Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-lh

June 21, 2012 - July 16, 2012



      
      Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
      
      
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From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Boothe Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 11:34 AM
Subject: Log Book
I have not flown since 1985, and my old log book was partially damaged in flood. The entries are still legible, and I am assuming that I should just start a new one. Anyone have any bright ideas? Gary Boothe NX308MB href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB" <steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil>
Date: Jun 21, 2012
Subject: Re: Log Book
I would start a new Logbook. this one will only become more fragile with time. I would put copies of the last two pages in the front of the new Logbook. As far as the binding. If you are not going to be using it. I would leave it alone. Tape can lead to other problems. On this old logbook first make sure that there is no mold or mildew. If there is, the best thing you can do is to take it out in Bright sunlight and make sure that all mold and mildew is exposed for several hours. It can take days to get all the pages. Then Put it in a sealed container with some original Lysol anti-bacterial liquid in the bottom. Killing the mold/mildew is essential. Then store it in a dry place. Everyone might consider scanning/copying their Logbooks and keeping them in hard copy and/or digits. Keep them separate from the originals, IE in hanger and at home. If you have a fire you don't want them all burned up. Then you can scan your new pages as they fill up. (You might consider doing this with any important photos as well.) I was a Museum Curator before 9-11 changed my life with multiple deployments and I have had multiple experiences with recovery from fires, floods and tornadoes. (Most fire recovery has more to do with water damage than fire damage.) Blue Skies, Steve D ----- Original Message ----- From: Gary Boothe <gboothe5(at)comcast.net> Date: Thursday, June 21, 2012 11:21 Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Log Book > Forgot to attach the picture. > > > > > > > > Thanks, Jack & Tools. I'm leaning toward the sentimental comment > that Tools > made..Duct tape may be the best fix. The binding took the worst of the > damage. If no one pops up with a better idea, then it'll be duct tape. > > > > Gary Boothe > > NX308MB > > > > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jack > Phillips > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 9:03 AM > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Log Book > > > > Keep the old one. Even damaged, it would still show some continuity. > Allied Van Lines lost my first logbook (I had already started the > second one > and managed to keep it). Life would be simpler if I still had it. > > > > You'll need a BFR from a Certified Flight Instructor and a medical > if you > are going to fly as a Private Pilot and carry passengers. If you > will be > flying as a Sport Pilot, you'll still need a BFR before carrying > passengers(I think - I've never dealt with Light Sport pilots as a > CFI), but it can be > administered by a Light Sport Instructor, or by a CFI. > > > > Jack Phillips > > NX899JP > > Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia > > > > _____ > > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of > Gary Boothe > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 11:34 AM > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Log Book > > I have not flown since 1985, and my old log book was partially > damaged in > flood. The entries are still legible, and I am assuming that I > should just > start a new one. Anyone have any bright ideas? > > > > Gary Boothe > > NX308MB > > > > > > href="blockedhttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol- > List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > href="blockedhttp://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="blockedhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "C N Campbell" <cncampbell(at)windstream.net>
Subject: Re: Log Book
Date: Jun 21, 2012
Yeah, Gary. I have started new log books several times. Just keep the old log book and transfer the total hours from the old one to the first page of the new one. I'm going to start a new log book with my biannual review when I get far enough along to get one. Don't want to get the review too far in advance -- I might forget how all over again. One never forgets how. Just get a bit of practice in another airplane before you fly the Piet for the first time. Chuck PS The corvair is just about ready for its first run. C ----- Original Message ----- From: Gary Boothe To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 11:33 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Log Book I have not flown since 1985, and my old log book was partially damaged in flood. The entries are still legible, and I am assuming that I should just start a new one. Anyone have any bright ideas? Gary Boothe NX308MB ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Log Book
From: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
Date: Jun 21, 2012
Q2h1Y2ssDQoNCldoZW4geW91IHN0YXJ0IHRoYXQgQ29ydmFpciwgYmUgc3VyZSB5b3UgaGF2ZSB5 b3Vyc2VsZiB0aWVkIGRvd24hIDstKQ0KDQpHYXJ5DQpEbyBub3QgYXJjaGl2ZQ0KU2VudCBvbiB0 aGUgU3ByaW50riBOb3cgTmV0d29yayBmcm9tIG15IEJsYWNrQmVycnmuDQoNCi0tLS0tT3JpZ2lu YWwgTWVzc2FnZS0tLS0tDQpGcm9tOiAiQyBOIENhbXBiZWxsIiA8Y25jYW1wYmVsbEB3aW5kc3Ry ZWFtLm5ldD4NClNlbmRlcjogb3duZXItcGlldGVucG9sLWxpc3Qtc2VydmVyQG1hdHJvbmljcy5j b20NCkRhdGU6IFRodSwgMjEgSnVuIDIwMTIgMTM6MDA6NTUgDQpUbzogPHBpZXRlbnBvbC1saXN0 QG1hdHJvbmljcy5jb20+DQpSZXBseS1UbzogcGlldGVucG9sLWxpc3RAbWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbVN1 YmplY3Q6IFJlOiBQaWV0ZW5wb2wtTGlzdDogTG9nIEJvb2sNCg0KVGhpcyBpcyBhIG11bHRpLXBh cnQgbWVzc2FnZSBpbiBNSU1FIGZvcm1hdC4NCg0K ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Turnbuckles for sale
From: "namrednos" <namrednos(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jun 21, 2012
Papa Mike, I will take 22 of the turnbuckles. Let me know what your pay-pall address is and I will send the money 859-468-0047 Thank You Scott -------- Scott Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376223#376223 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Duel time
From: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
Date: Jun 21, 2012
Assuming that it is near impossible to find a CFI who can/will climb into the front cockpit, how are others getting thru the requirement of 5 hrs dual in make and model for liability insurance? Gary from Cool Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 21, 2012
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Engine Assembly Update
Crew, I have been working on engine assembly and thought I might post some update pictures. I have a bunch on the camera still...I'll post some of tho se at a later date. The first two show the case halves before and after bead blasting. The case on the right in both pictures are how I got them back from zyglo inspectio n, the case of the left is after I blasted it. Next was the flushing. By blocking off various ports by hand, I got some gr eat fountain effects out of the different oil passages! Finally, prepping for paint. As of right now I have the cases back together.- I will be assembling and installing the accessory case either today or tomorrow. Next up will be cylinders. Michael Perez =0APietenpol HINT Videos =0AKaretaker Aero =0Awww.karetakeraero.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Turnbuckles for sale
From: "899PM" <rockriverrifle(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jun 21, 2012
At this point, I am pretty sure that I am sold out on the turnbuckles. Anyone that PM'd (or otherwise) prior to this post should be getting turnbuckles. Please be patient with me as I sort thru the posts and emails to respond in the order of date/time rec'd. Mike -------- PAPA MIKE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376228#376228 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Duel time
Date: Jun 21, 2012
Depends on the insurance. I insured mine with Falcon (EAA Insurance). They insured it for the first flight and all subsequent flights with no requirements for dual instruction. If you have had at least 3 inspections from an EAA Technical Counselor (every chapter should have at least one), they will insure itfor the first flights. Most other companies won't insure you until you have some minimum time (I think it's usually 10 hours) on the airplane. Note that I was a current pilot who had recently (within 2 years) owned a tailwheel airplane. Still, I borrowed a friend's J-3 Cub and got myself tailwheel current again before attempting to fly my Pietenpol. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of gboothe5(at)comcast.net Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 2:19 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Duel time Assuming that it is near impossible to find a CFI who can/will climb into the front cockpit, how are others getting thru the requirement of 5 hrs dual in make and model for liability insurance? Gary from Cool Sent on the SprintR Now Network from my BlackBerryR ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB" <steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil>
Date: Jun 21, 2012
Subject: Re: Duel time
Check with your local EAA chapter, there should be someone who loves these classic planes and will not only be willing, but eager to fly in your plane. Steve D ----- Original Message ----- From: gboothe5(at)comcast.net Date: Thursday, June 21, 2012 13:25 Subject: Pietenpol-List: Duel time > > Assuming that it is near impossible to find a CFI who can/will > climb into the front cockpit, how are others getting thru the > requirement of 5 hrs dual in make and model for liability insurance? > > Gary from Cool > Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Engine Assembly Update
Date: Jun 21, 2012
Nice pictures, Michael. Note for all you Corvair builders out there, just how large the front main bearing is on this low horsepower engine. Now you understand why the 5th bearing is needed on a Corvair (and even with the 5th bearing, it still doesn't have as much bearing area as this aircraft engine has). Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Perez Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 2:22 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Engine Assembly Update Crew, I have been working on engine assembly and thought I might post some update pictures. I have a bunch on the camera still...I'll post some of those at a later date. The first two show the case halves before and after bead blasting. The case on the right in both pictures are how I got them back from zyglo inspection, the case of the left is after I blasted it. Next was the flushing. By blocking off various ports by hand, I got some great fountain effects out of the different oil passages! Finally, prepping for paint. As of right now I have the cases back together. I will be assembling and installing the accessory case either today or tomorrow. Next up will be cylinders. Michael Perez Pietenpol HINT Videos Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: John Hofmann <jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com>
Subject: Re: Duel time
Date: Jun 21, 2012
When I added 502R last year I was not required to have any time in type. I also insure through Falcon and it probably helped that I already had a Cub on their books. -john- John Hofmann Vice-President, Information Technology The Rees Group, Inc. 2424 American Lane Madison, WI 53704 Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150 Fax: 608.443.2474 Email: jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.com On Jun 21, 2012, at 1:47 PM, Jack Phillips wrote: > > Depends on the insurance. I insured mine with Falcon (EAA Insurance). They > insured it for the first flight and all subsequent flights with no > requirements for dual instruction. If you have had at least 3 inspections > from an EAA Technical Counselor (every chapter should have at least one), > they will insure itfor the first flights. Most other companies won't insure > you until you have some minimum time (I think it's usually 10 hours) on the > airplane. > > Note that I was a current pilot who had recently (within 2 years) owned a > tailwheel airplane. Still, I borrowed a friend's J-3 Cub and got myself > tailwheel current again before attempting to fly my Pietenpol. > > Jack Phillips > NX899JP > Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of > gboothe5(at)comcast.net > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 2:19 PM > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Duel time > > > Assuming that it is near impossible to find a CFI who can/will climb into > the front cockpit, how are others getting thru the requirement of 5 hrs dual > in make and model for liability insurance? > > Gary from Cool > Sent on the SprintR Now Network from my BlackBerryR > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 21, 2012
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Engine Assembly Update
Thank you Jack.- That front bearing surface is about 3.5" long with quite the large oil hole in it and about 1.5" in dia. - I am glad to be building an aircraft engine...it is a great learning experi ence building my own. Michael Perez Pietenpol HINT Videos Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Duel time
From: "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil>
Date: Jun 21, 2012
Hi Gary - I'm assuming you're not angry enough with anyone to walk twenty paces, turn and fire. Regardless, I had a similar hour/dual requirement before Falcon would insure me. I self-insured until I had 25 hours and then reapplied. The premium went way down and continues to drop each year as we build time. -------- Kevin "Axel" Purtee NX899KP Austin/San Marcos, TX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376246#376246 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Duel time
Date: Jun 21, 2012
Kevin - I'm not angry. I'm nearing the culmination of a life-time dream and I'm sure this is minor hurdle...not sure what you mean about "self-insuring", though. In my case, the owners of the hangars require policy info. Jack - they did not ask if I had any inspections! I did present the problem of getting a CFI into the front cockpit, and asked if dual time in a Cub or Champ would be accepted....no answer back. I'm talking with Falcon, too. John - you may be the finest flyer I have ever seen...if only the war had lasted a little longer.... Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of kevinpurtee Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 1:10 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Duel time --> Hi Gary - I'm assuming you're not angry enough with anyone to walk twenty paces, turn and fire. Regardless, I had a similar hour/dual requirement before Falcon would insure me. I self-insured until I had 25 hours and then reapplied. The premium went way down and continues to drop each year as we build time. -------- Kevin "Axel" Purtee NX899KP Austin/San Marcos, TX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376246#376246 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 21, 2012
From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Duel time
HI kevin, with your prop set at 7.5 degrees what kind of fuel burn are you getting? With mine set at 8.5 I was getting 6 gal/hr. 2500 rpm and about 80 mph. Frank metcalf is getting 4.5 galper hr with a 66-34 wood prop. He cruises at 7o mph. jUST ASKING. Think more about Triple Tree Aerodrome just after Labor Day. It looks like we will have abt 10 PIETS THERE along with 400 others. Gardiner ----- Original Message ---- From: kevinpurtee <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil> Sent: Thu, June 21, 2012 4:11:59 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Duel time Hi Gary - I'm assuming you're not angry enough with anyone to walk twenty paces, turn and fire. Regardless, I had a similar hour/dual requirement before Falcon would insure me. I self-insured until I had 25 hours and then reapplied. The premium went way down and continues to drop each year as we build time. -------- Kevin "Axel" Purtee NX899KP Austin/San Marcos, TX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376246#376246 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 21, 2012
From: Dave Millikan <n11dmx(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Turnbuckles for sale
I will buy 6 of them if still available Dave in Fla. --- On Thu, 6/21/12, Ray Krause wrote: From: Ray Krause <Raykrause(at)frontiernet.net> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Turnbuckles for sale Date: Thursday, June 21, 2012, 3:07 AM et> Papa Mike, I will take 20 of them, if they are still available.- If OK with you, I w ill send a check whenever you say to do so. Thanks a Million for the offer! Ray Krause 843 Jay Street Colusa, Ca 95932 530-458-7097 (home) 530-736-2627 (cell) Building Sky Scout ----- Original Message ----- From: "899PM" <rockriverrifle(at)hotmail.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2012 5:36 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Turnbuckles for sale > > > I have over (100) AN140-16S turnbuckles for sale. They are used and have > (2) cable eyes. I used motorcycle chain sideplates/links to create a > "fork" and- used- these throughout my Air Camper. $8ea plus $5 shippi ng > via USPS Priority small flat rate box. Please PM me with orders. Check, M O > or PayPal all work fine. > > Thanx.......Mike > > -------- > PAPA MIKE > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376124#376124 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_4302_811.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_4299_207.jpg > > > le, List Admin. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB" <steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil>
Date: Jun 21, 2012
Subject: Re: Duel time
Gary, to "self Insure:" really means to fly without insurance. If you wreck your plane you fix it and suffer the loss. If you hit someone else's stuff then you are personally liable. (IE hit a Learjet or crash into a school house full of kids, then they sue you. Not the insurance company.) You might ask exactly what the hangerowners want. IE protection in case you burn the hanger down? Then you might see if there is a renters insurance that would cover you for much less. The only reason I insure my Vtail is so that I am covered by liability to fly kids for Young Eagles. I go ahead and get hull insurance because it only costs $200 more per year. ($800 for liability plus $200 for hull) my old Bonanza is worth about $20-25,000 IF I can find a buyer. Old airplane values crashed when the market did and have not recovered. It was worth about $60,000 before the crash. If I am not taking part in the Young Eagles Program, I "Self Insure". I figure if I slap a wing to the ground lightly, I will learn sheet metal work. If I roll it into a ball, I will either be in the hospital and not worried about the plane or I will walk away and sell the ball for scrap. I will then have to find a cheap little plane to fly. I might even have to build a plane. Blue Skies, Steve D 1948 straight 35 Bonanza, (Forked-tail Doctor Killer!) ----- Original Message ----- From: Gary Boothe <gboothe5(at)comcast.net> Date: Thursday, June 21, 2012 17:38 Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Duel time > > Kevin - I'm not angry. I'm nearing the culmination of a life-time dream and > I'm sure this is minor hurdle...not sure what you mean about > "self-insuring", though. In my case, the owners of the hangars require > policy info. > > Jack - they did not ask if I had any inspections! I did present the problem > of getting a CFI into the front cockpit, and asked if dual time in a Cub or > Champ would be accepted....no answer back. I'm talking with Falcon, too. > > John - you may be the finest flyer I have ever seen...if only the war had > lasted a little longer.... > > Gary Boothe > NX308MB > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of kevinpurtee > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 1:10 PM > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Duel time > > --> < > > Hi Gary - I'm assuming you're not angry enough with anyone to walk twenty > paces, turn and fire. > > Regardless, I had a similar hour/dual requirement before Falcon would insure > me. I self-insured until I had 25 hours and then reapplied. The premium > went way down and continues to drop each year as we build time. > > -------- > Kevin "Axel" Purtee > NX899KP > Austin/San Marcos, TX > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376246#376246 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Duel time
From: Ben Charvet <bencharvet(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jun 21, 2012
I insured my Piet for its first flight with EAA and all they required was that I completed a Flight Advisor review. I was current in a Baby Ace at the time. Have hou talked with them on the phone or just the online app? Sent from my iPhone On Jun 21, 2012, at 2:19 PM, gboothe5(at)comcast.net wrote: > > Assuming that it is near impossible to find a CFI who can/will climb into the front cockpit, how are others getting thru the requirement of 5 hrs dual in make and model for liability insurance? > > Gary from Cool > Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 21, 2012
From: shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: WACO Fly-In Ohio(Free food)
Is anyone going to the waco fly in- at Wynkoop Airport in Mount Vernon Oh io this weekend?- It is open to other than WACO traffic this year for the 1st time in 2 years.- I flew over there this evening and talked with Bil l Knight (Owns the Last Original, and a waco).- Frank Pavliga flew his WA CO 9 (or 10 I don't know wacos that well) in for the weekend.- I am only a 10 min. flight from Wynkoop(on a 3000 ft grass strip), so I am voulenteer ing to host a Piet cookout at my house for any one who wants to fly-in on s aturday afternoon.-(Pietenpol, and other cool tailwheelers as well).- I will probably fly over again tommorow and saturday weather permitting.- Let me know if anyone is interested.- I will post a time if I get some re sponses, otherwise, cook your own darn food....ha ha ha - Shad- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clif Dawson" <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Horn mistake....
Date: Jun 21, 2012
Don't forget farther movement. Banging rudder into elevators is not a good thing. :-) Even with proper horn I have bar stops to keep rudder one inch away from elevators. Clif > > I agree with Greg, Mario. If you put a smaller horn on the rudder than it > was designed for, two things will happen: Rudder pedal forces will go up, > and rudder sensitivity will increase. I can't predict how this will > affect > the handling of the airplane, but I can say that if built as designed, the > rudder on this airplane feels just about perfect - > Jack Phillips > NX899JP > Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Gerry Holland <gholland@content-stream.co.uk>
Subject: Re: pinstriping tape
Date: Jun 22, 2012
Douwe I used pin striping Vinyl to 'edge' a trim colour I painted on my aircraft. It was 8mm wide (3/8") and worked very well as the vinyl will follow bends if laid down gently. Press it home firmly with a soft cloth or rag once in position and there it stays. Having had a $8000 paint job on an earlier 'plastic' Airplane I had built I used a roller and polyurethane paint during this refurbishment of this one. The pin striping gave a quality finish. Here is an example of a supplier in UK. http://www.the4all.com/hometape.html Regards Gerry ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: pinstriping tape
From: "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com>
Date: Jun 22, 2012
Hey Douwe, This is the stuff I use. http://www.tptools.com/Product.aspx?display_id=106 Great stuff. The guys that paint flames on motorcycles and cars use this because it is very flexible. The key is to press it down firmly. I use the back of my fingernail to get a really good seal. To really ensure no leak through, spray a little of the base color along the edge of the tape or a little clear dope. Just a very fine layer. This will seal the edge. Then spray your trim color. The other key is to pull the tape off at nearly a 180 degree angle and pull it off at the right time. Sometimes that time is 20 to 30 minutes after spraying. But if the trim color starts to lift at all, stop! Wait a while. I don't like to wait more than 2 to 3 hours though because the paint starts to lose a little of its flexibility to cut a fine line when the tape is pulled. Very satisfying when you get it right! I recently used the 1/4" tape for the star insignia on the L2 I recently did. Don Emch NX899DE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376299#376299 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0957_730.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/photo0314_154.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Horn mistake....
From: "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com>
Date: Jun 22, 2012
Jack... Why is it that we keep our "practice" parts? I have a whole box of those too. Ha! Why do I keep those things?! Don Emch NX899DE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376302#376302 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Horn mistake....
Date: Jun 22, 2012
Good question. Maybe we put so much time into making them that even though they're bad, we can't bear to throw them away. Mine are gone now, though, unless they are big enough pieces of steel to be useful to make something else. For example, there is the spreader bar I built for my landing gear with one end flattened to the correct angle, and the other end also flattened, but at some odd angle to the first end. No way to fix it, but I don't want to throw away a 4' length of tubing with two flattened ends. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Don Emch Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 7:52 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Horn mistake.... Jack... Why is it that we keep our "practice" parts? I have a whole box of those too. Ha! Why do I keep those things?! Don Emch NX899DE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376302#376302 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: what is a BFR Jack?
Date: Jun 22, 2012
Hey Jack, What is the BFR you were referring to in your post about dual?? Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: what is a BFR Jack?
From: "womenfly2" <Love2Fly.KAP(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jun 22, 2012
-------- Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376313#376313 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Log Book
From: "AircamperN11MS" <Scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org>
Date: Jun 22, 2012
Gary, Come down and spend a weekend or week days with me. We will fly the piet all weekend to get you up to speed and comfortable with it. I think the insurance company would consider it duel time since I have so much time in them. In fact, that would be a good question for them. Even if they don't it would be a good transition for you. -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376314#376314 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Log Book
From: "AircamperN11MS" <Scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org>
Date: Jun 22, 2012
Here is my contact info. Cell 661-400-1876 Home 661-718-1155 Work 213-485-6137 Typically 5am-2pm Tuesday-Friday. Hours may vary depending on fun meter levels. Personal email: pietman(at)qnet.com -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376319#376319 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 22, 2012
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Mike Perez's Engine Assembly Update
Thanks Mike! I hope in another four months to have the engine running...but only time will tell. Working on these engines is enjoyable and quite rewarding. Michael Perez Pietenpol HINT Videos Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 22, 2012
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: from blizzard to 95F and a clean engine case in June
That was a great day for me...including the weather. EVERYTHING about that day told me I was making the right choice. That day would not have happened with out you Mike, so thanks to YOU! Michael Perez Pietenpol HINT Videos Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov>
Date: Jun 22, 2012
Subject: what's great about this whole Pietenpol thing
I can't help but think of all the guys who were further along in the proces s of building when I started to build who helped me out along the way-Frank Pavliga was instrumental in guiding me thru the building process sharing what he and his father learned and each one of you can tell a story of one, two, maybe 10 people who helped you as you got started and now along the way. The Piet group has always been like family almost where you start helping a person or they help you then you become friends because of your common interests and goals and then when you're well along in the process you can in turn reach back and help the newer builders in the same way. Very cool stuff. Now get back to making sawdust and burning yourself on hot metal fittings:) ! Mike C. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RE: Insurance requirements
From: woodflier(at)aol.com
Date: Jun 22, 2012
Gary, I insured 629ML through AUA Insurance in Birmingham, AL. I have anoth er airplane with them so I did get a good rate, but there was no time-in-type requirement. They d id want to know total tailwheel time, since the other airplane they insure is a nose dragger. But they did insure it for the first flight onward. One tip to cut insurance cost, since you can't carry passengers 40 hours, y ou can opt to delete any coverage for passenger liability or injury until you've flown off your time . Saves a few bucks. My policy allowed me to add that coverage after the test period. Also, I opted for hull coverage for not-in-motion only. Protects it if the hangar burns, or it gets damaged tied down but not while taxiing or flying. That was pretty cheap comparatively. And like Kevi n said, the more time you have in the airplane, the lower the rate will be if you want to add full coverage l ater on. Matt Paxton On Jun 21, 2012, at 2:19 PM, gboothe5(at)comcast.net wrote: > > Assuming that it is near impossible to find a CFI who can/will climb into the front cockpit, how are others getting thru the requirement of 5 hrs dual in make and model for liability insurance? > > Gary from Cool ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: what is a BFR Jack?
Date: Jun 22, 2012
Biennial Flight Review (now just called a Flight Review by the FAA). Required every 24 calendar months in order to carry passengers. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Douwe Blumberg Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 9:33 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: what is a BFR Jack? Hey Jack, What is the BFR you were referring to in your post about dual?? Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 22, 2012
From: shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: WACO Fly-In Ohio(Free food)
Guys, I was mistaken about the WACO fly-in, it is NOTAM'ed CLOSED.- I mis understood Mr Wynkoop, he gave ME permission so it might go over like a far t in church if one of you land there at the fly-in.- Ya'll are still welc ome to fly in here though for a bite to eat.- Sorry for the confusion, ju st don't want to invite someone into a violation if a fed would happen to b e around. - Ducking the rocks, - Shad ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov>
Date: Jun 22, 2012
Subject: Re: what's great about this whole Pietenpol thing
I thank you as well Jerry for the kind words and I'm sure now you're going to pass the torch of whatever knowledge you have to the next batch of Pietenpo l builders. After going thru this whole process you realize that you've not just built an airplane but lasting relationships with some good people. You gravitate t o the other builders approach their project and think along the same lines as you do and in my case I could tell right away that Jack Phillips was on the same t rack as I was so we would compare notes off list to help each other and eventual ly we flew formation together in 2005 from Cleveland to Brodhead arriving as a fl ight of two overhead and then circled to land for Jack's first appearance at Bro dhead. You can't beat that for capping off of project well done with the help of s ome solid, fun, and enjoyable people. For those of you who are attending Brodhead for the first time next month, Doc and Dee Mosher do a fantastic job helping this event to happen and when you register you'll get a name tag to wear. Some of the best things about this list are when you get to put that name tag and face together and shake that hand of someo ne on the list you've been reading and responding to for months, in some cases ye ars. There are a few MUST-meet people on this list...and I'm really blessed to b e friends with many of them. Mike C. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: what's great about this whole Pietenpol thing
From: "pineymb" <airltd(at)mts.net>
Date: Jun 22, 2012
Very well said Mike...nothing could be closer to the truth. As you say, really looking forward to putting faces to some of the people on the list who live and breath aviation. -------- Adrian M Winnipeg, MB Canada Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376378#376378 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Camera Mounts
From: "John Francis" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com>
Date: Jun 23, 2012
As I am building I am wondering if anyone has built in camera mounts at strategic locations for filming flights. Simple threaded studs could protude from several locations of the aircraft to easily attach a video camera. -------- John Francis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376425#376425 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: names tags at Brodhead
From: "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Date: Jun 23, 2012
As a reminder - the BPA generously provides nametags. Just check in at the friendly BPA booth upon arrival at the airport, and they'll give you a nametag. While you're there, you might as well renew your subscription to the BPA newsletter. If you're a member of the BPA, you're also eligible for the free raffle prizes. Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376432#376432 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Camera Mounts
From: Amsafetyc <amsafetyc(at)aol.com>
Date: Jun 23, 2012
I too am interested in learning that same thing as it would be much easier to incorporate that into the build than to do it as an add on or modification. John Sent from my iPhone On Jun 23, 2012, at 10:26 AM, "John Francis" wrote: > > As I am building I am wondering if anyone has built in camera mounts at strategic locations for filming flights. Simple threaded studs could protude from several locations of the aircraft to easily attach a video camera. > > -------- > John Francis > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376425#376425 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 1929,1932,1934... (purist alert!!)
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jun 23, 2012
I am NX29BP... so I vote for 1929 as well. Wiki says 1928... wonder where they got that info? Ray, the first sky scout (10718) was built in 1931 if we are to believe the data plate and it belonged to Orrin Hoopman. Wiki says 1933... wrong again. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376458#376458 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: 1929,1932,1934... (purist alert!!)
Date: Jun 23, 2012
I say, "Look on your plans." If they say 1937, as mine do, then I'm building a 1937 Pietenpol. How could it be anything different? If yours says 1927, then that's what you're building... Gary from Cool Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376458#376458 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ray Krause" <Raykrause(at)frontiernet.net>
Subject: Re: 1929,1932,1934... (purist alert!!)
Date: Jun 23, 2012
Thanks, Mark. I know the story behind the Sky Scout, so I knew it was later than the AirCamper. Guess I will have a fairly unique plane! All to plans, so far. Ray ----- Original Message ----- From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net> Sent: Saturday, June 23, 2012 1:55 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: 1929,1932,1934... (purist alert!!) > > I am NX29BP... so I vote for 1929 as well. Wiki says 1928... wonder where > they got that info? > > Ray, the first sky scout (10718) was built in 1931 if we are to believe > the data plate and it belonged to Orrin Hoopman. Wiki says 1933... wrong > again. > > -------- > Mark Chouinard > Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on > Landing Gear > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376458#376458 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: 1929,1932,1934... (purist alert!!)
Date: Jun 23, 2012
I thought mine said 1934. And I didn't know the Corvair existed in 1937. The A65 Continental was designed in 1936 and was in production by 1938, but I don't think the Corvair came into being until 1959. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Boothe Sent: Saturday, June 23, 2012 8:02 PM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: 1929,1932,1934... (purist alert!!) --> I say, "Look on your plans." If they say 1937, as mine do, then I'm building a 1937 Pietenpol. How could it be anything different? If yours says 1927, then that's what you're building... Gary from Cool Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376458#376458 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 23, 2012
Subject: NX7229R Flies again!
From: Andrew Eldredge <andrew.eldredge(at)gmail.com>
After major repairs to the fuselage, NX7229R put .75 hours on the Tach today. Annual was signed Thursday morning. Today, three high speed runs down the runway, she wanted to fly, but I only lifted the tail. Stopped to see if anythin in the controls had shifted. Called in a ground crew next and committed to the air for a lap around the patch. That worked out so nicely that I had to do it again.... -- Andrew Eldredge Provo, UT ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 1929,1932,1934... (purist alert!!)
From: "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Date: Jun 23, 2012
Hmmm... why did you paint "Travel Air" on the fin of your Pietenpol, Gene? That's confusing. Gene wrote: > You think painting the name on the tail is going to let anyone know what it is?? I've got "Travel Air" in big letters on the fin and still get "what is it, a Stearman?" all the time. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376480#376480 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 1929
Date: Jun 24, 2012
Well, that didn't turn out to be much of a horse beatin'. Was almost painless! Almost everyone agrees, so 1929 it is, plus I've always liked the earlier date. JOHN, when is the big unveiling event going to take place?? CONGRATS Andrew!! Send pics and post a video!! Prepping sheet metal today, spraying early this week, then twiddly stuff and reassembly?? ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: 1 piece vs. 3 piece wing weight?
From: "FandS_Piet" <fkim79(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jun 24, 2012
So I have been pondering about a building a 1 or 3 piece wing. Without ranting about the advantages and disadvantages that we all know about it seems to me like the 1 piece is a no brainer IF you have the space. Tony Bingelis says that says that the 1 piece is 30-50 lbs lighter and saves you about 100 hours in building time. Both of which are substantial numbers with weight savings being far more than important to me than time. My question is to those with flying Piets have you weighed your completed wing? I understand there are variables such as fuel tank or no fuel tank, stainless or aluminum ect... Thanks, Fred Kim Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376500#376500 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: 1 piece vs. 3 piece wing weight?
Date: Jun 24, 2012
Fred, Good luck with your decision. Mine is 3 piece by necessity. One very real benefit for me was that, except for hanging the wings for W&B, I have been able to lift, turn, hoist (hundreds...thousands...of times) all by myself. If you have built-in help, more power to you! Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of FandS_Piet Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2012 11:08 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: 1 piece vs. 3 piece wing weight? So I have been pondering about a building a 1 or 3 piece wing. Without ranting about the advantages and disadvantages that we all know about it seems to me like the 1 piece is a no brainer IF you have the space. Tony Bingelis says that says that the 1 piece is 30-50 lbs lighter and saves you about 100 hours in building time. Both of which are substantial numbers with weight savings being far more than important to me than time. My question is to those with flying Piets have you weighed your completed wing? I understand there are variables such as fuel tank or no fuel tank, stainless or aluminum ect... Thanks, Fred Kim Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376500#376500 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: 1 piece vs. 3 piece wing weight?
Date: Jun 24, 2012
Fred, I don't know about Tony Bingelis making ANY claims about the Pietenpol. He never built one. I can say that I seriously doubt any claim of the one-piece wing being 30-50 lbs lighter than the 3-piece. I would believe 10-15 lbs, but no more than that. Counter to the weight argument is the fact that the one piece wing is rather fragile until completed and mounted on the airplane. While I built the 3-piece wing myself (even though I had plenty of room to do a one-piece), I have helped Gene Rambo work on his one-piece wing and it is extremely difficult to turn that wing over, even with two people. You really need a third person to support the wing in the middle as you flip it over. Think about how many times you will need to turn that wing over as you build, cover and paint it. Then think about how you are going to transport it to the airport once built. And if, like me, you are unfortunate enough to make a forced landing and need to move the airplane from the crash site by truck, a one-piece wing will again cause more problems. I did a lot of things on my Pietenpol that I would change if I were to build another, but I would keep the 3-piece wing. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of FandS_Piet Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2012 2:08 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: 1 piece vs. 3 piece wing weight? So I have been pondering about a building a 1 or 3 piece wing. Without ranting about the advantages and disadvantages that we all know about it seems to me like the 1 piece is a no brainer IF you have the space. Tony Bingelis says that says that the 1 piece is 30-50 lbs lighter and saves you about 100 hours in building time. Both of which are substantial numbers with weight savings being far more than important to me than time. My question is to those with flying Piets have you weighed your completed wing? I understand there are variables such as fuel tank or no fuel tank, stainless or aluminum ect... Thanks, Fred Kim Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376500#376500 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 1 piece vs. 3 piece wing weight?
From: "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil>
Date: Jun 24, 2012
I have the one piece and, while it was probably less complex to build, it was a pain in the butt to handle. I was stranded on more than one occasion looking for help to flip it. As Jack says, if I land out and have to recover the aircraft by truck the one piece wing will be a challenge. Regarding weight savings: I believe most of my corvair brothers have built the three piece and and the corvair powered piets are all about the same weight. I'll built a 3 piece wing next time. -------- Kevin "Axel" Purtee NX899KP Austin/San Marcos, TX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376507#376507 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Next time...
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jun 24, 2012
Just noticed something kind of interesting in the 3 piece wing thread. That was Kevin's statement about building a three piece wing "next time". Dick N is on his third. I own one and am building. I knew a guy in San Diego who built one, then bought one. Who else has built or owned more than one? Is it more common in the Piet genre to build or own multiples? Also, Piets seem to be built in multiples by groups, as well as multiples building one (as in EAA chapters). I'm sure the RV series has a bunch of this, by nature of the popularity. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376508#376508 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 1 piece vs. 3 piece wing weight?
From: "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com>
Date: Jun 24, 2012
Hey Fred, I really like the benefits of a one piece wing. Lighter and less to build. Although I can't imagine it's much lighter than a few pounds. But having built/rebuilt/covered several wings I honestly can't imagine dealing with such a large panel. I'm glad I built the three piece. Someday when I finish the Piet my dad started it'll have the three piece, even if I have the space. By the way... are you Jr. or Sr.? Don Emch NX899DE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376513#376513 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 1 piece vs. 3 piece wing weight?
From: Amsafetyc <amsafetyc(at)aol.com>
Date: Jun 24, 2012
Fred, I am still in build mode but beyond the wing part. I built the fuse, wings and tail surfaces in a basement area that was maybe 18 feet wide at the widest and 10 feet at the narrowest and 24 long at its longest, so rather a small space. Building the 3 piece was a necessary exercise in spacial logistics manipulation. Yet most of the time I was able to hang and move the panels by my self. The night I did my first trial fit I had help on one side the other I hung myself a bit of an adventure but do able none the less. I am happy to have built the 3 piece rather than trying to move and manipulate the length and bulk of the single wing. I hope this helps in your decision making process. Btw I have no scarf joints in my spars, just hardware connectors to the center section. John Sent from my iPhone On Jun 24, 2012, at 2:07 PM, "FandS_Piet" wrote: > > So I have been pondering about a building a 1 or 3 piece wing. Without ranting about the advantages and disadvantages that we all know about it seems to me like the 1 piece is a no brainer IF you have the space. Tony Bingelis says that says that the 1 piece is 30-50 lbs lighter and saves you about 100 hours in building time. Both of which are substantial numbers with weight savings being far more than important to me than time. > My question is to those with flying Piets have you weighed your completed wing? I understand there are variables such as fuel tank or no fuel tank, stainless or aluminum ect... > > Thanks, > Fred Kim > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376500#376500 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 1 piece vs. 3 piece wing weight?
From: "FandS_Piet" <fkim79(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jun 24, 2012
Hey Don, This is Jr. Did you end up making it to Beach City? We ended up not going because of weather. We stuck around and did some local flying. I wanted to ask if you installed a trim tab on your airplane being that you installed a header tank and its forward of the CG? If not how is it while flying and do you think it would be worth installing. I myself found it hard to believe 30-50 lbs when I read that. If that was the case I think most probably would have opted to build the one piece wing. -------- Fred Kim Pittsburgh, Pa Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376517#376517 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/scan10001_148.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 1929,1932,1934... (purist alert!!)
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jun 24, 2012
Guess I better reserve 59BP... So then, what is the correct answer to the original question? Regardless of engine, instrumentation, type of covering or paint blend, when was the first true Air Camper flown? Doesn't really matter much to me... I'll continue to tell people that the airplane I'm building is based on a 1929 design... is that correct, or we need to keep our horse beaters handy? -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376527#376527 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 1 piece vs. 3 piece wing weight?
From: "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com>
Date: Jun 25, 2012
Hey Fred, I didn't make it to Beach City. The thunderstorms kept me away. I don't have any kind of trim system or tabs. My nose tank holds 14.5 gallons. When it is full I do have to hold some back stick, but it is so minimal I really don't even notice it. Even when flying cross-countries all day long it's no big deal. You'll probably get several different ideas on this but I've never seen it as anything I would need. Don Emch NX899DE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376544#376544 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: 3-piece wing
Date: Jun 25, 2012
I concur that the one piece wing cannot weigh much less, maybe 5 pounds max??... maybe??? My observations seem to reveal the chief reasons for building the one-piece are: 1. SOME weight savings 2. SOME building simplicity, though offset in my opinion FAR OFFSET by the PIA caused by it's size through the building process 3. It's the purist form of Pietenpol wing 4. and maybe the most important reason I've seen is. the all important COOLNESS FACTOR!! "Oh and. did you notice?.that's a one-piece wing up there." If any of these, or a combination of the above are important enough to you, then go ahead and build a one-piece. I'm personally very glad I have the three-piece for all the reasons stated by others. $.02 Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: 1 piece vs. 3 piece wing weight?
From: "pineymb" <airltd(at)mts.net>
Date: Jun 25, 2012
Compromise and meet half way as in a two piece. Supposedly about 7 pound saving in weight compared to three piece. -------- Adrian M Winnipeg, MB Canada Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376548#376548 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc00561_790.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc00105_497.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Need a ride to Chicago Midway?
From: "tkreiner" <tkreiner(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jun 25, 2012
Recently, someone posted the need for a ride from OSH to MDW after AirVenture is over. I wasn't able to find the post, hence this new post. On Sunday, July 29, I'll be driving to MDW early afternoon. Should arrive there around 6 pm... Exact time of arrival per wife's flight. If anyone needs a lift, let me know offline. -------- Tom Kreiner Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376549#376549 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "C N Campbell" <cncampbell(at)windstream.net>
Subject: Re: Next time...
Date: Jun 25, 2012
I just hope I get the one I'm working on finished before I pass on! I have never considered building another one. I might think more about it after I have flown the current one for a while. There are some things I would have done differently had I known before hand what would happen. Chuck Don not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2012 4:19 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Next time... > > Just noticed something kind of interesting in the 3 piece wing thread. > That was Kevin's statement about building a three piece wing "next time". > > Dick N is on his third. I own one and am building. I knew a guy in San > Diego who built one, then bought one. Who else has built or owned more > than one? Is it more common in the Piet genre to build or own multiples? > > Also, Piets seem to be built in multiples by groups, as well as multiples > building one (as in EAA chapters). I'm sure the RV series has a bunch of > this, by nature of the popularity. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376508#376508 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB" <steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil>
Date: Jun 25, 2012
Subject: Re: 1929,1932,1934... (purist alert!!)
What year was Bernard born? Blue Skies, Steve D ----- Original Message ----- From: K5YAC <hangar10(at)cox.net> Date: Saturday, June 23, 2012 16:01 Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: 1929,1932,1934... (purist alert!!) > > I am NX29BP... so I vote for 1929 as well. Wiki says 1928... wonder where they got that info? > > Ray, the first sky scout (10718) was built in 1931 if we are to believe the data plate and it belonged to Orrin Hoopman. Wiki says > 1933... wrong again. > > -------- > Mark Chouinard > Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on > Landing Gear > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376458#376458 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: anybody have two turnbuckles??
Date: Jun 25, 2012
I need two stupid turnbuckles to finish my tail surfaces. Does anybody have two small ones (1/16th cable) they don't need and want to sell?? I need two complete ones with a cable eye on one end and a fork on the other, and two extra fork ends. Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 25, 2012
Subject: Re: anybody have two turnbuckles??
From: Jim Markle <jim_markle(at)mindspring.com>
T24gdGhlIHdheSB0b21vcnJvdy4uLgoKU2VuZCBtZSB5b3VyIGFkZHJlc3MuLi4KCgpTZW50IHZp YSBzbWFydHBob25lLi4uLnNvIHBsZWFzZSBpZ25vcmUgbXkgYmFkIHNwZWxpbmcuLi4uCgotLS0t LS0tLSBPcmlnaW5hbCBtZXNzYWdlIC0tLS0tLS0tClN1YmplY3Q6IFBpZXRlbnBvbC1MaXN0OiBh bnlib2R5IGhhdmUgdHdvIHR1cm5idWNrbGVzPz8gCkZyb206IERvdXdlIEJsdW1iZXJnIDxkb3V3 ZWJsdW1iZXJnQGVhcnRobGluay5uZXQ+IApUbzogcGlldGVucG9sZ3JvdXAgPHBpZXRlbnBvbC1s aXN0QG1hdHJvbmljcy5jb20+IApDQzogIAoKSSBuZWVkIHR3byBzdHVwaWQgdHVybmJ1Y2tsZXMg dG8gZmluaXNoIG15IHRhaWwgc3VyZmFjZXMuwqAgRG9lcyBhbnlib2R5IGhhdmUgdHdvIHNtYWxs IG9uZXMgKDEvMTZ0aCBjYWJsZSkgdGhleSBkb27igJl0IG5lZWQgYW5kIHdhbnQgdG8gc2VsbD8/ wqAgSSBuZWVkIHR3byBjb21wbGV0ZSBvbmVzIHdpdGggYSBjYWJsZSBleWUgb24gb25lIGVuZCBh bmQgYSBmb3JrIG9uIHRoZSBvdGhlciwgYW5kIHR3byBleHRyYSBmb3JrIGVuZHMuCgrCoAoKRG91 d2UKCgoKXy09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT0KXy09ICAgICAgICAgIC0gVGhlIFBpZXRlbnBvbC1MaXN0IEVtYWlsIEZvcnVt IC0KXy09IFVzZSB0aGUgTWF0cm9uaWNzIExpc3QgRmVhdHVyZXMgTmF2aWdhdG9yIHRvIGJyb3dz ZQpfLT0gdGhlIG1hbnkgTGlzdCB1dGlsaXRpZXMgc3VjaCBhcyBMaXN0IFVuL1N1YnNjcmlwdGlv biwKXy09IEFyY2hpdmUgU2VhcmNoICYgRG93bmxvYWQsIDctRGF5IEJyb3dzZSwgQ2hhdCwgRkFR LApfLT0gUGhvdG9zaGFyZSwgYW5kIG11Y2ggbXVjaCBtb3JlOgpfLT0KXy09ICAgLS0+IGh0dHA6 Ly93d3cubWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbS9OYXZpZ2F0b3I/UGlldGVucG9sLUxpc3QKXy09Cl8tPT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09Cl8t PSAgICAgICAgICAgICAgIC0gTUFUUk9OSUNTIFdFQiBGT1JVTVMgLQpfLT0gU2FtZSBncmVhdCBj b250ZW50IGFsc28gYXZhaWxhYmxlIHZpYSB0aGUgV2ViIEZvcnVtcyEKXy09Cl8tPSAgIC0tPiBo dHRwOi8vZm9ydW1zLm1hdHJvbmljcy5jb20KXy09Cl8tPT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09Cl8tPSAgICAgICAgICAgICAtIExp c3QgQ29udHJpYnV0aW9uIFdlYiBTaXRlIC0KXy09ICBUaGFuayB5b3UgZm9yIHlvdXIgZ2VuZXJv dXMgc3VwcG9ydCEKXy09ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgLU1hdHQgRHJhbGxl LCBMaXN0IEFkbWluLgpfLT0gICAtLT4gaHR0cDovL3d3dy5tYXRyb25pY3MuY29tL2NvbnRyaWJ1 dGlvbgpfLT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PQoK ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 25, 2012
From: Dan Yocum <yocum137(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: what is a BFR Jack?
Not _just_ to carry pax... If you want to fly, you gotta have that Flight Review... On 06/22/2012 12:21 PM, Jack Phillips wrote: > Biennial Flight Review (now just called a Flight Review by the FAA). > Required every 24 calendar months in order to carry passengers. > Jack Phillips > NX899JP > Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -- Dan Yocum yocum137(at)gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Gene Rambo <generambo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: 1929,1932,1934... (purist alert!!)
Date: Jun 25, 2012
Just to confuse half-wits! Obviously it worked . . . Gene =3B) do not ar chive > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: 1929=2C1932=2C1934... (purist alert!!) > From: billspiet(at)sympatico.ca > Date: Sat=2C 23 Jun 2012 23:28:29 -0700 > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > ca> > > Hmmm... why did you paint "Travel Air" on the fin of your Pietenpol=2C Ge ne? That's confusing. > > Gene wrote: > > > You think painting the name on the tail is going to let anyone know wha t it is?? I've got "Travel Air" in big letters on the fin and still get "wh at is it=2C a Stearman?" all the time. > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376480#376480 > > > > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Insurance requirements
From: "AircamperN11MS" <Scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org>
Date: Jun 26, 2012
Gary, I would be willing to do that, provide you get your BFR done before hand. You won't need a medical since it qualifies as lightsport. Insurance won't be an issue since I am self insured, code for uninsured. I haven't had any since I rebuilt it in 2000. Most of my flying is over open desert. -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376642#376642 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Engine-Prop
From: "TriScout" <apfelcyber(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jun 26, 2012
Hi all.. Saw this engine/prop offered for sale. Thought I'd share the info.. http://www.j3-cub.com/smf/index.php?topic=7674.msg79081#msg79081 Larry Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376674#376674 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Progress, a clean bill of health, and hardware
From: "John Francis" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com>
Date: Jun 27, 2012
Tom, I had my first tech advisor visit as well. Kinda makes you feel good when he (or she) says all looks good. Be certain to wear a name tag at Brodhead as I would like to meet you. John -------- John Francis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376719#376719 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Turnbuckle barrels for sale
From: "899PM" <rockriverrifle(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jun 27, 2012
I am interested in seeing if a decent experimental/homebuilt market exists for AN155-16S & AN155-32S turnbuckle barrels. I can produce these new barrels, which are gaged to ASME/ANSI B1.3-2007 specs, for about $3.50 a barrel in quantities of (1000) and still make a small profit. Spread the word and reply to aircraftturnbuckles(at)yahoo.com with your thoughts and suggestions. These turnbuckles will be manufactured in Waukesha, Wisconsin, by a company that has been very successful at KEEPING products made here in the good ol USA! Mike Cushway -------- PAPA MIKE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376722#376722 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 27, 2012
From: Jim Boyer <boyerjrb(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Progress, a clean bill of health, and hardware
As an aside, I told them I was about to place an order for AN hardware, turnbuckles, etc. It so happens the Bellanca Super Viking was made in Alexandria, MN (where I live) and they said they might have some of the hardware available in the old factory. It was like a grocery store--aisles of bolts, washers, cable, aileron hinges, pulleys--pretty much anything you might need right there for the picking (at a good price). It just goes to show that aviation and this hobby is filled with lots of great people and a lot of great help that isn't too far away. HI Tom, I used to fly into Alexandria and visit the Bellanca factory. They also made the Bellanca Citabria in Alexandria. I am from Watertown SD and it was just a short flight to Alexandria. Sounds like you are doing fine on the Piet; keep up as you are making very good progress. Cheers, Jim B. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Pitenpol Air CAmper Prop Size
From: "Mike Lambeth" <mdlambeth(at)bellsouth.net>
Date: Jun 27, 2012
Hello, I have come across a 1991 Pietenpol Air Camper, Cub gear and wings, and a C-85 engine and McCauley C7441 74" prop. The engine starts and runs well but I'm only getting about 2350 RPM on take off. Does anyone know if all this sounds ok or could I possibly need a smaller prop? -------- Open Cockpit Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376734#376734 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack" <jack(at)textors.com>
Subject: Milestone
Date: Jun 27, 2012
Got the gear fitted and welded. A big thank you to Jerry Grogan for assisting with the welding. Starting to re-spoke the rebuilt wheels, life is good. Jack Textor DSM NX1929T ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 28, 2012
From: Jim Boyer <boyerjrb(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Milestone
Hi Jack, Your langing gear looks very good; nice work. Jim B. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 28, 2012
From: Jim Boyer <boyerjrb(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Milestone
Jack, even your landing gear looks good. Darn spelling anyway. Jim B. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Milestone
Date: Jun 28, 2012
Looking good, Jack! Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jack Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 8:18 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Milestone Got the gear fitted and welded. A big thank you to Jerry Grogan for assisting with the welding. Starting to re-spoke the rebuilt wheels, life is good. <<...>> <<...>> <<...>> <<...>> Jack Textor DSM NX1929T ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Milestone
From: "giacummo" <mario.giacummo(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jun 28, 2012
Jack, its a pleasure to see your job, I have't seen work as neat as yours. Regards -------- Mario Giacummo http://vgmk1.blogspot.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376760#376760 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: progress update
Date: Jun 28, 2012
First off, I can only find photo links about half the time, so Jack, I'm sure your new gear looks great!! All painted sheet metal installed, fabricated new center section cross bracing cables (were rods), fabricating forward baggage compartment (ala Jack P) closure. Have to paint underbelly ply, ordered eyelets and will do coamings soon. Guess I'll just glue up some foam cushions in case shapes need to be changed before I sew coverings. Hoping to head to the airport within a couple of weeks. Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pitenpol Air CAmper Prop Size
From: "AircamperN11MS" <Scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org>
Date: Jun 28, 2012
Hello Mike, I also have a c-85 on mine. I like to fly a 72 x 42 prop. It seems to work very good on these slow planes. 2350 - 2400 on climb out is not too bad. I turn about 2425 on climb out with mine. They red line at 2575. I can reach that at full throttle in straight & level flight. -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376772#376772 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pitenpol Air CAmper Prop Size
From: "AircamperN11MS" <Scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org>
Date: Jun 28, 2012
Mike, Please email me off line for more information. scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org pietman(at)qnet.com -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376773#376773 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com
Subject: Milestone
Date: Jun 28, 2012
Congrats Jack.....Nothing prettier than a nicely laid weld bead. From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jack Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 6:18 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Milestone Got the gear fitted and welded. A big thank you to Jerry Grogan for assisting with the welding. Starting to re-spoke the rebuilt wheels, life is good. <<...>> <<...>> <<...>> <<...>> Jack Textor DSM NX1929T ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Milestone
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jun 28, 2012
Super-Duper Jack! A Sig Kadet would have been my guess too. Never owned one, but have built and flown many others. I guess it's the large wing tip angles that make it seem right... I believe that the Kadet has been around since before I started in the hobby in the 80s. Heck, even your R/C stuff looks great! -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376794#376794 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Milestone
From: Dan Yocum <yocum137(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jun 28, 2012
Booootiful! -- Dan Yocum yocum137(at)gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Jun 27, 2012, at 7:18 PM, "Jack" wrote: > Got the gear fitted and welded. A big thank you to Jerry Grogan for assis ting with the welding. Starting to re-spoke the rebuilt wheels, life is goo d. > > <<...>> <<...>> <<...>> <<...>> > > > Jack Textor > > DSM > > NX1929T > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: RC
From: Amsafetyc <amsafetyc(at)aol.com>
Date: Jun 29, 2012
Is anyone bringing or considering bringing and flying RC aircraft at Brodhead? John Sent from my iPhone ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 29, 2012
From: Hans van der Voort <nx15kv(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Exaust stack,Brodhead
Shad,=0A-=0AI replaced mine last month, the carbon steel finally rusted t hrough after 7 years.=0AAlthough I could have patched it, the hole was at t he last turn right below the cowling.=0AThe rest of the Exhaust was still i n good shape.=0AI sand blasted and painted them with VHT. =0A-=0ANew exha ust is WW stainless, but modified to change a few angles to clear motor mou nt.=0A-=0AHans=0AWaller, TX=0ANX15KV=0A =0A=0A___________________________ _____=0A From: shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com>=0ATo: pietenpol-list@matro nics.com =0ASent: Thursday, June 28, 2012 9:01 PM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List : Exaust stack,Brodhead=0A =0AWell, Fell'ers I might try Brodhead if I ge t the Thurs and following Monday off.- Dad is probably going to sit this one out (even though he has the cofortable sleeping quarters).- I have to weld up a new exaust for the r/h side with a heat muff for the carb heat. - It has cracked once before, on our 1st time at Brodhead, that weld repa ir has reached it's end of its usefull life.- Dad ordered the flanges, no w I need to get the tubing.- The current exaust is stainless, I was wonde ring how long anyone out there's mild steel exausts are holding up.- I ca n weld mild steel, never tried much stainless (I got 8 hrs out of my last e xaust repair using acetylene and mild steel rod).- I might just pay the w elder across the street to weld a stainless stack with his TIG-after I cu t out all the parts, but I am stuborn and like to do it myself.- Also won dering if anyone here has ceramicoated there mild steel exaust pipes, and h ow expensive it is. =0A=0AHope to see you all in a few weeks, =0AShad =0ADo ====================== ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Exaust stack,Brodhead
From: "AircamperN11MS" <Scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org>
Date: Jun 29, 2012
Mild steel on mine for the past 30 years. Has never cracked. -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376835#376835 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: RC
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jun 29, 2012
I'll have some control line models... and beer brewing equipment! Wasn't bringing them to fly there, they're just tagging along on a relocation sort of event. It's an ugly old thing (a modified Sig Banshee built in '91 and '05) but it'll do the entire PAMPA stunt pattern easily. Also will have a Carl Goldberg Buster built for Foxberg racing that I use as a trainer. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376836#376836 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: RC
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jun 29, 2012
Not sure how the AMA or the FAA might look at those activities. The little park fliers are one thing, and could probably be safely confined to a corner of the field, but hot little nitro burners are probably another issue. If it is just a show and tell... I'll bring some photos. As for flying... a little risky given the other activities that will be going on. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376841#376841 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: RC
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jun 29, 2012
It's an uncontrolled airfield, so the FAA shouldn't care. I"ve flown at uncontrolled (and closed controlled) fields a lot over the years. The AMA has no jurisdiction whatsoever. Control line uses a hemisphere 120 feet in diameter. Radio control has a reasonable chance of a fly away whether it's electric or gas, so Mark is right, somewhat risky. However, there's times when no planes are airborne. The main issue would be to coordinate any RC activity to prevent interference. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376844#376844 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: RC
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jun 29, 2012
Jurisdiction is not the issue... it is a matter of safety and liability (insurance requirements). If you have any history at all with the AMA, you would know where I am coming from. There are ways to do this, but given the size of the field, the number people/aircraft and the activities, it might be a little sketchy to meed certain requirements. Again, little park fliers probably would not even be noticed by most, but before everyone packs up and hauls their 100+mph 3D stunt fliers out to corn country, we might need to think about this for a minute. As for the FAA, you are correct that it is an uncontrolled field, but if something were to happen that resulted in the loss of life or property (yes, it has happened with R/C), then I'm sure there would be agencies descending on the field to sort things out. Call me a worry wart... just making a few observations. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376851#376851 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: RC
From: Amsafetyc <amsafetyc(at)aol.com>
Date: Jun 29, 2012
Just a survey is all Sent from my iPhone On Jun 29, 2012, at 8:50 AM, Amsafetyc wrote: > > Is anyone bringing or considering bringing and flying RC aircraft at Brodhead? > > John > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Barnwell Regional Airport" <barnwellairport(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: re:Pietenpol fly In at Brodhead
Date: Jun 29, 2012
We, all Pietenpol enthusiasts, builders, flyers, visitors, etc., are guests of EAA Chapter 431, who own the airport. As guests, we should always be thankful the chapter allows the Pietenpol Association to have the Fly In every year. In all the years I've been attending,I don't recall any model airplanes being flown during the Fly In. Model airplanes may be an individuals passion, but the vast majority who attend every year come to see our Pietenpol friends, admire their airplane, enjoy the camaraderie and go away having had an enjoyable time. We do not go to see model airplanes. look forward to seeing you all at Brodhead P. F. Beck Barnwell, S. C. ps.... when you pick up your name tags, please give Dee and Doc a big thank you for all they do in putting out an excellent newsletter ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jun 29, 2012
Subject: Re: re:Pietenpol fly In at Brodhead
From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com>
Well put P.F..... There are people milling about, near the airplanes and back and forth across the field....real airplanes on the ground (static, and taxiing around), in the air....not exactly a safe, proper environment to be flying RC stuff. Additionally, Joe Smith may be a very competent RC pilot who can skillfully control his airplane; but if he gets to fly, so does Joe Schmuckatelli, who thinks he is a hotshot pilot but is not. So when he loses control and slams his Ugly Stik into an airplane, a building, people.....things would get ugly real fast. :) Real airplanes for real airplane fly-ins, RC airplanes for RC airplane fly-ins. Ryan On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 3:43 PM, Barnwell Regional Airport < barnwellairport(at)bellsouth.net> wrote: > ** > > We, all Pietenpol enthusiasts, builders, flyers, visitors, etc., are > guests of EAA Chapter 431, who own the airport. As guests, we should always > be thankful the chapter allows the Pietenpol Association to have the Fly In > every year. > > In all the years I've been attending,I don't recall any model airplanes > being flown during the Fly In. > > Model airplanes may be an individuals passion, but the vast majority who > attend every year come to see our Pietenpol friends, admire their airplane, > enjoy the camaraderie and go away having had an enjoyable time. We do not > go to see model airplanes. > > look forward to seeing you all at Brodhead > > P. F. Beck > Barnwell, S. C. > > ps.... when you pick up your name tags, please give Dee and Doc a big > thank you for all they do in putting out an excellent newsletter > > * > > * > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: I've bought a Piet!
Date: Jun 30, 2012
Hi Guys, I have just bought Dale McCleskey's Piet and am presently trying to ship it to Australia. I have a local shipping agent here in Australia dealing with it but I need some help with the packing. It will need to be packed in a 20 foot container. The aircraft is presently disassembled in Braggs OK. The shipper has a packer in Florida and another in San Francisco. Both are a bit far from Braggs! Does anybody know of a packer closer to Braggs that could pack the Piet in the container for me? Many thanks Peter Wonthaggi Australia http://www.cpc-world.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Cockpit Covers
Date: Jun 29, 2012
I did the requisite matronics search and found a few vague references to some generic covering materials. Does anyone have a specific product or supplier that they like? Gary Boothe NX308MB ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Cockpit Covers
From: "John Francis" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com>
Date: Jun 29, 2012
I know I am way ahead of myself here but I was considering using Sunbrella. I had a boat cover made with it and it sure is holding up well. -------- John Francis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376886#376886 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "skipgadd(at)earthlink.net" <skipgadd(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Cockpit Covers
Date: Jun 29, 2012
Gary, I used the best vinyl I could get from the local fabric shop, on Felix. Used Turn Button Fasteners on the front pit and just snaps on the back pit, I never fly with the back pit covered. Skip ----- Original Message ----- From: Gary Boothe Sent: 6/29/2012 7:40:17 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cockpit Covers I did the requisite matronics search and found a few vague references to some generic covering materials. Does anyone have a specific product or supplier that they like? Gary Boothe NX308MB ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Bill's taxiing!!
From: "aerocarjake" <flight.jake(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jun 29, 2012
Way to go Bill.....!! You made lightning fast progress without that nasty thing called "work" to slow you down...... -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376892#376892 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Cockpit Covers
Date: Jun 30, 2012
Gary, I used Sunbrella, (used sailcovers for sailboats, which are constantly exposed to sun and rain) which I bought at West Marine. http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productId =107205 <http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?productI d=107205&catalogId=10001&langId=-1&storeId=11151&storeNum=50821&subdeptNum=5 0833&classNum=50834> &catalogId=10001&langId=-1&storeId=11151&storeNum=50821&subdeptNum=50833&cla ssNum=50834 It is available in many colors - you're bound to find one that will go well with your color scheme. They also sell snap grommet kits to apply the snaps to the fabric. My wife sewed mine for me and they have served me well for 8 years, including some horrendous thunderstorms at Brodhead. And in the winter, I fly with the front cover in place to lesson the cold. It seems to be about 2 knots faster with the front 'pit covered. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Boothe Sent: Friday, June 29, 2012 7:39 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cockpit Covers I did the requisite matronics search and found a few vague references to some generic covering materials. Does anyone have a specific product or supplier that they like? Gary Boothe NX308MB ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Bill's taxiing!!
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jun 30, 2012
Very nice! -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376908#376908 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: I've bought a Piet!
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jun 30, 2012
Hi Peter, and congrats on your new wings! The outfit that I would recommend is Viking Packing Specialist located here in Tulsa, Oklahoma. These guys manufacture all kinds of custom shipping containers for individuals, airlines, Department of Defense and other government agencies. They once packaged an F-15 eagle for shipment to a museum. The owner of the company is an avid aviator and EAA member who also owns a very active flight school on my home field, so he is aware of the needs and concerns involved with handling aircraft. You can read a little about their operation here http://vikingpacking.com/ If you call 1-800-788-8525 and ask for Michelle, she can help you. I have already contacted the owner to give him an idea of what it is you are wanting to ship (he knows what a Pietenpol is)... he will brief Michelle on the job. He said that they prefer that the aircraft be disassembled to is shipping configuration in order to simply package the items and get them on their way, but he said that they would take care of disassembly if necessary. I would imagine that the disassembly operation would occur in Beggs, OK prior to any movement, which is only about 45 minutes south of Tulsa... I could probably round up a few Pietenpol builders to oversee and advise on that part of the operation if it were necessary. I'm not sure what other options there may be in Oklahoma, but this is one that I know of. They are a very reputable and respected outfit. I've been to their facility and it is amazing. I'd say that you could certainly ship your new bird with confidence using Viking. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376915#376915 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: I've bought a Piet!
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jun 30, 2012
Just realized that I misread the location... Braggs, not Beggs. Oh well, Braggs is not too much further away. Maybe a little over an hour from Tulsa. Sure am glad it didn't turn out to be in western OK! @Gary... Glad someone has a favorable impression of me. More often than not I get suspicious looks from people when they hear that I associate with guys named Markle, Recine, Booth, Purtee, etc. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376924#376924 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB" <steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil>
Date: Jun 30, 2012
Subject: Re: re:Pietenpol fly In at Brodhead
As I read this post, the good idea fairy settled on my shoulder and said, "Can't we all just get along?" Rather than simply ban RC aircraft. Give them a place to do their thing. Some have some neat Pietenpol RC planes. If there is a small grass area on the back side or away from the runway and pattern, perhaps a small RC field could be set up. Have an RC airboss, who keeps people in the right area and let kids fly some small backyard flyers. Perhaps a line of trees between the real plane runway and the RC area. I have been at airshows (more control to be sure) where the RC guys flew between each act. At Oshkosh they even have a Ultralight area. See if anyone will provide some simple RC aircraft for kids to fly. I have little interest in RC except just to play around. I don't build planes, talk electronics, and so forth. However, I am using RC to keep my 10 YO grandson interested in flying. He has one of these with a couple of spare parts. http://secure.hobbyzone.com/catalog/hz/HBZ4900.html It is simple and fun to fly. Blue Skies, Steve D ----- Original Message ----- From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com> Date: Friday, June 29, 2012 18:04 Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: re:Pietenpol fly In at Brodhead > Well put P.F..... > > There are people milling about, near the airplanes and back and forth > across the field....real airplanes on the ground (static, and taxiing > around), in the air....not exactly a safe, proper environment to be > flyingRC stuff. > > Additionally, Joe Smith may be a very competent RC pilot who can > skillfullycontrol his airplane; but if he gets to fly, so does Joe > Schmuckatelli, who > thinks he is a hotshot pilot but is not. So when he loses control > and slams > his Ugly Stik into an airplane, a building, people.....things would > getugly real fast. :) > > Real airplanes for real airplane fly-ins, RC airplanes for RC airplane > fly-ins. > > Ryan > > On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 3:43 PM, Barnwell Regional Airport wrote: > > > ** > > > > We, all Pietenpol enthusiasts, builders, flyers, visitors, etc., are > > guests of EAA Chapter 431, who own the airport. As guests, we should always > > be thankful the chapter allows the Pietenpol Association to have the Fly In > > every year. > > > > In all the years I've been attending,I don't recall any model airplanes > > being flown during the Fly In. > > > > Model airplanes may be an individuals passion, but the vast majority who > > attend every year come to see our Pietenpol friends, admire their airplane, > > enjoy the camaraderie and go away having had an enjoyable time. We do not > > go to see model airplanes. > > > > look forward to seeing you all at Brodhead > > > > P. F. Beck > > Barnwell, S. C. > > > > ps.... when you pick up your name tags, please give Dee and Doc a big > > thank you for all they do in putting out an excellent newsletter > > > > * > > > > * > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: Re: I've bought a Piet!
Date: Jul 01, 2012
Mark, Thanks. I have responded off list. Cheers Peter -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of K5YAC Sent: Sunday, 1 July 2012 2:05 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: I've bought a Piet! Hi Peter, and congrats on your new wings! The outfit that I would recommend is Viking Packing Specialist located here in Tulsa, Oklahoma. These guys manufacture all kinds of custom shipping containers for individuals, airlines, Department of Defense and other government agencies. They once packaged an F-15 eagle for shipment to a museum. The owner of the company is an avid aviator and EAA member who also owns a very active flight school on my home field, so he is aware of the needs and concerns involved with handling aircraft. You can read a little about their operation here http://vikingpacking.com/ If you call 1-800-788-8525 and ask for Michelle, she can help you. I have already contacted the owner to give him an idea of what it is you are wanting to ship (he knows what a Pietenpol is)... he will brief Michelle on the job. He said that they prefer that the aircraft be disassembled to is shipping configuration in order to simply package the items and get them on their way, but he said that they would take care of disassembly if necessary. I would imagine that the disassembly operation would occur in Beggs, OK prior to any movement, which is only about 45 minutes south of Tulsa... I could probably round up a few Pietenpol builders to oversee and advise on that part of the operation if it were necessary. I'm not sure what other options there may be in Oklahoma, but this is one that I know of. They are a very reputable and respected outfit. I've been to their facility and it is amazing. I'd say that you could certainly ship your new bird with confidence using Viking. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376915#376915 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: gap seals
Date: Jul 01, 2012
Hey all, Need to do the gap seals on the tail and ailerons. Wanted to hear what people did that worked. The first time around I used nylon self-adhesive rip stop tape in an upside down "U". Have read about carpet tape. Has anyone used foam weatherstripping?? Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Greg Cardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: gap seals
Date: Jul 01, 2012
Piano hinge on the ailerons, no gap seals on the tail. Greg Cardinal ----- Original Message ----- From: Douwe Blumberg To: pietenpolgroup Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2012 11:30 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: gap seals Hey all, Need to do the gap seals on the tail and ailerons. Wanted to hear what people did that worked. The first time around I used nylon self-adhesive rip stop tape in an upside down "U". Have read about carpet tape. Has anyone used foam weatherstripping?? Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 01, 2012
From: <r.r.hall(at)cox.net>
Subject: Plywood repairs
What is the best way to repair cracked plywood? I accidentally stepped on some thin plywood covered with fabric and heard it crack (it isn't on a Piet) and was hoping someone can tell me the best way to repair it. I know I will need to cut away the fabric over the area and cut out the cracked area but I'm not sure how to go about repairing the area. Rodney ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Plywood repairs
Date: Jul 01, 2012
AC 43.13 (formerly CAM 18) is THE BIBLE for aircraft repairs. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of r.r.hall(at)cox.net Sent: Sunday, July 01, 2012 8:48 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Plywood repairs What is the best way to repair cracked plywood? I accidentally stepped on some thin plywood covered with fabric and heard it crack (it isn't on a Piet) and was hoping someone can tell me the best way to repair it. I know I will need to cut away the fabric over the area and cut out the cracked area but I'm not sure how to go about repairing the area. Rodney ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: gap seals
From: "echobravo4" <eab4(at)comcast.net>
Date: Jul 01, 2012
I'm adding rounded balsa leading edges to the rudder and elevators- won't totally seal the gap but will make it much smaller -------- Earl Brown I may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up where I intended to be. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376981#376981 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol fly In at Brodhead
From: "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Date: Jul 01, 2012
Okay, John, here's your first response that falls within your three acceptable answers: Is anyone bringing or considering bringing and flying RC aircraft at Brodhead? "No." Having said that, most of the responses indicated reasons why it probably wouldn't be a good idea. I would interpret those responses as "No" as well. One thing I know for sure, is that when I finally manage to complete my Piet, and fly it all the way to Brodhead, I would be more than a little peeved if it were to be damaged by an errant model aircraft smashing into it. I can understand someone bringing a model Pietenpol to the event, just for display. But actually flying model aircraft at an active airport loaded with antique and handcrafted aircraft, that's another story. Doesn't seem like a good idea to me. Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376987#376987 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol fly In at Brodhead
From: Amsafetyc <amsafetyc(at)aol.com>
Date: Jul 01, 2012
Thanks Bill Sent from my iPhone On Jul 1, 2012, at 12:15 PM, "Bill Church" wrote: > > Okay, John, here's your first response that falls within your three acceptable answers: > > Is anyone bringing or considering bringing and flying RC aircraft at Brodhead? > > "No." > > Having said that, most of the responses indicated reasons why it probably wouldn't be a good idea. I would interpret those responses as "No" as well. > One thing I know for sure, is that when I finally manage to complete my Piet, and fly it all the way to Brodhead, I would be more than a little peeved if it were to be damaged by an errant model aircraft smashing into it. I can understand someone bringing a model Pietenpol to the event, just for display. But actually flying model aircraft at an active airport loaded with antique and handcrafted aircraft, that's another story. Doesn't seem like a good idea to me. > > > Bill C. > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376987#376987 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: gap seals
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 01, 2012
Question to the group: How critical is it, and what is the improvement to performance if the eleva tor gaps are sealed? Dan Helsper Puryear, TN no elevator gap seals -----Original Message----- From: echobravo4 <eab4(at)comcast.net> Sent: Sun, Jul 1, 2012 9:56 am Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: gap seals I'm adding rounded balsa leading edges to the rudder and elevators- won't totally seal the gap but will make it much smaller -------- Earl Brown I may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up whe re I intended to be. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376981#376981 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol fly In at Brodhead
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 01, 2012
Hey John, If I can get all the parts there, I'd be happy to find a little corner somewhere (hell, even a baseball field in town if necessary) and get him on the handle of a control line model. It'll be different than anything he's done before. Something about the smell of castor oil and a "real" engine usually gets a kid going. I've taught hundreds of kids, and so has my son, so it'll be fun, easy and no stress. Give me a shout, 423 580 1383 when you're there! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376993#376993 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Plywood repairs
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 01, 2012
If you can put a thinner piece on each side of the crack, that would work. TEDIOUS but also good, remove the cracked area, taper the edges to 12 to one taper and scarf in a new piece. Need more info to be more specific. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376994#376994 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Dan Yocum <yocum137(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: gap seals
Date: Jul 01, 2012
The Piet Gar bought uses the foam weather stripping... -- Dan Yocum yocum137(at)gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Jun 30, 2012, at 11:30 PM, "Douwe Blumberg" wrote: > Hey all, > > Need to do the gap seals on the tail and ailerons. Wanted to hear what pe ople did that worked. The first time around I used nylon self-adhesive rip s top tape in an upside down =9CU=9D. Have read about carpet tape . Has anyone used foam weatherstripping?? > > Douwe > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Dan Yocum <yocum137(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: gap seals
Date: Jul 01, 2012
N8031's behavior is much better with the gap seals on the elevator. I can li ft the tail in about 50' and it trims out much better in flight. I recommen d them. Dan -- Dan Yocum yocum137(at)gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Jul 1, 2012, at 1:13 PM, helspersew(at)aol.com wrote: > Question to the group: > > How critical is it, and what is the improvement to performance if the elev ator gaps are sealed? > > Dan Helsper > Puryear, TN > > no elevator gap seals > -----Original Message----- > From: echobravo4 <eab4(at)comcast.net> > To: pietenpol-list > Sent: Sun, Jul 1, 2012 9:56 am > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: gap seals > > > I'm adding rounded balsa leading edges to the rudder and elevators- > won't totally seal the gap but will make it much smaller > > -------- > Earl Brown > > I may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up wh ere I > intended to be. > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376981#376981 > > > > > > > > " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > tp://forums.matronics.com > _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Dan Yocum <yocum137(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol fly In at Brodhead
Date: Jul 01, 2012
I'm kosher with the 20g (less than an oz.) Parkflyer RCs for late evening flying. Anything bigger and I'll get real nervous with them near my plane. Brodhead isn't really set up for big RC flyers - hangars and Hatz's are at the south end of the field, Piets are at the north. Taxiing a/c in between... -- Dan Yocum yocum137(at)gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Jul 1, 2012, at 11:15 AM, "Bill Church" wrote: > > Okay, John, here's your first response that falls within your three acceptable answers: > > Is anyone bringing or considering bringing and flying RC aircraft at Brodhead? > > "No." > > Having said that, most of the responses indicated reasons why it probably wouldn't be a good idea. I would interpret those responses as "No" as well. > One thing I know for sure, is that when I finally manage to complete my Piet, and fly it all the way to Brodhead, I would be more than a little peeved if it were to be damaged by an errant model aircraft smashing into it. I can understand someone bringing a model Pietenpol to the event, just for display. But actually flying model aircraft at an active airport loaded with antique and handcrafted aircraft, that's another story. Doesn't seem like a good idea to me. > > > Bill C. > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=376987#376987 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol fly In at Brodhead
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 01, 2012
Wow... for the umteenth time CONTROL LINE, u/c, two sixty foot STEEL cables hooking my model to me, WITH a safety strap (only been flying radio control planes for 39 years, find control line more my style). I won't be ANYWHERE NEAR someone's precious plane. More than 60' and you're good. AND, as I mentioned, should it seem ANYWHERE near unsafe, I'll find a park, or cornfield, or somewhere someone won't complain or feel threatened and I'll check with all regulatory authorities. I find it hard to believe there aren't formal check rides to fly at this event... I generally don't fly with people who aren't specifically checked out by qualified airmen and federal inspectors in the genre I'm flying... There isn't a lot going on, on Thurs, or at least there wasn't last year. Should be a great time. I should also have a regular car should we need to travel somewhere off site. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377004#377004 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: gap seals
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 01, 2012
Dan, My Piet came with tape on the elevator and was highly recommended by Dick who sold me the piet. They made it most the way home (three days, probably had been on there a while) then I lost them and havn't replaced them (though I will). It definitely was an improvement, but nothing like the ailerons. Mostly in the getting the tail up early and in the flare (much more authority and less of a crisis getting the stick in your lap in the flare kind of thing). Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377007#377007 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: gap seals
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 01, 2012
OK, I am sold on the effectiveness of the elevator gap seals.................. .but how do I justify it? I continue to be hamstrung by this purist thing. I have rules. If I had some evidence that Bernerd used them at some point a long the way, or talked about them, or heck, even thought about using them, I would feel a whole lot better about the situation. Dan Helsper Puryear, TN PS: I wonder if the TC has elevator gap seals? -----Original Message----- From: tools <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Sun, Jul 1, 2012 4:41 pm Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: gap seals Dan, My Piet came with tape on the elevator and was highly recommended by Dick w ho sold me the piet. They made it most the way home (three days, probably had been on there a wh ile) then I lost them and havn't replaced them (though I will). It definitely was an improvement, but nothing like the ailerons. Mostly in the getting the tail up early and in the flare (much more authority and less of a crisis getting the stick in your lap in the flare kind of thing). Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377007#377007 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: gap seals
From: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
Date: Jul 01, 2012
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Subject: Re: Pietenpol fly In at Brodhead
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 01, 2012
The initial question was about R/C, and I still agree with Kevin... it would be appropriate to ask those that own/operate the field at a minimum. Also, it might ought to be published if these kind of activities are going to be conducted during the event... I'm sure that there are some that would side with Dan and not want to display their aircraft anywhere near this kind of stuff. I have an R/C airplane that will exceed 100mph... it's been clocked at 104... 60' is nothing. So, if it were going to be allowed, the guidelines would need to be made clear, as per Dan's recommendation. I to have been flying R/C for some time (started with a PT-20 in 1986), and my son is now also in the hobby. It is indeed a great hobby... along with model rocketry I credit the sport as what gave me the confidence to build an airplane, and it definitely has kept me interested in flying machines throughout my life. Having said that, I've always done what I could to demonstrate the positive side of the hobby... not everyone sees the sport as we do... as with anything else, people who don't know or understand the hobby as well as we might could view it as a nuisance, or worse if something bad were to happen. As with any sport or hobby, it is key to demonstrate good practices if we want to promote good will. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377029#377029 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Bill's taxiing!!
From: "taildrags" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jul 01, 2012
Bee-you-tee-ful!!! And what a nice pocketa-pocketa sound! Yes indeed, that is one clean and original-looking Air Camper. Congratulations! One teeny caution: stay the heck away from tie-down ropes on the apron while taxiing around. I couldn't tell if those were ropes or just cracks in the tarmac, but if they were ropes- you don't want the prop to suck one up and suddenly the airplane is on its nose with a rope wrapped around the prop or crankshaft. -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377032#377032 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: gap seals
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 01, 2012
Ok, that's cool and we understand... SOOOO... consider other 1929 airplanes. The travel air 3000 the eaa owns and operates uses a cool and simple strap hinge design that is not only vintage to the period, but nearly gap free, probably enough so that it would be considered sealed. That same design is used on the 1919 J-1 as well. It's a neat way to seal, would also look really good on a Piet. The bad news, you'd essentially have to build a new horiz stab and elevators. I can get some good pics if this appeals. Of course, there's a thousand other ways. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377040#377040 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Plywood repairs
From: "Billy McCaskill" <billmz(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 01, 2012
As tools mentioned, more specific info would be good. The repair method would probably depend on the size, extent and location of the damage. Is it merely a surface crack, an obvious break or a complete hole in the plywood? How accessible is the underside of the damaged area? It could be as simple as applying a thin doubler patch to the underside, or it could be as extensive as replacing the entire damaged area with new plywood. As also noted by Jack P, refer to AC 43.13 for the procedures and standards to effect such repairs. -------- Billy McCaskill Baker, LA tail section almost done, starting on ribs soon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377060#377060 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Can someone explain why...
From: "AircamperN11MS" <Scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org>
Date: Jul 02, 2012
Gary, Which airport are you taking it to? -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377074#377074 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: gap seals
Date: Jul 02, 2012
Dan I have some oatmeal cartons laying around I could send you that might work for a gap seal. They're Quaker Oats though and the box is of the modern design so on second thought. Could probably find some original ones on Ebay though. All kidding aside, I'm going to make two balsa half rounds or corner moldings and glue them in there with the faces along the axis which should allow a pretty tight seal. Thanks for all the ideas as usual! Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: gap seals
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 02, 2012
Just for the heck of it, wondering where you all are getting your balsa? It's been years, but I know the store is still there, but a place in San Antonio TX called Alamo hardwoods used to sell balsa like any other hardwood. It was in random widths and lengths (most 8' plus) mostly 8/4 (or 2" thick), by the board foot. They'd cut to any length and slap a shipping lable on it, wouldn't be much to ship in the quantities we're looking at. It wasn't contest quality super super lightweight stuff, but lighter than ANY other wood you're going to find. The type of stuff hollywood used to use to make props used in old western movie fight scenes (the chairs and tables that got broke up). Probably WAAAY cheaper than any hobby store stuff. Might be worth looking into for these sorts of applications (and strut fairing, etc). Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377084#377084 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Gap seals
From: woodflier(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 02, 2012
Douwe, I used plain 'ol aluminum tape from the hardware store. My wings are silver so it blended fine. I see where Kevin and Shelly used clear tape, w hich should work as well. I just put the tape over the gap on the top side of the wing, with the tape applied with the aileron full down. This assured no binding caused by too-tight tape. Its been on my wing for a year and 10 5 hours of flying. I have the traditional cupboard hinges on my ailerons, n ot the piano hinge. I don't have any seals on the elevator but haven't noti ced any lack of elevator authority. Matt Paxton ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 02, 2012
Subject: Re: gap seals
From: Ken Bickers <bickers.ken(at)gmail.com>
As it happens, I ordered a shipment of balsa from Lonestar Balsa just last week. I bought enough to fair the diagonal struts and jury struts. The wood was very nice -- not the super light stuff, but not much heavier. The whole order, including the shipping was under a hundred dollars. Cheers, Ken On Mon, Jul 2, 2012 at 10:02 AM, tools wrote: > > Just for the heck of it, wondering where you all are getting your balsa? > > It's been years, but I know the store is still there, but a place in San Antonio TX called Alamo hardwoods used to sell balsa like any other hardwood. It was in random widths and lengths (most 8' plus) mostly 8/4 (or 2" thick), by the board foot. They'd cut to any length and slap a shipping lable on it, wouldn't be much to ship in the quantities we're looking at. > > It wasn't contest quality super super lightweight stuff, but lighter than ANY other wood you're going to find. The type of stuff hollywood used to use to make props used in old western movie fight scenes (the chairs and tables that got broke up). > > Probably WAAAY cheaper than any hobby store stuff. Might be worth looking into for these sorts of applications (and strut fairing, etc). > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377084#377084 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: gap seals
From: "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil>
Date: Jul 02, 2012
Douwe - We've got the per-the-plan hinges. My aileron seal tape's installed from the bottom. I read on the fly-baby site about tape being applied on the top letting go and making things interesting for the pilot. Matt has succeeded for 105 hours so it probably has everything to do with surface prep before applying the tape. As Shelley mentioned, we don't have gap seals on the tail. I have no comparison, but the control authority seems ok. Reference this video from Markle: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQyYKxwqe-o I do have the East Texas Trim System on the stick - a bungee pulling the stick aft, which has worked wonderfully. Maybe gap seals on the elevator would improve that situation as Dan has stated. -------- Kevin "Axel" Purtee NX899KP Austin/San Marcos, TX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377089#377089 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: gap seals
Date: Jul 02, 2012
Douwe, I've had first hand experience flying Pietenpols with and without gap seals. I have piano hinges on my ailerons, so no seals are needed. When I ferried N502R to Brodhead a couple of years ago for Ryan Mueller, I picked it up from its owner, the late Gene Pennington, and flew it from Camden Tennessee to Jackson Tennessee, where I was visiting my mother. When I made that first takeoff, my first thought was something was broken because the ailerons were so inneffective. When I landed in Jackson, I immediately applied blue painter's tape in the aileron gaps, using the same technique Kevin used. What a difference! I know Ryan never changed that temporary tape job. He sold N502R to John Hofmann. I don't know if John still has my temporary gap seals in place, or if he has a more permanent solution. I tried gap seals on my elevators using duct tape applied to the underside. There were some minor changes due to sealing the gaps. Primarily, I found I could raise the tail on takeoff in less than half the distance required without gap seals. I could not tell any difference in flight qualities, except that more nose up trim was required to hold level flight. I have a slight amount of incidence set into my horizontal tail (two AN970 washers worth) and could probably remove that if I kept the gap seals in place. Last year on the way to Brodhead one of the pieces of duct tape peeled about halfway off (I couldn't tell anything from the feel of the airplane) so I removed the tape from both sides and have never replaced it. So, in my opinion, gap seals are essential on the ailerons and unncessary on the elevators. I have not tried them on the rudder, but the rudder has so much authority I can't believe it could be much improved. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of kevinpurtee Sent: Monday, July 02, 2012 12:46 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: gap seals --> Douwe - We've got the per-the-plan hinges. My aileron seal tape's installed from the bottom. I read on the fly-baby site about tape being applied on the top letting go and making things interesting for the pilot. Matt has succeeded for 105 hours so it probably has everything to do with surface prep before applying the tape. As Shelley mentioned, we don't have gap seals on the tail. I have no comparison, but the control authority seems ok. Reference this video from Markle: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQyYKxwqe-o I do have the East Texas Trim System on the stick - a bungee pulling the stick aft, which has worked wonderfully. Maybe gap seals on the elevator would improve that situation as Dan has stated. -------- Kevin "Axel" Purtee NX899KP Austin/San Marcos, TX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377089#377089 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 02, 2012
From: Jim Boyer <boyerjrb(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Can someone explain why...
Hi Gary, Will you be able to do first flight before Brodhead? Be sure to have a video for us slowpokes. Thanks, Jim B. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 02, 2012
From: shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: gap seals
Foam Could probably be used as well, might be a little lighter than most ba lsa.- It would have to be the correct type of foam that would hold up to fabric glue.- A biplane project I just sold had blue foam, and 1 light co at of glass in place of the balsa tips on the empenage, and l/e of the elev ators and ailerons.- It felt considerably lighter than the balsa I have o n my project.- I never weighed them for comparison, just an idea. - Shad - Don't archive --- On Mon, 7/2/12, tools wrote: From: tools <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: gap seals Date: Monday, July 2, 2012, 12:02 PM Just for the heck of it, wondering where you all are getting your balsa? It's been years, but I know the store is still there, but a place in San An tonio TX called Alamo hardwoods used to sell balsa like any other hardwood. - It was in random widths and lengths (most 8' plus) mostly 8/4 (or 2" th ick), by the board foot.- They'd cut to any length and slap a shipping la ble on it, wouldn't be much to ship in the quantities we're looking at. It wasn't contest quality super super lightweight stuff, but lighter than A NY other wood you're going to find.- The type of stuff hollywood used to use to make props used in old western movie fight scenes (the chairs and ta bles that got broke up). Probably WAAAY cheaper than any hobby store stuff.- Might be worth lookin g into for these sorts of applications (and strut fairing, etc). Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377084#377084 le, List Admin. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 02, 2012
From: Ben Charvet <bencharvet(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: gap seals
I just used some strips of douglas fir cut to a shallow triangle shape on my tailfeathers. I still used clear duct tape to seal the gap, even though it was only about 1/8 inch. Ben On 7/2/2012 7:06 PM, shad bell wrote: > Foam Could probably be used as well, might be a little lighter than > most balsa. It would have to be the correct type of foam that would > hold up to fabric glue. A biplane project I just sold had blue foam, > and 1 light coat of glass in place of the balsa tips on the empenage, > and l/e of the elevators and ailerons. It felt considerably lighter > than the balsa I have on my project. I never weighed them for > comparison, just an idea. > Shad > Don't archive > > --- On *Mon, 7/2/12, tools //* wrote: > > > From: tools <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: gap seals > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > Date: Monday, July 2, 2012, 12:02 PM > > <http://us.mc1621.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=n0kkj@yahoo.com>> > > Just for the heck of it, wondering where you all are getting your > balsa? > > It's been years, but I know the store is still there, but a place > in San Antonio TX called Alamo hardwoods used to sell balsa like > any other hardwood. It was in random widths and lengths (most 8' > plus) mostly 8/4 (or 2" thick), by the board foot. They'd cut to > any length and slap a shipping lable on it, wouldn't be much to > ship in the quantities we're looking at. > > It wasn't contest quality super super lightweight stuff, but > lighter than ANY other wood you're going to find. The type of > stuff hollywood used to use to make props used in old western > movie fight scenes (the chairs and tables that got broke up). > > Probably WAAAY cheaper than any hobby store stuff. Might be worth > looking into for these sorts of applications (and strut fairing, etc). > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List" > target=_blank>http://www.m; --> > <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377084#377084> > > > <http://forums.matronics.com/> > > * > > > * -- Ben Charvet, PharmD Staff Pharmacist Parrish Medical center ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: center section cut out
Date: Jul 03, 2012
Hey chaps (and lasses.) Just found an interesting article from a 1996 Buckeye Pietenpol Association Newsletter about a guy (Joe Leonard from Garrettsville, OH) experimenting with his center section cut-out. To Paraphrase. He had a cut-out in his center section with a rounded trailing edge. Somebody at Brodhead suggested the founded edge was causing turbulent airflow over the tail. As an experiment, he laminated up some foam shaped it to fill the cutout, duct taped it in place nad went flying. He did three landings and take-offs, a few stalls etc and reports "it was like flying a totally different airplane! Stall speed dropped about 5 m.p.h. The best climb rate previously occurred at 65 m.p.h, with the cut-out filled, it dropped to 60 m.p.h." "With the center section closed, it floats like a cub at 60. The rate of climb has not increased and I'm still not sure if the cruise speed has increased or not." "I've been telling people all along the center section is not a factor in creating lift, which is true, BUT it affects a bunch of other things." Pretty interesting info to ponder for those eliminating the flop. May Bernhard new what he was doing?? Douwe Progress report; had a granite engraving friend cut some stencils from adhesive backed rubber for my tail numbers and a little tail logo (decided against anything on the fuselage because with the side pipes it was too busy) and that worked great. She now has some stuff on the tail. Going to pinstripe the edges of the letters today. When I was building my wheels I forgot grease fittings, plus they're covered so. rather than having to remove the wheels to grease them (no biggie really) I welded up a little tube with a ninety degree in it and a grease fitting on one end. This goes inside the axle just behind the wheel retaining cap and is welded into a little hole in the axle between the bearings in the wheel. When I shoot grease into it, it comes out inside the wheel. Triple checking the engine installation before I install the cowling. Working on seat cushion designs Did one coaming then started the other and found out I had underestimated how many eyelets I needed so that stopped until more are delivered. The only area I sprayed latex over the old dope, under my center section, is staying a little tacky. Am hoping it'll dry up eventually. Starting my tailwheel re-education soon from one of the EAA pilots of the Ford Tri-motor here in beautiful Fallmouth, KY!!! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]" <michael.d.cuy(at)nasa.gov>
Date: Jul 03, 2012
Subject: center section cut out
Douwe, Great find about Joe's experimentations. Joe's plane is/was a heavy 85hp GN-1 Grega with a very long nose. I flew Joe's airplane with the cutout (he was gracious enough to allow me to fly his before my plane was finished ) and it was a very nice handling airplane but you could feel how much heav ier it was than say Frank Pavliga's or mine-still a good plane and glad you posted about Joe's article. Here's one thing I know. I have a cutout with a handhold and my plane sta lls power off at 29 mph. Build it light and it will stall nicely with or without a cutout. My empty weight is 632 lbs. So great to hear of your continuing progress on your Pietenpol and that you 'll be getting some good tailwheel instruction in the near future to prepar e you for the day of celebration! Mike C. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: gap seals
From: "FandS_Piet" <fkim79(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jul 03, 2012
Has anybody tried using piano hinges for the elevators? My dad and I have kicked this idea around but are still planning on making the per plans hinges On a milling machine unless of course the masses think it may be beneficial. -------- Fred Kim Pittsburgh, Pa Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377168#377168 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Types of Plywood
From: "namrednos" <namrednos(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 03, 2012
For the sides and bottom of a piet what type of plywood would you builders (flyer's) recommend. I have found local (no shipping cost) 1/4" Okume and 1/8" and 1/4" Meranti Marine plywood. Meranti looks like mahogany and is heavier than the Okume but at a better price. Both are stamped BS 1088, a British standard for glue waterproof and boil proof with minimum face ply thickness. Thanks for your help Scott in Kentucky Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377170#377170 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: gap seals
From: "namrednos" <namrednos(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 03, 2012
With piano hinge all the way across the elevator, did you have enough length of rap to attach the covering cloth. -------- Scott Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377171#377171 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Types of Plywood
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 03, 2012
Either one is fine. I personally prefer the meranti or the mahogany over the okume for the pure strength. The pure strength is a good thing because of how people get in and out of a piet stepping directly onto a 2 x 2 section of 1/4 ply with their full weight. If you were really anal about helping people in and out, and being careful yourself, I think the okume would be fine. >From a "specification" standpoint, either is fine, don't worry about it. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377176#377176 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 03, 2012
From: Rick Schreiber <lmforge(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Wing perimeter tapes
Yesterday I finished rib stitching one of my wing panels. I think the outside temp was around 98 with about 80% humidity. I have no idea how hot it was in the hangar, but I was pretty wiped out by the end. The wing covering and rib stitching has been fun, except for the heat here in NW Indiana. I had been starting around 7 am before the heat got too bad, but yesterday I was on a roll and just wanted to finish up the stitching. Plus I had a helper which sure makes it go faster. I getting ready to do the rib tapes and perimeter tapes and I have a question. I am using the Stewart System and in their instruction video they say to use a 4 inch perimeter tape on the leading edge. My question is how has everyone transitioned from the wider leading edge tape to the narrower 3 inch edge tape on the wing tip bow. If you just taper the 4 inch tape and seam it to the 3 inch tape where did you place the transition seam so it looks nice. I realize I am just obsessing over this, but I sure don't want to make a mistake at this stage. Tomorrow I may go out to the airport and start doing the rib tapes before sunrise to avoid the heat (except my wife just told me the low tonight is only going to be 80). Regards, Rick Schreiber Valparaiso IN NX478RS ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Wing perimeter tapes
From: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
Date: Jul 03, 2012
Yes, Rick, you're obsessing!;-) Just taper the 4" and transition juuust around the corner. You will be amazed at how good it'll look when all doped (and I didn't even use dope!) Gary from Cool ------Original Message------ From: Rick Schreiber Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com ReplyTo: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wing perimeter tapes Sent: Jul 3, 2012 4:31 PM Yesterday I finished rib stitching one of my wing panels. I think the outside temp was around 98 with about 80% humidity. I have no idea how hot it was in the hangar, but I was pretty wiped out by the end. The wing covering and rib stitching has been fun, except for the heat here in NW Indiana. I had been starting around 7 am before the heat got too bad, but yesterday I was on a roll and just wanted to finish up the stitching. Plus I had a helper which sure makes it go faster. I getting ready to do the rib tapes and perimeter tapes and I have a question. I am using the Stewart System and in their instruction video they say to use a 4 inch perimeter tape on the leading edge. My question is how has everyone transitioned from the wider leading edge tape to the narrower 3 inch edge tape on the wing tip bow. If you just taper the 4 inch tape and seam it to the 3 inch tape where did you place the transition seam so it looks nice. I realize I am just obsessing over this, but I sure don't want to make a mistake at this stage. Tomorrow I may go out to the airport and start doing the rib tapes before sunrise to avoid the heat (except my wife just told me the low tonight is only going to be 80). Regards, Rick Schreiber Valparaiso IN NX478RS Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 03, 2012
Subject: cabane fitting question
From: Ken Chambers <ken.riffic(at)gmail.com>
I'm working on the cabane to fuselage fittings. I'd rather not cut through the fuselage stiffener to make a space for the inside fitting. Would it be acceptable to move the fitting back an inch to avoid this? Could glue a piece in beneath the longeron to take the bolt. Or is there some other way to do this? Searched the archives and didn't find a good alternative. Thanks Ken ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: cabane fitting question
Date: Jul 03, 2012
Ken, Do you have Long Fuse plans? In those plans it is noted as a 3" "filler". Whatever you decide to do, you must ensure that the distance between the forward and rearward fittings corresponds with the distance between the struts, thereby preserving a parallelogram with the longerons, cabanes and center section. That allows you to move the center section back without changing the angle of incidence. Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ken Chambers Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 5:40 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: cabane fitting question I'm working on the cabane to fuselage fittings. I'd rather not cut through the fuselage stiffener to make a space for the inside fitting. Would it be acceptable to move the fitting back an inch to avoid this? Could glue a piece in beneath the longeron to take the bolt. Or is there some other way to do this? Searched the archives and didn't find a good alternative. Thanks Ken ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 04, 2012
From: Jim Boyer <boyerjrb(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Types of Plywood
Scotty I used marine Mahogany plywood for my Piet; 3mm (1/8) and 6mm (1/4). I like the mahogany look and it was very good quality at much less than aircraft plywood. Jim B. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: fungicide anyone?
From: "nightmare" <pauldonahuepilot(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 04, 2012
reading my eaa "wood aircraft building techniques". was wondering if builders are using a fungicide prior to varnishing? i live in south florida, so getting caught in a shower while flying or on the ground is very possible. ounce of prevention and all. if so, what product and where to purchase? thanks; Paul Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377249#377249 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "C N Campbell" <cncampbell(at)windstream.net>
Subject: Re: Wing perimeter tapes
Date: Jul 04, 2012
Rick, I might not really understand your problem but I suggest you check out the Stewart video on putting perimeter tapes on an elevator where 3-inch tape and 2-inch tape come together. Maybe that will give you an idea on joining 4-inch and 3-inch tapes. Chuck ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rick Schreiber" <lmforge(at)earthlink.net> Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 7:31 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wing perimeter tapes > > > Yesterday I finished rib stitching one of my wing panels. I think the > outside temp was around 98 with about 80% humidity. I have no idea how hot > it was in the hangar, but I was pretty wiped out by the end. The wing > covering and rib stitching has been fun, except for the heat here in NW > Indiana. I had been starting around 7 am before the heat got too bad, but > yesterday I was on a roll and just wanted to finish up the stitching. Plus > I had a helper which sure makes it go faster. > > I getting ready to do the rib tapes and perimeter tapes and I have a > question. I am using the Stewart System and in their instruction video > they say to use a 4 inch perimeter tape on the leading edge. My question > is how has everyone transitioned from the wider leading edge tape to the > narrower 3 inch edge tape on the wing tip bow. If you just taper the 4 > inch tape and seam it to the 3 inch tape where did you place the > transition seam so it looks nice. I realize I am just obsessing over this, > but I sure don't want to make a mistake at this stage. > > Tomorrow I may go out to the airport and start doing the rib tapes before > sunrise to avoid the heat (except my wife just told me the low tonight is > only going to be 80). > > Regards, > Rick Schreiber > Valparaiso IN > NX478RS > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 04, 2012
Subject: Re: cabane fitting question
From: Ken Chambers <ken.riffic(at)gmail.com>
Thanks Gary. Yep, long fuselage. I'l dig up those plans. On Tue, Jul 3, 2012 at 7:57 PM, Gary Boothe wrote: > Ken,**** > > ** ** > > Do you have Long Fuse plans? In those plans it is noted as a 3=94 =93fill er=94. > Whatever you decide to do, you must ensure that the distance between the > forward and rearward fittings corresponds with the distance between the > struts, thereby preserving a parallelogram with the longerons, cabanes an d > center section. That allows you to move the center section back without > changing the angle of incidence. **** > > ** ** > > Gary Boothe**** > > NX308MB**** > > ** ** > > *From:* owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto: > owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Ken Chambers > *Sent:* Tuesday, July 03, 2012 5:40 PM > *To:* pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > *Subject:* Pietenpol-List: cabane fitting question**** > > ** ** > > > I'm working on the cabane to fuselage fittings. I'd rather not cut throug h > the fuselage stiffener to make a space for the inside fitting. **** > > ** ** > > Would it be acceptable to move the fitting back an inch to avoid this? > Could glue a piece in beneath the longeron to take the bolt. **** > > ** ** > > Or is there some other way to do this? Searched the archives and didn't > find a good alternative. **** > > ** ** > > Thanks**** > > ** ** > > Ken **** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > * * > > * * > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List* > > ** > > ** > > *http://forums.matronics.com* > > ** > > ** > > ** > > ** > > *http://www.matronics.com/contribution* > > ** > > * * > > * > =========== =========== =========== =========== > * > > -- Ken Chambers 512-796-1798 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: center section cut out
From: "BYD" <billsayre(at)ymail.com>
Date: Jul 04, 2012
My understanding is Bernard claimed that a cutout was equivalent to cutting two feet off the wing span. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377254#377254 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "skipgadd(at)earthlink.net" <skipgadd(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: gap seals
Date: Jul 04, 2012
Douwe, I did kind of the same thing. Used 1/8 balsa glued into a V shape, than glued on the flippers. Skip ----- Original Message ----- From: Douwe Blumberg Sent: 7/2/2012 11:09:42 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: gap seals Dan I have some oatmeal cartons laying around I could send you that might work for a gap seal. Theyre Quaker Oats though and the box is of the modern design so on second thought Could probably find some original ones on Ebay though. All kidding aside, Im going to make two balsa half rounds or corner moldings and glue them in there with the faces along the axis which should allow a pretty tight seal. Thanks for all the ideas as usual! Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 04, 2012
From: airlion <airlion(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: center section cut out
I have the cutout and was wondering if I could put a cover on top and hinge it so I could use my handhold. Gardiner. Only the top would be covered. Cheers on the 4th. ----- Original Message ---- From: BYD <billsayre(at)ymail.com> Sent: Wed, July 4, 2012 11:28:49 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: center section cut out My understanding is Bernard claimed that a cutout was equivalent to cutting two feet off the wing span. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377254#377254 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: center section cut out
Date: Jul 04, 2012
Mikee wrote- >I have a cutout with a handhold and my plane stalls power off at 29 mph. >Build it light and it will stall nicely with or without a cutout. >My empty weight is 632 lbs. If you've ever seen pictures of Mike, it's hard to tell that he weighs that much, but maybe it's the loose-fitting tee shirts that he wears. Or maybe he meant that his *airplane's* empty weight is 632? ;o) Scout came in with an empty weight of 636 when I did the new W&B after swapping in the A75 engine and that's with three quarts of oil in the sump. No center section cutout... my airplane has a hinged flop. Like "Four-Eight-Mike-Charlie", "Four-One-Charlie-Charlie" stalls so low down on the airspeed indicator arc that I know the reading can't possibly be accurate. Pitot is out on the starboard side jury strut, just down from the wing leading edge, so it's well out of the propwash. The point is, build it light and it will fly great, stall at a very slow airspeed with good controllability, and you'll love flying it. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" Flying Squirrel N2069Z "Rocket" Medford/Ashland, OR website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 04, 2012
From: shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Brodhead Update
Well I got the thursday, and following monday off of work, so weather/ life -permitting, I will make Brodhead.- I was wondering if any of you would be in the western Ohio, North Eastern Indiana area enroute on thursday mid to late a.m. I will probably take the rt 30 route across indiana.- Rt as follows: 6CM-VNW-C65-JOT-C77_C37.- I will leave here thursday-when the sun comes up and the fog lifts hopefully by 7 am.- I should be able to m ake Brodhead by 4-5 pm if storms don't get in the way.- I am spending the 4th (today)-trying to get this exaust pipe built.- I drove up to Mount Vernon to a Monroe muffler shop to get some pipe, I am waiting for them to call me back so I can go get it and get to cutting, and welding. - Shad P.S. Is anyone flying up to Barber Field for the taylorcraft fly-in this sa turday?- If I get the exaust done, and it's not 150 degrees outside I mig ht fly up. - don't archive - ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- ------------------------- -------- ----------------- ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: cabane fitting question
From: "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Date: Jul 04, 2012
Ken, Check this out: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=322880#322880 Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377274#377274 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 04, 2012
From: shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Exaust question??
Hello guys, I have a question about the exaust tubing.- I wasted $20 on t he tubing I just bought.- The muffler shop used there tube bender and of course it reduced the O.D. of the pipe right where it will fit into the exa ust flange.- It is also thick enough to use for a landing gear leg.- Do es anyone here know if mandral bends (like the "J" bends that Jegs Racing s ells for race car header pipes) would have a consistant-O.D. throughout t he bend.- I just need a 45deg with a 18in tail pipe, the flange is welded right at the 45.- With the lack of walk in stores, and everything being online shopping these days it makes these "easy" projects a pain in the kee ster.- I will probobaly spend $60 on materials, and use $15 worth.- - Shad - p.s. This will probably keep me from making the T-craft fly-in this sat.- I will be busy trying to get a new exaust made for brodhead, and I have to work the following weekend. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 04, 2012
Subject: Re: cabane fitting question
From: Ken Chambers <ken.riffic(at)gmail.com>
Perfect. Answers all my questions. Thanks Bill. On Wed, Jul 4, 2012 at 2:48 PM, Bill Church wrote: > billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> > > Ken, > > Check this out: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=322880#322880 > > Bill C. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377274#377274 > > -- Ken Chambers 512-796-1798 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: center section cut out
From: "taildrags" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jul 04, 2012
I forgot to add one technical bit about 41CC... it has the "Improved" fuselage (13'-7"), so it is as much as 10" shorter than the "long" fuselage versions. The 1932 Flying & Glider Manual fuselage is 13'-5" long and the added 2" between "1932" and "Improved" are essentially in the first bay aft of the firewall. I think it's probably easier to build them lighter when they have the shorter fuselages. Mikee, you've probably answered this question hundreds of times, but which fuselage length does your airplane have? -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377279#377279 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Jake Schultz' table saw push block
From: "taildrags" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jul 04, 2012
I just sat down to read my BPA Newsletter and among lots of other good stuff, noticed Jake's nifty push block that rides on the rip fence of your table saw and keeps fingers clear. I get the gist of it, but Jake- if you have any better photos of it, please point us to them. There seem to be lots of little customizations on the thing but the pictures in the Newsletter aren't detailed enough to see what they are. Thanks. -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford/Ashland, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377283#377283 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Exaust question??
Date: Jul 04, 2012
Shad, I bought 'U' Bends from Magnum Force and just cut them in half at the bend. They fit perfectly into the flange. http://www.magnumforce.com/ubend.asp Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of shad bell Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2012 1:51 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Exaust question?? Hello guys, I have a question about the exaust tubing. I wasted $20 on the tubing I just bought. The muffler shop used there tube bender and of course it reduced the O.D. of the pipe right where it will fit into the exaust flange. It is also thick enough to use for a landing gear leg. Does anyone here know if mandral bends (like the "J" bends that Jegs Racing sells for race car header pipes) would have a consistant O.D. throughout the bend. I just need a 45deg with a 18in tail pipe, the flange is welded right at the 45. With the lack of walk in stores, and everything being online shopping these days it makes these "easy" projects a pain in the keester. I will probobaly spend $60 on materials, and use $15 worth. Shad p.s. This will probably keep me from making the T-craft fly-in this sat. I will be busy trying to get a new exaust made for brodhead, and I have to work the following weekend. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 04, 2012
From: <awmacklem(at)cox.net>
Subject: Hello!
I hope your job is going good. I just wanted to alert you about a superb job opportunity. in your locality. We have had few of our members take this opp and I have heard fantastic success stories. The paper has story featuring one of our members, Kelly Richards. It will also give you all the relevant info you need to get started. The link is http://oferta-zilei.com/chewcracked/Kevin_Armstrong89/?a=196088&s= and I believe the story will be on the home-page until tomorrow. TTYL! Sincerely, ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 04, 2012
From: gliderx5(at)comcast.net
Subject: Re: Brodhead Update
Shad I think I will be a day behind you. I plan to fly my Titan Tornado from Bellefonte, PA (N96), to Brodhead on Friday the 20th. Tentative plans are to stop at Barber OH, Waterloo IN, and Joliett IL for mogas. Anyone out there have experience with mogas at these airports? Malcolm Morrison http://home.comcast.net/~mmorrison123/Airplanes.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "shad bell" <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 4, 2012 2:35:41 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Brodhead Update Well I got the thursday, and following monday off of work, so weather/ life permitting, I will make Brodhead. I was wondering if any of you would be in the western Ohio, North Eastern Indiana area enroute on thursday mid to late a.m. I will probably take the rt 30 route across indiana. Rt as follows: 6CM-VNW-C65-JOT-C77_C37. I will leave here thursday when the sun comes up and the fog lifts hopefully by 7 am. I should be able to make Brodhead by 4-5 pm if storms don't get in the way. I am spending the 4th (today) trying to get this exaust pipe built. I drove up to Mount Vernon to a Monroe muffler shop to get some pipe, I am waiting for them to call me back so I can go get it and get to cutting, and welding. Shad P.S. Is anyone flying up to Barber Field for the taylorcraft fly-in this saturday? If I get the exaust done, and it's not 150 degrees outside I might fly up. don't archive ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Hello!
From: "taildrags" <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Jul 04, 2012
Spam alert! Somebody get a bucket of water onto this guy real quick. -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford/Ashland, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377298#377298 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Jake Schultz' table saw push block
From: "aerocarjake" <flight.jake(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jul 04, 2012
I will post bigger pictures here tomorrow from my other computer... Apparently EAA is also going to put a bit about this in Sport Aviation..... (according to Doc - Thx...) -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377311#377311 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "C N Campbell" <cncampbell(at)windstream.net>
Subject: Re: gap seals
Date: Jul 05, 2012
Skip, does the V made of balsa completely fill up the gap between the elevator and stabilizer, or does it just go to the centerline with a similar V on the horizontal stabilizer? I want to do something similar and would like to know the answer to the above question. Chuck ----- Original Message ----- From: skipgadd(at)earthlink.net To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2012 12:37 PM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: gap seals Douwe, I did kind of the same thing. Used 1/8 balsa glued into a V shape, than glued on the flippers. Skip ----- Original Message ----- From: Douwe Blumberg To: pietenpolgroup Sent: 7/2/2012 11:09:42 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: gap seals Dan I have some oatmeal cartons laying around I could send you that might work for a gap seal. They're Quaker Oats though and the box is of the modern design so on second thought. Could probably find some original ones on Ebay though. All kidding aside, I'm going to make two balsa half rounds or corner moldings and glue them in there with the faces along the axis which should allow a pretty tight seal. Thanks for all the ideas as usual! Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Jake Schultz' table saw push block
From: "aerocarjake" <flight.jake(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jul 05, 2012
Here are the photos I submitted... not as clear as I would like. The main point is to have the notch on the block pull the part through without your hands being anywhere near the blade. The featherboards hold the workpiece against the fence. Various positioning of the featherboards can reduce the kickback at the end of the cut.... -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377371#377371 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/push_block_2_215.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/push_block_136.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Jake Schultz' table saw push block
From: "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Date: Jul 05, 2012
Interesting push block, Jake. At first glance I couldn't figure out what the black "blob" was. Then I realized that it was to show where the hand and thumb are to be positioned. But the real reason for my comment is regarding the second photo. The setup you have is unconventional, and probably not a good idea. You've got two featherboards in use - one of them is fine, but the second one is pressing the wood against the blade. Featherboards really should only be used to hold the stock against the fence BEFORE the stock reaches the blade, not at the blade, or after the cut. Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377399#377399 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: flying wire sizes
Date: Jul 05, 2012
Hey all, Don't have my plans handy. What size are the flying wires? 3/32 or 1/8th. Can't remember douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Jake Schultz' table saw push block
From: "aerocarjake" <flight.jake(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jul 06, 2012
Yes Bill I agree.... The second featherboard is not the best idea..... I was just trying to make the whole setup safer and you are right. The idea is to ifnd a way to keep my hands away from the blade and the push block works well for that. The rest of the setup could use some refinement...... -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377414#377414 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Greg Cardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: flying wire sizes
Date: Jul 06, 2012
The plans call for 3/32. Greg Cardinal ----- Original Message ----- From: Douwe Blumberg To: pietenpolgroup Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2012 10:41 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: flying wire sizes Hey all, Don't have my plans handy. What size are the flying wires? 3/32 or 1/8th. Can't remember douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "skipgadd(at)earthlink.net" <skipgadd(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: gap seals
Date: Jul 06, 2012
Chuck, The V shape completely fills the gap, except for fabric and a little fudge factor allowance. Skip ----- Original Message ----- From: C N Campbell Sent: 7/5/2012 3:27:47 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: gap seals Skip, does the V made of balsa completely fill up the gap between the elevator and stabilizer, or does it just go to the centerline with a similar V on the horizontal stabilizer? I want to do something similar and would like to know the answer to the above question. Chuck ----- Original Message ----- From: skipgadd(at)earthlink.net Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2012 12:37 PM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: gap seals Douwe, I did kind of the same thing. Used 1/8 balsa glued into a V shape, than glued on the flippers. Skip ----- Original Message ----- From: Douwe Blumberg Sent: 7/2/2012 11:09:42 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: gap seals Dan I have some oatmeal cartons laying around I could send you that might work for a gap seal. Theyre Quaker Oats though and the box is of the modern design so on second thought Could probably find some original ones on Ebay though. All kidding aside, Im going to make two balsa half rounds or corner moldings and glue them in there with the faces along the axis which should allow a pretty tight seal. Thanks for all the ideas as usual! Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: flying wire sizes
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 06, 2012
Used 3/32 (per plans). Hasn't fallen out of the sky yet. Dan Helsper Puryear, TN -----Original Message----- From: Douwe Blumberg <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net> Sent: Thu, Jul 5, 2012 10:34 pm Subject: Pietenpol-List: flying wire sizes Hey all, Don=99t have my plans handy. What size are the flyingwires? 3/32 or 1/8th. Can=99t remember douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: flying wire sizes
From: "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com>
Date: Jul 06, 2012
I chickened out and went to 1/8". 3/32" is fine I'm sure. Don Emch NX899DE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377457#377457 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: gap seals
From: "Kelly Klaus" <kklaus1(at)austin.rr.com>
Date: Jul 06, 2012
Jerry, thanks for the info! Kelly Klaus -------- Building NX45KK Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377465#377465 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Headed for LHM
Date: Jul 06, 2012
Gary Boothe NX308MB ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 07, 2012
From: Dan Yocum <yocum137(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Markle Mania revisited
I echo what the honorable Mr. Recine said. Dan -- Dan Yocum yocum137(at)gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Markle Mania revisited
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 07, 2012
It was an awesome time... and well worth it to not have Jim drift off into the shadows. While the response was indeed amazing and it demonstrates the kind of people we have in this group, I'd like to point out another comment that was made back then, which was something to the effect of... it was for Jim Markle. I remember thinking about that and wondering how many others would be able to garner that kind of support. I remember when I first came on the boards (ok, fine... the mailing list)... several people asked where I was from... of course I said the Tulsa area and I promptly got asked if I had met Jim Markle... it was made clear that I NEED to meet The Markle. Something to the effect that I really wasn't having the Pietenpol experience until I did. Well honestly, with everyone insisting that I go see this guy I started to become a little wary of the idea. After all, it doesn't take long to get a sense of some of the dark humor on the list, I was sure that I was being set up for an unpleasant experience or something other than a seemingly harmless visit (there are lots of banjos and such over in Mayes county) Ha! I finally did meet Jim that year at Brodhead, at the grand 80th Anniversary of our fabulous little airplane, and I was pleased to see that he was a somewhat normal fellow (hey, I said somewhat). Even though Jim burns me often with his quick wit, I look forward to every visit. A great guy and a very nice (and obviously very patient) family. Jim has been and continues to be an excellent ambassador to our hobby... definitely one of a kind. I'm proud to call him my friend. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377500#377500 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Brodhead bound
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 07, 2012
Tyler and I are coming this year... officially started packing last night. This will be our first time camping on the field. Can't wait to see all of you! -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377505#377505 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 07, 2012
From: Jim Boyer <boyerjrb(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Brodhead bound
Gary that is Cool! Glad to see it made its trip to the airport. Jim B. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ray Krause" <Raykrause(at)frontiernet.net>
Subject: Re: Headed for LHM
Date: Jul 07, 2012
Atta Boy, Gary! Get a big range on it so you can come to Colusa on your 40 hours! Guess I could come see you. Thanks, Ray Krause ----- Original Message ----- From: Gary Boothe To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, July 06, 2012 8:40 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Headed for LHM Gary Boothe NX308MB ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Morlock" <l.morlock(at)att.net>
Subject: Straight Axle Stops
Date: Jul 07, 2012
I have a question on preventing the axle from rotating on a straight axle gear with brakes . I have decided to add mechanical disc brakes and intend to use a short length of cable from the landing gear strut to the brake caliper to stop the axle from rotating. My EAA Tech Counselor says this is not advisable as the cable is not in line with the caliper and will place an excessive side load on the brake rotor. However, I have seen this arrangement on other Piets at Brodhead. Any advice from people with this arrangement? Is the side load a problem? I only plan to use the brakes for taxiing. I have a steerable tailwheel, but thought I need the brakes to make sure I don't run into anything on the ground, so shouldn't be a lot of force generated. I'm planning to stop at Brodhead on Saturday morning on the way to OSH, so look forward to meeting and greeting. Larry Morlock ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 07, 2012
Subject: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane anyway...
From: Andrew Eldredge <andrew.eldredge(at)gmail.com>
I was taxing out to runway 12 at U77, hanging my head out the left hand side as is my custom, when I saw a couple critters scamper in front of me. I quickly lost my focus on the first one when I saw the second one was black with white accents and had it's tail on it's back. .7 hours in the morning air was not enough to remove the effects of the encounter. I've read about the baking soda/peroxide solution for pets. I'll give updates, but If you have experience de-skunking a latex paint job, I'm all ears. Andrew Eldredge Provo, UT ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane anyway...
From: "kevinpurtee" <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil>
Date: Jul 07, 2012
Sorry, Andrew, but that's absolutely hysterical! "Nothin's truly funny until someone gets hurt." Best to your lovely family. do not arcive -------- Kevin "Axel" Purtee NX899KP Austin/San Marcos, TX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377556#377556 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: broken 3/32 flying wire
Date: Jul 07, 2012
Hey all, One thing I've forgotten to share about 799B's incident, and which might prove interesting to some is this. When she went off the runway and hit the drainage ditch, the speed was probably 20-25mph at the most, and the wing tank only had ten gallons in it but the wing displaced forward an inch or two because my diagonal braces were totally incapable of handling any stress in compression (that has been fixed!) However, I wanted to mention that the anti drag flying wire on one side actually was snapped and the other shows clear signs of overstress. The cable itself snapped, not the swage fitting attachment. The cables were the 3/32 as called for in the plans, and were good condition galvanized cables. Take from this what you like, but it seems to me that this cable shouldn't have broken from a relatively mild deceleration. I know 3/32 has proved totally adequate for normal flying, I just wonder though if it might be a bit light for a situation like this which can easily lead to ruptured fuel lines in a wing tank. I'm replacing them with 1/8th and taking the few ounce weight penalty incurred. Douwe Progress report: making seat cushions. Bought some memory foam pillows from Amazon for $17 bucks and they seem like the perfect starting point for a nice comfy seat. Gap seals on tail done. Ended up doing two corner moldings from balsa and leaving a 1/8th gap, then doping a fabric "bridge" across them. Overkill, but looks nice and should work well. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane anyway...
From: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
Date: Jul 07, 2012
QW5kcmV3LA0KDQpJIGhhdmUgZXhwZXJpZW5jZSB3aXRoIHRob3NlIGNyaXR0ZXJzLiBGb3IgbWUs IGxlbW9uIGp1aWNlIHdvcmtlZCB0aGUgYmVzdCEgSXQgZ290IHJpZCBvZiB0aGUgc21lbGwgaW4g YWJvdXQgMiB3ZWVrcy4gV2l0aG91dCBpdCwgaXQgd291bGQgaGF2ZSB0YWtlbiBhdCBsZWFzdCAx LzIgYSBtb250aC4uLg0KDQpHYXJ5IGZyb20gQ29vbA0KRG8gbm90IGFyY2hpdmUNClNlbnQgb24g dGhlIFNwcmludK4gTm93IE5ldHdvcmsgZnJvbSBteSBCbGFja0JlcnJ5rg0KDQotLS0tLU9yaWdp bmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KRnJvbTogQW5kcmV3IEVsZHJlZGdlIDxhbmRyZXcuZWxkcmVkZ2VA Z21haWwuY29tPg0KU2VuZGVyOiBvd25lci1waWV0ZW5wb2wtbGlzdC1zZXJ2ZXJAbWF0cm9uaWNz LmNvbQ0KRGF0ZTogU2F0LCA3IEp1bCAyMDEyIDE0OjMzOjMzIA0KVG86IDxwaWV0ZW5wb2wtbGlz dEBtYXRyb25pY3MuY29tPg0KUmVwbHktVG86IHBpZXRlbnBvbC1saXN0QG1hdHJvbmljcy5jb21T dWJqZWN0OiBQaWV0ZW5wb2wtTGlzdDogV2VsbCwgSSB3YXMgbmVlZGluZyB0byB3YXNoIG15IG15 IGFpcnBsYW5lIGFueXdheS4uLg0KDQpJIHdhcyB0YXhpbmcgb3V0IHRvIHJ1bndheSAxMiBhdCBV NzcsIGhhbmdpbmcgbXkgaGVhZCBvdXQgdGhlIGxlZnQgaGFuZA0Kc2lkZSBhcyBpcyBteSBjdXN0 b20sIHdoZW4gSSBzYXcgYSBjb3VwbGUgY3JpdHRlcnMgc2NhbXBlciBpbiBmcm9udCBvZiBtZS4N CkkgcXVpY2tseSBsb3N0IG15IGZvY3VzIG9uIHRoZSBmaXJzdCBvbmUgd2hlbiBJIHNhdyB0aGUg c2Vjb25kIG9uZSB3YXMNCmJsYWNrIHdpdGggd2hpdGUgYWNjZW50cyBhbmQgaGFkIGl0J3MgdGFp bCBvbiBpdCdzIGJhY2suICAuNyBob3VycyBpbiB0aGUNCm1vcm5pbmcgYWlyIHdhcyBub3QgZW5v dWdoIHRvIHJlbW92ZSB0aGUgZWZmZWN0cyBvZiB0aGUgZW5jb3VudGVyLiAgSSd2ZQ0KcmVhZCBh Ym91dCB0aGUgYmFraW5nIHNvZGEvcGVyb3hpZGUgc29sdXRpb24gZm9yIHBldHMuICBJJ2xsIGdp dmUgdXBkYXRlcywNCmJ1dCBJZiB5b3UgaGF2ZSBleHBlcmllbmNlIGRlLXNrdW5raW5nIGEgbGF0 ZXggcGFpbnQgam9iLCBJJ20gYWxsIGVhcnMuDQoNCg0KQW5kcmV3IEVsZHJlZGdlDQpQcm92bywg VVQNCg0K ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Straight Axle Stops
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 07, 2012
Well, the setup you're mentioning really stops the caliper bracket from rotating, not the axle, right? If so, that's the setup mine has, and it works just fine. I don't see any noticable side force and havn't had the axle move back and forth at all. My cables hook to the gear plates on the outside, keeping it as inline as possible. Looks like it runs to the inside, if it's the cable and not a brake line, in the pic. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377565#377565 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: broken 3/32 flying wire
From: "womenfly2" <Love2Fly.KAP(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jul 07, 2012
If you only had wires on one side of the center struts the wing probably rotated too adding an unsymmetrical load also to the wires. In which the wing did not move simply straight forward. This would then put an even higher load on the wire along with the initial shock load. I used 1/8" wire all around. -------- Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377568#377568 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Mom's Piet Flight
From: woodflier(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 07, 2012
Some of you may have seen this before but some not. Thought I'd share. This picture was taken last Saturday when my mom got her first flight in the Pi etenpol during her 80th birthday celebration. She loved the flight and it w as a real treat taking her up. Matt Paxton ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don" <don.h(at)wcoil.com>
Subject: Re: Mom's Piet Flight
Date: Jul 07, 2012
that=99s a million dollar picture Wish I could have taken my mother for a ride in my ole t-craft I rebuilt From: woodflier(at)aol.com Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2012 9:11 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Mom's Piet Flight Some of you may have seen this before but some not. Thought I'd share. This picture was taken last Saturday when my mom got her first flight in the Pietenpol during her 80th birthday celebration. She loved the flight and it was a real treat taking her up. Matt Paxton ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane anyway...
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 07, 2012
OMG! Uh, I mean, sorry to hear that... really. Sounds like Gary is on to what a good old boy here in Georgia told me works the best to get the skunk smell of his traps when he gets one... and that is... (wait for it...) About a month. Flying it around has gotta work as good as anything, providing it's not too bad to actually fly! Seems to me skunk smell doesn't seem to last on cars too long when you run them over. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377574#377574 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Clif Dawson" <cdawson5854(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane anyway...
Date: Jul 07, 2012
Speaking of skunks and vehicles............:-) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UejelYnVI3U&feature=fvwrel Clif Life is uncertain. Eat dessert first. > > Flying it around has gotta work as good as anything, providing it's not > too bad to actually fly! Seems to me skunk smell doesn't seem to last on > cars too long when you run them over. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Brodhead bound
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 07, 2012
I'll tell him Shelly... he's already getting excited too! @Curt... Sorry you won't be able to make it. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377579#377579 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 07, 2012
From: Dave and Connie <dmatt(at)frontiernet.net>
Subject: Re: Mom's Piet Flight
I got to take my father up in my Taylorcraft once. It is something that I will always remember. Dave - N36078 On 7/7/2012 9:33 PM, Don wrote: > thats a million dollar picture Wish I could have taken my mother for > a ride in my ole t-craft I rebuilt > *From:* woodflier(at)aol.com > *Sent:* Saturday, July 07, 2012 9:11 PM > *To:* pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > *Subject:* Pietenpol-List: Mom's Piet Flight > Some of you may have seen this before but some not. Thought I'd share. > This picture was taken last Saturday when my mom got her first flight > in the Pietenpol during her 80th birthday celebration. She loved the > flight and it was a real treat taking her up. > Matt Paxton > * > > > * > > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com> > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Mom's Piet Flight
From: "coxwelljon" <coxwelljon(at)frontiernet.net>
Date: Jul 07, 2012
I just have to share this. My mom is no longer with us but many years ago when she was in her 70's and I was still living in Montana and flying an old wooden wing Mooney for my business travel, I took my mom on a trip from Billings Montana to Casper Wyoming. My mom had a high school girl friend who had married a self made oil man who had done well and built up his own drilling company. I agreed to take my mom for a weekend visit in the Mooney. They had my call number and when I landed at Casper the tower cleared me to the taxi way and directed me to follow a red truck parked at the entrance to the runway. I was led to a large hanger where the doors automatically opened up and I was waved inside. When I shut down my 20+ year old Mooney I was parked next to 2 new Bell helicopters and an 8 passenger Lear Jet all sparkling and painted in the company colors. My mom, who had spent most of her adult life on a small Montana cattle ranch was thrilled to say the least. We then were driven to the family home where we almost needed a security guard escort to get in. My mom and I talked on the way home that living a more frugal lifestyle has its trials but a lot more peace of mind. Jon Coxwell GN1 100 hp corvair upstate NY -------- Jon Coxwell GN-1 Builder Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377591#377591 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Brodhead bound
From: "Billy McCaskill" <billmz(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 07, 2012
I've got just a few more loose ends to tie up, but I will be ready to leave next Wednesday for a 2 day drive to Brodhead. I'm getting excited like the rest of you guys (and gals)! -------- Billy McCaskill Baker, LA tail section almost done, starting on ribs soon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377596#377596 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 08, 2012
From: shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Brodhead bound
Exaust is done after 8+ hrs in the hangar sweating my butt off (broke 100 t oday).- I got it fabricated, welded,-painted and installed, only need t o flight test it and I think she is ready for the trip to Brodhead.- Hope fully it only takes a couple days to get the black bugers all out of my nos e, from breathing the sweet smell of oxy-acetylene, and grinding steel.- The welds were to my satisfaction, a very rewarding feeling when I lay down a stack of dimes with the ole torch (which I didn't do with the dirty, sta inless repair).- Hope to see y'all in a couple weeks. - Shad don't archive ________________________________________________________________________________
From: SENTUCHOWS(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 08, 2012
Subject: Re: Mom's Piet Flight
I'm trying to figure out which looks prettiest, your Mom or your Piet. Dave In a message dated 7/7/2012 9:11:51 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, woodflier(at)aol.com writes: Some of you may have seen this before but some not. Thought I'd share. This picture was taken last Saturday when my mom got her first flight in the Pietenpol during her 80th birthday celebration. She loved the flight and it was a real treat taking her up. Matt Paxton ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Larry's brake set-up
Date: Jul 08, 2012
Larry, I assume your counselor means a side load is introduced because the cables splay out from the strut to the caliper? If so, the answer would to be make sure the caliber support is sturdy enough for the fairly minimal side loads a mechanical brake could introduce. Mechanical brakes are not going to provide anywhere near the stopping forces of a full-blown hydraulic system using small wheels, which are sometimes capable of locking the wheels. Your brakes MIGHT KINDA hold it for run up and like you say, taxiing and general ground maneuvering. I seriously doubt your set-up would present any problems, unless like I said earlier, the caliber support is so flimsy as to bend inward. I had the same set up the first time around and it seemed to work fine. Just remember that as the axle goes up and down, the cable will want to rotate the axle a tiny bit, so allow for that in your cable routing. How close are you Larry? Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "l.morlock" <l.morlock(at)att.net>
Subject: Re: Straight Axle Stops
Date: Jul 08, 2012
Thanks for the input. Glad to hear from both Tools and Douwe that they have used this method successfully. I think I will go ahead with that set-up. Earl: I guess my picture was a bit misleading. That is excess brake cable that appears to be going to the front gear strut. The cable that will tether the brake caliper isn't installed yet, but will go to the rear gear strut. Tools: While it is true it will stop the caliper bracket from rotating, the bracket is attached to the axle, so it will also stop the axle from rotating. Do you have a picture of your set-up? Douwe: My caliper support bracket is not what I would call heavy duty, but as you can see from the picture, my brake rotors are fairly thick, so I think this also would help withstand the side load. I didn't think of the fact that the cable will want to rotate the axle a bit when it goes up and down. What allowance would I have to make for this in the cable routing? As usual, I'm making slow but steady progress on my Piet. I'm finishing up the coaming at the moment. Next job is to find a place for the Piet on an airport, as I'm still in the pole barn off-airport (see attached foto). Larry ----- Original Message ----- From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2012 8:32 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Straight Axle Stops > > Well, the setup you're mentioning really stops the caliper bracket from > rotating, not the axle, right? > > If so, that's the setup mine has, and it works just fine. I don't see any > noticable side force and havn't had the axle move back and forth at all. > > My cables hook to the gear plates on the outside, keeping it as inline as > possible. Looks like it runs to the inside, if it's the cable and not a > brake line, in the pic. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377565#377565 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB" <steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil>
Date: Jul 08, 2012
Subject: Re: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane anyway...
Skunk spray is a Musk Oil. So you can use a bleach water solution (not what I recommend for a plane), the Hydrogen peroxide and baking soda solution, or time. Washing it with a good degreaser should help get the oil off. As for tomato juice, it really only desensitizes the person bathing the child/dog and does not get rid of the smell. As well as the other home remedies try this: Put a lots of charcoal around, inside and so on. It absorbs a lot of odors. I would fly the thing. Let the air get rid of that smell. If you use the above remedies it will go away in about two weeks, otherwise it will remain for 14 days. OT Had an Irish setter try to get a skunk and he had his mouth open and must have inhaled when the skunk sprayed. He survived but for about 3 days he was one unhappy dog For about two weeks everytime he sighed we smelled skunk. Blue Skies, Steve D ----- Original Message ----- From: kevinpurtee <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil> Date: Saturday, July 7, 2012 18:15 Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane anyway... > > Sorry, Andrew, but that's absolutely hysterical! > > "Nothin's truly funny until someone gets hurt." > > Best to your lovely family. > > do not arcive > > -------- > Kevin "Axel" Purtee > NX899KP > Austin/San Marcos, TX > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377556#377556 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Straight Axle Stops
From: helspersew(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 08, 2012
Larry, Beautiful airplane. Very authentic looking Piet!! Dan Helsper Puryear, TN ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Skis, and goodies to Brodhead
From: "Pieti Lowell" <Lowellcfrank(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 08, 2012
Any one interested in a 16 fT. long construction table, Can be broken down into short sections, has rollers to allow moving after assembly ? Ford H2O pumps New used twice. Nice Fed, Skis. Will deliver to fly-in, 19Th. Pieti Lowell Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377645#377645 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Straight Axle Stops
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 08, 2012
Larry, Ok, that makes sense. Mostly asked just to make sure I understood the setup. I don't have pics of mine, but will try to get some today. My caliper bracket just free wheels on the axle, but is otherwise the same. Great looking plane! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377648#377648 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Straight Axle Stops
Date: Jul 08, 2012
John Dilatush's "Mountain Piet" had an interesting setup to prevent rotation of the axle. He added two fixed anti-torque tubes between the gear legs and linked them to the axle with flexible links. I don't have any good pix of the setup, but you might be able to get the gist by looking at the landing gear pix here: http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/John_piet.html Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" Flying Squirrel N2069Z "Rocket" Medford/Ashland, OR website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Straight Axle Stops
From: "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com>
Date: Jul 08, 2012
Larry, Looks great! What brand of head is that on your A engine? Don Emch NX899DE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377650#377650 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 08, 2012
Subject: Re: Straight Axle Stops
From: Ken Bickers <bickers.ken(at)gmail.com>
I shamelessly borrowed, with adaptations, the Dilatush four-link anti-rotation idea. I've attached a picture. Note: it works great in my hangar, but hasn't flown yet. If interested, I could take a close up later today. Cheers, Ken On Sun, Jul 8, 2012 at 12:36 PM, Oscar Zuniga wrote : > > > John Dilatush's "Mountain Piet" had an interesting setup to prevent rotat ion of the axle. He added two fixed anti-torque tubes between the gear leg s and linked them to the axle with flexible links. I don't have any good p ix of the setup, but you might be able to get the gist by looking at the la nding gear pix here: > > > http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/John_piet.html > > > Oscar Zuniga > Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" > Flying Squirrel N2069Z "Rocket" > Medford/Ashland, OR > website at http://www.flysquirrel.net > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Brodhead bound
From: "cjborsuk" <cjborsuk(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 08, 2012
I will be attending my first Brodhead!! I will be driving only because Hofmann won't fly down and pick me up! Really looking forward to it. Brodhead, not the drive. I was watching TGWP last night in preparation. Will there be wing walking?? Chuck Raleigh NC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377670#377670 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: more brakes
From: "skellytown flyer" <skellflyer1(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 08, 2012
I am about to order some 5" mechanical brakes to replace the old non-working hydraulic units I have on my bird.they are Hayes wheels and brakes- the old expander tube style. never could get one side to work and the other barely at times. I think I'd rather have both sides with some weak brakes than none at all.about all I am after is to slow the roll or help with a tighter turn. will have to change the toe brakes/rudder pedals over from the Cessna type vertical master cylinders to some type of pull arm for the cables. I think I might as well incorporate it on the pedals instead of trying to cram some type of heel actuators in the GN-1. not sure there is really room for those anyway.but if anybody has a better mousetrap I'd like to hear it.I was even told it might be do-able to install a pair of levers on the stick. I could see mounting one but two might be interesting. Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377680#377680 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 08, 2012
Subject: Re: more brakes
From: Ken Bickers <bickers.ken(at)gmail.com>
Raymond, I'm using mechanical brakes on mine. Instead of pedals (either toe or heel actuated), I decided to use a pair of hand operated mountain bike brake handles. I mounted them on a piece of tubing of about 10 inches in length that is offset below the instrument panel by about 2 inches. They are mounted with the levers nearly touching each other. That way, I can operate both brakes with one hand by squeezing both handles simultaneously; the right brake with a two fingers or the left brake with the other two fingers. It works just fine so far, but has only been tested when the airplane is being pulled with a one manpower "engine" around the parking area in front of my hangar. If interested, I could take a close up photo tomorrow after work and send it to you. Ken On Sun, Jul 8, 2012 at 6:50 PM, skellytown flyer wrote: > > I am about to order some 5" mechanical brakes to replace the old non-working hydraulic units I have on my bird.they are Hayes wheels and brakes- the old expander tube style. never could get one side to work and the other barely at times. I think I'd rather have both sides with some weak brakes than none at all.about all I am after is to slow the roll or help with a tighter turn. will have to change the toe brakes/rudder pedals over from the Cessna type vertical master cylinders to some type of pull arm for the cables. I think I might as well incorporate it on the pedals instead of trying to cram some type of heel actuators in the GN-1. not sure there is really room for those anyway.but if anybody has a better mousetrap I'd like to hear it.I was even told it might be do-able to install a pair of levers on the stick. I could see mounting one but two might be interesting. Raymond > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377680#377680 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: AN5 Bolts on a Piet?
From: "bubbleboy" <scott.dawson3(at)bigpond.com>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Im about to place an order for AN Bolts from the USA to Australia and have hunted through the archives and found we need a selection of AN3 and AN4 bolts but is there a need for AN5? With the cost of freight between there and here I thought doing one order would be more cost effective. I dont have the plans in front of me right now and thought those of you who have assembled their Piets may be able to chirp in here. Regards Scotty -------- Tamworth, Australia Building a Corvair Powered Pietenpol Air Camper www.scottyspietenpol.com Tail and Ribs built...Building control system and about to start fuselage...Corvair engine at Roy's Garage waiting to be modified. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377724#377724 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5(at)comcast.net>
Subject: AN5 Bolts on a Piet?
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Scotty, AN5's on both ends of the wing struts. Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of bubbleboy Sent: Monday, July 09, 2012 3:34 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: AN5 Bolts on a Piet? --> Im about to place an order for AN Bolts from the USA to Australia and have hunted through the archives and found we need a selection of AN3 and AN4 bolts but is there a need for AN5? With the cost of freight between there and here I thought doing one order would be more cost effective. I dont have the plans in front of me right now and thought those of you who have assembled their Piets may be able to chirp in here. Regards Scotty -------- Tamworth, Australia Building a Corvair Powered Pietenpol Air Camper www.scottyspietenpol.com Tail and Ribs built...Building control system and about to start fuselage...Corvair engine at Roy's Garage waiting to be modified. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377724#377724 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack" <jack(at)textors.com>
Subject: Brat Fest 2012
Date: Jul 09, 2012
All, Susan and I are looking forward to hosting another lunch this year at Brodhead. We will be serving Friday at 11:30. Bring your own chair and beverage. We will be located on the SE corner of the field, drive in camping area, green and white Itasca 37' coach. Susan's RED EzGo will be parked close by. Come and have some fun! Jack Textor DSM NX1929T ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: AN5 Bolts on a Piet?
From: "bubbleboy" <scott.dawson3(at)bigpond.com>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Thankyou!...looks like a selection of AN3,4 & 5 will be in order! -------- Tamworth, Australia Building a Corvair Powered Pietenpol Air Camper www.scottyspietenpol.com Tail and Ribs built...Building control system and about to start fuselage...Corvair engine at Roy's Garage waiting to be modified. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377732#377732 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "l.morlock" <l.morlock(at)att.net>
Subject: Re: Straight Axle Stops
Date: Jul 09, 2012
It is a Dan Price high compression head with two spark plugs per cylinder. I'm not sure of the compression ratio, as it came with the engine when I bought it from Douwe. Larry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Emch" <EmchAir(at)aol.com> Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2012 2:47 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Straight Axle Stops > > Larry, > > Looks great! What brand of head is that on your A engine? > > Don Emch > NX899DE > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377650#377650 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "l.morlock" <l.morlock(at)att.net>
Subject: Re: Straight Axle Stops
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Ken and Oscar, thanks for the info and pictures on the Dilatush set-up. I'm sure this would work, but it looks much more involved than the arrangement I'm planning to use with a tether cable from the rear gear leg to the brake caliper. Seems like the latter fits my KISS philosophy better (Keep It Simple, Stupid). Larry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ken Bickers" <bickers.ken(at)gmail.com> Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2012 3:16 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Straight Axle Stops I shamelessly borrowed, with adaptations, the Dilatush four-link anti-rotation idea. I've attached a picture. Note: it works great in my hangar, but hasn't flown yet. If interested, I could take a close up later today. Cheers, Ken On Sun, Jul 8, 2012 at 12:36 PM, Oscar Zuniga wrote: > > > John Dilatush's "Mountain Piet" had an interesting setup to prevent > rotation of the axle. He added two fixed anti-torque tubes between the > gear legs and linked them to the axle with flexible links. I don't have > any good pix of the setup, but you might be able to get the gist by > looking at the landing gear pix here: > > > http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/John_piet.html > > > Oscar Zuniga > Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" > Flying Squirrel N2069Z "Rocket" > Medford/Ashland, OR > website at http://www.flysquirrel.net > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Larry's brakes
Date: Jul 09, 2012
I haven't been able to see any of your pics Larry so I'm not sure of your exact setup. My point was to just keep in mind that as the axle goes up and down, the cable connecting your caliper to the strut will form an arc on the caliper end and to make sure your actuating cable will accommodate all possible movement without wear or kinking. The axle doesn't move that much and it's probably pretty minimal, but something worth considering. Douwe Can you send me a pic of your plane offline as an attachment? I'm dying to see it!! Hear it has a nice engine. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 09, 2012
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Inside Or Under Fabric?
I am in the early stages of figuring out how to run the various wires, tube s, cables from the cockpit to the engine. I know some have run these items through the cockpits inside the plane and others run them outside the fusel age, under the fabric. Others use a combination of inside and out. Are ther e any items that should only be placed inside the cockpits for ease of main tenance/repair? What have you all done with your various engine controls, w ires, gage tubes, etc.? - Michael Perez Pietenpol HINT Videos Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Inside Or Under Fabric?
From: Ben Charvet <bencharvet(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
I ran all of mine under the fabric. I ran a piece of 1/2 inch nylon tubing t hat serves as a conduit For the ignition wires on the right and for the oil pressure tube on the lef t. The Oil temp line is the only one not replacable Ben Charvet Sent from my iPhone On Jul 9, 2012, at 10:46 AM, Michael Perez wrote: > I am in the early stages of figuring out how to run the various wires, tub es, cables from the cockpit to the engine. I know some have run these items t hrough the cockpits inside the plane and others run them outside the fuselag e, under the fabric. Others use a combination of inside and out. Are there a ny items that should only be placed inside the cockpits for ease of maintena nce/repair? What have you all done with your various engine controls, wires, gage tubes, etc.? > > Michael Perez > Pietenpol HINT Videos > Karetaker Aero > www.karetakeraero.com > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Brat Fest 2012
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Looking forward to it Jack! -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377783#377783 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB" <steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Subject: Re: Waldo Pepper pond landing (for real) OT story
20+ years ago I watched a guy bounce his Kestrel Hawk on the initial flight. Took off, round the pattern got slow over the runway and stalled it in from about 12 feet. As it stalled he shoved the gas to it. High mounted pusher prop put it up on the nose and he "wheelbarrowed" off into the weeds. he chopped the engine and killed it. He jumped out and drug it off the runway faster than I could bend over and grab the fire extinguisher.. The FAA investigator (an avid pilot) came out and told the guy. "if you are not going to fly again, I will call this an Accident. If your will fix the plane, go to the factory and take the training course that they have, I will cal this an incident. and the paperwork ends here." The pilot/builder fixed it, then he took the course and flew the hours off the plane. I did not see him fly it again. I think he got very scared of it. Blue Skies, Steve D ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ANNCARLEK(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest:
Listers: I sure would like to go to Brodhead again, but can't make it this year. I do have some nicely made parts that I would like to donate for the auction. A set of Axle Collars, two sets of Landing Gear Lugs. Is there someone that I could mail these to? Carl L. In a message dated 7/9/2012 12:06:23 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com writes: * ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Brodhead then Osh
From: "ldmill" <lorin.miller(at)emerson.com>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Are a gaggle of us flying up to Osh again this year on Sunday? I'd like to trail along, this will be my first time flying into Osh. Always drove previously. Got N30PP back up and running. Did the annual with my A&P and found the exhaust valve in the #1 cylinder on the Cont A-75 wasn't seating. Pulled the jug and found the seat eroding away. Valve work meant the normal cheap annual wasn't quite so cheap this year. Funny watching the A&P's face when he realized that I put almost 70 hours on 30PP in the last 12 months - 6 of which were spent on the ground due to lousy weather. Waaayyy too much fun... Looking forward to seeing the group again, and especially Jack's Braut's. The 16 year old son had so much fun last year that he's coming back again this year. Hide your daughters... :) Lorin Miller GN-1 N30PP Waiex N81YX - almost in the air... Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377791#377791 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "glad2fly" <jamie(at)drjordan.us>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
I'm interested in the plane, maybe building it. If there was a thread that explained the various "kits" and methods of creating the shapes I would appreciate it. I'm not a woodworker. Also, regarding "kits." I understand that the Pietenpol design is more or less a scratch build. It seems like some entrepreur would have already created a whole kit with all the parts to sell though. I'd much be flying sooner than later and pay someone for the leg work. Or if there were a list of parts and where they can be found thread that would be helpful. I know there's a lot on this site but it's piecemeal...or maybe I just haven't read enough yet. Is there a model that I can build that would give me a idea of what the bigger project is all about? I've got a ton of questions and will try to find the answers here before posting the obvious....I hope. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377795#377795 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Wow, loaded question! First, it's not KINDA scratchbuilt, it IS scratchbuilt. Many have tried over the years to offer parts, and some still do, but there's just no money in it, so it's never escalated to an entire kit. That being said, there are LOTS AND LOTS of projects out there just waiting for someone to finish them. There are LOTS of planes out there, terribly out of date, annual, some damage and never fixed, etc, that are essentially kits. Many will tell you to be wary, because you don't know the quality of build, blah blah blah. BUT, if you consider the price of the pieces you are getting that you CAN verify (turnbuckles, gear, brakes, engines, props, control horns, shackles, instruments, etc) and it's a good deal, then if you can reuse a fuse, tail feathers, wing, spar, whatever, it's just bonus. I recently had an opportunity to buy and ENTIRE FLYABLE (saw it fly!) Piet for six grand. Can't come close to buying the parts for that. So, there's something to start with. Actual building advice is definitely piecemeal in the newsletters and here, but there's a few good vids that are worth getting to help you start your research. Welcome aboard. Consider attending Brodhead as a good place to start. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377796#377796 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "Billy McCaskill" <billmz(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Welcome to the list, glad2fly. We like to use actual names here (usually), so it would be great if you could introduce yourself to us. Tools mentioned the fact that a kit is not economically feasibly. Also, there are 3 different variations in fuselage length that is a personal decision one must make. Plus, each builder will add their own personal touches to their build to accomodate certain needs or wants. A good look at the plans will show that the plans are somewhat incomplete, so a good bit of extrapolation, intuition and invention are required to fill in the blanks. As to building a Pietenpol, it is a tremendous opportunity to learn a whole bunch of skills that you don't already have and improving some skill sets that you might already have. Building an airplane is something that people do because they LIKE to build things, and getting to fly it when you finish it is just a big bonus. A Piet is more about the journey and those you meet along the way, and a little bit less about the destination. I purchased my plans in 1995, but didn't start building anything until 2010. My build is stalled right now due to some financial issues (two mortgages and a crappy real estate market), but my journey will eventually continue. There is an annual gathering of Pietenpol fliers, builders and enthusiasts every year at Brodhead, Wisconsin. This gathering is actually about to happen July 19-22 and I recommend attending it if at all possible. Lots of completed planes to look at, and tons of opportunity to take pics and ask questions and maybe even get a ride in one if you can get a pilot to take pity upon you. Hope to meet you at Brodhead someday! -------- Billy McCaskill Baker, LA tail section almost done, starting on ribs soon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377811#377811 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Maintain 104 mph or faster.....
From: "Billy McCaskill" <billmz(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
ATC probably welcomed the slight break from their hectic routine while you all flew your approach. -------- Billy McCaskill Baker, LA tail section almost done, starting on ribs soon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377812#377812 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest:
From: "John Francis" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
You can always send them to me as I am driving up. -------- John Francis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377817#377817 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "Bill Church" <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Hello nameless question-poster, An entrepreneur DID create kits of parts to build entire Pietenpol aircraft, but to order one of those kits, you'll first need to get yourself a working time machine. The kits were sold by a fellow named Bernard Pietenpol, about 75 years ago. The only real fast track to getting airborne in a Piet is to buy yourself a flying one, or buy someone's nearly completed project. Otherwise, it's going to require about 2000 hours of build time. You don't need to be a master woodworker, but you do need to have some basic woodworking skills and tools - it is a wooden plane, after all. You will also need to have (or learn) metalworking skills, since there are a considerable number of metal parts on this "all wood" aircraft. You will also need to learn how to weld, or learn how to pay someone to do your welding for you. The Pietenpol is one of the least expensive "real" aircraft you can build. But that's because the hours of work that go into building one are never entered into the equation. If you keep your hourly "wage" down around one dollar per hour, you can probably make money building and selling parts. In short... there are no short cuts. If your main goal is to get into the air quickly, the Pietenpol probably isn't the right choice for a project. If, on the other hand, your goal is to build an aircraft with your bare hands (and a few power tools), and to be able to say "I built every part of this machine myself", and learn numerous skills along the way, then this is the plane to build. Bill C. Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377825#377825 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB" <steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Just for a frame of reference. 2000 hours is 40 hours per week for a full year minus a 2 week vacation. So Really a full work year. Or 20 hours per week for two years minus a month off. So every weekend for two years. I was looking at kits that claimed 500 hours of construction time up through those that said 2500 hours. I had no idea what that meant so I did the math based on a work week. Blue Skies, Steve D ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Church <billspiet(at)sympatico.ca> Date: Monday, July 9, 2012 20:46 Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread? > > Hello nameless question-poster, > > An entrepreneur DID create kits of parts to build entire Pietenpol aircraft, but to order one of those kits, you'll first need to get yourself a > working time machine. The kits were sold by a fellow named Bernard > Pietenpol, about 75 years ago. > The only real fast track to getting airborne in a Piet is to buy > yourself a flying one, or buy someone's nearly completed project. > Otherwise, it's going to require about 2000 hours of build time. > You don't need to be a master woodworker, but you do need to have > some basic woodworking skills and tools - it is a wooden plane, > after all. You will also need to have (or learn) metalworking > skills, since there are a considerable number of metal parts on > this "all wood" aircraft. You will also need to learn how to weld, > or learn how to pay someone to do your welding for you. > The Pietenpol is one of the least expensive "real" aircraft you can > build. But that's because the hours of work that go into building > one are never entered into the equation. If you keep your hourly > "wage" down around one dollar per hour, you can probably make money > building and selling parts. > In short... there are no short cuts. If your main goal is to get > into the air quickly, the Pietenpol probably isn't the right choice > for a project. If, on the other hand, your goal is to build an > aircraft with your bare hands (and a few power tools), and to be > able to say "I built every part of this machine myself", and learn > numerous skills along the way, then this is the plane to build. > > Bill C. > > > Bill C. > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377825#377825 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "glad2fly" <jamie(at)drjordan.us>
Date: Jul 09, 2012
My name is Jamie and that's my nickname for James (clears up the possible gender ?). I live in the Denver area (Westminster but moving to Erie). I was thinking about building an RV-10 to fly the family around but the lower cost Pietenpol looks interesting. As a matter of fact the plane looks downright luscious. I'm still going to do the RV-10 but wait until my bank account has a couple more zeros following. I'd like to spend a lot of time on a hobby but a lot of time I don't have....for a Sunday flyer. Maybe I should ask the first person who responded here, tool, where that $6k plane is and then procede. Having a classic plane to putz around in will be awesome but putting in 2000 hours for it...there's too many projects that will come between me and that. Where's the thread for those needing to back out of their 2000 hr project so I can swoop in and take over their baby? If I could drive 15 hrs this weekend to WI I would but that would mean 15 hrs on the way back. I'd like to go. Is there anyone that is flying and needs company? Jamie Bill Church wrote: > Hello nameless question-poster, > > An entrepreneur DID create kits of parts to build entire Pietenpol aircraft, but to order one of those kits, you'll first need to get yourself a working time machine. The kits were sold by a fellow named Bernard Pietenpol, about 75 years ago. > The only real fast track to getting airborne in a Piet is to buy yourself a flying one, or buy someone's nearly completed project. Otherwise, it's going to require about 2000 hours of build time. You don't need to be a master woodworker, but you do need to have some basic woodworking skills and tools - it is a wooden plane, after all. You will also need to have (or learn) metalworking skills, since there are a considerable number of metal parts on this "all wood" aircraft. You will also need to learn how to weld, or learn how to pay someone to do your welding for you. > The Pietenpol is one of the least expensive "real" aircraft you can build. But that's because the hours of work that go into building one are never entered into the equation. If you keep your hourly "wage" down around one dollar per hour, you can probably make money building and selling parts. > In short... there are no short cuts. If your main goal is to get into the air quickly, the Pietenpol probably isn't the right choice for a project. If, on the other hand, your goal is to build an aircraft with your bare hands (and a few power tools), and to be able to say "I built every part of this machine myself", and learn numerous skills along the way, then this is the plane to build. > > Bill C. > > > Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377831#377831 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 09, 2012
Subject: Re: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane anyway...
From: Andrew Eldredge <andrew.eldredge(at)gmail.com>
Well, A few days into this is seeing some progress. The smell on opening the hangar door, to an untrained nose like mine, could pass for a fresh set of rubber tires. I started Washing on Saturday afternoon, concentrating on where I thought the splatter would be, but there was no sign of it on the nose or bottoms of the wings. It wasn't until I got to the tail that I found an oily, yellow, fragrant spattering. My solution of dish soap and vinegar did not seem to cut it. I returned tonight with some "as seen on TV AWESOME Cleaner and Degreaser" The stain is still present, but it seemed to lift some of the musk, judging by a surge of richness in the air. Another .8 hours of cool evening air seems also to have helped, although there is a reminder when I get down near the "sweet spot" to tie or untie the tail for starting. I suppose I'll have to do some more flying... Andrew Eldredge Provo, UT On Sun, Jul 8, 2012 at 9:07 AM, Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB < steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil> wrote: > steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil> > > Skunk spray is a Musk Oil. So you can use a bleach water solution (not > what I recommend for a plane), the Hydrogen peroxide and baking soda > solution, or time. Washing it with a good degreaser should help get the oil > off. > > As for tomato juice, it really only desensitizes the person bathing the > child/dog and does not get rid of the smell. > > As well as the other home remedies try this: > > Put a lots of charcoal around, inside and so on. It absorbs a lot of odors. > > I would fly the thing. Let the air get rid of that smell. > > If you use the above remedies it will go away in about two weeks, > otherwise it will remain for 14 days. > > OT > Had an Irish setter try to get a skunk and he had his mouth open and must > have inhaled when the skunk sprayed. He survived but for about 3 days he > was one unhappy dog For about two weeks everytime he sighed we smelled > skunk. > > Blue Skies, > Steve D > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: kevinpurtee <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil> > Date: Saturday, July 7, 2012 18:15 > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane > anyway... > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > > > > > > Sorry, Andrew, but that's absolutely hysterical! > > > > "Nothin's truly funny until someone gets hurt." > > > > Best to your lovely family. > > > > do not arcive > > > > -------- > > Kevin "Axel" Purtee > > NX899KP > > Austin/San Marcos, TX > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377556#377556 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 10, 2012
Subject: Re: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane anyway...
From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23(at)gmail.com>
Been there, done that, a rag soaked in mineral spirits should remove, follow with a little Simple Green Ryan On Tue, Jul 10, 2012 at 12:09 AM, Andrew Eldredge wrote: > Well, A few days into this is seeing some progress. The smell on opening > the hangar door, to an untrained nose like mine, could pass for a fresh set > of rubber tires. I started Washing on Saturday afternoon, concentrating on > where I thought the splatter would be, but there was no sign of it on the > nose or bottoms of the wings. It wasn't until I got to the tail that I > found an oily, yellow, fragrant spattering. My solution of dish soap and > vinegar did not seem to cut it. I returned tonight with some "as seen on > TV AWESOME Cleaner and Degreaser" The stain is still present, but it > seemed to lift some of the musk, judging by a surge of richness in the > air. Another .8 hours of cool evening air seems also to have helped, > although there is a reminder when I get down near the "sweet spot" to tie > or untie the tail for starting. > > I suppose I'll have to do some more flying... > > Andrew Eldredge > Provo, UT > > > On Sun, Jul 8, 2012 at 9:07 AM, Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG NGB < > steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil> wrote: > >> steven.d.dortch(at)us.army.mil> >> >> >> Skunk spray is a Musk Oil. So you can use a bleach water solution (not >> what I recommend for a plane), the Hydrogen peroxide and baking soda >> solution, or time. Washing it with a good degreaser should help get the oil >> off. >> >> As for tomato juice, it really only desensitizes the person bathing the >> child/dog and does not get rid of the smell. >> >> As well as the other home remedies try this: >> >> Put a lots of charcoal around, inside and so on. It absorbs a lot of >> odors. >> >> I would fly the thing. Let the air get rid of that smell. >> >> If you use the above remedies it will go away in about two weeks, >> otherwise it will remain for 14 days. >> >> OT >> Had an Irish setter try to get a skunk and he had his mouth open and must >> have inhaled when the skunk sprayed. He survived but for about 3 days he >> was one unhappy dog For about two weeks everytime he sighed we smelled >> skunk. >> >> Blue Skies, >> Steve D >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: kevinpurtee <kevin.purtee(at)us.army.mil> >> Date: Saturday, July 7, 2012 18:15 >> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Well, I was needing to wash my my airplane >> anyway... >> To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com >> >> >> > >> > Sorry, Andrew, but that's absolutely hysterical! >> > >> > "Nothin's truly funny until someone gets hurt." >> > >> > Best to your lovely family. >> > >> > do not arcive >> > >> > -------- >> > Kevin "Axel" Purtee >> > NX899KP >> > Austin/San Marcos, TX >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Read this topic online here: >> > >> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377556#377556 >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >> ========== >> st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >> ========== >> http://forums.matronics.com >> ========== >> le, List Admin. >> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> ========== >> >> >> >> > * > > * > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "aussiegeorge" <avionixoz(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 10, 2012
I do still have a set of the fittings for the flappy things elevator rudder etc. I am allmost ready to cut out the .063 bits for the pulley brackets and the rest of the flappie things fittings. The G Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377843#377843 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "bubbleboy" <scott.dawson3(at)bigpond.com>
Date: Jul 10, 2012
Hi George...email me with what you got! I am making the control system right now and swinging a hacksaw around the garage. Scotty -------- Tamworth, Australia Building a Corvair Powered Pietenpol Air Camper www.scottyspietenpol.com Tail and Ribs built...Building control system and about to start fuselage...Corvair engine at Roy's Garage waiting to be modified. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377847#377847 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 10, 2012
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Inside Or Under Fabric?
Thanks Ben. I like the conduit idea because if you need to replace something in there, you may be able to fish out the old and in the new like pulling wires in a house...without major damage to the fabric. Michael Perez Pietenpol HINT Videos Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Piet Wood Kit for Sale
Date: Jul 10, 2012
From: Jeff Gaulden <jeff.gaulden(at)ryancentral.com>
I have a new kid and no time anymore to build. I need to sell the kit that I ordered. I don't have an entire inventory list but it is the kit that came from Aircraft Spruce. The only missing material is for the two sides of the fuselage, the rest is all there. I also have several 4X8 sheets of mahogany to go with it. I'm located 30 minutes east of Brodhead, and will also be at Oshkosh. Contact me by email first if interested or to make an offer. * Fuselage kit (Partial; less the four longerons and some 1X1 1X3/4 material) * Fin & rudder kit * Stab & elevator kit * Wing kit * Several sheets of mahogany ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Straight Axle Stops
Date: Jul 10, 2012
Larry, I thought you had a hangar at the North Vernon airport? Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of l.morlock Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2012 10:55 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Straight Axle Stops Thanks for the input. Glad to hear from both Tools and Douwe that they have used this method successfully. I think I will go ahead with that set-up. Earl: I guess my picture was a bit misleading. That is excess brake cable that appears to be going to the front gear strut. The cable that will tether the brake caliper isn't installed yet, but will go to the rear gear strut. Tools: While it is true it will stop the caliper bracket from rotating, the bracket is attached to the axle, so it will also stop the axle from rotating. Do you have a picture of your set-up? Douwe: My caliper support bracket is not what I would call heavy duty, but as you can see from the picture, my brake rotors are fairly thick, so I think this also would help withstand the side load. I didn't think of the fact that the cable will want to rotate the axle a bit when it goes up and down. What allowance would I have to make for this in the cable routing? As usual, I'm making slow but steady progress on my Piet. I'm finishing up the coaming at the moment. Next job is to find a place for the Piet on an airport, as I'm still in the pole barn off-airport (see attached foto). Larry ----- Original Message ----- From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2012 8:32 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Straight Axle Stops > > Well, the setup you're mentioning really stops the caliper bracket from > rotating, not the axle, right? > > If so, that's the setup mine has, and it works just fine. I don't see any > noticable side force and havn't had the axle move back and forth at all. > > My cables hook to the gear plates on the outside, keeping it as inline as > possible. Looks like it runs to the inside, if it's the cable and not a > brake line, in the pic. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377565#377565 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "glad2fly" <jamie(at)drjordan.us>
Date: Jul 10, 2012
wow, interesting response Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377900#377900 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Date: Jul 10, 2012
Perhaps I can answer some of your questions, since I have built a Pietenpol and am now building an RV-10. There are some interesting comparisons between the two: Item Pietenpol RV-10 Hours to Build 2500 2500 New Skills to learn >10 1 (riveting) Cruise Speed 65 mph 200 mph # of seats 2 4 Cost to Build $15,000 $135,000 (typ) Cost to Fly $20/hr $85/hr Number of Everybody Nobody people who will come out on the ramp to see your new plane In short, I thoroughly enjoyed the build process with my Pietenpol. I learned a huge number of new skills (including wood-working, welding, metal-cutting, jig-building, rigging, fabric covering, painting, riveting, sheet-metal work, wiring, engine building, aircraft assembly, etc). The RV-10 on the other hand I find tedious. The main skill required is riveting (there are over 25,000 rivets in an RV-10, and each requires clecoing, match-drilling, unclecoing, deburring, dimpling (if for a flush rivet), reclecoing and finally either squeezing or bucking the rivet). All the fun part of the job is done for you by the factory. You get to do the tedious grunt work of assembly. Oh, and there's the cost. Van's touts an "expected build price" of about $75,000 for an RV-10, but so far I don't know of a single one that has been built for less than $125,000. My goal is to be the first to build one for under $100K. I will enjoy travelling in the RV-10 whenever I get it finished, but it will never have my heart like my Pietenpol does. Don't get me wrong - RV's are great airplanes. I have an RV-4 and used it this weekend for my wife and me to fly up near Buffalo NY, where we visited with Rob Busch (an excellent Pietenpol builder) and toured Niagara Falls. Now I'm back home in Virginia after only 2.5 hours of flying time - you can't do that in a Pietenpol. If I go to Brodhead this year, it will be in the RV-4 because I can make the trip in 4 hours, vs 14 hours and an overnight stay in a hotel in the Pietenpol. But it won't be anywhere near as much fun. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of glad2fly Sent: Monday, July 09, 2012 10:39 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread? My name is Jamie and that's my nickname for James (clears up the possible gender ?). I live in the Denver area (Westminster but moving to Erie). I was thinking about building an RV-10 to fly the family around but the lower cost Pietenpol looks interesting. As a matter of fact the plane looks downright luscious. I'm still going to do the RV-10 but wait until my bank account has a couple more zeros following. I'd like to spend a lot of time on a hobby but a lot of time I don't have....for a Sunday flyer. Maybe I should ask the first person who responded here, tool, where that $6k plane is and then procede. Having a classic plane to putz around in will be awesome but putting in 2000 hours for it...there's too many projects that will come between me and that. Where's the thread for those needing to back out of their 2000 hr project so I can swoop in and take over their baby? If I could drive 15 hrs this weekend to WI I would but that would mean 15 hrs on the way back. I'd like to go. Is there anyone that is flying and needs company? Jamie Bill Church wrote: > Hello nameless question-poster, > > An entrepreneur DID create kits of parts to build entire Pietenpol aircraft, but to order one of those kits, you'll first need to get yourself a working time machine. The kits were sold by a fellow named Bernard Pietenpol, about 75 years ago. > The only real fast track to getting airborne in a Piet is to buy yourself a flying one, or buy someone's nearly completed project. Otherwise, it's going to require about 2000 hours of build time. You don't need to be a master woodworker, but you do need to have some basic woodworking skills and tools - it is a wooden plane, after all. You will also need to have (or learn) metalworking skills, since there are a considerable number of metal parts on this "all wood" aircraft. You will also need to learn how to weld, or learn how to pay someone to do your welding for you. > The Pietenpol is one of the least expensive "real" aircraft you can build. But that's because the hours of work that go into building one are never entered into the equation. If you keep your hourly "wage" down around one dollar per hour, you can probably make money building and selling parts. > In short... there are no short cuts. If your main goal is to get into the air quickly, the Pietenpol probably isn't the right choice for a project. If, on the other hand, your goal is to build an aircraft with your bare hands (and a few power tools), and to be able to say "I built every part of this machine myself", and learn numerous skills along the way, then this is the plane to build. > > Bill C. > > > Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377831#377831 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "glad2fly" <jamie(at)drjordan.us>
Date: Jul 10, 2012
Jack, thanks for that comparison. I did the control surface practice kit for the RV and liked doing the rivets. And I've looked at the riveting needed on them. It is pretty significant. As far as what attracts other people when the RV-10 wing doors are open I think it gets some looks but otherwise it's not exactly eye-popping. I guess that's why I like the Pietenpol and the history behind it. What do you think about building more than one at the same time? Or maybe just cut the pieces and then sell that as a ready to fasten kit. Seems like there's someone out there (besides me) looking for a "quick build." Jamie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377944#377944 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Piet Wood Kit for Sale
From: "Dgaul9463979" <Jeff.Gaulden(at)ryancentral.com>
Date: Jul 10, 2012
Ryan, that is correct, dimensional spruce. Everything is uncut and basically still in the box. I didn't get far into the project. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377960#377960 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "l.morlock" <l.morlock(at)att.net>
Subject: Re: Straight Axle Stops
Date: Jul 10, 2012
Nope. I used to have a T-Hangar at North Vernon, but now based at Columbus, IN airport (BAK), as it is only a half mile from my home. North Vernon is still an option for my Piet, as it has a grass strip and T-Hangers are readily available, but with no doors and 15 miles away. I'm hoping to find something at BAK. Larry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net> Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2012 1:32 PM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Straight Axle Stops > > > Larry, > > I thought you had a hangar at the North Vernon airport? > > Jack Phillips > NX899JP > Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of l.morlock > Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2012 10:55 AM > To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Straight Axle Stops > > Thanks for the input. Glad to hear from both Tools and Douwe that they > have > used this method successfully. I think I will go ahead with that set-up. > > Earl: I guess my picture was a bit misleading. That is excess brake > cable > that appears to be going to the front gear strut. The cable that will > tether the brake caliper isn't installed yet, but will go to the rear gear > strut. > > Tools: While it is true it will stop the caliper bracket from rotating, > the > bracket is attached to the axle, so it will also stop the axle from > rotating. Do you have a picture of your set-up? > > Douwe: My caliper support bracket is not what I would call heavy duty, > but > as you can see from the picture, my brake rotors are fairly thick, so I > think this also would help withstand the side load. I didn't think of the > fact that the cable will want to rotate the axle a bit when it goes up and > down. What allowance would I have to make for this in the cable routing? > > As usual, I'm making slow but steady progress on my Piet. I'm finishing > up > the coaming at the moment. Next job is to find a place for the Piet on an > airport, as I'm still in the pole barn off-airport (see attached foto). > > Larry > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com> > To: > Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2012 8:32 PM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Straight Axle Stops > > >> >> Well, the setup you're mentioning really stops the caliper bracket from >> rotating, not the axle, right? >> >> If so, that's the setup mine has, and it works just fine. I don't see >> any > >> noticable side force and havn't had the axle move back and forth at all. >> >> My cables hook to the gear plates on the outside, keeping it as inline as >> possible. Looks like it runs to the inside, if it's the cable and not a >> brake line, in the pic. >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377565#377565 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Date: Jul 11, 2012
Actually, building two at the same time would make sense, if there were a serious market for a Pietenpol. The guy that got me into the EAA back in the early 70's was building two Pitts Specials. He sold one and made enough on it to pay for both. You couldn't do that with a Pietenpol. I've got $15,000 and 8 years work in mine, and if I sold it I might be able to get $15,000 for it, but I doubt it. In building mine, I probably made enough parts (particularly the metal fittings) for 1-1/2 Piets. It would have been pretty easy to just make twice as many parts since you are already up on the learning curve. But don't do it thinking there's a market for the parts, or the airplane. The best way is probably to get a bunch of friends together and build several Pietenpols simultaneously, as the "Big Piet" builders in Georgia did a few years ago. A kit has never been popular for Pietenpols since no two Pietenpols are the same. People modify them to suit their purposes, and a kit doesn't lend itself to such activity. Just quit worrying about it and start building. In the time you've spent online discussing various kit options you could have had your rib jig built and a couple of ribs produced. Buy the Tony Bingelis books, the EAA Wood Aircraft Construction book, the EAA Aircraft Welding book and then start making sawdust. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of glad2fly Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2012 6:13 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread? Jack, thanks for that comparison. I did the control surface practice kit for the RV and liked doing the rivets. And I've looked at the riveting needed on them. It is pretty significant. As far as what attracts other people when the RV-10 wing doors are open I think it gets some looks but otherwise it's not exactly eye-popping. I guess that's why I like the Pietenpol and the history behind it. What do you think about building more than one at the same time? Or maybe just cut the pieces and then sell that as a ready to fasten kit. Seems like there's someone out there (besides me) looking for a "quick build." Jamie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377944#377944 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Max Hegler <maxhegler(at)msn.com>
Subject: Forecast for next Thursday in Brodhead
Date: Jul 11, 2012
Looking at the Brodhead forecast for 19 through 22 July shows a high of 90 with thunderstorms on 19 July and cooler after that. Evening temps are in t he upper 60's. See you guys there! Max From: gboothe5(at)comcast.net Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Forecast for next Thursday in Brodhead Date: Tue=2C 10 Jul 2012 21:16:07 -0700 Good progress report=2C Rick! See you at Brodhead! Gary BootheNX308MBDo not archive From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-piet enpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Sent: Tuesday=2C July 10=2C 2012 8:48 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Forecast for next Thursday in Brodhead Since I have been struggling with 105 degree plus temps in the hangar as I worked on rib stitching=2C sleeping in a tent at Brodhead in the same weather is l osing some of its appeal. Does anyone have telephone numbers for some of th e local motels? As a progress report=2C I probably had one of my last Tech Counselor inspections tonight. I have all my control surfaces covered=2C al l the tail feathers and the left wing. Tomorrow I start putting fabric on t he right wing. I'm also close to my first engine start. Once that is done =2C then it's time for covering the fuselage=2C then it's time for paint. I t's possible I could be ready for first flight by October but early spring is more realistic. Rick SchreiberNX478RSValparaiso=2C IN Sent from my iPad On Jul 10=2C 2012=2C at 11:11 AM=2C "Cuy=2C Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage P artners=2C LLC]" wrote:Bring your ice cubes! Do no t archive http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "glad2fly" <jamie(at)drjordan.us>
Date: Jul 11, 2012
rib kit....here's what I see on aircraftspruce.com...http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/kitspages/pientenpolaircamper.php no rib kit listed. And it looks like the kits are mainly capstrips. Even though builders like to customize there seem to be some parts that are standard. I don't know what else to buy but capstrips I guess. If there was a spruce stock for the blankety blank kit I'd understand a little better. I know I need to buy the plans and I might be making this more difficult than it needs to be but geez, like a lot of things, the darn wheel has to be reinvented...in terms of what steps to take. If anyone has to respond to this comment other than agree with me it's because they already got it figured out and think I'm whining about it. And why does someone put in 2500 hrs and spends $15K to only have a plane worth $15K? That's ridiculous. Maybe people don't want Pietenpols. I can't understand that because it's a darn cool plane. It's pretty clear than building it gives a person a lot of satisfaction but looking at the cost of it....it makes more sense to buy someone elses. Jamie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378013#378013 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: Gerry Holland <gholland@content-stream.co.uk>
Date: Jul 11, 2012
Jamie I'm confused at your various rationale. Should you actually be thinking of building a Piet and any kit from scratch? Probably not. The wheel doesn't need re-inventing as the Pietenpol aircraft objective is to build an aircraft from scratch as per the design plans and then fly. YOU can change things if you want but it wont be as per plans but that is the beauty of this pastime. Make an Airplane that appeals to you and live with it. Again I'm sorry to say I'm confused and that leads me to form an opinion that may or may not be correct but....you're whining and I don't know why or what about? And why does someone put in 2500 hrs and spends $15K to only have a plane worth $15K? That's ridiculous. If you are building to make a profit then you are in cloud cuckoo land! The journey for most of us that build is as important as the destination or value. It's pretty clear thant building it gives a person a lot of satisfaction but looking at the cost of it....it makes more sense to buy someone else's. In your case definitely. There are good kit or scratch built aircraft for sale all the time. Go for it. Gerry ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "glad2fly" <jamie(at)drjordan.us>
Date: Jul 11, 2012
Thanks Earl. I'll look for that thread and if I find it I'll post it here also. Jamie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378018#378018 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: MOVING DAY!!!
Date: Jul 11, 2012
Well, looks like Monday is the big moving day! The wings are already there, but on Monday we plan to move the rest over as she's pretty much done. We'll get the wings hung on Monday so it's ready for my return from Brodhead. Douwe ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Date: Jul 12, 2012
Jamie, Check out http://www.cpc-world.com. I have a material list on the web site that should help. Cheers Peter Wonthaggi Australia http://www.cpc-world.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of glad2fly Sent: Thursday, 12 July 2012 3:37 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread? Thanks Earl. I'll look for that thread and if I find it I'll post it here also. Jamie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378018#378018 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "glad2fly" <jamie(at)drjordan.us>
Date: Jul 11, 2012
Peter, your site is going to be incredibly useful! Don't take it down (I'm going to copy the site for my own use just in case). Thanks for that. Your Pietenpol was very classy looking. I'm nosy, how much did you sell it for if you can say....and if you can't, did you get any sweat equity from the sale? Your Zodiac looks like an RV. What was your inspiration for that plane? Thanks, Jamie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378032#378032 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: AMsafetyC(at)aol.com
Date: Jul 11, 2012
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
I went to the lumber yard, a real live lumber yard and pulled form the racks yellow poplar planks that were rough sawn mill cuts ranging from 1 1/2 to 2 inch thick 12 feet long and 6 to 8 inches wide. I had it planed on 3 sides and brought down to 5 quarter and 1" thick material. I fed those planks through my 10" table saw and from them I cut out my longerons, lateral and diagonal supports. Tail strips leading and trailing edges and the spars, not to mention a bunch of smaller pieces for jigs, hold downs and work pieces. I believe my first order was right around 70.00 dollars. Those 4 planks kept me busy for months building my Piet. John NX895JR reserved ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 11, 2012
glad2fly wrote: > Peter, your site is going to be incredibly useful! Don't take it down (I'm going to copy the site for my own use just in case). You would have probably been directed to several other "incredibly useful" sites or threads if you weren't dead set on locating the non-existent Pietenpol kit, or telling one of our more respected contributors how ridiculous he is. Someone told you along the way that it is about the journey... those of us with patience get that. Why does that make it worth it? Well, that is something that you will have to discover for yourself... but primarily its because you CAN'T buy this airplane in a box. All of them are hand made... some more than others. If you hang around long enough you'll figure out what that means. There are times where you might be able to farm out work... for a part, or a skill that you just don't posses, or perhaps not to the level necessary or desired, but for the most part, you will have to look at the big puzzle, figure out a process that makes sense, choose a part and start making your materials look like the picture. It is fun, challenging, frustrating, rewarding, maddening, exhilarating and a variety of other emotions as the journey progresses. The other day I got to sit back and look at an assembly that I had struggled with on and off for months... to me, it finally looked fabulous... very rewarding. I sat and drank a couple of beers and just looked at it from all angles... yep, well worth all the frustration when you finally figure something out that has stumped you for a long time. Those are the little rewards that make it all worth while, and from what I hear there are many more rewards that I can't even imagine... I'm working my way there. In addition to that, the people in this group are fantastic. You haven't just stumbled onto a group of simple minded wooden airplane builders... there are people of all walks here... people who have built several airplanes... some highly educated... but for all of us, this process is an educational experience. We are all teachers and students. It really is a lot of fun. We all share the same goal... a desire to fly our own handcrafted machine. When that actually happens isn't quite as important as you might think. If you choose to set out on that journey, all of the comments in this thread will start to make sense. It wasn't that long ago that I started my project... but I can tell you that a nearly unnoticeable change occurred where I just settled in and accepted that this was going to take a while, and that I better just enjoy it while I can. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378042#378042 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "cjborsuk" <cjborsuk(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 11, 2012
Jamie, There is some great advice that has come your way. Take it to heart. No offense, but it does not sound like a Pietenpol is your plane. You need to look at the full kits. The RV12 might be a good fit. Mark - great points. Look forward to sharing a cold one together in Brodhead. Chuck Raleigh NC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378054#378054 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Gene Rambo <generambo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Throwing in the towel!
Date: Jul 12, 2012
OK=2C Guys=2C as Jack and Matt have reported=2C I am officially throwing in the towel. Despite my best efforts=2C my Piet will not be making the trip this year. Will and I=2C however=2C will be there! I am attaching a few photos to show the progress. I am sending some of the wing rotating jig I built. I am ready to paint the wing. The other photos show the last test- fit of the sheet metal before paint. I put the first coat of color on the tail surfaces and ailerons today. Before we leave for Brodhead=2C I expect that the tail will all be installed and rigged=2C leaving only the wing an d sheet metal to paint. The wheels I am using (not in the photo) are fabri c covered and being painted with the tail. Since these photos=2C I have fi nished plumbing the engine=2C and it is ready to run but for the exhaust st acks. I gave it my best effort!! See you all next week!! Gene ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka(at)bigpond.net.au>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Date: Jul 12, 2012
Jamie, As mentioned in previous emails on the list, there was no sweat equity. The sale price didn't even cover the build costs. I did end up with a load of experience in different aspects of wooden airplane construction and a whole bunch of new friends on this list. I built and fly the Zodiac because my local airport has a lot of "turn the key and fly" pilots. With the Piet I had to get changed in some warm gear, wait for some good weather and go fly. Not quite so convenient. My wife is not a particularly good passenger but she did fly with me in the Piet, once. There have been many more flights in the Zodiac. The Zodiac is a nice plane and I enjoyed building it but it doesn't have what a Piet has, character! I had often thought of building another Piet and when the opportunity arose to buy a damaged Piet at a good price, I jumped at it. It will be refurbished /repaired with (I hope) the same love and care as the original builder bestowed upon it. Now if the shipping company would just cooperate!!!!!!!!! Cheers Peter Wonthaggi Australia http://www.cpc-world.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of glad2fly Sent: Thursday, 12 July 2012 7:43 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread? Peter, your site is going to be incredibly useful! Don't take it down (I'm going to copy the site for my own use just in case). Thanks for that. Your Pietenpol was very classy looking. I'm nosy, how much did you sell it for if you can say....and if you can't, did you get any sweat equity from the sale? Your Zodiac looks like an RV. What was your inspiration for that plane? Thanks, Jamie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378032#378032 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Throwing in the towel!
Date: Jul 12, 2012
This Pietenpol is going to become the new standard for the purists. Even the cables have wrapped and soldered ends - no nicopress fittings or swagings for Gene! And all the hardware is cad-plated, but with the silver cadmium plating as was done in the 1930's, not the gold colored stuff we have now. I have no idea where Gene had to go to find the hardware. Absolutely beautiful job, Gene. I will be proud to fly alongside such a ship next year on the way to Brodhead. Hope to see you there next week. I won't know until Wednesday whether I'm coming or not, but I do know that if I come, it won't be by Pietenpol. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene Rambo Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2012 12:07 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Throwing in the towel! OK, Guys, as Jack and Matt have reported, I am officially throwing in the towel. Despite my best efforts, my Piet will not be making the trip this year. Will and I, however, will be there! I am attaching a few photos to show the progress. I am sending some of the wing rotating jig I built. I am ready to paint the wing. The other photos show the last test-fit of the sheet metal before paint. I put the first coat of color on the tail surfaces and ailerons today. Before we leave for Brodhead, I expect that the tail will all be installed and rigged, leaving only the wing and sheet metal to paint. The wheels I am using (not in the photo) are fabric covered and being painted with the tail. Since these photos, I have finished plumbing the engine, and it is ready to run but for the exhaust stacks. I gave it my best effort!! See you all next week!! Gene ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Old Brodhead Pictures
From: "DaveG601XL" <david.m.gallagher(at)ge.com>
Date: Jul 12, 2012
Here is another something to get us into the Brodhead state of mind. I was going through some of my old photo albums and pulled out some pictures I took there in 1983. This was the year after my father bought a partially completed GN-1 Aircamper project so we drove up to Brodhead for the day. I apologize for the quality. Since my scanner is no longer working I used a digital camera to take pictures of the pictures. Maybe someone can shed some light on the aircraft in the pictures. - The under-construction picture with the radial engine was one that really caught my eye. - As I recall, the shot of the Corvair engine being hand propped has a crowd behind it because it was not starting. There was plenty of suggestions on how to get it started. I believe they did eventually get it running. - I looked up the FAA registry on N3265 in the taxiing shot and it was exported to England in 1990. See you all there next week, -------- David Gallagher Zodiac 601 XL-B: flying, 200+ hours now Next project under construction: Aircamper Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378078#378078 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/brodhead1983_04_929.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/brodhead1983_03_730.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/brodhead1983_02_141.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/brodhead1983_01_996.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2012
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
Jamie, welcome to the Pietenpol list. - As already mentioned, the Pietenpol does not come in kit form, it is bu ilt from plans purchased from the Pietenpol family.- I believe there are about 14-16 pages of plans depending on if you build the three piece wing a nd straight axle landing gear.- The plans include provisions to install C ub type landing gear as well as model A Ford, Corvair or Continental engine s. Places like Aircraft Spruce sell wood kits...packages of wood already cut t o build the various parts of the plane...but not everything is included in these kits and you still need to cut the pieces to the proper length to fit .- Plywood kits need to be cut to shape. This is as close to a full plane kit as you will find. You will also need to build your own jigs for duplic ating the wing ribs, fuselage, engine mount, etc. There are those who offer metal pieces and parts custom made for you, but I have not used such parts and can't attest to the quality and cost. There is no detailed model that I am aware of to build that would simulate building the real plane. The plane truly is built- from scratch...as said before...some more then others, and they are all unique, works of art. I am sure you will figure out what is right for you and if you choose to pr oceeded with the Pietenpol, don't be shy to ask questions and seek help fro m this list. Michael Perez =0APietenpol HINT Videos =0AKaretaker Aero =0Awww.karetakeraero.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 12, 2012
Hey Jamie, There are lots of Piet models out there too, however, I wouldn't consider any of those useful for insight into building a piet. The design IS particularly well suited for duplicating in 1/3 or 1/4 scale, which would give you an idea of how one goes together. Years ago I saw a 1/4 scale model a ford on ebay... THAT would be cool! >From what I gather about your point of view, finding a partial complete is probably a good way for you to go. While ALL homebuilts have uniqueness, there are a couple of aspects about the Piet which are more substantial than most other designs. Primarily the engine, fuse length and gear. I'd highly recommend Brodhead or just finding some other venue with examples of these differences so you can determine how close to the configuration you desire, the project would be, which will help you determine it's worth to you. I'll dig around and see if I can find the contact info the Piet I referred to earlier. I'd have bought it, but timing was bad. I bought a flying Piet last year as well (hope to have it at brodhead) which was EXACTLY the configuration I wanted save the engine (though since I've decided it's definitely the engine I want, an A-65). I think it was a great way to go, my son (now 18yrs) and I are really having the time of our lives with the plane, and it's firmly cementing in my mind, the configuration of the plane I am building. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378093#378093 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "skipgadd(at)earthlink.net" <skipgadd(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Old Brodhead Pictures
Date: Jul 12, 2012
Very cool pictures Dave, The 929 picture is the Ted Davis, Dick Weeden and Francis Saunders LaBlond Piet. I believe it is still on the field with an A model. Jack Cox wrote an article in Sport Aviation April 1990 including this Piet. The 730 picture is Duane Tulba's Piet. That is his brother in law Tim Shefjak with the prop. That Corvair with blower fan could be hard to start. Duane brought it to Brodhead for over 10 years, but don't think it has flown in a while. Duane and Tim still come to Brodhead. The 996 picture is Verl Deal's Corvair Piet, it came to Brodhead a lot of years and Verl still comes. As of last year he was still working on another Corvair Piet for his son in law, good guy. Skip > [Original Message] > From: DaveG601XL <david.m.gallagher(at)ge.com> > To: > Date: 7/12/2012 8:45:07 AM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Old Brodhead Pictures > > > Here is another something to get us into the Brodhead state of mind. I was going through some of my old photo albums and pulled out some pictures I took there in 1983. This was the year after my father bought a partially completed GN-1 Aircamper project so we drove up to Brodhead for the day. I apologize for the quality. Since my scanner is no longer working I used a digital camera to take pictures of the pictures. > > Maybe someone can shed some light on the aircraft in the pictures. > - The under-construction picture with the radial engine was one that really caught my eye. > - As I recall, the shot of the Corvair engine being hand propped has a crowd behind it because it was not starting. There was plenty of suggestions on how to get it started. I believe they did eventually get it running. > - I looked up the FAA registry on N3265 in the taxiing shot and it was exported to England in 1990. > > See you all there next week, > > -------- > David Gallagher > Zodiac 601 XL-B: flying, 200+ hours now > Next project under construction: Aircamper > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378078#378078 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/brodhead1983_04_929.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/brodhead1983_03_730.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/brodhead1983_02_141.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/brodhead1983_01_996.jpg > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: question for the radio geeks
From: "scudrun" <jstreet(at)uwaterloo.ca>
Date: Jul 12, 2012
I got to agree with K5YAC here. I have spent as much time building radio transcievers and antennas as people spend building Pietenpols. Yes I'm that radio geek someone was looking for. If the antenna feedpoint has the same impedance as the feed line then the length of the feedline is only going to affect loss and has nothing to do with tuning. However in the real world antennas even if they are perfectly tuned, change their tune when something comes near them, and it all gets complicated. What people need is something that is simple and that works reasonably well and is easy to install. I am about to add a radio to my Piet. What I will do is use a piece of RG-58 coax long enough to run from the radio location to an area behind the seat that I can reach through inspection ports with the covering on the aircraft. I'll remove 24" of the shield being careful not to damage the insulation on the center conductor and leave a bit of the shield exposed to attach the ground radials. That's about 1/4 wave at 121.5 MHz. I'll solder four more 24" lengths of wire (say about 16 gauge) to the shield where I cut it and arrange to fan them out as evenly spaced as possible and as perpendicular as possible to the center conductor which is the antenna radiator. If I have to have bends in any of these wires I'll try to keep the bends as close to the ends of the wires as possible and run hem inline with the plane avoiding bending them in a direction that would be parallel to the antenna radiator. I'll arrange the antenna to be upside down with the radials extending in a horizontal plane and the radiator running straight down and as far away as possible from other conductors such as control cables, harness cables etc. The coax, I'll try to run straight away from the radiator in line with the plane of the radial wires of the ground plane until it is more than 2 feet (prefereably more than 4 feet) away from the antenna before it runs in any other direction. Based on lots of installations where I adhered to these princip! les the antenna with be awesome for these needs. BTW I would highly recommend against using a rubber duck antenna in combination with a headset. I've seen many problems with power from the antenna right beside the headset wires picking up radio frequency energy into the microphone line and playing havoc. Getting a proper external antenna mounted several feet away makes a world of difference to being heard as well as hearing. If the antenna is only a few feet away and you are still not being heard properly you could try putting some clip-on ferrite beads on your headset wires which can make a huge difference in improving your microphone audio in this situation. 72 (that's radio geek speak for softly saying best regards) Joe True and false. The feedline (be it coax or whatever feedline you prefer, although coax is standard), is not an active element. Yes, it must be of the proper impedance, and using the best type of coax for the given application is critical in proper transmission of signal, but length has nothing to do with tuning. This part of the conversation gets pretty deep as we start discussing dielectric materials, velocity factors, etc. To summarize, different frequencies travel through different dielectric materials at different rates (speeds)... therefore no one type of 50ohm coax is suitable for all applications... for example, I use LMR400 in my HF station. If I were wanting to squeeze every bit of signal out of my handheld air band transceiver I'd probably use LMR240 instead of RG-58, but at the lengths we are talking about the losses are negligible. That is really what we are talking about when it comes to feedlines, losses, not tuning. For example, the attenuation of a 100' length of RG-58 at 150MHz is ~6.2dB... the same length of LMR240 is only 3.0dB, or in radio talk, an entire s-unit! Ok, I understand, we aren't running 100', we are running closer to 10', which reduces those values by a factor of 10, or .62dB and .3dB of loss respectively. At that length we are talking about a difference of .32dB of signal loss between the two. Am I going to run out and get some LMR240 for that small of a boost in signal? Nope, I'll grab the readily available RG-58 and cut to whatever length I need... the shorter the better. Remember, length=attenuation=loss.[/quote] Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378096#378096 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2012
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Engine Work
Attached are a few more engine work pictures. I believe at this point I will cease engine work and start covering the fuselage. Michael Perez Pietenpol HINT Videos Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Engine Work
From: "Jack(at)textors.com" <jack(at)textors.com>
Date: Jul 12, 2012
Michael isn't it fun! Looks great! You will want string around the center st uds also. In my shop I keep the engine covered. You should too despite your spotless shop. Jack Textor Sent from my iPad On Jul 12, 2012, at 10:27 AM, Michael Perez wrote : > Attached are a few more engine work pictures. I believe at this point I wi ll cease engine work and start covering the fuselage. > > Michael Perez > Pietenpol HINT Videos > Karetaker Aero > www.karetakeraero.com > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2012
Subject: Re: question for the radio geeks
From: Ken Bickers <bickers.ken(at)gmail.com>
Joe, thanks for this information. It is timely, at least for me. Would it be possible to post a simple drawing showing what you intend to do in terms of your installation? It wouldn't need to be to scale, just something that gives a visual orientation. Thanks, Ken On Thu, Jul 12, 2012 at 8:50 AM, scudrun wrote: > > I got to agree with K5YAC here. I have spent as much time building radio transcievers and antennas as people spend building Pietenpols. Yes I'm that radio geek someone was looking for. If the antenna feedpoint has the same impedance as the feed line then the length of the feedline is only going to affect loss and has nothing to do with tuning. However in the real world antennas even if they are perfectly tuned, change their tune when something comes near them, and it all gets complicated. What people need is something that is simple and that works reasonably well and is easy to install. I am about to add a radio to my Piet. What I will do is use a piece of RG-58 coax long enough to run from the radio location to an area behind the seat that I can reach through inspection ports with the covering on the aircraft. I'll remove 24" of the shield being careful not to damage the insulation on the center conductor and leave a bit of the shield exposed to attach the ground radia! > ls. That's about 1/4 wave at 121.5 MHz. I'll solder four more 24" lengths of wire (say about 16 gauge) to the shield where I cut it and arrange to fan them out as evenly spaced as possible and as perpendicular as possible to the center conductor which is the antenna radiator. If I have to have bends in any of these wires I'll try to keep the bends as close to the ends of the wires as possible and run hem inline with the plane avoiding bending them in a direction that would be parallel to the antenna radiator. I'll arrange the antenna to be upside down with the radials extending in a horizontal plane and the radiator running straight down and as far away as possible from other conductors such as control cables, harness cables etc. The coax, I'll try to run straight away from the radiator in line with the plane of the radial wires of the ground plane until it is more than 2 feet (prefereably more than 4 feet) away from the antenna before it runs in any other direction. B! > ased on lots of installations where I adhered to these princip! > les the > > antenna with be awesome for these needs. > > BTW I would highly recommend against using a rubber duck antenna in combination with a headset. I've seen many problems with power from the antenna right beside the headset wires picking up radio frequency energy into the microphone line and playing havoc. Getting a proper external antenna mounted several feet away makes a world of difference to being heard as well as hearing. If the antenna is only a few feet away and you are still not being heard properly you could try putting some clip-on ferrite beads on your headset wires which can make a huge difference in improving your microphone audio in this situation. > > 72 (that's radio geek speak for softly saying best regards) > > Joe > > > True and false. The feedline (be it coax or whatever feedline you prefer, although coax is standard), is not an active element. Yes, it must be of the proper impedance, and using the best type of coax for the given application is critical in proper transmission of signal, but length has nothing to do with tuning. This part of the conversation gets pretty deep as we start discussing dielectric materials, velocity factors, etc. To summarize, different frequencies travel through different dielectric materials at different rates (speeds)... therefore no one type of 50ohm coax is suitable for all applications... for example, I use LMR400 in my HF station. If I were wanting to squeeze every bit of signal out of my handheld air band transceiver I'd probably use LMR240 instead of RG-58, but at the lengths we are talking about the losses are negligible. That is really what we are talking about when it comes to feedlines, losses, not tuning. For example, the attenuation of a 10! > 0' length of RG-58 at 150MHz is ~6.2dB... the same length of LMR240 is only 3.0dB, or in radio talk, an entire s-unit! Ok, I understand, we aren't running 100', we are running closer to 10', which reduces those values by a factor of 10, or .62dB and .3dB of loss respectively. At that length we are talking about a difference of .32dB of signal loss between the two. Am I going to run out and get some LMR240 for that small of a boost in signal? Nope, I'll grab the readily available RG-58 and cut to whatever length I need... the shorter the better. Remember, length=attenuation=loss.[/quote] > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378096#378096 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2012
From: Michael Perez <speedbrake(at)sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Engine Work
It IS fun!- There is string around those studs, hard to see in the small picture perhaps. Whenever the engines are not being worked on/photographed, they are covered .-- Happy to hear you appreciate a clean shop! Michael Perez =0APietenpol HINT Videos =0AKaretaker Aero =0Awww.karetakeraero.com =0A ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "glad2fly" <jamie(at)drjordan.us>
Date: Jul 12, 2012
I just visited a Piet builder this morning (Ken) who very graciously spent almost 2 hours showing me his incredible Piet. I'm astounded at the effort that goes into building this plane. I don't know what it is but there's something about building it yourself that interests me. It's like this guy that built (is building) Bishop's Castle. A one man show I had to go see myself. I want to put my stamp on something like this. Figuring out what that long-term effort/passion will be isn't easy. I'm planning my future out loud here. The craftiness of building the Piet is starting to sink in. Learning how to read the 1930's plans kinda concerns me but I suppose everyone gets over the interpretation and figures it out. And after all, there's just a bunch of pieces of wood that can be remade if needed. I know the plans call for a wood frame but would there be any significant issues using a combination of aluminum and wood? Do those 2 materials have any history being used well in a handcrafted plane? I know this would take the plane out of the traditional plans and not accepted as a Pietenpol. I'm just asking questions here and to those that think that would be sacrilegious I understand. Jamie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378121#378121 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Corvair core
From: "Pilot78" <brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com>
Date: Jul 12, 2012
I got my Corvair engine back to the hangar a few weeks ago. It's a running engine straight out of the 65' with all the correct serial numbers listed in the W.W. rebuild manual. I felt it was a decent price at $150, the only kicker is I had to purchase the 2 engines the guy had to get that price. So if anyone needs a good core out here on the West coast I have an extra. Contact me off list if interested or know someone who is. Brian SLC-UT Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378126#378126 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img02516_20120629_1543_122.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2012
From: Lawrence Williams <lnawms(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Ramping up for Brodhead
Just finished washing the Piet and will wax it tomorrow. (I know, I know, w hy bother when I fly behind a Ford). - -Not too sure if I'll polish the struts because they are a magnet to grim ey hands belonging to dumpy, 60-something guys holding forth to their buddi es about when they, "Had one just like this".Happens every year and I keep telling myself to just paint the darned things and be done with it....but I never do. - Flew for a while this a.m. just to make sure everything is still flying in close formation and nothing fell off. Guess that wraps up the preflight che cks! - Gotta douse the tent with h2o repellant, get-the citronella candles, put some clothes into a bag and be ready to leap off. - WX looks a little dicey in the forecast at the moment so I'll keep an eye o n it but assuming everything works as planned, I'll see you all in a week o r so. - Fly safe- - Larry (Top Curmudgeon) Williams NX899LW - ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: question for the radio geeks
From: "scudrun" <jstreet(at)uwaterloo.ca>
Date: Jul 12, 2012
Here is a link that has some diagrams. Just imagine the diagram on the right turned upside down. Also you don't need to use a connector to form the feed point of the antenna as shown there. You can just remove 1/4 wave length of shield from the cut end of the coax (24 inches) and use the center conductor with it's insulation still intact as your radiator (the red line). Solder the radial wires (blue) (also 24 inches) to the end of the shield where it is cut back and run them out to anchor points to form a plane. They can angle upwards in this case when the radiator is tensioned downwards to an anchor point on the fuselage. Run the radiator straight down and anchor it to a piece of the wooden frame. You can add an extender to the end of any of these wires if necessary by simply tying a piece of mason line to the wire and running it to a convenient point where you can drive a small wood screw. It is not critical that the radials form a perfect plane or cone, just go with what works and doesn't hang up on anything with the control system. Keep it light and simple. It is protected inside the fuselage and doesn't have to be super robust. Run the coax roughly paralleled to the blue ground plane wires until you are far from the radiator (several feet). Choose a coaxial cable that has the same type of connector on the end as your radio (usually a BNC for a handheld radio). Here is the link: http://273k.net/gsm/designing-and-building-a-gsm-antenna/monopole/ When I make mine I'll snap some pics along the way and post. Joe Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378131#378131 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2012
From: Michael Groah <dskogrover(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Airworthiness Certificate !!!
=0A=0A=0AToday we received our airworthiness certificate and my repairman's certificate for 414MV!- It feels good to have that part done.-- Now I just need to do that final part..... fly it!- The first flight should h appen in the next couple of weeks.- =0A=0AMike Groah=0ATulare CA ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2012
From: Jim Boyer <boyerjrb(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Airworthiness Certificate !!!
Mike and Vic, Congratulations!!!!!!!!!!! Your Piet really looks great and really glad to see you have it signed off. It is officially an airplane now. Take a video of your first flight and send it to us. Love the colors you picked too. Cheers, Jim B. =C2- ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Corvair core
From: Ben Charvet <bencharvet(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jul 12, 2012
I wouldnt sell the extra until you are sure you dont need it. I originally planned to use Corvair power and disassembled 3 cores to get enough usable parts . At least wait till you get your best one apart. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 12, 2012, at 5:23 PM, "Pilot78" <brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com> wrote: > > I got my Corvair engine back to the hangar a few weeks ago. It's a running engine straight out of the 65' with all the correct serial numbers listed in the W.W. rebuild manual. I felt it was a decent price at $150, the only kicker is I had to purchase the 2 engines the guy had to get that price. So if anyone needs a good core out here on the West coast I have an extra. Contact me off list if interested or know someone who is. > > Brian > SLC-UT > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378126#378126 > > > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/img02516_20120629_1543_122.jpg > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Airworthiness Certificate !!!
Date: Jul 12, 2012
Looks great, Mike! I must say, I like your paint scheme. Everything looks good except the prop turns the wrong way. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Groah Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2012 6:39 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Airworthiness Certificate !!! Today we received our airworthiness certificate and my repairman's certificate for 414MV! It feels good to have that part done. Now I just need to do that final part..... fly it! The first flight should happen in the next couple of weeks. Mike Groah Tulare CA ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Airworthiness Certificate !!!
From: Rick <lmforge(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Jul 12, 2012
Congratulations Mike and Vic. I bet the feeling is almost indescribable! Rick Schreiber Valparaiso IN Sent from my iPad On Jul 12, 2012, at 5:38 PM, Michael Groah wrote: > > > Today we received our airworthiness certificate and my repairman's certifi cate for 414MV! It feels good to have that part done. Now I just need to d o that final part..... fly it! The first flight should happen in the next c ouple of weeks. > > Mike Groah > Tulare CA > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol for dummies thread?
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 12, 2012
Tyler and I will be arriving Thursday, and we are planning to camp on the field too... this ought to be great. Have you prepared that safety spiel for the kiddos? -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378169#378169 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Airworthiness Certificate !!!
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 12, 2012
Looks great! Congratulations! -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378170#378170 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: VA flight next year and congrats...
Date: Jul 13, 2012
First off congrats to Vic and Mike, to Gene and everybody else finishing or nearing the finish line. WELL DONE!!! Jack and Gene, be sure you pick me up on your way north! Douwe Changed plans, we're moving to the hangar today. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Airworthiness Certificate !!!
From: "AircamperN11MS" <Scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org>
Date: Jul 13, 2012
Mike, It looks very nice. Perhaps I should fly up there to have a look at it. Let me know if that is possible for you. -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378182#378182 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2012
From: Hans van der Voort <nx15kv(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Airworthiness Certificate !!!
Congratulations now the exciting part starts=0A-=0AHave Fun=0A-=0AHans =0A-=0ANX 15KV=0A =0A=0A________________________________=0A From: Michael Groah =0ATo: "pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com" =0ASent: Thursday, July 12, 2012 5:38 PM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List: Airworthiness Certificate !!!=0A =0A=0A=0A=0A=0AToday we r eceived our airworthiness certificate and my repairman's certificate for 41 4MV!- It feels good to have that part done.-- Now I just need to do t hat final part..... fly it!- The first flight should happen in the next c ouple of weeks.- =0A=0AMike Groah=0ATulare CA ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Brat Fest 2012
From: "coxwelljon" <coxwelljon(at)frontiernet.net>
Date: Jul 13, 2012
Jack, Leaving Remsen NY on Wed. Hope to show my CO grandson Niagara Falls and make Brodhead by Thur. evening. Hope to see you on Friday. My grandson is not an airplane enthusiast yet but I am working on him. Jon Coxwell -------- Jon Coxwell GN-1 Builder Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378187#378187 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Model A crankshafts
From: "coxwelljon" <coxwelljon(at)frontiernet.net>
Date: Jul 13, 2012
A friend was cleaning out her barn and said she found a couple of Model A crank shafts. I have not seen them so I cannot speak to condition, but I suppose they are rusty. I am using a corvair so not too familiar with the what Ford parts are reusable. If anyone may be interested, contact me off line. -------- Jon Coxwell GN-1 Builder Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378188#378188 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Ride available from Chatt TN to Brodhead WI
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 13, 2012
Leaving Chatt TN headed to Brodhead on 18 Jul, arriving sometime on Thurs. 33' motorhome, currently may even NEED a driver, one other pax, so plenty of space, pickup on the way is fine (still need to finalize the route, it's following the plane). Headed from Brodhead to Oshkosh on Sun. Mike Danford, 423 580 1383 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378198#378198 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Airworthiness Certificate !!!
From: "AircamperN11MS" <Scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org>
Date: Jul 13, 2012
Hi Vic, Perhaps I can fly up this weekend. Porterville is only about 1.7 hour flight for me. Here is my contact info. Scott Liefeld Hm: 661-718-1155 Cell: 611-400-1876 Home email: pietman(at)qnet.com -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378201#378201 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Airworthiness Certificate !!!
From: "AircamperN11MS" <Scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org>
Date: Jul 13, 2012
I like Sat. Sunday would be ok if it were better for you. Either way, it's going to be hot. I would leave early in the morning. I don't think it gets foggy in the valley this time of the year. -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378206#378206 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Safetying Worm Drive Hose Clamps
From: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
Date: Jul 13, 2012
Just got off the phone with the FAA inspector, discussing my up-coming inspection. He warned that one of his cramps is un-safetied worm drive hose clamps. Anyone know a good method of safetying these? Gary from Cool Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Safetying Worm Drive Hose Clamps
From: Matthew <matthew.vandervort(at)gmail.com>
Date: Jul 13, 2012
Throu the slot and around the body, going under the exposed part of the screw. Does that make sense? I can try and get a picture when I get home if you'd like. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 13, 2012, at 4:01 PM, gboothe5(at)comcast.net wrote: > > Just got off the phone with the FAA inspector, discussing my up-coming inspection. He warned that one of his cramps is un-safetied worm drive hose clamps. Anyone know a good method of safetying these? > > Gary from Cool > Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Safetying Worm Drive Hose Clamps
Date: Jul 13, 2012
He must have a cow any time he flies in a Cub. Every A65 Continental has 16 worm drive hose clamps holding the pushrod tubes in place, and I've never seen a safety on any of them. Worm gear drives don't tend to move with vibration. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of gboothe5(at)comcast.net Sent: Friday, July 13, 2012 4:01 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Safetying Worm Drive Hose Clamps Just got off the phone with the FAA inspector, discussing my up-coming inspection. He warned that one of his cramps is un-safetied worm drive hose clamps. Anyone know a good method of safetying these? Gary from Cool Sent on the SprintR Now Network from my BlackBerryR ________________________________________________________________________________
From: brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com
Subject: Powder coating question
Date: Jul 13, 2012
Group, A friend of mine wants to give me a warming oven she used to use in her catering business. I thought about using it for powder coating, it's large almost 3ft deep, industrial, stainless steel and on casters. The only problem I think is that the oven only goes to 350 degrees. What is the temp range that most have used for powder coating? I assume powder manufactures may have their own cure temps, just curious to what the range of temps might be. Brian <> <> Brian Jardine L-3 Communications Operations Project Engineer 640 North 2200 West P.O.Box 16850 Salt Lake City, UT 84116 L <> <> 801-594-3482 801-882-0213 BB brian.e.jardine@L-3com.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Safetying Worm Drive Hose Clamps
From: "DaveG601XL" <david.m.gallagher(at)ge.com>
Date: Jul 13, 2012
I agree with Jack, but here is a link that might help to make your inspector happy and provide you with some peace of mind: http://avidflyer.wikia.com/wiki/Safety_Wire_Those_Worm_Drive_Clamps -------- David Gallagher Zodiac 601 XL-B: flying, 220+ hours now Next project under construction: Finish my father's Aircamper Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378227#378227 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Safetying Worm Drive Hose Clamps
From: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
Date: Jul 13, 2012
Thanks, Dave! Someday soon I'll be an avid flyer, but not an Avid flyer... This inspector came highly recommended by two builders who recently had airworthiness inspections done by him. They said his counterparts were too, "anal"! He did say that he's been doing this for 40 years, now, but still runs into new stuff that affects safety. His main request is that guys like you & I will carry the message out into the world...a reasonable and caring request! Gary ------Original Message------ From: DaveG601XL Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com ReplyTo: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Safetying Worm Drive Hose Clamps Sent: Jul 13, 2012 1:28 PM I agree with Jack, but here is a link that might help to make your inspector happy and provide you with some peace of mind: http://avidflyer.wikia.com/wiki/Safety_Wire_Those_Worm_Drive_Clamps -------- David Gallagher Zodiac 601 XL-B: flying, 220+ hours now Next project under construction: Finish my father's Aircamper Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378227#378227 Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Prop trade.
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 13, 2012
Sensenich wood 72x42 (great shape, 150 hrs since new) for a Sensenich metal 72x42 or 42x44. For use on a Piet, doesn't need to be certified. Or for ANYTHING that my engine will spin up to 2250 on the ground. It's a taper shaft Continental A-65. Mike Danford, 423 580 1383 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378244#378244 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Greg Cardinal" <gcardinal(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Powder coating question
Date: Jul 13, 2012
Powder coating questionEastwood powder coating requires 400 F. Lots of tech stuff on their website: http://www.eastwood.com/hotcoat-powder-coating.html?srccode=ga200100&gc lid=CKWursiGmLECFYcBQAodkzJCgw Greg Cardinal ----- Original Message ----- From: brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com Sent: Friday, July 13, 2012 3:25 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Powder coating question Group, A friend of mine wants to give me a warming oven she used to use in her catering business. I thought about using it for powder coating, it's large almost 3ft deep, industrial, stainless steel and on casters. The only problem I think is that the oven only goes to 350 degrees. What is the temp range that most have used for powder coating? I assume powder manufactures may have their own cure temps, just curious to what the range of temps might be. Brian Brian Jardine L-3 Communications Operations Project Engineer 640 North 2200 West P.O.Box 16850 Salt Lake City, UT 84116 L 801-594-3482 801-882-0213 BB brian.e.jardine@L-3com.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2012
From: Ben Charvet <bencharvet(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Prop trade.
I'm using a Sensenich 72X40 wood prop, and it will turn 2250 on the ground. What kind of RPM are you getting max power in level flight? Ben CHarvet A-65 Piet On 7/13/2012 6:37 PM, tools wrote: > > Sensenich wood 72x42 (great shape, 150 hrs since new) for a Sensenich metal 72x42 or 42x44. For use on a Piet, doesn't need to be certified. > > Or for ANYTHING that my engine will spin up to 2250 on the ground. It's a taper shaft Continental A-65. > > Mike Danford, 423 580 1383 > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378244#378244 > > -- Ben Charvet, PharmD Staff Pharmacist Parrish Medical center ________________________________________________________________________________
From: TOM MICHELLE BRANT <tmbrant(at)msn.com>
Subject: turnbuckes for sale
Date: Jul 13, 2012
I have (8) 1/16" turnbuckles with only the barrel and eye end (no fork end included). Think I have about $40 in to them - would like to get that out of them. If anyone's interested=2C lemme know. I'm in Minneapolis area. Tom B. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Prop trade.
From: "tools" <n0kkj(at)yahoo.com>
Date: Jul 13, 2012
1900 static, 2000 in flight during climb, maybe 2250 totally unloaded. AND just doesn't climb well. I borrowed a Sensenich metal 72x44 and got 2250 static. Climbed really well. Have a Macauley metal 71x45 on now and am getting 2000 static. A little better than the wood 72x42, but I REALLY liked the Sensenich. I reckon about any prop that duplicates the static rpm should perform about as well. I LOVE the look of the wood and like propping them better, but love climbing even more. It's one of my favorite things to do in a plane! Climbing just gets me all tingly! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378260#378260 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: TOM MICHELLE BRANT <tmbrant(at)msn.com>
Subject: corvair heads for sale
Date: Jul 13, 2012
Shoot - meant to put it in the same post as the turnbuckles... Anyway - I have a few corvair heads (cores) for sale if anyone wants them. Make me a reasonable offer - although shipping can be rough. If anyone's going to Brodhead next weekend from Minneapolis area maybe they could bring them down there if someone wants them. Tom B. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Mykitplane.com
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10(at)cox.net>
Date: Jul 14, 2012
Appears to be up today. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378283#378283 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Mykitplane.com
From: "John Francis" <Mrkringles(at)msn.com>
Date: Jul 14, 2012
Still not working for me. -------- John Francis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378284#378284 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Mike and Vic Groah visit
From: "AircamperN11MS" <Scott.liefeld(at)lacity.org>
Date: Jul 15, 2012
Hi Pieters, Mike and Vic have built a beautiful Piet. I very much approve of the colors they have chosen. The wood work is amazing. All they need to do now is fly it. We had a great visit and I am looking forward to flying with him in the near future. Congratulations to both Mike and Vic.. Outstanding Job, -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378342#378342 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0465_128.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0459_175.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0457_136.jpg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2012
From: shad bell <aviatorbell(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Can't make Brodhead
Well Guys and Gals, I won't be making Brodhead this year, I had some family commitments that came up that I need to be here for on Saturday.- I will miss your fellowship, and camaraderie.- I hope you all have a great time , take lots of pictures, videos.- Looks like a good forcast not in the 10 0's like last year.- - Fly safe, drive safe, Shad - - - - don't archive ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Gene Rambo <generambo(at)msn.com>
Subject: Travel Plans to Brodhead??
Date: Jul 16, 2012
Do any of you have plans that include travel to/from either Chicago or Milw aukee (or any other large city with an airport) Travel plans are getting m essed up and need transportation to/from Brodhead. Anyone?? Gene Rambo ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Travel Plans to Brodhead??
From: "chase143(at)aol.com" <chase143(at)aol.com>
Date: Jul 16, 2012
Hello Gene, Arriving MKE at 3:00, driving to Brodhead, we should have room. Feel free to contact me off line if still in need (chase143(at)aol.com). Steve -------- Steve www.mypiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378414#378414 ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Travel Plans to Brodhead??
From: Gene Rambo <generambo(at)msn.com>
Date: Jul 16, 2012
What day?? When going back to MKE?? On Jul 16, 2012, at 12:53 PM, "chase143(at)aol.com" wrote: > > Hello Gene, > Arriving MKE at 3:00, driving to Brodhead, we should have room. Feel free to contact me off line if still in need (chase143(at)aol.com). > Steve > > -------- > Steve > www.mypiet.com > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=378414#378414


June 21, 2012 - July 16, 2012

Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-lh