Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-fn
August 05, 2005 - September 05, 2005
Hi John,
Here's the Lat/Long from the AirNav site:
Lat/Long: 37-09-04.0000N / 084-15-27.0000W
37-09.066667N / 084-15.450000W
37.1511111 / -84.2575000
The AirNav site has lots of other info too:
http://www.airnav.com/airport/3KY2
Cheers,
Rusty (yes Steve, they print a new calendar EVERY year )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: TNK Homecoming |
| the 2005 Annual Fly-In. It is scheduled for Sept 23rd and 24th.
That should
| be a Thursday and a Friday. | Steve
Steve/Gang:
Travis is using wrong year. 23 and 24 will be more like Fri and Sat,
as usual. ;-)
john h
________________________________________________________________________________
required 4.6, BAYES_44 -0.00, HTML_MESSAGE 0.25)
Kolbers,
Guys it has been hot ...damn hot to be honest ..however still plugging along. Today
I went to the shop pondered many things but after a long week I just cleaned
up took a few pics and called it a night. Our new member to the list Mitty..
is planning to visit this weekend. He wants to build a Ultra star from scratch.
I like this idea. If any of you remember way back when I found this Kolb
list I was seeking info about a ultralight that I found on the internet. Turns
out it was Dennis performing loops in a Ultrastar with very short landing gear.
More like a quicksilver. I for one would love to find those pictures... The
Ultra star was my first pic but after two visits to TNK guess what .... dead
up in a high dollar Kolbra! yeeee haaaa
If any one can find those pics of Dennis inverted in that unpainted plain high
boom ultra I would sure like to archive them...
It was the struts over the king post and wires approach that drew me to Kolb aircraft
in the first place.
as for up dated pics of Ms Dixie here ya have it!
http://www.c-gate.net/~ppetty/photos/P8050001.JPG
http://www.c-gate.net/~ppetty/photos/P8050002.JPG
http://www.c-gate.net/~ppetty/photos/P8050003.JPG
http://www.c-gate.net/~ppetty/photos/P8050005.JPG
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tenn Metfan <tnmetfanbeckett(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: TNK Homecoming |
Can a Kolb wannabe drive in? Checked MapQuest says I am 4 hours and 270 miles away...,
any place for a motorhome to park nearby?
| the 2005 Annual Fly-In. It is scheduled for Sept 23rd and 24th.
That should
| be a Thursday and a Friday. | Steve
Steve/Gang:
Travis is using wrong year. 23 and 24 will be more like Fri and Sat,
as usual. ;-)
john h
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "woody" <duesouth(at)govital.net> |
| Subject: | Re: TNK Homecoming |
Thurs Fri ????? Wouldn't it be more sensible to have it Friday and Sat? More
people would attend.
----- Original Message -----
From: <N27SB(at)aol.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: TNK Homecoming
>
> To All,
>
> I talked to Travis today at Kolb and he asked if I would post the dates
for
> the 2005 Annual Fly-In. It is scheduled for Sept 23rd and 24th. That
should
> be a Thursday and a Friday. If you have any questions you can call him at
> 606-862-9692. He is about 400 E Mails behind so calling would be better.
>
>
> Steve
>
>
> --
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: TNK Homecoming |
| I know I have already gone on for to long already, but wanted to
give you a little info about where I am in the process of becoming a
Kolb owner. I look forward to becoming more involved with the list,
and am sure I will have many questions, but hope I will be able to
share in someway to repay for the knowledge gained.
|
|
| Mike Schnabel
|
| Manchester, Tennessee
Morning Mike/All:
Welcome aboard.
Be sure to be at The 2005 Kolb Home Coming. The more you are exposed
to Kolbs and Kolb people, the more you will learn about both. This
should make selection of the right Kolb for you a little easier.
Some of us will try to get to London a day or so early this year.
Take care,
john h
MKIII/912ULS
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | 447 Prop Pitch60 |
Beauford/Gang:
Back in the day of my original Firestar, kits were shipped with fixed
pitch wooden props. Homer wouldn't sell me a 377 for my Firestar, so
I horse traded the 377 for a 447. Flew that 447 with a Jim Culver
32X60. Tried a GSC 30X60 once. Flew it to Lakeland in 1989, but it
would pitched a little too light.
How does the 32X60 compare to the 66 inch prop and pitch you are
running on your 447? I am still leaning more to over pitched prop as
your major problem for high CHT's. If it was fuel or timing, EGT's
would be a major factor long before the CHT got hot.
Accuracy of gauges should probably be checked.
john h
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "flykolb" <flykolb(at)carolina.rr.com> |
1.30 DATE_IN_FUTURE_06_12 Date: is 6 to 12 hours after Received: date
Kolbers,
I have a Rotax 532 and am thinking of sending it to steve at Airscrew to convert
from points ot CDI. Any experience or comments?
Jim
Mark III
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Cottrell" <lcottrel(at)kfalls.net> |
Dennis,
I am sure that a standard pipe plug of the proper size would do the job.
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: <owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com>
>
> From: Kirby Dennis Contr MDA/AL <Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil>
> To: "'kolb-list(at)matronics.com'"
> Subject: EGT Probe for 912
> Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 16:18:34 +0100
>
> Kolb Friends -
>
> I am in the final stages of the 912 installation for my Mark-III.
>
> The engine was originally equipped with an EGT probe in the exhaust pipe.
> Since I do not intend to use an EGT gauge in my plane, I removed the
> probe.
> What's left is a 1/8" hole in the exhaust pipe, and I understand it is NOT
> recommended that the engine be run with this hole uncovered.
>
> My question is: What's the recommended way to seal this old EGT hole?
>
> Many thanks -
> Dennis Kirby
> Cedar Crest, NM
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM05(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: NOMEX- Wear it!!! |
Had a couple of guys fly into my strip a few weeks ago. One the pilot and
the other his instructor, he was one of those ultra light instructors that
could walk on water. They both complained how scary my strip is. They were
flying a MKIIIc with a 582 and the human load was app 370 lbs and the plane
weighed something like 500 lbs empty. I vaguely remember hearing them say
they climbed out of a airport 20 miles away at full power and never got over
2000 ft. When I looked at their plane it didn't have any seal between the
wing and the flaps or ailerons and they had lowered the horizontal
stabilizer so that it was parallel with the boom tube because they were
running out of up elevator. They had a bunch of other "improvements". I
tried to get across that the gap seal was important but the instructor had
his chest stuck out so far with great skill and knowledge he just knew I was
wrong. I didn't push the issue but I really wish I had. When they took off
they used every inch of my downhill 1400 ft strip. They then had to
maneuvered to pass between trees a half mile out. They scared the hell out
of me. When I got a chance I E-Mailed the guy and said that if he was still
alive to no fly again till he fixed the gap seal. He responded that my strip
was short, down wind, high density altitude, etc. but nothing about fixing
the problem. He also stated his rotation speed when heavy is 55MPH but
rotated at 52 because of the short strip. Hopefully I will not hear a crash
and burn story about these guys.
I can sort of overlook the student for not knowing and maybe not following
the plans when he had a "experienced" cobuilder and "instructor". I will
NEVER forgive the "instructor" for loading those two people up in that plane
and flying it cross country into my airstrip. The "instructor" had to have
known how poorly the plane flew solo. So why would he fly it heavy on a
cross country in that condition into a known (short strip?). You would have
to be brain dead to do that. Is this the kind of "instructor" these ultra
light organizations are turning out??? Maybe I'm over reacting? I'm planning
on tracking down the instructor and doing my best to get his "instructor"
status revoked. Again am I wrong? I live in a Rotax 912 and VW powered MKIII
world maybe the 582 is greatly underpowered. Am I out of touch? I don't like
hearing these crash and burn stories. Just tell me I'm wrong and I will
leave it alone.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW powered MKIIIc
----- Original Message -----
From: "dama" <dama(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: NOMEX- Wear it!!!
>
> Very sad. We had a Mini Max crash here recently on it's first flight with
> fatal results. Seems to have been a stall/spin. Get some space (multiple
> runways) and wear your Nomex, gents...
> Kip
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: NOMEX- Wear it!!! |
An airport friend of mine crashing>>
Hi Rusty,
really sorry to hear of your friends crash. Hope that he makes it OK.
Pat
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: NOMEX- Wear it!!!? Challenger performance |
The second instructor I had trained in a Challenger CW SPL. >>
Hi Dan,
That is terrible performance. Mine has around 5 ft extra span against the
Clipwing but my grass strip is about 1500 feet and if I am not airborne in
about a third of that and climbing at 800 feet a minute at 50knots something
is wrong. I weigh in at around 200 lbs. With Wendy aboard performance drop
off a bit but not much.
All on a 503 .
Cheers
Pat
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wayne T. McCullough" <blackbird754(at)alltel.net> |
| Subject: | Re: CDI conversion |
Jim,
I fly a 532 Rotax on a T-bird here in Springfield, Georgia....I am
president of Eaa chapter 330. I am currently building a Kolbra with a 582
bluehead engine....
On your subject , I have Steve Beatty C.D.I. ignition on my 532 and have had
three engine outs......Problem with the C.D.I. however, on inspection all
three times the coil under the flywheel had broken a wire in the winding
itself. In all fairness it wasn't his fault, he just sold the parts. I think
that he is using Japanese coils and winding off of what I do not know....the
club members and I unwound the wire on the coil and found the wire
INTERNALLY broke about three inches from the bottom.....
When C.D.I goes out......it does not spit or sputter like points do.....It
goes silent IMMEDIATELY....After 3 engine outs due to igniton problems, the
most of any club member, 68 all total, I am very leary of this setup, I will
not leave the local airport vicinity....Looking forward to the Kolbra and
two ignition systems.
15 years of flying and looking experience here. 2 stroke motorcycles and
boat racing after 33 years under my belt....Yep, and I will probably go to
the 4 stroke after I get the Kolbra flying.....
Wayne McCullough
----- Original Message -----
From: "flykolb" <flykolb(at)carolina.rr.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: CDI conversion
>
> Kolbers,
>
> I have a Rotax 532 and am thinking of sending it to steve at Airscrew to
> convert from points ot CDI. Any experience or comments?
>
> Jim
> Mark III
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "b young" <by0ung(at)brigham.net> |
What is the address where you guys are getting the 925 battery
shipped to you for your Kolbs? I recall you paid $100 for them and did that
include shipping?
Dallas Shepherd
Norfork, Ar.
the batery i am using in my mk III 912 i got from harber freight..... it is
a 18 amp hour sealed batery it came included in one of the quick starts, jump
starts.... it included a light, volt meter, air compressor, batery charger,,,,,
all for around $30 i put my old batery in the quick start,
it does not have power to start anything but it will still run the compressor
and light.
boyd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
Morning Gang:
I have been using Hawker Odyssey batteries for the last 5+ years.
This 12 amp hr battery will wind up a 912ULS with no problem in below
freezing weather.
http://www.gotbatteries.com/items.asp?params=search/SLA/1/odyssey/PC545
This battery with shipping will cost about $80.00 to Alabama.
Prior to the last Alaska flight I bought a new 16 amp hr Odyssey. No
way I can hand start the 912ULS safely, especially when I am out there
by myself somewhere. Did not want to take a chance on getting stuck
in the boonies.
http://www.gotbatteries.com/items.asp?params=batteries/SLA/1/Hawker%20Odyssey/PC680/0769-2016/SL105/37L105S5
This one will cost about $90.00 shipped to Alabama.
These batteries can be mounted in any position. No problem with acid
overflow on the airplane like the old wet Wal*Mart batteries some of
us used in the old days. I did the 1994 flight with a 14 amp hr
Wal*Mart motorcycle battery. Had to get a jump start in Dead Horse
when the temps got down below freezing.
Take care,
john h
MKIII/912ULS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob and Jenn B" <tabberdd(at)hotmail.com> |
Gap seals have been brought up again as in the past. Has anyone seen any
performance boost or better contol authority with them? I put them on my Mk
II, used the tape on the top and bottom, and didn't notice a thing. It
became a hassle when it started peeling so I took it off, still no change.
Maybe I just don't go fast enough to make a difference, I rarely get over
60, so the drag doesn't affect it and the stall seemed the same.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Denny Rowe" <rowedl(at)highstream.net> |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob and Jenn B" <tabberdd(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: Gap Seals
>
> Gap seals have been brought up again as in the past. Has anyone seen any
> performance boost or better contol authority with them? I put them on my
> Mk
> II, used the tape on the top and bottom, and didn't notice a thing. It
> became a hassle when it started peeling so I took it off, still no change.
>
> Maybe I just don't go fast enough to make a difference, I rarely get over
> 60, so the drag doesn't affect it and the stall seemed the same.
>
> Bob
>
>
> Bob,
On my Mk-3 I began flight testing without the tape and than added it.
The control response, glide performance, cruise and top speeds all improved.
It felt like I removed a lot of drag.
I applied the clear 3M book binding tape to the bottom side only.
One of the things that might make a differance from plane to plane is how
big of a gap the builder has between each surface, the bigger the gaps, the
more air passes between the surfaces without tape, so the bigger the
improvement when tape is added. OK OK I admit it, I have a little more gap
between surfaces than the plans call for.
Denny Rowe, Mk-3, PA, Still working on the hanger.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ted Cowan <trc1917(at)direcway.com> |
Just want to make a couple of comments here. I just know someone was really
smart enough to know to keep the piston rings marked and tagged for the
piston they came off of during decarbonization. I mean, pistons are not
round and they are not-not round at an equal pace. One piston can 'egg' at
a different position. If you put the ring/rings on the wrong piston during
assembly, you got a problem. Might work for a little while but would not
seat because of the micro grooves already in the walls and ring sets. (Note
the word 'sets') It would be very easy to put the top ring from #1 piston
to #2 piston especially if you were not practiced in this art.
Number two thought: If I were to have a little hole in my exhaust pipe
from a probe, I would put a small stainless screw in it and place a muffler
clamp on it for safety. I believe that would be that until I needed the
hole again.
Thirdly: I mostly wear my Nomax or whatever it is, jump suit unless it is
super hot out. I also wear a modified chopper helmet to protect what little
brain waves I may have at the present time. I wouldnt think of driving my
scooter without one either. You can beat your body into little pieces and
survive but one little tap in the wrong place on your head, yo a veggie. My
thoughts. Ted Cowan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Kolb List Archives |
| | To search the Kolb Archives, go to the bottom of this post, click
| on:
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "jdmurr(at)juno.com" <jdmurr(at)juno.com> |
| Subject: | Aileron Authority on Firestar |
In addition to gap seal, which I have, Is there any other way to increase the aileron
authority?
I have a 1989 Firestar. My stick travels to the left and it hits the windshield.
Right isn't much better. For most applications this is enough especially if
I add rudder. I just don't want to get caught short if I need it.
Is there a fix for this or a modification from the original installation? Thanks.
John
________________________________________________________________________________
To All
I am getting ready to replace the CHT Senders on my 447. Has any one come up
with an alternative to using the reglular old spark plug type?
Thanks
steve
Firefly #007
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bryan green <lgreen1(at)sc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Authority on Firestar |
Hello John, check for slop in your control system and check the
adjustment on your aileron cables you should have more then enough
aileron on your plane.
Bryan Green Elgin SC
Firestar 447 BRS
jdmurr(at)juno.com wrote:
>
>
>In addition to gap seal, which I have, Is there any other way to increase the
aileron authority?
>
>I have a 1989 Firestar. My stick travels to the left and it hits the windshield.
Right isn't much better. For most applications this is enough especially
if I add rudder. I just don't want to get caught short if I need it.
>
>Is there a fix for this or a modification from the original installation? Thanks.
>
>John
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bryan green <lgreen1(at)sc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Authority on Firestar |
Sorry gang, scratch the part about cables just woke up. check for wear
and adjustment in your aileron control system.
Bryan Green Elgin SC
bryan green wrote:
>
>Hello John, check for slop in your control system and check the
>adjustment on your aileron cables you should have more then enough
>aileron on your plane.
>Bryan Green Elgin SC
>Firestar 447 BRS
>
>jdmurr(at)juno.com wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>>
>>In addition to gap seal, which I have, Is there any other way to increase the
aileron authority?
>>
>>I have a 1989 Firestar. My stick travels to the left and it hits the windshield.
Right isn't much better. For most applications this is enough especially
if I add rudder. I just don't want to get caught short if I need it.
>>
>>Is there a fix for this or a modification from the original installation? Thanks.
>>
>>John
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "woody" <duesouth(at)govital.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Authority on Firestar |
Have you ever bumped your knuckles on the windshield while flying?
> I have a 1989 Firestar. My stick travels to the left and it hits the
windshield. Right isn't much better. For most applications this is enough
especially if I add rudder. I just don't want to get caught short if I need
it.
>
> Is there a fix for this or a modification from the original installation?
Thanks.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "jdmurr(at)juno.com" <jdmurr(at)juno.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Authority on Firestar |
yes
-- "woody" wrote:
Have you ever bumped your knuckles on the windshield while flying?
> I have a 1989 Firestar. My stick travels to the left and it hits the
windshield. Right isn't much better. For most applications this is enough
especially if I add rudder. I just don't want to get caught short if I need
it.
>
> Is there a fix for this or a modification from the original installation?
Thanks.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Authority on Firestar |
In a message dated 8/8/2005 11:35:12 AM Eastern Standard Time,
jdmurr(at)juno.com writes:
In addition to gap seal, which I have, Is there any other way to increase the
aileron authority?
\
Vortex Generators [VG's] will help some.......
Howard Shackleford
FS II
SC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WhiskeyVictor36(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 8/8/2005 12:26:12 PM Eastern Standard Time, N27SB(at)aol.com
writes:
alternative to using the reglular old spark plug type
Steve/All,
On my 447, I used a 10 mm size sender and installed it under the 8 mm cyl
head nut. This may not give you the exact head temp, but it will still allow you
to monitor any change. (Beauford, listen up)--Mine indicates 250 degrees,
lower than normal. This eliminates the wear and tear on the sensor everytime
you remove the sparkplug. I only use a single sensor and instrument. The
sensor is placed under the rear most bolt on the intake side of the engine, because
I thought that might be the hottest point.
Bill Varnes
Original Kolb FireStar
Audubon NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tom sabean <sabeantp(at)eastlink.ca> |
Listers,
When I built my Mark 3 Xtra I applied the gap seal to the ailerons only. Now I'm
wondering if I should extend it to include the flap area.
What do most guys do?
Thanks,
Tom Sabean
Mk3X
912/Warp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Denny Rowe" <rowedl(at)highstream.net> |
Seal everything on the wing.
----- Original Message -----
From: "tom sabean" <sabeantp(at)eastlink.ca>
Subject: Kolb-List: Gap Seals
>
> Listers,
>
> When I built my Mark 3 Xtra I applied the gap seal to the ailerons only.
> Now I'm wondering if I should extend it to include the flap area.
> What do most guys do?
>
> Thanks,
> Tom Sabean
> Mk3X
> 912/Warp
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Smith <ocleju(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Alternative Engines - Geo/Suzuki |
Alternative Engines - Geo/Suzuki
If you are interested in alternative engines for
experimental aircraft you are invited to
join the flyGeo_uncensored group and learn about the
fantastic Geo/Suzuki engines used in
aircraft.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FlyGeo_uncensored
Both bolt on gearbox and cog belt redrives and all
other aircraft
conversion parts are available for very reasonable
cost. Turbo
versions are available also. Gearbox type redrives for
around US$1750-
The Geo/Suzuki engine uses about half the fuel that
the two stroke
engines use.
The 1.3 litre four cylinder Suzuki engine beats the
Rotax 912 in
power and weight, again both gearbox and belt type
redrives are
available.
The Geo/Suzuki one litre engine weighs a little more
than a Rotax
582, it produces 62 HP normally aspirated but with a
better, flatter
torque curve.
All those advantages plus flying engines with the
hours up to prove
them and last but not lease, far, far cheaper than a
Rotax two or four stroke engine.
One person on the group has over 1000 hours on one
installation.
FlyGeo_uncensored is a very active and helpful group
that is also a fun group and is not
doubt one of the fastest growing aircraft alternative
engine groups.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FlyGeo_uncensored
The FlyGeo_uncensored Management
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "b young" <by0ung(at)brigham.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Authority on Firestar |
> I have a 1989 Firestar. My stick travels to the left and it hits the
windshield. Right isn't much better. For most applications this is enough
especially if I add rudder. I just don't want to get caught short if I need
it.
>
> Is there a fix for this or a modification from the original installation?
Thanks.
>
-----------------
how far does the trailing edge of the aileron move up and down when the
stick travels from full left to full right?
boyd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Pierzina <planecrazzzy(at)yahoo.com> |
Hey Guys,
Brian wrote me and I'm passing the message along to the list.....I
gave him the subscribe address, meanwhile
any of you guys sellin FS's can contact him....I thought somebody in Michigan had
just posted something....?
SNIP>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Nice plane! I live just East of the twin cities in River Falls WI and would like
to purchase a firestar II. Were's the best place to find a fully built one?
Thanks,
Brian Motzer
"Brian Motzer"
My Web Site:
http://www.geocities.com/planecrazzzy/Planecrazzzy.html
Sometimes you just have to take the leap and build your wings on the way down...
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ted Cowan <trc1917(at)direcway.com> |
Would like to mention that anyone looking for a really nice MkIII should go
to our web site at: www.homestead.com/southernflyers and check out the for
sale section. This is really nice especially for the price. Ted Cowan.
Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dama" <dama(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Pre Mix made easy |
For all of you pre-mixers out there, I thought that I would share what I have been
using for that last 3 years. Find a bottled water brand called "VOSS". And,
if you don't mind spending $1.89 for the 13oz. bottle, you'll have a convenient
bottle to mix in. It looks like this...
http://www.springeraviation.net/premix1.html
I add oil to the point to where it says "artesian" near the top. NOTE...in the
pic, I have tilted the bottle to show the letters but the idea is to fill it right
to the line. This is 50:1 for 5 gallons of gas. I add Marvels Mystery Oil
in the remainder of the bottle (about 2oz.) This package travels easily to the
gas station and I used it on my trip to Sun N Fun. I just bought a new bottle
and after 3 years, the "artesian" mark is still in the same place on the new
bottle.
http://www.springeraviation.net/premix2.html
This method sure works better that using the Ratio Rite at the gas station!
Regards,
Kip
http://www.springeraviation.net/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pre Mix made easy |
Kip and others,
I've found that a plastic baby bottle works even better with the ounces marked
on the side. Can't go wrong here.
Ralph
Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
-- \"dama\" wrote:
For all of you pre-mixers out there, I thought that I would share what I have been
using for that last 3 years. Find a bottled water brand called "VOSS". And,
if you don't mind spending $1.89 for the 13oz. bottle, you'll have a convenient
bottle to mix in. It looks like this...
http://www.springeraviation.net/premix1.html
I add oil to the point to where it says "artesian" near the top. NOTE...in the
pic, I have tilted the bottle to show the letters but the idea is to fill it right
to the line. This is 50:1 for 5 gallons of gas. I add Marvels Mystery Oil
in the remainder of the bottle (about 2oz.) This package travels easily to the
gas station and I used it on my trip to Sun N Fun. I just bought a new bottle
and after 3 years, the "artesian" mark is still in the same place on the new
bottle.
http://www.springeraviation.net/premix2.html
This method sure works better that using the Ratio Rite at the gas station!
Regards,
Kip
http://www.springeraviation.net/
Kip and others,
I've found that a plastic baby bottle works even better with the ounces marked
on the side. Can't go wrong here.
Ralph
Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
--\"dama\"wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"dama"
Forallofyoupre-mixersoutthere,IthoughtthatIwouldsharewhatIhavebeenusingforthatlast3years.Findabottledwaterbrandcalled"VOSS".And,ifyoudon'tmindspending$1.89forthe13oz.bottle,you'llhaveaconvenientbottletomixin.Itlookslikethis...
http://www.springeraviation.net/premix1.html
Iaddoiltothepointtowhereitsays"artesian"nearthetop.NOTE...inthepic,Ihavetiltedthebottleto&nb
sp;showthelettersbuttheideaistofillitrighttotheline.Thisis50:1for5gallonsofgas.IaddMarvelsMysteryOilintheremainderofthebottle(about2oz.)ThispackagetravelseasilytothegasstationandIuseditonmytriptoSunNFun.Ijustboughtanewbottleandafter3years,the"artesian"markisstillinthesameplaceonthenewbottle.
http://www.springeraviation.net/premix2.html
ThismethodsureworksbetterthatusingtheRatioRiteatthegasstation!
Regards,
Kip
http://www.spr
ingeraviation.net/
================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pre Mix made easy |
For all of you pre-mixers out there>>
Hi,
there seems to be much discussion about oils etc., on this list. Mainly
discussing brands of which I have never heard. Nothing surprising in that
between the USA and the UK but have you no main line suppliers as we have
Shell and BP?
I always buy half litres of oil and mix in a 25 litres tank of fuel. I
realise that buying a top brand in small quantities is an expensive way to
do it but it means the oil is always fresh and always dispensed accurately.
I have no idea of relative oil qualities in the States but I certainly
wouldn`t buy a brand called Marvels Mystery Oil as a matter of principle.
I am always offered a cheaper brand than the BP oil specifically made for
air cooled 2 strokes which I use, and I can buy it in larger quantities and
save a few pence but I consider my neck more important than saving a few
pennies, and I have never had a problem with my much maligned Rotax 503.
Of course now that petrol here is about 5dollars 35 cents for your gallon
no one will be able to fly at all..
What are you up to now? About a buck and a half.? My heart bleeds for you.
Cheers
Pat
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dama" <dama(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pre Mix made easy |
We're up to $2.50 now and, Marvels is great in one's tea if you don't trust
it in your engine:)
KIp
http://www.springeraviation.net/
----- Original Message -----
From: "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Pre Mix made easy
>
> For all of you pre-mixers out there>>
>
> Hi,
> there seems to be much discussion about oils etc., on this list. Mainly
> discussing brands of which I have never heard. Nothing surprising in that
> between the USA and the UK but have you no main line suppliers as we have
> Shell and BP?
> I always buy half litres of oil and mix in a 25 litres tank of fuel. I
> realise that buying a top brand in small quantities is an expensive way to
> do it but it means the oil is always fresh and always dispensed
accurately.
> I have no idea of relative oil qualities in the States but I certainly
> wouldn`t buy a brand called Marvels Mystery Oil as a matter of principle.
> I am always offered a cheaper brand than the BP oil specifically made for
> air cooled 2 strokes which I use, and I can buy it in larger quantities
and
> save a few pence but I consider my neck more important than saving a few
> pennies, and I have never had a problem with my much maligned Rotax 503.
>
> Of course now that petrol here is about 5dollars 35 cents for your gallon
> no one will be able to fly at all..
> What are you up to now? About a buck and a half.? My heart bleeds for you.
>
> Cheers
>
> Pat
>
>
> --
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
To All,
Bryan and I have been making good progress on our Twin Fireflys. (That's Twin
as in two of them that are the same, not twin engine) I have a new 447 and I
want to have the exhaust muffler coated. Who would be a good source for the
shiny stuff that looks like dull chrome?
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Ceramic coating |
In a message dated 8/10/2005 3:26:47 PM Eastern Standard Time, N27SB(at)aol.com
writes:
I
want to have the exhaust muffler coated. Who would be a good source for the
shiny stuff that looks like dull chrome?
We all used "Jet-Hot". 1 [800]432-3379
About 10 days, total. Costs about $125.
Howard Shackleford
FS II
SC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob N." <ronoy(at)shentel.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Ceramic coating |
I used Airborne Coatings, http://www.airbornecoatings.com 1-800-986-4646
two locations: 8180 Bourbon St, OKC OK 73128 ph (405) 685-4486
52 Village St, East Hartford CT 06108 ph
(860)528-8281 fax (860) 528-0023
Mine's been on 6 yrs and looks new, no rust.
Bob N.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Icrashrc(at)aol.com |
SUB_HELLO(at)roxy.matronics.com, Subject(at)roxy.matronics.com,
starts(at)roxy.matronics.com, with(at)roxy.matronics.com,
"Hello"@roxy.matronics.com
Hi, My name is Scott and I'm a Kolb-a-holic. I live in northern Indiana.
I've been lurking here for a while now.
Some of you may remember me from the Homecoming in 2003. I was the one flying
the rc plane after dark. J
I had my mind all but made up to build a Firefly but decided against it. I
figure if I'm going to build a plane it may as well be capable of sharing the
fun with a friend so a Mark III Extra is in my future instead.
My plan is to order kit one at the Homecoming this year. My friend Paul and I
will probably provide a little after dinner entertainment again if Donnie
lets us.
I'm sure Ill have lots of questions as time goes on but right now I just
wanted to give a formal HELLO! to everyone on the group.
Scott Thompson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitty <benny_bee_01(at)yahoo.com> |
Hi Scott!
Nice to meet ya man.I fly RC as well and love kolbs
too.And know Paul:)
Excuse my ignorance but what's a homecoming?
--- Icrashrc(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Hi, My name is Scott and I'm a Kolb-a-holic. I live
> in northern Indiana.
> I've been lurking here for a while now.
> Some of you may remember me from the Homecoming in
> 2003. I was the one flying
> the rc plane after dark. J
> I had my mind all but made up to build a Firefly but
> decided against it. I
> figure if I'm going to build a plane it may as well
> be capable of sharing the
> fun with a friend so a Mark III Extra is in my
> future instead.
> My plan is to order kit one at the Homecoming this
> year. My friend Paul and I
> will probably provide a little after dinner
> entertainment again if Donnie
> lets us.
> I'm sure Ill have lots of questions as time goes on
> but right now I just
> wanted to give a formal HELLO! to everyone on the
> group.
>
>
> Scott Thompson
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Earl & Mim Zimmerman <emzi(at)supernet.com> |
| Subject: | Kolb Mk. III For Sale |
My friend and hanger mate has his plane listed on barnstormers. ~ Earl
http://www.barnstormers.com/cat.php?mode=search&PHPSESSID=6567180d5ce7ccc31d3e78355d6cb99d
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Earl & Mim Zimmerman <emzi(at)supernet.com> |
| Subject: | Kolb Mk. III For Sale |
My friend and hanger mate has his plane listed on barnstormers. ~ Earl
http://www.barnstormers.com/cat.php?mode=search&PHPSESSID=6567180d5ce7ccc31d3e78355d6cb99d
Sorry that link won't work. Just search - 1993 KOLB MARK III
~ Earl
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
Scott, I flew R/C for many years before building and flying my Firestar. This is
how I learned to fly the Kolb (with 2-1/2 hours of UL training).
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
-- Icrashrc(at)aol.com wrote:
Hi, My name is Scott and I'm a Kolb-a-holic. I live in northern Indiana.
I've been lurking here for a while now.
Some of you may remember me from the Homecoming in 2003. I was the one flying
the rc plane after dark. J
I had my mind all but made up to build a Firefly but decided against it. I
figure if I'm going to build a plane it may as well be capable of sharing the
fun with a friend so a Mark III Extra is in my future instead.
My plan is to order kit one at the Homecoming this year. My friend Paul and I
will probably provide a little after dinner entertainment again if Donnie
lets us.
I'm sure Ill have lots of questions as time goes on but right now I just
wanted to give a formal HELLO! to everyone on the group.
Scott Thompson
Scott, I flew R/C for many years before building and flying my Firestar. This is
how I learned to fly the Kolb (with 2-1/2 hours of ULtraining).
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
--Icrashrc(at)aol.comwrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:Icrashrc(at)aol.com
Hi,MynameisScottandI'maKolb-a-holic.IliveinnorthernIndiana.
I'vebeenlurkinghereforawhilenow.
SomeofyoumayremembermefromtheHomecomingin2003.Iwastheoneflying
thercplaneafterdark.J
IhadmymindallbutmadeuptobuildaFireflybutdecidedagainstit.I
figureifI'mgoingtobuildaplaneitmayaswellbecapableofsharingthe
funwith
afriendsoaMarkIIIExtraisinmyfutureinstead.
MyplanistoorderkitoneattheHomecomingthisyear.MyfriendPaulandI
willprobablyprovidealittleafterdinnerentertainmentagainifDonnie
letsus.
I'msureIllhavelotsofquestionsastimegoesonbutrightnowIjust
wantedtogiveaformalHELLO!toeveryoneonthegroup.
ScottThompson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pre Mix made easy |
Second was diesel,>>
Hi Thom,
diesel was cheaper than petrol here until about 2 years ago. With the extra
mileage from diesel it was a good deal. The the Taxman saw easy pickings and
diesel is now 94p a litre minimum, petrol around 92p.
There must be alot of money around. I remember when the family owned a
garage many years ago petrol sold for 15 pence a GALLON ( that was when we
had 240 pence to the pound not 100pence) and if fuel price went up a
halfpenny we were on the verge of revolution. Now it goes up three times as
much per LITRE and apart from a bit of moaning everyone goes on just the
same.
LPG is not very common here although it is increasing.
Your proposed $2 increase is to help fight global warming????? Bush doesn`t
believe in that perhaps it is just the extra revenue. Naaaah!
Cheers
Pat
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: pre-mix made easy |
You wouldn't be trying to get us cowboy "rebels" worked up over gas
prices>>
Oh!, would I do that???
Cheers
Pat
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DAquaNut(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: New Kolb Factory flyin |
List,
Did anyone figure out what the definite dates and days for the year
2005 New Kolb Flyin were?
Thanks,
Ed
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New Kolb Factory flyin |
|
| Did anyone figure out what the definite dates and days for
the year
| 2005 New Kolb Flyin were?
|
| Thanks,
| Ed
|
Ed/Gang:
Travis said 23 and 24 Sep 2005. The Kolb Homecoming always occurs on
the last weekend of Sep each year.
john h
MKIII/912ULS
titus, alabama
PS: Bruce Chesnut, owner of The New Kolb Aircraft Company designated
the Kolb Flyins to be known as the Kolb Homecoming. For those that do
not know what homecoming means, well.........that is what it
means.........just what it says. All the Kolbs come home to the Kolb
Factory. Down here in the South, we have "homecomings" at our
churches, especially country churches. Folks that were affiliated
with that church come back for special services and "dinner on the
ground". I guess that is "pot luck" for Yankees. What the Hell do I
know. ;-)
Maybe this one should go in the archives.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David L. Bigelow" <dlbigelow(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
Well, I've committed to converting my FS2 to a twin engine aircraft. I've been
thinking about it for a long time, and decided to "go for it". The Big Island
is about 90% unlandable terrain, and I'm getting tired of betting my rear end
on a single two stroke engine every flight.
I've looked at several ways of doing the conversion, and have decided to cantilever
a beam across the original mounts and mount the engines on the ends of the
beam. There will be a prop extension on one engine, and the props will overlap
about 19 in. The major problem with this method is that it has to be done
just right so the wing folding isn't interfered with. Also, it has to be done
with two blade props, again because of wing folding. There is 93 inches clearance
between the ailerons, and the double prop disk will span 89 inches.
I looked at a lot of engines, and ordered two Hirth F-33's. They are 313 cc singles
with dual ignition and a 2.5:1 poly V belt redrive with electric start.
Both of them together (complete) weigh about the same as the Rotax 503. The
main design criterion is to put together an installation where the FS will fly
with a slight climb on one engine. There's no point in doing the conversion
if you can't stay in the air with one engine.
The F-33 with a two blade Powerfin 54 inch prop will put out 180 lbs of thrust
(from tests by users). Taking into account the high density altitude (5,000 ft)
where I live, 150 lbs is a realistic expectation. I tied my FS to a spring
fish scale, and found the RPM (5,700) that gives 150 lb. of thrust. I then flew
the ship with the power set at 5700 RPM, and even did some takeoffs at that
setting from a local airport with a long runway. I consistently was able to
get 200-300 fpm climb at 45 mph indicated. The numbers say it should work.....
There is some chance of taking out both props if something large comes off one
of the engines and goes through the props, but I'm going to do my best to do a
good solid installation. I'll take pictures as the project moves along and
post them.
Wish me luck!
Dave Bigelow
FS2, 503 DCDI
Kamuela, Hawaii
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
I'm with you 100%, Dave. I like the idea, and I think it should work. At
the very least you'll get some peace of mind, and if an engine DOes quit,
you'll be grinning. Lar. Do not
Archive.
Larry Bourne
Palm Springs, CA
Building Kolb Mk III
N78LB Vamoose
www.gogittum.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "David L. Bigelow" <dlbigelow(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Kolb-List: Twin Engine Firestar 2
>
>
> Well, I've committed to converting my FS2 to a twin engine aircraft. I've
> been thinking about it for a long time, and decided to "go for it". The
> Big Island is about 90% unlandable terrain, and I'm getting tired of
> betting my rear end on a single two stroke engine every flight.
>
> I've looked at several ways of doing the conversion, and have decided to
> cantilever a beam across the original mounts and mount the engines on the
> ends of the beam. There will be a prop extension on one engine, and the
> props will overlap about 19 in. The major problem with this method is
> that it has to be done just right so the wing folding isn't interfered
> with. Also, it has to be done with two blade props, again because of wing
> folding. There is 93 inches clearance between the ailerons, and the
> double prop disk will span 89 inches.
>
> I looked at a lot of engines, and ordered two Hirth F-33's. They are 313
> cc singles with dual ignition and a 2.5:1 poly V belt redrive with
> electric start. Both of them together (complete) weigh about the same as
> the Rotax 503. The main design criterion is to put together an
> installation where the FS will fly with a slight climb on one engine.
> There's no point in doing the conversion if you can't stay in the air with
> one engine.
>
> The F-33 with a two blade Powerfin 54 inch prop will put out 180 lbs of
> thrust (from tests by users). Taking into account the high density
> altitude (5,000 ft) where I live, 150 lbs is a realistic expectation. I
> tied my FS to a spring fish scale, and found the RPM (5,700) that gives
> 150 lb. of thrust. I then flew the ship with the power set at 5700 RPM,
> and even did some takeoffs at that setting from a local airport with a
> long runway. I consistently was able to get 200-300 fpm climb at 45 mph
> indicated. The numbers say it should work.....
>
> There is some chance of taking out both props if something large comes off
> one of the engines and goes through the props, but I'm going to do my best
> to do a good solid installation. I'll take pictures as the project moves
> along and post them.
>
> Wish me luck!
>
> Dave Bigelow
> FS2, 503 DCDI
> Kamuela, Hawaii
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
| Well, I've committed to converting my FS2 to a twin engine aircraft.
| Dave Bigelow
Hi Dave/Gang:
Are you planning to feed both engines from a single fuel tank?
john h
MKIII/912ULS
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
| There is some chance of taking out both props if something large
comes off one of the engines and goes through the props, but I'm going
to do my best to do a good solid installation. | Dave Bigelow
Hi Dave/Gang:
Prop survivabilty can be increased significantly by using Warp Drive
Props. They have proven to be much more durable than any of the other
available props. One of the primary reasons I have been using them
for the last 12 years and 2,300+ hours.
I did an involuntary test on a 70" three blade warp drive prop on my
912UL at WOT. A single 1.5" X18" steel exhaust pipe with a 180 deg
and a 90 deg bend seperated at the exhaust outlet on the head and went
through the prop. Heard a terrific noise, felt a severe jolt, and
picked up a slight vibration. Throttled back, flew to the next
airport, landed and checked out my situation. Discovered a good size
scar on the leading edge of one blade, and smaller scars on the
remaining two blades. Got back in the MKIII, flew 11.2 sm home to
Gantt IAP with no problem.
Did an involuntary test on a GSC three blade wood prop on a 582.
Think the air filter went through it. Collected all three blades and
destroyed them, damaged the tail boom to the degree of replacement
(actually bent the tail boom out of column a few degrees), shut the
engine down by slinging the carbs, and shook so hard it broke both
starter mounting bolts on the mag end of the 582. Throttle and
enricher cables were securing the carbs, and the battery cable was
securing the starter.
Usually, when we have problems with two and four stroke engines on our
airplanes, the problem is related to something insignificant, i.e.,
contaminated fuel, wiring problem, broken throttle cable (actually
stripping the little lead ball of the end), spark plug wire, broken
exhaust system on two strokes, etc.
There are some folks out there flying Hirth engines. To each his own.
They do not have a good reputation for reliability. I personally
would not fly one. My own personal opinion for what it is worth,
which ain't much. Please do not take my "opinion" wrong. I am basing
it on the history of use of the Hirth two stroke engines as I have
read and heard about them since they came into use on UL and lt
planes.
Take care,
john h
MKIII/912ULS
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rusty" <13brv3c(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
Well, I've committed to converting my FS2 to a twin engine aircraft. I've
been thinking about it for a long time, and decided to "go for it".
-----------
Right on Dave! As you know, I've been thinking of doing the same with a SS,
though it's going to have to wait until after the single rotor project is
complete.
As for the partially overlapped props, there's a company that is doing this
with a spray plane- http://vstolaircraft.com/
Good luck,
Rusty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Christopher Armstrong" <tophera(at)centurytel.net> |
| Subject: | Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
I think that this project has a very good chance of resulting in an engine
out since you are trading the very best two-stroke out there for two with a
less then stellar record, more then quadrupling your odds of an engine out,
or probably both engines out since fuel problems cause as many engine
stoppages as anything, and you probably are not going to have separate fuel
systems, or are you? If you do end up flying with one fairly low powered, of
center engine while dragging a for sure windmilling prop covering
approximately 1/3 of the good prop disk I predict extremely poor
performance, probably not able to maintain altitude, terrible control
characteristics and a very good chance of a crash due to stall spin at low
altitude, the very worst thing that you can do.
Other then that I think it is a great idea, and I look forward to seeing the
results!
Christopher Armstrong
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David L. Bigelow
Subject: Kolb-List: Twin Engine Firestar 2
Well, I've committed to converting my FS2 to a twin engine aircraft. I've
been thinking about it for a long time, and decided to "go for it". The Big
Island is about 90% unlandable terrain, and I'm getting tired of betting my
rear end on a single two stroke engine every flight.
I've looked at several ways of doing the conversion, and have decided to
cantilever a beam across the original mounts and mount the engines on the
ends of the beam. There will be a prop extension on one engine, and the
props will overlap about 19 in. The major problem with this method is that
it has to be done just right so the wing folding isn't interfered with.
Also, it has to be done with two blade props, again because of wing folding.
There is 93 inches clearance between the ailerons, and the double prop disk
will span 89 inches.
I looked at a lot of engines, and ordered two Hirth F-33's. They are 313 cc
singles with dual ignition and a 2.5:1 poly V belt redrive with electric
start. Both of them together (complete) weigh about the same as the Rotax
503. The main design criterion is to put together an installation where the
FS will fly with a slight climb on one engine. There's no point in doing
the conversion if you can't stay in the air with one engine.
The F-33 with a two blade Powerfin 54 inch prop will put out 180 lbs of
thrust (from tests by users). Taking into account the high density altitude
(5,000 ft) where I live, 150 lbs is a realistic expectation. I tied my FS
to a spring fish scale, and found the RPM (5,700) that gives 150 lb. of
thrust. I then flew the ship with the power set at 5700 RPM, and even did
some takeoffs at that setting from a local airport with a long runway. I
consistently was able to get 200-300 fpm climb at 45 mph indicated. The
numbers say it should work.....
There is some chance of taking out both props if something large comes off
one of the engines and goes through the props, but I'm going to do my best
to do a good solid installation. I'll take pictures as the project moves
along and post them.
Wish me luck!
Dave Bigelow
FS2, 503 DCDI
Kamuela, Hawaii
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
| If you do end up flying with one fairly low powered, off
| center engine while dragging a for sure windmilling prop covering
| approximately 1/3 of the good prop disk I predict extremely poor
| performance, probably not able to maintain altitude, terrible
control
| characteristics and a very good chance of a crash due to stall spin
at low
| altitude, the very worst thing that you can do.
| Christopher Armstrong
Topher/Gang:
Usually, when using a redrive, the prop will not windmill on a dead
engine.
The FS is an easy airplane to fly. They will fly almost as well a
full ball width out of trim as they do trimmed up. I don't know what
the hp of the single cyl Hirth is, but probably around 25 to 30.
Should be able to maintain enough airspeed to fly without stalling and
still maintain altitude.
john h
MKIII/912ULS
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Lockwood's Diagnosis |
Kolbers:
For the curious...
Lockwood put two new pistons in the 447, re-honed the jugs, cleaned out the carbon,
and declared it good to go...
Excessive piston to cylinder wall clearance was the verdict... had over .008 in
both
They installed standard size "green dot" pistons... For those not familiar with
the colors, green dot or red dot is the Rotax way of sizing pistons...
Greens are slightly "fat" and reds are slightly "skinny" , but technically, both
are
standard size.
Both cylinders were in good shape with little wear.
Case is tight... no leaking seals.
Timing is right on... wiring of trigger inside case is OK.
Reason for all the carbon is still unclear. They suspected the carb and they
went through it in detail. The enrichment piston's rubber bottom was
excessively recessed and the part was replaced. Theory is that it could have
been leaking raw fuel.
They also were suspicious of the pump primer, although they did not have it to
look at.
Mechs said that bad primers can ruin 2 stroke engines... depending on how they
fail, they can suck
either air or raw gas when they become defective. They recommend throwing it away
and getting a new
one annually. New primer pump is under $10 at Lockwood.
For John Hauck... The mechs all agree with you that running the 2-stroke engines
hard and
relatively lightly propped is best for them. recommend 6200 static and 6500 or
6600
level at WOT for the 447. Cruise at least 5800 and 6000 will not hurt it.
They said the 2-strokes, especially 447's, are highly sensitive to excessive oil
in the mix. Even a little extra is
bad news and will carbon things up quickly.... stay at exactly 50 to 1 for daily
operation.
Break in is different....I was surprised, but they said to do the break-in at 25
to 1... rings will seat faster and better
with the double oil. The little extra carbon will blow away quickly when you switch
to normal mix ratio.
This is not in any of the Rotax literature... they laughed and said they know it's
not, but use 25 to 1 anyway.
Got a warning about black automotive fuel lines... don't use them with pre-mix.
They are fine for straight gas,
but swell up and delaminate internally when exposed to oil in the gas.
Saw a totally cratered 912 today. Someone failed to heed the Rotax service bulletin
about valve keeper
replacement. It came in yesterday and they had it torn down on the bench -- it
looked like a bomb had gone
off in it... swallowed a valve and the fun spread from there. all pistons exploded,
heads broken in half,
major metal chunks all through all cylinders...etc... total loss... ugly.
Tomorrow I will be back up the 'ol ladder at Manatee putting it all back together
and breaking it in.
My thanks to all who offered advice while I was fooling with this problem...
Regards,
Beauford
FF #076
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Lockwood's Diagnosis |
| From: | Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)juno.com> |
Beauford
Did they offer any reason why you had so much skirt/piston wear in a
relatively short time? Herb
writes:
>
>
> Kolbers:
> For the curious...
>
> Lockwood put two new pistons in the 447, re-honed the jugs, cleaned
> out the carbon,
> and declared it good to go...
>
> Excessive piston to cylinder wall clearance was the verdict... had
> over .008 in both
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Lockwood's Diagnosis |
| For John Hauck... The mechs all agree with you that running the
2-stroke engines hard and
| relatively lightly propped | Beauford
Hi Beauford/All:
Well............good. At least somebody agrees with my two stroke
philosophy. ;-)
Hope you have gotten you 447 squared away now. Absolutely hate it
when my mechanical stuff does not operate correctly and I can not
figure out why...
john h
MKIII/912ULS
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Lockwood's Diagnosis |
Herb...
I pressed a little on this, since, like you, I considered this the obvious
question. And I
still am unsure of the answer...as are the Lockwood guys... They struck me
as honest and
competent.
The consensus seemed to be that the carbon/coke near-seizure sequence which
started this episode likely caused the bulk of this premature wear, but no
mech was willing to
state that conclusively... there were clearly smoothly polished shiny areas
halfway up the pistons
in which the factory machining was worn off and which mic'd .0005 to .006
undersize.
These areas apparently had no direct relationship to the minor scoring
which I inflicted upon the pistons
during my naive attempt to re- break in the rings... it was clear from the
wear patterns that the pistons
were rocking in the bores and there had to be excessive blow-by, even though
I heard no piston "slap" at idle.
I stood there and watched them mic the pistons and jugs, so I know they gave
a fair
assessment of their condition...
At this point, aside from the role of carbon in this, no one is sure why a
130 hour engine
should have worn out a couple of pistons...
The "green dot" pistons restored the piston - to- bore clearance to new
engine specs.
Here we go again...
Beauford
----- Original Message -----
From: "Herb Gayheart" <herbgh(at)juno.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Lockwood's Diagnosis
>
> Beauford
> Did they offer any reason why you had so much skirt/piston wear in a
> relatively short time? Herb
> writes:
>>
>>
>> Kolbers:
>> For the curious...
>>
>> Lockwood put two new pistons in the 447, re-honed the jugs, cleaned
>> out the carbon,
>> and declared it good to go...
>>
>> Excessive piston to cylinder wall clearance was the verdict... had
>> over .008 in both
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David L. Bigelow" <dlbigelow(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
Thanks for all the comments and encouragement. Here are my answers to some of
them:
1. John, I thought about independent fuel systems, since as we all know, a very
large proportion of engine outs are fuel related. I spent a lot of time putting
the fuel system together, and have an electric pump in parallel with the
engine pump. Also, have a good filter and always fill with Mr. Funnel. I decided
to continue with the system I have, since I would have to add cross-feed
capability (another level of complexity) to the two tanks to get the all the fuel
out with a single engine running.
2. Regarding Hirths, I've heard the stories too, but had good luck with the one
Hirth I owned. I forget the model number, but it was the equivalent of the
Rotax 377 with single carb and single point ignition. This was in the 80's.
I flew with it for nearly 10 years and never had any problem that was related
to the engine. I particularly liked the fact that it was designed for maximum
horsepower at about 4500 rpm. Cruise was at about 3700 rpm, and it was quiet
and smooth - much smoother than my 503.
3. Regarding the overlapping props, sometime in the early 90's, John Pitre and
I did some tests with the Paraplane (powered parachute rig). It ran two solo
engines to a centerline set of counter-rotating props with one shaft inside
the other - very nicely designed. We did thrust tests with both engines running,
and various combinations of single engine. Surprisingly enough, there was
very little interaction between the props.
There have been several other designs that used overlapping props, and they worked
OK. With an engine out, the prop will stop, and should have no effect other
than drag. The thrust line of each engine will be 17.5 inches from the CL
of the aircraft. The asymmetrical thrust should easily be within the rudder authority
of the FS. I've got a lot of time in multi-engine aircraft, so am not
worried about the flying aspects of single engine operation.
4. Biggest potential problem I'm concerned with is vibration. It's going to be
a challenge to get the mounting system right.
This is definitely a bit of a gamble to see if I can get the package together.
I'm doing my best to keep it simple. Keep the comments coming - I'm sure there
will be some ideas I've not thought of.
Dave Bigelow
FS2, 503 DCDI
Kamuela, HI
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Lockwood's Diagnosis |
| From: | Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)juno.com> |
Beauford
The reason that I asked the obvious is that I just rebuilt a 503 with
first over pistons. The old pistons still had the machining marks on the
skirts , yet they measured out of spec. I guess if they get hot enough
they will tend to collapse? Herb
writes:
>
>
> Herb...
> I pressed a little on this, since, like you, I considered this the
> obvious
> question. And I
> still am unsure of the answer...as are the Lockwood guys... They
> struck me
> as honest and
> competent.
>
> The consensus seemed to be that the carbon/coke near-seizure
> sequence which
> started this episode likely caused the bulk of this premature wear,
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Lockwood's Diagnosis |
Herb...
I assume so...
I asked them how high a CHT the cast pistons could stand without damage and
the answer
was "way over 400 in a 447".... They went on to say that the piston crowns
tend to deform and cave-in
during extreme CHT overtemps, but they did not specifically address the
skirts.
Regards,
Beauford
----- Original Message -----
From: "Herb Gayheart" <herbgh(at)juno.com>
> --. I guess if they get hot enough
> they will tend to collapse? >> obvious
>> question.
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "woody" <duesouth(at)govital.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
> I think that this project has a very good chance of resulting in an engine
> out since you are trading the very best two-stroke out there for two with
a
> less then stellar record,
Please explain that comment and give facts to prove the statement. Just
curious.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Laird <rlaird(at)cavediver.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
At 11:56 PM 8/12/2005, you wrote:
>
> > I think that this project has a very good chance of resulting in an engine
> > out since you are trading the very best two-stroke out there for two with
>a
> > less then stellar record,
>
> Please explain that comment and give facts to prove the statement. Just
>curious.
My brother has a Hirth, 2-stroke, 2-cylinder, fuel injected. He's had two
engine outs (both resulting in gear leg damage due to landing out in bad
fields), and had lots of problems. One engine out was caused by a bad
crank. They replaced it for "free" but of course he had to repair his
plane, remove the engine and ship it back, wait for weeks for the engine to
be returned, then he had to put the engine back on and do all the necessary
things you do for new engines.
His second engine out was caused by the fuel injection system deciding that
it was no longer going to inject. Repeat all the above except this time
the engine repair wasn't free.
Ok, so he gets a seemingly working engine, and he flys for a month or two,
then one day one mag fails. Again, repeat all the above.
He got it back and got it together and started it up, but it would not
reach full throttle. Very long story short: the computer chip had "lost"
its programming. So he sends it back for an "upgrade." He gets it back,
installs it, and there's no difference. This goes on for a month or so,
back and forth, back and forth, but he finally gets it to run (on the ground).
He takes it up, and while in the pattern, the engine loses power but
doesn't stop... so he puts it back down on the runway. He replaces all
spark plugs and spark plugs wires, and a week later, takes it up in the
pattern and it seems to be okay, but -- and this happened last week -- the
next time he goes to fly, one of the mags has failed again.
The worst Rotax I've ever heard of never had problems like this.
He's now going to sell the Hirth and get a 503. Anyone have a used but
good 503 they want to sell?
-- Robert
P.S. To be fair: When it worked, it was very powerful, easily 20-25%
better performance over a 503, but it simply isn't reliable, and there's no
one nearby that can help diagnose it and repair it.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Christopher Armstrong" <tophera(at)centurytel.net> |
| Subject: | Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
Just based on being around ultralights and very light planes powered by
2-strokes since 1983 my experience with Cuyuna and Rotax and only what I
have heard about Hirth. The 503 has earned my respect as the most reliable
of the 2-stroke twins by far (and its record isn't much to brag about). The
Hirth engines have never achieved nearly the same level of reliability. I
wish they would since they are very powerful and light, and affordable. But
they have not. Running two engines doubles your chance of engine failure...
simply because you have two engines. If each of those engines is twice as
likely to have a problem you are up to 4 times, and I think that is about
right. If the engines share any systems, fuel, electrical, or mechanical in
the form of overlapping props then odds are you might have both engines fail
at the same time as well.
Will a Firestar fly well with one 30 horse engine off center? (I read belt
drives and think of the old one I used to fly with the built in centrifugal
clutch, which is why I was thinking that the prop would be windmilling. I
suppose the new Hirth belt drive doesn't use a clutch.) Probably not too
bad, but it will not be perfect.
The key line of my post was the last one though, where I said I think it is
a great idea, and I am looking forward to see the results. That line wasn't
supposed to be taken too cynically (the rest was, at least a bit.) I do
think it is a great idea and I do hope it works well.
Christopher Armstrong
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of woody
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Twin Engine Firestar 2
> I think that this project has a very good chance of resulting in an engine
> out since you are trading the very best two-stroke out there for two with
a
> less then stellar record,
Please explain that comment and give facts to prove the statement. Just
curious.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitty <benny_bee_01(at)yahoo.com> |
0.06 FROM_HAS_ULINE_NUMS From": contains.an.underline.and.numbers/letters(at)roxy.matronics.com
Hello fellows.If anybody interested I got about two
dozen pictures from OSHKOSH.Three of my friends went
to see the planes and brought 1500 pics back.I have
selected ones.
I can upload them to the forum or attach to
messages.Admin,let me know if i can.
Mitty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "skyrider2" <skyrider2(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | The 447 - Part Two |
Beauford,
I'm really sorry that you've had such problems with the 447. I don't have
much experience with that engine, only had one plane with a 447 on it, back
in the 80's and it was a demonstrator that was sold before we put 20 hours
on it.
But if the VISA bill isn't too steep, it'll all be worth it to you when you
get your bird back in the air. And for me, getting to read your excellent
rendition, creative writing at it's finest, had me ROTFLMAO.
You shoud write a book..........
Fly Safely,
Doug Lawton
NE Georgia & Whitwell TN
Matthews Field and Gliderport
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Ellery Batchelder Jr ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Ellery Batchelder Jr
Lists: Kolb-List,Ultralight-List
Subject: REBUILD on ORIGINAL FIRESTAR
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/ElleryWeld@aol.com.08.13.2005/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Baker" <jlbaker(at)telepath.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
> P.S. To be fair: When it worked, it was very powerful, easily 20-
25%
> better performance over a 503, but it simply isn't reliable, and
> there's no one nearby that can help diagnose it and repair it.
My non-injected 2704 has been cooking along for 460 hours with
one set of plugs changed... and that's it! After watching the boys
from Benningen work on one of the first injected F30s at Oshkosh a
few years back, I decided against that route since they wouldn't give
the injection/timing mapping software to anyone, nor the Flash ROM
writer.
Jim Baker
580.788.2779
'71 SV, 492TC
Elmore City, OK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Baker" <jlbaker(at)telepath.com> |
| Subject: | Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
> If each of those engines is twice as likely to have a problem
> you are up to 4 times
Statistically, it doesn't work that way. Multivariate entities are not that
arithmatically simple.
Jim Baker
580.788.2779
'71 SV, 492TC
Elmore City, OK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Long XC in Original FS |
I
| am going to try and make it to the Kolb Homecoming but it will be a
long trip
| for me but I am looking at it as a bunch of short trips and I have
faith in
| the Kolb planes
| Ellery Batchelder Jr
Ellery B/All:
Super!!!
Some of the most memorable flights I made were way back in the
beginning, flying the Ultrastar and original Firestar. As the matter
of fact, for those new guys that do not know, my original FS made two
flights to the NE US in 1988 and 1989. Powered with the point ign
447. It was a blast. All navigation back then was pilotage and ded
reckoning, mag compass and sectional. Navigation, fuel management
were enough to keep you on your toes most of the time. Yes, I did get
a little misoriented a few times. One more reason, back then, to
carry 18 gal of fuel on an UL.
Cross country flights are a series of short hops tied together over a
period of time. Good luck. I am rooting for you to safely make that
flight to the Kolb Homecoming!!!
john h
MKIII/912ULS
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Firestar Adverse Roll |
I have adjusted aleron linkeage a few times and cant seem to
| figure out what it needs
| Ellery in Maine
Ellery/All:
Adjusting aileron linkage to correct adverse roll will not work. All
you are doing is displacing the control stick position laterally.
I used aileron trim tab on my right aileron to fly it up and correct
the adverse roll my Firestar had to the left.
On my MKIII, occassionally, I will have an adverse roll problem. I
correct this with a bungy cord trim tab I can slide up and down the
control stick to add and decrease lateral pressure to keep the
airplane trimmed out in roll attitude.
Take care,
john h
MKIII/912ULS
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firestar Adverse Roll |
| set it for what ever speed I would like to travel at and hope it
wouldnt make my
| controll go the other way on slow flight | Ellery Batchelder Jr.
Ellery/All:
I made my trim tabs for aileron and elevator for my original FS out of
.016 6061T6 aluminum sheet. Set both of them for cruise speed, 5,800
rpm. Lucked out. The little FS stayed trimmed up in roll and pitch
through out its speed range. Also had one on the rudder, IIRC. CRS
is hell. I'd have to go back and find some old photos to confirm the
rudder trim tab. hehehe
john h
MKIII/912ULS
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Christopher Armstrong" <tophera(at)centurytel.net> |
| Subject: | Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
Statistically, it doesn't work that way. Multivariate entities are not that
arithmatically simple.
Well, here is how it I think it works, statistically:
Probability of an engine failure is number of engine failures/number of
flights.
Using the Multiplication Theorem for Independent Events
If the events A and B are independent then
P(AB) = P(A)* P(B). So if one engine fails 1 time in every 1000 flights
both engine will fail once every 100000 flights. SO this is good.
But how often will one of the two engines fail?
Here we need to use the Addition Rule
If the event A1, A2, ..., An are pairwise mutually exclusive events then
P(A1+ A2+ ...+An)= P(A1)+P(A2)+ ...+P(An)
So if the first engine fails once in every 1000 flights, and the second
engine fails once in every 1000 flights together they will fail 2 times in
1000 flight, or twice as often. If the probability of each engine failing
moves to once in every 500 flights, then for 2 of them it is 2 times in
every 500 flights. One rotax 503 at 1/1000 versus two Hirths at 2/500 is 4
times as much.
So what do you think is wrong with my math?
As to the real twin engine data, do they actually fail twice as often.
Probability is that they do, and the data supports it, but the second engine
does keep the plane from crashing often enough that accident rates due to
engine failures are lower for twins. This assumes of course that the
engines have the same failure rate. If you add in a higher failure rate for
the twins engines then you are going to be somewhat less well off then just
going from a single to a twin.
Here is a clip of some data from avweb:
"For the group of light twins we looked at, mechanical failures of the
engine or propeller were responsible for One about 3% of all accidents.
Breaking that down, 15.3% of all accidents were due to mechanical failures,
and 20.8% of those involved the engine or propeller.
In contrast, roughly 8% of all accidents in high-performance singles were
attributed to engine or propeller failure: 17% of accidents were
mechanicals, but nearly 50% of those involved the engine or prop.
The statistics showed that a light twin is about equally likely to have a
mechanical-caused accident as a high-performance single. But the twin's
mechanical problem is most likely to be gear-related while the single's is
most likely to be engine/prop-related. A single is about two-and-a-half
times more likely to have an accident due to engine/prop failure than a twin
(8% versus 3%). And if we assume that a twin is twice as likely to have an
engine/prop failure (since it has twice as many to fail), then we can
conclude that an engine/prop failure in a single is five times more likely
to result in an accident than an engine/prop failure in a twin.
So are you any safer flying a light twin than a high-performance single? In
terms of the overall and serious accident rates, the answer seems clearly to
be no. But your risk profile changes somewhat: in the twin, you're less
likely to be hurt by an engine failure, and more likely to be victimized by
something else."
http://www.avweb.com/news/airman/184438-1.html this is some interesting
reading... in part it says:
"Have you ever wondered why a manufacturer puts more engines on an airframe?
There are many people who think that it's for safety; that a twin is safer
than a single. After all, if one engine fails, well, you just keep on flying
on the remaining one, right?
No. When one engine on a twin fails, you don't lose half of your excess
thrust, you typically lose 80% to 90% of your excess thrust, which means
that if you were climbing at 1200 fpm with both engines, if you configure
and fly the aircraft perfectly after an engine failure, you will likely see
around 200 fpm, which is pretty bad.
Most light twins, when operated anywhere near gross weight, have very
marginal single-engine performance, and are very intolerant of pilot error
in achieving a positive rate of climb. A non-turbocharged twin will
typically have a single-engine service ceiling of around 5000 foot density
altitude. So, an engine failure in cruise in summer means you're likely
going to descend.
And remember, with two engines, you're twice as likely to have an engine
failure."
http://avstop.com/Technical/twins.htm another interesting technical chat
about twins
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David L. Bigelow" <dlbigelow(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
>So if the first engine fails once in every 1000 flights, and the second
>engine fails once in every 1000 flights together they will fail 2 times in
>1000 flight, or twice as often. If the probability of each engine failing
>moves to once in every 500 flights, then for 2 of them it is 2 times in
>every 500 flights. One rotax 503 at 1/1000 versus two Hirths at 2/500 is 4
>times as much."
I'm not sure I agree with the conclusions here. It's intuitively obvious that
even with a pair of engines that may be less reliable than a particular single,
the odds of a simultaneous failure are quite slim.
Here's from an article by Arnold C. Anderson in his Ultralight Flying Notebook:
"To give you some idea as to what redundancy does to improve reliability, let's
say we have a single system that is 95% reliable, which is 5% unreliable. Two
systems operated in parallel will have an unreliability of 5% squared or .05
x .05 .0025. The reliability is now 100 - .0025 or 99.9975% reliable - a marked
improvement."
In the real world, the two systems (engines, ignitions, etc) do share some commonality,
and the actual reliability will probably be less than 99.9975%.
I can't predict the reliability of the Hirth F-33 compared to a 503, but it is
a dual ignition engine, and the operators I've been in contact with have hundreds
of trouble free hours. Another factor with a twin installation is that during
normal operation, the engines are not operated at as high an RPM as a single
engine installation. This reduces stress and increases time between overhaul.
Also, I'm not sure you can apply light twin statistics (constant speed props,
etc) to an experimental ultralight with near centerline thrust installation.
Guess I'll just have to try it and see..... :) Check's in the mail, and the
engines are coming!
Dave Bigelow
FS2
Kamuela, HI
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
| From: | "John J. Peters" <jjp1945(at)juno.com> |
David ,
I would think thee analysis of Arnold Anderson is a lot closer to
reality , of redundancy improving ones
chances / odds to avoid a mishap , than doubling the chances of a problem
refuses to fly with one engine . So I would conclude that with at least
some kind of power from the
remaining engine that the pilot could at least glide / fly to a further
out , and possibly safer landing site .
If you all play the lottery , and the odds are 50 million to one
are not 25 million to one , they are 50 million to two . ( hence my
lack of cash on hand )
$ .02 For what it's worth
JJP
FSII
single 503 DCDI , D-Carb
D-Floats
________________________________________________________________________________
Hello
I would like to add 2nd tank to my fs2 .
when tanks are near emmty will front tank have 2-3" left
in it since tail is high inflight?
tanks
Duane Zollinger
FS2,503 290 hrs
Rittman Ohio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Christopher Armstrong" <tophera(at)centurytel.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
Which part of my post didn't you read? I stated above this quote that the
odds of both failing at the same time is 1 in 100000, calculated exactly
like Anderson. Then I calculated the odds of either engine failing....
which is the section you are quoting. I give up on you guys... you just
don't get math.
Christopher Armstrong
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David L. Bigelow
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2
>So if the first engine fails once in every 1000 flights, and the second
>engine fails once in every 1000 flights together they will fail 2 times in
>1000 flight, or twice as often. If the probability of each engine failing
>moves to once in every 500 flights, then for 2 of them it is 2 times in
>every 500 flights. One rotax 503 at 1/1000 versus two Hirths at 2/500 is 4
>times as much."
I'm not sure I agree with the conclusions here. It's intuitively obvious
that even with a pair of engines that may be less reliable than a particular
single, the odds of a simultaneous failure are quite slim.
Here's from an article by Arnold C. Anderson in his Ultralight Flying
Notebook:
"To give you some idea as to what redundancy does to improve reliability,
let's say we have a single system that is 95% reliable, which is 5%
unreliable. Two systems operated in parallel will have an unreliability of
5% squared or .05 x .05 .0025. The reliability is now 100 - .0025 or
99.9975% reliable - a marked improvement."
In the real world, the two systems (engines, ignitions, etc) do share some
commonality, and the actual reliability will probably be less than 99.9975%.
I can't predict the reliability of the Hirth F-33 compared to a 503, but it
is a dual ignition engine, and the operators I've been in contact with have
hundreds of trouble free hours. Another factor with a twin installation is
that during normal operation, the engines are not operated at as high an RPM
as a single engine installation. This reduces stress and increases time
between overhaul. Also, I'm not sure you can apply light twin statistics
(constant speed props, etc) to an experimental ultralight with near
centerline thrust installation.
Guess I'll just have to try it and see..... :) Check's in the mail, and
the engines are coming!
Dave Bigelow
FS2
Kamuela, HI
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Lockwood's Diagnosis |
In a message dated 8/12/2005 9:15:10 PM Eastern Standard Time,
beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com writes:
> Got a warning about black automotive fuel lines... don't use them with
> pre-mix. They are fine for straight gas,
> but swell up and delaminate internally when exposed to oil in the gas.
>
>
Hi Beauford, I have been running the auto fuel lines for a few months with
not problem but I see their point. Marine brand black fuel lines are used with
premix all the time for years. I wonder how they differ from auto type if at
all.
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Baker" <jlbaker(at)telepath.com> |
| Subject: | Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
> Statistically, it doesn't work that way. Multivariate entities are not
> that arithmatically simple.
What we're really talking about here is reliability, defined as:
The probability that an item will perform a required function without
failure under stated conditions for a stated period of time.
> Probability of an engine failure is number of engine
failures/number
> of flights.
>
> Using the Multiplication Theorem for Independent Events
>
> If the events A and B are independent then
>
> P(AB) = P(A)* P(B). So if one engine fails 1 time in every 1000
> flights both engine will fail once every 100000 flights. SO this is
> good.
That's fine....except what if the engine that fails is now paired with an
engine that won't. There are such things as reliability probabilities for
repairable systems, systems reliability (reliability prediction), part
reliability (reliability estimation), and non-repairable system reliability.
Gets a bit more dicey.
That said, what is the real failure rate? Lets use your assumption of
one failure in every 1000 flights. I'll use, say, 2.5 hours duration per
flight (yeah, I know it's just a WAG). 2500 hours per 1000 flights. US
gen aviation piston single engine aircraft were estimated to have
flown 17.7 million hours in 2000. That shows 7080 engine related
failures per year in the general aviation, single engine universe.
What was the actual mechanically related failure rate? 81, with 41
partial power non-mechanical and 36 mechanical partial power
(NTSB, 2000). And yes, I know this relates primarily to four stroke
gen av engines and not the subject at hand, two stroke rates. But
then this really begs the question about repairable systems reliabilty,
considering sometimes just who is working on these two-stroke
engines, parts substitution, etc....
And that opens up an entirely new line of investigation, one for which
I've never seen any data....reliability data between two- and four-
cycle engines. Anyone claiming to have a good statistical handle on
engine reliability had better make the case with millions of data
points. Hell, I certainly can't...I'm not that smart!
> But how often will one of the two engines fail?
>
> Here we need to use the Addition Rule
>
> If the event A1, A2, ..., An are pairwise mutually exclusive events
> then
>
> P(A1+ A2+ ...+An)= P(A1)+P(A2)+ ...+P(An)
>
> So if the first engine fails once in every 1000 flights, and the
> second engine fails once in every 1000 flights together they will fail
> 2 times in 1000 flight, or twice as often. If the probability of each
> engine failing moves to once in every 500 flights, then for 2 of
them
> it is 2 times in every 500 flights. One rotax 503 at 1/1000 versus
> two Hirths at 2/500 is 4 times as much.
>
> So what do you think is wrong with my math?
The math is suspect with the assertion that Hirth fails once every 500
hours vs Rotax at 1000 hours, an unsubstantiated and self-serving
assumption. I certainly don't know the true figures. Please provide
your data source.
> As to the real twin engine data, do they actually fail twice as often.
> Probability is that they do, and the data supports it, but the second
> engine does keep the plane from crashing often enough that
accident
> rates due to engine failures are lower for twins. This assumes of
> course that the engines have the same failure rate. If you add in a
> higher failure rate for the twins engines then you are going to be
> somewhat less well off then just going from a single to a twin.
Let's look at some data from CASA (Australia) that muddies that
view, but only for fatality accidents (1986-1996), and maybe only for
Australia.
Single engine fatality rate per 100,000 hours .31
Twin engine fatality rate per 100,000 hours .98
The variables? VFR/IFR, pilot skills with single engine operations in
a twin, phase of flight......but still........
However the total accident rates for singles was 9.54 and 8.39 for
twins, per 100,000 hours. I'd be more concerned about this stat than
the reliability of twin engine systems.
Then the FAA data (2000) shows accident rates for single at 7.61
per 100k and 3.92 for twin (both piston). The fatality rate is 1.27 for
single and 1.35 for twins, per 100k hours.
Jim Baker
580.788.2779
'71 SV, 492TC
Elmore City, OK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
| The probability that an item will perform a required function
without
| failure under stated conditions for a stated period of time.
| Jim Baker
Jim B/Topher/All:
Numbers are great! However, when you are flying in front of a two
stroke, you won't have any idea when she is going, only that
eventually she will. No way numbers are going to let me know when not
to fly a two stroke.
As two stroke pilots, the best we can do is be prepared for that
particular time.
Be proficient at actual dead stick landings. Right! Landings with a
good engine shut down. Why? Because that is the way it is going to
be when it occurs. You will not likely have a chance to mull all this
immediate problem at hand over. Immediate decisions must be made to
make that predesignated forced landing area.
You only have one chance at each engine failure. Don't screw it up.
I screwed up two two stroke engine failures in 15 minutes. Had I left
well enough alone, I had put the MKIII down without a scratch when the
582 went belly up, I could have trailered the airplane home, done the
engine repair and been back in the air. Thinking the engine was now
free, ready and willing to propel me back into the air, I went for it.
At 30 feet it seized again, I was behind the aircraft, and stalled it
in. Result: gear legs, gear leg mount, some bent tubes, and torn
fabric.
Take care,
john h
MKIII/912ULS
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Baker" <jlbaker(at)telepath.com> |
> With the limited experience I have in our FSII, it seems that the
rear
> tank runs dry when the front one still has a couple inches left.
>
> Maybe we need to put a shim under the front one, raise it a couple
> inches? Comments? Good idea? Dumb idea?
Realistically, is anyone actually using that second seat? Just curious
since I don't as it really violates the 103 rule. Can't teach anyone
from the back and passengers really aren't learning to fly. Other than
that, I've got both five gallon tanks at the rear seat position. Benefits
are ease of fueling, not as significant a change in CG from full to
empty, and frees up the aft section for carrying "stuff".
Jim Baker
580.788.2779
'71 SV, 492TC
Elmore City, OK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Christopher Armstrong" <tophera(at)centurytel.net> |
| Subject: | Twin Engine Firestar 2 |
The math is suspect with the assertion that Hirth fails once every 500
hours vs Rotax at 1000 hours, an unsubstantiated and self-serving
assumption. I certainly don't know the true figures. Please provide
your data source.
Those are obviously just made up numbers, with no attempt to guess the rates
real accurately, since for the most part the planes these things fly in do
not have their rates recorded by anybody. That doesn't make the math
suspect or wrong like you implied. My math is right, and based on
information from the people who fly these things I bet my very rough guess
at relative engine stoppage rates (not the actual numbers but the
difference) is not too far off either. If you're going to say my math is
wrong
"> Statistically, it doesn't work that way. Multivariate entities are not
> that arithmatically simple."
mean that my math is wrong not that my guesses are bad. I will concede my
guesses might be bad.
As far as systems that are not independent the math for those is easy as
well, but determining the degree of dependence is work for smart minds then
me. Basically if the two engines share a fuel system and the largest cause
of engine stoppages is due to fuel problems then you're going to find out
that both engines are going to stop together much more often then just once
every 100000 flights. For every system they share it will get worse.
I would doubt that data from the GA twin world is applicable to this
discussion. The engines are way more reliable... and no I don't have an
numbers to back that up, but face it they are, and the systems that support
the engine, starting with the quality of the fuel and the amount of
maintenance that the planes get all the way to the skill of the pilots is
just not in the same ball park.
As usual, I am being told I am wrong on this list... when I am not. Oh well,
I have gotten used to it and you guys will fly on happily without this
useless SWAG anyway!
Topher
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Garvelink" <link(at)cdc.net> |
| Subject: | Kolb list electric trim tab |
Again you guys talk about trim tabs, I think that this is still the
coolest one I have seen.
SRGLINK
http://www.n566aj.com/max/frugal.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Kolb list electric trim tab |
| Again you guys talk about trim tabs, I think that this is still
the
| coolest one I have seen.
|
| SRGLINK
Steve G/All:
That's a pretty busy system.
What I look for in any system in my airplanes is simplicity,
reliability, and longevity.
As I posted yesterday, a simple aileron and elevator trim tab, popped
to the trailing edge tube with soft aluminum rivets, .016 aluminum,
did the job for my original Firestar. It was set and forget. Flew
neutral at all airspeeds and pitch angles.
john h
titus, alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Mk 11 vs Mk 111 |
| Can anyone tell me the major (and minor) differences between a
Twinstar
| Mk 11 and Mk 111(c)?
|
| Thom in Buffalo
Hi Thom/Gang:
Primary differences are tail boom and main wing spars. MKIII has 6"
instead of 5".
Fuselage is much better designed, wider and stronger.
I don't know much about the MKII. Never had any dealings with it
except what I read on this List.
john h
MKIII/912ULS
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron Lee" <rlee468(at)comcast.net> |
An electric screwdriver should work fine as a trim motor.
Ron
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Lockwood's Diagnosis-black fuel line |
Steve...
Good to hear from you...
I dunno about the marine lines, but the Lockwood guys were certainly adamant
about the subject and I cannot see where they would make any money from
bad-mouthing the black automotive lines...
Sure enough, when I pulled off the black rubber lines and filter yesterday,
the clear Fram filter had a flat chunk
of black rubber about half the size of a small fingernail in it... plus a
cloud of small black
particles that looked like the same stuff... The debris was largely hidden
in the folds of the paper element until shaken, then easy to see. I saved
it to show the other Kolbers on the field.
There was only about a foot of the black line ahead of that filter... Kinda
got my attention...
That line was installed in January 05.
Two thunderstorms on the airport this PM... then blessed overcast...was
smooth flying in the shade... and cool for a change.
Regards,
Beauford
----- Original Message -----
From: <N27SB(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Lockwood's Diagnosis
>
> In a message dated 8/12/2005 9:15:10 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com writes:
>
>> Got a warning about black automotive fuel lines... don't use them with
>> pre-mix. They are fine for straight gas,
>> but swell up and delaminate internally when exposed to oil in the gas.
>>
>>
>
> Hi Beauford, I have been running the auto fuel lines for a few months
> with
> not problem but I see their point. Marine brand black fuel lines are used
> with
> premix all the time for years. I wonder how they differ from auto type if
> at
> all.
>
> Steve
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)mindspring.com> |
At 10:08 PM 8/14/2005, you wrote:
>Consensus at Sebring is that 447 is most carbon-prone and crankiest
>to adjust of all the current Rotax engines.
>I believe it.
>
>Beauford
You better believe it.
My old 503 has recently run up to 335 - 340 CHT on climb out...and I'm starting
to get worried.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Cooley" <johnc(at)datasync.com> |
Hi Thom,
What John said and.....You sit way down in the MK II (the enclosed version)
and the MK III has flaps where the MK II has full span ailerons. The MK III
has more ribs and is beefier all around. I can't tell you about the flying
differences as I have never flown a MK III. I have owned two MK II's and am
building a MK IIIC currently. Compared to the FS II the MK II has a little
better roll rate, I assume due to the full span ailerons and control design.
Maybe Brother Pike can compare the roll rates of the Mk III versus the FS II
and give an idea of how the three models compare.
Also for you folks that have flown the MK III with a center stick versus the
twin stick setup, is there any difference in force required to move the
ailerons due to the slight rigging differences? John you have probably flown
both set-ups, did you notice any difference? I know that the aileron control
rods can be moved in at the torque rod connection to help with control
forces and I plan on trying this when the time comes, (see Richard Pikes
website) thanks Richard.
John Cooley
Lucedale, Ms.
FS II
MK II
Building MK III
| Can anyone tell me the major (and minor) differences between a
Twinstar
| Mk 11 and Mk 111(c)?
|
| Thom in Buffalo
Hi Thom/Gang:
Primary differences are tail boom and main wing spars. MKIII has 6"
instead of 5".
Fuselage is much better designed, wider and stronger.
I don't know much about the MKII. Never had any dealings with it
except what I read on this List.
john h
MKIII/912ULS
Titus, Alabama
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
-- \"Jim Baker\" wrote:
Realistically, is anyone actually using that second seat? Just curious
since I don't as it really violates the 103 rule. Can't teach anyone
from the back and passengers really aren't learning to fly. Other than
that, I've got both five gallon tanks at the rear seat position. Benefits
are ease of fueling, not as significant a change in CG from full to
empty, and frees up the aft section for carrying "stuff".
Jim Baker
580.788.2779
'71 SV, 492TC
Elmore City, OK
When did a Firestar ever make 103 weight limits (254 lbs)? I don't know of any.
Ralph
--\"JimBaker\"wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"JimBaker"
Realistically,isanyoneactuallyusingthatsecondseat?Justcurious
sinceIdon'tasitreallyviolatesthe103rule.Can'tteachanyone
fromthebackandpassengersreallyaren'tlearningtofly.Otherthan
that,I'vegotbothfivegallontanksattherearseatposition.Benefits
areeaseoffueling,notassignificantachangeinCGfromfullto
empty,andfreesuptheaftsectionforcarrying"stuff".
<
BR>
JimBaker
580.788.2779
'71SV,492TC
ElmoreCity,OK
When did a Firestar ever make 103 weight limits (254 lbs)? I don't know of any.
Ralph
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Pike <richard(at)bcchapel.org> |
No experience with flying a MKII.
Both our on-site Kolbs have VG's and modified aileron linkage, so comparing
them with a stock a/c might be irrelevant, but IMO, there is not much
difference in the roll rates in our two. Both respond very well, there is a
perceived difference in that the MKIII has a lower and more reclined
seating position, whereas the FSII has a taller, more upright position. So
your sensory feedback is a bit different, our FSII "feels like" there is
more of a pendulum effect, in reality, probably not.
I doubt there is much difference in the roll rates.
Both are very much three axis airplanes, coordinated stick and rudder are
mandatory for brisk response.
The FSII has notably more dihedral than stock, and will fly hands off.
The MKIII has stock dihedral and will not.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>
>Hi Thom,
>What John said and.....You sit way down in the MK II (the enclosed version)
>and the MK III has flaps where the MK II has full span ailerons. The MK III
>has more ribs and is beefier all around. I can't tell you about the flying
>differences as I have never flown a MK III. I have owned two MK II's and am
>building a MK IIIC currently. Compared to the FS II the MK II has a little
>better roll rate, I assume due to the full span ailerons and control design.
>Maybe Brother Pike can compare the roll rates of the Mk III versus the FS II
>and give an idea of how the three models compare.
>Also for you folks that have flown the MK III with a center stick versus the
>twin stick setup, is there any difference in force required to move the
>ailerons due to the slight rigging differences? John you have probably flown
>both set-ups, did you notice any difference? I know that the aileron control
>rods can be moved in at the torque rod connection to help with control
>forces and I plan on trying this when the time comes, (see Richard Pikes
>website) thanks Richard.
>
>John Cooley
>Lucedale, Ms.
>FS II
>MK II
>Building MK III
>
>
> | Can anyone tell me the major (and minor) differences between a
>Twinstar
>| Mk 11 and Mk 111(c)?
>|
>| Thom in Buffalo
>
>Hi Thom/Gang:
>
>Primary differences are tail boom and main wing spars. MKIII has 6"
>instead of 5".
>
>Fuselage is much better designed, wider and stronger.
>
>I don't know much about the MKII. Never had any dealings with it
>except what I read on this List.
>
>john h
>MKIII/912ULS
>Titus, Alabama
>
>
>--
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Nagy <dcnagy(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Kolb 1986 Twinstar w Rotax 503 |
In 1997 I bought a Kolb Twinstar that had a 1986 Rotax 503 SCSI with only 30
hours on the Hobbs. I went ahead and got it N numbered and flew for another
45 hours or so. In that time I had one engine outage which occurred when I
throttled back to idle before landing. Problem traced to clogged idle jet.
And a couple years ago I had a mishap and I'm only now getting the Twinstar
back together and ready to fly.
Question: Is the nearly 20 year old engine ,even though it has low time ,
too much of a risk. I know Rotax suggests new crank and bearings based on
age not just running hours. I've decarboned the heads, the rings are free
and the I can still see the cross hatching on the cylinder walls. But it's
the possible corrosion of the crank needle bearings that concern me.
And to put a little more urgency to the question Rotax is offering a $750
trade in of older engines on a new 503 til the end of this month.
The new engine would be nice with dual ignition and oil injection but it
will always be a 2 cycle..
Just to dream on a bit has anybody out there put a HKS 700 on a Kolb instead
of a Rotax. It seems it would be a fairly close match on power and weight
and of course be a 4 cycle but at double the price!
Dave Nagy
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Sunday visit to Bailes Airport |
Robert,
I flew down to Bailes yesterday on my way to Freeport. Just flying for the
fun of it. Ended up having to rush back because of weather.
Gary Haley
Dry Creek Airport (ts07)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <undoctor(at)rcn.com> |
Hello,
I have an Ultrastar I'm currently rebuilding. I had the nose
raised like a Firestar a few years ago. I bought a house and
have been up to my eyebrows with it until now, so the Ultrastar
just sat in all that time.
In the interim, the fellow where I had my plane died and I had
to move it in parts from there to here and now that I'm putting
it together, I've discovered I left a box of parts. Missing is all
the engine mount hardware.
Would you be kind enough to describe the parts and the
sequence they are installec? I understand the mounts are Lord
mounts, similar to the ones on the Firestar, but the Firestar
engine is right-side-up and the Ultrastar engine, of course,
hangs beneath the mounting tubing.
Any info you could supply me with would be greatly appreciated.
By the way, I'm living in Bethlehem, PA. What part of the
world do you call home?
Regards,
Davd Kulp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Bing Enrichment Piston |
Kolbers...
After a couple of folks mentioned it offline, one thing I guess I should put out
on the wire is additional evidence that the carb enrichment piston played a
role in the carbon problem... I previously mentioned that the mechanics discovered
the bottom insert (rubber) in the piston was pushed up and permanently deformed
away from the valve seat. They speculated that this could have been leaking
raw gas into the carb circuit. The enrichment piston was replaced.
The one hour and six minutes I flew it yesterday consumed just slightly less than
2.5 gallons... and most of that was
hard running, up around 5900 to 6000, with occasional 3 minute bursts at 6500 or
6600.
Before, it would have easily used over 3 gallons for an hour of average cruising
around... more like 3.3 to 3.4.
That gas was going somewhere, and based on the reduced fuel burn rate yesterday,
I strongly suspect it was passing through the defective seat in that piston
and going directly into coke production.
Henceforth, I plan to yank that little item out and have a look at it on an annual
basis... Before, all I ever inspected was to make certain that I could feel
the piston hit bottom when I closed it. Obviously, that was not adequate.
Will attempt to fly it again this afternoon, weather permitting... will measure
fuel burn again.
It's great to feel the wind beneath my Kolb wings again, instead of just the wind
beneath my britches while driving back and forth to Sebring....
Regards,
Optimistic Beauford
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Baker" <jlbaker(at)telepath.com> |
> Realistically, is anyone actually using that second seat? Just
curious
> since I don't as it really violates the 103 rule
Snip.....
> When did a Firestar ever make 103 weight limits (254 lbs)? I don't
> know of any. Ralph
Ralph is certainly correct on this point but there are some things the
FAA folks (well, at least the ones I've run into) will look at and some
they will ignore. I've been asked several times if those tanks were a
total of ten gallons and indicated, yes, they were. Seems as long as I
was the only one in the craft, everything else about 103 seemed to
go by the boards as long as the craft looked like a UL. And the FAA
folks told me as much. Obviously, others will have different
experiences.
Jim Baker
580.788.2779
'71 SV, 492TC
Elmore City, OK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
At 12:11 PM 8/15/2005, you wrote:
>
>Kolbers...
>
>After a couple of folks mentioned it offline, one thing I guess I
>should put out on the wire is additional evidence that the carb
>enrichment piston played a role in the carbon problem... I
>previously mentioned that the mechanics discovered the bottom insert
>(rubber) in the piston was pushed up and permanently deformed away
>from the valve seat. They speculated that this could have been
>leaking raw gas into the carb circuit. The enrichment piston was replaced.
What part on the "enrichment piston" was replaced.
Maybe a part number from CPS??
I assuming you mean the choke, right?
Does your's have a primer and a choke system??
Just looking for problems on mine, you know - things are starting to wear.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)mindspring.com> |
What kind of CHT temps are you guys getting on a 503 dual carb on
climb out .... and cruise at say 5,800 rpm?
At 10:35 PM 8/14/2005, you wrote:
>
>At 10:08 PM 8/14/2005, you wrote:
>
> >Consensus at Sebring is that 447 is most carbon-prone and crankiest
> >to adjust of all the current Rotax engines.
> >I believe it.
> >
> >Beauford
>
>You better believe it.
>My old 503 has recently run up to 335 - 340 CHT on climb out...and
>I'm starting
>to get worried.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Domenic Perez" <perezmdomenic(at)plateautel.net> |
Two tank Kolbers,
If using two tanks whose floors are at different levels in level flight, and
using the usual Mikuni pulse pump, here is the $64,000 question. If one tank
runs dry and starts sucking air, are the pulse pumps powerful enough to still
pull the fuel from the non-dry tank and keep the carb's bowls full? Or is some
of the fuel unusable? I've never run my tanks that low, so I don't know from
direct experience. Don't want to find out the hard way.
My setup is a line coming out the top of each tank (drawing from the bottoms
through check valves that give weight to the fuel lines so they stay down) and
joining at a "T" and on to the carbs. I have a primer pump, but no primer
bulb. I also have an "equalizer" line between the two tanks. Does this equalizer
do any good? My two tanks are mounted on the boom tube behind the 2nd seat
and seem pretty close to being equal height on the ground, but I just never thought
much about the tail being high enough in flight to make a significant difference.
Thinking about it now.
M. Domenic Perez
Vaughn, NM
Firestar II, 503 DCDI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
Brother Possum...
Yessir... Doan' got no CPS.... However, in the Lockwood book, they call
it a "choke piston with gasket...." It is part number 963-740 out of a 36mm
Bing Model 54... And you shall know it by its black rubber underside if you
are feeling sufficiently kinky to look there when it somes in the mail.
The goons at the castle call it an "enrichment piston," and you will have
to forgive me... I picked it up...(sure sign of a weak, or failing,
mind...). To me, being a fossil, a "choke" is a device that restricts
airflow by imposing a butterfly plate or somesuch across the airflow in the
venturi.... This thing "chokes" nothing, but merely dumps raw gas into the
equation... same end result, I reckon.
At their advice, I removed the primer from my engine...and concurrently
reduced the idle RPM from
2450 hot, to 2150 hot.... thus making it easier to start. So far it is
working.... third pull seems
to be the ticket. Their advice also included down-jetting the idle circuit
from a 45 to a 40, claiming that it would be a tad more smooth, and that a
2000 idle could thus be approached without chattering the B-box... I assume
that guidance is applicable only in a hot climate, but did not specifically
ask.
You are certainly correct, Sir... Things are most assuredly beginning to
wear... In the interests of common decency, I will not go there in this
post...
Good luck with the 503.... gotta be a better hand to hold than this 447....
The game continues.
Beauford
FF #076
Brandon, FL
----- Original Message -----
>
> At 12:11 PM 8/15/2005, you wrote:
>
> What part on the "enrichment piston" was replaced.
> Maybe a part number from CPS??
> I assuming you mean the choke, right?
> Does your's have a primer and a choke system??
>
> Just looking for problems on mine, you know - things are starting to wear.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: the 447 - Part Two |
Beauford....
You sir are a journalistic magician.....I certainly enjoyed that story...and
in our office,( I had to show it around here) we are all extra sensitive (or
jealous maybe) to the market dominating position Rotax has in the small
aircraft engine biz...and particularly amazed at the tactics they use , and
still maintain that position. In our industry, we would be smashed by our
competitors, boycotted by the dealers and disdained by the customers in a
moment if we operated the way they do.
Also...I feel compelled to admit....I now have 20 trouble free hours on the
new engine installation on the FlagFly....and like you, I have way to much
money in that dang 447. Sure wish there were more choices!
Don Gherardini
OEM.Sales / Engineering dept.
American Honda Engines
Power Equipment Company
CortLand, Illinois
800-626-7326
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David L. Bigelow" <dlbigelow(at)verizon.net> |
>What kind of CHT temps are you guys getting on a 503 dual carb on
>climb out .... and cruise at say 5,800 rpm?
I'm seeing 265 F for the front cylinder and 275 F for the rear with my 503 DC.
during climb, and slightly below that in cruise. That's with outside air temp
in the 60's.
Dave Bigelow
FS2, 503 DCDI
Kamuela, Hawaii
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "skyrider2" <skyrider2(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Kolb-List Digest: 28 Msgs - 08/15/05 |
And if you're worried about busting 103, doesn't the second 5 gallon fuel
tank do that as well? Or have they changed the rules since I read them
last?
Fly Safely,
Doug
Realistically, is anyone actually using that second seat? Just curious
since I don't as it really violates the 103 rule. Can't teach anyone
from the back and passengers really aren't learning to fly. Other than
that, I've got both five gallon tanks at the rear seat position. Benefits
are ease of fueling, not as significant a change in CG from full to
empty, and frees up the aft section for carrying "stuff".
Jim Baker
580.788.2779
'71 SV, 492TC
Elmore City, OK
When did a Firestar ever make 103 weight limits (254 lbs)? I don't know of
any.
Ralph
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JIM HEFNER" <hefner_jim(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: the 447 - Part Two |
Beauford....
You sir are a journalistic magician..... Don G.
Beauford, I'll second that... that story was certainly entertaining and hilarious
reading!! You really know how to evoke great mental images with words!!...
Thanks for taking the time!
Your entire saga with your 447 has been interesting and puzzling to follow! Sorry
you have had such a time with that little bugger. I've got 215 hrs on mine
and have never had one hint of an issue with it, so it was obvious that there
was something basic wrong with yours. The thing I still don't understand was
how it ran 120 hrs ok and then went south on you so fast.... the enrichment
valve seating theory seems like it would have been there all along since the engine
was new... did you remove it around that time? Oh well, we're all glad
to see it is performing better now and hopefully you will hundreds of trouble
free flying hours out of it now, like most of us with 447's.
Keep up the great stories!! Love it!!
Jim
Tucson, AZ
FF #022 447 215 trouble free hours and counting
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "jdmurr(at)juno.com" <jdmurr(at)juno.com> |
| Subject: | CHT & EGT for 503 DCDI |
I was wondering what the operating ranges are on the 503 DCDI for CHT and EGT.
Also what is the maximums I should see without damage to the engine?
For example this weekend it was in the high 90's and very humid. My EGT was a max
of 1,125 at 4,500 rpm. If I increased the rpm to 5,200, the temperature dropped
to 1,080. I assume that this was because of the better cooling with the
increased air flow. If I can remember correctly, the CHT was about 325-350,
but I could be wrong. Also my needles are set on position number 3.
I've only been flying for 2 weeks and it's always been stinking hot and humid when
I've been up, so I don't know what it's like to fly on a cool dry day yet.
Thanks!
John Murr
I was wondering what the operating ranges are on the 503 DCDI for CHT and EGT.
Also what is the maximums I should see without damage to the engine?
For example this weekend it was in the high 90's and very humid. My EGT was a max
of 1,125 at 4,500 rpm. If I increased the rpm to 5,200, the temperature dropped
to 1,080. I assume that this was because of the better cooling with the increased
air flow. If I can remember correctly, the CHT was about 325-350, but
I could be wrong. Also my needles are set on position number 3.
I've only been flying for 2 weeks and it's always been stinking hot and humid when
I've been up, so I don't know what it's like to fly on a cool dry day yet.
Thanks!
John Murr
________________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
You WILL suck air and the engine WILL stop with no advance warning. Don't
ask me how I know this.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Laird" <rlaird(at)cavediver.com> |
The only tank that should be feeding the pulse pump is the lower tank. The lower
tank needs to be "enclosed"... only one line going out to the pump, and only
one line going into it from the upper tank. The upper tank needs to be vented.
As fuel is pumped from the lower tank, the upper tank will feed the lower
tank. You only fill up the upper tank. I had a set up like this and it worked
perfect. However, I will admit that the lower tank did not overlap, vertically,
the upper tank. If they overlap like that, you may want to run a test,
first, but I don't think that will be an issue as long as the very bottom of the
pickup tube in the upper tank is higher than the top of the lower tank.
-- Robert
-------- Original Message --------
> From: "Domenic Perez" <perezmdomenic(at)plateautel.net>
> Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 5:41 PM
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Kolb-List: Two tanks
>
>
> Two tank Kolbers,
> If using two tanks whose floors are at different levels in level flight,
and using the usual Mikuni pulse pump, here is the $64,000 question. If one tank
runs dry and starts sucking air, are the pulse pumps powerful enough to still
pull the fuel from the non-dry tank and keep the carb's bowls full? Or is some
of the fuel unusable? I've never run my tanks that low, so I don't know from
direct experience. Don't want to find out the hard way.
> My setup is a line coming out the top of each tank (drawing from the bottoms
through check valves that give weight to the fuel lines so they stay down)
and joining at a "T" and on to the carbs. I have a primer pump, but no primer
bulb. I also have an "equalizer" line between the two tanks. Does this equalizer
do any good? My two tanks are mounted on the boom tube behind the 2nd seat
and seem pretty close to being equal height on the ground, but I just never
thought much about the tail being high enough in flight to make a significant
difference. Thinking about it now.
>
> M. Domenic Perez
> Vaughn, NM
> Firestar II, 503 DCDI
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Williamson" <kolbrapilot2(at)comcast.net> |
Domenic and All,
Bad information sent to the list is worse than no information at all.
If you install the two tanks as per Kolb instructions with the proper vent
lines and the fuel pickup tubes fitted in the top of the tank, the fuel will
feed from the tanks and the fuel levels will stay close together but not be
equal. When you shut down the engine, any difference in levels will equal
out in a short period of time.
When the bottom of one of the pickup tubes is above the fuel level, the fuel
will still be sucked out of the tank that has fuel covering the end of the
pickup tube.
This can be checked and should be checked by raising the tail of the Kolb to
the flight attitude and pump the fuel tanks dry using an aux pump and the
normal fuel line setup disconnected from the carb. This is how you find how
much fuel is unusable also.
I ran thru this process several time while I had the two 5 gallon tanks in
the Kolbra and got the same results each time.
John Williamson
Arlington, TX
Kolb Kolbra, Rotax 912ULS, 909 hours
<http://home.comcast.net/~kolbrapilot
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Cooley" <johnc(at)datasync.com> |
Hi Gang,
I have my FS II rigged per the Kolb instructions and as John talks about
below. The fuel levels stay very close to the same level when flying. I have
never flown until I ran out, but have had the levels down very low in each
tank and they should empty very close to each other based on what I have
experienced.
I have also fueled up before and started flying with the front tank at a
higher level than the back. After flying a while and checking the levels
they will be essentially the same. I suppose due to the tank with the higher
level having more head pressure and therefore feeding more to the fuel pump.
Later,
John Cooley
FS II
MK II
MK IIIC (building)
Domenic and All,
Bad information sent to the list is worse than no information at all.
If you install the two tanks as per Kolb instructions with the proper vent
lines and the fuel pickup tubes fitted in the top of the tank, the fuel will
feed from the tanks and the fuel levels will stay close together but not be
equal. When you shut down the engine, any difference in levels will equal
out in a short period of time.
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob Pongracz" <pongoflyer(at)myway.com> |
David, By the way, I'm living in Bethlehem, PA....Nice to hear of another Kolber
in PA. Where will you be flying from when your bird is complete?I am currently
working on a Firefly project at Flying M (P91) northwest of Allentown. I've
seen some other U.S.'s at area fly-ins, but don't know if they're on the list
or not. Let me know if I can be of any assistance. Bob Pongracz....Fogelsville,
PA...Firefly project
No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding.
Make My Way your home on the Web - http://dell.myway.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WhiskeyVictor36(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
In a message dated 8/15/2005 9:00:43 PM Eastern Standard Time,
beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com writes:
At their advice, I removed the primer from my engine
Beauford,
Do you mean the primer bulb, or the primer that shoots fuel into the side of
the carb? And could you tell us why did Lockwood suggest removing said primer?
Thank you
Bill Varnes
Original Kolb FireStar
Audubon NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Swiderski" <rswiderski(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Two tanks vented in series |
With my SlingShot setup with two tanks, one in front of the other, I wanted
to empty the rear 1st, so I set it up where the rear tank was vented to
atmosphere & its suction line from the top was connected to the front tanks
vent. Thus when I drew gas from the front thank, it 1st drew fuel from the
rear tank that it was vented to. When the rear tank was bone dry, then the
fuel level in the front tank would begin to fall. That way I got rid of the
high rear cg caused by the rear tank, & I could use all the fuel as well,
without worrying about if one was more empty than the other. Never had a
problem with that setup. Also, if I used less than 5 gal of fuel, I only
had to top off one tank. ...Richard Swiderski
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of BKlebon(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Two tanks
You WILL suck air and the engine WILL stop with no advance warning. Don't
ask me how I know this.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ElleryWeld(at)aol.com |
If you want to stop your worries with two five gallon tanks get one of these
ten gallon tanks Air-Tech Inc. :: Tank, Fuel, 10 Gal Only
I put one in my firestar and it works great
Ellery Batchelder in Maine
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
Bill...
Sorry I didn't make that as clear as I could have....
The rubber squeeze bulb with by-pass loop remains in place... The piston
pump primer which squirts gas into
the side of the carb via that little one-eighth inch line was removed from
the Fly.
The Sebring gents said they had seen some number of piston primer pumps
fail, and some engines get screwed up, because of the deterioration and
plugging of internal components in the primer pump as a result of exposure
to fuel, particularly pre-mix, over a long period... This leads to a
primer failure in one of two modes; either sucking air through the port in
the side of the carb, or raw fuel through the same port -- either one a bad
thing.
They claimed that if the idle rpm and idle jetting were properly set up
(down around 2100 someplace), and the enrichment piston is in good repair,
then the primer pump is not necessary to crank the engine. They also said
that if one really wanted to keep the primer pump, it was a good idea to
replace it at least every year or 18 months, since the problems were
associated with older pumps and new ones are cheap.... under $10. Their
logic for removal is that if it is not required, the pump and its one-eighth
inch lines become just unnecessary points of potential failure on the
engine.... get rid of it.
Based on their experience, I reckon it makes sense to remove it, at least in
Florida... If I operated in a more northern climate where I had to be
starting really cold Rotaxes in the winter, I suspect I would just be buying
a new primer pump each year. The Rotax and Bing brothers obviously went to
the trouble of placing that little injection port on the side of the carb
for some good reason... gotta be cold weather starting.
One other perspective lurks out there... As someone has pointed out, the
case can be made for doing just the opposite... Getting rid of that pesky
enrichment piston (sealing off the carb choke circuit)....and starting it by
using only a primer pump to squirt gas into the side of the carb.... heh,
heh....
That's all I know... hope this helps a little.
Beauford
FF #076
Brandon, FL
> >
> Beauford,
>
> Do you mean the primer bulb, or the primer that shoots fuel into the side
> of
> the carb? And could you tell us why did Lockwood suggest removing said
> primer?
> >
> Bill Varnes
> Original Kolb FireStar
> Audubon NJ
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Edward Steuber" <esteuber(at)rochester.rr.com> |
| Subject: | bing enrichment piston |
All ,
I am having a problem with the lines filling with air all the way back to
the squeeze bulb if the engine is idle for a day. I have a Mikuni carb on a Cuyuna
UL202 with a single squeeze bulb primer with the loop around and a one way
check valve so I don't have to pinch to prime. Upon squeezing the bulb it is
very hard to get fuel into the carb in any amount ...kind of dribbles through
slowly... after squeezing for a while , I can get it started usually on the
3rd pull but then the piston enrichment needs to be used numerous times till it
runs at 3,000 for a while and the fuel lines fill up. It seems as though I
can't get anything through the single fuel pump in any amount ....but the pump
works when the engine is running...if I restart within an hour I have no problem
at all with air in the lines. Is this normal because of the check valves in
the fuel pump ?
The engine runs strong and temps are ok in flight ..... both EGT's at 1125
except for a CHT spread of 350 and 270....I suspect a leaking inlet carb
needle but the inability to prime has got me wondering if I may have 2 problems...maybe
a new pump diaphram ? I think the piston enrichment is ok ! Too much
fuel may have been the reason why I had a carbon problem a short while ago
but a slow leak in my inlet needle should not be a problem except at idle....????
Ed in Western NY
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steven Jay <allife2001(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | BFI/Flying Fields |
Guys:
I am new to the Atlanta area and am looking for a BFI
who trains in a Kolb. Also for those that live and fly
here, where are the ultralight friendly flying fields
located?
Thanks
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
Hi all,
the following was sent to me by a mate in OZ.
Enjoy
Dear Pat:
I hope you and the family are well. I know it's been quite a while since you
last heard from me, but Doreen and the rest of the family are all OK but I
think they're getting a bit pissed off with station life, particularly when
there's bugger all rain to speak of - and the cattle and sheep are dying all
over the place!
I'm writing to you, mate, because I need your help to get me bloody pilots
license back (you keep telling me you got all the right contacts, well now's
your chance to make something happen for me because, mate, I'm bloody
desperate). But first, I'd better tell you what happened during my last
flight review with the CASA Examiner.
On the phone, Ron (that's the CASA d!ckhead) seemed a reasonable sort of
bloke. He politely reminded me of the need to do a flight review every two
years. He even offered to drive out, have look over my property and let me
operate from my own ALA. Naturally I agreed to that. Anyway, Ron turned up
last Wednesday.
First up, he said he was a bit surprised to see the plane outside my
homestead because the ALA is about a mile away. I explained that because the
strip was so close to the homestead, it was more convenient than the ALA,
despite the power lines crossing about midway down the strip (it's really
not a problem to land and take-off because at the half-way point down the
strip you're usually still on the ground). For some reason Ron seemed
nervous. So, although I had done the pre-flight inspection only four days
earlier, I decided to do it all over again. Because the pr!ck was watching
me carefully, I walked around the plane three times instead of my usual two.
My effort was rewarded because the colour finally returned to Ron's cheeks -
in fact they went a bright red.
In view of Ron's obviously better mood, I told him I was going to combine
the test flight with farm work as I had to deliver three poddy calves from
the home paddock to the main herd. After a bit of a chase I finally caught
the calves and threw them into the back of the ol' 172. We climbed aboard
but Ron started getting' into me about weight and balance calculations and
all that bullsh!t. Of course I knew that sort of thing was a waste of time
because, calves like to move around a bit, particularly when they see
themselves 500 feet off the ground! So, it's bloody pointless trying to
secure them as you know. However, I did tell Ron that he shouldn't worry as
I always keep the trim wheel 'Araldited' to neutral to ensure we remain
pretty stable at all stages throughout the flight.
Anyway, I started the engine and cleverly minimised the warm-up time by
tramping hard on the brakes and gunning her to 2,500rpm. I then discovered
that Ron has very acute hearing, even though he was wearing a bloody
headset. Through all that noise he detected a metallic rattle and demanded I
account for it. Actually it began about a month ago and was caused by a
screwdriver that fell down a hole in the floor and lodged in the fuel
selector mechanism. The selector can't be moved now, but it doesn't matter
because it's jammed on 'All Tanks', so I suppose that's OK.
However, as Ron was obviously a real nit-picker, I blamed the noise on
vibration from a stainless steel thermos flask, which I keep in a beaut
little possie between the windshield and the magnetic compass. My
explanation seemed to relax Ron because he slumped back in the seat and kept
looking up at the cockpit roof. I released the brakes to taxi out but
unfortunately the plane gave a leap and spun to the right, "Hell" I thought,
"not the starboard wheel chock again". The bump jolted Ron back to full
alertness. He looked wildly around just in time to see a rock thrown by the
prop wash disappear completely through the windscreen of his brand new
Commodore. "Sh!t, now I'm really in trouble", I thought.
While Ron was busy ranting about his car, I ignored his requirement that we
taxi to the ALA and instead took off under the power lines. Ron didn't say a
word, at least not until the engine started coughing right at the lift off
point, then he bloody screamed his head off, "Oh God! Oh God! Oh God!"
"Now take it easy, Ron" I told him firmly, "that often happens on take-off
and there is a good reason for it." I explained patiently that I usually run
the plane on standard MOGAS, but one day I accidentally put in a gallon or
two of kerosene. To compensate for the low octane of the kerosene, I
siphoned in a few gallons off super MOGAS and shook the wings up and down a
few times to mix it up. Since then, the engine has been coughing a bit but
in general it works just fine, if you know how to coax it properly.
Anyway Andy, at this stage Ron seemed to lose all interest in my flight
test. He pulled out some rosary beads, closed his eyes and became lost in
prayer (I didn't think anyone was a Catholic these days). I selected some
nice music on the HF radio to help him relax. Meanwhile I climbed to my
normal cruising altitude of 10,500 feet (I don't normally put in a flight
plan or get the weather because as you know getting NAIPS access out here is
a f#*% joke and the bloody weather is always 8/8 blue anyway. But since I
had that near miss with the Saab340, I might have to change me thinking).
Anyhow, on levelling out I noticed some wild camels heading into my improved
pasture. I hate camels and always carry a loaded .303 clipped inside the
door of the Cessna just in case I see any of the bastards. We were too high
to hit them, but as a matter of principle, I decided to have a go through
the open window. Mate, when I pulled the bloody rifle out, the effect on Ron
was friggin' electric. As I fired the first shot his neck lengthened by
about six inches and his eyes bulged like a rabbit with myxo. He really
looked as if he had been jabbed with an electric cattle prod on full power.
In fact, Ron's reaction was so distracting that I lost concentration for a
second and the next shot went straight through the port tyre. Ron was a bit
upset about the shooting (probably one of those pinko animal lovers I guess)
so I decided not to tell him about our little problem with the tyre. Shortly
afterwards I located the main herd and decided to do my fighter pilot trick.
Ron had gone back to praying when, in one smooth sequence, I pulled on full
flap, cut the power and started a sideslip from 10,500 feet down to 500 feet
at 130 knots indicated (the last time I looked anyway) and the little needle
rushing up to the red area on me ASI. Sh!t, what a buzz, mate!
About half way through the descent I looked back in the cabin to see the
calves gracefully suspended in mid air and mooing like crazy. I was going to
comment on this unusual sight but Ron looked a bit green and had rolled
himself into the foetal position and was screamin' his f*&%# head off. Mate,
talk about being in a bloody zoo. You should've been there, it was so bloody
funny!
At about 500 feet I levelled out, but for some reason we continued sinking.
When we reached 50 feet I applied full power but nothin' happened; no noise
no nothin'. Then, luckily, I heard me instructor's voice in me head saying
"carby heat, carby heat", so I pulled carby heat on and that helped quite a
lot, with the engine finally regaining full power. Whew, that was really
close, let me tell you!
Then mate, you'll never guess what happened next! As luck would have it, at
that height we flew into a massive dust cloud caused by the cattle and
suddenly went I.F. bloody R, mate. Andy, you would've been bloody proud of
me as I didn't panic once, not once, but I did make a mental note to
consider an instrument rating as soon as me gyro is repaired (something I've
been meaning to do for a while now).
Suddenly Ron's elongated neck and bulging eyes reappeared. His mouth opened
wide, very wide, but no sound emerged. "Take it easy," I told him. "We'll be
out of this in a minute." Sure enough, about a minute later we emerge; still
straight and level and still at 50 feet. Admittedly I was surprised to
notice that we were upside down, and I kept thinking to myself "Sh!t I hope
Ron didn't notice that I had forgotten to set the QNH when we were taxiing".
This minor tribulation forced me to fly to a nearby valley in which I had to
do a half roll to get upright again.
By now the main herd had divided into two groups leaving a narrow strip
between them. "Ah!" I thought, "There's an omen. We'll land right there."
Knowing that the tyre problem demanded a slow approach, I flew a couple of
steep turns with full flap. Soon the stall warning horn was blaring so loud
in me ear that I cut its circuit breaker to shut it up, but by then I knew
we were slow enough anyway. I turned steeply onto a 75 foot final and put
her down with a real thud. Strangely enough, I had always thought you could
only ground loop in a tail dragger but, as usual, I was proved wrong again!
Halfway through our third loop Ron at last recovered his sense of humour.
Talk about laugh. I've never seen the likes of it; he couldn't stop. We
finally rolled to a halt and I released the calves, who bolted out of the
aircraft like there was no tomorrow.
I then began picking clumps of dry grass. Between gut wrenching fits of
laughter Ron asked what I was doing. I explained that we had to stuff the
port tyre with grass so we could fly back to the homestead. It was then that
Ron really lost the plot and started running away from the aircraft. Can you
believe it?
The last time I saw him he was off into the distance, arms flailing in the
air and still shrieking with laughter. I later heard that he had been
confined to a psychiatric institution - poor bastard!
Anyhow, mate, that's enough about Ron. The problem is I just got a letter
from CASA withdrawing, as they put it, 'my privileges to fly'; until I have
undergone a complete pilot training course again and undertaken another
flight proficiency test. Now I admit that I made a mistake in taxiing over
the wheel chock and not setting the QNH using strip elevation, but I can't
see what else I did that was so bloody bad that they have to withdraw me
flamin' licence. Can you?
Anyhow mate, the reason for writing to you is to ask if you know any flight
instructors who would be willing to come out the station for about 2 months
to help get me back up to speed. I'll pay them good money while they're here
and they won't have to worry about paying for food or accommodation.
Looking forward to your response. Until then, take care, mate.
Kindest regards Pete O'Heat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JIM HEFNER" <hefner_jim(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
From: "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com<mailto:beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com>>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing Enrichment Piston
Bill...
Sorry I didn't make that as clear as I could have....
They claimed that if the idle rpm and idle jetting were properly set up
(down around 2100 someplace), and the enrichment piston is in good repair,
then the primer pump is not necessary to crank the engine. They also said
that if one really wanted to keep the primer pump, it was a good idea to
replace it at least every year or 18 months, since the problems were
associated with older pumps and new ones are cheap.... under $10. Their
logic for removal is that if it is not required, the pump and its one-eighth
inch lines become just unnecessary points of potential failure on the
engine.... get rid of it.
Folks,
I agree with the Sebring gents on this one. I've never had a primer on my 447....
just the in-line squeeze bulb with bypass. I pump the fuel lines and carb
bowl full with the squeeze bulb, open the enrichment valve full, give it two pulls
with ignition off, then one pull with live ignition and 9 out of 10 times
it's running. I've flown here in Tucson when it was in the 20's at the airport
and in Bryce Canyon it was 30 and never noticed any difference in starting
from when it's 70. If you have good clean fresh fuel, good plugs, fill the fuel
lines and carb bowl, your enrichment valve is working properly and your idle
jet is set properly you shouldn't need a primer to start it easily. Maybe someone
in MN or Maine might need a primer if they are flying when it's zero or
below... When mine no longer does this, I'll be taking everything apart until
I find out why.
Jim Hefner
Tucson
FF#022
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jack & Louise Hart <jbhart(at)ldd.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
>
>Bill...
>Sorry I didn't make that as clear as I could have....
>
>The rubber squeeze bulb with by-pass loop remains in place... The piston
>pump primer which squirts gas into
>the side of the carb via that little one-eighth inch line was removed from
>the Fly.
>
>The Sebring gents said they had seen some number of piston primer pumps
>fail, and some engines get screwed up, because of the deterioration and
>plugging of internal components in the primer pump as a result of exposure
>to fuel, particularly pre-mix, over a long period... This leads to a
>primer failure in one of two modes; either sucking air through the port in
>the side of the carb, or raw fuel through the same port -- either one a bad
>thing.
>
Beauford & Kolbers,
One way around this is add a primer that is designed for use with two cycle
engines. They are readily available and inexpensive and they work very
well. I took a primer pump off a discarded weed wacker and mounted it
directly on the Bing float bowl. Two or three squirts depending on the
outside temperature and the engine fires on the first or second time over
compression. It has been in use for over two years with no problems.
How it was done can be see at:
http://www.thirdshift.com/jack/firefly/firefly89.html
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
Jack B. Hart
jbhart(at)ldd.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
Beauford and others,
Every kolb should have a primer pump instead for better starts. Don't even use
the enrichner. I have disconnected the cable on mine. That enrichner is a problem
waiting to happen as it could easily hang up and throw more raw fuel into
the engine. If you disconnect the cable, there won't be a problem with it not
closing properly.
One less thing to go wrong ......
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
-- \"Beauford\" wrote:
Kolbers...
After a couple of folks mentioned it offline, one thing I guess I should put out
on the wire is additional evidence that the carb enrichment piston played a
role in the carbon problem... I previously mentioned that the mechanics discovered
the bottom insert (rubber) in the piston was pushed up and permanently deformed
away from the valve seat. They speculated that this could have been leaking
raw gas into the carb circuit. The enrichment piston was replaced.
The one hour and six minutes I flew it yesterday consumed just slightly less than
2.5 gallons... and most of that was
hard running, up around 5900 to 6000, with occasional 3 minute bursts at 6500 or
6600.
Before, it would have easily used over 3 gallons for an hour of average cruising
around... more like 3.3 to 3.4.
That gas was going somewhere, and based on the reduced fuel burn rate yesterday,
I strongly suspect it was passing through the defective seat in that piston
and going directly into coke production.
Henceforth, I plan to yank that little item out and have a look at it on an annual
basis... Before, all I ever inspected was to make certain that I could feel
the piston hit bottom when I closed it. Obviously, that was not adequate.
Will attempt to fly it again this afternoon, weather permitting... will measure
fuel burn again.
It's great to feel the wind beneath my Kolb wings again, instead of just the wind
beneath my britches while driving back and forth to Sebring....
Regards,
Optimistic Beauford
Beauford and others,
Every kolb should have a primer pump instead for better starts. Don't even use
the enrichner. I have disconnected the cable on mine. That enrichner is a problem
waiting to happen as it could easily hang up and throw more raw fuel into
the engine. If you disconnect the cable, there won't be a problemwith itnotclosing
properly.
One less thing to go wrong ......
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
--\"Beauford\"wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Beauford"
Kolbers...
Afteracoupleoffolksmentioneditoffline,onethingIguessIshouldputoutonthewireisadditionalevidencethatthecarbenrichmentpistonplayedaroleinthecarbonproblem...Ipreviouslymentionedthatthemechanicsdiscoveredthebottominsert(rubber)inthepistonwaspushedupandpermanentlydeformedawayfromthevalveseat.Theyspeculatedthatthiscouldhavebeenleakingrawgasintothecarbcirc
uit.Theenrichmentpistonwasreplaced.
TheonehourandsixminutesIflewityesterdayconsumedjustslightlylessthan2.5gallons...andmostofthatwas
hardrunning,uparound5900to6000,withoccasional3minuteburstsat6500or6600.
Before,itwouldhaveeasilyusedover3gallonsforanhourofaveragecruisingaround...morelike3.3to3.4.
Thatgaswasgoingsomewhere,andbasedonthereducedfuelburnrateyesterday,Istronglysuspectitwaspassingthroughthedefectiveseatinthatpistonand
goingdirectlyintocokeproduction.
Henceforth,Iplantoyankthatlittleitemoutandhavealookatitonanannualbasis...Before,allIeverinspectedwastomakecertainthatIcouldfeelthepistonhitbottomwhenIclosedit.Obviously,thatwasnotadequate.
Willattempttoflyitagainthisafternoon,weatherpermitting...willmeasurefuelburnagain.
It'sgreattofeelthewindbeneathmyKolbwingsagain,insteadofjustthewindbeneathmybritcheswhiledrivingbackandforthtoSebring....
R
egards,
OptimisticBeauford
=================================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DAquaNut(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
Beauford,
Was the enrichment piston in question a standard stock item on your
rotax 447? Is that the same as the choke?
Ed
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
At 11:03 AM 8/17/2005, you wrote:
>
>
>Folks,
>
>I agree with the Sebring gents on this one. I've never had a primer
>on my 447.... just the in-line squeeze bulb with bypass. I pump the
>fuel lines and carb bowl full with the squeeze bulb, open the
>enrichment valve full, give it two pulls with ignition off, then one
>pull with live ignition and 9 out of 10 times it's running.
>
>Jim Hefner
That's the trick - I think! Turn the engine over with the enrichment
valve (choke) open
and the ignition "off", throttle off - a few revs. >
Then pull it or crank it with the choke open and the ignition live -
throttle off.
I've never had a primer and never had a problem on my 503.
Now ...the old 447 with points and single carb was something else again.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
Jim and others,
Think about it, if the enrichner fails then it really does a number on your engine
(just ask Beauford). If the 1/4" primer line ever comes loose (which has never
happened in 18 years of flying these things), it will only let a small amount
of air into the carb when compared to the rest of the volume of air coming
through the air cleaner. This would not cause a seizure, just a high EGT reading.
For you pilots living in the north country, try starting a 2-stroke Rotax below
freezing with just the enrichner (choke) alone. A primer will start the engine
on the very first pull if it's done properly. At least mine does.
Which would you rather have?
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
From: "Beauford" >
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Bing Enrichment Piston
Bill...
Sorry I didn't make that as clear as I could have....
They claimed that if the idle rpm and idle jetting were properly set up
(down around 2100 someplace), and the enrichment piston is in good repair,
then the primer pump is not necessary to crank the engine. They also said
that if one really wanted to keep the primer pump, it was a good idea to
replace it at least every year or 18 months, since the problems were
associated with older pumps and new ones are cheap.... under $10. Their
logic for removal is that if it is not required, the pump and its one-eighth
inch lines become just unnecessary points of potential failure on the
engine.... get rid of it.
Folks,
I agree with the Sebring gents on this one. I've never had a primer on my 447....
just the in-line squeeze bulb with bypass. I pump the fuel lines and carb
bowl full with the squeeze bulb, open the enrichment valve full, give it two pulls
with ignition off, then one pull with live ignition and 9 out of 10 times
it's running. I've flown here in Tucson when it was in the 20's at the airport
and in Bryce Canyon it was 30 and never noticed any difference in starting
from when it's 70. If you have good clean fresh fuel, good plugs, fill the fuel
lines and carb bowl, your enrichment valve is working properly and your idle
jet is set properly you shouldn't need a primer to start it easily. Maybe someone
in MN or Maine might need a primer if they are flying when it's zero or
below... When mine no longer does this, I'll be taking everything apart until
I find out why.
Jim Hefner
Tucson
FF#022
Jim and others,
Think about it, if the enrichner fails then it really does a number on your engine
(just ask Beauford). If the 1/4" primer line ever comes loose (which has never
happened in 18 years of flying these things), it will only let a small amount
of air into the carb when compared to the rest of the volume of air comingthrough
the air cleaner. This would not cause a seizure, just a high EGT reading.
For you pilots living in the north country, try starting a 2-stroke Rotax below
freezing with just the enrichner (choke) alone. A primer will start the engine
on the very first pull if it's done properly. At least mine does.
Which would you rather have?
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
Time:10:34:02PMPSTUS
From:"Beauford"
Subject:Re:Kolb-List:BingEnrichmentPiston
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Beauford"
Bill...
SorryIdidn'tmakethatasclearasIcouldhave....
Theyclaimedthatiftheidlerpmandidlejettingwereproperlysetup
(downaround2100someplace),andtheenrichmentpistonisingoodrepair,
thentheprimerpumpisnotnecessarytocranktheengine.Theyalsosaid
thatifonereallywantedtokeepthe&
nbsp;primerpump,itwasagoodideato
replaceitatleasteveryyearor18months,sincetheproblemswere
associatedwitholderpumpsandnewonesarecheap....under$10.Their
logicforremovalisthatifitisnotrequired,thepumpanditsone-eighth
inchlinesbecomejustunnecessarypointsofpotentialfailureonthe
engine....getridofit.
Folks,
IagreewiththeSebringgentsonthisone.I'veneverhadaprimeronmy447....justthein-linesqueezebulbwithbypass.Ipumpthefuellinesa
ndcarbbowlfullwiththesqueezebulb,opentheenrichmentvalvefull,giveittwopullswithignitionoff,thenonepullwithliveignitionand9outof10timesit'srunning.I'veflownhereinTucsonwhenitwasinthe20'sattheairportandinBryceCanyonitwas30andnevernoticedanydifferenceinstartingfromwhenit's70.Ifyouhavegoodcleanfreshfuel,goodplugs,fillthefuellinesandcarbbowl,yourenrichmentvalveisworkingproperlyandyouridlejetissetproperlyyou&nb
sp;shouldn'tneedaprimertostartiteasily.MaybesomeoneinMNorMainemightneedaprimeriftheyareflyingwhenit'szeroorbelow...Whenminenolongerdoesthis,I'llbetakingeverythingapartuntilIfindoutwhy.
JimHefner
Tucson
FF#022
sp;FAQ,
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: BFI/Flying Fields |
Guys:
I am new to the Atlanta area and am looking for a BFI
who trains in a Kolb. Also for those that live and fly
here, where are the ultralight friendly flying fields
located?
Thanks
Steve
----------
Join the club at:
http://www.georgiasportflyers.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitty <benny_bee_01(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Kolb list electric trim tab |
Foks,
following example,,,
Is there any BFI who would be able to train me in
central mississippi except CMLF club ??
--- Steve Garvelink wrote:
>
>
> Again you guys talk about trim tabs, I think that
> this is still the
> coolest one I have seen.
>
> SRGLINK
>
>
> http://www.n566aj.com/max/frugal.htm
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Al Colloredo <alfi98596(at)yahoo.com> |
I am looking for a well built very low hour Firestar,
trailer also
considered. Close to West Coast if possible. Upgrades
and options such as
ballistic chute OK. Rotax 50 C box preferred.
Thanks
Al
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
Ralph...
Thought you would want to know...What you said in your post (see below)
contradicts what the Rotax mechs told me...
They said the primer pump can fail in two different modes...
1. Permits extra air to be drawn into carb , making engine run lean and
hot
2. Permits raw fuel to be drawn into carb, loading engine with carbon
They said that they had seen both types of primer pump failure in the past.
Of course the enrichment (choke) piston can fail too, and I am the poster
child for that particular malfunction...
Regards,
Beauford
FF#076
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com>
>
> Kolbers, another thing I forgot to mention about using a primer pump is
> that it cannot over richen the mixture by shooting extra fuel into the
> carb. . Should the pump fail or leak, nothing happens. > Ralph, Original
> Firestar, 18 years flying it
> > inMaineEllery
> donotarchive
>
>
> nbsp;
>
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
Beauford and others,
I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due to a faulty
primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the primer nipple in the
carb. Now compare that with the size of the air cleaner. The primer on mine
is fed into a nipple on the side of the intake manifold, so if there was a leaking
problem, it would be more severe than one fed into the carburetor body. By
the way, always cable tie the fuel line around the nipple (I'm using cable ties
now instead of those plastic rachet clamps. They work so much better with
no leaking).
The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty enrichner can
(you found that one out). I don't know why the Rotax mechanics would say this
(below). This might even explain why some guys have such good luck with their
Rotax's and others don't. I have not used the choke (enrichner) in years and
have not had a carbon problem. I did have the usual carbon problem that everyone
else has when I used the choke for starting it.
Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and reliability. I
prefer it this way.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
-- \"Beauford\" wrote:
Ralph...
Thought you would want to know...What you said in your post (see below)
contradicts what the Rotax mechs told me...
They said the primer pump can fail in two different modes...
1. Permits extra air to be drawn into carb , making engine run lean and
hot
2. Permits raw fuel to be drawn into carb, loading engine with carbon
They said that they had seen both types of primer pump failure in the past.
Of course the enrichment (choke) piston can fail too, and I am the poster
child for that particular malfunction...
Regards,
Beauford
FF#076
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ralph"
>
> Kolbers, another thing I forgot to mention about using a primer pump is
> that it cannot over richen the mixture by shooting extra fuel into the
> carb. . Should the pump fail or leak, nothing happens. > Ralph, Original
> Firestar, 18 years flying it
> > inMaineEllery
> donotarchive
>
>
> nbsp;
>
> >
>
>
Beauford and others,
I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due to a faulty
primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the primer nipple in the
carb. Now compare that with the size of the air cleaner. The primer on mine
is fed into a nipple on the side of the intake manifold, so if there was a leaking
problem, it would be more severe than one fed into the carburetor body. By
the way, always cable tie the fuel line around the nipple (I'm using cable ties
now instead of those plasticrachet clamps. They work so much better with no
leaking).
The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty enrichner can
(you found that one out). I don't know why the Rotax mechanics would say this
(below). This might even explain why some guys have such good luck with their
Rotax's and others don't. I have not used the choke (enrichner)in years and have
not had a carbon problem. I did have the usual carbon problem that everyone
else has when I used the choke for starting it.
Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and reliability. I
prefer it this way.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
--\"Beauford\"wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Beauford"
Ralph...
Thoughtyouwouldwanttoknow...Whatyousaidinyourpost(seebelow)
contradictswhattheRotaxmechstoldme...
Theysaidtheprimerpumpcanfailintwodifferentmodes...
1.Permitsextraairtobedrawnintocarb,makingenginerunleanand
hot
2.Permitsrawfueltobedrawnintocarb,loadingenginewithcarbon
Theysaidthattheyhadseenbothtypesofprimerpump
;failureinthepast.
Ofcoursetheenrichment(choke)pistoncanfailtoo,andIamtheposter
childforthatparticularmalfunction...
Regards,
Beauford
FF#076
-----OriginalMessage-----
From:"Ralph"
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Ralph"
Kolbers,anotherthingIforgottomentionaboutusingaprimerpumpis
thatitcannotoverrichenthemixturebyshootingextrafuelintothe
carb..Shouldthepumpfailorleak,nothinghappens.Ralph,Original
Firestar,18yearsflyingit
inMaineEllery
donotarchive
nbsp;
sp;
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Pike <richard(at)bcchapel.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
Several years ago one of our locals had a defective primer. It tended to
creep out from the closed position and would then allow fuel to be go
through the primer nipple and into the engine. This engine had been a real
pain to figure out, seemed like it was always jetted wrong. Removed the
primer and capped the nipple, problem solved. Don't remember if his primer
was upstream or downstream of the fuel pump, (I think upstream, been too
long ago...) but that could certainly have been a factor as well.
Moral of the story:
Enrichners can fail
Primers can fail.
Anything can (and probably eventually will) fail.
Primers do not leak fuel into the carb,
- but -
Faulty primers will allow fuel to be sucked into the engine.
If you have a fuel pump between the tank and the faulty primer,
then a faulty primer turns the primer nipple into an aux main jet.
Protect yourself at all times...
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>
>Beauford and others,
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due to a
>faulty primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the primer
>nipple in the carb. Now compare that with the size of the air cleaner. The
>primer on mine is fed into a nipple on the side of the intake manifold, so
>if there was a leaking problem, it would be more severe than one fed into
>the carburetor body. By the way, always cable tie the fuel line around the
>nipple (I'm using cable ties now instead of those plastic rachet clamps.
>They work so much better with no leaking).
>The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty
>enrichner can (you found that one out). I don't know why the Rotax
>mechanics would say this (below). This might even explain why some guys
>have such good luck with their Rotax's and others don't. I have not used
>the choke (enrichner) in years and have not had a carbon problem. I did
>have the usual carbon problem that everyone else has when I used the choke
>for starting it.
>Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and
>reliability. I prefer it this way.
>Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
>
>
>-- \"Beauford\" wrote:
>
>Ralph...
>Thought you would want to know...What you said in your post (see below)
>contradicts what the Rotax mechs told me...
>
>They said the primer pump can fail in two different modes...
> 1. Permits extra air to be drawn into carb , making engine run lean and
>hot
> 2. Permits raw fuel to be drawn into carb, loading engine with carbon
>
>They said that they had seen both types of primer pump failure in the past.
>
>Of course the enrichment (choke) piston can fail too, and I am the poster
>child for that particular malfunction...
>
>Regards,
>Beauford
>FF#076
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Ralph"
>
>
> >
> > Kolbers, another thing I forgot to mention about using a primer pump is
> > that it cannot over richen the mixture by shooting extra fuel into the
> > carb. . Should the pump fail or leak, nothing happens. > Ralph, Original
> > Firestar, 18 years flying it
> > > inMaineEllery
> > donotarchive
> >
> >
> > nbsp;
> >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>Beauford and others,
>
>
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due to a
>faulty primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the primer
>nipple in the carb. Now compare that with the size of the air cleaner. The
>primer on mine is fed into a nipple on the side of the intake manifold, so
>if there was a leaking problem, it would be more severe than one fed into
>the carburetor body. By the way, always cable tie the fuel line around the
>nipple (I'm using cable ties now instead of those plasticrachet clamps.
>They work so much better with no leaking).
>
>
>The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty
>enrichner can (you found that one out). I don't know why the Rotax
>mechanics would say this (below). This might even explain why some guys
>have such good luck with their Rotax's and others don't. I have not used
>the choke (enrichner)in years and have not had a carbon problem. I did
>have the usual carbon problem that everyone else has when I used the choke
>for starting it.
>
>
>Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and
>reliability. I prefer it this way.
>
>
>Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
>
>
>--\"Beauford\"wrote:
>--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Beauford"
>
>Ralph...
>Thoughtyouwouldwanttoknow...Whatyousaidinyourpost(seebelow)
>contradictswhattheRotaxmechstoldme...
>
>Theysaidtheprimerpumpcanfailintwodifferentmodes...
>1.Permitsextraairtobedrawnintocarb,makingenginerunleanand
>hot
>2.Permitsrawfueltobedrawnintocarb,loadingenginewithcarbon
>
>Theysaidthattheyhadseenbothtypesofprimerpump
> ;failureinthepast.
>
>Ofcoursetheenrichment(choke)pistoncanfailtoo,andIamtheposter
>childforthatparticularmalfunction...
>
>Regards,
>Beauford
>FF#076
>
>
>-----OriginalMessage-----
>From:"Ralph"
>
>
>--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Ralph"
>
>Kolbers,anotherthingIforgottomentionaboutusingaprimerpumpis
>thatitcannotoverrichenthemixturebyshootingextrafuelintothe
>carb..Shouldthepumpfailorleak,nothinghappens.Ralph,Original
>
> Firestar,18yearsflyingit
>inMaineEllery
>donotarchive
>
>
>nbsp;
>
>
> sp;
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
Richard,
Do you remember if the tank on this plane was about the same level or higher than
the carburetor (gravity fed, similar to the Quicksilvers)?
Ralph
-- Richard Pike wrote:
Several years ago one of our locals had a defective primer. It tended to
creep out from the closed position and would then allow fuel to be go
through the primer nipple and into the engine. This engine had been a real
pain to figure out, seemed like it was always jetted wrong. Removed the
primer and capped the nipple, problem solved. Don't remember if his primer
was upstream or downstream of the fuel pump, (I think upstream, been too
long ago...) but that could certainly have been a factor as well.
Moral of the story:
Enrichners can fail
Primers can fail.
Anything can (and probably eventually will) fail.
Primers do not leak fuel into the carb,
- but -
Faulty primers will allow fuel to be sucked into the engine.
If you have a fuel pump between the tank and the faulty primer,
then a faulty primer turns the primer nipple into an aux main jet.
Protect yourself at all times...
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>
>Beauford and others,
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due to a
>faulty primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the primer
>nipple in the carb. Now compare that with the size of the air cleaner. The
>primer on mine is fed into a nipple on the side of the intake manifold, so
>if there was a leaking problem, it would be more severe than one fed into
>the carburetor body. By the way, always cable tie the fuel line around the
>nipple (I'm using cable ties now instead of those plastic rachet clamps.
>They work so much better with no leaking).
>The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty
>enrichner can (you found that one out). I don't know why the Rotax
>mechanics would say this (below). This might even explain why some guys
>have such good luck with their Rotax's and others don't. I have not used
>the choke (enrichner) in years and have not had a carbon problem. I did
>have the usual carbon problem that everyone else has when I used the choke
>for starting it.
>Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and
>reliability. I prefer it this way.
>Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
>
>
>-- \"Beauford\" wrote:
>
>Ralph...
>Thought you would want to know...What you said in your post (see below)
>contradicts what the Rotax mechs told me...
>
>They said the primer pump can fail in two different modes...
> 1. Permits extra air to be drawn into carb , making engine run lean and
>hot
> 2. Permits raw fuel to be drawn into carb, loading engine with carbon
>
>They said that they had seen both types of primer pump failure in the past.
>
>Of course the enrichment (choke) piston can fail too, and I am the poster
>child for that particular malfunction...
>
>Regards,
>Beauford
>FF#076
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Ralph"
>
>
> >
> > Kolbers, another thing I forgot to mention about using a primer pump is
> > that it cannot over richen the mixture by shooting extra fuel into the
> > carb. . Should the pump fail or leak, nothing happens. > Ralph, Original
> > Firestar, 18 years flying it
> > > inMaineEllery
> > donotarchive
> >
> >
> > nbsp;
> >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>Beauford and others,
>
>
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due to a
>faulty primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the primer
>nipple in the carb. Now compare that with the size of the air cleaner. The
>primer on mine is fed into a nipple on the side of the intake manifold, so
>if there was a leaking problem, it would be more severe than one fed into
>the carburetor body. By the way, always cable tie the fuel line around the
>nipple (I'm using cable ties now instead of those plasticrachet clamps.
>They work so much better with no leaking).
>
>
>The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty
>enrichner can (you found that one out). I don't know why the Rotax
>mechanics would say this (below). This might even explain why some guys
>have such good luck with their Rotax's and others don't. I have not used
>the choke (enrichner)in years and have not had a carbon problem. I did
>have the usual carbon problem that everyone else has when I used the choke
>for starting it.
>
>
>Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and
>reliability. I prefer it this way.
>
>
>Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
>
>
>--\"Beauford\"wrote:
>--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Beauford"
>
>Ralph...
>Thoughtyouwouldwanttoknow...Whatyousaidinyourpost(seebelow)
>contradictswhattheRotaxmechstoldme...
>
>Theysaidtheprimerpumpcanfailintwodifferentmodes...
>1.Permitsextraairtobedrawnintocarb,makingenginerunleanand
>hot
>2.Permitsrawfueltobedrawnintocarb,loadingenginewithcarbon
>
>Theysaidthattheyhadseenbothtypesofprimerpump
> ;failureinthepast.
>
>Ofcoursetheenrichment(choke)pistoncanfailtoo,andIamtheposter
>childforthatparticularmalfunction...
>
>Regards,
>Beauford
>FF#076
>
>
>-----OriginalMessage-----
>From:"Ralph"
>
>
>--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Ralph"
>
>Kolbers,anotherthingIforgottomentionaboutusingaprimerpumpis
>thatitcannotoverrichenthemixturebyshootingextrafuelintothe
>carb..Shouldthepumpfailorleak,nothinghappens.Ralph,Original
>
> Firestar,18yearsflyingit
>inMaineEllery
>donotarchive
>
>
>nbsp;
>
>
> sp;
>
>
Richard,
Do you remember if the tank on this plane was about the same level or higher than
the carburetor (gravity fed, similar to the Quicksilvers)?
Ralph
--RichardPikewrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:RichardPike
Severalyearsagooneofourlocalshadadefectiveprimer.Ittendedto
creepoutfromtheclosedpositionandwouldthenallowfueltobego
throughtheprimernippleandintotheengine.Thisenginehadbeenareal
paintofigureout,seemedlikeitwasalwaysjettedwrong.Removedthe
primerandcappedthenipple,problemsolved.Don'trememberifhisprimer
wasupstreamordownstreamofthefuel&nb
sp;pump,(Ithinkupstream,beentoo
longago...)butthatcouldcertainlyhavebeenafactoraswell.
Moralofthestory:
Enrichnerscanfail
Primerscanfail.
Anythingcan(andprobablyeventuallywill)fail.
Primersdonotleakfuelintothecarb,
-but-
Faultyprimerswillallowfueltobesuckedintotheengine.
Ifyouhaveafuelpumpbetweenthetankandthefaultyprimer,
thenafaultyprimerturnstheprimernippleintoanauxmainjet.
Protectyourselfatalltimes...
RichardPike
MKIIIN420P(420ldPoops)
At03:4
8PM8/18/05+0000,youwrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Ralph"
Beaufordandothers,
Isawthispost.Theamountofairthatisleakedintothecarb,duetoa
faultyprimer,doesnotamounttomuch.Lookatthesizeoftheprimer
nippleinthecarb.Nowcomparethatwiththesizeoftheaircleaner.The
primeronmineisfedintoanippleonthesideoftheintakemanifold,so
iftherewasaleakingproblem,itwouldbemoreseverethanonefed
into
thecarburetorbody.Bytheway,alwayscabletiethefuellinearoundthe
nipple(I'musingcabletiesnowinsteadofthoseplasticrachetclamps.
Theyworksomuchbetterwithnoleaking).
Theprimerdoesnotleakrawfuelintothecarb,whereasafaulty
enrichnercan(youfoundthatoneout).Idon'tknowwhytheRotax
mechanicswouldsaythis(below).Thismightevenexplainwhysomeguys
havesuchgoodluckwiththeirRotax'sandothersdon't.Ihavenotused
thechoke(e
nrichner)inyearsandhavenothadacarbonproblem.Idid
havetheusualcarbonproblemthateveryoneelsehaswhenIusedthechoke
forstartingit.
Lesscarbonbuildup,ina2-stroke,meanslongerenginelifeand
reliability.Ipreferitthisway.
Ralph,OriginalFirestar,18yearsflyingit
--\"Beauford\"wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Beauford"
Ralph...
Thoughtyouwouldwanttoknow...Whatyousaidinyourpost(seebelow)
contradictswhattheRotaxmechstoldme...
They
saidtheprimerpumpcanfailintwodifferentmodes...
1.Permitsextraairtobedrawnintocarb,makingenginerunleanand
hot
2.Permitsrawfueltobedrawnintocarb,loadingenginewithcarbon
Theysaidthattheyhadseenbothtypesofprimerpumpfailureinthepast.
Ofcoursetheenrichment(choke)pistoncanfailtoo,andIamtheposter
childforthatparticularmalfunction...
Regards,
Beauford
FF#076
-----OriginalMessage-----
From:"Ra
lph"
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Ralph"
Kolbers,anotherthingIforgottomentionaboutusingaprimerpumpis
thatitcannotoverrichenthemixturebyshootingextrafuelintothe
carb..Shouldthepumpfailorleak,nothinghappens.Ralph,Original
Firestar,18yearsflyingit
inMaineEllery
donotarchive
nbsp;
Beaufordandothers,
Isaw&
nbsp;thispost.Theamountofairthatisleakedintothecarb,duetoa
faultyprimer,doesnotamounttomuch.Lookatthesizeoftheprimer
nippleinthecarb.Nowcomparethatwiththesizeoftheaircleaner.The
primeronmineisfedintoanippleonthesideoftheintakemanifold,so
iftherewasaleakingproblem,itwouldbemoreseverethanonefedinto
thecarburetorbody.Bytheway,alwayscabletiethefuellinearoundthe
nipple(I'musingcableties
;nowinsteadofthoseplasticrachetclamps.
Theyworksomuchbetterwithnoleaking).
Theprimerdoesnotleakrawfuelintothecarb,whereasafaulty
enrichnercan(youfoundthatoneout).Idon'tknowwhytheRotax
mechanicswouldsaythis(below).Thismightevenexplainwhysomeguys
havesuchgoodluckwiththeirRotax'sandothersdon't.Ihavenotused
thechoke(enrichner)inyearsandhavenothadacarbonproblem.Idid
havetheusualcarbonproblemthateveryoneelsehas
whenIusedthechoke
forstartingit.
Lesscarbonbuildup,ina2-stroke,meanslongerenginelifeand
reliability.Ipreferitthisway.
Ralph,OriginalFirestar,18yearsflyingit
--\"Beauford\"wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Beauford"
Ralph...
Thoughtyouwouldwanttoknow...Whatyousaidinyourpost(seebelow)
contradictswhattheRotaxmechstoldme...
Theysaidtheprimerpumpcanfailintwodifferentmodes...
1.Permitsextraairtobedrawnintocarb,makingenginerunleanand
hot
2.Permitsrawfueltobedrawnintocarb,loadingenginewithcarbon
Theysaidthattheyhadseenbothtypesofprimerpump
;failureinthepast.
&
gt;
Ofcoursetheenrichment(choke)pistoncanfailtoo,andIamtheposter
childforthatparticularmalfunction...
Regards,
Beauford
FF#076
-----OriginalMessage-----
From:"Ralph"
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Ralph"
Kolbers,anotherthingIforgottomentionaboutusingaprimerpumpis
thatitcannotoverrichenthemixturebyshootingextrafuelintothe
carb..Shouldthepumpfailorleak,nothinghappens.Ralph,Original
Firestar,18yearsflyingit
inMaineEllery
donotarchive
nbsp;
sp;
ortobrowse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DAquaNut(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
In a message dated 8/18/2005 1:52:01 P.M. Central Standard Time,
richard(at)bcchapel.org writes:
>Faulty primers will allow fuel to be sucked into the engine.
>If you have a fuel pump between the tank and the faulty primer,
>then a faulty primer turns the primer nipple into an aux main jet.
>Protect yourself at all times...
Richard,
Have you looked at Jack Harts home- made primer it has a tiny petcock
valve where it is turned off and no fuel can enter until it is turned on again.
Maybe a similar valve could be put on Rotax's primer.
Ed
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ron <CaptainRon1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Kolb 1986 Twinstar w Rotax 503 |
For me that would be the clincher. If they are going to take the old
one off my hands for 750 smackers towards a new one I'd do it in a
heart beat.
=========================================
And to put a little more urgency to the question Rotax is offering a $750
trade in of older engines on a new 503 til the end of this month.
The new engine would be nice with dual ignition and oil injection but it
will always be a 2 cycle..
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ron <CaptainRon1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pre Mix made easy |
MMO is easier on you, she only got's to sniff it.
We got WD40 here too, but we use that on hinges.
=====================================
Pat
If you want to know how to use it as a contraceptive. The girl hold the tin
firmly between her knees.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Kolb 1986 Twinstar w Rotax 503 |
In a message dated 8/18/2005 10:31:25 PM Eastern Standard Time,
CaptainRon1(at)cox.net writes:
And to put a little more urgency to the question Rotax is offering a $750
trade in of older engines on a new 503 til the end of this month.
The new engine would be nice with dual ignition and oil injection but it
will always be a 2 cycle..
When I heard of this a couple weeks ago, I thought they were taking only
Hirth & 2si engines on trade- not Rotaxes. Am I wrong?
Howard Shackleford
FS II
SC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
At 11:48 AM 8/18/2005, you wrote:
>
>Beauford and others,
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due
>to a faulty primer, does not amount to much.
Try taking off the capped nipple on the carb and see what happens.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
At 09:06 AM 8/18/2005, you wrote:
>
>Ralph...
>Thought you would want to know...What you said in your post (see below)
>contradicts what the Rotax mechs told me...
>
>They said the primer pump can fail in two different modes...
> 1. Permits extra air to be drawn into carb , making engine run lean and
>hot
> 2. Permits raw fuel to be drawn into carb, loading engine with carbon
>
>They said that they had seen both types of primer pump failure in the past.
>
>Of course the enrichment (choke) piston can fail too, and I am the poster
>child for that particular malfunction...
>
>Regards,
>Beauford
That part (enrichment choke piston) is a "One piece" cylinder with a
"rubber bottom".......I can't believe that it
is defective very often. It either works or it doesn't - "Except for
yours, Beauford" . Both mine still look the same after 650 hrs.
I've got two of them so I guess that would equate to 1300 hours using
the recent thread of the 2 engines vs. 1 engine theory.
I rebuilt both my carburetors about 14 months ago and replaced
"everything" that was indicated in the rebuild.
There was nothing said about the enrichment (choke) piston. The
springs that push it down or shut off the
fuel are very strong. I don't think that would be a problem unless
your cables wouldn't let it seat.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
OK ... me and Ralph been flyin these things for a while ... since
1983 for both of us ...I guess.
BTW I like talking to somebody that's been watching these things
evolve from bicycles with wings.
I've never had a primer, Ralph's never used the "coke" that comes
with the engine.
Both of us have had unbelievable success in starting our respective
engines on the first pull.
Hell ....I'll bet we could blow on the prop real hard and it would
start, right Ralph??
Belive it or not---I can "hand prop" my 503 DC using the method
discussed before.
And I'm sure Ralph can do the same -
Now .....you "yearlings" ( that would be those of you that have been
flying for a year or so and
ain't dead yet) have to keep in mind that neither of us have had
experience in "both" areas.
So nobody is dead wrong on anything. BOTH OF US are probably right
on. That can happen.
That's what's good about this list, if you don't let it get into the
"I'm right and your wrong" debate.
Just good clean fun - most of the time.
-------------------------
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due
>to a faulty primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the
>primer nipple in the carb. Now compare that with the size of the air
>cleaner. The primer on mine is fed into a nipple on the side of the
>intake manifold, so if there was a leaking problem, it would be more
>severe than one fed into the carburetor body. By the way, always
>cable tie the fuel line around the nipple (I'm using cable ties now
>instead of those plastic rachet clamps. They work so much better
>with no leaking).
>The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty
>enrichner can -snip- I have not used the choke (enrichner) in years
>and have not had a carbon problem. I did have the usual carbon
>problem that everyone else has when I used the choke for starting it.
>Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and
>reliability. I prefer it this way.
>Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
----------------------------------------------------
Try taking off the capped nipple on the carb and see what happens.
-----------------------------------------------------
That part (enrichment choke piston) is a "One piece" cylinder with a
"rubber bottom".......I can't believe that it
is defective very often. It either works or it doesn't - "Except for
yours, Beauford" . Both mine still look the same after 650 hrs.
I've got two of them so I guess that would equate to 1300 hours using
the recent thread of the 2 engines vs. 1 engine theory.
I rebuilt both my carburetors about 14 months ago and replaced
"everything" that was indicated in the rebuild.
There was nothing said about the enrichment (choke) piston. The
springs that push it down or shut off the
fuel are very strong. I don't think that would be a problem unless
your cables wouldn't let it seat.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Denny Rowe" <rowedl(at)highstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Kolb 1986 Twinstar w Rotax 503 |
>
> When I heard of this a couple weeks ago, I thought they were taking only
> Hirth & 2si engines on trade- not Rotaxes. Am I wrong?
>
> Howard Shackleford
> FS II
> SC
>
Yeah Howard, they are also taking older Rotax aircraft engines.
The serial number has to be for an aircraft engine and I also think you need
to include certain accessories.
Check their websight for details.
Denny Rowe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston - spring |
Brother Possum...
IMHO, the line you sent below contains the smoking Rotax....The spring
pushing down on that piston is strong indeed...
I think it is the very strength of that spring, pressing that rubber insert
down against the metal valve seat which causes the rubber to retreat up into
the body of the piston over time...four years in my case. The famous
2-cycle vibration probably compounds the impact of the seat as it deforms
the rubber...
It all adds up to a "must inspect" item for me at least annually, and
possibly even more frequently than that.
I intend to have two canaries in this little coal mine... a change in plug
color or deposits, and an unexplained increase in fuel burn over time. As I
think back, both birds died, but 'ol Beauford just kept diggin' coal.
Beauford
FF #076
----- Original Message -----
>
> At 09:06 AM 8/18/2005, you wrote:>>
There was nothing said about the enrichment (choke) piston. The
> springs that push it down or shut off the
> fuel are very strong. I don't think that would be a problem unless
> your cables wouldn't let it seat.
> >
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Nagy <dcnagy(at)gmail.com> |
To quote from August 2005 EAA Sport Pilot Magazine, "US service centers are
now offering a limited time trade in program for all qualified Rotax,Hirth
and 2SI engines with gearboxes. Qualifying engines can be traded for new
Rotax 503 or 582 engines with either B ,C or E gearboxes." Offer ends Aug
31,2005.
I called LEAF at 1 262 763 4087 and they would sell the 503 DCDI with B
box(w/o Electric start) for around $3500 with the trade in.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
I agree with 'ol Possum, whatever works for you is the way to go. My first winter
fly'in this thing took 35 pulls on the starter rope to get it going. After
setting it up on the frozen lake and not able to get the thing started was when
I decide to get the primer pump. Then I realized that rubber choke washer could
cause problems opening and closing on every flight, or inadvertently leaving
it open a little, so I didn't miss having the choke.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
-- possums wrote:
OK ... me and Ralph been flyin these things for a while ... since
1983 for both of us ...I guess.
BTW I like talking to somebody that's been watching these things
evolve from bicycles with wings.
I've never had a primer, Ralph's never used the "coke" that comes
with the engine.
Both of us have had unbelievable success in starting our respective
engines on the first pull.
Hell ....I'll bet we could blow on the prop real hard and it would
start, right Ralph??
Belive it or not---I can "hand prop" my 503 DC using the method
discussed before.
And I'm sure Ralph can do the same -
Now .....you "yearlings" ( that would be those of you that have been
flying for a year or so and
ain't dead yet) have to keep in mind that neither of us have had
experience in "both" areas.
So nobody is dead wrong on anything. BOTH OF US are probably right
on. That can happen.
That's what's good about this list, if you don't let it get into the
"I'm right and your wrong" debate.
Just good clean fun - most of the time.
-------------------------
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due
>to a faulty primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the
>primer nipple in the carb. Now compare that with the size of the air
>cleaner. The primer on mine is fed into a nipple on the side of the
>intake manifold, so if there was a leaking problem, it would be more
>severe than one fed into the carburetor body. By the way, always
>cable tie the fuel line around the nipple (I'm using cable ties now
>instead of those plastic rachet clamps. They work so much better
>with no leaking).
>The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty
>enrichner can -snip- I have not used the choke (enrichner) in years
>and have not had a carbon problem. I did have the usual carbon
>problem that everyone else has when I used the choke for starting it.
>Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and
>reliability. I prefer it this way.
>Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
----------------------------------------------------
Try taking off the capped nipple on the carb and see what happens.
-----------------------------------------------------
That part (enrichment choke piston) is a "One piece" cylinder with a
"rubber bottom".......I can't believe that it
is defective very often. It either works or it doesn't - "Except for
yours, Beauford" . Both mine still look the same after 650 hrs.
I've got two of them so I guess that would equate to 1300 hours using
the recent thread of the 2 engines vs. 1 engine theory.
I rebuilt both my carburetors about 14 months ago and replaced
"everything" that was indicated in the rebuild.
There was nothing said about the enrichment (choke) piston. The
springs that push it down or shut off the
fuel are very strong. I don't think that would be a problem unless
your cables wouldn't let it seat.
I agree with 'ol Possum, whatever works for you is the way to go. My first winter
fly'in this thing took 35 pulls on the starter rope to get it going. After
setting it up on the frozen lake and not able to get the thing startedwas when
I decide to get the primer pump. Then I realized that rubber choke washer could
cause problems opening and closing on every flight, or inadvertently leaving
it open a little, so I didn't misshavingthe choke.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
--possumswrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:possums
OK...meandRalphbeenflyinthesethingsforawhile...since
1983forbothofus...Iguess.
BTWIliketalkingtosomebodythat'sbeenwatchingthesethings
evolvefrombicycleswithwings.
I'veneverhadaprimer,Ralph'sneverusedthe"coke"thatcomes
withtheengine.
Bothofushavehadunbelievablesuccessinstartingourrespective
enginesonthefirstpull.
Hell....I'llbetwe
;couldblowontheproprealhardanditwould
start,rightRalph??
Beliveitornot---Ican"handprop"my503DCusingthemethod
discussedbefore.
AndI'msureRalphcandothesame-
Now.....you"yearlings"(thatwouldbethoseofyouthathavebeen
flyingforayearorsoand
ain'tdeadyet)havetokeepinmindthatneitherofushavehad
experiencein"both"areas.
Sonobodyisdeadwrongonanything.BOTHOFUSareprobablyright
on.Thatcanhappen.
That'swhat'sgoodaboutthis&
nbsp;list,ifyoudon'tletitgetintothe
"I'mrightandyourwrong"debate.
Justgoodcleanfun-mostofthetime.
-------------------------
Isawthispost.Theamountofairthatisleakedintothecarb,due
toafaultyprimer,doesnotamounttomuch.Lookatthesizeofthe
primernippleinthecarb.Nowcomparethatwiththesizeoftheair
cleaner.Theprimeronmineisfedintoanippleonthesideofthe
intakemanifold,soiftherewasaleakingproblem,itwould&
nbsp;bemore
severethanonefedintothecarburetorbody.Bytheway,always
cabletiethefuellinearoundthenipple(I'musingcabletiesnow
insteadofthoseplasticrachetclamps.Theyworksomuchbetter
withnoleaking).
Theprimerdoesnotleakrawfuelintothecarb,whereasafaulty
enrichnercan-snip-Ihavenotusedthechoke(enrichner)inyears
andhavenothadacarbonproblem.Ididhavetheusualcarbon
problemthateveryoneelsehaswhenIusedthechokefor&nbs
p;startingit.
Lesscarbonbuildup,ina2-stroke,meanslongerenginelifeand
reliability.Ipreferitthisway.
Ralph,OriginalFirestar,18yearsflyingit
----------------------------------------------------
Trytakingoffthecappednippleonthecarbandseewhathappens.
-----------------------------------------------------
Thatpart(enrichmentchokepiston)isa"Onepiece"cylinderwitha
"rubberbottom".......Ican'tbelievethatit
isdefectiveveryoften.Iteitherworksoritdoesn't-"Exceptfor
yours,Beauford".Bothminestilllookthesameaft
er650hrs.
I'vegottwoofthemsoIguessthatwouldequateto1300hoursusing
therecentthreadofthe2enginesvs.1enginetheory.
Irebuiltbothmycarburetorsabout14monthsagoandreplaced
"everything"thatwasindicatedintherebuild.
Therewasnothingsaidabouttheenrichment(choke)piston.The
springsthatpushitdownorshutoffthe
fuelareverystrong.Idon'tthinkthatwouldbeaproblemunless
yourcableswouldn'tletitseat.
nbsp;-TheKolb-ListEmailForum-
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James Tripp" <jtripp(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Ultralight Flying Magazine |
I have approximately 100 issues of Ultralight Flying that I need to get rid
of but I really don't want to throw them in the trash. They're a great
resource for anyone who is new to ultralight flying or looking to get into
the sport and want to learn as much as possible before taking the plunge.
I'll give them anyone who is willing to come get them or willing to pay the
UPS charges to ship them.
James Tripp, FSII
Millbrook AL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PENGUIN <pengy(at)humboldt.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Ultralight Flying Magazine |
I'll gladly pay ups for those babies...
Penguin
10 hours in a Mark III and counting...
UPS Shipping Address:
Gerald Myers
801 Elk Ridge Road
Redway CA 95560-0138
707.923.3353
James Tripp wrote:
>
>I have approximately 100 issues of Ultralight Flying that I need to get rid
>of but I really don't want to throw them in the trash. They're a great
>resource for anyone who is new to ultralight flying or looking to get into
>the sport and want to learn as much as possible before taking the plunge.
>I'll give them anyone who is willing to come get them or willing to pay the
>UPS charges to ship them.
>
>
>James Tripp, FSII
>
>Millbrook AL
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Ellery Batchelder Jr ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Ellery Batchelder Jr
Lists: Kolb-List,Ultralight-List
Subject: End Results of Rebuild
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/ElleryWeld@aol.com.08.20.2005/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Josh Lazar" <josh(at)filterco.qc.ca> |
| Subject: | looking for a Mark lll XTRA |
Dear Kolb Group,
Just joined this group, I don't own an ultralight yet but I am in the
process of finding one. The Mark lll XTRA is what I have in mind. Do any
of you know if there is a Kolb dealer in Canada, specifically in Montreal or
Toronto or that general vicinity.
Your help would be greatly appriciated.
Josh Lazar
Montreal, Canada
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Noel Bouchard <noelbou(at)cam.org> |
Hello Josh,
My name is Noel Bouchard, and i also live in Mtl ...
As far as i know ... there is no Kolb dealer in Canada ...
(But i may be missing something ...)
I am the proud owner of a Kolb MK II (Twinstar) since 1999.
Now ~ 320 hours on it ... and i love it !
You made the right choice in choosing Kolb ...
Feel free to contact me at (514) 723-6663
(or by email) if you want ...
Nol
Dear Kolb Group,
Just joined this group, I don't own an ultralight yet but I am in the
process of finding one. The Mark lll XTRA is what I have in mind. Do any
of you know if there is a Kolb dealer in Canada, specifically in Montreal
or
Toronto or that general vicinity.
Your help would be greatly appriciated.
Josh Lazar
Montreal, Canada
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cat36Fly(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Gap Seal & BRS |
Need a bit of help from some of you MKlll X builders on two issues.
1. Which BRS unit are you using on the Xtra and does BRS supply the proper
mounting hardware?
2.The fiberglass fairing on the wing gap seal is giving me fits (probably a
mental block). It appears that it will not fit over the windshield if I trim
it enough to fit the contour of the wing LE and sit on the top windshield
bow. I do not have the wind shield in yet and am trying to get the fit close for
now and do the final fit after engine and electronic's testing (radio's,
etc.) after which I will install the lexan. Does it help or hinder to install
some velcro to push the gap seal out from the LE a bit?
How to handle any other sticky issues on these last few weeks would be
appreciated. Have Gap Seal, Nose Bowl,& windshield as last remaining large items.
Thanks in advance
Larry Tasker
N615RT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Gap Seal & BRS |
The fiberglass fairing on the wing gap seal is giving me fits>>
Hi there,
`fits` in this case is not the word to use. Mine didn`t fit any where, about
like my army boots, in fact I was convinced that it was for another aircraft
entirely.
Glad someone else is finding it odd. I thought I was the only one
Good luck
Pat
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Mason <masonclan(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Gap Seal & BRS |
--- Cat36Fly(at)aol.com wrote:
I had to do some modification on the nose cone and the gap seal as
well, I had to open up the bottom of the nose cone so I could slip it
over the front of the cage to make it sit straight, also added some
sheet metal to the bttom end part of the gap seal and than attached
the end fairing to that.
Robert Mason
MK111 X 582
>
> Need a bit of help from some of you MKlll X builders on two issues.
>
> 1. Which BRS unit are you using on the Xtra and does BRS supply the
> proper
> mounting hardware?
>
> 2.The fiberglass fairing on the wing gap seal is giving me fits
> (probably a
> mental block). It appears that it will not fit over the windshield if
> I trim
> it enough to fit the contour of the wing LE and sit on the top
> windshield
> bow. I do not have the wind shield in yet and am trying to get the
> fit close for
> now and do the final fit after engine and electronic's testing
> (radio's,
> etc.) after which I will install the lexan. Does it help or hinder to
> install
> some velcro to push the gap seal out from the LE a bit?
>
> How to handle any other sticky issues on these last few weeks would
> be
> appreciated. Have Gap Seal, Nose Bowl,& windshield as last remaining
> large items.
>
> Thanks in advance
> Larry Tasker
> N615RT
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Ballenger" <ulpilot(at)cavtel.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Gap Seal & BRS |
Larry
I had to build up my fiberglass fairing at each side where it starts to turn
in at the side. I laid about 1 1/2 " of glass cloth on the inside and
sanded the outside down so the thickness was about 1/8 ".
Good luck
Jim Ballenger
Selling a FS KXP 447
Flying a MK III X 582
DO NO ARCHIVE
----- Original Message -----
From: <Cat36Fly(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Wing Gap Seal & BRS
>
> Need a bit of help from some of you MKlll X builders on two issues.
>
> 1. Which BRS unit are you using on the Xtra and does BRS supply the proper
> mounting hardware?
>
> 2.The fiberglass fairing on the wing gap seal is giving me fits (probably
> a
> mental block). It appears that it will not fit over the windshield if I
> trim
> it enough to fit the contour of the wing LE and sit on the top windshield
> bow. I do not have the wind shield in yet and am trying to get the fit
> close for
> now and do the final fit after engine and electronic's testing (radio's,
> etc.) after which I will install the lexan. Does it help or hinder to
> install
> some velcro to push the gap seal out from the LE a bit?
>
> How to handle any other sticky issues on these last few weeks would be
> appreciated. Have Gap Seal, Nose Bowl,& windshield as last remaining large
> items.
>
> Thanks in advance
> Larry Tasker
> N615RT
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitty <benny_bee_01(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Ultrastar inspection |
0.29 FROM_HAS_ULINE_NUMS From": contains.an.underline.and.numbers/letters(at)roxy.matronics.com
Hello Fellow aviators.
I believe i found me a Kolb bird.Its an ultrastar.
I would like to know what to look for when i am
inspecting the plane i e connectors,cables,tears in
material...Is there any special things i need to make
sure to check??Please any ideas and recomendations are
welcome.
Thanks alot!
Mitty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "woody" <duesouth(at)govital.net> |
| Subject: | Re: looking for a Mark lll XTRA |
I can sell you a Twinstar with a Hirth 2703 engine which has been mostly
trouble free or a Mk 3 kit with a 582. I am 200 miles south of Toronto near
Windsor. I was the first Kolb dealer ever but have not sold any for 20
years. It sounded like a good idea at the time and Kolb wanted a Canadian
source for their kits but that fizzled and I do not believe Kolb now has any
dealers. I have maintained an interest in Kolbs, owned 3, helped build an
additional 3 have one waiting to be built and a Kit 2 to do something with
in the future.and there are 4 Kolbs currently based at my airstrip.You will
not go wrong with a Kolb kit. Go by the plans and keep personal
modifications to a minimum and you will be fine. Do not give a moments worry
about it being a tail dragger.
>
> Dear Kolb Group,
> Just joined this group, I don't own an ultralight yet but I am in the
> process of finding one. The Mark lll XTRA is what I have in mind. Do any
> of you know if there is a Kolb dealer in Canada, specifically in Montreal
or
> Toronto or that general vicinity.
>
> Your help would be greatly appriciated.
>
> Josh Lazar
> Montreal, Canada
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jerb <ulflyer(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Lockwood's Diagnosis |
We had a Pennzoil corp rep at a safety seminar a couple years, he brought
up the same thing warning not to use automotive fuel line with two-cycle
premix that the mixture causes the fuel line to delaminate. He stated
marine fuel line intended for two stroke premix use was OK for use.
jerb
>
>In a message dated 8/12/2005 9:15:10 PM Eastern Standard Time,
>beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com writes:
>
> > Got a warning about black automotive fuel lines... don't use them with
> > pre-mix. They are fine for straight gas,
> > but swell up and delaminate internally when exposed to oil in the gas.
> >
> >
>
>Hi Beauford, I have been running the auto fuel lines for a few months with
>not problem but I see their point. Marine brand black fuel lines are used
>with
>premix all the time for years. I wonder how they differ from auto type if at
>all.
>
>Steve
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Josh Lazar" <josh(at)filterco.qc.ca> |
| Subject: | looking for a Mark lll XTRA |
Hi Woody,
Thanks for your advise and encouragement. With your experience, I could
no-doubt learn a great deal from you.
The Mk 3 kit with the 582 sounds right for me. What are you asking for it.
I could possibly take a drive to meet you and take a look at the kit.
Josh Lazar
Future owner of a Mk 3
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of woody
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: looking for a Mark lll XTRA
I can sell you a Twinstar with a Hirth 2703 engine which has been mostly
trouble free or a Mk 3 kit with a 582. I am 200 miles south of Toronto near
Windsor. I was the first Kolb dealer ever but have not sold any for 20
years. It sounded like a good idea at the time and Kolb wanted a Canadian
source for their kits but that fizzled and I do not believe Kolb now has any
dealers. I have maintained an interest in Kolbs, owned 3, helped build an
additional 3 have one waiting to be built and a Kit 2 to do something with
in the future.and there are 4 Kolbs currently based at my airstrip.You will
not go wrong with a Kolb kit. Go by the plans and keep personal
modifications to a minimum and you will be fine. Do not give a moments worry
about it being a tail dragger.
>
> Dear Kolb Group,
> Just joined this group, I don't own an ultralight yet but I am in the
> process of finding one. The Mark lll XTRA is what I have in mind. Do any
> of you know if there is a Kolb dealer in Canada, specifically in Montreal
or
> Toronto or that general vicinity.
>
> Your help would be greatly appriciated.
>
> Josh Lazar
> Montreal, Canada
--
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Space Shuttle Piggyback |
Wish I'd happened to be up in the Kolb>>
Hi Dominic,
what a thrill. Piggy back planes are not an everyday site. Planes seen from
another plane are really special.
I was in my Challenger one evening at about 1500 feet when a Spitfire
cruised across my nose at the same height on its way to a local show. One of
the most beautiful sights I shall ever see.
Talking piggy backs, when I was a kid I saw the Maia and Mercury
combination. Maia was a flying boat and she took off with the Mercury which
was a seaplane in a cradle above the wing. The Mercury was then able to then
start flying on to its desination with full fuel tanks. Designed primarily
as transatlantic mail carrier I think. In- flight refuelling was way in the
future in those days.
Cheers
Pat
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "woody" <duesouth(at)govital.net> |
| Subject: | Re: looking for a Mark lll XTRA |
HI Josh
I will have to check the prices because I had not even thought of selling
the kit untill a spur of the moment thing last night. It will probably be in
the range of a new kit from the factory but in canadian funds converting the
money at par. $100 US = 100 Can. In other words more than 1/3 less than a
new factory kit and no import fees.
> Hi Woody,
> Thanks for your advise and encouragement. With your experience, I could
> no-doubt learn a great deal from you.
> The Mk 3 kit with the 582 sounds right for me. What are you asking for it.
> I could possibly take a drive to meet you and take a look at the kit.
>
>
> Josh Lazar
> Future owner of a Mk 3
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Josh Lazar" <josh(at)filterco.qc.ca> |
| Subject: | looking for a Mark lll XTRA |
Hi Woody,
Sounds good. Has this kit been started or is still in original
packaging? Let me know if you decide to sell.
Best Regards,
Josh Lazar
Cell: 514-233-3251
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of woody
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: looking for a Mark lll XTRA
HI Josh
I will have to check the prices because I had not even thought of
selling
the kit untill a spur of the moment thing last night. It will probably
be in
the range of a new kit from the factory but in canadian funds converting
the
money at par. $100 US = 100 Can. In other words more than 1/3 less than
a
new factory kit and no import fees.
> Hi Woody,
> Thanks for your advise and encouragement. With your experience, I
could
> no-doubt learn a great deal from you.
> The Mk 3 kit with the 582 sounds right for me. What are you asking for
it.
> I could possibly take a drive to meet you and take a look at the kit.
>
>
> Josh Lazar
> Future owner of a Mk 3
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Williamson" <kolbrapilot2(at)comcast.net> |
>>>Are we still able to get the new website....
>>>Wayne McCullough
Nope. It's all offline.
John Williamson
Arlington, TX
Kolb Kolbra, Rotax 912ULS, 913 hours
kolbrapilot(at)comcast.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Williamson" <kolbrapilot2(at)comcast.net> |
Herb,
Try this:
South Mississippi Light Aircraft
1279 Marshall Smith Rd.
Lucedale, MS 39452
800-247-7652
601-947-4953
John Williamson
Arlington, TX
Kolb Kolbra, Rotax 912ULS, 913 hours
kolbrapilot2(at)comcast.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene D. Ledbetter" <gdledbetter(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Firefly Flat Tire |
To All,
Since I moved my Firefly to Owensville, KY last year, it's been
fairly normal to fly back to Waynesville where I used to have a
hangar and meet with friends there. A couple of weeks ago, I flew
there first and then over to Middletown, OH where you can park less
than a block from a Frisch's restaurant for lunch.
Middletown has both paved and separate sod runways.
After landing on the sod runway which had rather tall grass, it
became obvious that I had developed a flat tire on the left gear.
Since I had replaced the original tires with Turf Saver tractor tires
less than two years ago, I was able to taxi about a quarter mile and
parked for lunch.
Doing lunch gave an opportunity to debate what to do with the flat
tire situation.
Since I had been able to taxi a fairly long distance with the flat
tire, I decided to let the air out of the other tire and use the
paved runway for takeoff. That solution worked perfectly. I flew
directly home and landed without incident.
I ordered two new tubes from Lockwood and was surprised to find that
the flat was caused by a complete failure of one of the tube joints
on my Taiwan manufactured tube. The joint opened up for almost 3
inches.
The lesson here is to not be surprised if you have an unexpected flat
tire with Taiwan originated tires and tubes since you might remember
that I replaced the original tires and tubes almost two years ago
when the right tire had a blowout and split both the tube and tire!!.
Does anyone have suggestions where I might find suitable tubes with
the right angle valve stem for our little airplanes since I really
don't trust the Taiwan manufactured product after two failures within
two years.
By the way Beauford, my major problem this summer has been EGTs that
are too cool. With the pin in the lowest possible position, I've
been running below 1000 most of the time and as low as 900 in real
hot and muggy weather. The clip is also in the correct position.
The good news is we are finally having cooler weather and I will fly
to Waynesville tomorrow plus a visit to Middletown for lunch. If
weather forecast is good, I might even fly to the homecoming in
September. It's only 150 miles from my base according to my GPS....
I have completed 305 hours on the 447 and it is running so well that
I really hate to do anything with it. What are the thoughts of 447
maintenance at 300 hours?
Gene Ledbetter
Cincinnati, OH
Firefly, 447, 305 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)juno.com> |
Todd
Tony is now on line. tw172(at)netscape.com
Herb
writes:
>
>
> Send him my way.
>
> Thanks, Todd
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cat36Fly(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Gap Seal & BRS |
Thanks to all who responded to my delima.
Today I attacked the fairing with a Dremel tool and a mind set that it would
fit or I would destroy it (bad attitude). After much marking and cutting,
marking and grinding and more of the same, it is close. I may have to do some
fibre glass work after the windscreen ( for our English friends) is installed
but it's a start. Next the nose bowl ( I'm all aquiver with anticipation).
The response I did not get from anyone is the style BRS being used on the
MKlllX. Anyone?
Also, has any other Kolb builder/owner from Delaware ever shown up on this
site? We are a small state but there ought to at least one other.
Thanks again
Larry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LEE CREECH" <dcreech3(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel Tank Connection |
Can anyone offer any tips on making the connection at the bottom of 5-gallon
plastic fuel tanks? I've got the tanks, rubber grommets and metal fittings,
but was a bit surprised to see that it all appears to be just a press fit --
no real provision for tightening or securing it. Is there any trick to
getting a secure and leak-proof connection? Any experience-based tips will
be appreciated.
Thanks,
Lee
(Firestar II)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Connection |
Lee, that's all there is to it. Try not to have any burrs in the hole and if there
are, clean them off before pushing in the rubber grommet. Don't make the hole
any larger. Mine hasn't leaked in 18 years and I just replaced the tank after
all this time.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
-- \"LEE CREECH\" wrote:
Can anyone offer any tips on making the connection at the bottom of 5-gallon
plastic fuel tanks? I've got the tanks, rubber grommets and metal fittings,
but was a bit surprised to see that it all appears to be just a press fit --
no real provision for tightening or securing it. Is there any trick to
getting a secure and leak-proof connection? Any experience-based tips will
be appreciated.
Thanks,
Lee
(Firestar II)
Lee, that's all there is to it. Try not to have any burrs in the hole and if there
are, clean them off before pushing in the rubber grommet. Don't make the hole
any larger.Minehasn'tleaked in18 years and I just replaced the tank after
all this time.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
--\"LEECREECH\"wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"LEECREECH"
Cananyoneofferanytipsonmakingtheconnectionatthebottomof5-gallon
plasticfueltanks?I'vegotthetanks,rubbergrommetsandmetalfittings,
butwasabitsurprisedtoseethatitallappearstobejustapressfit--
norealprovisionfortighteningorsecuringit.Isthereanytrickto
gettingasecureandleak-proofconnection?Anyexperience-basedtipswill
b
eappreciated.
Thanks,
Lee
(FirestarII)
_
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Swiderski" <rswiderski(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Fuel Tank Connection |
Lee,
You could install from top & use a drop tube for a pickup as per
other Kolb installs.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ralph
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fuel Tank Connection
Lee, that's all there is to it. Try not to have any burrs in the hole and if
there are, clean them off before pushing in the rubber grommet. Don't make
the hole any larger. Mine hasn't leaked in 18 years and I just replaced the
tank after all this time.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
-- \"LEE CREECH\" wrote:
Can anyone offer any tips on making the connection at the bottom of 5-gallon
plastic fuel tanks? I've got the tanks, rubber grommets and metal fittings,
but was a bit surprised to see that it all appears to be just a press fit --
no real provision for tightening or securing it. Is there any trick to
getting a secure and leak-proof connection? Any experience-based tips will
be appreciated.
Thanks,
Lee
(Firestar II)
Lee, that's all there is to it. Try not to have any burrs in the hole and if
there are, clean them off before pushing in the rubber grommet. Don't make
the hole any larger.Minehasn'tleaked in18 years and I just replaced the tank
after all this time.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
--\"LEECREECH\"wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"LEECREECH"
Cananyoneofferanytipsonmakingtheconnectionatthebottomof5-gallon
plasticfueltanks?I'vegotthetanks,rubbergrommetsandmetalfittings,
butwasabitsurprisedtoseethatitallappearstobejustapressfit--
norealprovisionfortighteningorsecuringit.Isthereanytrickto
gettingasecureandleak-proofconnection?Anyexperience-basedtipswill
b
eappreciated.
Thanks,
Lee
(FirestarII)
_
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George E. Myers Jr." <gmyers(at)corridor.net> |
| Subject: | Synthetic Oil Plug Color on 503 |
Could some of you guys using synthetic oil tell me what your normal
plug color is.
Thanks
George
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Denny Rowe" <rowedl(at)highstream.net> |
| Subject: | A new Kolber is born. |
Kolb group,
I want to welcome Mike Schnabel also, known as "Tenn Metfan" to the world of Kolb
ownership.
Mike is the new owner of Jesse and Mary Lib Saxions Firestar II and trailer.
He is a real Gentleman and I am glad to see Jesse's bird going to a good guy like
Mike.
I spent the day with Mike and Mary Lib today helping to prepare the plane and trailer
for the long trip back to TN and hopefully Mike is well on his way by now.
He plans to spend the winter going over the bird and also has to complete his hanger
and home before he is ready to commit aviation, it sounds like Mike has
a real nice new place nearly ready for him and his new aircraft.
Thanks to everyone who expressed interest in the aircraft and trailer and here
is hoping you all find the Kolb you are seeking, they really are fantastic aircraft.
Denny Rowe
Mk-3 N616DR, 2SI 690L-70, Leechburg PA
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Connection |
In a message dated 8/22/2005 8:32:18 PM Eastern Standard Time,
dcreech3(at)hotmail.com writes:
Can anyone offer any tips on making the connection at the bottom of 5-gallon
plastic fuel tanks? I've got the tanks, rubber grommets and metal fittings,
but was a bit surprised to see that it all appears to be just a press fit --
no real provision for tightening or securing it. Is there any trick to
getting a secure and leak-proof connection? Any experience-based tips will
be appreciated.
Thanks,
Lee
(Firestar II]
I don't like the idea of having holes in the bottom of my gas tanks, so I
just drilled a hole in the top of both tanks just a little smaller than the OD
of
my fuel line & stuck it down to the bottom of the tank[s].
I made a "clunk" [like used on RC planes] out of a brass 1/4" barb & some
small brass pipe with a bunch of small holes drilled in it. It will filter out
all but the smallest chunks of debris & the holes in the clunk are above the
bottom of thre tank by 1/4" or so, therefore, will not pick up any water from
the bottom of the tank. The clunk actually rests on the bottom of the tank &
can move about to allow for when I'm climbing or descending.
Howard Shackleford
FS II
SC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James, Ken" <KDJames(at)berkscareer.com> |
| Subject: | Wing Gap Seal & BRS |
Go to the BRS site they have the proper sizing for the Extra and the
attachment drawings as a pdf.
Ken
-----Original Message-----
From: Cat36Fly(at)aol.com [mailto:Cat36Fly(at)aol.com]
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Wing Gap Seal & BRS
Thanks to all who responded to my delima.
Today I attacked the fairing with a Dremel tool and a mind set that it
would
fit or I would destroy it (bad attitude). After much marking and cutting,
marking and grinding and more of the same, it is close. I may have to do
some
fibre glass work after the windscreen ( for our English friends) is
installed
but it's a start. Next the nose bowl ( I'm all aquiver with anticipation).
The response I did not get from anyone is the style BRS being used on the
MKlllX. Anyone?
Also, has any other Kolb builder/owner from Delaware ever shown up on this
site? We are a small state but there ought to at least one other.
Thanks again
Larry
IMPORTANT/CONFIDENTIAL: This communication is intended solely for the use of the
individual or entity to which it is addressed. This e-mail contains information
from the Berks Career & Technology Center that may be privileged, confidential,
and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this communication
is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination,
distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.
If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately
and permanently delete this message including all attachments.
Thank you.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Synthetic Oil Plug Color on 503 |
George, I use Klotz synthetic 50:1 mix. The color of my spark plugs (the middle
post) are a light tan and it is lighter with less carbon than one using mineral
oil like Pennzoil. I change them annually and when I take them out, they look
good enough to go another year. The rim of the plug is black and this is normal
no matter what type of oil is used.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
-- \"George E. Myers Jr.\" wrote:
Could some of you guys using synthetic oil tell me what your normal
plug color is.
Thanks
George
--
George, I use Klotz synthetic 50:1 mix. The color ofmy spark plugs(the middle post)are
a light tan and itis lighter with less carbonthan one using mineral oil
like Pennzoil. I change them annually and when I take them out, they look good
enough to go another year. The rim of the plug is black and this is normal
no matter what type of oil is used.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
--\"GeorgeE.MyersJr.\"wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"GeorgeE.MyersJr."
Couldsomeofyouguysusingsyntheticoiltellmewhatyournormal
plugcoloris.
Thanks
George
--
hmore:
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BMWBikeCrz(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Kolb-List Dare to dream :-) |
What if money were No Object ...
Slingshot With Titanium frame
Gas turbine engine
Unbreakable low drag Gear ...
Oh well got to get a roof on the hanger and find a good Tig welder in north
Florida and buy some Dual in Kolb ... (anyone near Lake City or Tampa ?)
...Dave
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LEE CREECH" <dcreech3(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Connection |
Putting it in the top seems like such an obvious improvement that there must
be some reason it was originally (on my airplane) done the other way. Could
it be that it doesn't allow the two tanks to crossfeed, so that you can't be
sure of getting all the fuel out of both? Or something else I've not
thought of?
Thanks,
Lee in Ky
>From: HShack(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fuel Tank Connection
>Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:28:39 EDT
>
>
>In a message dated 8/22/2005 8:32:18 PM Eastern Standard Time,
>dcreech3(at)hotmail.com writes:
>Can anyone offer any tips on making the connection at the bottom of
>5-gallon
>plastic fuel tanks? I've got the tanks, rubber grommets and metal
>fittings,
>but was a bit surprised to see that it all appears to be just a press fit
>--
>no real provision for tightening or securing it. Is there any trick to
>getting a secure and leak-proof connection? Any experience-based tips will
>be appreciated.
>
>Thanks,
>Lee
>(Firestar II]
>
>
>I don't like the idea of having holes in the bottom of my gas tanks, so I
>just drilled a hole in the top of both tanks just a little smaller than the
>OD of
>my fuel line & stuck it down to the bottom of the tank[s].
>
>I made a "clunk" [like used on RC planes] out of a brass 1/4" barb & some
>small brass pipe with a bunch of small holes drilled in it. It will filter
>out
>all but the smallest chunks of debris & the holes in the clunk are above
>the
>bottom of thre tank by 1/4" or so, therefore, will not pick up any water
>from
>the bottom of the tank. The clunk actually rests on the bottom of the tank
>&
>can move about to allow for when I'm climbing or descending.
>
>
>Howard Shackleford
>FS II
>SC
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Connection |
In a message dated 8/23/2005 9:25:17 PM Eastern Standard Time,
dcreech3(at)hotmail.com writes:
Putting it in the top seems like such an obvious improvement that there must
be some reason it was originally (on my airplane) done the other way. Could
it be that it doesn't allow the two tanks to crossfeed, so that you can't be
sure of getting all the fuel out of both? Or something else I've not
thought of?
Thanks,
Lee in Ky
There is no downside. They still cross-feed. They won't leak out of the
bottom.
Over 500 hours this way- no problems.
Howard Shackleford
FS II
SC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Connection |
Could
it be that it doesn't allow the two tanks to crossfeed, >>
Hi,
Oh yes it does. Just connect the two tanks together taking care to block the
breather hole which may be integral in one of the tanks. In effect you are
crating one tank. One inlet and one outlet.
One of our ingenious listers has it in the archive somewhere. A very neat
set up.
I wouldn`t have any holes in my tanks anywhere but at the top. Asking for
trouble in the long run.
Pat
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Edward Steuber" <esteuber(at)rochester.rr.com> |
All,
Well , I finally had the Cuyuna quit and had to land in a corn field......
damage to the nose and a few cage tubes but nothing to the boom tube , wings
or tail. Removing the parts without damaging them or the corn further was the
challenge....I'll add the details later ....need to go to work !
Ed in
Western NY
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dama" <dama(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Ultrastar down |
Good job on keeping your cool, Ed. Hope the farmer's last name is not
"McNasty"...
Kip
http://www.springeraviation.net/
----- Original Message -----
From: "Edward Steuber" <esteuber(at)rochester.rr.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: Ultrastar down
>
> All,
> Well , I finally had the Cuyuna quit and had to land in a corn
field...... damage to the nose and a few cage tubes but nothing to the boom
tube , wings or tail. Removing the parts without damaging them or the corn
further was the challenge....I'll add the details later ....need to go to
work !
>
Ed in Western NY
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DCulver701(at)aol.com |
Hi Paul, work looks good! How many hours you got into your Kolbra now?
From the pictures it doesn't look like you had the powder coating done? Hope
to see some more pictures soon. Best regards, Dave Culver
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "c b" <seedeebee(at)hotmail.com> |
Hey Fellow Kolbers,
So I got my Mark III Amphibian flying only to break the spreader bar
on landing... The system was not strong enough for landing loads on
the gear.
It's now about ready to go on land gear.
I had to send the floats back to Full-Lotus to be repaired. Of course
when they got the floats, they told me to throw them away and start
over... (ouch) So the brand new floats should be here next week (yay!)
Anyway, one thing I noticed while flying is that the intercom makes so
much noise in the headsets that you can't hear anything. It's almost
better to leave the headsets behind.
The noise seems to be electronic. It is certainly coming from the
headsets and it increases in volume when the engine speed increases.
Does anyone have a solution? It's just a cheap intercom, but I didn't
really want to buy a new one if I didn't need to.
If I do need a new one, what do you folks recomend?
Thanks!
Chris Banys
Mark III Amphibian - 912
N10FR
________________________________________________________________________________
FROM_LOCAL_NOVOWEL(at)roxy.matronics.com, From:,
localpart(at)roxy.matronics.com, has(at)roxy.matronics.com,
series(at)roxy.matronics.com, of(at)roxy.matronics.com,
non-vowel(at)roxy.matronics.com, letters(at)roxy.matronics.com
the 13th annual fly-in at cherry grove airpark in wanamingo mn. will be this
sunday aug.28th.
you are all invited.
The runway is 1,200 feet long, lots of planes, cars and oddities will be on
hand.
Also there is a chuckwagon for your fine dinning pleasure.
the link to our websight is
_www.theflyin.com_ (http://www.theflyin.com)
mark hansen
twinstar
s.e.minnesota
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "kfackler" <kfackler(at)ameritech.net> |
| Subject: | Michigan Thumb Tour, September 17 |
My flying club, the Greater Thumb Ultralight Flyers (GTUF), is organizing one of
our semi-annual Michigan Thumb Tours for Saturday, September 17. While the beautiful
fall colors of Michigan likely won't quite be at their peak, there should
still be plenty of great scenery to enjoy.
We'll rendezvous and start the tour at Arnold Field near Croswell MI, then circumnavigate
the Michigan Thumb counter-clockwise, following the coastline northward
with several stops for fuel and one for a pizza lunch. The tour turns inland
at Sebewaing and pilots will depart the tour for their respective home bases
from either there or the last planned stop at Marlette.
You do NOT need to be a member to join us. While there are many aircraft types
that will be accompanying the tour, we will have between four and six Kolbs flown
by our members. Any of you here on the list who would be interested in joining
us would be welcome, you don't need to be a member of the club. However,
to be part of the flight there is a small fee to cover the lunch and expenses
of a volunteer ground crew's who will follow the flight with a recovery vehicle,
a gas truck, safety equipment, cold drinks, and so forth.
If interested, please check out the club's website for more information or to register
for the trip. The URL for the website is:
http://www.staliteaviation.com/gtuf/gtuf_menu.html
-Ken Fackler
Kolb Mark II / A722KWF
Rochester MI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Flycrazy8(at)aol.com |
the 13th annual fly-in at cherry grove airpark in wanamingo mn. will be
this
sunday aug.28th.
you are all invited.
Thanks for the invite
but tooo far and snakey for me : - ))
Stephen
Lower Alabama
Firefly
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Edward Steuber" <esteuber(at)rochester.rr.com> |
All,
Well , the problem with the Cuyuna is not certain untill I take the fan belt
cylinder apart, but the spark plug is wet and I am guessing the Wiseco piston
has carboned up again....I knew there was a problem with the Wiseco narrow
rings because I had just , 35 hours ago, cleaned the ring gaps on both pistons
and assumed I could get to the end of the flying season with the Wiseco pistons...
The Cuyuna parts guy had sent me a new standard set of Cuyuna pistons and
rings and had warned me that I may have more problems with the Wiseco's if
I left them in ...My CHT on this cylinder had been around 340 since the last decarbon
but yesterday it had been around 300...... There was no warning including
the gauges( had just scanned them 10 seconds before) when it went to idle
over a large woods with cross country power lines on the edge. I had just enough
glide to make the corn field and went under the lines and stalled in the corn
on the other side.....close , real close...
Damage to the Ultrastar is limited to a couple steel tubes ,some fabric
work and aluminum tubes in the nose...and a bent left gear leg (Firestar) and
a broken axle to gear leg fitting....One small hole from a punture in the left
outboard wing. It is not a lot of work but I am going to use this as an opportunity
to make some changes ...like a full canopy as the Sling shot has and more
fuel.....n numbers ?
The best description of what it was like is if you took a small motorcycle
at 35 mph and drove it into a 8 foot corn field.....you don't get very far
! ........Kinda dark in there, too !
The farmer turned out to be a brother of one of my regular customers and
understanding....said when they chopped the corn that he would let me know if
I owed him anything....you meet the nicest people at airplane accidents !
Corn Harvester Ed in Western
NY
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wayne F.Wilson" <wfwilson1(at)yahoo.ca> |
Hi Everyone
I thought everyone would like to know Woody had an
engine out on takeoff Tueday night at about 200 feet
with trees straight ahead. He crashed and broke is
leg. When I visited him in the hospital yesterday he
is in GREAT spirits. Sitting up in a chair and has
already been walking with a walker. He had metal put
into is leg and expects a full recovery. He hopes to
be out of the hospital next week. He tells me how
lucky he was. Unfortunately his bird did make out so
well and has major damage.
When Woody is out he will give you the direct scoop.
Regards
Wayne F Wilson
Find your next car at http://autos.yahoo.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bryan green <lgreen1(at)sc.rr.com> |
Thanks Wayne my best to Woody.
Bryan Green Elgin SC
Wayne F.Wilson wrote:
>
>Hi Everyone
>I thought everyone would like to know Woody had an
>engine out on takeoff Tueday night at about 200 feet
>with trees straight ahead. He crashed and broke is
>leg. When I visited him in the hospital yesterday he
>is in GREAT spirits. Sitting up in a chair and has
>already been walking with a walker. He had metal put
>into is leg and expects a full recovery. He hopes to
>be out of the hospital next week. He tells me how
>lucky he was. Unfortunately his bird did make out so
>well and has major damage.
>When Woody is out he will give you the direct scoop.
>Regards
>Wayne F Wilson
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Find your next car at http://autos.yahoo.ca
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
Woody had an
engine out on takeoff Tueday night at about 200 feet>>
Condolences and best wishes Woody. Glad you got away with it, (nearly)
Cheers
Pat.
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
I'm glad to hear that Woody is ok.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
-- "Wayne F.Wilson" wrote:
Hi Everyone
I thought everyone would like to know Woody had an
engine out on takeoff Tueday night at about 200 feet
with trees straight ahead. He crashed and broke is
leg. When I visited him in the hospital yesterday he
is in GREAT spirits. Sitting up in a chair and has
already been walking with a walker. He had metal put
into is leg and expects a full recovery. He hopes to
be out of the hospital next week. He tells me how
lucky he was. Unfortunately his bird did make out so
well and has major damage.
When Woody is out he will give you the direct scoop.
Regards
Wayne F Wilson
Find your next car at http://autos.yahoo.ca
I'm glad to hear that Woody is ok.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
--"WayneF.Wilson"wfwilson1(at)yahoo.cawrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"WayneF.Wilson"wfwilson1(at)yahoo.ca
HiEveryone
IthoughteveryonewouldliketoknowWoodyhadan
engineoutontakeoffTuedaynightatabout200feet
withtreesstraightahead.Hecrashedandbrokeis
leg.WhenIvisitedhiminthehospitalyesterdayhe
isinGREATspirits.Sittingupinachairandhas
alreadybeenwalkingwithawalker.Hehadmetalput
intoislegandexpectsafullrecovery.Hehopes&nbs
p;to
beoutofthehospitalnextweek.Hetellsmehow
luckyhewas.Unfortunatelyhisbirddidmakeoutso
wellandhasmajordamage.
WhenWoodyisouthewillgiveyouthedirectscoop.
Regards
WayneFWilson
Findyournextcarathttp://autos.yahoo.ca
se
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Terry Frantz <tkrolfe(at)usadatanet.net> |
Wayne F.Wilson wrote:
>
>Hi Everyone
>I thought everyone would like to know Woody had an
>engine out on takeoff Tueday night at about 200 feet
>
>
Glad to hear that Woody made it with relatively little damage to
himself. Hope he has a speedy recovery!!! That is definitely the
scariest time of any flight for me, knowing you don't have much time to
do anything about an engine out. Looking forward to his account of what
happened so that I can learn from it and thankful he will be able to do so!
Terry - FireFly #95
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Edward Steuber" <esteuber(at)rochester.rr.com> |
Glad to hear he's OK...
My escapade with the cornfield Cuyuna engine out has been solved... Piston wrist
pin bearing began making metal and got the PTO piston and rings....I had the
pistons out for a decarbon about 35 hours ago ....I never took the cageless
bearing apart to look at it when I had it out.....Dumb ! Could have saved me
a lot of grief....Looks like I may need a new crank because of the contamination
which is very little....The problem is the middle crank and main rod bearing
that can not be changed...don't know if they got any metal but don't want to
gamble...any of you Cuyuna experts got any advice ? I don't know the availability
of a new crank but I understand that all the 2SI parts are interchangeable
with the UL202 except ignition parts. ....I think a new crank and bearings
are what is needed....I have the OEM pistons already so the Wiseco's are trash
anyway....I will call Roger at ZDE (Cuyuna parts ) in Indiana in the morning....
gotta go back to work welding a couple new tubes into the
Ultrastar right now....
Ed in Western NY
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "jdmurr(at)juno.com" <jdmurr(at)juno.com> |
I had an engine out Saturday at 500 feet AGL. It was my fault thought. I was
moving around in my seat and hit both mag switches with my knee. It got real quiet.
Luckily I had a choice of about 5 different places to land and it was a
happy ending.
John Murr - Firestar
-- Terry Frantz wrote:
Wayne F.Wilson wrote:
>
>Hi Everyone
>I thought everyone would like to know Woody had an
>engine out on takeoff Tueday night at about 200 feet
>
>
Glad to hear that Woody made it with relatively little damage to
himself. Hope he has a speedy recovery!!! That is definitely the
scariest time of any flight for me, knowing you don't have much time to
do anything about an engine out. Looking forward to his account of what
happened so that I can learn from it and thankful he will be able to do so!
Terry - FireFly #95
>
>
>
>
>
I had an engine out Saturday at 500 feet AGL. It was my fault thought. I was moving
around in my seat and hit both mag switches with my knee. It got real quiet.
Luckily I had a choice of about 5 different places to land and it was a happy
ending.
John Murr - Firestar
--TerryFrantztkrolfe(at)usadatanet.netwrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:TerryFrantztkrolfe(at)usadatanet.net
WayneF.Wilsonwrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"WayneF.Wilson"wfwilson1(at)yahoo.ca
HiEveryone
IthoughteveryonewouldliketoknowWoodyhadan
engineoutontakeoffTuedaynightatabout200feet
GladtohearthatWoodymadeitwithrelativelylittledamageto
himself.Hopehehasaspeedyrecovery!!!Thatisdefinitelythe
scariesttimeofanyflightforme,knowi
ngyoudon'thavemuchtimeto
doanythingaboutanengineout.Lookingforwardtohisaccountofwhat
happenedsothatIcanlearnfromitandthankfulhewillbeabletodoso!
Terry-FireFly#95
;7-DayBrowse,Chat,FAQ,
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Kulp" <undoctor(at)rcn.com> |
Hello fellow Kolbers,
I began rebuilding my Ultrastar a few years ago and had to put it on hold for priority
reasons. In the interim, the fellow where I hangered my US died and I
had to move my plane home, and left a box of parts, including the engine mounting
hardware.
Would one of you US owners be so kind as to list the parts and sequence from the
engine mount bolts through the modified "A" on the airframe and into the inverted
Cayuna 430 engine? Or a close-up shot emailed would do wonders.
I'm back to reassembling my US and I'd really like to get that part right before
I'm too far from earth.
Thanks,
Dave Kulp
Bethlehem, PA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle) |
| Subject: | Anyone Know The Story Behind This Crash? |
Hi Listers,
Does anyone know the story behind this aircraft and the crash? Almost
looks like an RC model especially given the cameraman's rather
unemotional comment following the crash. Kind of looks like the
elevator may have been hooked up backwards following a rebuild.
http://media4.big-boys.com/content/oldplanecrash.wmv
Any information on this video would be intersting.
Matt
--
Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 8/29/2005 8:47:25 AM Eastern Standard Time,
jdmurr(at)juno.com writes:
I had an engine out Saturday at 500 feet AGL. It was my fault thought. I
was moving around in my seat and hit both mag switches with my knee. It got real
quiet. Luckily I had a choice of about 5 different places to land and it was
a happy ending.
John Murr - Firestar
cover your switches with upside down paint can covers.....I had the same
problem years ago
George Randolph
firestar driver from The Villages, fla
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DCulver701(at)aol.com |
Hi George, wondering where you keep your plane living at the Villages? I
have a winter home in Grand Island, ( Sunlake Estates) about 20 minutes from
you, and am trying to get all my ducks in a row for keeping a plane down there.
Safe flying, Dave Culver
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DCulver701(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Mk111 questions? |
What are the differences in handling between a plane with flaperons and the
classic,s flaps? Also does anyone have an opinion on the 912 engine offered
with fuel injection versus the twin carbs? I've seen it advertised as older
military 912 engines rebuilt at a certified Rotax repair service. Their $10 k
asking price isn't that far away from a new one, but curious anyway. Also
wondering about the seat cushions offered in the brochure, they don't look to
comfortable, or well made from the picture, but pictures can be deceiving. Tia,
best regards. Dave Culver
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | DHC-4 Crash in Canada |
1.25 IP_LINK_PLUS URI: Dotted-decimal IP address followed by
CGI
ASN Accident description 27 AUG 1992 de Havilland Canada DHC-4T Caribou N400NCMatt:
First test flight after an engine conversion...
Home =BB Database
Accident description
Date: 27 AUG 1992
Time: 10:20
Type: de Havilland Canada DHC-4T Caribou
Operator: NewCal Aviation
Registration: N400NC
Msn / C/n: 240
Year built: 1965
Crew: 3 fatalities / 3 on board
Passengers: 0 fatalities / 0 on board
Total: 3 fatalities / 3 on board
Airplane damage: Written off
Location: Gimli, MB (Canada)
Phase: Initial climb (ICL)
Nature: Test
Departure airport: Gimli Airport, MB (YGM)
Destination airport: Gimli Airport, MB (YGM)
Narrative:
The aircraft took off for a test flight for a turbine-engine conversion
programme. It climbed steeply, rolled to the right and crashed in a nose-down,
rightwing-low attitude.
Source: (also check out sources used for every accident)
Scramble 160 + Flight International 9-15.9.1992 (p.35) + ICAO Adrep
Summary 6/94 (#79)
[legend] [disclaimer]
copyright =A9 1996-2005 Aviation Safety Network
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beauford" <beauford(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | DHC-4 Crash Question |
Matt and Kolbers:
Tried to forward a page on this, but doubt it will work on Kolb List...
The Caribou in the crash video was N400NC, a test aircraft for a turbine engine
converstion program. Belonged to New Cal aviation in New Jersey, and had previously
been number 204 in the Kenyan Air Force. This was the second Caribou this
New Cal outfit lost... They ditched another one in the Atlantic in 1984 after
the pilot became lost and ran it out of gas.
The video clip accident happened on an engine test flight at Gimli, MB, (Canada)
August, 92. The P&W R-2000's had been replaced with Pratt PT-6 variants... All
3 aboard perished. Never did learn if they determined the cause.
Beauford
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Connection |
| I wouldn`t have any holes in my tanks anywhere but at the top.
Asking for
| trouble in the long run.
|
| Pat
Hi Pat/All:
Respectfully disagree with the above.
I prefer to plumb my fuel supply from the bottom of the tank. Notably
the lowest point. This insures all moisture and other crap is dumped
into the gascolator to keep it out of the rest of the fuel system.
Plumbing from the top is a normal marine procedure, based on the
normal low mounting position of fuel tanks in boats.
I am not saying plumbing from top is wrong, but I have had excellent
success pulling fuel out the bottom of the tanks and this is the way I
prefer to do it. Old Kolb used to pull from the bottom of plastic
tanks using a very good fitting and neoprene gasket that was a push
fit. We never had problems with this system, i.e., leaks.
This also eliminates leaving fuel in the tanks because of unequal draw
from top mounted systems. Sometimes a couple cups full of fuel could
make the difference from making it to the airstrip or not.
Thinking outloud in Greenwood, IN. Be home to hauck's holler to see
what's left in a couple days.
john h
MKIII and 912ULS with lots of hours on each.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Anyone Know The Story Behind This Crash? |
Hi Matt/All,
This is from airliners.net:
http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/2297994/
From the comments (some obviously uninformed), it looks like the
mechanic(s) left an elevator control lock in place. One of the worst videos
I've seen, for sure.
Ed in JXN
MkII/503
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: Anyone Know The Story Behind This Crash?
>
>
> Hi Listers,
>
> Does anyone know the story behind this aircraft and the crash? Almost
> looks like an RC model especially given the cameraman's rather
> unemotional comment following the crash. Kind of looks like the
> elevator may have been hooked up backwards following a rebuild.
>
> http://media4.big-boys.com/content/oldplanecrash.wmv
>
> Any information on this video would be intersting.
>
> Matt
>
>
> --
>
>
> Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
> 925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
> http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ray anderson <rsanoa(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Anyone Know The Story Behind This Crash? |
In 1943 I saw a C54 taking off towing two troop gliders do precisely the same manuever
and crash, burn ( the gliders had cut loose and peeled off) because they
left the elevator gust locks in place. Not a pretty sight up close.
Hi Matt/All,
This is from airliners.net:
http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/2297994/
From the comments (some obviously uninformed), it looks like the
mechanic(s) left an elevator control lock in place. One of the worst videos
I've seen, for sure.
Ed in JXN
MkII/503
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Dralle"
Subject: Kolb-List: Anyone Know The Story Behind This Crash?
>
>
> Hi Listers,
>
> Does anyone know the story behind this aircraft and the crash? Almost
> looks like an RC model especially given the cameraman's rather
> unemotional comment following the crash. Kind of looks like the
> elevator may have been hooked up backwards following a rebuild.
>
> http://media4.big-boys.com/content/oldplanecrash.wmv
>
> Any information on this video would be intersting.
>
> Matt
>
>
> --
>
>
> Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
> 925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
> http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
>
>
>
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kirby Dennis Contr MDA/AL <Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil> |
| Subject: | Reverse Rotation - Rotax-912 |
Fellow 912 Kolb Owners -
At our local airport, I heard a fellow light aircraft owner declare that
rotating the prop on a 912 engine in the reverse direction will RUIN THE
ENGINE. Is this true? (These guys are referred to as "sidewalk
mechanics.")
The 912 Operator's Manual advises not to turn the engine in the reverse
direction, and also states that the engine may be rotated in the reverse
direction up to one full rotation, max. But no dire warning of destroying
your engine if you exceed this.
Is this topic addressed at Eric Tucker's maintenance class?
Just wondering what the real risk is ...
Dennis Kirby
Mark-3, 912UL, Powerfin-70
Cedar Crest, NM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Reverse Rotation - Rotax-912 |
| Is this topic addressed at Eric Tucker's maintenance class?
| Just wondering what the real risk is ...
|
| Dennis Kirby
Denis K/Gang:
Yes, the topic of reverse rotation damage is discussed. The oil
pump/system of the 912 series engines is sensitive to induced air in
the oil. This is what happens when the prop is rotated in the reverse
direction. The 912 is a tough engine that will operate reliably for
many hours. However, the one factor that will kill the engine very
quickly is oil starvation. It can operate at reduced power without
coolant, should a hose or water pump fail in flight. So, don't shut
down your 912 and risk losing the aircraft and yourself by trying to
save the engine. It will operate for an extended period of time by
pulling back the throttle. My fat MKIII with 912S will fly at 3,000
rpm. Amount of heat generated at 4,000 rpm is no where near what is
produced at normal cruise of 5,000 rpm.
Take care,
john h
MKIII/912S
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "woody" <duesouth(at)govital.net> |
Once again I have proven the strength of Homer and Denis' design. Due to
medical problems I had grounded myself all summer and used the time to fix
up my Mk3. I reshaped the nose a bit, repainted some areas and created a
proffesional looking interior. Last on the agenda was getting the Jabi
running perfect. I was having trouble with the EGT running hot. I tryed new
gas and before I started digging deeper into the engine I decided to swap
the probes to rule out instrument failure. I use the classic one step at a
time plan to find out what is wrong. Tue. flight was to be a take off turn
around and land probably 10 min tops. After take off I checked the temps and
they were a bit different but the one one side was still very hot so I
narrowed instrumentation out of the equasion. Then it got real quiet. At 200
ft I dropped the nose and checked my options. I could do a 180 death turn
back or land 50 ft. up in a tree. I chose the turn with no real intention of
getting back to the strip. I have had several engine outs over the years and
was not really worried A couple bent tubes a yard of fabric a bit of paint
and I have another story to tell. This was different. When the engine died
it seemed like the controls disconnected. They got real sloppy and would not
obey the master. I got the speed to 50 but still not real authority. Pull up
and flair was an imaginary event. I hit rather hard and when the dust
settled I looked around and took stock of the situation. I was still belted
in but really cramped up with my knees around my ears and my leg hurt. All
extremities moved.Aaallright :) It took a few minutes to weasle my right
hand over to the let side of my body to poke at the belt realease. Finally I
got it off. Now what? I was so cramped in I couldn't move. Somehow I wiggled
out and fell to the ground but my right foot was still stuck under the
pedals some how. About this time I heard someone hunting for me and called
him over. It was difficult convincing him that in my best interest he should
free my foot. After an eternity he finally decided to free it. That was nice
of him but he didn't want to move my body. So there I was lying on the
ground, right hip now moving independantly from my body and my right leg
hanging around in the cockpit. A few more minutes and I convinced him I had
no back injury and that it would be better for me not to be sitting in this
puddle of gas. Finally he agreed and pulled me out. My screams directed the
paramedics to the landing site. I met my daughter at the ambulance and did
my best to put on a happy face. I don't think she believed me but at least
she knew I wasn't going to die and had no horrible injuries.. At the
hospital I was asked to do TV and nespaper interviews. After having gone
through this before I felt it was best to straighten the media out right
away so they would not make up things for a good story. All I asked was to
print the story as I tell it and to keep a positive spin on it to quell
fears in other pilots wives. They did a good job and even took photos and
video from my good side.The rest of the story is just about the six days I
spent as a guest of the Canadian medical system but I am home and that is
behind me now except when I go through airport security..
What now? Andy and I will go out to the hanger when I have the ambition
to do the 75 ft. walk to the hanger. I want to borrow the neighbour kid for
some photos cause Andy can't believe anyone could have fit in or got out of
that space. I will have to wait a few days untill I can walk out there. Next
step is to duct tape the parts back together and try to do a weight and
balance. I can't believe I would have flown it with out it after the Jabi
installation but I can't find it but I can't see me not doing it. The scales
are still in the hanger. The only thing I could think of is that when I did
the W&B I weighed 210. After a summer of working around the house and riding
a bike everywhere I am now trimmed down to 185 or less. Thats 25 lb
diference. Could that be it? I will have to reassemble and weigh to find out
. That loss of control was scary I need to know why. The actual engine out
was not a big worry. Sorry for the long post and I will keep you informed as
the story develops. Thanks to all for the personal emails. I hope to be well
enough to camp in Kentucky at the home comming. If I can't camp is there a
motel nearby?
Dick (Woody)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com> |
That was a rough go, Woody, but I'm sure glad it wasn't worse. We'll all be
waiting to hear what you find. Lar. Do
not Archive.
Larry Bourne
Palm Springs, CA
Building Kolb Mk III
N78LB Vamoose
www.gogittum.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "woody" <duesouth(at)govital.net>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: WOODY-Dick
>
> Once again I have proven the strength of Homer and Denis' design. Due to
> medical problems I had grounded myself all summer and used the time to fix
> up my Mk3. I reshaped the nose a bit, repainted some areas and
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM05(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Mk111 questions? |
I see no one has tried to answer the handling question so I will attempt to.
First I have never flown one with faperons. Generally speaking you have more
flap power (drag) with classic flaps than flaperons. I don't think there is
any reduction in roll authority with flaperons but the Kolbs with flaporons
have a shorter cord in the area were the ailerons are most effective. Most
people that have a choice will choose to have the classic flaps.
Maybe someone that has flown both will add their experience
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW powered MKIIIc
----- Original Message -----
From: <DCulver701(at)aol.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Mk111 questions?
>
> What are the differences in handling between a plane with flaperons and
> the
> classic,s flaps? Also does anyone have an opinion on the 912 engine
> offered
> with fuel injection versus the twin carbs? I've seen it advertised as
> older
> military 912 engines rebuilt at a certified Rotax repair service. Their
> $10 k
> asking price isn't that far away from a new one, but curious anyway. Also
> wondering about the seat cushions offered in the brochure, they don't look
> to
> comfortable, or well made from the picture, but pictures can be deceiving.
> Tia,
> best regards. Dave Culver
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | robert bean <slyck(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Mk111 questions? |
Another alternative would be to extend the wing in the flap area
and eliminate them entirely. You would then have a nice clean
high lift area with no extra mechanisms, gap seals and other
bothersome trivia. To each his own, but I like flying without a
bunch of lever pulling, switch flipping, radio bullcrap, navigation
aids,
etc, etc. -just lovin' the air flowing past my ears.
-BB, happy with what I have.
On 31, Aug 2005, at 3:23 PM, Richard & Martha Neilsen wrote:
>
>
> I see no one has tried to answer the handling question so I will
> attempt to.
> First I have never flown one with faperons. Generally speaking you
> have more
> flap power (drag) with classic flaps than flaperons. I don't think
> there is
> any reduction in roll authority with flaperons but the Kolbs with
> flaporons
> have a shorter cord in the area were the ailerons are most effective.
> Most
> people that have a choice will choose to have the classic flaps.
>
> Maybe someone that has flown both will add their experience
>
> Rick Neilsen
> Redrive VW powered MKIIIc
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <DCulver701(at)aol.com>
> To:
> Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Mk111 questions?
>
>
>>
>> What are the differences in handling between a plane with flaperons
>> and
>> the
>> classic,s flaps? Also does anyone have an opinion on the 912 engine
>> offered
>> with fuel injection versus the twin carbs? I've seen it advertised as
>> older
>> military 912 engines rebuilt at a certified Rotax repair service.
>> Their
>> $10 k
>> asking price isn't that far away from a new one, but curious anyway.
>> Also
>> wondering about the seat cushions offered in the brochure, they don't
>> look
>> to
>> comfortable, or well made from the picture, but pictures can be
>> deceiving.
>> Tia,
>> best regards. Dave Culver
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris Mallory" <wcm(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
Does anyone have some good plans for an "in flight" elevator trim system for
a Firestar II ?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | G Buck <sgtbuck8(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | New to this site.. |
Hi Everyone
I have been reading this list for the past few months. I have a Kolb 1989 Firestar. I just completed over 15 hours in the air with an instructor and should be solo in my Kolb very soon. I am in the San Diego area and I am a member of the San Diego ultralight as. I am the only one in the club with a Kolb at this time. Anyway I just wanted to say hi and thank you all for the great advise in your emails. Here are some pic of my plane.. http://profiles.yahoo.com/sgtbuck8
Galen in San Diego
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com> |
| Subject: | Pictures from last Sunday's fly-in |
Guys, here are some pictures from the local fly-in we had last Sunday.
http://frogflyers.com/phpbb/album.php
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
Guys, here are some pictures from the local fly-in we had last Sunday.
http://frogflyers.com/phpbb/album.php
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Change of E-Mail Address |
Hello list,
Just wanted to let everyone know of the change of e-mail address:
gearbender(at)bellsouth.net
Had a great visit with Gary Haley this past weekend. Took notes on some the improvements/mods
he has made.
Hope to get started very soon on my plane. Hope to be flying again in a couple
of months.
Plan to build a website on new field, rebuild and mods. May help others in same
situation. I'll be bugging the list and some of you individually for pointers
and recommendations. Some of you have found the best methods through trial
and error. Hope you won't mind if I skip the trial and error part and just steal
your good ideas.
Stay safe, make good decisions every flight.
Thanks,
John Bickham
St. Francisville, LA
Kolb Mark IIIC/912
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Flycrazy8(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: New to this site.. |
In a message dated 8/31/2005 6:07:03 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
sgtbuck8(at)yahoo.com writes:
http://profiles.yahoo.com/sgtbuck8
Welcome to the Gang/Club/Kolb/List..sgt. Galen Buck
Always glad to have another Kolber to sat by the camp fire.
Nice LQQKing Firestar U Got.
Stephen Bax
Firefly 447
Pansey, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Trollope" <flash_too(at)yahoo.co.uk> |
| Subject: | : Kolb-List:leaving this group |
I am leaving this group as I no longer have a Kolb...
An unfortunate incident lead to my Kolb sustaining damage to cage and
boom...
No problem I thought .... just order the spares from the states....
Great idea, the factory were great with advice and help but then Kolb put me
in touch with the UK importer......
Well.....
After a deafening silence of many months I have unfortunately decided that I
can wait no longer...
So I have now ordered a Skyranger....whose importer seems to offer an
excellent service..
So if anyone wants a set of wings and tailplanes etc for a Kolb MkIII......
Carl
How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Edward Steuber" <esteuber(at)rochester.rr.com> |
Anyone know where I can get a genuine Cuyuna flywheel puller or one that works
on a UL202. ? ?..the last time was a real problem with the improvised stuff I
have. Those things are really on there !
Ed in Western NY
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Connection |
plumb my fuel supply from the bottom of the tank>>
Hi John,
What works, works I suppose. I just don`t like holes below the waterline as
a general principle.
My Challenger has been flying since 1990 with a top of the tank takeout with
the feed pipe about an inch or so above the bottom. There is no water trap
or provision for removing water and I have only emptied the tank a couole of
times to dump the remains of old fuel.
I hope Hauks Hollow is OK. We are getting horrendous pics and stories
following Katrina. Hope all the Kolbers are OK.
Looks as though shooting a few looters might be a good idea, particularly as
they seem to be looting gunshops etc., rather than the food shops for which
they may have some excuse.
All the best
Pat
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
I have proven the strength of Homer and Denis' design. >>
Hi Woody,
Congratulations on `getting away with it` even in a slightly battered
condition. Seems that you did all the right things within the area of which
you had control.
I should be very interested in your weight and balance figures when you get
to that stage. My Xtra with the Jabi is really causing some head scratching.
The weight and balance and CG figures just don`t add up. The tail is so
heavy it is difficult to lift.
Anyone else with an Extra plus Jabi I would be grateful for some advice
here.
Cheers
Pat
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: New to this site.. |
In a message dated 8/31/2005 7:07:03 PM Eastern Standard Time,
sgtbuck8(at)yahoo.com writes:
Hi Everyone
I have been reading this list for the past few months. I have a Kolb 1989
Firestar. I just completed over 15 hours in the air with an instructor and should
be solo in my Kolb very soon. I am in the San Diego area and I am a member of
the San Diego ultralight as. I am the only one in the club with a Kolb at
this time. Anyway I just wanted to say hi and thank you all for the great advise
in your emails. Here are some pic of my plane..
http://profiles.yahoo.com/sgtbuck8
Galen in San Diego
welcome aboard Galen....you got a goodun, fella.
George Randolph
Firestar driver in The Villages Fla
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ray anderson <rsanoa(at)yahoo.com> |
The weight and balance and CG figures just don`t add up. The tail is so
heavy it is difficult to lift.
Pat,
Just an uncalled for comment. You've got a big problem it seems. Sharpen your pencil
or fire up the handheld computer. Tell us what you ultimately find, but
I believe it would stay grounded until I found it.
I have proven the strength of Homer and Denis' design. >>
Hi Woody,
Congratulations on `getting away with it` even in a slightly battered
condition. Seems that you did all the right things within the area of which
you had control.
I should be very interested in your weight and balance figures when you get
to that stage. My Xtra with the Jabi is really causing some head scratching.
The weight and balance and CG figures just don`t add up. The tail is so
heavy it is difficult to lift.
Anyone else with an Extra plus Jabi I would be grateful for some advice
here.
Cheers
Pat
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM05(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Weght and Balance |
Patrick
What doesn't add up? The calculations are a bit confusing but do add up. I
don't have a Xtra or a Jabi but I do have a VW on my MKIIIc and it can cause
weight and balance issues if not compensated for. What are your figures?
Just saying the tail is heavy to lift is kind of subjective.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW powered MKIIIc
----- Original Message -----
From: "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: WOODY-Dick
>
>
> I should be very interested in your weight and balance figures when you
> get
> to that stage. My Xtra with the Jabi is really causing some head
> scratching.
> The weight and balance and CG figures just don`t add up. The tail is so
> heavy it is difficult to lift.
> Anyone else with an Extra plus Jabi I would be grateful for some advice
> here.
>
> Cheers
>
> Pat
>
>
> --
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM05(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Connection |
Patrick
I also have the fuel connections on the bottom of my tanks as recommended by
the plans.. They have severed me well with never a leak. Last year I changed
my tanks for new ones and haven't had any leaks in the new ones either.
Why would anyone build a fuel system trying to have more unusable fuel. Most
of us try to build our airplanes as light as possible. If you are concerned
about fuel contamination (as you should be) follow standard aircraft
practices. Put finger screens in the tank leading to all feed lines, then
plum the system directly to a gascolator (with a drain valve) at the bottom
of your fuel system then plum the fuel line to a filter. I have a gascolator
at the bottom of my fuselage behind the passenger seat with the drain valve
sticking out the side of the fuselage just ahead of the gear leg. When I
preflight I always drain out a fuel sample. Any water or any other
contamination trapped in the gascolator gets drained before every flight.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW powered MKIIIc
----- Original Message -----
From: "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fuel Tank Connection
>
> plumb my fuel supply from the bottom of the tank>>
>
> Hi John,
>
> What works, works I suppose. I just don`t like holes below the waterline
> as
> a general principle.
> My Challenger has been flying since 1990 with a top of the tank takeout
> with
> the feed pipe about an inch or so above the bottom. There is no water trap
> or provision for removing water and I have only emptied the tank a couole
> of
> times to dump the remains of old fuel.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: : Kolb-List:leaving this group |
I am leaving this group as I no longer have a Kolb..>>
Hi Carl,
It would be nice to have a chat with you.
Contact me at pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com
Cheers
Pat.
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Tank Connection |
<>
Hi Rick,
sounds as though you have really covered yourself with your system. `Copper
bottomed, brazed and rivetted we would say.
I just followed the Challenger plans. With a system with which you can drain
accumulated water from the bottom of the tank then taking fuel from the
bottom makes sense.
With no such drainage system it makes sense to let the water accumulate
where it cannot get into the feed pipe.
Thanks for the comments
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DCulver701(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Mk111 questions? |
Thanks Rick & B.B. for your response to flap vs. flaperon handling question.
Hopefully i'll get a response from someone who has flown both, & can give a
bipartisan answer. Rick, i see you are using an V.W. engine on your MK111. Is
that the aero-vee engine sonex uses with their own aerovee carb. I was quite
impressed with the technology with that engine, along with the low initial
cost & low overhaul cost. How does the v.w compare with the Rotax on speed &
fuel consumption, matching same size engines? Also did you have any problem
mounting the engine. I presume it doesn't have a gearbox, so its performance
should be close to the Jab? I'm going to try to make the factory fly in, but
not quite sure of our schedule yet on our vacation return trip from Wis back
to N.J. So i'm hoping to meet some of you Kolbers and see the planes in person
instead of on the video & brochures. Tia, best regards. My prayers go out
to hurricane victims> Dave Culver
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James Tripp" <jtripp(at)elmore.rr.com> |
Chris,
If you need down trim, the simplest trim system is to hook a bungee from
your control stick to the floor pan in front of the rudder peddles. For trim
down, slide the bungee up the control stick which will pull the stick
forward as the bungee get higher. It works very well on my FS.
James Tripp, FSII
Millbrook AL
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris Mallory
Subject: Kolb-List:
Does anyone have some good plans for an "in flight" elevator trim system for
a Firestar II ?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris Mallory" <wcm(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: : Kolb-List: |
James,
Thanks for the information. My problem however, is the opposite. I need to
trim the nose up ... any ideas?
Thanks Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "James Tripp" <jtripp(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: RE: Kolb-List:
>
> Chris,
> If you need down trim, the simplest trim system is to hook a bungee from
> your control stick to the floor pan in front of the rudder peddles. For
> trim
> down, slide the bungee up the control stick which will pull the stick
> forward as the bungee get higher. It works very well on my FS.
>
> James Tripp, FSII
> Millbrook AL
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chris Mallory
> To: Kolb List
> Subject: Kolb-List:
>
>
> Does anyone have some good plans for an "in flight" elevator trim system
> for
>
> a Firestar II ?
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitty <benny_bee_01(at)yahoo.com> |
0.29 FROM_HAS_ULINE_NUMS From": contains.an.underline.and.numbers/letters(at)roxy.matronics.com
I just got home from gas hunting..No luck.I have about
1.5 - 2 gallons left in my bike.That will be enough
for two more trips to work and back .Then i'll buy me
a shwinn bike. :-/
Now there is a NUMBER of great folks.Everyone except
those few bastards luders(spell) are holding up
together.Helping out each other.Companies open doors
for people.Distributing ice and drinking water for
free..The only problem is that we have no gas around
here to drive and take chance for it.However we are
here are high spirited.We got through the storm with
minimal damage here .Got power back so we re cool.No
water or gas is ok...Hopefully soon we'll get some.
Now In new orleans few folks (watching here on TV) are
screaming "take us out,WE WANT OUT" Then walmart
burgluries.Heared on radio they were breaking in
hospitals looking for drugs.Hell here on CNN i saw a
dude running with about three dozens of fishing
poles.Those assholes(excuse my french) were warned and
asked to move out.Instread they chosen to ride it
out.Then they chose to break in the stores and steal
stuff even if they don't really need 6 pairs of jeans
or riding lawnmower(sae on CNN boy pushing it out of
store)
Then they choose to shoot up the helicopter that was
rescuing folks.
Then they acuse government because it's easier to
blame uncle sam then do something for your own good.
It's just a type of people.Makes me sick and
disgusted.Let me tell you,I saw a tramendous help from
government and other folks.People helping each other
and this is a bottom line.We'll get through it only
working together.Now acusing sam or each other.
Peace out...
Shaken but not stirred,
Mitty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Pike <richard(at)bcchapel.org> |
| Subject: | Re: : Kolb-List: |
If you need to trim the nose up, adjust the aileron rods and raise the
trailing edge of the ailerons until it flies like you want it. Kolbs are
very responsive to the position of the ailerons. Reflexing them (trailing
edge up) trims them out nose high & makes them act tail heavy, trailing
edge of the ailerons lower makes them act nose heavier. Works every time.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>
>James,
>Thanks for the information. My problem however, is the opposite. I need to
>trim the nose up ... any ideas?
>
>Thanks Chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Stonex" <cstonex(at)msn.com> |
Thanks for sharing Mitty. I saw simular problems after Hurricane Charley.
People working against each other instead of working together for a common
solution and unity.
Chuck Stonex
Des Moines IA
I just got home from gas hunting..No luck.I have about
1.5 - 2 gallons left in my bike.That will be enough
for two more trips to work and back .Then i'll buy me
a shwinn bike. :-/
Now there is a NUMBER of great folks.Everyone except
those few bastards luders(spell) are holding up
together.Helping out each other.Companies open doors
for people.Distributing ice and drinking water for
free..The only problem is that we have no gas around
here to drive and take chance for it.However we are
here are high spirited.We got through the storm with
minimal damage here .Got power back so we re cool.No
water or gas is ok...Hopefully soon we'll get some.
Now In new orleans few folks (watching here on TV) are
screaming "take us out,WE WANT OUT" Then walmart
burgluries.Heared on radio they were breaking in
hospitals looking for drugs.Hell here on CNN i saw a
dude running with about three dozens of fishing
poles.Those assholes(excuse my french) were warned and
asked to move out.Instread they chosen to ride it
out.Then they chose to break in the stores and steal
stuff even if they don't really need 6 pairs of jeans
or riding lawnmower(sae on CNN boy pushing it out of
store)
Then they choose to shoot up the helicopter that was
rescuing folks.
Then they acuse government because it's easier to
blame uncle sam then do something for your own good.
It's just a type of people.Makes me sick and
disgusted.Let me tell you,I saw a tramendous help from
government and other folks.People helping each other
and this is a bottom line.We'll get through it only
working together.Now acusing sam or each other.
Peace out...
Shaken but not stirred,
Mitty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ted Cowan <trc1917(at)direcway.com> |
Has anyone heard or know about Miss. Lite, Ronny Smith's place or John
Cooley. If you are there John, how are you doing and to what extent is the
damage? Ted Cowan.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Edward Steuber" <esteuber(at)rochester.rr.com> |
Yesterday I was able to make a good puller for the mag end of the UL202
and had in off in minutes ....examined the bearings and they all are OK....I even
see no problem with the bearing surface on the rod except slight discoloration...very
tempting to clean and reassemble but will get the advice of the supplier
in Illinois first. The rod end is my concern.....it mics up perfect ...
Very tempting to reassemble but after hearing a lot of 2 stroke stories
, I think I will defer to the "experts"...what do you think guys ?
Ed in Western NY
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "woody" <duesouth(at)govital.net> |
| Subject: | Re: : Kolb-List:leaving this group |
I don't fly a Kolb either but I am sticking around for a bit. How bad is
the cage? Any competant old time welder should be able to get it back into
prime shape at little cost and as strong as new. The 6" 6063 irrigation
tube should be easy to find also.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carl Trollope" <flash_too(at)yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: RE: Kolb-List:leaving this group
>
> I am leaving this group as I no longer have a Kolb...
>
> An unfortunate incident lead to my Kolb sustaining damage to cage and
> boom...
>
> No problem I thought .... just order the spares from the states....
>
> Great idea, the factory were great with advice and help but then Kolb put
me
> in touch with the UK importer......
>
> Well.....
>
> After a deafening silence of many months I have unfortunately decided that
I
> can wait no longer...
>
> So I have now ordered a Skyranger....whose importer seems to offer an
> excellent service..
>
> So if anyone wants a set of wings and tailplanes etc for a Kolb
MkIII......
>
> Carl
>
>
> How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday
>
>
> --
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Christopher Armstrong" <tophera(at)centurytel.net> |
>> I took out about 30 ft of tall corn which probably took some of the
>> impact. The scary part is that I did not damage the landing gear.
Hay woody,
glad you are not too worse for wear.
Do you think the corn pitched you nose down enough to make the primary
impact the nose, leaving the gear off the ground till most of the energy was
used up crunching the cage? Or were you coming in nose low before you hit
the corn... if you took out thirty feet of corn I would think that you were
still traveling significantly horizontal. Say 6 foot of corn over thirty
feet gives about an 11 degree approach angle... not super steep but lots
more then the 3 degree ideal. If any of your buddies could measure the
distance from corn impact to ground impact and the height of the corn you
would get a better guess at it.
Hope you get yourself back together soon.
Topher
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris Mallory" <wcm(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: : Kolb-List: |
Richard,
Thank you for the great information. I will try this idea out this weekend.
Chris Mallory
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Pike" <richard(at)bcchapel.org>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List:
>
> If you need to trim the nose up, adjust the aileron rods and raise the
> trailing edge of the ailerons until it flies like you want it. Kolbs are
> very responsive to the position of the ailerons. Reflexing them (trailing
> edge up) trims them out nose high & makes them act tail heavy, trailing
> edge of the ailerons lower makes them act nose heavier. Works every time.
>
> Richard Pike
> MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>
>
>>
>>James,
>>Thanks for the information. My problem however, is the opposite. I need to
>>trim the nose up ... any ideas?
>>
>>Thanks Chris
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob and Jenn B" <tabberdd(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Mark II For Sale |
Just listed on Barnstormers, due to unfortunate sudden circumstances I need
to sell my Kolb Mark II. It's in great shape and fun to fly (I had it at
Homers Fly-In). It's based in Eastern PA.
Specs:
Finished in 2001 by another builder
503 SCSI
39 hrs TT AF & Engine
340 lbs. Empty Weight
Blue/White
$11,500 Firm
Please write or call for photos or more info.
Bob Bennethum
717-519-7506
rbennethum(at)verizon.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | William Ferguson <willbflyn(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: From Jackson,MS |
AMEN!!!!!!
Billy
Mitty wrote:
I just got home from gas hunting..No luck.I have about
1.5 - 2 gallons left in my bike.That will be enough
for two more trips to work and back .Then i'll buy me
a shwinn bike. :-/
Now there is a NUMBER of great folks.Everyone except
those few bastards luders(spell) are holding up
together.Helping out each other.Companies open doors
for people.Distributing ice and drinking water for
free..The only problem is that we have no gas around
here to drive and take chance for it.However we are
here are high spirited.We got through the storm with
minimal damage here .Got power back so we re cool.No
water or gas is ok...Hopefully soon we'll get some.
Now In new orleans few folks (watching here on TV) are
screaming "take us out,WE WANT OUT" Then walmart
burgluries.Heared on radio they were breaking in
hospitals looking for drugs.Hell here on CNN i saw a
dude running with about three dozens of fishing
poles.Those assholes(excuse my french) were warned and
asked to move out.Instread they chosen to ride it
out.Then they chose to break in the stores and steal
stuff even if they don't really need 6 pairs of jeans
or riding lawnmower(sae on CNN boy pushing it out of
store)
Then they choose to shoot up the helicopter that was
rescuing folks.
Then they acuse government because it's easier to
blame uncle sam then do something for your own good.
It's just a type of people.Makes me sick and
disgusted.Let me tell you,I saw a tramendous help from
government and other folks.People helping each other
and this is a bottom line.We'll get through it only
working together.Now acusing sam or each other.
Peace out...
Shaken but not stirred,
Mitty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | G Buck <sgtbuck8(at)yahoo.com> |
Thank you all for such a warm welcome.
Wow your really into your Rotax 447. LOL
The engine on my Firestar is a Rotax 377 that was
redone by Danny Day. It has a CDI ignition and
only has 90 hours on it. The guy that had the Firestar
before me kept a log for the engine, airframe and prop.
HMMM I always have a hard time sleeping maybe
I will try counting Rotax 377s.
Thanks again everyone for such a nice welcome.
sgtbuck in SD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | russ kinne <kinnepix(at)earthlink.net> |
A tragic video of the Caribou crash. That's a strong solid aircraft
with a proven safety record -- but none of them will fly with the
controls locked. Those poor guys didn't have a chance, not one.
I recall a DC-9 that crashed at LGA years ago, killing 81. It seems
that when the pilot ran up his engines, a rock blew into the elevator
hinge, effectively locking the elevators in the up position.
Ever since then, the last thing I do before pushing the throttle
forward for takeoff, is to move the stick left, right, forward and
back, to make sure I have full range of
flight controls. It's a good habit.
Russ Kinne
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | russ kinne <kinnepix(at)earthlink.net> |
In re re-starting an engine in the air -- I know you probably couldn't
get enough airspeed in a Kolb to do it by windmilling -- but either
the electric or the hand starter should work -- would be even easier
than usual due to windmilling.
But of course it doesn't address the question of why it stopped in the
first place.
Has anyone any experience here?
Do Not arcghive
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: q "Aerial Restart" |
| In re re-starting an engine in the air -- I know you probably
couldn't
| get enough airspeed in a Kolb to do it by windmilling -- but either
| the electric or the hand starter should work -- would be even easier
| than usual due to windmilling.
| | Has anyone any experience here?
Russ/All:
Took the liberty to change the subject to reflect what you are talking
about. Still have no idea WTF the subject "Q" is.
To the best of my knowledge our little engines, two and four stroke,
driving the prop through a gear box, do not do aerial restarts by
windmilling.
As far as restarting in the air with the pull starter or electric
starter, both can be done successfully, most of the time, unless one
waits too long to attempt the restart. Once the engine gets chilled
off, which it does quite rapidly, chances are you ain't gonna restart
by pulling the string. Electric start....yes.
Actual engine failure, and not simply an engine that quit running
because it idled too long, etc., bests spend your time selecting and
flying the airplane to the best forced landing you can execute.
john h
MKIII
PS: Less than three weeks to the Kolb Homecoming. How many folks
going to try and get to London for the get together???
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <williamdgleason(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: q "Aerial Restart" |
>
> From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
> Date: 2005/09/03 Sat PM 06:34:32 EDT
> To:
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: q "Aerial Restart"
>
>
> | In re re-starting an engine in the air -- I know you probably
> couldn't
> | get enough airspeed in a Kolb to do it by windmilling -- but either
> | the electric or the hand starter should work -- would be even easier
> | than usual due to windmilling.
>
> | | Has anyone any experience here?
>
> Russ/All:
>
> Took the liberty to change the subject to reflect what you are talking
> about. Still have no idea WTF the subject "Q" is.
>
> To the best of my knowledge our little engines, two and four stroke,
> driving the prop through a gear box, do not do aerial restarts by
> windmilling.
>
> As far as restarting in the air with the pull starter or electric
> starter, both can be done successfully, most of the time, unless one
> waits too long to attempt the restart. Once the engine gets chilled
> off, which it does quite rapidly, chances are you ain't gonna restart
> by pulling the string. Electric start....yes.
>
> Actual engine failure, and not simply an engine that quit running
> because it idled too long, etc., bests spend your time selecting and
> flying the airplane to the best forced landing you can execute.
>
> john h
> MKIII
>
> PS: Less than three weeks to the Kolb Homecoming. How many folks
> going to try and get to London for the get together???
>
>
>
> Several years ago I decided to give it a try and killed the engine on my MkII
After practicing
many dead stick landings at idle. IT restarted but was only off for a minute or
two. I restarted
about 5 ft. from the ground before touchdown. I do remember thinking that it wasn't
that difficult at the time but I was a little stronger 10 years ago. Also,
I was told by D&F Aviation that the 503 with point ignition is easier to start.
Dale, MkII
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Pike <richard(at)bcchapel.org> |
Finished the annual today, flew for 2.6 hours, wx was almost perfect. We
were headed for a little strip 54 miles away at the base of a high ridge
just east of Middlesboro, Kentucky, home of "Glacier Girl," the P-38 that
was retrieved from the Greenland glacier. By the time we had flown 5 miles
and climbed a couple thousand feet, we could see our destination 50 miles
away. For Blue Ridge Mountain flyers, that is unheard of visibility.
The couple who own White Rock Strip were very gracious, invited us back
tomorrow, they are having a fly-in, the giant cooker was already there with
about ten bags of charcoal next to it, planning to roast a pig.
Left there, looking for a strip we couldn't find, then went and flew over
the little town of Duffield - which was having their annual fall fling -
"Duffield Daze," watched the tractor pulls for a bit. Then went and landed
on Copperhead Ridge at Bill Williams strip, it is 400' long, and sloped
about 20 degrees up the side of a hill. You land up hill and take off down
hill (What else?) What is really cool is that it has two whoop-de-do's in
it, it is not even close to level, but landing, you slow down so quick it
doesn't matter, and taking off, you accelerate so quick it doesn't matter.
And when you need to stop and pee, what difference would it make anyway?
Finally got home just before sunset.
Noted during the annual that the 582 had no carbon in the exhaust ports and
only a light amount on the piston tops, rings free and normal, typically
run between 5,000 and 5,500 rpm using Phillips Injex. Since the prevailing
wind today was out of the NNW, and 90 degrees to all the ridges we had to
cross, it was pretty roller-coaster-y, so we flew at around 60, which is
5,100 rpm. Used about ten gallons in 2.6 hours, about 4 gallons an hour.
Excellent day.
Question: On the 582, the exhaust gaskets overlap the exhaust port at
either end. I am sure I bought the correct gaskets for this engine, I
noticed when I put them in last year that they overlapped the port a bit,
and I remember the gaskets on the 532 I used to have were the same way. Any
body else notice this with their engines?
Anyway, when I installed new gaskets, I took the Dremel tool and buzzed out
the gaskets to correctly fit the port size, and noticed about a 50 rpm
increase on climb out.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Martin" <kolbdriver(at)hotmail.com> |
Kolb group:
I've got a chance to pick up a 2003 Rotax 503 with oil injection for what
seems a reasonable price. The engine is still in its transport box. Would
problems like internal corosion or deteriorating seals have developed over
the 2 year period? What protective measures should I use if kept in storage
for another year?
Anybody familiar with the Randolph method of coverings/paints? Good?Bad?
Thanks
Don
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Pike <richard(at)bcchapel.org> |
I would expect the engine to be in OK shape. Do a crankcase test on it just
to be sure. You need to have a crankcase pressure tester anyway, now is a
good time to get one.
Randolph fabric coatings are great. I have used both Randolph and Stits,
and the same techniques apply to both. IMO, Randolph coatings dry a bit
quicker, which helps when you are applying all the tapes. This is a very
subjective opinion, but I remember Randolph as a bit quicker to work with.
Or maybe I was just getting old by the time I got to the Stits...
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>
>Kolb group:
>
>I've got a chance to pick up a 2003 Rotax 503 with oil injection for what
>seems a reasonable price. The engine is still in its transport box. Would
>problems like internal corosion or deteriorating seals have developed over
>the 2 year period? What protective measures should I use if kept in storage
>for another year?
>
>Anybody familiar with the Randolph method of coverings/paints? Good?Bad?
>
>Thanks
>
>Don
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "kfackler" <kfackler(at)ameritech.net> |
My previous flight having been "disallowed" because it was not in a Kolb,
I'm happy to report that today I drove the Mark II to 10,640 feet msl, thus
insuring a full 10,000 feet above the ground. And that with a Rotax 503,
mind you! It was a well-nigh perfect day in the Michigan Thumb this morning.
I and another Kolber, Mark Gray, who flies a Firestar II, took off about 8am
from Ray Community (57D) near the thumb's "knuckle" and flew straight up to
the tip of the thumb, landing at Bad Axe for fuel. We then went west to the
Saginaw Bar coastline, which was glorious, and followed it south over
Sebewaing and then on to near Bay City before heading southwest to go to
Chesaning for lunch and another fuel stop. On the way home, we flew over
Kirk (Snuffy) Smith's place in Columbiaville and then angled for home. It
was on this final leg that I sent her "over the top." All in all, a
delightful morning of flying, 4.6 hours and over 250 miles covered. Not in
Brother Hauk's league, but it'll do, pig, it'll do.
-Ken Fackler
Kolb Mark II / A722KWF
Rochester MI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vince Nicely" <vincenic(at)xtn.net> |
| Subject: | Re: q "Aerial Restart" |
Russ/All,
I can give some specific information on two parts of this subject.
503 DCDI with 72 inch 2-blade IVO Prop B Gear Box with 2.58 Ratio
First, I have a Kolb Firestar II with 503 DCDI engine with electric restart.
Let's think about an air restart by the pull starter. My pull starter is
rigged so I can pull it by reaching over my shoulder, grasping the handle
and pulling it. If I pull the rope starter for the stopped engine when it
is in the air decending at 70 mph, it is like sitting on the ground and
pulling it. In neither case can I start the engine by sitting in the
cockpit and pulling the starter. With the engine stopped and the airplane
in the air, the electric starter works just like on the ground too. If you
need the enricher circuit because the engine has cooled, then it works just
like on the ground. When the ignition switches are switched off in the air,
my engine stops turning in a small time.
582 with 64 inch 2-blade Warp Drive Prop with E Gear Box with 2.62 Gear
Ratio
This engine was on a Sonerai aircraft which was in a tractor position on the
front of the aircraft. This aircraft is somewhat faster than a Kolb so the
prop was set at a 17.5 degree angle so the aircraft would fly about 135 mph
at 6500 rpm and about 70 mph at 4500 RPM. With all that background, the
engine would windmill after the ignition was turned off until the airspeed
decreased to somewhere in the 70-80 mph range. Then, the prop would stop
windmilling, but it would rotate slowly as the compression leaked off the
cylinders so I could watch it turn slowly in a step-wise fashion. After
rotation stopped, my notes from the times of the tests show that the prop
was only turning slowly upto at least 85 mph. The engine would restart by
restarting windmilling at a higher airspeed in a dive because I have
restarted it that way but I have no notes on the speed required. It may
have been 120 mph or higher. On one occasion, I was having fun gliding the
aircraft with the engine off and rotation stopped beginning at about 7000 ft
agl and I made an attemp to restart it at about 2500 ft agl. The engine
started windmilling after the electric start was engaged, but did not fire
at all. So, I began to plan for an off-field landing and then went throught
the potential problems. As soon as I pulled the enricher lever, the engine
started immediately. That was the first time I really let it cool after
stopping and before restart and it was surely different starting a cool
engine than a fully warmed engine.
Vince Nicely
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Schnabel <tnfirestar2(at)yahoo.com> |
Received this from EAA 104 Ultralight member, thought it was worth passing along...
Note: forwarded message attached.
Authentication-Results: mta105.mail.mud.yahoo.com
from=yahoogroups.com; domainkeys=pass (ok)
From: trimspeed <trimspeed(at)yahoo.com>
List-Id:
List-Unsubscribe:
Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:20:32 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: [ultralightchapter104] UL crash video
--hkdbIZrBjBWhOIUaLID6TH0hdAXOhck3QCjMg6d
Great video Barry. Four seconds from engine stoppage
to impact. The FAA says it takes a pilot about five
seconds after an engine failure to realize what has
happened. Only then can the pilot begin to perform
the emergency procedures.
Powerful...thanks for sending the link.
-Gary
--- beartooth37129 wrote:
> I don't know if any of you have seen this or not. If
> so....sorry for
> the repeat. Remember...."ALTITUDE IS OUR FRIEND".
>
>
> http://www.frogflyers.com/CrashVideo.wmv
>
>
> Barry
>
>
>
--hkdbIZrBjBWhOIUaLID6TH0hdAXOhck3QCjMg6d
Great video Barry. Four seconds from engine stoppage
to impact. The FAA says it takes a pilot about five
seconds after an engine failure to realize what has
happened. Only then can the pilot begin to perform
the emergency procedures.
Powerful...thanks for sending the link.
-Gary
--- beartooth37129 barryglenn(at)comcast.net wrote:
I don't know if any of you have seen this or not. If
so....sorry for
the repeat. Remember....ALTITUDE IS OUR FRIEND.
http://www.frogflyers.com/CrashVideo.wmv
Barry
Visit your group "ultralightchapter104" on the web.
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
ultralightchapter104-unsubscribe(at)yahoogroups.com
--hkdbIZrBjBWhOIUaLID6TH0hdAXOhck3QCjMg6d--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: UL crash video |
| the repeat. Remember....ALTITUDE IS OUR FRIEND.
|
|
| http://www.frogflyers.com/CrashVideo.wmv
|
|
| Barry
Mike S/Gang:
Take particular note what this pilot does when the engine quits. He
has just passed over a long straight dirt/gravel road. Instead of
banking left and pushing the stick forward, he immediately tries to
make the UL levitate by pulling all the way back on the control stick.
No wonder it went down so fast. He stalled the aircraft before it
went into the trees.
I may be speaking out of turn as I have zero experience in any other
UL except Kolbs and Burt Howland's Honeybee.
A good piece of teaching video!!!
john h
MKIII
PS: This one ought to be archived so others can refresh themselves
prior to engine failure.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ron <CaptainRon1(at)cox.net> |
Hey Woody
Glad to hear you are ok considering all.
Best wishes for a speedy recovery.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ron <CaptainRon1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | : Kolb-List:leaving this group |
That's unfortunate. Factory service here is first rate, too bad the
Brit counter part is not doing all he can.
=============================
>
>I am leaving this group as I no longer have a Kolb...
>
>An unfortunate incident lead to my Kolb sustaining damage to cage and
>boom...
>
>No problem I thought .... just order the spares from the states....
>
>Great idea, the factory were great with advice and help but then Kolb put me
>in touch with the UK importer......
>
>Well.....
>
>After a deafening silence of many months I have unfortunately decided that I
>can wait no longer...
>
>So I have now ordered a Skyranger....whose importer seems to offer an
>excellent service..
>
>So if anyone wants a set of wings and tailplanes etc for a Kolb MkIII......
>
>Carl
>
>
>
>How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Stonex" <cstonex(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: UL crash video |
Looked like to me that he forgot to fly the plane. Looked like a Quick
Silver which as I understand it has a good glide ratio.
| the repeat. Remember....ALTITUDE IS OUR FRIEND.
|
|
| http://www.frogflyers.com/CrashVideo.wmv
|
|
| Barry
Mike S/Gang:
Take particular note what this pilot does when the engine quits. He
has just passed over a long straight dirt/gravel road. Instead of
banking left and pushing the stick forward, he immediately tries to
make the UL levitate by pulling all the way back on the control stick.
No wonder it went down so fast. He stalled the aircraft before it
went into the trees.
I may be speaking out of turn as I have zero experience in any other
UL except Kolbs and Burt Howland's Honeybee.
A good piece of teaching video!!!
john h
MKIII
PS: This one ought to be archived so others can refresh themselves
prior to engine failure.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com> |
| Subject: | Re: UL crash video |
I dunno........?? I've got a few hours in a Quicksilver 2 seater, and it
was tough to get used to landing procedure. Coming in on final at 300 ft,
the instructor told me (and showed me) to wait till the numbers were between
my feet, chop the throttle, point the nose down and keep the Hall airspeed
indicator at 45 mph (if I remember right) and flare at the very last second.
It was a little (??) hair raising at 1st, and we came down very
steeply.......I'd guess at a 45 deg angle, and we'd touch down not much past
the numbers. Not much of a glide ratio there.
I think you and John are right, tho'. Looks like he forgot to fly the
plane, for all the time he had TO fly it.
Lar.
Larry Bourne
Palm Springs, CA
Building Kolb Mk III
N78LB Vamoose
www.gogittum.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chuck Stonex" <cstonex(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: UL crash video
>
> Looked like to me that he forgot to fly the plane. Looked like a Quick
> Silver which as I understand it has a good glide ratio.
>
>
> | the repeat. Remember....ALTITUDE IS OUR FRIEND.
> |
> |
> | http://www.frogflyers.com/CrashVideo.wmv
> |
> |
> | Barry
>
> Mike S/Gang:
>
> Take particular note what this pilot does when the engine quits. He
> has just passed over a long straight dirt/gravel road. Instead of
> banking left and pushing the stick forward, he immediately tries to
> make the UL levitate by pulling all the way back on the control stick.
> No wonder it went down so fast. He stalled the aircraft before it
> went into the trees.
>
> I may be speaking out of turn as I have zero experience in any other
> UL except Kolbs and Burt Howland's Honeybee.
>
> A good piece of teaching video!!!
>
> john h
> MKIII
>
> PS: This one ought to be archived so others can refresh themselves
> prior to engine failure.
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Stonex" <cstonex(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: UL crash video |
Sounds like landing T-Bird. IT has the trajectory of a 300 lb box of rocks.
I have never flown Quick Silver. I always thought they had a good ratio. But
I have flown T-Bird.
I dunno........?? I've got a few hours in a Quicksilver 2 seater, and it
was tough to get used to landing procedure. Coming in on final at 300 ft,
the instructor told me (and showed me) to wait till the numbers were between
my feet, chop the throttle, point the nose down and keep the Hall airspeed
indicator at 45 mph (if I remember right) and flare at the very last second.
It was a little (??) hair raising at 1st, and we came down very
steeply.......I'd guess at a 45 deg angle, and we'd touch down not much past
the numbers. Not much of a glide ratio there.
I think you and John are right, tho'. Looks like he forgot to fly the
plane, for all the time he had TO fly it.
Lar.
Larry Bourne
Palm Springs, CA
Building Kolb Mk III
N78LB Vamoose
www.gogittum.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chuck Stonex" <cstonex(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: UL crash video
>
> Looked like to me that he forgot to fly the plane. Looked like a Quick
> Silver which as I understand it has a good glide ratio.
>
>
>
> | the repeat. Remember....ALTITUDE IS OUR FRIEND.
> |
> |
> | http://www.frogflyers.com/CrashVideo.wmv
> |
> |
> | Barry
>
> Mike S/Gang:
>
> Take particular note what this pilot does when the engine quits. He
> has just passed over a long straight dirt/gravel road. Instead of
> banking left and pushing the stick forward, he immediately tries to
> make the UL levitate by pulling all the way back on the control stick.
> No wonder it went down so fast. He stalled the aircraft before it
> went into the trees.
>
> I may be speaking out of turn as I have zero experience in any other
> UL except Kolbs and Burt Howland's Honeybee.
>
> A good piece of teaching video!!!
>
> john h
> MKIII
>
> PS: This one ought to be archived so others can refresh themselves
> prior to engine failure.
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ray anderson <rsanoa(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: UL crash video |
Another example of where a BRS Ballistic might have spared him a lot of misery.
Like the American Express Card add says, "Never leave home without it".
Mike Schnabel wrote:
Received this from EAA 104 Ultralight member, thought it was worth passing along...
Note: forwarded message attached.
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From: trimspeed
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Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:20:32 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: [ultralightchapter104] UL crash video
--hkdbIZrBjBWhOIUaLID6TH0hdAXOhck3QCjMg6d
Great video Barry. Four seconds from engine stoppage
to impact. The FAA says it takes a pilot about five
seconds after an engine failure to realize what has
happened. Only then can the pilot begin to perform
the emergency procedures.
Powerful...thanks for sending the link.
-Gary
--- beartooth37129 wrote:
> I don't know if any of you have seen this or not. If
> so....sorry for
> the repeat. Remember...."ALTITUDE IS OUR FRIEND".
>
>
> http://www.frogflyers.com/CrashVideo.wmv
>
>
> Barry
>
>
>
--hkdbIZrBjBWhOIUaLID6TH0hdAXOhck3QCjMg6d
Great video Barry. Four seconds from engine stoppage
to impact. The FAA says it takes a pilot about five
seconds after an engine failure to realize what has
happened. Only then can the pilot begin to perform
the emergency procedures.
Powerful...thanks for sending the link.
-Gary
--- beartooth37129 barryglenn(at)comcast.net wrote:
I don't know if any of you have seen this or not. If
so....sorry for
the repeat. Remember....ALTITUDE IS OUR FRIEND.
http://www.frogflyers.com/CrashVideo.wmv
Barry
Visit your group "ultralightchapter104" on the web.
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
ultralightchapter104-unsubscribe(at)yahoogroups.com
--hkdbIZrBjBWhOIUaLID6TH0hdAXOhck3QCjMg6d--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: UL crash video |
what this pilot does when the engine quits.>>
Yes John,
I noticed that. He was not far above the tree tops but it looked as though
there was just about enough room to dive left to the road.
Shows the downside of openair flying. No fuselage to protect you.
He was really unlucky to collect all those imjuries though.
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | russ kinne <kinnepix(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: UL crash video |
Some things to be learned here --
1 NO shoulder belts!
2 It would have been so easy to stay over the nearby road, 'just in
case'.
Don't they teach this any more?
On Sep 4, 2005, at 9:30 PM, Mike Schnabel wrote:
>
> Received this from EAA 104 Ultralight member, thought it was worth
> passing along...
>
> Note: forwarded message attached.
>
> Authentication-Results: mta105.mail.mud.yahoo.com
> from=yahoogroups.com; domainkeys=pass (ok)
> To: ultralightchapter104(at)yahoogroups.com
> From: trimspeed <trimspeed(at)yahoo.com>
> List-Id:
> List-Unsubscribe:
>
> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:20:32 -0700 (PDT)
> Subject: Re: [ultralightchapter104] UL crash video
>
> --hkdbIZrBjBWhOIUaLID6TH0hdAXOhck3QCjMg6d
>
> Great video Barry. Four seconds from engine stoppage
> to impact. The FAA says it takes a pilot about five
> seconds after an engine failure to realize what has
> happened. Only then can the pilot begin to perform
> the emergency procedures.
>
> Powerful...thanks for sending the link.
>
> -Gary
>
> --- beartooth37129 wrote:
>
>> I don't know if any of you have seen this or not. If
>> so....sorry for
>> the repeat. Remember...."ALTITUDE IS OUR FRIEND".
>>
>>
>> http://www.frogflyers.com/CrashVideo.wmv
>>
>>
>> Barry
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --hkdbIZrBjBWhOIUaLID6TH0hdAXOhck3QCjMg6d
>
>
>
> Great video Barry. Four seconds from engine stoppage
>
> to impact. The FAA says it takes a pilot about five
>
> seconds after an engine failure to realize what has
>
> happened. Only then can the pilot begin to perform
>
> the emergency procedures.
>
>
> Powerful...thanks for sending the link.
>
>
> -Gary
>
>
> --- beartooth37129 barryglenn(at)comcast.net wrote:
August 05, 2005 - September 05, 2005
Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-fn