Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-ih
June 08, 2009 - June 25, 2009
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "b young" <by0ung(at)brigham.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aluminum Fuel Tank for MIII |
I am wanting to build a larger gas tank also but one thing I haven't seen or
addressed is W&B with more weight being shifted to the rear. I have a Mark
IIIC with a 912 UL and the factory two 5 gal tanks and had to install the
adjustable forward horz stablizer brkts for duel flight. I am installing an
electric horz stablizer trim system now so as not to have to change the pin
locations for solo and duel operations. That have you had to do to address
this problem with the larger gas tanks?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I bought the 16 gal alum fuel tank that was a factory option in 1998. when
doing W&B on my mkIIIC I determined the cg of the fuel tank is verrrrry
close to the rear cg limit. When flying solo I am near the rear cg,
from full to empty fuel, the cg does not move more than a quarter inch.
When I am flying with a passenger, my cg is closer to the center of the
range, and as I burn off fuel the cg will creep forward. Even at empty
tanks I am well within the limits, so to answer your question "That have
you had to do to address this problem with the larger gas tanks? " there is
no problem with my set up. Now if your fuel tank installs further aft
than mine does. You will have to do the math.
Boyd young
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beauford T" <beauford173(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: mildew on fabric |
Miss Cristal:
Before you go spraying calcium chloride (damp-rid) on yer machine, you
might want to take a look at
the MSDS sheet for that particular solution... para 10 of the MSDS is
shown below...I invite your attention to the
last two sentences in the "Incompatibilities" portion.
I have had pretty fair luck using a half and half solution of
isopropyl alcohol and water on stits mildew... as near
as I can determine, it isn't corrosive to the airframe metals and does
not attack the polyfiber products.
Worth what ye paid fer it...
beauford
FF-076
Brandon, FL
-------------MSDS excerpt; Calcium chloride---------------------
10. Stability and Reactivity
Stability:
Stable under ordinary conditions of use and storage. Substance will
pick up moisture from the air and go into solution if exposed in open
containers.
Hazardous Decomposition Products:
Emits toxic chlorine fumes when heated to decomposition. May form
hydrogen chloride in presence of sulfuric or phosphoric acids or with
water at elevated temperatures.
Hazardous Polymerization:
Will not occur.
Incompatibilities:
Methyl vinyl ether, water, zinc, bromine trifluoride, mixtures of
lime and boric acid, barium chloride, and 2-furan percarboxylic acid.
Metals will slowly corrode in aqueous calcium chloride solutions.
Aluminum (and alloys) and yellow brass will be attacked by calcium
chloride.
Conditions to Avoid:
Incompatibles.
--------------------unquote ------------------------------
WhiskeyVictor36(at)aol.co wrote:
>
> DampRid. Available in a spray bottle (like a kitchen cleaner)
> in the paint department at Lowes and Home Depot.
>
Thanks Bill. I'll have to see if I can find some here.
--------
Cristal Waters
Kolb Mark II Twinstar
Rotax 503 DCSI
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=247274#247274
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: mildew on fabric |
| From: | Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com> |
>From the Poly Fiber manual Appendix H: Dealing with stains: To remove
stains. First try good old Clorox laundry bleach. Work it in with a sponge
the flush with lots of water.While the PF manual is dealing with fuel and
bird stains, I've used dilute Clorox (or any generic bleach) to take black
mold off wall board, stone, and dacron sail cloth. Chlorine kills
everything, even housewives who mix it with ammonia to clean the toilet, so
use it in a well ventilated area or have an air supply.
Rick
On Mon, Jun 8, 2009 at 9:38 AM, Beauford T wrote:
>
> Miss Cristal:
> Before you go spraying calcium chloride (damp-rid) on yer machine, you
> might want to take a look at
> the MSDS sheet for that particular solution... para 10 of the MSDS is
> shown below...I invite your attention to the
> last two sentences in the "Incompatibilities" portion.
>
> I have had pretty fair luck using a half and half solution of
> isopropyl alcohol and water on stits mildew... as near
> as I can determine, it isn't corrosive to the airframe metals and does
> not attack the polyfiber products.
>
> Worth what ye paid fer it...
> beauford
> FF-076
> Brandon, FL
>
> -------------MSDS excerpt; Calcium chloride---------------------
> 10. Stability and Reactivity
> Stability:
> Stable under ordinary conditions of use and storage. Substance will
> pick up moisture from the air and go into solution if exposed in open
> containers.
> Hazardous Decomposition Products:
> Emits toxic chlorine fumes when heated to decomposition. May form
> hydrogen chloride in presence of sulfuric or phosphoric acids or with
> water at elevated temperatures.
> Hazardous Polymerization:
> Will not occur.
> Incompatibilities:
> Methyl vinyl ether, water, zinc, bromine trifluoride, mixtures of
> lime and boric acid, barium chloride, and 2-furan percarboxylic acid.
> Metals will slowly corrode in aqueous calcium chloride solutions.
> Aluminum (and alloys) and yellow brass will be attacked by calcium
> chloride.
> Conditions to Avoid:
> Incompatibles.
> --------------------unquote ------------------------------
>
>
>
>
> WhiskeyVictor36(at)aol.co wrote:
> >
> > DampRid. Available in a spray bottle (like a kitchen cleaner)
> > in the paint department at Lowes and Home Depot.
> >
>
>
> Thanks Bill. I'll have to see if I can find some here.
>
> --------
> Cristal Waters
> Kolb Mark II Twinstar
> Rotax 503 DCSI
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=247274#247274
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Back in the air! |
| From: | "grantr" <grant_richardson25(at)yahoo.com> |
March 22nd was the last time I flew my Kolb until yesterday afternoon. WOW nearly
3 months. I was getting a tad worried that I might be rusty and not do too
good. Well to my surprise I did even better than I did on March 22nd. No rust
to report! I have a detailed flight report I am working on to post later. I
took my camera but forgot the mount plate so I couldn't shoot any video :( It
would have been nice to because I did some low level flying over some corn,
peanut, cotton and wheat fields. And even landed on a private grass strip.
I will be listing my kolb for sale soon. I have moved over to gyroplanes. I am
currently training and hope to get my SP add on soon. I already have a gyroplane
so I really don't need 2 aircraft.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=247337#247337
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | russ kinne <russ(at)rkiphoto.com> |
FWIW I used to completely fill a Lycoming 0-360 (on the aircraft)
with regular Aeroshell (mineral) oil, while rotating prop several
times, slowly, for winter 'storage'.
I assume it helped avoid corrosion; made me feel better anyway.
But as Lucien says -- Cleanup took a little while tho.......
Russ K
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Denny Rowe" <rowedenny(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aluminum Fuel Tank for MIII |
Boyd,
Does your tank install from behind the seats like the new xtra tank?
I saw Kolbs online video of installing a big tank in the Xtra and was
wondering if the regular Mk-3 had the same option.
Denny Rowe
I bought the 16 gal alum fuel tank that was a factory option in 1998.
when doing W&B on my mkIIIC I determined the cg of the fuel tank is
verrrrry close to the rear cg limit. When flying solo I am near the
rear cg, from full to empty fuel, the cg does not move more than a
quarter inch. When I am flying with a passenger, my cg is closer to
the center of the range, and as I burn off fuel the cg will creep
forward. Even at empty tanks I am well within the limits, so to
answer your question "That have you had to do to address this problem
with the larger gas tanks? " there is no problem with my set up.
Now if your fuel tank installs further aft than mine does. You will
have to do the math.
Boyd young
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax Operating Parameters |
At 09:20 PM 6/4/2009, John Hauck wrote:
>Had a Cuyuna ULIIO2 on my Ultrastar. It had 385.0 hours on it...
>Had two Rotax 447 single carb engines. Kept one built on the bench so I
>would not miss air shows. Flew these engines 1135 hours...
Hey John,
What's your take on the relative reliability of the Cuyuna vs. the Rotax
when both are properly maintained? The Cuyunas are notorious, of course,
but I wonder how much of that is due to the aviation world's unfamiliarity
with 2-strokes when the Cuyunas were being produced?
With only about 30 trouble free hours (I don't blame the engine for a
carburetor failure) so far on my UltraStar I can't say myself, but he
Continental in my T-Craft got quiet a couple of times too...
-Dana
--
"640K of computer memory ought to be enough for anybody." - Bill Gates, 1981
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "grantr" <grant_richardson25(at)yahoo.com> |
I had a great flight Sunday afternoon! This was my 1st flight since March 22nd
in my Kolb. Yikes its been a while! The air was a little choppy but not too
bad. I flew mostly around 400 to 800 feet over some corn, wheat, cotton and peanut
fields. The temp was 85 degrees and it felt much hotter! My clothes were
drenched in sweat a few times setting up and tearing down my plane and taxiing.
Humidity was 59% 68 degrees dew point.
I arrived at the airport at bit after 2pm and the wind was picking up. During this
time I set up my plane which takes about 45 minutes to do. 30 to fold and
15 to fuel up and preflight. After I set it up the wind was still bad, so I fueled
it up and waited to preflight. It would be calm then it would blow full
force. The flags on the FBO would be straight out at times. Also the buzzards
and a hawk were being bounced around side to side in an abrupt manner as they
gained altitude in the thermals. These were good indicators to wait unless I wanted
to get hammered around. So I waited. Around 4 the wind started to calm down.
It would blow slightly then the flags would be dead still. By 4:30, I had
completed my preflight strapped in and taxied to runway 5.
Once I taxied to the hold line I did my final checks on my checklist then made
my call departing runway 5 and then 400 feet later I was in the air climbing out.
I climbed up to 800 feet and flew straight out over a big irrigation field
and flew around it and entered a left down wind for runway 5 at 1000 feet I continued
on the downwind and the turn base and continued to fly over the airport
at 1000 feet and headed for the hobby shop.
I continued on at 1000 feet over a patch of wood toward the hobby shop. Once I
passed the woods, I descended down to 700 to get a closer look at the fields I
was flying over. I gradually descended to 400 as I flew over the private strip.
I continued to head out over a big corn field and made a climbing 180 climbing
from 400 to 700 feet and followed a wood line along a few fields. At this
point I decided I wanted to land at the private strip. This would be my 1st landing
on another airstrip other than my 6000 foot home runway since I finished
training in September 08. Since it had been a while since I flew my plane, nearly
3 months, I decided to head back to my airport and do one landing to make
sure I was not too rusty. The landing was great!
I taxied back to runway 5 made my radio call and broke ground in 400 feet and climbed
to 800 feet. I made my way to the private strip at 800 feet and lined up
with the grass strip. As I approached I backed off the throttle and slowed my
airspeed and started descending. Once I had the field made I pulled back to
idle. As I passed the trees on the end I hit a pretty good bump. This did not
affect my approach to much so I didnt have to add power. I maintained idle all
the way in and made another soft landing. The grass field is a bit easier than
the pavement. The owner was out there mowing the grass. The field was like
a golf course. It was very smooth and the grass was just freshly cut with a reel
(spelling?) mower. I talked to the owner a bit and he checked out my plane.
He liked it and told me to come back when there were more people out there.
After talking with him it was time to head back to the home field. I climbed in
and taxied to the end of his grass strip and proceeded to take off. 400 feet
later I was airborne and climbing. As I passed the shed around 200 feet where
the owner was I gave him a big wave good bye as I ascended. I continued climbing
and began making a 180 turn and flew back over his airstrip on my way back
to my airport. I had reached 1000 feet in a short time and maintained it as
I approached the airport and entered left downwind for runway 5. Then I turned
base and final resulting in another great soft landing to end the days flying.
After taxing back to my trailer, I started to fold my airplane and put it
away in the trailer. 30 minutes later the airplane is secured in its enclosed
trailer safely tucked away from the elements. I am drenched in sweat feeling
like I am going to have a heat stroke.
All in all the waiting, sweating and hard work to get the plane ready was well
worth the exhilarating feeling of leaving the earth and soaring over it at 60
mph!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=247369#247369
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | =?ISO-8859-1?Q?No=EBl_Bouchard?= <noelbou(at)vif.com> |
| Subject: | Kolb Twinstar MK II for sale ... |
Hello all.
I have decided to sell my Twinstar MK II
For quick sale:
Kolb Twinstar MK II / Rotax 503
Built in 1990. Tot5al time about 650 Hrs.
Both Wings rebuilt in 2004.
Engine has 125 Hrs since complete overhaul.
Some minor repairs to be done. (Lexan winshield, cockpit fabric, seat and
a couple of patches on small holes on wings).
The first who offers $6000 gets it.
Located near Montreal, QC, Canada.
Some pictures available...
You can reach me, Noel, at 514 723 6663
or preferably at: n o e l @ t e l e d a t a . q c . c a
Noel Bouchard
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax Operating Parameters |
> What's your take on the relative reliability of the Cuyuna vs. the Rotax
> when both are properly maintained? The Cuyunas are notorious, of course,
> but I wonder how much of that is due to the aviation world's unfamiliarity
> with 2-strokes when the Cuyunas were being produced?
>
> -Dana
Was as good as a Rotax 377.
ULII02 had CDI ignition. Rotax had points (during my day).
ULII02 used Mikuni Carb. Rotax used Bing. I liked the Mikuni better, but
they stopped furnishing carbs for aviation applications.
ULII02 had a base cylinder gasket problem due to milling away too much
material from the cases to lighten the engine. Required frequent base
cylinder gasket replacement which required pulling the engine from the
airframe, pulling heads and cylinders.
Had a PTO end crank bearing seize on a 10 hour ULII02. Cheap Chinese
bearing with nylon cage. Ruined crank when it welded race to crank end.
We were also having piston pin bearing failures on the Rotax's, because of
caged wrist pin bearings.
The ULII02 was a strong running 35 hp. Did a great job on the Ultrastar
with a 50X30 Jim Culver prop.
I was a self taught fixed wing pilot in my Ultrastar. It was a fine
airplane to learn in and enjoy flying. It had some weak points, but overall
was a good little airplane.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | electric horz stablizer trim |
| From: | elleryweld(at)aol.com |
electric horz stablizer trim
I need to see your electric stabilizer trim controll system can you post
pics and info on this=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
Ellery in=C2- Maine working on Mk3 3 Xtra
-----Original Message-----
From: b young <by0ung(at)brigham.net>
Sent: Mon, 8 Jun 2009 10:53 am
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Aluminum Fuel Tank for MIII
I am wanting to build a larger gas tank also but one thing I haven't seen
=C2-or addressed is W&B with more weight being shifted to the rear. I ha
ve=C2-a Mark IIIC with a =C2-912 UL=C2-and the factory=C2-two 5 ga
l tanks and had to install the adjustable forward horz stablizer brkts for
duel=C2-flight. I am installing an electric horz stablizer trim system
=C2-now=C2-so as not to have to change the pin locations for solo and
duel=C2-operations. That have you had to do to address this problem wit
h the larger gas tanks?=C2-=C2-=C2-
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>=C2-
=C2-
I bought the 16 gal alum fuel tank that was a factory option in 1998.=C2
-=C2- when doing W&B=C2- on my mkIIIC=C2- I determined=C2- the
cg of t
he fuel tank is verrrrry close to the rear cg limit.=C2- =C2-When flyi
ng solo I am near the rear cg,=C2-=C2-=C2- from full to empty fuel,
=C2-=C2- the cg does not move more than a quarter inch.=C2-=C2- Wh
en I am flying with a passenger,=C2- my cg is closer to the center of th
e range,=C2- and as I burn off fuel the cg will creep forward.=C2-=C2
- Even at empty tanks I am well within the limits,=C2- =C2-so to ans
wer your question =9CThat have you had to do to address this problem
with the larger gas tanks? =9C=C2- there is no problem with my se
t up.=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- Now if your fuel tank inst
alls further aft than mine does.=C2- You will have to do the math.=C2-
=C2-
Boyd young
=C2-
=C2-
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aluminum Fuel Tank for MIII |
> This post leads to a question I've been meaning to ask for a while now.
Have you done a weight & balance lately on your plane with it loaded up and
ready for a trip? I'm hoping to get an idea of acceptable CG range so i have
some idea of where to start during flight testing. Thank you,
>
> Scott
I haven't done a weight and balance in a some time.
I am sure the results would be very interesting.
However, there has been extensive flight testing which indicates forward and
aft cg are in an acceptable range.
I'd be glad to let you do a weight and balance on my mkIII. I don't have
scales or a good place to do one now.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "b young" <by0ung(at)brigham.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aluminum Fuel Tank for MIII |
Denny
As I remember there are 3 tubes behind the seats that have to come out to
install the tank. When I ordered the cage they made provisions for the
tubes to be removed. There are tubes that come from either side of the
boom tube that join at the center of a cross over tube at the center behind
the two seats, and one tube from the boom tube area to the left corner
behind the seats. The first two they welded at the factory a small tab on
the tubes so we could drill a hole and install a bolt to get them in and
out. the third has a small sleeve that goes over where the tube was cut at
top and bottom and the sleeve is riveted to the stubs at both ends and also
the tube. The tank slides back into the area just behind the seats and
sits on the same diagonal tubes that support the plastic tank tray. On
the sides of the diagonal tubes there are some tabs welded down, and there
is some aluminum angle welded to the bottom of the tank that bolts to the
tabs. I drilled the holes in the alum angles a bit over sized and inserted
a rubber bushing in the hole and also have a rubber washer on both sides of
the angle, this gives the tank a rubber mount to help eliminate vibrations
from cracking things. The tank has a curve cut into the bottom to go
around and over the aileron torque tube. So there are 2 outlets on the
bottom that have to be connected together to get all the fuel out of the
tank. John h tank fits in the area behind his head where mine is behind
the seats. He has the area behind the seats for storage,, I use the area
above the tank for storage. And he carries 9 more gallons than I do.
If you have any other questions I can try and explain or send photos.
Boyd
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>..
Boyd,
Does your tank install from behind the seats like the new xtra tank?
I saw Kolbs online video of installing a big tank in the Xtra and was
wondering if the regular Mk-3 had the same option.
Denny Rowe
I bought the 16 gal alum fuel tank that was a factory option in 1998. when
doing W&B on my mkIIIC I determined the cg of the fuel tank is verrrrry
close to the rear cg limit. When flying solo I am near the rear cg,
from full to empty fuel, the cg does not move more than a quarter inch.
When I am flying with a passenger, my cg is closer to the center of the
range, and as I burn off fuel the cg will creep forward. Even at empty
tanks I am well within the limits, so to answer your question "That have
you had to do to address this problem with the larger gas tanks? " there is
no problem with my set up. Now if your fuel tank installs further aft
than mine does. You will have to do the math.
Boyd young
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Camp With Your Airplane |
It took 25 or more years, but this year EAA says I can camp with my airplane
near the Red Barn in the UL area.
Not sure I understand exactly what they are authorizing, but maybe some of
you can decipher their message:
http://www.airventure.org/news/2009/090608_ultralights.html
For years they stuck those that flew into the UL area at OSH over on the
other side of the airstrip so that spectators could not easily look at their
airplanes.
Wonder if they will let us taxi our aircraft to tie down, or make us push
them half way across Whitman Field?
Don't know whether I will make the flight to OSH this year or not. Will
have to wait and see when the time comes.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Camp With Your Airplane |
| From: | "Kirkds" <kirkds(at)dishmail.net> |
I ain't gotta worry bout camping at Oshcash can't afford that place. But if anybody
is headed there , coming through my neck of the woods , and need a place
to RON , your welcome to camp here.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=247764#247764
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Camp With Your Airplane |
John
At this point I'm planning to fly to Oshkosh for the week of AirVenture. I'm
not sure what all that means but I'm not camping by the red barn. No way am
I pushing my plane that far through all those people. I sent a E-Mail to
Tommy thanking him for the Port O Let in our regular camping area and
indicated that your friend Karla was going to make sure that the Port O Let
would not be there this year. I hope it is there.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 11, 2009 8:01 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Camp With Your Airplane
>
> It took 25 or more years, but this year EAA says I can camp with my
> airplane near the Red Barn in the UL area.
>
> Not sure I understand exactly what they are authorizing, but maybe some of
> you can decipher their message:
>
> http://www.airventure.org/news/2009/090608_ultralights.html
>
> For years they stuck those that flew into the UL area at OSH over on the
> other side of the airstrip so that spectators could not easily look at
> their airplanes.
>
> Wonder if they will let us taxi our aircraft to tie down, or make us push
> them half way across Whitman Field?
>
> Don't know whether I will make the flight to OSH this year or not. Will
> have to wait and see when the time comes.
>
> john h
> mkIII
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Camp With Your Airplane |
| From: | "ces308" <ces308(at)ldaco.com> |
I won't be flying over there either....however same deal...If you find yourself
in the Houghton Lake area and need a place ,I'm in the Mi airport book...just
call me.
chris ambrose
M3X/Jab
N327CS 22.0hrs
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=247777#247777
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "frank.goodnight" <frank.goodnight(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Flat tire {none event?} |
A couple of weeks ago I was chugging along about an hour from the
airport and about 500 ft.
feeling really pleased with myself , thinking - what a great day. then
I happened to look at
my left tire. It looked strange, in the firestar I can touch the tires
if I relax the sholder straps a
little.when i felt of it -PANIC- low time pilot, andnot much of it in
a kolb. WHATS GOING TO HAPPEN? An hour and a half latter when I HAD to
land , I did the very best full stall , tail wheel
first landing that I was capable of, there was NO difference from a
normal landing untill I
slowed to just above walking speed. Then the A/C just stopped moveing
no matter how
much power. I had to get out and pull it off the runway by hand. Can
some of you older pilots
tell me if this is normal , or was I just lucky? What is the best way
to land a kolb with a flat?
Frank Goodnight
firestar 2
75 hrs
Brownsville TX.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flat tire {none event?} |
Can
> some of you older pilots
> tell me if this is normal , or was I just lucky? What is the best way to
> land a kolb with a flat?
>
> Frank Goodnight
Jim Swann is a lot older than me, and a FS pilot. ;-)
Never tried to land with a flat tire.
I think you did it one satisfactory way. You made it down and did not bend
the airplane.
I have landed my Ultrastar with one main gear involuntarily retracted. Got
a wing tip, but that is the nature of the US. Landed my buddy's US after a
3/16 bolt sheared on one end of the main gear braces. Got his wing tip too.
;-(
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flat tire {none event?} |
At 09:01 AM 6/12/2009, frank.goodnight wrote:
>...the A/C just stopped moveing
>no matter how
>much power. I had to get out and pull it off the runway by hand. Can
>some of you older pilots
>tell me if this is normal , or was I just lucky? What is the best way
>to land a kolb with a flat?
I don't know if my tire was flat the other day when I landed; I realized it
was flat when it took a LOT of power to taxi after landing!
That was the call to put a tube in the tire; I had been procrastinating.
-Dana
--
The most useful tool for dealing with management types is, of course, an
automatic weapon.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "barry youngblood" <barry50(at)wk.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Kolb-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 06/11/09 |
Dear Connie,
This was TOO CUTE! I too would like to find that quiet house for a nap!
Thanks for sending me these good emails. I also enjoyed the tampon story.
Brenda
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kolb-List Digest Server" <kolb-list(at)matronics.com>
Sent: Friday, June 12, 2009 1:57 AM
Subject: Kolb-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 06/11/09
> *
>
> =================================================
> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> =================================================
>
> Today's complete Kolb-List Digest can also be found in either of the
> two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
> in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
> and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
> of the Kolb-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
> such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>
> HTML Version:
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 09-06-11&Archive=Kolb
>
> Text Version:
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 09-06-11&Archive=Kolb
>
>
> ===============================================
> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> ===============================================
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Kolb-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Thu 06/11/09: 4
> ----------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 05:08 PM - Camp With Your Airplane (John Hauck)
> 2. 07:02 PM - Re: Camp With Your Airplane (Kirkds)
> 3. 07:51 PM - Re: Camp With Your Airplane (Richard & Martha Neilsen)
> 4. 11:13 PM - Re: Camp With Your Airplane (ces308)
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 1
> _____________________________________
>
>
> From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
> Subject: Kolb-List: Camp With Your Airplane
>
>
> It took 25 or more years, but this year EAA says I can camp with my
> airplane
> near the Red Barn in the UL area.
>
> Not sure I understand exactly what they are authorizing, but maybe some of
> you can decipher their message:
>
> http://www.airventure.org/news/2009/090608_ultralights.html
>
> For years they stuck those that flew into the UL area at OSH over on the
> other side of the airstrip so that spectators could not easily look at
> their
> airplanes.
>
> Wonder if they will let us taxi our aircraft to tie down, or make us push
> them half way across Whitman Field?
>
> Don't know whether I will make the flight to OSH this year or not. Will
> have to wait and see when the time comes.
>
> john h
> mkIII
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 2
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Camp With Your Airplane
> From: "Kirkds" <kirkds(at)dishmail.net>
>
>
> I ain't gotta worry bout camping at Oshcash can't afford that place. But
> if anybody
> is headed there , coming through my neck of the woods , and need a place
> to RON , your welcome to camp here.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=247764#247764
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 3
> _____________________________________
>
>
> From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM(at)comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Camp With Your Airplane
>
>
> John
>
> At this point I'm planning to fly to Oshkosh for the week of AirVenture.
> I'm
> not sure what all that means but I'm not camping by the red barn. No way
> am
> I pushing my plane that far through all those people. I sent a E-Mail to
> Tommy thanking him for the Port O Let in our regular camping area and
> indicated that your friend Karla was going to make sure that the Port O
> Let
> would not be there this year. I hope it is there.
>
> Rick Neilsen
> Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
> Sent: Thursday, June 11, 2009 8:01 PM
> Subject: Kolb-List: Camp With Your Airplane
>
>
>>
>> It took 25 or more years, but this year EAA says I can camp with my
>> airplane near the Red Barn in the UL area.
>>
>> Not sure I understand exactly what they are authorizing, but maybe some
>> of
>> you can decipher their message:
>>
>> http://www.airventure.org/news/2009/090608_ultralights.html
>>
>> For years they stuck those that flew into the UL area at OSH over on the
>> other side of the airstrip so that spectators could not easily look at
>> their airplanes.
>>
>> Wonder if they will let us taxi our aircraft to tie down, or make us push
>> them half way across Whitman Field?
>>
>> Don't know whether I will make the flight to OSH this year or not. Will
>> have to wait and see when the time comes.
>>
>> john h
>> mkIII
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 4
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Camp With Your Airplane
> From: "ces308" <ces308(at)ldaco.com>
>
>
> I won't be flying over there either....however same deal...If you find
> yourself
> in the Houghton Lake area and need a place ,I'm in the Mi airport
> book...just
> call me.
>
> chris ambrose
> M3X/Jab
> N327CS 22.0hrs
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=247777#247777
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flat tire {none event?} |
At 09:01 AM 6/12/2009, you wrote:
>slowed to just above walking speed. Then the A/C just stopped moveing
>no matter how
>much power. I had to get out and pull it off the runway by hand. Can
>some of you older pilots
>tell me if this is normal , or was I just lucky? What is the best way
>to land a kolb with a flat?
>
>Frank Goodnight
I've landed with flats before. Not nearly as bad as you might think,
like having the brakes
on is all.
Taking off with a flat is a lot harder to do, but you can do it if
you have to, at least in a Firestar. If you've got nothing else, try
stuffing your shirt or
something in the flat tire to get off the ground. Of course if you
have a choice,
don't do it.
Landing without a tail wheel spring is not something you want to do.
It gets real
squirrely as soon as the tail wheel touches down.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Oil Injection... OK to change type??? |
| From: | "albertakolbmk3" <cheriebraun(at)xplornet.com> |
Hi,
First off I would like to say hi to everyone on the board. I purchased a kolb MK3
2 months ago. Just finishing my hours toward my ultralight permit. I have a
582 with oil injection and am wondering if it's ok to go from a synthetic to
a mineral oil even after the engine has run exclusively on synthetic. It was run
using Bombardier XP-S full synthetic 2 cycle oil. Is it better to stay with
what the previous owner has been running. I'm not trying to be cheap but the
local dealer wants $70 CAN for a gallon. I've had dirtbikes all my life and have
never run synthetic in any thing I own and have never had any issues. I change
my oil religiously.
Thanks,
Tony
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=247979#247979
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | daniel myers <h20maule(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Oil Injection... OK to change type??? |
how do i send a message to everyone like you just did? I have a firestar am
phib that I am trying to sell and I need to get the word out
daniel
> Subject: Kolb-List: Oil Injection... OK to change type???
> From: cheriebraun(at)xplornet.com
> Date: Sat=2C 13 Jun 2009 14:24:57 -0700
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>
om>
>
> Hi=2C
>
> First off I would like to say hi to everyone on the board. I purchased a
kolb MK3 2 months ago. Just finishing my hours toward my ultralight permit.
I have a 582 with oil injection and am wondering if it's ok to go from a s
ynthetic to a mineral oil even after the engine has run exclusively on synt
hetic. It was run using Bombardier XP-S full synthetic 2 cycle oil. Is it b
etter to stay with what the previous owner has been running. I'm not trying
to be cheap but the local dealer wants $70 CAN for a gallon. I've had dirt
bikes all my life and have never run synthetic in any thing I own and have
never had any issues. I change my oil religiously.
>
> Thanks=2C
>
> Tony
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=247979#247979
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that=92s right for you.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oil Injection... OK to change type??? |
| From: | Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com> |
Tony, I'd check with Lockwood Aviation about oil compatability. Certain
types, most notably Pennzoil Air Cooled and Pennzoil Marine will congeal
when combined.
Rick
On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 4:24 PM, albertakolbmk3 wrote:
> cheriebraun(at)xplornet.com>
>
> Hi,
>
> First off I would like to say hi to everyone on the board. I purchased a
> kolb MK3 2 months ago. Just finishing my hours toward my ultralight permit.
> I have a 582 with oil injection and am wondering if it's ok to go from a
> synthetic to a mineral oil even after the engine has run exclusively on
> synthetic. It was run using Bombardier XP-S full synthetic 2 cycle oil. Is
> it better to stay with what the previous owner has been running. I'm not
> trying to be cheap but the local dealer wants $70 CAN for a gallon. I've had
> dirtbikes all my life and have never run synthetic in any thing I own and
> have never had any issues. I change my oil religiously.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tony
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=247979#247979
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | daniel myers <h20maule(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Oil Injection... OK to change type??? |
Yes=2C make sure its not marine
daniel
Date: Sat=2C 13 Jun 2009 18:16:02 -0500
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Oil Injection... OK to change type???
From: aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com
Tony=2C I'd check with Lockwood Aviation about oil compatability. Certain t
ypes=2C most notably Pennzoil Air Cooled and Pennzoil Marine will congeal w
hen combined.
Rick
On Sat=2C Jun 13=2C 2009 at 4:24 PM=2C albertakolbmk3 wrote:
>
Hi=2C
First off I would like to say hi to everyone on the board. I purchased a ko
lb MK3 2 months ago. Just finishing my hours toward my ultralight permit. I
have a 582 with oil injection and am wondering if it's ok to go from a syn
thetic to a mineral oil even after the engine has run exclusively on synthe
tic. It was run using Bombardier XP-S full synthetic 2 cycle oil. Is it bet
ter to stay with what the previous owner has been running. I'm not trying t
o be cheap but the local dealer wants $70 CAN for a gallon. I've had dirtbi
kes all my life and have never run synthetic in any thing I own and have ne
ver had any issues. I change my oil religiously.
Thanks=2C
Tony
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=247979#247979
arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
http://forums.matronics.com
le=2C List Admin.
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live=99 SkyDrive=99: Get 25 GB of free online storage.
http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oil Injection... OK to change type??? |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
albertakolbmk3 wrote:
> Hi,
>
> First off I would like to say hi to everyone on the board. I purchased a kolb
MK3 2 months ago. Just finishing my hours toward my ultralight permit. I have
a 582 with oil injection and am wondering if it's ok to go from a synthetic to
a mineral oil even after the engine has run exclusively on synthetic. It was
run using Bombardier XP-S full synthetic 2 cycle oil. Is it better to stay with
what the previous owner has been running. I'm not trying to be cheap but the
local dealer wants $70 CAN for a gallon. I've had dirtbikes all my life and
have never run synthetic in any thing I own and have never had any issues. I change
my oil religiously.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tony
You'll be fine changing oils, the engine won't notice the switch. A dino oil will
be a little better in terms of corrosion protection anyway as it sticks to
surfaces better than synthetic. I always used the pennzoil air cooled which I
think has recently been rebranded to something else.
Make sure the new grade you switch to meets the API TC specification (tho a TCW-III
oil will work acceptably in the 582 also if that's the only grade available).
As for the oil injection I suppose you should drain it out before changing the
oils (I always ran premix so never did maintenance on the oil injection).
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248000#248000
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: Flat tire (non event) |
well i am for sure a old pilot....but have not landed with a flat
tire....what you did worked so it was ok .....but did you check the tires prior
to
take-off? if not you should....On my firestar the tires were sort of old
when I purchased it and I noticed a slow leak in one....I replaced both
tires with new tires and tubes...I think it pays to keep good tires on a
plane...I check tires on pre flight by stepping on them....glad things worked
ok
for you...
JIM SWAN
firestar ll, 503, N663S
Eaton Rapids, Mi. 48827
PH 517-663-8488 runway 2300' E & W (42-28.58N 084-44.69 W )
**************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy
steps!
JunestepsfooterNO62)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Injection... OK to change type??? |
I change my oil religiously.>>
You get the local local Reverend to do it? What a good idea, I must try
that. Perhaps just saying a prayer over it would work.
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | daniel myers <h20maule(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Injection... OK to change type??? |
For sale is a Kolb Firestar seaplane amphibian (single seat)...Comes with s
pare Full Lotus monofloat! The plane has just been refurbished and has new
paint=2C cables=2C fuel lines=2C WarpDrive prop=2C Full Lotus monofloat=2C
wheels/tires=2C brakes=2C nose cone and much more. 40 hrs total time on air
frame (since restoration) and engine (overhauled Rotax 582). Airplane was b
uilt in 1993 but sat most of its life indoors. The airframe probably has ab
out 200 hrs on it total. The plane has electric start=2C electric flaperons
=2C and electric landing gear. The landing gear runs off a jack screw and r
etracts into the plane behind the pilot seat. The plane cruises at 85 MPH a
nd gets about 4gph. I am selling the plane because I need a bigger plane wi
th more than one seat. Avionics include EIS (engine information system) Alt
imeter and Airspeed indicator. This plane will go anywhere and is flown 4-5
times a week. This plane is perfect for anyone seeking a good time flying.
Flight demonstration is available upon request. h20maule(at)hotmail.com is my
email address. Buy this plane now for $14=2C000!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUh7Wei9trk&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5-JDJxJluo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G34CQViHgqM&feature=related
> From: pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Oil Injection... OK to change type???
> Date: Sun=2C 14 Jun 2009 12:24:00 +0100
>
>
> I change my oil religiously.>>
>
> You get the local local Reverend to do it? What a good idea=2C I must try
> that. Perhaps just saying a prayer over it would work.
>
> Cheers
>
> Pat
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live=99 SkyDrive=99: Get 25 GB of free online storage.
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Warlick" <timwarlick(at)mchsi.com> |
I am 2.5 hours short of FINALLY reaching 40 hours on my BMW R100 powered
Kolb Mark 3 Classic. Although my initial flight was December 2004; work
(Teledyne Continental Motors), family (last of 7 kids is finally heading
off to college this fall), other hobby (am building a BMW K1200 powered
3 wheeled on-highway vehicle), and weather (always seems to be a 15 kts
crosswind at airport) have limited my flight time each year.
Since April, the engine has been working perfect and I have obtained 7
hours of flight time 1 hour at a time. The last problem early this year
was the Bing carburetor needle clip breaking during flight. I now have
new needles with the o-ring back-up. For those who don't want to check
my lD posts, I have a 93 BMW R100 motorcycle engine mated to a Rotax
gear drive assembly with a 3 blade, 68 inch Power Fin prop. Apparently,
everyone on the ground can hear that prop several miles away. I have
struggled with engine performance being less than desired so two years
ago, added the BMW sport camshaft and milled the heads to increase the
compression ratio to 9.5:1. The engine should have around 68 BHP at
6800 RPM. Aircraft performance is still marginal.
The airplane takes off immediately but climbs slow (500 ft/min) at 6500
RPM with fuel system set-up to best power (1350 to 1425 deg F EGT).
Cruise speed is 55 to 60 MPH. The BMW loves to run at 6000 RPM with
EGT's at 1370 and 1380 deg F, 345 deg F CHT, and 190 to 200 deg F oil
temp. I have an external oil cooler and run Mobile 1 synthetic oil. I
have completed filling out all my basic aircraft performance data (stall
speeds, best angle of climb, etc). Fuel consumption is around 3.3 GPH. I
take a 5 gallon gas can with me each time I head for the airport. I fly
out of Fairhope, AL airport which has a paved runway long enough for
some big jets. Last week I landed at my first grass strip and have
started practice landing in the grass next to the main runway at
Fairhope.
Flew today for 1.3 hours along the Mobile Bay. It always amazes me how
smooth it is along the edge of the water but when I go inland, the
thermals from the various fields and buildings can make for a bumpy
ride. I will most likely be at Oshkosh again this year but without my
Kolb. I normally have to work at the Teledyne tent some and this year we
will be promoting the 94UL unleaded Avgas that I have been developing
(visit our new web site www.genuinecontinental.aero/ and go the Advanced
technologies area). Those that attend Oshkosh, feel free to ask for me.
Tim Warlick
Mobile, Al
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: BMW Kolb update |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
timwarlick(at)mchsi.com wrote:
> For those who don't want to check my lD posts, I have a 93 BMW R100 motorcycle
engine mated to a Rotax gear drive assembly with a 3 blade, 68 inch Power
Fin prop. Apparently, everyone on the ground can hear that prop several miles
away.
Yeah the powerfin is pretty loud, I figure it's because of the squared off tips.
Every one I've had (I'm on my 3rd one now) has been deafening.
No better pusher on the market tho. I love mine....
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248128#248128
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Video of flight to Alvord Desert |
| From: | "John Bickham" <gearbender(at)bellsouth.net> |
I think it was Bill S and JP making request for some new videos the other day.
I spliced together a few pics and videos of our trip from the Rock House to the
Alvord Desert. It ain't much but something. It will only give you a small tease
of how much fun we had.
Sorry for those out of frame shots. It was bright and hard to to see the viewfinder.
I do that a lot. I just rough aim it most of the time.
John H provides a few key narratives along the way!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubxCX9EB3lY
Hope you enjoy!
--------
Thanks too much,
John Bickham
Mark III-C w/ 912UL
St. Francisville, LA
I know many pilots and a few true aviators. There is a distinct difference that
I have the greatest respect for.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248137#248137
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
Having wiped off the pitot tube twice from my Xtra by getting into long
grass etc I replaced it on top of the nose cone. Just far enough back so
that it wouldn`t get wiped off by someone walking by.
Flew last night and found the ASI reading about 10/15mph slow. 2800 rpm
produced only about 50 mph instead of around 65. Did a couple of stalls
at 2000ft to get some sort of idea and landed OK by guess and by God
with the ASI hovering just below 30mph.
Anyone put their pitots in a different position who can guide me to a
good spot for refitting?
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vince Hallam" <vince(at)devonwindmills.co.uk> |
Try halfway along the wing strut, sticking forward as much as you dar
Vince Hallam
Devon Windmill Holidays
Woodlands, Walls Hill Road
Torquay, Devon, TQ1 3LZ
Tel: 01803 316191 Mob: 07941 313141
www.devonwindmills.co.uk
----- Original Message -----
From: pj.ladd
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 9:48 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: ASI
Having wiped off the pitot tube twice from my Xtra by getting into
long grass etc I replaced it on top of the nose cone. Just far enough
back so that it wouldn`t get wiped off by someone walking by.
Flew last night and found the ASI reading about 10/15mph slow. 2800
rpm produced only about 50 mph instead of around 65. Did a couple of
stalls at 2000ft to get some sort of idea and landed OK by guess and by
God with the ASI hovering just below 30mph.
Anyone put their pitots in a different position who can guide me to a
good spot for refitting?
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
Try halfway along the wing strut>>
Thanks Vince. A quick reply like that had to be aBrit. There is no one
else about at this time in the morning.
Is that just a suggestion or have you tried it? Strikes me as a bit
vulnerable unless you get close to the wing and then there is the
disturbed air. Also the derigging problem, not that I derig mine but
someone will, one day
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vince Hallam" <vince(at)devonwindmills.co.uk> |
PJ,
Give me a ring , I`ll discuss. Im home now
Vince Hallam
Devon Windmill Holidays
Woodlands, Walls Hill Road
Torquay, Devon, TQ1 3LZ
Tel: 01803 316191 Mob: 07941 313141
www.devonwindmills.co.uk
----- Original Message -----
From: pj.ladd
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 10:24 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: ASI
Try halfway along the wing strut>>
Thanks Vince. A quick reply like that had to be aBrit. There is no
one else about at this time in the morning.
Is that just a suggestion or have you tried it? Strikes me as a bit
vulnerable unless you get close to the wing and then there is the
disturbed air. Also the derigging problem, not that I derig mine but
someone will, one day
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net> |
Pat,
Here is my solution.
http://www.jackbhart.com/firefly/firefly36.html
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, In
----------------------------
From: "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Anyone put their pitots in a different position who can guide me to a good
spot for refitting?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Denny Rowe" <rowedenny(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Spare Prop blade? |
Kolbers,
Last night while backing the Mk-3 into the hanger with my tractor, I
forgot to rotate the prop so that one blade was pointed down, was so
occupied watching the wing tips clearing the doors that the sound of the
straight up prop blade breaking on the door frame caught me completely
by surprise. :-( A John Deere 950 in low range does not give you any
feedback that you are hung up on something.
Anyway, I'll be ordering a new prop blade from Powerfin later today
along with a trailer dolly from harber freight to use to pull the bird
and TEE trailer in and out of the hanger by hand. Funny how the $20
trailer dolly seemed expensive until the $200 prop blade was sacrificed.
Dang
Dennis Rowe
Mk-3, 690L-70, Powerfin F
PS: If anyone has a spare blade from a Powerfin F model pusher 2 stroke
set up, call me quick to make a deal.
724 882 6788
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Spare Prop blade? |
Sorry to hear of your prop problem.
I've been running prop blades into the edge of the sheet metal roof on
my hangers since I first pushed the Firestar in its new home. However,
never broke one, probably because I push mine in by hand.
Would it be possible to see a photo of the damaged prop blade?
john h
mkIII
Last night while backing the Mk-3 into the hanger with my tractor, I
forgot to rotate the prop so that one blade was pointed down, was so
occupied watching the wing tips clearing the doors that the sound of the
straight up prop blade breaking on the door frame caught me completely
by surprise. :-(
Dennis Rowe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
My pitot/static system works great mounted to the bottom of the right
lift strut approximately 6 to 12 inches from the outboard end.
john h
mkIII
Is that just a suggestion or have you tried it? Strikes me as a bit
vulnerable unless you get close to the wing and then there is the
disturbed air. Also the derigging problem, not that I derig mine but
someone will, one day
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vince Hallam" <vince(at)devonwindmills.co.uk> |
Hey PJ,
I lost your phone no,Call again when you`re free.
Vince Hallam
Devon Windmill Holidays
Woodlands, Walls Hill Road
Torquay, Devon, TQ1 3LZ
Tel: 01803 316191 Mob: 07941 313141
www.devonwindmills.co.uk
----- Original Message -----
From: pj.ladd
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 10:24 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: ASI
Try halfway along the wing strut>>
Thanks Vince. A quick reply like that had to be aBrit. There is no
one else about at this time in the morning.
Is that just a suggestion or have you tried it? Strikes me as a bit
vulnerable unless you get close to the wing and then there is the
disturbed air. Also the derigging problem, not that I derig mine but
someone will, one day
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Video of fun at Owyhee State Reservoir |
| From: | "John Bickham" <gearbender(at)bellsouth.net> |
One more if your interested.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJek-uGXWDg&feature=channel
Hope you enjoy!
--------
Thanks too much,
John Bickham
Mark III-C w/ 912UL
St. Francisville, LA
I know many pilots and a few true aviators. There is a distinct difference that
I have the greatest respect for.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248216#248216
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | daniel myers <h20maule(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Spare Prop blade? |
I have a richter prop that may work for you...if interested=2C ill send pic
s and info
Daniel 321 356 9544
From: rowedenny(at)windstream.net
Subject: Kolb-List: Spare Prop blade?
Date: Mon=2C 15 Jun 2009 07:25:00 -0400
Kolbers=2C
Last night while backing the Mk-3 into the hanger with my tractor=2C I forg
ot to rotate the prop so that one blade was pointed down=2C was so occupied
watching the wing tips clearing the doors that the sound of the straight u
p prop blade breaking on the door frame caught me completely by surprise. :
-( A John Deere 950 in low range does not give you any feedback that you
are hung up on something.
Anyway=2C I'll be ordering a new prop blade from Powerfin later today along
with a trailer dolly from harber freight to use to pull the bird and TEE t
railer in and out of the hanger by hand. Funny how the $20 trailer dolly s
eemed expensive until the $200 prop blade was sacrificed.
Dang
Dennis Rowe
Mk-3=2C 690L-70=2C Powerfin F
PS: If anyone has a spare blade from a Powerfin F model pusher 2 stroke set
up=2C call me quick to make a deal.
724 882 6788
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live=99 SkyDrive=99: Get 25 GB of free online storage.
http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Video of flight to Alvord Desert |
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
Thats a great video John. It was so good I decided to see what other videos you
have posted and found this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJek-uGXWDg&feature=channel_page
Every bit as good as the first video !
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248224#248224
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "robcannon" <leecannon(at)telus.net> |
I have my pitot on top of the nose and it is accurate (gps checked). If I was doing
it again I would try it an inch or so further back as it sometimes gets bent
when it's in my crowded hanger.
cheers, Rob Cannon
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248230#248230
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/new_018_242.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "robcannon" <leecannon(at)telus.net> |
Can anyone tell me how to shrink photos when I attach them to emails. I use a canon
powershot A75.
Rob Cannon
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248231#248231
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Spare Prop blade? |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
[quote="rowedenny"]Kolbers,
Last night while backing the Mk-3 into the hanger with my tractor, I forgot to
rotate the prop so that one blade was pointed down, was so occupied watching
the wing tips clearing the doors that the sound of the straight up prop blade
breaking on the door frame caught me completely by surprise. :-( A John
Deere 950 in low range does not give you any feedback that you are hung up on
something.
Anyway, I'll be ordering a new prop blade from Powerfin later today along with
a trailer dolly from harber freight to use to pull the bird and TEE trailer
in and out of the hanger by hand. Funny how the $20 trailer dolly seemed expensive
until the $200 prop blade was sacrificed.
Dang
Dennis Rowe
Mk-3, 690L-70, Powerfin F
PS: If anyone has a spare blade from a Powerfin F model pusher 2 stroke set up,
call me quick to make a deal.
724 882 6788
> [b]
I might be stating the obvious but be sure you do a runout check on your prop flange
and inspect your motor mounts for tweaking, etc. while you have the prop
off.
Contrary to popular folklore, the F model blades are NOT weak, especially in terms
of bending-to-failure and you can definitely do damage in such a case.....
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248262#248262
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Denny Rowe" <rowedenny(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Spare Prop blade? |
Its a 68 inch diameter, forgot that tidbit
----- Original Message -----
From: Denny Rowe
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 7:25 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Spare Prop blade?
Kolbers,
Last night while backing the Mk-3 into the hanger with my tractor, I
forgot to rotate the prop so that one blade was pointed down, was so
occupied watching the wing tips clearing the doors that the sound of the
straight up prop blade breaking on the door frame caught me completely
by surprise. :-( A John Deere 950 in low range does not give you any
feedback that you are hung up on something.
Anyway, I'll be ordering a new prop blade from Powerfin later today
along with a trailer dolly from harber freight to use to pull the bird
and TEE trailer in and out of the hanger by hand. Funny how the $20
trailer dolly seemed expensive until the $200 prop blade was sacrificed.
Dang
Dennis Rowe
Mk-3, 690L-70, Powerfin F
PS: If anyone has a spare blade from a Powerfin F model pusher 2
stroke set up, call me quick to make a deal.
724 882 6788
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
06/15/09 05:54:00
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Spare Prop blade? |
Powerfin props have a weight mark on the root end of each blade. When you
order a new blade they will balance to that weight. If you purchase a spare
blade from someone else you aren't likely to get a blade that will balance
which is a bad thing.
Also there was a recent comment about them being noisy. The are quiet till
the tip speeds get to high subsonic. When a prop tip nears supersonic speeds
it will turn a bunch of horse power in to noise. Tapered tips can get closer
to supersonic speeds and still remain fairly quiet. If the prop is noisy it
is turning too high a RPM. Change to a higher reduction ratio or reduce the
length of the prop. Generally speaking a Kolb airplanes like longer props
and slower prop RPMs for best performance.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
----- Original Message -----
From: "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 12:53 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Spare Prop blade?
>
> [quote="rowedenny"]Kolbers,
> Last night while backing the Mk-3 into the hanger with my tractor, I
> forgot to rotate the prop so that one blade was pointed down, was so
> occupied watching the wing tips clearing the doors that the sound of the
> straight up prop blade breaking on the door frame caught me completely by
> surprise. :-( A John Deere 950 in low range does not give you any
> feedback that you are hung up on something.
> Anyway, I'll be ordering a new prop blade from Powerfin later today along
> with a trailer dolly from harber freight to use to pull the bird and TEE
> trailer in and out of the hanger by hand. Funny how the $20 trailer
> dolly seemed expensive until the $200 prop blade was sacrificed.
>
> Dang
>
> Dennis Rowe
> Mk-3, 690L-70, Powerfin F
> PS: If anyone has a spare blade from a Powerfin F model pusher 2 stroke
> set up, call me quick to make a deal.
> 724 882 6788
>
>
>> [b]
>
>
> I might be stating the obvious but be sure you do a runout check on your
> prop flange and inspect your motor mounts for tweaking, etc. while you
> have the prop off.
>
> Contrary to popular folklore, the F model blades are NOT weak, especially
> in terms of bending-to-failure and you can definitely do damage in such a
> case.....
>
> LS
>
> --------
> LS
> Titan II SS
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248262#248262
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Welch <mdnanwelch7(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Spare Prop blade? |
Denny=2C
Your tractor/prop mishap reminds me of mine. While trying to load my Kol
b MkIII onto a flatbed trailer (in preparation to move out of state)=2C I l
ifted the entire plane up in the air with my Kubota backhoe and set it on t
he trailer. The loaded plane was just too top heavy on the trailer=2C so I
lifted it back off. After untying the plane from my backhoe bucket=2C I t
hought I'd move the tractor out of the way......and then I drove the raised
bucket into the prop blade.
You are right. I can't recall the tractor showing any signs of "give" wh
en it came into contact with the blade. Can't recall any damage to the bac
khoe bucket. Evidently=2C tractors win every battle with airplanes.
I had a mishap once with my Cessna 172 and my 300ZX. I was parked under
the wing=2C with the rear decklid up. I need to move the plane back a few
feet and forget to lower the decklid. Sometimes=2C the airplane wins!!
I ended up mailing my entire prop back to Ivo Prop. They matched me a ne
w blade to my existing two good blades=2C did a thorough balance check on a
ll three=2C and replaced the stainless steel edges on all three. $200 tota
l. Now=2C my prop's good as new. Tractor not allowed within 25'.
Best regards getting it fixed=2C
Mike Welch
MkIII GEO 1.0L Turbo Ivoprop
A John Deere 950 in low range does not give you any feedback that you ar
e hung up on something.
Anyway=2C I'll be ordering a new prop blade from Powerfin later today along
with a trailer dolly from harber freight to use to pull the bird and TEE t
railer in and out of the hanger by hand. Funny how the $20 trailer dolly s
eemed expensive until the $200 prop blade was sacrificed.
Dang
Dennis Rowe
Mk-3=2C 690L-70=2C Powerfin F
PS: If anyone has a spare blade from a Powerfin F model pusher 2 stroke set
up=2C call me quick to make a deal.
724 882 6788
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live=99 SkyDrive=99: Get 25 GB of free online storage.
http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | daniel myers <h20maule(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Spare Prop blade? |
Dennis=2C the Richter prop actually belongs to my father. I just spoke to h
im and he wants $200 but I told him I told you $75. I asked my dad if I cou
ld sell it for $150 and he said yes...sorry about that. Would that be a fai
r price? Sorry that i got your hopes up.Daniel
From: rowedenny(at)windstream.net
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Spare Prop blade?
Date: Mon=2C 15 Jun 2009 12:55:31 -0400
Its a 68 inch diameter=2C forgot that
tidbit
----- Original Message -----
From:
Denny
Rowe
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday=2C June 15=2C 2009 7:25 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Spare Prop
blade?
Kolbers=2C
Last night while backing the Mk-3 into the hanger
with my tractor=2C I forgot to rotate the prop so that one blade was poin
ted
down=2C was so occupied watching the wing tips clearing the doors that th
e sound
of the straight up prop blade breaking on the door frame caught me comple
tely
by surprise. :-( A John Deere 950 in low range does not give
you any feedback that you are hung up on something.
Anyway=2C I'll be ordering a new prop blade from
Powerfin later today along with a trailer dolly from harber freight to
use to pull the bird and TEE trailer in and out of the hanger by
hand. Funny how the $20 trailer dolly seemed expensive until the $200
prop blade was sacrificed.
Dang
Dennis Rowe
Mk-3=2C 690L-70=2C Powerfin F
PS: If anyone has a spare blade from a Powerfin F
model pusher 2 stroke set up=2C call me quick to make a deal.
724 882 6788
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.
com/Navigator?Kolb-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
-
Release
Date: 06/15/09 05:54:00
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live=99 SkyDrive=99: Get 25 GB of free online storage.
http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Flying the Owyhee Part I and Part II |
A couple video clips I shot after departure from Owyhee Reservoir State
Airport, Oregon, flying south, up the canyon, 21 May 2009:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pxM4zXd-iw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCEac5NPAS4&feature=channel_page
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Kmet" <jlsk1(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Prop Extension & 582 stator |
Hi all.
I`ve got a 2.5 inch Ivo Brand prop extension that was used on a 582 &
Warp Drive prop that will go on E-bay soon unless someone wants it & the
bolts for $60. shipped.
I also have a good used stator for a Rotax 582, the only thing is that
the Tach coil doesn`t work, but the rest of it is fine. Contact me
offlist if interested.
Jim Kmet
Cookeville, TN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Simmons" <stevesimmons(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | I have a Verner 1400 engine in a Mark III I purchased |
Has anyone had a real engine failure that was caused by the design of the
engine, or is the problem like a Chevy vs Ford. (eg Verner vs rotax?)
My engine has 129 hours on it and there is no entry in the logs as having
any problems. I am taking the engine back to the Verner dealer in Florida
and we are going over the engine completely. Any thoughts?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Oil Injection... OK to change type??? |
At 06:27 PM 6/13/2009, daniel myers wrote:
>how do i send a message to everyone like you just did?
You just did...
-Dana
--
If vegetarians eat vegetables,..beware of humanitarians!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
I would like to thank the members that contribute to this list. About a year ago
I decided to learn to fly. I took lessons and bought a Firestar II that was
1500 miles from my home. I took my flying lessons serious because I was planning
to fly the plane home from Missouri to Arizona in July. After I got home I
was looking for a club that could help me to become a better pilot. I found a
local EAA ultralight chapter but they don't fly. I found this board and read the
thoughts and suggestions of the contributors. Almost every time I fly I am
practicing some kind of drill, I think I should, I only have 100 hours in my Firestar.
Last week I saw a post of a guy taxiing on on wheel. I thought I should
be able to control my plane this well. Next time at the airfield I was doing
this in a gusty crosswind. Yesterday I was practicing emergency proceedures.
I was low, slow, banked, power off, with lots of thermal activity. I impacted
the ground at about 50 indicated and full power. The plane left gouges in the
dirt runway. As I got back in the air my passenger (got knows why she wants to
be there when I practice this shit) pointed out that which I already knew, My
left main was severely bent. Climb performance was also a bit low, the motor
would not pull full revs. I said I was not sure how I was going to land this
thing, she replied on one wheel. Well I knew that, I just was not sure if I would
come in as slow as possible or as controlled as possible. I had enough fuel
t fly about 2 more hours until the thermals died down but decided the 10 mph
headwind was a good friend. I buzzed the field to get my friend Greg's attention
as the people at Turf had shut down operations and turned off the radio. Greg
asked how he could help, I said sweep up the pieces. I told Rebeka how I was
going to land. The impact had ripped the brake line from the right main as
well. I said I woould come in a little fast, land on one wheel with the plane
Cross controlled. As I slowed I would further cross control it and fly it on the
ground !
sideways
. As the right main touched I would have to give more left rudder and be ready
for left brake. I came in and the thermals blew me around slightly. After I touched
down I was yawed a little by a thermal. Seconds later all was calm, I lifted
the right wing higher and got more crossed up. I slowed and added more left
aileron and right rudder. At what seemed like 20-25 MPH the right wing fell
and I applied more left rudder. The plane came to rest with the right wingtip
about 1 foot off the ground, no contact. My Ivo prop was all but destroyed from
the gravel the tire kicked up and the left wing looks like it was hit with
a shot gun. My bad choices resulted in a near disaster, my practice resulted in
good landing. I forgot who posted the one wheel taxi video but thank you very
much for doing so. Rebeka has some photos I will post later, by the way, she
was hanging out the left side as much as she could to help, do you now understand
why I call her Ballast?
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248339#248339
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com> |
I don't know Dale, maybe you should change her name from Ballast to Guardian
Angel. Good on ya for pulling off a difficult landing.
Rick
On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 6:21 PM, dalewhelan wrote:
>
> I would like to thank the members that contribute to this list. About a
> year ago I decided to learn to fly. I took lessons and bought a Firestar II
> that was 1500 miles from my home. I took my flying lessons serious because I
> was planning to fly the plane home from Missouri to Arizona in July. After I
> got home I was looking for a club that could help me to become a better
> pilot. I found a local EAA ultralight chapter but they don't fly. I found
> this board and read the thoughts and suggestions of the contributors. Almost
> every time I fly I am practicing some kind of drill, I think I should, I
> only have 100 hours in my Firestar. Last week I saw a post of a guy taxiing
> on on wheel. I thought I should be able to control my plane this well. Next
> time at the airfield I was doing this in a gusty crosswind. Yesterday I was
> practicing emergency proceedures. I was low, slow, banked, power off, with
> lots of thermal activity. I impacted the ground at about 50 indicated and
> full power. Th!
> e plane left gouges in the dirt runway. As I got back in the air my
> passenger (got knows why she wants to be there when I practice this shit)
> pointed out that which I already knew, My left main was severely bent. Climb
> performance was also a bit low, the motor would not pull full revs. I said I
> was not sure how I was going to land this thing, she replied on one wheel.
> Well I knew that, I just was not sure if I would come in as slow as possible
> or as controlled as possible. I had enough fuel t fly about 2 more hours
> until the thermals died down but decided the 10 mph headwind was a good
> friend. I buzzed the field to get my friend Greg's attention as the people
> at Turf had shut down operations and turned off the radio. Greg asked how he
> could help, I said sweep up the pieces. I told Rebeka how I was going to
> land. The impact had ripped the brake line from the right main as well. I
> said I woould come in a little fast, land on one wheel with the plane Cross
> controlled. As I slo!
> wed I would further cross control it and fly it on the ground !
> sideways
>
> . As the right main touched I would have to give more left rudder and be
> ready for left brake. I came in and the thermals blew me around slightly.
> After I touched down I was yawed a little by a thermal. Seconds later all
> was calm, I lifted the right wing higher and got more crossed up. I slowed
> and added more left aileron and right rudder. At what seemed like 20-25 MPH
> the right wing fell and I applied more left rudder. The plane came to rest
> with the right wingtip about 1 foot off the ground, no contact. My Ivo prop
> was all but destroyed from the gravel the tire kicked up and the left wing
> looks like it was hit with a shot gun. My bad choices resulted in a near
> disaster, my practice resulted in good landing. I forgot who posted the one
> wheel taxi video but thank you very much for doing so. Rebeka has some
> photos I will post later, by the way, she was hanging out the left side as
> much as she could to help, do you now understand why I call her Ballast?
>
> --------
> Dale Whelan
> 503 powered Firestar II
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248339#248339
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
Sorry to hear about your mishap, glad you're OK, but:
At 07:21 PM 6/15/2009, dalewhelan wrote:
>
>....I found a local EAA ultralight chapter but they don't fly....
?????
-Dana
--
Computers run on smoke. If it leaks out, they don't work.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | russ kinne <russ(at)rkiphoto.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Injection... OK to change type??? |
Pat
I think swearing while you do it qualifies --
Russ
On Jun 14, 2009, at 7:24 AM, pj.ladd wrote:
>
> I change my oil religiously.>>
>
> You get the local local Reverend to do it? What a good idea, I
> must try that. Perhaps just saying a prayer over it would work.
>
> Cheers
>
> Pat
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
every time I fly I am practicing some kind of drill,>>
As should we all. But we don`t. Congrats on a good job
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Injection... OK to change type??? |
I think swearing while you do it qualifies --( no one else seems to have
picked it up)
Hi Russ
My oil change doesn`t make me swear. I have a sort of vacuum pump gismo that
drags the oil out of the filler tube. Slowish but clean. Beats fiddling
around between the engine and the top of the cabin cage where there is no
room..
Good story sent to me this morning.
There has been a very pleasant parking warden who has worked outside Bristol
Zoo for the last 25 years. 1 for cars. 5 for coaches. Rrecently he did not
turn up and eventually the Zoo authorities rang the Bristol Council for a
replacement. "Not our responsibility` said the Council "We dont pay him`.
"Not ours" said the Zoo "We don`t pay him"
Seems that noone paid him. He just turned up and pocketed the parking money,
estimated at 400 per day, for 25 years and is now living in Spain..
Heh! heh! heh!
Cheers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
John,
thanks for the gen.
I assume that you just have a couple of straight tubes projecting from
the front of the strut.
Questions. How long have you made them.?
Have you run the plastic tube internally or just run
it up the strut?
How have you fixed the assembly to the strut?
My thought is to bend the metal tubes through 90 degrees with the leg
attached to the plastic tube bound to the strut with a couple of cable
ties.
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
Dana,
The local EAA chapter I found has meetings, not during the summer. They have a
website that you need to be a member of to see. They have drive in breakfast once
in a while at an airport. They have planes in various states of disrepair.
I asked at a meeting how many had flyable planes, only the guy that taught me
to fly could say yes. They have many reasons why they can't fly, funny, the reasons
they give for not flying are the same reasons I have for flying.
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248407#248407
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com> |
Pat, There's another option you might wish to try that I use on my Mk III
and my trike. Both a short section of stiff vinyl tube to connect the short
pitot sticking out of the fuselage to an extension that gets it out about 8"
into the airstream. If I or someone else hits it it just bends out of the
way and then comes back into line when the offending party, usually some cow
at a Fly In, removes her haunch. Cheap to try and probably saves you from
having to call out the engineering battalion.
Rick
On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 4:54 AM, pj.ladd wrote:
> John,
> thanks for the gen.
>
> I assume that you just have a couple of straight tubes projecting from the
> front of the strut.
>
> Questions. How long have you made them.?
> Have you run the plastic tube internally or just run it
> up the strut?
> How have you fixed the assembly to the strut?
>
> My thought is to bend the metal tubes through 90 degrees with the leg
> attached to the plastic tube bound to the strut with a couple of cable ties.
>
> Pat
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Denny Rowe" <rowedenny(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Spare Prop blade? |
I'll see if I can figure out how to do that later today.
Denny
-----
Would it be possible to see a photo of the damaged prop blade?
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: I have a Verner 1400 engine in a Mark III I purchased |
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
Rotax is far superior to Verner engines, there is a really good reason why Rotax
is outselling Verner by about 1000 to 1... You can ignore that fact at your
own risk. Just because you don't have a list of differences or know why the
Verner is a substandard engine does not change the fact that it is.
My thoughts are, its too bad you got stuck with a Verner engine... Would I fly
with it ? That would depend on my financial situation. If I could possibly
afford a Rotax, I would change the engine. If I could not afford anything else,
I might risk flying with the substandard Verner, but I would never forget
that fact either, and I would be very careful.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248419#248419
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: I have a Verner 1400 engine in a Mark III I purchased |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
stevesimmons(at)charter.n wrote:
> Has anyone had a real engine failure that was caused by the design of the engine,
or is the problem like a Chevy vs Ford. (eg Verner vs rotax?)
>
> My engine has 129 hours on it and there is no entry in the logs as having any
problems. I am taking the engine back to the Verner dealer in Florida and we
are going over the engine completely. Any thoughts?
>
Back in my r/c days, when I'd ask the question about what radio/engine/heli etc.
to get, the guys would usually say well go out to your local flying field and
see what they're flying. Then go and get that.
That's actually pretty good advice for our big engines and planes as well.
Go out to your local airports and find the stuff that's actually flying through
the air. Then, take a look at what's sitting on the ramp or in hangars with a
bunch of dust and corrosion on it, flat tires etc.
This will give you a pretty good idea of where to start if you want to fly through
the air too.
When it came to engines, what I found flying all or most of the time was, for 2-strokes,
the Rotaxen - 447, 503 and 582 basically all over the place. Most of
the rotting stuff had Hirths and various other things that you frequently can't
identify. Usually when a Rotax was rotting away it was because of the plane
or the owner-op making some kind of mistake on the installation. I.e. I know
of one plane (a starlite) that's virtually completely grounded because the owner-op
refuses to use a short enough pulse line on its 447, resulting a fuel starvation
events every time the plane is flown when it is flown. It sits and rots
in a garage now.
Another had a 582 equipped plane, but the builder used a muffler mount where the
can was supported by a bracket hanging off the starter motor on the mag-end
starter. Every 30 or 40 hours or so, the starter housing cracks, grounding the
airplane for months until enough money is saved up to repair it. The owner-op
has consistently refused to change the mount even after repeated attempts to
tell him the design was moronic and the cause of the cracking housing. The plane
sits in a hangar now.
For 4-strokes on light a/c, I almost universally observe the 912 series on the
planes that actually fly. The close 2nd is the jabiru. The VW conversions are
a distant third and a few auto conversions here and there.
But the ones that crank and crank and crank out the hours year after year are the
912's ahead of all the others.
I've never personally seen a Verner equipped plane actually fly through the air,
tho I've heard of it happening.
But far, far and away, the Rotaxen dominate on light a/c. They have a stranglehold
on the market because they actually fly. The parts prices are ridiculously
high generally because they don't sell too many of em (except the consumables).
Even a set of 503 innards will last for years and years if the engine is setup
and run properly. 912's I don't think you can actually wear out.....
Just my experience and why I tend to stick with the Rotax. I'd rather let the other
guys test fly the other stuff ;).
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248425#248425
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
Actually, I found a PT-17 pitot/static system when I was building my
mkIII, and installed it to the strut using 4 pop rivets.
Ran the tubing through the lift strut.
It is a single tube aproximately 5" long that incorporates both pitot
and static pressure systems.
john h
mkIII
I assume that you just have a couple of straight tubes projecting
from the front of the strut.
My thought is to bend the metal tubes through 90 degrees with the leg
attached to the plastic tube bound to the strut with a couple of cable
ties.
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: I have a Verner 1400 engine in a Mark III I purchased |
Steve
The Verner engine has the potential of being a good engine. I only know
of one other on a Kolb and it had a initial problem. Any new engine can
have problems even the hallowed Rotax 912 had issues when it was new. I
do tend to be a anything but Rotax guy because the company is ripping
people off with high prices because they can get away with it.
With 129 hours on the engine you are likely to have a good engine.
Maintain the engine check or have the oil filer checked for metal from
time to time. Keep us informed about your engine.
There are a lot of other engine options GEO, VW, BMW, Verner, and maybe
even a diesel some day. When you have a over priced product you open the
door for others to build a better product and take the market away from
them. The door is open hears hopping. GM are you listening.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC - More that $10,000 less than a 912
----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Simmons
To: Kolb-List(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, June 15, 2009 6:15 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: I have a Verner 1400 engine in a Mark III I
purchased
Has anyone had a real engine failure that was caused by the design of
the engine, or is the problem like a Chevy vs Ford. (eg Verner vs
rotax?)
My engine has 129 hours on it and there is no entry in the logs as
having any problems. I am taking the engine back to the Verner dealer in
Florida and we are going over the engine completely. Any thoughts?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
dalewhelan wrote:
> Dana,
> The local EAA chapter I found has meetings, not during the summer. They have
a website that you need to be a member of to see. They have drive in breakfast
once in a while at an airport. They have planes in various states of disrepair.
I asked at a meeting how many had flyable planes, only the guy that taught
me to fly could say yes. They have many reasons why they can't fly, funny, the
reasons they give for not flying are the same reasons I have for flying.
I see this a lot too and a lot of them have had some kind of nasty experience that
keeps them out of the plane. Something broke or they doinked the plane or
something along these lines.
A lot of guys don't recognize that flying isn't (or shouldn't be) a survival exercise.
They think they just absolutely have to go up and fly around in those
15G25+ conditions where the stick and rudder pedals are constantly bumping up
against their stops just to maintain straight and level or get the airplane down
without bending something.
This is one of the hardest disciplines to have in aviation I think. The training
and peer pressure in this regard is the very worst and you really have to stay
on top of it to keep your plane out of the dirt and you in the cockpit only
in appropriate conditions.
I'm one of these wierdos that doesn't like to fly that close to the edge of control.
Im grounded (and sometimes criticized) for that reason a bit more than I
probably otherwise would be. I just don't get a charge out pushing it to the
limit anymore. Maybe if I were paid more at my job or didn't mind having to call
FSDO to get investigated for incidents.... dunno.
OTOH, I'm not buying a bunch of parts and doing a bunch of repairs when the weather
_is_ nice for an enjoyable flight. The plane amazingly stays together as
have all my past planes including my FS II. Nice exchange for little dings in
my ego here and there - I'd say I come out on top. Let the brave guys have the
convective activity and winds, it's more exciting to watch from the ground anyway
;).
Let's be careful out there,
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248442#248442
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
I have been working on a project restoring an Ultrlight that has a Cuyuna 430 motor
on it. It has a micro Tach that is not displaying because one of the leads
a red one is snapped clean off. There is plenty of wire left though. I am loath
to screw around with the wires on that motor as I got it to run and its running
good and strong. All I want to know is where in the maze of wires am I supposed
to hook up the red Micro Tach wire lead to get an RPM reading. I don't
know if I really care all that much about the RPM ( I really couldn't give a
rats ass ) but since I attached it to the post I wouldn't mind getting some display
even if its just a doggie chasing his tail. I may need to go and test fly
that rickety contraption in the next few days, any pictures would be real good.
Thanks
Ron @ KFHU
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
I got Rebeka's photos
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248451#248451
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc02083_113.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | william sullivan <williamtsullivan(at)att.net> |
- Dale- Wow.- I hope you ran out and bought a lottery ticket.- The wi
ng damage didn't show in the photo.- How bad is it?- Looks like it migh
t have nose cone damage.- Why did the engine fail to go to full power?
-
-------------------------
------------------ Bill Sullivan
-------------------------
------------------ Windsor Locks, Ct.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com> |
>From the Tiny tach web site:
he Tiny-Tach=99 meter can be mounted in the desired location using either
sheet metal screws or by using double sided tape. For best results when
using tape, be sure to clean off any dirt, grease and oil from the desired
mounting location using a suitable solvent such as denatured alcohol.
Find a suitable route to run the pick-up wire to the spark plug wire. It is
not critical how the wire is routed. It can be put into existing wire
harnesses or wrapped around and taped to metal supports.* Caution: Keep wir
e
clear of extremely hot engine parts such as the muffler, etc. Wire damage
(cuts or burns) will cause the wire to short and your Tiny-Tach=99 will sto
p
working. Wire damage is not under warranty.*
*The red wire should be wrapped around a section of the spark plug wire
using 3-4 turns.* Please be certain you do not wrap the red wire too close
to the spark plug that engine vibration will allow it to come into direct
contact with the metal portion of the spark plug. Most engines have a spark
plug cap and will prevent this from happening. After the connections are
made, any excess wire can be coiled up and taped to a convenient area.
Rick
On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 10:43 AM, Ron @ KFHU wrote:
>
> I have been working on a project restoring an Ultrlight that has a Cuyuna
> 430 motor on it. It has a micro Tach that is not displaying because one o
f
> the leads a red one is snapped clean off. There is plenty of wire left
> though. I am loath to screw around with the wires on that motor as I got
it
> to run and its running good and strong. All I want to know is where in th
e
> maze of wires am I supposed to hook up the red Micro Tach wire lead to ge
t
> an RPM reading. I don't know if I really care all that much about the RPM
(
> I really couldn't give a rats ass ) but since I attached it to the post I
> wouldn't mind getting some display even if its just a doggie chasing his
> tail. I may need to go and test fly that rickety contraption in the next
few
> days, any pictures would be real good.
> Thanks
> Ron @ KFHU
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
Well as Lucien suggested I was flying at or as evidence suggests, beyond my limits.
I was simulating deadstick landings. I was low, slow, banked, and power off. The
motor response was immediate, Blame it on many years of tuning 2 stroke roadrace
bikes, I was low and slow. I felt no indication of stall and no indication
of climb. It happened pretty quick, I may have hit some sink but it was my fault
for putting myself there.
I avoided wing contact with the ground but gravel went through the left wing via
the propeller.
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248465#248465
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc02086_150.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
Here is the poor little IVO prop
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248470#248470
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc02089_479.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
I was flying at or as evidence suggests, beyond my limits.
> I was simulating deadstick landings. I was low, slow, banked, and power
> off. I was low and slow. I felt no indication of stall
> --------
> Dale Whelan
Best not performed with passenger on board.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
Thank you very much.
I'll coil it tomorrow around the lead, and see if it works.
I'll also Google for the site.
Ron @ KFHU
====================
---- Richard Girard wrote:
============
>From the Tiny tach web site:
he Tiny-Tach meter can be mounted in the desired location using either
sheet metal screws or by using double sided tape. For best results when
using tape, be sure to clean off any dirt, grease and oil from the desired
mounting location using a suitable solvent such as denatured alcohol.
Find a suitable route to run the pick-up wire to the spark plug wire. It is
not critical how the wire is routed. It can be put into existing wire
harnesses or wrapped around and taped to metal supports.* Caution: Keep wire
clear of extremely hot engine parts such as the muffler, etc. Wire damage
(cuts or burns) will cause the wire to short and your Tiny-Tach will stop
working. Wire damage is not under warranty.*
*The red wire should be wrapped around a section of the spark plug wire
using 3-4 turns.* Please be certain you do not wrap the red wire too close
to the spark plug that engine vibration will allow it to come into direct
contact with the metal portion of the spark plug. Most engines have a spark
plug cap and will prevent this from happening. After the connections are
made, any excess wire can be coiled up and taped to a convenient area.
Rick
On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 10:43 AM, Ron @ KFHU wrote:
>
> I have been working on a project restoring an Ultrlight that has a Cuyuna
> 430 motor on it. It has a micro Tach that is not displaying because one of
> the leads a red one is snapped clean off. There is plenty of wire left
> though. I am loath to screw around with the wires on that motor as I got it
> to run and its running good and strong. All I want to know is where in the
> maze of wires am I supposed to hook up the red Micro Tach wire lead to get
> an RPM reading. I don't know if I really care all that much about the RPM (
> I really couldn't give a rats ass ) but since I attached it to the post I
> wouldn't mind getting some display even if its just a doggie chasing his
> tail. I may need to go and test fly that rickety contraption in the next few
> days, any pictures would be real good.
> Thanks
> Ron @ KFHU
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
Best not performed with passenger on board.
I agree, my passenger does not agree.
She too is a motorcycle racing veteran. I am not sure why she wants to be there
when I do these things, but she does.
She is studying for sport pilot written and when money permits, she too want to
get a pilot license.
She asks many questions while we fly.
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248619#248619
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | sweltering summer |
| From: | "cristalclear13" <cristalclearwaters(at)gmail.com> |
I don't understand this crazy weather. We have been having incredible heat and
humidity for two weeks straight now. It usually doesn't start this stuff until
July or August and even then the heat index doesn't usually stay in the hundreds
this long. Ugh!
I couldn't wait any longer to fly though. If the heat isn't going to leave then
I just have to fly in the heat. The good thing about flying is the higher you
go the cooler you get. Even at 1000 feet this evening it was a nice break
from the heat. The air was pretty smooth around 7:30pm. Heat index was over
100 and the density altitude was 2500. It was a nice flight.
I headed southeast from the airport and flew over my house and then over the shooting
range where my husband and son were having fun with their guns (didn't
get too close though) :). There were very few clouds. Then I headed back and
after I landed I looked back toward the southeast and saw the big cloud (in the
attached picture). It wasn't as close as it looks, but funny how those things
can sneak up behind you. The coast was probably getting a big thunderstorm.
I stopped at the store and on the drive home got to see an amazing lightning
show.
I really enjoyed the flight. I love my Kolb!
--------
Cristal Waters
Kolb Mark II Twinstar
Rotax 503 DCSI
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248629#248629
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/evening_storm_june_16th_190.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
I have not yet figured out what is wrong with my friends single carb dual ignition
Rotax 503
It recently developed a problem, I am not sure exactly when it happened so it
is hard for me to say it happened when this happened to the plane or motor.
When he first got it it reved over 7,000 rpm at partial throttle, an immediate
re pitch was in order. I had him add about 3 degrees to the 3 blade prop. On the
ground it was about 6,000.
He flew it and the motor acted up so he landed. I Found it ran on one ignition
and not the other. Fouled plugs were found.
The case was made that it is OK to lean out your 2stroke airplane, even necessary
at times.
Idle was OK but just above idle was pretty rich. I installed a smaller needle jet
in the VM Mikuni carb. Idle improved, (it is the smoothest idlingg Rotax 503
I have heard) cruise sounded better and fuel burn dropped to about 2.5 gallons
per hour.
I dropped the main jet a couple sizes and things got better on top.
In monument Valley I may have dropped the main jet and played with an air screw.
Greg's plane seemed on par with mine.
Well back in Phoenix I heard Greg's plane and it sounded off. He said it would
not rev.
Greg found oil on his prop, it was from a leaking head gasket, which was from
not one but 2 broken cylinder studs. After fixing that the problem remained
Here is what I have found so far.
With a CHT of 200 I apply full throttle and the motor revs to 6000 (static) after
the motor hits about 225 it starts to slow.
By the time I near 300 it won't rev past about 5,200.
If I kill ignition 1 it rev to 4,800.
If I kill only ignition 2, it revs to 4,300.
If I change the main jet either way it losses power.
At idle Ignition 1 killed results in 2,000 rpm while killing only ignition 2 results
in about 2,100 rpm idle.
The plugs look fine, the resistance values of the caps look good.
The motor runs smooth. The full throttle EGT looks low 900 but leaner main jet
reduces rpm and richer makes it run rough.
Main jet changes are seen on the EGT.
Ring end gap looks to be about .015 inch.
Carbon buildup looks to be in remission.
The motor is running 50:1 on the oil, I run 32:1 with the same oil and have about
90 hours on my plugs.
I get the highest EGT when I open the throttle to get about 4,200 rpm and can get
a little over 1,000 EGT with CHT below 300.
There is no evidence of detonation on the piston or the plugs, the burn back is
not real distinct but seems quite safe.
I will test the secondary required voltage and see if I get anywhere with that.
I am not looking for your basic doctorate dissertation assembled by someone that
has never tuned a 2 cycle engine.
prefer to keep it practical and applicable.
No Time Area Per Unit of Displacement, Brake Mean Effective Pressure, or squish
velocity theory needed here.
Mechanically the motor feels normal.
More or less fuel makes things worse.
Makes me lean toward electrical.
Has anyone seen this kind of thing before?
It is not plugs as changing the plug wires around on the plugs made no difference
in how it ran under any condition.
Any ideas would be appreciated.
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248637#248637
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
I was low, slow, banked, and power off.>>
Ugh!. That will do it everytime.
While I was learning to glide exactly that happened to a friend. With an
instructor he took off to practice `cable breaks` The equivalent of `engine
failure on takeoff` in power.
The instructor dropped the cable at around 5/600 ft and there was room on
the runway to land straight ahead. Instead the glider turned back toward the
launch point. Even so a downwind landing could have been pulled off without
too much drama. Unfortunately having reached the launch point, by now very
low, he tried to turn back into wind.
Because of the proximity off the ground the pilot was reluctant to put the
wing down as much as he should have done, he also held the nose up and got
even slower. This produced a flat turn, the inside wing stalled and they
spun in,from less than 100ft. killing instuctor and pupil.
Another time, during the war, I saw an Albemarle ( an unsuccesful twin
engined bomber reduced to glider tugging) with a Waco troop carrying glider
on tow. The Waco got out of position and pulled the Albemarles tail round.
The Albemarles inside wing stalled and she spun in killing everyone on
board.
I obviously subconciously learned the lesson as when I found myself in a
glider in a similar position going downwind very low and nowhere to land, I
dived at the ground, banked hard back into wind (nearly) and made a rough
but reasonable landing. I was torn off a tremendous strip by the airfields
owner, (quite right too I should not have got myself into that position) and
threatened with being banned from the field, but I was alive.
Low and slow is bad. Low, slow and banked is a killer.
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
Frank Goodnight>>
Really off topic but any connection to Goodnight and Loving?
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
It is a single tube aproximately 5" long that incorporates both pitot
and static pressure systems.>.
Thanks John, that sounds pretty neat with only a single tube.I have
never heard of that. Does that mean it measures pitot pressure only and
you use cockpit static?.
Incidentally I saw a couple of PT 17`s at a local airshow recently. Not
many about over here.
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
Cheap to try and probably saves you from having to call out the
engineering battalion.>>
Thanks Rick. A neat solution and may put the end of the pitot into
clear air.
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com> |
Dale,
Easiest advice, no theory involved, borrow a stock jetted Bing carb and air
cleaner off a known to run good single carb 503 and swap it for the Mikuni.
You'll probably have to change out throttle and choke cables, etc, and yes,
this will be a PITA.
Check the exhaust system for
Rick
On Wed, Jun 17, 2009 at 12:37 AM, dalewhelan wrote:
>
> I have not yet figured out what is wrong with my friends single carb dual
> ignition Rotax 503
> It recently developed a problem, I am not sure exactly when it happened so
> it is hard for me to say it happened when this happened to the plane or
> motor.
> When he first got it it reved over 7,000 rpm at partial throttle, an
> immediate re pitch was in order. I had him add about 3 degrees to the 3
> blade prop. On the ground it was about 6,000.
> He flew it and the motor acted up so he landed. I Found it ran on one
> ignition and not the other. Fouled plugs were found.
> The case was made that it is OK to lean out your 2stroke airplane, even
> necessary at times.
> Idle was OK but just above idle was pretty rich. I installed a smaller
> needle jet in the VM Mikuni carb. Idle improved, (it is the smoothest
> idlingg Rotax 503 I have heard) cruise sounded better and fuel burn dropped
> to about 2.5 gallons per hour.
> I dropped the main jet a couple sizes and things got better on top.
> In monument Valley I may have dropped the main jet and played with an air
> screw. Greg's plane seemed on par with mine.
> Well back in Phoenix I heard Greg's plane and it sounded off. He said it
> would not rev.
> Greg found oil on his prop, it was from a leaking head gasket, which was
> from not one but 2 broken cylinder studs. After fixing that the problem
> remained
> Here is what I have found so far.
> With a CHT of 200 I apply full throttle and the motor revs to 6000
> (static) after the motor hits about 225 it starts to slow.
> By the time I near 300 it won't rev past about 5,200.
> If I kill ignition 1 it rev to 4,800.
> If I kill only ignition 2, it revs to 4,300.
> If I change the main jet either way it losses power.
> At idle Ignition 1 killed results in 2,000 rpm while killing only ignition
> 2 results in about 2,100 rpm idle.
> The plugs look fine, the resistance values of the caps look good.
> The motor runs smooth. The full throttle EGT looks low 900 but leaner main
> jet reduces rpm and richer makes it run rough.
> Main jet changes are seen on the EGT.
> Ring end gap looks to be about .015 inch.
> Carbon buildup looks to be in remission.
> The motor is running 50:1 on the oil, I run 32:1 with the same oil and have
> about 90 hours on my plugs.
> I get the highest EGT when I open the throttle to get about 4,200 rpm and
> can get a little over 1,000 EGT with CHT below 300.
> There is no evidence of detonation on the piston or the plugs, the burn
> back is not real distinct but seems quite safe.
> I will test the secondary required voltage and see if I get anywhere with
> that.
> I am not looking for your basic doctorate dissertation assembled by someone
> that has never tuned a 2 cycle engine.
> prefer to keep it practical and applicable.
> No Time Area Per Unit of Displacement, Brake Mean Effective Pressure, or
> squish velocity theory needed here.
> Mechanically the motor feels normal.
> More or less fuel makes things worse.
> Makes me lean toward electrical.
> Has anyone seen this kind of thing before?
> It is not plugs as changing the plug wires around on the plugs made no
> difference in how it ran under any condition.
> Any ideas would be appreciated.
>
> --------
> Dale Whelan
> 503 powered Firestar II
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248637#248637
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com> |
Sorry about that, jumpy touch pad on the laptop. As I started to say, Check
the exhaust for blockages or part failure internally.
Rick
On Wed, Jun 17, 2009 at 7:00 AM, Richard Girard wrote:
> Dale,
> Easiest advice, no theory involved, borrow a stock jetted Bing carb and air
> cleaner off a known to run good single carb 503 and swap it for the Mikuni.
> You'll probably have to change out throttle and choke cables, etc, and yes,
> this will be a PITA.
> Check the exhaust system for
>
> Rick
>
> On Wed, Jun 17, 2009 at 12:37 AM, dalewhelan wrote:
>
>>
>> I have not yet figured out what is wrong with my friends single carb dual
>> ignition Rotax 503
>> It recently developed a problem, I am not sure exactly when it happened
>> so it is hard for me to say it happened when this happened to the plane or
>> motor.
>> When he first got it it reved over 7,000 rpm at partial throttle, an
>> immediate re pitch was in order. I had him add about 3 degrees to the 3
>> blade prop. On the ground it was about 6,000.
>> He flew it and the motor acted up so he landed. I Found it ran on one
>> ignition and not the other. Fouled plugs were found.
>> The case was made that it is OK to lean out your 2stroke airplane, even
>> necessary at times.
>> Idle was OK but just above idle was pretty rich. I installed a smaller
>> needle jet in the VM Mikuni carb. Idle improved, (it is the smoothest
>> idlingg Rotax 503 I have heard) cruise sounded better and fuel burn dropped
>> to about 2.5 gallons per hour.
>> I dropped the main jet a couple sizes and things got better on top.
>> In monument Valley I may have dropped the main jet and played with an air
>> screw. Greg's plane seemed on par with mine.
>> Well back in Phoenix I heard Greg's plane and it sounded off. He said it
>> would not rev.
>> Greg found oil on his prop, it was from a leaking head gasket, which was
>> from not one but 2 broken cylinder studs. After fixing that the problem
>> remained
>> Here is what I have found so far.
>> With a CHT of 200 I apply full throttle and the motor revs to 6000
>> (static) after the motor hits about 225 it starts to slow.
>> By the time I near 300 it won't rev past about 5,200.
>> If I kill ignition 1 it rev to 4,800.
>> If I kill only ignition 2, it revs to 4,300.
>> If I change the main jet either way it losses power.
>> At idle Ignition 1 killed results in 2,000 rpm while killing only ignition
>> 2 results in about 2,100 rpm idle.
>> The plugs look fine, the resistance values of the caps look good.
>> The motor runs smooth. The full throttle EGT looks low 900 but leaner main
>> jet reduces rpm and richer makes it run rough.
>> Main jet changes are seen on the EGT.
>> Ring end gap looks to be about .015 inch.
>> Carbon buildup looks to be in remission.
>> The motor is running 50:1 on the oil, I run 32:1 with the same oil and
>> have about 90 hours on my plugs.
>> I get the highest EGT when I open the throttle to get about 4,200 rpm and
>> can get a little over 1,000 EGT with CHT below 300.
>> There is no evidence of detonation on the piston or the plugs, the burn
>> back is not real distinct but seems quite safe.
>> I will test the secondary required voltage and see if I get anywhere with
>> that.
>> I am not looking for your basic doctorate dissertation assembled by
>> someone that has never tuned a 2 cycle engine.
>> prefer to keep it practical and applicable.
>> No Time Area Per Unit of Displacement, Brake Mean Effective Pressure, or
>> squish velocity theory needed here.
>> Mechanically the motor feels normal.
>> More or less fuel makes things worse.
>> Makes me lean toward electrical.
>> Has anyone seen this kind of thing before?
>> It is not plugs as changing the plug wires around on the plugs made no
>> difference in how it ran under any condition.
>> Any ideas would be appreciated.
>>
>> --------
>> Dale Whelan
>> 503 powered Firestar II
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248637#248637
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
Patrick:
I say again, the single tube incorporates both pitot and static pressure
systems. Too complicated for me to try and explain how it is designed
before I have my first cup of coffee.
john h
mkIII
It is a single tube aproximately 5" long that incorporates both pitot
and static pressure systems.>.
Thanks John, that sounds pretty neat with only a single tube.I have
never heard of that. Does that mean it measures pitot pressure only and
you use cockpit static?.
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | william sullivan <williamtsullivan(at)att.net> |
- Pat- Aircraft Spruce lists a couple of the single tube designs, plus a
couple of the double tube designs.- Listed under "Instruments".- Page 3
94 in my catalog.- I don't know which one John has.- They list one for
under $20 (US), and go up to almost $180.
-
-------------------------
----------------------- Bill
Sullivan
-------------------------
----------------------- Winds
or Locks, Ct.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com> |
Perhaps this drawing would help.
Rick
On Wed, Jun 17, 2009 at 7:57 AM, John Hauck wrote:
> Patrick:
>
> I say again, the single tube incorporates both pitot and static pressure
> systems. Too complicated for me to try and explain how it is designed
> before I have my first cup of coffee.
>
> john h
> mkIII
>
>
> It is a single tube aproximately 5" long that incorporates both pitot and
> static pressure systems.>.
>
> Thanks John, that sounds pretty neat with only a single tube.I have never
> heard of that. Does that mean it measures pitot pressure only and you use
> cockpit static?.
>
> Pat
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: sweltering summer |
| From: | "cristalclear13" <cristalclearwaters(at)gmail.com> |
Did I hear right that some people in New York got snow yesterday? Can you send
some of that cool weather down here to South Georgia please?
--------
Cristal Waters
Kolb Mark II Twinstar
Rotax 503 DCSI
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248687#248687
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | robert bean <slyck(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: sweltering summer |
No snow here. Mid-70s yesterday and dry clear air. I went canoeing.
The Kolb is near perfect now with the exception of having it quit at
idle (after touchdown) two evenings ago.
Erratic idle too. Pulled the carb off last night and it looks like a
break in the base flange gasket was letting
air leak in. I'll open it up and take a look anyway. -always
something.
BB
Scottsville, NY
On 17, Jun 2009, at 9:39 AM, cristalclear13 wrote:
>
>
> Did I hear right that some people in New York got snow yesterday?
> Can you send some of that cool weather down here to South Georgia
> please?
>
> --------
> Cristal Waters
> Kolb Mark II Twinstar
> Rotax 503 DCSI
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248687#248687
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
>
>I have not yet figured out what is wrong with my friends single carb dual ignition
Rotax 503
Dale,
Points or CD ignition? If it has points, the points may be floating due to
weak return springs or a sticky pivot.
Might be a fuel flow restriction. Check for dirt just ahead of the float
needle valve orifice, plugged fuel filter, cracked fuel or crankcase to pump
line, broken valve in fuel pump.
FWIW
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
Thanks, Rick.
The single tube pitot/static system at the bottom of the file is a good
example.
My system was manufactured by Kollsman Instruments during WWII. It was
still in its original wrapping with cosmoline. Has a Federal Stock
Number on it. Think I got it from WagAero for about $12.00. Made of
nickle plated brass.
john h
mkIII
Perhaps this drawing would help.
Rick
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
dalewhelan wrote:
> I have not yet figured out what is wrong with my friends single carb dual ignition
Rotax 503
> It recently developed a problem, I am not sure exactly when it happened so it
is hard for me to say it happened when this happened to the plane or motor.
> When he first got it it reved over 7,000 rpm at partial throttle, an immediate
re pitch was in order. I had him add about 3 degrees to the 3 blade prop. On
the ground it was about 6,000.
> He flew it and the motor acted up so he landed. I Found it ran on one ignition
and not the other. Fouled plugs were found.
> The case was made that it is OK to lean out your 2stroke airplane, even necessary
at times.
> Idle was OK but just above idle was pretty rich. I installed a smaller needle
jet in the VM Mikuni carb. Idle improved, (it is the smoothest idlingg Rotax
503 I have heard) cruise sounded better and fuel burn dropped to about 2.5 gallons
per hour.
> I dropped the main jet a couple sizes and things got better on top.
> In monument Valley I may have dropped the main jet and played with an air screw.
Greg's plane seemed on par with mine.
> Well back in Phoenix I heard Greg's plane and it sounded off. He said it would
not rev.
> Greg found oil on his prop, it was from a leaking head gasket, which was from
not one but 2 broken cylinder studs. After fixing that the problem remained
> Here is what I have found so far.
> With a CHT of 200 I apply full throttle and the motor revs to 6000 (static)
after the motor hits about 225 it starts to slow.
> By the time I near 300 it won't rev past about 5,200.
> If I kill ignition 1 it rev to 4,800.
> If I kill only ignition 2, it revs to 4,300.
> If I change the main jet either way it losses power.
> At idle Ignition 1 killed results in 2,000 rpm while killing only ignition 2
results in about 2,100 rpm idle.
> The plugs look fine, the resistance values of the caps look good.
> The motor runs smooth. The full throttle EGT looks low 900 but leaner main jet
reduces rpm and richer makes it run rough.
> Main jet changes are seen on the EGT.
> Ring end gap looks to be about .015 inch.
> Carbon buildup looks to be in remission.
> The motor is running 50:1 on the oil, I run 32:1 with the same oil and have about
90 hours on my plugs.
> I get the highest EGT when I open the throttle to get about 4,200 rpm and can
get a little over 1,000 EGT with CHT below 300.
> There is no evidence of detonation on the piston or the plugs, the burn back
is not real distinct but seems quite safe.
> I will test the secondary required voltage and see if I get anywhere with that.
> I am not looking for your basic doctorate dissertation assembled by someone that
has never tuned a 2 cycle engine.
> prefer to keep it practical and applicable.
> No Time Area Per Unit of Displacement, Brake Mean Effective Pressure, or squish
velocity theory needed here.
> Mechanically the motor feels normal.
> More or less fuel makes things worse.
> Makes me lean toward electrical.
> Has anyone seen this kind of thing before?
> It is not plugs as changing the plug wires around on the plugs made no difference
in how it ran under any condition.
> Any ideas would be appreciated.
Here's what you want to see on the 503:
WOT rpm on climbout: 6300 to 6500.
Cruise rpm: 5200-5500. above 5500 I wouldn't recommend for extended periods of
time and 6000+ continuous is too much indicating underpropping or simply running
too hard.
CHT: 300F nominal. Engine should sit between 290 and 310F indicated at cruise.
Shouldn't exceed 320-30 except in long full power climbs of more than a minute
or two, then you don't want to see more than 350F (new engine will run about
330F cruise for about the first 10 hours, then it'll settle down to about 300).
EGT: 1000-1050F at wide open of 6300 to 6400rpm. 900 is too low, 1100F is approaching
the edge. Cruise EGT's should sit around 1050 to 1100F. 1150F is getting
to the edge meaning either too lean or underpropped (or both), below 1050F usually
means too rich or overpropped or both.
Oil: 50:1 _ONLY_. Do NOT run higher concentrations of oil like 32:1. This will
put you down in a field after a while. The coking of the motor will stop the prop
if the too-lean mixture doesn't beat it to it.
After all that, I'd check the following mechanical things:
- did the repair on the head gaskets take? If they've been loose for a while, the
gasket or even the head can become deformed such that you may not get a good
seal even with proper torquing of the nuts.
- check for scuffing on the piston skirt through both the exhaust and intake ports.
A minor siezure can cause all kinds of wierd running problems like hesitation,
etc.
- as others have suggested, try fitting a known-good Bing to the engine to rule
out a carburettor problem.
It's a pretty simple motor so troubleshooting isn't that hard... Let us know how
it goes...
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248706#248706
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | kolbs were flying in michigan last sunday |
Rick Neilsen from near Grand Ledge Mi. with his volkswagon powered MK lll
and Ted Woodill from down near Elkhart IN. with his Firestar ll, myself
with my firestar ll flew Last Sunday to the fly in at Mason, Mi....there was
a good crowd there...I got out of buying breakfast as breakfast for pilots
in command was free...Rick's MK lll with the volkswagon engine got lots of
attention. I think people like the idea of a less expensive engine than the
4 stroke Rotax...we came back here to my strip and then over to another
airport to visit with some of the pilots there....was a good time and a all
day of flying....here is a pic of u
from left to right, Rick, Ted, Jim Ted said he never knew he was so
good looking !!!!
JIM SWAN
firestar ll, 503, N663S
Eaton Rapids, Mi. 48827
PH 517-663-8488 runway 2300' E & W (42-28.58N 084-44.69 W )
**************Dell Days of Deals! June 15-24 - A New Deal Everyday!
ad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B215692145%3B38015538%3Bh)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
Thanks for the input guys. some thoughts:
I had it running quite well on the Mikuni perhaps 6 hours.
I will find out if it is point or CDI, I assumed with dual ignition and coils like
my DCDI motor it was CDI
I have 100 hour on my plane with 32:1 oil and have less carbon in the motor than
Greg's plane at 50:1 The Spark plugs also look better than his and have 90 hours
on them.
Leaking head gasket has been repaired.
While more oil leans the mixture it is negligible and tunable. the difference in
fuel is less than 1 % in this case well under half a jet size, and the oil
is almost double.
I will do a leakdown test but the motor does not seem to me to be acting that way.
Will check piston condition but I don't think that is it, but I don't know what
the problem is yet.
It is not fuel starvation, I went up 50% on the main and it ran rich, rough, and
low RPM.
The plugged exhaust systems I have dealt with never let the motor rev, this motor
revs and holds it for a short time then drops. Once the motor cools the process
repeats.
I don't think I will see the motor for about 2 weeks, I will share with you guys
what was wrong weather you folks find the problem or I do.
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248731#248731
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jack Carillon <pcarillonsr(at)neo.rr.com> |
dalewhelan wrote:
>
> I got Rebeka's photos
>
> --------
> Dale Whelan
> 503 powered Firestar II
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248451#248451
>
>
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc02083_113.jpg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>
Dale, back in 96 when I soloed my Firestar II I did about the same thing
. First landing at sunset I came straight in at a private 2000' grass
strip that had been trenched across about half way down the strip for
field tile, then filled in leaving a mound of dirt across the runway a
little over a foot high, not a problem still had 1000' of runway to use.
I cut power at about 500', held airspeed at 50mph, air was completely
calm, used the mound of dirt as my threshold. I watched the dirt mound
in the windscreen to see if went up or down so I knew if I would land
short or long. Everything was going good till I got within a distance of
about 150' away an maybe 20' in the air from my threshold when I
realized I would touch down right at the mound of dirt
if I kept going the way I was, so instead of adding power I eased back
on the stick just a hair thinking I would clear the dirt. You guessed
it, the dreaded "Kolb Quit", speed bled off quick. Left wing stalled
first dropping from about 5' onto the left gear on top of the mound of
dirt, bending the gear leg, although not as bad as yours but it also
turned the wheel out about 45 degrees of toe out. After hitting I went
off the right side of the runway into some tall grass, motor still
running looked at the wheel with disgust ,added power and taxied out of
the tall grass and up the field where my buddy was.He had flown my
Firestar the 5 miles from his 600' strip to this field and I drove. I
said looks like we'll have to go get the trailer and haul it home. My
buddy said you taxied it up the strip so I'll try to fly it off. He did
just that, no problem taking off,You couldn't tell the wheel was the way
it was it tracked straight down the strip. He waited to land at his
house till I got there and had no problem landing. It my have been that
it was late enough in the evening that there was a little dew on the
grass. Grass strips a very forgiving. My buddy straightened the gear leg
and found no other damage.
Jack Carillon FirestarII 503 DCDI
Akron Oh.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
Re pitot.
Thanks Rick. Having thought it through I had decided that there must be
an internal tube involved.
Thanks for the drawing. Pretty neat. Too tricky for me to get involved
with.
I remember that many years ago there was an English Ccompany called
Ackles and Pollocks who specialised in small tubes. An foreign company
sent them the smallest tube which they manufactured with a note "Beat
that".
A and P sent it back with their own product inside it.
I will contact them (If they still exist)
Thanks Rick and John.
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
dalewhelan wrote:
> Thanks for the input guys. some thoughts:
> I had it running quite well on the Mikuni perhaps 6 hours.
> I will find out if it is point or CDI, I assumed with dual ignition and coils
like my DCDI motor it was CDI
> I have 100 hour on my plane with 32:1 oil and have less carbon in the motor than
Greg's plane at 50:1 The Spark plugs also look better than his and have 90
hours on them.
> Leaking head gasket has been repaired.
> While more oil leans the mixture it is negligible and tunable. the difference
in fuel is less than 1 % in this case well under half a jet size, and the oil
is almost double.
> I will do a leakdown test but the motor does not seem to me to be acting that
way.
> Will check piston condition but I don't think that is it, but I don't know what
the problem is yet.
> It is not fuel starvation, I went up 50% on the main and it ran rich, rough,
and low RPM.
> The plugged exhaust systems I have dealt with never let the motor rev, this motor
revs and holds it for a short time then drops. Once the motor cools the process
repeats.
> I don't think I will see the motor for about 2 weeks, I will share with you guys
what was wrong weather you folks find the problem or I do.
The only time I've seen a heavier mixture than 50:1 utilized was in the 582 in
a helicopter application - 40:1 was recommended due to the continuous high power
operation, but the engine exhibited a higher than normal failure rate anyway.
At 32:1, I'd increase the teardown/cleanup schedule for sure. There's no good reason
that I can think of to run that much oil, well, under any circumstances....
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248746#248746
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
>
Dale,
One last thought. If carbon builds up under the rings, it will cause the
problem you describe. I had this problem with a 447. What happens is the
rings heat up and try to expand but the slot depth is not available for them
to contract back into. As result the ring then presses more against the
cylinder wall and increases ring to cylinder wall friction. If you checked
the ring in the cylinder clearance did you clean out the slots?
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax Operating Parameters |
| From: | "GeoB" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net> |
John Hauck wrote:
>
>
> It was a fine airplane to learn in and enjoy flying. It had some weak points,
but overall was a good little airplane.
>
> john h
> mkIII
John, I am a flamin' Nubie here... (not a pilot, have no plane) I am interested
in Kolbs that are 103 compliant. I was totally impressed with a Firefly I saw
at Brians Ranch fly-in. Just looking at pictures the Ultrastar caught my eye.
I want something to learn on and not die too soon.
Could you elaborate a little on the strengths and weaknesses of the Ultrastar as
you perceive them? And if you have time, maybe you could touch on the Firefly?
(my first post, be gentle with me)
GeoB
--------
GeoB
"Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers,
so we could identify their corporate sponsors"
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248785#248785
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax Operating Parameters |
> John, I am a flamin' Nubie here... (not a pilot, have no plane) I am
> interested in Kolbs that are 103 compliant. I was totally impressed with a
> Firefly I saw at Brians Ranch fly-in. Just looking at pictures the
> Ultrastar caught my eye. I want something to learn on and not die too
> soon.
>
> Could you elaborate a little on the strengths and weaknesses of the
> Ultrastar as you perceive them? And if you have time, maybe you could
> touch on the Firefly?
>
> (my first post, be gentle with me)
> GeoB
GeoB:
I don't think the US is FAR Part 103 compliant. It flies too fast.
The Fire Fly can be built to comply with Part 103, but would be a difficult
task to accomplish.
Neither would be a good choice to "learn on and not die too soon".
Both are conventional 3 axis control airplanes. Best learn to fly before
you try one.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dana" <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
When I made a new pitot tube for my UltraStar, I made a concentric pitot/static
tube. The inner tube the original 1/4" aluminum tube that was on the plane when
I bought it, but i added an outer tube of 3/8" diameter brass with four small
holes in the middle, tapered bushings at each end of the outer tube, and a
small brass tube soldered to attach the static line. It works much better than
having the static air just venting inside the instrument pod as the previous
owner had it (every time I moved my foot the reading would change!)
It's still not entirely accurate, and I don't know why. At 30-35 mph it seems
correct, according to averaged GPS readings upwind and downwind... but at 45 mph
indicated (level flight at 5800 cruise) the averaged GPS readings are more
like 55 mph.
A picture is attached.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248838#248838
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/pitot_tube_146.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax Operating Parameters |
At 05:58 PM 6/17/2009, John Hauck wrote:
>I don't think the US is FAR Part 103 compliant. It flies too fast.
>
>The Fire Fly can be built to comply with Part 103, but would be a
>difficult task to accomplish.
John, I know you've said before your US was quite fast and I believe you,
but mine seems to cruise at 55 mph at 5800 rpm... I didn't carefully
measure level flight speed at WOT, but I don't think it's in excess of the
55 knot (62 mph) max. Not sure why yours would be that much faster, unless
you had a pod or additional streamlining that I don't have.
Both the FF and the US require stern discipline to keep within the 103
weight limits, but it can be done.
-Dana
--
Ever notice the Secret Service and the Nazi SS have the same initials?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax Operating Parameters |
> John, I know you've said before your US was quite fast and I believe you,
> but mine seems to cruise at 55 mph at 5800 rpm... I didn't carefully
> measure level flight speed at WOT, but I don't think it's in excess of the
> 55 knot (62 mph) max. Not sure why yours would be that much faster,
> unless you had a pod or additional streamlining that I don't have.
>
> -Dana
I thought they all flew like mine, when I was flying it.
I built it strictly stock, to plans.
Cuyuna ULII02 and a Jim Culver 50X30 prop.
No streamlining.
Did have a small instrument pod over my knees.
Flew with a Winter Venturi ASI which is very accurate across the entire
range. It was 0 to 75 mph, but the needle would wind past the 75 mph mark.
Interpolation was 85 mph.
My original Firestar had the same performance with a 447 and a 60X30 Jim
Culver Prop.
My MKIII flies well and is faster than most mkIII's. I don't know why.
Maybe the way I build them. I shrink fabric to the point of pulling tubing.
I like really tight fabric.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
Lucien wrote
At 32:1, I'd increase the teardown/cleanup schedule for sure. There's no good reason
that I can think of to run that much oil, well, under any circumstances....
LS[/quote]
With 90 hours on the plugs and a combustion chamber that is clean, my motor disagrees
with you, as do I.
I am not sure if you realize it but while some of what you wrote holds truth, the
way it sounds reminds me of a wannabe cowboy in a hole in the wall bar is some
city trying to pick a fight with someone who is just there to have a good
time. Perhaps I am just taking it wrong, but I have read similar sounding responses
to other forum members. Either way, perhaps I can set you straight.
If I misinterpreted your tone I do apologize.
So a little about me.
Please understand, I have lots to learn, but I have made a living for the past
28 years fixing many forms of internal combustion motors.
I have spent 15 years teaching the repair of Motorcycles.
I am a Honda registered technician.
I have taught Suzuki dealership personnel for American Suzuki.
I have repaired Leaf blowers, chain saws, lawn mowers, go carts, cars, boats, jetskis,
motorcycles, generators, snowmobiles, all terrain vehicles, and airplanes.
I have also spent 25 years in motorsports competition, some of that at the professional
level.
I have done all of my own machine preparation with the exception of cylinder porting,
re-plating, and combustion chamber reshaping.
Although I read much, I am not sharing with you what I have read, I am sharing
what I have found over years of testing and competition.
After Having conducted considerable dyno testing I can tell you exactly why I would
in some conditions run more than 50:1.
Reason 1 More Horsepower.
Reason 2 Improved engine longevity
Over simplification could go like this: no oil = no lubrication, Some oil= some
lubrication, More oil = more lubrication.
Of course there are practical limitations.
I gained over 3% on a 76 HP 250 cc racing engine by changing from 32:1 to 20:1.
My pipes and plugs are drier than those who run less oil and don't know how to
tune a 2 stroke.
That same 250cc racing motor develops 86 HP today.
The only place it develops carbon is the first 6 inches of the head pipe and a
very thin amount on the piston crown, the head wipes lean.
My friend did a long term test on a motocross 250 2 stroke and saw a 30% increase
in motor life by increasing the amount of oil he ran.
I can tell you why I would run little oil.
Less burned oil in the air or water in the case of boats.
The ring land idea sound worth looking into, the plane is a recent purchase and
was running so rich it would short plugs in under 10 hours. Every thing you can
see with the heads removed looks good to me but I did not look through any
ports or remove cylinders.
I guess it won't be a quick field fix, I may have to get serious.
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248847#248847
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WhiskeyVictor36(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
In a message dated 6/17/2009 1:51:33 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net writes:
Dale,
FWIW
The above comment describes a seizure in process. Engine heats up,
piston(s) expand and get tight in cylinder bore, so RPM's drop. The engine
cools, piston(s) shrink and get loose, then RPM's increase.
What caused them to be broken? I just saw a video on 503 rebuild and they
cautioned that when tightening the head bolts (nuts), make sure to tighten
each equally. That is, if one is tightened too much (even finger tight)
before the others, it can tip the head over to one side. Then when the
others are tightened, it can cause the bolts to break, or stretch to break
later. Might even cause damage to the head gasket and/or surface.
Bill Varnes
Original Kolb FireStar
Audubon NJ
Do Not Archive
**************Dell Days of Deals! June 15-24 - A New Deal Everyday!
ad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B215692145%3B38015538%3Bh)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
It may sound funny but when I am short my first thought is to gain speed, I am
not one to try to extend a glide.
When I was 12 my father and I were short in a glider.
Our options were trees now, or perpendicular to a canal just short of the runway.
My father spent his life as a teacher and took this time to teach me. He asked
what I wanted to do.
I said if we don't try to make it we may have some explaining to do. We had a headwind,
he added half the headwind component and we made it. I could see the
twist in the wire as we crossed the fence.
I have had 2 forced landings and have practiced many deadstick landings.
One time I was short with no motor, I was not going to clear a fence. I pushed
the nose down and aimed at the base of the fence and flared when I got there,
as I cleared the fence I pushed forward, the plane nose over but was done flying,
I got the nose back up but it hit hard, no damage.
I do practice harder than most, (I take all the ASF courses I can, I fly every
week, and I read this forum), I hope to not hurt myself doing it. I can guarantee
I will never put anyone at risk except myself and my ballast that demands
I take her when I practice. She knows the risk.
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248857#248857
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tony Oldman" <aoldman(at)xtra.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: sweltering summer |
Good here yesterday ,started at 30F and went to 44F, No wind ,no cloud, a
great day to fly. Work sucks even in winter
Downunder
MK111c
----- Original Message -----
From: "cristalclear13" <cristalclearwaters(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 1:39 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: sweltering summer
>
>
> Did I hear right that some people in New York got snow yesterday? Can you
> send some of that cool weather down here to South Georgia please?
>
> --------
> Cristal Waters
> Kolb Mark II Twinstar
> Rotax 503 DCSI
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248687#248687
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
I pushed the nose down and aimed at the base of the fence and flared when I
got there, as I cleared the fence I pushed forward, the plane nose over but
was done flying, I got the nose back up but it hit hard, no damage.>>
Hi Dale,
I once saw that done and like you, the pilot got away with it. Thinking
about it afterwards I came to the conclusion that continuing the glide, and
not diving was the better answer. At least in theory you cannot get higher
than you were by diving and pulling up. Where would the extra energy come
from? When you dive you exchange some of the potential energy stored in the
glider in the form of height for speed, and when you pull up you change it
back again from speed into height. Unfortunately there are losses involved.
Otherwise you would have invented a perpetual motion machine. In any case
the theoretical best you can do, disregarding any losses for the sake of
argument, is to get back to the height you were before, so you have gained
nothing. Of course you might expend all your energy getting back all the
height available and then the plane quits flying at that point and you just
fall over the fence, which is just about what happened to you.
Takes nerve to put the theory into practice and just sit there watching the
fence get higher. I think I might try to dive anyway.
I really should approach my flying in the same manner that you do. I am
afraid that I tend to think that whatever I have been doing up to now has
kept me alive so thats enough. I know that its not but I am too old to
change my habits now.
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
Hi Dana,
very neat job.
I envy you your ability to work in metal. I grew up in a timber yard and can
make a reasonable joint in wood but never had any metalwork training.
Welding and stuff is a mystery to me. I might just about make a soldered
joint if pushed but thats it.
Nevertheless I know a man who can do some stuff in metal and I might try
that if the other simpler suggestions for a mod to my piot don`t work.
Grotty weather day today. Just off to repair the wooden floor to my hangar
Thanks
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
dalewhelan wrote:
>
> With 90 hours on the plugs and a combustion chamber that is clean, my motor disagrees
with you, as do I.
Well, as you said you do have a lot to learn - I hope you learn it without having
to put down in a field when the fan stops turning. I'll have one more go here
and hope it takes. After that, it's your motor and your plane.
If you really have the mechanical experience you say you do, you know the value
of field experience with an engine - with the 503 we got lots of it, decades
in fact, and it all points to _50:1 only_, no other ratio when running premix.
More oil, especially at the level of 32:1, is taking your chances, much like the
suggestion of running 6500 rpm all the time.
But as I said, it's your plane and motor.
Good luck,
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248872#248872
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
At 05:13 AM 6/18/2009, pj.ladd wrote:
>At least in theory you cannot get higher than you were by diving and
>pulling up. Where would the extra energy come from? When you dive you
>exchange some of the potential energy stored in the glider in the form of
>height for speed, and when you pull up you change it back again from
>speed into height. Unfortunately there are losses involved. Otherwise you
>would have invented a perpetual motion machine. In any case the
>theoretical best you can do, disregarding any losses for the sake of
>argument, is to get back to the height you were before...
Well, yes and no. You have some kinetic energy at first as well, so you
may be able to end up higher, but at a lower airspeed than when you started.
-Dana
--
Help, I've fallen up and I can't get down
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
At 12:02 AM 6/18/2009, dalewhelan wrote:
>
>It may sound funny but when I am short my first thought is to gain speed,
>I am not one to try to extend a glide.
Well, sure. The speed for best glide _angle_ is faster than the speed for
minimum _sink_. Also the speed for best glide angle over the ground if
you're flying into the wind is faster than if you're flying
downwind. This is especially true in slow aircraft like ours, where the
wind speed may be a significant fraction of our airsped.
-Dana
--
Help, I've fallen up and I can't get down
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
Most of the time I land into the wind. If I lower the nose I progress further over
the ground.
The example I was given many years ago was was something like this.
If you stall at 30 and have a 30 MPH headwind you will never make the field flying
at 30.
If you fly 45 into a 30 MPH headwind your chances are better.
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248909#248909
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
[quote="lucien"]
dalewhelan wrote:
>
> With 90 hours on the plugs and a combustion chamber that is clean, my motor disagrees
with you, as do I.
You do know the 503 is a Dykes ring design right?
Of course I do
And that its primary use is on _airplanes_ not bikes?
Actually the primary use is low RPM boat motors and some motorcycles. Specifically
used because of the better sealing at low RPM because of the higher cylinder
contact surface area. While they have Less tendency to flutter at high RPM
than a conventional or Keystone ring They are not generally used in High RPM motors
due to the increased friction their surface area provides against the cylinder.
How many 503's have you run to TBO at 32:1?
None yet I got mine at TBO and have flown it 100 hours.
How many past TBO at 32:1?
I am 100 past TBOon my first 503 How many times have you had to tune a motor and
have it compared against the best tuners in America?
It'd be good to review your experience on this, could be very helpful to the rest
of us who've been hanging underneath this motor for years and years and been
doing it wrong all this time.
Sarcasm, something I have been told I am very good at, I have trouble not using
it myself. My grandma used to cut the ends off the roast before she cooked it,
so did my mom, mom did it because her mom did. Grandma did it to make it fit
in the pan. Not saying you are stupid or wrong, just saying there may be something
you do not know about.
You said you have a lot to learn
Thinking you know it all means the end of progress and to me the opportunity to
get taught the hard way that you don't know it all. - well, yeah, I'd say that
you do. And I hope you learn it without having to put down in a field when
the fan stops turning,
Funny, it seems that my background may be discomforting to you, The advice I get
is don't touch it you'll break it. Don't lean it you'll die. These same people
land and there plane won't restart hot using and electric starter. Mine starts
with one tug of the recoil started. In the morning I pull it 3 times and watch
them try to light off before the battery dies. They too have been hanging
under a 503 for many years. I found my flight instructors plane to be opening
the throttle only part way from the front, and I told him how to fix his charging
system. or advise someone else into doing the same. I'll have one more go
here and hope it takes. After that, it's your motor and your plane.
If you really have the mechanical experience you say you do,
That statement sounds like you are calling me a liar, hope you did not mean it
that way.
you know the value of field experience with an engine
There is much truth to what you say sadly I have seen many Harley mechanics that
think this way, my motor is so much different than any other motor that operates
on the suck squeeze bang blow method No one else but me can make the thing
run at all, ever notice how bad some of those sound? The fact is many people
working on motors are not mechanics and all they can really do is try to copy
what they think a mechanic does.
- with the 503 we got lots of it, decades in fact, and it all points to _50:1 only_,
no other ratio when running premix.
What ratios have you tried and what were your results? How did it do at 40:1 and
what specific problems did you have? What were the specific result of 60:1
More oil, especially at the level of 32:1, is taking chances you don't need to
take,
How so, what chances am I taking? The oil coking you mentioned in an earlier post
does not make sense to me, I have been told( By a technical service manager
at American Suzuki and a former Spectro employee) that oil coking was a result
of high oil temps, they had a problem with it when people left air cooled ATVs
idling for long period of time. The temperature the hit were nowhere close
to what a 503 sees.
much like the suggestion of running 6500 rpm all the time.
I read that post and you may have been in a hurry when you quoted it, you left
out how long he said to run it for, the time was 5 minutes, not all the time.
When you asked how long he had at 6,500 I thought about my limited time flying
and how I would answer that. My answer is about 300 takeoffs X 1 minute and maybe
about 100 of those at X about 4 minutes so about 700 minutes. I also thought
who would log max power time?
But it's your plane and motor.
This sounds like racing to me, I pay for all the choices I make no matter whose
advice I take, that is exactly why I experiment and test and learn and practice.
Let's all be careful out there including where we get our advice.
Many people think racer have a death wish, news flash many racers think that of
pilots. Both disciplines are very safety conscious, those who are not die, some
of those who are die too. Believe it or not I am safety conscious. While a
friend of mine calls me Mr Safety I am always trying to improve my safety. even
though my ballast does not like it, I always fly solo after working on my plane,
2 reasons, one is an FAR, the other is experience. When we were in Monument
Valley my ballast wanted a ride, the density altitude was higher than I had
taken off with her before so I had to evaluate the planes performance first.
I lean my motor out and people accuse me of trying to go faster (because of my
racing background I guess?), the reality is I don't want to run out of gas on
a cross country, lower fuel burn gives me a little insurance, too rich fouls
plugs, and I want to climb even if I am in sink.
As a side note, when I said I was going to Missouri to get my plane in July and
fly it back people told me it was a bad idea, nobody told me why. I now know
why. Another pilot/instructor/FBO voiced concerns until he talked and flew with
me. He still had concerns but was more comfortable.
Good luck,
Thanks for the reply and I hope I am not boring, or offending anyone.
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248923#248923
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
[quote="dalewhelan"]
lucien wrote:
>
>
> How many 503's have you run to TBO at 32:1?
> None yet I got mine at TBO and have flown it 100 hours.
>
That's what I figured. Let us know what your results are when you _do_ get a little
more experience with this motor.
Till then, folks, Caveat Emptor.
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248931#248931
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Blumax008(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: A new Slant on living with your Rotax... |
Just read the post / battle between Dale & whomever he's battling with.
I can't believe all this. I started flying ultralight aircraft in the
summer of '78 with a Terror-Dactyl (no canard) with a 22hp Sachs single banger.
Good motor. Somehow I've gotten along & stayed alive all that time without
BRSs too. 31 years & not a single expensive BRS purchase or expensive
repack.
Fast forward to 2009. I own a Trike for towing hang gliders with a 503, a
half partnership in a Phantom with a 503, a Kolb with a 503 & a SeaWing
Trike with a 582...only because it came with one.
What I'm getting at is that I can't believe all this incredibly complicated
technical talk you guys are doing. I fly the pee-living crap out of all my
motors & rarely do anything to them except change the plugs. And what the
hell is a TBO? Who put that imaginary time limit on it? Rotax wants you to
do it so you'll buy more parts that you "think" you need.
Do me a favor...before you go flying next time, stand close to your motor
and ask it this question..."How many hours do you have on you?" You probably
won't get an answer. The reason is that it doesn't know & can't speak
English. It has no idea.
My Trike, while towing hang gliders, flies WIDE-ASS OPEN at 6500rpm for the
entire flight up to (usually) 2,500 feet & has been wide open up to 5,500
feet. My motor has over 1,600 hours on it & is still going strong with a
solid crank. I've replaced both pistons & rings once & decarboned it 4
times. That's it & that's the truth. It'll be 12 years old come September.
My only 582 was on my Full Lotus equipped Maxair & it went 1,000 hours
(running at 6,000rpm+ most of that time) before I sold it to a guy in
California who wrecked it in the Pacific friggin' Ocean. The 582 is a good motor
too, it's just a pain in the ass to work with...anti-freeze, hoses,
radiators...for what? 12 or so extra horsepower? Try working on that damn thing
in
the field.
I really can only give you younger guys my years of experience & this
simple sentence of advice...Fly the damn things & forget all the bullshit you
read on the internet.
**************Dell Days of Deals! June 15-24 - A New Deal Everyday!
ad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B215692163%3B38015526%3Be)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
I have read many posts, many helpful. It is sad to think that some one with your
experience and background habitually expresses himself in a critical, dismissive,
and belittling manner.
When you do this fewer people want to hear from you.
I have noticed a couple of people on this site. John is one, I even met him briefly
at Monument Valley this year. He came over and said hi, he talked with Greg
about his nose gear Firestar, He took local kids for rides, he tries to help
us newbies on this forum. He seems like a kind and respectable man. I read posts
where it looked like you twisted what he said and ridiculed him. I expected
you to do the same with me and you seem to have fulfilled that promise. I like
it when people try to help others, I am disappointed when I see criticism
offered when help is asked for. It is a shame that with your greater life experience
and greater flying experience that I longer wish to hear what you have
to say. You probably have a lot to offer and could be a great mentor, I think
you prefer not to do that. Please don't offer me your type of help any longer.
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248941#248941
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
so you may be able to end up higher, but at a lower airspeed than when you
started.>>
Hi Dana,
thats why I said "disregarding other losses" or words to that effect.
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
503 we got lots of it, decades in fact, and it all points to _50:1 only_, no
other ratio when running premix. >>
Why do some pilots always disagree with the manufacturer? You would have
though that it was a safe assumption that the makers have data at their
fingertips which is not generally available to the average pilot. They have
the correlated results of every engine they have ever made. Even the most
enthusiastic pilot has only his own experience or maybe `say so` gleaned
from a local `expert`.
>From some of the posts it seems that there are pilots constantly changing
jets, renewing carb. needles, leaning the settings etc. Why not just leave
well alone.
Running an engine with lower oil in the mix strikes me as being foolish.
What is the object? Saving money?
Some people are just of a nature that they love pulling engines apart and
experimenting. Fair enough, its a lot of fun if you are that way inclined
but I don`t think that individual experience outweighs the accumulated info.
which a manufacturer has.
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
If you stall at 30 and have a 30 MPH headwind you will never make the field
flying at 30. >>
Don`t understand. What has stalling to do with it?
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
Aircraft Spruce lists a couple of the single tube designs,>>
Thanks Bill.
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: sweltering summer |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
aoldman(at)xtra.co.nz wrote:
> Good here yesterday ,started at 30F and went to 44F, No wind ,no cloud, a
> great day to fly. Work sucks even in winter
>
> Downunder
> MK111c
> ---
The monsoon season is almost upon us here. Even with that and the stronger winds
and convective activity, I don't miss that heat down on the gulf coast where
I lived the last 30 years.
Only other bummer is the density altitude. Back when I had my FSII, my max climb
rate was only about 400fpm in 10F temperatures. On a summer morning or evening,
300 was about all I could do. That was with the 503 3.47:1 C box cranking
that big ol warp drive taper tip too......
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=248973#248973
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com wrote:
>
> well alone.
> Running an engine with lower oil in the mix strikes me as being foolish.
> What is the object? Saving money?
>
> Some people are just of a nature that they love pulling engines apart and
> experimenting. Fair enough, its a lot of fun if you are that way inclined
> but I don`t think that individual experience outweighs the accumulated info.
> which a manufacturer has.
>
> Cheers
>
> Pat
It's worth noting that the 50:1 requirement is originally Rotax's requirement and
it still is.
There are some mistakes here and there in the 2-stroke manuals (such as the infamous
max CHT limit) but the rest is reliable for sure, including the premix oil
ratio.
I like to let the other guys do the experimenting as I generally can't afford the
mishaps, dealing with FSDO and FAA, etc., that come from going it on your own
and ignoring correct advice. So I just tow the line on what we know to be the
most reliable running configuration, rpms, installation, etc. and fly instead....
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249004#249004
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax Operating Parameters |
>I am interested in Kolbs that are 103 compliant. I was totally impressed
with a Firefly I saw at Brians Ranch fly-in. Just looking at pictures the
Ultrastar caught my eye. I want something to learn on and not die too
soon.
>
GeoB,
You may want to check out:
http://www.jackbhart.com/firefly/fireflylegal.html
It is a page describing the design parameters that determine if an aircraft
can be flown as an ultralight vehicle. There are two bits of info that are
difficult to dismiss and they are empty weight and fuel tank volume. If you
can meet these two requirements and you can calculate enough drag and low
enough wing loading, the air craft is declared an ultralight, no matter how
fast it will fly or at what speed it will stall.
If the UltraStar can meet the empty weight limit, surely it has more drag
that a FireFly.
For your interest, I invite you to look at:
http://www.jackbhart.com/firefly/firefly.html
and:
http://www.jackbhart.com/firefly/fireflyindex.html
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
Not that this was the intent of this thread but, Is there anyone on this board
other than myself that has tried running more than the recommended amount of
oil and willing to share with me what they found.
Just for fun, even though I have no inclination to do so, is there anyone on this
board that has run less oil than 50:1, ( I once saw a company claim you could
run their oil at 150:1) If so would you share your results with me?
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249046#249046
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: A new Slant on living with your Rotax... |
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
Sorry if I wasted your time, I just have a love for making motors work. I can drop
it or start a new thread called big egos, childish behavior if you like.
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249049#249049
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: WRT M3X prop boom measurements. |
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
After reading all the posts I really don't know anything about props.
I think the next prop I buy will be another 2 blade ground adjustable IVO.
It is just so easy to adjust.
I have a Firestar II with a 503 DCDI
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249057#249057
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
To oil ratio I think giving it a bit more oil will improve its reliability. There
is of course a point where the oil is detrimental. For example the octane level
may (?) start dropping and rapidly ( I need more data on that though, as
the oil may have somewhat of a retardant effect on burning efficiency thus preventing
detonation), burning efficiency starts falling and so on. But with some
experimentation I suppose I can find that point just before the decreased ratio
is becoming detrimental. At 35 / 1 the Cyuna seems happy so far. I may try
later to 30 to 1 and see if its good. I guess I could try 15-1 on the ground
only and see what happens just for the curiosity of it, but oil is more expensive
than 91 octane so I guess you can wonder if there is any point to it, to make
more smoke and less power. Once you reach the point where the motor gets all
the lube it needs then we ain't doing it anymore good tossing more oil into
it.
We just need to be careful.
Ron @ KFHU
=========================
---- dalewhelan wrote:
============
Not that this was the intent of this thread but, Is there anyone on this board
other than myself that has tried running more than the recommended amount of
oil and willing to share with me what they found.
Just for fun, even though I have no inclination to do so, is there anyone on this
board that has run less oil than 50:1, ( I once saw a company claim you could
run their oil at 150:1) If so would you share your results with me?
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249046#249046
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
I will share what I have found, if you want more contact me off list to reduce
drama, I can call you if you like.
[quote="captainron1(at)cox.net"]To oil ratio I think giving it a bit more oil will
improve its reliability. There is of course a point where the oil is detrimental.
More oil can cause problems if the motor is run at too low an RPM, like on final,
or prolonged idling. If the motor is jetted rich it will cause more problem
so I have had to have the jetting right on all circuits.
For example the octane level may (?) start dropping and rapidly ( I need more data
on that though, as the oil may have somewhat of a retardant effect on burning
efficiency thus preventing detonation), burning efficiency starts falling
and so on.
There is a way to look at the plugs to see how close to detonation a motor is,
you can't easily read it if you are a few sizes rich. The common variables are
Mixture, load, relative air density, and rpm. Others include octane, ignition
timing, and compression ratio.
But with some experimentation I suppose I can find that point just before the decreased
ratio is becoming detrimental.
I have found with fuel testing on a dyno that the motor makes the most power just
before it detonates, changing the fuel octane resulted in no power difference
once timing was corrected for the fuel and jetting was correct. When you add
oxygenated fuel, well cool things happen to the power. If I publicly told you
what octane I use, the lynch mob would come looking for me, funny thing, looking
at my instructor plane, it seems to need more octane than mine.
At 35 / 1 the Cyuna seems happy so far. I may try later to 30 to 1 and see if its
good. I guess I could try 15-1 on the ground only and see what happens just
for the curiosity of it, but oil is more expensive than 91 octane so I guess
you can wonder if there is any point to it, to make more smoke and less power.
Gordon Jennings was my inspiration for oil ratio testing, I stopped at 20:1 on
my race bike, pipes are dry but it smokes in the pits. He was testing for McCullough
I think. He said that the motor kept making more power as he added oil
and corrected the tuning until he got to something like 12 or 14:1. At that point
power increase was negligible and plug fouling was common.
Once you reach the point where the motor gets all the lube it needs then we ain't
doing it anymore good tossing more oil into it.
We just need to be careful.
Some people have been kind enough to share some things with me off list, they make
some good points. They even gave me reasons for why it could be bad and what
to watch for.
Ron @ KFHU
I will strive to create less drama
Dale Whelan
=========================
---- dalewhelan wrote:
============
Not that this was the intent of this thread but, Is there anyone on this board
other than myself that has tried running more than the recommended amount of
oil and willing to share with me what they found.
Just for fun, even though I have no inclination to do so, is there anyone on this
board that has run less oil than 50:1, ( I once saw a company claim you could
run their oil at 150:1) If so would you share your results with me?
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 49046#249046
--
kugelair.com[/quote]
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249070#249070
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
So I just tow the line on what we know to be the most reliable running
configuration, rpms, installation, etc. and fly instead....>>
Hi Lucien,
I agree except that I would `toe the line` not `tow the line` Heh Heh.
Theres another controversial thread!
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
At 10:08 PM 6/18/2009, dalewhelan wrote:
>Not that this was the intent of this thread but, Is there anyone on this
>board other than myself that has tried running more than the
>recommended amount of oil and willing to share with me what they found.
>Just for fun, even though I have no inclination to do so, is there anyone
>on this board that has run less oil than 50:1, ( I once saw a company
>claim you could run their oil at 150:1) If so would you share your results
>with me?
I have not, but kart and bike racers sometimes fiddle with the oil mix to
adjust the mixture when there's no time to make a jetting change (more oil
= less fuel so the engine runs leaner, and vice versa).
Remember that the oil lubricates, but it's the fuel, not the oil, that
cools the engine. More oil may give you more lubrication, but it's a much
worse at taking away heat than fuel. Also too much oil and you start
fouling spark plugs, particularly at low power settings... your engine may
quit (or just hesitate) just when you need it most, to go around or simply
stretch your glide after a long descent. Not to mention gunking up the
rings, and the black gook coating your prop.
OTOH, I have people telling me I should run my Cuyunna at 50:1 rather than
the manufacturer recommended 40:1... but I can't see any advantage. Sure,
I'd spend a bit less on oil, but it runs fine as it is, and I don't foul
plugs, so why mess with a good thing and have to fiddle with jetting all
over again?
-Dana
--
The sex was so good that even the neighbors had a cigarette.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
> We just need to be careful.
> Some people have been kind enough to share some things with me off list,
> they make some good points. They even gave me reasons for why it could be
> bad and what to watch for.
> Dale Whelan
In the world of aviation we're looking for reliability while working with
continuous duty engines that are more like tractor and equipment engines
than racing engines.
I have found that the engineers at Rotax are pretty smart guys. They do a
good job of setting up the engines when they leave the factory. The primary
problem encountered by most enthusiast is correct prop pitch/loading. If it
is correct, jetting and spark plugs that come in the engine from the factory
will also be correct. The only other factor that will change factory tuning
is altitude and temperature extremes, if you are running the correct fuel
and oil.
To match the engine and prop is pretty simple. I have found if I pitch the
prop to just bump the red line at wide open throttle (WOT), straight and
level flight when the airplane is flying as fast as it is going to fly, I
have loaded the engine correctly and I will get the best performance in
climb and cruise. EGT and CHT will also be in the green.
The biggest mistake aviators make with two stroke engines is trying to tune
a two stroke to a prop that is not properly loading the engine. Once they
start this, they start chasing their tail in a circle that either never ends
or ends when the engine seizes.
Somewhere along the line I remember, either a Shell engineer or during one
of Eric Tucker's Rotax engine courses, that operating with too much oil is
detrimental to Rotax two strokes in many ways. One way is crank shaft
bearings which are designed to operate at a certain level of oil in the
crank case. Too much oil can cause these crank shaft bearings to fail.
Next time I talk to Ronnie Smith or Eric Tucker I will try to remember to
ask them about this. May be a figment of my imagination, but I don't think
so.
I don't get involved with two stroke aviation much any more. I haven't seen
much change in them in the last 25 years that I have been involved in
ultralight and light plane aviation. My experience was to follow the book,
leave them alone the way they came from the factory, fly them hard and not
baby them. I had good luck and flew two strokes over a lot of this country
back in the old days. I was not interested in squeezing every ounce of
power out of the little engine or changing what the factory engineers had
written in the operators manual. My primary goal was to get there and get
home safely, and have a lot of fun while I was at it.
The environment we play in is very unforgiving.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com wrote:
>
> Hi Lucien,
> I agree except that I would `toe the line` not `tow the line` Heh Heh.
> Theres another controversial thread!
>
> Cheers
>
> Pat
Heh. I stand corrected.
No more controversial threads for me, as I'm not into online group therapy anymore.
If people get flustered upon presentation of the facts, that's their problem
and I'm outta there. ;)
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249082#249082
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
John Hauck wrote:
>
> Somewhere along the line I remember, either a Shell engineer or during one
> of Eric Tucker's Rotax engine courses, that operating with too much oil is
> detrimental to Rotax two strokes in many ways. One way is crank shaft
> bearings which are designed to operate at a certain level of oil in the
> crank case. Too much oil can cause these crank shaft bearings to fail.
Another problem is the Dykes rings used in our 2-strokes. The longevity and maintenance
schedule for these engines was very carefully arrived at at _only_ the
suggested oil mixture of 50:1 (premix).
Normally, a Dykes does it's own decarb of the ring land as it moves in and out
of the ring groove during operation. With too much oil, however, this can be interfered
with causing premature sticking of this ring with the obvious disastrous
results.
Usually it's the lower ring that starts to stick first and this was the original
reason for the suggested 50 hour decarb schedule by Rotax. With the correct
oil mix, however, we can go 150 or more reliably before having to do a teardown
and decarb.
With too much oil, you're putting yourself in very dangerous territory here not
to mention all the other problems associated with doing that.
Motorcycle experience does NOT translate automatically to safe advice on a 2-stroke
on an _airplane_. The applications are _different_ and we have to be very
careful about where we get our advice on this like I said.
It's unfortunate that some had to get all riled up at being corrected on this.
For that personal issue I suggest going to a good friend, relative, pastor etc.
for solace and or guidance. That's not my problem.
Keeping someone's airplane out of the dirt or worse when I can help with that,
tho, I'll go ahead and make the leap there.....
The excessive oil use thing is one of these. Let's be careful out there guys.
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249083#249083
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
----- Original Message -----
From: "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 8:36 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Rotax 503 running problem
>
>
> John Hauck wrote:
>>
>> Somewhere along the line I remember, either a Shell engineer or during
>> one
>> of Eric Tucker's Rotax engine courses, that operating with too much oil
>> is
>> detrimental to Rotax two strokes in many ways. One way is crank shaft
>> bearings which are designed to operate at a certain level of oil in the
>> crank case. Too much oil can cause these crank shaft bearings to fail.
>
>
> Another problem is the Dykes rings used in our 2-strokes. The longevity
> and maintenance schedule for these engines was very carefully arrived at
> at _only_ the suggested oil mixture of 50:1 (premix).
>
> Normally, a Dykes does it's own decarb of the ring land as it moves in and
> out of the ring groove during operation. With too much oil, however, this
> can be interfered with causing premature sticking of this ring with the
> obvious disastrous results.
>
> Usually it's the lower ring that starts to stick first and this was the
> original reason for the suggested 50 hour decarb schedule by Rotax. With
> the correct oil mix, however, we can go 150 or more reliably before having
> to do a teardown and decarb.
>
> With too much oil, you're putting yourself in very dangerous territory
> here not to mention all the other problems associated with doing that.
>
> Motorcycle experience does NOT translate automatically to safe advice on a
> 2-stroke on an _airplane_. The applications are _different_ and we have to
> be very careful about where we get our advice on this like I said.
>
> It's unfortunate that some had to get all riled up at being corrected on
> this. For that personal issue I suggest going to a good friend, relative,
> pastor etc. for solace and or guidance. That's not my problem.
>
> Keeping someone's airplane out of the dirt or worse when I can help with
> that, tho, I'll go ahead and make the leap there.....
>
> The excessive oil use thing is one of these. Let's be careful out there
> guys.
>
> LS
>
> --------
> LS
> Titan II SS
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249083#249083
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
>we have to be very careful about where we get our advice on this like I
said.
> LS
> Titan II SS
I'll agree with the above. Most of us, on this List, are known only from
what we post, not what we have actually done and do.
john h
mkIII - 2,950+ hours
912ULS - 389 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
John Hauck wrote:
>
>
>
> I'll agree with the above. Most of us, on this List, are known only from
> what we post, not what we have actually done and do.
>
> john h
> mkIII - 2,950+ hours
> 912ULS - 389 hours
Absolutely, 100% correct.
In fact, for the 2-stroke experience I've given here, it's easy to verify independently. If anyone is so inclined, one of the best resources is Mark Smith at tristate kite sales (www.trikite.com). He's the most experienced repairman and operator of the Rotax 2-stroke line of engines in the US and probably the whole world. He started flying/maintaining 2-strokes, Rotax and others, in the late 70's and is still flying and working on them regularly today.
He'll give you the right scoop on the 503.
I've followed his advice on them religiously and sure enough accumulated about
10 years of great flying under/in front of the 447 and 503's with only one engine
out with the 447 (wiring error on my part) and not so much as a hiccup out
of the 503.
So again noone has to believe me, and in fact I'd be smart not to take my experience
at face value anyway. There're lots of other resources to draw from to
confirm my experience.
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249103#249103
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
online group therapy>> I like that
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Ultrastar: How to take-off |
| From: | "GeoB" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net> |
> was once by mistake overloaded with fuel.
I believe this was early post-war, in a B-17. He was overloaded with fuel AND un-weighed
cargo made up of weapons and other iron materials. The problem was disorganization
and working with untrained Indian ground crews who threw stuff
on until it looked about right. I don't know why he tried to take off with all
of that. Seems foolish. But I assume he was young and immortal. Reading the piece
made my tummy feel funny.
--------
GeoB
"Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers,
so we could identify their corporate sponsors"
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249121#249121
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
I like the direction this thread has started to move in.
Because I told you so has never been reason enough for me.
I prefer to understand why.
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Projection, A simple and interesting Psychological concept
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249127#249127
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
> I like the direction this thread has started to move in.
> Because I told you so has never been reason enough for me.
> I prefer to understand why.
>
> --------
> Dale Whelan
Experience is not gained behind the keyboard and monitor unless you are
striving to improve your computer skills.
john h
mkIII - Loaded up and on the way to see Brother Jim in Woodville, FL. Not
flying this trip, but pulling the 5th wheel at 70 mph, hopefully.
Haven't had a chance to improve my flying experience since I
landed from my flight out West three weeks ago today. Gosh, seems like 6
months.
I'm ready to go again. ;-)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
I am listening attentively here. I will be flying in short order a cayuna 430 which
is running good now on 35-40 to 1 mixture. sort bounced around in the Ultrlight
this morning. I will need to put about 6 hours without any stoppages to
satisfy a deal for some survey work. The advice I am getting here is to remain
on 40/1 mixture that Cayuna recommended.
I guess I'll stick with that. Is there anything none exotic that I can get at Walmart
that will do the job, or do I need to get some special oil. I think I read
in the past that Pennzoil something or other is the recommended oil, is that
so?
Ron @ KFHU
========================
---- lucien wrote:
============
John Hauck wrote:
>
>
>
> I'll agree with the above. Most of us, on this List, are known only from
> what we post, not what we have actually done and do.
>
> john h
> mkIII - 2,950+ hours
> 912ULS - 389 hours
Absolutely, 100% correct.
In fact, for the 2-stroke experience I've given here, it's easy to verify independently. If anyone is so inclined, one of the best resources is Mark Smith at tristate kite sales (www.trikite.com). He's the most experienced repairman and operator of the Rotax 2-stroke line of engines in the US and probably the whole world. He started flying/maintaining 2-strokes, Rotax and others, in the late 70's and is still flying and working on them regularly today.
He'll give you the right scoop on the 503.
I've followed his advice on them religiously and sure enough accumulated about
10 years of great flying under/in front of the 447 and 503's with only one engine
out with the 447 (wiring error on my part) and not so much as a hiccup out
of the 503.
So again noone has to believe me, and in fact I'd be smart not to take my experience
at face value anyway. There're lots of other resources to draw from to
confirm my experience.
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249103#249103
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mark rinehart <capt_riney(at)yahoo.com> |
Mike Bigelow - is that Kiev prop still for sale? I just bought a 582 for my Kolb
Mark III and am looking for a prop.
Mark Rinehart
capt_riney(at)yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
Yeah,
Its still for sale, send me a PM.
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249176#249176
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: sweltering summer |
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
They sneak up on you, and also have a way of building rapidly from nothing when
they have friends in the area. I have been chased back to the field a couple
times to land in a bunch of wind and turbulence as one built from nothing one
evening.
1000 feet, did you take your oxygen with you crystal ;) I think I go that high
in the pattern just to stay legal, but I never stay that high long enough to
get cool or hypoxia ! My Kolb is really happy flying around 10 feet over the
middle of nowhere like John W. used to do in his videos. Glad to hear you having
a good time, thats what its all about.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249178#249178
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
Try putting five gallons of diesel in it sometime.
I did that once when I used the wrong "green" handle at
the gas station where they have both gas & diesel
at the same pump and I had a hangover. Of course I had already added the
requisite amount of oil to the can so .............. don't know
what mixture that might have been.
The sucker started and smoked like a mosquito fogger. But it ran.
I finally figured out what I had done after about five minutes
of smoking up half the county. I actually think it
helped lube up the bearings, but you could never rev it up
high enough to take off.
>
>To oil ratio I think giving it a bit more oil will improve its
>reliability. I guess you can wonder if there is any point to it, to
>make more smoke and less power. Once you reach the point where the
>motor gets all the lube it needs then we ain't doing it anymore good
>tossing more oil into it.
>We just need to be careful.
>
>Ron @ KFHU
>-===========================================================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
Thanks for the laugh. :-)
Ron @ KFHU
=================
---- possums wrote:
============
Try putting five gallons of diesel in it sometime.
I did that once when I used the wrong "green" handle at
the gas station where they have both gas & diesel
at the same pump and I had a hangover. Of course I had already added the
requisite amount of oil to the can so .............. don't know
what mixture that might have been.
The sucker started and smoked like a mosquito fogger. But it ran.
I finally figured out what I had done after about five minutes
of smoking up half the county. I actually think it
helped lube up the bearings, but you could never rev it up
high enough to take off.
>
>To oil ratio I think giving it a bit more oil will improve its
>reliability. I guess you can wonder if there is any point to it, to
>make more smoke and less power. Once you reach the point where the
>motor gets all the lube it needs then we ain't doing it anymore good
>tossing more oil into it.
>We just need to be careful.
>
>Ron @ KFHU
>-===========================================================
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brad Stump <sky-king(at)inbox.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
Sounds like you had plenty of lubrication.LOL I have found that in this world,we
should learn from other peoples mistakes,most safety rules are put in place
because someone else has been hurt or killed.If you play bt the rules than most
of the time you will be fine.BTW "can't we all just get along"
> -----Original Message-----
> From: possums(at)bellsouth.net
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Rotax 503 running problem
>
>
> Try putting five gallons of diesel in it sometime.
> I did that once when I used the wrong "green" handle at
> the gas station where they have both gas & diesel
> at the same pump and I had a hangover. Of course I had already added the
> requisite amount of oil to the can so .............. don't know
> what mixture that might have been.
>
> The sucker started and smoked like a mosquito fogger. But it ran.
> I finally figured out what I had done after about five minutes
> of smoking up half the county. I actually think it
> helped lube up the bearings, but you could never rev it up
> high enough to take off.
>
>
>
>
>>
> >To oil ratio I think giving it a bit more oil will improve its
> >reliability. I guess you can wonder if there is any point to it, to
> >make more smoke and less power. Once you reach the point where the
> >motor gets all the lube it needs then we ain't doing it anymore good
> >tossing more oil into it.
> >We just need to be careful.
>>
> >Ron @ KFHU
> >-===========================================================
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
[quote="John Hauck"]> I like the direction this thread has started to move in.
> Because I told you so has never been reason enough for me.
> I prefer to understand why.
>
> --------
> Dale Whelan
>
>
Experience is not gained behind the keyboard and monitor unless you are
striving to improve your computer skills.
I am sorry but I am not sure what you are trying to say.
You quoted me but I don't see the continuity to your response.
Just to clear the air I am not riled up and on a scale of 1 to 10 the most I have
been on this board is about 1.5.
I can question people without being riled up.
Are you saying the only place to improve my flying skills is flying my plane?
Are you saying you are tired of hearing from me?
Didcompletelytly miss what you were trying to say?
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Projection, A simple and interesting Psychological concept
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249224#249224
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
> You quoted me but I don't see the continuity to your response.
> --------
> Dale Whelan
Dale:
My screw up. Was not intended to reference your post.
Sorry about that.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: sweltering summer |
| From: | "cristalclear13" <cristalclearwaters(at)gmail.com> |
JetPilot wrote:
>
> 1000 feet, did you take your oxygen with you crystal ;) I think I go that high
in the pattern just to stay legal, but I never stay that high long enough
to get cool or hypoxia ! My Kolb is really happy flying around 10 feet over
the middle of nowhere like John W. used to do in his videos. Glad to hear you
having a good time, thats what its all about.
>
> Mike
Our "middle of nowheres" are nothing but pine trees and swamp. I prefer to stay
high to be able to get to some landing point if need be. Besides, I love heights.
I love to get on a high mountain (of which we have none for hundreds of
miles) and look out across the valley to the towns and countryside below. Flying
gives me that same pleasure. I've always loved and collected miniature
things and the earth looks so miniature from 1000+ feet. I love it when the trains
(of which we have tons here in Waycross) are moving around while I'm up
flying. It makes the earth look like a miniature train set. The cows and horses
appear so small you almost can't tell them apart. Coming in for a landing
today I saw some baby goats jumping around in a field. So cute.
I went to the airport early and went up for a bit but it was already getting pretty
bumpy and it was oh so hot and humid. Had a small piece of metal on the
corner of my windscreen/door break. It is too hot to work on it. After having
some cake and ice cream with some pilots at the airport, I left and noticed
the temperature at Walgreens said 100. My car confirmed it (see pic). Feels
worse than that with the humidity. Maybe it's just getting us ready for summer
so that 90-95 won't feel so bad.
Wish I had 2000 dollars to buy one of those big outdoor air conditioning units
they sell at Tractor Supply. I'd put one in my hanger and work on the little
squawks that are beginning to annoy me.
--------
Cristal Waters
Kolb Mark II Twinstar
Rotax 503 DCSI
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249249#249249
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/june_20th_100_degrees_662.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: sweltering summer |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
[quote="cristalclear13"]
JetPilot wrote:
>
>
> Our "middle of nowheres" are nothing but pine trees and swamp. I prefer to stay
high to be able to get to some landing point if need be. Besides, I love
heights. I love to get on a high mountain (of which we have none for hundreds
of miles) and look out across the valley to the towns and countryside below.
Flying gives me that same pleasure.
Ah, so nice to hear of another pilot that prefers the "up" experience to the "over
there" one ;).
Most of my flying miles are vertical and few are horizontal. Flying for me is like
a science fiction transporter, with this little machine literally taking me
to another world. The higher up I go, the further into that other existence
I go.
I've lost count of the routine trips to someplace X I've cancelled in favor of
going up because the cloud formations were particularly good at my takeoff point.
My routine mission nowadays is at least 2000' AGL. The only reason I don't
go higher at the moment is the 10,000' MSL limit (barely 3000' AGL around here).
Never got much of a charge out of long grinding xcountries, or low flight over
the ground. Seems I always just use the pickup for that experience. Can't explain
it.
The plane, tho, is for taking me up up and up....
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249286#249286
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: sweltering summer |
> Never got much of a charge out of long grinding xcountries, or low flight
> over the ground. Seems I always just use the pickup for that experience.
> Can't explain it.
>
> The plane, tho, is for taking me up up and up....
>
> LS
Maybe you don't know how to enjoy a good, long cross country flight.
Did you know you can fly high, low, or any where in between, in a Kolb?
Did you know there are some beautiful cloud formations encountered on almost
every long cross country flight?
Did you know you can encounter some of the most beautiful early mornings
flying over the mountains of Arkansas, North Carolina, Virginia, Kentucky,
when the ground fog is in the valleys, the air is crisp and clear without a
single bump in it anywhere?
Do you know of the excitement of flying nap of the earth for miles and miles
of desert, watching antelop, coyote, mustangs, jack rabbits, in their
element?
Have you discovered a herd of elk in a meadow above 10,000 feet where the
snow is still in the shadows, and the valley is 100F?
Do you know the challenge of making decisions to get yourself across the
Rockies when the weather is not the best it could be?
Have you shared the above, with your flying friends, after a long day of
flying, sitting around the airplanes and tents, waiting to go to bed, get up
and do it again tomorrow?
There's a lot more to flying cross country in a Kolb aircraft than grinding
out the miles. My questions, above, only scratch the surface.
Last month I, and a lot of my buddies, experienced all the above and much,
much more. Some of us do it every year, at least.
Sorry you get tired of hearing of cross country flying. If you hang around
the Kolb List you are prone to hear a lot more of it.
john h
mkIII
Woodville, Florida, without my Kolb.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: sweltering summer |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
John Hauck wrote:
>
> Maybe you don't know how to enjoy a good, long cross country flight.
>
No, just don't enjoy it a great deal. I've done a lot of it, mostly back in my
GA days, just doesn't float my boat. Done it since then, in my FSII and a hefty
one in the titan. Still doesn't. Couldn't tell you why.
[/quote]
Sorry you get tired of hearing of cross country flying. If you hang around
the Kolb List you are prone to hear a lot more of it.
john h
mkIII
Woodville, Florida, without my Kolb.[/quote]
Who said I'm tired of hearing about xcountry flying?
Just because I'm an "up" man, doesn't mean all you "over there" guys are doing
it wrong (or vice versa ;)). I love to hear about em, keep em coming!
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249311#249311
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
Can anyone give me the estimated or actual fuel burn with a Cuyuna 430, and the
usual cruise speed for a Pterodactyl the one with the canard in front of it.
Same thing with a Rotax 440 and Eipper MX the single surface old vintage type?
Thanks
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
I lost your phone no,Call again when you`re free..
Hi Vince,
01225 783450.
Bloody annoyed at the moment. Been out on a Rotary junket all day. I
relised that Kemble Air Day was on but I have just heard the the Vulcan
was scheduled to be there.
Damn and blast
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eugene Zimmerman <etzimm(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
2 gal per hr. @ 35 / 45 cruise, 55 mph vne.
On Jun 21, 2009, at 11:36 AM, Ron @ KFHU wrote:
> Can anyone give me the estimated or actual fuel burn with a Cuyuna
> 430, and the usual cruise speed for a Pterodactyl the one with the
> canard in front of it.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | robert bean <slyck(at)frontiernet.net> |
I understand completely. I saw the Vulcan fly at Toronto a few years
back. Mighty impressive.
Nothing like it.
BB
On 21, Jun 2009, at 1:39 PM, pj.ladd wrote:
> I lost your phone no,Call again when you`re free..
>
> Hi Vince,
>
> 01225 783450.
>
> Bloody annoyed at the moment. Been out on a Rotary junket all day.
> I relised that Kemble Air Day was on but I have just heard the the
> Vulcan was scheduled to be there.
> Damn and blast
>
> Pat
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net> |
| Subject: | Father's Day Flight |
Kolbers,
Had a very pleasant flight from Winchester 35 miles south to Connersville,
Indiana to Connersville Airport Father's Day event. Saw a few of the
Hargerstown, EAA Chapter members there. Some antiques, may be ten
experimentals, one life line helicopter, but mostly ga aircraft flew in.
The FireFly was the only ultralight vehicle. Lots of kids to look at the
FireFly and parents to encourage to let their kids learn to fly.
I have made some changes to the air fuel mixture control. I kept moving the
high pressure reference point around to try an find a stable source. But
things would happen that I could not figure out why they happened and so I
installed a positive dynamic pressure probe in the carburetor inlet. This
has proved to be a better pressure source in that as one retards the
throttle or opens the throttle the positive pressure follows the throttle
position. I was worried that may be the pressure could become too high and
run the engine so rich it would quit, but that has not been the case.
For what ever reason, and I have not completely rationalized what is going
on, but I can change throttle settings, and I do not have to readjust EGT.
Also, if I nose the FireFly down and unload the propeller, I do not see and
EGT increase. It is very stable.
Burned 1.81 gallons per hour, cruising at 50 to 55 mph gps and burned 2.61
gallons over 70 miles with two take off and landings for 26.8 gpm average
point to point.
Ready to start taking data on the air filter scoop.
I hope you had as good a Father's Day as I have had.
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | daniel myers <h20maule(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
I know a guy that had a pterodactyl on floats...flew it everywhere
Daniel Myers
FSII Seaplane
> From: etzimm(at)gmail.com
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl
> Date: Sun=2C 21 Jun 2009 14:50:04 -0400
>
> 2 gal per hr. @ 35 / 45 cruise=2C 55 mph vne.
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
Microsoft brings you a new way to search the web. Try Bing=99 now
http://www.bing.com?form=MFEHPG&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MFEHPG_Core_ta
gline_try bing_1x1
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
Thanks
That's exactly what I need, and from the picture it looks like the bird I am flying
has the bungee cords on the wrong end. I have no tach or any instruments
yet. I'll be using my G-295 for everything else on a Ram Mount when I need to
get somewhere.
=================================================
---- Eugene Zimmerman wrote:
============
2 gal per hr. @ 35 / 45 cruise, 55 mph vne.
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Denny Rowe" <rowedenny(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
> Can anyone give me the estimated or actual fuel burn with a Cuyuna 430,
> and the usual cruise speed for a Pterodactyl the one with the canard in
> front of it.
>
> Same thing with a Rotax 440 and Eipper MX the single surface old vintage
> type?
>
> Thanks
Ron,
The Dac Ascender with the 430 Cuyuna burns 2 to 2.5 gph max, likes to cruise
from 40 to 50 mph. I sold my old Pterodactyl to a friend that still flies
it with a J-bird supplied 440 Kawasaki and belt drive, he burns about 1.5
gph at 55mph+ but he clipped three feet off each wing.
The MX will burn quite a bit more and go a lot slower.
Denny Rowe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eugene Zimmerman <etzimm(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Father's Day Flight |
On Jun 21, 2009, at 5:01 PM, Jack B. Hart wrote:
> Burned 1.81 gallons per hour, cruising at 50 to 55 mph gps and
> burned 2.61
> gallons over 70 miles with two take off and landings for 26.8 gpm
> average
> point to point.
Jack, Is that 26.8 gallon per minute, or gallon per mile?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
thanks
The one I have is basically a loaner. It was in pieces in a shop got it assembled
and the Cuyuna fired up after some tugging on the cord. It must have been inop
for about 5 years or more. Yesterday I test flew a Rotax 440 on an Eipper
MX. What a racket it makes. I can fly on the Cuyuna at low power without ear plugs,
not so with the Rotax. That alone is enough for me to favor the Cuyuna motor.
Any other advice for flying the duck?
=================================================
---- Denny Rowe wrote:
============
> Can anyone give me the estimated or actual fuel burn with a Cuyuna 430,
> and the usual cruise speed for a Pterodactyl the one with the canard in
> front of it.
>
> Same thing with a Rotax 440 and Eipper MX the single surface old vintage
> type?
>
> Thanks
Ron,
The Dac Ascender with the 430 Cuyuna burns 2 to 2.5 gph max, likes to cruise
from 40 to 50 mph. I sold my old Pterodactyl to a friend that still flies
it with a J-bird supplied 440 Kawasaki and belt drive, he burns about 1.5
gph at 55mph+ but he clipped three feet off each wing.
The MX will burn quite a bit more and go a lot slower.
Denny Rowe
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Denny Rowe" <rowedenny(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
>
> thanks
> The one I have is basically a loaner. It was in pieces in a shop got it
> assembled and the Cuyuna fired up after some tugging on the cord. It must
> have been inop for about 5 years or more. Yesterday I test flew a Rotax
> 440 on an Eipper MX. What a racket it makes. I can fly on the Cuyuna at
> low power without ear plugs, not so with the Rotax. That alone is enough
> for me to favor the Cuyuna motor.
>
> Any other advice for flying the duck?
>
>
It aint the engines, its the airframes, the Ascender is a very low drag bird
compared to the MX.
Dacs are very pitch sensitive so don,t ham fist the stick, if you have the
nose down, get off the power or you will overspeed it in a hurry!
Like someone else said, the VNE is 55, you will get there in a hurry with
the nose down so beware.
PRACTICE IN NO CROSS WINDS they don't like cross winds.
Denny Rowe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chris davis <capedavis(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
Is that noisy engine a 440 Kawsaki or a Rotax 447?-- chris=0A=0A=0A=0A
=0A________________________________=0AFrom: "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.n
et>=0ATo: kolb-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Sunday, June 21, 2009 10:28:26 PM
=0ASubject: Re: Kolb-List: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl=0A=0A--> Kolb-List me
ssage posted by: "Ron- @- KFHU" =0A=0Athanks=0AThe
one I have is basically a loaner. It was in pieces in a shop got it assemb
led and the Cuyuna fired up after some tugging on the cord. It must have be
en inop for about 5 years or more. Yesterday I test flew a Rotax 440 on an
Eipper MX. What a racket it makes. I can fly on the Cuyuna at low power wit
hout ear plugs, not so with the Rotax. That alone is enough for me to favor
the Cuyuna motor.=0A=0AAny other advice for flying the duck?=0A=0A==
========================0A=0A
=0A=0A---- Denny Rowe wrote: =0A=0A====
=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A> Can anyone give me the estimate
d or actual fuel burn with a Cuyuna 430, =0A> and the usual cruise speed fo
r a Pterodactyl the one with the canard in =0A> front of it.=0A>=0A> Same t
hing with a Rotax 440 and Eipper MX the single surface old vintage =0A> typ
e?=0A>=0A> Thanks=0A=0A=0ARon,=0AThe Dac Ascender with the 430 Cuyuna burns
2 to 2.5 gph max, likes to cruise =0Afrom 40 to 50 mph.- I sold my old P
terodactyl to a friend that still flies =0Ait with a J-bird supplied 440 Ka
wasaki and belt drive, he burns about 1.5 =0Agph at 55mph+ but he clipped t
hree feet off each wing.=0AThe MX will burn quite a bit more and go a lot s
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -Matt Dralle, L
=========0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark" <mshimei(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
Not that this was the intent of this thread but, Is there anyone on this
board
other than myself that has tried running more than the recommended
amount of
oil and willing to share with me what they found.
Just for fun, even though I have no inclination to do so, is there
anyone on
this
board that has run less oil than 50:1, ( I once saw a company claim you
could
run their oil at 150:1) If so would you share your results with me?
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
I had a Phantom with a Kawasaki 440....got some "advice" from
J-Bird......He
claimed it needed to be mixed at 20:1 or it will burn up.
So I did.
In 30 hours the rings had so much carbon packed in them it pushed them
out
into the ports,,,not a good thing.Landed (glided)on the airfield,took it
apart and was surprised at what was in there.Carbon in the
ports,exhaust,etc.I also found my gauges were not very
accurate..replaced
them.
Got another used engine with 100+ hours on it,mixed 50:1,,,,,Havoline or
Penzoil,,,,and put 260 hours on that one and then sold the plane.No
problems
with fouling,ring sticking,etc.and never de-carboned it.Ran the same
from
the day I installed it,to when I last flew it.
My friend flew his SE-5A with a Cuyuna for over 300 hours,50:1,Amsoil 2
stroke.Replaced it with something else when it just quit running.Think
it
was a gearbox problem.
Mark ...Ultrastar, UL2 26 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Father's Day Flight |
>
>Jack, Is that 26.8 gallon per minute, or gallon per mile?
>
You got it figured out. I must have hit an inversion.
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
Dale,
Your accident would not have happened if you had VG's on your Firestar. The difference
VG's make on a Kolb are nothing short of miraculous, especially in the
conditions you describe. On my MK III Xtra, I get a full 10 MPH reduction on
stall, but that is not the best part. Low speed handling and response is just
amazing. I used to feel like the plane was mushing and that I was on the edge
of control if I got much below 60 MPH in the pattern, now I can do turns at
40 MPH, and it feels perfect. At a weight of 1000 pounds I can do power off
approaches holding 50 MPH and get a greaser landing out of it, never touching
the power. None of this was possible before my plane had VG's.
Your practicing for engine failures is a good thing, you will be ready and know
how to react properly when the time comes. Having a plane that is much more
capable of flying well and landing at slower speeds will also improve your safety
by a large margin if your engine ever quits.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249527#249527
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
Sorry that was a Rotax, 447 first time ever with one of them, I flew a buddy's
2 seater MX with a 582 (?) and it too was pretty loud, most likely its the muffler
design, I would guess. Its okay with a helmet and ear plugs.
---- chris davis wrote:
============
Is that noisy engine a 440 Kawsaki or a Rotax 447? chris
________________________________
From: "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net>
Sent: Sunday, June 21, 2009 10:28:26 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl
thanks
The one I have is basically a loaner. It was in pieces in a shop got it assembled
and the Cuyuna fired up after some tugging on the cord. It must have been inop
for about 5 years or more. Yesterday I test flew a Rotax 440 on an Eipper
MX. What a racket it makes. I can fly on the Cuyuna at low power without ear plugs,
not so with the Rotax. That alone is enough for me to favor the Cuyuna motor.
Any other advice for flying the duck?
========================
---- Denny Rowe wrote:
============
> Can anyone give me the estimated or actual fuel burn with a Cuyuna 430,
> and the usual cruise speed for a Pterodactyl the one with the canard in
> front of it.
>
> Same thing with a Rotax 440 and Eipper MX the single surface old vintage
> type?
>
> Thanks
Ron,
The Dac Ascender with the 430 Cuyuna burns 2 to 2.5 gph max, likes to cruise
from 40 to 50 mph. I sold my old Pterodactyl to a friend that still flies
it with a J-bird supplied 440 Kawasaki and belt drive, he burns about 1.5
gph at 55mph+ but he clipped three feet off each wing.
The MX will burn quite a bit more and go a lot s -Matt Dralle, L=======
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
captainron1(at)cox.net wrote:
> Yesterday I test flew a Rotax 440 on an Eipper MX. What a racket it makes. I
can fly on the Cuyuna at low power without ear plugs, not so with the Rotax.
That alone is enough for me to favor the Cuyuna motor.
>
> Any other advice for flying the duck?
>
>
The Rotax 447 is a far Superior motor to the Cuyuna. I like quiet motors, but
I am not convinced that the cuyuna is quieter than the Rotax 447. You tried a
Rotax on a Qucksilver, a horrible and draggy airplane that takes a huge amount
of power to keep it in the air. It may be that the airplane and its installation
has as much an impact on the noise as the motor itself.
Either way, I would not fly with an such unreliable and touchy motor as the Cuyuna
, noise or not... Not having in flight engine failures is far more important
than noise, and I have my doubts as to weather this is even the case or not.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249571#249571
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
JetPilot wrote:
>
> captainron1(at)cox.net wrote:
> >
> >
>
>
> The Rotax 447 is a far Superior motor to the Cuyuna. I like quiet motors, but
I am not convinced that the cuyuna is quieter than the Rotax 447. You tried
a Rotax on a Qucksilver, a horrible and draggy airplane that takes a huge amount
of power to keep it in the air. It may be that the airplane and its installation
has as much an impact on the noise as the motor itself.
>
> Either way, I would not fly with an such unreliable and touchy motor as the Cuyuna
, noise or not... Not having in flight engine failures is far more important
than noise, and I have my doubts as to weather this is even the case or
not.
>
> Mike
One of the problems with the Cuyuna, according to a guy who's flown it a bunch,
is the axial cooling. The cooling air for the rear cylinder goes through the
fins of the front one first, making the rear cylinder tend to run hot. He said
in continuous high power operation this could shorten the life of the rear cylinder
quite a bit or even lead to overheating.
The Rotax aircooled motors of course don't suffer from this as they use well-designed
shrouds that cool the cylinders more or less equally (ironically, it tends
to be the PTO cylinder that runs cooler).
The 447 is my other favorite 2-stroke besides the 503, as it's the simplest of
the lot and still runs reliably (long as you wire it right like I didn't do one
time). It's only problem is it tends to run hotter than the 503, being a suped-up
377 with not a whole lot of cooling fin area. But it can still do continuous
high power..... just runs a little warm doing it up in the 350F range.....
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249576#249576
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
At 04:04 PM 6/22/2009, you wrote:
>
>
>One of the problems with the Cuyuna, according to a guy who's flown
>it a bunch, is the axial cooling. The cooling air for the rear
>cylinder goes through the fins of the front one first, making the
>rear cylinder tend to run hot. He said in continuous high power
>operation this could shorten the life of the rear cylinder quite a
>bit or even lead to overheating.
We used to cut a couple of the fins off the front cylinder
to fix the problem.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
> Your accident would not have happened if you had VG's on your Firestar.
The difference VG's make on a Kolb are nothing short of miraculous,
especially in the conditions you describe.
>
> Mike
No kidding!
How did you come up with this profound statement?
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
:-)
I have no idea, some of you guys spent way more time than me in those contraptions.
So if you say a Rotax is preferable to a Cuyana ( have you ever noticed
how both of them have weird and unusual names) I go along with it. All I can say
I gotta fly the contraption I have as its the only one readily available for
the job. I wish I had some late model super gizmo with the latest things, but
alas .....
=====================================
---- JetPilot wrote:
============
captainron1(at)cox.net wrote:
> Yesterday I test flew a Rotax 440 on an Eipper MX. What a racket it makes. I
can fly on the Cuyuna at low power without ear plugs, not so with the Rotax.
That alone is enough for me to favor the Cuyuna motor.
>
> Any other advice for flying the duck?
>
>
The Rotax 447 is a far Superior motor to the Cuyuna. I like quiet motors, but
I am not convinced that the cuyuna is quieter than the Rotax 447. You tried a
Rotax on a Qucksilver, a horrible and draggy airplane that takes a huge amount
of power to keep it in the air. It may be that the airplane and its installation
has as much an impact on the noise as the motor itself.
Either way, I would not fly with an such unreliable and touchy motor as the Cuyuna
, noise or not... Not having in flight engine failures is far more important
than noise, and I have my doubts as to weather this is even the case or not.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249571#249571
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
> We had some yahoo ranting for seemed like for ever, like he knew more than
> any of the engineers at Rotax and you hardly gave him any of your wisdom.
> Yea I hope I don't get him started again. Then Mike makes a comment that
> might be a good safety suggestion and you zing him.
Rick:
I quoted what I was responding to:
> > Your accident would not have happened if you had VG's on your Firestar.
> The difference VG's make on a Kolb are nothing short of miraculous,
> especially in the conditions you describe.
>>
>> Mike
Still curious how Mike B knew VG's would have saved the ship.
Still waiting for someone to demonstrate to me how "miraculous VGs are".
Sorry your experienced friend has difficulty flying a FS. If VGs helped him
keep from breaking his FS, great. I haven't found a situation where I could
not live without them.
You are not reading what I was writing. I have never, nor will I ever bad
mouth VGs. I have flown a FS with them. I don't need them.
Please don't make me out as a bad guy. I do all right flying my airplanes
the way I prefer to.
I doubt I will fly to OSH.
Thanks,
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
I saw the Vulcan fly at Toronto >>
Hi Bob,
An incredible a/c. I saw her first at Farnborough Airshow. During the
previous years there had been a series of small, similarly shaped single
seaters built to explore the delta wing characteristics(It was a long
time ago) but on this occasion the three single seaters flew escort to
this massive bomber.
The flight was first seen at long distance as they waited for their
display entrance, Just glimpsed through the clouds. It reminded me of
that scene in `Shape of things to come` when the first flying machine
seen for years flies over the settlement. Heart stopping! When the
Vulcan, which hardly anyone knew existed, barrelled down the runway at
nought feet with the afterburners roaring. WOW!
When the Vulcan went to the States to take part in the bombing
competitions, which it won, the US put up an intercept shield. The
Vulcan crossed the coast, went knap of the earth, and no one saw her
again until she popped up to circuit height at the destination field.
Read Vulcan 403 (I think) for the story of how we managed to bomb the
Stanley airfield during the Falklands disagreement. If the Argies had
left it another two weeks the last of the Vulcan fleet would have been
out of service.
No one had experience of accurate bombing as the Vulcan was designed to
drop an atomic bomb where accuracy was not required and they had to dig
out an old Lancaster pilot from WW2 to brief the crew. We had no
experience of long distance raids and had to cobble together a fleet of
tankers and the Vulcan refuelling probes didn`t fit the kit. Museums
were raided and probes pinched from displays .One bit of kit was being
used as an ashtray in the Officers mess at one airfield. Typical Brit
lash up and muddle through, but it worked. Just!
The last remaining Vulcan is kept in the air by volunteers and public
gifts of money and she cannot go on indefinitely at around a million
pounds a year.
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Walter" <worrybear(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
----- Original Message -----
From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 3:26 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl
>
>
> captainron1(at)cox.net wrote:
>> Yesterday I test flew a Rotax 440 on an Eipper MX. What a racket it
>> makes. I
I have flown in front of a Cuyuna Ul202 for over 170 hours and Rotax
for over 100 hours. If the Cuyuna is jetted properly, Monitored for CHTs
and EGTs and is given a fuel system that is in good order I believe they are
just as reliable as the Rotax 377 and 477. My Ul202 quit as a result of a
blocked fuel filter and I know of another that quit due to a bad squeez
bulb, can't blame either on the engine.
I would rather fly a 4 cycle, but weight and price are a deal breaker.
Dan Walter
Ultrastar, Cuyuna
Palmyra, PA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
Hi guys, I have not yet tried VGs, but a friend has bought some for our planes.
There are reasons I question weather VGs would have helped in my situation.
I was not stalled, I was sinking.
I expect VGs would lower my stall, not sure they would stop the sink I was having
when I was not stalled.
I flew with a friend that has the same plane I do and has VG's. I think I remember
him losing altitude at speeds lower than my stall but I don't remember for
sure.
Set me straight if I have this wrong, seems to me the VGs big advantage is more
control (ailerons not stalled) and then second slightly more lift because wing
is no stalled.
Do I have this wrong? could I for instance climb at lower speeds than before?
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Projection, A simple and interesting Psychological concept
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249692#249692
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cuyuna oil, was: Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
At 07:38 PM 6/19/2009, Ron @ KFHU wrote:
>...The advice I am getting here is to remain on 40/1 mixture that Cayuna
>recommended.
>
>I guess I'll stick with that. Is there anything none exotic that I can get
>at Walmart that will do the job, or do I need to get some special oil. I
>think I read in the past that Pennzoil something or other is the
>recommended oil, is that so?
Ron, I'm using the "Pennzoil Air-Cooled 2-cycle oil" in my Cuyuna at the
recommended 40:1 ratio, as did the previous owner. Some people say "use
50:1, the oils are better today" but I'll stick with the factory
recommendation. Change oil ratio and you need to change jetting, too...
and the factory recommended jetting works, too.
Advance Auto Parts sells the Pennzoil but I usually buy it by the case from
<http://www.oil-store.com/>.
-Dana
--
Society is like a stew. If you don't keep it stirred up, you get a lot of
scum on top.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
At 03:26 PM 6/22/2009, JetPilot wrote:
>The Rotax 447 is a far Superior motor to the Cuyuna.... I would not fly
>with an such unreliable and touchy motor as the Cuyuna...
Everybody puts down the Cuyuna, but I have yet to see anything other than
anecdotal evidence that there's any significant difference in reliability
compared to the Rotax. Any 2-stroke engine needs proper care and
attention, and the Cuyunas gained their bad reputation in the early days of
ultralights when pilots raised on Continentals and others with no engine
experience at all didn't take proper care of them. If the 447 had been
around at the same time I'll bet it would have had the same [bad] reputation.
-Dana
--
Shotgun wedding: A case of wife or death.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | robert bean <slyck(at)frontiernet.net> |
I'm sure many of us have shared the experience of somehow making a
non-damaging landing out of
one that seemed only a second or two earlier to be sure catastrophe.
Part luck, part good responses,
part that wonderful ground effect cushion. Big heavies are also
subject to down drafts but less immediate
due to their mass. Watching a FF approach in gusty wind makes me
glad to have ole tubby, the MkIII.
I respect the atmosphere more than ever, especially now that I am
older and less bold.
But, if you do want to regain a feel for the plane after a period of
little flight you would do better going
out and wrestling the breezes than waiting for dead calm only.
BB, more of a sissy than I wuz
On 23, Jun 2009, at 12:35 PM, dalewhelan wrote:
>
>
> Hi guys, I have not yet tried VGs, but a friend has bought some for
> our planes.
> There are reasons I question weather VGs would have helped in my
> situation.
> I was not stalled, I was sinking.
> I expect VGs would lower my stall, not sure they would stop the
> sink I was having when I was not stalled.
> I flew with a friend that has the same plane I do and has VG's. I
> think I remember him losing altitude at speeds lower than my stall
> but I don't remember for sure.
> Set me straight if I have this wrong, seems to me the VGs big
> advantage is more control (ailerons not stalled) and then second
> slightly more lift because wing is no stalled.
> Do I have this wrong? could I for instance climb at lower speeds
> than before?
>
> --------
> Dale Whelan
> 503 powered Firestar II
> Projection, A simple and interesting Psychological concept
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249692#249692
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cuyuna oil, was: Re: Rotax 503 running problem |
| From: | "dalewhelan" <dalewhelan(at)earthlink.net> |
I hope I don't tick anybody off with this.
While it is true that adding oil leans the fuel mixture, and some have even tried
to change their jetting by altering fuel ratio. Changing from no oil premixed
to 20:1 changed the amount of fuel delivered by 5%
Changing from 50 to 20:1 changes your fuel by 3%
I am not sure how many ccs/ min a Bing jet like 158 flows, if you had your jetting
perfect to start with I would guess these oil changes would result in a change
of about 1 size.
I normally only jet to the closest main when I really want something to run, Some
people I know would get a half size by changing their coolant temp 5degrees
C Hotter=Richer
--------
Dale Whelan
503 powered Firestar II
Projection, A simple and interesting Psychological concept
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249739#249739
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
Well today I had the first real flight in the Cuyuana powered Duck got only about
15 miles from the strip I took off, when I had to put it down in a graded pre
construction job site. No problems at all. But the engine did not act well.
It look like there was bubbling right at the fuel filter. Maybe it has an air
leak. got it trailed the rest of the way to my hanger, now I got a nice place
to work on it but little time. We also found a length wise crack in the wood
prop. Its a two blader prop 54 inch long and the hub thickness is 4cm, I tried
measuring in inches but could not get a round number. Anyway I need a new prop
( like yesterday). It looks like a 2/1 reduction belt drive with a 4 bolt pattern
and its counter clock turning.
If anyone has one of these laying around and wants to sell it FedEx overnight contact
me offline.
Any ideas as to why the motor spattered when I advanced the prop to gull power
would be appreciated. Would a fuel pump do that? air leak in the line, too rich
a jetting?
It run okay kinda in mid power setting but when I gave it full power it did okay
for a while and then started chocking. I got one day or so to get it straightened
out.
Do we have any Kolbers in Tucson or the area that can fly a 60 mile track using
GPS way points out of KFHU Thursday and Friday. You want to have some fun and
make some money let me know. One way or another the job gotta be done.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net> |
At 12:35 PM 6/23/2009, you wrote:
>
>Hi guys, I have not yet tried VGs, but a friend has bought some for
>our planes.
>There are reasons I question weather VGs would have helped in my situation.
>
>Do I have this wrong? could I for instance climb at lower speeds than before?
If you have $100 to spare, it will be the best $100 you have ever spent on
your plane. You can climb at an unbelievable angle at an unimaginable
low speed without stalling -----at least on a single seater (stall
reduced at least
5 or 6 mph, control increased - but you would have to experience
that part of to know what I'm talking about.)
This thread has been beaten to death.
If you don't want to reinvent the wheel, buy them from
www.landshorter.com
and use their templates and instructions to install them, they've
already done the work.
Most of these were shot with VGs and are all, of course, "Photo
shopped" and no ducks were killed
or injured and not eaten during the making of these films as per PETA
guidelines.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4600043392041186975
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8022448200127542755
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5232234046747826901
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2622632755661898541
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
| From: | "lucien" <lstavenhagen(at)hotmail.com> |
Dana wrote:
>
> Everybody puts down the Cuyuna, but I have yet to see anything other than
> anecdotal evidence that there's any significant difference in reliability
> compared to the Rotax. Any 2-stroke engine needs proper care and
> attention, and the Cuyunas gained their bad reputation in the early days of
> ultralights when pilots raised on Continentals and others with no engine
> experience at all didn't take proper care of them. If the 447 had been
> around at the same time I'll bet it would have had the same [bad] reputation.
>
> -Dana
>
> --
> Shotgun wedding: A case of wife or death.
The early days of 2-strokes were really tough on their reputation. The engines
themselves had their own problems, but the non-existent training/experience in
their use by primarily 4-stroke drivers was far and away the biggest problem.
At the time, they didn't know how to install em, prop em, jet em, fuel em and maintain
em. It was nothing like the big iron in any of these respects for sure.
Virtually all my experience is with the Rotax aircooled motors so don't know much
about the history of the Cuyuna. But the Rotax have gone through so many updates
since their early introduction that I've lost count. The biggest ones have
been improvements to the bottom end, particularly beefing up of the crank and
its bearings especially at the PTO end, the provision 4 and then 8 crankcases
for reliable mounting of the gearboxes, the move to CDI, and a bunch more smaller
changes here and there.
The other significant enhancement is the field experience, now in the decades range,
which tells us how to operate and maintain the motors.
The jetting charts, breakin procedures, lots of folks around who knew the "gotchas"
and there are a few here and there with all the Rotaxen.
That more than anything else has been the biggest improvement in the reliability
of the 2-strokes, in addition to the improvements of the motors themselves of
course.
All that said, the very early non-provision points Rotaxen did break cranks from
time to time, mostly on the quicksilver which used a hard coupling shaft attached
directly to the crank, making for a bit of a PR problem for Rotax. But by
the time of the provision 8 motors and the wide usage of the gearbox, this became
practically a thing of the past (except for the 582 which still is a bit
weak in the crankshaft area).
Not to mention all the experience we have with them, that has virtually eliminated
the 2-stroke troubles of the old days. But the bad rap lingers on, mostly
from folks who don't much experience running them or 4-stroke drivers trying to
use their old skills with them.
LS
--------
LS
Titan II SS
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249752#249752
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Thank you VGs - John's favorite subject |
>
>If you don't want to reinvent the wheel, buy them from
>www.landshorter.com
They are little bitty things, easy to apply & hard to see.
If I have a decent headwind, I can lower a beer to the guys on the
ground with a fishing line.
If the wind's just right, I can fly backwards.
If the wind's perfect I can just tie a rope to my plane & I don't
have to use the engine at all.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
Lol.
=================
---- possums wrote:
============
At 12:35 PM 6/23/2009, you wrote:
>
>Hi guys, I have not yet tried VGs, but a friend has bought some for
>our planes.
>There are reasons I question weather VGs would have helped in my situation.
>
>Do I have this wrong? could I for instance climb at lower speeds than before?
If you have $100 to spare, it will be the best $100 you have ever spent on
your plane. You can climb at an unbelievable angle at an unimaginable
low speed without stalling -----at least on a single seater (stall
reduced at least
5 or 6 mph, control increased - but you would have to experience
that part of to know what I'm talking about.)
This thread has been beaten to death.
If you don't want to reinvent the wheel, buy them from
www.landshorter.com
and use their templates and instructions to install them, they've
already done the work.
Most of these were shot with VGs and are all, of course, "Photo
shopped" and no ducks were killed
or injured and not eaten during the making of these films as per PETA
guidelines.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4600043392041186975
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8022448200127542755
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5232234046747826901
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2622632755661898541
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Thank you VGs - John's favorite subject |
Now if there ever was a target for a paint ball gun, that fat balloon (an I ain't
talking about Mellisa) was it.
===========================================
---- possums wrote:
============
>
>If you don't want to reinvent the wheel, buy them from
>www.landshorter.com
They are little bitty things, easy to apply & hard to see.
If I have a decent headwind, I can lower a beer to the guys on the
ground with a fishing line.
If the wind's just right, I can fly backwards.
If the wind's perfect I can just tie a rope to my plane & I don't
have to use the engine at all.
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Thank you VGs - John's favorite subject |
| From: | "ces308" <ces308(at)ldaco.com> |
That is the next thing going on my airplane !!!!Thank you for that report...although
I was already convinced.....
chris ambrose
M3X/Jab/ 28.5 hrs
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249757#249757
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carlo Tura" <ctura(at)politecnica.it> |
Hello to all,
I'm finally completed the reconstruction of my Mark II.
I'm Italian and I am speaking little English.
I wanted to ask a question.
If I put on the wings the VGs, the speed cruise increases or decreases?
Thank you
Charly
--------------------------------
Politecnica aderisce al progetto Impatto Zero di Lifegate "Compensate le emissioni
di co2 per i propri consumi di carta con la creazione di nuove foreste".
http://www.impattozero.it
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ted Cowan" <tc1917(at)bellsouth.net> |
I am going to step out in defense of the ole 202 cuyunna engine. I have had
three of them and I want to tell you this: I have never had one go out on
me or fail me because of something it did. It was all ME. I pushed it too
hard, bad fuel, lines, squeeze bulbs, plugs, argh. I have however, had the
supposed good ole rotax stop on me. I lost a crank with no sign of failure
and no real reason, it just seized. One of the little bearings was square I
guess and it went to lunch and took its buddies with them. I have had a
lots of fan belt problems with the rotax but cooling with the 20II was no
problem if you just kept it in its envelope. Never, I repeat, Never try to
outclimb a rotax with a 20II cause it is not the same and wont do it. So, I
guess apples and oranges. If you treat any engine correctly and stay within
its tolerances, you should have good luck with them. We are our worse
enemies. Ted Cowan, original firestar 447, kobra cuyunna, pterodactyl
cuyunna. Slingshot 912UL. By the way, I might have a fix for the rum rum
of the 912. I have to experiment on this concept and let you know. If it
is it, many will appreciate it. It might not be what we all throught it
might be. (hey, sounds like life, huh.)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
properly built Kolb with a qualified pilot doesnt need VG's>>
Hi Ellery,
2 points. From the flying point of view I don`t think anyone has claimed
that you NEED them. They just make things a bit easier.
Second point. In the UK with an Xtra you DO NEED them because you will
not be allowed to fly it as a microlight without them. With no VG`s you
cannot get the stall speed low enough to fit into the formula which must
be met to qualify as a legal microlight.
Horses for courses?
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
I>>
If I put on the wings the VGs, the speed cruise increases or decreases?
Charly
you will not notice any difference in the cruise but the stalling speed will
be lower by about 5mph
Pat
?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
Bubbling at the fuel filter: It could be an air leak, especially if you
use the screw type hose clamps which don't always seal all the way around
small tubes. Better to use safety wire. A bit of bubbling when the engine
is first started is normal, as any air and vapor in the line works its way
through. However, if there is any blockage upstream (happened to me on my
first flight in the US, a bad primer bulb), the suction can cause steady
stream of bubbles as the fuel boils into vapor.
Re sputtering: Not clear from your description. Is it running OK at full
throttle once it clears out, and do the plugs and EGT look OK? If so, it's
likely it's loading up at lower throttle settings, could be the needle clip
(raise the clip to lower the needle and lean out the midrange) or idle
adjustment screw. The jettings listed in the Cuyuna manual (they give a
chart of jet sizes according to altitude and temperature) are a good place
to start. Using fuel with ethanol may shift it slightly lean, so you may
need to go one jet size larger.
If the crack in the prop isn't too bad, you can fix it. Spread it slightly
and squirt some wood glue (yellow carpenter's glue) into it... then balance
it afterwards. I've seen some amazing prop repairs in the PPG world; some
of them go too far, I think, but they hold together.
-Dana
At 11:00 PM 6/23/2009, Ron @ KFHU wrote:
>Well today I had the first real flight in the Cuyuana powered Duck got
>only about 15 miles from the strip I took off, when I had to put it down
>in a graded pre construction job site. No problems at all. But the engine
>did not act well. It look like there was bubbling right at the fuel
>filter. Maybe it has an air leak. got it trailed the rest of the way to my
>hanger, now I got a nice place to work on it but little time. We also
>found a length wise crack in the wood prop. Its a two blader prop 54 inch
>long and the hub thickness is 4cm, I tried measuring in inches but could
>not get a round number. Anyway I need a new prop ( like yesterday). It
>looks like a 2/1 reduction belt drive with a 4 bolt pattern and its
>counter clock turning.
>If anyone has one of these laying around and wants to sell it FedEx
>overnight contact me offline.
>Any ideas as to why the motor spattered when I advanced the prop to gull
>power would be appreciated. Would a fuel pump do that? air leak in the
>line, too rich a jetting?
>It run okay kinda in mid power setting but when I gave it full power it
>did okay for a while and then started chocking. I got one day or so to get
>it straightened out.
--
A flying saucer results when a nudist spills his coffee.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
I have the bulb above the fuel filter ( the bulb is brand new from Aircraft Spruce,
the original was rot cracked, plugs are also brand new), and we did not
install it with hose clams at all. I have already taken care of that now. I have
it installed Fuel Tank, filter, bulb, pump, I also have yet to run the motor
to check and see if the problem is solved. All that stuff happened yesterday.
The bubbles start right at the fuel filter probably air was getting in that
area, and also was another bubble stream was getting in around the bulb. I think
this will be a none issue as I now have clamps there too.
-Sputtering; On take off it was good all the way to mid power, but no sooner I
cleared the strip it started bogging down I brought the power back and it seemed
to have gone away. But every time after that when I gave it opened throttle
more to get some more altitude it started bogging down again. It got to where
I could not maintain altitude about half way to where I was going. I hope its
just an air leak and nothing else, I am aware that I may have more than one
issue here, no idea about the history of this motor, even though it is very strong
when it is doing is thing at full throttle, for the few seconds that it does.
I never opened a Bing carb before and don't have the manual can you tell me about
the jetting in a bit more detail. Density Altitude around here is around 7-8K
this time of year.
If I screw the idle in is that more gas or less? Can't tell by moving it sounds
the same no matter what I do. I got it pretty far screwed in right now.
---- Dana Hague wrote:
============
Bubbling at the fuel filter: It could be an air leak, especially if you
use the screw type hose clamps which don't always seal all the way around
small tubes. Better to use safety wire. A bit of bubbling when the engine
is first started is normal, as any air and vapor in the line works its way
through. However, if there is any blockage upstream (happened to me on my
first flight in the US, a bad primer bulb), the suction can cause steady
stream of bubbles as the fuel boils into vapor.
Re sputtering: Not clear from your description. Is it running OK at full
throttle once it clears out, and do the plugs and EGT look OK? If so, it's
likely it's loading up at lower throttle settings, could be the needle clip
(raise the clip to lower the needle and lean out the midrange) or idle
adjustment screw. The jettings listed in the Cuyuna manual (they give a
chart of jet sizes according to altitude and temperature) are a good place
to start. Using fuel with ethanol may shift it slightly lean, so you may
need to go one jet size larger.
If the crack in the prop isn't too bad, you can fix it. Spread it slightly
and squirt some wood glue (yellow carpenter's glue) into it... then balance
it afterwards. I've seen some amazing prop repairs in the PPG world; some
of them go too far, I think, but they hold together.
-Dana
At 11:00 PM 6/23/2009, Ron @ KFHU wrote:
>Well today I had the first real flight in the Cuyuana powered Duck got
>only about 15 miles from the strip I took off, when I had to put it down
>in a graded pre construction job site. No problems at all. But the engine
>did not act well. It look like there was bubbling right at the fuel
>filter. Maybe it has an air leak. got it trailed the rest of the way to my
>hanger, now I got a nice place to work on it but little time. We also
>found a length wise crack in the wood prop. Its a two blader prop 54 inch
>long and the hub thickness is 4cm, I tried measuring in inches but could
>not get a round number. Anyway I need a new prop ( like yesterday). It
>looks like a 2/1 reduction belt drive with a 4 bolt pattern and its
>counter clock turning.
>If anyone has one of these laying around and wants to sell it FedEx
>overnight contact me offline.
>Any ideas as to why the motor spattered when I advanced the prop to gull
>power would be appreciated. Would a fuel pump do that? air leak in the
>line, too rich a jetting?
>It run okay kinda in mid power setting but when I gave it full power it
>did okay for a while and then started chocking. I got one day or so to get
>it straightened out.
--
A flying saucer results when a nudist spills his coffee.
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
> -Sputtering; On take off it was good all the way to mid power, but no
sooner I cleared the strip it started bogging down I brought the power back
and it seemed to have gone away. But every time after that when I gave it
opened throttle more to get some more altitude it started bogging down
again. It got to where I could not maintain altitude about half way to
where I was going. I hope its just an air leak and nothing else, I am aware
that I may have more than one issue here, no idea about the history of this
motor, even though it is very strong when it is doing is thing at full
throttle, for the few seconds that it does.
Captain Ron:
Most folks do their engine testing on the ground, until they are satisfied
the engine will perform normally once airborne.
If I have an engine problem, I tie the airplane to my trailer hitch with a
secure tow strap. A lot safer, saves a lot of time, airplanes and people
doing it this way.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | williamtsullivan(at)att.net |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
- Ron- It sounds like your carb is doing the same as my Bing 54 on the Ro
tax 447.- Bogging down in mid range; seems Ok at full; and air screw does
not seem to be doing anything.- Take the carb bowl off carefully, and lo
ok in the gas and bottom of the bowl.- Maybe pour the gas out through a p
aper towel.- Look carefully in the bowl, and clean with a Q-tip.- The m
ain jet is located directly under the needle that you can see while looking
in through the air intake.- If you take off the filter, the gas goes up
thropugh the main jet.- It comes out easily for cleaning or replacement.
- I had congealed goo in mine, probably from sitting.- Also, mine had a
worn out choke seal, and more goo.- The seal plunger had to be replaced.
- I got the seal plunger and a carb kit from Lockwood.- The diagram is
in their book.-
- I found very clear instructions on the web from the "Ultralight news".
- Call up "Bing 54 adjustments" on web search.- Also, Scott Olendorf ha
s a couple of tricks on his website.- No special tools required, but a to
rch tip cleaner came in handy to poke the goo out.
- John Hauck is right about tieing it down.- I was running around tryin
g to test for the bogging, and look what happened to me.- Just don't walk
into the fan.
-
-------------------------
------------------- Bill Sullivan
-------------------------
------------------- Windsor Locks, Ct
.
-------------------------
------------------- FS 447
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Blumax008(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
In a message dated 6/24/2009 9:40:40 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com writes:
If I have an engine problem, I tie the airplane to my trailer hitch with a
secure tow strap. A lot safer, saves a lot of time, airplanes and people
doing it this way.
Yes, always but ALWAYS secure the aircraft before starting. Mr. Know-It-All
here (me) once started a 582 Maxair with the throttle accidentally
WIDE-ASS-OPEN....with NO securing strap. I was standing outside the aircraft
while hand propping.
You will not believe the power of a 582 at full throttle. I had enough time
to grab the horizontal stabilizer & hang on...and that's all I was allowed
to do...hang on! It whipped me around & around about 3 times in a circle,
dragging my 190 pound butt around like a rag doll or a piece of paper! I
actually thought I could stop it in place! Haaaaaaa! What an idiot!
I got my wits together on the 2nd. trip around (I was younger then) &
while being whipped around, got it aimed at a big bunch of bushes alongside the
runway. I managed to let go at the proper time. It actually took off on
it's own & flew itself into the bushes where it (Thank God) managed to bury
itself...and still ran wide-ass-open untill I could get to it! Amazingly, no
damage but did mow some bushes with the nickel leading edge Warp Drive
bushmower propellar. No damage to the Warp either!
Always but always secure your aircraft for any runups. Sitting in the
aircraft & cranking by battery while also tied to a friggin' TREE is the best
idea for runups.
Bill (wide-ass-open) Catalina
**************Check all of your email inboxes from anywhere on the web.
Try the new Email Toolbar now!
(http://toolbar.aol.com/mail/download.html?ncid=txtlnkusdown00000027)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Denny Rowe" <rowedenny(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
Ron,
Please put the filter after the bulb, any loose rubber from the bulb will
than be filtered out instead of going into the carb and becoming an
obstruction to your main jet.
I had this happen to me on my 503 powered Loehle SP years ago and it was a
close call. Little tiny peice of black rubber bobbing around in the float
bowel. Sounds like you better pull your bowel and check real close for
this.
Dennis Rowe
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net>
Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2009 9:02 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl
>
> I have the bulb above the fuel filter ( the bulb is brand new from
> Aircraft Spruce, the original was rot cracked, plugs are also brand new),
> and we did not install it with hose clams at all. I have already taken
> care of that now. I have it installed Fuel Tank, filter, bulb, pump, I
> also have yet to run the motor to check and see if the problem is solved.
> All that stuff happened yesterday. The bubbles start right at the fuel
> filter probably air was getting in that area, and also was another bubble
> stream was getting in around the bulb. I think this will be a none issue
> as I now have clamps there too.
> -Sputtering; On take off it was good all the way to mid power, but no
> sooner I cleared the strip it started bogging down I brought the power
> back and it seemed to have gone away. But every time after that when I
> gave it opened throttle more to get some more altitude it started bogging
> down again. It got to where I could not maintain altitude about half way
> to where I was going. I hope its just an air leak and nothing else, I am
> aware that I may have more than one issue here, no idea about the history
> of this motor, even though it is very strong when it is doing is thing at
> full throttle, for the few seconds that it does.
> I never opened a Bing carb before and don't have the manual can you tell
> me about the jetting in a bit more detail. Density Altitude around here is
> around 7-8K this time of year.
> If I screw the idle in is that more gas or less? Can't tell by moving it
> sounds the same no matter what I do. I got it pretty far screwed in right
> now.
>
>
> ---- Dana Hague wrote:
>
> ============
>
> Bubbling at the fuel filter: It could be an air leak, especially if you
> use the screw type hose clamps which don't always seal all the way around
> small tubes. Better to use safety wire. A bit of bubbling when the
> engine
> is first started is normal, as any air and vapor in the line works its way
> through. However, if there is any blockage upstream (happened to me on my
> first flight in the US, a bad primer bulb), the suction can cause steady
> stream of bubbles as the fuel boils into vapor.
>
> Re sputtering: Not clear from your description. Is it running OK at full
> throttle once it clears out, and do the plugs and EGT look OK? If so,
> it's
> likely it's loading up at lower throttle settings, could be the needle
> clip
> (raise the clip to lower the needle and lean out the midrange) or idle
> adjustment screw. The jettings listed in the Cuyuna manual (they give a
> chart of jet sizes according to altitude and temperature) are a good place
> to start. Using fuel with ethanol may shift it slightly lean, so you may
> need to go one jet size larger.
>
> If the crack in the prop isn't too bad, you can fix it. Spread it
> slightly
> and squirt some wood glue (yellow carpenter's glue) into it... then
> balance
> it afterwards. I've seen some amazing prop repairs in the PPG world; some
> of them go too far, I think, but they hold together.
>
> -Dana
>
>
> At 11:00 PM 6/23/2009, Ron @ KFHU wrote:
>
>>Well today I had the first real flight in the Cuyuana powered Duck got
>>only about 15 miles from the strip I took off, when I had to put it down
>>in a graded pre construction job site. No problems at all. But the engine
>>did not act well. It look like there was bubbling right at the fuel
>>filter. Maybe it has an air leak. got it trailed the rest of the way to my
>>hanger, now I got a nice place to work on it but little time. We also
>>found a length wise crack in the wood prop. Its a two blader prop 54 inch
>>long and the hub thickness is 4cm, I tried measuring in inches but could
>>not get a round number. Anyway I need a new prop ( like yesterday). It
>>looks like a 2/1 reduction belt drive with a 4 bolt pattern and its
>>counter clock turning.
>>If anyone has one of these laying around and wants to sell it FedEx
>>overnight contact me offline.
>>Any ideas as to why the motor spattered when I advanced the prop to gull
>>power would be appreciated. Would a fuel pump do that? air leak in the
>>line, too rich a jetting?
>>It run okay kinda in mid power setting but when I gave it full power it
>>did okay for a while and then started chocking. I got one day or so to get
>>it straightened out.
>
> --
> A flying saucer results when a nudist spills his coffee.
>
>
> --
> kugelair.com
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
06:23:00
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
:-)
Thanks John, at this point I could not agree with you more.
Now off to *my* hanger where I have all my tools, and set up, to maybe get this
contraption flight ready for 5-am tomorrow!
Ron @ KFHU
=======================
---- John Hauck wrote:
============
> -Sputtering; On take off it was good all the way to mid power, but no
sooner I cleared the strip it started bogging down I brought the power back
and it seemed to have gone away. But every time after that when I gave it
opened throttle more to get some more altitude it started bogging down
again. It got to where I could not maintain altitude about half way to
where I was going. I hope its just an air leak and nothing else, I am aware
that I may have more than one issue here, no idea about the history of this
motor, even though it is very strong when it is doing is thing at full
throttle, for the few seconds that it does.
Captain Ron:
Most folks do their engine testing on the ground, until they are satisfied
the engine will perform normally once airborne.
If I have an engine problem, I tie the airplane to my trailer hitch with a
secure tow strap. A lot safer, saves a lot of time, airplanes and people
doing it this way.
john h
mkIII
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
Thank you much! I printed it out and will take with me, to work on the Carb.
Ron @ KFHU
========
---- williamtsullivan(at)att.net wrote:
============
Ron- It sounds like your carb is doing the same as my Bing 54 on the Rotax 447.
Bogging down in mid range; seems Ok at full; and air screw does not seem to
be doing anything. Take the carb bowl off carefully, and look in the gas and bottom
of the bowl. Maybe pour the gas out through a paper towel. Look carefully
in the bowl, and clean with a Q-tip. The main jet is located directly under
the needle that you can see while looking in through the air intake. If you take
off the filter, the gas goes up thropugh the main jet. It comes out easily
for cleaning or replacement. I had congealed goo in mine, probably from sitting.
Also, mine had a worn out choke seal, and more goo. The seal plunger had to
be replaced. I got the seal plunger and a carb kit from Lockwood. The diagram
is in their book.
I found very clear instructions on the web from the "Ultralight news". Call up
"Bing 54 adjustments" on web search. Also, Scott Olendorf has a couple of tricks
on his website. No special tools required, but a torch tip cleaner came in
handy to poke the goo out.
John Hauck is right about tieing it down. I was running around trying to test
for the bogging, and look what happened to me. Just don't walk into the fan.
Bill Sullivan
Windsor Locks, Ct.
FS 447
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
Thank you
You guys are a treasure here!
Ron @ KFHU
=============
---- Denny Rowe wrote:
============
Ron,
Please put the filter after the bulb, any loose rubber from the bulb will
than be filtered out instead of going into the carb and becoming an
obstruction to your main jet.
I had this happen to me on my 503 powered Loehle SP years ago and it was a
close call. Little tiny peice of black rubber bobbing around in the float
bowel. Sounds like you better pull your bowel and check real close for
this.
Dennis Rowe
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net>
Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2009 9:02 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl
>
> I have the bulb above the fuel filter ( the bulb is brand new from
> Aircraft Spruce, the original was rot cracked, plugs are also brand new),
> and we did not install it with hose clams at all. I have already taken
> care of that now. I have it installed Fuel Tank, filter, bulb, pump, I
> also have yet to run the motor to check and see if the problem is solved.
> All that stuff happened yesterday. The bubbles start right at the fuel
> filter probably air was getting in that area, and also was another bubble
> stream was getting in around the bulb. I think this will be a none issue
> as I now have clamps there too.
> -Sputtering; On take off it was good all the way to mid power, but no
> sooner I cleared the strip it started bogging down I brought the power
> back and it seemed to have gone away. But every time after that when I
> gave it opened throttle more to get some more altitude it started bogging
> down again. It got to where I could not maintain altitude about half way
> to where I was going. I hope its just an air leak and nothing else, I am
> aware that I may have more than one issue here, no idea about the history
> of this motor, even though it is very strong when it is doing is thing at
> full throttle, for the few seconds that it does.
> I never opened a Bing carb before and don't have the manual can you tell
> me about the jetting in a bit more detail. Density Altitude around here is
> around 7-8K this time of year.
> If I screw the idle in is that more gas or less? Can't tell by moving it
> sounds the same no matter what I do. I got it pretty far screwed in right
> now.
>
>
> ---- Dana Hague wrote:
>
> ============
>
> Bubbling at the fuel filter: It could be an air leak, especially if you
> use the screw type hose clamps which don't always seal all the way around
> small tubes. Better to use safety wire. A bit of bubbling when the
> engine
> is first started is normal, as any air and vapor in the line works its way
> through. However, if there is any blockage upstream (happened to me on my
> first flight in the US, a bad primer bulb), the suction can cause steady
> stream of bubbles as the fuel boils into vapor.
>
> Re sputtering: Not clear from your description. Is it running OK at full
> throttle once it clears out, and do the plugs and EGT look OK? If so,
> it's
> likely it's loading up at lower throttle settings, could be the needle
> clip
> (raise the clip to lower the needle and lean out the midrange) or idle
> adjustment screw. The jettings listed in the Cuyuna manual (they give a
> chart of jet sizes according to altitude and temperature) are a good place
> to start. Using fuel with ethanol may shift it slightly lean, so you may
> need to go one jet size larger.
>
> If the crack in the prop isn't too bad, you can fix it. Spread it
> slightly
> and squirt some wood glue (yellow carpenter's glue) into it... then
> balance
> it afterwards. I've seen some amazing prop repairs in the PPG world; some
> of them go too far, I think, but they hold together.
>
> -Dana
>
>
> At 11:00 PM 6/23/2009, Ron @ KFHU wrote:
>
>>Well today I had the first real flight in the Cuyuana powered Duck got
>>only about 15 miles from the strip I took off, when I had to put it down
>>in a graded pre construction job site. No problems at all. But the engine
>>did not act well. It look like there was bubbling right at the fuel
>>filter. Maybe it has an air leak. got it trailed the rest of the way to my
>>hanger, now I got a nice place to work on it but little time. We also
>>found a length wise crack in the wood prop. Its a two blader prop 54 inch
>>long and the hub thickness is 4cm, I tried measuring in inches but could
>>not get a round number. Anyway I need a new prop ( like yesterday). It
>>looks like a 2/1 reduction belt drive with a 4 bolt pattern and its
>>counter clock turning.
>>If anyone has one of these laying around and wants to sell it FedEx
>>overnight contact me offline.
>>Any ideas as to why the motor spattered when I advanced the prop to gull
>>power would be appreciated. Would a fuel pump do that? air leak in the
>>line, too rich a jetting?
>>It run okay kinda in mid power setting but when I gave it full power it
>>did okay for a while and then started chocking. I got one day or so to get
>>it straightened out.
>
> --
> A flying saucer results when a nudist spills his coffee.
>
>
> --
> kugelair.com
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
06:23:00
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brad Stump <sky-king(at)inbox.com> |
Don't want to cause any undue heart-ache,but,I installed landshorter vg on my mk3
and love them.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: possums(at)bellsouth.net
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Thank you
>
>
> At 12:35 PM 6/23/2009, you wrote:
>>
> >Hi guys, I have not yet tried VGs, but a friend has bought some for
> >our planes.
> >There are reasons I question weather VGs would have helped in my
> situation.
>>
> >Do I have this wrong? could I for instance climb at lower speeds than
> before?
>
> If you have $100 to spare, it will be the best $100 you have ever spent
> on
> your plane. You can climb at an unbelievable angle at an unimaginable
> low speed without stalling -----at least on a single seater (stall
> reduced at least
> 5 or 6 mph, control increased - but you would have to experience
> that part of to know what I'm talking about.)
>
> This thread has been beaten to death.
>
> If you don't want to reinvent the wheel, buy them from
> www.landshorter.com
>
> and use their templates and instructions to install them, they've
> already done the work.
>
> Most of these were shot with VGs and are all, of course, "Photo
> shopped" and no ducks were killed
> or injured and not eaten during the making of these films as per PETA
> guidelines.
>
> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4600043392041186975
>
> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8022448200127542755
>
> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5232234046747826901
>
> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2622632755661898541
>
>
____________________________________________________________
FREE 3D EARTH SCREENSAVER - Watch the Earth right on your desktop!
Check it out at http://www.inbox.com/earth
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brad Stump <sky-king(at)inbox.com> |
My stall speed lowered by 10 mph.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: R: VGs
>
>
> I>>
>
> If I put on the wings the VGs, the speed cruise increases or decreases?
>
> Charly
> you will not notice any difference in the cruise but the stalling speed
> will
> be lower by about 5mph
>
> Pat
> ?
>
>
____________________________________________________________
GET FREE 5GB EMAIL - Check out spam free email with many cool features!
Visit http://www.inbox.com/email to find out more!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: R: VGs
>
> My stall speed lowered by 10 mph.
Brad S:
That is an impressive improvement.
What was your stall speed prior to, and after installation of
VGs?
At what altitude did you conduct your tests?
What were the differences in stall characteristics prior to and after
installation of VGs?
How did the VGs affect speed at your normal cruise power setting?
Did you test stall in ground effect, before and after?
What airplane are you flying?
Would you please expand on your experience flying this airplane before and
after?
If I could get a 10 mph reduction in stall speed in ground effect, I could
land at 20 mph.
john h
mkIII - Always impressed with the dramatic improvements in aircraft
performance and handling after installation of VGs.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
At 09:02 AM 6/24/2009, Ron @ KFHU wrote:
>I have the bulb above the fuel filter ( the bulb is brand new from
>Aircraft Spruce, the original was rot cracked, plugs are also brand new)...
Same here... my original bulb was dry and hard; I replaced it with a brand
new bulb from Aircraft Spruce. The brand new bulb was bad (clogged) out of
the box. It would pass enough fuel for warmup and mid power, and let the
carb bowl fill, but at full power the it couldn't keep up and the engine
would starve for fuel shortly after takeoff. I discovered this the hard
way on my first flight in the plane; fortunately it would make enough power
to get around the pattern and land. I now have a plunger primer and no
squeeze bulb.
> ...and we did not install it with hose clams at all. I have already
> taken care of that now. I have it installed Fuel Tank, filter, bulb,
> pump, I also have yet to run the motor to check and see if the problem is
> solved. All that stuff happened yesterday. The bubbles start right at the
> fuel filter probably air was getting in that area, and also was another
> bubble stream was getting in around the bulb. I think this will be a none
> issue as I now have clamps there too.
The point I was making is that the clamps can CAUSE an air leak, since they
don't do a very good job of clamping all the way around small
hoses. Safety wire (wrap around the hose three times, then twist) does a
better job and is lighter as well.
I would look for a blockage upstream of the first place you see the
bubbles. Places to look are the pickup inside the tank, and any fittings.
Do you have and EGT and/or CHT gauges on the engine? If so, what do they
say? If not, you should.
>-Sputtering; On take off it was good all the way to mid power, but no
>sooner I cleared the strip it started bogging down I brought the power
>back and it seemed to have gone away. But every time after that when I
>gave it opened throttle more to get some more altitude it started bogging
>down again.
Sounds like my experience, except that the rpm's were surging up and down.
>I never opened a Bing carb before and don't have the manual can you tell
>me about the jetting in a bit more detail. Density Altitude around here is
>around 7-8K this time of year.
You have a Bing? The Cuyunas originally came with a Mikuni which is a much
better carburetor for these engines. I'm told that lots of people have
trouble getting the engine to run correctly with the Bing.
The Cuyuna manual (as well as the Mikuni manual) can be downloaded from the
files section of the Cuyuna Yahoo group (I put them there):
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Cuyunamotor>
You might get some more useful advice there, too, though it's not a very
active group.
-Dana
--
To Be Old And Wise You Must First Be Young And Stupid
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron @ KFHU" <captainron1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cayuna 430 and Pterodactyl |
Well i think I found out one problem, and it had to do with the bulb. It seemed
that the Handy dude at the ranch who forced it into the tube cracked the intake
into the bulb. When I repositioned the bulb and tried to insert it into its
new position the prong just broke off easily. Re-did the entire fuel line, found
out that I had a bulb that Kolb sent me back when I bought the kit. My buddy
who is a good mechanic came and took a look at it. We had the Carb apart (
I said Bing,, its a Mikuni written right on it) he new it inside and out cleaned
some air input and the needle closed it up. And tomorrow we shall see if I
can get a solid hour out of it. Patched up the prop, new prop will be in tomorrow
too late for the AM flight.
Other than that will see what happens.
Ron @ KFHU
===============================
---- Dana Hague wrote:
============
At 09:02 AM 6/24/2009, Ron @ KFHU wrote:
>I have the bulb above the fuel filter ( the bulb is brand new from
>Aircraft Spruce, the original was rot cracked, plugs are also brand new)...
Same here... my original bulb was dry and hard; I replaced it with a brand
new bulb from Aircraft Spruce. The brand new bulb was bad (clogged) out of
the box. It would pass enough fuel for warmup and mid power, and let the
carb bowl fill, but at full power the it couldn't keep up and the engine
would starve for fuel shortly after takeoff. I discovered this the hard
way on my first flight in the plane; fortunately it would make enough power
to get around the pattern and land. I now have a plunger primer and no
squeeze bulb.
> ...and we did not install it with hose clams at all. I have already
> taken care of that now. I have it installed Fuel Tank, filter, bulb,
> pump, I also have yet to run the motor to check and see if the problem is
> solved. All that stuff happened yesterday. The bubbles start right at the
> fuel filter probably air was getting in that area, and also was another
> bubble stream was getting in around the bulb. I think this will be a none
> issue as I now have clamps there too.
The point I was making is that the clamps can CAUSE an air leak, since they
don't do a very good job of clamping all the way around small
hoses. Safety wire (wrap around the hose three times, then twist) does a
better job and is lighter as well.
I would look for a blockage upstream of the first place you see the
bubbles. Places to look are the pickup inside the tank, and any fittings.
Do you have and EGT and/or CHT gauges on the engine? If so, what do they
say? If not, you should.
>-Sputtering; On take off it was good all the way to mid power, but no
>sooner I cleared the strip it started bogging down I brought the power
>back and it seemed to have gone away. But every time after that when I
>gave it opened throttle more to get some more altitude it started bogging
>down again.
Sounds like my experience, except that the rpm's were surging up and down.
>I never opened a Bing carb before and don't have the manual can you tell
>me about the jetting in a bit more detail. Density Altitude around here is
>around 7-8K this time of year.
You have a Bing? The Cuyunas originally came with a Mikuni which is a much
better carburetor for these engines. I'm told that lots of people have
trouble getting the engine to run correctly with the Bing.
The Cuyuna manual (as well as the Mikuni manual) can be downloaded from the
files section of the Cuyuna Yahoo group (I put them there):
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Cuyunamotor>
You might get some more useful advice there, too, though it's not a very
active group.
-Dana
--
To Be Old And Wise You Must First Be Young And Stupid
--
kugelair.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
Always impressed with the dramatic improvements in aircraft
performance and handling after installation of VGs. >>
John,
you are fighting a rearguard action but by crackey you are doing it very
well.
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net> |
>
>
>If I could get a 10 mph reduction in stall speed in ground effect, I could
>land at 20 mph.
>
>
John,
The only way to find out is to try them. Why depend on others to do the
research for you? It only takes about $10 for materials and a few minutes
of your time to make them.
See "Vortex Generators" at:
http://www.jackbhart.com/firefly/fireflyindex.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brad Stump <sky-king(at)inbox.com> |
Hi John,
To answer some of your questions,I will first throw in a disclaimer.Iam not a 1000
hr or more pilot,just a dumb old country boy who likes to fly.
My stall speed prior to vg's was 42mph indicated and 32mph after,there is very
possible a + or - a few mph because of all the things that we know that can cause
errors.
There is not a lot of difference in stall handling before or after,Iam flying a
Kolb mk3 and she has a very gentle stall, and no tendency to drop a wing,there
never was any violence as reported by some others.
In ground effect before vg's in the 42-45mph range the plane would just drop to
the runway,after the vg's I can get down into the 32-35mph range and the plane
just seems to settle to the runway.
I hope this helps someone.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: R: VGs
>
>
>
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: R: VGs
>
>
>>
>> My stall speed lowered by 10 mph.
>
>
> Brad S:
>
> That is an impressive improvement.
>
> What was your stall speed prior to, and after installation of
> VGs?
>
> At what altitude did you conduct your tests?
>
> What were the differences in stall characteristics prior to and after
> installation of VGs?
>
> How did the VGs affect speed at your normal cruise power setting?
>
> Did you test stall in ground effect, before and after?
>
> What airplane are you flying?
>
> Would you please expand on your experience flying this airplane before
> and
> after?
>
> If I could get a 10 mph reduction in stall speed in ground effect, I
> could
> land at 20 mph.
>
> john h
> mkIII - Always impressed with the dramatic improvements in aircraft
> performance and handling after installation of VGs.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
>
> The only way to find out is to try them.
Morning Jack:
I have tried VG's, several times. I have also done a side by side flight
comparison between my fat old bird and a much lighter MKIII. The results of
those flights did not convince me to install VGs on my airplane.
This last flight West was interesting. There were times when I could have
used a lot more lift. Then there were times when I wished I had spoilers
installed on my wings. At the Rock House, in the desert of SE Oregon, we
watched our Kolbs attempting to fly and flying while tied down. Then there
was the difficult time at Grants, NM, where we were trying to deal with a
density altiutude of 9,300 feet, severe turbulence, cross wind, and dust
devils, on take off. I don't know if VGs would have helped me at Grants or
not.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
> My stall speed prior to vg's was 42mph indicated and 32mph after,there is
very possible a + or - a few mph because of all the things that we know that
can cause errors.
> In ground effect before vg's in the 42-45mph range the plane would just
> drop to the runway,after the vg's I can get down into the 32-35mph range
> and the plane just seems to settle to the runway.
Brad S:
A 10 mph decrease in stall speed is still a very impressive number.
In ground effect I get the same flight characteristics as you on the FSII I
was flying with VGs. The break at stall was very gentle. Other than that,
I could not find any other improvements in flight over a FSII without VGs.
My experience with Kolb aircraft indicates they fly as well without as they
do with VGs except for the very gentle break on landing. As far as extra
steep climbs, steep turns, and great control right through the mush/stall,
they all do it without VGs.
I have discovered I can make good landings if I stall the airplane closer to
the ground. If I stall it a foot above the ground, it will drop a foot. If
I don't want to take the chance of dropping in, I can always fly the Kolb to
the ground above stall speed.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
> you are fighting a rearguard action but by crackey you are doing it very
> well.
>
> Pat
Patrick:
No fight intended.
Trying to learn.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "robcannon" <leecannon(at)telus.net> |
Kolb Mark II, Hks 700 E, 550 lbs empty, 180 lb pilot, 2000'asl. Initial flights
with no vg's I was surprized and unhappy with my high stall speed of 38 mph
power off. I added vg's as an experiment with low expectations. You should have
seen my face when I landed after the first flight with vg's. Ten dollars
worth of hardware store flashing and a days messing around and my stall dropped
minimum 10 mph. That's right TEN mph ! TEN DOLLARS - TEN MPH. Stall characteristics
did not change that much - clean break around 26, but will mush along
in full control right down to 26.
The advantages here are obvious. The disadvantages are minuscule. Top speed
does not seem affected, but my testing would not be very accurate as my plane
is easily goes over vne, and low speed is my focus, so I didn't do very scientific
testing. I thought washing the wing would be a hassle but the soft bristle
brush I use doesnt seem to notice the vg's.
If anyone wants to make there own I'll send you a pattern one and instructions.
I tested different adhesives and decided upon indoor/outdoor carpet tape from
wallmart. It's sticky shit that is never coming off and is much cleaner to
use than any liquid adhesive ( just happens to come in a roll the same width
as the vg's). I put a rivet in the ones in front of the prop just in case but
in hindsite I don't think it was necessary. Try it you'll like it !! Rob Cannon
[Laughing]
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249950#249950
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "robcannon" <leecannon(at)telus.net> |
Oh yeah, forgot the landing part. I can now land at fifteen mph in ground effect.
............. Just kidding ..... With my 26 mph stall, I cant land this slow
as my tail will be too low. I built tall gear legs and I can get down pretty
slow (32 - 35) but any slower and the tail hits first.
The advantage is a huge safety margin at slow speeds. Theoretically I could
fly approaches at 39 mph ( with a 1.5 safety factor), but I fly them at 45 - 50.
If I have an engine failure, I can do a 180 at 45-50 and be around quicker
and higher. blah,blah,blah, Rob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=249952#249952
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Alvord Photo 2009 |
Mike M accompanied us Kolbers to the Rock House in Oregon last month. Mike
is a very accomplished photographer. He took this shot of Miss P'fer doing
her thing over the Alvord Desert. Thanks Mike.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Another Alvord Photo |
Beautiful blue sky.
Another photo by Mark M.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | william sullivan <williamtsullivan(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Alvord photo 2009 |
- Nice photo, John.- What are those straight lines going from the wing
to the halfway point on the wing struts?
-
-------------------------
----------------- Bill Sullivan
-------------------------
------------------Windsor Locks, Ct.
-------------------------
----------------- FS 447
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | william sullivan <williamtsullivan(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Another Alvord photo |
- And an even better one!- What is the thing hanging down between the l
anding gear, just below the seat?
-
-------------------------
---------------- Bill Sullivan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Alvord photo 2009 |
Those are streamlined 4130 jury struts. When I was building my MKIII at
Old Kolb in 1991, Homer Kolb asked me to install jury struts that were
in the plans. Although the factory MKIII did not have them installed,
Homer asked me to put them on my MKIII. I had not planned on using
them. He told me if I installed them it would encourage others to
install them. Don't think I have ever seen another Kolb with jury
struts. They did save my left lift strut when I wiped out the landing
gear at Muncho Lake, BC, in 2000. When the gear leg/axle socket failed,
the aircraft dropped down with the lift strut landing on top of the left
main tire. The lift strut would have been bent had the jury strut not
been installed.
john h
mkIII
Nice photo, John. What are those straight lines going from
the wing to the halfway point on the wing struts?
Bill Sullivan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Another Alvord photo |
Bill S:
That is the landing light. It is a KC off road driving light, 100w
halogen. Works well and is much more reliable than the old GE H4095
sealed beam, which were good for about 10 hours or less. My MKIII is
certified for night flight. I used to do a lot of night flying early
on, but do not fly at night now unless I get caught out and it gets dark
on me. My night system is not redundant. Murphy loves that and will
rear his ugly head the first time I get a little over confident.
john h
mkIII
And an even better one! What is the thing hanging down
between the landing gear, just below the seat?
Bill Sullivan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
An unforgetable flight with my friends to the Alvord and beyond.
Looking forward to doing it again next year.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
At 10:26 AM 6/25/2009, robcannon wrote:
>...my stall dropped minimum 10 mph.... The disadvantages are minuscule...
Perhaps... but one thing concerns me. My UltraStar supposedly stalls at
25mph (it's 30mph indicated). It gets risky to fly an airplane when the
wind is a significant fraction of your stall speed (one half is the usual
rule of thumb). As a PPG pilot also, you can imagine I'm quite sensitive
to this. As it is, I hesitate to fly on breezy days; I'd hate to lower
that flyable threshold at all.
-Dana
--
Question Authority and the authorities will question you!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Alvord photo 2009 |
| From: | Robert Laird <rlaird(at)cavediver.com> |
I have jury struts on my MkIII.
-- Robert
On Thu, Jun 25, 2009 at 10:26 AM, John Hauck wrote:
> Those are streamlined 4130 jury struts. When I was building my MKIII at
> Old Kolb in 1991, Homer Kolb asked me to install jury struts that were in
> the plans. Although the factory MKIII did not have them installed, Homer
> asked me to put them on my MKIII. I had not planned on using them. He told
> me if I installed them it would encourage others to install them. Don't
> think I have ever seen another Kolb with jury struts. They did save my left
> lift strut when I wiped out the landing gear at Muncho Lake, BC, in 2000.
> When the gear leg/axle socket failed, the aircraft dropped down with the
> lift strut landing on top of the left main tire. The lift strut would have
> been bent had the jury strut not been installed.
>
> john h
> mkIII
>
>
> Nice photo, John. What are those straight lines going from the wing
> to the halfway point on the wing struts?
>
> Bill Sullivan
>
>
> **
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
Dana wrote:
> At 10:26 AM 6/25/2009, robcannon wrote:
>
> > ...my stall dropped minimum 10 mph.... The disadvantages are minuscule...
> >
> >
>
> Perhaps... but one thing concerns me. My UltraStar supposedly stalls at
> 25mph (it's 30mph indicated). It gets risky to fly an airplane when the
> wind is a significant fraction of your stall speed (one half is the usual
> rule of thumb). As a PPG pilot also, you can imagine I'm quite sensitive
> to this. As it is, I hesitate to fly on breezy days; I'd hate to lower
> that flyable threshold at all.
>
> -Dana
>
> Dana,
>
> Your understanding of this is wrong. What you do not want is a gust causing
a loss of airspeed and stall in the airplane. VG's expand your flying envalope
and increase your safety margain aginst gust induced stall. Lets take a Firestar,
say it stalls at 30 MPH. If you approach at 40 MPH, a 10 MPH gust could
place you at the stall speed. With the same firestar with VG's, if you stall
at 22 MPH with VG's, a 10 MPH gust would not cause a stall, it would take
an 18 MPH gust to put you at stall speed. This equals increased safety.
>
> You have taken something that is generally true, and misapplied it. The danger
is when an airplane stalls very slow, and is ALSO have a very low approach
speed. The VG's do not mean that you have to fly your approaches slow if you
are in windy weather. VG's actually INCREASE safety and your protection against
gust induced stalls.
>
> Mike
>
>
>
>
> --
> Question Authority and the authorities will question you!
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=250006#250006
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
Dana wrote:
> At 10:26 AM 6/25/2009, robcannon wrote:
>
> > ...my stall dropped minimum 10 mph.... The disadvantages are minuscule...
> >
> >
>
> Perhaps... but one thing concerns me. My UltraStar supposedly stalls at
> 25mph (it's 30mph indicated). It gets risky to fly an airplane when the
> wind is a significant fraction of your stall speed (one half is the usual
> rule of thumb). As a PPG pilot also, you can imagine I'm quite sensitive
> to this. As it is, I hesitate to fly on breezy days; I'd hate to lower
> that flyable threshold at all.
>
> -Dana
>
> Dana,
>
> Your understanding of this is wrong. You are misapplying a generality that applies
to slow flying airplanes where the approach speed is very close to what
its stall speed is. What you do not want is a gust causing a loss of airspeed
and stall in the airplane. VG's expand your flying envelope and increase your
safety margin against gust induced stall. Lets take a Firestar, say it stalls
at 30 MPH. If you approach at 40 MPH, a 10 MPH gust could place you at the
stall speed. With the same Firestar with VG's, if you stall at 22 MPH with
VG's, a 10 MPH gust would not cause a stall, it would take an 18 MPH gust to
put you at stall speed. This equals increased safety.
>
> You have taken something that is generally true, and misapplied it. The danger
is when an airplane stalls very slow, and is ALSO have a very low approach
speed. The VG's do not mean that you have to fly your approaches slow if you
are in windy weather. VG's actually INCREASE safety and your protection against
gust induced stalls.
>
> Mike
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Question Authority and the authorities will question you!
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=250007#250007
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
Dana wrote:
>
>
> Perhaps... but one thing concerns me. My UltraStar supposedly stalls at
> 25mph (it's 30mph indicated). It gets risky to fly an airplane when the
> wind is a significant fraction of your stall speed (one half is the usual
> rule of thumb). As a PPG pilot also, you can imagine I'm quite sensitive
> to this. As it is, I hesitate to fly on breezy days; I'd hate to lower
> that flyable threshold at all.
>
> -Dana
>
Dana,
Your understanding of this is wrong. You are misapplying a generality that applies
to slow flying airplanes where the approach speed is very close to what its
stall speed is. What you do not want is a gust causing a loss of airspeed
and stall in the airplane. VG's expand your flying envelope and increase your
safety margin against gust induced stall. Lets take a Firestar, say it stalls
at 30 MPH. If you approach at 40 MPH, a 10 MPH gust could place you at the
stall speed. With the same Firestar with VG's, if you stall at 22 MPH with
VG's, a 10 MPH gust would not cause a stall, it would take an 18 MPH gust to put
you at stall speed. This equals increased safety.
You have taken something that is generally true, and misapplied it. The danger
is when an airplane stalls very slow, and is ALSO have a very low approach speed.
The VG's do not mean that you have to fly your approaches slow if you are
in windy weather. VG's actually INCREASE safety and your protection against
gust induced stalls.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=250008#250008
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
John Hauck wrote:
>
>
> Still curious how Mike B knew VG's would have saved the ship.
>
> john h
> mkIII
John,
I know this based on experience with flying my Kolb both with and without VG's.
Given the amount of damage to the plane, he was beyond the planes performance
but a SMALL amount, not by a lot. VG's have increased my performance by more
than this amount. I have done flight tests, and even posted videos of my
plane landing with no power at 1000 pounds in the same circumstances described
in Dales accident.
There is another KOLB MK III based at my field that has no VG's , he can not even
com close to landing power off at the speeds I can. People that have flown
both airplanes are just amazed at how much better mine handles and lands. They
describe his Kolb as dropping and landing hard with power off at slower speeds,
while mine greases right on.
We have done comparisons, and I can say that given Dales speed, and the amount
of damage to the airplanes, that properly installed VG's would have most definitely
made the difference in this case.
Dale,
You did not read my post very well, I talked about " MUSH " and how the stall speed
was not the best part of VG"s... Elimination of the mush and reduced response
at slower speeds is probably the best part of VG"s. I stated this very
clearly. I have posted this many times in the past before your accident.
Now you have the best information and advice you are ever going to get on how to
make your Kolb perform better at low speeds. You can either try VG's for yourself,
or ignore the evidence.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=250010#250010
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
John Hauck wrote:
>
>
> Still curious how Mike B knew VG's would have saved the ship.
>
> john h
> mkIII
John,
I know this based on experience with flying my Kolb both with and without VG's.
Given the amount of damage to the plane, he was beyond the planes performance
but a SMALL amount, not by a lot. VG's have increased my performance by more
than this amount. I have done flight tests, and even posted videos of my
plane landing with no power at 1000 pounds in the same circumstances described
in Dales accident.
There is another KOLB MK III based at my field that has no VG's , he can not even
com close to landing power off at the speeds I can. People that have flown
both airplanes are just amazed at how much better mine handles and lands. They
describe his Kolb as dropping and landing hard with power off at slower speeds,
while mine greases right on.
We have done comparisons, and I can say that given Dales speed, and the amount
of damage to the airplanes, that properly installed VG's would have most definitely
made the difference in this case.
Dale,
You did not read my post very well, I talked about " MUSH " and how the stall speed
was not the best part of VG"s... Elimination of the mush and reduced response
at slower speeds is probably the best part of VG"s. I stated this very
clearly. I have posted this many times in the past before your accident. If
you do put on VG's, the design and placement of VG's is CRITICAL to them working
well. Just cutting some aluminum and placing them where it " Looks Right
" does not cut it. Spend the 100 bucks and get them from and follow their directions
exactly.
www.landshorter.com
Now you have the best information and advice you are ever going to get on how to
make your Kolb perform better at low speeds. You can either try VG's for yourself,
or ignore the evidence.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=250011#250011
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com> |
I have not put
VG's on my firestar and if i can land it without the bad drop I do not
think
I will....I think I am improving with my landings..>>
Hi,
`The drop` is something all planes do , not only Kolbs. Slow down to
land, stall, drop!
The trick is to stall as close to the ground as possible. The closer you
are, the smaller `the drop`.
VG`s merely enable you to go more slowly before you stall. If you do it
10ft up they will be no help whatever. Fitting VG`s does not make you a
better pilot, merely extends the planes flying envelope a bit.
Good luck
Pat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
> You have taken something that is generally true, and misapplied it. The
danger is when an airplane stalls very slow, and is ALSO have a very low
approach speed. The VG's do not mean that you have to fly your approaches
slow if you are in windy weather. VG's actually INCREASE safety and your
protection against gust induced stalls.
>
> Mike
Mike B:
So...I increase my approach speed 10 to 15 mph and I am good to go without
VGs.
I'm not concerned over the small amount of difference in speed between "with
and without VGs" when I stall at 30 mph IAS in ground effect. Even if I
stalled at 40 mph in ground effect, I still would not be concerned about my
approach speeds of 50 to 60 mph IAS.
I'm very conservative when it comes to stall and approach speeds. I usually
shoot my approaches at 50 to 60 mph IAS, even on my short 750 ft strip.
VGs aren't going to do a whole lot to improve safety. We are talking of
very slow speeds with and without. Most average pilots should be able to
adjust a couple mph.
What makes landing with zero ground roll so important?
john h
MKIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
> I know this based on experience with flying my Kolb both with and without
VG's. Given the amount of damage to the plane, he was beyond the planes
performance but a SMALL amount, not by a lot. VG's have increased my
performance by more than this amount. I have done flight tests, and even
posted videos of my plane landing with no power at 1000 pounds in the same
circumstances described in Dales accident.
> There is another KOLB MK III based at my field that has no VG's , he can
> not even com close to landing power off at the speeds I can. People that
> have flown both airplanes are just amazed at how much better mine handles
> and lands. They describe his Kolb as dropping and landing hard with
> power off at slower speeds, while mine greases right on.
> We have done comparisons, and I can say that given Dales speed, and the
> amount of damage to the airplanes, that properly installed VG's would have
> most definitely made the difference in this case.
> Now you have the best information and advice you are ever going to get on
> how to make your Kolb perform better at low speeds. You can either try
> VG's for yourself, or ignore the evidence.
>
> Mike
Mike B:
I don't agree with anything referenced above.
The only thing that would have helped Dale W keep from busting his and his
girl friend's butts would have been more airspeed. Larry Cottrell could
probably add some actual experience information he gained by stalling his
FSII equipped with VGs. This is also the airplane that I have flown several
times to see how the VGs perform. Larry also busted his butt when he got
too slow, too close to the ground, with the "devices". ;-) If you stall
the airplane close to the ground, with or without VGs, you are going to bend
and/or break something.
I have well over 6,000 documented landings, in my log book, in all kinds of
conditions on my mkIII alone. Most of them have been power off right to the
ground, full flaps, full stall. All the other mkIII's I have flown, land
the same way.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
John H,
My ground roll is most assuredly longer than yours is, even with VG's.. I need
bigger brakes !!!
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=250020#250020
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
John H,
What kind of VG's does Larry have ? The only time I have seen reports that VG's
have had little effect is when they have been made at home, not the exact same
size and shape, or when they have been put on incorrectly. Like I said, as
with anything in aviation, they must be put on to precise tolerances or they
wont work very well.
Your experience in a Kolb may be why you think VG's are not needed. I am sure
you can out fly anyone here, and I think your skill level is to the point that
you don't even notice things that would be difficult for most others. You could
probably do a very difficult landing in a Kolb with a cup of coffee in one
hand while carrying on a casual conversation, while others would bend the gear.
Where VG's would help most others, you would compensate with skill, I just
have to guess that is why you don't really notice the difference.
I do wish you would get the chance to fly a Kolb with properly designed VG's that
are put on exactly like they should be. I would be very interested to see
what you think.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=250025#250025
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
John H,
What kind of VG's does Larry have ? The only time I have seen reports that VG's
have had little effect is when they have been made at home, not the exact same
size and shape, or when they have been put on incorrectly. Like I said, as
with anything in aviation, they must be put on to precise tolerances or they
wont work very well.
Your experience in a Kolb may be why you think VG's are not needed. I am sure
you can out fly anyone here, and I think your skill level is to the point that
you don't even notice things that would be difficult for most others. You could
probably do a very difficult landing in a Kolb with a cup of coffee in one
hand while carrying on a casual conversation, while others would bend the gear.
Where VG's would help most others, you would compensate with skill, I just
have to guess that is why you don't really notice the difference.
I do wish you would get the chance to fly a Kolb with properly designed VG's that
are put on exactly like they should be. I would be very interested to see
what you think.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=250026#250026
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
> My ground roll is most assuredly longer than yours is, even with VG's..
I need bigger brakes !!!
>
> Mike
Mike B:
Get some good MATCO's with 3/4" axles and tapered roller bearings. I have
had mine since I wiped off the main gear 9 years ago next week.
In fact, they are so good they slow the mkIII down before touch down.
hehehe
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net> |
>
>What makes landing with zero ground roll so important?
>
John,
Zero ground roll is a splat, but it what is important is a low energy
landing. Where this is useful is when you are landing on an unfamiliar
landing area. The slower you can fly the plane at touch down the less
likely you are going to bend something or tear out a leg socket. Why risk
the plane? This does not rule out the use of a high energy approach to
landing. Also, this is why it is important to learn to three point. VG's
will knock the energy down by 5 to 10 mph. In this case it can make the
difference of flying or trucking it home. I have done both and flying is
much more fun.
Fly safe.
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
> I do wish you would get the chance to fly a Kolb with properly designed
VG's that are put on exactly like they should be. I would be very
interested to see what you think.
>
> Mike
Mike B:
Maybe I'll have a chance to take you flying in my mkIII, or your mkIII, or
both. That would be a good comparison, both.
Kolbs are easy to fly. Very forgiving, as long as you stay above stall
speed when close to the ground.
All my flight time since I retired as a Army helicopter pilot and taught
myself to fly my Ultrastar (my solo fixed wing flight in 1984), has been in
Kolbs, with the exception of about 20 hours in a C 172, 19 years ago, to get
my private ticket to fly my mkIII, and a few hours in Bert Howland's
personal Honey Bee in 1989, 20 years ago. You might say I have specialized
in building and flying Kolbs. I still fly mine because I haven't found
anything to replace it with that would be an improvement on my style of
flying. I'm pretty sure I have learned a few things about these little
airplanes along the way, but not any more than any other pilot would in the
same circumstances.
One thing that I have found out, when I occassionally fly someone else's
Kolb, many times, is the fact that they lack the knowledge and experience to
set up the airplane correctly so that it flies the way I think a Kolb should
fly. If you don't know the difference, you will keep on keeping on thinking
you have the best that Kolb has to offer, when a little tweak here and there
might make a new airplane out of it.
Take care,
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | zeprep251(at)aol.com |
Think I'll put 3 sets on ,then I can hover.
?????????????? G.Aman mk-3c
-----Original Message-----
From: Jack B. Hart <jbhart(at)onlyinternet.net>
Sent: Thu, Jun 25, 2009 8:11 am
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: R: VGs
>
>
>If I could get a 10 mph reduction in stall speed in ground effect, I could
>land at 20 mph.
>
>
John,
The only way to find out is to try them. Why depend on others to do the
research for you? It only takes about $10 for materials and a few minutes
of your time to make them.
See "Vortex Generators" at:
http://www.jackbhart.com/firefly/fireflyindex.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
> Zero ground roll is a splat
>
> Jack B. Hart FF004
Jack H:
Zero ground roll is very attainable.
Did one in my Ultrastar and the MKIII. Both under same circumstances.
Wish John W was still here to verify my landing at Canon City, Colorado, in
2004, where I met John to do an attempt on Leadville, CO, highest airport in
the North American Continent. John landed at 1300 with 21 steady and gusts.
I landed at 1700 with 38 steady and gusts. I hovered to a touch down on a
gravel pad between the taxiway and the active. John was standing there to
catch the wing when I touched down. I'm sure we shared this with you all
after it happened. We were on our way to MV.
The landing I did at the Rock House this year, was done without flaps at 50
mph IAS. If I had known the turbulence was going to slack off the moment I
touched down, I could have used full flaps and done another hovering touch
down. If you saw John B's video clip of my landing, you can see how short
my ground roll was touching down at 50 mph IAS. I can assure you we had
some "real" wind that day, that continued for another couple days without
let up.
Last year, 2008, John W and I were grounded in Ontario, OR, with 45 mph
winds and gust over 50 mph for three days and nights without let up.
Normally, we set 25 mph steady as our red line for not flying.
Five or 10 mph in the speed range we land is not going to make a lot of
difference in surviving the landing or not.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JetPilot" <orcabonita(at)hotmail.com> |
John Hauck wrote:
>
>
> One thing that I have found out, when I occassionally fly someone else's
> Kolb, many times, is the fact that they lack the knowledge and experience to
> set up the airplane correctly so that it flies the way I think a Kolb should
> fly. If you don't know the difference, you will keep on keeping on thinking
> you have the best that Kolb has to offer, when a little tweak here and there
> might make a new airplane out of it.
>
> Take care,
>
> john h
> mkIII
John H,
You are so right about that ! I really need to get to Sun and Fun, or somewhere
that you are. I would like you to fly my Kolb and give me any suggestions
you have. There are surely things I have overlooked that you would notice immediately.
If I ever find you somewhere, I will fill up the Kolb with gas, give
you the keys, await your flight report and suggestions :)
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=250042#250042
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | william sullivan <williamtsullivan(at)att.net> |
- John- I saw the video of your landing at the Rock House.- If you were
10mph slower, you would have been going backwards!
- By the way- Do you habitually fly right seat?- Leftover from Army day
s?
-
-------------------------
----------------------- Bill
Sullivan
-------------------------
----------------------- Winds
or Locks, Ct.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
Bill S:
Depends on what airplane I am in. My brake pedals are on the right, my
throttle is in the middle. Works good that way.
I fly left seat when the brakes are on the left. Front seat in the
Kolbra and Sling Shot.
In the Army I flew left and right, front and back, depending on what
aircraft and whether I was flying as the Aircraft Commander or Pilot.
john h
mkIII
John- I saw the video of your landing at the Rock House. If
you were 10mph slower, you would have been going backwards!
By the way- Do you habitually fly right seat? Leftover from
Army days?
Bill Sullivan
Windsor Locks,
Ct.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | robert bean <slyck(at)frontiernet.net> |
Just about the time I'm hitting the sod I prefer a higher stall
speed. -at least 1 MPH higher than the wind on my nose.
That is the time that VGs and flaps (unless you are "Queekdraw" and
retract them at exactly squat time) are no friend.
I flew my MKIII for two years before i even tried flaps. A pleasant
novelty that I have come to appreciate.
BB
On 25, Jun 2009, at 6:06 PM, John Hauck wrote:
>
>
> > Zero ground roll is a splat
>>
>> Jack B. Hart FF004
>
>
> Jack H:
>
> Zero ground roll is very attainable.
>
> Did one in my Ultrastar and the MKIII. Both under same circumstances.
>
> Wish John W was still here to verify my landing at Canon City,
> Colorado, in 2004, where I met John to do an attempt on Leadville,
> CO, highest airport in the North American Continent. John landed
> at 1300 with 21 steady and gusts. I landed at 1700 with 38 steady
> and gusts. I hovered to a touch down on a gravel pad between the
> taxiway and the active. John was standing there to catch the wing
> when I touched down. I'm sure we shared this with you all after it
> happened. We were on our way to MV.
>
> The landing I did at the Rock House this year, was done without
> flaps at 50 mph IAS. If I had known the turbulence was going to
> slack off the moment I touched down, I could have used full flaps
> and done another hovering touch down. If you saw John B's video
> clip of my landing, you can see how short my ground roll was
> touching down at 50 mph IAS. I can assure you we had some "real"
> wind that day, that continued for another couple days without let up.
>
> Last year, 2008, John W and I were grounded in Ontario, OR, with 45
> mph winds and gust over 50 mph for three days and nights without
> let up. Normally, we set 25 mph steady as our red line for not flying.
>
> Five or 10 mph in the speed range we land is not going to make a
> lot of difference in surviving the landing or not.
>
> john h
> mkIII
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Alvord Photo 2009 |
| From: | "ces308" <ces308(at)ldaco.com> |
John.....That is a COOL picture ! That one should be hanging on a wall somewhere!!
chris ambrose
M3X/jab 29.0hrs
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=250057#250057
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | possums <possums(at)bellsouth.net> |
At 06:00 PM 6/25/2009, you wrote:
>Think I'll put 3 sets on ,then I can hover.
> G.Aman mk-3c
OK .....we got 3 sets on this one - I think.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_EjsgLXdb8&feature=related
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Another Alvord Photo |
| From: | "ces308" <ces308(at)ldaco.com> |
John .....Another cool picture ! Did the bulkhead behind your head cut out alot
of noise from the engine / prop ??
chris ambrose
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=250061#250061
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net> |
At 03:35 PM 6/25/2009, JetPilot wrote:
>Your understanding of this is wrong. You are misapplying a generality
>that applies to slow flying airplanes where the approach speed is very
>close to what its stall speed is. What you do not want is a gust causing
>a loss of airspeed and stall in the airplane...
That's one concern, which I guess is a non issue if you fly your approach
at the same speed. However, if you _do_ use the same approach speed,
doesn't it take longer to bleed off enough speed to set it down
stalled? It's that period of time, close to the ground on a gusty day,
that concerns me.
Don't get me wrong, I find the concept intriguing... and I'd like to fly
the same plane with and without VG's... but not enough to go through the
hassle of mounting them on my plane, and having to remove them and clean up
adhesive residue if I don't want to keep them. As John says, I don't
personally feel the need for them. But if somebody has an UltraStar with
VG's that they're willing to let me fly, I'd love to try it.
-Dana
--
In America, anyone can become president. That's one of the risks you take.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Alvord Photo 2009 |
> John.....That is a COOL picture ! That one should be hanging on a wall
> somewhere!!
>
> chris ambrose
Thanks, Chris:
I like it also.
Mike Marker is a great photographer, as well as a great airplane builder,
pilot, and adventurer. He is a retired Naval Aviator. He has built 8 or 9
experiementals, still has all of them, and one of them is a Kolb FSII.
I think the way the sun is blasting the windshield is kind of cool.
john h
mkIII
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
> OK .....we got 3 sets on this one - I think.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_EjsgLXdb8&feature=related
Possum:
Think this guy has VGs on his helmet, just like Buford.
I'd try the helmet VGs but afraid I might get a little light headed.
john h
mkIII - Don't know how I did it without "them"!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Another Alvord Photo |
> John .....Another cool picture ! Did the bulkhead behind your head cut
out alot of noise from the engine / prop ??
>
> chris ambrose
If it does anything, it probably amplifies the noise. If it was sound
insulated on the back side, and the bottom of the center section was also, I
bet it would cut the racket in half. As it is, it is a Kolb, loud!
john h
mkIII
June 08, 2009 - June 25, 2009
Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-ih