuselage, full compliment of gauges and an intercom for pilot
and passenger. Empty weight came to 496 lb.
I took several weight measurements while I had the plane on the scales.
I got numbers with myself in the plane, then added weight on the
passenger seat and also with different amounts of fuel in the tanks.
March 07, 1996 - August 19, 1996
Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-aa