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January 05, 2013 - February 19, 2013

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Subject: Re: Engines
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 05, 2013
It is good to hear that the 582 has enough power for the Mark III. The 582 in my Powered Parachute is OK, but would like more climb when I am 2 up. And mine is considered a lighter PPC, with some of the heavier PPC's out there the climb is even worse. I have the louvers on my grey head 582. It does help me feel better about preventing a cold seizure. -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391678#391678 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Eddie" <e.bayliss(at)blueyonder.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Engines
Date: Jan 04, 2013
Wesley I fly a mk1111c with a 582 and an arplast 62" three blade prop Here in the uk ( Liverpool) Our field is only about 10ft above sea level and When flying at max weigth ( over here 395 kilos ) in reality usually 10 or so kilos more with two heavyish people in her and full to the brim tanks I am off the ground in well under half of our 390 metre shortest runway and can usually get a climb rate of around 800fpm even in quite warm weather at about 55/60 mph airspeed .When in the cruise 55/60mph at about 5400rpm gets me in the region of 14/15 litres per hour a well usuable aircraft Eddie Bayliss mk111c 582 arplats prop liverpool uk ----- Original Message ----- From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 10:07 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Engines > > It is good to hear that the 582 has enough power for the Mark III. The 582 > in my Powered Parachute is OK, but would like more climb when I am 2 up. > And mine is considered a lighter PPC, with some of the heavier PPC's out > there the climb is even worse. I have the louvers on my grey head 582. It > does help me feel better about preventing a cold seizure. > > -------- > Wesley Elliott > Sport Pilot-PPC > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391678#391678 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Engines
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 05, 2013
Wow Eddie! Thats some good climb. I am used to only 300 fpm in my PPC on hot days and 2 up. I am at 3000 msl but on summer evenings density altitude is around 7000. -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391682#391682 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Viking/Honda Engines-Again!
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 05, 2013
I know that this new engine has been talked about in the past, but it seems they have been shipping out alot of them and it looks like they might be around for the longterm. One the viking yahoo forum there is a guy who says he is seriously considering mounting the Viking on a KOLB. Jan- I think it would be great if you looked at the integration of the engine on the 2 place KOLB's. I think it would be an excellent performance fit and I believe the market, especially retrofit, would be at least as large as the SeaRay. I could send you pictures or scanes of the drawings offline. The KOLB factory guys could probably do even better. I am aware of these airplanes with mostly 912's Jabs and 582's, but also 618's, Hirths, Subarus, VW's, and BMW's. I am not aware of any of them using a conventional welded tubing engine mount. They bolted from a bottom framework on the engine essentially at the engine longitudinal CG to 4 Berry/Lord mounts on about a 10 in square horizontal pad at the aft end of the KOLB cage. If there is available structure for that on the Viking it would probably be the most structurally efficient option...especially for those of us with a finished cage and looking at a retrofit from the Rotax configuration. Bob Might be another alternative to the costly 912? -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391684#391684 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Antioch, CA
From: Brad Nation <nationcap(at)comcast.net>
Date: Jan 05, 2013
You are correct about coming to the UK. That's good that you don't live in the uncouth part of the UK. Brad On Jan 5, 2013, at 4:54 , Pat Ladd wrote: > > Paul, > I suspect that you don`t want to come to the UK to look at my Kolb. > > Sorry about that. > > Of course if you DO. I am in the South of England and nowhere near Liverpool. > > Liverpool is in the uncouth Northern part of England where they talk funny and put salt on their porridge. > (Sorry Eddie) > > Pat > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "James Dustin" <jimd4414(at)hotmail.com>
Subject:
Date: Jan 05, 2013
Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic? I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will fit in it. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 05, 2013
Subject: Re: : Kolb-List:
From: Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com>
how big are you? Is there any reason to think that you wouldn't? Larry On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 PM, James Dustin wrote: > ** > > Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic? > I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will fit in it. > > * > > * > > -- *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.* ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "James Dustin" <jimd4414(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: : Kolb-List:
Date: Jan 05, 2013
I'm 5'11" and 260lbs. The owner thinks I may have trouble getting In and out of it. ----- Original Message ----- From: Larry Cottrell<mailto:lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:22 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: how big are you? Is there any reason to think that you wouldn't? Larry On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 PM, James Dustin > wrote: Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic? I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will fit in it. get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending. http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List igator?Kolb-List> http://www.matronics.com/contribution on> ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 05, 2013
Subject: Re: : Kolb-List:
From: Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com>
Well I flew a stock Mark 3 Classic when I was 6' 250 lbs, and didn't have any trouble. I doubt that you would have any more trouble with it, than you would with any other plane. Best guess is try it on for size. These little wormy guy's just don't know how resourceful a guy can be :-) Good luck Larry On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:27 PM, James Dustin wrote: > ** > I'm 5'11" and 260lbs. The owner thinks I may have trouble getting In and > out of it. > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Larry Cottrell > *To:* kolb-list(at)matronics.com > *Sent:* Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:22 PM > *Subject:* Re: Kolb-List: > > how big are you? Is there any reason to think that you wouldn't? > Larry > > On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 PM, James Dustin wrote: > >> ** >> >> Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic? >> I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will fit in it. >> >> * >> >> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List >> tp://forums.matronics.com >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> * >> >> > > > -- > *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email > address before sending.* > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c* > > * > > * > > -- *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.* ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "James Dustin" <jimd4414(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: : Kolb-List:
Date: Jan 05, 2013
Thanks Larry Are you close to Billings that I can take a look at yours? ----- Original Message ----- From: Larry Cottrell<mailto:lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:48 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Well I flew a stock Mark 3 Classic when I was 6' 250 lbs, and didn't have any trouble. I doubt that you would have any more trouble with it, than you would with any other plane. Best guess is try it on for size. These little wormy guy's just don't know how resourceful a guy can be :-) Good luck Larry On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:27 PM, James Dustin > wrote: I'm 5'11" and 260lbs. The owner thinks I may have trouble getting In and out of it. ----- Original Message ----- From: Larry Cottrell<mailto:lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:22 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: how big are you? Is there any reason to think that you wouldn't? Larry On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 PM, James Dustin > wrote: Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic? I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will fit in it. get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List tronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List> tp://forums.matronics.com<http://forums.matronics.com/> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ntribution> -- If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending. href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http:/ /forums.matronics.com<http://forums.matronics.com/> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending. http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List igator?Kolb-List> http://www.matronics.com/contribution on> ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 05, 2013
Subject: Re: : Kolb-List:
From: Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com>
No, I am in far Eastern Oregon, and I now have a Firestar II. If you are looking at a specific Mark 3, why not go to the plane that you are thinking of and have him take you for a ride. That way you can see how it works. If you are looking at a kit from Kolb, call Travis and talk to him, he won't steer you wrong. If you are just shopping for the type of plane, perhaps someone will step up and take you for a ride. Larry On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:52 PM, James Dustin wrote: > ** > Thanks Larry > Are you close to Billings that I can take a look at yours? > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Larry Cottrell > *To:* kolb-list(at)matronics.com > *Sent:* Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:48 PM > *Subject:* Re: Kolb-List: > > Well I flew a stock Mark 3 Classic when I was 6' 250 lbs, and didn't have > any trouble. I doubt that you would have any more trouble with it, than you > would with any other plane. Best guess is try it on for size. These little > wormy guy's just don't know how resourceful a guy can be :-) > Good luck > Larry > > On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:27 PM, James Dustin wrote: > >> ** >> I'm 5'11" and 260lbs. The owner thinks I may have trouble getting In >> and out of it. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> *From:* Larry Cottrell >> *To:* kolb-list(at)matronics.com >> *Sent:* Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:22 PM >> *Subject:* Re: Kolb-List: >> >> how big are you? Is there any reason to think that you wouldn't? >> Larry >> >> On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 PM, James Dustin wrote: >> >>> ** >>> >>> Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic? >>> I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will fit in it. >>> >>> * >>> >>> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List >>> tp://forums.matronics.com >>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >>> * >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email >> address before sending.* >> >> * >> >> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List >> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com >> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c* >> >> * >> >> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List >> tp://forums.matronics.com >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> * >> >> > > > -- > *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email > address before sending.* > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c* > > * > > * > > -- *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.* ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 05, 2013
Subject: Re: Viking/Honda Engines-Again!
From: Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com>
Wes You are asking a lot of interesting questions. That's good. A new engine on a airplane is from personal experience a lot of time and effort. Seemed like everything needed to be designed and built for that engine/air frame. Check the engine weight closely, it is real tough to beat the power/weight of a 912. Engine manufacturers are notorious for under reporting their operational weight. Additional weight means less load carrying capacity so you could end up with a single passenger airplane or worse. Engine mounts and exhaust systems are a nightmare and don't expect to have a engine or airplane manufacture to design one for you without a proven market opportunity. Seemingly easy things like prop selection and reduction ratios are very difficult to get right the first or second time. Bottom line it is easy to spend more than the cost of a 912 and not have as good a engine or worse. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 7:42 PM, alienwes wrote: > > I know that this new engine has been talked about in the past, but it > seems they have been shipping out alot of them and it looks like they might > be around for the longterm. One the viking yahoo forum there is a guy who > says he is seriously considering mounting the Viking on a KOLB. > > Jan- > I think it would be great if you looked at the integration of the engine > on the > 2 place KOLB's. I think it would be an excellent performance fit and I > believe > the market, especially retrofit, would be at least as large as the SeaRay. > I > could send you pictures or scanes of the drawings offline. The KOLB factory > guys could probably do even better. I am aware of these airplanes with > mostly > 912's Jabs and 582's, but also 618's, Hirths, Subarus, VW's, and BMW's. I > am > not aware of any of them using a conventional welded tubing engine mount. > They > bolted from a bottom framework on the engine essentially at the engine > longitudinal CG to 4 Berry/Lord mounts on about a 10 in square horizontal > pad at > the aft end of the KOLB cage. If there is available structure for that on > the > Viking it would probably be the most structurally efficient > option...especially > for those of us with a finished cage and looking at a retrofit from the > Rotax > configuration. > > Bob > > Might be another alternative to the costly 912? > > -------- > Wesley Elliott > Sport Pilot-PPC > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391684#391684 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 05, 2013
From: Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Viking/Honda Engines-Again!
It's also good to take a very close look at the vendor. That particular vendor has a long track record (that, with a different name, precedes the Viking project & has a much longer record). Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to determine what that track record is. Charlie On 01/05/2013 10:15 PM, Rick Neilsen wrote: > Wes > > You are asking a lot of interesting questions. That's good. A new > engine on a airplane is from personal experience a lot of time and > effort. Seemed like everything needed to be designed and built for > that engine/air frame. Check the engine weight closely, it is real > tough to beat the power/weight of a 912. Engine manufacturers > are notorious for under reporting their operational > weight. Additional weight means less load carrying capacity so you > could end up with a single passenger airplane or worse. Engine mounts > and exhaust systems are a nightmare and don't expect to have a engine > or airplane manufacture to design one for you without a proven > market opportunity. Seemingly easy things like prop selection and > reduction ratios are very difficult to get right the first or second > time. Bottom line it is easy to spend more than the cost of a 912 and > not have as good a engine or worse. > > Rick Neilsen > Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC > > On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 7:42 PM, alienwes > wrote: > > > > > I know that this new engine has been talked about in the past, but > it seems they have been shipping out alot of them and it looks > like they might be around for the longterm. One the viking yahoo > forum there is a guy who says he is seriously considering mounting > the Viking on a KOLB. > > Jan- > I think it would be great if you looked at the integration of the > engine on the > 2 place KOLB's. I think it would be an excellent performance fit > and I believe > the market, especially retrofit, would be at least as large as the > SeaRay. I > could send you pictures or scanes of the drawings offline. The > KOLB factory > guys could probably do even better. I am aware of these airplanes > with mostly > 912's Jabs and 582's, but also 618's, Hirths, Subarus, VW's, and > BMW's. I am > not aware of any of them using a conventional welded tubing engine > mount. They > bolted from a bottom framework on the engine essentially at the engine > longitudinal CG to 4 Berry/Lord mounts on about a 10 in square > horizontal pad at > the aft end of the KOLB cage. If there is available structure for > that on the > Viking it would probably be the most structurally efficient > option...especially > for those of us with a finished cage and looking at a retrofit > from the Rotax > configuration. > > Bob > > Might be another alternative to the costly 912? > > -------- > Wesley Elliott > Sport Pilot-PPC > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "James Dustin" <jimd4414(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: : Kolb-List:
Date: Jan 05, 2013
I was hoping to find one locally so I could try one on for size before making the trip to SC. Why did you go to a Firestar from a Mark lll ----- Original Message ----- From: Larry Cottrell<mailto:lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 9:13 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: No, I am in far Eastern Oregon, and I now have a Firestar II. If you are looking at a specific Mark 3, why not go to the plane that you are thinking of and have him take you for a ride. That way you can see how it works. If you are looking at a kit from Kolb, call Travis and talk to him, he won't steer you wrong. If you are just shopping for the type of plane, perhaps someone will step up and take you for a ride. Larry On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:52 PM, James Dustin > wrote: Thanks Larry Are you close to Billings that I can take a look at yours? ----- Original Message ----- From: Larry Cottrell<mailto:lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:48 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Well I flew a stock Mark 3 Classic when I was 6' 250 lbs, and didn't have any trouble. I doubt that you would have any more trouble with it, than you would with any other plane. Best guess is try it on for size. These little wormy guy's just don't know how resourceful a guy can be :-) Good luck Larry On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:27 PM, James Dustin > wrote: I'm 5'11" and 260lbs. The owner thinks I may have trouble getting In and out of it. ----- Original Message ----- From: Larry Cottrell<mailto:lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2013 8:22 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: how big are you? Is there any reason to think that you wouldn't? Larry On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 8:07 PM, James Dustin > wrote: Is anyone close to Billings, MT have a Kolb Mark lll Classic? I'm looking at buying a Kolb classic and Im curious if I will fit in it. get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List tronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List> tp://forums.matronics.com<http://forums.matronics.com/> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ntribution> -- If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending. href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http:/ /forums.matronics.com<http://forums.matronics.com/> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List tronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List> tp://forums.matronics.com<http://forums.matronics.com/> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ntribution> -- If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending. href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List ttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http:/ /forums.matronics.com<http://forums.matronics.com/> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending. http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List igator?Kolb-List> http://www.matronics.com/contribution on> ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Eddie" <e.bayliss(at)blueyonder.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Engines
Date: Jan 05, 2013
Yes I am more than happy with the climb rate of my Kolb but have to point out I have never checked the accuracy of the vsi but judging from the climb angle and the time to reach altitude it cant be too far off the mark ----- Original Message ----- From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Sunday, January 06, 2013 12:23 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Engines > > Wow Eddie! Thats some good climb. I am used to only 300 fpm in my PPC on > hot days and 2 up. I am at 3000 msl but on summer evenings density > altitude is around 7000. > > -------- > Wesley Elliott > Sport Pilot-PPC > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391682#391682 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Engines
From: "Thom Riddle" <riddletr(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jan 06, 2013
Rick, ...It seems that the high frequency vibration from these engines causes a bunch of metal fatigue issues withexhaustsystems and other systems on and around these engines. Talk to any 912 driver that has any significant hours on their engines and they will reportsimilarproblems.... A little clarification on this subject is needed. Following is my experience in this regard: I've owned 4 different airplanes with 912 engines. I've also been maintaining several other 912 powered aircraft for about 11 years. Only one of them ever had a cracked exhaust system problem. Allegro 2000 is the one that had regular and continued exhaust system cracking. It was due to crappy materials and design. It had absolutely nothing to do with the engine vibrations. I maintained all of these airplanes so the differences in maintenance was not the cause either. All 4 airplanes had at least several hundred hours on them, but only the Allegro, made in Czech Republic just like the Sport Cruiser, had exhaust system cracking problem. When I took the cracked exhaust system to a highly qualified local welder to repair the first time, he had a hard time welding it. He had never seen any kind of metal like it, ever, and he had been welding anything and everything for over 30 years. After second time it cracked I ordered a new, recently redesigned exhaust piece from the factory. It was so redesigned that it would not fit the old muffler. So I had the old one repaired again and sold the airplane, warning the new owner that he would have exhaust system cracking before long.... and he did. I'm now half owner of a Diamond Katana with Rotax 912-F3 engine which is second 912 engine in this airframe. First one was an A3 model which had about 1500 hours on it when it was swapped for the newer F3 model, which now has 1100+ hours on it. The original exhaust system is still on the airplane and has over 2600 hours on it with no cracks or other issues. There are no differences between the 912UL engines and the type certificated 912F3 engines in internal parts. The only differences are in some external systems such as fuel lines, oil lines, and double carb springs instead of single on the UL, and of course the paper work trail. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY (9G0) Kolb Slingshot SS-021 no engine FOR SALE Diamond Katana DA20-A1 Rotax 912 F3 Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long. - Anonymous Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391702#391702 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Viking engine in 750 Zenith
From: Gary Aman <zeprep251(at)aol.com>
Date: Jan 06, 2013
Seems Mike said it was 178# with cooling stuff,inaccurate maybe, but might be tough install in a pusher.Two of us lifted it off the pallet easily. -----Original Message----- From: Virgil <vlingerjr(at)aol.com> ary Aman ; Gary Jindra ; Paul St ropki Sent: Fri, Jan 4, 2013 3:11 pm Sent from my iPhone ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Viking engine in 750 Zenith
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 06, 2013
I saw the Viking in a Airwold PPC in the pusher config. The guy is always bragging how much he likes it. Wes -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391706#391706 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Flight Simulator
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 06, 2013
So I am looking at the Microsoft Flight Simulator. Has anyone bought the pedals and throttle for their PC? I assume the KOLB uses a stick and not a Yolk? Does anyone have any pics of the throttle and stick? Wes -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391707#391707 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dan Walter" <worrybear(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Flight Simulator
Date: Jan 06, 2013
Wes, I have bought 3 versions of Microsoft Flight Sim, none have worked properly, and I don't think they support it any more, not much support when they did. There are others out there but I haven't tried any of them. Dan ----- Original Message ----- From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Sunday, January 06, 2013 1:40 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Flight Simulator > > So I am looking at the Microsoft Flight Simulator. Has anyone bought the > pedals and throttle for their PC? > > I assume the KOLB uses a stick and not a Yolk? > > Does anyone have any pics of the throttle and stick? > > Wes > > -------- > Wesley Elliott > Sport Pilot-PPC > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391707#391707 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Flight Simulator
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 06, 2013
Thanks for sharing your experience. I got interested as Paul Hamilton has a section on it on his website. beasportpilot.com Your experience with it makes me think twice about it. -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391739#391739 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Engines
From: "GeoB" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net>
Date: Jan 07, 2013
> I was the first to fly a direct drive and now redrive VW on a Kolb. Rick, what have you heard about the actual proven benefits of the nikasil cylinders for the VW? GeoB -------- GeoB "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391745#391745 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 4A084 power?
From: "GeoB" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net>
Date: Jan 07, 2013
I am wondering if any of you know of anyone running a Teledyne/Continental 4A084 on a Kolb. I have a Firestar-I. Yes, I know they are heavy at ~127 lbs, they can be built to around 50 hp but prolly no more than that. Still... they are cheap and reliable and I wouldn't have to carry as much fuel. Parts are worlds cheaper than my Rotax DCDI 503. Just wondering... GeoB -------- GeoB "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391746#391746 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Pat Ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Flight Simulator
Date: Jan 07, 2013
Microsoft Flight Simulator. Has anyone bought the pedals and throttle for their PC?>> I have a stick which twists to provide rudder control. That works OK.# The pedals I bought did not. There is also an attachment to your cap which ,through a little receiver clipped to the screen enables you to change view by turning your head. Worked for a while then failed and I am not computer savvy enough to sort it out. My control stick has a throttle attached which is fine but it could do with a trimmer. Change of view is controlled by a `hat` on the stick. That is OK. I use the X plane version. This has a weightshift and a Piper Cub at the light aircraft end of the offerings with a nice gentle fly in Cross country and also landing the Cub on the top of a moving van. I have not managed that yet. There are now some very good additions of photographic scenery these days if you like VFR flying. Pat. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 07, 2013
Subject: Re: Engines
From: Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com>
GeoB I have no personal experience with the nikasil cylinders for VW engines. I had been told by Steve Bennitt (sp) at Great Plains Aircraft that they are 10# lighter than steel and have much better heat transfer. The last time I talked to Steve he had said that they weren't working out and he no longer recommended them. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 4:40 AM, GeoB wrote: > > > I was the first to fly a direct drive and now redrive VW on a Kolb. > > Rick, what have you heard about the actual proven benefits of the nikasil > cylinders for the VW? > > GeoB > > -------- > GeoB > > "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR > drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391745#391745 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HShack(at)aol.com
Date: Jan 08, 2013
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
Too heavy for FS I. Who said 50 hp? Gov't rated at 10 hp,; it may actually be 20 hp, It is 48 c,i., doubt it can produce over 1 hp per cube. I had one; fun to play with. Don't waste your time . You already have the best engine for FS I. Should be good for 500 hrs. before you need to spend any money. Shack SC In a message dated 1/7/2013 4:50:31 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, gab16(at)sbcglobal.net writes: --> Kolb-List message posted by: "GeoB" I am wondering if any of you know of anyone running a Teledyne/Continental 4A084 on a Kolb. I have a Firestar-I. Yes, I know they are heavy at ~127 lbs, they can be built to around 50 hp but prolly no more than that. Still... they are cheap and reliable and I wouldn't have to carry as much fuel. Parts are worlds cheaper than my Rotax DCDI 503. Just wondering... GeoB -------- GeoB "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391746#391746 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 07, 2013
From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
There are three models of these surplus engines...4a032. 4a042 and 4a084...the 084 is rated at 20 hp at 10,000 feet...It will fly a mini max with a redrive...doing so in Wise Co.,Va. will probably fly a Firestar or Firefly... but a bit heavy..as is noted... 84 cubes... Herb At 11:12 PM 1/7/2013, you wrote: >Too heavy for FS I. Who said 50 hp? Gov't rated at 10 hp,; it may >actually be 20 hp, It is 48 c,i., doubt it can produce over 1 hp per cube. > >I had one; fun to play with. Don't waste your time . > >You already have the best engine for FS I. Should be good for 500 >hrs. before you need to spend any money. > >Shack >SC > >In a message dated 1/7/2013 4:50:31 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, >gab16(at)sbcglobal.net writes: > >I am wondering if any of you know of anyone running a >Teledyne/Continental 4A084 on a Kolb. I have a Firestar-I. Yes, I >know they are heavy at ~127 lbs, they can be built to around 50 hp >but prolly no more than that. Still... they are cheap and reliable >and I wouldn't have to carry as much fuel. Parts are worlds cheaper >than my Rotax DCDI 503. Just wondering... > >GeoB > >-------- >GeoB > >"Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like >NASCAR drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391746#391746 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
From: "GeoB" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net>
Date: Jan 08, 2013
Thanks for your reply Shack! I hate it when someone asks a question then argues with someone who answers him! This isn't my intent here. Since this is a public forum and we have a public conversation here I am citing some information that I have collected from good sources, simply to keep the lurkers from making wrong decisions. > Too heavy for FS I. I have been wondering about this. Reason I was considering it is that the FS has a reasonably good gross weight (which I forget), and with not all that many structural changes it became a 2-place. The wings are not as strong as the 2-place but they are about the same sq footage. That being said, I have no clue if it is *really* too heavy. My 503 weighs about 98 lbs. The 084 weighs 127 lbs complete with prop in a typical setup. The 084 would be operated direct-drive. At the slow speeds of the FS-I, I think the advantage goes to the 503 with the gear reduction unit. > Who said 50 hp? Gov't rated at 10 hp,; it may actually be 20 hp >From a military manual: Bore: 3" Stroke: 3" Displacement: 84.8 cu in Rated continuous net hp: 20 @ 3600 rpm Max hp 33.3 @ 3600 rpm Max torque @ 2000 rpm; 60.3 This is to 5000 ft. Note that we free up some serious hp when we remove the huge cooling fan. Also, remember I said that the 084 cab 'built' to about 50 hp. This is without raising the low compression ratio. 084 experts (true experts) suggest that one NOT raise the CR because it would lead to over-heating. One expert markets an EFI setup for this engine. Over-all he seems to be a conservative can-do person, very believable. His engine is close to 50 hp based on the size/pitch of prop he spins with it. Most of us interested in the 084 accept that it produces 42-44 hp stock, w/o the fan. About 1/2 hp/cu inch. > It is 48 c,i., doubt it can produce over 1 hp per cube. we are looking at the 084, 84 cu inches. I think you are remembering the smaller 2-cylinder, the 2A042 (42 cu inches) > I had one; fun to play with. Don't waste your time . Now I am not sure if you had the 042 or the 084. There is a video on Youtube with a fella flying around just fine with the 042 on a Minimax. I have seen videos of several planes flying with the 084 but none of them were Firestar-I's. IIRC I have an old pic of a Kolb with an 084 but I can't seem to dig up more info on it. I already have three 084's. Haven't had a chance to crank them up yet. I am planning to build a big workshop but it will be months before that happens. > You already have the best engine for FS I. That is gratifying to hear. I like thinking about these swaps but will probably just learn to like a ring-ding. > Should be good for 500 hrs. Mine hasn't been run for 5-7 years. I expect I will have to tear it down and replace seals, from what I have heard. TT = 38 hours. Have you seen the 4A032? Cute lil 4-banger! About 70 lbs. I doubt it would ever be of use for flight but maybe on a Kart! I see that a class of karting using the Honda 390 or clone is getting popular. At 13 hp it really scoots. How much nicer to have a 4-banger with cute lil zoomies sticking up! I am guessing that it will put out ~14 hp. GeoB -------- GeoB "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391791#391791 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 08, 2013
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
From: Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com>
Just a few more thoughts. The RPMs listed are real close to my direct drive VW. Thrust is what makes a airplane fly, that and MONEY. The horse power needs to be converted to thrust and at a 3600 working RPM you are restricted to a small prop somewhere around 58" or less. The general rule is the bigger the prop the more HP is turned into thrust until the prop tips go supersonic.. My direct drive VW used to turn a good portion of its power into noise instead of thrust. Also the rated max torque is at 2000 RPM. I configured my latest VW to have maximum torque in the cruise to takeoff RPM range. Unlike a car a aircraft engine doesn't need very much torque at low RPMs but does require the most torque at cruise and takeoff RPMs. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC On Tue, Jan 8, 2013 at 4:11 AM, GeoB wrote: > > Thanks for your reply Shack! > > I hate it when someone asks a question then argues with someone who > answers him! This isn't my intent here. Since this is a public forum and we > have a public conversation here I am citing some information that I have > collected from good sources, simply to keep the lurkers from making wrong > decisions. > > > Too heavy for FS I. > > I have been wondering about this. Reason I was considering it is that the > FS has a reasonably good gross weight (which I forget), and with not all > that many structural changes it became a 2-place. The wings are not as > strong as the 2-place but they are about the same sq footage. That being > said, I have no clue if it is *really* too heavy. > > My 503 weighs about 98 lbs. The 084 weighs 127 lbs complete with prop in > a typical setup. > > The 084 would be operated direct-drive. At the slow speeds of the FS-I, I > think the advantage goes to the 503 with the gear reduction unit. > > > Who said 50 hp? Gov't rated at 10 hp,; it may actually be 20 hp > > >From a military manual: > > Bore: 3" > Stroke: 3" > Displacement: 84.8 cu in > Rated continuous net hp: 20 @ 3600 rpm > Max hp 33.3 @ 3600 rpm > Max torque @ 2000 rpm; 60.3 > > This is to 5000 ft. > > Note that we free up some serious hp when we remove the huge cooling fan. > > Also, remember I said that the 084 cab 'built' to about 50 hp. This is > without raising the low compression ratio. 084 experts (true experts) > suggest that one NOT raise the CR because it would lead to over-heating. > One expert markets an EFI setup for this engine. Over-all he seems to be a > conservative can-do person, very believable. His engine is close to 50 hp > based on the size/pitch of prop he spins with it. Most of us interested in > the 084 accept that it produces 42-44 hp stock, w/o the fan. About 1/2 > hp/cu inch. > > > It is 48 c,i., doubt it can produce over 1 hp per cube. > > we are looking at the 084, 84 cu inches. I think you are remembering the > smaller 2-cylinder, the 2A042 (42 cu inches) > > > I had one; fun to play with. Don't waste your time . > > Now I am not sure if you had the 042 or the 084. There is a video on > Youtube with a fella flying around just fine with the 042 on a Minimax. I > have seen videos of several planes flying with the 084 but none of them > were Firestar-I's. IIRC I have an old pic of a Kolb with an 084 but I can't > seem to dig up more info on it. I already have three 084's. Haven't had a > chance to crank them up yet. I am planning to build a big workshop but it > will be months before that happens. > > > You already have the best engine for FS I. > > That is gratifying to hear. I like thinking about these swaps but will > probably just learn to like a ring-ding. > > > Should be good for 500 hrs. > > Mine hasn't been run for 5-7 years. I expect I will have to tear it down > and replace seals, from what I have heard. TT = 38 hours. > > Have you seen the 4A032? Cute lil 4-banger! About 70 lbs. I doubt it would > ever be of use for flight but maybe on a Kart! I see that a class of > karting using the Honda 390 or clone is getting popular. At 13 hp it really > scoots. How much nicer to have a 4-banger with cute lil zoomies sticking > up! I am guessing that it will put out ~14 hp. > > GeoB > > -------- > GeoB > > "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR > drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391791#391791 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 08, 2013
From: Dan <dan42101(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
=C2-=C2-=C2-ENGINE Q&A=C2-- your engine questions investigated Experimenter - November 95=C2-Q.=C2-=C2-Dear Engine Q&A - To answer t he questions about engine horsepower ratings=C2-in the September EXPERIME NTER, I can suggest some rules of thumb that I have heard through the years . They seem to be good approximations.1) To get the effective prop swinging horsepower for small direct drive four-cycle engines, divide the cubic inc hes by two. That makes an O-200 Continental a 100 horse engine. The hopeles sly weak Corvair rated at 150 hp in a car has 145 cubic inches like the 65 hp Lycoming, and that=99s about all it can do. The 750 cubic Hisso en gine is rated at 150 horses but has an effective propeller power of 375 hp. That=99s why it can turn an eight-foot propeller and fly a big airpl ane that a 150 hp Lycoming can barely taxi. The source of this rule was Hob art Sorrell (now deceased) of Tenino, Washington. His crafty wits produced the Guppy biplane that flew on a Cushman golf cart engine.2) Using the effe ctive power described above, you can multiply times 4-1/4 to get the approximate thrust with typ ical propeller efficiency of 85%. Source of this rule was John Thorp (decea sed) of the T-18. See "Cowling and Cooling of Engines" which appeared in SP ORT AVIATION some years ago (Ed. Note: This series appeared in the November and December 1963 issues).Hopefully, these two have left a legacy that we can all use. When a reduction gear is applied to the engine, the effective power is multiplied by the gear ratio.I haven=99t tried to extrapolat e the formula to two stroke engines because I have very little experience w ith them. I can=99t tell what the effective power is of the little 70 horse drone engine that one sees buzzing away on a Bensen Gyrocopter for i nstance.Yours truly - Bertran Copp, Monmouth, OregonQ.=C2-=C2-Dear Mary - In the September 1995 EXPERIMENTER, Jim Delaney of Coralville,=C2-Iowa asks whether a Continental A-65, a 65 hp Rotax and a 65 hp Volkswagen all produce the same thrust. Assuming the same airplane and properly matched propeller/engine/a irplane combination for best cruise, the answer is yes, theoretically. Prop eller efficiency differences will produce the only variation in performance . This usually amounts to only 2 or 3%. Thus, horsepower is a valid method of comparison for correctly matched propellers because thrust is directly r elated to horsepower.Often static thrust is erroneously thought to be an in dicator of flight performance. A propeller designed for maximum static thru st will severely limit cruise speed. This type of design is only suitable f or helicopter rotors. It is an over-simplification if applied to airplanes. Proper propeller design involves matching thrust to drag and finding the b est cruise to climb tradeoff. Putting it all together involves difficult an d tedious calculations. I am a consulting aeronautical engineer and author of a computer program called "prop optimizer" that matches propeller to engine and airplane automatically.Many design studies I have done indic ate that there is an optimum propeller size and rpm for any engine/airplane combination. Airplanes, even of one design, can vary considerably in drag due to manufacturing differences. Therefore, if best performance is desired , the propeller should be individually matched for each airplane. Specific questions may be directed to me at 916/622-1886.Sincerely - Don Bates, Plac erville, CaliforniaQ.=C2-=C2-Dear Engine Q&A - I would like to know if there is a four-stroke engine out there in the=C2-65 hp range that would work on my new S-12XL, other than the Rotax 912 - one that doesn=99t require a second mortgage to purchase.The RANS S-12XL is an excellent aircr aft, I believe. The engine to use on it has stumped me. The only two engine s that I know of that might work are the new Yamaha four-stroke engine, whi ch is unavailable at this time, and the Moto Guzzi, which is unproven on a pusher aircraft. What is your opinion? Who answers these questions? What about a Subaru?Sincerely - Don Herwander, Everett, WashingtonA.=C2-=C2-Dear Don - We=99ll toss your questions out for our readers and see if, per ch ance,=C2-another S-12 owner is powering his aircraft with an alternate en gine.Thanks for writing! - MaryQ.=C2-=C2-Dear Don - May I congratulate you on your column in the EXPERIMENTER as I feel=C2-it is a very importan t part of that magazine providing the type of information that we all want regarding the Subaru engine.In the May edition, regarding the tip speed of propellers, was the decimal point in the wrong place? Should it have been . 00436 and not .000436?I am building a Pober Pixie lookalike under our 95/10 category and will be powering it with a Subaru EA 81 imported from Japan w ith approximately 34,000 miles on it. (It appears to be in very good condit ion.)I will be using one of the carburetors that you recommend, but is ther e any reason we can=99t use the one that is on it - a Hitachi DCM 306-1 downdraft.With respect to the engine, I will be leaving it exactly as is with direct drive and a 52 x 26 propeller. However, I will need a thrust bearing and propeller extensio n. Could you please advise me where I can obtain these.I also believe with this combination I should get in the vicinity of 70 hp. Is this correct?Tha nking you once again for all your help in the past and looking forward to m eeting you maybe one day at Oshkosh if we can make it again. (We were over there in 1982 - a wonderful show.)Kindest regards - Joe Anderson, Queenslan d, AustraliaA.=C2-=C2-Dear Joe - It=99s nice to receive a letter all the way from Australia. Your Pober Pixie=C2-lookalike is going to be a good looking aircraft. There=99s so many different aircraft to choo se from, it=99s hard to select one you would really like.Regarding th e Hitachi carburetor, it will work fine. The venturis are small and functio nal, but at this application, you=99ll want to use a larger venturi-type carburetor t o give you more power, like the Ford Pinto carburetor I=99ve mentione d before. If you look at them both together, you=99ll use the differe nce. You=99ll need more air to give more perforrmance because you =99re running the engine at a higher rpm. The engine has to breathe.Rega rding the thrust bearing, I don=99t think you=99ll need one. On the 52 x 26 you should get about 3600 rpm at about 60 or more hp because t he engine doesn=99t get into the power curve, but you should get 325 - 330 lbs. of thrust.What kind of prop adapter are you using. If you don =99t have one, you need to get one that you can drill a hole in the cent er and tap the crank shaft to make a good secure connection.The comment on tip speed on prop was made by Ed Sterba and I can=99t answer that (Ed . Note: Yes, you=99re right, the figure should have been .00436 - we apologize for this error and any confusion this has caused our readers. The correct formula, then, is: Tip Speed = .00436 x diamete r x rpm (with the tip speed in ft./sec. and the diameter in inches.)I hope I=99ve helped in some way. Feel free to write any time.Yours truly - DonQ.=C2-=C2-Greetings, Don - I=99ve found your work very informa tive and wonder if I could avail myself=C2-of some of your information se rvices, while keeping same as short as possible.I=99ve always been im pressed with the formula for torque, rather than horsepower. In endeavoring to keep a Subaru conversion as simple as possible the thought occurred to me to try drive direct and with half rpms. I=99ve often thought about a blower but with enough input, like a unit from an emission system, to ke ep a plenum full of intake air. Possibly a special cam shape may help in im proving induction while exhausting more fully.I realize this sounds extreme , but it appears the engine has enough flywheel weight to ensure smooth run ning at low rpms. And, with the extant oil pump, has any thought been given to oil cooling? I would imagin e any number of highly developed oil coolers might be available cheaply off of unused large airplane engines.Any thought or information in this very c onceptual stage will be greatly appreciated. By the same token, if you have any special interests, I=99d appreciate knowing them.All the best - Norman Benedict, Santa Maria, CaliforniaA.=C2-=C2-Dear Norman - Nice re ceiving your letter and the interest in Subaru powerplant conversions. If y ou use the EA-81 for small aircraft, straight drive, a 54 x 26 prop would g ive you 325 lbs. of thrust in the pusher type. You didn=99t mention t he aircraft you wanted to use. I have no idea what horsepower you want, so we=99ll cover all the bases.EA-81 - 72 hp (ideal for small aircraft). With drive would give around 450-475 lbs. of thrust with a 2.2:1 ratio. We ight with redrive 180 lbs.Legacy - 130 hp, straight drive would give you 45 0-475 lbs. of thrust. With redrive, 550-570 lbs. of thrust with a 2.1:1 ratio. The weigh t of the Legacy with drive would range from 180-210 lbs.Oil coolers have be en used on Subarus and are easy to hook up. There are discharge fittings on oil pumps that you can use.I hope I=99ve helped you. - DonQ.=C2- =C2-Dear Don - I have read with great interest the various responses to l etters in the=C2-EXPERIMENTER concerning the use of Subaru engines in hom ebuilt aircraft, and you obviously have an extensive knowledge of these pow erplants.In the November 1994 issue of EXPERIMENTER there was a table publi shed which defined general engine specifications, which I must assume was f rom official Subaru sources.When I study the table, I find that the highest horsepower developed by an EA-81 OHC engines in naturally aspirated forms do not achieve close to the advertised 98/100 hp advertised by all the majo r Subaru engine convertors for the EA-81.Any ideas how this massive discrep ancy occurs other than a communal dose of advertising licence?I have already ordered a converted EA-81 engine (SHO) version from what I judge as a professional e ngineer to be the premium quality source, but I will most certainly be very pleasantly surprised if the actual power output is in excess of 100 rather than the advertised 118 hp. Your article appeared two months after I had p laced my order after much deliberation on the relative merits of the Subaru versus the Rotax 912 or 914.Incidentally, there would appear to be equal o ptimism regarding fuel consumption of Rotax engines. A study of the genuine Rotax fuel flow charts will quickly reveal that one would have to lean the mixture to unburnable ratios to achieve the popular quoted figures. It was quite refreshing to read a report in the latest issue of KITPLANES of a fl ight test of the 914 in the Pelican which quoted realistic fuel consumption figures which do match the fuel burn rates shown on the Rotax charts for this engine.Any comments would be most welcome.Yours sincerely - Fred H. Tayler, Hoffman Estates, ILA.=C2-=C2-Dear Fred - Was nice rec eiving your letter and very interesting. The EA-81 engines=C2-that they a dvertise with higher horsepower is accomplished by different cams, shaving heads and polishing intake and exhaust ports,and sometimes increasing the s ize of pistons. That=99s how they accomplish the claimed horsepower.T he fuel consumption of the Rotax engine probably involves an in-cockpit adj ustment for the carburetor to lean out for better fuel consumption. You can also do that with the Subaru.I feel that the EA-81 stock works very well w ithout adding cams, etc. I feel if it works, don=99t mess with it.I h ope I=99ve answered your questions. Yours truly - Don=C2-=C2- __________=C2-engine q&a=C2-__________ =C2-Members Home Page=C2-|=C2-EAA Home Page=C2-|=C2-Chapters=C2 -|=C2-Government=C2-|=C2-Homebuilders Member Benefits=C2-|=C2-EAA Flight Planner=C2-|=C2-Aviation Advisor s=C2-|=C2-Magazine Search Aircraft Facts=C2-|=C2-Update your Profile=C2-|=C2-e-HOT LINE=C2- |=C2-EAA Airport & Destination Guide Contact Us=C2-|=C2-AirVenture=C2-|=C2- - DjD --- On Tue, 1/8/13, GeoB wrote: From: GeoB <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net> Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 4A084 power? Date: Tuesday, January 8, 2013, 3:11 AM Thanks for your reply Shack! I hate it when someone asks a question then argues with someone who answers him! This isn't my intent here. Since this is a public forum and we have a public conversation here I am citing some information that I have collecte d from good sources, simply to keep the lurkers from making wrong decisions . > Too heavy for FS I. I have been wondering about this. Reason I was considering it is that the F S has a reasonably good gross weight (which I forget), and with not all tha t many structural changes it became a 2-place. The wings are not as strong as the 2-place but they are about the same sq footage. That being said, I h ave no clue if it is *really* too heavy. My 503 weighs about 98 lbs. The 084 weighs 127 lbs complete with prop in=C2 - a typical setup. The 084 would be operated direct-drive. At the slow speeds of the FS-I, I t hink the advantage goes to the 503 with the gear reduction unit. >=C2- Who said 50 hp?=C2- Gov't rated at 10 hp,; it=C2- may actually be 20 hp >From a military manual: Bore: 3" Stroke: 3" Displacement: 84.8 cu in Rated continuous net hp: 20 @ 3600 rpm Max hp 33.3 @ 3600 rpm Max torque @ 2000 rpm; 60.3 This is to 5000 ft. Note that we free up some serious hp when we remove the huge cooling fan. Also, remember I said that the 084 cab 'built' to about 50 hp. This is with out raising the low compression ratio. 084 experts (true experts) suggest t hat one NOT raise the CR because it would lead to over-heating. One expert markets an EFI setup for this engine. Over-all he seems to be a conservativ e can-do person, very believable. His engine is close to 50 hp based on the size/pitch of prop he spins with it. Most of us interested in the 084 acce pt that it produces 42-44 hp stock, w/o the fan. About 1/2 hp/cu inch. > It is 48 c,i., doubt it can produce over 1 hp per=C2- cube. we are looking at the 084, 84 cu inches. I think you are remembering the sm aller 2-cylinder, the 2A042 (42 cu inches) =C2- > I had one; fun to play with.=C2- Don't waste your time . Now I am not sure if you had the 042 or the 084. There is a video on Youtub e with a fella flying around just fine with the 042 on a Minimax. I have se en videos of several planes flying with the 084 but none of them were Fires tar-I's. IIRC I have an old pic of a Kolb with an 084 but I can't seem to d ig up more info on it. I already have three 084's. Haven't had a chance to crank them up yet. I am planning to build a big workshop but it will be mon ths before that happens. =C2- > You already have the best engine for FS I. That is gratifying to hear. I like thinking about these swaps but will prob ably just learn to like a ring-ding. > Should be good for 500 hrs. Mine hasn't been run for 5-7 years. I expect I will have to tear it down an d replace seals, from what I have heard. TT = 38 hours. Have you seen the 4A032? Cute lil 4-banger! About 70 lbs. I doubt it would ever be of use for flight but maybe on a Kart! I see that a class of kartin g using the Honda 390 or clone is getting popular. At 13 hp it really scoot s. How much nicer to have a 4-banger with cute lil zoomies sticking up! I a m guessing that it will put out ~14 hp. GeoB -------- GeoB "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391791#391791 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HShack(at)aol.com
Date: Jan 08, 2013
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
I had a 4ao32 and a 4a084. I put a belt drive on the 32 and ran it on a mobile test cart [prop driven] Anemic at best. Would make a very good engine for a very large RC plane. Also put the 84 on the cart, direct drive. Better, but still weak. I got rid of all the cooling tin, the cooling fan, and the shielding on the spark plug wires. I think weight was less than 120 something. We tried several different carbs; none helped much. Sure, the 84 is flying on some planes, but I doubt any are flying out of a short field. Climb rate will be poor compared to a 503.[Even if it were 50 hp.] If I were to put one on a plane, it would probably be on a lightly built Minimax. Beef up the nose a little. Paint up the engine real nice. Put on an efficient wood prop. Tractor config. is much better at cooling than pusher.[without adding any cowling]. I had a nice FS II w/ 503, just recently sold it. Getting older and dumber meant it was time to get out. Have fun with the 84, just don't expect too much. Shack ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HShack(at)aol.com
Date: Jan 08, 2013
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
Using this formula, the 4ao84 would issue about 178 lb. thrust. My 503 gave 375 lb. thrust [static]. Howard Shackleford FS II SC In a message dated 1/8/2013 12:35:07 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, dan42101(at)yahoo.com writes: To get the effective prop swinging horsepower for small direct drive four-cycle engines, divide the cubic inches by two. That makes an O-200 Continental a 100 horse engine. The hopelessly weak Corvair rated at 150 h p in a car has 145 cubic inches like the 65 hp Lycoming, and that=99s about all it can do. The 750 cubic Hisso engine is rated at 150 horses but has an effective propeller power of 375 hp. That=99s why it can turn an eight-foot pr opeller and fly a big airplane that a 150 hp Lycoming can barely taxi. The source of this rule was Hobart Sorrell (now deceased) of Tenino, Washington. His crafty wits produced the Guppy biplane that flew on a Cushman golf cart engine. 2) Using the effective power described above, you can multiply times 4-1/4 to get the approximate thrust with typical propeller efficiency of 85% ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 08, 2013
From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
The 084 that is flying on a Hi Max is swinging a 62x40 prop at about 4000 rpms...Using a home made 1 to 1.66 redrive ratio... My bud who responded is the one who built the belted redrive. Not sure of the thrust? Likely over 200 lbs static... A friend has a firestar with a 377 and it flies very well...Herb At 01:35 PM 1/8/2013, you wrote: >Using this formula, the 4ao84 would issue about >178 lb. thrust. My 503 gave 375 lb. thrust [static]. > >Howard Shackleford >FS II >SC > >In a message dated 1/8/2013 12:35:07 P.M. >Eastern Standard Time, dan42101(at)yahoo.com writes: > >To get the effective prop swinging horsepower >for small direct drive four-cycle engines, >divide the cubic inches by two. That makes an >O-200 Continental a 100 horse engine. The >hopelessly weak Corvair rated at 150 hp in a car >has 145 cubic inches like the 65 hp Lycoming, >and that=99s about all it can do. The 750 cubic >Hisso engine is rated at 150 horses but has an >effective propeller power of 375 hp. That=99s >why it can turn an eight-foot propeller and fly >a big airplane that a 150 hp Lycoming can barely >taxi. The source of this rule was Hobart Sorrell >(now deceased) of Tenino, Washington. His crafty >wits produced the Guppy biplane that flew on a Cushman golf cart engine. > >2) Using the effective power described above, >you can multiply times 4-1/4 to get the >approximate thrust with typical propeller efficiency of 85% > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
From: "GeoB" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net>
Date: Jan 08, 2013
> a 3600 working RPM you arerestrictedto a small prop Thanks Rick. This is maybe the biggest draw-back. And with this engine it is a really big deal to attempt to raise the rpm of torque peak, unless I use EFI.. which will help there given I replace the entire intake manifold. I like doing/planning engine mods, done that for like 45 years. I have a coupla Generac engines I plan to modi-fly, I'd rather express myself there. I wonder about the over-heating issue I have been told about. Sure, more power generally means more heat. So, if I raise my CR I add to the thermal loading of the engine, IN THEORY. But since higher CR adds power and efficiency (or just efficiency which effects power), why couldn't I just back off the throttle a tad and lower the thermal loading? Should give greater available power for a short time plus yield better mpg. I think. I am actively soliciting comments on this idea. Sure, at full throttle the EFI will produce more heat also but I don't want a setup that requires full throttle all the time. GeoB -------- GeoB "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391849#391849 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 08, 2013
From: Malcolm Brubaker <brubakermal(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: michigan seminar
-=0Amula, our ultralight group is having a safety seminar and annual par ty kicking off our 25th anniversary. MULA now stands for Michigan ultraligh t lightsport association. when i put out a post like this our mula web site receives a real boost in activity. that reflects the real impact of a top ic, and the activety of a group. =0Ahttp://www.michiganultralight.com/newsl etter/JAN13/Jan13evers.PDF=0AMalcolm & Jeanne Brubaker =0AMichigan Sport Pi lot Repair =0Ahttp://michigansportpilotrepair.com/ =0ALSRM-A, PPC, WS=0AGr eat Sails - Sailmaker =0Afor Ultralight & Light Sport=0A(989)513-3022 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb-List Digest: 8 Msgs - 01/08/13
From: Ted <tc1917(at)bellsouth.net>
Date: Jan 09, 2013
Gotta respond to these thoughts of small engines on kolbs Been flying these little buggers from abt 1993. I feel mpg is important but when I hit a sinker, downdraft, sudden tailwind or just plain nasty wind I am mighty glad I have some reserve power to save my butt. We played with most all those cart and industrial engines and pretty much came to the conclusion we wanted strong, fast and reliable power plants. This dicussion might get some newbies thinking they should put their lawn mower engine on a kolb and die for it. While it may be perfectly fine for you expert engineers to configure a five horse briggs to fly do not encourage the average dude to try it. I would not want that on my head. Make sure they understand the ramifications of engine failure in flight and lack of power in emergencies. My opinion. Ted Cowan slingshot 912ul zoom zoom Sent from my iPhone On Jan 9, 2013, at 2:02 AM, Kolb-List Digest Server wrote: > * > > ================================================= > Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive > ================================================= > > Today's complete Kolb-List Digest can also be found in either of the > two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted > in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes > and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version > of the Kolb-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor > such as Notepad or with a web browser. > > HTML Version: > > http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 13-01-08&Archive=Kolb > > Text Version: > > http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 13-01-08&Archive=Kolb > > > =============================================== > EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive > =============================================== > > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > Kolb-List Digest Archive > --- > Total Messages Posted Tue 01/08/13: 8 > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > > Today's Message Index: > ---------------------- > > 1. 01:11 AM - Re: 4A084 power? (GeoB) > 2. 07:56 AM - Re: Re: 4A084 power? (Rick Neilsen) > 3. 09:35 AM - Re: Re: 4A084 power? (Dan) > 4. 11:27 AM - Re: Re: 4A084 power? (HShack(at)aol.com) > 5. 11:36 AM - Re: Re: 4A084 power? (HShack(at)aol.com) > 6. 02:39 PM - Re: Re: 4A084 power? (Herb Gayheart) > 7. 03:27 PM - Re: 4A084 power? (GeoB) > 8. 05:43 PM - michigan seminar (Malcolm Brubaker) > > > > ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ > > > Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 4A084 power? > From: "GeoB" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net> > > > Thanks for your reply Shack! > > I hate it when someone asks a question then argues with someone who answers him! > This isn't my intent here. Since this is a public forum and we have a public > conversation here I am citing some information that I have collected from good > sources, simply to keep the lurkers from making wrong decisions. > >> Too heavy for FS I. > > I have been wondering about this. Reason I was considering it is that the FS has > a reasonably good gross weight (which I forget), and with not all that many > structural changes it became a 2-place. The wings are not as strong as the 2-place > but they are about the same sq footage. That being said, I have no clue if > it is *really* too heavy. > > My 503 weighs about 98 lbs. The 084 weighs 127 lbs complete with prop in a typical > setup. > > The 084 would be operated direct-drive. At the slow speeds of the FS-I, I think > the advantage goes to the 503 with the gear reduction unit. > >> Who said 50 hp? Gov't rated at 10 hp,; it may actually be 20 hp > >> From a military manual: > > Bore: 3" > Stroke: 3" > Displacement: 84.8 cu in > Rated continuous net hp: 20 @ 3600 rpm > Max hp 33.3 @ 3600 rpm > Max torque @ 2000 rpm; 60.3 > > This is to 5000 ft. > > Note that we free up some serious hp when we remove the huge cooling fan. > > Also, remember I said that the 084 cab 'built' to about 50 hp. This is without > raising the low compression ratio. 084 experts (true experts) suggest that one > NOT raise the CR because it would lead to over-heating. One expert markets an > EFI setup for this engine. Over-all he seems to be a conservative can-do person, > very believable. His engine is close to 50 hp based on the size/pitch of prop > he spins with it. Most of us interested in the 084 accept that it produces > 42-44 hp stock, w/o the fan. About 1/2 hp/cu inch. > >> It is 48 c,i., doubt it can produce over 1 hp per cube. > > we are looking at the 084, 84 cu inches. I think you are remembering the smaller > 2-cylinder, the 2A042 (42 cu inches) > >> I had one; fun to play with. Don't waste your time . > > Now I am not sure if you had the 042 or the 084. There is a video on Youtube with > a fella flying around just fine with the 042 on a Minimax. I have seen videos > of several planes flying with the 084 but none of them were Firestar-I's. IIRC > I have an old pic of a Kolb with an 084 but I can't seem to dig up more info > on it. I already have three 084's. Haven't had a chance to crank them up yet. > I am planning to build a big workshop but it will be months before that happens. > >> You already have the best engine for FS I. > > That is gratifying to hear. I like thinking about these swaps but will probably > just learn to like a ring-ding. > >> Should be good for 500 hrs. > > Mine hasn't been run for 5-7 years. I expect I will have to tear it down and replace > seals, from what I have heard. TT = 38 hours. > > Have you seen the 4A032? Cute lil 4-banger! About 70 lbs. I doubt it would ever > be of use for flight but maybe on a Kart! I see that a class of karting using > the Honda 390 or clone is getting popular. At 13 hp it really scoots. How much > nicer to have a 4-banger with cute lil zoomies sticking up! I am guessing that > it will put out ~14 hp. > > GeoB > > -------- > GeoB > > "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, > so we could identify their corporate sponsors" > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391791#391791 > > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ > > > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: 4A084 power? > From: Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com> > > Just a few more thoughts. > > The RPMs listed are real close to my direct drive VW. Thrust is what makes > a airplane fly, that and MONEY. The horse power needs to be converted to > thrust and at a 3600 working RPM you are restricted to a small prop > somewhere around 58" or less. The general rule is the bigger the prop the > more HP is turned into thrust until the prop tips go supersonic.. My direct > drive VW used to turn a good portion of its power into noise instead of > thrust. Also the rated max torque is at 2000 RPM. I configured my latest VW > to have maximum torque in the cruise to takeoff RPM range. Unlike a car a > aircraft engine doesn't need very much torque at low RPMs but does require > the most torque at cruise and takeoff RPMs. > > Rick Neilsen > Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC > > On Tue, Jan 8, 2013 at 4:11 AM, GeoB wrote: > >> >> Thanks for your reply Shack! >> >> I hate it when someone asks a question then argues with someone who >> answers him! This isn't my intent here. Since this is a public forum and we >> have a public conversation here I am citing some information that I have >> collected from good sources, simply to keep the lurkers from making wrong >> decisions. >> >>> Too heavy for FS I. >> >> I have been wondering about this. Reason I was considering it is that the >> FS has a reasonably good gross weight (which I forget), and with not all >> that many structural changes it became a 2-place. The wings are not as >> strong as the 2-place but they are about the same sq footage. That being >> said, I have no clue if it is *really* too heavy. >> >> My 503 weighs about 98 lbs. The 084 weighs 127 lbs complete with prop in >> a typical setup. >> >> The 084 would be operated direct-drive. At the slow speeds of the FS-I, I >> think the advantage goes to the 503 with the gear reduction unit. >> >>> Who said 50 hp? Gov't rated at 10 hp,; it may actually be 20 hp >> >>> From a military manual: >> >> Bore: 3" >> Stroke: 3" >> Displacement: 84.8 cu in >> Rated continuous net hp: 20 @ 3600 rpm >> Max hp 33.3 @ 3600 rpm >> Max torque @ 2000 rpm; 60.3 >> >> This is to 5000 ft. >> >> Note that we free up some serious hp when we remove the huge cooling fan. >> >> Also, remember I said that the 084 cab 'built' to about 50 hp. This is >> without raising the low compression ratio. 084 experts (true experts) >> suggest that one NOT raise the CR because it would lead to over-heating. >> One expert markets an EFI setup for this engine. Over-all he seems to be a >> conservative can-do person, very believable. His engine is close to 50 hp >> based on the size/pitch of prop he spins with it. Most of us interested in >> the 084 accept that it produces 42-44 hp stock, w/o the fan. About 1/2 >> hp/cu inch. >> >>> It is 48 c,i., doubt it can produce over 1 hp per cube. >> >> we are looking at the 084, 84 cu inches. I think you are remembering the >> smaller 2-cylinder, the 2A042 (42 cu inches) >> >>> I had one; fun to play with. Don't waste your time . >> >> Now I am not sure if you had the 042 or the 084. There is a video on >> Youtube with a fella flying around just fine with the 042 on a Minimax. I >> have seen videos of several planes flying with the 084 but none of them >> were Firestar-I's. IIRC I have an old pic of a Kolb with an 084 but I can't >> seem to dig up more info on it. I already have three 084's. Haven't had a >> chance to crank them up yet. I am planning to build a big workshop but it >> will be months before that happens. >> >>> You already have the best engine for FS I. >> >> That is gratifying to hear. I like thinking about these swaps but will >> probably just learn to like a ring-ding. >> >>> Should be good for 500 hrs. >> >> Mine hasn't been run for 5-7 years. I expect I will have to tear it down >> and replace seals, from what I have heard. TT = 38 hours. >> >> Have you seen the 4A032? Cute lil 4-banger! About 70 lbs. I doubt it would >> ever be of use for flight but maybe on a Kart! I see that a class of >> karting using the Honda 390 or clone is getting popular. At 13 hp it really >> scoots. How much nicer to have a 4-banger with cute lil zoomies sticking >> up! I am guessing that it will put out ~14 hp. >> >> GeoB >> >> -------- >> GeoB >> >> "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR >> drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391791#391791 >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ > > > From: Dan <dan42101(at)yahoo.com> > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: 4A084 power? > > =C2-=C2-=C2-ENGINE Q&A=C2-- your engine questions investigated > Experimenter - November 95=C2-Q.=C2-=C2-Dear Engine Q&A - To answer t > he questions about engine horsepower ratings=C2-in the September EXPERIME > NTER, I can suggest some rules of thumb that I have heard through the years > . They seem to be good approximations.1) To get the effective prop swinging > horsepower for small direct drive four-cycle engines, divide the cubic inc > hes by two. That makes an O-200 Continental a 100 horse engine. The hopeles > sly weak Corvair rated at 150 hp in a car has 145 cubic inches like the 65 > hp Lycoming, and that=99s about all it can do. The 750 cubic Hisso en > gine is rated at 150 horses but has an effective propeller power of 375 hp. > That=99s why it can turn an eight-foot propeller and fly a big airpl > ane that a 150 hp Lycoming can barely taxi. The source of this rule was Hob > art Sorrell (now deceased) of Tenino, Washington. His crafty wits produced > the Guppy biplane that flew on a Cushman golf cart engine.2) Using the effe > ctive power described > above, you can multiply times 4-1/4 to get the approximate thrust with typ > ical propeller efficiency of 85%. Source of this rule was John Thorp (decea > sed) of the T-18. See "Cowling and Cooling of Engines" which appeared in SP > ORT AVIATION some years ago (Ed. Note: This series appeared in the November > and December 1963 issues).Hopefully, these two have left a legacy that we > can all use. When a reduction gear is applied to the engine, the effective > power is multiplied by the gear ratio.I haven=99t tried to extrapolat > e the formula to two stroke engines because I have very little experience w > ith them. I can=99t tell what the effective power is of the little 70 > horse drone engine that one sees buzzing away on a Bensen Gyrocopter for i > nstance.Yours truly - Bertran Copp, Monmouth, OregonQ.=C2-=C2-Dear Mary > - In the September 1995 EXPERIMENTER, Jim Delaney of Coralville,=C2-Iowa > asks whether a Continental A-65, a 65 hp Rotax and a 65 hp Volkswagen all > produce the same > thrust. Assuming the same airplane and properly matched propeller/engine/a > irplane combination for best cruise, the answer is yes, theoretically. Prop > eller efficiency differences will produce the only variation in performance > . This usually amounts to only 2 or 3%. Thus, horsepower is a valid method > of comparison for correctly matched propellers because thrust is directly r > elated to horsepower.Often static thrust is erroneously thought to be an in > dicator of flight performance. A propeller designed for maximum static thru > st will severely limit cruise speed. This type of design is only suitable f > or helicopter rotors. It is an over-simplification if applied to airplanes. > Proper propeller design involves matching thrust to drag and finding the b > est cruise to climb tradeoff. Putting it all together involves difficult an > d tedious calculations. I am a consulting aeronautical engineer and author > of a computer program called "prop optimizer" that matches propeller > to engine and airplane automatically.Many design studies I have done indic > ate that there is an optimum propeller size and rpm for any engine/airplane > combination. Airplanes, even of one design, can vary considerably in drag > due to manufacturing differences. Therefore, if best performance is desired > , the propeller should be individually matched for each airplane. Specific > questions may be directed to me at 916/622-1886.Sincerely - Don Bates, Plac > erville, CaliforniaQ.=C2-=C2-Dear Engine Q&A - I would like to know if > there is a four-stroke engine out there in the=C2-65 hp range that would > work on my new S-12XL, other than the Rotax 912 - one that doesn=99t > require a second mortgage to purchase.The RANS S-12XL is an excellent aircr > aft, I believe. The engine to use on it has stumped me. The only two engine > s that I know of that might work are the new Yamaha four-stroke engine, whi > ch is unavailable at this time, and the Moto Guzzi, which is unproven on a > pusher > aircraft. What is your opinion? Who answers these questions? What about a > Subaru?Sincerely - Don Herwander, Everett, WashingtonA.=C2-=C2-Dear Don > - We=99ll toss your questions out for our readers and see if, per ch > ance,=C2-another S-12 owner is powering his aircraft with an alternate en > gine.Thanks for writing! - MaryQ.=C2-=C2-Dear Don - May I congratulate > you on your column in the EXPERIMENTER as I feel=C2-it is a very importan > t part of that magazine providing the type of information that we all want > regarding the Subaru engine.In the May edition, regarding the tip speed of > propellers, was the decimal point in the wrong place? Should it have been . > 00436 and not .000436?I am building a Pober Pixie lookalike under our 95/10 > category and will be powering it with a Subaru EA 81 imported from Japan w > ith approximately 34,000 miles on it. (It appears to be in very good condit > ion.)I will be using one of the carburetors that you recommend, but is ther > e any reason we can=99t > use the one that is on it - a Hitachi DCM 306-1 downdraft.With respect to > the engine, I will be leaving it exactly as is with direct drive and a 52 x > 26 propeller. However, I will need a thrust bearing and propeller extensio > n. Could you please advise me where I can obtain these.I also believe with > this combination I should get in the vicinity of 70 hp. Is this correct?Tha > nking you once again for all your help in the past and looking forward to m > eeting you maybe one day at Oshkosh if we can make it again. (We were over > there in 1982 - a wonderful show.)Kindest regards - Joe Anderson, Queenslan > d, AustraliaA.=C2-=C2-Dear Joe - It=99s nice to receive a letter > all the way from Australia. Your Pober Pixie=C2-lookalike is going to be > a good looking aircraft. There=99s so many different aircraft to choo > se from, it=99s hard to select one you would really like.Regarding th > e Hitachi carburetor, it will work fine. The venturis are small and functio > nal, but at this > application, you=99ll want to use a larger venturi-type carburetor t > o give you more power, like the Ford Pinto carburetor I=99ve mentione > d before. If you look at them both together, you=99ll use the differe > nce. You=99ll need more air to give more perforrmance because you > =99re running the engine at a higher rpm. The engine has to breathe.Rega > rding the thrust bearing, I don=99t think you=99ll need one. On > the 52 x 26 you should get about 3600 rpm at about 60 or more hp because t > he engine doesn=99t get into the power curve, but you should get 325 > - 330 lbs. of thrust.What kind of prop adapter are you using. If you don > =99t have one, you need to get one that you can drill a hole in the cent > er and tap the crank shaft to make a good secure connection.The comment on > tip speed on prop was made by Ed Sterba and I can=99t answer that (Ed > . Note: Yes, you=99re right, the figure should have been .00436 - we > apologize for this error and any confusion this has caused > our readers. The correct formula, then, is: Tip Speed = .00436 x diamete > r x rpm (with the tip speed in ft./sec. and the diameter in inches.)I hope > I=99ve helped in some way. Feel free to write any time.Yours truly - > DonQ.=C2-=C2-Greetings, Don - I=99ve found your work very informa > tive and wonder if I could avail myself=C2-of some of your information se > rvices, while keeping same as short as possible.I=99ve always been im > pressed with the formula for torque, rather than horsepower. In endeavoring > to keep a Subaru conversion as simple as possible the thought occurred to > me to try drive direct and with half rpms. I=99ve often thought about > a blower but with enough input, like a unit from an emission system, to ke > ep a plenum full of intake air. Possibly a special cam shape may help in im > proving induction while exhausting more fully.I realize this sounds extreme > , but it appears the engine has enough flywheel weight to ensure smooth run > ning at low rpms. And, with the > extant oil pump, has any thought been given to oil cooling? I would imagin > e any number of highly developed oil coolers might be available cheaply off > of unused large airplane engines.Any thought or information in this very c > onceptual stage will be greatly appreciated. By the same token, if you have > any special interests, I=99d appreciate knowing them.All the best - > Norman Benedict, Santa Maria, CaliforniaA.=C2-=C2-Dear Norman - Nice re > ceiving your letter and the interest in Subaru powerplant conversions. If y > ou use the EA-81 for small aircraft, straight drive, a 54 x 26 prop would g > ive you 325 lbs. of thrust in the pusher type. You didn=99t mention t > he aircraft you wanted to use. I have no idea what horsepower you want, so > we=99ll cover all the bases.EA-81 - 72 hp (ideal for small aircraft). > With drive would give around 450-475 lbs. of thrust with a 2.2:1 ratio. We > ight with redrive 180 lbs.Legacy - 130 hp, straight drive would give you 45 > 0-475 lbs. of > thrust. With redrive, 550-570 lbs. of thrust with a 2.1:1 ratio. The weigh > t of the Legacy with drive would range from 180-210 lbs.Oil coolers have be > en used on Subarus and are easy to hook up. There are discharge fittings on > oil pumps that you can use.I hope I=99ve helped you. - DonQ.=C2- > =C2-Dear Don - I have read with great interest the various responses to l > etters in the=C2-EXPERIMENTER concerning the use of Subaru engines in hom > ebuilt aircraft, and you obviously have an extensive knowledge of these pow > erplants.In the November 1994 issue of EXPERIMENTER there was a table publi > shed which defined general engine specifications, which I must assume was f > rom official Subaru sources.When I study the table, I find that the highest > horsepower developed by an EA-81 OHC engines in naturally aspirated forms > do not achieve close to the advertised 98/100 hp advertised by all the majo > r Subaru engine convertors for the EA-81.Any ideas how this massive discrep > ancy occurs > other than a communal dose of advertising licence?I have already ordered a > converted EA-81 engine (SHO) version from what I judge as a professional e > ngineer to be the premium quality source, but I will most certainly be very > pleasantly surprised if the actual power output is in excess of 100 rather > than the advertised 118 hp. Your article appeared two months after I had p > laced my order after much deliberation on the relative merits of the Subaru > versus the Rotax 912 or 914.Incidentally, there would appear to be equal o > ptimism regarding fuel consumption of Rotax engines. A study of the genuine > Rotax fuel flow charts will quickly reveal that one would have to lean the > mixture to unburnable ratios to achieve the popular quoted figures. It was > quite refreshing to read a report in the latest issue of KITPLANES of a fl > ight test of the 914 in the Pelican which quoted realistic fuel consumption > figures which do match the fuel burn rates shown on the Rotax > charts for this engine.Any comments would be most welcome.Yours sincerely > - Fred H. Tayler, Hoffman Estates, ILA.=C2-=C2-Dear Fred - Was nice rec > eiving your letter and very interesting. The EA-81 engines=C2-that they a > dvertise with higher horsepower is accomplished by different cams, shaving > heads and polishing intake and exhaust ports,and sometimes increasing the s > ize of pistons. That=99s how they accomplish the claimed horsepower.T > he fuel consumption of the Rotax engine probably involves an in-cockpit adj > ustment for the carburetor to lean out for better fuel consumption. You can > also do that with the Subaru.I feel that the EA-81 stock works very well w > ithout adding cams, etc. I feel if it works, don=99t mess with it.I h > ope I=99ve answered your questions. > Yours truly - Don=C2-=C2- > __________=C2-engine q&a=C2-__________ > =C2-Members Home Page=C2-|=C2-EAA Home Page=C2-|=C2-Chapters=C2 > -|=C2-Government=C2-|=C2-Homebuilders > Member Benefits=C2-|=C2-EAA Flight Planner=C2-|=C2-Aviation Advisor > s=C2-|=C2-Magazine Search > Aircraft Facts=C2-|=C2-Update your Profile=C2-|=C2-e-HOT LINE=C2- > |=C2-EAA Airport & Destination Guide > Contact Us=C2-|=C2-AirVenture=C2-|=C2- > - DjD > > --- On Tue, 1/8/13, GeoB wrote: > > From: GeoB <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net> > Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 4A084 power? > > > Thanks for your reply Shack! > > I hate it when someone asks a question then argues with someone who answers > him! This isn't my intent here. Since this is a public forum and we have a > public conversation here I am citing some information that I have collecte > d from good sources, simply to keep the lurkers from making wrong decisions > .. > >> Too heavy for FS I. > > I have been wondering about this. Reason I was considering it is that the F > S has a reasonably good gross weight (which I forget), and with not all tha > t many structural changes it became a 2-place. The wings are not as strong > as the 2-place but they are about the same sq footage. That being said, I h > ave no clue if it is *really* too heavy. > > My 503 weighs about 98 lbs. The 084 weighs 127 lbs complete with prop in=C2 > - a typical setup. > > The 084 would be operated direct-drive. At the slow speeds of the FS-I, I t > hink the advantage goes to the 503 with the gear reduction unit. > >> =C2- Who said 50 hp?=C2- Gov't rated at 10 hp,; it=C2- may actually > be 20 hp > >> From a military manual: > > Bore: 3" > Stroke: 3" > Displacement: 84.8 cu in > Rated continuous net hp: 20 @ 3600 rpm > Max hp 33.3 @ 3600 rpm > Max torque @ 2000 rpm; 60.3 > > This is to 5000 ft. > > Note that we free up some serious hp when we remove the huge cooling fan. > > Also, remember I said that the 084 cab 'built' to about 50 hp. This is with > out raising the low compression ratio. 084 experts (true experts) suggest t > hat one NOT raise the CR because it would lead to over-heating. One expert > markets an EFI setup for this engine. Over-all he seems to be a conservativ > e can-do person, very believable. His engine is close to 50 hp based on the > size/pitch of prop he spins with it. Most of us interested in the 084 acce > pt that it produces 42-44 hp stock, w/o the fan. About 1/2 hp/cu inch. > >> It is 48 c,i., doubt it can produce over 1 hp per=C2- cube. > > we are looking at the 084, 84 cu inches. I think you are remembering the sm > aller 2-cylinder, the 2A042 (42 cu inches) > =C2- >> I had one; fun to play with.=C2- Don't waste your time . > > Now I am not sure if you had the 042 or the 084. There is a video on Youtub > e with a fella flying around just fine with the 042 on a Minimax. I have se > en videos of several planes flying with the 084 but none of them were Fires > tar-I's. IIRC I have an old pic of a Kolb with an 084 but I can't seem to d > ig up more info on it. I already have three 084's. Haven't had a chance to > crank them up yet. I am planning to build a big workshop but it will be mon > ths before that happens. > =C2- >> You already have the best engine for FS I. > > That is gratifying to hear. I like thinking about these swaps but will prob > ably just learn to like a ring-ding. > >> Should be good for 500 hrs. > > Mine hasn't been run for 5-7 years. I expect I will have to tear it down an > d replace seals, from what I have heard. TT = 38 hours. > > Have you seen the 4A032? Cute lil 4-banger! About 70 lbs. I doubt it would > ever be of use for flight but maybe on a Kart! I see that a class of kartin > g using the Honda 390 or clone is getting popular. At 13 hp it really scoot > s. How much nicer to have a 4-banger with cute lil zoomies sticking up! I a > m guessing that it will put out ~14 hp. > > GeoB > > -------- > GeoB > > "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR > drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391791#391791 > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ > > > From: HShack(at)aol.com > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: 4A084 power? > > I had a 4ao32 and a 4a084. I put a belt drive on the 32 and ran it on a > mobile test cart [prop driven] > Anemic at best. Would make a very good engine for a very large RC plane. > > Also put the 84 on the cart, direct drive. Better, but still weak. I got > rid of all the cooling tin, the cooling fan, and the shielding on the > spark plug wires. I think weight was less than 120 something. We tried > several different carbs; none helped much. > > Sure, the 84 is flying on some planes, but I doubt any are flying out of a > short field. Climb rate will be poor compared to a 503.[Even if it were > 50 hp.] > > If I were to put one on a plane, it would probably be on a lightly built > Minimax. Beef up the nose a little. Paint up the engine real nice. Put on > an efficient wood prop. > > Tractor config. is much better at cooling than pusher.[without adding any > cowling]. > > I had a nice FS II w/ 503, just recently sold it. Getting older and > dumber meant it was time to get out. > > Have fun with the 84, just don't expect too much. > > Shack > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ > > > From: HShack(at)aol.com > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: 4A084 power? > > Using this formula, the 4ao84 would issue about 178 lb. thrust. My 503 > > gave 375 lb. thrust [static]. > > Howard Shackleford > FS II > SC > > > In a message dated 1/8/2013 12:35:07 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > dan42101(at)yahoo.com writes: > > To get the effective prop swinging horsepower for small direct drive > four-cycle engines, divide the cubic inches by two. That makes an O-200 > Continental a 100 horse engine. The hopelessly weak Corvair rated at 150 h > p in a > car has 145 cubic inches like the 65 hp Lycoming, and that=99s about > all it can > do. The 750 cubic Hisso engine is rated at 150 horses but has an effective > > propeller power of 375 hp. That=99s why it can turn an eight-foot pr > opeller > and fly a big airplane that a 150 hp Lycoming can barely taxi. The source > > of this rule was Hobart Sorrell (now deceased) of Tenino, Washington. His > > crafty wits produced the Guppy biplane that flew on a Cushman golf cart > engine. > 2) Using the effective power described above, you can multiply times 4-1/4 > > to get the approximate thrust with typical propeller efficiency of 85% > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ > > > From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com> > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: 4A084 power? > > The 084 that is flying on a Hi Max is swinging a > 62x40 prop at about 4000 rpms...Using a home made > 1 to 1.66 redrive ratio... My bud who responded > is the one who built the belted redrive. Not > sure of the thrust? Likely over 200 lbs static... > > A friend has a firestar with a 377 and it flies very well...Herb > > > At 01:35 PM 1/8/2013, you wrote: >> Using this formula, the 4ao84 would issue about >> 178 lb. thrust. My 503 gave 375 lb. thrust [static]. >> >> Howard Shackleford >> FS II >> SC >> >> In a message dated 1/8/2013 12:35:07 P.M. >> Eastern Standard Time, dan42101(at)yahoo.com writes: >> >> To get the effective prop swinging horsepower >> for small direct drive four-cycle engines, >> divide the cubic inches by two. That makes an >> O-200 Continental a 100 horse engine. The >> hopelessly weak Corvair rated at 150 hp in a car >> has 145 cubic inches like the 65 hp Lycoming, >> and that=99s about all it can do. The 750 cubic >> Hisso engine is rated at 150 horses but has an >> effective propeller power of 375 hp. That=99s >> why it can turn an eight-foot propeller and fly >> a big airplane that a 150 hp Lycoming can barely >> taxi. The source of this rule was Hobart Sorrell >> (now deceased) of Tenino, Washington. His crafty >> wits produced the Guppy biplane that flew on a Cushman golf cart engine. >> >> 2) Using the effective power described above, >> you can multiply times 4-1/4 to get the >> approximate thrust with typical propeller efficiency of 85% >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ > > > Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 4A084 power? > From: "GeoB" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net> > > >> a 3600 working RPM you arerestrictedto a small prop > > Thanks Rick. This is maybe the biggest draw-back. And with this engine it is a > really big deal to attempt to raise the rpm of torque peak, unless I use EFI.. > which will help there given I replace the entire intake manifold. I like doing/planning > engine mods, done that for like 45 years. I have a coupla Generac engines > I plan to modi-fly, I'd rather express myself there. > > I wonder about the over-heating issue I have been told about. Sure, more power > generally means more heat. So, if I raise my CR I add to the thermal loading > of the engine, IN THEORY. But since higher CR adds power and efficiency (or just > efficiency which effects power), why couldn't I just back off the throttle > a tad and lower the thermal loading? Should give greater available power for a > short time plus yield better mpg. I think. I am actively soliciting comments > on this idea. > > Sure, at full throttle the EFI will produce more heat also but I don't want a setup > that requires full throttle all the time. > > GeoB > > -------- > GeoB > > "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, > so we could identify their corporate sponsors" > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391849#391849 > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ > > > From: Malcolm Brubaker <brubakermal(at)yahoo.com> > Subject: Kolb-List: michigan seminar > > -=0Amula, our ultralight group is having a safety seminar and annual par > ty kicking off our 25th anniversary. MULA now stands for Michigan ultraligh > t lightsport association. when i put out a post like this our mula web site > receives a real boost in activity. that reflects the real impact of a top > ic, and the activety of a group. =0Ahttp://www.michiganultralight.com/newsl > etter/JAN13/Jan13evers.PDF=0AMalcolm & Jeanne Brubaker =0AMichigan Sport Pi > lot Repair =0Ahttp://michigansportpilotrepair.com/ =0ALSRM-A, PPC, WS=0AGr > eat Sails - Sailmaker =0Afor Ultralight & Light Sport=0A(989)513-3022 > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject:
From: Gary Aman <zeprep251(at)aol.com>
Date: Jan 09, 2013
If you fold and unfold and don't like the pins to be moving out til the spr ing safety wire clip is up against the hole,this makes the head of the pin be the stop.G.Aman MK3C ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: another engine comming, maybe
From: "Thom Riddle" <riddletr(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jan 10, 2013
This could be an interesting development. New Rotary Engine From Austro Diamond Aircraft's Austro Engines has bench tested a new dual FADEC-controlled rotary aircraft engine, the AE80R, that aims to match a weight of 60 pounds with a power output of 80 hp. The engine has been in development for more than two years and builds on Austro's experience with the AE50R 55-hp rotary engine but has differences in its internal design that incorporates a "no loss lubrication system." The new engine is targeting the LSA and ultralight aircraft markets, and may also see use in unmanned aircraft. Austro Christian Dries, chairman and owner of Diamond Aircraft, which owns Austro, says the new engine "has no vibration" and is a good fit for weight-sensitive small aircraft. According to Diamond, the dual FADEC system will keep fuel consumption at its lowest possible limits and the engine oil system will result in extremely low oil consumption, maximizing its efficiency. Austro Engine last summer pursued airframe manufacturers other than Diamond, seeking potential matches for its diesel engines, which it sees as a growing segment in European aircraft markets. The company already offers diesel and rotary style engines. Austro's recent production of AE50-series rotary engines has been close to 125 engines per year. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY (9G0) Kolb Slingshot SS-021 no engine FOR SALE Diamond Katana DA20-A1 Rotax 912 F3 Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long. - Anonymous Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391973#391973 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: another engine comming, maybe
From: "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 10, 2013
One of the drawbacks is that the engine calls for 100LL, Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=391990#391990 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: another engine comming, maybe
From: "Thom Riddle" <riddletr(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jan 10, 2013
According to the tech sheet on the Austro Engine website, the 55 hp version already in production permits 100LL or 95 RON unleaded, which is equivalent to most hi-octane unleaded in the US. http://austroengine.at/uploads/pdf/mod_products2/2010092010AE50R_Technical_Data_Sheet.pdf -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY (9G0) Kolb Slingshot SS-021 no engine FOR SALE Diamond Katana DA20-A1 Rotax 912 F3 Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long. - Anonymous Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392004#392004 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: another engine comming, maybe
From: Brad Nation <nationcap(at)comcast.net>
Date: Jan 10, 2013
If the Aircraft Rotary engine is anything like the Mazda Rotary engine then this will be a great engine, perhaps better than the Rotax. I used to have a Mazda RX3, it was great! The power to weight was superb! On Jan 10, 2013, at 13:55 , Thom Riddle wrote: > > According to the tech sheet on the Austro Engine website, the 55 hp version already in production permits 100LL or 95 RON unleaded, which is equivalent to most hi-octane unleaded in the US. > http://austroengine.at/uploads/pdf/mod_products2/2010092010AE50R_Technical_Data_Sheet.pdf > > -------- > Thom Riddle > Buffalo, NY (9G0) > > Kolb Slingshot SS-021 > no engine > FOR SALE > > Diamond Katana DA20-A1 > Rotax 912 F3 > > Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long. > - Anonymous > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392004#392004 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Pat Ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: another engine comming, maybe
Date: Jan 11, 2013
Re the Rotary engine, I ran a Ro80 with a Wankel Rotary for a couple of years. Ultra smooth and it would run on almost any grade of fuel I liked it very much. However I hope things have improved technically. Fuel consumption was high, around 22 mpg when a similar car would have been 32 mph. Starting problems became a major set back and the oil consumption was unbelievable. I visited a local Air and Transport Museum a few years agoI was surprised to find my old car on display. Cheers Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 12, 2013
Subject: Surplus generator engines
From: Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
Attached are two pictures of my neighbor's AO42 twin mounted on a trike frame. Not flown yet, I'll keep you posted. One of the difficulties on mounting it on a stock Kolb is obvious, that deep oil pan. Pat tells me the engine is 84 lb. as pictured. Just a guess but if you were to get rid of the mag and replace with the ignition system used on the big Briggs and Stratton twins (with some rework) you could knock another 6 or 7 pounds off it. Rick Girard -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Bearden" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
Date: Jan 14, 2013
>Using this formula, the 4ao84 would issue about 178 lb. thrust. Les Smoot (who has worked for the military I think) claims he has rebuilt over a thousand 4A084s. He still builds and modifies them. He has put together an EFI package for the 084, most of it off-the-shelf from a vendor, that he feels produces around 50 hp. He claims that he gets 230-240 static thrust from these direct drive engines. It wasn't 100% clear to me if he was talking about the generic engine or his EFI models. Sounded like he was talking abut the generic version. I have a great video he made. He talks about his EFI setup. He demonstrates his EFI engine running. Sounds SO GOOD! I would like to post it where folks can get to it but it is 287 MB. any ideas? GeoB ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
Date: Jan 15, 2013
From: "Lockamy, Jack CIV Atlantic Targets Marine Ops, AD.5.3.3 / Key West Det"
George, As a suggestion, you can go to YouTube dot com and upload the video for FREE. Then you can send us the YouTube link and we can easily view it. V/R, Jack L. Lockamy Atlantic Targets & Marine Operations (ATMO) Pier D-1, Bldg. B27CG Trumbo Point Annex NAS Key West, FL 33040 (305) 293-2078 office (305) 293-4345 FAX DSN 483-4343 (301) 997-6808 cell jack.lockamy(at)navy.mil -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of George Bearden Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 2:36 Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 4A084 power? >Using this formula, the 4ao84 would issue about 178 lb. thrust. Les Smoot (who has worked for the military I think) claims he has rebuilt over a thousand 4A084s. He still builds and modifies them. He has put together an EFI package for the 084, most of it off-the-shelf from a vendor, that he feels produces around 50 hp. He claims that he gets 230-240 static thrust from these direct drive engines. It wasn't 100% clear to me if he was talking about the generic engine or his EFI models. Sounded like he was talking abut the generic version. I have a great video he made. He talks about his EFI setup. He demonstrates his EFI engine running. Sounds SO GOOD! I would like to post it where folks can get to it but it is 287 MB. any ideas? GeoB ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
From: "GeoB" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net>
Date: Jan 15, 2013
[quote="GeoB"] > Using this formula, the 4ao84 would issue about 178 lb. thrust. There is a video on Youtube showing an 084 pulling 215 lbs. Dunno about anything else, mods, etc. -------- GeoB "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392376#392376 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 4A084 power?
From: "GeoB" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net>
Date: Jan 15, 2013
jackinkeywest wrote: > you can go to YouTube dot com and upload the video for FREE Thanks, I'll do that GeoB -------- GeoB "Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors" Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392377#392377 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 15, 2013
From: Malcolm Brubaker <brubakermal(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: corvair news
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =0AThere is an article, wr itten by William Wynn, published on his site that =0AI believe everyone bui lding an aircraft should read. It is extremely =0Arevealing and encouraging . You will not regret taking the time to view =0Athis. The title is, "2,500 words about levels of aircraft finsh" and =0Ais on the t op of the philosophy page (for now) at his site here:=0A=0Ahttp://flycorvai r. net/category/ philosophy/=0A=0A=0A=0AMalcolm & Jeanne Brubaker =0AMichig an Sport Pilot Repair =0Ahttp://michigansportpilotrepair.com/ =0ALSRM-A, P PC, WS=0AGreat Sails - Sailmaker =0Afor Ultralight & Light Sport=0A(989)513 -3022 =0A=C2- =0A=0A=0A=0A =0A=0A________________________________=0A From : GeoB =0ATo: kolb-list(at)matronics.com =0ASent: Tuesday , January 15, 2013 4:34 PM=0ASubject: Kolb-List: Re: 4A084 power?=0A =0A-- eywest wrote:=0A> you can go to YouTube dot com and upload the video for FR EE=0A=0A=0AThanks, I'll do that=0AGeoB=0A=0A--------=0AGeoB=0A=0A"Memb ers of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, s o we could identify their corporate sponsors"=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=39237 =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- -Matt ============ ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Newbie Question - Kolb MK III Extra or Kolb IV
From: "DGaudette" <gyrodoug(at)woh.rr.com>
Date: Jan 15, 2013
Hello. I'm a former Glider/G.A./Gyro pilot looking to get a taildragger. I'm considering both a Kolb MK III Extra AND a Kitfox IV. I just can't find anywhere where someone has compared the two. Any advice? I'm specifically looking at the KF, Kolb or Avid because when I owned a Gyroplane, I trailered it to/from my local airport 3 miles away. I kept it in my barn and avoided hanger fees etc. Any thoughts folks? Thanks. Doug Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392391#392391 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: flaperon angle
From: "cdupuis" <ctdupuis(at)maine.rr.com>
Date: Jan 15, 2013
Has anyone changed the max angle on the firefly flaperons? What was the result? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392397#392397 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Replace 582 with 912
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 16, 2013
Was wondering how hard it would be to replace a 582 with a 912 on a Mark III? Just curious as to the level of difficulty.... -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392415#392415 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Replace 582 with 912
Date: Jan 16, 2013
Was wondering how hard it would be to replace a 582 with a 912 on a Mark III? Just curious as to the level of difficulty.... -------- Wesley Elliott The 912 and 582 bolt up the same. Kolb Aircraft can provide parts and technical advice. I initially powered my mkIII with a 582, then repowered with 912. Was a little more difficult to transition back then. We had to design engine mounts, radiator and oil cooler mounts, exhaust system, and reverse throttle control geometry. The 582 pulls throttle open. The 912 pulls throttle closed. Was worth the effort. john h mkIII Woodville, FL ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 16, 2013
From: frank goodnight <frank.goodnight(at)att.net>
Subject: wiring 912 uls
Need help understanding the 912 uls generating sys. looking at page 17-1 fig 29 of the rotax install manual. I need to know if i can check for voltage between one of the yellow (ge) wires and ground, or between the two yellow wires , and if so what should the voltage be. What does the 2,5 and a little square box repesent in the wires going to the G terminals on the rectifier? What is # 11 in fig 29 if it is a diode , what kind and where can i find one. my engine was removed from a wrecked plane and i don't think the hookup used the capaciator or whatever #11 is that is shown in fig 29. thanks to anyone that can help me. Frank Goodnight ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steve Simmons" <stevesimmons(at)charter.net>
Subject: Newbie Question - Kolb MK III Extra or Kolb IV
Date: Jan 16, 2013
Just as a thought I have owned a Kit Fox and a Mark IIIC. As for as SAFETY goes the Kolb has it all over the Kit Fox. However I would suggest you fly both of them before you make your decision. -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of DGaudette Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 9:20 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Newbie Question - Kolb MK III Extra or Kolb IV Hello. I'm a former Glider/G.A./Gyro pilot looking to get a taildragger. I'm considering both a Kolb MK III Extra AND a Kitfox IV. I just can't find anywhere where someone has compared the two. Any advice? I'm specifically looking at the KF, Kolb or Avid because when I owned a Gyroplane, I trailered it to/from my local airport 3 miles away. I kept it in my barn and avoided hanger fees etc. Any thoughts folks? Thanks. Doug Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392391#392391 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "b young" <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: wiring 912 uls
Date: Jan 16, 2013
________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: corvair news
From: "Richard Pike" <richard(at)bcchapel.org>
Date: Jan 16, 2013
Fascinating read. Thanks for that. -------- Richard Pike Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) richard (at) bcchapel(dot)org Kingsport, TN 3TN0 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392438#392438 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "b young" <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Fw: 912 elect
Date: Jan 16, 2013
frank contacted me direct and said that only the header came through to me. so I shot this back to him direct. From: b young Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 9:48 AM Subject: Re: 912 elect I think some how my computer don=99t like forwarding the graphics in your post. this was my reply boyd Need help understanding the 912 uls generating sys. looking at page 17-1 fig 29 of the rotax install manual. I need to know if i can check for voltage between one of the yellow (ge) wires and ground, or between the two yellow wires , and if so what should the voltage be.I would measure from yellow to yellow.... not sure but I think if there is a yellow to ground voltage, there may be a short. I would think the voltage would change with the rpm... but should be greater than 14 v probably around 18 V ac or there about. the regulator/rectifier will convert from ac to dc at the proper charge voltage for the battery. my eis showes 13.8 v dc. What does the 2,5 and a little square box repesent in the wires going to the G terminals on the rectifier?I am thinking, the 2.5@ is the wire size,, EG:2.5 mm squared the battery to the starter motor is 16 @ or 16 mm squared What is # 11 in fig 29 if it is a diode , what kind and where can i find one. it is a 3 W 12 V charge indicating lamp my engine was removed from a wrecked plane and i don't think the hookup used the capaciator or whatever #11 is that is shown in fig 29. thanks to anyone that can help me. I did not use the charge indicator lamp.. the eis shows battery voltage.. but I did use the capacitor shown as item (10) in the diagram between B+ and ground Frank Goodnight boyd young mkiii utah hope this helps ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 16, 2013
From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Fw: 912 elect
Same as the yellow wires on other Rotaxing engines.. the two yellow wires are the alternator output...AC , whose frequency varies with rpm's. There should be no short to ground when measuring each yellow wire.. The case of the regulator can be ground or there can be a black wire coming out for ground...Red is positive 13.8 or there bouts... The AC input voltage to the regulator can be quite high..though I have never measured it.. This info based on two cycle engines...should be the same for others.. Herb At 10:51 AM 1/16/2013, you wrote: >frank contacted me direct and said that only the >header came through to me. so I shot this back to him direct. > >From: <mailto:byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com>b young >Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 9:48 AM >To: frank goodnight >Subject: Re: 912 elect > >I think some how my computer don=99t like >forwarding the graphics in your post. >this was my reply >boyd >Need help understanding the 912 uls generating sys. >looking at page 17-1 fig 29 of the rotax install >manual. I need to know if i can check for >voltage between one of the yellow (ge) wires and >ground, or between the two yellow wires , and if >so what should the voltage be.I would measure >from yellow to yellow.... not sure but I think >if there is a yellow to ground voltage, there >may be a short. I would think the voltage would >change with the rpm... but should be greater >than 14 v probably around 18 V ac or there >about. the regulator/rectifier will convert from >ac to dc at the proper charge voltage for the battery. my eis showes 13.8 v dc. >What does the 2,5 and a little square box repesent >in the wires going to the G terminals on the >rectifier?I am thinking, the 2.5@ is the wire >size,, EG:2.5 mm squared the battery to the >starter motor is 16 @ or 16 mm squared >What is # 11 in fig 29 if it is a diode , what >kind and where can i find one. it is a 3 W 12 V charge indicating lamp >my engine was removed from a wrecked plane and i don't >think the hookup used the capaciator or whatever #11 is >that is shown in fig 29. thanks to anyone that >can help me. I did not use the charge indicator >lamp.. the eis shows battery voltage.. but I did >use the capacitor shown as item (10) in the diagram between B+ and ground >Frank Goodnight boyd young mkiii utah hope this helps > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Fw: 912 elect
Date: Jan 16, 2013
Herb: I am away from home and my manuals. The reg/rec for the 912 series engines are similar, but also quite different from the 2 stroke Rotax engines. john h mkIII Woodville, FL From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Herb Gayheart Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 11:33 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fw: 912 elect Same as the yellow wires on other Rotaxing engines.. the two yellow wires are the alternator output...AC , whose frequency varies with rpm's. There should be no short to ground when measuring each yellow wire.. The case of the regulator can be ground or there can be a black wire coming out for ground...Red is positive 13.8 or there bouts... The AC input voltage to the regulator can be quite high..though I have never measured it.. This info based on two cycle engines...should be the same for others.. Herb At 10:51 AM 1/16/2013, you wrote: frank contacted me direct and said that only the header came through to me. so I shot this back to him direct. From: b young <mailto:byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com> Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 9:48 AM Subject: Re: 912 elect I think some how my computer don=C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2t like forwarding the graphics in your post. this was my reply boyd Need help understanding the 912 uls generating sys. looking at page 17-1 fig 29 of the rotax install manual. I need to know if i can check for voltage between one of the yellow (ge) wires and ground, or between the two yellow wires , and if so what should the voltage be.I would measure from yellow to yellow.... not sure but I think if there is a yellow to ground voltage, there may be a short. I would think the voltage would change with the rpm... but should be greater than 14 v probably around 18 V ac or there about. the regulator/rectifier will convert from ac to dc at the proper charge voltage for the battery. my eis showes 13.8 v dc. What does the 2,5 and a little square box repesent in the wires going to the G terminals on the rectifier?I am thinking, the 2.5@ is the wire size,, EG:2.5 mm squared the battery to the starter motor is 16 @ or 16 mm squared What is # 11 in fig 29 if it is a diode , what kind and where can i find one. it is a 3 W 12 V charge indicating lamp my engine was removed from a wrecked plane and i don't think the hookup used the capaciator or whatever #11 is that is shown in fig 29. thanks to anyone that can help me. I did not use the charge indicator lamp.. the eis shows battery voltage.. but I did use the capacitor shown as item (10) in the diagram between B+ and ground Frank Goodnight boyd young mkiii utah hope this helps ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 16, 2013
From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Fw: 912 elect
Lots on the net... the output is two yellow wires...shielded...and they go to the reg/rect the inputs which are normally shown with a sign wave inscription .. Rotax choses to mark those with a "G". The + or output goes to a filter cap and a slow blow fuse...30 amp... and on to the plus side of the battery....normally found at the starter solenoid...Capacitor is 22k ufd or there bouts...not critical..just there for noise transients.. All pretty much the same as 2 cycle...Herb At 12:30 PM 1/16/2013, you wrote: >Herb: > >I am away from home and my manuals.=C2 The >reg/rec for the 912 series engines are similar, >but also quite different from the 2 stroke Rotax engines. > >john h >mkIII >Woodville, FL > >From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Herb Gayheart >Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 11:33 AM >To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fw: 912 elect > >Same as the yellow wires on other Rotaxing >engines.. the two yellow wires are the >alternator output...AC , whose frequency varies >with rpm's. There should be no short to ground >when measuring each yellow wire.. > > The case of the regulator can be ground or > there can be a black wire coming out for > ground...Red is positive 13.8 or there bouts... > The AC input voltage to the regulator can be > quite high..though I have never measured > it.. This info based on two cycle engines...should be the same for others.. > > Herb > > >At 10:51 AM 1/16/2013, you wrote: > >frank contacted me direct and said that only the >header came through to me. so I shot this back to him direct. > >From: <mailto:byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com>b young >Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 9:48 AM >To: frank goodnight >Subject: Re: 912 elect > >I think some how my computer don=C3=A2=99t like >forwarding the graphics in your ur post. >this was my reply >boyd >Need help understanding the 912 uls generating sys. >looking at page 17-1 fig 29 of the rotax install >manual. I need to know if i can check for >voltage between one of the yellow (ge) wires and >ground, or between the two yellow wires , and if >so what should the voltage be.I would measure >from yellow to yellow.... not sure but I think >if there is a yellow to ground voltage, there >may be a short. I would think the voltage would >change with the rpm... but should be greater >than 14 v probably around 18 V ac or there >about. the regulator/rectifier will convert from >ac to dc at the proper charge voltage for the battery. my eis showes 13.8 v dc. >What does the 2,5 and a little square box repesent >in the wires going to the G terminals on the >rectifier?I am thinking, the 2.5@ is the wire >size,, EG:2.5 mm squared the battery to the >starter motor is 16 @ or 16 mm squared >What is # 11 in fig 29 if it is a diode , what >kind and where can i find one. it is a 3 W 12 V charge indicating lamp >my engine was removed from a wrecked plane and i don't >think the hookup used the capaciator or whatever #11 is >that is shown in fig 29. thanks to anyone that >can help me. I did not use the charge indicator >lamp.. the eis shows battery voltage.. but I did >use the capacitor shown as item (10) in the diagram between B+ and ground >Frank Goodnight boyd young mkiii utah hope this helps > > >=C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 - The Kolb-List Email Forum - > > >=C2 =C2 --> ><http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List>http://www.matronics.com/Navi gator?Kolb-List > > >=C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - > > >=C2 =C2 --> <http://forums.matronics.com>http://forums.matronics.com > > >=C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 - List Contribution Web Site - >=C2 Thank you for your generous support! >=C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 >=C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 -Matt Dralle, List Admin. >=C2 =C2 --> ><http://www.matronics.com/contribution>http://www.matronics.com/contributio n > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 16, 2013
From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Fw: 912 elect
Here is a link. Lots more there... Herb http://www.search-document.com/pdf/1/8/rotax-912-wiring.html At 12:30 PM 1/16/2013, you wrote: >Herb: > >I am away from home and my manuals.=C2 The >reg/rec for the 912 series engines are similar, >but also quite different from the 2 stroke Rotax engines. > >john h >mkIII >Woodville, FL > >From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Herb Gayheart >Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 11:33 AM >To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Fw: 912 elect > >Same as the yellow wires on other Rotaxing >engines.. the two yellow wires are the >alternator output...AC , whose frequency varies >with rpm's. There should be no short to ground >when measuring each yellow wire.. > > The case of the regulator can be ground or > there can be a black wire coming out for > ground...Red is positive 13.8 or there bouts... > The AC input voltage to the regulator can be > quite high..though I have never measured > it.. This info based on two cycle engines...should be the same for others.. > > Herb > > >At 10:51 AM 1/16/2013, you wrote: > >frank contacted me direct and said that only the >header came through to me. so I shot this back to him direct. > >From: <mailto:byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com>b young >Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 9:48 AM >To: frank goodnight >Subject: Re: 912 elect > >I think some how my computer don=C3=A2=99t like >forwarding the graphics in your ur post. >this was my reply >boyd >Need help understanding the 912 uls generating sys. >looking at page 17-1 fig 29 of the rotax install >manual. I need to know if i can check for >voltage between one of the yellow (ge) wires and >ground, or between the two yellow wires , and if >so what should the voltage be.I would measure >from yellow to yellow.... not sure but I think >if there is a yellow to ground voltage, there >may be a short. I would think the voltage would >change with the rpm... but should be greater >than 14 v probably around 18 V ac or there >about. the regulator/rectifier will convert from >ac to dc at the proper charge voltage for the battery. my eis showes 13.8 v dc. >What does the 2,5 and a little square box repesent >in the wires going to the G terminals on the >rectifier?I am thinking, the 2.5@ is the wire >size,, EG:2.5 mm squared the battery to the >starter motor is 16 @ or 16 mm squared >What is # 11 in fig 29 if it is a diode , what >kind and where can i find one. it is a 3 W 12 V charge indicating lamp >my engine was removed from a wrecked plane and i don't >think the hookup used the capaciator or whatever #11 is >that is shown in fig 29. thanks to anyone that >can help me. I did not use the charge indicator >lamp.. the eis shows battery voltage.. but I did >use the capacitor shown as item (10) in the diagram between B+ and ground >Frank Goodnight boyd young mkiii utah hope this helps > > >=C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 - The Kolb-List Email Forum - > > >=C2 =C2 --> ><http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List>http://www.matronics.com/Navi gator?Kolb-List > > >=C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - > > >=C2 =C2 --> <http://forums.matronics.com>http://forums.matronics.com > > >=C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 - List Contribution Web Site - >=C2 Thank you for your generous support! >=C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 >=C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 =C2 -Matt Dralle, List Admin. >=C2 =C2 --> ><http://www.matronics.com/contribution>http://www.matronics.com/contributio n > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 16, 2013
From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Fw: 912 elect
Copyright =A9 ConAir Sports Ltd. All rights reserved. Site <http://www.conairsports.co.uk/index.html> home. <http://www.conairsports.co.uk/rotax.html> rotax. <http://www.conairsports.co.uk/cors-air.html> cors-air. <http://www.conairsports.co.uk/heated%20flying%20gear.html> heated flying gear. <http://www.ekmpowershop2.com/ekmps/shops/conairsports/index.asp> shop. <http://www.conairsports.co.uk/contact%20us.html> contact us. To search for parts or accessories click on the SHOP tab (left) and search in the shop. ConAir Rotax 4 Stroke Service ConAir Sports Banner rotax 4-stroke - ignition & charging 912UL, 912A, 912F, 912ULS, 912S, 914UL and 914F Engines resistance values / trigger gaps of the ignition unit The values indicated below can be checked on the engine installed in the aircraft, after detaching connections: Generator coil (on stator) yellow ' yellow 0.1-0.8 ohms Generator winding yellow ' grounding open circuit Charging coil (on stator) red ' ground 3.2-4.5 ohms Trigger coil green/white ' blue/yellow 115-123 ohms Trigger coil new* (with clamps) white/yellow ' blue/yellow 220-250 ohms Ignition coil, primary connection contact ' ground 0.1-0.4 ohms Ignition coil, secondary high voltage ' high voltage 6.1-6.7 kohms Resistance spark plug connector 4.4-6.0 kohms Trigger gap old style 0.4-0.5mm (16-20 thou) Trigger gap new style with clamps 0.3-0.4mm (12-16 thou) * fitted in serial production, starting with design year 1995 spark plugs & plug gaps ENGINE PLUG TYPE PART NUMBER PLUG GAP CHANGE INTERVAL S (unleaded mogas) CHANGE INTERVALS (avgas) 912UL DCPR7E 897255 0.6-0.7 mm (0.024 ' 0.028 in) 200 hours 100 hours 912A DCPR7E 897255C 0.6-0.7 mm (0.024 ' 0.028 in) 200 hours 100 hours 912F DCPR7E 897255C 0.6-0.7 mm (0.024 ' 0.028 in) 200 hours 100 hours 912ULS DCPR8E 297940 0.6-0.7 mm (0.024 ' 0.028 in) 200 hours 100 hours 912S DCPR8E 297940C 0.6-0.7 mm (0.024 ' 0.028 in) 200 hours 100 hours 914UL X27EPR 897257 0.6-0.7 mm (0.024 ' 0.028 in) 100 hours 100 hours 914F X27EPR 897257C 0.6-0.7 mm (0.024 ' 0.028 in) 100 hours 100 hours <http://www.conairsports.co.uk/4-stroke%20ignition.html#resistance_1>resista nce values / trigger gaps of the ignition unit <http://www.conairsports.co.uk/4-stroke%20ignition.html#spark>spark plugs & plug gaps All information provided here is correct at the time of publishing to the best of our knowledge, but Rotax recommendations may change at any time without our knowledge. It is the engine owners responsibility to ensure that the engine is fit for flight at all times. The information is provided here free of charge and with no obligation from us to the consumer. To ensure that you have the correct and most up to date information, you should refer to the current Installation, Operators and Maintenance manuals for your engine. The information provided here may not be valid for aircraft outside the UK. <http://www.conairsports.co.uk/terms%20of%20use.html>Click here for <http://www.conairsports.co.uk/terms%20of%20use.html>ConAir SportsTerms& Conditions, including website usage policy. [] [] [] [] Always apply the correct heat sink paste to plug threads, <http://www.ekmpowershop2.com/ekmps/shops/conairsports/silicon-heat-transfer -compound-1ml-lub-022-417-p.asp>see here wiring diagrams The wiring diagram is in the Installation manual for the engine which can be downloaded from the <http://www.rotax-aircraft-engines.com/a_searchdoc.aspx>Documentation page at www.rotax-aircraft-engines.com [] <http://www.conairsports.co.uk/4-stroke%20ignition.html#wiring_1>wiring diagrams [] does the ignition system need a battery to run the engine? No, the ignition system is completely self generating and redundant (two separate ignition systems). 912 series engines - circuit A fires 1-2 top 3-4 bottom plugs circuit B fires 1-2 bottom 3-4 top plugs 914 series engines - A fires all top, B fires all bottom plugs <http://www.rotax-aircraft-engines.com/a_searchdoc.aspx> <http://www.rotax-aircraft-engines.com/a_searchdoc.aspx> [] how does the electronic ignition work (basic description)? Rotating magnets in the flywheel generate power as they pass over coil windings on the stator. The power generated is stored in capacitors in the SMD modules until the =93triggers=94 send a signal to the capacitor which then passes the power to the secondary coils, which increase the voltage and send it, via the ignition cables, to the spark plugs. [] generator / regulator Regulators need cooling - mounting in the engine bay is not a good idea and can cause premature failure. The regulator output is 250W at 5500rpm. The output is less at cruise rpms. Do not overload the electrical system - items such as electrically heated clothing put high demands on the charging system. Here is some trouble shooting info on the 912...Charging system...Herb 914 engines rely on the electrical system for the fuel pumps. Improper installation or overloading of the charging system should be avoided. Problem: Battery not charging (I.e. Low voltage) Solutions: Remove the yellow wires and check the resistance between them is 0.3 - 0.8 ohms. If the resistance is infinity then you have a broken wire (open circuit). Re-install the yellow wires, run engine at idle and check output form yellow wires (should be 18-20 AC volts). Check output from B+ terminal or regulator, should be 14 DC volts - check the battery is charged - the regulator needs to be connected to a charged battery to energise it. Problem: The generator is putting out AC volts but the Regulator is not putting out more than battery voltage - regulator is faulty. Solution: Replace the regulator Problem: The generator is not producing AC volts, the stator wiring is faulty. Solution: Check / replace the stator wiring. Replace the stator. Check grounds on Regulator & engine block before ordering new parts! Check your wiring if you fail more than one regulator - faulty regulators are not common but crossed wires are! ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Aileron trim-drag question
Date: Jan 16, 2013
From: "Kirby, Dennis Civ USAF AFMC AFNWC/ENS" <Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil>
Kolb Friends - Been flying my Mark-3 for a while now (2002), and over the years have strived tried to clean up various airframe details to reduce drag. (Stuff like aileron gap seals, gear leg fairings, etc.) My Kolb requires aileron trim, for straight-and-level flight. I currently use the proven "John Hauck" method for aileron trim - a bungee around the control stick, pulling the stick to one side. Works great, and is cockpit adjustable. But I've been thinking of "upgrading" this system in favor of a proper trim tab on one of the ailerons, to fix my trim requirement. I've been wondering this: Would installing an aileron trim tab cause any MORE or LESS drag than the bungee cord system? Intuitively, I think the drag effect would be equal. But I wanted to hear what the more-experienced minds of my fellow Kolb folk think. Many thanks - Dennis Kirby Mark-3, 912ul, Powerfin-72 in Sandia Park, NM ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Aileron trim-drag question
Date: Jan 16, 2013
I've been wondering this: Would installing an aileron trim tab cause any MORE or LESS drag than the bungee cord system? Intuitively, I think the drag effect would be equal. But I wanted to hear what the more-experienced minds of my fellow Kolb folk think. Many thanks - Dennis Kirby If there is any difference, doubt it would be measureable. Why drill holes in the aileron and pop rivets when you already have an infinitely adjustable roll trim system? john h mkIII Woodville, FL ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 17, 2013
From: frank goodnight <frank.goodnight(at)att.net>
Subject: 912 gen sys
I would like to THANK everyone that answered my request for information.Both on the Kolb and the Zenith list.There is a huge pool of knowledge and experence out there , and people willing to take the time and effort to share what they know .I feel lucky to belong to to such a group.I have every reason to believe I can now get my 912 to charge the batt. Frank Goodnight HKS powered firestar 912uls 701 Fayetteville , Ark. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
From: "t41pilot" <t41pilot(at)frontier.com>
Date: Jan 18, 2013
My Firefly needed aileron trim as well. It was only a problem at full or cruise throttle settings so may be a P-Factor thing. At reduced throttle and approach speeds, the ailerons felt fine. I opted for a trim tab because I don't have much room in my cockpit area. I noticed an immediate improvement. The angle on the tab was a guess to start with and I just used test flights to get it dialed in. It's attached with #6 screws right now. I'm pretty much there now and it ended up at the same angle as my rudder tab. I think it's in the neighborhood of 22 to 25 degrees. I'll attach it permanently after I paint it....next spring. It's the dead of winter here right now. My tab is the width of 1 rib bay but a longer narrower tab could be used and would give more attach points if you so desired. I was scared while drilling the ribs that the drill bit would slip and I would ruin my cover job but managed without incident. Just slow and careful is the rule here with new bullet tip drill bit. In conclusion, I'm glad I did it. My only regret is that I needed a tab at all. Was it a building error or P-factor? I'm don't know but am not gointg to worry about it. The plane flies well now. It's possible I may have lost a mph or 2 but my firefly is so light and quick that I can't tell for sure since I'm affected by winds more than you. I have an install picture but am having trouble getting it small enough to post here. I'll work on that. Meanwhile, I can E-mail one to you if you are interested. -------- Gregg Kaat 2011 Firefly Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392578#392578 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
From: "t41pilot" <t41pilot(at)frontier.com>
Date: Jan 18, 2013
Here's the pic of my Tab. I'll paint to match in the spring -------- Gregg Kaat 2011 Firefly Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392594#392594 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/pa270080_837.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 18, 2013
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
From: Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com>
Fireflies must be different than Firestars, Mine is pointed in the other direction. You probably should make sure that you need the elevator to go up or down before you fasten it in a permanent fashion. Larry On Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 11:32 AM, t41pilot wrote: > > Here's the pic of my Tab. I'll paint to match in the spring > > -------- > Gregg Kaat > 2011 Firefly > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392594#392594 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/pa270080_837.jpg > > -- *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.* ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
From: "t41pilot" <t41pilot(at)frontier.com>
Date: Jan 18, 2013
Not sure what you meant by elevator up or down. This is an aileron trim tab. I determined what direction the ailerons needed to move before I made the tab to achieve the desired trim. The tab can be mounted up or down as long as the proper aileron side is chosen to do the type of mount you desire and the aileron deflects in the direction desired. In my case, I would achieve the same result with a downward pointing tab mounted on the opposite aileron. It may be a matter of what is more visually appealing to a person. The plane has already flown in the current configuration and my trim problem was solved. I just haven't got it mounted permanently yet. It's possible that a tab may work better in one configuration as compared with the other but an engineer would have to help with that. I don't know that answer. -------- Gregg Kaat 2011 Firefly Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392599#392599 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 18, 2013
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
From: Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com>
Oops, I thought that it was an elevator. You are of course correct. ( The sun was shining on my computer screen and I couldn't see the screen clearly. You believe that?) Larry On Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 1:51 PM, t41pilot wrote: > > Not sure what you meant by elevator up or down. This is an aileron trim > tab. I determined what direction the ailerons needed to move before I made > the tab to achieve the desired trim. The tab can be mounted up or down as > long as the proper aileron side is chosen to do the type of mount you > desire and the aileron deflects in the direction desired. In my case, I > would achieve the same result with a downward pointing tab mounted on the > opposite aileron. It may be a matter of what is more visually appealing to > a person. The plane has already flown in the current configuration and > my trim problem was solved. I just haven't got it mounted permanently yet. > It's possible that a tab may work better in one configuration as compared > with the other but an engineer would have to help with that. I don't know > that answer. > > -------- > Gregg Kaat > 2011 Firefly > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392599#392599 > > -- *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.* ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 18, 2013
From: Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
My Ultrastar was off in roll trim when I bought it. The top cross tube on the cage was visibly bent, not enough to be unsafe but enough to reduce the left wing incidence. I fixed it by making a new universal joint block (on the US the U-joint is at the main spar) with one hole offset about 1/8". Now the wings are even and the plane flies straight. My point in relating this is that if the roll trim is off, this is a simple way to fix it without adding a trim tab. -Dana -- The only correct outcome to an armed robbery attempt is a dead armed robber. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
From: "racerjerry" <gki(at)suffolk.lib.ny.us>
Date: Jan 19, 2013
To diagnose the reason for need of an aileron trim tab, beg/buy/borrow a digital level and tape it to a straight 5-foot wooden furring strip. If you have a problem that requires aileron trim; the reason is that either that the wing has a built-in twist or there is a slight difference in incidence between the two wings. Digital levels are neat because you can zero at any point and directly observe any difference when checking incidence at any point along the wing. I have seen a lot of wings with an unintentional built-in twist. If both wings were built with the same degree of twist, you would probably never know the difference. The problem is that if your construction table has a built-in twist, your two wings will be built with a twist in the opposite direction of each other; guaranteeing a roll trim problem. I was lucky to have acquired a digital level to set up a table for wing assembly. I was also lucky to have a cast iron bench and two long lengths of straight 3 x 3 square tubing to form a base for my plywood table. For anything lass rigid, during wing assembly, you need to recheck the table each day end-for-end to make sure one of your kids didnt bump the table. Also, there is nothing better than using a digital level when drilling that final hole at the wig root tab that sets wing incidence forever. -------- Jerry King Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392631#392631 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
From: "Richard Pike" <richard(at)bcchapel.org>
Date: Jan 19, 2013
I doubt that you are going to add much drag regardless of how you do it, so do it the way you want to. My preference to was to make an easily adjustable trim tab and adjust it for either solo or a passenger as part of my preflight. Simple and after a number of years, very reliable. In the link it still shows the original setup, I modified it with large nylon R/C aircraft hinges, & I like it much better now. http://www.bcchapel.org/pages/0003/pg6.htm -------- Richard Pike Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) richard (at) bcchapel(dot)org Kingsport, TN 3TN0 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392634#392634 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
From: "t41pilot" <t41pilot(at)frontier.com>
Date: Jan 19, 2013
It's certainly possible that one or the other wing could have a twist. This was my first aircraft build. The wing halves were actually built in a bedroom of my house last winter on a set of heavy sawhorses. My basement has a 90 deg turn in the stairway so couldn't get wings built down there. I actually had to bring my drag struts through the window for install since they had to fit through a little guide tube on the inboard steel ribs. My leading edges on the wings line up perfectly and of course the trailing edges attach at the U joint. Doesn't mean that there still couldn't be a problem with incidence. I can even see how twist could be induced during the covering process with too much shrinking. I think I could fix an incidence problem using Dana's method but twist sounds like a teardown to me. The plane flies well now with the tab so I'll start the summer with that and then look into seeing if I can fix anything. The key will be if I go to a get together somewhere and somebody can give me some help looking it over. -------- Gregg Kaat 2011 Firefly Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392635#392635 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/p9150073_193.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
Date: Jan 19, 2013
The plane flies well now with the tab so I'll start the summer with that and then look into seeing if I can fix anything. Gregg Kaat 2011 Firefly Seems to me you fixed the problem with the trim tab. Most airplanes use trim tabs on all three axes. I have a rudder trim tab on my MKIII. Pitch and roll trim pressures are relieved with forced trim. My Ultrastar and Firestar had tabs on all three axes. There are many, many things that can cause a wing to fly more or less than its partner. Our homebuilt airplanes constructed by amateurs are not precision machines. Neither am I. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 19, 2013
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
From: Robert Laird <rlaird(at)cavediver.com>
So, where do you put the trim tabs on YOU, John? ;-) On Sat, Jan 19, 2013 at 10:03 AM, John Hauck wrote: > There are many, many things that can cause a wing to fly more or less than > its partner. Our homebuilt airplanes constructed by amateurs are not > precision machines. Neither am I. > > john h > mkIII > Titus, Alabama > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
Date: Jan 19, 2013
You'll never guess. ;-) I flew the MKIII a half bubble out of trim for many, many hours, before coming up with a rudder trim tab that would correct the adverse yaw. Got the MKIII flying in trim, but I have always been a half bubble out. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama So, where do you put the trim tabs on YOU, John? ;-) On Sat, Jan 19, 2013 at 10:03 AM, John Hauck wrote: There are many, many things that can cause a wing to fly more or less than its partner. Our homebuilt airplanes constructed by amateurs are not precision machines. Neither am I. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 19, 2013
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
From: Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com>
What is done is done. I had a roll trim issue on my VW powered MKIIIC but decided to fix it with the optional Kolb adjustable rear attachment fitting. You move washers around till it flies the way you want it. No extra trim tab needed. I personally feel you will have less drag if the wings are aligned properly but I can't prove it. Worth what you paid for it. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW POwered MKIIIC On Sat, Jan 19, 2013 at 10:45 AM, t41pilot wrote: > > It's certainly possible that one or the other wing could have a twist. > This was my first aircraft build. The wing halves were actually built in a > bedroom of my house last winter on a set of heavy sawhorses. My basement > has a 90 deg turn in the stairway so couldn't get wings built down there. I > actually had to bring my drag struts through the window for install since > they had to fit through a little guide tube on the inboard steel ribs. My > leading edges on the wings line up perfectly and of course the trailing > edges attach at the U joint. Doesn't mean that there still couldn't be a > problem with incidence. I can even see how twist could be induced during > the covering process with too much shrinking. I think I could fix an > incidence problem using Dana's method but twist sounds like a teardown to > me. The plane flies well now with the tab so I'll start the summer with > that and then look into seeing if I can fix anything. The key will be if I > go to a get together somewhere and ! > somebody can give me some help looking it over. > > -------- > Gregg Kaat > 2011 Firefly > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392635#392635 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/p9150073_193.jpg > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: How do you transport a Kolb home?
From: "DGaudette" <gyrodoug(at)woh.rr.com>
Date: Jan 19, 2013
Folks, How would a guy transport a Kolb home? I'm considering purchasing a Kolb from several states away but am stuck on how do I get this thing home? Any suggestions? Pictures? Thanks, Doug Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392648#392648 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Lockamy" <jacklockamy(at)comcast.net>
Subject: How do you transport a Kolb home?
Date: Jan 19, 2013
Buy, rent or steal a 24-FT, V-nose, enclosed, utility trailer with rear door ramp. Easy to find on Craigslist. Sell the trailer when you get your Kolb home or keep it and use it as a portable hangar. Jack in Key West -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of DGaudette Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2013 2:24 PM Subject: Kolb-List: How do you transport a Kolb home? Folks, How would a guy transport a Kolb home? I'm considering purchasing a Kolb from several states away but am stuck on how do I get this thing home? Any suggestions? Pictures? Thanks, Doug Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392648#392648 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 19, 2013
From: Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: How do you transport a Kolb home?
At 02:23 PM 1/19/2013, DGaudette wrote: > >Folks, > >How would a guy transport a Kolb home? I'm considering purchasing a Kolb >from several states away but am stuck on how do I get this thing home? Fly it? -Dana -- Roses are red, Violets are blue, I'm wasting much too much time on the internet, and probably, so are you. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: How do you transport a Kolb home?
From: "Tom O'Hara" <tohara(at)alphagraphics.com>
Date: Jan 19, 2013
I rented a 28 foot U-Haul and brought one home from North WI to Eastern PA with no trailer rash. Wings were hung along the sides with 2ft pieces of carpet cushioned with 4" of foam. Fuselage was pushed in with wheels chocked and tires wired so that they could not move. Boom was raised with a cradle about 4" off the floor to remove load on the tail wheel-used foam and carpet again for padding. Make sure you have lock the boom on the cradle so that it doesn't bounce out. Stopped every 90 minutes to check on the ride. Send email address and I will send pics during the week. oharat2012(at)gmail.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392651#392651 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: flaperon angle
From: "Ducati SS" <hiwingflyer6219(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 19, 2013
I have Firefly sn- 22 Just curious why you want to change the angle. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392652#392652 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: How do you transport a Kolb home?
Date: Jan 19, 2013
How would a guy transport a Kolb home? I'm considering purchasing a Kolb from several states away but am stuck on how do I get this thing home? Any suggestions? Pictures? Thanks, Doug Doug/Kolbers: If the Kolb is flyable, why not fly it home? Much quicker, easier, and safer for the airplane. Trailering is really hard on Kolbs, especially long distances. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 19, 2013
Subject: Re: How do you transport a Kolb home?
From: Robert Laird <rlaird(at)cavediver.com>
Alternatively, get a (well-qualified) good friend to ferry it for you. I've done that in the past (but don't do it any more), and I usually suggest (if it's not a single-seater) to have them come with me... Lots of fun! And, like John says, easier on the plane, too. -- Robert On Sat, Jan 19, 2013 at 5:28 PM, John Hauck wrote: > > > How would a guy transport a Kolb home? I'm considering purchasing a Kolb > from several states away but am stuck on how do I get this thing home? > > Any suggestions? Pictures? > > Thanks, > Doug > > > Doug/Kolbers: > > If the Kolb is flyable, why not fly it home? > > Much quicker, easier, and safer for the airplane. Trailering is really > hard > on Kolbs, especially long distances. > > john h > mkIII > Titus, Alabama > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
Date: Jan 19, 2013
I enjoy the Kleenex Fly immensely and always marvel when it enthusiastically lifts me arse off the turf. Kolb on! worth what ye paid fer it beauford FF-076 Brandon, FL Me too! I have personally witnessed Beauford commit aviation in his Kleenex Kolb. It is a blur in the sky. A screaming banshee. A wonderful feeling. I committed got out the mkIII, flew 11 miles to 08A, Wetumpka Airport, got 10 gals of 100LL, shot an approach on the N/S grass strip, the headed back to Gantt International Airport. Felt good, although I was terribly rusty after a two month period without flying. First time I rolled out the mkIII since returning from the Kolb Homecoming the middle of Nov. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
Date: Jan 19, 2013
Gonna have to start proof reading before I hit the send button. Should have read: A wonderful feeling. I committed aviation this afternoon. Pushed out the MKIII, .. john A wonderful feeling. I committed got out the mkIII, flew 11 miles to 08A, Wetumpka Airport, got 10 gals of 100LL, shot an approach on the N/S grass strip, the headed back to Gantt International Airport. Felt good, although I was terribly rusty after a two month period without flying. First time I rolled out the mkIII since returning from the Kolb Homecoming the middle of Nov. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: flaperon angle
From: "cdupuis" <ctdupuis(at)maine.rr.com>
Date: Jan 19, 2013
I was reading a book on aircraft design and was curious if anyone had increased the angle of the flaperons. With the monospar on the firefly I was wondering if there were problems with torsional rigidity. When I put mine together I was expecting more angle, but I'm used to 150's, 172's, etc. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392681#392681 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Pat Ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
Date: Jan 20, 2013
Hi Beauford, your mention of the flying qualities of an 8x4 plywood sheet,plus the foot of snow outside my window at the moment reminded me of this. Many years ago, certainly 50, we had a long and hard winter (by UK standards). Snow was deep and persisted for some time. I lived at the edge of Salisbury Plain with lovely snow covered slopes. The family ran a builders merchant so with a couple of small hardboard sheets, about 4x2 , pinched from stock, my brother and I launched ourselves across the snow. In a sitting position with a bit of sash cord holding the leading edge up we proved the theory sound.. Next question. Will it be better with a larger board?. Will we go faster lying down.? In increments we increased the board size until we arrived at 8ftx4ft board, and a prone position holding up the leading edge with our hands. In the meantime the snow had hardened, become more icy, and more slippery. I launched from farther up the hill than ever before and immediately hit the highest speed yet. Also on the larger board I could not drag my toes in the snow to brake. Speed built up, the bumps seemed to flatten out, I was holding the leading edge up and sure enough, up she came.Flipped into a roll and dumped me on my back going a rate of knots. The board disappeared down the hill. Nothing was broken but we confined our efforts to a 6x4 board afterwards. I wish I still had that body which just bounced. If I did it now I would be in hospital for a couple of weeks. Happy days Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Pat Ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
Date: Jan 20, 2013
I had a roll trim issue on my VW powered MKIIIC but decided to fix it with the optional Kolb adjustable rear attachment fitting. >> Hi Rick, I had the same on my Xtra and fixed it the same way. Just the way the designer intended. With the Hauck mod. to correct for sitting off the centre line she shows no tendency to roll at all. Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: How do you transport a Kolb home?
From: "racerjerry" <gki(at)suffolk.lib.ny.us>
Date: Jan 20, 2013
Well yes, the safest way to transport a Kolb is to fly it home; however it may not be the safest for YOU. You need time to get accustomed to the plane, not to mention freezing URASS off this time of year. The problem with trailers is that the suspension is way too rigid and it transfers all shock loads directly to the airframe. Successful trailering requires a well thought plan. To trailer any distance at all, the wings need to be removed, tied to the trailer walls and hung in a sling to support them at the leading edge to spread the load. The tail boom requires a padded support such as shown in the Kolb construction manual. Where is your Kolb going to live? Kolbs fold easily, and the trailer can make a fine home if you do not have access to a hangar. Check out this page and links to see how your fellow Kolbers dealt with the same problem: http://oh2fly.net/Main_trailer_kolb.htm -------- Jerry King Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392697#392697 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
From: "Richard Pike" <richard(at)bcchapel.org>
Date: Jan 20, 2013
When I rebuilt the FSII after its wadding up event, I tried one of the Kolb adjustable rear spar attachment brackets, and it was reasonably successful. The airplane flies square in the bubble hands off, but it did still require a small trim tab on one aileron. No longer required one on the rudder, the spar bracket adjustment made that one unnecessary. As a side note, by adding some dihedral, a FSII can readily be trimmed to fly hands off. Dihedral does not enable a MKIII to do this. -------- Richard Pike Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) richard (at) bcchapel(dot)org Kingsport, TN 3TN0 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392698#392698 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Heated Seat Covers
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 20, 2013
It seems there is a lot of trouble involved with getting cabin heat into the Kolb. What about 12V seat heaters? Anyone tried it? http://www.activheat.com/index_files/heatedcarseatcover.htm -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392702#392702 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "b young" <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Aileron trim-drag question
Date: Jan 20, 2013
when I rebuilt, I increased the dihedral a bit and my mkiii went from negative roll stability to neutral roll stability... I believe that if I had increased the dihedral a bit more it would have gone positive. boyd young -----Original Message----- As a side note, by adding some dihedral, a FSII can readily be trimmed to fly hands off. Dihedral does not enable a MKIII to do this. -------- Richard Pike ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Heated Seat Covers
Date: Jan 20, 2013
It seems there is a lot of trouble involved with getting cabin heat into the Kolb. What about 12V seat heaters? Anyone tried it? http://www.activheat.com/index_files/heatedcarseatcover.htm -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC This Alabama boy made several flights, in his MKIII, to the Arctic regions of Alaska and Canada where he experienced freezing temps during the Summer months. First flight north was without cabin heat. Piled on layers of clothes and drove on. Of course, I was a youngster of 55. After the first flight, I discovered the Chilli Vest. 12VDC powered off the aircraft battery. The Chilli Vest kept me warm enough to fly with far less clothing. My hands and feet stayed comfortable. Ten years after the first flight to Alaska I made my last flight north at the ripe old age of 65. The Chilli Vest did its job again. http://www.sargentcycle.com/chillivest.htm I haven't used mine is a long time. Afraid to try it on. It was a little snug last time I wore it. Good idea to buy a size larger than you think you need. Remember, your body grows as you add thermal underwear, sweater, sweat shirt, etc, and with age. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama - Fair weather flyer. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 20, 2013
From: frank goodnight <frank.goodnight(at)att.net>
Subject: electric fuel pump
Hi, I fly a firestar with a HKS engine, it uses the same pluse pump as a 503 for the engine mounted pump with the elect pump mounted between the tank and and the engine pump. Do most of you that have that type system, leave the electric pump on all the time , or turn it off after takeoff? I have always left the electric pump on all the time--about 200 flight hrs--. Lately I have been hearing that it may be better to turn it off after takeoff. Like to hear thoughts from anyone who uses this type sys. Frank Goodnight ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: electric fuel pump
Date: Jan 20, 2013
Hi, I fly a firestar with a HKS engine, it uses the same pluse pump as a 503 for the engine mounted pump with the elect pump mounted between the tank and and the engine pump. Do most of you that have that type system, leave the electric pump on all the time , or turn it off after takeoff? I have always left the electric pump on all the time--about 200 flight hrs--. Lately I have been hearing that it may be better to turn it off after takeoff. Like to hear thoughts from anyone who uses this type sys. Frank Goodnight I fly with an engine driven pump and an electric fuel pump. I don't think it matters. The Facet Electric Pump has a good reputation and long service life. So does the Mikuni pulse pump. Never had a problem with either or both pumps over pressurizing the 447, 582, or 912 series engines. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 20, 2013
From: frank goodnight <frank.goodnight(at)att.net>
Subject: Re: electric fuel pump
Thanks John Frank ________________________________ From: John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> Sent: Sun, January 20, 2013 9:47:26 AM Subject: RE: Kolb-List: electric fuel pump Hi, I fly a firestar with a HKS engine, it uses the same pluse pump as a 503 for the engine mounted pump with the elect pump mounted between the tank and and the engine pump. Do most of you that have that type system, leave the electric pump on all the time , or turn it off after takeoff? I have always left the electric pump on all the time--about 200 flight hrs--. Lately I have been hearing that it may be better to turn it off after takeoff. Like to hear thoughts from anyone who uses this type sys. Frank Goodnight I fly with an engine driven pump and an electric fuel pump. I don't think it matters. The Facet Electric Pump has a good reputation and long service life. So does the Mikuni pulse pump. Never had a problem with either or both pumps over pressurizing the 447, 582, or 912 series engines. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Heated Seat Covers
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 20, 2013
That vest looks like it would keep you toastey! BTW, I have really enjoyed reading about your adventures. -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392713#392713 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Pat Ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: electric fuel pump
Date: Jan 20, 2013
Frank, Lets not start with the silly pictures eh? Just leave it to the under twelve year olds. Pat (Curmudgeon in UK) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: How do you transport a Kolb home?
From: Gary Aman <zeprep251(at)aol.com>
Date: Jan 20, 2013
Take a peek at "oh2fly"'s web site for trailering info.Better info than wha t you've hearing here of late -----Original Message----- From: racerjerry <gki(at)suffolk.lib.ny.us> Sent: Sun, Jan 20, 2013 7:29 am Subject: Kolb-List: Re: How do you transport a Kolb home? Well yes, the safest way to transport a Kolb is to fly it home; however it may not be the safest for YOU. You need time to get accustomed to the plane, n ot to mention freezing URASS off this time of year. The problem with trailers is that the suspension is way too rigid and it transfers all shock loads directly to the airframe. Successful trailering requires a well thought plan. To trailer any distance at all, the wings ne ed to be removed, tied to the trailer walls and hung in a sling to support them a t the leading edge to spread the load. The tail boom requires a padded support s uch as shown in the Kolb construction manual. Where is your Kolb going to live? Kolbs fold easily, and the trailer can m ake a fine home if you do not have access to a hangar. Check out this page and links to see how your fellow Kolbers dealt with the same problem: http://oh2fly.net/Main_trailer_kolb.htm -------- Jerry King Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392697#392697 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: electric fuel pump
From: Gary Aman <zeprep251(at)aol.com>
Date: Jan 20, 2013
Frank, The pulse supply from the intake manifold on the HKS is weak.We have had le an condition at high cruise power settings with the pulse pump only.Their h igh dollar replacement pump is still less than ideal.Run the pump all the t ime.If it was mine,I'd have a second electric pump in line as well.I doubt they could get good signal even from the crankcase.It needs a cam driven pu mp like Rotax or Jabiru.A stout engine other than that. G.Aman . -----Original Message----- From: frank goodnight <frank.goodnight(at)att.net> Sent: Sun, Jan 20, 2013 10:32 am Subject: Kolb-List: electric fuel pump Hi, I fly a firestar with a HKS engine, it uses the same pluse pump as a 503 for the engine mounted pump with the elect pump mounted between the tank and and the engine pump. Do most of you that have that type system, leave the electric pump on all the time , or turn it off after takeoff? I have always left the electric pump on all the time--about 200 flight hrs--. Lately I have been hearing that it may be better to turn it off after takeoff. Like to hear thoughts from anyone who uses this type sys. Frank Goodnight ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Heated Seat Covers
Date: Jan 20, 2013
That vest looks like it would keep you toastey! BTW, I have really enjoyed reading about your adventures. -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Thanks, Wes/Kolbers: Would like to do it one more time, but age (74 this Summer) and the hurdles one must jump to cross the border now days, takes a lot of fun out of the adventure. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Heated Seat Covers
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 20, 2013
That vest looks like it would keep you toastey! BTW, I have really enjoyed reading about your adventures. -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392731#392731 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Sky Biker <smlplanet(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Heated Seat Covers
Date: Jan 20, 2013
I have to say the MK 111 C is a lot warmer than when I use to fly UL's up north in the winter with skies=2C insulated coveralls and a PVC coveralls over that to stay warm. Live in south Fl now and only need a heavier jacket in the winter months above 4000-5000 '. On s unny days I may have to crack the door open to cool the cabin off. > Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Heated Seat Covers > From: elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com > Date: Sun=2C 20 Jan 2013 08:34:17 -0800 > To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com > > > That vest looks like it would keep you toastey! BTW=2C I have really enjo yed reading about your adventures. > > -------- > Wesley Elliott > Sport Pilot-PPC > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392713#392713 > > > > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: flaperon angle
From: "Ducati SS" <hiwingflyer6219(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 20, 2013
Do you need to improve the roll function or the flap function? I have given alot of thought to improving roll but I would not want to increase drag. I think a firefly with 1% more drag could be renamed cinder block. Of course improving roll will create some added drag , my thought was to leave deflection as is and add an inch or two to the flaperon cord. But this might induce flutter. Far to many projects to try it now , at some point in the future I hope to build new flaperons and give it a try. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392744#392744 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 20, 2013
From: GARY JINDRA <gajindra(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Heated Seat Covers
Wesley,my answer to heat with my 582 was to make an adapter to move the =0A thermostat out about three inches.-Then I could-tee a heater hose in be tween the =0Ahead and the thermostat.Installed a heater core out of a chevy s10 pickup.Used a =0Aball cock valve to open and close water flow to heate r.Return line-entered back =0Ain just before the water pump on opposite s ide of- motor.In cold weather the =0Athermostat will open when needed to let water thru to main radiator.Takes the =0Achill off very well.Put a smal l 12 volt fan on the back of heater core with just =0Aa on and off switch.S witching engines to a 912-UL now so will be making some =0Achanges but wi ll be basicly the same setup.Pictures attached-=0A-=0A-=0AGary Jindra =0AKolb mark3=0A117 hours=0AAkron Oh.=0A=0A=0A_____________________________ ___=0AFrom: alienwes <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>=0ATo: kolb-list(at)matronics.c om=0ASent: Sun, January 20, 2013 9:59:12 AM=0ASubject: Kolb-List: Heated Se yahoo.com>=0A=0AIt seems there is a lot of trouble involved with getting ca bin heat into the =0AKolb.- What about 12V seat heaters? Anyone tried it? =0A=0Ahttp://www.activheat.com/index_files/heatedcarseatcover.htm=0A=0A---- ----=0AWesley Elliott=0ASport Pilot-PPC=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic onlin e here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392702#392702=0A =========================0A ================= ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Heated Seat Covers
Date: Jan 20, 2013
Wesley,my answer to heat with my 582 Gary Jindra Professional looking setup. I like it. However, for my own personal use, the Chilli Vest is simple, quick, and doesn't pipe hot water into the cockpit area. I'm pretty particular when I fly now, comfort wise. Haven't used any kind of heat for years. Tried to find some stationary like Frank's, but, alas, the choices I found weren't nearly as cute. ;-) john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Heated Seat Covers
From: Brad Nation <nationcap(at)comcast.net>
Date: Jan 20, 2013
I have a pair of Gerbins heated gloves I use for winter motorcycle riding that work great. You can also get heated pants, vest, helmet liner, and socks. The gloves are a little bulky but very warm. If you go with heated gloves, some don't heat the thumb which my not make any difference to you, it does to me though. Sent from my iPad Brad On Jan 20, 2013, at 10:32, "alienwes" wrote: > > That vest looks like it would keep you toastey! BTW, I have really enjoyed reading about your adventures. > > -------- > Wesley Elliott > Sport Pilot-PPC > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392731#392731 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Sky Biker <smlplanet(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Heated Seat Covers
Date: Jan 20, 2013
I ride a bike also and have seen all of those. I have no plans to return to cold weather and do any flying. Having lived in So Fl for many years my bl ood is to thin. My next quest once I finish the modulations to to my MK 111 C and get all the paperwork completed is to island hop in the Bahamas. I ha ve had it set up for off field with heavy landing gear so that I can land o r take off on most fields or beaches now. I have a heater that pulls heat o ff the oil cooler if needed and ducted into the cabin=2C but can also rever se the blower and use it for cooling the oil if need be and vent the cabin. > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Heated Seat Covers > From: nationcap(at)comcast.net > Date: Sun=2C 20 Jan 2013 15:39:30 -0700 > To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com > > > I have a pair of Gerbins heated gloves I use for winter motorcycle riding that work great. You can also get heated pants=2C vest=2C helmet liner=2C and socks. The gloves are a little bulky but very warm. If you go with hea ted gloves=2C some don't heat the thumb which my not make any difference to you=2C it does to me though. > > Sent from my iPad > > Brad > > On Jan 20=2C 2013=2C at 10:32=2C "alienwes" wr ote: > > > > > That vest looks like it would keep you toastey! BTW=2C I have really en joyed reading about your adventures. > > > > -------- > > Wesley Elliott > > Sport Pilot-PPC > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392731#392731 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 20, 2013
From: Jon LaVasseur <firestar503(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 912 cabin heater
Kolbers,=0A-=0ASomeone or maybe many of you must have pulled the hot wate r off a 912 and piped it into a small heater core for the cabin heat.- I would appreciate it if you would describe the plumbing.- Where did you pu ll the coolant out and where-did you connect the return line.- Pictures would be great.- Did anyone have any problems with coolant circulating o r engine temps after installing the heater cores?=0A-=0AThanks guys.=0A -=0AJon L=0AMinnesota ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "b young" <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: 912 cabin heater
Date: Jan 21, 2013
jon I have the 912 and the radiator is just behind and below the engine. just ahead of the inlet and outlet of the radiator, I installed 2 tees. pointed down. ran radiator hose from there down inside the rear cage area behind the fuel tank. there attached the radiator hose to a small heater core. mounted a computer cooling fan to the back of the core. the fan takes air from inside the cage area and recirculates the air inside, I have a 2 inch duct taking air to the nose cone up near my feet that run cold when flying in cooler weather. I did not want hot water running under my legs to the nose of the plane... and if I had a leak in the coolent lines it would be hard pressed to get to my person. I run the radiator and fan all the time.... in the summer I use it to eliminate excess heat from the engine.... and with the vents open, I personally never over heat,,, in the winter it helps take the edge off the cold temps. but it cant keep up when the temps are real cold. the only problem I had was a precieved one.... on the first day I used it I took of it was 20 and when I landed it was 10 deg F I thought it was not working,,, till I opened the door and the real cold air rushed in.. it was working,,, just not keeping up. in the winter I have to tape over a good part of the main radiator in order to keep the temps up. rotax says there is no minimum water temps for the 912 so they don=99t make a thermostat for the engine. if I could find a good thermostat housing the engine would warm up quicker, but be one more thing to keep an eye on. boyd young mkiii From: Jon LaVasseur Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2013 9:40 PM Subject: Kolb-List: 912 cabin heater Kolbers, Someone or maybe many of you must have pulled the hot water off a 912 and piped it into a small heater core for the cabin heat. I would appreciate it if you would describe the plumbing. Where did you pull the coolant out and where did you connect the return line. Pictures would be great. Did anyone have any problems with coolant circulating or engine temps after installing the heater cores? Thanks guys. Jon L Minnesota ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Pat Ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Fw: cartoon
Date: Jan 21, 2013
Re cartoon, No big deal Frank. I just happen to think that `smileys` and their associated cartoons do little to enhance the message. Sorry that I was bit irascible. Comes with old age. Cheers Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 912 cabin heater
From: "Thumper" <dlong1957(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 21, 2013
Heater and Thermostat information. Here is information on a thermostat and heater. Works great and only pulls 40 watts max =2.5amp. Thermostat article from John Gilpin at stolspeed.com. Thermostat at radiator inlet, no more tape or louvers for the radiator on engines that run cold. And it helps the engine warm up a little faster, not a lot faster. But maintains stable temps of 165 winter and 195 summer with the 180 degree thermostat. http://shop.watt-man.com/Thermo-Bob-1-Universal-Kit-with-One-Inch-Fittings-TB1.htm Heater is an oil cooler with fan that moves lots of air and it will remove a fingertip so keep hands clear. Use a DPDT switch and it can be wired reversing so on a Kolbra put it between pilot and passenger and reverse as needed. Tee into the radiator hoses between the engine and thermostat for consistant warm water, I used copper water fittings to make what I needed. Will work on 583 also. I suggest using the above thermostat even on 583 as with the bypass maybe it can help with cold seizures on those engines since it will never be completely closed? I mounted it below the seat and just blow forward or back depending on who needs the heat. With a sealed cabin I only run it less than 5-10% of the time when in the low 30's. Small 6"x6"x4"and lightweight. 1/2" heater hose I used but could probably be smaller since the engine with the thermostat runs 165 consistent on these cold days. http://www.amazon.com/Northern-HURRICANE-Oil-Cooler-Cooling/dp/B005UO2NI8 Have a great day and now I fly no matter how cold it is. Photo's and switch wiring available off line unless everyone wants them. Dennis in not real cold west Tennessee. -------- Dennis Long Oakland TN 2001 Kolb Mark IIIC 160+ hours since March 2011 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392813#392813 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Sky Biker <smlplanet(at)msn.com>
Subject: 912 cabin heater
Date: Jan 21, 2013
You may check into a 4 " bilge exhaust blower which is what I use on mine. My cabin is completely enclosed from the seats forward and have a 4"vent ho se ducted into it. By reversing the polarity with a switch it can be revers e the motor and draw air or heat out of the cabin. These motors are designe d for high volume air flow and very light weight. From: byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 912 cabin heater Date: Mon=2C 21 Jan 2013 09:50:54 -0700 =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A yes I do believe a larger fan would do more to keep things =0A warm. the problem is finding a larger fan and keep the weight =0A down. the other thing that would go a long way to keep things warm =0A is some type of insulation on the cabin walls=2C ceiling=2C and floor.=0A =0A boyd young mkiii=0A =0A =0A =0A =0A From: frank goodnight =0A Sent: Monday=2C January 21=2C 2013 7:11 AM=0A Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 912 cabin heater=0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A From: b young =0A Sent: Mon=2C January 21=2C 2013 1:15:55 =0A AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 912 =0A cabin heater =0A =0A =0A =0A Morning =0A Boyd=2C=0A I =0A haven't asked anyone yet =2C but want to install some type of heat in my 70 1 =0A before next=0A winter. =0A The way you did it seems simple and pretty much fool proof.=0A =0A Do you think a larger fan would warm things more =2C the older i get--71--t he =0A colder i get.=0A Thanks =0A for the explanation. =0A Frank=0A do =0A not archive=0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A jon=0A =0A I have the 912 and the radiator is just behind and below the =0A engine. just ahead of the inlet and outlet of the radiator=2C I =0A installed 2 tees. pointed down. ran radiator hose from there down =0A inside the rear cage area behind the fuel tank. there attached the =0A radiator hose to a small heater core. mounted a computer =0A cooling fan to the back of the core. the fan takes air from inside the =0A cage area and recirculates the air inside=2C I have a 2 inch duct taking a ir =0A to the nose cone up near my feet that run cold when flying in cooler =0A weather. I did not want hot water running under my legs to the nose =0A of the plane... and if I had a leak in the coolent lines it would be hard =0A pressed to get to my person. I run the radiator and fan =0A all the time.... in the summer I use it to eliminate excess =0A heat from the engine.... and with the vents open=2C I personally never =0A over heat=2C=2C=2C in the winter it helps take the edge off the cold =0A temps. but it cant keep up when the temps are real =0A cold. the only problem I had was a precieved one.... on the first =0A day I used it I took of it was 20 and when I landed it was 10 deg =0A F I thought it was not working=2C=2C=2C till I opened the door and =0A the real cold air rushed in.. it was working=2C=2C=2C just not =0A keeping up. in the winter I have to tape over a good part of the main =0A radiator in order to keep the temps up. rotax says there is no =0A minimum water temps for the 912 so they don=92t make a thermostat for the =0A engine. if I could find a good thermostat housing the engine would warm up =0A quicker=2C but be one more thing to keep an eye on.=0A =0A boyd young=0A mkiii=0A =0A =0A =0A =0A From: Jon LaVasseur =0A Sent: Sunday=2C January 20=2C 2013 9:40 PM=0A Subject: Kolb-List: 912 cabin heater=0A =0A =0A =0A Kolbers=2C=0A =0A Someone or maybe many of you must have pulled the hot water off a 912 and =0A piped it into a small heater core for the cabin heat. I would appreciate =0A it if you would describe the plumbing. Where did you pull the coolant out =0A and where did you connect the return line. Pictures would be great. =0A Did anyone have any problems with coolant circulating or engine temps after installing =0A the heater cores?=0A =0A Thanks guys.=0A =0A Jon L=0A Minnesota=0A =0A href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics. com/Navigator?Kolb-List=0A href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com=0A href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c =0A =0A =0A href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics. com/Navigator?Kolb-List=0A href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com=0A href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A =0A ============0A ============0A ============0A ============0A =0A ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 21, 2013
Subject: printing aircraft
From: Robert Laird <rlaird(at)cavediver.com>
I wonder how much longer before an ultralight is printed..... http://www.geek.com/articles/geek-cetera/3d-printed-aircraft-successfully-takes-flight-20121023/ ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Future of Kolb
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 21, 2013
Seems the Kolb company has gone through some ownership changes in 2011. Does anyine know about the stability of the company? -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392864#392864 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Future of Kolb
Date: Jan 21, 2013
Seems the Kolb company has gone through some ownership changes in 2011. Does anyine know about the stability of the company? -------- Wesley Elliott I believe the best folks to talk to about the stability of the Kolb Aircraft Company is probably Travis Brown and/or Brian Melborn. I doubt anyone on this List knows anything about the stability of the company. john ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 21, 2013
From: Malcolm Brubaker <brubakermal(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Future of Kolb
speculation? Future of kolb? dare we start speculating on your flying futur e wesley?=0A=0A=0AMalcolm & Jeanne Brubaker =0AMichigan Sport Pilot Repair =0Ahttp://michigansportpilotrepair.com/ =0ALSRM-A, PPC, WS=0AGreat Sails - Sailmaker =0Afor Ultralight & Light Sport=0A(989)513-3022 =0A- =0A=0A=0A =0A =0A=0A________________________________=0A From: John Hauck <jhauck@elmo re.rr.com>=0ATo: kolb-list(at)matronics.com =0ASent: Monday, January 21, 2013 10:17 PM=0ASubject: RE: Kolb-List: Future of Kolb=0A =0A--> Kolb-List mess age posted by: "John Hauck" =0A=0A=0A=0A=0ASeems the Kolb company has gone through some ownership changes in 2011. Does=0Aanyine know about the stability of the company?=0A=0A--------=0AWesley Elliott=0A =0A=0A=0A=0AI believe the best folks to talk to about the stability of the Kolb Aircraft=0ACompany is probably Travis Brown and/or Brian Melborn.- I doubt anyone on=0Athis List knows anything about the stability of the comp =========================0A ====================== ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Confused about FAA Registration ...
From: "rsbiser" <Rsbiser(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jan 21, 2013
I recently bought a used Kolb Mark III Xtra. It already has an airworthiness certificate, but it has been de-registered by the former owner. In other words, he canceled the N Number and removed it from the aircraft. I have reserved a new N Number. Can anyone help me understand what registration process I must go through to register the plane with my newly reserved N Number? What forms must I submit, etc.? Thanks, Scott -------- Scott Biser Cincinnati, Ohio Mark III Xtra Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392867#392867 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "b young" <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Confused about FAA Registration ...
Date: Jan 21, 2013
call your local Flight Standards District Offices (FSDO) BOYD YOUNG -----Original Message----- From: rsbiser Sent: Monday, January 21, 2013 9:48 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Confused about FAA Registration ... I recently bought a used Kolb Mark III Xtra. It already has an airworthiness certificate, but it has been de-registered by the former owner. In other words, he canceled the N Number and removed it from the aircraft. I have reserved a new N Number. Can anyone help me understand what registration process I must go through to register the plane with my newly reserved N Number? What forms must I submit, etc.? Thanks, Scott -------- Scott Biser Cincinnati, Ohio Mark III Xtra Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392867#392867 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 22, 2013
Subject: Re: Confused about FAA Registration ...
From: Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
That will be a tough one. About the only option open to you is Experimental Exhibition since you didn't build it and it can't go Experimental Amateur Built. Rick Girard On Tue, Jan 22, 2013 at 12:19 AM, b young wrote: > > call your local Flight Standards District Offices (FSDO) > > BOYD YOUNG > > -----Original Message----- From: rsbiser > Sent: Monday, January 21, 2013 9:48 PM > To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Kolb-List: Confused about FAA Registration ... > > > I recently bought a used Kolb Mark III Xtra. It already has an > airworthiness certificate, but it has been de-registered by the former > owner. In other words, he canceled the N Number and removed it from the > aircraft. > > I have reserved a new N Number. > > Can anyone help me understand what registration process I must go through > to register the plane with my newly reserved N Number? What forms must I > submit, etc.? > > Thanks, > > Scott > > -------- > Scott Biser > > Cincinnati, Ohio > > Mark III Xtra > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/**viewtopic.php?p=392867#392867> > > -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 22, 2013
From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Confused about FAA Registration ...
Buy some paperwork from a wreck?? Herb At 12:33 PM 1/22/2013, you wrote: >That will be a tough one. About the only option open to you is >Experimental Exhibition since you didn't build it and it can't go >Experimental Amateur Built. > >Rick Girard > >On Tue, Jan 22, 2013 at 12:19 AM, b young ><byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com> wrote: ><byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com> > >call your local Flight Standards District Offices (FSDO) > >BOYD YOUNG > >-----Original Message----- From: rsbiser >Sent: Monday, January 21, 2013 9:48 PM >To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Kolb-List: Confused about FAA Registration ... > > ><Rsbiser(at)gmail.com> > >I recently bought a used Kolb Mark III Xtra. It already has an >airworthiness certificate, but it has been de-registered by the >former owner. In other words, he canceled the N Number and removed >it from the aircraft. > >I have reserved a new N Number. > >Can anyone help me understand what registration process I must go >through to register the plane with my newly reserved N Number? What >forms must I submit, etc.? > >Thanks, > >Scott > >-------- >Scott Biser > >Cincinnati, Ohio > >Mark III Xtra > > >Read this topic online here: > ><http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392867#392867>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392867#392867 > > >=================================== >arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List >=================================== >http://forums.matronics.com >=================================== >le, List Admin. >="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >=================================== > > >-- >Zulu Delta >Mk IIIC >Thanks, Homer GBYM > >It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. > - Groucho Marx > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Future of Kolb
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 22, 2013
I really hope the company stays afloat in this tough economy. But I think asking the company if they are doing good will result in a "yes" know matter what the truth may be. My reason for wanting to know is two fold. The first reason is to have parts available. The second is the value of a Kolb plane will remain higher if the company is still around. These are important things to me as I do my research. Brubaker, Not sure what you meant by your comment. I started skydiving in my early 20's and moved on to PPG's and PPC's. Currently have a Sport Pilot License and want to cross over to fixed wing. If I were to speculate I would say that I would continue doing what I have been doing for the last 12 years. Wes -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392899#392899 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Future of Kolb
Date: Jan 22, 2013
I really hope the company stays afloat in this tough economy. But I think asking the company if they are doing good will result in a "yes" know matter what the truth may be. Wes Wes/Kolbers: I have been doing business with Kolb Aircraft for 29 years and three owners. They have always been an outstanding organization, placing customer service first. I got it from a very reliable source that Kolb Aircraft is solvent. It is one of the oldest ultralight/light plane companies in the world. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 22, 2013
From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Future of Kolb
Remember also....The Kolb guys can do other things to fill dead time... They take on covering and welding jobs for GA airplanes also.. Excellent workmanship and at a better price than standard shops.. Herb At 04:57 PM 1/22/2013, you wrote: > > >I really hope the company stays afloat in this tough economy. But I think >asking the company if they are doing good will result in a "yes" know matter >what the truth may be. > >Wes > > >Wes/Kolbers: > >I have been doing business with Kolb Aircraft for 29 years and three owners. > >They have always been an outstanding organization, placing customer service >first. > >I got it from a very reliable source that Kolb Aircraft is solvent. It is >one of the oldest ultralight/light plane companies in the world. > >john h >mkIII >Titus, Alabama > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 22, 2013
From: Malcolm Brubaker <brubakermal(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Future of Kolb
- WESS what you meen then is you plan on flying PPC like you have for 12 years? =0A=0A=0AMalcolm & Jeanne Brubaker =0AMichigan Sport Pilot Repair =0Ahttp://michigansportpilotrepair.com/ =0ALSRM-A, PPC, WS=0AGreat Sails - Sailmaker =0Afor Ultralight & Light Sport=0A(989)513-3022 =0A- =0A=0A=0A =0A =0A=0A________________________________=0A From: alienwes <elliott.wesle y(at)yahoo.com>=0ATo: kolb-list(at)matronics.com =0ASent: Tuesday, January 22, 20 13 5:40 PM=0ASubject: Kolb-List: Re: Future of Kolb=0A =0A--> Kolb-List me ssage posted by: "alienwes" =0A=0AI really hope t he company stays afloat in this tough economy. But I think asking the compa ny if they are doing good will result in a "yes" know matter what the truth may be. My reason for wanting to know is two fold. The first reason is to have parts available. The second is the value of a Kolb plane will remain h igher if the company is still around. These are important things to me as I do my research. =0A=0ABrubaker, =0ANot sure what you meant by your comment . I started skydiving in my early 20's and moved on to PPG's and PPC's. Cur rently have a Sport Pilot License and want to cross over to fixed wing. If I were to speculate I would say that I would continue doing what I have bee n doing for the last 12 years. =0A=0AWes=0A=0A--------=0AWesley Elliott=0AS port Pilot-PPC=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forum ============= ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Future of Kolb
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 22, 2013
Malcolm, While I like the Low and Slow of PPC, I have been thinking alot about fixed wing. I like the idea of an enclosed cockpit, more opportunities to fly than the wind limitations of PPC, and greater distance abilities. I also like the folding wings so you can transport like a PPC. -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392909#392909 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Confused about FAA Registration ...
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 22, 2013
Since you have an Airworthiness Certificate I think there is hope. The N-Number is nothing more than a $5 fee to the FAA. The AIRWORTHINESS CERTIFICATE is the one thats hard to get. I ran across this on another forum. "So, if you don't re-register and you lose your N-number, you should still be able to get your aircraft re-instated. You'd have to register it and, if more than 90 days past due, it would be registered under a new N-number. You would then have to take your AWC and Ops Limits to the FSDO and have them re-issued under the new N-number. It shouldn't be anymore complicated than getting new paperwork after changing the N-number to a unique number (vanity number.) (I've done that. It's not too much trouble to do." Now, if it was the other way around and you only had an N number and NO Airworthiness Cert, you would be screwed. Only route then would be Experimental Exhibition. Congrats on your new plane as I am jealous, Wes -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392910#392910 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Confused about FAA Registration ...
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 22, 2013
Rick, You are right on those E-LSA's that were given an Airworthiness Cert that expired. If his Airworthiness Cert has an "unlimited" for the expiration which most do, I still think he will be just fine. The only thing that he needs is an N number. Not hard to get. I believe the ones that have an expiration on them had until Jan 1 2010 to make them unlimited, and that date has passed also. Wes -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392918#392918 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Confused about FAA Registration ...
From: "rsbiser" <Rsbiser(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jan 22, 2013
Hey Guys, Thanks for the help. Just to be clear, the Airworthiness Certificate is EAB issued in March of '07 with an UNLIMITED Expiry Date. It does include the old N Number which the previous owner transferred to another airplane. I already have my new N Number reserved. So, it looks like I'll just have to wrestle through the process with the FSDO. Hope it won't be too painful. Thanks, Scott -------- Scott Biser Cincinnati, Ohio Mark III Xtra Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392920#392920 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Pat Ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: printing aircraft
Date: Jan 23, 2013
how much longer before an ultralight is printed>> Hi, probably not as long as you think. There has already been a car printed. I have an app which enables a small object to be assembled from drawings on the computer and if the result is sent to the company they will print out in three dimensions whatever has been designed. Incredible. When I mentioned this to my grandchildren they were unimpressed and told me that they had a 3d Printer at school. The world is shifting under our feet. Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Confused about FAA Registration ...
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 23, 2013
Scott, Please update us when you talk to the FSDO. Forum: Did not want to come across as arguing on this forum. I really just want to get along with all members and contribute and learn as much as I can. Wes -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392931#392931 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 23, 2013
Subject: Re: Confused about FAA Registration ...
From: Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
Wes, It's a free country, you can think what you want, but the Light Sport Branch is using the logic that registration is a requirement for issuing an experimental Certificate of Airworthiness and if the registration expires, since there is NO paperwork path available for re-registration, the CoA then becomes void. I have tried to get the EAA, the AOPA, and the FAA legal council in Washington DC to address this to no avail. That's the interpretation and that's what happens. Again, I urge you to call the Light Sport Branch and verify it for yourself, perhaps the interpretation has changed. Rick On Tue, Jan 22, 2013 at 9:24 PM, alienwes wrote: > > Rick, > You are right on those E-LSA's that were given an Airworthiness Cert that > expired. If his Airworthiness Cert has an "unlimited" for the expiration > which most do, I still think he will be just fine. The only thing that he > needs is an N number. Not hard to get. I believe the ones that have an > expiration on them had until Jan 1 2010 to make them unlimited, and that > date has passed also. > Wes > > -------- > Wesley Elliott > Sport Pilot-PPC > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392918#392918 > > -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 23, 2013
Subject: Re: printing aircraft
From: Robert Laird <rlaird(at)cavediver.com>
I've no doubt that, right now, many of the components could be printed .... e.g. ribs... (Some, probably not so much, e.g., sails.) But it would be cool to have a 3D printer that, using a composite formula, would print the whole thing, from bottom to top, excluding non-printable stuff like sails, tires, etc.. I would think that, in theory, you could make something much, much lighter, in sum, than the lightest (in sum) UL currently made by conventional methods. On Wed, Jan 23, 2013 at 4:49 AM, Pat Ladd wrote: > ** > how much longer before an ultralight is printed>> > > Hi, > probably not as long as you think. There has already been a car printed. > I have an app which enables a small object to be assembled from drawings > on the computer and if the result is sent to the company they will print > out in three dimensions whatever has been designed. Incredible. > > When I mentioned this to my grandchildren they were unimpressed and told > me that they had a 3d Printer at school. > > The world is shifting under our feet. > > Pat > > * > > * > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Pat Ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: printing aircraft
Date: Jan 23, 2013
Robert, what I find incredible is that it is possible to print a WORKING model.. I saw a guy on TV copy an adjustable spanner (What you call a wrench I believe) and it featured a knurled nut to obtain the adjustment. At the last moment someone asked for the nut to be a different colour, Sure enough the finished copy not only was delivered with the nut in red and the rest of the spanner in silver but the nut WORKED and the spanner could be adjusted in the normal way. Also on TV I saw a small model with a multiple rolling leg design.It was 8/9 inches long and had a body about 4inches by 4.It looked like a design for a moon explorer. It came straight from the 3D printer.It then had a small fan attached. When the presenter blew on the fan it turned a gear train which drove an axle to which the legs were attached and the damn thing moved forward. There must have been 25 or 30 working joints on this thing and they all flexed and hinged as if assembled from separate pieces.This was STRAIGHT FROM THE PRINTER. Unbelievable. Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 23, 2013
Subject: Re: printing aircraft
From: Robert Laird <rlaird(at)cavediver.com>
Yes, I've seen the spanner demo... I've seen some incredible examples, one of a hollow sphere inside a hollow sphere inside a hollow sphere, with each sphere exquisitely "carved", something that would be truly impossible to do any other way. So, yeah, doing the impossible is why this is such an incredible technology. I think the next step is the ability to extrude different materials -- each with unique properties -- so that when printing, unique capabilities can be added... things like bearings, ceramic cylinders, etc. When we get to that stage, then people won't have to buy small appliances any longer, they'll just buy the "plans", it'll be downloaded into the home-3D-printer, and the appliance will simply be printed. (Ideally, old appliances can be de-constituted into its component parts, and the material re-used into the next appliance.) I do wonder if we'll ever be able to print a working engine... but if ceramics can be extruded, I can't think of why not. And, with enough resolution and control, sails should be able to be printed, too. So, my guess is about 15 years from now, for a fully printable aircraft. If only we could print gasoline/petrol! haha. -- R On Wed, Jan 23, 2013 at 9:54 AM, Pat Ladd wrote: > ** > Robert, > what I find incredible is that it is possible to print a WORKING model.. > > I saw a guy on TV copy an adjustable spanner (What you call a wrench I > believe) and it featured a knurled nut to obtain the adjustment. At the > last moment someone asked for the nut to be a different colour, Sure enough > the finished copy not only was delivered with the nut in red and the rest > of the spanner in silver but the nut WORKED and the spanner could be > adjusted in the normal way. > Also on TV I saw a small model with a multiple rolling leg design.It was > 8/9 inches long and had a body about 4inches by 4.It looked like a design > for a moon explorer. It came straight from the 3D printer.It then had a > small fan attached. When the presenter blew on the fan it turned a gear > train which drove an axle to which the legs were attached and the damn > thing moved forward. There must have been 25 or 30 working joints on this > thing and they all flexed and hinged as if assembled from separate > pieces.This was STRAIGHT FROM THE PRINTER. Unbelievable. > > Pat > > * > > * > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Too Cold To F fly
Date: Jan 23, 2013
Morning Kolbers: Too cold to play outside today. Stumbled across a few photos from our get together at the Rock House last June 2012. Was a much better day the day of this flight. The blue and white FSII is Larry Cottrell, Rock House, Oregon, and the yellow FS KXP is Roger Hankin, Grants Pass, Oregon. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
From: McCarthy Tom <mccarthy(at)jefnet.com>
Subject: Re: Confused about FAA Registration ...
Date: Jan 23, 2013
Subject: Re: Confused about FAA Registration ... From: Richard Girard Wes, Most of what you say is true, unless your airplane is E-LSA and not derived from an S-LSA airplane (like the RV-12) or demoted from an S-LSA when the manufacturer went out of business. If you let your registration expire on an E-LSA that was registered during the grandfathering phase of starting up LSA there is no way to go back and re-register. Why, because 21.191 i(1) expired on 1-31-2008. The version of form 8088A that was used during the grandfathering period to apply for registration expired then, too. I'm sure the good folks at the Light Sport Branch of the FAA in Oklahoma City are tired of confirming it, but you can call them and check it out. Rick, This has come up in the past regarding E-LSA registration expiring. I just talked to Tim Bogenhagen at EAA, and he told me this is not so. If you are the owner of an expired E-LSA, you simply have to send in form 8050-1. He said since you already own the plane, you do not have to submit form 8050-2 or show evidence of ownership. Whats more, he said if you purchase the plane with an expired N-number, you can submit "its equivalent" to evidence of ownership, as prescribed in part 47, and on the instructions of form 8050-1. I am certainly no expert on issues with the FAA, and I know that the EAA is not perfect, but he sounded like he's been down this path before. I encourage people to always do their own leg work and take info on forums with a grain of salt. As you said, call the FAA. Tom McCarthy N863GB Slingshot N441TM Firestar N541TM Zenith 601HD All registered E-LSA----All registrations current Back to lurking mode, and maybe build mode very soon. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Sun N Fun 2013
From: "kolbaircraft" <customersupport(at)tnkolbaircraft.com>
Date: Jan 23, 2013
Hi everyone I wanted to let you know that Kolb will be at Sun N Fun Light plane section in Paradise City Space # 2 . The show starts on The 9TH. of April and ends on the 14TH. We are busy here at The Kolb Co .I will be glad to see my friends and Warm weather . Please come and visit our display and always a pleasure to have such wonderful customers. We are keeping Homers design alive forever. Travis Kolb Co www.kolbaircraft.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392964#392964 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Sun N Fun 2013
Date: Jan 23, 2013
I wanted to let you know that Kolb will be at Sun N Fun Light plane section in Paradise City Space # 2 . Travis Kolb Co Travis: Is this the same site Kolb has been in for so many years in the ultralight area, or over in the LSA area? john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Future of Kolb
From: "kolbaircraft" <customersupport(at)tnkolbaircraft.com>
Date: Jan 23, 2013
Kolb is doing fine in all ways. We are blessed with Homer Kolb's name and design. We don't advertise much because it seems you guys are doing the best job of introducing new folks to this old ,well thought of design. Kolb will always be here for support and new kits. I take calls 24/7 and I love talking about these kits and design. Here is our youtube channel http://www.youtube.com/user/kolbaircraft?feature=watch Kind Regards Travis Kolb Co Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392967#392967 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 23, 2013
From: chris davis <capedavis(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: printing aircraft
Hiu guys , About 3d printer try "youtube 3d radial aircraft engine "to see something incredable !=0A=0A=0AChris Davis=0AKXP 503 492 hrs=0AGlider Pilot =0ADisabled from crash building Firefly=0A=0A=0A>__________________________ ______=0A>From: Robert Laird <rlaird(at)cavediver.com>=0A>To: kolb-list@matron ics.com =0A>Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2013 11:05 AM=0A>Subject: Re: Kolb -List: printing aircraft=0A>=0A>=0A>Yes, I've seen the spanner demo... -I 've seen some incredible examples, one of a hollow sphere inside a hollow s phere inside a hollow sphere, with each sphere-exquisitely-"carved", so mething that would be truly impossible to do any other way. -So, yeah, do ing the impossible is why this is such an incredible technology. =0A>=0A> =0A>I think the next step is the ability to extrude different materials -- each with unique properties -- so that when printing, unique capabilities c an be added... things like bearings, ceramic cylinders, etc. -When we get to that stage, then people won't have to buy small appliances any longer, they'll just buy the "plans", it'll be downloaded into the home-3D-printer, and the appliance will simply be printed. -(Ideally, old appliances can be de-constituted into its component parts, and the material re-used into t he next appliance.)=0A>=0A>=0A>I do wonder if we'll ever be able to print a working engine... but if ceramics can be extruded, I can't think of why no t. -And, with enough resolution and control, sails should be able to be p rinted, too.=0A>=0A>=0A>So, my guess is about 15 years from now, for a full y printable aircraft.=0A>=0A>=0A>If only we could print gasoline/petrol! -haha.=0A>=0A>=0A>- -- R=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>On Wed, Jan 23, 2013 at 9:54 AM , Pat Ladd wrote:=0A>=0A>Robert,=0A>>what I find i ncredible is that it is possible to print a WORKING model..=0A>>-=0A>>I s aw a guy on TV copy an adjustable spanner (What you call a wrench I believe ) and it featured a knurled nut to obtain the adjustment. At the last momen t someone asked for the nut to be a different colour, Sure enough the finis hed copy not only was delivered with the nut in red and the rest of the spa nner in silver but the nut WORKED and the spanner could be adjusted in the normal way.=0A>>Also- on TV I saw a small model with a multiple rolling l eg design.It was 8/9 inches long and- had a body about 4inches by 4.It lo oked like a design for a moon explorer. It came straight from the 3D printe r.It then had a small fan attached. When the presenter blew on the fan it t urned a gear train which drove an axle to which the legs were attached and the damn thing moved forward. There must have been 25 or 30 working joints on this thing and they all flexed and hinged as if assembled from separate pieces.This was --- STRAIGHT FROM THE PRINTER. Unbelievable.=0A>>- =0A>>Pat=0A>>get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List tp://forums.matronics.com_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ================= =0A>=0A> ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 23, 2013
From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Sun N Fun 2013
John I think Travis said that they got booted from their old spot...? Herb At 03:26 PM 1/23/2013, you wrote: > > > I wanted to let you know that Kolb will be at Sun N Fun Light plane >section in Paradise City Space # 2 . > > > Travis >Kolb Co > > >Travis: > >Is this the same site Kolb has been in for so many years in the ultralight >area, or over in the LSA area? > >john h >mkIII >Titus, Alabama > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 23, 2013
From: chris davis <capedavis(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: printing aircraft
Try this--- www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1eKadlPC4w =0A=0A=0AChris Davi s=0AKXP 503 492 hrs=0AGlider Pilot=0ADisabled from crash building Firefly =0A=0A=0A>________________________________=0A>From: chris davis <capedavis@ yahoo.com>=0A>To: "kolb-list(at)matronics.com" =0A>S ent: Wednesday, January 23, 2013 6:14 PM=0A>Subject: Re: Kolb-List: printin g aircraft=0A>=0A>=0A>Hiu guys , About 3d printer try "youtube 3d radial ai rcraft engine "to see something incredable !=0A>=0A>=0A>Chris Davis=0A>KXP 503 492 hrs=0A>Glider Pilot=0A>Disabled from crash building Firefly=0A>=0A> =0A>=0A>>________________________________=0A>>From: Robert Laird <rlaird@ca vediver.com>=0A>>To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com =0A>>Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2013 11:05 AM=0A>>Subject: Re: Kolb-List: printing aircraft=0A>>=0A>> =0A>>Yes, I've seen the spanner demo... -I've seen some incredible exampl es, one of a hollow sphere inside a hollow sphere inside a hollow sphere, w ith each sphere-exquisitely-"carved", something that would be truly imp ossible to do any other way. -So, yeah, doing the impossible is why this is such an incredible technology. =0A>>=0A>>=0A>>I think the next step is t he ability to extrude different materials -- each with unique properties -- so that when printing, unique capabilities can be added... things like bea rings, ceramic cylinders, etc. -When we get to that stage, then people wo n't have to buy small appliances any longer, they'll just buy the "plans", it'll be downloaded into the home-3D-printer, and the appliance will simply be printed. -(Ideally, old appliances can be de-constituted into its com ponent parts, and the material re-used into the next appliance.)=0A>>=0A>> =0A>>I do wonder if we'll ever be able to print a working engine... but if ceramics can be extruded, I can't think of why not. -And, with enough res olution and control, sails should be able to be printed, too.=0A>>=0A>>=0A> >So, my guess is about 15 years from now, for a fully printable aircraft. =0A>>=0A>>=0A>>If only we could print gasoline/petrol! -haha.=0A>>=0A>> =0A>>- -- R=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>On Wed, Jan 23, 2013 at 9:54 AM, Pat Ladd wrote:=0A>>=0A>>Robert,=0A>>>what I find incredibl e is that it is possible to print a WORKING model..=0A>>>-=0A>>>I saw a g uy on TV copy an adjustable spanner (What you call a wrench I believe) and it featured a knurled nut to obtain the adjustment. At the last moment some one asked for the nut to be a different colour, Sure enough the finished co py not only was delivered with the nut in red and the rest of the spanner i n silver but the nut WORKED and the spanner could be adjusted in the normal way.=0A>>>Also- on TV I saw a small model with a multiple rolling leg de sign.It was 8/9 inches long and- had a body about 4inches by 4.It looked like a design for a moon explorer. It came straight from the 3D printer.It then had a small fan attached. When the presenter blew on the fan it turned a gear train which drove an axle to which the legs were attached and the d amn thing moved forward. There must have been 25 or 30 working joints on th is thing and they all flexed and hinged as if assembled from separate piece s.This was --- STRAIGHT FROM THE PRINTER. Unbelievable.=0A>>>-=0A>> >Pat=0A>>>get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-Listtp: //forums.matronics.com_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution =0A> -======================== =================== =0A>=0A> ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 23, 2013
From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Sun N Fun 2013
Think he said that the old area was full.... ? Herb At 05:27 PM 1/23/2013, you wrote: > >John > > I think Travis said that they got booted from their old spot...? Herb > > >At 03:26 PM 1/23/2013, you wrote: >> >> >> >> >> I wanted to let you know that Kolb will be at Sun N Fun Light plane >>section in Paradise City Space # 2 . >> >> >> Travis >>Kolb Co >> >> >> >> >>Travis: >> >>Is this the same site Kolb has been in for so many years in the ultralight >>area, or over in the LSA area? >> >>john h >>mkIII >>Titus, Alabama >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Sun N Fun 2013
Date: Jan 23, 2013
I think Travis said that they got booted from their old spot...? Herb That would be a shame after all these years. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 23, 2013
From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Sun N Fun 2013
Do not think it was a negative thing...just something about changes in space allocation by Sun N Fun...?? Herb At 07:58 PM 1/23/2013, you wrote: > > > I think Travis said that they got booted from their old spot...? Herb > > >That would be a shame after all these years. > >john h >mkIII >Titus, Alabama > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: spar tubing
From: "kolbaircraft" <customersupport(at)tnkolbaircraft.com>
Date: Jan 24, 2013
If anyone comes up with another source of the tubing please let me know. I have one mill that runs my tubes at 1000 lbs minimum order. Travis Kolb Co. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392997#392997 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: spar tubing
Date: Jan 24, 2013
If anyone comes up with another source of the tubing please let me know. I have one mill that runs my tubes at 1000 lbs minimum order. Travis Kolb Co. Travis: Is that 6" tubes, or all sizes? I don't have a source. Just curious. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Fwd: JabiruEngine-List: Spark Plug Crush/Compression Washers
From: Gary Aman <zeprep251(at)aol.com>
Date: Jan 24, 2013
You can buy NGK plugs either way,You might have to order them.NAPA always kept them for me G.Aman -----Original Message----- From: dwwilt <dwwilt(at)aol.com> Sent: Wed, Jan 23, 2013 9:16 am Subject: JabiruEngine-List: Spark Plug Crush/Compression Washers --> JabiruEngine-List message posted by: "dwwilt" I thought I had seen a post regarding this subject, but have not been able to find it. Does anyone have a source for the Spark Plug Crush/Compression Washers? On another note, the NGK plugs do not come with the screw on caps. Is ther e also a source for these? Thanks, -------- Dennis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=392937#392937 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: spar tubing
From: "kolbaircraft" <customersupport(at)tnkolbaircraft.com>
Date: Jan 24, 2013
5 inch OD X 052 and 6 inch OD X 058 Are what we use. Travis Kolb Co. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393006#393006 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Sun N Fun 2013
From: "kolbaircraft" <customersupport(at)tnkolbaircraft.com>
Date: Jan 24, 2013
Same Area different space. I am looking forward to Sun N Fun. Warm weather and good people well airplanes too. Travis Kolb Co. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393007#393007 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 24, 2013
From: Malcolm Brubaker <brubakermal(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Sun N Fun 2013
we just herd from sun fun HQ- all new aria road and stuff sounds- nice to me =0A=0A=0AMalcolm & Jeanne Brubaker =0AMichigan Sport Pilot Repair =0Ahttp://michigansportpilotrepair.com/ =0ALSRM-A, PPC, WS=0AGreat Sails - Sailmaker =0Afor Ultralight & Light Sport=0A(989)513-3022 =0A- =0A=0A=0A =0A =0A=0A________________________________=0A From: kolbaircraft <customers upport(at)tnkolbaircraft.com>=0ATo: kolb-list(at)matronics.com =0ASent: Thursday, January 24, 2013 11:38 AM=0ASubject: Kolb-List: Re: Sun N Fun 2013=0A =0A raft.com>=0A=0ASame Area different space.- I am looking forward to Sun N Fun.=0AWarm weather- and good people well airplanes too.=0A=0A=0ATravis =0AKolb Co.=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.m ============= ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: How do you transport a Kolb home?
From: "Dennis Thate" <retroman(at)frontier.com>
Date: Jan 24, 2013
DGaudette wrote: > Folks, > > How would a guy transport a Kolb home? I'm considering purchasing a Kolb from several states away but am stuck on how do I get this thing home? > > Any suggestions? Pictures? > > Thanks, > Doug A snowmobile trailer rent is usually very reasonable and they offer great protection and road handling. A downside is the back main door is usually smaller then the inside dimensions, so you will have remove wings and prop and oil tank. Never attempt to fly a 400 pound Kolb home if you are unfamiliar with it's handling characteristics. Good Luck -------- Both optimists and pessimists contribute to our society. The optimist invents the airplane and the pessimist the parachute. ~Gil Stern Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393013#393013 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/snowmobile_trailer_909.bmp ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 26, 2013
From: Malcolm Brubaker <brubakermal(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: michigan ultralight NEWSLETTER
follow the link to the coolest newsletter in the whole wide universe =0Aand that IS not an exaggeration=0A=0AMalcolm & Jeanne Brubaker =0AMichigan Spo rt Pilot Repair =0Ahttp://michigansportpilotrepair.com/ =0ALSRM-A, PPC, WS =0AGreat Sails - Sailmaker =0Afor Ultralight & Light Sport=0A(989)513-3022 =0A- =0A=0A=0A=0A =0A----- Forwarded Message -----=0AFrom: "aerograf@lent el.com" =0ATo: "Chapman, J NL Exch." ; "Atkinson, B 6/13" ; "Hayes, R 6/14" ; "Cuddy, B N/A" ; "Rebol, B 6/12" ; "Brubaker, M 6/12" ; "PALMER , R 6/13" ; David Curtis ; "Hermel, D N/A NLE" ; "SMALEC, D 6/2013" ; "Fackler, K 6/13" ; Brian Taylor N/A ; "Collard, K 6/13" ; "Phillips, S 6/1 2" ; "Beagle, F NLE" ; "Hender son, G 6/13" ; "Moreford, G N/A (EAA #597)" ; "Taylor, T NL Exch. BARUC" ; "Lang, J 6/13" ; "Klepser, J 6/12" ; "Spinney, J N/A" ; "Fittante, P 6/13" ; ASC HQ N/A ; "Kociba, K NL Exch. BARUC" ; "Lin ker, Robert" ; Linker R NA/O ; "Allen, D. 6/13" ; "Niles, D 6/13" ; Jim Plourde -- NL Exch. ; PALMER. R 6/13 ; "Beck, R 6/13" ; Deanna Ma zar - NL Exch Chapt. 77 ; "CARMER, J 6/12" ; "Warber, G 6/13" ; "Tucker, D 6/13" ; "Hall, J 6/13" ; "Smith, D 6/1 3" ; "Soper, L 6/13" ; "McKay, Julie - Owosso Airport Assoc." ; "McArthur, J 6/13" < mcarthurclan(at)aol.com>; "Gerics, M 6/13" ; "Miller, M (L. M.)" ; "Minarik, L 6/12" ; "E AA Jones, M N/A" ; "Anderson, P&D 6/13" ; "Adkison, P 6/13" ; "Deme ter,P N/A" ; "Martinus, P 6/13" ; "LaPorte, D 6/13" ; "Ferrier, B 6/13" ; "Scott Blixt, N/A NLE" ; Ultralight Flyin g N/A ; "Hart, D 6/13" ; "S mith, R 6/13" ; "Spence, S 6/13" ; "Spence, S 6/13" ; Grass Roots Avia tors ; "Jones, R 6/13" ; "Myers, J. 6/12" ; "Williams, J 6/13" ; "McGrady, W N/A-O" ; "WARDAVOIR, G N/L Exch" ; "Pickens, B NLE" ; "Ha nes, R 6/13" ; "LaBar, R 6/13" ; "Bor oss, Z 6/10" =0ASent: Friday, January 25, 2013 3:40 PM=0ASubject: FEBRUARY NEWSLETTER=0A =0A=0AThe February Issue of Fly ing Wires can be downloaded from the link below:=0A=0Ahttp://www.michiganul tralight.com/newsletter/FEB13/Feb13evers.PDF=0A=0ABack issues of Flying Wir es can be retrieved from the parent directory link here:=0A=0Ahttp://www.mi chiganultralight.com/newsletter/FEB13/Feb13evers.PDF=0A=0AThe link below is the BARNSTORMERS.com Classified ad that details the 25th Annual MULA Fly-I n:=0Ahttp://barnstormers.com/ad_detail.php?ID=741552=0A=0A=0AIMPORTANT: - Please e-mail or phone me to let me know if you will be attending the S afety Seminar Feb. 16th and/or the MULA Annual Dinner.- I need to know ho w many from your party will attend each event.=0A=0A=0A=0AIMPORTANT NOTE: M y e-mail address will change effective Jan. 15th. =0AThe New Address is: ae rograf(at)lentel.com -=0APlease update your address book. Denny Demeter=0AAV /Grafix, Ltd.=0A(800)-352-2296=0A(989) 288-3090=0Awww.avgrafix.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Kolb Mark III versus Rans S-12
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 28, 2013
Maybe I can get the forum talking with this question: Has anyone compared the Kolb Mark III and the Rans S-12? Does the Rans S-12 fold as easily? Has anyone flown both and how do they compare? Wes -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393208#393208 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Kolb Mark III versus Rans S-12
Date: Jan 28, 2013
Maybe I can get the forum talking with this question: Has anyone compared the Kolb Mark III and the Rans S-12? Does the Rans S-12 fold as easily? Has anyone flown both and how do they compare? Wes Wes/Kolbers: This is the Kolb Aircraft Builders and Flyers List. We are much more interested in building and flying Kolbs than other brands. Kolbs have all the other brands beat hands down. There is no comparison between a MKIII and an S-12. The S-12 is not nearly as crash worthy as the Kolb, a very, very important characteristic. I've been told by some that they are not concerned about crash worthiness because they are not going to crash. Wish I knew that. Since I don't, I'll stick with a good crash worthy Kolb. I've never flown an S-12. Don't know if they fold or not. I do know the S-12 fuselage doesn't hold a candle to the Kolb. I have also seen several S-12 that crashed. They do not do well. My own personal observations and opinions. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Mark III versus Rans S-12
From: Brad Nation <nationcap(at)comcast.net>
Date: Jan 28, 2013
The Rans12 wings do fold but the gas tanks are in the wings.. Sent from my iPad Brad On Jan 28, 2013, at 18:20, "alienwes" wrote: > > Maybe I can get the forum talking with this question: Has anyone compared the Kolb Mark III and the Rans S-12? > > Does the Rans S-12 fold as easily? > > Has anyone flown both and how do they compare? > > Wes > > -------- > Wesley Elliott > Sport Pilot-PPC > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393208#393208 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 28, 2013
Subject: Re: Kolb Mark III versus Rans S-12
From: Robert Laird <rlaird(at)cavediver.com>
Wes -- I have owned both an S-12XL (about 2 years) and a Kolb MkIIIC (7 years)... I currently own the Kolb. The Kolb is sturdier in most every way, plus the wings fold easily, quickly and can be done alone. My opinion only, of course, but I thought the S12XL actually flew a tiny bit better, was a tiny bit more fun, and I thoroughly enjoyed flying it, but the wings don't fold at all... they basically just have to be removed, which is a major operation, starting with draining the wing tanks... overall, it's doable, but generally speaking, you're talking several hours/half-a-day ~at best~ to remove, and then another several hours to put back together. If wing folding is anywhere in your top 20 characteristics, then it's no contest. You'd have to go with the Kolb. Despite my slight preference for the S12XL for flight characteristics, the differences are very small, and I very much enjoy flying the Kolb. And, without a doubt, if I could choose which one to crash in, then it's again no contest... the S12XL will roll up in a little ball, and you with it. I've seen it happen to others but, luckily, I've never experienced it. If I had a hangar with room, I'd have both. But I needed a plane with foldable wings, so the Kolb was the best option, IMO. -- Robert On Mon, Jan 28, 2013 at 7:20 PM, alienwes wrote: > > Maybe I can get the forum talking with this question: Has anyone compared > the Kolb Mark III and the Rans S-12? > > Does the Rans S-12 fold as easily? > > Has anyone flown both and how do they compare? > > Wes > > -------- > Wesley Elliott > Sport Pilot-PPC > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393208#393208 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: <aoldman(at)xtra.co.nz>
Subject: Re: Kolb Mark III versus Rans S-12
Date: Jan 29, 2013
I have flown both. Only my opinion but I would go with the Kolb. One fine day flying a S12, 2 up off a sealed runway, at the end of the runway the 12 was at 500ft agl swapping to the Kolb we were at 1100ft at the same point. Both were 503 powered and at sea level . I would consider the S12 very under powered with a 503 and the Kolb acceptable with a 503 . I also prefer the third wheel to be at the back, I find the ground handling of the Kolb to be much better . In fairness I have flown the Kolb a lot more and would only have about 1 hr. in the S12 and over 200 in the Kolb. Out of the 9 or so aircraft types in my log book the only ones that come close to the Kolb would be the Piper cub or Aronca champ. A couple of the others were high performance so can not be fairly compared . Regards Downunder Kolb Mk111 -----Original Message----- From: alienwes Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2013 2:20 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb Mark III versus Rans S-12 Maybe I can get the forum talking with this question: Has anyone compared the Kolb Mark III and the Rans S-12? Does the Rans S-12 fold as easily? Has anyone flown both and how do they compare? Wes -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393208#393208 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steve Simmons" <stevesimmons(at)charter.net>
Subject: Mark III C for sale
Date: Jan 30, 2013
See attached flyer: Owner Motivated to sale need money for other projects, Lost medical you can e-mail @ stevesimmons(at)charter.net or call 423 748-4336 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 29, 2013
Subject: Slow News Day in Florida
From: Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com>
Big article in the local news paper about all the ultralight/LS/Experimental accidents in the area. Interesting the paper version said "smaller aircraft" but online it was "ultralight". They interviewed a mechanic and GA owner at the Manatee airport here in Florida who seemed to have a real grudge against anything that wasn't general aviation. The article was surprisingly accurate, biased but accurate for a news paper. Just a few errors. http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20130128/ARTICLE/130129551 Makes me think about interacting with the GA guys a my airport in Michigan. I think I have been accepted but it only takes one when a reporter wants to make a name for himself. Oh yes to keep it Kolb I haven't flown my Kolb since I left Michigan in October. Getting worked up to do a bunch of flying when I get back. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 29, 2013
From: william sullivan <williamtsullivan(at)att.net>
Subject: Re: Slow News Day in Florida
- Note the last line?- "Fuel Issues". --- On Tue, 1/29/13, Rick Neilsen wrote: From: Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com> Subject: Kolb-List: Slow News Day in Florida Date: Tuesday, January 29, 2013, 12:52 PM Big article in the local news paper about all the ultralight/LS/Experimenta l-accidents in the area. Interesting the paper version said "smaller airc raft" but online it was "ultralight". They interviewed a-mechanic-and -GA owner at the Manatee airport here in Florida who seemed to have a rea l grudge against anything that wasn't general-aviation. The article was -surprisingly-accurate, biased but accurate for a news paper. Just a fe w errors.-=0A http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20130128/ARTICLE/130129551 =0A Makes me think about interacting with the GA guys a my airport in Michigan. I think I have been accepted but it only takes one when a reporter wants t o make a name for himself.- Oh yes to keep it Kolb I haven't flown my Kolb since I left Michigan in Oct ober. Getting worked up to do a bunch of flying when I get back.-=0A =======0A=0A ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Slow News Day in Florida
Date: Jan 29, 2013
Big article in the local news paper about all the ultralight/LS/Experimental accidents in the area. Interesting the paper version said "smaller aircraft" but online it was "ultralight". They interviewed a mechanic and GA owner at the Manatee airport here in Florida who seemed to have a real grudge against anything that wasn't general aviation. The article was surprisingly accurate, biased but accurate for a news paper. Just a few errors. Rick Neilsen If the mechanic was making money off the Manatee Ultralights, he'd have a change of attitude. GA types like the 172 owner/pilot are a dime a dozen. They have this "my airplane is bigger and more expensive than your airplane complex". Most of the GA pilots at our local airport, 08A, never fly, and if they do, it is around the patch. Airplanes don't make the pilot either. Most of my flying friends are retired military or professional civilian pilots that like to fly Kolbs and other small experimentals and ULs more than they do GA aircraft that aren't nearly as much fun to fly. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Mark III versus Rans S-12
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jan 29, 2013
Thanks everyone for the posts! Very informative. I consider safety a big priority and I have read over and over about how solid the KOLB's are. Not that I plan on crashing one, but if I do. (Knock on Wood) -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393248#393248 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: New Possibilities
From: "Dennis Thate" <retroman(at)frontier.com>
Date: Jan 30, 2013
Meet the new mighty V4 "baby block" engine 1650cc liquid-cooled V4, 185 HP Can I purchase a V4 Baby Block engine for a different application? Yes, we will offer crated engines once they have completed durability testing and become available in 2013. Pricing, drawings, and specifications will be announced soon. http://motusmotorcycles.com/kmv4.html [Idea] -------- Both optimists and pessimists contribute to our society. The optimist invents the airplane and the pessimist the parachute. ~Gil Stern Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393279#393279 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 30, 2013
From: GARY JINDRA <gajindra(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Virus-DO NOT OPEN EMAIL with subject Hi (your name or Hey)
from me =0Aattaches to contact list and sends itself,sorry-=0AGary Jindra ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 30, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: 447 engine maintnance...
Ellery I am very interested to see your maintenance schedule for 447's. Thanks Herb n 01/30/2013 05:00 PM, Ellery Batchelder Jr wrote: > > I ran 3 different 447's without a hitch maintenance Is everything > > Ellery Batchelder Jr. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Kolb Slingshot
From: "Jimmy Young" <jdy100(at)comcast.net>
Date: Jan 30, 2013
Kolbers, I'm making this post on behalf of fellow Kolb owner & pilot Dean Chandler. He asked me to let the list know he is moving from Kentucky to Florida and has his Kolb Slingshot for sale. He would have made the post himself, but lives so far out in the boonies he does not have internet access. I first saw his plane back in 2007 at the Kolb Factory reunion. At the time I knew nothing about Kolbs or flying for that matter, but we stayed in touch and I have a few photos of his Slingshot on file which I am attaching. He told me the 582 engine has over 500 hrs, well past TBO, but according to him it still runs fine and has flown within the month. He is asking $6500 for the plane. It is N359RC and has an A/W certificate dated 1999. When I last saw it, his Slingshot was one fine looking Kolb. Dean's ph# is 606.305.7870. If anyone is interested, he asks that you give him a call. Jimmy Young Houston TX Former Kolb FS owner, but still a Kolb admirer & List Lurker. Now flying something different. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393333#393333 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/100_0950_487.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/105_2152_160.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 31, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
Guys Need this plane like I need the other three that I have...but...a deal is a deal!!...so...going up Sunday morning for pre buy inspection..I have dibs till then... I told Dean to call if someone calls and wants to head that way before hand with cash in pocket...therefore giving me first refusal... the 582 has 500 hours but fly's strong... If I buy it and very likely I will, I may want to replace the engine...though I have no qualms about flying a high time 582... :-) I understand that the wings will not fold if a 912 is mounted...? How about the HKS as an option....naturally I would look for a used one in either case ...:-) Do not envision using the rear seat....Herb Kolbers, I'm making this post on behalf of fellow Kolb owner & pilot Dean Chandler. He asked me to let the list know he is moving from Kentucky to Florida and has his Kolb Slingshot for sale. He would have made the post himself, but lives so far out in the boonies he does not have internet access. I first saw his plane back in 2007 at the Kolb Factory reunion. At the time I knew nothing about Kolbs or flying for that matter, but we stayed in touch and I have a few photos of his Slingshot on file which I am attaching. He told me the 582 engine has over 500 hrs, well past TBO, but according to him it still runs fine and has flown within the month. He is asking $6500 for the plane. It is N359RC and has an A/W certificate dated 1999. When I last saw it, his Slingshot was one fine looking Kolb. Dean's ph# is 606.305.7870. If anyone is interested, he asks that you give him a call. Jimmy Young Houston TX Former Kolb FS owner, but still a Kolb admirer & List Lurker. Now flying something different. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jan 31, 2013
Subject: Re: Slow News Day in Florida
From: Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com>
Another slow news day one day later but this time good. In the first link a local columnists in the same paper said no need to regulate........ http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20130130/COLUMNIST/130139968/2256/NEWS?Title=Lyons-No-need-to-regulate-risky-behavior In the columnist's blog site a knowledgeable pilot shared his viewpoint very good but unfortunately few will see it. http://tomlyonstheblog.blogs.heraldtribune.com/10296/ultralight-pilot-shoots-down-h-ts-crash-coverage/ Have a good Kolb day Rick Neilsen Redrive VW POwered MKIIIC On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 12:52 PM, Rick Neilsen wrote: > Big article in the local news paper about all the > ultralight/LS/Experimental accidents in the area. Interesting the paper > version said "smaller aircraft" but online it was "ultralight". They > interviewed a mechanic and GA owner at the Manatee airport here in Florida > who seemed to have a real grudge against anything that wasn't > general aviation. The article was surprisingly accurate, biased but > accurate for a news paper. Just a few errors. > > http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20130128/ARTICLE/130129551 > > Makes me think about interacting with the GA guys a my airport in > Michigan. I think I have been accepted but it only takes one when a > reporter wants to make a name for himself. > > Oh yes to keep it Kolb I haven't flown my Kolb since I left Michigan in > October. Getting worked up to do a bunch of flying when I get back. > > Rick Neilsen > Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC > > * > > * > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
Date: Feb 01, 2013
If that Slingshot is in good condition and well built it is an incredible bargain. Which brings to mind the adage, if it is too good to be true, do your due diligence. Thom Riddle I flew this SS some years ago. It belonged, for a while, to a friend of mine in my local area. It flew as well as any of the other SS's I have flown over the years. Saw it again at a Kolb Homecoming in London, KY, several years ago. It still looked good. john h mkIII Eglin AFB, Florida ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 01, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
I will know more Sunday morning... Going to Somerset Ky area with money in my pocket! :-) By the way..its the yellow one on the Slingshot page at the Kolb factory site..Herb If that Slingshot is in good condition and well built it is an incredible bargain. Which brings to mind the adage, if it is too good to be true, do your due diligence. Thom Riddle I flew this SS some years ago. It belonged, for a while, to a friend of mine in my local area. It flew as well as any of the other SS's I have flown over the years. Saw it again at a Kolb Homecoming in London, KY, several years ago. It still looked good. john h mkIII Eglin AFB, Florida http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 01, 2013
From: TheWanderingWench <thewanderingwench(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Looking for pilots in the Ft. Lauderdale area
=0AI recently spoke with an amazing =0Agentleman of soon-to-be 91 =0Ayears, who lives in Tamarack, Florida (a suburb of Ft. Lauderdale.) He's working his way through his "bucket list"; last year he celebrated his =0A90th birt hday with a parachute jump, and he'd like to celebrate his 91st with an ult ralight flight. He got my name off the internet and =0Acontacted me to find out about getting a flight in an "ultralight". =0A=0ADo any of you know so meone in the greater Ft. Lauderdale area who might be willing to give a =0A lively almost-91 year old a flight in an ultralight-type aircraft? We =0Aha d a delightful conversation on the phone and I'm sure that whomever =0Agive s him a flight will have a lot of fun getting to know him. =0A=0A=0AI know there's an EAA Chapter in the Ft. Lauderdale area and I've left a =0Afew me ssages, but haven't heard back, so am trying this way of reach out to other ultralight/LSA pilots.=0A=0APlease get in touch with me and I'll forward y our contact information to Sam. Thanks in advance -=0A=0AArty Trost=0ASandy , Oregon=0A=0A-=0Awww.LessonsFromTheEdge.com/uladventure2009.htm=0A=0A=0A "Life's a daring adventure or nothing"=0AHelen Keller=0A=0A=0A"I refuse to tip toe through life just to arrive safely at death."=0A=0A=0A_____________ ___________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
From: "Richard Pike" <richard(at)bcchapel.org>
Date: Feb 02, 2013
herbgh(at)nctc.com wrote: > Thom > > > Anyone have a good estimate as to cost to zero time the 582? Too late > to call the usual suspects... Herb > > In the past, Lockwood has been known to do them comparitively cheaply at this time of the year when business is slow. Might be worth a phone call. Or not. -------- Richard Pike Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) richard (at) bcchapel(dot)org Kingsport, TN 3TN0 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393436#393436 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 02, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
Richard I got on the net last night and found that the cost is in the 3k range...I certainly intend to do it myself..and save the 1k worth of labor ...or more..Herb by the way....this bird is registered with an N number...and I am an ul man...what sport classification is that under? On 02/02/2013 08:27 AM, Richard Pike wrote: > > > herbgh(at)nctc.com wrote: >> Thom >> >> >> Anyone have a good estimate as to cost to zero time the 582? Too late >> to call the usual suspects... Herb >> >> > > In the past, Lockwood has been known to do them comparitively cheaply at this time of the year when business is slow. Might be worth a phone call. Or not. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
From: "Thom Riddle" <riddletr(at)gmail.com>
Date: Feb 02, 2013
Herb, The N-number (registration number) means it is an aircraft, not a UL. Slingshots (and all other Kolb models) meet the limitations for LSA. Therefore, the pilot must have at least a Sport Pilot certificate, a valid and current US drivers license (or current FAA 3rd class or better medical certificate), and a current flight review (in last 24 months. Lacking any of these, a pilot cannot fly it legally. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY (9G0) Kolb Slingshot SS-021 no engine FOR SALE Diamond Katana DA20-A1 Rotax 912 F3 Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long. - Anonymous Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393445#393445 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: For Kolb Private Strip owners
From: "Dennis Thate" <retroman(at)frontier.com>
Date: Feb 02, 2013
Building a better runway involved removing all the topsoil first then stockpiling the black dirt in a long windrow then cutting down a slope and finally replacing the topsoil and leveling with a Transit Level Kit. Money well spent ! -------- Both optimists and pessimists contribute to our society. The optimist invents the airplane and the pessimist the parachute. ~Gil Stern Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393448#393448 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/leveling_the_slope_203.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/runway_leveling_164.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/end_product_241.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/before_467.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 02, 2013
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
From: Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
Herb, There's a lot of if's here so you'll need to take this with a grain of salt. You say the plane is a 98ish build. IF the plane was registered at that time it will almost certainly be as an Experimental Amateur Built. In that case you will need to have an A & P do an annual on it AND sign off any engine work you do. You cannot get a repairman's ticket for E-AB unless you are the original builder and you requested it at the time the airworthiness inspection was done. On the other hand, IF the plane was used under one of the old alphabet UL groups and operated under the two place training exemption and THEN grandfathered in under the Experimental Light Sport program (FAR 21.191 i (1)) then you can take the 16 hour class and get a repairman inspection card (LSARI) for it and do the annual and engine work yourself and sign it off. Without that ticket you will have to take it to an A & P OR someone with a repairman maintenance card (LSARM) to do the annual and supervise your engine work IF you want to keep the logs up to date and maintain the value of the airplane. As Thom said, no matter how the plane is registered, E-AB or E-LSA you're going to have to get at least a Sport Pilot airplane ticket to legally fly it. Rick Girard LSARM 3178721 On Sat, Feb 2, 2013 at 9:06 AM, herb wrote: > > Richard > > I got on the net last night and found that the cost is in the 3k > range...I certainly intend to do it myself..and save the 1k worth of labor > ...or more..Herb > > by the way....this bird is registered with an N number...and I am an ul > man...what sport classification is that under? > > On 02/02/2013 08:27 AM, Richard Pike wrote: > >> >> >> herbgh(at)nctc.com wrote: >> >>> Thom >>> >>> >>> >>> Anyone have a good estimate as to cost to zero time the 582? Too late >>> to call the usual suspects... Herb >>> >>> >>> >> In the past, Lockwood has been known to do them comparitively cheaply at >> this time of the year when business is slow. Might be worth a phone call. >> Or not. >> >> >> > > -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 02, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
Rick Thanks for the refresher info...all of which I have read many times....but too old to remember..and flying a Firefly...did not have much of a reason to do so...:-) I can see a fair amount of expense involved....for I recall that the 16 hour class is expensive for what they teach...but a bargain for the piece of paper that one gets!! :-) I am fairly sure it is reg...E-AB... and I will need my buddy who has the AP and IA endorsement do the necessary inspections and write offs... if he will?? I intend flying my Firefly to get my sport pilot training....(that may help ?? !! ) Herb Herb On 02/02/2013 11:09 AM, Richard Girard wrote: > Herb, There's a lot of if's here so you'll need to take this with a > grain of salt. > You say the plane is a 98ish build. IF the plane was registered at > that time it will almost certainly be as an Experimental Amateur > Built. In that case you will need to have an A & P do an annual on it > AND sign off any engine work you do. You cannot get a repairman's > ticket for E-AB unless you are the original builder and you requested > it at the time the airworthiness inspection was done. > On the other hand, IF the plane was used under one of the old alphabet > UL groups and operated under the two place training exemption and THEN > grandfathered in under the Experimental Light Sport program (FAR > 21.191 i (1)) then you can take the 16 hour class and get a repairman > inspection card (LSARI) for it and do the annual and engine work > yourself and sign it off. Without that ticket you will have to take it > to an A & P OR someone with a repairman maintenance card (LSARM) to do > the annual and supervise your engine work IF you want to keep the logs > up to date and maintain the value of the airplane. > As Thom said, no matter how the plane is registered, E-AB or E-LSA > you're going to have to get at least a Sport Pilot airplane ticket to > legally fly it. > > Rick Girard > LSARM 3178721 > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
From: "Thom Riddle" <riddletr(at)gmail.com>
Date: Feb 02, 2013
Rick, You mentioned that an A&P must supervise and sign off any engine work on an E/AB certificated aircraft. I've never heard that before. Can you point to a FAR that states this? -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY (9G0) Kolb Slingshot SS-021 no engine FOR SALE Diamond Katana DA20-A1 Rotax 912 F3 Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long. - Anonymous Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393453#393453 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 02, 2013
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
From: Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
Anyone can work on an E-AB, and charge money for it, for that matter. What they cannot do is write anything in the engine or aircraft log books, anything of a legal nature anyway. The last caveat about maintaining the value of the aircraft is what having an A & P supervise the engine over haul was meant to convey, so no, no requirement unless you want a logbook entry to go with the work. Rick On Sat, Feb 2, 2013 at 12:06 PM, Thom Riddle wrote: > > Rick, > You mentioned that an A&P must supervise and sign off any engine work on > an E/AB certificated aircraft. I've never heard that before. Can you point > to a FAR that states this? > > -------- > Thom Riddle > Buffalo, NY (9G0) > > Kolb Slingshot SS-021 > no engine > FOR SALE > > Diamond Katana DA20-A1 > Rotax 912 F3 > > Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long. > - Anonymous > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393453#393453 > > -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 02, 2013
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
From: Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
Thom, I should mention that it also depends on which version of the Operating Limits go with the airworthiness certificate. In the latest version there would be a requirement to notify the local FSDO of a major overhaul so they could put it back into Phase One testing and prescribe a flight test area. See Order 8130-2G starting on page 4-64, "(19) After incorporating a major change as described in 14 CFR =A7 21.93, the aircraft owner is required to reestablish compliance with 14 CFR =A7 91.319(b) and notify the geographically responsible FSDO of the location of the proposed test area. The aircraft owner must obtain concurrence from the FSDO as to the suitability of the proposed test area. If the major change includes installing a different type of engine (reciprocating to turbine) or a change of a fixed-pitch from or to a controllable propeller, the aircraft owner must fill out a revised FAA Form 8130-6 to update the aircraft=92s file in the FAA Aircraft Registration Branch. All operations must be conducted under day VFR conditions in a sparsely populated area. The aircraft must remain in flight test for a minimum of 5 hours. The FSDO may require additional time (more than 5 hours) depending on the extent of the modification. Persons nonessential to the flight must not be carried. The aircraft owner must make a detailed aircraft logbook and maintenance records entry describing the change before the test flight. Following satisfactory completion of the required number of flight hours in the flight test area, the pilot must certify in the records that the aircraft has been shown to comply with 14 CFR =A7 91.319(b)." Rick On Sat, Feb 2, 2013 at 2:39 PM, Richard Girard wrote: > Anyone can work on an E-AB, and charge money for it, for that matter. Wha t > they cannot do is write anything in the engine or aircraft log books, > anything of a legal nature anyway. The last caveat about maintaining the > value of the aircraft is what having an A & P supervise the engine over > haul was meant to convey, so no, no requirement unless you want a logbook > entry to go with the work. > > Rick > > > On Sat, Feb 2, 2013 at 12:06 PM, Thom Riddle wrote: > >> >> Rick, >> You mentioned that an A&P must supervise and sign off any engine work on >> an E/AB certificated aircraft. I've never heard that before. Can you poi nt >> to a FAR that states this? >> >> -------- >> Thom Riddle >> Buffalo, NY (9G0) >> >> Kolb Slingshot SS-021 >> no engine >> FOR SALE >> >> Diamond Katana DA20-A1 >> Rotax 912 F3 >> >> Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long. >> - Anonymous >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393453#393453 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> =========== =========== =========== =========== >> >> >> >> > > > -- > Zulu Delta > Mk IIIC > Thanks, Homer GBYM > > It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhapp y. > - Groucho Marx > > -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
From: "Thom Riddle" <riddletr(at)gmail.com>
Date: Feb 03, 2013
Rick, That is what I've always thought to be the case. Any "major repair" or "major alteration" requires notification of the FSDO as you stated. What constitutes a major repair or major alteration is defined in part 43 and these definitions apply to all aircraft regardless of certificate type. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY (9G0) Kolb Slingshot SS-021 no engine FOR SALE Diamond Katana DA20-A1 Rotax 912 F3 Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long. - Anonymous Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393490#393490 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Nick Cassara" <nickc(at)mtaonline.net>
Subject: Light Sport License
Date: Feb 03, 2013
Hello Kolbers, "I intend flying my Firefly to get my sport pilot training....(that may help ?? !!" My understanding is the for Herb to get a Light Sport License he will need to come up with a "Two place light sport qualified aircraft", if so his Firefly will not help him get his Ticket. Right? Nick Cassara Palmer ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 03, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Light Sport License
I am just hoping to influence the instructor...:-) Herb On 02/03/2013 11:17 AM, Nick Cassara wrote: > > Hello Kolbers, > > "I intend flying my Firefly to get my sport pilot > > training....(that may help ?? !!" > > My understanding is the for Herb to get a Light Sport License he will > need to come up with a "Two place light sport qualified aircraft", if > so his Firefly will not help him get his Ticket... Right? > > Nick Cassara > > Palmer > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 03, 2013
From: TheWanderingWench <thewanderingwench(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Light Sport License
You CAN get a Light Sport license in a single seat registered LSA. I did, i n my single seat Drifter. Your LS license will have a single seat limitatio n - that you cannot fly a two-seat as PIC, nor take a passenger. If you lat er want to "upgrade" your license to fly a two-seat LSA, you'll have to sta rt at the beginning and go through the entire testing process again.=0A=0AA rty Trost=0ASandy, Oregon=0A=0A=0A=C2-=0Awww.LessonsFromTheEdge.com/uladv enture2009.htm=0A=0A=0A"Life's a daring adventure or nothing"=0AHelen Kelle r=0A=0A=0A"I refuse to tip toe through life just to arrive safely at death. "=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0A From: Nick Cassara <nickc@mta online.net>=0ATo: kolb-list(at)matronics.com =0ASent: Sunday, February 3, 2013 9:17 AM=0ASubject: Kolb-List: Light Sport License=0A =0A=0A=C2-=C2- He llo Kolbers,=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=9CI intend=C2- flying=C2- my Fi refly=C2- to get my sport pilot =0Atraining....(that may help ??=C2- !! =9D=0A=C2-=0AMy understanding is the for Herb to get a Light Sport License he will need to come up with a =9CTwo place light sport quali fied aircraft=9D, if so his Firefly will not help him get his Ticket ====== ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 03, 2013
Subject: Re: Light Sport License
From: Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com>
Herb, your best bet would be to use the Slingshot to fly off your hours. Of course you will have to be solo'ed in it first. You will have to find a instructor that will check you out in the plane. When I was trying to get my privates lic. I bought a EAB Mark III, with the thought of using it to fly off my hours. I did manage to get the instructor in the plane for one ride, but he would not ever get in it again. Of course the thought of being only surrounded by fabric, rather than tin foil was too much for his limited mind to grasp. That should not be a problem with a LSA instructor. Just make sure that the plane has a current annual. If the engine is flying well, keep it in the pattern (or not) and work on the engine after all the dust clears. Hang in there, it took me 10.6 years to get legal, and force myself to jump through all the hoops. Its all good though and worth the effort. Larry On Sun, Feb 3, 2013 at 11:07 AM, TheWanderingWench < thewanderingwench(at)yahoo.com> wrote: > You CAN get a Light Sport license in a single seat registered LSA. I did, > in my single seat Drifter. Your LS license will have a single seat > limitation - that you cannot fly a two-seat as PIC, nor take a passenger. > If you later want to "upgrade" your license to fly a two-seat LSA, you'll > have to start at the beginning and go through the entire testing process > again. > > Arty Trost > Sandy, Oregon > > > www.LessonsFromTheEdge.com/uladventure2009.htm > > "Life's a daring adventure or nothing" > Helen Keller > > > "I refuse to tip toe through life just to arrive safely at death." > ------------------------------ > *From:* Nick Cassara > *To:* kolb-list(at)matronics.com > *Sent:* Sunday, February 3, 2013 9:17 AM > *Subject:* Kolb-List: Light Sport License > > Hello Kolbers, > > > =93I intend flying my Firefly to get my sport pilot > training....(that may help ?? !!=94 > > My understanding is the for Herb to get a Light Sport License he will nee d > to come up with a =93Two place light sport qualified aircraft=94, if so h is > Firefly will not help him get his Ticket=85 Right? > > Nick Cassara > Palmer > > ** > > > * > =========== =========== =========== =========== > * > > -- *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.* ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 03, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Light Sport License
The nearest instructor is within flying distance and that is what I meant...I will fly to the airport in the Firefly ..and would use the Slingshot to attain the necessary hours..Herb On 02/03/2013 12:35 PM, Larry Cottrell wrote: > Herb, your best bet would be to use the Slingshot to fly off your > hours. Of course you will have to be solo'ed in it first. You will > have to find a instructor that will check you out in the plane. When I > was trying to get my privates lic. I bought a EAB Mark III, with the > thought of using it to fly off my hours. I did manage to get the > instructor in the plane for one ride, but he would not ever get in it > again. Of course the thought of being only surrounded by fabric, > rather than tin foil was too much for his limited mind to grasp. That > should not be a problem with a LSA instructor. Just make sure that the > plane has a current annual. If the engine is flying well, keep it in > the pattern (or not) and work on the engine after all the dust clears. > Hang in there, it took me 10.6 years to get legal, and force myself > to jump through all the hoops. Its all good though and worth the effort. > Larry > > On Sun, Feb 3, 2013 at 11:07 AM, TheWanderingWench > > wrote: > > You CAN get a Light Sport license in a single seat registered LSA. > I did, in my single seat Drifter. Your LS license will have a > single seat limitation - that you cannot fly a two-seat as PIC, > nor take a passenger. If you later want to "upgrade" your license > to fly a two-seat LSA, you'll have to start at the beginning and > go through the entire testing process again. > > Arty Trost > Sandy, Oregon > > www.LessonsFromTheEdge.com/uladventure2009.htm > <http://www.LessonsFromTheEdge.com/uladventure2009.htm> > > ** > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Light Sport License
Date: Feb 03, 2013
I am just hoping to influence the instructor...:-) Herb Herb/Kolbers: Can't log airplane flight time in an ultralight vehicle. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Pat Ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Light Sport License
Date: Feb 04, 2013
Can't log airplane flight time in an ultralight vehicle.>> Not sure about that over here, John. We can, or could when I was working on it, get an allowance against the ultralight license for gliding time. Pat ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Light Sport License
From: "Thom Riddle" <riddletr(at)gmail.com>
Date: Feb 04, 2013
Herb, Note that the Slingshot does not have dual controls. The back seat is only a seat, nothing else. Will an instructor instruct from the back seat without controls? Highly unlikely, in my opinion. When I was instructing I would never consider it. -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY (9G0) Kolb Slingshot SS-021 no engine FOR SALE Diamond Katana DA20-A1 Rotax 912 F3 Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long. - Anonymous Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393590#393590 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Light Sport License
From: "Thom Riddle" <riddletr(at)gmail.com>
Date: Feb 04, 2013
Pat, In the UK Ultralights and Microlights are considered aircraft. In the US, contrary to common sense, the FAA calls things that fly and meet their Part 103 limitations(Single seat, 5 gal max fuel, 254 lbs max empty wt., max speed 63 mph, -------- Thom Riddle Buffalo, NY (9G0) Kolb Slingshot SS-021 no engine FOR SALE Diamond Katana DA20-A1 Rotax 912 F3 Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long. - Anonymous Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393591#393591 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 04, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Light Sport License
Yep. Aware of that.. My sport pilot training will likely be in a champ. Herb On 02/04/2013 11:27 AM, Thom Riddle wrote: > > Herb, > Note that the Slingshot does not have dual controls. The back seat is only a seat, nothing else. Will an instructor instruct from the back seat without controls? Highly unlikely, in my opinion. When I was instructing I would never consider it. > > -------- > Thom Riddle > Buffalo, NY (9G0) > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 04, 2013
Subject: Re: Light Sport License
From: Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
Pat, FAR 61.52 says in a lot of words that the use of ultralight experience for higher ratings expired on Jan. 31, 2012. Rick Girard On Mon, Feb 4, 2013 at 3:47 AM, Pat Ladd wrote: > ** > > Can't log airplane flight time in an ultralight vehicle.>> > > > Not sure about that over here, John. We can, or could when I was working > on it, get an allowance against the ultralight license for gliding time. > > > Pat > > * > > * > > -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 04, 2013
Subject: First flying day of the year
From: Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com>
The cold grip of winter here in the West has finally loosed. Today the temps soared to a dizzying 61 degrees, with no wind even. It was just too much for a mere mortal to resist. I rolled the Firestar out of the hanger for the first time since Oct, The runway was firm enough to use without damaging it with the tail wheel, so there was nothing to stop me. Every thing checked out and the sky was waiting. My landings were actually pretty good for a change. I did about 12 touch and go's before I decided that if the engine was going to quit, it should have already done so. I left the field and flew over to the ranch next door looking for Coyotes. I only forgot one thing- my chewing gum. I apparently habitually fly with my mouth hanging open and after an hour and half, I finally had to land to get rid of the terminal dry mouth. Hope that good weather comes to a location near you soon. Larry -- *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.* ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
From: "Jimmy Young" <jdy100(at)comcast.net>
Date: Feb 07, 2013
Kolbers, FYI, Dean called me and said the Slingshot has been sold. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393830#393830 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 07, 2013
From: Herb Gayheart <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
Ole Herb bought it...gonna trailer it home.... soon as I get my sailplane trailer fully converted.. Should have that done tomorrow.... Dean offered to fly it to my local airport,,,but he does not like to fly the 582 unless he gets 130 or above water temps...I noticed that he had some of the radiator covered....anyone have experience with this situation? I do not recall flying the MkIII in cold weather? I will have it in my possession by week end...weather permitting... Needs a good cleaning but otherwise...the 2 part stitts paint looks shiny as new...no signs of cracking... one of the dual puck Matco brakes is a bit spongy.... a few personal touches and good to go....Engine starts on first pull...but will be looking for a used starter and ring gear... Herb At 07:09 PM 2/7/2013, you wrote: > >Kolbers, > >FYI, Dean called me and said the Slingshot has been sold. > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393830#393830 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ted Cowan" <tc1917(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: sling shot
Date: Feb 08, 2013
I flew hundreds of hours in my sling shot with a 582. powered it just fine. had to cover the rad with tape according to the temps out side. sometimes only one strip, sometimes four. had the oil injection and liked it. put the 912 on and wow, zoom zoom. gonna pay for the engine just in gas and oil savings. Ted Cowan, slingshot 912UL zoom zoom ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ted Cowan" <tc1917(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: sling shot
Date: Feb 08, 2013
by the way, is the engine lifted up in the rear 5/8 " to 7/8"? if it is not and you want to fly better, email me off list. ted cowan ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "b young" <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
Date: Feb 08, 2013
I have flown my mkiii 912 in cold weather.... I have to completely cover the oil cooler both sides with aluminum backed tape. and cover around half of the radiator. in order to keep the temps up where they should be.... boyd Ole Herb bought it...gonna trailer it home.... soon as I get my sailplane trailer fully converted.. Should have that done tomorrow.... Dean offered to fly it to my local airport,,,but he does not like to fly the 582 unless he gets 130 or above water temps...I noticed that he had some of the radiator covered....anyone have experience with this situation? I do not recall flying the MkIII in cold weather? Herb ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
From: "Ralph B" <rstar447(at)gmail.com>
Date: Feb 08, 2013
rickofudall wrote: > Anyone can work on an E-AB, and charge money for it, for that matter. What they cannot do is write anything in the engine or aircraft log books, anything of a legal nature anyway. The last caveat about maintaining the value of the aircraft is what having an A & P supervise the engine over haul was meant to convey, so no, no requirement unless you want a logbook entry to go with the work. > > Rick > A buyer can do the work on an E-AB and log it as long as the original builder has the repairmans cert and signs it in the logs. I called the FAA about this before buying the Kolbra. Mark German is the original builder and he signs my logbook after I do the condition inspection every year. Ralph B -------- Ralph B Original Firestar 447 N91493 E-AB 1000+ hours 25 years flying it Kolbra 912 N20386 200 hours Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393858#393858 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 08, 2013
From: GARY JINDRA <gajindra(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: sling shot
Ted,I'm in the process of switching from a 582 to a 912UL 80 hp. on my mark =0A3.What kind of fuel saving did you see per hour-=0A-=0AGary Jindra =0AMark 3=0A117 hours=0A=0A=0A-From: Ted Cowan <tc1917(at)bellsouth.net>=0AT o: kolb-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Fri, February 8, 2013 6:36:24 AM=0ASubje wan" =0A=0AI flew hundreds of hours in my sling shot with a 582.- powered it just fine. had =0Ato cover the rad with tape acco rding to the temps out side.=0Asometimes only one strip, sometimes four.- had the oil injection and liked it.- =0Aput the 912 on and wow, zoom zoo m.- gonna pay for the=0Aengine just in gas and oil savings.- Ted Cowan, ======================= ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "The Kuffels" <kuffel(at)cyberport.net>
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
Date: Feb 08, 2013
<< A buyer can do the work on an E-AB and log it as long as the original builder has the repairmans cert >> According to EAA and my reading of the rules, anyone can work on an EAB and log what they did. The only requirement on logbook maintenance entries is within the last 12 months there must be a condition inspection signed by either the original builder with a repairman's certificate for that aircraft or an A&P (no IA needed). Of course, if the work constitutes a "major alteration" it should be logged by whoever did the work along with the FSDO testing requirements and completion of those requirements. But what is a "major alteration" is an entirely different issue. Tom Kuffel ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
Date: Feb 08, 2013
I have flown my mkiii 912 in cold weather.... I have to completely cover the oil cooler both sides with aluminum backed tape. and cover around half of the radiator. in order to keep the temps up where they should be.... boyd When I was flying the mkIII with 80 hp 912, I by-passed the oil cooler during the winter. Don't have that problem with the 100 hp 912. The higher compression engine generates much more heat than the 80 hp. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: sling shot
Date: Feb 08, 2013
Ted,I'm in the process of switching from a 582 to a 912UL 80 hp. on my mark 3.What kind of fuel saving did you see per hour Gary Jindra I'm not Ted, but will share my fuel burn info with you all. MKIII 582 - 5.5 gph at 5800 rpm cruise 912UL - 4.0 gph at 5000 rpm cruise. 912ULS - 5.0 gph at 5000 cruise. All three engines pushed the mkIII at 80 mph at cruise rpm. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 08, 2013
From: GARY JINDRA <gajindra(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: sling shot
Thanks John,the nunbers sound about what I expected.Hope to see 80 mph with 912 =0Abecause I've never got that with my 582 except with a good tailwind =0A-=0AGary Jindra=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: John Hauck =0ATo: kolb-list(at)matronics.com=0ASent: Fr i, February 8, 2013 4:29:35 PM=0ASubject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: sling shot=0A =0A=0A-=0ATed,I'm in the process of switching from a 582 to a 912UL 80 hp . on my mark =0A3.What kind of fuel saving did you see per hour-=0A-=0A Gary Jindra =0A -=0A -=0AI'm not Ted, but will share my fuel burn info with you all.=0A -=0AMKIII 582 -- 5.5 gph at 5800 rpm cruise=0A -=0A --------- 912UL - 4.0 gph at 5000 rpm cruise.=0A -=0A --------- 912ULS - 5.0 gph at 5000 cruise.=0A -=0AAll t hree engines pushed the mkIII at 80 mph at cruise rpm.=0A -=0Ajohn h=0Amk ====================== =0A ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
From: "Ralph B" <rstar447(at)gmail.com>
Date: Feb 08, 2013
kuffel(at)cyberport.net > > Of course, if the work constitutes a "major alteration" it should be logged by whoever did the work along with the FSDO testing requirements and completion of those requirements. But what is a "major alteration" is an entirely different issue. > > Tom Kuffel I replaced the Kolbra engine, prop, and avionics after they were stolen and this was considered a "major alteration". The FAA came out and inspected and assigned a new test area to fly off 10 hours. This was done last spring it's been flying ever since. Since I fly during the winter months, I tape off the front side of the radiator and both sides of the oil cooler when the OAT is below freezing. By doing this, the CHT's remain under 200 deg. As the weather starts warming, I will have to remove some tape to maintain normal CHT's. Ralph B -------- Ralph B Original Firestar 447 N91493 E-AB 1000+ hours 26 years flying it Kolbra 912ULS N20386 200 hours Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393894#393894 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ted Cowan" <tc1917(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: slingshot
Date: Feb 09, 2013
thought I might reply on line to a couple of questions. Firstly; with the 582 at normal cruise, forget the rpm, around 70 mph, I would get somewhere about 5 gph burn and 6 gph at around 78 mph. More than that if I were packed for camping. Had to tape the rad at cooler temps. The 912 gets me a solid 3 gph burn up to about 4700 rpm, around 75 mph. I now push it harder at 5200 rpm and 95 mph and get around 4 gph burn. In rough air 90s are somewhat bumpy and touchy on the controls but got a tail wind coming back from Thomasville last year and was clocking 126 over the ground. That was nice, dry, cool and smooth. THAT is why I love the 912. I found out I was actually running it too slow. Supposed to run it up to the 5000s for best performance. Actually runs cooler now too. By the way, since Miss Lite changed the gears in my gear box, there is a lot less noise and at the higher rpm, it is quieter and smoother also. Just thought I would throw that in. Have a great day. Looking for warmer weather soon. Ted Cowan, Slingshot, 912 ul, zoom zoom. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 09, 2013
From: ed hase <ehase(at)charter.net>
Subject: For Sale
I have been a subscriber to this list since I bought a Kolb in pieces three years ago. I now have changed the direction I am going and wish to sell the Kolb parts that I have. I have a single seat Firestar without a cage or motor (wings, tale tube and tail plane and control stick is there). It was a wreck in the rebuild process when I acquired it. I was going to finish it and replace my quicksilver with it as it is a more capable airplane, but have ran in to a deal on a two seat Hornet and am going that route. If intrusted contact me and I can send photos. ehase(at)charter.net 314-681-7050 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rodney Payne" <Rpayne4(at)stny.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
Date: Feb 09, 2013
Another way to go for you guys with Mark 3s. Take a look at Rotax Ricks 670 engine. I traded in my 582 for one and put it on my Xtra. It puts out 89hp and gets about 1 gph better fuel burn. Basically performs like a 912 on a 582 budget. This is my first yr with it so not alot of time but I put 60 hrs on it this yr and it was flawless. Make the 2 place alot more fun to fly when you have the extra power. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Kolb Slingshot
Date: Feb 09, 2013
Another way to go for you guys with Mark 3s. Take a look at Rotax Ricks 670 engine. I traded in my 582 for one and put it on my Xtra. It puts out 89hp and gets about 1 gph better fuel burn. Basically performs like a 912 on a 582 budget. This is my first yr with it so not alot of time but I put 60 hrs on it this yr and it was flawless. Make the 2 place alot more fun to fly when you have the extra power. Hopefully, your 670 will prove to be as reliable as a 912 series engine. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 09, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
On 02/09/2013 08:29 AM, Rodney Payne wrote: > Another way to go for you guys with Mark 3s. Take a look at Rotax > Ricks 670 engine. I traded in my 582 for one and put it on my Xtra. It > puts out 89hp and gets about 1 gph better fuel burn. Basically > performs like a 912 on a 582 budget. This is my first yr with it so > not alot of time but I put 60 hrs on it this yr and it was flawless. > Make the 2 place alot more fun to fly when you have the extra power. > Good looking bird.... wondering why the fuel burn is less than the 582? fuel Injection...running at lower rpm's? Herb ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Kolb Slingshot
Date: Feb 09, 2013
wondering why the fuel burn is less than the 582? fuel Injection...running at lower rpm's? Herb Fuel burn from one aircraft/engine/pilot to another is not consistent and comparisons are not accurate. For my own personal use, I have found that the only way to get accurate fuel burn is during long cross country flights where the throttle is set at cruise rpm and left there. The flight should be started with a full tank and topped off on landing. I get great fuel burn when I am flying local and playing around the airport. A lot of people figure their fuel burn on this type flying. Then, during their first serious cross country flight, they are shocked that there engine is burning so much fuel. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 09, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: 582 vs 670 fuel burn
* I was thinking about the 582 vs 670 fuel burn in the same airframe...? If I understood correctly...the 670 puts out 89 hp and burns less fuel...Herb * * * Fuel burn from one aircraft/engine/pilot to another is not consistent and comparisons are not accurate. For my own personal use, I have found that the only way to get accurate fuel burn is during long cross country flights where the throttle is set at cruise rpm and left there. The flight should be started with a full tank and topped off on landing. I get great fuel burn when I am flying local and playing around the airport. A lot of people figure their fuel burn on this type flying. Then, during their first serious cross country flight, they are shocked that there engine is burning so much fuel. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama * * > * > * ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Feb 09, 2013
>From what I have been told, the Rotax Rick uses alot of the same parts as a 582 but also has RAVE valves. The max RPM is 7000 and this is where the extra HP comes from. You basically send him your 582 when it needs a rebuild and he turns it into a Rotax Rick 670. What he is doing is common on snowmobiles so he is really just applying it for out use. I have thought of doing it on my PPC with a 582 but would like to transition to a fixed wing 912 Kolb eventually. I will search another forum where Rick put out some good info. -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393916#393916 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Feb 09, 2013
>From Rotax Rick, > Just so everyone knows a 618 with a 582 exhaust makes only 65 hp. The above 670 was using a 582 exhaust & made 75 hp. The 618 that I sent had no 618 exhaust with it. ( They were impossible to find, that is why I now build 4 different styles of that exhaust myself ) My current exhaust will fit the 618 above and give it the 75 hp it can produce. Here is how it works, send me your runout 582 ( or what evrer condition it's in) The O/H cost is $1650 Add $1500 to that and instead I send you a 670 back. I use your head, carburetors , Ducati Dual ignition & RV shaft. I install the BH ceramic water pump seal,Redo the 670 crank with $480 in parts,new spark plugs,wires boots, Jet the carbs,new carb boots, surface the cylinders & head,make a new coil mount plate,install your RV bottle, your starter and gearbox, The C/E gearbox flywheel is machined to fit the 670 crank. I can do the clutch as well. new pistons ,all new seals & gaskets, open the crank oil feed holes, ETC. The 582 prop will work, You will get 700 rpm more. The 670 redline is 7000 rpm, the same Rotax put on the 618,So just 1 to 2 deg's is fine,EP Dalton runs one now. He use to get 6400 rpm on takeoff, Now he gets 7100 rpm. Doing his 1 hour ride using the same rpm's as the 582 ran he burns 3.5 GPH instead of 5 GPH He runs it at 5600 rpm with floats on a Quicksilver Sprint and he's 235 lbs. > > I did forget to bring up one very important thing, Why did the 670 fail in aircraft years ago ??? They would buy the 93/94 engine, put a 100 hp pipe on it and run it like it came, When I did my first 670 crankshaft I found the reason, The 93/94 670's used the exact same bearing as the early 582's, the 583 snowmobile and the 580 Sea Doo,. That bearing failed in the 582 aircraft engines and failed in the 580 Sea Doo, The 583 did not have the problem because there so fast you can run them wide open for a long time. Rotax put a bigger bearing in the 95 aircraft modle, (and that is still the cause of every 2 out 3 582 engine failures) The aftermark guys double slotted the Sea Doo rods to get more oil to the bearing and that worked. Thats why I say all 582,618's and 670 engines need 40 to 1 oil ratio. Those bearings will fail sooner or latter without it. Here is what I do that makes the 670 work now, In the 98 /99 year high output models ( 132 HP ) they increased the top and bottom eye's and used the same size crank pin & wrist pin, they filled the gap with much larger roller bearings . These are the rods we now use since Jan 2010 and we use double slotted rods to get more oil to the bearing. > Call me for more help & info . I will tell you what to do if you want to build your own. I want to keep things safe and not rune the 670 name, It is the very best 2 cycle engine out there. (239) 572- -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=393917#393917 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: 582 vs 670 fuel burn
Date: Feb 09, 2013
I was thinking about the 582 vs 670 fuel burn in the same airframe...? If I understood correctly...the 670 puts out 89 hp and burns less fuel...Herb I understand that. However, how we get our fuel burn figures have to be consistent or that aren't any good. That's why I shared the illustration about flying around the patch vs cross country. It takes fuel to make power. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama - It's 52F, sun is shining, and I am going to drag Gantt IAP to get the cow crap spread out to dry while I get the mkIII ready to fly to 08A and the EAA Chap 822 monthly meeting. Doesn't look like there is any wind blowing today. I think I can handle that. ;-) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: kinne russ <russk50(at)gmail.com>
Subject: q
Date: Feb 17, 2013
Matt Haven't had any posts on the Kolb-list for a week! -- something wrong? I need these! Thanx Russ K ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 17, 2013
Subject: That old bugaboo, liability
From: Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
I am fortunate to live in an aviation community. A 2500' grass runway abuts my back yard. For this and the five acres that allows me to feed wild birds and enjoy nature (even the coyotes except when they take one of my guineas or chickens) I am very grateful. So you can probably understand I am not at all happy when some idiot uses our runway in a completely stupid manner. I am also the home owner association president so I have the interests and property values or my neighbors in mind, too. We carry a $1M liability policy for which all of us pay an assessment each year, but with the damage caused by Katrina, Sandy, et al, the possibility of loosing that policy or having the premium raised to a level that is not reasonable should someone make a claim against it, has caused me more than one sleepless night since two incidents happened in the last year. One, where a new property owner was allowing his and his friends children to play on the runway while the friend was trying to teach himself to fly ( I couldn't make this stuff up, cross my heart, it happened) and two, where same owner brings his "instructor and mechanic" to fly the plane. He proceeds to ignore the pattern direction arrows and FAR 91.119 and fly at tree top level over the homes and hangars of many of the members of our HOA until the engine seized and he was barely able to make a crash landing going ACROSS the runway. When questioned by a couple of the members the "instructor" refused to either identify himself or account for his actions. He was actually surly about it until it was explained that he could tone down his attitude or he could talk with a county sherrif deputy. In those sleepless nights I pondered what amendments to the HOA bylaws would allow us to weed out the idiots and whatever other measures we could use to protect ourselves. This last Thursday an article on the ANN "Propwash" newsletter told of the legislature of the State of Arkansas had just past an amendment to their recreational land use act to specifically include aviation. I was immediately interested and went looking on the web for information about similar statutes in Kansas. I found this site. http://theraf.org/sites/default/files/raf_files_videos/recreational_use_statutes_50_state_discussion.pdf Seeing that Kansas statute is of the "including, but not limited to the following" listing of recreational activities I contacted both my legislators to ask that the statutes be amended to specifically include aviation in that list. "Dear Sirs, I request that language be added to Kansas State Statute K.S.A. 58-3201 to 58-3207 to exempt private airports from liability when such airports are open to the general public as defined in the legislation. Small, privately owned airports receive no public funding yet they are a vital resource to Kansas. In times of disaster emergencies or environmental accidents such airports may be the only link for relief, medical care, and evacuation. As such I believe that they should be entitled to specific relief from liability. I would appreciate any effort you are able to give to make this change to our state's Recreational Land Use Act." To my surprise and delight, both my representative and senator responded with a personal note, not just a form letter of the "thank you for contacting me" genre, promising to look into it and address the issue when the legislature returns to session. On Friday I brought the issue to the attention of my EAA chapter and got some more information from other members who live in airport communities. My plans at this point are to A) use my list of chapter newsletter editors to spread the news and ask for more effort from across the state to get the statute amended and B) put up a Facebook page to solicit support and spread the news nationwide (only 16 states specifically mention aviation or aviation sports in the RLUA's) Guys, I urge you all to look up the link and see if your state is one of the 16 or one of the 34. If your state is in the latter group, write to your representatives and get the ball rolling. Okay, Russ, I've given us something that, while it isn't specifically Kolb related, it certainly directly affects Kolb owners and flyers. Hey, it's winter and I'm flying the trike right now (3 flights in January and 1 in February so far) while I plan the repairs of Zulu Delta. Fly Safe, Rick -- Zulu Delta Mk IIIC Thanks, Homer GBYM It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy. - Groucho Marx ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: That old bugaboo, liability
From: "Dennis Thate" <retroman(at)frontier.com>
Date: Feb 17, 2013
http://theraf.org/ -------- Both optimists and pessimists contribute to our society. The optimist invents the airplane and the pessimist the parachute. ~Gil Stern Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394459#394459 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 17, 2013
From: chris davis <capedavis(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 377
-Kolbers , just wondering if you gent thought a 377 without a fan would b e ok on a Kolb or if it was ridiculous to try ?=0A=0AChris Davis=0AKXP 503 492 hrs=0AGlider Pilot=0ADisabled from crash building Firefly ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: 377
Date: Feb 17, 2013
Kolbers , just wondering if you gent thought a 377 without a fan would be ok on a Kolb or if it was ridiculous to try ? Chris Davis Chris D/Kolbers Don't think you could cool it. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 17, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Kolb Slingshot
Kolb Slingshot sn005 is home and safely covered and in the barn... John; it was in Wetumpka at one time...maybe second owner...remember it? Herb ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Kolb Slingshot
Date: Feb 17, 2013
John; it was in Wetumpka at one time...maybe second owner...remember it? Herb Yes, the SS was owned by a friend of mine. Powered with a 582. I flew the SS. Next time I saw it, after it left Wetumpka, was at a Kolb Homecoming several years ago. john h mkIII Titus, Alabama ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 17, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Slingshot
I think the guy that I bought it from flew it to the home coming... It has been passed around...but I do not see that it has been damaged . Nor do I see poor construction... 4 or 5 owners in 15 years... not a good sign sometimes...but I surely do not see any flaws... Herb On 02/17/2013 07:20 PM, John Hauck wrote: > > > > > John; it was in Wetumpka at one time...maybe second owner...remember > it? Herb > > > > Yes, the SS was owned by a friend of mine. Powered with a 582. I flew the > SS. > > Next time I saw it, after it left Wetumpka, was at a Kolb Homecoming several > years ago. > > john h > mkIII > Titus, Alabama > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Kolb Mark III or Cessna Operating Costs
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Feb 17, 2013
Hi everyone, Sorry in advance if you do not like the topic, but I am sure others who decided to buy/build a Kolb looked into GA aircraft before making the decision. I have a local Dr. who is selling his Cessna 152 for 14K. He says operating costs are around the $42/hour range. It just had a rebuild 28 hours ago. I am pricing Mark III's and most are in the 20K-30K with a 912. I see some immediate benefits of both. Kolb needs no hangar fees, only a trailer. Kolb can take regular gas Kolb has better performance/climb Kolb has no medical requirement, but I can easily get a medical at age 33 Kolb has less annual costs Cessna is cheaper to start with AV gas is higher Annuals are higher Needs hangar Flies faster/farther Anything I am missing here? What are others operating cost per hour? Thanks, Wes -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394470#394470 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 17, 2013
From: Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb Mark III or Cessna Operating Costs
On 02/17/2013 08:52 PM, alienwes wrote: > > Hi everyone, > > Sorry in advance if you do not like the topic, but I am sure others who decided to buy/build a Kolb looked into GA aircraft before making the decision. I have a local Dr. who is selling his Cessna 152 for 14K. He says operating costs are around the $42/hour range. It just had a rebuild 28 hours ago. I am pricing Mark III's and most are in the 20K-30K with a 912. I see some immediate benefits of both. > > Kolb needs no hangar fees, only a trailer. > Kolb can take regular gas > Kolb has better performance/climb > Kolb has no medical requirement, but I can easily get a medical at age 33 > Kolb has less annual costs > > Cessna is cheaper to start with > AV gas is higher > Annuals are higher > Needs hangar > Flies faster/farther > > Anything I am missing here? > What are others operating cost per hour? > > Thanks, > > Wes > > -------- > Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC You really need to define your 'mission'. The Cessna could be moderately useful for travel, even for 2 (small) people. But probably a lot less fun than the Kolb. You can purchase an auto fuel STC for it, assuming you can find alcohol free mogas in your area. But it will almost certainly burn more of it. Medicals have gotten expensive where I live, even if you have no trouble passing them. You don't really *need* a hangar for a Cessna; it just keeps it in better shape. Annuals can be really cheap if nothing's wrong & the IA will let you do all the work, but if he isn't accommodating, they can be really expensive. Also, there's the ever present threat of AD's. Any time the ownership of a particular product on the plane (carb, mags, engine parts, Anything) changes hands, there will be an $AD$ on that product. Count on it. A friend purchased an old 150 that had been out of annual for several years. He paid something like 8-9 thousand for the plane, with a ferry permit to get it home. The 1st annual (before he could fly it again) included rebuilding a twisted wing & cost more than the plane. Only anecdotal, but it's not that unusual with older planes. How familiar are you with the history of each plane? Charlie (Cessna's are only fun until you fly something better....) :-) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 17, 2013
From: GARY JINDRA <gajindra(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Kolb Mark III or Cessna Operating Costs
Wes,you didn't say if you have your pilots license or not.Cessna's take G.A . =0Acertificate,Kolbs Sport pilot certificate.G.A.takes 40 hours,Sport tak es =0A20.National average for GA is close to 70hours.Sport is closer to 30 to 35.Makes =0Aa big difference in cost to start flying.=0A-=0AGary Jindr a=0AMark 3 117 hrs.=0A=0ASport Pilot=0A=0A=0A______________________________ __=0AFrom: alienwes <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>=0ATo: kolb-list(at)matronics.co m=0ASent: Sun, February 17, 2013 9:52:52 PM=0ASubject: Kolb-List: Kolb Mark wes" =0A=0AHi everyone,=0A=0ASorry in advance if you do not like the topic, but I am sure others who decided =0Ato buy/build a Kolb looked into GA aircraft before making the decision. I have a =0Aloc al Dr. who is selling his Cessna 152 for 14K. He says operating costs are =0Aaround the $42/hour range. It just had a rebuild 28 hours ago. I am pric ing Mark =0AIII's and most are in the 20K-30K with a 912. I see some immedi ate benefits of =0Aboth.=0A=0AKolb needs no hangar fees, only a trailer.=0A Kolb can take regular gas=0AKolb has better performance/climb=0AKolb has no medical requirement, but I can easily get a medical at age 33=0AKolb has l ess annual costs=0A=0ACessna is cheaper to start with=0AAV gas is higher=0A Annuals are higher=0ANeeds hangar=0AFlies faster/farther=0A=0AAnything I am missing here?=0AWhat are others operating cost per hour?=0A=0AThanks,=0A =0AWes=0A=0A--------=0AWesley Elliott=0ASport Pilot-PPC=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p= ======================= ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 18, 2013
From: Dana Hague <d-m-hague(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Kolb Mark III or Cessna Operating Costs
You can do all the maintenance on a Kolb yourself; you only need an A&P for the annual. The Cessna needs an A&P signoff for all maintenance other than a short list of simple preventative maintenance. A Kolb will eventually need a fabric recover job, the Cessna won't. At 14K the Cessna sounds like a great deal if it's in good shape. With a Kolb you're part of a great community, both Kolb guys and the larger experimental community. With a Cessna... well... it's just a Cessna... But most important: the Kolb will be a lot more FUN! -Dana At 09:52 PM 2/17/2013, alienwes wrote: > >Hi everyone, > >Sorry in advance if you do not like the topic, but I am sure others who >decided to buy/build a Kolb looked into GA aircraft before making the >decision. I have a local Dr. who is selling his Cessna 152 for 14K. He >says operating costs are around the $42/hour range. It just had a rebuild >28 hours ago. I am pricing Mark III's and most are in the 20K-30K with a >912. I see some immediate benefits of both. > >Kolb needs no hangar fees, only a trailer. >Kolb can take regular gas >Kolb has better performance/climb >Kolb has no medical requirement, but I can easily get a medical at age 33 >Kolb has less annual costs > >Cessna is cheaper to start with >AV gas is higher >Annuals are higher >Needs hangar >Flies faster/farther > >Anything I am missing here? >What are others operating cost per hour? > >Thanks, > >Wes > >-------- >Wesley Elliott >Sport Pilot-PPC > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394470#394470 > > -- If vegetarians eat vegetables... beware of humanitarians! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dan Walter" <worrybear(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Kolb Mark III or Cessna Operating Costs
Date: Feb 18, 2013
Wes, I was in the same boat, Wanted another Kolb bad but also wanted a 4 cycle. Could not afford anything with a 912, Jabiru or HKS. Ended up buying a nice Ercoupe, love the plane but repairs and annuals are difficult and expensive. And no short field capabilities. My next plane will be Experimental. Dan Walter ----- Original Message ----- From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Sunday, February 17, 2013 9:52 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb Mark III or Cessna Operating Costs > > Hi everyone, > > Sorry in advance if you do not like the topic, but I am sure others who > decided to buy/build a Kolb looked into GA aircraft before making the > decision. I have a local Dr. who is selling his Cessna 152 for 14K. He > says operating costs are around the $42/hour range. It just had a rebuild > 28 hours ago. I am pricing Mark III's and most are in the 20K-30K with a > 912. I see some immediate benefits of both. > > Kolb needs no hangar fees, only a trailer. > Kolb can take regular gas > Kolb has better performance/climb > Kolb has no medical requirement, but I can easily get a medical at age 33 > Kolb has less annual costs > > Cessna is cheaper to start with > AV gas is higher > Annuals are higher > Needs hangar > Flies faster/farther > > Anything I am missing here? > What are others operating cost per hour? > > Thanks, > > Wes > > -------- > Wesley Elliott > Sport Pilot-PPC > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394470#394470 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Mark III or Cessna Operating Costs
From: kinne russ <russk50(at)gmail.com>
Date: Feb 18, 2013
Alien , I have to question the cost of operating a 150 for 'about $42/hour'. Really don't see how it can be that low, esp. if he carefully includes everything. Like adding a buck or two towards the eventual overhaul. And does he include the cost of his own physicals? I had a 170 for 20 years and kept careful records. Just can't see that 42/hour unless he flies 300-400 hrs a year. But congrats to him if he can fly that cheaply. Russ K On Feb 17, 2013, at 9:52 PM, alienwes wrote: > > Hi everyone, > > Sorry in advance if you do not like the topic, but I am sure others who decided to buy/build a Kolb looked into GA aircraft before making the decision. I have a local Dr. who is selling his Cessna 152 for 14K. He says operating costs are around the $42/hour range. It just had a rebuild 28 hours ago. I am pricing Mark III's and most are in the 20K-30K with a 912. I see some immediate benefits of both. > > Kolb needs no hangar fees, only a trailer. > Kolb can take regular gas > Kolb has better performance/climb > Kolb has no medical requirement, but I can easily get a medical at age 33 > Kolb has less annual costs > > Cessna is cheaper to start with > AV gas is higher > Annuals are higher > Needs hangar > Flies faster/farther > > Anything I am missing here? > What are others operating cost per hour? > > Thanks, > > Wes > > -------- > Wesley Elliott > Sport Pilot-PPC > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394470#394470 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Looking for pilots in the Ft. Lauderdale area
From: "gotime242" <dylanshine(at)gmail.com>
Date: Feb 18, 2013
Ultralights are few and far between in the Ft Lauderdale area, as we as even just open ultralight-type experimentals. Id say the best bet is to venture north up to lantana or F45, or south into some of the outer airports in Miami. I know at lantana there are a couple challenger experimentals, but not much... I also think there was a guy giving rides out between Labelle / Clewiston...around the hang glider activity. Maybe give them a call to see what is possible. http://www.thefloridaridge.com/pages/pilot.php Good luck! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394485#394485 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Kolb Mark III or Cessna Operating Costs
From: "alienwes" <elliott.wesley(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Feb 18, 2013
Thanks everyone for your insight. To answer the question on my pilots license, I already have my Sport Pilot, but need a fixed wing endorsement as its only for PPC right now. That reduces the cost for the Kolb. I am assuming this Dr. just threw out a number for operating costs for the Cessna that he was told. Do not think he really considered all the facts. I do like being part of a community, which the Kolb seems to have much more than the Cessna. Just like the community of PPC pilots I enjoy knowing. Thanks again for everyones input. -------- Wesley Elliott Sport Pilot-PPC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394517#394517 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steve Simmons" <stevesimmons(at)charter.net>
Subject: Cessna 150 For sale
Date: Feb 18, 2013
I have a nice Cessna 150 for sale Completely rebuilt with only 7 hours on a major overhaul new paint and interior. Call me or e-mail if anyone is interested. Still have my Mark III C for sale. Stevesimmons(at)charter.net or 423 748-4336 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 377
From: "wakataka" <wakataka(at)charter.net>
Date: Feb 18, 2013
One of the advantages of fan cooled engines is that the cylinder temps stay more uniform. A free air engine cools down a lot more than a fan cooled engine while at low throttle on approach. When you throttle down a fan cooled engine, the fan slows down and the airflow across the cylinders decreases, so the engine stays warmer longer. This is particularly important if you are doing touch and go type flying. Cold seizures can occur when you got to full throttle after a long approach. The aluminum piston heats up faster than the steel cylinder, expands, and smears itself all over the cylinder walls. So even if you could get the CHT to be within spec at full throttle, there is still a good reason to stick with fan cooling. -------- There is something fascinating about science. One gets such wholesale returns of conjecture out of such a trifling investment of fact. Mark Twain Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394541#394541 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 18, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Re: 377
Wouldn't it be a good idea to block the air flow across the cylinders on descent? Some sort of venetian blind type of contraption? Also , rather than taping the radiator...a venetian blind mechanism with 0 to 100% blockage on the radiator of the 582 and 618 seems appropriate.. Herb On 02/18/2013 09:46 PM, wakataka wrote: > > One of the advantages of fan cooled engines is that the cylinder temps stay more uniform. A free air engine cools down a lot more than a fan cooled engine while at low throttle on approach. When you throttle down a fan cooled engine, the fan slows down and the airflow across the cylinders decreases, so the engine stays warmer longer. This is particularly important if you are doing touch and go type flying. Cold seizures can occur when you got to full throttle after a long approach. The aluminum piston heats up faster than the steel cylinder, expands, and smears itself all over the cylinder walls. So even if you could get the CHT to be within spec at full throttle, there is still a good reason to stick with fan cooling. > > -------- > There is something fascinating about science. One gets such wholesale returns of conjecture out of such a trifling investment of fact. > > Mark Twain > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394541#394541 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 377
From: "wakataka" <wakataka(at)charter.net>
Date: Feb 18, 2013
After two cold seizures, I tried to build something like that for my free air 277, but the vibration from that little beast kept tearing apart whatever design I came up with. I finally solved the problem by having the cylinder honed out about 0.003 larger than factory spec and running a main jet 2 steps richer than spec. I'm also very careful not to go to full throttle immediately after a long descent at idle. On a touch and go, I'll usually take off with about 3/4 throttle and wait until the CHT gets up to 250 before going to full throttle. -------- There is something fascinating about science. One gets such wholesale returns of conjecture out of such a trifling investment of fact. Mark Twain Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=394547#394547 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Feb 19, 2013
From: herb <herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Subject: Cooling and warming our Rotax engines:-)
I was always amazed that the 277 used almost fuel as my 447... On a Kitten, then 277 had to run very hard most of the time..while my 447 could cruise the Firefly very nicely between 5200 and 5600...

January 05, 2013 - February 19, 2013

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