Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-nk
March 10, 2015 - April 28, 2015
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Headset Modification |
Larry,
I fly an RV-4 using a QT Halo earplug style headset, and it is quite a
bit quieter than the old Lightspeed 15's (active noise cancelling) I
used to use. The Halo actually has the speaker elements mounted on the
headband, with small tubing connecting to the ear plugs. I would have
thought that the Clarity Aloft would be even quieter. Are you sure you
had a good seal between the ear plugs and your ear canal? If they don't
seal up completely just like regular noise blocking ear plugs, then they
won't block external sound very well at all.
I've flown with earplug style in-ear phones (Sony in-ear monitors
designed for musicians) under Lightspeed active noise cancelling
headsets, and it is a bit quieter with a noise cancelling headset on
top, but at the expense of wearing the headset. One of the things I love
about the Halo is that I don't have the weight/heat of the bulky headset
on my head.
I've never tried any type of in-ear active noise cancelling headset, but
if you could rig one with a mic, that sounds like the ultimate solution
for those of us who can tolerate 'earplugs' in our ear canals.
For those who have never used any of this stuff:
There's a huge difference between 'earbuds' like what came with your
iphone and earplug style systems like the Halo and Clarity Aloft.
Regular earbuds do not seal to the ear canal, so they don't really block
much sound at all. All regular earbuds will get you is louder sound (and
quicker hearing loss).
Charlie
On 3/9/2015 9:28 PM, Larry Cottrell wrote:
> What a great idea. Kind of makes one wonder why they didn't think of
> it themselves. I bought the ear bud type of headset from Quality aloft
> or some such thing, and it works great. The only problem is that the
> noise still comes in through the head bones or what ever, and though
> you can hear whats being said and or music through the set, the noise
> is still there, and what you end up with is still a lot of ambient
> noise. The ear buds is just louder than the engine noise. I had been
> considering using either my regular headset or a set of ear muffs to
> help block some of the ambient noise.
>
> Thanks,
> Larry
>
> On Mon, Mar 9, 2015 at 7:51 PM, > wrote:
>
> I just posted a new video tip for adding cheap earbuds to your
> headset to cut down on the engine/prop noise. It's effective and
> economical.
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETiRiRqb5_I
>
> Enjoy
> Malcolm Morrison
> www.wienerdogaero.com <http://www.wienerdogaero.com>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Headset Modification |
| From: | Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> |
On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 1:34 PM, Charlie England
wrote:
>
>
> I fly an RV-4 using a QT Halo earplug style headset, and it is quite a bit
> quieter than the old Lightspeed 15's (active noise cancelling) I used to
> use. The Halo actually has the speaker elements mounted on the headband,
> with small tubing connecting to the ear plugs. I would have thought that
> the Clarity Aloft would be even quieter. Are you sure you had a good seal
> between the ear plugs and your ear canal?
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
I just finished modifying my Sig S45 headset with a set of "ear buds".
Using a "pencil solder gun" I had no problem at all with soldering the
wires? to the speaker. Perhaps it was the type of flux core solder that I
had.
I also bought the QT Halo headset, and I liked it for the most part. I had
no problem hearing the radio, in fact I had to turn it down quite a bit,
and the best part is that I could listen to my music while flying. Not very
satisfying with a normal headset. I however was not a fan of the mic. I put
an Oregon Areo mic cover on it and it helped a lot, but the "boom for the
mic was as limp as 30 day old celery. I finally taped it to some alum wire
to give it a bit of a spine. Other wise I had to hold it in front of my
mouth if I wanted to talk to some one. My cockpit is just a cover (factory
wrap around) over the area that I sit. If I turned my head it would crack
the squelch and I would get a shot of full motor noise. So it was necessary
to turn up the squelch a lot to keep it from cracking.
You asked about seal, and I did have a good seal, but you also pick up
ambient noise through the bones that surround your ear as well. While I
could hear great, I felt that the noise of that HKS was still too loud. I
was considering using a set of ear muffs to help with the noise. To be
clear- I never had any problem with hearing the radio or my music. My wife
however often mentioned the motor noise was quite loud, and there was
occasional static. ( I think that there are better mic's out there than the
one that they use.)
I have a base station here at the house so I can talk with the wife to get
her input on clarity on her end of the conversation.
I decided to try adding the ear buds to my Sig S45's. I have found them to
be the best option for me even over ANR headsets. ( The ANR is set for GA
and works best on the 2400 RPM's of those engines. Ours turning 6000 RPM,
are out of the range that they generally work best at.)
However wearing glasses I was not happy with the noise even with gel ear
seals on the S 45's. I felt that I had to turn the sounds that I wanted to
hear up to the point that my old experienced ears would be still getting
damaging noise levels. I could not hear my music very well and if I played
it as loud as I needed to hear it at all in the plane, it would cause me to
wince at that level out of the plane.
After completing the modification I rolled the plane out for some touch and
go's. I plugged the ear buds in, covered my ears with the headset, and
found that I had to turn the volume down on both the headset and the music
radio for the first time. The noise level was substantially reduced from
both the Halo set and the S45 before modification, with the ear buds. Upon
landing my wife also confirmed that on her end the transmissions were a lot
clearer, louder and without static.
I will be using my Halo set as a backup. There was that much improvement.
Thanks Malcom.
Larry
>
>>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
--
*If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
address before sending.*
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Headset Modification |
Larry C:
Sounds great. Got to get me some "cheap" ear buds and go to work. I
have several DC and Sigtronic headsets to play with.
My hearing has gotten so bad and the noise level is so great in the
MKIII it takes the fun out of flying. Biggest complaint I have trying
to knock out 8 hour flight days. Noise is extremely fatiguing.
BTW: No cockpit noise comparison between a Kolb and an RV4. Kolb is
much, much louder and of a much higher frequency, engine and prop.
Pushers are normally much louder inside as well as outside the cockpit.
Irritates me how quiet my friends RANS S7 is with the same engine and
prop I am flying. ;-)
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry
Cottrell
Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2015 4:14 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Headset Modification
On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 1:34 PM, Charlie England
wrote:
I fly an RV-4 using a QT Halo earplug style headset, and it is quite a
bit quieter than the old Lightspeed 15's (active noise cancelling) I
used to use. The Halo actually has the speaker elements mounted on the
headband, with small tubing connecting to the ear plugs. I would have
thought that the Clarity Aloft would be even quieter. Are you sure you
had a good seal between the ear plugs and your ear canal?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------
I just finished modifying my Sig S45 headset with a set of "ear buds".
Using a "pencil solder gun" I had no problem at all with soldering the
wires? to the speaker. Perhaps it was the type of flux core solder that
I had.
I also bought the QT Halo headset, and I liked it for the most part. I
had no problem hearing the radio, in fact I had to turn it down quite a
bit, and the best part is that I could listen to my music while flying.
Not very satisfying with a normal headset. I however was not a fan of
the mic. I put an Oregon Areo mic cover on it and it helped a lot, but
the "boom for the mic was as limp as 30 day old celery. I finally taped
it to some alum wire to give it a bit of a spine. Other wise I had to
hold it in front of my mouth if I wanted to talk to some one. My cockpit
is just a cover (factory wrap around) over the area that I sit. If I
turned my head it would crack the squelch and I would get a shot of full
motor noise. So it was necessary to turn up the squelch a lot to keep it
from cracking.
You asked about seal, and I did have a good seal, but you also pick up
ambient noise through the bones that surround your ear as well. While I
could hear great, I felt that the noise of that HKS was still too loud.
I was considering using a set of ear muffs to help with the noise. To
be clear- I never had any problem with hearing the radio or my music. My
wife however often mentioned the motor noise was quite loud, and there
was occasional static. ( I think that there are better mic's out there
than the one that they use.)
I have a base station here at the house so I can talk with the wife to
get her input on clarity on her end of the conversation.
I decided to try adding the ear buds to my Sig S45's. I have found them
to be the best option for me even over ANR headsets. ( The ANR is set
for GA and works best on the 2400 RPM's of those engines. Ours turning
6000 RPM, are out of the range that they generally work best at.)
However wearing glasses I was not happy with the noise even with gel ear
seals on the S 45's. I felt that I had to turn the sounds that I wanted
to hear up to the point that my old experienced ears would be still
getting damaging noise levels. I could not hear my music very well and
if I played it as loud as I needed to hear it at all in the plane, it
would cause me to wince at that level out of the plane.
After completing the modification I rolled the plane out for some touch
and go's. I plugged the ear buds in, covered my ears with the headset,
and found that I had to turn the volume down on both the headset and the
music radio for the first time. The noise level was substantially
reduced from both the Halo set and the S45 before modification, with the
ear buds. Upon landing my wife also confirmed that on her end the
transmissions were a lot clearer, louder and without static.
I will be using my Halo set as a backup. There was that much
improvement.
Thanks Malcom.
Larry
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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address before sending.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Headset Modification |
Larry,
Might be worth a call to QT. He's 'local' for me, and I bought mine by
walking into his office. Nice guy & would probably work with you on the
issues. I haven't used mine in an open cockpit, so don't know about
whether wind would affect boom position (but suspect that it should
remove it from your head before it actually bends the boom, assuming
that it isn't defective). No experience with open cockpit wind noise on
the mic either (except getting it in the flow of the cockpit vent, which
triggers *any* mic), but I have heard of some people getting the boom on
backward & talking into the noise cancelling port instead of the front
of the mic. Might be worth a check. Also, if the port gets clogged with
debris it will kill the noise cancelling function of the mic.
Agree that active noise cancelling doesn't do that much in open cockpit;
most of the problem is wind noise, which is *much* higher frequency than
even a 2 stroke. That's where good physical seal and a bit of mass
really help.
John,
Are you talking about iphone/mp3 player type buds that basically hang in
your ear? If so, be aware that using those inside a set of regular
headphones will not reduce noise much if any over the headphones alone.
Yes, you will likely be able to hear better than with headphones alone
(for a short time), but all you're doing is making the volume of the
radio reception louder, which is *adding* to the ear's total noise
exposure. Any of us who have flown for a number of years, and/or abused
our ears in other ways (I did concert sound work in one of my previous
lives) need to not just hear today's radio comm, but keep whatever
hearing we have left. :-) There are in-ear models that actually 'plug'
your ear just like industrial earplugs (not as cheap), or you can have
custom molded inserts made, (not cheap at all). What's your remaining
hearing worth?
As to noise levels in RVs vs Kolbs, I can't compare. But I have flown in
the back seat of an Aircam with two 912s. Didn't seem that bad at the
time, but maybe the 912s were cancelling each other. Or I was having too
much fun to notice the noise...
Charlie
On 3/10/2015 5:11 PM, John Hauck wrote:
>
> Larry C:
>
> Sounds great.Got to get me some "cheap" ear buds and go to work.I have
> several DC and Sigtronic headsets to play with.
>
> My hearing has gotten so bad and the noise level is so great in the
> MKIII it takes the fun out of flying.Biggest complaint I have trying
> to knock out 8 hour flight days.Noise is extremely fatiguing.
>
> BTW:No cockpit noise comparison between a Kolb and an RV4.Kolb is
> much, much louder and of a much higher frequency, engine and
> prop.Pushers are normally much louder inside as well as outside the
> cockpit.Irritates me how quiet my friends RANS S7 is with the same
> engine and prop I am flying.;-)
>
> john h
>
> mkIII
>
> Titus, Alabama
>
> *From:*owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Larry
> Cottrell
> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 10, 2015 4:14 PM
> *To:* kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Kolb-List: Headset Modification
>
> On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 1:34 PM, Charlie England > wrote:
>
>
> I fly an RV-4 using a QT Halo earplug style headset, and it is quite a
> bit quieter than the old Lightspeed 15's (active noise cancelling) I
> used to use. The Halo actually has the speaker elements mounted on the
> headband, with small tubing connecting to the ear plugs. I would have
> thought that the Clarity Aloft would be even quieter. Are you sure you
> had a good seal between the ear plugs and your ear canal?
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I just finished modifying my Sig S45 headset with a set of "ear buds".
> Using a "pencil solder gun" I had no problem at all with soldering the
> wires? to the speaker. Perhaps it was the type of flux core solder
> that I had.
>
> I also bought the QT Halo headset, and I liked it for the most part. I
> had no problem hearing the radio, in fact I had to turn it down quite
> a bit, and the best part is that I could listen to my music while
> flying. Not very satisfying with a normal headset. I however was not a
> fan of the mic. I put an Oregon Areo mic cover on it and it helped a
> lot, but the "boom for the mic was as limp as 30 day old celery. I
> finally taped it to some alum wire to give it a bit of a spine. Other
> wise I had to hold it in front of my mouth if I wanted to talk to some
> one. My cockpit is just a cover (factory wrap around) over the area
> that I sit. If I turned my head it would crack the squelch and I would
> get a shot of full motor noise. So it was necessary to turn up the
> squelch a lot to keep it from cracking.
>
> You asked about seal, and I did have a good seal, but you also pick up
> ambient noise through the bones that surround your ear as well. While
> I could hear great, I felt that the noise of that HKS was still too
> loud. I was considering using a set of ear muffs to help with the
> noise. To be clear- I never had any problem with hearing the radio or
> my music. My wife however often mentioned the motor noise was quite
> loud, and there was occasional static. ( I think that there are better
> mic's out there than the one that they use.)
>
> I have a base station here at the house so I can talk with the wife to
> get her input on clarity on her end of the conversation.
>
> I decided to try adding the ear buds to my Sig S45's. I have found
> them to be the best option for me even over ANR headsets. ( The ANR is
> set for GA and works best on the 2400 RPM's of those engines. Ours
> turning 6000 RPM, are out of the range that they generally work best at.)
>
> However wearing glasses I was not happy with the noise even with gel
> ear seals on the S 45's. I felt that I had to turn the sounds that I
> wanted to hear up to the point that my old experienced ears would be
> still getting damaging noise levels. I could not hear my music very
> well and if I played it as loud as I needed to hear it at all in the
> plane, it would cause me to wince at that level out of the plane.
>
> After completing the modification I rolled the plane out for some
> touch and go's. I plugged the ear buds in, covered my ears with the
> headset, and found that I had to turn the volume down on both the
> headset and the music radio for the first time. The noise level was
> substantially reduced from both the Halo set and the S45 before
> modification, with the ear buds. Upon landing my wife also confirmed
> that on her end the transmissions were a lot clearer, louder and
> without static.
>
> I will be using my Halo set as a backup. There was that much improvement.
>
> Thanks Malcom.
>
> Larry
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mojavjoe(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Re: Headset Modification |
To make ear buds more like Clarity Aloft ear pieces I found a set of ear bu
ds that=C2-had the=C2-rubber ear pieces that slipped over a small knob.
=C2- Removed the rubber and found a small straw that would fit snugly ove
r the knob.=C2- Purchased some of the hearing protectors that=C2-mash d
own and using a small heated drill bit burnt a small hole through the lengt
h of them.=C2- Cut the straw about 1/4 to 3/8" long and slide the base of
the protector over it and the whole thing over the knob.=C2- The straw k
eeps the hole open and will still allow the ear piece to be mashed enough t
o fit into the ear cavity.
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2015 6:11:23 PM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Headset Modification
Larry C:
=C2-
Sounds great. =C2- Got to get me some "cheap" ear buds and go to work.
=C2- I have several DC and Sigtronic headsets to play with.
=C2-
My hearing has gotten so bad and the noise level is so great in the MKIII i
t takes the fun out of flying. =C2- Biggest complaint I have trying to kn
ock out 8 hour flight days. =C2- Noise is extremely fatiguing.
=C2-
BTW: =C2- No cockpit noise comparison between a Kolb and an RV4. =C2- K
olb is much, much louder and of a much higher frequency, engine and prop.
=C2- Pushers are normally much louder inside as well as outside the cockp
it. =C2- Irritates me how quiet my friends RANS S7 is with the same engin
e and prop I am flying. =C2- ;-)
=C2-
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
=C2-
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Cottrell
Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2015 4:14 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Headset Modification
=C2-
=C2-
=C2-
On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 1:34 PM, Charlie England < ceengland7(at)gmail.com > w
rote:
I fly an RV-4 using a QT Halo earplug style headset, and it is quite a bit
quieter than the old Lightspeed 15's (active noise cancelling) I used to us
e. The Halo actually has the speaker elements mounted on the headband, with
small tubing connecting to the ear plugs. I would have thought that the Cl
arity Aloft would be even quieter. Are you sure you had a good seal between
the ear plugs and your ear canal?=C2-
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------
I just finished modifying my Sig S45 headset with a set of "ear buds". Usin
g a "pencil solder gun" I had no problem at all with soldering the wires? t
o the speaker. Perhaps it was the type of flux core solder that I had.
=C2-
I also bought the QT Halo headset, and I liked it for the most part. I had
no problem hearing the radio, in fact I had to turn it down quite a bit, an
d the best part is that I could listen to my music while flying. Not very s
atisfying with a normal headset. I however was not a fan of the mic. I put
an Oregon Areo mic cover on it and it helped a lot, but the "boom for the m
ic was as limp as 30 day old celery. I finally taped it to some alum wire t
o give it a bit of a spine. Other wise I had to hold it in front of my mout
h if I wanted to talk to some one. My cockpit is just a cover (factory wrap
around) over the area that I sit. If I turned my head it would crack the s
quelch and I would get a shot of full motor noise. So it was necessary to t
urn up the squelch a lot to keep it from cracking.
=C2-
You asked about seal, and I did have a good seal, but you also pick up ambi
ent noise through the bones that surround your ear as well. While I could h
ear great, I felt that the noise of that HKS was still too loud. I was cons
idering =C2-using a set of ear muffs to help with the noise. To be clear-
I never had any problem with hearing the radio or my music. My wife howeve
r often mentioned the motor noise was quite loud, and there was occasional
static. ( I think that there are better mic's out there than the one that t
hey use.)
=C2-
I have a base station here at the house so I can talk with the wife to get
her input on clarity on her end of the conversation. =C2-
=C2-
I decided to try adding the ear buds to my Sig S45's. I have found them to
be the best option for me even over ANR headsets. ( The ANR is set for GA a
nd works best on the 2400 RPM's of those engines. Ours turning 6000 RPM, ar
e out of the range that they generally work best at.)
=C2-
However wearing glasses I was not happy with the noise even with gel ear se
als on the S 45's. I felt that I had to turn the sounds that I wanted to he
ar up to the point that my old experienced ears would be still getting dama
ging noise levels. I could not hear my music very well and if I played it a
s loud as I needed to hear it at all in the plane, it would cause me to win
ce at that level out of the plane.=C2-
=C2-
After completing the modification I rolled the plane out for some touch and
go's. I plugged the ear buds in, covered my ears with the headset, and fou
nd that I had to turn the volume down on both the headset and the music rad
io for the first time. The noise level was substantially reduced from both
the Halo set and the S45 before modification, with the ear buds. Upon landi
ng my wife also confirmed that on her end the transmissions were a lot clea
rer, louder and without static.=C2-
=C2-
I will be using my Halo set as a backup. There was that much improvement.
=C2-
Thanks Malcom.
=C2-
Larry
=C2-
=C2-
=C2-
=C2-
get="_blank"> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank"> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
=C2-
=C2-
--
If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email addres
s before sending.
=C2-
=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- - The Kolb-List Emai
l Forum -
=C2-=C2- --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2- - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
=C2-=C2- --> http://forums.matronics.com
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- -
List Contribution Web Site -
=C2- Thank you for your generous support!
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2- -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
=C2-=C2- --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
=C2-
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Headset Modification |
The MKIII suffers from the drum effect. Prop and engine noise is magnified
and confined to the enclosed cockpit. Open cockpit is not as loud.
Wouldn't do me much good to hand an ear bud on my ear. I've been wearing
hearing aids since 1978, while still on active duty and drawing flight pay.
Larry shot me a bc to get good ear buds that actually seal the ear canal.
The DC H-13.4 do about as good a job as any passively. The additional
passive noise reduction of the ear buds should allow for me to hear with
lower radio/intercom volume.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charlie England
Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2015 7:36 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Headset Modification
Larry,
Might be worth a call to QT. He's 'local' for me, and I bought mine by
walking into his office. Nice guy & would probably work with you on the
issues. I haven't used mine in an open cockpit, so don't know about whether
wind would affect boom position (but suspect that it should remove it from
your head before it actually bends the boom, assuming that it isn't
defective). No experience with open cockpit wind noise on the mic either
(except getting it in the flow of the cockpit vent, which triggers *any*
mic), but I have heard of some people getting the boom on backward & talking
into the noise cancelling port instead of the front of the mic. Might be
worth a check. Also, if the port gets clogged with debris it will kill the
noise cancelling function of the mic.
Agree that active noise cancelling doesn't do that much in open cockpit;
most of the problem is wind noise, which is *much* higher frequency than
even a 2 stroke. That's where good physical seal and a bit of mass really
help.
John,
Are you talking about iphone/mp3 player type buds that basically hang in
your ear? If so, be aware that using those inside a set of regular
headphones will not reduce noise much if any over the headphones alone. Yes,
you will likely be able to hear better than with headphones alone (for a
short time), but all you're doing is making the volume of the radio
reception louder, which is *adding* to the ear's total noise exposure. Any
of us who have flown for a number of years, and/or abused our ears in other
ways (I did concert sound work in one of my previous lives) need to not just
hear today's radio comm, but keep whatever hearing we have left. :-) There
are in-ear models that actually 'plug' your ear just like industrial
earplugs (not as cheap), or you can have custom molded inserts made, (not
cheap at all). What's your remaining hearing worth?
As to noise levels in RVs vs Kolbs, I can't compare. But I have flown in the
back seat of an Aircam with two 912s. Didn't seem that bad at the time, but
maybe the 912s were cancelling each other. Or I was having too much fun to
notice the noise...
Charlie
On 3/10/2015 5:11 PM, John Hauck wrote:
Larry C:
Sounds great. Got to get me some "cheap" ear buds and go to work. I have
several DC and Sigtronic headsets to play with.
My hearing has gotten so bad and the noise level is so great in the MKIII it
takes the fun out of flying. Biggest complaint I have trying to knock out 8
hour flight days. Noise is extremely fatiguing.
BTW: No cockpit noise comparison between a Kolb and an RV4. Kolb is much,
much louder and of a much higher frequency, engine and prop. Pushers are
normally much louder inside as well as outside the cockpit. Irritates me
how quiet my friends RANS S7 is with the same engine and prop I am flying.
;-)
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Cottrell
Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2015 4:14 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Headset Modification
On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 1:34 PM, Charlie England
wrote:
I fly an RV-4 using a QT Halo earplug style headset, and it is quite a bit
quieter than the old Lightspeed 15's (active noise cancelling) I used to
use. The Halo actually has the speaker elements mounted on the headband,
with small tubing connecting to the ear plugs. I would have thought that the
Clarity Aloft would be even quieter. Are you sure you had a good seal
between the ear plugs and your ear canal?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------
I just finished modifying my Sig S45 headset with a set of "ear buds". Using
a "pencil solder gun" I had no problem at all with soldering the wires? to
the speaker. Perhaps it was the type of flux core solder that I had.
I also bought the QT Halo headset, and I liked it for the most part. I had
no problem hearing the radio, in fact I had to turn it down quite a bit, and
the best part is that I could listen to my music while flying. Not very
satisfying with a normal headset. I however was not a fan of the mic. I put
an Oregon Areo mic cover on it and it helped a lot, but the "boom for the
mic was as limp as 30 day old celery. I finally taped it to some alum wire
to give it a bit of a spine. Other wise I had to hold it in front of my
mouth if I wanted to talk to some one. My cockpit is just a cover (factory
wrap around) over the area that I sit. If I turned my head it would crack
the squelch and I would get a shot of full motor noise. So it was necessary
to turn up the squelch a lot to keep it from cracking.
You asked about seal, and I did have a good seal, but you also pick up
ambient noise through the bones that surround your ear as well. While I
could hear great, I felt that the noise of that HKS was still too loud. I
was considering using a set of ear muffs to help with the noise. To be
clear- I never had any problem with hearing the radio or my music. My wife
however often mentioned the motor noise was quite loud, and there was
occasional static. ( I think that there are better mic's out there than the
one that they use.)
I have a base station here at the house so I can talk with the wife to get
her input on clarity on her end of the conversation.
I decided to try adding the ear buds to my Sig S45's. I have found them to
be the best option for me even over ANR headsets. ( The ANR is set for GA
and works best on the 2400 RPM's of those engines. Ours turning 6000 RPM,
are out of the range that they generally work best at.)
However wearing glasses I was not happy with the noise even with gel ear
seals on the S 45's. I felt that I had to turn the sounds that I wanted to
hear up to the point that my old experienced ears would be still getting
damaging noise levels. I could not hear my music very well and if I played
it as loud as I needed to hear it at all in the plane, it would cause me to
wince at that level out of the plane.
After completing the modification I rolled the plane out for some touch and
go's. I plugged the ear buds in, covered my ears with the headset, and found
that I had to turn the volume down on both the headset and the music radio
for the first time. The noise level was substantially reduced from both the
Halo set and the S45 before modification, with the ear buds. Upon landing my
wife also confirmed that on her end the transmissions were a lot clearer,
louder and without static.
I will be using my Halo set as a backup. There was that much improvement.
Thanks Malcom.
Larry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "brubakermal(at)yahoo.com" <brubakermal(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re:firefly parts for sale |
I have a wind screen- axil- fittings- and folding wing brace for sale
i can send pics off list .make a offer =0A=0ASent from Yahoo Mail on Andro
id=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Headset Modification |
| From: | Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> |
"Charlie wrote"
Might be worth a call to QT. He's 'local' for me, and I bought mine by
walking into his office. Nice guy & would probably work with you on the
issues.
Charlie,
I really do not have any substantial complaint about the Halo headset.
Yeah the wimpy mike boom is a bother, but not a real complaint. I feel that
in the normal course of things it is something that the manufacturer would
clean up in due time, but not enough of a problem to be a deal breaker. The
reason that I am using the S45 with ear buds is just that it is better, and
quieter. If I was flying a C150, I would use the Halo. In my operation
however, it just isn't the best one.
Larry
On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 6:35 PM, Charlie England
wrote:
> Larry,
>
> Might be worth a call to QT. He's 'local' for me, and I bought mine by
> walking into his office. Nice guy & would probably work with you on the
> issues. I haven't used mine in an open cockpit, so don't know about whether
> wind would affect boom position (but suspect that it should remove it from
> your head before it actually bends the boom, assuming that it isn't
> defective). No experience with open cockpit wind noise on the mic either
> (except getting it in the flow of the cockpit vent, which triggers *any*
> mic), but I have heard of some people getting the boom on backward &
> talking into the noise cancelling port instead of the front of the mic.
> Might be worth a check. Also, if the port gets clogged with debris it will
> kill the noise cancelling function of the mic.
>
> Agree that active noise cancelling doesn't do that much in open cockpit;
> most of the problem is wind noise, which is *much* higher frequency than
> even a 2 stroke. That's where good physical seal and a bit of mass really
> help.
>
> John,
>
> Are you talking about iphone/mp3 player type buds that basically hang in
> your ear? If so, be aware that using those inside a set of regular
> headphones will not reduce noise much if any over the headphones alone.
> Yes, you will likely be able to hear better than with headphones alone (for
> a short time), but all you're doing is making the volume of the radio
> reception louder, which is *adding* to the ear's total noise exposure. Any
> of us who have flown for a number of years, and/or abused our ears in other
> ways (I did concert sound work in one of my previous lives) need to not
> just hear today's radio comm, but keep whatever hearing we have left. :-)
> There are in-ear models that actually 'plug' your ear just like industrial
> earplugs (not as cheap), or you can have custom molded inserts made, (not
> cheap at all). What's your remaining hearing worth?
>
> As to noise levels in RVs vs Kolbs, I can't compare. But I have flown in
> the back seat of an Aircam with two 912s. Didn't seem that bad at the time,
> but maybe the 912s were cancelling each other. Or I was having too much fun
> to notice the noise...
>
> Charlie
>
> On 3/10/2015 5:11 PM, John Hauck wrote:
>
> Larry C:
>
>
> Sounds great. Got to get me some "cheap" ear buds and go to work. I
> have several DC and Sigtronic headsets to play with.
>
>
> My hearing has gotten so bad and the noise level is so great in the MKIII
> it takes the fun out of flying. Biggest complaint I have trying to knock
> out 8 hour flight days. Noise is extremely fatiguing.
>
>
> BTW: No cockpit noise comparison between a Kolb and an RV4. Kolb is
> much, much louder and of a much higher frequency, engine and prop. Pushers
> are normally much louder inside as well as outside the cockpit. Irritates
> me how quiet my friends RANS S7 is with the same engine and prop I am
> flying. ;-)
>
>
> john h
>
> mkIII
>
> Titus, Alabama
>
>
> *From:* owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [
> mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
> ] *On Behalf Of *Larry Cottrell
> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 10, 2015 4:14 PM
> *To:* kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Kolb-List: Headset Modification
>
>
> On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 1:34 PM, Charlie England
> wrote:
>
>
> I fly an RV-4 using a QT Halo earplug style headset, and it is quite a bit
> quieter than the old Lightspeed 15's (active noise cancelling) I used to
> use. The Halo actually has the speaker elements mounted on the headband,
> with small tubing connecting to the ear plugs. I would have thought that
> the Clarity Aloft would be even quieter. Are you sure you had a good seal
> between the ear plugs and your ear canal?
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I just finished modifying my Sig S45 headset with a set of "ear buds".
> Using a "pencil solder gun" I had no problem at all with soldering the
> wires? to the speaker. Perhaps it was the type of flux core solder that I
> had.
>
>
> I also bought the QT Halo headset, and I liked it for the most part. I had
> no problem hearing the radio, in fact I had to turn it down quite a bit,
> and the best part is that I could listen to my music while flying. Not very
> satisfying with a normal headset. I however was not a fan of the mic. I put
> an Oregon Areo mic cover on it and it helped a lot, but the "boom for the
> mic was as limp as 30 day old celery. I finally taped it to some alum wire
> to give it a bit of a spine. Other wise I had to hold it in front of my
> mouth if I wanted to talk to some one. My cockpit is just a cover (factory
> wrap around) over the area that I sit. If I turned my head it would crack
> the squelch and I would get a shot of full motor noise. So it was necessary
> to turn up the squelch a lot to keep it from cracking.
>
>
> You asked about seal, and I did have a good seal, but you also pick up
> ambient noise through the bones that surround your ear as well. While I
> could hear great, I felt that the noise of that HKS was still too loud. I
> was considering using a set of ear muffs to help with the noise. To be
> clear- I never had any problem with hearing the radio or my music. My wife
> however often mentioned the motor noise was quite loud, and there was
> occasional static. ( I think that there are better mic's out there than the
> one that they use.)
>
>
> I have a base station here at the house so I can talk with the wife to get
> her input on clarity on her end of the conversation.
>
>
> I decided to try adding the ear buds to my Sig S45's. I have found them to
> be the best option for me even over ANR headsets. ( The ANR is set for GA
> and works best on the 2400 RPM's of those engines. Ours turning 6000 RPM,
> are out of the range that they generally work best at.)
>
>
> However wearing glasses I was not happy with the noise even with gel ear
> seals on the S 45's. I felt that I had to turn the sounds that I wanted to
> hear up to the point that my old experienced ears would be still getting
> damaging noise levels. I could not hear my music very well and if I played
> it as loud as I needed to hear it at all in the plane, it would cause me to
> wince at that level out of the plane.
>
>
> After completing the modification I rolled the plane out for some touch
> and go's. I plugged the ear buds in, covered my ears with the headset, and
> found that I had to turn the volume down on both the headset and the music
> radio for the first time. The noise level was substantially reduced from
> both the Halo set and the S45 before modification, with the ear buds. Upon
> landing my wife also confirmed that on her end the transmissions were a lot
> clearer, louder and without static.
>
>
> I will be using my Halo set as a backup. There was that much improvement.
>
>
> Thanks Malcom.
>
>
> Larry
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
--
*If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
address before sending.*
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gliderx5(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Re: Headset Modification |
Charlie
=C2-
The earbuds that I reference in the video are the in ear canal, rubber type
that cost $10 at Walmart. Perhaps I used the wrong term but I assumed that
all the "thingys" that you put in your ear were called earbuds. Sorry for
the confusion. Whatever they are called, they work better for me than expen
sive headsets.
=C2-
Malcolm
----- Original Message -----
From: "Charlie England" <ceengland7(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2015 8:35:52 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Headset Modification
Larry,
Might be worth a call to QT. He's 'local' for me, and I bought mine by walk
ing into his office. Nice guy & would probably work with you on the issues.
I haven't used mine in an open cockpit, so don't know about whether wind w
ould affect boom position (but suspect that it should remove it from your h
ead before it actually bends the boom, assuming that it isn't defective). N
o experience with open cockpit wind noise on the mic either (except getting
it in the flow of the cockpit vent, which triggers *any* mic), but I have
heard of some people getting the boom on backward & talking into the noise
cancelling port instead of the front of the mic. Might be worth a check. Al
so, if the port gets clogged with debris it will kill the noise cancelling
function of the mic.
Agree that active noise cancelling doesn't do that much in open cockpit; mo
st of the problem is wind noise, which is *much* higher frequency than even
a 2 stroke. That's where good physical seal and a bit of mass really help.
John,
Are you talking about iphone/mp3 player type buds that basically hang in yo
ur ear? If so, be aware that using those inside a set of regular headphones
will not reduce noise much if any over the headphones alone. Yes, you will
likely be able to hear better than with headphones alone (for a short time
), but all you're doing is making the volume of the radio reception louder,
which is *adding* to the ear's total noise exposure. Any of us who have fl
own for a number of years, and/or abused our ears in other ways (I did conc
ert sound work in one of my previous lives) need to not just hear today's r
adio comm, but keep whatever hearing we have left. :-) There are in-ear mod
els that actually 'plug' your ear just like industrial earplugs (not as che
ap), or you can have custom molded inserts made, (not cheap at all). What's
your remaining hearing worth?
As to noise levels in RVs vs Kolbs, I can't compare. But I have flown in th
e back seat of an Aircam with two 912s. Didn't seem that bad at the time, b
ut maybe the 912s were cancelling each other. Or I was having too much fun
to notice the noise...
Charlie
On 3/10/2015 5:11 PM, John Hauck wrote:
Larry C:
=C2-
Sounds great. =C2- Got to get me some "cheap" ear buds and go to work.
=C2- I have several DC and Sigtronic headsets to play with.
=C2-
My hearing has gotten so bad and the noise level is so great in the MKIII i
t takes the fun out of flying. =C2- Biggest complaint I have trying to kn
ock out 8 hour flight days. =C2- Noise is extremely fatiguing.
=C2-
BTW: =C2- No cockpit noise comparison between a Kolb and an RV4. =C2- K
olb is much, much louder and of a much higher frequency, engine and prop.
=C2- Pushers are normally much louder inside as well as outside the cockp
it. =C2- Irritates me how quiet my friends RANS S7 is with the same engin
e and prop I am flying. =C2- ;-)
=C2-
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
=C2-
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [ mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@
matronics.com ] On Behalf Of Larry Cottrell
Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2015 4:14 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Headset Modification
=C2-
=C2-
=C2-
On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 1:34 PM, Charlie England < ceengland7(at)gmail.com > w
rote:
I fly an RV-4 using a QT Halo earplug style headset, and it is quite a bit
quieter than the old Lightspeed 15's (active noise cancelling) I used to us
e. The Halo actually has the speaker elements mounted on the headband, with
small tubing connecting to the ear plugs. I would have thought that the Cl
arity Aloft would be even quieter. Are you sure you had a good seal between
the ear plugs and your ear canal?=C2-
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------
I just finished modifying my Sig S45 headset with a set of "ear buds". Usin
g a "pencil solder gun" I had no problem at all with soldering the wires? t
o the speaker. Perhaps it was the type of flux core solder that I had.
=C2-
I also bought the QT Halo headset, and I liked it for the most part. I had
no problem hearing the radio, in fact I had to turn it down quite a bit, an
d the best part is that I could listen to my music while flying. Not very s
atisfying with a normal headset. I however was not a fan of the mic. I put
an Oregon Areo mic cover on it and it helped a lot, but the "boom for the m
ic was as limp as 30 day old celery. I finally taped it to some alum wire t
o give it a bit of a spine. Other wise I had to hold it in front of my mout
h if I wanted to talk to some one. My cockpit is just a cover (factory wrap
around) over the area that I sit. If I turned my head it would crack the s
quelch and I would get a shot of full motor noise. So it was necessary to t
urn up the squelch a lot to keep it from cracking.
=C2-
You asked about seal, and I did have a good seal, but you also pick up ambi
ent noise through the bones that surround your ear as well. While I could h
ear great, I felt that the noise of that HKS was still too loud. I was cons
idering =C2-using a set of ear muffs to help with the noise. To be clear-
I never had any problem with hearing the radio or my music. My wife howeve
r often mentioned the motor noise was quite loud, and there was occasional
static. ( I think that there are better mic's out there than the one that t
hey use.)
=C2-
I have a base station here at the house so I can talk with the wife to get
her input on clarity on her end of the conversation. =C2-
=C2-
I decided to try adding the ear buds to my Sig S45's. I have found them to
be the best option for me even over ANR headsets. ( The ANR is set for GA a
nd works best on the 2400 RPM's of those engines. Ours turning 6000 RPM, ar
e out of the range that they generally work best at.)
=C2-
However wearing glasses I was not happy with the noise even with gel ear se
als on the S 45's. I felt that I had to turn the sounds that I wanted to he
ar up to the point that my old experienced ears would be still getting dama
ging noise levels. I could not hear my music very well and if I played it a
s loud as I needed to hear it at all in the plane, it would cause me to win
ce at that level out of the plane.=C2-
=C2-
After completing the modification I rolled the plane out for some touch and
go's. I plugged the ear buds in, covered my ears with the headset, and fou
nd that I had to turn the volume down on both the headset and the music rad
io for the first time. The noise level was substantially reduced from both
the Halo set and the S45 before modification, with the ear buds. Upon landi
ng my wife also confirmed that on her end the transmissions were a lot clea
rer, louder and without static.=C2-
=C2-
I will be using my Halo set as a backup. There was that much improvement.
=C2-
Thanks Malcom.
=C2-
Larry
===
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "b young" <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | magnetic connectors,, |
Richard
that is what I spent time looking for a while back.... I think you could p
ut one of these on the inside or out side of the headset, then would not h
ave to worry about wire breakage. and it would not interfere with normal
use of the headset.
thanks boyd
>You got me browsing for magnetic connectors and found a web page for peopl
e who
>go to cosplay events and make their own clothing with lights embedded
---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "b young" <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com> |
a friend of mine has a halo style headset that is blue tooth capable, whi
le he is in the air in his crop duster he can make and receive phone calls.
he loves it. I was left with the impression it was in the 600 dollar ne
ighborhood.... ouch... niche market
boyd
---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Headset Modification |
Hi Malcolm,
I don't think you used the wrong term; it's just that there probably
isn't a universally accepted convention of terms and I was trying to be
sure that any late adopters understood the difference between typical
hang-in-the-ear style buds that come with iphones, etc, and 'plug' style
devices that actually seal into the ear canal.
Charlie
On 3/11/2015 9:34 AM, gliderx5(at)comcast.net wrote:
> Charlie
> The earbuds that I reference in the video are the in ear canal, rubber
> type that cost $10 at Walmart. Perhaps I used the wrong term but I
> assumed that all the "thingys" that you put in your ear were called
> earbuds. Sorry for the confusion. Whatever they are called, they work
> better for me than expensive headsets.
> Malcolm
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From: *"Charlie England" <ceengland7(at)gmail.com>
> *To: *"kolb-list"
> *Sent: *Tuesday, March 10, 2015 8:35:52 PM
> *Subject: *Re: Kolb-List: Headset Modification
>
> Larry,
>
> Might be worth a call to QT. He's 'local' for me, and I bought mine by
> walking into his office. Nice guy & would probably work with you on
> the issues. I haven't used mine in an open cockpit, so don't know
> about whether wind would affect boom position (but suspect that it
> should remove it from your head before it actually bends the boom,
> assuming that it isn't defective). No experience with open cockpit
> wind noise on the mic either (except getting it in the flow of the
> cockpit vent, which triggers *any* mic), but I have heard of some
> people getting the boom on backward & talking into the noise
> cancelling port instead of the front of the mic. Might be worth a
> check. Also, if the port gets clogged with debris it will kill the
> noise cancelling function of the mic.
>
> Agree that active noise cancelling doesn't do that much in open
> cockpit; most of the problem is wind noise, which is *much* higher
> frequency than even a 2 stroke. That's where good physical seal and a
> bit of mass really help.
>
> John,
>
> Are you talking about iphone/mp3 player type buds that basically hang
> in your ear? If so, be aware that using those inside a set of regular
> headphones will not reduce noise much if any over the headphones
> alone. Yes, you will likely be able to hear better than with
> headphones alone (for a short time), but all you're doing is making
> the volume of the radio reception louder, which is *adding* to the
> ear's total noise exposure. Any of us who have flown for a number of
> years, and/or abused our ears in other ways (I did concert sound work
> in one of my previous lives) need to not just hear today's radio comm,
> but keep whatever hearing we have left. :-) There are in-ear models
> that actually 'plug' your ear just like industrial earplugs (not as
> cheap), or you can have custom molded inserts made, (not cheap at
> all). What's your remaining hearing worth?
>
> As to noise levels in RVs vs Kolbs, I can't compare. But I have flown
> in the back seat of an Aircam with two 912s. Didn't seem that bad at
> the time, but maybe the 912s were cancelling each other. Or I was
> having too much fun to notice the noise...
>
> Charlie
>
> On 3/10/2015 5:11 PM, John Hauck wrote:
>
> Larry C:
>
> Sounds great.Got to get me some "cheap" ear buds and go to work.I
> have several DC and Sigtronic headsets to play with.
>
> My hearing has gotten so bad and the noise level is so great in
> the MKIII it takes the fun out of flying.Biggest complaint I have
> trying to knock out 8 hour flight days.Noise is extremely fatiguing.
>
> BTW:No cockpit noise comparison between a Kolb and an RV4.Kolb is
> much, much louder and of a much higher frequency, engine and
> prop.Pushers are normally much louder inside as well as outside
> the cockpit.Irritates me how quiet my friends RANS S7 is with the
> same engine and prop I am flying.;-)
>
> john h
>
> mkIII
>
> Titus, Alabama
>
> *From:*owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Larry
> Cottrell
> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 10, 2015 4:14 PM
> *To:* kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Kolb-List: Headset Modification
>
> On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 1:34 PM, Charlie England
> > wrote:
>
>
> I fly an RV-4 using a QT Halo earplug style headset, and it is
> quite a bit quieter than the old Lightspeed 15's (active noise
> cancelling) I used to use. The Halo actually has the speaker
> elements mounted on the headband, with small tubing connecting to
> the ear plugs. I would have thought that the Clarity Aloft would
> be even quieter. Are you sure you had a good seal between the ear
> plugs and your ear canal?
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I just finished modifying my Sig S45 headset with a set of "ear
> buds". Using a "pencil solder gun" I had no problem at all with
> soldering the wires? to the speaker. Perhaps it was the type of
> flux core solder that I had.
>
> I also bought the QT Halo headset, and I liked it for the most
> part. I had no problem hearing the radio, in fact I had to turn it
> down quite a bit, and the best part is that I could listen to my
> music while flying. Not very satisfying with a normal headset. I
> however was not a fan of the mic. I put an Oregon Areo mic cover
> on it and it helped a lot, but the "boom for the mic was as limp
> as 30 day old celery. I finally taped it to some alum wire to give
> it a bit of a spine. Other wise I had to hold it in front of my
> mouth if I wanted to talk to some one. My cockpit is just a cover
> (factory wrap around) over the area that I sit. If I turned my
> head it would crack the squelch and I would get a shot of full
> motor noise. So it was necessary to turn up the squelch a lot to
> keep it from cracking.
>
> You asked about seal, and I did have a good seal, but you also
> pick up ambient noise through the bones that surround your ear as
> well. While I could hear great, I felt that the noise of that HKS
> was still too loud. I was considering using a set of ear muffs to
> help with the noise. To be clear- I never had any problem with
> hearing the radio or my music. My wife however often mentioned the
> motor noise was quite loud, and there was occasional static. ( I
> think that there are better mic's out there than the one that they
> use.)
>
> I have a base station here at the house so I can talk with the
> wife to get her input on clarity on her end of the conversation.
>
> I decided to try adding the ear buds to my Sig S45's. I have found
> them to be the best option for me even over ANR headsets. ( The
> ANR is set for GA and works best on the 2400 RPM's of those
> engines. Ours turning 6000 RPM, are out of the range that they
> generally work best at.)
>
> However wearing glasses I was not happy with the noise even with
> gel ear seals on the S 45's. I felt that I had to turn the sounds
> that I wanted to hear up to the point that my old experienced ears
> would be still getting damaging noise levels. I could not hear my
> music very well and if I played it as loud as I needed to hear it
> at all in the plane, it would cause me to wince at that level out
> of the plane.
>
> After completing the modification I rolled the plane out for some
> touch and go's. I plugged the ear buds in, covered my ears with
> the headset, and found that I had to turn the volume down on both
> the headset and the music radio for the first time. The noise
> level was substantially reduced from both the Halo set and the S45
> before modification, with the ear buds. Upon landing my wife also
> confirmed that on her end the transmissions were a lot clearer,
> louder and without static.
>
> I will be using my Halo set as a backup. There was that much
> improvement.
>
> Thanks Malcom.
>
> Larry
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Things are warming up in Minnesota |
| From: | "west1m" <west1m(at)hotmail.com> |
After taking up space for a year or so I finally got to fly my Firefly today.
A short trip around the block but was much fun for my first flight since purchasing
it a year ago.
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439270#439270
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/kolbkrnh_905.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Things are warming up in Minnesota |
Proud of you.
Looks cold up there.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of west1m
Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2015 10:52 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Things are warming up in Minnesota
After taking up space for a year or so I finally got to fly my Firefly
today.
A short trip around the block but was much fun for my first flight since
purchasing it a year ago.
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439270#439270
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/kolbkrnh_905.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Things are warming up in Minnesota |
| From: | "west1m" <west1m(at)hotmail.com> |
Weedhoppers and weight shift Eipers don't carry temp gauges. When I got my Firefly
running i added the EIS system. While on this little hop I couldn't help but
notice the exhaust temps up into the 1200 range. (Rotax447) Unfortunately I
did not scroll through the monitor to see both cylinders just the highest was
showing. What is a normal looking cruise temp, say 5500-5800 RPM?
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439273#439273
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Things are warming up in Minnesota |
| From: | "t41pilot" <t41pilot(at)frontier.com> |
I've added the page from the 447 operating manual that contains the nominal operating
temps for the 447. 1200 Deg EGT is max. I've set my Grand Rapids unit to
reflect that as Red Line. I normally see EGT temps around 1120 and CHT around
350 during cruise depending on weather. The chart says normal EGT is 860
to 1000. I see the 1000 range during climb out and at wide open throttle but not
during cruise. Nose down and unloading the prop causes the EGT temp to rise
quickly. Don't be surprised if you see the EGT rise quickly in the 4000 RPM
range. That is the leanest area of the mixture curve for the Carb. I try to
stay out of that area as much as possible. If you experience high EGT all the
time, then you may have to visit your prop pitch setting and dial in a little
more pitch. I probably could dial in a tad more on mine but my Firefly is performing
very well where it's at so I haven't messed with it. I live in Michigan
and still have some snow. I hope to be flying by the beginning of April somewhere.
Kudos on your Firefly. Nice Pic
--------
Gregg Kaat
2011 Firefly
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http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439281#439281
Attachments:
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Things are warming up in Minnesota |
Envious...mine is in a trailer in a U store it lot in Conn....2000 mile
round trip!!
Hope to have it home by the end of the month... Herb
On 03/11/2015 11:21 PM, John Hauck wrote:
>
> Proud of you.
>
> Looks cold up there.
>
>
> john h
> mkIII
> Titus, Alabama
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of west1m
> Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2015 10:52 PM
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Kolb-List: Things are warming up in Minnesota
>
>
> After taking up space for a year or so I finally got to fly my Firefly
> today.
> A short trip around the block but was much fun for my first flight since
> purchasing it a year ago.
>
> --------
> West1m
> Hastings, MN
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439270#439270
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/kolbkrnh_905.jpg
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Things are warming up in Minnesota |
| From: | B Young <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com> |
High egt temps could be either or a combination of prop pitch, or possibly
running a bit lean. If it has sat for a year you may want to pull the jets
and make sure they are clean. if they have a film on them that could
restrict fuel and lean things some. Or maybe a larger jet. Good luck
Boyd
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Things are warming up in Minnesota |
| From: | "west1m" <west1m(at)hotmail.com> |
Thanks everyone for the quick response. I will have look into this much closer
after looking at the chart and the responses . I have a three blade Warp drive
prop in the corner of the garage I may try out some day but until then I will
check and clean the jets, maybe bump up a notch on the needle if I can or change
the jet. I also need to check if both cylinders are the same, I worry about
seal leaks on two strokes.
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439295#439295
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Things are warming up in Minnesota |
| From: | "west1m" <west1m(at)hotmail.com> |
Great looking Firefly. I know the drive you are looking forward to.
I bought my Firefly and most of a Firestar from a guy in New York. (I am in Minnesota)
It two trucks towing two trailers (one came with the Firefly) A small
fortune in toll both fees and a hotel night or two.
Not sure why I did it , but what the heck, Everyone loves a road trip.
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439297#439297
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Things are warming up in Minnesota |
| From: | "olendorf" <olendorf(at)gmail.com> |
If I remember correctly the cold air throws off the EGT reading. So if it's 30degrees
colder than 75F (egt manufacturer calibration temp) your gauge will show
30degrees higher.
Also the cold air will cause you to run leaner. I raise my needle a notch in the
winter and return it in the spring.
--------
Scott Olendorf
Original Firestar, Rotax 447, Powerfin prop
Schenectady, NY
http://sites.google.com/site/kolbfirestar/
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439299#439299
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Malcolm Brubaker <brubakermal(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | firefly stuff for sale |
=C2-we have a gas tank , folded wing boom tube =C2-Brace,=C2- wind sc
reen and axil fittings =C2-for sale cheep=C2- call any time malMalcolm
& Jeanne Brubaker
Michigan Sport Pilot Repair http://michigansportpilotrepair.comLSRM-A, PPC,
WS
Great Sails - Sailmaker
for Ultralight & Light Sport
(989)513-3022=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
From: B Young <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com>
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2015 10:58 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Things are warming up in Minnesota
High egt temps could be either or a combination of prop pitch, or possibly
running a bit lean.=C2- If it has sat for a year you may want to pull the
jets and make sure they are clean.=C2-=C2- if they have a film on them
that could restrict fuel and lean things some.=C2- Or maybe a larger jet
.=C2-=C2- Good luck
Boyd
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Flight Simulator Aircraft Configuration For Kolb |
| From: | Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com> |
Has anyone done or know of a aircraft configuration for a Kolb on Microsoft
Flight Simulator.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | There a nice Kolbra for sale on Ebay |
| From: | Larry Gitt <gittget(at)gmail.com> |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Gitt <gittget(at)gmail.com> |
Nice Kolbra for sale on E bay for the money i put in it some one will get
a good deal
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Kolbra for sale |
| From: | Duane Ransdell <radiobluebook(at)gmail.com> |
That is a pretty good deal. How much do you think you have in it?
On Mar 16, 2015 5:06 PM, "Larry Gitt" wrote:
> Nice Kolbra for sale on E bay for the money i put in it some one will get
> a good deal
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Kolbra for sale |
| From: | Larry Gitt <gittget(at)gmail.com> |
My wife say's close to 30 and you don't argue with your wife, Now were
divorce I think around 26. I just built a gyor from scratch end up with 11
in it.
t
On Mon, Mar 16, 2015 at 5:45 PM, Duane Ransdell
wrote:
> That is a pretty good deal. How much do you think you have in it?
> On Mar 16, 2015 5:06 PM, "Larry Gitt" wrote:
>
>> Nice Kolbra for sale on E bay for the money i put in it some one will
>> get a good deal
>>
>> *
>>
>> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
>> tp://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>
>> *
>>
>> *
>
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Firestar project for sale, $2000 |
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
Looked at a wrecked Firestar today, it was built in 1987, 5 rib wing. 300 hours
more or less, airframe and engine. Rotax 447, single ignition, wood prop in good
condition.
Hit hard on the nose and mains, sheared the rivits that hold the top of the gear
ring to the main tube and the gear ring detached from the tube & folded back.
The longeron tubes at the lift strut attachment point are all crumpled, the
gear legs look able to be straightened, and the gear sleeve tubes do not appear
to be bent. All it basically needs is a new cage to built. Called Travis, Kolb
will make you one for $3500. If I didn't already have a Kolb, I would jump
on this, and make a new cage myself, using the old one for a template & parts.
It might be possible to use part of the present cage, specifically the top tube
with the motor mounts and the rear verticals. In any event, I think there
is enough of the present cage left to straighten out and use as a template to
build a new one, assuming you are good with gas welding.
Wings, boom tube and tail assy. appear to be undamaged. The lift strut tang under
the left wing is bent, that is why the wings have anhedral. There are some
wrinkles in the fabric on the underside of the left elevator, but they do not
appear related to the crash.
Has a BRS parachute, the aluminum case is squashed, but the chute appears undamaged.
A good candidate to transfer into a soft bag for a hand toss chute, would
count towards getting the weight into legal U/L range.
It has brakes and some instruments, functionality unknown.
Cosmetics of the paint on the wings, boom and tail is excellent. Aircraft is located
5 miles South of Abingdon, VA.
If interested, email bpbuchanan(at)centurylink.net or call 276 -628 -3604
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
"Living for your own pleasure is the least pleasurable thing a man can do.
If his neighbors don't kill him in disgust he will die slowly of boredom and
powerlessness." - Joy Davidman
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | MK III - New Nose |
| From: | "Larlaeb" <larlaeb(at)gmail.com> |
Damaged my nose cone and since a new one was not available I had to make one from
scratch. Obviously changed the look a bit and I'm not sure if I'm happy with
it yet or not.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439470#439470
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/newnose_900.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK III - New Nose |
| From: | Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> |
Well it is a bit different, but that's not to say that one wouldn't get
used to it. Perhaps you should rename the plane to "Woody" . It does have
that penetrating look. You just need a Walter Lanz sound track to go with
it when landing. :-)
Larry
On Tue, Mar 17, 2015 at 10:03 AM, Larlaeb wrote:
>
> Damaged my nose cone and since a new one was not available I had to make
> one from scratch. Obviously changed the look a bit and I'm not sure if I'm
> happy with it yet or not.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439470#439470
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/newnose_900.jpg
>
>
--
*If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
address before sending.*
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK III - New Nose |
| From: | "Larlaeb" <larlaeb(at)gmail.com> |
You think maybe some eyes and a more 'beak' like color scheme might help? :)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439477#439477
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pcking" <pc.king(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: MK III - New Nose - Nice Job |
What's wrong with it. It looks factory. You did a nice job. I wouldn't
change a thing.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larlaeb" <larlaeb(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2015 1:00 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: MK III - New Nose
>
> You think maybe some eyes and a more 'beak' like color scheme might help?
> :)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439477#439477
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK III - New Nose - Nice Job |
| From: | "west1m" <west1m(at)hotmail.com> |
Looks Great! any picts of the building process?
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439479#439479
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pcking" <pc.king(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: MK III - New Nose - Nice Job |
Did you keep the mold?
You aren't the last person who will want a new nose.
----- Original Message -----
From: "west1m" <west1m(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2015 1:19 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: MK III - New Nose - Nice Job
>
> Looks Great! any picts of the building process?
>
> --------
> West1m
> Hastings, MN
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439479#439479
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK III - New Nose |
| From: | Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> |
I guess it just depends on how brave you are. Apparently we are the only
ones who watched cartoons as a kid. At least in that time frame. It does
look good, just a bit perkier than the factory.
Larry
On Tue, Mar 17, 2015 at 11:00 AM, Larlaeb wrote:
>
> You think maybe some eyes and a more 'beak' like color scheme might help?
> :)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439477#439477
>
>
--
*If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
address before sending.*
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK III - New Nose - Nice Job |
| From: | "Larlaeb" <larlaeb(at)gmail.com> |
Unfortunately most of my pictures of this process were lost when my phone was destroyed
(another unrelated story). I didn't use a plug or a mold. Not to say
it was the right way but this was done with three pieces of flat fiberglass
sheet, a small piece of foam, two pieces of PVC (removed after use), some pop
rivets (also removed), some fiberglass tape, resin, filler and paint. I do have
a few pics that I will post when I can pull them together.
Thanks,
Allan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439483#439483
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: FireFly Page Is Back UP |
| From: | "fxflyr" <tommy(at)priorart.com> |
Hello Jack Hart. Thank you for your FireFly page. I am the owner of FireFly 0058.
It is without an engine right now as thieves took the Rotax 447 before I got
it. I am now in process of getting a Hirth 2702 installed by Matt Dandridge
at Rec Power. Your pages are just so interesting and filled with great ideas and
skills well demonstrated. One day I would like to meet you. Tommy
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439484#439484
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pcking" <pc.king(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: MK III - New Nose - Nice Job |
That sounds like a quick build.
The story would be worth telling.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larlaeb" <larlaeb(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2015 2:43 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: MK III - New Nose - Nice Job
>
> Unfortunately most of my pictures of this process were lost when my phone
> was destroyed (another unrelated story). I didn't use a plug or a mold.
> Not to say it was the right way but this was done with three pieces of
> flat fiberglass sheet, a small piece of foam, two pieces of PVC (removed
> after use), some pop rivets (also removed), some fiberglass tape, resin,
> filler and paint. I do have a few pics that I will post when I can pull
> them together.
>
> Thanks,
> Allan
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439483#439483
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator Aircraft Configuration For Kolb |
| From: | "Larlaeb" <larlaeb(at)gmail.com> |
I have one for a Firefly on Microsoft X. I don't remember where I got it but pretty
sure it was a download from a search I did for Kolb on Google.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439487#439487
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: New (free) Aviation App |
| From: | "gbrasch" <gmbrasch(at)gmail.com> |
I still get a lot of questions on how to download the Airport Courtesy Cars app
on an iPad. So here are some simple instructions on how to do so. The app is
approaching 1400 car listings with over 6,400 pilots that have downloaded the
app. Glenn
Go to the app store on your iPad,
Click the search box and search for Airport Courtesy Cars,
The search will not show any results, however when the search is complete a bar
of menus will appear along the top of the page,
The very first one on the left says "Ipad only",
Click it to show a drop down menu,
Choose "iPhone only" and Airport Courtesy Cars" will be displayed, and you can
download the app.
--------
Glenn Brasch
RV-9A Flying
1952 Piper Tri-Pacer
Medevac Helicopter Pilot (Ret)
Tucson, Arizona
Owner, www.RVairspace.com and "Airport Courtesy Cars" Smart Phone App
www.RVairspace.com
Read this topic online here:
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK III - New Nose - Nice Job |
| From: | "Larlaeb" <larlaeb(at)gmail.com> |
Here are a few pictures and a description of the process.
1. I drew a template of the existing instrument panel shape and transferred that
to the fiberglass sheet and cut it out. I then attached some tabs for the
top and sides to attach to.
2. I clamped the template to the appropriate place on the frame.
3. I fixed two pieces of PVC tubing about 1 inch in diameter along the bottom
of the frame representing the bottom edges of where the nose needed to go. Make
sure these are at the angle you want the bottom of your nose to be.
4. I bent a sheet of fiberglass over the panel template and riveted it to the
pvc and the tabs on the panel.
5. I did not use a template for the front. Just made sure it was an even curve.
The front will be open at this point.
6. I did the same thing to the bottom sheet.
7. I sanded the edges so they merged with the PVC pretty well.
8. Coated the PVC with mold release wax. The edges of the fiber glass sheet need
to be left smooth so that a layer of fiberglass will stick but not stick too
well. Don't fasten down the edges of this tape. I had no trouble with this
but this outside layer will need to be peeled off.
9. Once you have shape you want, lay up one layer of fiber glass over the PVC
lapping over the panels an inch or so. (This layer will be removed)
10. Once that setups up drill out the rivets and remove the pvc tubing.
11. Layup fiberglass inside the cone using the thin outside layer to give you
a smooth radius.
12. Once that has setup, Peel off the outside layer. (You should be able to remove
the cone from the frame at this point.
13. Fill and sand the joints smooth.
14. Take a small block of foam (you can build this up from a few thin pieces)
and attach it to the open front. I carved the back of the block to fit the hole
and left a gap in a few places to run strips of fiberglass from the inside
of the nose to the outside of the foam plug.
15. Sand the foam to the shape you want and then glass the outside overlapping
the pieces already there. Edges should done by creating a 'lip' along the bottom
(see photo) that the top can make a good joint with. Then fill and round
out with lightweight filler.
16. Fair it and paint it.
17. I removed the front nose attachment and used tabs welded to the front of the
cage that attached to a Z shaped lip within the cone. Pretty easy to reach
from inside and invisible from the exterior. This is not necessary however and
you can use the old attach points.
Hope that makes some sense and I'm remembering all the steps. It was actually
easier than it sounds I think. Note that to use fiberglass on foam you will
need to use epoxy as the polyester stuff will melt it.
Thanks,
Allan
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pi Day Flight |
| From: | "west1m" <west1m(at)hotmail.com> |
OOOPs, you took off 10 minutes late!
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439612#439612
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Riveting question? |
list
What is the(desired) length of the rivets that are used to fasten
the drag strut gussett to the spar tube? There is the plate thickness,
the spar tube thickness and the H section thickness to deal with...
Obviously I can call my buds at Kolb tomorrow...but would like to
order tonight...Lots of Stainless 1/8th rivets on ebay...and yes I know
I can always use overly long ones... Herb
ps rebuilding the Firestar wings that I got from Rev. Pike...
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Riveting question? |
| From: | "west1m" <west1m(at)hotmail.com> |
maybe this helps,
I have a complete set of plans and the book for Firestar
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439749#439749
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dragstrut_124.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Riveting question? |
| From: | "west1m" <west1m(at)hotmail.com> |
here is another pic
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439751#439751
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dragstrut2_134.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Riveting question? |
Thanks...but guess I did not make it clear...it is the drag strut
fitting plates, which attach the strut to the Spar tube and into the H
section..at the lift strut attach area... There are two gussets; the
thick one on the bottom of the wing and the curved thin one on the
side.. Herb
On 03/22/2015 09:57 PM, west1m wrote:
>
> here is another pic
>
> --------
> West1m
> Hastings, MN
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439751#439751
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/dragstrut2_134.jpg
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mojavjoe(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Re: Riveting question? |
hurb
my plans call for 1/8 1/8 steel rivets on the side gusset and 1/8 1/4=C2-
steel rivets on the bottom, these should be steel and not stainless
mojavjoe=C2-
----- Original Message -----
From: "Herb" <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2015 8:03:56 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Riveting question?
Thanks...but guess I did not make it clear...it is the drag strut
fitting plates, which =C2-attach the strut =C2-to the Spar tube and int
o the H
section..at the lift strut attach area... There are two gussets; the
thick one on the bottom of the wing and the curved thin one on the
side.. Herb
On 03/22/2015 09:57 PM, west1m wrote:
>
> here is another pic
>
> --------
> West1m
> Hastings, MN
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439751#439751
>
>
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/dragstrut2_134.jpg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
===========
===========
MS -
===========
e -
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2--Matt Dralle, List Admin.
===========
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Riveting question? |
Thanks...
Wondering if the steel rivets are stronger in shear? Herb
On 03/23/2015 07:15 AM, mojavjoe(at)comcast.net wrote:
> hurb
> my plans call for 1/8 1/8 steel rivets on the side gusset and 1/8
> 1/4 steel rivets on the bottom, these should be steel and not stainless
> mojavjoe
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From: *"Herb" <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
> *To: *"kolb-list"
> *Sent: *Monday, March 23, 2015 8:03:56 AM
> *Subject: *Re: Kolb-List: Re: Riveting question?
>
>
> Thanks...but guess I did not make it clear...it is the drag strut
> fitting plates, which attach the strut to the Spar tube and into the H
> section..at the lift strut attach area... There are two gussets; the
> thick one on the bottom of the wing and the curved thin one on the
> side.. Herb
>
> On 03/22/2015 09:57 PM, west1m wrote:
> >
> > here is another pic
> >
> > --------
> > West1m
> > Hastings, MN
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439751#439751
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Attachments:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com//files/dragstrut2_134.jpg
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> &nbs================
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Riveting question? |
| From: | B Young <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com> |
My mk 3 plans show. 1/8 x1/4 rivets on 1/2 in spacing. Where drag strut
gusset attaches to Wing spar into H section my H section is uninstall
chrome Molly steel. If you have thick wall aluminium H section you will
probably need longer.
Boyd Young
On Mar 23, 2015 6:19 AM, wrote:
> hurb
> my plans call for 1/8 1/8 steel rivets on the side gusset and 1/8
> 1/4 steel rivets on the bottom, these should be steel and not stainless
> mojavjoe
>
> ------------------------------
> *From: *"Herb" <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
> *To: *"kolb-list"
> *Sent: *Monday, March 23, 2015 8:03:56 AM
> *Subject: *Re: Kolb-List: Re: Riveting question?
>
>
> Thanks...but guess I did not make it clear...it is the drag strut
> fitting plates, which attach the strut to the Spar tube and into the H
> section..at the lift strut attach area... There are two gussets; the
> thick one on the bottom of the wing and the curved thin one on the
> side.. Herb
>
> On 03/22/2015 09:57 PM, west1m wrote:
> >
> > here is another pic
> >
> > --------
> > West1m
> > Hastings, MN
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439751#439751
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Attachments:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com//files/dragstrut2_134.jpg
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> &nbs================
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Riveting question? |
| From: | B Young <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com> |
Steel would be stronger than aluminum. But I don't know between steel and
stainless steel. The stainless steel won't rust. All the pulled rivets
in my kit were stainless
Boyd
On Mar 23, 2015 7:10 AM, "Herb" wrote:
> Thanks...
>
> Wondering if the steel rivets are stronger in shear? Herb
>
> On 03/23/2015 07:15 AM, mojavjoe(at)comcast.net wrote:
>
> hurb
> my plans call for 1/8 1/8 steel rivets on the side gusset and 1/8
> 1/4 steel rivets on the bottom, these should be steel and not stainless
> mojavjoe
>
> ------------------------------
> *From: *"Herb" <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
> *To: *"kolb-list"
> *Sent: *Monday, March 23, 2015 8:03:56 AM
> *Subject: *Re: Kolb-List: Re: Riveting question?
>
>
> Thanks...but guess I did not make it clear...it is the drag strut
> fitting plates, which attach the strut to the Spar tube and into the H
> section..at the lift strut attach area... There are two gussets; the
> thick one on the bottom of the wing and the curved thin one on the
> side.. Herb
>
> On 03/22/2015 09:57 PM, west1m wrote:
>
> >
> > here is another pic
> >
> > --------
> > West1m
> > Hastings, MN
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439751#439751
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Attachments:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com//files/dragstrut2_134.jpg
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> &nbs================
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Riveting question? |
These H sections are cro molly...
I am rebuilding a set of wings...In the case of one wing the drag
strut gussets were torn out and the root rib sustained damage and I
replaced most of the ribs..... just a matter of match hole drilling a
new set of gussets...I have the match hole strap "tool"...and it should
work well..
Should be ready to cover in a day or so.. 7 rib Firestar wings.. They
will be covered and in silver , ready to paint,,and will probably be
for sale at a later date......Lift struts included..
I may try them on my "new to me" Firefly first......when and if I
make it to Conn. to retrieve it... Any ideas as to how these wings
might work on the Fly?
Herb (heading to Fastenal )
On 03/23/2015 08:54 AM, B Young wrote:
>
> My mk 3 plans show. 1/8 x1/4 rivets on 1/2 in spacing. Where drag
> strut gusset attaches to Wing spar into H section my H section is
> uninstall chrome Molly steel. If you have thick wall aluminium H
> section you will probably need longer.
> Boyd Young
>
> On Mar 23, 2015 6:19 AM, > wrote:
>
> hurb
> my plans call for 1/8 1/8 steel rivets on the side gusset and 1/8
> 1/4 steel rivets on the bottom, these should be steel and not
> stainless
> mojavjoe
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From: *"Herb" <Herbgh(at)nctc.com <mailto:Herbgh(at)nctc.com>>
> *To: *"kolb-list" >
> *Sent: *Monday, March 23, 2015 8:03:56 AM
> *Subject: *Re: Kolb-List: Re: Riveting question?
>
> >
>
> Thanks...but guess I did not make it clear...it is the drag strut
> fitting plates, which attach the strut to the Spar tube and into
> the H
> section..at the lift strut attach area... There are two gussets; the
> thick one on the bottom of the wing and the curved thin one on the
> side.. Herb
>
> On 03/22/2015 09:57 PM, west1m wrote:
> >
> >
> > here is another pic
> >
> > --------
> > West1m
> > Hastings, MN
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439751#439751
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Attachments:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com//files/dragstrut2_134.jpg
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> &nbs================
>
>
> *
>
> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
> tp://forums.matronics.com
> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Riveting question? |
As I recall...the early Kolbs used steel rivets...and they worked very
well..and the galvanic corrosion was not a problem as some thought...I
rebuilt a MkIII and Ultrastar and both used steel rivets..Herb
On 03/23/2015 09:09 AM, B Young wrote:
>
> Steel would be stronger than aluminum. But I don't know between
> steel and stainless steel. The stainless steel won't rust. All
> the pulled rivets in my kit were stainless
> Boyd
>
> On Mar 23, 2015 7:10 AM, "Herb" > wrote:
>
> Thanks...
>
> Wondering if the steel rivets are stronger in shear? Herb
>
> On 03/23/2015 07:15 AM, mojavjoe(at)comcast.net
> wrote:
>> hurb
>> my plans call for 1/8 1/8 steel rivets on the side gusset and 1/8
>> 1/4 steel rivets on the bottom, these should be steel and not
>> stainless
>> mojavjoe
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> *From: *"Herb" <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> <mailto:Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
>> *To: *"kolb-list"
>>
>> *Sent: *Monday, March 23, 2015 8:03:56 AM
>> *Subject: *Re: Kolb-List: Re: Riveting question?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks...but guess I did not make it clear...it is the drag strut
>> fitting plates, which attach the strut to the Spar tube and
>> into the H
>> section..at the lift strut attach area... There are two gussets; the
>> thick one on the bottom of the wing and the curved thin one on the
>> side.. Herb
>>
>> On 03/22/2015 09:57 PM, west1m wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > here is another pic
>> >
>> > --------
>> > West1m
>> > Hastings, MN
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Read this topic online here:
>> >
>> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439751#439751
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Attachments:
>> >
>> > http://forums.matronics.com//files/dragstrut2_134.jpg
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> &nbs================
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *
>>
>>
>> *
>
> *
>
> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
> tp://forums.matronics.com
> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Auto Pilot for less than 100 bucks... |
On another subject....
spent my career in the computer business...Hardware and little
software...too little software...for computer hardware is sold like
candy bars...and the real emphasis is in programming..
always interested in computers...built my first one in the
1970's...Motorolla 6800 chip..running at a blazing 1 mhz...:-) 1 k of
memory...hot stuff!!!
that said....I bought two credit card sized computers...one called
Ardunio and the other is a Raspberry Pi... The Ardunio has had many
additional plug "on" logic boards built for it...One of interest is
called the 10DOF...It encompasses a three axis accelerometer.. three
axis gyroscope.. a compass(magnetometer) and a barometer that can serve
as an altimeter... GPs boards are also available.
I believe that many of the "so called" drones use a similar device
that can be bought from hobby shops.. for a lot more money...the 10dof
cost about 30 bucks...and Chinese clones(9DOF) sell for 12 or so...The
Ardunio knock off's sell for 8 bucks...I bought the Fundunio...:-) All
to be found on Ebay.... Lots of canned software....and much info on You
tube..and elsewhere..
Pretty sure the C band satellite servo's , available from your
neighbors yard for free would have enough power to operate trim tabs..
Or large hobby ones..for more money..
wondering if anyone else has thought of trying one on a Kolb...with
strong servo's on the trim tabs...it should be possible to fly long
distances with minimal input...naturally, rough air would throw it
off...and cause gyrations as happens on "real planes" with auto pilots
...:-) Herb
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Riveting question? |
Most steels are stronger than stainless. Stainless is usually 'tougher',
but has less strength than high carbon steel. If you do a little
googling, you can find charts that show both shear and tension strength
of rivets all kinds & materials.
I fly heavier (won't say 'bigger' to avoid offending John H) homebuilts,
and in that world, most of us are pretty careful about deviating from
the designer's instructions in structural areas. There can even be
situations where 'stronger' may actually increase risk of failure in the
overall structure, so following the designer's specs is the safest path,
unless we are at least as qualified at engineering as he was. :-)
Charlie
On 3/23/2015 9:09 AM, B Young wrote:
>
> Steel would be stronger than aluminum. But I don't know between
> steel and stainless steel. The stainless steel won't rust. All
> the pulled rivets in my kit were stainless
> Boyd
>
> On Mar 23, 2015 7:10 AM, "Herb" > wrote:
>
> Thanks...
>
> Wondering if the steel rivets are stronger in shear? Herb
>
> On 03/23/2015 07:15 AM, mojavjoe(at)comcast.net
> wrote:
>> hurb
>> my plans call for 1/8 1/8 steel rivets on the side gusset and 1/8
>> 1/4 steel rivets on the bottom, these should be steel and not
>> stainless
>> mojavjoe
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> *From: *"Herb" <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> <mailto:Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
>> *To: *"kolb-list"
>>
>> *Sent: *Monday, March 23, 2015 8:03:56 AM
>> *Subject: *Re: Kolb-List: Re: Riveting question?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks...but guess I did not make it clear...it is the drag strut
>> fitting plates, which attach the strut to the Spar tube and
>> into the H
>> section..at the lift strut attach area... There are two gussets; the
>> thick one on the bottom of the wing and the curved thin one on the
>> side.. Herb
>>
>> On 03/22/2015 09:57 PM, west1m wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > here is another pic
>> >
>> > --------
>> > West1m
>> > Hastings, MN
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Read this topic online here:
>> >
>> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439751#439751
>> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Auto Pilot for less than 100 bucks... |
| From: | "t41pilot" <t41pilot(at)frontier.com> |
Back when I was building my firefly, I thought of installing electric trim for
an elevator tab. I did some research on RC servos and wind loads. I took worst
case scenarios for a trim tab at 90 degrees to the airflow and found that sail
winch servos for boats had more than enough torque to do the job. I came up
with a circuit using a 555 timer and a bargraph to show position of the trim tab
(assuming no mechanical failure of the linkage). I never installed the system
though so have no actual flight data but in theory it could work. Arduino
already has sketches for servos and 10dof sensors since robots have become so
prolific, so I'm sure if you put your mind to it, it could be done. I have used
arduino circuits in my plane in other capacities such as strobe lights and capacitive
fuel indicator with a bargraph. I'm just installing the arduino version
fuel indicator now. My analog version worked just fine but I got bored over
the winter and had to invent a new one with a larger, brighter display. My circuits
for the plane as well as links to my Youtube videos can be found on my
web page.
http://myplace.frontier.com/~t41pilot/index.html
--------
Gregg Kaat
2011 Firefly
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439798#439798
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Firefly Serenity web site |
| From: | "Airknocker" <airknocker(at)harnerfarm.net> |
Hi Everybody,
Here is a link to my new web site about building a Firefly Quick Build Kit.
http://harnerfarm.net/serenity/serenity.html
It contains quite a few photos with descriptions from the build process. There
were some times that I got so busy building that I forgot to take pictures. Also,
there is a complete copy of my builder's log.
Under videos there is just the one of my first landing. It appears in several formats
and it is kind of hard to see, but it is all I had. Hopefully, as I get
back to flying, I will be able to post more videos and flying reports.
This is a work in progress so if there is anything you would like to see added,
please let me know.
Thanks for looking,
Stuart
--------
"I don't care, I'm still free. You can't take the sky from me" - Josh
Wedon
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439836#439836
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Things are warming up in Minnesota |
| From: | "dcharter" <dpcharter1(at)gmail.com> |
You gotta go by what your sparkplugs read. Use your gauges for set points. In my
limited experience, that spike is a false reading from the way the pipe is tuned.
I'm not in any way telling you to stay at that throttle setting. I miss
my original firestar when it warms up in MN.
Dan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439909#439909
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Part 103 legal Firestar? |
| From: | "dcharter" <dpcharter1(at)gmail.com> |
My original firestar weighed in at 330lbs, ,377with an A box, 5 gal tank, brakes.
Dan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439910#439910
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: New (free) Aviation App |
| From: | "gbrasch" <gmbrasch(at)gmail.com> |
I can now insert photos of your courtesy cars into the app listings. Feel free
to email me your photos, and please be sure to indicate in the title of the email
the airport ID and/or city location, and if there is more than one FBO, which
one the car is located at. The app has broken 1400 locations nationwide.
Thanks, Glenn Email to airportcars101(at)gmail.com
--------
Glenn Brasch
RV-9A Flying
1952 Piper Tri-Pacer
Medevac Helicopter Pilot (Ret)
Tucson, Arizona
Owner, www.RVairspace.com and "Airport Courtesy Cars" Smart Phone App. Over 1400 cars nationwide.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439938#439938
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Kolb Mk III Classic for sale |
| From: | "Watkinsdw" <david.watkins0(at)gmail.com> |
Hi, Kolb List-ers,
I'm offering my 2001 Mk III for sale. It is in excellent condition, comes with
many extras, and has always been hangared.
It was built by Steven Green- has a Rotax 912ULS 100hp powerplant plus BRS, Mode
C Txpdr, Intercom, Handheld, Garmin 396 and ANR headsets.
TT 760 hours.
If the weather cooperates, it can be seen at S&F this year.
I'll hold off placing it on Barnstormers for a week or so, in case one of our own
wants to talk about it before I do so.
Please contact me off-list.
Asking $23,500.
Thanks,
Dave
david.watkins0(at)gmail.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440016#440016
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/kolb_mk_iii_207.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | keith coddington <kac_86(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Mk III Classic for sale |
thanks but im not looking to buy. =C2-I have fire star, just looking.
On Sunday, March 29, 2015 5:34 PM, Watkinsdw wrote:
Hi, Kolb List-ers,
I'm offering my 2001 Mk III for sale. It is in excellent condition, comes w
ith many extras, and has always been hangared.
It was built by Steven Green-=C2- has a Rotax 912ULS 100hp powerplant plu
s BRS, Mode C Txpdr, Intercom, Handheld, Garmin 396 and ANR headsets.
TT 760 hours.
If the weather cooperates, it can be seen at S&F this year.=C2-
I'll hold off placing it on Barnstormers for a week or so, in case one of o
ur own wants to talk about it before I do so.
Please contact me off-list.
Asking $23,500.
Thanks,
Dave
david.watkins0(at)gmail.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440016#440016
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/kolb_mk_iii_207.jpg
S -
-
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com> |
I bought a wrecked MK 111 classic that I am rebuilding. I have the original builders
manual but it doesn't contain any info about installing and hooking up the
controls that are between the seats, like the elevator cables, throttle, and
trim. Is there a separate manual for this kind of stuff?
Thanks
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440179#440179
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
Yep. I ought to scan it and post it online as a reference, but in the meantime,
here's these:
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440186#440186
Attachments:
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com> |
Thanks Richard. I think I will call Travis and see if I can get the entire manual.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440223#440223
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
If he doesn't have it, let me know, I will see about getting it posted on my web
page.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440224#440224
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gliderx5(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Latex Paint Forum at Sun N Fun |
Hi Fellow Kolbers,
I will be presenting the Latex Paint forum at this years Sun N Fun flyin in Lakeland,
FL. It will be on Tuesday the 21st at noon in classroom 11. I will be flying
down from PA with a friend in his Aerotrek and will be helping out at the
Aerotrek display also. Hope to meet some of you there.
Malcolm Morrison
www.wienerdogaero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Latex Paint Forum at Sun N Fun |
Kolbers:
I plan to fly Miss P'fer, my MKIII, to Sun and Fun 2015. If I make it
to Lakeland it will be my 32d consecutive visit.
The Kolb Gang has graciously offered me and Miss P'fer a corner of their
display area to live in for the week. Kolb display is located on the
left as you enter the main gate at Paradise City.
Hope to see a bunch of you all down there.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
I will be presenting the Latex Paint forum at this years Sun N Fun flyin
in Lakeland, FL. It will be on Tuesday the 21st at noon in classroom 11.
I will be flying down from PA with a friend in his Aerotrek and will be
helping out at the Aerotrek display also. Hope to meet some of you
there.
Malcolm Morrison
www.wienerdogaero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com> |
Ok Richard, thanks
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440262#440262
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
Probably be next week, busy right now.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440264#440264
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Latex Paint Forum at Sun N Fun |
Have a good trip John. As a non flyer now I have the next best thing
coming up this afternoon. I am booked in for a Simulator flight at a
local airfield. A poor substitute but there you go. Pat
From: John Hauck
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 12:07 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Latex Paint Forum at Sun N Fun
Kolbers:
I plan to fly Miss P'fer, my MKIII, to Sun and Fun 2015. If I make it
to Lakeland it will be my 32d consecutive visit.
The Kolb Gang has graciously offered me and Miss P'fer a corner of their
display area to live in for the week. Kolb display is located on the
left as you enter the main gate at Paradise City.
Hope to see a bunch of you all down there.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
I will be presenting the Latex Paint forum at this years Sun N Fun flyin
in Lakeland, FL. It will be on Tuesday the 21st at noon in classroom 11.
I will be flying down from PA with a friend in his Aerotrek and will be
helping out at the Aerotrek display also. Hope to meet some of you
there.
Malcolm Morrison
www.wienerdogaero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Latex Paint Forum at Sun N Fun |
Patrick:
I certainly remember your trip to Sun and Fun, and also to Monument
Valley. Those were some very good years. Never thought they would end.
john h
MKIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Ladd
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 3:43 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Latex Paint Forum at Sun N Fun
Have a good trip John. As a non flyer now I have the next best thing
coming up this afternoon. I am booked in for a Simulator flight at a
local airfield. A poor substitute but there you go. Pat
From: John Hauck <mailto:jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 12:07 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Latex Paint Forum at Sun N Fun
Kolbers:
I plan to fly Miss P'fer, my MKIII, to Sun and Fun 2015. If I make it
to Lakeland it will be my 32d consecutive visit.
The Kolb Gang has graciously offered me and Miss P'fer a corner of their
display area to live in for the week. Kolb display is located on the
left as you enter the main gate at Paradise City.
Hope to see a bunch of you all down there.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
I will be presenting the Latex Paint forum at this years Sun N Fun flyin
in Lakeland, FL. It will be on Tuesday the 21st at noon in classroom 11.
I will be flying down from PA with a friend in his Aerotrek and will be
helping out at the Aerotrek display also. Hope to meet some of you
there.
Malcolm Morrison
www.wienerdogaero.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Latex Paint Forum at Sun N Fun |
John. Terrible news. Went for my simulator flight yesterday in a Piper
Arrow. Shot two circuits and missed the blood runway each time and
pancaked in a field. Instructors said I was ``a little rusty.` It was
disgraceful. I shall have to check out a real plane just to prove to
myself that I can still do it. Hanging my head in shame. Pat
From: John Hauck
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 3:13 PM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Latex Paint Forum at Sun N Fun
Patrick:
I certainly remember your trip to Sun and Fun, and also to Monument
Valley. Those were some very good years. Never thought they would end.
john h
MKIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Ladd
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 3:43 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Latex Paint Forum at Sun N Fun
Have a good trip John. As a non flyer now I have the next best thing
coming up this afternoon. I am booked in for a Simulator flight at a
local airfield. A poor substitute but there you go. Pat
From: John Hauck
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 12:07 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Latex Paint Forum at Sun N Fun
Kolbers:
I plan to fly Miss P'fer, my MKIII, to Sun and Fun 2015. If I make it
to Lakeland it will be my 32d consecutive visit.
The Kolb Gang has graciously offered me and Miss P'fer a corner of their
display area to live in for the week. Kolb display is located on the
left as you enter the main gate at Paradise City.
Hope to see a bunch of you all down there.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
I will be presenting the Latex Paint forum at this years Sun N Fun flyin
in Lakeland, FL. It will be on Tuesday the 21st at noon in classroom 11.
I will be flying down from PA with a friend in his Aerotrek and will be
helping out at the Aerotrek display also. Hope to meet some of you
there.
Malcolm Morrison
www.wienerdogaero.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Kolb-Listhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://foru
ms.matronics.comhref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www
.matronics.com/c - The Kolb-List Email Forum - -->
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stuart Harner" <stuart(at)harnerfarm.net> |
| Subject: | Confidence building flight |
Hi everyone,
Managed to get out last evening and un-winterize the Firefly. It started on
the first pull!
Made two fast taxi trips up to flying speed, then took off for real. There
was a little wind shear turbulence at 2 to 4 hundred feet, but it was light.
Made it around just fine, but got a little high. Used a little slip on
final to take care of that and kept some throttle on all the way down.
Rounded out the descent and planted it firmly on two wheels with no bounce.
So much fun I did it again. Same results.
Now it is time to get serious and fly, fly, fly.
Happy Easter!
S
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Confidence building flight |
Way to go Stuart!! Frosty morn down here in Ky... Fred and I will
always feel a part of your flying...
did you remove the electric start?
someone may had said...the engine will break in noticeably in the 40
hour range... Herb
ps anyone know anything about installing a VW on a Kolb?? :-)
On 04/05/2015 08:09 AM, Stuart Harner wrote:
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> Managed to get out last evening and un-winterize the Firefly. It
> started on the first pull!
>
> Made two fast taxi trips up to flying speed, then took off for real.
> There was a little wind shear turbulence at 2 to 4 hundred feet, but
> it was light. Made it around just fine, but got a little high. Used
> a little slip on final to take care of that and kept some throttle on
> all the way down. Rounded out the descent and planted it firmly on two
> wheels with no bounce.
>
> So much fun I did it again. Same results.
>
> Now it is time to get serious and fly, fly, fly.
>
> Happy Easter!
>
> S
>
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Confidence building flight |
| From: | Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com> |
Taxi trips to flying speed aren't recommended for new or rusty pilots.
Without a aggressive forward stick movement as the throttle is retarded
will result in the aircraft lifting off with little power.
Herb, yes there are a growing number of VWs on Kolbs.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW powered MKIIIC
On Sun, Apr 5, 2015 at 9:40 AM, Herb wrote:
> Way to go Stuart!! Frosty morn down here in Ky... Fred and I will always
> feel a part of your flying...
>
> did you remove the electric start?
>
> someone may had said...the engine will break in noticeably in the 40
> hour range... Herb
>
> ps anyone know anything about installing a VW on a Kolb?? :-)
>
> On 04/05/2015 08:09 AM, Stuart Harner wrote:
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
> Managed to get out last evening and un-winterize the Firefly. It started
> on the first pull!
>
>
> Made two fast taxi trips up to flying speed, then took off for real.
> There was a little wind shear turbulence at 2 to 4 hundred feet, but it was
> light. Made it around just fine, but got a little high. Used a little
> slip on final to take care of that and kept some throttle on all the way
> down. Rounded out the descent and planted it firmly on two wheels with no
> bounce.
>
>
> So much fun I did it again. Same results.
>
>
> Now it is time to get serious and fly, fly, fly.
>
>
> Happy Easter!
>
>
> S
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stuart Harner" <stuart(at)harnerfarm.net> |
| Subject: | Confidence building flight |
No, you kept the started and installed the recoil unit.
I start the cold engine by squeezing the bulb until gas gets to carb,
then
two shots of primer into port on carb, throttle closed, enricher to
full.
Pull rope, engine starts.
Thanks for the great deal on this engine Herb, I really like it.
One thing I have found is that if I start it and let it warm up (CHT at
200=B0
+) while standing beside it, I can shut it off, get all strapped in and
then
start it up again from the seat. This is a nice feature to not be
trying to
get into a running plane. I tried it cold, but could not get enough pull
to
get it to start. Better leverage standing up with my left hand on the
leading edge.
More to come!
Stuart
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Herb
Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 8:40 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Confidence building flight
Way to go Stuart!! Frosty morn down here in Ky... Fred and I will
always
feel a part of your flying...
did you remove the electric start?
someone may had said...the engine will break in noticeably in the 40
hour
range... Herb
ps anyone know anything about installing a VW on a Kolb?? :-)
On 04/05/2015 08:09 AM, Stuart Harner wrote:
Hi everyone,
Managed to get out last evening and un-winterize the Firefly. It
started on
the first pull!
Made two fast taxi trips up to flying speed, then took off for real.
There
was a little wind shear turbulence at 2 to 4 hundred feet, but it was
light.
Made it around just fine, but got a little high. Used a little slip on
final to take care of that and kept some throttle on all the way down.
Rounded out the descent and planted it firmly on two wheels with no
bounce.
So much fun I did it again. Same results.
Now it is time to get serious and fly, fly, fly.
Happy Easter!
S
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Confidence building flight |
Rick:
How are we doing on VW powered Kolbs, number wise?
I was up at the Kolb Co a couple weeks ago. There was a VW powered
MKIII in the process of final build.
Don't know of any VW powered airplanes, Kolbs or not, in my neck of the
woods.
Heard there is a VW powered MKIII in Idaho, in the building process.
I'm grounded until I get my main gear mounts and legs back from Kolb.
Hoping for next week. Only two weeks until time to fly to Lakeland.
My how time flies when one is getting older.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Neilsen
Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 9:51 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Confidence building flight
Taxi trips to flying speed aren't recommended for new or rusty pilots.
Without a aggressive forward stick movement as the throttle is retarded
will result in the aircraft lifting off with little power.
Herb, yes there are a growing number of VWs on Kolbs.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW powered MKIIIC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Confidence building flight |
Now I am wondering what I did with it??? Forgetful old fart , Herb
On 04/05/2015 10:18 AM, Stuart Harner wrote:
>
> No, you kept the started and installed the recoil unit.
>
> I start the cold engine by squeezing the bulb until gas gets to carb,
> then two shots of primer into port on carb, throttle closed, enricher
> to full. Pull rope, engine starts.
>
> Thanks for the great deal on this engine Herb, I really like it.
>
> One thing I have found is that if I start it and let it warm up (CHT
> at 200 +) while standing beside it, I can shut it off, get all
> strapped in and then start it up again from the seat. This is a nice
> feature to not be trying to get into a running plane. I tried it cold,
> but could not get enough pull to get it to start. Better leverage
> standing up with my left hand on the leading edge.
>
> More to come!
>
> Stuart
>
> *From:*owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Herb
> *Sent:* Sunday, April 05, 2015 8:40 AM
> *To:* kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Kolb-List: Confidence building flight
>
> Way to go Stuart!! Frosty morn down here in Ky... Fred and I will
> always feel a part of your flying...
>
> did you remove the electric start?
>
> someone may had said...the engine will break in noticeably in the 40
> hour range... Herb
>
> ps anyone know anything about installing a VW on a Kolb?? :-)
>
> On 04/05/2015 08:09 AM, Stuart Harner wrote:
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> Managed to get out last evening and un-winterize the Firefly. It
> started on the first pull!
>
> Made two fast taxi trips up to flying speed, then took off for
> real. There was a little wind shear turbulence at 2 to 4 hundred
> feet, but it was light. Made it around just fine, but got a little
> high. Used a little slip on final to take care of that and kept
> some throttle on all the way down. Rounded out the descent and
> planted it firmly on two wheels with no bounce.
>
> So much fun I did it again. Same results.
>
> Now it is time to get serious and fly, fly, fly.
>
> Happy Easter!
>
> S
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *Matronics List Features Navigator to & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, -->http://www.matronic=================
> http://forums.matronics.com
> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List>- List Contribution Web
> Site -Matt Dralle,
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
> * *
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Confidence building flight |
Stuart:
This is a good point to remember if one is going to do engine off flight
with an in air restart.
I learned the hard way. Brand new Firestar, 1987. Was thrilled because
I
could restart from the cockpit. Of course I didn't trying cranking a
cold
engine while seated.
About the second day of flight on the new bird. Climbed to 3,000 feet
over
a very large hay field. Shut down the engine, glided to 1,500 feet.
Pulled
the recoil starter. Fired off, easy. That was so much fun I climbed to
5,000 feet, shut down, and glided to 1,000 feet. After several attempts
to
restart I realized the engine had cooled quickly and it wasn't going to
happen. Thank goodness I made a good decision to do my testing over a
good
forced landing area. Made my first forced landing in my new Firestar.
I liked to do engine off flight in my Ultrastar, but when the engine was
shut down, or if I killed it horsing around, it was an automatic forced
landing. On the ground I had to get out of the aircraft to restart.
This
meant dealing with 4 point harness and parachute bridal on my Jim
Handbury
hand deployed parachute. A royal pain in the butt.
Happy Easter, everyone!
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
One thing I have found is that if I start it and let it warm up (CHT at
200=B0
+) while standing beside it, I can shut it off, get all strapped in and
then
start it up again from the seat. This is a nice feature to not be
trying to
get into a running plane. I tried it cold, but could not get enough pull
to
get it to start. Better leverage standing up with my left hand on the
leading edge.
More to come!
Stuart
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dennis Rowe <rowedenny(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Confidence building flight |
Got a Mark3 X-tra close to me that's almost ready to fire up.
Roger Sell is the builder owner and should be lighting the fires in the Grea
t Planes / Valley Engineering redrive combo this Spring.=F0=9F=91=8D
Dennis "Skid" Rowe
Mk3, Rotax 670,
Leechburg, PA
> On Apr 5, 2015, at 11:28 AM, John Hauck wrote:
>
> Rick:
>
> How are we doing on VW powered Kolbs,
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Better than Seafoam? |
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
Cleaning out the rings on the 582, it's been a while, and the lower one was stuck
on one side near the locator pin, both pistons. Scraped and scraped, looked
pretty good, put the rings back in and was not real happy, Still sticking a little
bit on that same side. Went to scrape some carbon off the underside of the
head and think about it.
Scraped a bit, and then just for the heck of it, shot the head with some PB Blaster.
WOW! That stuff dissolves soft carbon like crazy. Let it sit for a while,
wiped it off with a paper towel. Went online and researched it, saw some posts
where other people had good results, but one post said to keep it away from
seals, it can make them swell.
Packed the base of the pistons with shop rags, drenched the rings and piston lands
with the stuff, letting it sit overnight. Will post again tomorrow. But I
did see dissolving carbon running down the sides of the pistons. That would seem
to be a good sign.
But unlike Seafoam, I really don't see putting this stuff in the gas tank.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440341#440341
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dennis Rowe <rowedenny(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Better than Seafoam? |
PB Blaster is the best liquid wrench I've ever used. Breaks loose unbelievably
tough rusted bolts and even galled threads.
Dennis "Skid" Rowe
Mk3, Rotax 670,
Leechburg, PA
> On Apr 6, 2015, at 6:20 PM, Richard Pike wrote:
>
>
> Cleaning out the rings on the 582, it's been a while, and the lower one was stuck
on one side near the locator pin, both pistons. Scraped and scraped, looked
pretty good, put the rings back in and was not real happy, Still sticking a
little bit on that same side. Went to scrape some carbon off the underside of
the head and think about it.
>
> Scraped a bit, and then just for the heck of it, shot the head with some PB Blaster.
WOW! That stuff dissolves soft carbon like crazy. Let it sit for a while,
wiped it off with a paper towel. Went online and researched it, saw some posts
where other people had good results, but one post said to keep it away from
seals, it can make them swell.
>
> Packed the base of the pistons with shop rags, drenched the rings and piston
lands with the stuff, letting it sit overnight. Will post again tomorrow. But
I did see dissolving carbon running down the sides of the pistons. That would
seem to be a good sign.
>
> But unlike Seafoam, I really don't see putting this stuff in the gas tank.
>
> --------
> Richard Pike
> Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
> Kingsport, TN 3TN0
> There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and
those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440341#440341
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Better than Seafoam? |
| From: | "George Alexander" <gtalexander(at)att.net> |
Richard:
Maybe you can convince the mfg to add wordage to the label, right alongside the
statement about fixing leaky toilets. 8>)
I agree with Dennis, it's good stuff.
rowedenny wrote:
> PB Blaster is the best liquid wrench I've ever used. Breaks loose unbelievably
tough rusted bolts and even galled threads.
>
> Dennis "Skid" Rowe
>
> On Apr 6, 2015, at 6:20 PM, Richard Pike wrote:
>
> . . . S N I P . . .
>
> Scraped a bit, and then just for the heck of it, shot the head with some PB
Blaster. WOW! That stuff dissolves soft carbon like crazy. Let it sit for a while,
wiped it off with a paper towel. Went online and researched it, saw some
posts where other people had good results, but one post said to keep it away from
seals, it can make them swell.
>
> . . . S N I P . . .
>
> But unlike Seafoam, I really don't see putting this stuff in the gas tank.
>
> --------
> Richard Pike
> Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
> Kingsport, TN 3TN0
> There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and
those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
>
:D
--------
George Alexander
FS II R503 N709FS
http://www.oh2fly.net
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440348#440348
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
| From: | "w0odi" <woodyz1957(at)gmail.com> |
I am 6'2" guy that weighs in at 250 to 260 lbs range just wondering if I am to
heavy to fly the Kolbra......I have been told that I am to heavy for this machine
and the weight and balance would be to nose heavy with me.
I am just curious cause I am considering buying one of these machines or something
similar and just want your expertise on this issue.. Would I be better off
with say a Mark III let me know what you all think about this.
Thanks in advance
Larry
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440352#440352
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
| From: | "Frankd" <FDucker(at)aol.com> |
HI Larry,
I have a MkIII xtra and have never flown a Kolbra but I am 200Lbs and can take
another 200Lb passenger in my 80HP Jabiru plane, but it does make the nose a
little heavy and I have limited passengers to 200Lbs for my comfort level.
If I take a 60Lb person it flys just fine with no noticeble effect, so I would
expect a MkIII to fly fine also.
I have sat in a Kolbra and I would advise you to try out each model as getting
in and out could be the major issue in deciding what model works best for you.
If you intend to fly just by yourself I would consider flying from the back seat
in a Kolbra for weight and balance considerations but it may not make much difference.
Good luck with your search.
Frankd
N1014S.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440378#440378
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
| From: | "Ralph B" <rstar447(at)gmail.com> |
Larry, as far as your up front max weight of 260 lbs, it's not a problem. My wife
and I weigh about 400 lbs (total weight of course) ahead of the cg and yes
the nose is a little heavy, but I always have enough up elevator to make safe
landings. I would recommend the Rotax 912uls (100 hp) for max performance and
the added weight aft of the cg to offset your weight if you are concerned about
it. I have my weight and balance sheets on file if you are interested.
I have made several videos with my wife and I flying the Kolbra. She does all the
video from the rear seat and yes you will be able to fly yours from the front.
If you would like to see any of these videos they are here on my youtube channel:
https://www.youtube.com/user/flyguy8294
Ralph
--------
Ralph B
Original Firestar 447
N91493 E-AB
1000+ hours
28 years flying it
Kolbra 912ULS
N20386
350 hours
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440383#440383
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
| From: | "Ralph B" <rstar447(at)gmail.com> |
Larry, as far as your up front max weight of 260 lbs, it's not a problem. My wife
and I weigh about 400 lbs (total weight of course) ahead of the cg and yes
the nose is a little heavy, but I always have enough up elevator to make safe
landings. I would recommend the Rotax 912uls (100 hp) for max performance and
the added weight aft of the cg to offset your weight if you are concerned about
it. I have my weight and balance sheets on file if you are interested.
I have made several videos with my wife and I flying the Kolbra. She does all the
video from the rear seat and yes you will be able to fly yours from the front.
If you would like to see any of these videos they are here on my youtube channel:
https://www.youtube.com/user/flyguy8294
Ralph
--------
Ralph B
Original Firestar 447
N91493 E-AB
1000+ hours
28 years flying it
Kolbra 912ULS
N20386
350 hours
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440384#440384
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Better than Seafoam? |
| From: | Gary Aman <zeprep251(at)aol.com> |
Had a chance to experiment on some old lawnmower engine cylinder heads
Sea foam PB blaster carb cleaner. Not much gets after hard carbon
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 6, 2015, at 8:59 PM, Dennis Rowe wrote:
>
>
> PB Blaster is the best liquid wrench I've ever used. Breaks loose unbelievably
tough rusted bolts and even galled threads.
>
> Dennis "Skid" Rowe
> Mk3, Rotax 670,
> Leechburg, PA
>
>
>
>> On Apr 6, 2015, at 6:20 PM, Richard Pike wrote:
>>
>>
>> Cleaning out the rings on the 582, it's been a while, and the lower one was
stuck on one side near the locator pin, both pistons. Scraped and scraped, looked
pretty good, put the rings back in and was not real happy, Still sticking
a little bit on that same side. Went to scrape some carbon off the underside of
the head and think about it.
>>
>> Scraped a bit, and then just for the heck of it, shot the head with some PB
Blaster. WOW! That stuff dissolves soft carbon like crazy. Let it sit for a while,
wiped it off with a paper towel. Went online and researched it, saw some
posts where other people had good results, but one post said to keep it away from
seals, it can make them swell.
>>
>> Packed the base of the pistons with shop rags, drenched the rings and piston
lands with the stuff, letting it sit overnight. Will post again tomorrow. But
I did see dissolving carbon running down the sides of the pistons. That would
seem to be a good sign.
>>
>> But unlike Seafoam, I really don't see putting this stuff in the gas tank.
>>
>> --------
>> Richard Pike
>> Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>> Kingsport, TN 3TN0
>> There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and
those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440341#440341
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
| From: | "w0odi" <woodyz1957(at)gmail.com> |
Ralph and Franks thanks for the Info and the quick replies... I sure do appreciate
you both taking time to give me some info on my concerns..
This is a great forum with a good bunch and lots of knowledge to draw from...
Thanks again
Larry
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440397#440397
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Better than Seafoam? |
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
Let it soak the rings & grooves overnight, helped a little. My conclusion: it works
great on soft carbon, not as much on hard carbon, still better than nothing.
OTOH, Seafoam only has one purpose, and if it doesn't clean the carbon off your
pistons and rings, it is pointless. PB Blaster works great on loosening rusted
stuff even if it doesn't clean the carbon off the rings as good as I wish.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440442#440442
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com> |
I have removed the single pedal cable brakes and want to install the Matco hydraulic
brakes. Is there any drawings on how and where to install them. I also bought
a set of steel gear legs but they don't look like they will fit. The aluminum
ones are same size all the way up inside the tubing on the cage but the
steel ones have 2 collars around them and are considerably smaller in diameter
where they exit the cage. Are they not for a MK 111?
Thanks
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440470#440470
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
Bob:
You can post a photo to this page.
Sounds like some gear legs Old Kolb Co came up with after Jim and I started
experimenting and using 4130 legs on my Firestar and MKIII.
Yes, tapered legs were designed for the MKIII. Doubt they will work on your
Kolbra.
Call Travis Brown at Kolb Co. He can fix you up with the correct gear legs.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of pipercolt
Sent: Wednesday, April 08, 2015 8:33 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: MK 111 rebuild
I have removed the single pedal cable brakes and want to install the Matco
hydraulic brakes. Is there any drawings on how and where to install them. I
also bought a set of steel gear legs but they don't look like they will fit.
The aluminum ones are same size all the way up inside the tubing on the cage
but the steel ones have 2 collars around them and are considerably smaller
in diameter where they exit the cage. Are they not for a MK 111?
Thanks
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440470#440470
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Better than Seafoam? |
| From: | "GeoB" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net> |
Richard Pike wrote:
> Let it soak the rings & grooves overnight, helped a little.
Wonder if anyone uses oven cleaner?
--------
GeoB
"Members of Congress should be compelled to wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers,
so we could identify their corporate sponsors"
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440483#440483
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
pipercolt wrote:
> I have removed the single pedal cable brakes and want to install the Matco hydraulic
brakes. Is there any drawings on how and where to install them. I also
bought a set of steel gear legs but they don't look like they will fit. The aluminum
ones are same size all the way up inside the tubing on the cage but the
steel ones have 2 collars around them and are considerably smaller in diameter
where they exit the cage. Are they not for a MK 111?
> Thanks
> Bob
If they look like this, then yes, they are for a MKIII. I am using them now.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440486#440486
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1050448_large_130.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1050449_large_153.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "KIRBY, DENNIS T GS-13 USAF AFMC AFNWC/EZS" <dennis.kirby.3(at)us.af.mil> |
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
From: "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com>
I have removed the single pedal cable brakes and want to install the Matco hydraulic
brakes. Is there any drawings on how and where to install them. I also bought
a set of steel gear legs but they don't look like they will fit. The aluminum
ones are same size all the way up inside the tubing on the cage but the
steel ones have 2 collars around them and are considerably smaller in diameter
where they exit the cage. Are they not for a MK 111?
Thanks
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "KIRBY, DENNIS T GS-13 USAF AFMC AFNWC/EZS" <dennis.kirby.3(at)us.af.mil> |
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
"pipercolt" wrote: << I have removed the single pedal cable brakes and want to
install the Matco hydraulic brakes. Is there any drawings on how and where to
install them. ... >> Thanks Bob
Bob -
Install your Matco brakes so that the brake unit is positioned in such a way that
the filler nipple is pointing upward. That will make filling your brakes with
fluid MUCH easier. To keep the nipple clean and free of dirt, I put a little
plastic cover on mine - the kind you find at hardware stores called "thread
protectors." They come in different sizes & colors. The red one (for a 1/4
inch bolt) is what fits on the filler nipple.
Dennis Kirby
Mark-3, 300 hrs TT
Sandia Park, NM
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com> |
Hi Guys
Thanks for the replies. Yes Dennis, those are the legs that I have.
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440493#440493
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "KIRBY, DENNIS T GS-13 USAF AFMC AFNWC/EZS" <dennis.kirby.3(at)us.af.mil> |
| Subject: | Re: Recall: Re: MK 111 rebuild |
KIRBY, DENNIS T GS-13 USAF AFMC AFNWC/EZS would like to recall the message, "Re:
MK 111 rebuild".
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com> |
I also have the tapered spring steel landing gear that Richard posted
photos of. Old Kolb developed these gear legs. When Old Kolb built them
they welded a tubular extension on the nub at the 31 inch (from Richard's
second photo) part of the gear legs. This extension carried the landing
load further up into gear socket in the fuselage cage.
When I installed these gear legs on my MKIIIC I slipped a 4130 steel tube
over the gear legs from the 21 inch measure to app 36 inch measure. The
tube is slightly smaller OD than the gear socket ID. I had to grind the nub
at the 31 inch measure down a bit to fit in the reinforcing tube. I would
have welded on a extension on like Old Kolb did but was afraid of changing
the tempering of the gear legs.
The gear legs are great, very durable with plenty of travel and spring.
They are shorter than the newer tubular gear legs but work well for me. You
do have to be careful because the spring in the gear will bounce you back
into the air on a bad landing.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Thu, Apr 9, 2015 at 7:45 AM, Richard Pike
wrote:
>
>
> pipercolt wrote:
> > I have removed the single pedal cable brakes and want to install the
> Matco hydraulic brakes. Is there any drawings on how and where to install
> them. I also bought a set of steel gear legs but they don't look like they
> will fit. The aluminum ones are same size all the way up inside the tubing
> on the cage but the steel ones have 2 collars around them and are
> considerably smaller in diameter where they exit the cage. Are they not for
> a MK 111?
> > Thanks
> > Bob
>
>
> If they look like this, then yes, they are for a MKIII. I am using them
> now.
>
> --------
> Richard Pike
> Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
> Kingsport, TN 3TN0
> There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,'
> and those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440486#440486
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1050448_large_130.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1050449_large_153.jpg
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com> |
Neil
I wonder what the reason was that Old kolb welded on the extension. Thanks to all
that have responded. This is a great site.
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440544#440544
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
Summer 1988, after flying over Niagara Falls the first time in my Kolb
Firestar, I had an engine failure and forced landing over the river between
Buffalo and Grand Island, NY, in the middle of the Niagara River. Got real
busy on short, short final and stalled the Firestar ripping out the gear leg
socket and shearing a socket in midsection. Up until this time the
instructions called for running the gear leg only halfway into the socket.
This put the load at the weakest point where the socket was drilled for
securing the leg. Winter 1988, Brother Jim and I completely rebuilt the
Firestar fuselage. We decided at this time to run the 4130 gear legs (our
design) all the way into the socket until it bottomed out at the
intersection, spreading the load throughout the socket. Never sheared
another one after that.
The extension was an improvement over the old system of insertion only
halfway in.
Homer Kolb used to tell me I was his best test bed. If it could be broken,
I'd probably do just that.
Miss those good old days.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of pipercolt
Sent: Thursday, April 09, 2015 6:43 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
Neil
I wonder what the reason was that Old kolb welded on the extension. Thanks
to all that have responded. This is a great site.
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440544#440544
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com> |
Well John, that does make sense. I live just about 50 airmiles South of your unintended
landing at the falls. I think I will install them as they are. I fly
off a 2000' grass strip and PLAN on any off field landings. Has anyone moved the
battery to the nose section of the plane? I know that is a long way to run
the positive cable but It sure would help with the CG.
Thanks
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440610#440610
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
With a steel leg terminating at the midpoint of the gear leg
socket, one has effectively constructed a shear at the
weakest point of the socket.
I haven't paid that much attention to the old solid steel
legs. Did not realize they were designed short.
Before I would relocate the battery from the CG to the nose
I would test fly the airplane. Now that is what I would do
if I had an itch to put a heavy battery way up there. Heck,
we have had folks haul lead in the nose.
Nose down pitch at cruise and full power is the biggest
annoyance of a MKIII. Normally, they do not have a CG
problem. Adverse pitch down is caused by the high thrust
line of the pusher configuration. Can be dealt with by
forced trim and aileron adjustment.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
pipercolt
Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 7:02 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
Well John, that does make sense. I live just about 50
airmiles South of your unintended landing at the falls. I
think I will install them as they are. I fly off a 2000'
grass strip and PLAN on any off field landings. Has anyone
moved the battery to the nose section of the plane? I know
that is a long way to run the positive cable but It sure
would help with the CG.
Thanks
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440610#440610
=
Photoshare, and much much more:
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com> |
Bob, I'm in the process of overhauling the brake system on a Just Aircraft
Highlander with Matco internal caliper brakes. I've not seen it mentioned
in the manual but make sure the calipers are mounted such that the airflow
carries the brake dust away from the sliders on the caliper. For the
internal calipers that's AFT of the axle.
Also, the Highlander was experiencing severe pad wear. Worn out in 30
hours. My theory is that the Nylaflow tubing was installed so that it had
to have an "S" bend that caused the tubing to act like a spring and keep
the fixed pad in constant contact with the disk. The fix, again my theory,
is to put a 90 degree steet ell into the caliper pointing toward the center
of the aircraft and a 45 degree 1/8 NPT to 1/4 compression fitting (Matco
has them:
http://www.matcomfg.com/BRASSELBOW45DEGR18NPT14COMPRESSIONWITHINSERT-idv-3584-35.html
so that the brake line follows the gear leg all the way to the caliper with
minimal bending. Like I said, that's the theory so use at your own
discretion.
Rick Girard
On Fri, Apr 10, 2015 at 7:38 PM, John Hauck wrote:
>
> With a steel leg terminating at the midpoint of the gear leg
> socket, one has effectively constructed a shear at the
> weakest point of the socket.
>
> I haven't paid that much attention to the old solid steel
> legs. Did not realize they were designed short.
>
> Before I would relocate the battery from the CG to the nose
> I would test fly the airplane. Now that is what I would do
> if I had an itch to put a heavy battery way up there. Heck,
> we have had folks haul lead in the nose.
>
> Nose down pitch at cruise and full power is the biggest
> annoyance of a MKIII. Normally, they do not have a CG
> problem. Adverse pitch down is caused by the high thrust
> line of the pusher configuration. Can be dealt with by
> forced trim and aileron adjustment.
>
> john h
> mkIII
> Titus, Alabama
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> pipercolt
> Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 7:02 PM
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
>
>
>
> Well John, that does make sense. I live just about 50
> airmiles South of your unintended landing at the falls. I
> think I will install them as they are. I fly off a 2000'
> grass strip and PLAN on any off field landings. Has anyone
> moved the battery to the nose section of the plane? I know
> that is a long way to run the positive cable but It sure
> would help with the CG.
> Thanks
> Bob
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440610#440610
>
>
> =
> Photoshare, and much much more:
> =
> =
> =
>
>
--
Believe those who are seeking the truth, doubt those who find it.
-Andre Gide
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
<>
John,
surely the C of G would have been calculated with the battery in position,
in flying position before the plane was taken into the air on her first
flight. I needed some lead in the nose to bring the C of G between the
specified limits on my Xtra. Nothing to do with flying characteristics. If
the battery can be moved to produce the correct C of G without adding extra
weight somewhere, thats a bonus.
Pat
-----Original Message-----
From: John Hauck
Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2015 1:38 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
With a steel leg terminating at the midpoint of the gear leg
socket, one has effectively constructed a shear at the
weakest point of the socket.
I haven't paid that much attention to the old solid steel
legs. Did not realize they were designed short.
Before I would relocate the battery from the CG to the nose
I would test fly the airplane. Now that is what I would do
if I had an itch to put a heavy battery way up there. Heck,
we have had folks haul lead in the nose.
Nose down pitch at cruise and full power is the biggest
annoyance of a MKIII. Normally, they do not have a CG
problem. Adverse pitch down is caused by the high thrust
line of the pusher configuration. Can be dealt with by
forced trim and aileron adjustment.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
pipercolt
Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 7:02 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
Well John, that does make sense. I live just about 50
airmiles South of your unintended landing at the falls. I
think I will install them as they are. I fly off a 2000'
grass strip and PLAN on any off field landings. Has anyone
moved the battery to the nose section of the plane? I know
that is a long way to run the positive cable but It sure
would help with the CG.
Thanks
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440610#440610
=
Photoshare, and much much more:
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eddie <e.bayliss(at)blueyonder.co.uk> |
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
Hi all long time no post from me but still read the list regularly. Like pa
t's extra my mk111 classic has lead in the nosecone it is one if the things
I am thinking of changing .I figure the battery sits behind the seat at ju
st about the cg and if I put it in the nose I can take the same weight of l
ead out of there only a few kilos saved but better out the aircraft than in
it .people with more experience and knowledge than me are welcome to point
out any pitfalls in my thoughts on this
Eddie
-----Original Message-----
From: "Patrick Ladd" <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: =8E11/=8E04/=8E2015 10:31
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
<>
John,
surely the C of G would have been calculated with the battery in position,
in flying position before the plane was taken into the air on her first
flight. I needed some lead in the nose to bring the C of G between the
specified limits on my Xtra. Nothing to do with flying characteristics. If
the battery can be moved to produce the correct C of G without adding extra
weight somewhere, thats a bonus.
Pat
-----Original Message-----
From: John Hauck
Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2015 1:38 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
With a steel leg terminating at the midpoint of the gear leg
socket, one has effectively constructed a shear at the
weakest point of the socket.
I haven't paid that much attention to the old solid steel
legs. Did not realize they were designed short.
Before I would relocate the battery from the CG to the nose
I would test fly the airplane. Now that is what I would do
if I had an itch to put a heavy battery way up there. Heck,
we have had folks haul lead in the nose.
Nose down pitch at cruise and full power is the biggest
annoyance of a MKIII. Normally, they do not have a CG
problem. Adverse pitch down is caused by the high thrust
line of the pusher configuration. Can be dealt with by
forced trim and aileron adjustment.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
pipercolt
Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 7:02 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
Well John, that does make sense. I live just about 50
airmiles South of your unintended landing at the falls. I
think I will install them as they are. I fly off a 2000'
grass strip and PLAN on any off field landings. Has anyone
moved the battery to the nose section of the plane? I know
that is a long way to run the positive cable but It sure
would help with the CG.
Thanks
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440610#440610
=
Photoshare, and much much more:
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
Hi Eddie. just thoughts. i did some experimentation with battery
position (and battery come to that) Find something substantial to fix
the battery to, and then do the sums. You need something more than a bit
of ply to hold the battery in place in a heavy landing, or maybe even in
strong turbulence. Better to maybe move the battery forward to a secure
location and then fine balance with a small amount of lead. Incidentally
I used a racing motorbike battery (Called a RED TOP over here) It had
bags of power whereas my first battery went flat if the engine didn`t
catch on the first few turns
Incidentally I used sheet lead cut to about 3 or 4 inch squares, put
them in a stack and drilled two holes right through. I clamped them
together with a metal bar across the top drilled to suit the holes in
the lead. With a suitable large plate at the other end and a couple of
bolts that was it. You can easily add or subtract a single piece of lead
when you get to fine tuning.
Cheers
Pat
From: Eddie
Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2015 12:54 PM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
Hi all long time no post from me but still read the list regularly. Like
pat's extra my mk111 classic has lead in the nosecone it is one if the
things I am thinking of changing .I figure the battery sits behind the
seat at just about the cg and if I put it in the nose I can take the
same weight of lead out of there only a few kilos saved but better out
the aircraft than in it .people with more experience and knowledge than
me are welcome to point out any pitfalls in my thoughts on this
Eddie
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
From: Patrick Ladd
Sent: =8E11/=8E04/=8E2015 10:31
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
<>
John,
surely the C of G would have been calculated with the battery in
position,
in flying position before the plane was taken into the air on her first
flight. I needed some lead in the nose to bring the C of G between the
specified limits on my Xtra. Nothing to do with flying characteristics.
If
the battery can be moved to produce the correct C of G without adding
extra
weight somewhere, thats a bonus.
Pat
-----Original Message-----
From: John Hauck
Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2015 1:38 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
With a steel leg terminating at the midpoint of the gear leg
socket, one has effectively constructed a shear at the
weakest point of the socket.
I haven't paid that much attention to the old solid steel
legs. Did not realize they were designed short.
Before I would relocate the battery from the CG to the nose
I would test fly the airplane. Now that is what I would do
if I had an itch to put a heavy battery way up there. Heck,
we have had folks haul lead in the nose.
Nose down pitch at cruise and full power is the biggest
annoyance of a MKIII. Normally, they do not have a CG
problem. Adverse pitch down is caused by the high thrust
line of the pusher configuration. Can be dealt with by
forced trim and aileron adjustment.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
pipercolt
Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 7:02 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
Well John, that does make sense. I live just about 50
airmiles South of your unintended landing at the falls. I
think I will install them as they are. I fly off a 2000'
grass strip and PLAN on any off field landings. Has anyone
moved the battery to the nose section of the plane? I know
that is a long way to run the positive cable but It sure
would help with the CG.
Thanks
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440610#440610
=
Photoshare, and much much mo - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "b young" <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Kolb-List Digest: 3 Mgs - 04/10/15 |
I had my battery up front in my mk III for a while then moved it back...
it just seemed to fly better with the cg back.... especially with a
passenger.
boyd
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Well John, that does make sense. I live just about 50 airmiles South of your
unintended
landing at the falls. I think I will install them as they are. I fly
off a 2000' grass strip and PLAN on any off field landings. Has anyone moved
the
battery to the nose section of the plane? I know that is a long way to run
the positive cable but It sure would help with the CG.
Thanks
Bob
---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dennis Rowe <rowedenny(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Kolb-List Digest: 3 Mgs - 04/10/15 |
If John H has a huge tail wheel, 26 gallon of fuel, and a 912S with a three blade
72" warp drive prop all behind his C/G, and his scrawny little butt in front
of the C/G and doesn't need his battery in the nose to balance his Mark3, why
does any Mark3 need nose ballast?
Dennis "Skid" Rowe
Mk3, Rotax 670,
Leechburg, PA
> On Apr 11, 2015, at 10:12 AM, b young wrote:
>
>
> I had my battery up front in my mk III for a while then moved it back... it
just seemed to fly better with the cg back.... especially with a passenger.
>
> boyd
>
>
>
> Well John, that does make sense. I live just about 50 airmiles South of your
unintended
> landing at the falls. I think I will install them as they are. I fly
> off a 2000' grass strip and PLAN on any off field landings. Has anyone moved
the
> battery to the nose section of the plane? I know that is a long way to run
> the positive cable but It sure would help with the CG.
> Thanks
> Bob
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> http://www.avast.com
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | K I <wrk2win4u(at)msn.com> |
=0A
=0A
Greetings Group=2C=0A
=0A
After buying an older Mark III that needed a LOT of fixing=2C=0A
I finally took it out this year for some Fast Taxi testing and a couple of
crow=0A
hops. I found it was better to fly the pattern than it was to crow hop it.
The one=0A
thing I have been having difficulty with is it tends to be tail-heavy at ab
out=0A
80mph ias. As I come in for landing=2C I can reduce some of the pressure on
the=0A
forward stick due to the diminishing air speed. Boyd Y. and I changed the
=0A
adjustment position of the flaps in hopes this would help it cruse =93hands
free=94=0A
or relatively stable flight. Currently when I let off the forward pressure
on=0A
the stick=2C it starts to climb right away. I have read some previous posti
ngs by=0A
John H. regarding =93nose heavy=94. His writings indicate the Kolb designed
to fly=0A
as they are and do not require aggressive trimming. =0A
=0A
If anyone has had a similar experience with the Mark III=0A
appearing to fly tail heavy=2C and you have been able to resolve the issue
=2C let=0A
me know what you did.=0A
=0A
Thanks=2C=0A
=0A
Kurt=0A
=0A
Mark III C=0A
=0A
Sandy=2C Utah=0A
=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com> |
Kurt
There is tail heavy more accurately called beyond the aft CG limits and
there is a rigging or trim issue that makes the plane pitch up. You need to
know what the problem is before you can resolve the issue.
Kolbs have a long fuselage and large tail surfaces so they aren't sensitive
to CG (Center of Gravity) changes. Do you know where the CG is for your
plane? If you don't you need to know this. My VW powered MKIIC needed the
battery in the nose cone to get the CG where it needed to be.
Once you have determined that the CG is in the recommended range check that
the horizontal stabilizer is mounted according to factory recommendations.
I assume you have adjusted the elevator trim lever and maybe the trim
spring tension. Reducing the tension will reduce the pitch up condition
also assuming it is tight. With every thing else rigged right you get the
best performance with the elevator trimmed to set about even with the
horizontal stabilizer with a light solo pilot but don't worry about that
yet. Check the wing angle of attack for factory recommendations. There is
one angle of attack for long gear legs and one for the stock legs with
corresponding changes for the horizontal stabilizer. Changes to the flaps
and ailerons rigging will have small changes to pitch. I normally like to
see flaps and ailerons rigged even with the bottom on the wing.
This will give you something to check on.
As always worth what you paid for it.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Sat, Apr 11, 2015 at 3:31 PM, K I wrote:
>
>
> Greetings Group,
>
> After buying an older Mark III that needed a LOT of fixing, I finally too
k
> it out this year for some Fast Taxi testing and a couple of crow hops. I
> found it was better to fly the pattern than it was to crow hop it. The on
e
> thing I have been having difficulty with is it tends to be tail-heavy at
> about 80mph ias. As I come in for landing, I can reduce some of the
> pressure on the forward stick due to the diminishing air speed. Boyd Y. a
nd
> I changed the adjustment position of the flaps in hopes this would help i
t
> cruse =9Chands free=9D or relatively stable flight. Currently
when I let off
> the forward pressure on the stick, it starts to climb right away. I have
> read some previous postings by John H. regarding =9Cnose heavy
=9D. His writings
> indicate the Kolb designed to fly as they are and do not require aggressi
ve
> trimming.
>
> If anyone has had a similar experience with the Mark III appearing to fly
> tail heavy, and you have been able to resolve the issue, let me know what
> you did.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Kurt
>
> Mark III C
>
> Sandy, Utah
>
> *
>
===========
onics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List>
===========
===========
om/contribution>
===========
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | B Young <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com> |
Can someone smarter than me explain adjusting aileron and flaps to
eliminate having to push forward on the stick to fly level. (Out of trim
feels tall heavy) VS Being tail heavy on the scales....
Boyd Y
On Apr 11, 2015 1:33 PM, "K I" wrote:
>
>
> Greetings Group,
>
> After buying an older Mark III that needed a LOT of fixing, I finally too
k
> it out this year for some Fast Taxi testing and a couple of crow hops. I
> found it was better to fly the pattern than it was to crow hop it. The on
e
> thing I have been having difficulty with is it tends to be tail-heavy at
> about 80mph ias. As I come in for landing, I can reduce some of the
> pressure on the forward stick due to the diminishing air speed. Boyd Y. a
nd
> I changed the adjustment position of the flaps in hopes this would help i
t
> cruse =9Chands free=9D or relatively stable flight. Currently
when I let off
> the forward pressure on the stick, it starts to climb right away. I have
> read some previous postings by John H. regarding =9Cnose heavy
=9D. His writings
> indicate the Kolb designed to fly as they are and do not require aggressi
ve
> trimming.
>
> If anyone has had a similar experience with the Mark III appearing to fly
> tail heavy, and you have been able to resolve the issue, let me know what
> you did.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Kurt
>
> Mark III C
>
> Sandy, Utah
>
> *
>
===========
onics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List>
===========
===========
om/contribution>
===========
>
> *
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
During flight, pull the flaps on. That will trim the nose down.
If flaps and/or ailerons are reflexed, that pulls the nose up.
If flaps and ailerons are trimmed level with the bottom of the wing on
the ground, they will be slightly drooped in flight. Air coming over
the wings pushed them down.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of B Young
Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2015 6:57 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tail Heavy
Can someone smarter than me explain adjusting aileron and flaps to
eliminate having to push forward on the stick to fly level. (Out of trim
feels tall heavy) VS Being tail heavy on the scales....
Boyd Y
On Apr 11, 2015 1:33 PM, "K I" wrote:
Greetings Group,
After buying an older Mark III that needed a LOT of fixing, I finally
took it out this year for some Fast Taxi testing and a couple of crow
hops. I found it was better to fly the pattern than it was to crow hop
it. The one thing I have been having difficulty with is it tends to be
tail-heavy at about 80mph ias. As I come in for landing, I can reduce
some of the pressure on the forward stick due to the diminishing air
speed. Boyd Y. and I changed the adjustment position of the flaps in
hopes this would help it cruse =9Chands free=9D or
relatively stable flight. Currently when I let off the forward pressure
on the stick, it starts to climb right away. I have read some previous
postings by John H. regarding =9Cnose heavy=9D. His writings
indicate the Kolb designed to fly as they are and do not require
aggressive trimming.
If anyone has had a similar experience with the Mark III appearing to
fly tail heavy, and you have been able to resolve the issue, let me know
what you did.
Thanks,
Kurt
Mark III C
Sandy, Utah
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Rebuilding/modifying my main gear |
Couple weeks ago carried my main gear and gear legs to London, KY, to let
the Kolb boys do some work on them.
After some hard landings, some extremely hard, a bent a drag strut on the
left main gear. Brother Jim suggested adding a 4130 sheet web to help keep
the braces in column during my klutzy landings. Even after all these years
I still have the ability to screw up pretty badly.
Attached are a few before during and after photos of the gear and a few of
the Kolb Gang.
Brian and Helen met me in Chattanooga, TN, this morning with my new looking
main gear. Thanks to all the guys at Kolb for your help.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com> |
Hi All
I just looked in my airframe logbook and it says that if it is flown solo, the
pilot must weigh at least 195 lbs. That is with the pizza cutter tail wheel. I
am removing that one and installing one that weighs about twice as much. I have
not run the numbers yet but I am guessing that the pilot will have to be well
over 200 lbs to stay within limits. As far as the battery goes, on my snowmobile
forum there is a lot of talk of light weight batteries that work well if
it isn't real cold out.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440688#440688
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
Trimming the ailerons and flaps up or down moves the center of pressure forward
or aft on the wing. Droop them, and the center of pressure, (lift) moves back
and the airplane becomes more nose heavy. Reflex them up and the center of pressure
(lift) moves forward and the airplane becomes more tail heavy. That is
why I modified my MKIII flap lever; so I could fine tune trim depending on passenger
load.
http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/pg3.htm
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440696#440696
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
I got one of those batteries, and it is awesome! Shorai Lithium Iron battery, 14
Amp Hour, 210 CCA, and weighs 1.5 pounds.
That's right, 1.5 pounds. With that little weight, you won't have to do a great
deal of reinforcing if you move it to the nose.
http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/pg9.htm
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440700#440700
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
You'll have more weight in cable than battery if it is relocated to the
nose.
I think the numbers on a Kolb W&B weigh more than the actual "aft CG"
problem.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Pike
Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2015 9:35 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
-->
I got one of those batteries, and it is awesome! Shorai Lithium Iron
battery, 14 Amp Hour, 210 CCA, and weighs 1.5 pounds.
That's right, 1.5 pounds. With that little weight, you won't have to do a
great deal of reinforcing if you move it to the nose.
http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/pg9.htm
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and
those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440700#440700
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com> |
John
I figure my battery cables are two-three feet longer attaching to my nose
cone mounted battery than they would be if they were attached to the
battery behind the seat. What size cables do you use. Figuring three feet
of cable weighing more than a 12-14 lb battery, those must be mighty big
cables.
I also switched to a Lithium Iron battery (another brand also less than 2
lb) last summer. The cables are still less than half the weight of that
battery. The two lb. battery and app one pound of cables still helps my
weight and balance.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW powered MKIIIC
On Sun, Apr 12, 2015 at 10:41 AM, John Hauck wrote:
>
> You'll have more weight in cable than battery if it is relocated to the
> nose.
>
> I think the numbers on a Kolb W&B weigh more than the actual "aft CG"
> problem.
>
> john h
> mkIII
> Titus, Alabama
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Pike
> Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2015 9:35 AM
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
>
> -->
>
> I got one of those batteries, and it is awesome! Shorai Lithium Iron
> battery, 14 Amp Hour, 210 CCA, and weighs 1.5 pounds.
> That's right, 1.5 pounds. With that little weight, you won't have to do a
> great deal of reinforcing if you move it to the nose.
> http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/pg9.htm
>
> --------
> Richard Pike
> Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
> Kingsport, TN 3TN0
> There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,'
> and
> those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440700#440700
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com> |
Hi Neil
What size battery cable did you use? Yes Richard, that is the battery I was thinking
of. Isn't it funny how many years ago when I was flying corporate we used
NiCad batteries and every so often we totally discharged them and then recharged
them. How theories have changed.
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440726#440726
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com> |
Hi Neil
What size battery cable did you use? Yes Richard, that is the battery I was thinking
of. Isn't it funny how many years ago when I was flying corporate we used
NiCad batteries and every so often we totally discharged them and then recharged
them. How theories have changed.
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440727#440727
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
Wellreckon I should have put smiley faces on my post,
or some such.
Why would someone put the battery in the nose if it is not necessary?
Why would someone put a 2 lb bat in the nose and run extra battery
cable? Cost more, weighs more, and every inch means a little more
voltage drop.
Remember, my comments are for myself. I don't care what you all do with
your airplanes.
I find it amusing that folks add weight to the nose of a Kolb, but bust
their ass to try and save a couple washers to reduce weight. ;-)
This comment below goes right along with the subject above.
Miss P'fer is on her newly overhauled gear. Brian did a super job of
straightening the sagging twisted gear legs. She looks and sits like
she did when she was new. Still have to put the seats back in, hook up
the power pack for the Whelen Strobes, and replace a bunch of tie wraps
that got cut to remove and replace the wheels, brakes, and gear legs.
Never goes back together easy after it is cut apart and welded, but
Dennis did a great job and I was able to get all the bolts back in.
Sure feels good.
Now I need some good weather to clean her up and do a lot of test
flying, for me and the airplane. Forecast rain all week at hauck's
holler.
Plan to depart to Lakeland Monday, 20 April. Hope to see a bunch of you
all down there.
BTW: I don't know how much my battery weighs or how big the battery
cables are, but I can pick them up with two hands if I grunt a little.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Neilsen
Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2015 1:23 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
John
I figure my battery cables are two-three feet longer attaching to my
nose cone mounted battery than they would be if they were attached to
the battery behind the seat. What size cables do you use. Figuring three
feet of cable weighing more than a 12-14 lb battery, those must be
mighty big cables.
I also switched to a Lithium Iron battery (another brand also less than
2 lb) last summer. The cables are still less than half the weight of
that battery. The two lb. battery and app one pound of cables still
helps my weight and balance.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW powered MKIIIC
On Sun, Apr 12, 2015 at 10:41 AM, John Hauck
wrote:
You'll have more weight in cable than battery if it is relocated to the
nose.
I think the numbers on a Kolb W&B weigh more than the actual "aft CG"
problem.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Pike
Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2015 9:35 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: MK 111 rebuild
-->
I got one of those batteries, and it is awesome! Shorai Lithium Iron
battery, 14 Amp Hour, 210 CCA, and weighs 1.5 pounds.
That's right, 1.5 pounds. With that little weight, you won't have to do
a
great deal of reinforcing if you move it to the nose.
http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/pg9.htm
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,'
and
those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440700#440700
-List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
FORUMS -
_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com> |
Mark III appearing to fly tail heavy>>
Put it on the scales and check your figures. It may feel tail heavy
because IT IS
Pat
From: B Young
Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2015 12:56 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tail Heavy
Can someone smarter than me explain adjusting aileron and flaps to
eliminate having to push forward on the stick to fly level. (Out of trim
feels tall heavy) VS Being tail heavy on the scales....
Boyd Y
On Apr 11, 2015 1:33 PM, "K I" wrote:
Greetings Group,
After buying an older Mark III that needed a LOT of fixing, I finally
took it out this year for some Fast Taxi testing and a couple of crow
hops. I found it was better to fly the pattern than it was to crow hop
it. The one thing I have been having difficulty with is it tends to be
tail-heavy at about 80mph ias. As I come in for landing, I can reduce
some of the pressure on the forward stick due to the diminishing air
speed. Boyd Y. and I changed the adjustment position of the flaps in
hopes this would help it cruse =9Chands free=9D or
relatively stable flight. Currently when I let off the forward pressure
on the stick, it starts to climb right away. I have read some previous
postings by John H. regarding =9Cnose heavy=9D. His writings
indicate the Kolb designed to fly as they are and do not require
aggressive trimming.
If anyone has had a similar experience with the Mark III appearing to
fly tail heavy, and you have been able to resolve the issue, let me know
what you did.
Thanks,
Kurt
Mark III C
Sandy, Utah
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
Hi Larry, I know there are pilots in the States who regularly fly their
planes at an all up weight which would be illegal here.Fine if you can get
away with it (I suppose) Certainly if you did it here and had a crunch the
insurers would not pay out if they could prove (and they can) that you were
overweight on take off. In any case why have a plane straining all the time
to keep you in the air when one with a bit more load carrying capacity, not
to mention room, is available. Incidentally is that 250/260 lbs you mention
dripping wet in the bathroom. If so think about the weight of your clothes,
boots sandwiches, bottles of water etc. Don`t kid yourself. Cheers.
Pat
-----Original Message-----
From: w0odi
Sent: Tuesday, April 07, 2015 3:48 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra?
I am 6'2" guy that weighs in at 250 to 260 lbs range just wondering if I am
to heavy to fly the Kolbra......I have been told that I am to heavy for this
machine and the weight and balance would be to nose heavy with me.
I am just curious cause I am considering buying one of these machines or
something similar and just want your expertise on this issue.. Would I be
better off with say a Mark III let me know what you all think about this.
Thanks in advance
Larry
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440352#440352
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com> |
That is why I modified my MKIII flap lever; so I could fine tune trim
depending on passenger load.>>
Hi Richard. On my Challenger there were no separate ailerons and flaps. Both
ailerons moved in unison for the trim. Winding them right down, from the
cockpit, and they acted as flaps. This also made the nose heavy which suited
me fine. If I was distracted on the approach I would rather the plane went
faster than slowed up and stalled. With the ailerons `up`they acted as fine
trim. A good simple sytem. Pat
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Pike
Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2015 2:43 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Tail Heavy
Trimming the ailerons and flaps up or down moves the center of pressure
forward or aft on the wing. Droop them, and the center of pressure, (lift)
moves back and the airplane becomes more nose heavy. Reflex them up and the
center of pressure (lift) moves forward and the airplane becomes more tail
heavy. That is why I modified my MKIII flap lever; so I could fine tune trim
depending on passenger load.
http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/pg3.htm
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and
those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440696#440696
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
pipercolt wrote:
> Hi Neil
> What size battery cable did you use? Yes Richard, that is the battery I was thinking
of. Isn't it funny how many years ago when I was flying corporate we used
NiCad batteries and every so often we totally discharged them and then recharged
them. How theories have changed.
> Bob
I had a friend at a car sound system shop sell me some of this at a good price: http://www.americanbassusa.com/categories/power---speaker-wires.htm
I have never seen large diameter wire like this before, it uses extremely small
fine wires woven together, it is almost as limp as rope. I used 8 gauge, soldered
the end fittings on and it seems to work fine.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440770#440770
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
On 4/13/2015 8:47 AM, Richard Pike wrote:
>
>
> pipercolt wrote:
>> Hi Neil
>> What size battery cable did you use? Yes Richard, that is the battery I was
thinking of. Isn't it funny how many years ago when I was flying corporate we
used NiCad batteries and every so often we totally discharged them and then recharged
them. How theories have changed.
>> Bob
>
> I had a friend at a car sound system shop sell me some of this at a good price: http://www.americanbassusa.com/categories/power---speaker-wires.htm
>
> I have never seen large diameter wire like this before, it uses extremely small
fine wires woven together, it is almost as limp as rope. I used 8 gauge, soldered
the end fittings on and it seems to work fine.
>
> --------
> Richard Pike
> Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
> Kingsport, TN 3TN0
> There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and
those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
>
>
That's how welding cable is made, with the bonus of having durable
insulation that's probably a lot more fire resistant than the stuff on
that speaker wire. Very common to see welding cable used for
battery/starter wire in big...(sorry, John) heavier homebuilts.
Available in various sizes from any local welding supply shop.
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
My MKIII must be an antique. I bought battery cable from Aircraft Spruce in
1991. It is aviation grade with a woven fabric chafe guard.
Looked for battery cable at Aircraft Spruce before writing this post. They
don't have anything that resembles the cable I am using. Guess it is a
thing of the past. All they have is what looks like normal 4 and 8 ga
cable.
Could hand prop the 80 horse 912, although it was still risky and not easy
to do because of the sharp edges of the blades. Hand propping the 912ULS is
out of the question with higher compression ratio on top of the gear
reduction. It is extremely important for me to be able to rely on battery
start. Want to make sure I have a system that is going to perform and get
stuck out in the boondocks somewhere.
On occasion I have failed to turn off the Master Switch and run the battery
down. If it gets near depletion the alternator will not pick up the charge.
One year at Sun and Fun I had a helper turn on my Master Switch, or I
accidentally hit the toggle switch with my toe getting out of the aircraft.
I got a jump start to get home, but was not able to get the alternator to
pick up the charge. I flew 425 miles with no electrical system. Radio was
able to operate on its integral battery. GPS on its batteries. Lost all my
electric engine instruments. All was well until I got to Headland, AL, to
refuel. No one at the airport to help me. Could not shut the engine down.
Was able to get close enough to the gas pump to get a chock with my foot,
while I kept the aircraft from rolling away. Refueled hot, which I did most
of the time in VN, and made the remainder of the flight back to Gantt IAP
without incident.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
That's how welding cable is made, with the bonus of having durable
insulation that's probably a lot more fire resistant than the stuff on that
speaker wire. Very common to see welding cable used for battery/starter wire
in big...(sorry, John) heavier homebuilts.
Available in various sizes from any local welding supply shop.
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Aman <zeprep251(at)aol.com> |
Pat,
My mk 3 with just me in it is at the aft limit of it's CG.If I use 1 notch
of flap and higher power setting it will fly about level,but in rough air i
t would pitch nose up and then return to level,kind of like riding over a w
ake of a boat.With a passenger its perfect.I attached 2 rings to the passe
nger floor and I strap in about 30 pounds of lead shot in a thick plastic l
iner, then covered with a denim bag.That stops the wallow in rough air and
fixes the trim issue.I'll probably get taken to task for using this method
but it works.I was going to try raising the horizontal tail leading edge bu
t never came up with a clean way to do it.
G.Aman MK 3 C Jabiru 2200A 950 hrs
-----Original Message-----
From: Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Mon, Apr 13, 2015 5:55 am
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tail Heavy
Mark III appearing to fly tail heavy>>
Put it on the scales and check your figures. It may feel tail heavy bec
ause IT IS
Pat
From: B Young
Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2015 12:56 AM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tail Heavy
Can someone smarter than me explain adjusting aileron and flaps to eliminat
e having to push forward on the stick to fly level. (Out of trim feels tall
heavy) VS Being tail heavy on the scales....
Boyd Y
On Apr 11, 2015 1:33 PM, "K I" < wrk2win4u(at)msn.com> wrote:
Greetings Group,
After buying an older Mark III that needed a LOT of fixing, I finally took
it out this year for some Fast Taxi testing and a couple of crow hops. I fo
und it was better to fly the pattern than it was to crow hop it. The one th
ing I have been having difficulty with is it tends to be tail-heavy at abou
t 80mph ias. As I come in for landing, I can reduce some of the pressure on
the forward stick due to the diminishing air speed. Boyd Y. and I changed
the adjustment position of the flaps in hopes this would help it cruse
=9Chands free=9D or relatively stable flight. Currently when I let
off the forward pressure on the stick, it starts to climb right away. I ha
ve read some previous postings by John H. regarding =9Cnose heavy
=9D. His writings indicate the Kolb designed to fly as they are and do n
ot require aggressive trimming.
If anyone has had a similar experience with the Mark III appearing to fly t
ail heavy, and you have been able to resolve the issue, let me know what yo
u did.
Thanks,
Kurt
Mark III C
Sandy, Utah
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List tp://forums.ma
tronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics
.com/Navigator?Kolb-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums
.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.ma
tronics.com/c
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
Hard core John, hard core. Good on ya, do what you have to do.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440809#440809
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: MK 111 rebuild |
| From: | "pipercolt" <bob.pipercolt(at)yahoo.com> |
Thanks Richard for your last comment about hand propping the 582. I was just about
to post that question.
Bob
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440813#440813
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
| From: | "Ralph B" <rstar447(at)gmail.com> |
patrickjladd(at)hotmail.c wrote:
> Hi Larry, I know there are pilots in the States who regularly fly their
> planes at an all up weight which would be illegal here.Fine if you can get
> away with it (I suppose) Certainly if you did it here and had a crunch the
> insurers would not pay out if they could prove (and they can) that you were
> overweight on take off. In any case why have a plane straining all the time
> to keep you in the air when one with a bit more load carrying capacity, not
> to mention room, is available. Incidentally is that 250/260 lbs you mention
> dripping wet in the bathroom. If so think about the weight of your clothes,
> boots sandwiches, bottles of water etc. Don`t kid yourself. Cheers.
> Pat
>
> --
Pat you have to remember that Larry would be flying solo and if he carried a passenger,
that person would have to be within the weight limits for the Kolbra
W&B. His max weight of 260 lbs is well within the weight limits for the Kolbra.
I have 400 lbs and more with me and my wife flying and as you can see in the
videos that it flies well.
Ralph
--------
Ralph B
Original Firestar 447
N91493 E-AB
1000+ hours
28 years flying it
Kolbra 912ULS
N20386
350 hours
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440844#440844
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
I am the manufacturer of my airplane, a Hauck/Kolb MKIII. I decide on what
the limitations are based on experience, design, and testing.
Most of us Americans don't like the Feds telling us what we can and cannot
do.
I can assure you, my MKIII is been thoroughly tested and proven to be more
than capable of any limitations I have imposed on it.
Ain't it nice to do things your way once in a while, have it all down its
Airworthiness Certificate, and all legal and above board.
I did a 20 minute test flight this morning. The new gear legs performed
great after three TO's and landings. Didn't have time to fly over to
Wetumpka Airport and land on pavement, but it sure did nice on grass and cow
crap. Yep, it's under the wing and on the horizontal tail.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ralph B
Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2015 10:38 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra?
patrickjladd(at)hotmail.c wrote:
> Hi Larry, I know there are pilots in the States who regularly fly
> their planes at an all up weight which would be illegal here.Fine if
> you can get away with it (I suppose) Certainly if you did it here and
> had a crunch the insurers would not pay out if they could prove (and
> they can) that you were overweight on take off. In any case why have
> a plane straining all the time to keep you in the air when one with a
> bit more load carrying capacity, not to mention room, is available.
> Incidentally is that 250/260 lbs you mention dripping wet in the
> bathroom. If so think about the weight of your clothes, boots sandwiches,
bottles of water etc. Don`t kid yourself. Cheers.
> Pat
>
> --
Pat you have to remember that Larry would be flying solo and if he carried a
passenger, that person would have to be within the weight limits for the
Kolbra W&B. His max weight of 260 lbs is well within the weight limits for
the Kolbra. I have 400 lbs and more with me and my wife flying and as you
can see in the videos that it flies well.
Ralph
--------
Ralph B
Original Firestar 447
N91493 E-AB
1000+ hours
28 years flying it
Kolbra 912ULS
N20386
350 hours
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440844#440844
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
| From: | "w0odi" <woodyz1957(at)gmail.com> |
John if I ever get one it will be landed in the pasture and will have cow crap
on it too...so just slinging a little money on the wings and tail... :D
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440850#440850
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
I do my best landings at my 700 foot grass strip that has difficult
approaches, landing NW or SE. Lots of 100 foot hardwoods to get over, then
let the bottom drop out, hold 50 mph and grease it in. The opposite
direction have to get over a high hedge row and make a 45 degree turn on
short, short final. The bigger the airport and the more runway I have, the
worst landings I will make. Think it is psychological.
My last landing this morning I hit a fresh one. When they have been eating
all this new crop green grass, it goes in one in and squirts out the other.
When it dries it is like epoxy.
We got about 100 head of new cows the last couple days. They haven't
learned the routine yet. The old cows were born and raised around my
airplane and noisy tractors. They don't pay much attention to any of them
except when they want to irritate me. They all love to feed and crap on my
airstrip.
Will start piling my camping gear in a pile on the living room floor and
check off my equipment list. All I got to do now is clean up Miss P'fer and
top her off with fuel. Then do a little rain dance so I'll have good
weather Monday to fly to Lakeland. It is 425 sm. Normally takes me 5.0
hours flight time, but have done it in 4.0 when I could snag a good
tailwind.
Hope to see a bunch of you guys down there.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of w0odi
Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2015 3:52 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra?
John if I ever get one it will be landed in the pasture and will have cow
crap on it too...so just slinging a little money on the wings and tail...
:D
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440850#440850
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gliderx5(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Sun N Fun Latex Paint Forum Cancelled |
I regret that I will have to cancel the Latex Paint forum for Sun N Fun. My ride
from PA had a foot operation and will not be able to go, and going on my own
is a little too pricey right now. I will be at Oshkosh and hope to see some of
you there on July.
Malcolm Morrison
www.wienerdogaero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
Most of us Americans don't like the Feds telling us what we can and cannot
do>> No argument there John although the Americans seem to have a more
aggressive streak of independence than we do. Trouble is that the more
people you have in a small space the more organisation/ interference is
need. Boy! Hove we got a lot of people in a small space
That cow crap is OK if you pick it up landing.It doesn`t have time to go
hard. If you pick it up on takeoff its like concrete when you land. Out with
the bucket.
You would love our Wx at the moment. Nearly three weeks of more or less wall
to wall sunshine and clear skies. Little or no wind.Good viz. Skies are so
clear that I have seen the Space Station go over for the last four nights.
Pat
.
-----Original Message-----
From: John Hauck
Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2015 8:33 PM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra?
I am the manufacturer of my airplane, a Hauck/Kolb MKIII. I decide on what
the limitations are based on experience, design, and testing.
Most of us Americans don't like the Feds telling us what we can and cannot
do.
I can assure you, my MKIII is been thoroughly tested and proven to be more
than capable of any limitations I have imposed on it.
Ain't it nice to do things your way once in a while, have it all down its
Airworthiness Certificate, and all legal and above board.
I did a 20 minute test flight this morning. The new gear legs performed
great after three TO's and landings. Didn't have time to fly over to
Wetumpka Airport and land on pavement, but it sure did nice on grass and cow
crap. Yep, it's under the wing and on the horizontal tail.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ralph B
Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2015 10:38 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra?
patrickjladd(at)hotmail.c wrote:
> Hi Larry, I know there are pilots in the States who regularly fly
> their planes at an all up weight which would be illegal here.Fine if
> you can get away with it (I suppose) Certainly if you did it here and
> had a crunch the insurers would not pay out if they could prove (and
> they can) that you were overweight on take off. In any case why have
> a plane straining all the time to keep you in the air when one with a
> bit more load carrying capacity, not to mention room, is available.
> Incidentally is that 250/260 lbs you mention dripping wet in the
> bathroom. If so think about the weight of your clothes, boots sandwiches,
bottles of water etc. Don`t kid yourself. Cheers.
> Pat
>
> --
Pat you have to remember that Larry would be flying solo and if he carried a
passenger, that person would have to be within the weight limits for the
Kolbra W&B. His max weight of 260 lbs is well within the weight limits for
the Kolbra. I have 400 lbs and more with me and my wife flying and as you
can see in the videos that it flies well.
Ralph
--------
Ralph B
Original Firestar 447
N91493 E-AB
1000+ hours
28 years flying it
Kolbra 912ULS
N20386
350 hours
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440844#440844
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
Most of us Americans don't like the Feds telling us what we can and cannot
do>> No argument there John although the Americans seem to have a more
aggressive streak of independence than we do. Trouble is that the more
people you have in a small space the more organisation/ interference is
need. Boy! Hove we got a lot of people in a small space
That cow crap is OK if you pick it up landing.It doesn`t have time to go
hard. If you pick it up on takeoff its like concrete when you land. Out with
the bucket.
You would love our Wx at the moment. Nearly three weeks of more or less wall
to wall sunshine and clear skies. Little or no wind.Good viz. Skies are so
clear that I have seen the Space Station go over for the last four nights.
Pat
.
-----Original Message-----
From: John Hauck
Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2015 8:33 PM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra?
I am the manufacturer of my airplane, a Hauck/Kolb MKIII. I decide on what
the limitations are based on experience, design, and testing.
Most of us Americans don't like the Feds telling us what we can and cannot
do.
I can assure you, my MKIII is been thoroughly tested and proven to be more
than capable of any limitations I have imposed on it.
Ain't it nice to do things your way once in a while, have it all down its
Airworthiness Certificate, and all legal and above board.
I did a 20 minute test flight this morning. The new gear legs performed
great after three TO's and landings. Didn't have time to fly over to
Wetumpka Airport and land on pavement, but it sure did nice on grass and cow
crap. Yep, it's under the wing and on the horizontal tail.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ralph B
Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2015 10:38 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra?
patrickjladd(at)hotmail.c wrote:
> Hi Larry, I know there are pilots in the States who regularly fly
> their planes at an all up weight which would be illegal here.Fine if
> you can get away with it (I suppose) Certainly if you did it here and
> had a crunch the insurers would not pay out if they could prove (and
> they can) that you were overweight on take off. In any case why have
> a plane straining all the time to keep you in the air when one with a
> bit more load carrying capacity, not to mention room, is available.
> Incidentally is that 250/260 lbs you mention dripping wet in the
> bathroom. If so think about the weight of your clothes, boots sandwiches,
bottles of water etc. Don`t kid yourself. Cheers.
> Pat
>
> --
Pat you have to remember that Larry would be flying solo and if he carried a
passenger, that person would have to be within the weight limits for the
Kolbra W&B. His max weight of 260 lbs is well within the weight limits for
the Kolbra. I have 400 lbs and more with me and my wife flying and as you
can see in the videos that it flies well.
Ralph
--------
Ralph B
Original Firestar 447
N91493 E-AB
1000+ hours
28 years flying it
Kolbra 912ULS
N20386
350 hours
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440844#440844
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 250# pilot to heavy to solo Kolbra? |
Hi Ralph.
Rules here are
Single seater MTOW 661lbs
Two seater 992 lbs MTOW
This is properly weighed as for C of G, full fuel etc. Done by test pilot on
renewal of annual C of A, but only about every 5 years.(Planes seem to get
naturally heavier with time)
Plane must stall at MTOW at 40 mph
We also have a sort of superlight category which operates under hardly any
rules at all except the all up weight.It is so low that it never interested
me and the planes look to be a bit of a handful in very moderate conditions.
Fun though. There is a very pretty Fokker Eindecker about which is
beautiful.
Pat
Pat you have to remember that Larry would be flying solo and if he carried a
passenger, that person would have to be within the weight limits for the
Kolbra W&B. His max weight of 260 lbs is well within the weight limits for
the Kolbra. I have 400 lbs and more with me and my wife flying and as you
can see in the videos that it flies well.
Ralph
--------
Ralph B
Original Firestar 447
N91493 E-AB
1000+ hours
28 years flying it
Kolbra 912ULS
N20386
350 hours
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440844#440844
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
zeprep251(at)aol.com wrote:
> Pat,
> I was going to try raising the horizontal tail leading edge but never came up
with a clean way to do it.
> G.Aman MK 3 C Jabiru 2200A 950 hrs
> --
Here is a semi-clean way to do it:
http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/FSIIelevatorbracket.html
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440907#440907
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Green <bgreen(at)bimi.org> |
| Subject: | Tail feathers for a Kolb |
Kolbers:
I have the tail feathers (rudder, elevators and stabilizers) for a small Kolb of
some
Sort. It has the small "pizza cutter" tail wheel." Anyone that is interested
or might
need these can respond to me using BG285P(at)yahoo.com. I have attempted to
attach three photos.
B Green
Kolb MKIIIX w/VW engine project.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Green <bgreen(at)bimi.org> |
| Subject: | FW: Tail feathers for a Kolb |
Hope these come through.
Subject: Tail feathers for a Kolb
Kolbers:
I have the tail feathers (rudder, elevators and stabilizers) for a small Ko
lb of some
Sort. It has the small "pizza cutter" tail wheel." Anyone that is interes
ted or might
need these can respond to me using BG285P(at)yahoo.com. I have attempted to
attach three photos.
B Green
Kolb MKIIIX w/VW engine project.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Tail feathers for a Kolb |
Bob:
Photos didn't come through.
I have good luck sending photos to the List by copying and pasting to the
msg portion of the email.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Kolbers:
I have the tail feathers (rudder, elevators and stabilizers) for a small
Kolb of some Sort. It has the small "pizza cutter" tail wheel." Anyone
that is interested or might need these can respond to me using
BG285P(at)yahoo.com. I have attempted to attach three photos.
B Green
Kolb MKIIIX w/VW engine project.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Static Port Tuning |
| From: | "Larlaeb" <larlaeb(at)gmail.com> |
I was a little surprised that during the first flight after replacing my nose cone
that my MKIII would only do about 50 knots indicated. I really didn't think
that modifying the nose shape should hurt me that much. Checking with GPS
told me I was correct and something was off with my airspeed indication. After
messing around with it a bit and trying several things it became clear that
I had changed the pressure around the static port by modifying the nose. I
was about to change the position or put in another port altogether when I came
across this article. This will probably be old news to some of you but it was
interesting to me. Particularly the part on 'tuning' the static port using
a rubber 'O' ring. I tried it and it works great. Took a couple of tries to
get it positioned right but I now go just as fast (unfortunately not much if any
faster) than I used to.
The link is here:
http://www.ch601.org/resources/pitot-static/pitot.htm
The tuning portion is quoted below and assumes a tube type static port with holes
drilled in the sides.
"If your airspeed reading is slow, it is because the static port is in a slight
high pressure zone. This can be corrected by slipping a small "O" ring over the
end of the static tube ahead of the tiny drilled holes (vents, that is).
Moving the "O" ring aft on the tube (in very small increments) will increase the
airspeed - on the gauge (not for the airplane, amigo . . . sorry). Conversely,
moving the "O" ring forward, away from the ports, will decrease the indicated
airspeed in much the same manner. Very small changes in the "O" ring position
make a noticeable difference in the indications.
What happens is that you are attempting to lower the static pressure "felt" by
the static ports with the "O" ring interrupting the airflow, thereby causing a
slight lowering in air pressure behind (downstream) the ring.
The closer the ring is to the ports, the lower the induced pressure.
If on the other hand the static-tube port happens to be located in an area of low
pressure, moving the ring to a position behind the ports should provide a slight
increase in the pressure felt by the static ports with results opposite
to that described above.
Because a rubber "O" ring will deteriorate, it should be replaced with a metal
ring having identical dimensions after the proper location is determined. A dab
of paint or epoxy should hold it in place."
Thanks,
Allan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440927#440927
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Static Port Tuning |
| From: | Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> |
Your tuning is very interesting. Another thing that you might do is to cut
your pitot tube at about a 45 degree angle. That matched my speed to the
actual speed reading, it also keeps it from being blanked out by angle of
attack.
Larry
On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 1:49 PM, Larlaeb wrote:
>
> I was a little surprised that during the first flight after replacing my
> nose cone that my MKIII would only do about 50 knots indicated. I really
> didn't think that modifying the nose shape should hurt me that much.
> Checking with GPS told me I was correct and something was off with my
> airspeed indication. After messing around with it a bit and trying several
> things it became clear that I had changed the pressure around the static
> port by modifying the nose. I was about to change the position or put in
> another port altogether when I came across this article. This will
> probably be old news to some of you but it was interesting to me.
> Particularly the part on 'tuning' the static port using a rubber 'O' ring.
> I tried it and it works great. Took a couple of tries to get it positioned
> right but I now go just as fast (unfortunately not much if any faster) than
> I used to.
>
> The link is here:
>
> http://www.ch601.org/resources/pitot-static/pitot.htm
>
> The tuning portion is quoted below and assumes a tube type static port
> with holes drilled in the sides.
>
> "If your airspeed reading is slow, it is because the static port is in a
> slight high pressure zone. This can be corrected by slipping a small "O"
> ring over the end of the static tube ahead of the tiny drilled holes
> (vents, that is).
>
> Moving the "O" ring aft on the tube (in very small increments) will
> increase the airspeed - on the gauge (not for the airplane, amigo . . .
> sorry). Conversely, moving the "O" ring forward, away from the ports, will
> decrease the indicated airspeed in much the same manner. Very small changes
> in the "O" ring position make a noticeable difference in the indications.
>
> What happens is that you are attempting to lower the static pressure
> "felt" by the static ports with the "O" ring interrupting the airflow,
> thereby causing a slight lowering in air pressure behind (downstream) the
> ring.
>
> The closer the ring is to the ports, the lower the induced pressure.
>
> If on the other hand the static-tube port happens to be located in an area
> of low pressure, moving the ring to a position behind the ports should
> provide a slight increase in the pressure felt by the static ports with
> results opposite to that described above.
>
> Because a rubber "O" ring will deteriorate, it should be replaced with a
> metal ring having identical dimensions after the proper location is
> determined. A dab of paint or epoxy should hold it in place."
>
> Thanks,
> Allan
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440927#440927
>
>
--
*If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
address before sending.*
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Static Port Tuning |
| From: | "Larlaeb" <larlaeb(at)gmail.com> |
Putting the angle on the front of the pitot tube is something I had already read
about from you and others on the forum and I've had that in place for a good
while now. Good stuff.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440932#440932
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dennis Rowe <rowedenny(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Static Port Tuning |
I did a similar thing in wrapping black tape around the static tube just aft of
the static holes to create a higher pressure zone over the static port. Do not
archive
Dennis "Skid" Rowe
Mk3, Rotax 670,
Leechburg, PA
> On Apr 16, 2015, at 3:49 PM, Larlaeb wrote:
>
>
> I was a little surprised that during the first flight after replacing my nose
cone that my MKIII would only do about 50 knots indicated. I really didn't
think that modifying the nose shape should hurt me that much. Checking with
GPS told me I was correct and something was off with my airspeed indication.
After messing around with it a bit and trying several things it became clear that
I had changed the pressure around the static port by modifying the nose.
I was about to change the position or put in another port altogether when I came
across this article. This will probably be old news to some of you but it
was interesting to me. Particularly the part on 'tuning' the static port using
a rubber 'O' ring. I tried it and it works great. Took a couple of tries to
get it positioned right but I now go just as fast (unfortunately not much if
any faster) than I used to.
>
> The link is here:
>
> http://www.ch601.org/resources/pitot-static/pitot.htm
>
> The tuning portion is quoted below and assumes a tube type static port with holes
drilled in the sides.
>
> "If your airspeed reading is slow, it is because the static port is in a slight
high pressure zone. This can be corrected by slipping a small "O" ring over
the end of the static tube ahead of the tiny drilled holes (vents, that is).
>
> Moving the "O" ring aft on the tube (in very small increments) will increase
the airspeed - on the gauge (not for the airplane, amigo . . . sorry). Conversely,
moving the "O" ring forward, away from the ports, will decrease the indicated
airspeed in much the same manner. Very small changes in the "O" ring position
make a noticeable difference in the indications.
>
> What happens is that you are attempting to lower the static pressure "felt" by
the static ports with the "O" ring interrupting the airflow, thereby causing
a slight lowering in air pressure behind (downstream) the ring.
>
> The closer the ring is to the ports, the lower the induced pressure.
>
> If on the other hand the static-tube port happens to be located in an area of
low pressure, moving the ring to a position behind the ports should provide a
slight increase in the pressure felt by the static ports with results opposite
to that described above.
>
> Because a rubber "O" ring will deteriorate, it should be replaced with a metal
ring having identical dimensions after the proper location is determined. A
dab of paint or epoxy should hold it in place."
>
> Thanks,
> Allan
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440927#440927
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Green <bgreen(at)bimi.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Kolb-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 04/16/15 |
VGhlIHRhaWwgZmVhdGhlcnMgaGF2ZSBiZWVuIHNwb2tlbiBmb3Igbm93LiAgVGhhbmtzLg0KQkdy
ZWVuDQpta0lJSVgNCg=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "b young" <byoungplumbing(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Kolb-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 04/16/15 |
Larry.. I am guessing that cutting your pitot at a 45 lowers your
indicated airspeed? and to keep from being blanked out by angle of
attack... again I assume the top is left long and the bottom is shortened.
boyd
>>>>>>>>>>>>
Your tuning is very interesting. Another thing that you might do is to cut
your pitot tube at about a 45 degree angle. That matched my speed to the
actual speed reading, it also keeps it from being blanked out by angle of
attack.
Larry
---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Kolb-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 04/16/15 |
| From: | Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> |
On Fri, Apr 17, 2015 at 8:04 AM, b young wrote:
>
> Larry.. I am guessing that cutting your pitot at a 45 lowers your
> indicated airspeed? and to keep from being blanked out by angle of
> attack... again I assume the top is left long and the bottom is shortened.
>
> boyd
>
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Actually the speed was reading too slow by about 5MPH. After
> cutting a bit at a time, the speed began matching my GPS readings, and yes
> although I am generally too busy to watch the ASI on landing, it does not
> now get blanked out. I would "assume" that the angled cut allows more air
> pressure to get it into the tube, thus showing a faster speed on the ASI.
>
Larry
--
*If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
address before sending.*
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Scrabeck" <skrabekk(at)charter.net> |
Does anyone by chance have a 5 inch spar tube unused , for my original
twinstar? I also need gear legs .Any help or advise appreciated Reply
offline
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Bearden" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net> |
| Subject: | RE: Kolb-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 04/17/15 |
> Larry.. I am guessing that cutting your pitot at a 45 lowers your
> indicated airspeed?
I am wondering if these various fixes yield a linear response?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Bearden" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net> |
> Does anyone by chance have a 5 inch spar tube unused
I don't know fer sure about the diameter, but an old aviator I know has a
large new tube in his rafters he wants to sell. I will email this msg to
him, see if he responds.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Steam gauge brass insert fix |
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
For those of you still using steam gauges, especially the ones like in the picture
below, you might save yourself a lot of grief if - before you install them
- you mix up a little JB Quick and carefully dab it around the outside of the
4 brass inserts that hold the gauge together, that are threaded for the retaining
screws. You want to bond the insert tightly to the gauge w/o getting any
epoxy on the threads. Obviously you do this on the back side.
Because after 18 years, that brass insert might corrode and cleave itself tightly
to the screw, and then when you try and remove the screw, instead of the screw
coming out, the insert spins in the gauge. Which results in fighting with
it for over an hour while in a position way too awkward for an old man. Guess
how I know this?
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440976#440976
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/westach_small_203.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stuart Harner" <stuart(at)harnerfarm.net> |
| Subject: | Steam gauge brass insert fix |
Good advice Richard.
Also, a drop of oil on the threads, or better yet a tiny amount of
anti-seize compound will help stop galvanic action between the dissimilar
metals of the screw and nut.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Pike
Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2015 1:11 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Steam gauge brass insert fix
-->
For those of you still using steam gauges, especially the ones like in the
picture below, you might save yourself a lot of grief if - before you
install them - you mix up a little JB Quick and carefully dab it around the
outside of the 4 brass inserts that hold the gauge together, that are
threaded for the retaining screws. You want to bond the insert tightly to
the gauge w/o getting any epoxy on the threads. Obviously you do this on the
back side.
Because after 18 years, that brass insert might corrode and cleave itself
tightly to the screw, and then when you try and remove the screw, instead of
the screw coming out, the insert spins in the gauge. Which results in
fighting with it for over an hour while in a position way too awkward for an
old man. Guess how I know this?
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and
those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=440976#440976
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/westach_small_203.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George Bearden" <gab16(at)sbcglobal.net> |
> Does anyone by chance have a 5 inch spar tube unused
GeoB's friend: "George, I have 3 20 foot 5" tubes all for sale. feel free to
give my phone numbers to interested party. Tubes would have to be picked up
in Fresno, freight may be costly."
GeoB: "Email me for phone numbers gab16(at)sbcglobal.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | 5 inch spar tube price per foot... |
I have a 5 inch boom tube for Kolbs... wondering what Travis gets a
foot.. ?
Thanks to Bob Green for the Firestar Tail feathers.... Now have a set
of rebuilt Firestar wings, thanks to Bro Pike... ...and Tail
feathers....looking for a re build able fuselage..preferably single
seater...but will take a two seater..
have a 447 for the project...and looking to trade a c box that has
new bearings and seals but still needs some small parts..to trade for a
good b box...2.58 preferred...
By the way Bob , down in the Chattanooga area has done a super job
on his MkIII extra... excellent fabric work on the wings...git er dun
...Bob!! :-)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 5 inch spar tube price per foot... |
| From: | Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> |
On Sun, Apr 19, 2015 at 7:13 PM, Herb wrote:
>
> I have a 5 inch boom tube for Kolbs... wondering what Travis gets a
> foot.. ?
>
>
> Thanks to Bob Green for the Firestar Tail feathers.... Now have a set of
> rebuilt Firestar wings, thanks to Bro Pike... ...and Tail
> feathers....looking for a re build able fuselage..preferably single
> seater...but will take a two seater..
>
> have a 447 for the project...and looking to trade a c box that has new
> bearings and seals but still needs some small parts..to trade for a good b
> box...2.58 preferred...
>
>
> By the way Bob , down in the Chattanooga area has done a super job on
> his MkIII extra... excellent fabric work on the wings...git er dun
> ...Bob!! :-)
>
> Are you sure that you wouldn't like a nice 503 to go on it instead? I just
> happen to have one.
>
Larry
>
>
--
*If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
address before sending.*
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 5 inch spar tube price per foot... |
Could get interested in the engine you replaced the 503 with!! :-)
How is the HKS working out? Herb
On 04/19/2015 09:17 PM, Larry Cottrell wrote:
>
>
> On Sun, Apr 19, 2015 at 7:13 PM, Herb > wrote:
>
> >
>
> I have a 5 inch boom tube for Kolbs... wondering what Travis
> gets a foot.. ?
>
>
> Thanks to Bob Green for the Firestar Tail feathers.... Now have
> a set of rebuilt Firestar wings, thanks to Bro Pike... ...and Tail
> feathers....looking for a re build able fuselage..preferably
> single seater...but will take a two seater..
>
> have a 447 for the project...and looking to trade a c box that
> has new bearings and seals but still needs some small parts..to
> trade for a good b box...2.58 preferred...
>
>
> By the way Bob , down in the Chattanooga area has done a super
> job on his MkIII extra... excellent fabric work on the wings...git
> er dun ...Bob!! :-)
>
> Are you sure that you wouldn't like a nice 503 to go on it
> instead? I just happen to have one.
>
> Larry
>
>
> ==========
> -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
> ==========
> FORUMS -
> _blank">http://forums.matronics.com
> ==========
> b Site -
> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ==========
>
>
> --
> /If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
> address before sending./
> *
>
>
> *
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 5 inch spar tube price per foot... |
| From: | Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> |
On Sun, Apr 19, 2015 at 9:03 PM, Herb wrote:
> Could get interested in the engine you replaced the 503 with!! :-) How
> is the HKS working out? Herb
>
>
>> The HKS is running well, especially now that I have done a little stream
lining, or actually vortex minimizing. I am getting in the low to mid 70's
with it. You too can run one for about 11 or 12 K :-) I decided to go for
the long haul. It should be the last engine that I have to buy.
Larry
>
>>
>
>
> --
> *If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
> address before sending.*
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
--
*If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
address before sending.*
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Sun and Fun 2015 |
Hi Folks:
Out the door and heading to the airstrip. Hope to be off the ground by 0630
CT. Should arrive KLAL before 1400 ET, which is when the field closes for
the daily air show. If I don't make it by 1400, I'll have to wait until
after 1730 ET to land at Paradise City. I've done that before.
Got about 415 sm and 5.0 flight hours.
Miss P'fer is already fueled and loaded. Did that last night.
Expected temps in the low 60's this morning, but got low 50's with the temps
going down instead of up. It has dropped 3 or 4 degrees since I got up at
0400.
Route of flight Titus, AL to Blakely, GA, to Cross City, FL, and Lakeland,
FL.
Hope to see some of you down there.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chris davis <capedavis(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Sun and Fun 2015 |
Fair winds John have a safe trip Chris=0A=0ASent from Yahoo Mail on Android
=0A=0AFrom:"John Hauck" =0ADate:Tue, Apr 21, 2015 at
6:59 AM=0ASubject:Kolb-List: Sun and Fun 2015=0A=0A--> Kolb-List message po
sted by: "John Hauck" =0A=0AHi Folks:=0A=0AOut the do
or and heading to the airstrip.- Hope to be off the ground by 0630=0ACT.
- Should arrive KLAL before 1400 ET, which is when the field closes for
=0Athe daily air show.- If I don't make it by 1400, I'll have to wait unt
il=0Aafter 1730 ET to land at Paradise City.- I've done that before.=0A
=0AGot about 415 sm and 5.0 flight hours.=0A=0AMiss P'fer is already fueled
and loaded.- Did that last night.=0A=0AExpected temps in the low 60's th
is morning, but got low 50's with the temps=0Agoing down instead of up.-
It has dropped 3 or 4 degrees since I got up at=0A0400.=0A=0ARoute of fligh
t Titus, AL to Blakely, GA, to Cross City, FL, and Lakeland,=0AFL.=0A=0AHop
e to see some of you down there.=0A=0Ajohn h=0AmkIII=0ATitus, Alabama=0A=0A
==============0A=0A=0A=0A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Sun and Fun 2015 |
| From: | Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com> |
On Tue, Apr 21, 2015 at 5:55 AM, John Hauck wrote:
>
> Hi Folks:
>
> Out the door and heading to the airstrip. Hope to be off the ground by
> 0630
> CT. Should arrive KLAL before 1400 ET, which is when the field closes for
> the daily air show. If I don't make it by 1400, I'll have to wait until
> after 1730 ET to land at Paradise City. I've done that before.
>
> Got about 415 sm and 5.0 flight hours.
>
> Miss P'fer is already fueled and loaded. Did that last night.
>
> Expected temps in the low 60's this morning, but got low 50's with the
> temps
> going down instead of up. It has dropped 3 or 4 degrees since I got up at
> 0400.
>
> Route of flight Titus, AL to Blakely, GA, to Cross City, FL, and Lakeland,
> FL.
>
> Hope to see some of you down there.
>
> john h
> mkIII
> Titus, Alabama
>
> I wish, but it's not happening for me this year.
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Sun and Fun 2015 |
Hi Folks:
Miss P'fer got 18.1 gal 100LL and I got two free hot dogs at Cross City, FL. 3.4
hours from Gantt IAP is pretty good in a fat ultralight.
I'll be at Lakeland in about 1.5 hours.
Brian Milborn said the crowd was down, but that is not unusual the first day.
Normally I have to wait to get fuel here at Cross City. One airplane here when
I landed.
Weather is great. I have had a ground speed from 88 to 105 mph. I love a tailwind.
If nothing happens, I'll make KLAL before the airshow begins at 1400 ET.
john h
mkIII
Cross City, Florida
---- John Hauck wrote:
>
> Hi Folks:
>
> Out the door and heading to the airstrip. Hope to be off the ground by 0630
> CT. Should arrive KLAL before 1400 ET, which is when the field closes for
> the daily air show. If I don't make it by 1400, I'll have to wait until
> after 1730 ET to land at Paradise City. I've done that before.
>
> Got about 415 sm and 5.0 flight hours.
>
> Miss P'fer is already fueled and loaded. Did that last night.
>
> Expected temps in the low 60's this morning, but got low 50's with the temps
> going down instead of up. It has dropped 3 or 4 degrees since I got up at
> 0400.
>
> Route of flight Titus, AL to Blakely, GA, to Cross City, FL, and Lakeland,
> FL.
>
> Hope to see some of you down there.
>
> john h
> mkIII
> Titus, Alabama
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Scrabeck" <skrabekk(at)charter.net> |
I=99ve had good help finding needed materials for my wing rebuild
so far. I thought I=99d try the list for a couple of more
requests. Anybody have enough fabric left from other jobs to cover the
wing and aleron of a twinstar? Need about 30 ft of 72 inch light 1.7
ceconite . Also need 12 ft. of leading edge 1 1/2 in. .028 tube and and
12 ft of trailing edge 1 1/4 .028 tube.Thanks for checking. Jerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kinne russ <russk50(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Fwd: Kolb-List Digest: 0 Msgs - 04/22/15 |
List
Can someone tell me where I can buy the little fuel fillers that fit over then
intake fuel line, inside the fuel tank?
Called finger-filters sometimes?
Id appreciate that
Russ K
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dennis Rowe <rowedenny(at)windstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fwd: Kolb-List Digest: 0 Msgs - 04/22/15 |
Aircraft Spruce has them
Dennis "Skid" Rowe
Mk3, Rotax 670,
Leechburg, PA
> On Apr 23, 2015, at 10:42 AM, kinne russ wrote:
>
>
>
> List
> Can someone tell me where I can buy the little fuel fillers that fit over then
intake fuel line, inside the fuel tank?
> Called finger-filters sometimes?
> Id appreciate that
> Russ K
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fwd: Kolb-List Digest: 0 Msgs - 04/22/15 |
| From: | Larry Cottrell <lcottrell1020(at)gmail.com> |
Russ,
If there is a hobby shop any where near you, check and see if they have
them. I used to use them for the fuel tanks for my radio controlled models.
Larry
On Thu, Apr 23, 2015 at 8:42 AM, kinne russ wrote:
>
>
> List
> Can someone tell me where I can buy the little fuel fillers that fit over
> then intake fuel line, inside the fuel tank?
> Called =98finger-filters=99 sometimes?
> I=99d appreciate that
> Russ K
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
--
*If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email
address before sending.*
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | second chantz chutes |
| From: | "crankpot" <bobg379(at)yahoo.com> |
Anyone used them in recent years?
I cant find anything on the internet except some 5 year old posts on a website.
Difficult to reach them via phone as well. Just wondering...
--------
1984 kolb ultrstar
Former 1997 kolb firestat
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441227#441227
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Kolb Firestar parts |
Kolbers and Kolbettes....
with the collection of Free Firestar parts...I now have a good ,
rebuilt set of wings...and Tail feathers...so...need a repairable
Fuselage...Herb
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stuart Harner" <stuart(at)harnerfarm.net> |
| Subject: | Firefly/447 RPM question |
Guys,
Here is a question for those that have a Firefly with a Rotax 447.
Assuming a properly dialed in propeller with a static full throttle output
of 6300 RPM, what do you usually see at straight and level cruise RPM and
speed?
For that matter, if you have any information of what airspeeds to expect at
different throttle settings (straight and level) I would appreciate knowing
what others are seeing.
I have been up a for a couple of short flights this spring and it seems to
me that a comfortable airspeed is between 55 and 60 indicated, but that
seems to be in the 4800 RPM range which is still giving me high EGT's. I
moved the needle clip down (more rich) one notch and that helped a lot. Now
when I get a warning at mid-range, I just add a little "choke" to take care
of it. I expect this problem to go away with warmer temps, but may have to
fuss with the pitch a little.
I need MUCH more time in the air to sort this stuff all out, but the weather
has not been cooperating very well.
Any numbers you can give me for comparison/starting points would be
appreciated.
Thanks,
Stuart
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
| From: | "olendorf" <olendorf(at)gmail.com> |
It all depends on what size prop you have. And the drag of your craft.
I find 4800rpms to be just about the hot spot for my EGTs also. 4600-4800. I
try to stay out of that range. I usually cruise around about 5500-5800rpm which
provides 53-58mph airspeed.
--------
Scott Olendorf
Original Firestar, Rotax 447, Powerfin prop
Schenectady, NY
http://sites.google.com/site/kolbfirestar/
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441248#441248
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
Remember also...Stuart,,,that engine is not broken in...rings will seat
in the 40+ hour range..temps usually drop...cht and egt...
I cruised in the 5600 range and saw high 50's to low 60's using a
three blade IVO..Herb
On 04/24/2015 02:42 PM, olendorf wrote:
>
> It all depends on what size prop you have. And the drag of your craft.
> I find 4800rpms to be just about the hot spot for my EGTs also. 4600-4800.
I try to stay out of that range. I usually cruise around about 5500-5800rpm which
provides 53-58mph airspeed.
>
> --------
> Scott Olendorf
> Original Firestar, Rotax 447, Powerfin prop
> Schenectady, NY
> http://sites.google.com/site/kolbfirestar/
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441248#441248
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stuart Harner" <stuart(at)harnerfarm.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
Thanks Scott. I have a 3 blade 60" Warp Drive at 7.5 of pitch. The amount
of drag is a little harder to figure. I have the short windshield, double
struts, and the larger wheels with brakes.
Less pitch will give more RPM but less thrust so that may be the way to go.
There is no shortage of thrust, that's for sure!
I need to go back and review to see if less pitch increases EGT or if I need
a little more.
I have had it up to 70 IAS in a descent and that seemed "uncomfortable" to
me. Maybe I am just not used to it yet, but I really like the way it
"feels" between 55 and 60.
Someone else said "climb at 50, cruise at 50 and approach at 50" or
something like that. So far that seems to fit. I didn't build it to travel
with anyway.
Your Firestar is slightly larger than the Firefly but if you have a full
enclosure it may have about the same amount of drag as I do.
Thanks again,
Stuart
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of olendorf
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2015 2:43 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
It all depends on what size prop you have. And the drag of your craft.
I find 4800rpms to be just about the hot spot for my EGTs also. 4600-4800.
I try to stay out of that range. I usually cruise around about 5500-5800rpm
which provides 53-58mph airspeed.
--------
Scott Olendorf
Original Firestar, Rotax 447, Powerfin prop Schenectady, NY
http://sites.google.com/site/kolbfirestar/
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441248#441248
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stuart Harner" <stuart(at)harnerfarm.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
Thanks Herb,
Sounds like a mandate to go fly! Tiny Tack is currently showing 19, halfway
there.
The darned wind comes up with the sun and temps these days. I am sure after
some time aloft, I will be able to handle more adverse conditions but at
this stage of the game I don't need any more to deal with, so will wait.
When you are a little kid at heart, waiting is sooooo HARD to do!
Patience was my dad's virtue, not mine. GRRRR!
I sure like the power (thrust) I am getting with the 447. Sometimes I wonder
if it is overkill for the Firefly. Better to have it and not need it than
need it and not have it. (True of most things in life)
Thanks again,
Stuart
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Herb
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2015 5:18 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
Remember also...Stuart,,,that engine is not broken in...rings will seat in
the 40+ hour range..temps usually drop...cht and egt...
I cruised in the 5600 range and saw high 50's to low 60's using a three
blade IVO..Herb
On 04/24/2015 02:42 PM, olendorf wrote:
>
> It all depends on what size prop you have. And the drag of your craft.
> I find 4800rpms to be just about the hot spot for my EGTs also.
4600-4800. I try to stay out of that range. I usually cruise around about
5500-5800rpm which provides 53-58mph airspeed.
>
> --------
> Scott Olendorf
> Original Firestar, Rotax 447, Powerfin prop Schenectady, NY
> http://sites.google.com/site/kolbfirestar/
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441248#441248
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
I bought the low time Firefly in Conn...pictures only...one of those
impulse things....! January...no way to get it....then had buyers
remorse...not because of the nice looking plane or nice trailer...just
taking my ole bones on a 2000 mile round trip....so I sold...it.... :-)
Hope to get back in the air before too long...Firestar this time
maybe.? More local too! :-) 447 engine...not the 503 I hope...or a
Firestar with no engine...for I have another 447...older model... single
seater..project would be good...damaged cage ok..if not too bad...
Herb
On 04/24/2015 07:22 PM, Stuart Harner wrote:
>
> Thanks Herb,
>
> Sounds like a mandate to go fly! Tiny Tack is currently showing 19, halfway
> there.
>
> The darned wind comes up with the sun and temps these days. I am sure after
> some time aloft, I will be able to handle more adverse conditions but at
> this stage of the game I don't need any more to deal with, so will wait.
>
> When you are a little kid at heart, waiting is sooooo HARD to do!
>
> Patience was my dad's virtue, not mine. GRRRR!
>
> I sure like the power (thrust) I am getting with the 447. Sometimes I wonder
> if it is overkill for the Firefly. Better to have it and not need it than
> need it and not have it. (True of most things in life)
>
> Thanks again,
>
> Stuart
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Herb
> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2015 5:18 PM
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
>
>
> Remember also...Stuart,,,that engine is not broken in...rings will seat in
> the 40+ hour range..temps usually drop...cht and egt...
>
> I cruised in the 5600 range and saw high 50's to low 60's using a three
> blade IVO..Herb
>
> On 04/24/2015 02:42 PM, olendorf wrote:
>>
>> It all depends on what size prop you have. And the drag of your craft.
>> I find 4800rpms to be just about the hot spot for my EGTs also.
> 4600-4800. I try to stay out of that range. I usually cruise around about
> 5500-5800rpm which provides 53-58mph airspeed.
>> --------
>> Scott Olendorf
>> Original Firestar, Rotax 447, Powerfin prop Schenectady, NY
>> http://sites.google.com/site/kolbfirestar/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441248#441248
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
| From: | kinne russ <russk50(at)gmail.com> |
Herb
Dunno if this is of any help to you but I have an open trailer, set up for a Kolb,
that you can borrow anytime you need it but its in MAINE!
Prolly 5-6 hrs north of CT. But youre welcome to use it
Fair winds,
Russ K
> On Apr 24, 2015, at 8:43 PM, Herb wrote:
>
>
> I bought the low time Firefly in Conn...pictures only...one of those impulse
things....! January...no way to get it....then had buyers remorse...not because
of the nice looking plane or nice trailer...just taking my ole bones on a 2000
mile round trip....so I sold...it.... :-)
>
> Hope to get back in the air before too long...Firestar this time maybe.? More
local too! :-) 447 engine...not the 503 I hope...or a Firestar with no engine...for
I have another 447...older model... single seater..project would be
good...damaged cage ok..if not too bad...
>
> Herb
>
> On 04/24/2015 07:22 PM, Stuart Harner wrote:
>>
>> Thanks Herb,
>>
>> Sounds like a mandate to go fly! Tiny Tack is currently showing 19, halfway
>> there.
>>
>> The darned wind comes up with the sun and temps these days. I am sure after
>> some time aloft, I will be able to handle more adverse conditions but at
>> this stage of the game I don't need any more to deal with, so will wait.
>>
>> When you are a little kid at heart, waiting is sooooo HARD to do!
>>
>> Patience was my dad's virtue, not mine. GRRRR!
>>
>> I sure like the power (thrust) I am getting with the 447. Sometimes I wonder
>> if it is overkill for the Firefly. Better to have it and not need it than
>> need it and not have it. (True of most things in life)
>>
>> Thanks again,
>>
>> Stuart
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Herb
>> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2015 5:18 PM
>> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
>>
>>
>> Remember also...Stuart,,,that engine is not broken in...rings will seat in
>> the 40+ hour range..temps usually drop...cht and egt...
>>
>> I cruised in the 5600 range and saw high 50's to low 60's using a three
>> blade IVO..Herb
>>
>> On 04/24/2015 02:42 PM, olendorf wrote:
>>>
>>> It all depends on what size prop you have. And the drag of your craft.
>>> I find 4800rpms to be just about the hot spot for my EGTs also.
>> 4600-4800. I try to stay out of that range. I usually cruise around about
>> 5500-5800rpm which provides 53-58mph airspeed.
>>> --------
>>> Scott Olendorf
>>> Original Firestar, Rotax 447, Powerfin prop Schenectady, NY
>>> http://sites.google.com/site/kolbfirestar/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441248#441248
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
Maine? Isn't that near Greenland?? :-) Thanks for the offer...One
more plane and I am out of the business for a while...Herb
On 04/24/2015 08:13 PM, kinne russ wrote:
>
> Herb
> Dunno if this is of any help to you but I have an open trailer, set up for a
Kolb, that you can borrow anytime you need it but its in MAINE!
> Prolly 5-6 hrs north of CT. But youre welcome to use it
> Fair winds,
> Russ K
>
>
>> On Apr 24, 2015, at 8:43 PM, Herb wrote:
>>
>>
>> I bought the low time Firefly in Conn...pictures only...one of those impulse
things....! January...no way to get it....then had buyers remorse...not because
of the nice looking plane or nice trailer...just taking my ole bones on a 2000
mile round trip....so I sold...it.... :-)
>>
>> Hope to get back in the air before too long...Firestar this time maybe.?
More local too! :-) 447 engine...not the 503 I hope...or a Firestar with no engine...for
I have another 447...older model... single seater..project would be
good...damaged cage ok..if not too bad...
>>
>> Herb
>>
>> On 04/24/2015 07:22 PM, Stuart Harner wrote:
>>>
>>> Thanks Herb,
>>>
>>> Sounds like a mandate to go fly! Tiny Tack is currently showing 19, halfway
>>> there.
>>>
>>> The darned wind comes up with the sun and temps these days. I am sure after
>>> some time aloft, I will be able to handle more adverse conditions but at
>>> this stage of the game I don't need any more to deal with, so will wait.
>>>
>>> When you are a little kid at heart, waiting is sooooo HARD to do!
>>>
>>> Patience was my dad's virtue, not mine. GRRRR!
>>>
>>> I sure like the power (thrust) I am getting with the 447. Sometimes I wonder
>>> if it is overkill for the Firefly. Better to have it and not need it than
>>> need it and not have it. (True of most things in life)
>>>
>>> Thanks again,
>>>
>>> Stuart
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
>>> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Herb
>>> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2015 5:18 PM
>>> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>>> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
>>>
>>>
>>> Remember also...Stuart,,,that engine is not broken in...rings will seat in
>>> the 40+ hour range..temps usually drop...cht and egt...
>>>
>>> I cruised in the 5600 range and saw high 50's to low 60's using a three
>>> blade IVO..Herb
>>>
>>> On 04/24/2015 02:42 PM, olendorf wrote:
>>>>
>>>> It all depends on what size prop you have. And the drag of your craft.
>>>> I find 4800rpms to be just about the hot spot for my EGTs also.
>>> 4600-4800. I try to stay out of that range. I usually cruise around about
>>> 5500-5800rpm which provides 53-58mph airspeed.
>>>> --------
>>>> Scott Olendorf
>>>> Original Firestar, Rotax 447, Powerfin prop Schenectady, NY
>>>> http://sites.google.com/site/kolbfirestar/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>>
>>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441248#441248
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
| From: | undoctor <undoctor(at)rcn.com> |
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
| From: | "Airknocker" <airknocker(at)harnerfarm.net> |
Hi Dave,
Thanks, I will check out your videos.
I have been considering getting a sports cam to record my flights so I can review
them later. My hope is to be able to learn things that I was too busy to notice
when in the air.
Did you find video useful in that way?
One of the many things I need to do is get some time aloft with my phone where
I can see the GPS speedometer readout. by flying different routes and then again
in reverse, I hope to get an idea at to the accuracy of the ASI.
--------
"I don't care, I'm still free. You can't take the sky from me" - Josh
Wedon
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441273#441273
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
| From: | "olendorf" <olendorf(at)gmail.com> |
stuart(at)harnerfarm.net wrote:
>
> ...
> Less pitch will give more RPM but less thrust so that may be the way to go.
> There is no shortage of thrust, that's for sure!
>
> I need to go back and review to see if less pitch increases EGT or if I need
> a little more.
> .....
> Stuart
>
> --
Less pitch will actually increase your EGT. You can try this test. Fly straight
and level watch EGT. Push nose down to unload prop a little, simulating less
pitch. Watch which way EGT goes. It will go up.
That's also your danger zone while decending at lower throttle you will be in that
hot zone of 4500 rpm already, then with the added unloading of the prop during
decent, you will see your EGT spike. I will either throttle back more to
get out of the zone or decend with more power. Depends on my approach.
The ideal situation would be to get a jet needle with a different curve that didn't
lean out at 4500rpm but so far I haven't found one. There was talk about
one on this forum a few years back. I bought it and it was way too thick so
I am back to stock.
I think the 3 blade on a Firefly is perfect. Lots of climb performance but less
top speed. Like you found the top speed isn't as much fun anyway. Seems uncomfortable.
It's much more comfortable in an enclosed cockpit where the wind,
noise and buffetting are reduced but whats the fun in that?
--------
Scott Olendorf
Original Firestar, Rotax 447, Powerfin prop
Schenectady, NY
http://sites.google.com/site/kolbfirestar/
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441279#441279
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: second chantz chutes |
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
I think they may be belly up. I have an old 2nd Chantz in my MKIII, it uses one
of the compressed nitrogen launchers which is still in the green, so I keep toting
it around. I have sent the canopy off to Skydive Kentucky and had them air
it out, check it and repack it a time or two.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441286#441286
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
If you have not seen this before, or if trying to figure out jetting and prop load seems non-intuitive, maybe this will help: http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/pg11.htm
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441288#441288
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stuart Harner" <stuart(at)harnerfarm.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
Ha! Yes, that is where I saw it before. Just could not remember the
details.
Thanks for the link. There are lots of other sources too, some I have read,
some not. This one is nice and concise with pictures even!
More flying, less thinking.
Thanks,
Stuart
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Pike
Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2015 9:48 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
-->
If you have not seen this before, or if trying to figure out jetting and
prop load seems non-intuitive, maybe this will help:
http://oh2fly.net/oldpoops/pg11.htm
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and
those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441288#441288
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stuart Harner" <stuart(at)harnerfarm.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
That is exactly where it happens, powered back for descent.
I guess that makes sense, energy not used by the prop gets dumped overboard
in the exhaust.
In any case, either getting out of the mid-range or adding a little "choke"
fixes it.
I get nice even temps on both cylinders everywhere but mid-range. The clip
was in the top slot and I dropped it to the second which is actually the
recommended starting point.
At this point I think it is dialed in fairly close and I don't want to make
any more changes until I can get some more hours on the engine, heck it is
still new. Also I have yet to fly it at temps above 70, so I expect things
to change some as the weather warms.
Probably the best thing to do would be quit thinking about flying and start
actually flying. Not today though, cool, cloudy and windy. :(
Thanks again,
Stuart
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of olendorf
Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2015 6:56 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
stuart(at)harnerfarm.net wrote:
>
> ...
> Less pitch will give more RPM but less thrust so that may be the way to
go.
> There is no shortage of thrust, that's for sure!
>
> I need to go back and review to see if less pitch increases EGT or if
> I need a little more.
> .....
> Stuart
>
> --
Less pitch will actually increase your EGT. You can try this test. Fly
straight and level watch EGT. Push nose down to unload prop a little,
simulating less pitch. Watch which way EGT goes. It will go up.
That's also your danger zone while decending at lower throttle you will be
in that hot zone of 4500 rpm already, then with the added unloading of the
prop during decent, you will see your EGT spike. I will either throttle
back more to get out of the zone or decend with more power. Depends on my
approach.
The ideal situation would be to get a jet needle with a different curve that
didn't lean out at 4500rpm but so far I haven't found one. There was talk
about one on this forum a few years back. I bought it and it was way too
thick so I am back to stock.
I think the 3 blade on a Firefly is perfect. Lots of climb performance but
less top speed. Like you found the top speed isn't as much fun anyway.
Seems uncomfortable. It's much more comfortable in an enclosed cockpit
where the wind, noise and buffetting are reduced but whats the fun in that?
--------
Scott Olendorf
Original Firestar, Rotax 447, Powerfin prop Schenectady, NY
http://sites.google.com/site/kolbfirestar/
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441279#441279
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: second chantz chutes |
| From: | JC Gilpin <j.gilpin(at)bigpond.com> |
Yes, Second Chantz is back in business.
He was out of business for 15 years because BRS paid him out to not produce
for that time.....
So John Dunham, the originator of Second Chance, is now back in business in
Carson City, NV. john(at)secondchantz.com Ph 775.315.0133.
Last July I took my much out-of-date Second Chantz to him and had it
repacked and a new rocket motor added. He reckoned he would have been the
one who originally packed that chute 22 years ago! Very friendly and
conscientious service; I have confidence in his experience and integrity.
JG
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Watkinsdw" <david.watkins0(at)gmail.com> |
Hi, Gang,
After a great visit with the Kolb folks and John Hauck at S&F, I returned to Pompano,
and met with a real gentleman who flew down from Minnesota to look at my
Steven Green MK III. He bought her on the spot, after a test flight with me
at 190, him at 220 and 10 gallons of fuel. She flew great, and sweetly, as is
her style, when I'm lucky!
He has a 2005 Firestar with a recently rebuilt 503 that he will be selling. If
anyone is in the market, contact me off-list, and I'll give you his contact info.
Thanks for the community over the years. I'll still be listening in, but I'm out
of the ownership business for now.
Dave Watkins
Mark III Classic
Pompano Beach, FL
954-608-5423
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441364#441364
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Watkinsdw" <david.watkins0(at)gmail.com> |
Oops, meant to say, "Landed Sweetly!"
Should have previewed before posting...
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441365#441365
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
| From: | "west1m" <west1m(at)hotmail.com> |
I just started flying my Firefly. It was running very hot 1200+ ish.
66' 30 pitch wooden prop. the prop is a bit under pitched as I can over rev it.
However, I saw a chart in Leading edge catalog that shows a 155 main jet for a
447 with a silencer or a 165 jet with out. I only have a K&N type filter.
I switched to a 162 jet and a moved the needle to the middle rich position and
problem solved, low 1000 temps. I will likely put the needle back to the middle
lean position.
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441368#441368
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
| From: | Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com> |
I read an article a few years back from the guy that developed the EGT
system. He said that he was against the idea that there be any number
markings on the gage. The only information that was important is that the
pilot can see quickly that the engine has been leaned too much. The result
is a much quicker swing of the EGT than the CHT when leaning in flight.
That is also how it is explained during my private pilot training.
So all this talk about adjusting the prop to get a specific EGT number just
sounds funny. I fail to understand how a engine is better when the heat of
the exhaust is captured more by the engine.
By all means get the prop loading right. Make sure the CHT temps are in
line and the spark plugs read correctly (these are the important things).
Again the EGT will tell you quickly when you have leaned the mixture too
much.
As always worth what you paid of it.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 8:53 AM, west1m wrote:
>
> I just started flying my Firefly. It was running very hot 1200+ ish.
> 66' 30 pitch wooden prop. the prop is a bit under pitched as I can over
> rev it.
> However, I saw a chart in Leading edge catalog that shows a 155 main jet
> for a 447 with a silencer or a 165 jet with out. I only have a K&N type
> filter.
> I switched to a 162 jet and a moved the needle to the middle rich
> position and problem solved, low 1000 temps. I will likely put the needle
> back to the middle lean position.
>
> --------
> West1m
> Hastings, MN
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441368#441368
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
Aluminum melts at 1221F. Rotax two stroke EGT redline is 1200. That's
close to the melting point. Instruments are not precision. A tiny hot
spot will melt a speck of the piston ring groove, enough to cause rings
to stick and blow by, then seizure.
I am a fan of the four stroke. They aren't as critical to tune as the
two stroke. They run well for me right out of the box. Prop loading is
not critical.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Neilsen
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
I read an article a few years back from the guy that developed the EGT
system. He said that he was against the idea that there be any number
markings on the gage. The only information that was important is that
the pilot can see quickly that the engine has been leaned too much. The
result is a much quicker swing of the EGT than the CHT when leaning in
flight. That is also how it is explained during my private pilot
training.
So all this talk about adjusting the prop to get a specific EGT number
just sounds funny. I fail to understand how a engine is better when the
heat of the exhaust is captured more by the engine.
By all means get the prop loading right. Make sure the CHT temps are in
line and the spark plugs read correctly (these are the important
things). Again the EGT will tell you quickly when you have leaned the
mixture too much.
As always worth what you paid of it.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 8:53 AM, west1m wrote:
I just started flying my Firefly. It was running very hot 1200+ ish.
66' 30 pitch wooden prop. the prop is a bit under pitched as I can over
rev it.
However, I saw a chart in Leading edge catalog that shows a 155 main
jet for a 447 with a silencer or a 165 jet with out. I only have a K&N
type filter.
I switched to a 162 jet and a moved the needle to the middle rich
position and problem solved, low 1000 temps. I will likely put the
needle back to the middle lean position.
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441368#441368
-List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
FORUMS -
_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stuart Harner" <stuart(at)harnerfarm.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
Not knowing a great deal about 2 stroke engines, I think the EGT limits
are to keep the exhaust ports from burning out. EGT is an indication of
whether or not the combustion is taking place mostly in the cylinder or
if it is spilling out into the exhaust. A charge of gas that is still
burning when the piston goes past the exhaust port would kind of act
like a cutting torch on the edges of the port.
On my 447 the only leaning is done with the clip on the needle (or
swapping needles and or jets). You can make the mixture more rich by
adding =9Cchoke=9D, which is what I have done on a couple of
occasions. Of course, the ideal is to get the engine to operate
properly though the entire RPM range so you don=99t have to fiddle
with things like the enricher while in the landing circuit.
I don=99t have anything against using the enricher when needed,
and indeed that may be the best solution for me. Maybe it will become
part of my descent and landing procedure. Kind of like adding carb heat
and going full rich when flying my old Cherokee. If that becomes the
case, I may relocate the enricher lever to be down by the throttle so I
am not reaching around blindly for a lever I can=99t see.
>From what I can gather, prop loading/engine mixtures is more sensitive
on little two strokes like the 447 and changes quite readily with temp
and altitude. Trying to fly in 3 seasons may cause me to have to adjust
things several times a year.
In any case, weather forecast is for flying conditions tomorrow.
Hopefully they are right this time, I am anxious to get back up and do
some more experimenting.
Stuart
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Neilsen
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
I read an article a few years back from the guy that developed the EGT
system. He said that he was against the idea that there be any number
markings on the gage. The only information that was important is that
the pilot can see quickly that the engine has been leaned too much. The
result is a much quicker swing of the EGT than the CHT when leaning in
flight. That is also how it is explained during my private pilot
training.
So all this talk about adjusting the prop to get a specific EGT number
just sounds funny. I fail to understand how a engine is better when the
heat of the exhaust is captured more by the engine.
By all means get the prop loading right. Make sure the CHT temps are in
line and the spark plugs read correctly (these are the important
things). Again the EGT will tell you quickly when you have leaned the
mixture too much.
As always worth what you paid of it.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 8:53 AM, west1m wrote:
I just started flying my Firefly. It was running very hot 1200+ ish.
66' 30 pitch wooden prop. the prop is a bit under pitched as I can over
rev it.
However, I saw a chart in Leading edge catalog that shows a 155 main
jet for a 447 with a silencer or a 165 jet with out. I only have a K&N
type filter.
I switched to a 162 jet and a moved the needle to the middle rich
position and problem solved, low 1000 temps. I will likely put the
needle back to the middle lean position.
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441368#441368
-List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
FORUMS -
_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
remember also...Stuart...the engine is on the main jet from somewhere
beyond 65 to 75 % throttle opening...before that you are on the needle
jet and needle..... Herb
On 04/27/2015 11:02 AM, Stuart Harner wrote:
>
> Not knowing a great deal about 2 stroke engines, I think the EGT
> limits are to keep the exhaust ports from burning out. EGT is an
> indication of whether or not the combustion is taking place mostly in
> the cylinder or if it is spilling out into the exhaust. A charge of
> gas that is still burning when the piston goes past the exhaust port
> would kind of act like a cutting torch on the edges of the port.
>
> On my 447 the only leaning is done with the clip on the needle (or
> swapping needles and or jets). You can make the mixture more rich by
> adding choke, which is what I have done on a couple of occasions.
> Of course, the ideal is to get the engine to operate properly though
> the entire RPM range so you dont have to fiddle with things like the
> enricher while in the landing circuit.
>
> I dont have anything against using the enricher when needed, and
> indeed that may be the best solution for me. Maybe it will become
> part of my descent and landing procedure. Kind of like adding carb
> heat and going full rich when flying my old Cherokee. If that becomes
> the case, I may relocate the enricher lever to be down by the throttle
> so I am not reaching around blindly for a lever I cant see.
>
> From what I can gather, prop loading/engine mixtures is more sensitive
> on little two strokes like the 447 and changes quite readily with temp
> and altitude. Trying to fly in 3 seasons may cause me to have to
> adjust things several times a year.
>
> In any case, weather forecast is for flying conditions tomorrow.
> Hopefully they are right this time, I am anxious to get back up and do
> some more experimenting.
>
> Stuart
>
> *From:*owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Rick Neilsen
> *Sent:* Monday, April 27, 2015 9:50 AM
> *To:* kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
>
> I read an article a few years back from the guy that developed the EGT
> system. He said that he was against the idea that there be any number
> markings on the gage. The only information that was important is that
> the pilot can see quickly that the engine has been leaned too much.
> The result is a much quicker swing of the EGT than the CHT when
> leaning in flight. That is also how it is explained during my private
> pilot training.
>
> So all this talk about adjusting the prop to get a specific EGT number
> just sounds funny. I fail to understand how a engine is better when
> the heat of the exhaust is captured more by the engine.
>
> By all means get the prop loading right. Make sure the CHT temps are
> in line and the spark plugs read correctly (these are the important
> things). Again the EGT will tell you quickly when you have leaned the
> mixture too much.
>
> As always worth what you paid of it.
>
> Rick Neilsen
>
> Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
>
> On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 8:53 AM, west1m > wrote:
>
> >
>
> I just started flying my Firefly. It was running very hot 1200+ ish.
> 66' 30 pitch wooden prop. the prop is a bit under pitched as I can
> over rev it.
> However, I saw a chart in Leading edge catalog that shows a 155 main
> jet for a 447 with a silencer or a 165 jet with out. I only have a K&N
> type filter.
> I switched to a 162 jet and a moved the needle to the middle rich
> position and problem solved, low 1000 temps. I will likely put the
> needle back to the middle lean position.
>
> --------
> West1m
> Hastings, MN
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441368#441368
>
>
> ==========
> -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
> ==========
> FORUMS -
> _blank">http://forums.matronics.com
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stuart Harner" <stuart(at)harnerfarm.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
Absolutely. I am shooting for high 1100=99s EGT and mid
300=99s for CHT. I think the 2 stroke is a fine line dance between
shock cooling and burning up. Carefully monitored and well maintained
the little Rotax would seem to be capable of going beyond what the
factory says it will, but make any mistakes and you are looking for a
place to land!
The Rotax guy from LEAF told us at OSH that 1250=C2=B0 was the absolute
top red line limit. Since my manual has no listing for max EGT, I will
defer to the factory certified guy. Consequently, I have my EIS limit
set to 1225=C2=B0.
If I could find a viable 4 stroke to put on a Firefly and keep it Part
103, I would buy it in a heartbeat.
Of course, 2 HP from every cubic inch of displacement on .01 GPH is
every pilots wet dream, right? Now where did I leave that box of
di-lithium crystals and that bottle of anti-matter?
Anyway, I think there may be a future in electric motors for the
Firefly. They are getting close to having reliable long lasing
batteries. The motors and controllers already exist. If you can get a
battery that will run a 30 HP motor for an hour with some left in
reserve that does not cost $45K and weigh 100#, we will be in business.
Stuart
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hauck
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 10:06 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
Aluminum melts at 1221F. Rotax two stroke EGT redline is 1200. That's
close to the melting point. Instruments are not precision. A tiny hot
spot will melt a speck of the piston ring groove, enough to cause rings
to stick and blow by, then seizure.
I am a fan of the four stroke. They aren't as critical to tune as the
two stroke. They run well for me right out of the box. Prop loading is
not critical.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Neilsen
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
I read an article a few years back from the guy that developed the EGT
system. He said that he was against the idea that there be any number
markings on the gage. The only information that was important is that
the pilot can see quickly that the engine has been leaned too much. The
result is a much quicker swing of the EGT than the CHT when leaning in
flight. That is also how it is explained during my private pilot
training.
So all this talk about adjusting the prop to get a specific EGT number
just sounds funny. I fail to understand how a engine is better when the
heat of the exhaust is captured more by the engine.
By all means get the prop loading right. Make sure the CHT temps are in
line and the spark plugs read correctly (these are the important
things). Again the EGT will tell you quickly when you have leaned the
mixture too much.
As always worth what you paid of it.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 8:53 AM, west1m wrote:
I just started flying my Firefly. It was running very hot 1200+ ish.
66' 30 pitch wooden prop. the prop is a bit under pitched as I can over
rev it.
However, I saw a chart in Leading edge catalog that shows a 155 main
jet for a 447 with a silencer or a 165 jet with out. I only have a K&N
type filter.
I switched to a 162 jet and a moved the needle to the middle rich
position and problem solved, low 1000 temps. I will likely put the
needle back to the middle lean position.
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441368#441368
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--> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
I don't seem to be able to copy the page out of the two stroke manual,
but MAX EGT is 1200F. Normal EGT is 860F to 1000F. That is on page
10-1.
MAX CHT is 500F. Normal is 374-446F.
Seems to me if you operate the 447 at 1200F and have your warning light
set at 1225F, you will be well over the red line before you know it. I
cannot remember how far downstream the EGT probe is located, but it is a
significant distance from the edge of the exhaust port. Seems to me, as
an uneducated hobbyist, the exhaust will be cooler at the probe.
Again, ultralight instruments are far from precision instruments.
I did pretty good with my two stroke engines flying them as they were
set up at the factory. The idea is to prop to the engine, not tune the
engine to the prop. Most two stroke engine failures are the result of
operators chasing their tail, trying to reinvent the wheel.
Here's the URL for the Rotax Two Stroke Manual. I assume it is the
current version:
http://www.rotax-aircraft-engines.com/portaldata/5/dokus/d04495.pdf
The above is my opinion only.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stuart Harner
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 11:24 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
Absolutely. I am shooting for high 1100=99s EGT and mid
300=99s for CHT. I think the 2 stroke is a fine line dance between
shock cooling and burning up. Carefully monitored and well maintained
the little Rotax would seem to be capable of going beyond what the
factory says it will, but make any mistakes and you are looking for a
place to land!
The Rotax guy from LEAF told us at OSH that 1250=C2=B0 was the absolute
top red line limit. Since my manual has no listing for max EGT, I will
defer to the factory certified guy. Consequently, I have my EIS limit
set to 1225=C2=B0.
If I could find a viable 4 stroke to put on a Firefly and keep it Part
103, I would buy it in a heartbeat.
Of course, 2 HP from every cubic inch of displacement on .01 GPH is
every pilots wet dream, right? Now where did I leave that box of
di-lithium crystals and that bottle of anti-matter?
Anyway, I think there may be a future in electric motors for the
Firefly. They are getting close to having reliable long lasing
batteries. The motors and controllers already exist. If you can get a
battery that will run a 30 HP motor for an hour with some left in
reserve that does not cost $45K and weigh 100#, we will be in business.
Stuart
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hauck
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 10:06 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
Aluminum melts at 1221F. Rotax two stroke EGT redline is 1200. That's
close to the melting point. Instruments are not precision. A tiny hot
spot will melt a speck of the piston ring groove, enough to cause rings
to stick and blow by, then seizure.
I am a fan of the four stroke. They aren't as critical to tune as the
two stroke. They run well for me right out of the box. Prop loading is
not critical.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Neilsen
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
I read an article a few years back from the guy that developed the EGT
system. He said that he was against the idea that there be any number
markings on the gage. The only information that was important is that
the pilot can see quickly that the engine has been leaned too much. The
result is a much quicker swing of the EGT than the CHT when leaning in
flight. That is also how it is explained during my private pilot
training.
So all this talk about adjusting the prop to get a specific EGT number
just sounds funny. I fail to understand how a engine is better when the
heat of the exhaust is captured more by the engine.
By all means get the prop loading right. Make sure the CHT temps are in
line and the spark plugs read correctly (these are the important
things). Again the EGT will tell you quickly when you have leaned the
mixture too much.
As always worth what you paid of it.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 8:53 AM, west1m wrote:
I just started flying my Firefly. It was running very hot 1200+ ish.
66' 30 pitch wooden prop. the prop is a bit under pitched as I can over
rev it.
However, I saw a chart in Leading edge catalog that shows a 155 main
jet for a 447 with a silencer or a 165 jet with out. I only have a K&N
type filter.
I switched to a 162 jet and a moved the needle to the middle rich
position and problem solved, low 1000 temps. I will likely put the
needle back to the middle lean position.
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441368#441368
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FORUMS -
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- The Kolb-List Email Forum -
--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
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--> http://forums.matronics.com
- List Contribution Web Site -
Thank you for your generous support!
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
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http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stuart Harner" <stuart(at)harnerfarm.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
Ah-Ha! Good find John. Thanks for the link.
My manual is older, and has this info:
I will be downloading and using the new version from here on out. EIS
limits will be adjusted down to 1200=C2=B0. It is also interesting to
see that it is acceptable to be in the high 800=99s in normal
operation. My understanding was that it should be at least 1000=C2=B0.
Strange, I had asked this question at OSH specifically since it was not
in my manual. Based on the higher CHT temps, the slightly higher
1250=C2=B0 EGT seemed to be in line that the 447 ran slightly hotter
than the 503. HMM, makes me wonder about other things said
there
Most of the time I am seeing 1150 =93 1190, but on a couple of
occasions I have seen it spike into the 1200+ range, which I quickly got
out of by changing throttle settings or adding =9Cchoke=9D.
While I don=99t think any damage was done, there certainly is no
reason to push destructive temperatures.
The probe bosses were welded in by Rotax. I don=99t remember the
dimensions off the top of my head, but I did measure to see that they
matched the instructions of where to drill if there were no bosses.
If memory serves me the hot spot may well be farther downstream than the
port opening itself. From welding class days the hot spot of the flame
is not at the tip but at the point of the lighter blue flame in the
middle. Since I can=99t see inside the exhaust, I can only imagine
that this MAY be the case.
I am going to read this updated version to see what other changes there
were. That may shed more light on what steps to take next.
The learning curve never ends.
Thanks,
Stuart
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hauck
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 12:22 PM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
I don't seem to be able to copy the page out of the two stroke manual,
but MAX EGT is 1200F. Normal EGT is 860F to 1000F. That is on page
10-1.
MAX CHT is 500F. Normal is 374-446F.
Seems to me if you operate the 447 at 1200F and have your warning light
set at 1225F, you will be well over the red line before you know it. I
cannot remember how far downstream the EGT probe is located, but it is a
significant distance from the edge of the exhaust port. Seems to me, as
an uneducated hobbyist, the exhaust will be cooler at the probe.
Again, ultralight instruments are far from precision instruments.
I did pretty good with my two stroke engines flying them as they were
set up at the factory. The idea is to prop to the engine, not tune the
engine to the prop. Most two stroke engine failures are the result of
operators chasing their tail, trying to reinvent the wheel.
Here's the URL for the Rotax Two Stroke Manual. I assume it is the
current version:
http://www.rotax-aircraft-engines.com/portaldata/5/dokus/d04495.pdf
The above is my opinion only.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Stuart Harner
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 11:24 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
Absolutely. I am shooting for high 1100=99s EGT and mid
300=99s for CHT. I think the 2 stroke is a fine line dance between
shock cooling and burning up. Carefully monitored and well maintained
the little Rotax would seem to be capable of going beyond what the
factory says it will, but make any mistakes and you are looking for a
place to land!
The Rotax guy from LEAF told us at OSH that 1250=C2=B0 was the absolute
top red line limit. Since my manual has no listing for max EGT, I will
defer to the factory certified guy. Consequently, I have my EIS limit
set to 1225=C2=B0.
If I could find a viable 4 stroke to put on a Firefly and keep it Part
103, I would buy it in a heartbeat.
Of course, 2 HP from every cubic inch of displacement on .01 GPH is
every pilots wet dream, right? Now where did I leave that box of
di-lithium crystals and that bottle of anti-matter?
Anyway, I think there may be a future in electric motors for the
Firefly. They are getting close to having reliable long lasing
batteries. The motors and controllers already exist. If you can get a
battery that will run a 30 HP motor for an hour with some left in
reserve that does not cost $45K and weigh 100#, we will be in business.
Stuart
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hauck
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 10:06 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
Aluminum melts at 1221F. Rotax two stroke EGT redline is 1200. That's
close to the melting point. Instruments are not precision. A tiny hot
spot will melt a speck of the piston ring groove, enough to cause rings
to stick and blow by, then seizure.
I am a fan of the four stroke. They aren't as critical to tune as the
two stroke. They run well for me right out of the box. Prop loading is
not critical.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Neilsen
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
I read an article a few years back from the guy that developed the EGT
system. He said that he was against the idea that there be any number
markings on the gage. The only information that was important is that
the pilot can see quickly that the engine has been leaned too much. The
result is a much quicker swing of the EGT than the CHT when leaning in
flight. That is also how it is explained during my private pilot
training.
So all this talk about adjusting the prop to get a specific EGT number
just sounds funny. I fail to understand how a engine is better when the
heat of the exhaust is captured more by the engine.
By all means get the prop loading right. Make sure the CHT temps are in
line and the spark plugs read correctly (these are the important
things). Again the EGT will tell you quickly when you have leaned the
mixture too much.
As always worth what you paid of it.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 8:53 AM, west1m wrote:
I just started flying my Firefly. It was running very hot 1200+ ish.
66' 30 pitch wooden prop. the prop is a bit under pitched as I can over
rev it.
However, I saw a chart in Leading edge catalog that shows a 155 main
jet for a 447 with a silencer or a 165 jet with out. I only have a K&N
type filter.
I switched to a 162 jet and a moved the needle to the middle rich
position and problem solved, low 1000 temps. I will likely put the
needle back to the middle lean position.
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441368#441368
-List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
FORUMS -
_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
- The Kolb-List Email Forum -
--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
--> http://forums.matronics.com
- List Contribution Web Site -
Thank you for your generous support!
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
--> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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--> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
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--> http://forums.matronics.com
- List Contribution Web Site -
Thank you for your generous support!
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
--> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Aman <zeprep251(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
Rick,
I agree with you on 4 stroke engines.But I always considered cht , on a 2 stroke
to be a indication more of load than mixture.If i was under propped it was like
running in second gear, lots of revs but not much load.no load makes the 2
stroke lean out which ups the egt but keeps the head cooler.In my opinion,you
need to prop the engine for the operating rpm then adjust the mixture for the
amount of load at that rpm.My 503 ,prop set for 6100, on takeoff gave about 1000
degrees at full throttle climb out and less than 1200 at 5500 cruise.But the
firestar was so clean the throttle was around half open at that rpm.At 5700
the egts got close to 1200 and 75 mph cruise but the head temps were always well
under the limits
G.Aman 750 hrs on the Firestar 503 dcdi oil injected
-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com>
Sent: Mon, Apr 27, 2015 10:50 am
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
I read an article a few years back from the guy that developed the EGT system.
He said that he was against the idea that there be any number markings on the
gage. The only information that was important is that the pilot can see quickly
that the engine has been leaned too much. The result is a much quicker swing
of the EGT than the CHT when leaning in flight. That is also how it is explained
during my private pilot training.
So all this talk about adjusting the prop to get a specific EGT number just sounds
funny. I fail to understand how a engine is better when the heat of the exhaust
is captured more by the engine.
By all means get the prop loading right. Make sure the CHT temps are in line and
the spark plugs read correctly (these are the important things). Again the EGT
will tell you quickly when you have leaned the mixture too much.
As always worth what you paid of it.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 8:53 AM, west1m wrote:
I just started flying my Firefly. It was running very hot 1200+ ish.
66' 30 pitch wooden prop. the prop is a bit under pitched as I can over rev it.
However, I saw a chart in Leading edge catalog that shows a 155 main jet for
a 447 with a silencer or a 165 jet with out. I only have a K&N type filter.
I switched to a 162 jet and a moved the needle to the middle rich position and
problem solved, low 1000 temps. I will likely put the needle back to the middle
lean position.
--------
West1m
Hastings, MN
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441368#441368
===========
-List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
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_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
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target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
[quote="John Hauck"]
The idea is to prop to the engine, not tune the engine to the prop. Most two stroke
engine failures are the result of operators chasing their tail, trying to
reinvent the wheel.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
[quote]
This. Jet it the way the book says, and then fiddle with the prop pitch until the
numbers are happy. Did a 150 hour carbon cleanout of the 582 top end last week,
flew Friday, climbout turning 6300, EGT 1,000. Cruising at 5,300 to 5,600
rpm gave consistent matching EGT's of 1050 to 1100. No problem with high EGT's
on descent because you adjust the throttle a bit and they stay around 1000.
Checked the plugs after landing, they are a medium brown.
Hope to fly again tomorrow with a passenger, will give an update and maybe a photo
of the plugs. The plugs verify if the temperatures are acceptable, and if
the EGT is close to accurate. From then on, the EGT gauge is mostly to warn you
anomalies.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441420#441420
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
Shouldn't the plug check be done at the power setting that you want to
check, e.g., cruise, WOT, etc?
If the plugs are checked after landing and taxi back to the hanger, does
that not give you an indication for low speed, low power settings?
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Pike
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 9:54 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Firefly/447 RPM question
-->
[quote="John Hauck"]
The idea is to prop to the engine, not tune the engine to the prop. Most
two stroke engine failures are the result of operators chasing their tail,
trying to reinvent the wheel.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
[quote]
This. Jet it the way the book says, and then fiddle with the prop pitch
until the numbers are happy. Did a 150 hour carbon cleanout of the 582 top
end last week, flew Friday, climbout turning 6300, EGT 1,000. Cruising at
5,300 to 5,600 rpm gave consistent matching EGT's of 1050 to 1100. No
problem with high EGT's on descent because you adjust the throttle a bit and
they stay around 1000. Checked the plugs after landing, they are a medium
brown.
Hope to fly again tomorrow with a passenger, will give an update and maybe a
photo of the plugs. The plugs verify if the temperatures are acceptable, and
if the EGT is close to accurate. From then on, the EGT gauge is mostly to
warn you anomalies.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and
those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441420#441420
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Firefly/447 RPM question |
| From: | "Richard Pike" <thegreybaron(at)charter.net> |
John Hauck wrote:
> Shouldn't the plug check be done at the power setting that you want to
> check, e.g., cruise, WOT, etc?
>
> If the plugs are checked after landing and taxi back to the hanger, does
> that not give you an indication for low speed, low power settings?
>
> john h
> mkIII
> Titus, Alabama
>
> --
I have always heard that, but years ago when I was building dirt bikes - 2 stroke
- I would check the plugs after a plain "ride," and then do a run at a specific
speed or load to check the jetting, and I couldn't see the difference. Perhaps
an expert with a magnifying glass could, but in my laymans experience, the
plugs sort of were what they were. For instance, putting in brand new plugs,
going out and doing a test, and then pulling them and looking at them, there
was not enough accumulation to tell much of anything.
Maybe I was just doing something wrong, or maybe I am missing something. I would
be glad to hear from somebody who is actually real good at that particular skill.
Since I run at cruise power & 1,000' AGL 95% of the time, and then just pull it
back on final, and then a fast idle downhill to taxi to the hangar, I am thinking
that I am not going to alter the appearance of the plugs all that much from
their normal state by that last 3 minutes of run time. But I could be wrong.
--------
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those
to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=441434#441434
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> |
March 10, 2015 - April 28, 2015
Kolb-Archive.digest.vol-nk