Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-ev

February 20, 2004 - March 13, 2004



      
         Steve Henry
         FS/377
      
      
      
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From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Facet Fuel Pump
Date: Feb 20, 2004
|I do not run my facet pump at all after that. The most probable time | for an accident is during take-off or landing. I don't like the thought of | being in a damaged aircraft with an electric fuel pump running and squirting | fuel everywhere. | Steven G. Hi Steve G/Gang: When you turn off your master switch, does that not turn off the electric fuel pump? If one has the time and forethought, good idea to kill the master before impact. Cuts down on the chances of an electrical spark igniting spilled fuel. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Starter trouble
Date: Feb 20, 2004
|It needed a new $12 one way clutch bearing. | Steve Henry Steve/All: Where did you get the bearing? john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: 582 Ebox MKIII and prop advise
Date: Feb 20, 2004
Now I discover I cannot put a large enough 3 blade prop on the 582 e box combo. | Giovanni Day Giovanni/Gang: What diameter is large enough? Just curious.. I had a 3 blade GSC wood and a 3 blade Warp, but can not remember what diameter they were. Maybe 68" or 70" on a C Gear Box. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DAquaNut(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 20, 2004
Subject: Re: Prop Pitch
Group, This may be a dumb question , But where do you check the pitch on an Ivo prop, At the tip? Also what is the purpose of the 1/2 inch holes on both sides of the gearbox on the 447. Does it hurt anything to leave them open. Im pretty sure that is how the factory Firefly is set up. Ed ( in Houston ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steven Green" <kolbdriver(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Facet Fuel Pump
Date: Feb 21, 2004
When you turn off your master switch, does that not turn off the electric fuel pump? If one has the time and forethought, good idea to kill the master before impact. Cuts down on the chances of an electrical spark igniting spilled fuel. Take care, john h Yes, the master does kill everything I was afraid I might be short on forethought or not have the time at a time like that. Your comments have changed my thoughts on where I will install the inertia switch. I will now install it in the circuit for the master power solenoid. There it will kill all power in the event of an undesireable event. Steven G. BTW: I was able to shut down all power when I had the engine failure, but I was probably 500' AGL. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Kirk Smith" <snuffy(at)usol.com>
Subject: Re: Facet Fuel Pump
Date: Feb 21, 2004
that. Your comments have changed my thoughts on where I will > install the inertia switch. I will now install it in the circuit for the > master power solenoid. There it will kill all power in the event of an > undesireable event. Steve/all Just curious about where this enertia switch goes in the circuit. If it only is in the coil circuit for the master solenoid you will still have one side of the contacts on the solenoid hot and the lead from there to the battery hot . Keeping that lead as short as possible decreases the chances of it being shorted to ground or arcing in a crash. Adding extra covering over that will help even more. You probably are already aware of this but just wanted to mention it in case. Kirk ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Airgriff2(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 21, 2004
Subject: Re: 582 Ebox MKIII and prop advise
> > >> what ratio and prop most are running on a 582? Thanks >> >> Giovanni Day >> MKIII >> > On my MK3 with 618, I use e-box, 3:47 to 1, 72", 3 blade Warp. Very pleased. Bob Griffin ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Outboard Rib Reinforcement
Date: Feb 21, 2004
Good Morning Kolbers: Was trying to find some other info for Paul Petty, rivet sequence for attaching ribs to spar. While looking through my old MKIII supplemental drawings, came across this page: http://home.elmore.rr.com/jhauck/MK%20III%20Construction/Rib%20Reinforcement.jpg If it is not large enough, I will rescan and upload another to my index page. Please note the date Dennis Souder drew the plans and the wrote the instructions, 1990. I built my first MKIII wings in 1991 and the second set in 1992. I noticed one thing I did not do on my rib reinforments, the two extra rivets in the front and rear gussets. So far, this has not presented any problem. When I rebuilt the left wing in 2001, the front and rear gussets were just fine. Also note that: "These are not necessary for NORMAL flight loads with a properly handled and maintained wing." I emphsize "normal flight loads." My wings have experienced much more than normal flight loads during their travels. Especially the one in the back of the trailer from Muncho Lake, BC, to OSH, and finally hauck's holler, Alabama. Also note, where the holes are drilled and riveted. Maybe List Member Jim Gerken will rethink what he wrote about "my" useless modifications "filling the ribs with unnecessary holes, weakening them, adding weight for nothing." Please take into consideration, my airplane has not led a NORMAL life, and will not lead a normal life in the future. In these conditions, I want Miss P'fer to keep on doing the excellent job she has been doing all these years. She has proven to me, whether any one else agrees or not, that the rib mods are, indeed, doing what I wanted them to do. If you all need a larger picture to see the plan sheet more clearly, let me know. I also added another 10 mb to the 5 free ones Road Runner gave me for my personal web site. $10.00 a month is a small fee to try and help folks with their Kolbs. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Fackler, Ken" <kfackler(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: Inertial switch to kill power
Date: Feb 21, 2004
I think this idea of an inertial switch is interesting. But I have one concern that I'd be interested to hear comments about. Is it possible that an unexpected bump in the air could trip the switch? Even on days when the flying was pretty sweet, I've hit an occasional blammo that would rattle my teeth. -Ken Fackler Kolb Mark II / A722KWF Rochester MI ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Green" <kolbdriver(at)bellsouth.net> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Facet Fuel Pump > > When you turn off your master switch, does that not turn off the > electric fuel pump? > > If one has the time and forethought, good idea to kill the master > before impact. Cuts down on the chances of an electrical spark > igniting spilled fuel. > > Take care, > > john h > > > Yes, the master does kill everything > > I was afraid I might be short on forethought or not have the time at a > time like that. Your comments have changed my thoughts on where I will > install the inertia switch. I will now install it in the circuit for the > master power solenoid. There it will kill all power in the event of an > undesireable event. > > Steven G. > > BTW: I was able to shut down all power when I had the engine failure, but I > was probably 500' AGL. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba(at)wtxs.net>
Subject: Re: mod weight
Date: Feb 21, 2004
----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Swiderski" <swiderski(at)rocketjet.net> Subject: RE: Kolb-List: mod weight > > Ronnie, > > Give me a call, 352-307-9009 drive. There were a lot of little > things that made a big difference in handling. ...Richard Swiderski > > > what did you do about the slop in the linkage, as mine has some not much > but > some? > > > > "garvelink" > > > > I flew an UltraStar hard & fast & sometimes heavy for about > > 350hrs. No aerobatics, if you don't count wingovers. Twice I went > > through some violent wing flutter (before I got rid of the control > > linkage slop & pin attatchment slop & inboard spar flex). It remained > a > > faithful & dependable friend. The only structural failures that I > know > > of were from impacting mother earth with not enough finesse. > ...Richard > > Swiderski > > > > Don, > > > > What about the Ultrastar? do you know if there have been any > structural > > failures? > > > > > > > == > == > == > == > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Paul Petty" <lynnp@c-gate.net>
Subject: Inertia switch
Date: Feb 21, 2004
Kolbers, For what it's worth, I have an inertia in my hand and it trips pretty easy. I remember when these were made mandatory by the DOT for fuel injected cars. I was working for a Ford dealer at the time and we had a lot of customers that would "trip" the switch by hitting a pot hole. It was common when they first started using them but not common anymore. pp ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Fackler, Ken" <kfackler(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: Re: Inertia switch
Date: Feb 21, 2004
This was my worry. So if I were to make a hard, bouncy landing and the engine were suddenly "off" because of this switch, I wouldn't have the option to use power to get things under control or to go around. I could even lose power by hitting a bad bump on summer day? -Ken Fackler Kolb Mark II / A722KWF Rochester MI ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Petty" <lynnp@c-gate.net> Subject: Kolb-List: Inertia switch > > Kolbers, > For what it's worth, I have an inertia in my hand and it trips pretty easy. I remember when these were made mandatory by the DOT for fuel injected cars. I was working for a Ford dealer at the time and we had a lot of customers that would "trip" the switch by hitting a pot hole. It was common when they first started using them but not common anymore. > > pp > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Inertia switch
Date: Feb 21, 2004
| This was my worry. So if I were to make a hard, bouncy landing and the | engine were suddenly "off" because of this switch, I wouldn't have the | option to use power to get things under control or to go around. I could | even lose power by hitting a bad bump on summer day? | | -Ken Fackler Ken/All: You will not shut down the engine by shutting off the master switch, if wired correctly, on electrical power, i.e., hot wires to cause sparks when crashing providing for ignition for spilled fuel. P Leads are grounded to kill ignition and shut down the engine. These are on seperate switches from the master switch. Master switch simply disconnects the continuous duty solenoid in the battery cable, isolating juice to the battery. I also have an alternator switch to disconnect the alternator from the main buss bar. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Inertia switch
Date: Feb 21, 2004
| You will not shut down the engine by shutting off the master switch, | if wired correctly, on electrical power, i.e., hot wires to cause | sparks when crashing providing for ignition for spilled fuel. | john h Kolbers: That paragraph sucks. Let me try again. That's what I get for not reading what I write. Master shuts down electrical power from the battery by disconnecting the master solenoid, a continuous duty device. This reduces chances of sparks from broken, shorted out wires, during and after the crash from igniting spilled fuel. P leads from ignition have to be grounded by the ignition switch(es). Not connected to master. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Thom Riddle" <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC?
Date: Feb 21, 2004
Does anyone having experience with the Bing 64 carbs, as on the Rotax 912 engines, know how and how well these carbs compensate for changes in density altitude? Do they work like the HAC kits on the Bing 54s on the 2 strokes? How high of a density altitude will they automatically compensate for? Any information regarding their experiences with these carbs, especially at high density altitudes, will be appreciated. Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Olenik Aviation" <olenik-aviation(at)buyitsellitfixit.com>
Subject: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC?
Date: Feb 21, 2004
The Bing 64 sort of compensate for pressure changes by default because it is pressure, and not a cable, that actually raises the carb slide in them. So they do have a modest amount of compensation by default. Tom Olenik Olenik Aviation - Supplying the lighter side of sport aviation. Level III Repair Station for Rotax Aircraft Engines Dealer for Summit Powered Parachutes http://www.buyitsellitfixit.com Toll Free: 877-AIR-MOTORS Buy from a dealer who can support what they sell...... (DO NOT USE THIS E-MAIL ADDRESS FOR DIRECT E-MAIL. WE WILL NEVER SEE IT. USE THE ABOVE CONTACT INFORMATION TO CONTACT US DIRECTLY) -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Thom Riddle Subject: Kolb-List: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC? Does anyone having experience with the Bing 64 carbs, as on the Rotax 912 engines, know how and how well these carbs compensate for changes in density altitude? Do they work like the HAC kits on the Bing 54s on the 2 strokes? How high of a density altitude will they automatically compensate for? Any information regarding their experiences with these carbs, especially at high density altitudes, will be appreciated. Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC?
Date: Feb 21, 2004
| Does anyone having experience with the Bing 64 carbs, as on the Rotax 912 engines, know how and how well these carbs compensate for changes in density altitude? | Thom in Buffalo Thom/All: Aug 1994, 13,500 feet, Rotax 912, MK III, still climbing and putting out power. May 2003, 14,500 feet, Rotax 912ULS, same MK III, still climbing and putting out power. Do not know if 912 carb operates like a HAC carb. Eric Tucker referred to the carbs as Constant Depression Carbs (CD). I have always, right or wrong, called them Constant Velocity Carbs (CV). The 912 carb is very similar in operation to the SU carbs used on Brit vehicles for many years. Also on my 1960 and 61 Volvo PV544's. Had to put light machine oil in the reservoirs for dampening the pistons. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC?
Date: Feb 21, 2004
| The Bing 64 sort of compensate for pressure changes by default because it is | pressure, and not a cable, that actually raises the carb slide in them. So | they do have a modest amount of compensation by default. | | Tom Olenik Tom/All: Your post makes the 912 carb sound like it doesn't work well, "they do have a modest amount of compensation by default." I realize your Pappy has been talking about "his" HAC system for two stroke carbs, but................. I just hit the send button on a post based on "actual" flight experience with the Bing CD carb to 14,500 feet. Many other flights above 10,000. Not bragging on the Bing Carb, would much rather have a good electronic fuel injection system. I am not a mechanic/engineer/dealer. But I have seen them work and work well without user input to change jetting or set up. 1994 was a different story for the carbs on the 912 that were not the least bit happy at anything below cruise power, which is 5,000 rpm for me. As soon as I would back off cruise, at temps in the 30s and 40s, the engine felt it was coming out of the mounts. Shuddered and shook something frightening. The following winter, after some user experimentation and a lot more flight time, I discovered the 912S manufactured in late 1992 was tuned very lean in midrange. Any further leaning would invoke complaints from the engine. On the other hand, the 912S, manufactured late 1999, had since had the carb tuning changed. Never had any problems, right out of the box, with the 912S flying in the same geographical and meteorogical conditions. NOTE: My post is not to cause controversy. Simply expressing my point of view, for those that would think otherwise. :-) john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Olenik Aviation" <olenik-aviation(at)buyitsellitfixit.com>
Subject: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC?
Date: Feb 21, 2004
Exactly right. I just don't want to say that they compensate 100% for density altitude, because they don't. Just fot pressure, which is only one componenst of density altitude. Still, that will be enough for most common flying. Tom Olenik Olenik Aviation - Supplying the lighter side of sport aviation. Level III Repair Station for Rotax Aircraft Engines Dealer for Summit Powered Parachutes http://www.buyitsellitfixit.com Toll Free: 877-AIR-MOTORS Buy from a dealer who can support what they sell...... (DO NOT USE THIS E-MAIL ADDRESS FOR DIRECT E-MAIL. WE WILL NEVER SEE IT. USE THE ABOVE CONTACT INFORMATION TO CONTACT US DIRECTLY) -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of John Hauck Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC? | The Bing 64 sort of compensate for pressure changes by default because it is | pressure, and not a cable, that actually raises the carb slide in them. So | they do have a modest amount of compensation by default. | | Tom Olenik Tom/All: Your post makes the 912 carb sound like it doesn't work well, "they do have a modest amount of compensation by default." I realize your Pappy has been talking about "his" HAC system for two stroke carbs, but................. I just hit the send button on a post based on "actual" flight experience with the Bing CD carb to 14,500 feet. Many other flights above 10,000. Not bragging on the Bing Carb, would much rather have a good electronic fuel injection system. I am not a mechanic/engineer/dealer. But I have seen them work and work well without user input to change jetting or set up. 1994 was a different story for the carbs on the 912 that were not the least bit happy at anything below cruise power, which is 5,000 rpm for me. As soon as I would back off cruise, at temps in the 30s and 40s, the engine felt it was coming out of the mounts. Shuddered and shook something frightening. The following winter, after some user experimentation and a lot more flight time, I discovered the 912S manufactured in late 1992 was tuned very lean in midrange. Any further leaning would invoke complaints from the engine. On the other hand, the 912S, manufactured late 1999, had since had the carb tuning changed. Never had any problems, right out of the box, with the 912S flying in the same geographical and meteorogical conditions. NOTE: My post is not to cause controversy. Simply expressing my point of view, for those that would think otherwise. :-) john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Christopher Armstrong" <tophera(at)centurytel.net>
Subject: Facet Fuel Pump
Date: Feb 21, 2004
If this inertial switch turns off for any reason other then a crash then you are adding a very negative piece of gear that you really don't need. KISS (keep it simple stupid) is usually the best guideline for systems design in aircraft. You already have a master switch. It takes only the flick of a finger to kill all power in the system. Do you really need a device that turns all power off for you based on some inertial spike? What are the specs. for this device? How is it calibrated. Does it matter how it is mounted to determine what g level sets it off? What is the failure rate and mode. Do they fail on or off? Is it resetable? If you land out in a field hard (or hit some wicked turbulence) and set this thing off can you reset it and start up again and keep flying or takeoff again if there is minimal damage? All I can say is leave it on your bench and you're sure it won't cause you problems. Put it on the plane and now you have to know the answers to all these questions, and a bunch more I haven't thought of. Topher -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kirk Smith Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Facet Fuel Pump that. Your comments have changed my thoughts on where I will > install the inertia switch. I will now install it in the circuit for the > master power solenoid. There it will kill all power in the event of an > undesireable event. Steve/all Just curious about where this enertia switch goes in the circuit. If it only is in the coil circuit for the master solenoid you will still have one side of the contacts on the solenoid hot and the lead from there to the battery hot . Keeping that lead as short as possible decreases the chances of it being shorted to ground or arcing in a crash. Adding extra covering over that will help even more. You probably are already aware of this but just wanted to mention it in case. Kirk ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Thom Riddle" <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: re: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC?
Date: Feb 21, 2004
Thanks for the information on your experiences....I'm a believer now. In fact the words "...moderate compensation..." triggered my original question. But....can anyone tell me how they work? I had the HAC kit on my old 582 and clearly understood how it worked. The engineer in me is just wanting to know if the Bing 64 uses the same sort of set-up but internal to or at least standard equipment with this carb. I know the HAC kit uses a single atmospheric pressure compensating bellows that connects to both carbs for equalized automatic adjustment. Since the two carbs on the 912 and the HKS 700 are not very close together and do not utilize a common air filter, I was wondering how they worked. I could not find a detailed and/or illustrated picture on the Bing website is why I asked this group. Any more details of its function? I know curiosity killed the cat but I can't help it. Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Inertia switch/ELT's
Date: Feb 21, 2004
| Maybe I should have said "most," as I've never seen all ELTs. | | Bob N. Bob N/All: Amen, Brother! Gots to be careful about what you say and how you say it. hehehe I have never fired off the old Pointer I bought in 1991, in the air, but have on the ground. Either weak enertia switch or very hard landings or both. The old Point ELT was cheap back then, but the batteries are very expensive. Hope to update to one of the ELT's that uses D Cell batteries and save some money on annuals. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC?
Date: Feb 21, 2004
| Exactly right. I just don't want to say that they compensate 100% for | density altitude, because they don't. Just fot pressure, which is only one | componenst of density altitude. Still, that will be enough for most common | flying. | | Tom Olenik Tom/All: How well does Gerry's HAC system do for compensation? I never had a chance to use the system Rotax was selling back in the 80's. Really did not need it as most of my flying was rather low. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: re: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC?
Date: Feb 21, 2004
The engineer in me is just wanting to know if the Bing 64 uses the same sort of set-up but internal to or at least standard equipment with this carb. | Thom in Buffalo Thom/All: Get that engineer out of ya and you will feel a lot better. Eric Tucker explained the full function of the Bing 64 during the 912 School. Since Paul Petty was also there, and he is my junior (in age), I will let him explain the operation of the Bing 64 Constant Depression Carburator. Or, ............ you can go to the Kodiak web site and download a 912 shop manual. There is an explanation in there. Or, if you can not find it on the Kodiak Research web site, let me know and I will scan that portion of the maintenance manual for you. In layman's terms: The carb measures static pressure at the end of the float bowl chamber static port tube. Another pressure port on the lip of the carb throat measures static pressure there. Another system measures the amount of airflow through the throat of the carb. The piston with fuel needle attached is raised and lowered by the differences in pressure to meter the correct amount of fuel through the main jet and needle jet. The Bing CD carb uses a butterfly throttle valve behind the piston (similar to the 2 stroke carb). Not too technical, but maybe you can get on my level and understand. :-) Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Olenik Aviation" <olenik-aviation(at)buyitsellitfixit.com>
Subject: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC?
Date: Feb 21, 2004
John, Actually, I was the first to have a conversion kit and dad copied me after seeing how many I was selling. :-) However, the kit works the same and uses pretty much the same compensator as the one Rotax sold except we covert your old carburetors instead of buying new ones. We just give you want you need. Rotax wanted to sell it as a complete package with the carbs.... poor marketing if you ask me. I've sold more of them in the last year than Rotax probably sold in 10 years. The kit compensates for both pressure and temperature. We normally use it for protecting against atmospheric changes from day to do or season to season. You know, my dad did have a piston seizure on an engine just from a day to day density altitude change of several thousand feet. It was an cool (rare) August morning and he had jetting for hot summer days in the 503. Totaled the blue Micro Mong on that one. Was lucky to stumble away with just a few stiches and a sprained ankle. Now, there is some limit to the compensation. Since the adjustment is done by a diaphragm expanding and contracting connected to a needle, there is only so far the diaphragm can expand and contract and as it reaches close to that limit, it will loose it's adjustment effectiveness. This range depends on who's kit you buy. I should say that the compensator as it comes from Bing is not EXACTLY the same as it was when Rotax made thier kits. We have to change some things which, exactly what is proprietary information. Basically, the compensator will not work right without these changes. My dad and I do it a little differently, but with my kit the lower edge of the adjustment range is a little below sea level and the upper part of the range is somewhere between 18,000 - 20,000 feet. I've never flown that high, so it's theoretical. That is also density altitude. Keep in mind that your density altitude can be extremely different from your physical altitude by several thousand feet. It's mostly handy for the seasonal changes, like I said. While I am perfrectly capable of changing needle clip positions or main jets, I don't want to be out there with a screwdriver, 10mm wrench and 8mm wrench in 20F weather fumbling around with jets with 20F gasoline on my unprotected fingers. I want to just get in and go. So the HAC works nicely for that. Tom Olenik Olenik Aviation - Supplying the lighter side of sport aviation. Level III Repair Station for Rotax Aircraft Engines Dealer for Summit Powered Parachutes http://www.buyitsellitfixit.com Toll Free: 877-AIR-MOTORS Buy from a dealer who can support what they sell...... (DO NOT USE THIS E-MAIL ADDRESS FOR DIRECT E-MAIL. WE WILL NEVER SEE IT. USE THE ABOVE CONTACT INFORMATION TO CONTACT US DIRECTLY) -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of John Hauck Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC? | Exactly right. I just don't want to say that they compensate 100% for | density altitude, because they don't. Just fot pressure, which is only one | componenst of density altitude. Still, that will be enough for most common | flying. | | Tom Olenik Tom/All: How well does Gerry's HAC system do for compensation? I never had a chance to use the system Rotax was selling back in the 80's. Really did not need it as most of my flying was rather low. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steven Green" <kolbdriver(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Facet Fuel Pump
Date: Feb 21, 2004
If this inertial switch turns off for any reason other then a crash then you are adding a very negative piece of gear that you really don't need. Reply: All automobiles with fuel injection (that know of) have inertia switches for the purpose I intend to use it. KISS (keep it simple stupid) is usually the best guideline for systems design in aircraft. You already have a master switch. It takes only the flick of a finger to kill all power in the system. Reply: I am probably not as quick to think and react as most others I am just afraid that if I were to stall at 30 - 40 feet AGL during a bad landing approach I would not think quickly enough to turn off the master. this is only one possibility of a quick accident. Do you really need a device that turns all power off for you based on some inertial spike? Reply: No. I just want it. What are the specs. for this device? How is it calibrated. Does it matter how it is mounted to determine what g level sets it off? Reply: My plane is an experimental. What is the failure rate and mode. Do they fail on or off? Is it resetable? Reply: Don't know. Don't know. And yes they reset with the push of a button. I plan to mount the switch within reach while seated and strapped in. If you land out in a field hard (or hit some wicked turbulence) and set this thing off can you reset it and start up again and keep flying or takeoff again if there is minimal damage? Reply: My engine will not quit running if the main power is off. All I can say is leave it on your bench and you're sure it won't cause you problems. Reply: And it won't give me any protection either. Put it on the plane and now you have to know the answers to all these questions, and a bunch more I haven't thought of. Again. My plane is an experimental. I am the manufacturer and tester of parts that go on it. I am also the test pilot. These are only my thoughts, I do not recommend this to any one. I am enjoying the thoughts and comments about it. One comment has caused me to change how I will put it in the system. Steven G. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Facet Fuel Pump
Date: Feb 21, 2004
| These are only my thoughts, I do not recommend this to any one. I am | enjoying the thoughts and comments about it. One comment has caused me to | change how I will put it in the system. | | Steven G. Steven G/All: Great response! I love it! That's why I like Steven Green. He is honest. I remember when we went round and round about post crash fires. Some wanted to build balistic resistant fuel systems. Some were going to build fuel tanks within fuel tanks. And on and on. I only know of one post crash fire in an ultralight, a RANS S-something, out in Texax many years ago that killed a husband and wife. Someone else knew of an UL accident that killed somebody else. Post crash fires are about as prevalent as fires in automobiles. They do happen, but not often. If you happen to be the one trapped in a burning aircraft, you will probably wish you had taken more precautions to survive. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ActionCrane(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 21, 2004
Subject: Re: Starter trouble
John, I was able to get it locally at Kaman Bearing. Steve H ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "garvelink" <link(at)cdc.net>
Subject: Re: Outboard Rib Reinforcement
Date: Feb 21, 2004
John, Thanks for the info either the link is down or incorrect because I can not get it to come up. I will try again in the morn. Srglink ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Subject: Kolb-List: Outboard Rib Reinforcement > > Good Morning Kolbers: > > Was trying to find some other info for Paul Petty, rivet sequence for > attaching ribs to spar. While looking through my old MKIII > supplemental drawings, came across this page: > > http://home.elmore.rr.com/jhauck/MK%20III%20Construction/Rib%20Reinforcement .jpg > > If it is not large enough, I will rescan and upload another to my > index page. > > Please note the date Dennis Souder drew the plans and the wrote the > instructions, 1990. I built my first MKIII wings in 1991 and the > second set in 1992. I noticed one thing I did not do on my rib > reinforments, the two extra rivets in the front and rear gussets. So > far, this has not presented any problem. When I rebuilt the left wing > in 2001, the front and rear gussets were just fine. > > Also note that: "These are not necessary for NORMAL flight loads with > a properly handled and maintained wing." I emphsize "normal flight > loads." My wings have experienced much more than normal flight loads > during their travels. Especially the one in the back of the trailer > from Muncho Lake, BC, to OSH, and finally hauck's holler, Alabama. > > Also note, where the holes are drilled and riveted. Maybe List Member > Jim Gerken will rethink what he wrote about "my" useless modifications > "filling the ribs with unnecessary holes, weakening them, adding > weight for nothing." > > Please take into consideration, my airplane has not led a NORMAL life, > and will not lead a normal life in the future. In these conditions, I > want Miss P'fer to keep on doing the excellent job she has been doing > all these years. She has proven to me, whether any one else agrees or > not, that the rib mods are, indeed, doing what I wanted them to do. > > If you all need a larger picture to see the plan sheet more clearly, > let me know. > > I also added another 10 mb to the 5 free ones Road Runner gave me for > my personal web site. $10.00 a month is a small fee to try and help > folks with their Kolbs. > > Take care, > > john h > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 21, 2004
From: "Bob N." <ronoy(at)shentel.net>
Subject: Re: Flap and Aileron hinge devations
Somewhere, maybe on Kolblist archives, are a whole bunch of msgs abt aileron hinges. Some on X-type hinges. Dig into that. Couple of years ago... Bob N. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "G. T. Alexander, Jr." <gtalexander(at)att.net>
Subject: Outboard Rib Reinforcement
Date: Feb 21, 2004
Try this one: http://home.elmore.rr.com/jhauck/Aircraft%20Construction/Rib%20Reinforcement .jpg -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of garvelink Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Outboard Rib Reinforcement John, Thanks for the info either the link is down or incorrect because I can not get it to come up. I will try again in the morn. Srglink ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 21, 2004
Hi All: Anyone have or had experience with the Micro Air 760 VHF transceiver? I am interested. The radio of small, about 2.5" square and 5.5" deep. Can mount in 2.25" instrument hole or come up with your own. Has intercom built in for two with side tone. Thanks, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Loose Rivets
Date: Feb 21, 2004
Hi All: I have some tail boom H brace rivets loosening up. Not many, but enough to feel it is time to correct. My H brace is alumnum. Nope, I did not design and fabricate it. I was stock on the first run of MK III's. Same for the wing H braces. Anyone have this problem and if so, how did you correct. Thanks, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 21, 2004
From: "Bob N." <ronoy(at)shentel.net>
Subject: Re: MicroAir 760
John, I've seen on FLY-UL some guys have used MicroAir. Bob N. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Bass" <gtb(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 21, 2004
John; No real experience with the radio you asked about, but, from comments of a friend with one, he stated that it worked well, but was sometimes very hard to change frequencies, or adjust, while in the air, due to the small size of the controls. Apparently, he attempted to change in a little less than perfect air and had some difficulty doing so. George --- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Bass" <gtb(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 21, 2004
John H; In my previous note regarding the MicroAir 760 I failed to mention that those comments from a friend where regarding his experience from the cockpit of his Dragonfly. He's now building a GlasAir, but, will NOT be using that radio in it. George --- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
Subject: Re: Prop Pitch
Date: Feb 21, 2004
Ed.. When I measure mine..for my own reference...I measure it 1 inch from the tip...at 11.5 deg the Cuyuna UL-II-02 will turn my 60' IVO 5900 static or so with a 2.58 gearbox...Runs out at 6300 IN FLight WOT..75 to 79 mph Don Gherardini FireFly 098 http://www.geocities.com/dagger369th/my_firefly.htm ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2004
From: Ted Cowan <tcowan1917(at)direcway.com>
Subject: crash fires
Was just wondering, how many fires after hard landings or crashes as it were, have been reported or are known to the members. I cannot remember one fire. I have seen some pretty nasty crashes and I guess if you gotta crash that bad, everyone is going to be dead anyway. ted cowan, alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Doug Lawton" <skyrider2(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 22, 2004
John, Several of the sailplanes at our field use the 760 with satisfactory results. I believe one fellow last year mentioned that he was having intermittent cutout with it but he finally traced it down to a wiring short outside of the radio. I plan to put one in the Europa motorglider that I'm building right now. I like the fact that it's small and has the builtin intercom. Perfect for a two-seater. Fly Safely, Doug Lawton NE Georgia & Whitwell TN PS Anyone heard anything from Beauford lately? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba(at)wtxs.net>
Subject: Re: Flap and Aileron hinge devations
Date: Feb 22, 2004
anybody have any pics of aileron counterbalaces on a ultrastar? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob N." <ronoy(at)shentel.net> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Flap and Aileron hinge devations > > Somewhere, maybe on Kolblist archives, are a whole bunch of msgs abt > aileron hinges. Some on X-type hinges. Dig into that. Couple of years ago... > > Bob N. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "garvelink" <link(at)cdc.net>
Subject: Re: MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 22, 2004
any of you guys ham operators? ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Subject: Kolb-List: MicroAir 760 > > Hi All: > > Anyone have or had experience with the Micro Air 760 VHF transceiver? > > I am interested. > > The radio of small, about 2.5" square and 5.5" deep. Can mount in > 2.25" instrument hole or come up with your own. > > Has intercom built in for two with side tone. > > Thanks, > > john h > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Denny Rowe" <rowedl(at)highstream.net>
Subject: Re: Loose Rivets
Date: Feb 22, 2004
> > Hi All: > > I have some tail boom H brace rivets loosening up. Not many, but > enough to feel it is time to correct. My H brace is alumnum. Nope, I > did not design and fabricate it. I was stock on the first run of MK > III's. Same for the wing H braces. > > Anyone have this problem and if so, how did you correct. > > Thanks, > > john h > > John, I would move my landing gear back to the stock position as to releive some of the stress on the tailboom. :-) Just kidding. I wonder how far into Mk-3 production the aluminum H braces went? My Mk-3 was #90 and as all the H braces were installed by the original owner before I bought the project, I do not know what mine are. I kind of hope they are aluminum after seeing how well Miss Pfer has held up, and it also lowers any rust conserns. Take Care, Denny Rowe, Mk-3, PA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Denny Rowe" <rowedl(at)highstream.net>
Subject: Re: crash fires
Date: Feb 22, 2004
AM Subject: Kolb-List: crash fires > > Was just wondering, how many fires after hard landings or crashes as it > were, have been reported or are known to the members. I cannot remember one > fire. I have seen some pretty nasty crashes and I guess if you gotta crash > that bad, everyone is going to be dead anyway. ted cowan, alabama > > Ted, > I recall Randy Schliter, the owner of Rans, was hurt in a post crash fire in his "lifting body" prototype a while back. Also Ernie Carlson "Carlson Aircraft Company" was taken from us in a fire following a test flight accident. It's a terrible thing, and somthing to be taken seriously. Has been a subject of nightmares for me on occasion. Sorry for peeing in everyones cereal this morning. :-( Be careful out there. Denny Rowe ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 22, 2004
I like the fact that it's small and has the builtin intercom. Perfect for a | two-seater. | Doug Lawton Doug/All: Mine too, Doug. How well does the intercom work? Was not clear whether it had a PTT capability for intercom or "turn on, leave on" as I understood from all the searches I did for info last night. Sky Sports sells a wiring harness for $190.00, which is way too much for that. Are you familiar with the requirements for wiring the radio? I wonder if the plug on the wiring harness comes with the radio? If so, it probably will not be that difficult to do my own wiring. Most of my intercom/VHF comm problems have been traced to wiring damage caused by the infamous rats a couple years ago. Every once in a while more damage in the form of chewed wires and cut wire insulation appears. They can do a lot of damage and in places one can not see. Thanks for the info, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "dama" <dama(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Loose Rivets
Date: Feb 22, 2004
I have some tail boom H brace rivets loosening up. Not many, but > > enough to feel it is time to correct. My H brace is alumnum. Nope, I > > did not design and fabricate it. I was stock on the first run of MK > > III's. Same for the wing H braces. > > Any idea how many landings are on the boom, John? Well, some people keep track, like me...(518 to date). Kip Atlanta FS II http://www.springeraviation.net/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Loose Rivets/Tail Boom
Date: Feb 22, 2004
| Any idea how many landings are on the boom, John? Well, some people keep | track, like me...(518 to date). | Kip Morning Kip/Gang: There's 5,372 landings in my log book since I got my PVT ticket. That figure includes about 30 hours 152, factory MKIII and Sling Shot time. I would guess, without going through the log books, near 5,000 on Miss P'fer. That averages out to about 2.5 per hour. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Loose Rivets
Date: Feb 22, 2004
Morning Denny/Gang: | I would move my landing gear back to the stock position as to releive some | of the stress on the tailboom. :-) Yea! And put one of those funky looking training hoops or training wheels under the nose? No thanks. | Just kidding. I wonder how far into Mk-3 production the aluminum H braces | went? I don't know. Mine is SN: M3-011, Feb 1991. I am sure Dennis Souder has a good idea when. You can look in the tail boom and see. The aluminum H brace uses very heavy wall tubing and is easy to identify with flash light and eyeball. Primary rivet loosening is near the center of the H brace. Nothing bad, at this time, but definitely getting loser. I was thinking about blocking the fuselage to neutralize the weight on the tail boom, drill the old rivets out and replace. First tell/tale sign of rivet working was the aerothane paint popped off the rivet heads. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 22, 2004
| I've asked repeatedly about Beauford, and nobody says a word. Lar. Larry/All: That's because we do not know. Maybe we need to contact Beauford. :-) I bet he is involved with his job again, or he got tired of the BS that seems to get slung around here about every two months now. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: snuffy(at)usol.com
Subject: Re: crash fires
Date: Feb 22, 2004
Was just wondering, how many fires after hard landings or crashes as it > were, have been reported or are known to the members. I cannot remember Ted, I think we are all concerned about the potential for fires with our planes whether we're aware of it or not. From simple refueling safety to minor leaks or major ruptures such as in a crash. Dallas Shephard recently crashed his Mark 3 and there were no real bad injuries but fuel was running on him and his grandson. He couldn't reach the master switch as I recall. Probably a good thing too as an arc created by opening the circuit under load could have ignited the fumes. Kirk ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: crash fires
Date: Feb 22, 2004
|He couldn't reach the master switch | as I recall. Probably a good thing too as an arc created by opening the | circuit under load could have ignited the fumes. | Kirk Snuffy/All: Not trying to create an argument, but aren't most continuous duty solenoids used as master switches sealed? I agree that switches that are not easy to reach are pretty much useless in emergency situation. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
Subject: Re: Prop Pitch
Date: Feb 22, 2004
ED...made a mistake in that post...I have a 2.65 :1 Gearbox...(2SI) Also.of note....at 5300 cruise...The FireFly is at 60mph...(2000 rpms prop) Don Gherardini FireFly 098 http://www.geocities.com/dagger369th/my_firefly.htm ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM(at)comcast.net>
Subject: John Williamson has his Kolbra for Sale
Date: Feb 22, 2004
I was surfing this morning and noticed on John Williamson's web site that he has his newly rebuilt Kolbra for sale. John please say it ain't so! Are you just switching to a differen't model Kolb? Rick Neilsen Redrive VW Powered MKIIIc ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HShack(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 22, 2004
Subject: Re: crash fires
In a message dated 2/22/2004 10:19:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, snuffy(at)usol.com writes: Was just wondering, how many fires after hard landings or crashes as it > were, have been reported or are known to the members. I cannot remember Recently, at a local airstrip, a wooden experimental [not an ultralight] apparently stalled & pancaked in. Pilot may have survived the impact, but the landing gear sheared the fuel lines & the pilot was engulfed in flames within seconds. The sliding canopy was jammed & he could not open it. The flames were so intense that rescuers could not get to him. The pilot, while screaming in pain, was able to climb over the back of his seat & kick out the side of his burning fuselage & crawl out far enough for rescuers to drag his burning body away from the inferno. Except for metal parts, the plane was consumed in under 2 minutes. Mostly third degree burns over 92% of his body. The pilot lived for a week until they removed life support. We are now planning on maintaining a"'crash-cart" at our field with several fire extinguishers, lots of sterile water, crowbar, axe, firemans coat & helmet,& what-ever else we can think of , all on a fast golf cart. Probably wouldn't have saved this pilot's life, but we feel the need to do something............ Howard Shackleford FS II SC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "boyd young" <by0ung(at)brigham.net>
<lynnp@c-gate.net>
Subject: inertia switch
Date: Feb 22, 2004
This was my worry. So if I were to make a hard, bouncy landing and the engine were suddenly "off" because of this switch, I wouldn't have the option to use power to get things under control or to go around. I could even lose power by hitting a bad bump on summer day? ------------------------------ No it would kill the radio, fuel pump, gps, intercom, lights, etc. the engine does not require outside power to run... cdi will work without 12v input. boyd ---------------------- All ELTs have inertial switches, that can be "unarmed' or switched off. I've never seen /heard of an ELT sw arming without plane hitting hard--turbs don't seem to do it. Maybe I should have said "most," as I've never seen all ELTs. Bob N. ---------------------- Elt inertia switches require aprox 1 g of forward deacceleration... a hard landing would not set it off only a sudden stop. boyd ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2004
Subject: Re: Loose Rivets/Tail Boom
From: ul15rhb(at)juno.com
writes: > > | Any idea how many landings are on the boom, John? Well, some > people keep > | track, like me...(518 to date). > | Kip > > Morning Kip/Gang: > > There's 5,372 landings in my log book since I got my PVT ticket. > That > figure includes about 30 hours 152, factory MKIII and Sling Shot > time. > > I would guess, without going through the log books, near 5,000 on > Miss > P'fer. > > That averages out to about 2.5 per hour. > > Take care, > > john h John, I was surprised to hear the H-section is made of aluminum on your Mark III. Intuition tells me that thin aluminum legs on the H-section would add little strength to the inside of the fuse tube. The Original Firestar has chromoly steel in both the wings and fuse tube. Old Kolb did it right the first time. I wonder if the new Kolbs are aluminum too. Somehow, I missed this bit of information over the years or the senior moments are becoming more frequent. I have 2500+ landings on mine and don't see any signs of loose rivets on the fuse tube, but then my Kolb is 540lbs gross. I've noticed, John, that you stand on your fuse tube to look at the top of the engine. I have never stood on mine. Even with the chomoly H-section, I would think my weight would stress it quite a bit. I have noticed the main 3/8" bolt has loosened up a turn or two after 15 years. Those bolts in the wings have locktite on them and this one didn't. I made my last winter flight of the season up here in the great northland. I landed on skis out on the lake about 12 times. It's getting too warm, too fast. Yesterday was blue skies and light winds with a high of 34F. The lakes are melting and there goes my winter flying activities. Ralph Original Firestar 17 years flying it ________________________________________________________________________________
From: snuffy(at)usol.com
Subject: Re: crash fires
Date: Feb 22, 2004
>aren't most continuous duty > solenoids used as master switches sealed? Probably are in most certificated aircraft. The toggle that is mounted on the panel probably isn't. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Duncan McBride" <duncanmcbride(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC?
Date: Feb 22, 2004
What I'm reading from these posts is that while it may be a modest amount of altitude compensation, it is more than sufficient for the altitudes we fly. Sometimes discussions get into finer points of engineering and physics and stuff, which is always interesting, but sometimes the practical matter is that some of the distinctions aren't terribly significant when it comes to actual performance. For someone considering the purchase of a 912 or 912S, I can offer a similar experience to John's. At a flying weight of around 920 lbs, my 912 powered Mark III was still climbing around 450fpm at 10,500 ft, the outside air temperature was around 36F. Maybe with computer controlled fuel injection it would be doing better, but I was cold and ready to stop climbing and come down. Actually, I like to fly along at about 10-15 feet, it makes it seem like you're going faster. ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC? > > | The Bing 64 sort of compensate for pressure changes by default > because it is > | pressure, and not a cable, that actually raises the carb slide in > them. So > | they do have a modest amount of compensation by default. > | > | Tom Olenik > > Tom/All: > > Your post makes the 912 carb sound like it doesn't work well, "they do > have a modest amount of compensation by default." > > I realize your Pappy has been talking about "his" HAC system for two > stroke carbs, but................. > > I just hit the send button on a post based on "actual" flight > experience with the Bing CD carb to 14,500 feet. Many other flights > above 10,000. Not bragging on the Bing Carb, would much rather have a > good electronic fuel injection system. > > I am not a mechanic/engineer/dealer. But I have seen them work and > work well without user input to change jetting or set up. > > 1994 was a different story for the carbs on the 912 that were not the > least bit happy at anything below cruise power, which is 5,000 rpm for > me. As soon as I would back off cruise, at temps in the 30s and 40s, > the engine felt it was coming out of the mounts. Shuddered and shook > something frightening. The following winter, after some user > experimentation and a lot more flight time, I discovered the 912S > manufactured in late 1992 was tuned very lean in midrange. Any > further leaning would invoke complaints from the engine. > > On the other hand, the 912S, manufactured late 1999, had since had the > carb tuning changed. Never had any problems, right out of the box, > with the 912S flying in the same geographical and meteorogical > conditions. > > NOTE: My post is not to cause controversy. Simply expressing my > point of view, for those that would think otherwise. :-) > > john h > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2004
Subject: q
From: Russ Kinne <kinnepix(at)earthlink.net>
They always used to teach pilots to OPEN THE DOORS!!! if a crash is imminent; I sure hope they still do. Maybe even more important than killing the switches. REuss Kinne ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2004
From: "Bob N." <ronoy(at)shentel.net>
Subject: Re: inertia switch
Boyd is correct in saying that ELTs are supposed to arm/go off at a forward G spike. This means attention to the physical placement of the ELT--making certain that the G sw is located/aligned where a forward spike will trip it. I sold several dozen EBC ELTs in early 70s, and installed a lot of them...and cked installations done by others. The worst...and many...were the installations on the leftside cabin interior, right below the windshield on 172s and 150s. This is a piece of .032 or thinner without any stiffening. In some crashes the ELT would not get the full spike of G, but would have the spike softened by being attached to the flexible side panel. It's one pc of equip. you don't want SHOCK mounted! Bob N. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Fw: Fabric Piper Restoration Seminar
Date: Feb 22, 2004
I thought this might be of interest to some. Lar. Do not Archive. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Fabric Piper Restoration Seminar Hello Everyone, Our EAA Chapter is hosting one of the best build/restore seminars in the country this coming May (See below or attached). This is the third time we've had the opportunity to present Clyde Smith, aka "The Cub Doctor" whose years of experience has helped so many builders/restorers get the job done the right way. Please pass this information along to your fellow EAAer's and post this at your chapter and in your newsletters. Thank you so much. Tim LoDolce President EAA 1073 ATTENTION: PIPER OWNERS / MECHANICS / ENTHUSIASTS RAG WINGERS FABRIC PIPER RESTORATION SEMINAR Intro: May 21, 22, 23 -- 2004 Presented By: Clyde Smith, Jr., =E2=80=9CThe Cub Doctor=E2=80=9D, A&P, IA Hosted by: EAA Chapter 1073, Inc., Truckee Tahoe A 3 day Introductory Seminar/Workshop relating to topics about rebuilding and maintaining your fabric covered Piper models J-3 through PA-22 and PA-25. Fee: $300 Seating Limited, Reserve Early For More Information Contact: Lou Reinkens, EAA 1073, Seminar Coordinator 530.525.5273 FAX: 530.525,5949 Email: rockwood(at)inreach.com Held at EAA 1073, INC. Chapter house/workshop located at Truckee Tahoe Airport 10356 TRUCKEE AIRPORT ROAD TRUCKEE, CA 96161 Hotels/Motels: Best Western Truckee Tahoe ( Closest to Seminar ) 11331 Highway 267 (Request =E2=80=9CFabric Piper Seminar=E2=80=9D group rate: $79) Truckee, CA 96161 ( INCLUDES BREAKFAST, 530.587.4525 800.824.6385 MUST HAVE RESERVATIONS IN by MAY 2 Note the airport has a courtesy van for transportation call 530.587.4119 Inn at Truckee 11506 Deerfield Drive Truckee, CA 96161 530.587.8888 Holiday Inn Express 10527 Cold Stream Road Truckee, CA 96161 530.582.9999 Lake Tahoe Central Reservations: 1-800 AT TAHOE (Truckee, North Lake Tahoe ) Camping/Rvs: Soar Truckee (Located at airport and have some bunk rooms and RV Spots. Open 1 May) 13184 Sailplane Way Truckee, CA 96161 530.587.6702 866.762.7875 Other full service RV parks and camp grounds are nearby. TRUCKEE TAHOE AIRPORT CONTACT =E2=80=94Mike Scott, Asst. GM, 530.587.4119 Dear Fabric Piper Owner / Enthusiast, Thank you for your interest in the upcoming restoration seminar. As the fabric Piper fleet ages and newer, younger owners and restorers take over, I find an ever increasing need to educate the current and future generation of owners and rebuilders on what the standards were when these aircraft were built, the oldest of which are now over 60 years in age. I can sense this lack of knowledge by the questions that are asked and all the phone calls and letters that I receive. The "Type Clubs" 'are doing a great job passing on information and experiences among the membership, but there is still a missing link, especially for those who don't belong to an owners club. It is for this reason that I have decided to put my restoration work to the side and conduct a field training program where I can go to the people, alone with various training aids, and work with them in small groups instead of one on one by mail or over the phone as I have been doing for nearly 20 years now. By using slides, video tapes, diagrams, and actual "hands on" methods of instruc=C2=ADtion and demonstration, there is not a more effective way to pass this information across. An additional advantage is the camaraderie and friendship among the students and the sharing of information and experiences of other students. That's what it's all about. With nearly nineteen years of my life spent working for Piper in such capacities as drafting, technical writing, technical instruction, product support on all the older models, and when called back to work in Vero Beach, was a man=C2=ADager and creator of the Cub Kit program. With all this experience and exposure, I feel well qualified and capable of con=C2=ADducting this mobile school program. I also own four fabric Piper models myself. A 1946 J-3, a PA-12, a PA-15, and the prototype PA- 16 Clipper. This is my goal, to preserve the past for the future, and pass this information on so that these fine airplanes may be preserved, maintained, and enjoyed well into the future. Now to tell you a little more about the upcoming seminar. By the way, if you don't even own an airplane yet, this is a fantastic way to familiarize yourself with each of the models and find out all there is to know from service problems to performance specs, and what you might expect to pay for a particular model that you are interested in. On. the first day we begin with a presentation of the Genealogy of the early Pipers. We'll discuss all the FAA AD notes that per=C2=ADtain to the airframe, engine and accessories. As the class progresses we'll go over the whole restoration process in great detail from tear down to the final inspection and test flight. We'll discuss cleaning, inspection, fabricating parts, and where to get parts and supplies. We'll also talk about covering, painting upholstering, and final touches. There will be demonstrations and a chance for some "hands on" experience. We'll end up with rigging and annual inspections. If time and space allow, workshop duties will include rib repair methods, wing panel tramming, rigging, Graco/Croix paint sprayer demonstration, and even fabric covering and stitching. Each student will receive an information packet including a notebook, pen, and a generous supply of very informative handouts. Decals and some small parts will be displayed for sale during the seminar. Old photos and factory reference books, along with currently published books on Piper history 'II also be displayed. Video's pertaining to Piper history will be shown during evening hours. If desired. workshop duties may continue after the final day, and I will be available, for a fee, for small duties or consulting. Coffee and doughnuts will be supplied, complimentary, every morning. Lunch and dinner will be up to the par=C2=ADticipants. EAA Chapter 1073 will have their BBQs going for a nominal charge and the classroom and instructor will be available for hangar flying. Group dinners at a local restaurant seem to be a popular idea. Don't delay and miss out. Class size is limited. The seminar tuition will still be $300.00 per person for the 2004 year, with spouses and family members under 21 at half price. Returning students from previous seminars will also be half price if space allows. As a courtesy to the host, and for plan=C2=ADning purposes, please pre-pay at least 6 weeks in advance(April 9, 2004). Checks may be made out to Cub Restoration Services. The instructor reserves the right to cancel a class if attendance is not sufficient. All funds received will be returned. Your host will provide lodging and transportation information as well as directions to the seminar site. Come join in and be a part of this friendly and informative session, and bring some photos of your airplane or project with you. I'm looking forward to meeting you. Sincerely, Original signed by Clyde Smith, Jr. Instructor, A&P, IA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Loose Rivets/Tail Boom
Date: Feb 22, 2004
| I've noticed, John, that you stand on your fuse tube to look at the top | of the engine. I have never stood on mine. Even with the chomoly | H-section, I would think my weight would stress it quite a bit. I have | noticed the main 3/8" bolt has loosened up a turn or two after 15 years.]] | Ralph Ralph/Ya'll: I have always got up on the tail boom to get to the top of the engine, Firestar and MKIII. Compared to the force exerted by that long tail boom and tail wheel strut on the H brace, my 185 lbs is negligible. Never had a rivet loosen up on the Firestar and it had 755 hours. Moving the main gear fwd increased the amount of stress on the H brace on my MK III. I doubt the nut backed off the 3/8" H brace bolt in your boom tube. Most likely paint, dope, fabric, and wear on that point will allow the bolt to get loose. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2004
Subject: Re: Loose Rivets/Tail Boom
From: ul15rhb(at)juno.com
writes: > I doubt the nut backed off the 3/8" H brace bolt in your boom tube. > Most likely paint, dope, fabric, and wear on that point will allow > the > bolt to get loose. > > john h John, Where the 3/8" bolt goes through has no paint, dope, or fabric there. I left my rear cage open with no paint on the fuse tube. Ralph ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Duncan McBride" <duncanmcbride(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 22, 2004
The installation manual is available from the Microair site, http://www.microair.com.au/index.aspx?page=157&mid=2 The intercomm is not voice operated - you turn it on with a switch. You can make it a momentary contact switch like a PTT or a panel switch to leave it on all the time. The Sigtronics intercomm was very easy to hook up just the mic and headphone line to the pilot's side of the Microair. The intercom delivers sound to both. I didn't use the PTT wiring of the intercom, I just wired the switch directly to the Microair. Works like a champ. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Ballenger" <ulpilot(at)cavtel.net> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: MicroAir 760 > > John > I have talked to Jabiru USA several times about the MicroAir 760. The > intercom is not that good they say. It is a PTT type. I am planning to > install the radio in my MK III X and use the intercom you have/recommend. > The Jabiru site has the wiring diagram for the radio. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2004
From: Earl & Mim Zimmerman <emzi(at)supernet.com>
Subject: Radio Interference Fixes?
Fellow Flyers, I am in the process of installing an Icom A-21 radio in my plane with a 582 and need to do something about the radio interference from the engine. I was wondering what kind of wire can or should be used for shielded kill switch wires? I have some 18 gauge shielded "security system" wire. Would that work ok for the kill wires? Is there anything else that I should be doing? Do you just shield the kill wires or must I shield the a/c alternator wires going to the rectifier / regulator? I have installed the resister spark plugs but have not installed the shielded caps or ign. wires. I have not had a chance to recheck it since replacing the plugs. Thanks, Earl Z. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2004
Subject: q
From: Russ Kinne <kinnepix(at)earthlink.net>
Sorry for making a possibly confusing statement. When I said OPEN THE DOORS -- I meant just unlock/unlatch them. You just about can't open doors inflight, with most aircraft. And on fire extinguishers -- I feel it's a good idea always to carry one in cars, boats & aircraft -- but remember you'll be BREATHING whatever you spray around. You can safely breathe HALON at concentrations that will put out fires. Dry-chemical? -- not a good idea. Hard to clean up too. Russ Kinne ________________________________________________________________________________
From: c.f.white(at)att.net
Subject: Microair 760
Date: Feb 22, 2004
Hi All: Anyone have or had experience with the Micro Air 760 VHF transceiver? I am interested. John, I have both the 760 VHF and also their matching transponder. Both work great! Be sure and buy the wiring harness that is available already assembled, it doesn't cost much and includes wiring for intercom. Also be sure to turn the mike gain way down on the intercom - if you don't, the background noise from the engine makes it difficult to hear. Regards... Charles White Rollins, Montana 59931 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2004
From: "Bob N." <ronoy(at)shentel.net>
Subject: Re: crash fires also contactor diode
Just stick a small el cheapo diode across the coil terminals. SWAG1a.@150PIV. Pos to Pos!! Bob N. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Elder" <billelder(at)denver.net>
Subject: Re: MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 22, 2004
John, I have a Microair 760 installed on my MK III Classic with a DRE 244 intercom. Works great! All radio checks have been loud and clear. Antenna mounted on the bottom of the nose cone with a pretty good sized grounding plane (.025 aluminum). Bill in Colorado ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Subject: Kolb-List: MicroAir 760 > > Hi All: > > Anyone have or had experience with the Micro Air 760 VHF transceiver? > > I am interested. > > The radio of small, about 2.5" square and 5.5" deep. Can mount in > 2.25" instrument hole or come up with your own. > > Has intercom built in for two with side tone. > > Thanks, > > john h > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Flap and Aileron hinge devations
Date: Feb 22, 2004
| | anybody have any pics of aileron counterbalaces on a ultrastar? Ronnie/All: Never seen any on an US, but I took some pics of mine a few minutes ago. They would look and attach same on all Kolb wings. Only exception would be wall thickness of leading edge of the aileron, which will determine the size of the tube that slides into the end of the aileron leading edge tube. All the pics are here: http://home.elmore.rr.com/jhauck/Aileron%20Counter%20Balance%20Weights/ Click on each file to see the pic. Now........all the pics are not of counter balance weights. Some are practice shots with the digi cam Clay Stuart sent me. You may also look at them. hehehe If you have any questions, let out a shout. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Microair 760
Date: Feb 22, 2004
| John, I have both the 760 VHF and also their matching transponder. Both work great! Be sure and buy the wiring harness that is available already assembled, it doesn't cost much and includes wiring for intercom. Also be sure to turn the mike gain way down on the intercom - if you don't, the background noise from the engine makes it difficult to hear. | | Regards... | | Charles White | Rollins, Montana 59931 Charles W/Gang: Thanks to everyone who responded to m question about the MicroAir 760. Rather than respond to all of them, this will save me some time. Again, Thanks! I looked at Sky Sports who also sell the MicroAir 760 and the wiring harness. Sky Sports wants $190.00 for the wiring harness. Seems a bit much for my budget, or any one else's, for that matter. Charles, where did you get your radio and wiring harness? Would you mind telling me how much you paid for the harness for the VHF? Aircraft Spruce has the VHF for 743.00, but did not see anything about the wiring harness. Guess could call them in the morning and see if they have it and how much. BTW, that was the best price I could find on the MicroAir 760. How about the intercom? Did you use a seperate intercom or the one in the MicroAir? Duncan McBride uses a Sigtronics intercom. I already have one installed in the aircraft, a Sig 400SN. Anybody got anything else on this radio, or a good alternative, let me know. Thanks to all, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 22, 2004
Antenna | mounted on the bottom of the nose cone with a pretty good sized grounding | plane (.025 aluminum). Bill in Colorado Bill/All: What are the dimensions on your ground plane? Just now reading a post on Bob Nukolls List. He says the ground plane radius should be, as a minimum, the length of the antenna. May airplane is not that wide where I have my antenna mounted under the nose pod. I think my ground plane is about 10 or 12" in diamter. Been working ok on the other two radios. Thanks, Bill. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Duncan McBride" <duncanmcbride(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 22, 2004
I've been using the $5.00 dipole that Boyd Young put on the list a while back. I get great results with it, and I didn't even install it correctly - one end should go up and the other down, and I laid them sideways. Anyway, it worked as well as a 1/4 wave whip and a 20" square ground plane in the rear of the fuselage like Richard Pike's, so I stayed with the dipole. A piece of coax runs from the radio to the nose where the center conductor exits the shielding. Equal lengths of the center conductor and shielding separate 180 degrees from each other and extend in as straight a line as possible, which isn't very far. Mine run from the nose just about back to the instrument panel. But it works ok. I'm hunting for the link. Here http://www.brigham.net/~byoung/antenna.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: MicroAir 760 > > Antenna ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba(at)wtxs.net>
Subject: Re: Flap and Aileron hinge devations
Date: Feb 22, 2004
many thanks john, ron in tx. ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Flap and Aileron hinge devations > > > | > | anybody have any pics of aileron counterbalaces on a ultrastar? > > Ronnie/All: > > Never seen any on an US, but I took some pics of mine a few minutes > ago. > > They would look and attach same on all Kolb wings. Only exception > would be wall thickness of leading edge of the aileron, which will > determine the size of the tube that slides into the end of the aileron > leading edge tube. > > All the pics are here: > > http://home.elmore.rr.com/jhauck/Aileron%20Counter%20Balance%20Weights/ > > Click on each file to see the pic. > > Now........all the pics are not of counter balance weights. Some are > practice shots with the digi cam Clay Stuart sent me. You may also > look at them. hehehe > > If you have any questions, let out a shout. > > john h > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com>
Subject: Checking In
Date: Feb 22, 2004
John, Lar, Kolbers, et.al... Back on line again... not quite dead yet, but working on it... Finally got computer running tonight... The younger hoodlum (computerman) tells me I had a L2 bios "event" of some sort which then promptly corrupted the operating system... happened about Christmas, but things got right interesting at work and I didn't have time to fool with it (him) until this week.... Stuffed a little more loot down the 'ol automation rathole, smiled, and am trying to move on.... So what did I miss...??? More Kolb internecine tribal warfare....? ....technical breakthroughs...? somebody market a 40 horsepower, 40 pound, 4-stroke that bolts right onto a FireFly? See if it will all condense down to a couple of paragraphs.... heh, heh... Went out to the patch, dragged the kleenex airplane out of the trailer and flew 1.1 this afternoon.... first time out in 6 weeks.... beautiful day... shirtsleeves... CAVU.... lots of buzzards out lazing around in the thermals.... Whilst jammed back into the sling seat listening to that stupid little Rotax sing its guts out on takeoff, I caught myself grinning... and was reminded once again why we put ourselves through all this.... lubrication for the soul.... Consider me contacted... thanks for asking...... :-) Beauford, The Aluminum Butcher of Brandon FF- 076 ----- > > | I've asked repeatedly about Beauford, and nobody says a word. > Lar. > >> > Maybe we need to contact Beauford. :-) > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 22, 2004
From: Richard Pike <rwpike(at)charter.net>
Subject: Re: Radio Interference Fixes?
I think any shielded wires ought to work. I used Radio Shack shielded wire from the engine to the panel for the tach and kill switches. Used plain wire from the engine to the reg/rect. No shields on the plug wires or caps, no problems. Using an old Terra 720 handheld hardwired into the panel. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) > > Fellow Flyers, > I am in the process of installing an Icom A-21 radio in my plane with >a 582 and need to do something about the radio interference from the >engine. I was wondering what kind of wire can or should be used for >shielded kill switch wires? I have some 18 gauge shielded "security >system" wire. Would that work ok for the kill wires? Is there anything >else that I should be doing? Do you just shield the kill wires or must I >shield the a/c alternator wires going to the rectifier / regulator? I >have installed the resister spark plugs but have not installed the >shielded caps or ign. wires. I have not had a chance to recheck it since >replacing the plugs. Thanks, Earl Z. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Checking In
Date: Feb 22, 2004
| Went out to the patch, dragged the kleenex airplane out of the trailer and | flew 1.1 this afternoon.... first time out in 6 weeks.... beautiful day... | shirtsleeves... CAVU.... lots of buzzards out lazing around in the | thermals.... Whilst jammed back into the sling seat listening to that | stupid little Rotax sing its guts out on takeoff, I caught myself | grinning... and was reminded once again why we put ourselves through all | this.... lubrication for the soul.... | | Consider me contacted... thanks for asking...... :-) | | Beauford, The Aluminum Butcher of Brandon | FF- 076 Beuford/All: Don't think you missed a thing. Check the Archives and see. hehehe I did the same thing you did today with the exception of pulling Miss P'fer out of the trailer. You got me beat by .1 hours. I flew 1.0, shirt sleeves, CAVU, and calm air. First flight since early January. Hope you will grace us humble folks with your presence at Paradise City in April. Take care, john h DO NOT ARCHVIVE ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DAquaNut(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 23, 2004
Subject: Re: Prop Pitch
In a message dated 2/21/04 11:48:40 PM Central Standard Time, donghe@one-eleven.net writes: << When I measure mine..for my own reference...I measure it 1 inch from the tip...at 11.5 deg the Cuyuna UL-II-02 will turn my 60' IVO 5900 static or so with a 2.58 gearbox...Runs out at 6300 IN FLight WOT..75 to 79 mph Don Gherardini FireFly 098 http://www.geocities.com/dagger369th/my_firefly.htm >> Don Thanks for the info. Have you had good luck with your Cuyuna? Ed (in Houston) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Elder" <billelder(at)denver.net>
Subject: Re: MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 23, 2004
John Don't have access to the airplane now but it's a "D" shaped grounding plane that fits right in front of the cage brace (where you bolt the nosecone to the cage). It fills the bottom area of the nosecone without bending up on the sides. Hope that makes sense. Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: MicroAir 760 > > Antenna > | mounted on the bottom of the nose cone with a pretty good sized > grounding > | plane (.025 aluminum). Bill in Colorado > > Bill/All: > > What are the dimensions on your ground plane? > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Doug Lawton" <skyrider2(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Revised Recomendation On MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 23, 2004
John, First let me say, I've not started purchasing any radio or electronic gear for my current project yet, (still sanding and filling, etc.) so virtually everything I say is third hand experience (So much for my CMA disclaimer). Your additional questions got me to wondering about the radio and built in intercom, so I called my Bro' up in TN to get an update. Well, the guy on our field who was having the intermittent problems, is still having them. Said it cleared up for about 2 months when he found the wiring problem, and then started doing it again. After extensive additional searching, he pulled the instrument and sent it back to the factory. So far, he hasn't gotten it back. I guess dealing with a company as far away as Australia can be a pain. He did mention that his first impression of the folks he'd dealt with at MicroAir wasn't positive. They were very defensive and arrogant regarding their product and whether or not it could have possibly have been their fault for the problems he was having. Time will tell but that's not usually a good sign. He was quoted something like $400.00 bucks to service the radio plus shipping. Sounds kinda high for a $700.00 retail radio. Also, Brother John has one of these radios in his single place sailplane, it came with the plane when he bought it. Obviously, he's not using the intercom function in a single place, but he said that he's had problems with the radio also. He didn't go into much detail other than to say he'd never by another one. He went with a Garmin 250 XL GPS/COM in his current project. And, he said that most of the guys on the field are using the "Becker" AR 4201 which is a bit more expensive, but fits the same size hole, has intercom, internal lighting among other features. Spruce lists it at $1095.00. Anyhow, I thought that since I had given the apparent wrong impression in my earlier response, that I'd clear that up. I'll just shut up now and stop giving out advice on things I have no "first hand" experience with..........; ) Come see us when you get the chance! Fly Safely, Doug NE Georgia & Whitwell TN Doug/All: Mine too, Doug. How well does the intercom work? Was not clear whether it had a PTT capability for intercom or "turn on, leave on" as I understood from all the searches I did for info last night. Sky Sports sells a wiring harness for $190.00, which is way too much for that. Are you familiar with the requirements for wiring the radio? I wonder if the plug on the wiring harness comes with the radio? If so, it probably will not be that difficult to do my own wiring. Most of my intercom/VHF comm problems have been traced to wiring damage caused by the infamous rats a couple years ago. Every once in a while more damage in the form of chewed wires and cut wire insulation appears. They can do a lot of damage and in places one can not see. Thanks for the info, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "garvelink" <link(at)cdc.net>
Subject: Re: Revised Recomendation On MicroAir 760
Date: Feb 23, 2004
doug, I am from chattanooga where do you fly out of? is it the glider port in the sequachie valley? Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doug Lawton" <skyrider2(at)earthlink.net> Subject: Kolb-List: Revised Recomendation On MicroAir 760 > > John, > > First let me say, I've not started purchasing any radio or electronic gear > for my current project yet, (still sanding and filling, etc.) so virtually > everything I say is third hand experience (So much for my CMA disclaimer). > Your additional questions got me to wondering about the radio and built in > intercom, so I called my Bro' up in TN to get an update. > > Well, the guy on our field who was having the intermittent problems, is > still having them. Said it cleared up for about 2 months when he found the > wiring problem, and then started doing it again. After extensive additional > searching, he pulled the instrument and sent it back to the factory. So > far, he hasn't gotten it back. I guess dealing with a company as far away > as Australia can be a pain. He did mention that his first impression of the > folks he'd dealt with at MicroAir wasn't positive. They were very defensive > and arrogant regarding their product and whether or not it could have > possibly have been their fault for the problems he was having. Time will > tell but that's not usually a good sign. He was quoted something like > $400.00 bucks to service the radio plus shipping. Sounds kinda high for a > $700.00 retail radio. > > Also, Brother John has one of these radios in his single place sailplane, it > came with the plane when he bought it. Obviously, he's not using the > intercom function in a single place, but he said that he's had problems with > the radio also. He didn't go into much detail other than to say he'd never > by another one. He went with a Garmin 250 XL GPS/COM in his current > project. > > And, he said that most of the guys on the field are using the "Becker" AR > 4201 which is a bit more expensive, but fits the same size hole, has > intercom, internal lighting among other features. Spruce lists it at > $1095.00. > > Anyhow, I thought that since I had given the apparent wrong impression in my > earlier response, that I'd clear that up. I'll just shut up now and stop > giving out advice on things I have no "first hand" experience > with..........; > ) > > Come see us when you get the chance! > > Fly Safely, > > Doug > NE Georgia & Whitwell TN > > > Doug/All: > > Mine too, Doug. How well does the intercom work? Was not clear > whether it had a PTT capability for intercom or "turn on, leave on" as > I understood from all the searches I did for info last night. > > Sky Sports sells a wiring harness for $190.00, which is way too much > for that. Are you familiar with the requirements for wiring the > radio? I wonder if the plug on the wiring harness comes with the > radio? If so, it probably will not be that difficult to do my own > wiring. > > Most of my intercom/VHF comm problems have been traced to wiring > damage caused by the infamous rats a couple years ago. Every once in > a while more damage in the form of chewed wires and cut wire > insulation appears. They can do a lot of damage and in places one can > not see. > > Thanks for the info, > > john h > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Flap and Aileron hinge devations
Date: Feb 23, 2004
| John I laughed out loud when I read your statement about getting away from engineering making a guy feel better. I've tried but it still haunts me . | | Duane the plane, Tallahassee, FL, FireFly SN 007, Mk3/912 N7078A. Hi Duane/Gang: Save me some shrimp and mullet. I may have to head down to Panacea for my regular seafood fix at any moment. If I need numbers and engineering, I can always count on Duane to help me out. He is definitely an engineer. I would like to see him and Jack Hart get together. Wouldn't matter if anyone else was around or not. These two guys would be locked up in numbers and engineer stuff. The wings built to Kolb specs with counterbalance weights get the job done for me. I used more hinge, but not necessary. My personal choice to do so. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "boyd young" <by0ung(at)brigham.net>
Subject: ki8ll wires
Date: Feb 23, 2004
. I was wondering what kind of wire can or should be used for shielded kill switch wires? I have some 18 gauge shielded "security system" wire. Would that work ok for the kill wires? Earl Z ------------------- i used coax... i grounded it at the engine and ran it to the control box at the top of the windshield. where i ran the center conductor and the braid to the terninals on the kill switch. anything elce that can be isolated will help boyd ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "boyd young" <by0ung(at)brigham.net>
Subject: crash
Date: Feb 23, 2004
Seems to me, never having been there, that they'd be more likely to pop open. Also, in flight, I don't think you could open the doors on a Mk III if you wanted to. What do you think, John ?? Lar. -------------------- i have pushed mine open a bit to get some air in during a summer flight.... have wondered what would happen if it went over center.... would it remain controlable or would the sind diip it closed. boyd ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "boyd young" <by0ung(at)brigham.net>
Subject: radio and intrxcom
Date: Feb 23, 2004
The intercomm is not voice operated - you turn it on with a switch. You can make it a momentary contact switch like a PTT or a panel switch to leave it on all the time. The Sigtronics intercomm was very easy to hook up just the mic and headphone line to the pilot's side of the Microair. The intercom delivers sound to both. I didn't use the PTT wiring of the intercom, I just wired the switch directly to the Microair. Works like a champ. when i first got my sigtronics spo22n i used a ptt that was between the intercom and the radio... was always told the audio was poor.... started using the ptt functon of the intercom and was told that things were a lot more clear. boyd ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: crash
Date: Feb 23, 2004
| i have pushed mine open a bit to get some air in during a summer flight.... have wondered what would happen if it went over center.... would it remain controlable or would the sind diip it closed. | boyd Larry/Boyd/And the rest of you all: Airstream keeps door in the popped open position. Never tried the over center exercise and hope I don't. Imagine the door would rip right off in a flash, or hang on and beat you to death. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: MicroAir 760 Wiring Harness
Date: Feb 23, 2004
Got an answer from Aircraft Spruce on wiring harness. They have them and would love to send me one for 143.95 plus shipping and handling. Better than 190.00 but still seems awfully expensive for what one gets. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "garvelink" <link(at)cdc.net>
Subject: Transporting an ultrastar.
Date: Feb 23, 2004
Thank goodness for this list. Now that I finally have figured it out. Great information. Now the question In a short time I am going to go pick up an ultrastar. I will trailor it back in an enclosed tralior. how can I protect the wings from damage on this long commute about 500 miles + -- will it ride in the retracted position ok. Steve Garvelink ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BKlebon(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 23, 2004
Subject: Re: Transporting an ultrastar.
You will need to build some type of support to keep the tail wheel off the trailer floor. the blue-prints and instruction book should explain how to do this. I use bungee cords around the aileron counter balances to help stabilize the winga and keep them from movint too much. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba(at)wtxs.net>
Subject: Re: Transporting an ultrastar.
Date: Feb 23, 2004
When I got mine it was about 150 miles and wind blowing like "unreal" we folded the tail and wings used some old carpet pad and 1" ratchat straps to secure the wings and tail, just make sure you check that the wings are on the tubing mount and tight ,or they might come off and rip some fabric I know!! used a 16' trailer loaded front first tied it down good, built a structure to set the boom in out of 2x4's and secured it.and drove home at 50 because of the 30+ winds that day,,, had to repair a couple of fabric rips in the top of the wings where they came loose from the tubing holder "my fault" and fell and ripped. hope this helps! ----- Original Message ----- From: "garvelink" <link(at)cdc.net> Subject: Kolb-List: Transporting an ultrastar. > > Thank goodness for this list. Now that I finally have figured it out. Great information. Now the question > > In a short time I am going to go pick up an ultrastar. I will trailor it back in an enclosed tralior. how can I protect the wings from damage on this long commute about 500 miles + -- will it ride in the retracted position ok. > > > Steve Garvelink > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba(at)wtxs.net>
Subject: secure ultrastar
Date: Feb 23, 2004
sorry forgot,, but secure the ailerions good ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Thom Riddle" <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: re: Bing 64 - Auto leaning like HAC?
Date: Feb 23, 2004
Thanks John and others. Your explanation was good enough for me but I may download the service manual anyway since I am a glutton for data...it gives me the illusion that I actually understand some of this stuff. The most valuable information was that it works to 12,000 ft and beyond and that is good enough for me. As Tom Olenik said, the convenience of not having to manually change the retainer position periodically makes it all worth while. When I had the HAC on my old 582 powered Zenith 701, I adjusted the HAC twice a year, in late fall, and late spring just to make sure all was up to snuff. Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Williamson" <kolbrapilot(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: John Williamson has his Kolbra for Sale
Date: Feb 23, 2004
Hi Rick and all, Yes the Kolbra is FOR SALE. I am going to fly it until it sells or until I get my new project finished and need the radios and engine for it. I am planning on flying the Kolbra to Sun n'Fun, Monument Valley, Whitefish, MT and possibly Oshkosh this spring and summer. I just spent the weekend out in Gig Harbor, Washington where I bought the tail kit to my project and went to the 21st Annual Northwest Aviation Conference & Trade Show at the Pierce County Fair Grounds. http://www.washington-aviation.org/ John Williamson Arlington, TX Kolb Kolbra: 518 hours, Rotax 912 ULS http://home.comcast.net/~kolbrapilot/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DAquaNut(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 24, 2004
Subject: Re: Prop Pitch
In a message dated 2/23/04 10:16:18 AM Central Standard Time, mitchmnd(at)msn.com writes: << I'm not sure where the info came from but I always measure the pitch the same way Don G. did. The important thing of course is to always measure it the same way while you are optimizing the pitch. Duane the Plane, Tallahassee, FL, FireFly SN 007. >> Duane/ Don / Jack/Others Thanks for the replies on Prop pitch Someday I WILL Finnish my firefly& actually FLY it. (the Lord willin) Seems Lar Borne was pretty far along, When I started, so I guess Im not doing too bad . Ha! Ed ( in Houston) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: noises when hit the xmit button
From: Erich_Weaver(at)URSCorp.com
Date: Feb 24, 2004
02/24/2004 11:43:41 AM John H. and List members: I have had a problem in the past that sounds similar to yours. On occasion, I have also heard loud strange warbling noises when pushing the xmit button on my Icom hand held radio while the David Clark intercom was on. No problem with the intercom off however. The funny thing was, when I ripped everything out and took it home, I had trouble duplicating the problem. Eventually sent the intercom back to David Clark and had some phone discussions with one of their technicians. Apparently, my problem is caused by the intercom being too close to the transmitting antenna. You may be a bit limited in your options there, but to the extent that you can, try to maximize the distance between the two. The David Clark guys added a capacitor to the intercom that they said would help, but there apparently wasnt a guaranteed-to-always work solution other than further separation between antenna and intercom. They also advised me that using brand new batteries in the intercom would help, as that somehow provides additional capacitance. Cant say I understand all the issues here, but I have done what they suggested and have had good success. regards, Erich Weaver ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: noises when hit the xmit button
Date: Feb 24, 2004
| I have had a problem in the past that sounds similar to yours. | Erich Weaver Erich/Gang: I think you probably save me about 1,500.00. What you say duplicates what I have experienced. January flight was about 4.5 hours with full battery (aircraft 12V). Then the airplane sat for 6 weeks. During that time the bat went completely dead. Last flight was operating primarily on the alternator. Bat never came up above 6 volts without the alternator. Radio was crystal clear. I have experiemented with different antenna, from wire whip to rubber ducky. Mounted the rubber ducky on the radio, right in front of the intercom and it worked ok. Also under the nose pod in place of whip. Worked ok there too. I talked to Mark Kelly at Sigtronics. He is sending me another wiring harness for the intercom. Also a resistor (or somthing) to wire in the system to give me more head phone volume. Says that the intercoms sometimes eat up hand held radio volume without this fix. As long as I can talk to Control Towers and FSS I am happy with what I have. If this fix give me more volume with my little ICOM A3 so I can understand other aircraft I fly with, I will be happy. Thanks for the information. I think you helped me solve my problem and save a bundle. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: My New Project
Date: Feb 24, 2004
| My new project is a Zenith S.T.O.L. CH 701. With the 912S on it, the wife | and I can go about anywhere we want to and still stay low and low. This | will also allow me to build out of metal which I have wanted to do for a | long time | John Williamson John W/Gang: We'll still let you tag along if you want to. Us Kolber's ain't prejudice. Doesn't Chris Heintz have a four place version of the 701? Two pilots and a lot of cargo! Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Swiderski" <swiderski(at)rocketjet.net>
Subject: Transporting an ultrastar.
Date: Feb 24, 2004
Steve, All the comments are good ones. An additional consideration is that that UltraStar might be an older model where the wing folding u-joint is on the front spar instead of on the rear drag strut. The later models moved it to the rear so the folded height would clear a 7ft garage door. The front joint version will not & probably will neither clear an enclosed trailer. Your options are to either, remove the wings (one bolt) & place their leading edge on foan & secure to the walls, or you could just remove the bolt & lower the wing while its still hanging from the rear bracket. In that case you'd need to hang it with eg., wire & securely tie off the top & bottom to keep them from flopping around. I had to do this every time I trailed mine. It was no big deal, I just hung them with a stiff wire & bungeed them secure, & I also replaced the bolt with an AN bolt with a tab in place of the hex head, ground the threaded tip slightly round to facilitate aligning holes (& help prevent threads from scrapping hole on every use) & used a wing nut & clip in place of the nylock nut. Was quick & easy & allowed wing to hang low. ...Richard Swiderski Ps: if you use the wing nut method, make sure the nut is snug, as a simple pin in this position would not be sufficient. In a short time I am going to go pick up an ultrastar. I will trailor it back in an enclosed tralior. how can I protect the wings from damage on this long commute about 500 miles + -- will it ride in the retracted position ok. Steve Garvelink ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba(at)wtxs.net>
Subject: Re: My New Project
Date: Feb 24, 2004
to john williamson, Please e-mail me rwehba(at)wtxs.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: My New Project > > | My new project is a Zenith S.T.O.L. CH 701. With the 912S on it, > the wife > | and I can go about anywhere we want to and still stay low and low. > This > | will also allow me to build out of metal which I have wanted to do > for a > | long time > | John Williamson > > John W/Gang: > > We'll still let you tag along if you want to. Us Kolber's ain't > prejudice. > > Doesn't Chris Heintz have a four place version of the 701? Two > pilots and a lot of cargo! > > Take care, > > john h > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "CRAIG M NELSON" <vitalfx0(at)msn.com>
"Dana Kimball" , "Debbie Kimball" , "Gary Eisert" , "John Hauck" , "John Williamson" , "Julie Woolsey" , "Kim Skinner" , "kolbra pilot" , "Nicholas Nelson" , "Suzanne Gherkins" , "Jodi Page"
Subject: Fw: Gas Prices
Date: Feb 24, 2004
----- Original Message ----- From: Suzanne Gherkins Gherkins (E-mail); DeeDee Howard (E-mail); Derek Gherkins (E-mail); Dj Burke; Donna Chavez (E-mail); Frances Toon (E-mail); Jacque Stewart; Jessie Larson (E-mail); JoAnn Poer (E-mail 2); Kelcie Gherkins (E-mail); Linda Allen (E-mail); Lindsie Gherkins (E-mail); Reed Ricks (E-mail); Sharon James (E-mail); Sheila Nelson (E-mail); Terri Scott (E-mail); Tim Gherkins (E-mail) Subject: FW: Gas Prices -----Original Message----- From: Jim & Doris [mailto:martin33(at)cox.net] Sylvia Lacey; Letha Burrell; Kent Burrell; Janet Skousen; JoAnn Hopper; Peggy Drake; Peggy Rae Dorris Subject: Fw: Gas Prices ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Irby Subject: FW: Gas Prices ----- Original Message ----- From: Rick Subject: Gas Prices Gas Prices Amazingly simple logic with the most sound probability of results I've ever heard! This Doctor has his head on straight! More aspects of our economy are effected by the cost of petroleum than most anything. Simply think about what he's saying and I think you'll agree: Join the resistance!!!! I hear we are going to hit close to $3.00 a gallon by the summer. Want gasoline prices to come down? We need to take some intelligent, united action. Phillip Hollsworth, offered this good idea: This makes MUCH MORE SENSE than the "don't buy gas on a certain day" campaign that was going around last April or May! The oil companies just laughed at that because they knew we wouldn't continue to "hurt" ourselves by refusing to buy gas. It was more of an inconvenience to us than it was a problem for them. BUT, whoever thought of this idea, has come up with a plan that can really work. Please read it and join with us! By now you're probably thinking gasoline priced at about $1.50 is super cheap. Me too! It is currently $1.97 for regular unleaded in my town. Now that the oil companies and the OPEC nations have conditioned us to think that the cost! of a gallon of gas is CHEAP at $1.50- $1.75, we need to take aggressive action to teach them that BUYERS control the marketplace....not sellers. With the price of gasoline going up more each day, we consumers need to take action. The only way we are going to see the price of gas come down is if we hit someone in the pocketbook by not purchasing their gas! And we can do that WITHOUT hurting ourselves. How? Since we all rely on our cars, we can't just stop buying gas. But we CAN have an impact on gas prices if we all act together to force a price war. Here's the idea: For the rest of this year, DON'T purchase ANY gasoline from the two biggest companies (which now are one), EXXON and MOBIL. If they are not selling any gas, they will be inclined to reduce their prices If they reduce their prices, the other companies will have to follow suit. But to have an impact, we need to reach literally millions of Exxon and Mobil gas buyers. It's really simple to do!! Now, don't whimp out on me at this point...keep reading and I'll explain how simple it is to reach millions of people!! I am sending this note to about thirty people. If each of you send it to at least ten more (30 x 10 300) .. and those 300 send it to at least ten more (300 x 10 3,000)...and so on, by the time the message reaches the sixth generation of people, we will have reached over THREE MILLION consumers! If those three million get excited and ! pass this on to ten friends each, then 30 million people will have been contacted! If it goes one level further, you guessed it..... THREE HUNDRED MILLION PEOPLE!!! Again, all You have to do is send this to 10 people. That's all. (If you don't understand how we can reach 300 million and all you have to do is send this to 10 people.... Well, let's face it, you just aren't a mathematician. But I am ... so trust me on this one.) How long would all that take? If each of us sends this e-mail out to ten more people within one day of receipt, all 300 MILLION people could conceivably be contacted within the next 8 days!!! I'll bet you didn't think you and I had that much potential, did you! Acting together we can make a difference. If this makes sense to you, please pass this message on. PLEASE HOLD OUT UNTIL THEY LOWER THEIR PRICES TO THE $1.30 RANGE AND KEEP THEM DOWN. THIS CAN REALLY WORK. Kerry Lyle, Director, Research Coordinator Interventional Cardiology Research Laboratories Division of Cardiovascular Diseases 932 Ziegler Research Bldg 703 South 19th Street University of Alabama @ B'ham Birmingham, Al 35294-0007 Phone: (205) 934-6163 Fax: (205) 934-7360 Joe Ingram 519 NE 165th #18 Shoreline WA 98155 206-417-8061 206-579-2205 Wireless --- Jim Irby --- giftsbyjim(at)earthlink.net The information contained in this e-mail is intended only for the individual or entity to whom it is addressed. Its contents (including any attachments) are confidential and may contain privileged information. If you are not an intended recipient you must not use, disclose, disseminate, copy or print its contents. If you receive this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by reply e-mail and delete and destroy the message. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 24, 2004
Subject: Re: Fw: Gas Prices
From: herbgh(at)juno.com
Guys I wonder how this idea would impact medical costs?? Herb in Ky > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Rick > To: Undisclosed-Recipient: > Subject: Gas Prices > > > Gas Prices > > > Amazingly simple logic with the most sound probability of results > I've ever heard! This Doctor has his head on straight! More > aspects of our economy are effected by the cost of petroleum than > most anything. Simply think about what he's saying and I think > you'll agree: > > Join the resistance!!!! > > I hear we are going to hit close to $3.00 a gallon by the summer. > Want gasoline prices to come down? We need to take some > intelligent, united action. Phillip Hollsworth, offered this good > idea: This makes MUCH MORE SENSE than the "don't buy gas on a > certain day" campaign that was going around last April or May! The > oil companies just laughed at that because they knew we wouldn't > continue to "hurt" ourselves by refusing to buy gas. > It was more of an inconvenience to us than it was a problem for > them. > BUT, whoever thought of this idea, has come up with a plan that can > really work. > Please read it and join with us! > By now you're probably thinking gasoline priced at about $1.50 is > super cheap. Me too! It is currently $1.97 for regular unleaded in > my town. > Now that the oil companies and the OPEC nations have conditioned us > to think that the cost! of a gallon of gas is CHEAP at $1.50- > $1.75, we need to take aggressive action to teach them that BUYERS > control the marketplace....not sellers. With the price of gasoline > going up more each day, we consumers need to take action. The only > way we are going to see the price of gas come down is if we hit > someone in the pocketbook by not purchasing their gas! > And we can do that WITHOUT hurting ourselves. How? Since we all > rely on our cars, we can't just stop buying gas. But we CAN have an > impact on gas prices if we all act together to force a price war. > Here's the idea: For the rest of this year, DON'T purchase ANY > gasoline from the two biggest companies (which now are one), EXXON > and MOBIL. If they are not selling any gas, they will be inclined > to reduce their prices If they reduce their prices, the other > companies will have to follow suit. But to have an impact, we need > to reach literally millions of Exxon and Mobil gas buyers. It's > really simple to do!! Now, don't whimp out on me at this > point...keep reading and I'll explain how simple it is to reach > millions of people!! > I am sending this note to about thirty people. If each of you send > it to at least ten more (30 x 10 300) .. and those 300 send it to > at least ten more (300 x 10 3,000)...and so on, by the time the > message reaches the sixth generation of people, we will have reached > over THREE MILLION consumers! If those three million get excited > and ! pass this on to ten friends each, then 30 million people will > have been contacted! If it goes one level further, you guessed > it..... THREE HUNDRED MILLION PEOPLE!!! > Again, all You have to do is send this to 10 people. That's all. > (If you don't understand how we can reach 300 million and all you > have to do is send this to 10 people.... Well, let's face it, you > just aren't a mathematician. > But I am ... so trust me on this one.) > How long would all that take? If each of us sends this e-mail out > to ten more people within one day of receipt, all 300 MILLION people > could conceivably be contacted within the next 8 days!!! I'll bet > you didn't think you and I had that much potential, did you! Acting > together we can make a difference. > If this makes sense to you, please pass this message on. > PLEASE HOLD OUT UNTIL THEY LOWER THEIR PRICES TO THE $1.30 RANGE AND > KEEP THEM DOWN. THIS CAN REALLY WORK. > Kerry Lyle, Director, Research Coordinator Interventional Cardiology > Research Laboratories Division of Cardiovascular Diseases > 932 Ziegler Research Bldg > 703 South 19th Street University of Alabama @ B'ham Birmingham, Al > 35294-0007 Phone: (205) 934-6163 Fax: (205) 934-7360 > Joe Ingram > 519 NE 165th #18 > Shoreline WA 98155 > 206-417-8061 > 206-579-2205 Wireless > > > --- Jim Irby > --- giftsbyjim(at)earthlink.net > > The information contained in this e-mail is intended only for the > individual or entity > to whom it is addressed. Its contents (including any attachments) > are confidential and > may contain privileged information. If you are not an intended > recipient you must not > use, disclose, disseminate, copy or print its contents. If you > receive this e-mail in > error, please notify the sender by reply e-mail and delete and > destroy the message. > > > = > = > = > = > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Sun & Fun Ultralight Arrival Procedure
Date: Feb 25, 2004
This is extracted from the FAA web page: http://www.faa.gov/NTAP/NTAP04FEB19/AS04001.HTM HELICOPTER AND ULTRALIGHT ARRIVALS AND DEPARTURES ULTRALIGHT ARRIVALS AND DEPARTURES All arriving and departing ultralight vehicles shall enter and exit from the south-southwest of the Lakeland Linder Regional Airport and shall remain below 500 feet AGL, remaining west of the large airport buildings. Be alert for helicopters arriving and departing at the same altitudes just to the east of the area reserved for ultralight operations. Radio equipped arriving aircraft monitor 119.25 until north of the east/west road on the south airport boundary. NORDO ultralight aircraft desiring to land at the ultralight grass strip prior to April 10, 2004, must pre-coordinate arrival information with the Lakeland Air Traffic Manager at (863) 648-3305. ---------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Kirby Dennis Contr ASC/TM <Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil>
Subject: Re: Verner 4 stroke
Date: Feb 25, 2004
<< How do you like the Verner engine? Does it have enough get up and go?...Is throttle response good? What about payload, do you have the same compared to the 912, 80 horse engine? Would you do it again? Bill in central Florida >> Bill, and other interested Kolbers - I am totally pleased with my choice of engine. It's mechanically simple, and I wanted a 4-stroke, which equals reliability in my book because I admit complete ignorance in the care & feeding of 2-stroke engines. Alhough my first choice of powerplant for my Mark-3 was a 912, I could not afford a new one at the time (1999) without waiting another 6-12 months, so the Verner was my choice. I paid $7500 for it, complete with everything. Puts out plenty of power for my 600-lb-empty plane. No regrets so far. Advertised as an 80-hp engine, it should really be considered a 70-hp engine, which is what the engine produces at its max continuous rpm of 4000. (5000 rpm limited to 5 minutes.) I've got a 72-inch Powerfin 3-blade prop, and my climb rate is 800 fpm, at density altitudes of 8500 ft (my field elevation is 6200 ft msl). Engine runs smoothly at all rpms, but it's best cruise range is 3400-3800. Another Mark-3 owner on this List (Bill George) has a Verner on his Mark-3, and he reports that it provides similar performance to a Rotax-582. He should know, as he replaced the 582 that was originally on his airplane with a Verner. I bought my engine from Steve Flynn, of Central Florida Flyers http://www.centralfloridaflyers.com/ who, at the time, was the sole US distributor for the Verner. Now, there are about 2 or 3 other sources. Steve has been outstanding in providing customer suppport for this engine. Some general performance figures: Takeoff run: 150 - 200 ft Climbout: 4200 rpm, 55 mph, 800 fpm Cruise: 4000 rpm - 75 mph 3800 rpm - 70 mph 3600 rpm - 65 mph Would I do it again? Although I like the Verner, I still wanna 912, and I hope I'll have saved up enough for one by the time I'm ready to switch. Dennis Kirby N93DK, Cedar Crest NM ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Sun$Fun
From: Dwight.Kottke(at)hti.htch.com
Date: Feb 25, 2004
02/25/2004 02:25:54 PM, Serialize complete at 02/25/2004 02:25:54 PM, Itemize by SMTP Server on HUDOMGW1/HTI(Release 5.0.12 |February 13, 2003) at 02/25/2004 02:25:46 PM, Serialize by Router on HUDOMGW1/HTI(Release 5.0.12 |February 13, 2003) at 02/25/2004 02:25:49 PM, Serialize complete at 02/25/2004 02:25:49 PM Dropped my membership in USUA after 19 continuous years, last year. Folks at USUA got too pricey for me to be a member of USUA and get their newspaper. john h John and others: I will continue to send in my membership to USUA for the next 19 years. Here's why; they are the only group that I could find that will insure us ultralight flyers. I just sent in my renewal membership and $375 annual premium for insuring my Firestar. I would encourage other list members to check it out. P.S. You do have to be a member, have your plan registered and you have to be a registered pilot also. Dwight Kottke The Flying Farmer ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Sun$Fun
Date: Feb 25, 2004
----- Original Message ----- From: <Dwight.Kottke(at)hti.htch.com> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Sun$Fun | | Dropped my membership in USUA after 19 continuous years, last year. | Folks at USUA got too pricey for me to be a member of USUA and get | their newspaper. | | john h | | John and others: | | I will continue to send in my membership to USUA for the next 19 years. | Here's why; they are the only group that I could find that will insure us | ultralight flyers. I just sent in my renewal membership and $375 annual | premium for insuring my Firestar. I would encourage other list members to | check it out. | | P.S. You do have to be a member, have your plan registered and you have to | be a registered pilot also. | | Dwight Kottke | The Flying Farmer | | | ==== | ==== | ==== | ==== | | | | | ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Sun$Fun
Date: Feb 25, 2004
| I scanned it in, and here it is from page 9 of Ultralight Flying, March 2004 | | Pilots, Manutacturers Heads Up | | Changes in Ultralight Area for Sun 'n Fun '04 | Jack & Louise Hart | jbhart(at)ldd.net Jack H/All: Thanks for posting the article, Jack. It sounds a bit different from the original interpretation by some other individual. The Air Ops folks at S&F ultralight flight ops have, for some years now, required an inspection by Air Ops personnel prior to flying in and out of the UL area, once you have done your initial landing, if flying in from some other location. However, they did not dig into your paper work. This article may be a cover you hind end type exercise on Dave's part. If I were flying an illegal two place, i.e., unregistered and not in strict compliance with current FAA regs, I would definitely do my homework, or leave my two place at home. Folks flying experiementals should always have all the required paperwork with them no matter when and where they fly, although a lot of us don't unless we are going on a cross country flight. If you want to be a single place UL, have extra fuel tanks in the open, which are obviously more than 5 gal, you might consider dropping them somewhere before flying in to Paradise City. Other than the above, it seems to be business as usual. Take care, john h PS: If someone wants to send my posts to other Lists, as well as my pics, please do me the courtesey of contacting me prior to doing so. Thanks, jrh. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 25, 2004
From: possums <possums(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Sun & Fun
We are planning a trip to fly to Lakeland, Fl on April the 12 thru the 16th. We will stay at the Sun-n-Fun for only 2 days. And then head towards St Augustine, Fl and then to Jekyle Island, GA and then finally back to Atlanta. http://www.georgiasportflyers.com/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GeoR38(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 26, 2004
Subject: Re: inertia switch
In a message dated 2/22/04 11:42:48 AM Eastern Standard Time, by0ung(at)brigham.net writes: > > This was my worry. So if I were to make a hard, bouncy landing and the > engine were suddenly "off" because of this switch, I wouldn't have the > option to use power to get things under control or to go around. I could > even lose power by hitting a bad bump on summer day? > > A coupla years ago i let a CFI fly my Firestar. It was still pretty new then and the ignition switch was out in the open as the plans had depicted, near the left knee. The CFI took it up on a kinda rainy day, don't ask why he picked such a time, and as he made his downwind, the engine quit at about 300 feet and 2/3 the way down the runway. Well, let me tell you, he made a quick turn over the treeline to make a quick final turn and then down on the ground with nothing left over...it came in hard and bent an aluminum gear. Scared, was he ever scared. Mumbled sumpin bout those damn 2 cycles, and helped the group that had gathered push/carry the puppy to the hangar. Days later my mind recalled that the ignition switch was off, and I asked him if he had turned it off after landing, to which he stumbled a "no, I don't think so". Then I knew that his pudgy lil knee had tripped the switch and caused the outage in the first place. I put a paint can plastic top around the switch to keep that from ever happening again. His mind had been so conditioned to the "damn problems with 2 cycles" that he never even suspected that he had killed the switch accidently himself. He used to be on this list ....but his mind was warped by the experience and he sold his Mark III shortly thereafter. Had onathemdamn532s oner. George Randolph firestar driver from The Villages ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GeoR38(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 26, 2004
Subject: Re: fire in da hole
In a message dated 2/22/04 1:54:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, rowedl(at)highstream.net writes: > I have one mounted right under the passengers legs, just in front of the > seat. > IMHO every aircraft should have one. > > Denny Rowe, MK-3, PA > > I agree, I have one too, above the 5 gal tank George Randolph ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jim Hauck" <jimh474(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Wheels
Date: Feb 26, 2004
Folks; I have a set of Hagar wheels, brakes, master cylinders, lines, fittings, extra "O" rings, no axles for sale. The wheels are new, brakes are used. Anyone interested, make a reasonable offer. Jim Hauck ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Kirby Dennis Contr ASC/TM <Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil>
Subject: Kolb Insurance
Date: Feb 26, 2004
<< ASUA are the only group that I could find that will insure us ultralight flyers. I just sent in my renewal membership and $375 annual premium for insuring my Firestar. I would encourage other list members to check it out. Dwight Kottke >> Dwight, and Kolb Friends - Wow - what a good deal! That's worth paying $19 a year for, if just to qualify for the insurance. Currenly, I am paying $650 per year with Falcon, and that's for liability only. ($1M) No hull coverage. Thanks for the tip. Dennis Kirby Mark-3, Verner-1400 in Cedar Crest, NM ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Insurance
Date: Feb 26, 2004
| Wow - what a good deal! | That's worth paying $19 a year for, if just to qualify for the insurance. | | Currenly, I am paying $650 per year with Falcon, and that's for liability | only. ($1M) No hull coverage. | | Dennis Kirby Dennis/Gang: Got to get some flight time, especailly in make and model, and tail wheel to get those premiums down. I can get the same liability coverage from Falcon for $300 a year, and AVEMCO for $250. It is the darned hull coverage that eats me up. The premiums are tough to pay. However, if you break your airplane, the coverage is nice to have. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 26, 2004
From: Jimmy <jhankin(at)planters.net>
Subject: Plantation Flying Club Fly-In
Kolb-List , info(at)georgiasportflyers.com, AUGUSTA_172 , BLAIRSVILLE-1211 , CARROLLTOM-976 , COLUMBUS-677 , DAWSON-354 , DUBLIN-1195 , LAWRENCEVILLE-690 , MOULTRIE-1082 , PERRY_38 , SPRINGFIELD_330 , ST SIMONS-905 , VIDALIA_1332 The Second Plantation Fly-in will be held on Saturday May 1, 2004 at the Plantation Air Park (JYL) Sylvania, Georgia, sponsored by the Plantation Flying Club. General Aviation and Ultralight's ( all types) welcome. Starting at 8:00 am. A Low Country Broil will be served, Pilots free lunch. Full facilities: Two runways 5 and 15, right traffic. 3800' X 75' 15 and 33, 5000' X 100' Elevation 188' Unicom 122.8 Beacon Restrooms Fuel, credit cards Lat. 32*38.73'N Lon 81*35.79'W Weather, 912 857 9000 HAVE YOUR CLUB JOIN US FOR A GREAT TIME. If you know of a group that is going to attend, please notify of about how many will be attending. Contact: Jimmy Hankinson 912 863 7384 jhankin(at)planters.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: PaulServaty(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 26, 2004
Subject: Kolb-List SUN$fUN
From:Paul Servaty www.paulservaty(at)aol.com Subject: Kolb-List Sun$fun Hi Gang I plan on going to Sun$Fun again trailing my Firestar KX & camping 6 days at Paradise City (3rd time). Flying at Paradise City is a lot of fun and worth it. First year 1st take-off I was chewed out after landing for too high a angle for take-off. Good start. Last year I flew all the morning parades except one. This is really fun as you can fly over GA & the warbirds at600 feet.Briefing is 6:00AM & flying is 7:00AM to 8:Am & two mornings my Kolb was covered with morning dew . Wiping the inside & outside lexon while taxing for takeoff was a challenge and when you got the wave-off you could barely see out. The last day there Dick Rahill (Kolb factory pilot) a trike and myself were the only UL to fly in the parade. A fog bank was moving toward PC. Dick made a landing but then took off . I landed behind him and took-off too. Big mistake ! The fog moved in .Tried climbing to 600 feet. Worse. Went down to 200 feet. Recognized some GA hangers and saw a green glow near-by. It was the neon sign on the Geico bldg. Flew to it and was going to land at the empty parking lot but the fog lifted temporarily & landed at Pc. Told the Kolb twin eng. flyer about it and he said I should walk away from my plane like it wasn't mine which I did for a half hour. As I said lots of fun. HA-HA-HA. Sorry to be long winded . FLY STRAIGHT Paul 1987 FS DO NOT ARCHIEVE ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Thom Riddle" <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: My New Project
Date: Feb 26, 2004
Finally a subject that I can speak about with some authority. My first airplane after retiring and not flying for 30+ years was a 582 powered 701, but I was not the builder. Mine weighed 608 lb.. empty and had an external torpedo shaped 10 gallon tank in addition to the 10 gallon header tank, because my 582 was a guzzler, and it also had a largish radiator that added to the aerodynamic dirtiness. They now have wing tanks. The gross weight of this early model was only 960# so with my 210# and 120# of fuel it was just under gross which was the way I flew it most of the time. I don't know how much distance it took to get off the ground but no matter what the temperature it took exactly 4 seconds from throttle forward to airborne and very nose high. With a 912 or 912S its take-off performance will be amazing. The worst thing about this aircraft to me was what others have said, the engine is on the wrong end and blocks your view way too much for my liking. The best thing about it was the Junker type flaperons. With these Junker flaperons this airplane easily has the best slow flight control response of anything I've ever flown, but it will not fly nearly as slow as most Kolbs at the same weight due to its smaller wing. However, if you are flying very slow and want to see ahead of you too, drop one notch of flaps. That will pitch the nose down enough to see a bit better. This is a very dirty airplane with the leading edge fixed slats and the Junker type flaperons hanging down in the wind. Mine was a bit dirtier than most due to the extra 10 gallon fuel tank. I cruised at 5900rpm at a true airspeed of 72mph and 6 gph fuel consumption, measured on some reasonably long x-countries. Of course a 912 will do better on all counts. Speaking of dirty, another terrific thing about this airplane was the ability to drop it into a very tight field over a high obstacle approach. For extreme short field high obstacle landings you approach at 55mph or so drop the flaps all the way down, and point the nose as far down as you can. It drops like a rock under full control and has a terminal velocity in this configuration of around 70mph or so, which I think is the flap limit speed. Of course in this scenario, timing the flare is very important but with practice it lands extremely short. Okay, if it was so good, why did I sell it? The answer is simple: I like to see where I am going and with the engine directly in front of you, well all Kolbers understand this. I flew a FlightStar trainer once with the engine up high in front which solves that problem but hated the way that plane handled. BTW, the 82 year old gentleman I sold the 701 to, immediately replaced the engine with a 912 and is having a blast with it, last I heard. I have some pictures of this 701 if anyone wants to see them...just email me. Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
Subject: Re: Wheels
Date: Feb 26, 2004
Jim H What size are the wheels? also.as granpa would always say.. .its your horse pard...you gotta price it! Don Gherardini Sales / Engineering dept. American Honda Engines Power Equipment Company CortLand, Illinois 800-626-7326 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jim Hauck" <jimh474(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Wheels
Date: Feb 26, 2004
Y'all; Dem wheels and brakes done been sold to Bryan Green. He was firstus t askus. Now bro John has a set of wheels, steel heat treated gear legs, brakes and the whole nine yards. He may be persuaded to part with them. Jim Hauck ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Denny Rowe" <rowedl(at)highstream.net>
Subject: Re: Wheels
Date: Feb 26, 2004
> Now bro John has a set of wheels, steel heat treated gear legs, brakes and > the whole nine yards. He may be persuaded to part with them. > > Jim Hauck > > >OK, what are they for? Stock Mk-3?, What type of wheels and brakes? Inquiring minds want to know. Denny Rowe ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GeoR38(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 27, 2004
Subject: Re: Sun$Fun
In a message dated 2/25/04 10:28:47 AM Eastern Standard Time, jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com writes: > Hi Dan/All: > > Can anyone scan the article and send it to me? Maybe post it to an > index page? I will post it to mine if I get a copy? > > Dropped my membership in USUA after 19 continuous years, last year. > Folks at USUA got too pricey for me to be a member of USUA and get > their newspaper. > > john h > same thing happened to me John, and i was USUA #299!! george Randolph Firestar drive at The Villages Fl ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GeoR38(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 27, 2004
Subject: Re: Sun$Fun
In a message dated 2/25/04 4:03:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, jbhart(at)ldd.net writes: > Kolbers, > > I scanned it in, and here it is from page 9 of Ultralight Flying, March 2004 > > Pilots, Manutacturers Heads Up > > Changes in Ultralight Area for Sun 'n Fun '04 > > This year marks the 30th anniversary of Sun 'n Fun, the Florida > springtime event/fly-in that celebrates aviation. Since the theme for > Sun 'n Fun '04 is "30 Years of Sun 'n Fun. A Salute to Volunteers," > many activities will honor the hundreds of volunteers without whom this an- > nual airshow would not happen. The ultralight area is no exception. > "We honor our volunteers every year," says ultralight chairman Dave > Piper. "We do a parade, have a Volunteer of the Year award that we do with- > in our area, and I try to make it as comforta~e and palatable as possible > for > the volunteers." > While it will be mostly ~usiness as usual" in the ultralight area, this > year > volunteers will be on hand to make sure pilots are flying in compliance with > any applicable FAA rules, including pilots who fly in and manufacturers who > bring planes to the airshow. > Single-seaters should be either in compliance with FAR Part 103 or prop- > erly registered with FAA and flown with the appropriate pilot certificate. > "If > somebody rolls out with a 10-gallon gas tank and says they're flying under > Part 108, we can't let that go," says Piper. "Something that's so flagrant, > we > can't turn a blind eye to that." > Two-seaters should be properly registered with FAA and flown with the > appropriate pilot certificate. If a pilot is flying a 2-seat ultralight > trainer, > that plane needs to have a registration number from the organization with > which it's registered, placarding, exemption certificate, the exemption > issued > (depending on who it's from) and the plane needs to meet the 496-pound > empty weight requirement. "Pilots need everything that's required to fly > under the 2-seat trainer exemption," explains Piper. "Then you'll get a > sticker > for your aircraft to go out onto the runway. > "We've always done it kind of on the honor system where you say you > have > your instructor rating if you're flying a 2-seater; you sign stating that," > Piper > explains. "And we have let that go. This year pilots will have to produce > doc- > umentation. It's all required to be in the aircraft anyhow. So we're not > asking > for anything that shouldn't be there. > "N-numbered aircraft need appropriate documentation; they need to > show > airworthiness, pilot certification, weight and balance," says Piper. "That > does > not necessarily mean that they will be flying. We've only got 1,350 feet of > runway. If we see an aircraft that doesn't have time to take off or is going > to > create an unsafe situation, we're going to have that aircraft stand down." > Pilots operating foreign registered aircraft may be required to work > with > FAA to receive a Special Flight Authorization (SFA). > In his l5th year as ultralight area chairman, Piper takes his job > seriously > but hastens to add, "We're not regulating the aircraft, we're not regulating > pilots; but we are going to regulate our venue." > > Vern's Back > Piper has also successfully talked ultralight commentator Vernon > Peck- > ham into coming back to lend his talents to Sun 'n Fun this year. "I had to > beg," says Piper, laughing. "He was bowing out for good reason, but we need > him. His retirement last year was for real. But I begged, and he said, 'I > can't > tell you no'." > Questions? Call Dave Piper, phone: (727) 898-2810. e-mail, > dav1673758(at)aol.com . > Thank you Jack Hart..... I am a memeber of a new Barbershop singing group here in North central Florida and our announcer, who is very professional is Ralph Peckham. I wonder if Vernon and Ralph are related. ....hmmm ....both are announcers. george Randolph ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ZackGSD(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 27, 2004
Subject: weight/balance question
does anyone know what the correct angle off the wing is for the older firestar. i have a 95, the one with the two tubes running from over the top of your head to the nose cone. i understand from kolb this was the year/model they bought and they have no plans/information on this year. when i do a weight & balance using 9 degrees it comes out 8 inches aft; yet the previous owner said never had a problem. he also said a guy 140lbs flew it and a guy 210 lbs flew it with out a glitche. any thoughts or ideas are appreceiated. alan firestar nrh, tx ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Bass" <gtb(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: Sun$Fun
Date: Feb 27, 2004
>> Dropped my membership in USUA after 19 continuous years, last year. >> Folks at USUA got too pricey for me to be a member of USUA and get >> their newspaper. >> >> john h >> > >same thing happened to me John, and I was USUA #299!! > >George Randolph Although not an aircraft owner, I have over 250 hours in UL's and near the same in GA planes. I've been a member of USUA since 1984. Not any more tho. I'll be letting my membership expire this year. Perhaps if I had a plane of my own, I would stay, but, this is the same kind of crap that has happened to the GA crowd, in that it is becoming even more prohibitive to continue with the different organizations that are "BENEFICIAL" to US, due to the increasing costs of it all. It is also the primary reason that I wanted to be involved in the UL movement from the start ........ costs. Can't really justify it anymore. Many of the UL aircraft are in the same monetary ballpark as a large number of the older GA planes, and the GA planes (especially the homebuilts) have fewer restrictions to deal with, when flying. I know, I know, you are going to tell me costs are excessive, but, in truth, they are not that much different from what the UL industry has become, and will continue to accelerate to, when the all 'new and wonderful' Sport Pilot Category is enacted. Why do you suppose the ENTIRE UL industry is anxious to get it done? Money.!!! And the PRESTIGE of becoming a recognized AIRCRAFT MANUFACTURER.!! Bull. George --- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Sun$Fun
Date: Feb 27, 2004
| same thing happened to me John, and i was USUA #299!! | | george Randolph | | Firestar drive at The Villages Fl George/All: Found this receipt, after all these years, in the bottom of the drawer I keep my monthly bills and stuff: http://home.elmore.rr.com/jhauck/History/Glider%20Rider.jpg I had just started doing my research for my first UL.. I had no money to buy a kit at that time. I had to wait until the insurance company settled up on my Fiat Spider that got T-Boned and totaled. In Feb 1984, got a check for $3,500.00. I promptly wrote a check for $3,495.00 for my new 1984 Ultra Star. This was my last USUA membership card and UL pilots "thingy", USUA 0912: http://home.elmore.rr.com/jhauck/History/USUA%20912.jpg I'm still wondering what USUA does, other than cash checks for $54.95. Oh yea, liability insurance for ULs. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba(at)wtxs.net>
Subject: Re: weight/balance question
Date: Feb 27, 2004
is nrh,tx north richland hills? i am over in sweetwater 240miles west ----- Original Message ----- From: <ZackGSD(at)aol.com> Subject: Kolb-List: weight/balance question > > does anyone know what the correct angle off the wing is for the older > firestar. i have a 95, the one with the two tubes running from over the top of your > head to the nose cone. i understand from kolb this was the year/model they > bought and they have no plans/information on this year. when i do a weight & > balance using 9 degrees it comes out 8 inches aft; yet the previous owner said > never had a problem. he also said a guy 140lbs flew it and a guy 210 lbs flew it > with out a glitche. any thoughts or ideas are appreceiated. > > alan > firestar > nrh, tx > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GeoR38(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 27, 2004
Subject: Re: Sun$Fun
In a message dated 2/27/04 11:35:25 AM Eastern Standard Time, gtb(at)commspeed.net writes: > >>Dropped my membership in USUA after 19 continuous years, last year. > >>Folks at USUA got too pricey for me to be a member of USUA and get > >>their newspaper. > >> > >>john h > >> > > > >same thing happened to me John, and I was USUA #299!! > > > >George Randolph > > > Although not an aircraft owner, I have over 250 hours in UL's > and near the same in GA planes. > > I've been a member of USUA since 1984. Not any more tho. > I'll be letting my membership expire this year. > > Perhaps if I had a plane of my own, I would stay, but, this > is the same kind of crap that has happened to the GA crowd, > in that it is becoming even more prohibitive to continue with > the different organizations that are "BENEFICIAL" to US, > due to the increasing costs of it all. > > It is also the primary reason that I wanted to be involved in > the UL movement from the start ........ costs. Can't really > justify it anymore. Many of the UL aircraft are in the same > monetary ballpark as a large number of the older GA planes, > and the GA planes (especially the homebuilts) have fewer > restrictions to deal with, when flying. > > I know, I know, you are going to tell me costs are excessive, > but, in truth, they are not that much different from what the > UL industry has become, and will continue to accelerate to, > when the all 'new and wonderful' Sport Pilot Category is > enacted. Why do you suppose the ENTIRE UL industry is > anxious to get it done? Money.!!! And the PRESTIGE of > becoming a recognized AIRCRAFT MANUFACTURER.!! > > Bull. > > George > I hear ya George, I think USUA had a squabble a coupla years back including its founder Ballentine, and since it wasn't explained, I lost confidence in the organization and found it easier to leave. I admit that the other comments about being loyal have preyed on me, as I really do think there needs to be a concentrated effort to maintain the UL catagory intact, but things and people (including me) change with time and now that I'm in Florida, without my plane, ...and the sport pilot thing is forever gonna be here (famous last words) .....almost like a Biglarism...;-)..... I better stop before.... someone detects....some shortcomings in my dialog..... George Randolph ps.....I sure do miss getting that magazine every month though!!!....Geeeez!!! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Thom Riddle" <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: re: weight/balance question
Date: Feb 28, 2004
I have no documentation whatsoever on the early Firestar/377 I fly. But my winter flying weight is 210# and have been known to fly with an extra 5gal jerry can of gas just behind the slingseat, in front of the bulkhead. I have had no CG problems at all. Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ZackGSD(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 28, 2004
Subject: Re: re: weight/balance question
In a message dated 2/28/2004 6:31:57 AM Central Standard Time, jtriddle(at)adelphia.net writes: > Subj: Kolb-List: re: weight/balance question > Date: 2/28/2004 6:31:57 AM Central Standard Time > From: jtriddle(at)adelphia.net > Reply-to: kolb-list(at)matronics.com > To: Kolb-List(at)matronics.com > Sent from the Internet > > > > > I have no documentation whatsoever on the early Firestar/377 I fly. But my > winter flying weight is 210# and have been known to fly with an extra 5gal > jerry can of gas just behind the slingseat, in front of the bulkhead. I have had > no CG problems at all. > > Thom in Buffalo > Thom, mine is equiped with a 503. the weight difference between the 377 and a 503 would make a difference, but I am not sure how much. thanks..Alan ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 28, 2004
From: "johnjung(at)compusenior.com" <johnjung(at)compusenior.com>
Subject: Re: weight/balance question
Alan and Group, If I recall correctly, the original Firestar that I owned used 9 degrees for weight and balance. My Firestar II uses 9 degrees, so probably all Firestars do. You may want to check your numbers again. I didn't think that it was possible to exceed the forward balance limit without first going well beyond the gross weight (i.e. a very heavy pilot). If you would like, e-mail me your numbers, off-list, and I will run them though my Excel program for a quick check. John Jung ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 28, 2004
From: "Bob N." <ronoy(at)shentel.net>
Subject: Virginia Ultralight Safety Seminar
The VA UL Safety Seminar will be held 20 March, 8:30 AM -3:30 PM at the Virginia Aviation Museum on Richmond Int'l Airport. More info: call Carolyn Toth at (804) 236-3637. Bob N. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 28, 2004
From: "Bob N." <ronoy(at)shentel.net>
Subject: what the????
Just got a sharp msg from some tinhorn (Symantek Mail Security) saying my last post re: VA Safety Seminar had "prohibited content." Their serial no: 266 quad trillion, 402 trillion, 962 billion, 8 million, 329 thousand, and 972. That's almost one fer every msg ever written. So, to all who read my msg, profound apologies--fer what?? I most certainly don't want to make it 266,402,962.008,329,973. The Mail Censor won't reply to my request, asking what was so bad. Bob N. My books are water; those of the great geniuses is wine. Everybody drinks water--Mark Twain ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 28, 2004
From: "Ron or Mary Payne" <whyme(at)vci.net>
Subject: Re: what the????
Your post came through here OK. Nothing prohibited about it in the message. Ron Payne -------Original Message------- From: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Date: 02/28/04 10:45:27 AM Subject: Kolb-List: what the???? Just got a sharp msg from some tinhorn (Symantek Mail Security) saying my last post re: VA Safety Seminar had "prohibited content." Their serial no: 266 quad trillion, 402 trillion, 962 billion, 8 million, 329 thousand, and 972. That's almost one fer every msg ever written. So, to all who read my msg, profound apologies--fer what?? I most certainly don't want to make it 266,402,962.008,329,973. The Mail Censor won't reply to my request, asking what was so bad. Bob N. My books are water; those of the great geniuses is wine. Everybody drinks water--Mark Twain ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 28, 2004
Subject: [ Mike Pierzina ] : New Email List Photo Share Available!
From: Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available: Poster: Mike Pierzina Subject: Firestar II Pitot Tube http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/planecrazzzy@lycos.com.02.28.2004/index.html o Main Photo Share Index http://www.matronics.com/photoshare o Submitting a Photo Share If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the following information along with your email message and files: 1) Email List or Lists that they are related to: 2) Your Full Name: 3) Your Email Address: 4) One line Subject description: 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic: 6) One-line Description of each photo or file: Email the information above and your files and photos to: pictures(at)matronics.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 28, 2004
Subject: [ Clay Stuart ] : New Email List Photo Share Available!
From: Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available: Poster: Clay Stuart Subject: Xtra rear fuselage enclosure http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/tcstuart@adelphia.net.02.28.2004/index.html o Main Photo Share Index http://www.matronics.com/photoshare o Submitting a Photo Share If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the following information along with your email message and files: 1) Email List or Lists that they are related to: 2) Your Full Name: 3) Your Email Address: 4) One line Subject description: 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic: 6) One-line Description of each photo or file: Email the information above and your files and photos to: pictures(at)matronics.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ActionCrane(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 28, 2004
Subject: Re: re: weight/balance question
Thom, If you weigh 210 you are probably right in the middle of the allowable 20 to 37% CG for the early Firestar. Steve H Firestar/377 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mid-State Sandblasting" <plane(at)rtmc.net>
Subject: Re: Transporting an ultrastar.
Date: Feb 28, 2004
I think that it is best to remove the wings and put them on 3 inch foam rubber or a couple of old matrices, put the leading edge down, fasten each wing bottom side against the wall of your trailer, do not let your wing get close to the wall use foam rubber to prevent any rubbing. fasten the ailerons so that they do not flop around I used foam insulation (used to keep pipes from freezing) with very good results use roofing nails to hold the foam in place on the walls, this may seem like a lot of work just to move the plane home but it is a lot harder to fix moving damage, ask me how I know this, Fasten the main wheels to the floor with ratchet straps put the tail wheel on foam rubber and tie it down with bungee cords this will help insulate the tail wheel from road shock I used 3/4 inch plastic pipe on each side of the rudder to hold the stabilizer up against the rudder, bungee cords work good to keep the ends of the pipe tight. use foam rubber around your rear wings and rudder, you may have to remove your rear wings due to roof clearance but that is easy, check your bird after about ten miles retighten any thing that may have shifted, don't forget to check on it every now and then. this is mostly common since stuff, and only let your bird parts rub against foam that will not work lose. do not get in a rush take your time and you will bring home a undamaged ultrastar Randy ----- Original Message ----- From: "garvelink" <link(at)cdc.net> Subject: Kolb-List: Transporting an ultrastar. > > Thank goodness for this list. Now that I finally have figured it out. Great information. Now the question > > In a short time I am going to go pick up an ultrastar. I will trailor it back in an enclosed tralior. how can I protect the wings from damage on this long commute about 500 miles + -- will it ride in the retracted position ok. > > > Steve Garvelink > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 28, 2004
From: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy(at)lycos.com>
Subject: KISS (old thread)
Hey Guys, Now I remember what the subject was when I sent those pictures of my Pitot tube installation... I wrote something that tied it into the current thread, but it didn't get typed with the pictures... The subject of KISS came up...and well,... my pitot tube qualified.... Theirs gotta be a better way for me to get pictures thru..... maybe a "miscellaneous page" on my web site. Gotta Fly... Mike in MN --- My Web Site: http://www.geocities.com/planecrazzzy/Planecrazzzy.html Sometimes you just have to take the leap and build your wings on the way down... Gotta Fly... ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ZackGSD(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 28, 2004
Subject: Re: re: weight/balance question
In a message dated 2/28/2004 7:23:21 PM Central Standard Time, ActionCrane(at)aol.com writes: > Subj: Re: Kolb-List: re: weight/balance question > Date: 2/28/2004 7:23:21 PM Central Standard Time > From: ActionCrane(at)aol.com > Reply-to: kolb-list(at)matronics.com > To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com > Sent from the Internet > > > > > Thom, > If you weigh 210 you are probably right in the middle of the allowable > 20 to 37% CG for the early Firestar. > > Steve H > Firestar/377 Steve, I have been using the following formular to do the CG on my older )95) Kolb - 12.8 - 23.7 inches; which is off the plans from a friend of mine's 97 Firestar 11. His also calls for a 9 degree angle. Thom sent me an old W & B sheet for the early 90's Kolb and it says to use what you are recomending - 20 - 37%. My Kolb CG comes in at around 31" aft of the leading edge. Can some one please explain why the older Kolbs W $ B sheets use a %; while the newer ones gives it to you in inches. If my older Kolb comes in at 31 inches aft of the leading edge, is that within the allowable limits, it would appear so? Alan ________________________________________________________________________________
From: William George <wgeorge(at)mountainmeadowranch.com>
Subject: Re: Web Sites
Date: Feb 29, 2004
Big Lar is right. I visit DP Review daily. I use the Canon 10D, Pro Digital talk, Epson talk and Mac Tools forums. That covers my equipment and interests. To put up your photos try PBase or Photo.net. They let you put up quite a few for no charge or you can get lots of capacity for a small fee, $24 per year for my PBase account. It's easy to upload, edit and delete files. Here's my PBase: http://www.pbase.com/wgeorge Bill George Hawaii Kolb Mk-3 Verner 1400 Powerfin On Feb 28, 2004, at 9:56 PM, Kolb-List Digest Server wrote: > From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com> > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Web Sites > > > I re-named this for the new subject. Two thoughts, 1 for Mike: > I > don't know how GeoCities is setup, but with my provider (Homestead) I'm > allowed X number of separate websites for a given fee. (BTW, they're > about > to lose me, cause the fees are increasing dramatically, year by year, > and > now they've gotten TOO greedy) What I've done is create 2 websites for > temporary pics only, 1 of which (flyingpics.com) I haven't used much > yet, > and the other (tempics.com) which I've used quite a bit on another > forum. > It makes it simple - you publish the picture and whatever explanation > you > want, when you want it, and for as long as you want it. Works good ! > ! ! > 2nd thought, for Matt Dralle: The other forum that I'm active on (and > where > I use the tempics.com a lot) is the DPReview's Nikon Digital Camera > Forum. > (www.dpreview.com/forums , and scroll down to Nikon Talk) It is truly > international, and I've had dialog recently with people from Malaysia > to the > Sudan; Norway to Australia. What Fun ! ! !................but what I > REALLY like about it is that in a message you can enter a .jpg link to > a > picture, (such as: > http://www.tempics.homestead.com/files/J_Cr_Take_Off_2C.JPG ) and > it'll > open automatically with the message on the forum. I don't know if it's > financially feasible for Matt, but it sure is a nice feature. It's a > VERY > active forum, too. Lar. Do not > Archive. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jo and Larry" <joandlp(at)starband.net>
Subject: Tail wheel ?
Date: Feb 29, 2004
A couple of tail wheels questions please. 1. Could someone recommend a replacement for the factory wheel and 2. Does anyone have experience using a full swiveling tail wheel with the Kolb? How does it work? I guess that was 3 , huh? :) Thanks in advance, Larry --- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Re: Web Sites
Date: Feb 29, 2004
Very nice pics, Bill. I like the colors on that pheasant, #2715. I haven't been to Hawaii in over 30 years, and never saw that side of it. Sure would like to..........someday. (but the big diesel Dodge draws the line at the Pacific Ocean) :-) Lar. Do not Archive. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "William George" <wgeorge(at)mountainmeadowranch.com> Subject: Re: Re: Kolb-List: Web Sites > > Big Lar is right. I visit DP Review daily. I use the Canon 10D, Pro > Digital talk, Epson talk and Mac Tools forums. That covers my equipment ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Fackler, Ken" <kfackler(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: Another tailwheel question
Date: Feb 29, 2004
Can anyone recommend a source for a replacement of the tailwheel on the Mark II? -Ken Fackler Kolb Mark II / A722KWF Rochester MI ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Joe Allman" <fisherallman(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Tail wheel ?
Date: Feb 29, 2004
Larry and all, We use a full swivel on both a Slingshot and a Mark III Xtra. If my memory serves me I think they came from Matco. Setup works great on both. Joe -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jo and Larry Subject: Kolb-List: Tail wheel ? A couple of tail wheels questions please. 1. Could someone recommend a replacement for the factory wheel and 2. Does anyone have experience using a full swiveling tail wheel with the Kolb? How does it work? I guess that was 3 , huh? :) Thanks in advance, Larry --- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mhqqqqq(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 29, 2004
Subject: Re: Tail wheel ?
I went to true value hardware and got a wheel for a riding mower deck. it is tough and light weight. cost is about 3 bucks. it is wider than the factory wheel and leaves less of a mark in the grass (the place I fly from the owner did not like the track the narrow wheel left.) mark twinstar minnesota ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
Subject: Re: re: weight/balance question
Date: Feb 29, 2004
Thom, Snip>>>>then why is it so easy for me to nose over? In some wet field situations, .......>>>>Snip Your Cg is in relation to the overall balance of the plane Thom...not in relation to the wheels...the safe cg range(envelope) is determined by the wings center of lift..control suface influence/effectivness ..but where the wheels are have nothing to do with an engineer decideing what the fore an aft CG safe range is. You know however, that your airplane will nose over easily....that is because the wheels are very near the CG....think of it as balanced on a perch...a Kolbs wheels are so close to the cg it makes it kinda "tippy"...you dont want to change your CG..because as you said...your airplane flys well. You mentioned the solution..change the Wheels in relation to the cg. I cant think of why this would be a bad thing...and about all I can think of is a fella might need a sturdier tailwheel and strut back there... Raiseing the airplane with longer legs would also make it harder to get into. Now...If you decide to do this..I would consider that just moving the wheels forward would make the plane less "tippy"...and Lengthening the gear would do this yes..because they will move forward along that angle of the gear....but it also would change the angle of attack of the wing on take off roll...and this might lengthen your take off roll...due to the lower power engine...If you had a big engine...then it probably would not matter... John H explained to me one time his gear mods on his different planes...and how they effected them. And it made alot of sense once he made me understand...I didnt consider there were 2 things to think about. Don Gherardini FireFly 098 http://www.geocities.com/dagger369th/my_firefly.htm ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steven Green" <kolbdriver(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Tail wheel ?
Date: Feb 29, 2004
A couple of tail wheels questions please. 1. Could someone recommend a replacement for the factory wheel and 2. Does anyone have experience using a full swiveling tail wheel with the Kolb? How does it work? I guess that was 3 , huh? :) Thanks in advance, Larry Larry, Give TNK a call. Full swivel tail wheel is standard for the mark IIIs and maybe some other models. Steven ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Lloyd McFarlane" <lrmcf(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Weight & Balance
Date: Feb 29, 2004
Alan, I have a 1999/2000 FireStar II which gives both % and inches based on an average chord of 64". CG to be between 20%12.8" and 35%22.4". My dry weight with 503 DC/DI, brakes and chute is 418 lbs. Lots of paint! I had to put my battery in the nose cone to stay in ahead of the aft CG limit. If your model is anything like mine and your 31" is correct, looks like you have a real problem with a tail heavy aircraft. Lloyd McFarlane Fullerton, CA I have been using the following formular to do the CG on my older )95) Kolb - 12.8 - 23.7 inches; which is off the plans from a friend of mine's 97 Firestar 11. His also calls for a 9 degree angle. Thom sent me an old W & B sheet for the early 90's Kolb and it says to use what you are recomending - 20 - 37%. My Kolb CG comes in at around 31" aft of the leading edge. Can some one please explain why the older Kolbs W $ B sheets use a %; while the newer ones gives it to you in inches. If my older Kolb comes in at 31 inches aft of the leading edge, is that within the allowable limits, it would appear so? Alan ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: heavy tail
Date: Feb 29, 2004
| Consider me in the group who want a little taller main gear leg on | my MkIII. -BB Hi Bob/Gang: The angle is too flat for long legs on the MK III. On the Original Firestar, the angle was just right for 35.5" legs shoved all the way in the socket until it bottomed out. Forget how much leg was sticking out of the socket, but I can go downstairs and measure my last set of legs from my old FS. OK, had 24" of leg sticking out and 11.5" inside the socket. Put the Original FS in a perfect, for me, 3 pt stance for landing and taking off. Helped slow me down landing on my short strip without brakes (not installed). Wanted to land 3 pt, and it did do nice ones, stalling right on the money a few inches off the sod. Did not change ground handling, that I could tell. The MK III was a different story. Having become accustomed to flying the old Factory MKIII, my new MK III and displaced main gear proved to be quite exciting until I became accustomed to them. There are still times my gear tend to get the interest factor going. She will ground loop, if you get behind her. With about 100 lbs on the tail wheel, that is a lot of weight way back there on the end of the tail boom. When it starts to swing and you haven't already done something about it, it is too late. With the new mounts and mount location on the MK III, the gear legs overall length is 24". They are made of the same size material that was used on the Fire Star (Original). Without good differential braking, my airplane would not be a fun airplane to fly. Is that characteristic worse than the tendancy to get up on its nose without much provocation? Heck no. I had much rather have "a real tail dragger" than have one that had to have a training wheel under the nose. Just kidding about the training wheel guys. Still don't want one on my airplane. To me, it is an advertisement that my airplane is prone to stand on its nose. I needed an airplane that would get me in and out of rough, tough, soft, sloppy stuff without going up on its nose and possibly on its back. Again, I emphasize, that is the kind of airplane I need and that is the way I have mine configured. It has proven it can do the job. The above is what I did to my airplane to make it suit me better. I am not advertising, encouraging, recommending, or otherwise, that anyone else do the same thing to their airplane. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ZackGSD(at)aol.com
Date: Feb 29, 2004
Subject: Re: re: weight/balance question
> Subj: Re: Kolb-List: Re: re: weight/balance question > Date: 2/29/2004 6:09:56 PM Central Standard Time > From: donghe@one-eleven.net > Reply-to: kolb-list(at)matronics.com > To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com > Sent from the Internet > Thom/John and guys, First, thanks to all of you who offered up all the advice to the newbie here; it was greatly appreciated. I went back out today & went through all the math again & found I had added my weight in as a positve & not a negative. After i corrected that, I came in at 36%; which is right in under the allowable 37% on the older Kolbs. I only weigh 148 lbs. But, the way I understand it, when my rear stock 5 gal tank gets lower, the CG will begin to move forward and help some. Any thoughts on leaving it as is; or adding a 1 inch steel plate to fit under my feet where the floor is now? that would add about 8 lbs. Alan 95 Firestar 1 N. Richland Hills, TX > > > > Thom, > > Snip>>>>then why is it so easy for me to nose over? In some wet field > situations, .......>>>>Snip > > Your Cg is in relation to the overall balance of the plane Thom...not in > relation to the wheels...the safe cg range(envelope) is determined by the > wings center of lift..control suface influence/effectivness ..but where the > wheels are have nothing to do with an engineer decideing what the fore an > aft CG safe range is. > You know however, that your airplane will nose over easily....that is > because the wheels are very near the CG....think of it as balanced on a > perch...a Kolbs wheels are so close to the cg it makes it kinda > "tippy"...you dont want to change your CG..because as you said...your > airplane flys well. > > You mentioned the solution..change the Wheels in relation to the cg. I cant > think of why this would be a bad thing...and about all I can think of is a > fella might need a sturdier tailwheel and strut back there... > > Raiseing the airplane with longer legs would also make it harder to get > into. > > Now...If you decide to do this..I would consider that just moving the wheels > forward would make the plane less "tippy"...and > Lengthening the gear would do this yes..because they will move forward along > that angle of the gear....but it also would change the angle of attack of > the wing on take off roll...and this might lengthen your take off roll...due > to the lower power engine...If you had a big engine...then it probably would > not matter... > John H explained to me one time his gear mods on his different planes...and > how they effected them. And it made alot of sense once he made me > understand...I didnt consider there were 2 things to think about. > > Don Gherardini > FireFly 098 > http://www.geocities.com/dagger369th/my_firefly.htm ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "momweyland" <momweyland(at)cox.net>
Subject: Firestar II wing tail vs.Orig. Firestar wing tail
Date: Mar 01, 2004
Hi,I'm new to this list,but will admit that I've been lurking in these shadows of Kolb Knowledge for a couple of months now.Thanks for the wealth of information I've already harvested.I need to know if a Firestar II wing and tail kit is compatible with the 91 KXP fuselage cage? Thanks,Hank Weyland ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
Subject: Re: A Few Ancient Pics
Date: Mar 01, 2004
John.. I dunno pard...thems awful old parts!...15 to 20 years old huh? hmmm... although I would like sumpthin better than these azuza's I have on my Fly. I dont need the legs..(I got training wheel!)...so sell them to that SouthCarolina Polecat Green!. hehe :)......and lemme know what you want for the Old wheels brakes and axles sockets.M/Cyls....tires too if ya got em. MAybe Sue will give me an advance on my allowance! Don Gherardini Sales / Engineering dept. American Honda Engines Power Equipment Company CortLand, Illinois 800-626-7326 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "H MITCHELL" <mitchmnd(at)msn.com>
Subject: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale.
Date: Mar 01, 2004
Greetings Kolbers, My wife say's one plane is enough so I'm going to sell the FireFly and start flying my recently completed Mk3/912. Any of you that are ready to buy should consider my FireFly. She is a well-behaved flyer that has served me well for ~160 hours. The last 5 hours have been logged over the beaches waters along Florida's Gulf Coast. When she is not in the air she has always been hangared or snug in her fully-enclosed lightweight trailer. She is still a good looker in spite of her age. This was my third Kolb and when the plane was first completed I had it weighed on a commercial scale. I have a ticket showing it weighed a little under 250 lbs. Bigger wheels and full enclosure have probably put her over the limit now but I saved all of the original parts and she could be stripped back to original if required. BRS Chute, Alt, ASI, dual CHT, dual EGT, Hobbs, Enclosed Trailer, 8" wheels ('still have those dinky Kolb wheels complete with the band brakes I made for them), Completed in 1999. The trailer was designed to be towed by a small Nissan pick-up but with my Ford 150 I keep forgetting it is back there. It was built by a commercial builder that makes specialty trailers and it is ready to go. The whole rig, ready for Springtime flying: $12,500. Duane the plane Mitchell, Tallahassee, FL (850) 878-9047 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 01, 2004
Subject: C&G
From: kinnepix <kinnepix(at)earthlink.net>
Just an interesting observation in re CG and position of gear -- You may see or have seen a LUSCOMBE, nice little aluminum 2-seater, side-by-side, taildragger. Look closely at the main gear -- the plane originally wanted to nose over, and most every one by now has had a strong plate installed, that moved the mains forward by that amount. So even the factory design wasn't right -- but at least easily corrected in this case. Look at the top of the rudder -- if it's squared off the aircraft was probably over on its back at some time. Most of them were. The further back the main gear was, the less likely the plane was to groundloop -- but the more likely it was to nose over. Same for any taildragger. Russ Kinne ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
Subject: Re: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale.
Date: Mar 01, 2004
Duane the plane.... Dang bro...I think you are keeping the wrong one!!!!...LOL..:) seriously...if who ever gets you fine airplane doesnt want the trailer...or you would split em up. I would be very interested in seeing it...for possible purchase thx.and good luck Don Gherardini Sales / Engineering dept. American Honda Engines Power Equipment Company CortLand, Illinois 800-626-7326 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "bryan green" <lgreen1(at)sc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: A Few Ancient Pics
Date: Mar 01, 2004
That deal might work out Don and if ya bend your legs let me know I'll have a pair of almost new Firefly legs for ya. Yep there still straight. DO NOT ARCHIVE p.s. Send me a pic when you get the tank installed. Bryan Green (Elgin SC) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: A Few Ancient Pics > > John.. > > I dunno pard...thems awful old parts!...15 to 20 years old huh? hmmm... > although I would like sumpthin better than these azuza's I have on my Fly. > I dont need the legs..(I got training wheel!)...so sell them to that > SouthCarolina Polecat Green!. hehe :)......and lemme know what you want > for the Old wheels brakes and axles sockets.M/Cyls....tires too if ya got > em. > MAybe Sue will give me an advance on my allowance! > > Don Gherardini > Sales / Engineering dept. > American Honda Engines > Power Equipment Company > CortLand, Illinois > 800-626-7326 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "H MITCHELL" <mitchmnd(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale.
Date: Mar 01, 2004
Hello Don, 'Great to hear from you. I read all your posts, especially the inside dope from your manufacturer's Rep. point of view. I have a potential buyer but he has to sell his new 503 before he can move on it. It will be no problem for me to ask any potential buyer if he would part with the trailer. I designed this trailer specifically for the FireFly and had it built by a local specialty trailer fabricator. I did not do any stress analysis on it because the builders experience was a lot more current than my training in that area. I still have copies of the drawings and performance specs. The documentation is only 3 pages and I will send you a full set if you would like. The trailer materials and labor cost was ~ $3,600. Keep your air speed, Duane the plane Mitchell, Tallahassee, FL (850) 878-9047 ----- Original Message ----- From: Don Gherardini To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 10:41 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale. Duane the plane.... Dang bro...I think you are keeping the wrong one!!!!...LOL..:) seriously...if who ever gets you fine airplane doesnt want the trailer...or you would split em up. I would be very interested in seeing it...for possible purchase thx.and good luck Don Gherardini Sales / Engineering dept. American Honda Engines Power Equipment Company CortLand, Illinois 800-626-7326 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
Subject: Re: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale.
Date: Mar 01, 2004
Duane..Hot dang pard...I would be deeply in your debt if you would send me what info you have on a trailer. I have been looking at trailers for a long time now...and I have not found a single one made (factory) like I want it...it seems that when you get an enclosed trailer long enough to haul an airplane...it is built to haul a bulldozer! they are all just too dang heavy built with heavy axles. I have alot of expierience hauling around new demo equipment in my carreer, and I know how hard those road miles are on trailer'd equuipment.. If you can email it..send it to donghe@one-eleven.net if you need to mail.. Don Gherardini R.R.#3 box 325A Sullivan, Illinois 61951 thx pard! Don Gherardini Sales / Engineering dept. American Honda Engines Power Equipment Company CortLand, Illinois 800-626-7326 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
Subject: Re: A Few Ancient Pics
Date: Mar 01, 2004
RgR tht Bryan.... so far..the tank has just been sitting in there to see how it fits...I have the boom out if the cage and the cage stripped..covering and all...to do some welding on...need tabs and tubing installed for the upper rear enclosure...and I am close to finished on those. I had it covered with a old bedsheet last nite to see how it all was going to workout...and discovered a spot that needed another peice of tubing to attach to covering to. Underside wing gap root fairings are gonna be integrated into the cage...and of a tube and fabric design. I got the wing gap cover finished up complete with cam-locs to hold it down in the rear.. working on a side door to facilitate refueling. All in all....the thinking part sure takes longer than the doing part! I will send ya pics as soon as I get that tank in.....gotta go on the road for a few days tomorrow morn..try an scrape out a living...hopefully get back to the Fly on the weekend! Don Gherardini OEM Sales / Engineering dept. American Honda Engines Power Equipment Company CortLand, Illinois 800-626-7326 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
Subject: Re: Lousy Brakes
Date: Mar 01, 2004
Duane, were they those Azsua jobs?.... I am on my second set of drums....trying to find some that fit better...If I can get something better like the Hegars...that whole mess will go into that big box under the bench! Don Gherardini OEM.Sales / Engineering dept. American Honda Engines Power Equipment Company CortLand, Illinois 800-626-7326 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba(at)wtxs.net>
Subject: Re: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale.
Date: Mar 01, 2004
me too!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale. > > Duane..Hot dang pard...I would be deeply in your debt if you would send me > what info you have on a trailer. > I have been looking at trailers for a long time now...and I have not found a > single one made (factory) like I want it...it seems that when you get an > enclosed trailer long enough to haul an airplane...it is built to haul a > bulldozer! they are all just too dang heavy built with heavy axles. I have > alot of expierience hauling around new demo equipment in my carreer, and I > know how hard those road miles are on trailer'd equuipment.. > > If you can email it..send it to > > donghe@one-eleven.net > > > if you need to mail.. > > Don Gherardini > R.R.#3 box 325A > Sullivan, Illinois > 61951 > > thx pard! > > > Don Gherardini > Sales / Engineering dept. > American Honda Engines > Power Equipment Company > CortLand, Illinois > 800-626-7326 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "H MITCHELL" <mitchmnd(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Lousy Brakes
Date: Mar 01, 2004
Hello Don, I think they were Azusa's, stamped out by the thousands in China, once used for go-carts. A couple of years ago one of my pals called and complained to one of the Azusa engineers. He went out to the work area and picked out some choice ones and sent them along to my pal. They were much better. ----- Original Message ----- From: Don Gherardini To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 12:48 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Lousy Brakes Duane, were they those Azsua jobs?.... I am on my second set of drums....trying to find some that fit better...If I can get something better like the Hegars...that whole mess will go into that big box under the bench! Don Gherardini OEM.Sales / Engineering dept. American Honda Engines Power Equipment Company CortLand, Illinois 800-626-7326 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Souder" <flykolb(at)pa.net>
Subject: Re: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale.
Date: Mar 01, 2004
Duane, Way back when .... I called a number of trailer manufacturers in an attempt to get them to make a lighter trailer for our application. No luck; their basic reasoning is that they know that if they make a trailer with, say a 1000 lb payload capacity, that the trailer will soon get used for another application and it will get overloaded and something will break and then they will get complaints about the trailer not being strong enough. A trailer large enough to house an ultralight is a relatively large trailer and just filling it with furniture, for instance, could easily overload it. Old Kolb made some custom enclosed trailers and these cost more to make than the manufactured trailers, even though they were much lighter, used lighter axles and etc. So the economics were not working in our favor doing that either. It appears making your own is about your only option unless you are lucky and Richard Swiderski is selling his at the same time your are looking for one. Or you could pay a small machine shop to custom make one for you, but it will be pricey! Happy hunting, Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale. > > Duane..Hot dang pard...I would be deeply in your debt if you would send me > what info you have on a trailer. > I have been looking at trailers for a long time now...and I have not found a > single one made (factory) like I want it...it seems that when you get an > enclosed trailer long enough to haul an airplane...it is built to haul a > bulldozer! they are all just too dang heavy built with heavy axles. I have > alot of expierience hauling around new demo equipment in my carreer, and I > know how hard those road miles are on trailer'd equuipment.. > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Souder" <flykolb(at)pa.net>
Subject: Re: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale.
Date: Mar 01, 2004
Oops meant to address this message to Don, and .... of course the rest of the Kolbers interested in lightweight trailers. Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Souder" <flykolb(at)pa.net> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale. > Duane, > > Way back when .... I called a number of trailer manufacturers in an attempt > to get them to make a lighter trailer for our application. No luck; their > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jon Croke" <jon(at)joncroke.com>
Subject: Re: FireFly with trailer for sale.
Date: Mar 01, 2004
On the front page of www.KolbPilot.com is a pic of my Firestar trailer...its custom built by another builder but is really light and well constructed.... just some more ideas for your trailer search! > > Dennis, > Any place you know of where there are pics or drawings or any info on the > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Doug Lawton" <skyrider2(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List Digest: 29 Msgs - 03/01/04
Date: Mar 02, 2004
Don, Of course, if you want "new axles" Northern tool has a good selection and you'll find some of them here: http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CategoryDisplay?storeId=6970&langId=-1&catalogId=4006970&PHOTOS=on&TEST=Y&categoryId=166843 They also have fenders, springs, hardware and other additional parts & pieces that you'll need. They don't seem to be too expensive. Fly Safely, Doug Lawton NE Georgia & Whitwell TN Don wrote: need to find a couple of matching axles...hmm.... Don Gherardini FireFly 098 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Re: FireFly with trailer for sale.
Date: Mar 02, 2004
Huh ! ! !..............thank you, Jon........you jogged my alleged brain a bit. I don't have plans for it, but my trailer was built by John Wood for a FireStar, and is light, strong, and tows well. Several pictures of it at http://www.biglar.homestead.com/landing.html . If you like, more pics are easily taken and published. Let me know. Lar. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jon Croke" <jon(at)joncroke.com> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: FireFly with trailer for sale. > > On the front page of www.KolbPilot.com is a pic of my Firestar > trailer...its custom built by another builder but is really light and well > constructed.... just some more ideas for your trailer search! > <donghe@one-eleven.net> > > > > Dennis, > > Any place you know of where there are pics or drawings or any info on the > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "bryan green" <lgreen1(at)sc.rr.com>
Subject: stick
Date: Mar 02, 2004
Can anyone see a problem with me shorting the control stick a couple inches on my plane? Bryan Green Elgin SC Firestar I 19LBG 377 BRS ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 02, 2004
From: "johnjung(at)compusenior.com" <johnjung(at)compusenior.com>
Subject: Enclosed trailers for Kolbs
To those interested in trailers, Here are a few of my thoughts on enclosed trailers to carry your Kolb: Light is not always better. Even light trailers are not easy to tow, when they are over 20' long and over 6' high. Plus light trailers are easily turned over by the wind. If you Kolb happens to be stored in the trailer when it is turned over, it is likely to be damaged. In my opinion a light trailer may very well need to be tied down when stored. Heavy trailers on torsion axles can give the plane a softer ride than a light trailer on any kind of axle. My enclosed trailer is heavy (2,000 lbs), and I don't like the cost of operating it's tow vehicle, but I don't see a light trailer as a real option, either. After I get a hanger here in the Phoenix area, I plan to sell the trailer and the tow truck. John Jung ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Rotax 912 Voltage Regulator
Date: Mar 02, 2004
| What I would like to know is if anyone has a spare they would | be willing to part with. Looks like new ones sell for 150 bucks. Please | contact me off list if you can help. | John Cooley John C/All: Looks like you screwed up. :-) hehehe The reason I can say that is because I understand where you are. I have been the same place. I never got the new 912 off the ground with the original voltage reg/rec. I wired it wrong and it would not work. Rewired it wrong and still would not work. Wired it wrong another way and it worked. Shut down my brand new 912, went in the house and called Bro Jim in Woodville, FL. Told him I had finally figured out what I was doing wrong with the reg/rec and it was working like a champ. About that time I smelled an electrical fire. Looked out the door and my brand new 912 and MK III were on fire. I was short on time and money to get to Alaska. Decided I would try the old Timpanian reg/rec from the 582. Ah!!! it worked. Got me on that long flight and several years thereafter. The alternator never was up to snuff in the performance department, but since I had no experience with the system, I figured everything was ok. When the Timpanian went belly up, replaced it twice with the Key West reg/rec. Blew them up in a matter of hours. Finally, bit the bullet, called Ronnie Smith, South Mississippi Light Aircraft, ordered a 912 reg/rec. Was amazed at how well the alternator performed. I had been severly limiting the output of the alternator by not using the correct reg/rec. My point is, no matter what, get the correct 912 voltage regulator/rectifier and take not short cuts. No matter what it cost. No, I don't have a spare. If I did, I would be like that guy up in Canada. Keep it! :-) Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Kolbra/Slingshot???
Date: Mar 02, 2004
| What's the difference between a Kolbra and a Slingshot? Kirk Kirk/All: It's all in the name. hehehe Well, about 8' of wing span and I forget how much tailboom difference. Can't remember if it uses a slightly different wing rib or not. I think that is the primary differences, along with probably a small cockpit on the Sling Shot. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Fackler, Ken" <kfackler(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: Rotax 503 value
Date: Mar 02, 2004
Fellow Kolbers: My Mark II is getting a new engine. I'm upgrading from points-based single ignition to Ducati-based dual ignition and adding a fuel injector. Consequently, I'll have a 503 block and heads for sale shortly. Any thoughts on what it might be worth? -Ken Fackler Kolb Mark II / A722KWF Rochester MI ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "flykolb" <flykolb(at)carolina.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Rotax 503 value
Date: Mar 02, 2004
Ken, In the Jan 04 issue of Experimenter magazine (which I was just reading today), the issue of converting a 503 SI to a dual was addressed. The answer from Phil Lookwood was "the old single-ignition Rotax aircraft engines cannot be economically converted to the current dual ignition system. That would require replacement of the cylinder heads, crankshaft, flywheel, ignition stator...and purchase of the two external ignition modules and trigger coils...more economical to sell that engine and buy a new one..." Jim Mark III 532 SIDC ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fackler, Ken" <kfackler(at)ameritech.net> Subject: Kolb-List: Rotax 503 value > > Fellow Kolbers: > > My Mark II is getting a new engine. I'm upgrading from points-based single > ignition to Ducati-based dual ignition and adding a fuel injector. > Consequently, I'll have a 503 block and heads for sale shortly. Any thoughts > on what it might be worth? > > -Ken Fackler > Kolb Mark II / A722KWF > Rochester MI > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Re: stick
Date: Mar 02, 2004
It'll work OK, depending on How Much you shorten it, but the effort to move the controls will increase, since you'll have a shorter lever arm to move them with. Lar. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "bryan green" <lgreen1(at)sc.rr.com> Subject: Kolb-List: stick > > Can anyone see a problem with me shorting the control stick a couple inches on my plane? > Bryan Green Elgin SC > Firestar I 19LBG 377 BRS > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "bryan green" <lgreen1(at)sc.rr.com>
Subject: spark plugs
Date: Mar 02, 2004
Your right about the insulator Paul along with the nose length and gas area around the electrode and type of material the plug controls heat transfer from the cylinder. The spark plug starts the fire than acts as a heat exchanger to keep the temps right. Bryan Green Elgin SC Firestar I 19LBG 377 BRS ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "bryan green" <lgreen1(at)sc.rr.com>
Subject: Spark plugs
Date: Mar 02, 2004
Here is a good link on plugs. http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/techinfo/spark_plugs/techtips.asp?nav31000&countryUS Bryan Green Elgin SC Firestar I 19LBG 377 BRS ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba(at)wtxs.net>
Subject: Re: FireFly with trailer for sale.
Date: Mar 02, 2004
works here larry!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: FireFly with trailer for sale. > > Hmmm............I don't know what to say. I just clicked on it, and it ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steven Green" <kolbdriver(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: spark plugs
Date: Mar 02, 2004
Don G. All, I have sold auto parts for some 24 years now and have never really understood what a "Heat range" of a spark plug does in the combustion chamber. I have always had and still have customers asking for "Hotter" spark plugs and the spark plug books explain the different "Heat Ranges" and what the number stands for but explain nothing about what's actually going on in there. Care to educate us? pp Paul, I'm not Don nor do I pretend to have the knowledge about engines that he and all the others have, but I will take a stab at your question. The heat range of a plug is more about how hot the tip or center electrode is allowed to get. The heat is provided by the combustion inside the cylinder. The length or distance that heat has to travel from the electrode tip to a heat sink (the body of the plug and ultimately the head) is what determines how hot the tip is allowed to get. If you look at two plugs that are the series but different heat ranges you will see that the insulator will be longer and maybe slimmer on the "hotter" plug. A "colder" plug will have a shorter path from the tip to the body of the plug. The reason for different heat ranges is to maintain the best temperature of the electrode and insulator in order to keep "stuff" burned off. Too cold of a plug and it will foul easily. Too hot and your engine will suffer from pre-ignition (the fuel mixture being ignited by the glowing electrode) Steven Green ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Fackler, Ken" <kfackler(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: Re: Rotax 503 value
Date: Mar 02, 2004
Thanks for the info, Jim. BUT, the "buy a new one" is exactly what I'm doing. That's why I will have a single-ignition block for sale. :-) -Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: "flykolb" <flykolb(at)carolina.rr.com> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Rotax 503 value > > Ken, > > In the Jan 04 issue of Experimenter magazine (which I was just reading > today), the issue of converting a 503 SI to a dual was addressed. The answer > from Phil Lookwood was "the old single-ignition Rotax aircraft engines > cannot be economically converted to the current dual ignition system. That > would require replacement of the cylinder heads, crankshaft, flywheel, > ignition stator...and purchase of the two external ignition modules and > trigger coils...more economical to sell that engine and buy a new one..." > > Jim > Mark III > 532 SIDC > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Fackler, Ken" <kfackler(at)ameritech.net> > To: > Subject: Kolb-List: Rotax 503 value > > > > > > Fellow Kolbers: > > > > My Mark II is getting a new engine. I'm upgrading from points-based single > > ignition to Ducati-based dual ignition and adding a fuel injector. > > Consequently, I'll have a 503 block and heads for sale shortly. Any > thoughts > > on what it might be worth? > > > > -Ken Fackler > > Kolb Mark II / A722KWF > > Rochester MI > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clay Stuart" <tcstuart(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: UL Flying Magazine
Date: Mar 02, 2004
If you want to order the magazine with the Mark IIIXtra on the cover you can go here: http://www.ulflyingmag.com/catalog/customer/home.php?cat=252 It is the March 2004 issue that will cost you $8. Bill Vincent said it would be worth having especially to those building or owner the Xtra. Clay Stuart ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "garvelink" <link(at)cdc.net>
Subject: Re: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale.
Date: Mar 02, 2004
what do you want for the trailor and do you have any pictures? Srglink ----- Original Message ----- From: "H MITCHELL" <mitchmnd(at)msn.com> Subject: Kolb-List: FireFly with enclosed trailer for sale. > > Greetings Kolbers, > > My wife say's one plane is enough so I'm going to sell the FireFly and start flying my recently completed Mk3/912. > > Any of you that are ready to buy should consider my FireFly. She is a well-behaved flyer that has served me well for ~160 hours. The last 5 hours have been logged over the beaches waters along Florida's Gulf Coast. When she is not in the air she has always been hangared or snug in her fully-enclosed lightweight trailer. She is still a good looker in spite of her age. > > This was my third Kolb and when the plane was first completed I had it weighed on a commercial scale. I have a ticket showing it weighed a little under 250 lbs. Bigger wheels and full enclosure have probably put her over the limit now but I saved all of the original parts and she could be stripped back to original if required. > > BRS Chute, > Alt, ASI, dual CHT, dual EGT, Hobbs, > Enclosed Trailer, > 8" wheels ('still have those dinky Kolb wheels complete with the band brakes I made for them), > Completed in 1999. > > The trailer was designed to be towed by a small Nissan pick-up but with my Ford 150 I keep forgetting it is back there. It was built by a commercial builder that makes specialty trailers and it is ready to go. > > > The whole rig, ready for Springtime flying: $12,500. > > Duane the plane Mitchell, Tallahassee, FL (850) 878-9047 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2004
From: possums <possums(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Final Flight Firestar 1990
I think that's what Aubrey's wing did. The front/leading edge folded back over the main/center spar and the wing failed. Hence the use of the alum angles in mine. Of course he was flying the five rib wing, way over grossed, doing loops, hammerheads, spins and no telling what else when it happened - at an air show. Had a second chance chute with a nylon strap instead of the kevlar ones we use today. Might not have mattered anyway - heard he must have been going 120 mph straight down when he finally pulled it and the chute cut loose. He would tear a Firestar up and just buy another one. Don't think he ever built one himself. Used to be our "Head Possum" but he would never admit to being one. >I am slowly getting a little be smarter in my old age. > >Discovered I can capture frames off the old VHS tape of the "wing >pulling" of my Firestar. Go through these files in order to see the >loop, then keep going and see the results of many, many loops, hours, >heavy loads, sub-warp speeds, and lots of rough air: > >http://home.elmore.rr.com/jhauck/Firestar%20Crash/ > >I appoligize for the size and quality of the pics, but the best I can >do for the moment. Perhaps I will get even more enlightened before I >become totally useless to humanity. > >john h ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2004
From: "Wayne F.Wilson" <wfwilson1(at)yahoo.ca>
Subject: Kolbra/Slingshot???
Kirk/All The Slingshot has 2 seats the back being a jump seat similar to the Firestar11. It only has one set of controls which makes it smaller than the Kolbra Here are some specs form TN Kolb flyers Mark3C Kolbra Slingshot Wingspan 30 ft 28ft 4 in 22 ft Wing Area 160 sq ft 154 sq ft 110 sq ft Length 22ft 6in 24 ft 19 ft except for the height the Slingshot has similar wingspan and length to the Firefly. SS is sometimes referred to as Firefly on Steroids Hope this helps Wayne F Wilson SS #009 wfwilson1(at)yahoo.ca Windsor ON ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 03, 2004
From: Jimmy <jhankin(at)planters.net>
Subject: Radio Control
Paul, I have been flying radio control for 35 years and do still fly them. Jimmy Hankinson 912-863-7384 Rocky Ford, Ga. 30455 jhankin(at)planters.net Kolb Firefly/447/240hrs Local field, Pegasus/2000/Grass Airport JYL/Sylvania, Ga. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Cuz'n P'fer's Wing Failure
Date: Mar 03, 2004
Hi All: Notice subject changed. Now that I have scared hell out of a lot of you all, I would like to clear up a few things. Number 1: I know of two wing failures of the type I experienced on my Firestar. Mine and Aubrey Radford's. I was fortunate and Aubrey was not. He knew of my wing failure, which happened about two months prior to his death. He knew how I flew and that did not change his manner of flying. Number 2: I do not see this type of failure happening to a good, serviceable wing that has not been damaged, has all the important lateral leading edge bracing, a strong aluminum nose on the inboard rib. Number 3: I feel it extremely prudent to do at least an annual inspection of the inside of each wing panel to insure you have everything your are supposed to have inside, and that all those things are attached as prescribed in the contruction manuals. This goes for all the 5 rib main wings on the Ultrastar and the Firestar. Number 4: Flown as prescribed in the design envelope of the aircraft, the wing should last for a very long time. A lot of things can contribute to weakening the wings not counting "flying fast, hard, and heavy". If mud daubers can get into the inside of the wing section, the residue they leave behind is corrosive to aluminum. Last time I opened up the ailerons and flaps on my MK III during repair and revcovering of the left wing, dirt daubers had gotten into both control surfaces through the drain holes, built nest. Everything that drained out of those nests flowed downhill and collected on the trailing edge and tails of the flap and aileron ribs. Where this smelly goop was located was extensive corrosion. Number 5: Lateral bracing can be broken by vibration during flight, mishandling on the ground, catching a wingtip on the ground as the result of a less than level landing or bending and/or breaking a landing gear leg. To check the inside of a wing that does not have inspection plates installed, cut a couple small slits in the inboard rib fabric. One to look through and one to shine your flashlight through. Should be able to get a good look at all bracing and other important parts in the wing. The 5/16" aluminum tube lateral bracing in the older Kolbs is prone to breaking at the point they are bent to marry up with the main spar and the leading edge tube. Length of time in service of these braces is dependent, to a degree, on how well the builder made these bends. Would I fly a 5 rib wing without additional reinforcing of the ribs? Yes, and I have many times since I lost my Firestar. There are a lot of them still out there flying after many years. Check'em out and fly safe. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Cuz'n P'fer's Wing Failure
Date: Mar 03, 2004
Gang: Forgot to mention, after cutting a couple small inspection slits in the inboard wing fabric, a couple small pieces of black electrical tape will do an excellent job of sealing these holes. How do I know, I have them on the right wing of my MKIII. Up until a couple years ago, prior to recovering the left wing, it also had a couple pieces of black electrical tape covering inspection slits. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "momweyland" <momweyland(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: Cuz'n P'fer's Wing Failure
Date: Mar 03, 2004
Hi John,Didn't seem to get a response on the Kolb Archive.Could you tell me if a Firestar II wing and tail kit would work on a 91 KXP fuse cage.Thanks,Hank ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Cuz'n P'fer's Wing Failure > > Gang: > > Forgot to mention, after cutting a couple small inspection slits in > the inboard wing fabric, a couple small pieces of black electrical > tape will do an excellent job of sealing these holes. How do I know, > I have them on the right wing of my MKIII. Up until a couple years > ago, prior to recovering the left wing, it also had a couple pieces of > black electrical tape covering inspection slits. > > Take care, > > john h > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Master Switch and fuel pumps
Date: Mar 03, 2004
From: "Jason Omelchuck" <jason(at)acuityinc.com>
I am setting up my BMW engine which has no mechanical fuel pump so I am using dual electrical pumps. If I have a solenoid powered master and I put them through it, the engine would die if the solenoid failed. Not putting the fuel pumps through the master seems to defeat the purpose of the master. Should I install a mechanical master and run everything through it? Once a mechanical switch is turned on, what are the chances of it failing? Jason Omelchuck MK III Portland OR ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "garvelink" <link(at)cdc.net>
Subject: Re: Radio Control
Date: Mar 03, 2004
I also fly RC have for 20 years or better Just recently got an ele-bee from cliff whitney of atlanta hobby it is the most fun I have had it is an electric wing and is the most agile and fun areobatic aircraft I have flown loops rolls fly upside down. I can put some photos up if you would like. this plane is made of epp foam and is almost indistructable. I ran into a roof tonight and picked the plane up and threw it and flew it for 10 more minutes. Steve Garvelink ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jimmy" <jhankin(at)planters.net> Subject: Kolb-List: Radio Control > > Paul, I have been flying radio control for 35 years and do still fly them. > > Jimmy Hankinson > 912-863-7384 > Rocky Ford, Ga. 30455 > jhankin(at)planters.net > Kolb Firefly/447/240hrs > Local field, Pegasus/2000/Grass > Airport JYL/Sylvania, Ga. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clay Stuart" <tcstuart(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: aluminum skin
Date: Mar 03, 2004
I was wondering about covering my Xtra fuselage with 0.020 aluminum. By my calculations it would be 37 square feet, adding just over 10 pounds versus fabric. What do you think? Advantages: . - It can be painted before attaching. Since my frame is powder coated, it would greatly simplify finishing by not having to mask and paint. - Possibly easier to repair by replacing damaged panel Disadvantages: - Added weight, but probably not significant since I plan on the 912S engine. - More strength to intrusions in case of accident - May weaken the longerons to drill rivet holes, but maybe the metal skin would provide more overall strength Questions: - would you use 6061T6 0.020 skin? - would the metal be much noisier and need sounproofing which would add additional weight? - would there be drumming of the thin metal and, if so, would additional stringers be needed? - do you think that the additional rivet holes would be a problem with loss of strength or will the metal skin compensate I think I have become fairly adept at metal working, making my fuel tanks, rear enclosure windows and fuel doors http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/tcstuart@adelphia.net.02.28.2004/airplane_005.jpg Thanks for your input Clay Stuart ________________________________________________________________________________
From: dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle)
Date: Mar 03, 2004
DNA: not not archive
Subject: [PLEASE READ] Virus Laden Spam Purports To Be From Matronics...
Dear Listers, First let me say that I normally don't condone the sharing of warnings about Internet viruses on the Matronics Email Lists. I don't want to start a storm of discussion regarding computer viruses on the Lists, so please just note the information below and refrain from commenting to the List. The circumstances I describe below are disturbing enough that I felt an explanation is necessary. That being said... There is a new email-bourne virus running rampant on the Internet that is cleverly disguising itself as legitimate email warning of such things as: "your email account is disabled because of unauthorized access" "Some of our clients complained about the spam (negative e-mail content) outgoing from your e-mail account" "Probably, you have been infected by a proxy-relay trojan server. In order to keep your computer safe, follow the instructions." "Our main mailing server will be temporary unavailable for next two days, to continue receiving mail in these days you have to configure our free auto-forwarding service." All of these messages include an attachment that you are instructed to click upon to "Get more information", "clean the virus from your system", or "check your system for infections". These enclosures all contain a virus that will infect your system and propagate even more copies of the original message. The disturbing part of these messages is that they appear to be coming from very legitimate addresses and have very legitimate, convincing dialog. For example, I have received a number of them today that appear to be from "support(at)matronics.com", "management(at)matronics.com", "administration(at)matronics.com", and "staff(at)matronics.com". The text of the messages seems believable enough, and given the forged source address, seem even more legitimate. Please be assured that no one at Matronics.com will be sending you these kinds of messages. If you receive one, it is a spam/virus that has forged headers and was sent to you from someone other than Matronics. Delete the message and the attachment promptly. Invest in a copy of Norton Antivirus and keep the definitions up dated on a daily basis. Again, I want to stress that I *DO NOT* want a big discussion of viruses on the Matronics Email Lists. Please do not reply to this email with any comments. You may write to me directly at dralle(at)matronics.com if you wish, but do not include the List. Since many of these appear to come from matronics.com, I wanted to assure everyone that Matronics wasn't the real source of these messages. Let's be careful out there and keep those virus definitions up to date! Today alone, the Matronics spam filter and virus blocking appliance has filtered out 11,550 spam messages and 375 viruses! That's just in an 18 hour period! Best regards, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator -- Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Airgriff2(at)aol.com
Date: Mar 04, 2004
Subject: Re: Cuz'n P'fer
> > >> >> Hi All: >> >> Anyone see anything wrong with the wings on this Firestar? >> >> http://home.elmore.rr.com/jhauck/Firestar%20Crash/PDVD_068.jpg >> >> john h >> > Hey John, I looked real close with a magnifying glass at your photo. Wings arn't too bad but when you look at the pilot, his eyes are really big and there's all this brown goop all over the tail section ? The best part is that you're here to pull your leg and joke about it a little. Bob Griffin ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jim Hauck" <jimh474(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Fuel pumps
Date: Mar 04, 2004
Y'all; I don't remember who posted the thread on using two electric fuel pumps along with a ton of solenoids and such on a BMW engine. Wouldn't a simple solution be, to drill and tap the crankcase and install a Mikuni pulse pump and use one electric fuel pump on a separate switch as a boost/back up pump. Might save a lot of head scratching and frustration. Jim Hauck The older better looking brother :<) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "rob" <edmist_r(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: .
Date: Mar 04, 2004
________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jim Hauck" <jimh474(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Ring Free Fuel Additive
Date: Mar 04, 2004
Vic; Marvel Mystery Oil does the same thing and probably much cheaper. I add Marvel to all my engines, diesel and gas for years. No carbon or sludge. Jim Hauck ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dale Sellers" <dsel1(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Ring Free Fuel Additive
Date: Mar 04, 2004
Jim, How much Marvel for five gal and how often? DS ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Hauck" <jimh474(at)earthlink.net> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Ring Free Fuel Additive > > Vic; > > Marvel Mystery Oil does the same thing and probably much cheaper. > > I add Marvel to all my engines, diesel and gas for years. No carbon or > sludge. > > Jim Hauck > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Paul Petty" <lynnp@c-gate.net>
Subject: website
Date: Mar 04, 2004
Kolbers, I have had some spare time here at work and made a Yahoo slide show of my work on the Kolbra. http://f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/kolbra012/slideshow?&.dir/e09f&.srcph Also ran across an old webpage that I made last year. I will make a new website this weekend and take this one down. www.c-gate.net/~ppetty later pp ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "boyd young" <by0ung(at)brigham.net>
Subject: spark plugs
Date: Mar 04, 2004
What I am trying to understand is where the heat is here. Have wondered about this for years. Is it a hotter spark? A bigger spark? Interesting how engine designers come up with this stuff. I bet there are 400 different spark plugs on my shelf. ---------------------------------------------- mu understand is that the heat range is determined by the legnth of the insulator around the center electrode. and how far the electrode extends beyond the insulator.... by changing these dimentions the rate of cooling is affected and a plug will run hotter or cooler. i could be wrong but that is what i have been led to believe. the spark should not be affected as both plugs should be gaped the same. the hotter plug will burn off deposits better than a cold plug.... but what it will do to an engine / piston is not known to me. boyd ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "boyd young" <by0ung(at)brigham.net>
Subject: axels
Date: Mar 04, 2004
Don wrote: need to find a couple of matching axles...hmm.... Don Gherardini FireFly 098 ----------------------------------- Don / others i have a set of axels and axel fittings for sale the axel fittings go on the aluminum gear legs on the mark III the axels fit the matco wheels. boyd. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Harris" <rharris@magnolia-net.com>
Subject: Re: website
Date: Mar 04, 2004
Paul, I could not get anything to load here. Yahoo says it has a problem.... c-ya Richard ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Petty" <lynnp@c-gate.net> Subject: Kolb-List: website > > Kolbers, > I have had some spare time here at work and made a Yahoo slide show of my work on the Kolbra. > http://f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/kolbra012/slideshow?&.dir/e09f&.srcph > > Also ran across an old webpage that I made last year. I will make a new website this weekend and take this one down. > > www.c-gate.net/~ppetty > > later > > pp > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 04, 2004
From: Earl & Mim Zimmerman <emzi(at)supernet.com>
Subject: Legal Paper Work ?
I have recently purchased a used plane which is registered experimental that had been owned and flown as an "ultralight". The plane was registered with the FAA when it was built by the original owner. But the guy that I bought it from was not a licensed pilot and didn't keep a log book or have the plane inspected in the 10 years that he owned it. I am also new to the registered planes, having flown ultralights for the past 24 years. So my questions are, what are the requirements for amateur built class as far as inspections, log books, documentation required to be carried in the plane, ---- ? Lots of questions I know! But if someone could at least point me in the right direction to find the answers I would greatly appreciate it!! I am a mechanic and would inspect and maintain the plane myself if that is possible?? I guess about the time I figure out what the reg's are then the sport pilot rules will come out and change the whole picture again. Earl Z. Pa. USA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
Subject: Re: spark plugs
Date: Mar 04, 2004
Bryan..Paul..Steve..Boyd and all you sparkie's! LOL....no I sure aint gonna hand you yourA...or tear you a new.... heck boys...I cant hardly add much to what you have been discussin since I was gone....you ar doing just fine...I didnt read anything that I thought was wrong.....BUT....hehe....I will put it a little differently..in case someone is haveing a hard time following you fellas .... : ) The Heat range of a spark plug....is actually how hot..(In degrees) the design of the plug allows the engine to heat it up to. You can imagine that if there was no factor to allow the plug to cool...or diassapate heat....then it would not take long until the plug was the same temp as the burning combustion gasses in the chamber....and it would be red hot...wouldnt work that away..it would act like a diesel glow plug and ignite the mixture before we were ready...(Pre-ignition)....and soon it would just burn off and disappear.... So a plug needs some sort of ability to dissapate the heat..the more of this ability a plug has...we say it is a "cooler" plug...or it has a lower heat range. So a "Hotter" plug...in fact simply has less ability to dissapate the heat that wants to build up than a "colder" plug does. it is NOT a measure of how "Hot" the spark is...it has nothing to do with its potential energy.... There are alot of New design plugs coming out today. You have seen the "split-fires" and all kinds of different electrode designs.....and they make claims to a "Hotter spark"....these claims should not be confused with a plugs heat range...Here they are talking about the potential energy they claim they can impart into the fuel mixture.....There is No industry accepted measure for this..... Don Gherardini OEM.Sales / Engineering dept. American Honda Engines Power Equipment Company CortLand, Illinois 800-626-7326 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Harris" <rharris@magnolia-net.com>
Subject: Re: spark plugs
Date: Mar 04, 2004
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/ignition-system2.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: spark plugs > > Bryan..Paul..Steve..Boyd and all you sparkie's! > > LOL....no I sure aint gonna hand you yourA...or tear you a new.... > heck boys...I cant hardly add much to what you have been discussin since I > was gone....you ar doing just fine...I didnt read anything that I thought > was wrong.....BUT....hehe....I will put it a little differently..in case > someone is haveing a hard time following you fellas .... : ) > > The Heat range of a spark plug....is actually how hot..(In degrees) the > design of the plug allows the engine to heat it up to. > You can imagine that if there was no factor to allow the plug to cool...or > diassapate heat....then it would not take long until the plug was the same > temp as the burning combustion gasses in the chamber....and it would be red > hot...wouldnt work that away..it would act like a diesel glow plug and > ignite the mixture before we were ready...(Pre-ignition)....and soon it > would just burn off and disappear.... > > So a plug needs some sort of ability to dissapate the heat..the more of this > ability a plug has...we say it is a "cooler" plug...or it has a lower heat > range. > So a "Hotter" plug...in fact simply has less ability to dissapate the heat > that wants to build up than a "colder" plug does. > > it is NOT a measure of how "Hot" the spark is...it has nothing to do with > its potential energy.... > > There are alot of New design plugs coming out today. You have seen the > "split-fires" and all kinds of different electrode designs.....and they make > claims to a "Hotter spark"....these claims should not be confused with a > plugs heat range...Here they are talking about the potential energy they > claim they can impart into the fuel mixture.....There is No industry > accepted measure for this..... > > Don Gherardini > OEM.Sales / Engineering dept. > American Honda Engines > Power Equipment Company > CortLand, Illinois > 800-626-7326 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tommy Dubroc" <TandCDubroc(at)centurytel.net>
Subject: Firestar KXP kit for sale
Date: Mar 04, 2004
Kolb Firestar KXP (kit) 1992 model (kit) Engine...Rotax 447 w/2.58-1 B-box complete with Bing 54 and exhaust system....all brand new in the box Prop...38 lamination wood 66" X 32" Tennessee Props Instruments...altimeter, airspeed, tachometer, dual EGT, compass and ball bank indicator Options...heavy duty gear legs, brakes, wheel pants, streamline aluminum struts, full (total) enclosure complete with door. Kit is complete with all hardware, fittings, cables, Stits fabric and Stits process chemicals. Paint is all that is needed to complete the kit. Price...$8,600.00 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Edward Chmielewski" <edchmiel(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Legal Paper Work ?
Date: Mar 04, 2004
Hi Earl/Kolbers, I ran into the exact set of problems when I bought a MkII. The only thing in my favor was the previous 4 owners had kept an ownership log, so I could show the feds a continuous list of previous owners when/if the time comes. I contacted a local fed and he turned out to be the greatest guy, very helpful but also informed me of possible pitfalls to re-registring and N-numbering. Hope you find one as helpful, there's usually one or more in each office. Good luck. Ed in JXN MkII/503 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Earl & Mim Zimmerman" <emzi(at)supernet.com> Subject: Kolb-List: Legal Paper Work ? > > I have recently purchased a used plane which is registered experimental > that had been owned and flown as an "ultralight". The plane was > registered with the FAA when it was built by the original owner. But the > guy that I bought it from was not a licensed pilot and didn't keep a log > book or have the plane inspected in the 10 years that he owned it. (Snip) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 04, 2004
From: "Richard S. Bezzard" <knotsofast(at)usadatanet.net>
Subject: Sun and Fun
Bill Vincent/all I can't see UL's evolving into light aircraft. If you want UL build UL. If you want experimental then do so. If Mr. Piper thinks he is GOD then do not fly in. If you want to attend then drive. Just MHO. Dick Bezzard Firefly 447 Knotsofast(at)USADATAnet.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dale Sellers" <dsel1(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: US weight & Balance
Date: Mar 05, 2004
Anybody know the attitude the Ultrastar should be in when being weighed? Normally you level the top aileron but there are none. Dale Sellers Georgia Ultrastar/Cuyuna II-02 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dale Sellers" <dsel1(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: US weight & Balance
Date: Mar 05, 2004
Sorry, I meant longeron. DS ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dale Sellers" <dsel1(at)bellsouth.net> Subject: Kolb-List: US weight & Balance > > Anybody know the attitude the Ultrastar should be in when being weighed? Normally you level the top aileron but there are none. > > Dale Sellers > Georgia > Ultrastar/Cuyuna II-02 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "James and Cathy Tripp" <jtripp(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: FS Prop
Date: Mar 06, 2004
For the FS owners, I'm about to order the prop for my FS and have decided on using a Powerfin. The question is, which one? For those of you flying with a 503 DCDI with a "B" gearbox who are also running with a Powerfin, which one are you using? James Tripp FSII, 80% done ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "dama" <dama(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: FS Prop
Date: Mar 06, 2004
James, just call Stuart at the factory and tell him your setup. He will help you with what you need. I have the same setup and cannot tell you the specifics so just give Powerfin a call. Perhaps you can get a "show special" at Sun n Fun? Kip FS II Atlanta http://www.springeraviation.net/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "James and Cathy Tripp" <jtripp(at)elmore.rr.com> Subject: Kolb-List: FS Prop > > For the FS owners, > I'm about to order the prop for my FS and have decided on using a Powerfin. The question is, which one? For those of you flying with a 503 DCDI with a "B" gearbox who are also running with a Powerfin, which one are you using? > > James Tripp > FSII, 80% done > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "boyd young" <by0ung(at)brigham.net>
Subject: Ring Free additive or Mystery oil?
Date: Mar 06, 2004
Ring Free additive or Mystery oil? My dad in law says that they used hydrolic oil to keep the engines clean on the old thrashing machine....dont ack cause i dont know... also OMC has a product that they sell for outboards. it is called engine tuner injection can. sates it removes gum varnish lacquer and removes carbon from sticky rings. for peek performance use every 50 hours or once a year. contains aromatic hydrocrbon solvents and butyl cellosolve. fly safe.. boyd ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 06, 2004
From: artdog1512 <nazz57(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: briggs for UL's ....
if anyone can read german... check this out - http://www.aeroklaus.de/50HP.JPG http://www.aeroklaus.de/SPORTPLEUEL.JPG __________________________________ http://search.yahoo.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 06, 2004
From: The Kuffels <kuffel(at)cyberport.net>
Subject: Re: Legal Paper Work ?
Earl, I'll take a stab at your questions. <> First the short version. You will need essentially the same documentation in the plane as any other GA aircraft. Airworthyness Certificate Registration Radio License from the FCC if you fly outside the USA Operating limitations and cockpit placards Weight and Balance As far as inspections, all you need is a logbook entry (not a continuous logbook trail) with a condition inspection in the last 12 calendar months signed by an A&P (any A&P will do, doesn't have to be an AI) Now for some real world if, ands or buts: I assume all of this paperwork is also missing was well as no logbooks. You have to establish ownership of the aircraft in a manner satisfactory to the FAA. This may be the most difficult part of the entire process. They really want an unbroken chain of FAA "Aircraft Bill of Sale" forms covering all ownership transfers. Although they will give you grief, they are required to accept any legal document. Try to get certified true copies of notarized bills of sale. Absent such a chain, life can get really bureaucratic and you must beg mercy from the folks at Oklahoma City where the FAA maintains the registration files. As far as the FAA is concerned, the plane has not flown for the last 10 years if the prior owner didn't use the original N-number. I would approach OKC with something like: "I plan to restore to flying status amateur build experimental Kolb Model XYZ, Serial Number 123 formerly registered as N1234AB built by Adam Baker in 19??. Enclosed are certified true copies of Bills of Sale from Mr. Baker to me. {Or tell them as much as you know about sales, *not* about any flight operations, and ask them what to do.} Please reregister this aircraft in accordance with the enclosed FAA Form [whatever, I forget the number]. All the documentation for this aircraft was lost or destroyed before I purchased it. Therefore, please send me duplicate copies of the Airworthyness Certificate and Operating Limitations on file along with a new Registration." I would do a new weight and balance anyway even if you got one from the prior owner. Also make sure all the required placards unique to amateur built experimental aircraft are affixed. <> Anyone can maintain/modify an amateur build experimental. All that is required is a "condition inspection" within the 12 prior calendar months signed by an A&P. Let me know if need the exact wording of the logbook entry. If you make a "major" modification you need to write your local FAA FSDO and tell them what you did and get their blessing and/or temporary flight test restrictions. See the list archives for more information about this issue. <> The Sport Pilot proposal makes absolutely no change to the amateur built experimental rules. The only effect is if the airplane meets the Light Sport Aircraft parameters (all Kolbs do fit) and the plane is flown within the limits of Sport Pilot operations, then the pilot does not need a medical if he has a driver's license (assuming the pilot has never *failed* a flight medical). The latter point is subject to controversy and possible change but that is how identical wording is currently interpreted for glider pilots. Gook luck in your quest. Tom Kuffel Whitefish, Montana Building Original FireStar ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 07, 2004
From: Ted Cowan <tcowan1917(at)direcway.com>
Subject: sports rules
It seems I have misread or misinterpreted or something concering the new 'grandfather in' clauses in the sports pilots rule. My question is this: If I were a registered 'pilot' with and organization as USUA, have kept logs of my flights and times and places for the last five years, have plenty of 'air' time, if I take an FAA writen exam (whatever it is going to be) possibly a performance test or whatever, I will or could be 'grandfathered in' for a sports license. Now, I have been told that you have to have log time in a 'registered' USUA plane, one that has been registered with the USUA or whatever in order for your logs to count. Wow, that is like admitting that we used an unlawful aircraft to commit aviation. Can someone please clarify? Being old has caused my memory to fade and I cannot find the rules handy. thanks. Ted ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Thom Riddle" <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: sports rules
Date: Mar 07, 2004
The following link explains the issue. http://www.sportpilot.org/nprm/student_pilot_cert.html Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Thom Riddle" <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: briggs for UL's ....
Date: Mar 07, 2004
Here is a link in English about this basic engine...20hp in standard form but "up to 60hp on nitro". http://www.briggsracing.com/racing_engines/vanguard.html Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Thom Riddle" <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: briggs for UL's ....
Date: Mar 07, 2004
And here is Honda's engine competing with the B&S V-Twin http://www.honda-engines.com/gx670.htm Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 07, 2004
Subject: 5-ribs and 503's
From: ul15rhb(at)juno.com
John H and gang, Along the same lines as George's question, I never got the word whether the leading edge bent out of place or did it actually break to the point where the aluminum tore away in the middle of the tube (I can't tell if the damage was due to ground impact in your pics). Somehow I cannot see how the leading edge would push in towards the spar unless the attaching nose rib gussets got bent. They are held in place by 2 rivets per rib as I recall. If the leading edge tube got ripped, that .028" wall thickness of that tube may explain why it gave way. All of the older Firestar's have the .028" LE tube, unless it was replaced with a .035" tube, and this might pose a problem if a larger engine like a 50 hp 503 is used. I'm curious how many pilots on this list have 503's on their 5-rib Original Firestar's without any modifications to the wings? I was contacted by a fellow yesterday who is interested in buying an Original Firestar powered by a 503. I wonder how many of them are out there? For some of you guys that are familiar with the Original Firestar's, what are your opinions on this? Ralph Burlingame Original Firestar 17 years flying it Rotax 447 > > In a message dated 3/3/04 1:53:20 AM Eastern Standard Time, > biglar(at)gogittum.com writes: > > > Hi All: > > > > > >I am slowly getting a little be smarter in my old age. > > > > > >Discovered I can capture frames off the old VHS tape of the > "wing > > >pulling" of my Firestar. Go through these files in order to see > the > > >loop, then keep going and see the results of many, many loops, > hours, > > >heavy loads, sub-warp speeds, and lots of rough air: > > > > > >http://home.elmore.rr.com/jhauck/Firestar%20Crash/ > > > > > >I appoligize for the size and quality of the pics, but the best I > can > > >do for the moment. Perhaps I will get even more enlightened > before I > > >become totally useless to humanity. > > > > > >john h > John, all > Neat pictures.....very educational.....but bring 2 questions to my > mind: > > 1. why did your leading edge bend up?....was it on Both wings? > > 2. How could such a little weeee canopy save such a biiiiiig > plane?....was > the landing very hard? > > George Randolph > firestar driver from The Villages ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Fackler, Ken" <kfackler(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: SEEKING a 5-gallon plastic fuel tank
Date: Mar 07, 2004
Fellow Kolbers: My Mark II has two five-gallon fuel tanks sitting side-by-side just behind the pilot compartment, probably very much in the same place that most of you have fuel tanks. During the refit of my new engine, the mechanic discovered that my starboard-side fuel tank had apparently had a leak patched (poorly) by the former owner. I've elected to replace the tank for safety. The tanks are semi-transluscent plastic and approximately 10" x 10" x 13" (and a smidge). The filler hole is placed off-center. So my question is: What are your recommendations for a source to purchase one of these? Many thanks for all responses and feel free to email me direct at: kfackler(at)ameritech.net. -Ken Fackler Kolb Mark II / A722KWF Rochester MI ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 07, 2004
From: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy(at)lycos.com>
Subject: Addition to web site
Hey Guys, I added stage # 26 to my web site... It's a few misc. pictures... The last one is my bird sitting in the Garage... Waiting for this snow to melt so I can push out my plane...extend the wings and do things like ,Break-in my engine , make a gap seal , Weight & Balance...etc Gotta Fly... Mike in MN --- My Web Site: http://www.geocities.com/planecrazzzy/Planecrazzzy.html Sometimes you just have to take the leap and build your wings on the way down... Gotta Fly... ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 07, 2004
From: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy(at)lycos.com>
Subject: RE:SEEKING a 5-gallon plastic fuel tank
Hey Ken, Kolb sells those tanks... there close to $100 bucks , I'll bet that repair job is looking better already.... I've seen those jugs somewhere else , but I can't find them... so I was stuck ordering it thru Kolb. I paid $125 for the tank & fuel pick up tube. Gotta Fly... Mike in MN --- My Web Site: http://www.geocities.com/planecrazzzy/Planecrazzzy.html Sometimes you just have to take the leap and build your wings on the way down... Gotta Fly... ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Duncan McBride" <duncanmcbride(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: RE:SEEKING a 5-gallon plastic fuel tank
Date: Mar 07, 2004
The tank costs less. It's the pickup hardware that gets pricey. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy(at)lycos.com> Subject: Kolb-List: RE:SEEKING a 5-gallon plastic fuel tank > > Hey Ken, > Kolb sells those tanks... there close to $100 bucks , I'll bet that repair job is looking better already.... > > I've seen those jugs somewhere else , but I can't find them... so I was stuck ordering it thru Kolb. I paid $125 for the tank & fuel pick up tube. > > Gotta Fly... > Mike in MN > > > --- > My Web Site: > http://www.geocities.com/planecrazzzy/Planecrazzzy.html > > > Sometimes you just have to take the leap > and build your wings on the way down... > Gotta Fly... > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 07, 2004
From: Terry <tkrolfe(at)usadatanet.net>
Subject: Gas tanks
Ken, The plastic five gallon tanks are a common container for chemicals. Farmers around my area buy their chemicals for cleaning and other uses around the dairy farm that come in these containers. Ask around the ag. supply store in your area if you have one, then go find a farmer that has an empty. They are not unique just to Ul aviation and are a common item used for many things. Good luck finding one, Terry - FireFly # 95 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 07, 2004
From: Richard Pike <rwpike(at)charter.net>
Subject: Re: RE:SEEKING a 5-gallon plastic fuel tank
You might want to call Lockwood Aviation, 1-800-527-6829, and ask them about their fuel tank, part # FT5-120. The cap that goes with it is FT5-120C. Price of the tank is $25, the cap is $2. According to the measurements in their catalog, (9.5" X 9.5" X 13.5") it would appear to be the same as the 5 gallon tank that came with my MKIII kit. Might be worth asking about. Or, all I ever used mine original Kolb tanks for was to go to the gas station and bring fuel home, they are sitting out in the hangar now. Send me a couple 5 or 6 gallon plastic gas cans to replace them with, and I'll stick mine in what ever boxes you used and send them to you for the price of shipping. They have been around since 1996, appear to be in normal condition, (dusty, smell like mogas, etc.) and are kept out of the sun, so this is a strictly an as-is deal. And if you don't want them, no hard feelings. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) > >Hey Ken, > Kolb sells those tanks... there close to $100 bucks , I'll bet > that repair job is looking better already.... > > I've seen those jugs somewhere else , but I can't find them... so > I was stuck ordering it thru Kolb. I paid $125 for the tank & fuel pick > up tube. > > Gotta Fly... > Mike in MN > > >--- >My Web Site: >http://www.geocities.com/planecrazzzy/Planecrazzzy.html > > >Sometimes you just have to take the leap >and build your wings on the way down... > Gotta Fly... > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Final Flight Firestar 1990
Date: Mar 07, 2004
| 1. why did your leading edge bend up?....was it on Both wings? | | 2. How could such a little weeee canopy save such a biiiiiig plane?....was | the landing very hard? | | George Randolph George/Gang: To answer the first question, the leading edge bent up because the main rib noses failed to do their job. Most of the upward pressure on the wing is being carried by those little rib noses. The failure started between the 2d and 3d OB ribs, at the point the .028" leading edge is drilled top and bottom for the center false ribs. That initiated the failure. That was the detonator. As it came up it pulled the main rib noses, along with all the false ribs, up and to the rear as far back as the main spar. Failures of the right wing first, then left wing were almost simultaneous. Like, boom/boom. Two very quick explosions. There was no ground damage to the wings what you see in those pictures are what the wing structure looked like after I got the aircraft home and removed the fabric from each wing. Both wings were twins, identical damage to each, in the same places. Thus, the reason I did a little work to make my rib noses a little stronger in that area, and also increase lateral bracing. To qualify again, for the umpteenth time, the reason I do what I do to my airplanes is because of the way I fly and the places I fly. Period. I do not recommend anyone else doing this to their Kolb aircraft. I don't recommend anything, period....... I think the Jim Handbury Hand Deployed Parachute is a 28' diameter canopy. If I am wrong, Bro Jim can correct me. The military T10 personnel parachute we jumped in the Army used 32' diamter canopies. IIRC the average rate of decent for a paratrooper with his equipment is 18' a second. The two parachute recoveries I made with my Jim Handbury were equipment jumps. Number one, I had an Ultrastar strapped to me. Number two (with the same parachute), I had my Firestar strapped to me. I did not hit the ground too hard on the first deployment. Reason: Timing of the occilation under the canopy with I had nothing to do with. I was mearly a sand bag on both deployments. Second deployment I was slowed down during penetration of the hardwoods. Nose of FS was 6" off the ground when it was all over. George, I had enough parachute to save my life twice, even though it was small. :-) Here is a picture, dusty frame and all, that I took down off the wall and stuck in the scanner. It was taken soon after I lit in the hardwood trees near Addison Airport, Alabama. Please pay particular attention to the leading edge of the right wing. It appears and is about 18" thick. Both wings failed identically. Really screws up ones flying. Notice the parachute and parachute bridal are still up in the trees. The bridal is the white (actually light yellow) line going up into the trees from the front of the center section. You can see the bottom of the left bow tip under the right wing. It failed into this position some time after I entered the trees. As far as I can tell from the video, both wings and lift struts were in their respective normal locations under the full canopy prior to disappearing into trees. This picture was framed for a UL BFI at our local airport. The inscription reads: 11 March 1990 Push the envelope, Pay the price. JR Hauck He refused to take it because he was trying to run a business and this picture would possibly run off some of his customers. The reason I went to the trouble to put this thing together to give him was because he was doing aerobatics, of sorts, with a two place Eipper Quicksilver. I did not get his attention. Brought the picture home. Put it on my wall in my living room right next to the fireplace to remind me of the same thing: Push the envelope, pay the price. I think this email will help answer some of Ralph Burlingame's questions in the next msg. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Final Flight Firestar 1990
Date: Mar 07, 2004
| Here is a picture, dusty frame and all, that I took down off the wall | and stuck in the scanner. It was taken soon after I lit in the | hardwood trees near Addison Airport, Alabama. | john h Hi Gang: Forgot the url: http://home.elmore.rr.com/jhauck/Firestar%20Crash/Push%20and%20Pay john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: 5-ribs and 503's
Date: Mar 07, 2004
Hi Ralph/Gang: I'll try to answer your questions, Ralph. | Along the same lines as George's question, I never got the word whether | the leading edge bent out of place or did it actually break to the point | where the aluminum tore away in the middle of the tube (I can't tell if | the damage was due to ground impact in your pics). The leading edge tube did not break, tear, or rip in two. It simply failed up in the exact middle of the number 2 and 3 main rib bays where the center false rib is attached with one 1/8" rivet top and bottom. Right and left wings failed identically and and almost simultaneously. | Somehow I cannot seehow the leading edge would push in towards the spar unless the attaching | nose rib gussets got bent. They are held in place by 2 rivets per rib as | I recall. Nose rib gussets held as designed. They really had nothing to do with the failure. The failure is described in my first paragraph above. The nose ribs were pulled out of column, inward, as the leading edge failed upward. The top tube of the rib nose, which is already bent to form the air foil then failed, collapsed. As the leading edge comes up, the fabric on top of the nose rib loses its tension and no longer assist the nose rib in staying together. | If the leading edge tube got ripped, that .028" wall thickness of that | tube may explain why it gave way. All of the older Firestar's have the | .028" LE tube, unless it was replaced with a .035" tube, and this might | pose a problem if a larger engine like a 50 hp 503 is used. The leading edge tube did not get ripped. It got tired and failed. I was working on obtaining a new 503 to install on my Original 5 Main Rib Firestar just prior to Cuz'n P'fer's distruction. | I'm curious how many pilots on this list have 503's on their 5-rib | Original Firestar's without any modifications to the wings? Knowing what I know now about my FS, no way would I install a 503 on it. | I was contacted by a fellow yesterday who is interested in buying an | Original Firestar powered by a 503. I wonder how many of them are out | there? For some of you guys that are familiar with the Original | Firestar's, what are your opinions on this? | | Ralph Burlingame Ralph, to answer the last paragraph: "Not very smart." Take care, fly safe, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clay Stuart" <tcstuart(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: longerons
Date: Mar 07, 2004
Everyone must be flying because I stirred up no debate about covering my Xtra fuselage with 0.020 aluminum by drilling 1/8" holes about every 4" in the frame. Will the holes weaken the longerons? Surely. Will the aluminum skin make up the difference in strength? I don't know. If the longerons are weakened, is it a good thing or not? I don't know, because in a crash, some crumpling is desirable. How much crumpling? I don't know. If the fuselage is weakened, is this a problem at normal flight speeds and maneuvers? I won't think so. In the event of a crash, what is most likely to cause you harm? I would guess that the engine behind you would be the most dangerous object around. A local gyrocopter pilot was killed last year after an engine-out forced landing. Reports I heard were that the Subaru engine behind him caused his fatal injuries. Maybe Kolb will crash test some remote controlled planes for research. Comments? Clay Stuart ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 07, 2004
From: Eugene Zimmerman <eugenezimmerman(at)dejazzd.com>
Subject: Re: 5-ribs and 503's
John , what was your estimated airspeed at the time of your leading edge failure? > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 07, 2004
From: Eugene Zimmerman <eugenezimmerman(at)dejazzd.com>
Subject: Re: Final Flight Firestar 1990
John I am not able to view the picture. It is in source code format???????? John Hauck wrote: > > > | Here is a picture, dusty frame and all, that I took down off the > wall > | and stuck in the scanner. It was taken soon after I lit in the > | hardwood trees near Addison Airport, Alabama. | john h > > Hi Gang: > > Forgot the url: > > http://home.elmore.rr.com/jhauck/Firestar%20Crash/Push%20and%20Pay > > john h > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: 5-ribs and 503's
Date: Mar 07, 2004
| John , what was your estimated airspeed at the time of your leading edge | failure? Eugene Zimmerman EZ/All: Indicated airspeed at time of failure was 75 mph. Aircraft was flying straight and level, normal cruise power. Air was turbulent at that particular day. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 07, 2004
From: Eugene Zimmerman <eugenezimmerman(at)dejazzd.com>
Subject: Re: longerons
Clay Stuart wrote: > > Everyone must be flying because I stirred up no debate about covering my > Xtra fuselage with 0.020 aluminum by drilling 1/8" holes about every 4" in > the frame. snip Clay, Besides the effect of all the rivit holes the problem with small dents from a knee or such hitting the aluminum would soon make an unsightly mess of the plane. Fabric is much more resilient and forgiving that way. I've seen planes built with sheet aluminum covering the leading edge and a small bump can produce an unsightly ding that is nearly impossible to remove completely so that it cannot be seen. I would advise against it. EZ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RPHanks(at)aol.com
Date: Mar 07, 2004
Subject: Re: SEEKING a 5-gallon plastic fuel tank
Hi Ken, I ordered a replacement tank from TNK a couple years ago. If you don't get the hardware, the bare tank is only about $20 plus shipping. I'm currently using a six gallon tank that fits the same hole, but is taller by a few inches. I installed one last winter and have 90hrs of use on it so far with no problems. Here is the link to the place I bought it from: Cubitainer and Hedpak Combination Packaging In case the link doesn't work here is the address: http://www.ba-industrial.com/hedpak.htm Scroll down their page to the six gallon Hedpack (part# 049-4440) I paid $12.95 shipped all the way to Oregon from Oklahoma. These tanks are a little thinner walled and less stiff than the Kolb tanks. That isn't a problem in my KXP, but might be something to consider depending on how the tanks are mounted in the MarkII. By the way, don't go buy one of those similar sized water containers at the local mart store. I put one in that was the same size and color, hoping it would work. It cracked at one of the seams after nine hours. Lucky for me it decided to fail on the ground and not in the air. The Hedpak tank I'm using now is certified for shipping harzardous liquids and you can't beat the price. I can send pictures if you would like. Hope this helps Roger in Oregon ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Swiderski" <swiderski(at)rocketjet.net>
Subject: 5-ribs and 503's
Date: Mar 07, 2004
Ralph, Everybody has an opinion, here's mine: I put about 350hr on my UltraStar which has a wing essentially identical to the original FireStar. My engine was a modified high performance Cuyuna which put out about 45hp. I did a pull test on it along side my buddy's single carb 503 Kolb TwinStar. With my prop set in the cruise setting, I was getting the same pounds of thrust (275). Because I inlaid some p-tips on my prop, I believe I was utilizing my hp better. At any rate, my airframe/wing was seeing the same thrust as a 48hp 503. I therefore would think that a 503 on an early FS is not unthinkable, especially if the craft was flown intelligently. Additionally, I made up some plans to use 2 Kawasaki 340 engines turning 2 counter rotating props, to put on my UltraStar. Using a derated configuration they put out 30hp each. I sat down at Sun & Fun with Homer & showed him what I was planning to do. I thought he would jump all over me. Instead he asked me a lot of questions. This gave me some hope and the nerve to ask him the big question. I asked him, if I did not use full power in straight & level, did not exceed the recommended speed envelope, & only used full throttle on climb out, would the UltraStar handle the setup? He looked down, scratched his head, smiled, & said it would handle the power in climb out, but not in level flight. I did not ask him if he would endorse the project because I knew he wouldn't. If I had an early FS & had the choice of a 447 or a 503, I'd put on the 503 without blinking an eye, because I would know that it would be me who controlled how fast the plane would go, not the engine. If I was the designer, I'd limit the plane to a 447. ...Richard Swiderski | I'm curious how many pilots on this list have 503's on their 5-rib | Original Firestar's without any modifications to the wings? | I was contacted by a fellow yesterday who is interested in buying an | Original Firestar powered by a 503. I wonder how many of them are out | there? For some of you guys that are familiar with the Original | Firestar's, what are your opinions on this? | | Ralph Burlingame ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: 5-ribs and 503's
Date: Mar 07, 2004
| If I had an early FS & had the | choice of a 447 or a 503, I'd put on the 503 without blinking an eye, | because I would know that it would be me who controlled how fast the plane | would go, not the engine. If I was the designer, I'd limit the plane to a | 447. ...Richard Swiderski Richard/All: The US and the Firestar were designed for 35 HP. Homer would not sell me a 40 HP 447 when I got my FS kit. I hope some of you on the Kolb List have paid attention to some of my mistakes over the past 20 years, and hopefully you will learn as much from them as I have. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Re: longerons
Date: Mar 08, 2004
Thought that comes to mind is to attach the skins with Adell clamps. No holes in the longerons that way...............and my feeling is that possible rust from water entering the holes would be a bigger long term factor than the holes weakening them. IMHO. Do not Archive. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clay Stuart" <tcstuart(at)adelphia.net> Subject: Kolb-List: longerons > > Everyone must be flying because I stirred up no debate about covering my > Xtra fuselage with 0.020 aluminum by drilling 1/8" holes about every 4" in > the frame. > > Will the holes weaken the longerons? Surely. Will the aluminum skin make up > the difference in strength? I don't know. If the longerons are weakened, ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 08, 2004
Subject: leading edge fabric
From: ul15rhb(at)juno.com
John H, After thinking about the leading edge tube deflecting the way it did made me think about whether you bonded the leading edge tube and fabric with Polytak. Sometimes a builder won't add aircraft cement to the leading edge tube because it makes the fabric rough underneath and cosmetically doesn't look as good. Without the attachment between tube and fabric, the LE tube would be more free to move around under the fabric and maybe cause the ribs to weaken. What about the 3" finishing tape on the LE? I notice a lot of builders don't add this because it makes the overall appearance not as attractive. The finishing tape is very heavy duty and adds strength to the LE of the wings when bonded with polybrush over the fabric. Did Cuz'n P'fer have 3" finishing tape on the leading edge? Just wondering ..... Ralph Original Firestar 17 years flying it ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: leading edge fabric
Date: Mar 08, 2004
Morning Ralph/All: Let's see if I can answer your questions. | After thinking about the leading edge tube deflecting the way it did made me think about whether you bonded the leading edge tube and fabric with Polytak. Sometimes a builder won't add aircraft cement to the leading edge tube because it makes the fabric rough underneath and cosmetically doesn't look as good. Without the attachment between tube and fabric, the LE tube would be more free to move around under the fabric and maybe cause the ribs to weaken. I don't see how anyone could not use Polytack for the bottom fabric to leading and trailing edges. What would hold that fabric in place while attempting to Polytack the top fabric over it? I do not believe the adhesion of fabric to leading edge tube adds any strength or locks it in place. Although the dacron is heat shrunk, it will still stretch and shrink. Push your thumb into the wing fabric for a minute or two. There will be a big dimple there when you remove your thumb. In a few minutes it will return to its original shape. I do not think the leading edge tube weakened the ribs on my FS in any way. If you take a serious look at what is holding the forward part of the wing together, you will see that 5 rib noses are not much. The FS rib is made of .028 X 5/16 tubing. | What about the 3" finishing tape on the LE? I notice a lot of builders don't add this because it makes the overall appearance not as attractive. The finishing tape is very heavy duty and adds strength to the LE of the wings when bonded with polybrush over the fabric. My FS wings were built and covered per Kolb instructions and plans, to include the required 3" finishing tape. In addition to the 3" tape on leading and trailing edges, all full ribs were completely wrapped with 2" tape (all the way around the wing and overlapped). I took no short cuts building and covering the FS wings. | Did Cuz'n P'fer have 3" finishing tape on the leading edge? Sure did. As I have mentioned in earlier posts to the Kolb List, it may be a good idea to take a look inside those wings to insure everything that is supposed to be in there is, and it is attached per plans and instructions. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Aircraft Insurance
Date: Mar 08, 2004
Hi Gang: A quick note for those interested. I just made my final decision on next year's insurance. I have been with AVEMCO for a long time, all the Alaska flights. However, Falcon, EAA endorsed, beat their premium by $341.00 and cover me and the airplane anywhere in the US (minus Hawaii), Canada, Mexico, and best of all, anywhere in Alaska. With AVEMCO I was required to have a geographic indorsement to cover me while flying in the North Slope area of Alaska. This was extremely expensive. Another advantage is no deductible. Can not remember what AVEMCO had for deductible. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Christopher Armstrong" <tophera(at)centurytel.net>
Subject: leading edge failure
Date: Mar 08, 2004
Just how many G's did John pull repeatedly doing all those loops in an unaerobatic airplane? How many times did he screw the loops up a bit and pull even more G's? How fast was he going when he pulled out of the bottom of some of those loops? Most of the lift on a wing is generated in the front 25% of the wing. Lets say John was flying around at around 600 pounds. At 5 G's that's 3000 pounds of lift on about 30 feet of wing and ten wing ribs. 100 pounds per foot of wing and 300 pound of lift per wing rib, mostly on the nose ribs. (And it is not spread evenly as the lift is a little greater inboard then outboard) Take a look at one of those little ribs made out of those tiny tubes and imagine a 200+ pound guy standing on the nose rib part of it, and now bounce on it for a couple of hours... Now add the wing bending that tends to twist the ribs so the tubes are no longer in column on the top. If I built a bridge out of this tubing put together like the ribs are across a deep canyon I bet not one of you would go out and jump on it. I think the reason the nose ribs failed isn't too much of a mystery. They were beat to death! Just my guess anyway. Topher ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Christopher Armstrong" <tophera(at)centurytel.net>
Subject: longerons
Date: Mar 08, 2004
The Rotor mouse helicopter cage is completely covered in lexan... I thought that was kinda cool. The main problem is that you are going to want to seal all those holes into the 4130 to prevent the interiors from rusting. that means using sealing rivets which are expensive if you are using structural rivets not the closed aluminum ones. And your going to need structural rivets if your want to get any strength from the aluminum. I would also look into .016 inch 6061 t6 aluminum as it would be lighter then the .02 and more corrosion resistant then the 2024. The extra strength of the 2024 is not a benefit for you in this case and the fact the 2024 will crack along any bend lines real easily compared to the 6061 is a major reason to use the 6061 if you're going to bend the aluminum to fit to the cage. -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Clay Stuart Subject: Kolb-List: longerons Everyone must be flying because I stirred up no debate about covering my Xtra fuselage with 0.020 aluminum by drilling 1/8" holes about every 4" in the frame. Will the holes weaken the longerons? Surely. Will the aluminum skin make up the difference in strength? I don't know. If the longerons are weakened, is it a good thing or not? I don't know, because in a crash, some crumpling is desirable. How much crumpling? I don't know. If the fuselage is weakened, is this a problem at normal flight speeds and maneuvers? I won't think so. In the event of a crash, what is most likely to cause you harm? I would guess that the engine behind you would be the most dangerous object around. A local gyrocopter pilot was killed last year after an engine-out forced landing. Reports I heard were that the Subaru engine behind him caused his fatal injuries. Maybe Kolb will crash test some remote controlled planes for research. Comments? Clay Stuart ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 08, 2004
Subject: Re: leading edge failure
From: ul15rhb(at)juno.com
Topher, You have a way with words my man. This is a very good explanation of what can happen with a wing under extra load. It will make me think a lot more when I want to do some of those fast pullups to feel the g's in my pants. Ralph Original 5-rb wing Firestar 17 years flying it -- "Christopher Armstrong" wrote: Just how many G's did John pull repeatedly doing all those loops in an unaerobatic airplane? How many times did he screw the loops up a bit and pull even more G's? How fast was he going when he pulled out of the bottom of some of those loops? Most of the lift on a wing is generated in the front 25% of the wing. Lets say John was flying around at around 600 pounds. At 5 G's that's 3000 pounds of lift on about 30 feet of wing and ten wing ribs. 100 pounds per foot of wing and 300 pound of lift per wing rib, mostly on the nose ribs. (And it is not spread evenly as the lift is a little greater inboard then outboard) Take a look at one of those little ribs made out of those tiny tubes and imagine a 200+ pound guy standing on the nose rib part of it, and now bounce on it for a couple of hours... Now add the wing bending that tends to twist the ribs so the tubes are no longer in column on the top. If I built a bridge out of this tubing put together like the ribs are across a deep canyon I bet not one of you would go out and jump on it. I think the reason the nose ribs failed isn't too much of a mystery. They were beat to death! Just my guess anyway. Topher ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Wings and Things
Date: Mar 08, 2004
Hi All: Ralph Burlingame was kind enough to let me know the following email went to him only. It was intended for all on the Kolb List. john h | Thanks again John. Did you want this to go to the list? You sent it directly to me, but I think you could put it on the list too. | | Very good advice .... | | Ralph | | -- "John Hauck" wrote: | | Hey thanks so much for sending those comments John. Your | experiences will help others from getting into trouble and hopefully | me too. | | | | I know there have been times where I have pushed the little Firestar | way beyond the limits. The Vne is 80 mph and I have had it over that. | Nothing broke yet, but I have to take it easy as the little bird is | getting old. | | | | Ralph | | Ralph/All: | | I intentionally left your entire post above. | | I can't remember if I shared this or not. It is not mine, but an old | timer friend back in 1990. He explained to me that "stress" can be | explained as a whole number, 1.0. Each time the aircraft is stressed, | a little bit is taken away, with nothing be replaced. So tht whole | number starts getting smaller and smaller. Finally, one day we ask | our airplane to do a task and it replies, "Sorry, I am all used up." | I believe this is what happened to me and my Firestar. | | I personally do not care if anyone agrees with the above or not. I | do, and it keeps me playing on a "fair" field. I am not saying that | the FS wing or US wing is weak, howeveer, it is not as strong as the 7 | rib wing panels nor the MKIII wing. I know from personal experience | that the wing can be worn out, used up, flown to the point that it | will finally give up. If and when that happens, it is awfully nice to | have some type of recovery system. Something to give you one more | option for survival. I, for one, can not predict if and when a wing | will fail. I only know of two. Mine and Aubrey Radford's. I think I | asked earlier if anyone else had any knowledge of US or FS wing | failures. I am sure Dennis Souder has that info, if it has happened | to others. | | What I am trying to impress on you all is to fly the all Kolb aircraft | the way they were designed to be flown. Inspect them, pull | maintenance on them, and enjoy them. They are the best available for | us to fly. That is why I have flown them for the last 20 years, and | hope I can still push mine out of the hanger 20 years from now. | Ignoring a possible maintence problem will not make it go away. | Because it has not happened yet, does not mean it will not. Never | take anything about building, maintaining and flying airplanes for | granted. That is what "Murphy's Law" wants you to do. Makes Murphy's | job much easier. Do not be afraid to cut a couple inspection slots in | those inboard rib wing panels. One to peek through, and one to shine | that little Mag Lite through. It there is a lateral brace or anything | else in there broken, bent, or does not look the way it should, do not | hesitate to cut some fabric and repair. | | The one big mistake I made with my US and FS was my attitude that the | last thing to fail on either aircraft was the wings. A lot of little | mods were made on the fuselage of both aircraft, but never looked hard | at the wings. We should have, based on the way I flew them. Had I | flown them both as designed, it would still be a mistake not to look | inside and see what is happening in there. | | Please try to interpret what I am saying as what I, John Hauck, should | do and/or should have done with both aircraft. I in no way am | recommending you all do anything, even though it may sound that way. | It is not my intention. My intention is to share my experience, | mistakes, and solutions for my aircraft and no one else's. I do not | want to see anyone experience a lot of the problems I experienced | learning to build, maintain, and fly these fun little airplanes. My | day is made if I can help one person prevent one accident. | | Take care, | | john h | | PS: A lot of Kolb flyers love to gain a lot of airspeed, pull back | hard on the control stick and feel the exhileration of about 3+ G's | and terrific climb. This amount of stress was normal with each of the | 1,000's of maneuvers I performed while doing aerobatics in my FS. | Think about it. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: 2024 Sheet vs 6061 and Other
Date: Mar 08, 2004
| The extra strength of the 2024 is not a benefit for you in | this case and the fact the 2024 will crack along any bend lines real easily | compared to the 6061 is a major reason to use the 6061 if you're going to | bend the aluminum to fit to the cage. Topher Topher/All: Have to agree 100% on not using 2024 sheet on ultralights. I started out experiementing with aluminum sheet to replace the nylon gap seal on the US and FS. Limited budget meant a quick trip to the hardware store and a roll of valley aluminum for house roofs. These lasted well. I got to thinking, if the valley aluminum lasted that well, some of that strong 2024 sheet would be even better. Made up a new center section, mounted it, and had stress cracks in a couple hours. It was too hard to work well in the high vibrations of the two stroke world. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: leading edge failure
Date: Mar 08, 2004
Topher/All: Thanks for your interesting response. Some I agree with, some I don't. | Just how many G's did John pull repeatedly doing all those loops in an | unaerobatic airplane? Every aircraft I have built, US, FS, and MKIII have been equipped with a certified accelerometer or G meter. I paid particular attention to mount the G meter so it would be parallel with the line of flight of the aircraft. Loops were consistently performed pulling a max of 3 to 3.5 G's. The amazing thing about the US and FS was how little stress is normally placed upon the airplane. Normally, 3 to 3.5 G's was all. In an attempt see how much stress I could place on it yielded 5.0 G's. That required a 90 mph vertical dive and an abrupt pull out. Not easy to get much above 3.5 G's flying aerobatics. However, I have experienced 3.5 G's while flying in clear air turbulence. I can not remember what my airspeed was, but I was on my way to Sun and Fun 1989, a very windy day, indeed. Out of the clear blue I got hit hard enough to hurt my neck. My normal cross country airspeeds in the FS were 65 to 75 mph. How many times did he screw the loops up a bit and | pull even more G's? Serioudly, not many screw ups. Usually the screw ups did not pull more g's. More G's were pulled going into and than coming out of. An overspeed coming out required a little longer pull out. Again, duration of stress, I am sure, also fits into the equation of "wearing out a wing". How fast was he going when he pulled out of the bottom | of some of those loops? Normally, 70 to 75 mph. Most g's were pulled going into the loop because of the pusher configuration/high thrust line, and increased power working against the inside loop. I found I could do beautiful loops with about half throttle by doing a series of nice and gentle pull ups until full stall, push the nose over to gain air speed back up steep into another full stall. Usually, about three of these repetitions would yield a beautiful symetrical loop at half throttle. I could do this without increasing power. The FS would hae done much nicer outside loops, based on high thrust line, if the lift struts had survived. Most of the lift on a wing is generated in the | front 25% of the wing. I think I emphasized that in a previous post a short time ago. I am glad you also pointed that out. Lets say John was flying around at around 600 | pounds. This would be a normal cross country gross weight for my FS. At 5 G's that's 3000 pounds of lift on about 30 feet of wing and | ten wing ribs. As previously stated, the FS only saw 5 g's once. Very difficult to pull 4.0. Average 3 to 3.5. | I think the reason the nose ribs failed isn't too much of a | mystery. They were beat to death! I don't like that description. I think "worn out" is a more apt description, and sounds much better than "beat to death". | Just my guess anyway. How often do you use that system of engineering at work? Just my guess, more often than I realize. Just kidding, Topher. But you get my point, I hope. :-) I have never tried to "sugar coat" or cover up the way I flew my FS, the weights and airspeeds I demanded, and the seriously inclement, turbulent weather it was exposed to in flight. I made many mistakes over the years and got my eyes opened wide 11 March 1990. Hopefully, I can open some more eyes with the informtion I share on this List so others do not have to go to the same extremes I did to get their "eyes opened". Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Christopher Armstrong" <tophera(at)centurytel.net>
Subject: leading edge failure
Date: Mar 08, 2004
I don't like that description. I think "worn out" is a more apt description, and sounds much better than "beat to death". | Just my guess anyway. How often do you use that system of engineering at work? I don't work much these days, but I guess when I have to... but the guess part was in getting the data, the analysis is done correctly. Using the better data you provided in the analysis still results in my correct analysis that the nose ribs failed because you "Wore them out!" Which does sound better then beat them to death, though I think my phrase makes the point better. Flown more mildly I don't think they would be wore out yet, though you put more hours on light planes then anybody I know cept maybe Mark Beierle. So using your better data at 3 G's (was that a recording g meter or one you only get a reading when you're looking at it real time?) And let's say only 550 pounds now you're talking only 1650 pounds or 165 pounds per rib. I weight 165 pounds so that is like me standing on the rib. I still say I wouldn't want to do that very often! If I put one Kolb rib over the edge of a 500 foot cliff would you go out and stand on it? (Really we should add the root ribs too so that's 12 ribs and only 137.5 pounds but that doesn't sound near as bad now does it, and I was trying to be scary to keep you guys safer!) Hay! Don't take my keyboard! What do we care, go out fly loops, load over gross, fly real fast! Trust us, Kolb would never sell you a plane with less then a 5 times safety margin on anything. Load her up, put on bigger engines, she can take it. yah that's the ticket, 200 hp will make it climb real good! And you just have to limit yer top speed yourself, no problem you can hold her right at the redline all day long, gusts? Don't worry, how often are you gonna be hit by a big gust. Never happen while you are in a loop or flying at red line. Don't worry about it. CG? You can't load a kolb out of the cg range, don't bother with a weight and balance. All your mods? How much could that 200hp move the cg anyway? Forget about it!) OK, I got the keyboard back from that looney, But he makes some kinda point with that raving. Topher ;-) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: leading edge failure
Date: Mar 08, 2004
| So using your better data at 3 G's (was that a recording g meter or one you | only get a reading when you're looking at it real time?) Recording.... | I weight 165 pounds so that is like me standing on the rib. I still say I | wouldn't want to do that very often! If I put one Kolb rib over the edge of | a 500 foot cliff would you go out and stand on it? Not until I got those snazzy aluminum angle reinforcements on them. :-) | (Really we should add the root ribs too so that's 12 ribs and only 137.5 | pounds but that doesn't sound near as bad now does it, and I was trying to | be scary to keep you guys safer!) When I built the wings for the MKIII, Jim recognized the increased strength in building a full 4130 inboard rib. My MKIII is equipped with full 4130 IB ribs. | But he makes some kinda point with that raving. Well, Topher, I have tried not to rave too much. I have all along shared the many errors I made in judgement overflying the US and the FS. Hopefully, you and many others will benefit from that. I have never tried to cover up my mistakes. Doesn't help others much to do that. So...........I will continue to fly my MKIII wings with all those holes drilled in all those ribs with all that extra weight that some think is doing absolutely nothing. I like'em that way. :-) Hoping they'll last long enough to get back to Alaska and other neat places. Take care, john h PS: If you aren't punching the time clock much anymore, ought to have the FS finished and flying in no time. I'm anxious to see how your mods perform, in flight. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 08, 2004
From: Richard Pike <rwpike(at)charter.net>
Subject: Digital camera to the rescue
This might make life simpler - Was holding a set of brake master cylinders in the place where they will end up, and trying to visualize how to make the new bracket, and then be able to remember the mental picture accurately enough to transfer the whole concept correctly into welded steel... Then I thought of my digital camera. Got the camera, held the cylinders in place, took a picture, printed the picture, and now I can mark the picture with dimensions and have it right at the workbench while I fabricate the bracket instead of having to run back and forth to the airplane. The odds of only having to build one bracket instead of two or three before getting it right just got better.... Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Guy Morgan" <morganguy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: longerons
Date: Mar 08, 2004
Howdy Folks. I don't own a Kolb (yet) nor have I built my own plane (yet), but I do work in aviation as a mechanic and avionics tech. IMHO I would not drill into any structural tube without approval from the manufacturer or a DER. The skin will not make up the difference in strength, especially 6061. For the skin to become part of the structure, all the holes would have to be close-tolerance, structural rivets, proper thickness and hardness, etc.....As much as I hate to say it, you would need an engineer to determine these things. Take a look at a RANS S-12 if you get a chance. I thought if I ever wanted to skin my homebuilt, I would go that route. The skin is bent over the tube and riveted to itself if I remember correctly. As for 2024, I make alot of panels from it and have never had a problem as long as you use proper technique, bend radius etc. Get a copy of the AC 43.13 if you don't have it already. You can download the whole thing from the FAA web site, I believe. Lotsa good structural stuff in there. Take Care, Guy Morgan (wanna-be Kolber) snip The main problem is that you are going to want to seal all those holes into the 4130 to prevent the interiors from rusting. that means using sealing rivets which are expensive if you are using structural rivets not the closed aluminum ones. And your going to need structural rivets if your want to get any strength from the aluminum. I would also look into .016 inch 6061 t6 aluminum as it would be lighter then the .02 and more corrosion resistant then the 2024. The extra strength of the 2024 is not a benefit for you in this case and the fact the 2024 will crack along any bend lines real easily compared to the 6061 is a major reason to use the 6061 if you're going to bend the aluminum to fit to the cage. -----Original Message----- -- Kolb-List message posted by: "Clay Stuart" tcstuart(at)adelphia.net Everyone must be flying because I stirred up no debate about covering my Xtra fuselage with 0.020 aluminum by drilling 1/8" holes about every 4" in the frame. Will the holes weaken the longerons? Surely. Will the aluminum skin make up the difference in strength? I don't know. If the longerons are weakened, is it a good thing or not? I don't know, because in a crash, some crumpling is desirable. How much crumpling? I don't know. If the fuselage is weakened, is this a problem at normal flight speeds and maneuvers? I won't think so. ime Offer) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 08, 2004
From: jerb <ulflyer(at)verizon.net>
Subject: New Twist Regarding Airport Insurance
Hey Folks, Any one know the particulars of any litigation involving UL's in Texas. We were informed by the airport owners association has been forewarned that if the airport has UL's based at the airport that they may expect a rate increase. Rationale was due to three present litigation cases involving UL's in Texas. Next question comes what will be the damage for the insurance, if too much being banded from use of the airport where we and other either own or rent hangar space. For present were letting the dog lie hoping things will not change. For the rest of you out there get ready for this as a means for insurance companies to increase revenue. jerb ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Paul Petty" <Lynnp@c-gate.net>
Subject: W&B Question
Date: Mar 08, 2004
Hi Kolbers, Guess your wondering.... What tha heck is this guy asking a W&B question at this point? Well here is why. My father-n-law and his new toy (the RV8) has completed the 40 hrs required time to leave our airport and carry a passenger. In the manuals we were looking at W&B and figuring CG. The manual for this airplane states "Tail wheel weight not to exceed 60lbs" So we bebop out to the airport with some scales and weigh the tail wheel because the W&B charts from the builder stated 49lbs. But neither me nor pops could lift the tail off the ground. Hmmmmm so after we both picked up the tail and got her tail on the scales she weighed a whopping 116lbs...????? The thought of plopping my big butt in the back seat and going for a ride calculated out to -10 gallons of fuel for correct CG. But wait!!! this cant be right.. we put 5 gallons of water in the rear seat to keep the tail wheel from dancing upward on take off roll if it hit a pebble or crack in the runway????? Scratching heads at this point.... After typing this thread to this point I think I will post it and see if you guys can figure out what we were doing wrong with this W&B of the tail and how Kolb's are weighed in this manner. After Charley got home and thought about it became crystal clear. And was why I wanted to ask this question in the first place after viewing photos of other builders W&B photos..... Have at it, I'm going to go drill some holes and pull some rivets....... Take Care Paul Petty Building Ms. Dixie Kolbra/912UL/Warp www.c-gate.net/~ppetty ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "bryan green" <lgreen1(at)sc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: W&B Question
Date: Mar 08, 2004
Hi Paul you have to have the plane in flight attitude to get the correct tail weight Bryan Green Elgin SC Firestar I 19LBG 377 BRS ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Petty" <
Lynnp@c-gate.net> Subject: Kolb-List: W&B Question > > Hi Kolbers, > Guess your wondering.... What tha heck is this guy asking a W&B question at this point? Well here is why. My father-n-law and his new toy (the RV8) has completed the 40 hrs required time to leave our airport and carry a passenger. In the manuals we were looking at W&B and figuring CG. The manual for this airplane states "Tail wheel weight not to exceed 60lbs" So we bebop out to the airport with some scales and weigh the tail wheel because the W&B charts from the builder stated 49lbs. But neither me nor pops could lift the tail off the ground. Hmmmmm so after we both picked up the tail and got her tail on the scales she weighed a whopping 116lbs...????? The thought of plopping my big butt in the back seat and going for a ride calculated out to -10 gallons of fuel for correct CG. But wait!!! this cant be right.. we put 5 gallons of water in the rear seat to keep the tail wheel from dancing upward on take off roll if it hit a pebble or crack in the runway????? Scratching heads ! > at this point.... After typing this thread to this point I think I will post it and see if you guys can figure out what we were doing wrong with this W&B of the tail and how Kolb's are weighed in this manner. After Charley got home and thought about it became crystal clear. And was why I wanted to ask this question in the first place after viewing photos of other builders W&B photos..... Have at it, I'm going to go drill some holes and pull some rivets....... > > Take Care > Paul Petty > Building Ms. Dixie > Kolbra/912UL/Warp > www.c-gate.net/~ppetty > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Christopher Armstrong" <tophera(at)centurytel.net>
Subject: W&B Question
Date: Mar 08, 2004
You are not weighting the plane in the flight attitude? -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Petty Subject: Kolb-List: W&B Question Hi Kolbers, Guess your wondering.... What tha heck is this guy asking a W&B question at this point? Well here is why. My father-n-law and his new toy (the RV8) has completed the 40 hrs required time to leave our airport and carry a passenger. In the manuals we were looking at W&B and figuring CG. The manual for this airplane states "Tail wheel weight not to exceed 60lbs" So we bebop out to the airport with some scales and weigh the tail wheel because the W&B charts from the builder stated 49lbs. But neither me nor pops could lift the tail off the ground. Hmmmmm so after we both picked up the tail and got her tail on the scales she weighed a whopping 116lbs...????? The thought of plopping my big butt in the back seat and going for a ride calculated out to -10 gallons of fuel for correct CG. But wait!!! this cant be right.. we put 5 gallons of water in the rear seat to keep the tail wheel from dancing upward on take off roll if it hit a pebble or crack in the runway????? Scratching heads ! at this point.... After typing this thread to this point I think I will post it and see if you guys can figure out what we were doing wrong with this W&B of the tail and how Kolb's are weighed in this manner. After Charley got home and thought about it became crystal clear. And was why I wanted to ask this question in the first place after viewing photos of other builders W&B photos..... Have at it, I'm going to go drill some holes and pull some rivets....... Take Care Paul Petty Building Ms. Dixie Kolbra/912UL/Warp www.c-gate.net/~ppetty ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 08, 2004
From: possums <possums(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: 5-ribs and 503's
One of us ("Possums") ask about the 503 on the XP Firestar and were told that the cage was not designed to take the engine and that cracks would develop around the back of the cage under the engine mount area. We did it anyway with a 503 single carb back in the early/mid 1990s??. The cage did develop cracks under the back part of the engine mounts. They were hard to see - but they were there. So watch out guys, it was originally built for a 377 or 447. I think cranking up a 503 is a little rougher on the cage than it was designed for. I know Homer really liked us, but had a problem with the name "Possums from Hell" for obvious reasons - if you know Homer. He said once that he was "very impressed" we were still alive. But he invited us to dinner at the airshows anyway- so ?? Young, dumb and invincible!!! But it was fun. >| If I had an early FS & had the >| choice of a 447 or a 503, I'd put on the 503 without blinking an >eye, >| because I would know that it would be me who controlled how fast the >plane >| would go, not the engine. If I was the designer, I'd limit the >plane to a >| 447. ...Richard Swiderski > >Richard/All: > >The US and the Firestar were designed for 35 HP. Homer would not sell >me a 40 HP 447 when I got my FS kit. > >I hope some of you on the Kolb List have paid attention to some of my >mistakes over the past 20 years, and hopefully you will learn as much >from them as I have. > >Take care, > >john h > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 08, 2004
From: possums <possums(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: 5-ribs and 503's
At 12:42 AM 3/8/2004, you wrote: > > >| If I had an early FS & had the >| choice of a 447 or a 503, I'd put on the 503 without blinking an >eye, Oh.. let me also add that I'm not saying don't experiment - if you want. I've got a kickass 503 E-box dual-carb 3 blade warp drive on mine now, but have beefed up/changed the cage a lot. Getting close to 575 hours without a single glitch, decarb, rebuild - nothing. Like I say, just an experiment. Going to trade it in at 600 hours for a new one - maybe. http://www.mindspring.com/~possums/Modrearframe.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 09, 2004
From: "Bob N." <ronoy(at)shentel.net>
Subject: Re: elcorrecto!!! aka W&B
Paul, Even my FireFly has W&B info: basic procedure, drwgs, example. If no one else can give you Kolbra stuff, I can send cy via FailMail. Bob N. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Bass" <gtb(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: Poker Run
Date: Mar 09, 2004
Bob Bean/List; Bob, I envy you and the folks you are fortunate to be flying with. Those 'games' that you speak of are the kind we used to do back in the 80's. The club that I belong to has about 30-35 members and NOT ONE of them is willing to be included in, or to support others involved in, these events of SKILL ENHANCEMENT. Proficiency does not come to us from the sofa. We have to actually get out there and get in the air. And hopefully, we have commerades that will fly with us and critique us honestly (and in humor when possible) to help us improve our flight abilities. I miss the "old style" flying, with the sense of achievement and satisfaction that comes with it. Keep up the good work. This list is AWESOME. George Bass --- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 10, 2004
Subject: Sling Shot details
From: herbgh(at)juno.com
Hi Guys Looking at a pic of a sling shot and wondering if it has 6 inch spars and tail boom?? Looks as if TNK no longer offers it . Herb in Ky ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tommy Dubroc" <TandCDubroc(at)centurytel.net>
Subject: Re: Firestar KXP kit for sale
Date: Mar 10, 2004
Bill, I am in central Louisiana. Tommy ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Swiderski" <swiderski(at)rocketjet.net>
Subject: 5-ribs and 503's
Date: Mar 10, 2004
Kolbers, A few days ago I posted my opinion (abbreviated below) on putting a 503 on an original FS. I thought it a reasonable thing to do, especially with the positive experience I had with a similar hp engine on my US. We just read testimonials of cage cracking on the FS with that application. And today, it just popped into my head that I too had cracking on my floating engine mount on the US, although at least one other engine mount on a UltraStar occurred that I know of & it was with a stock 35 hp engine. I reinforced the affected area, went on with life & forgot about it. Conclusions: 1) Modifications increase risk of the unexpected. 2) Richard Swiderski's opinion is not infallible. 3) Tapping into the knowledge base of a group is invaluable. Would I put a 503 on an original FS? Absolutely! For me, the performance would be worth the modification needed to beef up the cage. I am probably more comfortable than most in exploring my limits, & I am willing to deal with the cascading effects of changing one thing only to have to change 5 others because of it. If experimental were not allowed in aviation, I would not be either. My great-great grand uncle used to tell me, "Richie Boy, arrogant experimenters do not live long enough to brag too much." If you tinker, ask a lot of questions, do small steps & keep a humble opinion of your ability to see all the possibilities. ...Richard Swiderski PS: I just added an Exhaust System page to my website http://www.geocities.com/ib2polish/ExhaustSysem.html?1078877874592 I am working on posting the crank sensor assembly page next Ralph, Everybody has an opinion, here's mine: I put about 350hr on my UltraStar which has a wing essentially identical to the original FireStar. My engine was a modified high performance Cuyuna which put out about 45hp. ..... I therefore would think that a 503 on an early FS is not unthinkable, especially if the craft was flown intelligently. ...... If I had an early FS & had the choice of a 447 or a 503, I'd put on the 503 without blinking an eye, because I would know that it would be me who controlled how fast the plane would go, not the engine. If I was the designer, I'd limit the plane to a 447. ...Richard Swiderski | I'm curious how many pilots on this list have 503's on their 5-rib | Original Firestar's without any modifications to the wings? | I was contacted by a fellow yesterday who is interested in buying an | Original Firestar powered by a 503. I wonder how many of them are out | there? For some of you guys that are familiar with the Original | Firestar's, what are your opinions on this? | | Ralph Burlingame ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 10, 2004
From: Jack & Louise Hart <jbhart(at)ldd.net>
Subject: 5-ribs and 503's
.............. > Conclusions: 1) Modifications increase risk of the unexpected. ............. Richard, FireFlyers and Kolbers I agree. It is always good to proceed slowly and check and recheck. Adding a more powerful engine to the FireFly has had its price. I did not worry much about the hp because I thought I could hog it down with increased prop pitch to limit a 48 hp engine to 38 hp and to keep the FireFly 103-7 legal. I was more worried about keeping the weight within limits, and getting the FireFly trimmed so that it flew well. With most issues taken care of and almost 50 hours with the FireFly and Victor 1+ engine combination, it was time to limit the hp. I proceeded to add a couple of twists to the IVO pitch adjustment screw to increase pitch. After three adjustments followed by three flights, I discovered that I was not going to be able to reach my goal. I had reduced the WOT rpm from 6,000 to 5,400 rpm. Everything seemed to be fine in the air, but on the ground the FireFly was becoming a monster. The prop pitch was so high that one had to heavily ride the brakes while taxiing to and from the runway. Even though the two blade propeller had been shortened to 56 inches, the engine firing impulse was too high and shook the cage. I took the pitch back out of the prop and took another spin around the pattern. I noticed an increase in exhaust noise. After landing and pushing the FireFly in the hangar, I checked it over very carefully. In about 15 minutes of flight, I had cracked the muffler in four places, broken one radiator mounting bracket, and cracked one of the radiator shutter mounting brackets. Repairs are under way and I am grounded until they are complete. But the unescapable conclusion is that with the Victor 1+ and FireFly combination I will not be able to make 103-7. I will fly this summer with the Victor 1+ and then I will have to mount a smaller hp MZ 34 (Compact Radial Engines) or F-33 (Hirth). It will be interesting to see the effect of a 50 pound weight reduction on FireFly performance. Jack B. Hart FF004 Jackson, MO Jack & Louise Hart jbhart(at)ldd.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: WhiskeyVictor36(at)aol.com
Date: Mar 10, 2004
Subject: Can you convert 5 rib to 7?
All this talk about the 5 rib wing made me wonder if one could convert it to 7 ribs. That is, could you install 2 additional ribs onto the same "old" spars. This would require moving all the ribs to a new location, leaving some empty pop rivet holes and then require additional new holes for the rearranged rib locations. My Original FireStar builders manual cautioned against drilling "extra" unneccessary holes in the spar, so personally I wouldn't feel comfortable doing it. But, I was just curious if anyone else thought about it. Bill Varnes Original FireStar Audubon, NJ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 10, 2004
Subject: Re: Can you convert 5 rib to 7?
From: ul15rhb(at)juno.com
> > All this talk about the 5 rib wing made me wonder if one could > convert it to > 7 ribs. That is, could you install 2 additional ribs onto the same > "old" > spars. This would require moving all the ribs to a new location, > leaving some > empty pop rivet holes and then require additional new holes for the > rearranged > rib locations. My Original FireStar builders manual cautioned > against drilling > "extra" unneccessary holes in the spar, so personally I wouldn't > feel > comfortable doing it. But, I was just curious if anyone else > thought about it. > > > Bill Varnes > Original FireStar > Audubon, NJ Bill, I think it would be better to get new 7-rib wings for the Firestar. One interesting thing I have found this last week is the fact that 503's can be used on Challenger wings, CGS Hawk wings, and even on the Aerolite 103. The integrity of those wings do not measure up to a 5-rib, 5" spar Firestar wing in my opinion. I have been flying this plane some 17 years now. Maybe it's best to be on the conservative side (for airplanes that is). Ralph Original Firestar 17 years flying it ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 10, 2004
From: "Bob N." <ronoy(at)shentel.net>
Subject: Re: Can you convert 5 rib to 7?
A year or more ago there were a bunch of posts on this. Try archives, maybe there. Bob N. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Denny Rowe" <rowedl(at)highstream.net>
Subject: Re: Sling Shot details
Date: Mar 11, 2004
----- Original Message ----- From: <herbgh(at)juno.com> Subject: Kolb-List: Sling Shot details > > Hi Guys > > Looking at a pic of a sling shot and wondering if it has 6 inch spars > and tail boom?? Looks as if TNK no longer offers it . Herb in Ky > > Herb, The Slingshot does use 6 inch spars and tail boom. Same as the Mk-3s and Kolbras, only shorter. Denny Rowe I ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Mar 12, 2004
From: Eugene Zimmerman <eugenezimmerman(at)dejazzd.com>
Subject: List
Just a check. Did I get bumped off the list or did the list just die? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dale Sellers" <dsel1(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: List
Date: Mar 12, 2004
Died for me too. Bet nine months from now will tell what list members were doing. Dale Sellers Georgia ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eugene Zimmerman" <eugenezimmerman(at)dejazzd.com> Subject: Kolb-List: List > > Just a check. > > Did I get bumped off the list or did the list just die? > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Sling Shot Availability
Date: Mar 12, 2004
Hi All: Got a call from Travis Brown, Number One Parts Man, TNK. Travis asked me to pass on to the Kolb List the following. The Sling Shot is available. It has not been advertised, but kits are available on an as needed basis. That is, the parts for the kits are not kept on the shelf, but if someone buys a SS Kit, it will be welded up and sent on its way. I personally enjoy flying the SS. It is a fun airplane, agile, fast, extremely strong (I think Dennis and Homer designed it for me so I would not be able to break it.) and gets in the air and on the ground like the rest of the Kolb family. I heartedly endorse it. I have flown it with the 582 and a passenger with a big commercial video camera. Also flown the 912 powered SS with passenger. It seems to feel better when loaded down than when flown single pilot. Amazed me first time I took off with a passenger in the 582 powered SS. Did a tremendous job for those tiny little stubby 22' wings. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
Subject: Re: tank installation
Date: Mar 12, 2004
Bryan... I have got the tank installed...I set in in with the filler cap to the side...and all the way down on the boom..like the origional 5 gal was in the FireFly. I put it in there that way so to get the cap closer to the side to make it weasier to fill. I also ordered a 5 gal fuel jug from Jaz becuse I have always had trouble filling from a 5 gallon gas can. This "Fuel Jug", as they are called, has the neck all the way to the edge of the jug, so when you tip it up to horizontal, all the fuel will drain. Due to the way I have to fill my Fly, , from the side, I cant tip a 5 gallon can up very high because the it hits the bottom of the wing. and this taller tank will make that worse. I hope this new gas can will make it easier to fill. I welded the small tabs you see in the pics to the cage, and made a corresponding bracket from .250x..028 cromemoly tubing, and welded tabs on the ends , drilled for a AN3 bolt...and I will be able to remove it and replace it with something different if the need arises....Like maybe putting back a 5 gallon tank if I have to some day. THis way I can unbolt the large tank holding frame and bolt in a smaller oner that fits the smaller tank. This is very similiar to the way to other 5 gal tank was in there..other than the .250 tubing was welded to the cage...which I removed altogether. anyhow enclosed are the pics.. I am covering the cage today...and I made a door on the side hinged at the top and fastened with camlocs to access the fuel tank to fill it. and also access the small baggage storage I put in at the rear of the cage. That is the aluminum you see in the rear section of the cage. Don ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Paul Petty" <Lynnp@c-gate.net>
Subject: slow so...
Date: Mar 12, 2004
Hi Kolbers, It's been slow here in the Kolb camp for the past few days. I guess many, like myself have been busy dusting off the mowers, starting up the swimming pool and getting outdoors and flying and such. Not to mention building an airplane. With the grass starting to turn green and the temps beginning to climb out of the freezing range, I am excited about this summer. My plans include completing my PPL training and finishing my Kolbra. I ordered kit 2 yesterday and are waiting for it to arrive next week sometime. Just a note here when ordering kits from TNK. I plan on installing Matco brakes and larger wheels and tires that John W. has on his Kolbra. I also plan on a custom fuel cell and flaps for Ms.Dixie. So, when I ordered kit # 2 I asked Linda if she could delete the wheels and tires and fuel tanks. I was pleased to hear her say "Not a problem". They will subtract the "cost" of these items from the kit. TNK folks are a wonderful to work with. Key work here though is "cost" not what you and I would pay for these items, but what the factory pays for them. Probably more than what you could get for these items if ya sold them to a buddy. TNK company to me is more like a family of people rather than a kit airplane company. Trust me on this one.. Rans did a 180 on us after a hand shake deal at S$F last year. Engines.... On the way to the airport last weekend I asked Charley.. "Did you tell me previously that the "360" in IO360 stood for cubic inch displacement?" He replied with a yes. I sat quiet in the car and thought about that for a while.... Ok self.. trying to do the math... 4 cylinders ... 360 CID... dang that's 90 CI per hole.... if that were a V8 it would be a 720 CID engine! And after looking at the cylinder length it looks a lot like the 912 rotax. A calculation from a yahoo hanger regular and A&P said he figured it @ 5.125 bore x 4.375 stroke.... still don't sound big enough for me. Anyone care to explain this one to me? (pi 3.14159 pi/4 .7853975 d bore diameter of a cylinder dxx2 d-squared stroke stroke of crankshaft cyl number of cylinders) Don? ya out there buddy? Well guys & gals it's Friday night an I have a hot date with a air drill and a bunch of aluminum tubing! :-) ps. Charley..20k hour pilot flew the R/C J3 cub for me the first time this past weekend....hehe one turn and straight into the house.... engine torn off front of the foam fuselage ripped in half... we laughed for hours.... a little Elmer's and she was good to go! Have fun this weekend folks! Paul Petty Building Ms. Dixie Kolbra/912UL/Warp ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "H MITCHELL" <mitchmnd(at)msn.com>
Subject: Velcro deterioration
Date: Mar 12, 2004
Hi Gang, 'Took my Firefly for a hop this A.M. and she was happy to go. After climbout I took her up to cruise speed and was tooling along just fine until I heard one of those strange noises we all dread. 'Made it back to the field and set her down without further problems. When I looked her over I found that the back section of my metal wing gap cover had popped up and was making all the noise. Close examination showed that one area of two inch wide velcro had lost most of it's "fuz". It has been on there for about two years and was not bald but definitely less than new. I used a piece of new matching Velcro to test it's holding power and confirmed that it was no longer holding as it should. In addition the cables going to the BRS rocket were not where they should be and were pushing against the underside of the gap cover. Note: it was the fuzzy side of the velcro that lost it's grip the loop side tested o.k. Builder's Note: I found that removing the Velcro from the top of the inboard wing rib was going to be a real problem because it is glued on and MEK would make a real mess of the fabric in that area. I will probably just glue a new piece on top of the old one. The matching velcro (loops) on the underside of the metal gap cover is o.k. I should have had the fuzzy side glued to the metal so that when it wore out it would be easy to remove because the MEK would not damage the metal. Living and still learning, Duane the plane Tallahassee, FL, FireFly SN007, Mk3/912. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Christopher Armstrong" <tophera(at)centurytel.net>
Subject: slow so...
Date: Mar 12, 2004
----- A calculation from a yahoo hanger regular and A&P said he figured it @ 5.125 bore x 4.375 stroke.... still don't sound big enough for me. Displacement is piston area times stroke. The area is pi* r 2, so you have 3.14*(5.125/2) 2*4.375=90.25 cubic inches... times 4 cylinders is 361 CID. Topher ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Fw: Monument Valley
Date: Mar 12, 2004
I sent this link to Boyd a few minutes ago, and bcc'ed to myself. Since the new trip is in just a couple of months, I thought this might be an appropriate time to dust off the old memories, and get the dreams going again. Enjoy. Lar. Subject: Monument Valley I just published a few pics of the MV trip to the Nikon camera forum. This is a true world wide group, and a lot of fun. Your plane is in 2 of the pics I used, and I thought you might like to take another look. If this link works out, I think I'll send it to the whole List. John W., your plane's here, too, and I believe the pics were all taken from Miss P'fer. Good memories. Lar. http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum1007&message7985258 Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Velcro deterioration
Date: Mar 13, 2004
Duane: I also built an aluminum gap seal for the Fly... and I put the wide velcro on 100% of the side edges.... But I didn't trust the velcro enough to stop there.... Riveted 4 little angle hooks onto the trailing edge corners of the seal.... 2 on the top, 2 on the bottom... use two bungee cords to secure the seal's trailing edge around the top of the cage.... The bungees are out of sight and don't interfere with the BRS harness should it need to be deployed... The cords really nail down that gap seal and keep it snugged back against the leading edge.. takes an extra minute to hook it up when I install the seal, but worth it in terms of peace of mind ... that seal would really do a job on the IVO if it ever got back there... Glad yours didn't come completely loose... Regards, Beauford FF-076 ----- Original Message ----- > > 'Took my Firefly for a hop this A.M.. When I looked her over I found that the back section of my metal wing gap cover had popped up and was making all the noise. > > Close examination showed that one area of two inch wide velcro had lost most of it's "fuz, > > Duane the plane > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Elder" <billelder(at)denver.net>
Subject: Re: Monument Valley 2004
Date: Mar 13, 2004
John - please remove me from the list attending the Monument Valley event for this year. Family duties require me to be out of the country during that timeframe - too bad for me!!!! Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Williamson" <kolbrapilot(at)comcast.net> Subject: Kolb-List: Monument Valley 2004 > > Remember you are responsible for making your own arrangements with > Goulding's. > > Folks that have stated an interest in gathering at Monument Valley during > May 14-17, 2004: > > John Hauck, Kolb Mark III, Titus, AL jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com > John Williamson, Kolb Kolbra, Arlington, TX kolbrapilot(at)comcast.net > Boyd Young, Kolb Mark III, Brigham City, UT by0ung(at)brigham.net > Craig Nelson, Kolb Mark IIIXtra, Gilbert, AZ vitalfx0(at)msn.com > Dave Pelletier, Kolb Mark III or FireStar, Prescott, AZ > pelletier(at)cableone.net > Dave Rains, Cessna 175, El Paso, TX rr(at)htg.net > Dennis Kirby, Kolb Mark III, Cedar Crest, NM Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil > Erich Weaver, Kolb Mark III , Santa Barbara, CA erich_weaver(at)urscorp.com > Gary Haley, Kolb Mark III, Houston, TX ghaley(at)wt.net > Jim Hefner, Kolb FireFly, Tucson, AZ hefners_tucson(at)hotmail.com > John Bickham, Kolb Mark III, St. Francisville, LA BICUM(at)aol.com > Larry Bourne, Kolb Mark III, Palm Springs, CA biglar(at)gogittum.com > Larry Cottrell, Kolb Mark III, Klamath Falls, OR lcottrel(at)kfalls.net > Tim Gherkins, Kolb FireStar II, Gilbert, AZ rp3420(at)motorola.com > Tom Kuffel, Prospector, Whitefish, MT kuffel(at)cyberport.net > Will Uribe, Kolb FireStar II. El Paso, TX WillUribe(at)aol.com > Ted Cowan, Kolb SlingShot,Opelika, AL tcowan1917(at)direcway.com > Jim Clayton, Kolb Mark IIIXtra , Santa Clara, CA jspc78(at)yahoo.com > Bruce Williams, Kitfox, MS > Mark German, Kolb Kolbra, Chisago City, MN aerofab(at)worldnet.att.net > Bill Elder, Kolb Mark III, Conifer CO, billelder(at)denver.net > > > John Williamson > Arlington, TX > > Kolb Kolbra: 508 hours, Rotax 912 ULS > http://home.comcast.net/~kolbrapilot/ > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Re: MV Pics
Date: Mar 13, 2004
Gonna hafta do some research. Last night it worked fine; this morning it doesn't. Too bad...........some of the responses were funny. Ah, OK, just now I tried it again, and if you look near the top of the page, you'll see where it says "Jump To," and an arrow beside "News Discussions." Click that arrow, scroll down to "Nikon Talk," and click on it. As of 8:10 AM, Saturday, 3/13/04, my message and the replies are about 7th from the top. The forum moves pretty fast............in a couple of hours it may be way down there, if there's no more replies. Way up if there is. The 2nd reply from Bud Guinn, 6th from the top is amazing. I've got a lot to learn before I can do that. Impressed Lar. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Subject: MV Pics > Do we have to sign up to be able to find the correct page? > > The url does not take me there. > > http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum1007&message7985258 > > john h > >


February 20, 2004 - March 13, 2004

Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-ev