RV-Archive.digest.vol-ck
January 24, 1997 - January 30, 1997
.... Gil (stamps? I don't need no stinking stamps ..:^) Alexander
RV6A, #20701, EAA Technical Counselor, Chapter 40, Northridge, CA
My "Bottom Line" ... as John Ammeter has previously stated to the RV-list, your
TC would more likely appreciate a cold (or hot) drink and a pizza for his effort.
The TC is an unpaid volunteer, and often has long distances to drive (and
fighting freeway traffic), and isn't working on his own project while he's at
yours.
>
>Doug
>
>ps You must also keep the FAA notified if while in the phase II flight
>phase you change a major component (prop, exhaust, engine) this may
>(will) require a new Phase I flight test for a to be determined time and
>area. Certified aircraft have to have STC's of 337 forms for changes
>if they have not filed a STC or 337 the plane is not considered airworthy.
>Same thing with an experimental, you have to fly off the hours.
>
>Now realistically the FAA folks list equipment on the sheets as RV-6,
>Lycoming O-320-E2D, Experimental wood prop. So who is to say you
>finally junked the Tolles exhaust and put on a Vetterman Exhaust. Or
>changed to another brand wood prop.
Your insurance company might take note .... your plane _may_ be considered non-compliant
with airworthiness requirements.
>
>
>Doug Bloomberg
>RV-6A N399DB
>Denver, CO
>dougb(at)mail.diac.com (home)
>dougb(at)denver.sgi.com (work)
-------------------------------------------------------
gila(at)flash.net
Gil Alexander,
Los Angeles, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "J VanGrunsven" <rvforpla(at)pacifier.com> |
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_01BC09DB.4BAABDE0
The RV-8 has more room where it counts the most. Back seater has 2 inches
more width, can sit higher due to higher canopy at that station, more leg
space between front seat -back and side skins, and heal wells. The absence
of the roll over structure and its associated reflections on the canopy
give a much more open feeling too. Front seat impression is that of
sitting higher, due to deeper canopy (I got flash-backs of the T-34 when
first flying the 8). More shoulder and leg room and very clever adjustable
rudder pedals. Flying is supurb, especially the ailerons, very responsive,
yet solid. I've built and still own two RV-4's and have flown several
dozen
others and can say the 8 is a real thourough breed. Can hardly wait to
start my own 8. Jerry VanGrunsven
----------
> From: Rob Hatwell <overvne.demon.co.uk!hatters(at)matronics.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: RV4versRV8
> Date: Tuesday, January 21, 1997 8:10 AM
>
>
> A question for RV4 pilots who have actually flown or flown in the RV8
> and handled it.
>
> How does the RV8 general handling, roll rate, aileron forces, elevator
> forces and harmonisation of controls compare with the RV4.
>
> Comparison of back seat room.
>
> Vis from front seat compared with the RV4.
>
> Any flying differences.
> --
> Rob Hatwell
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chester razer <crazer(at)egyptian.net> |
| Subject: | Double Flare Fittings |
I was looking through AC 43.13 and found on pg 165 (Hydraulic and
Pneumatic Systems) that a double flare should be used on soft al tubing
3/8" OD or less. I don't remember reading this in the construction
plans for my 6A. Did I overlook something.
--
Chet Razer
crazer(at)egyptian.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AveryTools(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | RV-6 Tail & Wing Kit For Sale |
Anyone interested in the following, please call. Bob or Judy Avery
----- Avery
Enterprises at 817-439-8400 .
RV- 6 Tail sheet metal work complete - good workmanship -
include plans
and the manuel. $1000.00
RV -6 Wing Kit Has been opened, but no work done. Pre-drilled
spar.
May / 1992 Kit $3000.00
Both for $3500.00
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JBALBIERER(at)NYSYR.ANG.AF.MIL |
Has anyone installed or know of anyone installing a Century II wing
leveling system in their RV? I know about the NAVAID so no need comenting
on that, just Century II. I'm cheap and need the Att. ind and DG and this
system provides it along with a heading bug. I'm just wondering if it
works well in the RV.
John
jbalbierer(at)nysyr.ang.af.mil
RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Mertinooke" <mmertino(at)modicon.com> |
Hi;
For what it's worth, I was taught that you plot great circle routes
by stretching a string between waypoints on a globe. Any
computational method is an approximation of the same thing.
As for mileage variance, I assume this is proportional to the
convergence of lines of longitude, so the "gain" of a great circle
route depends (???) on your latitude.
Hey - it's a guess, okay? Geeze, I fly a Taylorcraft. Any trip over
fifty miles gets logged as a cross country.
Cheers!
Mike
Mike Mertinooke
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MiDiBu <midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV Alaska Trip |
>
>The Chicago Area RVators is planning an RV trip to Alaska this coming July.
What neat idea! I'll step up the building pace.
>Two flight plans will be developed, one to accomodate RV4s and
>6s, and a second to accomadate RV3s (shorter legs).
I think you've, sniff, forgotten a third plan.
>Rick McBride
>RV6 N523JC
>RICKRV6(at)aol.com
>
Mike Weller RV-8 (under construction)
midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com (preferred) or mike.weller(at)msfc.nasa.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Rozendaal" <DougR(at)netins.net> |
The short answer is, Get a GPS.
The long answer is waaaaaaay too long. The short version of the long
answer is there is no difference when going north and south, or east and
west at the equator. as you depart from either of these extremes the
difference becomes greater.
----------
> From: aol.com!EBundy2620(at)matronics.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Navigation
> Date: Friday, January 24, 1997 10:32 AM
>
>
> How long does a flight need to be in order to take advantage of great
circle
> navigation? How does one go about plotting a great circle course? How
much
> mileage variance is there for a given flight distance?
>
> Ed Bundy RV6A #23834 N427EM - flying
> Eagle, ID
> ebundy2620(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Gesele <scottg(at)villagenet.com> |
| Subject: | Re:Hartzell Prop |
>I have a question regarding the 1BF prop that Van sells. In the event
>of a loss of oil pressure, which pitch will the prop feather into?
>Maximum or Minimum drag. Is this the safety issue that Dave Barnhart is
>refering to?
>
>David "so many questions" Shipman
>
David,
The C/S props on singles use oil pressure for coarse pitch/ low RPM. A loss
of oil pressure would allow the blades to go "flat". This would create the
highest drag.
Twins typically use feathering props. With these props, oil pressure is
used to push the blades into a fine pitch, high RPM setting. A spring and
nitrogen pressure sets the blades at a course pitch. The loss of oil
pressure on one of these props would cause the prop to feather. During
engine shut down, when the RPM goes below a certain RPM (around 750 if I
remember correctly) locking pins engage to prevent the prop from feathering
on the ground. Look at a twin on the ramp (except for turbines) and you'll
notice the props haven't feathered.
Hope this helps.
Scott Gesele N506RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | d shipman <innovate(at)dallas.net> |
| Subject: | WTB:RV-3 plans/manual |
Hello everyone:
I would like to buy the latest preview plans and manual for the RV-3.
If anyone has a set they would be willing to sell, please e-mail me. I
am not planning on building at this time but would like to become familiar
with the design.
Thank you,
David Shipman
innovate(at)dallas.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Rudder off center |
Tony tivitz,
Tony I shot you 3 long E mails and all of them returned. You can call me at
(303)- 457-8387 or shoot me another Email and I will send you coppies through
the regular mail. I dont know why it wouldnt go through but the info was so
long I didnt want to clutter the list. Your right I did mean the rudder.
Ryan Bendure RV4131RB(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rust47rg(at)one.net |
| Subject: | Re:Hartzell Prop |
>
>Twins typically use feathering props. With these props, oil pressure is
>used to push the blades into a fine pitch, high RPM setting. A spring and
>nitrogen pressure sets the blades at a course pitch. The loss of oil
>pressure on one of these props would cause the prop to feather. During
>engine shut down, when the RPM goes below a certain RPM (around 750 if I
>remember correctly) locking pins engage to prevent the prop from feathering
>on the ground. Look at a twin on the ramp (except for turbines) and you'll
>notice the props haven't feathered.
>
>Hope this helps.
>
>Scott Gesele N506RV
>
Scott:
Actually I think you may find most twins use counterweighted blades and
spring or gas assists to go INTO feather. They use boosted oil pressure from
the governor to go to course pitch just like the HC C2Y that Van sells. The
twins I fly use lockouts below 1000 rpm so the props don't go into feather
during start up or shutdown when the counterweights, springs and gas can
overpower low oil pressure.
Some props do use oil pressure to go to fine pitch and in Hartzell's case a
-4 after the flange identifier in the model indicates oil pressure decreases
pitch. I believe you may find some of these in aerobatic applications. In
Hartzells case these -4 props do not feather.
Regards:
Rusty Gossard
N47RG RV-4 Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Fritz <75303.1623(at)CompuServe.COM> |
The easiest way to plot a Great Circle is to simply lay a piece of string on a
globe and stretch it between the departure and destination. That's a GC.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com> |
J VanGrunsven wrote:
>
> The RV-8 has more room where it counts the most.
**snip***
> Can hardly wait to start my own 8. Jerry VanGrunsven
> ----------
Hay JV good to see you on this list.
--
Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS First flight July 14, 1989 :-) Hillsboro, OR
jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Barnhart <barnhart(at)a.crl.com> |
| Subject: | Re: panel layout software |
>
>Has anyone tried the panel layout software that's available for $100?
Do you mean Panel Planner by INteractive Solutions? If so, I can't relly
recommend it.
1. It has an RV-6/6A panel, but it's not the standard dimensions. The
bottom has been extended by about 1-1/2 inches. Also the the slider's
panel is a bit taller than the tip-up, but the program does not tell you
which it is.
2. The program allows you to put instruments in the panel in places that
you actually cannot do so. (such as where the ribs attach to the panel).
3. There are no provisions for driving a plotter and making a full-size
drawing.
4. There are no provisions for making an AutoCad-compatible output file.
One thing it DOES do is allow you to print out full-size images of
instruments and radios. THey come out pretty nice on my HP color inkjet
printer. I then pasted them to a full-sized mock-up of the panel.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bud Newhall <bud(at)softcom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy covers and flight manual |
J.Ken Hitchmough wrote:
>
>
> Before I go off and spend MORE money, could someone please give
> recommendations on two things:
>
> 1. Canopy cover for a 6A tip up.
> 2. Theres an RV flight manual advertised in the back of Sport
> Aviation...anyone seen it...used it?
>
> Ken RV6A Flying
Ken,
I bought a canopy cover from D.J. Lauritzen for my -6. Good fit, good
quality, worth the money.
Ialso bought the flight manual advertised in Sport Aviation. Poor fit,
poor quality, not worth the money.
Bud Newhall
--
__|__
__|__ ____(+)____
____(+)____ ' '
' '
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rust47rg(at)one.net |
| Subject: | Re:Hartzell Prop |
>
SCott:
Actually I think you may find most twins use counterweighted blades and
spring or gas assists to go INTO feather. They use boosted oil pressure from
the governor to go to course pitch just like the HC C2Y that Van sells. The
twins I fly use lockouts below 1000 rpm so the props don't go into feather
during start up or shutdown when the counterweights, springs and gas can
overpower low oil pressure.
Some props do use oil pressure to go to fine pitch and in Hartzell's case a
-4 after the flange identifier in the model indicates oil pressure decreases
pitch. I believe you may find some of these in aerobatic applications. In
Hartzells case these -4 props do not feather.
Regards:
Rusty Gossard
Scott:
CORRECTION:
WHOOPS, I had a brain cramp,.Delet my previous .... I was thinking about too
many props at the same time, your're right. The oil pressure acts against
the counterweights and spring and/or gas pressure to decrease pitch. The
lock out does function as I stated preventing feather during startup and
shutdown and the -4 Hartzells are non feathering oil pressure reduces pitch
props. Now I think I've got it straight. It's been a long day.
Regards:
Rusty Gossard
N47RG RV-4 Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Barnhart <barnhart(at)a.crl.com> |
| Subject: | Re:Hartzell Prop |
innovate(at)dallas.net wrote:
>I have a question regarding the 1BF prop that Van sells. In the event
>of a loss of oil pressure, which pitch will the prop feather into?
>Maximum or Minimum drag. Is this the safety issue that Dave Barnhart is
>refering to?
Yes, it *IS* the safety issue I was referring to. With a loss of oil
pressure, the prop goes to flat pitch. Thats the same position it goes to
when you push the Prop (rpm) control all the way in. This means that you
can run the engine at FULL power if necessary (assuming, of course that you
only lost oil pressure to the prop and not the engine as well).
If the suffix is -2 (instead of -1) then the prop goes to COURSE pitch when
it loses oil pressure. This is the same thing as pulling the prop control
knob all the way OUT. If this happens, and you need any amount of power
from the engine, it will not last long.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
________________________________________________________________________________
about" (Jan 21, 6:54pm)
| From: | Dave Barnhart <barnhart(at)a.crl.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Strange Messages From RV-List... |
Matt:
Thanks for the explanation. I've always wondered what the "apparently to"
messages were!
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Barnhart <barnhart(at)a.crl.com> |
| Subject: | Re: =92 in messages |
The =92 (or any = followed by a two-digit hex number) is MIME. It's been a
while since I've worked with MIME, so my recollection may be off.
As I recall, if you have "Quotable Printable" turned on, then certain
characters are represented by an '=' followed by their hex value. The
receiving email system is supposed to convert them back to special
characters. My guess is that somehow the MIME type "Quotable Printable" in
the header is being changed to Text".
(I could be WAY off base on this, so don't take what I say to the bank!)
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darrell L. Anderson" <d.l.anderson(at)worldnet.att.net> |
>snip<
If the plane had not hit the car, it would have rolled into a hangar and
probably woulkd have taken out a wing. My next RV will have parking brakes,
even though I am going with the slider.
>snip<
Can anyone advise for/against installing parking brake valves, what
brands, how actuated, etc. I see several in parts catalogs.
Darrell Anderson
RV-4....sealing tanks.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernesto Sanchez" <es12043(at)utech.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6 Tail & Wing Kit For Sale |
Where are you located??
Ernesto Sanchez
E-Racer# 319
es12043(at)utech.net
----------
> From: aol.com!AveryTools(at)matronics.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: RV-6 Tail & Wing Kit For Sale
> Date: Friday, January 24, 1997 10:55 AM
>
>
> Anyone interested in the following, please call. Bob or Judy
Avery
> ----- Avery
> Enterprises at 817-439-8400 .
>
>
> RV- 6 Tail sheet metal work complete - good workmanship -
> include plans
> and the manuel. $1000.00
>
>
> RV -6 Wing Kit Has been opened, but no work done.
Pre-drilled
> spar.
> May / 1992 Kit $3000.00
>
> Both for $3500.00
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Bronson <70773.2700(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Re: Chatter: Re: Canopy covers |
Bob Skinner wrote:
On one occasion, when my Maule was tied down
outside, a major thunder storm came through. ..... The kind
FBO, seeing the approaching storm, untied my airplane and moved it inside.
There were winds up to 50 mph and some light hail.
Hey Bob,
Which FBO was this? If I get a chance, I'd like to buy some gas from them. This
is the kind of FBO I'll literally go out of my way to patronize.
Tim Bronson Pittsburgh, PA (rain, sleet, snow, and now dark of night)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Bronson <70773.2700(at)CompuServe.COM> |
Hello Listers,
Has anyone out there done any research on what paint colors and designs offer
best overall visibilty? I have noticed that airplanes with the W.W.II style
invasion stripes tend to stand out in the black and white pictures in the
various RV-related publications I read. I'll admit it's a bit of an
extrapolation, but it occurred to me that if my eve is drawn to one particular
1/2" image of thirty in a fly-in picture, maybe it's because the paint design
draws the human eye, as do flashing lights. Could come in handy on a "black and
white" day. "Fire engine red" seems to be an obvious choice for a stand-out
color, though I recall reading a while back that yellow-green is more of an
attention getter, hence the color choice for newer emergency vehicles. Any of
you ex-military and/or search and rescue types recall any information on what
kind of camouflage DOESN'T work?
On a related topic, Van's says some builders opt to put the white nav lights on
the wing tips rather than the one one the tail. My question: why? Is wiring to
the rudder a hassle, or a high maintenance item? I like the idea of one of
those combined white light and strobes on the rudder. Comments?
As a former motorcycle rider, I am acutely aware that relatively small vehicles
can be tough to see, especially if you're not looking for them. When I finally
finish my project, I want it to stand out as much as possible (within the limits
of good taste, of course).
Thanks for your input.
Tim Bronson
Contemplating ordering empennage (with light?), thinking loooooooong term about
paint
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George McNutt <72714.2663(at)CompuServe.COM> |
Re the question of great circle navigation. Here is my 2 cents worth.
Long range navigation using Inertial Navigation involves flying a great circle
route between waypoints. However the waypoints (the route) are a computer
generated least time track which takes best advantage of the wind. This is not
necessarily (never) a great circle route from the departure point to the
destination.
On our flight Vancouver to Hong Kong last week we operated over Anchorage, Nome,
through Russian and Chinese airspace north of Japan, over Bejing and into Hong
Kong. Return flight was south of Japan and on average about 800 N.M. further
south of westbound track to catch the wind. Flight time westbound 12+48,
eastbound 11+02 in B747-400.
Waypoints over the ocean are usually each 10 degrees of longitude, about 200 -
300 N.M. apart. I doubt that the difference between a rhumb line and great
circle route over this distance would amount to more than two or three miles
however I do not know exact amount or formula for same.
So, in my opinion, items such as wind, turbulence, letting the heading wander
and your climb/descent profile will make more difference to flight time than the
difference between a rhumb line or great circle track.
George McNutt, HKG & BKK again tomorrow.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tony Vitz <tvitz.airmail.net(at)mail.airmail.net> |
Tim:
The older kits had a fiberglass rudder bottom that required the builder
to remove part of the finished rudder to install it. In addition, the light
portion was flimsy(sp?) and hard to work with. One builder said he didn't
want to deal with the extra work and didn't want to remove part of rudder.
Another builder said it is probably a little less expensive to use a tail
light. The rudder bottoms are better now since they fit on the rudder easily
and without the need to remove any of the rudder. The light portion fits a
little lower than the older version. I cut out the entire round fiberglass
piece (face) of the light part of the rudder bottom and with the help of a
few of the Aero Country Experts, I made an aluminum piece to mount the light
and fit in the light hole. I filed a groove around the outside of the
aluminum mount and used T-88 to attach it to the fiberglass. The aluminum
piece is approx. 3\16th thick. It is thick enough to tap the screw holes.
There were about 4 good responses to my tail light wiring question in the
last 3 days. If you want them,let me know.
Tony Vitz- tvitz1(at)airmail.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ve7fp(at)jetstream.net (Ken Hoshowski) |
| Subject: | I'm almost afraid to ask? |
I hope I'm not starting something, but I was looking for part numbers for a
small order from Vans. My latest parts catalogue ( Nov. 95 ) Page 44
(Crests and Emblems ), last paragraph states, "Gift certificates for
tattoos available. Price depends on size and location. If you have a
strong stomach ask Randall or Rion to show you theirs".
I'M ALMOST AFRAID TO ASK?
You all heard the story of the guy who was in a serious car accident. The
grizzly old night nurse said, did you know that fellow in ward D-12 has
SWAN tattooed on his penis? Swan? exclaimed the lovely young student
nurse, when I gave him his sponge bath this morning it said SASKATCHEWAN!
RANDALL, YOU DIDN'T !
Just curious, I know that Van is expanding his product
line....but....Tattoos?
Ken RV6 C-FKEH
First flight Sept. 8 1993
Editor, Western Canada RVator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Parking Brakes |
<< Can anyone advise for/against installing parking brake valves, what
brands, how actuated, etc. I see several in parts catalogs. >>
Darrell-
I incorporated the Cleavland valve (from ACS) into my 6A. Just install on
the firewall where the plans say to mount the brake hose to tubing
transitions (pilot's side in the lower quadrant of the X brace). I mounted a
ratchet type actuating cable on the gear leg weldment. Works great. I got
the idea from Bud Newhall. Thx Bud!
Gary VanRemortel
vanremog(at)aol.com
(flying by Summer o'97)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ronald Vandervort <rvanderv(at)linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us> |
As I recall, when I worked for a living, we did a great circle route by
segmenting the great circle course with rhumb lines every 10 degrees of
longitude. Our waypoints were at the 10 degrees longitude lines. At
each waypoint therefore we had to make a slight turn as the course line
cuts each longitude line at a different angle. We were using inertial nav
system.
Ron Vandervort, RV-6Q
rvanderv(at)linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us
Seattle area
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rob Hatwell <hatters(at)overvne.demon.co.uk> |
Does anyone know how I can contact Eustance Bowhay?
--
Rob Hatwell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rob Hatwell <hatters(at)overvne.demon.co.uk> |
| Subject: | Re: Paint Schemes |
In message <970125035149_70773.2700_CHK38-1(at)CompuServe.COM>, Tim Bronson
writes
>
>Hello Listers,
>
>Has anyone out there done any research on what paint colors and designs offer
>
>draws the human eye,
> thinking loooooooong term about
>paint
>
Tim
The RAF as in UK RAF have carried out extensive studies on aircraft
visability recently and have found that "Black" yes "Black" is the
colour that makes the aircraft easiest to see in the air.
Hence they are now painting the Hawk and Tucano trainers black with
yellow flashes.
--
Rob Hatwell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Osgood <Rick(at)ccc.henn.tec.mn.us> |
Tony Vitz wrote:
>
>
> Tim:
>
> The older kits had a fiberglass rudder bottom that required the builder
> to remove part of the finished rudder to install it. In addition, the light
> portion was flimsy(sp?) and hard to work with. One builder said he didn't
> want to deal with the extra work and didn't want to remove part of rudder.
> Another builder said it is probably a little less expensive to use a tail
> light. The rudder bottoms are better now since they fit on the rudder easily
> and without the need to remove any of the rudder. The light portion fits a
> little lower than the older version. I cut out the entire round fiberglass
> piece (face) of the light part of the rudder bottom and with the help of a
> few of the Aero Country Experts, I made an aluminum piece to mount the light
> and fit in the light hole. I filed a groove around the outside of the
> aluminum mount and used T-88 to attach it to the fiberglass. The aluminum
> piece is approx. 3\16th thick. It is thick enough to tap the screw holes.
> There were about 4 good responses to my tail light wiring question in the
> last 3 days. If you want them,let me know.
> Tony Vitz- tvitz1(at)airmail.net
Tony... I am in the same position, I am working on mounting a light to
the rudder. I have already cut of the corner of my rudder. Please e-mail
me your other replys as well.
Thanks
--
Rick Osgood
Rick(at)ccc.henn.tec.mn.us
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Phil Arter <philip.arter(at)mci2000.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Paint Schemes |
Tim, hi
I did some research on this a while back. I intend to paint my RV-8 with a high
visibility paint scheme because I like to fly in remote areas and think it would
help my
chances of survival if I go down. The paint scheme you choose should depend on
where you
do most of your flying. In the Colorado mountains the ground is mostly covered
with
either snow or very dark fir trees. My plan is to use a pattern with black & white
for
high contrast, bright red/orange wing tips and tail, and polished aluminum for
reflectivity.
Check out the US Coast Guard fleet for some ideas at:
http://www.dot.gov/dotinfo/uscg/cgphotos.html
If you don't want to be seen, paint it like a stealth fighter. ;^)
Phil
philip.arter(at)MCI2000.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Fritz <75303.1623(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Re: I'm almost afraid to ask? |
Shame on you! Telling nasty jokes on a nice G rated web site like this. Kids
should learn of these things the way I did, at the smoke shop magazine rack or
from my old man's Playboy that he kept hidden under his socks.
Besides, the way I heard it (20 years ago) was that she thought he had named it
"Al" and then found out it was a return address to Albequerque, N.M in case he
got lost.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Fritz <75303.1623(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Re: Paint Schemes |
re. high viz paint schemes
The best thing I've ever seen for max viz is the system that alternates the
landing lights L-R-L-R-L. As a biker you may remember an add-on that allowed
your headlight to pulse bright-dim. It really works! And so does the Aviation
version. I was virtually forced to stare a guy on final the other day who had
it. Of course you have to run around with them on all the time and they don't
do diddly except from head-on but maybe you could wire them into smaller white
lights at the four corners.
Bob Fritz
working on shop for 6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AB320FLYER(at)aol.com |
Jerry,
I figured you would eventially show up here-welcome to the list. It will be
nice to have another longtime RV pilot on the list to brain pick.
Joel Harding
ab320flyer(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EBundy2620(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV6A fairings and towbar |
> 1. construction and installation of fairings for wheel pant to leg
> junction and leg to fuselage junction.
I'd be interested in this info as well. (If I can stop flying long enough to
DO it)
> 2. towbar, either design plans or commercially available. Can anyone
> confirm that the towbar for the Gruman Tiger well fit? Backing the
> plane into the hanger is a bear, particularily with uneven ground and
> having to roll over the hanger door "sill."
I'm using an old towbar that was given to me by my friendly A&P, It had been
laying around the shop for awhile and he thought it was a generic
Cessna-type. It is a non-adjustable 2 legged type (the legs have cups that
slip over the bolt in the nosewheel) with a collapsable handle. The legs
were a little too wide, but were easily bent to the proper width. Makes
backing into the hangar a LOT easier.
Ed Bundy RV6A #23834 N427EM - flying
Eagle, ID
ebundy2620(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernesto Sanchez" <es12043(at)utech.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Paint Schemes |
How about dark blue a'la the Corsair?
Ernesto Sanchez
E-Racer# 319
es12043(at)utech.net
----------
> From: Rob Hatwell <overvne.demon.co.uk!hatters(at)matronics.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Paint Schemes
> Date: Saturday, January 25, 1997 2:34 AM
>
>
> In message <970125035149_70773.2700_CHK38-1(at)CompuServe.COM>, Tim Bronson
> writes
> >
> >Hello Listers,
> >
> >Has anyone out there done any research on what paint colors and designs
offer
> >
> >draws the human eye,
> > thinking loooooooong term about
> >paint
> >
> Tim
>
> The RAF as in UK RAF have carried out extensive studies on aircraft
> visability recently and have found that "Black" yes "Black" is the
> colour that makes the aircraft easiest to see in the air.
>
> Hence they are now painting the Hawk and Tucano trainers black with
> yellow flashes.
> --
> Rob Hatwell
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: LOM RV-3?? was(Random Vne changes??) |
<<
Hi Jim,
As you know I am building an RV4 and I am interested in installing the LOM
engine caus' it looks good, is certified and seem's to perform well. You
mention that Van's motor mount vendor provided the mount - do you think he
would be interested in supplying one for the RV4?? what sort of cost
difference did you have between this installation and the original Lycoming
installation?.
I'm about to order the finishing kit so this is all pretty interesting to
me.>>>>>
I know I have a price list from Joe Krybus, but I haven't found it yet. I'm
also going to look at the differences between the RV-3 and RV-4 engine mount
at the firewall.
<<<< How's this Ivoprop/Lom installation compare in performance with the old
Lycoming, what's the aerobatic performance compare??
John Morrissey
>>>>
I haven't noticed any differences. But I've not done any exotic aerobatics
in my RV-3. Just rolls, loops and wingovers.
More later.
Jim Ayers
LesDrag(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Modifications |
Responding to the parking brake valve question the other day took me back to
some other modifications, gleaned from other builders, which I have
incorporated into my not yet flying RV-6A. They are:
HS front spar attach point reinforcement. These are simple 2" long 1/8" thk
aluminum angle doublers placed at the two bolt holes attaching the HS front
spar to the fuselage. They sit on top of the existing HS spar lower angle
and pick up two rivets each into the spar web portion of the angle. From a
local builder of many RVs.
Instrument Panel Chart box front door. The door, which is about 5/8" taller
than the box, has a hinge cleverly placed inside between the bottom of the
box and downward against the inside of the door. The hinge line ends up
about 5/8" above the bottom edge of the door. When you open it, the part of
the door below the hinge line goes in and at 90 degrees hits the bottom of
the box. From Don "the Duck" Wentz.
Eyeball Cockpit Lights. I modified the black polycarbonate mounting flange
by sanding flats on two opposing sides of the flange and adding another
mounting hole 180 degrees opposite one of the existing holes. This double D
shape allowed them to mount in the slider canopy decks some distance back
from the spar front bulkhead station. I installed two small rocker ON/OFF
switches to control them. They can flood the instrument panel with adequate
lighting should your panel lighting ever take a dump and also act as cabin
lights if you're fumbling for things in the cabin at night. From Bud
Newhall.
I installed lighting relays (the small ones used for adding extra candlepower
to off-road vehicles) rated at 30A to handle the landing light power
switching instead of the switch taking the relatively high current (8A) 100W
switching load. I have RMD fixtures with GE#4595 bulbs and use a split
rocker switch for each.
I will be installing stainless steel braided teflon lines from the fuselage
bulkhead fitting to the calipers. These are Earl's parts.
I made a special 3 ganged firewall shield for the Carb Heat, Mixture and
Throttle Cables that puts them in a tight (.875 centers) vertical line on the
far right side of the battery tray. It is constructed of .187 thk aluminum
both sides (in and out) and has (3) .750 dia X .050" dp counterbores on the
inside surfaces to catch and squeeze the (3) AN bushings. The inside piece
has (6) 6-32 locking helicoils and the outside piece has corresponding
countersunk clearance holes. I have an ACAD drawing.
I made special 4130 throttle/mixture and governor cable support brackets
since I used ACS controls and the Van's parts won't work. The sheath
attaching saddle clamps and spacers at the actuating ends are standard
teleflex parts. I got mine at Airstar. I have ACAD drawings of the
brackets.
I am using 12 camlocs on the upper curved portion of the top cowling.
Skybolt has the adjustable type receptacles.
I mounted my ACK (the yellow plastic one) ELT tray, after modifying the
straps, to the space between the seat back and the side of the fuselage on
the passenger side. Just fits. I put an antenna BNC jack on the seat back
bulkhead station to allow me to disconnect the ELT from the A/C mounted
antenna and use the rubber duck. I will be placing a Halon extinguisher in
the same area on the pilot's side.
I did not build the center console, as I need the leg room. Instead, I put a
7.5" long 2" X .75" X 1/8" aluminum angle bracket to hold throttle, prop and
mixture cable controls. Carb heat is directly above the throttle on the
panel. The controls are spaced horizontally on 3" centers. I beefed up the
center of the instrument panel mounting by riveting a flanged triangular
piece from the center support (slider) to the instrument panel secondary
bulkhead and a nutplated channel (actually a piece of aileron spar) from the
secondary bulkhead to the instrument panel flange. On this channel I mounted
a covered lighter outlet for plug-in accessories. The data dump connector
for the GPS, an audio speaker, my VM1000 DPU, blind encoder and Gyro filter
are also mounted on the secondary bulkhead.
I did the vertically enhanced pilot canopy modification (slider) documented
by Van's and moved the rudder pedals forward about 1.5" from plans. I
haven't cut the seat backs down (actually you cut them from the bottom) but
have been told that this may be a good thing to do. We'll see.
I have a Geo Orndorff dog house in the firewall and my contactors (battery
and starter) are mounted to it inside the cockpit. My B&C regulator is
mounted on the inside of the firewall as are the manifold pressure and
loadmeter senders for the VM1000 and the Vacuum regulator.
I rigged the electric primer solenoid and boost pump so that a two circuit
mil-spec pushbutton switch temporarily turns the boost pump on as the
solenoid opens.
I made sure that the control arms for all cable actuated items were the same
length (approx 1.75") as the throttle, mixture and governor so that other
cable throws in the cockpit were similar (cabin heat, parking brake, carb
heat).
I replaced the studded rod end bearings on the lower flap link with standard
rod ends and used a 1/4" ID drill bushing (ground down to the same standoff
distance as the stud) with an AN bolt and a capture washer to prevent
separation of the bearings.
I am using an ACS oil breather can and have plumbed the condensate return to
a 1/8" NPT barb fitting tapped into a flat on the dipstick tube. I have been
told that teeing into the oil return line from the #3 head would be better.
We'll see.
Again, these were not my mods, but I became aware of them by studying what
others have done. I offer them for your consideration.
Gary VanRemortel
vanremog(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "J.C. Hassall" <jhassall(at)ipass.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Paint Schemes |
>
>The best thing I've ever seen for max viz is the system that alternates the
>landing lights L-R-L-R-L. As a biker you may remember an add-on that allowed
>your headlight to pulse bright-dim. It really works! And so does the Aviation
>version. I was virtually forced to stare a guy on final the other day who had
>it. Of course you have to run around with them on all the time and they don't
>do diddly except from head-on but maybe you could wire them into smaller white
>lights at the four corners.
Has anyone installed lights which illuminate the VS? The VS might be too
small to be seen well, but seems that this would improve lateral visibility.
Good, bad or indifferent idea?
J.C. Hassall
RV-6 Builder Wannabe
jhassall(at)ipass.net
Raleigh NC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie & Tupper England <england(at)vicksburg.com> |
| Subject: | Re: EAA Chapter 524/download problem |
A>>Mike,
>>
>>No, there was no attachment, straight ASCII text. I've notice the same
>>thing over the past week with my Eudora mail reader. I am at a loss to
>>explain the "=20" as well. I haven't seen that before. Originally the text
>>I posted was in Microsoft Publisher. I clipped the text from the flyer we
>>sent out to the mailing list, but it was just copied to the clipboard and
>>pasted into the e-mail. Maybe Matte can shed some light on the subject.
>>
>>-Gene
>
>I hesitate to bring up E-mail problems, but I too, am getting two copies of
>some E-mail with the "errors converting one or more attachments. Do you
>want to leave the message on your POP server, get rid of it, or download as
>text." message.
>
>Bob Skinner BSkinner(at)navix.net
Could the source of the problem be shown above? Most 'real' word processors
operate in 8-bit mode while e-mail is designed for 7-bit characters, with
MIME, etc. being 'fixes' to convert 8-bit files to to 7-bit format for email
transmission, after which they are converted back to 8-bit. I'm no expert,
but perhaps someone who is can help us out. (I thought for awhile that they
were graphics files & I just didn't know enough about Eudora to access them.)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ve7fp(at)jetstream.net (Ken Hoshowski) |
| Subject: | Re: How to contact |
----------
> From: Rob Hatwell <overvne.demon.co.uk!hatters(at)matronics.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: How to contact
> Date: Saturday, January 25, 1997 2:07 AM
>
>
He can be contacted at 250 675-4428 or fax 250 675-3293
3331 McBride Rd. Blind Bay B.C. Canada
V0E 1H1
> Does anyone know how I can contact Eustance Bowhay?
> --
> Rob Hatwell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Alan Carroll <carroll(at)geology.wisc.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Modifications |
>
>Responding to the parking brake valve question the other day took me back to
>some other modifications, gleaned from other builders, which I have
>incorporated into my not yet flying RV-6A. They are:
>
>HS front spar attach point reinforcement. These are simple 2" long 1/8" thk
>aluminum angle doublers placed at the two bolt holes attaching the HS front
>spar to the fuselage. They sit on top of the existing HS spar lower angle
>and pick up two rivets each into the spar web portion of the angle. From a
>local builder of many RVs.
>
Why this mod? Have there been problems reported that make a plans
deviation advisable?
Alan Carroll
RV-8 #80177 (Empenage)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CAGPADDLES(at)aol.com |
I'm preparing to order my -6 tailfeathers as soon as I gather a few more
tools and a lot more knowledge. I'm looking to meet up with any RV builders
in the Tidewater VA
area to spy on. I recently joined EAA but don't yet know if there is a local
chapter.
Would appreciate any info. E-mail me direct at cagpaddles(at)aol.com. Thanks.
Jim Brown
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | d shipman <innovate(at)dallas.net> |
| Subject: | Jerry VanGrunsven |
Hello Jerry:
In the Jan 89 Sport Aviation, your RV-4 (N2JV) is listed as having a
206 mph cruise with 180hp (@ 75%) and a fixed wood prop. This is fantastic
performance. What pitch prop is that and does it have an adverse effect on
your take off distance/climb performance. What RPM/manifold press does this
represent.
Thank you,
David Shipman
innovate(at)dallas.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Paint Schemes |
Rob Hatwell wrote:
>
>
> In message <970125035149_70773.2700_CHK38-1(at)CompuServe.COM>, Tim Bronson
> writes
> >
> >Hello Listers,
> >
> >Has anyone out there done any research on what paint colors and designs offer
> >
> >draws the human eye,
> > thinking loooooooong term about
> >paint
> >
> Tim
>
> The RAF as in UK RAF have carried out extensive studies on aircraft
> visability recently and have found that "Black" yes "Black" is the
> colour that makes the aircraft easiest to see in the air.
>
> Hence they are now painting the Hawk and Tucano trainers black with
> yellow flashes.
> --
> Rob Hatwell
I drive a safty yellow e-one firetruck,( nick-named the nuclear banana )
and some how, people don't seem to see it to well. I cannot figure out
how someone one could miss that big, ugly, loud truck with so many
lights it has a negative drain on the battery at idle. I think no
matter what color you paint your plane people will still stare
directly at it and never see it.
Oh by the way it's cheaper to insure a pee-green fire truck than it is
a red one.
Craig Hiers
RV-4 N143CH
I'm gonna paint mine white so the Florida sun will not eat me alive.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Bronson <70773.2700(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Tony Vitz: Tail Light |
Tony,
I'm interested. Please send me your tail light wiring replies. Tried to E-mail
you off-list but failed address.
Thanks.
Tim
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Morristec(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Double Flare Fittings |
Chet,
Double flares are supposed to be used for aluminum tube sizes under 3/8".
That is if you want them to develope the strength to withstand the rated
pressures. There are also fatigue/cracking issues. I have seen 1/4 flares
that wern't double flared, cracked completly off . Of course everyones been
double flaring right? They do make tools just for this. Try Imperial
Eastman.
BTW, I wouldn't worry about things like pitot static lines and other very low
pressure applications. But I most certainly double flared fuel (low pressure
but safety concerns), and brake lines (up to 600 psi).
Dan Morris
Morristec(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | spjohnsn(at)ix.netcom.com (Stephen Paul Johnson) |
| Subject: | Marking Aluminum |
Hi all,
I dread making this post because I may have made a stupid mistake, but
I need to find out. Like everybody else, I use a sharpie for layout.
On occasion, I need to mark lines on primered parts (skeletons to show
center of flanges, etc.). I found that I could not use a sharpie to
mark the primered parts. Sherwin Williams wash, 2 to 1 if it matters.
I have used a pencil succcessfully for this. Someone told me today
that pencil is very corrosive to aluminum. I wonder if this is true? I
only used a pencil on primered parts, but some of them are in contact
with unprimered alclad skin. I couldn't finds a reference to it in
Tony's books or Van's instructions. What's the story?
Steve Johnson
RV-8 #10121
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitch Faatz <mfaatz(at)sagenttech.com> |
Why don't you forward them to the list? You can't have *too much*
information!!
--------------------- cut here
--------------------------------------------------------------
Mitch Faatz mfaatz(at)sagenttech.com San Jose, CA
RV-6AQME N727MF (reserved)
Finished with empennage and initial fuselage work, working on left wing
>...
>>There were about 4 good responses to my tail light wiring question in the
>>last 3 days. If you want them,let me know.
>>Tony Vitz- tvitz1(at)airmail.net
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Patrick E. Kelley" <patk(at)mail.ic.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Paint Schemes |
Tim Bronson wrote:
>
> Hello Listers,
>
>
>
> Thanks for your input.
>
> Tim Bronson
> Contemplating ordering empennage (with light?), thinking loooooooong term about
> paint
Tim, back when I was flying model sailplanes, I quickly learned that at
any long viewing distance all colors are black and white. Check this
for yourself at an airport. What matters is degree of contrast. Most
competition model sailplanes tend to be white with blue or red
undersurfaces. The dark color shows up well against the sky, and the
light color against the houses and ground when you are trying to
cra...er, land the beast. WWII planes went for the opposite effect.
For visibility, IMHO, dark below and light above would be best.
PatK - RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: panel layout software |
IThanks to a fellow RV lister we've got some DWG files floating around and I
still have them intact. (Thanks Fred S. IFR RV6A)
Email me directly for a ACAD10 *.DWG file attached response (must have Acad
to read folks, if you want IGS files state so.) Drawing file contains a 2d
flat panel IFR layout. And some basic VFR panels I'm contemplating. You
can get a *.GIF file from the HOVAN RV page too.
CNC equipment I to have at my disposal, so far for 2 of us up here used a
easier approach? All I have done is to paper full size plot out the panel
and paste it onto the surface and drill and cut with the hole punch tool.
Many toolshops, offices, blue print or office supply stores can do full
sized plots for a free to a nominal charge.
They are 2d drawings and all tip up's should be concerned with the tip up
hinge location and the back distance of the art horiz (in a typical layout)
as it can hit the hinge as it passes through the dash FWD sub panel!! Watch
out!
Other advise I've recieved. Think about a longer/lower dash, mine is +1.5"
and captures a full sized air vent under that triangular arm rest front piece
(to cold in garage to get part# off plans sorry). And plan provisions for
removable dash and or panel access.
AOL slowing "my" access/activity these days.
David McManmon McManD(at)aol.com
RV6, tip up, 0320H2AD, finish kit, canopy frame fitting (slowed to $%#@!*&^%
cold!!!)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Phil Arter <philip.arter(at)mci2000.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
Steve, hi
I have never heard of such a thing. In A&P school they taught us not to mark on
exhaust headers with a pencil because the graphite will diffuse into the steel
changing its' alloy and causing it to crack. Maybe that is what this person was
thinking of.
Phil #80005
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bjnash(at)connectnet.com (BJ Nash) |
| Subject: | Rejuvenating NiCad Battery Packs (HOW TO) |
Do it yourself and save!
Find out how to rejuvenate NiCads by getting the info file by
auto-responder. Send email to nicads(at)pdsig.com Fix/Make your own
packs or just find out where to get them repaired/replaced!
(No obligation, no salesmen will call).
BJ
AIRCRAFT REMANUFACTURING
1291 E.Vista Way, #150
VISTA, CA. 92084 (619) 749 0239 FAX: 749 6384
Aviation Parts Sales Directory: Infobot(at)pdsig.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RMiller159(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass quantity, source for 6A |
I have tried the photo roller over saran wrap and it works OK. However,
there is a roller specifically made for rolling out fiberglass cloth. It
looks like a J-roller used for installing Formica, but has grooves cut it.
Works fantastic. Available in a 1/2" corner model and a 4" straight model.
I purchased mine from a Corvette shop, but I have seen them in boat supply
stores and some auto parts stores. The metal ones last longer than the
plastic ones.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Lewis <lewy(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Paint Schemes |
Craig Hiers wrote:
>
> I drive a safty yellow e-one firetruck,( nick-named the nuclear banana )
> and some how, people don't seem to see it to well. I cannot figure out
> how someone one could miss that big, ugly, loud truck with so many
> lights it has a negative drain on the battery at idle. I think no
> matter what color you paint your plane people will still stare
> directly at it and never see it.
> Oh by the way it's cheaper to insure a pee-green fire truck than it is
> a red one.
>
> Craig Hiers
> RV-4 N143CH
> I'm gonna paint mine white so the Florida sun will not eat me alive.
Isn't this color a version of chartreuse? But seams it would be
difficult to see in the air but highly visable on the flight line.
--
lewy(at)pacbell.net
__________|__________ |O>>>>o
\ \_0_/ / |
__\___(_+_)___/__ |
|/ \| |
\|/........................\|/ | \|/
\|/ . .
. .
. .
. . () ()
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GWDFLYER(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
It's true that carbon and graphite are corrosive to aluminum alloys and
contact should be avoided. However, clad aluminum alloys are used in
aircraft construction because they are less susceptible to corrosion than
uncoated alloys. The clad coating is pure aluminum, pure aluminum is not
susceptible to corrosion. I'm not sure, but I believe that common pencil
lead might contain graphite?? If you haven't compromised the cladding you
probably haven't done any damage and can remove the pencil lines with no harm
done, but then I'm not a metallurgist. Let's see what others have to say on
the subject. Gary Dalleske RV3 13KE
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John B. Abell" <jbabell(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Strange Messages From RV-List... |
about" (Jan 21, 6:54pm) <l03010d00af0f11952e47@[168.75.107.10]>
In the e-mail system where I used to work, "Apparently to" indicated the
recipient of a "BCC," i.e., a blind carbon copy.
Jack Abell
RV-6A N333JA (Reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John B. Abell" <jbabell(at)ix.netcom.com> |
Ed,
It is typically difficult to take advantage of great circle routes as a
general aviation pilot. Usually other factors shape the routes we plan.
Consider a non-stop flight from Santa Monica airport in Southern
California to Spirit of St. Louis airport. The great circle distance is
1366.7 nautical miles. The direct distance is 1371.5 nm, a difference
of only 4.8 nm (only a fraction of one percent). I recently planned
such a flight in four legs. By the time I accommodated desirable fuel
stops, mountains, navigational aids, restricted airspace, etc., the
flight plan was for 1454 nm, and that doesn't include screwing around
with circuitous approaches and departures. This is typical. Very long,
East-West, non-stop flights in Northern latitudes profit by great circle
routing. Other considerations usually swamp out any advantage of great
circle routing in typical flights by general aviation aircraft within
the 48 states.
Jack Abell
RV-6A N333JA (Reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John B. Abell" <jbabell(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Paint Schemes |
I agree with the white paint on top idea. I also agree that airplanes
at a distance always look dark against the sky, even white ones. The
compelling reason for white paint, it seems to me, is to keep the
aircraft cool on the ground while on a sunlit ramp in the summer. Bands
of bright colors on the wingtips and vertical and horizontal stabilizers
seem to enhance visibility. I recall a photograph from Van's 1996
calendar showing a white RV-6 with "rainbow" stripes of that sort, and I
thought it was especially eye-catching, but at a distance I'd guess it
would look a lot like any airplane, a dark dot against a brighter
background.
Jack Abell
RV-6A N333JA (Reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Osgood <Rick(at)ccc.henn.tec.mn.us> |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
Stephen Paul Johnson wrote:
>
>
> Hi all,
>
> I dread making this post because I may have made a stupid mistake, but
> I need to find out. Like everybody else, I use a sharpie for layout.
> On occasion, I need to mark lines on primered parts (skeletons to show
> center of flanges, etc.). I found that I could not use a sharpie to
> mark the primered parts. Sherwin Williams wash, 2 to 1 if it matters.
> I have used a pencil succcessfully for this. Someone told me today
> that pencil is very corrosive to aluminum. I wonder if this is true? I
> only used a pencil on primered parts, but some of them are in contact
> with unprimered alclad skin. I couldn't finds a reference to it in
> Tony's books or Van's instructions. What's the story?
>
> Steve Johnson
>
> RV-8 #10121
I use the SW product called Marine primer. Still Zinc Chromate but much
cheaper ($30 a gallon). I use a Sharpie Fine Point on my primered pieces
with no problems.
--
Rick Osgood
Rick(at)ccc.henn.tec.mn.us
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robbins Mitch <ROBBINM(at)chi.ntsb.gov> |
| Subject: | Re:Hartzell Prop |
I read the preceding prop thread with great interest. Imagine trying to
figure out what is happening to your prop short notice when something
goes wrong in flight!!!
A very simple way to remember for almost all props is:
1. The aerodynamic force on the blades drives them toward low pitch.
Mc/4 for the engineer types.
2. Counterweights are installed on some props to counter #1 and drive
the blades toward high pitch.
3. No oil pressure means #1 or #2 drive the pitch.
4. Notice I said "almost all props." There is a multitude of
configurations of start locks, feathering, and unfeathering accumulators,
etc. These generally are secondary or supplemental to #1 and #2.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steve Dixon <sdixon(at)laker.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy covers and flight manual |
I'm going to Freeport tonight and will ask the guys in the tower what
the rules are and let you know.
Steve Dixon
sdixon(at)laker.net
Capt B-727
RV-8 Tail
J.Ken Hitchmough wrote:
>
>
> Terry Mortimore wrote:
> unfortunately I
> have been told that the Bahama's government has restricted homebuilt
> aircraft from entering their airspace, you should check it out to avoid
> being disappointed.
>
> Terry, you're not the first one to have said that since I posted I was
> planning a trip there. I've had a couple of private emails too..each
> time though its a "I've heard" or "there's a rumour that.."
>
> I will most certainly be doing whatever I can to check it out (and have
> had a couple of good leads to do just that) but if anyone has a
> difinitive answer that is not just rumour, I'm sure the list would
> appreciate it.
>
> I will post whatever I find out.
>
> Ken RV6A Flying (well, at least as far as Lauderdale maybe)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Double Flare Fittings |
>
> I was looking through AC 43.13 and found on pg 165 (Hydraulic and
> Pneumatic Systems) that a double flare should be used on soft al tubing
> 3/8" OD or less. I don't remember reading this in the construction
> plans for my 6A. Did I overlook something.
OK, I'll ask the stupid question: What's a double flare?
Tim Lewis (no longer depending on AOL)
---------------------
Tim Lewis
RV-6AQ #60023
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net
-----------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.acker" <r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
>> center of flanges, etc.). I found that I could not use a sharpie to
>> mark the primered parts. Sherwin Williams wash, 2 to 1 if it matters.
My sharpie works fine on SW primered parts.
Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q Project:
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rob_acker
(last updated 12/23/96 - Oshkosh '96 photos)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Modifications |
<< Why this mod? Have there been problems reported that make a plans
deviation advisable? >>
Alan-
I guess it just provides additional localized strength during aerobatics (to
spread out the attachment stresses). It may not be absolutely necessary but
I trusted his expertise. He has built RVs for many buyers.
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Fulkerson" <mfulker(at)caverns.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rejuvenating NiCad Battery Packs (HOW TO) |
----------
> From: BJ Nash <connectnet.com!bjnash(at)matronics.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Rejuvenating NiCad Battery Packs (HOW TO)
> Date: Sunday, January 26, 1997 12:29 AM
>
> Do it yourself and save!
> Find out how to rejuvenate NiCads by getting the info file by
> auto-responder. Send email to nicads(at)pdsig.com Fix/Make your own
> packs or just find out where to get them repaired/replaced!
> (No obligation, no salesmen will call).
> BJ
> AIRCRAFT REMANUFACTURING
> 1291 E.Vista Way, #150
> VISTA, CA. 92084 (619) 749 0239 FAX: 749 6384
> Aviation Parts Sales Directory: Infobot(at)pdsig.com
E-mail the information to mfulker(at)caverns.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.acker" <r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Double Flare Fittings |
>
>that wern't double flared, cracked completly off . Of course everyones been
>double flaring right? They do make tools just for this. Try Imperial
>Eastman.
I checked the spec, you are absolutely right on the double flare requirement
for 3/8" and under soft metals.
Avery offers two flaring tools, both described as being for aviation use on
aluminum tubing. Neither is mentioned as being a single or double flare
tool. A few days ago I rec'd the one I ordered (Parker brand). It is
single flare, not double.
How about a source, model number, and approximate price on the Imperial you
mention (ACS has one listed for $505, ouch!). I wonder if the other tool
Avery offers is truly an aviation 37 deg. tool for use on aluminum. Anybody
know?
Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q Project:
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rob_acker
(last updated 12/23/96 - Oshkosh '96 photos)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Top <jjtop(at)cts.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
>
>Stephen Paul Johnson wrote:
Someone told me today
>> that pencil is very corrosive to aluminum. I wonder if this is true? I
>> only used a pencil on primered parts, but some of them are in contact
>> with unprimered alclad skin. I couldn't finds a reference to it in
>> Tony's books or Van's instructions.
Stephen:
Graphite/carbon in contact with aluminum or any other metal in the
pressance of moisture will cause corrosion thru electolysis.
The black pigment in sharpies or pilot pens is probably carbon. It is
probably good practice to clean all markings off when they are no longer
needed.
John Top
Phone: (619) 549-3556
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Benedict <billb(at)europa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LOM RV-3?? was(Random Vne changes??) |
>
>
><<
> Hi Jim,
>
> As you know I am building an RV4 and I am interested in installing the LOM
> engine caus' it looks good, is certified and seem's to perform well. You
> mention that Van's motor mount vendor provided the mount - do you think he
> would be interested in supplying one for the RV4??
John, Give us a call at Van's and we will get a price for the motor mount.
We will substitute the LOM mount for the standard mount, that way you will
get the gear legs all fit and ready to go. Bill
>
>
Bill
RV-4-180 soon. N894RV with over 400 hours behind a O-320, Over 1000 RV
flying hours.
These opinions are mine and do not necessarily represent the opinions or
position of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Benedict <billb(at)europa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Spars are flowing. |
RV-8 builders:
Two weeks ago, or thereabout I wrote: The RV-8 spars have started flowing.
To date we have shipped 20 spar sets. This has been very frustrating to us,
as it has been to our customers. Just hang in there. We are shipping in
the order that people have called informing us they are waiting for the
spars. I am not going to try and predict a rate for now. Lets wait a
couple of weeks and you can ask the question again. Thanks for your patience.
26 Jan, 97 An update: We were up to 20 sets about two weeks ago, but
were busy with other scheduled orders last week. There are 30 sets of -8
spars that will get boxed up this week. This should make 30 people happy.
The pipeline is flowing. I think the fabrication problems have been solved.
I think another 12 will be ready for the first week in Feb. Bill
>
Bill
RV-4-180 soon. N894RV with over 400 hours behind a O-320, Over 1000 RV
flying hours.
These opinions are mine and do not necessarily represent the opinions or
position of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <72770.552(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
>I have never heard of such a thing. In A&P school they taught
>us not to mark on exhaust headers with a pencil because the
>graphite will diffuse into the steel changing its' alloy and
>causing it to crack. Maybe that is what this person was thinking of.
I didn't see the posts before this message came up but it reminded
me of what appears to be an "industrial legend" floating around Raytheon
Aircraft (was Beech) about a case where an inspector circled an over-flush
rivet on the skin of an airplane with a graphite pencil. The story
goes that after some time, the entire disk fell out due to electrolytic
corrosion induced by the electropotential differences between alluminum
and carbon . . . .
Needless to say, as an engineer with a "show me" attitude, I am skeptical.
I have seen many examples of markings on alluminum, including graphite
pencil where no adverse effects were noted on the affected surface,
much less complete destruction of the underlying material . . .
ESPECIALLY in the time frame required for an airplane under construction
to make it down the assembly line!
Soooooooo, forgive me if I raise the challenge for someone to produce
any aircraft component of any material that was so affected. I'll
personally pay for the metalurgical analysis of the parts to confirm
or deny the hypothesis. I've asked around the old salts at Beech about
this story . . . EVERYONE has heard it; it was posted for years on
multitudes of bulletin boards. However, NOBODY saw it or knows anyone
who saw it. I'd love to research, document and publish the real story.
If anyone can point me to individuals who have done work in this
area, I'd appreciate it. It most cases these stories have a grain of
truth about them but like all legends, they tend to "get better with
age."
Regards,
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
72770.552(at)compuserve.com
http:\\www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: Paint Schemes |
>I agree with the white paint on top idea. I also agree that airplanes
>at a distance always look dark against the sky, even white ones. The
>compelling reason for white paint, it seems to me, is to keep the
>aircraft cool on the ground while on a sunlit ramp in the summer.
Me too. Also, against a dark background (the ground), white seems to show up
well. Conversely, dark colours seem to show up well against the sky. So I'm
thinking of painting my plane white on top, dark underneath.
FWIW, the RNZAF just did some tests on visibility, painting their trainers
various colours. They're now all painted yellow, with black ailerons &
rudder. They seem to be more visible now than in the old colours of
silver-grey with flouro red tips.
Frank.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
frankv(at)pec.co.nz | "Knowledge=Power=Energy=Matter=Mass;
Frank van der Hulst | A good bookshop is just a genteel
Software Engineer | Black Hole that knows how to read".
PEC(NZ) Ltd (Cardax), Marton | Terry Pratchett, "Guards! Guards!"
http://www.pec.co.nz/~frankv/ |
--------------------------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Benedict <billb(at)europa.com> |
The subject of a double flare on aluminum tubing seems active and no one has
stepped forward to state that even though the specs call for a double flare,
I would venture to state that the single flare is most widely used in the
home building circles. Of those projects that I have seen the flares, and
even at Van's, the standard single flare is what we use. As another person
pointed out, $500 for a double flare tool puts it in the league of *the big
boys*. When I was building, I went to a local FBO and had some tubes
flared before buying my flaring tool and he performed a single flare.
Twenty years ago a person was reluctant to buy a homebuilt because they were
considered non standard and questionable. Today homebuilts are traded
daily. Maybe times have changed and the flaring methods need to be
revisited and re-evaluated for their applications. Was the double flare
standard established using the current sleeves and nuts or was the standard
established before the sleeves, and the sleeves replace the need for the
double flare? Perhaps Bob N. can look into this one? I know it isn't
electrical, but he seems to have the contacts! Bill
Bill
RV-4-180 soon. N894RV with over 400 hours behind a O-320, Over 1000 RV
flying hours.
These opinions are mine and do not necessarily represent the opinions or
position of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chinkley(at)ix.netcom.com (Curtis R. Hinkley) |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Spars are flowing. |
Bill,
Thank you for the update.
Curtis Hinkley
RV-8
chinkley(at)ix.netcom.com
hinkleyc(at)fca.gov
You wrote:
>RV-8 builders:
>Two weeks ago, or thereabout I wrote: The RV-8 spars have started
flowing.To date we have shipped 20 spar sets. This has been very
frustrating to us, as it has been to our customers. Just hang in
there. We are shipping in the order that people have called informing
us they are waiting for the spars. I am not going to try and predict a
rate for now. Lets wait a couple of weeks and you can ask the question
again. Thanks for your patience.
>
>26 Jan, 97 An update: We were up to 20 sets about two weeks ago,
but were busy with other scheduled orders last week. There are 30 sets
of -8 spars that will get boxed up this week. This should make 30
people happy. The pipeline is flowing. I think the fabrication
problems have been solved. I think another 12 will be ready for the
first week in Feb.
Bill
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Oops, HS mounting error |
Well, I've made one of those sickening errors. The horizontal
stabilizer has to be mounted to the fuselageat a zero degree
incidence angle. The plans call for using 1/8" spacers under the
front HS spar (so you clear some rivets), then the HS is levelled so
it is exactly level with the longerons. Then one drills holes thru
the rear HS spar into a couple of 3/16" thick extensions of F-611.
I mistakenly used 1/16" spacers under the front HS spar, and then
drilled the bottom two holes (one left, one right) thru the rear HS
spar into the F-611 piece. At that point I noticed my mistake.
If I go ahead and put 1/8" spacers under the front HS spar my HS
tilts up by about .28 degrees (according to my trig calculator). If
I leave the 1/16" spacers the front HS spar still clears the rivets,
but I've lost the ability to lower the angle of the HS if I should
need to after flight test. That's a real possibility, because I'm
going with an O-360 and C/S prop.
Here's what I'm thinking of doing:
- Put the 1/8" spacer under the front HS spar per the plans
- Raise the rear HS spar to the proper position (level with the
longerons). I can then drill the upper two holes thru the rear HS
spar into F-611. The lower holes (the ones I've already drilled)
will be misaligned by about 1/16".
- Drill the lower pair of holes to 1/4" (vs the 3/16" called for in
the plans) and just live with the fact that the resulting hole in
F-611 is oblong by about 1/32".
-I could eliminate the oblong hole by using an AN5 bolt (5/16")
Comments? Other ideas?
Thanks,
Tim
---------------------
Tim Lewis
RV-6AQ #60023
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net
-----------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Davi Howard <snoopyar(at)pacbell.net> |
Does anyone remember the magazine and month that the article came out
about the LOM powered RV-3? Thanks Davi
RV-4 Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John B. Abell" <jbabell(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
This thread has been somewhat interesting to me because I spent the
first half of my Air Force career in aircraft maintenance and the only
caution I ever heard about markings on aircraft material and components
involved pencil marks on steel parts that were subject to high
temperatures. The caution was due to the fact that the steel, when
heated to a high enough temperature (probably its eutectoid point),
would absorb some of the carbon from the pencil mark; therefore, its
metallurgical properties would change due to the higher local carbon
content and it could become brittle and subject to fatigue or cracking.
Is there any real evidence that a Sharpie line has ill effects on
Alclad, especially after priming? Does anyone have a source for
relevant material? If not, I'm not inclined to worry about it. BTW,
why mark aluminum with a pencil? A Sharpie is so much clearer.
Jack Abell
RV-6A N333JA (Reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.acker" <r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Double flare |
>
>
>home building circles. Of those projects that I have seen the flares, and
>even at Van's, the standard single flare is what we use.
Thanks Bill...I'll be using my single flare tool.
Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q Project:
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rob_acker
(last updated 12/23/96 - Oshkosh '96 photos)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.acker" <r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com> |
On my web page I have a picture of an RV-6 with a Wag-Aero ICS (intercom,
flip flop nav/comm, 20 channel memory, and glideslope) radio.
I am looking to contact the person this aircraft belongs to, and/or anyone
else with comments regarding this radio. Seems like a *lot* of bang for the
buck at $1200.
Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q Project:
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rob_acker
(last updated 12/23/96 - Oshkosh '96 photos)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mcarob(at)ozemail.com.au |
| Subject: | Polyurethane Painting |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: Oops, HS mounting error |
My recommendation is to fly it first. You may find that you don't have to
move it at all. Or maybe the front spar needs to be moved 'up'. Only if
you need to lower the front spar will you have to raise the rear spar.
Actually, I think the angle of attack of the wing plays a larger part than
the size/weight of the engine/prop.
If you do have to raise the rear spar than the idea of using 5/16" bolts may
be ok; you have to watch the edge margin, though.
>
>Well, I've made one of those sickening errors.
>
>I mistakenly used 1/16" spacers under the front HS spar, and then
>drilled the bottom two holes (one left, one right) thru the rear HS
>spar into the F-611 piece. At that point I noticed my mistake.
>
>
>Here's what I'm thinking of doing:
>- Put the 1/8" spacer under the front HS spar per the plans
>- Raise the rear HS spar to the proper position (level with the
>longerons). I can then drill the upper two holes thru the rear HS
>spar into F-611. The lower holes (the ones I've already drilled)
>will be misaligned by about 1/16".
>- Drill the lower pair of holes to 1/4" (vs the 3/16" called for in
>the plans) and just live with the fact that the resulting hole in
>F-611 is oblong by about 1/32".
>-I could eliminate the oblong hole by using an AN5 bolt (5/16")
>
>Comments? Other ideas?
>
>
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
First flight August 1990
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Johnson <rvgasj(at)popmail.mcs.net> |
| Subject: | Advice Needed On Panel Paint Color (Grey ? White ?) |
I will be painting my instrument panel in the next few days. I have seen
some planes painted with white instrument panels and really like the way
they have looked. However, some people have said that the white panel in an
RV (even with a long instrument panel glare shield) projects a lot of glare
onto the canopy.
I flew Vans RV6 (with instructor Mike Seeger) for 10 hours ( which had a mat
black panel ) and never noticed any glare. Unfortunately, I don't like the
way a black panel looks.
I have built my 6A with the tilt up canopy because I love the unrestricted
visibility of having nothing disturbing the outside view / fishbowl effect.
Not having had an airplane with a canopy before, I would greatly appreciate
any advice / experience that you have noticed with glare on the canopy as it
relates to instrument panel color.
I am wondering if grey is probably the best compromise.
Thanks to all who respond.
Scott Johnson rvgasj(at)mcs.com
Project Status: Expect taxi tests within a month ( getting excited ! )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darrell L. Anderson" <d.l.anderson(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
<72770.552(at)CompuServe.COM>
>I have never heard of such a thing. In A&P school they taught
>us not to mark on exhaust headers with a pencil because the
>graphite will diffuse into the steel changing its' alloy and
>causing it to crack. Maybe that is what this person was thinking of.
>Soooooooo, forgive me if I raise the challenge for someone to produce
any aircraft component of any material that was so affected. I'll
personally pay for the metalurgical analysis of the parts to confirm
or deny the hypothesis. I've asked around the old salts at Beech about
this story . . . EVERYONE has heard it; it was posted for years on
multitudes of bulletin boards. However, NOBODY saw it or knows anyone
who saw it. I'd love to research, document and publish the real story.
If anyone can point me to individuals who have done work in this
area, I'd appreciate it. It most cases these stories have a grain of
truth about them but like all legends, they tend to "get better with
age."<
Something similar was a part of Air Force Aircraft Maintenance lore. It was
always said that marking with a pencil in the gas path of an afterburner
would cause a burn-through, so, we don't do it. The engine specialists use
chalk for marking. I've seen some pretty spectacular burn-throughs, ("Why
is that guy poppin' flares in the pattern?"), but I don't know as they have
ever been identified as being caused by pencil marks. In fact, the F-16's
P&W F-100 engine uses a Molybdenum (graphite-like)dry lube on the sliding
parts of the augmentor nozzle. Most of the metal is ceramic coated. Since
the metal in there can be glowing white-hot, just a few degrees short of
melt down, I suppose that it's possible that the wrong catalyst (graphite?)
might cause a hot spot and touch it off.
Extreme case, huh? I've never heard of a problem on room temp alclad.
Suggestion: Try using Dry-Erase markers as used on "white boards" in the
office. I don't know if a fine enough point is available, though. Depends
on what tolerance you are building to, I guess. ;)
Darrell Anderson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: Oops, HS mounting error |
>I mistakenly used 1/16" spacers under the front HS spar, and then
>drilled the bottom two holes (one left, one right) thru the rear HS
>spar into the F-611 piece. At that point I noticed my mistake.
>
>If I go ahead and put 1/8" spacers under the front HS spar my HS
>tilts up by about .28 degrees (according to my trig calculator). If
>I leave the 1/16" spacers the front HS spar still clears the rivets,
>but I've lost the ability to lower the angle of the HS if I should
>need to after flight test.
My thoughts, mostly from my model aircraft background (I don't even have a
fuselage yet [sigh]).
Soooo.... what do people who need to alter their HS AOA do in terms of
redrilling the holes? Surely they're in exactly the same situation that you
find yourself in? Anyone out there done that?
If you need to lower the HS angle, can you not put 1/16" (or more) spacers
under the TE to raise it?
A quarter of a degree up incidence on the HS would equate to about half a
degree (I guess) up elevator, maybe 10 degrees up-trim, all the time.
Possibly it'll cost you 1-2 mph??
Frank (building elevators).
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
frankv(at)pec.co.nz | "Knowledge=Power=Energy=Matter=Mass;
Frank van der Hulst | A good bookshop is just a genteel
Software Engineer | Black Hole that knows how to read".
PEC(NZ) Ltd (Cardax), Marton | Terry Pratchett, "Guards! Guards!"
http://www.pec.co.nz/~frankv/ |
--------------------------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Rod End Bearings for Rudder |
| From: | tmyrick(at)juno.com (John A Myrick III) |
I have just completed the rudder for my RV8 and I have a couple of
questions for the list.
First, what is the best tool to screw the rod end bearings into the nut
plates on the rudder and elevators?
Second, I have studied the plans for my empennage kit and I can not find
the distance for the rod end bearing bolt hole from the spar. The ones
for the elevator are shown to be 13/16th. Am I to assume that this is
the same for the rudder?
Thanks,
Tripp Myrick
tmyrick(at)juno.com
RV-8 SN 80085 (wings due this week)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)navix.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Advice Needed On Panel Paint Color (Grey ? White |
?)
>I have built my 6A with the tilt up canopy because I love the unrestricted
>visibility of having nothing disturbing the outside view / fishbowl effect.
>Not having had an airplane with a canopy before, I would greatly appreciate
>any advice / experience that you have noticed with glare on the canopy as it
>relates to instrument panel color.
>Scott Johnson rvgasj(at)mcs.com
Scott, I have a white panel in my tip-up RV-6. You do get some reflection.
Certainly more than you would have with a dark panel but you can see the
reflection of even a dark panel if conditions are right. I guess the white
panel hasn't bothered me too much. I, too, like the looks of the black
gauges and radios on a white panel. Black panels look "old time" to me.
Some wood panels look good, some, not. I'll go with either a white or gray
panel in the next six.
Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)navix.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Smith <kpsmith(at)cnsnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass quantity, source for 6A |
Gougeon Brothers sels an excellent manual, gives away tech data on their
products, and sells all the tools you could want. Jan (one of the
brothers) told me last week that he's flying off time on his newly
completed RV4, and used his epoxy products on the tips, cowl and lots of
little places here and there.
http://www.cris.com/~Gougeon/
Ken Smith RV6 empanage sitting idle during iceboat season.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Smith <kpsmith(at)cnsnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
Paul McReynolds advised me to use a red pencil on primered parts. Easy
to see and no graphite to worry about. But primed parts don't have
graphite in contact with the metal anyway...
Ken Smith
Lonely RV6 empanage in shop full of iceboat.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott) |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
aol.com!GWDFLYER(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
>
> It's true that carbon and graphite are corrosive to aluminum alloys and
> contact should be avoided. However, clad aluminum alloys are used in
> aircraft construction because they are less susceptible to corrosion than
> uncoated alloys. The clad coating is pure aluminum, pure aluminum is not
> susceptible to corrosion. I'm not sure, but I believe that common pencil
> lead might contain graphite?? If you haven't compromised the cladding you
> probably haven't done any damage and can remove the pencil lines with no harm
> done, but then I'm not a metallurgist. Let's see what others have to say on
> the subject. Gary Dalleske RV3 13KE
What about permanent type magic markers? I've used one quite a bit,
especially over primered aluminum.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "J VanGrunsven" <rvforpla(at)pacifier.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_01BC0BAE.EE6BF9C0
----------
> From: r.acker <ix.netcom.com!r.acker(at)matronics.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Marking Aluminum
> Date: Sunday, January 26, 1997 8:15 AM
>
>
>
> >> center of flanges, etc.). I found that I could not use a sharpie to
> >> mark the primered parts. Sherwin Williams wash, 2 to 1 if it matters.
>
> My sharpie works fine on SW primered parts.
>
> Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q Project:
> http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rob_acker
> (last updated 12/23/96 - Oshkosh '96 photos)
>
------=_NextPart_000_01BC0BAE.EE6BF9C0
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------=_NextPart_000_01BC0BAE.EE6BF9C0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "les williams" <lesliebwilliams(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Advice Needed On Panel Paint Color (Grey ? White ?) |
Scott,
I painted my first 6A panel off-white and added a flattener to eliminate the
gloss. I didn't have any glare problem.
Les Williams
RV-6AQB #60027
Tacoma, WA
----------
From: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com on behalf of Scott Johnson
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 1997 4:38 PM
Subject: RV-List: Advice Needed On Panel Paint Color (Grey ? White ?)
I will be painting my instrument panel in the next few days. I have seen
some planes painted with white instrument panels and really like the way
they have looked. However, some people have said that the white panel in an
RV (even with a long instrument panel glare shield) projects a lot of glare
onto the canopy.
I flew Vans RV6 (with instructor Mike Seeger) for 10 hours ( which had a mat
black panel ) and never noticed any glare. Unfortunately, I don't like the
way a black panel looks.
I have built my 6A with the tilt up canopy because I love the unrestricted
visibility of having nothing disturbing the outside view / fishbowl effect.
Not having had an airplane with a canopy before, I would greatly appreciate
any advice / experience that you have noticed with glare on the canopy as it
relates to instrument panel color.
I am wondering if grey is probably the best compromise.
Thanks to all who respond.
Scott Johnson rvgasj(at)mcs.com
Project Status: Expect taxi tests within a month ( getting excited ! )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JamesCone(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Paint Schemes |
The all in one wing tip lights are just easier to install. If you really
want to be seen, be sure to get either a dual flash or comet flash strobe
system from Whelan. My wife says that she can see the strobes from miles
away when she can't even begin to see the plane.
Jim Cone
jamescone(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Advice Needed On Panel Paint Color (Grey ? White ?) |
Scott Johnson wrote:
>
> I have built my 6A with the tilt up canopy because I love the unrestricted
> visibility of having nothing disturbing the outside view / fishbowl effect.
> Not having had an airplane with a canopy before, I would greatly appreciate
> any advice / experience that you have noticed with glare on the canopy as it
> relates to instrument panel color.
>
> I am wondering if grey is probably the best compromise.
>
> Thanks to all who respond.
>
> Scott Johnson rvgasj(at)mcs.com
>
> Project Status: Expect taxi tests within a month ( getting excited ! )
Scott
I have a gray panel and don't notice any glare except when flying at
night i get reflection on the canopy from the inst. lights because I
have a short glare sheild, my feeling was I did not want the long
overhang of the glare sheild because it was just the perfect
spot to bump my head on if, heaven forbid, I should hit something
and come to a sudden stop.
--
Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS First flight July 14, 1989 :-) Hillsboro, OR
jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oops, HS mounting error |
>
>Well, I've made one of those sickening errors.
>
>I mistakenly used 1/16" spacers under the front HS spar, and then
>drilled the bottom two holes (one left, one right) thru the rear HS
>spar into the F-611 piece. At that point I noticed my mistake.
>
>
>Here's what I'm thinking of doing:
>- Put the 1/8" spacer under the front HS spar per the plans
>- Raise the rear HS spar to the proper position (level with the
>longerons). I can then drill the upper two holes thru the rear HS
>spar into F-611. The lower holes (the ones I've already drilled)
>will be misaligned by about 1/16".
>- Drill the lower pair of holes to 1/4" (vs the 3/16" called for in
>the plans) and just live with the fact that the resulting hole in
>F-611 is oblong by about 1/32".
>-I could eliminate the oblong hole by using an AN5 bolt (5/16")
>
>Comments? Other ideas?
>
Leave it as is tell you fly, I had to actually raise the LE of my
stabalizer about a 1/6" when I had a O-320 on my -6 and then when
I installed a O-360 and added a 12lb. harmonic dampner it made
maybe 1/8" to 1/4" inch difference in the position of the elevator
in flight. Bill Benedict could maybe commint on the structural
aspect of 1/6" versus 1/8" spacer.
--
Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS First flight July 14, 1989 :-) Hillsboro, OR
jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com
________________________________________________________________________________
Does anyone remember the magazine and month that the article came out
about the LOM powered RV-3? Thanks Davi
RV-4 Wings
>>
Hi All,
Sport Aviation, Oct. 1994, Page 40.
Sport Aviation, Dec. 1995, Page 14
Kitplanes, May 1996, Page 88-89
Aerokurier, May 1996, Front Cover and Page 110-113
As see http://member.aol.com/lesdrag/rv3.htm
and http://member.aol.com/lesdrag/ivoprop.htm
Jim Ayers
LOM M332A engine Ivprop Prop RV-3 N47RV Maroon Marauder
LesDrag(at)aol.com
Thousand Oaks, Ca. USA
http://member.aol.com/lesdrag/rv3.htm
http://member.aol.com/lesdrag/ivoprop.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Terry Jordan <ace(at)pacifier.com> |
------ =_NextPart_000_01BC0BE8.F15DB620
Forget the tail light. It's a pain and for about the same money, you can =
op to use the wing tip lighting kit that incorporates white to the rear, =
strobes and nav.=20
----------
From: Tim Bronson[SMTP:CompuServe.COM!70773.2700(at)matronics.com]
Sent: Friday, January 24, 1997 7:51 PM
Subject: RV-List: Paint Schemes
=3D=3D> RV-List message posted by: Tim Bronson =
<70773.2700(at)CompuServe.COM>
Hello Listers,
Has anyone out there done any research on what paint colors and designs =
offer
best overall visibilty? I have noticed that airplanes with the W.W.II =
style
invasion stripes tend to stand out in the black and white pictures in =
the
various RV-related publications I read. I'll admit it's a bit of an
extrapolation, but it occurred to me that if my eve is drawn to one =
particular
1/2" image of thirty in a fly-in picture, maybe it's because the paint =
design
draws the human eye, as do flashing lights. Could come in handy on a =
"black and
white" day. "Fire engine red" seems to be an obvious choice for a =
stand-out
color, though I recall reading a while back that yellow-green is more of =
an
attention getter, hence the color choice for newer emergency vehicles. =
Any of
you ex-military and/or search and rescue types recall any information on =
what
kind of camouflage DOESN'T work?
On a related topic, Van's says some builders opt to put the white nav =
lights on
the wing tips rather than the one one the tail. My question: why? Is =
wiring to
the rudder a hassle, or a high maintenance item? I like the idea of one =
of
those combined white light and strobes on the rudder. Comments?
As a former motorcycle rider, I am acutely aware that relatively small =
vehicles
can be tough to see, especially if you're not looking for them. When I =
finally
finish my project, I want it to stand out as much as possible (within =
the limits
of good taste, of course). =20
Thanks for your input.
Tim Bronson=20
Contemplating ordering empennage (with light?), thinking loooooooong =
term about
paint =20
------ =_NextPart_000_01BC0BE8.F15DB620
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XlFXfBFTQSbQ/yTQpFEKhacRBACVATZwKKF/PxKe8p/wQfEhklhqTKFtvnWB8gQgRtFSwXgRKFUy
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bfGVUS8Q/2ESIIEFsASBIHKzwQnwJNDnRqGr0xvkPyl2IguApaP/pXG3JCCCBJCfQR2yCoVPhH+5
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vAEeAD0AAQAAAAUAAABSRTogAAAAACS0
------ =_NextPart_000_01BC0BE8.F15DB620--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Benedict <billb(at)europa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Advice Needed On Panel Paint Color (Grey ? White |
?)
>
>I will be painting my instrument panel in the next few days. I have seen
>some planes painted with white instrument panels and really like the way
>they have looked. However, some people have said that the white panel in an
>RV (even with a long instrument panel glare shield) projects a lot of glare
>onto the canopy.
>
>I flew Vans RV6 (with instructor Mike Seeger) for 10 hours ( which had a mat
>black panel ) and never noticed any glare. Unfortunately, I don't like the
>way a black panel looks.
>Scott Johnson rvgasj(at)mcs.com
Scott, I agree with your observation regarding a black panel. My RV-4 has
a flat gray panel and I like it. At night, my DG (which does not like
aerobatics, so it just rotates around at about 360 degrees per 15 seconds.)
is right in the middle of my field of vision, so it does not really matter
what color the panel is, the instruments will still show up. We finally
ventured away from black on one of Van's 6A's, and it looks good, but
there are more reflections than if it was black. Typically, you do not see
the reflections unless you focus on them. I would go for the gray. Tom
Green has a -6 and went with Lycoming gray, a darker gray and it also looks
attractive. Bill
Bill
RV-4-180 soon. N894RV with over 400 hours behind a O-320, Over 1000 RV
flying hours.
These opinions are mine and do not necessarily represent the opinions or
position of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
Importance: normal
| From: | Klaus Roth <rothk(at)oims.med.siemens.de> |
Has somebody contact with Avery within the last couple of days ?
Is this company still running ? I faxed an order twice and didn't get an
answer so far.
(1st end of Nov. - 2nd beginning of Jan.)
Has the fax number changed ?? Is there an e-mail address ??
Any information is greately appreciated.
Klaus Roth
Germany
RV 4,
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | OrndorffG(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Rod End Bearings for Rudder |
Tripp,
Yes the 13/16 is a good start fot the lenth, as for the tool I have a
tool made just for screwing in rod end bearing in . cost $10.00 plus shipping
a will fit both sizes. If you need one call me at 817-439-3280....George
Orndorff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | OrndorffG(at)aol.com |
Kluas,
Yes the Avery's are still there I see them every day their phone number's
are (817)439-8400 , 1-800-652-8379, or fax (817)439-8402. I will pass your
message on to them....George Orndorff
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oops, HS mounting error |
Tim,
It's highly unlikely you will have to adjust the incidence of you HS. I
would leave it 1/16" and fly the airplane. If you're really worried about it
though there should be enough edge distance to install 5/16" bolts in the
rear spar.
Rick McBride
RICKRV6(at)aol.com
RV6 N523JC
RV8 80027
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rod End Bearings for Rudder |
Tripp,
I've seen a number of homemade tools to accomplish this. I picked up a cheap
(Taiwan) socket made of soft metal and cut a slot that fit the rod end
bearing. I don't recall the size socket I used but it has worked very well.
I used a Dremel tool with a burr type cutter to make the slot.
Rick McBride
RICKRV6(at)aol.com
RV6 N523JC
RV8 80027
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
<< The story goes that after some time, the entire disk fell out due to
electrolytic
corrosion induced by the electropotential differences between alluminum
and carbon . . . . >>
Bob,
The pivot word there is "potential". There is a graphite rod as the center
electrode of your standard carbon-zinc flashlight battery. This is a case of
technology harnessing a corrosion process. The electropotential difference
there in 1.5 volts. The electropotential difference between carbon and
aluminum is about 2.5 volts. This means that there is more energy to push a
corrosion process between carbon and aluminum. The potential exists, as they
say.
Briefly, however, some conditions are needed to have corrosion. Three things
in a mix, actually.
1. You need an electrolyte. Battery acid, orange juice, condensed moisture,
salt water, etc.
2. two materials with a electropotential difference. carbon/zinc,
aluminum/carbon, steel/rust,
3. everything in contact. ( conducting electricity)
In the situation with the pencil mark there are some mitigating
circumstances:
A. small amount of graphite to aluminum. The aluminum has a lot of material
to sacrifice relative to the amount of carbon driving the corrosion reaction.
This slows down the reaction a lot.
B. Lack of much electrolyte. I.E. no battery acid. This slows down the
reaction a lot also. There is some moisture in the air that would help do the
job but not much.
However, if the mix was trapped in a small crevice, corrosion can happen due
to some other factors that I'll not get into right now, ( Thermodynamic
equations and that sort of thing which I prefer to forget).
By they way, If you want to produce your very own zinc/carbon battery, just
spray some graphite into your car door lock and mix in some winter slush.
Car door locks are made of zinc die castings. If you have some time to kill
and you need a reference, look up a book by Uhlig called 'Corrosion and
Corrosion Control" It will keep you bored for the better part of a year.
The bottom line is that, chances are, one would never see a corrosion problem
with a pencil mark on an aluminum sheet unless there was a good exposure to
salt water and everything would go at that point. I like the story though,
it has potential.
Gene Francis
cafgef(at)aol.com
getting some aluminum stuff chromated for corrosion protection. I'm thinking
that I would like to fly to the Bahamas too
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2856300-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2856300-0-0
From:"No Full Name"
Subject: Re: RV-List: Rod End Bearings for Rudder
Tripp,
I've seen a number of homemade tools to accomplish this. I picked up a cheap
(Taiwan) socket made of soft metal and cut a slot that fit the rod end
bearing. I don't recall the size socket I used but it has worked very well.
I used a Dremel tool with a burr type cutter to make the slot.
Rick McBride
RICKRV6(at)aol.com
RV6 N523JC
RV8 80027
--Boundary-2856300-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2856446-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2856446-0-0
From:"No Full Name"
Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: Marking Aluminum
<< The story goes that after some time, the entire disk fell out due to
electrolytic
corrosion induced by the electropotential differences between alluminum
and carbon . . . . >>
Bob,
The pivot word there is "potential". There is a graphite rod as the center
electrode of your standard carbon-zinc flashlight battery. This is a case of
technology harnessing a corrosion process. The electropotential difference
there in 1.5 volts. The electropotential difference between carbon and
aluminum is about 2.5 volts. This means that there is more energy to push a
corrosion process between carbon and aluminum. The potential exists, as they
say.
Briefly, however, some conditions are needed to have corrosion. Three things
in a mix, actually.
1. You need an electrolyte. Battery acid, orange juice, condensed moisture,
salt water, etc.
2. two materials with a electropotential difference. carbon/zinc,
aluminum/carbon, steel/rust,
3. everything in contact. ( conducting electricity)
In the situation with the pencil mark there are some mitigating
circumstances:
A. small amount of graphite to aluminum. The aluminum has a lot of material
to sacrifice relative to the amount of carbon driving the corrosion reaction.
This slows down the reaction a lot.
B. Lack of much electrolyte. I.E. no battery acid. This slows down the
reaction a lot also. There is some moisture in the air that would help do the
job but not much.
However, if the mix was trapped in a small crevice, corrosion can happen due
to some other factors that I'll not get into right now, ( Thermodynamic
equations and that sort of thing which I prefer to forget).
By they way, If you want to produce your very own zinc/carbon battery, just
spray some graphite into your car door lock and mix in some winter slush.
Car door locks are made of zinc die castings. If you have some time to kill
and you need a reference, look up a book by Uhlig called 'Corrosion and
Corrosion Control" It will keep you bored for the better part of a year.
The bottom line is that, chances are, one would never see a corrosion problem
with a pencil mark on an aluminum sheet unless there was a good exposure to
salt water and everything would go at that point. I like the story though,
it has potential.
Gene Francis
cafgef(at)aol.com
getting some aluminum stuff chromated for corrosion protection. I'm thinking
that I would like to fly to the Bahamas too
--Boundary-2856446-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Immelmann(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Avery & Cleaveland |
<< Has somebody contact with Avery within the last couple of days ?
Is this company still running ? I faxed an order twice and didn't get an
answer so far.
(1st end of Nov. - 2nd beginning of Jan.)
Has the fax number changed ?? Is there an e-mail address ??
Any information is greately appreciated.
Klaus Roth
Germany
RV 4, >>
I just placed and order with them by phone at their 800 number. I don't
suppose that would work overseas, though. Their catalog says to call
817-439-8400. The fax # I have is 817-439-8402. They show a European
Representative & Sales Office:
Gloster Air Parts
"Glencree", Lansdown Road
Cheltenham, England GL51 6QW
Phone and fax: 01242 260242
I can't reach Cleaveland Air Tools. Anybody got a line on them? Their 800
number is disconnected and nobody answered the local # . I couldn't even get
my fax to go through.
Ed Holyoke
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Barnhart <barnhart(at)a.crl.com> |
| Subject: | Lighted Altimeter prices |
The price of a new internally-lighted altimeter is now up to about $380,
even from Van's. I was able to purchase a used, overhauled one from
Century Instrument fot $280. It's not everyday that one can safe a hundred
bucks, so I thought I would pass this info along.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Advice Needed On Panel Paint Color (Grey ? White ?) |
| From: | wstucklen1(at)juno.com (Frederic W Stucklen) |
Scott,
I painted my panel Dove Grey, then used black text on clear stick on
labels for all the switched, breakers etc.. I thinks it's very easy to
see, and doesn't overpower you in direct sunlight.
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
wstucklen1(at)juno.com
writes:
>
>I will be painting my instrument panel in the next few days. I have
seen
>some planes painted with white instrument panels and really like the way
>they have looked. However, some people have said that the white panel
in an
>RV (even with a long instrument panel glare shield) projects a lot of
glare
>onto the canopy.
**** SNIP *****
>I am wondering if grey is probably the best compromise.
>
>Thanks to all who respond.
>
>Scott Johnson rvgasj(at)mcs.com
>
>Project Status: Expect taxi tests within a month ( getting excited !
>)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael Angiulo <mikeang(at)MICROSOFT.com> |
I think I've seen the "all in one lights" that you mention below. The
prototype RV8 has them screwed on the outside of the wing tips. Is there
any way to install these under a flush plexi plate or does that prevent
them from being seen in enough of a rearward direction? I like the idea of
the simplicity it just looks a little draggy hanging out of the wing tip.
----------
From: aol.com!JamesCone(at)matronics.com
[SMTP:aol.com!JamesCone(at)matronics.com]
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 1997 10:02 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Paint Schemes
The all in one wing tip lights are just easier to install. If you really
want to be seen, be sure to get either a dual flash or comet flash strobe
system from Whelan. My wife says that she can see the strobes from miles
away when she can't even begin to see the plane.
Jim Cone
jamescone(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John B. Abell" <jbabell(at)ix.netcom.com> |
I just placed an order with Avery's last week. They're alive and still
answering their phone: (800) 652-8379.
Jack Abell
RV-6A N333JA (Reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2857011-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2857011-0-0
From:"ORAPOST"
Subject: RV-List: Return Message
--Boundary-2856300-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2856300-0-0
From:"No Full Name"
Subject: Re: RV-List: Rod End Bearings for Rudder
Tripp,
I've seen a number of homemade tools to accomplish this. I picked up a cheap
(Taiwan) socket made of soft metal and cut a slot that fit the rod end
bearing. I don't recall the size socket I used but it has worked very well.
I used a Dremel tool with a burr type cutter to make the slot.
Rick McBride
RICKRV6(at)aol.com
RV6 N523JC
RV8 80027
--Boundary-2856300-0-0--
--Boundary-2857011-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MiDiBu <midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com> |
>
>
>Has somebody contact with Avery within the last couple of days ?
I talked to him last week (approximately Jan 26). I had a yoke that had
been back-ordered and was due. I talked to him about noon, he said he would
immediately ship it UPS blue. About 2:00 p.m. the UPS truck showed up with
the yoke. Talk about service! I immediately called them back to make sure
that they didn't send me a second yoke. Shipping would have been at their
expense, but I would have had to eventually ship it back at my expense (I
have a couple of other small things that I need to return, so that would not
be a big deal).
>
>Is this company still running ? I faxed an order twice and didn't get an
> answer so far.
>(1st end of Nov. - 2nd beginning of Jan.)
>
Yes they are. Can't help you with the FAX.
>Has the fax number changed ?? Is there an e-mail address ??
>
Class? Class?
>Any information is greately appreciated.
>
>Klaus Roth
>Germany
>RV 4,
>
You're quite welcome. Now, if you would, please tell me how to drive my
Avery rivet gun. I practiced on the Orndorff control surface project with
my first 3/32" rivets. Not a pretty sight. Out of 21 rivets, 3 were
acceptable. Oh well, I'm going to get my wife to help me with the next 21.
I can blame her if there's no improvement.
Mike Weller RV-8 (under construction)
midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com (preferred) or mike.weller(at)msfc.nasa.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass education needed |
<< f his building instruction manuals
you would scoff at the others.
Good Luck!
B.A. RV6A 85TX >>
Thanks for the input, I have located a set of Vari-eze plans.
Don Riggs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Harold Sutphin <hsutphin(at)magicnet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
The instructor I had in sheet metal class at Parks College told us not
to use pencil directly on aluminum because it could, as a "stress
riser", cause cracking to take place at that point on the sheet. This
would be dependent on loads/cycles of stress and where that sheet was
used.
Harold
Lockheed Martin
//RV-6A Wingkit//
>
> The bottom line is that, chances are, one would never see a corrosion problem
> with a pencil mark on an aluminum sheet unless there was a good exposure to
> salt water and everything would go at that point. I like the story though,
> it has potential.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | alex.peterson(at)deltec.com |
>Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997 11:35:56 CST-6
| Subject: | Re: Oops, HS mounting error |
Enlarged holes in the aft (main) spar of the horizontal stabilizer aren't
problematic from an edge distance point of view. However, the bending
strength of the spar will be reduced due to the reduced cross section of
the spar. Doing so would seem inadvisable without talking to Van.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2857447-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2857447-0-0
From:"ORAPOST"
Subject: RV-List: Return Message
--Boundary-2856446-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2856446-0-0
From:"No Full Name"
Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: Marking Aluminum
<< The story goes that after some time, the entire disk fell out due to
electrolytic
corrosion induced by the electropotential differences between alluminum
and carbon . . . . >>
Bob,
The pivot word there is "potential". There is a graphite rod as the center
electrode of your standard carbon-zinc flashlight battery. This is a case of
technology harnessing a corrosion process. The electropotential difference
there in 1.5 volts. The electropotential difference between carbon and
aluminum is about 2.5 volts. This means that there is more energy to push a
corrosion process between carbon and aluminum. The potential exists, as they
say.
Briefly, however, some conditions are needed to have corrosion. Three things
in a mix, actually.
1. You need an electrolyte. Battery acid, orange juice, condensed moisture,
salt water, etc.
2. two materials with a electropotential difference. carbon/zinc,
aluminum/carbon, steel/rust,
3. everything in contact. ( conducting electricity)
In the situation with the pencil mark there are some mitigating
circumstances:
A. small amount of graphite to aluminum. The aluminum has a lot of material
to sacrifice relative to the amount of carbon driving the corrosion reaction.
This slows down the reaction a lot.
B. Lack of much electrolyte. I.E. no battery acid. This slows down the
reaction a lot also. There is some moisture in the air that would help do the
job but not much.
However, if the mix was trapped in a small crevice, corrosion can happen due
to some other factors that I'll not get into right now, ( Thermodynamic
equations and that sort of thing which I prefer to forget).
By they way, If you want to produce your very own zinc/carbon battery, just
spray some graphite into your car door lock and mix in some winter slush.
Car door locks are made of zinc die castings. If you have some time to kill
and you need a reference, look up a book by Uhlig called 'Corrosion and
Corrosion Control" It will keep you bored for the better part of a year.
The bottom line is that, chances are, one would never see a corrosion problem
with a pencil mark on an aluminum sheet unless there was a good exposure to
salt water and everything would go at that point. I like the story though,
it has potential.
Gene Francis
cafgef(at)aol.com
getting some aluminum stuff chromated for corrosion protection. I'm thinking
that I would like to fly to the Bahamas too
--Boundary-2856446-0-0--
--Boundary-2857447-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2858110-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2858110-0-0
From:"Dave Barnhart "
Subject: RV-List: Lighted Altimeter prices
The price of a new internally-lighted altimeter is now up to about $380,
even from Van's. I was able to purchase a used, overhauled one from
Century Instrument fot $280. It's not everyday that one can safe a hundred
bucks, so I thought I would pass this info along.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
--Boundary-2858110-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2858411-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2858411-0-0
From:"John B. Abell"
Subject: Re: RV-List: Avery
I just placed an order with Avery's last week. They're alive and still
answering their phone: (800) 652-8379.
Jack Abell
RV-6A N333JA (Reserved)
--Boundary-2858411-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2858730-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2858730-0-0
From:"Frederic W Stucklen"
Subject: Re: RV-List: Advice Needed On Panel Paint Color (Grey ? White ?)
Scott,
I painted my panel Dove Grey, then used black text on clear stick on
labels for all the switched, breakers etc.. I thinks it's very easy to
see, and doesn't overpower you in direct sunlight.
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
wstucklen1(at)juno.com
writes:
>
>I will be painting my instrument panel in the next few days. I have
seen
>some planes painted with white instrument panels and really like the way
>they have looked. However, some people have said that the white panel
in an
>RV (even with a long instrument panel glare shield) projects a lot of
glare
>onto the canopy.
**** SNIP *****
>I am wondering if grey is probably the best compromise.
>
>Thanks to all who respond.
>
>Scott Johnson rvgasj(at)mcs.com
>
>Project Status: Expect taxi tests within a month ( getting excited !
>)
>
>
--Boundary-2858730-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2858348-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2858348-0-0
From:"No Full Name"
Subject: Re: RV-List: Avery & Cleaveland
<< Has somebody contact with Avery within the last couple of days ?
Is this company still running ? I faxed an order twice and didn't get an
answer so far.
(1st end of Nov. - 2nd beginning of Jan.)
Has the fax number changed ?? Is there an e-mail address ??
Any information is greately appreciated.
Klaus Roth
Germany
RV 4, >>
I just placed and order with them by phone at their 800 number. I don't
suppose that would work overseas, though. Their catalog says to call
817-439-8400. The fax # I have is 817-439-8402. They show a European
Representative & Sales Office:
Gloster Air Parts
"Glencree", Lansdown Road
Cheltenham, England GL51 6QW
Phone and fax: 01242 260242
I can't reach Cleaveland Air Tools. Anybody got a line on them? Their 800
number is disconnected and nobody answered the local # . I couldn't even get
my fax to go through.
Ed Holyoke
--Boundary-2858348-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2858896-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2858896-0-0
From:"Michael Angiulo "
Subject: RE: RV-List: Paint Schemes
I think I've seen the "all in one lights" that you mention below. The
prototype RV8 has them screwed on the outside of the wing tips. Is there
any way to install these under a flush plexi plate or does that prevent
them from being seen in enough of a rearward direction? I like the idea of
the simplicity it just looks a little draggy hanging out of the wing tip.
----------
From: aol.com!JamesCone(at)matronics.com
[SMTP:aol.com!JamesCone(at)matronics.com]
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 1997 10:02 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Paint Schemes
The all in one wing tip lights are just easier to install. If you really
want to be seen, be sure to get either a dual flash or comet flash strobe
system from Whelan. My wife says that she can see the strobes from miles
away when she can't even begin to see the plane.
Jim Cone
jamescone(at)aol.com
--Boundary-2858896-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ab6a(at)juno.com (ALLAN E POMEROY) |
Klaus,
Avery does have an email address now. I haven't used it myself,
but was told the last time I talked to them on the phone, that it was
active. I think if you try they will recieve it.
Allan Pomeroy Central NY
AB6A(at)juno.com
writes:
>
>
>Has somebody contact with Avery within the last couple of days ?
>
>Is this company still running ? I faxed an order twice and didn't get
>an
> answer so far.
>(1st end of Nov. - 2nd beginning of Jan.)
>
>Has the fax number changed ?? Is there an e-mail address ??
>
>Any information is greately appreciated.
>
>Klaus Roth
>Germany
>RV 4,
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2858965-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2858965-0-0
From:"No Full Name"
Subject: Re: RV-List: Fiberglass education needed
<< f his building instruction manuals
you would scoff at the others.
Good Luck!
B.A. RV6A 85TX >>
Thanks for the input, I have located a set of Vari-eze plans.
Don Riggs
--Boundary-2858965-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2858869-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2858869-0-0
From:"MiDiBu "
Subject: Re: RV-List: Avery
>
>
>Has somebody contact with Avery within the last couple of days ?
I talked to him last week (approximately Jan 26). I had a yoke that had
been back-ordered and was due. I talked to him about noon, he said he would
immediately ship it UPS blue. About 2:00 p.m. the UPS truck showed up with
the yoke. Talk about service! I immediately called them back to make sure
that they didn't send me a second yoke. Shipping would have been at their
expense, but I would have had to eventually ship it back at my expense (I
have a couple of other small things that I need to return, so that would not
be a big deal).
>
>Is this company still running ? I faxed an order twice and didn't get an
> answer so far.
>(1st end of Nov. - 2nd beginning of Jan.)
>
Yes they are. Can't help you with the FAX.
>Has the fax number changed ?? Is there an e-mail address ??
>
Class? Class?
>Any information is greately appreciated.
>
>Klaus Roth
>Germany
>RV 4,
>
You're quite welcome. Now, if you would, please tell me how to drive my
Avery rivet gun. I practiced on the Orndorff control surface project with
my first 3/32" rivets. Not a pretty sight. Out of 21 rivets, 3 were
acceptable. Oh well, I'm going to get my wife to help me with the next 21.
I can blame her if there's no improvement.
Mike Weller RV-8 (under construction)
midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com (preferred) or mike.weller(at)msfc.nasa.gov
--Boundary-2858869-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)idacom.hp.com> |
> Any of
> you ex-military and/or search and rescue types recall any information on =
> what
> kind of camouflage DOESN'T work?
For SAR considerations, stick to colours and hues not found in nature.
White is about the easiest thing to see from the air, unless you go
down in winter (bummer). A bit of bright, unnatural colour somewhere
can help too, such as bright orange tips. If you want the best visibility,
paint it like a Canadian air force SAR aircraft: bright yellow with
red tips--looks like hell, though!
As always, file and fly a plan, and have a good ELT. Then it just won't
matter what colour you are.
Tedd McHenry
tedd(at)idacom.hp.com
Edmonton, Canada
(retired CAF SAR pilot; RV-6 plans, no money or workshop :-( )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil (Mike Wills) |
| Subject: | Re: Advice Needed On Panel Paint Color (Grey ? White ?) |
Scott,
No experience with my own but... My only flight in an RV to date was in a
-4. The panel in the plane was painted a dark blue, as were the floor
boards, a map holder along one side, and a circuit breaker panel along the
other side. Remainder of the cockpit was white. It was not quite as dark as
navy blue, and matched a trim stripe on the exterior of the airplane. Very
nice looking and didnt seem to have a problem with excessive glare.
Mike Wills
RV-4 (wings)
willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil
>
>I will be painting my instrument panel in the next few days. I have seen
>some planes painted with white instrument panels and really like the way
>they have looked. However, some people have said that the white panel in an
>RV (even with a long instrument panel glare shield) projects a lot of glare
>onto the canopy.
>
>I flew Vans RV6 (with instructor Mike Seeger) for 10 hours ( which had a mat
>black panel ) and never noticed any glare. Unfortunately, I don't like the
>way a black panel looks.
>
>I have built my 6A with the tilt up canopy because I love the unrestricted
>visibility of having nothing disturbing the outside view / fishbowl effect.
>Not having had an airplane with a canopy before, I would greatly appreciate
>any advice / experience that you have noticed with glare on the canopy as it
>relates to instrument panel color.
>
>I am wondering if grey is probably the best compromise.
>
>Thanks to all who respond.
>
>Scott Johnson rvgasj(at)mcs.com
>
>Project Status: Expect taxi tests within a month ( getting excited ! )
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
> Is there any real evidence that a Sharpie line has ill effects on
> Alclad, especially after priming?
There is one ill effect that I have experienced, and that is that the
mark will bleed through the primer and/or the finish paint. A sharpie
line on primer does not wipe off easily w/lacquer thinner or acetone. And
if you work at it TOO hard, you'll take off the primer.
I compromise by trying not to get carried away with the marking pen on
primered parts in areas that will be finish painted later. That way
there's less cleanup to do.
I'm surprised no one has mentioned this yet. Am I the only one who's
experienced this?
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott) |
Help, again. I'm looking at drawing 17 for the fuel tank. (rv-4)
In the center of the drawing of the fuel tank, at the bottom where it
shows the spacing for the nut plate holes, there is a dashed line from
right to left ending with a B at each end. What is this dashed line
trying to show me? I'm missing the point, I think. If anyone can help
me with this, thanks.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2859204-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2859204-0-0
From:"ORAPOST"
Subject: RV-List: Return Message
--Boundary-2857011-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2857011-0-0
From:"ORAPOST"
Subject: RV-List: Return Message
boundary="Boundary-2856300-0-0"
--Boundary-2856300-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
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verify these names and try them again.
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--Boundary-2856300-0-0
From:"No Full Name"
Subject: Re: RV-List: Rod End Bearings for Rudder
Tripp,
I've seen a number of homemade tools to accomplish this. I picked up a cheap
(Taiwan) socket made of soft metal and cut a slot that fit the rod end
bearing. I don't recall the size socket I used but it has worked very well.
I used a Dremel tool with a burr type cutter to make the slot.
Rick McBride
RICKRV6(at)aol.com
RV6 N523JC
RV8 80027
--Boundary-2856300-0-0--
--Boundary-2857011-0-0--
--Boundary-2859204-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil (Mike Wills) |
| Subject: | Re: Avery & Cleaveland |
Number is 1-800-368-1822. I just received an order from them last friday.
Their catalog is now available on the net at http://www.tdsi.net/~clevtool/.
You can find further order info there.
Mike Wills
RV-4 (wings)
willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil
>I can't reach Cleaveland Air Tools. Anybody got a line on them? Their 800
>number is disconnected and nobody answered the local # . I couldn't even get
>my fax to go through.
>Ed Holyoke
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Mortimore" <terry.mortimore(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod End Bearings for Rudder |
Hi John: I made a tool to install the rod end bearings out of a 1/2 drive
9/16 socket. I used a cut off wheel to cut slots on each side to allow the
socket to slide onto the body of the rod end. It has worked well for me,
hope this helps.
terry
Terry Mortimore 2.7L Subaru RV-6A
38 Cartier St.
Sault Ste Marie
Ontario, Canada
P6B-3K2
terry.mortimore(at)sympatico.ca
----------
> From: John A Myrick III <juno.com!tmyrick(at)matronics.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Rod End Bearings for Rudder
> Date: Sunday, January 26, 1997 10:53 PM
>
>
> I have just completed the rudder for my RV8 and I have a couple of
> questions for the list.
>
> First, what is the best tool to screw the rod end bearings into the nut
> plates on the rudder and elevators?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie & Tupper England <england(at)vicksburg.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Advice Needed On Panel Paint Color (Grey ? White |
?)
snip
>>I will be painting my instrument panel in the next few days. I have
>seen
>>some planes painted with white instrument panels and really like the way
>>they have looked. However, some people have said that the white panel
Can't speak for a -6 but my -4 has a white panel, no glare shield, and the
fuselage under the canopy (where the glare shield would be) is also white
(that way when I bought the airplane).
If I had built it I probably would have worried about it, but I've never
noticed a problem when flying. It does look good, too.
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2860367-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2860367-0-0
From:"No Full Name"
Subject: Re: RV-List: Oops, HS mounting error
Enlarged holes in the aft (main) spar of the horizontal stabilizer aren't
problematic from an edge distance point of view. However, the bending
strength of the spar will be reduced due to the reduced cross section of
the spar. Doing so would seem inadvisable without talking to Van.
--Boundary-2860367-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.acker" <r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | AV-10 Engine Monitor |
Audio Flight Avionics is offering a 20% discount on their AV-10 if sold in
lots of five or more. That brings the price from $1100 to $880 each.
How about it, four other RV builders interested? Please e-mail privately,
thanks.
Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q project:
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rob_acker
(last update 12/23/96 - Oshkosh '96 RV pictures)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "ORAPOST" <ORAPOST(at)tva.gov> |
--Boundary-2860420-0-0
The included message could not be delivered to the following invalid mail names.
Please
verify these names and try them again.
Bad name: eseay
--Boundary-2860420-0-0
From:"Harold Sutphin "
Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: Marking Aluminum
The instructor I had in sheet metal class at Parks College told us not
to use pencil directly on aluminum because it could, as a "stress
riser", cause cracking to take place at that point on the sheet. This
would be dependent on loads/cycles of stress and where that sheet was
used.
Harold
Lockheed Martin
//RV-6A Wingkit//
>
> The bottom line is that, chances are, one would never see a corrosion problem
> with a pencil mark on an aluminum sheet unless there was a good exposure to
> salt water and everything would go at that point. I like the story though,
> it has potential.
--Boundary-2860420-0-0--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ve7fp(at)jetstream.net (Ken Hoshowski) |
| Subject: | Cowl cheek hinges |
After 185 hrs I noticed that the left cowl cheek hinge has broken and will
have to be replaced. This is the short MS20001 extruded hinge behind the
prop spinner.
Has anyone tried strengthening this area and using cam-lock fasteners. I
would be interested in a good alternative. This is a lot of stress here
and strength is important.
Bill B. comments appreciated.
Ken ve7fp(at)jetstream.net
Beautiful British Columbia
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Tennison" <jtennison.cmrl(at)Veda.com> |
charset=US-ASCII
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - Original Message - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
From: datastar.net!lottmc(at)matronics.com (Michael C. Lott)
Date: Monday, January 27, 1997 at 2:54:10 pm EST
Attached: None
Help, again. I'm looking at drawing 17 for the fuel tank. (rv-4)
In the center of the drawing of the fuel tank, at the bottom where it
shows the spacing for the nut plate holes, there is a dashed line from
right to left ending with a B at each end. What is this dashed line
trying to show me? I'm missing the point, I think. If anyone can help
me with this, thanks.
I believe the line is a section cut. So look elswhere for section B-B and
your question should be answered.
Jim, "Sorry I don't have the plans in front of me" Tennison
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
>You're quite welcome. Now, if you would, please tell me how to drive my
>Avery rivet gun. I practiced on the Orndorff control surface project with
>my first 3/32" rivets. Not a pretty sight. Out of 21 rivets, 3 were
>acceptable.
Don't worry! I had the same kind of ratio at my first sheet-metal class. Now
I've done a few hundred rivets on the real thing, I hardly ever need to
drill one out.
Here's my various Dos & Don'ts on rivetting technique:
Try to use a handsqueezer on 3/32" rivets. Make sure that the air pressure
is *low* (35psi or so) when driving 3/32" rivets. Lean your weight against
the gun to keep pressure on the rivet head. Keep the gun at right angles to
the surface. Keep the bucking bar pressed hard against the rivet until
*after* you release the gun's trigger. Keep the bucking bar at right angles
to the surface. Use as heavy a bucking bar as you can.
>Oh well, I'm going to get my wife to help me with the next 21.
>I can blame her if there's no improvement.
Probably not a good idea... until you can drive & buck your own rivets, you
probably won't do a good job of driving them with someone else bucking.
Also, when *she* gets blamed for *your* poor rivetting, well,... I hope your
couch is comfortable. :-)
HTH,
Frank.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
frankv(at)pec.co.nz | "Knowledge=Power=Energy=Matter=Mass;
Frank van der Hulst | A good bookshop is just a genteel
Software Engineer | Black Hole that knows how to read".
PEC(NZ) Ltd (Cardax), Marton | Terry Pratchett, "Guards! Guards!"
http://www.pec.co.nz/~frankv/ |
--------------------------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Lauritsen" <clevtool(at)tdsi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Avery & Cleaveland |
We moved to a new location last Thursday and the phone company was kind
enough to put us out of buisness for more than a day. But everything is
corrected and working smoothly.
Our new address is 2225 First St. Boone, IA 50036.
Our phone and fax numbers remain the same:
515-432-6794
800-368-1822
515-432-7804 fax
clevtool(at)tdsi.net
Sorry for the confusion,
Mike Lauritsen
Cleaveland Aircraft Tool
1804 First St.
Boone, IA 50036
1-800-368-1822
clevtool(at)tdsi.net
----------
> From: aol.com!Immelmann(at)matronics.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Avery & Cleaveland
> Date: Monday, January 27, 1997 10:14 AM
>
>
> I can't reach Cleaveland Air Tools. Anybody got a line on them? Their 800
> number is disconnected and nobody answered the local # . I couldn't even
get
> my fax to go through.
> Ed Holyoke
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EBundy2620(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Advice Needed On Panel Paint Color (Grey ? White ?) |
> I have built my 6A with the tilt up canopy because I love the unrestricted
> visibility of having nothing disturbing the outside view / fishbowl
effect.
> Not having had an airplane with a canopy before, I would greatly
appreciate
> any advice / experience that you have noticed with glare on the canopy as
it
> relates to instrument panel color.
>
> I am wondering if grey is probably the best compromise.
I have a slider, and painted the canopy tubing/rollover bar and front brace
white because I like the way it looks. A few people told me that it would
drive me crazy because the tubing would be distracting. Well, I never even
notice it. A lot of airplanes have tubing, center posts, etc, and your mind
tunes them out after it realizes they are of no consequence.
As for the dash, I thought white might cause too much glare so I went with a
light grey (similar to Marhyde) and have had no glare problems at all. My
glareshield overhang is about 4" and seems to be just right.
Ed Bundy RV6A #23834 N427EM - flying
Eagle, ID
ebundy2620(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Barry & Valerie Wawrin <barval(at)digital.net> |
------ =_NextPart_000_01BC0C8F.4C06C520
Gentlemen:
One of the best things you can carry in your survival bag is a supply of =
Cyalume Lightsticks, aka: "Chem Lights". Why? Because most search and =
rescue missions are not limited to just daylight hours. Many crews fly =
in darkened environments with as little as 5% illumination by utilizing =
Night Vision Goggle technologies. A chem light, flashlight, fire, even =
a penlight can be spotted for several miles when viewed through NVG's. =
Just remember to extinguish the light source once the crews have located =
you or the light will "flood-out" the NVG and impair the rescuers =
vision.
Barry
USAFR Search and Rescue
HC-130 Flight Engineer
----------
From: Tedd McHenry[SMTP:idacom.hp.com!tedd(at)matronics.com]
Sent: Monday, January 27, 1997 2:26 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: Paint Schemes
=3D=3D> RV-List message posted by: Tedd McHenry
> Any of
> you ex-military and/or search and rescue types recall any information =
on =3D
> what
> kind of camouflage DOESN'T work?
For SAR considerations, stick to colours and hues not found in nature. =20
White is about the easiest thing to see from the air, unless you go=20
down in winter (bummer). A bit of bright, unnatural colour somewhere=20
can help too, such as bright orange tips. If you want the best =
visibility,=20
paint it like a Canadian air force SAR aircraft: bright yellow with=20
red tips--looks like hell, though! =20
As always, file and fly a plan, and have a good ELT. Then it just won't =
matter what colour you are. =20
Tedd McHenry
tedd(at)idacom.hp.com
Edmonton, Canada
(retired CAF SAR pilot; RV-6 plans, no money or workshop :-( )
------ =_NextPart_000_01BC0C8F.4C06C520
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------ =_NextPart_000_01BC0C8F.4C06C520--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | finnlass(at)ix.netcom.com (Finn Lassen) |
| Subject: | Reading of plans/drawings - answer |
Since no-one else answered:
A -----------------
| |
\/ \/
D D
line on a drawing simply indicates that there is a cross-section
drawing elsewhere on the sheet (plan) showing the marked part from a
different viewpoint (angle). In this example that drawing would be
called SECTION D-D.
Finn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)navix.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl cheek hinges |
>After 185 hrs I noticed that the left cowl cheek hinge has broken and will
>have to be replaced. This is the short MS20001 extruded hinge behind the
>prop spinner.
>Bill B. comments appreciated.
Bill,
A lot of builders are using nutplates as hinge breakage seems a common
problem. I riveted and glued on a .063" plate to the bottom cowl that
projects up into the upper cowl and used three, #8 truss head screws into
nutplates. No problems after 340 hours. I also used #6, truss head screws
to attach the top and bottom cowls to the fuse and this, too, seems to be
working well. I did use the hinges to join the top and bottom cowl and for
the two verticle surfaces of the bottom cowl.
Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)navix.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leo Davies <leo(at)icn.su.OZ.AU> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl cheek hinges |
Ken,
I have seen several flying RVs and one fuselage built by Art Chard in which
this short piece of hinge has been replaced with an aluminium plate with
plate nuts and screws. Makes me think this has happened before.
Leo Davies (planning to use plate nuts and structural screws)
>
>After 185 hrs I noticed that the left cowl cheek hinge has broken and will
>have to be replaced. This is the short MS20001 extruded hinge behind the
>prop spinner.
>
>Has anyone tried strengthening this area and using cam-lock fasteners. I
>would be interested in a good alternative. This is a lot of stress here
>and strength is important.
>
>Bill B. comments appreciated.
>
>
>Ken ve7fp(at)jetstream.net
>Beautiful British Columbia
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Reiff <Reiff(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Paint Schemes |
Robert Fritz wrote:
>
>
> re. high viz paint schemes
>
> The best thing I've ever seen for max viz is the system that alternates the
> landing lights L-R-L-R-L.
I'm planning to intall an alternating landing light system for collision
avoidance. Rather than buying the aviation units for several hundred
dollars, NAPA auto parts stores have a school bus flasher for about $10.
JC Whitney also sells a couple of ready made systems, one with a bimetal
flasher and one that's solid state. The solid state one was too heavy in
my opinion.
Bob Reiff
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cowl cheek hinges |
I also had the short hinges break on my 6A at this location. The fix I
used was to fasten an aluminum plate on the inside of the cowling, with
3/16" rivits holding it to the bottom cowl. Then on the outside, I
fastened another equal size plate rivited to the outside of the top
cowl. Two nutplates on top & two nutplates on the bottom with four
screws. To remove cowl, I have 4 screws on each side to remove. Not as
convienent as camlocks, but I don't expect to ever have a problem here
again.
Ted French
RV-6A flying C-FXCS
Ken Hoshowski wrote:
>
>
> After 185 hrs I noticed that the left cowl cheek hinge has broken and will
> have to be replaced. This is the short MS20001 extruded hinge behind the
> prop spinner.
>
> Has anyone tried strengthening this area and using cam-lock fasteners. I
> would be interested in a good alternative. This is a lot of stress here
> and strength is important.
>
> Bill B. comments appreciated.
>
> Ken ve7fp(at)jetstream.net
> Beautiful British Columbia
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cowl cheek hinges |
Whoops
Actually the rivits were 3/32". The plates are held in place by the
screws, the rivits are there to hold the plates in posn when removing &
installing the cowl.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bjnash(at)connectnet.com (BJ Nash) |
| Subject: | RADIOS: APPROVED/UNAPPROVED LISTING |
Get your list of aircraft radios either from the FCC at their web
page: http://www.fcc.gov/wtb/freqtol.html
or off our auto-responder by email: FCC explaination of the frequency
tolerances: freqtol(at)pdsig.com
Listing of approved radios: gdradio(at)pdsig.com
Listing of unapproved radios bdradio(at)pdsig.com
The above is offered as a free info service, if you'd like to keep
such stuff coming:
Our listing of used radios for sale: av(at)pdsig.com
Our listing of tools: tools(at)pdsig.com
A directory of all the stuff we have to offer: infobot(at)pdsig.com
Bill Nash
AIRCRAFT REMANUFACTURING
1291 E.Vista Way, #150
VISTA, CA. 92084 (619) 749 0239 FAX: 749 6384
Aviation Parts Sales Directory: Infobot(at)pdsig.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Davi Howard <snoopyar(at)pacbell.net> |
aol.com!LesDrag(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Does anyone remember the magazine and month that the article came out
> about the LOM powered RV-3? Thanks Davi
> RV-4 Wings
> >>
> Hi All,
>
> Sport Aviation, Oct. 1994, Page 40.
> Sport Aviation, Dec. 1995, Page 14
> Kitplanes, May 1996, Page 88-89
> Aerokurier, May 1996, Front Cover and Page 110-113
>
> As see http://member.aol.com/lesdrag/rv3.htm
> and http://member.aol.com/lesdrag/ivoprop.htm
>
> Jim Ayers
> LOM M332A engine Ivprop Prop RV-3 N47RV Maroon Marauder
> LesDrag(at)aol.com
> Thousand Oaks, Ca. USA
> http://member.aol.com/lesdrag/rv3.htm
> http://member.aol.com/lesdrag/ivoprop.htm
Thanks, I actually found the issues thanks to your references.
Davi
RV-4 Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
rv-list(at)matronics.com
| From: | Huw Williams <H.Williams(at)btinternet.com> |
delete H.Williams(at)BTInternet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
rv-list(at)matronics.com
| From: | Huw Williams <H.Williams(at)btinternet.com> |
remove H.Williams(at)BTinternet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Martinph(at)cyberbury.net |
sorry about that forgot the Email address
martinphcyberbury.net
thanks
Jeff RV8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Martinph(at)cyberbury.net |
MA>HI all
MA>just wanted to mention that I have an RV6 tail kit and a compleat set of
MA>RV dwg's for sale.horizontal stab is compleat less the trimming for tip
MA>caps. Id like to get about $800 for it Im building an 8 instead .
MA> thanks
MA> Jeff RV8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Davi Howard <snoopyar(at)pacbell.net> |
Michael C. Lott wrote:
>
>
> Help, again. I'm looking at drawing 17 for the fuel tank. (rv-4)
> In the center of the drawing of the fuel tank, at the bottom where it
> shows the spacing for the nut plate holes, there is a dashed line from
> right to left ending with a B at each end. What is this dashed line
> trying to show me? I'm missing the point, I think. If anyone can help
> me with this, thanks.
I believe that page 3-7 of your construction manual explains these
lines, at least that's what page it shows in my RV-4 manual.
Davi RV-4 wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Benedict <billb(at)europa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl cheek hinges |
>
>>After 185 hrs I noticed that the left cowl cheek hinge has broken and will
>>have to be replaced. This is the short MS20001 extruded hinge behind the
>>prop spinner.
>>Bill B. comments appreciated.
>
>Bill,
> A lot of builders are using nutplates as hinge breakage seems a common
>problem. I riveted and glued on a .063" plate to the bottom cowl that
>projects up into the upper cowl and used three, #8 truss head screws into
>nutplates. No problems after 340 hours. I also used #6, truss head screws
>to attach the top and bottom cowls to the fuse and this, too, seems to be
>working well. I did use the hinges to join the top and bottom cowl and for
>the two verticle surfaces of the bottom cowl.
>
>Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)navix.net
Bob and Ken and others,
The planes at Vans have not suffered too bad in this area. I have only been
at Vans for 4 1/2 years and I do not remember a problem here, but I am not
located at the site where the planes are maintained. Many people have had
problems around the spinner and Van recognizes that and provides the
extruded hinge which is more rugged than the AN257 hinge. A lot of builders
have bonded a metal plate to the lower cowl and use screws to hold the upper
cowl to the metal plate. In fact, I believe the RV-8 is fastened in this
manner. I personally had a problem with the rivets pulling through the
fiberglass and had to put a plate on the outside that the rivets go through,
kinda like a big washer under the rivet heads. That solved the problem of
rivets being pulled through the glass.
As far as using screws instead of the hinge pin along the cowl, I would
recommend against it. On all of the RVs there is a break in the hinge along
the top of the cowl. On the -4 it is the center where the hinge pins are
installed and on the -6s it is the passengers side, near the oil door
access. Usually this gap in the hinge is 3 to 4 inches and the cowl is not
supported in this area. When flying, the cowl has enough pressure as part
of the cooling program to actually try to explode the cowling. This
pressure tends to lift the cowling in the area where there is no hinge. The
gap is probably 0.100 inches (2.5mm). If you use screws or fasteners, the
cowl will take on a corrigated look as it bulges between the fasteners.
(Before anyone jumps me, Go fly your RV and raise yourself in the seat and
look where the cowl is unsupported. You have to raise yourself in the seat
to see it, as usually it is out of site.) If you use fasteners, the cowl
could probably be reinforced in this area by laying a 1/4" piece of rope on
the inside of the cowl and lay two layers of wet glass over it to form a
beam within the cowl. This would be just forward of the intersection
between the cowl and firewall.
I know a lot of people swear at the hinge pins, but they really do work
once they have about 10 hours of rattling around to loosen up. However, I
would probable use the plate and screws around the spinner area. Bill
Bill
RV-4-180 soon. N894RV with over 400 hours behind a O-320, Over 1000 RV
flying hours.
These opinions are mine and do not necessarily represent the opinions or
position of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gil Alexander <gila(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Marking Aluminum |
>
>> Is there any real evidence that a Sharpie line has ill effects on
>> Alclad, especially after priming?
>
>There is one ill effect that I have experienced, and that is that the
>mark will bleed through the primer and/or the finish paint. A sharpie
>line on primer does not wipe off easily w/lacquer thinner or acetone. And
>if you work at it TOO hard, you'll take off the primer.
Randall,
This is not a problem with the Dexter epoxy primer. I mark on mine
all of the time, and use acetone to remove it. Any epoxy primer sold as
"fluid resistant" should be able to stand up to acteone cleaning.
>
>I compromise by trying not to get carried away with the marking pen on
>primered parts in areas that will be finish painted later. That way
>there's less cleanup to do.
>
>I'm surprised no one has mentioned this yet. Am I the only one who's
>experienced this?
>
>Randall Henderson, RV-6
>randall(at)edt.com
....... Gil (sorry to mention the p*&^&^$% word) Alexander
RV6A, #20701 ... fiberglassing canopy and tail fairing
gila(at)flash.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernesto Sanchez" <es12043(at)utech.net> |
Where are you located at??
Ernesto Sanchez
E-Racer# 319
es12043(at)utech.net
----------
> From: cyberbury.net!Martinph(at)matronics.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: RV6
> Date: Monday, January 27, 1997 11:01 PM
>
>
>
> MA>HI all
> MA>just wanted to mention that I have an RV6 tail kit and a compleat set
of
> MA>RV dwg's for sale.horizontal stab is compleat less the trimming for
tip
> MA>caps. Id like to get about $800 for it Im building an 8 instead .
>
> MA> thanks
> MA> Jeff RV8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ronald Vandervort <rvanderv(at)linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron bracket template???? |
In the quickbuild and also the Frank Justice instructions there is talk
about a template to locate the hinge point of the aileron bracket. I'm
missing something for I
don't understand where it tells one how to make the template.
A thankyou to anyone who can shed some light on this.
Ron Vandervort, RV-6Q, rvanderv(at)linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us
Seattle area
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kevin lane <n3773(at)worldnet.att.net> |
A friends RV6 is wearing the tires on the inside and is not real stabile
when taxiing. He said when he jacked the plane up and supported the
fuselage he could get the gear legs to swivel a bit. Not having gotten that
far on my plane I couldn't offer him any real advice, although it sounded
like the retaining bolt holes had elongated. Can the toe in be adjusted?
This guy bought the RV totally built and this exchange reassured me that
while it's going to take a couple years of learning/building, I will know
how to fix my plane.(may have forgotten how to fly by then, but.... ;-)
Kevin RV6A N3773 rsvd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kevin lane <n3773(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | alternative strobes |
Does anyone have experience with Star Warning Systems remote power supply
strobes? These industrial-use strobes cost about $130 for two bulb/one
power supply/12' wire ea. and are available in 11 joules/2amps/1.0lbs, 15, &
23 joules/6amps/1.8lbs output, single flash, alternating, and quad flash.
They also have hi/lo power option. The unit can run one to four bulbs.
They are rugged enough to be mounted on dump truck beds and garbage trucks.
On their display unit the power supply circuit board had been dipped in a
black resin. It appeared very vibration proof. Their cables however did
not appear in the catalog to be shielded.
________________________________________________________________________________
On 01-25-97 rv-list(at)matronics.com wrote to degirolamo...
r >
r > You all heard the story of the guy who was in a serious car accident.
r > The
r > grizzly old night nurse said, did you know that fellow in ward D-12
r > has
r > SWAN tattooed on his penis? Swan? exclaimed the lovely young student
r > nurse, when I gave him his sponge bath this morning it said
r > SASKATOON,SASKATCHEWAN! ========>> :-)
r >
r > RANDALL, YOU DIDN'T !
r >
r > Just curious, I know that Van is expanding his product
r > line....but....Tattoos?
r >
r > Ken RV6 C-FKEH
r > First flight Sept. 8 1993
r > Editor, Western Canada RVator
r >
r > ---
... OFFLINE 1.40
--
|Fidonet: Marc Degirolamo 1:140/15
|Internet: Marc.Degirolamo@140-15.mx1.fidonet.org
| Standard disclaimer: The views of this user are strictly his/her own.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Stephen Jackson Soule <ssoule(at)vbimail.champlain.edu> |
Hello,
This is a line that indicates that the draftsman has drawn a
cross-section through the object and that you can find the cross-section
on another part of the drawing in a detail (smaller) drawing marked "B".
I am away from the plan, but I think detail "B" is at the top of the
drawing.
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Morristec(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Double flare |
In response to a couple of questions on double flares... First a double flare
is where the tube end is actually folded over inside on itself and flared.
The end of the tube is not exposed. The purpose is to increase the strength
of the flare mating surfaces and the joint in general. Since I'm a pnuematic
systems guy and not a structures type I don't know the exact particulars.
The answer to Bill B's comment is.. yes dthe double flare standard was
designed for the standard AN/MS style 37 degree flare fittings when using
aluminum alloy (3003, 5052) tube. In the Mil standards double flaring is
recommended for all flares for this tube size, but required for the higher
presures.
As I mentioned previously, double flaring is required to get the designed
pressure rating from the tube. I work with applications that typically
expose the tube to higher (800 to 1500 psi) pressures. Since all of our RV
applications except the brakes are just a few percent of the rated pressures
there is generally no problem with single flares. The brakes however can see
higher pressures, but keep in mind that it is for a short duration, and the
fatigue during the pressurized period is low, so you can get away with this.
Yes, I do agree that $500 to get a double flare tool is expensive, and if I
didn't have access to one would probable use single flares for our
applications. BTW many A&P's aren't aware that double flares should be used,
so that doesn't surprise me either. As Chet said though, it is in AC43-13.1A.
Now, if you want to take advantage of the experimental aspects try Swagelok
brand compression fittings available in aluminum, at you local industrial
tube supply house. Works great and NO flares or tooling. Cheaper, yet well
proven for high pressure, and vibration, but not Mil Std. These guys also
make the plastic fittings that can be used for the pitot /static system.
Dan Morris
Morristec(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Lighted Altimeter prices |
<< I was able to purchase a used, overhauled one from
Century Instrument fot $280. It's not everyday that one can safe a hund >>
Hi all:
The problem with buying from century, is that the warranty period starts on
the date of purchase, or it did (when they threw me in the river). I got a
bad one, that sat around till I finished my project, and no warranty service
when the thing didn't work. Seems I've seen warnings about these people
before...
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd <tmrv6(at)pop.erols.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl cheek hinges |
>
>After 185 hrs I noticed that the left cowl cheek hinge has broken and will
>have to be replaced. This is the short MS20001 extruded hinge behind the
>prop spinner.
>
Ken, I thought I might add something to the already good advice given on
this subject. I changed my broken hinges with a .032 plate, #8 screws and
platenuts. After the .032 cracked in less than 20 hours I replaced it with
.063. Seems to be holding up just fine now.
Todd N92TM RV-6 Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Beatty, Gary A." <beatty.gary(at)mayo.edu> |
| Subject: | Wear Cheese... or Die? |
This is one for the safety minded pilots out there. The following is an
article I thought might be fun to pass along especially after the Green
Bay Packers won the Super Bowl.
If ever there was a die-hard Green Bay Packers fan, it's Frank Emmert
Jr. Literally. By rights, he probably should be dead. Emmert is one of
two Superior men whose single-engine plane crashed near Stevens Point,
WI November 1995 when a build-up of ice overburdened the craft and
caused its engine to stall. Moments before impact, Emmert buried his
face in the foam-rubber "cheesehead" hat he'd recently (and proudly)
worn at the Packers-Browns game in Cleveland. At the very least, the
faux cheese cushioned the blow and saved him from severe facial
injuries. It may even have saved his life. He still feels flying's the
best and safest way to travel. From now on, though, making sure there's
a cheesehead on board will definitely be part of my preflight checklist.
Keep flying
Gary Beatty (die hard Green Bay fan)
beatty.gary(at)mayo.edu
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | OrndorffG(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: gear leg wobble |
Kevin,
No the wheels should not move like that I would check the bolts that hold
the gear on or even pull the gear to see if the gear legs have been over
sized drill trying the correct something like a more toe in . Once the gear
have been drilled on its hard to correct any problem. if the toe in is real
bad or the wobble is real bad your friend may want to just get another set of
gear legas a place the ones that are on the plane now.
Takeing care to get the gear straight so not to have any problems in the
future....Good luck George Orndorff
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass education needed |
If anybody is interested, I still have all the construction manuals from
a >>
Hobby,
I've acquired a set of Vari-eze plans and on another note I wonder if I could
borrow the 9 large sheets or possibly get you to copy them for me.
Good luck with your kit and by the way, where in Texas? I was born and
raised around the Fort Stockton, Monahans area.
Thanks for the help,
Don Riggs
N818WW RV-4
" Valerie's Nightmare"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | catbird(at)taylortel.com (TTC Carroll A. Bird) |
Michael C. Lott wrote:
>
>
> Help, again. I'm looking at drawing 17 for the fuel tank. (rv-4)
> That is showing you the "cut" B-B that is right below. This
shows the back baffle amd the rib spacing.
Carroll Bird, Buffalo Gap TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | teetime(at)flinthills.com |
This may sound like a stupid question but "I gots to know". On the RV4, it
tells you to crimp the fuel tube in the fuel tank. Why?
Also, for those that have used a PVC pipe or something simular to
run inside of the wing for nav wires, have you noticed any problem with
cracking of the ribs after some length of time due to the movement of the
wing in flight?
Tim Sweemer
RV4 Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "garrett v. smith" <blueskyman(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Lycoming-electronic igntion/fuel injection |
Hi All:
In the quest for a more efficient Lycoming, is anyone aware of an electronic
ignition for the Lyc. I have heard of a certified ignition system, however, I
am
curious if someone has had any luck with an un-certified system for
the homebuilt crowd. Any info is appreciated.
Regarding fuel injection, any comments on how the AirFlow Performance
FI system compares to the factory Lyc FI, price, performance, etc.
Thanks,
Garrett Smith
Calgary,Canada
blueskyman(at)msn.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dr John Cocker <jcocker(at)medhumor.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Lighted Altimeter prices |
My experience with Century is all positive.
They were a great help in planning, gave me a good discount, and six months
later when I changed my mind about an item, I returned it for a full
refund, no questions asked.
John Cocker.
C-GDOC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AveryTools(at)aol.com |
For everyone's information, Avery Tools current toll free order line is
1-800-652-8379; their technical / question line is 1-817-439-8400; & their
FAX is 817-439-8402. Some customers have tried to fax us orders using a fax
card system in their computer, and sometimes these never make it to us for
some reason. It might be a good idea to call and verify that we did receive
your fax (if you are using a fax card in your computer). (For everyones
info: Klaus Roth re-sent his order a third time and we received it this time
-- thanks for everyones help & input).
Judy
Avery
averytools(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.acker" <r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron bracket template???? |
>
>In the quickbuild and also the Frank Justice instructions there is talk
>about a template to locate the hinge point of the aileron bracket. I'm
>missing something...
Ron,
Do you mean the wing template, as drawn on the shipping crate and the shape
of the airfoil? You cut out the *inside* of the airfoil shape, cut it in
half and hinge it on one end, and place it over the wing.
This supposedly lines the aileron up with the wing, locating the aileron
brackets and hinges. In practice, the only real use I had for it was to
hold the aileron while I figured out a way to properly line things up.
Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q project:
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rob_acker
(last update 12/23/96 - Oshkosh '96 RV pictures)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cowl cheek hinges |
<< (Snip) When flying, the cowl has enough pressure as part of the cooling
program to actually try to explode the cowling. This pressure tends to lift
the cowling in the area where there is no hinge. The gap is probably 0.100
inches (2.5mm). If you use screws or fasteners, the cowl will take on a
corrigated look as it bulges between the fasteners. (Before anyone jumps
me, Go fly your RV and raise yourself in the seat and look where the cowl is
unsupported. You have to raise yourself in the seat to see it, as usually
it is out of site.)
(Snip)
Bill
RV-4-180 soon. N894RV with over 400 hours behind a O-320, Over 1000 RV
flying hours.
These opinions are mine and do not necessarily represent the opinions or
position of my employer.
>>
Hi All,
On the Lycoming, I built a box over each side of the cylinders between the
crankcase and the cylinder heads. The top, sides, and bottom of the airbox
extended forward to seal around the cowl air inlet opening. There is no
inlet air pressure against the upper cowl by doing it this way. And there is
less cooling drag.
The Formula 1 aircraft at Reno that I saw with the cowls off had a similar
arrangement, only more extreme.
The LOM engine comes from the factory with a similar airbox already installed
for cylinder cooling. A 1959 design.
Jim Ayers
LOM M332A Ivoprop RV-3 N47RV Maroon Marauder
LesDrag(at)aol.com
Thousand Oaks, Ca. USA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron bracket template???? |
> In the quickbuild and also the Frank Justice instructions there is talk
> about a template to locate the hinge point of the aileron bracket. I'm
> missing something for I
> don't understand where it tells one how to make the template.
In the non-QB kits, one of the crates has an airfoil template drawn on
the outside. I don't know about the QBs.
I picked up my parts myself (no crating) so I didn't receive this
template. Van's substituted a piece of butcher paper with two airfoil
templates drawn on it. Problem is, they were drawn with a thick felt
pen, and the two didn't even match up to each other very well, so I
didn't have much confidence in them. I instead made my own by laying
out a wing rib and aileron rib on the workbench, drawing a line
through the tooling holes, and laying tracing paper over it and
tracing the line. (I suppose Q-builders don't have any wing ribs
handy, but you could probably accomplish much the same thing by laying
a piece of wood or cardboard against the end of the wing and tracing
that.)
>From this I made a "jig" to locate the aileron hinge point. The jig
was just a piece of wood about 2' long, contoured on one side to match
the airfoil. At the proper location I drilled a 3/16" hole, 5/16"
from the edge (as specified on dwg 16, "End View -- Aileron & Mount").
Then I just held the jig up to the wing and stuck a bolt through the
hole, and through the bearing in the hinge bracket, to locate the
bracket.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RFierb6707(at)aol.com |
I'm about to order the RV6 tail kit and after studying the preview plans have
a few questions about the tail/wing jig. 1. What sort of lumber is acceptable
, is pressure treated 4x4 ok? How far is the crosspiece from the floor? Are
the vertical posts attatched to the ceiling and the floor? The drawing of the
jig in the plans is a little sketchy, any help is appreciated. How about
commercially available metal jigs, are they rented or bought and who are they
available from? 2. What are the "Justice Directions/Plans and how can i get
them. Thanks
Rob
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cowl cheek hinges |
<< (Snip) When flying, the cowl has enough pressure as part of the cooling
program to actually try to explode the cowling. This pressure tends to lift
the cowling in the area where there is no hinge. The gap is probably 0.100
inches (2.5mm). If you use screws or fasteners, the cowl will take on a
corrigated look as it bulges between the fasteners. (Before anyone jumps
me, Go fly your RV and raise yourself in the seat and look where the cowl is
unsupported. You have to raise yourself in the seat to see it, as usually
it is out of site.)
(Snip)
Bill
RV-4-180 soon. N894RV with over 400 hours behind a O-320, Over 1000 RV
flying hours.
These opinions are mine and do not necessarily represent the opinions or
position of my employer.
>>
Hi All,
On the Lycoming, I built a box over each side of the cylinders between the
crankcase and the cylinder heads. The top, sides, and bottom of the airbox
extended forward to seal around the cowl air inlet opening. There is no
inlet air pressure against the upper cowl by doing it this way. And there is
less cooling drag.
The Formula 1 aircraft at Reno that I saw with the cowls off had a similar
arrangement, only more extreme.
The LOM engine comes from the factory with a similar airbox already installed
for cylinder cooling. A 1959 design.
Jim Ayers
LOM M332A Ivoprop RV-3 N47RV Maroon Marauder
LesDrag(at)aol.com
Thousand Oaks, Ca. USA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gil(at)bala.HAC.COM (Gil Alexander) |
| Subject: | Anyone need a TERRA Comm? |
Guys,
As part of a possible radio package deal that I would need to split
up, I might have a Terra TX760D Comm. radio available.
The radio would have April 95 manufacture date, be unused,
uninstalled, with all manuals, installation tray, new in original box, and
with the original Terra warranty of 3 years that starts from the date of
the first flight of your homebuilt - and no dealer installation/sign-off
needed. It would come straight off a Terra dealer's shelf.
This is the newer Terra Digital version with the orange gas
discharge frequency display, NOT the older push-button type.
I would need $950 (I'll pay US shipping) for the TX760D to make the
overall package deal worthwhile to me, so is anyone out there interested??
Present selling price in T-A-P seems to be about $1140 plus shipping.
As a special bonus for our overseas RV-listers, hand delivery to
the United Kingdom would be possible in June 97 ....:^)
... thanks ... Gil Alexander
PS ... reason for this deal ... I already have two TX760Ds Comms, and just
got recently persuaded to plan a Nav. (as well as a GPS) in my panel.
Terra package prices are always better, so this deal would be suitable for
a builder that only wants a Comm. radio, especially one that fits in a
small space (RV4 builders?)
... reply to either this e-mail address or home < gila(at)flash.net >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Patrick E. Kelley" <patk(at)mail.ic.net> |
| Subject: | Re: crimped tube |
flinthills.com!teetime(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
>
> This may sound like a stupid question but "I gots to know". On the RV4, it
> tells you to crimp the fuel tube in the fuel tank. Why?
>
> Tim Sweemer
> RV4 Wings
I think you are referring to the practice of crimping the end and sawing
notches near the end to achieve a sort of 'fuel screen'. Van's now
sells feed tubes with screen strainers soldered on; this is a superior
method. You could even do this yourself, or attach removable strainers
(like the ones used in Harley fuel tanks); I have heard several methods
mentioned by builders. Myself, I bought Van's version.
PatK - RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MiDiBu <midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Rivet comments, thanks |
I'm going to snip some good replies to get to my point:
>>Now, if you would, please tell me how to drive my
>>Avery rivet gun. I practiced on the Orndorff control surface project with
>>my first 3/32" rivets. Not a pretty sight. Out of 21 rivets, 3 were
>>acceptable.
Bob Skinner responded:
> Mike,
> If you're practicing driving rivets in a flexable
>strip of aluminum, it's alot harder to rivet.
I was. And to tell the truth, I tried a lot of different techniques in that
session, because I have never in my life driven a rivet. I've bought a lot
of books, and to me, I have not seen one that describes how to do it. I've
spent a lot of time the last six months preparing the workshop, buying
tools, and preparing the tail kit components for "production". I was
reminded about the old question that one asks in New York City, "How do you
get to Carnegie Hall?". Response, "Practice, practice, practice!".
>The best idea---get together
>with someone who is proficient and learn from him (or her).
I wish it was that easy. I'm the type of person who will never have a
technical support person come by at work unless I've exhausted all other
options. I used to work in technical support. Still, though, I did go
ahead and get in touch with the local EAA chapter (#190). Nice vibes.
Building RV's is not work (in the sense of work being work). Thanks for the
prod.
>Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)navix.net
>
Thanks, Bob.
> From: Frank van der Hulst <pec.co.nz!frankv(at)matronics.com>
>Don't worry! I had the same kind of ratio at my first sheet-metal class. Now
>I've done a few hundred rivets on the real thing, I hardly ever need to
>drill one out.
>Also, when *she* gets blamed for *your* poor rivetting, well,... I hope your
>couch is comfortable. :-)
>HTH,
>Frank.
Thanks, also, Frank. You've got to understand, though, that *I* never use
smileys. And *my* couch is terribly uncomfortable. OK, just this time, :-)
>From: RV4Brown(at)aol.com
>Mike
> I picked up your thread regarding riveting. A couple of basics. For
>3/32" rivets, try setting the air pressure at 55 to 60 psig. The rivet gun
>should be able to Purr. That is start very slow and increase with trigger
>pressure. I had to send my Avery gun (2x model) back for rework. The gun I
>had only two modes. On or Off. What a challenge.
I've got a 3X and I can't blame the gun. It does feather nicely, and I
tried it with many different settings. I am, however, using a flush rivet
set with a rubber grommet guard (Avery part). It seems to me that the
retaining spring is too flimsy. A couple of times it slipped. I've ordered
the flush swivel set with a much nicer looking spring.
Thanks again to all. I'll try to summarize my experiences when I get past
this bump in the road.
Mike Weller RV-8 (under construction)
midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com (preferred) or mike.weller(at)msfc.nasa.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
Hi Rob,
>
>I'm about to order the RV6 tail kit and after studying the preview plans have
>a few questions about the tail/wing jig. 1. What sort of lumber is acceptable
>, is pressure treated 4x4 ok?
You want something stable. ie it won't warp/twist/move whilst you're
building. Depending on your construction speed, that could be a week or a
month (or more). I used a beam made from 2 Douglas fir 4x2 laminated together.
>How far is the crosspiece from the floor?
I set mine about waist height; I think now a bit lower would have been
better. You're going to need to rivet stuff that'll be 18" or so above the
crossbeam, as well as stuff at the crossbeam height. I wound up standing on
a chair to do the top rivets.
>Are
>the vertical posts attatched to the ceiling and the floor?
Mine are attached to the floor, and at the top to shelves securely screwed
to the walls. Again, how you attach isn't important (IMHO the posts aren't
really needed); the important thing is that they're stable and won't move.
>The drawing of the
>jig in the plans is a little sketchy, any help is appreciated.
Have a look at my RV page <http://www.pec.co.nz/~frankv/homebilt.htm>. It
has links to several other RV pages (including John Hovan's RV Heaven). Also
there are a couple of photos, my builder's log, and my "Bunny's Guide to RV
Building".
>How about
>commercially available metal jigs, are they rented or bought and who are they
>available from?
Sorry, can't help here.
>2. What are the "Justice Directions/Plans and how can i get them.
The Frank Justice manual additions are found on John Hovan's home page.
Regretfully, they're light on the early empennage stuff, and they mainly
deal with the old undrilled kit. Still well worth having though.
Frank.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
frankv(at)pec.co.nz | "Knowledge=Power=Energy=Matter=Mass;
Frank van der Hulst | A good bookshop is just a genteel
Software Engineer | Black Hole that knows how to read".
PEC(NZ) Ltd (Cardax), Marton | Terry Pratchett, "Guards! Guards!"
http://www.pec.co.nz/~frankv/ |
--------------------------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GHLX34A(at)prodigy.com (MR GEORGE T KILISHEK) |
I received a phone call from Van's today to tell me that my wing kit
had been shipped (the good news), AND to say that the F-804-C L& R
fuselage bulkheads had been fluted incorrectly, so don't use them.
Replacements to arrive within 2 weeks.
I don't know how widespread this problem is, whether it affects other
kits besides mine, whether it's a new problem or a newly discovered
problem, but wanted to alert builders (hopefully not to unnecessarily
alarm anyone). I'm pretty sure that if it affects other kits, Vans
will get the word out ASAP.
High marks to the folks at Vans for discovering the error and moving
rapidly to communicate.
George Kilishek
#80006-Ailerons, flaps & ribs done.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GHLX34A(at)prodigy.com (MR GEORGE T KILISHEK) |
Rob:
1. What sort of lumber is acceptable
, is pressure treated 4x4 ok?
-------------------------Pressure treated 4X4 is very likely to warp
(most likely in a spiral fashion). Try to find very dry 4 x 4 or
build up from dry 2 x 4 or fabricate from metal (I haven't tried
that, but would be tempted to start with 2x2 steel angle of the sort
used to hang garage door openers.
2. How far is the crosspiece from the floor?
------------------------------------ TLAR (That looks about right)
will do. Make it a height that puts the stabilizer rear spar at a
height where you can work on it without painful bending and so the
center of the front spar is at about eye level. The top of my
crosspiece is 35" from the floor and worked fine.
3. Are the vertical posts attatched to the ceiling and the floor?
----------------------------------Yes, they should be attached at
both top and bottom. How to do it depends very much on the
architecture of your workspace. I used 2'x2" steel utility angle at
the top and multiple "L" brackets on the bottom secured to the
concrete floor with masonry anchors. Make sure these posts are rigid
and plumb.
4. What are the "Justice Directions/Plans and how can i get them.
----------------------------------------Frank Justice wrote a manual
for assembly of the RV-6 which is very comprehensive and contains
necessary and highly useful "how-tos" that you won't find in Van's
manual. You need it, and it's free. On the World Wide Web, go to
John Hovan's Web Page at: http://atlantis.austin.apple.com/people.
pages/jhovan/home.html. Scroll down to "Frank Justice Manual
Addition," and print out everything. It will run to about 120 pages.
Good luck
George Kilishek
#80006 Wings.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MiDiBu <midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet comments, thanks |
>Just a tip from another 8 builder: give that flush set a second try. If
>you are finding that the spring is weak, get rid of the "quick release"
>type spring and get a normal beehive spring. They work better. The swivel
>sets are easy to get cock-eyed and they will dent if that happens. I have
>finished the entire tail and ailerons and flaps of my eight and have one
>dent. I just used the avery non-swivel set and it helps to have one fewer
>degree of freedom to swivel around. I'm just one data point though...
>
>
And a very good data point, at that, sir. I'd like to respond to the list.
You see, as far as I can tell, the beehive that Avery sold me will not fit
the flush rivet set! It even says so in the catalog. All I can use is the
flimsy quick set. It seems to me that it would be wonderful to have a full
beehive on the set, but it just doesn't look like it was made to fit the
flush set because of the extra flang. I'm scratching my head again, because
your advice seems so good. Avery even sells a non-guarded flush rivel set
that appears to be usable with the beehive for "experienced" builders.
Thanks again,
Mike Weller RV-8 (under construction)
midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com (preferred) or mike.weller(at)msfc.nasa.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl cheek hinges |
Ken,
You can wait until it breaks 2 or 3 more times or replace the hinge with a
steel backing plate and three camlocs now. My left hinge (never have had
trouble with the right side) broke at least 3 times before I got tired of
replacing the hinges.
Had no trouble after using the backing plate and camlocs.
>
>After 185 hrs I noticed that the left cowl cheek hinge has broken and will
>have to be replaced. This is the short MS20001 extruded hinge behind the
>prop spinner.
>
>Has anyone tried strengthening this area and using cam-lock fasteners. I
>would be interested in a good alternative. This is a lot of stress here
>and strength is important.
>
>Bill B. comments appreciated.
>
>
>Ken ve7fp(at)jetstream.net
>Beautiful British Columbia
>
>
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
First flight August 1990
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ammeterj(at)seanet.com (John Ammeter) |
>
>I'm about to order the RV6 tail kit and after studying the preview plans have
>a few questions about the tail/wing jig. 1. What sort of lumber is acceptable
>, is pressure treated 4x4 ok?
Sure, why not. Actually, any straight material is good enough. I used 4 x
4's for the uprights and a very straight 4 x 4 for the horizontal.
> How far is the crosspiece from the floor?
Whatever is comfortable for you. Mine was about waist height.
>Are the vertical posts attatched to the ceiling and the floor?
Well, it does help to attach them to the ceiling. The floor attachment
really isn't optional.
> The drawing of the
>jig in the plans is a little sketchy, any help is appreciated. How about
>commercially available metal jigs, are they rented or bought and who are they
>available from?
Save your money for more and better instruments. The simplest jig will
build a perfect RV. No need to spend hundreds of dinar for steel jigs or
whatever. Just be sure to get wood that is kiln dried and relatively knot free.
2. What are the "Justice Directions/Plans and how can i get
>them. Thanks
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Rob
>
>
>
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
3233 NE 95th St
Seattle WA, 98115 USA
RV-6 N16JA
First flight August 1990
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | 0320H2AD installation Questions |
Anybody got plans or templates made for the cooling baffels for the 0320H2AD
and an RV6?
Anybody care to share how they mounted their alternator on a 0320H2AD RV6?
My used 0320H2AD out of a C172 had no fuel pump. It now has one boted to it.
What inside (ie: crankshaft mounted driver?? Might not be ON???) under that
should I be aware of?
Care to talk to me direct.
Contact David McManmon McManD(at)aol.com Thanks
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Osgood <rick(at)ccc.henn.tec.mn.us> |
Has anyone else discovered and of the articles written by a Mr. Keith
Peshak??? According to him and backed up by government articles he has
posted, the federal government has authorized a company to develop
jamming equipment to render GPS unusable in the USA. Development and
testing of this jamming system is taking place in Saint Louis or Kansas
City.
Please, if this is true we must all contact EAA, AOPA and anyone else
that can raise a voice against this....
To read for yourself connect to www.rst-engr.com/peshak.html
--
Rick Osgood
Hennipen Technical College
Eden Prairie, MN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet comments, thanks |
>>The best idea---get together
>>with someone who is proficient and learn from him (or her).
>
>I wish it was that easy. I'm the type of person who will never have a
>technical support person come by at work unless I've exhausted all other
>options.
The fact that you're asking here suggests that you're already running out of
options. Do what Bob suggested... it'll save you heaps of time.
(Surprisingly, my experience has been that homebuilders are actually similar
to RV-listers in friendliness, helpfulness, etc).
Another thought I had, to add to the list of tips: Get a full-swivel
regulator for your rivet gun. The swiveller stops the air hose from pulling
your gun off-line; well worth the extra few dollars. The regulator regulates
the airflow to the gun, and makes it convenient to adjust how hard it hits.
>> I picked up your thread regarding riveting. A couple of basics. For
>>3/32" rivets, try setting the air pressure at 55 to 60 psig. The rivet gun
>>should be able to Purr. That is start very slow and increase with trigger
>>pressure. I had to send my Avery gun (2x model) back for rework. The gun I
>>had only two modes. On or Off. What a challenge.
Hmmmm.... I'm starting to wonder about my Avery 3X gun now... it doesn't
seem to have anything much between on and off. Maybe it needs fixing?
>I've got a 3X and I can't blame the gun. It does feather nicely, and I
>tried it with many different settings. I am, however, using a flush rivet
>set with a rubber grommet guard (Avery part). It seems to me that the
>retaining spring is too flimsy. A couple of times it slipped. I've ordered
>the flush swivel set with a much nicer looking spring.
The retaining spring doesn't do much except stop the rivet snap from flying
out of the gun if there's no rivet in front of it. It won't affect your
rivetting at all.
Frank.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
frankv(at)pec.co.nz | "Knowledge=Power=Energy=Matter=Mass;
Frank van der Hulst | A good bookshop is just a genteel
Software Engineer | Black Hole that knows how to read".
PEC(NZ) Ltd (Cardax), Marton | Terry Pratchett, "Guards! Guards!"
http://www.pec.co.nz/~frankv/ |
--------------------------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "mark jennings" <markjenn(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | RV-6/RV-8 Quickbuild option |
I have a question about the RV-6 Quickbuild option. Are the tail kits the
same for quickbuild and non-quickbuild? The reason I ask is that I was
considering building a tail kit to "test the waters." But if I did so and
then ordered quickbuild, would I get another partially-built tail in the
quickbuild?
I'm actually more interested in an RV-8, but I'm supposing the quickbuild
options would be similar for the -6 and -8 with respect to what is prebuilt
and what is left as an exercise to the builder. So I could get started on the
-8 tail now, and decide later to continue with standard kits or wait for
quickbuilds.
Also, any rumors when an RV-8 quickbuild might appear?. I've heard "at least
1998" but nothing more specific.
Finally a quick plug for this list - if I build an RV, the generous and
generally reasonable responses posted here will be a big reason why. You
folks are great.
- Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron bracket template???? |
> In the quickbuild and also the Frank Justice instructions there is talk
> about a template to locate the hinge point of the aileron bracket. I'm
> missing something for I
> don't understand where it tells one how to make the template.
Ron,
I understood this to mean the plywood wing template that fits over
the wing. On my quickbuild the template was drawn on the floor of
the crate. The leading and trailing edge points were marked on the
template, so from there one could construct the chord line, measure
over and mark the hinge line parallel to the chord line, and position
the hinge. At least, that's what I did.
Tim
---------------------
Tim Lewis
RV-6AQ #60023
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net
-----------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)navix.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet comments, thanks |
>>type spring and get a normal beehive spring. They work better. The swivel
>>sets are easy to get cock-eyed and they will dent if that happens. I have
>>I just used the avery non-swivel set and it helps to have one fewer
>>degree of freedom to swivel around. I'm just one data point though...
>>snip<<
>You see, as far as I can tell, the beehive that Avery sold me will not fit
>the flush rivet set! It even says so in the catalog. All I can use is the
>flimsy quick set. It seems to me that it would be wonderful to have a full
>beehive on the set, but it just doesn't look like it was made to fit the
<>
>Mike Weller RV-8 (under construction) midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com (preferred)
Could be my mistake, but I don't feel the type of spring is too important.
It just keeps the set from falling out. I've riveted without any spring on
in close quarters. Of course, I always forget there's no spring and the set
falls out after I'm done.
There were some interesting comments on solid vs. swivel sets. I put a
smiley on the bottom (thank goodness) of the outboard L.E. on one wing. I
was using a cardboard box with airfoil shapes cut into them to hold the L.E.
No time to build a proper holding fixture, right. Well, it was 100 degrees,
I was tired, I was trying to hold the box, L.E., etc. and rivet and----
Important lesson learned. Take time to make sure you've given yourself
every chance of success, IOW make a jig, etc.
After the smiley, I ordered the Avery swivel set and finished most of the
airplane with it. When I started my second RV, I started using the straight
set a little more. It might be my imagination, but it seems like I get a
little better surface with the smaller head diameter of the straight
mushroom set. Could it be that more energy is being transmitted to the
rivet and less to the surrounding surface? I still use the swivel when my
wife is running the gun. I still think it's easier to get a smiley with a
straight set. With either set, flush riveting is sure a lot more fun than
the round head riveting we're doing on the Glastar. Of course, we're
fiberglassing on the Glastar now, so even round head riveting looks pretty
good to me.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)navix.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl cheek hinges |
>As far as using screws instead of the hinge pin along the cowl, I would
>recommend against it. On all of the RVs there is a break in the hinge along
>the top of the cowl. On the -4 it is the center where the hinge pins are
>installed and on the -6s it is the passengers side, near the oil door
>access. Usually this gap in the hinge is 3 to 4 inches and the cowl is not
>supported in this area. When flying, the cowl has enough pressure as part
>of the cooling program to actually try to explode the cowling. This
>pressure tends to lift the cowling in the area where there is no hinge. The
>gap is probably 0.100 inches (2.5mm). If you use screws or fasteners, the
>cowl will take on a corrigated look as it bulges between the fasteners.
>(Before anyone jumps me, Go fly your RV and raise yourself in the seat and
>look where the cowl is unsupported. You have to raise yourself in the seat
>to see it, as usually it is out of site.) If you use fasteners, the cowl
>could probably be reinforced in this area by laying a 1/4" piece of rope on
>the inside of the cowl and lay two layers of wet glass over it to form a
>beam within the cowl. This would be just forward of the intersection
>between the cowl and firewall.
Fellow RVers,
Bill's comment about bulging between screws is probably right on the
money. Before I completed our Glasair, I rode in one. The top cowl was
attached with machine screws and the bulges in-between the screws was way
more than .100". You could just about see engine. On my six cowl, I used
some 1/4" foam about an inch wide to make hat sections and laid up two
layers of epoxied glass. I placed one stiffener right behind the baffles
and the other, four inches or so ahead of the rear of the top cowl. I
extended the glass all of the way aft, making this area a little thicker to
better stand machine countersinking. I think just one rib would have been
OK. I'm using 7, #6 flush screws with flush washers and there is no
bulging between screws. I think I have a pretty good fit on my baffles, so
escaping air shouldn't be pressurizing the engine compartment. Actually,
with such a large air exit at the bottom cowl, it doesn't seem possible that
it could pressurize the cowl. I wonder if the bulging is caused more by
aerodynamic lift on the top cowl? By the way, the fiberglass hat section
really makes the cowl rigid, making it a lot easier to line up to put on and
easier to remove---less floppy.
IMO, there are several advantages to the machine screws. No hinge loops
to break, no stuck fingers putting in or removing pins, no hinge attach
rivets working loose in the fiberglass, no hinges to ever have to replace,
no smoking or fretting along the top surface due to the smaller diameter
hinge pin used to make the corner and no need to figure out how to secure
pins. For me, it is easier to remove the screws than mess with pins.
Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)naix.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ab6a(at)juno.com (ALLAN E POMEROY) |
Hi Rob,
For my jig, I used premium White Fir (Hem Fir, kiln dried grade
stamp) 2x4's nailed and glued together back to back. I think the same
material in 4x4 would also work well. If you go to any lumber yard that
sells good quality lumber and ask for Burrel quality Hem Fir, you should
be OK. I would recommend against using pressure treated 4x4. I don't know
about other parts of the country, but in the Northeast, PT 4x4 will be
from Southern Yellow Pine. The PT process uses a liquid which means it
will have to dry out to use for a jig. As it dries, there's a good
chance of it twisting, which of course you don't want.
My jig is attached to the floor and the ceiling. I have heard of
a "free standing" jig, but I don't know how stable it would be. My cross
piece is about 29" off the floor, but I'm kind of a short guy. My
personal opinion is that metal jigs aren't needed. If you use quality
lumber, you should be OK. Hope this helps.
Allan Pomeroy Central NY
AB6A(at)juno.com
HS Skeleton
writes:
>
>I'm about to order the RV6 tail kit and after studying the preview
>plans have
>a few questions about the tail/wing jig. 1. What sort of lumber is
>acceptable
>, is pressure treated 4x4 ok? How far is the crosspiece from the
>floor? Are
>the vertical posts attatched to the ceiling and the floor? The drawing
>of the
>jig in the plans is a little sketchy, any help is appreciated. How
>about
>commercially available metal jigs, are they rented or bought and who
>are they
>available from? 2. What are the "Justice Directions/Plans and how can
>i get
>them. Thanks
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Rob
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Martinph(at)cyberbury.net |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet comments, thanks |
RV>Mike Weller RV-8 (under construction)
RV>midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com (preferred) or mike.weller(at)msfc.nasa.gov
mike
I havn't used the spring on my flush set since I started this project
and I do not have any dents from the flush set . I think that the spring
is just to keep the set in the end of the gun so it does keep falling
out .use slightly more pressure on the head of the rivet than on the
tail with the bucking bar . I hold the rivet between the gun tip and the
bucking bar and then slide the whole thing over to seat the head of the
rivet against the part .then drive pull the trigger to form the shop
head . also you must keep the tip flat on the surface while forming the
shop head or it " will "dent the part .
good luck .
Jeff RV8
working on L/H elivator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chester razer <crazer(at)egyptian.net> |
Is anyone out there flying behind RMI's encoder. Since I'm building a
VFR aircraft I've given serious thought to using the encoder in place of
the alt,vsi,and a/s. I guess I'm really interested to know if anyone
had problems jumping from needles to numbers.
Also, by the time you add up the cost of new instruments including an
encoder the RMI unit is about the same cost.
--
Chet Razer
crazer(at)egyptian.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ronald Vandervort <rvanderv(at)linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron bracket template???? |
Thanks to Rob, Randall and Tim on the response to my query on the
"Aileron bracket template".
Yes, it is the wing template that can also be used for locating the
aileron brackets. I find my problem is that I picked up my kit uncrated
at the factory. Therefore I did not receive a template, as they are
imprinted on the crate.
My solution; use the one leaning next to the wall by the RV-6A (which is
about to be hatched) in my hangar.
Thanks again,
Ron Vandervort,RV-6Q, rvanderv(at)linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us
Seattle area
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6/RV-8 Quickbuild option |
At 03:28 29/01/97 UT, you wrote:
>
>I have a question about the RV-6 Quickbuild option. Are the tail kits the
>same for quickbuild and non-quickbuild?
Yes. Well, the finished ones are, anyway.
>The reason I ask is that I was
>considering building a tail kit to "test the waters." But if I did so and
>then ordered quickbuild, would I get another partially-built tail in the
>quickbuild?
No. Vans gives a $2000 reduction in the QB price if you build your own
empennage... the RV-6 emp. kit costs $1100, so you save about $900 by doing
that. In addition, as you say, you get to practice building on small, cheap
parts.
If I was building a QB, I'd go this way.
Frank.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
frankv(at)pec.co.nz | "Knowledge=Power=Energy=Matter=Mass;
Frank van der Hulst | A good bookshop is just a genteel
Software Engineer | Black Hole that knows how to read".
PEC(NZ) Ltd (Cardax), Marton | Terry Pratchett, "Guards! Guards!"
http://www.pec.co.nz/~frankv/ |
--------------------------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott) |
I'm going to make it to sun-n-fun this year and was planning to look for
an engine down there. Does anyone know if this would be a good place to
check on used engine deals? I am going to be there when they open the
gates, just in case. If anyone has any ideas on this, let me know.
thanks..
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Walsh <jwalsh(at)ftp.com> |
| Subject: | wing spar/fuselage fit?? |
If anyone has recieved an RV4 wing kit and has verified that their fuselage=
bulkhead parts fit,
would you drop me a quick note to let me know? I'm talking about the F-404=
A,F404C and F404D parts which mate up with the wing spars.
None of these parts fit my spars and I have just received a new set of spar=
s/bulkheads from Phlogiston and this kit doesn't fit together either. Jus=
t to add insult to injury, the present spar set was damaged during shipment=
and the Roadway guy told my wife that the damage to the crate was "normal"=
and nothing to worry about. =20
Not too happy in N.H.
John
jwalsh(at)ftp.com
________________________________________________________________________________
<< Is anyone out there flying behind RMI's encoder. Since I'm building a
VFR aircraft I've given serious thought to using the encoder in place of
the alt,vsi,and a/s. I guess I'm really interested to know if anyone
had problems jumping from needles to numbers.
Also, by the time you add up the cost of new instruments including an
encoder the RMI unit is about the same cost.
--
Chet Razer
crazer(at)egyptian.net
>>
Hi All,
I have a RMI MicroEncoder in my RV-3. I replaced the vertical speed
indicator with the RMI unit. On the RMI unit, the bar graph with the
vertical speed number made the transition painless for me. An altitude
number, and an airspeed number were not a problem for me.
With the posibility of lossing an alternator, or having the battery die, I
believe RMI recommends having a mechanical airspeed indicator and altimeter
installed with their unit.
Jim Ayers
LOM M332A Ivoprop RV-3 N47RV Maroon Marauder
LesDrag(at)aol.com
http://member.aol.com/lesdrag/rv3.htm
http:/member.aol.com/lesdrag/ivoprop.htm
Thousand Oaks, Ca. USA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | catbird(at)taylortel.com (TTC Carroll A. Bird) |
chester razer wrote:
>
>
> Is anyone out there flying behind RMI's encoder. Since I'm building a
> VFR aircraft I've given serious thought to using the encoder in place of
> the alt,vsi,and a/s.
I just got through building the RMI encoder. I have not flew
with it yet, however it is sitting over here behind me happily working
with a 12V battery & charger.
This is my first electronic device to build and I just followed
the instructions and it started working on the first try, and been
working ever since.
As to flying with it I don't think I will have any trouble. It
is very straight forward. I have a lot of hours in a Citabria and used a
normal airspeed and altimeter, this instrument looks to me like it will
probably be easier to use. All this is in my HO.
Carroll
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Berndt <kberndt(at)badlands.nodak.edu> |
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>From: Ken Berndt <kberndt(at)badlands.nodak.edu>
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Future of GPS
>
>>
>>Has anyone else discovered and of the articles written by a Mr. Keith
>>Peshak??? According to him and backed up by government articles he has
>>posted, the federal government has authorized a company to develop
>>jamming equipment to render GPS unusable in the USA. Development and
>>testing of this jamming system is taking place in Saint Louis or Kansas
>>City.
>>
>>Please, if this is true we must all contact EAA, AOPA and anyone else
>>that can raise a voice against this....
>>
>>To read for yourself connect to www.rst-engr.com/peshak.html
>>
>>
>>--
>>Rick Osgood
>>Hennipen Technical College
>>Eden Prairie, MN
>>
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
Michael C. Lott wrote:
>
>
> I'm going to make it to sun-n-fun this year and was planning to look for
> an engine down there. Does anyone know if this would be a good place to
> check on used engine deals? I am going to be there when they open the
> gates, just in case. If anyone has any ideas on this, let me know.
> thanks..
michael
I have been looking for an engine at SUN-N-FUN for the last two years.
I find most of the lycomings way over priced. I think most of the
vendors put a big price-tag on the motors, then sit back and wait for
someone to come along with a checkbook.
However if you should find some good motors let me know. I purchased
one already, but it was bad so I got my money back ( but not before
I lost 400$ in round trip shipping Texas-Florida-Texas ).
Finding an engine somewhere here in the southeast, so I can go and
look at it has not been successful as of yet.
Craig Hiers
Tallahassee, FL.
RV-4 N143CH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Walsh <jwalsh(at)ftp.com> |
| Subject: | resend of Wing spar /fuselage fit... |
f anyone has recieved an RV4 wing kit and has verified that their fuselage =
bulkhead parts fit,
would you drop me a quick note to let me know? I'm talking about the F-404=
A,F404C and F404D parts which mate up with the wing spars.
None of these parts fit my spars and I have just received a new set of spar=
s/bulkheads from Phlogiston and this kit doesn't fit together either. Jus=
t to add insult to injury, the present spar set was damaged during shipment=
and the Roadway guy told my wife that the damage to the crate was "normal"=
and nothing to worry about. =20
Not too happy in N.H.
John
jwalsh(at)ftp.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Future of GPS |
| From: | Rudy Albachten <rudy.albachten(at)amd.com> |
Currently, the GPS system has deliberate error added into the system
that the military can cancel out. This is so, in times of heightened
national security, the system is usable by the "good guys" but not by
the "bad guys". Now that we would like to use GPS for precision
approaches a correction signal is transmitted in the area of the approach
and a special GPS receiver can add in the correction factor. Many
people would like to see the GPS system drop the deliberate errors
and allow all receivers to have the best accuracy. Before the pentagon
agrees to do this, they want to see if they can jam GPS in a small
region when necessary for national security. This would not affect
aviation, as we would be banned from that airspace anyway. Please
do not see this testing as a bad thing, the system is capable of much
greater precision than we are seeing today, and I would like to see
that precision made available to the public for automotive moving maps,
marine navigation, precision approaches, and ther uses that require
higher precision.
>
> Has anyone else discovered and of the articles written by a Mr. Keith
> Peshak??? According to him and backed up by government articles he has
> posted, the federal government has authorized a company to develop
> jamming equipment to render GPS unusable in the USA. Development and
> testing of this jamming system is taking place in Saint Louis or Kansas
> City.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Firewall assembly question |
I'm about ready to rivet my firewall assembly together
but noticed something in Frank Justice's instructions
that has me puzzled. In particular, Frank says to not
rivet the firewall recess to the firewall during the
initial assembly of the firewall. Since I want to
proseal my whole firewall, this creates a situation
where the proseal won't get compressed between the
various parts with the potential for gaps between the
parts.
Should I not rivet the firewall recess on during the
initial firewall assembly? If so, does this apply to
the whole recess or perhaps just the bottom?
I looked through the rest of the fuselage instructions
but did not see where Frank says to rivet the recess
on. If somebody is aware of where this is in his
instructions, could they please post that information.
Thanks.
Doug Medema, RV-6A, firewall in assembly.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Walsh <jwalsh(at)ftp.com> |
| Subject: | Wing Spar/Fuselage Bulkhead fit (Take 3) |
If anyone who has received an RV4 wing kit recently and has verified the fi=
t of the fuselage=20
bulkheads(F404-A,F404-C,F404-D) to the spar, could you drop me a quick note=
and let me know. The holes in my bulkhead parts do not match up with the=
holes in the spar.
Phlogistion sent me a new set of spars and bulkheads and the new set does n=
ot match either.
It was also damaged in shipping, just to add insult to injury.
thanks
John
jwalsh(at)ftp.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.acker" <r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com> |
>
>With the posibility of lossing an alternator, or having the battery die, I
>believe RMI recommends having a mechanical airspeed indicator and altimeter
>installed with their unit.
>
I am interested in this unit as well, and just downloaded the manuals for
both the RMI offerings. The following warning is given regarding
replacement of primary instruments:
"NOTICE: The uEncoder MUST NOT be used to replace more than the vertical
speed indicator in aircraft certified for or intended for IFR flight. It is
not prudent to chance a potential loss of three important flight parameters
during instrument conditions due to the failure of one unit."
The uMonitor has a battery backup circuit (good for about 10 hours of
operation from a small motorcycle battery), there must be a way to rig the
uEncoder to run off this also in the event of an electrical failure.
FWIW...the RV-8 prototype has the uEncoder as the only a/s, roc, and
altimeter instrument installed (as can be seen on my web page, sort of...bad
scan but its the main top center instrument). It also had only a Apollo 360
moving map GPS for navigation.
Anybody have any comments on the Apollo 360 as I am contemplating this unit
as well?
Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q project:
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rob_acker
(last update 12/23/96 - Oshkosh '96 RV pictures)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Kelley <patk(at)mail.ic.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet comments, thanks |
cyberbury.net!Martinph(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
>
> RV>Mike Weller RV-8 (under construction)
> RV>midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com (preferred) or mike.weller(at)msfc.nasa.gov
> mike
> I havn't used the spring on my flush set since I started this project
> and I do not have any dents from the flush set . I think that the spring
> is just to keep the set in the end of the gun so it does keep falling
> out .use slightly more pressure on the head of the rivet than on the
> tail with the bucking bar . I hold the rivet between the gun tip and the
> bucking bar and then slide the whole thing over to seat the head of the
> rivet against the part .then drive pull the trigger to form the shop
> head . also you must keep the tip flat on the surface while forming the
> shop head or it " will "dent the part .
>
> good luck .
>
> Jeff RV8
> working on L/H elivator
I could easily be wrong, because my only riveting experience is with my
kit, but I thought the spring was an IMPORTANT safety device to prevent
a flying set should the trigger be pressed while the set is not placed
against the work. Not having tried the obvious experiment, I have no
idea how fast the set would leave the gun, but my mental picture is
horrifying.
PatK - RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Kelley <patk(at)mail.ic.net> |
MR GEORGE T KILISHEK wrote:
>
> 3. Are the vertical posts attatched to the ceiling and the floor?
>
> ----------------------------------Yes, they should be attached at
> both top and bottom.
> Good luck
>
> George Kilishek
> #80006 Wings.
Or not. Mine is not the first free-standing jig built. Nor do they
need to be plumb. They DO need to be stable, because they need to hold
the structure in plumb. Remember, a jig is just there to hold the parts
in location. Don't get too hung up on making a perfectly straight jig.
Do try to make it as rock-solid a possible, but count on measuring and
re-measuring as you build. Never assume your jig has not changed. For
pictures of my free-standing, adjustable jig, see
http://ic.net/~patk/rv6a.htm and then get a copy the 16 Years of the
RV-ator and read Van's comments about jigs.
PatK - RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JBALBIERER(at)NYSYR.ANG.AF.MIL |
| Subject: | Firewall assembly question |
charset=US-ASCII
I'm just about finished with my fuselage and still haven't fitted my recess
panel. It is a good access hole to get to brake lines, rudder pedals,
etc.. The flange of the recess panel will have to be placed forward of the
firewall but you still will be able to seal it okay. If you rivet the
recess panel on first you can get away with having the flange on the inside
of the firewall. Either way appears to be acceptable, but the access
without the panel is nice!
John Balbierer
RV-6, Syracuse, NY
-------------
Original Text
>From physio-control.com!dougm(at)matronics.com (Doug Medema), on 1/29/97
10:10:
I'm about ready to rivet my firewall assembly together
but noticed something in Frank Justice's instructions
that has me puzzled. In particular, Frank says to not
rivet the firewall recess to the firewall during the
initial assembly of the firewall. Since I want to
proseal my whole firewall, this creates a situation
where the proseal won't get compressed between the
various parts with the potential for gaps between the
parts.
Should I not rivet the firewall recess on during the
initial firewall assembly? If so, does this apply to
the whole recess or perhaps just the bottom?
I looked through the rest of the fuselage instructions
but did not see where Frank says to rivet the recess
on. If somebody is aware of where this is in his
instructions, could they please post that information.
Thanks.
Doug Medema, RV-6A, firewall in assembly.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernesto Sanchez" <es12043(at)utech.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6/RV-8 Quickbuild option |
Same goes for me! Great questions...Great Answers!
Ernesto Sanchez
es12043(at)utech.net
----------
> From: mark jennings <msn.com!markjenn(at)matronics.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: RV-6/RV-8 Quickbuild option
> Date: Tuesday, January 28, 1997 7:28 PM
>
>
> I have a question about the RV-6 Quickbuild option. Are the tail kits
the
> same for quickbuild and non-quickbuild? The reason I ask is that I was
> considering building a tail kit to "test the waters." But if I did so
and
> then ordered quickbuild, would I get another partially-built tail in the
> quickbuild?
>
> I'm actually more interested in an RV-8, but I'm supposing the quickbuild
> options would be similar for the -6 and -8 with respect to what is
prebuilt
> and what is left as an exercise to the builder. So I could get started
on the
> -8 tail now, and decide later to continue with standard kits or wait for
> quickbuilds.
>
> Also, any rumors when an RV-8 quickbuild might appear?. I've heard "at
least
> 1998" but nothing more specific.
>
> Finally a quick plug for this list - if I build an RV, the generous and
> generally reasonable responses posted here will be a big reason why. You
> folks are great.
>
> - Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <72770.552(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Keeping warm . . . |
<< Have you thought ??? Seriously, there are battery
powered socks available from some sporting goods
outlets that use about 5-10 watts per sock. Hunters
use ni-cad packs to power them. A simple interface
would let you power from ships d.c. power. >>
>>Here in our harsh So. Cal. winters, our open cockpit
pilots (ultralight-type, Baby Aces, etc.) use a heated
vest that is plugged into 12 volts.<<
Here's an opportunity for someone to be immortalized in
print by doing an article on relatively low-power, keep-
warm accessories. Trying to heat the whole cockpit
electrically can be very hard if not impossible.
Further, it seems that when you are sitting relatively
motionless for long periods of time, it's difficult to
keep warm with simple layering of garments . . . but
specific application of electric heat to body parts
reduces electrical system loads and allows the cookee
to adjust the cooker to his/her personal preference.
If someone would do the legwork in finding out what kind
of products are out there and what they cost, I'd be
happy to help with the writing . . .
Regards,
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
==========oOOo=(_)=oOOo==========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
72770.552(at)compuserve.com
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JBALBIERER(at)NYSYR.ANG.AF.MIL |
| Subject: | Becker Com Radio |
charset=US-ASCII
Anyone out there know where I can get a hold of a new Becker Comm Radio.
Apparently it is a Geman radio that is 3 1/8" diameter with a good output.
John Balbierer
RV-6, Syracuse, NY
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | d shipman <innovate(at)dallas.net> |
Hello everyone:
I am looking for RV-3 plans for sale. Any leads would be
greatly appreciated.
Happy Landings,
David Shipman
innovate(at)dallas.net
________________________________________________________________________________
Try placing the cross piece about waist high or slightly higher. This will
give you good results.
Dave D
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ahefley(at)zapcom.net (Andy Hefley) |
Hi Chet,
I built one about 8 years ago and put it in a long easy. Did not have any
problems with it, nor did I have a problem going back and forth with traditional
insruments. It is a nice piece and I will problably get another one
for the RV6 I am building when the time comes.
Andy Hefley
>
>Is anyone out there flying behind RMI's encoder. Since I'm building a
>VFR aircraft I've given serious thought to using the encoder in place of
>the alt,vsi,and a/s. I guess I'm really interested to know if anyone
>had problems jumping from needles to numbers.
>
>Also, by the time you add up the cost of new instruments including an
>encoder the RMI unit is about the same cost.
>--
>Chet Razer
>crazer(at)egyptian.net
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rivet comments, thanks |
Concerning the springs used on rivet sets. I'll probably get flamed, but,
here goes. This is a trick we use at the airlines. Since we use several
different types of sets during the work shift, the spring really gets to be a
pain in the rear. What we do is to remove the spring and retainer and use a
strong rubber band attached to each set. The other end is draped around the
rear of the rivet gun. This makes changing the set very fast and easy. You
just have to remember that you can't pull the trigger unless the set is
placed against the work. If not, the set will come out of the gun and the
rubber band will shoot the set right back at you. If your head is in the
way, you learn real quick, ha ha. But this also has a good side. It is
harmful to your rivet gun to pull the trigger without having the set against
something. Give it a try, once you get used to it, you will never again use
that spring and retainer. And, if you get hurt doing this, too bad, I warned
you. (That was my disclaimer)
Dave D.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Drill Press no Bargain |
| From: | Bill Watson <watson1(at)apple.com> |
Some advice on drill press from Harbor Freight...
We have a lot of starting-out RV builders, including myself (6 emp
started), who are looking to streatch the tool budget to the max. I
bought the Harbor Freight 16 speed, bench mount dill press for $200. I
liked the low speed (for fly cutting). I thought, how bad can it be?
Briefly, here is my sad experience. Minutes after getting it set up, the
bolt to clamp the drilling platform stripped. Within a half hour I
noticed the idler pulley was binding and getting hot. Recently, now that
I have the emp kit, I tried to drill the pilot holes in the 610 & 614.
The chuck will not close enough to hold a 40 drill. Also, I notice about
.010 runout in the chuck. Ouch!
One dark night, the drill press and I are going for a ride; only one of
us is comming back. If you need to spend less, look at the floor mounted
"VULCAN" brand, made in Taiwan. It's also $200, but next to mine it
looks like a $1000.
Bill Watson
RV6 emp started
watson1(at)apple.com
=======================
Bill Watson
Licensing Operations
Phone: 408 974-7216
Fax: 408 974-0604
Page: 800-240-6371
email:watson1(at)apple.com
=======================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | joehine(at)nbnet.nb.ca (joehine) |
Hello Listers,
After reading a couple of posts today about people having trouble finding
suitable engines for their projects, thought I would post the following. I
have hesitated to do so in the past because of the feeling that the list
should stay as none commercial as possible. I promise not to clog things up.
I can offer for sale two engines, the first is a 0320-E2D from a 172. I
have the American Log Books for the engine. I don't know the totel time at
this moment. (The log book is not here for me to look at) The bottem end of
the engine has been majored by a licenced shop here in Canada. The
componants all have yellow tags. (case, cam, lifters, crank etc.) There are
Three good cylinders with the engine and one cracked but repairable
cylinder. It has the none fuel pump accessory housing but I might be able
to organize an exchange.
I would like to get $10,000 CDN for this engine.(The joys of exchange, Cdn
dollar today .7462 US = 7,462US plus shipping)
The second engine is a 0-360 A1B out of a Lake. The engine was turboed, but
no longer has the turbo attached. It also spent a few hours underwater, (A
hazard of Lakes) but the componants all appear ok, (the turbo was
serviceable). The engine is at the same shop as above and is disassembled
for inspection. All parts are serviceable. This engine has 700hrs total
time. The log book was lost but there is documentation from the last annual.
I would also like $10,000 CDN for this engine as is.
Again I apologize if anyone takes offence to a fairly long post of a
somewhat commercial nature, but I think both of these engines are finds and
would be very suitable, reasonably priced engines (if reasonably priced and
Lycoming can be said in the same sentence) for an RV.
Please respond off line if anyone is interested
Cheers
Joe
joehine(at)nbnet.nb.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Hinge Pin |
What is the accumulated wisdom about how best to insert the hinge pin
into the flap hinge? I am about ready to rivet the hinge to the
I used the split method. On one wing it was a piece of cake but the
other was very difficult, due to the not perfectly straight hinge line.
They should also be secured at the centre so they don't slide out. I
found this almost impossible so I made the pins just a little bit
longer than the hinges. I can now see the end of the pins (outboard
ends of flaps) during my preflight...none of the four have budged in 50
hours.
Another method is to drill a hole in the aileron bracket and insert the
whole pin from the aileron side, I've seen people put the pin in a
drill and work it in that way....a little oil and a nice taper would
help.
Ken
RV6A Flying
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | magic.ca!J.Ken_Hitchmough(at)matronics.com (J.Ken Hitchmough) |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Hinge Pin |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Russ Werner" <russ(at)maui.net> |
Here is a very simple way to make a perfect tail jig:
I bought a 2 x 3 steel tube and used it as my crosspiece. Make this
perfectly level. I attached a piece of 3/4 inch high-density
particle board about 4" wide along the entire length. The uprights
don't have to be straight or plumb, though it helps. Attach
particle board to these also for a smooth finish.
Drop a plumb line down from somewhere up a few feet on the uprights
and mark them, top and bottom. Connect the bottom of those two plumb
lines with a line along your crosspeice (strech dental floss and then
lightly spray paint over it for a perfect line). Strech a strong
string across from upright to upright on the plumb lines about 3
feet up from the crosspiece height. From this you can later hang
one or more plumb-bobs or needles to find a point above the
centerline at any height along your jig (just tie them on the
cross-string and slide them where you need them).
This will make a level, smooth, marked jig that you can drill and cleco
into.
Aloha,
Russ Werner
Maui Hawaii USA
mailto:russ(at)maui.net sends to me
mailto:RV-List(at)matronics.com sends to the RV List
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bjnash(at)connectnet.com (BJ Nash) |
| Subject: | Re: RADIOS: APPROVED/UNAPPROVED LISTING |
For you-alls edification.
I queried the FCC and questioned that some radios were on both lists,
approved and unapproved. They replied with the following
clarification: (Quoted verbatim).
Subject: Aviation Radios: Bad/Good -Reply
From: MAYDAY <MAYDAY(at)fcc.gov>
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 12:57:57 -0500
If a radio is on both lists, the company has type accepted it twice
and it is acceptable. Otherwise, you're radio is OK unless its on the
unacceptable list.
MAYDAY
The "acceptable" list is not inclusive of ALL models. The
"unacceptable" list is what's important.
On Tue, 28 Jan 1997 06:11:53 GMT, bjnash(at)connectnet.com (BJ Nash)
wrote:
>>Get your list of aircraft radios either from the FCC at their web
>>page: http://www.fcc.gov/wtb/freqtol.html
>>or off our auto-responder by email: FCC explaination of the frequency
>>tolerances: freqtol(at)pdsig.com
>>Listing of approved radios: gdradio(at)pdsig.com
>>Listing of unapproved radios bdradio(at)pdsig.com
>>
>>The above is offered as a free info service, if you'd like to keep
>>such stuff coming:
>>Our listing of used radios for sale: av(at)pdsig.com
>>Our listing of tools: tools(at)pdsig.com
>>A directory of all the stuff we have to offer: infobot(at)pdsig.com
>>
>>Bill Nash
>>AIRCRAFT REMANUFACTURING
>>1291 E.Vista Way, #150
>>VISTA, CA. 92084 (619) 749 0239 FAX: 749 6384
>>Aviation Parts Sales Directory: Infobot(at)pdsig.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Kamikaze pilot's flight gear |
So he can hear the radio, then transmit "tora, tora, tora" ;)
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | aol.com!SteveRV6(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: Kamikaze pilot's flight gear |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leo Davies <leo(at)icn.su.OZ.AU> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet comments, thanks |
Actually it's dissapointing. Stand in the backyard and try it, lucky if it
goes six feet. The spring is often in the way when riveting, its main use is
stopping the set falling out as you walk around.
Leo Davies
>
>cyberbury.net!Martinph(at)matronics.com wrote:
>>
>>
>> RV>Mike Weller RV-8 (under construction)
>> RV>midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com (preferred) or mike.weller(at)msfc.nasa.gov
>> mike
>> I havn't used the spring on my flush set since I started this project
>> and I do not have any dents from the flush set . I think that the spring
>> is just to keep the set in the end of the gun so it does keep falling
>> out .use slightly more pressure on the head of the rivet than on the
>> tail with the bucking bar . I hold the rivet between the gun tip and the
>> bucking bar and then slide the whole thing over to seat the head of the
>> rivet against the part .then drive pull the trigger to form the shop
>> head . also you must keep the tip flat on the surface while forming the
>> shop head or it " will "dent the part .
>>
>> good luck .
>>
>> Jeff RV8
>> working on L/H elivator
>
>I could easily be wrong, because my only riveting experience is with my
>kit, but I thought the spring was an IMPORTANT safety device to prevent
>a flying set should the trigger be pressed while the set is not placed
>against the work. Not having tried the obvious experiment, I have no
>idea how fast the set would leave the gun, but my mental picture is
>horrifying.
>
>PatK - RV-6A
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Forgot to put this in the last one. Consider using cedar 4x4's. It won't
warp, it smells good, they're usually straight, and it is very light and
strong. You don't have to drill pilot holes when running screws in the
posts, just use sheet rock screws. Worked great for me.
Dave D.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
The carved foam piece is per plans to
allow the lower cowl to drop some before moving forward past the
spinner.
Isn't this piece purely for appearance? It may be just laziness but I
haven't put one on mine. I do have a gap about 2 inches long forward of
the leg on the lower cowl (in the slit for the leg). The only way you
see this is from underneath. When the weather improves here I'll
probably put a plate over it, soewhat like the one behind the leg.
Admittedly the transition from gear leg to bottom cowl is not as smooth.
Ken RV6A Flying
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | magic.ca!J.Ken_Hitchmough(at)matronics.com (J.Ken Hitchmough) |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "les williams" <lesliebwilliams(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Rivet comments, thanks |
FWIW, I use a heavy rubber band looped around the shank of my flush set and
then hooked around the butt end of the gun to retain it in the barrel. This
seems to work for me. I also used a swivel flush set with a rubber guard when
I initially started riveting, but after I gained some experience, I went to a
standard flush set. Like someone else stated, more of the action is
transmitted to the rivet with the standard set and you don't have to put so
much pressure on the gun to rivet well.
Les Williams
RV-6AQBME #60027
Tacoma, WA
----------
From: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com on behalf of Patrick Kelley
Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 1997 11:28 AM
Subject: Re: FW: RV-List: Rivet comments, thanks
cyberbury.net!Martinph(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
>
> RV>Mike Weller RV-8 (under construction)
> RV>midibu(at)hsv.mindspring.com (preferred) or mike.weller(at)msfc.nasa.gov
> mike
> I havn't used the spring on my flush set since I started this project
> and I do not have any dents from the flush set . I think that the spring
> is just to keep the set in the end of the gun so it does keep falling
> out .use slightly more pressure on the head of the rivet than on the
> tail with the bucking bar . I hold the rivet between the gun tip and the
> bucking bar and then slide the whole thing over to seat the head of the
> rivet against the part .then drive pull the trigger to form the shop
> head . also you must keep the tip flat on the surface while forming the
> shop head or it " will "dent the part .
>
> good luck .
>
> Jeff RV8
> working on L/H elivator
I could easily be wrong, because my only riveting experience is with my
kit, but I thought the spring was an IMPORTANT safety device to prevent
a flying set should the trigger be pressed while the set is not placed
against the work. Not having tried the obvious experiment, I have no
idea how fast the set would leave the gun, but my mental picture is
horrifying.
PatK - RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: oil cooler mounting |
<< Vans recommends mounting oil cooler on firewall but gives no guidance in
such
mounting. Any ideas or suggestions would be appreciated. >>
Van's now has a mounting kit. Call them.
-GV
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | aol.com!Vanremog(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: oil cooler mounting |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bud Newhall <bud(at)softcom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Becker Com Radio |
NYSYR.ANG.AF.MIL!JBALBIERER(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
>
> Anyone out there know where I can get a hold of a new Becker Comm Radio.
> Apparently it is a Geman radio that is 3 1/8" diameter with a good output.
>
> John Balbierer
> RV-6, Syracuse, NY
My "93" ACS catalog (my newer ones at hte hanger) lists the Becker
radios. They have comm, nav, and xponder.
Bud
--
__|__
__|__ ____(+)____
____(+)____ ' '
' '
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Barnhart <barnhart(at)a.crl.com> |
Chet:
>Is anyone out there flying behind RMI's encoder.
A friend of mine has one in his Venture and loves it.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
>After getting the cowling and gear on my -6A, I found that I couldn't
remove the
>air filter without removing the nose gear leg. I had interference of the
air box
>with the leg and the little carved foam piece on the leg and there wasn't
enough
>room in the stackup to do anything else. The carved foam piece is per plans
to
>allow the lower cowl to drop some before moving forward past the spinner.
>
>I called Van's and they said typically "make it fit". After staring at it
and
>measuring the amount the box must drop to clear the filter, and realizing
there
>is no way I could even sculpt the box to clear, my dear wife suggested that
I
>cut the air box in two. After laughing a while I realized that seems to be
my
>best option. Actually, I plan to just cut a removable quadrant to clear
the
>foam piece and attach it with some screws.
>
>I can't see how this doesn't happen with all 6A's with O-320s. Anyone else
seen
>it?
>
>Tim Whitman
>
>sanding and filling fiberglass
>
>
>
Tim,
I'm planning on removing the nose gear every tine the air box comes off.
The fuse has to be propped up and one bolt removed from the nose gear.
-Scott Gesele N506RV
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | Scott Gesele <villagenet.com!scottg(at)matronics.com> |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | catbird(at)taylortel.com (TTC Carroll A. Bird) |
| Subject: | Re: wing spar/fuselage fit?? |
John Walsh wrote:
>
>
> If anyone has recieved an RV4 wing kit and has verified that their fuselage bulkhead
parts fit,
> would you drop me a quick note to let me know? I'm talking about the F-404A,F404C
and F404D parts which mate up with the wing spars.
>
>clip
I received my wing kit in Oct. 95. My wings are built and, yes
everything fit like a charm, however I built up my own spars.
Carroll Bird
Buffalo Gap, TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bubba Joe <Bubbajoe(at)earthlink.net> |
aol.com!RFierb6707(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
>
> I'm about to order the RV6 tail kit and after studying the preview plans have
> a few questions about the tail/wing jig. 1. What sort of lumber is acceptable
>
I built a table out of 2 x 4 fir 24" x 96"...topped it with particle
board 5/8" and also built a shelf under it.Then for my vertical risers I
just screwed 2 2 x 4 vertically for my horizontial root braces.It works
great and is easily moved around.It is also very sturdy,cost only 20.00
and was built in very little time.I would suggest it!!I also built a
4-way table for my vise,drill press,grinder,& band saw.I also was able
to store my Sears shop vac inside it with an electrical hook up and vac
hose running thru a hole in the top.I used pegboard for the sides which
i put my drill bits on and other tools i normally use. It is 36" x 36" x
36".5/8" part bd on top and 3" casters on it.I got the idea for it out
of Tony Binglis "Sport Plane Builder"
Hope this helps and by the way, I'm building in a 1 car garage 12'
x 25'
Rich Miller [;^)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Top <jjtop(at)cts.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The future of GPS |
Rick Osgood
>
> Has anyone else discovered and of the articles written by a Mr. Keith
> Peshak???
Jamming GPS signals is probably not much of a reat concern. It presents a
real dilema to our military since we are becoming more and more dependent
on GPS for our own operations. If they did decide to jam the affects would
be very localized.
FWIW I think that the more interesting of the Peshak articles deal with the
advantages using multi-frequency recievers capable of using both the
Russian and US systems.
John Top
Phone: (619) 549-3556
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tony Partain" <aviator(at)tseinc.com> |
The Apollo 360 is great . I have it mounted at the top of the panel, right
in the line of sight . The unit works very good and has great readability.
The LCD backlighting works in all conditions well and is easily adjustable.
This unit is easy to learn and small enough that fits in a 3 1/8 inch hole.
It also has 5 different navigation screens so you can pick one that you
like or scroll back and forth between the screens that you prefer. It may
not be as good as some of the new hand helds ,but in my opinion it is a
good solid unit .
Tony Partain
RV-4
N17PT
----------
> From: r.acker <ix.netcom.com!r.acker(at)matronics.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: RMI Encoder
> Date: Wednesday, January 29, 1997 11:29 AM
>
>
> >
> >With the posibility of lossing an alternator, or having the battery die,
I
> >believe RMI recommends having a mechanical airspeed indicator and
altimeter
> >installed with their unit.
> >
>
> I am interested in this unit as well, and just downloaded the manuals for
> both the RMI offerings. The following warning is given regarding
> replacement of primary instruments:
>
> "NOTICE: The uEncoder MUST NOT be used to replace more than the vertical
> speed indicator in aircraft certified for or intended for IFR flight. It
is
> not prudent to chance a potential loss of three important flight
parameters
> during instrument conditions due to the failure of one unit."
>
> The uMonitor has a battery backup circuit (good for about 10 hours of
> operation from a small motorcycle battery), there must be a way to rig
the
> uEncoder to run off this also in the event of an electrical failure.
>
> FWIW...the RV-8 prototype has the uEncoder as the only a/s, roc, and
> altimeter instrument installed (as can be seen on my web page, sort
of...bad
> scan but its the main top center instrument). It also had only a Apollo
360
> moving map GPS for navigation.
>
> Anybody have any comments on the Apollo 360 as I am contemplating this
unit
> as well?
>
> Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q project:
> http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rob_acker
> (last update 12/23/96 - Oshkosh '96 RV pictures)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Welding 6061-T6 |
Finn
You need an intense heat source to get a fast, concentrated heating at a very
localized area, the bonding point. A flame justs heat up a large area and
allows the whole area to slump. It has to do with the fact that aluminum
conducts heat real well and the flame doesn't heat the weld zone fast enough.
You need an arc. Take it to a welder that has a TIG welder and a lot of
experience.
Gene Francis
trying to fit a can-of-peas
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | aol.com!Cafgef(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: Welding 6061-T6 |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: Keeping warm . . . |
>Trying to heat the whole cockpit
>electrically can be very hard if not impossible.
[snip]
>but
>specific application of electric heat to body parts
>reduces electrical system loads and allows the cookee
>to adjust the cooker to his/her personal preference.
One word: Microwave!
Especially if you use the metallised canopy coating someone suggested
earlier as a way to stay cool in summer.
Is there a cheap source of 12V-powered microwave ovens out there? Open the
door, Duct-tape over the little interlock switch, and away you go.
Frank.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
frankv(at)pec.co.nz | "Knowledge=Power=Energy=Matter=Mass;
Frank van der Hulst | A good bookshop is just a genteel
Software Engineer | Black Hole that knows how to read".
PEC(NZ) Ltd (Cardax), Marton | Terry Pratchett, "Guards! Guards!"
http://www.pec.co.nz/~frankv/ |
--------------------------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net> |
| Subject: | "CONTACT!" Mag. RV articles |
Listers,
"CONTACT!" magazine has an article by Art Luther about his 2.7 liter =
Subaru powered RV-6A. Also Gene Nelson has an article about his Subaru =
EJ-22 Legacy powered RV-3. And last but not least, Marty Richey, an =
account executive for Garrett Turbocharger Systems, Allied Signal =
Automotive has a very interesting piece about "Automotive Engine =
Conversions for Aircraft". In his article he only compares automotive =
engines installed in RV aircraft. If I may quote Mr. Richey...."THE =
GOOD.....I'm impressed with the versatility of the basic RV design. It =
is capable of high top speed..........has very efficient mid speed =
performance........while demonstrating a very survivable low =
speed....stall. It appears to be a uniquely balanced design capable of =
meeting the desires of most homebuilders. No wonder it is extremely =
popular in its various configurations." He then goes on with THE BAD and =
THE UGLY, none of which refers to the airframes only the engines and the =
various performance statistics which he says are at best "acceptable =
when installed in the EXCEPTIONAL RV aircraft." I only posted this as =
another piece of information when you are deciding to choose an engine. =
Keep in mind that CONTACT! is dedicated to automotive engine conversions =
for aircraft use. And also don't forget that the OMAB guys are still out =
there and really look promising. Also please hold the flames, I don't =
have an opinion on this only a hope. Al =
prober(at)iwaynet.net
(I have included NO attachments to this message!)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitch Faatz <mfaatz(at)sagenttech.com> |
| Subject: | Drill Press no Bargain |
I bought a floor-standing (17" ?) drill press from Enco for about
$200-$250 and have been perfectly happy with it. I picked it up in
person, and could barely get it out of my Ford Bronco it's so heavy. I
think I ended up assembling it out of the tailgate so I could remove it
piece by piece instead of trying to move the box myself. Anyway, it
seems like decent quality for Taiwan: no noticeable play in the
bearings, beefy motor, decent construction. They do big mail order
business but I don't have their catalog number handy since they are
close enough to pick things up in person.
I did buy the 12" variable speed bench band saw from Harbor Freight, and
haven't had any problems with it. For $99, I wasn't expecting much, but
it hasn't thrown a blade yet and the variable speed is nice.
For another dollar-stretching tip, you can almost always find some cheap
local tool store that sells cheap pneumatic tools that are as cheap or
cheaper than mail order. I picked up a reversing drill for $39 and a
touch up gun for priming, $29. Not too bad.
--------------------- cut here
--------------------------------------------------------------
Mitch Faatz mfaatz(at)sagenttech.com San Jose, CA
RV-6AQME N727MF (reserved)
Finished with empennage and initial fuselage work, working on left wing
>----------
>From: Bill Watson[SMTP:apple.com!watson1(at)matronics.com]
>Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 1997 3:31 PM
>To: RV List
>Subject: RV-List: Drill Press no Bargain
>
>
>Some advice on drill press from Harbor Freight...
>
>We have a lot of starting-out RV builders, including myself (6 emp
>started), who are looking to streatch the tool budget to the max. I
>bought the Harbor Freight 16 speed, bench mount dill press for $200. I
>liked the low speed (for fly cutting). I thought, how bad can it be?
>Briefly, here is my sad experience. Minutes after getting it set up, the
>bolt to clamp the drilling platform stripped. Within a half hour I
>noticed the idler pulley was binding and getting hot. Recently, now that
>I have the emp kit, I tried to drill the pilot holes in the 610 & 614.
>The chuck will not close enough to hold a 40 drill. Also, I notice about
>.010 runout in the chuck. Ouch!
>
>One dark night, the drill press and I are going for a ride; only one of
>us is comming back. If you need to spend less, look at the floor mounted
>"VULCAN" brand, made in Taiwan. It's also $200, but next to mine it
>looks like a $1000.
>
>Bill Watson
>RV6 emp started
>watson1(at)apple.com
>
>
>=======================
>Bill Watson
>Licensing Operations
>Phone: 408 974-7216
>Fax: 408 974-0604
>Page: 800-240-6371
>email:watson1(at)apple.com
>=======================
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Spring Loading of Throttle and Mixture |
Gary, I am going to spring load the throttle and mixture. I hadn't actually
thought about the carb heat.
I am putting an oversize washer, with a hole drilled in it, to attach the
spring at each end.
There was some discussion on this before, but no on else seemed to be
enthused about it.
I am surprised that "fail safe" springing is not built into the carburetter.
John Cocker, also ready to fly in the Spring
>
>
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | Dr John Cocker <medhumor.com!jcocker(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Spring Loading of Throttle and Mixture |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Barnhart <barnhart(at)a.crl.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firewall assembly question |
Doug:
You wrote:
>
>I'm about ready to rivet my firewall assembly together
>but noticed something in Frank Justice's instructions
>that has me puzzled. In particular, Frank says to not
>rivet the firewall recess to the firewall during the
>initial assembly of the firewall...
And Frank is absolutely right. There is a bracket for the rudders that gets
riveted to one of the two center vertical stiffener angles. This bracket
MUST be riveted on prior to riveting the firewall recess. And of course you
don't know exactly how high the bracket must be until you actually install
the rudders.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
Has anybody on the list had success with welding 6061-T6 using the
Henrob 2000 (or any oxy-acetylen torch)?
I'm trying to weld a short length of 1/8" thick tubing to 1/8"
thick angle. The material seems to go soft and deform before the rod
will bond with the material. What's the secret?
Finn
finnlass(at)ix.netcom.com
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | ix.netcom.com!finnlass(at)matronics.com (Finn Lassen) |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Welding 6061-T6 |
Finn, About your question below-
> Has anybody on the list had success with welding 6061-T6 using the
> Henrob 2000 (or any oxy-acetylen torch)?
>
> I'm trying to weld a short length of 1/8" thick tubing to 1/8"
> thick angle. The material seems to go soft and deform before the rod
> will bond with the material. What's the secret?
Try using this technique. As you sense the material is just about to go
soft, bring in the rod and put 1/3 of the heat on the material and 2/3 of
the heat on the rod. This requires a different motion with the torch than
for other materials such as steel. If the material is still getting too
soft too quickly, run the torch a little longer up the rod. At the end of
the bond, aluminum requires more rod input to prevent the seam from melting
further. Put more heat on the rod as you approach the end of the material
and *push* more rod into the material as you bring the torch away.
Hope this helps, Chris Sargent sargentc(at)emh1.pa.net, Rv-8 someday
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | "Chris Sargent" <emh1.pa.net!sargentc(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Welding 6061-T6 |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Hinge Pin |
Steve,
Another way is to drill a small hole in the in board aleron mount just a
little off center of the hinge. That way once the pin is in it will settle
off the hole and will not come out unless you redirect it to the hole. These
pins are tight and some times you need to hook them to a drill to turn them
in , this is not uncommon....keep up the good work....George Orndorff
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | aol.com!OrndorffG(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Hinge Pin |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil (Mike Wills) |
| Subject: | Re: Keeping warm . . . |
As a long time motorcyclist I can tell you where to look for this type of
stuff if you are really interested. There are quite a number of
manufacturers of heated vests, chaps, gloves, socks, etc... The major
motorcycle periodicals usually do review/comparison articles on these items
once or twice a year. Check Motorcyclist and Cycle World magazines. You can
find mail order adds for distributors of this stuff in the same mags.
Mike Wills
RV-4(wings)
willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil
>If someone would do the legwork in finding out what kind
>of products are out there and what they cost, I'd be
>happy to help with the writing . . .
>
> Regards,
>
> Bob . . .
> AeroElectric Connection
> ////
> (o o)
> ==========oOOo=(_)=oOOo==========
> | |
> | Go ahead, make my day . . . |
> | Show me where I'm wrong. |
> =================================
> 72770.552(at)compuserve.com
> http://www.aeroelectric.com
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Haan <bobh(at)cdac.com> |
| Subject: | Dimpling Skins with Plastic Coating |
I would like to hear the groups views and pros and cons regarding dimpling
before removing the clear plastic coating Van's is now putting on the
aluminum skins. In other words, not removing the protective clear plastic
from the aluminum skins until just before priming and riveting.
A con is that chips may get stuck under the plastic skin adjacent to the
hole to be dimpled. Also, perhaps the dimples are formed a bit deeper.
A pro would be the aluminum skin is less likely to get scratched.
BTW, and easier way to remove the clear plastic coating skin is to heat it
with for example a hair dryer.
Bob Haan
bobh(at)cdac.com
Portland, OR
503-636-3550
RV6A working on the fuselage skins
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "mark jennings" <markjenn(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Drill Press no Bargain |
I recently bought a Jet JDF-17MF 16.5 inch floor press. Made in Taiwan, but
most of Jet's stuff is fairly nice.
The regular price at Eagle was $370 but they were having a 10% off sale on
everything in the store. And Jet has a $20 mail-in rebate. Net, net I got
the press for around $310. Extremely nice unit, built like a tank,
exceptionally rugged and well made. I'd recommend it highly. The rebate
expires end of Feb.
- Mark
===============
Mark Jennings
markjenn(at)msn.com
206-462-6628
206-453-0374 (Fax)
----------
From: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com on behalf of Bill Watson
Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 1997 3:31 PM
Subject: RV-List: Drill Press no Bargain
Some advice on drill press from Harbor Freight...
We have a lot of starting-out RV builders, including myself (6 emp
started), who are looking to streatch the tool budget to the max. I
bought the Harbor Freight 16 speed, bench mount dill press for $200. I
liked the low speed (for fly cutting). I thought, how bad can it be?
Briefly, here is my sad experience. Minutes after getting it set up, the
bolt to clamp the drilling platform stripped. Within a half hour I
noticed the idler pulley was binding and getting hot. Recently, now that
I have the emp kit, I tried to drill the pilot holes in the 610 & 614.
The chuck will not close enough to hold a 40 drill. Also, I notice about
.010 runout in the chuck. Ouch!
One dark night, the drill press and I are going for a ride; only one of
us is comming back. If you need to spend less, look at the floor mounted
"VULCAN" brand, made in Taiwan. It's also $200, but next to mine it
looks like a $1000.
Bill Watson
RV6 emp started
watson1(at)apple.com
=======================
Bill Watson
Licensing Operations
Phone: 408 974-7216
Fax: 408 974-0604
Page: 800-240-6371
email:watson1(at)apple.com
=======================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Hinge Pin |
Steve;
>Justice says that you cut out two eyes from the hinge in the middle and
>insert and withdraw the hinge pins from the middle.
The RVator suggest the same.
>Does this work?
Yep
>How easy is it to live with this over the hours after the airplane is
>flying?
Must be easy, I haven't thought of it in 4 years 'til you asked.
>If you had it to do over again, how would you do it?
Same way unless something easier is found.
>14 below yesterday, 75 in the shop
Glad your wife didn't lock you out?
John Darby RV6 N61764 flying
Stephenville TX
johnd@our-town.com
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | John Darby <our-town.com!johnd(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Hinge Pin |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
I didn't put the carved foam piece in for just this reason.....
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
wstucklen1(at)juno.com
writes:
>After getting the cowling and gear on my -6A, I found that I couldn't
remove the
>air filter without removing the nose gear leg. I had interference of the
air box
>with the leg and the little carved foam piece on the leg and there
wasn't enough
>room in the stackup to do anything else. The carved foam piece is per
plans to
>allow the lower cowl to drop some before moving forward past the
spinner.
>
>I called Van's and they said typically "make it fit". After staring at
it and
>measuring the amount the box must drop to clear the filter, and
realizing there
>is no way I could even sculpt the box to clear, my dear wife suggested
that I
>cut the air box in two. After laughing a while I realized that seems to
be my
>best option. Actually, I plan to just cut a removable quadrant to
clear the
>foam piece and attach it with some screws.
>
>I can't see how this doesn't happen with all 6A's with O-320s. Anyone
else seen
>it?
>
>Tim Whitman
>
>sanding and filling fiberglass
>
>
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | juno.com!wstucklen1(at)matronics.com (Frederic W Stucklen) |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dean & Scott Spencer <dspencer(at)kiva.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet comments, thanks |
aol.com!RV6DD(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
>
> Concerning the springs used on rivet sets. I'll probably get flamed, but,
> here goes. This is a trick we use at the airlines. Since we use several
> different types of sets during the work shift, the spring really gets to be a
> pain in the rear. What we do is to remove the spring and retainer and use a
> strong rubber band attached to each set.
If you don't like this idea, then Cleaveland tool (I think that's where
I got it) sells a really functional replacement spring of a lighter
guage which you don't have to unscrew from the gun when you change sets.
it has a little hook in the end which you simply pull back from the set
shank and pull out the set. As far as safety goes, it will also keep the
set in the gun when the trigger is accidently pulled without the set
against anything (not a good idea -bad for the gun). Works for me!
Scott
N4ZW
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.acker" <r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Becker Com Radio |
>
>Anyone out there know where I can get a hold of a new Becker Comm Radio.
>Apparently it is a Geman radio that is 3 1/8" diameter with a good output.
>
>John Balbierer
>RV-6, Syracuse, NY
I just ran across them in the Aircraft Spruce and Specialtly catalog. VERY
expensive though...
Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q Project:
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rob_acker
(last updated 12/23/96 - Oshkosh '96 photos)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Hinge Pin |
Steve,
On my RV-4, I drilled a small hole in the wing inboard aileron hinge. Just
slide the pin through the aileron hinge and into the flap piano hinge.
Works best with the aileron removed.
>Hello listers,
>
>What is the accumulated wisdom about how best to insert the hinge pin
>into the flap hinge?
>Steve, Huntington, Vermont
>14 below yesterday, 75 in the shop
>
>
Regards,
Louis Smith
lsmith(at)coastalnet.com
RV-8 #80126 wings
RV-4 #2844 N102LS sold
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | coastalnet.com!lsmith(at)matronics.com (Louis E. Smith Jr.) |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Hinge Pin |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Welding 6061-T6 |
Finn Lassen wrote:
>
> Has anybody on the list had success with welding 6061-T6 using the
> Henrob 2000 (or any oxy-acetylen torch)?
The secret is to use a MIG or a TIG welder. Welding 6061 with a MIG is
quite easy. But be aware, the area heated by the welding will be quite
soft.
Bud
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | Bud Newhall <softcom.net!bud(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Welding 6061-T6 |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Fritz <75303.1623(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Re: Future of GPS |
Jamming the GPS! Gadzooks! You mean the Army wants to develop a way to knock
out Saddam Hussein's ability to navigate around the desert!!! What a nefarious
plot!
Seriously, think it through and you'll see that in times of war, the ability
toknow exactly where you are is critical. And if you can deny the enemy that
ability you've got a huge edge.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Fritz <75303.1623(at)CompuServe.COM> |
Where to find an engine?
Try just behind the prop.
Smart ass!
Sorry Mom, I won't write anymore.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Hinge Pin |
Hello listers,
What is the accumulated wisdom about how best to insert the hinge pin
into the flap hinge? I am about ready to rivet the hinge to the
skin/flap brace. When I have it all clecoed up, I am at a loss to see
how I am going to get the hinge pin in and out after riveting. F.
Justice says that you cut out two eyes from the hinge in the middle and
insert and withdraw the hinge pins from the middle. Does this work?
How easy is it to live with this over the hours after the airplane is
flying? If you had it to do over again, how would you do it?
Steve, Huntington, Vermont
14 below yesterday, 75 in the shop
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | Stephen Jackson Soule <vbimail.champlain.edu!ssoule(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Hinge Pin |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Fritz <75303.1623(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6/RV-8 Quickbuild option |
Hi Mark,
Lots of us are "testing the waters" via standard kit for tail and then quick
build the rest. I've not done it yet but when I visted Van's I was told that
this is a popular way to go. And no, you don't get a spare tail unless you want
one. Otherwise Van's knocks about $2000 of the QB kit price. You paid about
half that for your tail kit so you're ahead by grand. Neat, huh?
Bob F.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Benedict <billb(at)europa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6/RV-8 Quickbuild option |
At 03:28 AM 1/29/97 UT, you wrote:
>
>I have a question about the RV-6 Quickbuild option. Are the tail kits the
>same for quickbuild and non-quickbuild? The reason I ask is that I was
>considering building a tail kit to "test the waters." But if I did so and
>then ordered quickbuild, would I get another partially-built tail in the
>quickbuild?
>
>Also, any rumors when an RV-8 quickbuild might appear?. I've heard "at least
>1998" but nothing more specific.
>
>Finally a quick plug for this list - if I build an RV, the generous and
>generally reasonable responses posted here will be a big reason why. You
>folks are great.
>
>- Mark
Mark, The tail kit is the same for a Q-build and the conventional kit. The
same will hold true for the -8. We don't know for sure, but when the -8
Q-build is available, the tail will probably not be part of it. Van's will
be sending the first wing over for fabrication within two months, but the
first set of kits will probably not be leaving until the fuselage kit is
available and in a near stock position. Then add another 6 months before
they are ready for the market. At best, it will be about the end of the
year before we have an -8 Q-build available. Bill, "the leak".
Bill
RV-4-180 soon. N894RV with over 400 hours behind a O-320, Over 1000 RV
flying hours.
These opinions are mine and do not necessarily represent the opinions or
position of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DougPage(at)aol.com |
I made the carved piece removeable with two tabs, two screws attaching it to
the gear. Makes removal of everything simple, and still looks good, filling
the gap, as well. Only way I could figure out to accomplish all.
Bill Orcutt
RV-6A, 200+ hours
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
(8.6.12/SMI-4.1)
| From: | aol.com!BestBillO(at)matronics.com |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Top <jjtop(at)cts.com> |
| Subject: | Re: "CONTACT!" Mag. RV articles |
> RV-List message posted by: Al Mojzisik
>
>Listers,
>"CONTACT!" magazine has an article by Art Luther about his 2.7 liter
>Subaru powered RV-6A
I subscribed to this magazine a couple of years ago. I think I got two
issues before they quit comming.
John Top
Phone: (619) 549-3556
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dann_Parks(at)KTEH.pbs.org (Dann Parks) |
| Subject: | Tape-on stiffeners |
A few months ago there was a discussion about using 3M structural adhesive
tape in RV construction. After some investigation and testing I have decided
to use this material to attach the stiffeners to the control surfaces in my
RV6A. Following is a description of the product and a brief description of
how I did it. For more info, please email me direct.
The adhesive is 3M VHB (Very High Bond) industrial double-sided foam tape. I
got a number of samples and specification sheets showing about two dozen
different types of foam and adhesives. This is an industrial product made
specifically to replace rivets, screws and welds in all-weather applications.
The spec sheets showed it used for attaching aluminum side panels on
steel-frame trucks and busses, attaching outdoor signage, scuff plates on
airliner flaps, even attaching ornaments to the outside of hot cast-iron
stoves.
The adhesive is tremendously strong -- the specs showed testing stronger than
rivets in tension, shear and peel forces that would destroy the aluminum
before the parts could be separated, tolerance of up to 300 degrees for short
periods (hour) and an 8 year salt-water emersion with no effect. I made some
test pieces of stiffener and .020 skin and tested different tapes against a
riveted sample. I could not separate the taped samples without bending the
skin to destruction. These were not scientific tests mind you, just my look
and feel comparisons. The tape I chose is 3M VHB 4930, a 25 mil thick acrylic
foam with a special A-30 family adhesive designed to work especially well on
aluminum.
I have a number of reasons for trying this material. Dimpling the thin
control skins is a delicate operation and can causes them to stretch and lead
to oil canning. I have seen cracks at the trailing edge rivets on RV control
surfaces (Jon Johanson's plane had them). Taping would provide solid support
from the spar to the trailing edge and eliminate any flexing of the surface.
It would also make a completely smooth surface. I also feel that, within
reason and safety, we should try new methods when applicable. This seemed a
perfect application, there are low structural forces on the stiffeners and if
there was a problem, the control surfaces could be easily rebuilt.
I talked it over with my technical counselor -- who felt the procedure was
sound -- and decided to try it. He saw this stuff used to hold together the
aluminum wings on top of sprint race cars. The only real concern was
longevity in this application. The specs showed long-term usage in things
like signs and motorhomes, but I don't know of it being used in an RV. I'm
putting in inspection holes and have made a number of long-term test samples
to keep track of.
After all that work, the application was easy. The stiffeners were made per
the plans with the exception that the trailing end was cut long enough to go
all the way to the point of the bend, and in fact was cut to match the angle
of the trailing edge of the rudder. They were also fluted to lie flat -- the
roller that made my raw stock left them bent. The skin was set on a flat
surface and marked to position the stiffeners as per the plans. At this point
the surfaces were cleaned per the 3M specs, the 1/2" wide tape was applied to
the stiffener and the liner was pealed back a bit from the trailing end. The
stiffener was placed trailing end first on the skin to assure perfect
position and the rest of the backing was pealed off underneath. It was
burnished down with a wooden stick and I move on to the next one. It took
about 40 minutes to do the rudder. It needs to sit for 3 days for complete
bonding to occur. Priming was done later. I used the recommended trailing
edge bender and a dowel (cut in a half-circle because the stiffeners went all
the way to the bend) to protect from over-bending. The rest was assembled per
plans. What resulted was a perfectly flat, mirror smooth rudder with no hint
of flexing (or rivets). I have yet to do the elevators, but I suspect it
should be very easy too -- after all that was one of the reasons to do this.
This information is not provided as a recommendation, just information as to
what a fellow RV builder is doing. Sorry for the long post, but I thought
this would be of interest to many.
Here is a number for 3M Industrial products on the US West Coast:
(800)241-4819. They have free samples of the tape.
Dann Parks
Sunnyvale, CA
EAA ch. 62 & 317
dann_parks(at)kteh.pbs.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Benedict <billb(at)europa.com> |
>
>Is anyone out there flying behind RMI's encoder. Since I'm building a
>VFR aircraft I've given serious thought to using the encoder in place of
>the alt,vsi,and a/s. I guess I'm really interested to know if anyone
>had problems jumping from needles to numbers.
>
>Also, by the time you add up the cost of new instruments including an
>encoder the RMI unit is about the same cost.
>--
>Chet Razer
>crazer(at)egyptian.net
Chet, Van's -8 uses the RMI encoder. It seems to work OK. I would not
hesitate to use it, although we have had to send it back at least once
because we blew its brains out. I don't think everyone flying the plane
goes through a sequence of shutting down the electrical system prior to
shutting down the engine, thus transients could have rearranged the eprom.
I only have one reservation, and that is the RV's decelerate rapidly during
the last phase of the flare and landing. With a needle (conventional
airspeed indicator), the pilot can see the needle moving and respond. With
numbers, by the time you focus on them and try to figure out what is up,
you have already plunked it in. For those of us that have flown RV's, we
have a visual representation and know how the landing goes. But until you
get accustomed to the airplane, fly the numbers very closely! The RMI
makes a great altimeter and VSI, with a backup airspeed indicator. Bill
Bill
RV-4-180 soon. N894RV with over 400 hours behind a O-320, Over 1000 RV
flying hours.
These opinions are mine and do not necessarily represent the opinions or
position of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Barry WARD <ward(at)axime.com> |
Just for those that count these things etc., the first RV6 built in France
flew at the beginning of January 97. The plane, unfortunately not mine, was
built by Michel Jaoul and Albert Lacombe in 18 months. It has a 360 A1A and
C/S prop. The engine which came via Vans had the bad serial no. After
pulling all the cylinders the piston wrist pins were found to be OK.
The plane which now has about 15 hours on it and which I recently had a
brief flight flies just like the specs say. It was my first trip in an RV
and I was pleased to note how easy it was to fly and how light and well
balanced are the controls.
The only glitch is with the King 155 Nav Com, so perhaps some of you
specialists can help. It is a problem with the COM section as the receive
range is only about 3 N miles however the transmit range is normal i.e.
several 10 of N miles. The antenna is the standard one fitted to the top of
the fuselage. The Nav section works OK. Any ideas?
Barry Ward; ward(at)axime.com Woking on flaps and aileron, Michel working? I
hope on my fuselage , first flight scheduled for this century.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Benedict <billb(at)europa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wing spar/fuselage fit?? |
> RV-List message posted by: John Walsh
>
>If anyone has recieved an RV4 wing kit and has verified that their fuselage
bulkhead parts fit,
>would you drop me a quick note to let me know? I'm talking about the
F-404A,F404C and F404D parts which mate up with the wing spars.
>
>None of these parts fit my spars and I have just received a new set of
spars/bulkheads from Phlogiston and this kit doesn't fit together either.
Just to add insult to injury, the present spar set was damaged during
shipment and the Roadway guy told my wife that the damage to the crate was
"normal" and nothing to worry about.
>
>Not too happy in N.H.
>
>John
>jwalsh(at)ftp.com
John, Van's has not made a change in this area in a long time, so the
parts should work. I would start again with the original parts and try to
assemble them again. Enough wings have been built that there should not be
a problem. Check the numbers etched on the center section and see if they
match the numbers on the spar. You might be trying to assemble something
backwards. Sometimes you need to put everything down, leave it for a day
and come back for a fresh start before things fit.
Give Van's a call or fax us a message of the problem so we can help you get
over the hurdle. Bill
Bill
RV-4-180 soon. N894RV with over 400 hours behind a O-320, Over 1000 RV
flying hours.
These opinions are mine and do not necessarily represent the opinions or
position of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Benedict <billb(at)europa.com> |
>
>
>FWIW...the RV-8 prototype has the uEncoder as the only a/s, roc, and
>altimeter instrument installed (as can be seen on my web page, sort of...bad
>scan but its the main top center instrument). It also had only a Apollo 360
>moving map GPS for navigation.
>
>Anybody have any comments on the Apollo 360 as I am contemplating this unit
>as well?
>
>Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q project:
>
Rob, I think the -360 is a great GPS. The human interface is straight
forward by my standards. The numbers are a little small on the map for
those of us over 50, but when I get the glasses aligned, they are
readable. I find that I use a page with large numbers for just cruising and
only go to the map in questionable airspace areas. You have my vote on the
-360. Bill
Bill
RV-4-180 soon. N894RV with over 400 hours behind a O-320, Over 1000 RV
flying hours.
These opinions are mine and do not necessarily represent the opinions or
position of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bennett(at)healey.com.au |
| Subject: | Re: Firewall assembly question |
This bracket
> MUST be riveted on prior to riveting the firewall recess. And of course you
> don't know exactly how high the bracket must be until you actually install
> the rudders.
>
> Best Regards,
> Dave Barnhart
>
Not absolutely necessary Dave. You can rivet through stiffener and
governor box. You may have to shim between the stiffener and box as I
did, but I think this would be easier than fiddling the box on
afterwards.
Peter Bennett
Sydney Australia
RV6 working inside fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Sears <sears(at)searnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Keeping warm . . . |
Based upon this thread, are you fellas telling me that the RV's have a
problem with heating the cabin? Doesn't the heat muff provide
enough? Just wondering since I'm building a -6A and have a AA5A
Cheetah with a heat system that gets so hot I almost have to turn it off
even when the temps get into the teens. Thanks!
Jim Sears
RV-6A (about to close the wings.)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | J.Ken_Hitchmough(at)magic.ca (J.Ken Hitchmough) |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Hinge Pin |
I sent the following message to the list on January 2nd. It just
arrived from the list on Jan 30.
Sorry for any confusion...but perhaps Matt can shed some light onthe
lonnnggg delay.
Ken
What is the accumulated wisdom about how best to insert the hinge pin
into the flap hinge? I am about ready to rivet the hinge to the
I used the split method. On one wing it was a piece of cake but the
other was very difficult, due to the not perfectly straight hinge line.
They should also be secured at the centre so they don't slide out. I
found this almost impossible so I made the pins just a little bit
longer than the hinges. I can now see the end of the pins (outboard
ends of flaps) during my preflight...none of the four have budged in 50
hours.
Another method is to drill a hole in the aileron bracket and insert the
whole pin from the aileron side, I've seen people put the pin in a
drill and work it in that way....a little oil and a nice taper would
help.
Ken
RV6A Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimpling Skins with Plastic Coating |
>
>I would like to hear the groups views and pros and cons regarding dimpling
>before removing the clear plastic coating Van's is now putting on the
>aluminum skins. In other words, not removing the protective clear plastic
>from the aluminum skins until just before priming and riveting.
I did this on my rudder & elevator. I don't think there's much advantage to
it... priming the inside gets done soon after dimpling is finished, so the
inside plastic gets removed then. Next step is rivetting the skin to the
skeleton, so the outer skin round the holes gets removed then.
One con is that the dimple dies seem to cut little circles out of the
plastic coating on the outside. If you aren't careful, these can get left in
the holes when the outer plastic is removed.
>A pro would be the aluminum skin is less likely to get scratched.
I think this is a big advantage, actually. Unless you're *very* careful with
lifting your skin from hole to hole with your Avery C-frame tool, it's easy
to scratch the skin.
>
>BTW, and easier way to remove the clear plastic coating skin is to heat it
>with for example a hair dryer.
Must try this... I've been using a soldering iron, and need to be careful,
otherwise the tip scratchs the aluminium.
Frank.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitch Faatz <mfaatz(at)sagenttech.com> |
| Subject: | Skyforce SkyMap II |
I haven't heard anybody talk about the new Skyforce SkyMap II
handheld/panel mount GPS unit. I haven't gotten terribly deep into the
research yet, but it looks like a real nice contender. I think it runs
~$1500 or so. It's got the nicest design I've seen - the button's
functions are printed on the screen, so they can change depending on
what mode you are in. One of those forehead slappers "why didn't I
think of that..". Also, when it can be mounted vertically or
horizontally, and when it's mounted horizontally, it fits in perfectly
with the width of your radio stack! The main software program comes
with their map upgrade cartridges too, so it's upgraded whenever you
upgrade maps.
Can someone go out and test drive this thing and get back to me? ;)
--------------------- cut here
--------------------------------------------------------------
Mitch Faatz mfaatz(at)sagenttech.com San Jose, CA
RV-6AQME N727MF (reserved)
Finished with empennage and initial fuselage work, working on left wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net> |
| Subject: | "CONTACT!" Mag. RV articles |
------ =_NextPart_000_01BC0E87.8CBB7300
Jon,
I have 6 Yrs. of "Contact!" on my reference library shelves. (I just realized,I
am a charter subscriber.) Call Mick Myal and
explain what happened. I'll bet he makes it right with you. You will have to
call information for the phone number If I recall, just ask for Mick's
(Michael C. Myal) phone number . The address is 2900 East Weymouth,
Tucson, Arizona 85716-1249. Let me know how you made out.
Al prober(at)iwaynet.net N162NV (res.)
----------
From: John Top[SMTP:cts.com!jjtop(at)matronics.com]
Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 1997 5:48 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: "CONTACT!" Mag. RV articles
> RV-List message posted by: Al Mojzisik
>
>Listers,
>"CONTACT!" magazine has an article by Art Luther about his 2.7 liter
>Subaru powered RV-6A
I subscribed to this magazine a couple of years ago. I think I got two
issues before they quit comming.
John Top
Phone: (619) 549-3556
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Terrance Jantzi <tjantzi(at)netrover.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Hinge Pin |
aol.com!DougPage(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
>
>
> What is the accumulated wisdom about how best to insert the hinge pin
> into the flap hinge? I am about ready to rivet the hinge to the
>
>
> I used the split method. On one wing it was a piece of cake but the
> other was very difficult, due to the not perfectly straight hinge line.
> They should also be secured at the centre so they don't slide out. I
> found this almost impossible so I made the pins just a little bit
> longer than the hinges. I can now see the end of the pins (outboard
> ends of flaps) during my preflight...none of the four have budged in 50
I have read several posts over the difficulty of securing flap hinge
pins when using the split hinge method. I copied an idea from another
builder annd it worked really well.
I drilled a hole for a #8 screw in the flap brace right above the
missing hinge loops. Working through the brace lightening holes I was
able to rivet in a platenut. I bent about one inch of the the hinge pins
90 degrees. These bent ends go up through two holes in a piece of .063
angle, and the angle is screwed to the flap brace. Simple and secure.
Terry
RV-6 C-GZRV "thirty-four small items to complete before the final"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jpl(at)showpg.mn.org (Joe Larson) |
| Subject: | Re: Drill Press no Bargain |
> One dark night, the drill press and I are going for a ride; only one of
> us is comming back. If you need to spend less, look at the floor mounted
> "VULCAN" brand, made in Taiwan. It's also $200, but next to mine it
> looks like a $1000.
I bought my drill press from Sears. I've been very happy with it, although
it hasn't see a ton of use yet.
-J
--
Joe Larson jpl(at)showpg.mn.org 612-591-1037
Showpage Software, Inc. http://www.wavefront.com/~showpg
14190 47th Ave N.
Plymouth, Mn 55446 Future RV-6A pilot.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | d shipman <innovate(at)dallas.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tape on stiffeners |
Hello everyone:
This is very interesting TESTING that Dann is doing. Unfortunately,
I understand that testing in the past (Sonerai?) was not successful.
Maybe with new bonding technology this will be effective and successful.
Just imagine, no more skin rivits; less work, faster flying and better
looking to boot! :)
Heres to new technology,
David Shipman
innovate(at)dallas.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)navix.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimpling Skins with Plastic Coating |
>I would like to hear the groups views and pros and cons regarding dimpling
>before removing the clear plastic coating Van's is now putting on the
>aluminum skins. In other words, not removing the protective clear plastic
>from the aluminum skins until just before priming and riveting.
or example a hair dryer.
>Bob Haan bobh(at)cdac.com Portland, OR 503-636-3550 RV6A working on the
fuselage skins
Bob, The "chips under the plastic" is why I remove the plastic along the
rivet line. I just lay a staight edge down and run a soldering iron down
both sides of the rivet line and rmove the plastic. You can leave the rest
of the plastic on the surface as long as you want.
Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)navix.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Herman Dierks <dierks(at)austin.ibm.com> |
| Subject: | Re: gear leg wobble |
One thing that I think ALL RV builders should do is to use
a slightly longer bolt to bolt on the gear leg at the top.
If I recall, the bolt provided is long enough but the bolt diameter
is smaller where the threads start and this can lead to working
and wallowing out the hole. I like to use a longer bolt and a
few washers so that the full shank diameter goes thru the socket.
I hope this makes sense.
Herman
dierks(at)austin.ibm.com
>
> A friends RV6 is wearing the tires on the inside and is not real stabile
> when taxiing. He said when he jacked the plane up and supported the
> fuselage he could get the gear legs to swivel a bit. Not having gotten that
> far on my plane I couldn't offer him any real advice, although it sounded
> like the retaining bolt holes had elongated. Can the toe in be adjusted?
> Kevin RV6A N3773 rsvd
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joe Wiza" <joe(at)flnet.com> |
Have reached the dreaded fuel tank stage (prepunched wing kit) just being
carefull before I install the T407 support ring. Looks like the bottom of
this ring is just lined up close to the rib web and then centered on the
rib. Do I just mount this ring then position the T408 access plate on the
rig and locate the the .563" and 1.5" hole positions and drill them out???
Another sort of RV related question. Just got my Fisher celebrity all
wood bi wing certified. I have a fresh overhauled C85 engine in it
(mineral Oil for break In) with two hours on it, my temperature reaches
220F (after about 20 minutes) at which time I land and let the engine cool.
My incoming and out going holes in the cowling are proper. My question is
if my temperature does not decrease as the engine gets broke in, can an oil
cooler can be attached to this engine and if so where can I get the parts
and where is it mounted? (I feel this subject is related because I consider
it therapy while the RV6 is being built.) Thanks for any help
Joe/wing joe(at)flnet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Martinph(at)cyberbury.net |
| Subject: | Dimpling Skins with Plastic Coating |
RV>Bob Haan
RV>bobh(at)cdac.com
RV>Portland, OR
RV>503-636-3550
RV>RV6A working on the fuselage skins
BoB
Take the time to remove the plastic coating on the inside of the skin
but on the outside I use a small soldering iron ( with the tip rounded
and smooth ) and a ruler for a strait edge . remove only enough plastic
either side of the rivet line to fit the bucking bar or rivet set once
you have heated the plastic just peel it back and the rest of the skin
remains protected till you are ready to paint
good luck
Jeff RV8
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Dimpling Skins with Plastic Coating |
| From: | bstobbe(at)juno.com (Bruce D Stobbe) |
Maybe I'm missing something here but it seems to me that unless you're
going to leave your airplane unpainted - a'la polished aluminum style - a
few minor scratches from normal handling won't make any difference.
After all, don't you have to rough up the surface with scotchbrite or
sandpaper before you can prime and paint anyway?
It seems to me that any scratch that's going to be deep enough to worry
about in terms of corrosion wouldn't be stopped by the thin plastic
coating anyway.
Since I haven't taken any special precautions (other than being
reasonably careful with them) in handling the skins for my airplane
during assembly I hope I haven't missed something important in my
assessment of this.
Bruce Stobbe
RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bstobbe(at)juno.com (Bruce D Stobbe) |
The manual flap installation in the RV-6 requires a brace (F683? I think)
that runs from under the back of the middle nylon bearing block to the
top of F605.
Since this brace runs on an angle from the floor to the top of F605, a
special 80 deg bracket is used to attach the brace to the floor.
However, the plans seem to show this brace bolted directly to the back of
the .063 angle which runs along with the top of F605, with no provision
for the fact that the brace is at an angle here.
What have those of you with RV-6s with manual flaps done here - have you
just bolted directly to this angle as shown in the plans? If so, doesn't
this put a twist in the top of F605? I'm considering bending the top of
the brace to fit...
Bruce Stobbe
RV-6; N508RV (res)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "r.acker" <r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com> |
>
>Rob, I think the -360 is a great GPS. The human interface is straight
>forward by my standards. The numbers are a little small on the map for
>those of us over 50, but when I get the glasses aligned, they are
>readable. I find that I use a page with large numbers for just cruising and
>only go to the map in questionable airspace areas. You have my vote on the
>-360. Bill
Bill, I was hoping you'd chime in on this one. FYI to listers
having/considering buying an older 360...Apollo will upgrade tese units to
the new screen, operating software, and database for $460.
Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q Project:
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/rob_acker
(last updated 12/23/96 - Oshkosh '96 photos)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Michael Gamble" <Micky_G(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Other ways of keeping warm. |
Motorcycle tourers use electric vests to keep warm in cold weather. You plug
it into a cicaret lighter socket. There are also heated grips, if one fit your
stick, could at least keep one hand warm.
Mick
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Dimpling Skins with Plastic Coating |
Although I have never tried this I would be concerned that the dimple would
not form properly with the plastic still in place. The quality of the dimple
makes a big difference in how well the skin looks after it is riveted. If
you want a good flat skin you need to pay the extra money and get high
quality dies (Cleaveland or Avery) and use the dimpling tool whenever
possible.
It also makes a difference in the type of hammer you use with the dimpling
tool. I used a regular carpenters hammer on my first RV and was satisfied
with the quality of the dimple. But I had been told that a dead blow hammer
works better. I made the mistake of buying a rubber tipped dead blow hammer
when I started my RV8 tail. Big mistake. That hammer is not capable of
properly forming the edge of the dimple. Consequently when the skin was
riveted to the underlying structure it had a wavyness or slight buldge
between each rivet. In addition, the rivet would not lay completely flush
with the skin. I broke down and bought a new skin and dimpled it the old
fashion way. Major improvement. I understand the steel end dead blow hammer
doesn't cause that problem.
Rick McBride
RICKRV6(at)aol.com
RV6 N523JC
RV8 80027
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John C. Devlin" <jdevlin(at)americus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: "CONTACT!" Mag. RV articles |
Al Mojzisik wrote:
>
> Jon,
> I have 6 Yrs. of "Contact!" on my reference library shelves. (I just realized,I
am a charter subscriber.) Call Mick Myal and
> explain what happened. I'll bet he makes it right with you. You will have to
> call information for the phone number If I recall, just ask for Mick's
> (Michael C. Myal) phone number . The address is 2900 East Weymouth,
> Tucson, Arizona 85716-1249. Let me know how you made out.
>
> Al prober(at)iwaynet.net N162NV (res.)
>
> ----------
> From: John Top[SMTP:cts.com!jjtop(at)matronics.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 1997 5:48 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: "CONTACT!" Mag. RV articles
>
>
> > RV-List message posted by: Al Mojzisik
> >
> >Listers,
> >"CONTACT!" magazine has an article by Art Luther about his 2.7 liter
> >Subaru powered RV-6A
>
> I subscribed to this magazine a couple of years ago. I think I got two
> issues before they quit comming.
>
> John Top
> Phone: (619) 549-3556
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------Al,
I just talked to Mick. His number is 520 881-2232. He was more than
happy to send back issues and take a subscription.
John Devlin
Finished RV-6 empennage last weekend. Wings due next month.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | William Yamokoski <wiyst1(at)vms.cis.pitt.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Drill Press no Bargain |
Just a response to Bill's sad note. I have the very same drill
press and have had no problems whatsoever, certainly none of the
glitches that Bill had. I have their belt/disc sander as well -
running fine.
Here are some comments from a fellow on the Glastar List...
Art, I cannot answer about "airless" paint sprayers, but otherwise
I've had good luck with a number of items from Harbor Freight. Of
course, I've never ordered wrenches from them. To me, wrenches and
drill bits are worth what you pay for them. I buy quality wrenches and
get my drill bits from a local machine shop supply house. Harbor
Freight sells imported items and a lot of the small items they sell
work just fine and cost much less than elsewhere. One has to be
selective. I do have a very fine drill press from them - everyone
comments on its quality. Probably made in Tibet - I've never looked.
My touch-up paint gun works as well as any other gun of its type. I
bought a cheap arbor press from them and it installs bushings
beautifully. My bench sander works great; it gets a lot of use. I have
pneumatic drills, die grinders, sanders, etc. from Harbor Freight. My
hangar partners seem to borrow such items a lot. They work fine. I
keep them well oiled. Their better pneumatic blind riveter makes "pop"
riveting a snap.
Maybe I'm just lucky. But then I use Craftsman wrenches and
professional-quality drill bits. (end of comment)
This whole business of buying tools involves a large element of risk
unless a person doesn't have worry about money. Then spending an
extra $100-$150 on a drill press is no big deal. But for the rest
of us newbies, luck seems to play a role. I don't know if I was
lucky or Bill was unlucky. The point is that, for me at least, $100
dollars is a large amount of money. If I can save it I will. But,
like Bill, I'm not doing it expecting a risk-free transaction. If any lurkers
out there are trying to make tool decisions now, remember -
cheap=risk.
William Yamokoski
4608 Windbrook Dr.
Murrysville, PA 15668
wiyst1(at)vms.cis.pitt.edu
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mikel(at)dimensional.com |
| Subject: | Re: Lighted Altimeter prices |
Seems I've seen warnings about [Century Instrument] before...
>
I had an overhauled manifold pressure guage I bought from them at OSH. Got
it home and noticed it wasn't reading the correct ambient pressure so sent
it back. They overhauled it again, finding problems and sent it back in
working order. One never has enough time to do something right, but always
finds the time to do it over correctly.
Michael
RV-4 232 SQ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: gear leg wobble |
Re. elongated holes in the gear legs: I seem to remember some talk a
while back about using taper pins as a fix for enlarged holes, or even
a better method of attaching them in the first place. Might be worth
a search in the archives.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Fritz <75303.1623(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Re: gear leg wobble/bolting practices |
Re. using a longer bolt so as to have the full shank extend beyond the surface
of the plates being joined.
Seems a nice idea at first, but clearance is clearance. That is to say, if you
are able to hand-insert the bolt then the shank has clearance as well as the
threads. And if you are relying on the bolt to prevent relative shift between
the plates you've not got a tight enough bolt-up.
Keep in mind that a bolt is not a expansion device. If you have to drive it in
with a hammer then either the holes are undersized or they are out of alignment.
Either case should be rectified because when tightened the bolt is under
tension. Misalignments creat wear points along the surface of the bolt which
create stress concentration points and that's a situation you don't want.
Things break wherever the stress exceeds the strength of the material.
So would using a longer bolt hurt anything? Realistically, I can't see why.
But it wouldn't help either.
A better practice would be to lubricate the threads, use a torque wrench, ensure
that a couple of threads extend beyond the nut, and safety wire everything.
Lubricate the threads?!?!?! Yep. Think about it for a minute. Threads are
nothing but an inclined plane wrapped around a cylinder. The whole point here
is to pull together the two pieces being joined. To do that we have to put
tension on the bolt. And we do that by using the inclined plane of a thread.
To assess how much tension we have we measure how much resistence there is to
moving along that inclined plane. But if the surface between our nut and bolt
has a lot of friction, we wind up hiding the tension and instead measure the
friction. Additionally, we twist the bolt.
This can completely obscure the very thing we are looking to achieve: the amount
of squeeze between the plates. If you think the friction factor is not
significant, think back to the last time you twisted off a bolt through
overtightening. You twisted it off....you didn't simply snap it with a straight
pull.
An example of how seriously this is taken is the installation procedure for the
bolts used to hold the lid on a nuclear reactor pressure vessel. They dodge
this entire friction issue by using a hydraulic tensioner to stretch the 6"
diameter bolts and then the worker simply spins the nut down by hand. The
tensioner is relaxed and removed and the correct pressure between the lid and
the vessel is assurred without inducing any torque or worrying about the
friction factor.
So I suspect that your friend with the wobbly landing gear simply had improperly
tightened the system.
Read chapters 3 and 5, there's an exam on Tuesday : )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: Tape-on stiffeners |
>
[snip]
>The tape I chose is 3M VHB 4930, a 25 mil thick acrylic
>foam with a special A-30 family adhesive designed to work especially well on
>aluminum.
>
[snip]
>At this point
>the surfaces were cleaned per the 3M specs, the 1/2" wide tape was applied to
>the stiffener and the liner was pealed back a bit from the trailing end.
First, thanks Dann for this informative report. Sounds like you now have a
very nice rudder.
A few questions:
1. At one point you say the tape is 25 mil thick... what's a mil? Obviously
not a mm!
2. Is there any flexing/movement between the stiffener and the skin? I guess
the amount of this depends on the tape's thickness and stiffness.
3. The tape is 1/2" wide, which with a 5/8" flange leaves 1/16" each side
unglued. I assume there's no problem here?
4. I s this a contact adhesive? ie how much room do you have to manoeuvre
(sp?) once you start sticking it down?
Frank.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
frankv(at)pec.co.nz | "Knowledge=Power=Energy=Matter=Mass;
Frank van der Hulst | A good bookshop is just a genteel
Software Engineer | Black Hole that knows how to read".
PEC(NZ) Ltd (Cardax), Marton | Terry Pratchett, "Guards! Guards!"
http://www.pec.co.nz/~frankv/ |
--------------------------------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Dimpling Skins with Plastic Coating |
> Maybe I'm missing something here but it seems to me that unless you're
> going to leave your airplane unpainted - a'la polished aluminum style - a
> few minor scratches from normal handling won't make any difference.
Yes you are definitely missing something -- you aren't anal enough!
:-)
Actually I spent a lot of time trying to keep my skins nice and
scratch-free, etc. for a while but eventually got enough overspray
and minor scuffs that I gave up trying to have "pristine skins" all
the way up to the point of painting.
The problem is that Bob Haan (the original poster of this thread) has
a friend, who shall remain unnamed, who is absolutely fastidious about
this, and his plane is a sight to behold. It positively gleams --
even though he too plans to paint his plane in the end.
So the net of it is, Bob Haan, quit trying to keep your plane as nice
as D** B****'s !!!!
:-) :-) :-)
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimpling Skins with Plastic Coating |
>
>Maybe I'm missing something here but it seems to me that unless you're
>going to leave your airplane unpainted - a'la polished aluminum style - a
>few minor scratches from normal handling won't make any difference.
>After all, don't you have to rough up the surface with scotchbrite or
>sandpaper before you can prime and paint anyway?
Yes. However, roughing up the surface with scotchbrite still leaves a fairly
smooth surface.
>It seems to me that any scratch that's going to be deep enough to worry
>about in terms of corrosion wouldn't be stopped by the thin plastic
>coating anyway.
Not so! The plastic coating is quite tough and reasonably thick (for
plastic), and stops all but the very worst of scratchs. IMHO it saves a lot
of polishing prior to painting. Corrosion isn't much of an issue if the
skins are going to be primed.
Frank.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
frankv(at)pec.co.nz | "Knowledge=Power=Energy=Matter=Mass;
Frank van der Hulst | A good bookshop is just a genteel
Software Engineer | Black Hole that knows how to read".
PEC(NZ) Ltd (Cardax), Marton | Terry Pratchett, "Guards! Guards!"
http://www.pec.co.nz/~frankv/ |
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert G. Miller, Jr." <rgmiller(at)sprintmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: gear leg wobble |
Herman Dierks wrote:
>
>
> One thing that I think ALL RV builders should do is to use
> a slightly longer bolt to bolt on the gear leg at the top.
> If I recall, the bolt provided is long enough but the bolt diameter
> is smaller where the threads start and this can lead to working
> and wallowing out the hole. I like to use a longer bolt and a
> few washers so that the full shank diameter goes thru the socket.
>
> I hope this makes sense.
> Herman
> dierks(at)austin.ibm.com
> >
> > A friends RV6 is wearing the tires on the inside and is not real stabile
> > when taxiing. He said when he jacked the plane up and supported the
> > fuselage he could get the gear legs to swivel a bit. Not having gotten that
> > far on my plane I couldn't offer him any real advice, although it sounded
> > like the retaining bolt holes had elongated. Can the toe in be adjusted?
> > Kevin RV6A N3773 rsvd
> >
> >
The holes have elongated on quite a few (six or so) RV 4's and RV-6 in
this area. The common solution is to tack weld the legs in place. One
tack is sufficient and can be ground off if necessary.
Robert Miller
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Immelmann(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Tape on stiffeners |
<< I have a number of reasons for trying this material. Dimpling the thin
control skins is a delicate operation and can causes them to stretch and lead
to oil canning. I have seen cracks at the trailing edge rivets on RV control
surfaces (Jon Johanson's plane had them). Taping would provide solid support
from the spar to the trailing edge and eliminate any flexing of the surface.
It would also make a completely smooth surface. I also feel that, within
reason and safety, we should try new methods when applicable. This seemed a
perfect application, there are low structural forces on the stiffeners and if
there was a problem, the control surfaces could be easily rebuilt. >>
<< This is very interesting TESTING that Dann is doing. Unfortunately,
I understand that testing in the past (Sonerai?) was not successful.
Maybe with new bonding technology this will be effective and successful.
Just imagine, no more skin rivits; less work, faster flying and better
looking to boot! :)
>>
Does anybody know anything concrete about Sonerai bonding failures (what
adhesive was used, prep etc.). I would hate to see a usefull inovation shot
down on heresay.No flame intended.
I'm just about ready to start on my tail and I find this very interesting.
All this talk of oilcanning in the tail surfaces concerned me enough to order
the heavy skins, thinking that perhaps the dimpling wouldn't stretch them as
much. In the 16 years of RV-ator there's an article by Van about an elusive
problem of elevator buffet followed by pitch up that was eventually traced to
oilcanning. A new elevator was what the doctor prescribed. It seems to me
that this kind of problem could be very hazardous if it leads to full fledged
flutter and a technique that leads to flat and true controls surfaces is a
good thing.
I didn't get from Dann's post that he intends to not rivit the skins to the
structure, just the stiffeners.
Interested,
Ed Holyoke
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JAllen6526(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Does the jig ever warp? |
For my fuselage jig I went to the local lumber yard and bought the most knot
free wood I could get. There was nothing special about the wood (i.e. not
kiln dried or aged).
The jig stayed straight throughout the building process. Yet,the extra 2x4's
that I had under the jig warped noticeably.
>From this I surmised that once the wood is in the jig it is held fairly rigid
and will not tend to warp. People take a lot of precautions to keep the jig
from warping, but I am not aware of anyone who has actually had a problem
with a fuselage jig warping.
You do not need a perfectly straight jig to build a perfectly straight
airplane. You only need it to stay still. Even if you buy the most exotic
wood, you are still going to periodically check you jig and make any
adjustments necessary to keep it plumb.
John Allen
Sitting in the seat making airplane noises
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Haan <bobh(at)cdac.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimpling Skins with Plastic Coating |
>> Maybe I'm missing something here but it seems to me that unless you're
>> going to leave your airplane unpainted - a'la polished aluminum style - a
>> few minor scratches from normal handling won't make any difference.
>
>The problem is that Bob Haan (the original poster of this thread) has
>a friend, who shall remain unnamed, who is absolutely fastidious about
>this, and his plane is a sight to behold. It positively gleams --
>even though he too plans to paint his plane in the end.
>
>So the net of it is, Bob Haan, quit trying to keep your plane as nice
>as D** B****'s !!!!
>Randall Henderson, RV-6
>randall(at)edt.com
>http://www.edt.com/homewing
Randall is correct, I keep trying to match Dan Benua's building skills but
also Randall's. But I would also for the record like to give credit to my
good friend and old competition soaring buddy, Gordon Comfort in Michigan,
who built and is flying a beautiful RV4 that he kept scratch free using
contact paper and it is now polished aluminum with gray trim on the
fiberglass and very very beautiful.
Bob Haan
bobh(at)cdac.com
Portland, OR
503-636-3550
RV6A working on the fuselage skins
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Dimpling Skins with Plastic Coating |
John C Darby Jr.
RV6 N61764 flying
Stephenville TX
----------
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Dimpling Skins with Plastic Coating
> Maybe I'm missing something here but it seems to me that unless you're
> going to leave your airplane unpainted - a'la polished aluminum style - a
> few minor scratches from normal handling won't make any difference.
> After all, don't you have to rough up the surface with scotchbrite or
> sandpaper before you can prime and paint anyway?
Bruce, I'm glad you said this, I was getting to feel that I was the only
one. I busted my chops all the way through construction to attempt to keep
out all scuffs, scratches, etc. And along comes Jones at painting time and
the first thing we did by the experts advice was to scuff up all of the
skin!!! No telling how many hours was wasted only to do what I had been
trying to prevent. And then using sanding/filler to cover it all!! I
told before on here about the guys that almost scared me away from building
because of their discussion about what kind of material the gloves had to
be and what kind of powder to use on the gloves to 'keep from scratching
the metal'. Hog wash!! Those guys should have been brain surgeons.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Keeping warm . . . |
John C Darby Jr.
RV6 N61764 flying
Stephenville TX
----------
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Keeping warm . . .
> Based upon this thread, are you fellas telling me that the RV's have a
> problem with heating the cabin? Doesn't the heat muff provide
> enough?
Jim, I don't think the RV has a heat problem, but then I've flown it in
temps. down to only about 25F. At that on a sunny day, it was still
comfortable except for my feet, but my feet are cold all of the time
anyway. The only time I've had the cabin heat on was to see if it would
operate, it did.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil (Mike Wills) |
| Subject: | Re: Tape on stiffeners |
I'm working from memory here (my research materials are at home). I believe
the failures referred to were not with the Sonerai, but with another Monnett
design, the Moni motorglider. The wing skins were bonded with a Hysol epoxy
(dont remember which, but could research further if asked) after a clean-up
of the surfaces with MEK. After some subsequent failures, Monnett issued an
AD to retrofit rivets to the wing skins.
The Monnett Monerai, a sailplane also used the same bonding technique, but I
dont recall ever reading or hearing about any failures with it.
Go to http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/CEmmons/ which is the Moni
homepage and read the safety reports for a little more info.
Mike Wills
RV-4(wings)
willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil
><< This is very interesting TESTING that Dann is doing. Unfortunately,
> I understand that testing in the past (Sonerai?) was not successful.
>Does anybody know anything concrete about Sonerai bonding failures (what
>adhesive was used, prep etc.).
>Interested,
>Ed Holyoke
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Fritz <75303.1623(at)CompuServe.COM> |
| Subject: | Re: Tape-on stiffeners / What's mil |
Question: What's a mil?
Answer: Yer gonna love this.
Source: Standard Handbook for Mechanical Engineers Seventh Edition
Definition: 1 circular mil = area of circle 0.001" in diameter
also: 1,000,000 circular mils = 1 circular inch.
Source: Larousse Dictionary of Scientific and Technical Terms
Definition: Colloquialism (slang) for 0.001" in length
Source: Std Handbook for Mech. Engr.
Definition: A dimension associated with electrical resistivity based on the
cross sectional area of the conductor. (my paraphrase....you don't want the
whole shebang!)
What is meant by a mil, then, depends on who'se talking but in 99.9% of the
cases, including, I'm sure, this one, it means " a thousanth of an inch a.k.a.
1/1000 inch a.k.a. a thou."
Wot a language! obfuscations abound. ; )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne) |
| Subject: | Re: gear leg wobble/bolting practices |
Hi all you designers and developers of the light planes of the future!
Robert Fritz said:
"A better practice would be to lubricate the threads, use a torque wrench,
ensure that a couple of threads extend beyond the nut, and safety wire
everything."
I always thought that a bolt should extend beyond the nut by an amount at least
equal to the bolt diameter. Is this right or excessive?
While I'm here, I have to say a few words about tools. I've used a lot of them
ranging from all the mecahnics and machinists stuff to software tools. I
graduated an Industrial Engineer and used to belong to the ASTE - Am. Society of
Tool Engineers. Doesn't mean I know what I'm talking about so I'll just give
opinions.
Don't buy the best tools you can get - save some money for flying. Buy tools
that meet your requirements. I'd rather have a set of cheap tools in the car
for emergencies than an equal dollar amount worth of Snap-Ons (a screwdriver!).
I use cheap wrenches when I want to bend and twist one for a special use. I
keep a cheap screwdriver in the plane for opening gas cap and cowl buttons.
I jamb a chunk of scrap wood onto file handles rather than buy a snazzy piece of
plastic.
So you're an old hand and you want really good tools, fine. I just worry that
we frighten away newbies or make them spend unwisely.
And don't use your fist for a hammer, someday you'll see that it was expensive!
Hal Kempthorne halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. (SJC)
Debonair N6134V RV-6AQ on order!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Top <jjtop(at)cts.com> |
| Subject: | CONTACT! Magazine |
Al:
The minute that I poked the "Send Queued Messages" button on my short but
uncalled-for message RE: CONTACT I regretted it.
It is quite obvious from the response that mine was an isolated case. It
was 3 or 4 years ago when I was interested in building a hi flying,
pressurized, tupperware 4 place, so when the magazine quit coming I did not
even bother to call and find out why. I just assumed that another start-up
had folded. I am glad to find out that that is not the case. My applogies
to Mick, he certainly has a lot of satisfied and loyal subscribers. I will
try to reach him over the week-end. I am heading north at O'dark:30 in the
AM and will be on the run all day.
John Top #5372
(619) 549-3356
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | john.perrin1(at)sympatico.ca |
| Subject: | Re: ALERT! 8 WINGS |
>
> I received a phone call from Van's today to tell me that my wing kit
> had been shipped (the good news), AND to say that the F-804-C L& R
> fuselage bulkheads had been fluted incorrectly, so don't use them.
> Replacements to arrive within 2 weeks.
... rest of text deleted
This must be common problem in all the kits - I got the same phone call.
Now for the good news - I just started unpacking my (complete) RV-8 wing kit.
The spars and center section are a thing of beauty. Definitely worth the wait.
Bill, Andy, whoever else from Vans is listening - you guys have
outdone yourselves this time. The effort is appreciated.
Now, back to the garage.
Christmas in January. Gotta like it.
John Perrin
john.perrin1(at)sympatico.ca
RV-8 80118
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom and Martha Warren" <mtnest(at)shentel.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Drill Press no Bargain |
As I understand it, Jet equiptment is made by Delta.
Tom Warren
Sonerai I
on the gear.
>
> I recently bought a Jet JDF-17MF 16.5 inch floor press. Made in Taiwan,
but
> most of Jet's stuff is fairly nice.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Reiff <Reiff(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Skyforce SkyMap II |
Mitch Faatz wrote:
>
>
> I haven't heard anybody talk about the new Skyforce SkyMap II
> handheld/panel mount GPS unit. I haven't gotten terribly deep into the
> research yet, but it looks like a real nice contender. I think it runs
> ~$1500 or so. It's got the nicest design I've seen - the button's
> functions are printed on the screen, so they can change depending on
> what mode you are in. One of those forehead slappers "why didn't I
> think of that..". Also, when it can be mounted vertically or
> horizontally, and when it's mounted horizontally, it fits in perfectly
> with the width of your radio stack! The main software program comes
> with their map upgrade cartridges too, so it's upgraded whenever you
> upgrade maps.
>
> Can someone go out and test drive this thing and get back to me? ;)
Mitch,
I bought one a month ago and highly recommend it. Actually, it's not
new, though. It's made in the UK and has been sold in Europe for about a
year and has been just recently introduced in the US. Some air forces are
using it, like RAF and South African AF.
The "soft key" system makes operation very intuitive. I've never used a
GPS before and figured out how to use it literally without cracking the
book. The function of each key changes in different screens, and they are
labeled on the screen, like an automated teller machine. It also has a
cute little joystick for moving the cursor around and entering data,
instead of the 4 position rocker switch common on other units. I like it.
I also like the big screen. Most handhelds are 1/3 screen, 1/3 keypad,
and 1/3 battery pack/antenna. This one is mostly screen - very
efficient. The screen can be oriented any of 4 ways, with keys at top,
bottom, rt, or left.
They say theirs is easier to read in direct sunlight than other GPS's. I
don't know about that as I haven't compared them, but I guess it's
something to pay attention to if you want to use it in a bubble canopied
RV. Mine is very visible in sunlight.
The database and operating software are on the same plug-in cartridge, so
when you buy a database update ($158 each, first one is free) you
January 24, 1997 - January 30, 1997
RV-Archive.digest.vol-ck