RV-Archive.digest.vol-bp
June 27, 1996 - July 11, 1996
815-758-4573 after 6pm central daylight time.
Apollo 360 integrated 3 inch moving map GPS
EBC102A ELT - the neat little yellow lightweight, easy to install,
handheld one
Cessna engine instrument cluster - very nice in an RV panel
Carburetor - Marvel Schebler
RT328T 720 channel nav com w/ indicator
RT328C 360 channel nav com w/ indicator
R546E ADF
Narco AT50A transponder w/ altitude encoder
Narco 824 Digital Nav
Cessna Audio Panel
VSI, Turn & Bank, vacuum pump, alternator
All will include trays, existing harnesses, etc.
Mitch Robbins
robbinm(at)chi.ntsb.gov
RV4 N13MR Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | OrndorffG(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: restrictor fittings |
You can file the rivet down to fit , or us a 1099 type rivet (1/8 shank with
3/32 head) and
it will work fine, at least it did on both of my planes.Keep in touch
...george orndorff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Osgood <Rick(at)ccc.henn.tec.mn.us> |
| Subject: | Re: Good Deals on Parts |
Robbins Mitch wrote:
>
> I just bought a well equipped, wind damaged, late model Cessna 172 to
> cannibalize the engine. I have an amazing number of extra parts, many of
> which I wish I had when I was building my RV-4, but can't use on my
> latest project. I'll list a few of the items, but I have most of the
> panel, airframe, interior, etc for sale. I'm just trying to recoup part
> of my investment (so I can buy more parts) and will beat any of the
> trade-a-plane dealer prices. This is my first announcement and I might
> run an add in trade-a-plane soon. If anyone is looking for a good deal
> on any parts that one might find on a C-172, let me know off list or call
> 815-758-4573 after 6pm central daylight time.
>
> Apollo 360 integrated 3 inch moving map GPS
> EBC102A ELT - the neat little yellow lightweight, easy to install,
> handheld one
> Cessna engine instrument cluster - very nice in an RV panel
> Carburetor - Marvel Schebler
> RT328T 720 channel nav com w/ indicator
> RT328C 360 channel nav com w/ indicator
> R546E ADF
> Narco AT50A transponder w/ altitude encoder
> Narco 824 Digital Nav
> Cessna Audio Panel
> VSI, Turn & Bank, vacuum pump, alternator
>
> All will include trays, existing harnesses, etc.
>
> Mitch Robbins
> robbinm(at)chi.ntsb.gov
> RV4 N13MR FlyingHi Mitch... How about a price on the ELT, 720 nav/comm, vsi
turn/bank
and vacum
Thanks
Rick Osgood
Always looking for a deal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris Ruble <cruble(at)cisco.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Safety Belt, was Mustang II |
This is required for compatition.
Chris
>
> I took a couple of hours in a Pitts S2 a few years ago out at Santa Paula. In
> addition to the five point harness, there was a light automotive type belt for
> safety backup. Not a bad idea, I think.
>
> Steve Johnson
> spjohnson(at)mmm.com
> RV-8, #80121, empennage on the way
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com (Peter B. Mortensen) |
| Subject: | Re: Good Deals on Parts |
You wrote:
>
>
>
>I just bought a well equipped, wind damaged, late model Cessna 172 to
>cannibalize the engine. I have an amazing number of extra parts, many
of
>which I wish I had when I was building my RV-4, but can't use on my
>latest project. I'll list a few of the items, but I have most of the
>panel, airframe, interior, etc for sale. I'm just trying to recoup
part
>of my investment (so I can buy more parts) and will beat any of the
>trade-a-plane dealer prices. This is my first announcement and I
might
>run an add in trade-a-plane soon. If anyone is looking for a good
deal
>on any parts that one might find on a C-172, let me know off list or
call
>815-758-4573 after 6pm central daylight time.
>
>Apollo 360 integrated 3 inch moving map GPS
>EBC102A ELT - the neat little yellow lightweight, easy to install,
>handheld one
>Cessna engine instrument cluster - very nice in an RV panel
>Carburetor - Marvel Schebler
>RT328T 720 channel nav com w/ indicator
>RT328C 360 channel nav com w/ indicator
>R546E ADF
>Narco AT50A transponder w/ altitude encoder
>Narco 824 Digital Nav
>Cessna Audio Panel
>VSI, Turn & Bank, vacuum pump, alternator
>
>All will include trays, existing harnesses, etc.
>
>Mitch Robbins
>robbinm(at)chi.ntsb.gov
>RV4 N13MR Flying
>
Mitch, I am building an RV-4 and I am just starting on the instrument
panel. I am interested in the xponder & alt encoder, the engine
instrument cluster, the ELT, and possibly the T & B. Please send me
the prices to n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com
Also, please describe the engine instruments in detail. Since I am
building a -4, I have very limited space. Also, tell me specifically
what instruments there are and their size, cost and shape. Thanks,
Peter B. Mortensen.
________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rdunn(at)ionet.net (Ronald M. Dunn) |
| Subject: | Re: HS REAR SPAR |
>I recently finished riveting the rear spar assembly of my RV-8. Now
>if find that it has bowed, in the direction of the spar flanges
>(toward the rear of the aircraft). Bow is about 1/2" on one end and
>1-1/4" on the other.
>
>Is this something I should be worried about, or will all of that
>structure and all of those rivets hold it in alignment?
>
>Also, any idea how this happens? Differential thermal expansion
>between steel reinforcements and AL2 spar channel? (My workshop has
>gotten very hot recently with the onset of the Texas summer.
>
>
>
>Thanks
>
>George Kilishek
>
Hi George,
When I first assembled my rear spar, I discovered that the spar webs did not
butt smoothly at the center. So I filed about .030 off the center of each
web so that when clecoed together I could see light (a space) between the
two halves. There's going to be a 1/4 to 3/8 gap in your front spar pieces
also.
Good luck,
Ron
Ron Dunn (RV-8 #80078)
rdunn(at)ionet.net
Broken Arrow, OK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Marian K. Rendall or Scott Sawby" <mkr(at)netw.com> |
I have to take a week off and help my mother with some house projects. She
lives in Plainfield, IL. I would love to visit somebody's project if there
is any lister in that vicinty. I'll probably be too busy to travel very far
from there.
I leave Saturday the 29th.
Scott Sawby RV 6A (fusilage finally off the jig)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charles England <england(at)vicksburg.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Mustang II?? |
aol.com!WStucklen(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
>
> >Saw a Mustang II last weekend - thought it was an RV at first. Any
> >wisdom out there as to a comparison between the two??
> >
> >Dave Musgrave
>
> Higher (much higher) landing speeds..... And it's tapered wing does real
> nice snap rols when you try and slow it down too much.........
>
> Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
> wstucklen(at)aol.comThe Mustang II newsletter documented a reason for higher than
published
stall speeds than Mr. Bushby claims.
The airfoil has a relatively sharp leading edge, & when (most) builders
attempt to make their own wing leading edge, they tend to 'crease' it &
end up with a near-knife-edge, and a very high speed, agressive, often
uneven stall. A friend built one using the now-available preformed
leading edge and with a 200 pound overweight airframe (200hp,cs
prop,Retractable Trigear!) he's claiming a stall under 60 mph. It's still
not an RV (narrow cockpit, etc.) but if built right they are nice a/c and
a typical example is USUALLY faster than a typical RV-6. I'd rather have
a -6 but wouldn't reject the M-II without some further research.
Charlie England RV-4 N4375J
england(at)vicksburg.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Louis Willig <larywil(at)Op.Net> |
| Subject: | Re: Safety Belt, was Mustang II |
>
>>As I recall from an old RVator article on Don's death by Van, he was
>>flying with a passenger when a seat belt/harness let go (failed
>>stitching) under some negative G - passenger hit the canopy. The canopy
>>separated, and then hit the tail and took off the horizontal stab.
>
>>Lesson to learn? How do you quality check a new seat belt/harness?
>
>>Mike Kukulski (kukulski(at)indirect.com)
>>RV-4 N96MK, rigging second aileron
>
>I took a couple of hours in a Pitts S2 a few years ago out at Santa Paula. In
>addition to the five point harness, there was a light automotive type belt for
>safety backup. Not a bad idea, I think.
>
>Steve Johnson
>spjohnson(at)mmm.com
>RV-8, #80121, empennage on the way
>
>
The second lap belt, the automotive belt, is lovingly referred to as a
"Jesus Christ" belt, because,if the first one gives way, the usual exclaimation
is "Jesus Christ". And, lo and behold, we are saved (by the back-up belt).
--Lou
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | J.Ken_Hitchmough(at)magic.ca (J.Ken Hitchmough) |
| Subject: | Air Box for Fuel Injection |
For those who were curious about my air box flapper valve (Fred). My
fuel injected air box is the same as on a carb, just slightly in a
different fwd/aft position. I'm not dead sure it will work but its
simply about a 2inch by 3inch aluminum plate on a hinge right in the
centre of the airbox (surrounded by filter). It is spring loaded to the
closed position with the hope that if my filter ever completely iced,
the vacuum would suck it open and it would get air from inside the
cowl, bypassing the filter completely
Ken
Still waiting for final paperwork ;-(
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Pat McClung <pmc123(at)airmail.net> |
| Subject: | GotChas!! to look for |
I had a couple of things get my attention while flying off the
first few hours on my RV6 (Have 5 to go).
First, I had an old, used Bendix ignition switch without keys
that had been around for years--Had keys made, tested it with a meter,
and everything seemed to work(bad mistake). After about 18 hours and
maybe 10 starts, the "start" position stuck and thrashed the light
weight starter. I was lucky to get shut down in time to save the
starter ring. Old starter switches can be deceiving and there is not
way to really test them for sure. That was my first "gotcha"!
While in the process of replacing the ignition switch and
starter, the aircraft was down about two or three days--Hot summer, lots
of bugs, etc. Something got in the right gas tank vent, apparently.
When flown next, the right tank began to develop dents. A change of
tanks and prompt landing was in time to open the tank lid(not easy with
a lot of vacumm pressure, but the tank popped back in shape. Lots of
time blowing out both vents, etc. and, more importantly, fabricating
screen covers for the fuel vents to deter the bugs!!----
Just thought I would pass these things along from one who has
been there, done that.
Keep building--see you at Oshkosh and at Van's
Homecoming.
N3XM - flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: GotChas!! to look for |
. Something got in the right gas tank vent, apparently.
>When flown next, the right tank began to develop dents. A change of
>tanks and prompt landing was in time to open the tank lid(not easy with
>a lot of vacumm pressure, but the tank popped back in shape. Lots of
>time blowing out both vents, etc. and, more importantly, fabricating
>screen covers for the fuel vents to deter the bugs!!----
>
>
I came across a unique screen cover for the 3/16" AL fuel vent lines. I
found a metal screen that has a tube extending about 3/16" long from the
screen. The tube has an OD just the right size to force fit inside the
3/16" AL line.
It's hard to describe but what you end up with is a fuel line with a screen
across the opening. Very unobtrusive and very effective.
I have a few of these left and, if anyone is interested, I could send you
two of them. To cover shipping you should send a check (or cash) for $1.00.
I have enough for 15 to 20 more RV's but you might ask if I still have any
before sending money. I could get more but I might have to buy at least
1000 at a time if I do. Somehow I hesitate to do that.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | To Purchasers of Arlington Airfair Tickets |
I was unable to get the tickets as planned last Friday. I picked them up
after work today and they will be mailed tomorrow on my way to work. Please
let me know if you have not received them by Tuesday, July 2.
Sorry to bother the List but this is the quickest way to notify the people
buying these tickets.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bcon(at)ix.netcom.com (Robert M. Cornacchia ) |
| Subject: | Re: Illinois RV's |
You wrote:
>
>I have to take a week off and help my mother with some house projects.
She
>lives in Plainfield, IL. I would love to visit somebody's project if
there
>is any lister in that vicinty. I'll probably be too busy to travel
very far
>from there.
>
>I leave Saturday the 29th.
>
>Scott Sawby RV 6A (fusilage finally off the jig)
>
>
Hi Scott,
Every Friday between 11:00am and 12:30pm about 20 to 25 RV builders
meet for lunch at Clow airport (1C5) just outside of Plainfield IL.
look them up and meet them for lunch.
See ya,
Bob Cornacchia RV6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis [SFZ]" <76430.2670(at)CompuServe.COM> |
>I have to take a week off and help my mother with some house projects. She
>lives in Plainfield, IL. I would love to visit somebody's project if there
>is any lister in that vicinty. I'll probably be too busy to travel very far
>from there.
>I leave Saturday the 29th.
>Scott Sawby RV 6A (fusilage finally off the jig)
Scott, there is an RV-Group that meets at Clow Airport (about 5 miles from
Plainfield) every Friday for lunch and there are usually several RV's that
show up. People start showing up around 11:30 am, have lunch and talk
informally. There are typically 15 people or so that show up and many of
those are current builders. I'm new to the group myself so I don't have any
names or phone numbers to pass along but they are a friendly group (aren't
all builders?) and are willing to talk.
MIke Nellis 76430.2670(at)compuserve.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Riveting Advice Needed |
Looks like you're getting mostly blank stares from this one. I'm not
surprised. The only place I remember ever seeing anything that
indicates you would NOT want to just dimple all 3 pieces is my Standard
Aviation Maintenance Handbook, which indicates that any combined
underlying thicknesses can be treated as a single thickness, and the
"recommended" procedure is to machine c-sink the underlying pieces if
thick enough, (in this case a .025 rib and .025 skin, for a total of
.050) and dimple the outer (in this case .025) skin. Even so, I am not
aware of anything that _prohibits_ dimpling all three pieces.
I think one issue here is that while the total thickness of the
underlying structure is thick enough to machine c-sink, I would think
you'd want the pieces to be perfectly flat against each other while you
do the countersinking, not easy to do with the fluted ribs and all.
I would be interested in knowing what A&P types know about this.
BTW, I dimpled all of it.
Randall Henderson
randall(at)edt.com
RV-6
> Hey guys I need a little riveting advice. I was preparing
> my two bottom skins (F676 and F677) to rivet when I realized
> I had accidently dimpled all my baggage compartment and seat
> ribs. I will not be able to dimple F676 and countersink
> F677 and the seat and cockpit ribs. Question is: should I
> go ahead and dimple the two skins where they over lap and
> then rivet them to dimpled ribs or should I flatten out the
> seat and baggage compartment ribs that have been dimpled and
> then rivet a dimpled skin into machine countersunk backings.
> This only pertains to the single line of lap joint rivets
> where the two skins meet (see lower left diagram of drawing
> 36.
>
> chet: still having occasional stupid attacks.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
N # |TYPE| COLORS | NAME | E-MAIL |ARRIVING
----------------------------------------------------------------------
N517RL| 6A |Dk. Green/Gray |Rob Lee |av8r(at)hic.net | 30th
N47RV| 3 |Maroon w/ Silver Stripe|Jim Ayers|LesDrag(at)aol.com| 31st tenatively
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chester razer <crazer(at)egyptian.net> |
| Subject: | dimpling and riveting question |
Hey builders, I called Vans and they said it was OK to
dimple two skins into a dimpled rib. In fact a few builders
responded privately and indicated they had done that with
very good results. For some reason I had it in my mind that
when a skin was to be underlaid with two thin skins the two
underlying skins had to be treated as one thick skin and
needed to be machine countersunk.
thanks to those who responded.
chet razer: about to mount and drill gear mounts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KHarrill(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Wing Tip vs Fuselage Antenna |
Has anyone analyzed, calculated, estimated, or SWAGed how much drag
would be saved by using wing tip antennae as opposed to fuselage antennae?
How would the saving translate to performance? Would the drag associated
with fuselage antennae be less if mounted on the fuselage bottom in dirty
air?
I am at the point of needing to decide wheather to route an extra cable
or conduit for a wing tip antenna. Any thoughts????
Ken Harrill
RV - 6
KHarrill @aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Lewis <lewisjw(at)hqsocom.af.mil> |
Subject: Joe Larson email
Joe Larson:
Send me your e-mail address.
Joe Lewis lewisjw(at)hqsocom.af.mil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RFlunker(at)aol.com |
Ordered my Fuse last week. I'm curious as to how long it took you builders
to do your fuse?
Dick Flunker, Still on the wing
RV-6A, N326DB-Res
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
A while back I posted an AOPA alert regarding user fees and the gutting
of the Aviation Trust fund, and also a request for private responses to
see how many people responded. In case anyone's interested, I got a
total of 13 responses from people who told me that they'd written to
their Senator(s) in response to my post. I haven't seen anything further
from AOPA so I'm sure it's not too late to send your letter if you
haven't done so already.....
Randall Henderson
randall(at)edt.com
RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Gesele <scottg(at)villagenet.com> |
| Subject: | rv-list: Cowl Installation |
I just spoke with Bill at Van's. He indicates that the engine will "drop"
slightly after it is run for the first few hours, thus lowering the spinner
about 3/16". This is due to the lord mounts compressing. Van's is now
recommending that the cowl be intentionally installed 3/16" lower than
normal (as measured at the spinner back plate). Once the engine is run, it
will drop and everything will be in alignment (theoretically).
Has anybody experienced this "dropping of the engine"? I'm installing a new
engine and it has not been run yet (except for Lycoming's test run). Are
there any opinions out there regarding intentionally installing the cowling
3/16" lower? I've thought about splitting the difference and installing it
3/32" lower than normal. Any comments /opinions on this?
Thanks in advance.
-Scott N506RV (installing cowl)
scottg(at)villagenet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | NAEK31A(at)prodigy.com ( KURT L KEILBACH) |
Does anyone have any experience or knowledge concerning MT
propellers ? How do they perform ? I know they are German made , wood
with composite overlay blades . I'm looking into a 2 or 3 bladed
elect. controlled variable pitch model . I've seen this prop on some
of the high performance airplanes , the latest being the VIPER in
the most recent Kitplanes .
thanks ,
kurt keilbach naek31a(at)prodigy.com
6-a waiting for finishing kit , bought a Legacy 2.2 that's ready
to be installed ( and it's all stock ) reduction drive on its way ( 1.
9/1.0 ) and starting to look for panel instruments.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Pat McClung <pmc123(at)airmail.net> |
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: Cowl Installation |
Scott Gesele wrote:
>
> I just spoke with Bill at Van's. He indicates that the engine will "drop"
> slightly after it is run for the first few hours, thus lowering the spinner
> about 3/16". This is due to the lord mounts compressing. Van's is now
> recommending that the cowl be intentionally installed 3/16" lower than
> normal (as measured at the spinner back plate). Once the engine is run, it
> will drop and everything will be in alignment (theoretically).
>
> Has anybody experienced this "dropping of the engine"? I'm installing a new
> engine and it has not been run yet (except for Lycoming's test run). Are
> there any opinions out there regarding intentionally installing the cowling
> 3/16" lower? I've thought about splitting the difference and installing it
> 3/32" lower than normal. Any comments /opinions on this?
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> -Scott N506RV (installing cowl)
> scottg(at)villagenet.com
I've got 21 hrs on mine and it hasn't shown signs of "Dropsy", yet. How
many are there in the 'first few' hours????
Mine was lined up at installation and remains the same. Pat 3XM--RV6
Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
>Does anyone have any experience or knowledge concerning MT
>propellers ? How do they perform ? I know they are German made , wood
>with composite overlay blades . I'm looking into a 2 or 3 bladed
>elect. controlled variable pitch model . I've seen this prop on some
>of the high performance airplanes , the latest being the VIPER in
>the most recent Kitplanes .
>
>thanks ,
>kurt keilbach naek31a(at)prodigy.com
>6-a waiting for finishing kit , bought a Legacy 2.2 that's ready
>to be installed ( and it's all stock ) reduction drive on its way ( 1.
>9/1.0 ) and starting to look for panel instruments.
>
>
I don't know about MT props but I do have some pictures of a hub after both
blades parted company. That company (no longer in business, I understand)
used wood blades glued inside aluminum shafts. The shafts could be rotated
by a manually operated control while in flight. Nice idea but when both
blades flew off while the pilot was on top over the Cascades at 10,500 it
was only good luck and damn good piloting that saved his life.
The MT prop may be totally different. I'm suggesting you check thoroughly.
Your luck and skill may not be as good as the above pilot should the MT have
the same problem.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Pat McClung <pmc123(at)airmail.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuse Build Time |
aol.com!RFlunker(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
> Ordered my Fuse last week. I'm curious as to how long it took you builders
> to do your fuse?
>
> Dick Flunker, Still on the wing
> RV-6A, N326DB-Res
>From March 94 to May 96, flight date--That is completed with time out
for Oshkosh and Van's homecoming one time each. Pat N3XM- flying with 4
hrs to go on test time.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: Cowl Installation |
>I just spoke with Bill at Van's. He indicates that the engine will "drop"
>slightly after it is run for the first few hours, thus lowering the spinner
>about 3/16". This is due to the lord mounts compressing. Van's is now
>recommending that the cowl be intentionally installed 3/16" lower than
>normal (as measured at the spinner back plate). Once the engine is run, it
>will drop and everything will be in alignment (theoretically).
>
>Has anybody experienced this "dropping of the engine"? I'm installing a new
>engine and it has not been run yet (except for Lycoming's test run). Are
>there any opinions out there regarding intentionally installing the cowling
>3/16" lower? I've thought about splitting the difference and installing it
>3/32" lower than normal. Any comments /opinions on this?
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>-Scott N506RV (installing cowl)
>scottg(at)villagenet.com
>
>
Van's is RIGHT on this one. I followed their advice and installed the
cowling so it was about 3/16 to 1/4" low in relation to the spinner. After
about 10 to 20 hours of running the spinner is almost exactly lined up with
the cowling. I have seen some RV's where the builder lined them up while
building and now the spinner is as much as 3/8" lower than the cowling; not
a pretty sight. Not to mention the horrendous drag you'd get from that
extra frontal area. :-)
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rust47rg(at)one.net |
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: Cowl Installation |
SNIP>>
>Has anybody experienced this "dropping of the engine"? I'm installing a new
>engine and it has not been run yet (except for Lycoming's test run). Are
>there any opinions out there regarding intentionally installing the cowling
>3/16" lower? I've thought about splitting the difference and installing it
>3/32" lower than normal. Any comments /opinions on this?
>
>-Scott N506RV (installing cowl)
Scott:
Hang it and let it sit as long as you can before you fit the cowl. Make
sure the mounts are seated
in the rings. This will minimize the "SAG". I let mine hang for 6 months
and have seen very little sag in 2 years of flying. Make sure you get the
hard mounts on the correct (compression) side of rings and install the large
washers correctly.
Regards:
Rusty Gossard
N47RG RV-4 Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rust47rg(at)one.net |
>Does anyone have any experience or knowledge concerning MT
>propellers ? How do they perform ? I know they are German made , wood
>with composite overlay blades . I'm looking into a 2 or 3 bladed
>elect. controlled variable pitch model . I've seen this prop on some
>of the high performance airplanes , the latest being the VIPER in
>the most recent Kitplanes .
>
>thanks ,
>kurt keilbach naek31a(at)prodigy.com
>6-a waiting for finishing kit , bought a Legacy 2.2 that's ready
>to be installed ( and it's all stock ) reduction drive on its way ( 1.
>9/1.0 ) and starting to look for panel instruments.
>
Kurt:
MT's are BIG bucks. Makes my Hartzell look cheap. I've never seen one on an RV.
Regards:
Rusty Gossard
N47RG RV-4 Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Smidler <smidler(at)dcwi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Safety Belt, was Mustang II |
Louis Willig wrote:
> The second lap belt, the automotive belt, is lovingly referred to as a
> "Jesus Christ" belt, because,if the first one gives way, the usual exclaimation
> is "Jesus Christ". And, lo and behold, we are saved (by the back-up belt).
>
> --Lou
When skydivers first started to use tandem containers in the late 60's
and early 70's they often did not trust not being able to "punch" the
reserve container when they pulled the ripcord (as they could with the
old belly warts). So...they tied a "Jesus String" to the top flap and
ran it up over there shoulder so they could tug on it when they cut away
thier main and would exclaim "Jesus I hope this works."
Frank Smidler
N96FS reserved (I better get building)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Smidler <smidler(at)dcwi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel tank rib alignment |
Patrick Kelley wrote:
>
> the tank skins are
> another matter. There are no lightening holes to reach through. I started
> at the top side from the spar to the leading edge and would line up the ribs
> for a few holes, strap the skin down, drill and clecoe until the centerlines
> started to wander, unstrap the skin, align a little more, etc. It would have
> been much easier to jig the skeleton where I thought it should be (holding
> the ribs in alignment with threaded rod) and mark the skins to match, as I
> did with the empennage. If I ever do this again, I will ask for unpunched
> skins and one piece main skins.
I had the prepunched skins with my wing kit and had no problem aligning
the tank ribs with a 1/4" rod and 13 collers with set screws. You put
one coller on each side of a rib to hold the proper rib spacing and have
enough rod sticking outboard to go into the end rib of the outer leading
edge to jig vertical. The rod came from the hardware store and the 1/4"
collers from a hobby shop.
Frank Smidler
RV6 fuselage top skins going on.
N96FS reserved
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Smidler <smidler(at)dcwi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Grand Rapid Engine Monitor |
hic.net!av8r(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
> Now we can do some real checking. I have a Grand Rapids (excellent by
> the way) Technologies Engine monitor. CHT & EGT on #1 and #4 - Started
> to record temperature spreads etc - was appalled!!! No 1 ( in cruise
> ) was CHT 300 and EGT 900. While No 4 was CHT 400 and EGT 1350. Oops -
> not good....far to big a spread...So....
>
Rob, can you tell us how the visability of the Grand Rapid Engine
Monitor is in the sun? Did you get the newer larger screan? Where did
you position it on the instrument panel? Your input would be
appreciated since I also plan to use it in my RV6.
Frank Smidler
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis [SFZ]" <76430.2670(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Welcome to the list... |
>Hi Mike,
>Welcome to the rv-list..... A lot of the old Compuserve crew is over here
>now. That's why you don't see much RV talk in Avsig.
>How's things? Any luck in convincing the wife....?
>good luck
>John
Hey John, actually, I've been lurking here and soaking up the information
for the last 6 mos. or so. My wife is dead set against me building this
plane. We're not talking fun and games here. The arguments have been fierce
and I've even resorted to having a friend invite us over to dinner so they
can tell her about the joy of building (I've been helping him do the wings on
his Berkut). In fact we "discussed" the plane thing again tonight but still
no movement. Pretty soon I'm just going to have to ask "so what's the
consequences gonna be when I just do it"? That should be an interesting
conversation.
How's your project coming along? You should be about half way through the
wings by now.
Will you be going to Oshkosh?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: Cowl Installation |
>I just spoke with Bill at Van's. He indicates that the engine will "drop"
>slightly after it is run for the first few hours, thus lowering the spinner
>about 3/16". This is due to the lord mounts compressing. Van's is now
>recommending that the cowl be intentionally installed 3/16" lower than
>normal (as measured at the spinner back plate). Once the engine is run, it
>will drop and everything will be in alignment (theoretically).
>
>Has anybody experienced this "dropping of the engine"? I'm installing a new
>engine and it has not been run yet (except for Lycoming's test run). Are
>there any opinions out there regarding intentionally installing the cowling
>3/16" lower? I've thought about splitting the difference and installing it
>3/32" lower than normal. Any comments /opinions on this?
>-Scott N506RV (installing cowl)
>scottg(at)villagenet.com
Scott, I installed my spinner 1/4" high in relation to the cowl and it
worked out well. The plane has 285 hours. I have the dynafocal mounts.
Results may vary with the flat (conical) mount. I think that if one had to
error, I would vote for spinner too high than too low. There's a RV-6A here
whose spinner is 1/2" low in relation to the cowl. I think this
mis-alignment really shows up and if the spinner is a little high, it's not
quite as apparent.
Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dale(at)ecnet.com (dale) |
| Subject: | fuselage jig for sale - Wisconsin |
Wooden fuselage jig for sale $50.00
Dale
Eau Claire, WI
715 836-7492
--
Registered ICC User
check out http://www.usefulware.com/icc.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mikel(at)dimensional.com |
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: Cowl Installation |
>Has anybody experienced this "dropping of the engine"? I'm installing a new
>engine and it has not been run yet (except for Lycoming's test run). Are
>there any opinions out there regarding intentionally installing the cowling
>3/16" lower? I've thought about splitting the difference and installing it
>3/32" lower than normal. Any comments /opinions on this?
Scott: Well, in the usual way things work I put the cowel on and off and on
and off and then on again, scraping nanometers of glass off each time to get
the elusive perfect fit. And, by golly, it got to looking pretty good.
Then, of course, I took it off the next time and put it on and it didn't fit
anymore. (Sound familiar?) The end result was an unintentional drop of
about 3/16". What a deal. The engine does, indeed, drop and, as with every
thing else, it is just a by guess and by golly measurement/estimate. THEN,
if it drops TOO much, you tell people that in cruse the engine pulls UP
thereby making the spinner even with the cowel and yes, of COURSE I did that
on purpose.
Michael
RV-4 232 SQ
mikel(at)dimensional.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mikel(at)dimensional.com |
>Does anyone have any experience or knowledge concerning MT
>propellers ? How do they perform ? I know they are German made , wood
>with composite overlay blades . I'm looking into a 2 or 3 bladed
>elect. controlled variable pitch model . I've seen this prop on some
>of the high performance airplanes , the latest being the VIPER in
>the most recent Kitplanes .
Kurt: EXPENSIVE.
Michael
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: Cowl Installation |
Scott and fellow builders-
I am aware of RVs in our area having this problem re: engine settling on new
mounts following initial run and well into the break-in. Apparently it takes
a little while 6-12 months to finally "bottom out" and take a
compression/extension set. 3/16" to 1/4" at the spinner top sounds about
right for those of you wanting to place your cowls in anticipation of this
phenomena. Those with O-360 and c/s props will probably need to go 1/4".
For those of you that didn't expect this, you could probably restore the
engine to the original position by adding another fender washer between the
bottom mounts and the block.
Bear in mind that the engine prop combination may lift somewhat back to the
original position (or even past) during flight so don't reduce the spinner
bulkhead clearance below that recommended by Van's.
Gary VanRemortel
Vanremog(at)aol.com
(sound-proofing in, panel powder coated,
wiring done, wings going on 6A)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Nav/strobe/posit lights update |
Hi all:
Here are some things not included in my first post about the wingtip
lighting:
These units are manufactured by Aeroflash. Flash (10 joule single, 12 joule
double flash) rate is 72, + or - 10, per minute, not syncronized. The flash
section is FAA-PMA'd, the nav/posit isn't, at this time. A good deal for us
experimentals. The set includes two (single or double flash) power supplies,
lamp assemblies with bulbs, and 18" leads on the strobe bulbs. I requested
the longer 18" leads so the power supply could be mounted on the face of the
main spar behind the landing light (for service), and the supplied leads for
the strobe would still be long enough (no splicing).
I can also get the "piggyback" style strobe so many mount at the top of the v
stab. These are $249 for a pair ( I'll see if I can get a single unit price),
plus shipping. I had this unit in my -4, and it made a steady "ping", as did
a unit in my friend's -6. The wingtip mounting on the Rocket is very quiet,
but this is the designed application. I don't know why one is quiet, and the
other isn't.
I also have access to the entire Aeroflash product line.
Please, let me know if I can help!
Check six!
Mark
mlfred(at)aol.com
512-918-8582
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russ Werner <russ(at)maui.net> |
| Subject: | Rudder stiffener question |
Can someone confirm what is the proper way to put the rudder stiffners in?
Is it skin-side flange opposite the other skin-side flange, with the
perpendicular flanges exactly pointing at each other, or are the
perpendicular flanges on opposite sides (ie one high one low)? Does this
question make sense?!
Graphically:
| |
|| ||
|| ||
||____ ____||
| |
| |
| |
OR
| ____ |
|| ||
|| ||
||____ ||
| |
| |
| |
Aloha,
Russ Werner, Maui Hawaii
russ(at)maui.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder stiffener question |
Russ-
FWIW I mirrored and staggered them (rivet line slightly up on one skin and
slightly down on opposing skin). This allows them to "nest" and protect each
other at the TE during oil canning, so as not to hammer on the insides of the
skin.
Pictorial below:
>
>| |
>|| ____ |
>|| ||
>||____ ||
>| ||
>| |
Carry on.-
a beggar on the theshold of the void,
Gary VanRemortel
Vanremog(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
To those that ordered some fuel lube: I've packed a few 35mm film canisters
and they are ready to ship. When you receive them, you may wonder if I
packaged cereal in a previous life. I packed as much as I could without
spending all day. You'll understand after you receive the stuff. Anyway,
it looks to me like a 35mm film canister supply will do 5 or more RV's, so
you might want to share some with your fellow RVer's. I used fuel lube on
all screws for the access cover plate and fuel sender. I also used it to
coat the gaskets. I've used it on pipe fittings for fuel and oil. Don't
use this stuff on the 37 degree flare fittings or their mating surfaces. It
doesn't take much. Be sure if you used it on the pipe thread portion of AN
fittings that you don't use so much that there is a chance some will be
introduced into the fluid stream.
My Aircraft Spruce master brake fluid reservoir leaked around the (really
thin) gasket for the lid and I used a very small amount dabbed on the gasket
to seal this. My nylon fittings in the top of the brake master cylinders
weep a little brake fluid and I've been thinking of applying a small amount
to the pipe thread on these. The uses described in this paragraph may not
be the recommended uses for this product. Maybe someone on the list can
give additional comments on this.
Speaking of pipe threaded components. Does it seem that when you use
anything but a straight fitting that the end you need to attach to is always
pointed in the wrong direction? With the nylon fittings that go into the
top of the brake cylinders, one position is too loose and if you rotate 360
degrees there is a possiblity of stripping the threads in the nylon. There
is a general consenses that Teflon thread tape should not be used in
aircraft fittings. I've used it a couple of locations using great care to
make sure that there is no material that can be introduced into the system.
Using this tape is one way to "tighted-up" the threads so the fitting is
pointed in the proper direction. How have other builders handled this
problem of getting their fittings to line up in the diesired direction? Bob
Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bcos(at)ix.netcom.com (William Costello ) |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder stiffener question |
You wrote:
>
>Can someone confirm what is the proper way to put the rudder stiffners
in?
>
>Is it skin-side flange opposite the other skin-side flange, with the
>perpendicular flanges exactly pointing at each other, or are the
>perpendicular flanges on opposite sides (ie one high one low)? Does
this
>question make sense?!
>
>Graphically:
>
>
>| |
>|| ||
>|| ||
>||____ ____||
>| |
>| |
>| |
>
>
>OR
>
>| ____ |
>|| ||
>|| ||
>||____ ||
>| |
>| |
>| |
>
>
>
>Aloha,
>
>
>Russ Werner, Maui Hawaii
>russ(at)maui.net
>
>
They are DEFINITELY the second way above. The first way would not let
you squeeze the trailing edge down to the size it needs to be. They
should also overlap so that when you do squeeze the trailing edge, if
the stiffeners meet, they go against each other.
|
______ |
| |
| |
| |
| ______|
|
|
The overlap is exaggerated here, but it gives the idea I guess.
Best regards,
--
Bill Costello | bcos(at)ix.netcom.com | Chicago | 312-445-1246
Building RV-6 or 6A | Reserved N97WC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russ Werner <russ(at)maui.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder stiffener question |
Thanks all for the clarification. I was pretty sure how to do it, but
wanted some confirmation!
Aloha,
Russ Werner, Maui Hawaii
russ(at)maui.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Espen Dahl <dahl(at)sn.no> |
>>Does anyone have any experience or knowledge concerning MT
>>propellers ? How do they perform ? I know they are German made , wood
>>with composite overlay blades . I'm looking into a 2 or 3 bladed
>>elect. controlled variable pitch model . I've seen this prop on some
>>of the high performance airplanes , the latest being the VIPER in
>>the most recent Kitplanes .
>>
>>thanks ,
>>kurt keilbach naek31a(at)prodigy.com
>>6-a waiting for finishing kit , bought a Legacy 2.2 that's ready
>>to be installed ( and it's all stock ) reduction drive on its way ( 1.
>>9/1.0 ) and starting to look for panel instruments.
>>
There is a RV-4 flying in Norway with a 3 blade MT prop. That particular
RV-4 is pictured in formation with some F-16s in Vans 1996 calendar (Dec?)
I don`t have any performance numbers on the installation, but the owner has
about 300 troublefree hours on it by now.(Since 1991 I believe)
I have had some rides in this RV-4, and what is most impressive to me, is
the way you can slow the airplane down and make a relatively steep approach
without building speed.
Espen Dahl
Building RV-4
Oslo, Norway
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Kelley <patk(at)mail.ic.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel tank rib alignment |
Frank Smidler wrote:
> I had the prepunched skins with my wing kit and had no problem aligning
> the tank ribs with a 1/4" rod and 13 collers with set screws. You put
> one coller on each side of a rib to hold the proper rib spacing and have
> enough rod sticking outboard to go into the end rib of the outer leading
> edge to jig vertical. The rod came from the hardware store and the 1/4"
> collers from a hobby shop.
>
> Frank Smidler
> RV6 fuselage top skins going on.
> N96FS reserved
I tried that with the outboard L.E. ribs, but the alignment was not good. Even
with ribs fluted so they lie reasonably flat and attached so that the rib aligns
with the skin at the spar, I was unable to ensure that the line marked for edge
distance on the rib flange would line up along the entire run. Usually the
offset was only a 1/16", but if it was away from the rib web I felt very
uncomfortable about my edge distance. I found that 1/16" was easy to 'horse'
into position by hand while drilling, so I tossed the rod and opted for pefect
rib alignment instead. Doing the same for the tank was a bear, but I at least
know that the rivets fall on the centerlines of the rib flanges. Still, if I
had my way, I would rather use the rod and drill the skins to match my ribs
rather than the other way around.
PatK - RV-6A - left tank 40 % riveted and prosealed.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel tank rib alignment |
>I tried that with the outboard L.E. ribs, but the alignment was not good.
Even
>with ribs fluted so they lie reasonably flat and attached so that the rib
aligns
>with the skin at the spar, I was unable to ensure that the line marked for
edge
>distance on the rib flange would line up along the entire run. Usually the
>offset was only a 1/16", but if it was away from the rib web I felt very
>uncomfortable about my edge distance. I found that 1/16" was easy to 'horse'
>into position by hand while drilling, so I tossed the rod and opted for pefect
>rib alignment instead. Doing the same for the tank was a bear, but I at least
>know that the rivets fall on the centerlines of the rib flanges. Still, if I
>had my way, I would rather use the rod and drill the skins to match my ribs
>rather than the other way around.
>
>PatK - RV-6A - left tank 40 % riveted and prosealed.
Pat, I think I'd rather drill all of the holes, as well. This is how I did
my first RV and have not reached that point yet on my second, so the jury is
still out.
I have thought quite a bit on how to keep ribs lined up for the
pre-drilled skins. I'm wondering if we could use nylon re-enforced tape.
This would require that one rib, nose or main, be solidly supported so that
there is absolutely no flex on any part of the rib. This rib would have to
be attached solidly to an up right. Maybe you would want to this to a rib
on each end. Then, you would use several strips of this tape, say 3 or 4
lengths for each side of a main rib and starting with the solidly mounted
rib and work on down the wing. Measurements could be taken on the distances
between ribs before each rib is stuck down. This tape is pretty sticky and
has no stretch to it and I think might do a pretty good job of immobilizing
the ribs. RVer's, what do you think? Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barnhart(at)a.crl.com (Dave Barnhart) |
| Subject: | RV6 jigs available |
My RV-6 fuselage came out of the jig today (in and out of the jig in 3 months).
I now have the following RV-6/6A jigs available:
Rv-6/6A empennage/wing jig:
I made this jig myself from 2 x 4 inch rectangular steel tubing. (I would
have used 4x4 wood, but the steel cost me no more than the wood would have,
so what the heck.)
Rv-6/6A fuselage jig:
This is a wooden jig. My fuselage is the fifth one built in this jig, and
the long side members are still straight as an arrow.
Both of these jigs are available FREE to anyone in the Phoenix, Arizona
area. All you have to do is to come and get them.
PLEASE do not clutter up the rv-list with responses. Instead contact me at:
e-mail: barnhart(at)a.crl.com
Phone: (602) 931-6605
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB
fuselage out of jig
Finishing kit on order
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JamesCone(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: GotChas!! to look for |
John,
If you have any left, I would like two. Send me an E-Mail and let me know
that you have them reserved fro me and I will drop you a check.
Jim Cone
jamescone(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JamesCone(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: Cowl Installation |
There was a long article in one of the back isues of my newsletter that
talked about this very issue. 1995 back issues are avaliable for $5. and a
1996 subscription is also $5. and will include the back issues for that year.
The July issue is complete and is on the way to the printer now. If you are
interested in my newsletter, drop me an E-mail. I will send you the back
issues and your check can cross the in the snail mail.
Jim Cone
Editor, Van's Air Force, Tri-State Wing Newsletter
jamescone(at)aol.com
422 Savannah Ridge Drive
St. Charles, MO 63303
(314) 928-8703
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
I'm cutting off the offer for fuel line vents. I have enough for all of you
that have asked for them. Once the dust settles and if I find that I have
more to distribute I may open up the gates again. For now, the last two to
contact me were Jim Cone and Rion Bourgeois; I've got you two covered.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: GotChas!! to look for |
>John,
>
>If you have any left, I would like two. Send me an E-Mail and let me know
>that you have them reserved fro me and I will drop you a check.
>
>Jim Cone
>jamescone(at)aol.com
>
>
I just put your name on an envelope. Maybe I should buy a 1000 of them; I'm
going to announce they're all gone now. I just hope I've got enuf for all
the responses so far.
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robbins Mitch <ROBBINM(at)chi.ntsb.gov> |
| Subject: | rv-list: Cowl Installation |
I didn't notice any settling but my engine was hung for several weeks in
>100 degree temperatures in Arizona before I fit the cowl. With regard
to where it should be, the spinner cowl interface is critical, for
minimum aerodynamic drag and asthetics.
My $.02
I haven't set one up in a wind tunnel but accepted practice suggests that
the cowl should protrude slightly above the spinner on top as Van
recommends. The issue is not primarily one of minimum frontal area, but
preventing boundary layer separation which produces exponentially more
drag. The bottom of the cowl is at a positive angle of attack for almost
all "normal" AOA's. It provides a positive pressure gradient across the
spinner gap, thus eliminates potential separation regardless of minor
variations in geometry. The top of the cowl, being more nearly parallel
to the longitudinal axis of the airplane does not.
Mitch Robbins
----------
>I just spoke with Bill at Van's. He indicates that the engine will
"drop"
>slightly after it is run for the first few hours, thus lowering the
spinner
>about 3/16". This is due to the lord mounts compressing. Van's is now
>recommending that the cowl be intentionally installed 3/16" lower than
>normal (as measured at the spinner back plate). Once the engine is run,
it
>will drop and everything will be in alignment (theoretically).
>
>Has anybody experienced this "dropping of the engine"? I'm installing a
new
>engine and it has not been run yet (except for Lycoming's test run).
Are
>there any opinions out there regarding intentionally installing the
cowling
>3/16" lower? I've thought about splitting the difference and installing
it
>3/32" lower than normal. Any comments /opinions on this?
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>-Scott N506RV (installing cowl)
>scottg(at)villagenet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dr John Cocker <jcocker(at)interhop.net> |
| Subject: | Canopy/fuselage interface |
I am having a problem I dn't recall seeing discussed before.
When I lift up the canopy, the front edge catches on the fuselage sheet in
front of it.
Because of the hinge position, the canopy moves up and foreward. The two
edges catch. I have been trimming back the fuselage skin, so now there is a
gap, which is unsightly, and it is still catching.
Any solutions ?
John Cocker (Just starting to wire things up)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mikel(at)dimensional.com |
| Subject: | Re: Couple o' questions |
I have two questions re: RV-4s
1. How is the front canopy fairing (the fiberglass) attached to the
plexiglass and front canopy skin. In looking at the ones at a recent flyin
the methods are many and varied. Do the rivets that attache the plexiglass
to the frame go through the fairing or is the fairing laid on top and then
secured by some other means. It would make more sense that the rivets go
through. Some installations have rivets throught the fairing into the front
skin also.
2. Are the "approximate measurements" given in the plans for the aileron
push rods (both the long aluminum and shorter steel) close to being
accurate? I am about to shove I mean gently slide the wings on and off and
on and would like to minimize the number of times they go on and off. There
is no drawing that shows what nutural position of the aileron bellcrank is
to help in determining length (THAT would be handy).
Michael
RV-4 232 SQ
mikel(at)dimensional.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: GotChas!! to look for |
John;
Do these fit inside of the alum. tube, or inside of the fitting that Vans
says to put on the bottom of the fuse.? Reason I ask, I would like two of
them (my screens keep blowing off), but I have those AN fittings that are
threaded (bulkhead fittings) and then sliced off at an angle below the
threaded part.
John D
>I came across a unique screen cover for the 3/16" AL fuel vent lines. I
>found a metal screen that has a tube extending about 3/16" long from the
>screen. The tube has an OD just the right size to force fit inside the
>3/16" AL line.
>I have a few of these left and, if anyone is interested, I could send you
>two of them. To cover shipping you should send a check (or cash) for $1.00.
John Darby RV6 N61764 flying
johnd@our-town.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dan Boudro <dboudro(at)nmia.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Couple o' questions |
See responses below:
Dan Boudro
RV-4 N9167Z
Albuquerque, NM
dboudro(at)nmia.com
On Sun, 30 Jun 1996 dimensional.com!mikel(at)matronics.com wrote:
> I have two questions re: RV-4s
>
> 1. How is the front canopy fairing (the fiberglass) attached to the
> plexiglass and front canopy skin. In looking at the ones at a recent flyin
> the methods are many and varied. Do the rivets that attche the
plexiglass
> to the frame go through the fairing or is the fairing laid on top and then
> secured by some other means. It would make more sense that the rivets go
> through. Some installations have rivets throught the fairing into the front
> skin also.
This one's easy, I didn't make a fairing. I sealed the plexiglass
to the skin with clear Silicone. Seems to work great, my wife and I
just got back from Madison, WI. we encountered some slight rain and
didn't have a problem, haven't experienced heavy rain yet but I try
to avoid it anyway with my wood prop.
>
> 2. Are the "approximate measurements" given in the plans for the aileron
> push rods (both the long aluminum and shorter steel) close to being
> accurate? I am about to shove I mean gently slide the wings on and off and
> on and would like to minimize the number of times they go on and off. There
> is no drawing that shows what nutural position of the aileron bellcrank is
> to help in determining length (THAT would be handy).
I gently slid the wings in too (with a big hammer), I then attached the
ailerons, put the bellcrank in about the middle of its movement, get the
aileron/bellcrank pushrod length set then proceed to set the
control/bellcrank pushrod length. This seemed to work fairly well.
You've got some adjustment but not a whole lot (maybe 1/2")
>
> Michael
> RV-4 232 SQ
> mikel(at)dimensional.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy/fuselage interface |
>I am having a problem I dn't recall seeing discussed before.
>When I lift up the canopy, the front edge catches on the fuselage sheet in
>front of it.
>Because of the hinge position, the canopy moves up and foreward. The two
>edges catch. I have been trimming back the fuselage skin, so now there is a
>gap, which is unsightly, and it is still catching.
>Any solutions ?
>
>John Cocker (Just starting to wire things up)
John, I had a little interference in this area, as well. You're right, I
don't remember discussion on this subject. I beveled the front fuselage
skin and the front canopy skin a little. I also had to trim to a little
larger gap than I thought ideal. I didn't do too much of this until the
skin was riveted down, which did improve the situation. If the problem is
severe, you may have to resort to bending the front canopy skin up just a
little. If the front canopy skin isn't riveted on yet you might be able to
gain some height (and needed clearance) by inserting a shim under the front
canopy skin. I thought, that on my next six, I might mount the canopy just
a tad bit higher for clearance. You don't want to have joints (canopy fit,
cowl fit, etc.) too tight as you'll want to allow room so the painted edges
don't hit each other and chip paint. Also, rounded edges hold paint better
than squared off edges.
Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Thomas J. Kopp" <tkopp(at)mixcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Couple o' questions |
Dan Boudro wrote:
> just got back from Madison, WI. we encountered some slight rain and
Well...I'm a lurker on the list here (only things I've ever flown is radio
controlled airplanes and helicopters)...
Just curious if any of you are in the Milwaukee, WI area...? Be kind of nice to
see either
a work-in-progress or a finished copy...mostly interested in the -6 and -6A or
maybe the 4.
I'm a fairly long way away from building my own, but would like to do it someday
(5-10 years
from now, maybe)...my interest is torn between the RV's and the -Eze variants (berkut,
e-racer)
Tom
--
Thomas J. Kopp - Milwaukee, WI tkopp(at)mixcom.com
'95 Z-28, PEG2, T's, M6, RS-As 13.940 @ 101.47
Memphis #23
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrabstonD(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Riveting Spar Strips To Spar Webb |
Van's Aircraft Co:
I'd like for you to respons to the following problem, please.
I'm also sending this to RV-LIST to see what other builders have been doing
in cases like this, and to help anyone getting ready to drive spar rivets.
After reading the instructions and looking at the plans, I concluded that all
of the # 6 rivets in the wing spars were to be installed with the shop head
aft. That worked great (flange strips and webbs fit together real tight)
until I got to station 71.5 where the W606A spar web was not sandwiched
between the heavy spar strips. Of course that ment , the shop heads went
aganist the thinner .040" spar webb. The rivets drove down good and tight.
But, after I finished driving them I noticed that W606A was not held as
tightly against spar strip W606C as before. It appears that driving the
rivets caused a slight bulge around the holes in the .040" material resulting
in a small gap (about .008") midway between the rivets. The spar webb is held
tightly against the flange strip at the rivets but does a gradual separaion
to about .008" at the point midway between the rivets. I think this could
have been prevented by placing the factory heads on the .040 side and driving
the shop heads on the flange strip side.
Did I do something wrong?
Is this slight separation common?
Will this slight separation cause a problem?
If the separation is not acceptable, what is a solution?
Thanks,
Doug Brabston
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gksugar(at)gate.net (gregory warr) |
| Subject: | Re: Couple o' questions |
In article dimensional.com!mikel(at)matronics.com writes:
>Received: from matronics.com by netcomsv.netcom.com with UUCP (8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
>Errors-To: bounces(at)matronics.com
>From: dimensional.com!mikel(at)matronics.com
>Date: Sun, 30 Jun 1996 10:50:07 -0600 (MDT)
>Posted-Date: Sun, 30 Jun 1996 10:50:07 -0600 (MDT)
>Message-Id: <199606301650.KAA23635(at)blackhole.dimensional.com>
>X-Sender: mikel(at)dimensional.com
>X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2
>Mime-Version: 1.0
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Couple o' questions
>Sender: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Precedence: bulk
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>I have two questions re: RV-4s
>1. How is the front canopy fairing (the fiberglass) attached to the
>plexiglass and front canopy skin. In looking at the ones at a recent flyin
>the methods are many and varied. Do the rivets that attache the plexiglass
>to the frame go through the fairing or is the fairing laid on top and then
>secured by some other means. It would make more sense that the rivets go
>through. Some installations have rivets throught the fairing into the front
>skin also.
>2. Are the "approximate measurements" given in the plans for the aileron
>push rods (both the long aluminum and shorter steel) close to being
>accurate? I am about to shove I mean gently slide the wings on and off and
>on and would like to minimize the number of times they go on and off. There
>is no drawing that shows what nutural position of the aileron bellcrank is
>to help in determining length (THAT would be handy).
>Michael
>RV-4 232 SQ
>mikel(at)dimensional.com
Michael, in response to your second question I found the demensions to be
fairly close. There is a lot of adjustment once the initial installation is
made.Once this is done you can determine where your ailerons will be set in
relation to the wing tip and trailing edge of flap.You also have the max/min
degree travel for the ailerol to be set.(don't foget the nut plates on the
bottom inboard wing panel that fasten wing and bottom skin.)....First
question....if my memory serves me the canopy is fitted,trimmed,drilled and
rivited....temporarily. The canopy skin is then trimmed,fitted,drilled and
clecoed in place. The part of the skin next to the "glass" is flared outward
so it lays parallel,or smoothly against it. Final drilling.....Through skin ,
"glass" and canopy bow is done next. The remaining part of the canopy skin is
drilled (# 40 ) and clecoed in place. When all is done and your happy with
the fit you disassemble, debur and get it ready for the final assembly. As a
final thought...,what do the directions say? I know they are a little vague at
times. good luck
Greg Warr N 524 KW
gksugar(at)gate.net
old pilot.....new plane
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | joehine(at)mi.net (joehine) |
| Subject: | plexiglass cracks. |
Listers:
There was a discussion here a few months ago about the repairing of
plexiglass cracks. I saved the messages I wanted but they since have been
accidently deleated. (no hard copy)
One person wrote of a method of fixing a crack by dissolving pieces of
plexiglass in, I believe, MEK and using the mixture to weld the crack back
togeather.
If the person who posted that method is still on the list, could you repost
it or send it to me privately. I have a small drill stopped crack I would
like to try and repair and I can't find the post in the archives.
thanks
Joe
joehine(at)mi.net Comp. 9, Site 8, RR#4
506-452-1072 Home Fredericton, NB
506-452-3495 Work Canada, E3B 4X5
Nobody on their death bed has ever been heard to say "Geeze,I wish I'd spent
more time at work"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Solana <102131.2407(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Test - not getting messages |
Test message. I'm not getting messages for the last few days. Did this get through?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Michael C. Gamble" <mgamble(at)chiba.netxn.com> |
| Subject: | Test - not getting messages |
------ =_NextPart_000_01BB668F.B18EC1A0
Rick:
I got it, here in Bakersfield!
Mick
----------
From: Rick Solana[SMTP:CompuServe.COM!102131.2407(at)matronics.com]
Sent: Sunday, June 30, 1996 1:09 PM
Subject: RV-List: Test - not getting messages
Test message. I'm not getting messages for the last few days. Did this get through?
------ =_NextPart_000_01BB668F.B18EC1A0
eJ8+IhYVAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgABBJAG
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AKHi
------ =_NextPart_000_01BB668F.B18EC1A0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LHaines794(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Whatzit?(Good Deals on Parts) |
(Robbins Mitch) writes:
<< Narco 824 Digital Nav >>
Just curious, never heard of it before.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
Bob- I've not finished the dual brake installation yet, but I believe Van's
now supplies brass fittings instead of nylon. Same problem with alignment of
the elbows... my A&P suggested non-hardening Permatex Form-A-Gasket on the
pipe threads, which I did. So far no leaks, but then, so far there's never
been a drop of fluid in the system!!
Bill Boyd
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Couple o' questions |
>2. Are the "approximate measurements" given in the plans for the aileron
>push rods (both the long aluminum and shorter steel) close to being
>accurate? I am about to shove I mean gently slide the wings on and off and
>on and would like to minimize the number of times they go on and off. There
>is no drawing that shows what nutural position of the aileron bellcrank is
>to help in determining length (THAT would be handy).
>Michael
>RV-4 232 SQ
>mikel(at)dimensional.com
Hi Mike,
By far the eaiest way to do this sort of stuff is with the wings out of the
fuse. i.e. do not put the wings on (yet)!!
Place the wings on two saw horses, about 2/3 out to the tips. They do of course
need to be joined by the spar re-inforcement joining plates at the center. Hang
the ailerons - you can now attach the joystick assemblies where you can easily
get at them to do pushrod lengths etc. without the interference of that fuselage
:)
Hope this helps - it was one of the best tips I got!
Regards,
Rob Lee
av8r(at)hic.net
RV6A flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Couple o' questions (aileron rigging) |
| From: | Mike Kukulski <kukulski(at)indirect.com> |
You wrote:
>Are the "approximate measurements" given in the plans for the aileron
>push rods (both the long aluminum and shorter steel) close to being
>accurate? I am about to shove I mean gently slide the wings on and off and
>on and would like to minimize the number of times they go on and off. There
>is no drawing that shows what nutural position of the aileron bellcrank is
>to help in determining length (THAT would be handy).
You asked at the right time - just finished rigging the ailerons in my
RV-4. My short steel pushrods were sized per the plans. I fitted the
long ones by riveting on the fitting at one end, inserting it into the
wing from the tip end (tip not attached), and then attaching it via the
rod end to the bellcrank in the wing. With the aileron and control
column clamped in the neutral position, I could then very accurately mark
the large pushrod for the proper length. I do have a neutral position for
the bellcrank specified on my plans (sheet #16).
I have a penciled in revision that specifies that in the neutral
position, there is a 1-3/16" distance between the center of the bellcrank
bolt hole that attaches the large pushrod and the inboard vertical face
of the angle that the bellcrank pivots on. This came from an RVator plans
update from eons ago. My serial number is 1811, so my yellowed plans have
lots of pencil revisions.
Don't take the wing off until you've done everything - set incidence
angle, fabricated fuel tank mount, root fairings, tubing runs, flap and
aileron rigging, etc.. Then the second time you install it, it stays on.
That's my plan anyway.
Mike Kukulski (kukulski(at)indirect.com)
RV-4 N96MK , removing the second wing TODAY.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WStucklen(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: restrictor fittings |
>I have a question about this. (Big surprise, huh?) I assume that for a -4
>fitting you use a -4 rivet. But the rivet head sticks out around the
>perimeter of the flared fitting. Won't that interfere with the sealing of
>the tube? Or does the tube/rivet area "mash" itself to fit? (sounds
>doubtful)
>
>Sigh,
>Ed Bundy
>
>
>
Cut the head off........
________________________________________________________________________________
Importance: normal
| From: | Klaus Roth <rothk(at)oims.med.siemens.de> |
Sorry to the list, but I couldn't send direct to Kurt.
- ----------
Von: Roth Klaus
An: 'Kurt Keilbach'
Betreff: MT prop
Datum: Montag, 1. Juli 1996 12:44
Hello Kurt,
Just I ordered a MT 3 blade constant speed prop for my RV 4.
It is expensive, (14 000 DM, about 9500$) but because our request for low
noise level here in
Germany I think I can achieve it with this prop and two additional
mufflers.
Send a fax to: mt-propeller
Germany, 9429 8432
and you will get more information
I talked with Michael Muehlbauer. He is the "junior boss".
A lot of airplanes have mt props here in Germany, and I never heard a
problem.
Best regards
Klaus Roth, RV 4
Germany
rothk(at)oims.med.siemens.de
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com (Peter B. Mortensen) |
| Subject: | Re: Test - not getting messages |
You wrote:
>
>Test message. I'm not getting messages for the last few days. Did
this get through?
>
Yes. Peter Mortensen n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com
_____________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fuse Build Time |
I had my fuselage in and out of the jig in 90 days...it only took an
additional 2 years from that point!!! That was working 15-20 hours a week.
Keep on going.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ward9(at)llnl.gov (Rich Ward) |
Wyoming with my RV.) You might E-mail me off the list & tell me your
>sending the money and I'll try to have everything packed and ready (don't
>want to fill a bunch of canisters that won't be mailed). Don't forget to
>include your name and mailing address.
>
>Bob Skinner BSkinner(at)ltec.net
Bob,
I'll be sending my five buck off in a day or so.
Rich Ward
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WStucklen(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy/fuselage interface |
> am having a problem I dn't recall seeing discussed before.
>When I lift up the canopy, the front edge catches on the fuselage sheet in
>front of it.
>Because of the hinge position, the canopy moves up and foreward. The two
>edges catch. I have been trimming back the fuselage skin, so now there is a
>gap, which is unsightly, and it is still catching.
>Any solutions ?
>
>John Cocker (Just starting to wire things up)
>
>
John:
I assume you are talking about the tilt up canopy, not the sliding canopy.
I have the tiltup on my -6A.
I had the same problem. I found that the front /top fuselage skin should be
flat in the center area where it butts up against the canopy skin. If it's
bulged up, even a little, and the gap between the canopy and forward skin is
tight, they will catch each other when the canopy is tilted up. By putting a
slight downward bent edge on the forward/top fuse skin, beveling both skin
edges slightly, then adjusting the gap between them, will eliminate the
problem.
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
wstucklen(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WStucklen(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: Cowl Installation |
>Has anybody experienced this "dropping of the engine"? I'm installing a new
>engine and it has not been run yet (except for Lycoming's test run). Are
>there any opinions out there regarding intentionally installing the cowling
>3/16" lower? I've thought about splitting the difference and installing it
>3/32" lower than normal. Any comments /opinions on this?
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>-Scott N506RV (installing cowl)
>scottg(at)villagenet.com
>
>
I've put on 715 Hrs in 2 Years, 9 Months. My spinner has falen about
1/4".....
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
wstucklen(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
>Bob- I've not finished the dual brake installation yet, but I believe Van's
>now supplies brass fittings instead of nylon. Same problem with alignment of
>the elbows... my A&P suggested non-hardening Permatex Form-A-Gasket on the
>pipe threads, which I did. So far no leaks, but then, so far there's never
>been a drop of fluid in the system!!
>
>Bill Boyd
Bill, The brass fittings will take a little more torque, I'm sure. I might
go to a straight fitting and longer tubing to my reservoir. I'm putting off
any "under panel" work until cooler weather. Bob Skinner
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Couple o' questions |
> >2. Are the "approximate measurements" given in the plans for the aileron
> >push rods (both the long aluminum and shorter steel) close to being
> >accurate? I am about to shove I mean gently slide the wings on and off and
> >on and would like to minimize the number of times they go on and off. There
> >is no drawing that shows what nutural position of the aileron bellcrank is
> >to help in determining length (THAT would be handy).
Yes they're close. I don't remember exactly what I ended up cutting mine
at but I think if you cut em to the length specified you'd be fine.
I did, however, first check everything at the NEUTRAL POSITION as shown on
dwg. #19A, upper left corner, just below where the Aileron Bellcrank
Plate is depicted, view labeled "Top View".
Randall Henderson
randall(at)edt.com
RV-6.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Johnson, Steve" <spjohnson(at)msmail.mmmg.com> |
I will be unsubscribing here at work due to a lot of changes going on as
Imation breaks off from 3M. I am on the list at home and will be getting my
mail at my address there.
Steve Johnson
spjohnsn(at)ix.netcom.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Couple o' questions |
> I did, however, first check everything at the NEUTRAL POSITION as shown on
> dwg. #19A, upper left corner, just below where the Aileron Bellcrank
> Plate is depicted, view labeled "Top View".
OOPS -- that was for the -6... did you have a -4? I'll bet it's on the
dwgs for that too, but I don't know for sure.
Randall Henderson
randall(at)edt.com
RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larson, Joe" <Joseph.P.Larson(at)nmb.norwest.com> (Joe Larson) |
I asked about where the Naviad Devices autopilot servo goes a week or so ago.
The answer at the time was that I could install the servo underneath the
seats.
I just called Navaid to see what they could say. He did point out that most
pilots are installing in the wing instead. He said it's a much easier
installation in the wing if you do so during construction.
Other tidbits I got from him:
1. Lead time right now is about 3 weeks. He expects this to extend to
4-6 weeks for a few months immediately following Oshkosh.
2. They do not recommend use of the autopilot near the ground or during IFR
flight. (To me: that means I'll turn it off once I'm established inbound
on my approaches.) He didn't think their unit was legal for IFR use, but
queries to the FAA on that point have gone unanswered. I'll install a
TSO'd turn coordinator and only use the autopilot to hold a heading.
3. Unit can be overridden in flight if it gets cranky. It has a "safety
clutch".
Figured if I had these questions, others did, too....
-Joe
--
Joe Larson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rust47rg(at)one.net |
| Subject: | Re: Navaid Devices |
>2. They do not recommend use of the autopilot near the ground or during IFR
> flight. (To me: that means I'll turn it off once I'm established inbound
> on my approaches.) He didn't think their unit was legal for IFR use, but
> queries to the FAA on that point have gone unanswered. I'll install a
> TSO'd turn coordinator and only use the autopilot to hold a heading.
Joe:
I've had one in my 4 for 18 months. It works as well as any certified wing
leveler I've flown with. Actually better than some.
Read between the lines in their answers. Product liability. And when you're
up in the clouds and getting vectored all over the place and you need to
switch charts be sure not to turn your non TSO'd wing leveler on.....just
let it roll over on it's back.:)
By the way , mines under the seat and thats where I'd put it if I were to do
it again.
Regards:
Rusty Gossard
N47RG RV-4 Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Navaid Devices |
>I just called Navaid to see what they could say. He did point out that most
>pilots are installing in the wing instead. He said it's a much easier
>installation in the wing if you do so during construction.
>Joe Larson
Joe. I don't know if you're going to put it in the four or six. I've got
one in my RV-6 and it is mounted under the passenger seat. The unit works
very well. I intend to put the servo in the wing on the six that I'm
building now. When mounting under the seat, location becomes critical
because of the great for-aft movement of the stick. When mounting in the
wing, you have less movement of the aileron push tube to contend with and
installation and service access could be made a little easier.
Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WCannon313(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Fwd: First flight of N36WC |
---------------------
Subj: First flight of N36WC
Date: 96-06-30 23:56:23 EDT
From: WCannon313
Wanted to take a moment to announce the first flight of RV-6 N36WC on 6/29/96
at Boeing field in Seattle. It was a beautiful 60 degree calm morning, the
taxi testing was done, the FAA man had paid a visit, and I couldn't think of
any reason not to fly the sucker. Everything went exactly as planned and I
orbited the field at about 1500' (under the TCA) for 15 minutes and then
brought it in for a landing, absolutely no problems!! It's now a day later I
have five hours and half a dozen landings and things couldn't be sweeter. The
0-360 with a constant speed provides great climb performance, I haven't wrung
out the top end yet but I'm sure I'll be pleased.
Stick with it!!!
Walt Cannon
N36WC
Seattle, WA.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EBundy2620(at)aol.com |
Does anyone have any info/opinions on "Snowline" Welding & Fabrication? They
make SS exhaust systems for RV's.
Apparently these are the ones that ACS sells, and they have an ad in
"Kitplanes".
I've only heard good things about the Vetterman exhaust, but I've had one on
back order with Van's for quite a while now, and they have no idea when
they'll be in stock.
Thanks,
Ed Bundy
ebundy2620(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: Fwd: First flight of N36WC |
>
>---------------------
>Forwarded message:
>Subj: First flight of N36WC
>Date: 96-06-30 23:56:23 EDT
>From: WCannon313
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
>Wanted to take a moment to announce the first flight of RV-6 N36WC on 6/29/96
>at Boeing field in Seattle. It was a beautiful 60 degree calm morning, the
>taxi testing was done, the FAA man had paid a visit, and I couldn't think of
>any reason not to fly the sucker. Everything went exactly as planned and I
>orbited the field at about 1500' (under the TCA) for 15 minutes and then
>brought it in for a landing, absolutely no problems!! It's now a day later I
>have five hours and half a dozen landings and things couldn't be sweeter. The
>0-360 with a constant speed provides great climb performance, I haven't wrung
>out the top end yet but I'm sure I'll be pleased.
>
>Stick with it!!!
>
>
>Walt Cannon
>N36WC
>Seattle, WA.
>
>
Congratulations, Walt; it seems only a year or so ago that you had the wing
in the jig. You must like it. Five hours in the first two days is pretty good.
Be sure to bring it to Arlington. You won't need the special rate we've got
for Arlington tickets now. You qualify for the 'pilot' rate on your own.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ted French <french(at)computime.bc.ca> |
| Subject: | Nose gear vibration |
Hi folks. My name is Ted French and I have about 5 hours on my RV-6A.
It flies beautifully and is a joy to handle. However, when I land I get
a very pronounced vibration in the nose gear. I have taken the fairing
off and when I do the vibration goes away. I suspect that I have to
balance the fairing around the axis of the axle. Has anyone on the list
run into a similiar problem. Any suggestions gratefully accepted.
Thanks
Ted French RV-6A C-FXCS
Prince George BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | thayer(at)sirius.com (Thayer Syme) |
| Subject: | Re: Fwd: First flight of N36WC |
>Wanted to take a moment to announce the first flight of RV-6 N36WC on 6/29/96
>at Boeing field in Seattle. It was a beautiful 60 degree calm morning, the
Well done Walt, and thanks for the inspiration. Hope all goes well frome
here on out.
Thayer Syme
San Francisco
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David W.S. King" <KingD(at)direct.ca> |
>Does anyone have any info/opinions on "Snowline" Welding & Fabrication? They
>make SS exhaust systems for RV's.
Subject to correction of somewhat faulty memory ;-]
Snowline I believe has job'd out then eventually took over
fabrication of the Ultimate aircraft line of airframes and components.
Needless to say thier work is quite accdeptable
(that is if I am remembering the right place ;-)
Cheers
Dave
Dave King
KingD(at)Direct.Ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | OrndorffG(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Nose gear vibration |
Ted ,
check the shimmie damper tightness. Also if you touch down alittle to
fast the nose wheel will vibrate. any other question call 817-438-3280 or
write....george orndorff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WStucklen(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Nose gear vibration |
<< Hi folks. My name is Ted French and I have about 5 hours on my RV-6A.
It flies beautifully and is a joy to handle. However, when I land I get
a very pronounced vibration in the nose gear. I have taken the fairing
off and when I do the vibration goes away. I suspect that I have to
balance the fairing around the axis of the axle. Has anyone on the list
run into a similiar problem. Any suggestions gratefully accepted.
Thanks
Ted French RV-6A C-FXCS
Prince George BC >>
Ted:
The ONLY problems I've had with the nose wheel on my -6A is a shimmy if
the tension has not been reset properly. By tension I'm referring to the
test that Van outlines in the instruction manual for a required 20 lb pull at
the wheel axil, adjustable by the pivot axle nut. The tension will change as
the arm bushings seat into the axle, and as the assembly loosens up in
general. The tighter you can make the tension, the less problems you will
have.
Also, in the drawing I have, the U-611 disc springs are shown back to
back against the axle nut. I found that placing one on the top, and one on
the bottom of the arm, resulted in a more even tension adjustment. Each
spring faces the arm (ie, the largest contact area). In fact, when assembled
per the drawings, I had more shimmy related problems.
I have found that, even when set properly, the nose wheel can be castered
off center during landings in very strong cross winds. This usually results
in a significant shimmy when the nose wheel touches the runnway. Usually, by
lifting the wheel (with back stick pressure) and touching it down LIGHTLY,
will allow it to straighten out without a shimmy. When you're concentrating
on the vigors of a strong cross wind this process can get difficult.
I usually check the nose wheel tension at every oil change. If you have
had a shimmy condition, be sure to check the WD-631 axle flange. I have
replace mine once already, due to cracking around the AN5-17A mounting bolt
holes.
Hope that helps.....
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
wstucklen(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuse Build Time |
On my RV6, from the time I started work on the firewall to the point I turned
the fuselage over, took 232 hours. There was still a lot of fuselage work to
be done at this point. From the time I started the fuse to the time I began
mounting flying surfaces (which directly preceeded finish kit work) took 451
hours.
Rick McBride
RV6 N523JC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Bordelon <greg(at)brokersys.com> |
| Subject: | Fwd: First flight of N36WC |
Congradulations Walt!!!!
I'm sure your experiencing one of the more critical RV grins right now. The
break your face, ear to ear grin.... :-)) Well done! See yah at
Oskosh?
Greg Bordelon
greg(at)brokersys.com
----------
From:
aol.com!WCannon313(at)matronics.com[SMTP:aoFrom owner-rv-list Tue Jul 2
09:37:03 1996
From: mikel(at)dimensional.com
Date: Tue, 2 Jul 1996 10:31:21 -0600 (MDT)
Subject: Re: RV-List: Fwd: First flight of N36WC
>
>---------------------
>Forwarded message:
>Subj: First flight of N36WC
>Date: 96-06-30 23:56:23 EDT
>From: WCannon313
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
>Wanted to take a moment to announce the first flight of RV-6 N36WC on 6/29/96
>at Boeing field in Seattle. It was a beautiful 60 degree calm morning, the
>taxi testing was done, the FAA man had paid a visit, and I couldn't think of
>any reason not to fly the sucker. Everything went exactly as planned and I
>orbited the field at about 1500' (under the TCA) for 15 minutes and then
>brought it in for a landing, absolutely no problems!! It's now a day later I
>have five hours and half a dozen landings and things couldn't be sweeter. The
>0-360 with a constant speed provides great climb performance, I haven't wrung
>out the top end yet but I'm sure I'll be pleased.
>
>Stick with it!!!
>
>
>Walt Cannon
>N36WC
>Seattle, WA.
WAHOO!! Then it is possible...mine WILL fly some day!!!! Oh, good; I was
beginning to wonder.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>CONGRATS!!!!<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Now: we need test flight reports to keep us groundlings dreaming.
Michael
mikel(at)dimensional.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jerryflyrv(at)village.yvv.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Navaid Devices |
>
> >I just called Navaid to see what they could say. He did point out that most
> >pilots are installing in the wing instead. He said it's a much easier
> >installation in the wing if you do so during construction.
> >Joe Larson
>
> Joe. I don't know if you're going to put it in the four or six. I've got
> one in my RV-6 and it is mounted under the passenger seat. The unit works
> very well. I intend to put the servo in the wing on the six that I'm
> building now. When mounting under the seat, location becomes critical
> because of the great for-aft movement of the stick. When mounting in the
> wing, you have less movement of the aileron push tube to contend with and
> installation and service access could be made a little easier.
> Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
Joe
I think that where ever you mount it you will be happy with the way
it works. I have mine under the seat and hooked up to my Flybuddy
GPS and it works great.
Bob
Did you hook your push pull rod up to the bottom of the passenger
stick or to the bottom of the pilot stick? I hooked mine up to
the pilot side and this does away with some of the problems of
the fore-aft movement of the controls. I also made a little
opening in the cover that goes over the servo, with a little cover that
goes over this opening so that If I need to get to the clutch for
adjustments I can do so with out takeing it out of the airplane.
Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS first flight July 14,1989 :-)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mikel(at)dimensional.com |
>Does anyone have any info/opinions on "Snowline" Welding & Fabrication? They
>make SS exhaust systems for RV's.
>
>Apparently these are the ones that ACS sells, and they have an ad in
>"Kitplanes".
>
>I've only heard good things about the Vetterman exhaust, but I've had one on
>back order with Van's for quite a while now, and they have no idea when
>they'll be in stock.
>
>Thanks,
>Ed Bundy
>ebundy2620(at)aol.com
>
Hey, Ed: Having seen several exhaust systems Vetterman's is definitly worth
waiting for. Why don't you contact him directly:
Larry Vetterman: 303-932-0561
snail: 7216 S. Pierce Court
Littleton, CO 80123
Michael
mikel(at)dimensional.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mikel(at)dimensional.com |
| Subject: | Re: restrictor fittings |
>
>>I have a question about this. (Big surprise, huh?) I assume that for a -4
>>fitting you use a -4 rivet. But the rivet head sticks out around the
>>perimeter of the flared fitting. Won't that interfere with the sealing of
>>the tube? Or does the tube/rivet area "mash" itself to fit? (sounds
>>doubtful)
>>
>>Sigh,
>>Ed Bundy
OK: here's another method: I used a SMALL piece of brass rod (hobby store)
and drilled a 1/16 hole in the middle. I then drilled the aluminum fitting
3/16 and slipped the brass rod in for a nice tight fit.
Michael
mikel(at)dimensioanl.com
RV-4 232 SQ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mikel(at)dimensional.com |
| Subject: | Re: plexiglass cracks. |
>There was a discussion here a few months ago about the repairing of
>plexiglass cracks.
YIKES!! This is like talking about hemorrhoids: maybe if you don't think
about it you won't get them. As I was POPPING on my canopy last week (ok
here we go gonna pull another rivet oh please oh please OH! this makes
me nervous) I was thinking that I hadn't seen too many repaired canopies in
all the RV's I'd seen :>) which means (maybe) it isn't that common a
problem. Have many listers had a canopy go bad AFTER installation?? I
probably spent too much time polishing the edges and even polishing the
holes but seems like time well spent. Course, I fit and filed and refit
making sure all the holes had ample clearance and, as things usually go, as
I was popping the rivets in, the LAST TWO HOLES to get a rivet needed some
enlargement. :>\
Michael
mikel(at)dimensional.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Drew" <noeldrew(at)iafrica.com> |
Greeted Jon in Durban, South Africa last night at 10:37 pm at the end of
his 12 hour leg across the Indian Ocean. He departed the island of Mauritius
at10:30 yesterday morning after being held up by some paper work.
He landed with more fuel in his tanks than my standard RV6 can carry
and looking as though he had been flying for fun.
He will spend a few days flying aroung South Africa before leaving
the continent of Africa at Walvis Bay in Namibia en route for
Ascension Island and Brazil. He will be in Oshkosh again this year
carrying the Australian flag and will deservedly earn the title of the
first to fly both ways around the world. And in a RV!
We have helped him feed and water his steed which is in excellent
condition and will wish him bon voyage tomorrow morning.
Noel Drew
noeldrew(at)iafrica.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jerryflyrv(at)village.yvv.com> |
aol.com!EBundy2620(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
> Does anyone have any info/opinions on "Snowline" Welding & Fabrication? They
> make SS exhaust systems for RV's.
>
> Apparently these are the ones that ACS sells, and they have an ad in
> "Kitplanes".
>
> I've only heard good things about the Vetterman exhaust, but I've had one on
> back order with Van's for quite a while now, and they have no idea when
> they'll be in stock.
>
> Thanks,
> Ed Bundy
> ebundy2620(at)aol.com
Ed
Can't you order direct from Larry Vettermen? Thats the way I got mine,
maybe things have changed in the last couple of years.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Edward Cole <emcole(at)cris.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fwd: First flight of N36WC |
aol.com!WCannon313(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
> ---------------------
> Forwarded message:
> Subj: First flight of N36WC
> Date: 96-06-30 23:56:23 EDT
> From: WCannon313
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
> Wanted to take a moment to announce the first flight of RV-6 N36WC on 6/29/96
> at Boeing field in Seattle. It was a beautiful 60 degree calm morning, the
> taxi testing was done, the FAA man had paid a visit, and I couldn't think of
> any reason not to fly the sucker. Everything went exactly as planned and I
> orbited the field at about 1500' (under the TCA) for 15 minutes and then
> brought it in for a landing, absolutely no problems!! It's now a day later I
> have five hours and half a dozen landings and things couldn't be sweeter. The
> 0-360 with a constant speed provides great climb performance, I haven't wrung
> out the top end yet but I'm sure I'll be pleased.
>
> Stick with it!!!
>
> Walt Cannon
> N36WC
> Seattle, WA.Nice Going Walt! I envy you. Good Luck with the future flights.
Ed Cole
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Krahenbuhl, Edward" <krahenbe(at)hono.PREL.hawaii.edu> |
UNSUBSRIBE RV-LIST KRAHENBE(at)PREL.HAWAII.EDU
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Navaid Devices |
>Bob
>Did you hook your push pull rod up to the bottom of the passenger
>stick or to the bottom of the pilot stick? I hooked mine up to
>the pilot side and this does away with some of the problems of
>the fore-aft movement of the controls. I also made a little
>opening in the cover that goes over the servo, with a little cover that
>goes over this opening so that If I need to get to the clutch for
>adjustments I can do so with out takeing it out of the airplane.
>
>Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS first flight July 14,1989 :-)
Jerry, I went from the servo to the co-pilot stick. I can sure see that
going to the other side would reduce the throw of the servo to stick push
rod. Did you have to enlarge any areas in the seat ribs for clearance of
the servo push rod? The cover idea sounds like a great one, also. I'll
have to give your idea some thought but am still leaning towards a wing
installation. Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ron Caldwell <74504.1365(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Arlington Fly-In |
Are their any plans to hold a RV builders/flyers chat session at Arlington WA?
I will be flying my Piper Cherokee from Salt Lake City and would really like to
meet and share experiences. I'm the group leader for the Salt Lake RV Builders
Group (consisting of 29 builders). My group members are expecting me to bring
back lots of RV info and pictures.
Ron Caldwell
74504.1365(at)compuserve.com
RV6A (Just beginning the Wings)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: Arlington Fly-In |
>Are their any plans to hold a RV builders/flyers chat session at Arlington WA?
>I will be flying my Piper Cherokee from Salt Lake City and would really like to
>meet and share experiences. I'm the group leader for the Salt Lake RV
Builders
>Group (consisting of 29 builders). My group members are expecting me to bring
>back lots of RV info and pictures.
>
>Ron Caldwell
>74504.1365(at)compuserve.com
>RV6A (Just beginning the Wings)
>
>
>
The RV Bunch will be parked in the Southwest area of the field. Stop at our
hospitality tent and we'll show you around. Also, we're having a
hamburger/salmon BBQ on Saturday afternoon. All RVer's invited; suggested
$3.00 donation to help cover costs.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jpl(at)showpg.mn.org (Joe Larson) |
> Can't you order direct from Larry Vettermen? Thats the way I got mine,
> maybe things have changed in the last couple of years.
I talked to Larry a couple of months ago -- he donated an exhaust system to
the Minnesota Wing's builder's forum. At that time, he said that he would
continue to handle direct orders, but suggested that Van's would be able to
keep them in stock better than he could.
-Joe
--
Joe Larson jpl(at)showpg.mn.org 612-591-1037
Showpage Software, Inc. http://www.wavefront.com/~showpg
6121 St. Croix Ave. N.
Golden Valley, Mn 55422 Future RV-6A pilot.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GHLX34A(at)prodigy.com (MR GEORGE T KILISHEK) |
| Subject: | Fwd: First flight of N36WC |
Walt:
Congratulations and best wishes. I know how much effort has gone
into this achievement, and I'm very happy for you.
George Kilishek
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JamesCone(at)aol.com |
There is a reason that Vetterman is back ordered. He just makes the best
exhaust systems there are. Call Larry: 303-932-0561 and ask him to see if he
can move up your delivery date.
Jim Cone
jamescone(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | arnia(at)iav.is (Arni Arnason) |
UNSUBSRIBE RV-LIST arnia(at)iav.is
______________________________
| =C1rni =C1rnason |
| T=F6lvudeild |
/ ) =CDslenskir a=F0alverktakar ( \
/ /| Keflav=EDkurflugv=F6llur |\ \
_( ( | =CDsland | ) )_
(((\ \| /-) S=EDmi 421-4200 (-\ |/ /)))
(\\\\ \_/ / arnia(at)iav.is \ \_/ ////)
\ /________________________\ /
\ / \ /
\___/ F=E6st rabbabar sulta \____/
=ED Noregi?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | cn755(at)freenet.carleton.ca (Catherine Lamport) |
Has anyone used a MacCauley B2D 34C211 prop with an O-360 engine
in a 6 or 6A. If so, is there a problem with spinner or cowling
fit. Also any general comments about this combination are
welcome. Thanks!
Dale Lamport
Nepean, Ontario, Canada
cn755(at)freenet.carleton.ca
Working on Fuselage of 6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cecil Hatfield / Fourstar Printing <cecil(at)alto1.altonet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Banquet at Oshkosh |
I cleared this with Tom at Van's today.
I will arrive an hour early with some signs to reserve space for people from
this RV list at the Banquet Sunday evening at Oshkosh.
I need to get a feel for how much to reserve. 5 spaces - half a table - two
tables or what. It always sells out it seems so I need to be accurate.
Soooooooo
Please let me know If you plan to attend the Banquet and we can start
putting some faces to these names on the list.
Thanks,
Cecil Hatfield
cecil(at)altonet.com
(805) 375-2660
Fax;(805) 375-2663
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Royce Craven <roycec(at)ozemail.com.au> |
Anyone know anything about an engine supplier call T.S.Smith??
Apparently I need a core 0-320
Anyone know of a cheap core I could buy to supply to this company?
Royce Craven
royce(at)ozemail.com.au
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
I'm a little behind the power curve on this one. I think that I will attend
during the first weekend however I have no place to sleep and camping is
O.U.T. out.
Any suggestions.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fwd: First flight of N36WC |
Welcome to the club. Don't even try to wipe that smile off your face...you
never seem to loose the RV grin.
Best of luck with your new toy.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DMusgrave(at)swri.edu |
| Subject: | Re: Banquet at Oshkosh |
charset=US-ASCII
Cecil Hatfield / Fourstar Printing | Date: | Jul 03, 1996 |
| From: | Lewis <lewisjw(at)hqsocom.af.mil> |
Subject: T.W. Smith Engine Co.
T.W. Smith Engine Co. has an excellent reputation. I've been flying one of
their rebuilt engines for 10 plus years withou a glitch. Joe
lewisjw(at)hqsocom.af.mil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WStucklen(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: plexiglass cracks. |
<< YIKES!! This is like talking about hemorrhoids: maybe if you don't think
about it you won't get them. As I was POPPING on my canopy last week (ok
here we go gonna pull another rivet oh please oh please OH! this makes
me nervous) I was thinking that I hadn't seen too many repaired canopies in
all the RV's I'd seen :>) which means (maybe) it isn't that common a
problem. Have many listers had a canopy go bad AFTER installation?? I
probably spent too much time polishing the edges and even polishing the
holes but seems like time well spent. Course, I fit and filed and refit
making sure all the holes had ample clearance and, as things usually go, as
I was popping the rivets in, the LAST TWO HOLES to get a rivet needed some
enlargement. :>\
Michael
mikel(at)dimensional.com
>>
No cracks in mine! I had the same apprehensions about pop riveting the
plexi into place, so I used nuts, screws, & washers instead. Besides, this
leaves you a place to attach the apolstery......
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rust47rg(at)one.net |
>I'm a little behind the power curve on this one. I think that I will attend
>during the first weekend however I have no place to sleep and camping is
>O.U.T. out.
>
>Any suggestions.
>
>Gary Corde
>RV-6 N211GC
>
Gary:
Learn to love camping or start planning for next year.:)
Regards:
Rusty Gossard
N47RG RV-4 Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rust47rg(at)one.net |
>
>
>Anyone know anything about an engine supplier call T.S.Smith??
>Apparently I need a core 0-320
>Anyone know of a cheap core I could buy to supply to this company?
>
>Royce Craven
>royce(at)ozemail.com.au
>
Royce:
Are you refering to T.W. Smith Engine Co. in Cincinnati. I hangar just down
the row from them at Lunken Airport. They have a good reputation around here
and have always been a help to me. They stay very busy so that tells me they
are doing something right. Everyone I know that is flying behind one of
their engines seems to be happy. As far as a core....can't help on that one.
Regards:
Rusty Gossard
N47RG RV-4 Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EBundy2620(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: restrictor fittings |
<< OK: here's another method: I used a SMALL piece of brass rod (hobby store)
and drilled a 1/16 hole in the middle. I then drilled the aluminum fitting
3/16 and slipped the brass rod in for a nice tight fit.
>>
That sounds promising. However, considering the engine can put out up to
100psi, what keeps the brass rod from being pushed out of the fitting and
into the hose?
Ed Bundy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rod Kimmell <rkimmell(at)teleport.com> |
| Subject: | Oshkosk Accomodations Info |
For those still looking for housing at Oshkosh, I
suggest you call their housing hotline, 414 235-3007.
The hotline has information of private residences and at last
check they indicated there is always private homes
that have a room or two to rent.
Also, check out the web page:
http://airspacemag.com/EAA/EAA_Housing.html
See you there..
Rod
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Johnson <rvgasj(at)popmail.mcs.net> |
| Subject: | Variprime Warning, Did You Know ... |
I talked to one of the chief chemists today at Dupont and I got shocking
news. I variprimed the inside of the wing and all my structures thinking I
was protecting them from corrosion. Not ! According to Dupont, variprime
presents no moisture barrier unlike othe zinc chromate primers. Therefore,
if you do not top coat the variprime with a sealer (called Dupont variseal
etc.), you have virtually no corrosion protection. Unfortunately, most of
the RVers I know didn't. Based on this information, I wished I would have
stuck with one of the other zinc chromate primers. Additionally, if you want
a real surprise, try taking any magic marker lines that are on top of the
variprime off with isopropyl alchol. The variprime will easily rub all off
(And that after the variprime had dried for one month)! When I tried that
with standard aircraft zinc chromate primer (in spray cans), it did not come
off. Hope this helps anybody from making a mistake like I did. Any comments
to Scott Johnson rvgasj(at)mcs.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Louis Willig <larywil(at)Op.Net> |
>I'm a little behind the power curve on this one. I think that I will attend
>during the first weekend however I have no place to sleep and camping is
>O.U.T. out.
>
>Any suggestions.
>
>Gary Corde
>RV-6 N211GC
>
Gary, Call me if you absolutly can not find a place to stay. I have a room
in Appleton over the weekend. It has two beds.
Louis I Willig
Penn Valley, PA
(610) 668-4964
P.S. It'll cost a ride in an RV-4 or RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rion Bourgeois <RION(at)worldnet.att.net> |
>
>
>Anyone know anything about an engine supplier call T.S.Smith??
>Apparently I need a core 0-320
>Anyone know of a cheap core I could buy to supply to this company?
>
>Royce Craven
>royce(at)ozemail.com.au
>
>
In your dreams, and somebody else just put a deposit on it. Rion.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Smidler <smidler(at)dcwi.com> |
Catherine Lamport wrote:
>
> Has anyone used a MacCauley B2D 34C211 prop with an O-360 engine
> in a 6 or 6A. If so, is there a problem with spinner or cowling
> fit. Also any general comments about this combination are
> welcome. Thanks!
>
> Dale Lamport
> Nepean, Ontario, Canada
> cn755(at)freenet.carleton.ca
> Working on Fuselage of 6A
John Marshal in Indianapolis has a MacCauley prop on an 0-360 and had to
add several bumps onto the cowling to get it to fit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Smidler <smidler(at)dcwi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: I0-360 in RV-6 |
HELP.....
I have a chance to get a good deal on an IO-360, slant valve, 200 hp
engine at a decent price (if there is such a thing). Has anyone out
their put one into an RV-6 and what kind of hassels did you have doing
it? It is a little wider than an o-360 so will it fit into the cowling?
It has the siemies mags, will they interfer with the engine mount?
How was your weight and balance?
Please don't respond that the RV-6 is not set up for this engine, I know
what Van recomends. Would anyone trade me a comparable 180 HP O-360 for
it if I did buy it?
Frank Smidler
N96FS reserved
smidler(at)dcwi.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | inet(at)intellisys.net (brian whatcott) |
| Subject: | Re: restrictor fittings |
>
><< OK: here's another method: I used a SMALL piece of brass rod (hobby store)
> and drilled a 1/16 hole in the middle. I then drilled the aluminum fitting
> 3/16 and slipped the brass rod in for a nice tight fit.
> >>
>
>That sounds promising. However, considering the engine can put out up to
>100psi, what keeps the brass rod from being pushed out of the fitting and
>into the hose?
>
>Ed Bundy
>
>
Sounds like a fair comment. 100 psi on that area amounts to a max force under
3 lbs. Hopefully, the fitting will stop it at a shoulder.
brian
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: I0-360 in RV-6 |
>HELP.....
>
>I have a chance to get a good deal on an IO-360, slant valve, 200 hp
>engine at a decent price (if there is such a thing). Has anyone out
>their put one into an RV-6 and what kind of hassels did you have doing
>it? It is a little wider than an o-360 so will it fit into the cowling?
> It has the siemies mags, will they interfer with the engine mount?
>How was your weight and balance?
>
>Please don't respond that the RV-6 is not set up for this engine, I know
>what Van recomends. Would anyone trade me a comparable 180 HP O-360 for
>it if I did buy it?
>
>Frank Smidler
>N96FS reserved
>smidler(at)dcwi.com
>
>
If you can get it at a 'decent' price go for it. If nothing else, you can
save it for your RV-8 project. That engine is said to cost about $10,000
more than an O-360 180 HP. I'm sure you won't lose assuming you make a good
deal on it.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jerryflyrv(at)village.yvv.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Variprime Warning, Did You Know ... |
Scott Johnson wrote:
>
> I talked to one of the chief chemists today at Dupont and I got shocking
> news. I variprimed the inside of the wing and all my structures thinking I
> was protecting them from corrosion. Not ! According to Dupont, variprime
> presents no moisture barrier unlike othe zinc chromate primers. Therefore,
> if you do not top coat the variprime with a sealer (called Dupont variseal
> etc.), you have virtually no corrosion protection. Unfortunately, most of
> the RVers I know didn't. Based on this information, I wished I would have
> stuck with one of the other zinc chromate primers. Additionally, if you want
> a real surprise, try taking any magic marker lines that are on top of the
> variprime off with isopropyl alchol. The variprime will easily rub all off
> (And that after the variprime had dried for one month)! When I tried that
> with standard aircraft zinc chromate primer (in spray cans), it did not come
> off. Hope this helps anybody from making a mistake like I did. Any comments
> to Scott Johnson rvgasj(at)mcs.com
>
Scott (damm, the primer thing again)
Nonsense!!!! the chemists will tell you anything to sell you more
high priced paint. This story has been going around for years.
First I assume you are going to seal any primer that is exposed
to the outside.
When I do a condition inspection on my airplane and take everything
apart I see no signs of a corrosion, some of the parts have been
primed for nine years, and in the wet Northwest at that. I just hate to
see a statement made that each of us that used Variprime made a mistake
when it just is not so. Some of the 4130 parts on the inside of my
airplane have only Variprime on them and they still show no signs of
corrosion or rust. There may be better primers and there may be worse but Veriprime
is not a mistake.
Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS first flight July 14, 1989 :-) (still no corrosion)
P.S. Are you mixing two parts per instructions?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mikel(at)dimensional.com |
| Subject: | Re: Variprime Warning, Did You Know ... |
>I talked to one of the chief chemists today at Dupont and I got shocking
>news. I variprimed the inside of the wing and all my structures thinking I
>was protecting them from corrosion. Not ! According to Dupont, variprime
>presents no moisture barrier unlike othe zinc chromate primers. Therefore,
>if you do not top coat the variprime with a sealer (called Dupont variseal
>etc.), you have virtually no corrosion protection. Unfortunately, most of
>the RVers I know didn't. Based on this information, I wished I would have
>stuck with one of the other zinc chromate primers. Additionally, if you want
>a real surprise, try taking any magic marker lines that are on top of the
>variprime off with isopropyl alchol. The variprime will easily rub all off
>(And that after the variprime had dried for one month)! When I tried that
>with standard aircraft zinc chromate primer (in spray cans), it did not come
>off. Hope this helps anybody from making a mistake like I did. Any comments
>to Scott Johnson rvgasj(at)mcs.com
>
>
>Great...my insides are VeriPrime city............
Michael
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: restrictor fittings |
>
><< OK: here's another method: I used a SMALL piece of brass rod (hobby store)
> and drilled a 1/16 hole in the middle. I then drilled the aluminum fitting
> 3/16 and slipped the brass rod in for a nice tight fit.
> >>
>
>That sounds promising. However, considering the engine can put out up to
>100psi, what keeps the brass rod from being pushed out of the fitting and
>into the hose?
>
>Ed Bundy
>
>
what I did was to thread the fitting for a brass bolt that I had. I then
drilled the bolt with a restrictor hole. Tighten the bolt into place and
cut off the head; no chance of it working its way free from that.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mikel(at)dimensional.com |
| Subject: | Re: restrictor fittings |
>
><< OK: here's another method: I used a SMALL piece of brass rod (hobby store)
> and drilled a 1/16 hole in the middle. I then drilled the aluminum fitting
> 3/16 and slipped the brass rod in for a nice tight fit.
> >>
>
>That sounds promising. However, considering the engine can put out up to
>100psi, what keeps the brass rod from being pushed out of the fitting and
>into the hose?
>
>Ed Bundy
The fact that the flaired end hole and the brass rod is now a little bit
bigger than the fitting it is being fit into!!! "No room!! No room!!" The
Mad Hatter
Michael
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DMCooke <dmcooke(at)rand.nidlink.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Variprime Warning, Did You Know ... |
Scott Johnson wrote:
According to Dupont, variprime
> presents no moisture barrier unlike othe zinc chromate primers. Therefore,
> if you do not top coat the variprime with a sealer (called Dupont variseal
> etc.), you have virtually no corrosion protection.
Hey Scott,
I used Variprime on the main spar and am using Marhyde on the rest of
the riveted interfaces. I wonder if the same "no moisture barrier"
property also applies to Marhyde.
Probably the best thing to do is construct the airplane, paint the
outside so that it is pretty and fog the interior every couple of years
if you are worried about moisture and corrosion. Some Cessna 150s have
been flying for forty years with no interior protection at all. I have
seen some of these old planes with no sign of corrosion and I have seen
some later models with lots of corrosion.
I believe it all depends on how you maintain your airplane and the
environment in which you normaly operate the craft. So, for many of us,
there is probably no need to do the interior priming. (Except for the
cabin. It must be pretty of course.) :-)
Happy 4th. Have a blast.
Dave Cooke
dmcooke(at)rand.nidlink.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: restrictor fittings |
OK here's another way to restrict oil /fuel pressure sender hoses. Use a
steel AN fitting, solder the hole shut and drill to whatever size you choose.
Todd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | sburch(at)norfolk.infi.net (stan burchett) |
I'm starting a -6A fuse, in a partnership. Need mostly good used hand
tools.. Pneumatic with regulator, swivel fitting, squeezer with heads,
paint gun, drill, and rt.angle attachment. 3/16 and 1/8 cleco fasteners and
pliers, R and L snips, spacer fan, dimpler, straight, flush and offset
rivet sets, bucking bars, back plate, straight edge, drilled deburrers and
any other appropriate goodies, including new drill bit#s 41,40,40 long,
30,30 long,12,3/16 and 1/4. Also a bench model band saw. If you have any or
all, that are looking for a good home..please send list and prices > my
email or 757-867-7244. Thank you.
Stan from Yorktown VA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dennis Trusty <dtrusty(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | RV-6 Empennage and Wing Kit For Sale |
I have a completed empennage kit(needs mass balancing), and a wing kit with
both spars built. One leading edge and fuel tank(not sealed) are completed
and the top skins are drilled, deburred and dimpled for one wing. Project
includes a steel wing jig. $4300.
I haven't quit. Have purchased a complete kit with lot's more done. Will be
in Oshkosh a year+ sooner.
Dennis Trusty
PS Visit the home page for EAA 983, Granbury,TX at
http://www.flash.net/~dtrusty/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Derrick L. Aubuchon" <n184da(at)cctrap.com> |
| Subject: | Cripming question |
Hello fellow RV'ers.....
Question for the group:
How does everyone crimp #2 & #8 terminals without spending several
hundred $$$$ for a special tool??
A friend of mine made a "crimper" thats works in his bench-vise.....but
I was curious to see how others tackled this detail.
Thanks in advance....
Derrick L. Aubuchon
RV4 N184DA... in its seemingly endless finishing stages!!!
n184da(at)cctrap.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cripming question |
>How does everyone crimp #2 & #8 terminals without spending several
>hundred $$$$ for a special tool??
>A friend of mine made a "crimper" thats works in his bench-vise.....but
>I was curious to see how others tackled this detail.
>Derrick L. Aubuchon
Derrick, I have a friend that works for REA (rural electric). I cut,
stripped the insulation and indexed the terminal to the wire and took
everything over to his house. He had an assortment of crimping tools and we
found one that worked. You might also try electrical supply houses. I
imagine you could find someone who would be glad to crimp the terminals if
you brought the wire & terminals to their place of business.
Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cripming question |
Derrick;
I've seen it done with a flare tool. The type that is two bars with the
insides a half of the flare for a tube. They are usually formed with ridges
inside of it. Place these in the vice and crank down on it. Seems to work.
I did some and they were ok. Eventually, some one was here with one of those
high dollar tools and we redid them.
John D
John Darby RV6 N61764 flying
johnd@our-town.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Variprime Warning, Did You Know ... |
Scott:
Unless you are planning on dunking your plane in the ocean (or isopropyl
alcohol) and then leaving it tied down for a year I really doubt you'll
ever have to worry about corrosion. We RVers seem to have a particular
thing about primers (I include myself), and have a tendency to forget
how many 30 and 40 year old Spam Cans there are out there, many of which
have spent years tied down on the ramp, and are still going strong with
no primer at all on the interior.
Randall Henderson
randall(at)edt.com
RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EBundy2620(at)aol.com |
< Anyone know anything about an engine supplier call T.S.Smith??
>Apparently I need a core 0-320
>Anyone know of a cheap core I could buy to supply to this company? >
Good luck with the core. I spent about 6 months looking for a runout to
rebuild and couldn't find anything that was complete for less than $5500.
Add approximately $10k to that for a "real" (i.e. total) rebuild and the new
Lyc's from Van's made a lot of sense.
-- Ed Bundy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | csanchez(at)world.std.com (Cheryl Sanchez) |
| Subject: | Exhaust for sale |
I noticed that some builders are waiting for exhaust systems.
I have a Larry Vetterman exhaust for sale. It is stainless. It is the
crossover style for an O-320 6A. I have the nuts washers and gaskets
that Larry provides, even the instructions. It has never been used.
This exhaust came from the 6A project I bought. I removed the
320 and put on a 360.
I will sell it for $500 and I pay the shipping.
Cheryl Sanchez
csanchez(at)world.std.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Boris Robinson <smbr(at)inetw.net> |
| Subject: | wing closure - final riveting |
I am almost finished riveting the top skins on the wing, which I've done
first using the long back rivet set. I will close the wings soon, riveting
on the bottom skins. Doing a procedure test with clecos I found that there's
a lot force and bending required of the skin in order to buck some of the
rivets. I'm worried about deforming the skin.
My question is: Considering that the bottom of the rear spar flange points
forward, what is a good procedure to follow?
1. Rivet aft to front (and root to tip) which will give me more room through
the larger forward lightening holes to reach the final rivets in each bay?
Or, ???
Thanks in advance.
Boris Robinson
smbr(at)inetw.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: Cripming question |
>Derrick;
>I've seen it done with a flare tool. The type that is two bars with the
>insides a half of the flare for a tube. They are usually formed with ridges
>inside of it. Place these in the vice and crank down on it. Seems to work.
>I did some and they were ok. Eventually, some one was here with one of those
>high dollar tools and we redid them.
>John D
>John Darby RV6 N61764 flying
>johnd@our-town.com
>
>
>
That's a good solution, too. Gives me another idea; how about using the
crimping tool normally used for stainless steel aircraft cable. You'd have
to use one of the larger sizes but it should work perfectly.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: Cripming question |
>Hello fellow RV'ers.....
>
>Question for the group:
>
>How does everyone crimp #2 & #8 terminals without spending several
>hundred $$$$ for a special tool??
>A friend of mine made a "crimper" thats works in his bench-vise.....but
>I was curious to see how others tackled this detail.
>
>Thanks in advance....
>
>Derrick L. Aubuchon
>
>RV4 N184DA... in its seemingly endless finishing stages!!!
>
>n184da(at)cctrap.com
>
>
My biggest problem was finding a tool small enough to crimp #2 and #8
terminals. Actually wasn't quite that bad; I just put a large drill bit
inside my Triplex crimpers. Triplex, for those not in the electrical trade,
is the wire (usually three wires together) that hang from the pole to your
house and provide the power to run your air compressors and other essential
items. Sometimes it does help to be in the Electrical Utility business.
Your buddy who made a crimper for use in his vise had the right idea. You
need to not only crimp the connector but also swage the copper wires inside
the connector. They must be 'one' with each other. That takes a _lot_ of
pressure. The crimper we use for triplex has a handle about 20 inches long
and it take a fair amount of muscle to operate.
I know some advise against soldering connectors but I soldered the
connectors after crimping them. To avoid having the wire break at the
solder joint I used a heavy duty heat shrink sleeve around the connector and
extending back onto the wire about 3/4". This stops the wire from flexing
and breaking at the solder joint. The heat shrink that I used is much
thicker than normal and may not be available in the normal outlets. I also
use it for my wrench handles.
This is what I did. Don't know if it helps you any but maybe it'll give you
or someelse ideas.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: wing closure - final riveting |
>I am almost finished riveting the top skins on the wing, which I've done
>first using the long back rivet set. I will close the wings soon, riveting
>on the bottom skins. Doing a procedure test with clecos I found that there's
>a lot force and bending required of the skin in order to buck some of the
>rivets. I'm worried about deforming the skin.
>
>My question is: Considering that the bottom of the rear spar flange points
>forward, what is a good procedure to follow?
>
>1. Rivet aft to front (and root to tip) which will give me more room through
>the larger forward lightening holes to reach the final rivets in each bay?
>
>Or, ???
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>Boris Robinson
>smbr(at)inetw.net
>
>
I've included an article from the 'Best of Puget Sound RVators' that kind of
addresses this issue. As far as deforming the skin, I was surprised at how
far you can bend the skin without causing any harm.
Boris used the 'back rivet' method but I can't see how that can be done on
the bottom skin after the top skin is in place. Of course, that is why we
do the top skin first. It's only our snoopy friends that check the bottom
of the wing for mistakes. My biggest and most obvious 'boo-boo' in on the
top of the wing but since they all look on the bottom they never notice it. :-)
DO YOU WANT A WING WITHOUT ANY POP RIVETS?
by Jim Morgan
Puget Sound RVators
I had been thinking how to rivet the main skins on without using any pop
rivets. John Ammeter and I talked about this on several occasions and had
heard of someone who had put in the root ribs last after the skins have been
riveted in place. This allows you to use driven rivets on each of the root
ribs.
The way to do this is to first rivet in place all the ribs with flanges
facing toward the wingtip. Make sure that the rivets on the bottom side of
the rear spar where the aileron goes are flush rivets so that the aileron
gap seal can be riveted in. Do not rivet in the root ribs that are facing
inboard at this time but go ahead and drill and cleco them for later
installation of rivets and bolts.
After you have drilled, deburred, and dimpled the skins and ribs, and done
all the other things you need to do before you rivet the main skins on,
check it again; this is your last chance before closing. When riveting on
the main skins the thing to remember is not to rivet the skins to the root
ribs that face inboard. Now you can take out the inboard ribs one at a
time; this may take a little doing as it is a tight fit. Leave in place the
rib next to the first outboard facing rib. With these ribs removed you have
the room to reach in and buck the root ribs one at a time. Be careful to
watch the sequence of rivets; don't leave any rivets out because you won't
be able to buck them once the next rib is installed.
With care you will have a wing without any pop rivets even in the wing root
area.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wbpace(at)adnc.com (Bill Pace) |
Parts Is Parts:
I've been inventoring my wing kit. Van's has this bad habit of labeling
the small parts "Bag nnn" without explaining what's in the bag. Now that's
no problem with most things such as rivets, bolts and the like, but how the
heck am I supposed to know what some of these items are? For example, what
the heck are those cone shaped things? And what are those small squares of
sheet metal for in one of the bags? I _assume_ that they are for the
aileron doubler plates, but I don't _like_ to assume anything!
I can deal with just taking it on faith that the bagged stuff is complete
(if I have an even number of items, that's a good sign) but I want to label
them in my storage cabinet accurately. I hate to guess and end up using the
wrong item, or worse, end up with extra hardware and wonder if I missed
something. Is there a standard reference around that will help me out -
preferably with pictures or drawings?
Are you listening Van's? It would surely be nice if you were a little more
detailed in the pick list on some of these more esoteric items.
Aging Rivets:
On a related matter, I have heard that rivets will age over time and that
"fresh" rivets are best. I'm on the slow-build plan - it has taken me 18
months to finish up the empennage kit due to other commitments in my life.
So should I avoid mixing my leftover empennage rivets with the new wing
hardware or is this short enough a period for it not to matter. At the
rate I'm going, I figure it will take 2-3 years to build the wings so this
might be a real issue if I try to use a 4 year old rivet near the end.
-----
Bill Pace The only expensive tool
wbpace(at)adnc.com is a cheap tool.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dennis Trusty <dtrusty(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | List of RV-list members and email addresses |
How would I obtain a list of all members and there email addresses.
Dennis
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: List of RV-list members and email addresses |
>How would I obtain a list of all members and there email addresses.
>
>Dennis
>
>
>
Why, do you want to send us a Christmas Card?? I'm not trying to be
argumentative but I already get unwanted advertisements, etc.
I find that I can get all the email return addresses I want or need by
following the List email exchanges.
If I want to make a mailing to all members I just send a message to the
RV-list; if I want to send a message to Elon or Bob Skinner I send them a
message privately.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Parts Is Parts |
You should have a list of what's in each bag. Even with that it
can be a bit difficult to figure out WHICH thing in bag XXX is
the widget and which is the gizmo, but by using the process of
elimination (I know THAT'S a widget, so the other thing must
be a gizmo) I've been able to figure it all out through the
fuselage kit.
If you don't have this piece of paper (it's not the pick list,
it's a separate one) call Van's and get it.
Randall Henderson
randall(at)edt.com
RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | frankv(at)pec.co.nz |
| Subject: | Re: Aging rivets: was Re: Parts Is Parts |
>Aging Rivets:
>On a related matter, I have heard that rivets will age over time and
>that "fresh" rivets are best. I'm on the slow-build plan - it has
>taken me 18 months to finish up the empennage kit due to other
>commitments in my life. So should I avoid mixing my leftover
>empennage rivets with the new wing hardware or is this short enough a
>period for it not to matter. At the rate I'm going, I figure it will
>take 2-3 years to build the wings so this might be a real issue if I
>try to use a 4 year old rivet near the end.
Keep 'em in your freezer, according to an ex-RAF engineer I know. He
reckoned that otherwise they should be used within 3 months. [How long
do they stay on Van's shelf, I wonder?]
If they have hardened (I think that's the potential problem), you can
heat (not sure how hot) then dunk them in cold water to freshen them
up again. As you can see, I'm not sure of the details, but I trust him
enough to keep all my rivets in the freezer until I need them. I
haven't felt the need to heat'n'cool them yet.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
frankv(at)pec.co.nz | "Knowledge=Power=Energy=Matter=Mass;
Frank van der Hulst | A good bookshop is just a genteel
Software Engineer | Black Hole that knows how to read".
PEC(NZ) Ltd (Cardax), Marton | Terry Pratchett, "Guards! Guards!"
http://www.pec.co.nz/~frankv/ |
--------------------------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fred Hiatt <hiatt001(at)gold.tc.umn.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Parts Is Parts |
Bill Pace wrote:
>
> Parts Is Parts:
>
> I've been inventoring my wing kit. Van's has this bad habit of labeling
> the small parts "Bag nnn" without explaining what's in the bag. Now that's
> no problem with most things such as rivets, bolts and the like, but how the
> heck am I supposed to know what some of these items are? For example, what
> the heck are those cone shaped things? And what are those small squares of
> sheet metal for in one of the bags? I _assume_ that they are for the
> aileron doubler plates, but I don't _like_ to assume anything!
>
> I can deal with just taking it on faith that the bagged stuff is complete
> (if I have an even number of items, that's a good sign) but I want to label
> them in my storage cabinet accurately. I hate to guess and end up using the
> wrong item, or worse, end up with extra hardware and wonder if I missed
> something. Is there a standard reference around that will help me out -
> preferably with pictures or drawings?
>
> Are you listening Van's? It would surely be nice if you were a little more
> detailed in the pick list on some of these more esoteric items.
>
> Aging Rivets:
>
> On a related matter, I have heard that rivets will age over time and that
> "fresh" rivets are best. I'm on the slow-build plan - it has taken me 18
> months to finish up the empennage kit due to other commitments in my life.
> So should I avoid mixing my leftover empennage rivets with the new wing
> hardware or is this short enough a period for it not to matter. At the
> rate I'm going, I figure it will take 2-3 years to build the wings so this
> might be a real issue if I try to use a 4 year old rivet near the end.
>
> -----
> Bill Pace The only expensive tool
> wbpace(at)adnc.com is a cheap tool.
Bill, Somehow when I opened up the paperwork on my wing kit I found a
complete list of all of Van's bags with the contents identified. If you
would like a copy of this list, send me your address or FAX number and I
will send you a copy.
Fred, hiatt001(at)gold.tc.umn.edu
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jpl(at)showpg.mn.org (Joe Larson) |
| Subject: | Re: Variprime Warning, Did You Know ... |
> >I talked to one of the chief chemists today at Dupont and I got shocking
> >news. I variprimed the inside of the wing and all my structures thinking I
> >was protecting them from corrosion. Not ! According to Dupont, variprime
> >presents no moisture barrier unlike othe zinc chromate primers.
> >Great...my insides are VeriPrime city............
>
> Michael
Yeah. Wouldn't you know -- I sprayed my wing spars just last night!
-J
--
Joe Larson jpl(at)showpg.mn.org 612-591-1037
Showpage Software, Inc. http://www.wavefront.com/~showpg
6121 St. Croix Ave. N.
Golden Valley, Mn 55422 Future RV-6A pilot.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gregory Young" <gyoung(at)Net1.Net> |
| Subject: | Re: Parts Is Parts |
I got a 3-4 page list in both the empenage and wing kits that listed the
contents of every bag for all kits. It's not in fromt of me but I think it
had prices for each bag. Search your paperwork and call Van's if it's not
there. BTW I think the cone things you're referring to are the aileron
push tube ends.
--
Greg Young
gyoung(at)net1.net
Citabria N90AV
RV-6 s/n 23070 - starting wings - ribs, ribs, ribs
----------
> From: Bill Pace <adnc.com!wbpace(at)matronics.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Parts Is Parts
> Date: Thursday, 1996 July, 04 16:14 PM
>
> Parts Is Parts:
>
> I've been inventoring my wing kit. Van's has this bad habit of labeling
> the small parts "Bag nnn" without explaining what's in the bag. Now
that's
> no problem with most things such as rivets, bolts and the like, but how
the
> heck am I supposed to know what some of these items are? For example,
what
> the heck are those cone shaped things? And what are those small squares
of
> sheet metal for in one of the bags? I _assume_ that they are for the
> aileron doubler plates, but I don't _like_ to assume anything!
>
> I can deal with just taking it on faith that the bagged stuff is
complete
> (if I have an even number of items, that's a good sign) but I want to
label
> them in my storage cabinet accurately. I hate to guess and end up using
the
> wrong item, or worse, end up with extra hardware and wonder if I missed
> something. Is there a standard reference around that will help me out -
> preferably with pictures or drawings?
>
> Are you listening Van's? It would surely be nice if you were a little
more
> detailed in the pick list on some of these more esoteric items.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EBundy2620(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Cripming question |
<< How does everyone crimp #2 & #8 terminals without spending several
hundred $$$$ for a special tool??
A friend of mine made a "crimper" thats works in his bench-vise.....but
I was curious to see how others tackled this detail. >>
I'm working on that right now myself. I did the #8's myself with the #10
crimper on my crimp tool. Worked fine. I made up all of the #2 cables and
taped the ends in place and took them to my local friendly FBO. They did
them for free. Of course I DO hangar and buy gas from them... I think most
places that do any major repair will have a crimp tool.
-- Ed Bundy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JRoss10612(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Variprime Warning, Did You Know ... |
Zinc Chromate works by exchanging ions as the paint ages. As a result, Zinc
Chromate has a life span that can be limited, due to the conditions of
exposure.
Veriprime does not have this limitation, and it is a self etching primer with
good adhesion. Perhaps it has limited moisture barrier capabilities, I don't
know. But there are spec sheets for the stuff. Two part epoxy primer will
have excellent moisture barrier specs, but it is fussy to use, more expensive
and probably requires more surface preparation. And I'm sure the adhesion
qualities are directly related to the surface preparation.
I'm sure Van's has considered all the above befor recommending Dupont
Veriprime. I'm interested in other folks input on this topic.
Jon Ross RV-8 on Long Island
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Kimmel <blpzx(at)pacifier.com> |
| Subject: | Instrument Panel Connundrum |
I have run into a real poser as I examine the three different versions =
of the instrument panel included in my RV-3 kit:
Version #1: The drawing on the print measures 9.5" top to bottom-- a =
measurement consistent with other dimensions on the drawing which I know =
to be correct.
Version #2: The value listed on the drawing for the above dimension is =
8.5"--, a result I find consistent in that there are several other =
incorrect dimensions on the same contour.
Version #3: The instrument panel blank included in the kit has an =
outline traced on it which measures 10.5" top to bottom.
Obviously, version #3 is the one most kit builders are going to go with, =
but I'd like confirmation. I don't have a finished RV-3 handy, or I'd =
measure it directly. Any comments? Is there anyone else out there =
building a sliding canopy RV-3?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leo Davies <leo(at)icn.su.OZ.AU> |
| Subject: | Re: Cripming question |
The right crimping tool usually makes a more reliable connection than kluged
setups, try and borrow the tool.
ld
>Derrick;
>I've seen it done with a flare tool. The type that is two bars with the
>insides a half of the flare for a tube. They are usually formed with ridges
>inside of it. Place these in the vice and crank down on it. Seems to work.
>I did some and they were ok. Eventually, some one was here with one of those
>high dollar tools and we redid them.
>John D
>John Darby RV6 N61764 flying
>johnd@our-town.com
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steve Mayer <72652.670(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Re: Aging rivets: was Re: Parts Is Parts |
Just received the latest "16 years of Rvator" book from VANS the other
day and found an article on page 11 where Van says that rivets don't harden
signifigantly in a 5-10 yr timeframe.
I guess that if you had freezer room it wouldn't hurt, but if one buys a
kit at a time, rivets shouldn't harden in our building timeframe. There are
plenty of things to worry about while building an RV, but that's not one of
them, IMHO.
Steve
RV-4 emp
(year 1 of my personal 10 year plan)
----- Forwarded Message -----
>TO: [unknown], INTERNET:RV-LIST(at)MATRONICS.COM
>FROM: INTERNET:frankv(at)pec.co.nz, INTERNET:frankv(at)pec.co.nz
>DATE: 7/4/96, 9:32 PM
>
>Re: RV-List: Aging rivets: was Re: Parts Is Parts
>>Aging Rivets:
>>On a related matter, I have heard that rivets will age over time and
>>that "fresh" rivets are best. I'm on the slow-build plan - it has
>>taken me 18 months to finish up the empennage kit due to other
>>commitments in my life. So should I avoid mixing my leftover
>>empennage rivets with the new wing hardware or is this short enough a
>>period for it not to matter. At the rate I'm going, I figure it will
>>take 2-3 years to build the wings so this might be a real issue if I
>>try to use a 4 year old rivet near the end.
>Keep 'em in your freezer, according to an ex-RAF engineer I know. He
>reckoned that otherwise they should be used within 3 months. [How long
>do they stay on Van's shelf, I wonder?]
>If they have hardened (I think that's the potential problem), you can
>heat (not sure how hot) then dunk them in cold water to freshen them
>up again. As you can see, I'm not sure of the details, but I trust him
>enough to keep all my rivets in the freezer until I need them. I
>haven't felt the need to heat'n'cool them yet.
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Harold Sutphin <hsutphin(at)magicnet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Crimping question |
A good trick and easy to use - try crushing in a vise with a bolt
proportionate to the terminal you are using, for example try a 3/16"
bolt to crimp a number 4 terminal. Put the wire and terminal in a vise
and squeeze with the bolt positioned (not the threaded part) on top of
the terminal sleeve. When you crush, the wires should all get bunched up
together (good contact) and "spread" (good mechanical bond) a little
where they come out of the sleeve. The bolt leaves a slightly rounded
indentation as a crimper might. The result is the same as if you
crimped. Try a pull test if you aren't sure.
Harold
RV-6A
>
> The right crimping tool usually makes a more reliable connection than kluged
> setups, try and borrow the tool.
>
> >Derrick;
> >I've seen it done with a flare tool. The type that is two bars with the
> >insides a half of the flare for a tube. They are usually formed with ridges
> >inside of it. Place these in the vice and crank down on it. Seems to work.
> >I did some and they were ok. Eventually, some one was here with one of those
> >high dollar tools and we redid them.
> >John D
> >John Darby RV6 N61764 flying
> >johnd@our-town.com
> >
> >
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Royce Craven <roycec(at)ozemail.com.au> |
| Subject: | Re: wing closure - final riveting |
John,
This is the method hat I intended to use. (I stole it from F.J.)
What I am worring about is that I built the rear spar before I read the
excellent Justice manual (Thanks F.J. if you're out there) and riveted the
area where the root ribs go with the shop head on the inside.
I riveted the top skins on and can get the root ribs out at the moment, but
as I rivet the skins I assume the rear spar will get harder to push down.
Should I just rivet the ribs in place before I start the lower skin and live
with the pop rivets.
I would prefer not to.
Any views from thoes in the know?
Royce Craven
roycec(at)ozemail.com.au
>
>I've included an article from the 'Best of Puget Sound RVators' that kind of
........
>
>DO YOU WANT A WING WITHOUT ANY POP RIVETS?
>by Jim Morgan
>Puget Sound RVators
>
........... can be riveted in. Do not rivet in the root ribs that are facing
>inboard at this time but go ahead and drill and cleco them for later
>installation of rivets and bolts.
.............
>
>John Ammeter
>ammeterj(at)seanet.com
>3233 NE 95th St
>Seattle WA, 98115 USA
>RV-6 N16JA
>Flying 5 years
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | spjohnsn(at)ix.netcom.com (Stephen Paul Johnson) |
| Subject: | Re: Variprime Warning, Did You Know ... |
>I'm sure Van's has considered all the above befor recommending Dupont
>Veriprime. I'm interested in other folks input on this topic.
>
>Jon Ross RV-8 on Long Island
>
I just got out my data sheet on Sherwin Williams wash primer P60 G2
which I understand is used by Van's. To quote:
___________________________________________________________________
Advantages:
Promotes Excellent adhesion
Serves as a tie coat over non-ferrous metals, ferrous metals and zinc
coated steel
P60 G2 is an excelent primer for many enamel topcoats such as (list
follows)
Non-photochemically reactive when reduced 150% with reducer R7 K 44.
____________________________________________________________________
Notice no claims are made regarding corrosion protection, for what it's
worth.
Steve Johnson
RV-8
spjohnsn(at)ix.netcom.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | joehine(at)mi.net (joehine) |
Thought I would just take a moment to wish all in the USA a happy forth of
July.
After our close call with the Quebec vote in October it seems we canadians
are finally starting to learn that a little patriotism is a good thing. I
saw more flags here on our July 1st holiday than I have seen in years.
Anyway, happy forth to all, and I hope you all have a happy, safe weekend.
Joe
joehine(at)mi.net Comp. 9, Site 8, RR#4
506-452-1072 Home Fredericton, NB
506-452-3495 Work Canada, E3B 4X5
Nobody on their death bed has ever been heard to say "Geeze,I wish I'd spent
more time at work"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | joehine(at)mi.net (joehine) |
| Subject: | Re: wing closure - final riveting |
>John,
> This is the method hat I intended to use. (I stole it from F.J.)
>What I am worring about is that I built the rear spar before I read the
>excellent Justice manual (Thanks F.J. if you're out there) and riveted the
>area where the root ribs go with the shop head on the inside.
>I riveted the top skins on and can get the root ribs out at the moment, but
>as I rivet the skins I assume the rear spar will get harder to push down.
>Should I just rivet the ribs in place before I start the lower skin and live
>with the pop rivets.
>I would prefer not to.
>
>Any views from thoes in the know?
>
>
>Royce Craven
>roycec(at)ozemail.com.au
Listers,
On my four wings I managed to get all of the root ribs rivited on without
using pop rivits at all. With difficulty and using a 10 year old with small
hand and arms as your bucking partner for the last few rivits toward the
trailing edge of the wing, it is possible to do this.
If the price is right I have an experianced now 12 year old I will rent out
for this job. You must pay the shipping and up keep while you have him. :)
cheers
Joe
joehine(at)mi.net Comp. 9, Site 8, RR#4
506-452-1072 Home Fredericton, NB
506-452-3495 Work Canada, E3B 4X5
Nobody on their death bed has ever been heard to say "Geeze,I wish I'd spent
more time at work"
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Parts Is Parts |
Try using some of Frank Justice's instructions. He specifies many times in
his version which bag the goodies are in. His instructions are more complete
and detailed than Van's. I try to combine his, Vans and Orndorff's and I
still screw up.....
Mal rvbildr(at)juno.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dan Boudro <dboudro(at)nmia.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wing closure - final riveting |
Joe,
If you've got a 10 year old that you could teach to buck you must
be doing something right. My hat is off to you.
Dan Boudro
RV-4 N9167Z
Albuquerque, NM
dboudro(at)nmia.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Crimping question |
>
> The right crimping tool usually makes a more reliable connection than kluged
> setups, try and borrow the tool.
>
I concur. Case in point: Ken Scott recently installed an electronic
ignition on his RV-6 (read about it in the last RVator) and had to
mess around a lot before he got all the kinks out. Most of the problems
were related to poor crimp connections. Really intermittent, un-fun
problems to try to track down.
Perhaps if you have a local builders group, or know several RV builders
in your area, you could go in on a good crimp tool or two. Come to think
of it, that would work well for OUR group -- I might bring that up at
the next meeting....
Another candidate for "group purchase" low-use/high expense tool would be a
37 degree flaring tool for those fuel lines....
Randall Henderson, RV-6
Editor, Home Wing Newsletter
http://www.edt.com/homewing
randall(at)edt.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Johnson <rvgasj(at)popmail.mcs.net> |
| Subject: | Paint Advise Needed ... |
I am using Randolph Aircraft Acrylic Laquer to paint my airplane. I have
used it many times spraying Piper Cherokees and have had good results. But I
always sprayed over the pre-existing Acrylic Laquer. Randolph Acrylic Laquer
was used on Pipers almost 20 years.
Heres my problem. I purchased the companies Epibond epoxy primer that they
say you can use with their Acrylic Laquer. We first coated the alumipreped
and alodined aluminum with this Randolph epoxy primer. We let it sit two
days as recommended, and then sprayed with the Randolph acrylic laquer. The
results were terrible ! We got a significant orange peel. To make sure it
wasnt the gun settings, we sprayed bare aluminum and got perfect results
with the laquer.
I called the chief chemist at Randolph and talked to the president of
Randolph paints and they gave me many suggestions which we tried with the
same results. I am so frustrated it is unbelievable. So we bought aircraft
stripper to take off the paint and the primer, and the primer won't come all
off. The president of Randolph aircraft paints has been unwilling to give me
an compensation even for the paint.
Since I have already bought the acrylic laquer I am contemplating doing the
following.
1.) Strip off as much primer as I can with aircraft stripper.
2.) Spray with Dupont Variprime.
3.) Top coat the Variprime with Dupont Variseal (spelling ?)
4.) Then spray the Randolph acrylic laquer.
If anybody can give me recommendations on what to do I would greatly
appreciate it. I certainly think Randolph support in standing behind their
products at this point is terrible. If they were in this state, I would be
filling out a small claims suit at this moment.
When I called Dupont, they said you can't use an epoxy primer with acrylic
laquer. Why does Randolph paints say you can ? (Yet both the chemist and
president at Randolph say you can.)
So frustrated and mad I could ... Scott Johnson
rvgasj(at)mcs.com
P.S. Any good information will be rewarded with a free dinner when we meet
at Oshkosh !!!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Russ Werner <russ(at)maui.net> |
| Subject: | Citabria dual in SEA area |
Anyone know where I might be able to get some dual in a Citabria in the SEA
area? I'll be on a layover there next week and need a checkout before I can
fly my new plane!
Reply to my email address rather than the list. Thanks,
Russ Werner, Maui Hawaii
russ(at)maui.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: wing closure - final riveting |
I honestly don't remember the sequence I used to close my wings, bnut I
followed the Orndorff tapes and with very few contortions and virtually no
assistant time was able to close both wings with zero pop rivets anywhere,
top or bottom. I later had to drill one rivet out that I wasn't happy with,
and had to replace it with a pop rivet, so there is definitely a critical
order to follow. George and Becki will usually steer you the best way; so I
recommend the tapes for guidance. I've since sold mine so I can't refer back
and tell you the sequence.
Bill Boyd
Enameling the Instrument Panel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Cecil Hatfield / Fourstar Printing <cecil(at)alto1.altonet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wing closure - final riveting |
John,
Last January while in Bakersfield talking with the RV family there, I was
told they solved that problem by making a special bucking bar. At the time
they drew it out for me but I didn't keep the sketch. If you haven't done
the top skins yet, another way is to do the top skin last and hide the pop
rivets with the black 'wing walk' material. I'm at this point myself and
still haven't decided which way to go. (I just today, finished the tanks).
I'm going to look hard at Oshkosh in a few weeks before I decide.
At Oshkosh, I'm also going to be looking at 'canopie fits' and try to
make up my mind about tip-up vs. sliding.
>.I riveted the top skins on and can get the root ribs out at the moment,
>but
>as I rivet the skins I assume the rear spar will get harder to push down.
>Should I just rivet the ribs in place before I start the lower skin and
>live
>with the pop rivets.
>I would prefer not to.
>Any views from thoes in the know?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | 1996 Northwest RV Fly-In |
Just wanted to report that the 1996 Northwest RV Fly-In
was a BIG success. 64 RVs flew in including Van and crew,
the weather was great, we gave some Young Eagle rides, had
some good food, and generally had a fun time all around.
Check out the "Home Wing Home Page" (http://www.edt.com/homewing)
for a complete report, including pictures.
Randall Henderson
Editor, Home Wing Newsletter
http://www.edt.com/homewing
randall(at)edt.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | NAEK31A(at)prodigy.com ( KURT L KEILBACH) |
| Subject: | rv 6 crash / Boulder , CO. |
Did anyone catch the news last Sunday ( CNN ) . A glider turned to
avoid a couple of airplanes and ended up hitting the prop of yet
another plane . The glider landed safely but the plane crashed upside
down . They showed a closeup which confirmed it was a 6 or 6a . Does
anyone have any knowledge of this ?
Thanks ,
Kurt Keilbach naek31a(at)prodigy.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hal & Suzanne Smith <smithhm(at)phoenix.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6 Empennage and Wing Kit For Sale |
Dennis Trusty wrote:
>
> I have a completed empennage kit(needs mass balancing), and a wing
I would be interested in your empennage if you are interested in
selling it separately. What is your asking price for just that part.
I live in Bellville, Tx., just outside of Houston.
Please reply to my e-mail address:
Hal Smith
smithhm(at)phoenix.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Derrick L. Aubuchon" <n184da(at)cctrap.com> |
First...
Thanks to all for the responses to my crimping question.
Next topic....GYROS.
Is there much difference between Sigma-tek vs RC Allen?? The price
difference is not that large...and in fact, with the info that I have,
AS&S charges more for the RC Allen than the Sigma-Tek...whereas Chief
prices them the other way around. So I don't believe I should choose
based upon cost alone.
Does anyone have specific preferences??? Good/bad experiences with
either??
Geeezzz...sooo many decisions....whats a builder to do
Thanks again in advance,
RV4 N184DA...STILL in its finishing phase
--
Derrick L. Aubuchon
n184da(at)cctrap.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Kerzie <dckerzie(at)qnet.com> |
| Subject: | Elevator Control horn - Hole Location |
We are in the process of installing the aft elevator push rod in our =
RV-6. We have checked all the prints and can not find a precise =
location demension wise for the bottom most hole ( elevator horn =
WD-405) for the bolt that connects to the fitting for the push rod. I am =
concerned about edge distance as scaling Print # 34 indicates about 5/16 =
of an inch. Print #5A has some layout lines which also hint that the =
location might be 5/16 in from the edge. This is a 3/16 hole for the =
connecting bolt. We have drilled the holes with slightly more than the =
5/16 but didn't want to go much more due to possible impact with =
deflections, clearances, etc. Should I be worried. I would believe this =
a critical point of the control system.
Any comments?
Dave Kerzie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jerryflyrv(at)village.yvv.com> |
Derrick L. Aubuchon wrote:
>
> First...
> Thanks to all for the responses to my crimping question.
>
> Next topic....GYROS.
>
> Is there much difference between Sigma-tek vs RC Allen?? The price
> difference is not that large...and in fact, with the info that I have,
> AS&S charges more for the RC Allen than the Sigma-Tek...whereas Chief
> prices them the other way around. So I don't believe I should choose
> based upon cost alone.
> Does anyone have specific preferences??? Good/bad experiences with
> either??
>
> Geeezzz...sooo many decisions....whats a builder to do
>
> Thanks again in advance,
>
> RV4 N184DA...STILL in its finishing phase
> --
>
> Derrick L. Aubuchon
>
> n184da(at)cctrap.com
Derrick
I have RC ALLENS in my RV-6 and have had no problems with them
even doing aerobatics I think they are a good unit, I have no
experience with Sigma Tek so can't speak about them.
Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS first flight July 14, 1989 :-)
jerryflyrv(at)Village.yvv.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rion Bourgeois <RION(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Parts Is Parts |
>Parts Is Parts:
>
>I've been inventoring my wing kit. Van's has this bad habit of labeling
>the small parts "Bag nnn" without explaining what's in the bag. Now that's
>no problem with most things such as rivets, bolts and the like, but how the
>heck am I supposed to know what some of these items are? For example, what
>the heck are those cone shaped things? And what are those small squares of
>sheet metal for in one of the bags? I _assume_ that they are for the
>aileron doubler plates, but I don't _like_ to assume anything!
>
>I can deal with just taking it on faith that the bagged stuff is complete
>(if I have an even number of items, that's a good sign) but I want to label
>them in my storage cabinet accurately. I hate to guess and end up using the
>wrong item, or worse, end up with extra hardware and wonder if I missed
>something. Is there a standard reference around that will help me out -
>preferably with pictures or drawings?
>
>Are you listening Van's? It would surely be nice if you were a little more
>detailed in the pick list on some of these more esoteric items.
>
>
>Aging Rivets:
>
>On a related matter, I have heard that rivets will age over time and that
>"fresh" rivets are best. I'm on the slow-build plan - it has taken me 18
>months to finish up the empennage kit due to other commitments in my life.
>So should I avoid mixing my leftover empennage rivets with the new wing
>hardware or is this short enough a period for it not to matter. At the
>rate I'm going, I figure it will take 2-3 years to build the wings so this
>might be a real issue if I try to use a 4 year old rivet near the end.
>
>
>-----
>Bill Pace The only expensive tool
>wbpace(at)adnc.com is a cheap tool.
>
>
>
There is a pick list with each kit that Van uses to "pick" the bags. There
is also another parts list, two-sided in very small print, that identifies
what is in each bag. I didn't get the parts list with my fuselage kit and
was going nuts trying to ID all the parts in the bags with a building manual
when another builder told me about the parts list I should have gotten. I
called Van's and they faxed it right over. Sounds like you also failed to
get the parts list.
In regards to aging rivets, there was an article in Sports Aviation
a couple of years ago about Dave Anders' polished RV-4 that was Reserve
Grand Champion in '93 or '94. Dave is a dentist, and used his little
furnace at work to heat up the rivets to a very specific and very hot
temperature, then quenched them in cold water, which made them softer. If
you have seen Dave's A/C, you can appreciate the care he went to. However,
the temperature is critical, and you can't duplicate this technique with the
kitchen stove. The rivets I have gotten in each kit vary slightly in color,
and I have tried to use the newest rivets. However, when I have had to use
the older rivets, I haven't noticed any difference. If you want to polish
your airplane and try for Reserve Grand .Champion at Oshkosh, you may want
to invest in a dentist's furnace. Rion.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Peter Bennett" <bennett(at)healey.com.au> |
| Subject: | Rocky Mountains Instruments |
There was some list traffic a couple of months ago about the RMI
uMonitor and uEncoder.
RMI have since put up a web page at http://rkymtn.com which not only
has their sales literature but also their operating, installation and
programming manuals.
Wish all suppliers were this switched on to what buyers need!
Peter Bennett
Sydney Australia
RV6 fuselage upright, engine on order.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | joehine(at)mi.net (joehine) |
Listers,
A friend of mine here in Fredericton who is not on the list asked me
to post this question on the list. He is building, on spec, a RV6,6A and
last weekend took a prospective buyer for a flight in his flying 6. As you
all know having a ride did the trick and the person called him back the next
day and wanted a specific price. Jerry was at a loss to say how much a
flying well equiped, well build 6 is worth. (self rebuilt 0-320, wood prop,
Gyros, one radio, Mode C, and GPS).
Could anyone give him an idea, If you are aware of any aircraft in
your areas that have sold recently could you drop me a quick line off the
list so as to not clutter it up. It would be much appreciated
thanks
Joe
joehine(at)mi.net Comp. 9, Site 8, RR#4
506-452-1072 Home Fredericton, NB
506-452-3495 Work Canada, E3B 4X5
Nobody on their death bed has ever been heard to say "Geeze,I wish I'd spent
more time at work"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barnhart(at)a.crl.com (Dave Barnhart) |
| Subject: | Re: I0-360 in RV-6 |
Frank Smidler wrote:
>I have a chance to get a good deal on an IO-360, slant valve, 200 hp
>engine at a decent price (if there is such a thing)...
The 200hp IO-360 is the most expensive (and most sought-after) Lycoming on
the used market. They command a premium price. It it were ME, I'd snap it
up and resell it to some Lancair builder for a profit. Then you could buy
the engine you REALLY want and have some money left over.
(IMHO Van screwed up when he selected the IO360 for the RV-8. He should
have used the IO540. They are less expensive.)
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
Dave Barnhart
barnhart(at)a.crl.com
rv-6 sn 23744
finishing kit on order
fuselage out of the jig
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Kelley <patk(at)mail.ic.net> |
I just closed my left fuel tank last week and wanted to pass on a
hopefully handy tip to anyone else doing this task. I was a bit daunted
by the thought of making up all those little wooden clamps. I was also
concerned because dimpling the rear baffle and skins had caused a slight
divergence from the spar, which might possibly get worse as I squeezed
the rivets. I had rebent them as best as I could, but the act of
assembly spread them out again.
Anyway, I borrowed a trick from when I was building fiberglass model
sailplanes and needed to mold a removable component in place. Once the
rear baffle was riveted, I cleaned the outer skins and removed most of
the gunk from the aft surfaces, except where I had oversmeared rivets.
I then took saran wrap and placed it on the spar over the flange. Two
sheets, top and bottom, gave me plenty of overlap to cover the spar and
allow the wrap to trail aft about four inches.
Next, I placed the tank in position on the spar (carefully, to avoid
tearing the saran wrap), and clecoed it into place, starting with the
forward holes and finishing with the aft ones to avoid letting the saran
wrap move. The innermost trailing edge, where there are no holes, I
clamped to the spar flange with clecoe sidegrips. Sure enough, there
had been a couple of places where the trailing edge wanted to gap about
one eighth of an inch.
Today, after the Proseal had cured for over forty-eight hours, I removed
the tank from the spar. There was some minor sticking where Proseal had
followed the clecoes through the saran wrap, but not enough to cause any
problem. The best part is that the tank skins remained in their clamped
condition, tight to the spar flange. I am now ready to pressure test
and (hopefully) call another part completed.
Just thought I'd throw this out in case it aids others.
PatK - RV-6A - Working on Landing Light installation today.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barnhart(at)a.crl.com (Dave Barnhart) |
| Subject: | Re: wing closure - final riveting |
roycec(at)ozemail.com.au wrote:
>What I am worring about is that I built the rear spar before I read the
>excellent Justice manual (Thanks F.J. if you're out there) and riveted the
>area where the root ribs go with the shop head on the inside.
>I riveted the top skins on and can get the root ribs out at the moment, but
>as I rivet the skins I assume the rear spar will get harder to push down.
>Should I just rivet the ribs in place before I start the lower skin and live
>with the pop rivets.
I did the "insert root ribs after riveting top and bottom skins on" method
for my first wing. I decided that riveting those ribs to the rear spar was
so difficult (many of them are blocked by the flap brace), that I decided
to try a different method on the second wing.
I am happy to report that you can go ahead and rivet ALL the ribs to the
spars BEFORE riveting the skins on. When riveting the final (in my case
bottom) skins on, I was able to reach in through the lightning holes in the
root ribs and buck all of the rivets. (I was even able to do the bucking
and riveting in this area by myself.)
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
barnhart(at)a.crl.com
Fuselage out of the jig
finishing kit on order
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Postmaster(at)gateway.altonet.com |
| Subject: | Re: wing closure - final riveting |
Royce,
Early this year I was in Bakersfield talking to the RV family there. They
made a special bucking bar for this problem. They sketched up a drawing for
me at the time, but I didn't save it.
I have just finished the tanks and skin closure is next. Ive mulled this
stage over for a year now and at this time I believe this is how I'm going
to do it. Bottom skin last. I see that I can get my hands into everything
except the few rivets near the rear spar. I am going to weld a handle onto a
bucking bar at about a 30 degree angle and bend it as needed to get the job
done. If I (God fobid) make a dent, it will be on the bottom.
A good alternitave way would be to do the top last and pop the few you
have to, then cover them with the 'walk mat'. I plan on covering that area
with a 'walk mat anyway, wether I poprivet that area or not.
Cecil Hatfield
You wrote the following:
I riveted the top skins on and can get the root ribs out at the moment, but
as I rivet the skins I assume the rear spar will get harder to push down.
Should I just rivet the ribs in place before I start the lower skin and live
with the pop rivets.
I would prefer not to.
Any views from thoes in the know?
Royce Craven
roycec(at)ozemail.com.au
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BPattonsoa(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Where to put the Strobe Power Unit in a -6 |
I am busy just putting things in before riveting together the forward fues
frame of the fues. Skin to be left off until the day before painting. Came
to the Whelan Power unit for the strobes, (not the local unit, but the big
one.)
It is about 1" too wide to fit between frames under the seat. I have come up
with the following possible locations:
1. Just forward of the fuel valve assembly
2. Behind the seat, exposed to the baggage compt., just ahead of the flap
tube
3. Behind the baggage compartment (how to support?)
4. Your better idea!
Considering wire runs, getting in the seat hassles, radio noise, exposure to
damage, etc, what is the lists preferences?
Bruce Patton
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DerFlieger(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Cripming question |
Try a nicopress tool.
Jim Stugart
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DerFlieger(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust for sale |
> I noticed that some builders are waiting for exhaust systems.
I have an Allan Tolle stainless crossover system for an 0-360. Used it over
300 hours with NO cracking anywhere. Secret is to hang each pipe from the
engine sump bolts, and cross brace the two pipes just before they exit the
cowl. Friend of mine has the same system with over 600 hours and NO cracks.
$350. including shipping.
Jim Stugart
DerFlieger(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don Mack <donmack(at)theramp.net> |
Just completed the wings after 2 years and 566 hours.
I guess it's time to go back in the basement and start looking at those
fuselage parts.
don mack
rv-6a
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steve Mayer <72652.670(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | PPG prep question |
Does anyone know what the PPG equivalent to alumiprep and alodyne is?
TIA,
Steve Mayer
RV-4 empenage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: Where to put the Strobe Power Unit in a -6 |
>I am busy just putting things in before riveting together the forward fues
>frame of the fues. Skin to be left off until the day before painting. Came
>to the Whelan Power unit for the strobes, (not the local unit, but the big
>one.)
>
>It is about 1" too wide to fit between frames under the seat. I have come up
>with the following possible locations:
>
>1. Just forward of the fuel valve assembly
>2. Behind the seat, exposed to the baggage compt., just ahead of the flap
>tube
>3. Behind the baggage compartment (how to support?)
>4. Your better idea!
>
>Considering wire runs, getting in the seat hassles, radio noise, exposure to
>damage, etc, what is the lists preferences?
>
>Bruce Patton
>
>
>
My choice would be forward of the fuel valve assembly. Easy to get at in
case of need for repair and it puts the weight forward of the CG.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: rv 6 crash / Boulder , CO. |
>Did anyone catch the news last Sunday ( CNN ) . A glider turned to
>avoid a couple of airplanes and ended up hitting the prop of yet
>another plane . The glider landed safely but the plane crashed upside
>down . They showed a closeup which confirmed it was a 6 or 6a . Does
>anyone have any knowledge of this ?
Hi All:
I was at Longmont, and I saw the Sunday paper pictures (yechh) and article on
this accident. The a/c was a -6, and the collision was head on. The glider's
wingtip took a prop blade off the -6. The two gentlemen in the -6 were from
Kansas, and the pilot's cousin was in trail formation with them. Evidently,
there is a lake near the Boulder airport, and the fellas in the -6 were
sightseeing over the lake. The glider was approaching the airport for a
landing (made successfully) when the collision occured. The article made no
mention of an avoidance manuver performed by the glider pilot previous to the
collision with the -6.
Evidently, instead of circling over the approach end of the runway, the -6
pilot circled the lake, and landed short in the water. The picture I saw
showed the a/c as it was pulled from the water. Most of the front section
forward of the spar appeared to be missing. The left fuel tank was also gone.
Flip-up canopy was broken. Witnesses dove for the wreck (two recieved
gasoline/chemical burns), but didn't find it for 45 min. 50 people were
involved in the search. The two occupants were pulled form the wreckage, and
taken to the hospital. The pilot was pronounced dead on arrival, but the
passenger lived another 6 hours.
Check six (Keep your head on a swivel!)
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
| Subject: | Re: PPG prep question |
>Does anyone know what the PPG equivalent to alumiprep and alodyne is?
>Steve Mayer
Steve, DX 533 Aluminum Cleaner is a phosphoric acid based cleaner and DX
503 is a chronic acid based, chrome conversion coating (gold to tan in color).
Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: PPG prep question |
>Does anyone know what the PPG equivalent to alumiprep and alodyne is?
The alumaprep equivalent in PPG is DX533 and the equivalent for Alodine
(Amchem tradename) in PPG is DX503 (gold). PPG is in Strongsville, OH.
Regards,
Gary VanRemortel
Vanremog(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barnhart(at)a.crl.com (Dave Barnhart) |
| Subject: | Re: Where to put the Strobe Power Unit in a -6 |
BPattonsoa(at)aol.com wrote:
>I am busy just putting things in before riveting together the forward fues
>frame of the fues. Skin to be left off until the day before painting. Came
>to the Whelan Power unit for the strobes, (not the local unit, but the big
>one.)
>
>It is about 1" too wide to fit between frames under the seat...
Mine is going under the baggage floor. I'm riveting a doubler to the skin,
and attaching the power supply to that. All of the High-voltage wiring
runs aft of the spar anyway. I'll have only one pair of wires then that I
have to run from the supply to the panel.
(Yes, it means that I cannot pop-rivet the baggage floor down.)
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
barnhart(at)a.crl.com
rv-6 sn 23744
finishing kit on order
fuselage out of the jig
________________________________________________________________________________
I have an RV3-A. Are the plans and material kits available for distrubution
to the
owners of the "-A". If not when are they expected to be available??
Is there an online chat room for "RV" types??
virgily
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | finnlass(at)ix.netcom.com (Finn Lassen ) |
| Subject: | Re: RV3-A wing mods |
I'm building an RV3. I understand that Van's will be sending out the
plans and even the needed material when it's ready. I requested the
plans about 2 months ago, but haven't heard back. I suppose they're
not ready yet?
Finn
finnlass(at)ix.netcom.com
You wrote:
>
>I have an RV3-A. Are the plans and material kits available for
distrubution
>to the
>owners of the "-A". If not when are they expected to be available??
>
>Is there an online chat room for "RV" types??
>
>virgily
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Where to put the Strobe Power Unit in a -6 |
I installed my power unit on the cockpit side of the firewall, high and left
of center.
So far no interference of any kind.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Pat McClung <pmc123(at)airmail.net> |
The cowl and wing tips I had have been claimed. They have gone to a
RV-3 builder.
They were available on first come, first served basis. I got a lot of
nibbles but no "bites" till yesterday. Thanks for the various
responses.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Royce Craven <roycec(at)ozemail.com.au> |
Can I get a bit of info on types of Lycombing engines that are being used.
Good or bad. If they needed to be modified (I'm building one of thoes RV6
with the traning wheel at the front). I'd like a IO-320-???, but what the
??? is I don't know. Which injector/carb used etc.
Thanks
Royce Craven
roycec(at)ozemail.com.au
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kelli Lewis <mikel(at)dimensional.com> |
| Subject: | Re: rv 6 crash / Boulder , CO. |
>
>>Did anyone catch the news last Sunday ( CNN ) . A glider turned to
>>avoid a couple of airplanes and ended up hitting the prop of yet
>>another plane . The glider landed safely but the plane crashed upside
>>down . They showed a closeup which confirmed it was a 6 or 6a . Does
>>anyone have any knowledge of this ?
>
Hey, RV guys. I live 7 miles from Boulder and was at the Longmont Fly-in
the day of the accident. I talked to a glider pilot from Boulder and
apparently both craft were in the pattern for landing. The glider runway
(dirt) parallels the hard runway for the powered types. The lake is on the
approach end-and I do mean ON THE APPROACH END (houses houses dirt trees
water water fence runway) and I understand they have put a few airplanes in
the lake over the years. (I give it a pretty good look when I land there.)
The story I got (and who knows) was that the wing of the glider clipped the
prop and the landing gear of the -6 and the pilot went AROUND even with a
damaged prop. As he was lining up again for final, he pulled power and the
engine shut down and it was a stall/spin into the lake (NTSB report
pending). The lake isn't that deep which was the problem getting to the
occupants: it was up-side-down in the water and they couldn't get to them
for 45 minutes. For having hit solid water, the aircraft looked remarkably
intact (thanks, Van).
OK.....YIKES!!!!
Now: some of the lessons:
1. FLY THE AIRPLANE
A. I can't IMAGINE the vibration that was being experienced by a
damaged prop but it must have been quite the distraction.
2. FLY THE AIRPLANE
A. Sometimes the airport is NOT the best place to land. There are
some airports that give me the creeps (Portage WI, for example) because if
something goes wrong its trees and houses. The airport at Boulder is
surrounded by houses and junk but the surrounding area is fields fields
fields. From pattern altitude or so there were many choices available that
would have made the walk back to the house longer but not quite as
newsworthy. One of the advantages of a slick airplane is, if the fan stops,
there is a longer glide to THE NOISE if the need arives.
3. Know your airplane
A. From any given altitude do you know where you have to go/are
able to get to if you suddenly have to land?? Have you practiced that lately??
B. Fly a lot. We have been given such a great airplane (thanks,
Van), why not?? When I hear of someone having the test hours "flown off" by
some other pilot, it makes me wonder: what a missed opportunity to get to
know the airplane a little more.
4. Hit something slowly at a shallow angle
A. Kit Aircraft this month ran an article about the speed and angle
of a volunteer touchdown that would be survivable. (Again a hemorrhoid
subject: if we don't talk about it, it won't happen.) The article basicly
stated that (I am paraphrasing) since Van designed us such a GREAT airplane
that goes fast AND goes SLOW we should be able to walk away from an
unscheduled touch of the dirt complaining the whole time (Thanks, Van). If
you need to hit something you don't want to, make it at the end of your
landing roll when things are slowing down.
5. DON'T STALL
A. Fly the airplane (did I mention that?)
6. CNN
A. If it was news enough to make CNN, that means it was big news
which means it was something unusual. But it still happens and is one of
the most worried about occurances in aviation.
7. LOOK AROUND
A. You can't look around enough. As the old military training
manual says "A sore neck is better than a broken one."
Michael
RV-4 232 SQ
mikel(at)dimensional.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Lightweight starters |
Hi Group!
Bad news, my starter went out last night so I'm going to take the
opportunity to replace it with one of the lightweight ones.
In my trade-a-plane there seems to be 2 reasonable options. Under
Lycoming parts etc. is one from a company called Air-Tec for $199,
with a "for homebuilders" rider, or I can get a Sky Tec from Sky Ranch
for $359 - does anyone out there have experience with these or indeed
any other suggestions?
Thanks in advance
Rob Lee - av8r(at)hic.net
temporarily non-flying 6A - N517RL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jpl(at)showpg.mn.org (Joe Larson) |
I thought I'd relate something regarding painting. Most of you already
know this, but people who are just starting out could learn from my mistake.
When I started my RV, I was told to pick up a small touch-up gun for priming.
I related this to mean to pick up an inexpensive gun, so I went to Menard's
and bought an inexpensive spray gun, but it was larger than a touch up gun.
It's been hell ever since.
Last night, I went to Sears and bought their $50 touch-up gun. I used it
to finish priming my wing spars. What a difference! This gun worked great!
There are two important lessons:
1. Don't buy a cheap "handyman's" gun. A $50 is still pretty cheap when it
to guns, but it's more than I spent the first time.
2. Make sure you use lacquer thinner, not mineral spirits, for cleaning up
primer. Be thorough.
-Joe
--
Joe Larson jpl(at)showpg.mn.org 612-591-1037
Showpage Software, Inc. http://www.wavefront.com/~showpg
6121 St. Croix Ave. N.
Golden Valley, Mn 55422 Future RV-6A pilot.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JamesCone(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Where to put the Strobe Power Unit in a -6 |
I put mine on the forward side of the instrument sub panel using nutplates.
There is plenty of room and helps make up for the fact that I weigh more
than my significant bucker, also know as my very understanding wife.
Jim Cone
jamescone(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JamesCone(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: PPG prep question |
Alumiprep is DX533 Aluminum Conditioner. Alodine is DX503 Aluminum
Conditioner.
Jim Cone
jamescone(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wbpace(at)adnc.com (Bill Pace) |
| Subject: | Re: rv 6 crash / Boulder , CO. |
Here are two articles I found on the net. They're from the Colorado
Springs Gazette Telegraph. Reprinted without permission from their web
site.
Sunday, June 30:
2 die after plane, glider collide in midair near Boulder
--------------------------------------------------------
Associated Press
BOULDER -- Two occupants of a small, single-engine airplane suffered fatal
injuries Saturday when the plane crashed into Hayden Lake after colliding
in mid-air
with a glider, officials said.
A Federal Aviation Administration spokesperson in Seattle said the plane, a
home built RV-4, was registered to an owner in Emporia, Kan.
The names of the victims were not released.
Witnesses said the plane and the glider collided in mid-air. The pilot of
the glider told authorities he made a sharp turn to avoid two other
aircraft he had spotted and
collided with the plane. His name was not released.
The glider made a safe landing at nearby Boulder Airport. A passenger on
the glider was`treated at a local hospital for chest pains and then
released.
Authorities said the pilot of the airplane radioed after the crash that he
was returning to the airport, but the plane apparently stalled on approach
and crashed into the
lake.
Arnold Scott, an investigator with the National Transportation Safety Board
said the plane's propeller may have been damaged in the collision.
"We believe he was missing a propeller blade .. and could have been losing
control because of that," Scott said.
Flying the plane with a missing propeller blade could have created a
tremendous vibration that would make the plane extremely difficult to
control, Scott said.
After the plane plunged into the lake, witnesses swam or boated to the
site`and attached a line to the sunken plane, but were unable to rescue the
occupants because the
plane was upside down. Divers from the Boulder Fire Department said they
couldn't get to the submerged cockpit because of debris and the wreckage
was towed
to`shore.
After the plane was hauled to shore, the two occupants were removed and
taken to Boulder Community Hospital, where one was pronounced dead on
arrival and the
other died a few hours later.
*****
Monday, July 1:
Plane crash victims identified
------------------------------
The two men who died Saturday in Boulder after their single-engine airplane
collided
with a glider and plunged into a lake near a municipal airport were
identified early Sunday.
David R. Prevatt, 49, and Barry D. Balkenhol, 40, both of Emporia, Kan.,
were taken to Boulder Community Hospital Saturday where Prevatt was
pronounced dead
on arrival and Balkenhol died about six hours later.
Autopsies were to be performed Sunday.
Investigators said the glider's left wing struck the left wheel of the
small airplane at about 6,100 feet over the east end of a runway at Boulder
Municipal Airport,
sending the plane into nearby Hayden Lake.
The pilot of the glider was identified as Alfonso Ossorio, 35. His
passenger was identified as Robert Murr, 50. Their hometowns were not
released.
The airplane, registered to Prevatt, was a home built RV-6.
Murr apparently believed he was suffering a heart attack, said sheriff's
Sgt. Dick Dutrow. Murr was later treated for chest pains at a local
hospital and was released.
Ossorio tried to land the glider and dived after spotting two planes, said
a Boulder County Emergency Services spokesman.
The airplane pilot appeared to know his aircraft had been struck, banked to
the right in an attempt to land and lost power over the lake, authorities
said. The glider later
landed at the airport safely.
Arnold Scott, an investigator with the National Transportation Safety Board
said the plane's propeller may have been damaged inM the collision.
After the plane plunged into the lake, about 20 witnesses swam or boated to
the site and attached a line to the sunken plane, but were unable to rescue
the occupants
because the plane was upside down.
The airplane was hauled to shore by a tow truck after emergency land crews
and divers determined it would be faster and safer.
Lt. Lori Miller of the Boulder Fire Department estimated the victims were
in the water for about 45 minutes to an hour. They were both belted into
their seats, she said.
"It all happened in about 45 seconds," said Kellen Sinning, 13, of Boulder,
who works for the company that owns the glider. "There was this black
circle of smoke
circling down from the plane. I yelled, `Get the fire extinguisher!' and
ran out to the lake to try to help."
Two unidentified men who tried to rescue the victims were treated for
gasoline burns and later released from a county hospital.
The airplane had been at an air show in Longmont, said airportJspokesman
Martin Boniek.
-----
Bill Pace The only expensive tool
wbpace(at)adnc.com is a cheap tool.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ron Caldwell <74504.1365(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Two Wing Building |
My wing kit finally arrived two days ago. I have heard there are some benefits
and time savings to building both wings together. I do have space for both jigs
but would like to get some other opinions from those of you that have done so.
Can this process help to eliminate mistakes or cause mistakes to be transferred
to the other set of wings being built? Thanks in advance for your suggestions.
Ron Caldwell
RV6A (Ready to Start Wings)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WCannon313(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Lightweight starters |
Rob Lee
I have a sky tec PM starter on the O-360 in my -6. The same engine was in a
t-18 that I owned before with the stock prestolite. Can't vouch for the
durability, but the thing weighs about half as much and turns the the engine
what seems like twice as fast. Appears to be a quality product---installation
was a snap.
Walt Cannon
First flight last week -- 12 hours now -- sweet!!!!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Haan <bobh(at)synopsys.com> |
| Subject: | Re: PPG prep question |
>Does anyone know what the PPG equivalent to alumiprep and alodyne is?
>
>
>TIA,
>Steve Mayer
>RV-4 empenage
alumiprep = "Aluminum Cleaner" DX533
alodyne = "Aluminum Conditioner" DX503
Bob Haan
Portland, OR
RV6-A 2 wings in the jigs, LEs, Top Skins, Tanks, Ailerons, Flaps done
bobh(at)synopsys.com
Evenings 503-636-3550
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wbpace(at)adnc.com (Bill Pace) |
| Subject: | Jon Johanson (chatter) |
For those of you with web browsers, there is a web page covering Jon
Johanson's flight at http://saaa.nasma.com. The link on the EAA page is
wrong (there is no "www." in the URL). There's lots of info here on his
accomplishments and his current Round-The-World mission.
Frankly, I think I'm just a little in awe of him and the Aussies are justly
proud of him. As they say on one of the pages "Jon Johanson is an ordinary
Australian doing extraordinary things!" Here's this guy, a simple man, a
nurse, doing something most of us wouldn't even dream of, especially in a
homebuilt. Personally I think aviation suffers an over abundance of
inflated egos and self-promotion and sometimes it wants to make me puke.
But having this guy do something so incredible _twice_, the first time on a
shoe string budget, wants to make me cheer!
Guys like this are the true heros of aviation.
(Of course, nothing succeeds like success. I noticed a lot more corporate
sponsor's logos on his fuselage this time :-) ).
GO JON!
------
Bill Pace Just an ordinary American
wbpace(at)adnc.com doing ordinary things.
-----
Bill Pace The only expensive tool
wbpace(at)adnc.com is a cheap tool.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Curt Reimer <Curt_Reimer(at)MBnet.MB.CA> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Control horn - Hole Location |
On Fri, 5 Jul 1996, David Kerzie wrote:
> We are in the process of installing the aft elevator push rod in our RV-6.
We have checked all the prints and can not find a precise location
demension wise for the bottom most hole ( elevator horn WD-405) for the
bolt that connects to the fitting for the push rod. I am concerned about
edge distance as scaling Print # 34 indicates about 5/16 of an inch.
Print #5A has some layout lines which also hint that the location might
be 5/16 in from the edge. This is a 3/16 hole for the connecting bolt.
We have drilled the holes with slightly more than the 5/16 but didn't
want to go much more due to possible impact with deflections,
clearances, etc
Since the elevator is restrained by the control stops, should it be forced
to one extreme of travel or the other, I think that the most force
that that connecting bolt would see would be the force exerted by your
own muscles, multiplied by the mechanical advantage of the stick.
So, say 200 lbs of pull x 3:1 advantage (a guess) is 600 lbs, divide by
two since there are two bearing surfaces for the bolt (the holes
in the left and right elevator horn). So those holes need to take
about 300 lbs of shear, maximum. Since you allowed 5/16 edge distance,
and the elevator horns are pretty heavy guage steel, my
guess would be that the AN3 bolt would fail first, and an AN3 bolt should be
good for at least 2000 lbs of shear, so that's about a 7:1 safety factor,
I reckon.
Curt Reimer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JAllen6526(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fuse. RV-6 jig avail in So. Cal |
I will be removing my RV-6A from its wooden jig in the next several weeks.
If someone in So. California needs a jig I would part with it for the cost
of the lumber, about $50.00
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Tip vs Fuselage Antenna |
> Has anyone analyzed, calculated, estimated, or SWAGed how much drag
>would be saved by using wing tip antennae as opposed to fuselage antennae?
> How would the saving translate to performance? Would the drag associated
>with fuselage antennae be less if mounted on the fuselage bottom in dirty
>air?
> I am at the point of needing to decide wheather to route an extra
cable
>or conduit for a wing tip antenna. Any thoughts????
>
>Ken Harrill
>RV - 6
>KHarrill @aol.com
I talked to Tracy Saylor (220+ mph RV-6) about this, since he has been busy
removing his external antenna's and replacing them with wing tip antenna's.
Tracy felt that there may be a 1 mph drag penalty in having the COM antenna
outside the aircraft.
For my two cents, since the Sportcraft wingtip NAV antenna (the drag of two
COM antennas) can get the same reception as the extrenal NAV antenna, why
hang those ugly antenna's on the outside of the aircraft.
I have been on vacation. I haven't gotten the new exhaust pipes back on my
LOM engine yet, so I can check out the Sportcraft wingtip COM antenna for
myself. (Still reserving judgement on this one.)
Jim Ayers
LOM M332A RV-3 N47RV Maroon Marauder
LesDrag(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leo Davies <leo(at)icn.su.OZ.AU> |
| Subject: | Re: Where to put the Strobe Power Unit in a -6 |
Bruce,
I plan to put mine under the baggage compartment floor and have made my
right sided baggage floor removable (all nut plates instead of LP 4s ). I
have seen other peopl build a little hatch in the floor.
Leo Davies
6A
>I am busy just putting things in before riveting together the forward fues
>frame of the fues. Skin to be left off until the day before painting. Came
>to the Whelan Power unit for the strobes, (not the local unit, but the big
>one.)
>
>It is about 1" too wide to fit between frames under the seat. I have come up
>with the following possible locations:
>
>1. Just forward of the fuel valve assembly
>2. Behind the seat, exposed to the baggage compt., just ahead of the flap
>tube
>3. Behind the baggage compartment (how to support?)
>4. Your better idea!
>
>Considering wire runs, getting in the seat hassles, radio noise, exposure to
>damage, etc, what is the lists preferences?
>
>Bruce Patton
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mcarob(at)ozemail.com.au |
| Subject: | Two Wings Together ?? |
My wing kit finally arrived two days ago. I have heard there are some benefits
and time savings to building both wings together. I do have space for both jigs
but would like to get some other opinions from those of you that have done so.
Can this process help to eliminate mistakes or cause mistakes to be transferred
to the other set of wings being built? Thanks in advance for your suggestions.
Ron Caldwell
RV6A (Ready to Start Wings)
Ron,
My -6 wings are in the final skinning stages and have been built parallel in
two jigs.
I can recommend doing both together if you have the room, but there are
drawbacks. "Murphy's Law" is really alive and well in Oz and it is really
easy to duplicate mistakes, particularly in measurement of main rib
locations on the rear spars (trust me). The overriding law is of course "be
careful" and check every thing you do on each wing as you proceed, dont get
one "right" and then just copy to the other.
I have about four feet between jigs and can easily work between them. The
wings are positioned so that the upper surfaces face inwards towards one
another. Another local builder simply extended the arms of the one jig and
built the wings back-to-back, this is OK, but he does complain about having
to jump over the rear spar braces and squeeze around the single central jig
upright.
After thirteen months, I am getting a bit sick of looking at wings, but am
glad of not facing the prospect of "doing it all over again"
Rob McAnally
mcarob(at)ozemail.com.au
RV-6 Wings almost done.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Lightweight starters |
>Bad news, my starter went out last night so I'm going to take the
>opportunity to replace it with one of the lightweight ones.
Rob; If I were you, I wouldn't leave Mark Landoll's Electrical Service out
of the running.
I'm using his light wt. starter and have been very pleased with it.
His phone # is (405) 685-0239 or 392-3847.
It is a remfd Datsun starter and mounting bracket, at the time I bought it,
it was 197.00 including frt.
It sure turns my 0-320 over fast.
johnd
John Darby RV6 N61764 flying
johnd@our-town.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RV-List:Empennage/HS Ribs |
I am in the process of placing the ribs onto the spars of my -8 horizontal
stabilizer. The manual says that when you install the HS-404 rib it must be
trimmed to clear the HS-814 aluminum bracket. If you trim according to the
plans then the rivet that goes in that spot will not have enough edge
clearance. I have thought about moving the rib over slightly so that I would
not have trim so close to the rivet hole, but since the skins are pre-drilled
I can not do this. The plans even show this rivet with very little edge
clearance. What have others done here or am I overlooking something?
Tripp Myrick
RV-8 #80085
Assembling HS skeleton
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RFlunker(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | RV-6A Fuse Jig Wanted - Dallas Area |
I'm still working on my left wing, but I have my Fuselage kit on order so am
starting to look for a fuse jig. I expect it will be early September before
I actually need it. If you have one or know of one that is or will be
available, please contact me.
I live just north of Dallas so please keep responses to those in this area -
ie
within 100 miles or so.
Let's not flood the list with this - please contact me directly..
Dick Flunker (RFLUNKER(at)AOL.COM)
RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Lightweight starters |
>In my trade-a-plane there seems to be 2 reasonable options. Under
>Lycoming parts etc. is one from a company called Air-Tec for $199,
>with a "for homebuilders" rider, or I can get a Sky Tec from Sky Ranch
>for $359 - does anyone out there have experience with these or indeed
>any other suggestions?
>Rob Lee - av8r(at)hic.net
Rob, I'm using the Sky Tec lightweight starter. It has 290 hours on it and
no problems. When I first installed it, it developed an internal short. I
sent it back and put the old Prestolite starter on that came with the
engine. The Sky Tec was repaired promptly and hasn't missed a lick since.
The Sky Tec spins the prop with more gusto that the heavy Prestolite. I
have heard some negative comment about some new versions of starters that
they were/are using on Lycomings. I don't know if this is the model that
Air-Tec is selling. Even with the problem with the Sky Tec, I'm satisfied
and would probably buy another one. Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mcarob(at)ozemail.com.au |
| Subject: | Full Swiveling Tail Wheel |
Folks,
Has anybody out there had any experience with the full swiveling tail wheel
for the RV-6?
At the time I ordered my kit the new tail wheel was not an option and I was
supplied with the origional unit.
Is the new swiveling unit worth the modification of the origional ?
Regards
Rob McAnally
mcarob(at)ozemail.com.au
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Morrissey <John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au> |
| Subject: | Re: Full Swiveling Tail Wheel |
G'day Rob,
The full swiveling tailwheel is real nice to have if you are tight for
hangar space. It allows you to push the RV6 backwards without having to lift
the tailplane. The swiveling tailwheel has much higher quality bearings and
it still has all the nice features of being steerable.
All in all - highly recommended!!
John
>Folks,
>
>Has anybody out there had any experience with the full swiveling tail wheel
>for the RV-6?
>At the time I ordered my kit the new tail wheel was not an option and I was
>supplied with the origional unit.
>Is the new swiveling unit worth the modification of the origional ?
>
>Regards
>
>Rob McAnally
>mcarob(at)ozemail.com.au
>
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Morrissey
CSIRO ITS
Communications Section
Phone:- 06 2766811
Fax:- 06 2766617
Mobile:- 018 628804
Email:- John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au
CSIRO ---- AUSTRALIA'S SCIENCE, AUSTRALIA'S FUTURE!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rwoodard(at)lawyernet.com |
| Subject: | RV-List:Empennage/HS Ribs |
RV>I am in the process of placing the ribs onto the spars of my -8 horizontal
RV>stabilizer. The manual says that when you install the HS-404 rib it must be
RV>trimmed to clear the HS-814 aluminum bracket. If you trim according to the
RV>plans then the rivet that goes in that spot will not have enough edge
RV>clearance. I have thought about moving the rib over slightly so that I woul
RV>not have trim so close to the rivet hole, but since the skins are pre-drille
RV>I can not do this. The plans even show this rivet with very little edge
RV>clearance. What have others done here or am I overlooking something?
RV>Tripp Myrick
RV>RV-8 #80085
RV>Assembling HS skeleton
I'm at almost exactly the same point you are. What I've been told that
others are doing is a.) remove the rivet hole entirely and leave that
rivet out; or b.) go ahead and drive a rivet in there in spite of the
improper edge distance. I'm leaning toward cutting the hole out
entirely, myself. The most important thing (from what I'm told) is to
_NOT_ try to alter the size/shape of the HS-814 tongue.
Good luck, keep in touch.
Rod Woodard
RWoodard(at)lawyernet.com
RV-8 #80033
Construction temporarily halted---moving into new building factory
(aka, house w/3-car garage) :-)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Full Swiveling Tail Wheel |
The full swivel tailwheel is the only way to fly!!
Todd RV-6 N92TM flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Lightweight starters |
I just replaced my Lycoming starter with a Sky-Tek starter. I love it. If
you have a front mounted oil cooler you will need to use the PM model as the
solenoid will not interfere with the cooler. Hope this helps.
Todd
RV-6 N92TM 63 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rust47rg(at)one.net |
| Subject: | Re: Full Swiveling Tail Wheel |
>Folks,
>
>Has anybody out there had any experience with the full swiveling tail wheel
>for the RV-6?
>At the time I ordered my kit the new tail wheel was not an option and I was
>supplied with the origional unit.
>Is the new swiveling unit worth the modification of the origional ?
>
>Regards
>
>Rob McAnally
>mcarob(at)ozemail.com.au
Rob:
IMHO Yes.....The only way to go. Send your tailspring back for credit and
get the one thats already machined for the swiveling unit.
Regards:
Rusty Gossard
N47RG RV-4 Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robbins Mitch <ROBBINM(at)chi.ntsb.gov> |
| Subject: | Paint Advise Needed ... |
Scott,
I'm not envious of your having to strip and respray. I know it's a major
task. Orange peel is generally caused by the paint flashing before it
flows out. Usually a slightly heavier coat will help but it's always a
compromise between flow and sags. Guns and settings are critical. What
is potentiallly happening is the primer, being slightly porous, is
absorbing solvent causing the laquer to flash. You might try a warmer
temperature reducer, or spray when the temperature is cooler. This will
retard the hardening and allow the laquer to flow a bit more. My
preference for airplanes has never been laquer because it drys very
rapidly and takes a great deal of skill to apply it on large surfaces
without getting dry spots. Also, although I don't know the specifics in
your case, laquer will raise many undercoats resulting in nice blisters.
A skilled person can probably achieve the nicest finish with laquer but
it requires an extreme amount of talent and rubbing. Urethanes such as
DuPont imron or Ditzler (PPG) durethane, dispite the safety precautions
necessary to spray them, will flow for about 5 days. Thus the "wet" look
and an extremely durable finish. My personal preference is PPG DP40 or
50 primer. No sanding is required if color is applied within a few days,
and PPG durethane colors.
I only recommend the DP primer for use in areas that will be painted, not
as a preservative for interior parts. It will work as a seal coat over
many undercoats and will accept many different top coats. PPG has
excellent literature for compatability.
Always spray some test panels first to be sure every thing is working
right, then spray the airplane.
Acrylic enamels are a good compromise. They flow better than laquer but
supposedly are not as dangerous to spray as the urethanes. Use a hardner
with acrylic enamel to obtain a more durable finish. I'm not an expert
but have obtained some very nice results. Good Luck!
Mitch Robbins
----------
From: owner-rv-list[SMTP:owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com]
Sent: Friday, July 05, 1996 3:54 PM
Subject: RV-List: Paint Advise Needed ...
I am using Randolph Aircraft Acrylic Laquer to paint my airplane. I have
used it many times spraying Piper Cherokees and have had good results.
But I
always sprayed over the pre-existing Acrylic Laquer. Randolph Acrylic
Laquer
was used on Pipers almost 20 years.
Heres my problem. I purchased the companies Epibond epoxy primer that
they
say you can use with their Acrylic Laquer. We first coated the
alumipreped
and alodined aluminum with this Randolph epoxy primer. We let it sit two
days as recommended, and then sprayed with the Randolph acrylic laquer.
The
results were terrible ! We got a significant orange peel. To make sure it
wasnt the gun settings, we sprayed bare aluminum and got perfect results
with the laquer.
I called the chief chemist at Randolph and talked to the president of
Randolph paints and they gave me many suggestions which we tried with the
same results. I am so frustrated it is unbelievable. So we bought
aircraft
stripper to take off the paint and the primer, and the primer won't come
all
off. The president of Randolph aircraft paints has been unwilling to give
me
an compensation even for the paint.
Since I have already bought the acrylic laquer I am contemplating doing
the
following.
1.) Strip off as much primer as I can with aircraft stripper.
2.) Spray with Dupont Variprime.
3.) Top coat the Variprime with Dupont Variseal (spelling ?)
4.) Then spray the Randolph acrylic laquer.
If anybody can give me recommendations on what to do I would greatly
appreciate it. I certainly think Randolph support in standing behind
their
products at this point is terrible. If they were in this state, I would
be
filling out a small claims suit at this moment.
When I called Dupont, they said you can't use an epoxy primer with
acrylic
laquer. Why does Randolph paints say you can ? (Yet both the chemist and
president at Randolph say you can.)
So frustrated and mad I could ... Scott Johnson
rvgasj(at)mcs.com
P.S. Any good information will be rewarded with a free dinner when we
meet
at Oshkosh !!!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Lightweight starters |
I purchased a new Lyc 0-360A1A engine through Van's Aircraft. It came from
the factory with a lightweight starter. When the engine was hot, the starter
jammed every time and had to be hand propped. Since the engine was still in
warranty, Lycoming replaced the lightweight starter with a new "old style"
starter and the invoice showed a price of $1200.00! I'm sure glad I didn't
have to pay that one! Anyway I have never had a bit of trouble with the
second starter after 230 hours.
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Gesele <scottg(at)villagenet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Two Wing Building |
>My wing kit finally arrived two days ago. I have heard there are some benefits
>and time savings to building both wings together. I do have space for both
jigs
>but would like to get some other opinions from those of you that have done so.
>Can this process help to eliminate mistakes or cause mistakes to be transferred
>to the other set of wings being built? Thanks in advance for your
suggestions.
>
>Ron Caldwell
>RV6A (Ready to Start Wings)
>
>
>
Ron,
I built both wings at the same time in a two car garage. The spars were
laid out at a right angle to each other. With this arrangement, only three
uprights are needed. Pictures of my wings going together, along with the
rest of the project, are upon the web at http://www.villagenet.com/~scottg
. I would highly recommend building both at once, if you have the room. It
was easier, faster, and after building one, I wouldn't want to start over
again. There are two flying -4's in my local chapter. One builder built
both at once, the other one at a time. Both agree that, space permitting,
you should build both at once.
Hope this helps.
-Scott N506RV (working on cowl)
scottg(at)villagenet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WStucklen(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Where to put the Strobe Power Unit in a -6 |
<< I am busy just putting things in before riveting together the forward fues
frame of the fues. Skin to be left off until the day before painting. Came
to the Whelan Power unit for the strobes, (not the local unit, but the big
one.)
It is about 1" too wide to fit between frames under the seat. I have come
up
with the following possible locations:
1. Just forward of the fuel valve assembly
2. Behind the seat, exposed to the baggage compt., just ahead of the flap
tube
3. Behind the baggage compartment (how to support?)
4. Your better idea!
Considering wire runs, getting in the seat hassles, radio noise, exposure to
damage, etc, what is the lists preferences?
Bruce Patton
>>
I put mine in front o fthe fuel valve. Running the wires is no problem,
especially if you have put the wing wire runs in front of the spare.
Otherwise, you have to go throught the spare, but that's not a big a problem
as you might think.
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
wstucklen(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WStucklen(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: rv 6 crash / Boulder , CO. |
<< I was at Longmont, and I saw the Sunday paper pictures (yechh) and article
on
this accident. The a/c was a -6, and the collision was head on. The glider's
wingtip took a prop blade off the -6. The two gentlemen in the -6 were from
Kansas, and the pilot's cousin was in trail formation with them. Evidently,
there is a lake near the Boulder airport, and the fellas in the -6 were
sightseeing over the lake. The glider was approaching the airport for a
landing (made successfully) when the collision occured. The article made no
mention of an avoidance manuver performed by the glider pilot previous to
the
collision with the -6.
Evidently, instead of circling over the approach end of the runway, the -6
pilot circled the lake, and landed short in the water. The picture I saw
showed the a/c as it was pulled from the water. Most of the front section
forward of the spar appeared to be missing. The left fuel tank was also
gone.
Flip-up canopy was broken. Witnesses dove for the wreck (two recieved
gasoline/chemical burns), but didn't find it for 45 min. 50 people were
involved in the search. The two occupants were pulled form the wreckage,
and
taken to the hospital. The pilot was pronounced dead on arrival, but the
passenger lived another 6 hours.
Check six (Keep your head on a swivel!)
Mark
>>
Thisshould be a reminder to all that, when you fly a fast airplane like
the RV's, ALL OTHERS ARE A TARGET....... When you're near an airport
readying to land, SLOW DOWN......
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
wstucklen(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Full Swiveling Tail Wheel |
>Is the new swiveling unit worth the modification of the origional ?
>
Rob; I have the orig. type tail wheel. I was worried that it would keep me
from making tight turns on the ground-- no problem, it turns as well as the
full swivel. One draw back, when you want to push the a/c backwards-it acts
up. I got an old cessna tail wheel draw bar, spring clamps over the nuts
on each side of the wheel axle and can pull it very easy without lifting the
tail. It works for me and without the expense of the full swivel. As I
said, the only time it's a hassle is if you try to push the a/c backwards.
The original will swivel at least 90 degrees no problem in ground taxi.
john d
John Darby RV6 N61764 flying
johnd@our-town.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | walsh(at)cpeedy.ENET.dec.com |
| Subject: | Re: Variprime Warning, Did You Know ... |
Variprime......
Other than the Epoxy "Stuff", I don't see that there is any way to "seal"
the inside surfaces without a top coat. So.... What's wrong with shooting
"variseal"?? over the Variprime? Can you shoot it right after? Or do you
have to wait a day or so?
Specifically, are there any special procedures necessary for use of Variseal?
Also, did the Chemist indicate that Variprime might make matters worse?
Remember the filliform corrosion that the Cessnas suffered. I believe that
the paint they used actually absorbed moisture. The alum would have been
better off not painted at all.
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Prices |
It depends on..... well just about everything.
I have seen well equiped RV-6's in the $60,000 to $75,000 range. However,
there are people who charge $50,000 to complete an RV. When you add all of
the other costs that works out to about $90,000. I for one like to see these
high resale prices. The RV's enjoy the highest resale return in the kitplane
business.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Aging rivets & Useless Vari Prime |
OH PLEASE, lets not scare everybody (especially all the people that scare
easily) with this one again. And that goes for the latest Veri-Prime thing
as well.
Worry about the important stuff like finding time to finish your plane or
where to find an engine. There is so much good information on this list but
every now and then I feel that I must interject to help other sort through
the BS....
There are plenty of people that used "superannuated" rivets to complete their
RV's. My RV took almost 6 years to complete and there are many others that
took longer. I didn't replace my rivets every 18 months nor did I give them
a shower and a bath or what ever else I have read about. I even drove rivets
in 30 degree temps. (oh my).
If you want to avoid work hardening your rivets do the following:
1) Don't drive them in one fast blast. Feather the trigger on your gun.
2) Drive them to the correct height the first time. Don't get into the habit
of driving them a little and then hitting them with "just a little extra".
3) Use the correct bucking bar. The bigger the better.
4) Take your time and enjoy the project. This will not keep you from work
hardening your rivets but it will help you to have some fun.
I hope that I can help my fellow listers sort the wheat from the chafe.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Phil Arter <arter(at)ncar.ucar.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-List:Empennage/HS Ribs |
Tripp, hi
What I did was to trim the skin and HS-404 rib about 1/16 - 3/32" out beyond
the HS-814 (following the shape of the 814) which is just far enough to
totally eliminate the hole in the skin. In my opinion it is not worth
trying to save this one rivet, or add one to replace it (which screws up the
spacing and looks ugly).
Phil
arter(at)ncar.ucar.edu
>I am in the process of placing the ribs onto the spars of my -8 horizontal
>stabilizer. The manual says that when you install the HS-404 rib it must be
>trimmed to clear the HS-814 aluminum bracket. If you trim according to the
>plans then the rivet that goes in that spot will not have enough edge
>clearance. I have thought about moving the rib over slightly so that I would
>not have trim so close to the rivet hole, but since the skins are pre-drilled
>I can not do this. The plans even show this rivet with very little edge
>clearance. What have others done here or am I overlooking something?
>
>Tripp Myrick
>RV-8 #80085
>Assembling HS skeleton
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | twg(at)blink.ho.att.com (Tom Goeddel(x5278)) |
| Subject: | Re: wing closure - final riveting |
I had already riveted the wing walk ribs in place before I heard about
the idea of putting them in one at a time. I found a sequence to close the
bottom skin that I found worked well - no horrible contortions, need
for child labor, etc. I started at the rear spar and riveted up all of the
wing walk ribs simultaneously. That is, one rivet in the first rib, one
in the second, one in the third, one in the fourth, one in the fifth,
then back for another in the first, another in the second, etc. Once
it got too tight to reach in from the top (by the main spar), the last
few rivets in each rib and those on the main spar could be reached either
through the forward lightening hole, or from the outboard bay. You are
basically doing all of the the tough to reach rivets at the rear of the wing
walk area while the forward part of the skin is completely unattached and can
be peeled back for easy access. Once the wing walk area is done, the rest are
relatively easy. This worked well enough for me that I have decided to do it
again for the second wing even though I had the option of leaving the ribs
un-riveted for this one.
Tom Goeddel
RV-6a (still finishing the last wing, fuse on order...)
goeddel@bell-labs.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Bordelon <greg(at)brokersys.com> |
| Subject: | lCorrosion Control - Primers |
Guys, we are building metal airplanes and with all the talk about primers I
have the following thoughts. You can leave your structure bare or prime it
with Sher Williams, Variprime, Zinc Chromate or Epoxy primer or what ever.
Each has it's own advantages. ALL of them will deteriorate over time
leaving you with less protection. During normal service expect scratches,
chaffing, rubbing and just plain wear and tear.
I recommend that you start mentally preparing yourself with the idea of
spraying or fogging your a/c with some form of corrosion inhibitor /
preventative such as ACF 50, Corrosion Block or LPS3. It's not a matter of
to fog or not to fog........it's a matter of WHEN to fog. Sooner or later
you will have to use these products if you expect to keep corrosion under
control. Many a/c have gone to the scrape yard because the owners waited
until it was to late and did not take corrosion seriously. Priming only
delays the use of these products.
With all that in mind, while building give some thought as to how you can
visually inspect closed up areas of your a/c. Ask yourself how can I look
in hear later? How can I fog this area? A small hole is all that's
necessary for fogging but a larger hole may be required for inspection. I
am not suggesting you should install additional inspection holes with all
those nut plates...........just give it some thought.
Do not fool yourself into thinking moisture will not get into your wings,
tail and fuse. Every time you fly all those chemicals in the air will get
into every cavity that is not sealed air tight (there isn't any place on
our a/c that should be air tight any way). The moisture / chemicals will
condense and start the corrosion process. The cabin is usually a corrosive
area due to body sweat.......this is a highly corrosive area on Cessnas. Go
look at one and open up the headliner if you don't believe me.
Personally on my RV6 I'm etching, alodining and epoxy priming and I will
not hesitate to spray ACF50 if any corrosion is spotted later. Yes, the
corrosion inhibitor will weep out the seems for a couple of months ........
that means the stuff is working. If your worried about looks....... which
looks better an a/c with corrosion inhibitor seeping from the seems or an
a/c with a nice paint job grounded due to structural corrosion?
It's your call....don't sweat the primer stuff!
Greg Bordelon
Houston, Texas
greg(at)brokersys.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Bordelon <greg(at)brokersys.com> |
| Subject: | Aging rivets & Useless Vari Prime |
AMEN brother Gary! Well said!
Greg Bordelon
greg(at)brokersys.com
----------
From: aol.com!RV6junkie(at)matronics.com[SMTP:aol.com!RV6junkie(at)matronics.com]
Sent: Monday, July 08, 1996 11:21 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Aging rivets & Useless Vari Prime
OH PLEASE, lets not scare everybody (especially all the people that scare
easily) with this one again. And that goes for the latest Veri-Prime thing
as well.
Worry about the important stuff like finding time to finish your plane or
where to find an engine. There is so much good information on this list but
every now and then I feel that I must interject to help other sort through
the BS....
There are plenty of people that used "superannuated" rivets to complete their
RV's. My RV took almost 6 years to complete and there are many others that
took longer. I didn't replace my rivets every 18 months nor did I give them
a shower and a bath or what ever else I have read about. I even drove rivets
in 30 degree temps. (oh my).
If you want to avoid work hardening your rivets do the following:
1) Don't drive them in one fast blast. Feather the trigger on your gun.
2) Drive them to the correct height the first time. Don't get into the habit
of driving them a little and then hitting them with "just a little extra".
3) Use the correct bucking bar. The bigger the better.
4) Take your time and enjoy the project. This will not keep you from work
hardening your rivets but it will help you to have some fun.
I hope that I can help my fellow listers sort the wheat from the chafe.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Bordelon <greg(at)brokersys.com> |
>Aging Rivets:
>On a related matter, I have heard that rivets will age over time and
>that "fresh" rivets are best. I'm on the slow-build plan - it has
>taken me 18 months to finish up the empennage kit due to other
>commitments in my life. So should I avoid mixing my leftover
>empennage rivets with the new wing hardware or is this short enough a
>period for it not to matter. At the rate I'm going, I figure it will
>take 2-3 years to build the wings so this might be a real issue if I
>try to use a 4 year old rivet near the end.
I have never had a problem driving TWO DECADE old rivets. I guess I should
get some "new born" rivets and perform a test. Don't waste your time
reasearching all this rivet aging stuff. If a rivet was age limited you can
bet the the FAA would have found some way to identify it as such. And yes
some rivets are age & and temperature limited...... but an AN470 rivet is
an AN470 rivet. Rivet age is not an issue!
Now sometimes a soft or softer rivet is needed for attaching non-structual
stuff or filling an occasional oversize hole. An AN470 rivet can be made
significantly softer by heating them with a torch. Place the rivets to be
softened on a can and using your torch heat them up untill the are glowing.
You have to keep playing the flame so you don't melt the rivets, their made
of aluminum remember. After a minute remove the flame and let them cool.
These rivets are now "cosmetic" rivets....i.e. NOT STRUCTUAL. They will be
easy to drive with your rivet gun....better test on scrape peices first.
These are useful for attaching stuff to fiberglass. Every A&P knows this
trick but the hangar door will be closed when this process is in use.
Greg Bordelon
Houston Texas
greg(at)brokersys.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | pilla(at)emmanuel.espinc.com (Michael Pilla) |
| Subject: | Hint on adding "shims" to low spots under skins |
I just finished riveting the turtle deck on my RV-4 a week ago and
thought I would pass along a hint that Jim Perucca, a "lurker" on
this list, gave me. Jim is building an RV-4 and is "installing systems".
I had one fueslage former, F-408, that wouldn't match very well, for
some reason. Well, I bit the bullet and sliced it above the longerons
and spliced a couple of doubler plates in; now the fit was almost perfect
for the "cone" from the baggage area to the tail. I still had a few low
spots requiring 0.032 or so shims.
Jim's idea was to cut the shim, drill and dimple it, then apply it to the
bulkhead with "hot glue" from those inexpensive glue guns. Of course, by
the time you get the shim clecoed on, the glue has "set" and the shim stands
a little "proud". Next, Jim told me to apply heat from one of those
hot air guns (I had an old Monokote gun around - modelers will know the
type I mean.) Well, Jim was right; the clecoe applied just enough pressure
so that as the hot glue "re-melted", the shim was pulled down to the
bulkhead. Neat!
BTW, I had an interesting experience trying to back drill the turtle deck
skin to the fuselage top longerons (I had already drilled, countersunk,
dimpled the side skin, ...) I had clamped the skin and had 3/4 x 3/4
ballister clamped along the longeron line. I was inside with my air drill,
clecoe supply, and clecoe pliers. I am rather broad in the shoulders (can
you say "bubba"? :-) But, since, as my wife puts it, "I have ape arms", I
figured that I could slide down and use my 36 - 37" sleeve length arms to
drill/clecoe, ... Well, it "almost" worked. I was going great guns,
feeling a little claustrophobic, kind of like an MRI, when I dropped the
clecoe pliers and, without even thinking, reached with my other arm. Of
course, I was now wedged, quite tightly, in the tail cone. No one else
around, garage door closed because is was after 8:00pm (mosquitos, don't
you know). I managed to get out, but found someone *much* smaller who
hadn't read Huckleberry Finn and conned him into going in there for the
balance... :-)
Mike Pilla
pilla(at)espinc.com
RV-4, #2866
installing VertStab on fuse, canopy frame
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don McNamara <mcnamara(at)sbt.infi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: New RV-8 Builder |
Hi, all...
I'm in the process of building my jig for the RV-8 empennage. I'd
appreciate any help and words of wisdom from those of you with experience
before I screw up my first piece of aluminum! Feel free to e-mail me
rather than bore everybody on the list with elementary pointers.
Many thanks!!
Don McNamara
RV-8 Tail Builder
mcnamara(at)sbt.infi.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barnhart(at)a.crl.com (Dave Barnhart) |
| Subject: | I'm overhauling my engine |
Some folks here might remember a few months ago that I acquired a runout
IO320-B1A. I've started the overhaul process, and so I though I would post
a status report here as things progress.
The engine came out of a twin comanche several years ago at TBO. The owner
decided to do the 'counter-rotating props conversion' instead of just
overhauling the existing engines. The engine had been overhauled once and
had 3800 hours TT on it when I bought it. I essentially bought it
'firewall forward'. So, I not only have an engine, I have all accessories,
including the oil cooler. (anybody need a twin comanche motor mount?)
The Sump:
The IO320-B1A has the mount for the fuel injection servo on the aft face of
the sump. I could have had my mount modified, but after talking with Don
Wentz, decided it would be easier to locate a different sump.
The hard part of that process was figuring out exactly what the Lycoming
part number of the correct sump should be. (I think there must be about a
zillion sump part numbers.) After figuring out the right part number, it
only took 1/2 hour on the phone and $350 to have the sump on its way.
Crankshaft:
About two weeks ago, i took the engine to an A&P friend's hanger and we
tore it down (the engine, not the hanger). Internally, this engine turned
out to be exceptionally clean and wear-free. I don't have the crank back
yet, but it looks good (hooray!!!!) The crank has never been ground. The
front main bearing journal has one small score about 1 thou deep. The
score may polish out, but I expect they will need to grind it 3 thou
undersized. A quick runout check and magnaflux revealed no problems with
the prop flange. The crank is now out at the crank shop, and I expect to
hear the final verdict in a few days.
Camshaft:
The cam and cam followers look GREAT! In fact, people kept coming by, and
after seeing the parts, wanted to know what kind of oil was used in this
engine (Aeroshell 50, with oil and filter change every 50 hours.) They
will go out for grinding and re-nitriding this week.
Crankcase:
The case showed minor signs of fretting, and has been sent out. It should
be back in about three weeks.
Oil pump gears:
This engine had one steel and one aluminum gear. The gears and shafts
really looked great. It's a shame I have to throw them away. Also this is
a REALLY OLD engine. The oil pump housing is the old two-part style, and
will have to be replaced with the new single-part one. I'm told that
Superior now makes oil pump housings. Also, the oil pump has a stationary
idler-gear shaft (The gear rotates on the shaft, whereas the new gears have
an integral shaft.) The accessory case will therefore need to have an
additional oil gallery drilled (This is in a Lycoming service bulletin).
It is a simple process, but I decided to let the local engine shop do it.
The only noticable wear was on the crankshaft gear. I understand that this
normal for Lycomings.
Rods:
My engine uses the older style rod bolts. The new style have a radius
under the head, so a little machining was necessary to make my rods accept
the new style bolts.
Cylinders:
Well, they *Look* real good, but I'll hold off sending them in until I get
the bill for what has been done so far.
That's it for now.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
barnhart(at)a.crl.com
rv-6 sn 23744
finishing kit on order
fuselage out of the jig
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Allan W. Mojzisik" <prober(at)iwaynet.net> |
| Subject: | Variprime Warning, Did You Know ... |
------ =_NextPart_000_01BB6D11.589BD5A0
Just a note on all this primer stuff.......Before you get too fancy go =
look at your car where the paint has chipped and moisture has gotten =
under the paint. (If you have an old enough car) If your talking about =
sealing the primer, it is very unlikely that you will be able to seal it =
100% so anywhere that moisture can get to the aluminum (under the =
paint/primer) you are going to have a problem big time......I don't know =
that much about variprime but I do think you had better think twice =
about sealing it in an enclosed area.......I think that is why they used =
zinc chromate before and you are only supposed to mist that on not thick =
coat it. Just my $.02............Al N162NV (Res) =20
----------
From: =
cpeedy.ENET.dec.com!walsh(at)matronics.com[SMTP:cpeedy.ENET.dec.com!walsh(at)ma=
tronics.com]
Sent: Monday, July 08, 1996 11:54 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Variprime Warning, Did You Know ...
Variprime......
Other than the Epoxy "Stuff", I don't see that there is any way to =
"seal"
the inside surfaces without a top coat. So.... What's wrong with =
shooting
"variseal"?? over the Variprime? Can you shoot it right after? Or do =
you
have to wait a day or so? =20
Specifically, are there any special procedures necessary for use of =
Variseal?
Also, did the Chemist indicate that Variprime might make matters worse?
Remember the filliform corrosion that the Cessnas suffered. I believe =
that
the paint they used actually absorbed moisture. The alum would have =
been=20
better off not painted at all.
John
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Kelley <patk(at)mail.ic.net> |
Well, I finally got my web site back up and running on my new service,
and I added an RV page while I was at it. My home page is
http://ic.net/~patk/home.htm and, for those of you too impatient to look
at my home page, the RV page is http://ic.net/~patk/rv6a.htm . Enjoy,
and let me know what you think. Cheers!
PatK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Elon Ormsby" <Elon.Ormsby(at)quickmail.llnl.gov> |
| Subject: | Paint advise needed |
REGARDING Paint advise needed
Scott I am really sorry you are having such a problem. I have never used
Randolf paints but I can assure you that theirs is a "system" just like all of
the other manufactures. If just one little costitutent of the system is a
little wrong the whole process will blow up! Shermin Williams, Dupont they
are all the same. Not only is the surface preparation important but the
PRECISION of using the components in the "system" is critical. Since you can
only remove some of the primer with paint-remover it appears that you have a
good, tenacious product. Also, your comment about bare aluminum producing a
good finish (more on this later) lends me to believe it may be technique and
not product at fault.
Mitch Robins remarks are accurate on all accounts.
Generally, "orange peel" is caused by the color coat setting up too fast and
this can be caused by the following "controllable" variables.
(1) Using the WRONG reducer/thinner for the ambient conditions. Usually you
are using a reducer that is too HOT for the existing temperature. In other
words, if it is a hot day you need a reduced(thinner) that will evaporate much
SLOWER to allow time for the color coat to flow or get that wet look. A cold
day can use a thinner that is hotter (will evaporate faster) since the color
coat will not dry as fast due to the cold. One of the most difficult tasks of
getting a good paint job is selecting the CORRECT THINNER for the ambient
temperature. If you use a thinner that is too slow you greatly increase the
chance of RUNS - If it is too hot you get ORANGE PEEL.
(2) Wrong primer. Primers act as an adhesion layer but due to their porosity
some are required to have a SEALER COAT on top of the primer so the color coat
will "wet". Does the Randolp system require a sealer?
(3) Too high of air pressure (or wrong gun) for the "system". Generally high
pressure will atomize smaller paint particles. These will NOT "wet" as easily
and can produce orange peel. In addition, they accentuate the problem if you
have the WRONG thinner (for the temperature) because they will tend to start
drying in the air before they even hit the surface. The wrong gun will
contribute to the same problem. Contrary to intuition larger droplets will
flow (or "wet) when applied. They will also be less critical of the wrong
thinner.
You stated you got a GOOD FINISH on BARE aluminum which tends to pinpoint to
one of the problems above. Since there was no primer it was NOT adsorbed and
your color coat "wet" when applied. Any of the three problems mentioned above
would prevent good "wetting" of the color coat and will lead to orange peel.
When in doubt, always use a slower thinner and risk getting paint runs. Good
technique can minimize runs but they can be fixed much better that the problem
you are now faced with.
-Elon
ormsby1(at)llnl.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | spjohnsn(at)ix.netcom.com (Stephen Paul Johnson) |
| Subject: | Re: New RV-8 Builder |
>I'm in the process of building my jig for the RV-8 empennage. I'd
>appreciate any help and words of wisdom from those of you with
experience
>before I screw up my first piece of aluminum! Feel free to e-mail me
>rather than bore everybody on the list with elementary pointers.
>
>Many thanks!!
>
>Don McNamara
>RV-8 Tail Builder
>mcnamara(at)sbt.infi.net
>
Welcome to the list Don,
I will give a VERY brief resume of what I've picked up and found
useful, not just for you but for the others who might be lurking out
there.
1. The jig is best made from laminated 3/4" plywood or 2x4.
2. I found that I will need to file a bit off the inner ends of the
HS-603's to make the holes in the HS609 stiffeners line up just right.
Others also report this.
3. The fabrication of HS-810 and HS-814 is tricky. Use a bandsaw. A
friend pointed out over the weekend that the holes forming the ears in
HS-814 should be started from the back, using a small pilot hole, so
that the radius doesn't cause the drill to wander.
4. Order longer sizes of AN426AD rivets.
5. When possible, drill and cleco with #40 even when #30 is called for
until the final alignment, then go back and use the #30 moving any
holes a small amount as necessary.
Steve Johnson
RV-8, jig finished tomorow, about to put this good advice to the test.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aging rivets & Useless Vari Prime |
nor did I give them
>a shower and a bath or what ever else I have read about.
>4) Take your time and enjoy the project. This will not keep you from work
>hardening your rivets but it will help you to have some fun.
>
>Gary Corde
Gary, WHAT! You mean I didn't have to knit each rivet a bathrobe so they
wouldn't catch cold after their baths. If only I'd known:)
Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barnhart(at)a.crl.com (Dave Barnhart) |
>Can I get a bit of info on types of Lycombing engines that are being used.
>Good or bad. If they needed to be modified (I'm building one of thoes RV6
>with the traning wheel at the front). I'd like a IO-320-???, but what the
>??? is I don't know. Which injector/carb used etc.
I'm in the middle of overhauling an IO32-B1A, so I can speak with *some*
experience about the IO320. (I assume that you know that the IO320 is fuel
injected and the O320 is carburated.)
The first thing ya gotta know is that these engines came in two styles:
1. Standard Cylinder Flange (STD), also know as narrow deck engines
2. Wide Cylinder Flange (WCF), also known as wide deck engines.
Both will fit. WCF engines are the newer style, and given a choice, you'd
prefer a WCF over a STD, but usually you don't get that kind of choice.
As to engine and part numbers, I can only speak to the STD style because
that is what mine is. The WCF IO320 series is covered by an entirely
separate parts manual.
The STD O320 and IO320 parts manual shows these IO320 models:
IO320-B1A, -B1C, -C1A, -D1A, -D1B and -E2A.
TheFollowing eninges all have the fuel injection servo hanging off the aft
face of the oil sump. It will never fit in an RV-6A without changing the
sump:
-B1A, -B1C, and -C1A
The following engines have the fuel injection servo mounted on the bottom
of the sump (where you need it).
-D1B, -E2A
Your best bet is to find ANY IO320, and swap out the sump if necessary.
When looking at pictures of sumps in the parts manual, the most important
thing to look for is the oil pickup tube. SOme engines (mine, for
instance) have the oil pickup tube integral to the sump. Others (the newer
engines) use a separate oil pickup tube. You cannot exchange one for the
other without also exchanging the accessory case.
I'm sorry if I've kinda gone on and on about the sump, but I've just worked
this problem, and the part number maze is unbelievable.
As for the WCF IO320's, I have no idea what the correct part number is.
As for the fuel injector itself, I believe that all of them used the Bendix
RSA5 unit. IMPORTANT: If you are looking at a fuel injected engine with
the idea of buying it, make sure yoiu get the fuel injection servo, fuel
distributor, and injectors. That fuel injection servo is worth about
$1500. If yours is missing, guess what ya gotta do?
The Dec 94 RVator had a good article on engines.
Also, included in the Construction Manual are two very helpful items:
1. a list of all Lycoming engine model numbers and the *major* differences
between them.
2. a list of engines and the production aircraft they were installed in.
I hope this helps.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
barnhart(at)a.crl.com
rv-6 sn 23744
finishing kit on order
fuselage out of the jig
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barnhart(at)a.crl.com (Dave Barnhart) |
| Subject: | Re: RV3-A wing mods |
finnlass(at)ix.netcom.com (Finn Lassen ) wrote:
>I'm building an RV3. I understand that Van's will be sending out the
>plans and even the needed material when it's ready. I requested the
>plans about 2 months ago, but haven't heard back. I suppose they're
>not ready yet?
As I understand it, there needs to be several variations on the
modification kit, dependiong upon how your spars were built and whether or
not you have wing tanks.
Last I heard, they were completing the design of all the variations before
shipping anything out.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
barnhart(at)a.crl.com
rv-6 sn 23744
finishing kit on order
fuselage out of the jig
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barnhart(at)a.crl.com (Dave Barnhart) |
| Subject: | Re: Full Swiveling Tail Wheel |
Rob McAnally mcarob(at)ozemail.com.au wrote:
>Has anybody out there had any experience with the full swiveling tail wheel
>for the RV-6?
>At the time I ordered my kit the new tail wheel was not an option and I was
>supplied with the origional unit.
>Is the new swiveling unit worth the modification of the origional ?
Life will be much easier with a full swivel tailwheel. You can use Van's
or the Aviation Products tailwheel. Either one requires a different
tailwheel spring.
Van's is an improved, less expensive copy of the Aviation Products tailwheel.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
barnhart(at)a.crl.com
rv-6 sn 23744
finishing kit on order
fuselage out of the jig
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barnhart(at)a.crl.com (Dave Barnhart) |
>2. Make sure you use lacquer thinner, not mineral spirits, for cleaning up
> primer. Be thorough.
I actually keep two toughup guns around:
- AN inexpensive gun for shooting primer
- an expensive Binks for shooting topcoats.
As much as you clean the gun, you can never get it REALLY clean.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
barnhart(at)a.crl.com
rv-6 sn 23744
finishing kit on order
fuselage out of the jig
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Kelley <patk(at)mail.ic.net> |
| Subject: | Re: New web site |
Michael Angiulo wrote:
> Wow. In an apartment. Amazing. It's the noise thing I can't believe. My neighbors
hate it and I work inside a completely enclosed house.
Well, there are a few factors. 1st, the apartment building is concrete
and cinder block; noise is pretty well contained. 2nd, the neighborhood
is on a busy street, and the complex is not exactly quiet. Lastly, I am
careful never to rivet during quiet hours. With a little planning, I
can do most riveting during the noon to 4 range on a weekend. Using the
squeezer does not count against this. Swearing loudly at a cut finger
does count as noise .
PatK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Osgood <74774.54(at)CompuServe.COM> |
I came across a posting on Compuserve for a O-360 A1E or O360-C1E for sale and
called the owner. I wanted to post the info on the engine for all to consider.
The engine was in a 96 Scout. TT 13 hours. The oil temp sensor was not seated
properly and most of the oil leaked out during a takeoff. The engine was torn
down and inspected and it was determined that the crank and rods were damaged
and must be replaced. All other pieces are fine. This engine was replaced by
a
new engine in the Scout and is now for sale.
Asking price is $8,000 as is. Includes all accessories including a new
carburator. The old one was put on the new engine before he new that a new carb
was sent with the new engine.
He has a detailed list of items and cost to repair. The current estimated cost
to repair is $8,000. The owner believes this is high and could be done for
about $5,000.
I do not have any affiliation with this person and will not profit from any
sale. I pass this info on so any one who needs an engine can follow up and
decide if it will work for them.
If you would like to talk with the owner his name is: Guy Baldwin
Tulsa, OK
(918) 299-8485
Hope this works for someone
Rick Osgood,
74774.54(at)compuserve.com
Now on left wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JZidek7003(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Banquet at Oshkosh |
Put me in for two.
John Zidek
(913)491-2944
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JZidek7003(at)aol.com |
Gary I will be staying in an airconditioned trailer in the Oshkosh camp
ground the entire week of this great meeting. If you can't find a better
place to stay give me a call. I am building an RV-4 and I am about 4 months
away from flying it. I am looking for someone to give me a ride in an
RV(tail dragger). Anyone else out there that may be looking for a place to
stay, give me a call. Space is limited but who sleeps at Oshkosh anyway.
John Zidek
KC RV-Avatiors
(913) 491-2944
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com (Peter B. Mortensen) |
| Subject: | Re: TOOLS WANTED |
You wrote:
>
Need mostly good used hand
>tools.. for a good home..please send list and prices > my
>email or 757-867-7244. Thank you.
> Stan from Yorktown VA
Stan,
Please give your e-mail address so we can write to you without
bothering the list.
I have some used cleco pliers, drill bits and bucking bars. All are
used from Boeing Surplus. If you send me a private e-mail with your
snail mail address, I will send you a price list. Peter Mortensen
n21pe(at)ix.nectom.com
_______________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au (Geoff Brown) |
| Subject: | Long range fuel tanks |
Hi there,anyone have any ideas on long range fuel tanks? I'm building an
RV6 and am after an extra hour or 2 in fuel. I'll probably end up with the
tip tanks like Jon Johanson (extra 30 litres per side) but I'd like to hear
from anyone who has put extra tanks in.
Ta
Geoff Brown
geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
Geoff Brown
geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au (Geoff Brown) |
| Subject: | landing light position |
I'm on the wings of my RV6 and wondering about where to put the landing
light, wing or nose cowl,(like the Piper Cherokee). Any ideas???
Thanks
Geoff Brown
geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
Geoff Brown
geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au (Geoff Brown) |
| Subject: | plastic coatings on skins |
Hi
I'm having trouble getting the plastic protective coating and glue off some
of my wing skins. A friend of mine is also having trouble so I assume its a
common problem. I've tried kerosene, methylated spirits, petrol, soap,
alumiprep and several others but the glue is very stubborn.
If anyone else knows the problem, and more to the point, knows the cure,
I'd love to hear from them
Thanks
Geoff Brown
geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
Geoff Brown
geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rust47rg(at)one.net |
| Subject: | Re: Engine for Sale |
>The engine was in a 96 Scout. TT 13 hours. The oil temp sensor was not seated
>properly and most of the oil leaked out during a takeoff. The engine was torn
>down and inspected and it was determined that the crank and rods were damaged
>and must be replaced. All other pieces are fine. This engine was replaced
by a
>new engine in the Scout and is now for sale.
>
>Asking price is $8,000 as is. Includes all accessories including a new
>carburator. The old one was put on the new engine before he new that a new
carb
>was sent with the new engine.
>
>He has a detailed list of items and cost to repair. The current estimated cost
>to repair is $8,000. The owner believes this is high and could be done for
>about $5,000.
>
Price the crank before you jump on this one. Even if you could rebuild it
for 5000 that means you have 13 large in it. For a few more you can buy a
new one from Van that has a warranty and hasn't been hurt! Don't discount
the warranty.
In 2 years of flying I've had 2 warranty claims on my 360 and have had no
problems from Lycoming even after 12 months. I have a claim on one of the
original light weight starters right now and I've been flying for 2 years.
Everybody wants to badmouth the Factory but I've found them to be fair.
Regards:
Rusty Gossard
N47RG RV-4 Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Gesele <scottg(at)villagenet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: I'm overhauling my engine |
>Cylinders:
>Well, they *Look* real good, but I'll hold off sending them in until I get
>the bill for what has been done so far.
>
>That's it for now.
>
>Best Regards,
>
>Dave Barnhart
>barnhart(at)a.crl.com
>rv-6 sn 23744
>finishing kit on order
>fuselage out of the jig
>
>
>
>
Dave,
When all is said and done, I'd be curious to know what the final (overall)
cost came to. Even though I already have my engine, it could help others
with the new / overhauled decision.
-Scott N506RV (Installing cowl)
scottg(at)villagenet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Gesele <scottg(at)villagenet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine for Sale |
>Asking price is $8,000 as is. Includes all accessories including a new
>carburator. The old one was put on the new engine before he new that a new
carb
>was sent with the new engine.
>
>He has a detailed list of items and cost to repair. The current estimated cost
>to repair is $8,000. The owner believes this is high and could be done for
>about $5,000.
>
>I do not have any affiliation with this person and will not profit from any
>sale. I pass this info on so any one who needs an engine can follow up and
>decide if it will work for them.
>
>If you would like to talk with the owner his name is: Guy Baldwin
> Tulsa, OK
> (918) 299-8485
>
>Hope this works for someone
>
>Rick Osgood,
>74774.54(at)compuserve.com
>Now on left wing
>
>
Let's see, $8,000 core + $8,000 rebuilding cost (the seller's estimate) =
$16,000. This will get you an engine that HAS BEEN involved in an incident
(after considerable work rebuilding).
I just spent $17,000 for a fresh from the factory, brand spanking new O-320
from Van's. Now I don't feel so bad spending all that money on the engine :)
BTW, a new O-320 sitting in it's box is a real pretty sight.
-Scott N506RV
scottg(at)villagenet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Gesele <scottg(at)villagenet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: landing light position |
>I'm on the wings of my RV6 and wondering about where to put the landing
>light, wing or nose cowl,(like the Piper Cherokee). Any ideas???
>
>Thanks
>
>Geoff Brown
>geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
>
>Geoff Brown
>geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
>
>
>
>
Geoff,
I installed the Duck Works landing light in the left wing leading edge. The
kit is very well laid out, easy to install and looks good. I've never had a
problem seeing a runway a night, then again the project hasn't left the
garage yet :)
-Scott N506RV (installing the cowl)
scottg(at)villagenet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | david_fried(at)smtpgwy.dehavilland.ca |
| Subject: | Re: Long range fuel tanks |
What would happen if you bought an extra tank skin, split it and
spliced it to the ends of your existing tank skins. There is a
potential for up to 50% increase in capacity. You would need some
material for the splice, so maybe 40%.
I haven't given this splice idea much thought, you might be better off
making your own leading edge skins. I bent all of my leading edges
without too much trouble.
A new tank baffle, some ribs and the forward spar web would also be
required. The web could probably be modified if the spar is
unassembled.
Spanwise distribution of mass reduces wing bending moment for a given
wing loading. Roll inertia increases but this aircraft certainly has
enough lateral control power. Obviously you must watch the gross
weight. Van can probably supply you with an approval to increase this
somewhat (~1750 lb.).
The standard tank skins are 4 feet wide. I built longer tanks to
replace volume lost due to the taper in my wing. The total volume is
something like 20 USG each side.
David Fried
DF-6 C-____
dfried(at)dehavilland.ca
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: RV-List: Long range fuel tanks
Date: 7/9/96 10:34 AM
Hi there,anyone have any ideas on long range fuel tanks? I'm building an
RV6 and am after an extra hour or 2 in fuel. I'll probably end up with the
tip tanks like Jon Johanson (extra 30 litres per side) but I'd like to hear
from anyone who has put extra tanks in.
Ta
Geoff Brown
geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
Geoff Brown
geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Phil Arter <arter(at)ncar.ucar.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder bottom fairing |
Mike,
You are right, it does leave a step. I have considered fabbing an
additional skin to wrap around the counterbalance and build it up to the
same level as the rudder skin, but haven't decided if it is worth the effort
(the elevators would also need the same treatment). Problem is I don't have
any material long enough. An interesting thing is that, on the elevators
the small "joggles" in the tip ribs and spars are missing, which means the
skins can't lay flat at that intersection because of the thickness of the
counterbalance wraparound skin. I happened to have some "joggling" pliers
and added joggles so they are like the rudder.
I plan clamp these strips on the inside and drill them at the same time as
the skin/rib. I'm sure they don't go between the rib and skin. I have a
rudder bottom and the edges are square cut unlike all the other tips are
that fit inside the skins. They probably need to be ground down a bit on
the inside so they are the right thickness to come out flush with the skin.
Phil
arter(at)ncar.ucar.edu
>I'm currently building my 8 rudder and have some questions. First off, at
>the top of the rudder there is a counterbalance skin which, if I'm correct,
>portrudes from beneath the rudder skin to wrap the top most rib (the
>counterweight is on the top). Is that right? It looks like this leaves a
>little "step" between the foreward most edge of the rudder skin and the
>counterbalance strip.
>
>The other question has to do with the method for attaching the rudder bottom
>fairing. The plans show a strip which is attached to the bottom rib (on the
>inside? Sandwiched between the skin and the rib flange?). As far as I
>could see the manual made no mention or explanation of when to install this
>strip, whether to use the same rivet holes that the skin/rib were using, or
>to just use some others.
>
>This is all compounded with the fact that I don't have my rudder bottom yet
>(backordered) so I can't test fit it to see what's going on. I don't want
>to rivet the whole rudder together to later find out I had to install those
>strips between the rib and skin.
>
>Can someone please explain how these are attached? I used to have the
>Orndorff tapes, but some guy got my name & address from VAN's when he was
>picking up his kit, he came over to my house to watch me work, and
>"borrowed" my tapes (and a dozen clecos) before disappearing.
>
>Any help would be appreciated (in either locating this guy who stole my
>tapes or in explaining how to finish the top & bottom of the rudder)
>
>Thanks,
>-Mike
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WStucklen(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV Forum Fulton NY |
Would somebody please tell me what format these attached files are in. I
get them as rvlistrv.dat. What application software is used to view
them????????????
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
wstucklen(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Bordelon <greg(at)brokersys.com> |
| Subject: | plastic coatings on skins |
The stuff your using is not strong enough evidently. MEK, Acetone or
Lacquer Thinner will work. The Lacquer Thinner may work best. Wear some
chemical resistance gloves and a breathing apparatus......this stuff can
hurt you long term!
Hi
I'm having trouble getting the plastic protective coating and glue off some
of my wing skins. A friend of mine is also having trouble so I assume its a
common problem. I've tried kerosene, methylated spirits, petrol, soap,
alumiprep and several others but the glue is very stubborn.
If anyone else knows the problem, and more to the point, knows the cure,
I'd love to hear from them
Thanks
Geoff Brown
geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Bordelon <greg(at)brokersys.com> |
| Subject: | Long range fuel tanks |
>Hi there,anyone have any ideas on long range fuel tanks? I'm building an
>RV6 and am after an extra hour or 2 in fuel. I'll probably end up with the
>tip tanks like Jon Johanson (extra 30 litres per side) but I'd like to
hear
>from anyone who has put extra tanks in.
>Geoff Brown
>geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
I too have been interested in this idea. I think someone on the list
mentioned extending the fuel tank out towards the tip by incorporating the
next rib bay into the tank. This will probably require a new tank skin,
extra ribs and a modified web of some kind. That should give the O360 that
extra bit of fuel. I like this idea instead of the additional tanks method
and the associated tank management duties. Extending the rib bay helps me
keep with the KISS method. Any body out there with experience on this?
Greg Bordelon
greg(at)brokersys.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "A. Reichert" <reichera(at)clark.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV Forum Fulton NY |
Can you send this in ASCII format, please?
- Alan
On Tue, 9 Jul 1996 baldcom.net!mailman(at)matronics.com wrote:
[NON-Text Body part not included]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ted French <french(at)computime.bc.ca> |
| Subject: | Grand Rapids Technologies engine monitor |
The engine monitor which is sold by Grand Rapids Technologies is a very
good
unit with which I have had good success. However, there is a potential
problem
with the tach hook-up instructions. The instructions say to use a 10K
resistor
when connecting to the p-lead for magneto sensing. I am aware of at
least 3
people who have had problems with this. The symptom is the tach reading
is
very erratic at all RPM's. The fix is to use a 39k resistor instead.
There is also a new software revision available which will give two AUX
inputs
instead of one. The trade-off is that the temperature choices are now
fixed at
two cyl head temps, and two exh gas sensors. I have not recieved my
revised
software yet so don't know what other changes ther are.
Ted French RV-6A flying with 5hrs on it.
Prince George BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gil(at)rassp.hac.com (Gil Alexander) |
*** big snip ***
>Your best bet is to find ANY IO320, and swap out the sump if necessary.
>When looking at pictures of sumps in the parts manual, the most important
>thing to look for is the oil pickup tube. SOme engines (mine, for
>instance) have the oil pickup tube integral to the sump. Others (the newer
>engines) use a separate oil pickup tube. You cannot exchange one for the
>other without also exchanging the accessory case.
NOTE: this info. for O-320 WCF models - probably OK for others, but check
it carefully first!
I am starting the process of converting an O-320-E2G into a -E2D
(the aft mounted carb of the -E2G hits the -6A nose gear leg while the -E2D
has a mid-mounted carb), and came across the oil pick-up variation problem
mentioned above. According to the guys at Ly-Con in Visalia, this pick-up
variation is not a big deal if you are rebuilding. A exchange sump cost
$300 from them.
The sump with the integral pickup tube _will_ mate with the
accessory cases listed in the O-320 WCF manual. The seperate pickup tube
is removed, and a blanking plate needs to be fabricated to cover the
machined area it was bolted to. The integral pickup in the sump will now
feed oil to the case if the blanking plug is removed from the bottom of the
case oil gallery where it mates to the sump (easy to see, hard to describe
...:^) The same gaskets - with the pick up hole present - are used for
both sumps.
Though not usually done, I think the reverse swap would also work.
In this case, the oil gallery plug would be installed, and the boss
machined to accept the seperate, bolt-on oil pick-up tube. According to
the WCF parts manual pictures, all of the cases have this mounting boss,
it's just not machined if it's not needed.
Apparently, due to the number of -6As being built, the swap from
aft-mounted to mid-mounted carb is the most popular, and is reflected in
the cost of the replacement sump .... :^(
Please note, these are only preliminary findings, and I will do a
full write-up of the sump conversion when I have completed the engine
rebuild (in about 9 - 12 months, I hope ...:^) I just needed to remount
the carb now to proceed with engine installation .... then it gets a
rebuild.
.. hope this helps .... Gil Alexander ... almost completed the
new "wing
storage facility", then
back to
canopies.
gil(at)rassp.hac.com
RV6A, #20701, N64GA (rsvd)
>
>I'm sorry if I've kinda gone on and on about the sump, but I've just worked
>this problem, and the part number maze is unbelievable.
>
>
>Best Regards,
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | patk(at)mail.ic.net (Patrick Kelley) |
| Subject: | Re: Rudder bottom fairing |
>The other question has to do with the method for attaching the rudder bottom
>fairing. The plans show a strip which is attached to the bottom rib (on the
>inside? Sandwiched between the skin and the rib flange?). As far as I
>could see the manual made no mention or explanation of when to install this
>strip, whether to use the same rivet holes that the skin/rib were using, or
>to just use some others.
Assuming that they are like the RV-6 arrangement, they go inside the rib, not
between the rib and skin. I used the same holes. This merely leaves you
with a tab used to attach the rudder bottom. The rudder bottom fairing has
no joggle or flange to fit into the rudder; it just ends flush at the skin.
Sorry for the late reply, somehow I missed this not when you posted it and
only saw it through Phil's reply.
PatK - RV-6A - Left wing getting skinned.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | plastic coatings on skins |
Use a heat gun or hair dryer to heat up the plastic and it
will peel right off.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
Editor, Home Wing Newsletter
http://www.edt.com/homewing
randall(at)edt.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | david riehl <driehl(at)cycor.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Long range fuel tanks |
Greg Bordelon wrote:
>
>
> >Hi there,anyone have any ideas on long range fuel tanks? I'm building an
> >RV6 and am after an extra hour or 2 in fuel. I'll probably end up with the
> >tip tanks like Jon Johanson (extra 30 litres per side) but I'd like to
> hear
> >from anyone who has put extra tanks in.
> >Geoff Brown
> >geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
>
> I too have been interested in this idea. I think someone on the list
> mentioned extending the fuel tank out towards the tip by incorporating the
> next rib bay into the tank. This will probably require a new tank skin,
> extra ribs and a modified web of some kind. That should give the O360 that
> extra bit of fuel. I like this idea instead of the additional tanks method
> and the associated tank management duties. Extending the rib bay helps me
> keep with the KISS method. Any body out there with experience on this?
>
> Greg Bordelon
> greg(at)brokersys.com
My guess is that Vans RV-8 tank skins should be larger when they become available.
For now though John Harmon supplies larger tank skins for the Rocket II that will
fit.
His tanks are 76 litres ( 16.75 Imp Gal ) ( 20 US Gal ) each. Rear baffle extensions
are
also available.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | john henley <j.henley(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | rv6 fuselage bulkhead alignment |
I guess it is time for me to request some help. In building my RV6, I am
using the FJ instructions. when I check alignment of my rear bulkheads by
running strings between F-606 and F-612, I cannot get F-610 to align with
the other bulkheads. There is a gap of approx. 3/16 on each side. I cannot
move it aft because of it being a HS attach bulkhead. I have repeatedly
checked the fore-aft
spacing and it is correct. It appears that the bulkhead may have been manuf.
too narrow but I can't find the dimensions on the plans. Has anyone else had
a similar problem? Help appreciated.
John Henley
j.henley(at)worldnet.att.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E Steffens" <resteffe(at)dpcmail.dukepower.com> |
| Subject: | Plastic skin coverings |
Removing plastic skin coverings
Blow a little heat on them - like from one of those kerosene heaters
or a 'big' hair dryer. I didn't have any trouble, but during the
winter when I had the torpedo kerosene heater going, I let it blow a
bit on the skins and the plastic came off real easy.
Dick Steffens
resteffe(at)dpcmail.dukepower.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dr John Cocker <jcocker(at)interhop.net> |
I am at the stage where I need to fit an alternator. They seem to be either
very expensive, or they are the El-Cheapo ones for cars. There is an
alternator shop nearby which has reconditioned ones, the Japanese types are
$110, they may be reconditioned, or they may just have black paint sprayed
on the outside.
I would appreciate some guidelines.
John Cocker.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Japundza <bob(at)holli.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Long range fuel tanks |
Greg Bordelon wrote:
>
>
> >Hi there,anyone have any ideas on long range fuel tanks? I'm building an
> >RV6 and am after an extra hour or 2 in fuel. I'll probably end up with the
> >tip tanks like Jon Johanson (extra 30 litres per side) but I'd like to
> hear
> >from anyone who has put extra tanks in.
> >Geoff Brown
> >geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
>
> I too have been interested in this idea. I think someone on the list
> mentioned extending the fuel tank out towards the tip by incorporating the
> next rib bay into the tank. This will probably require a new tank skin,
> extra ribs and a modified web of some kind. That should give the O360 that
> extra bit of fuel. I like this idea instead of the additional tanks method
> and the associated tank management duties. Extending the rib bay helps me
> keep with the KISS method. Any body out there with experience on this?
>
> Greg Bordelon
> greg(at)brokersys.com
Greg,
The Harom Rocket II has this arrangement--the fuel tank skins are
extended one more rib outward for a couple of gallons extra fuel-- I
don't think it is vey much. The spar is also modified so that there is
extra flange length on the front side so the extended fuel tank has
something to mount on to.
Bob Japundza
RV-6 canopy being fitted
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Angiulo <mikeang(at)MICROSOFT.com> |
| Subject: | Rudder bottom fairing |
I spoke with Tom at Van's and he said that the counterbalance skin on the
elevator does get sandwiched between the skin and rib, that there will be a
step and a resulting crease, and to just deal with it. He said if you want
to get carried away you can bevel the edge of the counterbalance skin and
make sure that the edge falls in between two rivet holes to minimize the
crease.
I don't like that answer so I'm going to fabricate a shim to run the rest
of the length of the elevator tip ribs (towards the elevator TE) to cause
the skin to lie flush. I don't have joggling pliers, nor do I see how you
can create a joggle across the two webs of the back to back tip ribs.
-Mike
Building left elevator
----------
From: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com[SMTP:owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com] on
behalf of Phil Arter
Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 1996 9:14 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Rudder bottom fairing
Mike,
You are right, it does leave a step. I have considered fabbing an
additional skin to wrap around the counterbalance and build it up to the
same level as the rudder skin, but haven't decided if it is worth the
effort
(the elevators would also need the same treatment). Problem is I don't
have
any material long enough. An interesting thing is that, on the elevators
the small "joggles" in the tip ribs and spars are missing, which means the
skins can't lay flat at that intersection because of the thickness of the
counterbalance wraparound skin. I happened to have some "joggling" pliers
and added joggles so they are like the rudder.
I plan clamp these strips on the inside and drill them at the same time as
the skin/rib. I'm sure they don't go between the rib and skin. I have a
rudder bottom and the edges are square cut unlike all the other tips are
that fit inside the skins. They probably need to be ground down a bit on
the inside so they are the right thickness to come out flush with the
skin.
Phil
arter(at)ncar.ucar.edu
>I'm currently building my 8 rudder and have some questions. First off, at
>the top of the rudder there is a counterbalance skin which, if I'm
correct,
>portrudes from beneath the rudder skin to wrap the top most rib (the
>counterweight is on the top). Is that right? It looks like this leaves a
>little "step" between the foreward most edge of the rudder skin and the
>counterbalance strip.
>
>The other question has to do with the method for attaching the rudder
bottom
>fairing. The plans show a strip which is attached to the bottom rib (on
the
>inside? Sandwiched between the skin and the rib flange?). As far as I
>could see the manual made no mention or explanation of when to install
this
>strip, whether to use the same rivet holes that the skin/rib were using,
or
>to just use some others.
>
>This is all compounded with the fact that I don't have my rudder bottom
yet
>(backordered) so I can't test fit it to see what's going on. I don't want
>to rivet the whole rudder together to later find out I had to install
those
>strips between the rib and skin.
>
>Can someone please explain how these are attached? I used to have the
>Orndorff tapes, but some guy got my name & address from VAN's when he was
>picking up his kit, he came over to my house to watch me work, and
>"borrowed" my tapes (and a dozen clecos) before disappearing.
>
>Any help would be appreciated (in either locating this guy who stole my
>tapes or in explaining how to finish the top & bottom of the rudder)
>
>Thanks,
>-Mike
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Phil Arter <arter(at)ncar.ucar.edu> |
Anybody ever used ACF-50 during assembly and tried to paint the exterior
afterwards, or is it like silicone spray?
Phil
arter(at)ncar.ucar.edu
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Harold Sutphin <hsutphin(at)magicnet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: plastic coatings on skins |
Just a general comment to the RV listers, some of you are aware that
there are search engines set up for ALL of the past RV list postings,
some folks are new and have not used them. Try one before you post a
question - it really works quite well and the plus is that you get your
answer instantly. Try this search engine next time you have an RV
question. As an example for the query below you could search on the word
"plastic" and find it in the subject line on your first try (along with
a lot of other hits). It cuts down on list traffic. So much to read
so little time...since we have grown so large!!
http://dunkin.Princeton.EDU/.rvlist/
Harold
RV-6A //wing kit arriving this week...please//
> Hi
> I'm having trouble getting the plastic protective coating and glue off some
> of my wing skins. A friend of mine is also having trouble so I assume its a
> common problem. I've tried kerosene, methylated spirits, petrol, soap,
> alumiprep and several others but the glue is very stubborn.
> If anyone else knows the problem, and more to the point, knows the cure,
> I'd love to hear from them
> Thanks
>
> Geoff Brown
> geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Terryg(at)SceptreCal.CCMAIL.CompuServe.COM |
| Subject: | VS Tip Attach (Long) |
'Listers -- a couple of weeks back, I posed a question on the subject of
attaching the fibreglass tip to a vertical stabilizer -- at least one where the
flange had been trimmed by a quarter of an inch too much (oops)...although very
belated, here's a short summary of the answers...at the very end I have put some
thoughts as to what I think I'm going to do at this point...thanx to all that
replied! Cheers...TCG
****** One of my fellow Canucks on the East Coast, Joe Hine, suggested...
"Glue it on with proseal. You have to heat it and expand it a bit so
it is a tight fit in the top of the VS. I masked the top of the VS and a
line about 1/8 inch up the tip from the line the top of the VS would make
and then spread proseal on the fiberglass and pressed it in place. I then
took a popsical stick and make a nice neat bead of proseal at the joint,
using the excess that squeezed out.
Looks good, no rivits, the proseal takes paint ok. I just hope I never have
to take it off."
****** Joe then followed up with...
"Just to clarify a little I do have four rivits in mine that I put there just
for a peace of mind thing, but I would just glue it now. I have since glued the
vent for fresh air to the fus. side with proseal and it cannot be moved. I
would have no problem with gluing the tips now.
Having said that, its not an easy job. As I said you have to get them to
the right shape so they stay in place by friction before you apply the
proseal."
****** Greg Bordelon suggested...
"I think in this case I'd just glue the tip on and glass it in. I'm not a fan of
glass stuff to aluminum but I think in this case that would be the ideal fix.
Just drill a couple of holes to cleco the thing together while the glue
cures.You could also just glue a block of foam to the VS and make a new glassed
in tip.....this may be redundant as you already have a tip. OR you could drill
our the tip rivets and re-rivet back together with a new strip flange on the
inside of rib flange. This new flange would extend past your skin and the
fiberglass tip would slip over it. Anyhow, I'm going to put
antenna/strobe/lights and stuff in the tips. I really don't think your going to
like that strobe in the VS tip. I'd glass it in!"
****** Eric Henson suggested...
"After talking to some guru types they have assured me its no big deal.
If your cuts are like mine when you try to line up the caps the bottom edges
might not extend far enough (my cuts ended up angled, front is fine, the
back is down to 1/4 of an inch) so I am glassing some extensions to the
bottoms that will also have alum. strips backing. Everyone tells me rivets
are not needed so I will epoxy my caps on and back up with a couple of pops
per side ( as Frank J. says I'm a nervous type).
Sounds like you on the other hand want yours removable, I did at first too
and chewed on this a great deal. I figured I would do the glass extensions
as above. Then pop (symetrically of course) through the tip rib itself
instead of through the skin. The cosmetics would of course depend on
properly altering the rib or (gulp) building one from scratch that would be
a custom fit. Yuck. Structurally I don't think it's a problem."
****** My own thinking at the time was...
"1) The rivets attaching the VS tip are shown a 1/4" back from the top of the
VS. I can still do that with mine, although I'll end up nicking the edge of
the flange of the tip rib. Also, I'll have to modify the flange a little on the
tip itself.
2) I can attach a nut plate behind each of the two tooling holes in the tip rib,
and again, with a few minor changes to the tip itself, screw the tip on with two
bolts into these nutplates. I'll have to make sure that they can seal though,
so that they don't permit water to enter the VS."
****** And here's what I think I'll do...
I'll have to admit that I've basically been staring at this problem for the last
month, and haven't made much physical progress, although I think I have solved
the problem and know what I'll do. It's a variation on my plan to put a couple
of plate nuts behind the tooling holes. In fact, I think what I'll do is put a
*single* plat nut behind the aft tooling hole in the tip rib, sized for a
quarter inch bolt. I'll build up a little structure inside the tip that will
support a countersink for the bolt (which will probably be nylon). At the front
of the tip, I will fashion some arrangement of hooks. To attach the tip. you'll
set it in place, and then push it forward to engage these hooks, and then insert
and tighten the bolt at the back. The intention is to have a tip that's
removable, with one bolt. I will trim the flange on the fibreglass a little to
clear the flanges on the tip rib inside the skin.
I very much liked the idea of Prosealing the thing on and forgetting about it,
but I've still got this idea that there's going to be an antenna or light up
there, and the removable arrangement seems to better suit that possibility.
Hope this helps, folks...cheers...
Terry in Calgary
S/N 24414
"The Empennage Stiffener King"
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: rv6 fuselage bulkhead alignment |
| From: | "Calin Brabandt" <cwbraban(at)ichips.intel.com> |
John Henley laments:
> I cannot get F-610 to align with
> the other bulkheads. There is a gap of approx. 3/16 on each side. I cannot
> move it aft because of it being a HS attach bulkhead. I have repeatedly
> checked the fore-aft
> spacing and it is correct. It appears that the bulkhead may have been manuf.
> too narrow but I can't find the dimensions on the plans. Has anyone else had
> a similar problem? Help appreciated.
John,
Before you commit this bulkhead to a permanent position, it would be
good to check where your h-stab front spar attach angle hits. This
dimension (and the ones that affect where your v-stab to h-stab spar
splice plate falls) often don't work out quite right and the splice
plate junction often requires shims or a taller splice plate. If you're
lucky, you may be able to move the bulkhead aft, still get the bolts
through the h-stab attach angles with enough edge distance and at least
reduce the side shims under the skin to something less than 3/16".
Cal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chester razer <crazer(at)egyptian.net> |
| Subject: | Re: rv6 fuselage bulkhead alignment |
john henley wrote:
>
> I guess it is time for me to request some help. In building my RV6, I am
> using the FJ instructions. when I check alignment of my rear bulkheads by
> running strings between F-606 and F-612, I cannot get F-610 to align with
> the other bulkheads. There is a gap of approx. 3/16 on each side. I cannot
> move it aft because of it being a HS attach bulkhead. I have repeatedly
> checked the fore-aft
> spacing and it is correct. It appears that the bulkhead may have been manuf.
> too narrow but I can't find the dimensions on the plans. Has anyone else had
> a similar problem? Help appreciated.
>
> John Henley
> j.henley(at)worldnet.att.net
Yes, I had exactly the same problem, The fix is to center
the bulkhead and after the skin is drilled go back and
insert individual shims or shim strips. I riveted my strips
in place but I read on the list where some guys have been
hot gluing them in place until final riveting
chet: fuse out of jig
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: rv6 fuselage bulkhead alignment |
...
> when I check alignment of my rear bulkheads by
> running strings between F-606 and F-612, I cannot get F-610 to align with
> the other bulkheads
I posted this a month or two ago, not sure whether it made it
to the list though....
----
This is an issue that I came up against, and although the answer
is still somewhat ambiguous, I went through an interesting
process, and found out some things about this very issue that you
probably want to consider.
On the bulkhead fabrication drawing (my old one, I didn't get a new
one either), at some point there was a revision to widen the F-607
and F-608 bulkheads by 1/8" per side, or 1/4" overall. Local lore had
it that this was done on purpose "so the skins would lie better". When
I got my fuselage all jigged up I found that there was a bulge in the
longerons because of this widening. I decided to call Vans and confirm
that this was indeed supposed to be there, since nothing was said about
it in the manual, and in fact the longeron curve profile on dwg #22
specifically shows the longeron being "straight aft of this point".
Tom and Bill both told me no, the longerons are supposed to be straight,
the revision was because previously the bulkheads were too narrow. Not
being satisfied with this, I did the geometry and found that
mathematically, using the dimensions prior to the revision, and at the
station lines called out, the bulkhead sides would all have formed a straight
line. The extra 1/8" per side added in the revision would add a bulge,
and you'd have to move the station lines to make them straight again.
I pointed this out to Vans (they really hate it when you do that) but they
were still not convinced, and told me if I had to change the station lines
to make them straight, then do so. This seemed REALLY wierd to me -- if I
had to move the station lines BECAUSE of the revision, then why the revision
in the first place, and why not move the station lines at the same time
as the widening of the bulkheads?
As a reality check I looked at four other RV-6s under construction in the
area, and ALL of them had this bulge. So I decided to track down the "lore"
that said they were SUPPOSED to bulge. I finally found that it originally came
from Art Chard, who as we all know used to build prototypes for Vans. Art
told me that yes, a side effect of the way the tailcone skins are rolled is
that there is a slight curve to the skins perpindicular to the bottom "curl",
and that the bulge was added so as to offset the tendency of the skins to
oil-can. He also said that aerodynamically, an 1/8" bulge should be
insignificant.
So according to Art Chard, there is SUPPOSED to be a 1/8" bulge per
side between the F-606 and F-610.
I went back to Vans with this, and they finally conceeded that there
may have been a revision such as this that no one remembered the reason
for, but they also said that they went out and laid a straightedge up
against the factory demonstrators, which were all built by Art Chard,
and they couldn't detect any bulge. Go figure.
So I left the bulge in. I did end up widening the next aft bukhead by 1/16"
(F-610) to remove a slight "fishtail" flairing at that point. Now when you
sight down it you can see a slight curve, but otherwise it's undetectable.
My skins lie nice and smooth, and there appears to be no oil canning.
Bottom line is, I really don't know if it helped or not, but at least it
didn't hurt anything.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
Editor, Home Wing Newsletter
http://www.edt.com/homewing
randall(at)edt.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | rv6 fuselage bulkhead alignment |
| From: | "Sam Ray" <str(at)almaden.ibm.com> |
> I guess it is time for me to request some help. In building my RV6, I am
>using the FJ instructions. when I check alignment of my rear bulkheads by
>running strings between F-606 and F-612, I cannot get F-610 to align with
>the other bulkheads. There is a gap of approx. 3/16 on each side. I cannot
>move it aft because of it being a HS attach bulkhead. I have repeatedly
>checked the fore-aft
>spacing and it is correct. It appears that the bulkhead may have been manuf.
>too narrow but I can't find the dimensions on the plans. Has anyone else had
>a similar problem? Help appreciated.
I know of another builder who had the same problem; he split the bulkhead and
spliced the two halves to fit. His fuselage skins look smooth.
Sam Ray
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Haan <bobh(at)synopsys.com> |
| Subject: | Re: plastic coatings on skins |
Heating up the plastic protective coating makes it much easier to remove.
>Hi
>I'm having trouble getting the plastic protective coating and glue off some
>of my wing skins. A friend of mine is also having trouble so I assume its a
>common problem. I've tried kerosene, methylated spirits, petrol, soap,
>alumiprep and several others but the glue is very stubborn.
>If anyone else knows the problem, and more to the point, knows the cure,
>I'd love to hear from them
>Thanks
>
>Geoff Brown
>geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
>
>Geoff Brown
>geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
Bob Haan
Portland, OR
RV6-A 2 wings in the jigs, LEs, Top Skins, Tanks, Ailerons, Flaps done
bobh(at)synopsys.com
Evenings 503-636-3550
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
| Subject: | Re: rv6 fuselage bulkhead alignment |
> I guess it is time for me to request some help. In building my RV6, I am
>using the FJ instructions. when I check alignment of my rear bulkheads by
>running strings between F-606 and F-612, I cannot get F-610 to align with
>the other bulkheads. There is a gap of approx. 3/16 on each side. I cannot
>move it aft because of it being a HS attach bulkhead. I have repeatedly
>checked the fore-aft
>spacing and it is correct. It appears that the bulkhead may have been manuf.
>too narrow but I can't find the dimensions on the plans. Has anyone else had
>a similar problem? Help appreciated.
>John Henley
John, I had the same problem when I built my fuse several years ago. I
ended up cutting the bulhead so that the top would fit flush with the top of
the fuselage and riveted on doublers per AC 43.13 to close the gap. It
seems that some builders have bulkheads that fit perfectly and others have
to do modifications. There may be differences in form blocks or maybe it's
just the way things turn out. Anyway, while frustrating, it's an easy fix.
Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EBundy2620(at)aol.com |
<< I am at the stage where I need to fit an alternator. They seem to be
either
very expensive, or they are the El-Cheapo ones for cars. There is an
alternator shop nearby which has reconditioned ones, the Japanese types are
$110, they may be reconditioned, or they may just have black paint sprayed
on the outside. >>
I opted for the one from Van's. It's $140, and comes with really nice
machined, anodized aluminum mounting brakets. The unit is a rebuilt and
looks really nice. I haven't flown it yet, so who knows?
Ed Bundy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com |
| Subject: | Re: landing light position |
>I'm on the wings of my RV6 and wondering about where to put the landing
>light, wing or nose cowl,(like the Piper Cherokee). Any ideas???
>
>Thanks
>
>Geoff Brown
>geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
>
>Geoff Brown
>geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
>
>
>
>
Most RV's I have seen use the wing, either the outer bay or wingtip. Don
Wentz has a nice lightweight, easy to install kit which goes in the last
bay. I saw a wingtip model at Chief a couple of weeks ago made for a 6.
Ross Mickey
rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GHLX34A(at)prodigy.com (MR GEORGE T KILISHEK) |
| Subject: | Re: RV-List:Empennage/HS Ribs |
Tripp:
I'm at just that stage now on my RV-8, and here's what I'm about to
do: (1) Place a single rivet in the center of the HS-404 flange,
trimmed as per the plans. (2) Fabricate a second flange for the rear
of the HS-404, with a single rivet tothe spar. (3) After aligning,
drilling and clecoing all of this lashup, remove the HS-404 and rivet
the rear flange to the spar. (4) After the skin is rivetted to the
center rib and front spar, attach the HS-404 to the auxiliary flange
with three pop rivets. (5) Rivet the front flange of the HS-404 just
like God intended, only using a single rivet.
George Kilishek
Getting ready to skin HS.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kingm(at)whidbey.net (Monte King) |
| Subject: | Long range fuel tanks |
Mark Myres installed two 5 gallon header tanks in front of the 688 subpanel
on his -6. He installed a single filler spout on the top front fuselage
skin. It worked just great and kept the weight as far forward as is
possible. He'll be at Oshkosh for anyone that wants to look them over.
Monte King
RV-6A
>
>>Hi there,anyone have any ideas on long range fuel tanks? I'm building an
>>RV6 and am after an extra hour or 2 in fuel. I'll probably end up with the
>>tip tanks like Jon Johanson (extra 30 litres per side) but I'd like to
>hear
>>from anyone who has put extra tanks in.
>>Geoff Brown
>>geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
>
>I too have been interested in this idea. I think someone on the list
>mentioned extending the fuel tank out towards the tip by incorporating the
>next rib bay into the tank. This will probably require a new tank skin,
>extra ribs and a modified web of some kind. That should give the O360 that
>extra bit of fuel. I like this idea instead of the additional tanks method
>and the associated tank management duties. Extending the rib bay helps me
>keep with the KISS method. Any body out there with experience on this?
>
>Greg Bordelon
>greg(at)brokersys.com
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Smidler <smidler(at)dcwi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: plastic coatings on skins |
Geoff Brown wrote:
>
> Hi
> I'm having trouble getting the plastic protective coating and glue off some
> of my wing skins. A friend of mine is also having trouble so I assume its a
> common problem. I've tried kerosene, methylated spirits, petrol, soap,
> alumiprep and several others but the glue is very stubborn.
> If anyone else knows the problem, and more to the point, knows the cure,
> I'd love to hear from them
> Thanks
>
> Geoff Brown
> geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
>
> Geoff Brown
> geoffbro(at)ozemail.com.au
Try using your hair dryer on them. I heard of this solution after I
already fought the problem and know how difficult it can be.
Frank Smidler
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Smidler <smidler(at)dcwi.com> |
| Subject: | Tim the Tool Man Taylor syndrom |
With great difficulty I am writing this because I just got back from a
late night trip to the emergency room and my right hand is still numb
from getting three stiches in the middle finger (now I have a reason to
hold it up). Leason to be learned.... deburred and rounded edges of
alum sheet (used scotch bright on them) can still put a nasty gash in
ones finger if you run it by fast enough. But on a more possitve note,
I did get the flap weldment mounted.
Frank Smidler
Looking for that $200 garage sale O-360.
N96FS (reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com (Peter B. Mortensen) |
| Subject: | Re: Tim the Tool Man Taylor syndrom |
You wrote:
>
>With great difficulty I am writing this because I just got back from a
>late night trip to the emergency room and my right hand is still numb
>from getting three stiches in the middle finger (now I have a reason
to
>hold it up). Leason to be learned.... deburred and rounded edges of
>alum sheet (used scotch bright on them) can still put a nasty gash in
>ones finger if you run it by fast enough. But on a more possitve
note,
>I did get the flap weldment mounted.
>
>Frank Smidler
>Looking for that $200 garage sale O-360.
>N96FS (reserved)
>
Frank, you are obviously not deburring adequately. I use sandpaper on
all edges until they are completely smooth. There is not a single edge
or corner on my plane one could hurt oneself on.
I hope your finger heels quickly. Also, if you live anywhere near NY
or LA, be very careful how you orient that sick finger or you may get
hurt even worse.
Peter Mortensen. n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com
___________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WStucklen(at)aol.com |
<< I am at the stage where I need to fit an alternator. They seem to be
either
very expensive, or they are the El-Cheapo ones for cars. There is an
alternator shop nearby which has reconditioned ones, the Japanese types are
$110, they may be reconditioned, or they may just have black paint sprayed
on the outside.
I would appreciate some guidelines.
John Cocker.
>>
John:
I have an 60 Amp automotive alternator in my RV-6A. It does not have the
regulator built into it. The only drawback that I have found is that the
fiels wire is connected with a plastic plug instead of the screw/nut
arrangement on an aircraft quality unit. The draw back to the plastic plug is
that it can, and has, come loose. The solution is to use hi temp RTV to
"rubber band" it in place.......
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
wstucklen(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Gesele <scottg(at)villagenet.com> |
>
>I opted for the one from Van's. It's $140, and comes with really nice
>machined, anodized aluminum mounting brakets. The unit is a rebuilt and
>looks really nice. I haven't flown it yet, so who knows?
>
>Ed Bundy
>
Ed,
When you installed the alternator, did you need to put additional spacers
between the adjustment arm and engine case. Mine did not want to line up
unless I added about 4-5 washers. Otherwise the installation went smoothly.
Did you notice the cost of those anodized mounting brackets? About $50 for
the alternator to case bracket. Oh well, they do look good and probably
required a bunch of work to manufacture.
-Scott N506RV
scottg(at)villagenet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jack Abell <abell(at)rand.org> |
Could someone please supply me with an address or phone number for Chief
Aircraft?
Many thanks.
Jack Abell
RV-6A N333JA (Reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)ltec.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tim the Tool Man Taylor syndrom |
>>hold it up). Leason to be learned.... deburred and rounded edges of
>>alum sheet (used scotch bright on them) can still put a nasty gash in
>>ones finger if you run it by fast enough. But on a more possitve
>note,
>>I did get the flap weldment mounted.
>>Frank Smidler
>Frank, you are obviously not deburring adequately. I use sandpaper on
>all edges until they are completely smooth. There is not a single edge
>or corner on my plane one could hurt oneself on.
>I hope your finger heels quickly. Also, if you live anywhere near NY
>or LA, be very careful how you orient that sick finger or you may get
>hurt even worse.
>Peter Mortensen. n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com
The double edged "V" deburring tool that Avery sells does a good job of
deburring and is much faster than Scotch brite, files or sandpaper. Bob
Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dan Boudro <dboudro(at)nmia.com> |
I bought the mounting bracket kit from Van's (it had a chunk of al that you
cut the arm out of) and two steel brackets used for engine mounts. I then
went down to the local auto electric store and bought a GM alternator. I
browsed through the book looking for one that might fit. The newer ones are
smaller and lighter than older ones. I choose one, it happened to be a
100 amp but looked ok. When I got it home I found I still had to modify
the cowl to get it to fit but that's life. Put a bubble in the cowl, hung
the alternator (internal regulator) and things have been fine so far. I've
never seen it put out more than 14 amps immediately after startup, it
usually runs between 2-5 amps during flight. I have a digital volt/amp
meter connected through the alternator lead (EI from Van's). It shows
about 14.1V when the engine is on and about 12.1 when the alt is not
running. I've got a 35amp sealed lead batt (Concord). So far, so good
with 54 hours and climbing fast! I use a piece of fuseable link between
the alternator and master relay to protect stuff. I'm a electrical
engineer that works on computers but my degree was in power. This stuff
isn't rocket science but I know if your unfamiliar with it, it could seem
scary. There's lots of ways to get this done, I choose what seemed to
be the simplest for me. :-)
Dan Boudro
RV-4 N9167Z
Albuquerque, NM
dboudro(at)nmia.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EBundy2620(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Voltage regulators |
Does anyone have any thoughts on voltage regulators? I don't know much about
them, but I was wondering what the difference is between the unit Van's sells
at $36 and the one I can buy at the local auto parts store for $13.
Are there differences in regulators or are they all about the same?
Thanks
Ed Bundy
ebundy2620(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EBundy2620(at)aol.com |
I thought I'd post this in case anyone's interested.
I never felt real comfortable about the way the fuel valve (at least on the
6) operates. It has a little tiny "pointer" that points at the port in use
and a big "handle" to operate it. Unfortunately, all of the aircraft I've
ever flown (Cessnas and Mooneys primarily) have a "pointer" that looks like
the handle on the 6 valve.
I had visions of switching to the right tank (via the pointer) but thinking
it was the left tank (as it would be on most factory-iron).
So after much head-scratching, a simple fix dawned on me. I ground off the
pointer on the valve, and plumbed the ports backwards (left port to right
tank and vice-versa). Voila! Now what I consider to be the real pointer
(the fat handle) points to the correct tank.
My apologies if this was obvious (or not a problem) to everyone else...
Ed Bundy
ebundy2620(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | inet(at)intellisys.net (brian whatcott) |
| Subject: | Re: VS Tip Attach (Long) |
///
> In fact, I think what I'll do is put a
>*single* plat nut behind the aft tooling hole in the tip rib, sized for a
>quarter inch bolt. I'll build up a little structure inside the tip that will
>support a countersink for the bolt (which will probably be nylon). At the
front
>of the tip, I will fashion some arrangement of hooks...
////
>Terry in Calgary
>S/N 24414
>"The Empennage Stiffener King"
>
>
A QUARTER inch bolt?
I reached for the keyboard immediately.
That's what Rolls-Royce have hung COMPLETE engines from!
-Then I saw the nylon bolt idea, and cooled right down...
brian
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
The import alternator's work great. I have a unit that I got from Mark
Landoll (not for the faint at heart) that work's great. One friend has a
Honda 55 amp that works great as well. Another friend has a B&C unit which
looks great - and is small and light - but they are expensive. The best thing
you can do to increase the life of your alternator is to have a blast tube on
it.
Depending on the pully on your fly wheel, you may need to change the pully on
the alternator. I think that there are two size pullys on Lycoming
flywheels, 7 & 9 inches. The larger pullys require the change on the
alternator.
PS A word about Landoll's stuff.
Marks workmanship is bad...at best. However, with that said I am using his
alternator bracket and starter bracket (that's the components that he
manufacturers. The alternater is a Ford/Mazda truck unit and the starter is
from a Datsun 280ZX or 810). As bad as his components look, they work great.
Factor in that they're cheep and they are good buys. Once you mount these
units you can't see the brackets anyway.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
Don't use ACF-50 until after the aircraft is finished and painted. That
stuff will find its way into and through everything. There is a good chance
that it will cause a problem when you paint because it never really dries.
But then again, if you give your plane a good wash it shouldn't matter...but
why chance it. If you store your parts in a dry place there is no reason to
fog 'em anyway.
That stuff is great. I wish that I knew about it when I was building my RV
because I would have NEVER wasted my time priming alclad Alumnium.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Edward Cole <emcole(at)cris.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Chief Aircraft |
Jack Abell wrote:
>
> Could someone please supply me with an address or phone number for Chief
> Aircraft?
>
> Many thanks.
>
> Jack Abell
> RV-6A N333JA (Reserved)Jack,
Chief Aircraft
1-800-447-3408
fax 1-541-479-4431
email chief(at)magick.net
1301 Brookside Blvd.
Grants Pass, OR 97526
Ed Cole
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
>I thought I'd post this in case anyone's interested.
>
>
>
>So after much head-scratching, a simple fix dawned on me. I ground off the
>pointer on the valve, and plumbed the ports backwards (left port to right
>tank and vice-versa). Voila! Now what I consider to be the real pointer
>(the fat handle) points to the correct tank.
>
>
>Ed Bundy
>ebundy2620(at)aol.com
>
>
Ed,
Be REAL SURE that if anyone other than you flys the airplane that they are
told about this modification. I know that I'd be really unhappy if I had
taken your aircraft for a jaunt and ran out of gas because the valve was
pointing in the wrong direction.
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
Flying 5 years
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Modifying 0-360s to fit RV-6A |
I just bought a used O-360F1A6 which allegedly came out of a Cessna 172RG,
knowing full well that it did not have the straight riser sump which is
needed on my tricycle nose gear. However, a Lycoming Tech Rep was very
helpful to me, and he gave me permission to put his phone number on the RV
list. He is also an EAA member. His name is Bob Ohnmeiss, Phone
1-717-327-7127. He gave me the Lycoming part numbers which I would need to
convert my engine to a straight riser sump:
Straight Riser Sump #78915
Pipes (4) #70485
Clamps (2) #73346
4 Hoses #69603
Sump Gasket #LW15353
Bob also recommended that I get carburetor part #10-5193. I found a used
Straight Riser Sump, Pipes and Clamps for $750. I can apparently turn in my
10-5235 carburetor for $400 credit so that Aircraft Spruce's rebuilt #10-5193
will cost me another $749. I found that used 0-360s with a straight riser
sump were very hard to come by, so it may be that others can find a different
0-360 and convert it as I am doing. A new straight riser sump costs $1273
from the local Lycoming dealer. My converted engine cannot be certified, but
for my experimental purposes, that is ok. By the way, if you may want a
constant speed prop, do not get a solid crank engine. Th'e conversion costs
then become prohibitive. I am just taking my fuselage out of the jig, so I
am a long way from flying this engine and proving that all of the above works
satisfactorily. Also, I am a novice pilot. I just got my PPASEL yesterday
at age 71. So Beware.
dougpage(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | inet(at)intellisys.net (brian whatcott) |
>
I use a piece of fuseable link between
>the alternator and master relay to protect stuff. I'm a electrical
>engineer that works on computers but my degree was in power.
///
>Dan Boudro
>RV-4 N9167Z
>Albuquerque, NM
>dboudro(at)nmia.com
>
The fuse link - was it regular fuse link cable like used in cars?
Can you tell us how to determine the fuse load? Is there
a color-code? How do you splice it?
thanks
brian
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | inet(at)intellisys.net (brian whatcott) |
>...A word about Landoll's stuff.
>Marks workmanship is bad...at best. However, with that said I am using his
>alternator bracket and starter bracket (that's the components that he
>manufacturers.
////
>Gary Corde
>RV-6 N211GC
>
>
Ouch! If there are no sharp notches or deep scratches on bends
so much the better. A loose generator is an uncomfortable thought
if you're into electronic ignition or electric fuel pumps....
brian whatcott
Altus
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bcon(at)ix.netcom.com (Robert M. Cornacchia ) |
| Subject: | Re: Chief Aircraft |
You wrote:
>
>
>Could someone please supply me with an address or phone number for
Chief
>Aircraft?
>
>Many thanks.
>
>Jack Abell
>RV-6A N333JA (Reserved)
>
Hi Jack,
Chief Aircraft Inc.
Grants Pass Airport
1301 Brookside Boulevard
Grants Pass, OR 97526
1-800-447-3408
Open
Monday - Friday 6:00 am to 6:00 pm PT
Sat. 9:00am to 4:00pm Pacific Time
Goodbye,
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don McNamara <fang(at)sbt.infi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 assistance |
Thanks for the welcome! I've received many helpful hints and have found
much useful, if confusing, information on this list and elsewhere online.
I've read much about three sources of building reference: Van's manuals
(supplied with the kits), Frank Justice's manual for the RV-6A (online),
and the Orndorff(sp?) tapes.
Some questions: 1) Is anyone compiling a reference manual similar to
FJ's for the RV-8? 2) Is anyone out there done with the videos and want
to sell them? 3) Will they be coming out with videos specifically for
the -8, thus making question #2 irrelevant?
My jig's done, it's square, it's empty. I'm trying to glean as much info
as possible before I start sticking pieces together. I think this is
just a variation on a theme...buck fever.
Don McNamara
Granger, IN
mcnamara(at)sbt.infi.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com (Peter B. Mortensen) |
| Subject: | Re: Tim the Tool Man Taylor syndrom |
You wrote:
>
>>>hold it up). Leason to be learned.... deburred and rounded edges of
>>>alum sheet (used scotch bright on them) can still put a nasty gash
in
>>>ones finger if you run it by fast enough. But on a more possitve
>>note,
>>>I did get the flap weldment mounted.
>>>Frank Smidler
>>Frank, you are obviously not deburring adequately. I use sandpaper
on
>>all edges until they are completely smooth. There is not a single
edge
>>or corner on my plane one could hurt oneself on.
>>I hope your finger heels quickly. Also, if you live anywhere near NY
>>or LA, be very careful how you orient that sick finger or you may get
>>hurt even worse.
>>Peter Mortensen. n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com
>
>The double edged "V" deburring tool that Avery sells does a good job
of
>deburring and is much faster than Scotch brite, files or sandpaper.
Bob
>Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)ltec.net
The V tool is just the starting point for me. After that I sand it
round and smooth. Peter n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com
___________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com (Peter B. Mortensen) |
| Subject: | Re: Modifying 0-360s to fit RV-6A |
You wrote:
>
>I just bought a used O-360F1A6 which allegedly came out of a Cessna
172RG,
>knowing full well that it did not have the straight riser sump which
is
>needed on my tricycle nose gear. However, a Lycoming Tech Rep was
very
>helpful to me, and he gave me permission to put his phone number on
the RV
>list. He is also an EAA member. His name is Bob Ohnmeiss, Phone
>1-717-327-7127. He gave me the Lycoming part numbers which I would
need to
>convert my engine to a straight riser sump:
>Straight Riser Sump #78915
>Pipes (4) #70485
>Clamps (2) #73346
>4 Hoses #69603
>Sump Gasket #LW15353
>Bob also recommended that I get carburetor part #10-5193. I found a
used
>Straight Riser Sump, Pipes and Clamps for $750. I can apparently turn
in my
>10-5235 carburetor for $400 credit so that Aircraft Spruce's rebuilt
#10-5193
>will cost me another $749. I found that used 0-360s with a straight
riser
>sump were very hard to come by, so it may be that others can find a
different
>0-360 and convert it as I am doing. A new straight riser sump costs
$1273
>from the local Lycoming dealer. My converted engine cannot be
certified, but
>for my experimental purposes, that is ok. By the way, if you may want
a
>constant speed prop, do not get a solid crank engine. Th'e conversion
costs
>then become prohibitive. I am just taking my fuselage out of the jig,
so I
>am a long way from flying this engine and proving that all of the
above works
>satisfactorily. Also, I am a novice pilot. I just got my PPASEL
yesterday
>at age 71. So Beware.
>dougpage(at)aol.com
Doug, you might be able to get a cheaper exchanged rebuilt carburator
from Precision Airmotive Corp. in Everett, Washington. They rebuild
all Marvel Schebler carburators and probably did the Aircraft Spruce
unit before they marked up the price. Peter M. n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com
__________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | timpresl(at)sprynet.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 assistance |
Don,
I,m 2 1/2 years into an RV-4 with 1 to go. (Just started finish kit last week)
As far as I know there are no tapes on the 8, Van's is just now getting the wing
kit together for sale. The tapes are not conected to Van's, Orendorf is an
individual builder. However I have the 6/6A tapes and they have been helpful to
my project. If your jig is ready you wasteing time,start putting metal together
and meet the project head on,ask questions as they come up, you will do great!
The sooner you start the sooner you fly! I'll help if I can drop a not if you
like. X in Texas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com (Peter B. Mortensen) |
You wrote:
>
>I thought I'd post this in case anyone's interested.
>
>I never felt real comfortable about the way the fuel valve (at least
on the
>6) operates. It has a little tiny "pointer" that points at the port
in use
>and a big "handle" to operate it. Unfortunately, all of the aircraft
I've
>ever flown (Cessnas and Mooneys primarily) have a "pointer" that looks
like
>the handle on the 6 valve.
>
>I had visions of switching to the right tank (via the pointer) but
thinking
>it was the left tank (as it would be on most factory-iron).
>
>So after much head-scratching, a simple fix dawned on me. I ground
off the
>pointer on the valve, and plumbed the ports backwards (left port to
right
>tank and vice-versa). Voila! Now what I consider to be the real
pointer
>(the fat handle) points to the correct tank.
>
>My apologies if this was obvious (or not a problem) to everyone
else...
>
>Ed Bundy
>ebundy2620(at)aol.com
Ed, I have been wrestling with exactly the same problem with my fuel
valve on the RV-4 I am building. Then I saw how my RV-6 buddy, Ervin
Luke, did his. He painted a bright red stripe where the pointer was
and also on the legend which showed what it pointed to. The older
valves, of which I have one, are even worse since there is an even
smaller pointer on them.
Another problem I have had related to what has already been mentioned
on the list which is that the 90 degree fittings never screw in to the
point where they point in the right direction. I analyzed this
phenomenon and found that every 90 degree fitting ends up in a
different place in any given port of the valve (i.e. the fittings are
not all threaded the same). Knowing this I decided to simply buy a big
bag of 90 degree fittings at my local airplane parts shop and try them
all until I found the ones that worked for me. Guess what; those
fittings are Mil Spec and are $5 each!!
Plan B: I went to my local hardware store and bought a $4.75 pipe tap.
It is a bottom tap but I ground even more off the tip. I haven't
tried this yet but I plan to tap each hole in the valve a little more
until the 90 fitting threads in the correct amount.
Peter Mortensen n21pe(at)ix.netcom.com
_____________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Peter Bennett" <bennett(at)healey.com.au> |
| Subject: | Re: Voltage regulators |
Ed, you should have realised why by now. Aviation volts, like
everything else in aviation, need much more regulation to to protect
the public, This regulation costs, hence the higher price.
Peter Bennett
Sydney Australia
RV6 engine on order.
> Does anyone have any thoughts on voltage regulators? I don't know much about
> them, but I was wondering what the difference is between the unit Van's sells
> at $36 and the one I can buy at the local auto parts store for $13.
>
> Are there differences in regulators or are they all about the same?
>
> Thanks
> Ed Bundy
> ebundy2620(at)aol.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Maynard, Bryon" <maynardb(at)snowmass.ksc.nasa.gov> |
Hooray
I just did this. I replaced my O-320-A1A sump with a O-320-E2A sump
and intake stacks. I also used a blanking plate on the external oil
line and removed the plug at the accessory case. Worked out great.
----------
From: rassp.hac.com!gil(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Engines
Date: Tuesday, July 09, 1996 16:08
*** big snip ***
>Your best bet is to find ANY IO320, and swap out the sump if necessary.
>When looking at pictures of sumps in the parts manual, the most important
>thing to look for is the oil pickup tube. SOme engines (mine, for
>instance) have the oil pickup tube integral to the sump. Others (the newer
>engines) use a separate oil pickup tube. You cannot exchange one for the
>other without also exchanging the accessory case.
NOTE: this info. for O-320 WCF models - probably OK for others, but
check
it carefully first!
I am starting the process of converting an O-320-E2G into a -E2D
(the aft mounted carb of the -E2G hits the -6A nose gear leg while the
-E2D
has a mid-mounted carb), and came across the oil pick-up variation
problem
mentioned above. According to the guys at Ly-Con in Visalia, this
pick-up
variation is not a big deal if you are rebuilding. A exchange sump cost
$300 from them.
The sump with the integral pickup tube _will_ mate with the
accessory cases listed in the O-320 WCF manual. The seperate pickup
tube
is removed, and a blanking plate needs to be fabricated to cover the
machined area it was bolted to. The integral pickup in the sump will
now
feed oil to the case if the blanking plug is removed from the bottom of
the
case oil gallery where it mates to the sump (easy to see, hard to
describe
...:^) The same gaskets - with the pick up hole present - are used for
both sumps.
Though not usually done, I think the reverse swap would also
work.
In this case, the oil gallery plug would be installed, and the boss
machined to accept the seperate, bolt-on oil pick-up tube. According to
the WCF parts manual pictures, all of the cases have this mounting boss,
it's just not machined if it's not needed.
Apparently, due to the number of -6As being built, the swap from
aft-mounted to mid-mounted carb is the most popular, and is reflected in
the cost of the replacement sump .... :^(
Please note, these are only preliminary findings, and I will do
a
full write-up of the sump conversion when I have completed the engine
rebuild (in about 9 - 12 months, I hope ...:^) I just needed to
remount
the carb now to proceed with engine installation .... then it gets a
rebuild.
.. hope this helps .... Gil Alexander ... almost completed the
new "wing
storage facility",
then
back to
canopies.
gil(at)rassp.hac.com
RV6A, #20701, N64GA (rsvd)
>
>I'm sorry if I've kinda gone on and on about the sump, but I've just worked
>this problem, and the part number maze is unbelievable.
>
>
>Best Regards,
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | OrndorffG(at)aol.com |
John,
You need to have a good electrical system starting with the alternator and
voltage regulator. The best on the market for the money comes from B&C Spec.
phone number(316)283-8662 ask for Bill. He knows his stuff.....George
Orndorff
________________________________________________________________________________
>>pointer on the valve, and plumbed the ports backwards (left port to right
>>tank and vice-versa). Voila! Now what I consider to be the real pointer
>>(the fat handle) points to the correct tank.
Ed; I've learned something else about the difference in civilian and
military flying. For me (ex military) the short end of the fuel selector is
the pointer end of the selector handle (T-6, P-51, C-47 etc). I had no idea
that civilian is different. Good thing I didn't do anything that required
fuel selection when I got my bi an review.
By the way, there is a piper fuel selector valve that I've found to be much
better than Vans sold in the past (he may have changed now). The piper
valve is the same size, 3 ports (inlet, left and right, no requirement to
plug a fourth outlet), has a plastic insert that makes it operate smoothly,
a very positive click into place. I rooted around in the FBO's junk box and
found a handle that has the flat spot at 90 degrees rather than under the
nose (short end). Now when the short end (pointer to me) is 45 degrees to
the left of forward, it's feeding the left tank, 45 to rt is rt tank. I had
gone through two of Vans valves, they were very hard to operate even after
fuel grease was applied,almost no click into place, plus both of them
started to leak after a few months. I'm much more pleased with Mr. Pipers
valve. Been over a year, operates great, very positive click into place, is
directional (well, to us ex military it is), and hasn't leaked nor seeped.
It cost me 20.00 at the FBO. What it is suppose to sell for, I don't know.
John D
John Darby RV6 N61764 flying
johnd@our-town.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | OrndorffG(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 assistance |
Don,
The video for the RV8 is in the works and will be completed soon , watch the
list and the RVator for when it is ready.....George Orndorff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
In April, I bought a used 0-360A2G from Wentworth, which Steve Wentworth had
converted with a straight riser sump so that it would fit an RV-6A. In early
May the shipping company phoned me saying the engine would be delivered the
next day. It has never been delivered to this day. The carrier says that
the engine was stolen in Dublin California (25 miles from Oakland) where the
delivery truck was parked overnight. Since I paid by Visa, I have cancelled
the charge and Steve Wentworth has filed a claim with the carrier for the
loss. Meanwhile I found and have bought another engine. Meanwhile, there is
a hot engine out there somewhere, serial #L-12656-36A, with a straight riser
sump. I have the logs. BEWARE. Doug Page
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "A. Reichert" <reichera(at)clark.net> |
| Subject: | Was: Modifying 0-360s to fit RV-6A |
On Wed, 10 Jul 1996 aol.com!DougPage(at)matronics.com wrote:
[...]
> satisfactorily. Also, I am a novice pilot. I just got my PPASEL yesterday
> at age 71. So Beware.
Congratulations! :-)
- Alan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <Jim=Preston%303FS_DOT%Whiteman(at)szl.afres.af.mil> (Maj, 305FS/DOT, Whiteman |
AFB, 975-2968)
charset=US-ASCII
George O...
Are you and Becky all moved in now? Working on your RV-8 tapes yet?
What's the best way to get the -6 tapes...from you directly, from Avery, or
from Van's?
Jim
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BDStobbe <70743.2727(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Decoder; RV Forum |
Hi Guys,
For those of you who are having trouble decoding the RV Forum message which was
recently sent, following is a decoded version. It's not perfect since it was
apparently originally done in MS Word and that's how the unaltered decoded file
should be viewed for optimum results...
BTW, until today I wasn't able to decode these ASCII files either. However, I
searched a local BBS and found a nice decoder called mimefile.exe (shareware)
that you may want to try; it can encode and decode non-ASCII type files for
sending via E-mail. I downloaded it from Creative Edge BBS in CT at
203-791-8532 (it's compressed in ZIP format and is called mimefile.zip).
Hope this helps...
BDStobbe
RV-6 N508RV (reserved)
=================================================================================
=====
EAA Chapter 486 Stamp
Dale Buller, Chairman Here
1996 Northeast RV Builders' Forum
113 Belle Terrace
N Syracuse, New York, 13212-3824
Address Label Here
NORTHEAST RV FORUM Please read and respond Immediately!!
***
Welcome to the Second Annual Northeast RV Builders Forum. See the photos
and write-up (pages 88 and 89) in the April 1996 issue of "Sport Aviation" for
complete information on the First Forum.
Again, we need to know (as soon as possible) our facility requirements and
if the attendance supports an extra-ordinary effort (the more that come the more
we are likely to do). If you are 90% sure that you will attend, REFOLD and SEND
this page IMMEDIATELY. Share the fun bring a builder, friend, spouse!
Please indicate threshold level Yourself / Friend
of interest (such as "wings") _____________ / _____________
Will you be ( )driving, ( )flying [RV( )], ( )other ______?
Likely to arrive (_______________:00): Fri ( ), Sat( ), Sun ( ).
Preferred lodging: Chapter member's home( ), hotel( ), camping( ).
Will you want a ride in an RV ( )y/( )n? If you are flying in an RV, would
you give rides to builders ( )y/( )n? We will provide ride gas. We want to
thank all those that gave rides last year!
Some speakers will be repeats of last year and some will be new. Note:
Registration fee waived for lecturers/presenters! and Free lodging with Chapter
members for lecturers/presenters!
If you would care to make a presentation, please indicate area(s)
of expertise, etc. ______________, your 'phone ___:_______
***
**********
* *
* Thanks *
* *
**********
EAA Chapter 486
1996 Northeast RV Builders' Forum
Dale Buller, Chairman
113 Belle Terrace
N Syracuse, New York 13212-3824
Rev. 2 (7/7/96)
1996 Northeast RV BUILDERS' FORUM
(and FlyIn Breakfast)
Oswego County Airport, Fulton, New York
Dale Buller, Chairman 315:451-1304
If you are considering an RV Project, have one in progress, or
have completed one, this may be the FORUM for you. The intent is to build your
knowledge and confidence with the hope of increasing your productivity and
quality or - share what you have learned -all while having fun. Most of our
speakers/presenters will be experienced builders who have already "been there,
done that".
Friday Evening (Sept. 6)
RV Welcome Cook Out and 486 Chapter Meeting
Saturday Forum (and Flying)
September 7, 1996
Note: Program subject to change.
Flying may be limited by weather (and aircraft available).
8:00 Breakfast, Continental 1:00 Wiring, advanced
9:00 Riveting: Empennage, Wings, 2:00 Forward of firewall
10:00 Fuselage 3:00 Painting
11:00 Wiring, basic 4:00 FIRST Flight
12:00 Lunch 5:00 FAA's advice to builders
7:00 Builders' Award Banquet
Sunday (Sept. 8) FlyIn Breakfast
(Breakfast free for Pilots of RV's flown in.)
******* 1996 Northeast RV Builders Forum REGISTRATION *******
* (Forum & Meals on Saturday.) *
* Make Check payable to: EAA Chapter 486 RV Forum. *
* Due: August 15, 1996 - $30 before 16th/ $35 after *
*
*
* For lodging information or reservation to stay with *
* Chapter Members (nominal donation to Chapter - $10 per *
* person per night) call 315:___-____. Ground transportation *
* provided. Aircraft Rides - Donation (toward gas, etc.) *
*
*
* Mail to: EAA Chapter 486 RV Forum *
* Dale Buller, Chairman *
* 113 Belle Terrace * *
N Syracuse, New York 13212-3824 * Rev 2 (7/7/96)*
*
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris Ruble <cruble(at)cisco.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stolen 0-360A2G |
If you haven't already done so, this should be posted to every usenet
aviation group.
Chris
>
> In April, I bought a used 0-360A2G from Wentworth, which Steve Wentworth had
> converted with a straight riser sump so that it would fit an RV-6A. In early
> May the shipping company phoned me saying the engine would be delivered the
> next day. It has never been delivered to this day. The carrier says that
> the engine was stolen in Dublin California (25 miles from Oakland) where the
> delivery truck was parked overnight. Since I paid by Visa, I have cancelled
> the charge and Steve Wentworth has filed a claim with the carrier for the
> loss. Meanwhile I found and have bought another engine. Meanwhile, there is
> a hot engine out there somewhere, serial #L-12656-36A, with a straight riser
> sump. I have the logs. BEWARE. Doug Page
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Voltage regulators |
I used a Ford transister unit and it works fine. I did buy an over-voltage
"crow bar" from B&C (about $20) however. This unit is attached to the FIELD
breaker and if it sees more than a present amount of voltage it will trip the
5 amp field breaker.
B&C sells a VR with over-voltage protection built in to it but at about $200
it was a little rich for me. I accomplished the same thing for about $40.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob Newman" <bn(at)poseidon.crosslink.net> |
| Subject: | Lycoming factory OH - best prices |
Anybody have recent experience on who offers the best deals on
Lycoming factory overhauled engines? Airpower is the big advertiser,
but is theirs the best price?
Bob Newman
bn(at)crosslink.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | pilla(at)emmanuel.espinc.com (Michael Pilla) |
| Subject: | Looking for Tracy Cooke (sp?) of Florida |
Claudio Tonini, RV4 "Purple Passion", asked me to see if anyone on the
list knows the phone number of Tracy Cooke, of Florida. I'm not sure
of the spelling. Claudio left the message on my office voice-mail and
it was a little difficult to understand the message.
Thanks.
BTW, an update on Claudio's RV-3: he is skinning both wings (fuel tanks
are finished), boy, is he fast.
He came to my shop all upset about the dimpled holes in his fuel tanks
and skins - the 3/32 size. Seems that the holes were too large and his
"bucker" was having trouble keeping the shop head straight, ...
Turns out that Claudio's "Brand X" 3/32 dimple dies (not sure of the
source, but *not* Avery or Cleveland) was forcing the hole opening to
be just about 10 thousandths larger in diameter than my holes (Avery
dimple die set.) We dimpled some scrap using my dies and his and there
was no question; the Avery dimple dies were clearly superior. Fortunately,
I had a spare set and Claudio has borrowed the set and is proceeding; and,
yes, we checked the new set - virtually identical to the old Avery set.
Interesting.
Mike Pilla
pilla(at)espinc.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EBundy2620(at)aol.com |
<< Be REAL SURE that if anyone other than you flys the airplane that they are
told about this modification. I know that I'd be really unhappy if I had
taken your aircraft for a jaunt and ran out of gas because the valve was
pointing in the wrong direction. >>
This was a big consideration for me. However, it seems to me that the "RV"
way is the exception, not the rule. I have never seen another fuel valve
that operates in this manner. I did grind of the tip of the selector so
there is no other pointer other than the handle, and the placarding will
reflect proper operation.
I will make a point, however to specifically notify any other RV drivers. It
seems to me that there would be far more chance for someone to be confused by
the RV setup however, unless the person was familliar with the RV fuel
system.
-- Ed Bundy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EBundy2620(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 assistance |
<< My jig's done, it's square, it's empty. I'm trying to glean as much info
as possible before I start sticking pieces together. I think this is
just a variation on a theme...buck fever.
>>
My advice to you is: Jump in! There are a million pieces of information you
will need to pick up to finish this project. Don't try to get them all at
once. You'll just overload, and you can't remember all of it anyway.
Get started, and as questions arise, ask. You WILL screw parts up, you WILL
scream and throw things, and it WILL get easier.
Remember, an empty jig is an unhappy jig.
Ed Bundy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EBundy2620(at)aol.com |
<< When you installed the alternator, did you need to put additional spacers
between the adjustment arm and engine case. Mine did not want to line up
unless I added about 4-5 washers. Otherwise the installation went smoothly.
Well, mine didn't want to fit at all. (Odd, considering I bought everything
including the engine from Van) When the alternator was mounted in the base
bracket, the adjusting arm fell right dead center on the mounting ear. It
sounds like yours did the same thing. I didn't feel comfortable using 5
washers on the adjusting arm bolt because the alternator get shaken around
quite a bit, and also the pulley didn't line up properly in that situation.
So instead, I ground off about 3/16" off the ear of the alternator that
mounts to the base bracket on the fwd side. This allows me to mount the
alternator farther fwd and then mount the adjusting arm on the back of the
alternator. The pulleys now line up perfectly.
Did you notice the cost of those anodized mounting brackets? About $50 for
the alternator to case bracket. Oh well, they do look good and probably
required a bunch of work to manufacture. >>
Yeah, I thought that was a bit high (especially since they need to be
modified) but, I beats doing it myself.. :)
-- Ed Bundy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | avlaw(at)nwlink.com (Steve Fribley) |
| Subject: | Re: Voltage regulators |
Twenty one bucks
But you could go get a marine unit at the boat store- might be more
explosiion proof. Might cost about $ 36
>Does anyone have any thoughts on voltage regulators? I don't know much about
>them, but I was wondering what the difference is between the unit Van's sells
>at $36 and the one I can buy at the local auto parts store for $13.
>
>Are there differences in regulators or are they all about the same?
>
>Thanks
>Ed Bundy
>ebundy2620(at)aol.com
>
>
Warmest Regards,
Steve Fribley
avlaw(at)nwlink.com
________________________________________________________________________________
><< I am at the stage where I need to fit an alternator. They seem to be
>either
> very expensive, or they are the El-Cheapo ones for cars. There is an
> alternator shop nearby which has reconditioned ones, the Japanese types are
> $110, they may be reconditioned, or they may just have black paint sprayed
> on the outside.
> I would appreciate some guidelines.
> John Cocker.
A local junkyard can supply you with a pre-owned unit from a Chevy Sprint/
Geo Metro. These are not el-cheapo, but are inexpensive. They also fit a
Lycoming mount and arm with a bit of filing, and are internally regulated.
Check six!
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BARNES_ERIC(at)Tandem.COM |
| Subject: | For Sale: PS Engineering Intercom |
This hit our pilots' mail list at work and I thought I'd pass it along.
NOTE - CONTACT BY PHONE ONLY (it's not me!)
Ron Suliteanu
408-285-0526 (work - SF Bay Area)
EB-
barnes_eric(at)tandem.com
------------ ORIGINAL ATTACHMENT --------
SENT 07-10-96 FROM PRINCE_BILL @TSII
For Sale: PS Engineering Intercom.
This is a basic 2-input intercom with VOX, and volume
and squelch controls for each input. Also has a
separate music in jack. Music mutes when other audio
happens. Rechargable with AC adapter (included).
Names your price
do not respond to this e-mail. Call Ron Suliteanu
at 5-0526.
I will make a point, however to specifically notify any other RV drivers. It
seems to me that there would be far more chance for someone to be confused by
the RV setup however, unless the person was familliar with the RV fuel
system.
-- Ed Bundy
________________________________________________________________________________
June 27, 1996 - July 11, 1996
RV-Archive.digest.vol-bp