Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-di
August 14, 2003 - August 31, 2003
the
unrolled paper, it really gives me a feel for how fast I'm actually
traveling...it gets small really fast!! The thing is so light, and falls so slow,
that
any slight breeze blows it way off target. Once in a while I get it to land
within 1/4 mile. On several occasions, I'll climb to the highest altitude I've
ever been to - around 3000' AGL, and let one go, and circle back around and
see if I can cut it...very difficult to do. I haven't got a cut yet, but it
sure is a Hoot to try !!
Chuck G.
More flying stories to come !!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James Dallas" <BEC176(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: long-time auditor |
John, there is a guy on the corvair list that is just South of Chicago that is
always selling engines. I will try and get his name.
Jim D
----- Original Message -----
From: john e fay
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2003 6:41 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: long-time auditor
> Last Fall I started building my Piet.
I will use the Corvair and have three
> engines
> waiting.
> Arden Adamson
>
> Waupaca, WI
>
Arden,
Do you know where there are any more of those engines available.
John Fay in Peoria
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Dilatush" <dilatush(at)amigo.net> |
| Subject: | Re: flying stories |
----- Original Message -----
From: <Isablcorky(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: flying stories
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Corky,
Good for you, what can they do to you anyway?
John
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
> Gary,
>
> 1. Never volunteer for anything
>
> 2. He who asks questions gets answers
>
> 3. My Dr says I'm ok. Good eyes, reflexies, blood pressure, nerves,
attitude,
> just deaf'ern hell. Don't use a radio so that's not important.
>
> 4. Soooooooooooooo who gives a damn about waiting for those beauros to get
> off their dead Clinton and pass a ruling. Not this rebel
>
> Guess who in La
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: More Flying Stories !! |
In a message dated 8/14/03 9:19:17 PM Central Daylight Time, BEC176(at)msn.com
writes:
<< The bad things I've taught you!!! >>
Why is it always the bad things that are so much fun ?? !!
Hey Jim, or anyone else, are you going to Blakesburg Iowa at the end of the
month? Another adventure in the works !!
Chuck G.
working on a tailwheel, and front seatbelt harness.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: wing flop panel |
I've always assumed the same--pilot entry from
the left. And yet, all the front cockpit doors I've
seen are on the right. ??????
> >
> I think most folks make their flop panels symmetrical about the airplane's
> centerline, but what the heck- it makes sense to make it wider on the
entry
> side of the plane.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 08/13/03 |
Garth,
Have you tried your local CORSA chapter?
I found a guy with two engines, one for
$100 Canadian and the other, still in the car
and running fine for $250 Can, thats $70 and
170 US. Well I bought the cheap one of
course and it turned out partialy unusable so
I bit the bullet, phoned him and yes he still
had the other. He sold me that one for the
difference since the first didn't work out. So
I have 1 3/4 engines for 250. I have been
offered another engine( haven't seen it.) free
from another Piet guy not on the list.
One point is, once you put the word out in
your local aviation community good things
seem to happen.
I thought I'd NEVER get one, now three!!
Have patience, it will come.
Another thing is that there are Piet builders
that for one reason or another don't want
to become involved on the web. There's
probably at least one such in your area.
There's four I know of within 3 hrs of me.
And another Piet hanging in a museum, unflown.
Corsa--http://www.corvair.org/
Clif Dawson, Another member of
the Raven family.
>
> Arden,
> I've just started my search for a Corvair and have not had much
luck
> finding anything to overhaul under $500. Since you have accumulated three,
I
> thought I would ask if you might suggest where I might start shopping for
an
> engine to build up.
> Garth Dawson
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Dilatush" <dilatush(at)amigo.net> |
| Subject: | Re: wing flop panel |
----- Original Message -----
From: "clif" <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: wing flop panel
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Clif,
I'ts tradition, you always mount your horse from the left side, but ladies
wish to enter their carriage from the right, which is curb side to avoid the
mud. :o)
John
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
> I've always assumed the same--pilot entry from
> the left. And yet, all the front cockpit doors I've
> seen are on the right. ??????
>
>
> > >
> > I think most folks make their flop panels symmetrical about the
airplane's
> > centerline, but what the heck- it makes sense to make it wider on the
> entry
> > side of the plane.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Markle" <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: More Flying Stories !! |
Wow, Blakesburg...that WOULD be an adventure.....it's definitely on my
"Where I'll Fly My Pietenpol" list...but....NO!!!! No more temptations!!!!
I'm going to my workshop (the garage) and getting back to work.....
One of my smart alecky friends looked at my center section last night and
observed that I only have 28' of a 30' wing left to complete......
Back to building for me......
jim
----- Original Message -----
From: <Rcaprd(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: More Flying Stories !!
>
> In a message dated 8/14/03 9:19:17 PM Central Daylight Time,
BEC176(at)msn.com
> writes:
>
> << The bad things I've taught you!!! >>
>
> Why is it always the bad things that are so much fun ?? !!
>
> Hey Jim, or anyone else, are you going to Blakesburg Iowa at the end of
the
> month? Another adventure in the works !!
>
> Chuck G.
> working on a tailwheel, and front seatbelt harness.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jack Textor <Jack(at)personnelincorporated.com> |
| Subject: | More Flying Stories !! |
Chuck,
I will be there, sans airplane. It is a great fly-in, usually a half dozen
Piets. I'm hoping to catch my first ride in one. I'm building an RV 8 but
thinking seriously about starting a Piet. Who knows. Hope to meet you.
Jack
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Markle
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: More Flying Stories !!
Wow, Blakesburg...that WOULD be an adventure.....it's definitely on my
"Where I'll Fly My Pietenpol" list...but....NO!!!! No more temptations!!!!
I'm going to my workshop (the garage) and getting back to work.....
One of my smart alecky friends looked at my center section last night and
observed that I only have 28' of a 30' wing left to complete......
Back to building for me......
jim
----- Original Message -----
From: <Rcaprd(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: More Flying Stories !!
>
> In a message dated 8/14/03 9:19:17 PM Central Daylight Time,
BEC176(at)msn.com
> writes:
>
> << The bad things I've taught you!!! >>
>
> Why is it always the bad things that are so much fun ?? !!
>
> Hey Jim, or anyone else, are you going to Blakesburg Iowa at the end of
the
> month? Another adventure in the works !!
>
> Chuck G.
> working on a tailwheel, and front seatbelt harness.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Arden Adamson" <adamson(at)wnmdag.org> |
John & Garth,
I purchased my three Corvair engines (correct serial numbers according
to W. Wynne) from an older gentleman who had been a Corvair buff for
many years. He said he was now too old and wanted to sell all his
parts. He had a real collection. I found him on the Corvair club web
site. He lives near Sheboygan, WI and said he has about 50 engines. He
sold me three for $25 each. That's right, $25 each for a total of $75.
I believe they are good rebuildable engines. Also purchased two of the
preferred oil coolers for $15. His name is Bob Ehrenreich,
(920-458-1170). Hope this helps.
Arden
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Loar" <skycarl(at)megsinet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: wing flop panel |
Walt,,, Me too, Sounds like the same procedure I use to get in.
Carl
----- Original Message -----
From: "w b evans" <wbeevans(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: wing flop panel
>
> Jim,
> I assume you have small tires and/or a step, and/or a higher wing than
> standard.
> I built with the original "V" gear with the 21" O.D. tires. I'm 6'3" and
> after I do a high kick, like the Rockettes, get my leg in, my left toe
is
> "toedancing" to get me to the hole. Now as I rest some butt weight on the
> turtledeck, so I can reach forward to grab a strut, I'm right in the
center
> of my circular cutout.
> There is no way I would be able to get in with out the cutout.
> walt evans
> NX140DL
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "dpilot" <dpilot(at)yahoo.com>
> To:
> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: wing flop panel
>
>
> >
> > Why in the world does anybody need a flop panel?
> > I have moved my wing 6.5 inches to the rear, and the rain doesn't drip
in
> the rear seat,
> > and I have no problem getting in or out.
> > I am 6'6" tall, 260 pounds and 70 years old.
> > Seems to me a lot younger and smaller guys are less able to bend!
> > JimV.
> >
> >
> > "Hubbard, Eugene" wrote:
> >
> > I couldn't figure out how to do an assymetrical flop panel on a 3-piece
> > wing.
> >
> > Gene
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Oscar Zuniga [mailto:taildrags(at)hotmail.com]
> > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: Pietenpol-List: wing flop panel
> >
> >
> >
> > Y'know, folks- I seem to learn something every time I sit down and look
at
> > the plans or pictures of the Pietenpol. Last night I was looking at the
> > Pete Bowers article on the Piet from back in the 60's and noticed in the
> > 3-view (very informative, by the way, and clearer than the BHP plans
> 3-views
> >
> > in many details) that the wing flop panel is asymmetrical... it's wider
on
> > the port side to make entry easier. Coincidentally, I was browsing
through
> > the pictures that Mike Cuy uploaded to the Matronics site and noticed
the
> > same thing in a photo of the beautiful yellow Piet. I had never noticed
> > that in the plans or in photos, but there it is.
> >
> > I think most folks make their flop panels symmetrical about the
airplane's
> > centerline, but what the heck- it makes sense to make it wider on the
> entry
> > side of the plane.
> >
> > Oscar Zuniga
> > San Antonio, TX
> > mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
> > website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Waytogopiet(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: wing flop panel |
In a message dated 8/15/2003 11:24:28 AM Central Standard Time,
skycarl(at)megsinet.net writes:
> I couldn't figure out how to do an assymetrical flop panel on a 3-piece
> >>wing.
> >>
> >>Gene
>
Gene
Terminate the aft end of your root fairings at the front edge of the flop.
Extend your flop width to fill the 3" root gap to within 1/4 " (after covering
allowance) of the wing root ribs on either side. You'll be surprised at the
added room this small amount will give you. And, you can board from either the
right or left side. This assumes you are building according to the plans and
are NOT using the "gapless" Gary (Kerri Ann) Price design. My cabanes have not
been raised and I have no trouble getting in, standing up (with the flop open)
and sliding into the seat.
Don Hicks
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Hubbard, Eugene" <ehubbard(at)titan.com> |
Already did it that way, and it works fine. But it's symmetric... ;-)
Gene
-----Original Message-----
From: Waytogopiet(at)aol.com [mailto:Waytogopiet(at)aol.com]
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: wing flop panel
In a message dated 8/15/2003 11:24:28 AM Central Standard Time,
skycarl(at)megsinet.net writes:
> I couldn't figure out how to do an assymetrical flop panel on a 3-piece
> >>wing.
> >>
> >>Gene
>
Gene
Terminate the aft end of your root fairings at the front edge of the flop.
Extend your flop width to fill the 3" root gap to within 1/4 " (after
covering
allowance) of the wing root ribs on either side. You'll be surprised at the
added room this small amount will give you. And, you can board from either
the
right or left side. This assumes you are building according to the plans and
are NOT using the "gapless" Gary (Kerri Ann) Price design. My cabanes have
not
been raised and I have no trouble getting in, standing up (with the flop
open)
and sliding into the seat.
Don Hicks
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ANNCARLEK(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 27 Msgs - 08/14/03 |
In a message dated 8/15/03 12:02:37 AM, pietenpol-list-digest(at)matronics.com
writes:
<< From: "Hubbard, Eugene" <ehubbard(at)titan.com>
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: wing flop panel
>>
Someone on this list suggested to me that I could make a "dog-leg" panel for
the flop. My way of thinking just doesn't include asymmetries, so I really
appreciate the suggestion, and that is just what I did. I'm hinging the flop at
the rear spar, so it's going to be easy to get in and out, and I'm using a
handle just like your for an assist. I wish I could remember the suggestor so I
could give him credit!
CARL L @ COMPTON AIRPORT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Ash <ashcan(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 12 Msgs - |
08/13/03
This is why I asked Garth0, you wrote:
>
>Garth,
>
>Have you tried your local CORSA chapter?
>I found a guy with two engines, one for
>$100 Canadian and the other, still in the car
>and running fine for $250 Can, thats $70 and
>170 US. Well I bought the cheap one of
>course and it turned out partialy unusable so
>I bit the bullet, phoned him and yes he still
>had the other. He sold me that one for the
>difference since the first didn't work out. So
>I have 1 3/4 engines for 250. I have been
>offered another engine( haven't seen it.) free
>from another Piet guy not on the list.
>One point is, once you put the word out in
>your local aviation community good things
>seem to happen.
>
>I thought I'd NEVER get one, now three!!
>Have patience, it will come.
>
>Another thing is that there are Piet builders
>that for one reason or another don't want
>to become involved on the web. There's
>probably at least one such in your area.
>There's four I know of within 3 hrs of me.
>And another Piet hanging in a museum, unflown.
>
>Corsa--http://www.corvair.org/
>
>Clif Dawson, Another member of
> the Raven family.
>
> >
> > Arden,
> > I've just started my search for a Corvair and have not had much
>luck
> > finding anything to overhaul under $500. Since you have accumulated three,
>I
> > thought I would ask if you might suggest where I might start shopping for
>an
> > engine to build up.
> > Garth Dawson
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Ash <ashcan(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 12 Msgs - |
08/13/03
This is why I asked Garth where he was located. I could probably find him
the local people, and depending on where he's located, I might know a few
of them personally.
I've driven and worked on Corvairs since the late 70's; raced, rallied,
autocrossed, you name it. I've rebuilt my own engines more times than I can
remember. I've been a member of Central Florida Corvairs for 13 years, as a
guess. I was president for two years. We put on a yearly show that draws
cars from all over the southeast. I'm also a long-time Corsa member. My
customer number with Clark's is so low it gets comments sometimes.
Currently, I've got a '61 Lakewood and an Ultravan with a shot engine, but
I have a good 110 and transaxle waiting to be rebuilt and put in it. I've
got 4 other engines and I don't know how many transaxles in my basement,
including two 140's (no 110's, sorry guys). If I could find a decent
late-model coupe or convertible that wasn't priced like a senoir points
car, I'd probably pick it up. I've known William Wynne for a good number of
years; he used to deal cores with one of our members, and I've seen him at
Sun 'n Fun more than once. I bought his book many years back just to see
what he was up to.
Corvair stuff isn't hard to find if you know the right people, and it
doesn't have to be expensive. But it's an insiders game. Fortunately
getting on the inside isn't that hard.
Jim Ash
>
>Garth,
>
>Have you tried your local CORSA chapter?
>I found a guy with two engines, one for
>$100 Canadian and the other, still in the car
>and running fine for $250 Can, thats $70 and
>170 US. Well I bought the cheap one of
>course and it turned out partialy unusable so
>I bit the bullet, phoned him and yes he still
>had the other. He sold me that one for the
>difference since the first didn't work out. So
>I have 1 3/4 engines for 250. I have been
>offered another engine( haven't seen it.) free
>from another Piet guy not on the list.
>One point is, once you put the word out in
>your local aviation community good things
>seem to happen.
>
>I thought I'd NEVER get one, now three!!
>Have patience, it will come.
>
>Another thing is that there are Piet builders
>that for one reason or another don't want
>to become involved on the web. There's
>probably at least one such in your area.
>There's four I know of within 3 hrs of me.
>And another Piet hanging in a museum, unflown.
>
>Corsa--http://www.corvair.org/
>
>Clif Dawson, Another member of
> the Raven family.
>
> >
> > Arden,
> > I've just started my search for a Corvair and have not had much
>luck
> > finding anything to overhaul under $500. Since you have accumulated three,
>I
> > thought I would ask if you might suggest where I might start shopping for
>an
> > engine to build up.
> > Garth Dawson
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: wing flop panel |
Well, That sounds like a Pietenpol
kind of thing to do. No plans for a
door, but if I do, it'l be on the right.
Thanks, Clif
> Clif,
>
> I'ts tradition, you always mount your horse from the left side, but ladies
> wish to enter their carriage from the right, which is curb side to avoid
the
> mud. :o)
>
> John
> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka(at)yahoo.com> |
So I'll put my door on the left!
Peter
Wonthaggi Australia.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of clif
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: wing flop panel
Well, That sounds like a Pietenpol
kind of thing to do. No plans for a
door, but if I do, it'l be on the right.
Thanks, Clif
> Clif,
>
> I'ts tradition, you always mount your horse from the left side, but
> ladies wish to enter their carriage from the right, which is curb side
> to avoid
the
> mud. :o)
>
> John
> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
advertising on the Matronics Forums.
Share: Share photos & files with other List members.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "baileys" <baileys(at)ktis.net> |
| Subject: | Re: wing flop panel |
Umm, could it be because the throttle is on the left?
Bob B. - Missouri
----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: wing flop panel
>
> So I'll put my door on the left!
>
> Peter
> Wonthaggi Australia.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of clif
> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: wing flop panel
>
>
> Well, That sounds like a Pietenpol
> kind of thing to do. No plans for a
> door, but if I do, it'l be on the right.
> Thanks, Clif
>
> > Clif,
> >
> > I'ts tradition, you always mount your horse from the left side, but
> > ladies wish to enter their carriage from the right, which is curb side
> > to avoid
> the
> > mud. :o)
> >
> > John
> > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
>
> advertising on the Matronics Forums.
> Share: Share photos & files with other List members.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carbarvo(at)aol.com |
BuddyGuynes(at)msfc.nasa.gov, marylbutler(at)mindspring.com,
rwcarden(at)mindspring.com, cjcuboat(at)netscape.net, DSrimavin(at)aol.com,
donna(at)amtec-corp.com, EJestice(at)aol.com, steve_eldredge(at)byu.edu,
gbdoane3(at)mindspring.com, GMacLaren(at)aol.com, jack1(at)fidnet.com,
jortel(at)nc.rr.com, n56ml(at)hiwaay.net, lechowich(at)earthlink.net,
bill(at)gulfguaranty.com, johnnina(at)home.com, Frankplively(at)aol.com,
lnawms(at)msn.com, rluther(at)hiwaay.net,
kmccut(at)bellsouth.netkmccut@bellsouth.net, Michael.D.Cuy(at)lerc.nasa.gov,
moravia(at)moraviation.com, jhofenlo(at)intergraph.com, sortel(at)nc.rr.com,
svo(at)akc.org, 2scott(at)bellsouth.net, pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com,
rambog(at)erols.com, dramsey(at)hiwaay.net, Delta928(at)aol.com,
alexms1(at)bellsouth.net, stcroix(at)mddc.com, taildrags(at)hotmail.com,
vterry(at)harbert.net, tab60651(at)aol.com, toberer(at)netzero.net, LERACHVO(at)aol.com,
tvought(at)gte.net, hhzwinger(at)juno.com
I have just received word that someone with whom we communicate regularly has
gotten a virus that propagates through the address book. I have been advised
to check my computer for a file entitled jbdgmgr.exe. I found it in my
computer files and deleted it. This thing apparently lingers for a while in your
machine before it starts doing anything. The last time I got a notice like this,
it turned out to be a hoax and I wound up deleting a file that was supposed to
be there, so be careful. Since you are in my address book, you too may have
it. The logo is a Teddy bear. DO NOT OPEN THIS FILE! Contact me if you have any
uncertainty about this. I regret that this has happened. I don't know what I
could have done to prevent it that we haven't already done (we have antivirus
software....and you probably do too....) Best regards to all of you....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron Bell" <rbell(at)hpavet.com> |
This one is a Hoax.
From: http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;Q322993
There is a virus hoax that advises customers to delete a valid Windows file
that is named Jdbgmgr.exe. This file is the Microsoft Debugger Registrar for
Java.
Don't delete the file, but check it out on Microsofts support site or
Symantec web site for Norton Antivirus
http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/jdbgmgr.exe.file.hoax.html
Ya'll be careful out there, and keep your antivirus software up to date. :-)
and fly safely,
Ron Bell
----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Virus
|
| I have just received word that someone with whom we communicate regularly
has
| gotten a virus that propagates through the address book. I have been
advised
| to check my computer for a file entitled jbdgmgr.exe. I found it in my
| computer files and deleted it. This thing apparently lingers for a while
in your
| machine before it starts doing anything. The last time I got a notice like
this,
| it turned out to be a hoax and I wound up deleting a file that was
supposed to
| be there, so be careful. Since you are in my address book, you too may
have
| it. The logo is a Teddy bear. DO NOT OPEN THIS FILE! Contact me if you
have any
| uncertainty about this. I regret that this has happened. I don't know what
I
| could have done to prevent it that we haven't already done (we have
antivirus
| software....and you probably do too....) Best regards to all of you....
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
, , ,
, ,
, , ,
, , ,
, , ,
, , ,
, , ,
, ,
, , ,
<2scott(at)bellsouth.net>, , ,
, "Alex Sloan" ,
, , ,
, , ,
,
Yet another HOAX. File is loaded when Windows is installed. Please check
www.snopes.com BEFORE you send this Nonsense out.
----- Original Message -----
From: <Carbarvo(at)aol.com>
; ;
; ; ;
; ; ;
; ; ;
; ; ;
; ; ;
; ;
bellsouth.netkmccut@bellsouth.net>; ;
; ; ;
; <2scott(at)bellsouth.net>; ;
; ; ;
; ; ;
; ; ;
; ;
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Virus
>
> I have just received word that someone with whom we communicate regularly
has
> gotten a virus that propagates through the address book. I have been
advised
> to check my computer for a file entitled jbdgmgr.exe. I found it in my
> computer files and deleted it. This thing apparently lingers for a while
in your
> machine before it starts doing anything. The last time I got a notice like
this,
> it turned out to be a hoax and I wound up deleting a file that was
supposed to
> be there, so be careful. Since you are in my address book, you too may
have
> it. The logo is a Teddy bear. DO NOT OPEN THIS FILE! Contact me if you
have any
> uncertainty about this. I regret that this has happened. I don't know what
I
> could have done to prevent it that we haven't already done (we have
antivirus
> software....and you probably do too....) Best regards to all of you....
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LAWRENCE WILLIAMS" <lnawms(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | flying under bridges |
It's too long to recount on the list but, the next time any of you see me, ask
about flying a B-47 under the Mackinac bridge that spans between upper and lower
Michigan!!!
Larry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Patrick Driscoll" <patrick36(at)usfamily.net> |
| Subject: | Re: flying under bridges |
Larry,
I remember when the B-47 flew under the bridge. If I remember right, the
pilot was the son of an Air Force general. I think it was in the 50's and
the bridge had just been finished.
Pat Driscoll
patrick36(at)usfamily.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carbarvo(at)aol.com |
At the gentle "suggestion" of Cy Galley, I checked www.snopes.com and found
that they say the referenced address is indeed a hoax. This is very embarassing
and I apologize to all of you who, like me, were taken in.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LAWRENCE WILLIAMS" <lnawms(at)msn.com> |
Doug Bryant............please contact me off-line.
Thanks-
Larry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Ford" <Jford(at)indstate.edu> |
jbdgmgr.exe is an integral part of Windows! DO NOT DELETE IT! It is
part of the java system. Things won't work right if it's missing.
John
John Ford
john(at)indstate.edu
812-237-8542
>>> Carbarvo(at)aol.com Saturday, August 16, 2003 9:56:55 AM >>>
I have just received word that someone with whom we communicate
regularly has
gotten a virus that propagates through the address book. I have been
advised
to check my computer for a file entitled jbdgmgr.exe. I found it in my
computer files and deleted it. This thing apparently lingers for a
while in your
machine before it starts doing anything. The last time I got a notice
like this,
it turned out to be a hoax and I wound up deleting a file that was
supposed to
be there, so be careful. Since you are in my address book, you too may
have
it. The logo is a Teddy bear. DO NOT OPEN THIS FILE! Contact me if you
have any
uncertainty about this. I regret that this has happened. I don't know
what I
could have done to prevent it that we haven't already done (we have
antivirus
software....and you probably do too....) Best regards to all of
you....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Ford" <Jford(at)indstate.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: flying under bridges |
Larry,
I just drove over that bridge last weekend. Wow. I'd love to hear the
tale!
John
John Ford
john(at)indstate.edu
812-237-8542
>>> lnawms(at)msn.com Saturday, August 16, 2003 11:25:59 AM >>>
It's too long to recount on the list but, the next time any of you see
me, ask about flying a B-47 under the Mackinac bridge that spans between
upper and lower Michigan!!!
Larry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike <bike.mike(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: flying under bridges |
The story is told very well at
http://www.b-47.com/Stories/lappo/lappo.html
happy reading.
John Ford wrote:
>
> Larry,
>
> I just drove over that bridge last weekend. Wow. I'd love to hear the
> tale!
>
> John
>
> John Ford
> john(at)indstate.edu
> 812-237-8542
>
> >>> lnawms(at)msn.com Saturday, August 16, 2003 11:25:59 AM >>>
>
>
>
> It's too long to recount on the list but, the next time any of you see
> me, ask about flying a B-47 under the Mackinac bridge that spans between
> upper and lower Michigan!!!
>
> Larry
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bert Conoly" <bconoly(at)earthlink.net> |
Not a problem. Some of us have better "manners" than others on this group.
----- Original Message -----
From: <Carbarvo(at)aol.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: False Alarm
>
> At the gentle "suggestion" of Cy Galley, I checked www.snopes.com and found
> that they say the referenced address is indeed a hoax. This is very
embarassing
> and I apologize to all of you who, like me, were taken in.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "w b evans" <wbeevans(at)verizon.net> |
OK, hurry up, we'll wait.
seriously tho,,,,,This day in the north east was strange as usual. Rainy this
AM, and that turned to sunny and windy midday, and that turned into thunder heads
with lightning up to and including now (1620).
Spent some midday hours cleaning my plane. washing, waxing, polishing. It's a
strange feeling that I hadn't felt before. As I cleaned each part my memory went
back to when I made that piece. It's all kind of a blur now, with all the
time spent on it.
Then it all turns to the thought that ,,,,,,," all the stuff that I glued, tacked,
clamped,bolted, eyeballed, trammelled, etc., etc., etc.
And now it carries my boney arse thru the sky looking down on breathtaking sights,
that many earthbound people will never see.
Ain't life grand!!
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: dvraun(at)msn.com
To: Fishnet
Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2003 3:26 PM
Subject: Re: FFP test
Wait for me !
----- Original Message -----
From: walt evans
Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2003 3:10 PM
To: Fishnet(at)topica.com
Subject: Re: FFP test
I'm here. Guess we're the only 2.
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: <ChessFly(at)aol.com>
To:
Sent: Sunday, August 17, 2003 2:07 PM
Subject: FFP test
>
>
> :
> Check out the Fishnet Hangar at...
> http://www.lairdlind.com/fishnet.htm
> Submit a picture of your Fishnet project to Laird Lind
> lairdl(at)airmail.net
>
>
:
Check out the Fishnet Hangar at...
http://www.lairdlind.com/fishnet.htm
Submit a picture of your Fishnet project to Laird Lind
lairdl(at)airmail.net
--
Or send an email to: Fishnet-unsubscribe(at)topica.com
--
:
Check out the Fishnet Hangar at...
http://www.lairdlind.com/fishnet.htm
Submit a picture of your Fishnet project to Laird Lind
lairdl(at)airmail.net--
Or send an email to: Fishnet-unsubscribe(at)topica.com
--
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 8/17/03 3:31:52 PM Central Daylight Time,
wbeevans(at)verizon.net writes:
<< Spent some midday hours cleaning my plane. washing, waxing, polishing.
It's a strange feeling that I hadn't felt before. As I cleaned each part my
memory went back to when I made that piece. It's all kind of a blur now, with
all the time spent on it.
Then it all turns to the thought that ,,,,,,," all the stuff that I glued,
tacked, clamped,bolted, eyeballed, trammelled, etc., etc., etc.
And now it carries my boney arse thru the sky looking down on breathtaking
sights, that many earthbound people will never see.
Ain't life grand!!
walt evans
NX140DL >>
Walt,
You say it so well...
Chuck G.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | cutting aircraft cable |
Howdy, folks;
You know how all the tips and how-to's for cutting aircraft cable say to use
a cold chisel and hammer (including Bingelis' books)? The problem is, once
you've gotten your cable fitted and nicopressed in position, at least on one
end of the cable there is no way to get a chisel, hammer, or anything else
in there to do the cutting. So here's a nifty tip from one of the old
Pietenpol newsletters for when you've got the cable all nicopressed in place
and are ready to cut off the tag end. Take your Dremel tool with the small
abrasive cut-off wheel and use it to slice through the tag end! Slip a
small piece of stainless or other metal between the tag end and the standing
cable so your cutoff wheel doesn't nick the standing part of the cable as it
cuts through, and before you start cutting wrap the whole thing with some
masking tape to catch the cutoff bits of cable.
And you did remember to slip a piece of heat-shrink tubing over the cable
before you fitted the cable and nico, didn't you? After cutting off the
excess cable and making sure everything is fitted, cover the nico and cut
end with heat shrink tubing (unless you're concerned about your inspector or
designee not being able to see that the cables are properly nico'd).
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Wood Prop & Rain |
OK, here is another flying story, during my Big Adventure:
On the second leg of my return trip from Oshkosh, Sat. 8/2, enroute from
Iowa Co. Wisconsin (MRJ) to Mount Pleasant, Iowa (MPZ)...what turned out to be
one of the longer legs of my trip - 3 1/2 hours in the seat !! I was faced
with a beautiful panoramic view of the Mighty Mississippi River about 5
stretching to 10 miles or more, out in front of me. Words simply cannot portray
this type of scenery. I was in 'The Zone', with thoughts of how our
civilization has progressed, and altered the scenery from how it must have looked
before
humans were on earth. Holding the stick between my thumb and fingers, it was
a little bit bumpy, but my reflexes became used to letting 'er just ride it
out, instead of correcting for every bump. The earth was slowly slipping about
1000 feet below my trusty wings, when all of a sudden...BAM !! Something
smacked me right on the forehead !! I thought a bolt or something fell off the
engine, when I noticed the drops of water crawling up my windscreen. My
thoughts instantly went to how rain can 'sandblast' a wood prop into a useless
piece
of frayed wood. As I instantly rolled into a steep right bank & haul back on
the stick, my being was searching for any slight vibration, with thoughts of
the prop eroding into an out of balance block of hard wood, then shaking the
engine loose from the airframe, then becoming WAY tail heavy, I would spin in,
and that would be that. I was ready to shut 'er down, if any serious vibration
would be felt. After completing a 180 turn, it lasted what seemed like an
eternity, but actually maybe another 30 seconds. Drops were still on the
windscreen, but they just stayed there...no more crawlers. I was out of the rain.
Decision time. Go back to Iowa Co. Airport, or see if I can pick my way
through. Raising each wing tip, I could see what I was in. Towering cumulus to
the South, where I could see the showers under a portion of them, but directly
west looked like a wide path, judging by how the sun was shining on the earth.
I picked up a westerly heading for the 10 mile wide path cut in the clouds.
Approaching the Mighty Miss again, I always climb an extra 1000 feet, just in
case the engine conks out. Engines always seem to have a way of sputtering
when crossing a large body of water, or a forest. On this occasion, she never
skipped a beat !! After crossing the Miss, I just had to fly along the West
shore for a little while, just to take it all in. What a magnificent river !!
Way off course now, I had to locate my position with the chart I had strapped
on my lap board. This wasn't too difficult, because there are numerous
landmarks to refer to, and the ol' Piet just isn't fast enough to get lost...well,
almost...but that's another story. The rest of this leg consisted of picking
my way through the high clouds, enjoying every moment, and maintaining my
position with my finger on the chart.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
logged 29.3 hours during my Big Adventure !!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: cutting aircraft cable |
Dremels are great! go to your local
hobbyshop and get the FIBRE discs.
They cost more than the standard
cheapo ones but last a lot longer and
are considerably less frustrating to
use as they don't fly to pieces at the
merest whim.
As far as the shrink tube, why not
leave them loose until the inspector
has come and gone?
I've got a Foredom hanging in my
shop. It's stronger than the Dremel
and QUIET! Unfortunately it's also
expensive. I liberated mine from the
wife's jewelry making phase. Have
to make do with what's available
you know.
Happy Landings, Clif
Subject: Pietenpol-List: cutting aircraft cable
>
> Howdy, folks;
>
> You know how all the tips and how-to's for cutting aircraft cable say to
use
> a cold chisel and hammer (including Bingelis' books)? The problem is,
once
> you've gotten your cable fitted and nicopressed in position, at least on
one
> end of the cable there is no way to get a chisel, hammer, or anything else
> in there to do the cutting. So here's a nifty tip from one of the old
> Pietenpol newsletters for when you've got the cable all nicopressed in
place
> and are ready to cut off the tag end. Take your Dremel tool with the
small
> abrasive cut-off wheel and use it to slice through the tag end! Slip a
> small piece of stainless or other metal between the tag end and the
standing
> cable so your cutoff wheel doesn't nick the standing part of the cable as
it
> cuts through, and before you start cutting wrap the whole thing with some
> masking tape to catch the cutoff bits of cable.
>
> And you did remember to slip a piece of heat-shrink tubing over the cable
> before you fitted the cable and nico, didn't you? After cutting off the
> excess cable and making sure everything is fitted, cover the nico and cut
> end with heat shrink tubing (unless you're concerned about your inspector
or
> designee not being able to see that the cables are properly nico'd).
>
> Oscar Zuniga
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Sloan" <alexms1(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wood Prop & Rain |
Chuck G., great story. Keep it going. I want to hear all about the full 29
hours in the air.
Alex S.
----- Original Message -----
From: <Rcaprd(at)aol.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wood Prop & Rain
>
> OK, here is another flying story, during my Big Adventure:
> On the second leg of my return trip from Oshkosh, Sat. 8/2, enroute
from
> Iowa Co. Wisconsin (MRJ) to Mount Pleasant, Iowa (MPZ)...what turned out
to be
> one of the longer legs of my trip - 3 1/2 hours in the seat !! I was
faced
> with a beautiful panoramic view of the Mighty Mississippi River about 5
> stretching to 10 miles or more, out in front of me. Words simply cannot
portray
> this type of scenery. I was in 'The Zone', with thoughts of how our
> civilization has progressed, and altered the scenery from how it must have
looked before
> humans were on earth. Holding the stick between my thumb and fingers, it
was
> a little bit bumpy, but my reflexes became used to letting 'er just ride
it
> out, instead of correcting for every bump. The earth was slowly slipping
about
> 1000 feet below my trusty wings, when all of a sudden...BAM !! Something
> smacked me right on the forehead !! I thought a bolt or something fell
off the
> engine, when I noticed the drops of water crawling up my windscreen. My
> thoughts instantly went to how rain can 'sandblast' a wood prop into a
useless piece
> of frayed wood. As I instantly rolled into a steep right bank & haul back
on
> the stick, my being was searching for any slight vibration, with thoughts
of
> the prop eroding into an out of balance block of hard wood, then shaking
the
> engine loose from the airframe, then becoming WAY tail heavy, I would spin
in,
> and that would be that. I was ready to shut 'er down, if any serious
vibration
> would be felt. After completing a 180 turn, it lasted what seemed like an
> eternity, but actually maybe another 30 seconds. Drops were still on the
> windscreen, but they just stayed there...no more crawlers. I was out of
the rain.
> Decision time. Go back to Iowa Co. Airport, or see if I can pick my way
> through. Raising each wing tip, I could see what I was in. Towering
cumulus to
> the South, where I could see the showers under a portion of them, but
directly
> west looked like a wide path, judging by how the sun was shining on the
earth.
> I picked up a westerly heading for the 10 mile wide path cut in the
clouds.
> Approaching the Mighty Miss again, I always climb an extra 1000 feet, just
in
> case the engine conks out. Engines always seem to have a way of
sputtering
> when crossing a large body of water, or a forest. On this occasion, she
never
> skipped a beat !! After crossing the Miss, I just had to fly along the
West
> shore for a little while, just to take it all in. What a magnificent
river !!
> Way off course now, I had to locate my position with the chart I had
strapped
> on my lap board. This wasn't too difficult, because there are numerous
> landmarks to refer to, and the ol' Piet just isn't fast enough to get
lost...well,
> almost...but that's another story. The rest of this leg consisted of
picking
> my way through the high clouds, enjoying every moment, and maintaining my
> position with my finger on the chart.
>
> Chuck G.
> NX770CG
> logged 29.3 hours during my Big Adventure !!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gadd, Skip" <Skip.Gadd(at)ssa.gov> |
| Subject: | Wood Prop & Rain |
Chuck, Great story, no excuses when I get home from work today, I'm going to
do something on the Piet.
Skip
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carbarvo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wood Prop & Rain |
Chuck...I love it! C Vought
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave and Connie <dmatthe1(at)rochester.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: To build or not to build |
>
>
>Hi all,
>2 years ago, I was deciding to build a Piet or RV8, well I started the RV.
>The empennage and wings are basically done. With 2 kids in college dollars
>are short. This has me looking at very long term to complete the RV. I
>probably should have gone with the Piet years ago...and maybe would have
>been flying by now. I need something to get me off center to start a Piet.
>If anyone knows of a un-started or barely started Piet, that might be the
>motivation I need to get going.
>Thanks to all !
>Jack
Jack,
I have the kit of spruce and the plans for a Piet. I have built half a
dozen ribs. The rest of the wood is still in the shipping tubes. Where
are you located?
For Sale:
Wood kit for Long Fuselage Pietenpol. Purchased in March of 1999 from
Western Aircraft Supply. I have built 6 ribs since then. All other wood
is still in the shipping tubes. This is all of the spruce to build a
Pietenpol Aircamper. I will include the already built ribs and a rib jig.
Full set of plans purchased from the Pietenpol family. Includes 3 piece
wing and Corvair sheets.
Reprint package of BPA newsletters from July 83 - 2nd Quarter 99. This is
the set that Mike Bill put together a few years back.
Wood is located in Retsof, NY which is about 5 miles from Geneseo (D52). I
will not ship it and will not sell the plans or newletters seperately
unless the wood is already gone. I will deliver within about 100 miles of
Geneseo (US only).
$1600 for all. If you think it is too much let me know what you think it
is worth.
Dave
N36078 '41 BC-12-65
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Christian Bobka" <bobka(at)compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | Re: To build or not to build |
Dave,
I don't know where you live but I am driving an empty car back from CT to
Minneapolis sometime in October/early November. I could get this stuff from
Retsof west for you.
Chris bobka----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave and Connie" <dmatthe1(at)rochester.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: To build or not to build
>
>
> >
> >
> >Hi all,
> >2 years ago, I was deciding to build a Piet or RV8, well I started the
RV.
> >The empennage and wings are basically done. With 2 kids in college
dollars
> >are short. This has me looking at very long term to complete the RV. I
> >probably should have gone with the Piet years ago...and maybe would have
> >been flying by now. I need something to get me off center to start a
Piet.
> >If anyone knows of a un-started or barely started Piet, that might be the
> >motivation I need to get going.
> >Thanks to all !
> >Jack
>
> Jack,
> I have the kit of spruce and the plans for a Piet. I have built half a
> dozen ribs. The rest of the wood is still in the shipping tubes. Where
> are you located?
>
> For Sale:
> Wood kit for Long Fuselage Pietenpol. Purchased in March of 1999 from
> Western Aircraft Supply. I have built 6 ribs since then. All other wood
> is still in the shipping tubes. This is all of the spruce to build a
> Pietenpol Aircamper. I will include the already built ribs and a rib jig.
> Full set of plans purchased from the Pietenpol family. Includes 3 piece
> wing and Corvair sheets.
> Reprint package of BPA newsletters from July 83 - 2nd Quarter 99. This is
> the set that Mike Bill put together a few years back.
> Wood is located in Retsof, NY which is about 5 miles from Geneseo (D52). I
> will not ship it and will not sell the plans or newletters seperately
> unless the wood is already gone. I will deliver within about 100 miles of
> Geneseo (US only).
> $1600 for all. If you think it is too much let me know what you think it
> is worth.
>
> Dave
> N36078 '41 BC-12-65
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave and Connie <dmatthe1(at)rochester.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: To build or not to build |
Chris,
Thanks for the offer. If I get a question from someone along that path I
will keep you in mind as an option.
Retsof is about 30 miles south of Rochester, NY or 5 miles from Geneseo
(D52). I have had an inquiry from a person in Utah. The problem with
shipping is that one of the tubes is just over 14' long. That is why
Western Aircraft shipped them by air freight. I have to find the original
bill to get an idea of what it would cost to air freight the tubes anywhere.
Dave
>
>Dave,
>
>I don't know where you live but I am driving an empty car back from CT to
>Minneapolis sometime in October/early November. I could get this stuff from
>Retsof west for you.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brants" <tmbrant(at)usfamily.net> |
| Subject: | piet builders - IN, PA, VA?? |
I'm leaving for a trip to Virginia Beach on Thursday of this week, flying a trusty
old 172. I plan to be stopping in Knox Indiana, Somerset PA, and Suffolk
VA. Any pieters near by that wouldn't mind a visit?
Tom B.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "w b evans" <wbeevans(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: piet builders - IN, PA, VA?? |
Tom,
I'm in Northern NJ. Newton Airport (on the charts) Finished last fall,
and now flying. It's at the field if you want to swing wide.
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brants" <tmbrant(at)usfamily.net>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: piet builders - IN, PA, VA??
>
> I'm leaving for a trip to Virginia Beach on Thursday of this week, flying
a trusty old 172. I plan to be stopping in Knox Indiana, Somerset PA, and
Suffolk VA. Any pieters near by that wouldn't mind a visit?
>
> Tom B.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene Rambo" <rambog(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | Re: piet builders - IN, PA, VA?? |
How about Culpeper, Virginia? I'll be there all day Saturday. Piet is in
the hangar.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brants" <tmbrant(at)usfamily.net>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: piet builders - IN, PA, VA??
>
> I'm leaving for a trip to Virginia Beach on Thursday of this week, flying
a trusty old 172. I plan to be stopping in Knox Indiana, Somerset PA, and
Suffolk VA. Any pieters near by that wouldn't mind a visit?
>
> Tom B.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Sloan" <alexms1(at)bellsouth.net> |
Barry,
I talked with Joe Norris, he works for EAA and is a newly appointed DAR, and
he said transponders are not required as long as air space is not penetrated
where one is required. You might give him a call or I can forward you the
E-mail I got.
Alex
----- Original Message -----
From: "Barry Davis" <bed(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Mode C
>
> DJ
> Thanks for your info, we plan to recheck with our FISDO before we add the
> generators. We are using information given to us from an examiner about a
> year and a half ago.
> Barry
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Mode C
>
>
> >
> > there's also the "other" way to get around it....
> >
> > Run battery and power your comm radio with it but keep the battery
charged
> via a wind driven generator.... The FAR states that an airplane with an
> engine driven electrical system needs a Mode C Xponder.... wind driven is
> exempt. I have even talked with a couple DAR's on this recently and
they
> agree that it is perfectly legal.
> >
> > This is how I plan on doing my Corvair powered GN-1 which will be based
> within Phoenix 30nm class B
> >
> > DJ
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Barry Davis
> > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 12:00 PM
> > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Mode C
> >
> >
> >
> > I live inside the Mode C ring at Atlanta. We fly non radio aircraft
all
> the
> > time with no problems. If the aircraft is manufactured with no
> electrical
> > system, then Mode C is not required. We have (with special permission)
> flown
> > the L-2 Taylorcraft into Hartsfield and landed. Several of no-radio
> craft
> > flew in, but had to follow a 150 with a radio. One of those darn Cub
> drivers
> > did a loop on final, but thats another story.
> > Oops, back to the subject. Our FISDO has helped us with the rules on
our
> > Piets. If the engine needs a battery and generator to run, it is still
> > considered a non-electrical aircraft and no Mode-C required. Example:
> > Corvair with a starter, battery, alternator, battery ignition system,
> not
> > magneto. But the first time you run a little tiny wire over to the
> handheld
> > radio or GPS, you had better also run the wire to a transponder,
because
> > then it is required.
> > Check with your local FAA, because they can "translate" the rules in
> many
> > different ways.
> > Barry Davis
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Dean Dayton" <deandayton(at)hotmail.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Mode C
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Their used to be a flying club at Palo Alto (maybe still is) that
flew
> a
> > no
> > > electric Cub with a handheld radio. It was a lot of fun to fly, but
it
> > > certainly did limit where you could go in that area.
> > >
> > > Dean Dayton
> > > >
> > > >From: Jeff Cours <piet-j(at)moriarti.org>
> > > >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: introduction and -- where's the cargo
> go?
> > > >
>
> > > >
> > > >Christian Bobka wrote:
> > > > > Why the mode C?
> > > >
> > > >Unfortunately, the two nearby airports (San Carlos and Palo Alto)
are
> > > >both within San Francisco International's mode C veil. I'm not too
> > > >worried about installing mode C, though one of the things I'm
> pondering
> > > >as I decide whether or not to build a Piet is that I'd be flying it
> out
> > > >of some crowded, tower controlled airports with concrete runways
and
> > > >fairly complex airspace -- not exactly a Piet's native environment.
> So,
> > > >it'd probably need to pick up some extra equipment, which starts to
> > > >detract from its simplicity. On the other hand, I really like the
> fact
> > > >that it has a nice, slow cruise speed, which would give me plenty
of
> > > >time to figure out which way I need to go next so I don't fly
through
> > > >the wrong airspace on my way out to the wide open places.
> > > >
> > > >- Jeff C.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > > This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for
viewing by
> Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more
> information on an anti-virus email solution, visit
> <http://www.halfpricehosting.com/av.asp>.
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Sloan" <alexms1(at)bellsouth.net> |
Question to all straight axle Piet builders.
What size and what wall thickness are you using?
Thanks
Alex Sloan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: piet builders - IN, PA, VA?? |
Culpepper, huh,
Do you know Andrew King?
Been flying around with him this summer.
Hes got a Fleet.
Ask him about the "Hayfield" fly-in.
JimV.
Gene Rambo wrote:
How about Culpeper, Virginia? I'll be there all day Saturday. Piet is in
the hangar.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brants"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: piet builders - IN, PA, VA??
>
> I'm leaving for a trip to Virginia Beach on Thursday of this week, flying
a trusty old 172. I plan to be stopping in Knox Indiana, Somerset PA, and
Suffolk VA. Any pieters near by that wouldn't mind a visit?
>
> Tom B.
>
>
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)grc.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Guys--- Long time Piet supporter, Virgil Phillips has asked that we bring
as many flying Piets to the Mideastern Regional Fly-In (MERFI) at Marion,
Ohio this weekend. The biggest day is Saturday. If everything works out
we could have as many as five of us there. Come if you can ! If all of
us make it we'll have Larry W. Jim K. Frank P. Wilbur G. and me. For more
info see sites below.
Mike C.
22-24, Fri-Sun. EAA Mid-Eastern Fly-In, Marion Municipal Airport (MNN),
Marion, OH. Call 440-352-1781.
http://www.eaa.org/communications/eaanews/030522_merfi.html
http://www.marionairport.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Dilatush" <dilatush(at)amigo.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wood Prop & Rain |
----- Original Message -----
From: <Rcaprd(at)aol.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wood Prop & Rain
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Chuck,
I recently had a similar experience, not with rain but a "rough running"
engine when going through a mountain pass. You have expressed the true
feelings of the pilot when in such a situation wonderfully.
I am the newsletter editor of our chapter and would like with your
permission to reprint your e-mail in our newsletter
May I do this?
John
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
> OK, here is another flying story, during my Big Adventure:
> On the second leg of my return trip from Oshkosh, Sat. 8/2, enroute
from
> Iowa Co. Wisconsin (MRJ) to Mount Pleasant, Iowa (MPZ)...what turned out
to be
> one of the longer legs of my trip - 3 1/2 hours in the seat !! I was
faced
> with a beautiful panoramic view of the Mighty Mississippi River about 5
> stretching to 10 miles or more, out in front of me. Words simply cannot
portray
> this type of scenery. I was in 'The Zone', with thoughts of how our
> civilization has progressed, and altered the scenery from how it must have
looked before
> humans were on earth. Holding the stick between my thumb and fingers, it
was
> a little bit bumpy, but my reflexes became used to letting 'er just ride
it
> out, instead of correcting for every bump. The earth was slowly slipping
about
> 1000 feet below my trusty wings, when all of a sudden...BAM !! Something
> smacked me right on the forehead !! I thought a bolt or something fell
off the
> engine, when I noticed the drops of water crawling up my windscreen. My
> thoughts instantly went to how rain can 'sandblast' a wood prop into a
useless piece
> of frayed wood. As I instantly rolled into a steep right bank & haul back
on
> the stick, my being was searching for any slight vibration, with thoughts
of
> the prop eroding into an out of balance block of hard wood, then shaking
the
> engine loose from the airframe, then becoming WAY tail heavy, I would spin
in,
> and that would be that. I was ready to shut 'er down, if any serious
vibration
> would be felt. After completing a 180 turn, it lasted what seemed like an
> eternity, but actually maybe another 30 seconds. Drops were still on the
> windscreen, but they just stayed there...no more crawlers. I was out of
the rain.
> Decision time. Go back to Iowa Co. Airport, or see if I can pick my way
> through. Raising each wing tip, I could see what I was in. Towering
cumulus to
> the South, where I could see the showers under a portion of them, but
directly
> west looked like a wide path, judging by how the sun was shining on the
earth.
> I picked up a westerly heading for the 10 mile wide path cut in the
clouds.
> Approaching the Mighty Miss again, I always climb an extra 1000 feet, just
in
> case the engine conks out. Engines always seem to have a way of
sputtering
> when crossing a large body of water, or a forest. On this occasion, she
never
> skipped a beat !! After crossing the Miss, I just had to fly along the
West
> shore for a little while, just to take it all in. What a magnificent
river !!
> Way off course now, I had to locate my position with the chart I had
strapped
> on my lap board. This wasn't too difficult, because there are numerous
> landmarks to refer to, and the ol' Piet just isn't fast enough to get
lost...well,
> almost...but that's another story. The rest of this leg consisted of
picking
> my way through the high clouds, enjoying every moment, and maintaining my
> position with my finger on the chart.
>
> Chuck G.
> NX770CG
> logged 29.3 hours during my Big Adventure !!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Barry Davis" <bed(at)mindspring.com> |
Carrollton airport is about 400 feet outside the 30 mile mode C ring, but
all the grass strips (including mine) is just inside the ring. Probably will
start out without electrical, but am putting wires out the wing before
covering, just in case I change my mind later.
bed
----- Original Message -----
From: "Alex Sloan" <alexms1(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Mode C
>
> Barry,
> I talked with Joe Norris, he works for EAA and is a newly appointed DAR,
and
> he said transponders are not required as long as air space is not
penetrated
> where one is required. You might give him a call or I can forward you the
> E-mail I got.
> Alex
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Barry Davis" <bed(at)mindspring.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Mode C
>
>
> >
> > DJ
> > Thanks for your info, we plan to recheck with our FISDO before we add
the
> > generators. We are using information given to us from an examiner about
a
> > year and a half ago.
> > Barry
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Mode C
> >
> >
> > >
> > > there's also the "other" way to get around it....
> > >
> > > Run battery and power your comm radio with it but keep the battery
> charged
> > via a wind driven generator.... The FAR states that an airplane with an
> > engine driven electrical system needs a Mode C Xponder.... wind driven
is
> > exempt. I have even talked with a couple DAR's on this recently and
> they
> > agree that it is perfectly legal.
> > >
> > > This is how I plan on doing my Corvair powered GN-1 which will be
based
> > within Phoenix 30nm class B
> > >
> > > DJ
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Barry Davis
> > > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> > > Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 12:00 PM
> > > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Mode C
> > >
> > >
>
> > >
> > > I live inside the Mode C ring at Atlanta. We fly non radio aircraft
> all
> > the
> > > time with no problems. If the aircraft is manufactured with no
> > electrical
> > > system, then Mode C is not required. We have (with special
permission)
> > flown
> > > the L-2 Taylorcraft into Hartsfield and landed. Several of no-radio
> > craft
> > > flew in, but had to follow a 150 with a radio. One of those darn Cub
> > drivers
> > > did a loop on final, but thats another story.
> > > Oops, back to the subject. Our FISDO has helped us with the rules on
> our
> > > Piets. If the engine needs a battery and generator to run, it is
still
> > > considered a non-electrical aircraft and no Mode-C required.
Example:
> > > Corvair with a starter, battery, alternator, battery ignition
system,
> > not
> > > magneto. But the first time you run a little tiny wire over to the
> > handheld
> > > radio or GPS, you had better also run the wire to a transponder,
> because
> > > then it is required.
> > > Check with your local FAA, because they can "translate" the rules in
> > many
> > > different ways.
> > > Barry Davis
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Dean Dayton" <deandayton(at)hotmail.com>
> > > To:
> > > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Mode C
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Their used to be a flying club at Palo Alto (maybe still is) that
> flew
> > a
> > > no
> > > > electric Cub with a handheld radio. It was a lot of fun to fly,
but
> it
> > > > certainly did limit where you could go in that area.
> > > >
> > > > Dean Dayton
> > > > >
> > > > >From: Jeff Cours <piet-j(at)moriarti.org>
> > > > >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: introduction and -- where's the
cargo
> > go?
> > > > >
> >
> > > > >
> > > > >Christian Bobka wrote:
> > > > > > Why the mode C?
> > > > >
> > > > >Unfortunately, the two nearby airports (San Carlos and Palo Alto)
> are
> > > > >both within San Francisco International's mode C veil. I'm not
too
> > > > >worried about installing mode C, though one of the things I'm
> > pondering
> > > > >as I decide whether or not to build a Piet is that I'd be flying
it
> > out
> > > > >of some crowded, tower controlled airports with concrete runways
> and
> > > > >fairly complex airspace -- not exactly a Piet's native
environment.
> > So,
> > > > >it'd probably need to pick up some extra equipment, which starts
to
> > > > >detract from its simplicity. On the other hand, I really like the
> > fact
> > > > >that it has a nice, slow cruise speed, which would give me plenty
> of
> > > > >time to figure out which way I need to go next so I don't fly
> through
> > > > >the wrong airspace on my way out to the wide open places.
> > > > >
> > > > >- Jeff C.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for
> viewing by
> > Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more
> > information on an anti-virus email solution, visit
> > <http://www.halfpricehosting.com/av.asp>.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Cardinal" <gcardinal(at)startribune.com> |
The straight axle is 1 1/2" x .120 tubing.
This is the size Dale and I used on ours. The weight of the landing
gear is 57 pounds. This includes the axle, spreader bars, gear legs, 19
X 3.50 tires and aluminum rims, bungee cords and bracing cables.
No brakes were installed.
Greg Cardinal in Minneapolis
>>> alexms1(at)bellsouth.net 08/20/03 06:45AM >>>
Question to all straight axle Piet builders.
What size and what wall thickness are you using?
Thanks
Alex Sloan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "rambog(at)erols.com" <rambog(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | Re: piet builders - IN, PA, VA?? |
Know him well, know about the hayfield, just have not been able to make it.
Andrew finished the Ryan in my hangar. Do I know you?
Gene
Original Message:
-----------------
From: dpilot dpilot(at)yahoo.com
Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 05:04:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: piet builders - IN, PA, VA??
Culpepper, huh,
Do you know Andrew King?
Been flying around with him this summer.
Hes got a Fleet.
Ask him about the "Hayfield" fly-in.
JimV.
Gene Rambo wrote:
How about Culpeper, Virginia? I'll be there all day Saturday. Piet is in
the hangar.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brants"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: piet builders - IN, PA, VA??
>
> I'm leaving for a trip to Virginia Beach on Thursday of this week, flying
a trusty old 172. I plan to be stopping in Knox Indiana, Somerset PA, and
Suffolk VA. Any pieters near by that wouldn't mind a visit?
>
> Tom B.
>
>
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Isablcorky(at)aol.com |
Pieters,
In as much as: Those beauros are still procrasting the Sport Pilot issue and
likely not to rule within a year at the earliest.
In as much as: I'm an impatient old fox who doesn't want to be out hangar
rent and insurance for that time by only looking at the plane
And in as much as Piet NX311CC is well over 1/3 completed
Isabelle has decided it best to let 41CC make someone else very happy for
$14.5K
If interested, contact me direct for pics or call 318 868 3385 for further
information
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Welding up the control horns |
| From: | rhartwig11(at)juno.com |
Another small step completed today--- edge welding the control
horns. I found this to be some of the toughest gas welding that I have
done (I just couldn't see spending $2000 for a TIG outfit.) I have a
Smith torch and started out using my smallest tip--a No.203 (#3)
tip....way too much heat...aargh....rats!! I then bought a No. 201 (#1)
tip....still too much heat. The No. 2000 (#00) tip that I purchased on
the next trip did the job, but the going was a little slow. A No. 200
(#0) probably would have been just right. (Sounds like the story of the
three bears.)
Now it's on to the landing gear. I will be building a Cup type gear
but with die springs. I would appreciate any tips on gas welding those
thin gear legs to the .125 axles. This would probably be another great
place to have a TIG outfit......maybe I'll.....nah! That 2 grand will
buy most of my Corvair parts!
Dick Hartwig
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)grc.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Greg Cardinal & Dale's Piet in Minneapolis |
Another neat thing at Brodhead is that I got to meet Greg and Dale and
oogle over their Pietenpol construction photographs. Cane seats, burled
wood instument panel...whew. That is going to be one good looking
plane. Will you guys possibly be flying for next year's 75th Anniversary
of the Pietenpol design ? Would be great.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Ford" <Jford(at)indstate.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Greg Cardinal & Dale's Piet in Minneapolis |
Good grief those are beautiful photos! It was nice to meet Dale at
Brodhead as well. Actually it was great to meet lots of you folks,
though I wasn't wearing a name tag and mostly lurked (I was wearing the
black Red Hat Linux hat and taking pictures of everything). Maybe the
involved parties would be willing to post the photos for everybody's
inspiration. Lovely, lovely work (and lots of it).
john
John Ford
john(at)indstate.edu
812-237-8542
>>> Michael.D.Cuy(at)grc.nasa.gov Wednesday, August 20, 2003 2:02:26 PM
>>>
Another neat thing at Brodhead is that I got to meet Greg and Dale and
oogle over their Pietenpol construction photographs. Cane seats,
burled
wood instument panel...whew. That is going to be one good looking
plane. Will you guys possibly be flying for next year's 75th
Anniversary
of the Pietenpol design ? Would be great.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Cardinal" <gcardinal(at)startribune.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Greg Cardinal & Dale's Piet in Minneapolis |
We moved the wing panels and tail feathers to Stanton airfield for
painting about a month ago.
Fuselage was trailered to the airfield last weekend.
We aren't going to rush the completion but Brodhead 2004 is a very real
possibility.
Greg (itchin' to strafe a train) Cardinal in Minneapolis
>>> Michael.D.Cuy(at)grc.nasa.gov 08/20/03 02:02PM >>>
Another neat thing at Brodhead is that I got to meet Greg and Dale and
oogle over their Pietenpol construction photographs. Cane seats,
burled
wood instument panel...whew. That is going to be one good looking
plane. Will you guys possibly be flying for next year's 75th
Anniversary
of the Pietenpol design ? Would be great.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sam Marinucci" <srmjem(at)ezol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: piet builders - IN, PA, VA?? |
Hi Tom,
I'm located in Dover, Delaware so if you want to you're more than
welcome to see my Piet in progress. At this stage I have all the major
components completed and now need to install the engine(Cont A-65), hook up
the instruments, and cover the wings, fuselage, and tail surfaces using the
ceconite with dope method. If you want to "crew rest" before continuing on,
you are more than welcome to spend the night with us.
Sam Marinucci
NX115SM (reserved number)
-----Original Message-----
From: Brants <tmbrant(at)usfamily.net>
Date: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 11:45 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: piet builders - IN, PA, VA??
>
>I'm leaving for a trip to Virginia Beach on Thursday of this week, flying a
trusty old 172. I plan to be stopping in Knox Indiana, Somerset PA, and
Suffolk VA. Any pieters near by that wouldn't mind a visit?
>
>Tom B.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Malcolm Morrison" <morrisons5(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: piet builders - IN, PA, VA?? |
Tom
I'm in Howard, PA. It's between State College and Lock Haven. My Piets' in
my garage, under construction, tail on fuselage, gear on, Corvair on the
mount. Unfortunately I will not be home this weekend. I'm heading for
Caesars Creek, Ohio for a regional soaring competition. If you are ever in
the area again give me a yell and stop by. That goes for the rest of you
guys too.
Malcolm
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brants" <tmbrant(at)usfamily.net>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: piet builders - IN, PA, VA??
>
> I'm leaving for a trip to Virginia Beach on Thursday of this week, flying
a trusty old 172. I plan to be stopping in Knox Indiana, Somerset PA, and
Suffolk VA. Any pieters near by that wouldn't mind a visit?
>
> Tom B.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Craig Lawler <clawler(at)ptd.net> |
I have a C-65 Piet with about 400 hours. We are flying off a 1,200ft
strip and the pucker factor with two people in the plane is a little
much. Do any of you have any experience with the more powerful engines
on the Piet. What prop is best on a C-90 or O-200? Is the performance
improvement worth the change? Will my current engine mount work? I think
the cases are the same? I appreciate any help.
Thanks,
Craig Lawler
899CL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Schreiber <schreib(at)netnitco.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Guys:
I am a long way from having my Piet done, but my wife and I will be
flying our Tripacer to Marion for the flyin. My Daughter lives in Muncie
just SE of Marion, so we plan on going to Muncie, picking her up and
then flying back to Marion. I saw in the MERFI flyers that Pietenpol's
were going to be featured so I new I had to go.
Rick Schreiber
Valparaiso, IN
Michael D Cuy wrote:
>
>Guys--- Long time Piet supporter, Virgil Phillips has asked that we bring
>as many flying Piets to the Mideastern Regional Fly-In (MERFI) at Marion,
>Ohio this weekend. The biggest day is Saturday. If everything works out
>we could have as many as five of us there. Come if you can ! If all of
>us make it we'll have Larry W. Jim K. Frank P. Wilbur G. and me. For more
>info see sites below.
>
>Mike C.
>
>
>22-24, Fri-Sun. EAA Mid-Eastern Fly-In, Marion Municipal Airport (MNN),
>Marion, OH. Call 440-352-1781.
>
>http://www.eaa.org/communications/eaanews/030522_merfi.html
>
>http://www.marionairport.com/
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
The C-85 will use the same mount. One thing you can do is re-configure the
timing and flatten the prop pitch for more RPM. A-65 red-lines at 2300 for
65HP while just running the engine faster at 2600 you get 75HP. The big end
of the rods should be drilled for an oil squirt hole but most have been
already for improved longevity. Since you are running experimental, one can
bore the A-65 case for C series cylinders. Might want to use one of the
larger oil tanks. They all fit; even the 0-200. If you use the C-85, you
can effectively stroke the engine by using an O-200 crank. Talk to an old
time mechanic and check out your options.
Cy Galley - Bellanca Champion Club
Newsletter Editor & EAA TC
www.bellanca-championclub.com
Actively supporting Aeroncas every day
Quarterly newsletters on time
Reasonable document reprints
1-518-731-6800
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig Lawler" <clawler(at)ptd.net>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: C-90 or O-200
>
> I have a C-65 Piet with about 400 hours. We are flying off a 1,200ft
> strip and the pucker factor with two people in the plane is a little
> much. Do any of you have any experience with the more powerful engines
> on the Piet. What prop is best on a C-90 or O-200? Is the performance
> improvement worth the change? Will my current engine mount work? I think
> the cases are the same? I appreciate any help.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Craig Lawler
> 899CL
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BARNSTMR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
Craig,
What prop are you using? How fast are you reving the engine at takoff? You
might be amazed how much it helps to have a "climb" prop (one with a flatter
pitch) that allows the engine to rev up a little higher. The Sensenich
websight (
http://www.sensenichprop.com/sen_html/aircraft_cet/aircraft/experimental.html) shows their model W72CK-40 is optimum for climb pn an A65 powered
Pietenpol. This means the pitch is flattened out (40 degrees) to be optimum for
the
2350 max certified rpm of the A65. My prop is a 72CK-44 but I have not flown
it yet on the Piet. I don't expect awesome climb performance. It is a "cruise
prop".
If you want to bore the case for the larger bore cylinders/pistons, I can
assist you with FAA field approval to maintain your engine as a "certified
engine. Or you can Just DO IT without having the approval and the engine can be
considered an experimental. I have the drawing, the 337, and can provide a DER
approval paperwork. Just about any small machine shop can do the machine work.
It is a simple change and makes good sense, considering the cost for a
rebuilt studded cylinder assembly for the O-200 is WAY less than for an A65. I
am
planning to do this to my engine whenever it is time to overhaul. I helped a
friend do this on his Luscombe. I estimate it will make 75 brake horsepower
at 2350 rpm at sea level or >80 bhp at 2600 RPM. You might tweak 95 to 100 bhp
out of it if you also change to the longer stroke crankshaft. These
configurations are certifiable by similarity to other TCM configurations, verified
through illustrated parts catalog verification. You wind up with a configuration
that is essentially the same as a C-85.
Terry Bowden
Consultant DER, Powerplant Installation and Engines
ph (254) 715-4773
fax (254) 853-3805
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wood Prop & Rain |
In a message dated 8/20/03 7:46:03 AM Central Daylight Time,
dilatush(at)amigo.net writes:
<< I am the newsletter editor of our chapter and would like with your
permission to reprint your e-mail in our newsletter
May I do this? >>
John,
Yes, you sure can print it !! I would be honored to have it printed in your
newsletter. One thing I forgot to mention about the prop. Upon landing, I
closely inspected the prop for any sign of damage. The only thing I found was
that the Ace Spar Varnish on just the very leading edge had a matt finish to
it...that's all !! Hey...maybe I have a writing career ahead.
from trees & rags,
to stick & rudder !!
Pietenpols Forever !!
Chuck Gantzer
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
In a message dated 8/20/03 7:21:02 AM Central Daylight Time,
Michael.D.Cuy(at)grc.nasa.gov writes:
<< Long time Piet supporter, Virgil Phillips has asked that we bring
as many flying Piets to the Mideastern Regional Fly-In (MERFI) at Marion,
Ohio this weekend. >>
Mike,
Let's see...three days to get there, two days full of Pietenpol
entertainment, three days to get back. I sure wish I had more time off at work
!! Sounds
like a great time ! However, I will be flying up to Blakesburg, Iowa, next
weekend. And I'm REALLY looking forward to next summer, when WE ALL must fly
to the 75th Aniversery of our beloved deisign, and blacken the skies of
Brodhead '04 with Pietenopls !!!!!!
Chuck G.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Wait a minute, isn't the Marion you want in Ohio?
JimV.
Richard Schreiber wrote:
Guys:
I am a long way from having my Piet done, but my wife and I will be
flying our Tripacer to Marion for the flyin. My Daughter lives in Muncie
just SE of Marion, so we plan on going to Muncie, picking her up and
then flying back to Marion. I saw in the MERFI flyers that Pietenpol's
were going to be featured so I new I had to go.
Rick Schreiber
Valparaiso, IN
Michael D Cuy wrote:
>
>Guys--- Long time Piet supporter, Virgil Phillips has asked that we bring
>as many flying Piets to the Mideastern Regional Fly-In (MERFI) at Marion,
>Ohio this weekend. The biggest day is Saturday. If everything works out
>we could have as many as five of us there. Come if you can ! If all of
>us make it we'll have Larry W. Jim K. Frank P. Wilbur G. and me. For more
>info see sites below.
>
>Mike C.
>
>
>22-24, Fri-Sun. EAA Mid-Eastern Fly-In, Marion Municipal Airport (MNN),
>Marion, OH. Call 440-352-1781.
>
>http://www.eaa.org/communications/eaanews/030522_merfi.html
>
>http://www.marionairport.com/
>
>
>
>
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Dilatush" <dilatush(at)amigo.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wood Prop & Rain |
----- Original Message -----
From: <Rcaprd(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Wood Prop & Rain
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Chuck,
Thanks for the OK. I'll have the newsletter out sometime next month and
send you a copy then if you will let me have your mailing address.
Yes, you do have a future as an aviation writer!
John
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
> In a message dated 8/20/03 7:46:03 AM Central Daylight Time,
> dilatush(at)amigo.net writes:
>
> << I am the newsletter editor of our chapter and would like with your
> permission to reprint your e-mail in our newsletter
>
> May I do this? >>
>
> John,
> Yes, you sure can print it !! I would be honored to have it printed in
your
> newsletter. One thing I forgot to mention about the prop. Upon landing,
I
> closely inspected the prop for any sign of damage. The only thing I found
was
> that the Ace Spar Varnish on just the very leading edge had a matt finish
to
> it...that's all !! Hey...maybe I have a writing career ahead.
>
> from trees & rags,
> to stick & rudder !!
> Pietenpols Forever !!
>
> Chuck Gantzer
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Schreiber <schreib(at)netnitco.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Yes it is. I realized the mistake just after I sent the e-mail. I still
plan on going to Marion, Ohio that is.
dpilot wrote:
>
>Wait a minute, isn't the Marion you want in Ohio?
>JimV.
>
>
>Richard Schreiber wrote:
>
>Guys:
>I am a long way from having my Piet done, but my wife and I will be
>flying our Tripacer to Marion for the flyin. My Daughter lives in Muncie
>just SE of Marion, so we plan on going to Muncie, picking her up and
>then flying back to Marion. I saw in the MERFI flyers that Pietenpol's
>were going to be featured so I new I had to go.
>
>Rick Schreiber
>Valparaiso, IN
>
>Michael D Cuy wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>>Guys--- Long time Piet supporter, Virgil Phillips has asked that we bring
>>as many flying Piets to the Mideastern Regional Fly-In (MERFI) at Marion,
>>Ohio this weekend. The biggest day is Saturday. If everything works out
>>we could have as many as five of us there. Come if you can ! If all of
>>us make it we'll have Larry W. Jim K. Frank P. Wilbur G. and me. For more
>>info see sites below.
>>
>>Mike C.
>>
>>
>>22-24, Fri-Sun. EAA Mid-Eastern Fly-In, Marion Municipal Airport (MNN),
>>Marion, OH. Call 440-352-1781.
>>
>>http://www.eaa.org/communications/eaanews/030522_merfi.html
>>
>>http://www.marionairport.com/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>---------------------------------
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Isablcorky(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
Terry,
I appreciated reading your e mail about converting from A 65. Here is my
plight:
I bought a A 65 locally from a friend, removed the cylinders, had an old time
a/c engine rebuilder check them. He took them to bore out +15. After 4 months
he had done nil, nothing. I decided to retrieve all my parts and start again
elsewhere. Glen Ramsey, El Reno Avn suggested I send them to Sentry in Ft
Worth which I did. After several weeks Sentry called saying the cyl had been bored
out over +20 and they were rejects but could possibly be chromed so off to
Tulsa they went. Next report was two could and two couldn't. Suggested they may
be silvered. So off to San Antonia for that process. Called after a couple of
weeks and Sentry was unable to give me any report saying San Antonia was too
busy to inform him.
That's the way I'm sitting now. Not very comfortable as I know little or
nothing about these processes. If the cyl are finally rejected could there be a
way to use some other cyl which may be more available less expensive than those
65's. Sentry has made a point each time I talk with them that they have plenty
of rebuilt 65 cyl at 550 each.
Can you assit me in anyway?
Corky in La
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BARNSTMR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
Corky,
Wow....you have been thru the ringer.
First let me say I stand corrected about prop pitch. Chuck Gantzer reminded me
that the "40" dash # on the Sensenich prop does not refer to angular degrees
of pitch. However it is a relative unit of pitch. Chuck states... "the '40'
stands for 'Inches of forward travel, no slip". The angular measurement would
be something more like 12 to 15 degrees out about 30 inches from the hub.
Anyway....about the cost difference between A65 and C90 cylinders, heres what I
was basing my logic on.
The following prices are listed on the ECi (Engine Components Inc.) websight for
overhauled nickel plated (cermi-nil) cylinders - complete assy including valves,
rockers, pistons, rings fitted, gapped, assembled, plus gasket set.
A65 assy = $949
C90 assy = $673
Thats a total difference of $1104.00 for 4 cylinders. Those prices are before
core credit. You'll perhaps find smaller or larger differences if you shop around.
But the difference is enough to justify the case mod. ECi can bore your
case for a fee of about $400, however you should be able to find a good machinist
to do it for quite a bit less than ECi.
The bottom line is you should be able to save significantly by building an engine
this way. And you'd save a LOT at the next overhaul since the machine work
won't need redone.
Unfortunately, it sounds like your cylinders may not be acceptable for core credit.
Terry L. Bowden
ph 254-715-4773
fax 254-853-3805
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "w b evans" <wbeevans(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
Corky,
You could try my old buddy Dick Lawson. 973-383-7821.
Seems whenever I go there, I'm stepping over all types of cylinders.
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: <Isablcorky(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: C-90 or O-200
>
> Terry,
> I appreciated reading your e mail about converting from A 65. Here is my
> plight:
> I bought a A 65 locally from a friend, removed the cylinders, had an old
time
> a/c engine rebuilder check them. He took them to bore out +15. After 4
months
> he had done nil, nothing. I decided to retrieve all my parts and start
again
> elsewhere. Glen Ramsey, El Reno Avn suggested I send them to Sentry in Ft
> Worth which I did. After several weeks Sentry called saying the cyl had
been bored
> out over +20 and they were rejects but could possibly be chromed so off to
> Tulsa they went. Next report was two could and two couldn't. Suggested
they may
> be silvered. So off to San Antonia for that process. Called after a couple
of
> weeks and Sentry was unable to give me any report saying San Antonia was
too
> busy to inform him.
>
> That's the way I'm sitting now. Not very comfortable as I know little or
> nothing about these processes. If the cyl are finally rejected could there
be a
> way to use some other cyl which may be more available less expensive than
those
> 65's. Sentry has made a point each time I talk with them that they have
plenty
> of rebuilt 65 cyl at 550 each.
>
> Can you assit me in anyway?
>
> Corky in La
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "" <catdesign(at)intergate.com> |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
Craig
Try contacting Alan James in England at MADjames(at)theknapp.freeserve.co.uk his
Air Camper has a C-90 and as I hear he flies out of a small grass strip with
trees, hills and wires. He may also know how to contact the person
who flies a O-200 Piet in England.
Chris
Sacramento, CA
Quoting Craig Lawler :
>
> I have a C-65 Piet with about 400 hours. We are flying off a 1,200ft
> strip and the pucker factor with two people in the plane is a little
> much. Do any of you have any experience with the more powerful engines
> on the Piet. What prop is best on a C-90 or O-200? Is the performance
> improvement worth the change? Will my current engine mount work? I think
> the cases are the same? I appreciate any help.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Craig Lawler
> 899CL
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
-------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Barry Davis" <bed(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
We have an engine builder in our EAA Chapter. He can work wonders on
experimental engines, like flow-matching the heads, higher compression
pistons, hotter cam, etc. He does a lot of engines for the RV builders. He
also loves the 65,75,85 and O-200 engines. I have one of these engines with
about 300 hours on it now and it is still as smooth as it was new. I'm not
advertising for him, but he has some great ideas for engines, just don't
mention auto fuel. Don Swords email is donsdream1(at)aol.com He has a lot of
good ideas and it doesn't cost anything to ask.
Barry Davis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig Lawler" <clawler(at)ptd.net>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: C-90 or O-200
>
> I have a C-65 Piet with about 400 hours. We are flying off a 1,200ft
> strip and the pucker factor with two people in the plane is a little
> much. Do any of you have any experience with the more powerful engines
> on the Piet. What prop is best on a C-90 or O-200? Is the performance
> improvement worth the change? Will my current engine mount work? I think
> the cases are the same? I appreciate any help.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Craig Lawler
> 899CL
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
Don't mention Auto fuel???>?
Does this guy have a secret supply of 80 Octane aviation fuel?
I don't think so.
100 Low Lead has 4 times the lead of 80.
What does this gent want to use ?
I've used auto fuel almost exclusively for 10 years and 900 hours in my T'craft.
No problems.
Anybody that has trouble with their engine because of using auto fuel will have
trouble with any kind of fuel.
If an engine is put together properly, it will have no trouble no matter what the
fuel.
I will tell what most people do wrong that overhaul engines, if anyone wants to
hear it.
JimV.
Barry Davis wrote:
We have an engine builder in our EAA Chapter. He can work wonders on
experimental engines, like flow-matching the heads, higher compression
pistons, hotter cam, etc. He does a lot of engines for the RV builders. He
also loves the 65,75,85 and O-200 engines. I have one of these engines with
about 300 hours on it now and it is still as smooth as it was new. I'm not
advertising for him, but he has some great ideas for engines, just don't
mention auto fuel. Don Swords email is donsdream1(at)aol.com He has a lot of
good ideas and it doesn't cost anything to ask.
Barry Davis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig Lawler"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: C-90 or O-200
>
> I have a C-65 Piet with about 400 hours. We are flying off a 1,200ft
> strip and the pucker factor with two people in the plane is a little
> much. Do any of you have any experience with the more powerful engines
> on the Piet. What prop is best on a C-90 or O-200? Is the performance
> improvement worth the change? Will my current engine mount work? I think
> the cases are the same? I appreciate any help.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Craig Lawler
> 899CL
>
>
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Craig Lawler <clawler(at)ptd.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 34 Msgs - 08/20/03 |
Thanks to Cy and Terry for the help. I am running a 72 33 Culver prop
now. It turns up 2400 in cruise. I am pushing a little to get more than
the equipment is designed to produce. I don't think the Culver is really
a 33. Maybe a 38 or so. I tried a 72 40 Senenich a it was the pits
compared to the Culver. It think they are more durable, but not as efficent.
Craig Lawler
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Craig Lawler <clawler(at)ptd.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 34 Msgs - 08/20/03 |
Thanks to Cy and Terry for the help. I am running a 72 33 Culver prop
now. It turns up 2400 in cruise. I am pushing a little to get more than
the equipment is designed to produce. I don't think the Culver is really
a 33. Maybe a 38 or so. I tried a 72 40 Senenich a it was the pits
compared to the Culver. It think they are more durable, but not as efficent.
Craig Lawler
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Barry Davis" <bed(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
We have an engine builder in our EAA Chapter. He can work wonders on
experimental engines, like flow-matching the heads, higher compression
pistons, hotter cam, etc. He does a lot of engines for the RV builders. He
also loves the 65,75,85 and O-200 engines. I have one of these engines with
about 300 hours on it now and it is still as smooth as it was new. I'm not
advertising for him, but he has some great ideas for engines, just don't
mention auto fuel. Don Swords email is donsdream1(at)aol.com He has a lot of
good ideas and it doesn't cost anything to ask.
Barry Davis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig Lawler" <clawler(at)ptd.net>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: C-90 or O-200
>
> I have a C-65 Piet with about 400 hours. We are flying off a 1,200ft
> strip and the pucker factor with two people in the plane is a little
> much. Do any of you have any experience with the more powerful engines
> on the Piet. What prop is best on a C-90 or O-200? Is the performance
> improvement worth the change? Will my current engine mount work? I think
> the cases are the same? I appreciate any help.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Craig Lawler
> 899CL
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Barry Davis" <bed(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
Jim, didn't mean to stir you up. You're preaching to the choir. I've used
autofuel in my 172 and 150 for about 10 years now with no problems. Its all
I can get at the grass strip. We are building all six Piets to burn auto
also.
I am very interested in the engine building info you have.
Barry
----- Original Message -----
From: "dpilot" <dpilot(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: C-90 or O-200
>
> Don't mention Auto fuel???>?
> Does this guy have a secret supply of 80 Octane aviation fuel?
> I don't think so.
> 100 Low Lead has 4 times the lead of 80.
> What does this gent want to use ?
> I've used auto fuel almost exclusively for 10 years and 900 hours in my
T'craft.
> No problems.
> Anybody that has trouble with their engine because of using auto fuel will
have trouble with any kind of fuel.
> If an engine is put together properly, it will have no trouble no matter
what the fuel.
> I will tell what most people do wrong that overhaul engines, if anyone
wants to hear it.
> JimV.
>
>
> Barry Davis wrote:
>
> We have an engine builder in our EAA Chapter. He can work wonders on
> experimental engines, like flow-matching the heads, higher compression
> pistons, hotter cam, etc. He does a lot of engines for the RV builders. He
> also loves the 65,75,85 and O-200 engines. I have one of these engines
with
> about 300 hours on it now and it is still as smooth as it was new. I'm not
> advertising for him, but he has some great ideas for engines, just don't
> mention auto fuel. Don Swords email is donsdream1(at)aol.com He has a lot of
> good ideas and it doesn't cost anything to ask.
> Barry Davis
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Craig Lawler"
> To:
>
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: C-90 or O-200
>
>
> >
> > I have a C-65 Piet with about 400 hours. We are flying off a 1,200ft
> > strip and the pucker factor with two people in the plane is a little
> > much. Do any of you have any experience with the more powerful engines
> > on the Piet. What prop is best on a C-90 or O-200? Is the performance
> > improvement worth the change? Will my current engine mount work? I think
> > the cases are the same? I appreciate any help.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Craig Lawler
> > 899CL
> >
> >
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BARNSTMR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
Jim,
Please share your "what most people do wrong" info. Its thru "lessons learned"
that we can make the world better.
Thanks
Terry L. Bowden
ph 254-715-4773
fax 254-853-3805
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Hello guys i plan on being up at merfi this year hope
to see you all there!
Shad Bell
( father, Gary , is getting close to covering his peit.)
__________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Cours <piet-j(at)moriarti.org> |
| Subject: | work bench length |
Hi, everyone -
We've finally unpacked the last of the boxes in the new apartment, and
now it's time to design the work table. The notes with the Piet plans
talk about making it a 16' bench, but I'm trying to make sure that's
about right for a long fuse Air Camper.
From the plans, the long fuse is 14' 4-3/8" without the rudder, which
looks to add 20". I'm assuming that's the source of the 16' dimension.
I'm planning a modular table, with 4 sections of 4' x 30" each, so I can
add an extra interior section if I need to extend it, but I'd sure
rather get it right the first time out.
So, for those of you who've been through this process, or are going
through it now, is a 16'x30" table about the right size for a long fuse
Air Camper? Also, is there anything you ran into with your work table
that you wish you'd done differently?
thanks much,
Jeff C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)grc.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | fatal Piet crash in Indiana August. 3rd, 2003 |
Just got this from a friend via e-mail. I looked up the owner and it was
Tom Young. Don't recall, but was this plane/pilot at Brodhead ? Seems
odd because I flew back home over Indiana a day earlier than this crash.
Mike C.
NTSB Identification: CHI03LA241
14 CFR Part 91: General Aviation
Accident occurred Sunday, August 03, 2003 in Peru, IN
Aircraft: Young Pietenpol Air Camper, registration: N81171
Injuries: 1 Fatal.
This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors.
Any errors in this report will be corrected when the final report has been
completed.
On August 3, 2003, about 1400 central daylight time, a Young Pietenpol Air
Camper, N81171, piloted by a recreational pilot, sustained substantial
damage on impact with trees and terrain during a landing at Robinson
Airport (IN33), near Peru, Indiana. The personal flight was operating under
14 CFR Part 91. Visual meteorological conditions prevailed at the time of
the accident. No flight plan was on file. The pilot was fatally injured.
The flight originated from Logansport Municipal Airport, near Logansport,
Indiana, at time unknown and was landing at IN33 at the time of the
accident.
At 1355, the Grissom Air Reserve Base, near Peru, Indiana, recorded weather
was: Wind 230 degrees at 11 knots, variable between 200 degrees and 260
degrees; visibility 7 statute miles; sky condition scattered 3,000 feet,
broken 3,500 feet, broken 8,000 feet; temperature 25 degrees C; dew point
18 degrees C; Altimeter 29.90 inches of mercury.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BARNSTMR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: work bench length |
I saw a nice workbench down at Kingsbury TX at the Vintage Aeroplane Association
hangar. They are restoring 2 different WWI Fokkers there and three Bristol
fighters.
The table was designed like a tressel table with racks to store tubing or other
long lengths of materials underneath. It was handy because you could access
the long materials from each side.
Terry L. Bowden
ph 254-715-4773
fax 254-853-3805
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BARNSTMR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: fatal Piet crash in Indiana August. 3rd, 2003 |
********************************************************************************
** Report created 8/15/2003 Record 6 **
********************************************************************************
IDENTIFICATION
Regis#: 81171 Make/Model: PIE Description: PIETENPOL AIR CAMPER
Date: 08/03/2003 Time: 1900
Event Type: Accident Highest Injury: Fatal Mid Air: N Missing: N
Damage: Destroyed
LOCATION
City: PERU State: IN Country: US
DESCRIPTION
AIRCRAFT HIT TREES WHILE LANDING AT A PRIVATE STRIP, ONE PERSON ON BOARD
WAS FATALLY INJURED, PERU, IN
INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 1
# Crew: 1 Fat: 1 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
# Pass: 0 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
# Grnd: Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
WEATHER: KGUS 031855Z 23011KT 20011KT 200V260 7SM SCT030 BKN035 BKN035 BKN080 25/18
OTHER DATA
Activity: Pleasure Phase: Landing Operation: General Aviation
Departed: LOGANSPORT, IN Dep Date: 08/03/2003 Dep. Time: 1900
Destination: ROBERTSON FIELD PERU Flt Plan: NONE Wx Briefing: U
Last Radio Cont: NONE
Last Clearance: NONE
FAA FSDO: SOUTH BEND, IN (GL17) Entry date: 08/04/2003
********************************************************************************
********************************************************************************
********************************************************************************
** Report created 8/15/2003 Record 2 **
********************************************************************************
IDENTIFICATION
Regis#: 317PP Make/Model: EXP Description: EXP-PIETENPOL ACMPR GN
Date: 08/03/2003 Time: 1730
Event Type: Incident Highest Injury: None Mid Air: N Missing: N
Damage: Unknown
LOCATION
City: EAST WENATCHEE State: WA Country: US
DESCRIPTION
LANDING GEAR FOLDED DURING TAXI TEST, EAST WENATCHEE, WA
INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 0
# Crew: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
# Pass: 0 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
# Grnd: Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
WEATHER: METAR KEAT 021655Z AUTO 29011KT 10SM CLR 26/07 A2991
OTHER DATA
Activity: Pleasure Phase: Taxi Operation: General Aviation
Departed: Dep Date: Dep. Time:
Destination: Flt Plan: UNK Wx Briefing: U
Last Radio Cont:
Last Clearance:
FAA FSDO: SPOKANE, WA (NM13) Entry date: 08/04/2003
********************************************************************************
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
I will always respond to a well asked question.
I may "bait the hook" a little to stress the importance.
The place where people go wrong is in not knowing the most important
dimention/tolerance information in the list of limits.
One is more important than any other.
It is the most important
Do it wrong and the engine is destined to have problems.
And it is not real easy to do.
JimV.
BARNSTMR(at)aol.com wrote:
Jim,
Please share your "what most people do wrong" info. Its thru "lessons learned"
that we can make the world better.
Thanks
Terry L. Bowden
ph 254-715-4773
fax 254-853-3805
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carbarvo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Hi Shad....about the Piet that's being covered......I'm covering mine now.
The Stitts manual describes a method of covering a negative camber wing and I
don't like it. They want you to riblace before tauting the fabric. That means
before sealing. I plan to glue the fabric to the underside of the ribs when I
first put the fabric on, then iron the fabric, then seal with Polybrush, then
ribstich. The question is: Is the Stitts Polytack going to be strong enough to
hold the fabric in place while it is being tauted. What do you think?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick and Marge Gillespie" <margdick(at)peganet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
I used the Poly-Fiber process exactly as directed and it worked great.
DickG.
----- Original Message -----
From: <Carbarvo(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio
>
> Hi Shad....about the Piet that's being covered......I'm covering mine now.
> The Stitts manual describes a method of covering a negative camber wing
and I
> don't like it. They want you to riblace before tauting the fabric. That
means
> before sealing. I plan to glue the fabric to the underside of the ribs
when I
> first put the fabric on, then iron the fabric, then seal with Polybrush,
then
> ribstich. The question is: Is the Stitts Polytack going to be strong
enough to
> hold the fabric in place while it is being tauted. What do you think?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Schreiber <schreib(at)netnitco.net> |
| Subject: | Re: work bench length |
Jeff I'm glad you asked the question about the fuselage work table. I
just finished my tailfeathers and I am getting ready to do my fuselage.
Have other people used 2 x 10's as the manual says, or is this overkill.
Would 2 x6's with 3/4 inch ply or MDF do the trick.
Thanks
Rick Schreiber
Jeff Cours wrote:
>
>Hi, everyone -
>
>We've finally unpacked the last of the boxes in the new apartment, and
>now it's time to design the work table. The notes with the Piet plans
>talk about making it a 16' bench, but I'm trying to make sure that's
>about right for a long fuse Air Camper.
>
> From the plans, the long fuse is 14' 4-3/8" without the rudder, which
>looks to add 20". I'm assuming that's the source of the 16' dimension.
>I'm planning a modular table, with 4 sections of 4' x 30" each, so I can
>add an extra interior section if I need to extend it, but I'd sure
>rather get it right the first time out.
>
>So, for those of you who've been through this process, or are going
>through it now, is a 16'x30" table about the right size for a long fuse
>Air Camper? Also, is there anything you ran into with your work table
>that you wish you'd done differently?
>
>thanks much,
>Jeff C.
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | work bench length |
Jeff,
I used two 8 foot by 3 foot flooring sheets to get a 16 foot by 3 foot
table. Works a treat.
Peter.
http://cpc-world.cable.nu
(Check out fuse construction, need to get some new pictures on there!!)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard
Schreiber
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: work bench length
-->
Jeff I'm glad you asked the question about the fuselage work table. I
just finished my tailfeathers and I am getting ready to do my fuselage.
Have other people used 2 x 10's as the manual says, or is this overkill.
Would 2 x6's with 3/4 inch ply or MDF do the trick.
Thanks
Rick Schreiber
Jeff Cours wrote:
>
>Hi, everyone -
>
>We've finally unpacked the last of the boxes in the new apartment, and
>now it's time to design the work table. The notes with the Piet plans
>talk about making it a 16' bench, but I'm trying to make sure that's
>about right for a long fuse Air Camper.
>
> From the plans, the long fuse is 14' 4-3/8" without the rudder, which
>looks to add 20". I'm assuming that's the source of the 16' dimension.
>I'm planning a modular table, with 4 sections of 4' x 30" each, so I can
>add an extra interior section if I need to extend it, but I'd sure
>rather get it right the first time out.
>
>So, for those of you who've been through this process, or are going
>through it now, is a 16'x30" table about the right size for a long fuse
>Air Camper? Also, is there anything you ran into with your work table
>that you wish you'd done differently?
>
>thanks much,
>Jeff C.
>
>
>
>
advertising on the Matronics Forums.
Share: Share photos & files with other List members.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wizzard187(at)aol.com |
PIETERS, I want to put a new crank seal on a tapershaft cont and wonder if
anyone knows how to remove the prop flange from the crank. I know I can
split the case and use a split seal but prefer not to. There is not enough
room behind the flange to get a seal in.
Any help would be appreciated.
Ken Conrad in Hot Iowa
The overhaul manuals don't give a clue
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Sloan" <alexms1(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: work bench length |
Jeff,
I built my fuselage on a 16' work table and had room to spare. It is the
stretch fuselage. It is now sitting on the table glued together. My work
shop is so small I have to leave it there and stand on stools to work on the
inside. I have all the plywood glued on.
Alex Sloan
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Cours" <piet-j(at)moriarti.org>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: work bench length
>
> Hi, everyone -
>
> We've finally unpacked the last of the boxes in the new apartment, and
> now it's time to design the work table. The notes with the Piet plans
> talk about making it a 16' bench, but I'm trying to make sure that's
> about right for a long fuse Air Camper.
>
> From the plans, the long fuse is 14' 4-3/8" without the rudder, which
> looks to add 20". I'm assuming that's the source of the 16' dimension.
> I'm planning a modular table, with 4 sections of 4' x 30" each, so I can
> add an extra interior section if I need to extend it, but I'd sure
> rather get it right the first time out.
>
> So, for those of you who've been through this process, or are going
> through it now, is a 16'x30" table about the right size for a long fuse
> Air Camper? Also, is there anything you ran into with your work table
> that you wish you'd done differently?
>
> thanks much,
> Jeff C.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Sloan" <alexms1(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: work bench length |
Terry,
I have my spars and extra spruce and all the 4130 stored under the 16' work
table.
Alex Sloan
----- Original Message -----
From: <BARNSTMR(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: work bench length
>
> I saw a nice workbench down at Kingsbury TX at the Vintage Aeroplane
Association hangar. They are restoring 2 different WWI Fokkers there and
three Bristol fighters.
>
> The table was designed like a tressel table with racks to store tubing or
other long lengths of materials underneath. It was handy because you could
access the long materials from each side.
>
> Terry L. Bowden
> ph 254-715-4773
> fax 254-853-3805
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "w b evans" <wbeevans(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Me too! Did my Piet wing exactly to the Poly Fiber manual, and it came out
great. Don't try to second guess the professionals. (my 2 cents.....thank
you)
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dick and Marge Gillespie" <margdick(at)peganet.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio
>
> I used the Poly-Fiber process exactly as directed and it worked great.
> DickG.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <Carbarvo(at)aol.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio
>
>
> >
> > Hi Shad....about the Piet that's being covered......I'm covering mine
now.
> > The Stitts manual describes a method of covering a negative camber wing
> and I
> > don't like it. They want you to riblace before tauting the fabric. That
> means
> > before sealing. I plan to glue the fabric to the underside of the ribs
> when I
> > first put the fabric on, then iron the fabric, then seal with Polybrush,
> then
> > ribstich. The question is: Is the Stitts Polytack going to be strong
> enough to
> > hold the fabric in place while it is being tauted. What do you think?
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Neal" <lneal(at)ev1.net> |
| Subject: | Re: work bench length |
I ripped a sheet of 1/2" ply and made a 2'x16' bench. Spliced two pairs of
10' 2'x4''s with bolts and screwed the ply on top of these, spaced parallel
about 18" apart.
Put the whole thing on top of three plastic workbenches, leveled and snapped
a straight line down the middle. When finished, the whole thing broke down
in ten minutes and is in the loft for use on the next project.
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: "Alex Sloan" <alexms1(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: work bench length
>
> Jeff,
> I built my fuselage on a 16' work table and had room to spare. It is the
> stretch fuselage. It is now sitting on the table glued together. My work
> shop is so small I have to leave it there and stand on stools to work on
the
> inside. I have all the plywood glued on.
> Alex Sloan
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jeff Cours" <piet-j(at)moriarti.org>
> To:
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: work bench length
>
>
> >
> > Hi, everyone -
> >
> > We've finally unpacked the last of the boxes in the new apartment, and
> > now it's time to design the work table. The notes with the Piet plans
> > talk about making it a 16' bench, but I'm trying to make sure that's
> > about right for a long fuse Air Camper.
> >
> > From the plans, the long fuse is 14' 4-3/8" without the rudder, which
> > looks to add 20". I'm assuming that's the source of the 16' dimension.
> > I'm planning a modular table, with 4 sections of 4' x 30" each, so I can
> > add an extra interior section if I need to extend it, but I'd sure
> > rather get it right the first time out.
> >
> > So, for those of you who've been through this process, or are going
> > through it now, is a 16'x30" table about the right size for a long fuse
> > Air Camper? Also, is there anything you ran into with your work table
> > that you wish you'd done differently?
> >
> > thanks much,
> > Jeff C.
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "w b evans" <wbeevans(at)verizon.net> |
Ken,
The books, (Tony B's I think) goes into it in detail. Remove any securing
device, and put a bar about 2 ft. long in the holes of the hub, and pull in
the unwind direction while leaning on the prop. ( Lefty loosie, righty
tighty)
then I had to give the prop hub a whack with a dead blow, like a piece of
4X4 or a sledge hammer hitting the hub thru a block of wood, and it will pop
off.. Next thing you will have the prop and the hub combined in your hand.
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: <Wizzard187(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List:
>
> PIETERS, I want to put a new crank seal on a tapershaft cont and wonder
if
> anyone knows how to remove the prop flange from the crank. I know I can
> split the case and use a split seal but prefer not to. There is not
enough
> room behind the flange to get a seal in.
> Any help would be appreciated.
> Ken Conrad in Hot Iowa
> The overhaul manuals don't give a clue
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BARNSTMR(at)aol.com |
There's an internal snap ring. Be sure you look at it and understand how it
secures the hub before you back off the nut. Wedge a small piece of aluminum
or something to hold it gapped apart so it will not draw together as you back
the hub off. This will save you some grief.
Terry Bowden
ph (254) 715-4773
fax (254) 853-3805
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: work bench length |
My workbench is rather permanent.
4' X 14' as that is the maximum reasonable
length for my shop and I originaly was going
to build the standard short fuse. I think I'm
going for a 14' fuse now. You can see some
shots here.( Ignore the mess please, the
silver stuff on the floor is shavings from
routing aluminum parts for the Corvair.)
http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList2.cfm?AlbumID=27
The lower height of a bench like this is
usefull for many projects besides airplanes
so for me it's not a problem being a
permanent fixture in the shop. Besides. I
need more space to handle my insatiable
need to collect the useless bits I may need
someday.
I don't want to change it at all. Good thing
considering.
Clif
>
> Hi, everyone -
>
> We've finally unpacked the last of the boxes in the new apartment, and
> now it's time to design the work table. The notes with the Piet plans
> talk about making it a 16' bench, but I'm trying to make sure that's
> about right for a long fuse Air Camper.
>
> From the plans, the long fuse is 14' 4-3/8" without the rudder, which
> looks to add 20". I'm assuming that's the source of the 16' dimension.
> I'm planning a modular table, with 4 sections of 4' x 30" each, so I can
> add an extra interior section if I need to extend it, but I'd sure
> rather get it right the first time out.
>
> So, for those of you who've been through this process, or are going
> through it now, is a 16'x30" table about the right size for a long fuse
> Air Camper? Also, is there anything you ran into with your work table
> that you wish you'd done differently?
>
> thanks much,
> Jeff C.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 8/22/03 12:01:46 AM Central Daylight Time,
BARNSTMR(at)aol.com writes:
<< There's an internal snap ring. Be sure you look at it and understand how
it
secures the hub before you back off the nut. Wedge a small piece of
aluminum
or something to hold it gapped apart so it will not draw together as you
back
the hub off. This will save you some grief. >>
Ah, yes. I remember this snap ring. It's an internal snap ring, that has
four access holes to squeeze the snap ring clear of the internal portion of the
hub. I made four studs that were a little smaller than the holes, about 3/16"
long, and held them in the holes, and compressed that snap ring with a hose
clamp around the outside of them. Tighten up the hose clamp, after aligning
the little studs within the holes, and the snap ring clears the groove, then the
hub can be threaded off. However, break the tapered shaft loose, before
doing the snap ring thing.
Chuck G.
Chuck
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Not having done any fabric yet my observations
may be off but it seems to me that stitching
rather than glueing allows some movement to
relieve shrinking stresses. If the ribs are glued
each panel is a seperate entity from it's
neighbours. This may not mean anything in
real life but as you say, the pros stitch for a
reason.
Clif
>
> Me too! Did my Piet wing exactly to the Poly Fiber manual, and it came
out
> great. Don't try to second guess the professionals. (my 2
cents.....thank
> you)
> walt evans
> NX140DL
>
> >
> > I used the Poly-Fiber process exactly as directed and it worked great.
> > DickG.
> >
> > >
> > > Hi Shad....about the Piet that's being covered......I'm covering mine
> now.
> > > The Stitts manual describes a method of covering a negative camber
wing
> > and I
> > > don't like it. They want you to riblace before tauting the fabric.
That
> > means
> > > before sealing. I plan to glue the fabric to the underside of the ribs
> > when I
> > > first put the fabric on, then iron the fabric, then seal with
Polybrush,
> > then
> > > ribstich. The question is: Is the Stitts Polytack going to be strong
> > enough to
> > > hold the fabric in place while it is being tauted. What do you think?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kip & Beth Gardner <kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
>
>Not having done any fabric yet my observations
>may be off but it seems to me that stitching
>rather than glueing allows some movement to
>relieve shrinking stresses. If the ribs are glued
>each panel is a seperate entity from it's
>neighbours. This may not mean anything in
>real life but as you say, the pros stitch for a
>reason.
>
>Clif
Group,
I have not done any covering on my own yet, but about 2 years ago I went to
a covering workshop run by Jim (?) & Dondi Miller, the Ohio PolyFiber
distributors. My recollection is that they followed the manual pretty
closely & only glued the fabric down around the edges of the wing panel.
Then they LIGHTLY shrunk the fabric to take out the major wrinkles, but
leaving enough slack in the fabric to conform to the undercamber, followed
by rib stitching and then the final shrinking to get it all tight. As Clif
implied, this distributes the stresses of shrinking evenly across the wing
panel. If you glue to the ribs before shrinking, I think you run the risk
of having bays with more 'wrinkle' than you can heat-shrink out, and others
could be too tight.
My 'learned-once' opinion!
Kip
North Canton, OH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "w b evans" <wbeevans(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Don't get me wrong, but don't try to reinvent the wheel :>).
Get the $10.00 Poly Fiber "how to" book, and all of this is covered in
there. Even the concave wing of the Piet.
It's a step by step book with pictures, and very easy to understand. My ,
now flying Piet, was my second project with Poly Fiber, and I'm sold on it.
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kip & Beth Gardner" <kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio
>
> >
> >Not having done any fabric yet my observations
> >may be off but it seems to me that stitching
> >rather than glueing allows some movement to
> >relieve shrinking stresses. If the ribs are glued
> >each panel is a seperate entity from it's
> >neighbours. This may not mean anything in
> >real life but as you say, the pros stitch for a
> >reason.
> >
> >Clif
>
> Group,
>
> I have not done any covering on my own yet, but about 2 years ago I went
to
> a covering workshop run by Jim (?) & Dondi Miller, the Ohio PolyFiber
> distributors. My recollection is that they followed the manual pretty
> closely & only glued the fabric down around the edges of the wing panel.
> Then they LIGHTLY shrunk the fabric to take out the major wrinkles, but
> leaving enough slack in the fabric to conform to the undercamber, followed
> by rib stitching and then the final shrinking to get it all tight. As Clif
> implied, this distributes the stresses of shrinking evenly across the wing
> panel. If you glue to the ribs before shrinking, I think you run the risk
> of having bays with more 'wrinkle' than you can heat-shrink out, and
others
> could be too tight.
>
> My 'learned-once' opinion!
>
> Kip
>
>
> North Canton, OH
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "" <catdesign(at)intergate.com> |
| Subject: | Re: work bench length |
My work bench top is made up from two (used) solid core doors(partical board
cores). I got them for 20 bucks at a door stoor. I used 2x4s for legs and 1x4s
to brace the legs. The doors sit on top of 2x4s along the edges. I had to leave
a space (about 1-foot)between the two doors to get the table long enough. This
space was braced with plywood strips connecting the two seperate benches. I
also put 5/8th inch bolts in a hole drilled into the bottom of each leg. These
were used to level the bench. After I leveled the bench I put some wood glue
around each bolt where it sat on the concrete floor. This holds the bench in
place and also tells me if anything has moved. Cost of the bench was 40 bucks
and took a couple hours to build. I also keep stuff under the bench on the
cross braces.
Chris
Sacramento, CA
Quoting Jeff Cours :
>
> Hi, everyone -
>
> We've finally unpacked the last of the boxes in the new apartment, and
> now it's time to design the work table. The notes with the Piet plans
> talk about making it a 16' bench, but I'm trying to make sure that's
> about right for a long fuse Air Camper.
>
> From the plans, the long fuse is 14' 4-3/8" without the rudder, which
> looks to add 20". I'm assuming that's the source of the 16' dimension.
> I'm planning a modular table, with 4 sections of 4' x 30" each, so I can
> add an extra interior section if I need to extend it, but I'd sure
> rather get it right the first time out.
>
> So, for those of you who've been through this process, or are going
> through it now, is a 16'x30" table about the right size for a long fuse
> Air Camper? Also, is there anything you ran into with your work table
> that you wish you'd done differently?
>
> thanks much,
> Jeff C.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
-------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick and Marge Gillespie" <margdick(at)peganet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Not only that, (the book) you can call them toll-free in CA and ask them
any questions you might have. (Poly-Fiber that is)
DickG
----- Original Message -----
From: "w b evans" <wbeevans(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio
>
> Don't get me wrong, but don't try to reinvent the wheel :>).
>
> Get the $10.00 Poly Fiber "how to" book, and all of this is covered in
> there. Even the concave wing of the Piet.
> It's a step by step book with pictures, and very easy to understand. My ,
> now flying Piet, was my second project with Poly Fiber, and I'm sold on
it.
> walt evans
> NX140DL
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Kip & Beth Gardner" <kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio
>
>
>
> >
> > >
> > >Not having done any fabric yet my observations
> > >may be off but it seems to me that stitching
> > >rather than glueing allows some movement to
> > >relieve shrinking stresses. If the ribs are glued
> > >each panel is a seperate entity from it's
> > >neighbours. This may not mean anything in
> > >real life but as you say, the pros stitch for a
> > >reason.
> > >
> > >Clif
> >
> > Group,
> >
> > I have not done any covering on my own yet, but about 2 years ago I went
> to
> > a covering workshop run by Jim (?) & Dondi Miller, the Ohio PolyFiber
> > distributors. My recollection is that they followed the manual pretty
> > closely & only glued the fabric down around the edges of the wing panel.
> > Then they LIGHTLY shrunk the fabric to take out the major wrinkles, but
> > leaving enough slack in the fabric to conform to the undercamber,
followed
> > by rib stitching and then the final shrinking to get it all tight. As
Clif
> > implied, this distributes the stresses of shrinking evenly across the
wing
> > panel. If you glue to the ribs before shrinking, I think you run the
risk
> > of having bays with more 'wrinkle' than you can heat-shrink out, and
> others
> > could be too tight.
> >
> > My 'learned-once' opinion!
> >
> > Kip
> >
> >
> > North Canton, OH
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Victorjeanharper(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Colorado Piet folks |
Hi everyone, I'm going to get started soon on a Piet. I live in the Denver
area, If anyone is building/flying one around here give me a call. Thanks Vic
Harper 303-796-9504
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carbarvo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
I think something was lost in the translation...I wasn't advocating gluing
instead of ribstitching but in addition to it.....C Vought
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ian Holland" <iholland(at)telusplanet.net> |
Hi, guys! I've been offline for a while trying to cope with an
illness(not mine). The bottom line is that, regretfully, I cannot
complete my Pietenpol project of 9 years and am looking for a buyer
before I try the e-bay route. I thought I would see if there were any
"lurkers" out there on the List that might want a huge headstart on
the project. The fuselage is on the gear and wheels, wings are
complete. A Corvair is sitting on the nose and it is basically ready
for the prefabric inspection. I have $12,000 US invested in the
material and 1200 hours in labour. I am looking to recover the cost of
the materials. The time was well spent, and I enjoyed the help and
wisdom available from the group. Material and fittings are top of the
line. There is a full panel of instruments.
The only condition will be that when completed, I get a ride as a
passenger.
The decision to sell is one of the hardest that I have had to make in
a long time. The location is north West Alberta, in Whitecourt.
For more details, contact me direct at iholland(at)telusplanet.net
Thanks for all your help over the years!
-=Ian=-
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Sloan" <alexms1(at)bellsouth.net> |
Lan,
I for one am sad that you are having to make this decision. I had to sell
my RV-6 I built and flew for a number of years and it was also a very tough
thing to do. To take up the slack I am build the Pietenpol. Gives me
something to do and keeps me occupied.
I hope you get your ride in your Pietenpol.
Alex Sloan
North Alabama
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ian Holland" <iholland(at)telusplanet.net>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: For Sale
>
> Hi, guys! I've been offline for a while trying to cope with an
> illness(not mine). The bottom line is that, regretfully, I cannot
> complete my Pietenpol project of 9 years and am looking for a buyer
> before I try the e-bay route. I thought I would see if there were any
> "lurkers" out there on the List that might want a huge headstart on
> the project. The fuselage is on the gear and wheels, wings are
> complete. A Corvair is sitting on the nose and it is basically ready
> for the prefabric inspection. I have $12,000 US invested in the
> material and 1200 hours in labour. I am looking to recover the cost of
> the materials. The time was well spent, and I enjoyed the help and
> wisdom available from the group. Material and fittings are top of the
> line. There is a full panel of instruments.
>
> The only condition will be that when completed, I get a ride as a
> passenger.
>
> The decision to sell is one of the hardest that I have had to make in
> a long time. The location is north West Alberta, in Whitecourt.
>
> For more details, contact me direct at iholland(at)telusplanet.net
>
> Thanks for all your help over the years!
>
> -=Ian=-
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
In a message dated 8/22/03 7:41:48 AM Central Daylight Time,
kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net writes:
<< only glued the fabric down around the edges of the wing panel.
Then they LIGHTLY shrunk the fabric to take out the major wrinkles, but
leaving enough slack in the fabric to conform to the undercamber, followed
by rib stitching and then the final shrinking to get it all tight.
That's the way I did it. Pay close attention to iron temp with one of those
little iron thermometers, and ironing everything thouroughly & evenly, in two
directions . My first shrink was done evenly, at less than half of the max
temp. Do not glue the fabric to the ribs.
Chuck G.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wood Prop & Rain |
In a message dated 8/21/03 6:56:01 AM Central Daylight Time,
dilatush(at)amigo.net writes:
<< +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Chuck,
Thanks for the OK. I'll have the newsletter out sometime next month and
send you a copy then if you will let me have your mailing address.
Yes, you do have a future as an aviation writer!
John
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>
John,
Thanks in advance ! My address:
Chuck Gantzer
626 Pattie
Wichita, KS 67211
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Lauritz Larsen" <pietlars(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: work bench length |
Hi:
I planned to laminate my wing spars, so when i started on the table, a
requirement was a flat, straight plane surface.
Looked at the 14' and 16' 2x4s and 2x6s and was not happy with the
straightness or the cost. So I used metal stud and metal plates, (2x4
size). They are straight and don't warp and they are cheap. The studs are
a perfect fit to the inside of the plates, (they are both galvanized steel
channels). So I butted two 8' studs at the mid point of a 10'plate; then
butted a an 8' +/- plate to the side plates. These were 45 deg. V notched
at the 3' and 5' points and bent into 90 deg. corners at the V, forming the
end pieces of a 2' x 16' frame. held everything together with 1/2" sheet
metal screws. Also reinforced the ends with wood a 2x4 trimmed to fit
inside the stud section liners. Ditto with 2x4s at 4' intervals inside the
frame; used drywall screws to fasten them.
The table surface was made of doubled 1/2" particle board; I happened to
find some 34" x 8' pieces cheap so thats what I used. Centered a piece,
with half pieces butted for the bottom layer and 2 pieces for the top layer
making the top 1" thick and very ridgid. Mounted the frame/table top on 3
sawhorses. Checked the flatness with a stretched wire and it checked out
OK. By using drywall screws, it was easily disassembled and reused.
I am sold on the metal stud/plate frame concept and do recommend it. Also
the particle board is easy to screw the jig pieces to.
Just another way to make a table.
Regards,
Lou Larsen
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Cours" <piet-j(at)moriarti.org>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: work bench length
>
> Hi, everyone -
>
> We've finally unpacked the last of the boxes in the new apartment, and
> now it's time to design the work table. The notes with the Piet plans
> talk about making it a 16' bench, but I'm trying to make sure that's
> about right for a long fuse Air Camper.
>
> From the plans, the long fuse is 14' 4-3/8" without the rudder, which
> looks to add 20". I'm assuming that's the source of the 16' dimension.
> I'm planning a modular table, with 4 sections of 4' x 30" each, so I can
> add an extra interior section if I need to extend it, but I'd sure
> rather get it right the first time out.
>
> So, for those of you who've been through this process, or are going
> through it now, is a 16'x30" table about the right size for a long fuse
> Air Camper? Also, is there anything you ran into with your work table
> that you wish you'd done differently?
>
> thanks much,
> Jeff C.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kip & Beth Gardner <kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
>
>In a message dated 8/22/03 7:41:48 AM Central Daylight Time,
>kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net writes:
>
><< only glued the fabric down around the edges of the wing panel.
> Then they LIGHTLY shrunk the fabric to take out the major wrinkles, but
> leaving enough slack in the fabric to conform to the undercamber, followed
> by rib stitching and then the final shrinking to get it all tight.
>
>That's the way I did it. Pay close attention to iron temp with one of those
>little iron thermometers, and ironing everything thouroughly & evenly, in two
>directions . My first shrink was done evenly, at less than half of the max
>temp. Do not glue the fabric to the ribs.
>
>Chuck G.
Walt, Chuck, etc.,
I certainly don't want to reinvent the wheel & the Millers ARE PolyFiber
distributors & application experts. They do go by the book; I was just
reflecting on what I observed these experts doing & what they had us do. I
look forward to getting to the covering phase, although it looks a long way
off; right now I'm working 10 hr. days & my 4-yr. old wants Daddy's
attention when I do get home from work. So this does not leave much, if
any, time for building.
Anyway, from my limited experience, covering is a fun process, even if I
still can't do the damn rib-stitch knot without 5 or 6 trys first - I was
not a good boy scout (I kept getting distracted by rockets, model airplanes
& girls - not necessarily in that order).
Chuck, I enjoyed meeting you at Brodhead & getting to look over your
widely-traveled plane - I'd love to have the time to circiumnavigate the US
- maybe I will by the time I finish my project. Your flying stories are
great, keep it up. BTW, several of us were admiring your prop, it had
really nice 'lines' (props, like women, should have nice curves, as far as
I'm concerned) - did you make it?
Kip Gardner
North Canton, OH
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Greg Cardinal ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Greg Cardinal
Subject: General Construction Pictures
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/gcardinal@mn.rr.com.08.23.2003/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
In a message dated 8/23/03 12:29:42 PM Central Daylight Time,
kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net writes:
<< Chuck, I enjoyed meeting you at Brodhead & getting to look over your
widely-traveled plane - I'd love to have the time to circiumnavigate the US
- maybe I will by the time I finish my project. Your flying stories are
great, keep it up. BTW, several of us were admiring your prop, it had
really nice 'lines' (props, like women, should have nice curves, as far as
I'm concerned) - did you make it? >>
Kip,
Brodhead was the Best !! Meeting all you good folks, puts faces with names,
and seeing all those beautiful planes, made me realize that there are lots of
people out there with similar unique intrests. I'm working on my next story,
as I type. At work, I'm trying to convince 'em to give me a leave of absence
next summer, so I can do 'A Lap Around America'. Would that be cool, or what
??? Yes, thank you, I did make that prop. Maybe that was the reason I
didn't want that rain to undue all the effort I put into it !! Props, like women,
should also be smooth to the touch, easy on the eyes, and usually lead me
around by the nose !!
Chuck G.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com> |
| Subject: | what do you find odd in this NTSB report?? |
Here's an NTSB accident report on a Piet.
Fortunatley there was no fatality, but read it and see if you can find what
I did that sounded really odd.....
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001211X11558&key=1
DJ Vegh
N74DV
Mesa, AZ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: what do you find odd in this NTSB report?? |
Must have been awfully nose heavy, or somebody
went missing.
>
> Here's an NTSB accident report on a Piet.
>
> Fortunatley there was no fatality, but read it and see if you can find
what
> I did that sounded really odd.....
>
> http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001211X11558&key=1
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: what do you find odd in this NTSB report?? |
Tail heavy Clif, The duselage had to be overbuilt... imagine the
position of the CG with him in the "real pilots" seat...
Saludos
Gary Gower.
--- clif wrote:
>
> Must have been awfully nose heavy, or somebody
> went missing.
>
>
>
> >
> > Here's an NTSB accident report on a Piet.
> >
> > Fortunatley there was no fatality, but read it and see if you can
> find
> what
> > I did that sounded really odd.....
> >
> > http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001211X11558&key=1
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Charts, Pilotage & Dead Reconing vs. GPS |
When flying a Pietenpol, its best if you play the part wearing a leather
helmet, goggles, and long white silk scarf. It gives you a much better
relationship with the way our Forefathers did it in the early days. Using a GPS
in
a Pietenpol, to me, seemed like contradiction in terms. GPS is for
sissies...I don't need one, and I don't want one. However, Doug Bryant insisted
I take
his GPS along with me, and just try it out. It's a Magellan SkyBlazer XL.
All the guys at Benton said "GPS is the best thing that's happened since
ailerons". Well, I guess I had to go along with the majority. After some
experimentation, we found the best place to mount the antenna was on the trailing
edge,
just above the pilot seat. I had to drill holes in the trailing edge to mount
the thing...I HATE drilling useless holes in my plane. Mike (at Benton) was
familiar with a similar model, and was showing me some of the features of
this little 1" x 3 1/2 x 6 1/2 box, while I was trying desperately to do final
preparations on my plane before the trip. I also scanned through the thick
instruction manual. I do, sometimes, read directions !! Now I have another
chore, of building some kind of bracket to hold this thing. Real Estate, as you
know, is very limited in the cockpit. I already had to make a bracket for the
Com radio, on the right longeron, to allow the antenna to point up, just to
the right side of the windshield. I also had to get another flying helmet, to
accommodate the headset I wore, and also had a wire going to the 'PTT' (push to
talk) on the control stick. I finally opted to just make a sling, our of
some duct tape, and wear the GPS around my neck...just not enough time to
develop a suitable bracket. It felt like a bowling ball. I hate all this wiring,
and EELEC TRONIC crap !!
The first time I actually used it, was on the first leg of my journey.
It showed ground speed, direction to the airport, distance to the airport,
heading, CDI, and some other stuff, too. All right, that's kinda cool. During
the second leg, the thing said 'Battery Power', then crapped out. After I
landed at Ottowa, took on some fuel, talked with the locals about where I'm coming
from and going to, I replaced the THREE batteries that are in this electronic
marvel. During the fourth leg, the thing said 'Battery Power', and once
again...crapped out !! I wasn't even a quarter of the way there, yet. I would
have thrown this thing overboard, but it had a sling around my neck !! This
thing eats batteries, like a teenager with the munchies !! I assumed the best
way
to use it, was to turn it on just to double check my heading, or the remote
possibility - if I got lost. At the next fuel stop, I replenished the
batteries, stowed it next to my left hip, and never turned it on again...until
I was
half way back on my return trip.
Studying the scenery, using pilotage to maintain position, is truly the
most enjoyable method of navigation. The panoramic view, offered in an open
cockpit, is unparalleled. Watching all those 'Grounders' (folks who never fly),
I kind of feel sorry for them, for they will never know what they are
missing. It really gives you a chance to appreciate the countryside. Once, I
saw a
back yard swimming pool, and yes, there were a couple of bikini clad girls
down there !! I pulled power, and dropped down for a closer look. On my second
lap around the pool, they both started waving their arms at me !! I gave 'em
a good wing wave back, hoping they were from the 'Girls Gone Wild' video, but
no such luck. Gave 'em another wing wave, and took up a northeast heading.
An afterthought, was to holler down to them, my request...I'll do that next
time !!
On the return trip, Saturday evening, at the end of my third long leg of
flying, I had spent over 7 hours in the sky. Except for a sore butt, I really
didn't feel fatigued. I came up on a stretch of forest, where there were
just no distinguishable features, so I just checked one of the VOR's on the
chart, noted the direction I needed to fly, and flew compass heading for a while.
Twenty minutes later, I finally came upon a small town, but couldn't find it
on the chart. Then I thought...damn...I didn't correct for wind. OK, there's
another town in the distance, and it has a water tower on the West side of
town. As I looked at how the roads and railroads laid, I still didn't find it
on
the chart. OK, pull power, drop down to have a look at the name on the water
tower. Turned out this was a small water tower, the kind that looks like a
golf ball on a tee, and it was evedently one that just fed the needs of a farm,
and didn't have a name on it. OK, it's only 7:30, still lots of daylight
left, and I have plenty of fuel onboard. Should I go in this direction, or that
direction. I zig zagged to two more towns, but couldn't find them on the
chart either. I wasn't really lost...I mean I knew what area I was in, I just
didn't know my position. Well, as I began to look for a suitable landing area,
I
went over in my mind how I would do it: Do three of four low fly-bys,
checking for spider webs (electric & telephone wires), and dropping a little lower
on each pass. Then do a couple of touch & goes, just to test the soil, or the
road, and wondering how I would explain this to the neighbors that I would
have to encounter. However, I do have another option: program the GPS. I
hesitated calling it my 'Ace in the Hole'. I had to program this unfamiliar
gadget, with the 'from' and 'to' identifiers I found on the chart, MPZ to IRK,
while
I was looking for landmarks or a place to land, and most of all - Fly the
Plane !! With my head in the cockpit, it seamed each time I looked back up, the
nose was way high, or a wing was way high. I double checked each letter I put
in the GPS, because I didn't want to put the wrong identifier in.
Finally...WA LAA !! It showed me what heading to take up, and Kirksville was
just nine
miles away !! I noted the heading, and turned the GPS back off, to conserve
those three tiny batteries. Turned it back on when I was about three miles
out, then spotted the airport. I turned on the COM radio to enter the class D
airspace, and when I broadcast my position and intention, the 'Battery' light
was flashing on the COM radio !! I still don't like this battery stuff, and
electronic crap, but I guess I've come to terms with the fact that we live in a
different time. Kirksville has a nice East / West grass runway, and I
greased 'er on with at least 15 minutes of daylight left. After taxiing in to where
the pumps were, nobody around, I was glad to see it was the credit card type
pumps. Had to kind of pry my body out of the cockpit, stretch all the kinks
out, and fuel 'er up. Pushed 'er over to a tie down area, secured my trusty
pair of wings, unpacked a few things and headed over to the big glass doors of
the building...locked. No phone around. Walked around the side of the building
to where it said 'Pilot Brief', and the door was unlocked. Hummmm....vending
machines and a couch !! I had three bags of corn chips, two bags of
skittles, & two cans or root beer for supper, and got a good nights sleep on the
couch !!! Just doesn't get any better than this !!
Chuck Gantzer
NX770CG
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cinda Gadd" <csfog(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | what do you find odd in this NTSB report?? |
This Piet was at Brodhead 93 94 and 95. It was red fuse
and cream wing, with Continental power. It had a big rooster on the side, and a
large silver spinner.
I found a picture of this plane with the pilot just
getting in or out of the REAR pit.
I think the FAA report just got it wrong, he was flying
from the correct cockpit.
http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001211X11558 key=1
--- Skip Cinda Gadd
--- csfog(at)earthlink.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Loar" <skycarl(at)megsinet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: what do you find odd in this NTSB report?? |
I think it was because he was in England AR. It's that being in England
with that left side, right side, front seat, back seat stuff. And what's
with that food? It's very confusing there.
Carl
----- Original Message -----
From: "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: what do you find odd in this NTSB report??
>
> Here's an NTSB accident report on a Piet.
>
> Fortunatley there was no fatality, but read it and see if you can find
what
> I did that sounded really odd.....
>
> http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001211X11558&key=1
>
>
> DJ Vegh
> N74DV
> Mesa, AZ
> www.imagedv.com/aircamper
>
>
> -
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BARNSTMR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Charts, Pilotage & Dead Reconing vs. GPS |
Chuck,
I just read your story aloud to my father in-law. We throroughly enjoyed
your tale and had a good laugh to start our day. Makes us even more anxious to
get the bird in the air. We wanted to know....back at the pool. Would your
"request have been "Which way to the local church?"
Keep up the great stories.
Terry Bowden
ph (254) 715-4773
fax (254) 853-3805
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron Butcher" <rbutch(at)inreach.com> |
| Subject: | Hardware Inventory |
Hello all...
Has anybody taken the time to put together a list of hardware (i.e. nuts and bolts,
washers, turnbuckles, etc.) that one needs to assemble a proper Piet? I
know that with the variations that we all like to do and with short/long fuselage
versions, 3 piece vs. single piece wing that it would be a little different.
Someone did do a wood listing a while back....just wonder'in if anyone had
done something similar with hardware?????
Ron - Turlock, Cal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ANNCARLEK(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 9 Msgs - 08/23/03 |
In a message dated 8/23/03 11:56:48 PM, pietenpol-list-digest(at)matronics.com
writes:
<< From: "Jeff Cours" <piet-j(at)moriarti.org>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: work bench length
>>
I built mine 16' long, which is totally adequate for the long fuse. I paid
the extra price to use two sheets of particle board, 36" wide. This width was
swell: I used it for all sorts of things, and would not make another bench
narrower than this
Carl L @ Compton Airport
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Isablcorky(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Chuck,
Don't want to intrude on your writings as Isabelle and I are thoroughly
enjoying it. I told her about your conclusions about women and props and your
proposed, "Cruise around America". She says, why don't you go with him while you
still have a Piet?
Want to talk?
Corky in La raring to go
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carbarvo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Hi Chuck.....Are you familiar with the chap from here in Alabama who flew the
US perimeter in a Kolb Mark III? If not and you're interested, I'll look him
up and give you his name, etc. But the folks at "New Kolb" can probably tell
you about him. Carl V.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ian Holland" <iholland(at)telusplanet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hardware Inventory |
Yep, my builder's log at $12,000 plus change (U.S)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 9 Msgs - 08/23/03 |
| From: | rhartwig11(at)juno.com |
One more idea for a workbench/layout table:
Use 10 inch TGI's (Tongue & groove I-beams), buy a 16 footer and cut in
half, span the ends with plywood that is the same depth as the I-beam. I
then screw short 2X4 blocks on the inside of the web--these support 2X4
cross braces which are spaced every 2 feet. You only need a 2X4 leg on
each corner and don't need to brace the legs. The top is the material of
your choice. This table is as flat as you can get with lumber and is
(very!!!) solid. I also drill a 7/32 hole in the bottom end of each leg
and screw in a 1/4 inch carriage bolt to use as a leveling jack. Two of
these tables screwed together and leveled make a 1st class Piet building
table......and they knock down in a few minutes and store compactly.
Dick Hartwig
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Craig Lawler <clawler(at)ptd.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Chuck's travels |
Sometimes to unplanned stops can be the most fun. I mostly fly without,
but once in a while I'll duck tape the GPS antenna to my tail cone. It
makes it too easy.
Craig Lawler
899CL
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
In a message dated 8/24/03 12:51:21 PM Central Daylight Time,
Isablcorky(at)aol.com writes:
<< Chuck,
Don't want to intrude on your writings as Isabelle and I are thoroughly
enjoying it. I told her about your conclusions about women and props and
your
proposed, "Cruise around America". She says, why don't you go with him while
you
still have a Piet?
Want to talk?
Corky in La raring to go >>
Corky,
You have a gem of a wife, there, to suggest you set out on a trek like that
!!
I'm thinking of at least a month, or so, for a complete lap around America.
Let's meet up at Brodhead next summer, and from there, we can just go where
the weather ain't !! Who knows, maybe there will be others that will join us.
Chuck, in Hot, Hot Kansas
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
In a message dated 8/24/03 3:34:41 PM Central Daylight Time, Carbarvo(at)aol.com
writes:
<< Hi Chuck.....Are you familiar with the chap from here in Alabama who flew
the
US perimeter in a Kolb Mark III? If not and you're interested, I'll look him
up and give you his name, etc. But the folks at "New Kolb" can probably tell
you about him. Carl V. >>
Hey Carl,
I've not heard of that one !! I would certainly like to get a hold of him,
and hear about his experiences !!
Chuck
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)grc.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | You don't have a WHAT ? |
Chuck---like answering machines, cell phones, and gps units, I'm ALWAYS the
last one on my block to get one. I still do NOT have a cell
phone. (though my wife does) I took the Piet to Oshkosh in 1998 and 1999
with NO gps, NO com radio and did just fine. No wires to clutter the
cockpit, no batteries to go dead, no fuss. When I got to the photo
briefing session with EAA the photo plane pilot asked if anyone didn't have
a gps---and I was the only one in the room to raise my hand. I was the
only one to raise my hand again when asked if "if anyone does not have a
com radio". I got some nasty looks from some of those better than me
types in the room but shrugged it off and carried on. I broke down about
2 years ago though and bought and handheld and a gps and a buddy made me up
a neat 12 volt system out of a neat little battery that is the size of an
index card box. He wired a cigarette lighter female adapter to the
terminals, and I bought the appropriate DC power/cig lighter plugs for my
gps and hanheld to run them off of. He also made me up a 12 volt AC/DC
charger from I think radio shack with the cig. adapter to charge up the 12
volt battery after trips. Works GREAT ! I can run for a long time on
that battery. All the way up to Wisc. and back with plenty of power to
spare. Course 97% of that is for the gps, since I only use the radio if
absolutely needed to get into controlled airspace. I strap the battery
which is in a little black nylon case to the front seat using the belt and
run my wires next to my left leg into the gps. I still love to navigate
by the chart and keep track of where I'm at because you cannot rely solely
on that gps since it can go belly up on you for a myriad of reasons. I
will say that the gps is just some fantastic technology and I do enjoy
using it very much but it does distract us from doing what we should do
more and that is looking for other traffic. Trouble tho is that at least
with me, I get lulled into the sense that nobody else is flying even on
nice days. Yesterday the conditions were just excellent in Ohio to fly---I
mean just perfect and while I was up for about 1.5 hours I only saw 3 other
planes. Heck, on the way to Wisc. a few weeks ago I only saw 2 other
planes in the air the whole way ! Great stories Chuck---love to
take a month and fly all over this land.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Haines" <robertsjunk(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: what do you find odd in this NTSB report?? |
There is a "Pietenpol" located at the Pinckneyville, IL airport that is
flown from the front seat. It seems to be about the same size as a Piet
(i.e. - not some ultralight variation) with the exception that it's powered
by a Volkswagen engine. My guess is that the lighter powerplant and the
front seat pilot's position are related. Regardless, it's registered as a
"Pietenpol" so the NTSB report may not be incorrect.
Robert Haines
Du Quoin, Illinois
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "baileys" <baileys(at)ktis.net> |
| Subject: | Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
Well duh, so they are. My question is what is the difference in the way
loads are transferred between wing, center section, and fuselage? First,
this is purely rhetorical I'm not proposing any change to the design. Also
I'm not a mechanical engineer and have zero training in stress analysis.
First the one piece spar; within the spar itself compression and tension
loads will be felt by the center section from both wings. In normal flight
the cabane struts and the wing struts will be in tension. The bottom
fuselage cross member will also be in tension.
Three piece spar; no spar tension loads transferred to the center section,
only compression. Cabane struts have far less tension load. Wing struts and
bottom fuselage member under much greater tension.
O.K. Will somebody who understands the mystic art of stress analysis please
help straighten me out?
Bob B - Missouri
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
| From: | Mike <bike.mike(at)verizon.net> |
In normal, upright, flight, aerodynamic loads on the wing inboard and
outboard of the lift strut attach points sort of balance each other. The
Cabanes actually carry very small lift loads, no matter whether the wing is
made in one piece or three.
Whether one piece or three, there are tension loads on the lift struts which
can be resolved into a vertical component and a horizontal component. The
horizontal component of the tension is resisted by compression in the spars
which is carried through the spars and the wing joint fittings in the
three-piece or only in the wooden spars in the one piece.
The vertical component is resisted at the upper end by the wing's lift and
at the lower end by the fuselage weight on the lower fitting.
You are correct in that the fuselage bottom cross piece, made of ash in
BHP's plans, is in tension, resisting the horizontal component of strut
load.
There is very little difference between the one-piece and three-piece wings,
if any at all, in the way the fuselage and the cabane struts are loaded.
Mike Hardaway
Former Aeronautical Engineer
on 8/25/03 6:16, baileys at baileys(at)ktis.net wrote:
>
> Well duh, so they are. My question is what is the difference in the way
> loads are transferred between wing, center section, and fuselage? First,
> this is purely rhetorical I'm not proposing any change to the design. Also
> I'm not a mechanical engineer and have zero training in stress analysis.
>
> First the one piece spar; within the spar itself compression and tension
> loads will be felt by the center section from both wings. In normal flight
> the cabane struts and the wing struts will be in tension. The bottom
> fuselage cross member will also be in tension.
>
> Three piece spar; no spar tension loads transferred to the center section,
> only compression. Cabane struts have far less tension load. Wing struts and
> bottom fuselage member under much greater tension.
>
> O.K. Will somebody who understands the mystic art of stress analysis please
> help straighten me out?
>
> Bob B - Missouri
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Cours <piet-j(at)moriarti.org> |
| Subject: | Re: work bench length |
Thanks for all the great info, everyone! After mulling it over a bit, I
decided on an all-wood design to let me dust off my carpentry skills and
give my wife, who's helping me but has never done any carpentry work, a
chance to learn a bit of woodworking on something that's not going to be
hauling us around the sky...
The final design is in four sections of 30"x4' each. (Can't go any wider
than 30" in the space available.) The tops are 5/8" plywood with 1x6
framing. Each leg will be two 1x4's fastened into an "L" (like an angle
iron) for stiffness. I plan to use adjustable furniture glides to level
it, but haven't yet decided exactly how I'll attach them to the leg
bottoms: either I'll go directly into one of the 1x4 ends, or I'll
attach a 5/8" ply plate to the end of the leg and go into that. I also
saved an old mouse pad: I plan to put pieces of it under the glides so
they don't glide.
The whole structure should be fairly stiff and light, and it'll let me
pop out a section if I don't need the full length for something.
Underneath, I'll put in some cross-pieces to act as a rack for long
stock and will probably use at least some of the plywood off-cuts for
shelving. Some of it may also become a rib jig. And a saw bench or two.
Bought the lumber and cut the tops over the weekend, still need to cut
the boards to length and assemble it.
I also need to start thinking about aircraft glues, so I can build ribs
until my carpentry skills are up to scratch.
- Jeff C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
The difference is 32.
The three piece wing is 32 pounds heavier.
JimV.
baileys wrote:
Well duh, so they are. My question is what is the difference in the way
loads are transferred between wing, center section, and fuselage? First,
this is purely rhetorical I'm not proposing any change to the design. Also
I'm not a mechanical engineer and have zero training in stress analysis.
First the one piece spar; within the spar itself compression and tension
loads will be felt by the center section from both wings. In normal flight
the cabane struts and the wing struts will be in tension. The bottom
fuselage cross member will also be in tension.
Three piece spar; no spar tension loads transferred to the center section,
only compression. Cabane struts have far less tension load. Wing struts and
bottom fuselage member under much greater tension.
O.K. Will somebody who understands the mystic art of stress analysis please
help straighten me out?
Bob B - Missouri
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carbarvo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Chuck...I'll look that stuff up and get back with you......Carl V
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carbarvo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
I've heard this before, so when I started building my Piet, I was watching
for it. Can anybody suggest where the 30 or so pounds comes from? My whole
center section (V. J. Kappler plans with a flop added) doesn't weigh 20 pounds
(including the fuel tank) and my wings are each a foot shorter than one half of
a
one piece wing. Carl V.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Victorjeanharper(at)aol.com |
Hello, I'm getting ready to start building, I thought I'd do the wings first.
I've got a couple of questions if you don't mind. I have Don Pietenpols
plans, are Vi Kapplers better? How did you make your spars, routed plank, I-beam
etc. Should you build the spars first to get the width dimension of the caps
so the ribs can be build to that size? .When you glue the compression struts
to the spars did you add any triangle gussets. Thanks for any help!! Vic
Harper
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com> |
| Subject: | an aquaintance of mine goes down in his Cessna 140 - sad |
news
I don't know what it is lately but last summer a friend of mine was killed when
his Fisher Celebrity had a massive structural failure killing him and his daughter....
now this....
I went to Indiana/Michigan last weekend to visit my cousin. My cousin has a 1946
Tcraft and a beautiful house with a 2600ft. grass strip in the back yard.
Lots of pilots stop by his place and BS about flying and such.
Last weekend I was introduced to a guy named Steve who had a beautiful Cessna 140.
He was a really neat guy who was very low key and not that typical "hot shot"
mentality that so many pilots seem to have. We all talked with him for several
hours that day and then the next day he flew in again and we all had a
get together and lunch.
he took my cousin's sister for a ride in his 140. She loved it.
I ended up heading home last Tuesday full of great memories from the vacation.
Lots of farm yard flying.
Then my cousin calls me a couple nights ago with a very distraught tone to his
voice.... he says "hey, remember Steve, the guy with the 140?" I say yes and
then he proceeds to tell me how he was just killed not 20 minutes before.
Apparently he was doing some real low flybys over Juno Lake which is just about
1/2 mile north of my cousins strip. he was buzzing my cousins uncle who happened
to be in his boat out on the lake. Just as he is making his low pass he
clipped some power lines which sheared off a wing and then he spun in. My cousins
uncle sped over in his boat and jumped in just as the plane was sinking to
try to save him... the fuel was all over the water and he couldn't see anything
due to the fuel burning his eyes. no luck. Not that it would have mattered
anyway I guess because Steve was most likely dead upon impact. The power lines
were about 30ft. off the water.
I snapped some pics of Steve and his plane just last weekend. here's a link to
some of them
http://imagedv.com/indiana-8-03/pages/DSCN0285.htm
http://imagedv.com/indiana-8-03/pages/DSCN0293.htm
http://imagedv.com/indiana-8-03/pages/DSCN0296.htm
here's one of him standing by his plane
http://imagedv.com/indiana-8-03/pages/DSCN0288.htm
It just goes to show you how quickly things can change. I know alot of us like
to fly "low and slow" but I really hope that we can learn from stuff like this..
flying low over populated areas or areas unknown to us poses a serious risk.
Let's all think twice before we "get down" for those low passes.
DJ Vegh
----- Original Message -----
From: Rcaprd(at)aol.com
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, August 23, 2003 10:39 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Charts, Pilotage & Dead Reconing vs. GPS
When flying a Pietenpol, its best if you play the part wearing a leather
helmet, goggles, and long white silk scarf. It gives you a much better
relationship with the way our Forefathers did it in the early days. Using a
GPS in
a Pietenpol, to me, seemed like contradiction in terms. GPS is for
sissies...I don't need one, and I don't want one. However, Doug Bryant insisted
I take
his GPS along with me, and just try it out. It's a Magellan SkyBlazer XL.
All the guys at Benton said "GPS is the best thing that's happened since
ailerons". Well, I guess I had to go along with the majority. After some
experimentation, we found the best place to mount the antenna was on the trailing
edge,
just above the pilot seat. I had to drill holes in the trailing edge to mount
the thing...I HATE drilling useless holes in my plane. Mike (at Benton) was
familiar with a similar model, and was showing me some of the features of
this little 1" x 3 1/2 x 6 1/2 box, while I was trying desperately to do final
preparations on my plane before the trip. I also scanned through the thick
instruction manual. I do, sometimes, read directions !! Now I have another
chore, of building some kind of bracket to hold this thing. Real Estate, as
you
know, is very limited in the cockpit. I already had to make a bracket for the
Com radio, on the right longeron, to allow the antenna to point up, just to
the right side of the windshield. I also had to get another flying helmet, to
accommodate the headset I wore, and also had a wire going to the 'PTT' (push
to
talk) on the control stick. I finally opted to just make a sling, our of
some duct tape, and wear the GPS around my neck...just not enough time to
develop a suitable bracket. It felt like a bowling ball. I hate all this wiring,
and EELEC TRONIC crap !!
The first time I actually used it, was on the first leg of my journey.
It showed ground speed, direction to the airport, distance to the airport,
heading, CDI, and some other stuff, too. All right, that's kinda cool. During
the second leg, the thing said 'Battery Power', then crapped out. After I
landed at Ottowa, took on some fuel, talked with the locals about where I'm coming
from and going to, I replaced the THREE batteries that are in this electronic
marvel. During the fourth leg, the thing said 'Battery Power', and once
again...crapped out !! I wasn't even a quarter of the way there, yet. I would
have thrown this thing overboard, but it had a sling around my neck !! This
thing eats batteries, like a teenager with the munchies !! I assumed the best
way
to use it, was to turn it on just to double check my heading, or the remote
possibility - if I got lost. At the next fuel stop, I replenished the
batteries, stowed it next to my left hip, and never turned it on again...until
I was
half way back on my return trip.
Studying the scenery, using pilotage to maintain position, is truly the
most enjoyable method of navigation. The panoramic view, offered in an open
cockpit, is unparalleled. Watching all those 'Grounders' (folks who never fly),
I kind of feel sorry for them, for they will never know what they are
missing. It really gives you a chance to appreciate the countryside. Once,
I saw a
back yard swimming pool, and yes, there were a couple of bikini clad girls
down there !! I pulled power, and dropped down for a closer look. On my second
lap around the pool, they both started waving their arms at me !! I gave 'em
a good wing wave back, hoping they were from the 'Girls Gone Wild' video, but
no such luck. Gave 'em another wing wave, and took up a northeast heading.
An afterthought, was to holler down to them, my request...I'll do that next
time !!
On the return trip, Saturday evening, at the end of my third long leg of
flying, I had spent over 7 hours in the sky. Except for a sore butt, I really
didn't feel fatigued. I came up on a stretch of forest, where there were
just no distinguishable features, so I just checked one of the VOR's on the
chart, noted the direction I needed to fly, and flew compass heading for a while.
Twenty minutes later, I finally came upon a small town, but couldn't find it
on the chart. Then I thought...damn...I didn't correct for wind. OK, there's
another town in the distance, and it has a water tower on the West side of
town. As I looked at how the roads and railroads laid, I still didn't find it
on
the chart. OK, pull power, drop down to have a look at the name on the water
tower. Turned out this was a small water tower, the kind that looks like a
golf ball on a tee, and it was evedently one that just fed the needs of a farm,
and didn't have a name on it. OK, it's only 7:30, still lots of daylight
left, and I have plenty of fuel onboard. Should I go in this direction, or that
direction. I zig zagged to two more towns, but couldn't find them on the
chart either. I wasn't really lost...I mean I knew what area I was in, I just
didn't know my position. Well, as I began to look for a suitable landing area,
I
went over in my mind how I would do it: Do three of four low fly-bys,
checking for spider webs (electric & telephone wires), and dropping a little
lower
on each pass. Then do a couple of touch & goes, just to test the soil, or the
road, and wondering how I would explain this to the neighbors that I would
have to encounter. However, I do have another option: program the GPS. I
hesitated calling it my 'Ace in the Hole'. I had to program this unfamiliar
gadget, with the 'from' and 'to' identifiers I found on the chart, MPZ to IRK,
while
I was looking for landmarks or a place to land, and most of all - Fly the
Plane !! With my head in the cockpit, it seamed each time I looked back up,
the
nose was way high, or a wing was way high. I double checked each letter I put
in the GPS, because I didn't want to put the wrong identifier in.
Finally...WA LAA !! It showed me what heading to take up, and Kirksville was
just nine
miles away !! I noted the heading, and turned the GPS back off, to conserve
those three tiny batteries. Turned it back on when I was about three miles
out, then spotted the airport. I turned on the COM radio to enter the class
D
airspace, and when I broadcast my position and intention, the 'Battery' light
was flashing on the COM radio !! I still don't like this battery stuff, and
electronic crap, but I guess I've come to terms with the fact that we live in
a
different time. Kirksville has a nice East / West grass runway, and I
greased 'er on with at least 15 minutes of daylight left. After taxiing in to
where
the pumps were, nobody around, I was glad to see it was the credit card type
pumps. Had to kind of pry my body out of the cockpit, stretch all the kinks
out, and fuel 'er up. Pushed 'er over to a tie down area, secured my trusty
pair of wings, unpacked a few things and headed over to the big glass doors of
the building...locked. No phone around. Walked around the side of the building
to where it said 'Pilot Brief', and the door was unlocked. Hummmm....vending
machines and a couch !! I had three bags of corn chips, two bags of
skittles, & two cans or root beer for supper, and got a good nights sleep on
the
couch !!! Just doesn't get any better than this !!
Chuck Gantzer
NX770CG
=
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carbarvo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
LATER......Chuck: I got some very capable help from Susan at the EAA
library..She was able to look up the story about the guy from Alabama who flew
around
the United States...Here's the data...
See EXPERIMENTER (Part 1) , May 1995, p 22
ditto (Part 2) June, 1995, p 27
ditto (Part 3) July, 1995, p 43
ditto (Part 4) Aug., 1995, p 43
He is John Hauck from Gantt, Alabama. He's got quite a story!...Carl Vought
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Sloan" <alexms1(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
Good question Carl
I would like to hear the answer.
Alex S.
----- Original Message -----
From: <Carbarvo(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Three piece and one piece wings are differen??
>
> I've heard this before, so when I started building my Piet, I was watching
> for it. Can anybody suggest where the 30 or so pounds comes from? My whole
> center section (V. J. Kappler plans with a flop added) doesn't weigh 20
pounds
> (including the fuel tank) and my wings are each a foot shorter than one
half of a
> one piece wing. Carl V.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
I presume it is the weight of all the botls, nuts and metal fittings.
I think it was Vi Kappler that told me .
JimV.
Carbarvo(at)aol.com wrote:
I've heard this before, so when I started building my Piet, I was watching
for it. Can anybody suggest where the 30 or so pounds comes from? My whole
center section (V. J. Kappler plans with a flop added) doesn't weigh 20 pounds
(including the fuel tank) and my wings are each a foot shorter than one half of
a
one piece wing. Carl V.
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
We are talking about the DIFFERENCE in weight between the 3 piece and the one piece
wing.
Not the weight of any one thing.
The last wings that Mr. Pietenpol built used spars laminated of 7 pieces of wood
and finished size of 4 3/4 X 3/4
Each piece was .666 X .750.
He put a bearing plate under where each rib contacted the spar that was 1/8 thick.
This made everything come out right.
My brain and memory are old , and I hope I have remembered well.
JimV.
PS, I built mine that way.
The finished empty weight of my Aircamper was 610 pounds.
Alex Sloan wrote:
Good question Carl
I would like to hear the answer.
Alex S.
----- Original Message -----
From:
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Three piece and one piece wings are differen??
>
> I've heard this before, so when I started building my Piet, I was watching
> for it. Can anybody suggest where the 30 or so pounds comes from? My whole
> center section (V. J. Kappler plans with a flop added) doesn't weigh 20
pounds
> (including the fuel tank) and my wings are each a foot shorter than one
half of a
> one piece wing. Carl V.
>
>
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carbarvo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
Yes, I realize that you are talking "difference". That's what puzzles me.
Thank you for expanding on your memo. The laminated spars are very interesting
and will become even more interesting as time goes on and spruce prices go up.
Were your laminations one piece from end to end or were you able to splice
them?...Carl V.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
I made them out of a lot of short pieces.
The 10 to 1 cuts didnt overlap
Jim
Carbarvo(at)aol.com wrote:
Yes, I realize that you are talking "difference". That's what puzzles me.
Thank you for expanding on your memo. The laminated spars are very interesting
and will become even more interesting as time goes on and spruce prices go up.
Were your laminations one piece from end to end or were you able to splice
them?...Carl V.
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "w b evans" <wbeevans(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
Consider this. I built right to the plans, with very little variations.
Long fuselage with an A-65, and the three piece wing. also a wing tank and
a nose tank, and my empty weight was 595#. Would a one piece wing weigh in
at 565# ?
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: <Carbarvo(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Three piece and one piece wings are differen??
>
> Yes, I realize that you are talking "difference". That's what puzzles me.
> Thank you for expanding on your memo. The laminated spars are very
interesting
> and will become even more interesting as time goes on and spruce prices go
up.
> Were your laminations one piece from end to end or were you able to splice
> them?...Carl V.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
In a message dated 8/25/03 7:10:11 PM Central Daylight Time, Carbarvo(at)aol.com
writes:
<< LATER......Chuck: I got some very capable help from Susan at the EAA
library..She was able to look up the story about the guy from Alabama who
flew around
the United States...Here's the data...
See EXPERIMENTER (Part 1) , May 1995, p 22
ditto (Part 2) June, 1995, p 27
ditto (Part 3) July, 1995, p 43
ditto (Part 4) Aug., 1995, p 43
He is John Hauck from Gantt, Alabama. He's got quite a story!...Carl Vought
>>
Carl, or anyone,
Is there any way I can view these articles on the internet ? Or, should I
just try to order each of these magazines from EAA?
Also, does anyone know what was the longest cross country flight in a
Pietenpol ? I'm feeling the need to get in the record books !!
Chuck G.
I appreciate your effort, Carl
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
How much do the attachment straps weigh?
I don't have mine yet but I would think
5-8 oz? There are 16 of them. There are
28 assorted nuts and bolts and 2 pulleys.
Two small straps for those pulleys and two
extra ribs. There's possibly a little more ply
in the center section. What else?
We're missing the two very long bolts, front
and rear, holding the center of each one piece
spar together. The center pulleys and their
mounts are extra in the wing as they were
originaly at the strut/fuse point, not in the wing.
Anybody got a collection of these parts to weigh?
----- Original Message -----
From: "w b evans" <wbeevans(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Three piece and one piece wings are differen??
>
> Consider this. I built right to the plans, with very little variations.
> Long fuselage with an A-65, and the three piece wing. also a wing tank
and
> a nose tank, and my empty weight was 595#. Would a one piece wing weigh
in
> at 565# ?
> walt evans
> NX140DL
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <Carbarvo(at)aol.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Three piece and one piece wings are
differen??
>
>
> >
> > Yes, I realize that you are talking "difference". That's what puzzles
me.
> > Thank you for expanding on your memo. The laminated spars are very
> interesting
> > and will become even more interesting as time goes on and spruce prices
go
> up.
> > Were your laminations one piece from end to end or were you able to
splice
> > them?...Carl V.
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: You don't have a WHAT ? |
In a message dated 8/25/03 7:50:21 AM Central Daylight Time,
Michael.D.Cuy(at)grc.nasa.gov writes:
<< Chuck---like answering machines, cell phones, and gps units, I'm ALWAYS
the
last one on my block to get one. I still do NOT have a cell
phone. (though my wife does) I took the Piet to Oshkosh in 1998 and 1999
with NO gps, NO com radio and did just fine. No wires to clutter the
cockpit, no batteries to go dead, no fuss. When I got to the photo
briefing session with EAA the photo plane pilot asked if anyone didn't have
a gps---and I was the only one in the room to raise my hand. I was the
only one to raise my hand again when asked if "if anyone does not have a
com radio". I got some nasty looks from some of those better than me
types in the room but shrugged it off and carried on. I broke down about
2 years ago though and bought and handheld and a gps and a buddy made me up
a neat 12 volt system out of a neat little battery that is the size of an
index card box. He wired a cigarette lighter female adapter to the
terminals, and I bought the appropriate DC power/cig lighter plugs for my
gps and hanheld to run them off of. He also made me up a 12 volt AC/DC
charger from I think radio shack with the cig. adapter to charge up the 12
volt battery after trips. Works GREAT ! I can run for a long time on
that battery. All the way up to Wisc. and back with plenty of power to
spare. Course 97% of that is for the gps, since I only use the radio if
absolutely needed to get into controlled airspace. I strap the battery
which is in a little black nylon case to the front seat using the belt and
run my wires next to my left leg into the gps. I still love to navigate
by the chart and keep track of where I'm at because you cannot rely solely
on that gps since it can go belly up on you for a myriad of reasons. I
will say that the gps is just some fantastic technology and I do enjoy
using it very much but it does distract us from doing what we should do
more and that is looking for other traffic. Trouble tho is that at least
with me, I get lulled into the sense that nobody else is flying even on
nice days. Yesterday the conditions were just excellent in Ohio to fly---I
mean just perfect and while I was up for about 1.5 hours I only saw 3 other
planes. Heck, on the way to Wisc. a few weeks ago I only saw 2 other
planes in the air the whole way ! Great stories Chuck---love to
take a month and fly all over this land.
Mike C. >>
Mike,
I haven't got a cell phone either...don't need one, don't want one.
Hummm...That's the same thing I said before I got the GPS !! As much as I hate
to admit it, I'm putting in a retractable, or removable, bracket to accomodate
the GPS. My fear is that I'll get so used to using it, that when it craps out
the next time, I'll be left high & dry. I hope to have enough self control,
to only use the GPS if I'm lost...fat chance!! Another problem I have with
the GPS, is that when I turn it on, it causes static noise on the COM radio.
Does anyone else have this happen ?
I'll probably also add on the battery, preferebly mounted on the
firewall, to be recharged after each flight. The battery would also be usefull
to run
a windshield washer pump, for...SMOKE OIL !! Yeah...that's how I can
justifiy the battery !!
OK...Looks like Corky, Mike Cuy, and myself will be doing a 'Lap Around
America' !!! Is there anyone else out there, that would like to join us in a
massed flotilla ??
Chuck G.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
Here's a plot of the lift distribution of
a hershey wing I came across. It might
help in clarifying what Mike is saying.
http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoDisplay.cfm?PhotoName=IMG_0592.jpg&PhotoID=1397
The distance from the attach bolt to the strut
mount on the plans is 79". The panel is162".
The inboard section is approx 49% of the
entire panel. It lifts approx 57% of the load.
That leaves 43% for the outer section to lift.
We haven't taken into account the lift of the
center section at this point. So there is a
definite load on the cabanes, not significant
as Mike says but some is there.
On the three piece plans the spars are shown
butted tightly together. This is to keep most
of the considerable compression loads out
of the joint fittings. They are not made to
handle the compression. Look at the pics of
DJ's GN fittings, they're quite different.
>
> In normal, upright, flight, aerodynamic loads on the wing inboard and
> outboard of the lift strut attach points sort of balance each other. The
> Cabanes actually carry very small lift loads, no matter whether the wing
is
> made in one piece or three.
>
> Whether one piece or three, there are tension loads on the lift struts
which
> can be resolved into a vertical component and a horizontal component. The
> horizontal component of the tension is resisted by compression in the
spars
> which is carried through the spars and the wing joint fittings in the
> three-piece or only in the wooden spars in the one piece.
>
> The vertical component is resisted at the upper end by the wing's lift and
> at the lower end by the fuselage weight on the lower fitting.
>
> You are correct in that the fuselage bottom cross piece, made of ash in
> BHP's plans, is in tension, resisting the horizontal component of strut
> load.
>
> There is very little difference between the one-piece and three-piece
wings,
> if any at all, in the way the fuselage and the cabane struts are loaded.
>
> Mike Hardaway
> Former Aeronautical Engineer
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
I left Vancouver at 8:01 and arrived at
Jefferson County Airport in Port Townsend
at 1:45. 1/2 hr out for brekky in Bellingham.
1/2 hr wait for ferry and 1/2 hr ferry ride to
Port Townsend.
Jim Markle and I met there to look over
Larry Prange's Piet, almost ready for
covering.
This is a model A job with wire wheels
and straight axle. The rad is quite narrow
so covers only a small portion of the sky.
Great looking job! Excellent workmanship.
And the cowling has to be seen to be believed.
http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList2.cfm?AlbumID=140
What a great day! Thanks for inviting us Larry.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
Why not ask Vi Kappler next year at Brodhead?
JimV.
clif wrote:
How much do the attachment straps weigh?
I don't have mine yet but I would think
5-8 oz? There are 16 of them. There are
28 assorted nuts and bolts and 2 pulleys.
Two small straps for those pulleys and two
extra ribs. There's possibly a little more ply
in the center section. What else?
We're missing the two very long bolts, front
and rear, holding the center of each one piece
spar together. The center pulleys and their
mounts are extra in the wing as they were
originaly at the strut/fuse point, not in the wing.
Anybody got a collection of these parts to weigh?
----- Original Message -----
From: "w b evans"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Three piece and one piece wings are differen??
>
> Consider this. I built right to the plans, with very little variations.
> Long fuselage with an A-65, and the three piece wing. also a wing tank
and
> a nose tank, and my empty weight was 595#. Would a one piece wing weigh
in
> at 565# ?
> walt evans
> NX140DL
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From:
> To:
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Three piece and one piece wings are
differen??
>
>
> >
> > Yes, I realize that you are talking "difference". That's what puzzles
me.
> > Thank you for expanding on your memo. The laminated spars are very
> interesting
> > and will become even more interesting as time goes on and spruce prices
go
> up.
> > Were your laminations one piece from end to end or were you able to
splice
> > them?...Carl V.
> >
> >
>
>
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BARNSTMR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Sunday outing |
In a message dated 8/26/2003 1:56:39 AM Central Daylight Time,
cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca writes:
> http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList2.cfm?AlbumID=140
**************************************************************
I was just admiring the photos of Larry Prange's Piet. What a beautiful job
Larry! I have a question about thosae struts. Are those streamline aluminum
with steel tube inside for reinforcement?
Terry Bowden
ph (254) 715-4773
fax (254) 853-3805
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
Call Sue Lurvey. She can provide reprints of the articles. 1-800-eaa-info
and ask for the library. The very pleasant voice will be Sue.
You can also e-mail her at slurvey(at)eaa.org
Cy Galley
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
----- Original Message -----
From: <Rcaprd(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio
>
> In a message dated 8/25/03 7:10:11 PM Central Daylight Time,
Carbarvo(at)aol.com
> writes:
>
> << LATER......Chuck: I got some very capable help from Susan at the EAA
> library..She was able to look up the story about the guy from Alabama who
> flew around
> the United States...Here's the data...
> See EXPERIMENTER (Part 1) , May 1995, p 22
> ditto (Part 2) June, 1995, p 27
> ditto (Part 3) July, 1995, p 43
> ditto (Part 4) Aug., 1995, p 43
> He is John Hauck from Gantt, Alabama. He's got quite a story!...Carl
Vought
> >>
>
> Carl, or anyone,
> Is there any way I can view these articles on the internet ? Or, should I
> just try to order each of these magazines from EAA?
> Also, does anyone know what was the longest cross country flight in a
> Pietenpol ? I'm feeling the need to get in the record books !!
>
> Chuck G.
> I appreciate your effort, Carl
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TomTravis(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: You don't have a WHAT ? |
If I can get mine finished in time, deal me in. When do we leave?
Tom Travis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "baileys" <baileys(at)ktis.net> |
| Subject: | lift distribution chart was three piece.... |
Clif,
That chart is very interesting. I wonder if anybody has ever run a
comparison plot of the same wing with the Hoerner tip?
Also how does the Piet wingtip stack up against other tips???
Thanks,
Bob B. - Missouri
>
> Here's a plot of the lift distribution of
> a hershey wing I came across. It might
> help in clarifying what Mike is saying.
>
>
http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoDisplay.cfm?PhotoName=IMG_0592.jpg&PhotoID=1397
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carbarvo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
As you already know, Sport Aviation is available on CD. Eventually,
Experimenter will also, but not right now. Reprints are expensive..Tell ya what...I'll
Xerox the first installment and mail it to you (I don't think my scanner is up
to it, so an email attachment is out). From the first part, you should be
able to tell if you want to plunk down for the rest of them....Let me know if you
want to proceed that way. Carl Vought
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
You can order a reprint (xerox copy) of each article to the EAA.
Saludos
Gary Gower.
--- Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 8/25/03 7:10:11 PM Central Daylight Time,
> Carbarvo(at)aol.com
> writes:
>
> << LATER......Chuck: I got some very capable help from Susan at the
> EAA
> library..She was able to look up the story about the guy from
> Alabama who
> flew around
> the United States...Here's the data...
> See EXPERIMENTER (Part 1) , May 1995, p 22
> ditto (Part 2) June, 1995, p 27
> ditto (Part 3) July, 1995, p 43
> ditto (Part 4) Aug., 1995, p 43
> He is John Hauck from Gantt, Alabama. He's got quite a story!...Carl
> Vought
> >>
>
> Carl, or anyone,
> Is there any way I can view these articles on the internet ? Or,
> should I
> just try to order each of these magazines from EAA?
> Also, does anyone know what was the longest cross country flight in a
>
> Pietenpol ? I'm feeling the need to get in the record books !!
>
> Chuck G.
> I appreciate your effort, Carl
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Prange Larry J CONT PSNS <prangel(at)psns.navy.mil> |
| Subject: | Clif and Jim's Visit . . . |
Last Sunday, Clif Dawson and Jim Markle stopped by my hangar to look at my
Piet. Much thanks to Clif for posting some pictures that he took and for
his kind words about my ship. (
http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList2.cfm?AlbumID=140 ) And,
thanks to Jim for buying lunch! I've gotta say that both Jim and Clif are a
credit to our Piet community. It was great to finally meet them both after
reading their thoughts for years. I have been lurking on this list since
its' inception, but not saying much. Maybe I should be more vocal . . .
I would like to take this opportunity to thank to all of you who have, over
the years, patiently (and sometimes passionately) answered questions and
discussed the relative merits and pratfalls of different Piet-things. A lot
of what you all have suggested/proposed/discussed, has ended up in my Piet.
The things that you write on this list make building easier and the final
product better for folks that you don't even know. My Piet would be a lot
different now if I did not have your vast array of Piet-Lore at my finger
tips. I owe you all a debt. ( That and 25 cents won't even buy you a cup
of coffee anymore. ;o} )
Is this a great list or what?
Larry Prange - Live from the Olympic Pennisula, Washington State. (Just
another day in Paradise . . . )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kip & Beth Gardner <kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: lift distribution chart was three piece.... |
>
>Clif,
>That chart is very interesting. I wonder if anybody has ever run a
>comparison plot of the same wing with the Hoerner tip?
>Also how does the Piet wingtip stack up against other tips???
>Thanks,
>Bob B. - Missouri
Hi Bob,
OK, I'm ignorant, what is/was the Hoerner wing tip?
As far as any of us on the list know (I'm going back about 4 years), there
has never been any really serious aerodynamic testing of the Piet, so
'hard' data about things like different wing tip performance probably
doesn't exist (I say while lifting my foot towards my mouth).
For a while I was employed at Old Dominion University in Norfolk, VA, the
place where they are doing the wind-tunnel testing of the EAA's 1903 Wright
Flyer replica. I was acquainted with some of the guys involved & at that
time there was some talk about trying to interest them in putting a Piet
(or 2) into the wind tunnel. However, we (the list) never got our act
together & then I moved to OH. Maybe someday.
BTW, I got the CD of Brodhead pics you sent - very nice - thanks !
With all this talk of a group 'lap around America' I wish I had the next
year free to work on my Piet full-time! Guess I'll just have to settle for
being Tail-End Charlie some day!
Cheers,
Kip Gardner
North Canton, OH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Hubbard, Eugene" <ehubbard(at)titan.com> |
Hi Vic,
I'll tell you how I did mine--YMMV, as they say. I'm not familiar with Vi
Kappler's wing plans, so I can't speak to that one. I used 1" material for
my spars and routed it. I don't feel like I had a particularly good reason
to do it that way, but I liked the idea of having a one-piece machined wood
spar. Also, it puts the material at the top and bottom where it does good
and leaves a thinner (1/2") web where it doesn't. I considered, and priced,
the I-beam option. It would have been just as good, use less wood, and lots
more epoxy.
I built the ribs with only a single upright next to each rib. It saves an
insignificant amount of weight, and doesn't affect the rib integrity at all.
It also makes it impossible to have problems fitting the ribs onto the spar.
When I glued up the wing, I used spring clamps to hold the ribs to the spars
as the glue hardened. I made the ribs first--much cheaper, and it gives you
a chance to look at the kind of wood that your supplier delivers. I wound
up buying my wood from Wick's because of that experiment.
I gussetted my compression struts to everything in sight. I didn't trust
the butt joint as far as I could throw it, and I could imagine enough
flexure in the wing to pop the strut off and leave it lying on the bottom
surface of the wing. You can make the top strut flush with the top of the
spar and put a plywood gusset over both of them. The bottom strut has to be
above the bottom of the spar due to the undercamber, but I made up a
trapazoidal filler block, and gusseted it to the bottom of the spar.
Gene Hubbard
San Diego
-----Original Message-----
From: Victorjeanharper(at)aol.com [mailto:Victorjeanharper(at)aol.com]
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpol wings
Hello, I'm getting ready to start building, I thought I'd do the wings
first.
I've got a couple of questions if you don't mind. I have Don Pietenpols
plans, are Vi Kapplers better? How did you make your spars, routed plank,
I-beam
etc. Should you build the spars first to get the width dimension of the
caps
so the ribs can be build to that size? .When you glue the compression struts
to the spars did you add any triangle gussets. Thanks for any help!! Vic
Harper
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: an aquaintance of mine goes down in his Cessna 140 |
- sad ...
In a message dated 8/25/03 6:55:31 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
aircamper(at)imagedv.com writes:
> It just goes to show you how quickly things can change. I know alot of us
> like to fly "low and slow" but I really hope that we can learn from stuff
> like this.. flying low over populated areas or areas unknown to us poses a
> serious risk.
>
> Let's all think twice before we "get down" for those low passes.
>
My flying instructor always told me he better not hear about me flying lower
than 800' for any reason other than to take off and land. Way too many low
level flyby accidents I've heard of and seen the remains of. Bridges, power
lines, and all are nothing to fool around with.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: You don't have a WHAT ? |
In a message dated 8/26/03 8:14:47 AM Central Daylight Time,
TomTravis(at)aol.com writes:
<< If I can get mine finished in time, deal me in. When do we leave?
Tom Travis >>
A preliminary date, would be next summer. Kinda general, right now. Around
Brodhead, for sure. We could hook up with folks in various places around the
country that can't make the whole oddisy, and maybe they could fly a leg, or
so.
Chuck G.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol Reunion this Weekend in Ohio |
In a message dated 8/26/03 9:35:50 AM Central Daylight Time, Carbarvo(at)aol.com
writes:
<< Tell ya what...I'll
Xerox the first installment and mail it to you >>
Carl,
Before you go to that hassle, let me talk with Sue Lurvey at the EAA library,
first. Cy Galley's suggestion. A big Thank You, to Cy, for his help at
Oshkosh !! He's one of the guys that volunteers his time and expertise, at
Emergency Aircraft Repair. Folks like him are credited with what makes our 'World
of Aviation' go 'round & 'round. Ain't nobody in the world, like 'Airplane
People' !!!
Chuck
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol wings |
Eugene,
Like you, I used the I-beam spar section. But I laminated my spars from
very fine grade Douglas Fir and installed swallow tail filler blocks at the
fitting attachment points. This was back in 1968-69 and Aerolite glue was
then in favour. On my most recent annual inspection, I found absolutely no
sign of glue line separation anywhere, although excess Aerolite fillets that
were squeezed out during clamping tend to crack and craze. If I were to
build another wooden airplane, I would use something like T 88.
I, too, was leery about those compression struts simply butting up against
the spar with nothing to hold them in place except the compressive force
generated by the drag/antidrag wires. I gusseted everything, as you did,
and tied the upper and lower struts together with 1/8" x 1 1/4" plywood
strips near both front and rear spars. (I had read an account of the com-
pression strut on a British SE 5 coming adrift during its testing program.
The wing folded and the test pilot was killed. The fix was to secure the
compression strut attachment and the SE 5 became a stout aircraft which
was about the best available to withstand the rigors of skywriting in the
years following WW I.)
My Pietenpol has been flying for nearly 33 years and has given good ser-
vice. It is a good design and a few easy, but important, changes can en-
hance its durability and safety. I heartily agree with your changes.
Cheers,
Graham Hansen (CF-AUN, in cooler Alberta, Canada)
.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BARNSTMR(at)aol.com |
Pieters,
I just posted 10 pictures and have many more to come of our Piet project.
Check it out.
http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList.cfm?Menu=PhotoGallery
Terry Bowden
ph (254) 715-4773
fax (254) 853-3805
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: You don't have a WHAT ? |
--- Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 8/26/03 8:14:47 AM Central Daylight Time,
> TomTravis(at)aol.com writes:
>
> << If I can get mine finished in time, deal me in. When do we leave?
>
>
>
>
> Tom Travis >>
>
> A preliminary date, would be next summer. Kinda general, right now.
> Around
> Brodhead, for sure. We could hook up with folks in various places
> around the
> country that can't make the whole oddisy, and maybe they could fly a
> leg, or
> so.
>
> Chuck G.
That is a great idea, I will tell you what has worked here in long
trips with several planes (and diferent speeds):
There has to be a Leader (or two).
They organize the flyinn "thinking for them selves" if anybody joins,
has two options: follow the leader or go by itself.
Trying to organize a flight (with several legs) that will work with
everyone will never get right, if ever gets done.
Hope this helps, and I am sorry that I cant make it, maybe only
directly from Texas to Broadhead and Oshkosh...
Saludos
Gary Gower.
__________________________________
http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Sunday outing |
I believe the steel only goes as far as the
bolts you see, not all the way through.
Clif
>
> In a message dated 8/26/2003 1:56:39 AM Central Daylight Time,
> cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca writes:
>
>
> > http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList2.cfm?AlbumID=140
> **************************************************************
>
> I was just admiring the photos of Larry Prange's Piet. What a beautiful
job
> Larry! I have a question about thosae struts. Are those streamline
aluminum
> with steel tube inside for reinforcement?
>
> Terry Bowden
> ph (254) 715-4773
> fax (254) 853-3805
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)grc.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Model A Parts & More---Ken Perkins |
Any of you who have seen Ken Perkin's Ford powered Piet will attest to the
fine workmanship he's put into it. I just ran across a bunch of pics on
line where he shows and offers many parts for the Ford engine plus other
things like wire wheel hubs. He give prices and all. Ken is a
no-nonsense guy who knows his Piet schtuff !
http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList2.cfm?AlbumID=8
Mike C.
Please archive
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JamesJboyer(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pictures posted |
In a message dated 8/26/2003 10:06:30 PM Pacific Standard Time,
BARNSTMR(at)aol.com writes:
> http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList.cfm?Menu=PhotoGallery
Hi Terry,
Nice photos and congratulations on getting the Piet. I'm not quite that far
on mine yet but almost. Went to Brodhead and seeing all the Piets there was
very helpful to my further enthusiasm to work on mine.
Good luck. Jim
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com> |
| Subject: | Aircraft Spruce - I am about to never use them again. |
If Aircraft Spruce does not get their act to gether I may end up never buying from
them again.
I have been dealing with them on a return for 2 months now.
2 months ago I ordered a set of custom made cables with rotary swaged MS forks
on the ends.
I get the cables soon after only to find they are swaged WAYout of round. it almost
looks like they used a bench vice to crimp the fork over the cable.
The AC43.12 syas the swaged fitting must be .219" in diamter after the swage ALL
THE WAY AROUND. My cables were .218 on one axis and as high as .240 on the
other.
Totally unuseable and not FAA airworthy.
The customer service people have told me that they have sold thousands of these
cables with no problem and that since they are custom they will not offer a refund.
I told the lady several times... a couple times VERY slowly.... "these
cables do not meet 43.13 and will fail long before the fork will." she still
did not get it.
I then told here... "if I use these, eventually my wings will probably rip off
and I will die" . her comback was still " we sell alot of these and nobody complains"
So then I say, "maybe all those other cables are good and I got a bad set. Just
send me a good set." She says no joy. sales are final I am stuck with them.
What the hell?? I've spent about $3,500 with them and now they want to lose me
over $70?
DJ
www.imagedv.com
=
This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for viewing by Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more information on an anti-virus email solution, visit <http://www.halfpricehosting.com/av.asp>.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chad and Susan Johnson" <chadnsue(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Piet ride and advice |
To Chuck and Doug in Benton,
Would it be possible to meet up with one or the other of you or both
sometime between Sept 2 and 7th. I have 5 days off and would love to buy a
tank of gas and some coffee in exchange for a piet ride and some advice on
starting my piet project. I live an hour North of Wichita. Please give me a
call or write back. I just watched a documentary on The "Colditz Castle"
escapes. They built a glider as per the prisoners plans and it flew great.
I figure if those POWs can design and build an actual airworthy airplane
from broken up foot lockers and bed rails, bed sheets and boiled millet for
dope, all using hand made tools,, well its time I get started.
With all valuable information and guidance everyone on this list provides,
I have no excuses. Thanks and let me know. (480) 480-9395
Chad Johnson, (lurking for years)
McPherson, Kansas
--- Susan Johnson
--- chadnsue(at)earthlink.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Ash <ashcan(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce - I am about to never use |
them again.
I hope Aircraft Spruce is saving a lot of money on customer service people,
otherwise they're paying them way too much for the skills they exhibit.
I ordered a nickle and dime part from them years back, and asked them to
throw in a current catalog, also. When the order came, there were a couple
big, heavy boxes on my doorstep. The person that entered the order screwed
up and ordered me 50 catalogs instead of one, then charged me for them. My
$30 order was somewhere in the $200+ range, for what I recall. It took a
couple calls to convince someone I didn't care to read that much and I
wasn't scamming them to get free catalogs for my friends; I didn't have
that many friends. Instead of paying for the return shipping, they told me
just to keep them and hand them out to friends, anyhow. My local EAA guys
benefit from that one.
Did you pay them with a credit card? I'd deny the charge. You're obvously
dealing with someone who 1) doesn't know and 2) doesn't care. Denying the
charge will at least wake someone up.
Jim
>
>If Aircraft Spruce does not get their act to gether I may end up never
>buying from them again.
>
>I have been dealing with them on a return for 2 months now.
>
>2 months ago I ordered a set of custom made cables with rotary swaged MS
>forks on the ends.
>
>I get the cables soon after only to find they are swaged WAYout of
>round. it almost looks like they used a bench vice to crimp the fork over
>the cable.
>
>The AC43.12 syas the swaged fitting must be .219" in diamter after the
>swage ALL THE WAY AROUND. My cables were .218 on one axis and as high as
>.240 on the other.
>
>Totally unuseable and not FAA airworthy.
>
>The customer service people have told me that they have sold thousands of
>these cables with no problem and that since they are custom they will not
>offer a refund. I told the lady several times... a couple times VERY
>slowly.... "these cables do not meet 43.13 and will fail long before the
>fork will." she still did not get it.
>
>I then told here... "if I use these, eventually my wings will probably rip
>off and I will die" . her comback was still " we sell alot of these and
>nobody complains"
>
>So then I say, "maybe all those other cables are good and I got a bad
>set. Just send me a good set." She says no joy. sales are final I am
>stuck with them.
>
>What the hell?? I've spent about $3,500 with them and now they want to
>lose me over $70?
>
>DJ
>www.imagedv.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Ash <ashcan(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | The Birdmen ? / was Piet ride and advice |
I remember a movie from the 70's called The Birdmen that sounds a lot like
this documentary. I loved that movie, but I thought it was just fictional
nonsense.
You're telling me it was for real? Wow.
Jim Ash
>
>
>To Chuck and Doug in Benton,
>Would it be possible to meet up with one or the other of you or both
>sometime between Sept 2 and 7th. I have 5 days off and would love to buy a
>tank of gas and some coffee in exchange for a piet ride and some advice on
>starting my piet project. I live an hour North of Wichita. Please give me a
>call or write back. I just watched a documentary on The "Colditz Castle"
>escapes. They built a glider as per the prisoners plans and it flew great.
>I figure if those POWs can design and build an actual airworthy airplane
>from broken up foot lockers and bed rails, bed sheets and boiled millet for
>dope, all using hand made tools,, well its time I get started.
>With all valuable information and guidance everyone on this list provides,
>I have no excuses. Thanks and let me know. (480) 480-9395
>
>Chad Johnson, (lurking for years)
>McPherson, Kansas
>
>--- Susan Johnson
>--- chadnsue(at)earthlink.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Cours <piet-j(at)moriarti.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce - I am about to never use them |
again.
DJ Vegh wrote:
>
>
> If Aircraft Spruce does not get their act to gether I may end up
> never buying from them again.
It's very interesting hearing about the various vendors and supply
houses -- extremely useful information for someone like me who's just
starting out!
I can't speak about Aircraft Spruce in particular, but with most medium
to large companies you often have to get past the front-line customer
service folks to reach people that'll listen to reason. I'd suggest
going straight to the top. I found this on their web site, in the
"message from our president" section
<http://www.aircraftspruce.com/pres.html>
> If you wish to comment or make suggestions on our products or
> service, please contact me directly at jji(at)aircraftspruce.com .
A well-placed e-mail message may be a good choice at this point...
- Jeff C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce - I am about to never use them again. |
Thanks for finding Jim Irwins email address..... I sent an unaggressive, yet concerned
email to him
we'll see what happens
DJ Vegh
Editor - Animator - Digital Artist
Larry John Wright, Inc.
1045 E. University Dr.
Mesa, AZ 85203
480.833.8111 - Office
602.743.5768 - Mobile
"The Nation's Number One Retail Advertising Agency"
Achieving Big Time Results for Local and Regional Retailers
----- Original Message -----
From: Jeff Cours
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 12:59 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aircraft Spruce - I am about to never use them again.
DJ Vegh wrote:
>
>
> If Aircraft Spruce does not get their act to gether I may end up
> never buying from them again.
It's very interesting hearing about the various vendors and supply
houses -- extremely useful information for someone like me who's just
starting out!
I can't speak about Aircraft Spruce in particular, but with most medium
to large companies you often have to get past the front-line customer
service folks to reach people that'll listen to reason. I'd suggest
going straight to the top. I found this on their web site, in the
"message from our president" section
<http://www.aircraftspruce.com/pres.html>
> If you wish to comment or make suggestions on our products or
> service, please contact me directly at jji(at)aircraftspruce.com .
A well-placed e-mail message may be a good choice at this point...
- Jeff C.
=
This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for viewing by Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more information on an anti-virus email solution, visit <http://www.halfpricehosting.com/av.asp>.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Textor" <jack(at)personnelincorporated.com> |
Any Pietors going to Blakesburg this weekend?
Jack Textor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick and Marge Gillespie" <margdick(at)peganet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce - I am about to never use them again. |
I think someone from AS&S monitors our list. Sometime ago I was complaining
about a freight overcharge on the list and they (AS&S) contacted me and gave
me a credit for the difference.
DickG.
----- Original Message -----
From: "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aircraft Spruce - I am about to never use them
again.
>
> Thanks for finding Jim Irwins email address..... I sent an unaggressive,
yet concerned email to him
>
> we'll see what happens
>
> DJ Vegh
> Editor - Animator - Digital Artist
> Larry John Wright, Inc.
> 1045 E. University Dr.
> Mesa, AZ 85203
> 480.833.8111 - Office
> 602.743.5768 - Mobile
>
> "The Nation's Number One Retail Advertising Agency"
> Achieving Big Time Results for Local and Regional Retailers
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Jeff Cours
> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 12:59 PM
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aircraft Spruce - I am about to never use
them again.
>
>
> DJ Vegh wrote:
> >
> >
> > If Aircraft Spruce does not get their act to gether I may end up
> > never buying from them again.
>
> It's very interesting hearing about the various vendors and supply
> houses -- extremely useful information for someone like me who's just
> starting out!
>
> I can't speak about Aircraft Spruce in particular, but with most medium
> to large companies you often have to get past the front-line customer
> service folks to reach people that'll listen to reason. I'd suggest
> going straight to the top. I found this on their web site, in the
> "message from our president" section
>
> <http://www.aircraftspruce.com/pres.html>
>
> > If you wish to comment or make suggestions on our products or
> > service, please contact me directly at jji(at)aircraftspruce.com .
>
> A well-placed e-mail message may be a good choice at this point...
>
> - Jeff C.
>
>
> > This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for viewing by
Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more
information on an anti-virus email solution, visit
<http://www.halfpricehosting.com/av.asp>.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "w b evans" <wbeevans(at)verizon.net> |
Where's that?
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack Textor" <jack(at)personnelincorporated.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Blakesburg
>
> Any Pietors going to Blakesburg this weekend?
> Jack Textor
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kip & Beth Gardner <kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net> |
>
>
>Any Pietors going to Blakesburg this weekend?
>Jack Textor
Jack,
Gene Rambo is going, I think in his Travelair, but he has probably left DC
already. I got an e-mail from him this AM that indicated he was getting
ready to leave.
Kip Gardner
North Canton, OH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Gower <ggower_99(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce - I am about to never use them again. |
Ask to get Jerry Aguilar in the phone, He is a great person, we (he
speaks spanish) have dealed with him for several years, since he was on
the counter, now he is the Marketing Director.
I finaly meet him in person at S&F two years ago and we had a great
chat and helped me with my byuing there, just like he was one of the
guys in the counter.
I am sure you will talk with the right person... (I hope).
Good luck
Saludos
Gary Gower.
--- DJ Vegh wrote:
>
>
> If Aircraft Spruce does not get their act to gether I may end up
> never buying from them again.
>
> I have been dealing with them on a return for 2 months now.
>
> 2 months ago I ordered a set of custom made cables with rotary swaged
> MS forks on the ends.
>
> I get the cables soon after only to find they are swaged WAYout of
> round. it almost looks like they used a bench vice to crimp the fork
> over the cable.
>
> The AC43.12 syas the swaged fitting must be .219" in diamter after
> the swage ALL THE WAY AROUND. My cables were .218 on one axis and as
> high as .240 on the other.
>
> Totally unuseable and not FAA airworthy.
>
> The customer service people have told me that they have sold
> thousands of these cables with no problem and that since they are
> custom they will not offer a refund. I told the lady several times...
> a couple times VERY slowly.... "these cables do not meet 43.13 and
> will fail long before the fork will." she still did not get it.
>
> I then told here... "if I use these, eventually my wings will
> probably rip off and I will die" . her comback was still " we sell
> alot of these and nobody complains"
>
> So then I say, "maybe all those other cables are good and I got a bad
> set. Just send me a good set." She says no joy. sales are final I
> am stuck with them.
>
> What the hell?? I've spent about $3,500 with them and now they want
> to lose me over $70?
>
> DJ
> www.imagedv.com
>
>
> > This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for
> viewing by Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting
> provider. For more information on an anti-virus email solution, visit
> <http://www.halfpricehosting.com/av.asp>.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Engellkenjohn" <wingding(at)usmo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Three piece and one piece wings are differen?? |
----- Original Message -----
From: "dpilot" <dpilot(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Three piece and one piece wings are differen??
>
> Why not ask Vi Kappler next year at Brodhead?
> JimV.
>
> clif wrote:
>
> How much do the attachment straps weigh?
> I don't have mine yet but I would think
> 5-8 oz? There are 16 of them. There are
> 28 assorted nuts and bolts and 2 pulleys.
> Two small straps for those pulleys and two
> extra ribs. There's possibly a little more ply
> in the center section. What else?
> We're missing the two very long bolts, front
> and rear, holding the center of each one piece
> spar together. The center pulleys and their
> mounts are extra in the wing as they were
> originaly at the strut/fuse point, not in the wing.
> Anybody got a collection of these parts to weigh?
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "w b evans"
> To:
>
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Three piece and one piece wings are
differen??
>
>
> >
> > Consider this. I built right to the plans, with very little variations.
> > Long fuselage with an A-65, and the three piece wing. also a wing tank
> and
> > a nose tank, and my empty weight was 595#. Would a one piece wing weigh
> in
> > at 565# ?
> > walt evans
> > NX140DL
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From:
> > To:
>
> > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Three piece and one piece wings are
> differen??
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Yes, I realize that you are talking "difference". That's what puzzles
> me.
> > > Thank you for expanding on your memo. The laminated spars are very
> > interesting
> > > and will become even more interesting as time goes on and spruce
prices
> go
> > up.
> > > Were your laminations one piece from end to end or were you able to
> splice
> > > them?...Carl V.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 8/27/03 5:23:37 PM Central Daylight Time,
jack(at)personnelincorporated.com writes:
<< Any Pietors going to Blakesburg this weekend?
Jack Textor >>
I'm planning on flying my Piet up to Blakesburg Iowa, this weekend. Leave
Friday - late afternoon, after work, overnight somewhere enroute, arrive at
Antique Field sometime Saturday morning. Problem is, there is a big front moving
in on Friday, with LOTS of rain in it. Could put a damper on the weekend.
Chuck G.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Al Latham" <geebeed(at)grm.net> |
Hi Kip,
I got off the phone with Karen a bit ago and Gene is stuck in WV for now. He
is in the TravelAir.
I hope to get there early Friday morning, but if Gene dosen't make it I may
scrub the whole thing.
Al Latham
Lathrop, MO.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kip & Beth Gardner" <kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Blakesburg
>
> >
> >
> >Any Pietors going to Blakesburg this weekend?
> >Jack Textor
>
> Jack,
>
> Gene Rambo is going, I think in his Travelair, but he has probably left DC
> already. I got an e-mail from him this AM that indicated he was getting
> ready to leave.
>
>
> Kip Gardner
>
> North Canton, OH
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Al Latham" <geebeed(at)grm.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce - I am about to never use them again. |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Cours" <piet-j(at)moriarti.org>
> It's very interesting hearing about the various vendors and supply
> houses -- extremely useful information for someone like me who's just
> starting out!
> - Jeff C.
Jeff,
I've dealt with Aircraft Spruce and Wick's for years as most everybody on
this list has.
While I have never returned anything to AS, my biggest complaint is the
slowness in
getting things to the customer. I've seen Jim in the Hot Seat at Lakeland
more than once
about this problem. I recently ordered a fuselage envelope for an Aeronca
that I have in
the shop and received it within 5 working days, I was quite happy. I was
also dealing with
a lady that worked with Ron Alexander when it was Alexander Aeroplane, they
were great
people to deal with, I hated to see them eaten up buy the big guys. Stuff
out of CA seems to
take longer.
I have had nothing but fantastic service from Wick's, my wife often drops in
and picks up
my orders and has nothing but nice things to say about how she is treated.
These pickups
are usually after a week of driving a tractor trailer to Chicago every day
so she may not be
in the best of moods, they haven't banned me from buying so I guess things
are ok. We spent
10K+ on spruce with them last year in what was a very difficult order to
fill but we had it within
two weeks.
Al Latham,
Lathrop, MO.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chad and Susan Johnson" <chadnsue(at)earthlink.net> |
Not sure of the Movie Title, but I too saw a really neat movie many years
ago about POWs building a glider and launching it to freedom. It is indeed
based upon the true story of The Colditz Castle POW camp and they really
did build a glider. The glider was very near completion when the American
forces arrived and liberated the town and the camp. There is only one
known photograph surviving and you can see that on the web if you do a
search for Colditz Castle. The glider was broken up and used for fire
wood, it never flew. That is just one of many amazing escape stories from
that place. There is a book or two written about this stuff also. The
documentary I watched was a NOVA, PBS program. Not sure when it aired.
Chad J.
--- Susan Johnson
--- chadnsue(at)earthlink.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Piet ride and advice |
In a message dated 8/27/03 2:23:56 PM Central Daylight Time,
chadnsue(at)earthlink.net writes:
<< To Chuck and Doug in Benton,
Would it be possible to meet up with one or the other of you or both
sometime between Sept 2 and 7th. I have 5 days off and would love to buy a
tank of gas and some coffee in exchange for a piet ride and some advice on
starting my piet project. >>
Hi Chad !!
I remember getting a note from you in my cockpit, earlier this spring. I'm
glad to hear you want to start on the adventure of your life - build & fly your
own Pietenpol. I've got to warn you, though...it is very addictive !!
Yes, I will certainly be around between the 2nd and 7th. We can work out a
time to meet up. Doug doesn't have his Piet anymore, but he has a '46
Taylorcraft, and just recently bought a '39 Taylorcraft project. I'm sure he will
be
around too. Joe Beck's Corvair Pietenpol project is hangered right next to
me. It should be flying this year. I haven't yet had a passanger onboard. If
I don't get to go to Blakesburg this weekend, I'll be working on preparing my
plane for a passanger. I need to finish up my tailwheel, install the harness
in the front pit, install the slanted struts and remove the X cables on the
right side of the front pit, and change out the windshield, and install a
windshield for the passanger. Then I will see how she handles with progressively
increasing loads of balast in the front pit. I probably won't have all that
done by next week, but McPherson is well within the range of a day trip !! I'm
always looking for new destinations. For sure, we'll be able to 'Kick the
tires, twang the wires, and light the fire !!'
I remember seeing that documentry on the 'Coldiz Castle', a couple of
years ago. They built a hidden room, and then built it without any guards
finding out. I think only one of them was able to escape. I think they drew
straws, or something.
Chuck Gantzer
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: You don't have a WHAT ? |
In a message dated 8/27/03 12:57:04 AM Central Daylight Time,
ggower_99(at)yahoo.com writes:
<< Hope this helps, and I am sorry that I cant make it, maybe only
directly from Texas to Broadhead and Oshkosh... >>
Gary,
How 'bout Texas to Wichita to Brodhead and Oshkosh ? There are quite a few
Piet projects in Texas and Oklahoma. We could make quite an arrival in
Brodhead, with everyone from out west, and from the southwest, for the 75th
anniversery !!
Chuck G.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
They did build a replica and one of
them flew it on the show that I saw.
I believe it was a 1 hr documentary.
That's about a year ago now.
ClifSubject: Pietenpol-List: The Birdmen
>
> Not sure of the Movie Title, but I too saw a really neat movie many years
> ago about POWs building a glider and launching it to freedom. It is indeed
> based upon the true story of The Colditz Castle POW camp and they really
> did build a glider. The glider was very near completion when the American
> forces arrived and liberated the town and the camp. There is only one
> known photograph surviving and you can see that on the web if you do a
> search for Colditz Castle. The glider was broken up and used for fire
> wood, it never flew. That is just one of many amazing escape stories from
> that place. There is a book or two written about this stuff also. The
> documentary I watched was a NOVA, PBS program. Not sure when it aired.
>
> Chad J.
>
> --- Susan Johnson
> --- chadnsue(at)earthlink.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=34202&item=2429073203
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clif <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca> |
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2189281561&category=419
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Textor" <jack(at)personnelincorporated.com> |
Walt,
It is at Antique Airfield, Blakesburg, IA which is just west of Ottumwa, IA.
The ID is IA27. Sponsored by the Antique Airplane Association. It is a
member only event. You can learn more at their site http://www.aaa-apm.org
. Very casual and many nice antiques.
Jack Textor
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of w b evans
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Blakesburg
Where's that?
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack Textor" <jack(at)personnelincorporated.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Blakesburg
>
> Any Pietors going to Blakesburg this weekend?
> Jack Textor
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy(at)grc.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce - I am about to never use |
them again.
DJ-- I have posted my preference several times on this list in dealing with
Wicks near St. Louis and Dillsburg Aeroworks in PA for AN hardware rather
that the idiots at ASS. They farm out much of that work--- like tach
cables. When I got fed up after waiting over 2 mos. for a simple
tachometer cable I dug up enough dirt to find out that ASS has some
backyard garage outfit making these things in Arizona and that was the hold
up. I only use them when all other options are exhausted.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com> |
| Subject: | Aircraft Spruce -who is this guy?! |
I got this email.... in the "From" line it said "John and Susan
". In the "Subject" line it said "Aircraft Spruce,
i.e., cables."
here's what the message read:
Dear DJ; Get a life
------------------------------
who the hell is this jackass? it must be either someone on the Piet list or
the Corvair list because I only sent my email about Aircraft Spruce to those
lists.
I need to get a life because I'm concerned about the safety of my aircraft
and the safety of my 9 yr. old son who will be sitting in front seat of my
Piet?!
I invite this John character to say that to my face if he ever sees me.
DJ Vegh
N74DV
Mesa, AZ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Barry Davis" <bed(at)mindspring.com> |
When I order something, the standard question is "do you have it in stock and when
will it ship". If I don't get the answer I like, then the shopping around
begins. It is a must to have all the vendors catalogs in your library when building
an airplane. I own 5 companies and know first hand that you can't stock
everything and can't make everything yourself. We have to rely on the small jobbers.
What we can't tolerate is unreal delivery claims. If its going to take
a long time, I want to know it up front. Then I can see who has it in stock before
I order it.
Also A/S will price match. I found this out buying a Garmin GPS. I made the comment
that so and so had it for a lower price and the salesman popped up and said
they will match the lowest price we could find. Garmin has a minimum advertised
price that can be printed in the catalog, but it can be sold "on sale" by
any vendor. It saved me a couple hundred dollars, so I bought my tach also.
My $.02
Barry
ps. all 168 ribs built now
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Cours <piet-j(at)moriarti.org> |
| Subject: | uprights next to the spars |
> I built the ribs with only a single upright next to each rib. It saves an
> insignificant amount of weight, and doesn't affect the rib integrity at all.
> It also makes it impossible to have problems fitting the ribs onto the spar.
I've been wondering about this. The rib drawing on my "Wing Plans
3-3-34" sheet doesn't seem to show any vertical capstrip next to the
spars, just some pieces that meet on a diagonal. That matches the
diagram in the 1932 Flying and Glider Manual. However, the full-sized
rib drawing shows a single vertical piece next to each spar.
What's the general wisdom on these upright pieces?
thanks,
Jeff C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce - I am about to never use |
them again.
| From: | John Hofmann <jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com> |
What Mikey said:
I use ASS as only a last resort. How I miss Alexander Aeroplane before they
were bought out. Wicks has always treated me very well. I get my Spruce
locally in Madison, WI at McCormick's lumber. They stock straight grain
Sitka. I are reasonable and I know they ship.
-john-
>
>
> DJ-- I have posted my preference several times on this list in dealing with
> Wicks near St. Louis and Dillsburg Aeroworks in PA for AN hardware rather
> that the idiots at ASS. They farm out much of that work--- like tach
> cables. When I got fed up after waiting over 2 mos. for a simple
> tachometer cable I dug up enough dirt to find out that ASS has some
> backyard garage outfit making these things in Arizona and that was the hold
> up. I only use them when all other options are exhausted.
>
> Mike C.
>
>
>
>
>
>
---------------------------------
John Hofmann
Manager, Information Technology
The Rees Group, Inc.
7600 Terrace Avenue, Ste. 203
Middleton, WI 53562
Phone: 608-831-3611, ext. 150
Fax: 608-831-5122
Email: jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken Hannan" <isp.inc(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Instrument Panel |
Group, It's time for me to put together my instrument panel, I would like to
know what type and brand I should use, also what instruments do I need? this
is for my Model A powered Pietenpol.
Thanks
Ken Hannan
Temecula, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce |
How interesting...... I made the post about AS&S yesterday on the Piet list and
on the 'Vair list. a few members from the 'Vair list even sent an email directly
to AS&S stressing their concerns.
I also sent an email yesterday to Jim Irwin (Pres.of AS&S) explaining my strife.
I get a call this morning from the Customer Service General Mgr and she says she
has had a new set of cables made and that these cables will meet spec. She
says they are very concerned about safety.
Funny how it takes getting aggressive to get things done. I'll post back when
I mic the swages and see for myself.
DJ
=
This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for viewing by Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more information on an anti-virus email solution, visit <http://www.halfpricehosting.com/av.asp>.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Markle" <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Recent visit to see Larry Prange's Pietenpol Air Camper |
What a fun visit with Larry and Clif Dawson! They're both craftsmen who
know how to get the job done (with skill levels that humble me).
If I had known that building a Pietenpol might allow me to hang out with
this crowd, I would have started it years ago.
Thanks guys.
Jim in Plano
>
> To view Jim Markle's pictures at Shutterfly,
> simply go to:
>
> <http://www.shutterfly.com/osi.jsp?i=67b0de21b32895fbe4f1>
>
> (If you can't click on this link, try copying and pasting it
> into your web browser.)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Al Latham" <geebeed(at)grm.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Spruce |
Hi DJ,
Sounds like a simple case of bending the right persons ear...
It appears that the first person you talked with was a "clock watcher"
and couldn't care less if you were happy or if the items were safe.
Hope it ends well.
Al Latham,
Lathrop, MO.
----- Original Message -----
From: "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aircraft Spruce
>
> How interesting...... I made the post about AS&S yesterday on the Piet
list and on the 'Vair list. a few members from the 'Vair list even sent an
email directly to AS&S stressing their concerns.
>
> I also sent an email yesterday to Jim Irwin (Pres.of AS&S) explaining my
strife.
>
> I get a call this morning from the Customer Service General Mgr and she
says she has had a new set of cables made and that these cables will meet
spec. She says they are very concerned about safety.
>
> Funny how it takes getting aggressive to get things done. I'll post back
when I mic the swages and see for myself.
>
> DJ
>
>
> > This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for viewing by
Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more
information on an anti-virus email solution, visit
<http://www.halfpricehosting.com/av.asp>.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: uprights next to the spars |
Use them if you make a spar that is 3/4 ths inches wide.
Dont use them if you make a spar that is 1 inch wide
JimV.
Jeff Cours wrote:
> I built the ribs with only a single upright next to each rib. It saves an
> insignificant amount of weight, and doesn't affect the rib integrity at all.
> It also makes it impossible to have problems fitting the ribs onto the spar.
I've been wondering about this. The rib drawing on my "Wing Plans
3-3-34" sheet doesn't seem to show any vertical capstrip next to the
spars, just some pieces that meet on a diagonal. That matches the
diagram in the 1932 Flying and Glider Manual. However, the full-sized
rib drawing shows a single vertical piece next to each spar.
What's the general wisdom on these upright pieces?
thanks,
Jeff C.
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | The Hawk, and the Sneaky Piet |
Suprising to me, I've been getting a lot of positive responses about
these flying stories. Here's one that actually happened in mid May. I make notes
in my Pilot Log, about each flight, so that when I'm no longer able to fly
(yes, we will all get there), I'll be able to relive flying this wonderful
airplane. This event took less than a minute to unfold, but it is rather humorous.
It was an afternoon test flight, kinda bumpy conditions, especially when
I was trying to see how the plane trims out, at various airspeeds. I have
since found that my plane trims out nicely at 1900 rpm for a 70 mph level cruise.
What still amazes me, is that if I add just 100 rpm, up to 2000 rpm, the
nose will pitch up slightly and go into a shallow climb. On the other end, if
I
reduce it by just 100 rpm, to 1800 rpm, it will slightly pitch down into a
shallow decent. The balance and control feel of a Pietenpol is such that you
easily become one with the plane.
Anyway, I was in an area about 5 or 10 miles west of El Dorado Lake.
It's a sparsely populated area with plenty of fields, where an emergency landing
could be made. I've often seen birds while flying, some that seemed to be too
close for comfort. I've heard tell, that Pietenpols sometimes take a bird
strike...from the REAR !! Last year, I was taking a friend a ride in a spam
can C-150, and we spotted a Bald Eagle, well off in the distance, but easily
recognizable. I noted that in my log book.
On this occasion I spotted a hawk, off my 11 O'clock, maybe half mile
away, and several hundred feet lower altitude. I thought...Hummm...I wonder how
close I could get to him, if I sneak up on him with a low power setting,
however probably not a wise thing to do. My wisdom succumbed to my curiosity,
and
I pulled power to around 1500 rpm. The exhaust noise was very significantly
reduced, but the wind noise was still evident, so I pitched the nose up a
little, to slow down and maintained a glide speed of 45 or 50 mph, where the wind
noise is reduced. As I approached him, keeping him at my 10 to 11 O'clock, I
couldn't really tell what his heading was. Our bretherns in flight, Hawks and
Eagles, are among the most graceful creatures on earth, tuned to their
environment. As I got closer, I could see he was having no problem with the bumpy
thermals, and was in full control with a twitch of his wing tips, and tail. I
could now tell he was on approximately the same heading as I was. He was
looking down, and was probably thinking "look at how those damned humans have
ruined my land". Either that, or "I've got to find a big fat grain fed mouse".
He certainly did not see my approach. I was coming up quickly now, and when he
was at my 9 O'clock, less than 100', and maybe 30' lower, he turned and
looked me right in the eye, and his eyes got bigger than his head !! He instantly
turned into a ruffled ball of feathers, and squirted a white glob out of his
six !! I am certain that it fell on someone's newly waxed vehicle !! In a
heartbeat, he gathered himself back together in a 90 banked left turn, and
slowly disappeared in the distance. I just didn't have the heart to turn and
follow him. Maybe I gave him an appreciation of how his prey feels, just before
he
strikes them. Maybe I've made him a better hunter. I can only hope he
didn't pull a muscle, or something...
Chuck Gantzer
every flight is an adventure !!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary M. Colwill" <g.colwill3(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: The Hawk, and the Sneaky Piet |
That's the funniest flying story I've ever heard!
Gary C.
Chino, CA
Rcaprd(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Suprising to me, I've been getting a lot of positive responses about
>these flying stories. Here's one that actually happened in mid May. I make notes
>in my Pilot Log, about each flight, so that when I'm no longer able to fly
>(yes, we will all get there), I'll be able to relive flying this wonderful
>airplane. This event took less than a minute to unfold, but it is rather humorous.
> It was an afternoon test flight, kinda bumpy conditions, especially when
>I was trying to see how the plane trims out, at various airspeeds. I have
>since found that my plane trims out nicely at 1900 rpm for a 70 mph level cruise.
> What still amazes me, is that if I add just 100 rpm, up to 2000 rpm, the
>nose will pitch up slightly and go into a shallow climb. On the other end, if
I
>reduce it by just 100 rpm, to 1800 rpm, it will slightly pitch down into a
>shallow decent. The balance and control feel of a Pietenpol is such that you
>easily become one with the plane.
> Anyway, I was in an area about 5 or 10 miles west of El Dorado Lake.
>It's a sparsely populated area with plenty of fields, where an emergency landing
>could be made. I've often seen birds while flying, some that seemed to be too
>close for comfort. I've heard tell, that Pietenpols sometimes take a bird
>strike...from the REAR !! Last year, I was taking a friend a ride in a spam
>can C-150, and we spotted a Bald Eagle, well off in the distance, but easily
>recognizable. I noted that in my log book.
> On this occasion I spotted a hawk, off my 11 O'clock, maybe half mile
>away, and several hundred feet lower altitude. I thought...Hummm...I wonder how
>close I could get to him, if I sneak up on him with a low power setting,
>however probably not a wise thing to do. My wisdom succumbed to my curiosity,
and
>I pulled power to around 1500 rpm. The exhaust noise was very significantly
>reduced, but the wind noise was still evident, so I pitched the nose up a
>little, to slow down and maintained a glide speed of 45 or 50 mph, where the wind
>noise is reduced. As I approached him, keeping him at my 10 to 11 O'clock, I
>couldn't really tell what his heading was. Our bretherns in flight, Hawks and
>Eagles, are among the most graceful creatures on earth, tuned to their
>environment. As I got closer, I could see he was having no problem with the bumpy
>thermals, and was in full control with a twitch of his wing tips, and tail. I
>could now tell he was on approximately the same heading as I was. He was
>looking down, and was probably thinking "look at how those damned humans have
>ruined my land". Either that, or "I've got to find a big fat grain fed mouse".
>He certainly did not see my approach. I was coming up quickly now, and when he
>was at my 9 O'clock, less than 100', and maybe 30' lower, he turned and
>looked me right in the eye, and his eyes got bigger than his head !! He instantly
>turned into a ruffled ball of feathers, and squirted a white glob out of his
>six !! I am certain that it fell on someone's newly waxed vehicle !! In a
>heartbeat, he gathered himself back together in a 90 banked left turn, and
>slowly disappeared in the distance. I just didn't have the heart to turn and
>follow him. Maybe I gave him an appreciation of how his prey feels, just before
he
>strikes them. Maybe I've made him a better hunter. I can only hope he
>didn't pull a muscle, or something...
>
>Chuck Gantzer
>every flight is an adventure !!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Hofmann <jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com> |
Any MAAC members on the list off to Brodhead for Grassroots next weekend?
-john-
---------------------------------
John Hofmann
Manager, Information Technology
The Rees Group, Inc.
7600 Terrace Avenue, Ste. 203
Middleton, WI 53562
Phone: 608-831-3611, ext. 150
Fax: 608-831-5122
Email: jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dan john <ballmell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The Hawk, and the Sneaky Piet |
Hi list.I`m new to the list(first day).What a story to
be greeted with!Great.I have just completed Grega GN1
that my son started when he was 13.He is 38 now.You
would`nt throw a guy out for having a Grega would you?
It has a Corvair engine.I am having a problem getting
insurance because of the engine.Now one will cover it
until the restrictions are flown off. My test pilot
will be Vi Kapler,so that can`t be an insurance
problem.Has anyone one the list had this happen? Also
I see a reference to a corvair list.Did`nt know about
this.Got an address? Buy the way,in reference to
Aircraft Spruce,I`m all done with them as I have had
there Sales Manager flat out lie to me.Thanks,John P.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com> |
| Subject: | John Ficklen - this guys a moron |
I'm really ticked at this John Ficklen character on this list. the guy who
told me to "get a life" because I was worried about my AS&S cables.
he sends me an email today saying
" I'm a prominent aviation artist, model builder, and historian. I have
restoried several antique airplanes and my Piet will fly in Dec. after two
years work. If you spent more time in your shop with Tony B's books and less
time on the computer you would probably get more done. Who the (explative
deleted) are you?"
Who is he to judge me on how fast I build my project? And yes.... I do
spend alot of time on the computer.... I spend hours updating my
construction/pictures log online. I spend hours discussing issues with you
folks on this list.
I guess I just consider myself an involved Piet community individual who
likes to share with others.
I'm sorry Mr. Ficklen that I'm not a recluse like you who finished a Piet in
2 years.
I hope you read this Johhny boy and I hope you read any replies this may
generate.
DJ Vegh
N74DV
Mesa, AZ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | del magsam <farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: John Ficklen - this guys a moron |
DJ
This guy and others are bent on causing cayouse. And
if you read his emails and get upset, then he has
succeeded in his mission. If you just press delete
even before you read his emails, then he hasn't even
made it to first base. and it remains his problem, and
you havn't made it yours, or ours. if you bring it up
on the list, then you will get everybody riled up,
waste time, bandwidth etc. and then this guy will
really succeed.
Del
--- DJ Vegh wrote:
>
>
> I'm really ticked at this John Ficklen character on
> this list. the guy who
> told me to "get a life" because I was worried about
> my AS&S cables.
>
> he sends me an email today saying
>
> " I'm a prominent aviation artist, model builder,
> and historian. I have
> restoried several antique airplanes and my Piet will
> fly in Dec. after two
> years work. If you spent more time in your shop with
> Tony B's books and less
> time on the computer you would probably get more
> done. Who the (explative
> deleted) are you?"
>
> Who is he to judge me on how fast I build my
> project? And yes.... I do
> spend alot of time on the computer.... I spend hours
> updating my
> construction/pictures log online. I spend hours
> discussing issues with you
> folks on this list.
>
> I guess I just consider myself an involved Piet
> community individual who
> likes to share with others.
>
> I'm sorry Mr. Ficklen that I'm not a recluse like
> you who finished a Piet in
> 2 years.
>
> I hope you read this Johhny boy and I hope you read
> any replies this may
> generate.
>
> DJ Vegh
> N74DV
> Mesa, AZ
> www.imagedv.com/aircamper
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> latest messages.
> List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
=====
Del-New Richmond, Wi
"farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com"
__________________________________
http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | del magsam <farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The Hawk, and the Sneaky Piet |
my vair powered sonex is covered by avemco, liability
only for $1200/year. They will require 10 hrs of dual,
which is a little difficult, but can be done. you can
sign up for the vair list at www.corvaircraft.com
and welcome!
Del
--- dan john wrote:
>
>
> Hi list.I`m new to the list(first day).What a story
> to
> be greeted with!Great.I have just completed Grega
> GN1
> that my son started when he was 13.He is 38 now.You
> would`nt throw a guy out for having a Grega would
> you?
> It has a Corvair engine.I am having a problem
> getting
> insurance because of the engine.Now one will cover
> it
> until the restrictions are flown off. My test pilot
> will be Vi Kapler,so that can`t be an insurance
> problem.Has anyone one the list had this happen?
> Also
> I see a reference to a corvair list.Did`nt know
> about
> this.Got an address? Buy the way,in reference to
> Aircraft Spruce,I`m all done with them as I have had
> there Sales Manager flat out lie to me.Thanks,John
> P.
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> latest messages.
> List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
=====
Del-New Richmond, Wi
"farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com"
__________________________________
http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary McNeel" <gmcneel(at)mykitplane.com> |
| Subject: | John Ficklen - this guys a moron |
Never heard of him, but who cares. Your work is great and your concerns are
valid. Ask him if he has any friends who died in a plane crash because they
just were not worried about structural parts failing.
Frankly, I am VERY surprised that AS&S will not take them back. That is the
BIG Company mentality for you.
-Gary
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of DJ Vegh
Subject: Pietenpol-List: John Ficklen - this guys a moron
I'm really ticked at this John Ficklen character on this list. the guy who
told me to "get a life" because I was worried about my AS&S cables.
he sends me an email today saying
" I'm a prominent aviation artist, model builder, and historian. I have
restoried several antique airplanes and my Piet will fly in Dec. after two
years work. If you spent more time in your shop with Tony B's books and less
time on the computer you would probably get more done. Who the (explative
deleted) are you?"
Who is he to judge me on how fast I build my project? And yes.... I do
spend alot of time on the computer.... I spend hours updating my
construction/pictures log online. I spend hours discussing issues with you
folks on this list.
I guess I just consider myself an involved Piet community individual who
likes to share with others.
I'm sorry Mr. Ficklen that I'm not a recluse like you who finished a Piet in
2 years.
I hope you read this Johhny boy and I hope you read any replies this may
generate.
DJ Vegh
N74DV
Mesa, AZ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com> |
| Subject: | Re: John Ficklen - this guys a moron |
yeah... you know what... you are right. my delete key will get some use
from this guy.
DJ Vegh
N74DV
Mesa, AZ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
----- Original Message -----
From: "del magsam" <farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: John Ficklen - this guys a moron
>
> DJ
> This guy and others are bent on causing cayouse. And
> if you read his emails and get upset, then he has
> succeeded in his mission. If you just press delete
> even before you read his emails, then he hasn't even
> made it to first base. and it remains his problem, and
> you havn't made it yours, or ours. if you bring it up
> on the list, then you will get everybody riled up,
> waste time, bandwidth etc. and then this guy will
> really succeed.
> Del
> --- DJ Vegh wrote:
> >
> >
> > I'm really ticked at this John Ficklen character on
> > this list. the guy who
> > told me to "get a life" because I was worried about
> > my AS&S cables.
> >
> > he sends me an email today saying
> >
> > " I'm a prominent aviation artist, model builder,
> > and historian. I have
> > restoried several antique airplanes and my Piet will
> > fly in Dec. after two
> > years work. If you spent more time in your shop with
> > Tony B's books and less
> > time on the computer you would probably get more
> > done. Who the (explative
> > deleted) are you?"
> >
> > Who is he to judge me on how fast I build my
> > project? And yes.... I do
> > spend alot of time on the computer.... I spend hours
> > updating my
> > construction/pictures log online. I spend hours
> > discussing issues with you
> > folks on this list.
> >
> > I guess I just consider myself an involved Piet
> > community individual who
> > likes to share with others.
> >
> > I'm sorry Mr. Ficklen that I'm not a recluse like
> > you who finished a Piet in
> > 2 years.
> >
> > I hope you read this Johhny boy and I hope you read
> > any replies this may
> > generate.
> >
> > DJ Vegh
> > N74DV
> > Mesa, AZ
> > www.imagedv.com/aircamper
> >
> >
> >
> > Contributions
> > any other
> > Forums.
> >
> > latest messages.
> > List members.
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> =====
> Del-New Richmond, Wi
> "farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com"
>
> __________________________________
> http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James Dallas" <bec176(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: John Ficklen - this guys a moron |
DJ, Ignore him---I for one like what your doing and spend quite a bit of
time at your web site.
Jim D.
>From: "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com>
>Reply-To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: John Ficklen - this guys a moron
>Date: Fri, 29 Aug 2003 07:33:25 -0700
>
>
>I'm really ticked at this John Ficklen character on this list. the guy who
>told me to "get a life" because I was worried about my AS&S cables.
>
>he sends me an email today saying
>
>" I'm a prominent aviation artist, model builder, and historian. I have
>restoried several antique airplanes and my Piet will fly in Dec. after two
>years work. If you spent more time in your shop with Tony B's books and
>less
>time on the computer you would probably get more done. Who the (explative
>deleted) are you?"
>
>Who is he to judge me on how fast I build my project? And yes.... I do
>spend alot of time on the computer.... I spend hours updating my
>construction/pictures log online. I spend hours discussing issues with you
>folks on this list.
>
>I guess I just consider myself an involved Piet community individual who
>likes to share with others.
>
>I'm sorry Mr. Ficklen that I'm not a recluse like you who finished a Piet
>in
>2 years.
>
>I hope you read this Johhny boy and I hope you read any replies this may
>generate.
>
>DJ Vegh
>N74DV
>Mesa, AZ
>www.imagedv.com/aircamper
>
>
Enter for your chance to IM with Bon Jovi, Seal, Bow Wow, or Mary J Blige
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Ford" <Jford(at)indstate.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: John Ficklen - this guys a moron |
I deal with people like him rather often (computer support - what do you
expect!). Happiness being a relative thing, they try to make everybody
else unhappy to raise their relative level of happiness. It is both sad
and humorous at the same time. I hope we don't read about him and his
not-worried-about cables in an NTSB report somewhere, and I hope that
your concerns of quality (and others expressed daily on this list by
everybody) make an impression on him. I haven't started building yet
(have to finish the house first), and you all have made me think about
issues I may never have considered if I were building in a vacuum. I
hope you make it to Brodhead when you're finished and I can meet you and
see your plane. I hope he makes it to Brodhead as well, so we can all
share and enjoy what we've got for awhile and realize we all have
different ideas and values. It's not worth taking this kind of thing to
heart...
John
John Ford
john(at)indstate.edu
812-237-8542
>>> aircamper(at)imagedv.com Friday, August 29, 2003 9:33:25 AM >>>
I'm really ticked at this John Ficklen character on this list. the guy
who
told me to "get a life" because I was worried about my AS&S cables.
he sends me an email today saying
" I'm a prominent aviation artist, model builder, and historian. I
have
restoried several antique airplanes and my Piet will fly in Dec. after
two
years work. If you spent more time in your shop with Tony B's books and
less
time on the computer you would probably get more done. Who the
(explative
deleted) are you?"
Who is he to judge me on how fast I build my project? And yes.... I
do
spend alot of time on the computer.... I spend hours updating my
construction/pictures log online. I spend hours discussing issues with
you
folks on this list.
I guess I just consider myself an involved Piet community individual
who
likes to share with others.
I'm sorry Mr. Ficklen that I'm not a recluse like you who finished a
Piet in
2 years.
I hope you read this Johhny boy and I hope you read any replies this
may
generate.
DJ Vegh
N74DV
Mesa, AZ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New GN-1 member |
Hi John,
I have a GN-1 which is about 50% complete and I have my William Wynne
Corvair whcih will be powering it. GN-1's are certainly welcome on this
list.
if you get a chance and feel like checking out my site, I have TONS of pics
and construction log entries. the site is
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
Welcome!
DJ Vegh
N74DV
Mesa, AZ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
----- Original Message -----
From: "del magsam" <farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: The Hawk, and the Sneaky Piet
> >
> >
> > Hi list.I`m new to the list(first day).What a story
> > to
> > be greeted with!Great.I have just completed Grega
> > GN1
> > that my son started when he was 13.He is 38 now.You
> > would`nt throw a guy out for having a Grega would
> > you?
> > It has a Corvair engine.I am having a problem
> > getting
> > insurance because of the engine.Now one will cover
> > it
> > until the restrictions are flown off. My test pilot
> > will be Vi Kapler,so that can`t be an insurance
> > problem.Has anyone one the list had this happen?
> > Also
> > I see a reference to a corvair list.Did`nt know
> > about
> > this.Got an address? Buy the way,in reference to
> > Aircraft Spruce,I`m all done with them as I have had
> > there Sales Manager flat out lie to me.Thanks,John
> > P.
> >
> >
> >
> > Contributions
> > any other
> > Forums.
> >
> > latest messages.
> > List members.
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
> > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> =====
> Del-New Richmond, Wi
> "farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com"
>
> __________________________________
> http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: John Ficklen - this guys a moron |
Actually, "John" has a point.
I don't know what kind of cables are being discussed here, as I built all of mine
with a $19.95 nicopress masher, and have flown over 400 hours with no problems.
I guess if you want to get fancy and make things better than they need to be, a
lot of people dont want to hear about the problems associated with changing the
plans.
JimV.
John Ford wrote:
I deal with people like him rather often (computer support - what do you
expect!). Happiness being a relative thing, they try to make everybody
else unhappy to raise their relative level of happiness. It is both sad
and humorous at the same time. I hope we don't read about him and his
not-worried-about cables in an NTSB report somewhere, and I hope that
your concerns of quality (and others expressed daily on this list by
everybody) make an impression on him. I haven't started building yet
(have to finish the house first), and you all have made me think about
issues I may never have considered if I were building in a vacuum. I
hope you make it to Brodhead when you're finished and I can meet you and
see your plane. I hope he makes it to Brodhead as well, so we can all
share and enjoy what we've got for awhile and realize we all have
different ideas and values. It's not worth taking this kind of thing to
heart...
John
John Ford
john(at)indstate.edu
812-237-8542
>>> aircamper(at)imagedv.com Friday, August 29, 2003 9:33:25 AM >>>
I'm really ticked at this John Ficklen character on this list. the guy
who
told me to "get a life" because I was worried about my AS&S cables.
he sends me an email today saying
" I'm a prominent aviation artist, model builder, and historian. I
have
restoried several antique airplanes and my Piet will fly in Dec. after
two
years work. If you spent more time in your shop with Tony B's books and
less
time on the computer you would probably get more done. Who the
(explative
deleted) are you?"
Who is he to judge me on how fast I build my project? And yes.... I
do
spend alot of time on the computer.... I spend hours updating my
construction/pictures log online. I spend hours discussing issues with
you
folks on this list.
I guess I just consider myself an involved Piet community individual
who
likes to share with others.
I'm sorry Mr. Ficklen that I'm not a recluse like you who finished a
Piet in
2 years.
I hope you read this Johhny boy and I hope you read any replies this
may
generate.
DJ Vegh
N74DV
Mesa, AZ
www.imagedv.com/aircamper
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Gow" <rgow(at)avionicsdesign.ca> |
| Subject: | Pietenpol with model A engine |
I'm wondering if anyone has realistic performance figures for a Pietenpol
with the stock Model A engine @ gross weight. I suspect more power would be
a good thing. From what I can see there has been quite a bit of work done
in increasing the horsepower in the lower RPM range. On set of Dyno
results I saw with a replica performance head, needle bearings, 451 pistons
and so forth indicated about 70 HP @ 2500 rpm. Does anyone have experience
with this sort of modification?
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Markle" <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Interesting item on eBay web site item#2429974094: Pietenpol |
Air Camper
Wow, this looks like a good one....
Interesting item on eBay web site item#2429974094: Pietenpol Air Camper
> I saw this item for sale at eBayMotors, The World's Online Marketplace TM,
and thought that you might be interested.
>
> Title of item: Pietenpol Air Camper
> Seller: beepilot
> Price: Currently $500.00
> To bid on the item, go to:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2429974094
>
>
> Item Description:
>
> Pietenpol Air Camper
>
> I am listing this Pietenpol project for Kevin, who needs the hanger space.
This would make a great starting point for someone wanting to build a "1937
Air camper" I
don't personally know the details, but the workmanship looks great.
The plans are there, along with some pictures of the build process.
>
>
> Vehicle Condition
>
>
> This is a partially built project.
>
> Plans are listed as
"1937 Air Camper with a 1960 Corvair Engine"
>
> Always been indoors
and with no apparent damage to the structures.
>
> Photo's can be
viewed at http://www.steve.dewright.us/Pietenpol/index.htm
>
> If you have any
questions contact Kevin at 1-636-926-0039
> Or e-mail me and
I'll do my best to answer any questions.
>
>
> Terms of Sale
>
>
> Paypal, US Postal Money Order, orCash. 25% of winning
bid must be paid within 3 days of auction ending. The balances due at time
of pick up or after arrangements are made for shipping.Buyer must
arrange all shipping. Buyer must pick up or have shipping arrangements made
within an agreeable time frame.
>
>
>
> Visit eBay, The World's Online Marketplace TM at http://www.ebay.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carbarvo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: John Ficklen - this guys a moron |
Me too! It's a disgrace to have someone like that sully an otherwise friendly
exchange. I hope we never fall into the rut of strong language and
disrespect. From what I've seen, that's very unlikely EXCEPT for this one individual.
Carl V.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
I plan on going with the Bellanca
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Hofmann" <jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Grassroots
>
> Any MAAC members on the list off to Brodhead for Grassroots next weekend?
>
> -john-
>
> ---------------------------------
> John Hofmann
> Manager, Information Technology
> The Rees Group, Inc.
> 7600 Terrace Avenue, Ste. 203
> Middleton, WI 53562
> Phone: 608-831-3611, ext. 150
> Fax: 608-831-5122
> Email: jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com> |
| Subject: | completed GN-1 pics in Michigan |
I took some pics of a GN-1 that I came across while doing some barnyard flying
in the back country of Michigan.
This yellow one stunned me because it has the same style lettering along the side
that I will be doing on mine.
some pics here:
http://www.imagedv.com/indiana-8-03/index.htm
&
http://www.imagedv.com/indiana-8-03/index_2.htm
DJ Vegh
Editor - Animator - Digital Artist
Larry John Wright, Inc.
1045 E. University Dr.
Mesa, AZ 85203
480.833.8111 - Office
602.743.5768 - Mobile
"The Nation's Number One Retail Advertising Agency"
Achieving Big Time Results for Local and Regional Retailers
----- Original Message -----
From: Al Latham
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2003 3:21 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aircraft Spruce
Hi DJ,
Sounds like a simple case of bending the right persons ear...
It appears that the first person you talked with was a "clock watcher"
and couldn't care less if you were happy or if the items were safe.
Hope it ends well.
Al Latham,
Lathrop, MO.
----- Original Message -----
From: "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com>
To:
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aircraft Spruce
>
> How interesting...... I made the post about AS&S yesterday on the Piet
list and on the 'Vair list. a few members from the 'Vair list even sent an
email directly to AS&S stressing their concerns.
>
> I also sent an email yesterday to Jim Irwin (Pres.of AS&S) explaining my
strife.
>
> I get a call this morning from the Customer Service General Mgr and she
says she has had a new set of cables made and that these cables will meet
spec. She says they are very concerned about safety.
>
> Funny how it takes getting aggressive to get things done. I'll post back
when I mic the swages and see for myself.
>
> DJ
>
>
> > This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for viewing by
Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more
information on an anti-virus email solution, visit
<http://www.halfpricehosting.com/av.asp>.
>
>
=
This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for viewing by Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more information on an anti-virus email solution, visit <http://www.halfpricehosting.com/av.asp>.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <aircamper(at)imagedv.com> |
| Subject: | Another item on eBay |
here's another Aircamper
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category26428&item2429669998
by the looks of the landing gear and the wing ribs, me thinks it's a GN-1 and not
a Piet
DJ Vegh
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Markle
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, August 29, 2003 9:12 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Interesting item on eBay web site item#2429974094: Pietenpol
Air Camper
Wow, this looks like a good one....
Interesting item on eBay web site item#2429974094: Pietenpol Air Camper
> I saw this item for sale at eBayMotors, The World's Online Marketplace TM,
and thought that you might be interested.
>
> Title of item: Pietenpol Air Camper
> Seller: beepilot
> Price: Currently $500.00
> To bid on the item, go to:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item2429974094
>
>
> Item Description:
>
> Pietenpol Air Camper
>
> I am listing this Pietenpol project for Kevin, who needs the hanger space.
This would make a great starting point for someone wanting to build a "1937
Air camper" I
don't personally know the details, but the workmanship looks great.
The plans are there, along with some pictures of the build process.
>
>
> Vehicle Condition
>
>
> This is a partially built project.
>
> Plans are listed as
"1937 Air Camper with a 1960 Corvair Engine"
>
> Always been indoors
and with no apparent damage to the structures.
>
> Photo's can be
viewed at http://www.steve.dewright.us/Pietenpol/index.htm
>
> If you have any
questions contact Kevin at 1-636-926-0039
> Or e-mail me and
I'll do my best to answer any questions.
>
>
> Terms of Sale
>
>
> Paypal, US Postal Money Order, orCash. 25% of winning
bid must be paid within 3 days of auction ending. The balances due at time
of pick up or after arrangements are made for shipping.Buyer must
arrange all shipping. Buyer must pick up or have shipping arrangements made
within an agreeable time frame.
>
>
>
> Visit eBay, The World's Online Marketplace TM at http://www.ebay.com
=
This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for viewing by Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more information on an anti-virus email solution, visit <http://www.halfpricehosting.com/av.asp>.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Ash <ashcan(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Which Corvair ? / was: Interesting item on eBay web site |
...
This eBay ad lists a 1960 Corvair, which got me thinking.
Is anybody here using a Corvair engine that isn't a late-model 110?
I'm not personally a fan of the earlies (although I've got one in a car),
mostly because of the smaller displacement / hp, but as long as you're not
running a 140 or a 180, I can't say a whole lot.
I'm not trying to stir up an argument, I'm just curious.
Jim Ash
>
>Wow, this looks like a good one....
>
>Interesting item on eBay web site item#2429974094: Pietenpol Air Camper
>
>
> > I saw this item for sale at eBayMotors, The World's Online Marketplace TM,
>and thought that you might be interested.
> >
> > Title of item: Pietenpol Air Camper
> > Seller: beepilot
> > Price: Currently $500.00
> > To bid on the item, go to:
>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2429974094
> >
> >
> > Item Description:
> >
> > Pietenpol Air Camper
> >
> > I am listing this Pietenpol project for Kevin, who needs the hanger space.
>This would make a great starting point for someone wanting to build a "1937
>Air camper" I
>don't personally know the details, but the workmanship looks great.
>The plans are there, along with some pictures of the build process.
> >
> >
> > Vehicle Condition
> >
> >
> > This is a partially built project.
> >
> > Plans are listed as
>"1937 Air Camper with a 1960 Corvair Engine"
> >
> > Always been indoors
>and with no apparent damage to the structures.
> >
> > Photo's can be
>viewed at http://www.steve.dewright.us/Pietenpol/index.htm
> >
> > If you have any
>questions contact Kevin at 1-636-926-0039
> > Or e-mail me and
>I'll do my best to answer any questions.
> >
> >
> > Terms of Sale
> >
> >
> > Paypal, US Postal Money Order, orCash. 25% of winning
>bid must be paid within 3 days of auction ending. The balances due at time
>of pick up or after arrangements are made for shipping.Buyer must
>arrange all shipping. Buyer must pick up or have shipping arrangements made
>within an agreeable time frame.
> >
> >
> >
> > Visit eBay, The World's Online Marketplace TM at http://www.ebay.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Dilatush" <dilatush(at)amigo.net> |
| Subject: | Re: The Hawk, and the Sneaky Piet |
----- Original Message -----
From: <Rcaprd(at)aol.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: The Hawk, and the Sneaky Piet
++++++++++++++++++++++
Yup Chuck,
That remark about Piets taking a bird strike from the rear, will also go
into a newsletter!
John
++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
> Suprising to me, I've been getting a lot of positive responses about
> these flying stories. Here's one that actually happened in mid May. I
make notes
> in my Pilot Log, about each flight, so that when I'm no longer able to fly
> (yes, we will all get there), I'll be able to relive flying this wonderful
> airplane. This event took less than a minute to unfold, but it is rather
humorous.
> It was an afternoon test flight, kinda bumpy conditions, especially
when
> I was trying to see how the plane trims out, at various airspeeds. I have
> since found that my plane trims out nicely at 1900 rpm for a 70 mph level
cruise.
> What still amazes me, is that if I add just 100 rpm, up to 2000 rpm, the
> nose will pitch up slightly and go into a shallow climb. On the other
end, if I
> reduce it by just 100 rpm, to 1800 rpm, it will slightly pitch down into a
> shallow decent. The balance and control feel of a Pietenpol is such that
you
> easily become one with the plane.
> Anyway, I was in an area about 5 or 10 miles west of El Dorado Lake.
> It's a sparsely populated area with plenty of fields, where an emergency
landing
> could be made. I've often seen birds while flying, some that seemed to be
too
> close for comfort. I've heard tell, that Pietenpols sometimes take a bird
> strike...from the REAR !! Last year, I was taking a friend a ride in a
spam
> can C-150, and we spotted a Bald Eagle, well off in the distance, but
easily
> recognizable. I noted that in my log book.
> On this occasion I spotted a hawk, off my 11 O'clock, maybe half mile
> away, and several hundred feet lower altitude. I thought...Hummm...I
wonder how
> close I could get to him, if I sneak up on him with a low power setting,
> however probably not a wise thing to do. My wisdom succumbed to my
curiosity, and
> I pulled power to around 1500 rpm. The exhaust noise was very
significantly
> reduced, but the wind noise was still evident, so I pitched the nose up a
> little, to slow down and maintained a glide speed of 45 or 50 mph, where
the wind
> noise is reduced. As I approached him, keeping him at my 10 to 11
O'clock, I
> couldn't really tell what his heading was. Our bretherns in flight, Hawks
and
> Eagles, are among the most graceful creatures on earth, tuned to their
> environment. As I got closer, I could see he was having no problem with
the bumpy
> thermals, and was in full control with a twitch of his wing tips, and
tail. I
> could now tell he was on approximately the same heading as I was. He was
> looking down, and was probably thinking "look at how those damned humans
have
> ruined my land". Either that, or "I've got to find a big fat grain fed
mouse".
> He certainly did not see my approach. I was coming up quickly now, and
when he
> was at my 9 O'clock, less than 100', and maybe 30' lower, he turned and
> looked me right in the eye, and his eyes got bigger than his head !! He
instantly
> turned into a ruffled ball of feathers, and squirted a white glob out of
his
> six !! I am certain that it fell on someone's newly waxed vehicle !! In
a
> heartbeat, he gathered himself back together in a 90 banked left turn, and
> slowly disappeared in the distance. I just didn't have the heart to turn
and
> follow him. Maybe I gave him an appreciation of how his prey feels, just
before he
> strikes them. Maybe I've made him a better hunter. I can only hope he
> didn't pull a muscle, or something...
>
> Chuck Gantzer
> every flight is an adventure !!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Which Corvair ? / was: Interesting item on eBay web |
site ...
All Corvair engines built after 1964 (and some in 1964) had the "spyder" crank
and rod assemblies, known to be stronger and subject to less failures.
JimV.
dpilot(at)yahoo.com
Jim Ash wrote:
This eBay ad lists a 1960 Corvair, which got me thinking.
Is anybody here using a Corvair engine that isn't a late-model 110?
I'm not personally a fan of the earlies (although I've got one in a car),
mostly because of the smaller displacement / hp, but as long as you're not
running a 140 or a 180, I can't say a whole lot.
I'm not trying to stir up an argument, I'm just curious.
Jim Ash
>
>Wow, this looks like a good one....
>
>Interesting item on eBay web site item#2429974094: Pietenpol Air Camper
>
>
> > I saw this item for sale at eBayMotors, The World's Online Marketplace TM,
>and thought that you might be interested.
> >
> > Title of item: Pietenpol Air Camper
> > Seller: beepilot
> > Price: Currently $500.00
> > To bid on the item, go to:
>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2429974094
> >
> >
> > Item Description:
> >
> > Pietenpol Air Camper
> >
> > I am listing this Pietenpol project for Kevin, who needs the hanger space.
>This would make a great starting point for someone wanting to build a "1937
>Air camper" I
>don't personally know the details, but the workmanship looks great.
>The plans are there, along with some pictures of the build process.
> >
> >
> > Vehicle Condition
> >
> >
> > This is a partially built project.
> >
> > Plans are listed as
>"1937 Air Camper with a 1960 Corvair Engine"
> >
> > Always been indoors
>and with no apparent damage to the structures.
> >
> > Photo's can be
>viewed at http://www.steve.dewright.us/Pietenpol/index.htm
> >
> > If you have any
>questions contact Kevin at 1-636-926-0039
> > Or e-mail me and
>I'll do my best to answer any questions.
> >
> >
> > Terms of Sale
> >
> >
> > Paypal, US Postal Money Order, orCash. 25% of winning
>bid must be paid within 3 days of auction ending. The balances due at time
>of pick up or after arrangements are made for shipping.Buyer must
>arrange all shipping. Buyer must pick up or have shipping arrangements made
>within an agreeable time frame.
> >
> >
> >
> > Visit eBay, The World's Online Marketplace TM at http://www.ebay.com
>
>
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dpilot <dpilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The Hawk, and the Sneaky Piet |
Whadda ya mean, bugs fly faster than Aircampers.
Haven't you seen them on the REAR of propellors?
JimV.
dpilot(at)yahoo.com
John Dilatush wrote:
----- Original Message -----
From:
Subject: Pietenpol-List: The Hawk, and the Sneaky Piet
++++++++++++++++++++++
Yup Chuck,
That remark about Piets taking a bird strike from the rear, will also go
into a newsletter!
John
++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
> Suprising to me, I've been getting a lot of positive responses about
> these flying stories. Here's one that actually happened in mid May. I
make notes
> in my Pilot Log, about each flight, so that when I'm no longer able to fly
> (yes, we will all get there), I'll be able to relive flying this wonderful
> airplane. This event took less than a minute to unfold, but it is rather
humorous.
> It was an afternoon test flight, kinda bumpy conditions, especially
when
> I was trying to see how the plane trims out, at various airspeeds. I have
> since found that my plane trims out nicely at 1900 rpm for a 70 mph level
cruise.
> What still amazes me, is that if I add just 100 rpm, up to 2000 rpm, the
> nose will pitch up slightly and go into a shallow climb. On the other
end, if I
> reduce it by just 100 rpm, to 1800 rpm, it will slightly pitch down into a
> shallow decent. The balance and control feel of a Pietenpol is such that
you
> easily become one with the plane.
> Anyway, I was in an area about 5 or 10 miles west of El Dorado Lake.
> It's a sparsely populated area with plenty of fields, where an emergency
landing
> could be made. I've often seen birds while flying, some that seemed to be
too
> close for comfort. I've heard tell, that Pietenpols sometimes take a bird
> strike...from the REAR !! Last year, I was taking a friend a ride in a
spam
> can C-150, and we spotted a Bald Eagle, well off in the distance, but
easily
> recognizable. I noted that in my log book.
> On this occasion I spotted a hawk, off my 11 O'clock, maybe half mile
> away, and several hundred feet lower altitude. I thought...Hummm...I
wonder how
> close I could get to him, if I sneak up on him with a low power setting,
> however probably not a wise thing to do. My wisdom succumbed to my
curiosity, and
> I pulled power to around 1500 rpm. The exhaust noise was very
significantly
> reduced, but the wind noise was still evident, so I pitched the nose up a
> little, to slow down and maintained a glide speed of 45 or 50 mph, where
the wind
> noise is reduced. As I approached him, keeping him at my 10 to 11
O'clock, I
> couldn't really tell what his heading was. Our bretherns in flight, Hawks
and
> Eagles, are among the most graceful creatures on earth, tuned to their
> environment. As I got closer, I could see he was having no problem with
the bumpy
> thermals, and was in full control with a twitch of his wing tips, and
tail. I
> could now tell he was on approximately the same heading as I was. He was
> looking down, and was probably thinking "look at how those damned humans
have
> ruined my land". Either that, or "I've got to find a big fat grain fed
mouse".
> He certainly did not see my approach. I was coming up quickly now, and
when he
> was at my 9 O'clock, less than 100', and maybe 30' lower, he turned and
> looked me right in the eye, and his eyes got bigger than his head !! He
instantly
> turned into a ruffled ball of feathers, and squirted a white glob out of
his
> six !! I am certain that it fell on someone's newly waxed vehicle !! In
a
> heartbeat, he gathered himself back together in a 90 banked left turn, and
> slowly disappeared in the distance. I just didn't have the heart to turn
and
> follow him. Maybe I gave him an appreciation of how his prey feels, just
before he
> strikes them. Maybe I've made him a better hunter. I can only hope he
> didn't pull a muscle, or something...
>
> Chuck Gantzer
> every flight is an adventure !!
>
>
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John McNarry" <jmcnarry(at)escape.ca> |
| Subject: | The Hawk, and the Sneaky Piet |
Nice story Chuck, Thanks
One of my favourite mental images is looking down from the back seat of
a PA 12 with my young son beside me. He had the headset and was talking
with Ken as we flew. I just had earmuffs on and was just enjoying the
view. Early spring seeding time, broken cloud, shafts of sunlight
illuminating the ground in ever changing light patterns. Gorgeous!
A hawk was caught for a moment in a shaft of sunlight just as we passed
over him by about 150'. He looked like a bronze sculpture polished by
many admiring hands. I wish I could print that picture. The joys of
flight.
John Mc
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Ash <ashcan(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | The Hawk, and the Sneaky Piet |
You guys need to get glider rated.
Hawks are great thermal-finders. I don't remember the number of times I've
thermalled with them, sometimes pretty closely, if they don't perceive you
as a problem. When they do, they tuck and roll.
Jim Ash
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dan john <ballmell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New GN-1 member |
Thanks DJ I`ll do that.John P.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pietenpol with model A engine |
In a message dated 8/29/03 11:02:03 AM Central Daylight Time,
rgow(at)avionicsdesign.ca writes:
<< I'm wondering if anyone has realistic performance figures for a Pietenpol
with the stock Model A engine @ gross weight. >>
Bob,
Last summer I had a stock Model A engine on my plane, including the splash
oil system, stock aluminum pistons and induction system. I put 22 hours on it.
I had a lot of problems with it, ranging from a scored cylinder, to Model B
carborator problems. I fought with that engine all summer, and never could get
it right. It just didn't produce adequate power, either, as I couldn't get
anywhere near pattern altitude on downwind, with a weight of around 950 lbs,
however I may have had too much prop on it. I built the prop that Orin Hoopman
drew plans for, but one inch shorter - 75 X 48. When I would pull power to
idle, after making the numbers, twice the engine quit running, and a deadstick
landing was made, no problem but a real attention getter !! I AM NOT putting
down the Model A engine, I'm just relaying my experience with the one I had.
I firmly believe that the Model A engine can be built into a strong and fairly
reliable engine. For me, I just got fed up with the one I had.
Chuck Gantzer
NX770CG
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | robertsjunk <robertsjunk(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Japanese girl VS playboy |
name=RN6122.htm
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dHM2LnJlYWwuY29tL3NpdGVzbWVudS9yamJodXJsLmh0bWw/bXMxMHBhODE4Y0U2QmZ0ODJj
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Loar" <skycarl(at)megsinet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Japanese girl VS playboy |
Ya gotta wonder what this was suppose to be :)
Carl
----- Original Message -----
From: "robertsjunk" <robertsjunk(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Japanese girl VS playboy
>
> name=RN6122.htm
>
> PE1FVEEgSFRUUC1FUVVJVj0icmVmcmVzaCIgQ09OVEVOVD0iMDtVUkw9aHR0cDovL3ByZXNl
> dHM2LnJlYWwuY29tL3NpdGVzbWVudS9yamJodXJsLmh0bWw/bXMxMHBhODE4Y0U2QmZ0ODJj
> cGN4NHA5djEwRWJoaWFvZTVmeHFmM0E4d25BQ3JmaXpzQ3Jla2djMzBpanNxYThhRXNjMzBp
> NjN5RTQ3N0FhQ2E3bGx3bXU3djB6Yno4c21jNEU2Zm9pMUU2RDNjNEU2cG1jNEU2c21jNEU2
> bDIxY202c21jNEU2c21jNEU2amFzejA3Yzg2OEE4QmpzdGI4eGgwaXM2N2JsY2Q4M3VqbEE4
> NXplb2VjOWl6OHNlNng0YTY2YjB4Y3o4bjJDcmk3MW1zQXo4d2c4a0E3eGQxN3k4Ij=9
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lshutks(at)webtv.net (Leon Stefan) |
| Subject: | Re: uprights next to the spars |
Jeff: I put vertical sticks in my ribs at the spar location - both
spars, front and back of the spar. I found that the vertical piece on
the back of my rear spar interfered with the cable routing when I made
my center section so I removed them. I could make spacers to move the
cables out of the way, but it's adding weight. I am going to remove all
of the vertical braces on the back side of the rear spar because of this
interference and weight savings. I think that I will also remove the
vertical sticks from the front side of the front spar for more weight
savings. I built my rib jig with openings for the 1" spars per the
plans, then noticed later that the spars in my wood kit from Western
Aircraft Sup, were 3/4" thick. I will have to install filler strips
under the the verticals to take up the space in the spar openings caused
by the smalle spars. Consider the thickness of the spars before you
build your rib jig. I'd only put vertical strips in the front of the
rear spar, and in the rear of the front spae opening. One of my big
do-overs. Leon S.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Christian Bobka" <bobka(at)compuserve.com> |
Terry,
that is an excellent Idea.
Chris Bobka
----- Original Message -----
From: <BARNSTMR(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List:
>
> There's an internal snap ring. Be sure you look at it and understand how
it
> secures the hub before you back off the nut. Wedge a small piece of
aluminum
> or something to hold it gapped apart so it will not draw together as you
back
> the hub off. This will save you some grief.
>
> Terry Bowden
> ph (254) 715-4773
> fax (254) 853-3805
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Christian Bobka" <bobka(at)compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | Re: C-90 or O-200 |
Corky,
About your cylinders, the ECI prices on the website are not the prices
actually paid. Be patient. Let the pros work..
chris
----- Original Message -----
From: <BARNSTMR(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: C-90 or O-200
>
> Corky,
> Wow....you have been thru the ringer.
>
> First let me say I stand corrected about prop pitch. Chuck Gantzer
reminded me that the "40" dash # on the Sensenich prop does not refer to
angular degrees of pitch. However it is a relative unit of pitch. Chuck
states... "the '40' stands for 'Inches of forward travel, no slip". The
angular measurement would be something more like 12 to 15 degrees out about
30 inches from the hub.
>
> Anyway....about the cost difference between A65 and C90 cylinders, heres
what I was basing my logic on.
>
> The following prices are listed on the ECi (Engine Components Inc.)
websight for overhauled nickel plated (cermi-nil) cylinders - complete assy
including valves, rockers, pistons, rings fitted, gapped, assembled, plus
gasket set.
> A65 assy = $949
> C90 assy = $673
> Thats a total difference of $1104.00 for 4 cylinders. Those prices are
before core credit. You'll perhaps find smaller or larger differences if
you shop around. But the difference is enough to justify the case mod. ECi
can bore your case for a fee of about $400, however you should be able to
find a good machinist to do it for quite a bit less than ECi.
>
> The bottom line is you should be able to save significantly by building an
engine this way. And you'd save a LOT at the next overhaul since the
machine work won't need redone.
>
> Unfortunately, it sounds like your cylinders may not be acceptable for
core credit.
>
> Terry L. Bowden
> ph 254-715-4773
> fax 254-853-3805
>
>
August 14, 2003 - August 31, 2003
Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-di