Pietenpol-List Archive Browser

Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-je
May 01, 2010 - May 18, 2010

thanks all, john egan Greenville, WI need to make a motor mount ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Large reg numbers and more
From: "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 01, 2010
Data plate on th cowling huh? have you got it inspected that way? I'm pretty sure they normally want it on the outside at the tail. I have been wondering about the statements that it is OK to use big numbers under the wings that are not your N-numbers. if I read that right I am surprised the feds would approve that one.but who knows. maybe I should put pipeline patrol under mine. I very seldom fly 500 feet AGL-usually not over 150.course outside of upsetting a few antelope- I try to stay away from towns and people too.I used to fly with my old instructor when he had a pipeline patrol job and did a lot of the flying on long runs from the Texas panhandle to Denver,into Kansas and home.he'd occasionally ask me to fly a little higher when I started needing to pull up over power lines.but then I like it down in the dirt.that old Skyhawk felt like it was really moving.Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296416#296416 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clif Dawson" <CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Metal pieces for wooden landing gear
Date: May 01, 2010
This is how I did mine. http://clifdawson.ca/Pietenpol3.html Clif PS-Don't look at the tailwheel. I've changed to one I bought at Arlington and modified. Got to put it up sometime. ( Now where did I put that 29 hour clock! :-) Here is a link on how to do the gear.... http://www.westcoastpiet.com/construction_of_wood_gear.htm Once you get the wood legs done, then you can make the metal parts to fit. Rick Schreiber ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: big numbers
Date: May 02, 2010
I agree, I couldn't believe it would be legal to put numbers other than the reg numbers on. I had read the regs and it stated clearly that you could paint whatever letters or numbers you wanted as long as it didn't start with the letter "N". I specifically asked him and he said my interpretation was correct, paint away! Who knew? Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 02, 2010
From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov>
Subject: Re: construction and glue
Dan, Ryan, Chris, Thanks for the feedback and the Bingelis scan - that helped a lot. No way I'll be mitring each cross-brace now as long as the ends butt up against the capstrip and the adjoining cross-brace. Of course, after I sent the question about the white pine I recalled that I've got a small pile of one-by doug fir standing in the corner of the garage - left-overs from the trim jobs in the house. It's not aircraft grade, but for a 1/2" x 1/2" x 2" cross piece I'm sure it's sufficient. Thanks, Dan -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ed G." <flyboy_120(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Aluminum cabane insert material
Date: May 02, 2010
I haven't seen any replies to your question on wooden strut inserts so I'll give it a shot. I would be afraid of useing wood inserts because wood has a fairly low strength on short sections with the grain. There is only about 5/16" of material below the bolt hole on the bottom fitting (and above on the top fitting). With the loads and shock loads applied by the strut the b olt would pull out the small chunk of wood below the bolt along the grain l ines. They would be strong in compression but very weak in tension. I would n't make them out of wood. You would be much better off with metal inserts. Ed G. > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum cabane insert material > From: speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net > Date: Sat=2C 1 May 2010 12:12:09 -0700 > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > net> > > I believe I have my posting woes fixed=2C so I am trying this again. > > I am using aluminum cabanes and am curious if a hard wood=2C (oak/ash) wo uld be suitable for the inserts. I know most use some type of steel or alum inum=2C but since the fittings attach to soft spruce and ply wood gussets o n the fuselage end=2C why not wood inside the cabanes? > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296389#296389 > > > > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > _________________________________________________________________ The New Busy is not the old busy. Search=2C chat and e-mail from your inbox . http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID28326::T:WLMTAGL:O N:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:042010_3 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris" <catdesigns(at)att.net>
Subject: Aileron to Wing Gap
Date: May 02, 2010
How wide should I make the gap at the end of the aileron between the wing and the aileron? You know the area between the two solid end plates? Does 3/8" sound correct? Chris Sacramento, Ca Westcoastpiet.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aileron to Wing Gap
From: "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson(at)erec.net>
Date: May 02, 2010
I have been studying on the same thing as I will be building the ailerons this coming week. I will make mine the width of the folded piano hinge. Is that what you were referring to? -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 Started building NX510JD July, 2009 Ribs and tailfeathers done using Lycoming O-235 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296500#296500 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc00204_131.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris" <catdesigns(at)att.net>
Subject: Re: Aileron to Wing Gap
Date: May 02, 2010
Jerry, What I am referring to is the end of the aileron where it abuts the wing panel parallel to the cord line. For the left wing it would be the right end of the aileron. Chris Sacramento, Ca Westcoastpiet.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Dotson Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2010 1:37 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aileron to Wing Gap I have been studying on the same thing as I will be building the ailerons this coming week. I will make mine the width of the folded piano hinge. Is that what you were referring to? -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 Started building NX510JD July, 2009 Ribs and tailfeathers done using Lycoming O-235 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296500#296500 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc00204_131.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 02, 2010
From: Ben Charvet <bcharvet(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Aileron to Wing Gap
I think I made mine 1/4 inch. You need to allow for the covering and paint on each side and still have enough gap. I ended up with about 1/8 inch when it was finished. You definitely don't want it too tight, but 3/8 would probably leave about 1/4 inch of gap on completion. Ben Charvet On 5/2/2010 6:03 PM, Chris wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Chris" > > Jerry, > > What I am referring to is the end of the aileron where it abuts the wing > panel parallel to the cord line. For the left wing it would be the right end > of the aileron. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 02, 2010
Subject: spar butt straps
From: Ken Chambers <ken.riffic(at)gmail.com>
Working on the 16 center section spar butt straps for the 3-piece wing. My first metal fittings. I've read a lot of advice about making fittings longer. These center section straps don't poke out through the fabric and I can't see a reason to make them longer. What has everyone else done? Anyone made them to plans and had to do them over? I'm really slow so I'd like to avoid doing them over. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 02, 2010
From: Ben Charvet <bcharvet(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: spar butt straps
These are some of the easier fittings to make, especially if you buy the steel in the width specified on the plans. I made my butt straps the same length as the plans. If you are planning to add dihedral, leave enough room for a gap between the wing spars and center section spars. I drilled the ones for the wing spars in a stack so they would be interchangable. Ben Charvet Mims, Fl On 5/2/2010 9:02 PM, Ken Chambers wrote: > > Working on the 16 center section spar butt straps for the 3-piece > wing. My first metal fittings. > > I've read a lot of advice about making fittings longer. These center > section straps don't poke out through the fabric and I can't see a > reason to make them longer. > > What has everyone else done? Anyone made them to plans and had to do > them over? I'm really slow so I'd like to avoid doing them over. > > > * > > > * ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris" <catdesigns(at)att.net>
Subject: spar butt straps
Date: May 02, 2010
I made mine the length shown on the plans and they worked fine. The fittings that you might want to make longer are the ones that project away from the structure where something else bolts to it. On the center section fittings these would be the tabs that the brace wires attach to and the tabs ones that the vertical struts bolt to. Chris Sacramento, Ca Westcoastpiet.com _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ken Chambers Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2010 6:03 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: spar butt straps Working on the 16 center section spar butt straps for the 3-piece wing. My first metal fittings. I've read a lot of advice about making fittings longer. These center section straps don't poke out through the fabric and I can't see a reason to make them longer. What has everyone else done? Anyone made them to plans and had to do them over? I'm really slow so I'd like to avoid doing them over. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 02, 2010
From: Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: spar butt straps
You might want to also check into the way Dale Johnson and Greg Cardinal did theirs. It eliminated the big gap and did the job nicely. If I was at the point you're NOW at...I would do it exactly the way they did it..... jm -----Original Message----- From: Ben Charvet Sent: May 2, 2010 8:17 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: spar butt straps These are some of the easier fittings to make, especially if you buy the steel in the width specified on the plans. I made my butt straps the same length as the plans. If you are planning to add dihedral, leave enough room for a gap between the wing spars and center section spars. I drilled the ones for the wing spars in a stack so they would be interchangable. Ben Charvet Mims, Fl On 5/2/2010 9:02 PM, Ken Chambers wrote: Working on the 16 center section spar butt straps for the 3-piece wing. My first metal fittings. I've read a lot of advice about making fittings longer. These center section straps don't poke out through the fabric and I can't see a reason to make them longer. What has everyone else done? Anyone made them to plans and had to do them over? I'm really slow so I'd like to avoid doing them over. href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aileron to Wing Gap
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: May 02, 2010
I made my gap 1/4" too, like Ben did. Looks like it should provide plenty of room for covering, paint, etc. -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296531#296531 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: spar butt straps
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: May 02, 2010
Is this what you are talking about Jim? -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296533#296533 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0422_149.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aileron to Wing Gap
From: "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson(at)erec.net>
Date: May 02, 2010
Chris, Yeah what Ben said. I read but what you said it blew right by me. I will make mine 1/4" also. I ripped and fitted the 1/2" by 3" spars this afternoon. -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 Started building NX510JD July, 2009 Ribs and tailfeathers done using Lycoming O-235 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296534#296534 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gcardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: spar butt straps
Date: May 02, 2010
We followed the KeriAnn Price plans..... Greg Cardinal ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com> Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2010 9:00 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: spar butt straps > > > You might want to also check into the way Dale Johnson and Greg Cardinal > did theirs. It eliminated the big gap and did the job nicely. If I was > at the point you're NOW at...I would do it exactly the way they did > it..... > > jm > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Ben Charvet > > Sent: May 2, 2010 8:17 PM > > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: spar butt straps > > > These are some of the easier fittings to make, especially if you buy > the steel in the width specified on the plans. I made my butt straps > the same length as the plans. If you are planning to add dihedral, > leave enough room for a gap between the wing spars and center section > spars. I drilled the ones for the wing spars in a stack so they would > be interchangable. > > > Ben Charvet > > Mims, Fl > > > On 5/2/2010 9:02 PM, Ken Chambers wrote: > > > Working on the 16 center section spar butt straps for the 3-piece wing. > My first metal fittings. > > > I've read a lot of advice about making fittings longer. These center > section straps don't poke out through the fabric and I can't see a > reason to make them longer. > > > What has everyone else done? Anyone made them to plans and had to do > them over? I'm really slow so I'd like to avoid doing them over. > > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 02, 2010
Subject: Re: spar butt straps
From: Ken Chambers <ken.riffic(at)gmail.com>
Thanks everyone. I found that that photo of Greg and Dale's beautiful plane too, on West Coast piet. But I'm not smart enough to understand the significance of the fittings meeting beneath the wing. They adjusted the angle of the straps, made them longer...then what happens? On a different topic, has anyone drilled their fittings with a hand drill? I figure I can level the surface the metal is on, use the level on the drill and get a pretty clean hole. Or I'm kidding myself and it's absolutely time to invest in a drill press? On Sun, May 2, 2010 at 9:24 PM, K5YAC wrote: > > Is this what you are talking about Jim? > > -------- > Mark - working on wings > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296533#296533 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0422_149.jpg > > -- Ken Chambers 512-796-1798 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 02, 2010
Subject: Re: spar butt straps
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
Correct, and you may want to make the wing strut fittings a little longer. rick On Sun, May 2, 2010 at 7:40 PM, Chris wrote: > I made mine the length shown on the plans and they worked fine. The > fittings that you might want to make longer are the ones that project away > from the structure where something else bolts to it. On the center section > fittings these would be the tabs that the brace wires attach to and the tabs > ones that the vertical struts bolt to. > > Chris > Sacramento, Ca > Westcoastpiet.com > > ------------------------------ > *From:* owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto: > owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Ken Chambers > *Sent:* Sunday, May 02, 2010 6:03 PM > *To:* pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > *Subject:* Pietenpol-List: spar butt straps > > > Working on the 16 center section spar butt straps for the 3-piece wing. My > first metal fittings. > > I've read a lot of advice about making fittings longer. These center > section straps don't poke out through the fabric and I can't see a reason to > make them longer. > > What has everyone else done? Anyone made them to plans and had to do them > over? I'm really slow so I'd like to avoid doing them over. > > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c* > > * > > * > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clif Dawson" <CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material
Date: May 02, 2010
One question, are you going to bolt to the fuselage fittings through the cabane itself? If so then why do you want anything in there? The only way an insert is going to add strength in tension is if that insert has at least one more bolt through it and the strut an inch or so above the bottom hole. This is a good idea with aluminum. In this case it's best to use a bar of aluminum. It's not like using wood struts. What you do there is add metal plates to the outside with another bolt 1 1/2" above the one that bolts the strut to the fuselage. This icreases the area of the "plug" sides thus increasing the tearout resistance dramaticaly. In both cases the idea is to strengthen the strut. Clif There is only about 5/16" of material below the bolt hole on the bottom fitting (and above on the top fitting). With the loads and shock loads applied by the strut the bolt would pull out the small chunk of wood below the bolt along the grain lines. You would be much better off with metal inserts. Ed G. > > I believe I have my posting woes fixed, so I am trying this again. > > I am using aluminum cabanes and am curious if a hard wood, (oak/ash) would be suitable for the inserts. I know most use some type of steel or aluminum, but since the fittings attach to soft spruce and ply wood gussets on the fuselage end, why not wood inside the cabanes? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gcardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: spar butt straps
Date: May 02, 2010
Hold on, I'm trying to sketch and scan a picture. Greg C. ----- Original Message ----- From: Ken Chambers To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2010 9:47 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: spar butt straps Thanks everyone. I found that that photo of Greg and Dale's beautiful plane too, on West Coast piet. But I'm not smart enough to understand the significance of the fittings meeting beneath the wing. They adjusted the angle of the straps, made them longer...then what happens? On a different topic, has anyone drilled their fittings with a hand drill? I figure I can level the surface the metal is on, use the level on the drill and get a pretty clean hole. Or I'm kidding myself and it's absolutely time to invest in a drill press? On Sun, May 2, 2010 at 9:24 PM, K5YAC wrote: Is this what you are talking about Jim? -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296533#296533 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0422_149.jpg ========== st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ========== http://forums.matronics.com ========== le, List Admin. ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ========== -- Ken Chambers 512-796-1798 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gcardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: spar butt straps
Date: May 02, 2010
Hopefully the attached PDF answers your question. Greg Cardinal ----- Original Message ----- From: Ken Chambers To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2010 9:47 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: spar butt straps Thanks everyone. I found that that photo of Greg and Dale's beautiful plane too, on West Coast piet. But I'm not smart enough to understand the significance of the fittings meeting beneath the wing. They adjusted the angle of the straps, made them longer...then what happens? On a different topic, has anyone drilled their fittings with a hand drill? I figure I can level the surface the metal is on, use the level on the drill and get a pretty clean hole. Or I'm kidding myself and it's absolutely time to invest in a drill press? On Sun, May 2, 2010 at 9:24 PM, K5YAC wrote: Is this what you are talking about Jim? -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296533#296533 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0422_149.jpg ========== st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ========== http://forums.matronics.com ========== le, List Admin. ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ========== -- Ken Chambers 512-796-1798 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris" <catdesigns(at)att.net>
Subject: Re: spar butt straps
Date: May 02, 2010
Ken If you take a look at the pictures on my wing building page you will how I drilled almost every hole with hand drill and a simple drill guide.http://westcoastpiet.com/wings.htm A small drill press does come in handy for drilling some of the holes but I see no reason why you could not drill all the holes by hand. For a description on how I drill hole see this webpage http://westcoastpiet.com/drilling_holes.htm The only thing I do different is to clamp the drill guide on when possible. Now I typically drill the starting holes on my drill press but you could center punch the spot then use a drill guide with a notch to straddle the fitting. Just clapm it to a flat surface and your all set. Kind of like a poor mans drill press. I bet you could find somone with a drill press to drill you some holes to make severl drill guides. _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ken Chambers Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2010 7:48 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: spar butt straps Thanks everyone. I found that that photo of Greg and Dale's beautiful plane too, on West Coast piet. But I'm not smart enough to understand the significance of the fittings meeting beneath the wing. They adjusted the angle of the straps, made them longer...then what happens? On a different topic, has anyone drilled their fittings with a hand drill? I figure I can level the surface the metal is on, use the level on the drill and get a pretty clean hole. Or I'm kidding myself and it's absolutely time to invest in a drill press? On Sun, May 2, 2010 at 9:24 PM, K5YAC wrote: Is this what you are talking about Jim? -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296533#296533 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0422_149.jpg ========== st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ========== http://forums.matronics.com ========== le, List Admin. ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ========== -- Ken Chambers 512-796-1798 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 02, 2010
Subject: Re: spar butt straps
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
Drill press would be a real good idea, can get one from Harbor Freight for less than the price of your hand drill. http://www.harborfreight.com/garage-shop/stationary-drill-press/5-speed-drill-press-38119.html rick On Sun, May 2, 2010 at 8:47 PM, Ken Chambers wrote: > Thanks everyone. > > I found that that photo of Greg and Dale's beautiful plane too, on West > Coast piet. But I'm not smart enough to understand the significance of the > fittings meeting beneath the wing. They adjusted the angle of the straps, > made them longer...then what happens? > > On a different topic, has anyone drilled their fittings with a hand drill? > I figure I can level the surface the metal is on, use the level on the drill > and get a pretty clean hole. Or I'm kidding myself and it's absolutely time > to invest in a drill press? > > > On Sun, May 2, 2010 at 9:24 PM, K5YAC wrote: > >> >> Is this what you are talking about Jim? >> >> -------- >> Mark - working on wings >> >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296533#296533 >> >> >> >> >> Attachments: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0422_149.jpg >> >> >> >> >> ========== >> st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >> ========== >> http://forums.matronics.com >> ========== >> le, List Admin. >> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> ========== >> >> >> >> > > > -- > Ken Chambers > 512-796-1798 > > * > > * > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris" <catdesigns(at)att.net>
Subject: Metal pieces for wooden landing gear
Date: May 02, 2010
Clif Finally! Now I know where I got the idea to building my landing gear the way I did. it's been bugging me because I knew I had seen an inverted jig setup before but could not find it again. Thanks for the inspiration. It worked great. Chris Sacramento, Ca Westcoastpiet.com _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Clif Dawson Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2010 7:58 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Metal pieces for wooden landing gear This is how I did mine. http://clifdawson.ca/Pietenpol3.html Clif PS-Don't look at the tailwheel. I've changed to one I bought at Arlington and modified. Got to put it up sometime. ( Now where did I put that 29 hour clock! :-) Here is a link on how to do the gear.... http://www.westcoastpiet.com/construction_of_wood_gear.htm Once you get the wood legs done, then you can make the metal parts to fit. Rick Schreiber ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clif Dawson" <CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: spar butt straps
Date: May 02, 2010
The image here shows a small bench model drill press being used to drill the holes for the landing gear plates. You can do the same with anything that can be jigged up on your bench. Drill press would be a real good idea, rick ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clif Dawson" <CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Metal pieces for wooden landing gear
Date: May 03, 2010
You're welcome Chris. I'm sending some pics of my new ( to me ) tailwheel. The first is with the small wheel and modified arms to hold it. The original was twice as big. The other two show it with the horns lengthened to match the rudder horn. Now it tracks the same as the rudder. Clif Thanks for the inspiration. It worked great. Chris Sacramento, Ca Westcoastpiet.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Metal pieces for wooden landing gear
From: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
Date: May 03, 2010
Clif, I gotta say, in the 80 year history of Pietenpols, you may be the only Pietenpoler building amongst the ferns and rhododendrons! I'll bet you also have a small water feature, for further piece and tranquility... Gary Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Clif Dawson" <CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca> Date: Mon, 3 May 2010 00:30:46 Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Metal pieces for wooden landing gear This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 03, 2010
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material
I was pondering the use of a hard wood in place of the usual aluminum inser t. Since the fuselage fitting is bolted through the spruce longeron, I thou ght that maybe wood would be fine as the insert as well. My plan was to do exactly what you said Clif...at the fuselage fitting, bolt through the stee l fitting, through the aluminum strut, then through- the wood insert. Of course, above-that, just as with the-metal inserts, there would be anot her bolt to secure the wood to the strut.- Ed mentioned concerns about ma terial around the bolt hole; I can make the fittings as long as I want, thu s I can have as much material around the tops and bottoms of the bolts as n eeded. - My concerns now are with making sure the wood will not rot, mold, crack, sp lit, etc. I can varnish the wood prior to inserting it into the strut, but that would effect the fit some after cutting it.- There is no easy way to look inside the strut after it is installed to inspect either.--I now concur it would be best to go with the standard aluminum type insert. - - -- On Sun, 5/2/10, Clif Dawson wrote: From: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum cabane insert material Date: Sunday, May 2, 2010, 11:16 PM #yiv1659257443 .hmmessage P { PADDING-BOTTOM:0px;MARGIN:0px;PADDING-LEFT:0px;PADDING-RIGHT:0px;PADDING-TO P:0px;} #yiv1659257443 .hmmessage { FONT-FAMILY:Verdana;FONT-SIZE:10pt;} One question, are you going to bolt to the fuselage fittings-through the cabane itself? If so then why do you want anything in there? The only way an insert is goi ng to add strength in tension is if that insert has at least one more bolt through it and the strut an inch or so above the bottom hole. This is a good idea with aluminum. In this case it's best to use a bar of aluminum. - It's not like using wood struts. What you do there is add metal plates to t he outside with another bolt 1 1/2" above the one that bolts the strut to the fuselage . This icreases the area of the "plug" sides thus increasing the tearout resistanc e dramaticaly. - In both cases the idea is to strengthen the strut. - Clif There is only about 5/16" of material below-the bolt hole on the bottom f itting (and above on the top fitting). With the loads and shock loads appli ed-by the strut the bolt would pull out the small chunk of wood below the bolt along the grain lines.- You would be much better off with-metal i nserts.-- Ed G. - - - - - > > I believe I have my posting woes fixed, so I am trying this again. > > I am using aluminum cabanes and am curious if a hard wood, (oak/ash) woul d be suitable for the inserts. I know most use some type of steel or alumin um, but since the fittings attach to soft spruce and ply wood gussets on th e fuselage end, why not wood inside the cabanes? ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 03, 2010
Subject: Re: spar butt straps
From: Ken Chambers <ken.riffic(at)gmail.com>
Thanks everyone. Didn't realize drill presses are so cheap. Might be simpler than drilling guides. Question: What if you made the straps just like the plans and then closed up the gap in the 3-piece wing by extending the plywood stiffener into the gap? And then cut openings in the plywood for bolt access? On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 1:28 AM, Clif Dawson wrote: > The image here shows a small bench model drill press > being used to drill the holes for the landing gear plates. > You can do the same with anything that can be jigged > up on your bench. > > > Drill press would be a real good idea, > rick > > -- Ken Chambers 512-796-1798 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ed G." <flyboy_120(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Aluminum cabane insert material
Date: May 03, 2010
When I responded I wasn't thinking that you had planned to drill through th e aluminum strut=2C I was thinking you wanted to leave the wood sticking ou t like they do with lift struts and just drill through the wood. Aluminum s truts are fairly thick on the sides where the flat is on the inside and alu minum is a very good bearing material. So=2C if you made the fuselage fitti ngs slightly longer you may not need any filler block inside or If you were worried about the bolt pressure collapseing the tubing you could just put a spacer inside. Varnished or epoxy coated harwood should work for that I w ould think. Cabane loads are really not all that high and being under the w ing they shouldn't get much moisture inside. Ed G. Date: Mon=2C 3 May 2010 06:36:28 -0700 From: speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum cabane insert material I was pondering the use of a hard wood in place of the usual aluminum inser t. Since the fuselage fitting is bolted through the spruce longeron=2C I th ought that maybe wood would be fine as the insert as well. My plan was to d o exactly what you said Clif...at the fuselage fitting=2C bolt through the steel fitting=2C through the aluminum strut=2C then through the wood inser t. Of course=2C above that=2C just as with the metal inserts=2C there would be another bolt to secure the wood to the strut. Ed mentioned concerns ab out material around the bolt hole=3B I can make the fittings as long as I w ant=2C thus I can have as much material around the tops and bottoms of the bolts as needed. My concerns now are with making sure the wood will not rot=2C mold=2C crack =2C split=2C etc. I can varnish the wood prior to inserting it into the str ut=2C but that would effect the fit some after cutting it. There is no eas y way to look inside the strut after it is installed to inspect either. I now concur it would be best to go with the standard aluminum type insert. -- On Sun=2C 5/2/10=2C Clif Dawson wrote: From: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum cabane insert material Date: Sunday=2C May 2=2C 2010=2C 11:16 PM One question=2C are you going to bolt to the fuselage fittings through the cabane itself? If so then why do you want anything in there? The only way an insert is goi ng to add strength in tension is if that insert has at least one more bolt through it and the strut an inch or so above the bottom hole. This is a good idea with aluminum. In this case it's best to use a bar of aluminum. It's not like using wood struts. What you do there is add metal plates to t he outside with another bolt 1 1/2" above the one that bolts the strut to the fuselage . This icreases the area of the "plug" sides thus increasing the tearout resistanc e dramaticaly. In both cases the idea is to strengthen the strut. Clif There is only about 5/16" of material below the bolt hole on the bottom fit ting (and above on the top fitting). With the loads and shock loads applied by the strut the bolt would pull out the small chunk of wood below the bol t along the grain lines. You would be much better off with metal inserts. Ed G. > > I believe I have my posting woes fixed=2C so I am trying this again. > > I am using aluminum cabanes and am curious if a hard wood=2C (oak/ash) wo uld be suitable for the inserts. I know most use some type of steel or alum inum=2C but since the fittings attach to soft spruce and ply wood gussets o n the fuselage end=2C why not wood inside the cabanes? " rel=nofollow target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenp ol-List et=_blank>http://forums.matronics.com llow target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail has tools for the New Busy. Search=2C chat and e-mail from your inb ox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID28326::T:WLMTAGL:O N:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:042010_1 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material
From: "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Date: May 03, 2010
This topic is confusing me. First of all I don't understand why one would want to use hardwood inside an aluminum strut. Most of the logical reasons not to do this have already been mentioned. But now I'm confused by this latest posting. Ed wrote: "I was thinking you wanted to leave the wood sticking out like they do with lift struts and just drill through the wood." This statement creates two new questions in my mind: 1. Who are "they" that leave wood sticking out of aluminum lift struts? I don't think I've ever seen anything like that. anyone got a photo to illustrate what that would look like? 2. Since "they" only drill through the wood, and not the metal, does that mean that the wood is NOT mechanically fastened to the aluminum? What is it - a friction fit? or glued? I must be misunderstanding something here (I hope). Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296622#296622 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ed G." <flyboy_120(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material
Date: May 03, 2010
well the whole thing was confusing to me too...but THEY usually bolt a squa re aluminum or steel insert into an aluminum lift strut which sticks out of the strut and is drilled for a bolt. Thats what I origionally thought he wanted to do with wood instead of metal . No wonder no one else tried to answer LOL.. > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material > From: billspiet(at)sympatico.ca > Date: Mon=2C 3 May 2010 15:50:27 -0700 > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > ca> > > This topic is confusing me. > First of all I don't understand why one would want to use hardwood inside an aluminum strut. Most of the logical reasons not to do this have already been mentioned. > But now I'm confused by this latest posting. > Ed wrote: "I was thinking you wanted to leave the wood sticking out like they do with lift struts and just drill through the wood." > This statement creates two new questions in my mind: > 1. Who are "they" that leave wood sticking out of aluminum lift struts? I don't think I've ever seen anything like that. anyone got a photo to illus trate what that would look like? > 2. Since "they" only drill through the wood=2C and not the metal=2C does that mean that the wood is NOT mechanically fastened to the aluminum? What is it - a friction fit? or glued? > I must be misunderstanding something here (I hope). > > > Bill C. > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296622#296622 > > > > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > _________________________________________________________________ The New Busy is not the old busy. Search=2C chat and e-mail from your inbox . http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID28326::T:WLMTAGL:O N:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:042010_3 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 03, 2010
From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: corvair
Well guys, after 17 hrs flying time my engine started missing and loosing power. I made it to the ground ok and oil temp was climbing sky hi., and loosing oil just a little. Today, I did a compression and leak test and both failed on number 3 cylinder. Since the get go I have had a leak under that area so now I know why. I had replaced the oil pan but that did not help. I am in the process of taking the rt. side head off to check for a blown gasket or any other anamoly. I did notice that the upper head bolts had not been torqued as I could almost turn them by hand. To be continued. Gardiner Mason. PS I hope I can get this resolved so I can fly to Brodhead. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Supplementary plans and Keri-Ann Price
From: "Russ" <russell.mcgifford(at)gmail.com>
Date: May 03, 2010
Hi all, I'm a new builder starting out in Australia. I'm starting on the ribs, and am trying to get a hold of the supplementary plans that are floating around. I'm also trying to get in touch with J.K.Wills as I'd like to use the UK plans and Wills' wing design. I'm mainly after Keri-Ann Price's plans for the passenger door and her other mods, but since geocities closed last year I've got no idea how to get in touch with her. Anyone know of an updated site? Also, are there any other plans people recommend taking a look at? All I've decided firmly on is that I'm using the Riblett 612 profile, and will likely go down the corvair path. As a last aside, I know there's a Piet down here in Tasmania, but I have no idea who built it and I'm yet to try the SAAA. Anyone know some details? Ta! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296641#296641 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Supplementary plans and Keri-Ann Price
From: "echobravo4" <eab4(at)comcast.net>
Date: May 03, 2010
Hi Russ, Welcome- You can reach Keri-ann at this email: keriannprice(at)hotmail.com Her website is down put she can send you some pdf files with info Earl -------- I may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up where I intended to be. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296648#296648 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Supplementary plans and Keri-Ann Price
From: "bubbleboy" <scott.dawson(at)optusnet.com.au>
Date: May 03, 2010
Hi Russ....welcome aboard! Im in Tamworth, Australia. I have also just started and I have Jims plans and email etc here. Contact me through my website and I can give you all the goss on where to get materials etc. Scotty www.scottyspietenpol.com -------- Scotty Tamworth, Australia Building a Corvair Powered Pietenpol Air Camper www.scottyspietenpol.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296649#296649 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clif Dawson" <CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material
Date: May 04, 2010
Well, let's see. First off, yes I do have a little fountain in a little pool. Next. about those winters. It does go below freezing, occasionaly. Bill's right, no snow until AFTER the games were over. What a pain in the tu-tu that all was. No flying for two months! Lot's of sun, no wind, no fly. After the games? Rainy, cloudy and windy! Bitch, bitch, bitch...and I haven't even made the porridge yet! :-) So, I did up a little pic with the strut and insert. Really, the only reason to have such would be to add strength by having a second bolt higher up the strut. In which case the inserts job is to connect the bolts. Another thought. Since the strut is 3/4" wide and the space between the straps is at least 1 1/4" then why use a bolt? One could use a clevis pin. After all you're not pulling anything tightly together at this connection. ----- Original Message ----- From: Ed G. well the whole thing was confusing to me too...but THEY usually bolt a square aluminum or steel insert into an aluminum lift strut LOL.. > This topic is confusing me. > First of all I don't understand why one would want to use hardwood inside an aluminum strut. Most of the logical reasons not to do this have already been mentioned. > But now I'm confused by this latest posting. > 1. Who are "they" that leave wood sticking out of aluminum lift struts? > 2. Since "they" only drill through the wood, and not the metal, does that mean that the wood is NOT mechanically fastened to the aluminum? What is it - a friction fit? or glued? I must be misunderstanding something here (I hope). Bill C. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clif Dawson" <CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Metal pieces for wooden landing gear
Date: May 04, 2010
British Columbia. We're famous for the same stuff as the other Columbia, apparently. :-) Clif > Cliff, Are you Vancouver B.C. or Vancouver WA? I recognize the vegetation especially, the moss growing on the ground from growing up in the Northwest. Brian ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: corvair
From: "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson(at)erec.net>
Date: May 04, 2010
Gardiner sorry to hear of your trouble. Post what you find. Glad you and the Piet are not damaged! -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 Started building NX510JD July, 2009 Ribs and tailfeathers done using Lycoming O-235 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296686#296686 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material
The drawing that Cliff provided is what I had envisioned. I was strictly ta lking about the cabane struts in my original post, the design and function of the wing/lift struts was not asked about.- I assumed that the aluminum strut would need something inside of it for strength as well as to keep th e bolt from collapsing it. I figured since the fitting that attaches to thi s cabane strut is attached to spruce, that a hard wood would suffice for th e insert. However, it was mentioned that a simple spacer, (tube) could be u sed inside the strut to keep it from collapsing and that the strut itself i s strong enough and an insert is not required. True? - Bottom line for me is that I am using aluminum cabanes and want to know the best/lightest way to attach them to the fuselage fittings. - Thanks. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material
I used to marvel at how small the cabanes are on Bernard Pietenpol's originals. Then several years ago someone did the stress analysis and found less than 50# of lift (tension) on each of the 4 cabanes. What Clif has sketched here looks like a pretty neat solution. Sure makes my maple/mahogany laminated cabanes with carbon fiber strips (vacuum bagged) in between the laminates...a bit of overkill. Probably a LOT of overkill. I like Clif's idea. jm -----Original Message----- From: Clif Dawson Sent: May 4, 2010 2:36 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material Well, let's see. First off, yes I do have a little fountain in a little pool. Next. about those winters. It does go below freezing, occasionaly. Bill's right, no snow until AFTER the games were over. What a pain in the tu-tu that all was. No flying for two months! Lot's of sun, no wind, no fly. After the games? Rainy, cloudy and windy! Bitch, bitch, bitch...and I haven't even made the porridge yet! :-) So, I did up a little pic with the strut and insert. Really, the only reason to have such would be to add strength by having a second bolt higher up the strut. In which case the inserts job is to connect the bolts. Another thought. Since the strut is 3/4" wide and the space between the straps is at least 1 1/4" then why use a bolt? One could use a clevis pin. After all you're not pulling anything tightly together at this connection. ----- Original Message ----- From: Ed G. well the whole thing was confusing to me too...but THEY usually bolt a square aluminum or steel insert into an aluminum lift strut LOL.. > This topic is confusing me. > First of all I don't understand why one would want to use hardwood inside an aluminum strut. Most of the logical reasons not to do this have already been mentioned. > But now I'm confused by this latest posting. > 1. Who are "they" that leave wood sticking out of aluminum lift struts? > 2. Since "they" only drill through the wood, and not the metal, does that mean that the wood is NOT mechanically fastened to the aluminum? What is it - a friction fit? or glued? I must be misunderstanding something here (I hope). Bill C. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
Date: May 04, 2010
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
Well boys, after many weeks, I have now completed the final painting of NX 929DH. This has been the least enjoyable part of the whole build for me. I guess because at this stage I am impatient, and painting is 99% tedious preparation and 1% spraying. I am happy with my results (Stewart System), not as good as it could have been, but there is a learning curve to spray painting with only one chance at it, especially when you are spending so much money per gallon (no opportunity for practice). Now I am on to reassembly....what a joy it is!!!..... Finally!!! ......all the misc. parts I have been saving in the cardboard box under my workbenc h for up to 10 years. Last night made an inspection plate for the undersid e of fuse, because I was one short. Pretty easy to make and it took only two tries. Still hope to make Brodhead. Advantage for me is Brodhead is so close I ca n include it in my fly-off area....takes a little more pressure off for th e deadline. Really need to put some more run time on my Model A since I ha ve only run it for about an hour. Lesson learned from Douwe is that I will wait for a windless, sunny, high- pressure morning for the first flight, and resist the temptation to fly in anything but a perfect situation. The grass runway here is very wide and plenty long so plenty of opportunity to abort if I have to. So keep working boys,...... little-by-little it all adds up. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
Copy that Dan, well done! I am glad to hear you have seen the project throu gh...soon you'll get to fly your creation...how cool is that!? --- On Tue, 5/4/10, helspersew(at)aol.com wrote: From: helspersew(at)aol.com <helspersew(at)aol.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Milestone- Spray painting complete! Date: Tuesday, May 4, 2010, 8:52 AM Well boys, after many weeks, I have-now completed the final painting of N X929DH. This has been the least enjoyable part of the whole build for me. I guess because at this stage I am impatient, and painting is 99% tedious pr eparation and 1% spraying. I am happy with my results (Stewart System), not as good as it could have been, but there is a learning curve to spray pain ting with only one chance at it, especially when you are spending so much m oney per gallon (no opportunity for practice). - Now I am on to reassembly....what a joy it is!!!..... Finally!!!-......al l the misc. parts I have been saving in the cardboard box under my workbenc h for up to 10 years. Last night made an inspection plate for the underside of fuse, because I was one short. Pretty easy to make and it took only two tries. - Still hope to make Brodhead. Advantage for me is Brodhead is so close I can include it in my fly-off area....takes a little more pressure off for the deadline. Really need to put some more run time on my Model A since I have only run it for about an hour. - Lesson learned from Douwe is that I will wait for a windless, sunny, high-p ressure morning for the first flight, and resist the temptation to fly in a nything but a perfect situation. The grass runway here is very wide and ple nty long so plenty of opportunity to abort if I have to. - So keep working boys,...... little-by-little it all adds up. - Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: May 04, 2010
Sounds good Dan... can't wait to see it! -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296704#296704 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material
For those interested, attached is the exact dimensions of my struts. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: "TOM STINEMETZE" <TOMS(at)mcpcity.com>
Subject: Re: corvair
One of our EAA chapter members had almost the same thing happen to him with his Corvair / Sonex system. He was at about hour 20 and 15 miles from the airport when the engine started losing power and the oil temp started rising. He made it safely back to the airport but it was a near thing. Anyway, he discovered a blown lower cylinder gasket (between the jug and the case.) Not a particularly hard fix but one that should not have been required. According to WW the most likely culprit was improper torqueing of the head during assembly. He had not noticed any oil leakage prior to the incident. Stinemetze McPherson, KS. >>> airlion 5/3/2010 7:56 PM >>> Well guys, after 17 hrs flying time my engine started missing and loosing power. I made it to the ground ok and oil temp was climbing sky hi., and loosing oil just a little. Today, I did a compression and leak test and both failed on number 3 cylinder. Since the get go I have had a leak under that area so now I know why. I had replaced the oil pan but that did not help. I am in the process of taking the rt. side head off to check for a blown gasket or any other anamoly. I did notice that the upper head bolts had not been torqued as I could almost turn them by hand. To be continued. Gardiner Mason. PS I hope I can get this resolved so I can fly to Brodhead. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: Tim Willis <timothywillis(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material
So, Michael, since your entire cabane fits within the steel fingers of the attachment fittings-- those off the wing and those off the longerons, you can nestle the cabane down within those fingers and may not need any bar at all. However, since Al. is not as hard as steel, I would stick an aluminum bar in there, and make it long enough to run two bolts through it-- one above the other. This will keep the Al. bar from "working" on the Al. inside the tube over a long time, with vibration and various loads. I have done something like that in my Al. cabanes, but have extended the bar out, for my cabane streamline tubes are the next size larger, so that a 1" X 1" Al bar is a snug fit inside. Tim in central TX -----Original Message----- From: Michael Perez Sent: May 4, 2010 8:28 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material For those interested, attached is the exact dimensions of my struts. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
From: "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Date: May 04, 2010
Soon will come the day that we will all finally get to know Dan's secret color scheme that has piqued many curiosities. What other color(s) go with that mauve tailgear? Enquiring minds want to know. Way to go, Dan. Must be exciting. Excellent plan regarding that first flight. Clear and calm, all the way. Bill C Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296722#296722 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: Jim Ash <ashcan(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: corvair
The Corvair engine is sensitive to head torquing sequence. Use the one in 'How to Keep Your Corvair Alive'. I start with finger tight, then run through the whole thing in 5 ft-pound increments until they're fully tight. I'm guessing this is standard shtick if you're one of those following William Wynne's lead. There are no new Corvair engines and the probability of finding one that hasn't already been messed with is low. About the best you can hope for is one that was rebuilt by somebody who knew what they were doing (none of this should be new to the Corvair Pieters). The reason I mention all this is because I did a head job on a '66 coupe back in the mid 90's. While on the last pass of my torquing sequence, one of the studs let go. Some previous knumbnuts had stripped one out of the block and used a helicoil insert to fix it, which I didn't know about until then. Unfortunately, they only used one insert instead of stacking two, so the stud only had half the thread bite it should have. I don't know how they got it torqued down the first time (I suspect they didn't take it all the way, and I've never checked torques on disassembly). Your oil temp thing concerns me. I'm not picturing how this relates to your cylinder problem and I suspect you may have two different problems. I suppose it's possible a busted ring is allowing blow-by, but that's a lot of heat when you've got no compression in that jug. The basic in-out rules of heat flow come to mind; either you're heating it up faster than you should, or not removing it as fast as you should. Verify somehow you've got flow through your oil cooler, both oil and air. On the shroud system used in the cars, it was common for leaves and mice nests to pile up on top of the cooler and restrict air flow. It was also common for backyard mechanics to seal up leaky oil cooler seals with blue goo, which seals 'em up real nice, but the good also oozes into the inside of the seal and restricts the oil flow. Jim Ash, ~(CS)^2 -----Original Message----- >From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> >Sent: May 3, 2010 8:56 PM >To: pietenpol >Subject: Pietenpol-List: corvair > > >Well guys, after 17 hrs flying time my engine started missing and loosing power. I made it to the ground ok and oil temp was climbing sky hi., and loosing oil just a little. Today, I did a compression and leak test and both failed on number 3 cylinder. Since the get go I have had a leak under that area so now I know why. I had replaced the oil pan but that did not help. I am in the process of taking the rt. side head off to check for a blown gasket or any other anamoly. I did notice that the upper head bolts had not been torqued as I could almost turn them by hand. To be continued. Gardiner Mason. PS I hope I can get this resolved so I can fly to Brodhead. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material
Thanks Tim for your thought out-reply.-What you mention is what my orig inal idea was as well. I guess I'll use an aluminum insert and two bolts. I believe this is still a nice light package and strong. - - --- On Tue, 5/4/10, Tim Willis wrote: From: Tim Willis <timothywillis(at)earthlink.net> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material Date: Tuesday, May 4, 2010, 10:43 AM et> - - So, Michael, since your entire cabane fits within the steel fingers of the attachment fittings-- those off the wing and those off the longeron s, you can nestle the cabane down within those fingers and may not need any bar at all.- However, since Al. is not as hard as steel, I would stick a n aluminum bar in there, and make it long enough to run two bolts through i t-- one above the other.- This will keep the Al. bar from "working" on th e Al. inside the tube over a long time, with vibration and various loads. - - I have done something like that in my Al. cabanes, but have extende d the bar out, for my cabane streamline tubes are the next size larger, so that a 1" X 1" Al bar is a snug fit inside.- Tim in central TX -----Original Message----- From: Michael Perez Sent: May 4, 2010 8:28 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material For those interested, attached is the exact dimensions of my struts. le, List Admin. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Another straight axle gear question
From: "chase143(at)aol.com" <chase143(at)aol.com>
Date: May 04, 2010
Starting on my gear. I previously read in the archives (I can't find it now), something to the effect: "...with the plane on the ground, the straight axle ash block is parallel to the ground..." Q- Shouldn't the block be parallel to the deck angle (using the top longerons)? Or am I miss interpreting this? Also, I know the block angles should converge on the tailwheel/skid. Q- Is this angle intersection precise, and if so what is the recommended location? Middle of the tail wheel, forward edge of the tail wheel, center point of the back of the fuselage? Thanks. Steve -------- Steve www.mypiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296730#296730 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
Date: May 04, 2010
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
Hi Bill, I abandon that color scheme about 6 months ago. Decided I could not live with it forever, and went with a more period scheme. Only Gene Rambo know s, and if he is inclined to reveal it, I'll have to stop him, with deadly force if necessary. I know he is sore about it, because he thinks I stole it from him, but I really came up with it first. :o) Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: Bill Church <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 9:56 am Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete! a> Soon will come the day that we will all finally get to know Dan's secret color cheme that has piqued many curiosities. What other color(s) go with that mauve ailgear? Enquiring minds want to know. Way to go, Dan. Must be exciting. Excellent plan regarding that first flight. Clear and calm, all the way. Bill C ead this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296722#296722 ======================== =========== -= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum - -= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse -= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription, -= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, -= Photoshare, and much much more: - -= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - -= Same great content also available via the Web Forums! - -= --> http://forums.matronics.com - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - List Contribution Web Site - -= Thank you for your generous support! -= -Matt Dralle, List Admin. -= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution -======================== ======================== =========== ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: corvair
Thanks tom, Ijust took the head off on the right side and there was lot of blow by. The cy head gskets appear to be ok. Also all the bolts and nuts on the rt side had not been torqued as I could turn no 3 by hand and the others with just a little pressure with a wrench ________________________________ From: TOM STINEMETZE <TOMS(at)mcpcity.com> Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 9:29:56 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair One of our EAA chapter members had almost the same thing happen to him with his Corvair / Sonex system. He was at about hour 20 and 15 miles from the airport when the engine started losing power and the oil temp started rising. He made it safely back to the airport but it was a near thing. Anyway, he discovered a blown lower cylinder gasket (between the jug and the case.) Not a particularly hard fix but one that should not have been required. According to WW the most likely culprit was improper torqueing of the head during assembly. He had not noticed any oil leakage prior to the incident. Stinemetze McPherson, KS. >>> airlion 5/3/2010 7:56 PM >>> Well guys, after 17 hrs flying time my engine started missing and loosing power. I made it to the ground ok and oil temp was climbing sky hi., and loosing oil just a little. Today, I did a compression and leak test and both failed on number 3 cylinder. Since the get go I have had a leak under that area so now I know why. I had replaced the oil pan but that did not help. I am in the process of taking the rt. side head off to check for a blown gasket or any other anamoly. I did notice that the upper head bolts had not been torqued as I could almost turn them by hand. To be continued. Gardiner Mason. PS I hope I can get this resolved so I can fly to Brodhead. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: corvair
Thanks Jim, I am looking into it,. Prior to this, the oil temps appeared to be normal but I did have an oil leak. I did replace the pan gasket but that is not the problem. Gardiner Mason ----- Original Message ---- From: Jim Ash <ashcan(at)earthlink.net> Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 9:13:29 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair The Corvair engine is sensitive to head torquing sequence. Use the one in 'How to Keep Your Corvair Alive'. I start with finger tight, then run through the whole thing in 5 ft-pound increments until they're fully tight. I'm guessing this is standard shtick if you're one of those following William Wynne's lead. There are no new Corvair engines and the probability of finding one that hasn't already been messed with is low. About the best you can hope for is one that was rebuilt by somebody who knew what they were doing (none of this should be new to the Corvair Pieters). The reason I mention all this is because I did a head job on a '66 coupe back in the mid 90's. While on the last pass of my torquing sequence, one of the studs let go. Some previous knumbnuts had stripped one out of the block and used a helicoil insert to fix it, which I didn't know about until then. Unfortunately, they only used one insert instead of stacking two, so the stud only had half the thread bite it should have. I don't know how they got it torqued down the first time (I suspect they didn't take it all the way, and I've never checked torques on disassembly). Your oil temp thing concerns me. I'm not picturing how this relates to your cylinder problem and I suspect you may have two different problems. I suppose it's possible a busted ring is allowing blow-by, but that's a lot of heat when you've got no compression in that jug. The basic in-out rules of heat flow come to mind; either you're heating it up faster than you should, or not removing it as fast as you should. Verify somehow you've got flow through your oil cooler, both oil and air. On the shroud system used in the cars, it was common for leaves and mice nests to pile up on top of the cooler and restrict air flow. It was also common for backyard mechanics to seal up leaky oil cooler seals with blue goo, which seals 'em up real nice, but the good also oozes into the inside of the seal and restricts the oil flow. Jim Ash, ~(CS)^2 -----Original Message----- >From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> >Sent: May 3, 2010 8:56 PM >To: pietenpol >Subject: Pietenpol-List: corvair > > >Well guys, after 17 hrs flying time my engine started missing and loosing power. I made it to the ground ok and oil temp was climbing sky hi., and loosing oil just a little. Today, I did a compression and leak test and both failed on number 3 cylinder. Since the get go I have had a leak under that area so now I know why. I had replaced the oil pan but that did not help. I am in the process of taking the rt. side head off to check for a blown gasket or any other anamoly. I did notice that the upper head bolts had not been torqued as I could almost turn them by hand. To be continued. Gardiner Mason. PS I hope I can get this resolved so I can fly to Brodhead. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
From: "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Date: May 04, 2010
So, if you've abandoned the old color scheme, Dan, I guess you could share it with us now. I've got five bucks says the other color was going to be hot pink. BC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296744#296744 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
From: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
Date: May 04, 2010
aG1tbW1tLi4uLndvbmRlciB3aGF0IEdlbmUncyBwcmljZSBpcz8NCg0KR2FyeSBCb290aGUNClNl bnQgZnJvbSBteSBWZXJpem9uIFdpcmVsZXNzIEJsYWNrQmVycnkNCg0KLS0tLS1PcmlnaW5hbCBN ZXNzYWdlLS0tLS0NCkZyb206IGhlbHNwZXJzZXdAYW9sLmNvbQ0KRGF0ZTogVHVlLCAwNCBNYXkg MjAxMCAxMjo0MjoyNSANClRvOiA8cGlldGVucG9sLWxpc3RAbWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbT4NClN1Ympl Y3Q6IFJlOiBQaWV0ZW5wb2wtTGlzdDogUmU6IE1pbGVzdG9uZS0gU3ByYXkgcGFpbnRpbmcgY29t cGxldGUhDQoNCg0KSGkgQmlsbCwNCg0KSSBhYmFuZG9uIHRoYXQgY29sb3Igc2NoZW1lIGFib3V0 IDYgbW9udGhzIGFnby4gRGVjaWRlZCBJIGNvdWxkIG5vdCBsaXZlIHdpdGggaXQgZm9yZXZlciwg YW5kIHdlbnQgd2l0aCBhIG1vcmUgcGVyaW9kIHNjaGVtZS4gT25seSBHZW5lIFJhbWJvIGtub3dz LCBhbmQgaWYgaGUgaXMgaW5jbGluZWQgdG8gcmV2ZWFsIGl0LCBJJ2xsIGhhdmUgdG8gc3RvcCBo aW0sIHdpdGggZGVhZGx5IGZvcmNlIGlmIG5lY2Vzc2FyeS4gSSBrbm93IGhlIGlzIHNvcmUgYWJv dXQgaXQsIGJlY2F1c2UgaGUgdGhpbmtzIEkgc3RvbGUgaXQgZnJvbSBoaW0sIGJ1dCBJIHJlYWxs eSBjYW1lIHVwIHdpdGggaXQgZmlyc3QuIDpvKQ0KDQpEYW4gSGVsc3Blcg0KUG9wbGFyIEdyb3Zl LCBJTC4NCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCi0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2FnZS0tLS0tDQpGcm9tOiBCaWxs IENodXJjaCA8YmlsbHNwaWV0QHN5bXBhdGljby5jYT4NClRvOiBwaWV0ZW5wb2wtbGlzdEBtYXRy b25pY3MuY29tDQpTZW50OiBUdWUsIE1heSA0LCAyMDEwIDk6NTYgYW0NClN1YmplY3Q6IFBpZXRl bnBvbC1MaXN0OiBSZTogTWlsZXN0b25lLSBTcHJheSBwYWludGluZyBjb21wbGV0ZSENCg0KDQot LT4gUGlldGVucG9sLUxpc3QgbWVzc2FnZSBwb3N0ZWQgYnk6ICJCaWxsIENodXJjaCIgPGJpbGxz cGlldEBzeW1wYXRpY28uY2E+DQpTb29uIHdpbGwgY29tZSB0aGUgZGF5IHRoYXQgd2Ugd2lsbCBh bGwgZmluYWxseSBnZXQgdG8ga25vdyBEYW4ncyBzZWNyZXQgY29sb3IgDQpjaGVtZSB0aGF0IGhh cyBwaXF1ZWQgbWFueSBjdXJpb3NpdGllcy4gV2hhdCBvdGhlciBjb2xvcihzKSBnbyB3aXRoIHRo YXQgbWF1dmUgDQphaWxnZWFyPyBFbnF1aXJpbmcgbWluZHMgd2FudCB0byBrbm93Lg0KV2F5IHRv IGdvLCBEYW4uIE11c3QgYmUgZXhjaXRpbmcuDQpFeGNlbGxlbnQgcGxhbiByZWdhcmRpbmcgdGhh dCBmaXJzdCBmbGlnaHQuIENsZWFyIGFuZCBjYWxtLCBhbGwgdGhlIHdheS4NCkJpbGwgQw0KDQoN CmVhZCB0aGlzIHRvcGljIG9ubGluZSBoZXJlOg0KaHR0cDovL2ZvcnVtcy5tYXRyb25pY3MuY29t L3ZpZXd0b3BpYy5waHA/cD0yOTY3MjIjMjk2NzIyDQoNCg0KDQo9PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT0NCi09ICAgICAgICAgIC0gVGhlIFBpZXRlbnBvbC1MaXN0IEVtYWls IEZvcnVtIC0NCi09IFVzZSB0aGUgTWF0cm9uaWNzIExpc3QgRmVhdHVyZXMgTmF2aWdhdG9yIHRv IGJyb3dzZQ0KLT0gdGhlIG1hbnkgTGlzdCB1dGlsaXRpZXMgc3VjaCBhcyBMaXN0IFVuL1N1YnNj cmlwdGlvbiwNCi09IEFyY2hpdmUgU2VhcmNoICYgRG93bmxvYWQsIDctRGF5IEJyb3dzZSwgQ2hh dCwgRkFRLA0KLT0gUGhvdG9zaGFyZSwgYW5kIG11Y2ggbXVjaCBtb3JlOg0KLT0NCi09ICAgLS0+ IGh0dHA6Ly93d3cubWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbS9OYXZpZ2F0b3I/UGlldGVucG9sLUxpc3QNCi09DQot PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09DQotPSAgICAgICAgICAgICAgIC0gTUFUUk9OSUNTIFdFQiBGT1JVTVMgLQ0KLT0gU2FtZSBn cmVhdCBjb250ZW50IGFsc28gYXZhaWxhYmxlIHZpYSB0aGUgV2ViIEZvcnVtcyENCi09DQotPSAg IC0tPiBodHRwOi8vZm9ydW1zLm1hdHJvbmljcy5jb20NCi09DQotPT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09DQotPSAgICAgICAgICAg ICAtIExpc3QgQ29udHJpYnV0aW9uIFdlYiBTaXRlIC0NCi09ICBUaGFuayB5b3UgZm9yIHlvdXIg Z2VuZXJvdXMgc3VwcG9ydCENCi09ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgLU1hdHQg RHJhbGxlLCBMaXN0IEFkbWluLg0KLT0gICAtLT4gaHR0cDovL3d3dy5tYXRyb25pY3MuY29tL2Nv bnRyaWJ1dGlvbg0KLT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PQ0KDQoNCg0K ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
Subject: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
Great news Dan, I am covering the fuselage now (using Stewart EcoBond) and will also be painting soon. rick On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 6:52 AM, wrote: > > Well boys, after many weeks, I have now completed the final painting of > NX929DH. This has been the least enjoyable part of the whole build for me. I > guess because at this stage I am impatient, and painting is 99% tedious > preparation and 1% spraying. I am happy with my results (Stewart System), > not as good as it could have been, but there is a learning curve to spray > painting with only one chance at it, especially when you are spending so > much money per gallon (no opportunity for practice). > > Now I am on to reassembly....what a joy it is!!!..... Finally!!! ......all > the misc. parts I have been saving in the cardboard box under my workbench > for up to 10 years. Last night made an inspection plate for the underside of > fuse, because I was one short. Pretty easy to make and it took only two > tries. > > Still hope to make Brodhead. Advantage for me is Brodhead is so close I can > include it in my fly-off area....takes a little more pressure off for the > deadline. Really need to put some more run time on my Model A since I have > only run it for about an hour. > > Lesson learned from Douwe is that I will wait for a windless, sunny, > high-pressure morning for the first flight, and resist the temptation to fly > in anything but a perfect situation. The grass runway here is *very *wide > and plenty long so plenty of opportunity to abort if I have to. > > So keep working boys,...... little-by-little it all adds up. > > Dan Helsper > Poplar Grove, IL. > > * > > * > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
Subject: Re: corvair
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
Strange Gardiner, I could understand maybe one stud pulling loose from the block resulting in a loose head nut but several is hard to believe. If you are lucky maybe you can just re-torque both heads and verify no studs are pulling out of the block. rick On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 11:29 AM, airlion wrote: > Thanks tom, Ijust took the head off on the right side and there was lot of > blow by. The cy head gskets appear to be ok. Also all the bolts and nuts on > the rt side had not been torqued as I could turn no 3 by hand and the others > with just a little pressure with a wrench > > ------------------------------ > *From:* TOM STINEMETZE > *To:* pietenpol > *Sent:* Tue, May 4, 2010 9:29:56 AM > *Subject:* Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair > > *One of our EAA chapter members had almost the same thing happen to him > with his Corvair / Sonex system. He was at about hour 20 and 15 miles from > the airport when the engine started losing power and the oil temp started > rising. He made it safely back to the airport but it was a near thing. > Anyway, he discovered a blown lower cylinder gasket (between the jug and the > case.) Not a particularly hard fix but one that should not have been > required. According to WW the most likely culprit was improper torqueing of > the head during assembly. He had not noticed any oil leakage prior to the > incident.* > ** > *Stinemetze* > *McPherson, KS.* > > > >>> airlion 5/3/2010 7:56 PM >>> > > Well guys, after 17 hrs flying time my engine started missing and loosing > power. I made it to the ground ok and oil temp was climbing sky hi., and > loosing oil just a little. Today, I did a compression and leak test and > both failed on number 3 cylinder. Since the get go I have had a leak under > that area so now I know why. I had replaced the oil pan but that did not > help. I am in the process of taking the rt. side head off to check for a > blown gasket or any other anamoly. I did notice that the upper head bolts > had not been torqued as I could almost turn them by hand. To be continued. > Gardiner Mason. PS I hope I can get this resolved so I can fly to Brodhead. > > * > > * > > * > > * > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Aluminum cabane insert material
Will do Tim, as soon as I redesign the thing, modify it, make it light, and ... - ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov>
Date: May 04, 2010
Subject: I found a secret photo of Dan's completed paint scheme
!!!!! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gene Rambo" <generambo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
Date: May 04, 2010
Hey, Hey!! What did I do to get to be the target of this??? I don't think you stole it, I think great minds think alike. I am still going with it because I already have all of the dope. Sorry ;( Gene ----- Original Message ----- From: helspersew(at)aol.com<mailto:helspersew(at)aol.com> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2010 12:42 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete! Hi Bill, I abandon that color scheme about 6 months ago. Decided I could not live with it forever, and went with a more period scheme. Only Gene Rambo knows, and if he is inclined to reveal it, I'll have to stop him, with deadly force if necessary. I know he is sore about it, because he thinks I stole it from him, but I really came up with it first. :o) Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: Bill Church <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 9:56 am Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete! > Soon will come the day that we will all finally get to know Dan's secret color scheme that has piqued many curiosities. What other color(s) go with that mauve tailgear? Enquiring minds want to know. Way to go, Dan. Must be exciting. Excellent plan regarding that first flight. Clear and calm, all the way. Bill C Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296722#296722 .matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296722#296722> t" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List m/Navigator?Pietenpol-List> http://www.matronics.com/contribution on> ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
I've asked that same question more than once....John Recine probably had SOMETHING to do with it.... :-) Hey, Hey!! What did I do to get to be the target of this??? I don't think you stole it, I think great minds think alike. I am still going with it because I already have all of the dope. Sorry ;( Gene ----- Original Message ----- From: helspersew(at)aol.com To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2010 12:42 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete! Hi Bill, I abandon that color scheme about 6 months ago. Decided I could not live with it forever, and went with a more period scheme. Only Gene Rambo knows, and if he is inclined to reveal it, I'll have to stop him, with deadly force if necessary. I know he is sore about it, because he thinks I stole it from him, but I really came up with it first. :o) Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: Bill Church <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 9:56 am Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete! Soon will come the day that we will all finally get to know Dan's secret color scheme that has piqued many curiosities. What other color(s) go with that mauve tailgear? Enquiring minds want to know. Way to go, Dan. Must be exciting. Excellent plan regarding that first flight. Clear and calm, all the way. Bill C Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296722#296722 t" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution title=http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
Date: May 04, 2010
Rick, My memory often fails me. I thought you were going to paint with house paint? Are you not the one who did the sample piece a couple years ago for weather testing? Gary Boothe Cool, CA Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, Fuselage on gear 18 ribs done From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Holland Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2010 10:48 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Milestone- Spray painting complete! Great news Dan, I am covering the fuselage now (using Stewart EcoBond) and will also be painting soon. rick On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 6:52 AM, wrote: Well boys, after many weeks, I have now completed the final painting of NX929DH. This has been the least enjoyable part of the whole build for me. I guess because at this stage I am impatient, and painting is 99% tedious preparation and 1% spraying. I am happy with my results (Stewart System), not as good as it could have been, but there is a learning curve to spray painting with only one chance at it, especially when you are spending so much money per gallon (no opportunity for practice). Now I am on to reassembly....what a joy it is!!!..... Finally!!! ......all the misc. parts I have been saving in the cardboard box under my workbench for up to 10 years. Last night made an inspection plate for the underside of fuse, because I was one short. Pretty easy to make and it took only two tries. Still hope to make Brodhead. Advantage for me is Brodhead is so close I can include it in my fly-off area....takes a little more pressure off for the deadline. Really need to put some more run time on my Model A since I have only run it for about an hour. Lesson learned from Douwe is that I will wait for a windless, sunny, high-pressure morning for the first flight, and resist the temptation to fly in anything but a perfect situation. The grass runway here is very wide and plenty long so plenty of opportunity to abort if I have to. So keep working boys,...... little-by-little it all adds up. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: corvair
Rick, since I don't trust this engine right now , I am going to take it down to Bill Clap in Valdosts Ga. The whole right side of the engine had not been torqued. Thanks for the reply, Gardiner ________________________________ From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com> Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 2:15:57 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair Strange Gardiner, I could understand maybe one stud pulling loose from the block resulting in a loose head nut but several is hard to believe. If you are lucky maybe you can just re-torque both heads and verify no studs are pulling out of the block. rick On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 11:29 AM, airlion wrote: Thanks tom, Ijust took the head off on the right side and there was lot of blow by. The cy head gskets appear to be ok. Also all the bolts and nuts on the rt side had not been torqued as I could turn no 3 by hand and the others with just a little pressure with a wrench > > ________________________________ From: TOM STINEMETZE <TOMS(at)mcpcity.com> >To: pietenpol >Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 9:29:56 AM >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair > > >One of our EAA chapter members had almost the same thing happen to him with his Corvair / Sonex system. He was at about hour 20 and 15 miles from the airport when the engine started losing power and the oil temp started rising. He made it safely back to the airport but it was a near thing. Anyway, he discovered a blown lower cylinder gasket (between the jug and the case.) Not a particularly hard fix but one that should not have been required. According to WW the most likely culprit was improper torqueing of the head during assembly. He had not noticed any oil leakage prior to the incident. > >Stinemetze >McPherson, KS. > > >>>> airlion 5/3/2010 7:56 PM >>> > >Well guys, after 17 hrs flying time my engine started missing and loosing power. I made it to the ground ok and oil temp was climbing sky hi., and loosing oil just a little. Today, I did a compression and leak test and both failed on number 3 cylinder. Since the get go I have had a leak under that area so now I know why. I had replaced the oil pan but that did not help. I am in the process of taking the rt. side head off to check for a blown gasket or any other anamoly. I did notice that the upper head bolts had not been torqued as I could almost turn them by hand. To be continued. Gardiner Mason. PS I hope I can get this resolved so I can fly to Brodhead. > > > > >" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >tp://forums.matronics.com >_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Mahogeny or Birch
From: "bcolleran" <bcolleran(at)comcast.net>
Date: May 04, 2010
Mahogeny or birch for gussets and the plywood used on the plane? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296795#296795 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: corvair
Date: May 04, 2010
Gardiner, You had your engine completely assembled by WW? Since William built the engine, have you called him about it? He has a reputation of providing pretty good support for stuff that he builds. On the other hand, I'm sure Bill Clapp would salivate over the opportunity to steal away a WW customer. Good luck either way. Sorry to hear about your woes. Ryan On May 4, 2010, at 7:35 PM, airlion wrote: > Rick, since I don't trust this engine right now , I am going to take it down to Bill Clap in Valdosts Ga. The whole right side of the engine had not been torqued. Thanks for the reply, Gardiner > > From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com> > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 2:15:57 PM > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair > > Strange Gardiner, I could understand maybe one stud pulling loose from the block resulting in a loose head nut but several is hard to believe. If you are lucky maybe you can just re-torque both heads and verify no studs are pulling out of the block. > > rick > > On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 11:29 AM, airlion wrote: > Thanks tom, Ijust took the head off on the right side and there was lot of blow by. The cy head gskets appear to be ok. Also all the bolts and nuts on the rt side had not been torqued as I could turn no 3 by hand and the others with just a little pressure with a wrench > > From: TOM STINEMETZE <TOMS(at)mcpcity.com> > To: pietenpol > Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 9:29:56 AM > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair > > One of our EAA chapter members had almost the same thing happen to him with his Corvair / Sonex system. He was at about hour 20 and 15 miles from the airport when the engine started losing power and the oil temp started rising. He made it safely back to the airport but it was a near thing. Anyway, he discovered a blown lower cylinder gasket (between the jug and the case.) Not a particularly hard fix but one that should not have been required. According to WW the most likely culprit was improper torqueing of the head during assembly. He had not noticed any oil leakage prior to the incident. > > Stinemetze > McPherson, KS. > > > >>> airlion 5/3/2010 7:56 PM >>> > > Well guys, after 17 hrs flying time my engine started missing and loosing power. I made it to the ground ok and oil temp was climbing sky hi., and loosing oil just a little. Today, I did a compression and leak test and both failed on number 3 cylinder. Since the get go I have had a leak under that area so now I know why. I had replaced the oil pan but that did not help. I am in the process of taking the rt. side head off to check for a blown gasket or any other anamoly. I did notice that the upper head bolts had not been torqued as I could almost turn them by hand. To be continued. Gardiner Mason. PS I hope I can get this resolved so I can fly to Brodhead. > > > > > > " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > tp://forums.matronics.com > _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > > > -- > Rick Holland > Castle Rock, Colorado > > "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 04, 2010
Subject: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
Correct, EcoBond is the sticky stuff to attach the fabric. Am using the Stewart stuff to paint my aluminum parts and latex on the fabric (using the proven Bell method). And concerning the test panel, it is still in great shape, will have been out on that post at 6700 ft. facing true South for five years this August. rick On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 5:41 PM, Gary Boothe wrote: > Rick, > > > My memory often fails me. I thought you were going to paint with house > paint? Are you not the one who did the sample piece a couple years ago for > weather testing? > > > Gary Boothe > > Cool, CA > > Pietenpol > > WW Corvair Conversion > > Tail done, Fuselage on gear > > 18 ribs done > > > *From:* owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto: > owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Rick Holland > *Sent:* Tuesday, May 04, 2010 10:48 AM > > *To:* pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > *Subject:* Re: Pietenpol-List: Milestone- Spray painting complete! > > > Great news Dan, I am covering the fuselage now (using Stewart EcoBond) and > will also be painting soon. > > rick > > On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 6:52 AM, wrote: > > > Well boys, after many weeks, I have now completed the final painting of > NX929DH. This has been the least enjoyable part of the whole build for me. I > guess because at this stage I am impatient, and painting is 99% tedious > preparation and 1% spraying. I am happy with my results (Stewart System), > not as good as it could have been, but there is a learning curve to spray > painting with only one chance at it, especially when you are spending so > much money per gallon (no opportunity for practice). > > > Now I am on to reassembly....what a joy it is!!!..... Finally!!! ......all > the misc. parts I have been saving in the cardboard box under my workbench > for up to 10 years. Last night made an inspection plate for the underside of > fuse, because I was one short. Pretty easy to make and it took only two > tries. > > > Still hope to make Brodhead. Advantage for me is Brodhead is so close I can > include it in my fly-off area....takes a little more pressure off for the > deadline. Really need to put some more run time on my Model A since I have > only run it for about an hour. > > > Lesson learned from Douwe is that I will wait for a windless, sunny, > high-pressure morning for the first flight, and resist the temptation to fly > in anything but a perfect situation. The grass runway here is *very *wide > and plenty long so plenty of opportunity to abort if I have to. > > > So keep working boys,...... little-by-little it all adds up. > > > Dan Helsper > > Poplar Grove, IL. > > * * > > * * > > *" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List* > > *tp://forums.matronics.com* > > *_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > > * * > > > -- > Rick Holland > Castle Rock, Colorado > > "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" > > * * > > * * > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List* > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://forums.matronics.com* > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > > ** > > * * > > * > > * > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gcardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Mahogeny or Birch
Date: May 04, 2010
Builder's choice. They are both acceptable. Greg C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "bcolleran" <bcolleran(at)comcast.net> Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2010 9:26 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Mahogeny or Birch > > Mahogeny or birch for gussets and the plywood used on the plane? > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296795#296795 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 05, 2010
From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: corvair
Ryan , I have been trying to contact William for a week now by phone and email with no luck. Thanks for the reply, Gardiner ________________________________ From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com> Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 10:50:37 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair Gardiner, You had your engine completely assembled by WW? Since William built the engine, have you called him about it? He has a reputation of providing pretty good support for stuff that he builds. On the other hand, I'm sure Bill Clapp would salivate over the opportunity to steal away a WW customer. Good luck either way. Sorry to hear about your woes. Ryan On May 4, 2010, at 7:35 PM, airlion wrote: Rick, since I don't trust this engine right now , I am going to take it down to Bill Clap in Valdosts Ga. The whole right side of the engine had not been torqued. Thanks for the reply, Gardiner > > ________________________________ From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com> >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com >Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 2:15:57 PM >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair > >>Strange Gardiner, I could understand maybe one stud pulling loose from the block resulting in a loose head nut but several is hard to believe. If you are lucky maybe you can just re-torque both heads and verify no studs are pulling out of the block. > >rick > > >On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 11:29 AM, airlion wrote: > >Thanks tom, Ijust took the head off on the right side and there was lot of blow by. The cy head gskets appear to be ok. Also all the bolts and nuts on the rt side had not been torqued as I could turn no 3 by hand and the others with just a little pressure with a wrench >> >> >> >> ________________________________ From: TOM STINEMETZE <TOMS(at)mcpcity.com> >>To: pietenpol >>Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 9:29:56 AM >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair >> >> >>One of our EAA chapter members had almost the same thing happen to him with his Corvair / Sonex system. He was at about hour 20 and 15 miles from the airport when the engine started losing power and the oil temp started rising. He made it safely back to the airport but it was a near thing. Anyway, he discovered a blown lower cylinder gasket (between the jug and the case.) Not a particularly hard fix but one that should not have been required. According to WW the most likely culprit was improper torqueing of the head during assembly. He had not noticed any oil leakage prior to the incident. >> >>Stinemetze >>McPherson, KS. >> >> >>>>> airlion 5/3/2010 7:56 PM >>> >> >>Well guys, after 17 hrs flying time my engine started missing and loosing power. I made it to the ground ok and oil temp was climbing sky hi., and loosing oil just a little. Today, I did a compression and leak test and both failed on number 3 cylinder. Since the get go I have had a leak under that area so now I know why. I had replaced the oil pan but that did not help. I am in the process of taking the rt. side head off to check for a blown gasket or any other anamoly. I did notice that the upper head bolts had not been torqued as I could almost turn them by hand. To be continued. Gardiner Mason. PS I hope I can get this resolved so I can fly to Brodhead. >> >> >> >> >> >> >>" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >>tp://forums.matronics.com >>_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> > > >-- >Rick Holland >Castle Rock, Colorado > >"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" > > > > >href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com >href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Another straight axle gear question
Date: May 05, 2010
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
Steve, The archives were correct. When the plane is in the three point position, the ash blocks are parallel to the ground, and the ash blocks will necess arily point back toward the tail skid plate. Once you start you will see that because of all the angles this is just the way it comes out. Your be st bet for sure is follow along with the instructions from Chris Tracy www .westcoastpiet.com. You are lucky because this was not available when I ma de mine and I really struggled. Lucky for me I got some extra help from a couple of guys on this list that went out of their way for me, namely Jac k Phillips and Mike Cuy. This was the most challenging part of the whole airplane, but also the most satisfying (until I decided to carve a prop that is). Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: chase143(at)aol.com <chase143(at)aol.com> Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 10:58 am Subject: Pietenpol-List: Another straight axle gear question com> Starting on my gear. I previously read in the archives (I can't find it no w), omething to the effect: "...with the plane on the ground, the straight axl e ash lock is parallel to the ground..." Q- Shouldn't the block be parallel to the eck angle (using the top longerons)? Or am I miss interpreting this? lso, I know the block angles should converge on the tailwheel/skid. Q- Is this ngle intersection precise, and if so what is the recommended location? Mid dle f the tail wheel, forward edge of the tail wheel, center point of the back of he fuselage? Thanks. teve -------- teve ww.mypiet.com ead this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296730#296730 ======================== =========== -= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum - -= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse -= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription, -= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, -= Photoshare, and much much more: - -= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - -= Same great content also available via the Web Forums! - -= --> http://forums.matronics.com - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - List Contribution Web Site - -= Thank you for your generous support! -= -Matt Dralle, List Admin. -= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution -======================== ======================== =========== ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: corvair
Date: May 05, 2010
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
As a businessman, it sounds like WW needs some competition. Can't contact him for a week? Wow. Frustrating. DH -----Original Message----- From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> Sent: Wed, May 5, 2010 6:51 am Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair Ryan , I have been trying to contact William for a week now by phone and email with no luck. Thanks for the reply, Gardiner From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com> Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 10:50:37 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair Gardiner, You had your engine completely assembled by WW? Since William built the en gine, have you called him about it? He has a reputation of providing prett y good support for stuff that he builds. On the other hand, I'm sure Bill Clapp would salivate over the opportunity to steal away a WW customer. Go od luck either way. Sorry to hear about your woes. Ryan On May 4, 2010, at 7:35 PM, airlion wrote: Rick, since I don't trust this engine right now , I am going to take it do wn to Bill Clap in Valdosts Ga. The whole right side of the engine had not been torqued. Thanks for the reply, Gardiner From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com> Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 2:15:57 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair Strange Gardiner, I could understand maybe one stud pulling loose from the block resulting in a loose head nut but several is hard to believe. If yo u are lucky maybe you can just re-torque both heads and verify no studs ar e pulling out of the block. rick On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 11:29 AM, airlion wrote: Thanks tom, Ijust took the head off on the right side and there was lot of blow by. The cy head gskets appear to be ok. Also all the bolts and nuts on the rt side had not been torqued as I could turn no 3 by hand and the others with just a little pressure with a wrench From: TOM STINEMETZE <TOMS(at)mcpcity.com> Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 9:29:56 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair One of our EAA chapter members had almost the same thing happen to him wit h his Corvair / Sonex system. He was at about hour 20 and 15 miles from the airport when the engine started losing power and the oil temp started rising. He made it safely back to the airport but it was a near thing. Anyway, he discovered a blown lower cylinder gasket (between the jug and the case.) Not a particularly hard fix but one that should not have been required. According to WW the most likely culprit was improper torqueing of the head during assembly. He had not noticed any oil leakage prior to the incident. Stinemetze McPherson, KS. >>> airlion 5/3/2010 7:56 PM >>> Well guys, after 17 hrs flying time my engine started missing and loosing power. I made it to the ground ok and oil temp was climbing sky hi., and loosing oil just a little. Today, I did a compression and leak test and both failed on number 3 cylinder. Since the get go I have had a leak unde r that area so now I know why. I had replaced the oil pan but that did not help. I am in the process of taking the rt. side head off to check for a blown gasket or any other anamoly. I did notice that the upper head bolts had not been torqued as I could almost turn them by hand. To be continued . Gardiner Mason. PS I hope I can get this resolved so I can fly to Brodhe ad. " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List p://forums.matronics.com blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matr onics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com ref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/con tribution ======================== =========== -= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum - -= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse -= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription, -= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, -= Photoshare, and much much more: - -= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - -= Same great content also available via the Web Forums! - -= --> http://forums.matronics.com - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - List Contribution Web Site - -= Thank you for your generous support! -= -Matt Dralle, List Admin. -= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution -======================== ======================== =========== ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 05, 2010
From: Jim Ash <ashcan(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: corvair
If you suspect a dead cylinder (on an airplane), the first thing your can do is to ID which piston is where, then pull the prop through. A cylinder with no compression will not provide the resistance the good ones will (This will obviously not ID bad ignition on the problem cylinder). Also, if the engine can be run, start it cold and run it for a minute. The head on the dead cylinder will be colder than the others. This is a little harder to do on a Corvair with three cylinders per head because the aluminum conducts head so well. Jim -----Original Message----- From: Rick Holland Sent: May 4, 2010 2:15 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair Strange Gardiner, I could understand maybe one stud pulling loose from the block resulting in a loose head nut but several is hard to believe. If you are lucky maybe you can just re-torque both heads and verify no studs are pulling out of the block. rick On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 11:29 AM, airlion wrote: Thanks tom, Ijust took the head off on the right side and there was lot of blow by. The cy head gskets appear to be ok. Also all the bolts and nuts on the rt side had not been torqued as I could turn no 3 by hand and the others with just a little pressure with a wrench From: TOM STINEMETZE <TOMS(at)mcpcity.com> Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 9:29:56 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair One of our EAA chapter members had almost the same thing happen to him with his Corvair / Sonex system. He was at about hour 20 and 15 miles from the airport when the engine started losing power and the oil temp started rising. He made it safely back to the airport but it was a near thing. Anyway, he discovered a blown lower cylinder gasket (between the jug and the case.) Not a particularly hard fix but one that should not have been required. According to WW the most likely culprit was improper torqueing of the head during assembly. He had not noticed any oil leakage prior to the incident. Stinemetze McPherson, KS. >>> airlion 5/3/2010 7:56 PM >>> Well guys, after 17 hrs flying time my engine started missing and loosing power. I made it to the ground ok and oil temp was climbing sky hi., and loosing oil just a little. Today, I did a compression and leak test and both failed on number 3 cylinder. Since the get go I have had a leak under that area so now I know why. I had replaced the oil pan but that did not help. I am in the process of taking the rt. side head off to check for a blown gasket or any other anamoly. I did notice that the upper head bolts had not been torqued as I could almost turn them by hand. To be continued. Gardiner Mason. PS I hope I can get this resolved so I can fly to Brodhead. " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 05, 2010
From: Douwe Blumberg <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Dan's progress and supposedly secret color scheme
Actually... I too might have some inside information re Dan's top secret color scheme, just contact me offlist. JUST KIDDING! Dan I won't tell. Seriously, congrats on almost being there, I too am completely convinced it'll be a gorgeous plane. Actually, after seeing your work, I'm kinda glad I get to do my rebuild so I can bring my detail work up to to snuff. Let us know the minute she flies ps. Dan, I'm driving with Marci down through Beloit this weekend from Rochester, how far off 39 are you? are you around for a visit? douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Another straight axle gear question
Date: May 05, 2010
Steve, You are now at the most difficult and challenging part of the entire project. It took me a long time to figure out the landing gear geometry. At first I tried making the gear with the "V Block" (at the bottom of the V where the axle rides) parallel to the top longeron and parallel to the airplane centerline (I missed the part about it pointing to the tailpost). I tried over and over to make struts (fortunately I was smart enough to make them out of cheap pine until I got the right geometry) that would fit properly at the fuselage and at the V Block. Finally, I ran strings representing the edges of the struts and found that the V Block must be towed in at the back in order for the strings to line up. It just happens that this angle points APPROXIMATELY to the tailpost. Here are a couple of photos showing how I did it: Landing Gear Jig 2 shows the V Block parallel to the top longeron and the centerline. You can see the pink mason's twine strings I laid in place, representing the edges of the struts. Landing Gear Jig - Revised 1 shows the angle that I had to move the V Block in order to make the strings line up when viewed from the front. Once I modified the jig to hold the V Blocks at that angle, the struts fit beatufully and I made the final struts of laminated spruce. Good Luck! Email me offlist if you have any further problems and I'll try to help you. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of chase143(at)aol.com Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2010 11:59 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Another straight axle gear question Starting on my gear. I previously read in the archives (I can't find it now), something to the effect: "...with the plane on the ground, the straight axle ash block is parallel to the ground..." Q- Shouldn't the block be parallel to the deck angle (using the top longerons)? Or am I miss interpreting this? Also, I know the block angles should converge on the tailwheel/skid. Q- Is this angle intersection precise, and if so what is the recommended location? Middle of the tail wheel, forward edge of the tail wheel, center point of the back of the fuselage? Thanks. Steve -------- Steve www.mypiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296730#296730 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 05, 2010
From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: corvair
My apologies to William as he was out of town with family stuff. Iam taking the engine down to him in fl. where he can go over it. He says that it was probably detonation, and can easily be taken care of.Improper torqueing is not the problem as the engine would not have run so well for 16 hours. Cheers, Gardiner ________________________________ From: "helspersew(at)aol.com" <helspersew(at)aol.com> Sent: Wed, May 5, 2010 8:00:33 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair As a businessman, it sounds like WW needs some competition. Can't contact him for a week? Wow. Frustrating. DH -----Original Message----- From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net> Sent: Wed, May 5, 2010 6:51 am Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair Ryan , I have been trying to contact William for a week now by phone and email with no luck. Thanks for the reply, Gardiner ________________________________ From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com> Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 10:50:37 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair Gardiner, You had your engine completely assembled by WW? Since William built the engine, have you called him about it? He has a reputation of providing pretty good support for stuff that he builds. On the other hand, I'm sure Bill Clapp would salivate over the opportunity to steal away a WW customer. Good luck either way. Sorry to hear about your woes. Ryan On May 4, 2010, at 7:35 PM, airlion wrote: > >> >> >Rick, since I don't trust this engine right now , I am going to take it down to Bill Clap in Valdosts Ga. The whole right side of the engine had not been torqued. Thanks for the reply, Gardiner > > ________________________________ From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com> >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com >Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 2:15:57 PM >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair > >>Strange Gardiner, I could understand maybe one stud pulling loose from the block resulting in a loose head nut but several is hard to believe. If you are lucky maybe you can just re-torque both heads and verify no studs are pulling out of the block. > >>rick > > >On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 11:29 AM, airlion wrote: > >>> >>>> >>>> >>Thanks tom, Ijust took the head off on the right side and there was lot of blow by. The cy head gskets appear to be ok. Also all the bolts and nuts on the rt side had not been torqued as I could turn no 3 by hand and the others with just a little pressure with a wrench >> >> >> >> ________________________________ From: TOM STINEMETZE <TOMS(at)mcpcity.com> >>To: pietenpol >>Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 9:29:56 AM >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair >> >> >>One of our EAA chapter members had almost the same thing happen to him with his Corvair / Sonex system. He was at about hour 20 and 15 miles from the airport when the engine started losing power and the oil temp started rising. He made it safely back to the airport but it was a near thing. Anyway, he discovered a blown lower cylinder gasket (between the jug and the case.) Not a particularly hard fix but one that should not have been required. According to WW the most likely culprit was improper torqueing of the head during assembly. He had not noticed any oil leakage prior to the incident. >> >>Stinemetze >>McPherson, KS. >> >> >>>>>>> airlion 5/3/2010 7:56 PM >>> >> >>>>Well guys, after 17 hrs flying time my engine started missing and loosing power. I made it to the ground ok and oil temp was climbing sky hi., and loosing oil just a little. Today, I did a compression and leak test and both failed on number 3 cylinder. Since the get go I have had a leak under that area so now I know why. I had replaced the oil pan but that did not help. I am in the process of taking the rt. side head off to check for a blown gasket or any other anamoly. I did notice that the upper head bolts had not been torqued as I could almost turn them by hand. To be continued. Gardiner Mason. PS I hope I can get this resolved so I can fly to Brodhead. >> >> >> >> >> >> >>" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >>tp://forums.matronics.com >>_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> > > >>-- >>Rick Holland >>Castle Rock, Colorado > >>"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" > > > > >href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >href="http://forums.matronics.com%22%3ehttp//forums.matronics.com >href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution%22%3Ehttp://www.matronics.com/contribution > =================================== t" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List=================================== tp://forums.matronics.com =================================== _blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution=================================== ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Another straight axle gear question
From: "chase143(at)aol.com" <chase143(at)aol.com>
Date: May 05, 2010
Thanks guys. Yes, a big shout out to Chris for the landing gear info on WCP. -------- Steve www.mypiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296835#296835 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gene Rambo" <generambo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: Another straight axle gear question
Date: May 05, 2010
To anyone building the straight gear . . . if you have not already bought an axle, I have a spare one I just bought that I am not going to use. It is the right diameter and thickness (1.5" x .135?). I would like to sell for what the piece cost me, would save you the $25 cut fee most places charge. Please contact offline if interested. Gene ----- Original Message ----- From: Jack Phillips<mailto:pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 2010 8:29 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Another straight axle gear question Steve, You are now at the most difficult and challenging part of the entire project. It took me a long time to figure out the landing gear geometry. At first I tried making the gear with the "V Block" (at the bottom of the V where the axle rides) parallel to the top longeron and parallel to the airplane centerline (I missed the part about it pointing to the tailpost). I tried over and over to make struts (fortunately I was smart enough to make them out of cheap pine until I got the right geometry) that would fit properly at the fuselage and at the V Block. Finally, I ran strings representing the edges of the struts and found that the V Block must be towed in at the back in order for the strings to line up. It just happens that this angle points APPROXIMATELY to the tailpost. Here are a couple of photos showing how I did it: Landing Gear Jig 2 shows the V Block parallel to the top longeron and the centerline. You can see the pink mason's twine strings I laid in place, representing the edges of the struts. Landing Gear Jig - Revised 1 shows the angle that I had to move the V Block in order to make the strings line up when viewed from the front. Once I modified the jig to hold the V Blocks at that angle, the struts fit beatufully and I made the final struts of laminated spruce. Good Luck! Email me offlist if you have any further problems and I'll try to help you. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of chase143(at)aol.com Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2010 11:59 AM To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Another straight axle gear question Starting on my gear. I previously read in the archives (I can't find it now), something to the effect: "...with the plane on the ground, the straight axle ash block is parallel to the ground..." Q- Shouldn't the block be parallel to the deck angle (using the top longerons)? Or am I miss interpreting this? Also, I know the block angles should converge on the tailwheel/skid. Q- Is this angle intersection precise, and if so what is the recommended location? Middle of the tail wheel, forward edge of the tail wheel, center point of the back of the fuselage? Thanks. Steve -------- Steve www.mypiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296730#296730 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 05, 2010
From: Tim Willis <timothywillis(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
Rick, where is this, CO? HAs the "Bell method" been described herein? Tim in central TX -----Original Message----- From: Rick Holland Sent: May 4, 2010 11:00 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Milestone- Spray painting complete! Correct, EcoBond is the sticky stuff to attach the fabric. Am using the Stewart stuff to paint my aluminum parts and latex on the fabric (using the proven Bell method). And concerning the test panel, it is still in great shape, will have been out on that post at 6700 ft. facing true South for five years this August. rick On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 5:41 PM, Gary Boothe wrote: Rick, My memory often fails me. I thought you were going to paint with house paint? Are you not the one who did the sample piece a couple years ago for weather testing? Gary Boothe Cool, CA Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, Fuselage on gear 18 ribs done From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Holland Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2010 10:48 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Milestone- Spray painting complete! Great news Dan, I am covering the fuselage now (using Stewart EcoBond) and will also be painting soon. rick On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 6:52 AM, wrote: Well boys, after many weeks, I have now completed the final painting of NX929DH. This has been the least enjoyable part of the whole build for me. I guess because at this stage I am impatient, and painting is 99% tedious preparation and 1% spraying. I am happy with my results (Stewart System), not as good as it could have been, but there is a learning curve to spray painting with only one chance at it, especially when you are spending so much money per gallon (no opportunity for practice). Now I am on to reassembly....what a joy it is!!!..... Finally!!! ......all the misc. parts I have been saving in the cardboard box under my workbench for up to 10 years. Last night made an inspection plate for the underside of fuse, because I was one short. Pretty easy to make and it took only two tries. Still hope to make Brodhead. Advantage for me is Brodhead is so close I can include it in my fly-off area....takes a little more pressure off for the deadline. Really need to put some more run time on my Model A since I have only run it for about an hour. Lesson learned from Douwe is that I will wait for a windless, sunny, high-pressure morning for the first flight, and resist the temptation to fly in anything but a perfect situation. The grass runway here is very wide and plenty long so plenty of opportunity to abort if I have to. So keep working boys,...... little-by-little it all adds up. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-Listtp://forums.matronics.com_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 05, 2010
Subject: Re: Milestone- Spray painting complete!
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
When I saw Shad and Garys Piet at Brodhead I thought it had a real nice dope finish. Found out later that it was a real nice Latex paint job. The technique is real simple, (correct me if I got this wrong Shad), two cross-coats of Latex primer on the bare fabric then two cross-coats of Satin Latex, all with a foam brush and thinned with Flotrol the amount recommend on the bottle. (Could use semi or gloss if you want a glossier finish). rick On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 3:24 PM, Tim Willis wrote: > timothywillis(at)earthlink.net> > > Rick, where is this, CO? HAs the "Bell method" been described herein? > Tim in central TX > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rick Holland > Sent: May 4, 2010 11:00 PM > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Milestone- Spray painting complete! > > Correct, EcoBond is the sticky stuff to attach the fabric. Am using the > Stewart stuff to paint my aluminum parts and latex on the fabric (using the > proven Bell method). And concerning the test panel, it is still in great > shape, will have been out on that post at 6700 ft. facing true South for > five years this August. > > rick > > > On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 5:41 PM, Gary Boothe wrote: > > > Rick, > > My memory often fails me. I thought you were going to paint with house > paint? Are you not the one who did the sample piece a couple years ago for > weather testing? > > > Gary Boothe > Cool, CA > Pietenpol > WW Corvair Conversion > Tail done, Fuselage on gear > 18 ribs done > > > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto: > owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Holland > Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2010 10:48 AM > > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Milestone- Spray painting complete! > > > Great news Dan, I am covering the fuselage now (using Stewart EcoBond) and > will also be painting soon. > > rick > > > On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 6:52 AM, wrote: > > > Well boys, after many weeks, I have now completed the final painting of > NX929DH. This has been the least enjoyable part of the whole build for me. I > guess because at this stage I am impatient, and painting is 99% tedious > preparation and 1% spraying. I am happy with my results (Stewart System), > not as good as it could have been, but there is a learning curve to spray > painting with only one chance at it, especially when you are spending so > much money per gallon (no opportunity for practice). > > > Now I am on to reassembly....what a joy it is!!!..... Finally!!! ......all > the misc. parts I have been saving in the cardboard box under my workbench > for up to 10 years. Last night made an inspection plate for the underside of > fuse, because I was one short. Pretty easy to make and it took only two > tries. > > > Still hope to make Brodhead. Advantage for me is Brodhead is so close I can > include it in my fly-off area....takes a little more pressure off for the > deadline. Really need to put some more run time on my Model A since I have > only run it for about an hour. > > > Lesson learned from Douwe is that I will wait for a windless, sunny, > high-pressure morning for the first flight, and resist the temptation to fly > in anything but a perfect situation. The grass runway here is very wide and > plenty long so plenty of opportunity to abort if I have to. > > > So keep working boys,...... little-by-little it all adds up. > > > Dan Helsper > > Poplar Grove, IL. > > " target="_blank"> > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-Listtp://forums.matronics.com_blank > ">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > -- > Rick Holland > Castle Rock, Colorado > > "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com > http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > tp://forums.matronics.com > _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > -- > Rick Holland > Castle Rock, Colorado > > "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Mahogeny or Birch
From: "dgaldrich" <dgaldrich(at)embarqmail.com>
Date: May 06, 2010
If not specified by the vendor as "water and boil proof" suggest a "boil" test to make sure the glue is up to snuff. Stick a sample in boiling water for 10 minutes (iirc, there's a standard somewhere) and see if the stuff delaminates. No delamination= good to go. Quick, simple, cheap test. Dave Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296952#296952 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 06, 2010
From: Tim Willis <timothywillis(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Ethanol in Mogas-- more coming
We have posted about ethanol in motor fuel gasoline previously and wondered when/if we were going to see it pretty much everywhere. Texas had been resisting this, but about a month ago some vendors here in TX began posting ethanol labels on their pumps. Now I am seeing others-- Murphy first, then Shell. I will check others. This has been done without any local announcements. I suspect it is a federal mandate in order for the states to get matching federal highway $$$$. The labels thus far in TX state that "up to 10 percent" of the fuel may be ethanol. We know that ethanol in the gas bonds with water and makes it difficult, if not impossible, to separate out the water in the tanks and at the gascolator. We know that ethanol is more volatile than gasoline, and thus we have more evaporative cooling at the carbuerator. The combo of more cooling and more water can cause more carb icing. So, as we have throttled back we need more carb heat when using mogas. At the other end of performance, 100% power for takeoff, ethanol is troublesome, as well. Since ethanol has about 30% less energy than gasoline, we will have performance degradation on takeoff. And with more volatility from the ethanol, on a hot day at full power, we have greater possibility of vapor lock when we need all the power. Am I missing something? Some additive? Does anyone know if the 92 or higher octane mogas is being left alone, or any way out of this problem, other than 100LL avgas (and another set of problems there for many engines)? Tim in central TX ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 06, 2010
From: H RULE <harvey.rule(at)rogers.com>
Subject: Re: Ethanol in Mogas-- more coming
Heres what I know;I always thought that the higher octane was kept to no et hanol especially Shell-till I talked to a tanker driver and he told me th at when they have extra regular left over then they put it into the high te st tanks.He works all night long delivering gas.He told me nobody sees what they do and the station owners don't complain so hey why not eh.When you t hink you are getting pure high octane check it next time,you may see some e thonol in there.When you think you are paying for high octain you may be pa ying for regular.Unless you have these guys staked out all the time you wil l never catch them.It's not a perfect world out there,I wish it was.I guess the only way to be sure is to stick to the 100LL and even then I would que stion it.=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: Tim Willis =0ATo: matronics piet site =0ASent: Thu, May 6, 2010 2:07:29 PM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List: Tim Willis =0A=0A=0A- - We have posted abo ut ethanol in motor fuel gasoline previously and wondered when/if we were g oing to see it pretty much everywhere.- Texas had been resisting this, bu t about a month ago some vendors here in TX began posting ethanol labels on their pumps.- Now I am seeing others-- Murphy first, then Shell.- I wi ll check others.- This has been done without any local announcements.- I suspect it is a federal mandate in order for the states to get matching f ederal highway $$$$. =0A- - The labels thus far in TX state that "up to 10 percent" of the fuel may be ethanol.=0A- - We know that ethanol in the gas bonds with water and makes it difficult, if not impossible, to sepa rate out the water in the tanks and at the gascolator.- We know that etha nol is more volatile than gasoline, and thus we have more evaporative cooli ng at the carbuerator.- The combo of more cooling and more water can caus e more carb icing.- So, as we have throttled back we need more carb heat when using mogas.- =0A- - At the other end of performance, 100% power for takeoff, ethanol is troublesome, as well.- Since ethanol has about 3 0% less energy than gasoline, we will have performance degradation on takeo ff.- And with more volatility from the ethanol, on a hot day at full powe r, we have greater possibility of vapor lock when we need all the power.=0A - - Am I missing something?- Some additive?- Does anyone know if th e 92 or higher octane mogas is being left alone, or any way out of this pro blem, other than 100LL avgas (and another set of problems there for many en == ________________________________________________________________________________
From: AMsafetyC(at)aol.com
Date: May 06, 2010
Subject: Question regarding control surface travel
I have seen where aileron travel in degrees was discussed previously and remember parts of the discussion. I do not however remember anyone discussing the amount of travel for each surface individually and in the same document. At the risk of having the information repeated in part, could someone with either empirical or theoretical based knowledge provide the following information for control surfaces: Ailerons travel in inches and degrees up and down Rudder deflection left and right of center Elevator up and down from center Center being considered at the zero surface position where no deflection exists I want to be assured that when I begin my surface set up that I have adequate or greater than adequate surface deflection such that I never run out of aileron, rudder and elevator authority. Thanks John ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Ethanol in Mogas-- more coming
From: "gtche98" <garywilson213(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 06, 2010
Without regard to what shady drivers/stations may put in their high test tanks, as Harvey mentions below, I know that the Kwiktrip stations in Wisconsin specifically advertise their Premium fuel as being ethanol free and the recommended "Recreation Fuel" for ATVs, Snowmobiles, and small engines. They must not see the mogas aviation community as a big enough market to advertise to. :D Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296973#296973 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Ethanol in Mogas-- more coming
From: "dgaldrich" <dgaldrich(at)embarqmail.com>
Date: May 06, 2010
There's a series of gas stations in Maine that actually have the chutzpah to put "ENRICHED with up to 10% methanol." Some of the customers actually buy into it. Ignorance is bliss. Dave Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296984#296984 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Ethanol in Mogas-- more coming
From: "John Recine" <amsafetyc(at)aol.com>
Date: May 06, 2010
QWx3YXlzIHdhbnRlZCB0byBrbm93IGhvdyB0byBzcGVsbCB0aGF0LCBqdXN0IG5ldmVyIGhhZCB0 aGUgY2h1dHpwYWggdG8gYXNrDQoNCkpvaG4NCg0KRG8gbm90IGFyY2hpdmUNClNlbnQgZnJvbSBt eSBWZXJpem9uIFdpcmVsZXNzIEJsYWNrQmVycnkNCg0KLS0tLS1PcmlnaW5hbCBNZXNzYWdlLS0t LS0NCkZyb206IEggUlVMRSA8aGFydmV5LnJ1bGVAcm9nZXJzLmNvbT4NCkRhdGU6IFRodSwgNiBN YXkgMjAxMCAxNjoxMToxOSANClRvOiA8cGlldGVucG9sLWxpc3RAbWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbT4NClN1 YmplY3Q6IFJlOiBQaWV0ZW5wb2wtTGlzdDogUmU6IEV0aGFub2wgaW4gTW9nYXMtLSBtb3JlIGNv bWluZw0KDQpFbnJpY2hlZCxlbmhhbmNlZCxiZXR0ZXIgdGhhbiBiZWZvcmUsYmVzdCB0aGVyZSBl dmVyIHdhcyxiZXN0b3VzIGluIHRoZSBsYW5kLkl0IGFsbCBhZGRzIHVwIHRvIHdoZXJlIGNhbiBJ IGZpbmQgYSBzYWZlIHBsYWNlIHRvIGxhbmQgd2hlbiBldmVyeXRoaW5nIGdvZXMgcXVpZXQuVGhl IFBpZXQgaW4gY2FzZSBhbnlvbmUgaGFzbid0IG5vdGljZWQgaXMgbm90IHRoZSBiZXN0IGdsaWRl ciBpbiB0aGUgbGFuZC4NCmRvIG5vdCBhcmNoaXZlDQoNCg0KDQoNCl9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQpGcm9tOiBkZ2FsZHJpY2ggPGRnYWxkcmljaEBlbWJhcnFtYWlsLmNv bT4NClRvOiBwaWV0ZW5wb2wtbGlzdEBtYXRyb25pY3MuY29tDQpTZW50OiBUaHUsIE1heSA2LCAy MDEwIDU6NTE6MDYgUE0NClN1YmplY3Q6IFBpZXRlbnBvbC1MaXN0OiBSZTogRXRoYW5vbCBpbiBN b2dhcy0tIG1vcmUgY29taW5nDQoNCi0tPiBQaWV0ZW5wb2wtTGlzdCBtZXNzYWdlIHBvc3RlZCBi eTogImRnYWxkcmljaCIgPGRnYWxkcmljaEBlbWJhcnFtYWlsLmNvbT4NCg0KVGhlcmUncyBhIHNl cmllcyBvZiBnYXMgc3RhdGlvbnMgaW4gTWFpbmUgdGhhdCBhY3R1YWxseSBoYXZlIHRoZSBjaHV0 enBhaCB0byBwdXQgIkVOUklDSEVEIHdpdGggdXAgdG8gMTAlIG1ldGhhbm9sLiKgIFNvbWUgb2Yg dGhlIGN1c3RvbWVycyBhY3R1YWxseSBidXkgaW50byBpdC6gIElnbm9yYW5jZSBpcyBibGlzcy4N Cg0KRGF2ZQ0KDQoNCg0KDQpSZWFkIHRoaXMgdG9waWMgb25saW5lIGhlcmU6DQoNCmh0dHA6Ly9m b3J1bXMuPT09PT09PT09PT09PQ0KDQo ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Mahogeny or Birch
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: May 06, 2010
I've used some of both so far. -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=296996#296996 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov>
Date: May 07, 2010
Subject: no flying in Ohio Saturday.........
for me, anyway. Saturday Very windy and much cooler. Cloudy with a 50 percent chance of showers. Hig hs in the lower 50s. Southwest winds 25 to 35 mph with gusts to 55 mph. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 07, 2010
From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu>
Subject: Re: no flying in Ohio Saturday.........
If Mikey ain't flyin', ain't NOBODY flyin'!! >for me, anyway. > > >Saturday >Very windy and much cooler. Cloudy with a 50 percent chance of >showers. Highs in the lower 50s. Southwest winds 25 to 35 mph with >gusts to 55 mph. > > -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..." ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 07, 2010
From: gcardinal(at)comcast.net
Subject: Re: no flying in Ohio Saturday.........
"Highs in the lower 50's"..........LUXURY! Minneapolis is expecting 2" of wet snow. I'm not flying either. Greg C. Minneapolis ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael D. Cuy (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]" michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov for me, anyway. Saturday Very windy and much cooler. Cloudy with a 50 percent chance of showers. Highs in the lower 50s. Southwest winds 25 to 35 mph with gusts to 55 mph. for me, anyway. Saturday Very windy and much cooler. Cloudy with a 50 percent chance of showers. Highs in the lower 50s. Southwest winds 25 to 35 mph with gusts to 55 mph. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: no flying in Ohio Saturday.........
Date: May 07, 2010
I just got down from a brief excursion in the RV-4. A few loops and rolls and a hammerhead over Smith Mountain Lake (we're up here for the weekend). I wish I had the Pietenpol here, wx is perfect. _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation] Sent: Friday, May 07, 2010 9:00 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: no flying in Ohio Saturday......... for me, anyway. Saturday Very windy and much cooler. Cloudy with a 50 percent chance of showers. Highs in the lower 50s. Southwest winds 25 to 35 mph with gusts to 55 mph. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Wayne Bressler <wayne(at)taildraggersinc.com>
Subject: Re: no flying in Ohio Saturday.........
Date: May 07, 2010
Jack, You should have said hello. I've been working "Leesburg Radio" since 2:30. :) Wayne Bressler Jr. Taildraggers, Inc. taildraggersinc.com On May 7, 2010, at 3:51 PM, "Jack Phillips" wrote: > I just got down from a brief excursion in the RV-4. A few loops and > rolls and a hammerhead over Smith Mountain Lake (we=99re up here for t > he weekend). I wish I had the Pietenpol here, wx is perfect. > > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner- > pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cuy, Michael D. > (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation] > Sent: Friday, May 07, 2010 9:00 AM > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: no flying in Ohio Saturday......... > > for me, anyway. > > > Saturday > Very windy and much cooler. Cloudy with a 50 percent chance of > showers. Highs in the lower 50s. Southwest winds 25 to 35 mph with > gusts to 55 mph. > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > http://forums.matronics.com > http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 07, 2010
From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu>
Subject: Re: Ethanol in Mogas-- more coming
Nope, I don't think you're missing anything. I wish we were missing something and I'd love to hear solutions or tricks or work-arounds that actually work. As to mandates, there is a brief article at http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2010/05/with-new-mandates-being-questioned-ethanol-lobby-points-to-gulf-oil-disaster.html that suggests the new mandates may be delayed. Here's hoping. I am lucky in that I can buy avgas at several local airports. Within 30 miles the prices today range from a high of $7.70 at Hartsfield-Jackson to a low of $3.49 at Jackson County (19A). I, of course, always buy at 19A. :) The cheapest premium grade gasoline in the area is $3.03. The price difference between suspect premium gasoline and avgas is thus $3.49 - 3.03 = $0.46 per gallon. I fly about 100 hrs per year at about 5 gal per hour. Using just this snapshot of data, the cost of the peace of mind of avgas for a year's flying is 100 hrs x 5 gal/hr x 0.46 dollars/gal = $230. Even if the price difference was double, that might be the best deal in aviation. But, like I said, I'm lucky. Not all of us even has access to avgas, and many that do must pay much, much more for it. And like I said, I wish we were all missing something here, some strategy or trick, but I don't think we are. -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..." ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: What must be done to invert a Ford Model A engine?
From: "Mild Bill" <whfrank(at)charter.net>
Date: May 07, 2010
I did a search on the site but didn't find much detailed information. Didn't find much information elsewhere on the web, either, though possibly I could with a diligent search. So, exactly what alterations must be performed to make a Ford Model A run reliably when inverted? Lubrication system, cooling system, carburetor/manifolds, etc. Attention, Pieti Lowell..... (Any relation? I'm from the northwest Illinois Franks.) -------- Bill Frank Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297088#297088 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 07, 2010
Subject: Re: What must be done to invert a Ford Model A engine?
From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com>
I think you need to first turn it into a Model B engine, and then turn that into a Funk engine. The Model A has a mostly splash lubed crank, doesn't it? Hard to make that work when you turn it upside down. Do tell, why would you want to try that? Ryan On Fri, May 7, 2010 at 8:04 PM, Mild Bill wrote: > > I did a search on the site but didn't find much detailed information. > Didn't find much information elsewhere on the web, either, though possibly I > could with a diligent search. > > So, exactly what alterations must be performed to make a Ford Model A run > reliably when inverted? Lubrication system, cooling system, > carburetor/manifolds, etc. > > Attention, Pieti Lowell..... > > (Any relation? I'm from the northwest Illinois Franks.) > > -------- > Bill Frank > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297088#297088 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: What must be done to invert a Ford Model A engine?
From: "Pieti Lowell" <Lowellcfrank(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 07, 2010
I built the inverted B Ford block.( Funk ) In 1998. It is hangered at Palmyra WI. The basics are, Oil pump in the dist, spot. radiator is parallel to left side of block, with dampers to control temps.oil drains to oil sump on fire wall from the valve cover front and back locations.crank drilled to accept oil from mains. side mounted mag,water pump driven from rear pulley on crank, there is a 1"hi ring that is anchored at each cylinder to slow oil flow into piston/rod area,6.25 compression and alum. head.64 HP. There are a few other items that are required but it sure makes a faster, clean operating Pietenpol. The Funk Airplane used this engine in it's early models. Pieti Lowell Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297092#297092 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Ethanol in Mogas-- more coming
From: "coxwelljon" <coxwelljon(at)frontiernet.net>
Date: May 07, 2010
All stations in central NY are 10% ethanol. Traveled in SW Colorado last week and all the stations I saw there were also 10%. -------- Jon Coxwell GN-1 Builder Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297097#297097 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Question regarding control surface travel
From: "coxwelljon" <coxwelljon(at)frontiernet.net>
Date: May 07, 2010
I have a GN-1 but I think they are the same. Don't have specs for ailerons but for the elevators up 20 deg. down max. 30. Rudder is left and right to within 1" of touching the elevator edge with elevator at neutral position. -------- Jon Coxwell GN-1 Builder Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297098#297098 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 08, 2010
Subject: Gardiner's Corvair issue, or how not to cool the Corvair
in your Pietenpol
From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com>
I'm sure many recall the posts Gardiner made to the list recently about the unfortunate problems he encountered with the Corvair engine he has installed in his Pietenpol. There was the suggestion on his part that it may have been due to subpar workmanship during assembly of the engine, which was assembled by one of William Wynne's former hangar crew. Gardiner took the engine down to William Wynne, and a partial teardown and analysis of the engine revealed that it had been suffering from a combination of sketchy timing and inadequate cooling, leading to severe detonation. The timing issue stemmed from having an equally sketchy individual (not related to William or one of his associates) make modifications to the distributor, and the cooling issue stemmed from a number of flaws in Gardiner's particular cooling configuration. William has put a detailed post on his site explaining exactly what happened, and how to avoid these issues: http://flycorvair.com/pietengineissue.html I highly recommend giving it a read if you are at all interested in using a Corvair, or if you are already committed to using one. Plenty of good information. Gardiner, We wish you the best with getting the 'Vair back together and back on your Piet. We hope you can get all the kinks sorted out and are able to fly her to Brodhead this year! We'll be there with our new Piet, and we look forward to seeing yours. Have a nice weekend, Ryan ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 08, 2010
From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Gardiner's Corvair issue, or how not to cool the Corvair
in your Pietenpol William, I thoroughly enjoyed your discussion about my mistakes and I am not hurt in the least by bringing them to light. I have learned a lot in the last few days and I thank you. Gardiner. ________________________________ From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com> Sent: Sat, May 8, 2010 8:58:03 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Gardiner's Corvair issue, or how not to cool the Corvair in your Pietenpol I'm sure many recall the posts Gardiner made to the list recently about the unfortunate problems he encountered with the Corvair engine he has installed in his Pietenpol. There was the suggestion on his part that it may have been due to subpar workmanship during assembly of the engine, which was assembled by one of William Wynne's former hangar crew. Gardiner took the engine down to William Wynne, and a partial teardown and analysis of the engine revealed that it had been suffering from a combination of sketchy timing and inadequate cooling, leading to severe detonation. The timing issue stemmed from having an equally sketchy individual (not related to William or one of his associates) make modifications to the distributor, and the cooling issue stemmed from a number of flaws in Gardiner's particular cooling configuration. William has put a detailed post on his site explaining exactly what happened, and how to avoid these issues: http://flycorvair.com/pietengineissue.html I highly recommend giving it a read if you are at all interested in using a Corvair, or if you are already committed to using one. Plenty of good information. Gardiner, We wish you the best with getting the 'Vair back together and back on your Piet. We hope you can get all the kinks sorted out and are able to fly her to Brodhead this year! We'll be there with our new Piet, and we look forward to seeing yours. Have a nice weekend, Ryan ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: rib test, wood failure
From: "schuerrman" <sdschuerr(at)live.com>
Date: May 08, 2010
I have two completed ribs and I was looking through the archives to find ways to test them. Could anyone point me in the right direction? I'm sure I couldn't build a rib worse than these two. I forgot to glue the backs of some gussets on one, and I started pulling one out of the jig too soon, so I'm confident that these two will be the worst of my lot. Are there any numbers on what the rib should be able to take? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297102#297102 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: rib test, wood failure
From: "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 08, 2010
I'm sure you'll get some more technical answers later. but if you can tug at the gussets without them coming loose and they held their shape well after coming out.and you used good clean wood without knots or deformities I'd guess they are pretty good.( of course unless you're wanting to test them to destruction you have to use some judgment on how hard to pull on the gussets.there was a post a while back about a wing that had been flying for some time and the gussets peeling off when they checked them so it would be good to do that before constructing a wing with them I'd guess. I have in the past made a master rib for a pattern and sanded the others as needed on a belt/disc sander till they were a very close match.and when I used plywood for ribs on another project I used a ball bearing pilot router bit to trim them all to the master rib after clamping them to it. lots of ways to check them. Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297103#297103 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 08, 2010
From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu>
Subject: Re: Gardiner's Corvair issue, or how not to cool the
Corvair in your Pietenpol Gardiner, you're a true gentleman and a seeker of truth. >William, I thoroughly enjoyed your discussion about my mistakes and >I am not hurt in the least by bringing them to light. > >I have learned a lot in the last few days and I thank you. Gardiner. -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..." ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: rib test, wood failure
From: "schuerrman" <sdschuerr(at)live.com>
Date: May 08, 2010
The third just came out of the jig beautifully. They look great, and they're very solid. I'm going to mock up two on some two foot spars, tack some leading and trailing edge on and pile some weight on from a few different angles. I just bought another bingelis book, it will be here shortly. I do have a question about grain, though. What is the preferred direction of the grain in relation to stress? Should rings be horizontal, vertical, or it doesn't matter? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297105#297105 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 08, 2010
From: kmordecai001(at)comcast.net
Subject: Mogas and carb ice - Stromberg carbs
=C2-Fellow Pieters, Tim Willis wrote:=C2- =C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2-=C2-"We know that ethanol is more volatile than gasoline, and thus we have more evaporative cooling at the carbuerator. =C2-The combo of more cooling and more water can cause more carb icing. =C2-So, as we have throttled back we need more carb heat when using mogas.=C2-=C2-" Down here in the FL panhandle on a=C2-typically damp morning in near idea l icing conditions,=C2-my Stromberg=C2-iced up at full throttle=C2-du ring climbout.=C2-=C2-Application of carb heat cleared it up quickly, s o I circled the field and continued the climb to a safe altitude and turned off carb heat. After about 30-45 seconds the loss of power and roughness c ame back, and was cleared up again=C2-by the application of carb heat. Th is was in 2005 or 2006 when I=C2-was running mogas from the local BP that supplied most of the local boaters and=C2-supposedly had no ethanol.=C2 - I made up a quick home-made=C2-ethanol tester per the EAA instruction s, and=C2-found that this fuel not only had ethanol in it, but that it wa s saturated with water as well. Since then I've run nothing but 100LL in the A-75.=C2- It makes a little more power,=C2-doesn't threaten to kill me with carb=C2-ice or leave my hands stinking, (in fact, it smells good), and won't go bad=C2-in a shor t time like today's crappy mogas.=C2- It does cost more and I have to dri ve about 30 miles to fill my 5 gallon cans, but=C2-for a year's worth of flying it's only about $40-50 more total cost.=C2- Cheap Insurance. Of course, we don't all have a local unattended source of avgas, so please do make an ethanol tester and do your homework if you must run mogas. My 2 cents worth, Dave Mordecai 41 Monocoupe Circle Panacea, FL NX520SF=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2- ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Weight.
From: "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 08, 2010
can anybody give me a pretty good guess as to where the center of gravity for the pilot or passenger is supposed to be in relation to the seat back? I'm working to get the W&B figured out on the project I bought from D.J. and the fuselage has been stretched quite a bit.I just don't know whether to use something like 4 or 5 inches ahead of the bottom of the seat back as the distance for pilot or passenger weight calculations or what. hope someone can enlighten me here. Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297140#297140 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Weight.
From: Thomas Bernie <tsbernie(at)earthlink.net>
Date: May 08, 2010
Raymond, I can give you a good idea if your GN-1 is according to the plans. Beware, the weight and balance information (example) in the plans is wrong. Look in the archives. Tom Gloucester, Mass GN-1 N666TB Going to the hanger next week. On May 8, 2010, at 8:40 PM, skellytown flyer wrote: > > can anybody give me a pretty good guess as to where the center of gravity for the pilot or passenger is supposed to be in relation to the seat back? I'm working to get the W&B figured out on the project I bought from D.J. and the fuselage has been stretched quite a bit.I just don't know whether to use something like 4 or 5 inches ahead of the bottom of the seat back as the distance for pilot or passenger weight calculations or what. hope someone can enlighten me here. Raymond > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297140#297140 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 08, 2010
Subject: Re: Weight.
From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com>
Raymond, If I recall correctly, DJ's project was a GN-1...if that is the case I can't say how much what I say applies to a GN-1, as I am referring to Pietenpol information. According to Don Pietenpol: "not under any condition should this airplane be flown with the C.G. more than 20" from the leading edge of the wing". You can use any reference you like to establish where the C.G. falls...the firewall, leading edge of the wing, it doesn't really matter. But what you must do is to use the C.G. that your W&B gives you to determine where that falls in relation to the leading edge of the wing. HTH, Ryan On Sat, May 8, 2010 at 7:40 PM, skellytown flyer wrote: > skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com> > > can anybody give me a pretty good guess as to where the center of gravity > for the pilot or passenger is supposed to be in relation to the seat back? > I'm working to get the W&B figured out on the project I bought from D.J. and > the fuselage has been stretched quite a bit.I just don't know whether to use > something like 4 or 5 inches ahead of the bottom of the seat back as the > distance for pilot or passenger weight calculations or what. hope someone > can enlighten me here. Raymond > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297140#297140 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Weight.
From: "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 08, 2010
Tom that is good to know.I have never figured out how to search the archives. maybe that's the reason I come up with questions that have been covered so often.if you would not mind visiting off list about it I'd be glad to pick your brain. but what I am trying to use is a calculator that is available on the Kansas city Dawn patrol website.I have the distances measured on my airplane using the firewall as a datum.as well as empty weights at the wheels and everything level.if I could just get a good centerline for pilot weight.I seem to remember reading once it would be at about a person's hip bone when sitting. that probably depends on the reclining angle.and whether it is a normal person or someone like me with long legs.but the figures I am coming up with sure don't look usable. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297144#297144 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Weight.
From: Thomas Bernie <tsbernie(at)earthlink.net>
Date: May 08, 2010
Raymond, If the plane is built according to the plans, the moments provided are all you need. Learn how to compute your c.g. with a pencil and a piece of paper (backwards, in your sleep) first. You have to understand it -- there is no shortcut. Tom On May 8, 2010, at 9:03 PM, skellytown flyer wrote: > > Tom that is good to know.I have never figured out how to search the archives. maybe that's the reason I come up with questions that have been covered so often.if you would not mind visiting off list about it I'd be glad to pick your brain. but what I am trying to use is a calculator that is available on the Kansas city Dawn patrol website.I have the distances measured on my airplane using the firewall as a datum.as well as empty weights at the wheels and everything level.if I could just get a good centerline for pilot weight.I seem to remember reading once it would be at about a person's hip bone when sitting. that probably depends on the reclining angle.and whether it is a normal person or someone like me with long legs.but the figures I am coming up with sure don't look usable. > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297144#297144 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 08, 2010
Subject: Re: Weight.
From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com>
Raymond, Searching the archives isn't too difficult. First off, you have to get there. You can find it at: http://www.matronics.com/search/ The first step is to use the 'Select Archive' dropdown to choose Pietenpol. I would leave 'Message Order' at Newest First. I like to set 'Output Method' at 3 frame Index. Then you arrive at entering your search. There are instructions on the site. To boil them down: If you want to search for one word, just type the word and click Begin Search. For example, if I want to find all posts that talk about Stromberg carbs, I'll search for 'stromberg' (minus the quotes). If I want to search for a phrase, I can just enter the words. Maybe I want to see what was posted about how to build landing gear. I can enter 'landing gear', and it will find every post that contains the word 'landing' that is followed immediately by the word 'gear'. Maybe I want to find out about how elevator travel might relate to throttle usage. Well, odds are I won't find a two or three word phrase containing those words right next to each other that is common to many posts. In this case I can search for 'elevator & throttle & travel'. This will show me any posts that contain those three words, whether they are next to each other or not. Maybe you decide you want to see if there is any information about Pietenpols with Warner engines, or with Lambert engines. There may be posts on the list about one, or the other, but not both. To find them you can do a search for 'warner | lambert. The | character, which you can enter by hitting Shift plus the |\ key, means or. So you are searching for posts that contain the words 'Warner' or 'Lambert', but not both. If you need any more help with searching in the archives please feel free to shoot me an email. I can talk you through it on the phone if you are more comfortable with that, just let me know. Good luck! Ryan On Sat, May 8, 2010 at 8:03 PM, skellytown flyer wrote: > skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com> > > Tom that is good to know.I have never figured out how to search the > archives. maybe that's the reason I come up with questions that have been > covered so often.if you would not mind visiting off list about it I'd be > glad to pick your brain. but what I am trying to use is a calculator that is > available on the Kansas city Dawn patrol website.I have the distances > measured on my airplane using the firewall as a datum.as well as empty > weights at the wheels and everything level.if I could just get a good > centerline for pilot weight.I seem to remember reading once it would be at > about a person's hip bone when sitting. that probably depends on the > reclining angle.and whether it is a normal person or someone like me with > long legs.but the figures I am coming up with sure don't look usable. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297144#297144 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Weight.
From: "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 08, 2010
well that's one of the problems -it wasn't built to plans-it has quite a bit of stretch and as I understood from a previous post the plans had wrong info anyway. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297148#297148 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 08, 2010
Subject: Re: Gardiner's Corvair issue, or how not to cool the
Corvair in your Pietenpol
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
Interesting writeup from WW, one thing mentioned that I do not have is an air passage between the left and right eyebrow baffles, has anyone seen this on a Corvair/Piet installation? Shouldn't be too hard to add a 2 1/2" Scat hose between my eyebrows. rick On Sat, May 8, 2010 at 6:58 AM, Ryan Mueller wrote: > I'm sure many recall the posts Gardiner made to the list recently about the > unfortunate problems he encountered with the Corvair engine he has installed > in his Pietenpol. There was the suggestion on his part that it may have been > due to subpar workmanship during assembly of the engine, which was assembled > by one of William Wynne's former hangar crew. Gardiner took the engine down > to William Wynne, and a partial teardown and analysis of the engine revealed > that it had been suffering from a combination of sketchy timing and > inadequate cooling, leading to severe detonation. The timing issue stemmed > from having an equally sketchy individual (not related to William or one of > his associates) make modifications to the distributor, and the cooling issue > stemmed from a number of flaws in Gardiner's particular cooling > configuration. William has put a detailed post on his site explaining > exactly what happened, and how to avoid these issues: > > http://flycorvair.com/pietengineissue.html > > I highly recommend giving it a read if you are at all interested in using a > Corvair, or if you are already committed to using one. Plenty of good > information. > > Gardiner, > > We wish you the best with getting the 'Vair back together and back on your > Piet. We hope you can get all the kinks sorted out and are able to fly her > to Brodhead this year! We'll be there with our new Piet, and we look forward > to seeing yours. Have a nice weekend, > > Ryan > > * > > * > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 08, 2010
Subject: Re: Mogas and carb ice - Stromberg carbs
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
I love the smell of Avgas in the morning. Since then I've run nothing but 100LL in the A-75. It makes a little more > power, doesn't threaten to kill me with carb ice or leave my hands stinking, > (in fact, it smells good), and won't go bad in a short time like today's > crappy mogas. > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Weight.
From: Thomas Bernie <tsbernie(at)earthlink.net>
Date: May 08, 2010
O.K. You have to put the plane on scales, weigh it empty -- compute the empty c.g. Sit in it, compute the c.g. and derive the pilot moment. Sit in the front hole, compute the c.g. and derive the passenger moment. I found the passenger moment to be in error on my plane. The scales do not lie. I had to make a new motor mount and cowling and correct for short tach, carb heat and oil temp lines (not fun). Learn it. Tom On May 8, 2010, at 10:03 PM, skellytown flyer wrote: > > well that's one of the problems -it wasn't built to plans-it has quite a bit of stretch and as I understood from a previous post the plans had wrong info anyway. > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297148#297148 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Weight.
From: "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 08, 2010
Well now that's what I need! gonna need a helper but I get it now.instead of using my weight or a pre-determined one at a certain distance.I can do it with the scales and get a real true figure. Probably something I can get done.I know I am way too far forward CG. which is unusual.but that is a way to get some realistic figures. thanks! Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297156#297156 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 08, 2010
From: Ben Charvet <bcharvet(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Weight.
I think I read in one of the Bingelis books to use your bellybutton as your center of gravity, but when I weighed myself in the airplane, my moment was a few inches forward of my bellybutton. I agree with the advice to do your weight and balance with the planned pilot sitting in the pilot's seat, then derive your moment. Ben Charvet On 5/8/2010 11:06 PM, skellytown flyer wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "skellytown flyer" > > Well now that's what I need! gonna need a helper but I get it now.instead of using my weight or a pre-determined one at a certain distance.I can do it with the scales and get a real true figure. Probably something I can get done.I know I am way too far forward CG. which is unusual.but that is a way to get some realistic figures. thanks! Raymond > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297156#297156 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: Gardiner's Corvair issue, or how not to cool the Corvair
in your Pietenpol
Date: May 09, 2010
Rick, Check out http://www.cpc-world.com/new_card_images/images/IMG_0522_JPG.jpg. That's how I did mine and it all worked out OK. I have a section on Corvair cooling under "Engine Construction" on the web site. Cheers Peter Wonthaggi Australia http://www.cpc-world.com From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Holland Sent: Sunday, 9 May 2010 12:07 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Gardiner's Corvair issue, or how not to cool the Corvair in your Pietenpol Interesting writeup from WW, one thing mentioned that I do not have is an air passage between the left and right eyebrow baffles, has anyone seen this on a Corvair/Piet installation? Shouldn't be too hard to add a 2 1/2" Scat hose between my eyebrows. rick On Sat, May 8, 2010 at 6:58 AM, Ryan Mueller wrote: I'm sure many recall the posts Gardiner made to the list recently about the unfortunate problems he encountered with the Corvair engine he has installed in his Pietenpol. There was the suggestion on his part that it may have been due to subpar workmanship during assembly of the engine, which was assembled by one of William Wynne's former hangar crew. Gardiner took the engine down to William Wynne, and a partial teardown and analysis of the engine revealed that it had been suffering from a combination of sketchy timing and inadequate cooling, leading to severe detonation. The timing issue stemmed from having an equally sketchy individual (not related to William or one of his associates) make modifications to the distributor, and the cooling issue stemmed from a number of flaws in Gardiner's particular cooling configuration. William has put a detailed post on his site explaining exactly what happened, and how to avoid these issues: http://flycorvair.com/pietengineissue.html I highly recommend giving it a read if you are at all interested in using a Corvair, or if you are already committed to using one. Plenty of good information. Gardiner, We wish you the best with getting the 'Vair back together and back on your Piet. We hope you can get all the kinks sorted out and are able to fly her to Brodhead this year! We'll be there with our new Piet, and we look forward to seeing yours. Have a nice weekend, Ryan " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Weight.
Date: May 09, 2010
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
Hi Raymond, What I did was to cut a piece of plywood, sit down on it with a pipe under neath so that I could roll back and forth on the pipe to find the balance point. When you sit down make sure your outstretched legs are the same as when each person (front or back) is seated. You can get both seat locatio ns CG easily this way and it will be very accurate. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: skellytown flyer <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Sat, May 8, 2010 6:40 pm Subject: Pietenpol-List: Weight. o.com> can anybody give me a pretty good guess as to where the center of gravity for he pilot or passenger is supposed to be in relation to the seat back? I'm orking to get the W&B figured out on the project I bought from D.J. and th e uselage has been stretched quite a bit.I just don't know whether to use omething like 4 or 5 inches ahead of the bottom of the seat back as the istance for pilot or passenger weight calculations or what. hope someone can nlighten me here. Raymond ead this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297140#297140 ======================== =========== -= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum - -= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse -= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription, -= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, -= Photoshare, and much much more: - -= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - -= Same great content also available via the Web Forums! - -= --> http://forums.matronics.com - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - List Contribution Web Site - -= Thank you for your generous support! -= -Matt Dralle, List Admin. -= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution -======================== ======================== =========== ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 09, 2010
From: hpvs(at)southwind.net
Subject: Re: Pilot CG was Weight.
Hey Raymond, The "best guess" I've used is to figure that your belly button is your seated CG -- i.e. about 10" forward of the seat back and about 10" above the seat bottom (I've used this to figure the CG on recumbent bikes, etc.) -- this may vary in real life depending on the the seat back angle and if you are flying in combat boots or flip-flops! ;-) "just another" Mike C. Pretty Prairie, KS -----Original Message----- >From: skellytown flyer <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com> >Sent: May 8, 2010 7:40 PM >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Weight. > > >can anybody give me a pretty good guess as to where the center of gravity for the pilot or passenger is supposed to be in relation to the seat back? I'm working to get the W&B figured out on the project I bought from D.J. and the fuselage has been stretched quite a bit.I just don't know whether to use something like 4 or 5 inches ahead of the bottom of the seat back as the distance for pilot or passenger weight calculations or what. hope someone can enlighten me here. Raymond > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297140#297140 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Clamps
From: "bcolleran" <bcolleran(at)comcast.net>
Date: May 09, 2010
So I have seen some folks using a circular clamp lately. Is it just a piece of black pvc with a line cut in it? I saw some on cliff dawsons page and it sounds like that is all he used. Any input would be great. Bill Colleran N424BK Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297181#297181 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 09, 2010
From: Tim Willis <timothywillis(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Clamps
Either Clif or one of our other "really scratch builders" posted the method of making such clamps a couple of years ago. You might find it in the archives. However, the same general technique is covered in the current edition (May 2010)of our EAA national magazine-- "Sport Aviation"-- pp. 82-83. The author describes the technique of using 2.5 inch diameter PVC pipe for his material. This is not a common dimension-- I thought they came in 2 inch, 3 inch, etc. Maybe 3 inch schedule 80 pipe has a 2.5 inch I.D.? Our own builder used wooden dowels as the handles. The article uses 1/4" steel rods, bent to form more of a "handle." Tim in central TX -----Original Message----- >From: bcolleran <bcolleran(at)comcast.net> >Sent: May 9, 2010 10:44 AM >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Clamps > > >So I have seen some folks using a circular clamp lately. Is it just a piece of black pvc with a line cut in it? I saw some on cliff dawsons page and it sounds like that is all he used. Any input would be great. > >Bill Colleran >N424BK > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297181#297181 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Michael Silvius" <silvius(at)gwi.net>
Subject: Re: Clamps
Date: May 09, 2010
http://www.sportaviationonline.org/sportaviation/201005#pg84 ----- Original Message ----- From: "bcolleran" <bcolleran(at)comcast.net> > > So I have seen some folks using a circular clamp lately. Is it just a piece of black pvc with a line cut in it? I saw some on cliff dawsons page and it sounds like that is all he used. Any input would be great. > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Gardiner's Corvair issue, or how not to cool the Corvair
in
From: "coxwelljon" <coxwelljon(at)frontiernet.net>
Date: May 09, 2010
William Wynn has put a detailed post on his site explaining exactly what happened, and how to avoid these issues: http://flycorvair.com/pietengineissue.html (http://flycorvair.com/pietengineissue.html) I highly recommend giving it a read if you are at all interested in using a Corvair, or if you are already committed to using one. Plenty of good information. Ryan > > > > [b] Ryan, thank you for posting the link. I will be using a Corvair and the recent information about Gardiner's problem is excellent. Jon Coxwell -------- Jon Coxwell GN-1 Builder Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297194#297194 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 09, 2010
From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov>
Subject: Re: Weight.]
Ryan's instructions are clear but the matronics search interface is somewhat cumbersome (no offence, Matt). There's another, easier way to search the archives using google. Simply add the following sting to any search you want perform specifically on the matronics pietenpol list: site:matronics.com pietenpol So, to search specifically for "landing gear," search like this: site:matronics.com pietenpol "landing gear" For a searches about Lambert or Warner engines: site:matronics.com pietenpol lambert OR warner For search about A65 engines but you don't want to hear what that yocum guy has to say, do this: site:matronics.com pietenpol A65 -yocum Hope this helps, Dan On 05/08/2010 09:02 PM, Ryan Mueller wrote: > Raymond, > > Searching the archives isn't too difficult. First off, you have to get > there. You can find it at: > > http://www.matronics.com/search/ > > The first step is to use the 'Select Archive' dropdown to choose Pietenpol. > > I would leave 'Message Order' at Newest First. > > I like to set 'Output Method' at 3 frame Index. > > Then you arrive at entering your search. There are instructions on the > site. To boil them down: > > If you want to search for one word, just type the word and click Begin > Search. For example, if I want to find all posts that talk about > Stromberg carbs, I'll search for 'stromberg' (minus the quotes). > If I want to search for a phrase, I can just enter the words. Maybe I > want to see what was posted about how to build landing gear. I can enter > 'landing gear', and it will find every post that contains the word > 'landing' that is followed immediately by the word 'gear'. > Maybe I want to find out about how elevator travel might relate to > throttle usage. Well, odds are I won't find a two or three word phrase > containing those words right next to each other that is common to many > posts. In this case I can search for 'elevator & throttle & travel'. > This will show me any posts that contain those three words, whether they > are next to each other or not. > Maybe you decide you want to see if there is any information about > Pietenpols with Warner engines, or with Lambert engines. There may be > posts on the list about one, or the other, but not both. To find them > you can do a search for 'warner | lambert. The | character, which you > can enter by hitting Shift plus the |\ key, means or. So you are > searching for posts that contain the words 'Warner' or 'Lambert', but > not both. > > If you need any more help with searching in the archives please feel > free to shoot me an email. I can talk you through it on the phone if you > are more comfortable with that, just let me know. Good luck! > > Ryan > > > On Sat, May 8, 2010 at 8:03 PM, skellytown flyer > wrote: > > > > > Tom that is good to know.I have never figured out how to search the > archives. maybe that's the reason I come up with questions that have > been covered so often.if you would not mind visiting off list about > it I'd be glad to pick your brain. but what I am trying to use is a > calculator that is available on the Kansas city Dawn patrol > website.I have the distances measured on my airplane using the > firewall as a datum.as <http://datum.as> well as empty weights at > the wheels and everything level.if I could just get a good > centerline for pilot weight.I seem to remember reading once it would > be at about a person's hip bone when sitting. that probably depends > on the reclining angle.and whether it is a normal person or someone > like me with long legs.but the figures I am coming up with sure > don't look usable. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297144#297144 > > > ========== > st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > ========== > http://forums.matronics.com > ========== > le, List Admin. > ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ========== > > > * > > > * -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB" <steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil>
Date: May 09, 2010
Subject: Re: Ethanol in Mogas-- more coming
Everything Around Austin is 10% liquor as well. NW Oklahoma has all sorts of signs that say "No Ethanol in our Gas" and this is in the middle of Farm country! Blue Skies, Steve D ----- Original Message ----- From: coxwelljon <coxwelljon(at)frontiernet.net> Date: Friday, May 7, 2010 23:09 Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Ethanol in Mogas-- more coming > > All stations in central NY are 10% ethanol. Traveled in SW Colorado last week and all the stations I saw there were also 10%. > > -------- > Jon Coxwell > GN-1 Builder > Recycle and preserve the planet > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297097#297097 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 09, 2010
Subject: Re: Gardiner's Corvair issue, or how not to cool the
Corvair in your Pietenpol
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
Beautiful sheet metal work Peter, interesting that not even an external oil cooler solved your problems until you stuck it out in the airstream. My 12 plate cooler keeps my oil temps in range on the test stand so far but I kno w that means nothing until its in the air. rick On Sun, May 9, 2010 at 1:35 AM, Peter W Johnson wro > Rick, > > > Check out http://www.cpc-world.com/new_card_images/images/IMG_0522_JPG.jp g > . > > > That=92s how I did mine and it all worked out OK. I have a section on Cor vair > cooling under =93Engine Construction=94 on the web site. > > > Cheers > > > Peter > > Wonthaggi Australia > > http://www.cpc-world.com > > > *From:* owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto: > owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Rick Holland > *Sent:* Sunday, 9 May 2010 12:07 PM > *To:* pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > *Subject:* Re: Pietenpol-List: Gardiner's Corvair issue, or how not to > cool the Corvair in your Pietenpol > > > Interesting writeup from WW, one thing mentioned that I do not have is an > air passage between the left and right eyebrow baffles, has anyone seen t his > on a Corvair/Piet installation? Shouldn't be too hard to add a 2 1/2" Sca t > hose between my eyebrows. > > rick > > On Sat, May 8, 2010 at 6:58 AM, Ryan Mueller wrote : > > I'm sure many recall the posts Gardiner made to the list recently about t he > unfortunate problems he encountered with the Corvair engine he has instal led > in his Pietenpol. There was the suggestion on his part that it may have b een > due to subpar workmanship during assembly of the engine, which was assemb led > by one of William Wynne's former hangar crew. Gardiner took the engine do wn > to William Wynne, and a partial teardown and analysis of the engine revea led > that it had been suffering from a combination of sketchy timing and > inadequate cooling, leading to severe detonation. The timing issue stemme d > from having an equally sketchy individual (not related to William or one of > his associates) make modifications to the distributor, and the cooling is sue > stemmed from a number of flaws in Gardiner's particular cooling > configuration. William has put a detailed post on his site explaining > exactly what happened, and how to avoid these issues: > > http://flycorvair.com/pietengineissue.html > > I highly recommend giving it a read if you are at all interested in using a > Corvair, or if you are already committed to using one. Plenty of good > information. > > Gardiner, > > We wish you the best with getting the 'Vair back together and back on you r > Piet. We hope you can get all the kinks sorted out and are able to fly he r > to Brodhead this year! We'll be there with our new Piet, and we look forw ard > to seeing yours. Have a nice weekend, > > Ryan > > > * * > > * * > > *" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List* > > *tp://forums.matronics.com* > > *_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > > * * > > > -- > Rick Holland > Castle Rock, Colorado > > "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" > > * * > > * * > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List* > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://forums.matronics.com* > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > > ** > > * * > > * > =========== =========== =========== =========== > * > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 10, 2010
From: Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Google!
Ok, now that's just about the neatest thing! I use the matronics search engine regularly and this will sure help! Very cool. thanks Dan! -----Original Message----- >From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov> >Sent: May 9, 2010 10:21 PM >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: seaching matronics archives [was: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Weight.] > > >Ryan's instructions are clear but the matronics search interface is >somewhat cumbersome (no offence, Matt). > >There's another, easier way to search the archives using google. Simply >add the following sting to any search you want perform specifically on >the matronics pietenpol list: > >site:matronics.com pietenpol > >So, to search specifically for "landing gear," search like this: > >site:matronics.com pietenpol "landing gear" > >For a searches about Lambert or Warner engines: > >site:matronics.com pietenpol lambert OR warner > >For search about A65 engines but you don't want to hear what that yocum >guy has to say, do this: > >site:matronics.com pietenpol A65 -yocum > >Hope this helps, >Dan > > >On 05/08/2010 09:02 PM, Ryan Mueller wrote: >> Raymond, >> >> Searching the archives isn't too difficult. First off, you have to get >> there. You can find it at: >> >> http://www.matronics.com/search/ >> >> The first step is to use the 'Select Archive' dropdown to choose Pietenpol. >> >> I would leave 'Message Order' at Newest First. >> >> I like to set 'Output Method' at 3 frame Index. >> >> Then you arrive at entering your search. There are instructions on the >> site. To boil them down: >> >> If you want to search for one word, just type the word and click Begin >> Search. For example, if I want to find all posts that talk about >> Stromberg carbs, I'll search for 'stromberg' (minus the quotes). >> If I want to search for a phrase, I can just enter the words. Maybe I >> want to see what was posted about how to build landing gear. I can enter >> 'landing gear', and it will find every post that contains the word >> 'landing' that is followed immediately by the word 'gear'. >> Maybe I want to find out about how elevator travel might relate to >> throttle usage. Well, odds are I won't find a two or three word phrase >> containing those words right next to each other that is common to many >> posts. In this case I can search for 'elevator & throttle & travel'. >> This will show me any posts that contain those three words, whether they >> are next to each other or not. >> Maybe you decide you want to see if there is any information about >> Pietenpols with Warner engines, or with Lambert engines. There may be >> posts on the list about one, or the other, but not both. To find them >> you can do a search for 'warner | lambert. The | character, which you >> can enter by hitting Shift plus the |\ key, means or. So you are >> searching for posts that contain the words 'Warner' or 'Lambert', but >> not both. >> >> If you need any more help with searching in the archives please feel >> free to shoot me an email. I can talk you through it on the phone if you >> are more comfortable with that, just let me know. Good luck! >> >> Ryan >> >> >> >> On Sat, May 8, 2010 at 8:03 PM, skellytown flyer > > wrote: >> >> > >> >> Tom that is good to know.I have never figured out how to search the >> archives. maybe that's the reason I come up with questions that have >> been covered so often.if you would not mind visiting off list about >> it I'd be glad to pick your brain. but what I am trying to use is a >> calculator that is available on the Kansas city Dawn patrol >> website.I have the distances measured on my airplane using the >> firewall as a datum.as <http://datum.as> well as empty weights at >> the wheels and everything level.if I could just get a good >> centerline for pilot weight.I seem to remember reading once it would >> be at about a person's hip bone when sitting. that probably depends >> on the reclining angle.and whether it is a normal person or someone >> like me with long legs.but the figures I am coming up with sure >> don't look usable. >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297144#297144 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ========== >> st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >> ========== >> http://forums.matronics.com >> ========== >> le, List Admin. >> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> ========== >> >> >> >> >> * >> >> >> * > >-- >Dan Yocum >Fermilab 630.840.6509 >yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov >"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 10, 2010
From: John Egan <johnegan99(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Airleron cable turnbuckle locations
Builders,=0A=0ARegarding the fabrication of cables-and location of turnbu ckles for the aileron cables running to the control stick:=0A=0A1.- Have you guys found that having a two piece cable, where it breaks at the root o f the wing-assists in assembly and dismantling of the wings where it warr ents doing it?- =0A=0A2.- If so, do you use-clevises to make a splice (as Bengilis), or place the turnbuckle in between the wing and the center section which can be used for the splice and for tensioning?=0A=0A3.- Reg ardless of assembly, is there any advantage or disadvantage in having the t urnbuckle in the wing instead of at the control stick?=0A=0AThank you all. - I think I'll go with the proven majority on this one. I appreciate your help.=0A=0Ajohn egan=0Agreenville, wi=0A=0A=0A ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 10, 2010
From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu>
Subject: Peter's trim
Peter, I just noticed what looks to be a trim wheel on the right side of your cockpit. Did your system work, and if so, do you have design details at your website? I couldn't find anything. Thanks, Jeff -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..." ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pilot CG was Weight.
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: May 10, 2010
Zing! -- Hey, wait a minute... I resemble that remark. [Shocked] -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297261#297261 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 10, 2010
From: Ken Howe <ken@cooper-mtn.com>
Subject: Re: Clamps
I used 4" pipe because I needed a big enough opening to fit over the 1/2" capstrip, a gusset on each side, a 3/16" plywood caul (spreads the pressure), and the 3/4" jig baseboard. I used oak dowels for the handles, which I found at Home Despot. Use a hot glue gun to hold the handles in position at the back side of the clamp. Pictures are attached, one showing the clamp itself, and one that shows how they work on my rib jig. bcolleran wrote: > > So I have seen some folks using a circular clamp lately. Is it just a piece of black pvc with a line cut in it? I saw some on cliff dawsons page and it sounds like that is all he used. Any input would be great. > > Bill Colleran > N424BK > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297181#297181 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 10, 2010
From: Ben Charvet <bcharvet(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Airleron cable turnbuckle locations
Just for simplicity sake I put all my turnbuckles on the aileron bellcranks. The crossover cable joins in the center with a clevis. I put my joint in the center, but it would have been better closer to one side (easier to assemble). The upper cables are one-piece from the aileron to the control stick. This makes it necessary to remove the pulleys on the center section to assemble the wing, but it wasn't a big deal for my setup. All this needs to be done before you cover the wings, then it goes pretty smoothly when it comes time for final assembly. There are other ways it could be done with less turnbuckles, I suppose, but I got a good deal on a bunch of them from B&B, around $7.50 each, which is cheaper than a clevis. Ben Charvet Mims, Fl On 5/10/2010 9:45 AM, John Egan wrote: > Builders, > Regarding the fabrication of cables and location of turnbuckles for > the aileron cables running to the control stick: > 1. Have you guys found that having a two piece cable, where it breaks > at the root of the wing assists in assembly and dismantling of the > wings where it warrents doing it? > 2. If so, do you use clevises to make a splice (as Bengilis), or > place the turnbuckle in between the wing and the center section which > can be used for the splice and for tensioning? > 3. Regardless of assembly, is there any advantage or disadvantage in > having the turnbuckle in the wing instead of at the control stick? > Thank you all. I think I'll go with the proven majority on this one. > I appreciate your help. > john egan > greenville, wi > > * > > > * ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clif Dawson" <CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Clamps
Date: May 10, 2010
Yep, that looks good. I put my handles through to the split side. Definitely put handles on the things. It makes a world of difference! Clif > > http://www.sportaviationonline.org/sportaviation/201005#pg84 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: Peter's trim
Date: May 11, 2010
Jeff, Yes the trim system did work quite well. I originally had a lever in its place to tension the cables on the elevator horn but couldn't get enough travel. I came up with the idea of wrapping the cables round a piece of pvc tube suitably mounted on the fuse side. http://www.cpc-world.com/new_card_images/images/IMG_0710_JPG.jpg shows the concept. I don't have much else in the way of design details. A bit of a "back of a fag (cigarette) packet" design. Cheers Peter -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Boatright Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 2010 12:10 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim Peter, I just noticed what looks to be a trim wheel on the right side of your cockpit. Did your system work, and if so, do you have design details at your website? I couldn't find anything. Thanks, Jeff -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..." ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 10, 2010
From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu>
Subject: Peter's trim
Peter, I poked around and found several more photos on your site showing how the cable that wraps around the trim wheel attach to the Big Bell Crank behind the pilot's seat. I feel like the SECOND guy who invented the zipper. Your design and implementation are nearly exactly how I envisioned a trim system, which is to say, I was still at the "back of a fag packet" stage until you told me that your system works. Now that I hear it will work, I'm Oh-ficially at the "build it" stage. Thanks, Jeff > > >Jeff, > >Yes the trim system did work quite well. > >I originally had a lever in its place to tension the cables on the elevator >horn but couldn't get enough travel. I came up with the idea of wrapping the >cables round a piece of pvc tube suitably mounted on the fuse side. > >http://www.cpc-world.com/new_card_images/images/IMG_0710_JPG.jpg shows the >concept. > >I don't have much else in the way of design details. A bit of a "back of a >fag (cigarette) packet" design. > >Cheers > >Peter > > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff >Boatright >Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 2010 12:10 AM >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com; vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim > > >Peter, > >I just noticed what looks to be a trim wheel on the right side of >your cockpit. Did your system work, and if so, do you have design >details at your website? I couldn't find anything. > >Thanks, > >Jeff >-- > >Jeff Boatright >"Now let's think about this..." > > -- --- Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Ophthalmology Emory University School of Medicine Editor-in-Chief Molecular Vision ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: Peter's trim
Date: May 11, 2010
Jeff, Nice to see the pictures are useful. Maybe I should patent the "fag packet"; although I'm sure it already is :-) Cheers Peter -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Boatright Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 2010 9:29 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim Peter, I poked around and found several more photos on your site showing how the cable that wraps around the trim wheel attach to the Big Bell Crank behind the pilot's seat. I feel like the SECOND guy who invented the zipper. Your design and implementation are nearly exactly how I envisioned a trim system, which is to say, I was still at the "back of a fag packet" stage until you told me that your system works. Now that I hear it will work, I'm Oh-ficially at the "build it" stage. Thanks, Jeff > > >Jeff, > >Yes the trim system did work quite well. > >I originally had a lever in its place to tension the cables on the elevator >horn but couldn't get enough travel. I came up with the idea of wrapping the >cables round a piece of pvc tube suitably mounted on the fuse side. > >http://www.cpc-world.com/new_card_images/images/IMG_0710_JPG.jpg shows the >concept. > >I don't have much else in the way of design details. A bit of a "back of a >fag (cigarette) packet" design. > >Cheers > >Peter > > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff >Boatright >Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 2010 12:10 AM >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com; vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim > > >Peter, > >I just noticed what looks to be a trim wheel on the right side of >your cockpit. Did your system work, and if so, do you have design >details at your website? I couldn't find anything. > >Thanks, > >Jeff >-- > >Jeff Boatright >"Now let's think about this..." > > -- --- Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Ophthalmology Emory University School of Medicine Editor-in-Chief Molecular Vision ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Peter's Wiring Diagram
Date: May 10, 2010
Peter, I would also like to compliment you on your wiring diagram. I was just about ready to post a request for info, but decided to check the archives, first, and found an old post! Hope you don't mind that I have regurgitated it here. I was looking for something simple...no lights, no radios, no glass panel, no GPS, no night terrain following..... Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion, mounted Tail done, Fuselage on gear (18 ribs down.) -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peter W Johnson Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 5:15 PM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim Jeff, Nice to see the pictures are useful. Maybe I should patent the "fag packet"; although I'm sure it already is :-) Cheers Peter -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Boatright Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 2010 9:29 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim Peter, I poked around and found several more photos on your site showing how the cable that wraps around the trim wheel attach to the Big Bell Crank behind the pilot's seat. I feel like the SECOND guy who invented the zipper. Your design and implementation are nearly exactly how I envisioned a trim system, which is to say, I was still at the "back of a fag packet" stage until you told me that your system works. Now that I hear it will work, I'm Oh-ficially at the "build it" stage. Thanks, Jeff > > >Jeff, > >Yes the trim system did work quite well. > >I originally had a lever in its place to tension the cables on the elevator >horn but couldn't get enough travel. I came up with the idea of wrapping the >cables round a piece of pvc tube suitably mounted on the fuse side. > >http://www.cpc-world.com/new_card_images/images/IMG_0710_JPG.jpg shows the >concept. > >I don't have much else in the way of design details. A bit of a "back of a >fag (cigarette) packet" design. > >Cheers > >Peter > > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff >Boatright >Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 2010 12:10 AM >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com; vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim > > >Peter, > >I just noticed what looks to be a trim wheel on the right side of >your cockpit. Did your system work, and if so, do you have design >details at your website? I couldn't find anything. > >Thanks, > >Jeff >-- > >Jeff Boatright >"Now let's think about this..." > > -- --- Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Ophthalmology Emory University School of Medicine Editor-in-Chief Molecular Vision ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gcardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Airleron cable turnbuckle locations
Date: May 10, 2010
John, On NX18235 the aileron cables are one piece with the turnbuckles located in the cockpit at the torque-tube control horn. Pulleys in the center-section need to be disassembled to remove the cables in the rare event of removing the wings. Greg Cardinal ----- Original Message ----- From: John Egan To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 8:45 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Airleron cable turnbuckle locations Builders, Regarding the fabrication of cables and location of turnbuckles for the aileron cables running to the control stick: 1. Have you guys found that having a two piece cable, where it breaks at the root of the wing assists in assembly and dismantling of the wings where it warrents doing it? 2. If so, do you use clevises to make a splice (as Bengilis), or place the turnbuckle in between the wing and the center section which can be used for the splice and for tensioning? 3. Regardless of assembly, is there any advantage or disadvantage in having the turnbuckle in the wing instead of at the control stick? Thank you all. I think I'll go with the proven majority on this one. I appreciate your help. john egan greenville, wi ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Peter's trim
Date: May 10, 2010
Peter, Very nice - neat & simple - keep smoking :). Kip Gardner On May 10, 2010, at 6:58 PM, Peter W Johnson wrote: > > > Jeff, > > Yes the trim system did work quite well. > > I originally had a lever in its place to tension the cables on the > elevator > horn but couldn't get enough travel. I came up with the idea of > wrapping the > cables round a piece of pvc tube suitably mounted on the fuse side. > > http://www.cpc-world.com/new_card_images/images/IMG_0710_JPG.jpg > shows the > concept. > > I don't have much else in the way of design details. A bit of a > "back of a > fag (cigarette) packet" design. > > Cheers > > Peter > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff > Boatright > Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 2010 12:10 AM > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com; vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim > > > > Peter, > > I just noticed what looks to be a trim wheel on the right side of > your cockpit. Did your system work, and if so, do you have design > details at your website? I couldn't find anything. > > Thanks, > > Jeff > -- > > Jeff Boatright > "Now let's think about this..." > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: Peter's Wiring Diagram
Date: May 11, 2010
Gary, The original KISS technique!! Thanks Peter -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Boothe Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 2010 10:30 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Peter's Wiring Diagram Peter, I would also like to compliment you on your wiring diagram. I was just about ready to post a request for info, but decided to check the archives, first, and found an old post! Hope you don't mind that I have regurgitated it here. I was looking for something simple...no lights, no radios, no glass panel, no GPS, no night terrain following..... Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion, mounted Tail done, Fuselage on gear (18 ribs down.) -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peter W Johnson Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 5:15 PM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim Jeff, Nice to see the pictures are useful. Maybe I should patent the "fag packet"; although I'm sure it already is :-) Cheers Peter -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Boatright Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 2010 9:29 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim Peter, I poked around and found several more photos on your site showing how the cable that wraps around the trim wheel attach to the Big Bell Crank behind the pilot's seat. I feel like the SECOND guy who invented the zipper. Your design and implementation are nearly exactly how I envisioned a trim system, which is to say, I was still at the "back of a fag packet" stage until you told me that your system works. Now that I hear it will work, I'm Oh-ficially at the "build it" stage. Thanks, Jeff > > >Jeff, > >Yes the trim system did work quite well. > >I originally had a lever in its place to tension the cables on the >elevator horn but couldn't get enough travel. I came up with the idea >of wrapping the >cables round a piece of pvc tube suitably mounted on the fuse side. > >http://www.cpc-world.com/new_card_images/images/IMG_0710_JPG.jpg shows >the concept. > >I don't have much else in the way of design details. A bit of a "back >of a fag (cigarette) packet" design. > >Cheers > >Peter > > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com >[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff >Boatright >Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 2010 12:10 AM >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com; vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim > >--> > >Peter, > >I just noticed what looks to be a trim wheel on the right side of your >cockpit. Did your system work, and if so, do you have design details at >your website? I couldn't find anything. > >Thanks, > >Jeff >-- > >Jeff Boatright >"Now let's think about this..." > > -- --- Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Ophthalmology Emory University School of Medicine Editor-in-Chief Molecular Vision ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Airleron cable turnbuckle locations
Date: May 11, 2010
I've had the wings off of 41CC to trailer it, and the way Corky set it up, it's very easy to disconnect the aileron control cables and re-rig it back later. The cross-connect cable has a connecting link in the middle of the centersection, like most of the others who responded. The adjustment turnbuckles are in the cockpit, down at the torque tube arms... again, like most others. What makes it easy to connect and disconnect the cables and wings is that the centersection pulleys don't need to be fiddled with because the cables have a connecting link AFTER they go through the pulleys. These connecting links (similar to motorcycle chain links but with cottered or safety-wired clevis pins) are accessible through inspection holes on the bottom of the wing. Yes, it's a bit of a pain to adjust and safety the turnbuckles down in the cockpit, but it's not something you need to do very often and they are easy to inspect there. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Ohio Fly-In of Interest
Date: May 11, 2010
Group, My EAA Chapter is having a Fly-in that should be of interest to Pieters, particularly those of us using those 'crank-snapping' corvairs, to wit: EAA 82 is having it's 4th Annual "WINGS AND WHEELS FLY-IN" on Saturday and Sunday, June 5 & 6th at Barber Airport (2D1). The field is located approximately three miles north of Alliance, Ohio on State Route 225. There will be aircraft with automotive and alternative engines - CORVAIRS AND VOLKSWAGENS on display. Ther will be a pancake breakfast on Saturday and Sunday from 7 till 11 AM with lunch on Saturday from noon till 2 PM. This event is open to the public. There will be homebuilt aircraft ( KR-2S's, Pietenpols, an Afford-a- Plane), PRA #19 (Rotorcraft Chapter) will have trikes and a demonstrator, and Vintage and Antique aircraft (Waco 9, Fleet, Taylorcrafts) on the field. There will be a fleet of some nicely restored Corvair cars on display. There will be several Corvair engines and a "Roy's Garage" Fifth Bearing on display for those who are interested in using a Corvair in their project. *************Roy Szarafinski of Roy's Garage will be present to answer questions about his bearing and will gladly check your engine cases for proper tolerances before you start an engine rebuild.********* The fly-in hours will be Saturday... 7 AM - 4 PM and Sunday... 7 AM - 2 PM. For more information, contact Ron Willett @ 330-314-0075 or Pete Klapp @ 330-388-2074, and Forrest Barber (FBO) at WWW.BARBERAIRCRAFT.COM. We can provide lodging for those who would be flying in for our event. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Cool altimeter on ebay
Date: May 11, 2010
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
Item #350351022733 WW1 British Altimeter Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 11, 2010
Subject: Re: Airleron cable turnbuckle locations
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
Greg So you use three turnbuckles total for all your aileron cables? Two on the torque tube control horn and one in the center of your center section? rick On Mon, May 10, 2010 at 7:49 PM, gcardinal wrote: > John, > > On NX18235 the aileron cables are one piece with the turnbuckles located in > the cockpit at the torque-tube control horn. > Pulleys in the center-section need to be disassembled to remove the cables > in the rare event of removing the wings. > > Greg Cardinal > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* John Egan > *To:* pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > *Sent:* Monday, May 10, 2010 8:45 AM > *Subject:* Pietenpol-List: Airleron cable turnbuckle locations > > Builders, > > Regarding the fabrication of cables and location of turnbuckles for the > aileron cables running to the control stick: > > 1. Have you guys found that having a two piece cable, where it breaks at > the root of the wing assists in assembly and dismantling of the wings where > it warrents doing it? > > 2. If so, do you use clevises to make a splice (as Bengilis), or place the > turnbuckle in between the wing and the center section which can be used for > the splice and for tensioning? > > 3. Regardless of assembly, is there any advantage or disadvantage in > having the turnbuckle in the wing instead of at the control stick? > > Thank you all. I think I'll go with the proven majority on this one. I > appreciate your help. > > john egan > greenville, wi > > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c* > > * > > > * > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 11, 2010
From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov>
Subject: Re: Peter's trim
Jeff, How do you get to the bellcrank behind the seat? Isn't your seat glued in place? I should take the nauga off my seat and see if I can get back there - I'd like a trim system like this, too. My partner-in-crime last Wednesday was Dan Thurnau. He's about 210 and boy, did I have to push the stick forward to keep 'er flying straight. Thanks, in advance, Dan On 05/10/2010 06:28 PM, Jeff Boatright wrote: > > Peter, > > I poked around and found several more photos on your site showing how > the cable that wraps around the trim wheel attach to the Big Bell Crank > behind the pilot's seat. I feel like the SECOND guy who invented the > zipper. Your design and implementation are nearly exactly how I > envisioned a trim system, which is to say, I was still at the "back of a > fag packet" stage until you told me that your system works. Now that I > hear it will work, I'm Oh-ficially at the "build it" stage. > > Thanks, > > Jeff > -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gcardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Airleron cable turnbuckle locations
Date: May 11, 2010
That is correct. Greg ----- Original Message ----- From: Rick Holland To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 2010 11:12 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Airleron cable turnbuckle locations Greg So you use three turnbuckles total for all your aileron cables? Two on the torque tube control horn and one in the center of your center section? rick On Mon, May 10, 2010 at 7:49 PM, gcardinal wrote: John, On NX18235 the aileron cables are one piece with the turnbuckles located in the cockpit at the torque-tube control horn. Pulleys in the center-section need to be disassembled to remove the cables in the rare event of removing the wings. Greg Cardinal ----- Original Message ----- From: John Egan To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 8:45 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Airleron cable turnbuckle locations Builders, Regarding the fabrication of cables and location of turnbuckles for the aileron cables running to the control stick: 1. Have you guys found that having a two piece cable, where it breaks at the root of the wing assists in assembly and dismantling of the wings where it warrents doing it? 2. If so, do you use clevises to make a splice (as Bengilis), or place the turnbuckle in between the wing and the center section which can be used for the splice and for tensioning? 3. Regardless of assembly, is there any advantage or disadvantage in having the turnbuckle in the wing instead of at the control stick? Thank you all. I think I'll go with the proven majority on this one. I appreciate your help. john egan greenville, wi href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 11, 2010
From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu>
Subject: Re: Peter's trim
Hey Dan, I didn't describe the plan well. The bellcrank is accessible from under the fuselage by two inspection panel holes that are below the bellcrank. I have tested and I can reach both ends of the bellcrank through these holes. It will be challenging, but with some Zen meditation, planning, and pre-construction of as much of the system as possible, it should be doable. Beer might help, too. HTH, Jeff PS: Flying straight is highly over-rated. > >Jeff, > >How do you get to the bellcrank behind the seat? Isn't your seat >glued in place? > >I should take the nauga off my seat and see if I can get back there >- I'd like a trim system like this, too. > >My partner-in-crime last Wednesday was Dan Thurnau. He's about 210 >and boy, did I have to push the stick forward to keep 'er flying >straight. > >Thanks, in advance, >Dan > -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..." ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 11, 2010
From: Rodrigo Liberato <ditoliberato(at)terra.com.br>
Subject: Rotec Engine
Hi everyone, since building is kind of slow down here, Id like to ask Dick N. and the others about the Rotec Radial. Recently I bumped into their site and got hooked right away. Than it lead me to Dicks airplane pics and its a perfect match (just focusing on the looks). Besides price, what do you think of this pathway? Cheers Rodrigo - Brazil ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: horiz stab and elevator
From: "bcolleran" <bcolleran(at)comcast.net>
Date: May 11, 2010
So I started the construction of the horizontal stab and elevator tonight. I have one question. What size wood are you using on the beams between the LE and TE on the sides. I was going to use a piece of 1"x1" the same as the main beam just not routed out. What is your thoughts? Bill Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297439#297439 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Airleron cable turnbuckle locations
From: "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 11, 2010
it is probably not helping you since I have the GN-1 but I put a turnbuckle on each down aileron cable in the middle of my center section and used a ling i made for the up cross cable.have the Nico/thimbles on both.I can just undo the turnbuckles and have a big enough hole in the center section end rib so that the cable end will pass through to remove the wings leaving the rest of the cables in the fuselage and center section.seemed like the simples way to make it work even though I was making a large cover on the bottom of the center section to access it.if I need to tighten the up elevator cable much I'll need to either make a little shorter link or slip a little larger bushing on the through bolts. as it is I used 3/16" bolts in the link and cut some short bushings from 1/4" stainless steel tubing after I drilled it out to go over the bolts just so the thimbles wouldn't be wearing directly on the bolts.for just a slight tension increase I believe it would be OK to put a twist or two in the cable.probably some will throw a shoe on that one but I doubt in the 20 plus feet of cable that would put any significant strain on the cable.Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297449#297449 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 11, 2010
From: jorge lizarraga <flightwood(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: horiz stab and elevator
that is great- for my case I used the same way to australian piet buildin g laminate le and beams not router I don have it the web side from australi an iswww.cpc-world.com these give you alot ideas easy way and safe and incl ude video for the first fly and my tail used same as plans in these moment 3/4by 1" i think , i hope these help you and we seyou nex jorge from hanfor d --- On Tue, 5/11/10, bcolleran wrote: From: bcolleran <bcolleran(at)comcast.net> Subject: Pietenpol-List: horiz stab and elevator Date: Tuesday, May 11, 2010, 5:26 PM So I started the construction of the horizontal stab and elevator tonight. - I have one question.- What size wood are you using on the beams betwe en the LE and TE on the sides.- I was going to use a piece of 1"x1" the s ame as the main beam just not routed out.- What is your thoughts? Bill Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297439#297439 le, List Admin. =0A=0A=0A ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 12, 2010
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Rotec Engine
Rodrigo, here is my personal opinion. I love radial engines, but I am not a big fan of the- Rotecs. I do not know much about them, but I do know tha t they have an internal gear reduction unit. This unit seems to give them a bit of a whine which I do not care for.- Again, in my opinion, they look a bit large for the Pietenpol as well, both in the number of cylinders and the actual diameter of the engine. - I am looking for a more vintage radial for my Piet., so if anyone ever hear s of such a thing for sale, please let me know! - If Rotec is listening...if they make a 5 cylinder, 90 HP, non whining radia l cheap enough for most home builders to afford...they would make a killing ! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 12, 2010
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Epoxy smudges with varnish
Curious, is it necessary to sand off any epoxy smudges prior to varnish? I wonder if the varnish covers them up nicely or do the smudges show through? - Thanks. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 12, 2010
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: horiz stab and elevator
Well, you will pay a small weight penilty if you use solid 1" spruce on the ends as opposed to the normal "routed" type. One way to get that same shap e is to epoxy two pieces together. (Picture attached)- The other picture is of the tapered sides for the elevators. I modified my elevators some, so the taper is more pronounced. - Looking ahead to covering... if you use the solid 1" spruce, that wide 1" f lat will be visable under the fabric. You'll see that 1" border on those si des, where as if routed it is 1/4". - - ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 12, 2010
From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov>
Subject: Re: Epoxy smudges with varnish
The epoxy will seal the wood just as well, if not better, than varnish. So, unless the part you're varnishing is visible I don't see the need to sand the epoxy off prior to sealing it with varnish. Now, if the part you're varnishing is visible, i.e., in the cockpit, the varnish may not adhere to the epoxy nicely and it may not look as nice. I'd probably sand or scrape (with a sharp paint scraper) the epoxy off prior to varnishing. Dan On 05/12/2010 09:42 AM, Michael Perez wrote: > Curious, is it necessary to sand off any epoxy smudges prior to varnish? > I wonder if the varnish covers them up nicely or do the smudges show > through? Thanks. > > * > > > * -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 12, 2010
From: shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: can't get any flying done
Well guys, I still don't have the annual done on 92gb, I have been working on a hanger addition, to get my tractors out of the main hanger area. It is a mudy mess! I hope to have both the Piet, and the hanger done before the Ohio Piet "Party", on june 19. Putting up a pole barn without help is making me wish I was still in my 20's, it hurts more now than it used to. At least I haven't missed any good flying weather since last week, I think I will go out and play in the mud now, happy flying. "You gotta be tough, when you're dumb." Shad ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: horiz stab and elevator
From: "Catdesigns" <Catdesigns(at)att.net>
Date: May 12, 2010
Bill, This is how I built horizontal stab and elevator. http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/Tail_Wood_Piece_Location.jpg Chris -------- Chris Sacramento, CA WestCoastPiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297501#297501 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 12, 2010
From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov>
Subject: Re: Peter's trim
Jeff, On 05/11/2010 06:27 PM, Jeff Boatright wrote: > > Hey Dan, > > I didn't describe the plan well. The bellcrank is accessible from under > the fuselage by two inspection panel holes that are below the bellcrank. > I have tested and I can reach both ends of the bellcrank through these > holes. It will be challenging, but with some Zen meditation, planning, > and pre-construction of as much of the system as possible, it should be > doable. Beer might help, too. How are you going to "attach" the trim cables to the elevator bell crank? This is how Mike has his arranged: http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Mike%20Cuy%20A-65%20Piet/trim_detail_on_bellcrank_and_belly_door_panel_alum_sheet.jpg That little extra bell crank welded on the right side (in the picture) of the bar is attached to the trim knob under the seat, here: http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Mike%20Cuy%20A-65%20Piet/seat_framework_and_trim_lever_setup.jpg Thanks, Dan -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 12, 2010
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Epoxy smudges with varnish
You are right Dan, I meant where visible. Thanks. - ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 12, 2010
From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu>
Subject: Re: Peter's trim
I figured I'd attach the cables to the pin shackles already in place on the bell crank ends to which the main control cables are already attached to. The trim cables will go off to the left, so they shouldn't foul the control cables. I'm open to suggestions, though. > >Jeff, > >On 05/11/2010 06:27 PM, Jeff Boatright wrote: >> >>Hey Dan, >> >>I didn't describe the plan well. The bellcrank is accessible from under >>the fuselage by two inspection panel holes that are below the bellcrank. >>I have tested and I can reach both ends of the bellcrank through these >>holes. It will be challenging, but with some Zen meditation, planning, >>and pre-construction of as much of the system as possible, it should be >>doable. Beer might help, too. > >How are you going to "attach" the trim cables to the elevator bell >crank? This is how Mike has his arranged: > >http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Mike%20Cuy%20A-65%20Piet/trim_detail_on_bellcrank_and_belly_door_panel_alum_sheet.jpg > >That little extra bell crank welded on the right side (in the >picture) of the bar is attached to the trim knob under the seat, >here: > >http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Mike%20Cuy%20A-65%20Piet/seat_framework_and_trim_lever_setup.jpg > >Thanks, >Dan > > >-- >Dan Yocum >Fermilab 630.840.6509 >yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov >"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." > -- --- Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Ophthalmology Emory University School of Medicine Editor-in-Chief Molecular Vision ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 12, 2010
Subject: Re: Peter's trim
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
This is the was to provide bellcrank access. Mine is a bit smaller but same idea. rick On Tue, May 11, 2010 at 5:27 PM, Jeff Boatright wrote: > > Hey Dan, > > I didn't describe the plan well. The bellcrank is accessible from under the > fuselage by two inspection panel holes that are below the bellcrank. I have > tested and I can reach both ends of the bellcrank through these holes. It > will be challenging, but with some Zen meditation, planning, and > pre-construction of as much of the system as possible, it should be doable. > Beer might help, too. > > HTH, > > Jeff > > PS: Flying straight is highly over-rated. > > >> >> Jeff, >> >> How do you get to the bellcrank behind the seat? Isn't your seat glued in >> place? >> >> I should take the nauga off my seat and see if I can get back there - I'd >> like a trim system like this, too. >> >> My partner-in-crime last Wednesday was Dan Thurnau. He's about 210 and >> boy, did I have to push the stick forward to keep 'er flying straight. >> >> Thanks, in advance, >> Dan >> >> > > -- > > Jeff Boatright > "Now let's think about this..." > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: tightness of fit?
From: "bcolleran" <bcolleran(at)comcast.net>
Date: May 12, 2010
So I started today on the horizontal stab as the first piece that I am building. I have about enough room to slide a piece of paper in the tightness of my fit between my diagonal braces. Is that too much or will the t-88 expand and make up for it? Thanks, Bill N424BK Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297533#297533 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 12, 2010
Subject: Re: Peter's Wiring Diagram
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
Talking about wiring diagrams, if anyone is interested I posted a jpg of my Corviar/Piet wiring diagram if anyone is interested. Hasn't flown yet but everything works fine through an hour of test running. http://picasaweb.google.com/at7000ft/DropBox?authkey=Gv1sRgCIz1y77h75vb8gE#slideshow/5470444710890360866 rick On Mon, May 10, 2010 at 6:29 PM, Gary Boothe wrote: > Peter, > > I would also like to compliment you on your wiring diagram. I was just > about > ready to post a request for info, but decided to check the archives, first, > and found an old post! Hope you don't mind that I have regurgitated it > here. > > I was looking for something simple...no lights, no radios, no glass panel, > no GPS, no night terrain following..... > > Gary Boothe > Cool, Ca. > Pietenpol > WW Corvair Conversion, mounted > Tail done, Fuselage on gear > (18 ribs down.) > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peter W > Johnson > Sent: Monday, May 10, 2010 5:15 PM > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim > > > > Jeff, > > Nice to see the pictures are useful. Maybe I should patent the "fag > packet"; > although I'm sure it already is :-) > > Cheers > > Peter > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff > Boatright > Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 2010 9:29 AM > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim > > > Peter, > > I poked around and found several more photos on your site showing how > the cable that wraps around the trim wheel attach to the Big Bell > Crank behind the pilot's seat. I feel like the SECOND guy who > invented the zipper. Your design and implementation are nearly > exactly how I envisioned a trim system, which is to say, I was still > at the "back of a fag packet" stage until you told me that your > system works. Now that I hear it will work, I'm Oh-ficially at the > "build it" stage. > > Thanks, > > Jeff > > > > > > > >Jeff, > > > >Yes the trim system did work quite well. > > > >I originally had a lever in its place to tension the cables on the > elevator > >horn but couldn't get enough travel. I came up with the idea of wrapping > the > >cables round a piece of pvc tube suitably mounted on the fuse side. > > > >http://www.cpc-world.com/new_card_images/images/IMG_0710_JPG.jpg shows > the > >concept. > > > >I don't have much else in the way of design details. A bit of a "back of a > >fag (cigarette) packet" design. > > > >Cheers > > > >Peter > > > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com > >[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff > >Boatright > >Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 2010 12:10 AM > >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com; vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au > >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Peter's trim > > > > > >Peter, > > > >I just noticed what looks to be a trim wheel on the right side of > >your cockpit. Did your system work, and if so, do you have design > >details at your website? I couldn't find anything. > > > >Thanks, > > > >Jeff > >-- > > > >Jeff Boatright > >"Now let's think about this..." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > --- > > Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D. > Associate Professor of Ophthalmology > Emory University School of Medicine > Editor-in-Chief > Molecular Vision > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 12, 2010
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: tightness of fit?
That will be just fine. You do not want a starved T-88 joint any way. The g ussets, that come later, are where the strength comes from. - ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: tightness of fit?
From: "bcolleran" <bcolleran(at)comcast.net>
Date: May 12, 2010
that is what I was thinking. thanks for the help. Bill N424BK Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297544#297544 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: tightness of fit?
From: "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Date: May 12, 2010
Probably just getting picky here, but T-88 will not expand to fill the gap. It will bridge small gaps, but it does not expand. If the gaps are too large, and you're using straight T-88 (no fillers) you will come back later to find that some of the glue has run out of the joint. But in your case, with a gap the thickness of a piece of paper, you shouldn't have any problem. That polyurethane Gorilla Glue stuff does expand. But I wouldn't use that glue on my airplane. It isn't really strong enough for aircraft structural applications. BC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297547#297547 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 12, 2010
From: jorge lizarraga <flightwood(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: gauges for trade
tanks all you guys for all help you giveme in the past time , i like to now if some one intersted in trade two airspeed gauges calibrate in knots.trad e for one-for i can used in my proyect piet calibrate in mph. one in the left I gate from ebay in ok condition the right one for builder in near cit y in bery good con dition shipin and hanled free delivery if you like more in form senmy a not i like to answer all tanks again jorge from hanford --- On Tue, 5/11/10, jorge lizarraga wrote: From: jorge lizarraga <flightwood(at)yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: horiz stab and elevator Date: Tuesday, May 11, 2010, 10:14 PM that is great- for my case I used the same way to australian piet buildin g laminate le and beams not router I don have it the web side from australi an iswww.cpc-world.com these give you alot ideas easy way and safe and incl ude video for the first fly and my tail used same as plans in these moment 3/4by 1" i think , i hope these help you and we seyou nex jorge from hanfor d --- On Tue, 5/11/10, bcolleran wrote: From: bcolleran <bcolleran(at)comcast.net> Subject: Pietenpol-List: horiz stab and elevator Date: Tuesday, May 11, 2010, 5:26 PM So I started the construction of the horizontal stab and elevator tonight. - I have one question.- What size wood are you using on the beams betwe en the LE and TE on the sides.- I was going to use a piece of 1"x1" the s ame as the main beam just not routed out.- What is your thoughts? Bill Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297439f="http://www.matroni cs.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List" target=_blank>httef="http://forums.mat ronics.com/" target=_blank>http://forums.matronics; - - - --- - List Contribution Web Site - ================== =0A=0A=0A ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: access to bellcrank
Date: May 13, 2010
As I've mentioned before, Corky installed a nifty access hole and cover in the fuselage directly below the elevator bellcrank for inspection and service. It works great. the cover is a simple rectangle of aluminum sheet with a break in the middle. Much, much easier than trying to work through two round inspection covers. Pictures: http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/repairs/P5060002.JPG and http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/repairs/P5060003.JPG Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 13, 2010
From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu>
Subject: Re: access to bellcrank
Yeah, but I'm LAZY. Installing a panel looks like work to me. But, it may come to that. We'll see. > > >As I've mentioned before, Corky installed a nifty access >hole and cover in the fuselage directly below the elevator >bellcrank for inspection and service. ... -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..." ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: access to bellcrank
Date: May 13, 2010
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
I put a huge access panel down there on the underside of the fuze. Boy am I glad I did because it comes in handy. I can get my whole upper torso in to that space. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu> Sent: Thu, May 13, 2010 8:57 am Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: access to bellcrank Yeah, but I'm LAZY. Installing a panel looks like work to me. But, it may come to that. We'll see. > > > >As I've mentioned before, Corky installed a nifty access >hole and cover in the fuselage directly below the elevator >bellcrank for inspection and service. ... -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..." ======================== ============ ======================== ============ ======================== ============ ======================== ============ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dick N" <horzpool(at)goldengate.net>
Subject: Re: Rotec Engine
Date: May 13, 2010
Rodrego I strongly disagree with Michael P. on the engine comments. My engine sticks out 2" higher and 2" on each side. I think it has a well balanced look to it. My only criticizm is it's too quite. Strnage when you are flying. Installation was on the difficult side. All in all I'm very happy with the engine. Dick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rodrigo Liberato" <ditoliberato(at)terra.com.br> Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 2010 6:42 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Rotec Engine Hi everyone, since building is kind of slow down here, Id like to ask Dick N. and the others about the Rotec Radial. Recently I bumped into their site and got hooked right away. Than it lead me to Dicks airplane pics and its a perfect match (just focusing on the looks). Besides price, what do you think of this pathway? Cheers Rodrigo - Brazil ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 13, 2010
From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov>
Subject: Schweizer SGS 2-33 trim system [was: Peter's trim]
Jeff, Here's an alternative trim system that I'm thinking about putting into N8031 to replace the screen door spring that's used, now. The whole system is in the cockpit, so there's no need to break your back trying to get to the bellcrank behind the seat. This system is based on a version of a trim system found in Schweizer SGS 2-33 gliders. It's a lever attached to the stick which can couple/decouple with a gear that's held under tension by 2 bungees. The gear is attached to the pivot point of the stick, and the bungees are attached to the pivot tube. Basically, you put the stick where you want to fly, then engage the lever in the gear to place the stick under tension. Caveat Emptor!! Though I've used this sort of trim system, I've never actually *seen* it (the gear is below the floor in the glider), so if build it, you may need to fiddle with the placement of the engaging lever, the rotation of the gear, etc. I'll try to get a picture of an actual 2-33 trim system to verify that what I've drawn is actually what it looks like. Cheers, Dan -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 13, 2010
From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu>
Subject: Re: Schweizer SGS 2-33 trim system [was: Peter's trim]
Dan, Thanks much for the drawing and idea. Looks interesting. I have been pondering "in-cockpit" solutions, but hadn't come up with anything. This looks promising. Jeff -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..." ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 13, 2010
From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri(at)emory.edu>
Subject: Peter's Wiring Diagram
I seem to recall several Piets with fixed trim tabs on just one elevator. Functionally identical to this situation, I believe, and they all fly fine. >Rick, >I'm considering the same setup. Do you have any concerns with >having trim on just the one elevator and not having the elevators >directly connected? Has anyone flown with a similar setup? >Thanks, >Jack -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..." ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 13, 2010
From: Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Schweizer SGS 2-33 trim system [was: Peter's trim]
I have flown the 2-33 quite a bit and loved the trim mechanism..And have always wanted to setup a trim system in my Piet like the 2-33....and have looked FOREVER for how it was designed.... Now I have it!!!! thanks VERY much.... -----Original Message----- >From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov> >Sent: May 13, 2010 8:50 AM >To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Schweizer SGS 2-33 trim system [was: Peter's trim] > >Jeff, > >Here's an alternative trim system that I'm thinking about putting into >N8031 to replace the screen door spring that's used, now. The whole >system is in the cockpit, so there's no need to break your back trying >to get to the bellcrank behind the seat. > >This system is based on a version of a trim system found in Schweizer >SGS 2-33 gliders. It's a lever attached to the stick which can >couple/decouple with a gear that's held under tension by 2 bungees. The >gear is attached to the pivot point of the stick, and the bungees are >attached to the pivot tube. Basically, you put the stick where you want >to fly, then engage the lever in the gear to place the stick under >tension. > >Caveat Emptor!! Though I've used this sort of trim system, I've never >actually *seen* it (the gear is below the floor in the glider), so if >build it, you may need to fiddle with the placement of the engaging >lever, the rotation of the gear, etc. > >I'll try to get a picture of an actual 2-33 trim system to verify that >what I've drawn is actually what it looks like. > >Cheers, >Dan > > >-- >Dan Yocum >Fermilab 630.840.6509 >yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov >"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: tank float indicator
From: "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 13, 2010
Has anybody come up with a good home made drop down style gage for overhead tanks? I think I'm going to be making a center section tank for my project and need to get one or install an electric gage which I'd rather not do.Aircraft spruce has what they call a Stearman type gage but it is pricey.I just can't think of anything in the way of a small threaded clear tube that would withstand gas to make one from. Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297649#297649 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 13, 2010
From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: tank float indicator
My capacitance electrick gage works fine and I don' t have to worry about it breaking and leaking fuel all over the place. Cheers, Gardiner Mason ----- Original Message ---- From: skellytown flyer <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Thu, May 13, 2010 6:11:51 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: tank float indicator Has anybody come up with a good home made drop down style gage for overhead tanks? I think I'm going to be making a center section tank for my project and need to get one or install an electric gage which I'd rather not do.Aircraft spruce has what they call a Stearman type gage but it is pricey.I just can't think of anything in the way of a small threaded clear tube that would withstand gas to make one from. Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297649#297649 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: tank float indicator
Date: May 13, 2010
Raymond, Here is the much-touted Steve Eldridge Stearman Type Home Made Gauge. Gary Boothe Cool, CA Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, Fuselage on gear 18 ribs done -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of skellytown flyer Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 3:12 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: tank float indicator Has anybody come up with a good home made drop down style gage for overhead tanks? I think I'm going to be making a center section tank for my project and need to get one or install an electric gage which I'd rather not do.Aircraft spruce has what they call a Stearman type gage but it is pricey.I just can't think of anything in the way of a small threaded clear tube that would withstand gas to make one from. Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297649#297649 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: tank float indicator
From: "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 13, 2010
I thought I had seen that somewhere. good idea. I wonder if the clear Tygon tubing I find in the stores is gas proof? Actually I had thought of making something similar but was wondering about finding something like clear plexi-glass tube that would be in a diameter that could be threaded on the end and screwed into a bushing.J.B. Weld always stood up to gas good as far as sealing the threads and I have some white Teflon paste now that is made for gasoline and similar products. it sealed my fuel connections drip proof. I also wonder whether my old Stromberg carb DJ installed has been modified for higher flow. I think that I read somewhere they could be increased some way maybe with a different venturi for larger engines than the A-65.anybody know how to tell by looking? it had a shop tag from a repair shop somewhere around San Antonio maybe? but it does leak bad if you put car gas in it.though only drips when 100LL is in it.I had the bowl off and couldn't see any crud in it but hated to strip it completely down. I am wondering if that heavy looking brass float just doesn't float well enough in this sorry excuse for car gas these days.I can close the fuel shut off and do anyway when not running it.but I'd sure like to verify the changes that might have been made if I go to the trouble of taking it off again. Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297662#297662 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Wayne Bressler <wayne(at)taildraggersinc.com>
Subject: Project For Sale (not mine)
Date: May 13, 2010
Just an FYI. I saw this on Barnstormers, and thought I'd pass it along... Wayne Bressler Jr. Taildraggers, Inc. taildraggersinc.com PIETENPOL - 90% DONE =A2 $3,000 =A2 PROJECT FOR SALE =A2 Almost done. Needs engine, fabric and other tweaks. Finish it & fly in 2 months. I don't have time. =A2 Contact Todd Trainor, Owner - located Brighton, MI USA =A2 Telephone: 810-599-4035 . =A2 Posted May 13, 2010 =A2 Show all Ads posted by this Advertiser =A2 Recommend This Ad to a Friend =A2 Email Advertiser =A2 Save to Watchlist =A2 Report This Ad =A2 View Larger Pictures ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: tank float indicator
Date: May 13, 2010
If I recall correctly, the Stromberg for the Corvair should be setup equivalent to the configuration for a C-85. I think the difference between that and the A-65 is a venturi change. But if the exact nature of the overhaul is unknown, plus it drips or dribbles gas depending on it's mood, I would pack it up and ship it off to Russ Romey at D&G Supply in MI. He's the go-to guy to have carbs overhauled and setup for the Corvair. For probably around $400 it will come back good as new, and more importantly it will perform and function correctly. Ryan Sent from my iPhone On May 13, 2010, at 5:29 PM, "skellytown flyer" wrote: > > > > I thought I had seen that somewhere. good idea. I wonder if the > clear Tygon tubing I find in the stores is gas proof? Actually I had > thought of making something similar but was wondering about finding > something like clear plexi-glass tube that would be in a diameter > that could be threaded on the end and screwed into a bushing.J.B. > Weld always stood up to gas good as far as sealing the threads and I > have some white Teflon paste now that is made for gasoline and > similar products. it sealed my fuel connections drip proof. > I also wonder whether my old Stromberg carb DJ installed has been > modified for higher flow. I think that I read somewhere they could > be increased some way maybe with a different venturi for larger > engines than the A-65.anybody know how to tell by looking? it had a > shop tag from a repair shop somewhere around San Antonio maybe? but > it does leak bad if you put car gas in it.though only drips when > 100LL is in it.I had the bowl off and couldn't see any crud in it > but hated to strip it completely down. I am wondering if that heavy > looking brass float just doesn't float well enough in this sorry > excuse for car gas these days.I can close the fuel shut off and do > anyway when not running it.but I'd sure like to verify the changes > that might have been made if I go to the trouble of taking it off > again. Raymond > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297662#297662 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: tank float indicator
Date: May 14, 2010
Does he handle Marvel carbs too? I have an old one I got on eBay that I'm planning to use on my Corvair that obviously needs an overhaul. Contact info? Kip Gardner On May 14, 2010, at 2:32 AM, Ryan Mueller wrote: > > > If I recall correctly, the Stromberg for the Corvair should be > setup equivalent to the configuration for a C-85. I think the > difference between that and the A-65 is a venturi change. But if > the exact nature of the overhaul is unknown, plus it drips or > dribbles gas depending on it's mood, I would pack it up and ship it > off to Russ Romey at D&G Supply in MI. He's the go-to guy to have > carbs overhauled and setup for the Corvair. For probably around > $400 it will come back good as new, and more importantly it will > perform and function correctly. > > Ryan > > Sent from my iPhone > > On May 13, 2010, at 5:29 PM, "skellytown flyer" > wrote: > >> >> >> I thought I had seen that somewhere. good idea. I wonder if the >> clear Tygon tubing I find in the stores is gas proof? Actually I >> had thought of making something similar but was wondering about >> finding something like clear plexi-glass tube that would be in a >> diameter that could be threaded on the end and screwed into a >> bushing.J.B. Weld always stood up to gas good as far as sealing >> the threads and I have some white Teflon paste now that is made >> for gasoline and similar products. it sealed my fuel connections >> drip proof. >> I also wonder whether my old Stromberg carb DJ installed has been >> modified for higher flow. I think that I read somewhere they could >> be increased some way maybe with a different venturi for larger >> engines than the A-65.anybody know how to tell by looking? it had >> a shop tag from a repair shop somewhere around San Antonio maybe? >> but it does leak bad if you put car gas in it.though only drips >> when 100LL is in it.I had the bowl off and couldn't see any crud >> in it but hated to strip it completely down. I am wondering if >> that heavy looking brass float just doesn't float well enough in >> this sorry excuse for car gas these days.I can close the fuel shut >> off and do anyway when not running it.but I'd sure like to verify >> the changes that might have been made if I go to the trouble of >> taking it off again. Raymond >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297662#297662 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Electric Trim
Date: May 14, 2010
From: tbyh(at)aol.com
The only electric trim I'll need is for the flying field grass and my hair and whiskers... ; ) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: tank float indicator
From: "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil>
Date: May 14, 2010
Float indicator: cup-style wire indicator out of the fuel cap works pretty well & is bone simple. I have a small mirror (hello kitty - kids love it) on a lanyard in the cockpit. You're flying by time anyway. The mirror works great. I know that's not what you're looking for but it's a simple option. Carb: I sure felt better after having a pro shop overhaul it. It was pricey but that seemed a bad place to pinch pennies. I think my carb is a pretty typical C-65 carb & there's no problem whatsoever with adequate fuel flow. It does leak a little sitting static on the ground, which is solved by yet another simple solution: turn off the gas when you're not flying. The on/off switch is on the right rear cabane inches from my face. Have not taken off with the switch off so far (I'm waiting). Kevin NX899KP Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297720#297720 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: tank float indicator
Date: May 14, 2010
I'm pretty sure they handle the Marvels as well. Their website is at: http://www.dgsupply.com/ You can find all their contact info there. Ask for Russ Romey, explain what you have and that you would like to have it overhauled for use on a Corvair aircraft engine conversion, and go from there. Ryan Sent from my iPhone On May 14, 2010, at 4:07 AM, Kip and Beth Gardner wrote: > > > > Does he handle Marvel carbs too? I have an old one I got on eBay > that I'm planning to use on my Corvair that obviously needs an > overhaul. > > Contact info? > > Kip Gardner > > > On May 14, 2010, at 2:32 AM, Ryan Mueller wrote: > >> > >> >> If I recall correctly, the Stromberg for the Corvair should be >> setup equivalent to the configuration for a C-85. I think the >> difference between that and the A-65 is a venturi change. But if >> the exact nature of the overhaul is unknown, plus it drips or >> dribbles gas depending on it's mood, I would pack it up and ship it >> off to Russ Romey at D&G Supply in MI. He's the go-to guy to have >> carbs overhauled and setup for the Corvair. For probably around >> $400 it will come back good as new, and more importantly it will >> perform and function correctly. >> >> Ryan >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On May 13, 2010, at 5:29 PM, "skellytown flyer" > > wrote: >> >>> > >>> >>> I thought I had seen that somewhere. good idea. I wonder if the >>> clear Tygon tubing I find in the stores is gas proof? Actually I >>> had thought of making something similar but was wondering about >>> finding something like clear plexi-glass tube that would be in a >>> diameter that could be threaded on the end and screwed into a >>> bushing.J.B. Weld always stood up to gas good as far as sealing >>> the threads and I have some white Teflon paste now that is made >>> for gasoline and similar products. it sealed my fuel connections >>> drip proof. >>> I also wonder whether my old Stromberg carb DJ installed has been >>> modified for higher flow. I think that I read somewhere they could >>> be increased some way maybe with a different venturi for larger >>> engines than the A-65.anybody know how to tell by looking? it had >>> a shop tag from a repair shop somewhere around San Antonio maybe? >>> but it does leak bad if you put car gas in it.though only drips >>> when 100LL is in it.I had the bowl off and couldn't see any crud >>> in it but hated to strip it completely down. I am wondering if >>> that heavy looking brass float just doesn't float well enough in >>> this sorry excuse for car gas these days.I can close the fuel shut >>> off and do anyway when not running it.but I'd sure like to verify >>> the changes that might have been made if I go to the trouble of >>> taking it off again. Raymond >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Read this topic online here: >>> >>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297662#297662 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: fuse construction
From: "schuerrman" <sdschuerr(at)live.com>
Date: May 14, 2010
I'm getting ready to put one side of the fuse together and I noticed that there's no gusset on the second member, on the bottom. (extended fuse)Should I put one there? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297731#297731 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: A great Ford engine for sale, ready to fly
Date: May 14, 2010
Hey guys, After much soul-searching, I have made the difficult decision to replace my Ford with a Continental. I LOVE Fords, and especially LOVE this one that I've put so much time and money into. However, with the areas that Marci and I are wanting to fly (out west) I decided that since I'm rebuiding the fuse anyways, now would be the time to make the switch. If I was only going to fly around here, or up in the lowlands, I'd stick with it in a heartbeat and I still think they make the coolest Piet going. This all having been said, If anyone is interested in an absolutely great Ford that has been built by the best hand in America and test run up the ying-yang, contact me. The engine is running on a test-stand at Lowell's right now, here are the specs: Built by Ron Kelly (check out his website, rk designs) from handpicked parts counterbalanced crank, dye-penetrant tested modern Chevy pistons insert bearings Ken Perkins double magneto set up higher compression, two plug aluminum head (Dan Price head, no longer available) Enlarged oil sump, holds on extra quart. B grind cam bronze timing bear, not fiber or aluminum Modern design "T" type water pump that PUSHES cold water from down low into the engine, rather than sucking hot coolant from the engine. Has two carb/intake setups for increased performance, a weber and an aerocarb. Has two brand new slick 4130 mags with harness on it, I'll sell with or without, as I'd like them for the Continental. I also have the Forrest Lovely radiator, the engine mounts etc. This engine has been built with longevity and strength as paramount concerns. It has almost 20 hours on the test stand. An average Ford average will turn 1800 to 1850 static, this one is turning 1992rpm with a 76X42 Sensenich prop. (we have the photos to verify) This motor is ready to install and go, all the work and painstaking research has been done to ensure the safest, most reliable Ford possible. I am figuring out a price, but if you're interested, call or emails your questions. Douwe douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net 805 573 3564 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: fuse construction
Date: May 14, 2010
If I understand the question, the entire bottom will be 'gusseted' when you add the plywood floor. Gary Boothe Cool, CA Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, Fuselage on gear 18 ribs done -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of schuerrman Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 8:00 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: fuse construction I'm getting ready to put one side of the fuse together and I noticed that there's no gusset on the second member, on the bottom. (extended fuse)Should I put one there? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297731#297731 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: rib test, wood failure
From: "womenfly2" <keriannprice(at)hotmail.com>
Date: May 14, 2010
Check this out on the testing of a Fokker D.vII rib. You can do the same with a Piet rib. Cheers! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297746#297746 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chris" <catdesigns(at)att.net>
Subject: fuse construction
Date: May 14, 2010
Never notice it before but you are correct the plans do not show a gusset. I put one there and it hasn't been problem. All the other plans show a gusset there. So I would say yes put a gusset there too. Chris Sacramento, Ca Westcoastpiet.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of schuerrman Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 8:00 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: fuse construction I'm getting ready to put one side of the fuse together and I noticed that there's no gusset on the second member, on the bottom. (extended fuse)Should I put one there? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297731#297731 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Another straight axle gear question
From: "womenfly2" <keriannprice(at)hotmail.com>
Date: May 14, 2010
Here is a picture of my wood gear and you can see the ash block is pretty parallel to the ground. Hope this helps. Cheers. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297750#297750 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/nov18_08_111.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: tank float indicator
From: "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Date: May 14, 2010
Just took a look at Aircraft Spruce's website, and see that the Stearman type fuel gauge retails for $69. For an aircraft part, I wouldn't really call that "pricey". The sight gauge isn't a complicated thing to make, but you will spend a fair amount of time searching for suitable components, and thinking, and building, and testing, and re-building. Material costs will be pretty low, but time spent will add up. I guess it depends on how much time you have to spare, and how much you like or dislike building things from scratch, but $70 doesn't seem too bad for a fuel gauge. The only downside that I can see is that the one they sell is for an 8" tank depth - so it will likely need to be modified for use in a Piet wing tank, so there goes some of the time savings. I believe AS used to sell a "short" version of the same gauge, but unfortunately, no more. BC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297773#297773 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 14, 2010
From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov>
Subject: Re: tank float indicator
On 05/13/2010 05:11 PM, skellytown flyer wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "skellytown flyer" > > Has anybody come up with a good home made drop down style gage for overhead tanks? I think I'm going to be making a center section tank for my project and need to get one or install an electric gage which I'd rather not do.Aircraft spruce has what they call a Stearman type gage but it is pricey.I just can't think of anything in the way of a small threaded clear tube that would withstand gas to make one from. Raymond If I recall correctly, Oscar has. His design is in the BPA newsletter from July 2009. Dan -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack" <jack(at)textors.com>
Subject: fuse construction
Date: May 15, 2010
Yes, but you might want to wait until you install the ash cross-piece. That way the gusset can be cut or formed around the cross-piece. My site www.textors.com has some pictures. Jack DSM I'm getting ready to put one side of the fuse together and I noticed that there's no gusset on the second member, on the bottom. (extended fuse)Should I put one there? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297731#297731 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 15, 2010
From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov>
Subject: Re: fuse construction
Jack, Wasn't this topic recently discussed? The gusset shouldn't be notch out to fit around the ash crosspiece - the strength comes from the gussets and if you cut a section of it out, you lose a lot of the strength. It's OK to butt the crosspiece up to the gusset. Dan On 05/15/2010 06:42 AM, Jack wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack" > > Yes, but you might want to wait until you install the ash cross-piece. That > way the gusset can be cut or formed around the cross-piece. My site > www.textors.com has some pictures. > Jack > DSM > > > I'm getting ready to put one side of the fuse together and I noticed that > there's no gusset on the second member, on the bottom. (extended > fuse)Should I put one there? > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297731#297731 > > -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tom Stinemetze" <tstinemetze(at)cox.net>
Subject: Pietenpole for sale
Date: May 15, 2010
Gentlemen: I just received this notice for posting on our EAA Chapter website. Since one of the planes is a Pietenpol Air Camper with a Cont. A65 I thought I should share it with you as well. Tom Stinemetze AIRPLANE SALE JUNE 5, 2010 10am - 4pm 12353 Hwy 59, Oskaloosa, KS 4 project planes 1948 Cessna 140 with Cont. 85 1968 Pitts S1-C w/ Lycoming 0320 1986 Pietenpol Air Camper w/ Cont. 65 1957 Cassut - no engine The planes have not been inspected for over 5 years. Best offer of the day on each plane gets the sale. (There will be a reserve on each one. The court won't let me give them away.) The planes may be viewed the 2 days preceding the sale or by appointment. Planes may be ferried out that day or picked up the next day. Lots of other stuff - engines, engine mounts, engine casings, struts, props, tail feathers, tools, and much more Also 50 acres with private airstrip, 40' by 60" hanger with a 3 bedroom house that needs work For more information or pictures contact: Barb Frank - 816-285-3072 weekdays 816-455-4672 evenings and weekends b.frank(at)stonemfg.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 15, 2010
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: fuse construction
I agree, gussets should be left in tact. At the ash location along the bott om, it butts up against the side fuselage gussets. The floor helps hold it all together as well. - On a side note, I am about 80% done with HINT Video #5 FUSELAGE. It looks l ike it will be a little over 2 hours long. If you could wait another week o r so, it will be available for sale and it may just help you with your work . - I am also working on posting some pictures on my site as well...for those o f you who would be interested. - www.karetakeraero.com - ________________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Stromberg NA-S3A1 carb
Date: May 15, 2010
Raymond wrote: >I also wonder whether my old Stromberg carb DJ installed >has been modified for higher flow. I think that I read >somewhere they could be increased some way maybe with a >different venturi for larger engines than the A-65. >Anybody know how to tell by looking? You have to pull the venturi out of the carb and it will have the throat diameter cast into the side. Or you can use an inside caliper. Pulling the venturi means taking the carb apart. If you go here: http://www.bowersflybaby.com, you'll find the best resource available for small Continental engines and their carbs. On that page you'll find a link to the parts interchangeability for the small engines and you'll see that the C85 and C90 use a 1-3/8" venturi while the A65 uses a 1-1/4" and the 75 uses a 1-5/16" (both of those are too small for the O-145 Corvair). There are also differences in the main jet. If I had to guess, I'd say DJ probably knew this and provided the proper venturi, but all it means if he didn't is that you may not develop full static RPM without changing the venturi. >it does leak bad if you put car gas in it. though only drips >when 100LL is in it. My experience with these carbs has been similar. Exactly my experience. You can run both fuels in them, but if you set it up properly for one fuel, it won't be right for the other except when the engine is running. I run mine exclusively on 100LL. There is a very simple little metal gauge that you can make to set the float bowl fuel level so the carb won't drip; that info is also on the Fly Baby site. I set mine using that tool and have had zero problems with it since then. >I am wondering if that heavy looking brass float just doesn't >float well enough in this sorry excuse for car gas these days. Like I said, if you set it up for auto gas, it won't be right for avgas and vice-versa. Set it up for one or the other. The viscosity and some other characteristics are just different enough to cause the carb to drool if you set it up for avgas and then run auto gas in it. The engine doesn't mind, but like you say- shut off the fuel when the airplane is sitting, run the float bowl dry when you shut the engine down, and when you turn on the fuel, be ready to start the engine or you'll start seeing fuel in the carb intake air box. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Stromberg NA-S3A1 carb
From: "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com>
Date: May 16, 2010
Thanks again for the info. I will get back to the carb when I get a chance and check the Venturi diameter.I can handle that and since I am planning on running 100LL for the near future at least when I get the thing complete I'm not going to sweat the rest if it only drips occasionally -just close the valve as normal and move along.the diameter was the big thing I needed. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297884#297884 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ALAN LYSCARS" <alyscars(at)myfairpoint.net>
Subject: Re: Stromberg NA-S3A1 carb
Date: May 16, 2010
You can buy rebuild parts, including the venturi, metering needle & seat, etc. from: Fresno Airparts, Chandler Field, Fresno, CA. Al Lyscars Manchester, NH ----- Original Message ----- From: "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 8:43 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Stromberg NA-S3A1 carb > > > Thanks again for the info. I will get back to the carb when I get a chance > and check the Venturi diameter.I can handle that and since I am planning > on running 100LL for the near future at least when I get the thing > complete I'm not going to sweat the rest if it only drips > occasionally -just close the valve as normal and move along.the diameter > was the big thing I needed. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297884#297884 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: tank float indicator
Date: May 16, 2010
I used a Piper PA-12 Fuel Gage I got from Wag-Aero for $75 (I think it was about $50 at the time). http://store.wagaero.com/product_info.php?products_id' Works fine. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Church Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 3:34 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: tank float indicator Just took a look at Aircraft Spruce's website, and see that the Stearman type fuel gauge retails for $69. For an aircraft part, I wouldn't really call that "pricey". The sight gauge isn't a complicated thing to make, but you will spend a fair amount of time searching for suitable components, and thinking, and building, and testing, and re-building. Material costs will be pretty low, but time spent will add up. I guess it depends on how much time you have to spare, and how much you like or dislike building things from scratch, but $70 doesn't seem too bad for a fuel gauge. The only downside that I can see is that the one they sell is for an 8" tank depth - so it will likely need to be modified for use in a Piet wing tank, so there goes some of the time savings. I believe AS used to sell a "short" version of the same gauge, but unfortunately, no more. BC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297773#297773 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 100 Report NX899KP
From: "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil>
Date: May 16, 2010
Its taken 8 months to get here. Had hoped to get 200 hours in the 1st year but life keeps getting in the way. Mechanically, most the bugs have been worked out. Im a little surprised at how quickly its gotten nicked, scratched and worn by routine use, mostly as a result of bugs, vibration and Young Eagles. Realistic performance numbers with the Corvair: Static RPM: 2650 (this was with the original pitch. I changed it & then went back to it.) 2500 RPM = 72 mph 2600 RPM = 77 mph Level flight, WOT gives 2750 RPM and 85 mph Rate of climb with just me: vigorous (~700 fpm on a cool day at sea level.) Rate of climb with a full grown passenger: dignified (havent measured.) Fuel burn: 5 gph Stock fuel tank makes for short legs and lots of fuel stops, especially with headwinds. Flight numbers: Take off: pretty quick tail up in ~100 feet, off the ground in ~250 Stall: really slow Final: ~60 mph Landing: pretty slow Roll out: pretty short Cross countries: 2 day trips at 400 miles all day affairs Several 200 mile trips Number of landings: ~350 (several with the motor stopped, intentionally, for practice in carefully controlled situations. Behaves the same as with the engine at idle.) Number of attempted ground loops: several Number of successful ground loops: 0 It likes to be wheel-landed. Number of passengers: 13 different people (8 Young Eagles) Kevin Purtee Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297907#297907 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 16, 2010
From: Ben Charvet <bcharvet(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Stromberg NA-S3A1 carb
In my limited experience, opening up one of these carburetors was not a big deal. I didn't completely disassemble mine, but did buy the gasket kit and stainless steel needle kit from Fresno. Using instructions easily available from the internet, I set up a system for adjusting the float height using the supplied spacers in the kit. I'm using autofuel, so that is what I used. I don't think this talk of dripping fuel has as much to do with the float level setting as it does with the fact that the steel needles sometimes don't seat perfectly and will drip. This is all described in Harry Fenton's articles on the Fly Baby site. My carb had an old rubber tipped needle that didn't leak or anything, but I had no idea how old it was, and didn't want to take the chance of accidently exposing it to ethanol somewhere along the way. After the rebuild (or regasketing/re-needling) The engine ran the same as before. Your results may vary..... Ben Charvet NX866BC 30 hours flown On 5/16/2010 11:02 AM, ALAN LYSCARS wrote: > > > You can buy rebuild parts, including the venturi, metering needle & > seat, etc. from: Fresno Airparts, Chandler Field, Fresno, CA. > > Al Lyscars > Manchester, NH > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "skellytown flyer" > > To: > Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 8:43 AM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Stromberg NA-S3A1 carb > > >> >> >> Thanks again for the info. I will get back to the carb when I get a >> chance and check the Venturi diameter.I can handle that and since I >> am planning on running 100LL for the near future at least when I get >> the thing complete I'm not going to sweat the rest if it only drips >> occasionally -just close the valve as normal and move along.the >> diameter was the big thing I needed. >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297884#297884 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 16, 2010
Subject: Re: 100 Report NX899KP
From: Rick Holland <at7000ft(at)gmail.com>
Sounds good Kevin, bet the Young Eagles kids love getting a ride in an ope n cockpit, much more exciting than riding in a 140 or 172. What size prop are you using? Have you thought of trying a lower pitch prop to get a little higher rpm? rick On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 12:34 PM, kevinpurtee wro te: > kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil> > > It=92s taken 8 months to get here. Had hoped to get 200 hours in the 1st > year but life keeps getting in the way. > > Mechanically, most the bugs have been worked out. > > I=92m a little surprised at how quickly it=92s gotten nicked, scratched a nd > worn by routine use, mostly as a result of bugs, vibration and Young Eagl es. > > Realistic performance numbers with the Corvair: > Static RPM: 2650 (this was with the original pitch. I changed it & then > went back to it.) > 2500 RPM = 72 mph > 2600 RPM = 77 mph > Level flight, WOT gives 2750 RPM and 85 mph > Rate of climb with just me: vigorous (~700 fpm on a cool day at sea level .) > Rate of climb with a full grown passenger: dignified (haven=92t measured. ) > Fuel burn: 5 gph > Stock fuel tank makes for short legs and lots of fuel stops, especially > with headwinds. > > Flight numbers: > Take off: pretty quick ' tail up in ~100 feet, off the ground in ~250 > Stall: really slow > Final: ~60 mph > Landing: pretty slow > Roll out: pretty short > > Cross countries: > 2 day trips at 400 miles ' all day affairs > Several 200 mile trips > > Number of landings: ~350 (several with the motor stopped, intentionally, > for practice in carefully controlled situations. Behaves the same as wit h > the engine at idle.) > Number of attempted ground loops: several > Number of successful ground loops: 0 > It likes to be wheel-landed. > > Number of passengers: 13 different people (8 Young Eagles) > > Kevin Purtee > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297907#297907 > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Stromberg NA-S3A1 carb
Date: May 16, 2010
I overhauled my Stromberg using the stainless steel needle valve and found a good way to make the valve seat perfectly so it doesn't drip. Chuck the needle in your drill press. Coat it with Crest toothpaste which is mildly abrasive and as the drill press spins the needle, press the valve seat against the needle with the toothpaste on it to "lap" in the valve seat. It will polish it to match the conical surface of the needle perfectly and make a tight seal. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ben Charvet Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 8:21 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Stromberg NA-S3A1 carb In my limited experience, opening up one of these carburetors was not a big deal. I didn't completely disassemble mine, but did buy the gasket kit and stainless steel needle kit from Fresno. Using instructions easily available from the internet, I set up a system for adjusting the float height using the supplied spacers in the kit. I'm using autofuel, so that is what I used. I don't think this talk of dripping fuel has as much to do with the float level setting as it does with the fact that the steel needles sometimes don't seat perfectly and will drip. This is all described in Harry Fenton's articles on the Fly Baby site. My carb had an old rubber tipped needle that didn't leak or anything, but I had no idea how old it was, and didn't want to take the chance of accidently exposing it to ethanol somewhere along the way. After the rebuild (or regasketing/re-needling) The engine ran the same as before. Your results may vary..... Ben Charvet NX866BC 30 hours flown On 5/16/2010 11:02 AM, ALAN LYSCARS wrote: > > > You can buy rebuild parts, including the venturi, metering needle & > seat, etc. from: Fresno Airparts, Chandler Field, Fresno, CA. > > Al Lyscars > Manchester, NH > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "skellytown flyer" > > To: > Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 8:43 AM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Stromberg NA-S3A1 carb > > >> >> >> Thanks again for the info. I will get back to the carb when I get a >> chance and check the Venturi diameter.I can handle that and since I >> am planning on running 100LL for the near future at least when I get >> the thing complete I'm not going to sweat the rest if it only drips >> occasionally -just close the valve as normal and move along.the >> diameter was the big thing I needed. >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297884#297884 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Kevin's post
Date: May 17, 2010
Kevin, Thanks for taking the time to post your results, and especially for being such a great ambassador with the young eagles. They are the future of grass roots flying. Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 17, 2010
From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov>
Subject: Re: 100 Report NX899KP
Kevin, I think you've shocked everyone into silence! Luckily, I'm rarely at a loss for words... often to my detriment, of course. ;-) 100 hours in 8mo is amazing! I could only dream of having that much time to fly. Granted, we get snow, and I don't have skis, yet. I have some questions: 100' to get the tail up - do you have gap seals on the elevator? I don't have the FBL Fact File handy and I'm too lazy to look for it - what size/pitch prop did you finally end up on? I'm bit surprised that wide open, you can only hit 85mph. N8031 with a 74/42 cruises at a respectable 88-90mph, though the climb rate isn't anything to write home about - yours is much, much better. Look forward to see you at Brodhead this summer! Cheers, Dan On 05/16/2010 08:41 PM, Rick Holland wrote: > Sounds good Kevin, bet the Young Eagles kids love getting a ride in an > open cockpit, much more exciting than riding in a 140 or 172. What size > prop are you using? Have you thought of trying a lower pitch prop to get > a little higher rpm? > > rick > > On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 12:34 PM, kevinpurtee > wrote: > > > > > Its taken 8 months to get here. Had hoped to get 200 hours in the > 1st year but life keeps getting in the way. > > Mechanically, most the bugs have been worked out. > > Im a little surprised at how quickly its gotten nicked, scratched > and worn by routine use, mostly as a result of bugs, vibration and > Young Eagles. > > Realistic performance numbers with the Corvair: > Static RPM: 2650 (this was with the original pitch. I changed it & > then went back to it.) > 2500 RPM = 72 mph > 2600 RPM = 77 mph > Level flight, WOT gives 2750 RPM and 85 mph > Rate of climb with just me: vigorous (~700 fpm on a cool day at sea > level.) > Rate of climb with a full grown passenger: dignified (havent measured.) > Fuel burn: 5 gph > Stock fuel tank makes for short legs and lots of fuel stops, > especially with headwinds. > > Flight numbers: > Take off: pretty quick tail up in ~100 feet, off the ground in ~250 > Stall: really slow > Final: ~60 mph > Landing: pretty slow > Roll out: pretty short > > Cross countries: > 2 day trips at 400 miles all day affairs > Several 200 mile trips > > Number of landings: ~350 (several with the motor stopped, > intentionally, for practice in carefully controlled situations. > Behaves the same as with the engine at idle.) > Number of attempted ground loops: several > Number of successful ground loops: 0 > It likes to be wheel-landed. > > Number of passengers: 13 different people (8 Young Eagles) > > Kevin Purtee > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=297907#297907 > > > ========== > st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > ========== > http://forums.matronics.com > ========== > le, List Admin. > ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ========== > > > -- > Rick Holland > Castle Rock, Colorado > > "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" > > * > > > * -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 100 Report NX899KP
From: "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil>
Date: May 17, 2010
The prop is a 68" warp drive. I tried decreasing the pitch. The static went up ~150 rpm. Gave me a slightly improved climb, slower top speed and more fuel burn (all to be expected). I put it back the way it was. I could probably try to increase the pitch and improve that top speed but it flies so darn good now I'm reluctant to change it. Given my short legs it doesn't matter too much anyway. (You know, if I hadn't verified that my airspeed indicator reads 10% high,I could lie about the top speed in good conscious...) I don't have gap seals on the elevators. The tail comes up really quick just the way it is. Kevin Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=298028#298028 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Countdown to Brodhead
Date: May 18, 2010
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
Last night's progress: Removed new, uninteresting modern-design ACS primer. Installed cool-lookin g antique Lunkenheimer primer that I found on Ebay. Installed front cockpi t cowl, and started lacing "distressed" leathercockpit coaming perimeter padding. Got it half laced. I want to use thin washers under all the metal cowl hold-on screws. All th e washers I have seen are too large in diameter and looks stupid because it extends out past the head of the screw. Does anyone know where I can find #8 washers that are less than 3/8" O.D.? Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Countdown to Brodhead
From: "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Date: May 18, 2010
Dan, 3/8" is pretty much the standard size for a #8 screw, but it looks like McMaster Carr carries some smaller washers: http://www.mcmaster.com/#washers/=7544va Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=298047#298047 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 18, 2010
From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov>
Subject: Re: Countdown to Brodhead
Hi Dan, On 05/18/2010 06:18 AM, helspersew(at)aol.com wrote: > Last night's progress: > Removed new, uninteresting modern-design ACS primer. Installed > cool-looking antique Lunkenheimer primer that I found on Ebay. Installed > front cockpit cowl, and started lacing "distressed" leathercockpit > coaming perimeter padding. Got it half laced. > I want to use thin washers under all the metal cowl hold-on screws. All > the washers I have seen are too large in diameter and looks stupid > because it extends out past the head of the screw. Does anyone know > where I can find #8 washers that are less than 3/8" O.D.? McMaster-Carr to the rescue: http://www.mcmaster.com/#washers/=7542hw Follow the trail: washers -> round hole -> for screw size [8] -> Outside Diameter Range [.25" to .399"] -> take your pick of Outside Diameter = [.28", .31", .313", or .375"] Cheers, Dan -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov>
Date: May 18, 2010
Subject: washers
Dan, I used nylon washers under my cowling screws for whatever size you need thru ACS, Wicks, or Dillsburg Aero. The nylon washers don't mar your paint and are lighter than steel washers. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 18, 2010
From: <dknoll(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: washers
Also available at Airparts of K.C. ---- "Cuy wrote: > > Dan, I used nylon washers under my cowling screws for whatever size you need thru ACS, Wicks, > or Dillsburg Aero. > > The nylon washers don't mar your paint and are lighter than steel washers. > > > > > > > > -- Lynn ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Allan Macklem" <awmacklem(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: washers
Date: May 18, 2010
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 18, 2010
From: Lawrence Williams <lnawms(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: lost piet builder?
I've lost track of a man that I visited a number of years ago in his shop. As near as I remember it was about 2000-2002. His name is Lou Larson and he lived in Tavares, FL. He had an "A" and was getting ready to cover when I visited him. Anyone know Lou??? Larry W. ' ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Countdown to Brodhead
From: "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson(at)erec.net>
Date: May 18, 2010
Dan these people have a good selection of small parts. I have quite a stock from my modeling days. My Piet has already got some on it. Very reasonable prices too. -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 Started building NX510JD July, 2009 Ribs and tailfeathers done using Lycoming O-235 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=298125#298125 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Washers
Date: May 18, 2010
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
Hi all, Thanks to everybody that gave me leads on washers for my cowling. I was ab le to find some that I think will work. It was tricky, cause they had to be black.....................oops..............I think I may have just gi ven something away. Darn!! Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: horiz stab capstrip question
From: "bcolleran" <bcolleran(at)comcast.net>
Date: May 18, 2010
Ok guys I made my gussets on my horizontal stab too big! yes there is such a thing. Now my capstrip placement is off. If I place the capstrip where it belongs as evenly placed I go right over my capstrip. I have attached a picture. I am thinking about just moving the capstrip placement 1" to it's planned placement. What are your thoughts? Little embarrassed I didn't lay it all out, but I guess that is what learning is for! Thanks, Bill N424BK Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=298128#298128 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0502_166.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: May 18, 2010
From: Dan Yocum <yocum(at)fnal.gov>
Subject: Re: lost piet builder?
Hi Larry, http://www.whitepages.com comes up with a couple suggestions: Lewis C Larson 415 Turkey Run Winter Park, FL No phone number given

May 01, 2010 - May 18, 2010

Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-je