Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-fp
January 11, 2007 - January 30, 2007
Skip Gadd
csfog(at)earthlink.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Skip-Cinda Gadd" <csfog(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Ohio piets planning on brodhead |
Shad,
I am going to try and fly Felix the GN-1 to Brodhead this summer. I live about
an hour, Piet time, southeast of Columbus Ohio in West Virginia.
Skip
----- Original Message -----
From: shad bell
Just wondering who plans on flying up to Brodhead from Ohio or surrounding states.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <harvey.rule(at)bell.ca> |
I had mentioned in a letter that I was using 90 mineral oil.Correct that
to be 80 mineral oil;used to work in an engine when new parts are
installed or if engine is new.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Making Rib Gussets |
| From: | "Bill Church" <eng(at)canadianrogers.com> |
You're right, Glenn,
That's the way I did my gussets. Most of my gussets are made with 2"
diameter discs, which are then cut into halves or quarters.
Here's a link to the round gussets and sanding
http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/buildLogReportDetail.cfm?BuildLogID=115
3&PlaneID=510&FName=Bill&LName=Church&PlaneName=Air%20Camper
I did also use some rectangular gussets (1" x 2 3/4") in my ribs - at
three locations - the leading edge, at the rear spar, and at the
trailing edge
http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/buildLogReportDetail.cfm?BuildLogID=115
7&PlaneID=510&FName=Bill&LName=Church&PlaneName=Air%20Camper
Bill C
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Ohio piets planning on brodhead |
Skip, Which day will you be flying up? Dad and I took turns last year flying
and driving the "chase truck". He was in Delaware Ohio, but moved it up to
my place in Centerburg OH. Stay in touch and we can try to meet up along the
way. US RT 30 is a great route to follow all the way to the south edge of ORD
class B then up the western side toward Rockford ILL. Centerburg might even
be on your way to Brodhead with out going out of the way.
Shad
I am going to try and fly Felix the GN-1 to Brodhead this summer. I live about
an hour, Piet time, southeast of Columbus Ohio in West Virginia.
Skip
---------------------------------
Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask your question
on Yahoo! Answers.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Center section butt rib location |
I can't picture the fittings perfectly in my minds eye, but I think the space is
to conceal the wing attatch fittings between the C-section and outter wing pannel.
Look at the plans, if the outter wing pannel to c-section bolts are inside
of the rib outline then that is why you will need the space between the but
ribs, to get the bolts in.
Greg Bacon wrote: Does anyone know if a significant
reason the butt rib on the center section is 1-7/8 inch from the end of the
spar while the butt rib on the wing is only 1/2 inch from the end of it's spar?
It looks as though the butt rib could be closer to the end of the CS spar
without causing any major problem. However, I might be failing to see potential/operational
problems.
I would like to have the butt ribs on the CS as far apart as possible to allow
for a wider arc cut-out (instead of the flop). I'm rebuilding Mtn Piet's CS
a little wider, like Bill Rewey's bird.
Thanks,
Greg Bacon
Prairie Home, MO
P.S. For the age survey, I'm 39 with only 16 days until 40!
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
Corky,
Don't forget to pack your long johns and some of those instant heat
packets too keep your equipment from freezing up:) Bet its been a long
time since
you wrote your name in the snow, so being in the cold is sometimes fun.
At least you don't have to dot the I like in my name. Talk about a
challenge.
Glad to hear you called off the Fargo trip until they get some
less-brutal temperatures. I see they are calling for sub-zero lows and
single digits for this
weekend when you would have been there.
The Yankee Boy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Isablcorky(at)aol.com |
Hey Yankee Boy,
Isabelle dug up my johns so I might be ready. About the autograph, you're
right it has been a long time. Once I peed all over Indiana, no problem but once
in Korea we woke in our bunker to -45 and when I went it was like ice cream
salt hitting the ground. Now yankee boy, top that one
The Reb
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
Wow Corky, I can't top that one, brother. Reminds me of the old joke
where one dad is pissed because a neighbor boy kept writing his
name in the snow in this guys yard and the father of the boy told the
other father and he said "yeah, he shouldn't be doing that but did you
notice that it is in your daughter's handwriting ??"
The Yankee Boy
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Ride with these Mustangs at Oshkosh |
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
Excellent video. I'd give my left one to ride with these guys....
Mike C.
http://airshowbuzz.com/videos/index.php?id=2
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "walt evans" <waltdak(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: tenpol-List:OIL |
What does the 90 and 80 represent? Hopefully it's not viscosity.
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: harvey.rule(at)bell.ca
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2007 8:40 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List:OIL
I had mentioned in a letter that I was using 90 mineral oil.Correct
that to be 80 mineral oil;used to work in an engine when new parts are
installed or if engine is new.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Thomas" <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com> |
Corky,
Just curious, where were you in Korea? I was at Osan AB for 8 years. Things have
changed quite a bit between our 2 tours. Funny that we still have a presence
there. Kind of makes you wonder how much longer we'll be in Iraq.
--------
Glenn Thomas
N?????
http://www.flyingwood.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=86971#86971
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Isablcorky(at)aol.com |
I'm topped
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gardiner Mason" <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
Is there a good way to bend the 1/16 plywood around rhe leading edge? I
am thinking about glueing and tacking the bottom edge and glueing to
the bottom of the ribs. When this dries then I start wetting down around
the leading edge to make the bend, and then I glue and tack the top. Has
anyone tried this, or is there any other better way? Thanks, Gardiner
Mason in Atlanta , Ga.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "walt evans" <waltdak(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Ride with these Mustangs at Oshkosh |
Kind of takes me back. My flight instructor in the 60's was a P51 pilot
in the south Pacific in WWll. It's the old thing about how the young
thinks about the old these days. They are just babbling old turds that
had no idea.
Remember me asking about his old plane, and he said that another guy had
taken it. Said that the enemy had "run up his ass and got him"
means alot more to me now.
Got old pics of him in his P51, P39, and something else. His wife was
named Ruth. So it was Ruth-less 1,2,3,4
As you get older,,,the more you know,,the less you know,,,,,wow
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2007 3:37 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Ride with these Mustangs at Oshkosh
Excellent video. I'd give my left one to ride with these guys....
Mike C.
http://airshowbuzz.com/videos/index.php?id=2
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au> |
Gardner,
I bent my ply around a 1 inch steel tube first. I wet the ply and gradually
tightened the clamps until the ply was almost bent in half. We the ply was
formed I glued it to the wing. I used trailer tie down straps and staples to
hold everything in place until the glue dried. If I were to do it again I
would used a long piece of timber under the tie down strap along the leading
edge. This would stop some indentations along the leading edge caused by
uneven tension in the straps. Check out HYPERLINK
"http://www.cpc-world.com/"http://www.cpc-world.com. Go to Airframe
Construction > Wings > Outer Sections. There are some more pictures on Page
9 in the build photos section.
Hope that helps.
Peter
Wonthaggi Australia
HYPERLINK "http://www.cpc-world.com/"http://www.cpc-world.com
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gardiner
Mason
Sent: Friday, 12 January 2007 10:37 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: bending wood
Is there a good way to bend the 1/16 plywood around rhe leading edge? I am
thinking about glueing and tacking the bottom edge and glueing to the
bottom of the ribs. When this dries then I start wetting down around the
leading edge to make the bend, and then I glue and tack the top. Has anyone
tried this, or is there any other better way? Thanks, Gardiner Mason in
Atlanta , Ga.
"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List"http://www.matronics.com/
Navigator?Pietenpol-List
2:52 PM
--
2:52 PM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Rice <rice(at)iapdatacom.net> |
The conventional wisdom I always heard is to use mild steel welding rod,
as the flame from the torch always adds some carbon even when it's
neutral, and 4130 + carbon is too brittle. I don't know for sure if
that's technically correct, but I've been up in a lot of airplanes
welded with mild steel rod and I'm still here to talk about it. I use
RG45 myself.
Larry the micro Mong guy
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gardiner Mason" <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: bending wood |
Peter, Thanks for the feedback,but in my case I don,t thing the straps
will work. My center section-like yours- is the fuel tank closed up. I
am only putting wood on that section- the wings have a metal leading
edge and I used clamping straps which worked well. You do beautiful
work, and I hope mine turns out pretty good. My center section will hold
about 17 gallons feeding down to a 3 gallon header tank. WM Wynne is
finishing my engine,but I did all the prep work. I don,t have a problem
with all the wood work, but I had to cut all the metal pieces by hand
and learn how to gas weld myself. I could go on and on so thanks for
your help. All your pictures are a big help. I started my project in
March 05, and hope to have it finished in the fall. Gardiner Mason,
Atlanta, Ga. USA
----- Original Message -----
From: Peter W Johnson
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2007 7:16 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: bending wood
Gardner,
I bent my ply around a 1 inch steel tube first. I wet the ply and
gradually tightened the clamps until the ply was almost bent in half. We
the ply was formed I glued it to the wing. I used trailer tie down
straps and staples to hold everything in place until the glue dried. If
I were to do it again I would used a long piece of timber under the tie
down strap along the leading edge. This would stop some indentations
along the leading edge caused by uneven tension in the straps. Check out
http://www.cpc-world.com. Go to Airframe Construction > Wings > Outer
Sections. There are some more pictures on Page 9 in the build photos
section.
Hope that helps.
Peter
Wonthaggi Australia
http://www.cpc-world.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gardiner
Mason
Sent: Friday, 12 January 2007 10:37 AM
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: bending wood
Is there a good way to bend the 1/16 plywood around rhe leading edge?
I am thinking about glueing and tacking the bottom edge and glueing to
the bottom of the ribs. When this dries then I start wetting down around
the leading edge to make the bend, and then I glue and tack the top. Has
anyone tried this, or is there any other better way? Thanks, Gardiner
Mason in Atlanta , Ga.
-- Date: 10/01/2007 2:52 PM
--
10/01/2007 2:52 PM
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
1/10/2007
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: bending wood |
In a message dated 1/11/2007 5:39:31 PM Central Standard Time,
airlion(at)bellsouth.net writes:
When this dries then I start wetting down around the leading edge to make the
bend, and then I glue and tack the top. Has anyone tried this, or is there
any other better way?
Gardiner,
The best way is according to the plans - no need to bend the plywood around
the leading edge. It only goes on the top. Overlap the top of the leading
edge with the forward edge of the 1/16, but not around the L. E. radius. Then
blend in (sand) the top of the plywood with the leading edge.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Whaley" <MerlinFAC(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: bending wood |
>> Is there a good way to bend the 1/16 plywood around rhe leading edge?
>> I am thinking about glueing and tacking the bottom edge and glueing to
>> the bottom of the ribs. When this dries then I start wetting down around
>> the leading edge to make the bend, and then I glue and tack the top.
>> Has anyone tried this, or is there any other better way? Thanks,
>> Gardiner Mason in Atlanta , Ga.
Steen Aero Lab makes 1/16" vacuum-formed laminated plywood leading edges
that might work for you with a little adaptation. They're VERY popular with
the acro bipe crowd nowadays. Check out www.steenaero.com (look in the
products section and in the online store.) Steen can do custom work on
these, it's usually just a matter of how the pieces are trimmed and laid
into the mold.
The Obligatory Disclaimer: I work for Steen... but I thought this would be
of interest to this discussion.
-Mike
Mike Whaley merlin@ov-10bronco.net
Webmaster, OV-10 Bronco Association
http://www.ov-10bronco.net/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HelsperSew(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: bending wood |
Gardiner,
I did not pre-bend my 1/16" ply. It is not necessary to go under the wing,
only on top. It only adds that extra "dreaded" weight anyway. I undercut
(with a router) the 1/16" depth into the leading edge spruce piece, giving you
a small "ledge" to nest the starting edge into, and provide a solid nailing
surface. I did this by clamping a straight 1 x 4 to the top of the ribs, to
use as a straight edge, so I would have something to guide the router. After
this operation, you have a nice starting point for the edge of the plywood.
It "nests" into the leading edge down flush, so that no sanding or
feathering is needed. I began by glueing and nailing all along the starting edge
(only do 8' length at a time). Just nail it down, from front to back, back and
forth along the length, bending it back and nailing as you go along. I would
suggest pre-starting your nails before mixing the glue. There are alot of
nails to drive. I was very happy with the way mine came out. Think ahead about
creating a nailing suface at the end of the operation, betwen the ribs,
where it will end over the spar. I added some small strips of spruce in between
the ribs so that this edge of the plywood would not "oil can" or pull down
when the fabric is applied. This was one of the most fun and satisfying parts
of the project for me. The toughest and most time consuming/frustrating
parts of building for me was the straight axle landing gear. Praise the Lord
I
have finally finished this, and my Piet will at long last be standing on its
own gear by the end of this weekend. Also, here is a good idea for holding
those small gosh darn nails so you can drive them straight. Use a cheap wire
stripper pliers, the kind with the little searations in the jaws. The little
nails fit in the searations of the jaws, and it makes it very easy to hold
the nails for driving. Hope all this helps.
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <harvey.rule(at)bell.ca> |
I believe the number refers to weight;not sure.I just do as I'm told and
my AME said use this stuff to work the engine in.
________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of walt
evans
Sent: January 11, 2007 4:15 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List:OIL
What does the 90 and 80 represent? Hopefully it's not viscosity.
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: harvey.rule(at)bell.ca
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2007 8:40 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List:OIL
I had mentioned in a letter that I was using 90 mineral
oil.Correct that to be 80 mineral oil;used to work in an engine when new
parts are installed or if engine is new.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat
r
onics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joseph Czaplicki" <fishin3(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | help from nawthrurn |
Corky, Besides preparing yourself for the arctic trek, don't forget to have all
the necessary survival gear packed away in the corner of your vehicle. Blankets,
extra cloths, food rations, jumper cables, shovel, kiddie litter for traction
etc. You should remember from your early days up in Wisc. And most important,
your vehicle itself. Be sure your radiator is protected for the minus double
digit temps that you're heading into. Chances are that Cajun auto protection
temps are nowhere near what you'll be needing.
Good luck for a safe trip up nawth and back.
JoeC in the NE corner of IL counting the days till spring 22498 & 94634
From: Isablcorky(at)aol.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Help from Nawthurn Pieters
Nawthurn and upper mid-western Pieters,
Joseph Czaplicki
fishin3(at)earthlink.net
EarthLink Revolves Around You.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Shawn Wolk" <shawnwolk(at)can.rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Not Flying today! |
Hello Group,
Just for info, and so you all don't believe that I've lost it. It's
-37 C (-35F) here on Winnipeg this morning. And I will NOT go flying on
skis today. I'll bet at this temperature the oil could be sliced like
sandwich meat.
Shawn Wolk
C-FRAZ
Winnipeg MB Canada
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Nawthurn Pieters |
| From: | "Dan Loegering" <danl(at)odayequipment.com> |
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
Pietenpol-List Digest Server
Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 1:57 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List Digest: 25 Msgs - 01/11/07
*
=================================================
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===============================================
Corky,
Crosswinds and lightly loaded trailers are not a good combination for the roads
around here right now, but I wouldn't let that deter you from making the trip
up to sample our lovely weather this time of year. When Ken mentioned that you
were heading this way this week, I hoped you realized what you were running
into. Glad to see that you still have your "johns" - you'll need 'em!
Hopefully you will get a chance to swing by and check out the projects - currently
both fuselages are in my garage and we are getting close to the point of joining
the fuse sides. Was out there working last night with the heaters on and
a thought dawned on me as I was watching frost form on the windows. I had
the inside temp up to about 60 Deg, and the outside temp was somewhere around
13 below... not too bad a temp differential! Granted it took two hours just to
get it that warm and when the wife came home all that heat disappeared in about
20 seconds when she opened the garage door. But such are the challenges of
building in North Dakota. If we wait a month, it will be back in the 20's -
30's and life will be good again! ;-)
And now a question for all - since T-88 has a lower temp limit of 50 deg during
cure, what adverse effects will happen if during the cure time, the temperature
dips significantly below that point? Is the cure just slowed down and will
it develop full strength if I warm the joints. Usually at the end of a build
session, I usually shut down the heaters and the garage maintains it's temp long
enough for the glue to cure up fully before the temp has dropped significantly.
But if one of the garage doors is opened and a cold soaked car is moved
in there when the OAT is -13, it tends to get pretty cold pretty quickly...
I checked my joints this morning (garage temp = 30 deg, OAT = -11) and they had
set, but were still soft. I will kick the heat on again this evening and warm
everything up to around 60 again and hope for the best.
Dan Loegering
Fargo, ND
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Holland" <at7000ft(at)gmail.com> |
Several 'experts' at Oshkosh recommend ER80S-D2. A welder from the company
that makes the Legend Cub was welding one of their fuselages at SNF last
year for a demo. He was using ER70S-2 and said their was no reason to use
the more expensive ER80S-D2.
Other info gathered from welding experts (many PhD metallurgists):
- 80% say copper coated rod is fine, 20% say the copper contaminates the
weld and you will surely die.
- 50% say you don't have to stress relieve welds, 50% say you must or you
will die (interestingly enough the experts from the big companies that sell
tig welders all say you don't need to stress relieve)
- in case you ever wondered if you need to remove all that thin black
coating from 4130 tubing before welding, the guy from Legend Cub never
removes any of it, and they are FAA certified. But you will find plenty of
experts that will tell you that you will die if even a single molecule of
that stuff gets in your weld. Don't know if I will keep cleaning that stuff
off or not.
Rick
On 1/11/07, Larry Rice wrote:
>
>
> The conventional wisdom I always heard is to use mild steel welding rod,
> as the flame from the torch always adds some carbon even when it's
> neutral, and 4130 + carbon is too brittle. I don't know for sure if
> that's technically correct, but I've been up in a lot of airplanes
> welded with mild steel rod and I'm still here to talk about it. I use
> RG45 myself.
>
> Larry the micro Mong guy
>
>
> --
>
>
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Holland" <at7000ft(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: bending wood |
I also pre-bent my leading edge ply Gardiner (see attached picture). Soaked
it in a bath tub, stood it on edge then clamped the front 1 1/2" inch
between an angle and a 1 x 2 then bent the rest over 90 degrees and let it
dry. The fit was very close, when I glued it on I held it on with 5/16"
staples over plastic strips for easy removal.
Rick
On 1/11/07, Gardiner Mason wrote:
>
> Is there a good way to bend the 1/16 plywood around rhe leading edge? I
> am thinking about glueing and tacking the bottom edge and glueing to the
> bottom of the ribs. When this dries then I start wetting down around the
> leading edge to make the bend, and then I glue and tack the top. Has anyone
> tried this, or is there any other better way? Thanks, Gardiner Mason in
> Atlanta , Ga.
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Nawthurn Pieters |
Dan wrote-
>I checked my joints this morning (garage temp = 30 deg, OAT = -11) and
>they had set, but were still soft.
Yeah, I know what you mean. It gets that cold and MY joints set, too ;o)
We have what's called Southern Comfort for that condition. It continues to
work very well on your joints even well below 50 degrees, especially the
black label version.
And so this post isn't considered totally useless, I've uploaded a photo of
the tailwheel hold-down release that I just made, using the idea from the
"Craftsman's Corner" article with a few modifications. It is not yet flight
tested, but will be soon. It's at
http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/P1120002.JPG . It does not yet have the
trip cord attached; probably a length of nylon "parachute cord" will run
from the split ring on the release pin, up to the cockpit.
Oscar Zuniga, in warm south Texas
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
Type your favorite song. Get a customized station. Try MSN Radio powered
by Pandora. http://radio.msn.com/?icid=T002MSN03A07001
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
Rick-- most everything I referenced said that the proper filler rod for
4130N (normalized condition) was was you said the Legend Cub guys are
using, AWS ER70S-2. Anything with a nice low carbon content around
0.06% carbon is good. I used 316 s/s rod which has a 0.3% carbon
content. Some poo-poo stainless but low carbon is a big factor to
crack-free 4130 welds. (plus a myriad of other factors like
pre-heating and cool
down practices. For some straight talk on welding look (once again I
preach the word of Homebuilding according to the Book of Bingelis) at
the Tony Bingelis books.
One of the main things (and I found out by some sloppy cleaning habits
early on) is to remove the oils from your 4130 before you try to weld.
I had to backup and punt making my motor mount because I didn't clean
out the INSIDE of the tubing and boy, does that oil like to come to
the surface and bubble up thru your nice melted filler material and
cause a beautiful Swiss cheese effect. MEK to the rescue.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alan Lyscars" <alyscars(at)maine.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nawthurn Pieters |
Nice work Oscar!
Al in Maine
> And so this post isn't considered totally useless, I've uploaded a photo
of
> the tailwheel hold-down release that I just made, using the idea from the
> "Craftsman's Corner" article with a few modifications. It is not yet
flight
> tested, but will be soon. It's at
> http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/P1120002.JPG . It does not yet have the
> trip cord attached; probably a length of nylon "parachute cord" will run
> from the split ring on the release pin, up to the cockpit.
>
> Oscar Zuniga, in warm south Texas
> San Antonio, TX
> mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
> website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Type your favorite song. Get a customized station. Try MSN Radio powered
> by Pandora. http://radio.msn.com/?icid=T002MSN03A07001
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Holland" <at7000ft(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: filler for 4130 |
Correct Mike. I started off using ER80S-D2 (which is .09% C) based on some
experts suggestions at Oshkosh. But since talking to the Legend Cub guys and
more research I have stayed with the ER70S-2 at .06% Carbon (and its cheaper
too).
Rick
On 1/12/07, Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC] wrote:
>
>
> Rick-- most everything I referenced said that the proper filler rod for
> 4130N (normalized condition) was was you said the Legend Cub guys are
> using, AWS ER70S-2. Anything with a nice low carbon content around
> 0.06% carbon is good. I used 316 s/s rod which has a 0.3% carbon
> content. Some poo-poo stainless but low carbon is a big factor to
> crack-free 4130 welds. (plus a myriad of other factors like pre-heating
> and cool
> down practices. For some straight talk on welding look (once again I
> preach the word of Homebuilding according to the Book of Bingelis) at
> the Tony Bingelis books.
>
> One of the main things (and I found out by some sloppy cleaning habits
> early on) is to remove the oils from your 4130 before you try to weld.
> I had to backup and punt making my motor mount because I didn't clean out
> the INSIDE of the tubing and boy, does that oil like to come to
> the surface and bubble up thru your nice melted filler material and cause
> a beautiful Swiss cheese effect. MEK to the rescue.
>
> Mike C.
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dale Johnson" <ddjohn(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: bending wood |
Mike
The 1/16 plywood goes from the center of the front spar to 1/2 " overlap on
the
leading edge. It's about a 9" strip of 1/16 plywood. After gluing sand it
down to feather it in with the
leading edge.No wetting no bending required.
Dale
> [Original Message]
> From: Mike Whaley <MerlinFAC(at)cfl.rr.com>
> To:
> Date: 1/12/2007 12:20:05 AM
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: bending wood
>
>
> >> Is there a good way to bend the 1/16 plywood around rhe leading edge?
> >> I am thinking about glueing and tacking the bottom edge and glueing to
> >> the bottom of the ribs. When this dries then I start wetting down
around
> >> the leading edge to make the bend, and then I glue and tack the top.
> >> Has anyone tried this, or is there any other better way? Thanks,
> >> Gardiner Mason in Atlanta , Ga.
>
> Steen Aero Lab makes 1/16" vacuum-formed laminated plywood leading edges
> that might work for you with a little adaptation. They're VERY popular
with
> the acro bipe crowd nowadays. Check out www.steenaero.com (look in the
> products section and in the online store.) Steen can do custom work on
> these, it's usually just a matter of how the pieces are trimmed and laid
> into the mold.
>
> The Obligatory Disclaimer: I work for Steen... but I thought this would be
> of interest to this discussion.
>
> -Mike
>
> Mike Whaley merlin@ov-10bronco.net
> Webmaster, OV-10 Bronco Association
> http://www.ov-10bronco.net/
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Willis <timothywillis(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Nawthurn Pieters |
Beautiful, Oscar. Thanks for the pic. Used some Bridgeport time?
Tim in central TX
-----Original Message-----
>From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
>Sent: Jan 12, 2007 2:26 PM
>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Nawthurn Pieters
>
>
>Dan wrote-
>
>>I checked my joints this morning (garage temp = 30 deg, OAT = -11) and
>>they had set, but were still soft.
>
>Yeah, I know what you mean. It gets that cold and MY joints set, too ;o)
>We have what's called Southern Comfort for that condition. It continues to
>work very well on your joints even well below 50 degrees, especially the
>black label version.
>
>And so this post isn't considered totally useless, I've uploaded a photo of
>the tailwheel hold-down release that I just made, using the idea from the
>"Craftsman's Corner" article with a few modifications. It is not yet flight
>tested, but will be soon. It's at
>http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/P1120002.JPG . It does not yet have the
>trip cord attached; probably a length of nylon "parachute cord" will run
>from the split ring on the release pin, up to the cockpit.
>
>Oscar Zuniga, in warm south Texas
>San Antonio, TX
>mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
>website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Type your favorite song. Get a customized station. Try MSN Radio powered
>by Pandora. http://radio.msn.com/?icid=T002MSN03A07001
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Bacon" <gbacon67(at)hughes.net> |
| Subject: | Re: bending wood |
John Dilatush has a really nice method for attaching the ply to the leading
edge. He router cut the leading edge 1/16"th by 1/4". Attached is a quick
sketch to show the detail. I used some scrap to get the angle right. This
gives a 1/4" gluing surface to the leading edge without any bending around
the leading edge.
Greg Bacon
Prairie Home, MO
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dale Johnson" <ddjohn(at)earthlink.net>
Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 4:42 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: bending wood
>
>
> Mike
> The 1/16 plywood goes from the center of the front spar to 1/2 " overlap
> on
> the
> leading edge. It's about a 9" strip of 1/16 plywood. After gluing sand it
> down to feather it in with the
> leading edge.No wetting no bending required.
> Dale
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Rice <rice(at)iapdatacom.net> |
I know guys who use 1/16, others who claim they get more control with
3/32, whatever workd for you. I think it's supposed to vary with the
wall thickness of what you're welding, and should be pretty close to the
same.
Larry the micro mong guy
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Thomas" <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com> |
Rick,
That post was hillarious. Too bad there is such variance in data on such an important
topic.
Thanks
--------
Glenn Thomas
N?????
http://www.flyingwood.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=87195#87195
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Interesting Info on leading edge sheeting |
Hello Group, Just passing on some 2nd hand knowlage about leading edges that might
be of interest to some Pieters. Was told by Stan McLeod (I think it was)
designer of the Cavilier series of aircraft, That for the most efficiant wing
the leading edge sheeting should go back to the thickest part of the wing on
top. This will help keep that ridge where the fabric pulls in aft of the sheeting
from forming. Even most factory built aircraft covered with fabric have
a visible bump or edge all the way down the top of the wing spanwise where the
fabric "bellies" down between the ribs aft of the sheeting. One solution to
this (as I was told) is to take your ply back to the thickest part of the camber,
and scallop the ply in a radius a litle bigger than the rib spacing if you
want to save some weight. In theroy this will keep the airfoil of the covered
wing much closer to the shape of the ribs. Don't hold me to this, like I
said it 2nd hand info, but it makes perfect sense
to me. And by more efficiant that means less drag, more lift and more speed (even
though speed is not the issue for a piet). I will be trying this on my Jungster
1 biplane. One question, Does anyone on the list have any experiance
with gluing fabric to rip capstrips in place of stitching. I know some of you
will say NO!!! YOU HAVE TO STITCH, but any way that is how this airplane was
designed, what fabric cement would you recomend?
Shad
---------------------------------
The fish are biting.
Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | tail tiedown release |
To answer questions from several who asked about the tiedown release, the
rough machine work was done by friend and KR builder extraordinaire Mark
Langford in Alabama. Mark bought a mill and some other shop tools from Carl
Vought's widow and this was his first little project on the mill. It's made
of a hunk of aluminum scrap milled to rough shape. He also drilled the
guide holes for the release pin and formed the pin from a 5/16" carriage
bolt that was in the shop. Plans called for a 1/4" pin, but you use what
you have.
I finish-shaped the piece, rounded the edges, chamfered the holes, found a
spring for it, and assembled it. There are a few things that could be done
differently to make it a little better, but this one seems to work just fine
as-is. Time will tell.
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
Your Hotmail address already works to sign into Windows Live Messenger! Get
it now
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HVandervoo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: skydiving the next generation? |
Check this out
_http://jet-man.com/actuel.html_ (http://jet-man.com/actuel.html)
Hans
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KMHeide <kmheidecpo(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Interesting Info on leading edge sheeting |
Shad,
I understand your description of the trailing edge of the leading edge material
creating a "step down" of fabric. However, I have learned from other builders
outside the Pietenpol ring they have used a piece of flexible material to blend
in and hide the transition when fabric is applied and shrunk. I can't recall
what they were using, but on many aircraft that have a leading edge wrap,
filler material was utilized and no sign of any transition step was ever noticed.
shad bell wrote:
Hello Group, Just passing on some 2nd hand knowlage about leading edges that
might be of interest to some Pieters. Was told by Stan McLeod (I think it
was) designer of the Cavilier series of aircraft, That for the most efficiant
wing the leading edge sheeting should go back to the thickest part of the wing
on top. This will help keep that ridge where the fabric pulls in aft of the
sheeting from forming. Even most factory built aircraft covered with fabric
have a visible bump or edge all the way down the top of the wing spanwise where
the fabric "bellies" down between the ribs aft of the sheeting. One solution
to this (as I was told) is to take your ply back to the thickest part of the
camber, and scallop the ply in a radius a litle bigger than the rib spacing
if you want to save some weight. In theroy this will keep the airfoil of the
covered wing much closer to the shape of the ribs. Don't hold me to this, like
I said it 2nd hand info, but it makes perfect
sense to me. And by more efficiant that means less drag, more lift and more speed
(even though speed is not the issue for a piet). I will be trying this on
my Jungster 1 biplane. One question, Does anyone on the list have any experiance
with gluing fabric to rip capstrips in place of stitching. I know some
of you will say NO!!! YOU HAVE TO STITCH, but any way that is how this airplane
was designed, what fabric cement would you recomend?
Shad
---------------------------------
The fish are biting.
Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing.
---------------------------------
Get your own web address.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KMHeide <kmheidecpo(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | A response to having a flyin.. |
YAHOO.Shortcuts.hasSensitiveText = true; YAHOO.Shortcuts.doUlt = false; YAHOO.Shortcuts.location
= "us"; YAHOO.Shortcuts.lang = "us"; YAHOO.Shortcuts.annotationSet
= { lw_1168663128_0: { text: 'Arlington', weight: 0.835352, type: ['shortcuts:/us/instance/place/ambiguous']
, metaData: [ { geoArea: "249.207",
geoCountry: "United States", geoCounty: "Tarrant", geoIsoCountryCode: "US", geoLocation:
"(-97.107872, 32.735119)", geoName: "Arlington", geoPlaceType: "Town",
geoState: "Texas", geoStateCode: "TX", geoTown: "Arlington", type: "shortcuts:/us/instance/place/us/town"},
{ geoArea: "144.307", geoCountry: "United
States", geoCounty: "Arlington", geoIsoCountryCode: "US", geoLocation: "(-77.083817,
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"Seattle", type: "shortcuts:/us/instance/place/us/town" } }, lw_1168663128_2:
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}; YAHOO.Shortcuts.overlaySpaceId
= "97546169"; YAHOO.Shortcuts.hostSpaceId = "97546168";
I can see it now:
"Deckard Field, E021GW inbound for landing."
"1GW be advised that landing on this airfield could lead to serious
injury or death. Land only at your own risk. Owners of this field
cannot be held responsible for claims, actions or judgments resulting
from damages to persons or property in the use of this land for the
purpose of landing, taxing, parking, storage or departure of your
aircraft. While you are on the property, personal safety equipment
is required but not provided. Please verbally acknowledge your
unconditional acceptance of these terms by repeating the following:
I One Golf Whisky hereby acknowledge that I have voluntarily chosen
to land my craft and use the facilities at Deckard Field (hereinafter
called "Jerry's Patch").
I understand the risks involved in the fly-in activities. I recognize
that this activity involves risk of injury and I agree to accept any
and all risks associated with it, including but not limited to
property damage or loss, minor bodily injury, severe bodily injury,
and death. Furthermore, I recognize that this activity involves risks
incidental thereto, including but not limited to, travel to and from
the restroom, parking and hangar areas. There is limited
availability of medical assistance and the possiblity of reckless
conduct of others present. I am voluntarily participating in the
activities with full knowledge of the risks involved and hereby agree
to accept any and all inherent risks of property damage, bodily
injury, or death.
In consideration of my participation in the fly-in and to the fullest
extent permitted by law, I agree to indemnify, defend and hold
harmless Jerry's Patch, its officers, directors, employees, agents,
volunteers and assigns from and against all claims arising out of or
resulting from my participation in the event. "Claim" as used in this
agreement means any financial loss, claim, suit, action, damage, or
expense, including but not limited to attorney's fees, attributable
to bodily injury, sickness, disease or death, or injury to or
destruction of tangible property including loss of use resulting
therefrom. In addition, I hereby voluntarily hold harmless Jerry's
Patch, its officers, directors, employees, agents, volunteers and
assigns from any and all claims, both present and future, that may be
made by me, my family, estate, heirs or assigns.
I hereby expressly agree to indemnify, defend, and hold harmless
Jerry's Patch, its officers, directors, employees, agents, volunteers
and assigns for any claim arising out of or incident to my
participation in the fly-in, unless claim is caused by sole
negligence or willful misconduct.
I also understand that Jerry's Patch does not provide any medical or
dental insurance or life insurance to cover bodily injury, illness or
death, nor insurance for personal property damage or loss, nor
insurance for liability arising out of my negligent acts or poor
pilotage; and I acknowledge that I am completely responsible for my
own insurance to cover these expenses.
I further understand that this acknowledgment of risk and hold
harmless is intended to be as broad and inclusive as permitted by the
laws of the State of Washington and that if any portion hereof is
held invalid, I agree that the balance shall, notwithstanding,
continue in full legal force and effect.
I agree that this acknowledgment of risk and hold harmless is
effective for as long as I participate in the fly-in."
.
.
.
--- In FlyChallenger@ yahoogroups. com, "Jerry Deckard"
wrote:
>
> This is an example of why I don't have flyin's at my strip. I would
love to have them, but don't want to take the chance.
> Jerry
>
---------------------------------
Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask your question
on Yahoo! Answers.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Interesting Info on leading edge sheeting |
Shad, and all,
None of the posts about how to install the plywood is better than the way
Bernard shows to do it in the plans. However, bending it around the leading
edge, notching and nesting the plywood into leading edge, and scalloping the
plywood between the ribs WILL be more work, with No advantage !! The real
beauity of the Pietenpol is in it's simplicity.
The Jungster 1 biplane is quite a different design than the Pietenpol,
and should not influence anyone to build the Pietenpol wing, using anything
other than the conventional ribstiching method.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: tail tiedown release |
Oscar,
Great looking release! Looking forward to your report once you've used it.
Gene
:
>
> Your Hotmail address already works to sign into Windows Live Messenger!
> Get it now
>
>
> Checked by PC Tools AntiVirus (3.1.0.10 - 9.055.001).
> http://www.pctools.com/anti-virus/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Isablcorky(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: A response to having a flyin.. |
Ken,
Is this the place where I am to pick up Blue Boy?
Corky
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KMHeide <kmheidecpo(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: A response to having a flyin.. |
No.....It was just a post from another flyer who made it know he was not going
to host any flyins on his strip...
Isablcorky(at)aol.com wrote: Ken,
Is this the place where I am to pick up Blue Boy?
Corky
---------------------------------
Food fight? Enjoy some healthy debate
in the Yahoo! Answers Food & Drink Q&A.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Andimaxd(at)aol.com |
Howdy group,
It's cold down here in Texas today...
I've been a lurker for quiet some time. I'm afraid of heights and don't
really believe in airplane's, I've heard they are really dangerous. I can
barely stand on a ladder without getting scared.
All that said, we mounted our vertical stabilizer straight with the world,
no offset in the front to counter P-factor and torque. I was just wondering
what the experts here thought about this. Will I end up having to put a
degree or two in, will it be noticeable, or can it be fixed with a ground
adjustable tab on the rudder or what? I would like to know in inches how far
the
offset is (and in which direction) it should be, half inch, one inch or whatever
some of you are flying with. The A-75 does have an offset, I don't remember
exactly how much; and how many flying have no offset...
Thanks in advance,
Max L. Davis
Arlington, TX.
NX101XW (Reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Glass" <redsglass(at)hotmail.com> |
Hi Max
Here attached is a picture of an adjuster I had copied and filed away.
Best regards
Steve in Maine
>From: Andimaxd(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: flying straight
>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 15:35:52 EST
>
>Howdy group,
>
>It's cold down here in Texas today...
>
>I've been a lurker for quiet some time. I'm afraid of heights and don't
>really believe in airplane's, I've heard they are really dangerous. I can
>barely stand on a ladder without getting scared.
>
>
>All that said, we mounted our vertical stabilizer straight with the world,
>no offset in the front to counter P-factor and torque. I was just
>wondering
>what the experts here thought about this. Will I end up having to put a
>degree or two in, will it be noticeable, or can it be fixed with a ground
>adjustable tab on the rudder or what? I would like to know in inches how
>far the
>offset is (and in which direction) it should be, half inch, one inch or
>whatever
>some of you are flying with. The A-75 does have an offset, I don't
>remember
>exactly how much; and how many flying have no offset...
>
>Thanks in advance,
>Max L. Davis
>Arlington, TX.
>NX101XW (Reserved)
_________________________________________________________________
Your Hotmail address already works to sign into Windows Live Messenger! Get
it now
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Andimaxd(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: flying straight |
In a message dated 1/13/2007 3:50:29 P.M. Central Standard Time,
redsglass(at)hotmail.com writes:
Here attached is a picture of an adjuster I had copied and filed away.
Best regards
Steve in Maine
Steve,
I appreciate your picture, I've seen it before. My issue is that mine is
installed, sans adjustment apparatus. I'm just wondering what to expect during
the flight phase. I think Chuck G.'s is straight like mine, but I can't
remember for sure.
Max
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gcardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: flying straight |
I would strongly suggest you build in a means of adjusting both the
vertical and horizontal stabilizers for trim adjustments. You will be
glad you did if you discover that you need it.
Greg C.
----- Original Message -----
From: Andimaxd(at)aol.com
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 2:35 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: flying straight
Howdy group,
It's cold down here in Texas today...
I've been a lurker for quiet some time. I'm afraid of heights and
don't really believe in airplane's, I've heard they are really
dangerous. I can barely stand on a ladder without getting scared.
All that said, we mounted our vertical stabilizer straight with the
world, no offset in the front to counter P-factor and torque. I was
just wondering what the experts here thought about this. Will I end up
having to put a degree or two in, will it be noticeable, or can it be
fixed with a ground adjustable tab on the rudder or what? I would like
to know in inches how far the offset is (and in which direction) it
should be, half inch, one inch or whatever some of you are flying with.
The A-75 does have an offset, I don't remember exactly how much; and how
many flying have no offset...
Thanks in advance,
Max L. Davis
Arlington, TX.
NX101XW (Reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: flying straight |
In a message dated 1/13/2007 4:21:29 PM Central Standard Time,
Andimaxd(at)aol.com writes:
Steve,
I appreciate your picture, I've seen it before. My issue is that mine is
installed, sans adjustment apparatus. I'm just wondering what to expect during
the flight phase. I think Chuck G.'s is straight like mine, but I can't
remember for sure.
Max
Hey Mad Dawg,
You're right, my vertical fin is straight. After flying for a couple of
years with a very slight pressure on the right rudder bar, I decided to
install a non adjustable trim tab on the rudder, similar in design to the ones
that
I have on the flippers. I used a 5" piece of balsa wood trailing edge (from
the hobby store for R.C. planes), and duct taped it to the center of the
trailing edge of the rudder. I radiused the leading edge of the balsa, to match
the
trailing edge of the rudder, with sand paper wrapped around an ink pen. Put
a slight angle on each end, so it can blend in. Duct tape it at an
approximate angle, and go fly. I've adjusted the angle twice, and now I have a
permanent angle, that allows neutral pressure on the rudder bar. Now I remove
the
duct tape, and glue it on at that angle, cover it with fabric & paint. Using
this method makes a clean looking install, and no screws are needed.
I've got a picture of the method here - http://nx770cg.com/Fuselage.html
Fine tune the pitch trim with the flying wires on the tail, by adjusting
the turnbuckles to raise or lower the leading edge of the horizontal stab.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
slip sliding on the ice
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "walt evans" <waltdak(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: flying straight |
Max,
I can just report how mine handles.
My tail section is right to plans.
The mount is right to plans, with the exception of extending 1 3/4"
(approx)
On climbout you need to hold right rudder, At cruise, no rudder needed,
flies straight
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: Andimaxd(at)aol.com
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 3:35 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: flying straight
Howdy group,
It's cold down here in Texas today...
I've been a lurker for quiet some time. I'm afraid of heights and
don't really believe in airplane's, I've heard they are really
dangerous. I can barely stand on a ladder without getting scared.
All that said, we mounted our vertical stabilizer straight with the
world, no offset in the front to counter P-factor and torque. I was
just wondering what the experts here thought about this. Will I end up
having to put a degree or two in, will it be noticeable, or can it be
fixed with a ground adjustable tab on the rudder or what? I would like
to know in inches how far the offset is (and in which direction) it
should be, half inch, one inch or whatever some of you are flying with.
The A-75 does have an offset, I don't remember exactly how much; and how
many flying have no offset...
Thanks in advance,
Max L. Davis
Arlington, TX.
NX101XW (Reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roman Bukolt" <conceptmodels(at)tds.net> |
| Subject: | Re: flying straight |
For what it's worth, My Piet's vertical stabilizer is centered on the
fuse center line and it flies straight with no ruddeer input.
Roman Bukolt NX 20795
----- Original Message -----
From: Rcaprd(at)aol.com
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 10:21 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: flying straight
In a message dated 1/13/2007 4:21:29 PM Central Standard Time,
Andimaxd(at)aol.com writes:
Steve,
I appreciate your picture, I've seen it before. My issue is that
mine is installed, sans adjustment apparatus. I'm just wondering what
to expect during the flight phase. I think Chuck G.'s is straight like
mine, but I can't remember for sure.
Max
Hey Mad Dawg,
You're right, my vertical fin is straight. After flying for a
couple of years with a very slight pressure on the right rudder bar, I
decided to install a non adjustable trim tab on the rudder, similar in
design to the ones that I have on the flippers. I used a 5" piece of
balsa wood trailing edge (from the hobby store for R.C. planes), and
duct taped it to the center of the trailing edge of the rudder. I
radiused the leading edge of the balsa, to match the trailing edge of
the rudder, with sand paper wrapped around an ink pen. Put a slight
angle on each end, so it can blend in. Duct tape it at an approximate
angle, and go fly. I've adjusted the angle twice, and now I have a
permanent angle, that allows neutral pressure on the rudder bar. Now I
remove the duct tape, and glue it on at that angle, cover it with fabric
& paint. Using this method makes a clean looking install, and no screws
are needed.
I've got a picture of the method here -
http://nx770cg.com/Fuselage.html
Fine tune the pitch trim with the flying wires on the tail, by
adjusting the turnbuckles to raise or lower the leading edge of the
horizontal stab.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
slip sliding on the ice
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lshutks(at)webtv.net (Leon Stefan) |
I built "hard points" on the trailing edges of my elevator, and rudder
just in case I need to add trim tabs. Not as pretty as stab.
adjustments, but much, much less work. Leon S.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | NX41CC is rolling again |
Howdy, Pieters-
Yesterday goes down in my memoirs as a red-letter day. Saturday, Jan. 13,
in the final fading minutes of the day, I taxied 41CC up and down the runway
at Zapata County Airport to the applause of a cheering crowd of several
uncaring South Texas coyotes and one grizzled old airport manager. The A65
thundered mightily, with all those hungry horses just waiting to be let out
of the corral... but never saw more than a couple of hundred RPM this day on
the ground.
The weather was perfect. Very slight breeze, overcast, 80 degrees (yes,
EIGHTY degrees Fahrenheit, you northerners), and I had just worked furiously
to get the brakes finished up and the cowlings back on before dark. An old
Alabama A&P with a long southern drawl had signed off the annual inspection
about an hour earlier after only picking up a few little squawks, and
neither the airplane nor I had any more excuses. My instructor (the
grizzled old airport manager) propped it off with me at the controls and the
A65 fired on the first blade after sitting quietly since Thanksgiving, oil
pressure came right up, thumbs went up, chocks were pulled, and off I went.
It was my first time at the controls of a fully operational and airworthy
Pietenpol. I only had a few minutes of daylight left, but it was enough to
let me taxi around on the apron, get a feel for the rudder bar and brakes,
then roll up and down the runway to get a feel for the view over the nose
and the general ground handling characteristics. The biggest surprise was
how responsive the airplane is to the rudder and steerable tailwheel. I was
expecting the usual slow swing of the tail, but this airplane is almost
zippy enough on the ground to run a slalom course. It was absolutely
delightful to taxi this airplane, but I'll have to watch the rudder dance to
make sure I don't overcontrol it on the ground.
More taxiing is in store, to be followed by return to flight. Right now I
have a brake on the port side that will not release completely. The shoes
stay on the disk pretty tightly, and post-taxi inspection (my hand) proved
that the port side brake was mucho hot while the starboard brake was not. I
may have to disassemble the wheel cylinder to see if the piston is dragging
or something. Any ideas on what might be wrong are appreciated.
Weather will be very bad for at least the next week, but soon enough 41CC
will again grace the skies of South Texas! Thanks to everyone who has
helped along the way... Corky, Randy, Mark, Jeff, Mike, and a host of
others. I know I keep repeating myself, but there have been so many who
have helped me with so many different things over the last two years. I owe
you all rides ;o)
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
Your Hotmail address already works to sign into Windows Live Messenger! Get
it now
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Isablcorky(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: NX41CC is rolling again |
Oscar,
It's like beautiful music to these ears.
Corky
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KMHeide <kmheidecpo(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: NX41CC is rolling again |
Oscar......
My address if Fargo, ND and I'll take that ride this June 12, 2007 between the
hours of 4:30 and 5:30 PM. I'll have the lawn chairs out and steaks on the
grill for when you arrive. I would like a nice flight from Hawley Airport down
into Elbow Lake Airport and back.
Ken Heide
Fargo, ND
Oscar Zuniga wrote:
Howdy, Pieters-
Yesterday goes down in my memoirs as a red-letter day. Saturday, Jan. 13,
in the final fading minutes of the day, I taxied 41CC up and down the runway
at Zapata County Airport to the applause of a cheering crowd of several
uncaring South Texas coyotes and one grizzled old airport manager. The A65
thundered mightily, with all those hungry horses just waiting to be let out
of the corral... but never saw more than a couple of hundred RPM this day on
the ground.
The weather was perfect. Very slight breeze, overcast, 80 degrees (yes,
EIGHTY degrees Fahrenheit, you northerners), and I had just worked furiously
to get the brakes finished up and the cowlings back on before dark. An old
Alabama A&P with a long southern drawl had signed off the annual inspection
about an hour earlier after only picking up a few little squawks, and
neither the airplane nor I had any more excuses. My instructor (the
grizzled old airport manager) propped it off with me at the controls and the
A65 fired on the first blade after sitting quietly since Thanksgiving, oil
pressure came right up, thumbs went up, chocks were pulled, and off I went.
It was my first time at the controls of a fully operational and airworthy
Pietenpol. I only had a few minutes of daylight left, but it was enough to
let me taxi around on the apron, get a feel for the rudder bar and brakes,
then roll up and down the runway to get a feel for the view over the nose
and the general ground handling characteristics. The biggest surprise was
how responsive the airplane is to the rudder and steerable tailwheel. I was
expecting the usual slow swing of the tail, but this airplane is almost
zippy enough on the ground to run a slalom course. It was absolutely
delightful to taxi this airplane, but I'll have to watch the rudder dance to
make sure I don't overcontrol it on the ground.
More taxiing is in store, to be followed by return to flight. Right now I
have a brake on the port side that will not release completely. The shoes
stay on the disk pretty tightly, and post-taxi inspection (my hand) proved
that the port side brake was mucho hot while the starboard brake was not. I
may have to disassemble the wheel cylinder to see if the piston is dragging
or something. Any ideas on what might be wrong are appreciated.
Weather will be very bad for at least the next week, but soon enough 41CC
will again grace the skies of South Texas! Thanks to everyone who has
helped along the way... Corky, Randy, Mark, Jeff, Mike, and a host of
others. I know I keep repeating myself, but there have been so many who
have helped me with so many different things over the last two years. I owe
you all rides ;o)
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
Your Hotmail address already works to sign into Windows Live Messenger! Get
it now
---------------------------------
Don't pick lemons.
See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gardiner Mason" <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: bending wood |
Rick, thanks for the feedback. I have already wraped the leading edge of
both wings with metal,and it worked fine. The center section is where I
will use wood. I have decided to glue the bottom on first and then the
top next. I will use Z Grip to fair off the front edge. By the way, what
is all that white stuff behind your house? Down here in Ga. we just have
Georgia ice cream. I am going to Fl this weekend to get my engine.
William says he has all the parts and come on down to finish putting it
together. Take care, Gardiner.
----- Original Message -----
From: Rick Holland
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 2:34 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: bending wood
I also pre-bent my leading edge ply Gardiner (see attached picture).
Soaked it in a bath tub, stood it on edge then clamped the front 1 1/2"
inch between an angle and a 1 x 2 then bent the rest over 90 degrees and
let it dry. The fit was very close, when I glued it on I held it on with
5/16" staples over plastic strips for easy removal.
Rick
On 1/11/07, Gardiner Mason wrote:
Is there a good way to bend the 1/16 plywood around rhe leading
edge? I am thinking about glueing and tacking the bottom edge and
glueing to the bottom of the ribs. When this dries then I start wetting
down around the leading edge to make the bend, and then I glue and tack
the top. Has anyone tried this, or is there any other better way?
Thanks, Gardiner Mason in Atlanta , Ga.
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
http://forums.matronics.com
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
1/12/2007
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | NX41CC is rolling again |
Ken;
I'll be happy to give you that ride up in Fargo if you'll help me convert a
little box of Bendix parts into an impulse coupling for my left mag,
installed and timed. I don't dare touch a magneto, don't know anything
about working on or timing them, have the parts, want to add impulse to my
left mag, and might be able to do that flight sometime if you've got the
know-how.
But I sure ain't going up your way before the spring thaw, and June might
not be warm enough up your way!
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
Fixing up the home? Live Search can help
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Catdesigns" <catdesigns(at)comcast.net> |
Hey Don,
Glad to hear your finally going to build a Piet.
I soaked my wing upper wing rib piece in my bathtub for about 2 or 3
hours so I could bend it. They are nice and wet when I take them out,
as in really wet and pliable. I have not noticed any staining, weakness
or discoloration from this. What you need to watch out for is getting a
piece of dusty or dirty wood wet. This will drive the dirt into the
wood and stain it. Also, some how something leaked into my fuselage and
stained the mahogany plywood on the floor. I think it was water off the
garage door as I would open it though I'm not sure as I never saw it
drip nor have I since seen it drip. In any event I think the plywood
might stain easily. I would think if you wrap it up as tight as you
can you will be fine. Just make sure you open it up to dry out as soon
as possible.
Chris Tracy
Sacramento, Ca
Website at http://www.Westcoastpiet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | For Sale - Piet Ribs |
| From: | "Jack T. Textor" <jtextor(at)thepalmergroup.com> |
God morning all. Recently, I purchased a partially completed project
from David Paulsen in Missouri. I don't need the ribs, so plan to sell
them. There are 33 ribs, built for a 1" spar, glued with T88. The
spruce was from Wicks. David did a good job, but they will require a
couple of hours cleaning them up a bit. You can see some pictures on my
site www.textors.com <http://www.textors.com/> , under Piet Project,
towards the bottom. I'm asking $300.00, plus packaging and shipping.
If you have questions or wish to purchase, drop me an email at
jtextor(at)thepalmergroup.com.
Thanks,
Jack Textor
Des Moines, IA
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | tail brace fittings |
| From: | "Arden Adamson" <aadamson(at)wnmdag.org> |
Gentlemen,
I have a simple question I'd like your opinion on. Do you mount the
wire brace fittings for the rudder and horizontal stabilizer under the
covering and protruding through or on top of the covering? Does it even
matter? What did you do and/or what do you recommend? Any thoughts
would be appreciated.
Arden
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: For Sale - Piet Ribs |
| From: | amsafetyc(at)aol.com |
Jack,
Let me know shipping and prep cost, to Lititz, Pennsylvania 17543. I think w
e have a deal, will confirm but just about certain I want the ribs, unless y
ou have already sold them.
Please advise as soon as possible, my project make take off on an accerlerat
ed rate of build.
Thanks
John Recine
office number and answering machine 717-627-4901
-----Original Message-----
From: jtextor(at)thepalmergroup.com
Sent: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 9:54 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: For Sale - Piet Ribs
God morning all. Recently, I purchased a partially completed project from D
avid Paulsen in Missouri. I don=99t need the ribs, so plan to sell th
em. There are 33 ribs, built for a 1=9D spar, glued with T88. The sp
ruce was from Wicks. David did a good job, but they will require a couple o
f hours cleaning them up a bit. You can see some pictures on my site www.te
xtors.com, under Piet Project, towards the bottom. I=99m asking $300.
00, plus packaging and shipping. If you have questions or wish to purchase,
drop me an email at jtextor(at)thepalmergroup.com.
Thanks,
Jack Textor
Des Moines, IA
________________________________________________________________________
ee AOL Mail and more.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Congradulations Oscar |
Oscar, Its a great feeling isn't it! NX92GB is pretty well behaved on the ground
(except the old goose the throtle smash the rudder and aim the stick at the
ground to turn routine), and I imagine your piet is also. There is definatly
plenty of rudder athority with slow speeds. I have no experiance with a steerable
tailwheel (on a piet) but don't think it would be any harder to control
than a Cub or Champ. Just fly it by feel and carry a little extra speed on final
untill you get the feel of the landings. I was a little too hot on my 1st
landing and used up a lot of runway but touched down smoothly. It wont float
as much as a cub or champ with one person aboard. It will flare loose speed
rapidly and just bump down and stay down. Start at 55-60 mph over the fence
and work down to what you feel it should be. I flew a cub for the 1st time this
past November and with me and the owner aboard (probably a little over gross)
it was heavy but acted very similar to the piet
on landing when I came in at 50mph. Take your time, do things in your own time,
and enjoy the hell out of it!! CONGRATS
Shad
---------------------------------
We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love
(and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: tail brace fittings |
| From: | Hans Vander Voort <hans.vander.voort(at)alfalaval.com> |
Arden,
It is up to your personal preference how you do it, I do not think there is
right or wrong way here
I did mine under the fabric, just like BHP's last original.
Hans
"Arden Adamson"
<aadamson@wnmdag.
org> To
Sent by:
owner-pietenpol-l cc
ist-server@matron
ics.com Subject
Pietenpol-List: tail brace fittings
01/15/2007 09:57
AM
Please respond to
pietenpol-list@ma
tronics.com
Gentlemen,
I have a simple question Id like your opinion on. Do you mount the wire
brace fittings for the rudder and horizontal stabilizer under the covering
and protruding through or on top of the covering? Does it even matter?
What did you do and/or what do you recommend? Any thoughts would be
appreciated.
Arden
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DONALD COOLEY <adonjr(at)sbcglobal.net> |
Hello, group,
I apologize for forgetting to snip before I replied to yesterday's digest.
I'll be more careful in the future. Keep the sawdust flying! Don Cooley
Pietenpol-List Digest Server wrote:
*
=================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
=================================================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Singleton" <slsingleton(at)cvalley.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Another dumb question |
---Hi everyone- I've found a source locally that has 1/8in Baltic
Birch in 5x5 sheets and am wanting to use it for Gusset material. Would
this be aceptable to use? Thanks. Steve Singleton
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Another dumb question |
Steve,
Baltic Birch is an interior grade plywood (the glue is not
waterproof), and is NOT recommended for aircraft. The other
consideration is that is mainly intended for finish applications -
the interior plys may not be up to aircraft spec structurally.
What you can use that is cheaper than aircraft grade is Marine Grade
plywood that meets a spec (don't remember the #) for waterproofness,
quality of interior plys, etc. It is generally sold in metric
thicknesses (made in Israel), so you'll need to convert (~25mm/inch).
If I remember correctly, the best source for this is a marine
building supply company that's called Noah's (?). They have locations
in Buffalo and Toronto.
Kip Gardner
>
>
>---Hi everyone- I've found a source locally that has 1/8in Baltic
>Birch in 5x5 sheets and am wanting to use it for Gusset material.
>Would this be aceptable to use? Thanks. Steve Singleton
>
>
><http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
--
North Canton, OH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MICHAEL SILVIUS" <M.Silvius(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Donald:
I live less than a half mile form Richard Decosta. I thought he had sold
that about 2 years ago but my UPS man just told me it was still in his
garage last week. I have seen the plane it is a nice short fuselage Piet
built to the original construction manual if I recall correctly. I
passed on buying it as I could not fit in the short fuse with my big
clodhoppers.
As for wrapping the thing with shipping grade saran wrap you'd likely be
fine. Just be sure to wrap in the right direction so the wind don't blow
it off. U-Haul sells the stuff in 18 inch wide rolls. Transport should
be easy as it is the 3 piece wing. If you are really concerned we are
right on the coast an thus we have a lot of boating around here. And we
also have a lot of folks that do shrink wrapping of boats for winter
storage. I am certain that if you were up for it you could get it shrink
wrapped for the trip by one of the fellows that do that around here.
Richard or myself could come up with some phone numbers for you. It may
give you the extra peace of mind for the long journey. I hauled a
project home from western Vermont just a week before Christmas and was
having a kinipshen fit when I went through a couple of rain brief and
ever so slight showers. They passed quick enough.
http://rides.webshots.com/album/147451245dhnmgI
the piet parts are in the basement for now
michael silvius
scarborough, maine
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MICHAEL SILVIUS" <M.Silvius(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Another dumb question |
Re: Pietenpol-List: Another dumb
questionhttp://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/wppages/finnishbirch.php
http://www.wicksaircraft.com/catalog/product_cat.php/subid=9/index.html
http://www.wicksaircraft.com/catalog/product_cat.php/subid=8/index.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Singleton" <slsingleton(at)cvalley.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Another dumb question |
Re: Pietenpol-List: Another dumb questionThanks Kip-The price was really
cheap. I guess thats why. Just a tibit of info-I'm 48 and yes a waist
line that should be somewhat smaller. I built the ribs last winter
(glued them up in the living room) If i have the Piet done by the time
I'm 50 I'll be doing great. I only fell twice today on the ice comeing
and going between the shop and house. Steve Singleton
----- Original Message -----
From: Kip and Beth Gardner
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 5:36 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Another dumb question
Steve,
Baltic Birch is an interior grade plywood (the glue is not
waterproof), and is NOT recommended for aircraft. The other
consideration is that is mainly intended for finish applications - the
interior plys may not be up to aircraft spec structurally.
What
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <dj(at)veghdesign.com> |
wow! what fun today. Been practicing short field landings in our
Taylorcraft. Today I managed down and stopped in 230' (see attached) Winds
were ahead at 9kts. I wonder... a Piet/GN-1 should be able to do the same
right?? For those flying, what's your shortest landing in your Piet and
what were the winds?
DJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca> |
My choice for moving large object this way is 10 mil poly.
It's 10 ft wide and you buy it in any length you want. Wrap
the part in it with the seam on the "bottom" surface away
from the rain. You'll have to plan that of course. :-)
Tape up seams with lots of duct tape. The problem I see
with the saran wrap idea is that there are multitudes of
seams, each a potential leak. It doesn't always stick to
itself as well as you would need. Now how would I know
that? :-)
The shrink wrap is a good one too. I like that. I think it just
boils down to which you one guys think would be easier.
Clif
----- Original Message -----
From: MICHAEL SILVIUS
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 3:58 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: wet wood?
Donald:
As for wrapping the thing with shipping grade saran wrap you'd likely
be fine. Just be sure to wrap in the right direction so the wind don't
blow it off. And we also have a lot of folks that do shrink wrapping of
boats for winter storage. I am certain that if you were up for it you
could get it shrink wrapped for the trip by one of the fellows that do
that around here.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Isablcorky(at)aol.com |
Here I go again after saying I never would again.
May I suggest that you get up to Maine a few days earlier than planned put
on a couple of coats of good spar varnish, 1st coat thinned then 2d coat full
strength out of the can. I like Ace hardware gloss. Then you wouldn't have to
wrap anything or worry about plastic flying. I'm thinking like a completed
fuse of course.
Just a thought but I bet that's the way I'd do it.
Corky
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: tail brace fittings |
In a message dated 1/15/2007 10:01:45 AM Central Standard Time,
aadamson(at)wnmdag.org writes:
Gentlemen,
I have a simple question I=99d like your opinion on. Do you mount the
wire
brace fittings for the rudder and horizontal stabilizer under the covering a
nd
protruding through or on top of the covering? Does it even matter? What di
d
you do and/or what do you recommend? Any thoughts would be appreciated.
Arden
Arden,
The tail wire brace fittings for the vertical and horizontal stabilizer, are
Under the fabric. I used 3/16" iron rivets, called out in the plans, so it
was a permanent install, before fabric. You need to have them installed whe
n
you pre-fit the empenage. Then you the parts, and cover the vert & horiz st
abs,
with just a slit for the fittings to protrude, then install a re-enforcing
small round patch (about 3" diameter), slit for the protruding fitting, with
the
fibers running at about a 45=C2=BA to the covering, on top of the fabric. A
llow
the fabric to creep up on the fitting, and it makes for a nice clean looking
,
and waterproof install.
You can see the fittings here, as well as how I set up the heel brakes,
sealed hinge gaps, and means to jack the plane up
http://nx770cg.com/Unique.html
Chuck G.
NX770CG
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: tail brace fittings |
Arden,
In general, early designs having a wooden structure (and the Pietenpol
fits this category) have fittings placed outside the fabric covering.
The DeHavilland Moths, among others, did it this way because:
1. Inspection of fittings is made easy.
2. Fabric covering is easier to accomplish.
3. It is easy to seal between the fabric and the fittings.*
4. Removal/replacement of fittings or bolts is facilitated.
5. You get a nice "antique" appearance.
* Use a high quality marine sealant here.
Covering the fittings with fabric is OK, but make sure no water can
enter where the fitting emerges from the fabric. This can be difficult
to accomplish for long term protection.
I opted to place my fittings outside the fabric and tolerate the extra
drag they produce. After all, what's a bit more drag to a Pietenpol?
Graham Hansen (Pietenpol CF-AUN)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | tail brace fittings |
Just to chime in here, the tail brace fittings on NX41CC are mounted outside
the fabric and I've been glad of it a time or two already. I had to remove
the vertical stabilizer for repairs and it was my first time doing fabric
covering. It was tricky learning to fit the fabric around protruding
fittings (the Vi Kapler style rudder hinges in this case), and the fewer
fittings I need to work fabric around, the better for me. I'm sure it
presents a smoother finish to cover over them though.
And after looking at Chuck Gantzer's link to his page, I remembered how
slick his heel brake setup is. 41CC has toe brakes and they work fine, but
that heel brake setup of Chuck's is nifty too. Higher parts count and more
detail than the toe brake setup, I'll admit. Someone else sent me pictures
of their heel brake setup (along with their trim wheel setup, using part of
a bicycle chain with a nicely done wooden trim wheel) and that one, too, is
really nice; it uses Matco masters in the laydown position along with short
sections of tubing below the rudder bar to activate the brakes.
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
>From photos to predictions, The MSN Entertainment Guide to Golden Globes has
it all. http://tv.msn.com/tv/globes2007/?icid=nctagline1
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Church" <eng(at)canadianrogers.com> |
I agree with Clif. I would wrap with polyethylene (vapour barrier), and
seal ALL the seams. Water has a way of working through almost any
opening, and if you have the misfortune of driving through a rainstorm,
or even if the roads are wet, the water will get to places you don't
want it to be. Since you're going to be driving across the continent,
there's likely going to be some rain along the way. To seal the seams, I
would use this stuff:
http://www.can-save.ca/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=19
5&Ite
mid=93
It really sticks, and is waterproof - much better than duct tape. Up
here in Canada, we can buy it at building supply stores (Home Depot
carries it) - not sure how available it is on your side of the border.
Bill C
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Case" <dav3xor(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | No Space to Build. |
Just to back up what's being said -- I'm making ribs in my dinette -- no
problem at all. My wife always balks at the talk of "Oh, I'll hang the
wings up from the ceiling; think of it as decoration!". Maybe I can get a
shop built by then. :) Plus, it has it's advantages, I don't have to worry
about temperature, but I do have to worry about drifts of sawdust in my
kitchen.
I just bought an electronic scale accurate to within 1/10th of a gram --
makes measuring T-88 braindead simple, and I can also measure dry
ingredients (flower, sugar etc...) like the Europeans do. It's a MyWeigh
i500, and cost me about $60. I always had a nagging fear in the back of my
head that measuring T-88 by eye was a bad idea.
Plus, how can you call it a real aircraft project if you don't make it on to
some sort of Drug Enforcement Agency watch list?
--
David Case
Dav3xor(at)gmail.com
www.builddiary.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Case" <dav3xor(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | More Measuring Epoxy... |
Forgot to mention... it takes about 5 grams of resin per rib, and remember
to multiply your weight of resin by .83 to get the amount of hardener to
use. Results may vary. Do not attempt to operate a motor vehicle while
mixing epoxy. Warning -- glue may attach objects together beyond your
ability to break them apart again. It is advisable to take your gloves off
before opening any doors. No matter how good it smells, please don't eat
the hardener.
--
David Case
Dav3xor(at)gmail.com
www.builddiary.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | More Measuring Epoxy... |
| From: | "Bill Church" <eng(at)canadianrogers.com> |
I wonder what advantage, if any, one might gain by weighing epoxy
components, rather than measuring the volume. I just used small
disposable plastic graduated measuring cups. For each rib I measured 1/4
oz resin and added hardener, to make 1/2 oz of epoxy, which seems to be
a good amount to do one rib - leaves a little (maybe 1/8 oz) in the
bottom of the cup to save as a glue batch sample. I wrote the date on
each cup and set them aside for safekeeping. I also numbered each rib
assembly, so that if I found a glue sample to be not quite right, I
could identify the rib built with that batch of glue.
Bill C
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Ask Markle about the mustard |
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
I hate to bust a good builder from Texas but Jim Markle had a funny
story about what not to eat one day.......
and for what it's worth, I mixed all of my epoxy by eye. Two very
similar diameter blobs of part A and part B and did glue joint tests
with many batches
along the way and nary at time when the joint didn't break where it
should--in the wood.
A good use for all of those cap strip pieces that you might normally
throw away is to use them to test your glue batches from time to time.
A sharp FAA or
DAR inspector might even ask you to produce to a few (dated is best,
with a pencil or marker) I used to dab two offset overlapping joints,
let them cure then
clamp one end in a vise and hit the other end/piece with a hammer and
see where the joint would break.
Mike C.
(PS-- white vinegar on a paper towel works good for removing T-88 from
tools, hands, hair, and makes you smell like a cucumber salad somewhat)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "walt evans" <waltdak(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: No Space to Build. |
I built my Pietenpol in a 10x20ft basement. Where there's a
wil,,,,blah, blah.
PS did have to take a piece of the foundation out to get the wings out
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: Dave Case
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 1:36 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: No Space to Build.
Just to back up what's being said -- I'm making ribs in my dinette --
no problem at all. My wife always balks at the talk of "Oh, I'll hang
the wings up from the ceiling; think of it as decoration!". Maybe I can
get a shop built by then. :) Plus, it has it's advantages, I don't
have to worry about temperature, but I do have to worry about drifts of
sawdust in my kitchen.
I just bought an electronic scale accurate to within 1/10th of a gram
-- makes measuring T-88 braindead simple, and I can also measure dry
ingredients (flower, sugar etc...) like the Europeans do. It's a
MyWeigh i500, and cost me about $60. I always had a nagging fear in the
back of my head that measuring T-88 by eye was a bad idea.
Plus, how can you call it a real aircraft project if you don't make it
on to some sort of Drug Enforcement Agency watch list?
--
David Case
Dav3xor(at)gmail.com
www.builddiary.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Bacon" <gbacon67(at)hughes.net> |
| Subject: | Syringes and measuring epoxy |
Just a tip I thought I'd share with the list:
I fill two 10cc syringes, one with resin and one with hardener. I can
then dispense various amounts of each part. If I have a small job, I
may only dispense 2cc of each, leaving the rest in the syringes. For a
bigger job I might use 4cc of each. This ensures a very close
volumetric mix of both parts and you can quickly dispense the amount you
need.
BTW, T-88 is formulated to be mixed 1:1 by VOLUME.
My 2 cents anyway.
Greg Bacon
Prairie Home, MO
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Singleton" <slsingleton(at)cvalley.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Congratulations Gene Hubbard |
Doug-I had some wood in my house attic for a few years and when i went
to use it it had dried out so much in the hot attic that the wood was no
good to use. I hope you the best on your Piet. I just getting started
also. Steve Singleton Hale MO
----- Original Message -----
From: DOUGLAS BLACKBURN
To: Pietenpol List
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2007 12:45 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Congratulations Gene Hubbard
Good job Gene!!!!!
I have been down to see Gene a few times over the years. He even
loaned me his rib jig to many years ago. I have to say I have been the
proverbial bump on a log, and I'd say it is time to get off that log and
pull my head out and get to building. Even though Gene loaned me his
jig, It appears to be a better deal to build your own from what I have
been reading in the archives this evening. I have the cap-strip for the
ribs, the wood for the tail group, and all the wood for the fuse in the
attic above the garage. I suppose this list is making me accountable so
to speak for getting this project on the road. I hope my questions over
the next few years don't become too much for you guys. No more excuses
either. Tomorrow I will pick up a board to build the rib jig. Gene I
will return yours as soon as it fits into yours and mines schedule.
Email me off list and we will work that out.
My wife has had many health problems and I suppose I have been hiding
behind that in a way. He rproblems continue, but it is time for me to
move forward with this dream of mine to build a plane. I hope to learn
as much, and be able to teach as much some day to someone else, in the
way you all teach each other. I'll get off the soapbox now, I need to
find a place to build a website, and start the progress logs. Thanks,
you'll be hearing from me.
Doug Blackburn
Yucaipa California
p.s. Carl Levken, drop me a line..............
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | santiago morete <moretesantiago(at)yahoo.com.ar> |
| Subject: | Jenny landing gear & ash cross member |
I am building the jenny style landing gear and since there are no ash cross members
in the F&GM for this type of gear, I am wondering if it is really necesary.
As far as I know, most of you use them anyway, but there is a reason? I
hope that my english has been sufficiently clear . Thanks to all.
Santiago
---------------------------------
Pregunt. Respond. Descubr.
Todo lo que queras saber, y lo que ni imaginabas,
est en Yahoo! Respuestas (Beta).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Eldredge" <steve(at)byu.edu> |
About 20' ground roll once in the piet. It was downright scary. I didn't dare
turn off the runway for fear I would flip. Winds were about 35kts down the runway
after I diverted to the larger metro apt. with a crosswind runway. I somehow
got it to a tie down and left it there for the weekend. I haven't landed
backwards yet though. My personal record for TO/Landings is 5 without a pattern
on our 5900' strip. Take off, climb to 100' and land straight ahead full
stop, without turning as many times as you can before running out of runway.
Silly headwind piet tricks.
Steve E
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of DJ Vegh
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 6:02 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: down in 230'
wow! what fun today. Been practicing short field landings in our
Taylorcraft. Today I managed down and stopped in 230' (see attached) Winds were
ahead at 9kts. I wonder... a Piet/GN-1 should be able to do the same right??
For those flying, what's your shortest landing in your Piet and what were the
winds?
DJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gcardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jenny landing gear & ash cross member |
Hi Santiago,
Yes, the ash cross members are necessary. They stiffen and reinforce the
plywood floor between the gear leg attach points. The metal strap
addition is a good idea also.
Greg C.
----- Original Message -----
From: santiago morete
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 10:02 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Jenny landing gear & ash cross member
I am building the jenny style landing gear and since there are no ash
cross members in the F&GM for this type of gear, I am wondering if it is
really necesary. As far as I know, most of you use them anyway, but
there is a reason?
I hope that my english has been sufficiently clear . Thanks to all.
Santiago
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Pregunt=E1. Respond=E9. Descubr=ED.
Todo lo que quer=EDas saber, y lo que ni imaginabas,
est=E1 en Yahoo! Respuestas (Beta).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gcardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: down in 230' |
I can't beat 20' but I did have a ground roll of less than 100' in a 20kt
wind straight down the runway.
Even in windless conditions the ground roll is only a few hundred feet. This
is in NX18235 which is brakeless.
Greg Cardinal
----- Original Message -----
>
> About 20' ground roll once in the piet. It was downright scary. I didn't
> dare turn off the runway for fear I would flip. Winds were about 35kts
> down the runway after I diverted to the larger metro apt. with a crosswind
> runway. I somehow got it to a tie down and left it there for the weekend.
> I haven't landed backwards yet though. My personal record for TO/Landings
> is 5 without a pattern on our 5900' strip. Take off, climb to 100' and
> land straight ahead full stop, without turning as many times as you can
> before running out of runway. Silly headwind piet tricks.
>
>
> Steve E
>
>
> > server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of DJ Vegh
> > Subject: Pietenpol-List: down in 230'
>
> wow! what fun today. Been practicing short field landings in our
> Taylorcraft. Today I managed down and stopped in 230' (see attached)
> Winds were ahead at 9kts. I wonder... a Piet/GN-1 should be able to do
> the same right?? For those flying, what's your shortest landing in your
> Piet and what were the winds?
>
> DJ
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
I think my shortest landing was at Oshkosh in 2005. I had flown from
Brodhead on Sunday morning and landed on runway 18. Winds were 250 at
20 kts, gusts to 25 (remember the winds that morning, Chuck?). I didn't
measure it (are you kidding - this is OSHKOSH!), but I touched down just
in front of the big painted dot on the end of the runway and stopped
rolling just on the other side of the dot. I think it was well under
200'. I was just glad to get it down safe in such a crosswind, never
mind in front of such a crowd of highly critical spectators. It sure
wasn't the softest landing I've ever made, but it was the shortest. The
so-called "RV Grin" was nothing compared to the grin I had that day.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of DJ Vegh
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 8:02 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: down in 230'
wow! what fun today. Been practicing short field landings in our
Taylorcraft. Today I managed down and stopped in 230' (see attached)
Winds
were ahead at 9kts. I wonder... a Piet/GN-1 should be able to do the
same
right?? For those flying, what's your shortest landing in your Piet and
what were the winds?
DJ
_________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
I'm looking into buying another prop for my A-65 powered Piet. Does
anyone have any knowledge of Cloudcars or Tennessee props and how well
or how poorly they perform
Also would be interested in anyones opinion of any other props (good or
bad) they have used.
Thank You
Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
| From: | <harvey.rule(at)bell.ca> |
I'm using a Tennessee prop 72X42 on my 80hp Franklin and it seems to be
performing fine.I've only got two hours on it so far.
________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene and
Tammy
Sent: January 17, 2007 9:00 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers
I'm looking into buying another prop for my A-65 powered Piet. Does
anyone have any knowledge of Cloudcars or Tennessee props and how well
or how poorly they perform
Also would be interested in anyones opinion of any other props (good or
bad) they have used.
Thank You
Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roman Bukolt" <conceptmodels(at)tds.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
I have a Sturba wood prop 72 x 42 on my Piet, total gross at 1223 lbs.
with two people and 15 gal. fuel, which climbs well and cruises at 80mph
at 2150rpm. iI'm quite satisfied with its performance.
Roman Bukolt NX20795
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene and Tammy
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 8:00 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers
I'm looking into buying another prop for my A-65 powered Piet. Does
anyone have any knowledge of Cloudcars or Tennessee props and how well
or how poorly they perform
Also would be interested in anyones opinion of any other props (good
or bad) they have used.
Thank You
Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
Roman,
Thnks for your reply. Which engine do you have? Do you remember what
you gave for the prop? I've heard of the Sturba prop but am not
familiar with it. Do you have a phone # or address?
Thank You
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Roman Bukolt
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 8:56 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I have a Sturba wood prop 72 x 42 on my Piet, total gross at 1223 lbs.
with two people and 15 gal. fuel, which climbs well and cruises at 80mph
at 2150rpm. iI'm quite satisfied with its performance.
Roman Bukolt NX20795
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene and Tammy
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 8:00 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I'm looking into buying another prop for my A-65 powered Piet. Does
anyone have any knowledge of Cloudcars or Tennessee props and how well
or how poorly they perform
Also would be interested in anyones opinion of any other props (good
or bad) they have used.
Thank You
Gene
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
Harvey,
Thanks for your reply. Do you happen to know how much your 72X42
Tennesse Prop weighed? I'm going to be replacing a metal prop and I'm a
little concerned about the weight difference. Have thought about adding
a battery in the engine compartment to off set the difference.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: harvey.rule(at)bell.ca
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 8:50 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I'm using a Tennessee prop 72X42 on my 80hp Franklin and it seems to
be performing fine.I've only got two hours on it so far.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <dj(at)veghdesign.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
I've 14 hours of ground run time on my Tennesee 66x29. It's a well made
prop. One of the only propr makers that I know of that use 1/16"
laminations. There are 48 laminations on my prop and it's very sturdy
and tracks dead on.
DJ
----- Original Message -----
From: harvey.rule(at)bell.ca
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 7:50 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I'm using a Tennessee prop 72X42 on my 80hp Franklin and it seems to
be performing fine.I've only got two hours on it so far.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene and
Tammy
Sent: January 17, 2007 9:00 AM
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers
I'm looking into buying another prop for my A-65 powered Piet. Does
anyone have any knowledge of Cloudcars or Tennessee props and how well
or how poorly they perform
Also would be interested in anyones opinion of any other props (good
or bad) they have used.
Thank You
Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
DJ,
Thanks for the info on the Tennessee. I've always liked the ultralite
props that Tennessee makes but have not seen any of the props they make
for GA.. Well worth looking into. What motor are you running the 66X29
on?
Gene----- Original Message -----
From: DJ Vegh
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 9:24 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I've 14 hours of ground run time on my Tennesee 66x29. It's a well
made prop. One of the only propr makers that I know of that use 1/16"
laminations. There are 48 laminations on my prop and it's very sturdy
and tracks dead on.
DJ
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <harvey.rule(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
>From: <harvey.rule(at)bell.ca>
>To:
>Subject: FW: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers
>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:52:00 -0500
>
>
>________________________________
>
>From: Rule, Harvey G (N092740)
>Sent: January 17, 2007 11:48 AM
>To: 'pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com'
>Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
>propellers
>
>
>I don't know how much it weighed but I took a metal prop off and
>replaced it with the wood prop and the weight difference of the two
>props was quite substantial.I also took off an adaptor plate which
>weighed a lot as well.I put my battery in the front seat (bolted in with
>a battery box).I was able to put my started back on with the weight I
>took off.Tennessee props could give you the exact answer to the weight
>question.I will say that the prop I received from them is a work of
>art.I paid 650$ for it and it's worth every penny.I get about 80 -85 mph
>out of her and I'm hoping to make that 90 mph in the spring.
>
>
>________________________________
>
>From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene and
>Tammy
>Sent: January 17, 2007 10:16 AM
>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
>propellers
>
>
>Harvey,
>
>Thanks for your reply. Do you happen to know how much your 72X42
>Tennesse Prop weighed? I'm going to be replacing a metal prop and I'm a
>little concerned about the weight difference. Have thought about adding
>a battery in the engine compartment to off set the difference.
>
>Gene
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: harvey.rule(at)bell.ca
>
> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 8:50 AM
>
> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
>propellers
>
>
> I'm using a Tennessee prop 72X42 on my 80hp Franklin and it
>seems to be performing fine.I've only got two hours on it so far.
>
>
>________________________________
>
>
>href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matr
>onics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ Vegh" <dj(at)veghdesign.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
mine is mounted to a 100hp Corvair
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene and Tammy
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
DJ,
Thanks for the info on the Tennessee. I've always liked the ultralite
props that Tennessee makes but have not seen any of the props they make
for GA.. Well worth looking into. What motor are you running the 66X29
on?
Gene----- Original Message -----
From: DJ Vegh
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 9:24 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I've 14 hours of ground run time on my Tennesee 66x29. It's a well
made prop. One of the only propr makers that I know of that use 1/16"
laminations. There are 48 laminations on my prop and it's very sturdy
and tracks dead on.
DJ
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HVandervoo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
Gene,
I use a Tennessee prop, 64 x 34 on my Corvair powered Piet.
It is a well made prop, I have the urethane leading edge option.
The prop is excellently balanced and performs well,
I have about 40 hours on it and it show little wear, I fly from grass.
I would definitely buy from Tennessee prop again
Hans
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HelsperSew(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
Hans,
You said you had the urethane leading edge on your prop. Have you ever flown
through rain, and if so, how did it hold up?
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <harvey.rule(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
I forgot ,I have the urethane leading edge on mine as well.After a flight I
just spray a light mixture of dish washing soap and water on it and wipe the
bugs off.Looks like new all the time.I have attached a picture of what it
looks like on the aircraft.
>From: HVandervoo(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers
>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:44:25 EST
>
>Gene,
>
>I use a Tennessee prop, 64 x 34 on my Corvair powered Piet.
>It is a well made prop, I have the urethane leading edge option.
>
>The prop is excellently balanced and performs well,
>I have about 40 hours on it and it show little wear, I fly from grass.
>
>I would definitely buy from Tennessee prop again
>
>Hans
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Roman Bukolt" <conceptmodels(at)tds.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
The engine is a Continental A-65.
The prop was on the plane when I bought it last Oct. but it was bought
in 2004 and i can probably find out from the previous owner.
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene and Tammy
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 9:05 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
Roman,
Thnks for your reply. Which engine do you have? Do you remember what
you gave for the prop? I've heard of the Sturba prop but am not
familiar with it. Do you have a phone # or address?
Thank You
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Roman Bukolt
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 8:56 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I have a Sturba wood prop 72 x 42 on my Piet, total gross at 1223
lbs. with two people and 15 gal. fuel, which climbs well and cruises at
80mph at 2150rpm. iI'm quite satisfied with its performance.
Roman Bukolt NX20795
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene and Tammy
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 8:00 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I'm looking into buying another prop for my A-65 powered Piet.
Does anyone have any knowledge of Cloudcars or Tennessee props and how
well or how poorly they perform
Also would be interested in anyones opinion of any other props
(good or bad) they have used.
Thank You
Gene
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
I've got a certified Sensenich 72 x 42 and I'm not all that happy with
it. On the way back from OSH in 2005, I flew through some pretty heavy
rain (got myself soaked). The rain knocked all the varnish off the
brass leading edge, although the varnish on the wood itself seemed to
hold up alright. I don't think it is pitched right for a Pietenpol
climb prop as I can't get full redline RPM in level flight at full
throttle. I've got a St. Croix that is 74 x 36 that I want to try this
spring, to see if I can get a little better climb.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
HVandervoo(at)aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 12:44 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
Gene,
I use a Tennessee prop, 64 x 34 on my Corvair powered Piet.
It is a well made prop, I have the urethane leading edge option.
The prop is excellently balanced and performs well,
I have about 40 hours on it and it show little wear, I fly from grass.
I would definitely buy from Tennessee prop again
Hans
_________________________________________________
This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privilege
d, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it i
n error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any
other use of the email by you is prohibited.
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - N
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KMHeide <kmheidecpo(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
Gene,
I do not know much about props but can tell you my experience with Tennessee
Props.
I ordered one for my Challenger Ultralight some 9 years ago. Upon receiving it,
I tested it for balance and found it to be near perfect! Having said that,
of the other 5-8 challenger operators whom had the same prop, none were even close
to being balanced. As I recalled, the blade would drop quite fast to the
bottom of our balance rod. Many people sanded their until close to balance and
then re-coated them. I eventually ordered the Warp Drive three blade ground adjustable
for less noise and better performance. Again....just my 2 pennies worth.
I hope they have improved since then....
Ken H
Fargo Pietenpol Association (FPA)
Gene and Tammy wrote:
I'm looking into buying another prop for my A-65 powered Piet. Does
anyone have any knowledge of Cloudcars or Tennessee props and how well or how
poorly they perform
Also would be interested in anyones opinion of any other props (good or bad)
they have used.
Thank You
Gene
---------------------------------
Bored stiff? Loosen up...
Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick Navratil" <horzpool(at)goldengate.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
I'm with you on that, Jack. A couple of weeks ago in discussion,
someone had much better climb performance with the same engine. It
would be worth the change if we could climb out better.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: Phillips, Jack
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 11:55 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I've got a certified Sensenich 72 x 42 and I'm not all that happy with
it. On the way back from OSH in 2005, I flew through some pretty heavy
rain (got myself soaked). The rain knocked all the varnish off the
brass leading edge, although the varnish on the wood itself seemed to
hold up alright. I don't think it is pitched right for a Pietenpol
climb prop as I can't get full redline RPM in level flight at full
throttle. I've got a St. Croix that is 74 x 36 that I want to try this
spring, to see if I can get a little better climb.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-Listhttp://forums.matronics.
com _________________________________________________
This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain
privileged, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have
received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands
- N
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
Once again, Thanks everyone for all of the good input. As I understand
it, what may work well from one prop maker will not necessarily work
well from another.
I have been told by one prop maker that he thought 74X38 would be the
best all around prop for the 65 Piet. Anyone use this prop?
Gene
N502R
Tennessee
----- Original Message -----
From: Dick Navratil
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 9:16 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I'm with you on that, Jack. A couple of weeks ago in discussion,
someone had much better climb performance with the same engine. It
would be worth the change if we could climb out better.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: Phillips, Jack
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 11:55 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I've got a certified Sensenich 72 x 42 and I'm not all that happy
with it. On the way back from OSH in 2005, I flew through some pretty
heavy rain (got myself soaked). The rain knocked all the varnish off
the brass leading edge, although the varnish on the wood itself seemed
to hold up alright. I don't think it is pitched right for a Pietenpol
climb prop as I can't get full redline RPM in level flight at full
throttle. I've got a St. Croix that is 74 x 36 that I want to try this
spring, to see if I can get a little better climb.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-Listhttp://forums.matronics.
com _________________________________________________
This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain
privileged, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have
received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands
- N
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
As I said in an earlier post, I've got a St. Croix that is 74 x 36 and
was supposedly designed for a Pietenpol, as a climb prop. I have not
flown it yet, but will do so this spring.
Jack Phillips
Raleigh, NC - where it is currently snowing on top of the sleet we got
last night.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene and
Tammy
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 9:02 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
Once again, Thanks everyone for all of the good input. As I understand
it, what may work well from one prop maker will not necessarily work
well from another.
I have been told by one prop maker that he thought 74X38 would be the
best all around prop for the 65 Piet. Anyone use this prop?
Gene
N502R
Tennessee
----- Original Message -----
From: Dick Navratil <mailto:horzpool(at)goldengate.net>
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 9:16 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I'm with you on that, Jack. A couple of weeks ago in
discussion, someone had much better climb performance with the same
engine. It would be worth the change if we could climb out better.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: Phillips, Jack <mailto:Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com>
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 11:55 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars &
Tennessee propellers
I've got a certified Sensenich 72 x 42 and I'm not all
that happy with it. On the way back from OSH in 2005, I flew through
some pretty heavy rain (got myself soaked). The rain knocked all the
varnish off the brass leading edge, although the varnish on the wood
itself seemed to hold up alright. I don't think it is pitched right for
a Pietenpol climb prop as I can't get full redline RPM in level flight
at full throttle. I've got a St. Croix that is 74 x 36 that I want to
try this spring, to see if I can get a little better climb.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
http://forums.matronics.com
<http://forums.matronics.com>
_________________________________________________
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and delete
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
| From: | hvandervoo(at)aol.com |
Dan,
Only once and for a short time, less than 5 minutes.
No noticeable difference on the prop.
Not fun in a open cockpit Piet.
Did make some landings in high grass, where the prop acted as a weed-wacker.
I must state I clean my prop after most flights and frequently wax the prop.
The wax (TURTLE WAX) helps in removing bugs and grass stains.
Hans
-----Original Message-----
From: HelsperSew(at)aol.com
Sent: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers
Hans,
You said you had the urethane leading edge on your prop. Have you ever flown through
rain, and if so, how did it hold up?
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
I didn't realize your 74 X 36 was made for a Piet. Where can I get
information on the St Croix? Haven't heard of them before.
If you were a dedicated mentor you'd say "Damn the snow and rain, I'm
going to put that prop on today and fly it so Gene will know if he
should order one." Corky would do that, wouldn't you Corky.
As a side note, I fould Ed Sterba's phone number and I'm giving him a
call today as well as Tennessee Props.
Gene
PS I'll spend the day waiting for your report on how well your St Croix
does.
----- Original Message -----
From: Phillips, Jack
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 8:09 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
As I said in an earlier post, I've got a St. Croix that is 74 x 36 and
was supposedly designed for a Pietenpol, as a climb prop. I have not
flown it yet, but will do so this spring.
Jack Phillips
Raleigh, NC - where it is currently snowing on top of the sleet we got
last night.
----- Original Message -----
From: Dick Navratil
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 9:16 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I'm with you on that, Jack. A couple of weeks ago in discussion,
someone had much better climb performance with the same engine. It
would be worth the change if we could climb out better.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: Phillips, Jack
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 11:55 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
I've got a certified Sensenich 72 x 42 and I'm not all that happy
with it. On the way back from OSH in 2005, I flew through some pretty
heavy rain (got myself soaked). The rain knocked all the varnish off
the brass leading edge, although the varnish on the wood itself seemed
to hold up alright. I don't think it is pitched right for a Pietenpol
climb prop as I can't get full redline RPM in level flight at full
throttle. I've got a St. Croix that is 74 x 36 that I want to try this
spring, to see if I can get a little better climb.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-Listhttp://forums.matronics.
com _________________________________________________ This message is
for the designated recipient only and may contain privileged,
proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it
in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete Dansk -
Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - N
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ttp://forums.matronics.com
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Abramson" <davea(at)symbolicdisplays.com> |
| Subject: | Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
The Phone # for St Croix Aircraft 1-641-322-4041 Chad Wille is the
man!!!!!!!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Gene and
Tammy
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 7:11 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers
I didn't realize your 74 X 36 was made for a Piet. Where can I get
information on the St Croix? Haven't heard of them before.
If you were a dedicated mentor you'd say "Damn the snow and rain, I'm going
to put that prop on today and fly it so Gene will know if he should order
one." Corky would do that, wouldn't you Corky.
As a side note, I fould Ed Sterba's phone number and I'm giving him a call
today as well as Tennessee Props.
Gene
PS I'll spend the day waiting for your report on how well your St Croix
does.
----- Original Message -----
From: Phillips, Jack <mailto:Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 8:09 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers
As I said in an earlier post, I've got a St. Croix that is 74 x 36 and was
supposedly designed for a Pietenpol, as a climb prop. I have not flown it
yet, but will do so this spring.
Jack Phillips
Raleigh, NC - where it is currently snowing on top of the sleet we got last
night.
----- Original Message -----
From: Dick Navratil <mailto:horzpool(at)goldengate.net>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 9:16 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers
I'm with you on that, Jack. A couple of weeks ago in discussion, someone
had much better climb performance with the same engine. It would be worth
the change if we could climb out better.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: Phillips, Jack <mailto:Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 11:55 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers
I've got a certified Sensenich 72 x 42 and I'm not all that happy with it.
On the way back from OSH in 2005, I flew through some pretty heavy rain (got
myself soaked). The rain knocked all the varnish off the brass leading
edge, although the varnish on the wood itself seemed to hold up alright. I
don't think it is pitched right for a Pietenpol climb prop as I can't get
full redline RPM in level flight at full throttle. I've got a St. Croix
that is 74 x 36 that I want to try this spring, to see if I can get a little
better climb.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
http://forums.matronics.com
_________________________________________________
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
Dave,
Thank you for the phone #. I'll give Chad a call.
--- Original Message -----
From: Dave Abramson
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 10:12 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
The Phone # for St Croix Aircraft 1-641-322-4041 Chad Wille is the
man!!!!!!!
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
http://forums.matronics.com
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Brake calipers, slow flight |
Question: I asked this once before but don't recall what the responses were
-- what would you all recommend for disk brake calipers. I see that at the
bottom end there are Manco mechanically actuated calipers that are very
inexpensive and from there calipers go up to more than $100 for juice actuated
brakes. Let me know your thoughts -- I've got the Jenny-style landing gear.
Speaking of slow flight -- way back in 1978 I learned to fly in a 150-HP
SuperCub. The day of my flight exam it was cold and rather windy but we went out
anyway. The winds aloft were even stronger straight out of the Northwest,
gusting to 35 mph...while demonstrating slow flight the examiner had me head
into that northwesterly wind because he wanted to see if we could go backwards.
I had it slowed down just hanging on the prop and edge of a stall until we
almost did creep backwards over the ground! We sure weren't moving ahead!
The FBO sold the Cub not long after that -- always loved that airplane and I
was told by the FBO owner that I was the first person to get a private ticket
in a tailwheel airplane at the La Crosse airport in nearly 20 years. The
SuperCub sure wasn't fast, but she'd sure get off the ground quick. Never used
the flaps either, preferring to slip her in -- great fun! In fact, my
instructor had neglected to teach me about the flaps and the first time I used
them
was on that check ride!
Enough rambling --let me know your thoughts on brake calipers...Many thanks!
Fred Beseler
La Crosse, WI
_TBYH(at)aol.com_ (mailto:TBYH(at)aol.com)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom Stinemetze" <tstinemetze(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | RE: Short Landings |
Just so the list members won't think that I died or gave up on my
Pietenpol project since you haven't heard from me for about 6-months -
just a word of update. I have not been building since I haven't the
funds or time to build at the same time that I am taking flying lessons.
Well, that's about to change as I passed my Private Pilot check ride
about two hours ago. Winds 18 kts gusting to 25 - WHAT WAS I THINKING?
Well, it was either do it today or wait and see what the next ice storm
/ blizzard / "winter mix" has in store for us this weekend. I want to
hear all your "ho humm" stories about how easy your check ride was.
Back to the Workshop for me!
Tom Stinemetze
McPherson, KS
____ | ____
\8/
/ \
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | passed your checkride ! |
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
Way to go Tom Stinemetze on passing your private checkride and letting
us know !!!!
Sure is more fun to build a Piet if you know you are qualified to fly it
when you're done.
Excellent. I half think that you have a better chance of passing a
checkride on a rough
day since you have to prove you can handle the plane in adverse
conditions---and you did !
Loved my checkride in 1981. WWII veteran. Instructor from Kent State
University named Dick Schwabe.
He flew more of the checkride than I did because he rarely got time in
much else than 150's and I
showed up in a Grumman AA-1B. Still a rough, windy day and despite my
flaws, he passed me.
Mike C.
PS-- you'll sleep good tonight
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jdavis2a(at)wmconnect.com |
| Subject: | Re: RE: Short Landings |
CONGRATS!!!!!! from Tulsa
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Brake calipers, slow flight |
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
Fred,
I've got regular Cleveland 8" discs on mine. Got 'em on ebay for $25.
The pads were worn and had to be replaced (okay, add another $22 to the
cost) but they work fine. Any less brake and I wouldn't be able to hold
it for a runup. I've got the Jenny style gear and 21" wheels. Those
big wheels are mighty hard to stop. Airplanes quit using big wheels
about the time they started using brakes.
Jack Phillips
Snow has stopped in Raleigh. Now it's just foggy. And COLD
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
TBYH(at)aol.com
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 2:38 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Brake calipers, slow flight
Question: I asked this once before but don't recall what the responses
were -- what would you all recommend for disk brake calipers. I see that
at the bottom end there are Manco mechanically actuated calipers that
are very inexpensive and from there calipers go up to more than $100 for
juice actuated brakes. Let me know your thoughts -- I've got the
Jenny-style landing gear.
Speaking of slow flight -- way back in 1978 I learned to fly in a 150-HP
SuperCub. The day of my flight exam it was cold and rather windy but we
went out anyway. The winds aloft were even stronger straight out of the
Northwest, gusting to 35 mph...while demonstrating slow flight the
examiner had me head into that northwesterly wind because he wanted to
see if we could go backwards. I had it slowed down just hanging on the
prop and edge of a stall until we almost did creep backwards over the
ground! We sure weren't moving ahead!
The FBO sold the Cub not long after that -- always loved that airplane
and I was told by the FBO owner that I was the first person to get a
private ticket in a tailwheel airplane at the La Crosse airport in
nearly 20 years. The SuperCub sure wasn't fast, but she'd sure get off
the ground quick. Never used the flaps either, preferring to slip her in
-- great fun! In fact, my instructor had neglected to teach me about the
flaps and the first time I used them was on that check ride!
Enough rambling --let me know your thoughts on brake calipers...Many
thanks!
Fred Beseler
La Crosse, WI
TBYH(at)aol.com
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| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
Fred,
I purchased Comet brake calipers at a local lawnmower/ go-kart shop
http://www.hoffcocomet.com/comet/aftermarket-brakes.asp (scroll down
when
you get there) and traded aerial photos of a machinist friend's home for
him to turn some rotors that fit my wheel hubs. My wheels are 19" and
my rotors are 6" in diameter and the Comet DC Series caliper just hold
me for run-up and no more---which works out fine. As you've seen my
plane at Brodhead, I made up heel
brakes ala Cub/Champ and actuate the calipers with 1/16" cable. Lots of
ATV brakes out there too now which I'm sure would be worth looking into
depending
on what suites you.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Brake calipers, slow flight |
OK, OK, Guess the fog lets you out of the propeller trial.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Phillips, Jack
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 3:27 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Brake calipers, slow flight
Fred,
I've got regular Cleveland 8" discs on mine. Got 'em on ebay for $25.
The pads were worn and had to be replaced (okay, add another $22 to the
cost) but they work fine. Any less brake and I wouldn't be able to hold
it for a runup. I've got the Jenny style gear and 21" wheels. Those
big wheels are mighty hard to stop. Airplanes quit using big wheels
about the time they started using brakes.
Jack Phillips
Snow has stopped in Raleigh. Now it's just foggy. And COLD
ttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Singleton" <slsingleton(at)cvalley.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: Short Landings |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Stinemetze" <tstinemetze(at)cox.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 1:56 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: RE: Short Landings
>
>
> Just so the list members won't think that I died or gave up on my
> Pietenpol project since you haven't heard from me for about 6-months -
> just a word of update. I have not been building since I haven't the
> funds or time to build at the same time that I am taking flying lessons.
> Well, that's about to change as I passed my Private Pilot check ride
> about two hours ago. Winds 18 kts gusting to 25 - WHAT WAS I THINKING?
> Well, it was either do it today or wait and see what the next ice storm
> / blizzard / "winter mix" has in store for us this weekend. I want to
> hear all your "ho humm" stories about how easy your check ride was.
>
> Back to the Workshop for me!
>
> Tom Stinemetze
> McPherson, KS
>
> ____ | ____
> \8/
> / \
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Singleton" <slsingleton(at)cvalley.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: Short Landings |
Congradulations Tom! Happy for you. Steve Singleton
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Stinemetze" <tstinemetze(at)cox.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 1:56 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: RE: Short Landings
>
>
> Just so the list members won't think that I died or gave up on my
> Pietenpol project since you haven't heard from me for about 6-months -
> just a word of update. I
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | passed your checkride! |
There is only one time in your life when you will pass your private pilot
checkride, Tom, so savor the moment. I remember mine like it was yesterday.
Andy Anderson, old-time instructor at David Wayne Hooks Memorial field
outside of Houston, TX- gave me my checkride. Smooth and strong as an old
hickory walking stick was old Andy, skin was the color of walnut and just as
sturdy. I took my ride in a Piper Warrior that I knew inside and out and it
went great. Andy pulled the old "darn... these old fingers... I dropped my
pencil down there by the flap handle. Would you reach and get it while I
try to fold this sectional, please?" while he put the airplane in an unusual
attitude and messed up my inner ear. No problem; I recovered it and we
moved on.
He put me through the paces and I wanted him to. I wanted to please that
examiner more than anything else in the world. He was my golden gate to my
flying future and I wanted his name in my logbook that day. I wanted to
show him that I knew how to fly an airplane.
When we landed and he signed me off (he never really said I'd passed until
he had signed me off), he told me that he used to be a Navy basic training
instructor during the war and that he had sent boys younger than me off to
fly fighters and bombers in a war, with fewer hours than I had in my
logbook, and we're not talking about Piper Warriors either. Don't sell
yourself short... the human mind and body can learn and perform things far
more complex than flying a single-engine light aircraft with much less
training than we receive, especially when we're doing something that we
fervently enjoy and want to excel at. Now you have your ticket to learn. I
found out that these old airplanes are good teachers, too ;o)
Now follow me off my wing as I fly 41CC through that big field with the
trees alongside it up ahead. The space between the trees and the fencerow
is plenty wide enough to clear our wingtips. Smoke on and down onto the
deck!!!
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
The MSN Entertainment Guide to Golden Globes is here. Get all the scoop.
http://tv.msn.com/tv/globes2007/?icid=nctagline2
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: down in 230' |
In a message dated 1/17/2007 7:02:18 AM Central Standard Time,
Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com writes:
Winds were 250 at
20 kts, gusts to 25 (remember the winds that morning, Chuck?).
Ah yes, Jack, I remember that morning well. Brodhead '05, and you took off
shortly before I did, en route to that other show up north. You must have
stayed low on that leg, because the winds at 3000' msl where I was, were quite
different. I don't really know why I climbed that high...I think I just wanted
to see more of the beautiful Wisconsin countryside from the higher altitude. I
got about 15 miles to the north of Brodhead, trying to track to the North,
but the strong winds out of the West caused the nose of my plane to point almost
directly West !! I had almost full power in, and was indicating just over 75
mph, and according to my GPS, I had about 15 mph. ground speed. At one
point, I noticed a tower to the North, between the right struts a couple of miles
away. Five minutes later that tower was still in the same place...10 minutes
later, still there...15 minutes later that tower didn't change location !!
I've never been in that situation before, where I'm trying to track north,
heading west, with almost full power in and getting nowhere. It was a strange
feeling. I decided to abort the leg to Oshkosh, and headed back to Brodhead.
For
a while, I wasn't sure that I could even make it back, till I dropped to a
much lower altitude where the winds weren't quite as strong. I finally made it
back to Brodhead, and rode up to Oshkosh with Dennis & Kathy E. We had a great
time there, but I never could find Jack.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
In a message dated 1/18/2007 8:13:15 AM Central Standard Time,
Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com writes:
As I said in an earlier post, I=99ve got a St. Croix that is 74 x 36 a
nd was
supposedly designed for a Pietenpol, as a climb prop. I have not flown it y
et,
but will do so this spring.
Jack,
I'm very interested in how the 74 X 36 prop changes the performance of your
plane. I think the longer blades, with a shorter pitch would work better on
a
Pietenpol...at least as far as climb / short field take off performance, but
I've never heard of anyone using that prop on their Piet. It just seems lik
e
the standard prop for an A 65 has always been a 72 X 42 prop.
Chuck G.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
I never got more than 500 feet off the ground on that trip, Chuck
(typical Pietenpol altitude for me). I know why you went high - trying
to get out of the turbulence down low. It about beat me to death. Down
low the winds were more from the west-southwet and I had a pretty good
tailwind component. As I recall, I was seeing groundspeed on the GPS of
around 90 mph.
I only stayed at OSH until Wednesday morning, then took off for the long
trip home.
I'm bringing the RV-4 this year. Will you have your Tailwind at
Brodhead this summer?
Jack
Trying to stay focused on building the RV-10 (yawn). Not as much
challenge or fun as a Pietenpol, but slightly better for travelling
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Rcaprd(at)aol.com
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2007 1:10 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: down in 230'
In a message dated 1/17/2007 7:02:18 AM Central Standard Time,
Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com writes:
Winds were 250 at
20 kts, gusts to 25 (remember the winds that morning, Chuck?).
Ah yes, Jack, I remember that morning well. Brodhead '05, and you took
off shortly before I did, en route to that other show up north. You
must have stayed low on that leg, because the winds at 3000' msl where I
was, were quite different. I don't really know why I climbed that
high...I think I just wanted to see more of the beautiful Wisconsin
countryside from the higher altitude. I got about 15 miles to the north
of Brodhead, trying to track to the North, but the strong winds out of
the West caused the nose of my plane to point almost directly West !! I
had almost full power in, and was indicating just over 75 mph, and
according to my GPS, I had about 15 mph. ground speed. At one point, I
noticed a tower to the North, between the right struts a couple of miles
away. Five minutes later that tower was still in the same place...10
minutes later, still there...15 minutes later that tower didn't change
location !! I've never been in that situation before, where I'm trying
to track north, heading west, with almost full power in and getting
nowhere. It was a strange feeling. I decided to abort the leg to
Oshkosh, and headed back to Brodhead. For a while, I wasn't sure that I
could even make it back, till I dropped to a much lower altitude where
the winds weren't quite as strong. I finally made it back to Brodhead,
and rode up to Oshkosh with Dennis & Kathy E. We had a great time
there, but I never could find Jack.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
_________________________________________________
This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privilege
d, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it i
n error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any
other use of the email by you is prohibited.
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - N
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee propellers |
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
As I indicated, I hope to do the prop swap this spring - probably after
I fly the Pietenpol to Sun 'n' Fun. I wish I had a second prop hub -
then the swap would be easier. The St. Croix came from a fellow in our
EAA Chapter who had started a Pietenpol project with a couple of other
fellows years ago. He bought the prop and then decided he didn't like
the workmanship the rest of the team was doing, so he took his prop and
left the partnership. When he found I was building a Piet, he offered
to sell it to me for what he paid for it in the early '80's - $125. I
bought the Sensenich because I wanted to get my test time down to 25
hours, and I thought it would perform better. If the St. Croix works as
well as I think it will, I'll probably sell the Sensenich.
Jack
NX899JP
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Rcaprd(at)aol.com
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2007 1:23 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jay Anderson Cloudcars & Tennessee
propellers
In a message dated 1/18/2007 8:13:15 AM Central Standard Time,
Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com writes:
As I said in an earlier post, I've got a St. Croix that is 74 x
36 and was supposedly designed for a Pietenpol, as a climb prop. I have
not flown it yet, but will do so this spring.
Jack,
I'm very interested in how the 74 X 36 prop changes the performance of
your plane. I think the longer blades, with a shorter pitch would work
better on a Pietenpol...at least as far as climb / short field take off
performance, but I've never heard of anyone using that prop on their
Piet. It just seems like the standard prop for an A 65 has always been
a 72 X 42 prop.
Chuck G.
_________________________________________________
This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privilege
d, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it i
n error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any
other use of the email by you is prohibited.
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - N
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
Jack wrote-
>I wish I had a second prop hub - then the swap would be easier.
I take it that you have a tapered shaft hub and the prop bolts are the
problem? But if both props have the same thickness at the hub, can't you
use the same length bolts? What's easier about pulling and swapping the
entire prop and prop hub over swapping just the prop on the same hub?
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
Search for grocery stores. Find gratitude. Turn a simple search into
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
Yes, I have a tapered shaft. If I had an additional hub, I could mount
the new prop to the spare hub, then just pull the entire prop/hub
assembly off the engine and install the new one, without ever having to
remove and re-torque the prop bolts. Unfortunately, a new hub assembly
sells for somewhere in the $500 neighborhood. I bought another one on
ebay for about $100, but I was dissappointed with its quality and don't
consider it airworthy.
The tapered shaft is a pretty neat concept. The thread on the end of
the shaft allows the threaded collar on the hub to act as a "prop
puller". By inserting a 1/2" diameter rod into the hole in that collar,
you can just unscrew the whole assembly, backing the hub off the keyed
taper of the crankshaft.
Jack Phillips
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Oscar
Zuniga
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2007 8:57 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: prop swaps
Jack wrote-
>I wish I had a second prop hub - then the swap would be easier.
I take it that you have a tapered shaft hub and the prop bolts are the
problem? But if both props have the same thickness at the hub, can't
you
use the same length bolts? What's easier about pulling and swapping the
entire prop and prop hub over swapping just the prop on the same hub?
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
Search for grocery stores. Find gratitude. Turn a simple search into
something more.
http://click4thecause.live.com/search/charity/default.aspx?source=hmemta
gline_gratitude&FORM=WLMTAG
_________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joe Krzes" <jkrzes(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | passed your checkride! |
Yep, Ol' Andy reached down and shut the fuel off on the C-150 during my
checkride (also at DWH).
I passed. Shirt tail that was hung up in the hanger is long gone, but I
have the other part of the shirt :)
Joe
>From: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
>
>Andy Anderson, old-time instructor at David Wayne Hooks Memorial field
>outside of Houston, TX- gave me my checkride. Smooth and strong as an old
>hickory walking stick was old Andy, skin was the color of walnut and just
>as sturdy. I took my ride in a Piper Warrior that I knew inside and out
>and it went great. Andy pulled the old "darn... these old fingers... I
>dropped my pencil down there by the flap handle. Would you reach and get
>it while I try to fold this sectional, please?" while he put the airplane
>in an unusual attitude and messed up my inner ear. No problem; I recovered
>it and we moved on.
_________________________________________________________________
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | passed your checkride! |
| From: | Hans Vander Voort <hans.vander.voort(at)alfalaval.com> |
Well I don't know Andy,
But DWH is where I passed my check ride, still rent an airplane there once
in a while.
The flight school is moving away from aluminum steam gage Cessna's and has
now plastic & glass Katana and Cirrus on the flight line.
Hans
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | taper-shaft prop hubs, Continentals |
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
I agree with the practical nature of the taper-shaft prop hub design
Jack, but in reality it really wouldn't take you much longer than
an hour to remove your prop/hub assembly, knock the prop bolts out, and
re-install, torque, and track your other prop. We are
supposed to totally relax our prop bolts once a year then re-torque and
check after about 45 minutes again so you're almost 1/2 way
there with that procedure alone. I'm preaching to the choir I know,
but worth a thought I think. Too bad your weather has turned to
crap like us, but tis winter.
Mike C.
PS-- the guy who sold me my engine (runout, no logs from North Carolina,
incidentally) was not happy with himself after he found out
he should have sold me the engine sans the taper-shaft prop hub since he
could have sold it for a third again as much as he sold me
the entire engine, carb, mags, and hub for ! (I didn't know how much
those were worth either until I had the engine home in my basement)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom Stinemetze" <tstinemetze(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: passed your check ride! |
> Now follow me off my wing as I fly 41CC through that big field
with the
trees alongside it up ahead. The space between the trees and the
fencerow
is plenty wide enough to clear our wingtips. Smoke on and down
onto the
deck!!! <
Oscar: Thanks for that great story. Now I'm going to have to put smoke
in the Piet for sure. Maybe I can join you, Mike C., and Chuck G. and
fog for mosquitoes at Broadhead. I hear they get pretty big up there.
Tom Stinemetze
____ | ____
\8/
/ \
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: down in 230' |
In a message dated 1/19/2007 7:00:09 AM Central Standard Time,
Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com writes:
I never got more than 500 feet off the ground on that trip, Chuck (typical
Pietenpol altitude for me). I know why you went high =93 trying to ge
t out of the
turbulence down low. It about beat me to death. Down low the winds were
more from the west-southwet and I had a pretty good tailwind component. As
I
recall, I was seeing groundspeed on the GPS of around 90 mph.
I only stayed at OSH until Wednesday morning, then took off for the long tri
p
home.
I=99m bringing the RV-4 this year. Will you have your Tailwind at Bro
dhead
this summer?
Jack,
Yes, you are right about that turbulence...it was pretty rough down low. I
think we got going too late in the morning. It was the only flight that I'v
e
ever made, that I didn't make my intended destination. Every flight is
certainly a Learning Experience, and I love it !!
I'm hoping to get both wings complete this winter, in the environmentally
controlled atmosphere of my Dining Room. Having done that, I'll be able to
pre-fit them to the fuselage in the spring, and then complete the fuselage.
I
think the cowling is going to take me a long time to build, because I hope t
o make
a very efficient cooling system. Instrument panel will be two flat screens,
with a small steam gauges - ASI and Altimeter as backup. If I didn't have t
o
go to work every day, I could certainly have 'er going by mid summer. Be th
at
as it may, I think it will be a next summer '08 before she graces the skies.
Jack,I hope you still have that spam can RV-4 then !!
Chuck G.
NX770CG
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 1/19/2007 11:09:09 AM Central Standard Time,
taildrags(at)hotmail.com writes:
You don't see the airport until you're practically over it, which means you
need a fairly steep approach over the trees once you're there. I guess with
the Piet all you'd have to do is chop the power and you'd come right down.
Oscar,
That reminds me of where NX41CC first broke the surely bonds of earth, and
was born - Bluebird Hill Airport (5F5). I think I probably still slipped it
in a little.
Ol' Corky warned me not to get it mixed up with another small airstrip that
is a couple of miles to the west. "If you land there, you will be shot on
sight !!" Hummmm....OK, Corky...I'll keep that in mind.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: passed your check ride! |
In a message dated 1/19/2007 6:32:33 PM Central Standard Time,
tstinemetze(at)cox.net writes:
Oscar: Thanks for that great story. Now I'm going to have to put smoke
in the Piet for sure. Maybe I can join you, Mike C., and Chuck G. and
fog for mosquitoes at Broadhead. I hear they get pretty big up there.
Hey Tom,
Congrats on your checkride !! I'm going to make a flight up to McPhereson
sometime this spring, and give you some stick time in my plane...I have the
stick, throttle and now I have an intercom in the front cockpit, but I didn't
install the pedals, because unless you have very short legs, there is just not
enough room up there. Besides, the rudder pedals would be in the way of cargo,
where as the stick is easily removed.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
Wichita, KS with 6 or 7 inches on snow on the ground since yesterday
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Holland" <at7000ft(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: passed your checkride ! |
You are right about taking check rides on rough days Mike, on my Private
check ride a long time ago the crosswinds were too strong do short field
landing approaches so the examiner just asked me to describe how I would do
them and that was good enough. However if the winds are real bad he could
just ask you to come back and complete the testing on another day.
Rick
On 1/18/07, Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC] wrote:
>
> michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov>
>
>
> Way to go Tom Stinemetze on passing your private checkride and letting
> us know !!!!
> Sure is more fun to build a Piet if you know you are qualified to fly it
> when you're done.
> Excellent. I half think that you have a better chance of passing a
> checkride on a rough
> day since you have to prove you can handle the plane in adverse
> conditions---and you did !
>
> Loved my checkride in 1981. WWII veteran. Instructor from Kent State
> University named Dick Schwabe.
> He flew more of the checkride than I did because he rarely got time in
> much else than 150's and I
> showed up in a Grumman AA-1B. Still a rough, windy day and despite my
> flaws, he passed me.
>
> Mike C.
>
> PS-- you'll sleep good tonight
>
>
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Holland" <at7000ft(at)gmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: down in 230' |
A guy in our chapter is also building an RV-10, never seen so many clecos in
my life, think he said he had a total of around 10,000 rivets to drive, is
that right?
Rick
On 1/19/07, Phillips, Jack wrote:
>
>
> I'm bringing the RV-4 this year. Will you have your Tailwind at Brodhead
> this summer?
>
>
> Jack
>
> Trying to stay focused on building the RV-10 (yawn). Not as much
> challenge or fun as a Pietenpol, but slightly better for travelling
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> *From:* owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Rcaprd(at)aol.com
> *Sent:* Friday, January 19, 2007 1:10 AM
> *To:* pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Pietenpol-List: down in 230'
>
>
> In a message dated 1/17/2007 7:02:18 AM Central Standard Time,
> Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com writes:
>
> Winds were 250 at
> 20 kts, gusts to 25 (remember the winds that morning, Chuck?).
>
> Ah yes, Jack, I remember that morning well. Brodhead '05, and you took
> off shortly before I did, en route to that other show up north. You must
> have stayed low on that leg, because the winds at 3000' msl where I was,
> were quite different. I don't really know why I climbed that high...I think
> I just wanted to see more of the beautiful Wisconsin countryside from the
> higher altitude. I got about 15 miles to the north of Brodhead, trying to
> track to the North, but the strong winds out of the West caused the nose of
> my plane to point almost directly West !! I had almost full power in, and
> was indicating just over 75 mph, and according to my GPS, I had about 15
> mph. ground speed. At one point, I noticed a tower to the North, between
> the right struts a couple of miles away. Five minutes later that tower was
> still in the same place...10 minutes later, still there...15 minutes later
> that tower didn't change location !! I've never been in that situation
> before, where I'm trying to track north, heading west, with almost full
> power in and getting nowhere. It was a strange feeling. I decided to abort
> the leg to Oshkosh, and headed back to Brodhead. For a while, I wasn't sure
> that I could even make it back, till I dropped to a much lower altitude
> where the winds weren't quite as strong. I finally made it back to
> Brodhead, and rode up to Oshkosh with Dennis & Kathy E. We had a great time
> there, but I never could find Jack.
>
>
> Chuck G.
>
> NX770CG
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
>
> _________________________________________________
>
>
> Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - N
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Verthein <minoxphotographer(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Steamin' Curious |
Since I'm still in the planing and gathering stages of the project, I
noticed on the Pietenpol Official Website in the discussion on
construction, it says "no steaming" necessary for rib construction, yet
here it's often discussed. What's the scoop on that?
Tim in Bovey
==
You *can* repair a flip-flop with a capacitor!
==
Have a burning question?
Go to www.Answers.yahoo.com and get answers from real people who know.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | del magsam <farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Steamin' Curious |
It means that you don't have to steam anything but some people do anyway. I didn't
and got along just fine, but maybe others like to think of their longerons
without that much pressure/stress on them. A personal choice....works either
way
Del
Tim Verthein wrote:
Since I'm still in the planing and gathering stages of the project, I
noticed on the Pietenpol Official Website in the discussion on
construction, it says "no steaming" necessary for rib construction, yet
here it's often discussed. What's the scoop on that?
Tim in Bovey
==
You *can* repair a flip-flop with a capacitor!
==
Have a burning question?
Go to www.Answers.yahoo.com and get answers from real people who know.
Del-New Richmond, Wi
"farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com"
---------------------------------
It's here! Your new message!
Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "walt evans" <waltdak(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Steamin' Curious |
Tim,
My feeling was that I didn't want to take the chance of breaking a rib cap,
so I steamed,,,or actually "steeped"
Every day I'd come home from work, and put on a pot of water to boil. By the
time I'd changed, the water was boiling.
Carried it down to the aircraft factory (cellar). And poured it into a
thing I'd made out of 1 1/4" (or 1 1/2") white PVC pipe. It was capped and
vertical, and about 16" tall. This was mounted on a wood block so it was
self standing.
I'd pour the water in the pipe, and insert the end on the next capstrip.
And it would "steep" while I put away the completed rib I'd done the day
before , and removed the prior rib from the jig ready to get the second side
of gussets, and lay that aside.
Now lay the bottom cap strip in the jig, pull the top strip out of the pipe
and bend it beautifully around the jig top formers, and procede to cut the
rest of the rib "sticks".
When done, pull the internal sticks out, after numbering them, and mix a
batch of T-88. that rib got glued with one side gussets,,,and the previous
nites got a final set of gussets. this drill goes on for 30 some odd days
till the gussets are done.
I usually left the rib work for the last hour or so of the work day. Kind
of played it by ear,,,when I had an hour left in me,,I'd switch to the rib
job. Before you know it the ribs are done.
They are all the same except for the end ribs that have more sticks.
walt evans
NX140DL
PS Just remember that T-88 work just as well on wet wood as dry,,,amazing!
read the specs
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Verthein" <minoxphotographer(at)yahoo.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 4:20 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Steamin' Curious
>
>
> Since I'm still in the planing and gathering stages of the project, I
> noticed on the Pietenpol Official Website in the discussion on
> construction, it says "no steaming" necessary for rib construction, yet
> here it's often discussed. What's the scoop on that?
>
> Tim in Bovey
>
> ==
> You *can* repair a flip-flop with a capacitor!
> ==
>
>
> Have a burning question?
> Go to www.Answers.yahoo.com and get answers from real people who know.
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick Navratil" <horzpool(at)goldengate.net> |
A question for any who are more experienced at Oxy/actl welding. I was
making some parts today and kept having that popping in the molten pool.
Sometimes I can work away without having it occur but today it was
blowing holes in my tubing.That is real frustrating.
Can someone tell me what I am doing wrong.
Dick N.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "GlennThomas(at)flyingwood.com" <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Steamin' Curious |
I did things very close to the way Walt explains. Although, Walt being a
better man than I, got it done in 30 days. I do a rib whenever I can and
have been lucky to get 3 or 4 a week lately and have been at it for 9
months. Today just finished up rib #20. 12 more to go. Watching them add
up in my study is keeping me active in the shop. Renovations on my house
took me out of the game for a couple months but I've been staying pretty
committed to getting the ribs done the last month or so.
Steaming...
I originally made something that just allowed steam to pass by them and it
didn't seem to penetrate (even after an hour) and the capstrip broke when
clamping into the bending jig. ...so I put a wine bottle full of water
(kind of a double-boiler) in the steam chamber and let them sit there while
I make a rib. When the gussets are all on the second side of the last rib
and then the gussets of the first side of the next rib is done I pull it out
of the steamer and put it in a bending jig to set it's curve. Every day out
in the rib factory it's a similar routine:
1. Start a capstrip in the steamer.
2. Put the Side B gussets on the last half-completed rib.
3. Cut and fit into the rib jig all the pieces and put the Side A gussets
on using the capstrip now dry in the bending jig from the previous day.
(Doesn't necessarily have to be dry, just fits my pace/routine.)
4. Put the freshly steamed capstrip in the bending jig.
It only takes a day (actually a few hours) to do those 4 steps, so if you
have the time you definitely should be able to do it in a month. (and I
clamp my gussets using a custom clamping rib jig) If you use staples or
nails you could make more than 1 rib per day. I like the no-nails look and
the reduced weight. Time up front spent on a jig that clamps is reclaimed
in the end. Idea was stolen from Bill Church on MyKitPlanes.com. Lots of
great pictures of his and other projects there too.
Everybody has a slightly different way of doing things and if you go to
Brodhead and see them side by side you can see their many subtle differences
but all recognizably Pietepols, very cool. If you didn't scratch your head
and come up with your own way to build each part you missed out on the fun.
Glenn W. Thomas
Storrs, CT
http://www.flyingwood.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gcardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net> |
Hi Dick,
Increase the flow of gas. The popping is the welding gases igniting
inside the torch because the tip is getting too hot.
Greg C.
----- Original Message -----
From: Dick Navratil
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 8:15 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: welding
A question for any who are more experienced at Oxy/actl welding. I
was making some parts today and kept having that popping in the molten
pool. Sometimes I can work away without having it occur but today it
was blowing holes in my tubing.That is real frustrating.
Can someone tell me what I am doing wrong.
Dick N.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lshutks(at)webtv.net (Leon Stefan) |
Hi Dick: Ditto what Greg said. That happened to me too and someone
suggested going to a larger tip size for more flow to cool the tip. That
worked for me. Lucky for me I didn't burn the house down. Leon S.
Finally having a white Christmas in Ks.--a mo. late.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
Chuck, I should still have the RV-4 in '08. My original plan was to
sell the RV-4 when it came time to buy the engine for the RV-10 and use
the money to buy a Lycoming IO-540. However, I got an opportunity to
pick up a freshly rebuilt O-540-A1D5 from an Aztec for $13K this past
fall, so I already have the engine for the RV-10 and can keep the RV-4 a
little longer. I'm going to miss it when I finally have to sell it.
The RV-10 will be nice for travel, but that's all. The RV-4 is just
FUN. Not the most comfortable cross-country airplane, though. Karen
gets tired of just staring at the back of my head. I'm hoping to have
the RV-10 finished in early 2009, and at that point I'll have to seel
the -4. Can't afford to keep three airplanes, and I'll never sell the
Pietenpol.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP Pietenpol Air Camper
N18LR RV-4
N142KW RV-10 (under construction)
-----Original Message-----
.=2E. Be that as it may, I think it will be a next summer '08 before she
graces the skies. Jack,I hope you still have that spam can RV-4 then !!
Chuck G.
NX770CG
_________________________________________________
This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privilege
d, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it i
n error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any
other use of the email by you is prohibited.
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - N
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Abramson" <davea(at)symbolicdisplays.com> |
| Subject: | Steamin' Curious |
This is also how I did my ribs....I had a 24" tube that I filled with cold
water. Let the cap strip soak for 8hrs then after work poured out the cold
water and filled with VERY hot water to soak the cap strip in for 5min or
so.... Took it out of the water wiped it off and put it into my rib jig..
you know the rest..... Worked out very well and you get a system after a
while and they move right along.
Cheers,
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of walt evans
Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 3:52 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Steamin' Curious
Tim,
My feeling was that I didn't want to take the chance of breaking a rib cap,
so I steamed,,,or actually "steeped"
Every day I'd come home from work, and put on a pot of water to boil. By the
time I'd changed, the water was boiling.
Carried it down to the aircraft factory (cellar). And poured it into a
thing I'd made out of 1 1/4" (or 1 1/2") white PVC pipe. It was capped and
vertical, and about 16" tall. This was mounted on a wood block so it was
self standing.
I'd pour the water in the pipe, and insert the end on the next capstrip.
And it would "steep" while I put away the completed rib I'd done the day
before , and removed the prior rib from the jig ready to get the second side
of gussets, and lay that aside.
Now lay the bottom cap strip in the jig, pull the top strip out of the pipe
and bend it beautifully around the jig top formers, and procede to cut the
rest of the rib "sticks".
When done, pull the internal sticks out, after numbering them, and mix a
batch of T-88. that rib got glued with one side gussets,,,and the previous
nites got a final set of gussets. this drill goes on for 30 some odd days
till the gussets are done.
I usually left the rib work for the last hour or so of the work day. Kind
of played it by ear,,,when I had an hour left in me,,I'd switch to the rib
job. Before you know it the ribs are done.
They are all the same except for the end ribs that have more sticks.
walt evans
NX140DL
PS Just remember that T-88 work just as well on wet wood as dry,,,amazing!
read the specs
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Verthein" <minoxphotographer(at)yahoo.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 4:20 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Steamin' Curious
>
>
> Since I'm still in the planing and gathering stages of the project, I
> noticed on the Pietenpol Official Website in the discussion on
> construction, it says "no steaming" necessary for rib construction, yet
> here it's often discussed. What's the scoop on that?
>
> Tim in Bovey
>
> ==
> You *can* repair a flip-flop with a capacitor!
> ==
>
>
> Have a burning question?
> Go to www.Answers.yahoo.com and get answers from real people who know.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TGSTONE236(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Steamer for wood bending |
I needed to bend some wood so I made a steamer.
10 ft X 4 inch pvc pipe
2 - 4 inch pvc pipe threaded adapter no need to glue things together. just
slip fit
2 - 4 in pvc threaded plug
1 wallpaper steamer , drill a hole in one plug end for the steamer hose and
some vent holes in the other plug
for the steam to exit. this is the most efficient rig I have ever used for
bending wood. Try it
Ted Stone
Building a Piet one little piece at a time
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed G." <flyboy_120(at)hotmail.com> |
Hi Dick
Popping is caused by burning too small a flame on too big of a tip. use a
smaller tip which will give you a smaller flame but still keep the flow of
gas up enough to cool the tip. Ed G.
>From: "Dick Navratil" <horzpool(at)goldengate.net>
>Reply-To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: welding
>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 20:15:25 -0600
>
>A question for any who are more experienced at Oxy/actl welding. I was
>making some parts today and kept having that popping in the molten pool.
>Sometimes I can work away without having it occur but today it was blowing
>holes in my tubing.That is real frustrating.
>Can someone tell me what I am doing wrong.
>Dick N.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | saving hands and fingers on the table saw |
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
Click on the hot dog demo video if nothing else.
Amazing...a small electrical charge in this saw's blade is constantly
monitored and if your finger or hand
touches the blade it changes the charge slightly that the electronics
are monitoring in the blade
and an aluminum blade brake stops the saw in something like 1/4000th of
a second.
Amazing...a small electrical charge in this saw's blade is constantly
monitored and if your finger or hand
touches the blade it changes the charge slightly that the electronics
are monitoring in the blade
and an aluminum blade brake stops the saw in something like 1/4000th of
a second.
http://www.sawstop.com/
<http://www.sawstop.com/>
________________________________________________________________________________
Dick,
Torch popping/backfiring is often caused by:
1. Holding the inner cone of the flame too close to the puddle, thus
overheating the tip.
2. A partly clogged, or dirty, tip.
3. Using too large a tip for the job, and reducing the gas flow too much
in order to avoid totally melting the work piece.
Possible solutions:
Keep tips clean and use the recommended tip pressures for the tip size
you are using (this may vary with the make of the welding outfit). Keep
inner flame cone clear of the puddle (try 1/8" to 1/4" clearance and
find what works for you). Don't use too large a tip for the job and try
to throttle it back; take the time to switch to a smaller tip, rather
than trying to manage with the too-large tip.
Good luck!
Graham Hansen (Pietenpol CF-AUN)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Singleton" <slsingleton(at)cvalley.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Steamer for wood bending |
I made a temporary steamer useing a 4ft x 6in pipe (galv.) welded one
end shut, set it up over the barbeque grill burner (of cource one end
was higher than the other) fill with water and after a bit the water
boils-stick in as many cap strips as you can hold onto and after 30
seconds in the boiling water took out and clamped them in a wide jig.
done about half the cap strips at a time. I did disect the burner so i
could raise it up somewhat so a 4in concrete block could be put under it
to raise it up to meet the pipe. I'll admit the galv pipe is not ideal
to weld on but it was cheap to make. I also used a srap piece of metal
to close off most of the open end. Had a lot of fun doing this-sometime
i want to try heating a 2x4 and see how much it will bend. Steve
Singleton
----- Original Message -----
From: TGSTONE236(at)aol.com
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 9:06 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Steamer for wood bending
I needed to bend some wood so I made a steamer.
10 ft X 4 inch pvc pipe
2 - 4 inch pvc pipe threaded adapter no need to glue things together.
just slip fit
2 - 4 in pvc threaded plug
1 wallpaper steamer , drill a hole in one plug end for the steamer
hose and some vent holes in the other plug
for the steam to exit. this is the most efficient rig I have ever used
for bending wood. Try it
Ted Stone
Building a Piet one little piece at a time
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom Stinemetze" <tstinemetze(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: passed your check ride! |
Hey Chuck:
Stick time in a real, honest to goodness Air Camper. Now I've got
something to get the juices flowing.
Tom in McPherson
____ | ____
\8/
/ \
> Congrats on your checkride !! I'm going to make a flight up to
McPherson
sometime this spring, and give you some stick time in my plane...I
have the
stick, throttle and now I have an intercom in the front cockpit,
but I didn't
install the pedals, because unless you have very short legs, there
is just not
enough room up there. Besides, the rudder pedals would be in the
way of cargo,
where as the stick is easily removed.>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Whaley" <MerlinFAC(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Fly-In in Central Florida... seeking Piets & other interesting |
airplanes
Hi all,
I know this is a bit off-topic but perhaps it will be of interest to those
of you in Florida... we're having a little fly-in / aviation day type event
on February 17th at Valkaria Airport (X59) and we're trying to round up
"exotic" aircraft to show all the interesting aspects of general and
recreational aviation to the community. ("Exotic" meaning anything except a
white Cessna 152, basically... homebuilts, warbirds, ultralights, balloons,
helicopters, anti-gravity boots, rocket belts, magic flying carpets, big red
bulletproof capes, etc.) Valkaria is a small uncontrolled field a little bit
south of Melbourne on the east coast of Florida, with cheap avgas and some
interesting homebuilt activity.
If anyone is interested in attending, get in touch with me and I can give
you more info, or check out our website:
http://www.mlbpilots.org/ValkariaAirFest/
Thanks!
-Mike
Mike Whaley merlin@ov-10bronco.net
Webmaster, OV-10 Bronco Association
http://www.ov-10bronco.net/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "GlennThomas(at)flyingwood.com" <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com> |
| Subject: | Re: saving hands and fingers on the table saw |
Hmmm,
I wonder if this technology could be adapted to my circa 1950 Cast Iron
Craftsman table saw.
Glenn W. Thomas
Storrs, CT
http://www.flyingwood.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 2:51 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: saving hands and fingers on the table saw
Click on the hot dog demo video if nothing else.
Amazing.a small electrical charge in this saw's blade is constantly
monitored and if your finger or hand
touches the blade it changes the charge slightly that the electronics
are monitoring in the blade
and an aluminum blade brake stops the saw in something like 1/4000th
of a second.
Amazing.a small electrical charge in this saw's blade is constantly
monitored and if your finger or hand
touches the blade it changes the charge slightly that the electronics
are monitoring in the blade
and an aluminum blade brake stops the saw in something like 1/4000th
of a second.
http://www.sawstop.com/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | snow in Texas Metric snow? |
Steve in Maine wrote-
>Looks to me like you got 20 cm. Glad to see you use the metric system
Alright, lay off. So I played on "special effects" a little bit. Maybe
that just adds to the humor, OK? I could have said that the tape was a
scaling tape used by loggers to measure tree diameter.
>Do you get metric snowflakes in Texas I thought they just fell up in
>Canada.
No, up there they have "bunyip" snowflakes or something. Eh?! ;o)
In order to keep this focused on Pietenpols, I'd like to mention that the
president of our EAA Chapter 35 just invited me to present the February
program to our chapter. I chose the topic, "All About Aircampers" and will
outline the attractions of our simple, affordable, honest Pietenpol. I'm
putting together a Powerpoint presentation with a general introduction to
the airplane, source of information and plans (the Pietenpol family, the
BPA, and this list), engine options, and of course all of the traits that
make this airplane such a fine contender for any builder's project. With a
heavy population of ex-Air Force people around here, this airplane should
win more hearts than among the modern "fast glass/slick panel" crowd.
Anyway, I have plenty of great photos for the program (thanks again, Chris
Tracy, for such a great stash of photos). And Mike Cuy, and Chuck Gantzer,
and Corky, and DJ Vegh, and Steve Eldredge, Don Emch, and so many of you who
have provided a rich archive of extremely nice photos and documentation of
the building and flying process. The problem is sifting them all down to a
35-minute presentation! I'll tell you, Don's photo of his airplane full of
kids has got to be one of the all-time classics and says it all about what
this airplane, and flying, are all about...
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
Valentines Day -- Shop for gifts that spell L-O-V-E at MSN Shopping
http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8323,ptnrid=37,ptnrdata=24095&tcode=wlmtagline
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick Navratil" <horzpool(at)goldengate.net> |
Thanks all for the input. I don't do enough welding to ever get good at
it. I went out tonight for an evenings entertainment, cleaned the tip,
there was already a 205 tip installed, I adjusted pressures and tried a
hotter flame and holding the tip farther from the puddle. Much better
and now I have a new tailwheel assembly.
Dick N.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "GlennThomas(at)flyingwood.com" <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com> |
| Subject: | Re: snow in Texas Metric snow? |
You could probably start off with a plans interpretation intro and continue
the presentation on the group dynamics of this forum. The information you
received from the various sources you mentioned could be the various
interpretations of plans/modifications citing photos from different sources
as each individual's own interpretation and their chosen technique for
implementing a certain aspect of the plane's construction. In the end they
are all nice Air Campers, right? You might even limit the discussion to one
part of the plane and cover the various methods people have chosen to, say,
build a wing.
I sit in on other building forums and they are nothing like ours. We all
respect each other and know when to provide ideas and when to be silent.
This group has been my greatest resource so far.
Just trying to give you an angle.
Glenn W. Thomas
Storrs, CT
http://www.flyingwood.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: saving hands and fingers on the table saw |
Why pay for something you already have?
It's a wonderful piece of natural technology
called "Situational Awareness".
To paraphrase, it's "Where the Eye Meets the Blade."
Like any fine tool it benefits from sharpening.
Clif
----- Original Message -----
From: GlennThomas(at)flyingwood.com
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 7:17 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: saving hands and fingers on the table saw
Hmmm,
I wonder if this technology could be adapted to my circa 1950 Cast
Iron Craftsman table saw.
Glenn W. Thomas
Storrs, CT
http://www.flyingwood.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: saving hands and fingers on the table saw |
| From: | amsafetyc(at)aol.com |
As the consummate safety director that I am, I have contacted them to ask th
e same question. A retro fit for all saws would save tons of injuries, indus
trial as well as infrequent hobbyist and the dedicated Piet builder. It shou
ld be interesting to see a reply of which I will share as soon as they get b
ack to me.
Although I have the professional interest, as of this week end I was putting
my table saw together, thinking about the hazards associated with it and ho
w to prevent them.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com
Sent: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 10:17 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: saving hands and fingers on the table saw
Hmmm,
I wonder if this technology could be adapted to my circa 1950 Cast Iron Craf
tsman table saw.
Glenn W. Thomas
Storrs, CT
http://www.flyingwood.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]
Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 2:51 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: saving hands and fingers on the table saw
Click on the hot dog demo video if nothing else.
Amazinga small electrical charge in this saw's blade is constantly
monitored and if your finger or hand
touches the blade it changes the charge slightly that the electronics are mo
nitoring in the blade
and an aluminum blade brake stops the saw in something like 1/4000th of a se
cond.
Amazinga small electrical charge in this saw's blade is constantly
monitored and if your finger or hand
touches the blade it changes the charge slightly that the electronics are mo
nitoring in the blade
and an aluminum blade brake stops the saw in something like 1/4000th of a se
cond.
http://www.sawstop.com/
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matron
ics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________
ee AOL Mail and more.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Steamin' Curious |
| From: | "Bill Church" <eng(at)canadianrogers.com> |
Granted, this isn't an airplane part, but here's an example of the power
of steam bending. In the attached photo you'll see a small wooden box I
just built (from a kit)
http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=1&p=53191&cat=1,250,43313
&ap=1
The wood (cherry) is 1/16" thick, and was soaked in hot water for about
20 minutes, then put into my capstrip steamer for another 20 minutes. I
was amazed how pliable the wood became. Of course, the thinner the
strip, the more pliable it is, so it's no real surprise that the thin
strips were much more bendy (scientific term)than my 1/4" x 1/2" spruce
capstrips were, but look how sharp those ends are bent. It's important
to get the wood wet and hot. The heat helps to change the structure of
the lignin (the "glue" that holds the wood fibers together) and allows
the wood fibers to move. When the wood cools down and dries out, it
holds the shape. This box doesn't use any glue - just a few copper tacks
and a few tiny wooden dowels (toothpicks).
While it may be possible to build your wing ribs without steaming or
soaking your top capstrips and pre-bending them, I think it would put
unnecessary stress in your rib structure, and make fitting your pieces
into your rib jig more frustrating. Afterall, what you are trying to
achieve is a strong, stable, lightweight, consistant profile.
The fuselage longerons, however, have a much gentler curve (especially
the "Improved Air Camper" (1933) plans as compared to the Flying and
Glider plans), and are not necessary to pre-bend - although I haven't
done my fuselage yet, so what do I know. You would need quite a big
steam box to steam your longerons.
Bill C
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HelsperSew(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Steamin' Curious |
Bill,
I built all my ribs before I knew I was supposed to steam the top cap strip.
The guys at Brodhead said they had heard of ribs breaking after the
airplane had been flown awhile. They scared me, so I took all my finished ribs,
and
soaked the noses of them in warm water in a 5 gal. bucket. When I took them
out, two of the top cap strip pieces had broken at the sharpest point. I
had to make these two ribs over again. My thinking was that soaking after
completion relieved the stress, and was better than nothing.
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Church" <eng(at)canadianrogers.com> |
When it comes to power tools, especially the table saw, one always has
to keep in the FRONT (as opposed to the back) of one's mind just how
powerful these tools are and how much respect they deserve. Take any
chunk of wood and cut through it with a handsaw. Then cut that same
piece of wood and do the same cut on a tablesaw. All that work that your
arm did to cut the wood is packed into that one or two seconds of the
tablesaw cut. Fingers are softer than wood, and. sawblades don't
discriminate.
I got my wake-up call when one time I decided to adjust the blade height
without shutting the saw off. I got my eye level down to the saw table
height and was using a piece of wood as reference for the desired blade
height, when the wood made contact with the spinning blade. It kicked
back, and the small piece of wood hit me square between the eyes. An
inch or so to either side and I am sure I would have lost an eye. As it
was I just ended up with a very conspicuous welt in the middle of my
forehead. I was extremely lucky. Since then I have never made
adjustments to the blade height or angle without shutting the saw off.
ALWAYS be prepared for kickback, allowing a path for the wood to travel
in that doesn't include contact with or passing through your body. Use a
featherboard whenever possible.
I have one more reminder of the need to respect the power of the table
saw - my father-in-law's fingers (or lack thereof). He lost about one
and a half fingers in a fraction of a second on his table saw several
years ago. Unlike starfish, human fingers don't grow back.
Be safe. Stay awake.
Bill C
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Steamin' Curious |
| From: | "Bill Church" <eng(at)canadianrogers.com> |
Dan,
My guess is that the two capstrips that broke probably had defects or
weak spots in the wood, and would have also broken if you had pre-soaked
and pre-bent them. The lucky part is that you found out before you had
them assembled into a wing, and could easily replace them.
Bill C
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Steamin' Curious |
| From: | amsafetyc(at)aol.com |
That makes a good point, if the hot water test is found to be an acceptable stress
inspection technique. Should that become a recommended practice for checking
ribs either home made or purchased from another builder to identify ribs that
may fail in flight?
John
-----Original Message-----
From: eng(at)canadianrogers.com
Sent: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:31 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Steamin' Curious
Dan,
My guess is that the two capstrips that broke probably had defects or weak spots
in the wood, and would have also broken if you had pre-soaked and pre-bent them.
The lucky part is that you found out before you had them assembled into a
wing, and could easily replace them.
Bill C
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Steamin' Curious |
| From: | "Bill Church" <eng(at)canadianrogers.com> |
John,
Before you start cooking your ribs, one thing to watch out for is
whether the ribs were constructed with T-88 (or similar epoxy). These
epoxies are not intended for high temperature applications, and sticking
your assembled rib into a pot of boiling water might net you with a
collection of loose sticks.
Bill C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
Absolutely, Glenn. My old Sears table saw gave me outstanding service
and used push sticks on 95% of my cuts. One push stick
and a second push type stick to keep the work piece against the fence.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | del magsam <farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com> |
Always keep to front of the sawblade as well, never reach around behind and pull
something through. This is how people loose fingers 99 percent of the time.
Del
Bill Church wrote:
When it comes to power tools, especially the table saw, one always has to keep
in the FRONT (as opposed to the back) of one's mind
Del-New Richmond, Wi
"farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com"
---------------------------------
Never miss an email again!
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Church" <eng(at)canadianrogers.com> |
Actually, you want to be a little off to the side, not directly in front
of the blade. Carbide-tipped sawblades (which is the vast majority of
the sawblades sold today) have been known to throw a tooth on occasion,
if they are damaged. That tooth will be flying at over 100 - 125mph -
a nasty little projectile that you don't want to hit your body parts.
But, yes reaching to the back side of the blade is a good way to get
your fingers pulled into the blade.
Bill C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eric Williams" <ewilliams805(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Fly-In in Central Florida... seeking Piets & other |
interesting airplanes
We Cessna drivers won't be turned away by a squadron of Piets if we try to
fly in will we?
>From: "Mike Whaley" <MerlinFAC(at)cfl.rr.com>
>Reply-To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>To: "Pietenpol List"
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fly-In in Central Florida... seeking Piets & other
>interesting airplanes
>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2007 21:38:59 -0500
>
>
>Hi all,
>
>I know this is a bit off-topic but perhaps it will be of interest to those
>of you in Florida... we're having a little fly-in / aviation day type event
>on February 17th at Valkaria Airport (X59) and we're trying to round up
>"exotic" aircraft to show all the interesting aspects of general and
>recreational aviation to the community. ("Exotic" meaning anything except a
>white Cessna 152, basically... homebuilts, warbirds, ultralights, balloons,
>helicopters, anti-gravity boots, rocket belts, magic flying carpets, big
>red
>bulletproof capes, etc.) Valkaria is a small uncontrolled field a little
>bit
>south of Melbourne on the east coast of Florida, with cheap avgas and some
>interesting homebuilt activity.
>
>If anyone is interested in attending, get in touch with me and I can give
>you more info, or check out our website:
>
>http://www.mlbpilots.org/ValkariaAirFest/
>
>Thanks!
>
>-Mike
>
>Mike Whaley merlin@ov-10bronco.net
>Webmaster, OV-10 Bronco Association
>http://www.ov-10bronco.net/
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MICHAEL SILVIUS" <M.Silvius(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Had one of them flying carbide tips embed in my eye lid once!!!!!
TABLE SAW SAFETY 101
your hands should never be on the table saw top. ---EVER---
use a push stick and a feather board, if you bugger up your wood - -
-big deal!!!,
it can be replaced, not so your fingers, besides it really sucks to try
and pick your nose with stumps.
20 yrs of making a living as a carpenter and still have all my digits
if you wrap your fingers around your board so as they make contact with
the edge of the table top when they get to it your hands will never go
near the blade.
now for angle grinders- - - had cutting wheel shatter on me this summer.
Makita 10k rpm, estimated distance to my belly 17 inches. the two inch
piece that hit my belly (yes guard was on) was found in the neighbors
garage 200 feet across the street. felt like a gun shot to the gut.
Doubeld over out of breath for 5 minutes. Waiting to see the blod gush
between my gloved fingers. I was real lucky, fortunately it hit side on
as opposed to on edge so no penetration. the apple sized
purple-pink-black-and-blue was sore as al getup for 32 weeks and took 3
months to dissipate.
be safe.
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Church
. Carbide-tipped sawblades have been known to throw a tooth on occasion
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MICHAEL SILVIUS" <M.Silvius(at)worldnet.att.net> |
that was meant to read 3 weeks!! not 32 I Have no stumps but I type as
if I doo!!!
-black-and-blue was sore as al getup for 32 weeks and took 3 months to
dissipate.
be safe.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ben Charvet <bcharvet(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fly-In in Central Florida... seeking Piets & other |
interesting airplanes
My Pietenpol won't be able to make it (still a few years away from
flight), but I may be able to come in my Baby Ace. I bought it from a
guy in my EAA chapter (866), and it was built in 1955. Not too exotic,
but a homebuilt that old has to be a classic. I haven't flown it yet,
cause I'm one test ride away from my BFR and tailwheel endorsement. If
I get a chance to get in some flight practice and the weather looks good
I'll head your way.
Ben Charvet
Mims, Fl
Mike Whaley wrote:
>
>Hi all,
>
>I know this is a bit off-topic but perhaps it will be of interest to those
>of you in Florida... we're having a little fly-in / aviation day type event
>on February 17th at Valkaria Airport (X59) and we're trying to round up
>"exotic" aircraft to show all the interesting aspects of general and
>recreational aviation to the community. (
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Online Piet database |
| From: | "Bill Church" <eng(at)canadianrogers.com> |
Hi guys (and gals),
Just stumbled onto this website that has a bunch of Piet photos (lots of
them hi-res), and even more Piet registration info. If you have photos
of any of the planes listed, you can submit your photo for all to share.
I just posted a couple of Canadian Piets that I had photos of.
Take a look and see if your plane is there. Not sure how you would add
your plane if it's not listed, though.
http://www.airport-data.com/search/search2.html?field=model&code=piet
enp
ol
Bill C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick Navratil" <horzpool(at)goldengate.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Online Piet database |
Bill
Thanks for posting that site. That list is amazing.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Church
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 9:58 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Online Piet database
Hi guys (and gals),
Just stumbled onto this website that has a bunch of Piet photos (lots
of them hi-res), and even more Piet registration info. If you have
photos of any of the planes listed, you can submit your photo for all to
share. I just posted a couple of Canadian Piets that I had photos of.
Take a look and see if your plane is there. Not sure how you would add
your plane if it's not listed, though.
http://www.airport-data.com/search/search2.html?field=model&code=piet
enpol
Bill C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Online Piet database |
Hey what am I doing in that picture!! I checked out the pic of Mike Cuy's Piet
on the link web sight and I am in the picture, talking to Mike, (the high and
tight haircut on the left) and Dad is the one in the Grey t-shirt with his back
to the camera.
---------------------------------
No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Online Piet database |
| From: | Hans Vander Voort <hans.vander.voort(at)alfalaval.com> |
As with any data base it has its limitations.
This one is partly based on FAA records and for the FAA register the
builder is you. (not pietenpol)
So to fix this I run three queries, one on "Pietenpol" one for "Air
Camper" and one Aircamper
Dumped them all in a spread sheet and removed duplicates
588 Pietenpol airplanes, not all active
(See attached file: 588 pietenpol air campers.xls)
Hans
"Bill Church"
To
Sent by:
owner-pietenpol-l cc
ist-server@matron
ics.com Subject
Pietenpol-List: Online Piet
database
01/24/2007 09:58
AM
Please respond to
pietenpol-list@ma
tronics.com
Hi guys (and gals),
Just stumbled onto this website that has a bunch of Piet photos (lots of
them hi-res), and even more Piet registration info. If you have photos of
any of the planes listed, you can submit your photo for all to share. I
just posted a couple of Canadian Piets that I had photos of.
Take a look and see if your plane is there. Not sure how you would add your
plane if it's not listed, though.
http://www.airport-data.com/search/search2.html?field=model&code=pietenpol
Bill C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Online Piet database |
Corky is now immortalized in cyberspace in the photo with 41CC on that page.
I assumed that the photo was taken by Isabelle, but if not- sorry.
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
Get Hilary Duffs homepage with her photos, music, and more.
http://celebrities.live.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Online Piet database |
Hey guys, I finnaly got a picture of Dad's Piet posted on this site. This was
the infamous day (sat of brodhead 2006) when the Fords beat the Chevys. Engine
problems plagued me about 45 min after this picture was taken, then for the
rest of the day untill we trailered her home. Look at the listings for N92GB.
Enjoy,
Shad
http://www.airport-data.com/search/search2.html?field=model&code=pietenpol
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Catdesigns" <catdesigns(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Online Piet database |
Shad,
I see you have a fixed tailwheel. How well does it taxi on pavement?
Any operational issues with a fixed wheel? It would certainly lighten
things up back there.
Chris Tracy
Sacramento, Ca
Website at http://www.Westcoastpiet.com
----- Original Message -----
From: shad bell
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 3:32 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Online Piet database
Hey guys, I finnaly got a picture of Dad's Piet posted on this site.
This was the infamous day (sat of brodhead 2006) when the Fords beat the
Chevys. Engine problems plagued me about 45 min after this picture was
taken, then for the rest of the day untill we trailered her home. Look
at the listings for N92GB.
Enjoy,
Shad
http://www.airport-data.com/search/search2.html?field=model&code=piet
enpol
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Whaley" <MerlinFAC(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fly-In in Central Florida... seeking Piets & other |
interesting airplanes
Hi Ben,
Baby Ace? That ain't no Piet! hehehe
Actually I like the Corbin planes a lot... Kristin and I saw a Junior Ace at
Oshkosh and REALLY liked it, I hope that Mr. Wood can keep the Ace line
going and growing for a long time.
Certainly hope you can make it. That reminds me, if you see Jim Webb soon,
please ask him if he can bring his Piet if possible... we may have several
other Corvair aircraft there as well. Spread the word! :)
-Mike
Mike Whaley merlin@ov-10bronco.net
Webmaster, OV-10 Bronco Association
http://www.ov-10bronco.net/
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ben Charvet" <bcharvet(at)bellsouth.net>
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 7:29 PM
Subject: [piet] Re: Pietenpol-List: Fly-In in Central Florida... seeking
Piets & other interesting airplanes
>
> My Pietenpol won't be able to make it (still a few years away from
> flight), but I may be able to come in my Baby Ace. I bought it from a
> guy in my EAA chapter (866), and it was built in 1955. Not too exotic,
> but a homebuilt that old has to be a classic. I haven't flown it yet,
> cause I'm one test ride away from my BFR and tailwheel endorsement. If
> I get a chance to get in some flight practice and the weather looks good
> I'll head your way.
>
> Ben Charvet
> Mims, Fl
>
> Mike Whaley wrote:
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Whaley" <MerlinFAC(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Fly-In in Central Florida... seeking Piets & other |
interesting airplanes
Hehehe... not at all... everyone's welcome!
Now, if you get bounced by a gaggle of Piets on the way there armed with
rolls of air-to-air toilet paper, well... :)
-Mike
Mike Whaley merlin@ov-10bronco.net
Webmaster, OV-10 Bronco Association
http://www.ov-10bronco.net/
>
> We Cessna drivers won't be turned away by a squadron of Piets if we try to
> fly in will we?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CapnAvid(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Central Fla Piet fly-in |
Mike Whately
Central Fla Piet fly-in; when and where? I'm at Sun-n-Fun volunteering and
would join you if not too far away--no airplane, just me as a builder.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Taxing with a fixed tailwheel |
Chris, Dad went that route to save all the weight he could back there. He is about
220 and I am About 180lbs. The wing is set back 4 inches I think and engine
mount is a couple inches longer than plans. It is definitly eaiser to taxi
a Champ or Cub or anything with a steerable tailwheel, but a hell of a lot less
fun...ha ha ha. It took us longer to get good at taxing NX92GB than it did
to learn to fly it. It sure turns heads when you roll up on the ramp and are
goosing the throtle holding full down elevator and mashing full rudder and brake
to turn. Everybody looks and says "What in the hell is that guy doing?!!!"
(Except the older guys who have flown planes with tail skids) We did go through
a few tailwheels before we figured out it needs ball bearings, industrial
castor with sleeve bushing did not last and the wheel split in half, steel wheel
makes a lot of noise and still wears too fast on pavement. The 2 1/2 in
wheel from wicks or Aircraft spruce works well.
You have to think well ahead and know where you want to taxi, especially when
exiting a runway on to a narrow taxi way, I had to shut down, unbuckle, and climb
out the first time I flew off to a local airport to show it off. I hesitated
my turn off the runway and didn't leave enough room. It is fine on grass,
it slides on around. The best thing is you touch down strieght and for the most
part it will stay there with little inputs. I have landed in 30-40mph quarting
gusty crosswind (once, and only out of necesity) and stayed on the asphault
runway, so as far as the airplane design, and the fixed tailwheel I feel it
is pretty forgiving. If you fly out of busy, controlled, paved airports a sterable
wheel would be a lot better, and you would have to change tailwheels a
lot less.
Shad
P.S. Guys, Please don't give me the credit for building 92GB, it is Dads airplane
and he built 99% of all the parts on it, I just did some riviting and helped
out here and there. Although I am very proud of his accomplishment, and I
get to fly it he he he.
Shad,
I see you have a fixed tailwheel. How well does it taxi on pavement? Any operational
issues with a fixed wheel? It would certainly lighten things up back
there.
Chris Tracy
Sacramento, Ca
Website at http://www.Westcoastpiet.com
http://www.airport-data.com/search/search2.html?field=model&code=pietenpol
---------------------------------
Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels
in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Catdesigns" <catdesigns(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Taxing with a fixed tailwheel |
Thanks Shad, that's exactly the advice I was looking for. I will stick
with my sterable tailwheel for now as I doubt I will land on grass very
much. Do they even have grass runways in California? Good to have a
great flight report as it's always something I have wondered about.
Tell your Dad he did a great job.
Chris Tracy
Sacramento, Ca
Website at http://www.Westcoastpiet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Whaley" <MerlinFAC(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Central Fla Piet fly-in |
Valkaria airport (X59) on Feb. 17th. It's not a Piet-specific fly-in,
though it sounds like we'll probably have a couple Piets there
(hopefully more!) Full info available here:
http://www.mlbpilots.org/ValkariaAirFest/
-Mike
Mike Whaley merlin@ov-10bronco.net
Webmaster, OV-10 Bronco Association
http://www.ov-10bronco.net/
Central Fla Piet fly-in; when and where? I'm at Sun-n-Fun volunteering
and would join you if not too far away--no airplane, just me as a
builder.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
NX41CC is back in the air. Three successful touch and goes shortly before
noon today. I wasn't there but Charlie says she handles nicely with just a
touch of heaviness on the right wing. More testing as weather allows, but
not out of the pattern yet.
Life is good. It's Friday. Hope Corky is now in possession of an Aeronca.
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
Valentines Day -- Shop for gifts that spell L-O-V-E at MSN Shopping
http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8323,ptnrid=37,ptnrdata=24095&tcode=wlmtagline
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
Great News, Oscar! I'm sure ol' Corky is pleased.
Jack Phillips
Shivering in chilly North Carolina and hoping for warmer weather
tomorrow so i can do some flying
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Oscar
Zuniga
Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 3:00 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: update on 41CC
NX41CC is back in the air. Three successful touch and goes shortly
before
noon today. I wasn't there but Charlie says she handles nicely with
just a
touch of heaviness on the right wing. More testing as weather allows,
but
not out of the pattern yet.
Life is good. It's Friday. Hope Corky is now in possession of an
Aeronca.
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
Congratulations, Oscar ! Have a cigar for us, okay ?
Mike C.
PS-- anyone get a Corkyreport ?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Willis <timothywillis(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: update on 41CC |
Oscar,
That's super.
Tim
-----Original Message-----
>From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
>Sent: Jan 26, 2007 1:59 PM
>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: update on 41CC
>
>
>NX41CC is back in the air. Three successful touch and goes shortly before
>noon today. I wasn't there but Charlie says she handles nicely with just a
>touch of heaviness on the right wing. More testing as weather allows, but
>not out of the pattern yet.
>
>Life is good. It's Friday. Hope Corky is now in possession of an Aeronca.
>
>Oscar Zuniga
>San Antonio, TX
>mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
>website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Valentines Day -- Shop for gifts that spell L-O-V-E at MSN Shopping
>http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8323,ptnrid=37,ptnrdata=24095&tcode=wlmtagline
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | del magsam <farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com> |
| Subject: | update on 41CC (the weather) |
How cold is it? we had a nice warm day at 30 degrees, planes were out everywhere.
I had to work on my house watching them fly over....
Del
"Phillips, Jack" wrote:
Jack Phillips
Shivering in chilly North Carolina and hoping for warmer weather
tomorrow so i can do some flying
Del-New Richmond, Wi
"farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com"
---------------------------------
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Isablcorky(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: update on 41CC |
Corky is in Souix 'city Iowa on his way to Fargo to get his plane. Isablc
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Cold Weather Building |
| From: | "Glenn Thomas" <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com> |
Chris,
Took your post to heart and went to Home Depot. Got a 45000 BTU, 2 burner, propane
heater for 60 bucks. Immediately put it together and got the shed from 8.6F
to 82F in about 25 minutes on low. Runs on a regular gas grill tank. They
have another one that has one burner , 15000 BTUs, for 29 bucks. Once the place
is warmed up I could probably fall back to 1 burner and crack a window.
Burns clean and my work shed is warmer than the house! Just curious how long
a tank lasts.
--------
Glenn Thomas
N?????
http://www.flyingwood.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90744#90744
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
I once had one of those Home Depot two burner heaters and a tank lasted about a
day and a half. But I kept it on the highest setting.
But...after 5 days without electricity last week because of a sever ice storm in
NE OK, I have become EXTREMELY aware of (possible) carbon monoxide generating
heating devices. One of my neighbors and her kids just got out of the hospital
because of carbon monoxide poisoning....
Please add another $20 to that $60 investment and buy a carbon monoxide monitor...please...
JM
-----Original Message-----
>From: Glenn Thomas <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com>
>Sent: Jan 26, 2007 9:10 PM
>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cold Weather Building
>
>
>Chris,
>Took your post to heart and went to Home Depot. Got a 45000 BTU, 2 burner, propane
heater for 60 bucks. Immediately put it together and got the shed from
8.6F to 82F in about 25 minutes on low. Runs on a regular gas grill tank. They
have another one that has one burner , 15000 BTUs, for 29 bucks. Once the
place is warmed up I could probably fall back to 1 burner and crack a window.
Burns clean and my work shed is warmer than the house! Just curious how long
a tank lasts.
>
>--------
>Glenn Thomas
>N?????
>http://www.flyingwood.com
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90744#90744
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
| From: | "Glenn Thomas" <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com> |
Jim,
That is an excellent idea. I was planning on keeping the window open a little
and opening the door frequently but your suggestion is a more scientific solution
to that guessing game.
Thanks
--------
Glenn Thomas
N?????
http://www.flyingwood.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90756#90756
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KMHeide <kmheidecpo(at)yahoo.com> |
CorkyReport.......
Just received a telephone call from him indicating he is in Sioux City, Iowa.
I hope he is not down wind of the stock yards...Yes.....he is not liking the
cold, snow and wind....
Ken H.
Fargo, ND
Blue Boy Owner (Champ Defender)
"Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" wrote:
Congratulations, Oscar ! Have a cigar for us, okay ?
Mike C.
PS-- anyone get a Corkyreport ?
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Catdesigns" <catdesigns(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
Glen,
It all depends on how much you have to use it. I cycle mine on and off as I
get to cold. My last tank lasted about a month and a half but I used it a
lot. Around here a BBQ tank cost $15 to fill. Seems like a cheap way to go
for me. Does the instructions have a flow rate in it? You could calculate
the hours per tank. It also works better when the tank is full.Your probably
right that you could go down to 1 burner to maintain the heat and save cost.
I think I will go and see if HD has any here. All you need now is to get
your self a bag of marshmallows.
Isn't it fun to be hotter then the house. My wife gives me grief because I
wont let her keep the house that warm.
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn Thomas" <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com>
Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 7:10 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cold Weather Building
>
>
> Chris,
> Took your post to heart and went to Home Depot. Got a 45000 BTU, 2
> burner, propane heater for 60 bucks. Immediately put it together and got
> the shed from 8.6F to 82F in about 25 minutes on low. Runs on a regular
> gas grill tank. They have another one that has one burner , 15000 BTUs,
> for 29 bucks. Once the place is warmed up I could probably fall back to 1
> burner and crack a window. Burns clean and my work shed is warmer than
> the house! Just curious how long a tank lasts.
>
> --------
> Glenn Thomas
> N?????
> http://www.flyingwood.com
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90744#90744
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Catdesigns" <catdesigns(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
I frequently take my digital carbon dioxide detector out in the garage to do
air sampling and it never registers anything. I sometimes wonder if the
thing is working. I think I will by another one just to test it. Fear of
carbon monoxide is one of the reasons I cycle it on and off.
My garage is a bit drafty so I'm sure it helps circulate the air. PLEASE
everyone listen to Jim and get a carbon dioxide tester and test it for your
self.
Speaking of Jim, did Jim finally get back to working on his plane?
Chris Tracy
Sacramento, Ca
Website at http://www.Westcoastpiet.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com>
Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 8:03 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Cold Weather Building
>
>
> I once had one of those Home Depot two burner heaters and a tank lasted
> about a day and a half. But I kept it on the highest setting.
>
> But...after 5 days without electricity last week because of a sever ice
> storm in NE OK, I have become EXTREMELY aware of (possible) carbon
> monoxide generating heating devices. One of my neighbors and her kids
> just got out of the hospital because of carbon monoxide poisoning....
>
> Please add another $20 to that $60 investment and buy a carbon monoxide
> monitor...please...
>
> JM
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>>From: Glenn Thomas <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com>
>>Sent: Jan 26, 2007 9:10 PM
>>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cold Weather Building
>>
>>
>>
>>Chris,
>>Took your post to heart and went to Home Depot. Got a 45000 BTU, 2
>>burner, propane heater for 60 bucks. Immediately put it together and got
>>the shed from 8.6F to 82F in about 25 minutes on low. Runs on a regular
>>gas grill tank. They have another one that has one burner , 15000 BTUs,
>>for 29 bucks. Once the place is warmed up I could probably fall back to 1
>>burner and crack a window. Burns clean and my work shed is warmer than
>>the house! Just curious how long a tank lasts.
>>
>>--------
>>Glenn Thomas
>>N?????
>>http://www.flyingwood.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Read this topic online here:
>>
>>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90744#90744
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Rice <rice(at)iapdatacom.net> |
I found one that is catalytic & has an oxygen sensor that shuts it down
when oxygen is short, which is when you tend to get significant carbon
monoxide.
Larry the micromong guy
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | del magsam <farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
A couple of years ago, I was working on my engine on the plane in a non insulated
hangar. I made a 10 x 10 plastic pvc pipe frame with plastic sheet stretched
between the pipes. hung the thing from the ceiling, and then hung plastic all
of way around the edges. when I went there to work I plugged in the knipko 100,000
btu heater to get it to 80 degrees in about 5 minutes, and then maintained
it at about 60 degrees with the lp "sunflower" heater. I didn't even use the
whole tank for the project. But BEWARE...do not leave it unattended or get
it close to the plastic.
Del
Catdesigns wrote:
Glen,
It all depends on how much you have to use it. I cycle mine on and off as I
get to cold. My last tank lasted about a month and a half but I used it a
lot. Around here a BBQ tank cost $15 to fill. Seems like a cheap way to go
for me. Does the instructions have a flow rate in it? You could calculate
the hours per tank. It also works better when the tank is full.Your probably
right that you could go down to 1 burner to maintain the heat and save cost.
I think I will go and see if HD has any here. All you need now is to get
your self a bag of marshmallows.
Isn't it fun to be hotter then the house. My wife gives me grief because I
wont let her keep the house that warm.
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn Thomas"
Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 7:10 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cold Weather Building
>
>
> Chris,
> Took your post to heart and went to Home Depot. Got a 45000 BTU, 2
> burner, propane heater for 60 bucks. Immediately put it together and got
> the shed from 8.6F to 82F in about 25 minutes on low. Runs on a regular
> gas grill tank. They have another one that has one burner , 15000 BTUs,
> for 29 bucks. Once the place is warmed up I could probably fall back to 1
> burner and crack a window. Burns clean and my work shed is warmer than
> the house! Just curious how long a tank lasts.
>
> --------
> Glenn Thomas
> N?????
> http://www.flyingwood.com
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90744#90744
>
>
>
Del-New Richmond, Wi
"farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com"
---------------------------------
Don't get soaked. Take a quick peak at the forecast
with theYahoo! Search weather shortcut.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
| From: | "dwilson" <marwilson(at)charter.net> |
These posts have been pretty interesting to read. I used an electric heater in
my attached insulated garage. Could have bought a new Cessna for what I paid
the utility company. I now have a natural gas furnace. The furnace is 45,000
btu and is vented to the outside through a forced air chimney. Even in the
garage with a forced air furnace I have a CO (Carbon Monoxide) detector. You
can purchase a very reliable CO detector for less than $ 25 at most discount
and hardware stores. Seems like very cheap insurance. Click on this link to
learn more...
http://www.nfpa.org/itemDetail.asp?categoryID=280&itemID=18270&URL=Research%20&%20Reports/Fact%20sheets/Safety%20in%20the%20home/Carbon%20monoxide%20poisoning&cookie%5Ftest=1
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90792#90792
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Fisher <mfisher(at)gci.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Testing CO Detectors |
Cold Weather Builders,
Check your digital electronic CO detectors for operational status and sensitivity
by lighting a stick of incense in a safe container about a foot below the unit
and leaving it for an hour or so. The reading should show anywhere between
5 and 75 parts per million. Incense burns about as dirty as an old
Continental with a leaky needle valve. DO NOT test your detector by placing
it near an engine exhaust.
Mike Fisher
Talkeetna, Alaska
I frequently take my digital carbon dioxide detector out in the
> garage to do
> air sampling and it never registers anything. I sometimes wonder
> if the
> thing is working. I think I will by another one just to test it.
> Fear of
> carbon monoxide is one of the reasons I cycle it on and off.
>
> My garage is a bit drafty so I'm sure it helps circulate the air.
> PLEASE
> everyone listen to Jim and get a carbon dioxide tester and test it
> for your
> self.
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
Well, it was in the mid 60s today, clear and nice, the new brake linings
were all cured and full braking effect available, and Charlie took the
airplane out of ground effect and into the pattern. Quite different from
the slight right wing heaviness in ground effect, he found that in the
pattern he had to hold the stick with both hands at one point, hard left
aileron, due to excessive wash-in on the starboard wing. But we have plenty
of threads on the forward lift strut fork end to make adjustments, so that's
next.
The engine pulled 2250 RPM in climb with that 72x42 Hegy prop, climbing at
50 MPH. I have not verified the mechanical tach against an optical one, so
I'm feeling real good about the engine and prop doing just about as good as
you can expect. It runs and sounds strong and smooth.
Life is good ;o)
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
FREE online classifieds from Windows Live Expo buy and sell with people
you know
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: update on 41CC |
Congrats Oscar! Pretty exciting. Keep us posted and get some in flight
photos you can share with us.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2007 7:58 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: update on 41CC
>
>
> Well, it was in the mid 60s today, clear and nice, the new brake linings
> were all cured and full braking effect available, and Charlie took the
> airplane out of ground effect and into the pattern. Quite different from
> the slight right wing heaviness in ground effect, he found that in the
> pattern he had to hold the stick with both hands at one point, hard left
> aileron, due to excessive wash-in on the starboard wing. But we have
> plenty of threads on the forward lift strut fork end to make adjustments,
> so that's next.
>
> The engine pulled 2250 RPM in climb with that 72x42 Hegy prop, climbing at
> 50 MPH. I have not verified the mechanical tach against an optical one,
> so I'm feeling real good about the engine and prop doing just about as
> good as you can expect. It runs and sounds strong and smooth.
>
> Life is good ;o)
>
> Oscar Zuniga
> San Antonio, TX
> mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
> website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> FREE online classifieds from Windows Live Expo - buy and sell with people
> you know
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
Thanks Chris!
Well, no, I'm not back to work on it yet. Been out of work (unemployed) for a
couple months and frankly haven't had the motivation to even look at it.
But I WILL some day. I have several interviews going and expect to get back in
the swing of important things (like my Pietenpol!) soon. I do get a bit sad
though thinking about how nice it would have been to be finishing up right now
so I can fly it this summer. Hey, that will just make it that much sweeter when
it DOES happen!
In the meantime, I'm living the aviator's dream...vicariously...I just read Oscar's
summary of 41CC's flight in the pattern and my arms are still sore from holding
in so much left aileron...Hopefully he'll get the struts adjusted so I
can imagine a nice gentle flight around the pattern.
What's really been interesting is how many of my Pietenpol friends have been a
key part of me NOT getting really depressed during an otherwise "challenging"
period of my life. Very nice.
And I'm glad there has been so much discussion/thought about heaters. I know everyone
is careful, but on this stuff you can't be TOO careful!
Hope everyone's staying warm!
Jim in Northeastern Oklahoma...where all that darn ice is now melting...I've never
seen SO much mud!
-----Original Message-----
>From: Catdesigns <catdesigns(at)comcast.net>
>Sent: Jan 27, 2007 12:44 AM
>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Cold Weather Building
>
>
>I frequently take my digital carbon dioxide detector out in the garage to do
>air sampling and it never registers anything. I sometimes wonder if the
>thing is working. I think I will by another one just to test it. Fear of
>carbon monoxide is one of the reasons I cycle it on and off.
>
>My garage is a bit drafty so I'm sure it helps circulate the air. PLEASE
>everyone listen to Jim and get a carbon dioxide tester and test it for your
>self.
>
>Speaking of Jim, did Jim finally get back to working on his plane?
>
>Chris Tracy
>Sacramento, Ca
>Website at http://www.Westcoastpiet.com
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com>
>To:
>Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 8:03 PM
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Cold Weather Building
>
>
>>
>>
>> I once had one of those Home Depot two burner heaters and a tank lasted
>> about a day and a half. But I kept it on the highest setting.
>>
>> But...after 5 days without electricity last week because of a sever ice
>> storm in NE OK, I have become EXTREMELY aware of (possible) carbon
>> monoxide generating heating devices. One of my neighbors and her kids
>> just got out of the hospital because of carbon monoxide poisoning....
>>
>> Please add another $20 to that $60 investment and buy a carbon monoxide
>> monitor...please...
>>
>> JM
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>>>From: Glenn Thomas <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com>
>>>Sent: Jan 26, 2007 9:10 PM
>>>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>>>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cold Weather Building
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Chris,
>>>Took your post to heart and went to Home Depot. Got a 45000 BTU, 2
>>>burner, propane heater for 60 bucks. Immediately put it together and got
>>>the shed from 8.6F to 82F in about 25 minutes on low. Runs on a regular
>>>gas grill tank. They have another one that has one burner , 15000 BTUs,
>>>for 29 bucks. Once the place is warmed up I could probably fall back to 1
>>>burner and crack a window. Burns clean and my work shed is warmer than
>>>the house! Just curious how long a tank lasts.
>>>
>>>--------
>>>Glenn Thomas
>>>N?????
>>>http://www.flyingwood.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90744#90744
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KMHeide <kmheidecpo(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | A corksickle update........ |
Members of the List:
Corky arrived with his son around 1:00 pm Fargo time (amidst zero temperatures,
strong winds, Less then 5 miles visability, windchill of 20 below) to
greet his new found project.. the 42' Blue Boy Defender Aeronca Champ. He arrived
excited yet tired of the long trip up. "Us Yankees handle the cold much better
than them southerners"......
Corky, his son David, me and my daughters started up the salamander heater and
started the work of removing the tail section. Everything went smoothly but
with the cold inside the hanger, it made a 10 minute job much longer. We kept
working with rotation between heater time and planning time. Finally, we moved
the trailer into the hanger along side the plane for loading.
Created a wood platform for the front gear and then another platform for the
tail. With the plane parallel to the trailer, lifted the tail up onto the rear
of the trailer. Then, we planned on lifting the front of the Defender (one gear
leg at a time) onto the trailer with hopes of sliding the wheels across into
position/alignment with the trailer. Since the wood was frozen and had some
frost on it, I added more snow to make it slippery for sliding the planes gear
across it. Corky and I grabbed one side of the front gear leg and his son David
used a dolly on the opposite side to lift that sides' wheel off the floor as
we lifted our side. The tail-wheel was kept in place with a block to prevent
moving on the rear platform. *(Note - Corky being a young man (80 yrs. old) is
extremely strong!!) Together we lifted the entire side of the plane and set
the wheel onto the trailer which was about 3 1/2 feet tall! We then walked around
and grabbed the side David was on and picked
up the wheel and side it the remaining wheel onto the trailer and into position.
In summation, we picked up the entire front of the defender and slide it on
to the trailer. (We are two strong sons-of- *itches! Don't mess with pietenpol
builders!)
After this we decided to call it a day. Total time on loading fuselage.....about
4 1/2 hours. Tomorrow....the wings under the fuselage and then strapping everything
down. Departure time around 1:00 PM or thereabouts.
Photos to follow....
This has been a Corksickle update! He loves winter in North Dakota....Will try
and get him to help make snowman tomorrow...before he is completely frozen and
can't move!
Ken H
Fargo, ND
---------------------------------
No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu> |
| Subject: | short Piet movie; Wayne's BFR |
Wayne took and passed his BFR in the Piet yesterday. The video is at
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFZjsCnu__g
It was a fairly warm day (maybe in the low 50s), but fairly windy,
and due to the runway slope, they had a quartering tailwind. You'll
see the effects of this in the ground run and lift off. On landing,
of course, it was a headwind, and Wayne really stuck it at the
numbers. It's hard to tell in the video, but that was a short landing
as the field slopes very steeply at the other end, too.
Anyway, hope this gives you a little smile on a cold Sunday morning!
Jeff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: A corksickle update........ |
Ken,
Thanks for the update. I think we were all wondering how he's coming
along. It's great to hear he's really enjoying the winter wonderland.
What more could he ask for, other than a nice long flight over the
winter scene in a Piet. I think he deserves one.
Gene
This has been a Corksickle update! He loves winter in North
Dakota....Will try and get him to help make snowman tomorrow...before he
is completely frozen and can't move!
Ken H
Fargo, ND
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Rice <rice(at)iapdatacom.net> |
| Subject: | Enforced "no build" Time |
Jim,
Keep your chin up. We all go through times that are difficult for
various reasons. My project has been at a standstill due to moving and
tuition & etc for 2 kids. One gets out of school in a couple months and
should be supporting herself, and I'm really looking forward to it. :)
Just roll with the punches & it'll come out allright.
Larry the micromong guy
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <harvey.rule(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
After the ice storm of 97/98 up here in Ottawa we changed our fire place to
a gas style instead of wood burning and at the flick of a switch I have
instant heat even if the hydro goes off.Now mind you there won't be any
blower from the fire place if the hydro is off but you can get enough heat
from it to survive.Sort of like camping out.You just bring your sleeping
bags down and sleep in front of the fire place.Nothing to do with Pietenpols
but everything to do with survival and carbonmonoxide poisoning.There won't
be any danger from this system.
>From: Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com>
>Reply-To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Cold Weather Building
>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 22:03:09 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
>
>
>
>I once had one of those Home Depot two burner heaters and a tank lasted
>about a day and a half. But I kept it on the highest setting.
>
>But...after 5 days without electricity last week because of a sever ice
>storm in NE OK, I have become EXTREMELY aware of (possible) carbon monoxide
>generating heating devices. One of my neighbors and her kids just got out
>of the hospital because of carbon monoxide poisoning....
>
>Please add another $20 to that $60 investment and buy a carbon monoxide
>monitor...please...
>
>JM
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
> >From: Glenn Thomas <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com>
> >Sent: Jan 26, 2007 9:10 PM
> >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cold Weather Building
> >
>
> >
> >Chris,
> >Took your post to heart and went to Home Depot. Got a 45000 BTU, 2
>burner, propane heater for 60 bucks. Immediately put it together and got
>the shed from 8.6F to 82F in about 25 minutes on low. Runs on a regular
>gas grill tank. They have another one that has one burner , 15000 BTUs,
>for 29 bucks. Once the place is warmed up I could probably fall back to 1
>burner and crack a window. Burns clean and my work shed is warmer than the
>house! Just curious how long a tank lasts.
> >
> >--------
> >Glenn Thomas
> >N?????
> >http://www.flyingwood.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Read this topic online here:
> >
> >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90744#90744
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <harvey.rule(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | A corksickle update........ |
Go Corky!Good luck on the return trip our peayers are with you man!
>From: KMHeide <kmheidecpo(at)yahoo.com>
>Reply-To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>To: Pietenpol
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: A corksickle update........
>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 22:01:31 -0800 (PST)
>
>Members of the List:
>
> Corky arrived with his son around 1:00 pm Fargo time (amidst zero
>temperatures, strong winds, Less then 5 miles visability, windchill of 20
>below) to greet his new found project.. the 42' Blue Boy Defender Aeronca
>Champ. He arrived excited yet tired of the long trip up. "Us Yankees handle
>the cold much better than them southerners"......
>
> Corky, his son David, me and my daughters started up the salamander
>heater and started the work of removing the tail section. Everything went
>smoothly but with the cold inside the hanger, it made a 10 minute job much
>longer. We kept working with rotation between heater time and planning
>time. Finally, we moved the trailer into the hanger along side the plane
>for loading.
>
> Created a wood platform for the front gear and then another platform for
>the tail. With the plane parallel to the trailer, lifted the tail up onto
>the rear of the trailer. Then, we planned on lifting the front of the
>Defender (one gear leg at a time) onto the trailer with hopes of sliding
>the wheels across into position/alignment with the trailer. Since the wood
>was frozen and had some frost on it, I added more snow to make it slippery
>for sliding the planes gear across it. Corky and I grabbed one side of the
>front gear leg and his son David used a dolly on the opposite side to lift
>that sides' wheel off the floor as we lifted our side. The tail-wheel was
>kept in place with a block to prevent moving on the rear platform. *(Note -
>Corky being a young man (80 yrs. old) is extremely strong!!) Together we
>lifted the entire side of the plane and set the wheel onto the trailer
>which was about 3 1/2 feet tall! We then walked around and grabbed the
>side David was on and picked
> up the wheel and side it the remaining wheel onto the trailer and into
>position. In summation, we picked up the entire front of the defender and
>slide it on to the trailer. (We are two strong sons-of- *itches! Don't mess
>with pietenpol builders!)
>
> After this we decided to call it a day. Total time on loading
>fuselage.....about 4 1/2 hours. Tomorrow....the wings under the fuselage
>and then strapping everything down. Departure time around 1:00 PM or
>thereabouts.
>
> Photos to follow....
>
> This has been a Corksickle update! He loves winter in North
>Dakota....Will try and get him to help make snowman tomorrow...before he is
>completely frozen and can't move!
>
> Ken H
> Fargo, ND
>
>
>---------------------------------
>No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
>with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Enforced "no build" Time OT |
| From: | John Hofmann <jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com> |
Hey Larry!
I remember when those girls were about three feet tall with you in the 150!
Hope all is well. I have some books of yours I found in my last move.
-john-
---------------------------------
John Hofmann
Vice-President, Information Technology
The Rees Group, Inc.
2810 Crossroads Drive, Ste 3800
Madison, WI 53718
Phone: 608-443-2468, ext. 150
Fax: 608-443-2474
Email: jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com
>
>
> Jim,
>
> Keep your chin up. We all go through times that are difficult for
> various reasons. My project has been at a standstill due to moving and
> tuition & etc for 2 kids. One gets out of school in a couple months and
> should be supporting herself, and I'm really looking forward to it. :)
> Just roll with the punches & it'll come out allright.
>
> Larry the micromong guy
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | propane heater/was Cold Weather Building |
Regarding the use of propane shop heaters. When we lived in Oregon I bought
one of those "orange torpedo" type heaters with electronic spark ignition
and used it with a standard barbeque grill type propane tank. I seem to
recall it being 75,000 btu/hr.
A standard gas grill type propane tank is nominal 20 lbs. or 4 gal. of
propane, which has a heating value of about 71,000 btu/hr/gal. As you can
see, with a 75,000 btu/hr heater you have a little less than 4 hours of
blowing and going at full blast. I used to use it to warm the garage up (15
min. or so), then fire it up again every hour or as needed to take the chill
off. Sucker was too loud to run continuously in there even if I had wanted
to, but it sure was warm when the heater was running. I never worried about
CO or CO2 because my garage door had cracks that you could drive a VW
through, all around it, and I never ran the heater unattended or for
extended periods.
And hey, Jim Markle- what line of work are you in? If you're in science or
engineering or anything related (chemistry, geology, etc.)- we are always
looking for engineers, scientists, and technicians at Southwest Research.
Careers webpage at http://www.swri.org/hr/default.htm
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
Valentines Day -- Shop for gifts that spell L-O-V-E at MSN Shopping
http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8323,ptnrid=37,ptnrdata=24095&tcode=wlmtagline
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MICHAEL SILVIUS" <M.Silvius(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
this rig cost me a couple of hundred to set up, mostly the insulated pipe to
run through the ceiling. The kit for the barrel stove was about $70, barel
rescued from behind the local Catterpillar dealer.
fuel is mostly pallate material collected behind big box stores, and
construction site dumpster diving. 3 yrs and I never had to pay for fuel for
it yet.
keeps my uninsulated shop in T shirrt conditions till the ouside temps drop
below zero.
then a sweat shirt is all we need.
I know in the republic of Kalifornia where you have to get a burn permit for
a Hibachy you could not do this but then you likely don need to either.
Michael in Maine
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave and Connie <dmatt(at)frontiernet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
My father used to have a similar stove in the cellar. His was a Sotz with
a double barrel. The top barrel sucked out so much heat that he had to be
careful to not put a smoke shelf in the chimney. He put in an old water
heater with a convction loop into the stove and put that in series with the
house water heater. It had a pressure vent to the outdoors and blew off
most mornings. With an all electric house it made a huge difference.
Before we were married my wife to be was visisting and mentioned that she
was cold. It took about 10 minutes to put the whole house to 80 or so.
Dave
At 06:38 PM 1/28/2007, MICHAEL SILVIUS wrote:
>this rig cost me a couple of hundred to set up, mostly the insulated pipe to
>run through the ceiling. The kit for the barrel stove was about $70, barel
>rescued from behind the local Catterpillar dealer.
>
>fuel is mostly pallate material collected behind big box stores, and
>construction site dumpster diving. 3 yrs and I never had to pay for fuel for
>it yet.
>
>keeps my uninsulated shop in T shirrt conditions till the ouside temps drop
>below zero.
>then a sweat shirt is all we need.
>
>I know in the republic of Kalifornia where you have to get a burn permit for
>a Hibachy you could not do this but then you likely don need to either.
>
>Michael in Maine
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MICHAEL SILVIUS" <M.Silvius(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
heres the one I have:
http://www.vogelzang.com/barrel_stoves.htm
If I leave the door open it gets going to fast. too much draft. it is a
leaky thing so even with the damper shut she draws real good. Sometimes on
real low wind days if I open the door to soon when its all shut down low it
will belch out a cloud of smoke. But my shop is quite drafty so its not a
big deal. Runing it with the door open is not real efficient and runs
through fuel way to fast.
I try to keep the fire in the back 3rd of the barrel and it keeps thing
runing nicely without to much belching.
michael
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
| From: | "Glenn W. Thomas" <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com> |
Do you line the bottom of the Vogelzang with fire brick or is there a
grate or something? That looks like a great way to heat up a building.
>
>
> heres the one I have:
>
> http://www.vogelzang.com/barrel_stoves.htm
>
> If I leave the door open it gets going to fast. too much draft. it is a
> leaky thing so even with the damper shut she draws real good. Sometimes on
> real low wind days if I open the door to soon when its all shut down low
> it
> will belch out a cloud of smoke. But my shop is quite drafty so its not a
> big deal. Runing it with the door open is not real efficient and runs
> through fuel way to fast.
>
> I try to keep the fire in the back 3rd of the barrel and it keeps thing
> runing nicely without to much belching.
>
> michael
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MICHAEL SILVIUS" <M.Silvius(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cold Weather Building |
Glen:
Just a bit of sand on the inside of the barrel, couple of 25 lb bags is
enough.
as you see I also have the cement paver pad under the stove.
at first I was concerned but with the sand in the bottom of the barrel the
underside remains completey cool to the touch. so there is no issue at all
there. I also placed he stove so that it is in the corner of the shop and
the stair well comes up around it so it tends do draw cool air in form the
garage bellow.
michael
----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn W. Thomas" <glennthomas(at)flyingwood.com>
> Do you line the bottom of the Vogelzang with fire brick or is there a
> grate or something? That looks like a great way to heat up a building.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HelsperSew(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Source for tailwheel spring |
Hi Pieters,
Can anyone help with a source for the large coil tail wheel spring? Thanko
mucho (that's Spanish for thank you very much).
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Hall" <adaairport(at)cableone.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Source for tailwheel spring |
I'm building a Sky Scout with a tail skid. I bought a coil spring at a
local farm supply house that normally would go on a gate. I don't know
how it will hold up, but that is at least a source. Good luck, Terry
Hall, Ada, OK
----- Original Message -----
From: HelsperSew(at)aol.com
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 11:29 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Source for tailwheel spring
Hi Pieters,
Can anyone help with a source for the large coil tail wheel spring?
Thanko mucho (that's Spanish for thank you very much).
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
I'm checking into building a new fuel tank for my Piet. What grade of
aluminum should I use? Has anyone used any other metal for their tanks?
I could use extra weight up front so the weight is not a negative
factor. I'm changing from a metal prop to a wood one, a loss of about 12
lbs Plus when I pulled my old tank I found 16 lbs of lead the builder
had installed in front of the tank. I'm going to mount a battery and a
tool box on the firewall and that will help some.
Thanks
Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steve Ruse <steve(at)wotelectronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Source for tailwheel spring |
The day I bought my GN-1, I was doing some taxi practice on a big
grass strip (my first time ever in a GN-1 or Piet). At some point, I
lost a tailwheel spring. I was in a hurry to get in the air, as I had
an 800+ mile trip ahead of me and already felt like I was behind
schedule. A couple of us started looking for the spring in the grass,
while some helpful guy who I didn't know went to the hardware store to
see what he could find. He found a two pack of the exact sprint that
was on my tailwheel...I was amazed. It took twenty minutes & $2. If
it had been a certified plane, it would have taken three weeks and
$150 to get that spring.
So I put a new spring on both sides, and zip tied the ends to secure
the springs and avoid that problem in the future. No problems since
then in ~200hrs of flying.
Anyway, I've seen these same springs several times in several
different hardware stores since then. The ones I've found come in
pairs in a small yellow/white plastic bag, and generally they have at
least 4-5 sizes to choose from. I was in Lowes a few days ago and saw
them and thought I should pick some up for spares.
Terry, I didn't know you were in Ada. I'm in Norman, OK, not too far
away. Chet Peek is building a Model A Piet in Norman, and there are
at least a couple others in the OKC area. We will have to get
together sometime, I would love to see your project. I'm going to go
to the Paul's Valley fly-in on Saturday if the weather allows, and the
following weekend (February 10th) I'm having a fly-in at the strip
where I keep my plane (a few miles south of Norman), you should come
out if you aren't busy. Chet Peek will probably be there.
Here is some more information if you are interested:
http://www.wotelectronics.com/flyin
Steve Ruse
Norman, OK
Quoting Terry Hall :
> I'm building a Sky Scout with a tail skid. I bought a coil spring
> at a local farm supply house that normally would go on a gate. I
> don't know how it will hold up, but that is at least a source. Good
> luck, Terry Hall, Ada, OK
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: HelsperSew(at)aol.com
> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 11:29 AM
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Source for tailwheel spring
>
>
> Hi Pieters,
>
> Can anyone help with a source for the large coil tail wheel
> spring? Thanko mucho (that's Spanish for thank you very much).
>
> Dan Helsper
> Poplar Grove, IL.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gbowen(at)ptialaska.net" <gbowen(at)ptialaska.net> |
Gene,
Mucho simpler to build out of fiberglass and epoxy using the lost foam core
method I decribed about 1 year ago. Ask someone in the EAA chapter who's
building any composite plane for help. Carving a foam core to fit exactly
what you want isn't hard, laminating glass with epoxy over the outside,
putting in 1/4 Al blanks for the hard points needed for drains/vent/fills,
piece of cake. You simply cut the thing in half, take out the "lost" foam.
You got a custom tank, lighter than metal.
Gordon
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Gene and Tammy zharvey(at)bellsouth.net
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 11:56:47 -0600
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
I'm checking into building a new fuel tank for my Piet. What grade of
aluminum should I use? Has anyone used any other metal for their tanks? I
could use extra weight up front so the weight is not a negative factor. I'm
changing from a metal prop to a wood one, a loss of about 12 lbs Plus when
I pulled my old tank I found 16 lbs of lead the builder had installed in
front of the tank. I'm going to mount a battery and a tool box on the
firewall and that will help some.
Thanks
Gene
--------------------------------------------------------------------
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Source for tailwheel spring |
Steve,
We went through exactly the same thing on our Piet. The springs are
for storm doors and come with their own chains. I like your zip-tie
addition. I'll try it.
Jeff
>
>... He found a two pack of the exact sprint that was on my
>tailwheel...I was amazed. It took twenty minutes & $2. If it had
>been a certified plane, it would have taken three weeks and $150 to
>get that spring.
>
>So I put a new spring on both sides, and zip tied the ends to secure
>the springs and avoid that problem in the future. No problems since
>then in ~200hrs of flying.
>
>Anyway, I've seen these same springs several times in several
>different hardware stores since then. The ones I've found come in
>pairs in a small yellow/white plastic bag, and generally they have
>at least 4-5 sizes to choose from. I was in Lowes a few days ago
>and saw them and thought I should pick some up for spares.
...
--
_____________________________________________________________
Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD
Associate Professor, Emory Eye Center, Atlanta, GA, USA
Senior Editor, Molecular Vision, http://www.molvis.org/molvis
mailto:jboatri(at)emory.edu
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Source for tailwheel spring |
| From: | "Bill Church" <eng(at)canadianrogers.com> |
Dan,
Just did a search of the Matronics List and found the following:
http://www.matronics.com/searching/getmsg_script.cgi?INDEX=616679?KEYS=
t
ail_spring?LISTNAME=Pietenpol?HITNUMBER=23?SERIAL=10362125687?SHOWB
UTTON
S=YES
<http://www.matronics.com/searching/getmsg_script.cgi?INDEX=616679?KEYS
tail_spring?LISTNAME=Pietenpol?HITNUMBER=23?SERIAL=10362125687?SHOW
BUTTO
NS=YES>
here's the relevant info, cut and pasted from the above posting (incase
the link doesn't work for you):
"John Deere sells a spring that's a perfect match for the specs; its
part number is T 143444, and it costs about $9.00. Its outer dia. is
1.5in.; full length( no load ) is 6.73"
Bill C
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Source for tailwheel spring |
| From: | "Catdesign" <Catdesign(at)intergate.com> |
http://www.mcmaster.com/
I bought two springs, Part Number: 96485K141 and 96485K135.
I ended up using the 96485K141 because spring 96485K135 seemed to easy to compress.
Look at their webpage to get the information on each spring.
Chris Tracy
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=91364#91364
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
Thanks for the reply Gordon.
Fiberglass was considered as I've built and repaired fiberglass boats for a
fair number of years. I discarded the idea for a number of reasons. I
actually need more weight not less. I guess the biggest reason is the
alcohol that is finding its way into almost all fuel. A real killer on
fiberglass tanks. If you use only av gas it shouldn't be a problem for now,
but I end up using a lot of auto gas.
Thank you
Gene in Tennessee (down with the flu)
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> mail2web.com - Enhanced email for the mobile individual based on
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HelsperSew(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Tailwheel spring |
Thanks Chris,
I just ordered the 96485K141. I had an order ready for Mcmaster Carr
anyway today, so I just added it on.
I love that place. They have everything under the sun, and you can order 1
bolt or nut if you need it. (and
have it the next morning). A lot of my misc. parts in my airplane come
from there. Also I have been looking at your posted photos of your tailwheel
assembly. I got some good ideas from you. Mine will be a skid plate, with
the option of attaching (with pins) a removable tailwheel. At this point it
will be a non-steerable tailwheel. We shall see how it goes. Hopefully with
good brakes, I won't need the steerable model.
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Source for tailwheel spring |
I think different folks are talking about different springs. Unless I'm
mistaken, the original request was for a source for the spring that is used
in the Pietenpol tail skid design. It's a single large coil in the vertical
position. The other responders seem to be talking about steerable tailwheel
springs, aka storm door springs, inline with the tailwheel steering cables.
Different critters.
I believe someone said they got their large coil spring from a farm tractor
seat.
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
>From predictions to trailers, check out the MSN Entertainment Guide to the
Academy Awards
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | McMaster-Carr for just about anything |
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
Dan from Poplar Grove is right, McMaster-Carr is amazing--we use them
for things we need at work almost every other week and I don't
know how they do it but we generally order one day and have the goods
the next day. http://www.mcmaster.com/
I needed some high-strength metric bolts for a brake job I was doing on
my stepson's car last fall and it had to be a super fine metric
thread. Nobody in town carried anything of the sort but McMaster-Carr
had them and I had them the next day. Amazing.
Come to find out that unlike SAE threads like NC and NF coarse and fine,
metric bolts have three or four different thread spacing's and a
grade 8 in SAE is not the same as a grade 8 in metric. Learned quite a
bit that day.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gbowen(at)ptialaska.net" <gbowen(at)ptialaska.net> |
Gene,
Fiberglass made using polyester resin is a problem with all sorts of
solvents, including normal fuel. But fiberglass tanks made with epoxy have
been in service with the canard-pusher guys since Rutan first flew into Osh
in the early 70's. If they're done right, they don't leak. But if weight
is the consideration, make them out of galvanized steel like my Piete. If
fixed my weight problem (I'm 275lbs) with a 0-235 engine, chevy starter,
car battery under legs of passenger seat and moved the engine mount forward
about 4". With Aeronca wings get about 750'/min. climb, with full 22 gal
fuel, my fat carcass, and indicates 105 mph at 3000' with full 2650 rpm
power. But love to cruise at 2000 rpm at 75mph indicated, hang the elbow
out the side like driving a convertable, fuel burn is about 6 gal/hr Fresh
jugs on Lyco gets about 108 hp.
Gordon
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Gene and Tammy zharvey(at)bellsouth.net
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:30:11 -0600
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
Thanks for the reply Gordon.
Fiberglass was considered as I've built and repaired fiberglass boats for a
fair number of years. I discarded the idea for a number of reasons. I
actually need more weight not less. I guess the biggest reason is the
alcohol that is finding its way into almost all fuel. A real killer on
fiberglass tanks. If you use only av gas it shouldn't be a problem for
now,
but I end up using a lot of auto gas.
Thank you
Gene in Tennessee (down with the flu)
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> mail2web.com - Enhanced email for the mobile individual based on
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> Exchange - http://link.mail2web.com/Personal/EnhancedEmail
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack T. Textor" <jtextor(at)thepalmergroup.com> |
Gordon,
At 105 indicated, do you have a concern with control fluter?
Jack
www.textors.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
Gordon,
Very interested in your galvanized steel tank. What thickness did you use?
How hard was it to work with? I plan on forming my own and then having it
welded by someone that knows what their doing. Sounds like you get great
performance out of your plane.
I'm in the middle of completely going thru my Piet and doing a major on the
A-65. I'm not completely happy with the current fuel tank and using a
heavier metel would allow me to do away with the lead.
As far as fiberglass using polyester resin or epoxy I encourage anyone
considering building a fuel tank from fiberglass to check around and do a
little investigating pior to building. Boat US is a good source of
information on fiberglass fuel tanks as well as many of the homebuilt sites
(Avid, Kit Fox ect) that use fiberglass tanks. Fuel with alcohol is a big
problem for fiberglass tanks everyone should be awear of..
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: <gbowen(at)ptialaska.net>
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 4:35 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
>
>
> Gene,
> Fiberglass made using polyester resin is a problem with all sorts of
> solvents, including normal fuel. But fiberglass tanks made with epoxy
> have
> been in service with the canard-pusher guys since Rutan first flew into
> Osh
> in the early 70's. If they're done right, they don't leak. But if weight
> is the consideration, make them out of galvanized steel like my Piete. If
> fixed my weight problem (I'm 275lbs) with a 0-235 engine, chevy starter,
> car battery under legs of passenger seat and moved the engine mount
> forward
> about 4". With Aeronca wings get about 750'/min. climb, with full 22 gal
> fuel, my fat carcass, and indicates 105 mph at 3000' with full 2650 rpm
> power. But love to cruise at 2000 rpm at 75mph indicated, hang the elbow
> out the side like driving a convertable, fuel burn is about 6 gal/hr
> Fresh
> jugs on Lyco gets about 108 hp.
> Gordon
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: Gene and Tammy zharvey(at)bellsouth.net
> Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:30:11 -0600
> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
>
>
>
>
> Thanks for the reply Gordon.
> Fiberglass was considered as I've built and repaired fiberglass boats for
> a
> fair number of years. I discarded the idea for a number of reasons. I
> actually need more weight not less. I guess the biggest reason is the
> alcohol that is finding its way into almost all fuel. A real killer on
> fiberglass tanks. If you use only av gas it shouldn't be a problem for
> now,
> but I end up using a lot of auto gas.
> Thank you
> Gene in Tennessee (down with the flu)
>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
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________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 1/29/2007 1:32:37 PM Central Standard Time,
zharvey(at)bellsouth.net writes:
Thanks for the reply Gordon.
Fiberglass was considered as I've built and repaired fiberglass boats for a
fair number of years. I discarded the idea for a number of reasons. I
actually need more weight not less. I guess the biggest reason is the
alcohol that is finding its way into almost all fuel. A real killer on
fiberglass tanks. If you use only av gas it shouldn't be a problem for now,
but I end up using a lot of auto gas.
Thank you
Gene in Tennessee (down with the flu)
Gene,
I built both my fuel tanks with fiberglass, however, I mistakenly used
polyester resin (auto body stuff). Instead of the lost foam method, I built
female moulds, and did the 4 ply layups inside the moulds. I have a lot of
pictures and explainations about this process on my web site:
http://nx770cg.com/FuelSystem.html
West Systems Epoxy is the type of resin you should use in a fuel tank, as it
is impervious to fuels, oil, and solvents. I am VERY careful about not having
alcohol in my fuel, and I use MoGas about half the time. There is a lot of
corn out here in Kansas, and more and more of it is being used in the fuel.
Another thing I would like to mention, is that a Nose Heavy Pietenpol is
about as rare as a light weight Pietenpol driver. Have you ever done a Weight
& Balance ? And then do it all over again, with a helper, just to confirm
the first time ?
Chuck G.
NX770CG
(hope you get to feeling better...flying weather ain't far off !! )
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Source for tailwheel spring |
| From: | "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com> |
Hey guys,
Just as another source. I got mine from the front forks of a motorcycle. At
the time I didn't realize how easy it was to order from McMaster-Carr. I went
to a local junkyard and they had a few motorcycles with bent front forks. They
told me if they were bent to have at it and do what I wanted to them. The
forks are a hydraulic cylinder with a spring inside. I took the cap off of both
bent tubes from one bike and ended up with 2 springs almost 18" long. They
charged me a whopping $2.00 for both. I cut it down and now have a few spares.
It has been doing really well back there since I started flying.
If you really want to know there is probably a story behind just about every
part on my plane. And I'm sure all the other Piets are the same!
Don Emch
NX899DE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=91443#91443
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Tailwheel spring |
In a message dated 1/29/2007 2:56:04 PM Central Standard Time,
HelsperSew(at)aol.com writes:
Mine will be a skid plate, with the option of attaching (with pins) a
removable tailwheel. At this point it will be a non-steerable tailwheel. We shall
see how it goes. Hopefully with good brakes, I won't need the steerable model.
Dan,
I tried that set up, and in '03 I flew 'er from Wichita to Brodhead /
Oshkosh.
Here is a re-print of one of the write ups I did about that flight:
Subj: Pietenpol-List: Flying Stories - Tail skids & hard surface
Date: 8/12/03 12:10:02 AM Central Daylight Time
From: Rcaprd(at)aol.com
I just gotta share some of my flying stories with y'all (most of them are
true), as well as some of the lessons I've learned.
Flying a 'Low & Slow' airplane cross country is absolutely the best way
to see this beautiful country we live in, and meet so many people...it's a real
attention getter at the FBO's. Don't tell me this ain't no cross country
airplane, cause I don't wanna hear about it. On the return trip, someone asked
"Well, how many hours did it take to get there ?" I replied "When you fly a
Pietenpol on a cross country, you don't measure time in hours, you measure it
in days !!" After a good heart felt laugh, they gathered themselves back
together and asked "OK, well how many days did it take you to get there ?" I
replied with a grin "Three !!"
Tail Skids, and hard surface runways:
I have always flown off the grass runways, no brakes, and the tail skid
performs very well on the grass. Simplicity at it's finest, and much less weight
back at the tail. Stick forward, add power, and just rudder it around...no
worries. I got the brakes operational just a week before Brodhead, but didn't
have time to get a tail wheel done. Well, when ya try to land a tail skid on a
hard surface runway, ya really gotta spit your gum out, and pay attention !!
My first one, was on the second leg of my trip. I did four hard surface
landings during my adventure to Brodhead / Oshkosh adventure, and each time I
almost lost it on roll out - maybe 20 or 15 mph down to zero mph. I learned that
any slight breeze will push the tail around, and with the engine at idle - no
prop wash, she just doesn't pay any attention to where the rudder is, and the
tail just goes wherever the wind tells it to. When I left, I thought I could
just use a touch of brake in this situation, and everything would be cool...Big
Mistake...BIG BIG MISTAKE !! Example: When she's headed to the right side
of the edge of the runway, I just lightly stabbed the left brake to keep it on
course down the runway. Well, this got 'er pointed back on course, but it
also brought the tail up abruptly, and then it did a double bounce back down.
Adding power takes a second or two, for the prop wash to reach the rudder. On
my second hard surface landing, I just let 'er go to the grass off the side of
the runway...I think she was just letting me know she likes it there much
more !! Each time, I had visions of either nosing over, or doing a ground loop.
So...THAT'S why I was the only one there at Brodhead with a tail skid !!
When I landed at Oshkosh in front of all those people, and as I was doing this
dance down the runway, ATC was saying to me "Red high wing, exit runway...as
soon as you can..."
So... the morale of this story, is 'Entertainment is as close as my next
landing'.
Or...'Tail skids, and hard surface runways, just don't mix well'.
Chuck Gantzer
NX770CG
Wichita, KS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PIETLARS29(at)wmconnect.com |
Hi,
Made my tank out of 26 ga. galvanized iron; I think that 28 ga would do OK.
We soldered the seams, not welded; make flanges at joints and rivet the
pieces for mechanical joining then solder the seams. You need a large soldering
iron, preferably using a gas burner to heat it.
Lou Larsen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com> |
Mine is .050" 5052 Al. It is very soft and workable. I formed it all up and used
a filler neck and cap from Aircraft Spruce. I clamped it together and took
it to a racecar builder who welds aluminum tanks and 4130 steel car frames.
The guy is from Gibsonburg, OH (near Toledo) and does really great work. He
has done several other airplane tanks and 4130 tubing engine mounts. If anyone
is interested I could get the info.
Don Emch
NX899DE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=91449#91449
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
Chuck,
No I haven't heard of a nose heavy Piet. That's the reason I'm looking
for a heavy fuel tank. Need the weight up front. When I pulled the
tank I found the builder had installed 16 lbs of lead to help put more
weight forward Plus I'm taking off the metal prop and installing a wood
prop (about a 12 lb loss). Guess I should have mentioned that my fuel
tank sets right behind the firewall.
The plane has been flying hands off but you had better believe I will be
doing a new W & B after my changes. So far I'm not a builder but I
would call my self a "redoer". I've rebuilt 5 different airplanes and
I've been pleased with the results. I can't afford to build and fly at
the same time and I hate to give up flying for very long. Rebuilding is
much quicker and I still get some of the satisfaction of building, plus
it's a great way to get to know your airplane. The plane should be down
only about 2 to 3 months, mainly because of the engine major overhaul.
I'll be flying by spring.
I really appreciate all the good info and advice from this site.
Gene in Tennessee
----- Original Message -----
From: Rcaprd(at)aol.com
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 6:17 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
In a message dated 1/29/2007 1:32:37 PM Central Standard Time,
zharvey(at)bellsouth.net writes:
Thanks for the reply Gordon.
Fiberglass was considered as I've built and repaired fiberglass
boats for a
fair number of years. I discarded the idea for a number of reasons.
I
actually need more weight not less. I guess the biggest reason is
the
alcohol that is finding its way into almost all fuel. A real killer
on
fiberglass tanks. If you use only av gas it shouldn't be a problem
for now,
but I end up using a lot of auto gas.
Thank you
Gene in Tennessee (down with the flu)
Gene,
I built both my fuel tanks with fiberglass, however, I mistakenly
used polyester resin (auto body stuff). Instead of the lost foam
method, I built female moulds, and did the 4 ply layups inside the
moulds. I have a lot of pictures and explainations about this process
on my web site: http://nx770cg.com/FuelSystem.html
West Systems Epoxy is the type of resin you should use in a fuel tank,
as it is impervious to fuels, oil, and solvents. I am VERY careful
about not having alcohol in my fuel, and I use MoGas about half the
time. There is a lot of corn out here in Kansas, and more and more of
it is being used in the fuel.
Another thing I would like to mention, is that a Nose Heavy
Pietenpol is about as rare as a light weight Pietenpol driver. Have you
ever done a Weight & Balance ? And then do it all over again, with a
helper, just to confirm the first time ?
Chuck G.
NX770CG
(hope you get to feeling better...flying weather ain't far off !! )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
Lou,
Good info. How long (flight hours) have you had your tank and how has
it held up?
Thank you
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: PIETLARS29(at)wmconnect.com
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 6:34 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
Hi,
Made my tank out of 26 ga. galvanized iron; I think that 28 ga would
do OK.
We soldered the seams, not welded; make flanges at joints and rivet
the pieces for mechanical joining then solder the seams. You need a
large soldering iron, preferably using a gas burner to heat it.
Lou Larsen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gcardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net> |
Tried this method on NX18235 and we were not happy. The tank was
beautifully constructed and leak checked on the bench.
It held fine for the first hour of flight time and then the tell-tale
blue streaks of 100LL started showing up.
After about 50 hours of flight time the galvanized, riveted and soldered
tank was leaking at the rate of about 1 gallon per hour.
Replaced it with a TIG welded aluminum tank. No more leaks and no more
worries.
Greg Cardinal
----- Original Message -----
Hi,
Made my tank out of 26 ga. galvanized iron; I think that 28 ga would
do OK.
We soldered the seams, not welded; make flanges at joints and rivet
the pieces for mechanical joining then solder the seams. You need a
large soldering iron, preferably using a gas burner to heat it.
Lou Larsen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KMHeide <kmheidecpo(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | A Corksickle Update |
Today we finished securing the airplane and wings in place. Everything is tucked
underneath with the tail section dissembled and stored in the back of the truck.
As Corky filled up with gas, I made sure the trailer tires were properly inflated.
Finally with map in one hand and the other waving goodbye, I heard him exclaim....Merry
Christmas to all..... and to yous Yankees with 15 below kiss my cold
southern @*#%+ ass!
Tee-hee-hee
Enjoy the trip corky and my god bless you always!
Members...enjoy the photos.
Ken H.
Fargo, ND
---------------------------------
Don't get soaked. Take a quick peak at the forecast
with theYahoo! Search weather shortcut.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
Greg,
Thanks for the heads up report on your galvanized fuel tank. Did you
use 5052 Aluminum on your new tank? The reason I ask is that the
aluminum tank installed in my Piet is stress cracking after only 50
hours. Have no idea what aluminum was used but I want to do it right
when I replace it.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: gcardinal
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 10:59 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
Tried this method on NX18235 and we were not happy. The tank was
beautifully constructed and leak checked on the bench.
It held fine for the first hour of flight time and then the tell-tale
blue streaks of 100LL started showing up.
After about 50 hours of flight time the galvanized, riveted and
soldered tank was leaking at the rate of about 1 gallon per hour.
Replaced it with a TIG welded aluminum tank. No more leaks and no more
worries.
Greg Cardinal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HelsperSew(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Tailwheel spring |
Chuck,
Thanks for the archive report. Did you put the "keels" on your skid plate,
and do you think these are necessary on grass?
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Glass" <redsglass(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel tanks and baffels |
With all the talk about fuel tank and some failures of the thinner tanks,
has anybody installed any baffels in their tanks?
I understand these are fairly small tanks but the baffels would structurally
stiffen the tanks and slow down the fuel "banging" into one side or the
other.
What do you other guys think?
Steve in Maine
_________________________________________________________________
FREE online classifieds from Windows Live Expo buy and sell with people
you know
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PIETLARS29(at)wmconnect.com |
Gene,
Flight time on my tank is zero; I'm about 90% complete and about 70% to go.
My tank was built with an majority assist by a Chapter member who is retired
from the sheet metal trade. he used to make ferry tanks for folks ferrying
aircraft to South America from Miami, so he knows what he's doing. . We did
pressure tests and leak tests until we had it tight.
B. Pietenpol used terne plate for his tanks and a while back Larry Williams
presented considerable detail on his G.I. tank fabrication; should be in the
archives.
Regards,
Lou Larsen
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Source for tailwheel spring |
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
I got mine at McMaster-Carr. http://www.mcmaster.com/ I forget what
model number I used.
Jack Phillips
Getting ready to fly the Piet to Sun 'n' Fun
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
HelsperSew(at)aol.com
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 12:30 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Source for tailwheel spring
Hi Pieters,
Can anyone help with a source for the large coil tail wheel spring?
Thanko mucho (that's Spanish for thank you very much).
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
_________________________________________________
This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privilege
d, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it i
n error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any
other use of the email by you is prohibited.
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - N
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
Gene,
I made my tank out of 5052 aluminum, .040" thick, riveted together and
then TIG welded
Jack
NX899JP
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene and
Tammy
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 12:57 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
I'm checking into building a new fuel tank for my Piet. What grade of
aluminum should I use? Has anyone used any other metal for their tanks?
I could use extra weight up front so the weight is not a negative
factor. I'm changing from a metal prop to a wood one, a loss of about 12
lbs Plus when I pulled my old tank I found 16 lbs of lead the builder
had installed in front of the tank. I'm going to mount a battery and a
tool box on the firewall and that will help some.
Thanks
Gene
_________________________________________________
This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privilege
d, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it i
n error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any
other use of the email by you is prohibited.
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - N
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Luther <luther(at)gci.net> |
Gene,
My vote for a fuel tank is .040 5052 H32 Aluminum. You can assemble it easy
enough and have it Tig welded.
Mike Luther
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene and Tammy <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net>
Date: Monday, January 29, 2007 9:06 am
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
> I'm checking into building a new fuel tank for my Piet. What
> grade of aluminum should I use? Has anyone used any other metal
> for their tanks? I could use extra weight up front so the weight
> is not a negative factor. I'm changing from a metal prop to a wood
> one, a loss of about 12 lbs Plus when I pulled my old tank I found
> 16 lbs of lead the builder had installed in front of the tank.
> I'm going to mount a battery and a tool box on the firewall and
> that will help some.
> Thanks
> Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Fuel tanks and baffels |
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
My tank (centersection) has two baffles acting as ribs to stiffen the
tank. About 80 hours on the plane now and no leaks. 15 gallon tank.
Jack Phillips
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve
Glass
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 7:53 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks and baffels
With all the talk about fuel tank and some failures of the thinner
tanks,
has anybody installed any baffels in their tanks?
I understand these are fairly small tanks but the baffels would
structurally
stiffen the tanks and slow down the fuel "banging" into one side or the
other.
What do you other guys think?
Steve in Maine
_________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MICHAEL SILVIUS" <M.Silvius(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Source for tailwheel spring |
Try searching for Part # 9624 K6 at http://www.mcmaster.com/
that is the spring for the main landing gear in the Cub type set up with
springs instead of bungees.
that # will bring up the page with the springs and then you can go from
there.
michael
----- Original Message -----
From: Phillips, Jack
I got mine at McMaster-Carr. http://www.mcmaster.com/ I forget what
model number I used.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
Thanks Mike. My local A & P is saying the same. I just want to explore
all possibilities and find out what other Piet builders have done.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Mike Luther
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 10:45 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
Gene,
My vote for a fuel tank is .040 5052 H32 Aluminum. You can assemble
it easy enough and have it Tig welded.
Mike Luther
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene and Tammy <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net>
Date: Monday, January 29, 2007 9:06 am
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> I'm checking into building a new fuel tank for my Piet. What
> grade of aluminum should I use? Has anyone used any other metal
> for their tanks? I could use extra weight up front so the weight
> is not a negative factor. I'm changing from a metal prop to a wood
> one, a loss of about 12 lbs Plus when I pulled my old tank I found
> 16 lbs of lead the builder had installed in front of the tank.
> I'm going to mount a battery and a tool box on the firewall and
> that will help some.
> Thanks
> Gene
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
Jack,
Hate to make a pest out of myself but where have you found to be the
best place to order your metal. Still haven't decided what I'm going to
use but I need to place an order soon.
How soon can I expect a report on that prop?
Thanks
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Phillips, Jack
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 10:20 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
Gene,
I made my tank out of 5052 aluminum, .040" thick, riveted together and
then TIG welded
Jack
NX899JP
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene and
Tammy
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 12:57 PM
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
I'm checking into building a new fuel tank for my Piet. What grade of
aluminum should I use? Has anyone used any other metal for their tanks?
I could use extra weight up front so the weight is not a negative
factor. I'm changing from a metal prop to a wood one, a loss of about 12
lbs Plus when I pulled my old tank I found 16 lbs of lead the builder
had installed in front of the tank. I'm going to mount a battery and a
tool box on the firewall and that will help some.
Thanks
Gene
_________________________________________________
This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain
privileged, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have
received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands
- N
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: A Corksickle Update |
Ken,
Thanks for the report on Corky the wimp. Where can I find the photos?
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: KMHeide
To: Pietenpol
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 1:04 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: A Corksickle Update
Today we finished securing the airplane and wings in place. Everything
is tucked underneath with the tail section dissembled and stored in the
back of the truck.
As Corky filled up with gas, I made sure the trailer tires were
properly inflated.
Finally with map in one hand and the other waving goodbye, I heard him
exclaim....Merry Christmas to all..... and to yous Yankees with 15
below kiss my cold southern @*#%+ ass!
Tee-hee-hee
Enjoy the trip corky and my god bless you always!
Members...enjoy the photos.
Ken H.
Fargo, ND
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Don't get soaked. Take a quick peak at the forecast
with theYahoo! Search weather shortcut.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com> |
I don't know the best place, but I just ordered most of my aluminum from
AS&S. The prop report will probably be after SNF.
Jack Phillips
In San Diego on business, and enjoying the warmth (it was 22 F when I
left NC yesterday)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene and
Tammy
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
Jack,
Hate to make a pest out of myself but where have you found to be the
best place to order your metal. Still haven't decided what I'm going to
use but I need to place an order soon.
How soon can I expect a report on that prop?
Thanks
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Phillips, Jack <mailto:Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal.com>
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 10:20 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
Gene,
I made my tank out of 5052 aluminum, .040" thick, riveted
together and then TIG welded
Jack
NX899JP
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene and
Tammy
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 12:57 PM
To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
I'm checking into building a new fuel tank for my Piet. What
grade of aluminum should I use? Has anyone used any other metal for
their tanks? I could use extra weight up front so the weight is not a
negative factor. I'm changing from a metal prop to a wood one, a loss of
about 12 lbs Plus when I pulled my old tank I found 16 lbs of lead the
builder had installed in front of the tank. I'm going to mount a
battery and a tool box on the firewall and that will help some.
Thanks
Gene
_________________________________________________
This message is for the designated recipient only and may
contain privileged, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If
you have received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and
delete
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese -
Nederlands - N
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matr
onics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
_________________________________________________
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n error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | 17 gallon nose tank, no baffles |
| From: | "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov> |
My behind the firewall tank is just like Jack's being 5052 .040" and TIG
welded. I have the tank well supported so it doesn't oil can on me that
I can
tell and no leaks after 300 plus hours.
Used Fuel Lube on the screw-in fittings. Small can will last you two or
three
lifetimes and to share with other homebuilders. I liken it to cold bees
wax...very
stiff and sticky but better than using teflon tape (which is verboten in
fuel systems...see
Bingelis books) or other goop.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 17 gallon nose tank, no baffles |
Mike
The tank I removed from my Piet is almost an exact copy of your drawing!
The only difference I noticed is the stainless strap. I'm not sure of the
thickness of the tank. I've even considered just plateing over the tank.
I'm going to take the tank to someone knowledgable to see what they say.
In the end, it'll be me that makes the decision on what to do and it will be
me flying with it. Everyones input has been really helpful. I'm learning a
lot
Thanks for the heads up on the Fuel Lube and yes, teflon tape is a good
thing to keep away from fuel or oil. All it takes is one little ol' piece
to shut you down in a big way (been there/done that with a P/U truck
engine).
Thanks
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov>
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 1:00 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: 17 gallon nose tank, no baffles
My behind the firewall tank is just like Jack's being 5052 .040" and TIG
welded. I have the tank well supported so it doesn't oil can on me that
I can
tell and no leaks after 300 plus hours.
Used Fuel Lube on the screw-in fittings. Small can will last you two or
three
lifetimes and to share with other homebuilders. I liken it to cold bees
wax...very
stiff and sticky but better than using teflon tape (which is verboten in
fuel systems...see
Bingelis books) or other goop.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "walt evans" <waltdak(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 17 gallon nose tank, no baffles |
Mine looks very similar to yours mike, except 14 gallons. Made mine to sit
on the original "A" shelf.
No baffles
The pics are of the tank BEFORE having it rewelded by my welder/builder
friend. After I welded it I used it to water the flowers in the garden,
then had it rewelded. :^)
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov>
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 2:00 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: 17 gallon nose tank, no baffles
My behind the firewall tank is just like Jack's being 5052 .040" and TIG
welded. I have the tank well supported so it doesn't oil can on me that
I can
tell and no leaks after 300 plus hours.
Used Fuel Lube on the screw-in fittings. Small can will last you two or
three
lifetimes and to share with other homebuilders. I liken it to cold bees
wax...very
stiff and sticky but better than using teflon tape (which is verboten in
fuel systems...see
Bingelis books) or other goop.
Mike C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gbowen(at)ptialaska.net" <gbowen(at)ptialaska.net> |
Jack,
Haven't seen a problem yet, but don't spend much time at that speed due to
my ears fluttering in the wind. My buddy has a Champ and with the tight
cowling he has he timed us as I tried to catch up for pictures, C-85 on the
Champ
Gordon
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Jack T. Textor jtextor(at)thepalmergroup.com
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:10:31 -0600
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
Gordon,
At 105 indicated, do you have a concern with control fluter?
Jack
www.textors.com
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gbowen(at)ptialaska.net" <gbowen(at)ptialaska.net> |
Gene,
The issue of alcohol in fuel has been batted around the canardian group a
lot. Concensus is use AVgas, unless forced to use a tank or two of Mogas
with alcohol. Epoxy is pretty resistant to alcohol and most other
solvents, I suspect the aromatics they put in no-lead fuel is more damaging
to epoxy tanks than the issue of alcohol. I run only Avgas.
Gordon
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Gene and Tammy zharvey(at)bellsouth.net
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 18:02:33 -0600
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
Gordon,
Very interested in your galvanized steel tank. What thickness did you use?
How hard was it to work with? I plan on forming my own and then having it
welded by someone that knows what their doing. Sounds like you get great
performance out of your plane.
I'm in the middle of completely going thru my Piet and doing a major on the
A-65. I'm not completely happy with the current fuel tank and using a
heavier metel would allow me to do away with the lead.
As far as fiberglass using polyester resin or epoxy I encourage anyone
considering building a fuel tank from fiberglass to check around and do a
little investigating pior to building. Boat US is a good source of
information on fiberglass fuel tanks as well as many of the homebuilt sites
(Avid, Kit Fox ect) that use fiberglass tanks. Fuel with alcohol is a big
problem for fiberglass tanks everyone should be awear of..
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: <gbowen(at)ptialaska.net>
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 4:35 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
>
>
> Gene,
> Fiberglass made using polyester resin is a problem with all sorts of
> solvents, including normal fuel. But fiberglass tanks made with epoxy
> have
> been in service with the canard-pusher guys since Rutan first flew into
> Osh
> in the early 70's. If they're done right, they don't leak. But if weight
> is the consideration, make them out of galvanized steel like my Piete. If
> fixed my weight problem (I'm 275lbs) with a 0-235 engine, chevy starter,
> car battery under legs of passenger seat and moved the engine mount
> forward
> about 4". With Aeronca wings get about 750'/min. climb, with full 22 gal
> fuel, my fat carcass, and indicates 105 mph at 3000' with full 2650 rpm
> power. But love to cruise at 2000 rpm at 75mph indicated, hang the elbow
> out the side like driving a convertable, fuel burn is about 6 gal/hr
> Fresh
> jugs on Lyco gets about 108 hp.
> Gordon
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: Gene and Tammy zharvey(at)bellsouth.net
> Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:30:11 -0600
> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
>
>
>
>
> Thanks for the reply Gordon.
> Fiberglass was considered as I've built and repaired fiberglass boats for
> a
> fair number of years. I discarded the idea for a number of reasons. I
> actually need more weight not less. I guess the biggest reason is the
> alcohol that is finding its way into almost all fuel. A real killer on
> fiberglass tanks. If you use only av gas it shouldn't be a problem for
> now,
> but I end up using a lot of auto gas.
> Thank you
> Gene in Tennessee (down with the flu)
>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>> mail2web.com - Enhanced email for the mobile individual based on
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>> Exchange - http://link.mail2web.com/Personal/EnhancedEmail
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "walt evans" <waltdak(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Prop refinishing/out of the blue |
Just happened to remember when I was looking at some old pics of my
building.....
I had gotten an old Sensinich and refinished it. I contacted them
and they sent me new decals for free.
You may be able to get them right off the net.
Just a little something.
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene and Tammy" <zharvey(at)bellsouth.net> |
Gordon,
Your right that as long as you use Avgas, fiberglass tanks are safe. I'm
one of those that simply wants to be able to make the choice without fear of
putting my self or my plane in danger. The last plane I owned (Avid) had
fiberglass tanks and I didn't have one single problem. I always tested
every tank of gas for alcohol. Others with the same plane, same fiberglass
tanks, that did not test their gas, were having bad problems and some planes
may have been lost because of it. Lots of problems with fiberglass and
alcohol are well documented. I'm not trying to scare anyone or badmouth
fiberglass, just want others to be informed.
Gene ----- Original Message -----
From: <gbowen(at)ptialaska.net>
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 2:45 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
>
>
> Gene,
> The issue of alcohol in fuel has been batted around the canardian group a
> lot. Concensus is use AVgas, unless forced to use a tank or two of Mogas
> with alcohol. Epoxy is pretty resistant to alcohol and most other
> solvents, I suspect the aromatics they put in no-lead fuel is more
> damaging
> to epoxy tanks than the issue of alcohol. I run only Avgas.
> Gordon
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: Gene and Tammy zharvey(at)bellsouth.net
> Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 18:02:33 -0600
> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
>
>
>
>
> Gordon,
> Very interested in your galvanized steel tank. What thickness did you
> use?
> How hard was it to work with? I plan on forming my own and then having it
> welded by someone that knows what their doing. Sounds like you get great
> performance out of your plane.
> I'm in the middle of completely going thru my Piet and doing a major on
> the
> A-65. I'm not completely happy with the current fuel tank and using a
> heavier metel would allow me to do away with the lead.
> As far as fiberglass using polyester resin or epoxy I encourage anyone
> considering building a fuel tank from fiberglass to check around and do a
> little investigating pior to building. Boat US is a good source of
> information on fiberglass fuel tanks as well as many of the homebuilt
> sites
> (Avid, Kit Fox ect) that use fiberglass tanks. Fuel with alcohol is a big
> problem for fiberglass tanks everyone should be awear of..
> Gene
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <gbowen(at)ptialaska.net>
> To:
> Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 4:35 PM
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
>
>
>>
>>
>> Gene,
>> Fiberglass made using polyester resin is a problem with all sorts of
>> solvents, including normal fuel. But fiberglass tanks made with epoxy
>> have
>> been in service with the canard-pusher guys since Rutan first flew into
>> Osh
>> in the early 70's. If they're done right, they don't leak. But if
>> weight
>> is the consideration, make them out of galvanized steel like my Piete.
>> If
>> fixed my weight problem (I'm 275lbs) with a 0-235 engine, chevy starter,
>> car battery under legs of passenger seat and moved the engine mount
>> forward
>> about 4". With Aeronca wings get about 750'/min. climb, with full 22 gal
>> fuel, my fat carcass, and indicates 105 mph at 3000' with full 2650 rpm
>> power. But love to cruise at 2000 rpm at 75mph indicated, hang the elbow
>> out the side like driving a convertable, fuel burn is about 6 gal/hr
>> Fresh
>> jugs on Lyco gets about 108 hp.
>> Gordon
>>
>> Original Message:
>> -----------------
>> From: Gene and Tammy zharvey(at)bellsouth.net
>> Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:30:11 -0600
>> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks for the reply Gordon.
>> Fiberglass was considered as I've built and repaired fiberglass boats for
>> a
>> fair number of years. I discarded the idea for a number of reasons. I
>> actually need more weight not less. I guess the biggest reason is the
>> alcohol that is finding its way into almost all fuel. A real killer on
>> fiberglass tanks. If you use only av gas it shouldn't be a problem for
>> now,
>> but I end up using a lot of auto gas.
>> Thank you
>> Gene in Tennessee (down with the flu)
>>
>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> mail2web.com - Enhanced email for the mobile individual based on
>>> Microsoft
>>> Exchange - http://link.mail2web.com/Personal/EnhancedEmail
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>> myhosting.com - Premium Microsoft Windows and Linux web and application
>> hosting - http://link.mail2web.com/myhosting
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
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> hosting - http://link.mail2web.com/myhosting
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Tailwheel spring & Skid |
In a message dated 1/30/2007 6:09:59 AM Central Standard Time,
HelsperSew(at)aol.com writes:
Did you put the "keels" on your skid plate, and do you think these are
necessary on grass?
Nope, no keels on the bottom of the skid plate...just a flat plate. At
Brodhead '03, I had to weld another plate on the skid, because it was worn
through. I can't think of the guy's name, but he has the shop behind the fuel
pumps there, and he found me a piece of metal, and let me use his torches. No
place in the world like Brodhead !! I bought him a six pack of his favorite
beer.
I had to taxi across some asphalt at my home field, and I'm sure it would
have left marks on the asphalt on a hot summer day. I don't think the keel
is really necessary. It handled well on the grass. Get it on the pavement
though, with any cross wind, and it's very difficult to control, unless you are
going very slow, and you have differential brakes. Land on hard surface with a
tail skid, and you are completely at the mercy of a cross wind. I've never
taken out any runway lights, but she did veer off the runway twice, and there
were a few other close calls on hard surface landings. Landing full stall on
the grass was a no-brainer, and she tracked straight on roll out, and the
rudder was effective.
I now have a 3 1/2" steerable tailwheel, but it should have been a 4".
I've got to use some brakes to steer in tall grass. The 1/16" tailwheel cables
run all the way up to the inboard portion of the rudder bar. I can go
anywhere now, with confidence. I used the original tail skid, and added the wheel
to the aft portion, to keep the tail as low as possible. I've got to touch the
tail wheel before the mains, to get a full stall landing now, or she'll
bounce a little because the wing is not done flying yet. If I ever put a 4" wheel
back there, it would be even more challenging to get a full stall landing.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "gbowen(at)ptialaska.net" <gbowen(at)ptialaska.net> |
The Canardian group I'm a member has about 1000 members via Yahoo, several
are engineers in the fuel industry. Since all the Rutanesque type planes
have all composite tanks, this problem of Mogas has been beat around a heck
of alot. Biggest issue is the variable nature of Mogas, diff formula for
different times of year and different regions of the country. Issue of
increased amounts of alcohol in Mogas has been of great concern lately.
Most problems have come from the additives to gas eating the various
gaskets in the entire fuel system. I spent most of my career in the epoxy
industry, so can be pretty sure the least of the problems with composite
tanks is the epoxy. Derakane, epoxie's chemical cousin is used for
underground fuel storage tanks at the local gas station.
Gordon
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Gene and Tammy zharvey(at)bellsouth.net
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 16:31:36 -0600
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
Gordon,
Your right that as long as you use Avgas, fiberglass tanks are safe. I'm
one of those that simply wants to be able to make the choice without fear
of
putting my self or my plane in danger. The last plane I owned (Avid) had
fiberglass tanks and I didn't have one single problem. I always tested
every tank of gas for alcohol. Others with the same plane, same fiberglass
tanks, that did not test their gas, were having bad problems and some
planes
may have been lost because of it. Lots of problems with fiberglass and
alcohol are well documented. I'm not trying to scare anyone or badmouth
fiberglass, just want others to be informed.
Gene ----- Original Message -----
From: <gbowen(at)ptialaska.net>
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 2:45 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
>
>
> Gene,
> The issue of alcohol in fuel has been batted around the canardian group a
> lot. Concensus is use AVgas, unless forced to use a tank or two of Mogas
> with alcohol. Epoxy is pretty resistant to alcohol and most other
> solvents, I suspect the aromatics they put in no-lead fuel is more
> damaging
> to epoxy tanks than the issue of alcohol. I run only Avgas.
> Gordon
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: Gene and Tammy zharvey(at)bellsouth.net
> Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 18:02:33 -0600
> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
>
>
>
>
> Gordon,
> Very interested in your galvanized steel tank. What thickness did you
> use?
> How hard was it to work with? I plan on forming my own and then having it
> welded by someone that knows what their doing. Sounds like you get great
> performance out of your plane.
> I'm in the middle of completely going thru my Piet and doing a major on
> the
> A-65. I'm not completely happy with the current fuel tank and using a
> heavier metel would allow me to do away with the lead.
> As far as fiberglass using polyester resin or epoxy I encourage anyone
> considering building a fuel tank from fiberglass to check around and do a
> little investigating pior to building. Boat US is a good source of
> information on fiberglass fuel tanks as well as many of the homebuilt
> sites
> (Avid, Kit Fox ect) that use fiberglass tanks. Fuel with alcohol is a big
> problem for fiberglass tanks everyone should be awear of..
> Gene
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <gbowen(at)ptialaska.net>
> To:
> Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 4:35 PM
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
>
>
>>
>>
>> Gene,
>> Fiberglass made using polyester resin is a problem with all sorts of
>> solvents, including normal fuel. But fiberglass tanks made with epoxy
>> have
>> been in service with the canard-pusher guys since Rutan first flew into
>> Osh
>> in the early 70's. If they're done right, they don't leak. But if
>> weight
>> is the consideration, make them out of galvanized steel like my Piete.
>> If
>> fixed my weight problem (I'm 275lbs) with a 0-235 engine, chevy starter,
>> car battery under legs of passenger seat and moved the engine mount
>> forward
>> about 4". With Aeronca wings get about 750'/min. climb, with full 22 gal
>> fuel, my fat carcass, and indicates 105 mph at 3000' with full 2650 rpm
>> power. But love to cruise at 2000 rpm at 75mph indicated, hang the elbow
>> out the side like driving a convertable, fuel burn is about 6 gal/hr
>> Fresh
>> jugs on Lyco gets about 108 hp.
>> Gordon
>>
>> Original Message:
>> -----------------
>> From: Gene and Tammy zharvey(at)bellsouth.net
>> Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:30:11 -0600
>> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tanks
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks for the reply Gordon.
>> Fiberglass was considered as I've built and repaired fiberglass boats for
>> a
>> fair number of years. I discarded the idea for a number of reasons. I
>> actually need more weight not less. I guess the biggest reason is the
>> alcohol that is finding its way into almost all fuel. A real killer on
>> fiberglass tanks. If you use only av gas it shouldn't be a problem for
>> now,
>> but I end up using a lot of auto gas.
>> Thank you
>> Gene in Tennessee (down with the flu)
>>
>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> mail2web.com - Enhanced email for the mobile individual based on
>>> Microsoft
>>> Exchange - http://link.mail2web.com/Personal/EnhancedEmail
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>> myhosting.com - Premium Microsoft Windows and Linux web and application
>> hosting - http://link.mail2web.com/myhosting
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> myhosting.com - Premium Microsoft Windows and Linux web and application
> hosting - http://link.mail2web.com/myhosting
>
>
>
January 11, 2007 - January 30, 2007
Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-fp