Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-bf
December 29, 1998 - January 24, 1999
the job. Thank in advance.
Kent
________________________________________________________________________________
A humble word of caution to you MX flyers. Based on my experience (this
last summer) on the transition from a MX to Original Firestar, be
cautious. Make sure you have some current time in a conventional 3 axis
control aircraft. Flying the Kolb has been a joy from the first, landing
took some getting used to. My feet just didn't want to do the rudder
thing.
--
Happy Landings!!
Adam Violett
Original Firestar, 377
Quicksilver MX2A, 503
http://www.springhill-online.net/~violett/
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
I quit the list. Can't get my messages out.
Woody
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Espen Aarhus" <eshus(at)online.no> |
As vel as i know you have to use ordinary bungee from a Cub or simmular
aircraft here in Norway my friend Charles hav tried it out for about 350
hours the ordinary bungees from cub was the only thing holdin
this force if any questions just mail me and Charles vil ansver any
questions about it(sorry for my writing)
best regards Espen
----------
> From: Kenmead(at)aol.com
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: New Battery
> Date: 30. desember 1998 01:25
>
>
> Hi Guys;
> I was wondering if anyone has tried out one of those new 12 volt
starter
> batteries that weigh 1.6 lb. I know John H was using one and said it
cranked
> the engine fine, can't remember how many times. I was wondering how they
hold
> up over an extended period of time. Anybody know anything about them?
Also
> anyone using skies, what size bungee cord are you using to hold your skis
up.
> The only ones I can find around here are don't seem to be heavy enough to
do
> the job. Thank in advance.
>
> Kent
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Don't give up the ship ( plane ?? ) Woody. You're a good contributor.
Your Hirth engines sending is blank for sure, but there has to be a reason.
Big Lar.
----------
> From: wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net>
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Kolb-List: I Quit
> Date: Tuesday, December 29, 1998 5:30 PM
>
>
> I quit the list. Can't get my messages out.
>
> Woody
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
I think I mentioned in an earlier posting that I'm working on a way to vary
the tension on one rudder return spring, so I can fine tune the rudder trim
in the air. Similar to the way the elevator trim works. Seems to me that
the need will vary, depending on load, climb angle, throttle setting, etc.
Big Lar.
----------
> From: John Jung <jrjung(at)execpc.com>
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
> Date: Tuesday, December 29, 1998 12:41 PM
>
>
> Storm door springs work good on the rudder. Their cheap, and the are
plated.
> Just throw away the extra hardware.
> John Jung
>
> Scott Bentley wrote:
>
> >
> > One of the factory people told me when I assembled my Mark III to use
> > muffler springs rather than the original supplied springs for the
rudder.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Adrio Taucer <adrio(at)capitalnet.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Just an off the wall suggestion. As many (I think) others on this list
I have been in to RC aircraft. What about using an RC servo to control
a trim tab on the surface which controls the rotation in the axis you
wish to trim (on rudder, elevator or aileron). The circuit to control
the RC servo is very simple (a 555 timer and a couple of resistors and
capacitors). The servo is very light so the weight and balance penalty
even at that far a moment arm is not too great.
This might be something for a "tinkerer" in the group to try. I have
used these servos and a 555 circuit to control the opening of floor
heater vents remotely and it works fine.
Also I flew a Katana (DV20) which had electric elevator trim and a bar
LED indicator of trim position. It was activated by a momentary contact
rocker switch. It sure was nice to just push on that rocker switch
until the force on the stick was zero, then you were in trim.
For the electronics types on the list the position of an RC servo is
controlled by the width of a 5V square pulse. So you just have to set
up the 555 so that it varies the duty cycle such that the pulse width
goes from fully clockwise to fully counter clockwise. If any one wants
the exact values of the pulse width just ask me and I will look it up.
Adrio
Larry Bourne wrote:
>
>
> I think I mentioned in an earlier posting that I'm working on a way to vary
> the tension on one rudder return spring, so I can fine tune the rudder trim
> in the air. Similar to the way the elevator trim works. Seems to me that
> the need will vary, depending on load, climb angle, throttle setting, etc.
> Big Lar.
>
> ----------
> > From: John Jung <jrjung(at)execpc.com>
> > To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
> > Date: Tuesday, December 29, 1998 12:41 PM
> >
> >
> > Storm door springs work good on the rudder. Their cheap, and the are
> plated.
> > Just throw away the extra hardware.
> > John Jung
> >
> > Scott Bentley wrote:
> >
>
> > >
> > > One of the factory people told me when I assembled my Mark III to use
> > > muffler springs rather than the original supplied springs for the
> rudder.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Jim Baker" <jlbaker(at)telepath.com> |
Subject: | Re: Hirth engines |
> Hirth engines suck compared to same H.P. Rotax
> Our group tried one in place of a 503.
> Broke down 3 times first year - maybe 80 hours total.
> Sent it back to factory and got back what we could for it.
Gee...240 hrs on mine, two sets of plugs and haven't had to do
anything except seal one intake manifold leak.
J. Baker
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
From: | rbaker2(at)juno.com (Ray L Baker) |
Larry,
At a fly in I attended this fall, there was a Rans (a bit on the aged
side) for sale. I poked my head inside and observed what appeared to be
a vertical hand wheel (3 or 4 inch diameter). A light bungee ran from
the shaft rotated by the wheel to the control linkage. It appeared to be
used to adjust trim. I am sorry now that I did not take closer look.
It was located at the Flying Ten airfield SW of Gainesville, FL. If you
would like, and it is still there when EAA chapter 98 meets there
1/19/98, I will try to check it out.
L. Ray Baker
Lake Butler, Fl
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Jim Baker" <jlbaker(at)telepath.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
> What about using an RC servo to control
> a trim tab on the surface which controls the rotation in the axis you
> wish to trim (on rudder, elevator or aileron).
Not off the wall at all....in fact, already being sold in the av
magazines. If you look closely at the picture you can tell it's just a
std 1/4 scale servo (or larger....possibly a sail winch servo). As for
the control, the old ACE R/C used to have a servo pacer that would
work just fine for the purpose (a single turn pot to control the
position) though you'd have to amplify the signal for a really long
run and step the voltage down to 6 to 7.2v from the 12 or so
available.
J. Baker
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "John Hauck" <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
was wondering if anyone has tried out one of those new 12 volt starter
>batteries that weigh 1.6 lb. I know John H was using one and said it
cranked
>the engine fine, can't remember how many times. I was wondering how they
hold
Kent and Gang:
I wanted one of those new batteries and thought I had one, but when it came
down to the wire, I could have bought a Sling Shot kit for what they want
for one of those little batteries and their price to me was their cost. No
I haven't had a chance to try the battery and I am still using my Walmart
special 14 amp batteries that I have used since day one. If I ever go back
to the Arctic though, I will have a larger capacity battery or one of those
stick batteries as a back up. The Arctic can be a cold lonely place when
you can't get a fire built in the Rotax.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Hansen, Mark" <MHansen(at)ConusNews.com> |
Subject: | Spring for Rudder tension |
great idea. But just as a thought would a cordless screwdriver work better,
(it may have more power) (note: I don't mean a cordles drill)
> ----------
> From: Adrio Taucer[SMTP:adrio(at)capitalnet.com]
> Reply To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Tuesday, December 29, 1998 9:17 PM
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
>
>
> Just an off the wall suggestion. As many (I think) others on this list
> I have been in to RC aircraft. What about using an RC servo to control
> a trim tab on the surface which controls the rotation in the axis you
> wish to trim (on rudder, elevator or aileron).
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "John Hauck" <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
>
> I quit the list. Can't get my messages out.
>
>Woody
Hang in there, Woody:
Ya got your quitting msg out just fine.
Have you tried switching servers, modems, modem drivers, modem set ups, etc?
Must be some little glitch causing your mail not to get through.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | ul15rhb(at)juno.com (Ralph H Burlingame) |
Kent, I use a standard bungee cord and tie several knots into each one
to get the correct tension. It has to overcome heavy wet snow that would
accumulate on the tip of the ski. With the tailwheel on the ground and a
3" block in front of the axle, using 5-1/2' skis (converted water skis),
will give the correct angle for "tip-up". The axle would be 39" back from
the tip.
Ralph Burlingame
Original FireStar, equipped with skis
>anyone using skies, what size bungee cord are you using to hold your
>skis up.
>The only ones I can find around here are don't seem to be heavy enough
>to do
>the job. Thank in advance.
>
>
>Kent
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
The input is interesting. Thank you. I think the cordless screwdriver
would work in my application, but would be heavy and spendy. Never thought
of the RC servos - great idea, but my rudder's already built, and I'm not
real crazy about add-ons sticking out. At this point I'm noodling with 2
thoughts ( 1.) A floor mounted lever with notches like the elevator trim,
with a cable going forward around a pulley and back to the spring. ( 2.) I
already have a window crank mechanism - the kind where you turn the crank,
and a worm gear moves an arm back and forth. The arm could pull on the end
of the spring. Right now I've finally got the latch mechanism for the gull
wing doors figured out, and the pilots' side built. Beautiful: light, 3
point, lockable, very strong, and a thief will have to smash things to get
in. I hope to catch him in the act, and do some smashing of my own. I'll
be going after the rudder trim next. Big Lar.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Thank you, Ray: The leader of our local U/L club has an S-12, and I
took a long, hard look at the trim control. It's expensive ( A/C Spruce
sells the set up for something like $185.00 ) and once again would involve
major surgery on the tail. For a while, I thought of using that for the
elevators, and the factory set-up for the rudder. Probably a little
stubborn-ness there, plus I guess I chickened out a little. It would
probably be the best choice, though, all things considered.
Big Lar.
----------
> From: Ray L Baker <rbaker2(at)juno.com>
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
> Date: Tuesday, December 29, 1998 7:38 PM
>
>
> Larry,
> At a fly in I attended this fall, there was a Rans (a bit on the aged
> side) for sale. I poked my head inside and observed what appeared to be
> a vertical hand wheel (3 or 4 inch diameter). A light bungee ran from
>
> L. Ray Baker
> Lake Butler, Fl
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "John Hauck" <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
>
>I think I mentioned in an earlier posting that I'm working on a way to vary
>the tension on one rudder return spring, so I can fine tune the rudder trim
>in the air. Similar to the way the elevator trim works. Seems to me that
>the need will vary, depending on load, climb angle, throttle setting, etc.
> Big Lar.
Big Lar and Gang:
In the MK III the only time I need rudder trim, other than the offset I have
in the leading edge and the trim tab on the rudder, is during cruise flt.
Right foot get pretty tired keeping pressure on the right rudder pedal. On
really long XCs I can put my left foot on the right rudder pedal in front of
the left seat, I fly right seat. That way I can keep right pedal pressure
with both feet.
Yes, some sort of rudder pedal forced trim sounds like a good idea. I would
be interested.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Bluhm <irena(at)ccis.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Larry Bourne wrote:
> " I'm working on a way to vary
> the tension on one rudder return spring, so I can fine tune the rudder
> trim
> in the air."
Hey Big Lar,I have some "inlaw" family down there in Palm Springs..
(That isn't why I now write.) Now, about this trim problem, I am having.
I am trying a similar length spring (as furnished by Kolb) from Home
Depot, where a make-shift bracket is mounted to the left peddle for
added tension. I now realize the ease of flying using a trim tab
effect, so my indeavers will continue also. I have a few patients
(mechanics & the like) who are trying to find a small 12V servo motor
for me. The restriction is the weight allowance due to the placement
needs of this type of actuation. If this doesn't make too much sense,
then I'll just say that I used a trim-tab once and liked it's effects.
I want an adjustable trim-tab or some other means to have this effect I
liked. Could you keep me in mind for a reminder, should you accomplish
this inflight-adjustable tension gizmo? My next flight will use the
Home Depot spring I am using. I'll post it's effects on the list.
Good Luck
Doc
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry & Karen Cottrel" <lcottrel(at)kfalls.net> |
Subject: | Re: Heel Breaks to tight |
Hi,
If I understand correctly you have the "tin can" drums mounted on a wheel
barrow wheel? If so the difficulty is in drilling the holes for the drum to
mount to the wheel. I suggest that you get a bolt, or whatever will fit
into the bearings and stick it into a vise so that you can turn it on the
shaft. Figure out how far out from the shaft that the mounting holes are
and draw or scribe a line around the wheel by turning it on the shaft.
Drill three or four new holes on the line and you should be close enough to
overcome the dragging problem.
Larry
----------
> From: Gary Thacker <gthacker(at)mciunix.mciu.k12.pa.us>
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Heel Breaks to tight
> Date: Monday, December 28, 1998 9:08 PM
>
>
>
> I know I'm not the only one with this problem but wanted to know what you
> guy's have done to solve it.
>
> I have drum breaks on my FSII. As, I guess with all of em they are out
> of round. >
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Blued gun barrels will rust like crazy, you have to keep them lightly
oiled. Maybe a shot of WD-40 from time to time ??
One last comment on the rudder springs and I'll shut up - promise. You
know, even at this late date, I'm still not sure which way my prop will be
turning, driven off the transmission end of the VW engine. So I'm also not
sure - yet - which way I'm going to have to compensate with the rudder.
Big Lar.
----------
> From: Scott Bentley <Scott.Bentley(at)Bentley.COM>
> To: 'kolb-list(at)matronics.com'
> Subject: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
> Date: Tuesday, December 29, 1998 10:28 AM
>
>
> One of the factory people told me when I assembled my Mark III to use
> muffler springs rather than the original supplied springs for the rudder.
>
> We tried using gun barrel bluing to keep them from rusting with mixed
> results.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Bluhm <irena(at)ccis.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Hansen, Mark wrote:
> great idea. But just as a thought would a cordless screwdriver work
> better,
> (it may have more power) (note: I don't mean a cordles drill)
Hey Mark,
I had that idea, but my screwdriver is toooooooo heavy... And I'm not
talking about an electric drill. Remember that this must be mounted at
the rear of the rudder.. Do you realize what a 1 pound weeight will do
at that location? Second... How would you remotely activate the forward
& reverse actions???
Nice try
Doc
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Top End Running Problem |
<< t runs just fine at cruise and idle. What other things could cause this
problem?
>>
make sure the vent in your gas tank is not plugged. and don't hesitate to
remove your mikuni fuel pump and open it up and inspect for foreign
particles.........I had both problems, but my engine would quit completely at
high power..........worth lookin anyway.....................GeoR38
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Back to Rudder Pedals |
<<
Big Lar: I spent a lot of time making vroom, vroom noises also, it was also
a way to see if my petite body would fit in the MKIII. So have your fun
garage flying it only gets better.
Frank >>
Great Gobs of unmitigated diabolical genuine pristine crystalline FLAME!!...If
the list could only peruse that not so heavenly body!! Hi
Frank..................GeoR38
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Duncan McBride" <dmcbride(at)indigo.fgcu.edu> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
How come you don't use the tab to trim the Mk III for hands-off (feet-off?)
straight and level flight at cruise, where you spend most of your time, and
then just have to cope with pedal pressures while climbing?
-----Original Message-----
From: John Hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com>
>In the MK III the only time I need rudder trim, other than the offset I
have
>in the leading edge and the trim tab on the rudder, is during cruise flt.
>Right foot get pretty tired keeping pressure on the right rudder pedal. On
>really long XCs I can put my left foot on the right rudder pedal in front
of
>the left seat, I fly right seat. That way I can keep right pedal pressure
>with both feet.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "CHRISTOPHER DAVIS" <cdavis2(at)capecod.net> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Ray
>Larry,
>At a fly in I attended this fall, there was a Rans (a bit on the aged
>side) for sale. I poked my head inside and observed what appeared to be
>a vertical hand wheel (3 or 4 inch diameter). A light bungee ran from
>the shaft rotated by the wheel to the control linkage. It appeared to be
>used to adjust trim. I am sorry now that I did not take closer look.
>
>It was located at the Flying Ten airfield SW of Gainesville, FL. If you
>would like, and it is still there when EAA chapter 98 meets there
>1/19/98, I will try to check it out.
>
>L. Ray Baker
>Lake Butler, Fl
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "F J MARINO" <FMARINO(at)netlink1.nlcomm.com> |
Big lar: Ron Christensen, out there close to you had some kind of trim set
up on his MKIII1/2, why don't you talk to him, in the pictures he sent me it
looked like a lever by the control stick with cables to the rudder pedals.
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: Larry Bourne <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Wednesday, December 30, 1998 12:14 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Rudder Trim
>
>The input is interesting. Thank you. I think the cordless screwdriver
>would work in my application, but would be heavy and spendy. Never thought
>of the RC servos - great idea, but my rudder's already built, and I'm not
>real crazy about add-ons sticking out. At this point I'm noodling with 2
>thoughts ( 1.) A floor mounted lever with notches like the elevator trim,
>with a cable going forward around a pulley and back to the spring. ( 2.) I
>already have a window crank mechanism - the kind where you turn the crank,
>and a worm gear moves an arm back and forth. The arm could pull on the end
>of the spring. Right now I've finally got the latch mechanism for the gull
>wing doors figured out, and the pilots' side built. Beautiful: light, 3
>point, lockable, very strong, and a thief will have to smash things to get
>in. I hope to catch him in the act, and do some smashing of my own. I'll
>be going after the rudder trim next. Big Lar.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "F J MARINO" <FMARINO(at)netlink1.nlcomm.com> |
Big Lar; I have a rudder trim on my MKIII, the factory sent some drawings a
few years ago and I made one, looks like hell (but better looking than
Ge0R38's "Fire Star") any way the trim tab works great once I got it set up.
George has a trim tab on the elevator of his FS but his looks like he has
two more elevators.
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: Larry Bourne <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Wednesday, December 30, 1998 12:14 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Rudder Trim
>
>The input is interesting. Thank you. I think the cordless screwdriver
>would work in my application, but would be heavy and spendy. Never thought
>of the RC servos - great idea, but my rudder's already built, and I'm not
>real crazy about add-ons sticking out. At this point I'm noodling with 2
>thoughts ( 1.) A floor mounted lever with notches like the elevator trim,
>with a cable going forward around a pulley and back to the spring. ( 2.) I
>already have a window crank mechanism - the kind where you turn the crank,
>and a worm gear moves an arm back and forth. The arm could pull on the end
>of the spring. Right now I've finally got the latch mechanism for the gull
>wing doors figured out, and the pilots' side built. Beautiful: light, 3
>point, lockable, very strong, and a thief will have to smash things to get
>in. I hope to catch him in the act, and do some smashing of my own. I'll
>be going after the rudder trim next. Big Lar.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Rob Reynolds" <rfreynol(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
I've seen several planes that use MAC servos for electric trim. They work
great!
-Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: Adrio Taucer <adrio(at)capitalnet.com>
Date: Tuesday, December 29, 1998 7:13 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
>
>Just an off the wall suggestion. As many (I think) others on this list
>I have been in to RC aircraft. What about using an RC servo to control
>a trim tab on the surface which controls the rotation in the axis you
>wish to trim (on rudder, elevator or aileron). The circuit to control
>the RC servo is very simple (a 555 timer and a couple of resistors and
>capacitors). The servo is very light so the weight and balance penalty
>even at that far a moment arm is not too great.
>
>This might be something for a "tinkerer" in the group to try. I have
>used these servos and a 555 circuit to control the opening of floor
>heater vents remotely and it works fine.
>
>Also I flew a Katana (DV20) which had electric elevator trim and a bar
>LED indicator of trim position. It was activated by a momentary contact
>rocker switch. It sure was nice to just push on that rocker switch
>until the force on the stick was zero, then you were in trim.
>
>For the electronics types on the list the position of an RC servo is
>controlled by the width of a 5V square pulse. So you just have to set
>up the 555 so that it varies the duty cycle such that the pulse width
>goes from fully clockwise to fully counter clockwise. If any one wants
>the exact values of the pulse width just ask me and I will look it up.
>
>
>Adrio
>
>Larry Bourne wrote:
>>
>>
>> I think I mentioned in an earlier posting that I'm working on a way to
vary
>> the tension on one rudder return spring, so I can fine tune the rudder
trim
>> in the air. Similar to the way the elevator trim works. Seems to me
that
>> the need will vary, depending on load, climb angle, throttle setting,
etc.
>> Big Lar.
>>
>> ----------
>> > From: John Jung <jrjung(at)execpc.com>
>> > To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>> > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
>> > Date: Tuesday, December 29, 1998 12:41 PM
>> >
>> >
>> > Storm door springs work good on the rudder. Their cheap, and the are
>> plated.
>> > Just throw away the extra hardware.
>> > John Jung
>> >
>> > Scott Bentley wrote:
>> >
>>
>> > >
>> > > One of the factory people told me when I assembled my Mark III to use
>> > > muffler springs rather than the original supplied springs for the
>> rudder.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Rob Reynolds" <rfreynol(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
This is the standard RANS trim system. You can buy it from them, or from
LEAF. I think the entire system, including trim tabs, linkages, trim wheel,
and trim indicator runs about $180
-Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: Ray L Baker <rbaker2(at)juno.com>
Date: Tuesday, December 29, 1998 7:52 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
>
>Larry,
>At a fly in I attended this fall, there was a Rans (a bit on the aged
>side) for sale. I poked my head inside and observed what appeared to be
>a vertical hand wheel (3 or 4 inch diameter). A light bungee ran from
>the shaft rotated by the wheel to the control linkage. It appeared to be
>used to adjust trim. I am sorry now that I did not take closer look.
>
>It was located at the Flying Ten airfield SW of Gainesville, FL. If you
>would like, and it is still there when EAA chapter 98 meets there
>1/19/98, I will try to check it out.
>
>L. Ray Baker
>Lake Butler, Fl
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Adrio Taucer <adrio(at)capitalnet.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
I agree about the weight concern, at that moment arm it is a big
issue. However I would not put the servo mechanism (whatever it is) at
the rear of the rudder, rather I would mount it forward of the control
surface (trying to keep the centre of mass of the moving surface forward
of the centre of effort). I was thinking one could use a "golden rod"
cable I think they were called (kind of like a light version of a
bicycle brake cable) to get the mechanical motion from the servo
(mounted on the stabilizer or boom) back to the rear of the rudder).
Richard Bluhm wrote:
>
>
> Hansen, Mark wrote:
>
> > great idea. But just as a thought would a cordless screwdriver work
> > better,
> > (it may have more power) (note: I don't mean a cordles drill)
>
> Hey Mark,
> I had that idea, but my screwdriver is toooooooo heavy... And I'm not
> talking about an electric drill. Remember that this must be mounted at
> the rear of the rudder.. Do you realize what a 1 pound weeight will do
> at that location? Second... How would you remotely activate the forward
> & reverse actions???
> Nice try
> Doc
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "John Hauck" <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
>
>How come you don't use the tab to trim the Mk III for hands-off (feet-off?)
>straight and level flight at cruise, where you spend most of your time, and
>then just have to cope with pedal pressures while climbing?
Howdy Duncan and Gang:
That is my ultimate goal, cruise straight and level with no pedal pressure
to keep her trimmed.
She will fly trimmed up with no power. Add power and the nose goes left,
912 pusher prop turns counterclockwise.
Added trim tab on rudder. Helped some, but not enough. Displaced leading
edge of vertical stabilizer more than an inch to left. That got me to
within a half ball width of trim at 80 mph cruise. However, I lost a lot of
effectiveness with that move because the vert stab curved. If I ever
rebuild the vert stab I will adjust it to be straight in its offset
position. This will require cutting the lower tube stub and rewelding.
I like Big Lar's idea of using adjustable forced trim on the rudder cable or
pedal. Something to take the load off the right pedal during XCs.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Ron Christensen" <SPECTRUMINTERNATIONAL(at)email.msn.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Hey Larry;
You may recall seeing my rudder tension control arrangement which is
controllable from the cockpit. IMHO, you rarely need to change the rudder
tension, so the effort of building such a device is of questionable utility.
I almost never use mine.
Ron Christensen
MKIII1/2
===========================================
>I think I mentioned in an earlier posting that I'm working on a way to vary
>the tension on one rudder return spring, so I can fine tune the rudder trim
>in the air. Similar to the way the elevator trim works. Seems to me that
>the need will vary, depending on load, climb angle, throttle setting, etc.
> Big Lar.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Frank, Christie & Frank Hodson" <fchodson(at)bigfoot.com> |
Could be that you are sending your messages in HTML format instead of in
"plane" text format. Check your email settings. I believe that the Kolb
list is only accepting plain text email (because of the size) while most all
of the current email programs email in HTML format by default.
Franklin E. Hodson III
fchodson@bigfoot.com |http://www.bigfoot.com/~fchodson
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Erich Weaver 805-683-0200 <sbaew(at)dames.com> |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
Autoforwarded: false
UA-content-id: 11CCF2AE1500
Hop-count: 1
Hey guys
I suffered a set back in my bid to get in the air with my Mrk III. Had a
Rotax 912 mounted with a warp drive prop, but got a prop strike upon
start up. Strike was on flap control arm and on the tapered basket on
rear of fuselage (This is an old style Mrk III with the back of fuselage
tapered). Damage to plane can be fixed without too much trouble, but do
need to replace one blade of prop, and find the best solution.
Obviously, more clearance was needed. The fastest way to get clearance
is to add a spacer for the prop, but my mechanic is reluctant to add a
four inch spacer, because with the weight of the warp drive prop, this
could damage or quickly wear the gearbox.
Who out there has a 912 with a warp drive prop on a Mrk III? How much
clearance do you have from the flap control arm? Are you using a spacer?
If so, what size? I prefer the warp drive prop, but perhaps I just need
to go to the IVO prop with less weight so that the spacer isnt a problem?
Dont be shy; I need to learn.
Thanx,
Erich Weaver
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Bluhm <irena(at)ccis.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Duncan McBride wrote:
> How come you don't use the tab to trim the Mk III for hands-off
> (feet-off?)
> straight and level flight at cruise, where you spend most of your
> time, and
> then just have to cope with pedal pressures while climbing?
Hello Duncan,
I must support my position with a brief discription of my problem. I am
in my sixty's, I have work habbits where the heaviest thing I lift is a
pencil. My body is not in good shape. As a matter of fact, whenever I
feel like I could use some exercise, I will lay down until that feeling
goes away...I have become spoiled, fat and probably will die before my
time from lack of body use...
After I flew with the trim-tab, I knew this was MUCH easier than
without, so my attempts now are to have the effects of a trim-tab. I
will probably have to learn to control the ground effects with a
trim-tab, but I want to look elsewhere before I resort to this. I must
rev the engine many times while parking the plane due to the uneven,
holy (not devine), cow-marked area I call a cow-pasture. These rev's
will almost deny a right turn as well as forcing a left turn. Take-offs
cannot include full throttle starts unless left turns are allowed before
speed is reached. So,,,,,, If there is an alternative, I wish to give
the effort of looking... I hope you will not be correct, but you just
may be right in this message of yours.
Doc
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Duncan McBride" <dmcbride(at)indigo.fgcu.edu> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
I didn't mean to suggest that rudder trim wouldn't be worthwhile, just that
if you didn't have a way to adjust the rudder trim in flight, the desired
fixed trim would be hands-off at cruise speeds. I haven't flown a Mk III, I
just ordered the wing kit last month. But it sounds like there is a
significant trim change from high-power/low speed to cruise power/cruise
speed and an inflight adjustable rudder trim would be useful.
Most powered planes have the fin offset to achieve hands-off cruise. Sounds
like John Hauck tried this but there wasn't enough play to get enough offset
to do the job. Has anyone experimented with attaching the vertical fin
offset for a right turn?
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Bluhm <irena(at)ccis.com>
Date: Wednesday, December 30, 1998 2:05 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
>
>Duncan McBride wrote:
>
>> How come you don't use the tab to trim the Mk III for hands-off
>> (feet-off?)
>> straight and level flight at cruise, where you spend most of your
>> time, and
>> then just have to cope with pedal pressures while climbing?
>
>Hello Duncan,
>I must support my position with a brief discription of my problem. I am
>in my sixty's, I have work habbits where the heaviest thing I lift is a
>pencil. My body is not in good shape. As a matter of fact, whenever I
>feel like I could use some exercise, I will lay down until that feeling
>goes away...I have become spoiled, fat and probably will die before my
>time from lack of body use...
>After I flew with the trim-tab, I knew this was MUCH easier than
>without, so my attempts now are to have the effects of a trim-tab. I
>will probably have to learn to control the ground effects with a
>trim-tab, but I want to look elsewhere before I resort to this. I must
>rev the engine many times while parking the plane due to the uneven,
>holy (not devine), cow-marked area I call a cow-pasture. These rev's
>will almost deny a right turn as well as forcing a left turn. Take-offs
>cannot include full throttle starts unless left turns are allowed before
>speed is reached. So,,,,,, If there is an alternative, I wish to give
>the effort of looking... I hope you will not be correct, but you just
>may be right in this message of yours.
>Doc
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "John Hauck" <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
>Dont be shy; I need to learn.
>
>Thanx,
>Erich Weaver
>
Hang in there Erich:
I have been flying with 3 blade warp drive. Had slight startup strike on
flap horn and rear of leading edge tube of flap.
I had a friend turn me a prop extention out of alum round with stainless
steel shims (for torque). I think it is 2.75 inches. I'll have to measure
when I go to airstrip. I'll also try to remember to measure clearance on
flap horn.
I don't recommend going to ivo, which flexes more than warp, and requires
longer extention. Ivo uses an extention that has no provision for torque.
Prop bolts take all the stress in shear.
If you have a chance to look at my airplane, you will see some small pieces
of black tape on the flap tube. It is covering up a ding from the prop on
the left flap. Added the tape on the right flap to make it symetrical.
Black electrical tape works miracles. Can cover up lots of things and dings
with it.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
<< Big Lar; I have a rudder trim on my MKIII, the factory sent some drawings
a
few years ago and I made one, looks like hell (but better looking than
Ge0R38's "Fire Star") any way the trim tab works great once I got it set up.
George has a trim tab on the elevator of his FS but his looks like he has
two more elevators.
Frank >>
one thing all of you seem to be missing on this trim tab business is the fail
safe aspect of the fixed tab on the elevator, and no spring approach, such as
Frank M has in his MKIII. I used to have a pteradactyl and could fly it all
day without touching any directional control stick.....I could reach out and
pull on the guys and fly like ol wilbur and Orville, by wing warping....course
no one can warp the sturdy wing on the Kolb aircraft, but one thing I did was
add a trim tab on my elevator (ugly as it is) for the sole purpose of enabling
me to fly my plane in for a landing using only the throttle in case I somehow
lost elevator control completely ....just like on my pterodactyl , it was
totally controllable by throttle for up/down and wing warpable for left/right
control.........If I lose the rudder on the kolb I still have the
ailerons.......just an extra check and balance that is important to probably
no one but me...........GEEZ.....I even have a Chute!!. .GeoR38......the
ol glider pilot who thinks fail safe
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
<< I must support my position with a brief discription of my problem. I am
in my sixty's, I have work habbits where the heaviest thing I lift is a
pencil. My body is not in good shape. As a matter of fact, whenever I
feel like I could use some exercise, I will lay down until that feeling
goes away...I have become spoiled, fat and probably will die before my
time from lack of body use... >>
Doc, I love the way you write.........you gotta great sense of humor GeoR38,
the ol glider pilot who just turned 60 and immediately survived a heart
attack....my worst year)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Frank_R_Reynen(at)notes.seagate.com |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
Hi John,
I had already decided to go with the IVO for my 912 engine conversion
including the extension and I am puzzled by your comment below about the
IVO extension not having provisions for torque.
Can you elaborate on this some more?
Frank Reynen MKIII@485hrs Still looking for that cheap but perfect (only
slightly used) 912
I don't recommend going to ivo, which flexes more than warp, and requires
longer extention. Ivo uses an extention that has no provision for torque.
Prop bolts take all the stress in shear.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
A few thoughts about trim: I have a trim tab on the rudder of my MKIII that
is about one rib-space long, and 1 1/2" wide. Since I am using a 532 with a
B box, the tab points to the right, pushing the rudder left. With this tab,
the yaw string stays pretty much straight up all the time, dual or solo.
I think with the 912, it has to go the other way (?).
I have an adjustable trim tab on the right aileron. It is made from Lexan,
and has a control horn from an RC model at the outboard end. I used a
couple very small diameter model airplane bolts with large diameter flat
washers and lock nuts to hold the trim tab semi-snugly on, so that it
flexes up and down when I push the control horn.
The control rod that goes into the control horn is clamped under a
washer/wingnut/safety ring that is attached to the outboard end of the
aileron.
When I remove the safety ring, I can turn the wingnut, and slide the
control rod forward or backward to push the control horn and adjust the
trim tab.
Normally it uses no trim with two people, and trim down when solo.
Maybe I just got lucky, but this worked real effortlessly for the trip
to/from Oshkosh this summer.
I have a note on the preflight checklist to check the trim tab for
dual/solo setting. If I forget, and it is wrong, it is just a nuisance.
DO NOT put any more weight toward the rear edge of the rudder that you
can
help. I put a nav light at the rear of mine, and had to put a big
counterbalance out the front to cure major flutter.
I think if I were to try an adjustable rudder trim tab, I would use the
same arrangement as the aileron: model airplane RC control horn, and a
pushrod/pushtube with an adjustable fixture at the airframe end.
Fortunately, my fixed tab works OK.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "John Hauck" <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
Kolb-List message posted by: Frank_R_Reynen(at)notes.seagate.com
>
>Hi John,
>I had already decided to go with the IVO for my 912 engine conversion
>including the extension and I am puzzled by your comment below about the
>IVO extension not having provisions for torque.
>Can you elaborate on this some more?
Hi Guys:
I cannot for the life of me remember the proper nomenclature for the drilled
studs on the prop flange of the 912 and on Continentals and Lycomings.
Where's the Grey Baron? help me out, please. Anyhow their purpose in life
is to take the shear load created by the rotation of the prop shaft instead
of the prop bolts. With this configuration, prop bolts only purpose is to
have something to practice safety wiring on and to keep the prop from flying
off. The HP Hub by Warp Drive is drilled to accept these shims or studs.
My homemade prop extention is drilled on one side to accept prop flange
studs and other side has stainless steel studs to mate up with Warp Drive HP
Hub. My prop extention is turned from a solid billet.
Ivo, to the best of my knowledge, uses an alum tube drilled to accept prop
bolts and does not make use of these shear studs in prop flange. I am a nut
for making things very strong and maybe my prop extention is going
overboard, but I don't want to lose that big prop in flight that near the
tail boom and tail section.
Check with Kolb on the Ivo prop and extention on their MK III and 912. They
can tell you how it is set up.
I remember on my 582 prop flange, there were studs that screwed into the
flange to carry torque and shear loads instead of prop bolts. I believe
these are removed from the 582 flange to accept the Ivo extention, but I
could be wrong. Won't be the first time. Some of you guys out there with
that set up help us out please.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Rutledge Fuller" <rut007(at)hotmail.com> |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
Frank Reynen MKIII@485hrs Still looking for that cheap but perfect
(only
slightly used) 912
Call Glenn Rink at (850) 592-5891 or 592-8547. He has a 912 with all
the AD's with less than 100 hours on it. Including an aluminum large
cap. fuel tank, EIS, hydrolic drakes, wheels and tundra tires all off
of a crashed Mark III.
Rutledge Fuller
Tallahassee,Fl.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
>
>Hi Guys:
>
>I cannot for the life of me remember the proper nomenclature for the drilled
>studs on the prop flange of the 912 and on Continentals and Lycomings.
>Where's the Grey Baron? help me out, please.
Here's the Old Poop instead, do you mean drive lugs? That's what they are
called in Tony Bingelis' book.
Anyhow their purpose in life
>is to take the shear load created by the rotation of the prop shaft instead
>of the prop bolts. With this configuration, prop bolts only purpose is to
>have something to practice safety wiring on and to keep the prop from flying
>off. The HP Hub by Warp Drive is drilled to accept these shims or studs.
>My homemade prop extention is drilled on one side to accept prop flange
>studs and other side has stainless steel studs to mate up with Warp Drive HP
>Hub. My prop extention is turned from a solid billet.
>
>Ivo, to the best of my knowledge, uses an alum tube drilled to accept prop
>bolts and does not make use of these shear studs in prop flange.
This is correct. It is a very thickwalled hollow tube, 3" long, with six
holes through it lengthwise that the prop bolts go through.
>
>Check with Kolb on the Ivo prop and extention on their MK III and 912. They
>can tell you how it is set up.
>
>I remember on my 582 prop flange, there were studs that screwed into the
>flange to carry torque and shear loads instead of prop bolts. I believe
>these are removed from the 582 flange to accept the Ivo extention, but I
>could be wrong. Won't be the first time. Some of you guys out there with
>that set up help us out please.
>
>john h
The 582/532 B box has twelve holes in it, 6 are tapped to 1/4" and 6 are
tapped for 8mm.
Question: since neither the Ivo or the Warp Drive hub comes with any
provision for drive lugs to augument the torque/shear load carried by the
bolts, why would it make any difference if there was an extension or not?
The rotational torque is carried by the frictional load exerted by the
bolts squeezing the prop between the faceplate and the hub, would an
extension change anything? I'm not an engineer, just seems logical to me...
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Frank_R_Reynen(at)notes.seagate.com |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
OK, now I understand what you mean and you are correct in that the IVO does
not have or can use these studs but instead rely on friction (from the
preloaded prop bolts) between the mated surfaces in addition to the bolt
shear stress to transfer the torque to the prop blades. It is interesting
to note that the max torque output from a 582 with 3:1 gearbox is nearly
equal to the 912 with a 2.27ratio at the prop flange and may be the reason
IVO is using the same mounting style.
Frank R
Kolb-List message posted by: Frank_R_Reynen(at)notes.seagate.com
>
>Hi John,
>I had already decided to go with the IVO for my 912 engine conversion
>including the extension and I am puzzled by your comment below about the
>IVO extension not having provisions for torque.
>Can you elaborate on this some more?
Hi Guys:
I cannot for the life of me remember the proper nomenclature for the
drilled
studs on the prop flange of the 912 and on Continentals and Lycomings.
Where's the Grey Baron? help me out, please. Anyhow their purpose in life
is to take the shear load created by the rotation of the prop shaft instead
of the prop bolts. With this configuration, prop bolts only purpose is to
have something to practice safety wiring on and to keep the prop from
flying
off. The HP Hub by Warp Drive is drilled to accept these shims or studs.
My homemade prop extention is drilled on one side to accept prop flange
studs and other side has stainless steel studs to mate up with Warp Drive
HP
Hub. My prop extention is turned from a solid billet.
Ivo, to the best of my knowledge, uses an alum tube drilled to accept prop
bolts and does not make use of these shear studs in prop flange. I am a
nut
for making things very strong and maybe my prop extention is going
overboard, but I don't want to lose that big prop in flight that near the
tail boom and tail section.
Check with Kolb on the Ivo prop and extention on their MK III and 912.
They
can tell you how it is set up.
I remember on my 582 prop flange, there were studs that screwed into the
flange to carry torque and shear loads instead of prop bolts. I believe
these are removed from the 582 flange to accept the Ivo extention, but I
could be wrong. Won't be the first time. Some of you guys out there with
that set up help us out please.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Frank_R_Reynen(at)notes.seagate.com |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
My engineering instincts tell me that the lugs design if carried al the way
through to the prop blades as John did, could increase the safety margin
of this design by unloading prop bolt shear stresses. My question is;
Anybody out there ever lost an IVO using a hub extension due to shearstress
failure of the bolts while maintaining proper preload?
Frank Reynen(powerless MKIII)
PS; just sold my 582 but are still looking for a home for the C-box and
66"IVO props
>
>Hi Guys:
>
>I cannot for the life of me remember the proper nomenclature for the
drilled
>studs on the prop flange of the 912 and on Continentals and Lycomings.
>Where's the Grey Baron? help me out, please.
Here's the Old Poop instead, do you mean drive lugs? That's what they
are
called in Tony Bingelis' book.
Anyhow their purpose in life
>is to take the shear load created by the rotation of the prop shaft
instead
>of the prop bolts. With this configuration, prop bolts only purpose is to
>have something to practice safety wiring on and to keep the prop from
flying
>off. The HP Hub by Warp Drive is drilled to accept these shims or studs.
>My homemade prop extention is drilled on one side to accept prop flange
>studs and other side has stainless steel studs to mate up with Warp Drive
HP
>Hub. My prop extention is turned from a solid billet.
>
>Ivo, to the best of my knowledge, uses an alum tube drilled to accept prop
>bolts and does not make use of these shear studs in prop flange.
This is correct. It is a very thickwalled hollow tube, 3" long, with
six
holes through it lengthwise that the prop bolts go through.
>
>Check with Kolb on the Ivo prop and extention on their MK III and 912.
They
>can tell you how it is set up.
>
>I remember on my 582 prop flange, there were studs that screwed into the
>flange to carry torque and shear loads instead of prop bolts. I believe
>these are removed from the 582 flange to accept the Ivo extention, but I
>could be wrong. Won't be the first time. Some of you guys out there with
>that set up help us out please.
>
>john h
The 582/532 B box has twelve holes in it, 6 are tapped to 1/4" and 6
are
tapped for 8mm.
Question: since neither the Ivo or the Warp Drive hub comes with any
provision for drive lugs to augument the torque/shear load carried by the
bolts, why would it make any difference if there was an extension or not?
The rotational torque is carried by the frictional load exerted by the
bolts squeezing the prop between the faceplate and the hub, would an
extension change anything? I'm not an engineer, just seems logical to me...
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Cavuontop(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
In a message dated 12/30/98 5:47:35 PM Eastern Standard Time,
Frank_R_Reynen(at)notes.seagate.com writes:
<< Anybody out there ever lost an IVO using a hub extension due to shearstress
failure of the bolts while maintaining proper preload? >>
I asked both Dennis and the ivo guys about this a while back and there were
no reports.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
I just unsubscribed subscribed again hope it helps
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | back again -test |
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | swultra <swultra(at)primenet.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Larry Bourne wrote:
>
>
> Blued gun barrels will rust like crazy, you have to keep them lightly
> oiled. Maybe a shot of WD-40 from time to time ??
>
>
> One last comment on the rudder springs and I'll shut up - promise. You
> know, even at this late date, I'm still not sure which way my prop will be
> turning, driven off the transmission end of the VW engine. So I'm also not
> sure - yet - which way I'm going to have to compensate with the rudder.
> Big Lar.
>
> ----------
> > From: Scott Bentley <Scott.Bentley(at)Bentley.COM>
> > To: 'kolb-list(at)matronics.com'
> > Subject: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
> > Date: Tuesday, December 29, 1998 10:28 AM
> >
>
> >
> > One of the factory people told me when I assembled my Mark III to use
> > muffler springs rather than the original supplied springs for the rudder.
> >
> > We tried using gun barrel bluing to keep them from rusting with mixed
> > results.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
Larry I was thinking the same thing on my geo eng. for my mark-3.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "John Hauck" <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
john h
>
> Question: since neither the Ivo or the Warp Drive hub comes with any
>provision for drive lugs to augument the torque/shear load carried by the
>bolts, why would it make any difference if there was an extension or not?
>The rotational torque is carried by the frictional load exerted by the
>bolts squeezing the prop between the faceplate and the hub, would an
>extension change anything? I'm not an engineer, just seems logical to me...
> Richard Pike
> MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
Richard and Gang:
I know my memory is not that bad, there were drive lugs on my C Gear Box
prop flange. They were solid and one end was threaded and the other slotted
for a common screw driver. If you don't use anti-seize when installed,
you'll need visegrips to get them out. My Warp Drive HP Hub has provision
to mate up to the drive lugs on the 912 prop flange.
I think the extension ivo uses might change a few things. If what you say
is true, ref frictional load applied by the prop bolts, then if we reduce
the area of friction, aren't we also adding to the shear/torque force
applied to the bolts??? Aren't we also extending the arm which creates more
leverage??? I don't know. Just food for thought.
I do know I have not broken a prop bolt on the 912. I broke them quite
regularly on the b gear box 447 and on the c gear box 582.
When I fly the factory aircraft, I fly without drive lugs. Have had no
problem with them, but don't put near the hours on them as I do my own
aircraft.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | bob n <ronoy(at)shentel.net> |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
Dang, here was my one chance to get a gold star on my Post calendar.You
mean them hollow tube thing-ys that take the shear load off the prop
bolts? I was told many years ago they were prop shear tubes, but can't
recall exact name. I'm THINKING, BION. GB
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | back again -test |
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Kim Steiner <steiner(at)spreda.sk.ca> |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
I have added a Ivo prop extension between my C drive and three blade 66 inch
Warp drive prop. It has worked great for close to 100 hours. It has
reduced prop noise and vibration. I have an original Kolb Mark 111 (582
Rotax) with the streamlined fairing that came within a few inches of the
prop. My kit came from Kolb in 1991. My original wood prop had short
torque studs that were about 5/16 inch in diameter (I think they are
actually metric). The wood prop only used 1/4 inch aircraft bolts as a
means of attachment. I believe the torque studs were an additional safety
measure due to the small diameter prop bolts. The Warp drive prop uses the
same number of thicker metric bolts and no torque studs.
Kim Steiner
Saskatchewan, Canada
P.S. I had a great flight on Sunday with wheel - skis (0 degrees F)
Reach me by ICQ. My ICQ# is 4551867 or,
* Page me online through my Personal Communication Center:
http://wwp.mirabilis.com/4551867 (go there and try it!) or,
* Send me E-mail Express directly to my computer screen
4551867(at)pager.mirabilis.com
For downloading ICQ at http://www.icq.com/
For adding similar signatures to your e-mail go to:
http://www.icq.com/emailsig.html
Brian "Kim" Steiner
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
For your consideration. I am working on a small DC motor with a piece of
all-thred attached. A trim tab with a nut attached to the control horn. Switch
in the cockpit is center off spring return in either direction so you can apply
opposite polarities. One way runs the nut out (pushes the tab up) the other way
runs the nut in (pulls the tab down). So far it looks good on the bench.
--
Happy Landings!!
Adam Violett
Original Firestar, 377
Quicksilver MX2A, 503
http://www.springhill-online.net/~violett/
> What about using an RC servo to control a trim tab on the surface which
> controls the rotation in the axis you
> wish to trim (on rudder, elevator or aileron).
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Please keep us up to date on your progress with that Geo engine. I'll bet
it's a gonna be a good one. Thanks. Big Lar.
>
> > >
> > >
> >
> Larry I was thinking the same thing on my geo eng. for my mark-3.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Hi Frank: And Ron, too. I'm not ignoring you, honest. Frank, I went
and looked at Ron's Mk III 1/2 about 1 1/2 yrs. ago, and it's magnificent.
Even took quite a few pics of it, but unfortunately not of the trim
mechanism. I remember it having the trim, but for the life of me, I can't
remember the set-up. Think I've got a semi-permanent attack of CRS
disease. I keep begging Ron to come to one of our U/L club meetings, (
we're only about 50 or so miles from Chino ) so that my buddies and I can
crawl all over it, but I think he's worried about me drooling on it.
Honest Ron, I promise I'll clean it up before you leave.
Big Lar.
----------
> From: F J MARINO <FMARINO(at)netlink1.nlcomm.com>
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Rudder Trim
> Date: Wednesday, December 30, 1998 6:23 AM
>
>
> Big lar: Ron Christensen, out there close to you had some kind of trim
set
> up on his MKIII1/2, why don't you talk to him, in the pictures he sent me
it
> looked like a lever by the control stick with cables to the rudder
pedals.
>
> Frank
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Woody Weaver <mts0140(at)ibm.net> |
Woody,
Welcome back!
Woody
wood wrote:
>
>
> I just unsubscribed subscribed again hope it helps
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | ToddThom(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
As an FYI, I think a word of caution is appropriate here regarding prop
extensions. In my opinion the IVO prop extesnion is a cheap ($40) and simple
but potentially dangerous device. There is no way to ensure or maintain
runout with in tolerences. (Mine is 2 Ks max. The prop bolts take all the
shear. Not a good thing. Runouts (vibrations) cause undue wear and tear on
your gear box and aircraft frame.
If you have a "friend" machine an extension you should think in terms of what
type of metal to use. Aluminum is common and light but there are many types
to choose from. (Prop extesnions should be made from 2024T) Machining
technques require very carefull attenstion to the radii so that no chatter
marks exist. This is where flexing forces will focus and cause cracks. The
aluminum should be annodised and this can be very difficult with some types of
aluminum specially with the type used for extesnions. This type of aluminum
is also very hard to machine correctly in this application. Much to the
surprise of some people Aluminum does "rust" and become weaker over time if
not properly cared for. This rust is in the form of oxidation and produces
white residue powder or "salt".
The extesnion should be designed and machined to absorb the shear and
torsional loads placed on it by the engine coming on and off the throttle and
the flexing of the propellor otherwise your gear box is going to have to
absorb these loads and it will suffer - at the least opportune moment.
All in all, I would not trust a "friend" to cut a prop extension. This is an
exacting science. I would find a machinist who understands the aircraft
environment in which this extension will be applied.
I used the apportunity to move from the 75 mm bolt pattern to 100. My
extension is machined out like a thread spool and center drilled to lighten.
It was annodised to prevent oxidation. It was expensive but the benefits are
real. Pulling the prop away from the trailing edge gets the prop into less
turbulated air. This produces greater lift and a side benefit is that the
prop noise is lessened. And I have the confidence to know that this part is
built to not fail. Its one aircarft part that does not keep me up at night.
If the prop you are using flexes a lot and you want to use an extension you
had better make sure its going to take the loads imposed on it. Think of it
this way. YOu've already spend some 10-20 K on your aircraft. Is it worth it
to basement build a prop extension using the wrong type of aluminum,
incorrect radii, runouts exceeding acceptable professional levels and lastly
only saving a couple of hundred dollars?
If you're interested in getting a prop extension here is one person you can
contact. This person makes prop extensions for Lycoming. They are considered
by many to be the finest in the industry. SHE KNOWS WHAT SHE IS DOING. More
importanlty she can design one for your specific application.
Judy Saber
Saber Manufacturing http://www.long-ez.com/Extension.html
She used to be in Florida but has recently moved to Arizona. I think she is
Scottsdale/Phoenix area.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Wally Hofmann" <whofmann(at)eudoramail.com> |
Does anyone have any experience with the HVLP spray guns that use a normal compressor
as opposed to a dedicatd turbine? They sell for $75 to $150. Thanks and
Happy New Year to all.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Wally Hofmann
Wickenburg, Arizona
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
ps. Close to covering the 'Fly'
Join 18 million Eudora users by signing up for a free Eudora Web-Mail account at http://www.eudoramail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Cavuontop(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: HVLP sprayers |
In a message dated 12/31/98 12:02:19 PM Eastern Standard Time,
whofmann(at)eudoramail.com writes:
<< Does anyone have any experience with the HVLP spray guns that use a normal
compressor as opposed to a dedicatd turbine? >>
I had an excellent experience with one I bought from the Harbor Freight
company. I used the Stitts process and tought myself how to use the gun. It
was pretty easy and cost less than paying someine to paint the plane for me.
I thought it came out pretty good. See my web page at
The N496BM
Homepage
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | ToddThom(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: HVLP sprayers |
Are you saying that you bough a Harbor Freight SPray guy and used it on an
HVLP system and had great results or bought a HB spray guy and used it on a
standard compressor? This is important to distinguish. Thanks
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Cavuontop(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: HVLP sprayers |
In a message dated 12/31/98 12:35:30 PM Eastern Standard Time,
ToddThom(at)aol.com writes:
<< Are you saying that you bough a Harbor Freight SPray guy and used it on an
HVLP system and had great results or bought a HB spray guy and used it on a
standard compressor? This is important to distinguish. Thanks >>
I bought their cheapo $89 HVLP gun that you run of a standard compressor.
It worked great. I don't think I would say that if I painted planes for a
living, but for what I did it was a super buy. They also have a touch up gun
for something like $30. I used that for the striping. I think it is a
Taiwanese copy of a Binks gun. Anyway the small one was great too. Good
luck.
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: HVLP sprayers |
No direct experience, though a neighbor has a Sharpe unit that he is
happy with (for automotive finishes). But for other opinions (or other
people to ask), check out:
http://www.horizonweb.com/wwwboard/spray_101/wwwboard.html
Marc Robertson
marc@blackberry-ridge.com
Wally Hofmann wrote:
>
>
> Does anyone have any experience with the HVLP spray guns that use a normal compressor
as opposed to a dedicatd turbine? They sell for $75 to $150. Thanks
and Happy New Year to all.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Wally Hofmann
> Wickenburg, Arizona
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> ps. Close to covering the 'Fly'
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Frank_R_Reynen(at)notes.seagate.com |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
John,
The total frictionforce transmitted is independent from the surface area
and only changes with loadforce (propbolt preload) and friction coefficient
which depends on the topography and hardness of the two surfaces.The
extension of the arm is in the horizontal direction and adds a little to
the radial loads in the propshaft bearings which in this application are
very small compared to the inline or axial forces the bearings have to
absorb to push the plane foreward.
What do you think caused the propbolts to break on your C-box if standard
torque and methods were applied? I have not broken one in close to 500 hrs
on my 3bl IVO with extension and C-box on a 582 and checked the preload
every 25 hrs or so and only on one occasion did I find a low torque value
on one bolt.
Frank Reynen
I think the extension ivo uses might change a few things. If what you say
is true, ref frictional load applied by the prop bolts, then if we reduce
the area of friction, aren't we also adding to the shear/torque force
applied to the bolts??? Aren't we also extending the arm which creates
more
leverage??? I don't know. Just food for thought.
I do know I have not broken a prop bolt on the 912. I broke them quite
regularly on the b gear box 447 and on the c gear box 582.
When I fly the factory aircraft, I fly without drive lugs. Have had no
problem with them, but don't put near the hours on them as I do my own
aircraft.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "John Hauck" <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
>What do you think caused the propbolts to break on your C-box if standard
>torque and methods were applied? I have not broken one in close to 500 hrs
>on my 3bl IVO with extension and C-box on a 582 and checked the preload
>every 25 hrs or so and only on one occasion did I find a low torque value
>on one bolt.
>
>Frank Reynen
Frank and Gang:
Have no idea. However, was not a big deal. I always carry a couple spare
prop bolts just in case. I always detected the broken bolt during
preflight, so did not present a problem, and never broke more than one at a
time. Did not happen often and may have been the Hauck luck syndrome again,
or still.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Jim Baker" <jlbaker(at)telepath.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
> For your consideration. I am working on a small DC motor with a piece of
> all-thred attached. A trim tab with a nut attached to the control horn. Switch
> in the cockpit is center off spring return in either direction so you can apply
> opposite polarities. One way runs the nut out (pushes the tab up) the other
way
> runs the nut in (pulls the tab down). So far it looks good on the bench.
> --
> Happy Landings!!
> Adam Violett
For further consideration, call and get one of these catalogs....lots
of neat stuff for ideas like Adam's. Has the threaded rod, helix rod,
and other engineering items.
Small Parts 1-800-220-4242
J. Baker
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
For your consideration. I am working on a small DC motor with a piece of
all-thred attached. A trim tab with a nut attached to the control horn.
Switch in the cockpit is center off spring return in either direction so
you can apply opposite polarities. One way runs the nut out (pushes the
tab up) the other way runs the nut in (pulls the tab down). So far it looks
good on the bench.
--
Happy Landings!! Adam Violett
Several years ago I used an electric screwdriver to actuate the flaps on
the J-6. The screwdriver was set up to run on three volts, and I used a
resistor to drop the aircraft's 12 volts to about 8, and it worked pretty
good. The screwdriver turned a length of all-thread either way to either
raise or lower the flaps. It would kill the battery if you wern't careful tho.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: HVLP sprayers |
From: | rayul(at)juno.com (Raymond L Lujon) |
>snip<
>Does anyone have any experience with the HVLP spray guns that use a
>normal compressor as opposed to a dedicatd turbine? They sell for $75
>to $150. Thanks and Happy New Year to all.
>
>Wally Hofmann
Wally......I painted my plane with a Turbine Sprayer CX-7 (high volume,
low pressure). It had the Sherwin Williams name on it. It was
manufactured by Graco Industries. This unit sprays at only 5 psi and
there is no overspray.
Don't confuse this high quality sprayer with the cheap " squirt " guns
they use to spray fences, decks, etc. My unit cost $350 used. New units
will cost $550 and up. Sounds like a vacuum cleaner. Used the Stits
process. Results excellent. Best if used in moderate temps and low
humidity. My unit is for sale. If interested, contact me off list.
Ray
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Tom Wormsley <tomsw(at)bellsouth.net> |
Subject: | Re: HVLP sprayers |
> Does anyone have any experience with the HVLP spray guns that use a normal compressor
as opposed to a dedicatd turbine? They sell for $75 to $150. Thanks
and Happy New Year to all.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Wally Hofmann
> Wickenburg, Arizona
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
Hi Wally,
I have never used the turbine type, but did use a Sharp gravity feed HVLP spray
gun. Compared to a standard gun it uses a lot more air. My 5hp compressor ran
almost constantly but it
did maintain pressure. Also noticed that there was much less overspray in the
air. I was very happy with the results. This was also the first time I had used
a gravity feed gun.
Compared to the suction type the gravity feed cup is much easier to fill and
I think less likely to leak. I don't think I'll ever go back to a standard gun.
Hope this helps.
Tom
FSII N8035W
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "F J MARINO" <FMARINO(at)netlink1.nlcomm.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Ole Poops: This has nothing to do with tail springs, I have the MKIII in
the garage for the winter and removed the exhaust to check the rings and
pistons, the rings move in easy and pop out easy also I found no carbon on
the pistons and no scratches on the cylinder walls or pistons. I'm almost
reluctant to change any thing. I have 57 hours and never changed the jet
setting that came from the factory, the only thing I did was to change plugs
about every 10 hours, I also use penzoil in the oil injector tank and high
test fuel. So with all that I just might leave well enough alone. What do
you guys think. Put it back together or tinker. I know what geor38 would
say, but I don't listen to him no how.
PS I am changing my tail wheel to what John Hauck has on his MKIII. I hope
it works out ok.
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com>
Date: Thursday, December 31, 1998 4:03 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
>
>For your consideration. I am working on a small DC motor with a piece of
>all-thred attached. A trim tab with a nut attached to the control horn.
>Switch in the cockpit is center off spring return in either direction so
>you can apply opposite polarities. One way runs the nut out (pushes the
>tab up) the other way runs the nut in (pulls the tab down). So far it looks
>good on the bench.
>--
>Happy Landings!! Adam Violett
>
> Several years ago I used an electric screwdriver to actuate the flaps on
>the J-6. The screwdriver was set up to run on three volts, and I used a
>resistor to drop the aircraft's 12 volts to about 8, and it worked pretty
>good. The screwdriver turned a length of all-thread either way to either
>raise or lower the flaps. It would kill the battery if you wern't careful
tho.
> Richard Pike
> MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
>
>Ole Poops: This has nothing to do with tail springs, I have the MKIII in
>the garage for the winter and removed the exhaust to check the rings and
>pistons, the rings move in easy and pop out easy also I found no carbon on
>the pistons and no scratches on the cylinder walls or pistons. I'm almost
>reluctant to change any thing. I have 57 hours and never changed the jet
>setting that came from the factory, the only thing I did was to change plugs
>about every 10 hours, I also use penzoil in the oil injector tank and high
>test fuel. So with all that I just might leave well enough alone. What do
>you guys think. Put it back together or tinker. I know what geor38 would
>say, but I don't listen to him no how.
It's risky to "inspect" somebody elses engine based on their visual
analysis, but if my engine looked the way you are describing your engine, I
would probably button it back up, and then pull the exhaust off every 20 or
25 hours and keep checking it until it began to change. If there is NO
carbon, NO sticking, and EVERYTHING looks clean and good, I would just keep
checking it, I wouldnt pull mine down.
takes about a half hour to pull the exhaust off, look and poke, and bolt it
back together. So why not just check it every 20 hours?
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Mick Fine <froghair(at)busprod.com> |
Subject: | Re: Mrk III prop clearance problem |
>
>....Aluminum is common and light but there are many types
>to choose from. (Prop extesnions should be made from 2024T) ...
Take these comments for what they're worth, I'm not a metalurgist but I
have been machining aircraft parts for the last 13 years or so. 6061-T6 is
probably more common, usually machines a little better and is still PLENTY
adequate for a prop spacer. I believe 7075-T6 would be equal or superior to
2024-T3 in this application but now I'm just nit-pickin'.
>.... The
>aluminum should be annodised and this can be very difficult with some
types of
>aluminum specially with the type used for extesnions. ...
Annodizing a prop spacer is just throwing money away -IMHO. It does make it
look very pretty 'though. Annodizing makes the surface very hard and is
great for a surface that wears such as a pulley on a belt reduction drive.
I don't think there should be much friction on a properly torqued prop
spacer. As for corrosion protection, I'd lose more sleep worrying about my
wing ribs. My guess is they'll rot-away long before a thick piece of
material like a prop spacer.
>...All in all, I would not trust a "friend" to cut a prop extension.
This is an
>exacting science. I would find a machinist who understands the aircraft
>environment in which this extension will be applied. ...
Maybe I should be flattered but I bet most any machinist who knows his way
around a lathe and a drill press can probably whip-out a decent spacer
(IMHO). He doesn't have to have made parts for the Shuttle! $482 for a 6"
extension seems a little steep for me!
Happy New Year!
-Mick Fine
Tulsa, Oklahoma
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/froghair
Green Country Ultralight Flyer's Organization (UFO)
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/gcufo
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | swultra <swultra(at)primenet.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Larry Bourne wrote:
>
>
> Please keep us up to date on your progress with that Geo engine. I'll bet
> it's a gonna be a good one. Thanks. Big Lar.
>
> >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > Larry I was thinking the same thing on my geo eng. for my mark-3.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
Hi larry and group, I just recived my redrive from raven, Im useing
there small ul drive,dry sump and mount kit. I got my Ivo 72" inflight
adjustable prop a couple of weeks ago. Im running coumpass avionics
duell coumpter and duell distribtorless ingions, It also gives you in
flight adjustable fuel mixture control. there is a guy in canada all
ready runing the tubro set up on a beaver with floats he clames it is a
real rocket ship. I was looking at my prop and I belive it will turn
counter clock wize.. I just finished the wing gap seal what a bogger!
See ya Steve Ward Mark-3
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | rick106(at)juno.com |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
FRANK
It sounds like all is OK with the free movement of the rings if their is
no carbon on top of the piston I would make sure that the gaskets are in
good shape ,and then put her back together for the next flight, did you
do a compression check?
Rick
writes:
>
>
>Ole Poops: This has nothing to do with tail springs, I have the MKIII
>in
>the garage for the winter and removed the exhaust to check the rings
>and
>pistons, the rings move in easy and pop out easy also I found no
>carbon on
>the pistons and no scratches on the cylinder walls or pistons. I'm
>almost
>reluctant to change any thing. I have 57 hours and never changed the
>jet
>setting that came from the factory, the only thing I did was to change
>plugs
>about every 10 hours, I also use penzoil in the oil injector tank and
>high
>test fuel. So with all that I just might leave well enough alone.
>What do
>you guys think. Put it back together or tinker. I know what geor38
>would
>say, but I don't listen to him no how.
>
>PS I am changing my tail wheel to what John Hauck has on his MKIII. I
>hope
>it works out ok.
>
> Frank
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com>
>To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>Date: Thursday, December 31, 1998 4:03 PM
>Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
>
>
>>
>>For your consideration. I am working on a small DC motor with a piece
>of
>>all-thred attached. A trim tab with a nut attached to the control
>horn.
>>Switch in the cockpit is center off spring return in either direction
>so
>>you can apply opposite polarities. One way runs the nut out (pushes
>the
>>tab up) the other way runs the nut in (pulls the tab down). So far it
>looks
>>good on the bench.
>>--
>>Happy Landings!! Adam Violett
>>
>> Several years ago I used an electric screwdriver to actuate the
>flaps on
>>the J-6. The screwdriver was set up to run on three volts, and I used
>a
>>resistor to drop the aircraft's 12 volts to about 8, and it worked
>pretty
>>good. The screwdriver turned a length of all-thread either way to
>either
>>raise or lower the flaps. It would kill the battery if you wern't
>careful
>tho.
>> Richard Pike
>> MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Ken Murphey <kenmurphey(at)yahoo.com> |
Anyone on the list have experience with this model Kolb . I found one
used and would like some feedback on how this model performs. Cruise
speed , never exceed speed, stall speed. Any safety concerns?
Has a Cuyuna engine 35hp belt drive. Does the Kolb factory have a web
site or email address?
Thanks
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Ron Christensen" <SPECTRUMINTERNATIONAL(at)email.msn.com> |
Big Lar wrote;
>Hi Frank: And Ron, too. I'm not ignoring you, honest. Frank, I went
>and looked at Ron's Mk III 1/2 about 1 1/2 yrs. ago, and it's magnificent.
>Even took quite a few pics of it, but unfortunately not of the trim
>mechanism. I remember it having the trim, but for the life of me, I can't
>remember the set-up. Think I've got a semi-permanent attack of CRS
>disease. I keep begging Ron to come to one of our U/L club meetings, (
>we're only about 50 or so miles from Chino ) so that my buddies and I can
>crawl all over it, but I think he's worried about me drooling on it.
>Honest Ron, I promise I'll clean it up before you leave.
>Big Lar.
>
===============
Larry, you are MUCH too generous with your remarks; thank you. I'll visit
your U/L club meeting as soon as I get the 40 hours flown off (about 30 to
go as of yesterday). As for the in-cockpit rudder control I made, it looks
nice, but it is not "strong" enough to do the job; it won't deflect the
rudder enough. I ended up adding a fixed trim tab to my rudder and one to
my left aileron to achieve a hands & feet off condition in cruise flight.
They are made of Lexan and really don't show badly. It seems to me that
after all-is-said-and-done, the fixed tabs are best. As someone posted,
they are fail-safe. I haven't used my in-cockpit rudder trim, although I
might if I fly a long XC with a cross wind.
Ron Christensen
MKIII1/2
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "F J MARINO" <FMARINO(at)netlink1.nlcomm.com> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
Rick: thanks for the reply, I'm sticking it back together as we speak, I
ordered new gaskets from Leaf should be here any day, also rewired the egt,s
always had problems with one gage found out it was the wires. Actually I'm
just going over every thing while it is in the garage, it also is due an
annual inspection. In three months I'll be flying again, to cold to putzs
around now. My buddy ole gilder pile it Geor38 flies around with a 60lb snow
mobile suit which is bright orange, you can see him 60 miles away, he's not
too bright only his suit.
Frank
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: rick106(at)juno.com <rick106(at)juno.com>
Date: Friday, January 01, 1999 12:16 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
>
>FRANK
>It sounds like all is OK with the free movement of the rings if their is
>no carbon on top of the piston I would make sure that the gaskets are in
>good shape ,and then put her back together for the next flight, did you
>do a compression check?
>Rick
>
> writes:
>>
>>
>>Ole Poops: This has nothing to do with tail springs, I have the MKIII
>>in
>>the garage for the winter and removed the exhaust to check the rings
>>and
>>pistons, the rings move in easy and pop out easy also I found no
>>carbon on
>>the pistons and no scratches on the cylinder walls or pistons. I'm
>>almost
>>reluctant to change any thing. I have 57 hours and never changed the
>>jet
>>setting that came from the factory, the only thing I did was to change
>>plugs
>>about every 10 hours, I also use penzoil in the oil injector tank and
>>high
>>test fuel. So with all that I just might leave well enough alone.
>>What do
>>you guys think. Put it back together or tinker. I know what geor38
>>would
>>say, but I don't listen to him no how.
>>
>>PS I am changing my tail wheel to what John Hauck has on his MKIII. I
>>hope
>>it works out ok.
>>
>> Frank
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com>
>>To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>>Date: Thursday, December 31, 1998 4:03 PM
>>Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
>>
>>
>>>
>>>For your consideration. I am working on a small DC motor with a piece
>>of
>>>all-thred attached. A trim tab with a nut attached to the control
>>horn.
>>>Switch in the cockpit is center off spring return in either direction
>>so
>>>you can apply opposite polarities. One way runs the nut out (pushes
>>the
>>>tab up) the other way runs the nut in (pulls the tab down). So far it
>>looks
>>>good on the bench.
>>>--
>>>Happy Landings!! Adam Violett
>>>
>>> Several years ago I used an electric screwdriver to actuate the
>>flaps on
>>>the J-6. The screwdriver was set up to run on three volts, and I used
>>a
>>>resistor to drop the aircraft's 12 volts to about 8, and it worked
>>pretty
>>>good. The screwdriver turned a length of all-thread either way to
>>either
>>>raise or lower the flaps. It would kill the battery if you wern't
>>careful
>>tho.
>>> Richard Pike
>>> MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
<< also I found no carbon on
the pistons and no scratches on the cylinder walls or pistons. I'm almost
reluctant to change any thing. I have 57 hours and never changed the jet
setting that came from the factory, the only thing I did was to change plugs
about every 10 hours, I also use penzoil in the oil injector tank and high
test fuel. So with all that I just might leave well enough alone. What do
you guys think. Put it back together or tinker. I know what geor38 would
say, but I don't listen to him no how. >>
Frank, Ol buddy, I think YOU should change plugs every 7.5 hours.
............GeoR38
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "F J MARINO" <FMARINO(at)netlink1.nlcomm.com> |
Ron and Big Lar, I also used the fixed trims on the rudder and left aileron,
I made mine out of "aluminum" which looks kind of ugly but it flies hands
off. I suppose when I take some one heavy like George I'll have to adjust
the trim tabs. I tokk my two neices for a ride and didn't notice to much as
when I fly solo, I did have to add some up trim.
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Christensen <SPECTRUMINTERNATIONAL(at)email.msn.com>
Date: Friday, January 01, 1999 3:41 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Rudder Trim
>
>Big Lar wrote;
>>Hi Frank: And Ron, too. I'm not ignoring you, honest. Frank, I went
>>and looked at Ron's Mk III 1/2 about 1 1/2 yrs. ago, and it's magnificent.
>>Even took quite a few pics of it, but unfortunately not of the trim
>>mechanism. I remember it having the trim, but for the life of me, I can't
>>remember the set-up. Think I've got a semi-permanent attack of CRS
>>disease. I keep begging Ron to come to one of our U/L club meetings, (
>>we're only about 50 or so miles from Chino ) so that my buddies and I can
>>crawl all over it, but I think he's worried about me drooling on it.
>>Honest Ron, I promise I'll clean it up before you leave.
>>Big Lar.
>>
>===============
>Larry, you are MUCH too generous with your remarks; thank you. I'll visit
>your U/L club meeting as soon as I get the 40 hours flown off (about 30 to
>go as of yesterday). As for the in-cockpit rudder control I made, it
looks
>nice, but it is not "strong" enough to do the job; it won't deflect the
>rudder enough. I ended up adding a fixed trim tab to my rudder and one to
>my left aileron to achieve a hands & feet off condition in cruise flight.
>They are made of Lexan and really don't show badly. It seems to me that
>after all-is-said-and-done, the fixed tabs are best. As someone posted,
>they are fail-safe. I haven't used my in-cockpit rudder trim, although I
>might if I fly a long XC with a cross wind.
>Ron Christensen
>MKIII1/2
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: back again -test |
>>
Was this all you sent on your test Richard?........It's all I
got.....................GeoR38
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
Subject: | Re: static port location |
On Wed, 23 Dec 1998 Tim_Hrib(at)BCBSMD.COM wrote:
> citizens, a friend of mine has installed a pitot/static tube out the
> nose cone of his firestar. after doing this he says that his indicated
> airspeed does not match his hall airspeed meter. what brought this on was
> i enclosed my firestar and he told me that this would effect my indicated
> airspeed , that my indicated airspeed would show faster than i was really
> going. my static port is vented to the cockpit. i figure, what would
> enclosing the cockpit do to effect my indicated airspeed ? my cockpit isn't
> exactly air tight. .......... anyway, i have two questions - # 1 does
> enclosing the cockpit affect indicated airspeed when the static port is
> vented to the cockpit? # 2 where is the best place to install a
> pitot/static tube on the firestar ? .................... tim
>
Hi Y'all,
I've been out of town, commandeered by kids things, family travel
and the like. Some of the time away has been nice, but man do I miss
my toys! My nephew has a cable modem, so I took the opportunity to
skim the 150+ messages. This one caught my eye as something I may
be able to help with.
The static pressure drops inside the "cabin" when you partially
enclose it becaues the airstream over the cabin sucks air out of the
open enclosure. (I spose it would be a pressurized cabin if you put
the enclosure on backwards.) I tried the static port out the front of
the pod as someone else suggested, and even tried it with various hole
sizes,O-rings for bumps, different hole positions, etc. It looked like
a sieve by the time I thru it out, nothing helping at all. Then, after
contemplating poking holes in the sides of my cockpit, I tried simply
routing the static port --via a nylon T -- to the nose-cone overlap
on each side of the front of the plane. I cut little holes in the
fabric to get small (1/8" fish tank size) hose out to the small space
overlapped by the nose pod. Indicated airspeed is now very very close
to TAS. I get 1-2mph too high at 60mph, maybe 2+mph too high as I
go over 70-75. Stall ASI is within 1mph of TAS. Getting my ASI back
to realistic numbers was oh so nice. I can't recommend this static
location highly enf. Too easy, works perfect.
(FS KXP)
-Ben Ransom
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Kolb Ultrastar |
From: | blborg(at)juno.com (Bruce l Borg) |
Ken
I still have the Ultrastar I built in1983. It is a very fine flying
aircraft. cruise 55, stall 27.
Some were factory welded , I welded mine.
The thrust line is through the center of drag so it doesn,t have the
pitch change tendencys with power changes.
Mine is for sale now too since I can't fly 4 airplanes.
blborg(at)juno.com
Bruce
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
<< My buddy ole gilder pile it Geor38 flies around with a 60lb snow
mobile suit which is bright orange, you can see him 60 miles away, he's not
too bright only his suit.
>>
and to this I merely say.......................Oh
YEA??.............................GeoR38
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Christopher John Armstrong" <Tophera(at)centuryinter.net> |
Subject: | prop shear on bolts |
Folks,
The warp drive prop blades are held against centrifical shear by their hub,
not the prop bolts, and if the prop is reasonably balanced there will be
fairly small shear force to absorb, except with powerchanges. say your able
to get 400 pounds of thrust out of your prop and it is 80 % efficent, then
you only get .2*400= 80 pounds of shear force out of steady state running.
The Ivo uses the prop bolts to hold the blades against centrifical shear as
well. To calculate centrifical shear load is blade mass times blade
velocity squared divided by radius to center of mass of blade... time for a
WAG... blade rotational velocity is 2500/60 =42RPS, Ivo prop blade weight
~1.5 pounds = .0466 slugs,radius at center of mass for 68" blade = 1.1 feet.
Force shear = M*v
2/r=.047*42
2/1.1= 75 pounds per blade... so add the
80 pounds of drag and you get 230 pounds... most of that will be carried by
the friction of the hubs squeezing the prop root, but even the whole thing
is not a terribly huge shear load
for six bolts. (actually only 4 bolts take shear in the Ivo two blade prop)
I did this fast so there is probably a big mistake here somewhere (might
have to use feet per second velocity instead of rotational velocity I dont
remember, or pounds mass instead of slugs....), the point being if you want
to know what is going on do the math. I also havent calculated the loads
due to change in velocity... Which happens every time the two cycle gives
the prop a whack, and might be a much bigger number.
I worry when people try to make to much of heresay or experiance without
also doing a bit of math. Sure shear lugs offload the bolts from shear
loads... if the shear loads are a 10th of what the bolts can handle when
sized for other considerations then who cares, it is just added weight, and
puts bigger/more holes in your prop hub which might be alot worse thing to
do.
I would be really worried about any installation that broke prop bolts...
"its no big deal I always carry spares" said Mr Hauck, our pilot with
a gazillion hours experiance. I know squat by comparison but I dont like
the sound of
that. My feeling is that a properly torqued and sized prop bolt should
never be within 50% of failing... not even close.
Topher
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Beauford Tuton" <beaufordw(at)WORLDNET.ATT.NET> |
Subject: | Re: prop shear on bolts |
Topher....
I preface my comments by admitting that from an engineering standpoint, I am
a guy who can barely find his way to and from his parking place at work,
but I gotta tell you how much I enjoy reading your engineering assessments
of the daily problems encountered by we legions on the "great unwashed" here
on the list... you bring an element of class to this undertaking...
thanks...
Beauford, the aluminum buther of Brandon, Fla...
-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher John Armstrong <Tophera(at)centuryinter.net>
Date: Friday, January 01, 1999 10:29 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: prop shear on bolts
>
>Folks,
>
>The warp drive prop blades are held against centrifical shear by their hub,
>not the prop bolts, and if the prop is reasonably balanced there will be
>fairly small shear force to absorb, except with powerchanges. say your
able
>to get 400 pounds of thrust out of your prop and it is 80 % efficent, then
>you only get .2*400= 80 pounds of shear force out of steady state running.
>
>The Ivo uses the prop bolts to hold the blades against centrifical shear as
>well. To calculate centrifical shear load is blade mass times blade
>velocity squared divided by radius to center of mass of blade... time for a
>WAG... blade rotational velocity is 2500/60 =42RPS, Ivo prop blade weight
>~1.5 pounds = .0466 slugs,radius at center of mass for 68" blade = 1.1
feet.
>
>Force shear = M*v
2/r=.047*42
2/1.1= 75 pounds per blade... so add the
>80 pounds of drag and you get 230 pounds... most of that will be carried by
>the friction of the hubs squeezing the prop root, but even the whole thing
>is not a terribly huge shear load
>for six bolts. (actually only 4 bolts take shear in the Ivo two blade
prop)
>
>I did this fast so there is probably a big mistake here somewhere (might
>have to use feet per second velocity instead of rotational velocity I dont
>remember, or pounds mass instead of slugs....), the point being if you want
>to know what is going on do the math. I also havent calculated the loads
>due to change in velocity... Which happens every time the two cycle gives
>the prop a whack, and might be a much bigger number.
>
>I worry when people try to make to much of heresay or experiance without
>also doing a bit of math. Sure shear lugs offload the bolts from shear
>loads... if the shear loads are a 10th of what the bolts can handle when
>sized for other considerations then who cares, it is just added weight, and
>puts bigger/more holes in your prop hub which might be alot worse thing to
>do.
>
>I would be really worried about any installation that broke prop bolts...
>"its no big deal I always carry spares" said Mr Hauck, our pilot with
>a gazillion hours experiance. I know squat by comparison but I dont like
>the sound of
>that. My feeling is that a properly torqued and sized prop bolt should
>never be within 50% of failing... not even close.
>
>Topher
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | john hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: prop shear on bolts |
>I would be really worried about any installation that broke prop bolts...
>"its no big deal I always carry spares" said Mr Hauck, our pilot with
>a gazillion hours experiance. I know squat by comparison but I dont like
>the sound of
>that. My feeling is that a properly torqued and sized prop bolt should
>never be within 50% of failing... not even close.
>
>Topher
Never have gotten used to being called Mr. Hauck. I was too young to be
called Mr. when I went in the Army, and by the time I retired I had gotten
to old and accustomed to being called other things, including my rank
sometimes, hehehe. Don't recall ever introducing myself or signing off on
any email as Mr. Hauck.
Making ones self understood to everyone on the List all the time is
impossible. I can't even understand myself sometimes. This isn't the
first time I felt I needed to better explain myself. I don't want anyone
on this List or anywhere else to think that a broken prop bolt is not big
deal. It is, and It hasn't happened that often to me, although I broke
them on the 447 w/B gearbox and 582 w/C gearbox. What I was trying to say,
and didn't do a very good job of it, was that I didn't realize I had broken
one until I caught it on post flight or preflight inspection. The airplane
got me home safely. That was the point I was trying to stress, not that I
didn't give a crap about my equipment falling apart. The main reason I
carried two spare bolts on my flights with the 912 was that I could not get
them from Warp Drive or any avn sup house. I had to go to the nut and bolt
store and buy grade 8 bolts of sufficient length to work with my prop
extension. Then I had to take them home and drill so I could safety wire.
That's not an easy job for me, especially with a tiny bit.
Now, I don't have much book learning so I don't know how much a gazillion
hours of flight time is. Compared to most people, I don't have much at
all. But I do have a little experience with Kolb airplanes and the
problems that have cropped up along the way. I have learned to deal with
them on the laymens level and not with a sliderule. Maybe if I had had a
slide rule I could have saved some time, money, and heart ache.
"My feeling is that a properly torqued and sized prop bolt should
never be within 50% of failing... not even close."
That's a good feeling, Topher, but it doesn't always work out that way in
reality.
I have a great deal of faith in Kolb aircraft and our little uncertified
power plants. If I didn't, I wouldn't fly 'em. I'm pushing 60 and not
nearly as quick as I used to be, so I reckon I don't need to be doing all
those real forced landings that we came to accept as routine back in the
early days.
I don't know if I made any sense or not, but I do want to emphasize I do
take equipment or safety very seriously. i want to fly tomorrow.
john h (working a a gazillion flight hours in Hauck's Holler, Alabama)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Beauford Tuton" <beaufordw(at)WORLDNET.ATT.NET> |
Subject: | Re: HVLP sprayers |
Wally:
For whatever it's worth, I have a DeVilbess HVLP gun FLG 622-322 which I
have been using on a Sears 5 hp compressor which puts out 9.1 cfm at 40
PSI... Have painted one car with acrylic enamel, and about half of the
current Kolb project with Stits...... so far, so good... The compressor
seems to keep up with the volumetric flow requirements of the gun ok, but I
have noted that it takes more than the claimed 24 PSI at the gun to move the
material properly... I end up using about 30-32 or so PSI to stay in
business, even thinned down pretty far... I gotta admit that I don't see
much difference in overspray or fog... the 'ol lady's cat hung around the
garage for a day or so during the last spray session, but haven't seen him
in a while...
Bill Tuton
building at FF #76
Brandon, FL
-----Original Message-----
From: Wally Hofmann <whofmann(at)eudoramail.com>
Date: Thursday, December 31, 1998 12:02 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: HVLP sprayers
>
>
>Does anyone have any experience with the HVLP spray guns that use a normal
compressor as opposed to a dedicatd turbine? They sell for $75 to $150.
Thanks and Happy New Year to all.
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>Wally Hofmann
>Wickenburg, Arizona
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>ps. Close to covering the 'Fly'
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | john hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Hi Guys:
Sorry about this.
I forgot to add that ultralighters and Rotaxers are not the only ones that
suffer from an occassional broken prop bolt. Yep, it happens on those old
Continental 65s at times. My buddy at Wetumpka Airport with an old L-4
(Cub) broke one recently. He is a very meticulous mechanic and also owner
of the 98 OSH Grand Champ Lt Plane. He had rebuilt the eng very recently
and replaced the prop. I don't know what size the bolts are, but they are
pretty husky guys. Don't know why that one broke. Murphy???
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Beauford Tuton" <beaufordw(at)WORLDNET.ATT.NET> |
Subject: | Re: prop shear on bolts |
Brother Hauck...
First of all, don't feel bad about being addressed as "Mister" Hauck..
Having spent 30 years in that Big Army, I can tell you that there is no
higher honor, Chief...
Second, never apologize for drilling with a "tiny bit" ... we all are called
upon to do that from time to time... It all averages out...
Hope to meet you at Sun N' Fun....
Bill Tuton
Aluminum Butcher of Brandon... FF #76
-----Original Message-----
From: john hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com>
Date: Friday, January 01, 1999 11:13 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: prop shear on bolts
>
>>I would be really worried about any installation that broke prop bolts...
>>"its no big deal I always carry spares" said Mr Hauck, our pilot with
>>a gazillion hours experiance. I know squat by comparison but I dont like
>>the sound of
>>that. My feeling is that a properly torqued and sized prop bolt should
>>never be within 50% of failing... not even close.
>>
>>Topher
>
>
>Never have gotten used to being called Mr. Hauck. I was too young to be
>called Mr. when I went in the Army, and by the time I retired I had gotten
>to old and accustomed to being called other things, including my rank
>sometimes, hehehe. Don't recall ever introducing myself or signing off on
>any email as Mr. Hauck.
>
>Making ones self understood to everyone on the List all the time is
>impossible. I can't even understand myself sometimes. This isn't the
>first time I felt I needed to better explain myself. I don't want anyone
>on this List or anywhere else to think that a broken prop bolt is not big
>deal. It is, and It hasn't happened that often to me, although I broke
>them on the 447 w/B gearbox and 582 w/C gearbox. What I was trying to say,
>and didn't do a very good job of it, was that I didn't realize I had broken
>one until I caught it on post flight or preflight inspection. The airplane
>got me home safely. That was the point I was trying to stress, not that I
>didn't give a crap about my equipment falling apart. The main reason I
>carried two spare bolts on my flights with the 912 was that I could not get
>them from Warp Drive or any avn sup house. I had to go to the nut and bolt
>store and buy grade 8 bolts of sufficient length to work with my prop
>extension. Then I had to take them home and drill so I could safety wire.
>That's not an easy job for me, especially with a tiny bit.
>
>Now, I don't have much book learning so I don't know how much a gazillion
>hours of flight time is. Compared to most people, I don't have much at
>all. But I do have a little experience with Kolb airplanes and the
>problems that have cropped up along the way. I have learned to deal with
>them on the laymens level and not with a sliderule. Maybe if I had had a
>slide rule I could have saved some time, money, and heart ache.
>
>"My feeling is that a properly torqued and sized prop bolt should
>never be within 50% of failing... not even close."
>
>That's a good feeling, Topher, but it doesn't always work out that way in
>reality.
>
>I have a great deal of faith in Kolb aircraft and our little uncertified
>power plants. If I didn't, I wouldn't fly 'em. I'm pushing 60 and not
>nearly as quick as I used to be, so I reckon I don't need to be doing all
>those real forced landings that we came to accept as routine back in the
>early days.
>
>I don't know if I made any sense or not, but I do want to emphasize I do
>take equipment or safety very seriously. i want to fly tomorrow.
>
>john h (working a a gazillion flight hours in Hauck's Holler, Alabama)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Mick Fine <froghair(at)busprod.com> |
Subject: | Re: prop shear on bolts |
>
>... we all are called
>upon to do that from time to time...
Gees Bill, slow down! My eyes were still waterin from picturing a cat with
a big Cessna-blue fur ball hopelessly stuck to his tongue...
-Mick Fine
Tulsa, Oklahoma
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/froghair
Green Country Ultralight Flyer's Organization (UFO)
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/gcufo
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: prop shear on bolts |
<< "My feeling is that a properly torqued and sized prop bolt should
never be within 50% of failing... not even close."
That's a good feeling, Topher, but it doesn't always work out that way in
reality.
>>
If I might HELP to muddy the water her, the loading on the bolts is not a
static load, bu t a shear load caused by an impulse instead of a continuous
force, or at least partially. Impulses are much harder to "plan for" or design
around and often can bite you. I agree with "Mr. Tropher" and .....John. he
he............................GeoR38
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | Re: back again -test |
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | Re: prop shear on bolts |
.I could not get
>them from Warp Drive or any avn sup house. I had to go to the nut and bolt
>store and buy grade 8 bolts of sufficient length to work with my prop
>extension.
I think the problem was the gr8 bolts, While stronger than the AN bolts
they are more brittle, I was told by an aircraft inspector that you can get
away with the GR8 bolts anywhere except the prop.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | rick106(at)juno.com |
Frank
I also have my M III in the garage do an inspection as you may have read
my tach went out and I am waiting foe the new one to come in ,I had to
put a patch on the cage in the rear where the aileron tubes are I have
the type that has the tapered tail , part of the taper broke and I had to
weld it back put the patch on and then poly-brush the patch and feather
it in then I painted the rear quarter panel it came out good , Did a
compression check on the 582 and came out with 125 psi on one and 120 on
the other. Took the 3 phase rect. out and put a new one in the one I went
back with is the blue one cain't remember the name but it has four screw
type lugs with no load it puts out about 14.8 volts with everything on
she comes to 13.2 or so .Well I have rambled on enought , I bet that old
GEOR38 gets cold even if he has his 60 pound snow suit
talk to you later
Rick Libersat
writes:
>
>
>Rick: thanks for the reply, I'm sticking it back together as we speak,
>I
>ordered new gaskets from Leaf should be here any day, also rewired the
>egt,s
>always had problems with one gage found out it was the wires. Actually
>I'm
>just going over every thing while it is in the garage, it also is due
>an
>annual inspection. In three months I'll be flying again, to cold to
>putzs
>around now. My buddy ole gilder pile it Geor38 flies around with a
>60lb snow
>mobile suit which is bright orange, you can see him 60 miles away,
>he's not
>too bright only his suit.
>
> Frank
>
> Frank
>-----Original Message-----
>From: rick106(at)juno.com <rick106(at)juno.com>
>To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>Cc: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>Date: Friday, January 01, 1999 12:16 PM
>Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
>
>
>>
>>FRANK
>>It sounds like all is OK with the free movement of the rings if
>their is
>>no carbon on top of the piston I would make sure that the gaskets are
>in
>>good shape ,and then put her back together for the next flight, did
>you
>>do a compression check?
>>Rick
>>
>> writes:
>>>
>>>
>>>Ole Poops: This has nothing to do with tail springs, I have the
>MKIII
>>>in
>>>the garage for the winter and removed the exhaust to check the rings
>>>and
>>>pistons, the rings move in easy and pop out easy also I found no
>>>carbon on
>>>the pistons and no scratches on the cylinder walls or pistons. I'm
>>>almost
>>>reluctant to change any thing. I have 57 hours and never changed the
>>>jet
>>>setting that came from the factory, the only thing I did was to
>change
>>>plugs
>>>about every 10 hours, I also use penzoil in the oil injector tank
>and
>>>high
>>>test fuel. So with all that I just might leave well enough alone.
>>>What do
>>>you guys think. Put it back together or tinker. I know what geor38
>>>would
>>>say, but I don't listen to him no how.
>>>
>>>PS I am changing my tail wheel to what John Hauck has on his MKIII.
>I
>>>hope
>>>it works out ok.
>>>
>>> Frank
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com>
>>>To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>>>Date: Thursday, December 31, 1998 4:03 PM
>>>Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>For your consideration. I am working on a small DC motor with a
>piece
>>>of
>>>>all-thred attached. A trim tab with a nut attached to the control
>>>horn.
>>>>Switch in the cockpit is center off spring return in either
>direction
>>>so
>>>>you can apply opposite polarities. One way runs the nut out
>(pushes
>>>the
>>>>tab up) the other way runs the nut in (pulls the tab down). So far
>it
>>>looks
>>>>good on the bench.
>>>>--
>>>>Happy Landings!! Adam Violett
>>>>
>>>> Several years ago I used an electric screwdriver to actuate the
>>>flaps on
>>>>the J-6. The screwdriver was set up to run on three volts, and I
>used
>>>a
>>>>resistor to drop the aircraft's 12 volts to about 8, and it worked
>>>pretty
>>>>good. The screwdriver turned a length of all-thread either way to
>>>either
>>>>raise or lower the flaps. It would kill the battery if you wern't
>>>careful
>>>tho.
>>>> Richard Pike
>>>> MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
>>>>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | john hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: prop shear on bolts |
> I think the problem was the gr8 bolts, While stronger than the AN bolts
>they are more brittle, I was told by an aircraft inspector that you can get
>away with the GR8 bolts anywhere except the prop.
>
Hi Woody and Gang:
Nope. Not the grade 8's and I am probably wrong on the grade of bolt
because I am using metric size. I haven't broken a bolt on the 912 in more
than 1,000 hours. Still using the original bolts I bought and installed.
Bolts I broke were the little 1/4 inch bolts on B and C gearbox.
I understand what you are saying about grade 8 and prop application. I'm
not at home now, but when I get home I will try and remember to look at a
spare prop bolt and give you all the proper nomenclature and size.
Happy New Year Gang,
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
Subject: | Annual, Web page |
This morning the Good Lookin' Ol' Poop and I took N420P apart
and put it in the garage for it's annual. Projects for this winter are
to replace the stock seat belts and cross straps with 4-point harnesses,
modify the windshield and doors a bit, redo the fuel pump plumbing per
J Hauck's advice at Oshkosh, (thanks John) and fine tune the flap
handle for an option to give a tiny reflex when two up, and a tiny
droop when solo. Will also add counter weights to the ailerons, with
brackets welded to the outside edge so I can play with the spade idea.
Also this winter I will try to figure out how to make a web page
and put some pictures of various mods on it. From what I've done so far,
it would probably be easier to build another airplane, but if I can muddle
through, it may be be a resource for new builders.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
Subject: | Favorite Humorist |
Beauford, Happy New Year. Now that you're active here again, the other
OldPoop will be reading the list over my shoulder!
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | PaulSpadin(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: the 2 cycle discussion |
If you know the instrument isn't accurate and you don't believe the reading,
then you should fix it or remove it.
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Annual, Web page |
From: | rbaker2(at)juno.com (Ray L Baker) |
Richard,
Could you give a little more detail on this change and the expected
benefits.
"fine tune the flap handle for an option to give a tiny reflex when two
up, and a tiny droop when solo."
Thanks
L. Ray Baker
Lake Butler, Fl
Mk III (tail feathers almost finished)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle 925-606-1001) |
Subject: | PLEASE READ - New List Archive Browsing and Downloading Web |
Page...
Listers,
I've added an all new Archive file Browsing and Downloading page. The index
for browsing the archives is now generated each time you go to the page, so
only the *available* archive "books" are shown along with the start/end
dates. The browsing archives are now also formatted similar to the way
the Search Engine returns messages, so reading through the messages should
be a little easier as well.
I've also added new ftp links to all of the various forms of the archives that
are available for download including Plain Text, Zip, and UNIX Compressed.
I've added a new line in the posted message trailer that lists the URL for
the new Archive Browsing web site.
Please have a look; I'm sure you will enjoy the new an improved browsing
capabilities!
The URL is:
http://www.matronics.com/archives
Best Regards,
Matt Dralle
RV, Kolb, and Zenith List Admin.
--
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
>
>Richard,
>
>Could you give a little more detail on this change and the expected
>benefits.
>
>"fine tune the flap handle for an option to give a tiny reflex when two
>up, and a tiny droop when solo."
>
>Thanks
>
>L. Ray Baker
>Lake Butler, Fl
>Mk III (tail feathers almost finished)
>
> Sure; the MKIII is very sensitive to flap position. If the flaps are
reflexed any, the nose rises and airspeed drops even if it is a little
noseheavy.
If the flaps are drooped any, the nose drops and airspeed increases.
I have in mind to modify the flap detent bracket by grinding a notch/slot
in the upper passenger side so that by pushing the flap handle out and up, it
will fit into a new position. This slot will only be about 3/32" deep.
Right now the flaps up gives me a solo, elvevator trim full forward,
hands off trim speed of 42. With a 200 pound passenger, I need almost full
aft trim on the trim handle. This mod I am planning will allow me to adjust
the flaps so that the dual position will be very slightly higher than now.
This should make the nose "lighter" with two up.
The solo position will be very slightly lower than now. This should give
me
a solo trim speed of around 55, instead of 40-42.
Try an experiment: flying a MKIII, reach up and pull the flap handle down
just a bit. Major trim change.
I'm just experimentin' with my experimental airplane...
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Geoff Thistlethwaite" <geoffthis(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Subject: | Re: Spring for Rudder tension |
I've seen this arrangement somewhere on the net...maybe Feathers from the
nest - N.J. U/L club?!! They had pictures and description. I think it was on
a MiniMax.
I'll try to find it and let y'all know.
Geoff Thistlethwaite
-----Original Message-----
From: Adam Violett <violett@springhill-online.net>
Date: Wednesday, December 30, 1998 9:05 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spring for Rudder tension
<violett@springhill-online.net>
>
>For your consideration. I am working on a small DC motor with a piece of
>all-thred attached. A trim tab with a nut attached to the control horn.
Switch
>in the cockpit is center off spring return in either direction so you can
apply
>opposite polarities. One way runs the nut out (pushes the tab up) the
other way
>runs the nut in (pulls the tab down). So far it looks good on the bench.
>--
>Happy Landings!!
>Adam Violett
>Original Firestar, 377
>Quicksilver MX2A, 503
>http://www.springhill-online.net/~violett/
>
>
>> What about using an RC servo to control a trim tab on the surface
which
>> controls the rotation in the axis you
>> wish to trim (on rudder, elevator or aileron).
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Woody Weaver <mts0140(at)ibm.net> |
Subject: | Firefly Thrust Line |
Does using a three blade prop (IVO?) instead of a longer two blade allow lowering
the thrust line on the
firefly?
Woody Weaver
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Cliff / Carolyn Stripling <striplic(at)dfw.net> |
To all,
Help! I at first thought that Richard might have what he was saying
entirely backwards, but the more I thought the more I think he is probably
right. I think it is worth a question anyway (???) about reflexing (moving
upward) and drooping (moving downward) the flaps. At first I thought
moving them up or down would affect only the general lift of the entire
main wing (which it does do I guess) but the fact that the effect caused by
the flap is behind the CG (or mayby we are talking about the center of
lift) would cause the opposite effect. Some of you air-0-nauatical
engineers could help by explaining what exactly does happen more
intelligently.
Thanks,
--
Cliff & Carolyn Stripling Him: Retired Pharmacist
(972)247-9821 Dallas Texas Her: Real Estate Broker - Texas
and Marble Falls Texas Both: 5th Wheel - RV - Travel
Kolb MKIII - N582CC (50+ hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Dennis Souder <flykolb(at)epix.net> |
Subject: | Re: Firefly Thrust Line |
>
>Does using a three blade prop (IVO?) instead of a longer two blade allow
lowering the thrust line on the
>firefly?
>Woody Weaver
>
The thrust line remains the same; the engine cannot be lowered with a
smaller dia prop - it's position is fixed.
Dennis Souder
Pres Kolb Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Dennis Souder <flykolb(at)epix.net> |
Subject: | Re: Annual, Web page |
>
> . Will also add counter weights to the ailerons, with
>brackets welded to the outside edge so I can play with the spade idea.
>
This idea has been tried by one of our good builders and he reported that it
did not work. He explained why he thought it did not work and I agree with
him. The wing tip has a strong upflow of air from the bottom of the wing
(it's what crates the wing tip vortex) and messes up the clean air flow
needed for the spades. The spade needs to be well inboard of the tip to
work where it sees reasonably "clean" airflow from straight ahead.
You could install a spade/counter balance inboard of the wing, but then it
probably will not allow the aileron to fold - if that is a consideration for
your application. This could be attached to the aileron tube with a split
steel tube that would rivet to the aileron tube.
Dennis Souder
Pres Kolb Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Lindy" <lindy(at)snowhill.com> |
Subject: | HKS 700E Jap Engine on Hawk Arrow--wrist flight computer |
The following information is my personal and professional opinion.
My flying Buddy's father in law a retired WW2 B-26 Pilot-Vietnam Helicopter
pilot-79 years of age decided to purchase a custom built RANS due to his
excessive height-He owned one of the 1st RansS-12 previously.Randy was to
busy so he decided on the Hawk arrow.
The new Hawk Arrow has a folding wing capability-very similar to
Kolb--however if u install wing tanks-1 in each wing-gravity flow the fold
up capability is lost.
Plane was custom built at Factory outside Cleveland-delivered behind
schedule-Individual owner designed own instrument panes (EIS-and other
instruments) custom designed exhaust--NOTE" HKS 700E was designed for use as
a tractor engine. Installed on Hawk as a pusher.
HKS 700E engine has oil cooled valves-high oil temp and high EGT from
beginning-Factory initial recommendation was oil temp not to exceed 191
degrees-down from 212--Modified oil cooler from Engine Manufacture by adding
locally manufacture air scoops out of scrap sheet metal--Helped a little but
not enough to make a difference-could not cruise in flight as oil temp was
close to boiling. Directly related was high EGT-Engine equipped w/Bing 64
carbs (2).Climb EGT would drop-had to fly by climbing-throttle
back -descend-then repeat process-frustrating---noticed slight
vibrations--on Ground found 1 blade of IVO in flight adjustable prop to be
out of track.
Have hanger with everything but a lathe-the average person could not have
made all repairs and modifications.
Have come to the following Conclusion----HKS 700E engine
expensive---support-follow on support logistical/admin-in my mind
questionable- Engine definitely designed for Tractor use only--check fuel
consumption w/flow meter --approx. 2.7 to 3 GPM.
Flaps approx. 1-3 degrees above airelons--designed for ??????--Lift ?????
Model comes in a tail dragger or tri gear-recommend tri-gear---w/out wing
tanks--loss of fold up capability not worth it--sufficient cockpit space
behind seat to install whatever tank is desired.
Bracket for Stainless Steel Oil tank not strong enough-in-flight vibration
cause tank (expensive ) to leak in first 5 hours of testing.
EIS system-very accurate--check with direct pressure gages-found EIS to be
very reliable!
Would not recommend installation on Kolb Mark 3!
2nd TEST--See ultralight flying magazine page 19--Jan 99 edition---bought
new vector wrist top flight computer--very accurate to include VSI--only
problem I have had in altitude configuration it has a lot of capability to
include setting ground (elevation) with an alarm to warn you.
On flight found computer to be high--the exact approximate field evaluation
I put in--still learning as much more than u need- this could replace all
instruments except-RPM and EGT/CHT.Cost $199--Note cost me 154 to have my
altimeter repaired-
Hope information will assist you our your friends in most immediate future.
Weather here until yesterday excellent for flying--2 from Alabama-2 from
Florida-1 from Georgia- met in air over NW Florida--flew East to
Marianna,Florida- at 1000 ft--maintained excellent commo with hand held
radio's--followed I-10 main East West interstate- from Marianna to Quincy as
swamps and forests --no emergency landing areas--flew at approx. 500 feet -3
on one side of interstate -2 on other-people on ground-parking/rest
area's--all waving--at Quincy Turned North and had to climb to 5000 ft to
find calm air-on to Donaldsonville, Georgia East to Dothan-Florida gang a 75
Mile flight south with 30 MPH tail winds.
Weather today like most of u experiencing--severe thunderstorms-wind gusts
to 65MPH yesterday-turned cold last night-30F with 20 MPH winds last
night-today about same with sun shining--tonight low 20's-that is cold for
the deep South.
Respectively,
Lindy
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Woody Weaver <mts0140(at)ibm.net> |
Subject: | Re: Firefly Thrust Line |
Dennis Souder wrote:
>
>
> >
> >Does using a three blade prop (IVO?) instead of a longer two blade allow
> lowering the thrust line on the
> >firefly?
> >Woody Weaver
> >
>
> The thrust line remains the same; the engine cannot be lowered with a
> smaller dia prop - it's position is fixed.
>
> Dennis Souder
> Pres Kolb Aircraft
>
> Thanks. See you at Sun 'n Fun.
Woody Weaver
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | gerken(at)us.ibm.com |
>Who out there has a 912 with a warp drive prop on a Mrk III? How much
>clearance do you have from the flap control arm? Are you using a spacer?
>If so, what size? I prefer the warp drive prop, but perhaps I just need
>to go to the IVO prop with less weight so that the spacer isnt a problem?
>Dont be shy; I need to learn.
>Thanx,
>Erich Weaver
Erich, when I initially installed the flap control arms, I did it according
to plans, and so they had an angle backwards (they were not vertical).
Later, after installing the prop and noting the small clearance (2-3"), I
notified the prop manufacturer and he said this may be too close
(PowerFin). I caled Dennis at Kolb and he recommended changing the angle
of the control arms to get more clearance. Please ask Dennis if this
applies to your model and how to do it. It got me 2 more inches of
clearance.
jim
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle 925-606-1001) |
Subject: | Re: Finding Information |
>--------------
>I am not sure how this whole thing works, but I'm trying to find help
>for a "release of Liability" as I have plans to sell my RV4 and my wife
>is quite concerned (as am I) as to how we assure the buyer he is buying
>"as is" on an amateur build aircraft. I'm sure the subject has been
>discussed and I have tried to send the request a couple different ways
>on advice of friends who say "You (Matronics) are the best source". I
>have "subscribed" and await response and/or direction.
>
>a barely literate computer rookie...Don
>--------------
Hi Don,
You have a couple of options to find some answers to your questions. First,
I'd recommend that you use your web browser and try out the RV-List Archive
Search Engine! Go to the following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/search
The web page will allow you to search through all of the 10 years of postings
to the RV-List. On the search web page, select the RV-List Archive (there are
two other Lists here - the Kolb and Zenith - and you might try searching
these List Archives as well) and put in the search string "liability & sale"
without the double quotes. Click on 'Begin Search'. This should return an
index of about 92 previous RV-List posts that contains the above words. You
then click on the indexed Subjects which will return that message for you to
read. You can also modify the search words to widen or narrow the search as
required. The main Search web page has detailed instuctions on how to use
the Search Engine.
If you can't find exactly what you're looking for using the search engine,
simply send an email message to "rv-list(at)matronics.com" requesting the
specific information you are looking for. Your message will be redistribued
to all of the RV-List members.
Good luck,
Matt
--
Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Lindy" <lindy(at)snowhill.com> |
Subject: | Fw: Need One??????????? |
Date: Monday, January 04, 1999 12:41 PM
Subject: Need One???????????
>These two guys had each just gotten divorced and they swore
>they would never have anything to do with women again. They
>were best friends and they decided to move up to Alaska as
>far north as they could go and never look at a woman again.
>They got up there and went into a trader's store and told
>him, "Give us enough supplies to last two men for one year."
>The trader got the gear together and on top of each one's
>supplies he laid a board with a hole in it with fur around the
>hole. The guys said "What's that board for?" The trader said,
>"Well, where you're going there are no women and you might
>need this."
>
>They said "No way! We've sworn off women for life!" The trader
>said," Well. take the boards with you, and if you don't use them
>I'll refund your money next year. "Okay," they said and left.
>Next year this guy came into the trader's store and said
>
>"Give me enough supplies to last one man for one year." The
>trader said "Weren't you in here last year with a partner?"
>
>"Yeah" said the guy.
>
>"Where is he?" asked the trader.
>
>"I shot him" said the guy.
>
>"Why?"
>
>"I caught him in bed with my board."
>
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Jim Cowen <jcowen(at)apk.net> |
Subject: | Looking for Mark 111 |
I'am interested in purchasing a Kolb Mark 111 and would prefer something
east of Mississippi. Also would like to know of anyone in the Ohio area
that would give instruction in the Mark 111. Please reply by email.
Thanks
Jim Cowen
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | dleister <dleister(at)eriecoast.com> |
Subject: | Re: Looking for Mark 111 |
dleister wrote:
> Jim Cowmen wrote:
>
> >
> > I'am interested in purchasing a Kolb Mark 111 and would prefer something
> > east of Mississippi. Also would like to know of anyone in the Ohio area
> > that would give instruction in the Mark 111. Please reply by email.
> > Thanks
> > Jim Cowen
> >
>
> Jim: My name is Dave Leister and I own a Mark III with a Rotax 912. I just
> finished my 40 hr restriction and I would be glad to take you up. I think you
> should hold off on flight instructions until you are ready to fly your own Mark
> III. It took me four years to build my aircraft, and two weeks before it was
> ready to be inspected by the FAA I went to Phoenixville PA and took two full
> hours of instruction from the Kolb factory instructor. Well worth every penny
> and then some.
> My kolb is stored in a hangar at 92D,(Harlan Airfield, LaGrange, OH ).
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard <swidersk(at)digital.net> |
Hello Ray,
I modified my UltraStar, which had full length ailerons, to flaperons. The
effect
that I experienced seems quite different than Richard P's. At cruise, if I drooped
them, my speed decreased if I reflexed them up, the
back pressure would decrease & speed would increase about 3-4mph. Depending on
the
degree of reflex ( between 1-4 degrees) the back pressure would neutralize or even
go
negative (eg, forward stick pressure). It was a wonderful trim tab, gave me a
little
higher cruise & slower stall. The refexed position did not work well at full gross
unless you were at 80% throttle, as it definitely would decrease the lift & raise
the
stall, in fact if the air got real squirrely when I returned to land, I'd put in
max.
reflex, which effectively raised my wing loading, allowed me to come in faster
& be
thrown around less.
As our speed increases, the center of lift moves forward significantly with
our
airfioil, which demands significant forward stick pressure, which is drag.(& this
is a
drag because it counters our intention of going fast!) ((This is also why our wonderful
climbing planes will never go real fast, even with lots of power & streamlining,
we
rather quickly hit a point of deminishing returns, where the induced drag gobbles
up
our hp. ....everything is a compromise.)) The reflex, to an extent, reduces this
induced drag, but it is not a fix.
Years back, I looked at Harry Riblet's airfoils & he had a semi-symetrical
airfoil
whose lift/drag ratio was much better than a Clark Y (Kolb's is a modified Clark
Y?),
its center of lift did not travel forward nearly as much as a Clark Y, the coeffecient
of lift was comparable, & the coeffecient of lift with flaps was much better.
This
looked like a fix to me. Somebody with a Firestar built & flew this wing. I never
did
hear the verdict... Did it provide "the fix" without losing the beloved flying
qualities that we have, like spectacular climbout/STOL, forgiving/docile, authorative
&
predictable? I sure wish this mystery guy would discover this thread & let us
know.
So anyway Ray, "reflexible" flaps will have the same effect as "reflexible"
flaperons, but not over the entire length of the wing. Also, flaperons, (& to
a lesser
extent,flaps) especially reflexive, can complicate the pilots options ... in the
right
situation, used in the wrong way, they can make a normally friendly kolb turn nasty.
They will expand the plane's envelope, but they will also offer you the option
to make
a fatal mistake, where the factory kolb will not. -Richard S
> >Richard,
> >
> >Could you give a little more detail on this change and the expected
> >benefits.
> >
> >"fine tune the flap handle for an option to give a tiny reflex when two
> >up, and a tiny droop when solo."
> >
> >Thanks
> >
> >L. Ray Baker
> >Lake Butler, Fl
> >Mk III (tail feathers almost finished)
> >
> > Sure; the MKIII is very sensitive to flap position. If the flaps are
> reflexed any, the nose rises and airspeed drops even if it is a little
> noseheavy.
> If the flaps are drooped any, the nose drops and airspeed increases.[snip]
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | dleister <dleister(at)eriecoast.com> |
gerken(at)us.ibm.com wrote:
>
> >Who out there has a 912 with a warp drive prop on a Mrk III? How much
> >clearance do you have from the flap control arm? Are you using a spacer?
> >Erich Weaver
>
> Erich, when I initially installed the flap control arms, I did it according
> to plans, and so they had an angle backwards (they were not vertical).
> Jim and Erich: I had the same problem with my 912 powered MarkIII with a warp
> drive prop. Fist time I ran it everything was fine, second time I went to
> full power and after shut down I noticed the prop tip had nicked the flap
> fabric were the 5/16 aluminum tube joins the 1 1/4 flap torque tube. This
> small fabric covered tube joins the main tube at a 30 or 40 degree angle on
> the inboard end, which is why at full power the prop tips moved forward enough
> to intercept this angled section of the flap..
Warp Drive said shortening the 72" prop by 1/2" was no problem. That done I
fired up the engine again. This time while the engine was bucking and jumping
around like all engines do until they smooth out at idle, one blade made contact
with the flap control horn. Damage was minimal and all I had to do was change
the protective cellophane tape and rebalance the prop. A call to Kolb for
answers, was to reposition the flap horns to parallel the prop track (hang it
almost straight down instead of back 30 degrees as the plans show) and to make
sure the motor mounts were something or other - 90, indicating they were for the
912 and not -60 which would be for a smaller lighter engine.
With these modification I haven't had any trouble since. 45 Hrs on the
tach, last flight on Christmas Day in 10 degree weather. Wish I had a set of
skies, I'm finished for the season as soon as it snows around here. PS
For added insurance when I fist start my engine I droop the flaps two notches
just to get that little bit more clearance just in case.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Hansen, Mark" <MHansen(at)ConusNews.com> |
Subject: | Re: Finding Information |
take it apart. wings, tail, prop, etc. make the new owner put it together.
now it is the new
owners fault if it goes bad.
> ----------
> From: dralle(at)matronics.com[SMTP:dralle(at)matronics.com]
> Reply To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Monday, January 04, 1999 12:31 PM
> To: dotndon(at)worldnet.att.net
> Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Finding Information
>
> 925-606-1001)
>
>
> >--------------
> >I am not sure how this whole thing works, but I'm trying to find help
> >for a "release of Liability" as I have plans to sell my RV4 and my wife
> >is quite concerned (as am I) as to how we assure the buyer he is buying
> >"as is" on an amateur build aircraft. I'm sure the subject has been
> >discussed and I have tried to send the request a couple different ways
> >on advice of friends who say "You (Matronics) are the best source". I
> >have "subscribed" and await response and/or direction.
> >
> >a barely literate computer rookie...Don
> >--------------
>
>
> Hi Don,
>
> You have a couple of options to find some answers to your questions.
> First,
> I'd recommend that you use your web browser and try out the RV-List
> Archive
> Search Engine! Go to the following URL:
>
> http://www.matronics.com/search
>
> The web page will allow you to search through all of the 10 years of
> postings
> to the RV-List. On the search web page, select the RV-List Archive (there
> are
> two other Lists here - the Kolb and Zenith - and you might try searching
> these List Archives as well) and put in the search string "liability &
> sale"
> without the double quotes. Click on 'Begin Search'. This should return
> an
> index of about 92 previous RV-List posts that contains the above words.
> You
> then click on the indexed Subjects which will return that message for you
> to
> read. You can also modify the search words to widen or narrow the search
> as
> required. The main Search web page has detailed instuctions on how to use
>
> the Search Engine.
>
> If you can't find exactly what you're looking for using the search engine,
> simply send an email message to "rv-list(at)matronics.com" requesting the
> specific information you are looking for. Your message will be
> redistribued
> to all of the RV-List members.
>
> Good luck,
>
> Matt
>
>
> --
>
> Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
> 925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
> http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
>
>
>
>
> -
>
> -
>
> -
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Tim_Hrib(at)carefirst.com |
Subject: | Re: Kolb Ultrastar |
ken, i had an ultrastar and i loved it. it flew great, i mean it
stalled gently and was easy to fly. mine had a cuyuna 430 ( 35 hp ) with
a belt drive prop. the engine never gave me a bit of trouble. however,
every aircraft design has a flaw - the only drawback to the ultrastar is
the landing gear. the way the landing gear is designed if you do a hard
landing you bend the entire cage and shove the prop into the boom tube, so
with an ultrastar a hard landing can be very expensive . the ultrastar
hasn't been made since 1984 so the factory doesn't have much as far as
parts but they can help with any questions you might have, i called them
several times when i had mine and they always were able to help.
............................... tim
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Rutledge Fuller" <rut007(at)hotmail.com> |
Hey Guys:
New Years Day in sunny Florida motivated me to take advantage of the
weather while everyone else in the country was freezing their
hindquaters off. A fellow aviator at Quincy just purchased a used N3
Pup and was itchin' for a cross country. We planned to travel to the
coast to do some beach flyin'. First leg was 70 miles from Quincy to
Apalachicola where we fueled up. I burnt 4 gallons, and Bob in the N3
with a 1/2 VW motor topped off with 1.8 gallons. Not a bad fuel burn
for a 1.2 hour flight. From there we followed the bridge over to St.
George Island were we flew right on the deck the entire length of the
island. The scenery was magnificint as we slowly made our way over to
Dog Island, and finally headed back to Quincy--which was a two hour
flight after our stop at Apalachicola. Everything was great until
postflight inspection of the Firestar. I discovered that an exhaust
mounting (8mm x 40mm) bolt had worked it's way out and went right
through the prop. I replaced the bolt and repaired the IVO prop with
baking soda and super glue. Two hours of flight since then and patch is
still holding.
Moral of the story: I always take time to do a cautious preflight of
the aircraft and even inspected the bolts prior to taking off. Post
flight showed that all of the bolts were loose--visual inspection did
not catch this. Since I fly so much, I haven't taken the time recently
to actually put a wrench on the buggers. Lesson learned..
Rutledge Fuller
Tallahassee, Fl.
Original Firestar 120 hrs.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | WGeorge737(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Shipping-Mk-III/Firestar? |
Aloha:
I am planning the purchase of a pre-built Kolb on the US mainland. Shipping it
to Hawaii is a major factor. Would it be best to crate the entire aircraft and
ship it as a unit or to break it down to several components? If breakdown is
best, what units should be separated? Also, what are the best freight options.
If anyone has some thoughts/experience on this comments will be appreciated.
Bill George
Honokaa-The Big Island
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
Subject: | Re: Shipping-Mk-III/Firestar? |
Aloha Bill,
I'm assuming you'll get better, more specific info, but for starters:
I'd have the plane separated into the following pieces:
- engine
- prop
- each wing
- fuselage (leaving tail ass'y on)
Reasons:
- engine is a lot of mass and a hard clunk to the container could push
this load too hard against the frame, or perhaps it's mass could cause
the whole fuselage to move inside a crate if jolted.
- wings: They are practically no mass for their size and would be
difficult to pack adequately if left tied to the fuselage. (They might
flop against the fuselage.) I would think they could be packed in
cushioned wood frames.
- fuselage: this is all that is left. You could have the tail ass'y
removed too if overall length is a problem. Removal or adding back
the tail might be ~1-2 days work.
Seems it would be worthwhile having somebody who knows and cares about
the plane do the packing, then get it to a container/shipping company.
Good Luck!
-Ben Ransom ...pining for a ride in Hawaii someday :)
On Tue, 5 Jan 1999 WGeorge737(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Aloha:
>
> I am planning the purchase of a pre-built Kolb on the US mainland. Shipping it
> to Hawaii is a major factor. Would it be best to crate the entire aircraft and
> ship it as a unit or to break it down to several components? If breakdown is
> best, what units should be separated? Also, what are the best freight options.
> If anyone has some thoughts/experience on this comments will be appreciated.
>
> Bill George
> Honokaa-The Big Island
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
Subject: | Re: Shipping-Mk-III/Firestar? |
>
>Aloha:
>
>I am planning the purchase of a pre-built Kolb on the US mainland.
Shipping it
>to Hawaii is a major factor. Would it be best to crate the entire aircraft
and
>ship it as a unit or to break it down to several components? If breakdown is
>best, what units should be separated? Also, what are the best freight
options.
>If anyone has some thoughts/experience on this comments will be appreciated.
>
>Bill George
>Honokaa-The Big Island
I ferried a C-175 to Santa Paula, Ca. in 1995 that was to be crated and
shipped to New Zealand. There is a shipper on the airport at Santa Paula
that uses standard shipping containers, and he had pictures of Pitts
Specials, Skyhawks, Etc. with the wings off, dissassembled, etc, and tucked
two to the box.
Don't remember his name, I am sure someone at the airport could give it
to
you. He was most remarkably salty in his language, but he apparently knew
his business. Had many testimonial letters that nothing got scratched.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "F J MARINO" <FMARINO(at)netlink1.nlcomm.com> |
Subject: | Re: Looking for Mark 111 |
I have a MKIII with a 582 on it and dual controls, I live in Warren Ohio, I
have a buddy with a Fire Star KXP but you would have to take a drink of saki
and tie on your kamakazi scarf to fly it. What part of Ohio are you in.
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Cowen <jcowen(at)apk.net>
Date: Monday, January 04, 1999 4:21 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Looking for Mark 111
>
>I'am interested in purchasing a Kolb Mark 111 and would prefer something
>east of Mississippi. Also would like to know of anyone in the Ohio area
>that would give instruction in the Mark 111. Please reply by email.
>Thanks
>Jim Cowen
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | gerken(at)us.ibm.com |
What do you antenna-experienced guys think about the following:
I have been looking for the best antenna install location on the MKiii, and
like the suggestion from someone on this list to put it sticking out the
bottom of the fuselage behind the pilot. But this means it could be only
about 10 inches long before a bend backward, to keep it off the ground. I
understand from Adrio that the bend will cause the polarization to cross
somewhat, so I'd sure like to minimize the horizontal length. Here's my
idea. The aluminum tray that the fuel tanks are sitting on may make a good
ground plane. It is bigger than a foot square on each side of the boom
tube so the area isn't too bad. My point is that it is up inside the
fuselage about a foot above the bottom fabric, so the antenna could start
there, and stick almost straight down and not hit the ground. In other
words, half of the 24" length would be inside the fuselage fabric, and half
would be sticking thru the bottom. On my plane, the fuselage did get a
thin spray coat of Poly-something (the silver UV coating), so do you thing
this would screw up the idea? I assume that the fabric and paint alone
would not make much difference but the Poly-silver coat may make a
difference since it would reflect the transmitted wave???
It may be something I have to try out. Thanks for your ideas.
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Antenna stuff |
In a message dated 1/5/99 12:46:01 PM Pacific Standard Time, gerken(at)us.ibm.com
writes:
<< What do you antenna-experienced guys think about the following:
I have been looking for the best antenna install location on the MKiii, and
like the suggestion from someo >>
On my Mark III I used a fibreglass composite antenna from Gulf Coast Avionics
and installed it in the nose cone. Reception and transmit worked very well
and installation was simple (I duct taped it in until I was sure it worked,
then bonded it in place). Cost is about $120.00
Pete Krotje
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Bluhm <irena(at)ccis.com> |
Hey, you guy's...
I can't put any photo's on this list, but if you would like to see a
photo of my plane, I will respond to your "personal" email address.. My
plane is a GOOD-LOOKER.
regards
Doc.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | swultra <swultra(at)primenet.com> |
Richard Bluhm wrote:
>
>
> Hey, you guy's...
> I can't put any photo's on this list, but if you would like to see a
> photo of my plane, I will respond to your "personal" email address.. My
> plane is a GOOD-LOOKER.
> regards
> Doc.
>
All this technology an we can't see pic's!!!!!!! SAD
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Ron Carroll" <ron.carroll(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Me! Me! Me!
Ron Carroll
Original Firestar
Independence, Oregon
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Bluhm <irena(at)ccis.com>
Date: Friday January 08 1999 9:02 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Photo shoot
>
>Hey, you guy's...
>I can't put any photo's on this list, but if you would like to see a
>photo of my plane, I will respond to your "personal" email address.. My
>plane is a GOOD-LOOKER.
>regards
>Doc.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
<< Me! Me! Me!
>>
me too........................GeoR38 the ol glider pilot ....or pile it as
Frank M says!
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Jim Baker" <jlbaker(at)telepath.com> |
Subject: | Old aviation stories..... |
Ran across this site and thought others may enjoy the early (very)
stories of flight and attempted flight......
http://hawaii.cogsci.uiuc.edu/invent/library/source.html
J. Baker
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Jim Baker" <jlbaker(at)telepath.com> |
Subject: | Two strokes...... |
And you thought they were recent inventions......
http://hawaii.cogsci.uiuc.edu/invent/library/Magazines/Whitehead.ht
ml
J. Baker
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Used or partial MKIIIw912 |
From: | tonarockfarm(at)juno.com (JEFF H VAUGHAN) |
I too am looking for a used MKIII with a 912. Our towing club wants to
purchase a MKIII and convert it into a MKIII TUG version. This means we
do not need the wing. We will be replacing it with a new modified tug
wing. We will be towing ultrlight gliders and hang gliders. Also- Can
anyone elaborate on the various options available for overhauling a 912
when it is time to do so? Send it to Rotax? Are there other companies
that do rebuilds? How about regular maintenance stuff that the none
mechanical do not want to tackle- Do A&Ps work on these things?
Jeff Vaughan
Southeastern Pa. Flight Park
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Jon Croke" <joncroke(at)itol.com> |
Subject: | John Jung in KitPlanes |
Congratulations to John Jung for his display in Completions of KitPlanes
with his FSII !
Six weeks has to be a record!
Good job (Ive seen the plane myself) !
Jon
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry & Karen Cottrel" <lcottrel(at)kfalls.net> |
Subject: | Fw: ATP 12v battery |
In the last Ultralight Flyer, they advertised the new battery, but had a
disclaimer that it wasn't suitable for aircraft. I emailed asking why the
1.6 lb battery could not be used in a airplane. This is the reply. I
personally am interested if the cost is anywhere reasonable. I am beginning
to have trouble losing any more weight, 15 lbs loss and still be able to
eat occasionally. :-/
Larry
----------
From: Tisha Lockwood <lockwood(at)digital.net>
Subject: ATP 12v battery
Date: Tuesday, January 05, 1999 3:48 PM
Larry,
ATP put out the disclaimer on the batteries, not Lockwood. They don't say
why it can't be mounted in an airplane, but you might be right. They do
however expect to have a slightly larger version about 3 lbs. total that
can be mounted in the aircraft. In fact I am having a meeting with the
designer of the batteries tonight, so I should know more about its price
and availability as soon as tomorrow a.m.
Regards,
Jeff Hudson
Lockwood Aviation Supply
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Dennis Souder <flykolb(at)epix.net> |
Subject: | Re: Shipping-Mk-III/Firestar? |
>
>Aloha:
>
>I am planning the purchase of a pre-built Kolb on the US mainland. Shipping it
>to Hawaii is a major factor. Would it be best to crate the entire aircraft and
>ship it as a unit or to break it down to several components? If breakdown is
>best, what units should be separated? Also, what are the best freight options.
>If anyone has some thoughts/experience on this comments will be appreciated.
>
>Bill George
>Honokaa-The Big Island
>
>
Allow me to interject my $0.02 worth: It would be best to put in all in one
box. We shipped a FS to Brazil in one crate and it made the trip just fine.
Can't help with the cost - but could get a quote.
Dennis
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | NAME <bob_gross(at)mindspring.com> |
Hi all. I recently found a web page for a europeanengine manufacturer
called "David". He has four engines in his line including a single cylinder
4 stroke 35 hp engine that weighs only 57 pounds w/belt drive.
Can anyone provide me with info/experience with this product?
Bob
original FS Rotax 377
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Scott Bentley <Scott.Bentley(at)Bentley.COM> |
I have the same antenna, located in the same place (though still with Duct
tape,) and it seems to work OK.
-----Original Message-----
From: PKrotje(at)aol.com [mailto:PKrotje(at)aol.com]
Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 1999 5:28 PM
...
<< What do you antenna-experienced guys think about the following:
I have been looking for the best antenna install location on the MKiii, and
like the suggestion from someo >>
On my Mark III I used a fibreglass composite antenna from Gulf Coast
Avionics
and installed it in the nose cone. Reception and transmit worked very well
and installation was simple (I duct taped it in until I was sure it worked,
then bonded it in place). Cost is about $120.00
Pete Krotje
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Jason Omelchuck <jason(at)acuityinc.com> |
Subject: | The order of hinge installation |
What order did everyone install the hinges for the flaps ailerons and
tail surfaces. Did you paint the hinges and install them separately
after the surfaces were painted, this would leave the rivet heads
exposed. Did you paint the color on the wings and surfaces with the
hinges installed? Did you paint the hinges at all?
Should I put my UV blocker in the spray on coat of Poly Brush or should
I put it in the first coat of color, or does it matter?
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Terry Swartz <tswartz(at)desupernet.net> |
Subject: | Re: Antenna stuff |
> Pete
I considered using that antenna also, but it seemed too long to mount it according
to instructions. How did you mount it?
Terry
> On my Mark III I used a fibreglass composite antenna from Gulf Coast Avionics
> and installed it in the nose cone. Reception and transmit worked very well
> and installation was simple (I duct taped it in until I was sure it worked,
> then bonded it in place). Cost is about $120.00
>
> Pete Krotje
name="tswartz.vcf"
filename="tswartz.vcf"
begin:vcard
n:Swartz;Terry
adr:;;;;;;
version:2.1
email;internet:Tswartz(at)desupernet.net
note:http://users.success.net/tswartz/
fn:Terry Swartz
end:vcard
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Antenna stuff |
From: | blborg(at)juno.com (Bruce l Borg) |
Hi Jim
On my twinstar with own design enclosure , I put my antenna (gas welding
rod) cost a few cents, ahead of the wing at a tubing intersection
(ground plane), and had good results.
Fly down and visit Eyota some time!
Bruce Borg
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | ul15rhb(at)juno.com (Ralph H Burlingame) |
Rut, think about this: if this had been a wood prop, it may have
shattered and who knows what kind of damage it can do then. Those 8mm
muffler bolts can be replaced with drilled heads so they can be safety
wired. Do this so they cannot loosen up.
Ralph Burlingame
Original FireStar, 447 powered
writes:
>Everything was great until postflight inspection of the Firestar. I
discovered that >an exhaust mounting (8mm x 40mm) bolt had worked it's
way out and went >right through the prop ....................
>Moral of the story: I always take time to do a cautious preflight of
>the aircraft and even inspected the bolts prior to taking off. Post
>flight showed that all of the bolts were loose--visual inspection did
>not catch this.
>
>Rutledge Fuller
>Tallahassee, Fl.
>Original Firestar 120 hrs.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
Subject: | Re: Antenna stuff |
>
>What do you antenna-experienced guys think about the following:
>
>I have been looking for the best antenna install location on the MKiii, and
>like the suggestion from someone on this list to put it sticking out the
>bottom of the fuselage behind the pilot. But this means it could be only
>about 10 inches long before a bend backward, to keep it off the ground. I
>understand from Adrio that the bend will cause the polarization to cross
>somewhat, so I'd sure like to minimize the horizontal length.
For what it's worth, my antenna sticks down about 5-6" before it turns
back horizontal, and it does'nt know if it's on the North or South
polarazation. But I can ask my cohorts at the tower how it sounds from 20
miles out and 1000" agl, and they say it sounds normal.
I am using a Terra 720 handheld and a Blackhawk 4DX headset, (the cheap
one).
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
Oldest Controller at TRI for 9 more months!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard <swidersk(at)digital.net> |
Subject: | Re:Rotax/Hirth Comparison |
An interesting discussion at: http://www.ultralightnews.com/buz/rtxhirt.html
Judge for yourself, probably some bias & some truth?
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "John Hauck" <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Antenna stuff |
>
>What do you antenna-experienced guys think about the following:
>
>I have been looking for the best antenna install location on the MKiii, and
Howdy Gang:
I mounted the antenna on Firestar and MK III under the nosepod. Riveted a
round 12" or so dia groundplane to mount it on. I use ELT antennas for ELT
and for VHF voice. They are inexpensive, have BNC connector already
attached, are cut and tuned for 121.5, which is right in the ball park for
freq range. Any of the acft supply houses handles them, Gulf Coast
Avionics, and others.
I use a 1989 King KX99 handheld VHF (purchased new in 1989) that flew in FS
and is now in MKIII. Bought a new nicad battery for big flt in 94, to make
sure I had no battery problems on trip. That was 4 1/2 years ago and the
original battery (9 yrs old) is still operational. Sent the KX99 back to
King for some work once. Was repaired, yellow tagged, and promptly
returned. I'm happy with my setup and get many compliments on my "real
airplane" sounding radio by other "real" airplane pilots as well as
controllers. BTW, I have a 45 deg bend in my antenna, per instructions
received with antenna. Could have left straight or bent. I may be cross
polarized, but if it works what difference does it make.
john h (still freezing his buns in hauck's holler, Alabama)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | WGeorge737(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: Shipping-Mk-III/Firestar? |
Thanks for the info. "Scratches are not approved."
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Jim Cowen <jcowen(at)apk.net> |
Subject: | Re: Looking for Mark 111 |
I live in Medina, and have also heard from an owner in Lagrange, which is not to
far-neither is Warren really as my first girlfriend some 38 years ago was from
warren. Used to wear a hole in the highway going to see her.
I have a private ticket (not active) and have had several small aircraft over
the years. A Luscombe which I purchased for the outragous price of 1200 and a
150, for which I had to dole out all of 3500. Those prices will give you an idea
of my age (57 and counting).
The fellow from Lagrange is Dave Lister and he has a Mark 111 with a 912 Rotex.
A pricey engine but not out of the question. Currently looking for a plane for
sale or still thinking about building also. Planning to got to the Kolb factory
in a couple of weeks.
Would like to get your opinion before I make any commitment. Had considered the
Challanger, but would prefer side by side- and the Kolb looks more substantial.
Jim Cowen
F J MARINO wrote:
>
> I have a MKIII with a 582 on it and dual controls, I live in Warren Ohio, I
> have a buddy with a Fire Star KXP but you would have to take a drink of saki
> and tie on your kamakazi scarf to fly it. What part of Ohio are you in.
>
> Frank
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jim Cowen <jcowen(at)apk.net>
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Monday, January 04, 1999 4:21 PM
> Subject: Kolb-List: Looking for Mark 111
>
> >
> >I'am interested in purchasing a Kolb Mark 111 and would prefer something
> >east of Mississippi. Also would like to know of anyone in the Ohio area
> >that would give instruction in the Mark 111. Please reply by email.
> >Thanks
> >Jim Cowen
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Mark E Navratil" <menavrat(at)crnotes.collins.rockwell.com> |
Hey all,
I am interested in hearing from those who are flying with the 912 (better
yet, those who've flown both the 912 and various Rotax 2-strokes). I'm
debating between the 912 and 582 on a Slingshot. Aside from the obvious
difference in cost (which might be offset somewhat over a long period of
time because of the 912's higher TBO and lower fuel consumption), is there
any real statistical evidence that the 912 is more reliable? This is not
intended to re-ignite the 2- vs. 4-stroke debate, but overall the
perception seems to be that the 912 would be the more reliable choice.
Also interested in vibration levels. I remember a while back Dennis
reporting on the HKS testing, and stating that it had significantly higher
vibration levels than the Rotax 2-strokes. How does the 912 compare to a
2-stroke like the 582 in vibration and noise levels?
The 912 is heavier than a 582 with electric start, but it uses less fuel
which would seem to offset the slight loss in useful load---not to mention
the extra 15 horses.
In short: the cost issue aside, is there anybody out there who wouldn't
want to run a 912, and if not, why?
Thanks,
--Mark Navratil
Systems Engineer, Rockwell Collins
Cedar Rapids, IA
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Cavuontop(at)aol.com |
Hey . . . send some photos along. You are welcomeme to look at my page too.
The N496BM
Homepage
Mark Sellers
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
Subject: | Re: The order of hinge installation |
>
>What order did everyone install the hinges for the flaps ailerons and
>tail surfaces. Did you paint the hinges and install them separately
>after the surfaces were painted, this would leave the rivet heads
>exposed. Did you paint the color on the wings and surfaces with the
>hinges installed? Did you paint the hinges at all?
>
Installed the hinges and the gap seal strip, then painted.
CAUTION! Make sure the ailerons and flaps do not lay over against the
rear spar for a couple days until the paint gets real hard,
Otherwise it will stick to itself and pull off in spots. Stits does
not seem to dry hard as quick as Randolph or other types of more
traditional "dopes" type aircraft paint.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Cavuontop(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: The order of hinge installation |
In a message dated 1/9/99 11:09:25 AM Eastern Standard Time,
rpike(at)preferred.com writes:
<< Did you paint the color on the wings and surfaces with the
>hinges installed? Did you paint the hinges at all? >>
I used clecos to hold everything together until the last possible moment.
I drilled the holes for the hinges and fit all the parts up prior to covering.
After covering but before painting I used a soldering iron to poke through the
holes for the aileron an d flaps. That way I could paint all the parts
separately. It was much more convenient. I used DuPont Centauri on the
hinges and other metal parts. I found that Stits Polytone doesn't stick to
metal for spit. I hear that if you use their epoxy primer and then spray on
the Polytone before it cures up completely you can get decent adhesion. I
never tried it.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "John Hauck" <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Kolb-List message posted by: "Mark E Navratil"
>
>
>In short: the cost issue aside, is there anybody out there who wouldn't
>want to run a 912, and if not, why?
Hi Gang:
You guys knew I would have to add my 2 cents worth, didn't you.
Flew my 912 powered MK III a couple days ago and logged 994.5 hours. Lost
eng 2 times because of water in fuel (1st time) and trash in fuel (2d time).
Normal maintenance consist of plugs every 200 hrs, oil and fil every 100
hrs. Other than that, keep the bolts tight and oil the K&N air filters
every once in a while. Damn reliable eng.
Flew my MK III with 582 for a couple hundred hrs before the 912 (MK III
airframe now has 1226.0 hrs). The 912 changed the character of the airplane
a bit. It now has a more solid, reliable feel to it. I have run the Hell
out of the 912, on occassion 8,9,10, and an 11 or 12 hour day. Until
recently hasn't used any oil, but I think it may be using a little now, not
enough to add any between changes.
I'm happy with my setup.
john h (hauck's holler, alabama)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Cavuontop(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 1/9/99 5:23:11 PM Eastern Standard Time,
hawk36(at)mindspring.com writes:
<< In short: the cost issue aside, is there anybody out there who wouldn't
>want to run a 912, and if not, why? >>
Here's my two cents. The preface is that I have a 582 on a mark 3. I have
spent some time looking at the 912 instalation on the factory mark 3 and it
sure looks like a big bunch of tubes and wires. It sounds like John Hauk set
his up well and could then more or less forget about it. The 582 is less
complicated.
I once heard Dennis say that in his mind the optimum setup for the mark 3
was a 582 with a B box and no electric start, largely because it was so light.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | dleister <dleister(at)eriecoast.com> |
Richard Bluhm wrote:
>
> Hey, you guy's...
> I can't put any photo's on this list, but if you would like to see a
> photo of my plane, I will respond to your "personal" email address.. My
> plane is a GOOD-LOOKER.
> regards
> Doc.
>
I would like to see the pictures
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Subject: | Re: The order of hinge installation |
I'm not to the cover and paint point yet, but in setting up the moving
components I did the same as cavuontop, and it works very well. However,
in some cases the clecos limit movement, so I used a minimum of soft
aluminum rivets from Ace Hardware. They drill out easily without damaging
the hole, are cheap, and give accurate line-up with full range of motion,
so you can check for interference and fit, etc. With care and gentleness,
you can use the drill to cut the head off the al rivet, then snap punch the
body on through, and the drill doesn't even go through the hole a 2nd
time. Big Lar.
----------
> From: Cavuontop(at)aol.com
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: The order of hinge installation
> Date: Saturday, January 09, 1999 8:16 AM
>
>
> In a message dated 1/9/99 11:09:25 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> rpike(at)preferred.com writes:
>
> << Did you paint the color on the wings and surfaces with the
> >hinges installed? Did you paint the hinges at all? >>
>
>
> I used clecos to hold everything together until the last possible
moment.
> I drilled the holes for the hinges and fit all the parts up prior to
covering.
> After covering but before painting I used a soldering iron to poke
through the
> holes for the aileron an d flaps. That way I could paint all the parts
> separately. It was much more convenient. I used DuPont Centauri on the
> hinges and other metal parts. I found that Stits Polytone doesn't stick
to
> metal for spit. I hear that if you use their epoxy primer and then spray
on
> the Polytone before it cures up completely you can get decent adhesion.
I
> never tried it.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
The point was soon made after my last message about the drilled off ends of
rivets rattling around inside the structures. All of the components are
open at the ends. Just shake the pieces out. Only place where that's
difficult is the vertical tail tube. If you have clecoed it on for trial
fitting, just take if off and shake it out. Even if you've rivetted it
solid (as I did) there's only 6 little pieces sitting down there, and I
don't really think they'll hurt anything. Certainly don't weigh much, and
I just went out and shook hell out of it, and got rattles and squeaks all
over the place. Can't tell which, if any, were rivet pieces bouncing
around. Enjoy. Big Lar.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Bluhm <irena(at)ccis.com> |
Subject: | error-error-error |
Looking for:
Someone with a title something like "DAEMON(at)otto.ccis.com" .
Your e-mail has jumped back at me. I made a mistake somewhere but don't
know where. If you still want the photo, send the request to my private
e-mail and that way I can't make a mistake with yours???? (What'd he
say?????)
Doc
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Jerry Bidle <jbidle(at)airmail.net> |
Subject: | Re: Dauid engines |
David haed a distibutor in Ca and has done some advertising in Ultralight
flyer magazine back in March April May time frame. Earthstar flew one of
their engines to Oshkosh and back to CA. Their holding comments since they
didn't have a good match of prop to engine nor jeeting. It turns backwards
from the Rotax. What I picked up is they are hopped up Honda Industrial
engines. Question is will they hold together running at the speed their
being pushed to. Little hour base to base a conclusion. Some of their
documentation conflicts between the figures provided.
Bye Jerry
>
>Hi all. I recently found a web page for a europeanengine manufacturer
>called "David". He has four engines in his line including a single cylinder
>4 stroke 35 hp engine that weighs only 57 pounds w/belt drive.
>Can anyone provide me with info/experience with this product?
>
>Bob
>original FS Rotax 377
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Scott Bentley <Scott.Bentley(at)Bentley.COM> |
I fly a Mark III with a 912.
I doubt you'll find an economic justification on better fuel economy, but I
once discussed this briefly with Homer Kolb, and he said something along the
line that anyone that could fly with a 4 stroke should, since in his
experience they were much more reliable.
For what little I could add to that, I agree.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Jason Omelchuck <jason(at)acuityinc.com> |
Subject: | Painting and hinges |
Richard: Did you paint the hinges with Polytone? Did you alodyne them
or paint them with epoxy primer? Is the paint sticking OK to them? I
will be using the book binding tape method of gapsealing because people
on this list have said it works well and with the cloth method the paint
will crack off eventually, have you found this to be true? It was my
understanding that the book binding tape is applied after everything is
painted, please anyone correct me if this is wrong.
Richard wrote:
Installed the hinges and the gap seal strip, then painted.
CAUTION! Make sure the ailerons and flaps do not lay over against the
rear spar for a couple days until the paint gets real hard,
Otherwise it will stick to itself and pull off in spots. Stits does
not seem to dry hard as quick as Randolph or other types of more
traditional "dopes" type aircraft paint.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Cavuontop(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: Painting and hinges |
In a message dated 1/11/99 11:17:41 AM Eastern Standard Time,
jason(at)acuityinc.com writes:
<< I
will be using the book binding tape method of gapsealing because people
on this list have said it works well and with the cloth method the paint
will crack off eventually, have you found this to be true? >>
Here is my two cents on the bookbinding tape method. A friend built a
chalenger at the same time I did my mark 3. I used the Stits tape method
described in the manual and painted the tape by hand with polytone and a
brush. My buddy said that was too much work. He went with the book binding
tape and applied one layer bewteen the horizontal stab and the elevator.
After his first flight with the tape I pointed out to him that grass clippings
were stuck to the sticky part of the tape bewteen the two surfaces. He agreed
and removed all the tape and carefully cut another pice of tape longways and
applied it to the sticky side of the tape so it would not be able to pick up
dirt. His position was that if the tape started to deteriorate he would just
replace it. It would be fast and easy. After two years the tape has yellowed
slightly and is still flexible. But more interestingly it has also shrunk
slightly. The shrinkage pulled the tape back from its original position
leaving residual tape adhesive in the place where it was. That adhesive has
picked up dirt and my friend now has yellowed tape and grimy black lines at
the edges of the tape. The tape is still servicable and flexible but he is
not sure what solvent to use to get the adhesive/grime off the stits without
hurting the fabric, plus the thought of having to remake the double sided tape
gapseals looks like alot more trouble than just slapping down a single piece
of tape like he originally contemplated.
My stits tape gap seals look exactly the same.
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Painting and hinges |
From: | rbaker2(at)juno.com (Ray L Baker) |
REMOVING THE STICKY RESIDUE
I would try Goo Gone or De-Solv-It, citrus solutions, available at
Wal-mart/Kmart etc. Seems to work on most adhesives and safe for paints.
I would try it on a test patch 1st just to be safe.
L. Ray Baker
Lake Butler, Fl
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
Subject: | Re: Cross Country---Florida |
On Mon, 11 Jan 1999, Bob Gross wrote:
> I will be glad to have you stop by as well. I live at an airpark called
> Tailwinds id-FD15 located abt 12nm north of PBI. let me know if you need
> fuel etc.
You guys in FL are getting to me. In the central CA valley we haven't
seen the sun in over a week, except for a minor teaser last Friday
afternoon. The very best we got out of Sat and Sunday was 2 miles
visibility, ~1000' clg, 40deg F, and that was when it got good for
1.5 hours in the afternoon.
Blue sky on one day of one weekend ...is that sooooo much to ask?!!!
-Ben 'fog bound and sick of chores' Ransom
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Skip Staub <skips(at)bhip.infi.net> |
Subject: | Re: Cross Country---Florida |
>>did a compression check on the
>> engine and the front cyl was 115lbs and the rear cyl was 120, the book said
>> it shoukd be from 100 to 120 so I guess I'm in the ballpark,
Just curious.... We are working with aircraft engines, both 2 and 4
stroke. (haven't heard of any single cycle aircraft powerplants:-) Why
then don't we use a differential compression check as we would with
certified engines?
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Cross Country---Florida |
Hi Guys;
You think it is bad down there, it hasn't gotten above 0 here for the last
three weeks. The temp last night was 26 below. I wonder if Ralph is flying
in this?
Kent
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
Subject: | Re: Painting and hinges |
>
>Richard: Did you paint the hinges with Polytone? Did you alodyne them
>or paint them with epoxy primer? Is the paint sticking OK to them? I
>will be using the book binding tape method of gapsealing because people
>on this list have said it works well and with the cloth method the paint
>will crack off eventually, have you found this to be true? It was my
>understanding that the book binding tape is applied after everything is
>painted, please anyone correct me if this is wrong.
>
>Richard wrote:
> Installed the hinges and the gap seal strip, then painted.
>CAUTION! Make sure the ailerons and flaps do not lay over against the
>rear spar for a couple days until the paint gets real hard,
>Otherwise it will stick to itself and pull off in spots. Stits does
>not seem to dry hard as quick as Randolph or other types of more
>traditional "dopes" type aircraft paint.
> Richard Pike
> MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
>
Scruffed them up with Scotchbrite, wiped them down with MEK thinner and
painted them with Polybrush, Poly spray, and what ever the Poly-Color
topcoat is called. Still look great. The fabric gapseals still look great too.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
Subject: | Re: Painting and hinges |
>
> Here is my two cents on the bookbinding tape method.
That adhesive has picked up dirt and my friend now has yellowed tape and
grimy black lines at the edges of the tape. The tape is still servicable
and flexible but he is not sure what solvent to use to get the
adhesive/grime off the stits without hurting the fabric, plus the thought
of having to remake the double sided tape gapseals looks like alot more
trouble than just slapping down a single piece of tape like he originally
contemplated.
My stits tape gap seals look exactly the same.
I bet that GOO GONE will clean it up fine without any damage.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
Subject: | 4 point harnesses |
Yesterday I got out the new 4 point harnesses I bought this
summer and started trying to figure out how to attach them to the front
spar carrythrough with that big gas tank in there, when the good lookin'
Old Poop comes over to see what I'm doing. I show her the new, fancy
harnesses. She says they are very nice, but she liked the old ones
just fine.
FOR SALE: 2 Brand New 4-point seat belt harness assemblys.
Shoulder harness is Y-style, with adjusters. Lap belts have adjusters
both sides with standard style buckles. Color is bright blue.
Sold as a set for cost plus shipping, $125.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Subject: | Re: Cross Country---Florida |
Guess I'd better not brag about beautiful, sunny, warm Palm Springs then.
No telling how many feelings I might hurt. Then too, I sure hate to see
grown men cry. I can smirk now, and it IS great, but I know you can all
remember a different tune from me last summer. Big Lar. Do
not archive.
----------
> From: Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu>
> To: Kolb
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Cross Country---Florida
> Date: Monday, January 11, 1999 2:24 PM
>
>
> On Mon, 11 Jan 1999, Bob Gross wrote:
> > I will be glad to have you stop by as well. I live at an airpark called
> > Tailwinds id-FD15 located abt 12nm north of PBI. let me know if you
need
> > fuel etc.
>
> You guys in FL are getting to me. In the central CA valley we haven't
> seen the sun in over a week, except for a minor teaser last Friday
> afternoon. The very best we got out of Sat and Sunday was 2 miles
> visibility, ~1000' clg, 40deg F, and that was when it got good for
> 1.5 hours in the afternoon.
>
> Blue sky on one day of one weekend ...is that sooooo much to ask?!!!
>
> -Ben 'fog bound and sick of chores' Ransom
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Hi Group: Sometimes the simplest things can get you down. Anyone
building or planning to build a VW engine will want to check this out.
When I started engine assembly, I trial fitted everything, measured
everything, read all my ( sometimes contradictory ) books, talked to
supposed experts and the whole nine yards. When all was just right, I
disassembled, lubed all the components, including the special stuff for the
cam and lifters, and coated the mating edges with Permatex Aviation. I
know some will say, " oh no, not that stuff. " Others will say the
opposite. Mated the 2 halves, snugged them down gently with washers and
nuts, checked freedom of movement, etc., timed the engine, then installed
the cylinders and pistons. When all that was checked out and fine, then
started replacing the nuts with nyloc nuts. No, not on the cylinder heads.
The bad news - - - the nylocs turn out to be about 1/8" thicker than the
stock nuts. The studs are seated deeply enough in the case so that the top
of the studs just about touches the nylon inserts. No such thing as 2
threads above the nut. Never, ever dreamed of such a thing. You shoulda
heard the language when what I was seeing sank in. So, what I spent last
weekend doing is pulling studs. What a beast of a job. Stud pullers don't
reach some, (too thick) some are ruined and had to be replaced, they're all
sticky with sealer, loctite doesn't seem to want to stick very well with
whatever the factory used, and at this stage I'm real reluctant to separate
the case halves again. If only one of the books had said something, or one
of the " pro's " had said something, or if the special purpose locknut kit
had had a warning in it. S.O.a.B ! ! ! I know the nylocs aren't
strictly necessary, but I feel better with them. I also know I can drill
and safety wire the stock nuts, but that's a heck of a job in its' own
right. So take heed, sports fans, what a mess. Big Lar.
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Kolb-List 912 vs. 582 |
From: | czechsix(at)juno.com (Mark E Navratil) |
>Subject: RE: Kolb-List: 912 vs. 582
>
>
>
>I fly a Mark III with a 912.
>
>I doubt you'll find an economic justification on better fuel economy,
>but I
>once discussed this briefly with Homer Kolb, and he said something
>along the
>line that anyone that could fly with a 4 stroke should, since in his
>experience they were much more reliable.
>
>For what little I could add to that, I agree.
>
Thanks for the input. Now I need to go clean out my piggy bank and see
if I can afford a 912. BTW, has anyone seen the new 912 S rated at 100
hp? There's some good info on it on Zenith's website. Sounds like it's
not much different from the 912 UL but they've done some internal
workings to cams, etc, to get the extra boost. A 25% increase in power
with (apparently) no additional weight or complexity. Wonder if
reliability will suffer any......and I haven't seen a price.
Could the Slingshot handle 100hp? Dennis?????
--Mark Navratil
Systems Engineer, Rockwell Collins
Cedar Rapids, IA
PS--along a different note, I haven't heard from anyone building a Laser.
Is anyone out there building one yet? How many have been sold....?
--Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | gerken(at)us.ibm.com |
Subject: | painting and hinges for Jason |
Jason
wrote:_____________________________________________________________________
___________
>From: Jason Omelchuck <jason(at)acuityinc.com>
>Subject: Kolb-List: Painting and hinges
>Richard: Did you paint the hinges with Polytone? Did you alodyne them
>or paint them with epoxy primer? Is the paint sticking OK to them? I
>will be using the book binding tape method of gapsealing because people
>on this list have said it works well and with the cloth method the paint
>will crack off eventually, have you found this to be true? It was my
>understanding that the book binding tape is applied after everything is
>painted, please anyone correct me if this is wrong.
Jason, if you are still determined to use the bookbinding tape, please go
to the Matronics page and use the search engine with:
gap & seal & fabric & tape
as your search criteria. You will be returned thirty-some messages that
summarize the gap seal issue real well. Also included is the 3M tape
number. And you will find my reference to successfully using PPG Wax and
grease remover to clean the adhesive easily (along with some other ideas
that did not work for me). Also, there is a note describing my method of
application with a pvc tube.
Painting: What I did seems like a lot of work but I could not think of a
better way, and they turned out perfect. I layed out the paint scheme with
everything assembled, with the hinges screwed on with sheetmetal screws,
marking the fabric with masking tape for the paint lines. Then I painted
each pc seperately (each wing, each aileron, etc). Then I brought them
back together and marked the hinges to match (the three-color paint scheme
crosses four hinges, the remaining hinges are solid white). The hinges
were scotchbrited, epoxy primed, and poly tone painted while primer was
curing. Adhesion is good, only one place later came off, probably had oil
on it. Final assembly was next, rivetting the hinges in place. Last the
tape was applied, with the wings hanging with trailing edges at eye-level
in the shop.
USE the 3" tape. 2" is too narrow and will pull off. Cover the center
with 1", as described in an earlier post, to minimize the dirt, try to make
it color-coordinated tape if you can.
For anyone who hasn't tried it, BUY A $20 airbrush for all the details.
You will love it.
good luck
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Dennis Souder <flykolb(at)epix.net> |
Subject: | Re: Kolb-List 912 vs. 582 |
>
>Could the Slingshot handle 100hp? Dennis?????
>
Could your budget handle having your taxes increased by 25%???
Nope.
Dennis Souder
Pres Kolb Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Hello again folks: An add on to wrap up last nights' crying over my
lock nuts. Pulling and re-seating the 8 mm studs was a raging pain in the
neck, as well as messy. Had to replace 3 that I chewed the threads on, but
they're done and secure. The big 12 mm were a different story. I pulled
the upper on the transmission end of the engine, and had fits getting it
back in with any loctite on it. Forgot about the fat O-ring that goes on
that stud between the case halves to prevent oil leaks. It very
efficiently squeegeed the loctite off the threads, as well as wanting to
shift without the stud to hold it in place. Wound up applying loctite with
a long pipe cleaner, and VERY carefully turning the stud back in. Now,
sitting here in retrospect, I can picture that squeezed off loctite inside
that engine, above the O-ring, inside the stud channel, all nice and cured.
Do I really expect to get that engine apart sometime down the road ??
That's RED loctite I used in there, friends. On those, it seems much
preferable to drill the nuts and safety wire them. In retrospect, it would
probably ( make that certainly ) have been better to go ahead and drill and
safety wire the 8 mm's as well. Seems to me that I've mentioned before
that I tend to be a little stubborn. You might even say " Stub-Bourne."
Oh well. Happy Easter or something. Big Lar.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Duncan McBride" <dmcbride(at)indigo.fgcu.edu> |
I got half of Kit #1 last night and sorted parts. Got to call around about
powder coating today, and get a hand riveter. Looking at the plans, I'm
thinking about the optional method of attaching the control surface ribs to
the trailing edge by bending the rib 90 degrees and riveting through it. It
leaves the surface perfectly smooth. But for that I'd need a tool that will
bend 5/16 tube with a 3/4 radius. The catalogs have 3 in 1 benders and
lever types and cheap nylons ones that will do 5/16 but they don't specify
the radius, or how nice a job they do. Does anybody have any suggestions?
Many thanks.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
>
>I got half of Kit #1 last night and sorted parts. Got to call around about
>powder coating today, and get a hand riveter. Looking at the plans, I'm
>thinking about the optional method of attaching the control surface ribs to
>the trailing edge by bending the rib 90 degrees and riveting through it. It
>leaves the surface perfectly smooth. But for that I'd need a tool that will
>bend 5/16 tube with a 3/4 radius. The catalogs have 3 in 1 benders and
>lever types and cheap nylons ones that will do 5/16 but they don't specify
>the radius, or how nice a job they do. Does anybody have any suggestions?
>Many thanks.
>
I bent the rear of my ribs 90 degrees and was real pleased with how it
turned out. The tubing bender I used is in the J.C.Whitney catalog .
Looking in catalog 620J, it is on page 175, and is part #81VF2326R and
is
called the Tubing Bender with Angle Gauge for $9.95.
Worked just fine, I don't think it was a 3/4" radius, but whatever it was,
looked OK to me.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Tube bender/Riveters |
From: | rbaker2(at)juno.com (Ray L Baker) |
Duncan,
Which great Kolb are you building?
If you have a compressor available, I suggest you consider a power
riveter.
(I paid Northern Tool $85). These steel rivets are really tough! I
pulled a few by hand just for the experience. It appears that the power
riveter pulls the head of the shank up into the rivet better. Sometimes
the hand pulled ones fall out while the others are really hard to drive
out.
I am a first time builder so MHO is just that.
L. Ray Baker
Lake Butler, Fl
________________________________________________________________________________
Hi All;
Hope everyone is having a good winter. I have a question. I had a friend
make me a prop spacer for my firestar and I was wondering about the gearbox
being able to take the extra weight-inertia of the spacer. The prop is just
about at the max limit of the gear box without the spacer. Will the spacer
make a big difference to the amount of stress on the gearbox? The spacer is
1 lb, 9 oz. Thanks for any info.
Kent
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | rick106(at)juno.com |
Duncan
I used the optional method that you are thinking about , and now that
it is all over with I am glad that I did. When you get the tubeing bender
get the one that has only the 5/16 radius on it I tryed both and by far
like the one with just the 5/16 radius. Good luck take lot of pictures
,cause before you know it , you will be in the air.
Rick Libersat
writes:
>
>
>I got half of Kit #1 last night and sorted parts. Got to call around
>about
>powder coating today, and get a hand riveter. Looking at the plans,
>I'm
>thinking about the optional method of attaching the control surface
>ribs to
>the trailing edge by bending the rib 90 degrees and riveting through
>it. It
>leaves the surface perfectly smooth. But for that I'd need a tool
>that will
>bend 5/16 tube with a 3/4 radius. The catalogs have 3 in 1 benders
>and
>lever types and cheap nylons ones that will do 5/16 but they don't
>specify
>the radius, or how nice a job they do. Does anybody have any
>suggestions?
>Many thanks.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Hansen, Mark" <MHansen(at)ConusNews.com> |
Subject: | Tube bender/Riveters |
rivet gun, Harbor Frieght Tools. Great prices.
> ----------
> From: rbaker2(at)juno.com[SMTP:rbaker2(at)juno.com]
> Reply To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Wednesday, January 13, 1999 6:14 PM
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tube bender/Riveters
>
>
> Duncan,
>
> Which great Kolb are you building?
>
> If you have a compressor available, I suggest you consider a power
> riveter.
> (I paid Northern Tool $85). These steel rivets are really tough! I
> pulled a few by hand just for the experience. It appears that the power
> riveter pulls the head of the shank up into the rivet better. Sometimes
> the hand pulled ones fall out while the others are really hard to drive
> out.
>
> I am a first time builder so MHO is just that.
>
> L. Ray Baker
> Lake Butler, Fl
>
>
>
>
> -
>
> -
>
> -
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Geoff Thistlethwaite" <geoffthis(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Subject: | Re: Painting and hinges |
............and my friend now has yellowed tape and
>grimy black lines at the edges of the tape. The tape is still servicable
>and flexible but he is not sure what solvent to use to get the
>adhesive/grime off the stits without hurting the fabric, plus the thought
>of having to remake the double sided tape gapseals looks like alot more
>trouble than just slapping down a single piece of tape like he originally
>contemplated.
>
> My stits tape gap seals look exactly the same.
>I bet that GOO GONE will clean it up fine without any damage.
> Richard Pike
> MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
If not Bestine will and won't damage the paint.
Geoff Thistlethwaite
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "F J MARINO" <FMARINO(at)netlink1.nlcomm.com> |
Subject: | Re: Tube bender/Riveters |
Mark, I don't know how far into your building you are but one investment I
made was a horizontal metal cutting band saw from Harbor freight it was
about $200 save a lot of time especially when cutting all the pieces for the
wings , and after I was finished I had no problem selling it for almost the
same price. I pulled all the rivets by hand and I think the sugggestion
about the air riveter is a good one.
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: Hansen, Mark <MHansen(at)ConusNews.com>
Date: Thursday, January 14, 1999 12:24 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Tube bender/Riveters
>
>rivet gun, Harbor Frieght Tools. Great prices.
>
>> ----------
>> From: rbaker2(at)juno.com[SMTP:rbaker2(at)juno.com]
>> Reply To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 13, 1999 6:14 PM
>> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tube bender/Riveters
>>
>>
>> Duncan,
>>
>> Which great Kolb are you building?
>>
>> If you have a compressor available, I suggest you consider a power
>> riveter.
>> (I paid Northern Tool $85). These steel rivets are really tough! I
>> pulled a few by hand just for the experience. It appears that the power
>> riveter pulls the head of the shank up into the rivet better. Sometimes
>> the hand pulled ones fall out while the others are really hard to drive
>> out.
>>
>> I am a first time builder so MHO is just that.
>>
>> L. Ray Baker
>> Lake Butler, Fl
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -
>>
>> -
>>
>> -
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
Subject: | Re: Tube bender/Riveters/cutting |
On Thu, 14 Jan 1999, F J MARINO wrote:
> Mark, I don't know how far into your building you are but one investment I
> made was a horizontal metal cutting band saw from Harbor freight it was
I used my radial arm saw. With a normal fine-tooth ChroMoly blade it
goes thru thin aluminum easily (gussets or tubes) and cuts straight lines.
Just hold on tight so it won't grab.
Ben Ransom
http://mae.ucdavis.edu/~ransom
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Erich Weaver 805-683-0200 <sbaew(at)dames.com> |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
Kent:
I just went through this very issue myself, and unfortunately never got a
clear picture. The concern regarding wear and tear of the gear box is
valid. But be aware its not so much the extra weight of the spacer, but
the extra force from the weight of the prop (and the spacer) along an
effectively longer lever. Every inch of prop extension makes that much
longer of a lever for the weight of the prop (and extension) to act on -
all of which must be handeled by the gear box.
I talked to individuals at California Power Systems and Leading Edge
Airfoils (both Rotax distributors), Warp Drive (props), Kolb aircraft,
my mechanic, and of course the Kolb List. No clear consensus; but
clearly the gear box you have, the length of the extension, and the prop
weight all need to be taken into consideration. For my situation, I was
considering an extension for a Warp Drive prop on a Rotax 912. LEAF told
me that prop extensions should not be used, period. CPS told me if I
kept it to 2" or less there shouldnt be a problem. Kolb list replys
varied from a guy using a full 4" extension (originally for an IVO prop
but being used on a Warp Drive) with no reported problems, to grave
concerns regarding the grade of alumiunum necessary and various
engineering properties. After talking it over with my mechanic, Im
limiting my extension to 1", which will give me decent clearance, but
limit the increased force that must be absorbed by the gear box by any
extension. Dan at Kolb seemed to think this was reasonable. If I was
going to use an IVO prop, I probably would have gone for a longer
extension, because the prop weight is reduced.
I would encourage you to figure out the minimum length you really need,
and then make some calls to people who are moost knowledgeable to discuss
your particular situation. Ed Wilson at LEAF (719-683-5323)seems to be
well regarded with respect to Rotax.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Frank_R_Reynen(at)notes.seagate.com |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
I am converting my MKIII to a 912 with 72" 3-blade IVO high pitch prop and
use the IVO supplied 2.5" extension.
IVO states this combo to be capable of handling up to 115hp.
Checked up on the IVO Magnum also but was told that the 72" version weight
is over 22 lbs and almost double the price of a std UL version .
The Lotus floats with their forward CG gives me plenty room to play around
with the engine location.
If I line up the 912 rearmount holes with the centerline of the MKIII
rubber mounts,it will provide 5" clearance for the prop.
Frank Reynen
PS: Still have a good looking RH 66" 3-blade IVO for sale with only 50 hrs
on it.
Kent:
I just went through this very issue myself, and unfortunately never got a
clear picture. The concern regarding wear and tear of the gear box is
valid. But be aware its not so much the extra weight of the spacer, but
the extra force from the weight of the prop (and the spacer) along an
effectively longer lever. Every inch of prop extension makes that much
longer of a lever for the weight of the prop (and extension) to act on -
all of which must be handeled by the gear box.
I talked to individuals at California Power Systems and Leading Edge
Airfoils (both Rotax distributors), Warp Drive (props), Kolb aircraft,
my mechanic, and of course the Kolb List. No clear consensus; but
clearly the gear box you have, the length of the extension, and the prop
weight all need to be taken into consideration. For my situation, I was
considering an extension for a Warp Drive prop on a Rotax 912. LEAF told
me that prop extensions should not be used, period. CPS told me if I
kept it to 2" or less there shouldnt be a problem. Kolb list replys
varied from a guy using a full 4" extension (originally for an IVO prop
but being used on a Warp Drive) with no reported problems, to grave
concerns regarding the grade of alumiunum necessary and various
engineering properties. After talking it over with my mechanic, Im
limiting my extension to 1", which will give me decent clearance, but
limit the increased force that must be absorbed by the gear box by any
extension. Dan at Kolb seemed to think this was reasonable. If I was
going to use an IVO prop, I probably would have gone for a longer
extension, because the prop weight is reduced.
I would encourage you to figure out the minimum length you really need,
and then make some calls to people who are moost knowledgeable to discuss
your particular situation. Ed Wilson at LEAF (719-683-5323)seems to be
well regarded with respect to Rotax.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Frank_R_Reynen(at)notes.seagate.com |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
Consider the following basic loadforces on the propshaft and bearings:(
taken from gearbox design 101)
The weight of the propeller and extension creates a vertical loadforce
which is balanced by the rear bearing in a positive(up) and front bearing
in a negative(down) load. If a typical 10 lbs propeller is extended by 2.5"
it increases the vertical rear bearing load component from 23 to 38 lbs.
Torque transfer from the input shaft gear is transferred to the output
shaft as a torque moment and a horizontal force.The torque component is
passed tru to the prop and the counter torque created by the spinning
propeller balances it out and this does not change by whatever the lenght
of an extension.This is the main loadforce of the outputshaft and its size
is designed to safely handle this by a healthy margin. This leaves us with
the horizontal forces which are split up and absorbed in a horizontal
direction by the bearings which pass them on to the gearbox and are
absorbed by the gearbox/engine. This force is always in a horizontal
direction when the output shaft is above or below the input shaft and will
vary with engine load . In a Rotax 912 gearbox and 168 ftlbs torque(80 HP)
this translates into 896 lbs or 448lbs maximum load per bearing .
It can now easily be seen that by increasing the vertical component by 15
lbs and compounding it with the horizontal load of 448 lbs, the total
loadforce vector acting on the bearing and output shaft increases by only
1 lb!
A badly vibrating engine or an out of balance propeller can easily increase
these bearing and shaft loads by a much larger margin.
The propeller also creates an axial force on the output shaft and this
load is in a different direction again.The front bearing with lower forces
acting on it is typically called upon to absorb this force pushing the
plane foreward and an extension does not change anything.
Frank Reynen MKIII
http://www.webcom.com/reynen/mark3.html
Kent:
I just went through this very issue myself, and unfortunately never got a
clear picture. The concern regarding wear and tear of the gear box is
valid. But be aware its not so much the extra weight of the spacer, but
the extra force from the weight of the prop (and the spacer) along an
effectively longer lever. Every inch of prop extension makes that much
longer of a lever for the weight of the prop (and extension) to act on -
all of which must be handeled by the gear box.
I talked to individuals at California Power Systems and Leading Edge
Airfoils (both Rotax distributors), Warp Drive (props), Kolb aircraft,
my mechanic, and of course the Kolb List. No clear consensus; but
clearly the gear box you have, the length of the extension, and the prop
weight all need to be taken into consideration. For my situation, I was
considering an extension for a Warp Drive prop on a Rotax 912. LEAF told
me that prop extensions should not be used, period. CPS told me if I
kept it to 2" or less there shouldnt be a problem. Kolb list replys
varied from a guy using a full 4" extension (originally for an IVO prop
but being used on a Warp Drive) with no reported problems, to grave
concerns regarding the grade of alumiunum necessary and various
engineering properties. After talking it over with my mechanic, Im
limiting my extension to 1", which will give me decent clearance, but
limit the increased force that must be absorbed by the gear box by any
extension. Dan at Kolb seemed to think this was reasonable. If I was
going to use an IVO prop, I probably would have gone for a longer
extension, because the prop weight is reduced.
I would encourage you to figure out the minimum length you really need,
and then make some calls to people who are moost knowledgeable to discuss
your particular situation. Ed Wilson at LEAF (719-683-5323)seems to be
well regarded with respect to Rotax.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Patty & Phil MacGregor" <pattym(at)lushen.com> |
Hi,
I built an ultrastar, cage and all and used a tubing cutter purchased from
the hardware for about 8 bucks. It worked really good and gave a clean 90
degree cut on the ends of the tube. Worked on aluminum and 4130 steel. Just
an idea.
Phil MacGregor
Hibernating Ultrastar.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
>Torque transfer from the input shaft gear is transferred to the output
>shaft as a torque moment and a horizontal force The torque component is
>passed tru to the prop and the counter torque created by the spinning
>propeller balances it out and this does not change by whatever the lenght
>of an extension
You are forgetting an important part of the calculation, the gyroscopic
forces, you are putting a great deal of stress on the bearings when you turn
your aircraft due to that big gyroscopic spinner called a prop, this does
not really want to change direction when the aeroplane does and that force
is taken up in the bearings A longer shaft will change the moment arm to the
bearing causing a lot more force on these bearings
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Mick Fine <froghair(at)busprod.com> |
Subject: | Re: Tube cutting |
>
>Hi,
> I built an ultrastar, cage and all and used a tubing cutter purchased from
>the hardware for about 8 bucks. It worked really good and gave a clean 90
>degree cut on the ends of the tube. Worked on aluminum and 4130 steel. Just
>an idea.
>
>
>Phil MacGregor
>Hibernating Ultrastar.
Hi Phil,
Welcome to the list!
Now, about that tubing cutter - not good advice! The construction manual
for my Twinstar (1984) has a caution against using a tube cutter. The
manual for my Flyer (1982) doesn't (at least none I could find in a 10
minute search).
The reason for avoiding a tube cutter is that it induces stress on the
tubing as it cuts. This "work-hardens" the tube right at the cut making it
more brittle and prone to cracking. A saw cut is much less stressful (on
the tube - NOT the builder of course).
-Mick Fine
Tulsa, Oklahoma
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/froghair
Green Country Ultralight Flyer's Organization (UFO)
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/gcufo
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
Hi Guys;
I guess I should have given the specs on my gearbox and prop. They are, B
box, Powerfin prop 58 in. 3 blade which is close to the limit of the B box
without the extension. The extension is a 2.5 in. aluminum that is 1 lb,9 oz.
I seem to be getting a lot of different info on if it will work or not. Keep
it coming, I will figure it out yet.
Kent
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard <swidersk(at)digital.net> |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
Hello Listers,
I too am of the understanding that the gyroscopic forces are by far the most
severe forces to be considered. Any sudden pitch or yaw change takes the
enormous energy stored in the spinning prop & transfers it 90 degrees, which
will always be seen as a bending force on the prop shaft. To make matters
worse, the force is not linear but rather it is squared. Eg, if you double the
distance of your spacer say from 1" to 2", then the force is not twice as great,
but rather 4 times as great, & if you went to 4", it would be 16 times greater.
Even considering extending our props ought to make us shiver a little,
especially in planes that have powerful pitch authority combined with large
diameter props like Kolbs.
wood wrote:
>
>
> >Torque transfer from the input shaft gear is transferred to the output
> >shaft as a torque moment and a horizontal force The torque component is
> >passed tru to the prop and the counter torque created by the spinning
> >propeller balances it out and this does not change by whatever the lenght
> >of an extension
>
> You are forgetting an important part of the calculation, the gyroscopic
> forces, you are putting a great deal of stress on the bearings when you turn
> your aircraft due to that big gyroscopic spinner called a prop, this does
> not really want to change direction when the aeroplane does and that force
> is taken up in the bearings A longer shaft will change the moment arm to the
> bearing causing a lot more force on these bearings
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
You bet ! ! ! The gyroscopic force is the big, bad boogeyman ! ! !
Richard's reply below is right on the money. For an easily seen example,
take a regular bicycle wheel, ( 26" ?? ) and hold it by the axle shafts -
one on each index finger. Get the wheel spinning, the faster the better,
then take one hand away. Gyro forces will balance the wheel on one finger,
and it will turn ( precess ) around you, so that you'll have to turn to
follow it. Now for the kicker - support it on both fingers again, one on
each side. Get it spinning as fast as you can, hold each axle TIGHTLY, and
try and turn that wheel. If you've never done it before, you'll be amazed.
Multiply that X the weight and diameter of your prop - - turning at 2500
RPM, and you've got an enormous amount of force. Big Lar.
----------
> From: Richard <swidersk(at)digital.net>
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Prop Extenstion
> Date: Thursday, January 14, 1999 7:41 PM
>
>
> Hello Listers,
> I too am of the understanding that the gyroscopic forces are by far
the most
> severe forces to be considered. Any sudden pitch or yaw change takes the
> enormous energy stored in the spinning prop & transfers it 90 degrees,
which
> will always be seen as a bending force on the prop shaft. To make
matters
> worse, the force is not linear but rather it is squared. Eg, if you
double the
> distance of your spacer say from 1" to 2", then the force is not twice as
great,
> but rather 4 times as great, & if you went to 4", it would be 16 times
greater.
> Even considering extending our props ought to make us shiver a little,
> especially in planes that have powerful pitch authority combined with
large
> diameter props like Kolbs.
>
> wood wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > >Torque transfer from the input shaft gear is transferred to the output
> > >shaft as a torque moment and a horizontal force The torque component
is
> > >passed tru to the prop and the counter torque created by the spinning
> > >propeller balances it out and this does not change by whatever the
lenght
> > >of an extension
> >
> > You are forgetting an important part of the calculation, the
gyroscopic
> > forces, you are putting a great deal of stress on the bearings when you
turn
> > your aircraft due to that big gyroscopic spinner called a prop, this
does
> > not really want to change direction when the aeroplane does and that
force
> > is taken up in the bearings A longer shaft will change the moment arm
to the
> > bearing causing a lot more force on these bearings
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | John Hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Hi Gang:
Been flying for 994.5 hours with my 912 and MK III combo. Of the 994.5
hours at least 950 or 975 have been with my own "shade tree" prop
extension, about 2 inches.
Have had no problems so far. Much better with prop extension than with
prop smacking leading edge tube of flap and flap horn.
john h (1226.0 on the airframe. Will increase that number this weekend if
the rain stops.)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Tim.Hrib(at)carefirst.com |
Subject: | Re: Tube bender/Riveters |
todd, in response to your hand riviting message. tell me about it
brother. i hand rivited an ultrastar together,... twice ! why twice you
say ? well, s - - t happens ya know . ........................... tim
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Christopher John Armstrong" <Tophera(at)centuryinter.net> |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
> The weight of the propeller and extension creates a vertical loadforce
>which is balanced by the rear bearing in a positive(up) and front bearing
>in a negative(down) load. If a typical 10 lbs propeller is extended by 2.5"
>it increases the vertical rear bearing load component from 23 to 38 lbs.
>Torque transfer from the input shaft gear is transferred to the output
>shaft as a torque moment and a horizontal force.
When you pull a couple of g's that 10 pounds becomes twenty pounds...
I think that the inertial forces are what you need to worry about. When you
spin this long stick it becomes a great gyro and does not want to rotate.
But inevitably the plane rotates as it flies and drags the prop rotational
axis around with it fighting the gyro forces. As prop rotational inertia
(mass and or blade length) increases or distance from the bearings (prop
extension) increases the gyro forces on the shaft bearings go up. I think
that these forces are probably higher then the 10 pounds of the Ivo or 20
pounds of a warp drive. When you size a part like this you have to size it
for the worsed case combination of all loads... the plane pulling max g's,
pitching up, rolling and yawing, the engine transitioning from min to max or
max to min torque... the spike loads of the two stroke engine sending a
torsional power pulse through the drive. You cant just say the prop weighs
~10 pounds and the gear reaction force is ~400 pounds and decide that the
shaft and bearing are up to the task. I am not a structures guy but it is
not that simple a problem.
Topher
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | WGeorge737(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extensions |
John:
I noted in one of your earlier posts that the installation of the 912 "changed
the character" of the airplane. Can you amplify for me? I am in the process of
purchasing a Mk III and someday might like to go with the 4 stroker..
Thanks
Bill George
Honokaa--the Big Island
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
I too am going to chime in on this as another shade-tree engineer.
I've thought the gyro forces are significant, but not necessarily
something we need to get too concerned about, especially wrt the prop
extension. Planes change direction relatively slowly so I would think
that gyro forces would be low because they are induced over the time
to change pitch or yaw. I have heard too though (years ago), that lower
gyro forces is one of the minor advantages of going from a large diameter
2-blade prop to a smaller diam 3-blade prop. A prop extension doesn't do
much to gyro loads because it's added mass is close to the radial center
line -- it poses little difference in torque load for that same reason.
Within typical props we use I would say the biggest factor in gearbox
or prop drive bearing life is having a balanced prop and good engine
timing -- these two things mean balanced load (prop) and smooth forces
(piston stroke). Ok, oil in the gearbox is good too. :)
-Ben 'praying to the weather gods' Ransom
On Thu, 14 Jan 1999, Richard wrote:
>
> Hello Listers,
> I too am of the understanding that the gyroscopic forces are by far the most
> severe forces to be considered. Any sudden pitch or yaw change takes the
> enormous energy stored in the spinning prop & transfers it 90 degrees, which
> will always be seen as a bending force on the prop shaft. To make matters
> worse, the force is not linear but rather it is squared. Eg, if you double the
> distance of your spacer say from 1" to 2", then the force is not twice as great,
> but rather 4 times as great, & if you went to 4", it would be 16 times greater.
> Even considering extending our props ought to make us shiver a little,
> especially in planes that have powerful pitch authority combined with large
> diameter props like Kolbs.
>
> wood wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > >Torque transfer from the input shaft gear is transferred to the output
> > >shaft as a torque moment and a horizontal force The torque component is
> > >passed tru to the prop and the counter torque created by the spinning
> > >propeller balances it out and this does not change by whatever the lenght
> > >of an extension
> >
> > You are forgetting an important part of the calculation, the gyroscopic
> > forces, you are putting a great deal of stress on the bearings when you turn
> > your aircraft due to that big gyroscopic spinner called a prop, this does
> > not really want to change direction when the aeroplane does and that force
> > is taken up in the bearings A longer shaft will change the moment arm to the
> > bearing causing a lot more force on these bearings
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Duncan McBride" <dmcbride(at)indigo.fgcu.edu> |
Subject: | Control Surface construction |
The plans offer an alternative to the way the control surface ribs are
connected to the trailing edge that doesn't leave a bump. I'd like to do
the same thing at the leading edge of the control surfaces. I believe using
a gusset on either side of the control surface LE to fasten the ribs would
be as strong as the plans method of riveting the rib directly to the LE. I
wondered about using the cleanest method, that of bending the rib 90 degrees
and riveting to the backside of the LE (offset a little to the side so the
surface of the rib was even with the surface of the LE) Would this be
acceptable?
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | John Hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extensions |
>
>John:
>
>I noted in one of your earlier posts that the installation of the 912
"changed
>the character" of the airplane. Can you amplify for me? I am in the
process of
Hi Bill and Kolb Gang:
I think the 912 changed the character of my MK III, to me as the sole
pilotd/owner:
1. Gave it a more solid/secure feeling.
2. Definitely increased reliability over previous 582 (in my case).
3. Cheaper to operate, so far (994.5 hrs).
4. Really difficult to explain the feeling, but it gives me an overall
feeling of security and well being.
It has been a long time since I have flown my MKIII with a two stroke.
Hard to compare. I get time in the factory Sling Shot w/582 at Lakeland
and OSH, and it feels good too, flying in that type environment anyhow.
I do remember that initially, the first few flights with the 912 that
everything did feel better to me. Never had the engine shut down except
three times, and two of those were the same incident. Both incidents were
caused by fuel contamination which puts the responsibility on my back and
not the engines for not draining fuel prior to takeoff.
john h
PS You guys on the Florida flight, good luck and have a lot of fun, good
winds and warm weather. I am envious.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Bluhm <irena(at)ccis.com> |
Subject: | Re: Control Surface construction |
Duncan McBride wrote:
>
>
> The plans offer an alternative to the way the control surface ribs are
>
> connected to the trailing edge that doesn't leave a bump. I'd like to
> do
> the same thing at the leading edge of the control surfaces. I believe
> using
> a gusset on either side of the control surface LE to fasten the ribs
> would
> be as strong as the plans method of riveting the rib directly to the
> LE. I
> wondered about using the cleanest method, that of bending the rib 90
> degrees
> and riveting to the backside of the LE (offset a little to the side so
> the
> surface of the rib was even with the surface of the LE) Would this be
>
> acceptable?
Hey Duncan,
Here, you must remember the forces. You are turning "only" the leading
edge (so to speak) whenever you activate these surface's. It is the
ribs that spread this (turning) force throughout the surface area. You
are requesting narrowing the distance (or leverage) between these rib
foundations. Do you understand, the wider these attachments are, the
stronger they are??? If you are intent on continuing this survey, I
would ask the big "D" this question. (Big "D" = Dennis Sauder.)
Doc
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Windscreen bolt size |
Plans say bolts that hold windscreen on FS I [the ones that screw in to the
little riveted on nuts] should be "3/16 machine screw". Ace Hardware man
says this is a 10-24 screw but that doesn't seem to want to go in. Can anyone
shed any light on this? Maybe it's a 10-32.
Howard Shackleford
FS I
Lexington, SC
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Tube cutting |
In a message dated 1/14/99 8:06:04 PM Eastern Standard Time,
froghair(at)busprod.com writes:
<< The reason for avoiding a tube cutter is that it induces stress on the
tubing as it cuts. This "work-hardens" the tube right at the cut making it
more brittle and prone to cracking. A saw cut is much less stressful (on
the tube - NOT the builder of course).
-Mick Fine >>
Makes good sense to me!...............GeoR38...but in most cases the very end
of the tube probably wouldn' t have much stress on it anyway, except for use a
s a socket or something like the hole you put your landing gear into, can you
think of others?
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
In a message dated 1/15/99 12:43:13 PM Eastern Standard Time,
ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu writes:
<< A prop extension doesn't do
much to gyro loads because it's added mass is close to the radial center
line -- it poses little difference in torque load for that same reason.
Within typical props we use I would say the biggest factor in gearbox
or prop drive bearing life is having a balanced prop and good engine
timing -- these two things mean balanced load (prop) and smooth forces
(piston stroke). Ok, oil in the gearbox is good too. :)
-Ben 'praying to the weather gods' Ransom >>
This one sounds closer to the world of reality and farther from the world of
academecia.....I'm buying in on Ben............another shade tree engineer and
ol glider pilot where we didn't have to worry about such
things...............GeoR38
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Mick Fine <froghair(at)busprod.com> |
Subject: | Re: Windscreen bolt size |
>
>Plans say bolts that hold windscreen on FS I [the ones that screw in to the
>little riveted on nuts] should be "3/16 machine screw". Ace Hardware man
>says this is a 10-24 screw but that doesn't seem to want to go in. Can
anyone
>shed any light on this? Maybe it's a 10-32.
>
>Howard Shackleford
A standard AN nutplate should be 10-32. Of course, it is likely a lock-nut
but you should still be able to start the first couple turns with
'finger-force'. If it only goes a turn or less before getting tight, you
probably have a mismatch.
BTW - I didn't know Ace sold aircraft grade hardware (?).
-Mick Fine
Tulsa, Oklahoma
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/froghair
Green Country Ultralight Flyer's Organization (UFO)
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/gcufo
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Mick Fine <froghair(at)busprod.com> |
Subject: | Re: Tube cutting |
>
>Makes good sense to me!...............GeoR38...but in most cases the very end
>of the tube probably wouldn' t have much stress on it anyway, except for
use a
>s a socket or something like the hole you put your landing gear into, can you
>think of others?
I don't think the warning in the manual was aimed at steel parts (in the
Twinstar manual it's in the "Working with aluminum" section). For the
'old-timers' (Flyer & US builders) who had to do their own welding, the
straight cut (and brittle area) made by a tube cutter would have been
mostly ground away when fitting the tubes together before welding anyway.
The gear leg sockets and control horn ends are about the only straight cuts
I can think of in the steel parts.
The warning applied mainly to the aluminum tubes in the wing, empenage, and
control surfaces. As you know, most all the ribs are attached to the
leading or trailing edge tubes with rivet(s) very close to the end of the
rib tubing. Squeezing the ends of these tubes into a tight oval also
promotes cracking so it's probably best to eliminate as much stress as
possible. (I've tried to get the wife to cut the grass using the same
theory but that's another story...)
-Mick Fine
Tulsa, Oklahoma
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/froghair
Green Country Ultralight Flyer's Organization (UFO)
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/gcufo
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Lindy" <lindy(at)snowhill.com> |
Subject: | Fw: IMPORTANT INFORMATION |
-----Original Message-----
From: Todd Drexler <tdrexler(at)ala.net>
; John Gaddy ; Danny Myers
; Brad D Sanders
Date: Tuesday, January 12, 1999 6:00 PM
Subject: Fw: IMPORTANT INFORMATION
-----Original Message-----
From: RANONIS1(at)aol.com <RANONIS1(at)aol.com>
Date: Monday, January 11, 1999 7:38 AM
Subject: IMPORTANT INFORMATION
>
>> >~~ Important Information ~~
>> >
>> >There is a new bill in US Congress that will be affecting all Internet
>> >Users. You might want to read this and pass it on with a prayer. CNN
>> >stated that the Government would in two weeks time decide to allow or
>> >not allow a Charge to your (OUR) phone bill equal to a long distance
>> >call each time you access the internet.
>> >Think about that for a minute, and how it would effect each and
>> everyone
>> >of us.
>> >
>> >Anyone in business on the internet is going to be affected as well. .
>> >.are you going to pay high-prices to
>> >the person who designs your site so he can stay on-line longer to work
>> >your site? How about the users? Do you think they are going to spend
>> >hours online browsing through your catalog of items so they can order
>> >something from you if they are being charged Long Distance charges
>> >everytime they log on? I think not. I, myself, would put on some
>> clothes
>> >and head out to the store in my area that sold that same merchandise
>> >that you did. My gasoline in my car would not equal the cost of a
>> >several-hour-long phone call.
>> >
>> >Internet Service Providers (including AOL, Compuserve, etc) will lose
>> >customers because people will not want to pay for access, AND a long
>> >distance phone call!!!!
>> >
>> >Everyone will be affected, and the United States will lose out on the
>> >Internet! Other countries where they can still make a local call to
>> >access the internet will surpass the United States - do we want this to
>> >happen?
>> >
>> >Please visit the following URL and fill out the necessary form!
>> >
>> >The address is :
>> >
>> > Write Your Representative ->
>>Lookup Representative
>> >( click on above blue writing to get there )
>> >
>> >This link is: http://www.house.gov/writerep
>> >
>> >If EACH and everyone of us, forward this message on to others in a
>> >hurry,
>> >we may be able to prevent this injustice from happening!
>> >============================================================
>> >PLEASE FORWARD THIS EMAIL TO AS MANY INTERNET USERS AS POSSIBLE
>> >=====================================================
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Subject: | Re: Windscreen bolt size |
Unless I'm real mistaken, I believe the 3/16 translates to a 12/24 or
12/32. Anyone ?? Big Lar.
----------
> From: HShack(at)aol.com
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Windscreen bolt size
> Date: Friday, January 15, 1999 7:20 PM
>
>
> Plans say bolts that hold windscreen on FS I [the ones that screw in to
the
> little riveted on nuts] should be "3/16 machine screw". Ace Hardware
man
> says this is a 10-24 screw but that doesn't seem to want to go in. Can
anyone
> shed any light on this? Maybe it's a 10-32.
>
> Howard Shackleford
> FS I
> Lexington, SC
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
AN-3 is the 3/16" bolt size which equals a 10 X 32 NF bolt and nut.
AN-4 is the 1/4" bolt size which equals a 1/4 X 28 NF bolt and nut.
AN-5 is the 5/16" bolt size which equals a 5/16 X 24 NF bolt and nut.
AN-6 is the 3/8" bolt size which equals a 3/8 X 24 NF bolt and nut.
The only place where you should consider using hardware store grade
bolts is in non-structural places like holding little brackets behind
your instrument panel, map pouches, sick-sac racks, relief tubes, etc.
10 X 32 is the only size that qualifies for that sort of thing.
If it looks like it needs something bigger than 3/16", it needs AN
grade stuff.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
><< A prop extension doesn't do
> much to gyro loads because it's added mass is close to the radial center
> line -- it poses little difference in torque load for that same reason.
>
>
>This one sounds closer to the world of reality and farther from the world of
>academecia.....I'm buying in on Ben............another shade tree engineer and
>ol glider pilot where we didn't have to worry about such
>things...............GeoR38
>
I may be beating a dead horse but if I could offer up one more experiment
or thought experiment to the gyro force discussion, imagine mounting a
bicycle wheel to a 1/4 horse electric motor hold the motor in your hand and
turn it on, notice it runs smooth with no undo torque, Now turn 90* to the
right and notice the gyro force acting on the motor and your arms, now
pretend you are holding a 50 hp engine spinning a heavier flywheel and do
the same thing, lotsa force there, in my little Twinstar I can turn fast
enough to suck me down into the seat and hit thermals that strain my
seatbelts, the prop is reacting to these forces also and the bearings and
gear box are paying the price, nothing you can do about it but be aware of
this when you make modifications
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Mick Fine <froghair(at)busprod.com> |
Subject: | Re: Windscreen bolt size |
>
>Unless I'm real mistaken, I believe the 3/16 translates to a 12/24 or
>12/32. Anyone ?? Big Lar.
Number Drills:
#10 = .1935"
#12 = .189"
3/16" = .1875"
Granted, #12 is closer to 3/16 than is #10. AN hardware is denoted
(roughly) in 16ths:
AN4 = 4/16 = 1/4 = .250"
AN5 = 5/16 = .3125"
There's sort of an exception for AN3, one would assume it is exactly 3/16
(.1875") but for some unknown reason, AN3 is actually #10 (.1935"). A
difference of .006" doesn't sound like much but it could be a problem if
someone used a 3/16 screw in a #10 lock-nut. That extra .006" clearance
would certainly add to the likelihood of the screw backing out (besides
that by definition, a 3/16 screw is not aircraft hardware).
-Mick Fine
Tulsa, Oklahoma
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/froghair
Green Country Ultralight Flyer's Organization (UFO)
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/gcufo
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Woody Weaver <mts0140(at)ibm.net> |
Subject: | Re: Windscreen bolt size |
Mick Fine wrote:
>
>
> >
> >Unless I'm real mistaken, I believe the 3/16 translates to a 12/24 or
> >12/32. Anyone ?? Big Lar.
>
> Number Drills:
>
> #10 = .1935"
> #12 = .189"
> 3/16" = .1875"
>
Wrong, sorry.
The numberr drills do NOT equal screw sizes.
The larger the number for machine screws, the larger the diameter.
The larger the number for a drill, the smaller the diamter.
For number sizes in machine screws, take the number times 13 and add 0.060". That
means a #10 screw is
>0.190". A # 12 would be 0.026" larger.
Woody Weaver
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | bob n <ronoy(at)shentel.net> |
Subject: | Re: Fw: IMPORTANT INFORMATION |
I read this same stuff several months ago, followed by a retraction. My
S-I-L laywer in FCC says it's bunk. GB
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | vcbush(at)total.net.by.cheryll.cs.fredonia.edu.with.SMTP (8.8.4/8.8.4) |
Dear "Kolb",
I wonder if you might be able to answer the following questions, or perhaps advise
me of an internet spot where I might be able to complete my research:
Could a 'clandestine' group traveling in the dessert feasibly be able to 'breakdown'
an ultralight in order to 'pack' it on a camel(s)? And how many camels?
What would be involved time-wise for breakdown and reassembly? What technical
problems need to be overcome?
Thankyou,
Victor Bush
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | vcbush(at)total.net.by.cheryll.cs.fredonia.edu.with.SMTP (8.8.4/8.8.4) |
Dear "Kolb",
I wonder if you might be able to answer the following questions, or perhaps advise
me of an internet spot where I might be able to complete my research:
Could a 'clandestine' group traveling in the dessert feasibly be able to 'breakdown'
an ultralight in order to 'pack' it on a camel(s)? And how many camels?
What would be involved time-wise for breakdown and reassembly? What technical
problems need to be overcome?
Thankyou,
Victor Bush
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Mick Fine <froghair(at)busprod.com> |
Subject: | Re: Windscreen bolt size |
>
>
>Wrong, sorry.
>The numberr drills do NOT equal screw sizes.
>The larger the number for machine screws, the larger the diameter.
>The larger the number for a drill, the smaller the diamter.
>
>For number sizes in machine screws, take the number times 13 and add
0.060". That means a #10 screw is
>>0.190". A # 12 would be 0.026" larger.
>
>Woody Weaver
Woody's right, I guess it's just chance that number drills and number
screws pass within .0035" at the #10 juncture (sounds like a good place for
a train wreck, don't it...).
Woody, have we ever met? You remind me of every parts inspector I've ever
worked with ;-)
Crow eaten - I'm back in my hole - see ya!
-Mick Fine
Tulsa, Oklahoma
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/froghair
Green Country Ultralight Flyer's Organization (UFO)
http://www.angelfire.com/ok/gcufo
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
cheryll.cs.fredonia.edu (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP
>
>
>Dear "Kolb",
>I wonder if you might be able to answer the following questions, or perhaps
advise me of an internet spot where I might be able to complete my research:
>
>Could a 'clandestine' group traveling in the dessert feasibly be able to
'breakdown' an ultralight in order to 'pack' it on a camel(s)? And how many
camels? What would be involved time-wise for breakdown and reassembly?
What technical problems need to be overcome?
>
>Thankyou,
>Victor Bush
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
>
>Dear "Kolb",
>I wonder if you might be able to answer the following questions, or perhaps
advise me of an internet spot where I might be able to complete my research
The easiest way would be Pagojets, backpack powered parachutes, next would
be hang glider trike type units, A kolb if you mounted motorcycle wheels on
it and towed it behind a camel, sand and engines don't mix well, Are you a
writer or mercenary
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Kolb Cross Country |
From: | czechsix(at)juno.com (Mark E Navratil) |
Question for John Hauck:
John, you seem to be the man with more cross country hours in Kolbs than
all the rest of us put together. I don't know a lot about 2-stroke
engines, so what I'm wondering is how much XC flying you did with the 582
(or any other 2-stroke)? Is it really practical because of the poor fuel
efficiency (= short legs and frequent refueling stops) and the need to
add oil to the fuel or oil tank?
I am interested in the Slingshot for some XC flying, and everyone is
saying that the 582 is the ideal engine for it, but it seems like a lot
of hassle to go very far with a 2-stroke. Can you purchase 2-stroke oil
at many airports or do you have to carry it with you?
--Mark Navratil
Systems Engineer, Rockwell Collins
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Lindy" <lindy(at)snowhill.com> |
-----Original Message-----
From: jim harris <jwharris(at)linkfast.net>
; wayne wells (Abbotts) ;
venson cole ; Terry computer ;
roger humphrey ; paul moore ;
Nina At Home King ; Marcel Boles
; Maloney, Michael ; LMFINGER(at)aol.com
; Lindy ; LGHHOPE(at)aol.com
; John W. Nelson ; jim whaley
; Jena And Corey McKee
; Jason Nunnelley ; jackie
baker ; hollis bridges ; gerald sandlin
; Fred Shockley ; fox rowell
; Donna Merritt ; Don Ledyard
; david&donna wallace ; David
Kyle Barnette ; david cargo ; Cleo
Allbritton ; chad thomas ; carl bailey
; bobbie hall ; Aniceto AOL
Bagley ; Andy Bobbitt
Date: Saturday, January 16, 1999 1:08 PM
Subject: Fw: IRS Warning
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: RevelsJW(at)aol.com <RevelsJW(at)aol.com>
>To: MouseGrfix(at)aol.com ; naugher(at)birmingham.va.gov
>; MSDAVLEGIS(at)aol.com ;
>BADGER833(at)aol.com ; REVELSj(at)aol.com ;
>SHAR078(at)aol.com ; Sithnite(at)aol.com ;
>Silverdrak(at)aol.com ; rrev(at)bellsouth.net
>; MUSTOUNGE(at)aol.com ;
>charlie(at)gnes.net ; AB4149(at)aol.com ;
>CBrouillet(at)aol.com ; FKAIDE(at)aol.com ;
>MATT228(at)aol.com ; MH9808(at)aol.com ;
>Oursis72(at)aol.com ; PaulBrou(at)aol.com ;
>REWebb7053(at)aol.com ; AAT4RU1(at)juno.com
>; aibagley(at)juno.com ;
>angelic3(at)snowhill.com ; fastjag(at)gulftel.com
>; hobama(at)juno.com ;
>jwharris(at)linkfast.net ; thurston(at)alaweb.com
>; cwmills(at)webtv.net ;
>Pictonk(at)wwisp.com ; rjh(at)internettport.net
>; PopaSmurf2(at)aol.com
>Cc: wellsa(at)juno.com ; dfcsociety(at)usa.net
>; Grosehoyle(at)aol.com ;
>JDela435(at)aol.com ; Jansails(at)aol.com ;
>wjhinson(at)digitalexp.com ;
>jacquelynhinson(at)hotmail.com ;
>zydor(at)carolina.net
>Date: Saturday, January 16, 1999 8:07 AM
>Subject: IRS Warning
>
>
>>WARNING! PLEASE READ IMMEDIATELY! THIS IS SERIOUS!
>>
>>If you get an envelope from a company called the Internal Revenue
Service,"
>DO
>>NOT OPEN IT!
>>
>>This group operates a scam around this time every year. Their letter
claims
>>that you owe them money, which they will take and use to pay for the
>operation
>>of essential functions of the United States government. This is untrue!
The
>>money the IRS collects is used to fund various inefficient and pointless
>>social engineering
>>projects.
>>
>>This organization has ties to another shady outfit called the Social
>Security
>>Administration, who claim to take money from your regular paychecks and
>save
>>it for your retirement. In truth, the SSA uses the money to pay for the
>same
>>misguided make-work projects the IRS helps mastermind.
>>
>>These scam artists have bilked honest, hard working Americans out of
>billions
>>of dollars. Don't be among them!
>>
>>>>> FORWARD THIS MESSAGE TO EVERYONE YOU KNOW! <<<
>>================== and rember ...
>>"There is only one way to kill capitalism - by taxes, taxes, and more
>taxes."
>> -- Karl Marx
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | John Hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Kolb Cross Country |
Mark E Navratil wrote:
>
> engines, so what I'm wondering is how much XC flying you did with the 582
> (or any other 2-stroke)? Is it really practical because of the poor fuel
> efficiency (= short legs and frequent refueling stops) and the need to
> add oil to the fuel or oil tank?
>
> Can you purchase 2-stroke oil
> at many airports or do you have to carry it with you?
>
>
Mark and Gang:
I did quite a bit of xc flying in my Firestar w/447 pt ign, and MK III
with 582. Flew FS from Miami, Fl, to Maine, Texas to Wisconsin, Canada,
32 States in all. All States east of the Mississippi River plus a
handful on the west side. MK III w/582 to Lakeland, Homer Kolb's in Pa,
and OSH.
Fuel efficiency isn't much worse than a 4 stroke. 582 burned 5 to 5.5
gph at 80 mph. 912 burns 4 gph at 80 mph. 447 burned 3.5 to 3.75 gph
at 5800 rpm in FS and gave me about 70 mph.
Yes, I think it is practical to XC a 2 stroke. I had 18 gal fuel tank
in FS and 25 gal fuel tank in MK III. On long XCs I started out with 12
qts oil and a couple sets of plugs. Burned what ever fuel was
available, 100ll primarily, and mogas 91 octane or above if I lucked
out. NOTE: I never requested transportation from an FOB to go some
place else and buy mogas. To me that is like slapping the FOB up side
his gourd.
The older I get the shorter my flt legs, and the smaller my bladder
becomes. I usually fly 1 to 2 hr legs. I have found short flt legs
will improve your XC. It is like charging your battery. Makes me feel
a lot better. There's airports (uncontrolled) everywhere. Never been
run out of an airport with UL. Never had a problem running 100ll in 2
or 4 stroke.
I mixed oil in the tank of the FS and had oil injection on the MK III.
If one XCs a bit one will be able to make close estimate of how much
fuel it will take to fill tank. I'd guess how much oil to put in the
tank, pour it in, roll the acft back and forth rapidly, then fill it
up. Only time I had problem with this procedure was when I forgot to
slosh the fuel and oil around. If that happens, go to full enricher and
keep on flying until you can get back on the airfield.
Never found any 2 stroke oil for sale a GA type airfield.
Never let a 2 stroke stop me from going places in my little airplanes.
Never flew with a gerry can, unless it was someone else's.
Go for it.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
<< I may be beating a dead horse but if I could offer up one more experiment
or thought experiment to the gyro force discussion, imagine mounting a
bicycle wheel to a 1/4 horse electric motor hold the motor in your hand and
turn it on, notice it runs smooth with no undo torque, Now turn 90* to the
right and notice the gyro force acting on the motor and your arms, now
pretend you are holding a 50 hp engine spinning a heavier flywheel and do
the same thing, lotsa force there, in my little Twinstar I can turn fast
enough to suck me down into the seat and hit thermals that strain my
seatbelts, the prop is reacting to these forces also and the bearings and
gear box are paying the price, nothing you can do about it but be aware of
this when you make modifications
>>
and I'll help you beat him again!....I believe everything you have said and am
somewhat aware of the forces involved, especially when you find yourself in
turbulence or sink or lift....I'm from Ohio, so I don't have to worry so much
about lift.....I think the only question is.... order of magnitude/are the
forces strong enough to take the bearings past the point of yield and
therefore cause damage to them? Numbers would help...or experience...but I buy
in 100% on your concepts!!
BTW I have an IVO with a 5* aluminum extension and have not noticed any
"squirrely" gyroscopic effects so far...but then, when I hit Lift...I always
throttle back...just a habit, I guress..........GeoR38
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
Subject: | Re: Kolb Cross Country |
>
>Question for John Hauck:
>
>John, you seem to be the man with more cross country hours in Kolbs than
>all the rest of us put together. I don't know a lot about 2-stroke
>engines, so what I'm wondering is how much XC flying you did with the 582
>(or any other 2-stroke)? Is it really practical because of the poor fuel
>efficiency (= short legs and frequent refueling stops) and the need to
>add oil to the fuel or oil tank?
>
>I am interested in the Slingshot for some XC flying, and everyone is
>saying that the 582 is the ideal engine for it, but it seems like a lot
>of hassle to go very far with a 2-stroke. Can you purchase 2-stroke oil
>at many airports or do you have to carry it with you?
>
>--Mark Navratil
>Systems Engineer, Rockwell Collins
>Cedar Rapids, Iowa
>
John is THE X-C MAN on the list, but having flown my MKIII to Oshkosh this
summer, here is some current data. Flown slowly, around 5100 rpm, the Rotax
532 (which burns about the same as a 582) burns about 3.5 GPH.
Carrying a passenger, or going fast at 5800 rpm, it burns about 5 GPH.
Since my airplane has a 16 gallon tank, this is long enough.
And yes, you do need to carry your own oil. I used 24 pints for the whole
trip of 31 hours.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "F J MARINO" <FMARINO(at)netlink1.nlcomm.com> |
It all depends on how much you are in love your camel, I wouldn't want my
girl friend to carry my Kolb on her back.
-----Original Message-----
From: 8.8.4/8.8.4 <vcbush(at)total.net.by.cheryll.cs.fredonia.edu.with.SMTP>
Date: Saturday, January 16, 1999 5:25 PM
cheryll.cs.fredonia.edu (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP
>
>
>Dear "Kolb",
>I wonder if you might be able to answer the following questions, or perhaps
advise me of an internet spot where I might be able to complete my research:
>
>Could a 'clandestine' group traveling in the dessert feasibly be able to
'breakdown' an ultralight in order to 'pack' it on a camel(s)? And how many
camels? What would be involved time-wise for breakdown and reassembly?
What technical problems need to be overcome?
>
>Thankyou,
>Victor Bush
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
> (__) ,---------. NOTE: The preceding message was sent via Jaek
and
> (oo) | :\/: _ _ \ Jon's WWW mail cow gateway. That is to say,
the
> /-------\/_/ : :: :: : ) person who sent this message could in fact be
an
> / | MAIL|| \_ ' '`-'`-'/ anonymous prankster. Even though this message
was
>* ||"" || \__________/ mailed to you from the cs.fredonia.edu domain,
it
>
could have been generated by anyone in the world.
>Please keep this in mind. Thank you! --Jaek (smit2204) and -Jon-
(stei0302)
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | John Hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Kolb Cross Country |
Richard Pike wrote:
>
> John is THE X-C MAN on the list, but having flown my MKIII to Oshkosh this
> summer, here is some current data. Flown slowly, around 5100 rpm, the Rotax
> 532 (which burns about the same as a 582) burns about 3.5 GPH.
> Carrying a passenger, or going fast at 5800 rpm, it burns about 5 GPH.
> Since my airplane has a 16 gallon tank, this is long enough.
> And yes, you do need to carry your own oil. I used 24 pints for the whole
> trip of 31 hours.
> Richard Pike
> MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
>
>
Hey Old Poops and Gang:
For comparison only, my XC style and Richard's:
Rich used 24 pints of oil to fly 31 hours, aprx 1200 miles round trip,
aprx 40 mph average, 108 gal fuel.
I used zero oil to fly 23 hrs, 1600 miles round trip, 70mph average, 92
gal fuel.
Richard did have an advantage though. He got to fly 8 hours longer than
I did.
john h (Wondering how our XC'ers in Central Florida are doing.)
PS 350 miles from my airstrip to KTRI, Kingston, Tn.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Jeff Wilde" <jeffwilde(at)mpinet.net> |
Don't archive. This camel thing is a joke, right?
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
Subject: | camels(?) no, geese & ducks yes |
Finally got airborne again yesterday. As usual, great fun, but
maybe especially so for having been stuck on the ground for almost
two months. WX was reasonbly warm but 2k overcast with
intermittent sprinkles. I experimented more with flying with
ducks and geese. So far, my data is that snow geese hate me,
Canadian geese can almost tolerate me at 120 yards off the wing --
although not for long, and Pintail ducks either like me or are
too dumb to care. I can fly with a flock of Pintails for minutes
at a time at about 200 feet off my wing. Of course the Pintails
are probably thinking the same about me (either i like them or
am too dumb). I've found the same experience with Pintails in the
past. Pintails seem to cruise at 40-45mph, high rpm on the wings,
although in the past I've hung with an eager bunch at over 50mph
-- mating season perhaps.
Hey John Hauck, where all did you keep 18 gallons of gas in a FS?
I'm mostly giving up on my idea to make a high center fuel tank
combined with wing gap seal. It would make it too complicated
to get to clevis pins, plus other problems, and there isn't really
enf volume to make even 5 gallons there.
-Ben Ransom
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | bob n <ronoy(at)shentel.net> |
Subject: | Re: Fw: IRS Warning |
Can't we get this person off the List? Talk abt Off-List postings, and
using BW! GB
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | John Hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Fire Star Fuel Tank |
Ben Ransom wrote:
>
> Hey John Hauck, where all did you keep 18 gallons of gas in a FS?
>
Ben and Gang:
I had a 85 Fire Star. Needed more cargo area to carry my XC stuff, plus
more fuel capacity. Area from middle of fuselage behind bulkhead was
not being used. Designed and built alum tank to fit in that area,
opening up the area around the front end of boom tube for carrying
goodies. Forget how many sides on that tank, but it just slipped into
place with a shoe horn, and ended up with 18 gal usable.
Before that I used the original 5 gal can and a Ken Brock seat tank (8
gal usable). Gave me a total of 13 gal. I would fly 2 hours off the
clock on the seat tank, then open a little valve and gravity feed the
5gal down to the seat tank. That worked alright, but seat took up a lot
of room in cockpit and I didn't have the extra storage. One draw back.
If I forgot to cross check time flown, the seat tank would run dry, the
447 would stop, and unless I was lucky, very lucky, I would not be able
to restart before kissing Mother Earth. Forgot two times. Near Live
Oak, Florida, I couldn't restart and landed on a logging road. Near
Lake Ockechobe (sp), Florida, I was already low, maybe 400 feet AGL.
You never saw a guy squeeze a primer bulb so fast and yank a starter
rope so hard. Lucked out and saved it. Everglade farmers make
extremely high furrows in that soft back muck. Didn't want to try a
landing there if I could help it.
john h (just got back from flying a little)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | Re: Fw: IRS Warning |
>>>WARNING! PLEASE READ IMMEDIATELY! THIS IS SERIOUS!
>>>
>>>If you get an envelope from a company called the Internal Revenue
>Service,"
>>DO
>>>NOT OPEN IT!
I believe Matt asked that stuff like this not be included on the list
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "CHRISTOPHER DAVIS" <cdavis2(at)capecod.net> |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
Do you count to three and wrap it up towards the high wing ????? I do Chris.
-----Original Message-----
From: GeoR38(at)aol.com <GeoR38(at)aol.com>
Date: Sunday, January 17, 1999 2:54 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Prop Extenstion
>
>
><< I may be beating a dead horse but if I could offer up one more
experiment
> or thought experiment to the gyro force discussion, imagine mounting a
> bicycle wheel to a 1/4 horse electric motor hold the motor in your hand
and
> turn it on, notice it runs smooth with no undo torque, Now turn 90* to the
> right and notice the gyro force acting on the motor and your arms, now
> pretend you are holding a 50 hp engine spinning a heavier flywheel and do
> the same thing, lotsa force there, in my little Twinstar I can turn fast
> enough to suck me down into the seat and hit thermals that strain my
> seatbelts, the prop is reacting to these forces also and the bearings and
> gear box are paying the price, nothing you can do about it but be aware of
> this when you make modifications
> >>
>
>and I'll help you beat him again!....I believe everything you have said and
am
>somewhat aware of the forces involved, especially when you find yourself in
>turbulence or sink or lift....I'm from Ohio, so I don't have to worry so
much
>about lift.....I think the only question is.... order of magnitude/are the
>forces strong enough to take the bearings past the point of yield and
>therefore cause damage to them? Numbers would help...or experience...but I
buy
>in 100% on your concepts!!
>BTW I have an IVO with a 5* aluminum extension and have not noticed any
>"squirrely" gyroscopic effects so far...but then, when I hit Lift...I
always
>throttle back...just a habit, I guress..........GeoR38
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Ron Carroll" <ron.carroll(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Subject: | Re: Fire Star Fuel Tank |
John, I just want to be sure I understand what you are saying about the 18 gallon
tank you
built for your Firestar.
Is it correct that the tank you made fit in the UPPER half of the rear part of
the cage?
If do, then you didn't use the 5-gal stock tank, and the area for 'goodies' is
in the
LOWER half of the rear of the cage, right? Did you put something on the 'floor'
of the
lower section to protect the fabric and help support the weight of the goodies?
This interests me because I am having a hard time finding any room for such things
as
first aid kit, extra oil, tools, spark plugs, etc. I can't even find a good place
to
mount a handheld radio and GPS without getting in the way of the control stick.
I can't
mount them in the instrument panel because I can't reach it while strapped in.
Thanks,
Ron Carroll
Original Firestar-377
-----Original Message-----
From: John Hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com>
>
>Ben Ransom wrote:
>>
>> Hey John Hauck, where all did you keep 18 gallons of gas in a FS?
>>
>
>Ben and Gang:
>
>I had a 85 Fire Star. Needed more cargo area to carry my XC stuff, plus
>more fuel capacity. Area from middle of fuselage behind bulkhead was
>not being used. Designed and built alum tank to fit in that area,
>opening up the area around the front end of boom tube for carrying
>goodies. Forget how many sides on that tank, but it just slipped into
>place with a shoe horn, and ended up with 18 gal usable.
>Before that I used the original 5 gal can and a Ken Brock seat tank (8
>gal usable). Gave me a total of 13 gal. I would fly 2 hours off the
>clock on the seat tank, then open a little valve and gravity feed the
>5gal down to the seat tank. That worked alright, but seat took up a lot
>of room in cockpit and I didn't have the extra storage. One draw back.
>If I forgot to cross check time flown, the seat tank would run dry, the
>447 would stop, and unless I was lucky, very lucky, I would not be able
>to restart before kissing Mother Earth. Forgot two times. Near Live
>Oak, Florida, I couldn't restart and landed on a logging road. Near
>Lake Ockechobe (sp), Florida, I was already low, maybe 400 feet AGL.
>You never saw a guy squeeze a primer bulb so fast and yank a starter
>rope so hard. Lucked out and saved it. Everglade farmers make
>extremely high furrows in that soft back muck. Didn't want to try a
>landing there if I could help it.
>
>john h (just got back from flying a little)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | John Hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Fire Star Fuel Tank |
Ron Carroll wrote:
>
>
> Is it correct that the tank you made fit in the UPPER half of the rear part of
the cage?
Right Ron. We only used the 18 gal alum tank. Putting it up stairs
opened up the bottom for goodies, except for the tail boom running thru
it.
> If do, then you didn't use the 5-gal stock tank, and the area for 'goodies' is
in the
> LOWER half of the rear of the cage, right?
The above is correct.
Did you put something on the 'floor' of the
> lower section to protect the fabric and help support the weight of the goodies?
I didn't put anything on the bottom to protect fabric. However, I never
put loose items back there. Everything went in stuff sacks and tool
bags, etc.
I basically did the same thing when I built the MK III. 25 gal alum
tank upstairs in the open area. Opened up the lower area for cargo,
except the the tail boom. Finished up fabric on rear of fuselage
similar to old style original Fire Star.
Works for me.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Scott Olendorf" <olendorf(at)empireone.net> |
Subject: | Re: Fire Star Fuel Tank |
Ron, I use a soft backpack to hold my stuff. I hung it right behind the
fabric seat. I originally had the area behind the seat covered in fabric and
this worked out good. I use a foam pad behind my back so I never noticed
anything poking me. Now i have recoverd without the fabric behind the seat
and the backpack hardly even touches my seat fabtric. I carry pint or 2 of
oil, oil measue cup, wire, spark plugs, safety wire nuts,bolts, clevis pins,
safety pins, first aid kit, sometimes tiedowns and rope. I have a funnel, 2
gal gas tank hanging bak there also. This is also with the parachute
mounted to the fuse tube below the gas tank.
There is a piece of plywood mounted to the right side of the cage near my
upper leg that has a bracket to hold my radio. It works great for the Delcom
since the freq wheels are on the top.
I may try for a sleeping bag in there this year for a little camping.
Scott Olendorf
Original Firestar, Rotax 377
Schenectady, NY USA
http://members.aol.com/olefiresta
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Carroll <ron.carroll(at)worldnet.att.net>
Date: Sunday, January 17, 1999 8:14 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fire Star Fuel Tank
>
>This interests me because I am having a hard time finding any room for such
things as
>first aid kit, extra oil, tools, spark plugs, etc. I can't even find a
good place to
>mount a handheld radio and GPS without getting in the way of the control
stick. I can't
>mount them in the instrument panel because I can't reach it while strapped
in.
>
>Thanks,
>Ron Carroll
>Original Firestar-377
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard Pike <rpike(at)preferred.com> |
If you have never flown with geese before, a word of caution: they hate to
break
formation and normally will not until they panic. When they panic, if they
are not
at either end of the echelon, but are trapped in the middle, they will pull in
one wing and turn into a giant maple leaf, and spin out of the flock,
recovering
about fifty feet below. It is easy to see how this helps them escape from
predator birds.
The first time I saw this, I was following a flock around with my Hummer,
and was about 50' behind and 10' below a flock. The first goose that
"mapleleafed"
on me almost caught the right wing on his way down.
Moral: when following geese, stay at or above their altitude.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
<< Do you count to three and wrap it up towards the high wing ????? I do
Chris.
-----Original Message-----
From: GeoR38(at)aol.com <GeoR38(at)aol.com> >>
well, I don't know how old you are Chris, but ...there's another OL Glider
pilot out there!!...Abslutely, I do and unfortunately I have only had the
opportunity to do it 3 times since moving back to Ohio from El Paso, the land
of WillU, where I first learned to soar in '78-80. And I have never had the
chance to fly WITH the geese or ducks as Ben has, but I have been in a gaggle
or two of other kinds of LARGER birds....and that was pure JOY! I must have
been the ugliest bird there by the expressions on some of therr
faces!!....GeoR38
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | bob n <ronoy(at)shentel.net> |
Richard, I agree abt flying near geese, As I posted a while back, Don't
Fly Under Them!! Tried it in a SNJ in '43 and brought home a goose in
front cockpit. Mess cook not amused, nor were mechs. I had goose blood
all over me, as well as some other "body fluids."
________________________________________________________________________________
<< The first time I saw this, I was following a flock around with my
Hummer,
and was about 50' behind and 10' below a flock. The first goose that
"mapleleafed"
on me almost caught the right wing on his way down.
Moral: when following geese, stay at or above their altitude.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (42OldPoops) >>
I know exactly what you're talking about cause I saw it in the movie and now I
look for it in the many goose formations (we gotalota parks here) that fly
over here. That's good info that just might have saved me an embarassing goose
encounter though, 42OL or Poops or N420P........kinda hard to pick a nickname
for you Richard. ............GeoR38
________________________________________________________________________________
<< Tried it in a SNJ in '43 and brought home a goose in
front cockpit. >>
Bob, were you actually in the Big One?? and isn't the SNJ the navy version of
the
AT-6 Texan?...I'll bet YOU have some real experiences!!.............GeoR38
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle 925-606-1001) |
Subject: | NOTICE! Matronics Email Server Downtime.... |
Dear Listers,
I will be taking the Matronics Email server down tonight, Monday 1/18 for
a major disk rebuilding. I have been having problems for a number of weeks
with disk errors and corrupted files. This morning there was a system
crash and I had to restore the three email List address files from a backup
on the 13th - if you subscribed or unsubscribed since the 13th you may be
back on or off the List depending on what you've done since then. I am
going to do a full backup tonight and then completely rebuild the system
from scratch. Hopefully this will resolve the problems I've been having
of late with the system.
I will be taking the system down about 7pm and I have no idea how long it
will take to completely rebuild and restore the system. I hope to have it
done tonight (Monday), but I have a feeling its going to be a looooonnggg
night, if you know what I mean.
Thanks for understanding...
Matt Dralle
List Admin.
PS - The web server will be fully available during the rebuild of the email
server.
--
Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | Re: Hirth w/Mk-3? |
>
>Anyone operating the Hirth 65 hp on Mk-3? If so I would be interested to know
>how it is performing. How long has it been on the airplane? Comments on fuel
>consumption, reliability and any installation problems are appreciated.
>
>Thanks
>
>Bill George
OK Andy I know you are out there, How about responding to this, I can't
remember any problems with the instalation, it still hasn't flown
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle 925-606-1001) |
Subject: | NOTICE! - Email Server Back Online... |
Listers,
After a grueling system upgrade on the Matronics Email machine last night,
a great deal left to do to get everything dialed-in on the new system, but
at this point, things are working much better. I did a low-level format
on the system disk, then did a clean install of the OS. Most all of the
archives and email list files have been resolved and postings should be
flowing normally now. Obviously there wasn't a Digest Posting last night.
Also, messages posted between about 7:30pm pst 1/18 and 4:30am pst 1/19
were lost because of a problem with the new version of Perl installed with
the upgrade. If you posted a message between these times, please feel
free to repost your message.
I will be continuing to configure the new system today including upgrading
the kernel from the current single-processor mode, to the latest version
of the symmetric multi-processor (SMP) kernel. The system should, however,
be generally available today for normal List posting.
I apologize for the downtime last night and the lost messages. The up-side
is that the system seems to be working *much* better now on the reformat
and clean install.
Best Regards,
Matt Dralle
RV, Kolb, and Zenith List Admin.
--
Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | WGeorge737(at)aol.com |
Subject: | MK-3 and Hirth. Re-post |
Don't know if my original post made it to the list due server being fixed.
Here it is again:
Anyone operating the Hirth 65 hp on Mk-3? If so I would be interested to know
how it is performing. How long has it been on the airplane? Comments on fuel
consumption, reliability and any installation problems are appreciated.
Thanks
Bill George
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Larry Bourne" <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net> |
Subject: | Corrosion Protection |
Okay, then let's try this a second time.
>
> Hi Group: I know we chewed this over a while back, but I recently
> received the Nov/Dec issue, # 115, of Water Flying magazine from the SPA.
> Page 26 has an article by Bill Gamble, VP - Corrosion Technologies on
> corrosion in Seaplanes. He strongly recommends either ACF - 50, mfg in
> Canada, or Corrosion X from Dallas, TX. Both use Fluid Thin Film Coating
> ( FTFC ) technology, and sound like the way to go, especially for those
> with an existing aircraft. Food for thought. Big Lar.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Possum <possums(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: MK-3 and Hirth. Re-post |
Well the big thing is, we never could get the Carb right, it's so tickish,
it just would "not" idle, it had too much compression, we even had the
factory- guys work on it down at "Sun & Fun". They spent 2 or 3 hours,
liked to wore-out the dog-gone starter!
Enuf-Problems sold the engine for $2000. Paid about $4000 for it.
Had around 80 hours, 3 break-downs.
Buy One & you'll find out about the problems.
The fan belt is BAD
The whole fan system is a nightmare.
It will not idle.
If you want to be a TEST pilot, try it.
You buy one, and then you'll know!
Or E-Mail me back & I'll give you the phone # of the guy in our group of
"Possums"
that spent the time and money on it. You make your own call after that!
We have had "4" 503 Rotax-dual carb-E-gear box-no problems.
We have had "3" AMW Engines-HP-65? not what they said-sent them ALL back.
We have had "1" Hearth 65 HP-"No Way" sent it back.
P.S.
The Ultralight is the safest airplane in the world;
It can just barely kill you!
Sully
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Dennis Souder <flykolb(at)epix.net> |
Subject: | Warning: Rotax 912 with Rans Muffler |
We have heard the following report about the following engine failure incident:
A Mark-III with a Rotax 912 reportedly had an engine failure due to a piece
of baffling coming loose from inside the Rans muffler and sliding down the
manifold into the engine through the exhaust port. When the engine was
started, the piece of metal caused damaged to the engine. The hour meter
showed 70 hours, the aircraft was 4-5 years old.
The Rans muffler is oval in shape, made of stainless steel and sits on top
of the engine. It is connected to the engine with 4 header pipes. If you
are flying with one of these mufflers, you should not fly until you know
there are no loose parts inside the muffler. If you have questions give us
at Kolb Aircraft.
If you know of anyone with one of these mufflers, pass this warning on to them.
Dennis Souder
Pres Kolb Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Rutledge Fuller" <rut007(at)hotmail.com> |
Subject: | Re: Kolb Cross Country |
Question for John Hauck:
John, you seem to be the man with more cross country hours in Kolbs than
all the rest of us put together. I don't know a lot about 2-stroke
engines, so what I'm wondering is how much XC flying you did with the
582
(or any other 2-stroke)? Is it really practical because of the poor
fuel
efficiency (= short legs and frequent refueling stops) and the need to
add oil to the fuel or oil tank?
I am interested in the Slingshot for some XC flying, and everyone is
saying that the 582 is the ideal engine for it, but it seems like a lot
of hassle to go very far with a 2-stroke. Can you purchase 2-stroke oil
at many airports or do you have to carry it with you?
--Mark Navratil
Systems Engineer, Rockwell Collins
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
Mark,
I am a little behind on my mail and am sure that John answered your
question, but here is my 2 cents. The reason that I am behind on my
mail is because I just got back on a 600 mile cross country flight from
Quincy, Florida to Howie in the Hills, Florida. I fly an Original
Firestar with a 377 and run at 6000 rpm burning 3 gallons an hour. The
other guys that I fly with have both a 503 and a 582. They run 1000 rps
less than I so they don't run off and leave me. They were burning 2.8
gallons an hour. Fueling has never been a problem and YOU will have to
carry the oil. Best of luck.
Rutledge Fuller
Orginal Firestar 377 138hrs since 8/98
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Terry Wells <tgw(at)aloha.net> |
I would like to start a discussion on the best material for fuel lines.
I've tried several different kinds without much satisfaction. Either
they get hard get soft or get brittle. I suspect it is the fuel
additives. What have others had good luck with.
Terry Wells
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Rob Reynolds" <rfreynol(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: MK-3 and Hirth. Re-post |
I have a friend that had 3 different engine failures all within 25 hours on
a brad new hirth 2703. All were caused by bearings failures. He replaced
it with a 503DC, and at 80+ hours, it is going stong.
-Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: Possum <possums(at)mindspring.com>
Date: Tuesday, January 19, 1999 9:10 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: MK-3 and Hirth. Re-post
>
>
>Well the big thing is, we never could get the Carb right, it's so tickish,
>it just would "not" idle, it had too much compression, we even had the
>factory- guys work on it down at "Sun & Fun". They spent 2 or 3 hours,
>liked to wore-out the dog-gone starter!
>Enuf-Problems sold the engine for $2000. Paid about $4000 for it.
>Had around 80 hours, 3 break-downs.
>Buy One & you'll find out about the problems.
>The fan belt is BAD
>The whole fan system is a nightmare.
>It will not idle.
>If you want to be a TEST pilot, try it.
>You buy one, and then you'll know!
>Or E-Mail me back & I'll give you the phone # of the guy in our group of
>"Possums"
>that spent the time and money on it. You make your own call after that!
>We have had "4" 503 Rotax-dual carb-E-gear box-no problems.
>We have had "3" AMW Engines-HP-65? not what they said-sent them ALL back.
>We have had "1" Hearth 65 HP-"No Way" sent it back.
>P.S.
>The Ultralight is the safest airplane in the world;
>It can just barely kill you!
> Sully
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | WGeorge737(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: MK-3 and Hirth. |
Wow! You just might get a position on the Hirth marketing team.
hanks
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | John Hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: Kolb Cross Country |
Rutledge Fuller wrote:
> Mark,
>
> I am a little behind on my mail and am sure that John answered your
> question, but here is my 2 cents. The reason that I am behind on my
> mail is because I just got back on a 600 mile cross country flight from
> Quincy, Florida to Howie in the Hills, Florida. I fly an Original
Hey Rut:
Welcome home.
Am patiently waiting an AAR (after action report) of your recent XC.
Wish I could have been with you all. Know you had a good time.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
I'm glad to see this come up. I know it has been discussed before and
good suggestions put forth. However, I'm curious if anyone has tried
a pulse line (the 6" from pulse port to Mikuni pump) made of clear
high pressure line with braids embedded in the plastic. Somebody got
on my case like I was asking for death tomorrow for using this, saying
it would deteriorate and "do me in for sure". I know there are perhaps
better methods, such as Richard's auto fuel hose with (AL?) inserted
sleeve, but can anybody add to whether the know-it-all I encountered
was/is right on the braided line?
As for fuel line in general, I've had no problems whatsoever using the
clear line we get from UL suppliers (or Ace hardware, getting the thick
wall stuff). Use, replace as necessary. Most of mine lasts ~2 years
and some didn't really need replacing at that point. I've not had
brittleness so much as the fitting ends harden enf to not make a tight
secure attachment.
-Ben Ransom
On Wed, 20 Jan 1999, Terry Wells wrote:
>
> I would like to start a discussion on the best material for fuel lines.
> I've tried several different kinds without much satisfaction. Either
> they get hard get soft or get brittle. I suspect it is the fuel
> additives. What have others had good luck with.
> Terry Wells
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | John Hauck <hawk36(at)mindspring.com> |
Terry Wells wrote:
>
>
>
> I would like to start a discussion on the best material for fuel lines.
Hi Gang:
Fuel systems and fuel lines on UL aircraft have reared up and bit me on
several occasions. Here are some of my thoughts, verified by actual
experience. Hopefully, I/we learn by our experiences and mistakes.
1. Forced landing, probably a half dozen until I finally figured out
what was causing the problem. Fuel filters with paper elements are fine
as long as moisture is not present in the fuel. A few drops of water
will cause the paper element to swell and effectively cut off fuel
supply. Nylon elements, like the ones Kolb sends with their kits, work
great.
2. Fuel filters with glass globes are nice to see what kind of trash is
in them. I am still using one that I installed on my Ultrastar in 1984
or 85. I got it installed in the afternoon. Came back the next day to
fly and all fuel had drained out on the ground. Glass cylinder had
cracked some time during the time I was gone. I replaced the glass
cylinder with a piece of .058 X 7/8 alum tubing cut to the same length.
That fuel filter is still in use on my 912, 15 years and several
thousand hours later. Had two forced landings with this filter last Jun
in Texas caused by contaminated fuel. Pilot error. Didn't drain fuel
prior to takeoff.
3. Silicone seal and fuel do not mix. Fuel constriction in Firestar
over Sebring, Florida. Would not run at cruise rpm, but would just keep
aircraft aloft at much reduced rpm. Landed on football field Sebring
High School. Discovered little silicone turds in intake side of primer
bulb. Had used silicone seal to seal up vent hole in fuel tank cap in
Ken Brock seat tank. Had installed overboard vent out bottom of
aircraft. Discovered that fuel ran down back of my neck and into my
helmet when aircraft was resting on its back with me strapped inside.
Thus, the overboard fuel vent at 37 hours on the clock.
4. UV plays hell with urethane fuel line. It does not last long in
sunshine. It also does not make the best pulse line for 2 stroke fuel
pump because a metal clamp will easily put a pin hole in it. This
causes fuel starvation, and sometimes even worse severe leaning which
burns pistons and causes seizures. I use two different types of fuel
line. One is a marine grade 1/4 in ID thick walled synthetic rubber.
The other is urethane. I have some urethane lines inside the fuselage,
where the sun don't shine, have been in use since March 1992, 1227.8
hours ago. They are in fine shape and will be changed eventually, when
I feel like crawling inside the fuselage and changing them out. They
live in the dark. The thick walled marine grade fuel line does not
crimp, even when bent to some severe angles.
5. I changed to black marine grade fuel line after my MK III was
totaled because of fuel starvation caused by a pinched tygon fuel line.
Tygon fuel lines were used on the round the world flight by the
Voyager. I figured if they were good enough for them, good enough for
me. Tygon is soft, super soft. A tie wrap that had been installed
loosely, on purpose, did not seem correct to someone in the area when I
was testing my MK III. It was tightened without my knowledge and I lost
the engine on takeoff, which resulted in the crash worthiness test and
destruction of my little bird. I didn't get a scratch. When you get
ready to test fly your aircraft, do it with one or two good aircraft
oriented friends who have been structed not to change anything on the
aircraft without your knowledge.
Sorry for the long dissertation, but I figured I better share this with
you all while I was in the mood to type. If this info prevents one
person from busting his butt, then it was worth the effort to share it.
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Rutledge Fuller" <rut007(at)hotmail.com> |
Subject: | Re: Kolb Cross Country |
Hey Rut:
Welcome home.
Am patiently waiting an AAR (after action report) of your recent XC.
Wish I could have been with you all. Know you had a good time.
john h
On Saturday January 16th, I arrived at Quincy Airport to ready for the
three day trip around Florida. I loaded the Firestar with 6 pints of
oil, a load of tools, a siphon hose, blanket, gloves, toothbrush,
toothpaste, and deodorant. By 9:30am Mike and Richard were entering the
traffic pattern. Mike flys one of those F______'s, and Richard flys a
Challanger CWS single place. They refueled, and off we went.
First stop was Perry. At Perry we emptied our bladders and visited with
the Firemen. Perry's fire department is located at the airport. We
decided to wait until we got to Cross City to refuel and eat lunch. Off
we went again. Not a bump in the sky. The terrain between Perry and
Cross City is pretty hostile stuff. We tried to stay within landing
distance of logging roads and such. Not really something you would want
to land on though. With Cross City in sight, tension eased. We landed
and taxied to the fuel pump where we were met by Ray Baker. We took
several photos and ate lunch. Ray is looking forward to completing his
Mark III project. We were also joined by Bill the Trike pilot who
landed just after us.
Next we flew to Dunnellon where the fun really began. Open fields as
far as the eye could see. I dove toward the ground and maintained about
50feet agl over the wonderful rolling hills until we made it to
Dunnellon. Mike actually made me climb to 800 ft agl to enter the
traffic pattern. : ( At Dunnellon they were towing up hangliders with
a Dragon Fly UL. We fueled and tied down for the night. We slept in a
cold single wide trailer. Being the newest and youngest, I got the
comfortable floor. Needless to say, I had a sleepless night.
The next morning we were off to Howie in the Hills, where my parents
live. We followed I75 to the Turnpike and buzzed the folks. We were
astonished to discover that the Florida Flying Gators Airpark was just 3
miles South of my parents house. We landed to find the Gators flying
hand launched remote control gliders. The big kick was watching them
tow the gliders up by a remote control tow plane. This airpark is
awsome and a MUST see for anyone ever in the area. It is located just
off of Hwy 27 and State Rd. 19. They must have 30 or 40 UL's and light
experimental aircraft there. Most of which are amphibious and sporting
912's some even turbo charged!
Later that day, we flew 10 miles South to Sheets in Groveland to meet up
with Duncan McBribe, owner of Mark III parts. Duncan is also hanglides.
Sheets had all sorts of hangliding rigs, and several Dragonfly tow
planes. What a neat place! Mike was going to take a ride on one of the
tandem hangliders, but they wanted over $100 for the ride. I think that
they were tring to get back at him for flying a F______. That night we
tied down at Gator Airpark and spent the night at the parents house.
Almost forgot: My Dad got his first ride in a UL. Mike took him up in
the F_____. I think that he is hooked.....
Monday came and so did the bad weather. Thank God I work for the State.
I just called in and said I would be back when I got there. Monday did
allow for some local flying. The big joke was "It's by the lake". We
were located in Lake county. Now I know were they got the name.
Normally in the Tallahasse area, navigation is conducted by using
landmarks (lakes). In our current setting, lakes are everywhere and
provided no means of navigation---even though we tried.
Tuesday the weather cleared and we flew back. Uneventful flight. We
touched down in Quincy at about 3pm and ate at the Subway. Still wanted
to fly some more, so I followed Mike and Richard over to Glenn Rink's
and flew back. Total Time for the trip was 12.6 hrs. I burnt a steady
3 gallons per hour.
Loads a fun,
Rutledge Fuller
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Frank_R_Reynen(at)notes.seagate.com |
Subject: | Re: Prop Extenstion |
>Torque transfer from the input shaft gear is transferred to the output
>shaft as a torque moment and a horizontal force The torque component is
>passed tru to the prop and the counter torque created by the spinning
>propeller balances it out and this does not change by whatever the
lenght
>of an extension
You are forgetting an important part of the calculation, the gyroscopic
forces, you are putting a great deal of stress on the bearings when you
turn
your aircraft due to that big gyroscopic spinner called a prop, this does
not really want to change direction when the aeroplane does and that force
is taken up in the bearings A longer shaft will change the moment arm to
the
bearing causing a lot more force on these bearings
Hi Richard, Big Lar and all,
I had thought about this gyroscopic force also but do not believe(as does
Ben Ransom) that it is a major stress contributor compared to the primary
torque and bearing loads. First of all , as Ben mentioned already, a
propeller makes a lousy flywheel since its biggest mass is in the center
and not at the prop tips and flexing of the blades dampens this even more.
Secondly, when you change directions in flight, it stresses the bearing
inner race and shaft continually in different directions due to them
spinning around and are of short duration. This stress is perpendicular to
the main torque load and not directly additive. Third; the extented prop
does not increase the bending load of the shaft nor increases the bearing
loads during directional changes in flight since only torque load is
generated(from gyroscopic effect by the prop plane changing directions)
and transferred to to the bearings which are in a different area of the
same plane ( a plane through the axis of the propshaft) This is independend
of the lenght of the prop extension and does therefore not induce
additional loads on the system.
My ME bible sums it up as follows (edited): "CW moments in a plane can be
relocated to different areas of that plane without additional forces
generated and can also be balanced out by CCW moments without inducing
additional forces independend of the distance between them as long as they
are all acting in one plane".
As I see it and expressed before , extending the prop location by a few
inches induces only secondary type loads i.e. in different directions and
different type to the propshaft and bearings main load and the resulting
load increase on the shaft and bearings will be small.
Frank Reynen MKIII@485 hrs (installing a 912 with 2.5" extended IVO)
http://www.webcom.com/reynen/mark3.html
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Erich Weaver 805-683-0200 <sbaew(at)dames.com> |
Subject: | Re: UL insurance |
Fellow Kolbers:
When its finally ready, I will have a Mrk III with a 912 engine. UL
ooperation at the local club site is restricted to single place except
for a designated instructor at the site (regardless of whether you have
your own BFI or not), and liability insurance is also required. I will
be able to fly the Mrk III there provided I fly single place, remove the
unused seat, and acquire liability insurance.
All that is ok by me, but Im a little concerned about whether an
insurance company will provide coverage to me given that for right now
anyway, without a BFI, I dont meet the legal UL defintition. Will they
care? My position is that everyone else flying at the club is overweight
too, but perhaps a Mrk III with a 912 is stretching things a bit too
far...
What choices are there for UL liability insurance? Will this be a
problem for me?
I should also probably tell you that I plan to get that BFI ASAP so that
I can be more nearly in compliance with Fed regs. Yes, Ive read the regs
and understand them.
Thanks for the input.
Erich Weaver
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Howard Ping" <hping(at)hyperaction.net> |
Fellow Kolber's
The Blue Grass Ultralight Group (BUG's) will be holding
their Fourth Annual Safety Seminar this Sat.23rd. at Lexington Ky.
Frank Beagle will be the MC and Phill Lockwood will be one of the
speakers.
Admission is free,radios,G.P.S.,flight jacket,flight suit,caps,&
tee shirts,will be given away through tickets.
For more information contact Danny Mullins at (606)233-
1580 Howard
FS2 116hr.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "F J MARINO" <FMARINO(at)netlink1.nlcomm.com> |
A year or so ago some one mentioned that they installed a small door or
access panel to get at the fuel tanks, I want to change my fuel lines but I
can't reach the stinkin things, I left the back of the seats open so I could
get at the lines but I still can't reach them. If any one remembers how the
door was made I would like some information. Also for the MKIII owners when
you connected you fuel lines from each tank did you put them under the
control rod for the ailerons or over top, I put mine under and this is where
the promblem is if it was on top the tanks would come out easier but the
fuel would flow up over the rod . Could use some info on this.
Frank
-----Original Message-----
From: Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu>
Date: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 11:46 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fuel lines
>
>I'm glad to see this come up. I know it has been discussed before and
>good suggestions put forth. However, I'm curious if anyone has tried
>a pulse line (the 6" from pulse port to Mikuni pump) made of clear
>high pressure line with braids embedded in the plastic. Somebody got
>on my case like I was asking for death tomorrow for using this, saying
>it would deteriorate and "do me in for sure". I know there are perhaps
>better methods, such as Richard's auto fuel hose with (AL?) inserted
>sleeve, but can anybody add to whether the know-it-all I encountered
>was/is right on the braided line?
>
>As for fuel line in general, I've had no problems whatsoever using the
>clear line we get from UL suppliers (or Ace hardware, getting the thick
>wall stuff). Use, replace as necessary. Most of mine lasts ~2 years
>and some didn't really need replacing at that point. I've not had
>brittleness so much as the fitting ends harden enf to not make a tight
>secure attachment.
>-Ben Ransom
>
>On Wed, 20 Jan 1999, Terry Wells wrote:
>>
>> I would like to start a discussion on the best material for fuel lines.
>> I've tried several different kinds without much satisfaction. Either
>> they get hard get soft or get brittle. I suspect it is the fuel
>> additives. What have others had good luck with.
>> Terry Wells
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: | MKIII 912 TOW PLANE |
From: | JEFF H VAUGHAN <tonarockfarm(at)juno.com> |
Anyone know of any MKIIIS WITH a 912 for sale? Our soaring club is
looking for a tow plane. W do not need a complete plane because we will
be modifing the wing to be a MKIII TUG version. Also can anyone tell us
what it costs to overhaul a 912? Who does the overhauls? Is it best to
send to Rotax? What other options are available?
Jeff Vaughan
Southeastern Pa flight Park
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | rick106(at)juno.com |
Subject: | Re: Warning: Rotax 912 with Rans Muffler |
Ok Dennis
I have what you are talking about what is the next step what will rans
do ? to fix this problem.or will they do anything well thanks for passing
this along .I bought your friends 912 (JIM COTE) so I know you have seen
my engine and muffler please let me -us know the right steps to take.
Rick Libersat
writes:
>
>We have heard the following report about the following engine failure
>incident:
>
>A Mark-III with a Rotax 912 reportedly had an engine failure due to a
>piece
>of baffling coming loose from inside the Rans muffler and sliding down
>the
>manifold into the engine through the exhaust port. When the engine
>was
>started, the piece of metal caused damaged to the engine. The hour
>meter
>showed 70 hours, the aircraft was 4-5 years old.
>
>The Rans muffler is oval in shape, made of stainless steel and sits on
>top
>of the engine. It is connected to the engine with 4 header pipes. If
>you
>are flying with one of these mufflers, you should not fly until you
>know
>there are no loose parts inside the muffler. If you have questions
>give us
>at Kolb Aircraft.
>
>If you know of anyone with one of these mufflers, pass this warning on
>to them.
>
>
>Dennis Souder
>Pres Kolb Aircraft
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Mark Scott" <mdscott3(at)excite.com> |
Subject: | looking for MKIII owner |
Iam interested in building a MKIII but first i want to see one. I live in
south louisiana right outside of neworleans does any one know of anyone that
has one in are around my area.
Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | Re: MK-3 and Hirth. Re-post |
>
>
>Well the big thing is, we never could get the Carb right, it's so tickish,
>it just would "not" idle, it had too much compression, we even had the
>factory- guys work on it down at "Sun & Fun"..
>The fan belt is BAD
>The whole fan system is a nightmare.
>It will not idle.
>If you want to be a TEST pilot, try it.
>You buy one, and then you'll know!
My experiences are a lot different from yours, Idles great at 800rpm 100
hrs on it now and no fan or cooling problems, main thing I found was I was
given the wrong timing info in the owners manual
Could the carb have been bad, I had that problem on a Zenoah and after
hours and hours dinking around it turned out to be a bad carb
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Ralph H Burlingame <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
Ben,
I think ordinary auto fuel line hose for the pulse line is best because
of its high temperature rating and wall thickness that will never go flat
on you. My 447 has the braided line installed and I haven't changed it
yet, although no problems with it.
Ralph Burlingame
Original FireStar, 447 powered
>but can anybody add to whether the know-it-all I encountered
>was/is right on the braided line?
>-Ben Ransom
>
>On Wed, 20 Jan 1999, Terry Wells wrote:
>>
>> I would like to start a discussion on the best material for fuel
>lines.
>> I've tried several different kinds without much satisfaction.
>Either
>> they get hard get soft or get brittle. I suspect it is the fuel
>> additives. What have others had good luck with.
>> Terry Wells
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Dirk4315(at)aol.com |
Please sent a photo
Mines a good looker also
MK III on alum. amphid Floats with a 912
Thanks Dirk in Ca.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Jim Baker" <jlbaker(at)telepath.com> |
Subject: | Re: MK-3 and Hirth. Re-post |
>
> >
> >
> >Well the big thing is, we never could get the Carb right, it's so tickish,
> >it just would "not" idle, it had too much compression, we even had the
> >factory- guys work on it down at "Sun & Fun"..
> >The fan belt is BAD
> >The whole fan system is a nightmare.
> >It will not idle.
> >If you want to be a TEST pilot, try it.
> >You buy one, and then you'll know!
>
>
> My experiences are a lot different from yours, Idles great at 800rpm 100
> hrs on it now and no fan or cooling problems, main thing I found was I was
> given the wrong timing info in the owners manual
> Could the carb have been bad, I had that problem on a Zenoah and after
> hours and hours dinking around it turned out to be a bad carb
Same here. Experiences are all good. 2704 with 240 hrs, had a fan
belt problem but fixed with a factory fan pulley update (crowned,
both drive and driven pully). No other problems, no decarbons, one
set of plugs changed, idles about 900-1000, runs very smoothly.
Can commiserate on the high compression though....takes a lot of
ooomph from the battery to get it turning but kicks off after 1/2 rev.
J. Baker
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Possum <possums(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: | Re: MK-3 and Hirth. Re-post |
> My experiences are a lot different from yours, Idles great at 800rpm 100
>hrs on it now and no fan or cooling problems, main thing I found was I was
>given the wrong timing info in the owners manual
>Could the carb have been bad, I had that problem on a Zenoah.
Yes-could have been the Carb.
Wasn't my Engine & wasn't my money, I only watched.
If your engine works great, stick with it.
Not trying to act like a know-it-all.
Shouldn't have had that last beer- before I hit the send button.
Like some else said an interesting discussion at:
<http://www.ultralightnews.com/buz/rtxhirt.html>
Judge for yourself, probably some bias & some truth?
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Jerry Bidle <jbidle(at)airmail.net> |
Subject: | Re: UL insurance |
You don't say if you have a pilot certificate and current medial, since you
didn't I assume you don't have one or either. That kills you on insuring
it as an experimental if you went through the process as the builder to get
an N number.
Second, why would they allow a 2 place way over weight to operate out of
that field as a single place. I would think to get a policy issued for
that plane, you would have to declare it a trainer. When you take the seat
out, your no longer fit that category and would your insurance policy
remain in force to protect them. Most policies have little protective
clauses which address intentional use out side the designated operational
parameters. I think your pushing everything to the limit and beyond.
Jerry
>
>Fellow Kolbers:
>
>When its finally ready, I will have a Mrk III with a 912 engine. UL
>ooperation at the local club site is restricted to single place except
>for a designated instructor at the site (regardless of whether you have
>your own BFI or not), and liability insurance is also required. I will
>be able to fly the Mrk III there provided I fly single place, remove the
>unused seat, and acquire liability insurance.
>
>All that is ok by me, but Im a little concerned about whether an
>insurance company will provide coverage to me given that for right now
>anyway, without a BFI, I dont meet the legal UL defintition. Will they
>care? My position is that everyone else flying at the club is overweight
>too, but perhaps a Mrk III with a 912 is stretching things a bit too
>far...
>
>What choices are there for UL liability insurance? Will this be a
>problem for me?
>
>I should also probably tell you that I plan to get that BFI ASAP so that
>I can be more nearly in compliance with Fed regs. Yes, Ive read the regs
>and understand them.
>
>Thanks for the input.
>
>Erich Weaver
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | William Weber <bweber2(at)earthlink.net> |
Subject: | Re: Top End Running Problem |
Awhile ago I was asking for suggestions on a problem I was having losing
power at the top end, but only after 2 or 3 touch and go's. I checked
and re-checked the ignition and played with the carb jetting to no
avail. Finally, at the suggestion of a fellow flyer who once had a
similar problem, I re-tightened the exhaust manifold bolts and that
fixed it! Apparently there was a slight exhaust leak that didn't show up
until temps and rpm's were high enough.
Something more to keep in mind.
--
***********************************************
* Bill Weber * Keep *
* Voiceboard Corp * the shiny *
* Simi Valley, CA * side up *
***********************************************
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Possum <possums(at)mindspring.com> |
Subject: Tool Humor
HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer
nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate thin walled aluminum
tubing
not far from the bolt you are trying to "tap" in..
MECHANIC'S KNIFE: Used to open and slice through the contents of
cardboard cartons delivered to your front door; works particularly
well on boxes containing seats and fabric containers.
ELECTRIC HAND DRILL: Normally used for spinning steel Pop rivets in
their holes until you die of old age, but it also works great for
drilling mounting holes in fabric just to the left of the rib you are
trying to hit.
PLIERS: Used to round off bolt heads.
HACKSAW: One of a family of cutting tools built on the Ouija board
principle. It transforms human energy into a crooked, unpredictable
motion, and the more you attempt to influence its course, the more
dismal your future becomes.
VICE-GRIPS: Also used to round off bolt heads. When nothing else is
available, they can also be used to transfer intense welding heat to
the palm of your hand.
OXYACETELENE TORCH: Used almost entirely for lighting various
flammable objects in your garage on fire. Also handy for igniting
the fumes inside the wing that your just painted yesterday.
WHITWORTH SOCKETS: Once used for working on older British cars and
motorcycles, they are now used mainly for impersonating that 9/16 or
1" socket you've been searching for the last 15 minutes.
DRILL PRESS: A tall upright machine useful for suddenly snatching
flat metal bar stock out of your hands so that it smacks you in the chest
and flings your beer across the room, splattering it against that
freshly painted part you were drying.
WIRE WHEEL: Cleans rust off small parts and then throws them
somewhere under the workbench with the speed of light. Also
removes fingerprint whorls and hard-earned guitar callouses in
about the time it takes you to say, "Ouc...."
E-Z OUT BOLT AND STUD EXTRACTOR: A tool that snaps off in bolt
holes and is ten times harder than any known drill bit.
CRAFTSMAN 1 x 16-INCH SCREWDRIVER: A large motor mount prying tool
that inexplicably has an accurately machined screwdriver tip on the
end without the handle.
BATTERY ELECTROLYTE TESTER: A handy tool for transferring sulfuric
acid from a battery to the inside of your toolbox after
determining that your battery is dead as a doornail, just as you
thought.
AVIATION METAL SNIPS: See hacksaw.
PHILLIPS SCREWDRIVER: Normally used to stab the lids of $100 per gallon
aircraft paint and splash it on your shirt; can also be
used, as the name implies, to round off Phillips screw heads.
AIR COMPRESSOR: A machine that takes energy produced in a
coal-burning power plant 200 miles away and transforms it into
compressed air that travels by hose to a Chicago Pneumatic impact
wrench that grips cylinder head bolts last tightened 2 years ago by someone
using RED loctight, and rounds them off.
PRY BAR: A tool used to crumple the metal 12 ft leading edge surrounding
that clip or bracket you needed to remove in order to replace a 50 cent part.
HOSE CUTTER: A tool used to cut fuel lines 1 inch too short.
ICE SCRAPER: To scrape frost off plexiglass so you can use the big
scratches as a marker to set pitch.
When working on a project, if you put away a tool that you're certain
you're finished with, you will need it instantly
Any tool, when dropped, will roll into the least accessible corner of the
workshop.
If a tool can be borrowed and it can be broken, if you borrow it and you
will break it.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Geoff Smart" <gsmart(at)iinet.net.au> |
Be careful with standard auto fuel line, with the suck and blow of pulse
line some have be known to lose some of the inner lining and get blocked in
the line.
read the last 50 or so pages in the CPS catalogue and you will find some
very useful info.
-----Original Message-----
From: Ralph H Burlingame <ul15rhb(at)juno.com>
Date: Thursday, 21 January 1999 10:27
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fuel lines
>
>Ben,
>
>I think ordinary auto fuel line hose for the pulse line is best because
>of its high temperature rating and wall thickness that will never go flat
>on you. My 447 has the braided line installed and I haven't changed it
>yet, although no problems with it.
>
>Ralph Burlingame
>Original FireStar, 447 powered
>
>
>
>>but can anybody add to whether the know-it-all I encountered
>>was/is right on the braided line?
>>-Ben Ransom
>>
>
>
>>On Wed, 20 Jan 1999, Terry Wells wrote:
>>>
>>> I would like to start a discussion on the best material for fuel
>>lines.
>>> I've tried several different kinds without much satisfaction.
>>Either
>>> they get hard get soft or get brittle. I suspect it is the fuel
>>> additives. What have others had good luck with.
>>> Terry Wells
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Rutledge Fuller" <rut007(at)hotmail.com> |
Subject: | Re: X-C flight and F_______ |
A long story, but it stands for Ferguson. Sorry Dennis, he made me do
it. You see, every time Dennis sees that F______ word, he gets enraged
at the copy cat design and runs through the Kolb factory like a bull in
a china shop. I was trying to keep tensions eased by continuing to
designate it as the F______. I can't help it that one of my flying
buddies flys one.
Rutledge (Will fly with anyone) Fuller
Tallahassee, Fl.
----Original Message Follows----
From: Kerrjb(at)aol.com
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 19:45:36 EST
Subject: X-C flight
Hi,
>>Mike flys one of those F______'s,>>
Excuse my igornance, what is a F______?
Bernie Kerr
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | Re: MK-3 and Hirth. Re-post |
>
>Like some else said an interesting discussion at:
><http://www.ultralightnews.com/buz/rtxhirt.html>
> Judge for yourself, probably some bias & some truth?
>
>
Is that the Buzzman reveiw, Dave is quite a character but once he has an
opinion he is like a pitbull and won't give up, right or wrong
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | ToddThom(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: UL insurance |
Erich, If you remove the other seat in your MKIII it will not qualify as a UL
under part 103, and 4274 exception restricts flying two place UL's to
instructional use only. This means that you must have a student in the
second seat or be in route to giving a lesson.
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | rick106(at)juno.com |
Subject: | Re: looking for MKIII owner |
Mark
I am not too far from you I'm in Beaumont ,Texas that is just about 40
min or so from Lake Charles
Rick Libersat
writes:
>
>Iam interested in building a MKIII but first i want to see one. I live
>in
>south louisiana right outside of neworleans does any one know of
>anyone that
>has one in are around my area.
>
>
>Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Dennis Watson" <djwatson(at)olg.com> |
Are there any Kolb owners in Md. or D.C. area on the list??
Thanks,
Dennis
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "CHRISTOPHER DAVIS" <cdavis2(at)capecod.net> |
Subject: | Re: UL insurance |
You should try what a well reconized UL instructor has beebn known to do ,
I refereto a grey haired bearded man from region one , he flys with a
man sized stuffed gorilla , but thats in a d ifferent m,ake of UL isn't
it walt??
-----Original Message-----
From: ToddThom(at)aol.com <ToddThom(at)aol.com>
Date: Thursday, January 21, 1999 11:00 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: UL insurance
>
>Erich, If you remove the other seat in your MKIII it will not qualify as a
UL
>under part 103, and 4274 exception restricts flying two place UL's to
>instructional use only. This means that you must have a student in the
>second seat or be in route to giving a lesson.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Richard <swidersk(at)digital.net> |
Subject: | Re: Thinking of starting a club |
Ray Baker's mention of the " Boo Boo Of The Month Club" got me thinking.
I'd like to nominate myself as President with this unembelished true tale:
Once upon a time I took apart a perfectly good running engine because it
suddenly stopped after a prop strike (I don't have the courage to share that
part of the stoy yet). After totally disassembling it & carefully plugging all
holes & oriffices to keep out FL bugs & dirt, I meticulously inspected every
piece, decarboned what little was there & then I lightly honed it & put in new
rings just because I felt I shouldn't go thru so much work & not do something to
it {she had 200 hrs). I proudly reinstalled it. It started on the 3rd pull
just like always. When the CHT got to 200 I began my break-in procedure. She
purred like a kitten & I was swelling with pride. But then, I hit 4.8K rpm where
she coughed & sputtered untill I backed off the throttle. I thought a naughty
word. Perplexed but undaunted, I decided to wash the air filter & replace the
fuel filter... NC (No Change) Normally I didn't throw away my platinum spark
plugs untill they had 50 hrs, but with 25hrs I did it anyway...NC. I did a
compression test...perfect. I did a leak down test...perfect. I replaced the
resister sparkplug caps...NC. The belief in gremlins became attractive at this
point. I went through both carbs...NC. I replaced both carbs...NC. I
dismissed gremlins & tried praying...NC. I removed my plug wire
shielding...NC. I replaced the plug wires...NC. I replaced the coil...NC. In
desperation, I replaced that expensive black box...NC! I started to believe in
gremlins again. Or maybe it was something magic. After a few days of blackbut,
it occured to me, I'll bet I twisted the crank! I happily removed the engine,
bought a degree wheel, & rigged it up along with a dial indicator in each plug
hole...perfect. Blackbut set in again. Logic wasn't providing any more options
& the local farm supply wouldn't sell me any dynomite, thus began my attempt to
bend reality. I reasoned that it was possible that the crank had twist built
into it & maybe I knocked it out! I always wanted to put in the heavy duty
version crankshaft & besides, how could I ever trust that old crank again? I
again meticulously tore down the engine, replaced the crank & put the engine
back on the UltraStar. With fear & trepidation, I started it up in 3 pulls,
waited untill I saw 200 degrees & pushed her to 4.8K. My heart sank as she
coughed & sputtered. I started to sputter something too. Two weeks later I
decided I wouldn't sell my plane after all. Then a light turned on, The
mag/flywheel must have twisted the keyway, changed the timing which won't allow
it to advance properly. Off the plane & back on the bench as I eagerly began
disassembling it again. I didn't bother putting it back together after I found
the mag to be A-ok. After two days my stubborn streak reared its head & I
defiantly replaced the the only parts that remained untouched, the trigger coil
& ignition coil inside the mag & it's wire harness. I put it all back together
& back onto the plane. Afraid to even hope, I started her up on the 3rd pull,
waited for 200 & gave her the gas...NC! She sputtered & puked out as soon as
that tach hit 4.8K! If it were a matter of just quitting flying or throwing
that motor over a bridge I would gladly have done it. But I was mad. I was
humiliated that this stupid hunk of metal without a brain was defeating me.
Another week went by & I just got madder because each time I reran the problem
thru my head I came up blank & feeling like my nose was rubbed in the dirt one
more time. Then came that fateful day...my misery drove me to call a buddy,
long distance call during prime time (I used up all my local friends.) He only
let me whine for a few minutes when he told me he knew what was wrong with my
engine. At first I was upset that he interrupted me, then I felt he was rather
arrogant, making such a brash proclamation. He said, "Richard, you're stopping
short in your thinking. You are forgetting about the part of the motor that
stuffs the fuel mixture back into the cylinder." I told him the muffler didn't
have any cracks & was almost new, besides, how could a sudden strike effect a
muffler? He wouldn't argue with me. Instead, he just kept repeating himself.
So I ripped off the muffler & looked it over real close & shook it every which
way...nothing unusual. Blew air thru it & lots came out the other end. I poked
a wire into it, ran water through it & banged on it...nothing. Not wanting my
muffler to rust on the inside, I lit up the torch real high & put the flame
inside the inlet. It started to smoke & stink something terrible, unlike
anything carbon or oil would do. I banged it some more & a piece of my shop
rag fell out!!! I left the rag in the muffler inlet. When the engine fired up
it blew it into the resonace chamber where it bounced around happily untill the
engine started to "get on the pipe", e.g., the standing wave began packing the
fuel-air mixture back into the engine, & the rag would be blown against the
inlet & choke the motor. Besides the stupid mistake of the rag, I made 2 fatal
errors: 1) I got stuck in the line of thinking that the prop strike was causual
& 2) I forgot to consider the 2-stroke's tuned exhaust system as part of the
engine. Even though my stupidity was glaring in my face, I sure felt good!
This was dumb. I've done even dumber things. But how I achieved the prop
strike was in the dumbest catagory. Maybe if someone starts a "Most
Embarrassing Story Club" I would have the courage to share it. Ray this
verbage is all your fault.
---Richard In Ocala
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Cavuontop(at)aol.com |
Subject: | Re: Thinking of starting a club |
In a message dated 1/21/99 8:29:58 PM Eastern Standard Time,
swidersk(at)digital.net writes:
<< Maybe if someone starts a "Most
Embarrassing Story Club" I would have the courage to share it. >>
That is an excellent embarassing story. And I have one to top it. But it
wasn't me, it was my brother, I swear. He had a Stinson 108-2. A cylinder on
the Franklin engine went bad on him so he took it off, stuffed couple of rags
in the hole and sent the cylinder out for reman. When it came back he put it
on and it started up and taxied out to to see how it ran. As he taxied out he
heard a big bag and all the old boys that hang out by the FBO started waving
their hands and running toward him. The oil line had blown off and sprayed
oil all over.
They rolled the plane back to hangar and my bro closed the door thinking he
was in for a very expensive ride. When his mechanic buddy showed up a couple
of days later and dropped the pan he stuck in his hand and pulled out a bunch
of fuzzy yuck and little stretchy bits of stuff that looked like chopped up
rubber bands. It took a couple of seconds for my brother to realize that what
he was looking at was what remained of the elastic waistband from a pair of
his jockey shorts.
Now top THAT!!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | bob n <ronoy(at)shentel.net> |
Subject: | Re: Kolb's in MD. |
Dennis, I'm not in Dc, (thank him that keeps me airborne), nor in MD.
Does 100mi west of Dc count? Grey Baron , FireFly, in Winchester VA
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Mark Scott" <mdscott3(at)excite.com> |
Subject: | Looking for someone with a kolb in my area |
HI THERE; I am very interested in KOLB airplanes
Expecially the mark III. Is there anyone in the south Louisiana area are
nearby with one.
Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Jon Croke" <joncroke(at)itol.com> |
Subject: | Re: Thinking of starting a club |
>
> Ray Baker's mention of the " Boo Boo Of The Month Club" got me
thinking.
>I'd like to nominate myself as President with this unembelished true tale:
>
Richard in Ocala,
What a great story!!!!
I know it had to be terribly frustrating to go thru all of that.... but you
must now have a big bag full of perfectly good spare parts!! And some
great experience in engine teardowns and the like......
Destroy that rag... it just might possess some evil soul... wouldnt trust it
for anything!!
Jon in Greenbay
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Mark Scott" <mdscott3(at)excite.com> |
Subject: | Re: looking for MKIII owner |
>
> Mark
> I am not too far from you I'm in Beaumont ,Texas that is just about 40
> min or so from Lake Charles
>
> Rick Libersat
>
> writes:
> >
> >Iam interested in building a MKIII but first i want to see one. I live
> >in
> >south louisiana right outside of neworleans does any one know of
> >anyone that
> >has one in are around my area.
> >
> >
Hey Rick; thanks for responding. Im an old Quicksilver MX pilot.I sold my MX
about 1 yr ago and I have missed it ever since. But now im thinking of
building another airplane but this time something nicer and faster. The KOLB
MKIII seams to be what im looking far. But sofar i havent sean one in real
life only in the info pack from KOLB. What kind do you have ? are you still
building? How long have you had it and how many hours do you have in it?
what size engine are you using.
> >Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | Re: UL insurance |
>
>Erich, If you remove the other seat in your MKIII it will not qualify as a UL
>under part 103,
It also means that whatever insurance you buy will not be valid in case
of an accident because you misrepresented your aircraft as an ultralight,
same goes for Fat ultralights (there is no such catagory, It is either is
an ultralight or an unregisterd experimental)
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Dennis Watson" <djwatson(at)olg.com> |
Subject: | Re: Kolb's in MD. |
Bob, I went to a fly-in that USUA Club 1 had, If I remember correctly it was
near Winchester. I would like to check out a Firefly in person. I did see
a Firestar at the fly-in but did not get a chance to check it out. Which
brings up a question I'm sure someone can answer for me, what is a KXP???
--
>
>Dennis, I'm not in Dc, (thank him that keeps me airborne), nor in MD.
>Does 100mi west of Dc count? Grey Baron , FireFly, in Winchester VA
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | bob n <ronoy(at)shentel.net> |
Subject: | Re: Kolb's in MD. |
Dennis, c'mon over to Winchester 'most anytime as I'm retired. Ph 540
722 3628, e mail ronoy(at)shentel.net
Be glad to show you my FF. Your e mail?
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | rick106(at)juno.com |
Subject: | Re: looking for MKIII owner |
Mark I have the M/3 it is flying has been for about 2 years I have a582
on it now and it flys great but I just bought a 912 and I an putting it
on and selling the 582 . I have 73 hr.on it with out a bit of trouble .
Hope that you decide to get the M/3 it is a thought one to beat.
Rick Libersat
writes:
>
>
>>
>> Mark
>> I am not too far from you I'm in Beaumont ,Texas that is just about
>40
>> min or so from Lake Charles
>>
>> Rick Libersat
>>
>> writes:
>> >
>> >Iam interested in building a MKIII but first i want to see one. I
>live
>> >in
>> >south louisiana right outside of neworleans does any one know of
>> >anyone that
>> >has one in are around my area.
>> >
>> >
>Hey Rick; thanks for responding. Im an old Quicksilver MX pilot.I sold
>my MX
>about 1 yr ago and I have missed it ever since. But now im thinking of
>building another airplane but this time something nicer and faster.
>The KOLB
>MKIII seams to be what im looking far. But sofar i havent sean one in
>real
>life only in the info pack from KOLB. What kind do you have ? are you
>still
>building? How long have you had it and how many hours do you have in
>it?
>what size engine are you using.
>> >Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Hansen, Mark" <MHansen(at)ConusNews.com> |
Subject: | engine, it may be worth looking at. |
A few months ago I tried to get some info on a Suzuki snowmobile engine.
I found it. They range from 60 to 100 horse power. And yes you can use the
rotax gear box on them. I found it at J-Bird in Kewaskum, WI
The engine price is $1,700 (you still need carbs & stuff) I don't know what
the full price is for a ready to go engine, but for you new builders who
plan to change to a 912 later it might be worth looking into.
phone 414-626-2611
mark
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Terry Swartz <tswartz(at)desupernet.net> |
Subject: | Re: looking for MKIII owner |
Rick
You will really like the 912. I have 127 hrs on mine in the last year and a
half, and it hasn't missed a beat since I replaced those cone shaped air filters
with the flat ones. The cone shaped air filters allowed ram air to lean the
mixture too much. Which prop are you using? I guess you will have to fly off
another 40 hrs. now.
Terry
rick106(at)juno.com wrote:
>
> Mark I have the M/3 it is flying has been for about 2 years I have a582
> on it now and it flys great but I just bought a 912 and I an putting it
> on and selling the 582 . I have 73 hr.on it with out a bit of trouble .
> Hope that you decide to get the M/3 it is a thought one to beat.
> Rick Libersat
name="tswartz.vcf"
filename="tswartz.vcf"
begin:vcard
n:Swartz;Terry
adr:;;;;;;
version:2.1
email;internet:Tswartz(at)desupernet.net
note:http://users.success.net/tswartz/
fn:Terry Swartz
end:vcard
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Jim Kelly" <jtk1976(at)mail.tqci.net> |
Subject: | Re: Kolb's in MD. |
Original FireStar 377, second owner here.
Hangared at St. Mary's County Airport, about 50 miles south of DC, near the
Patuxent River Naval Air Station.
Jim Kelly
-----Original Message-----
From: Dennis Watson <djwatson(at)olg.com>
Date: Thursday, January 21, 1999 6:45 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb's in MD.
>
>Are there any Kolb owners in Md. or D.C. area on the list??
>Thanks,
>Dennis
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Ron Carroll" <ron.carroll(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Subject: | Re: Thinking of starting a club |
By no stretch of the imagination do I claim to be a whiz when it comes to building
a Kolb,
but can't resist offering my suggestion for drilling the hinges.
I made a 'master' template' out of .125" X 1" X 6" steel (another longer one for
the
aileron hinges) with accurately spaced holes drilled in it, spaced according to
the Kolb
plans. The hinges, after being cut to the proper length, were placed onto the
template
(they would only fit one way), clamped in place and drilled. VOILA! All hinges
of the
same length came out identical to all the others, and could be used in ANY location
using
that length hinge-half. There was no markings or lists required, they all just
fit
perfectly.
The jig only took a few minutes to make and apparently saved me a lot of work later
on
down the road.
Ron Carroll
Original Firestar-377 (Flying great, now with 28-hours on it, and no more seizures)
-----Original Message-----
From: Larry Bourne <larrybiglar(at)earthlink.net>
>This makes me think of some comments from last week. Seems to me this is
>one of those that SHOULD be archived. I'll bet Ray is far from the first
>to make a boo-boo like that. I've listed a few of my own, hoping that
>someone's bad experience will help someone else avoid same. Incidentally,
>I cut different shaped notches in the edges of my hinges, and made a master
>list of which notch went where. Hope I can find it. If I had thought of
>stamps, I'd probably have used them. Good Idea. Big Lar.
>
>----------
>> Had a great day Tuesday. Cut the 6 hinges for the elevators and rudder
>> from 72" 1 1/16th P2 hinge supplied. Drilled 288 holes. Arm sore from
>> patting self on back for an enjoyable day. Instructions suggest marking
>> hinges so they do not get mixed up during covering etc.
>>
>> The genius realizes this is the perfect time to use the stamping set that
>> has been setting unused for yea these many weeks. 12" hinge is whipped
>> onto small anvil, stamp in place, small tap with hammer, nice clean
>> numbers on hinge. Same to other side of hinge. Looks great, deep enough
>> that paint will not obscure.
>>
>> Work hinge open and closed. DUE TO SPREADING METAL WITH STAMP, HINGE NOW
>> "OIL CANS" AS IT CROSSES CENTER!!! Obviously I stamped too deep/hard.
>>
>> Please send 12" section of P2 hinge so that the "genius" can drill 48
>> more holes and use a less destructive method of marking hinges. US Mail
>> service will be adequate.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
Subject: | Re: Thinking of starting a club |
On Thu, 21 Jan 1999, Richard wrote:
> Ray Baker's mention of the " Boo Boo Of The Month Club" got me thinking.
> I'd like to nominate myself as President with this unembelished true tale:
Richard,
Fortunately there are 12 months in each year so plenty of room for all
of us in this club (blech). You deserve the prize for at least the
one or even two months of your 2-stroke on the rag story. And here I
thought I had gone to a rediculous amount of trouble once with going
so far as doing leak-down checks etc, only to find a gasket leak on the
exhaust side. I read your great saga and feel like maybe I only would
get honerable mention!! :) ...and i still won't admit how I started
to try to do the leakdown test -- a VP nomination in that story :)
Part of what comes from your story is the bit about 2-strokes being
harder to deal with than 4 strokes. The hardest part about them is
simply that they are different from what/how we are used to thinking.
I know it is easy too, to become too hooked on what we think is 'cause
-effect'.
I will be careful where I leave rags.
Thanks,
-Ben Ransom
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Ben Ransom <ransom(at)mae.engr.ucdavis.edu> |
Subject: | Re: UL insurance |
> >
> >Erich, If you remove the other seat in your MKIII it will not qualify as a UL
> >under part 103,
>
On Thu, 21 Jan 1999, wood wrote:
> It also means that whatever insurance you buy will not be valid in case
> of an accident because you misrepresented your aircraft as an ultralight,
> same goes for Fat ultralights (there is no such catagory, It is either is
> an ultralight or an unregisterd experimental)
AVEMCO recognizes fat ultralights. However, Erich, most would agree
you are looking for way more than what fits in anybodies' gray area.
Good luck finding a solution, whether it is Exp Category or possibly
UL Trainer.
-Ben Ransom
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Jason Omelchuck <jason(at)acuityinc.com> |
I was web surfing and came across this add in some on line ultra light
"magazine". About half way down in the page in this attached link is
someone selling 912's cheep. I have no experience with this person, I
just wanted to pass this information along.
http://www.web-search.com/equip.html#e
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | Re: Thinking of starting a club |
>
>On Thu, 21 Jan 1999, Richard wrote:
>> Ray Baker's mention of the " Boo Boo Of The Month Club" got me thinking.
>> I'd like to nominate myself as President with this unembelished true tale:
I once used the term Boo Boo to describe an incident where someone may
have wished to have installed the nose skid. I was told in no uncertain
terms KOlb folks or good pilots did not have BooBoo's
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | wood <richard.wood(at)usa.net> |
Subject: | Re: Thinking of starting a club |
>
>I made a 'master' template' out of .125" X 1" X 6" steel (another longer
one for the
>aileron hinges) with accurately spaced holes drilled in it, spaced
according to the Kolb
>plans
I have a bad habit of oversimpifying but I just numbered the hinges with a
magic marker
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | rick106(at)juno.com |
Subject: | Re: Cheep 912's? |
Jason
I have been looking for a while at the 912 and found out that the guys
that sell them don't sell them at a discount rate be careful about the
cheep price you may be looking at an overhaul and if you look at the C P
S book the overhaul price $ 6000.00
so you could maybe get it cheep5 or / 6k. but you may be looking at a run
out engine that needs a 6k face lift that looks like $ 10,000 -
11,000
Rick Libersat
writes:
>
>I was web surfing and came across this add in some on line ultra light
>"magazine". About half way down in the page in this attached link is
>someone selling 912's cheep. I have no experience with this person, I
>just wanted to pass this information along.
>http://www.web-search.com/equip.html#e
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | rick106(at)juno.com |
Subject: | Re: looking for MKIII owner |
Terry
Thanks I think I will like the 912 ok as far as the air filters I have
the flat ones , but now on the prop I don't know what to buy??? I talked
to DAN at KOLB and he said they use the IVO then Mr. Hauck he uses the
warp drive ,then FRANK R REYNEN will use the IVO I like frank's
reason it makes all the since in the world ,and I could keep going on an
on . what I would like to do is use the one that will use the shortest
spacer. what did you go with and did you have to put the spacer in. You
got me on the HAVE TO FLY OFF THE 40 HR. again . what about one of the
guy's on the list he was one of the F.A.A. boys do I have to fly off 40
hr if I put on another engine.
Rick Libersat
writes:
>
>
>Rick
>
>You will really like the 912. I have 127 hrs on mine in the last year
>and a
>half, and it hasn't missed a beat since I replaced those cone shaped
>air filters
>with the flat ones. The cone shaped air filters allowed ram air to
>lean the
>mixture too much. Which prop are you using? I guess you will have to
>fly off
>another 40 hrs. now.
>
>Terry
>
>rick106(at)juno.com wrote:
>
>>
>> Mark I have the M/3 it is flying has been for about 2 years I have
>a582
>> on it now and it flys great but I just bought a 912 and I an
>putting it
>> on and selling the 582 . I have 73 hr.on it with out a bit of
>trouble .
>> Hope that you decide to get the M/3 it is a thought one to beat.
>> Rick Libersat
>
> name="tswartz.vcf"
> filename="tswartz.vcf"
>
>begin:vcard
>n:Swartz;Terry
>adr:;;;;;;
>version:2.1
>email;internet:Tswartz(at)desupernet.net
>note:http://users.success.net/tswartz/
>fn:Terry Swartz
>end:vcard
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | rick106(at)juno.com |
Subject: | Re: Cheep 912's? |
Jason
I have been looking for a while at the 912 and found out that the guys
that sell them don't sell them at a discount rate be careful about the
cheep price you may be looking at an overhaul and if you look at the C P
S book the overhaul price $ 6000.00
so you could maybe get it cheep5 or / 6k. but you may be looking at a run
out engine that needs a 6k face lift that looks like $ 10,000 -
11,000
Rick Libersat
writes:
>
>I was web surfing and came across this add in some on line ultra light
>"magazine". About half way down in the page in this attached link is
>someone selling 912's cheep. I have no experience with this person, I
>just wanted to pass this information along.
>http://www.web-search.com/equip.html#e
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | Terry Swartz <tswartz(at)desupernet.net> |
Subject: | Re: looking for MKIII owner |
Rick
I have the warp drive and I did not have to use spacers. The flap horns must be
installed straight down for the 912 with a warp drive which I did when I built
it. If yours isn't built that way, you will need a prop spacer or change the
flap horns and then the flap linkage. If the IVO reduces noise levels because
of the increased distance from the flaps, I would go with the IVO. This summer,
I took off the full enclosure for summertime flying. I ended up putting the
back piece right back on because of the high noise level. I would like to try
a
spacer with the warp and it seems, despite of all the discussion, its hard to
argue with all the hours John H has on his. My only reason would be to reduce
noise.
I'm pretty sure you are supposed to get a sign off and fly off another 40 hours
if you change the engine or prop.
Terry
rick106(at)juno.com wrote:
>
> Terry
> Thanks I think I will like the 912 ok as far as the air filters I have
> the flat ones , but now on the prop I don't know what to buy??? I talked
> to DAN at KOLB and he said they use the IVO then Mr. Hauck he uses the
> warp drive ,then FRANK R REYNEN will use the IVO I like frank's
> reason it makes all the since in the world ,and I could keep going on an
> on . what I would like to do is use the one that will use the shortest
> spacer. what did you go with and did you have to put the spacer in. You
> got me on the HAVE TO FLY OFF THE 40 HR. again . what about one of the
> guy's on the list he was one of the F.A.A. boys do I have to fly off 40
> hr if I put on another engine.
>
name="tswartz.vcf"
filename="tswartz.vcf"
begin:vcard
n:Swartz;Terry
adr:;;;;;;
version:2.1
email;internet:Tswartz(at)desupernet.net
note:http://users.success.net/tswartz/
fn:Terry Swartz
end:vcard
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Ron Christensen" <SPECTRUMINTERNATIONAL(at)email.msn.com> |
Subject: | Re: Control Surface construction |
Hi Duncan:
I made triangular shaped gussets for attaching all the control surface ribs
to the L.E. because I too didn't like the bump created by riveting the rib
to the sides of the L.E. Of course, the T.E. bumps have also been
eliminated on my airplane. Recommend gussets at the L.E. rather than trying
to rivet the rib to the back side of the L.E. of each control surface. Sure
makes a nice looking finished product.
Ron Christensen
MKIII 1/2
-----------------------------
You wrote:
>The plans offer an alternative to the way the control surface ribs are
>connected to the trailing edge that doesn't leave a bump. I'd like to do
>the same thing at the leading edge of the control surfaces. I believe
using
>a gusset on either side of the control surface LE to fasten the ribs would
>be as strong as the plans method of riveting the rib directly to the LE. I
>wondered about using the cleanest method, that of bending the rib 90
degrees
>and riveting to the backside of the LE (offset a little to the side so the
>surface of the rib was even with the surface of the LE) Would this be
>acceptable?
________________________________________________________________________________
From: | "Dennis Watson" <djwatson(at)olg.com> |
List, Thanks to all that responded.
Hey Jim, I live in Ridge. I talked to you on the phone 4 or 5 Months ago
when I was looking for an instructor. Give me a call sometime at
301-872-9523 (H) or at the Office 301-863-5090 X241 I would love to check
out your Kolb and get some insight into flying out of St.Marys.
Thanks.........Dennis djwatson(at)olg.com
December 29, 1998 - January 24, 1999
Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-bf