Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-gj

November 13, 2006 - December 01, 2006



      
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________________________________________________________________________________
From: APilot(at)webtv.net
Date: Nov 13, 2006
Subject: Re: Fall Color From a Kolb
Drifter are great, but what was wrong with the Hummer? ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 13, 2006
From: "Vic Peters" <vicsvinyl(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Fall Color From a Kolb
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Fall Color From a Kolb
From: "olendorf" <olendorf(at)gmail.com>
Date: Nov 13, 2006
OK, I want to play too. Here is Tomhannock reservoir near Albany, NY. There was a flight of 4 A10's flying by. One of the rocked his wings so he must have had radar lock on me. I grabbed a handful of chaff just in case. [Wink] -------- Scott Olendorf Schenectady, NY Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74149#74149 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/a10_128.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Fall Color From a Kolb
From: "John Williamson" <kolbrapilot1(at)comcast.net>
Date: Nov 13, 2006
Well, the original post got several Kolbers to post some photos of color. But where are the photos from the rest of you fliers? -------- John Williamson Arlington, TX Kolbra, 912ULS http://home.comcast.net/~kolbrapilot1 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74168#74168 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Firestar II HKS Conversion
Date: Nov 13, 2006
| > I'm hoping to test fly it shortly after the first of the year. | > | > -------- | > Dave Bigelow Dave: Rather than place all your test results on one prop, coordination with Daryl at Warp Drive might get you some different props to test with the HKS and the FSII. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HShack(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 13, 2006
Subject: Re: Firestar II HKS Conversion
In a message dated 11/13/2006 10:31:53 AM Eastern Standard Time, jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com writes: Dave: Rather than place all your test results on one prop, coordination with Daryl at Warp Drive might get you some different props to test with the HKS and the FSII. john h mkIII Since he will run a "B" box, maybe a Warp Drive will be too heavy? Howard Shackleford FS II SC ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Fall Color From a Kolb
From: "George Alexander" <gtalexander(at)att.net>
Date: Nov 13, 2006
John Williamson wrote: > Well, the original post got several Kolbers to post some photos of color. But where are the photos from the rest of you fliers? No mountains but plenty of color in FL in the Fall. [Wink] -------- George Alexander http://gtalexander.home.att.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74234#74234 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/fall_in_fl_312.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Firestar II HKS Conversion
Date: Nov 13, 2006
| Since he will run a "B" box, maybe a Warp Drive will be too heavy? | | Howard Shackleford Shack: I don't know. Does the HKS, in fact, use a Rotax B gearbox? I have very little, zero, knowledge of the HKS. My concern is to give the engine a fair shake on the FSII. Running one prop, which I also know nothing about, IMHO, would not be a fair test. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Fw: KITPLANES Completions
Date: Nov 13, 2006
Hi Gang: Travis asked me to send the following email from Kit Planes reference their Completions column each month. If you have completed your airplane, get a picture and description of it in Kit Planes which is an International Mag. Thanks, john h mkIII | | ----- Original Message ----- | From: "Julia Downie" <downie(at)djdownie.com> | To: | Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2006 8:56 PM | Subject: KITPLANES Completions | | | > Dear Aircraft Designer/Manufacturer: | > | > Wouldn't you love to see your company's aircraft published in KITPLANES | > magazine at no cost to you? Make it happen by urging your customers to | > submit their story and photo to us for "Completions"-the most popular | > feature in the magazine showing (your customer's) new homebuilt. We do our | > best to publish every item submitted for this section, generally in the | > order in which the submission was received. | > | > Each submission should include: | > | > A brief (200 words maximum) description of the completed homebuilt that | > has already been flown. Have your builders include details on | > construction, | > the panel, interior and any unique features. | > | > Digital images are preferable as long as they are high resolution. | > (900x1500 pixels minimum; that highest output from a 2-megapixel camera | > will | > do it.) Images should be sent in .JPG form but .TIF or .EPS are | > acceptable. | > | > All materials can be sent by e-mail to completions(at)kitplanes.com | > Please | > ask the builder to indicate whether we may publish his or her street | > address | > and/or e-mail address in case other builders would like to contact them. | > | > Many companies offer an incentive ranging from T-shirt and cap to $100 | > cash | > or credit for each submission we publish. Be sure to remind your builders | > often and list the criteria (or a link to our site: | > http://www.kitplanes.com/hobby/completions.html | > in your newsletter, on your web site, in newsgroups, etc. | > | > Thanks for helping us feature your customers' homebuilts in KITPLANES | > magazine. | > | > Happy landings, | > The KITPLANES Staff | > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 13, 2006
From: Michael Sharp <kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com>
Subject: Re: Fw: KITPLANES Completions
Many companies offer an incentive ranging from T-shirt and cap to $100 | > cash | > or credit for each submission we publish. Be sure to remind your builders I know Sonex gives out a cap for submission to either EAA or Kitplanes... Does TNK have an offer??? Just wondering.... Do Not Acrhive Mike John Hauck wrote: Hi Gang: Travis asked me to send the following email from Kit Planes reference their Completions column each month. If you have completed your airplane, get a picture and description of it in Kit Planes which is an International Mag. Thanks, john h mkIII | | ----- Original Message ----- | From: "Julia Downie" | To: | Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2006 8:56 PM | Subject: KITPLANES Completions | | | > Dear Aircraft Designer/Manufacturer: | > | > Wouldn't you love to see your company's aircraft published in KITPLANES | > magazine at no cost to you? Make it happen by urging your customers to | > submit their story and photo to us for "Completions"-the most popular | > feature in the magazine showing (your customer's) new homebuilt. We do our | > best to publish every item submitted for this section, generally in the | > order in which the submission was received. | > | > Each submission should include: | > | > A brief (200 words maximum) description of the completed homebuilt that | > has already been flown. Have your builders include details on | > construction, | > the panel, interior and any unique features. | > | > Digital images are preferable as long as they are high resolution. | > (900x1500 pixels minimum; that highest output from a 2-megapixel camera | > will | > do it.) Images should be sent in .JPG form but .TIF or .EPS are | > acceptable. | > | > All materials can be sent by e-mail to completions(at)kitplanes.com | > Please | > ask the builder to indicate whether we may publish his or her street | > address | > and/or e-mail address in case other builders would like to contact them. | > | > Many companies offer an incentive ranging from T-shirt and cap to $100 | > cash | > or credit for each submission we publish. Be sure to remind your builders | > often and list the criteria (or a link to our site: | > http://www.kitplanes.com/hobby/completions.html | > in your newsletter, on your web site, in newsgroups, etc. | > | > Thanks for helping us feature your customers' homebuilts in KITPLANES | > magazine. | > | > Happy landings, | > The KITPLANES Staff | > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 13, 2006
From: "Richard Girard" <jindoguy(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Firestar II HKS Conversion
John, HKS specs their 2.58 box for the same inertia limits as the Rotax B, 3000kg/cm^2. The 3.47 box is rated the same as the Rotax C and E, 6000kg/cm^2. At the flex wing and powered parachute LSA repairman classes I was at last week we did an inertia check on a 68 X 40 Tennessee Props wood two blade. According to the charts published by CPS, it was right at the upper limit for the Rotax B. Rick On 11/13/06, John Hauck wrote: > > > | Since he will run a "B" box, maybe a Warp Drive will be too heavy? > | > | Howard Shackleford > > Shack: > > I don't know. Does the HKS, in fact, use a Rotax B gearbox? > > I have very little, zero, knowledge of the HKS. > > My concern is to give the engine a fair shake on the FSII. Running > one prop, which I also know nothing about, IMHO, would not be a fair > test. > > john h > mkIII > > -- Rick Girard "Ya'll drop on in" takes on a whole new meaning when you live at the airport. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Fw: KITPLANES Completions
Date: Nov 13, 2006
| I know Sonex gives out a cap for submission to either EAA or Kitplanes... Does TNK have an offer??? | | Just wondering.... | | Do Not Acrhive | Mike Mike: I don't know, but sounds like a good idea. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Firestar II HKS Conversion
Date: Nov 13, 2006
| According to the charts published by CPS, it was right at the upper limit | for the Rotax B. | | Rick Rick: That is not much capability. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 13, 2006
From: Bob Noyer <a58r(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Fall Color From a Kolb (not)
Old pix of northern Shenandoah Valley...same every year, though. regards, Bob N. FireFly 070 Old Kolb http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 13, 2006
From: "Richard Girard" <jindoguy(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Firestar II HKS Conversion
Yeah, I know. I just got an HKS on a Northwing trike, but I got the 3.47box. The trike came with a medium three blade Ivo and I'm going to be real surprised if the moment of inertia falls within that 6000kg cm^2 limit. If it doesn't, I guess I can try it as a two blade. Rick On 11/13/06, John Hauck wrote: > > > | According to the charts published by CPS, it was right at the upper > limit > | for the Rotax B. > | > | Rick > > Rick: > > That is not much capability. > > john h > mkIII > > -- Rick Girard "Ya'll drop on in" takes on a whole new meaning when you live at the airport. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 13, 2006
Dave was killed this morning when his Kolb went down with another man. Both were killed instantly. Many of the Kolb flyers on this list knew him and his wife Eve from M V. It would be nice if you could send condolences to his wife. Mrs. Eve Pelletier 1134 Fair St. Prescott, Az. 86305 Az. Bald Eagle ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 13, 2006
What do you say ?? Dave's one of the nicer guys around. Ah, George, I'm so very sorry to hear this. Have you heard how it happened ?? Lar. Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: George Thompson To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 4:30 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Dave was killed this morning when his Kolb went down with another man. Both were killed instantly. Many of the Kolb flyers on this list knew him and his wife Eve from M V. It would be nice if you could send condolences to his wife. Mrs. Eve Pelletier 1134 Fair St. Prescott, Az. 86305 Az. Bald Eagle ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "kfackler" <kfackler(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 13, 2006
What a tragedy! Dave was one of the nicest members of this group. A couple of years ago when I temporarily lost the use of my right eye, David went to great links to provide support and encouragement. Had it not been for him, I might have given up flying altogether. He will be sorely missed. My prayers will be with Eve. GEORGE: Is it possible you could arrange for flowers at the funeral on behalf of this group? I would certainly be willing to contribute toward such. -Ken Fackler Kolb Mark II / A722KWF Rochester MI ----- Original Message ----- From: To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 7:30 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Dave was killed this morning when his Kolb went down with another man. Both were killed instantly. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 13, 2006
From: "David Lehman" <david(at)davidlehman.net>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Here's more information, so sad... *11/13/2006 5:37:00 PM * *Email this article- Print this article * *Two people die in light aircraft crash near Paulden * *Accident is third area plane crash in 10 weeks* *By MIRSADA BURIC* The Daily Courier PRESCOTT - A Prescott pilot and a passenger died Monday morning when an experimental/light sport aircraft crashed near Pilots Rest Airstrip in Paulden, about five miles west of Highway 89. David Arthur Pelletier, 68, and his passenger Michael Francis Maikowski, 54 , of Kent, Wash., didn't show any signs of life when first responders arrived . A Falcon Way resident called 911 at 10:27 a.m. to report the crash after sh e and her husband saw the Kolb MK3 wreckage in their driveway. Sally Strickland-McAleenan and Ken McAleenan said they didn't see the actua l crash, but they heard a loud noise. After Strickland-McAleenan reported the crash, she rushed to help the victims. "There was absolutely no life in there," she said. "It is so sad." She remained on the scene until the first Chino Valley Fire engine arrived, she said. A couple of other witnesses were in the area, she said, and they told her that they saw the plane flying northwest toward nearby mountains, and as it made a turn it dove into the ground. Strickland-McAleenan said she and her husband were familiar with the aircraft because Pelletier often flew in the area. According to Federal Aviation Administration spokesman Ian Gregor, the aircraft took off from the airstrip branching off Falcon Way. Strickland-McAleenan said, "This is a grandfathered airstrip. It has been there since the World War II" when the military used it to practice touch and go landings and take-offs, she said. "Most of the people like the airstrip and use it quite often." As he watched authorities remove the bodies from the wreckage, Paulden resident Ron Stoks said, "It looks like a hard hit." Stoks heard of the crash from a friend and rushed to the scene to see it fo r himself. He said he knew Pelletier for 10 years. "He just got a sport-pilot license," said Stoks, who also owns an experimental aircraft. "He was flying a lot here. He had fun giving rides." Because his friend was safety-minded, Stoks said, he wouldn't board the plane if he thought that it had a mechanical problem. A few days before the October air show at the Prescott Airport, Stoks said, he and Pelletier flew in the DC3 with William "Billy" Friedman, a 40-year pilot who died in the Oct. 18 plane crash that also killed four other peopl e on board. Coincidently, Friedman saw the Sept. 2 plane crash that killed two adults and a teenager near the Pi=F1on Oaks subdivision in Prescott. The National Transportation Safety Board is still investigating the previou s two incidents. Gregor said a Scottsdale-based FAA crew and NTSB will investigate this incident also. Contact the reporter at mburic(at)prescottaz.com DVD On 11/13/06, George Thompson wrote: > > Dave was killed this morning when his Kolb went down with another man. > Both were killed instantly. Many of the Kolb flyers on this list knew him > and his wife Eve from M V. > It would be nice if you could send condolences to his wife. > Mrs. Eve Pelletier > 1134 Fair St. > Prescott, Az. 86305 > > Az. Bald Eagle > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Dalton" <wiserguy(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 13, 2006
Eve, George and All I am very sad to hear of this tragedy, as Ken and Larry have mentioned Dave was just the nicest guy. My first year at MV Dave saw me sitting on the sidelines just chomping at the bit to get my first ride in a Kolb. Dave ever so smoothly mentioned to Boyd Young, how about taking this guy up and I was airborne within minutes. Dave and Eve were just perfect for making us new guys feel at home with everyone. Dave I will greatly miss you my friend and Eve I am so sorry for your loss. Ken great idea for the flowers, I will standby for further info. Bob D. Manteca, CA _____ From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of kfackler Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 4:59 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave What a tragedy! Dave was one of the nicest members of this group. A couple of years ago when I temporarily lost the use of my right eye, David went to great links to provide support and encouragement. Had it not been for him, I might have given up flying altogether. He will be sorely missed. My prayers will be with Eve. GEORGE: Is it possible you could arrange for flowers at the funeral on behalf of this group? I would certainly be willing to contribute toward such. -Ken Fackler Kolb Mark II / A722KWF Rochester MI ----- Original Message ----- From: <mailto:eagle1(at)commspeed.net> Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 7:30 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Dave was killed this morning when his Kolb went down with another man. Both were killed instantly. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 13, 2006
GEORGE: Is it possible you could arrange for flowers at the funeral on behalf of this group? I would certainly be willing to contribute toward such. -Ken Fackler Ken: Excellent idea. Count me in. hauck's holler is a very sad place tonight. I lost a good buddy. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 13, 2006
From: Bob Noyer <a58r(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
I'm in...lemme know. regards, Bob N. FireFly 070 Old Kolb http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Arksey(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 13, 2006
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Ken, count me in on flowers and let me know. I did not know Dave but sure feel bad about losing a fellow Kolber. Jim Swan firestar ll michigan ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 13, 2006
This is just too sad! I always enjoyed his posts. My condolences to his family and many friends. Ed in JXN ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 13, 2006
Larry, Of couce it is not official because the NTSB are going to investigate it because he had just registered the Kolb as a sport certified plane.They had been doing touch and go's all morning. I don't know how big (heavy) the passenger was but it is my and most others that he made a low level turn and just stalled and spun in. He only had a 282 Rotax on it. It went in straight down. No chance for his chute. Since he was in the pattern, I doubt that they were more than4-500 feet high. our field is 4500 feet. George ----- Original Message ----- From: Larry Bourne To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 6:43 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave What do you say ?? Dave's one of the nicer guys around. Ah, George, I'm so very sorry to hear this. Have you heard how it happened ?? Lar. Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: George Thompson To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 4:30 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Dave was killed this morning when his Kolb went down with another man. Both were killed instantly. Many of the Kolb flyers on this list knew him and his wife Eve from M V. It would be nice if you could send condolences to his wife. Mrs. Eve Pelletier 1134 Fair St. Prescott, Az. 86305 Az. Bald Eagle href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- 11/12/2006 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Need 503 help!
From: "John Jung" <jrjungjr(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Nov 13, 2006
Group, Last Friday, I flew my Firestar for the first time since last spring. No problems at all until I shut the engine off on the runway to get out and measure a short landing. When I got back in the plane, it would not fire, not even once. Today, I pulled the plugs out put them back in the caps, and cranked the engine over while watching for spark. No spark on any of the 4 plugs. Next, I disconnected both "kill" wires at the engine to isolate my wiring and switch. Still no spark. I pulled the flywheel to inspect for damage underneath. Eveything looked normal. I'm at a loss. I don't know what to do next. Ideas? -------- John Jung Firestar II N6163J Surprise, AZ Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74404#74404 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 13, 2006
Eve says she does not want any more flowers. Dave's passion was Kids. He was very much into the Young Eagles program.She requests that you make all donations to the EAA Young Eagles Program in Dave's name. I will get a phone number and E mail address tomorrow.Thanks for your concern. Az. Bald Eagle ----- Original Message ----- From: David Lehman To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 6:07 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Here's more information, so sad... 11/13/2006 5:37:00 PM Email this article - Print this article Two people die in light aircraft crash near Paulden Accident is third area plane crash in 10 weeks By MIRSADA BURIC The Daily Courier PRESCOTT - A Prescott pilot and a passenger died Monday morning when an experimental/light sport aircraft crashed near Pilots Rest Airstrip in Paulden, about five miles west of Highway 89. David Arthur Pelletier, 68, and his passenger Michael Francis Maikowski, 54, of Kent, Wash., didn't show any signs of life when first responders arrived. A Falcon Way resident called 911 at 10:27 a.m. to report the crash after she and her husband saw the Kolb MK3 wreckage in their driveway. Sally Strickland-McAleenan and Ken McAleenan said they didn't see the actual crash, but they heard a loud noise. After Strickland-McAleenan reported the crash, she rushed to help the victims. "There was absolutely no life in there," she said. "It is so sad." She remained on the scene until the first Chino Valley Fire engine arrived, she said. A couple of other witnesses were in the area, she said, and they told her that they saw the plane flying northwest toward nearby mountains, and as it made a turn it dove into the ground. Strickland-McAleenan said she and her husband were familiar with the aircraft because Pelletier often flew in the area. According to Federal Aviation Administration spokesman Ian Gregor, the aircraft took off from the airstrip branching off Falcon Way. Strickland-McAleenan said, "This is a grandfathered airstrip. It has been there since the World War II" when the military used it to practice touch and go landings and take-offs, she said. "Most of the people like the airstrip and use it quite often." As he watched authorities remove the bodies from the wreckage, Paulden resident Ron Stoks said, "It looks like a hard hit." Stoks heard of the crash from a friend and rushed to the scene to see it for himself. He said he knew Pelletier for 10 years. "He just got a sport-pilot license," said Stoks, who also owns an experimental aircraft. "He was flying a lot here. He had fun giving rides." Because his friend was safety-minded, Stoks said, he wouldn't board the plane if he thought that it had a mechanical problem. A few days before the October air show at the Prescott Airport, Stoks said, he and Pelletier flew in the DC3 with William "Billy" Friedman, a 40-year pilot who died in the Oct. 18 plane crash that also killed four other people on board. Coincidently, Friedman saw the Sept. 2 plane crash that killed two adults and a teenager near the Pi=F1on Oaks subdivision in Prescott. The National Transportation Safety Board is still investigating the previous two incidents. Gregor said a Scottsdale-based FAA crew and NTSB will investigate this incident also. Contact the reporter at mburic(at)prescottaz.com DVD On 11/13/06, George Thompson wrote: Dave was killed this morning when his Kolb went down with another man. Both were killed instantly. Many of the Kolb flyers on this list knew him and his wife Eve from M V. It would be nice if you could send condolences to his wife. Mrs. Eve Pelletier 1134 Fair St. Prescott, Az. 86305 Az. Bald Eagle ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- 11/12/2006 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Need 503 help!
Date: Nov 13, 2006
Eveything looked normal. I'm at a loss. I don't know what to do next. Ideas? | | -------- | John Jung JJ: Get the Rotax book off the internet that has the procedure for checking ignition modules, coils, alternator stator, etc. Call Ronnie Smith at South Mississippi Light Aircraft and he can lead you in the right direction. There is a pretty simple check list for the 912 engines which use similar electrical/ign components, but different values. Personally, I hate electrical problems, engine and avionics. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Vamoose
Date: Nov 13, 2006
Too bad I didn't get around to saying this a day earlier....... I pulled the ad for Vamoose off Barnstormers last week, and when I get set up here in NM, I'll figure out a way to bring airplane and boat both back to Santa Fe. Not quite sure what I'll do for an engine yet, but that troublesome reduction drive is long ago in the trash, so's I can't be tempted again. Sorry, Dave - I wish you could've seen it fly. Lar. Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Vic" <vicw(at)vcn.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List Digest: 23 Msgs - 11/12/06
Date: Nov 13, 2006
I have very sad news to report. Dave Pelletier, known as AZ Dave to the list died in a plane crash this morning. Dave was a good friend and will be missed by many people. Vic Worthington ________________________________________________________________________________
From: APilot(at)webtv.net
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Subject: Re: half doors
I took Richard's advice and made 1/2 doors for my Mark III Classic. I flew it with the half door on the pilot side and no door on the other side. It worked out really good for taking pictures and there is almost no wind hitting me. Thanks Richard. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Thom Riddle <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: Fall Color From a KolbFall Color From a Kolb
Date: Nov 14, 2006
.... Last year I got to fly an original Firestar that was under 300 pounds, maybe even part 103 legal. It felt about the same way.... Richard Pike..... Richard, I used to own an early Firestar but have never flown a MkIII. Was the above statement comparing the Firestar to the MkIII or the Hummer? Never having flown a Hummer either I'm trying to figure out which airplane's handling characteristics are similar to the early Firestar. There may be other Kolbers who have flown one type but not the other and might like to know too. Thanks in advance for your clarification. Attached are a few photos taken on Oct 7 on my flight to Old Rhinebeck Aerodrome near Kingston, NY. Anyone in that area during the summer should take the time to see their antique airs how on weekends. They have a good website with videos of several of their antiques flying. If I've mentioned this before, forgive my aging memory. http://www.oldrhinebeck.org/ Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 14, 2006
From: "David Lehman" <david(at)davidlehman.net>
Subject: Re: Fall Color From a KolbFall Color From a Kolb
OK, I picked on the Texans about the "mountains", so where's the concrete in the NY pictures?... They have trees in NY?... ;-) I know there's brands X, Y & Z, but the pictures I enjoy the most come from "brand" Kolb... Thanx Thom... DVD On 11/14/06, Thom Riddle wrote: > > > .... Last year I got to fly an original Firestar that was under 300 > pounds, maybe even part 103 legal. It felt about > the same way.... Richard Pike..... > > > Richard, > I used to own an early Firestar but have never flown a MkIII. Was the > above statement comparing the Firestar to the MkIII or the Hummer? > Never having flown a Hummer either I'm trying to figure out which > airplane's handling characteristics are similar to the early Firestar. > There may be other Kolbers who have flown one type but not the other > and might like to know too. > > Thanks in advance for your clarification. > > Attached are a few photos taken on Oct 7 on my flight to Old Rhinebeck > Aerodrome near Kingston, NY. Anyone in that area during the summer > should take the time to see their antique airs how on weekends. They > have a good website with videos of several of their antiques flying. If > I've mentioned this before, forgive my aging memory. > > http://www.oldrhinebeck.org/ > > > Thom in Buffalo > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 14, 2006
From: TheWanderingWench <thewanderingwench(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
When Doug (Sky Raider) and I (Maxair Drifter) flew into Gouldings, MV this past May, we wondered if we'd gotten the dates wrong - the airstrip looked deserted from a distance. As we got closer we saw a single long white trailer - and a beautiful Kolb being unloaded. Arizona Dave was the first Kolber we met, and his instant warmth an friendliness let us know this was going to be a great weekend. I remember spending time with him, Eve and George, sharing Cherry Garcia ice cream in their motor home, talking about flying, motorcycling, and being human. Lots of memories of him and Eve packed into a short time. Although I didn't know him very long or well, I feel his loss acutely. I was so looking forward to reconnecting with him in MV in 2007 - I envy those of you who knew him well. Arty --- George Thompson wrote: > Dave was killed this morning when his Kolb went down > with another man. Both were killed instantly. Many > of the Kolb flyers on this list knew him and his > wife Eve from M V. > It would be nice if you could send condolences > to his wife. > Mrs. Eve Pelletier > 1134 Fair St. > Prescott, Az. 86305 > > Az. Bald Eagle www.LessonsFromTheEdge.com "Life's a daring adventure or nothing" Helen Keller "I refuse to tip toe through life just to arrive safely at death." ________________________________________________________________________________
From: russ kinne <kinnepix(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: If You Got This Email, You Haven't Made A Contribution
Yet! :-)
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Matt I need your snailmail address -- On Nov 8, 2006, at 3:11 AM, Matt Dralle wrote: > > If you received this particular Matronics List Email message, its > because you haven't yet made a Contribution to support your Lists! > This is the first PBS-like funds drive message under the new > distribution system. The new system selectively sends out the > Contribution messages ONLY to those that forgot to whip out the 'ol > credit card this year to support the continued operation and > upgrade of the Matronics Email Lists! Don't you wish PBS worked > that way? :-) > > You heard that right. Once you make your Contribution, these > support requests messages during November will suddenly stop coming > to your personal email inbox! Pardon me if I seem kind of excited > about the new feature. I've wanted to implement something like > this for a number of years now, but it was always such a daunting > task to modify the back-end List processing code, that I just kept > putting it off. Finally this year, I just decided to bite the > bullet and put the code-pounding time it to make it work. A few > days later, bam! A working system! > > Anyway, I'll stop gushing now. I really do appreciate each and > every one of your individual Contributions to support the Lists. > It is your support that enables me to upgrade the hardware and > software that are required to run a List Site like this. It also > goes to pay for the Commercial-Grade Internet connection and to pay > the rather huge electric bill to keep the computer gear running and > the air conditioner powered up. > > Your personal Contribution matters because when combined with other > Listers such as yourself, it pays the bills to keep this site up > and running. I accept exactly ZERO advertising dollars for the > Matronics Lists sites. I can't stand the pop-up ads and all other > commercialism that is so prevalent on the Internet these days and I > particularly don't want to have it on my Email List site. I'm > pretty sure you don't either. > > If you appreciate the ad-free, grass-roots, down-home feel of the > Matronics Email Lists, please make a Contribution today to keep it > that way!! > > http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > Thank you! > > Matt Dralle > Matronics Email List Administrator > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: See'm fly at Rheinebeck -was fall color
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Apple-Mail-51-528232498-- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: See'm fly at Rheinebeck -was fall color
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Apple-Mail-54-528254942 Apple-Mail-55-528254946 Apple-Mail-56-528254949-- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: See'm fly at Rheinebeck -was fall color
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Apple-Mail-59-528269299 Apple-Mail-60-528269303-- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Edward Bonsell" <ebonsell(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Firestar Fuel Tank
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Friends, This is my first post to the list in a long time. I have an original Firestar. Built it in 1986 & 87. Flew it until 2000 when it suffered an unfortunate event. I started to rebuild it but job, family, mistakes, ect. got in the way and I had to shelve it. I now have more time so I got it out and dusted it off. I hope to have it back in the air in 2007. I'll post some stories and photo's of some of our great trips we had around here, (SE PA). I'm also interested in a Firestar fuel tank conversion. I replaced the original 5 gallon tank with an 8 gallon tank the from the auto racing industry. It's heavy, barely fits, and I was never really happy with it. I hope to replace it with something better. I'm also looking for MK II in good condition. Does anyone know of one for sale? I'm sorry to hear about Dave. We have lost several pilots around here. Two due to engine failure on take off leading to a stall/spin. One of which tried to turn around and go back to the field. A third due to unsafe flying techniques. Please be careful out there. Sincerely, Ed Bonsell ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: See'm fly at Rheinebeck -was fall color
Date: Nov 14, 2006
OOOPS! Looks like I did something wrong. I try again later. On Nov 14, 2006, at 10:44 AM, Eugene Zimmerman wrote: > Apple-Mail-59-528269299 > Apple-Mail-60-528269303-- > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Travis Brown (Kolb Aircraft)" <travis(at)tnkolbaircraft.com>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 14, 2006
This is such A loss to our Kolb family. I never had the privilege of meeting Dave in person,but did talk with him on the phone several times.It was always such A pleasure to hear his happy cheerful voice.Our sincere condolences to the families Kolb Aircraft ----- Original Message ----- From: George Thompson To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 7:30 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Dave was killed this morning when his Kolb went down with another man. Both were killed instantly. Many of the Kolb flyers on this list knew him and his wife Eve from M V. It would be nice if you could send condolences to his wife. Mrs. Eve Pelletier 1134 Fair St. Prescott, Az. 86305 Az. Bald Eagle ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: See'm fly at Rheinebeck -was fall color
From: "Eugene Zimmerman" <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Nov 14, 2006
See'm fly at Rheinbeck Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74529#74529 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/9_961.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/8_212.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/7_730.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/6_299.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/5_628.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/4_924.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/3_115.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/2_893.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/1_118.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 14, 2006
From: chris davis <capedavis(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Vamoose
Larry Glad you made that choice ! it will all work out Good luck and please stay on the list and keep us informed and entertained . Chris Davis Larry Bourne wrote: Too bad I didn't get around to saying this a day earlier....... I pulled the ad for Vamoose off Barnstormers last week, and when I get set up here in NM, I'll figure out a way to bring airplane and boat both back to Santa Fe. Not quite sure what I'll do for an engine yet, but that troublesome reduction drive is long ago in the trash, so's I can't be tempted again. Sorry, Dave - I wish you could've seen it fly. Lar. Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com --------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 14, 2006
I just talked to Marsha at the EAA headquarters.Dave's wife, Eve told me that she would rather have donations made to the EAA Young Eagles program than flowers You can send checks to phone#1 800 564 6322 EAA Aviation Center PO Box 3086 Oshkosh Wisconsin 54906 Put on the check, For the Dave Pelletier memorial. His wife's name is Eve for those of you who do not know, at 1134 Fair St. Prescott, Az. 86305 Funeral arrangements are still to be made, but she told me that she is going to have him buried in Arlington National Cemetery. I am going to miss Dave very much as he was my closest friend here in Prescott. George Thompson Az. Bald Eagle ----- Original Message ----- From: George Thompson To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 7:31 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Eve says she does not want any more flowers. Dave's passion was Kids. He was very much into the Young Eagles program.She requests that you make all donations to the EAA Young Eagles Program in Dave's name. I will get a phone number and E mail address tomorrow.Thanks for your concern. Az. Bald Eagle ----- Original Message ----- From: David Lehman To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 6:07 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Here's more information, so sad... 11/13/2006 5:37:00 PM Email this article - Print this article Two people die in light aircraft crash near Paulden Accident is third area plane crash in 10 weeks By MIRSADA BURIC The Daily Courier PRESCOTT - A Prescott pilot and a passenger died Monday morning when an experimental/light sport aircraft crashed near Pilots Rest Airstrip in Paulden, about five miles west of Highway 89. David Arthur Pelletier, 68, and his passenger Michael Francis Maikowski, 54, of Kent, Wash., didn't show any signs of life when first responders arrived. A Falcon Way resident called 911 at 10:27 a.m. to report the crash after she and her husband saw the Kolb MK3 wreckage in their driveway. Sally Strickland-McAleenan and Ken McAleenan said they didn't see the actual crash, but they heard a loud noise. After Strickland-McAleenan reported the crash, she rushed to help the victims. "There was absolutely no life in there," she said. "It is so sad." She remained on the scene until the first Chino Valley Fire engine arrived, she said. A couple of other witnesses were in the area, she said, and they told her that they saw the plane flying northwest toward nearby mountains, and as it made a turn it dove into the ground. Strickland-McAleenan said she and her husband were familiar with the aircraft because Pelletier often flew in the area. According to Federal Aviation Administration spokesman Ian Gregor, the aircraft took off from the airstrip branching off Falcon Way. Strickland-McAleenan said, "This is a grandfathered airstrip. It has been there since the World War II" when the military used it to practice touch and go landings and take-offs, she said. "Most of the people like the airstrip and use it quite often." As he watched authorities remove the bodies from the wreckage, Paulden resident Ron Stoks said, "It looks like a hard hit." Stoks heard of the crash from a friend and rushed to the scene to see it for himself. He said he knew Pelletier for 10 years. "He just got a sport-pilot license," said Stoks, who also owns an experimental aircraft. "He was flying a lot here. He had fun giving rides." Because his friend was safety-minded, Stoks said, he wouldn't board the plane if he thought that it had a mechanical problem. A few days before the October air show at the Prescott Airport, Stoks said, he and Pelletier flew in the DC3 with William "Billy" Friedman, a 40-year pilot who died in the Oct. 18 plane crash that also killed four other people on board. Coincidently, Friedman saw the Sept. 2 plane crash that killed two adults and a teenager near the Pi=F1on Oaks subdivision in Prescott. The National Transportation Safety Board is still investigating the previous two incidents. Gregor said a Scottsdale-based FAA crew and NTSB will investigate this incident also. Contact the reporter at mburic(at)prescottaz.com DVD On 11/13/06, George Thompson wrote: Dave was killed this morning when his Kolb went down with another man. Both were killed instantly. Many of the Kolb flyers on this list knew him and his wife Eve from M V. It would be nice if you could send condolences to his wife. Mrs. Eve Pelletier 1134 Fair St. Prescott, Az. 86305 Az. Bald Eagle href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Date: 11/12/2006 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- 11/12/2006 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 14, 2006
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: Re: If You Got This Email, You Haven't Made A Contribution
Yet! :-) Russ et al, Please snail mail your List Contribution to: Matt Dralle/Matronics PO Box 347 Livermore, CA 94551 USA Be sure to include your email address along with your check! Thank you! Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator At 07:00 AM 11/14/2006 Tuesday, you wrote: > >Matt >I need your snailmail address -- > >On Nov 8, 2006, at 3:11 AM, Matt Dralle wrote: > >> >>If you received this particular Matronics List Email message, its >>because you haven't yet made a Contribution to support your Lists! >>This is the first PBS-like funds drive message under the new >>distribution system. The new system selectively sends out the >>Contribution messages ONLY to those that forgot to whip out the 'ol >>credit card this year to support the continued operation and >>upgrade of the Matronics Email Lists! Don't you wish PBS worked >>that way? :-) >> >>You heard that right. Once you make your Contribution, these >>support requests messages during November will suddenly stop coming >>to your personal email inbox! Pardon me if I seem kind of excited >>about the new feature. I've wanted to implement something like >>this for a number of years now, but it was always such a daunting >>task to modify the back-end List processing code, that I just kept >>putting it off. Finally this year, I just decided to bite the >>bullet and put the code-pounding time it to make it work. A few >>days later, bam! A working system! >> >>Anyway, I'll stop gushing now. I really do appreciate each and >>every one of your individual Contributions to support the Lists. >>It is your support that enables me to upgrade the hardware and >>software that are required to run a List Site like this. It also >>goes to pay for the Commercial-Grade Internet connection and to pay >>the rather huge electric bill to keep the computer gear running and >>the air conditioner powered up. >> >>Your personal Contribution matters because when combined with other >>Listers such as yourself, it pays the bills to keep this site up >>and running. I accept exactly ZERO advertising dollars for the >>Matronics Lists sites. I can't stand the pop-up ads and all other >>commercialism that is so prevalent on the Internet these days and I >>particularly don't want to have it on my Email List site. I'm >>pretty sure you don't either. >> >>If you appreciate the ad-free, grass-roots, down-home feel of the >>Matronics Email Lists, please make a Contribution today to keep it >>that way!! >> >>http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> >>Thank you! >> >>Matt Dralle >>Matronics Email List Administrator >> >> >> >> >> > > Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Hi Folks: Was looking through some old photos and came across this one. It was a dark dreary day at Birchwood Airport, Alaska. The more I looked at it, the more I thought it an appropriate way to say farewell to my ole bud, AZ Dave. Farewell friend. -------- John Hauck MKIII/912ULS hauck's holler, alabama Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74566#74566 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/farewell_az_dave_138.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 14, 2006
From: TheWanderingWench <thewanderingwench(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Fall Color From a Kolb
I know this is a Kolb list - but a request is a request - right? :>) To keep it as Kolb-related as possible, three of these 5 shots were taken on the way to/at the Kolb MV fly-in in May 2006. (I flew there in my Maxair Drifter from Sandy, Oregon with a buddy flying his Sky Raider.) I sometimes choose to include part of the Drifter in the photo, as I've done with one of these - but when I do so, I have to twist and turn for the shot. Arty Trost --- FS2Kolb(at)aol.com wrote: > > Arty, > I would like to see some pictures you have taken > from you drifter. www.LessonsFromTheEdge.com "Life's a daring adventure or nothing" Helen Keller "I refuse to tip toe through life just to arrive safely at death." ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Bass" <gtb(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Kolbers: I too knew Dave Pelletier. Although my visits to the USUA Chapter #555 (that he had become president of) were simply memories, the influence, and the inspiration that he brought to the organization was part of the energy that kept it going. It has been some time since I've been able to get to a meeting, but, to show you how GIVING this person was, he had actually encouraged me to fly his old Firestar, after he got the 2-place. How many others would even have considered GIVING another the joy of flying their prize toy, never having seen me fly, nor having spoken to anyone we knew, of my capabilities. He instilled trust and safety, and encouraged many who would not have otherwise flown. My heart aches this day. I will be among those who remember the examples he set, for all of us to follow, and share with others. Prayers and condolences for Eve, and envy of the time she had with Dave. My sympathies to George Thompson, as well, George Bass ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 14, 2006
From: Bob Noyer <a58r(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Perfect, John. regards, Bob N. FireFly 070 Old Kolb http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Thanks John, That was nice. George ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2006 12:46 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Az. Dave > > Hi Folks: > > Was looking through some old photos and came across this one. > > It was a dark dreary day at Birchwood Airport, Alaska. > > The more I looked at it, the more I thought it an appropriate way to say > farewell to my ole bud, AZ Dave. > > Farewell friend. > > -------- > John Hauck > MKIII/912ULS > hauck's holler, alabama > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74566#74566 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/farewell_az_dave_138.jpg > > > -- > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RICHARD BUTLER" <RICHARDBUTLERS(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Photo E-mail Play slideshow<http://photos.msn.com/Viewing/Album.aspx?PST=8nK2AN1B!1LmPLmC 9HXTYwxc1VPOuBcbtNsS50ibyoP!V7bHM2Asg4769OAi6z7FN7tiW809PFDmbxGy0eFEpA%24 %24> | Download images <http://photos.msn.com/viewing/Photos.aspx?pi_Type=SlideshowTask&Task= Download&stppData=&pi_ImagesOnly=1&Folder=nBuRgwTGIGhKPWRvXLqz1CTQX yL6bqt*md7sGsDCogA%24&User=LJjObqfwa74Uwc5F8IouiKZvNRUblFzh&pi_NoLogin= 1> I have about 10 of Dave I took ...one from 2 yras ago in M Valley AZ of a leg of our trip. R Butler Rimrock<http://photos.msn.com/Viewing/Album.aspx?PST=8nK2AN1B!1LmPLmC9H XTYwxc1VPOuBcbtNsS50ibyoP!V7bHM2Asg4769OAi6z7FN7tiW809PFDmbxGy0eFEpA%24%2 4> 2005 from Dave's Kolb ----- Original Message ----- From: George Thompson<mailto:eagle1(at)commspeed.net> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2006 4:46 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Az. Dave > Thanks John, That was nice. George ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com<mailto:jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>> To: > Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2006 12:46 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Az. Dave > > > Hi Folks: > > Was looking through some old photos and came across this one. > > It was a dark dreary day at Birchwood Airport, Alaska. > > The more I looked at it, the more I thought it an appropriate way to say > farewell to my ole bud, AZ Dave. > > Farewell friend. > > -------- > John Hauck > MKIII/912ULS > hauck's holler, alabama > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74566#74566 atronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74566#74566> > > > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/farewell_az_dave_138.jpg matronics.com//files/farewell_az_dave_138.jpg> > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > www.aeroelectric.com<http://www.aeroelectric.com/> www.buildersbooks.com<http://www.buildersbooks.com/> www.kitlog.com<http://www.kitlog.com/> www.homebuilthelp.com<http://www.homebuilthelp.com/> http://www.matronics.com/contribution on> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List igator?Kolb-List> This MSN Photo E-mail slideshow will be available for 30 days. To share high quality pictures with your friends and family using MSN Photo E-mail, join MSN<http://g.msn.com/0PHenus1/29>. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
From: "Roger Lee" <ssadiver1(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Hi All, This is truly a sad, sad day. This hits really close to home. I first met Dave at MV and then down here in Tucson. Dave had been talking to me about purchasing my Kolb. Dave and I had talked numerous times on the phone for an hour. A really nice guy. I will really miss him. Roger Tucson, Az. Here is a picture of the accident that was posted in the local newspaper. Double click the picture and it will open up and be more clear. -------- Roger Lee Tucson, Az. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74623#74623 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/scan0001_521.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/scan0001_447.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: If You Got This Email, You Haven't Made A Contribution
Yet! :-) (
Date: Nov 14, 2006
From: "Craig Nelson" <Craig.Nelson(at)heraeus.com>
Matt Dralle Please check I am getting this e mail. I don't care about the e mail but I have concerns that I did e mail my credit card $100 for the list contribution and did not credit it to my e mail address Craig.Nelson(at)heraeus.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2006 10:40 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: If You Got This Email, You Haven't Made A Contribution Yet! :-) Russ et al, Please snail mail your List Contribution to: Matt Dralle/Matronics PO Box 347 Livermore, CA 94551 USA Be sure to include your email address along with your check! Thank you! Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator At 07:00 AM 11/14/2006 Tuesday, you wrote: > >Matt >I need your snailmail address -- > >On Nov 8, 2006, at 3:11 AM, Matt Dralle wrote: > >> >>If you received this particular Matronics List Email message, its >>because you haven't yet made a Contribution to support your Lists! >>This is the first PBS-like funds drive message under the new >>distribution system. The new system selectively sends out the >>Contribution messages ONLY to those that forgot to whip out the 'ol >>credit card this year to support the continued operation and >>upgrade of the Matronics Email Lists! Don't you wish PBS worked >>that way? :-) >> >>You heard that right. Once you make your Contribution, these >>support requests messages during November will suddenly stop coming >>to your personal email inbox! Pardon me if I seem kind of excited >>about the new feature. I've wanted to implement something like >>this for a number of years now, but it was always such a daunting >>task to modify the back-end List processing code, that I just kept >>putting it off. Finally this year, I just decided to bite the >>bullet and put the code-pounding time it to make it work. A few >>days later, bam! A working system! >> >>Anyway, I'll stop gushing now. I really do appreciate each and >>every one of your individual Contributions to support the Lists. >>It is your support that enables me to upgrade the hardware and >>software that are required to run a List Site like this. It also >>goes to pay for the Commercial-Grade Internet connection and to pay >>the rather huge electric bill to keep the computer gear running and >>the air conditioner powered up. >> >>Your personal Contribution matters because when combined with other >>Listers such as yourself, it pays the bills to keep this site up >>and running. I accept exactly ZERO advertising dollars for the >>Matronics Lists sites. I can't stand the pop-up ads and all other >>commercialism that is so prevalent on the Internet these days and I >>particularly don't want to have it on my Email List site. I'm >>pretty sure you don't either. >> >>If you appreciate the ad-free, grass-roots, down-home feel of the >>Matronics Email Lists, please make a Contribution today to keep it >>that way!! >> >>http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> >>Thank you! >> >>Matt Dralle >>Matronics Email List Administrator >> >> >> >> >> > > Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DAquaNut(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
In a message dated 11/13/2006 6:31:54 P.M. Central Standard Time, eagle1(at)commspeed.net writes: Dave was killed this morning when his Kolb went down with another man. Both were killed instantly. Many of the Kolb flyers on this list knew him and his wife Eve from M V. It would be nice if you could send condolences to his wife. Mrs. Eve Pelletier 1134 Fair St. Prescott, Az. 86305 Az. Bald Eagle Eve, George, and others, Just met Dave this year and got to know him. He was a swell Guy. What a loss, He will be missed. Eve will be in our prayers! Ed Diebel ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: If You Got This Email, You Haven't Made A Contribution
Yet
From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Date: Nov 14, 2006
Craig.Nelson(at)heraeus.c wrote: > Matt Dralle > Please check I am getting this e mail. I don't care about the e mail but > I have concerns that I did e mail my credit card $100 for the list > contribution and did not credit it to my e mail address > Craig.Nelson(at)heraeus.com > -- Craig, Well, this particular post *response* is kind of an exception to the Squelch. Without waxing to geek, when I send out a Fund Raiser message, I include a special email header that flags the email as a Contribution message so when it gets processed by the Matronics system, it is only sent to people that haven't yet made a Contribution. This special header isn't kept when the message is redistributed by the system, however, so any subsequent replies to my original message will go to everyone. I checked the records, and your generous Contribution was successfully received and recorded. Thank you! The Contribution web site is: http://www.matronics.com/contribution Best regards, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator -------- Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74662#74662 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Dave
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Nice one John. I shall miss Daves posts although I never had the good fortune to meet him.. Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 15, 2006
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: LOC
Each year at the end of the List Fund Raiser, I post a message acknowledging everyone that so generously made a Contribution to support the Lists. Its sort of my way of publicly thanking everyone that took a minute to show their appreciation for the Lists. Won't you take a moment and assure that your name is on that List of Contributors (LOC)? As a number of members have pointed out over the years, the List seems at least - if not a whole lot more - valuable as a building/flying/recreating/entertainment tool as your typical magazine subscription! Please take minute and assure that your name is on this year's LOC! Show others that you appreciate the Lists. Making a Contribution to support the Lists is fast and easy using your Credit card or Paypal on the Secure Web Site: http://www.matronics.com/contribution or by popping a personal check in the mail to: Matt Dralle / Matronics PO Box 347 Livermore CA 94551-0347 I would like to thank everyone that has so generously made a Contribution thus far in this year's List Fund Raiser! Remember that its YOUR support that keeps these Lists going and improving! Don't forget to include a little comment about how the Lists have helped you! Best regards, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <kfackler(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Does anyone know what engine Dave was flying under? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Green" <bgreen(at)bimi.org>
Subject: If You Got This Email, You Haven't Made A Contribution
Yet! :-)
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Will do. Thanks for the lists. Bob Please snail mail your List Contribution to: Matt Dralle/Matronics PO Box 347 Livermore, CA 94551 USA Be sure to include your email address along with your check! Thank you! Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator At 07:00 AM 11/14/2006 Tuesday, you wrote: > >Matt >I need your snailmail address -- > >On Nov 8, 2006, at 3:11 AM, Matt Dralle wrote: > >> >>If you received this particular Matronics List Email message, its >>because you haven't yet made a Contribution to support your Lists! >>This is the first PBS-like funds drive message under the new >>distribution system. The new system selectively sends out the >>Contribution messages ONLY to those that forgot to whip out the 'ol >>credit card this year to support the continued operation and >>upgrade of the Matronics Email Lists! Don't you wish PBS worked >>that way? :-) >> >>You heard that right. Once you make your Contribution, these >>support requests messages during November will suddenly stop coming >>to your personal email inbox! Pardon me if I seem kind of excited >>about the new feature. I've wanted to implement something like >>this for a number of years now, but it was always such a daunting >>task to modify the back-end List processing code, that I just kept >>putting it off. Finally this year, I just decided to bite the >>bullet and put the code-pounding time it to make it work. A few >>days later, bam! A working system! >> >>Anyway, I'll stop gushing now. I really do appreciate each and >>every one of your individual Contributions to support the Lists. >>It is your support that enables me to upgrade the hardware and >>software that are required to run a List Site like this. It also >>goes to pay for the Commercial-Grade Internet connection and to pay >>the rather huge electric bill to keep the computer gear running and >>the air conditioner powered up. >> >>Your personal Contribution matters because when combined with other >>Listers such as yourself, it pays the bills to keep this site up >>and running. I accept exactly ZERO advertising dollars for the >>Matronics Lists sites. I can't stand the pop-up ads and all other >>commercialism that is so prevalent on the Internet these days and I >>particularly don't want to have it on my Email List site. I'm >>pretty sure you don't either. >> >>If you appreciate the ad-free, grass-roots, down-home feel of the >>Matronics Email Lists, please make a Contribution today to keep it >>that way!! >> >>http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> >>Thank you! >> >>Matt Dralle >>Matronics Email List Administrator >> >> >> >> >> > > Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle(at)matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 15, 2006
582 with two up at 4300 ft. George ----- Original Message ----- From: kfackler(at)ameritech.net To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 7:24 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Does anyone know what engine Dave was flying under? ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- 11/14/2006 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RICHARD BUTLER" <richardbutlers(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 15, 2006
George do you really mean 4300 feet? R Butler Rimrock ----- Original Message ----- From: George Thompson<mailto:eagle1(at)commspeed.net> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 8:30 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave 582 with two up at 4300 ft. George ----- Original Message ----- From: kfackler(at)ameritech.net<mailto:kfackler(at)ameritech.net> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 7:24 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Does anyone know what engine Dave was flying under? href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.comwww.aeroelectric.comhref="http://www.buildersbooks.com">w ww.buildersbooks.comhref="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.comhref=" http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.comhref="http://www.mat ronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref="http://www.mat ronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-L ist> href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Date: 11/14/2006 www.aeroelectric.com<http://www.aeroelectric.com/> www.buildersbooks.com<http://www.buildersbooks.com/> www.homebuilthelp.com<http://www.homebuilthelp.com/> http://www.matronics.com/contribution on> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List igator?Kolb-List> ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 15, 2006
That's our field elevation. ----- Original Message ----- From: RICHARD BUTLER To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 8:42 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave George do you really mean 4300 feet? R Butler Rimrock ----- Original Message ----- From: George Thompson To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 8:30 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave 582 with two up at 4300 ft. George ----- Original Message ----- From: kfackler(at)ameritech.net To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 7:24 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Does anyone know what engine Dave was flying under? href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ------------------------------------------------------------------------- - Date: 11/14/2006 href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com title=
http://www.buildersbooks.com/ href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- 11/14/2006 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RICHARD BUTLER" <richardbutlers(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Thanks for my clarification George. R Butler ----- Original Message ----- From: George Thompson<mailto:eagle1(at)commspeed.net> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 9:18 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave That's our field elevation. ----- Original Message ----- From: RICHARD BUTLER<mailto:richardbutlers(at)msn.com> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 8:42 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave George do you really mean 4300 feet? R Butler Rimrock ----- Original Message ----- From: George Thompson<mailto:eagle1(at)commspeed.net> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 8:30 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave 582 with two up at 4300 ft. George ----- Original Message ----- From: kfackler(at)ameritech.net<mailto:kfackler(at)ameritech.net> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 7:24 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Does anyone know what engine Dave was flying under? href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.comwww.aeroelectric.comhref="http://www.buildersbooks.com">w ww.buildersbooks.comhref="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.comhref=" http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.comhref="http://www.mat ronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref="http://www.mat ronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-L ist> href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Date: 11/14/2006 href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com title=http://www.buildersbooks.com/ href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?Kolb-List href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Date: 11/14/2006 www.aeroelectric.com<http://www.aeroelectric.com/> www.buildersbooks.com<http://www.buildersbooks.com/> www.homebuilthelp.com<http://www.homebuilthelp.com/> http://www.matronics.com/contribution on> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List igator?Kolb-List> ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Az. Dave
Date: Nov 15, 2006
From: "Gherkins Tim-rp3420" <rp3420(at)freescale.com>
Guys, I have been so stunned and saddened about losing Dave, I have just had a hard time posting about it. Every time Dave brought somebody to the valley to show them uncle Craig's and my airplanes, he would pay the highest compliments. Recently spent some time with him at Copperstate Fly-in and he kept ranting and raving the judges to come over and judge our planes. Always the center of goings on at monument valley where he and Eve gave freely of their pop, food and a chair. We will sorely miss him. Our humble condolences to Eve and her family and of course his right hand man, George. Tim Gherkins & Uncle Craig ________________________________ From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of George Thompson Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 9:19 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave That's our field elevation. ----- Original Message ----- From: RICHARD BUTLER <mailto:richardbutlers(at)msn.com> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 8:42 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave George do you really mean 4300 feet? R Butler Rimrock ----- Original Message ----- From: George Thompson <mailto:eagle1(at)commspeed.net> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 8:30 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave 582 with two up at 4300 ft. George ----- Original Message ----- From: kfackler(at)ameritech.net To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 7:24 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Does anyone know what engine Dave was flying under? href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com www.aeroelectric.comhref="http://www.buil d ersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.comhref="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kit l og.comhref="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.comhref=" htt p://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref="htt p ://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">
http://www.matronics.com/Navig ator?Kolb-List> href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c h ref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics . com/Navigator?Kolb-List ________________________________ Date: 11/14/2006 href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com title=http://www.buildersbooks.com/ href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c h ref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics . com/Navigator?Kolb-List href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c h ref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics . com/Navigator?Kolb-List ________________________________ Date: 11/14/2006 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Cockpit Noise
From: "David Lucas" <d_a_lucas(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Nov 15, 2006
> That hole in the back was acting like a giant megaphone Just wondering, Does the Tube back to the tail feathers also act like a drum with each passing of the nearby prop tip thus passing the noise back up the tube to the cockpit cage ? Has anyone done any work on this theory by having some sound deadening material inside the tube at that point at least ? Resonation can travel well within the confines of a tube especially if harmonics are involved. Just curious. David Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74833#74833 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 15, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Teat
>Sorry to hear about Dave. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: WillUribe(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Subject: Az. Dave
Az. Dave had been flying the Kolb for a long time and had flown many passengers. I find it hard to believe he just stalled and spun in. I want wanabies or newbies to know that Kolbs don't just fall out of the sky and the plane had just been inspected. My first thought was he either suffered a hart attack or a stroke. But that will all come out in the NTSB report. At least I got to spend a short time with Dave at the Copperstate fly-in. Regards, Will Uribe El Paso, TX FireStar II N4GU _http://home.elp.rr.com/airplane/_ (http://home.elp.rr.com/airplane/) From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of George Thompson Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 7:06 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Az. Dave Larry, Of couce it is not official because the NTSB are going to investigate it because he had just registered the Kolb as a sport certified plane.They had been doing touch and go's all morning. I don't know how big (heavy) the passenger was but it is my and most others that he made a low level turn and just stalled and spun in. He only had a 282 Rotax on it. It went in straight down. No chance for his chute. Since he was in the pattern, I doubt that they were more than4-500 feet high. our field is 4500 feet. do not archive ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Check out Low and slow - Google Video
From: "N111KX (Kip)" <n111kx(at)mindspring.com>
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Great flying, Will :D . I wish that it was that easy to fly low in Georgia! I have been lying low recently as I have been deciding on a next project. I hope to have a Waiex kit delivered in Feb [Shocked] . Don't worry, the Firestar is going nowhere and will someday have a big brother in the hangar with her... Kip -------- Kip Firestar II (born September 2000) Atlanta, GA N111KX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74857#74857 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Cockpit Noise
Date: Nov 15, 2006
David I have been trying to make my MKIII quieter since I lowered my engine by adding sound deadening material everywhere I could think of with no luck. I never considered the fuselage tube but that could be it. definitely worth checking. My tube is plugged near the tail feathers but not on the fuselage end so it might be even more noisy. Good idea. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW powered MKIIIc ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Lucas" <d_a_lucas(at)hotmail.com> Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 4:36 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Cockpit Noise > > >> That hole in the back was acting like a giant megaphone > > > Just wondering, Does the Tube back to the tail feathers also act like a > drum with each passing of the nearby prop tip thus passing the noise back > up the tube to the cockpit cage ? > > Has anyone done any work on this theory by having some sound deadening > material inside the tube at that point at least ? > > Resonation can travel well within the confines of a tube especially if > harmonics are involved. > > Just curious. David > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74833#74833 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Check out Low and slow - Google Video
From: "John Williamson" <kolbrapilot1(at)comcast.net>
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Since "Low and Slow"is a relative term, here is a link to 5 videos from the Kolbra or standing by it: http://home.comcast.net/~kolbrapilot2/LowandSlow.htm -------- John Williamson Arlington, TX Kolbra, 912ULS http://home.comcast.net/~kolbrapilot1 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74861#74861 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: APilot(at)webtv.net
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Subject: Re: Cockpit Noise
You make a good point of air coming forward in the Mk III tube. I have been wondering about cutting a louver in the under side of the nose cone to relieve the vacuum which would also stop the forward movement of air in the tube. According to Mr. Newton, the reaction would be less from the forward moving air. However, the drag of a louver would be more. Hard to figure. Vic ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Check out Low and slow - Google Video
Date: Nov 15, 2006
| Since "Low and Slow"is a relative term, | -------- | John Williamson Hi John W: The Sand Dune Video brings back some fond memories of several years ago. Do you have the video you shot on our flight down the Texax coast last year? john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Dalton" <wiserguy(at)comcast.net>
Subject: For Dave
Date: Nov 15, 2006
All, I wanted to express a little more on the loss of Dave Pelletier and thought about putting together a slideshow. But I decided on this picture instead, it made me feel better. Bob D. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Firestar II HKS Conversion
From: "Dave Bigelow" <up_country(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Regarding props - I've had very good results with Powerfin props. They are well made, rugged, and have a low moment of inertia. I would use a Warp Drive for sure if I was on floats or operating off a gravel runway because of the metal leading edge. Prop preferance is kind of like blondes, brunettes, or red heads. I'll certainly test a warp drive if I can get ahold of one for that purpose. -------- Dave Bigelow Kamuela, Hawaii FS2, HKS 700E Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74883#74883 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ron wehba" <rwehba(at)cebridge.net>
Subject: Re: For Dave
Date: Nov 15, 2006
very, very nice thanks ----- Original Message ----- From: Bob Dalton To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 6:29 PM Subject: Kolb-List: For Dave All, I wanted to express a little more on the loss of Dave Pelletier and thought about putting together a slideshow. But I decided on this picture instead, it made me feel better. Bob D. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Firestar II HKS Conversion
Date: Nov 15, 2006
| Prop preferance is kind of like blondes, brunettes, or red heads. | | I'll certainly test a warp drive if I can get ahold of one for that purpose. | | -------- | Dave Bigelow Dave: Try to keep preference and performance seperated in your HKS test. ;-) Props are the primarly connection between the aircraft and the air we fly in. Differences in manufacturers and designs reflect in differences in performance. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Original FS Fuel Tank Upgrade
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Hi Gang: Someone was asking about increasing fuel capacity in their original FS. Here is how Brother Jim and I did it on my FS in 1988, an 18 gal 5052 Aluminum .050 wall tank, mounted in the upper rear behind the bulkhead, opening up a cargo compartment below. Similar configuration as my MKIII. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HShack(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Subject: Re: Firestar II HKS Conversion
In a message dated 11/15/2006 7:39:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, up_country(at)hotmail.com writes: I'll certainly test a warp drive if I can get ahold of one for that purpose. Dave, as dicussed in previous posts, save yourself some trouble & call Warp Drive & ask for the inertia on whatever prop you would use. You will probably fund it is way too high for your gearbox. I like Warp props; used one for 500 hrs. I'm now using a Kiev prop; like it better. Howard Shackleford FS II SC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: My Kind of Airport
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Hi Gang: On my way north to Alaska, 2001, I landed at Ashley, ND, for a short break. There was no one there, but they did have an old rotary dial type telephone on the wall of the little one room FBO. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Early Days of Cross Country Flying
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Hi Gang: This photo was taken of my FS and one man bivy tent, affectionately referred to as my "body bag", at Sun and Fun 1988, 18 years ago. About as close to barn storming as I could get back then. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: FS 1989
Date: Nov 15, 2006
Hi Gang: Making a low pass and go around to eventually land in a small cow pasture near Woodville, FL, some time in 1989. This little airplane and I always felt like one. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 15, 2006
From: TheWanderingWench <thewanderingwench(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: For Dave
Bob - This is incredible! If you want to print it out and send it to Eve, matted and framed, I'll be glad to help out with the cost. (Frames seem to get more expensive every year, especially with special mats.) Arty Trost --- Bob Dalton wrote: > All, > > > > I wanted to express a little more on the loss of > Dave Pelletier and thought > about putting together a slideshow. But I decided on > this picture instead, > it made me feel better. > > > > Bob D. > > > > www.LessonsFromTheEdge.com "Life's a daring adventure or nothing" Helen Keller "I refuse to tip toe through life just to arrive safely at death." ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Early Days of Cross Country Flying
From: "N111KX (Kip)" <n111kx(at)mindspring.com>
Date: Nov 16, 2006
Ancient times. Even before streamlined struts were invented [Wink] Kip -------- Kip Firestar II (born September 2000) Atlanta, GA N111KX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=74963#74963 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Early Days of Cross Country Flying
Date: Nov 16, 2006
| Ancient times. Even before streamlined struts were invented [Wink] | Kip Kip: Got to look a little closer. I believe 4130 streamline struts were already in place. I do remember the first two things we changed on the original FS was gear legs and lift struts. We went to .090 wall 4130 X 1" and heat treated to 42 Rockwell. I got the Rockwell number from Maxair. Experience dictated harder heat treating and larger diameter legs the next year. Still using the same material and numbers for the gear legs on my mkIII. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Original FS Fuel Tank Upgrade
Date: Nov 16, 2006
Morning Gang: Those interested, if there are more photos of the original FS 18 gal aluminum fuel tank, I will be glad to post them. This tank was baffled internally, pulled fuel from the bottom rear, lowest point of tank, through a finger strainer. Fueled from the rear through an inlet made up of pvc and brass plumbing parts. This tank worked great in all areas except a small leak in the bottom rear that was not detected until after installation. This tank was not sloshed. Had we sloshed it, like we did the 25 gal aluminum tank in my mkIII, we probably would not have had any leakage problems. Soon as I get a chance I will dig through old photos and see what I can find. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: thanks everyone for the pictures
Date: Nov 16, 2006
I intend to look into the electric kit for the carbs. is anyone running them? > Hi, we have a version that heats the carb itself available here. no switching on and off as it is on all the time. I have it on the Jabi on my mk 111 but as I have not flown since I crunched my wing and had only a few hours before that i cannot speak for it. efficiency. It is getting general use here and I have heard nothing against it. Cheers Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David Key" <dhkey(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: thanks everyone for the pictures
Date: Nov 16, 2006
I have a carb heating system for a 912 that circulates the coolant from the heads to keep the carbs at a tempature where they don't ice. I forget the name but I can photo it. >From: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> >Reply-To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com >To: >Subject: Re: Kolb-List: thanks everyone for the pictures >Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 16:34:55 -0000 > >I intend to look into the electric kit for the carbs. is anyone running >them? > > >Hi, we have a version that heats the carb itself available here. no >switching on and off as it is on all the time. I have it on the Jabi on my >mk 111 but as I have not flown since I crunched my wing and had only a few >hours before that i cannot speak for it. efficiency. > >It is getting general use here and I have heard nothing against it. > >Cheers > >Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Original FS Fuel Tank Upgrade
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Date: Nov 16, 2006
Here's a few more photos of my aluminum tank installation in the original FS. I don't think I have any of the construction phase of the tank. -------- John Hauck MKIII/912ULS hauck's holler, alabama Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75031#75031 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/scan0003_319.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/scan0004_188.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/scan0002_509.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jim Kmet" <jlsk1(at)frontiernet.net>
Subject: Covering supplies
Date: Nov 16, 2006
Hi all, Im recovering the Fuse on my MK-3, who has the best prices for Poly-Brush/Spray/Tone of recent? & contact info would be appreciated. I only need a gallon of each W/reducers. Thanks, Jim ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Covering supplies
Date: Nov 16, 2006
Hi all, Im recovering the Fuse on my MK-3, who has the best prices for Poly-Brush/Spray/Tone of recent? & contact info would be appreciated. I only need a gallon of each W/reducers. Thanks, Jim Hi Jim: Try Jim and Dondi Miller: http://www.aircrafttechsupport.com/ CALL TOLL FREE 1-877-877-3334 john h mkIII hauck's holler, alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Mark-II for sale (UNCLASSIFIED)
From: "lndc" <lndc(at)fnbcnet.com>
Date: Nov 16, 2006
Hi, I mailed a guy in Lakeville MN. to see if he still has his Mark ll for sale. If he does, I'll leave all the info you need to get hold of him. It's real nice. Dan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75093#75093 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 17, 2006
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: List Value...
If you look forward to checking your List email everyday (and a lot of you have written to say that you do!), then you're probably getting at least 0 or 0 worth of Entertainment from the Lists each year. You'd pay twice that for a subscription to some lame magazine or even a dinner out. Isn't the List worth at least that much to you? Wouldn't it be great if you could pay that same amount and get a well-managed media source free of advertising, SPAM, and viruses? Come to think of it, you do... Won't you please take a minute to make your Contribution today and support YOUR Lists? Contribution Page: http://www.matronics.com/contribution Again, I want to say THANK YOU to everyone that has made a Contribution thus far during this year's List Fund Raiser!! These Lists are made possible exclusively through YOUR generosity!! Thank you for your support! Matt Dralle Email List Admin. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Mark ll for sale
From: "lndc" <lndc(at)fnbcnet.com>
Date: Nov 17, 2006
Hi, I talked to Alan Olson(Oly). His plane is for sale. Give him a call at (952) 892-0518 or mail at OLISFLYROD(at)aol.com I saw this plane a couple of years ago and it was real nice. I'm sure not many more hrs have been put on it. He's always working. Dan Charter Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75205#75205 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Original FS Fuel Tank Upgrade
Date: Nov 16, 2006
my attempt at the John/Jim Hauck fuel tank design for a Mark III>> thanks for the good clear pics. I assume that it is the black filler tube showing at top right. Does it lead to somewhere else when the engine is installed?. From the pic it looks as though it might be pretty difficult to get at. I think the change would bedifficult to do in the UK where we do not have the leeway of your Experimental Category (yet). What did it do to your C of G? It would seem that it must move backwards quite a bit from the original configuration of tanks laying athwartships (as it were) right at the front of the cage Cheers Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: John/Jim Hauck fuel tank design for a Mark III
Date: Nov 17, 2006
re-assemeble and do a new W&B at differnet fuel levels>> Should prove interesting. Thanks John. I understand that Kolb are now shipping the Mark3 with a slightly taller tank with but the same footprint. This will put the total fuel carried up a bit, but I suspect not to the extent of your tank Might help someone who does not want to cut the support tubes about. Cheers Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 17, 2006
Dear fellow Kolber's, I feel it is my duty to put out the correct information as I know it from here. A Fellow from Washing State contacted Dave on line wanting to know if he could get some familiarizing time in a Kolb. It seems that he had picked out one to buy in Calif. and the Guy told him to come on down and fly it. ( It must have been a single place). This man told the Calif man that he had no time in ultlalights and didn't feel comfortable enough to try it. Dave told him to come on down and he would give him some flights in his. This Guy had a private license. He flew down to Phoenix and rented a car and drove up here to Prescott. Got in late Sunday night and they went flying early Monday Morn. Neither Eve nor I saw him. Now, the people who live around the field (Some who are pilots) say they heard them making 5 or 6 touch and goes that morning. Now understand, This Guy came all the way down here to get some familiarizing flights in this type of plane. It is my and most of our ulralight Friends who knew Dave, Think this is what happened. After making several trips around the patch, Dave would have said "Do you want to take it around now"? There was a long take off run and turn to cross wind, then on the turn to down wind the plane stalled made a quarter turn to the right and went straight in from no more than 2-300 feet. I talked to his Flight instructor who had just given him his training for his Sport license and he told me that he stressed and stressed departureHoward stalls. Therefore I am certain that Dave was not at the controls at that time. Dave told me that he would not fly from the right seat because he was not comfortable there. Because the Kolb had duel controls, it doesn't matter which seat the man flying it was in. Don't know much about the other man. He was unmarried and had/was a air controller from SeaTac In Tacoma Wa. We are trying to have the memorial held at the Embry Riddle Auditorium here for next Saturday, 25th. That's not for sure yet. Eve had a firm date to have his remains interned in Arlington Nation Cementary on December 22nd, his birthday. He was a retired Master Sgt. in the Air force She requests family only. No flowers, All donations are to go to the EAA Young Eagles Program in Dave's Name. They said they would send acknowledgments to his Wife Eve Mrs. Dave Pelletier 1134 Fair St. Prescott, Az. 86305 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 17, 2006
| this from newspaper "David Arthur Pelletier, 68, and his passenger | Michael Francis Maikowski, 54, of Kent, Wash., didn't show any signs | of life when first responders arrived." | | regards, | Bob N. FireFly 070 Old Kolb Bob N: Understand the above. My question was the coincidence of "Cris Wolf" asking about a check out in a MKIII to test a prospective buy a few days prior to Dave's accident. If I remember correctly, he stated flying commercial to another location would not be a problem. Was Maikowski a member of the Kolb List? Is Cris Wolf a online ID for Maikowski, or is Cris Wolf, on the Kolb List, actually Cris Wolf. Have not seen Cris Wolf post since the check ride request a few days prior to the accident date. Trying to tie some things together, in my mind, which is probably very dangerous. Take care, john h ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 17, 2006
From: "Robert Laird" <rlaird(at)cavediver.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
When I did an Internet search for "Chris Wolf" using his email address, I found a link to a page that had a link that said "Books by Chris Wolf"... lo, and behold, when I click on that link, this is what I got (look at the name on the book cover): http://www.jeffcomp.com/index.html -- Robert On 11/17/06, John Hauck wrote: > > > | this from newspaper "David Arthur Pelletier, 68, and his passenger > | Michael Francis Maikowski, 54, of Kent, Wash., didn't show any signs > | of life when first responders arrived." > | > | regards, > | Bob N. FireFly 070 Old Kolb > > > Bob N: > > Understand the above. > > My question was the coincidence of "Cris Wolf" asking about a check > out in a MKIII to test a prospective buy a few days prior to Dave's > accident. If I remember correctly, he stated flying commercial to > another location would not be a problem. > > Was Maikowski a member of the Kolb List? > > Is Cris Wolf a online ID for Maikowski, or is Cris Wolf, on the Kolb > List, actually Cris Wolf. > > Have not seen Cris Wolf post since the check ride request a few days > prior to the accident date. > > Trying to tie some things together, in my mind, which is probably very > dangerous. > > Take care, > > john h > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: N27SB(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 17, 2006
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
John, I agree, I thought the same thoughts. It would be nice to hear from Chris, He appeared to be an avid and enthusiastic new member to our group. HEY CHRIS, Speak up Steve ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 17, 2006
| Looks like we have our answer. Chris Wolf and Maikowski are one and | the same. | | john h Gang: Here's one of his (their) books that has both names on it: http://jeffcomp.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=100 Best I can figure they were the same guy. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 17, 2006
| Here's one of his (their) books that has both names on it: | | http://jeffcomp.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=100 | | Best I can figure they were the same guy. | | john h And.................. Here is the msg that sparked my interest in the two names: "So my question is, where can I go to get checked out in a Kolb Mark III Xtra? We don't seem to have any in the Seattle area, where I live. Would it be best to go back to the factory, in Kentucky? Does the factory do this sort of thing? Or is there somebody who would like to give me a checkout in a Kolb Xtra? For pay, of course! And I can travel for the instruction." Chris Wolf cwolf41(at)comcast.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 17, 2006
From: Bob Noyer <a58r(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
My apologies for putting my one-cent into this thread. regards, Bob N. FireFly 070 Old Kolb http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 17, 2006
From: Robert Mason <masonclan(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Chris Wolf and Mike Maikowski are separate people. They were very close friends. Mike and Chris were in the process of purchasing my Kolb Mark 3X. Robert Mason --- John Hauck wrote: > > | Looks like we have our answer. Chris Wolf and Maikowski are one > and > | the same. > | > | john h > > > Gang: > > Here's one of his (their) books that has both names on it: > > http://jeffcomp.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=100 > > Best I can figure they were the same guy. > > john h > mkIII > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Terry Davis" <davistcs(at)eoni.com>
Subject: Firestar Fuel Tank
Date: Nov 17, 2006
With the posts lately about increased fuel and aluminum tanks I thought I'd add my two cents worth. A priority from the start of building my Firestar was to provide for more and reliable fuel. I'm not much of a fan of plastic jugs either, although their simplicity is a big advantage, I have to admit. Safety in a crash and keeping fuel weight forward as far as possible were other considerations. I ended up making the "bulkhead" at the end of the fuse tube removable and mocking up a cardboard tank that held a little over 14 gallons that sat on the tube and fit the taper inside the cage. The tank is cross baffled with a quick drain at the back of the sump to drain water when parked and the finger strainer at the front which is lowest when flying. If I was doing it again (and I might) I would shape the tank sump somewhat differently and make the fuel inlet at the back to get the last drops while climbing. I just never thought about it until the tank was finished. A drawback of working alone I guess. As it is, with a gallon in the tank it would take a fairly steep climb to unport the inlet. A word about welded tanks and sloshing. I was pretty proud of my tig welding and thought I didn't need no "steenking" sloshing. Wrong! Long (ugly) story short, when I put fuel (mix) in the tank to start the engine break-in I started noticing "oily" spots on the tank. The gas was seeping out, evaporating, and leaving the oil in about 3 places. We all know that a drop of oil spreads out and looks like a gallon, well there were a lot of drops. So I swallowed my pride, rinsed the tank, etched it with Alumi-prep and sloshed it 3 times. No seeps now. I think if you could get a certified welder from Boeing or space shuttle work to weld the tank up it would probably be great, but for this normal mortal, I'll use the slosh. If Kolb made a high capacity plastic molded tank to fit our planes, something with the fuel inlet out the bottom, I sure wouldn't have bothered to make one but since they don't I'm pretty happy with this one. Nothing like a little extra gas, unless the plane is on fire. ;-) Terry Davis N66TD Firestar 1, 503 DCDI, BRS, Powerfin 3 bl. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 17, 2006
From: "Robert Laird" <rlaird(at)cavediver.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
On 11/17/06, David Downey wrote: > > It seems that it would be quite adventuresome to be making pattern turns > at relatively high gross weight at 2-300 feet AGL altitude. IF something > goes wrong there is no time to react or salvage the situation... > Is that what I am hearing? > Maybe I got left out of something somewhere along the lines, but am I the only person who flies the pattern at field altitude+1000 feet? Granted, I'm doing descending turns for base and final, but my turn for final is between 600 and 800 feet. It certainly doesn't sound like something an experienced Kolb pilot would be doing. -- Robert ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 17, 2006
From: "Robert Laird" <rlaird(at)cavediver.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Robert -- Then, my condolences to his friend, Chris. It's not a happy time for anyone. -- Robert On 11/17/06, Robert Mason wrote: > > > Chris Wolf and Mike Maikowski are separate people. They were very close > friends. Mike and Chris were in the process of purchasing my Kolb Mark > 3X. > Robert Mason > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Pilot In Charge
Date: Nov 17, 2006
I'm truly saddened by Dave's death. I only talked to him a few times at Monument Valley 2005 but he appeared to be a great guy. None of us know what happened and we may never know but this may be a good time to discuss pilot in charge procedures. When I first flew with my basic training instructor he went over the basics. The drill was, I'm the pilot, I will give you the controls by saying "your airplane" when I need to take control I will say "my airplane" and you will immediately take your hands off the controls. When you fly with someone else you need to go over these rules. The last thing you want is to be fighting over the controls in a bad situation close to the ground. But just because you go over this doesn't mean they will follow through. You could still find your self fighting a fear stricken passenger fighting the controls. Be prepared to elbow them in the kidneys and maybe the face. What ever you do you may need to do it quickly. Remember this isn't a popularity contest it could be the only thing that saves both of your lives. My $.02 worth Rick Neilsen Redrive VW powered MKIIIc ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Russ Kinne <russ(at)rkiphoto.com>
Subject: Re: Pilot In Charge
Date: Nov 17, 2006
Richard, that was VERY well said. I'm often appalled by the lack of safety procedures in many facets of small-aircraft flying. What you describe should be absolutely mandatory before any flight with passengers, ever. Russ K do not archive On Nov 17, 2006, at 7:57 PM, Richard & Martha Neilsen wrote: > I'm truly saddened by Dave's death. I only talked to him a few > times at Monument Valley 2005 but he appeared to be a great guy. > > None of us know what happened and we may never know but this may be > a good time to discuss pilot in charge procedures. When I first > flew with my basic training instructor he went over the basics. The > drill was, I'm the pilot, I will give you the controls by saying > "your airplane" when I need to take control I will say "my > airplane" and you will immediately take your hands off the > controls. When you fly with someone else you need to go over these > rules. The last thing you want is to be fighting over the controls > in a bad situation close to the ground. But just because you go > over this doesn't mean they will follow through. You could still > find your self fighting a fear stricken passenger fighting the > controls. Be prepared to elbow them in the kidneys and maybe the > face. What ever you do you may need to do it quickly. Remember this > isn't a popularity contest it could be the only thing that saves > both of your lives. > > My $.02 worth > > Rick Neilsen > Redrive VW powered MKIIIc > ============================================================ _- > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List_- > =========================================================== > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Need 503 help!
From: "John Jung" <jrjungjr(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Nov 17, 2006
John Hauck wrote: > > JJ: > Get the Rotax book off the internet that has the procedure for > checking ignition modules, coils, alternator stator, etc. > Thanks, John H. I looked up the how to test the ignition system, did all the tests and everything passed. My flying buddy, Chuck, sugested that maybe there was spark but I didn't see it because of too much daylight. I put everything back together today, closed the hanger doors, and sure enough, I had spark on all plugs. To satisfy myself, I opened the doors again and repeated the test. No visable spark. So, I learned a lesson about Ducati ignitions, but now I still need to find out why my engine didn't start. -------- John Jung Firestar II N6163J Surprise, AZ Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75366#75366 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: WillUribe(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 16, 2006
Subject: Re: Check out Low and slow - Google Video
I don't know, it has been like that for a least 30 years. I guess someone tried to start a new subdivision when gas was less expensive and just didn't make a go of it. Regards, Will do not archive From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Cottrell Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 4:33 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Check out Low and slow - Google Video Why in the world did they cut so many roads in the desert? New subdivision? Larry, Oregon ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Need 503 help!
Date: Nov 17, 2006
| So, I learned a lesson about Ducati ignitions, but now I still need to find out why my engine didn't start. | | -------- | John Jung John J: Don't remember what the book says about spark plug gap. We also use a Ducati ignition on the 912 series engines. The book calls for .028", but many of us run with .020 to .022" gap because there are times the standard gap will not fire during start up. Might try closing the gap up a bit and see if that helps. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 17, 2006
From: "Robert Laird" <rlaird(at)cavediver.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
On 11/17/06, George Thompson wrote: > > No, Why would you clime up to 1000 ft Agl shooting touch and goes in the > pattern. > George - That's been answered by a couple others here, and it would sound trite to say it was "because that's the way I was taught." However, if an instructor teaches you how to do a particular maneuver, do you always just blow it off? Don't you think there's a good reason why s/he, and every other instructor, teaches that maneuver that way? The reason for that "maneuver" has been addressed, and my instructor addressed it, too, when I was training. But unless I have many years of experience AND good cause to alter the way a maneuver was taught to me, then I'll typically do it that way indefinitely. "Good cause", to me, FYI, does NOT include "convenient" or "faster" or "easier"... all those things stack up and spell "complacent." I have always tried hard to fly my UL as if it were an N-numbered experimental... in my minds eye, that's how I see it, anyway. Typically, I find I get a lot more respect from ALL pilots when I behave that way. -- Robert P.S. Besides, with a climb rate the envy of all my GA neighbors, it's fun to show it off at each touch-n-go! :-) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rick Pearce" <rap(at)isp.com>
Subject: Preheating 912
Date: Nov 18, 2006
Now that cold weather is up on us I need to come up with a way to preheat my 912 on Mark3 Classic Instead of reinventing the wheel I figured I would ask the list and see how other people are doing it. Rick Pearce do not archieve ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Need 503 help!
From: "John Jung" <jrjungjr(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Nov 18, 2006
John Hauck wrote: > > John J: > > Don't remember what the book says about spark plug gap. We also use a > Ducati ignition on the 912 series engines. The book calls for .028", > but many of us run with .020 to .022" gap because there are times the > standard gap will not fire during start up. Might try closing the gap > up a bit and see if that helps. > > john h > mkIII Plugs are at .014 - .018 per the book for a 503 Ducati. I will be doing some testing to try to find out what is going on with the engine. It seems to be getting fussy and I am losing confidence it it. -------- John Jung Firestar II N6163J Surprise, AZ Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75406#75406 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: snuffy(at)usol.com
Subject: Re: Preheating 912
Date: Nov 18, 2006
I've never preheated a 912 but did so on a Continental 4 banger. I got one of those small catylitic heaters that screw on to a propane bottle. Hunters and ice fisherman use them up here in the cold north. Then I got some 6 inch diameter expanding aluminum ducting. I could position it so it ran up under the cowling and up next to the oil sump. I'd then place the propane bottle on the ground, light the burner and put the ducting over the burner. Worked quite well. > Now that cold weather is up on us I need to come up with a way to > preheat my 912 on Mark3 Classic Instead of reinventing the wheel I > figured I would ask the list and see how other people are doing it. > Rick Pearce > do not archieve do not archieve ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Head sets
From: "John Jung" <jrjungjr(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Nov 18, 2006
This would be a good question for Comtronics. I don't think that they are compatable. -------- John Jung Firestar II N6163J Surprise, AZ Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75408#75408 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <kfackler(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: Snuffy: Flying over you
Date: Nov 18, 2006
Hey, Kirk! It's nice to see a post from you. I'm leaving for the airport now (circa 0830) to meet up with Mark and Grey for a flight up to Frankenmuth. We'll be departing Ray at 10a. Wave at us as we go over! -Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: <snuffy(at)usol.com> Sent: Saturday, November 18, 2006 9:34 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Preheating 912 > > I've never preheated a 912 but did so on a Continental 4 banger. I > got one of those small catylitic heaters that screw on to a propane > bottle. Hunters and ice fisherman use them up here in the cold north. > Then I got some 6 inch diameter expanding aluminum ducting. I could > position it so it ran up under the cowling and up next to the oil sump. > I'd then place the propane bottle on the ground, light the burner and > put the ducting over the burner. Worked quite well. > > > Now that cold weather is up on us I need to come up with a way > to > > preheat my 912 on Mark3 Classic Instead of reinventing the wheel I > > figured I would ask the list and see how other people are doing it. > > Rick Pearce > > do not archieve > do not archieve > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 18, 2006
| I have always tried hard to fly my UL as if it were an N-numbered | experimental... in my minds eye, that's how I see it, anyway. | | -- Robert Robert: Thought you were flying a MKIII? john h mkIII N101AB ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "J.D. Stewart" <jstewart(at)inebraska.com>
Subject: Preheating 912
Date: Nov 18, 2006
Use one of those stick-on engine heater pads on your oil tank. After a few seconds warm oil is running all through your engine. I found them at Bomgaars, Tractor Supply, but I would bet auto parts stores would have them too. J.D. Stewart UltraFun AirSports, LLC www.ultrafunairsports.com > > I've never preheated a 912 but did so on a Continental 4 > banger. I got one of those small catylitic heaters that > screw on to a propane bottle. Hunters and ice fisherman use > them up here in the cold north. > Then I got some 6 inch diameter expanding aluminum ducting. I > could position it so it ran up under the cowling and up next > to the oil sump. > I'd then place the propane bottle on the ground, light the > burner and put the ducting over the burner. Worked quite well. > > > Now that cold weather is up on us I need to come up with a way > to > > preheat my 912 on Mark3 Classic Instead of reinventing the wheel I > > figured I would ask the list and see how other people are doing it. > > Rick Pearce > > do not archieve > do not archieve ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "J.D. Stewart" <jstewart(at)inebraska.com>
Subject: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 18, 2006
I almost didn't pass my PPL practical test because I turned crosswind at the same point I normally would in my Titan or Challenger, just past the end of the runway. I was flying a C-152 for the practical, and the CFI stressed to me that I don't turn crosswind until I have reached pattern altitude. It didn't matter that it was 90 degrees out, that we could only put 9 gallons of gas in it to avoid going over gross, and that it would take 3~4 miles to get to 1000'. We were going to head straight out until we got there. With most Kolb's amazing climb, 1000' shouldn't take more than a minute anyway. J.D. Stewart UltraFun AirSports, LLC www.ultrafunairsports.com Hey guy's, here is the way I see it. Number one 1000ft AGL is the standard pattern altitude as long as you are in the pattern doing TAG or what ever. You should be 500 ft before turning cross wind and maintain a safe airspeed at all times. There are a lot of accidents that happen in the pattern, sticking to regulations makes all of us safer. And it keeps the GA pilots happy . And remember altitude is good Ins. To have something go wrong at 200 to 300 ft you don't have much time to react.. Fly safe... Bill Futrell No, Why would you clime up to 1000 ft Agl shooting touch and goes in the pattern. George On 11/17/06, David Downey wrote: It seems that it would be quite adventuresome to be making pattern turns at relatively high gross weight at 2-300 feet AGL altitude. IF something goes wrong there is no time to react or salvage the situation... Is that what I am hearing? Maybe I got left out of something somewhere along the lines, but am I the only person who flies the pattern at field altitude+1000 feet? Granted, I'm doing descending turns for base and final, but my turn for final is between 600 and 800 feet. It certainly doesn't sound like something an experienced Kolb pilot would be doing. -- Robert ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Thom Riddle <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: Firestar Fuel Tank
Date: Nov 18, 2006
Alternative aluminum fuel tank leak fix (aluminium, for Pat). When I was driving a Titan, built by someone else, the home-built aluminum fuel tank sprung a couple leaks at the welded seams. I used Pro-Seal to fix the leaks and it worked great. It is my understanding that this is the stuff that many airlines use to patch their aluminum fuel tank leaks. It is available from Aircraft Spruce, maybe others too. Not cheap and messy to work with but it does work very well. Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 18, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Need 503 help!
At 08:56 PM 11/17/2006, you wrote: > >I looked up the how to test the ignition system, did all the tests >and everything passed. My flying buddy, Chuck, sugested that maybe >there was spark but I didn't see it because of too much daylight. I >put everything back together today, closed the hanger doors, and >sure enough, I had spark on all plugs. To satisfy myself, I opened >the doors again and repeated the test. No visable spark. > >So, I learned a lesson about Ducati ignitions, but now I still need >to find out why my engine didn't start. > >-------- >John Jung Might want to make sure the "vent lines" aren't clogged up. If it's a single carb, it won't start if the the holes in the bottom of theses little tubes are clogged. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: E-box gears for sale
From: "Paul Petty" <paulpetty(at)hughesnet.com>
Date: Nov 18, 2006
Hi Gang, Buddy of mine has been trying to get the right combo for his warp prop and new 582. Think he has it right now and has 2 sets of very low time gear sets for a E-box he wants to sell. 1 is a 3.47 ratio and the other is 2.62. They cost 500 bucks new any one needing a set will find a good deal here. I am going to post them on e-bay next week for him but wanted to see if my kolb brothers needed them first! if interested call me @ 601-480-9979 or e-mail. Make offer. Paul -------- Paul Petty Kolbra #12 Ms Dixie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75443#75443 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 18, 2006
From: Erik Grabowski <grabo172(at)sc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Patterns
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found --- A message with no text/plain MIME section was received. The entire body of the message was removed. Please resend the email using Plain Text formatting. HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section in their client's default configuration. If you're using HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text". --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found --- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 18, 2006
| Also John remember we fly our experimental Kolbs into Oshkosh as ultralights | and land at the "ultralight strip" | Rick Neilsen Thought it was an airstrip for light planes, ultralights, rotorcraft, flying bed sheets, trikes, and rag bags. Rick, you need to explain your statement above. Folks, don't forget, many of us fly out of cow pastures, back yards, deserts, desert roads, gravel bars, hay fields, borrow pits, and parking lots, etc. I fly in and out of my cow pasture in a routine manner. Usually, the same procedure each time, except when the wind changes my landing direction. Does it look like a traffic pattern at an airport. Probably not in the least. I don't know the first thing about the airstrip AZ Dave was flying out of, other than an abandoned WWII field. Probably nothing out there but the old strip and desert. Doubt if many GA aircraft fly in and out of there, but I may be wrong. AZ George can enlighten us on the airstrip at Paulden. Personally, I don't see anything wrong with 100 or 200 ft pattern altitude at Paulden, if it is not an official FAA recognized airport. Kolbs are more than happy flying at that altitude as they are at 1,000 feet. Kolbs don't stall because of insufficient altitude, but insufficient airspeed. From the few photos I saw of the area, looked like a lot of flat high desert to me. I could be wrong though. Plenty places to do an off field landing, if necessary. I believe Dave did one a year or so ago and busted his mkIII. Some of us have flown coast to coast, low level, and I don't mean less than 10,000 feet. When I fly in and out of airports, I fly the traffic pattern, usually not nearly as big as the GA guys. Why, because I don't need to. Many times I have landed ahead of GA (150, 152, etc.) aircraft that were flying B-52 type traffic patterns, even though they entered the traffic pattern long before I did. At my local airport, 08A, I can fly 3 or 4 Kolb traffic patterns before a 152 flies a single pattern. Its been a while since I went through primary flight training, but if I remember correctly (and if I don't, John W will certainly correct me), I can turn cross wind when I clear the departure end of the runway, turn down wind when I reach traffic pattern altitude, turn base and start my descent when I am 45 degrees from the approach end of the runway, and turn final so I'll roll out lined up on the center line of the runway. Maybe ya'll do it different now. ;-) Take care, john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 18, 2006
Hi, re pattern flying. 1000ft seems awfully high. In the UK there is usually an ultralight pattern at 6 or 800 ft and smaller than the regular GA pattern leading to a grass runway parallel to the main tarmac. In my own field I fly lower and my approach is of the `turn left behind the big elm tree` variety. Partly because I like doing it and partly because I learned to fly in gliders and they generally fly a pretty loosely defined sort of pattern like that. I wouldn`t dream of doing that at a `proper` field. Ultralighters have a bad enough name anyway without deliberately acting in a stupid, and probably dangerous manner. Whoever suggested flying without a license, in whatever circumstances should be locked up for the benefit of the rest of us. Imagine the headlines. Uninsured and unlicenced pilot crashes on house killing mother of 4 children. The general public think we should be grounded when they discover that we have no radio and file no flight plans, let alone fly without a licence. The entire movement would be crucified and regulations would be piled on evryone. Just look at the demands to stop GA flights down the river after that plane flew into the skyscaper. As for `showing off my super climb rate`....fine in your own field with your mates..on a GA field you are nuts. Traffic on a field is planned on the basis of everyone having roughly similar perfomances and if you suddenly climb at twice the usual rate you upset the expectations of every other pilot in the pattern and throw off their planning. Perhaps it is a function of the space you have in the States and the fact that you can fly a long, long way from any authority but happenstance will get you in the end. Cheers Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Firestar Fuel Tank
Date: Nov 18, 2006
Alternative aluminum fuel tank leak fix (aluminium, for Pat).>> Hi Thom, thank you for you consideraton. Cheers Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
From: WillUribe(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 18, 2006
Subject: Re: Check out Low and slow - Google Video
Hi Larry, I did some asking around and found out the roads were cut for colonias. The city could not afford to annex them because once annexed the city would have to install all infrastructure. This was a thorn in it's side because they couldn't expand it's tax base. After the roads were cut colonias were outlawed, a law was passed prohibiting the sale of small lots unless they had utilities. In a nut shell, depriving low income families from affording property. Colonias lack essential elements of infrastructure. They are unincorporated community located within 150 miles of the U.S.-Mexico border, with a population of less than 10,000 that is low and very low income, and which lacks safe, sanitary and sound housing, as well as services such as potable water, adequate sewage systems, drainage, streets and utilities. Colonias are usually found in rural areas. Subdivisions are usually created out of cheap desert land. Usually it is not in a city's interest to annex a colonia because it would subsequently be required to provide it with such city services as water, electricity, and sewage, even though the tax revenue from annexed colonias would probably not cover the cost of installation and use of services. Counties, under whose jurisdiction colonias tend to be, are usually not required to render such services. In contrast with shantytowns in other parts of the world, however, most residents actually do legally own the land on which they reside To make this post Kolb relevant here are some pictures flying over the desert taken a couple of weeks ago. Regards, Will do not archive From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Cottrell Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 4:33 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Check out Low and slow - Google Video Why in the world did they cut so many roads in the desert? New subdivision? Larry, Oregon ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 18, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Patterns
Our airport has an "Ultralight" pattern different from the GA pattern. Stay below 600 ft AGL, shorter turns, inside of GA planes, use the middle half of the runway, etc. Cartersville VPC field elevation is 759 MSL. UL pattern is 1,300 ft MSL. Guess old dogs can learn 'new tricks. http://www.georgiasportflyers.com/pages/patterns.htm ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 18, 2006
purple-faced gentleman with | steam coming out of his ears and a clipboard (or summons book) in his | hand, wearing a cap that says "FAA", approaching your aircraft after | landing -- Russ K: Know what that is. Couple years ago, John W, Gary H, and I, got nailed by one of those when we arrived at the UL airstrip, Sun and Fun, Lakeland, FL. What an ass hole, pardon my French. Luckily we had John W with us. John W squared this short, fat, ill mannered SOB away in short order. John asked him if he had read the NOTAM for the UL airstrip. FAA type replied, negative. John said there were more than 30 pages for the main airport and one paragraph of a few lines for the UL airstrip. What the FAA type was trying to nail us on, illegal low pass was not in the UL NOTAM. The airstrip was closed, except for arrivals. I was flying lead on a three ship formation. Was my duty to drag the field to insure it was safe to land. All three of us drug the field, but we stayed south of the ditch that parallels the airstrip, which is covered in the daily briefings at Lakeland each year. End of story, FAA type departed in his little golf cart never to bother us again, I hope. ;-) Take care, john h mkIII PS: What was the question? ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Patterns
From: "grabo172" <grabo172(at)sc.rr.com>
Date: Nov 18, 2006
You're welcome for the diagram... Of course that's for any standard airport... I think that UL patter from the other post is a good example of what we would be expected to do in our planes... Those who land at other than a standard airport of course have to modify the standard pattern to fit terrain and field length and so on. Speaking of... I'm curious because this is something that I'm wanting to learn how to do... when you all do land wherever, such as a creek bank or sand bar or cow pasture, do you generally know the owners of the land or know the public places where you won't bother anyone? Every once in a while I see a nice place that I'd like to stop by, land, and see on the ground but never do because I'd hate to get in someone's land and have them call the police or something... -------- -Erik Grabowski Kolb Firestar N197BG CFI/CFII Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75496#75496 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 18, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Patterns
At 07:53 PM 11/18/2006, you wrote: >nd at other than a standard airport of course have to modify the >standard pattern to fit terrain and field length and so on. > >Speaking of... I'm curious because this is something that I'm >wanting to learn how to do... when you all do land wherever, such as >a creek bank or sand bar or cow pasture, do you generally know the >owners of the land or know the public places where you won't bother anyone? > >-------- >-Erik Grabowski My old Firestar had a large decal on the boom tube. People would look - but never seemed to bother me. Worked pretty good when I had my helmet camera on. Not that I would suggest this to anyone else. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 18, 2006
From: "Charles Davis" <ceddavis(at)gmail.com>
Subject: New Pilot
Well, A month ago I passed my sport pilot written. Today I passed my practical and am now a Sport Pilot. Total "N-Number" time, 9.5 hours, thanks to the registered UL exemptions. 41 years too late, but still happy to get it done. If you can't fly a kolb, I highly recommend an Evecktor Sportstar. Now, there's only to scrape togetehr the $$$... http://www.sportaircraftinternational.com/ Chuck ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 532 engine ignition
From: "blackbird" <blackbird754(at)alltel.net>
Date: Nov 18, 2006
Ok guys, Today at our meeting I tried to fly my 532 engine again....It has Steve Beattys aftermarket ignition system in it.....The pickup coil has gone again (behind the flywheel)..Is their anything I can do besides replace the engine ....It runs great ...till no spark.... And yes its the coil......I unwound the thing to find a broken wire on the winding.... Do NOT want to take the engine off of the Kolbra to fly this aircraft....Is points better.......Maybe they will at least sputter..... Thanks.... WT Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75504#75504 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: FSII Pictures
From: "Richard Pike" <richard(at)bcchapel.org>
Date: Nov 18, 2006
Took some pictures of Ed's Firestar II this afternoon, some of them came out pretty good. After we got back on the ground, took my MKIII apart and put it in the garage, time for some winter maintenance, fix that cranky radio that quit working, and put some dihedral in the wings. Going to see if the MKIII can be made to fly hands off like the FSII does. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75522#75522 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1020312_large_135.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1020310_large_342.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1020276_large_180.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1020256_large_139.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1020214_large_702.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1020206_large_723.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 447 EGT?
From: "grabo172" <grabo172(at)sc.rr.com>
Date: Nov 18, 2006
Hey all, Since I've piped up a bit today, I think I'll ask a question too... Why doesn't the 447 have an EGT spec? Just wondering... Thanks! -------- -Erik Grabowski Kolb Firestar N197BG CFI/CFII Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75543#75543 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/egt_599.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 19, 2006
From: Scott Perkins <2scott(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: video for steel tube construction
I saw mention elsewhere of this being pretty good http://www.jumprunenterprises.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 18, 2006
From: "Robert Laird" <rlaird(at)cavediver.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Yes, a MkIII w/ 912S On 11/18/06, John Hauck wrote: > > > | I have always tried hard to fly my UL as if it were an N-numbered > | experimental... in my minds eye, that's how I see it, anyway. > | > | -- Robert > > > Robert: > > Thought you were flying a MKIII? > > john h > mkIII > N101AB > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 19, 2006
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
From: Todd Fredricks <flyingfox(at)copper.net>
John: In our Class D, traffic permitting I routinely turn crosswind as soon as I have 500 feet AGL and no runway remaining. I do not wait for the departure end. The less turn I have to make in the event of an engine failure the better. PKB has a tower and a crosswind runway and as long as you communicate they let you do pretty much anything within the realm of safety. 21 has a big valley and woods at the end of it so I like to get pointed back toward concrete as soon as possible during repeated patterns and power changes. There is an AIM method of patterns but as I learned long ago about holding patterns, there are really just two practical rules: stay in the protected side of the hold and enter in the most expeditious and practical means possible. All else is mishmash. It will be good, if possible, to determine why Dave's airplane crashed, but one thing I learned from sailplane flying, if it has a wing, it typically wants to fly and if left alone to do its thing properly it usually will. Todd On 11/18/06 2:30 PM, "John Hauck" wrote: > > > > | Also John remember we fly our experimental Kolbs into Oshkosh as > ultralights > | and land at the "ultralight strip" > > | Rick Neilsen > > Thought it was an airstrip for light planes, ultralights, rotorcraft, > flying bed sheets, trikes, and rag bags. > > Rick, you need to explain your statement above. > > Folks, don't forget, many of us fly out of cow pastures, back yards, > deserts, desert roads, gravel bars, hay fields, borrow pits, and > parking lots, etc. > > I fly in and out of my cow pasture in a routine manner. Usually, the > same procedure each time, except when the wind changes my landing > direction. Does it look like a traffic pattern at an airport. > Probably not in the least. I don't know the first thing about the > airstrip AZ Dave was flying out of, other than an abandoned WWII > field. Probably nothing out there but the old strip and desert. > Doubt if many GA aircraft fly in and out of there, but I may be wrong. > AZ George can enlighten us on the airstrip at Paulden. > > Personally, I don't see anything wrong with 100 or 200 ft pattern > altitude at Paulden, if it is not an official FAA recognized airport. > Kolbs are more than happy flying at that altitude as they are at 1,000 > feet. Kolbs don't stall because of insufficient altitude, but > insufficient airspeed. From the few photos I saw of the area, looked > like a lot of flat high desert to me. I could be wrong though. > Plenty places to do an off field landing, if necessary. I believe > Dave did one a year or so ago and busted his mkIII. > > Some of us have flown coast to coast, low level, and I don't mean less > than 10,000 feet. > > When I fly in and out of airports, I fly the traffic pattern, usually > not nearly as big as the GA guys. Why, because I don't need to. Many > times I have landed ahead of GA (150, 152, etc.) aircraft that were > flying B-52 type traffic patterns, even though they entered the > traffic pattern long before I did. At my local airport, 08A, I can > fly 3 or 4 Kolb traffic patterns before a 152 flies a single pattern. > > Its been a while since I went through primary flight training, but if > I remember correctly (and if I don't, John W will certainly correct > me), I can turn cross wind when I clear the departure end of the > runway, turn down wind when I reach traffic pattern altitude, turn > base and start my descent when I am 45 degrees from the approach end > of the runway, and turn final so I'll roll out lined up on the center > line of the runway. Maybe ya'll do it different now. ;-) > > Take care, > > john h > mkIII > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: N27SB(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 19, 2006
Subject: Re: Patterns
To All, Changing from Experimental Land Plane to UL Floatplane has been a lot of fun. Take off and Landing takes on a new perspective. Every approach is different. Most approaches are a 90 to 180 degree steep descending spiral and much like John's Cow Field your landing spot is subject to change second to second. Give it a try sometime Steve FF007 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 19, 2006
From: "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net>
Subject: FSII Dihedral
> >It flies hands off, you can drive it around with rudder only, and it seems >to handle very well. Flown it like that for a year, no negatives. I put my >MKIII in the garage yesterday, it is getting longer wing struts and we'll >see how it does. Richard, It seems like it would require additional rudder to side or forward slip. This could be a factor for cross wind landings. Have you noticed any difference? What is the actual dihedral in degrees? Has it influenced roll rate? Jack B. Hart FF004 Winchester, IN ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 19, 2006
I must add to this pattern thread. Our field is an old WW II field. At one time it had a light asphalt covering, but now only a small spot or to is all that is left of the paving. It is dirt and a mile long with no obstructions at either end nor on the sides. We normally make the take off near the middle of the field and usually make our first turn by the time we reach the departcher end.There are homes now starting to be built near the South side, but we have always flown a right hand pattern. There are three homes on the North side, two of them are pilots.There are two GA planes there and Four ultralingt type hangered there. The field is on the charts as "Pilots Rest" and private.It is as John says mostly high desert open country. It is an ideal place to fly because of the weather and an ultrllalight and even a GA plane could make a forced landing anywhere off field. It is seldom used by GA aircraft other than the ones housed there or from the neighboring field to the South. I think that "Big Lar" is the only other Kolber who has visited our field. Jump in her Lar and give your comments. I don't recommend using the pattern that we use here at other fields. Always use the altitude that is recommended for that field.That is what I have always done. We have been comfortable using the 3-500 feet altitude here and will continue to do so. Dave's Wife, Eve requests that in lew of flowers, donations be made to the EAA Young Eagles program in Dave's name. Or send them to her home. Mrs. David Pelletier 1134 Fair St. Prescott. Az.86305 Az Bald Eagle George Thompson . ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Sent: Saturday, November 18, 2006 12:30 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dave's accident > > > | Also John remember we fly our experimental Kolbs into Oshkosh as > ultralights > | and land at the "ultralight strip" > > | Rick Neilsen > > Thought it was an airstrip for light planes, ultralights, rotorcraft, > flying bed sheets, trikes, and rag bags. > > Rick, you need to explain your statement above. > > Folks, don't forget, many of us fly out of cow pastures, back yards, > deserts, desert roads, gravel bars, hay fields, borrow pits, and > parking lots, etc. > > I fly in and out of my cow pasture in a routine manner. Usually, the > same procedure each time, except when the wind changes my landing > direction. Does it look like a traffic pattern at an airport. > Probably not in the least. I don't know the first thing about the > airstrip AZ Dave was flying out of, other than an abandoned WWII > field. Probably nothing out there but the old strip and desert. > Doubt if many GA aircraft fly in and out of there, but I may be wrong. > AZ George can enlighten us on the airstrip at Paulden. > > Personally, I don't see anything wrong with 100 or 200 ft pattern > altitude at Paulden, if it is not an official FAA recognized airport. > Kolbs are more than happy flying at that altitude as they are at 1,000 > feet. Kolbs don't stall because of insufficient altitude, but > insufficient airspeed. From the few photos I saw of the area, looked > like a lot of flat high desert to me. I could be wrong though. > Plenty places to do an off field landing, if necessary. I believe > Dave did one a year or so ago and busted his mkIII. > > Some of us have flown coast to coast, low level, and I don't mean less > than 10,000 feet. > > When I fly in and out of airports, I fly the traffic pattern, usually > not nearly as big as the GA guys. Why, because I don't need to. Many > times I have landed ahead of GA (150, 152, etc.) aircraft that were > flying B-52 type traffic patterns, even though they entered the > traffic pattern long before I did. At my local airport, 08A, I can > fly 3 or 4 Kolb traffic patterns before a 152 flies a single pattern. > > Its been a while since I went through primary flight training, but if > I remember correctly (and if I don't, John W will certainly correct > me), I can turn cross wind when I clear the departure end of the > runway, turn down wind when I reach traffic pattern altitude, turn > base and start my descent when I am 45 degrees from the approach end > of the runway, and turn final so I'll roll out lined up on the center > line of the runway. Maybe ya'll do it different now. ;-) > > Take care, > > john h > mkIII > > > -- > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 19, 2006
From: Charles Blackwell <wozani(at)optonline.net>
Subject: MkII Twinstar for sale
Still have my MkII Twinstar with 503 DCDI for sale in NJ. Will give to good home for $8,000. Advertisements on Barnstormers and Aviation Classifieds. Charles Blackwell MkII in NJ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <kfackler(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: Stories of off-airport landings
Date: Nov 19, 2006
Russ Kinne wrote: >>FWIW I've landed on lots of off-airport sites, never had a problem, >>usually invited in for coffee, a meal, or even overnite. Not to diminish from the sorrow we're all feeling over Az Dave, but I think Russ has broached a wonderful topic, to wit, things experienced after an off-airport landing. I'd like to suggest that this threat NOT be about what happened to the airplane, i.e., you damaged the landing gear or whatever, but be about the EXPERIENCES you had, good or bad. In that vein, I'll start with this one: This was quite a few years ago, while flying from an ultralights-only field in Red Oak, Tx. I was in the air and noticed that a bungee cord used to hold one of the tail-bracing wires safely out of the prop arc had come undone. Now, this was certainly no emergency but I felt more comfortable making a precautionary landing and reattaching it. So I picked a likely looking field that appeared to have been recently mowed or harvested and swooshed in. After landing, I taxied to the end of the field from which I expected to take off, turned into the wind and killed the engine. As I was climbing out, I noticed a pickup truck nosing into the field. Now in my experience this isn't an unusual occurence. It seems that an ultralight landing attracts onlookers in vehicles quite as much as a bloody, multiple car pileup. So anyway, I tossed the chap a casual wave and went about the business of reattaching the offending bungee cord. When I stood up and turned around I found myself looking down the barrel of a gun. Not being an expert on such matters, I can't tell you what type of gun it was, except that it was some kind of rifle and the bore looked like big enough at that moment that I thought I could fly through it! "Uh, what's wrong?" says I. Brilliant, just brilliant. It turns out (surprised?) that he was the owner of the field and he was righteously ticked off! Apparently some time in the not too distant past a glider club had been making free with his field, landing there and then driving vehicles and trailers all over his hay to retrieve them. He had told them in no uncertain terms to clear out and not come back. Since his home was just across the highway from this field, it was unavoidable that he'd seen me land. And, not illogically, he assumed I was part of the glider club. After some very tense moments, I managed to convince him that I wasn't a member of that club and had only chosen his field for a semi-emergency and that if he'd only not shoot me I'd be on my way without any undue harm to his crop. After all, this was a real ultralight (not a Kolb back then, alas) and it didn't weigh much, hardly leaving even any wheel impressions on the stubble. I eventually soothed his ruffled feathers, then soothed my own nerves enough to get airborne and safely home. Who'd have thought you could come so close to getting killed in an ultralight while it was on the ground?! Next story? -Ken Fackler Kolb Mark II / A722KWF Rochester MI ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Stories of off-airport landings
From: "R. Hankins" <rphanks(at)grantspass.com>
Date: Nov 19, 2006
Last summer I landed in an alfalfa field about 7 miles southeast of Montegue, CA due to high bladder pressure. I took care of the pressure problem and was stretching my legs a little when I saw a vehicle approaching. A weathered older gentleman in a well used brown Ford F-250 pulled up next to me in a swirl of dust. I walked over, shook hands and explained the high pressure situation. He just chuckled and told me he thought I might need some help, so he drove out to see. We talked for a while, and by the time I left his son and a hired hand had shown up. That made three beat up pickup trucks in the field waiting to watch me take off. I've never run into anyone in a bad mood while landing out. I'll keep my fingers crossed. -------- Roger in Oregon 1992 KXP 503 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75633#75633 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Picture of Homer Kolb
Date: Nov 19, 2006
George A: Thanks for bringing that to our attention. Here is the info on the deregistered Kolb Feather: Deregistered Aircraft 1 of 1 Aircraft Description Serial Number K2 Type Registration Unknown Manufacturer Name KOLB Certificate Issue Date None Model KOLB FEATHER Mode S Code 50307012 Year Manufacturer None Cancel Date / / Reason for Cancellation Unknown Exported To Notice the Serial Number: K2. Must have been the second Kolb aircraft Homer built and flew. Too bad there are no dates on it. Here's the info on the other Kolb: Aircraft Description Serial Number 3-A Type Registration Corporation Manufacturer Name KOLB COMPANY INC Certificate Issue Date 01/28/1984 Model TWIN STAR MSK-1 Status Undel Tri Type Aircraft Fixed Wing Single-Engine Type Engine Reciprocating Pending Number Change None Dealer No Date Change Authorized None Mode S Code 50307012 MFR Year 1983 Fractional Owner NO This aircraft was built in 1983 and registered in 1984. That is cool. I love Kolb history. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Pike" <richard(at)bcchapel.org>
Subject: Re: Patterns
Date: Nov 19, 2006
I think that is called a "Hobbs meter pattern." When I was a controller at Albany, GA, we had an instructor that preferred that sort of pattern, we also had a cropduster school at the field, and the duster instructors took the attitude that if your downwind or base legs got further from the runway than gliding distance, you were an idiot. So occasionally we had things like "Stearman 59Charlie, you're number two following the Skipper." "Roger tower, 59Charlie following the Skipper doing the bomber pattern." "Tower, this is Skipper 8Uniform Sierra, we are flying a normal pattern!" "Tower this is Stearman 59Charlie, tell the Skipper that the bomber base is east of town, and that's where they normally fly that sort of pattern." etc. Since the instructor in the Skipper really was an idiot, we gave the cropduster instructors a fairly free hand to rag him... Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) ----- Original Message ----- From: "jimhefner" <hefner_jim(at)msn.com> Sent: Sunday, November 19, 2006 11:49 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Patterns > > My GA CFI is from the old school and wants me to fly 1 mile finals.... > with stabilized approach. He also stresses no turns until 500' altitude > gain and wants me to be at pattern alt (1000' at 57AZ) by the time I turn > downwind if staying in the pattern, so it requires long legs at the climb > rate of a 150. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Pike" <richard(at)bcchapel.org>
Subject: Re: FSII Dihedral
Date: Nov 19, 2006
----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net> Sent: Sunday, November 19, 2006 9:43 AM Subject: Kolb-List: FSII Dihedral > Richard, > > It seems like it would require additional rudder to side or forward slip. > This could be a factor for cross wind landings. Have you noticed any > difference? What is the actual dihedral in degrees? Has it influenced > roll rate? > > Jack B. Hart FF004 > Winchester, IN Jack, I don't know if it requires any additional rudder to slip because we never flew it without dihedral. So what it does now is what it has always done. But it slips pretty good. Roll rate is great, it improved when we redid the control horn, moved the lower ends of the aileron pushrods inboard and reduced the stick pressure. Vince Nicely had flown his FSII for several years with this same dihedral before we did this FSII, so we just used his numbers. He raised the tips 9.8 inches from flat, the lift struts needed an extra 2.25 inches in length. The actual dihedral in degrees turns out to be about 3.6 degrees. Vince had an occasion to land on grass with an eleven knot direct crosswind and had no problems with the extra dihedral. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Thom Riddle <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: English vs. Ahmurican
Date: Nov 19, 2006
Hello Pat, My son-in-law (from Carlisle), occasionally reminds me of the mother tongue's spelling and pronunciation variances with the Ahmurican version of the de facto world language. Some say music is the common language of the world but perhaps enthusiasm for thing that fly might qualify as the great uniter. Your humble servant, Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Thom Riddle <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: Pilot In ChargePilot In Charge
Date: Nov 19, 2006
Will, I am very glad you lived to tell us this story of your Uncle's freezing the controls for you. It could very well have turned out far worse. I think the FAA passenger notification requirement should include "Don't touch the controls unless I'm dead. After that you can do whatever you want with them." Thom in Buffalo ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Lee/Cannon" <leecannon(at)telus.net>
Subject: twinstar structure
Date: Nov 19, 2006
Hello Kolb folks - My name is Rob Cannon, and I recently purchased a Twinstar 532 in Vancouver B.C. Canada. I understand the structure is similar to the firestar II, and I am considering installing the hks 60 hp. Any comments ?? thanks, Rob ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: English vs. Ahmurican
Date: Nov 19, 2006
enthusiasm for thing that fly might qualify as the great uniter.>> You could be right Thom. I collect signed aviation prints and went to a recent `signing` and there were the old boys, German and English who fought each other in their Spits and Hurricanes against the Me 109 and Fw 190`s all chatting away and getting along famously. Last weekend there was a seminar at one of our Universities where the Argentinians who invaded the Falklands and the Brits who took it back met up for the weekend. All buddies. Carlisle???? they speak worse English up there than you do.... Heh! Heh! Cheers Pat :-) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 19, 2006
What does a "happenstance" look like?>> John, I think Russ Kines description will do just fine. I remember getting cursed when flying my glider out of Compton Abbas, a local hill top field. A road runs alongside the field which is bordered by quite a large wood. Because of the wood and the curve of the hill top the field is invisible from the South. I had only flown from the field a couple of times and on this occasion I had taken my first airotow launch. In error a short rope was used and the tug and I left the ground and flew through the curl over from the valley leaving me facing one way and the tug, at a different height, facing the other. In fact the tug pilot said later that he almost pulled the plug on me. Returning to the field I suddenly discovered that it was invisible. I could see the road and the local towns and village and was certain of my position but the field was gone. Height was slipping away as I just flew blind at minimum sink rate towards where the field MUST be. I just about cleared the wood and with great relief actually saw the field. Unfortunately I was 90 degrees to the strip, about halfway along its length and only about 50ft up.The strip was too narrow to land across so I stuck the the nose down to get a bit of speed, stuffed the port wing over as steeply as I could and applied a bootful of left rudder.Centralised everything and bum;ped to a halt. As I gathered myself together there was the pounding of feet and the extremely irate owner of the field was glaring into the cockpit. shaking with rage " Pat, If thats the *******way they taught you to ******* fly at ******Keevil you can get yourself and your *****glider off my *****field and never *****well come back" Luckily I knew him well and bought him a beer later and all was well, But there was no doubt that I fully deserved the telling off. Cheers Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 19, 2006
I'm amazed that I'm the only one who's stopped there, George. My memory of your private strip is mostly of wide open spaces, a huge airstrip, taxiways everywhere, widely spaced houses, mostly owned by pilots with planes of several types in their driveways, and an easy going, pleasant attitude from everybody I met. I really liked it, really enjoyed myself, and wouldn't mind living there myself. I even enjoyed being scrunched into the backseat (??) of your FS II, cramps and all. :-) We certainly did fly low & slow, and saw antelope, deer and coyotes. The antelope almost outran the airplane. To show I wasn't too scared off, I even scrunched into the back seat of Larry Cottrell's FS II at the Alvord a couple of years ago. Larry's a little (??) bigger than you, my chest was the support for his seat back, and my knees were his elbow rests. I think so, anyway - I was pretty numb. When I took a deep breath, Larry's forehead hit the windshield. I could actually move my hands and head - a bit. I could tell you much about groaning with a non-resolvable cramp, but I enjoyed that ride, too. I've flown out of several strips that had dual patterns, since I've flown both ultralights and GA airplanes - mostly GA, but enuf UL's to give me a perspective of their different requirements. With the situation at your place, I don't see any problem with either or both patterns, assuming people watch and listen. Dave's turning crosswind at 300 ft or so doesn't strike me as a bad thing at all, given the situation there. A stall/spin from close to 1,000 ft probably won't be resolved in time, either. I've done quite a few spins (intentional) with instructors in Port Angeles, WA, and seems to me that it took 1000 to 1200 ft or so to straighten out the plane. My 1st spin - on my 1st solo flight in a Cessna 172 - was totally un-intentional, is a long story, and took well over 2,000 ft to resolve, but that was my fault, as was the spin. Once again, lack of airspeed causes stalls and spins, not altitude. We could speculate forever, and point fingers back & forth, and never know for sure what really happened that day, tho' it's purely guaranteed that it was a crying shame. Dave will be missed. Lar. Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net> Sent: Sunday, November 19, 2006 8:26 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dave's accident > > I must add to this pattern thread. Our field is an old WW II field. At one > time it had a light asphalt covering, but now only a small spot or to is > all that is left of the paving. It is dirt and a mile long with no > obstructions at either end nor on the sides. We normally make the take off > near the middle of the field and usually make our first turn by the time > we reach the departcher end.There are homes now starting to be built near > the South side, but we have always flown a right hand pattern. There are > three homes on the North side, two of them are pilots.There are two GA > planes there and Four ultralingt type hangered there. The field is on the > charts as "Pilots Rest" and private.It is as John says mostly high desert > open country. It is an ideal place to fly because of the weather and an > ultrllalight and even a GA plane could make a forced landing anywhere off > field. It is seldom used by GA aircraft other than the ones housed there > or from the neighboring field to the South. > I think that "Big Lar" is the only other Kolber who has visited our field. > Jump in her Lar and give your comments. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Denny Rowe" <rowedl(at)highstream.net>
Subject: Re: twinstar structure
Date: Nov 19, 2006
Rob, Welcome to the list. The HKS will most likely be an excellent choice for your Twinstar. We currently have a list member installing an HKS on his Firestar II and I am sure he and the HKS dealer assisting him will be very helpful to you. I imagine he will be replying to you shortly, sorry his name escapes me right now. :-( Denny Rowe, Mk-3, PA ----- Original Message ----- From: Lee/Cannon To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Sunday, November 19, 2006 5:32 PM Subject: Kolb-List: twinstar structure Hello Kolb folks - My name is Rob Cannon, and I recently purchased a Twinstar 532 in Vancouver B.C. Canada. I understand the structure is similar to the firestar II, and I am considering installing the hks 60 hp. Any comments ?? thanks, Rob ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- 11/10/2006 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 19, 2006
A stall/spin from | close to 1,000 ft probably won't be resolved in time, either. I've done | quite a few spins (intentional) with instructors in Port Angeles, WA, and | seems to me that it took 1000 to 1200 ft or so to straighten out the plane. Lar. Larry: Recovery from a stall/spin/tail slide or whatever, can easily be recovered from at 1,000 AGL. My fat mkIII will spin half turn and recover in about 300 feet. Of course, it has to be persuaded to spin. Entering stalls is easy, spins are more difficult in Kolbs. However, folks still get in to them. john h mkIII PS: My original FS would fly out of a spin with the controls locked, full aft stick, and full left or right rudder, in half turn. Could not make it spin a full turn with the engine idling. Dead stick was another situation. It would spin up like a top. I think that is a good example of how much drag there is on a windmilling prop. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 20, 2006
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: Why? [Please Read]
Dear Listers, Each year I like to explain why I have a Fund Raiser and also take the opportunity to express why I think the List Services here provide a superior experience over the commercial equivalents. I use the List Fund Raiser each year to offset the costs involved with running a high performance email list site such as this one. With the annual support from the List members through the PBS-like Fund Raiser, I have found I can run the entire site without having to inflect any of the members with those annoying banner ads flashing up all the time trying to sell little-blue-pills or other garbage nobody wants or needs. From the comments I've received over the years regarding the Lists, the great majority of the members really appreciate the non-commercialism of my List systems and don't mind my 'go-team-go' banter once a year during November to encourage members to support the Lists. I believe that the Lists services that I provide here offer many benefits over the commercial equivalents in a number of ways. The first feature I believe to be significant is that you cannot receive a computer v*rus from any of these Lists directly. Each incoming message is filtered and dangerous attachments stripped off prior to posting. I also provide a Photo and File Share feature that allows members to share files and bitmaps with other members and everyone can be assured that these files will be prescanned for any sort of v*rus before they are posted. Safe and simple. Another very important feature of this system in my opinion is the extensive List Archives that are available for download, browsing, and searching. The Archives go all the way back to the very beginning of each List and with the very fast Search Engine, the huge size of some of the Archives is a non-issue in quickly finding the data you're looking for. And added just this year is the new Email List Forum that allows members who prefer the Web BBS-style of List interaction. The beauty of the new List Forums is that they contain the exact same content that is distributed via email. Messages posted via email are cross-posted to the respective Forum and vice versa. The Forums also allow for another convenient method of sharing pictures and other files. Additionally added this year is the new List Wiki that allows members to build their own "Online List Encyclopedia" of sorts, documenting various aspects of their project for all to share. I've been running email Lists and services under the matronics.com domain since about 1989 starting with RV-List and 30 guys I knew and who where also building RVs. It has grown into nearly 70 different aviation-related Email Lists and an associated web site that receives over 23,000,000 hits each year!! Additionally, the List Email system forwarded well over 87,000 postings last year, accounting for an unbelievable 39,000,000 (yes, that's 39 MILLION) email messages delivered to Matronics List subscribers! I think there's a lot of value in supporting a service that has gone the long haul and is still providing and improving a high quality service all _without any advertising budget_! I have to admit running these Lists is a labor of love and I hope it shows in the quality of the experience that you receive when you get a List Email Message, Search the Archives, use the List Browser, or surf the Forums and Wiki sites. The Lists will be here for a long time to come. If you just want to lurk a while for free, that's great and I encourage you to do so. If you use, appreciate, and receive value from these Lists, then please support them during the Annual List Fund Raiser! List Contribution Web Site: http://www.matronics.com/contribution Thank you, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: FSII Dihedral
From: "Dave Bigelow" <up_country(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Nov 20, 2006
The FS II rigged with only a few inches of dihedral from the plans has spiral instability. If you let go of the stick and get bumped into a little bit of bank, the bank will continue to increase until you provide a correction. Some people confuse this with roll responsiveness, since it takes very little stick input to start a roll, however it takes a lot more input to stop or reverse the roll. An aircraft with spiral instability that has powerful ailerons is not unsafe, but does require a constant hand on the stick to keep the wings level. It's kind of like driving an automobile that does not have the front wheel camber, caster, and toe in set correctly. I added dihedral to my FS II until I could fly it hands off, and if rudder was held in either direction, the aircraft would gradually start a bank in that direction. It makes for a much more pleasant flying aircraft, and I notice no appreciable difference in performance. If you add too much dihedral, it can reduce the roll rate. Here's how it goes: 1. Add dihedral - more roll stability; more adverse yaw when moving the ailerons; more yaw/roll coupling when you move the rudder. 2. Remove dihedral - less roll stability; less adverse yaw when moving the airlerons; less yaw/roll coupling when moving the rudder. Too much one way, and the aircraft gets twitchy and harder to fly. Too much the other way, and it becomes a truck. Look for the sweet spot in the middle somewhere. -------- Dave Bigelow Kamuela, Hawaii FS2, HKS 700E Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75835#75835 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 20, 2006
From: "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net>
Subject: Re: FSII Dihedral
> >1. Add dihedral - more roll stability; more adverse yaw when moving the ailerons; more yaw/roll coupling when you move the rudder. > >2. Remove dihedral - less roll stability; less adverse yaw when moving the airlerons; less yaw/roll coupling when moving the rudder. > >Too much one way, and the aircraft gets twitchy and harder to fly. Too much the other way, and it becomes a truck. Look for the sweet spot in the middle somewhere. > Dave, My FireFly was the twitchy truck variety with the Kolb plan specified dihedral. The reason it was a truck was because cause of excessive aileron chord that lead to high control forces in roll. One could not displace the ailerons at cruise. This doomed one to kicking rudders to keep the wings level. By changing the wing chord from fifteen inches to nine inches and changing the crank to push rod leverage points the truck became a twitchy sports car. Removing all slack from the aileron control system and adding VG's the twitchiness has disappeared. If one lets go of the stick it will slowly roll off to one side. Stick pressure required to keep the wings level in rough air is very light. It is nimble and quick and goes where it supposed to. And best of all, I can fly it an hour in the middle of the day and have enough energy left to get right back in it and do it again. Adding dihedral to compensate for aileron high dynamic loading will make the aircraft more stable in roll. But it will require more pilot effort to fly in the middle of the day or cross country than a plane with reasonable sized ailerons. Jack B. Hart FF004 Winchester, IN ________________________________________________________________________________
From: WillUribe(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 20, 2006
Subject: Re: Stories of off-airport landings
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 20, 2006
From: Larry Rice <rice(at)iapdatacom.net>
Subject: N2H
Remember that in 1956 there was no such thing as an ultralight in the regs. Larry the micromong guy -- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <kfackler(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: Re: N2H
Date: Nov 20, 2006
A flying buddy sent me the picture below alleging it is a Kolb. But I'm not so sure. What do ya'll think? Kolb or Fergie or something else? She's sure a pretty one either way. -Ken ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: FSII Dihedral
From: "Dave Bigelow" <up_country(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Nov 20, 2006
Jack, The heavy aileron control force problem you describe with the Firefly has little to do with dihedral. The Firestar has responsive and easy to move ailerons. Adding some dihedral adds little extra control force unless you go to extremes. Almost any aircraft will slowly start a roll to one side or other if you stay off the controls long enough. If it has spiral instability, it will continue to roll off to a high angle of bank. If it has the proper amount of spiral stability, the bank will stabilize at 20 - 30 degrees. Don't confuse light control forces with stability - not the same thing. -------- Dave Bigelow Kamuela, Hawaii FS2, HKS 700E Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=75997#75997 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Stories of off-airport landings
From: "John Williamson" <kolbrapilot1(at)comcast.net>
Date: Nov 20, 2006
It's only illegal if you get caught! -------- John Williamson Arlington, TX Kolbra, 912ULS http://home.comcast.net/~kolbrapilot1 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=76015#76015 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/100_3738_105.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/100_3739_104.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Stories of off-airport landings
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Date: Nov 20, 2006
Dire need for pit stop. Nearest airport 30 miles north of course. Could not make it to the next airport on course. Decided to land in a dry creek bed in the desert on the California/Nevada border east of LA. Good landing, but dry creek bed was very deep sand. As a precaution, dug out in front of each main tire to help get the aircraft moving initially. Got out ok. Unique experience a long way from anywhere. -------- John Hauck MKIII/912ULS hauck's holler, alabama Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=76037#76037 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dry_wash_2_163.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/dry_wash_1_411.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 21, 2006
From: "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net>
Subject: Re: FSII Dihedral
>The heavy aileron control force problem you describe with the Firefly has little to do with dihedral. The Firestar has responsive and easy to move ailerons. Adding some dihedral adds little extra control force unless you go to extremes. > Dave, I agree. As long as the in flight cg is below the wing the wing with a little dihedral will in, in most cases, right its self in roll. I guess the point I was trying to make is that if you are going to increase dihedral compensate for heavy roll stick forces, there are other options. First, you can accept it as it is. If you want to fly with low energy input, this limits flying to the quiet times. If you want to fly during the mid-day times, you can bulk up your shoulder through strength training and attempt to keep the wings level. If you do not want to end up with a sore shoulder, you can let it roll. I have done this, but after an hour of kicking rudder pedals to help pick up the wing, I was close to up chucking. Even though I told my self that I would not apply side pressure to the stick, I could not refrain from trying to keep the wings level with the horizon. This resulted in a sore right shoulder. Second, you can add dihedral, and wing will right itself more quickly in rough air. But roll stick forces will remain high. On cross countries it will be a little bit more comfortable, but in my case I would arrive with sore shoulder. On a FireFly this means you have to replace four struts. Third, you can add spades with their additional weight. Fourth, you can reduce aileron chord and modify the aileron linkages to reduce roll stick forces. This lets you fly in the middle of the day with low pilot energy output. This is extremely important to me because I am an "old guy" who rarely gets to the airport before 2 PM. Dropping a few inches off the aileron chord saves some weight on the FireFly. Fifth, you can sell your aircraft and purchase or build something that is more fun to fly. In my case, my choice was the fourth option. After the addition of VG's and removing all slack from the roll control components, the FireFly is a pure delight to fly. In rough air, I do not have to kick a rudder to pick up a wing. I just apply a little side pressure to the stick and the FireFly plows straight ahead and the wing remains level. It will bob up and down a little, but this is not bothersome if the seat belts are tight enough to keep your back on the seat. Jack B. Hart FF004 Winchester, IN ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 21, 2006
From: "Arran Addington" <Arran.Addington(at)state.tn.us>
Subject: Mark III question
Good Afternoon, I am new to the matronics list and appreciate reading everyones commments. My question is this: I want to build a Mark IIIX. On barnstormers.com there is a set of Mark III wings and tailfeathers for sale. I could save a lot of money by buying these wings and then buying the fuselage kit from the factory. I spoke with the EAA and they said that I should still be able to apply for and get the FAA repairman certificate once it is all put together. Is this a good idea or not? Would I have any problems matching it up to a different fuselage? Are there considerations that I am not aware of? I would appreciate your input and experience. Sincerely, Arran Addington CFII Nashville, TN Arran J. Addington Transportation Planner Office of Local Programs Suite 600, James K. Polk Building 505 Deaderick Street Nashville, TN 37243-0341 voice: 615-253-8526 fax: 615-741-9673 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Pike" <richard(at)bcchapel.org>
Subject: Re: Mark III question
Date: Nov 21, 2006
Only real match up consideration would be the holes drilled in the root rib flange which aligns the wing to the fuselage. A good welder ought to be able to replace them with some virgin steel to drill your alignment holes through. Otherwise, unless the workmanship is poor, they ought to be a good deal. And if you decide to go get them, stop by on your way if you like, the MKIII is currently in the garage for some updates, and I only live an easy 2 miles off Interstate 81. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Arran Addington" <Arran.Addington(at)state.tn.us> Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 2:12 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Mark III question > > > Good Afternoon, > > I am new to the matronics list and appreciate reading everyones > commments. My question is this: I want to build a Mark IIIX. On > barnstormers.com there is a set of Mark III wings and tailfeathers for > sale. I could save a lot of money by buying these wings and then buying > the fuselage kit from the factory. I spoke with the EAA and they said > that I should still be able to apply for and get the FAA repairman > certificate once it is all put together. > > Is this a good idea or not? > Would I have any problems matching it up to a different fuselage? > Are there considerations that I am not aware of? > > I would appreciate your input and experience. > > Sincerely, > > Arran Addington > CFII Nashville, TN > > Arran J. Addington > Transportation Planner > Office of Local Programs > Suite 600, James K. Polk Building > 505 Deaderick Street > Nashville, TN 37243-0341 > voice: 615-253-8526 > fax: 615-741-9673 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Mark III question
From: "John Jung" <jrjungjr(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Nov 21, 2006
Arran, My Kolb is built from some parts from a damaged one and the rest ot the parts were bought from the company. It saved my a lot of money. One thing that you may want to check on is if you need ownership of the serial number and the plans. When I did mine, old Kolb would not sell parts to me unless I already owned a Kolb. I don't know if new Kolb has the same rule. -------- John Jung Firestar II N6163J Surprise, AZ Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=76201#76201 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Souder" <flykolb(at)pa.net>
Subject: Stories of off-airport landings
Date: Jan 21, 2002
In that vein, I'll continue with this one: It was the first or second year TOK showed its TS at SNF. I took Howard Levy, who used to write for Popular Mechanics but was then writing for various aviation magazines, on a ride. We had an engine out, the TS had a 447 (yes the first TS was 447 powered) and that engine was never quite right. That was the first of several seizures. It was during the flying session and I landed in the woods - don't remember if was in or outside the pattern, but it was close by. I landed on a narrow twisting dirt lane thru the woods, gracefully following the twists and turns of the path until touch down. Landed safely - no damage - and I was a bit apprehensive because I was not ahmm, er ... properly credentialed to make such a flight with passenger. So I was not anxious to hang around to see who might show up. I pulled the starter cord and the 477 popped back to life as if nothing had happened. I explained to Howard that I hated to leave him stranded, but I thought I might get him out quicker if I went for help and, of course, I'd be better off solo as I had to fly of the same twisty path I had landed on. I got no argument from him! I got out of there fast and returned to paradise city and went to get Howard in another vehicle for which I was properly credentialed. Howard was very gracious and never mentioned the incident in the article he wrote on the TS. He could have ... but didn't. Thanks Howard, Dennis ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 22, 2006
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: Please Make a Contribution to Support Your Lists...
Dear Listers, Just a reminder that November is the Annual List Fund Raiser. Please make a Contribution today to support the continued operation and upgrade of these great List services!! Pick up a really nice free gift with your qualifying Contribution too! The Contribution Site is fast and easy: http://www.matronics.com/contribution Thank you! Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 22, 2006
From: David Downey <planecrazydld(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Stories of off-airport landings
good morning Dennis; Of all the posters on the list, I look forward to yours most due to your involvement in teh project throughout. Please update the date on your PC though. It is a hassle to have to page back and back and back to find yoru postings since they are dated in 2002! Thanks! Dennis Souder wrote: In that vein, I'll continue with this one: It was the first or second year TOK showed its TS at SNF. I took Howard Levy, who used to write for Popular Mechanics but was then writing for various aviation magazines, on a ride. We had an engine out, the TS had a 447 (yes the first TS was 447 powered) and that engine was never quite right. That was the first of several seizures. It was during the flying session and I landed in the woods - don't remember if was in or outside the pattern, but it was close by. I landed on a narrow twisting dirt lane thru the woods, gracefully following the twists and turns of the path until touch down. Landed safely - no damage - and I was a bit apprehensive because I was not ahmm, er ... properly credentialed to make such a flight with passenger. So I was not anxious to hang around to see who might show up. I pulled the starter cord and the 477 popped back to life as if nothing had happened. I explained to Howard that I hated to leave him stranded, but I thought I might get him out quicker if I went for help and, of course, I'd be better off solo as I had to fly of the same twisty path I had landed on. I got no argument from him! I got out of there fast and returned to paradise city and went to get Howard in another vehicle for which I was properly credentialed. Howard was very gracious and never mentioned the incident in the article he wrote on the TS. He could have ... but didn't. Thanks Howard, Dennis Dave Downey in SE PA --------------------------------- Mortgage rates as low as 4.625% - $150,000 loan for $579 a month. Intro-*Terms ________________________________________________________________________________
From: N27SB(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 22, 2006
Subject: Re: Hangar update
Nice work Mike, You will be very happy with your building. If you have not Grouted in the bottom of your walls yet, You might want to paint that area with something to prevent moisture from causing the grout to eat the steel. I used regular silver type roof coating. It is far easier to do this BEFORE you erect but I see you have already started. It is still easy to do. Steve ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: New Prop
Date: Nov 22, 2006
From: "Kirby Dennis Contr MDA/AL" <Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil>
Classification: UNCLASSIFIED Kolb Friends - I switched props on my Mark-III, and am happy to report a noticeable performance improvement. I'm running a 912ul. Went from a Powerfin 3-blade 70-inch diameter to a 72-inch diameter (still a Powerfin 3-blade). The extra 2 inches diam appears to have increased my indicated airspeeds by 3 mph, for the all the same power settings between 4200 and 5200 rpm. I'm happy with it! And there is still 2 inches of clearance between the prop tip and the tailboom. Noise level, however, is somewhat increased. (Time to start looking for a ANR headset!) Since I do all my cruising below 5000 rpm, I figured I'd take advantage of the "larger prop turning slower is more efficient than a smaller prop spinning fast" principle. Here are the numbers I'm seeing, for this bone-stock Mark-III: RPM IAS 4400 58 4600 62 4800 68 5000 72 Since these indicated airspeeds were taken at 8000 feet msl, converting for altitude puts my true airspeeds at about ten MPH faster, across the board. Dennis Kirby 912ul, Powerfin-72, 60 hrs TT Cedar Crest, NM Classification: UNCLASSIFIED ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 22, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Stories of Off-Airport Landings
> We finally >concluded that a curious horse was probably investigating this strange, >new thing in his field, and was under the wing when something must've >startled him. His enormous equine head, jerking up, is what apparently >hit the wing bottom, doing an amazing amount of damage. Lesson learned: >Keep your stranded airplanes away from large creatures! > >Dennis Kirby I've been there before - actually horses like to "rub" up against things like fences and airplanes. I had to round up several and put them in the barn (after the owner explained this habit of theirs to me) in order to leave my plane in his field until the next day. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: N27SB(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 22, 2006
Subject: Re: Hangar update
Rick, Unlike Mike's building, I used a formed steel U channel. It simplifies the concrete work. And the channel get filled with a Portland/sand grout. This last step really stiffens the building. Steve ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: DRE-6000 ANR Headset
Date: Nov 22, 2006
Hi Gang: Tropic Aero has DRE-6000 Headsets. These are relatively inexpensive great performing units. Good feature is the ability to use aircraft 12VDC system to operate ANR, plus two 9VDC bats for backup. I have been using a set for the past 18 months. I have lost a lot of my hearing, to the point I have difficulty understanding the spoken word on the radio through a David Clark passive headset (H 10-40). The DRE gives me a new lease on life. Everyone's radios start transmitting better and I can understand what the are saying most of the time. ;-) http://www.tropicaero.com/10Expand.asp?ProductCode=DRE-6000 Not selling them, but several of us on the Kolb List use them. They make a long cross country day in a noisy Kolb much more pleasant and far less fatiguing. Take care, john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 22, 2006
From: "Richard Girard" <jindoguy(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Hangar update
I opted for the foundation weldments so I only have to do more bolts. After 7600, what's a few more? I can't wait to have real room again. Anybody doing radiant floor heat? Rick On 11/22/06, N27SB(at)aol.com wrote: > > Rick, > Unlike Mike's building, I used a formed steel U channel. It simplifies > the concrete work. > And the channel get filled with a Portland/sand grout. This last step > really stiffens the building. > > Steve > > * > > > * > > -- Rick Girard "Ya'll drop on in" takes on a whole new meaning when you live at the airport. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 22, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Flight Info
Still need your address - again. Practicing the levitation stuff, but it looks a lot better outside than inside don't you think?? http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5760228286962943975&hl=en ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Re: Flight Info
Date: Nov 22, 2006
Perty kewl trick, senor. Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "possums" <possums(at)bellsouth.net> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 7:12 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Flight Info > > > Still need your address - again. > Practicing the levitation stuff, > but it looks a lot better outside than inside > don't you think?? > > http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5760228286962943975&hl=en > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 22, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Flight Info
At 12:21 AM 11/23/2006, you wrote: > >Perty kewl trick, senor. > >Larry Bourne Sorry - didn't mean to send it to "you". But it does look better outside - in the sun. http://www.icaruseffect.com/home.html ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ron wehba" <rwehba(at)cebridge.net>
Subject: Re: Flight Info
Date: Nov 23, 2006
anyone got this figgered out? ----- Original Message ----- From: "possums" <possums(at)bellsouth.net> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 10:50 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Flight Info > > At 12:21 AM 11/23/2006, you wrote: >> >>Perty kewl trick, senor. >> >>Larry Bourne > Sorry - didn't mean to send it to "you". > > > But it does look better outside - in the sun. > http://www.icaruseffect.com/home.html > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Denny Rowe" <rowedl(at)highstream.net>
Subject: Re: Flight Info
Date: Nov 23, 2006
No, I am always a little slow on the uptake. Myself and my kids would appreciate anyone wanting to explain the trick. :-) Happy Thanksgiving to all. Denny Rowe ----- Original Message ----- From: "ron wehba" <rwehba(at)cebridge.net> Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2006 8:47 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Flight Info > > anyone got this figgered out? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "possums" <possums(at)bellsouth.net> > To: > Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 10:50 PM > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Flight Info > > >> >> At 12:21 AM 11/23/2006, you wrote: >>> >>>Perty kewl trick, senor. >>> >>>Larry Bourne >> Sorry - didn't mean to send it to "you". >> >> >> But it does look better outside - in the sun. >> http://www.icaruseffect.com/home.html > > > -- > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jim Kmet" <jlsk1(at)frontiernet.net>
Subject: Where is everybody
Date: Nov 23, 2006
Hi all, As a relatively new member to this list, ( MK-3 owner, for a year in 1996 ), & recently acquired MK-3 owner again), I see posting from people all over the place, with hints of who has what plane & their locations. For instance, the guy that has a MK-# 2 miles off of I-81 & the guy in Nashville thinking of building a MK-3. My question is this, is there a map, or listing available that shows who`s got what Kolb model & geographically where they are? Thanks, Jim In Cookeville, TN ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Where is everybody
Date: Nov 23, 2006
My question is this, is there a map, or listing available that shows who`s got what Kolb model & geographically where they are? Thanks, Jim In Cookeville, TN Jim: Try this: http://www.frappr.com/kolbaircraft john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 23, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Flight Info
I forgot - don't order this thing or the parts and put it anywhere near your computer, else your hard drive will be "reformatted" erased etc. - for free. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 23, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Flight Info
At 12:16 PM 11/23/2006, you wrote: > >At 09:18 AM 11/23/2006, you wrote: >> >>One of the posts linked to a guy outing the trick. And you'll need two of these too. http://www.forcefieldmagnets.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=165 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 23, 2006
From: "John Murr" <jdm(at)wideworld.net>
Subject: Spark Plug Gap Question
Happy Thanksgiving everyone! I'm changing plugs in my 503 and I was wondering what the gap should be? The plugs are NGK BR8ES. Thank you! John Murr Original Firestar 503 DCDI ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Spark Plug Gap Question
Date: Nov 23, 2006
| I'm changing plugs in my 503 and I was wondering what the gap should be? | The plugs are NGK BR8ES. | | John Murr John M: Kodiak has all the manuals for all the engines on the web. Download and check it out: http://www.kodiakbs.com/tiintro.htm john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 23, 2006
From: "John Murr" <jdm(at)wideworld.net>
Subject: Re: Spark Plug Gap Question
Thank you! ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2006 4:56 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spark Plug Gap Question > > > | I'm changing plugs in my 503 and I was wondering what the gap > should be? > | The plugs are NGK BR8ES. > | > | John Murr > > > John M: > > Kodiak has all the manuals for all the engines on the web. Download > and check it out: > > http://www.kodiakbs.com/tiintro.htm > > john h > mkIII > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HShack(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 23, 2006
Subject: Re: Spark Plug Gap Question
In a message dated 11/23/2006 4:42:27 PM Eastern Standard Time, jdm(at)wideworld.net writes: I'm changing plugs in my 503 and I was wondering what the gap should be? The plugs are NGK BR8ES. Thank you! John Murr My book says ".016- .020". I use a flat feeler guage & set to a snug .017". Howard Shackleford FS II SC ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Spark Plug Gap Question
From: "John Jung" <jrjungjr(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Nov 23, 2006
> I'm changing plugs in my 503 and I was wondering what the gap should be? > My 503 with gual Ducati ignition is supposed to have plug gaps of .014 - .018 per the manual. I can be hard to start if the plug gap is larger than spec. -------- John Jung Firestar II N6163J Surprise, AZ Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=76625#76625 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HShack(at)aol.com
Date: Nov 23, 2006
Subject: Re: Spark Plug Gap Question
In a message dated 11/23/2006 10:44:48 PM Eastern Standard Time, jrjungjr(at)yahoo.com writes: My 503 with gual Ducati ignition is supposed to have plug gaps of .014 - .018 per the manual. I can be hard to start if the plug gap is larger than spec. -------- John Jung Firestar II N6163J Surprise, AZ The manual I have came with my 503 DCDI purchased in late '98; I wonder if Rotax changed the gap spec. sometime after that........... Howard Shackleford FS II SC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Spark Plug Gap Question
Date: Nov 23, 2006
| The manual I have came with my 503 DCDI purchased in late '98; I wonder if | Rotax changed the gap spec. sometime after that........... | | Howard Shackleford Shack: Look it up here: http://www.kodiakbs.com/tiintro.htm john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 24, 2006
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: More Great List Comments - Please Make A Contribution!
Dear Listers, There's a little less than one week left for this year's List Fund Raiser. I thought it would a great time to share a few more of the great comments I've been receiving from Contributors regarding what the Lists mean to them. There are some particularly poignant ones in this batch and I encourage you to have a look at some of them. Don't forget that once you make your Contribution, the Contribution Squelch kicks in and you won't receive any future messages from me regarding the Fund Raiser this year! This holds true for the Realtime and Digest distributions and now also the HTML and TXT links included with the Digest! (Note that for technical reasons, if someone replies to one of my contribution messages, the Squelch will _not_ be activated, and you will still receive it. Contribution messages will also still be found on the Forums site and the List Browse). Please make your Contribution today to support these List services! Pick up a great Gift too! http://www.matronics.com/contribution Thank you! Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ============================= WLAS #2 ============================ Tackling my project without the List would be like building on a deserted island. The List has made me part of a learning (and laughing) community. -Larry W Thank you for providing such a fantastic resource for us Kolbers. I'm very happy to contribute towards keeping such a wonderful resource available. -Geoff T ..you do a great service for the flying community by providing this service. -John L ..solidly administered. -James C A great source of information. -Ralph S The Lists have likely saved a numbers of lives... -James F ..exceptional user service. -Larry W Better than a magazine! -Aaron G Thanks to your List I will be able to finish and fly my project. Without the help of the great people on your List I doubt it would have happened. -Ed G I learn something on a too regular basis thanks to these lists! -Ralph C ..valuable service. -John F ..a well administered service. -Stewart C Great forum! -Ronald C A great service! -Andy H Been reading the lists since my first RV in 1999. Good work and as necessary to me as a rivet. -Albert G The lists are a great help. -Gary S This resource has been critical to my building success so far. -Timothy F Great system and support! -Richard P Very helpful in the building my CH 701. -Ralph S Another year of entertainment and pleasure! -Larry B A great resource for all of us. -Larry W Another year of great service! Once again, the information is worth more than I can ever contribute. Thank you also for the "community" that the List fosters. I cannot tell you the number of times that seeing an friend's name come up has caused so many awesome memories to come flooding back - along with the eager desire to gather with these great guys again. I love hearing the beginner's enthusiasm, the builder's progress, and the flyer's success... -Robert B Our list has great info and I love reading the "Flame Posts! " -Stephen M Great service! -James B Excellent source of information. -David P You provide a very valuable service to the aviation community. -David H The RV related lists have been a tremendous help in the construction of my RV-7... -Norman R Awesome list!! -John E Great bunch of guys and very knowledgeable! -Herbert G Thank you for making it so easy to stay in touch with my fellow RV-10 builders. -David J I love the list and have been a reader for a long time. -James V Continues to be a great service! -George A Awesome List server. -Deke M Many of us would never finish our airplanes without [the List]. With it, I'm getting close! -Ronald C An excellent source of both information and inspiration! -William R Forums and format are easy to use. -Jack B Great help with my kit building. -Ralph H Super service. -Richard N Still loving it. -Jared S You have a fantastic web! -Harvey R ..a great service. -James M Glad you are there... -David A I get some great information on your list. -John P Fantastic service. Couldn't have made it as far as I have without it. -Stephen T A great learning experience with my RV-6A. -Ron B Great resources! -Jason H Well done. Very valuable. -Jeffrey D Great resource for the experimental aircraft community. -Chris H This List has been one of the most helpful tools in building my RV-10, since I build alone, and do not have any help readily available. Without the List, I could not have embarked on building my RV-10. -Jim H You run a great list there. -James H Really like the Kolb List. -Don W ============================= WLAS #2 ============================ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 24, 2006
From: "John Murr" <jdm(at)wideworld.net>
Subject: Re: Spark Plug Gap Question
The Kodiak guide says .016-.020 for the 503. I used .018. ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2006 11:33 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Spark Plug Gap Question > > | The manual I have came with my 503 DCDI purchased in late '98; I > wonder if > | Rotax changed the gap spec. sometime after that........... > | > | Howard Shackleford > > Shack: > > Look it up here: > > http://www.kodiakbs.com/tiintro.htm > > john h > mkIII > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Souder" <flykolb(at)pa.net>
Subject: Kolb Ultrastar
Date: Nov 24, 2006
Hi Bob, Have you connected with John Yates yet? Last I heard he left his job here in Millersburg and moved away. I forget if someone mentioned Reading or not. Anyway just checking to see if you got started with the FF project yet. Dennis -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Pongracz Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 6:22 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb Ultrastar David, By the way, I'm living in Bethlehem, PA....Nice to hear of another Kolber in PA. Where will you be flying from when your bird is complete?I am currently working on a Firefly project at Flying M (P91) northwest of Allentown. I've seen some other U.S.'s at area fly-ins, but don't know if they're on the list or not. Let me know if I can be of any assistance. Bob Pongracz....Fogelsville, PA...Firefly project No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding. Make My Way your home on the Web - http://dell.myway.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: Dave's accident
Date: Nov 24, 2006
OK, this may be the last word on AZ. Dave. Eve, his wife now want's all donations to go to the Embry Riddle University here in Prescott. There address is. Embry Riddle Aeronautical Inveracity 3700 Willow Creek Rd. Prescott, As. 86301 Because the University has been so good in allowing her to have the memorial in it's campus that is why she desires donations be made to the University. But for the ones that have sent donations to the Eagles, That's good too. The memorial service will be held here on Saturday December 4th at the DLC auditorium on campus. Signs will be posted to direct you.. He will be interned in Arlington Nation Cemetery on Dec 22. He was a hero among us. I do hope his Arizona friends will come to up celebrate Dave's varied and interesting life. The Az. Bald Eagle George Thompson ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com> Sent: Sunday, November 19, 2006 7:44 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dave's accident > > I'm amazed that I'm the only one who's stopped there, George. My memory > of your private strip is mostly of wide open spaces, a huge airstrip, > taxiways everywhere, widely spaced houses, mostly owned by pilots with > planes of several types in their driveways, and an easy going, pleasant > attitude from everybody I met. I really liked it, really enjoyed myself, > and wouldn't mind living there myself. I even enjoyed being scrunched > into the backseat (??) of your FS II, cramps and all. :-) We certainly > did fly low & slow, and saw antelope, deer and coyotes. The antelope > almost outran the airplane. > > To show I wasn't too scared off, I even scrunched into the back seat of > Larry Cottrell's FS II at the Alvord a couple of years ago. Larry's a > little (??) bigger than you, my chest was the support for his seat back, > and my knees were his elbow rests. I think so, anyway - I was pretty > numb. When I took a deep breath, Larry's forehead hit the windshield. I > could actually move my hands and head - a bit. I could tell you much > about groaning with a non-resolvable cramp, but I enjoyed that ride, too. > > I've flown out of several strips that had dual patterns, since I've flown > both ultralights and GA airplanes - mostly GA, but enuf UL's to give me a > perspective of their different requirements. With the situation at your > place, I don't see any problem with either or both patterns, assuming > people watch and listen. Dave's turning crosswind at 300 ft or so doesn't > strike me as a bad thing at all, given the situation there. A stall/spin > from close to 1,000 ft probably won't be resolved in time, either. I've > done quite a few spins (intentional) with instructors in Port Angeles, WA, > and seems to me that it took 1000 to 1200 ft or so to straighten out the > plane. My 1st spin - on my 1st solo flight in a Cessna 172 - was totally > un-intentional, is a long story, and took well over 2,000 ft to resolve, > but that was my fault, as was the spin. Once again, lack of airspeed > causes stalls and spins, not altitude. We could speculate forever, and > point fingers back & forth, and never know for sure what really happened > that day, tho' it's purely guaranteed that it was a crying shame. Dave > will be missed. Lar. > > Larry Bourne > Santa Fe, NM > www.gogittum.com > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net> > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 19, 2006 8:26 AM > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dave's accident > > >> >> I must add to this pattern thread. Our field is an old WW II field. At >> one time it had a light asphalt covering, but now only a small spot or >> to is all that is left of the paving. It is dirt and a mile long with no >> obstructions at either end nor on the sides. We normally make the take >> off near the middle of the field and usually make our first turn by the >> time we reach the departcher end.There are homes now starting to be built >> near the South side, but we have always flown a right hand pattern. There >> are three homes on the North side, two of them are pilots.There are two >> GA planes there and Four ultralingt type hangered there. The field is on >> the charts as "Pilots Rest" and private.It is as John says mostly high >> desert open country. It is an ideal place to fly because of the weather >> and an ultrllalight and even a GA plane could make a forced landing >> anywhere off field. It is seldom used by GA aircraft other than the ones >> housed there or from the neighboring field to the South. > >> I think that "Big Lar" is the only other Kolber who has visited our >> field. Jump in her Lar and give your comments. > > > -- > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: English vs. Ahmurican
Date: Nov 25, 2006
But many of the poor Args in the Falklands didn't even know where they were, or why. >> Hi Russ, the guy I heard on the radio was a General. Presumably he knew where he was. By the way, I predicted the Falklands war nearly a year before it happened. Our Parliament in their wisdom voted against spending money on extending the runway at Stanley and, bearing in mind that the greatest concentrations of krill occur in those waters and that is going to be invaluable in the future I told my wife that the the message that decision sends to anyone looking longingly at the Falklands is that we are not interested in the place.( That must be the longest and most ill constructed sentence I have ever written. Cant be bothered to change it. Standards are slipping.....) Normally I wouldn`t bet on the sun coming up tomorrow but I was on the money with that one. Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Where is everybody
From: "Paul Petty" <paulpetty(at)myway.com>
Date: Nov 25, 2006
John H, Thats a cool site I added me and Ms Dixie thanks -------- Paul Petty Kolbra #12 Ms Dixie covering and painting Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=76897#76897 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob" <bobontheroad(at)cableone.net>
Subject: Dave Pelletier
Date: Nov 26, 2006
The following article is in today's Prescott Daily Courier and contains some very nice words by friends and family of Dave: Dave A. Pelletier Dave was born on Dec. 22, 1937, and died Nov. 13, 2006. The dates are only for the headstone. What he did between those dates is what is important. Dave had many hobbies and into each one he always put in 100 percent. He wore many hats during his life. He was a proud retired United States Air Force veteran and patriot. After 22 years in service to our country, he worked at Northrop Aviation on the Stealth B-2 bomber. He was a professional musician, per-forming Bluegrass and Old Time Music in the Western states and into Canada. His persona of Cousin Homer of Winooski, Vermont, was enjoyed by all. He loved boating, fishing, hunting, motorcycle touring, stamp collecting, and was a gatherer of obscure Early American music. Prolific writer of songs, poems and stories for children, his legacy will continue to give laughter. He loved kids best and would interact with any group of them he would meet. There was never a dull moment when Dave was around. He lived life to the fullest every single day. Everyone who knew him was the better for it. He died doing what he loved, his passion for flying. =8BA Friend, George Thompson Dave was and always will be a unique person. He has touched many souls in his short stay we shared with him on planet earth. To the person who served him his favorite meal (breakfast) to playing games with the grandchildren, Grandpa Dave was always on stage and experiencing life. Dave's six grandkids never had any down time =AD Grandpa time was always soaring high with silly jokes and magic tricks. There were no limits to Dave's antics =AD not even Grandpa Dave's glass eye. I was privileged to know Dave for 24 years, and I will try to share my experiences with my kids on a daily basis, no matter how small it may seem. Our world is a lot of small blessings bound into a wonderful ball of loving life. =8BSon Damon Rogers The recent loss of Dave Pelletier extends beyond his family and local community; his presence extended much further. Dave drew his energy from the smiles and excitement of others. That was his fuel that inspired his gift. He chose hobbies that would involve others, whether he was plucking his banjo or flying his plane. Dave enjoyed going to festivals and volunteering to entertain the attendees, especially the young and impressionable. While at a festival and trying to find Dave, we would just look for the group of laughing kids and Dave would be in the middle of them. Dave's first plane was a single-seater. He quickly realized he needed another seat to share his love of flying. Fortunately, Dave's grandchildren and dozens of others were able to experience the joy of flight in his light aircraft. He will be greatly missed. =8BSon Ryan Rogers QUOTE: "You can do anything you put your mind to." =8BFirst wife Shirley Pelletier Good-bye, my love =8B soar with the eagles. You are the love of my life. =8BWife Evelynn Pelletier A Celebration of Dave's Life will take place at the DLC Auditorium, Embry-Riddle Campus at 9 a.m. on Saturday, Dec. 2, 2006. Final Internment will take place at 2 p.m. on Dec. 22, 2006, at Arlington National Memorial Cemetery in Virginia. In lieu of flowers, donations may be made in Dave's name to the Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University, attention Dave Roy. The Arizona Ruffner Wakelin Funeral Home assisted the family with arrangements. Best Regards, Bob Thompson (no relation to George) Prescott, AZ -- 11/26/2006 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Need 503 help!
From: "John Jung" <jrjungjr(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Nov 26, 2006
Group, I believe that I solved the problem. It was the battery. After doing a lot of checking, I discovered that the size battery that I have been using was less than recommended. The 503 manual said 13 AmpHr minimum and I was using a 9 AmpHr. So, I bought a 16 AmpHr battery and installed it today. Now, when I turn the key, it starts immediately. -------- John Jung Firestar II N6163J Surprise, AZ Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=77129#77129 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 27, 2006
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: List of Contributors Coming Soon - Make Sure You're Listed!
Dear Listers, The List of Contributors (LOC) is just around the corner! On December 1st I post a list of everyone that so generously made a Contribution to support the Lists. Its my way of publicly thanking everyone that took a minute to show their appreciation for the Lists. As a number of people have pointed out in their Contribution comments, the List seems at least as valuable of a building/flying/recreating tool as a typical your magazine subscription! And how interactive is a magazine, after all? :-) Won't you take minute and assure that your name is on the upcoming LOC? Tell others that you appreciate the Lists. Making a Contribution to support the Lists is fast and easy using your Visa, MasterCard, or Paypal account: http://www.matronics.com/contribution Or, by droping a personal check in the mail to: Matronics / Matt Dralle PO Box 347 Livermore CA 94551-0347 USA (Please include your email address on the check!) I would like to thank everyone that has so generously made a Contribution thus far during this year's List Fund Raiser! Remember that its YOUR support that keeps these Lists running and improving! Don't forget to include a little comment about how the Lists have helped you! Thank you! Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "JAMES BEARD" <JAMESBEARD305(at)msn.com>
Subject: Az Daves' services
Date: Nov 27, 2006
Two weeks after Daves accident and I can barely think of it without welling up. I Wanted to post something meaningful here but words cannot communicate the emotions we are all experiencing. I know that George, the Black Mesa Flyers, Uncle Craig, Tim and many others must feel his loss even more deeply than do I, having known Dave just a brief year. He mentored myself and many others in all things Kolb; He was so very generous with his time and his wisdom that the community owes him a great deal of respect, if nothing more. Many of you will travel far to join us in celebrating his life Saturday in Prescott; for those who might need a place to r.o.n. Friday evening, please give Sandy and I a call on the land line at 928-649-9440, or simply send an email. We live just off the Cottonwood airport in Clarkdale, thirty minutes from Embry-Riddel. Any friend of Dave is more than welcome, and we would have much to share. It's the least we could do for such a remarkable individual, such a wonderful man. Jim and Sandy Beard; MlllX "Jackalope" (under construction) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Thompson" <eagle1(at)commspeed.net>
Subject: Re: Az Daves' services
Date: Nov 27, 2006
I will second that. I have two queen sized beds here at my home for anyone who needs to spend the night by coming from affair. Any friend of Dave's is a friend of mine. Please contact me off line if you need a bed for the night. Az. Bald Eagle George Thompson ----- Original Message ----- From: JAMES BEARD To: kolb-list Sent: Monday, November 27, 2006 2:43 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Az Daves' services Two weeks after Daves accident and I can barely think of it without welling up. I Wanted to post something meaningful here but words cannot communicate the emotions we are all experiencing. I know that George, the Black Mesa Flyers, Uncle Craig, Tim and many others must feel his loss even more deeply than do I, having known Dave just a brief year. He mentored myself and many others in all things Kolb; He was so very generous with his time and his wisdom that the community owes him a great deal of respect, if nothing more. Many of you will travel far to join us in celebrating his life Saturday in Prescott; for those who might need a place to r.o.n. Friday evening, please give Sandy and I a call on the land line at 928-649-9440, or simply send an email. We live just off the Cottonwood airport in Clarkdale, thirty minutes from Embry-Riddel. Any friend of Dave is more than welcome, and we would have much to share. It's the least we could do for such a remarkable individual, such a wonderful man. Jim and Sandy Beard; MlllX "Jackalope" (under construction) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- 11/27/2006 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: ms dixie
From: "Paul Petty" <paulpetty(at)myway.com>
Date: Nov 27, 2006
Hey gang got the fuselage painted and headed to the shop tonight to work on the tail and nose cone. Photos are here >>>> http://groups.msn.com/AerialWorld/kolbra012.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=2994 Later -------- Paul Petty Kolbra #12 Ms Dixie covering and painting Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=77426#77426 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 27, 2006
From: "Richard Girard" <jindoguy(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Adventures in Prop Inertia
Like the weather, everyone talks about prop inertia. Okay, maybe it's only a few gearheads, but I got real interested after seeing the technique demonstrated while doing the weight shift and powered parachute modules for the repairman maintenance ticket. Having had plenty of time to think about it while driving back home from CA, I figured I had four props I could check and see how it all fit together. So I gathered them altogether and built the setup per Rotax Service Information instruction SI 11 UL 91 E, Available from the Rotax owners site and paraphrased in the CPS catalog. So here are the numbers for a 66" Ritz 2 blade wood prop, a 66" Warp Drive 3 blade straight carbon fiber prop with CNC aluminum hub, an IVO 60" 3 blade composite prop with quick adjust hub, and a 48" 2 blade Tennessee Propellor wood prop. Each prop was run 3 times and the times shown are the average of the three, although each prop's runs were all +/- 1 second. I'll go heaviest to lightest. Warp Drive 66" 3 blade CNC hub Wt. 9 lb. 12 oz. Average time to 30 oscillations, 180 seconds Inertia 5200 Kg cm^2 IVO 60" 3 blade Quick adjust hub Wt. 6 lb. 4 oz. Average time to 30 oscillations, 161 seconds Inertia 2700Kg cm^2 Ritz 66 X 28 2 blade Wt 5 lb. 1 oz. Average time to 30 oscillations, 190 seconds Inertia 3000 Kg cm^2 TPI 48 X 34 2 blade Wt. 3 lb. 3 oz. Average time to 30 oscillations, 127 seconds Inertia 1100Kg cm^2 So there you have it, you can definitely see the variance in inertia caused by length and mass. The Ritz is right at the top of the allowable range for a B gearbox, while the shorter, heavier IVO is right near it and the TPI shorty should represent no problem. The Warp drive is well within range of the C and E gearboxes but would be brutal on a B box. Rick -- Rick Girard "Ya'll drop on in" takes on a whole new meaning when you live at the airport. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Edward Bonsell" <ebonsell(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Firestar Lord Mounts, Rudder Cables
Date: Nov 27, 2006
Hi All, Went out to Dillsburg aeroplane works today and got some new nuts and bolts to reassemble my 86 Firestar. They didn't have any lord mounts. Does anyone know where Kolb got their 1 3/4 inch lord mounts? Also, I pulled the control cables today and found the Rudder Cables had one or two broken strands in the pully area. Those of you with older or high time kolbs might want to check this. Ed Bonsell ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Firestar Lord Mounts, Rudder Cables
From: "R. Hankins" <rphanks(at)grantspass.com>
Date: Nov 27, 2006
Ed, Thanks for the heads up on the rudder cables. How many hours on your firestar? -------- Roger in Oregon 1992 KXP 503 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=77489#77489 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 28, 2006
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: Who is "Matt Dralle" & What Are "The Lists"? [Please Read]
Dear Listers, Who is Matt Dralle and what exactly are these Lists? Well, I've been working in the information technology industry for over 20 years primarily in computer networking design and implementation. I have also done extensive work in web development and CGI design during this period. I started the Matronics Email Lists back in 1990 with about 30 fellow RV builders from around the world. Since that time, I have added 63 other kinds of aircraft related Lists to the line up and numerous other List related services such as the Forums, Wiki, Archives and Search Engine just to name a few. For flexibility and reliability, I have chosen to run all of my own servers here locally. Other List-related systems include a 1 Gigabit, fully switched network infrastructure, a commercial-grade Netscreen firewall, a Barracuda spam filter, a local T1 Internet router, and a commercial-grade business T1 Internet connection with full static addressing. The computer servers found here include a brand new, quad-processor Xeon Linux server for List web services, a dual-processor Xeon Linux system dedicated to the email processing List functions, and another P4 Linux system serving as a remote storage disk farm for the archives, databases, and for an on-line hard drive-based backup system with 3.2 Terra Bytes of storage, soon to be upgraded to over 6 Terra Bytes! This entire system is protected by three large, commercial-grade uninterrupted power supply (UPS) systems that assure the Lists are available even during a local power outage! Speaking of power, imagine how much electricity it takes to run all of these systems. One month this Summer, I had a staggering $1368 bill for electricity alone! I recently upgraded all of the computer racking infrastructure including new power feeds and dedicated air conditioning for the room that serves as the Computer Center for the Matronics Email Lists. This year I added another rack to house the new MONSTER quad-processor web system that didn't quite fit into the first rack! Here's a composite photo of the List Computer Center before the addition of the second rack: http://www.matronics.com/MattDralle-ListComputerCenter.jpg As you can see, I take running these Lists very seriously and I am dedicated to providing an always-on, 24x7x365 experience for each and every Lister. But building and running this system isn't cheap. As I've stated before, I don't support any of these systems with commercial advertising on the Lists. It is supported 100% through List member Contributions! That means you... and you... and YOU! To that end, I hold a List Fund Raiser each November and ask that members make a small Contribution to support the continued operation and upgrade of this ever-expanding system. Its solely YOUR Contributions that keeps it running! Please make a Contribution today to support these Lists! http://www.matronics.com/contribution Or, by dropping a personal check in the mail to: Matronics / Matt Dralle PO Box 347 Livermore CA 94551-0347 USA (Please include your email address on the check!) Thank you! Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Facet pump thread sealer
From: "Dave Bigelow" <up_country(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Nov 28, 2006
I used teflon tape to seal the threads on my facet, and have had no problems. You really should plumb the two pumps in parallel. Both the facet and the mechanical pump have built in check valves, so the failure of either pump will not affect the operation of the other. If you put the pumps in series, a failure of either pump can affect the fuel flow to the engine. You do not need a squeeze bulb with a parallel setup - in fact there have been a number of fuel starvation incidents because of squeeze bulb failures This is a controversial subject on this forum, and there are a number of Kolbers who are running the pumps in series. Consider that virtually all GA and T Category aircraft with dual tank pumps use the parallel system. That's good enough for me. The facet pump alone provides more pressure than the mechanical pump alone. Check the pumps before flight by turning on the electric pump long enough to fill the carb bowls. If you are using transparent fuel line, you will see the fuel lines fill up. Turn off the electric pump and start, taxi, and partial power run up with the mechanical pump. If it is not working, the carb bowls will run dry and the engine will quit. Turn on the electric pump before takeoff and leave it on for the entire flight. -------- Dave Bigelow Kamuela, Hawaii FS2, HKS 700E Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=77567#77567 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 28, 2006
From: Charlie England <ceengland(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Facet pump thread sealer
Many have used the tape without any problems. However, some homebuilts have had blocked fuel systems caused by slivers of teflon tape. Even if there's no problem on initial installation, residue in the female threads can get pushed into the lines if the connection is opened & re-made. It doesn't take much to block a fuel injector or carb jet. Charlie Dave Bigelow wrote: > >I used teflon tape to seal the threads on my facet, and have had no problems. > >You really should plumb the two pumps in parallel. Both the facet and the mechanical pump have built in check valves, so the failure of either pump will not affect the operation of the other. If you put the pumps in series, a failure of either pump can affect the fuel flow to the engine. You do not need a squeeze bulb with a parallel setup - in fact there have been a number of fuel starvation incidents because of squeeze bulb failures > >This is a controversial subject on this forum, and there are a number of Kolbers who are running the pumps in series. Consider that virtually all GA and T Category aircraft with dual tank pumps use the parallel system. That's good enough for me. > >The facet pump alone provides more pressure than the mechanical pump alone. Check the pumps before flight by turning on the electric pump long enough to fill the carb bowls. If you are using transparent fuel line, you will see the fuel lines fill up. Turn off the electric pump and start, taxi, and partial power run up with the mechanical pump. If it is not working, the carb bowls will run dry and the engine will quit. Turn on the electric pump before takeoff and leave it on for the entire flight. > >-------- >Dave Bigelow >Kamuela, Hawaii >FS2, HKS 700E > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Re: Facet pump thread sealer
Date: Nov 29, 2006
I 3rd that. Charlie's exactly right - on re-assembly residue in the female threads get pushed into the system. I work on commercial appliances, and can say that many manufacturers of gas appliances will void warranties if they find teflon tape on connections. Lar. Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charlie England" <ceengland(at)bellsouth.net> Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 7:37 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Facet pump thread sealer > > Many have used the tape without any problems. > > However, some homebuilts have had blocked fuel systems caused by slivers > of teflon tape. Even if there's no problem on initial installation, > residue in the female threads can get pushed into the lines if the > connection is opened & re-made. It doesn't take much to block a fuel > injector or carb jet. > > Charlie ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Facet pump thread sealer
Date: Nov 29, 2006
From: "Kirby Dennis Contr MDA/AL" <Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil>
<< Hi All, My Facet pump came today, are there any suggestions as to what I should use to seal the threads? Lanny Fetterman >> Lanny - Use the Permatex product called "High Temperature Thread Sealant." Available in most auto parts stores. It's purpose is to seal any threaded fuel or oil lines, instead of Teflon tape. Reason to avoid the Teflon tape: someone on this List shared a story about an engine stoppage that was due to a tiny fleck of Teflon tape that came loose from a threaded fuel line fitting and got stuck in a carb jet. Dennis Kirby Mark-III, 912ul ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Chris Wolf <cwolf41(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
On Monday, November 13, 2006, at 10:27 a.m. local time, a Kolb Mark III Classic aircraft carrying the owner, Dave Pelletier, and Michael Maikowski, a visiting pilot, crashed near the town of Paulden, Arizona. Both men were instantly killed on impact, and the aircraft was destroyed. At the time of the crash, there was speculation that Michael Maikowski and Chris Wolf were the same person. I can state, with absolute certainty, they are not. Michael Maikowski died at 10:27 a.m. I died about three hours later when a police chaplain came to my door to give me the terrible news that my best friend was dead. For some reason, I was given a second chance to live again, and try to rebuild my shattered life. For some reason, Mike and Dave were not. Mike Maikowski was my best friend, business partner, and lifelong flying buddy. I've known him for the last 36 years, ever since we attended Purdue University together. I've spent the last two weeks grieving, trying to understand what happened, and trying to accept the fact that I will never see my best friend again. At the time of the accident, there was much speculation as to what actually happened, and what caused it. I think I have as much information about the crash as anyone. And more importantly, I knew Mike Maikowski better than anyone. I know exactly what sort of pilot he was. During the speculation about the crash, someone solicited my feedback. I was in no condition to give it, at the time, but I think I am now. So here is what I know. I've been told that Dave Pelletier was a very good pilot, was very safety conscious, and that his plane had been inspected by an A&P mechanic only a week earlier. I have no reason to doubt any of this. If Mike Maikowski had even the slightest doubt about Dave's plane, or Dave's piloting skills, Mike would never have flown with Dave. Mike Maikowski had been flying fixed wing aircraft for forty years. At age 13, he won a statewide aviation essay contest, held in Wisconsin. Senator William Proxmire personally handed Mike First Prize at the big Milwaukee aviation show, held every year. Mike had been in love with airplanes all his life. I think he was greatly influenced by the 1950s television series, "The Whirlybirds." (I know I was.) If the names PT, Barney, and Helen mean anything to you, then you know what I'm talking about. According to his parents, Mike soloed at age 14. Perhaps he was not quite that young, but when Mike came to Purdue University to pursue a degree in aeronautical engineering, he already had his private pilot license. Mike had wanted to go to the Air Force academy, and eventually fly for the airlines, but he was beaten out by another applicant who didn't have a couple of trapped air bubbles in his tailbone (the contest it was so close, that was the final selection criteria). Mike was greatly disappointed that he didn't get into the Air Force Academy, but he was never one to complain. Instead, he came to Purdue University to become an aeronautical engineer. That's where we met in Mike's Freshman year (I was a Sophomore). I had a room on the seventh floor of the local residence hall, with a view of the local airport, and Mike asked to be my roommate (so he could watch the airplanes take off and land). As it turned out, that was the luckiest day in my life. Mike and I became fast friends. We both loved to fly, and I was always happy to split the cost of an hour's flight with Mike. He logged the time, and I got to look out the window. Even after graduation, Mike and I continued to live and work together. We just got along so damn well, and worked so well together, and had so much fun together, that we decided to live and work together until one of us got married (or got tired of each other). Somehow this peculiar arrangement lasted for the next 36 years. I still can't figure out how. We never fought, we never quarreled, and we never had a harsh word for each other. A lot of married couples envied our compatibility. And we weren't even gay. We were just two guys who really enjoyed each other's company. Mike and I wrote and published books together, patented and licensed a new type of computer keyboard (almost got rich off that one), explored caves, canoed rivers, traveled all around the country, and took flying trips as often as we could afford them. It was a good life. Mike Maikowski was the best pilot I have ever known. He was fanatical about safety, never cut corners, never hurried, and never panicked. When I flew with him, I had total trust and confidence in his flying skills. (I know enough to take the controls, if necessary, but I'm not a licensed pilot.) When we got caught in zero-zero conditions in Alaska, over the Inside Passage, and Mike had to get us up through the soup, and on top, while not running into high mountains on all sides of us, I was so confident in Mike's flying skills that I sat in the back seat, drinking coffee. Mike had been an instrument pilot for many years. He flew almost every week, practicing and refining his instrument flying skills. He was working on his Commercial rating when he lost his life, and was planning on being an instructor for a few years after he retired from the FAA next year. While still at Purdue, Mike spent several semesters interning at Edwards Air Force Base, in California, working on NASA's Supercritical Wing project. After graduating from Purdue University, Mike worked for the Boeing Aircraft company, in Seattle, for several years, as an aeronautical engineer. Then when President Regan fired the striking air traffic controllers (PATCO), in the early 1980s, Mike went to work as an air traffic controller for the FAA. He was a controller for the next 25 years. And a pretty damned good one. There are several pilots flying today who owe their lives to Mike Maikowski's air traffic control skills. And at least one airline who still has an unbroken DC-10, thanks to the fact that Mike was as good a pilot as he was a controller. Before 911, air traffic controllers used to be allowed to ride in the cockpits of commercial airliners to help familiarize themselves with air traffic from the pilot's perspective. Mike was once sitting in the cockpit of a DC-10 that had a minor mechanical problem. A pickup truck, containing a mechanic, was dispatched out to the plane as it sat on the runway, to see if the problem could be fixed on the spot. The pilots of the DC-10 were busy, but Mike happened to be looking out the window as the pickup truck drove under the airplane, and parked there. Then the Captain of the DC-10 said he was going to move the plane down the runway, while he waited for the pickup truck to arrive. The Captain was reaching for the throttles when Mike stopped him, and told him the truck was already parked under his airplane. I'll leave it to your imagination as to what happens when a DC-10 tries to taxi over a pickup truck. But that's the kind of guy Mike was. If a pilot made a bad mistake while in the pattern, Mike didn't automatically report him. Being a pilot himself, Mike could relate to the pilots. Usually he just invited the pilot up to the tower, so Mike could explain what had happened, and how to avoid it in the future. And Mike also worked the air traffic control side of the equation, as well. If a new controller simply couldn't be trained to control airplanes, and was about to be fired, Mike took over and trained the controller. So I guess what I'm trying to say here, is that Michael Maikowski was a pretty damn good pilot who knew what he was doing, and hadn't learned to fly last week. So what happened on the morning of November 13? Mike had been flying GA aircraft for forty years. About six years ago, we acquired a powered parachute (PPC) and flew that just for fun. (And because it was cheap to fly.) We liked to tow it on a trailer behind my RV, and drive to interesting areas, camp in the RV, and then explore the area. But while the powered parachute was fun, it was also pretty limited in what it could do. With a top speed of only 30 mph, it was at the mercy of the wind, and it wasn't safe to fly if the wind was blowing much more than 10 mph. And it didn't have a range of much more than about 15 or 20 miles. And since the PPC had to be launched and landed into the wind, there were a lot of airports where it wasn't practical to fly it. But we liked it. And then the FAA decided that powered parachutes should be included in the new Sport Pilot program. Mike was already qualified to fly the PPC, since had his private pilot ticket, but I would have to get a Sport Pilot license. I would also have to get the PPC inspected and N-numbered. Worse yet, I'd have to fly across the country and take a 16 hour repairman's course if I wanted to be able to do my own annual inspections, and sign off on my own maintenance (which I'd been doing for five years). What a pain! After years of carefree flying under Part 103, it was like having your paper airplane, or your box kite, suddenly regulated by the FAA. And that's when I suggested to Mike that perhaps we might think about flying something else. Especially if I had to bother with Sport Pilot. Perhaps a little fixed-wing airplane with folding wings that we could transport on a trailer behind the RV. Something with more speed and range. Something that could handle a crosswind better than a PPC. We looked at the Zenith 701. I even went to one of their factory workshops and built a rudder. Nice little plane, but not the best folding wing design in the world. Then I saw a picture of a Kolb, in flight, and saw how easily the wings folded. That looked like it might be our plane. I came onto this list and gathered information about the Kolb. I talked to the Kolb factory, and was much impressed with their level of customer support. After much discussion, Mike and I decided that the Kolb Mark III was the plane for us. It looked like the perfect flightseeing airplane; ideal for towing behind an RV. Robert Lee, down in Arizona, had a Mark III Classic for sale. It had the Rotax 912 engine on it, and was even equipped with a ballistic parachute. (I'm a firm believer in ballistic parachutes. I even equipped our powered parachute with a ballistic parachute.) I told Mike we needed to travel to Arizona and see this plane. The only drawback was that it was a Classic, and not an Xtra. Mike was only 5'8", and weighed 170 pounds, but I'm 6'4" and weigh 250 pounds. I was concerned that I might not be able to fit comfortably in a Classic, whereas the Extra was a little larger for larger pilots. Still, the Arizona plane had everything we wanted on a Kolb, so I figured it was worth a look. But somebody else was ahead of us in the buyer line. A man from Miami bought the Arizona plane, and that was that. Then I learned of another Kolb for sale. Better still, it was a Mark III Xtra. Sounded like it was made for a larger pilot, like me. I won't mention the owner's name, out of privacy considerations. The Mark III Xtra only had a Rotax 582 engine on it, and had no ballistic parachute, but I knew I could sell the 582 and replace it with a 912. And I could install a ballistic parachute. And it was one beautiful plane. I saw lots of pictures of it. The owner was obviously quite a craftsman. There was just one problem with buying the plane. The owner was currently under a doctor's care, and didn't feel safe in flying the plane. So he couldn't take us up for a test flight, or give Mike some familiarization flights in the plane. However we were welcome to come and test fly it ourselves. But the Kolb is a taildragger, and Mike had only flown tricycle gear. Also, Mike did not want to fly the Kolb "cold." He wanted an experienced Kolb pilot to fly with him, and show him the ropes. So I called the Kolb factory and asked them if they could recommend a Kolb owner who could familiarize Mike with the Kolb. Then we could test fly the Mark III Xtra, and if we liked it, buy it. The Kolb factory gave me the names of three Kolb pilots who might be able to help us. The name at the top of the list was Dave Pelletier. Mike promptly called Dave, and they became instant friends. Dave not only offered to familiarize Mike with the Kolb, but even offered to have him as a guest in his home while they did it. I understand this was very typical behavior for Dave. I was planning to go to Arizona, with Mike, and take some familiarization rides in Dave's plane. I knew Dave's Classic wouldn't be quite as roomy as the Xtra we were thinking of buying, but I figured it would give me a pretty good idea of the view from the Kolb, in flight, and the overall suitability of the plane for us. But there was just one problem. Dave's flying field was at an elevation of 4400 feet. And Dave's Kolb only had a Rotax 582 engine on it. Dave said there would be no problem flying with Mike, but that I was too heavy for safe flying. With both Dave and myself on board, the plane would be too heavily loaded for Dave's liking. But that was no problem. I told Mike I would stay home and tend to our business, and start making preparations to bring the Xtra home. Mike could travel to Arizona and get checked out in the Kolb. Then the following weekend we would test fly the Xtra. If we liked it, and bought it, I would pick up the plane with my RV, and bring it home. And so it was that on the morning of November 12, 2006, I shook Mike's hand at the curb of local airport as he was about to board his flight to Arizona. I have never seen him so happy and excited. Even though Mike was half owner of our PPC, and even though he was part owner of a Cessna Cardinal, this would be his first, honest-to-God airplane that was all his. He would able to base it just about five minutes drive from his home, and fly it whenever he wanted to, wherever he wanted to, and as often as he wanted to. I would take the Repairman's Course, and do the maintenance on it (just as I've done with the PPC for the last five years), so the Kolb would be dirt cheap for Mike to fly. And when Mike retired from the FAA in 2008, with a fine pension, we would spend a lot of time towing the Kolb in its trailer, behind my RV. We would take it all over the country, and fly it in all sorts of interesting and beautiful places. What a way to spend the next thirty years! That was the plan. Mike called me from Dave Pelletier's house, Sunday night, to tell me he had safely arrived in Arizona, had rented a car, and had driven up to Dave's house near Prescott, Arizona. Before he left Seattle, I reminded Mike that Dave's Kolb only had a 65 horsepower engine, there would be two people in the plane, and the field elevation where they would be flying was almost a mile above sea level. I told him not to push the performance of the plane, to be extra-cautious, and not to fly over unfriendly terrain unless the plane was equipped with a ballistic parachute. So I was delighted when Mike called me on Sunday night to tell me that Dave's plane was equipped with a ballistic parachute. I knew that Mike was safe as he could possibly be. Mike said they were going out early next morning, probably at dawn, to get Mike checked out in the Kolb. Good time to get familiar with a new plane. Calm, cold, dense air. Best possible learning time. The next morning, on Monday, November 13, I hadn't heard anything as of noon. This was unusual, because Mike had promised to call me on Monday morning, and tell me how the Kolb was working out. When I didn't hear from him, I started to wonder if he and Dave had run into some trouble. But I wasn't worried. I knew the Kolb could easily make an emergency landing, in case the engine quit, and if anything really serious happened, all they had to do was pull the firing handle on the ballistic parachute, and float down to a safe landing. Just about the time I was thinking that, a chaplain from the local police department came to my door. When I opened the door, and saw who it was, my heart sank. I instantly knew what had happened. I won't try to describe what the rest of that day was like. I won't try to describe what the next two weeks were like. I did not know that such suffering was possible. I've never lost anyone close to me. The top value in my life was suddenly wrenched away and destroyed. My life was shattered. I died that day. Mike and I weren't even gay, but now I think I know what it's like to lose a husband or a wife. I guess I thought this kind of a loss could never happen to me or my people. But it did. And my life will never be the same again. If I could make a bargain with God or the Devil to split the remaining years of my life, and give half of them to Mike, so he could live again, I would do it in an instant. I tried. But this post is about the crash of Mike and Dave; not me. So what happened? I've spoken with the Chino Fire Department, who were the first responders on the scene. When Mike and Dave crashed, the folks who lived in a nearby house rushed out to the crash site. They said they found no sign of life in either pilot. Apparently Mike and Dave died instantly, on impact. When the Chino Fire Department arrived soon after, they found no sign of life either. And the ballistic parachute, that could have saved the plane and the pilots, had not been fired. According to the Fire Department, the plane crashed only about 600 feet from the end of the runway. We know from eyewitnesses at the airport (who heard the crash) that Mike and Dave had been doing touch-and-go maneuvers, and had just taken off again. We don't know who was flying the plane at the time of the crash. According to a neighborhood eyewitness, the plane appeared to be making a turn when it suddenly nosed over and dived into the ground. Now this sounds like a classic departure stall turn. The pilot loses his engine shortly after takeoff, and frantically tries to turn around and regain the runway. In his panic, he turns too steeply, stalls the plane, has insufficient altitude to recover, and crashes. Or perhaps the pilot is doing touch and goes, and is turning around for another landing. He turns too steeply, fails to keep the nose down and the power up, and stalls and crashes. Happens all too regularly. But the problem with this scenario is that both Mike and Dave were very experienced pilots. Mike wasn't experienced with the Kolb, but he had been flying fixed-wing aircraft for forty years. Everyone who has ever flown with Mike agrees that he was a first-rate pilot. And I never saw Mike Maikowski panic in his life. Not even when we suddenly flew into zero-zero conditions in Alaska, earlier this year, while surrounded by high mountains on all sides, only three miles away. Mike had his contingency plan all ready, and handled the situation in his calm, cool, professional manner. By all accounts, Dave was an experienced Kolb pilot who had given rides to his grandchildren and to many other people. So Dave certainly knew the Kolb very well, and how it handled, and what it could do, and what it couldn't do. And before they even made their first flight together, I know that Mike would have conducted an intense safety briefing with Dave, so there would be no doubt as to who would be in command in the air, and who would be at the controls, and how they would trade off, and what they would do in case of any conceivable emergency. That's just the way Mike flew. So what happened? Pilot error doesn't seem likely, and neither does mechanical malfunction. I'm told the Kolb is not an easy plane to stall; that you really have to try. The plane had just been checked out by an A&P mechanic (according to Eve Pelletier). Could the engine have failed in flight? Certainly. Everyone knows the Rotax 582 is not the most reliable engine in the world. But even if the engine failed, Mike and Dave would have simply glided down to a safe landing. The area where they crashed is wide open grassland. Endless places for power-off landings. No serious obstacles to avoid or hit. The only obstacle on the ground was a wire fence, about twenty feet in front of the plane, but from the position of the plane on the ground, it's pretty obvious that the plane never flew over the fence, but rather crashed short of it. And according to the fire department, the fence shows no sign of damage. So even if Mike and Dave were gliding to a power-off landing, they apparently did not hit the fence. And even if they had clipped the top of the fence while landing, and nosed over, it seems unlikely that the Kolb would have been so utterly destroyed, as it was, given its slow landing speed. And according to the eyewitness, the plane dived toward the ground, rather than gliding down in a power-off landing. Another clue as to what happened can be seen in a photograph that I recently obtained from the Chino Fire Department (and have attached to this post). It's taken from the front of the crash site, and shows the engine and propeller, sitting on top of the crumpled wing. All three blades of the propeller are shattered. Only three short stubs remain. This strongly suggests to me that the engine was running, and was under full power when the plane struck the ground, and the spinning prop was shattered when it struck the earth. If the engine had quit in flight, the prop would have instantly stopped. Even if the prop had a clutch on it, it would only be windmilling. In any case, without the power of the engine to drive it, the prop might have broken one blade on impact, possibly two blades, but most likely the third blade would have been relatively undamaged. Since all three blades were totally destroyed, I'm pretty confident that the engine was still running, probably at a high power setting, when the plane crashed. And if the plane suffered some sort of massive mechanical failure while in the air, why didn't Mike or Dave just pull the firing handle of the ballistic parachute, and float down to safety? Below three hundred feet of altitude, a save with a ballistic parachute starts to get iffy, but it's been done. Could it have been a medical emergency? Could Mike or Dave have suffered a heart attack, fallen forward on the controls, and caused the plane to crash before the other pilot could correct it? Possibly. But Mike was only 54 years old, and in excellent heath. Dave was older (68, I believe), but was also reported to be in excellent heath. So what happened? I just don't know. The NTSB has the wreckage, and will be investigating it, but their report is many months away. My guess is that Mike and Dave were doing touch and go maneuvers, and had just taken off, and were at a very low altitude when something went terribly, terribly wrong. My guess is that the plane suffered a massive mechanical malfunction that caused the aircraft to instantly go out of control and crash in only a few seconds. It probably happened so fast that neither pilot had a chance to fire the ballistic parachute. In any case, my guess is that no pilot in the world could have saved that plane from disaster. But I have no doubt that both Mike and Dave were trying to get the aircraft back under control when both men lost their lives. That's about all I know. I relate these details in the hopes that the rest of us may learn something from this terribly tragedy, and possibly save the lives of other pilots in the future. If anyone has any ideas, or comments, please feel free to share them with me; in public or in private. Mike Maikowski was my best friend. He was the finest man I have ever known. He did not deserve to die in the prime of his life. And I will miss him very, very much. Chris Wolf cwolf41(at)comcast.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Chris Wolf <cwolf41(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
Forgot to attach the photos of the crash in my previous post. Here they are. Chris Wolf cwolf41(at)comcast.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Chris Wolf <cwolf41(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
Okay, let's try the pictures again. Chris Wolf cwolf41(at)comcast.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 29, 2006
From: Cory Emberson <bootless(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Dear Chris, Thank you for taking the time to write such a beautiful, heartfelt tribute to your best friend, and to add to that a clear-headed potential analysis of what happened. My heart is breaking you for, and you will be in my prayers. Chris was extremely fortunately to have such a friend as you. I know there's not much that will ease the pain you're in right now, but do know that the family of pilots stand behind you. And maybe it will help to know that every good thing we do in our lives (and it sounds like Mike and Dave and you have all done much good) ... *every* good deed and word leaves a permanent mark on this world. Please take care... best, Cory > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Chris Wolf <cwolf41(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
Oops! I just realized that in my first post about the Kolb crash of Dave and Mike, I neglected to update the section on the condition of the prop after the crash. What I originally wrote was based on a firsthand examination of the photographs, made late at night, while very tired. The next day I realized my description was incorrect, but I forgot to update it before sending the post to the list. My apologies. The following is what I intended to post. Another clue as to what happened can be seen in a photograph that I recently obtained from the Chino Fire Department (and have attached to this post). It's taken from the front of the crash site, and shows the engine and propeller, sitting on top of the crumpled wing. All three blades of the propeller are shattered. Two short stubs remain, while the third blade appears to have a little more than half its length still intact. This description was also confirmed to me by one of the fireman who was at the scene of the crash. This strongly suggests to me that the engine was running, and was under high power when the plane struck the ground, and the spinning prop was shattered when it struck the earth. If the engine had quit in flight, the prop would have instantly stopped. Even if the prop had a clutch on it, it would only be windmilling. In any case, without the power of the engine to drive it, the prop might have broken one blade on impact, possibly two blades, but most likely the third blade would have been relatively undamaged, since it would have been pointing away from the other two blades, and away from the ground. Since all three blades were heavily damaged (and two totally shattered), I'm pretty confident that the engine was still running, probably at a high power setting, when the plane crashed. Chris Wolf cwolf41(at)comcast.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Wayne T. McCullough" <blackbird754(at)alltel.net>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
Chris, Everyone that I have ever met in the aircraft world......is like a band of brothers and sisters..........ESPECIALLY people who fly the light stuff....... I have lost my wingman 2 years ago to heart problems.........but he still flew a quicksilver every chance he got.......... Still miss him though........... I too am Deeply touched by your responce and take on the accident.......... Wayne McCullough Kolbra 004 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Wolf" <cwolf41(at)comcast.net> Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 2:40 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf > > > Oops! I just realized that in my first post about the Kolb crash of Dave > and Mike, I neglected to update the section on the condition of the prop > after the crash. What I originally wrote was based on a firsthand > examination of the photographs, made late at night, while very tired. The > next day I realized my description was incorrect, but I forgot to update > it > before sending the post to the list. My apologies. The following is what > I intended to post. > > Another clue as to what happened can be seen in a photograph that I > recently obtained from the Chino Fire Department (and have attached to > this > post). It's taken from the front of the crash site, and shows the engine > and propeller, sitting on top of the crumpled wing. All three blades of > the propeller are shattered. Two short stubs remain, while the third > blade > appears to have a little more than half its length still intact. This > description was also confirmed to me by one of the fireman who was at the > scene of the crash. This strongly suggests to me that the engine was > running, and was under high power when the plane struck the ground, and > the > spinning prop was shattered when it struck the earth. If the engine had > quit in flight, the prop would have instantly stopped. Even if the prop > had a clutch on it, it would only be windmilling. In any case, without > the > power of the engine to drive it, the prop might have broken one blade on > impact, possibly two blades, but most likely the third blade would have > been relatively undamaged, since it would have been pointing away from the > other two blades, and away from the ground. Since all three blades were > heavily damaged (and two totally shattered), I'm pretty confident that the > engine was still running, probably at a high power setting, when the plane > crashed. > > Chris Wolf > cwolf41(at)comcast.net > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
Chris, Thanks for sharing with us. I'm pained for you and for all the bereaved of this grievous tragedy. As a long time Kolb flyer the first thing that comes to my mind as a possible cause, is a sudden failure of the up elevator cable. With two people on board, and flaps extended, and full thrust power, which it is reasonable to assume they would have had at that time, is the most force a Kolb plane can possibly exert to nose over. Were the elevator cable to suddenly fail at that point @ 600 ft AGL an incident such as occurred would be almost impossible to prevent even at sea level. May God give you grace for this difficult time. Gene Z On Nov 29, 2006, at 2:11 PM, Chris Wolf wrote: > If anyone has any ideas, or comments, > please feel free to share them with me; in public or in private. grievous ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Kirk Smith" <snuffy(at)usol.com>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
> >> If anyone has any ideas, or comments, > >> please feel free to share them with me; in public or in private. > >grievous You were both fortunate men to have had such a friendship. My father always told me that if you have one true friend in your life you're a fortunate man. I guess the closest I had to that was in Vietnam. The last time I saw him was when they put him in a body bag. He was drafted and had just turned 21. A whole life was ahead of him. Not to be. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
Gene, that exact thought is why Vamoose has dual elevator cables, and that thought occured to me, too, regarding the crash. Also seems to me that a couple of people poo-poo-ed the idea when I brought it up 6 or 8 years ago. That's the only thing I can think of that 2 experienced pilots would have no option for. Lar. Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eugene Zimmerman" <etzim62(at)earthlink.net> Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 12:55 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf > > Chris, > Thanks for sharing with us. > I'm pained for you and for all the bereaved of this grievous tragedy. > > As a long time Kolb flyer the first thing that comes to my mind as a > possible cause, is a sudden failure of the up elevator cable. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Dual Elevator Cables
Date: Nov 29, 2006
While thinking on this topic, I'll refer you to a page of my website. Take a look about 1/2 way down the page............. http://www.biglar.homestead.com/STARTINGTHECABIN.html Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com> Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 5:07 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf > > Gene, that exact thought is why Vamoose has dual elevator cables, and that ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
----- Original Message ----- | Gene, that exact thought is why Vamoose has dual elevator cables, and that | thought occured to me, too, regarding the crash. Also seems to me that a | couple of people poo-poo-ed the idea when I brought it up 6 or 8 years ago. | That's the only thing I can think of that 2 experienced pilots would have no | option for. Lar. Larry: Don't remember if I poo-poo-ed your idea back then or not. Don't know that I have ever poo-poo-ed anything. Don't know that I know how to poo-poo! ;-) MKIII plans and instructions called for 3/32" cable when I built my MKIII in 1961. Because my airplanes work a little harder than most "normal" Kolbs, I elected to go 1/8" cable for up elevator, even though one would be hard pressed to fail the up elevator cable, short of an improper nico press job on both nicopress sleeves. Guess one could lose 3/16 bolt at either forward or aft end. Never heard of an up elevator failure on a Kolb. Doesn't mean it didn't happen. Just means I did not hear about it if it did. As for AZ Dave's crash, a look at the three photos show the elevator in what looks like the near full up position. Appears something is holding the elevator in the up position.If I remember correctly, Dave's MKIII had the standard single control stick mounted in the center. This system is built like a tank and pretty much bullet proof, no matter how heavy the pilot's hand happens to be. I have survived several crashes in the US, FS, and MKIII. These crashes placed tremendous loads to both rudder cables through the pedals, during impact. Have bent forward, those pedals, but never failed a 3/32 rudder cable. Course that was loading both cables pretty much equally. Looks like all the tail wires are still attached as requred. Lower cables appear larger than the upper cables. Perhaps Dave had changed these from standard size??? It is always disappointing when fatalities occur and parachutes are not deployed. I think Larry Bourne said it was doubtful that they could have been saved from less than 1,000 feet AGL. Over the years a hand deployed parachute saved my life from 200 and 500 feet AGL. No doubt in my mind, a BRS will deploy at 300-400 feet AGL, and probably much, much lower. We have experienced several fatal accidents on this List because parachute was not deployed. It takes training and practice to be ready to use the parachute, should the situation dictate its use. Not uncommon for folks to freeze up, physically and mentally, when critical situations occur. One must make a snap decision and act, right then to pull the red handle. Can not sit there and think about it. Not fair for me to speculate on why an accident happened when I was many, many miles from the scene, did not witness it, and only have the words of a single witness that saw the aircraft crash, to go on. Best left to the experts to determine what happened, although they do not have a lot of info to go on either. Was a tragic accident that quite possibly could have been survivable. I am sorry it happened. I lost a good friend, as did many others on this List. Take care, john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
Larry, duel up elevator cables is a very good idea. I know of two kolb planes that experienced in-flight torn rudder cables, and as your web site so aptly points out ,,,,"with no up-elevator, you're gonna make your final dive - period " Redundant up elevator cables will be one thing on my to do list. On Nov 29, 2006, at 8:07 PM, Larry Bourne wrote: > > Gene, that exact thought is why Vamoose has dual elevator cables, > and that thought occured to me, too, regarding the crash. Also > seems to me that a couple of people poo-poo-ed the idea when I > brought it up 6 or 8 years ago. That's the only thing I can think > of that 2 experienced pilots would have no option > for. Lar. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
Thanks, Eugene. It's almost certain that they'll never be necessary, but it seems to be such a simple thing for that much insurance. Lar. Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eugene Zimmerman" <etzim62(at)earthlink.net> Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 7:18 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf > > Larry, duel up elevator cables is a very good idea. > I know of two kolb planes that experienced in-flight torn rudder ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
| I know of two kolb planes that experienced in-flight torn rudder | cables, Hi Eugene: Will you expand on "in-flight torn rudder cables" please. Don't think I understand what you are saying. Thanks, john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
Yep, I predict you will become a trend setter if our suspicion is confirmed by the investigators. On Nov 29, 2006, at 11:36 PM, Larry Bourne wrote: > Thanks, Eugene. It's almost certain that they'll never be > necessary, but it seems to be such a simple thing for that much > insurance. Lar. > > Larry Bourne > Santa Fe, NM ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 30, 2006
John, Sorry for my feeble communication and confusing phraseology. I know of two of at least two kolb planes and two pilots that experienced sudden complete tearing or breaking of rudder cables while in-flight. One was our own Mk II with my son Earl as the pilot taking off at the Father's day fly-in in a pretty good cross wind. The other pilot was Wilmer Z, with his Ultrastar. In both cases the cables suddenly severed at the pulleys and showed no significant wear before they broke. Wilmer said he noticed one tiny strand of wire in the cable was broken and he was planning to replace the cables but it suddenly snapped before he got the chance to replace it. On Nov 29, 2006, at 10:45 PM, John Hauck wrote: > Hi Eugene: > > Will you expand on "in-flight torn rudder cables" please. Don't think > I understand what you are saying. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 29, 2006
Hi Gene: | Sorry for my feeble communication and confusing phraseology. Not you, my friend. I am slow to read, interpret, and understand stuff. | I know of two of at least two kolb planes and two pilots that | experienced sudden complete tearing or breaking of rudder cables | while in-flight. How many flight hours were on these cables before they failed? What kind of cable was it? Strands, twists, wires, SS, Galvanized??? The tighter the bend, the more prone a cable will be to failure. The US rudder cable has to make some 90 degree turns before it gets to the tail boom. Nylon fairleads, as used on the mkIII are very prone to wearing through strands of wire in the cables. There is constant rubbing during flight from vibration more than from operation of the pedals. Good idea to include cables in ones preflight, especially up elevator cables. Never had any wear in elevator cables on the mkIII, but do get a bit of wear on the rudder cables. Thanks, john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 30, 2006
From: Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com>
Subject: Last "Official" Day Of The List Fund Raiser!
Dear Listers, Well, its November 30th and that means three things... 1) Today I am now officially 43 years old... (arg...) 2) It marks that last "official" day of the List Fund Raiser! 3) Its the last day I will be bugging everyone for a whole year! :-) If you use the Lists and enjoy the content and the no-advertising, no-spam, and no-censorship way in which they're run, please make a Contribution today to support their continued operation and upkeep. Your $20 or $30 goes a long way to further the List operation and keep the bills paid. I will be posting the List of Contributors next week, so make sure your name is on it! :-) Thank you to everyone that has made a Contribution so far this year! It is greatly appreciated. List Contributions: http://www.matronics.com/contribution Best regards, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
Date: Nov 30, 2006
John, The cable failure in our MkII was probably eight or ten years ago. I do not remember how many flight hrs it had at that time. I'm certain Wilmer's Ultrastar was a high time plane when his rudder cable failed. To the best of my knowledge both planes had the cables that were supplied with the kits from kolb. I don't recall if they were stainless or galvanized but stainless definitely is inferior and should be avoided for this application IMHO. Another serious elevator issue that I have seem on some kolbs is with cable turnbuckles. Where turnbuckles are bolted directly to the control horn on the stick sometimes there is not enough clearance for full stick movement in the yoke of the turnbuckle causing the yoke of the turnbuckle to bottom out on the horn causing bending side pressure on the stem of the turnbuckle. This condition will eventually cause the turnbuckle to fail. The solution is to file or grind the control horn to allow for full stick movement without the yoke of the turnbuckle bottoming out on the horn. Gene On Nov 30, 2006, at 12:22 AM, John Hauck wrote: > How many flight hours were on these cables before they failed? > > What kind of cable was it? > > Strands, twists, wires, SS, Galvanized??? ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 30, 2006
From: "Richard Girard" <jindoguy(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Dual Elevator Cables
Larry, Does your extra elevator cables also work as trim cables like the original early Mk 3's, or do you just run them double from bell crank to bell crank? As I documented here last summer, the early system of returning the elevator cable to the trim lever made for handling I didn't like. The airplane seemed to hunt for a pitch attitude all the time. The reason is that when you pull on some trim the elevator cable would go slack. Now each pitch input goes through the trim spring. I'd pull back just a bit, I usually fly with index finger and thumb wrapped around the bottom of the stick grip, and nothing would happen. Pull back just a smidge more and oops now we're gaining a bit, ease off the stick pressure and we're diving again. In my early days of extreme ham handedness, when I had my whole hand wrapped around the stick grip, I drove myself nuts. There were times when I could not tell if it was the aircraft or me causing PIO's. We would just slide through the sky making a gentle, shallow sine wave. Eventually I got pretty good at compensating, but there was never a time when I could just relax and trim the airplane out. Unfortunately, unlike others, who can report on the effect of going to the new style rigging, I'm still fooling around with a new electrical system for my Mk 3 and won't be flying for several weeks. As soon as I get her airborne again, I'll report on the change. Incidentally, when I told Travis of the rigging I found, he said the guys at TNK hadn't seen it done like this, so the change occured sometime before they took over. My Mk 3 is serial # 43. Rick On 11/29/06, Larry Bourne wrote: > > > While thinking on this topic, I'll refer you to a page of my > website. Take > a look about 1/2 way down the page............. > > http://www.biglar.homestead.com/STARTINGTHECABIN.html > > Larry Bourne > Santa Fe, NM > www.gogittum.com > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com> > To: > Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 5:07 PM > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf > > > > > > Gene, that exact thought is why Vamoose has dual elevator cables, and > that > > -- Rick Girard "Ya'll drop on in" takes on a whole new meaning when you live at the airport. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Control Cable
Date: Nov 30, 2006
Morning Bob B: Took the liberty of changing the subject line to something a little more appropriate. Don't know if a dab of grease would help or not. Probably would, if it did not also attract dirt and grit. Not a big problem, but something to keep you eye on if you put a lot of hours on your mkIII. I can't remember how many times I have changed out the rudder and elevator cables over the 2500 hours my mkIII has been flying, but not that often. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Control Cable
Date: Nov 30, 2006
| Another serious elevator issue that I have seem on some kolbs is with | cable turnbuckles. Where turnbuckles are bolted directly to the | control horn on the stick sometimes there is not enough clearance | for full stick movement in the yoke of the turnbuckle causing the | yoke of the turnbuckle to bottom out on the horn causing bending | side pressure on the stem of the turnbuckle. This condition will | eventually cause the turnbuckle to fail. The solution is to file or | grind the control horn to allow for full stick movement without the | yoke of the turnbuckle bottoming out on the horn. | | Gene Gene Z: I have also seen this turn buckle clearance problem on Kolbs. You are absolutely right. It will eventually cause the turn buckle to fail. I remember Old Kolb sending out a supplemental change to grind out clearance on a Firestar control stick to prevent this from happening. Another place that a cable gets bent with a hard side load is the forward end of the throttle cable, where it is attached to the clevis. If it bends enough it will eventually break. These are areas that need to be checked and corrected before they break. Thanks for the turn buckle problem. I had forgotten about that one. I changed the subject line to reflect what we are discussing. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dual Elevator Cables
Date: Nov 30, 2006
| Larry, Does your extra elevator cables also work as trim cables like the | original early Mk 3's, | | Rick Rick: Believe you are mistaken on the dual up elevator cables and mkIII's. I have serial number M3-011, was at the factory working when the first mkIII kit was sitting on the shipping dock to be picked up by Rudy Doctor. Forced pitch trim system with springs attached to the elevator bell crank has always been that way on mkIII's. The Twinstar used a cable operated elevator trim tab. So maybe the mkII is the Kolb that used redundant up elevator cables. You speak of the aircraft not wanting to settle down in pitch trim. My mkIII was that way during experimentation with my adjustable leading edge on the horizontal stabilizers, until I found the sweet spot. Now it behaves its self. Take care, john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Pike" <richard(at)bcchapel.org>
Subject: Re: Dual Elevator Cables
Date: Nov 30, 2006
I had the same problem with it not wanting to settle down. In my case, having a flap handle with three settings in the "up" position was the cure. Regular "up", about 3 degrees more "up", and about three degrees down from regular "up." That's the nice thing about the MKIII, no matter how you skin the cat, you get good results. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) DNA ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 10:52 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dual Elevator Cables > > > | Larry, Does your extra elevator cables also work as trim cables like > the > | original early Mk 3's, > | > | Rick > > > Rick: > > Believe you are mistaken on the dual up elevator cables and mkIII's. > I have serial number M3-011, was at the factory working when the first > mkIII kit was sitting on the shipping dock to be picked up by Rudy > Doctor. Forced pitch trim system with springs attached to the > elevator bell crank has always been that way on mkIII's. > > The Twinstar used a cable operated elevator trim tab. So maybe the > mkII is the Kolb that used redundant up elevator cables. > > You speak of the aircraft not wanting to settle down in pitch trim. > My mkIII was that way during experimentation with my adjustable > leading edge on the horizontal stabilizers, until I found the sweet > spot. Now it behaves its self. > > Take care, > > john h > mkIII > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dual Elevator Cables
Date: Nov 30, 2006
In my case, | having a flap handle with three settings in the "up" position was the cure. | Richard Pike Richard: One of these days I would like to have infinite flap adjustment on my mkIII. I think it would be fun to experiment with, and much, much simpler than adjusting push/pull tubes each time a change was desired. Main reason I never got around to doing a lot of experimentation with reflexed flaps, pain in the butt set up in the normal configuration. Eventually, I may get around to it. The old flap mechanism is showing its age. Vibration has worn down the tabs an 1/8" or so over the years. Take care, john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com>
Date: Nov 30, 2006
Subject: Re: Control Cable
John and all, I've never changed elevator or rudder cables in the 20 years of flying my Kolb. I've inspected them many times and they are still good. Ralph Original Firestar 20 years flying it -- "John Hauck" wrote: Morning Bob B: Took the liberty of changing the subject line to something a little more appropriate. Don't know if a dab of grease would help or not. Probably would, if it did not also attract dirt and grit. Not a big problem, but something to keep you eye on if you put a lot of hours on your mkIII. I can't remember how many times I have changed out the rudder and elevator cables over the 2500 hours my mkIII has been flying, but not that often. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Control Cable
Date: Nov 30, 2006
| John and all, I've never changed elevator or rudder cables in the 20 | years of flying my Kolb. I've inspected them many times and they are | still good. | | Ralph Hi Ralph: That is great! Now, how does 20 years flying equate to hours flown? Flight hours gives us a better idea of how much use/wear has been placed on a piece of equipment. Most Kolb owners don't fly 50 hours a year, and many of them do not log their flight time. Guess you are getting geared up to start flying off the ice. :-) john h mkIII I change mine out about every 1,000 hours. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 30, 2006
From: "Richard Girard" <jindoguy(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Dual Elevator Cables
John, perhaps my description was lacking. On my Mk. 3 the pitch trim cable and the up elevator cable were two ends of the same long wire. From the spring on the trim handle there was a multihole link of flat sheet metal and the wire started there, went back to the aft elevator bell crank and then forward to the forward elevator bell crank in the cockpit. The forward bell crank differs from the current one shown in the plans and does not have the tab and hole to hook up the trim wire coming from the spring to the forward bellcrank. My solution was to use a tang salvaged from my friend Jeff Johnson's 1975 Eipper-Formance FlexiFlyer Rogallo attached with the same bolt as the push rod coming from the stick. The circuit is now the same as plans stock in function, but I get to carry a piece of Jeff along with me from now on. When I first recounted this last summer, I thanked another lister (sorry forgot your name again) who had recounted a similar setup and published a warning about it. Perhaps it was a mod endorsed by a small community of builders, back when. Once again assume made an ass of me. :-) Rick On 11/30/06, John Hauck wrote: > > > In my case, > | having a flap handle with three settings in the "up" position was > the cure. > | Richard Pike > > > Richard: > > One of these days I would like to have infinite flap adjustment on my > mkIII. I think it would be fun to experiment with, and much, much > simpler than adjusting push/pull tubes each time a change was desired. > Main reason I never got around to doing a lot of experimentation with > reflexed flaps, pain in the butt set up in the normal configuration. > > Eventually, I may get around to it. The old flap mechanism is showing > its age. Vibration has worn down the tabs an 1/8" or so over the > years. > > Take care, > > john h > mkIII > > -- Rick Girard "Ya'll drop on in" takes on a whole new meaning when you live at the airport. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 30, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf
At 08:16 PM 11/29/2006, you wrote: > >I have survived several crashes in the US, FS, and MKIII. These >crashes placed tremendous loads to both rudder cables through the >pedals, during impact. >We have experienced several fatal accidents on this >List because parachute was not deployed. It takes training and >practice to be ready to use the parachute, should the situation >dictate its use. Not uncommon for folks to freeze up, physically and >mentally, when critical situations occur. One must make a snap >decision and act, right then to pull the red handle. Can not sit >there and think about it. I agree 1. I changed my pulleys to "real" aircraft parts a long time ago the ones with the bearings etc. I've cut thru some of the cheaper ones like John says. 2. If you don't practice (at least practice) pulling the red handle every time you are sitting on the runway - about to takeoff, odds are that you will not even remember that you have a chute when things go wrong, I've been situations where I would (maybe?) have used the chute, but didn't remember that I had one until it was to late to use it. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com>
Subject: Re: Dual Elevator Cables
Date: Nov 30, 2006
It's hard to remember and the plane is 800 miles away. Seems like I ran the trim cable to a separate anchor point on the elevator horn, to make 2 completely separate systems. I saw a couple of ideas that used a common anchor point, and didn't think too much of them, cause you've still really got the effect of just one actual cable. If that connection failed, all the cables in the world wouldn't help. Lar. Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Girard To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 6:28 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dual Elevator Cables Larry, Does your extra elevator cables also work as trim cables like the original early Mk 3's, or do you just run them double from bell crank to bell crank? As I documented here last summer, the early system of returning the elevator cable to the trim lever made for handling I didn't like. The airplane seemed to hunt for a pitch attitude all the time. The reason is that when you pull on some trim the elevator cable would go slack. Now each pitch input goes through the trim spring. I'd pull back just a bit, I usually fly with index finger and thumb wrapped around the bottom of the stick grip, and nothing would happen. Pull back just a smidge more and oops now we're gaining a bit, ease off the stick pressure and we're diving again. In my early days of extreme ham handedness, when I had my whole hand wrapped around the stick grip, I drove myself nuts. There were times when I could not tell if it was the aircraft or me causing PIO's. We would just slide through the sky making a gentle, shallow sine wave. Eventually I got pretty good at compensating, but there was never a time when I could just relax and trim the airplane out. Unfortunately, unlike others, who can report on the effect of going to the new style rigging, I'm still fooling around with a new electrical system for my Mk 3 and won't be flying for several weeks. As soon as I get her airborne again, I'll report on the change. Incidentally, when I told Travis of the rigging I found, he said the guys at TNK hadn't seen it done like this, so the change occured sometime before they took over. My Mk 3 is serial # 43. Rick On 11/29/06, Larry Bourne wrote: While thinking on this topic, I'll refer you to a page of my website. Take a look about 1/2 way down the page............. http://www.biglar.homestead.com/STARTINGTHECABIN.html Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar(at)gogittum.com> To: Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 5:07 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dave Pelletier, Michael Maikowski, and Chris Wolf biglar(at)gogittum.com> > > Gene, that exact thought is why Please Support Your Lists This Month -- Terrific Free Incentive Gifts provided sp; * The Builder's Bookstore www.homontribution"> sp; -Ma======================= ef="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics. co===================== -- Rick Girard "Ya'll drop on in" takes on a whole new meaning when you live at the airport. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 30, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Y'all be careful out there !
http://www.jumpcut.com/view?id=8DAA37A65F9911DBA8C9961586523BC9 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Dual Elevator Cables
Date: Nov 30, 2006
Hi Gang: Anybody know of a yahoo breaking a 3/32" aircraft cable on an elevator on a mkIII? That cable has a breaking strength of 920 lbs. If you double your 3/32" cable you will end up with about 1840 lbs. If you go to a single 1/8" cable you will have to exert 1700 lbs to break that cable. Tell me, please. How the hell is anyone going to exert that much load on that little bitty elevator??? Another note. Don't think Homer Kolb would have put us in jeopardy by using a cable that was not strong enough to do the job. I am not a mathematician or an engineer, so I don't know how much load is possible to apply to the elevator. I have an idea though, that those little 5/16" aluminum tubes in the elevator are going to bend and break long before one overloads the cable. Since I have a habit of breaking Homer's airplanes, I used a single 1/8" cable on my up elevator. Of note is my pitch trim system cable which is 1/16" cable. 1/16" cable has a breaking strength of 480 lbs. That is what we used for tail wire bracing on the Ultrastar. Normally, my nose up trim is carrying the up elevator flight load. That tiny cable has been doing all that work for more than 2500 hours without as much of a whine. But........if it makes you feel better, make'em redundant. Let's see. The Piper Cubs and other small Piper aircraft all use 1/8" elevator cable. Taylorcraft, same same. Wonder why the FAA did not make them go redundant? Take care, john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 30, 2006
From: Lanny Fetterman <donaho(at)uplink.net>
Subject: Almost pulled the BRS handle
Hi, Back when I was teaching myself to fly my Quicksilver MX, ( not too smart of a decision as I look back on it, however there weren`t any instructors close by 15 years ago ) I did a high speed stall at about 1500 AGL. I remember pulling back on the stick and the nose of the airplane just kept going up and up and up, I was laying back in my seat looking at the clouds, thinking, this is really cool! When the stall broke, I heard the flying wires snap like a bow string, thank goodness they didn`t break. I found myself looking straight down at the fields of corn and soybeans. I was off the seat hanging from the seat belt bent in a V shape, with NOTHING between me and the ground but 1500 feet of calm air. Thank goodness the seat belt held, or this would be an accident not an incident! When I took my hand off the stick to pull the BRS handle I couldn`t believe the forces working against me. It took all my strength, ( I`m no beast, but no wuss either) to force my hand in the direction of the BRS handle. Before I could deploy the BRS, The Quicksilver flew itself back to straight and level. ( no help from me). Incident over, all was good. I landed safely and a lot smarter. NOW HERE IS MY POINT: I always wonder, when I hear that the BRS was not deployed, if the pilot could over come the forces, and get his hand on the BRS handle. I guess it all depends which way you are tumbling. If people have nine lives, I cashed in one of mine that day. Come to think of it I probably only have one or two left. Everyone fly safely out there! Lanny Fetterman N598LF FSII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 30, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Almost pulled the BRS handle
At 07:51 PM 11/30/2006, you wrote: > > When I took my hand off the stick to pull the BRS handle I > couldn`t believe the forces working against me. It took all my > strength, ( I`m no beast, but no wuss either) to force my hand in > the direction of the BRS handle. Before I could deploy the BRS, The > Quicksilver flew itself back to straight and level. ( no help from > me). Incident over, all was good. I landed safely and a lot smarter. > NOW HERE IS MY POINT: I always wonder, when I hear that the > BRS was not deployed, if the pilot could over come the forces, and > get his hand on the BRS handle. I guess it all depends which way > you are tumbling. When you need the chute,, you'd better be able to pull it with your eyes closed, upside down and spinning out of control. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Dual Elevator Cables
Date: Nov 30, 2006
Hey John relax, The issue is most certainly NOT cable strength. I believe you are the one who reminded us in the past that everything has a life span or life cycle. I believe most cables have a life span longer than even the youngest pilot. but, some cables break in flight, some kolb wings break in flight. Remember most kolbs are built by uncertified amateurs and flown by fallible humans. Gene Z On Nov 30, 2006, at 7:37 PM, John Hauck wrote: > Hi Gang: > > Anybody know of a yahoo breaking a 3/32" aircraft cable on an elevator > on a mkIII? That cable has a breaking strength of 920 lbs. > > If you double your 3/32" cable you will end up with about 1840 lbs. > > If you go to a single 1/8" cable you will have to exert 1700 lbs to > break that cable. > > Tell me, please. How the hell is anyone going to exert that much load > on that little bitty elevator??? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Souder" <flykolb(at)pa.net>
Subject: Dual Elevator Cables
Date: Nov 30, 2006
John, I don't think that even you could break an elevator cable. If you could pull hard enough to exert the necessary force to break the cable, the cable would stretch enough so you would run out of travel. With a straight run like the Mark-III has for the elevator, there is little to fatigue it. The flight loads alone would not be sufficient to fatigue it. Running over a pulley adds more stress than anything else, but there are no pulleys in the M3 elevator system. Dennis -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hauck Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 7:37 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dual Elevator Cables Hi Gang: Anybody know of a yahoo breaking a 3/32" aircraft cable on an elevator on a mkIII? That cable has a breaking strength of 920 lbs. If you double your 3/32" cable you will end up with about 1840 lbs. If you go to a single 1/8" cable you will have to exert 1700 lbs to break that cable. Tell me, please. How the hell is anyone going to exert that much load on that little bitty elevator??? Another note. Don't think Homer Kolb would have put us in jeopardy by using a cable that was not strong enough to do the job. I am not a mathematician or an engineer, so I don't know how much load is possible to apply to the elevator. I have an idea though, that those little 5/16" aluminum tubes in the elevator are going to bend and break long before one overloads the cable. Since I have a habit of breaking Homer's airplanes, I used a single 1/8" cable on my up elevator. Of note is my pitch trim system cable which is 1/16" cable. 1/16" cable has a breaking strength of 480 lbs. That is what we used for tail wire bracing on the Ultrastar. Normally, my nose up trim is carrying the up elevator flight load. That tiny cable has been doing all that work for more than 2500 hours without as much of a whine. But........if it makes you feel better, make'em redundant. Let's see. The Piper Cubs and other small Piper aircraft all use 1/8" elevator cable. Taylorcraft, same same. Wonder why the FAA did not make them go redundant? Take care, john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 30, 2006
From: possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: and a happy new year.
http://216.239.51.104/search?q=cache:hiKxAILexi0J:www.fugly.com/videos/4501/tbwa_xmas_wmv.html+xmas+%22tbwa%22&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ralph" <ul15rhb(at)juno.com>
Date: Dec 01, 2006
Subject: Re: Control Cable
John, sorry about not posting the hours. I have 810 hours on the Firestar in 20 years. I'm a weekend flyer. Ralph Original Firestar -- "John Hauck" wrote: | John and all, I've never changed elevator or rudder cables in the 20 | years of flying my Kolb. I've inspected them many times and they are | still good. | | Ralph Hi Ralph: That is great! Now, how does 20 years flying equate to hours flown? Flight hours gives us a better idea of how much use/wear has been placed on a piece of equipment. Most Kolb owners don't fly 50 hours a year, and many of them do not log their flight time. Guess you are getting geared up to start flying off the ice. :-) john h mkIII I change mine out about every 1,000 hours. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Nov 30, 2006
From: Earl & Mim Zimmerman <emzi(at)supernet.com>
Subject: Dual Elevator Cables
Eugene Zimmerman wrote: > I know of two of at least two kolb planes and two pilots that > experienced sudden complete tearing or breaking of rudder cables while > in-flight. > > One was our own Mk II with my son Earl as the pilot taking off at the > Father's day fly-in in a pretty good cross wind. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> Remember most kolbs are built by uncertified amateurs and flown by >> fallible humans. >> >> Gene Z As I remember it the cable in question was exposed to some heat while gas welding a pulley bracket with the cable was installed. The fresh replacement cable has nearly 500 hrs. without a problem. I agree with John. I don't think Dave's cables failed! There could be nothing else that would hold the elevator up in the crash pictures that were posted. Sure would love to know what DID happen! ~Earl ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Edward Bonsell" <ebonsell(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Firestar Rudder Cables
Date: Nov 30, 2006
I mentioned a few days back I found a few broken threads on the rudder cables on my Firestar. I have just over 300 hours on the plane. The threads were showing in the area where the cable goes around the pulley under the seat. My first plane was a 1983 Cobra by Advanced Aviation. One time I was inspecting the rudder cables on that and I found threads breaking in the same place. Where they went around a pulley. I got new cable and hardware so I'm ready to make new cables. The last time it came up I believe it was best to leave a little bit of the cable end sticking out after the 2nd nicopress? Do I remember that correctly? I hope to have some photo's soon. Ed ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <kfackler(at)ameritech.net>
Subject: Flying time
Date: Nov 30, 2006
> John, sorry about not posting the hours. I have 810 hours on the > Firestar in 20 years. I'm a weekend flyer. I got my Mark II back in the air after the winter hiartus at the end of April. As of last weekend I have a bit over 100 hours this year. There's ~350 on this engine and I put 135 on the engine that was on it when I bought it. So, ~485 hrs on the bird since I first put it in the air in September 2002. That's in Michigan where we can only fly about 8 months each year at best. -Ken Fackler Kolb Mark II / A722KWF Rochester MI ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "noel anderson" <nandrand(at)xtra.co.nz>
Subject: Re: Dual Elevator Cables
Date: Dec 01, 2006
Hi List. Is it the cable it's self that breaks, or the crimping?? John H. is right, it's hard to break "The Cable"in normal use!!! There is a possability that the cable at, or in, the crimp could "work harden" over time and snap a number of strands, thus reducing the strength. Just my $0.02. Fly safe. Noel ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 1:37 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dual Elevator Cables > > > Hi Gang: > > Anybody know of a yahoo breaking a 3/32" aircraft cable on an elevator > on a mkIII? That cable has a breaking strength of 920 lbs. > > If you double your 3/32" cable you will end up with about 1840 lbs. > > If you go to a single 1/8" cable you will have to exert 1700 lbs to > break that cable. > > Tell me, please. How the hell is anyone going to exert that much load > on that little bitty elevator??? > > Another note. Don't think Homer Kolb would have put us in jeopardy by > using a cable that was not strong enough to do the job. I am not a > mathematician or an engineer, so I don't know how much load is > possible to apply to the elevator. I have an idea though, that those > little 5/16" aluminum tubes in the elevator are going to bend and > break long before one overloads the cable. > > Since I have a habit of breaking Homer's airplanes, I used a single > 1/8" cable on my up elevator. > > Of note is my pitch trim system cable which is 1/16" cable. 1/16" > cable has a breaking strength of 480 lbs. That is what we used for > tail wire bracing on the Ultrastar. Normally, my nose up trim is > carrying the up elevator flight load. That tiny cable has been doing > all that work for more than 2500 hours without as much of a whine. > > But........if it makes you feel better, make'em redundant. > > Let's see. The Piper Cubs and other small Piper aircraft all use 1/8" > elevator cable. Taylorcraft, same same. Wonder why the FAA did not > make them go redundant? > > Take care, > > john h > mkIII > > > -- > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Used 582 engine for sale
Date: Dec 01, 2006
If any one is looking for a used 582 Rotax engine I have the one on my Firestar for sale on E-Bay. http://cgi.ebay.com/COMPLETE-ROTAX-582-ULTRALIGHT-AIRCRAFT-ENGINE- WITH- PROP_W0QQitemZ270059742602QQihZ017QQcategoryZ26437QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Dec 01, 2006
From: "David Lehman" <david(at)davidlehman.net>
Subject: Re: Used 582 engine for sale
Eugene... This link will work better... *http://tinyurl.com/tx27z* DVD On 12/1/06, Eugene Zimmerman wrote: > > > If any one is looking for a used 582 Rotax engine I have the one on > my Firestar for sale on E-Bay. > > http://cgi.ebay.com/COMPLETE-ROTAX-582-ULTRALIGHT-AIRCRAFT-ENGINE- > WITH- > PROP_W0QQitemZ270059742602QQihZ017QQcategoryZ26437QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Firestar Rudder Cables
Date: Dec 01, 2006
The last time it came up I believe it was best to leave a little bit of the cable end sticking out after the 2nd nicopress? Do I remember that correctly? Ed Morning Ed: That's the way I do it. Here is a diagram off the NICOPRESS web site. john h ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Firestar Rudder Cables
Date: Dec 01, 2006
Ed B: Forgot to mention, get a Go/No Go Gauge to check your Nicopress Sleeve crimps to insure you have made a good one. john h mkIII ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Dec 01, 2006
From: "Richard Girard" <jindoguy(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Cables, pulleys and nico press swages
All snowed in and no where to go here on the Great Grass Desert. First, a single nico sleeve of the proper size and properly swaged is as strong as the cable it is installed on. A second nico actually decreases the cables strength. If you leave cable sticking out of the second one, then it has no purpose whatsoever. Its only function is to keep you from getting those nasty little holes in your finger. Those who have mentioned finding broken strands don't say what type of cable they have. 7 X 7? 7 X 19? 1 X 19? Each type of construction has its own place. Since pulleys are mentioned, it probably isn't 1 X 19. This is what throttle and choke cables are made from because it's pretty stiff and will take a bit of a compression load when the cable is pushed instead of pulled. 7 X 19 on the other hand is very soft, relatively speaking, and will work better when a small pulley must be used. Generally speaking 7 X 7 construction is probably what most of us have. Incidentally, the numbers refer to the number of wires in each bundle and the number of bundles in the cable. 1 X 19 has 1 wire in each bundle and 19 bundles in the cable. 7 X 19 has 7 wires per bundle and 19 bundles per cable. What material? Common aircraft cable is just carbon steel, hence the oil to protect it from corrosion. Stainless Steel is dry, usually, and if you get it from a boat shop, like West Marine, is usually pre stretched. Whenever possible I try to use pre stretched SS 7 X 7 rather than carbon steel because the lubricant attracts dirt and gets all over everything it touches. Pulleys are sized by the cable and degree of bend the cable must make. Too small a pulley increases the internal strain on the individual wire in the cable, and eventually these little wires give up. All of this can be found in FAA publication AC 43.13 1b and 2a, "Acceptable Methods, Techniques, and Practices - Aircraft Inspection and Repair", about $20 from ASA and available from shops like Sporty's. It's also available on line at FAA.gov. Go to Advisory Circulars (AC's). Cable strengths are deceiving, the numbers sound high but don't take into account dynamic loads. In the early days of hang gliding at least one manufacturer used 1/8" 7 X 7 with swaged on terminals as a hang strap for the pilot. They looked at the stregth of the cable and thought 9G load, perfect. What they didn't count on was the dynamic loads produced, in this case, when the aircraft was transitioning the shear at the boundary of a thermal. The pilot would go weightless and put slack in the cable, when he fell back the cable snapped. Those who had backup hang straps of tubular nylon strap lived to tell the tale, others didn't. My point here is don't look at breaking strength, look at safe working load and use that number instead. Rick -- Rick Girard "Ya'll drop on in" takes on a whole new meaning when you live at the airport. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Control Cable
From: "Thom Riddle" <jtriddle(at)adelphia.net>
Date: Dec 01, 2006
For those of you who do not have your very own AC 43.13, here is a link to the section about aircraft cables. Very informative. http://www2.tech.purdue.edu/at/courses/at308/Technical_Links/Ac43-13-1B/CH7_8.pdf Here it is in as a Tiny URL, in case the previous one line wraps. http://tinyurl.com/ymlu68 -------- Thom in Buffalo Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=78391#78391 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Used 582 engine for sale
Date: Dec 01, 2006
Thanks Dave, On Dec 1, 2006, at 8:41 AM, David Lehman wrote: > Eugene... > > This link will work better... > > http://tinyurl.com/tx27z > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Dual Elevator Cables
Date: Dec 01, 2006
because amateur-built aircraft are not built to a "standard" like "store bought" aircraft, >> Hi David, does that mean that anyone can build a plane (within the ultralight limits) and just fly it? No one checks the validity of the design or the workmanship? Here the CAA has devolved inspection/certification etc to the Popular Flying Assoc. Roughly like the EAA. You can certainly build your own design if you wish but the plans will have to be passed by the PFA and the building will be checked at intervals by an PFA Inspector. In the case of ulralights by the British Microlight Assoc. No one can just build and fly what they like if it has an engine. If you want to build a glider and have a large farm then you can get away with it. Cheers Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Pike" <richard(at)bcchapel.org>
Subject: Re: Dual Elevator Cables
Date: Dec 01, 2006
That is correct. We can build and attempt to fly anything we like, as long as it meets the specs of FAR 103. Our government still allows us the freedom to do what we want (even be stupid) as long as we don't hurt someone else in the process. And I guess it is working - How many innocent bystanders/uninvolved third parties have been taken out by a legal ultralight? Some? A few? None? Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) ----- Original Message ----- From: pat ladd To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 11:10 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dual Elevator Cables because amateur-built aircraft are not built to a "standard" like "store bought" aircraft, >> Hi David, does that mean that anyone can build a plane (within the ultralight limits) and just fly it? No one checks the validity of the design or the workmanship? Cheers Pat DNA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: FS2Kolb(at)aol.com
Date: Dec 01, 2006
Subject: Re: Dual Elevator Cables
In a message dated 12/1/2006 9:14:42 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com writes: does that mean that anyone can build a plane (within the ultralight limits) and just fly it? No one checks the validity of the design or the workmanship? That's right.. God Bless American, land of the free. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Dec 01, 2006
From: Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Ultrastar
Hi all, I'm new to this list. I have an opportunity to buy an Ultrastar locally. As far as I know it's in very good condition, always hangared, Cuyuna engine, $3000 with an enclosed trailer which I gather is a pretty good price (might be even less). The impression I get from the archives is that everybody seems to love these birds. Anyway, a few questions: Will it be a "true legal" 103 machine (<254#)? Would it still make weight if the engine was replaced, say, with a 447?


November 13, 2006 - December 01, 2006

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