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RV-Archive.digest.vol-dh
August 27, 1997 - September 04, 1997

'Rob the trim tab?It appears to me this is not necessary. > thanks to all > > chris marion > rv6 left elevator > cincy oh > > > ------=_NextPart_000_01BCB30F.59CE39A0
Chris,
I found that I needed to just = knock off the edge of the outboard stiffener.

Bill Wootton
RV6 = Wings ---------- > From: FLYRV6 <prodigy.net!FLYRV6(at)matronics.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: left ele,short = stiffeners
> Date: Wednesday, August 27, 1997 11:08 AM
> =
> --> RV-List message posted by: "FLYRV6" <FLYRV6(at)prodigy.net>
>
> dear listers,
> is = there a need to taper the seven short left elevator stiffeners that = are
> in front of the trim tab?It appears to me this is not = necessary.
> thanks to all
>
> chris marion
> = rv6 left elevator
> cincy oh
>
>
>
> = +-- = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; &nb= sp; &nbs= p; = ; --+
> = | Visit the Matronics & RV-List Web Sites at = http://www.matronics.com> |
> | = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; --- = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; |
>= color=3D"#0000FF">rv-list-request(at)matronics.com" |
> | & put the word = "[un]subscribe" in the *body*. No other text or subject. = |
> | = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; --- = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; |
>= | Please = |
> +-- = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; &nb= sp; &nbs= p; = ; --+
------=_NextPart_000_01BCB30F.59CE39A0-- ________________________________________________________________________________ server @sac3-84.calweb.com ip 207.173.128.84 account=wcw
From: "Bill Wootton" <wcw(at)calweb.com>
Subject: AlClad
Date: Aug 27, 1997
This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01BCB312.03A41740 I have access to 10 4'x12' sheets of .032 2024 T3 AlClad. This stuff is a little different than what Van's supplies, The material I have is laminated .016 sheets. It is used allot in the Airospace industry. I am wondering if anybody has any input to strength differences between a straight .032" and the laminated materials. The intent is to make single piece top skins for the wings. I have a friend who has a laser system to cut to size and prepunch the holes. Anybody else interested? Bill RV6 Wings wcw(at)calweb.com ------=_NextPart_000_01BCB312.03A41740
I have access to 10 4'x12' sheets of = .032 2024 T3 AlClad.
This stuff is a little different than what = Van's supplies, The material I have is laminated .016 sheets. = It is used allot in the Airospace industry. I am wondering = if anybody has any input to strength differences between a straight = .032" and the laminated materials.

The intent is to make = single piece top skins for the wings. I have a friend who has a = laser system to cut to size and prepunch the holes. Anybody else = interested?

Bill
RV6 Wings
wcw(at)calweb.com
------=_NextPart_000_01BCB312.03A41740-- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
Date: Aug 27, 1997
Further complicating the CG issue is the large compressed air tank for the starter! I assume this goes aft of the baggage compartment unless one gives up baggage space. Read about this often-overlooked feature (?) in the IBM Patent Server web site under Zoche. The patent write up is interesting reading. Dennis 6A fuselage ---------- > From: Tedd McHenry <idacom.hp.com!tedd(at)matronics.com> > To: RV Listserver > Subject: Re: RV-List: Just wondering out loud > Date: Tuesday, August 26, 1997 2:05 PM > > > Frank van der Hulst writes: > > > > f) A 150 should go OK, given its lighter weight (100lbs lighter?) > > However, that in turn may lead to weight and balance problems (battery > > in the tailcone? :-) > > If the Zoche engine is 100 lb lighter, it might not be practical > to put it in an RV. (Zoche's web page quotes the weight as 84 kg, > or about 185 lb which, I think, would make it at least 100 lb > lighter than an O-320.) It would have to be mounted with its CofG > about 2 or 3 feet further forward! > > Tedd McHenry > Surrey, BC > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 27, 1997
From: Dennis Jackson <denny(at)transport.com>
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
Tedd McHenry wrote: > > I did a few weight-and-balance calculations last night, based > on information from the Zoche web page and some blatant guessing. > The damned engine is so light that it would probably have to be > ballasted to go in an RV! To keep the same moment about the > CofG as a Lycoming, it would have to be mounted very far forward. > I think I worked out that the engine CofG would have to be about > 15" forward of where a Lycoming's CofG is. Mind you, the Zoche > CofG is probably a lot closer to the plane of the prop than a > Lycoming's CofG is, so the prop might not have to be too much > further forward than it is now. > Try running the numbers using the weight for the 300 hp model or was that the one you were using. Think about 300 hp on the front end of the -8. Mmmmmmmmm yeah! DJ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 27, 1997
From: halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne)
Subject: Other Engine Alternatives - don't bad mouth Lycoming
Scott Gesele wrote: >Lycoming doesn't appear that bad. We can bad mouth Lycomings all day, but >all in all, they still work very well for what they were designed for. No argument Scott. I think we all agree they are better than a Kinner or OX5 but that they're not quite what we want to use for the next 10 million years. It isn't a trait of us EAA experimenters to sit on our butts and wait for someone else to give us airplanes like we want - we make our own. Neither Lycoming nor Continental are evil ogres, they are just trying to stay alive. We could easily lose them, you know. Sales for them are down severely over the last decade or two. Current engines aren't junk. However, it is interesting to note that Victor does a brisk business buying new Continentals, and maybe Lycomings, tearing them down and building them back up the way the factory could have done. Of course, they would then cost more and we can't afford them already. Someone pointed out that the engine in a new Bonanza is only 10% or so of the price of the plane. For experimentals like my 6A, a new Lycoming 180 would be more like half the price of the plane. Ten times the price of a Chevy V-6 with all the accessories. Neither Lyc or Continental can make huge investments and have them pay off. People who don't understand the economics here need to think about how to make a profit from spending $50 million and then selling only a few hundred engines each year. I asked about putting a new Continental IO-550 in my Debonair. It is a pretty simple installation but it would cost about $55,000! I love to have it but my wife won't let me sell the house. If a new Lycoming 180 for my RV6A could be had for say $12000, you wouldn't hear another peep out of me. I believe that money can be made selling auto conversions and I believe that it will be done. I wouldn't try it but I could give those who are some advice, learn something about marketing and selling! I expect an all aluminum *production* Chevy V-6 soon. Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- Auto engines on MWF, Lycomings on TTS halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 27, 1997
From: dcahoon.ipa.net(at)siren.ipa.net (David Cahoon)
Subject: rv-fuel tanks
I sent my RV-4 tanks to Tankcrafters in Vancouver, WA last November. I have had several conversations woth Carl Finch since then with a promise that they would be shipped the first week in August. Now I cannot get him on the phone (disconnected), fax or get him to reply to a letter. Does anyone know him, where he works, number or know anything about him? Please reply directly to dcahoon(at)ipa.net David Cahoon - Jonesboro, AR. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 27, 1997
From: Louis Willig <larywil(at)op.net>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Statistics
>for the buck. > Why not use the power of your pen or phone to offer some new constructive >ideas on how the EAA could improve services and events. If enough people >write, heck they might even listen. IMHO. > >Tom Brown - RV4 Tom, I have been having an on-and-off discussion with Dick Knapinski of the EAA over the past few months--mostly about things I don't like about the EAA. But I would never drop out. Dick always graciously responded to my points and flames, and some of my complaints were addressed this year...Not because of my suggestions, but because many other members made similar complaints or suggestions. While I still have criticisms of the EAA, the "power of the pen" is still my weapon of choice. Your description of the EAA is correct, and we should fight to make it better-not resign because it does not meet our expectations. I am writing this post as a response to Jim Sears who has probably had some frustrating problems with EAA, as have I. After a rotten time at Sun and Fun this Spring, I expected the worst from Oshkosh. Instead, It was the best of my 10 or so trips there. The complaints we all made this past July may have had some small influence after all. If we keep it up, it will slowly sink in to the powers that be at EAA headquarters. Jim, keep complaining,but don't leave us. Louis Willig ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 27, 1997
From: Gil Alexander <gila(at)flash.net>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Statistics
> > ><< know I've appeared negative about EAA recently; but, the more I > hear, the more I've decided to not go to Oshkosh and maybe even > drop out of the EAA. Sorry for the negatives. > > Jim Sears > RV-6A #22220 (getting ready to do gear mounts.) >> > > >Jim, > I have seen a lot of negative press about the flight line policy at >Oshkosh this year. I don't necessarily agree with it myself. *** snip *** > Why not use the power of your pen or phone to offer some new constructive Tom, ... I've tried. Many folks (including myself) assigned their voting proxies to Jim Wier this year, but somehow they never were recorded at the Annual Meeting at Oshkosh. I have even written to Tom P. to attempt to find out how voting proxies are assigned, but got no reply. When an Organization has an Annual Meeting, and one person has 10's of thousands of proxies, and the other directors have proxies for a few hundred at the most, the meeting becomes somewhat useless! At present, there is absolutely no incentive to listen. ... bitch mode OFF ... .... Gil Alexander Volunteer EAA Technical Counselor, Chapter #40 ... wishing EAA had more homebuilding emphasis ... >ideas on how the EAA could improve services and events. If enough people >write, heck they might even listen. IMHO. > >Tom Brown - RV4 ------------------------------------------------------- mailto:gila(at)flash.net Gil Alexander, Los Angeles, CA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 27, 1997
Subject: Re: Flightcom 403 assistance needed
<< "If you do not hear a sidetone while transmitting on the radio". I've transmitted and do not hear a sidetone. What is the purpose of a side tone and should I attempt to reconfigure the DIP switches in my intercom as stated in the manual. >> The term sidetone just means that you should be able to hear your own voice in the headset when you push the PTT and transmit. You should be able to. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Warren/MK Bishop" <wemkbish(at)nponline.net>
Subject: RST Engineering
Date: Aug 27, 1997
Has anyone built/used the latest Audio Panel/Intercom--RST 564--from RST Engineering? Any comments appreciated. Warren RV-6 Engine cowling area ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz>
Subject: Re: RST Engineering
nponline.net!wemkbish(at)matronics.com wrote: > Has anyone built/used the latest Audio Panel/Intercom--RST 564--from > RST > Engineering? I've built one, but am a long way away from using it for real. > Any comments appreciated. In brief... very good kit (although somewhat overkill for an RV), excellent manual, excellent support, good company to deal with (would be excellent, except they won't pay me to endorse them :-) Go to http://www.pec.co.nz/~frankv/bunnyaud.htm for my detailed comments. Any further questions, get back to me. Frank. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Lothar Klingmuller <lothark(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Propellors - 3 blades vs 2
Date: Aug 28, 1997
>Just a few days ago I achieved a flight level of 24 000 ft and I could >climb further. (I had 200 ft/min in this flight level) Klaus: Those climb rates, altidudes and noise levels with your prop/engine combination are sure impressive. I bet there are quite a few of us HIGH FLYIERS here in the Rockies who are interested in high altitude performence, since we usually start our flying day @ a mile (5280 ft). Do you have any cruise and fuel consumtion data? I am extrmely interested. Dank im Vorraus! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 27, 1997
Subject: Re: Just wondering: Zoche
From: ebundy(at)juno.com (Ed Bundy)
>The folks at Zoche have been promising to have an engine for sale >within the next year for at least 10 years that I know of. They are still not >available. Don't hold your breath. Very true, Jim, and very unfortunate. I'm sure those folks are working very hard on the conversion, but it is all too easy to underestimate the difficulties and overestimate the performance, TBO, (one of my favorites on an engine with no history) and the like. It is very easy to announce an engine that is: "Lighter, more powerful, uses less gas, has a longer TBO, and costs less than a comparable Lycoming - the only snag is, well, it doesn't actually *exist* yet, but NEXT year for sure..." Ed Bundy RV6A - first flight 11/20/96 ebundy(at)juno.com - Eagle, ID ________________________________________________________________________________
From: kevin lane <n3773(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: not guilty?
Date: Aug 28, 1997
I'm not sure anyone cares, I posted my original predicament simply as a warning to others, but today I received a check from a mechanic who claims he had nothing to do with stealing of the cream off my "creampuff" engine. It will cover 2/3rds of new cylinders, mags and oil filter. Had all this become a court case I suppose I could have been compensated for long distance phone charges, reassembly labor, and pain and suffering. But, I feel some of the responsibility was mine for so blindly walking into this mess. Capt. Secrest, the original owner of the engine, was kind and upright enough to have gotten involved in this and apparently was quite persuasive. Faith in mankind restored! Carry on. kevin ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 27, 1997
From: John Ammeter <ammeterj(at)seanet.com>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys)
Let me add that I, also, gave my proxy to Jim Wier. I'm the Vice Pres of Chapter 26 in Seattle and one of the tech counselors. The EAA is a good organization but it suffers from a lack of grassroots support. Homebuilders and experimenters built the EAA but it has become so big that the Board of Directors doesn't really care about us anymore. The UPS workers went on strike and accomplished virtually everything they wanted. I know many of us bitched because we couldn't get our parts but the company buckled under. Maybe, just maybe, if every homebuilder boycotted Oshkosh the EAA management would realize that we, the homebuilders, are the EAA. I know we all wanted to see over 250 RV's at Oshkosh this year but wouldn't it have been more noticeable if NO RV's showed up and it became public WHY we stayed away?? The only way that the EAA will change is if they have to change. As it is now, they have the proxy's to 'elect' (what a joke!!!) whoever they want to the board. Any other ideas?? I'm open to whatever we can do that can be effective. John Ammeter > > Many folks (including myself) assigned their voting >proxies to Jim Wier this year, but somehow they never were recorded at the >Annual Meeting at Oshkosh. I have even written to Tom P. to attempt to >find out how voting proxies are assigned, but got no reply. > When an Organization has an Annual Meeting, and one person has 10's >of thousands of proxies, and the other directors have proxies for a few >hundred at the most, the meeting becomes somewhat useless! > At present, there is absolutely no incentive to listen. > > ... bitch mode OFF ... > > .... Gil Alexander > >Volunteer EAA Technical Counselor, Chapter #40 >... wishing EAA had more homebuilding emphasis ... > > > >------------------------------------------------------- >mailto:gila(at)flash.net >Gil Alexander, >Los Angeles, CA > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Lothar Klingmuller <lothark(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Van's Air Force Newsletter
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Jim: Sorry to hear you intend to give up the editorschip of the Tri-State Newsletter! Your reasons are sound and each phase in life calls for specific activities. Con we expect an occaisonal article in the coming years??? Thanks for all the hard work and excellent writing! I sincerely hope you will find someone to fill your shoes (pen does not sound wright). Happy flying in your RV and greetings to your very understanding copilot! >I have been the editor of Van's Air Force, Tri-State Wing Newsletter for all >of the time that I was building my RV-6A SNIP ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4131rb(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Subject: RV4 Firewall cracking
Bill B or anyone else who has dealt with this problem, Over the last three months I have done condition inspections on three different RV4's. On the bottom corner of the firewall where all the angles of the triangle intersect I have found several cracks. These cracks are well hidden behind the gusset on the lower corners of the engine mount where the gear legs attatch. On one airplane we stop drilled the cracks (2 cracks of less than 1 inch in length). One of the other is in worse condition. I have manufactured a 025 stainles scab patch complete with all the angles. I intend to round out the cracks and install the stainless scab patch wet with sealant, and attatch with rivets. Hopefully this will dampen some of the shock and vibration. Im assuming that this is a high stress area possibly due to the three bends that intersect at this point. Unfortunatly the 3rd airplane is mine and I can honestly say Ive never had a hard landing in my bird so that obviously had no bearing on the cracks.( Ive put every hour on it). My question is, is this an acceptable repair? Is this overkill? Ive always assumed the firewall on the 4 is more of a fire barrier than a strucural member. Has this subject come up before? All of the 3 airplanes have less than 500hrs time on the airframe. Im very interested in your opinion. Also some of you may want to look at your airplanes in this area( with a flashlight and mirror you can see without removing your cowl. Ryan Bendure RV4131RB(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Bob Skinner <BSkinner(at)navix.net>
Subject: Re: Sensenich and 0-320-E3D
>Bob Skinner wrote: >> On my prop, we used 2 AN4 bolts, six large area washers and AN365 >> nuts. >Where does one put all these bolts and washers? I am sure that you don't drill a >hole in your prop. >Gary Zilik Gary, Sorry it took a while to reply. I've moved but not changed ISPs so have to pick up my E-mail long distance. I downloaded for 10 minutes and got half of my RV and Glastar list messages. I now have some empathy for Compuserve, AOL, etc. users. Downloading 200 messages can add up to some bucks. A suggestion for "listers": If your reply is to one person, don't reply to the list. Also, edit the text that you're rplying to and eleminate unnecessary lines and footers. Or, you could always read the FAQ that Matt puts out. It'll tell you the same thing. Gary (and others who sent private E-mail): You can install weights on the rear spinner bulkhead. My ring gear had 1/4" holes in it and we used these, instead, and this worked very well. This eleminates the need to remove and re-install the spinner. Bob Skinner RV-6 BSkinner(at)navix.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 27, 1997
From: "Larry D. Hoatson" <lhoatson(at)e2.empirenet.com>
Subject: Re: Van's Air Force Newsletter
> I have been the editor of Van's Air Force, Tri-State Wing Newsletter > for all > of the time that I was building my RV-6A and I have really enjoyed > writing It would be a great loss if you step aside - having received newsletters for several different amateur builts, yours is by far the best yet. Please reconsider... Larry -- Larry D. Hoatson Yucaipa, CA Redlands (L12) Airport lhoatson(at)empirenet.com KC6WYF via packet at: KC6WYF(at)W6JBT.SOCAL.CA.USA.NOAM Restoring 1950 Cessna 170A N9948A... Looking forward to RV-6 "Either Raise Your Skill Level... or Lower Your Standards" ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ve7fp(at)jetstream.net (Ken Hoshowski)
Subject: Fuel Tanks
Date: Aug 27, 1997
This last week has had much on testing fuel tanks and more than I expected on leaking rivits. I did my fuel tanks about 7 years ago so had no options but to use the dreaded pro seal. It really isn't that bad, if I was doing it again I would probably do it the same old way. Being in the grocery business I was able to get an old scale, just like computers, scales become obsolete within 5 years or so. This one weighted in hundreds of a pound. If I recall correctly proseal was mixed 10:1. I always used a small salmon or tuna can to mix in, weighed the can then added 10/100 lb proseal and 1/100 lb accelerator. Always saved popsicle sticks to mix with. This mixed up about 50 gram batches ( Just under two ounces) and could easily be doubled if required. As far as leaking rivits are concerned I have been flying for 3 years without any leaks. When I did my tanks I would put a blob of mixed proseal on a piece of heavy scrap cardboard and dump in 20 - 30 - 40 rivits and mix them in the proseal. It was then very easy to pick them out one at a time as required with a toothpick and pop them into the rivit hole. This put proseal around the entire rivit, in addition to the proseal that was between the rib and the inside tank skin. When Van was up I told him about this and he said they didn't do it and had no problems. I am not sure if he approved or disapproved, but it worked for me. If my memory serves me right, I dimpled then touched up with the machine countersink before prosealing. The danger of course is with having a little more proseal under the rivit head it might have a tendency to stick up. Mine didn't. I was very pleased with the results, I didn't want to have to patch leaking tanks. Had enough of that with my Cherokee 180. This does make it a bit messier riviting but a handy can of acetone and a roll of paper towels cleans it up nicely. You might want to try this on a scrap piece before you try your tank. I did have one small (my wife didn't think it was small) incident with proseal, somehow I managed to get a small blob on her newly reupholstered breakfast nook, tan colored yet.... I was about as popular as a skunk at a picnic for a few days, and then, there's the time I brought the elevator push rod (newly primed inside) up the stairs and dripped Dupont Corlor on the new lino, but thats another story........ Ken Hoshowski Editor Western Canada RVator C-FKEH 160 HP C/S First flight Sept 8/94 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Robert.R.F.Ziegler(at)scbvpno.simis.com
Subject: Just wondering out loud
Date: - - - , 20-
Web site is: http://193.26.97.194/ Kind regards Robert Dipl.Ing. Robert Ziegler, ODE Sac Postal Shell Congo B.V. Pointe-Noire c/o UNIVERSAL EXPRESS B.P. 10387 Aeroport Charles de Gaule F-95706 Roissy CDG, FRANCE Ph: +242 42 8356 Fax: +242 94 3447 Satphone: +871 382 040 322 ex221 SatFax: +871 682 040 490 Internet: Robert.R.F.Ziegler(at)scbvpno.simis.com Internet alternate (private): Robert.Ziegler(at)usa.net X.400: /I=RF/G=Robert/S=Ziegler/O=SCBV POINTE NOIRE/PRMD=SHELL/ADMD=400NET/C=NL/ ---------- From: c=GB;a=CWMAIL;p=NET;dda:RFC-822=owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com; Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 1997 05:52 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Just wondering out loud 732 957 6611) Tedd, Read your summary regarding the Zoche engine....and there area couple of questions that come to mind that you may have an answer about: 1) how about vibration levels??? I had a diesel in one of my previous small pick-up trucks and found it to have a little more vibration than it's gasoline powered version. 2) can you describe how they air cool the engine without finned cylinder heads....... thanks Paul M. Bilodeau pmbs(at)probe.mt.att.com 732-957-6611 RV-6A Empennage Fluting and finishing edges of H.S. Ribs... ps is there a website??? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Lauritsen" <clevtool(at)tdsi.net>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Statistics
Date: Aug 28, 1997
> When an Organization has an Annual Meeting, and one person has 10's > of thousands of proxies, and the other directors have proxies for a few > hundred at the most, the meeting becomes somewhat useless! > At present, there is absolutely no incentive to listen. Well said! I can't believe the one sided voting power. We ALL need to give our vote to another board member, but take the next step too. Explain the problem to EVERY EAA member you talk to, and encourage them to tell everyone they know... Bring it up at chapter meetings, pilot's club meetings, and while hangar flying. Mike (now getting down off of the box!) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net>
Subject: Fuel tank building?
I've been following the fuel tank leak testing thread for a couple weeks now and my question is can the tanks be all welded instead of riveted? I just have the preview plans and haven't really had time to take a close look, but it seams that if the seams were tig welded, there'd be less chance for leakage? Pros and cons anyone? Scott (RV-4 preview plans so far) -- Gotta Fly or Gonna Die ! --Ask me about my Aeronca Super Chief-- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Luker, Michael G." <luker.michael(at)mayo.edu>
Subject: Citation HVLP painting system
Date: Aug 28, 1997
I recently painted my airplane With sikkens paint. This is the best paint on the market. I used a CR promer to etch the aluminum, and top coated over the top. THis paint job is very light, durable, etc., The Croix paint system is Junk don't use it!! It is highly over rated. Any HVLP that uses it's own source of air, or heated air as far as I'm concerned is junk. You want a good gun get the SATA gravity feed HVLP gun, along with Sikkons paint. You can't go wrong. > ---------- > From: > apollo.hp.com!rimbold(at)matronics.com[SMTP:apollo.hp.com!rimbold(at)matroni > cs.com] > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 1997 6:47 PM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Citation HVLP painting system > > > > > I've painted with regular stuff, a little, long ago but have no HVLP > > knowledge but what I read and am told. Croix seems to be will > > liked. I *KNOW* Binks is good and any body shop would probably give > > me a bit of help if I showed up with a surplus six-pack. The Binks > > will work with a 4 or 5 hp compressor. > > The Croix (the company has a new name now) that we've been using to > prime our RV6A has been working well. It came with a turbine HVLP air > supply - no compressor necessary. > > 'Rob > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: spjohnsn(at)ix.netcom.com (Stephen Paul Johnson)
Subject: Re: Pro-Seal substitute from Spruce?
Mark wrote: > >You can order this stuff in up to 168 hr times , if needed. We use the 4 hr >stuff here, and the extra work time is useful, Specify B-4 (4 hr work time). >I toured the Omega II (remember that one?)facilities, and they were using 30 >min (B-1/2) stuff! The tech said the lack of humidity caused a slower >kick-off time. >We buy from Seal-pac. > >Check six! >Mark > Mark, Please post the phone number for Seal-pac. Thanks, Steve Johnson RV-8 #80121 Left wing, about ready for the dreaded fuel tank ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mlfred(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Subject: incredible BSFC!
<< A BSFC of .45 ain't wonderful either; IIRC Lycomings do about .35. >> Uh.......What are you smoking? I seem to recall that the most efficient piston engine was the simple to build and maintain turbo-compound 3350, and it was around .33. I seriously doubt that the Lyc we use comes close...... Check six! Mark ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Rick and Barbara Osgood <randbosgood(at)sprintmail.com>
Subject: Re: RST Engineering
Warren/MK Bishop wrote: > > > Has anyone built/used the latest Audio Panel/Intercom--RST 564--from > RST > Engineering? > > Any comments appreciated. > > Warren > RV-6 Engine cowling area > Warren, I built one of the first RST-564 kits that RST shipped. The kit is complete and of good quality. There were a few minor pc-layout problems that have now been corrected by RST. My "Biggest" complaint about RST is they are a small company and have almost no resources. My kit has been done for 3 months and I need to get it aligned. RST can not do the alignment "at this time" because they lost there technician. If you want a decent quality, low cost audio panel RST may be a good choice. If you need it now and need service from RST you may want look elsewhere. I had hoped to by there marker beacon kit but am holding off till RST shows me they are able to meet all there customers needs and not just the sale of the kit. Rick RV6A wings ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 26, 1997
From: Shirley Hobenshield <shobenshield(at)cmsd.bc.ca>
Subject: Re: Sensenich and 0-320-E3D
> >> >> First time writing. My name is Jim Nolan from Warsaw, In. I have an >> RV-4 with 0-320E3D. I'm putting 160 pistons in it at overhaul and >> would like to hear from subscribers about the pros and cons of >> putting a Sensenich metal prop on it. The response of subscribers >> with this combination is what I'm needing to help in making an >> informed decision on what to go with. Thanks N444JN >> > >>> I have a RV-6 with a O-320B2C converted to a B1A. ( Mags, but still >>>Conical Mount ). This unit has 160 pistons in it. I run a Colin Walker wood prop,( 69x69 ) If need imfo, contact. Ed Hobenshield, C-FXXG, Mountian Guy. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Craig Hiers <CRAIG-RV-4.@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Other Engine Alternatives
Scott Gesele wrote: > > > >>I know this is really off of the beaten path, but if people can mention > >>Briggs and Stratton and Honda, then maybe it isn't too strange to mention. I > >>often wondered about the feasability of converting an outboard motor for > >>aircraft use. > > Have you prices a new OMC (Johnson/ Evinrude) in either 150 or 175 HP? > They're pushing 10K. Now consider the major modifications (water cooling, > horizontal vs. vertical crank, etc) and other uncertainties and a new > Lycoming doesn't appear that bad. We can bad mouth Lycomings all day, but > all in all, they still work very well for what they were designed for. > > Just my $.02 > > Scott Gesele (final assembly, taxi test this weekend) > I have lived on a lake all of my life, we ski about seven months out of the year. We are on our 5th Johnson and they have all taken one hell of a beating. They are reliable, tough and expensive, however if you get 1400 hours out of one you have done real well ( oil injection has made a real diffrence ). the boat will go about 65 mph but we ski around 30-35 mph, so we don't operate at full power all the time and even at these power levels only 1400 hours? Lycoming may not be the only game in town, but for me it's still the best Craig Hiers Tallahassee,FL. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: chester razer <crazer(at)egyptian.net>
Subject: Flightcom 403 Assistance
Thanks to all who responded re: the sidetone issue. I can hear myself transmit and so can passenger. Intercom works perfectly and Miles Davis is alive and well via Sony Diskman patched through it. -- Chet Razer crazer(at)egyptian.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net>
Subject: EAA - One man's oppinion
It is with great trepiudation that I write this. I am not looking for flames or trying to insinuate that anyone with a different oppinion is wrong or out of line. I have been reading the criticisms of EAA for the last couple of months and I must admit that at first I was in agreement with them. (i.e. more for big bucks war birds, not much left for homebuilders etc....) I have been pondering what the existence of EAA has come to be and have concluded that it is a natural progression for any major entity (read - many, many members) to become first and formost a political action committee for its members. This I believe almost all of you will agree is what EAA has become. I resent that at the most basic of levels, however, I also see the need for protection of our rights as citizens AND pilots against our own (for the people and by the people) government and it's regulatory agencies. (FAA). Now I'm not some anti-Govt. crackpot and see some good that the FEDS do however with the Bob Hoover and many other less publicized incidents and the major airlines trying to lay claim to ALL airspace and certain airports, and cities trying to shut down "noisy" airports so they can build more houses and increase their tax bases we need EAA to have their hat in the ring along with AOPA and the others. What does all this translate too? MONEY!! and lots of it. So EAA has to maximize their income. I can understand feeling kinda used and kinda left out but hey, this is America, and we can form another "division" of EAA or our own "organization" just for home builders. But what will it look like? Probably just like EAA without some other parts of aviation that are included in EAA. EAA still supplies homebuilders with a wealth of information and help. Form your own builders groups or better yet internet builders groups like the RV-List. (I have actually met live people who participate on the RV-List and I wouldn't have even known they existed without the Net!) If you choose to "show off" your baby at Oshkosh, expect the worst and prepare for it. I know I will probably rope mine off and "look silly" but hey thats my right. I also know I'll probably grab an interested kid and put him or her in the cockpit for the thrill of his or her young life. My point in all of this is EAA has grown and represents more that just us home builders. It represents non-commercial pilots and aviation. I believe we should support EAA with our membership and we also just happen to get a good magazine doing it. As far as proxies are concerned, you would have a better chance of a proxy fight against Bill Gates than Tom P.. Most "voters" are just subscribing to "Sport Aviation" and have no idea that anyone is unhappy about the organizations officers. (read - We're not talking about profits here!) As far as Oshkosh...just look at Sun 'n Fun after only a quarter if the life of Osh. In closing, my EAA number is 30988. I have belonged off and on for 31 years and I joined when I was 15. I agree that EAA needs some work but I believe that can only be accomplished through active participation and dialog. I believe they are listening. Soap box back in the hangar....Al ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Sharlene Shipley or Bruce Knoll <snsbfk(at)mail.sage.net>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Statistics
Hi To All, How about starting a homebuilders section of the EAA, like the War Birds?? This group could take over the Experimenter or even start its own magazine. It might have to be unofficial for a while, but it might help the entrenched leaders" (?) get the idea. Bruce Knoll soon to start the RV6AQ > >> >> >><< know I've appeared negative about EAA recently; but, the more I >> hear, the more I've decided to not go to Oshkosh and maybe even >> drop out of the EAA. Sorry for the negatives. >> >> Jim Sears >> RV-6A #22220 (getting ready to do gear mounts.) >> >> >> >>Jim, >> I have seen a lot of negative press about the flight line policy at >>Oshkosh this year. I don't necessarily agree with it myself. > >*** snip *** > >> Why not use the power of your pen or phone to offer some new constructive > >Tom, > ... I've tried. Many folks (including myself) assigned their voting >proxies to Jim Wier this year, but somehow they never were recorded at the >Annual Meeting at Oshkosh. I have even written to Tom P. to attempt to >find out how voting proxies are assigned, but got no reply. > When an Organization has an Annual Meeting, and one person has 10's >of thousands of proxies, and the other directors have proxies for a few >hundred at the most, the meeting becomes somewhat useless! > At present, there is absolutely no incentive to listen. > > ... bitch mode OFF ... > > .... Gil Alexander > >Volunteer EAA Technical Counselor, Chapter #40 >... wishing EAA had more homebuilding emphasis ... > >>ideas on how the EAA could improve services and events. If enough people >>write, heck they might even listen. IMHO. >> >>Tom Brown - RV4 > >------------------------------------------------------- >mailto:gila(at)flash.net >Gil Alexander, >Los Angeles, CA > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Denny Harjehausen <retflygtiger(at)proaxis.com>
Subject: Citation HVLP painting system
> (Snip) >I recently painted my airplane With sikkens paint. This is the best >paint on the market. (Snip) The Croix paint system is Junk don't use it!! It is highly over rated. Any >HVLP that uses it's own source of air, or heated air as far as I'm >concerned is junk. You want a good gun get the SATA gravity feed HVLP >gun, along with Sikkons paint. You can't go wrong. (Snip) That was rather strongly put...Do you paint for a living? What do you base your statements on? I have seen a couple of paint jobs that non-pro's have done on their airplanes with a Croix 9 and I would be proud if I can get that good of a paint job by me or a pro. Have a good one! Denny, RV-6 (R)N641DH Fuselage-top side Lebanon, OR ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ShelbyRV6A(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Subject: Re: pre-manufactured fuel cells
In a message dated 8/27/97 7:27:37 PM, you wrote: <> I agree, tedious but very doable. Take your time and maybe try these pre-mix tubes. I used the old style mix as you go and even that was not that bad. Shelby in Nashville. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Subject: Re: Fuel tank building?
<< I've been following the fuel tank leak testing thread for a couple weeks now and my question is can the tanks be all welded instead of riveted? I just have the preview plans and haven't really had time to take a close look, but it seams that if the seams were tig welded, there'd be less chance for leakage? Pros and cons anyone? Scott (RV-4 preview plans so far) >> First of all you would have to build them of 5052 or 6061 if you wanted to weld them in lieu of riveting. 2024 is not weldable. It is extremely important when welding tanks, to get a good fillet at both sides of each seam. Butt seams just end up cracking in use, but lap seams could be made reliable. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Alan Carroll <carroll(at)geology.wisc.edu>
Subject: Dave Clark ANR
Has anyone had experience with the Dave Clark ANR headsets? (H10-13X, I think). How well do they work, and how do they compare to other options? I've used an H10-20 headset for 10 years with no problems, but would like ANR. Thanks, Alan Carroll RV-8 #80177 (Wings) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: "les williams" <lesliebwilliams(at)classic.msn.com>
Subject: Citation HVLP painting system
What is "CR promer" and "SATA" and where do you find them? Les ---------- From: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com on behalf of Luker, Michael G. Sent: Thursday, August 28, 1997 4:41 AM Subject: RE: RV-List: Citation HVLP painting system I recently painted my airplane With sikkens paint. This is the best paint on the market. I used a CR promer to etch the aluminum, and top coated over the top. THis paint job is very light, durable, etc., The Croix paint system is Junk don't use it!! It is highly over rated. Any HVLP that uses it's own source of air, or heated air as far as I'm concerned is junk. You want a good gun get the SATA gravity feed HVLP gun, along with Sikkons paint. You can't go wrong. > ---------- > From: > apollo.hp.com!rimbold(at)matronics.com[SMTP:apollo.hp.com!rimbold(at)matroni > cs.com] > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 1997 6:47 PM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Citation HVLP painting system > > > > > I've painted with regular stuff, a little, long ago but have no HVLP > > knowledge but what I read and am told. Croix seems to be will > > liked. I *KNOW* Binks is good and any body shop would probably give > > me a bit of help if I showed up with a surplus six-pack. The Binks > > will work with a 4 or 5 hp compressor. > > The Croix (the company has a new name now) that we've been using to > prime our RV6A has been working well. It came with a turbine HVLP air > supply - no compressor necessary. > > 'Rob > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Denny Harjehausen <retflygtiger(at)proaxis.com>
Subject: Engine Mount Installation
Thanks to John Bollierer and Greg Hiers for the tips, I will be using both today. Have a good one! Denny, RV-6 (R)N641DH Fuselage-top side Lebanon, OR ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Dick Knapinski <dknapinski(at)eaa.org>

Subject: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys)
Date: Aug 28, 1997
charset="ISO-8859-1" Gil, John, et al: Caught the string of postings regarding Oshkosh. I appreciate your comments, even if they're not always bouquets thrown our way. I think one comment that said the Board really doesn't care about the homebuilders or other groups within EAA is mistaken. The Board is certainly open to ideas from any part of the membership. That's not to say that every idea will be adopted, but I can say that all are considered at a Board or administrative level. To that end, what programs or activities do you think would be valuable for homebuilders to erase the impression stated by some that the organization "doesn't care"? I see there are some Technical Counselors checking in here. Is there anything that could be added to that program, for instance, to improve or add depth to it? Conversely, are there programs that should be eliminated because it doesn't serve the purpose of the membership or a significant portion of the membership? Remember, please, that EAA's mission statement as always stated that membership is open to all regardless of their aviation interest. There are programs for each one of those facets of aviation, just as there are and have been for homebuilders. If there's something more than could be done to assist homebuilders, we're always interested in hearing about it. I didn't mean to clutter up the forum, but did want to address a few of the points brought up. In the interest of keeping the RV forum relatively uncluttered with non-building items, feel free to forward e-mail to me off-list if you prefer. Best, Dick Knapinski EAA OSH > ---------- > From: John Ammeter[SMTP:seanet.com!ammeterj(at)matronics.com] > Reply To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 1997 11:23 PM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys) > > > Let me add that I, also, gave my proxy to Jim Wier. I'm the Vice Pres > of > Chapter 26 in Seattle and one of the tech counselors. The EAA is a > good > organization but it suffers from a lack of grassroots support. > Homebuilders > and experimenters built the EAA but it has become so big that the > Board of > Directors doesn't really care about us anymore. > > The UPS workers went on strike and accomplished virtually everything > they > wanted. I know many of us bitched because we couldn't get our parts > but the > company buckled under. Maybe, just maybe, if every homebuilder > boycotted > Oshkosh the EAA management would realize that we, the homebuilders, > are the > EAA. I know we all wanted to see over 250 RV's at Oshkosh this year > but > wouldn't it have been more noticeable if NO RV's showed up and it > became > public WHY we stayed away?? > > The only way that the EAA will change is if they have to change. As > it is > now, they have the proxy's to 'elect' (what a joke!!!) whoever they > want to > the board. > > Any other ideas?? I'm open to whatever we can do that can be > effective. > > John Ammeter > > > > > > Many folks (including myself) assigned their voting > >proxies to Jim Wier this year, but somehow they never were recorded > at the > >Annual Meeting at Oshkosh. I have even written to Tom P. to attempt > to > >find out how voting proxies are assigned, but got no reply. > > When an Organization has an Annual Meeting, and one person has > 10's > >of thousands of proxies, and the other directors have proxies for a > few > >hundred at the most, the meeting becomes somewhat useless! > > At present, there is absolutely no incentive to listen. > > > > ... bitch mode OFF ... > > > > .... Gil Alexander > > > >Volunteer EAA Technical Counselor, Chapter #40 > >... wishing EAA had more homebuilding emphasis ... > > > > > > > >------------------------------------------------------- > >mailto:gila(at)flash.net > >Gil Alexander, > >Los Angeles, CA > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Robert Acker <r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Other Engine Alternatives - don't bad mouth
Lycoming >If a new Lycoming 180 for my RV6A could be had for say $12000, you wouldn't hear >another peep out of me. A fresh rebuild O-360A1A, with new crankshaft, can be had for $13000 (at least I was quoted that 3 months ago). Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6Q in slowbuild mode :( ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Luker, Michael G." <luker.michael(at)mayo.edu>
Subject: Citation HVLP painting system
Date: Aug 28, 1997
charset="iso-8859-1" Sikkens paint is a product out of Germany as is the SETA gun. Both excellant products. You may have to research many automotive supply stores to find the product. CR PRIMER is a primer, you scuff the surface of Aluminum, Stainless Steal, with a red scotch bright pad, clean the surface. And spray the CR. It is a very light thin coating, but it will etch into just about anything. 15 minutes after applying you can top coat, or spray a color build(scratch filler) primer if you would like, but this would add weight. The CR primer was designed for the aviation industry. > ---------- > From: les > williams[SMTP:classic.msn.com!lesliebwilliams(at)matronics.com] > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 1997 10:05 AM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RE: RV-List: Citation HVLP painting system > > > > What is "CR promer" and "SATA" and where do you find them? > > Les > > ---------- > From: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com on behalf of Luker, Michael > G. > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 1997 4:41 AM > To: 'rv-list(at)matronics.com' > Subject: RE: RV-List: Citation HVLP painting system > > > > I recently painted my airplane With sikkens paint. This is the best > paint on the market. I used a CR promer to etch the aluminum, and top > coated over the top. THis paint job is very light, durable, etc., > The > Croix paint system is Junk don't use it!! It is highly over rated. > Any > HVLP that uses it's own source of air, or heated air as far as I'm > concerned is junk. You want a good gun get the SATA gravity feed HVLP > gun, along with Sikkons paint. You can't go wrong. > > > ---------- > > From: > > > apollo.hp.com!rimbold(at)matronics.com[SMTP:apollo.hp.com!rimbold(at)matroni > > cs.com] > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 1997 6:47 PM > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Citation HVLP painting system > > > > > > > > > I've painted with regular stuff, a little, long ago but have no > HVLP > > > knowledge but what I read and am told. Croix seems to be will > > > liked. I *KNOW* Binks is good and any body shop would probably > give > > > me a bit of help if I showed up with a surplus six-pack. The > Binks > > > will work with a 4 or 5 hp compressor. > > > > The Croix (the company has a new name now) that we've been using to > > prime our RV6A has been working well. It came with a turbine HVLP > air > > supply - no compressor necessary. > > > > 'Rob > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: "Hamilton,Thom" <Thom_Hamilton(at)so.xerox.com>
Subject: Oshkosh Statistics
Posting-Date: Thu, 28 Aug 1997 12:44:55 -0600 Hop-Count: 3 Randall Henderson wrote: >I attended OSH this year for the first time. I travelled there as >co-pilot in an RV-6 (mine's STILL not done yet -- argh!), in a flight of >three RV's (2 -6s and a -4). When we arrived, the RV parking area was >full so we had to park in an adjacent area for the first couple of days, >then we moved to the RV area after some planes had left. > >I didn't notice any undue "gaper" activity around the planes, and as far >as I know there was no "tourist rash" in our group. The difference of perception here between those who did and did not take great offense at the treatment of their planes may be related to composition of the planes. Literally, as anyone who is also on the Cozy or Canard Aviator lists can tell you, the Canard drivers were largely up in arms about the treatment of their planes at Osh. Understand, I didn't go myself this year, but the traffic has been very heavy on both lists regarding the unkind treatment and numerous reports of damage that the canard craft suffered. It may well be that metal airplanes stand up to a crowd better. (I'm not gonna' TOUCH the holding up in flight question! I lost my asbestos underwear.) So, maybe that's part of the difference of opinions on how bad the crowds were this year. If I had only talked to Canard people I think I would've been ready to boycott Osh until the policy is changed, which many of them are planning to do. But apparently the problems weren't universal outside that group. Methinks I am glad to be building (about to build) a metal airplane anyway. Just a little more confidence. Thom Hamilton thom_hamilton(at)so.xerox.com "I'm not sure." ---- Werner Heisenberg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim Sears <sears(at)searnet.com>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Statistics
Date: Aug 28, 1997
>How about starting a homebuilders section of the EAA, like the War >Birds?? This group could take over the Experimenter or even start >its own magazine. It might have to be unofficial for a while, but it >might help the entrenched leaders" (?) get the idea. > >Bruce Knoll Better yet, a new organization. Jim Sears ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson)
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Statistics
Jim: You make some valid points. I suppose I should have qualified my comments; I was mostly speaking to my experience at Oshkosh, which included the favorable location of the RVs this year. Different events have different setups and audiences, and I agree that for example I'd NEVER leave my plane unattended at Hillsboro Airshow for without ropes around it (and maybe not even then!) And if the RV area at Oshkosh did in fact have a lot of people walking through, I agree that it would be appropriate to rope off the planes. On the other hand, the situation as I saw it there seemed to be pretty much under control and in that case it seems to me to be benefecial to be more open about things. I guess part of my reaction comes from people who get all uptight about EAA and say they won't go to Oshkosh, etc., based on people messing with their planes. I think there are solutions other than just staying away, and the there is more that EAA could do, like for example having ticket buyers read and sign some sort of etiquette agreement, and/or putting said guidelines on the back of the entry tickets, and posting signs, and making frequent announcements, and training volunteers to watch out for people messing with planes and to intervene if necessary. But I also think we could do a lot on our own if we just agreed among ourselves to keep a vigilant eye on each other's planes and intervene when called for. And you are right, I have not finished my plane (I said that up front). But if you go back and read my message you will see that I was relating the reactions of the group I was with, which consisted of both builders and non-builders. Anyhow, I'm building my plane to fly and have fun with. I hope I don't get so uptight about keeping it in pristine condition that it keeps me from going places and showing it off now and then. Randall ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson)
Subject: Re: Engine Mount installation
If you're building a taildragger, be aware that the engine mount alignment will determine whether the plane sits level on the gear. A small error in the engine mount can translate to an inch or more difference at the wingtips. What I did was to drill one of the top corner holes (using the brass tube method others have described), then put the landing gear legs in their sockets, and use blocks of wood to level them up at the axles. Then using the first engine mount hole as a pivot, I adjusted the mount until the plane was sitting level across the longerons. I then drilled out the remaining engine mount holes. Randall Henderson, RV-6 randall(at)edt.com http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)idacom.hp.com>
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Dennis Jackson writes: > > Try running the numbers using the weight for the 300 hp model or was > that the one you were using. Think about 300 hp on the front end of the > -8. Mmmmmmmmm yeah! Thought about that, but I'm inclined to agree with Van here: you shouldn't oughtta be able to exceed Vne in level flight! Still, it does make you think, doesn't it? Tedd McHenry Surrey, BC composition of the paint, this is not a good thing. Lastly, no I'm not a professional painter, but I'm connected to an industry that does a lot of painting. The Croix is considered the bottom line/cheap paint system. The heat going through that gun is a lot. I had a frined who painted his Cozy with the Croix gun, and he used concept, it looks beautiful, but he had orange peel city at first. He spent several weeks sanding an buffing to get the orange peel out. > ---------- > From: Denny > Harjehausen[SMTP:proaxis.com!retflygtiger(at)matronics.com] > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 1997 9:27 AM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RE: RV-List: Citation HVLP painting system > > > > > (Snip) > >I recently painted my airplane With sikkens paint. This is the best > >paint on the market. > (Snip) > The Croix paint system is Junk don't use it!! It is highly over > rated. Any > >HVLP that uses it's own source of air, or heated air as far as I'm > >concerned is junk. You want a good gun get the SATA gravity feed > HVLP > >gun, along with Sikkons paint. You can't go wrong. > > (Snip) > > That was rather strongly put...Do you paint for a living? > What do you > base your statements on? I have seen a couple of paint jobs > that > non-pro's have done on their airplanes with a Croix 9 and I > would be > proud if I can get that good of a paint job by me or a pro. > > Have a good one! > > Denny, > RV-6 (R)N641DH > Fuselage-top side > Lebanon, OR > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Luker, Michael G." <luker.michael(at)mayo.edu>
Subject: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys)
Date: Aug 28, 1997
charset="iso-8859-1" I've heard that the warbirds at oshkosh do not have to pay for there fuel is this true? and if so who is paying for the fuel? Young Eagles. The EAA pushes the young eagles program but does not supprt it. I would like to see if an EAA member flies 10 hours worth of young eagles in a year that he would get a free subcription to Sport Aviation. The Young Eagles program is a great program but it is expensive! 10 hours of flight time at 10 gallons an hour is $200.00 dollars, this would give EAA members some insentive to reach the 1,000,000 younge eagles deal. WIth all the money that is being made how come there arent any grants being offerd to the chapters to help support the building of a hanger or airplane? This year at oshkosh I was riding a bike with a fellow who was staying at a non EAA headquarters campsite, he was riding his bike to the bike parking, and was turned around because he didn't have a camp Schuler bicycle sticker, kind of silly don't you think! > ---------- > From: Dick Knapinski[SMTP:eaa.org!dknapinski(at)matronics.com] > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 1997 10:28 AM > To: 'rv-list(at)matronics.com' > Cc: 'ammeterj(at)seanet.com'; 'gila(at)flash.net' > Subject: RE: RV-List: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys) > > > Gil, John, et al: > > Caught the string of postings regarding Oshkosh. I appreciate your > comments, even if they're not always bouquets thrown our way. > > I think one comment that said the Board really doesn't care about the > homebuilders or other groups within EAA is mistaken. The Board is > certainly open to ideas from any part of the membership. That's not > to > say that every idea will be adopted, but I can say that all are > considered at a Board or administrative level. > To that end, what programs or activities do you think would be > valuable > for homebuilders to erase the impression stated by some that the > organization "doesn't care"? I see there are some Technical > Counselors > checking in here. Is there anything that could be added to that > program, for instance, to improve or add depth to it? > Conversely, are there programs that should be eliminated because it > doesn't serve the purpose of the membership or a significant portion > of > the membership? > > Remember, please, that EAA's mission statement as always stated that > membership is open to all regardless of their aviation interest. > There > are programs for each one of those facets of aviation, just as there > are > and have been for homebuilders. If there's something more than could > be > done to assist homebuilders, we're always interested in hearing about > it. > > I didn't mean to clutter up the forum, but did want to address a few > of > the points brought up. In the interest of keeping the RV forum > relatively uncluttered with non-building items, feel free to forward > e-mail to me off-list if you prefer. > > Best, > Dick Knapinski > EAA OSH > > > ---------- > > From: John Ammeter[SMTP:seanet.com!ammeterj(at)matronics.com] > > Reply To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 1997 11:23 PM > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys) > > > > > > Let me add that I, also, gave my proxy to Jim Wier. I'm the Vice > Pres > > of > > Chapter 26 in Seattle and one of the tech counselors. The EAA is a > > good > > organization but it suffers from a lack of grassroots support. > > Homebuilders > > and experimenters built the EAA but it has become so big that the > > Board of > > Directors doesn't really care about us anymore. > > > > The UPS workers went on strike and accomplished virtually everything > > they > > wanted. I know many of us bitched because we couldn't get our parts > > but the > > company buckled under. Maybe, just maybe, if every homebuilder > > boycotted > > Oshkosh the EAA management would realize that we, the homebuilders, > > are the > > EAA. I know we all wanted to see over 250 RV's at Oshkosh this year > > but > > wouldn't it have been more noticeable if NO RV's showed up and it > > became > > public WHY we stayed away?? > > > > The only way that the EAA will change is if they have to change. As > > it is > > now, they have the proxy's to 'elect' (what a joke!!!) whoever they > > want to > > the board. > > > > Any other ideas?? I'm open to whatever we can do that can be > > effective. > > > > John Ammeter > > > > > > > > > > Many folks (including myself) assigned their voting > > >proxies to Jim Wier this year, but somehow they never were recorded > > at the > > >Annual Meeting at Oshkosh. I have even written to Tom P. to > attempt > > to > > >find out how voting proxies are assigned, but got no reply. > > > When an Organization has an Annual Meeting, and one person > has > > 10's > > >of thousands of proxies, and the other directors have proxies for a > > few > > >hundred at the most, the meeting becomes somewhat useless! > > > At present, there is absolutely no incentive to listen. > > > > > > ... bitch mode OFF ... > > > > > > .... Gil Alexander > > > > > >Volunteer EAA Technical Counselor, Chapter #40 > > >... wishing EAA had more homebuilding emphasis ... > > > > > > > > > > > >------------------------------------------------------- > > >mailto:gila(at)flash.net > > >Gil Alexander, > > >Los Angeles, CA > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Doug Rozendaal" <DougR(at)netins.net>
Subject: Re: Dave Clark ANR
Date: Aug 27, 1997
Alan, I just bought a DC 10-13X at OSH. It is not a Bose.. It works well however and cost half as much. I can't say that I am thrilled with it and I have to decide, because I have 30 days to return it. I will probably keep it. It is just as good as the Headset's Inc add on and alot cleaner and if you add the headset plus the add on kit you are close to what I paid. I have used the lightspeed and it is probably better Noise Canceling but it is an all plastic and would not hold up to the abuse that I give a headset. The short story is that the Bose is twice as good as any of the others I have used and costs twice as much. My name is "Rozendaal" and my people come from the land of wooden shoes and Iron heads like the "Van Grunsven's" and I am too dutch (read tight$$$) to give Dr. Bose a grand. IMHO Tailwinds, N240 the pink panther Doug Rozendaal Dougr(at)netins.net http://www.petroblend.com/dougr ---------- > From: Alan Carroll <geology.wisc.edu!carroll(at)matronics.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: Dave Clark ANR > Date: Thursday, August 28, 1997 10:00 AM > > > Has anyone had experience with the Dave Clark ANR headsets? (H10-13X, I > think). How well do they work, and how do they compare to other options? > I've used an H10-20 headset for 10 years with no problems, but would like > ANR. > > Thanks, > > > Alan Carroll > RV-8 #80177 (Wings) > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)idacom.hp.com>
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Dennis Persyk writes: > > Further complicating the CG issue is the large compressed air tank for the > starter! I assume this goes aft of the baggage compartment unless one > gives up baggage space. Read about this often-overlooked feature (?) in > the IBM Patent Server web site under Zoche. The patent write up is > interesting reading. I checked the web page but couldn't find anything about the size of the tank. Just how big is it? The engine would mount so far forward of the firewall in an RV, for CofG reasons, that maybe there'd be room there. The Zoche is a bit pie-in-the-sky for an RV, to be sure. But then, my RV-6 is mostly pie-in-the-sky at the moment! At the rate I'm going, off-the-shelf warp drive might be available for me. Tedd McHenry Surrey, BC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Craig Moen <Moen(at)mail.dec.com>
Subject: Dave Clark ANR
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Has anyone had experience with the Dave Clark ANR headsets? (H10-13X, I think). How well do they work, and how do they compare to other = options? I've used an H10-20 headset for 10 years with no problems, but would = like ANR. Hi Alan, I have a set of DC's with the Texas Co. - Headsets Inc.'s ANR retrofit. = It is a good value. However, you loose some(sometimes a lot) of the = dynamic range. I have static tested the 10-13x's and found that they = still have a loss of dynamic range in sound reproduction. I fly a = friends Mooney with Bose 1 headsets installed and like them but still = the freq. range is limited. Even went to the Bose truck at OSH ready to = buy if they had it right with the Bose II but was not impressed with = their simulation. The simulation of Cessna noise was much lower then = reality in my opinion such that the ANR feature was not as strong as I = felt it should be.=20 Lightspeed was interesting but I was not impressed with the quality and = gross size of the high end model. They stick out so much one would have = marks all over their canopy in turbulence. No easy answer... Now that stereo is a bigger desire, dynamic range is a bigger issue. Why = have a great stereo on those long x-countries if the headset makes it = sound like a tin can... more feedback anyone... Craig Moen Maryland RV-8 #338 N184CM reserved moen(at)mail.dec.com Thanks, Alan Carroll RV-8 #80177 (Wings) ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: incredible BSFC!
From: tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com (John T. Craig-Stearman)
Date: Aug 28, 1997
I have to agree with Mark. The BSFC figures I have seen for a Lycoming at cruise power are all in the low 0.4s, like 0.42 lb/hp hr. Regards, Tom Craig-Stearman tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com RV-4 preparing to mount wings ><< A BSFC of .45 ain't wonderful either; IIRC Lycomings > do about .35. >> > >Uh.......What are you smoking? I seem to recall that the most >efficient >piston engine was the simple to build and maintain turbo-compound >3350, and >it was around .33. I seriously doubt that the Lyc we use comes >close...... > >Check six! >Mark ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
From: rodwoodard(at)juno.com (Rodney W. Woodard)
writes: > >Dennis Jackson writes: >> >> Try running the numbers using the weight for the 300 hp model or was >> that the one you were using. Think about 300 hp on the front end of >the >> -8. Mmmmmmmmm yeah! > >Thought about that, but I'm inclined to agree with Van here: >you shouldn't oughtta be able to exceed Vne in level flight! >Still, it does make you think, doesn't it? > >Tedd McHenry >Surrey, BC I kind of like being able to push Vne in a climb though. :-) Why do we need cars that are capable of exceeding 75mph--the maximum speed limit in all but one of our states? I'd want it for the extra performance and ability to get my fanny to the speed limit a little faster. These are sport aircraft we're building here... it's only natural and the American way to want to make things just a little more "sporty." Rod (IO-5??) Woodard Loveland, Colorado RV-8, #80033 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz>
Subject: Re: incredible BSFC!
aol.com!Mlfred(at)matronics.com wrote: > << A BSFC of .45 ain't wonderful either; IIRC Lycomings > do about .35. >> > > Uh.......What are you smoking? I seem to recall that the most > efficient > piston engine was the simple to build and maintain turbo-compound > 3350, and > it was around .33. I seriously doubt that the Lyc we use comes > close...... You're probably right... the .35 was from my vague memory. I did a quick hunt round Greg Travis' engines site and couldn't find anything. Any idea what figure an O-360 does give? How about a typical car engine or Mazda rotary? Frank. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Steve Beckham <76623.1166(at)CompuServe.COM>
Subject: Re: Auto Engines (was O-360 operating limits)
Charlie: Thanks for nice note. R.e. 3-rotor possibility, yes we have been approached by several people including a helicopter manufacturer regarding a 3 and 4 rotor engine. But for now we're focusing in getting the 2-rotor conversion engine into service and working on the inevitable adjustments. But we are extremely pleased with progress to date. Steve Beckham Powersport, Inc. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: pmbs(at)probe.mt.att.com (Paul M Bilodeau +1 +1 732 957 6611)
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
Tedd and alll. Re: exceeding Vne in level flight - perhaps one just wants takeoff and climb performance and would throttle back for cruise fuel savings. Besides that throttling back would extend the supposed 2000 TBO..... Wonder if we'll be able to afford one when it gets certified??? Paul M. Bilodeau pmbs(at)probe.mt.att.com 732-957-6611 RV-6A Empennage Fluting and finishing edges of H.S. Ribs... 4 to go.... ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: pmbs(at)probe.mt.att.com (Paul M Bilodeau +1 +1 732 957 6611)
Subject: Citation HVLP painting system
where does one get MSDS/Specification Sheets for the CR Primer?? and how much does it cost?? thanks Paul M. Bilodeau pmbs(at)probe.mt.att.com 732-957-6611 RV-6A Empennage Fluting and finishing edges of H.S. Ribs...4 to go ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: L & M Rowles <lmrowles(at)netspace.net.au>
Subject: Lost GPS antenna
Hi, Just a few lines to mention if anybody dropped what appeared to be a hand held gps antenna in the RV area at Oshkosh I picked it up at the tent in the RV parking area and handed it to the boys at the main RV tent. Regards Les Rowles. Les Rowles Po Box 1895 Traralgon Australia 3844 lmrowles(at)netspace.net.au ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Steve Beckham <76623.1166(at)CompuServe.COM>
Subject: Re: Rotary RV-4
Denny: Yes, we are working on engine installation in RV-6 for our 200 h.p. Powersport-Mazda (this is the conversion engine/reduction gear, etc.)--We've been held up by work on RV-3 and RV-4 mounts and cowlings. I've got to get going on cowlings and mounts for RV-6 as we have had so many requests by -6 builders. I assume that most of RV's being built now are -6's but we've had a surprising number of inquiries from builders asking if we would do an RV-8 engine/mount/cowling. Steve Beckham Powersport ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Dennis Jackson <denny(at)transport.com>
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
Tedd McHenry wrote: > > > Dennis Jackson writes: > > > > Try running the numbers using the weight for the 300 hp model or was > > that the one you were using. Think about 300 hp on the front end of the > > -8. Mmmmmmmmm yeah! > > Thought about that, but I'm inclined to agree with Van here: > you shouldn't oughtta be able to exceed Vne in level flight! > Still, it does make you think, doesn't it? > > Tedd McHenry > Surrey, BC So let's explore that a bit. What factors determine Vne and what could be done to expand the envelope by say 40 knots? The Rockets are pushing that now. What have they done to prevent flutter at the higher speeds? What other factors beside control surface flutter have to be considered? Please don't anybody tell Van we're discussing these things! ;>) DJ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz>
Subject: Re: RST Engineering
sprintmail.com!randbosgood(at)matronics.com wrote: > My kit has been done for 3 months and I need to > get it aligned. RST can not do the alignment "at this time" because > they > lost there technician. By alignment, I assume you mean calibration. There are 4 pots (variable resistors) on the board which adjust the automatic attenuation of the marker beacon signal and the amplitude of the COM1/2 signal needed to turn the AUX (music) volume down. One more I can't recall. I did the calibration myself, mainly because the cost to ship the unit back to the US wouldn't make it worthwhile. I bought and built (I was starting to enjoy this electronics stuff :-) a signal generator kit from the local Dick Smith Electronics (I'm sure Radio Shack or whoever in the US would sell the same kind of thing). Although RST says you need two signal generators, it's possible (but a little more difficult) to do it with just one. Frequency isn't critical -- anything audible (say 1kHz-5kHz) will do. I borrowed an oscilloscope from work for the calibration. You don't need an expensive high-quality 'scope; any cheap thing will do. You could probably borrow both these items from a local radio ham, or any reasonably-equipped high school. Alternatively, a good meter would be sufficient; you want to know the peak-to-peak amplitude of the signal going into and coming out of the circuit. Like the rest of RST's Testing procedure, it's no big deal if you know how to drive the equipment. > If you want a decent quality, low cost audio panel RST may be a good > choice. If you need it now and need service from RST you may want look > > elsewhere. I had hoped to by there marker beacon kit but am holding > off > till RST shows me they are able to meet all there customers needs and > not just the sale of the kit. People may want to hold off longer on the audio panel -- I suggested to Jim that a cut-down VFR panel (2 COMs, 1 AUX in (CD player), AUX out (Video camera, tape recorder, whatever), 2-place intercom, no cabin speaker) would find a niche in the homebuilt market, and he said they have plans to do that. I'd guess by the slow progress on their headset kits and Rick's comments that a new audio panel would be several months (maybe years) away though. Frank. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4Brown(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys)
John, you asked for an alternative to a boycott of Oshkosh? Try this: Take up a collection from us poor folks. Take out a full page advertisement in "Sport Aviaition" and state your case. Tell EAA exactly what you want that your are not getting from the organization along with a proposal of how this might be accomplished! It may not get published, But it will get their attention! ________________________________________________________________________________ deficiencies or complaints about the EAA: - EAA caters to the rich - exactly how they do this wasn't expounded upon - EAA devotes a lot of attention to the warbirds - The voting system via proxy is not fair - The Board and Officers of EAA are not responsive and do not represent us. - The EAA flight line policy invites ignorant people to trash our airplanes - The EAA ignores the grass roots homebuilder. The following is a summary of the proactive assertive steps and action plans being proposed to address the items listed above! - Resign from the EAA - Boycott Oshkosh - Don't take your aircraft to Oshkosh - Write or call the EAA and voice your concerns (I'm biased but this one might work) Gentlemen: I apologize for the use of the cyberspace but I believe if don't like what you're getting, you have to tell the affected parties what you do want and you have to offer a feasible alternative. I'm having a hard time understanding what you really want from the organization that they are not doing. What did the EAA do in the past that they don't do today (tell me about the good old days)? What would you do and what changes would you make to EAA if you were Tom Poberezny? What are the top three priority policies or services that need to be changed? What basic steps would you take to implement these changes? Tom Brown RV-4 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)idacom.hp.com>
Subject: Re: incredible BSFC!
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Frank van der Hulst writes: > > You're probably right... the .35 was from my vague memory. I did a quick > hunt round Greg Travis' engines site and couldn't find anything. Any > idea what figure an O-360 does give? How about a typical car engine or > Mazda rotary? According to Gregory Travis, these are typical numbers: carburetted aircraft engines .43 - .48 carburetted auto engines .48 - .60 injected aircraft engines .37 - .44 injected auto engines .40 - .48 Perhaps what you remembered was the .37 quoted for injected aircraft engines. Travis also quotes .39 to .43 for Lycomings specifically (the injected ones). Travis attributes the generally better BSFC of aircraft engines to the lower surface:volume ratio that results from a smaller number of larger cylinders (for a given displacement). As I recall, the Mazda rotary is in the low .5x range, but don't quote me on that. Tedd McHenry Surrey, BC ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Shirley Hobenshield <shobenshield(at)cmsd.bc.ca>
Subject: Re: Need a prop -- Any suggestions
> >aol.com!DkSJC(at)matronics.com wrote: >> >> >> I'm getting to the point where I need to aquire a prop for my RV-4. I'll >> eventually go to a constant speed when I go through the motor, but for >>now a >> fixed is more practical. >> > >> Dan >RV 4 N363G> > > Dan, Try Colin Walker of Surrey British Columbia, ( near Vancouver ) Phone # 604-581-9602 When the price is right and the performance is there, he may be your man. Ed Hobenshield, C-FXXG 42hrs S/N RV-6 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JimNolan(at)mail.kconline.com
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Subject: Oshkosh Fly-in
People! I didn't mean to sound all negitive about civilians being admitted to the showline at Oshkosh. I was just pointing out why some folks rope-off thier airplanes at aviation events. ( It's not silly.) My RV-4 is five years old and I haven't missed Oshkosh or Sun-N-Fun since it was completed. I've never had any trouble at these places yet. If it were'nt for EAA and EAA events where would we go on the weekends. Don Just call and I'll be up. What do you mean (OLD) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Frank van der Hulst" <frankv(at)pec.co.nz>
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
> >you shouldn't oughtta be able to exceed Vne in level flight! > >Still, it does make you think, doesn't it? > I kind of like being able to push Vne in a climb though. :-) It might make the RV-8 a hot aerobatic mount too. Especially if it could accelerate vertically :-) Frank. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Chris Hinch <chris(at)dcc.govt.nz>
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
Date: Aug 29, 1997
> > Dennis Jackson writes: > > > > > > Try running the numbers using the weight for the 300 hp model or was > > > that the one you were using. Think about 300 hp on the front end of the > > > -8. Mmmmmmmmm yeah! > > > > Thought about that, but I'm inclined to agree with Van here: > > you shouldn't oughtta be able to exceed Vne in level flight! > > Still, it does make you think, doesn't it? > > > > Tedd McHenry > > Surrey, BC Yeah, it makes you think, all right - "lemme see now, ahm gonna git me one of them 300 hp engines, then ahm gonna paint my RV-8 bright orange, ahm gonna call it Glamorous Glen... then ahm gonna get mah sorry rear end dropped out of a USAF bomber..." Seriously tho, in this purely hypothetical RV-8 installation, wouldn't the 300hp engine be derated down to abound the 200 hp mark to extend it's life? Chris "what was that booming sound?" Hinch chris(at)dcc.govt.nz ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JimNolan(at)mail.kconline.com
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Subject: Oshkosh Statistics
Dick Knapinski, I just read your reply to criticism of the EAA. I'm a Tech Counseler and there is something you could consider doing for me. Can you lower the price of admission to homebuilders for bringing thier airplanes to (thier) Fly-ins at Oshkosh and Sun-N-Fun. Also can you bring back the Button passes instead of the wristbands that most of (us) want for (our) fly-in. Notice that I didn't say a word about buying gas or getting a gas discount. If you don't want to know----don't ask. Jim Nolan N444JN ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne)
Subject: Re: incredible BSFC!
I'm skeptical - Is this from a drylab run or real tests of auto engines in airplanes? Is this something we can expect from real pilots in real airplanes? I didn't see any reference citations in Greg's pages. I've heard numbers like 0.37 - 0.39 for the Chevy V-6. My Debs continental is a 225 hp. At 7500 it would put out 75% times 225 or about 169 hp. Should burn 169 X 0.44 (at worst) / 6 or 12.38. Seems about right but I burn more for fear of burning expensive metal. Who's going to test the others? hal > According to Gregory Travis, these are typical numbers: > > carburetted aircraft engines .43 - .48 > carburetted auto engines .48 - .60 > > injected aircraft engines .37 - .44 > injected auto engines .40 - .48 > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: emcole <emcole(at)concentric.net>
Subject: Re: RST Engineering
Rick and Barbara Osgood wrote: > > > Warren/MK Bishop wrote: > > > > > > > Has anyone built/used the latest Audio Panel/Intercom--RST 564--from > > RST > > Engineering? > > > > Any comments appreciated. > > > > Warren > > RV-6 Engine cowling area > > > > Warren, I built one of the first RST-564 kits that RST shipped. The kit > is complete and of good quality. There were a few minor pc-layout > problems that have now been corrected by RST. My > "Biggest" complaint about RST is they are a small company and have > almost no resources. My kit has been done for 3 months and I need to > get it aligned. RST can not do the alignment "at this time" because they > lost there technician. > > If you want a decent quality, low cost audio panel RST may be a good > choice. If you need it now and need service from RST you may want look > elsewhere. I had hoped to by there marker beacon kit but am holding off > till RST shows me they are able to meet all there customers needs and > not just the sale of the kit. > > Rick > RV6A wings > Rick is corrrect-- I have a friend who has an older RST radio he needs repaired and was told the same thing. Their tech left and they can't predict when anything will be repaired. This was of early August. Ed Cole ________________________________________________________________________________
From: winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Subject: RV Book Survey
Please help. We are putting together a catalogue of books that are useful for RV builders. Would you please take a moment and list for us the 2-3 books or videos which you own and have found most interesting and beneficial in building, maintaining or flying your RV. Thanks for your help. to avoid congestion on the list, please send your responses directly to us at winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com Thanks again Andy Gold Winterland Publications ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Flyinghi(at)worldnet.att.net
Subject: painting
Date: Aug 28, 1997
can anyone offer any help concerning painting. I would like to paint my own RV-6A even though I have no experience. I know that sounds crazy but, I never built an airplane before this either. Any videos out there that would describe painting, techniques, etc. Also, a friend told me that an HVLP painter would work best. Can an HVLP gun be used with a standard compressor (25 gallon, 4.5 HP). Since this is my first note on the list, I eagerly await some great help. Charles Golden flyinghi(at)worldnet.att.net (409) 786-4270 RV-6A waiting on Belted air firewall forward kit GM V6 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Flyinghi(at)worldnet.att.net
Subject: Re: storing canopy
Date: Aug 28, 1997
I recently installed my canopy after 12 months of it standing on end in one of our extra rooms in the house. Went like a charm with no problems. Charles Golden finishing canopy installation RV-6A Waiting on delivery of Belted Air Chevy V-6 ---------- > From: juno.com!bstobbe(at)matronics.com > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: storing canopy > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 1997 7:21 PM > > > Listers, > > Due to the fact that I am running out of storage space for all these > airplane parts, I find that I must consider storing the canopy vertically > on its aft end. I tried it and it seems quite happy and relatively > stable sitting in this position, but I'm hesitant to leave it this way > due to all the horror stories about cracks, etc. > > Any words of wisdom out there as to why I really shouldn't do this, or > better yet, any "hey, don't worry I did that and didn't have any > problems..." > > Bruce Stobbe > RV-6 > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: "Mark D Hiatt" <OttoPilot_MSN(at)classic.msn.com>
Subject: Just wondering out loud
This may not be entirely accurate. I don't know how the Zoche folks' engine is set up, but a lot of people try to "baby" their Lycomings and Continentals and end up doing more harm than good. The published procedures really are the best way to operate an engine. Cessna used to build a geared 172 swinging a much bigger prop much slower. That was the idea behind the 175, or "Skylark". It was marginally faster and supposed to be more comfortable at cruise, with less vibration and noise than the short-club 172 all wound-out. But it felt strange to people, flying around at higher power settings the way the book recommended. Most flew them throttled-back like they were Skyhawks and most were disappointed with engine life and cruise speeds. You're not doing your average Lycoming/Continental any favors by throttling it back. I doubt if it will help a round diesel, either. Mark D Hiatt Visit us on MSN v2! OttoPilot_MSN@msn.com http://Forums.msn.com/Aviation Aviation Forum Manager, AvChat Mondays 10pm Eastern The Microsoft Network mic://Chat.msn.com/AvChat Paul Bilodeau posted: Besides that, throttling back would extend the supposed 2000 TBO... ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
Date-Warning: Date header was inserted by InfoAve.Net
From: GIBBONSR.FTC-I.NET(at)InfoAve.Net (RB Gibbons)
Subject: RE: Dave Clark ANR
Has anyone had experience with the Dave Clark ANR headsets? (H10-13X, I think). How well do they work, and how do they compare to other options? I've used an H10-20 headset for 10 years with no problems, but would like ANR. Thanks, Alan Carroll RV-8 #80177 (Wings) I've been using the 13X for about a year now. They attenuate the low frequencies such as engine and Prop noise but don't do as good a job on the high frequencies. They also add a small amount of high freq noise as a result of the electronics. I would suggest you try to borrow a set to try them. I like them, some of my friends don't. RB Gibbons RV-8 #80067 (Wings and tail complete.. moving to Tucson) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Dave Barnhart <barnhart(at)a.crl.com>
Subject: Re: Overvoltage Protection
> I decided to replace the Honda unit with a 60 amp alternator from B & C. > I have been contemplating the upgrade anyway...now I have a valid reason. I was impressed with the B&C Voltage Regulator too. It not only has OVP, but also has a low voltage warning light. Best Regards, Dave Barnhart rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB cowling ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "mcomeaux" <mcomeaux(at)cmc.net>
Subject: Unsubscribe list
Date: Aug 28, 1997
"Unsubscribe" ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 28, 1997
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: RST Engineering
> > Warren, I built one of the first RST-564 kits that RST shipped. > > The kit is complete and of good quality. There were a few minor > > pc-layout problems that have now been corrected by RST. My > > "Biggest" complaint about RST is they are a small company and have > > almost no resources. My kit has been done for 3 months and I need > > to get it aligned. RST can not do the alignment "at this time" > > because they lost there technician. > > > > If you want a decent quality, low cost audio panel RST may be a good > > choice. If you need it now and need service from RST you may want > > look elsewhere. I had hoped to by there marker beacon kit but am > > holding off till RST shows me they are able to meet all there > >customers needs and not just the sale of the kit. > > > > Rick > > RV6A wings > > > > Rick is corrrect-- > I have a friend who has an older RST radio he needs repaired and was > told the same thing. Their tech left and they can't predict when > anything will be repaired. This was of early August. > > Ed Cole > May I suggest you guys jump over to the *rec.aviation.homebuilt* NG and post these concerns, as Jim Weir of RST is there all the time, maybe it would lite a fire under him if he see these concerns posted on the NG. I did build the marker beacon serverl years ago and it worked great. Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS First flight July 14, 1989 :-) Hillsboro, OR jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Re: Sensenich and 0-320-E3D
<< > On my prop, we used 2 AN4 bolts, six large area washers and AN365 > nuts. Where does one put all these bolts and washers? I am sure that you don't drill a hole in your prop. >> I think that most reasonable people put them on the rear spinner bulkhead. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Btinn(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Re: pre-manufactured fuel cells
<< So, if someone out their has a working phone number for Carl (or > another tank manufacturer) could you send it to me. > > Thanks, > > Scott > RV-6 (ready to order wings) > Scott, Save your money. The tanks aren't any harder than the rest of the plane. Proseal is a little messy to work with, but no big deal. If you can build the leading edge assembly, you can build the tanks. It will be over before you know it. If you want any details, contact me off-list. Ed Cole RV6A N648RV >> Scott, I agree with Ed completely. I heard others talk about getting someone else to build their tanks and was somewhat apprehensive when I started mine, but it is really no more difficult than the leading edge section and you can use the money you save to buy another instrument, tool or toy. Just use your "painting clothes" and clean up before the stuff gets cured too well-within a couple of hours or less of your mixing time. It won't come out of your clothing or off your carpet so be careful there. The suggestion in the construction manual to do the job in about three sessions is a good one. I highly recommend it. Bob Tinnell RV-6A wings ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: "H. Sutphin" <hsutphin(at)magicnet.net>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Statistics
Jim, Seems I remember talking about the AMA(Academy of Model Aeronautics) that way, why is the EAA any different? A new organization would be hard to start. Why not shape it the way we want it. The same sound reasoning you gave me for keeping/staying with the AMA applys here as well. We can make the EAA work for us, if enough people voice their opinions and vote. Harold Jim Sears wrote: > > >How about starting a homebuilders section of the EAA,(snip)... > > Better yet, a new organization. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Luker, Michael G." <luker.michael(at)mayo.edu>
Subject: Oshkosh Statistics
Date: Aug 29, 1997
I have a friend who flies a Cozy. While at Oshkosh one of the non aviation tourists, a man about 65 years of age wacked the leading edge of this cozy with his lawn chair. Don't know the damages but the owner was awfully upset. > ---------- > From: > Hamilton,Thom[SMTP:so.xerox.com!Thom_Hamilton(at)matronics.com] > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 1997 11:39 AM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RE: RV-List: Oshkosh Statistics > > > > Randall Henderson wrote: > > >I attended OSH this year for the first time. I travelled there as > >co-pilot in an RV-6 (mine's STILL not done yet -- argh!), in a flight > of > >three RV's (2 -6s and a -4). When we arrived, the RV parking area > was > >full so we had to park in an adjacent area for the first couple of > days, > >then we moved to the RV area after some planes had left. > > > >I didn't notice any undue "gaper" activity around the planes, and as > far > >as I know there was no "tourist rash" in our group. > > The difference of perception here between those who did and did not > take great offense at the treatment of their planes may be related to > > composition of the planes. Literally, as anyone who is also on the > Cozy or Canard Aviator lists can tell you, the Canard drivers were > largely up in arms about the treatment of their planes at Osh. > Understand, I didn't go myself this year, but the traffic has been > very > heavy on both lists regarding the unkind treatment and numerous > reports of damage that the canard craft suffered. > > It may well be that metal airplanes stand up to a crowd better. (I'm > not gonna' TOUCH the holding up in flight question! I lost my > asbestos underwear.) So, maybe that's part of the difference of > opinions on how bad the crowds were this year. If I had only talked > to Canard people I think I would've been ready to boycott Osh until > the policy is changed, which many of them are planning to do. But > apparently the problems weren't universal outside that group. > > Methinks I am glad to be building (about to build) a metal airplane > anyway. Just a little more confidence. > > Thom Hamilton > thom_hamilton(at)so.xerox.com > "I'm not sure." ---- Werner Heisenberg > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Luker, Michael G." <luker.michael(at)mayo.edu>
Subject: Oshkosh Statistics
Date: Aug 29, 1997
wait untill your done, your views will change. I agree the RV's were in a great location this year, hopefully we can remain there. The Cozy builders that were upset, were also upset that we took there parking area. Since the RV's are the best selling airplanes on the market, we should be allowed to keep this area. In addition, maybe us RV builders and fliers could form an EAA oshkosh group that would patrol our airplanes. WIth everyone involved it would require veryl little time per person, and alittle bit more security for out planes? > ---------- > From: > edt.com!randall(at)matronics.com[SMTP:edt.com!randall(at)matronics.com] > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 1997 12:43 PM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oshkosh Statistics > > > Jim: > > You make some valid points. I suppose I should have qualified my > comments; I was mostly speaking to my experience at Oshkosh, which > included the favorable location of the RVs this year. Different > events > have different setups and audiences, and I agree that for example I'd > NEVER leave my plane unattended at Hillsboro Airshow for without ropes > around it (and maybe not even then!) And if the RV area at Oshkosh > did > in fact have a lot of people walking through, I agree that it would be > appropriate to rope off the planes. On the other hand, the situation > as > I saw it there seemed to be pretty much under control and in that case > it seems to me to be benefecial to be more open about things. > > I guess part of my reaction comes from people who get all uptight > about > EAA and say they won't go to Oshkosh, etc., based on people messing > with > their planes. I think there are solutions other than just staying > away, > and the there is more that EAA could do, like for example having > ticket > buyers read and sign some sort of etiquette agreement, and/or putting > said guidelines on the back of the entry tickets, and posting signs, > and > making frequent announcements, and training volunteers to watch out > for > people messing with planes and to intervene if necessary. But I also > think we could do a lot on our own if we just agreed among ourselves > to > keep a vigilant eye on each other's planes and intervene when called > for. > > And you are right, I have not finished my plane (I said that up > front). > But if you go back and read my message you will see that I was > relating > the reactions of the group I was with, which consisted of both > builders > and non-builders. > > Anyhow, I'm building my plane to fly and have fun with. I hope I > don't > get so uptight about keeping it in pristine condition that it keeps me > from going places and showing it off now and then. > > Randall > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
<19970828.143720.13758.0.RodWoodard(at)juno.com>
From: wstucklen1(at)juno.com (Frederic w Stucklen)
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Rod, Careful what you wish for! Some people get speeding tickets too....... Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV (Working on second RV-6A - Chevy Powered!) wstucklen1(at)juno.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Statistics
From: wstucklen1(at)juno.com (Frederic w Stucklen)
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Listers, I agree with the statement below. While I didn't go to Oshkosh this year, I have been to Sun 'N Fun the last four years. I have also given so many rides in N925RV that I'velost count. And yes, I do have scraped/scratched paint, but nothing that can't be easily re-done. I also wouldn't change a thing. When I look at those scratches, I see an investment in the future of aviation. NOTHING comes for free. Lets not shoot ourselves in the foot.... There' more to flying than our own personal pride...... Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV 965 Hours (in four years) and climbing (Working on second RV-6A - Chevy Powered!) wstucklen1(at)juno.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Overvoltage Protection
From: wstucklen1(at)juno.com (Frederic w Stucklen)
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Dave, Since I put my B&C 60 Amp Alt and reg in my RV, I've had a constant whine problem on the ADF. I've tried the big cap on the Alt (10,000 uF) and it's still there. Rerouted all the wires also. The ADF is the only radio effected...... Other than that, his design is great (but over priced). You can get the same system at a lower cost by buying a Nippon alt at your local alt shop and modifying it yourself. Then use his reg........ Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV (Working on second RV-6A - Chevy Powered!) wstucklen1(at)juno.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: REEVES322(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Re: Citation HVLP painting system
could you please explain the Seta a little more,,Email direct if you like, Im ready to buy a system and would like to know more about it. I asked the people at my paint shop, and they hadnt heard of it..thanks in advance..Bob ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: "JHTH " <JHTH(at)classic.msn.com>
Subject: RV Book Survey
Orndorff videos John Hall Wichita KS RV8-80227 finishing tail ---------- From: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com on behalf of rkymtnhi.com!winterland(at)matronics.com Sent: Thursday, August 28, 1997 10:30 PM Subject: RV-List: RV Book Survey Please help. We are putting together a catalogue of books that are useful for RV builders. Would you please take a moment and list for us the 2-3 books or videos which you own and have found most interesting and beneficial in building, maintaining or flying your RV. Thanks for your help. to avoid congestion on the list, please send your responses directly to us at winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com Thanks again Andy Gold Winterland Publications ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: Denny Harjehausen <retflygtiger(at)proaxis.com>
Subject: Citation HVLP painting system
> >I intially used the croix to paint my airplane, had nothing but orange >peel, when I switched to the SETA my problems were resolved. The Croix >is designed for a perticluar type of paint and is not a universal paint >gun for all paints. I've heard that if you really reduce the paint when >using the croix that it works better. (snip) I was under the impression from people like Tony Bingelis's articles that the tip size is what made most of the difference in the atomizing of the various densities of paint along with the heating of the paint. Larger nozzle openings for dense paint and the reverse for thinner types. Using thinner then recommended by the paint manufacture was not recommended to any large degree. If the above impression is not true, what would be the standard some poorer home builder's would look for in a gun to know we are get quality with reason? Obviously if some of us could afford to have it done we probably would do just that. I know it certainly is not the part of building I am looking forward to (other than it is done and I can go fly now). Have a good one! Denny, RV-6 (R)N641DH Fuselage-top side Lebanon, OR ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: chester razer <crazer(at)egyptian.net>
Subject: RMI Micro Encoder Help Needed
I need a little help from someone who has built and installed an RMI micro-encoder or who has a working knowledge of them. The last line of the first paragraph of page 5 in the installation manual states: "The strobe connection on pin 15 must be jumpered to ground (pin 14) if the transponder does not have an altitude enable line." What is an altitude enable line and what is the strobe connection (pin 15). I am connecting to a new KT76A transponder so should I jumper pin 15 and 14 or not? -- Chet Razer crazer(at)egyptian.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Aviatrz(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Re: Unsubscribe list
UNSUBSCIBE, THANK YOU ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: John Walsh <walsh(at)adra.com>
Subject: Oshkosh Statistics
First: To Bill Benedict and Dick Knapinski Please go out to the RV parking area at OSH and drive stakes into the ground proclaiming this soil to be the official RV parking area for all eternity. It was a great spot! 2nd I think some of the glass guys may not be happy because they were right up on the flightline. Throngs of people walked right through their planes to get to the flightline. Most of the people walking through the RV area were there to look at the RVs. 3rd While I agree with the proxy problem, I have to admit that there is not a whole lot that I STRONGLY feel must be changed about EAA. Overall, I think they are doing quite a good job. I do like the suggestion of FREE admission for anyone bringing a showplane to OSH. That would be a nice token of appreciation. I do think that a polite etiquette statement in signs posted prominently around the airplanes may help. I believe that many non pilots simply don't understand that it's bad to lean on an airplane or allow a child to walk across a fuel tank, etc.. John ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: John Walsh <walsh(at)adra.com>
Subject: Just wondering out loud
>You're not doing your average Lycoming/Continental any favors by throttling it >back. I doubt if it will help a round diesel, either. Mark, What do you base this on? There seems to be a body of evidence accumulating that indicates running these engines at 60-65% power does them a world of good. One example is the C-310 owned by Mike Bush. Turbo Continentals both making it to TBO with NO cylinder work. That is almost unheard of. John ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: Edward Cole <emcole(at)concentric.net>
Subject: Re: RST Engineering
Jerry Springer wrote: > > > > > Warren, I built one of the first RST-564 kits that RST shipped. > > > The kit is complete and of good quality. There were a few minor > > > pc-layout problems that have now been corrected by RST. My > > > "Biggest" complaint about RST is they are a small company and have > > > almost no resources. My kit has been done for 3 months and I need > > > to get it aligned. RST can not do the alignment "at this time" > > > because they lost there technician. > > > > > > If you want a decent quality, low cost audio panel RST may be a good > > > choice. If you need it now and need service from RST you may want > > > look elsewhere. I had hoped to by there marker beacon kit but am > > > holding off till RST shows me they are able to meet all there > > >customers needs and not just the sale of the kit. > > > > > > Rick > > > RV6A wings > > > > > > > Rick is corrrect-- > > I have a friend who has an older RST radio he needs repaired and was > > told the same thing. Their tech left and they can't predict when > > anything will be repaired. This was of early August. > > > > Ed Cole > > > > May I suggest you guys jump over to the *rec.aviation.homebuilt* NG > and post these concerns, as Jim Weir of RST is there all the time, > maybe it would lite a fire under him if he see these concerns posted > on the NG. I did build the marker beacon serverl years ago and it > worked great. > > Jerry Springer > > RV-6 N906GS First flight July 14, 1989 :-) Hillsboro, OR > jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com > > I would hope the Jim is aware of the problem since it is his people at his company passing out the bad news. Grass Valley is not the technical center of California, and he is probably having a difficult time recruiting. Ed Cole ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: Edward Cole <emcole(at)concentric.net>
Subject: RV4 Constant Speed Prop
Attenion RV4 flyers---- Can anyone who is flying an RV4 who converted from a fixed pitch prop to a constant speed prop please contact me off line with your experiences good or bad. Ed Cole emcole(at)concentric.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Ken_Hitchmough(at)magic.ca (Ken Hitchmough)
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Re: RMI Micro Encoder Help Needed
I need a little help from someone who has built and installed an RMI micro-encoder or who has a working knowledge of them. The last line of the first paragraph of page 5 in the installation manual states: "The strobe connection on pin 15 must be jumpered to ground (pin 14) if the transponder does not have an altitude enable line." Chet, I haven't built an RMI unit but I suspect that the transponder you have doesn't have a strobe line. Connecting the 14 to 15 on the encoder won't do any harm, all it does is enable the data from the encoder to the transponder permanently. If you're not sure, the transponder manual should tell you. Ken RV6A Flying ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: incredible BSFC!
Date: Aug 29, 1997
---------- > From: John T. Craig-Stearman <juno.com!tcraig-stearman(at)matronics.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: incredible BSFC! > Date: Thursday, August 28, 1997 2:52 PM > Craig-Stearman) > > I have to agree with Mark. The BSFC figures I have seen for a Lycoming > at cruise power are all in the low 0.4s, like 0.42 lb/hp hr. > > Regards, > Tom Craig-Stearman > tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com > RV-4 preparing to mount wings > > ><< A BSFC of .45 ain't wonderful either; IIRC Lycomings > > do about .35. >> Source: Avco Lycoming Operator's Manual O-320 ... Series Aircraft Engines p/n 60297-16 page 3-12 Economy Cruise 8.8 gph Applying the math, 8.8 gph = 0.47 lb/hp-hr using a density of 6.0 lbs/gal Dennis 6A fuselage in jig ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Re: Pro-Seal substitute from Spruce?
<< Please post the phone number for Seal-pack. >> Steve- Ever hear of the Yeller Pages? Using them prevents the reposting of such repetitive data as this to the list and the archive. The Yeller Pages are also linked from Van's Aircraft site. http://www.sound.net/~hartmann/yelrpage.htm Regards, -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: "Mark D Hiatt" <OttoPilot_MSN(at)classic.msn.com>
Subject: Just wondering out loud
My own observations, John, over twenty years. Sitting in and listening to mechanics and having engine builders come and talk to our EAA chapter (569). Walking around engines on stands and talking about why this is worn, why that is pitted, why those broke. Note that 65% power shows up in most POHs. Run one there frequently and give it time to warm-up and cook-off the moisture, change your oil and so on and you should make TBO and beyond (maybe). But the guys who visit the airport five or six times per year and only do a couple of touch-n-go's, who operate at the bottom of the green arcs only rarely and think they're saving money are fooling themselves. No full-throttle takeoffs, rarely build any heat into the engine before stopping it, etc. They may be saving gas, but I wouldn't bet on them getting to TBO. Again, I don't know how a diesel in general or a Zoche in particular works in this regard. But I can't imagine treating a 300hp engine like a 150hp engine would do it any good over the long haul. Mark D Hiatt Visit us on MSN v2! OttoPilot_MSN@msn.com http://Forums.msn.com/Aviation Aviation Forum Manager, AvChat Mondays 10pm Eastern The Microsoft Network mic://Chat.msn.com/AvChat -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com On Behalf Of John Walsh Sent: Friday, August 29, 1997 9:14 AM Subject: RE: RV-List: Just wondering out loud What do you base this on? There seems to be a body of evidence accumulating that indicates running these engines at 60-65% power does them a world of good. One example is the C-310 owned by Mike Bush. Turbo Continentals both making it to TBO with NO cylinder work. That is almost unheard of. John ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Dick Knapinski <dknapinski(at)eaa.org>
Subject: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys)
Date: Aug 29, 1997
charset="iso-8859-1" Michael: You bring some interesting ideas regarding Young Eagles, which I'll respond to off-list just for brevity sake here. I did, however, want to respond to the mistaken impression about warbirds fuel (a rumor that, like a woodtick, just refuses to die) ... Any showcase or air show pilot, regardless of aircraft classification, is eligible to receive fuel to replace any they used while flying in those events only. That's it. Not for flying to Oshkosh or back home. So, for instance, if one were fly a LongEZ in the showcase flying or (like Jim Roberts) in the air show, fuel would be replaced. Hope that helps! Best, Dick Knapinski EAA OSH > ---------- > From: Luker, Michael > G.[SMTP:mayo.edu!luker.michael(at)matronics.com] > Reply To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 1997 1:20 PM > To: 'rv-list(at)matronics.com' > Subject: RE: RV-List: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys) > > > > I've heard that the warbirds at oshkosh do not have to pay for there > fuel is this true? and if so who is paying for the fuel? Young > Eagles. > The EAA pushes the young eagles program but does not supprt it. I > would > like to see if an EAA member flies 10 hours worth of young eagles in a > year that he would get a free subcription to Sport Aviation. The > Young Eagles program is a great program but it is expensive! 10 hours > of flight time at 10 gallons an hour is $200.00 dollars, this would > give > EAA members some insentive to reach the 1,000,000 younge eagles deal. > WIth all the money that is being made how come there arent any grants > being offerd to the chapters to help support the building of a hanger > airplane? This year at oshkosh I was riding a bike with a fellow > who > was staying at a non EAA headquarters campsite, he was riding his bike > to the bike parking, and was turned around because he didn't have a > camp > Schuler bicycle sticker, kind of silly don't you think! > > > ---------- > > From: Dick Knapinski[SMTP:eaa.org!dknapinski(at)matronics.com] > > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 1997 10:28 AM > > To: 'rv-list(at)matronics.com' > > Cc: 'ammeterj(at)seanet.com'; 'gila(at)flash.net' > > Subject: RE: RV-List: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys) > > > > > > Gil, John, et al: > > > > Caught the string of postings regarding Oshkosh. I appreciate your > > comments, even if they're not always bouquets thrown our way. > > > > I think one comment that said the Board really doesn't care about > the > > homebuilders or other groups within EAA is mistaken. The Board is > > certainly open to ideas from any part of the membership. That's not > > to > > say that every idea will be adopted, but I can say that all are > > considered at a Board or administrative level. > > To that end, what programs or activities do you think would be > > valuable > > for homebuilders to erase the impression stated by some that the > > organization "doesn't care"? I see there are some Technical > > Counselors > > checking in here. Is there anything that could be added to that > > program, for instance, to improve or add depth to it? > > Conversely, are there programs that should be eliminated because it > > doesn't serve the purpose of the membership or a significant portion > > of > > the membership? > > > > Remember, please, that EAA's mission statement as always stated that > > membership is open to all regardless of their aviation interest. > > There > > are programs for each one of those facets of aviation, just as there > > are > > and have been for homebuilders. If there's something more than > could > > be > > done to assist homebuilders, we're always interested in hearing > about > > it. > > > > I didn't mean to clutter up the forum, but did want to address a few > > of > > the points brought up. In the interest of keeping the RV forum > > relatively uncluttered with non-building items, feel free to forward > > e-mail to me off-list if you prefer. > > > > Best, > > Dick Knapinski > > EAA OSH > > > > > ---------- > > > From: John Ammeter[SMTP:seanet.com!ammeterj(at)matronics.com] > > > Reply To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 1997 11:23 PM > > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys) > > > > > > > > > Let me add that I, also, gave my proxy to Jim Wier. I'm the Vice > > Pres > > > of > > > Chapter 26 in Seattle and one of the tech counselors. The EAA is > a > > > good > > > organization but it suffers from a lack of grassroots support. > > > Homebuilders > > > and experimenters built the EAA but it has become so big that the > > > Board of > > > Directors doesn't really care about us anymore. > > > > > > The UPS workers went on strike and accomplished virtually > everything > > > they > > > wanted. I know many of us bitched because we couldn't get our > parts > > > but the > > > company buckled under. Maybe, just maybe, if every homebuilder > > > boycotted > > > Oshkosh the EAA management would realize that we, the > homebuilders, > > > are the > > > EAA. I know we all wanted to see over 250 RV's at Oshkosh this > year > > > but > > > wouldn't it have been more noticeable if NO RV's showed up and it > > > became > > > public WHY we stayed away?? > > > > > > The only way that the EAA will change is if they have to change. > As > > > it is > > > now, they have the proxy's to 'elect' (what a joke!!!) whoever > they > > > want to > > > the board. > > > > > > Any other ideas?? I'm open to whatever we can do that can be > > > effective. > > > > > > John Ammeter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Many folks (including myself) assigned their voting > > > >proxies to Jim Wier this year, but somehow they never were > recorded > > > at the > > > >Annual Meeting at Oshkosh. I have even written to Tom P. to > > attempt > > > to > > > >find out how voting proxies are assigned, but got no reply. > > > > When an Organization has an Annual Meeting, and one person > > has > > > 10's > > > >of thousands of proxies, and the other directors have proxies for > a > > > few > > > >hundred at the most, the meeting becomes somewhat useless! > > > > At present, there is absolutely no incentive to listen. > > > > > > > > ... bitch mode OFF ... > > > > > > > > .... Gil Alexander > > > > > > > >Volunteer EAA Technical Counselor, Chapter #40 > > > >... wishing EAA had more homebuilding emphasis ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >------------------------------------------------------- > > > >mailto:gila(at)flash.net > > > >Gil Alexander, > > > >Los Angeles, CA > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Re: Unsubscribe list
From: ebundy(at)juno.com (Ed Bundy)
Please READ the information posted at the end of EVERY message. Thank you. > >UNSUBSCIBE, >THANK YOU > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne)
Subject: Re: painting
Hi Charles Golden and all, > > can anyone offer any help concerning painting. I would like to paint my > own RV-6A even though I have no experience. I know that sounds crazy but, > I never built an airplane before this either. Doesn't sound crazy to me, I'm planning on it. I have limited spray gun experience and then with the now obsolete methods. It is difficult to become a master but not to become as good as some shops. You can learn to spray paint in a day at most. Most of that reading! The hard part is prep and understanding that everything done incorrectly will be highly visible. I believe that it is 90% intellectual. Spray hideous color combos in weird arrangements and no gun skill can make it look good. Practice and knowledge will help avoid runs, orange peel etc. You can find orange peel on brand new cars! >Also, a friend told me that an > HVLP painter would work best. Can an HVLP gun be used with a standard > compressor (25 gallon, 4.5 HP). > Jim Boyd, a rep from Alumigrip Paint Co, spoke to our local EAA and he said that a compressor half the size you have will work with a Binks HVLP gun. Binks is the Leica (Rolls Royce - King Air etc) of paint spray equipment - the best. Gun is about $400 but probably is to resell when you are done - maybe to me? As I see it, a 1hp compressor would work - if you have a *BIG* tank. Or we can paint the right wing, wait for the compressor, paint the left wing ... Unlike an automobile where you might like to keep a "wet edge" we could paint our toys in pieces. It also seems to me that the HVLP, which uses less air per amount of paint, should work anywhere a regular gun would. Now tell us about your engine installation! Will it come with instructions? Warranty? What is the TBO for the belt? Do they suggest a TBO for the engine? What are they asking for the whole thing? What all is included? Will you install it? What are the latest performance figures such as top speed (TAS) they've seen and fuel consumption ? Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- Auto engines on MWF, Lycomings on TTS halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: Dennis Jackson <denny(at)transport.com>
Subject: Re: RMI Micro Encoder Help Needed
chester razer wrote: > > > I need a little help from someone who has built and installed an RMI > micro-encoder or who has a working knowledge of them. The last line of > the first paragraph of page 5 in the installation manual states: "The > strobe connection on pin 15 must be jumpered to ground (pin 14) if the > transponder does not have an altitude enable line." > > What is an altitude enable line and what is the strobe connection (pin > 15). > > I am connecting to a new KT76A transponder so should I jumper pin 15 and > 14 or not? > -- > Chet Razer > crazer(at)egyptian.net > Chet: Ron Mowrer at RMI will answer any questions you have about your instruments. He is very helpful and responsive. You can talk to him on the phone (307-864-9300) or e-mail at ronmow(at)rkymtn.com. DJ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: Dennis Jackson <denny(at)transport.com>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys)
Now Tom, THIS is good. Clear analysis, positive tone, a definite course of action. If the dissatisfied individuals who have posted to this group don't have any better ideas to satisfy the *majority* of the EAA members, and they can't live with the decisions and policies of the organization, then perhaps it is time to move on. It really isn't very productive to whine and snivvle about how bad things are to everyone except the ones who can do something about it. General statements about how bad things are just tend to put everyone in a bad frame of mind and get them to thinking that maybe someone somewhere is screwing them. Things can always be better, they can always be a lot worse. Be glad for what you've got and work to make things better, but realize that what is better for you might not be for someone else. We all have to live together and put up with each other's differences. When I voiced concerns I had about the safety of my plane at the convention, I recieved an immediate personal reply from Dick Knapinski at headquarters, not just a form letter. If that isn't being responsive to a completely insignificant member then I don't know what is. I'm thankful for the EAA both national and local and all the people who have put a lot of sweat into making it what it is, most of them freely volunteering their time and resources. Come on people, let's not just focus on the negative here. We've got a great organization that is vitally concerned and involved with maintaining our flying privileges against many pressures from many groups public and private. Not a perfect organization perhaps, but name one that is. BTW if you ever do find a perfect group, don't join it. You'll screw it up. ;) Dennis the Menace RV-4 N296DJ First Flight 11/11/95 210 hours aol.com!RV4Brown(at)matronics.com wrote: > > > John, > you asked for an alternative to a boycott of Oshkosh? > > Try this: Take up a collection from us poor folks. Take out a full page > advertisement in "Sport Aviaition" and state your case. Tell EAA exactly what > you want that your are not getting from the organization along with a > proposal of how this might be accomplished! It may not get published, But it > will get their attention! > > >From the responses over the last three days I have summarized the following > deficiencies or complaints about the EAA: > > - EAA caters to the rich - exactly how they do this wasn't expounded upon > - EAA devotes a lot of attention to the warbirds > - The voting system via proxy is not fair > - The Board and Officers of EAA are not responsive and do not represent us. > - The EAA flight line policy invites ignorant people to trash our airplanes > - The EAA ignores the grass roots homebuilder. > > The following is a summary of the proactive assertive steps and action plans > being proposed to address the items listed above! > > - Resign from the EAA > - Boycott Oshkosh > - Don't take your aircraft to Oshkosh > - Write or call the EAA and voice your concerns (I'm biased but this one > might work) > > Gentlemen: > I apologize for the use of the cyberspace but I believe if don't like > what you're getting, you have to tell the affected parties what you do want > and you have to offer a feasible alternative. I'm having a hard time > understanding what you really want from the organization that they are not > doing. What did the EAA do in the past that they don't do today (tell me > about the good old days)? What would you do and what changes would you make > to EAA if you were Tom Poberezny? What are the top three priority policies or > services that need to be changed? What basic steps would you take to > implement these changes? > > Tom Brown RV-4 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David Moore"<dmoore8(at)tuelectric.com>
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Re: Overvoltage Protection
ccm.fm.intel.com!Allen_Duberstein(at)matronics.com on 08/27/97 10:15:00 AM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RV-List: Overvoltage Protection Allen wrote: Subject: Overvoltage Protection A recent experience leads me to suggest to everyone on the list that they incorporate over voltage protection in their alternator charging circuit. I believe production aircraft must have some sort of OVP. Without going down a rat hole because I used this example, I think this is a very valid requirement. OVP seems to add about $100 to the system cost. My panel cost is near $10K. Inflight smoke adds greatly to under garment cost! It is true, certified airplanes do have overvoltage protection. It is inexpensive and easy to install on any experimental too. Bob Nuckolls at AeroElectric Connection has a crowbar overvoltage device available for about $30.00. You need a circuit breaker for your alternator field, but probably already have this. It hooks up with two leads, is resettable, and works reliably. It is very cheap insurance against destruction of expensive avionics or worse (ie, cockpit fire). ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: Ernesto Sanchez <40106(at)utech.net>
Subject: Re: Overvoltage Protection
Frederic w Stucklen wrote: > You can get the same system at a lower cost by buying a Nippon alt at > your local alt shop and modifying it yourself. Then use his reg........ > How do you modify the alternator?? Ernesto Sanchez es12043(at)utech.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: MikeT(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Re: Pro-Seal substitute from Spruce?
The head mechanic at the local FBO suggested I use the pre measured tubes of sealant. They used 2, 6 oz tubes to seal around the edges of the 3 back windows on one of their 172's and had a little left over. He also recommended ProSeal C20 for all of the RV tank faying surface seals and then B2 for the fillet seals. That is also what the big airplanes (Citation, Boeing etc) do in their tanks. Mike Talley building RV-6 flaps ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: Craig Hiers <CRAIG-RV-4.@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Statistics
Luker, Michael G. wrote: > In addition, maybe us RV builders > and fliers could form an EAA oshkosh group that would patrol our > airplanes. WIth everyone involved it would require veryl little time > per person, and alittle bit more security for out planes? > > > ---------- Ahhhhhhh the voice of reason!!!!!! This is the best idea anyone has come up with yet. My rv-4 will be there in 98 and I think an RV neighborhood watch would be our best bet. I'll even bring a cattle prod, 5-6 jolts with that sucker an they will never touch a plane agian. That may be a little extreme, but if someone wacked the plane I just poured 4 years of my life into with a lawn chair on purpose I would go nuts. I'll volunteer my time as the RV-COP with a smile. Craig Hiers RV-4 N143CH My address for the next week will be Cabo San Lucas, where I will catching marlin and having drinks with little umbrella's in them. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: Charlie & Tupper England <england(at)vicksburg.com>
Subject: Slobovia Outernational Open House
We'd like to invite our fellow RVers to the annual open house at N4375J's home, Slobovia Outernational, on October 11, 1997. We are located near Jackson, MS, about 6 mi west of the JAN vor. The field officially closes from ~1:00pm to 4:00pm for an airshow, featuring the North American Team of T-6's (Oshkosh fame), Andy McCain flying a clip-wing Taylorcraft, and whoever else shows up with a low level waiver & is competent to fly safely. There will be a hangar dance with a (live) band Saturday night after the air show. There are 3 Globe Swift owners on the field, and this is an official Swift flyin event. These guys think that the Swift is the best flying plane ever built. While they may be right about production aircraft, we'd like to show them the better homebuilt alternative. e-mail if you'd like more info. Charlie ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Darrell L. Anderson" <d.l.anderson(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Oshkosh Statistics
Date: Aug 29, 1997
I think there are solutions other than just staying away, and the there is more that EAA could do, like for example having ticket buyers read and sign some sort of etiquette agreement, and/or putting said guidelines on the back of the entry tickets, and posting signs, and making frequent announcements, and training volunteers to watch out for people messing with planes and to intervene if necessary. But I also think we could do a lot on our own if we just agreed among ourselves to keep a vigilant eye on each other's planes and intervene when called for. I agree with the above, but.... Do you think that having ticket buyers sign a written agreement, posting signs around aircraft, or on the back of tickets will mean that people will actually READ those notices? For example, you may have noticed that number of RV-Listers still cannot read or understand the notice at the bottom of every posting to: (some answered threads have 2 or 3 copies of Matt's how-to in the quoted text!) 2. To unsubscribe, you send the mail to "rv-list-request(at)matronics.com" **NOT** to rv-list(at)matronics.com. Today there were 2 more requests to the list to unsubscribe. At least they didn't spell it "unscribe" and expect the automated system to respond. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Doug Rozendaal" <DougR(at)netins.net>
Subject: Re: auto engines (was cam oilers)
Date: Aug 28, 1997
---------- > From: Mike Wills <nosc.mil!willsm(at)matronics.com> > Doug, > > I think we are giving the auto engines way too much credit > >here. I know of no one that has run an auto engine in > >anything for anywhere near 2000 hours.I just don't think we are going to > >see an auto conversion that will meet the Hp to weight ratio of a lycoming > >with durability. > > I agree that nobody has yet proven that this is possible, but just because > it hasnt yet been proven, doesnt mean its impossible. I also agree that > expecting 1 hp per cubic inch at the rpms typically used in auto conversions > is unreallistic. However there are liquid cooled auto engines out there that > have comparable power to weight ratios to Lyc. My research into this subject > seems to indicate that the most common failure modes for auto conversions > these days (not including VW's) are related to support systems and not the > basic engine itself. Stuff like PSRU failures, problems with cooling system > design, improper setup/use/understanding of efi and electronic ignition > systems, etc...Not to dismiss these as non problems because a failure of any > of these can make things go quiet, but these problems should be solvable by > proper engineering and application. I am in agreement we should continue to solve these engineering problems, but they are solved with $$$'s. That leads us back to the volume problem, if we could sell 100,000's each we could make them cheaper. > > If we pulled 180hp out of a 350 Chev like we do an 0-360 > >Lycoming we could make it last, And we could pull 300 horse out of a 360 > >Lycoming with a reduction unit on it, and a 1000 hour TBO(or less). > > > > Horsepower is a function of rpm (assuming normally aspirated, non-nitrous > injected). If you spun a Lyc 0-360 fast enough to generate 300 hp I bet you > would measure TBO in minutes, not hours. The engine is designed to make > power at prop rpms (large displacement packed into few cylinders usually > means low rpm torque). Large reciprocating assembly at high rpm dont go > together well...I wouldnt want to be standing nearby! > I was speaking specifically of a geared, supercharged or turbo charged variant, I fly a P-Navaho with a 435hp , 540 cu in Lycoming, It has a 1200 hr TBO and seldom makes it. If you do the math theory would suggest that a 287 hp 360 would be possible, however I would not want one, and certianly not on a single engine Airplane ;-) > >I agree with Louis, the lycomings are pretty good, We have two problems > >TBO and $$$$ > > I also agree that the Lycoming is a good engine, purpose built, and with > many years of refinement behind it. But if you simply cant afford it, it > doesnt matter how good it is because you arent going to be able to own one. > If you are realistic about your expectations performance wise, and you can > live with a shorter/unknown TBO (longest I know of is a Mazda 13B operated > in a autogyro for 1100+ hours @ 7000+ RPM), The most promising auto conversion I have seen are the lower Hp options VW, Subaru, Mazda. The Toyota aircraft engine would be nice to see, but I'll bet the price for that is in LyCont country. > and you can do a lot of the work > yourself to keep cost down, an auto engine can be a viable alternative. TBO > is not such a big deal for most auto engines since overhaul cost is > typically less than the cost of 2 Lyc cylinders. > I still think the primary problem with cost is the volume is too low. I'll bet if you called Superior Air Parts Chapter 11 or not and orders 20,000 O-360 engines they could solve all their engineering problems and build it for a price with in the ballpark of an auto conversion including radiators, and reductions. > > > >To reduce the costs, that is simple too, If Lycoming were selling tens of > >thousands of engines like the auto makers do they would be much cheaper > >too. P.S. go to your local Chev dealer and get a price on a new corvette > >engine in a box... > > > >Tailwinds, > >Doug Rozendaal > >dougr(at)netins.net > >www.petroblend.com/dougr > > > > I havent priced a Corvette engine in a box from Chevy recently, but I would > be willing to bet that it is quite a bit cheaper than the $18K+ that you > would pay Van's for a new Lyc. Kind of ironic that my last hotrod was a > Datsun 260Z with a tuned port injected Chevy 383 that I assembled myself > because I couldnt afford the late model Corvette that I would liked to have had. > ZZ-4 350 cu in high performance engine, 355 hp @ 5500 rpm List price $6200 no radiator, fuel system, prop reduction, etc, etc, etc, > I enjoy this auto engine debate and welcome responses/differing views, on > or off list. I hope my long winded response here is taken as a different > point of view and not a criticism of any of Doug's comments. None taken, I enjoy it as well, I agree that the Ly-Conts leave much to be desired, but if it is single engine, IFR at night, I'll take them over any auto conversion I have seen so far. That doesn't mean we should keep working on cost saving alternatives, That's why we call them experimental! Doug Rozendaal > Mike Wills > RV-4 (wings) > willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Flyinghi(at)worldnet.att.net
Subject: Re: RST Engineering
Date: Aug 28, 1997
I finished one up last weekend and sent it back to RST on Monday to have it calibrated. You can call me to discuss at 409 786-4270. It is relatively easy if you follow the directions carefully but you do need a good set of eyes to identify small parts. You will also need to be somewhat proficient at soldering as the points are relatively small. This is my second unit and the first several years ago worked very well. It did take about 20 hours to build. ---------- > From: Warren/MK Bishop <nponline.net!wemkbish(at)matronics.com> > To: RV List > Subject: RV-List: RST Engineering > Date: Thursday, August 28, 1997 2:24 AM > > > Has anyone built/used the latest Audio Panel/Intercom--RST 564--from RST > Engineering? > > Any comments appreciated. > > Warren > RV-6 Engine cowling area > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)idacom.hp.com>
Subject: Re: auto engines (was cam oilers)
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Just a comment on this question of the cost of auto engine conversions. I don't think there's any doubt that economy of scale is one of, if not the, determining factor in the cost difference between off-the-shelf auto engines and off-the-shelf aero engines. Any engine built for a specific, demanding purpose in low volumes will be expensive, no matter who builds it or what the basic design is. Just look at the cost of marine engines or auto racing engines. But, for people interested in auto engine conversions, all that is moot. Homebuilders build planes because they like to, and because they can have something a lot closer to what they want if they build it themselves than if they buy it from a factory. The exact same is true of auto engine conversions. There's nothing rational about the choice of sport plane a person builds. Is an aerobatic plane more rational than a STOL plane? Is a STOL more rational than a cross-country plane? It all depends on what you're interested in. If someone really wants a rotary in his plane, he's going to have to build it himself. (Or buy it from someone who's developing a firewall-forward package--which will, as many have pointed out, cost close to what a Lycoming costs.) Likewise for water cooling. Those choices are equally as rational (or not) as the choice to build your own airplane in the first place. Tedd McHenry Surrey, BC ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne)
Subject: What does the EAA do? Provoked by Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys)
Denny wrote: > > Now Tom, THIS is good. Clear analysis, positive tone, a definite course > of action. I suspect we all want a positive course of action... > It really isn't very productive to whine and snivvle about how bad.... Mustn't knock the complainers too hard as the first step in making changes in our not yet perfect world is to recognize that there are problems. Does the EAA have a "mission statement" or words to that effect? What is its purpose? Isn't it to promote flying for fun? That seems to be what they are doing, anyway. Warbirds and jets bring people with some interest to the show, where they see other ordinary humans who have created planes with their hands in garages and even living rooms. They can see - even get instruction in construction methods while rubbing shoulders with real live builders and aviators. What can the EAA do for us builders? For those who have completed and flown, probably not much. These people can already do anything! Their airplane proves it. These builders have been apprentices or learners. Now it is their turn to be mentors. The "graduate" builders can now encourage and teach the neophytes. They do this to some extent already by showing off their works of art. Could we figure out a way to do it more? At Watsonville, they gave those who flew in a special pin on ribbon labled so everyone could see who had that status. Maybe what many builders want is more recognition. Maybe we feel lost in that all aviation shuffle. Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- Auto engines on MWF, Lycomings on TTS halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JimNolan(at)mail.kconline.com
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Oshkosh Statistics
Dick Knapinski, Thanks for the reply.You're right. There! I said it. (it hurts). I'm EAA all the way, anyone that knows me, knows that. I'll be there with bells on, always have, always will. Makes me proud to know those with a say-so are monitoring this channel and care enough to respond. Better stop, I'm beginning to hear a big sucking sound. Jim Nolan N444JN ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: emcole <emcole(at)concentric.net>
Subject: Re: Overvoltage Protection
David Moore wrote: > > > ccm.fm.intel.com!Allen_Duberstein(at)matronics.com on 08/27/97 10:15:00 AM > > Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com > > To: RV-list(at)matronics.com > cc: (bcc: David Moore/CPSES/Texas Utilities) > Subject: RV-List: Overvoltage Protection > > > Allen wrote: > > Subject: Overvoltage Protection > A recent experience leads me to suggest to everyone on the list that they > incorporate over voltage protection in their alternator charging circuit. > > I believe production aircraft must have some sort of OVP. Without going > down a rat hole because I used this example, I think this is a very valid > requirement. OVP seems to add about $100 to the system cost. My panel > cost is near $10K. Inflight smoke adds greatly to under garment cost! > > It is true, certified airplanes do have overvoltage protection. It is > inexpensive and easy to install on any experimental too. Bob Nuckolls at > AeroElectric Connection has a crowbar overvoltage device available for > about $30.00. You need a circuit breaker for your alternator field, but > probably already have this. It hooks up with two leads, is resettable, and > works reliably. It is very cheap insurance against destruction of > expensive avionics or worse (ie, cockpit fire). > Isn't this what Bob Knuckols has been telling us all along? Ed Cole ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne)
Subject: Other Engine Alternatives - don't bad mouth
I said: >If a new Lycoming 180 for my RV6A could be had for say $12000, you wouldn't > hear another peep out of me. Rob Acker wrote: > A fresh rebuild O-360A1A, with new crankshaft, can be had for $13000 (at > least I was quoted that 3 months ago). > This isn't new is it. Add $6000 for a core charge? I knew that :-) Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- Auto engines on MWF, Lycomings on TTS halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Statistics
<34074C77.1B5F(at)worldnet.att.net>
From: gasobek(at)juno.com (Gary A. Sobek)
Back in 1986 or 1987 Kent (Rocky) Rockwell started exactly what you suggest. He used POLICE do NOT CROSS barricaded tape between RV's. Jim Ayers may have been there when this was done. Gary >Luker, Michael G. wrote: >> In addition, maybe us RV builders >> and fliers could form an EAA oshkosh group that would patrol our >> airplanes. WIth everyone involved it would require veryl little >time per person, and alittle bit more security for out planes? >> >> > ---------- > > >Ahhhhhhh the voice of reason!!!!!! >This is the best idea anyone has come up with yet. >My rv-4 will be there in 98 and I think an RV neighborhood >watch would be our best bet. >I'll volunteer my time as the RV-COP with a smile. > >Craig Hiers >RV-4 N143CH ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr(at)netins.net>
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Statistics
Date: Jan 28, 1980
I did the same thing this year at OSH. I ran tape from the aileron around the tail to the other aileron. It keeps people from climbing on the wings and flaps, but they can still look in the cockpit from in front of the wing. Worked great for me. you can buy a several thousand ft roll for not much $$$$. May be the EAA should issue 100 ft to each a/c when you register? Tailwinds, N240 the pink panther Doug Rozendaal dougr(at)netins.net www.petroblend.com/dougr ---------- > From: Gary A. Sobek <juno.com!gasobek(at)matronics.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oshkosh Statistics > Date: Friday, August 29, 1997 5:47 PM > > > Back in 1986 or 1987 Kent (Rocky) Rockwell started exactly what you > suggest. He used POLICE do NOT CROSS barricaded tape between RV's. Jim > Ayers may have been there when this was done. > > Gary > > >Luker, Michael G. wrote: > >> In addition, maybe us RV builders > >> and fliers could form an EAA oshkosh group that would patrol our > >> airplanes. WIth everyone involved it would require veryl little > >time per person, and alittle bit more security for out planes? > >> > >> > ---------- > > > > > >Ahhhhhhh the voice of reason!!!!!! > >This is the best idea anyone has come up with yet. > >My rv-4 will be there in 98 and I think an RV neighborhood > >watch would be our best bet. > >I'll volunteer my time as the RV-COP with a smile. > > > >Craig Hiers > >RV-4 N143CH > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RMille6453(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 30, 1997
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
Hi Ted! I was just as excited about the Zoche engine as you are, when I left Oshkosh--------- in 1990. At that time, certification was "nearly complete" and it would be available "soon". I'm not holding my breath. Good luck in your quest for an engine. Rob Miller RV8 wing #2 Fuse OTW ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 30, 1997
From: Curt Reimer <Curt_Reimer(at)mbnet.mb.ca>
Subject: Re: RV Book Survey
JHTH wrote: > > > Orndorff videos > > John Hall > Wichita KS > RV8-80227 > finishing tail > > ---------- > From: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com on behalf of > rkymtnhi.com!winterland(at)matronics.com > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 1997 10:30 PM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: RV Book Survey > > > Please help. > > We are putting together a catalogue of books that are useful for RV > builders. > > Would you please take a moment and list for us the 2-3 books or > videos which you own and have found most interesting and beneficial in > building, maintaining or flying your RV. > > Thanks for your help. > > to avoid congestion on the list, please send your responses directly to > us at > winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com > > Thanks again > Andy Gold > Winterland Publications Sky Ranch Engineering Manual THe Tony Bingelis series If there are any others out there, I'd sure like to know about them! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ShelbyRV6A(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 30, 1997
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
In a message dated 8/30/97 2:44:29 PM, you wrote: <> I was reading my GA News(?) last night and seemed like two of the research projects, I am not sure who funded them were planning to use the Zoche diesel engine. It seems like at least some folks are hoping this thing will come to fruition. As far as a RV application, I would think there would have to be a total redisign because of the weight. With at least three diesels in development, I would imagine that diesel will play at least a moderate role in future airplanes. I for one would love to have a diesel. Shelby in Nashville. 325lb. IO-360 Pondering 175lb Zoche TurboDiesel ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 22, 1997
From: lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott)
Subject: (no subject)
please subscribe me. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 21, 1997
From: lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott)
Subject: (no subject)
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
From: lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott)
Subject: mail
Hello, Matte, I haven't been getting any mail from the list in over a week. Do you know which end the problem is on? I have been getting mail from other sources. Thanks. Michael ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Cafgef(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 30, 1997
Subject: Re: Pro-Seal substitute from Spruce?
Just a side comment on Proseal. It can be stored for a couple of days if you freeze it. The chemists rule of thumb is that a chemical reaction rate ( speed of reaction) will double for every 10 degrees Celsius (18 F) rise in temperature and halve for every drop of 10 degrees C. (18F). So if you can get into a freezer as soon as you can at -20 F(from 70F), that works out to be a slow down of 32 times what's left on the working life of that batch of Proseal. That should give you a couple of days to set up the next Proseal project. A couple of experiments will tell you how long it takes to thaw and start curing again. That's for those of you who like to make messy experiments. Gene Francis cafgef(at)aol.com Glad that I'm finished with Proseal( I hope) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 29, 1997
Subject: Re: auto engines (was cam oilers)
From: tcastella(at)juno.com (Anthony J Castellano)
I have been flying the Sonerai 2L that I built (including 2180 cc VW engine) for about 440 hrs. I don't have many original parts in that engine. It has gone through more than one set of cylinders, and several sets of heads (valve problems). The most serious problems were a broken crankcase and a broken crankshaft. Fortunately I was within gliding distance of an airport when both of these occured. The point I would like to make, is that one of the most important parts of an engine installation is the prop shaft/thrust bearing mechanism. Auto engines (particularly the VW) do not have a proper thrust bearing. In the case of the VW, the thrust bearing is at the rear of the engine so the crankshaft is being stretched, and to compound the problem, the forward main bearing is not designed to take the beating it gets from the gyroscopic forces of the prop. This guarantees a broken crank and or case. By the way, the crank that broke was a new magnafluxed forged Porsche crank. As a result, I am going to install a Lycoming O-360 on my RV-6. Tony Castellano tcastella(at)juno.com Hopewell Junction, NY RV-6 (fuselage now out of jig) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 31, 1997
From: "W. Tom Glover" <tglovebox(at)bc.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
aol.com!ShelbyRV6A(at)matronics.com wrote: > > > > 325lb. IO-360 Pondering 175lb Zoche TurboDiesel > >Uh-huh... I'm just wondering how one is going to get the Zoche round motor stuck on an RV-anything high enough for the prop to clear the ground without cancelling forward vision! I thought they gave up looking through cylinders with the Stearman. You'd need reeely long gangly-looking gear to keep the prop outa the asphalt, otherwise, like one of them Yak-thingies. Round motors are (likely) going to be installed on aircraft specifically designed for round motors....I had to edit this line, because I have seen with mine own beady eyes a Russian radial on a Helio Courier, and it looked VERY impressive. But Helios take off, fly and land in a 3-point attitude anyway (except for the trike, which teeters around on some of that gangly-looking hardware), so there's obviously no prop clearance problem. .....and I never lie. Hey, you lucky 1997 OSH goers, was there any sign of the 200 HP inverted V-4 Diesel that was static-displayed on a Velocity (or similar plastic ilk) in 1995? It appeared to be one of those exciting but underfunded follies that show up then unfortunately flutter away without fanfare. It looked like a good show. I've got a brochure for it tucked away, and a letter from one of the proprietors explaining how the partnership had come to ruin. And nothing more. My attention is on the Renault. It's real, it's running (evidently), it's flat (giving a high crank placement), and Renault is BIG (albeit French and thus subject to French-like corporate decision-making. Say, I just read that Reims is gonna build some French Cessnas. You don't think.... Nah! Some day I'll lament about the 9 (maybe 11) cylinder air-cooled big fat round diesel engine made by Guiberson(?), used by Air Canada, that was sold out of our Socialist Government's abandoned Transportation Museum near Vancouver. (Sniff.) Celebrated too much private transportation, like cars and planes and trucks, you know, instead of proletariat public mass transportation like buses and trains.... but I digress.... Realistically, however, currently, the proven pudding is Lycoming. Say what you like, the maximum RV return on investment (reliability safety and resale considered), for now, will be with a Lycoming engine. Salutations, and good night! Tom (the rumormonger) Glover tglovebox(at)bc.sympatico.ca P.S. Whatever came of the Roller Camshaft mod that somebody was working on for Lycs??????? ( Not only Rockers, but Cam and Lifters.) Ah, but these engines are SOOOOO crude! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 31, 1997
From: Rick and Barbara Osgood <randbosgood(at)sprintmail.com>
Subject: H2AD Info needed
If any builders have installed the H2AD engine on a RV6 or 6A and would like to share some of the trials and tribulations please e-mail me off list with phone number and best time to call. Thanks Rick Osgood RV6A ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 31, 1997
From: spjohnsn(at)ix.netcom.com (Stephen Paul Johnson)
Subject: Fuel Tank Fabrication
Hi all, I had a conversation with Mr Paul Irbek whose name was mentioned on the list recently as an expert fuel tank builder. He is local, so I thought I'd check out the possibility of getting help on the sealing process. He's booked up now, but he gave me some hints regarding fabrication I thought I'd pass along. Two I haven't seen before are: 1. Recheck the flanges on all of the ribs to make sure they are absolutely 90 degrees to the web after fluting. 2. Install the stiffeners backwards so the rivets are visible. I will call Van's on number 2 unless there are responses on the list that it's a well known technique, since it does represent a deviation from the plans. Steve Johnson RV-8 #80121 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 31, 1997
From: "Larry Bowen" <lcbowen(at)classic.msn.com>
Subject: Garmin GPS 90 - info request
I'm not sure if this model GPS is a handheld or not, but generally speaking, can handheld models talk to the autopilot system like other panel-mounted nav systems do? If not, do handheld owners consider this a major drawback or does the price savings make up for it? Larry lcbowen(at)msn.com RV-8 Dreamer; OSH RV-8 $30k free ride recipient... -----Original Message----- I have my GPS-90 mounted to my RV-6 panel and it worked extremely well on our Oshkosh trip from Oregon. I would like to know how many other GPS-90 users are on the list. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Subject: Re: Magneto Help
<19970830.190115.15134.0.tcastella(at)juno.com>
From: tcastella(at)juno.com (Anthony J Castellano)
I have a low time O360-A1F6D Lycoming engine that I intend to install on my RV-6. This engine has a single drive dual Bendix magneto which has a history of problems, so I want to use a different type of ignition system. I plan to use a single Slick magneto with an impulse coupler in place of the dual Bendix and an Electroair electronic ignition for the second set of plugs. I spoke to Jeff Rose of Electoair at Oshkosh who thought this was a good way to go, and he gave me the model numbers of some magnetos that would work for me. These are: Bendix model LM 1209 (I0-349305-1 not sure about this ) Slick model 4370 non impulse Slick model 4373 impulse Jeff is not 100% sure about the slick model numbers. Can anyone tell me if these model numbers are OK. Thank you, Tony Castellano tcastella(at)juno.com Hopewell Junction, NY RV-6 (fuselage now out of jig) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Ken Harrill <KHarrill(at)OSA.STATE.SC.US>
Subject: Holes in Spar?
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Before the final closing of my wings, I would like to mount my strobe power packs (Aeroflash individual powerpacks). The best location seems to be on the spar just inboard of the tip rib. Is it permissible to drill four #19 holes in the spar at this location? Would Van's approve? Any opinions will be greatly appreciated. Ken Harrill RV - 6, closing up both wings ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Glen Watson" <gtwatson(at)students.wisc.edu>
Subject: RV-4 wing spar question
Date: Aug 31, 1997
I'm currenlty working on the main spar for my -4. The plans show a cut out through the spar web and spar web doubler at the spar root. I find no mention of this in the construction manual. Is this something that should be cut right now or is it done at a later time? Glen Watson ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 31, 1997
From: Scott Johnson <rvgasj(at)popmail.mcs.net>
Subject: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
I have an RV6A with Vans baffling and a new Lycoming 0-360. This spring when temperatures were still around 40 degrees F., my oil temp. was running 180 degrees. However, this summer, when it gets 85 degrees out, its running about 210 degrees. I have re-checked my baffles for leaks, and my oil cooler is mounted in the same position as a cherokee 180 with a 3" Hose going to it from the cowl inlet. Is this in the acceptable range ? What are you guys getting ? Also, does anybody know where I can get those cylinder temperature stick ons that warn if the temp. goes over 475 degrees ? Wondering what to build next ..... ( almost started to build a sailboat, I wish Van would make a super motorglider kit or something !!!! ) rvgasj(at)mcs.com Scott Johnson Chicago ________________________________________________________________________________
From: N230LF(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Subject: Subcribe
Subcribe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 31, 1997
From: "Mark S. Malone" <mmalone(at)dialus.com>
Subject: Aux Power Cover
While at Oshkosh I noticed a RV6 with a auxillary power outlet (cigarette lighter) with a No Smoking Cover. Does anyone know where I can get one? I don't like the lighter but I do need the power outlet for hand held devices. Thanks for the help. RV6A , Working on panel Mark Malon e 85MM ________________________________________________________________________________
From: winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
Scott Johnson wrote: > > > I have an RV6A with Vans baffling and a new Lycoming 0-360. However, this summer, when it gets 85 degrees out, its running about 210 degrees. I have re-checked my baffles for leaks, and my oil cooler is mounted in the same position as a cherokee 180 with a 3" Hose > going to it from the cowl inlet. Is this in the acceptable range ? What > are you guys getting ? I am having the same problem you are with high oil temp readings. i've seen as high as 240 one day on a climb out. however my CHT and EGT temps are at more normal levels. I spoke to Bill at Vans about this. He said the first thing to do was to calibrate the oil temp gauge by removing the sender, sticking it in a can of boiling water and then observing the actual reading on the gauge. He said that some of the cheaper gauges, even the Isspro gauges that Van's sells are notoriously inaccurate. If you boil water you then have an absolute 212 degree (depending on altitude) standard reading. I'll then make a mark on my gauge at that point and judge readings from there. I haven't done this yet, but its definitely on the short list. I will post the results when i have them. Andy Gold ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
From: ebundy(at)juno.com (Ed Bundy)
>I have an RV6A with Vans baffling and a new Lycoming 0-360. This >spring when temperatures were still around 40 degrees F., my oil temp. was >running 180 degrees. However, this summer, when it gets 85 degrees out, its >running about 210 degrees. I have re-checked my baffles for leaks, >and my oil cooler is mounted in the same position as a cherokee 180 with a 3" >Hose going to it from the cowl inlet. Is this in the acceptable range ? I'd suggest that you check your sender/gauge to make sure they are accurate. I have a 3" hose coming off the back of the baffle to a cooler on the firewall. I have a problem keeping my temps UP. I even installed a remote cooler block-off plate. The only time I need it open is when ground temps are over about 80F. When ground temps are 40 or below, I needed to block off about 3/4 of the inlet in addition to the remote block-off. I usually try to keep my temps between 180-190. When I first started flying it last winter, I was only able to get about 150 until I blocked off most of the inlet. Ed Bundy RV6A - first flight 11/20/96 ebundy(at)juno.com - Eagle, ID ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Flyinghi(at)worldnet.att.net
Subject: Engine Vacuum
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Can anyone offer help with a vacuum installation for instruments. The engine is a Belted Air, firewall forward Chevy V-6 package but has no vacuum pump. The standard 211cc is typically installed on the cam of the lycoming if I remember correctly so belt driving it off the crank would increase the rpm significantly, I suppose. Is the pump capable of this or is there a better method? I would hate to hang a big horn off the side of a beautiful RV-6A to supply vacuum, so I was hoping for some great ideas from a large group. Any information can be posted or directed to me at flyinghi(at)worldnet.att.com. Or leave me a number to call and a time and I will contact you. On mains awaiting Chevy. N609CG ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Elevator trim tab attachment
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Greetings fellow RVers, I'm just about done with the left elevator on my -8, but...just HOW IN THE WIDE, WIDE WORLD OF SPORTS does a guy get the piano hinge riveted to the elevator after it's rivetted to the tab?!?! (In best Slim Pickin's voice). The plans call for typical AN426 solid shanks here..and I just can't see how to get a squeezer in there..or, a buck bar without smashing the hinge pin to oblivion while setting. So, I've boldly ventured forth..and probably screwed up in the process..and drilled them out for CS4-4 flush head blind rivets. These are 1/8" rivets, as you all know, and the 2d edge distance is just barely maintained. So, is it considered acceptable to use blind rivets in this case? They will be under shear load while in flight. My FAA acceptable methods book says NO..do NOT use hollow shaft blind rivets in load bearing members..but they do not mention whether going up one size will negate the strength loss issue. HELP!! Any thoughts? Am I doomed to redo the elevator?....if I hear a resounding "YES, redo the whole thing"...the screams you will no doubt hear will be mine... Thanks folks! Brian Denk RV-8 #379 elevators ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: jorear(at)mari.net
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Subject: Typical Newbie Question
Hello Listeners: Just opened the box for my 6A empenage and finished with the inventory. Having been an RC modeler for years, I can easily see that I am going to enjoy myself very much. Just gotta get used to working with aluminum instead of balsawood! As I expected, I will need the help of the list. Here I haven't even deburred a thing, and I already have a question. The kit provides a bundle of trim sheet aluminum that measures about 12"x3" with 3 sheets of what I will call a "thick" sheet, and 3 sheets of a "thinner" sheet AL. How much of this is available for me to get used to dimpling/riviting etc? I know that some of it can be used to line up ribs with spars, and to make temporary rib supports as in the Orendorf tapes, but I just don't want to waste any of it in case I need it later on in the construction process. Looking forward to getting started and to "meeting" all of you on the list. Hopefully I will be able to return good advice to the list in the future. Thanks! Jeff Orear RV 6A Empenage inventory done jorear(at)mari.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Subject: Re: Magneto Help
<< Jeff is not 100% sure about the Slick model numbers. Can anyone tell me if these model numbers are OK. >> Why not contact Unison? They make the Slick stuff and are listed in the Yeller Pages at http://www.sound.net/~hartmann/yelrpage.htm -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
<< Also, does anybody know where I can get those cylinder temperature stick ons that warn if the temp. goes over 475 degrees ? >> Many welding supply shops sell these Tempil brand stickers. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 31, 1997
From: Louis Willig <larywil(at)op.net>
Subject: RV-4 Flap Lever
I'm having a difficult time grasping and positioning the RV-4 flap lever. Other than installing electric flaps, what modifications have others made to make flap application easier? Lou Willig ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Subject: Re: Aux Power Cover
<< While at Oshkosh I noticed a RV6 with a auxillary power outlet (cigarette lighter) with a No Smoking Cover. >> In California they are sold in Grand Auto stores in a choice of about four different colors. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 31, 1997
From: chester razer <crazer(at)egyptian.net>
Subject: Re: Typical Newbie Question
Jeff, in regards to the bundle of trim sheet aluminum, just use it for whatever you need and don't worry about using it up. If your project is like mine you will have a lot of scrap left over (messed up parts) and you will have ordered several sizes of sheet aluminum from Wicks or some other supplier for building, rebuilding , etc. You will also find that while Vans kits are very complete you will probably be constantly ordering hardware, tools, accessories and lots of other stuff to complete your project. -- Chet Razer crazer(at)egyptian.net ________________________________________________________________________________ server @sac5-132.calweb.com ip 207.173.128.132 account=wcw
From: "Bill Wootton" <wcw(at)calweb.com>
Subject: Re: Typical Newbie Question
Date: Aug 31, 1997
This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01BCB644.3C494F40 Well Jeff, Good question. If you read through all of the empenage instructions you will little reference to needing any of it! The only places I used any of it was connecting the Control horn on the rudder, and two strips to attach the glass to the bottom of the rudder. You have started out right by asking questions!! This won't be your last! Best of luck and have a great time Bill Wootton RV6 wings ---------- > From: mari.net!jorear(at)matronics.com > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: Typical Newbie Question > Date: Sunday, August 31, 1997 6:11 PM > > > Hello Listeners: > > Just opened the box for my 6A empenage and finished with the > inventory. Having been an RC modeler for years, I can easily see that > I am going to enjoy myself very much. Just gotta get used to working > with aluminum instead of balsawood! > > As I expected, I will need the help of the list. Here I haven't > even deburred a thing, and I already have a question. The kit provides > a bundle of trim sheet aluminum that measures about 12"x3" with 3 sheets > of what I will call a "thick" sheet, and 3 sheets of a "thinner" sheet > AL. How much of this is available for me to get used to > dimpling/riviting etc? I know that some of it can be used to line up > ribs with spars, and to make temporary rib supports as in the Orendorf > tapes, but I just don't want to waste any of it in case I need it later > on in the construction process. > > Looking forward to getting started and to "meeting" all of you on > the list. Hopefully I will be able to return good advice to the list in > the future. > > Thanks! > > Jeff Orear > RV 6A Empenage inventory done > jorear(at)mari.net > > > > > ------=_NextPart_000_01BCB644.3C494F40
Well Jeff,
Good question. If = you read through all of the empenage instructions you will little = reference to needing any of it! The only places I used any of it = was connecting the Control horn on the rudder, and two strips to attach = the glass to the bottom of the rudder.
You have started out right by = asking questions!! This won't be your last!

Best of luck = and have a great time
Bill Wootton
RV6 = wings ---------- > From: mari.net!jorear(at)matronics.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Typical Newbie = Question
> Date: Sunday, August 31, 1997 6:11 PM
>
> = --> RV-List message posted by: jorear(at)mari.net
> =
> Hello Listeners:
>
> = Just opened the box for my 6A empenage and = finished with the
> inventory. Having been an RC modeler for = years, I can easily see that
> I am going to enjoy myself very = much. Just gotta get used to working
> with aluminum instead = of balsawood!
>
> As I = expected, I will need the help of the list. Here I haven't
> = even deburred a thing, and I already have a question. The kit = provides
> a bundle of trim sheet aluminum that measures about = 12"x3" with 3 sheets
> of what I will call a = "thick" sheet, and 3 sheets of a "thinner" = sheet
> AL. How much of this is available for me to get used = to
> dimpling/riviting etc? I know that some of it can be = used to line up
> ribs with spars, and to make temporary rib = supports as in the Orendorf
> tapes, but I just don't want to = waste any of it in case I need it later
> on in the construction = process.
>
> Looking = forward to getting started and to "meeting" all of you = on
> the list. Hopefully I will be able to return good = advice to the list in
> the future.
>
> = Thanks!
>
> Jeff = Orear
> RV 6A Empenage inventory done
> jorear(at)mari.net
> =
>
>
>
>
> +-- = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; &nb= sp; &nbs= p; = ; --+
> = | Visit the Matronics & RV-List Web Sites at = http://www.matronics.com> |
> | = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; --- = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; |
>= color=3D"#0000FF">rv-list-request(at)matronics.com" |
> | & put the word = "[un]subscribe" in the *body*. No other text or subject. = |
> | = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; --- = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; |
>= | Please = |
> +-- = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; &nb= sp; &nbs= p; = ; --+
------=_NextPart_000_01BCB644.3C494F40-- ________________________________________________________________________________ server @sac5-132.calweb.com ip 207.173.128.132 account=wcw
From: "Bill Wootton" <wcw(at)calweb.com>
Subject: Re: Elevator trim tab attachment
Date: Aug 31, 1997
This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01BCB645.B9C93060 Pull The Pin out! Then you can use a squeezer. now I would use -4 flush rivets (solid AL) ---------- > From: Brian Denk <hotmail.com!akroguy(at)matronics.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: Elevator trim tab attachment > Date: Sunday, August 31, 1997 5:33 PM > > > Greetings fellow RVers, > > I'm just about done with the left elevator on my -8, but...just HOW IN > THE WIDE, WIDE WORLD OF SPORTS does a guy get the piano hinge riveted to > the elevator after it's rivetted to the tab?!?! (In best Slim Pickin's > voice). The plans call for typical AN426 solid shanks here..and I just > can't see how to get a squeezer in there..or, a buck bar without > smashing the hinge pin to oblivion while setting. > > So, I've boldly ventured forth..and probably screwed up in the > process..and drilled them out for CS4-4 flush head blind rivets. These > are 1/8" rivets, as you all know, and the 2d edge distance is just > barely maintained. So, is it considered acceptable to use blind rivets > in this case? They will be under shear load while in flight. My FAA > acceptable methods book says NO..do NOT use hollow shaft blind rivets in > load bearing members..but they do not mention whether going up one size > will negate the strength loss issue. > > HELP!! Any thoughts? Am I doomed to redo the elevator?....if I hear a > resounding "YES, redo the whole thing"...the screams you will no doubt > hear will be mine... > > Thanks folks! > > Brian Denk > RV-8 #379 > elevators > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > > > ------=_NextPart_000_01BCB645.B9C93060
Pull The Pin out! Then you can = use a squeezer.

now I would use -4 flush rivets (solid = AL) ---------- > From: Brian Denk <hotmail.com!akroguy(at)matronics.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Elevator trim tab = attachment
> Date: Sunday, August 31, 1997 5:33 PM
> =
> --> RV-List message posted by: "Brian Denk" = <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
>
> Greetings fellow RVers,
> =
> I'm just about done with the left elevator on my -8, but...just = HOW IN
> THE WIDE, WIDE WORLD OF SPORTS does a guy get the piano = hinge riveted to
> the elevator after it's rivetted to the = tab?!?! (In best Slim Pickin's
> voice). The plans call for = typical AN426 solid shanks here..and I just
> can't see how to = get a squeezer in there..or, a buck bar without
> smashing the = hinge pin to oblivion while setting.
>
> So, I've = boldly ventured forth..and probably screwed up in the
> = process..and drilled them out for CS4-4 flush head blind rivets. = These
> are 1/8" rivets, as you all know, and the 2d = edge distance is just
> barely maintained. So, is it considered = acceptable to use blind rivets
> in this case? They will be under = shear load while in flight. My FAA
> acceptable methods = book says NO..do NOT use hollow shaft blind rivets in
> load = bearing members..but they do not mention whether going up one size =
> will negate the strength loss issue.
>
> HELP!! = Any thoughts? Am I doomed to redo the elevator?....if I hear a
> = resounding "YES, redo the whole thing"...the screams you will = no doubt
> hear will be mine...
>
> Thanks = folks!
>
> Brian Denk
> RV-8 #379
> = elevators
>
> = ______________________________________________________
> Get Your = Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com>
>
>
>
> +-- = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; &nb= sp; &nbs= p; = ; --+
> = | Visit the Matronics & RV-List Web Sites at = http://www.matronics.com> |
> | = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; --- = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; |
>= color=3D"#0000FF">rv-list-request(at)matronics.com" |
> | & put the word = "[un]subscribe" in the *body*. No other text or subject. = |
> | = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; --- = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; |
>= | Please = |
> +-- = &= nbsp; &n= bsp; &nb= sp; &nbs= p; = ; --+
------=_NextPart_000_01BCB645.B9C93060-- ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Wings on!
From: tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com (John T. Craig-Stearman)
Date: Aug 31, 1997
'Listers, I just came back from the hangar where I installed my wings this evening. It went much more smoothly than I imagined it would. I can't get this perma-grin off my face. It looks like an airplane now! Regards, Tom Craig-Stearman tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com RV-4 wings mounted ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: RV-4 wing spar question
From: tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com (John T. Craig-Stearman)
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Glen, Yes, go ahead and cut out the center now. This opening allows you to install the control column later. It is a tight fit, so don't skimp on the dimensions. Check the "Sixteen Years of the RVator" articles on the subject. Regards, Tom Craig-Stearman tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com RV-4 Wings installed! >I'm currenlty working on the main spar for my -4. The plans show a >cut out >through the spar web and spar web doubler at the spar root. I find no >mention of this in the construction manual. Is this something that >should >be cut right now or is it done at a later time? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "tompfing" <tompfing(at)brainerd.net>
Subject: Harmon Rocket
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Anyone know John Harmon's address or phone number? Email me off-list Thanks, Thomas Pfingsten tompfing(at)brainerd.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Trim tab attachment..and my humility
Date: Aug 31, 1997
Of COURSE! Take the hinge pin out..and squeeze as usual. I outta quit while I'm ahead..and stick to RC models....NOT! Thanks Bill! NOw, one more silly question. What's the best way to secure the pin afterwards? A slight crimp of the aluminum on each end? Or, should a new, longer pin be used and then folded back somewhat? I know this question has been posed here before..but I can't recall the answer. If it wasn't for this forum...I would not be nearly as far along on this project as I am now...MUCH thanks to those who have helped me...and those who will offer sage advice in the future.... PEACEFUL skies and soft arrivals to all.... Brian Denk "red-faced but continuing on" RV-8 #379 finishing tail components, wing kit ordered. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "jacquelyn eastburn" <jimnjax(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Elevator trim tab attachment
Date: Aug 31, 1997
brian, remove the pin and separate the hinges. cleco half to the elevator and cleco the other half to the trim tab. check that the two halves "mate" together. rivet the one half to the trim and the other half to the elevator then reinsert the piano wire. there ya got it.. hinged trim.. jimnjax(at)worldnet.att.net Hillsboro Oregon RV - 8 Ser. No. 80079 ---------- > From: Brian Denk <hotmail.com!akroguy(at)matronics.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: Elevator trim tab attachment > Date: Sunday, August 31, 1997 5:33 PM > > > Greetings fellow RVers, > > I'm just about done with the left elevator on my -8, but...just HOW IN > THE WIDE, WIDE WORLD OF SPORTS does a guy get the piano hinge riveted to > the elevator after it's rivetted to the tab?!?! (In best Slim Pickin's > voice). > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 31, 1997
From: Gil Alexander <gila(at)flash.net>
Subject: Re: Artificial Horizons
*** sent privately *** Brian, I was on vacation in June, but don't remember a follow-up. Was there a follow-up?? ... thanks ... Gil Alexander >Hi there > >A few days ago I posted a question about surplus military 28 volt electric >A.H's for approx $200 (excl posting and local taxes). Bob N. replied that >I should check out whether it is not an AC (as opposed to DC) instrument: >as usual he is right. They are AC. I'm investigating appropriate power >supplies, and have received a couple of replies from the list in this >regard. > >I have asked the supplier to give me a couple of photo's and details of the >A.H's for me to post to this list. > >I'm due to see a military avionics engineer this coming weekend. > >Hang in there for a couple of days, and I will post all the info as soon as > >I have it to hand. > >Kind regards > >Brian Hitchings >South Africa >RV6A : Wings > > ------------------------------------------------------- mailto:gila(at)flash.net Gil Alexander, Los Angeles, CA ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 31, 1997
From: Ernesto Sanchez <40106(at)utech.net>
Subject: Re: Engine Vacuum
worldnet.att.net!Flyinghi(at)matronics.com wrote: > Can anyone offer help with a vacuum installation for instruments. The > engine is a Belted Air, firewall forward Chevy V-6 package but has no > vacuum pump. I've heard of smog pumps being used with good results. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: George McNutt <GMcNutt(at)compuserve.com>
Subject: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
"I have an RV6A with Vans baffling and a new Lycoming 0-360. This spring when temperatures were still around 40 degrees F., my oil temp. was runni= ng 180 degrees. However, this summer, when it gets 85 degrees out, its running about 210 degrees. I have re-checked my baffles for leaks, and m= y oil cooler is mounted in the same position as a cherokee 180 with a 3" Ho= se going to it from the cowl inlet." Lycoming Operators Manual for 0-360 page 3-13 shows: 1) Ambient air temp above 80F - Oil INLET temp- desired 180F max 245F 2) " " " 30 to 90F - Oil INLET temp- desired 180F max 245F 3) Engine oil temp should not be below 140F during continuous operation. Sounds to me like your oil temps are a little high but well within limits= =2E = Years ago, in a Piper Owners Magazine, I read about a rare cause of high oil temperatures that can occur on some coolers. Depending on oil cooler inlet and outlet locations (bottom corners) internal construction, (no standpipe to top) and how the cooler was initially filled with oil. It is possible to trap a pocket of air in the top half of some oil coolers so that their cooling capacity is greatly reduced. = George McNutt. 6A, Left elev, 0-320 staying cool in corner of garage. = Langley, B.C. = ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: William Costello <bcos(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Trim tab attachment..and my humility
Brian Denk wrote: > <> NOw, one > more silly question. What's the best way to secure the pin afterwards? A > slight crimp of the aluminum on each end? Or, should a new, longer pin > be used and then folded back somewhat? I know this question has been > posed here before..but I can't recall the answer. > <>> > Brian Denk "red-faced but continuing on" > RV-8 #379 I hate to do something that can't be easily undone or taken apart. The advantage of going to Oshkosh every year for the last 12 or so is that you can see how hundreds have done it. I like either getting a longer pin and bending the inside end at an angle then into a loop and anchoring it with a screw into a nutplate on the inside face of the elevtor -or- carefully drilling about a 1/32 hole thru the hinge and hinge pin and safety wiring it. I have seen lots of planes using both methods. Best regards, Bill Costello -- Bill Costello | bcos(at)ix.netcom.com | Building RV-6 | Reserv N97WC Cell Tech Ind Dist SBGA 800-325-7544 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Tom Martin <fairlea(at)execulink.com>
Subject: Re: Engine Vacuum
> > I would hate to hang a big horn off the side of >a beautiful RV-6A to supply vacuum, so I was hoping for some great ideas >from a large group. > >On mains awaiting Chevy. >N609CG I am seriously thinking of using a small 2 inch horn mounted on the belly in the engine outlet air. There is already turbulence there and the heat might keep it from freezing. There was an article about an RV-4 in Sport Aviation that had done this. I have had a vacum pump failure and am told to expect one every 500 hours, not very reliable. The pump is heavy as well. Any thoughts out there? Tom Martin RV-4 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Tom Martin <fairlea(at)execulink.com>
Subject: Re: RV-4 wing spar question
> >I'm currenlty working on the main spar for my -4. The plans show a cut out >through the spar web and spar web doubler at the spar root. I find no >mention of this in the construction manual. Is this something that should >be cut right now or is it done at a later time? > >Glen Watson > I would do it now as it is much easier before you rivet. This cutout is for your control stick tube. There has been a revision on the cut out size make sure you make it big enough. Tom Martin RV-4 > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RICKRV6(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Subject: Re: Aux Power Cover
Mark, Radio Shack sell one that isn't intended to be mounted in a panel. I used one in my six and stored it underneath the fuel selector valve with enough wire to place the outlet on the passenger seat to power a portable CD player. Rick McBride rickrv6(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott)
Subject: Re: Garmin GPS 90 - info request
I just saw a device in trade a plane that will couple a handheld gps to an autopilot without the need for a dg. If I can find it again I will put it on the list. ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Overvoltage Protection
<34071B0F.F1E(at)utech.net>
From: wstucklen1(at)juno.com (Frederic w Stucklen)
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Ernesto, Then comcept is to rewire the rotating field (ie, amature) so that one side is grounded and the other side returns to the regulator. The internal regulator PCB is disabled by cutting the PCB foil to achieve this end solution, and adding a ground to the other side of the field. This is called a "B" circuit. Your local alternator shop could probably do the modification for you if you didn't feel comfortable about it. The disadvantage of doing this yourself, is that you will have an automotive quality (ie, tolerences) alternator. B & C does select parts that have closer tolerences. Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV (Working on second RV-6A - Chevy Powered!) wstucklen1(at)juno.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Engine Vacuum
From: wstucklen1(at)juno.com (Frederic w Stucklen)
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Tom, I have 967 hrs on my -6A on the original vacuum pump. I fly IFR and do have a standby system. Now that I've said this, i should expect it to fail!!!! Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV (Working on second RV-6A - Chevy Powered!) wstucklen1(at)juno.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John Devlin" <jdevlin(at)americus.net>
Subject: Rivet Tape
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Hello Listers, I stumbled across some 3M Magic Tape while flush riveting my wing control surfaces. This tape works great for holding flush rivets in place while riveting. It peels off after riveting leaving little, if any, residue. It is far superior to even the best grade masking tape and equal to the special purpose tape sold by Avery. It is available at Walmart and is sold as "3M Magic Tape." It costs about a dollar per 3/4 inch roll. Hope this helps. Best regards, John RV-6A, skinning wings ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: "Patrick E. Kelley" <patk(at)mail.ic.net>
Subject: Re: Elevator trim tab attachment
Brian Denk wrote: > > Greetings fellow RVers, > > I'm just about done with the left elevator on my -8, but...just HOW IN > THE WIDE, WIDE WORLD OF SPORTS does a guy get the piano hinge riveted to > the elevator after it's rivetted to the tab?!?! (In best Slim Pickin's > voice). The plans call for typical AN426 solid shanks here..and I just > can't see how to get a squeezer in there..or, a buck bar without > smashing the hinge pin to oblivion while setting. You will hate yourself when you hear the answer, but I had the same problem and had to stare at the plans for awhile until the obvious hit me. The hinge has been drilled to the elevator with the trim tab in place, and clecoed. Now, remove the hinge pin and rivet the hinge half that is still clecoed to the elevator. I used a squeezer. Reassemble the hinge and quit beating your head on the wall. Like I said, I too considered folding the tab back to do the riveting and came up with the same question. Happens to us all. PatK - RV-6A - Wings still not complete; had a small accident at Sturgis Bike Week. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Subject: Re: Garmin GPS 90 - info request
> I'm not sure if this model GPS is a handheld or not, but generally speaking, > can handheld models talk to the autopilot system like other panel-mounted nav > systems do? If not, do handheld owners consider this a major drawback or does > the price savings make up for it? A handheld's data stream can be used to drive an autopilot if a converter is used. The Navaid devices autopilot has a "smart coupler II" converter built in ($150 option), which takes the GPS data stream (NMEA 0183) from my handheld Garmin 195 and converts the signal to analog left/right signals such as are produced by a traditional VOR. So far, I think it's a slick system. The Navaid Devices autopilot will track VOR, GPS course, or GPS heading. Mine is all hooked up, except for final pushrod connection and some servo mounting screws. Tests using the GPS in the simulator mode were successful (don't forget to enable the GPS' data output port). I believe the smart coupler is available from Navaid Devices as a stand alone unit if you already have an autopilot. Tim ------------------------------------ Tim Lewis N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023 San Antonio TX timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or timrv6a(at)iname.com ------------------------------------ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Glenn & Judi <glenn(at)chocolatetruffles.com>
Subject: Air Vents
Hi, I am ready to position the airvent scoops on the skin of my RV-6 project (New style rudder system). The instructions are very vague about where to position these. Any suggestions? -Glenn Gordon -- MZ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Subject: Re: Garmin GPS 90 - info request
<> Try Porcine Associates listed in the Yeller Pages. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: "r.acker" <r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Other Engine Alternatives - don't bad mouth
>This isn't new is it. Add $6000 for a core charge? >I knew that :-) Negative on the core charge Hal. Rob Acker / r.acker(at)ix.netcom.com / RV-6 Quickbuild in slowbuild mode... :( ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Gil Alexander <gila(at)flash.net>
Subject: Re: Rivet Tape
> >Hello Listers, > I stumbled across some 3M Magic Tape while flush riveting my wing >control surfaces. This tape works great for holding flush rivets in place >while riveting. It peels off after riveting leaving little, if any, >residue. It is far superior to even the best grade masking tape and equal >to the special purpose tape sold by Avery. It is available at Walmart and >is sold as "3M Magic Tape." It costs about a dollar per 3/4 inch roll. >Hope this helps. >Best regards, >John >RV-6A, skinning wings John, ... and others ... make sure you get the 3M REMOVEABLE Magic Tape. There are two versions (the other is labelled 3M Magic Tape), and you want the one with a less agressive sticky surface. It is a good way to go, and seems better than the professional riveters tape. Masking tape is a real mess after you've hit it a few times with a rivet gun ...:^) Gil (tape those rivets) Alexander ------------------------------------------------------- mailto:gila(at)flash.net Gil Alexander, Los Angeles, CA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Engine Vacuum
Date: Sep 01, 1997
How about using manifold vacuum? The STC'd aftermarket units for certificated planes keep the gyros alive so perhaps this approach could be used for a primary system. I noted in a friend's Mooney that the only effect of turning on the standby vacuum was a slight change in idle speed. Dennis 6A fuselage in jig ---------- > From: Tom Martin <execulink.com!fairlea(at)matronics.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Engine Vacuum > Date: Monday, September 01, 1997 5:22 AM > > > > > > I would hate to hang a big horn off the side of > >a beautiful RV-6A to supply vacuum, so I was hoping for some great ideas > >from a large group. > > > >On mains awaiting Chevy. > >N609CG > > I am seriously thinking of using a small 2 inch horn mounted on the belly in > the engine outlet air. There is already turbulence there and the heat might > > Tom Martin > RV-4 > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Glenn & Judi <glenn(at)chocolatetruffles.com>
Subject: cleco substitute.
Hi, I am in the process of fitting the forward top skin (just forward of the canopy frame) onto my RV-6 Tip-up project. I need to tip up the canopy to check clearance, however the clecos on the mentioned skin are in the way. If I rivit this skin in place, then I can't trim it down if necessary. Is there a low profile substitute for the clecos? -Glenn Gordon -- MZ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr(at)netins.net>
Subject: Re: RV-4 Flap Lever
Date: Jan 31, 1980
Lou, Slow down more before you put the flaps down, and only use one notch of flaps. That will work until winter, then put in the electric flap kit. That is my plan. Tailwinds, N240 the pink panther Doug Rozendaal dougr(at)netins.net www.petroblend.com/dougr ---------- > From: Louis Willig <op.net!larywil(at)matronics.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: RV-4 Flap Lever > Date: Sunday, August 31, 1997 8:04 PM > > > > I'm having a difficult time grasping and positioning the RV-4 flap lever. > Other than installing electric flaps, what modifications have others made > to make flap > application easier? > > Lou Willig > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Michael Lott <Michael.Lott(at)ssc.nasa.gov>
Subject: handhelp gps autopilot coupler
The ad I had mentioned in trade-a-plane about the handheld gps to autopilot couplers was indeed the Porcine Associates ad mentioned by another lister. They are located in menlo park, california. The number is 415-326-2669. It is called the GPS Smart Coupler II. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Rivet tape idea
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Greetings folks, Thanks for all the great input regarding the trim tab hinge riveting technique...I'm still kicking myself for being so oblivious to the blatantly obvious. Anyway, I used el cheapo electrical tape to hold the rivets in place when back-riveting the skin stiffeners...ZERO residue and reuseable. Try it out! Works great! Brian Denk RV-8 #379 tail surfaces, wing kit on order ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Warren/MK Bishop" <wemkbish(at)nponline.net>
Subject: Re: cleco substitute.
Date: Sep 01, 1997
None that I know of. We installed the cleos from the back (under) side and then had to leave some out. Warren Bishop RV-6 engine area ---------- From: Glenn & Judi <matronics.com!chocolatetruffles.com!glenn> Subject: RV-List: cleco substitute. Date: Monday, September 01, 1997 6:48 PM Hi, I am in the process of fitting the forward top skin (just forward of the canopy frame) onto my RV-6 Tip-up project. I need to tip up the canopy to check clearance, however the clecos on the mentioned skin are in the way. If I rivit this skin in place, then I can't trim it down if necessary. Is there a low profile substitute for the clecos? -Glenn Gordon -- MZ ---------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Flyinghi(at)worldnet.att.net
Subject: Re: Rivet Tape
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Another useful item that is readably available without having to order is 1" wide Post-it Correction and Cover up tape available at all office suppy stores. I got mine at office depot and did the entire backriveting jobs on the airplane with one roll. It can be reused several times and leaves absolutely no residue. The rolls are 1" X 700" for about 5 bucks I believe. Just another way to beat the system. Charles ---------- > From: John Devlin <americus.net!jdevlin(at)matronics.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: Rivet Tape > Date: Monday, September 01, 1997 12:00 PM > > > Hello Listers, > I stumbled across some 3M Magic Tape while flush riveting my wing > control surfaces. This tape works great for holding flush rivets in place > while riveting. It peels off after riveting leaving little, if any, > residue. It is far superior to even the best grade masking tape and equal > to the special purpose tape sold by Avery. It is available at Walmart and > is sold as "3M Magic Tape." It costs about a dollar per 3/4 inch roll. > Hope this helps. > Best regards, > John > RV-6A, skinning wings > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Flyinghi(at)worldnet.att.net
Subject: Re: cleco substitute.
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Hi Glenn & Judi: I don't have the tip up canopy so I'm not familiar with your particular circumstance. However, many times I had to cleco from the inside to leave the outside area free. Maybe that will work. ---------- From: Glenn & Judi <chocolatetruffles.com!glenn(at)matronics.com> Subject: RV-List: cleco substitute. Date: Monday, September 01, 1997 11:48 PM Hi, I am in the process of fitting the forward top skin (just forward of the canopy frame) onto my RV-6 Tip-up project. I need to tip up the canopy to check clearance, however the clecos on the mentioned skin are in the way. If I rivit this skin in place, then I can't trim it down if necessary. Is there a low profile substitute for the clecos? -Glenn Gordon -- MZ ---------- ________________________________________________________________________________
From: kevin lane <n3773(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: punch line needed
Date: Sep 02, 1997
What is considered the best way to break in a newly O/H'd engine with an unflown airplane(owned by a low time pilot)? Seriously folks, inquiring minds want to know. Apparently, the Wally method of tying the tail to the hanger and running it for two hours isn't universally recognized as a great idea. kevin 6A (220 hrs) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bumflyer(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Subject: Re: Air Vents
In a message dated 9/1/97 10:22:04, you wrote: >I am ready to position the airvent scoops on the skin of my RV-6 project >(New style rudder system). > >The instructions are very vague about where to position these. Any >suggestions? > >-Glenn Gordon HERE ARE SOME THINGS T0 CONSIDER: 1. HEIGHT. I PUT MINE AS HIGH AS POSSIBLE. THIS IS RIGHT NEAR THE LONGERON. YOU MUST WATCH THE TOP ANCHOR POINT FOR THE RUDDER PEDALS FOR CLEARANCE, ALTHOUGH YOU DON'T NEED MUCH. THE BOLT MUST BE ABLE TO RISE FROM THE BLOCK ENOUGH TO ALLOW THE PLASTIC BLOCK TO BE (RE) MOVED IF EVER NECESSARY. IF YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE THE AIR EXIT POINTS LOW DOWN UNDER THE PANEL LIKE MOST FOLKS, YOU MAY WANT TO LOWER THE INLET A LITTLE TO ALLOW THE WATER IT MAY SOME DAY ACCUMULATE A WAY TO ROLL DOWN HILL AND EXIT OUTSIDE INSTEAD OF INSIDE THE COCKPIT. 2. FORE AND AFT. I PUT MINE AS FAR FORWARD AS POSSIBLE. YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO KEEP IT FORWARD OF THE WING TO GET HIGH PRESSURE AIR. I NOTICE THIS IS THE SINGLE GREATEST SOURCE OF NOISE, SO IT MAY BE QUIETER A LITTLE AFT. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: kevin lane <n3773(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
Date: Sep 02, 1997
>I spoke to Bill at Vans about this. He said the first thing to do was to calibrate the oil >temp gauge by removing the sender, sticking it in a can of boiling water and then observing >the actual reading on the gauge. He said that some of the cheaper gauges, even the >Isspro gauges that Van's sells are notoriously inaccurate. If you boil water you then have >an absolute 212 degree (depending on altitude) standard reading. I had a big argument with my wife about the reason for the term "hard boil" used in cookbooks. I discovered using a candy thermometer that even at a hard boil the temp. indicated only 200 degrees, since it registers the average of the pan, not the actual boiling water molecules. If this is true then this calibration method could be off by 12 degrees. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Glenn & Judi <glenn(at)chocolatetruffles.com>
Subject: Electronic Ignition?
Hi, I saw that Vans is offering an electronic ignition options on its new Lycoming engines. + $1500.00 I know next to nothing about these ignition systems. Are the magnetos eliminated from the engine? Can anyone volunteer to explain what electronic ignition is all about? Thank you, Glenn Gordon -- MZ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Subject: Re: Air Vents
<< The instructions are very vague about where to position these. Any suggestions? >> With the fuselage upright, make sure the bottom of the vents are about 3/4" minimum above the top of the rudder pedal weldment pivot blocks and that the vent is approximately centered longitudinally between the firewall and the vertical side skin stiffener angle. I stuck them on with proseal, but 3M 2216 Gray structural epoxy would be okay, too. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4Brown(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 01, 1997
Subject: Re: RV-4 wing spar question
<< Watson >> You will have to cut a hole in the spar web to permit the control column to transit from the front to rear of the aircraft. It would be easier to cut the hole in advance of the wing installation. Note you also installed a cutout in F404 bulheads for the same purpose. The spar hole should be the same size. See drawings 11 and 13 for details. Review drawing 28 for function of hole. Tom Brown RV4 - fuselage in jig ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Bud Newhall <bud(at)softcom.net>
Subject: Re: cleco substitute.
Glenn & Judi wrote: > > Is there a low profile substitute for the clecos? > > -Glenn Gordon > -- A few times when clecos were in the way I used soft alum. pop rivets (hardware store variety). They are easy to drill out later. Don't use more than you need to hold the stuff together. -- Bud Newhall bud(at)softcom.net __|__ __|__ ____(+)____ ____(+)____ ' ' ' ' ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Dennis Jackson <denny@tms-usa.com>
Subject: Re: Holes in Spar?
Ken Harrill wrote: > > > Before the final closing of my wings, I would like to mount my strobe > power packs (Aeroflash individual powerpacks). The best location seems > to be on the spar just inboard of the tip rib. Is it permissible to > drill four #19 holes in the spar at this location? Would Van's approve? > Any opinions will be greatly appreciated. > Ken: Since the spar carries very little of the load at the tips you can safely drill small holes out there. Just deburr carefully so you don't leave any stress risers. DJ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Dennis Jackson <denny@tms-usa.com>
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
Ed Bundy wrote: ........> > I usually try to keep my temps between 180-190. When I first started > flying it last winter, I was only able to get about 150 until I blocked > off most of the inlet. > Ed: Isn't that Vernitherm thingy set to bypass the cooler until the oil hits about 170 or so? Seems like I remember reading that somewhere. Maybe you've got a sticky one. DJ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BrownTool(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: RV-List:Sheetmetal Tools
A great source of sheetmetal tools for RV builders is Brown Aviation Tool Supply Co. of Oklahoma City, Oklahoma. They offer a free catalog by calling 1-800-587-3883. Items available include: clecos, riveting tools, countersinks, extension drills, air tools, and more. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Dennis Jackson <denny@tms-usa.com>
Subject: Re: punch line needed
kevin lane wrote: > > > What is considered the best way to break in a newly O/H'd engine with an > unflown airplane(owned by a low time pilot)? Seriously folks, inquiring > minds want to know. Apparently, the Wally method of tying the tail to the > hanger and running it for two hours isn't universally recognized as a great > idea. kevin 6A (220 hrs) > Kevin: Do as little taxi testing and ground running as possible, then take it up and run high power settings until oil consumption stabilizes. At that point the rings will be seated and you can relax. Shouldn't take more than a couple of hours or so depending on the kind of cylinder surface you have (nitride, chrome, etc). The important thing is to keep the cylinder pressure up during breakin so the rings are deflected down to their maximum angle and the ring surface riding on the cylinder wears in at that angle. Then after breakin you'll get good oil consumption at high power while at lower cylinder pressures (lower power settings) the ring will still scrape oil properly. If you do it the other way around and seat the rings at low power, the ring won't scrape the oil off at higher power settings than what was used for breakin and you'll use a lot of oil. I think the main problem with trying to break in an engine on the ground would be cooling it. If you had some way of forcing air over the cylinders to maintain temp limits, I don't see why you couldn't use a test stand to break the engine in. I guess that's the way they must do it a Lyc. My engine came already run in from the factory. Good luck. DJ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Dennis Jackson <denny@tms-usa.com>
Subject: Re: Engine Vacuum
Dennis Persyk wrote: > > How about using manifold vacuum? The STC'd aftermarket units for > certificated planes keep the gyros alive so perhaps this approach could be > used for a primary system. I noted in a friend's Mooney that the only > effect of turning on the standby vacuum was a slight change in idle speed. > Dennis 6A fuselage in jig > I tried using manifold vacuum to run just a single DG and found there isn't enough vacuum to keep it spun up at cruise. There's more than enough at idle, but once you open the throttle, you only have an inch or two difference between atmospheric and manifold pressure. DJ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 01, 1997
From: Gil Alexander <gila(at)flash.net>
Subject: Re: Air Vents
> ><< The instructions are very vague about where to position these. Any > suggestions? >> > >With the fuselage upright, make sure the bottom of the vents are about 3/4" >minimum above the top of the rudder pedal weldment pivot blocks and that the >vent is approximately centered longitudinally between the firewall and the >vertical side skin stiffener angle. I stuck them on with proseal, but 3M >2216 Gray structural epoxy would be okay, too. > >-GV > -6 Fus. builders, ... note that many folks (myself included) are putting spacers in that raise the rudder cross tubes about 1 inch. If you want to do this, then the air vents must be raised by a corresponding amount. Check the archives for discussions on brake/rudder pedal height. ... Gil (check those archives) Alexander ------------------------------------ RV6A, #20701, finishing kit "REPLY" sends to entire RV-list mailto:gila(at)flash.net to reply privately ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: Leo Davies <leo(at)icn.su.OZ.AU>
Subject: Re: Electronic Ignition?
Glenn, I have just had an engine delivered with the "Lasar" electronic ignition option. It still has slick magnetos but these now have a control harness that connects to a controller with pressure compensation. Should the controller fail the engine reverts to a fixed advance magneto (the advance will permit running but without the battery and controller the engine cannot be started). What you are buying is a system that will modify the advance according to engine RPM and ambient pressure. I should add that no documentation came with the system except a cryptic note on the box that it should be installed according to Slick service bulletin #xxxxxxxxx. I am in the process of trying to obtain same. This is a little irritating. I hope I am at the leading edge of ignition technology. It is possible that I am a beta test site. Cheers, Leo Davies > >Hi, > >I saw that Vans is offering an electronic ignition options on its new >Lycoming engines. + $1500.00 =20 > >I know next to nothing about these ignition systems. Are the magnetos >eliminated from the engine? Can anyone volunteer to explain what >electronic ignition is all about? > >Thank you, >Glenn Gordon >--=20 >MZ=90 > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: jbalbierer(at)nysyr.ang.af.mil
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: cleco substitute.
charset=US-ASCII That skin is the most Pain in the A#@. Once your canopy is on with the struts installed, the damn frame moves forward a little from the pressure of the struts. Your nicely fit skins now need trimming and fitting again. That's what makes me now want the slider. John Balbierer, RV-6 ------------- Original Text ________________________________________________________________________________ 6:48 PM: Hi, I am in the process of fitting the forward top skin (just forward of the canopy frame) onto my RV-6 Tip-up project. I need to tip up the canopy to check clearance, however the clecos on the mentioned skin are in the way. If I rivit this skin in place, then I can't trim it down if necessary. Is there a low profile substitute for the clecos? =20 -Glenn Gordon --=20 MZ=90 om" | ct. | ________________________________________________________________________________
From: jbalbierer(at)nysyr.ang.af.mil
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Air Vents
charset=US-ASCII There are no real guidlines as to where to put them. Watch out for your rudder pedals on the inside. Look at the plans and this gives you a general location. Tape on the template, make sure it 's level with the longeron and cut! John Balbierer, RV-6 ------------- Original Text ________________________________________________________________________________ 10:22 AM: Hi, I am ready to position the airvent scoops on the skin of my RV-6 project (New style rudder system). The instructions are very vague about where to position these. Any suggestions? -Glenn Gordon --=20 MZ=90 om" | ct. | ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mlfred(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: Holes in Spar?
<< Before the final closing of my wings, I would like to mount my strobe power packs (Aeroflash individual powerpacks). The best location seems to be on the spar just inboard of the tip rib. Is it permissible to drill four #19 holes in the spar at this location? Would Van's approve? Any opinions will be greatly appreciated. >> Ken: I've done several set this way. I usually use only two holes, tho. More nutplates, eh? What fun........ Check six! Mark ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mlfred(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: RV-4 wing spar question
<< I'm currenlty working on the main spar for my -4. The plans show a cut out through the spar web and spar web doubler at the spar root. I find no mention of this in the construction manual. Is this something that should be cut right now or is it done at a later time? Glen Watson >> Do this at the same time that you're building up the #4 blkhd. It's easy then, diffucult later. BTW, cut the 2" hole for the heat hose at this time, too. Check six! Mark ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mlfred(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: Pro-Seal substitute from Spruce?
<< Mark, Please post the phone number for Seal-pac. Thanks, Steve Johnson RV-8 #80121 Left wing, about ready for the dreaded fuel tank >> 316-942-6211 Have fun! A regular caulk gun can be easily converted for use with thees tubes- reduce the size of the plunger end so it fits inside the end of the tube. Now you have a dispenser for 99 cents! Some styles of caulk guns will require a rubber band or two around the gun & tube to hold things together, too. Check six! Mark ________________________________________________________________________________
From: OrndorffG(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: Electronic Ignition?
Glenn, Becki and I just installed a electronic Ignition from electro air and are very pleased with it. ItThe system directly replaces one mag leaving the other as a backup, cost $800.00. If you would like more info give me a call at (817)439-3280....George Orndorff ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: gcomfo(at)tc3net.com (Gordon Comfort)
Subject: Re: RV-4 Flap Lever
Louis Willig wrote: > > > I'm having a difficult time grasping and positioning the RV-4 flap lever. Lou: Since the handle lays tight to the floor, I cut away about 50% of the forwardmost end next to the floor for a distance back from the end sufficient to get my fingers around the handle except for a small spur at the very end to reduce the chance of slipping off the handle. When you remove the handle for this mod, make sure you remove metal from the proper edge. You might guess why I suggest this last. G.Comfort RV4 N363GC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: rust47rg(at)one.net
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: Electronic Ignition?
> >Glenn, > >I have just had an engine delivered with the "Lasar" electronic ignition >option. It still has slick magnetos but these now have a control harness >that connects to a controller with pressure compensation. Should the >controller fail the engine reverts to a fixed advance magneto (the advance >will permit running but without the battery and controller the engine >cannot be started). What you are buying is a system that will modify the >advance according to engine RPM and ambient pressure. > >I should add that no documentation came with the system except a cryptic >note on the box that it should be installed according to Slick service >bulletin #xxxxxxxxx. I am in the process of trying to obtain same. This is >a little irritating. I hope I am at the leading edge of ignition >technology. It is possible that I am a beta test site. > >Cheers, > >Leo Davies > >> >>Hi, >> >>I saw that Vans is offering an electronic ignition options on its new >>Lycoming engines. + $1500.00 >> >>I know next to nothing about these ignition systems. Are the magnetos >>eliminated from the engine? Can anyone volunteer to explain what >>electronic ignition is all about? >> >>Thank you, >>Glenn Gordon There are other options....Lightspeed, Electroair are systems I am familiar with. They are stand alone electronics, not piggy back systems such as the Unison. But they work fine and are significantly cheaper. I have an Electroair on my 4 and it works great. Electroair's # 423-622-8825, Jeff Rose is the owner. I believe he has over 800 of his systems flying. Regards: Rusty Gossard N47RG RV-4 Flying since 8-94 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: Scott Gesele <scottg(at)icsnet.com>
Subject: Re: Holes in Spar?
>Before the final closing of my wings, I would like to mount my strobe >power packs (Aeroflash individual powerpacks). The best location seems >to be on the spar just inboard of the tip rib. Is it permissible to >drill four #19 holes in the spar at this location? Would Van's approve? >Any opinions will be greatly appreciated. > > >Ken Harrill Ken, I see no problem in drilling #19 holes in the spar near the tip. Keep them close to the center of the spar (top to bottom) as this is where the stress is the least. Deburr the holes and you should have no problems. If you are wondering if Van would approve, just call the factory. Hope this helps. Scott Gesele N506RV (Taxi test complete, almost ready for FAA inspection) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: Charlie Kuss <charliekuss(at)sprintmail.com>
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
snipped > even the > >Isspro gauges that Van's sells are notoriously inaccurate. If you boil > water you then have > >an absolute 212 degree (depending on altitude) standard reading. > > I had a big argument with my wife about the reason for the term "hard boil" > used in cookbooks. I discovered using a candy thermometer that even at a > hard boil the temp. indicated only 200 degrees, since it registers the > average of the pan, not the actual boiling water molecules. If this is true > then this calibration method could be off by 12 degrees. No offense, but isn't it possible that the candy thermometer was not accurate? They aren't exactly high dollar items. For that matter I haven't seen many home oven thermostats that were accurate. Charlie Kuss ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: Will Cretsinger <cretsinger(at)startext.net>
Subject: Re: Rivet tape idea
Brian Denk wrote: > > > > Anyway, I used el cheapo electrical tape to hold the rivets in place > when back-riveting the skin stiffeners...ZERO residue and reuseable. Try > it out! Works great! > I used electrical tape and had gobs of residue after a few cycles of hot days...I have about eight rolls I'd sell cheap! Scotch Removable Magic Tape #811 from your local office supply store is the choice for backriveting and holding flush rivets. I never found an equivalent tape to hold universal head rivets satisfactorily...I needed something to hold the 3/16 spar rivets while waiting my turn at the factory rivet squeezer. Haven't needed such a product since. Masking tape and duct tape do leave residue to clean up... Will Cretsinger cretsinger(at)arlington.net 6A fuselage out of jig Arlington, TX > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David Moore"<dmoore8(at)tuelectric.com>
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: Aux Power Cover
While at Oshkosh I noticed a RV6 with a auxillary power outlet (cigarette lighter) with a No Smoking Cover. Does anyone know where I can get one? I don't like the lighter but I do need the power outlet for hand held devices. Thanks for the help. You can buy an aux power outlet at any auto parts store or RadioShack. I bought mine at the later - it was about $6. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: Louis Willig <larywil(at)op.net>
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
I discovered using a candy thermometer that even at a >hard boil the temp. indicated only 200 degrees, since it registers the >average of the pan, not the actual boiling water molecules. If this is true >then this calibration method could be off by 12 degrees. This is absolutely not true. At standard atmospheric pressure (29.92 in.mercury), you can get that pot to a true boil and see 210-212 deg. on any decent thermometer. I check our shop's thermometers this way. On a day with higher atmospheric pressure, you can get readings of 215 degrees. Kevin, I have to believe your candy thermometer is incorrect. Louis Willig ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Air Vents and Cowl pins
Date: Sep 02, 1997
One builder in my area has used the vent as the input point for the cowl pins. If you do this, center the vents in line with where the two halves of the cowl meet. A hole is then drilled through the forward end of the vent. A small length of metal tubing is prosealed in place to align the pin with the hinges on the cowl. A large pop rivet is then placed in the vent as the anchor point for the pin (using the center hole of the pop rivet). This setup keeps the pin on the outside for ease of removal and removes the possibility of the pin getting loose and messing up your prop. Ross Mickey rmickey@ix,netcom.com > I am ready to position the airvent scoops on the skin of my RV-6 project > (New style rudder system). > > The instructions are very vague about where to position these. Any > suggestions? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "David Moore"<dmoore8(at)tuelectric.com>
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: cleco substitute.
chocolatetruffles.com!glenn(at)matronics.com on 09/01/97 06:48:42 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RV-List: cleco substitute. Hi, I am in the process of fitting the forward top skin (just forward of the canopy frame) onto my RV-6 Tip-up project. I need to tip up the canopy to check clearance, however the clecos on the mentioned skin are in the way. If I rivit this skin in place, then I can't trim it down if necessary. Is there a low profile substitute for the clecos? I am having a similar problem. I suggest riveting the skin in place, and making all of your trim adjustments on the canopy glare skin. It has more edge distance anyway. Alternatively - you can probably get the canopy partially open before it contacts the clecoes (about 5%). This is about all that you need since the interference problem occurs just as it opens. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: Leif <jamtcom(at)pocab.se>
Subject: Lycoming IO320
Hi folks! I have a question about a IO320 for sale. The price is right, 2500$, but the engine has a problem. It=B4s a Dynafocal 2, 18degr. mount, and the injector is aprox. 45 degr. backw. what kind of modification do I need to do? The engine came from a Twin Comanche, 1800 hour. Leif Stener, RV-6 in Sweden. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: Dr John Cocker <jcocker(at)medhumor.com>
Subject: Re: Garmin GPS 90 - info request
I have a Garmin 50 which is couples to a Navaid, and orks very well. I thought it would be a big deal, but in fact there were just two wire to connect John C GDOC 75 hours ________________________________________________________________________________
From: winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
kevin lane wrote: > I had a big argument with my wife about the reason for the term "hard boil" > used in cookbooks. I discovered using a candy thermometer that even at a > hard boil the temp. indicated only 200 degrees, since it registers the > average of the pan, not the actual boiling water molecules. If this is true > then this calibration method could be off by 12 degrees. > Water boils at lower temps at higher altitudes. The boiling point goes down about 1.2 degrees per thousand feet, so you must adjust your reading accordingly. Also as a secondary check, you can always put a known thermometer in the water with your oil temp sender. This way you can compare it to the reading on the gauge as temps increase. Andy ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: "Louis E. Smith Jr." <lsmith(at)coastalnet.com>
Subject: RV-8 fuselage jig for sale
RV-8 Fuselage Jig For Sale Wood, Glued, & Screwed. $100.00 Louis Smith Rocky Mount, NC lsmith(at)coastalnet.com (919)937-4905 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Kevin, What altitude was the pot at when it was boiling? At standard conditions (sea level, 760 mm Hg pressure) a thermometer immersed in a boiling solution of water will indeed read 212 F if it is properly calibrated. There are corrections (published in Physics tables and elsewhere) for altitude and pressure. Either your candy thermometer is off or your altitude/pressure were not standard at the time of the test. Dennis 6A fuselage in jig ---------- > From: kevin lane <worldnet.att.net!n3773(at)matronics.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ? > Date: Monday, September 01, 1997 7:58 PM > > > If you boil > water you then have > >an absolute 212 degree (depending on altitude) standard reading. > > I had a big argument with my wife about the reason for the term "hard boil" > used in cookbooks. I discovered using a candy thermometer that even at a > hard boil the temp. indicated only 200 degrees, since it registers the > average of the pan, not the actual boiling water molecules. If this is true > then this calibration method could be off by 12 degrees. > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: punch line needed
From: ebundy(at)juno.com (Ed Bundy)
> What is considered the best way to break in a newly O/H'd engine >with an unflown airplane(owned by a low time pilot)? Seriously folks, Seriously? Don't do any more taxiing than absolutely necessary. A couple of minutes to check the gear and brakes, make sure the panel stuff works, shut down and check for leaks, then put the hammer to it and fly. Running a new or newly o/h'd engine at low power is the absolute worst thing you can do. You need to run it at 75% power for as long as the manufacturer says. Lycoming recommends running at 75% power on a new engine for 25-50 hours, or until the oil consumption stabilizes. My oil consumption was stable right from the factory at about a quart every 15 hours. Lycoming says this is common on new engines with nitrided cylinders and to keep up the break-in period (and the straight mineral oil) for 25 hours, with an oil/filter change at 12 hours. I'm not sure what your 220 hours are in, but as far as the test flight is concerned, if you have little or no time in RV's, you might want to enlist the help of an experienced test pilot. At 190mph, and monitoring an unproven airplane, you can get behind the curve fairly quickly. Ed Bundy RV6A - first flight 11/20/96 ebundy(at)juno.com - Eagle, ID ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
<340B984A.3EFF@tms-usa.com>
From: ebundy(at)juno.com (Ed Bundy)
Isn't that Vernitherm thingy set to bypass the cooler until the oil hits about 170 or so? Seems like I remember reading that somewhere. Maybe you've got a sticky one. DJ, that is more or less the idea. From what I understand however, the vernatherm valve still lets quite a bit of oil through even when "closed". It doesn't have near the range of an automotive thermostat. Because RV's cool so well, the oil that keeps circulating through the cooler is enough to keep the temps quite cool in the winter. Ed Bundy RV6A - first flight 11/20/96 ebundy(at)juno.com - Eagle, ID ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: RV-4 Flap Lever
From: tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com (John T. Craig-Stearman)
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Lou, I soldiered on with the manual flap handle until I installed rear seat foot wells as shown in the RVator article. The flap handle goes right down the middle of the left foot well. I gave up and installed the electric motor. The installation was quite straight-forward, and will be my first choice on my next project. Regards, Tom Craig-Stearman tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com RV-4 wings mounted, hooking up the myriad little details >I'm having a difficult time grasping and positioning the RV-4 flap >lever. >Other than installing electric flaps, what modifications have others >made >to make flap >application easier? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)idacom.hp.com>
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Shelby wrote: > > With at least three diesels in development, I would imagine that diesel will > play at least a moderate role in future airplanes. I for one would love to > have a diesel. > I think diesel's going to play a big role. No matter which way you look, you see people doing diesel (or turbine) development for GA aircraft. These projects all seem to be based on the belief that avgas will become uneconomical or unavailable in the not-too-distant future. I don't know a heck of a lot about diesels, but the duty cycle and desirable power curve of airplane engines seems to be a lot like what diesels are typically used for. Tedd ________________________________________________________________________________
From: MAlexan533(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Harbor Freight HVLP Spray Gun
I notice that everyone keeps talking about the spray guns they use such as Binks, Croix, and others that run $300-$800 and up. I wanted to share my experience using the Harbor Freight Central Pneumatic Brand HVLP spray gun. I paid $59.00 for mine five years ago and have painted 3 airplanes with it, including a Cessna Cardinal and an RV-4, plus lots of primer. The results have been outstanding, I've had people ask where I had my paint done, so they could get an estimate! I used to paint cars occasionally as a hobby, and my experience is that unless you are into production spraying, etc. a gun such as the above is more than adequate. The current catalog number of my gun is #05726-5URA, $69.00 and free shipping. 1-800-423-2567. Just my opinion, thats all. RV-4 N107RV Von Alexander MAlexan533(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Cafgef(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
<> Possible sources of error: 1. Water boils at 200 F at 6500 feet altitude. Are you located in Colorado Springs? 2. Candy thermometer could be off by a couple of degrees( more probable). Accurate thermometers are expensive. Gene cafgef(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson)
Subject: fuel line routing
I would like some advice on fuel line routing for the RV-6. For various reasons I am considering a different routing from the selector valve and the firewall than what is shown on the plans. I think what I have in mind should work but am a little nervous about modifying this critical item. Any help/advice would be appreciated. The routing I am considering is this: down from the fuel selector, 90 degree left turn, 6 to 12 inches straight, then into the fuel flow sensor, 90 degree turn out of there (bent or a fitting), forward along one of the floor stiffeners, up to the electric boost pump, which will be mounted at a 45 degree cant (per instructions) on the firewall, thence up and through the firewall. What do y'all think? The electric pump (Facet) instructions say to keep it out of the engine compartment and away from heat. Is it too much heat if it's mounted to the back side of the firewall? Would a bracket that held it 3/4" back be needed/enough? Also the plans show the line going through the firewall at what looks to be the exact level of the fuel selector valve. Is there a specific reason for this? Are there other high/low dimensional considerations I need to make sure I take into account? Randall Henderson, RV-6 randall(at)edt.com http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr(at)netins.net>
Subject: Would you use better engine oil?
Date: Feb 01, 1980
Well here goes, I have received several replies off the list about the oils I am always talking about. I have been doing some thinking, (we all know how dangerous that is...) If I were to formulate an metalic detergent based engine oil based on the latest additive technology how many would be interested in it? This would not be something I dream up in our lab, it would be formulated using the experience of major lubricant additive manufacters. And I don't mean Slick 50. It would not have Teflon, and it would not allow you to run your engine for an hour without any oil. Nothing magic or too good to be true. Just a way to reduce the rate at which the valve train and the cylinder walls eat themselves. We are not talking about 4000 hour TBO's either. Just a statistically significant reduction in engine wear. I would fund the oil and oil analysis on these engines. I could not warranty anything, but it would further the knowledge pool. I am certain that the majors are not going down this road because the market is just not there. I am not promising anything at this point but if you are interested drop me a note off-list at dougr(at)petroblend.com. I would need to first find some high timers that were using some oil to find out if it would plug up the valve guides. I have less concern about the rings. But would want to watch them as well. Obviously this would be a blind test and some of the engines would get the same oil they are currently using. I would put in my 200 hr IO-320 160 hp. It burns less than a quart to 20 hours. If we could get some success on the oil burners we could expand into the lower timers. Please include: Engine Hrs SMOH, STOH Oil consumption Filter or Screen Drain Interval Current Oil, brand, Viscosity grade, AD or mineral Hours flown per month Are you currently doing oil analysis? Also if you are happy with the oils you are using tell me that too, that is just as important. I have been harping on this subject for years, maybe it is time to put up or shut up.. I am about half afraid to push send but here goes.... Tailwinds, N240 the pink panther Doug Rozendaal dougr(at)netins.net www.petroblend.com/dougr PS See more about the company at www.petroblend.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: "les williams" <lesliebwilliams(at)classic.msn.com>
Subject: Electronic Ignition?
Leo, Maybe the reason that no installation instructions are included is to insure that you obtain the latest version before the final hook-up even though a lot of the basic installation has already been done by Lycoming for the run in. A friend of mine obtained a new engine from Van's in early 1991 and still hasn't run it. A lot of changes could be made in that kind of time frame. I don't think you're a beta tester as mine came the same way just three days ago. A notice in the box also mentions a video which also might be handy to have. Looks like it was probably in the box before Lycoming did their bit. Would appreciate knowing what you find out. If Bill Benedict is reading this maybe he will respond also. Thanks, Les ---------- From: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com on behalf of Leo Davies Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 1997 1:20 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Electronic Ignition? I should add that no documentation came with the system except a cryptic note on the box that it should be installed according to Slick service bulletin #xxxxxxxxx. I am in the process of trying to obtain same. This is a little irritating. I hope I am at the leading edge of ignition technology. It is possible that I am a beta test site. Cheers, Leo Davies ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: incredible BSFC!
<< Any idea what figure an O-360 does give? >> The following is right out of the Lycoming Manual for O-360-A1A: At 100% power (180 hp @ 2700 rpm) it uses 15 gph for a BSFC of .50. At 75% power (135 hp @ 2450 rpm) it uses 10.5 gph, for a BSFC of .47. At 65% power (117 hp @ 2350 rpm) it uses 9 gph, for a BSFC of .46. The extra fuel above 75% power is for cooling. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: the real squeaky brake solution
Last week I thought i had found the answer to a serious squeal from my left brake. When I began to look at the problem then I thought there were 3 possible fixes. One was to find whether the brake pads (with a very high metal content) was the culprit. To solve that problem I switched the pads around from the left to the right sides. If the pads were bad, the problem would have followed itself to the new side. It did not. The next possibility was to apply a compound called "disk brake quiet" to the contact points on the slave cylinder. I thought that was the answer because on the next ride, everything quieted down and the problem dissappeared. The third "fix" I performed that day, I did not take very seriously. I thought that since the brakes were apart anyway, I might as well lube the two pins that allow the calipers to ride in and out of the brake assembly. Well, a couple of flights ago the grinding and squealing came back. I applied some more "disk brake quiet" and nothing happened. The problem was still there. So today, I opened the brakes again and re-lubed the pins with a powder graphite type lubricant. The problem went away. Obviously the lubrication of the pins in their slots is the answer. However I am still concerned on why this needs to be done. The right side works fine without the lubricant. Is anybody here familiar with the standard Cleaveland brake package that Van's provides? Is the need for lubrication in this area normal? If so what kind of lubricant should be used? The graphite worked, but only for 3-4 flights? If this is new to everyone, does anybody have the phone numebr for the Cleaveland Brakes Company so i can call them? Thanks Andy Gold ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVator(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
I discovered quite by accident that by turning off my Loran, My electric oil temp guage would indicate about 10 degrees cooler. Turned my radio off and it dropped another 5 or so, turned the transponder off and the reading dropped another 3 degrees or so. Obviously I have a wireing "guage" glitch or some other anomoly, but you might check it out and recieve some cheap peace of mind. RVator Steve Schmitz ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: "Gregory S. Brewsaugh" <gregbrew(at)gte.net>
Subject: Aerobatic Survey
Listers, Please respond to me personally, and I'll post the results. Are you/did you install the "flop tube" in your fuel tanks for aerobatics? A simple "Yes" or "No" is adequate. Thanks, Greg gregbrew(at)gte.net -6A HS and VS done Rudder 1/2 Got Wing Kit! ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Oshkosh Statistics
<19970829.180044.4807.0.GASobek(at)juno.com>
From: less_drag(at)juno.com (JAMES E AYERS)
Date: Sep 02, 1997
A. Sobek) writes: >in 1986 or 1987 Kent (Rocky) Rockwell started exactly what you >suggest. He used POLICE do NOT CROSS barricaded tape between RV's. >Jim Ayers may have been there when this was done. > >Gary > Hi Gary and all, Actually, I remember it being 2" wide red ribbon in 1986. He could have used the "POLICE" tape on other years that he went. One thing that really made a difference (even with the ribbon) was having the canopy cover on the airplane. (As soon as Rocky would lift the cover to get something out of his RV-3, someone would be there to get a picture of the cockpit. Rocky received an Outstanding Workmanship award in 1986.) There was one other deterrent. I had blisters on both feet, and was sitting in front of, or lying under, the wing of Rocky's RV-3 most of the time. :-) Jim Ayers ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: "Gregory S. Brewsaugh" <gregbrew(at)gte.net>
Subject: Instruments
Listers, As I'm at least a year away from needing them, is there some as yet hidden/secret source for the discerning buyer for good used avionics VFR & IFR? With the time, I can pick and choose. TIA. Greg -6A HS & VS done Rudder 1/2 Got Wing Kit! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: Anthony Wiebe <awiebe(at)cadvision.com>
Subject: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy
Hello Folks, Having visited Oshkosh last month, I finally settled on an RV-6A as apposed to an RV-6. Now I have another problem. I'm about to order my kit and I'm at a loss as to weather or not I should order the sliding canopy or the tip-up canopy. The way I see it, the tip-up canopy has two downfalls. 1) Optically incorrect. 2) Exposed instrumentation. The sliding canopy also has two issues that I'm aware of: 1) Draft eminating from the rear of the canopy (I live in a rather cold climate - Calgary, Alberta & this would be unacceptable), 2) More difficult to install (so I'm told). I would appreciate any feedback on this subject including work-arounds to the various short-comings. Is there other factors I should be considering? Thanks for your assistance. Anthony Wiebe Calgary, Alberta, Canada ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Just wondering out loud
From: less_drag(at)juno.com (JAMES E AYERS)
Date: Sep 02, 1997
writes: > >Hi Ted! > >I was just as excited about the Zoche engine as you are, when I left >Oshkosh--------- in 1990. At that time, certification was "nearly >complete" >and it would be available "soon". > >I'm not holding my breath. > >Good luck in your quest for an engine. > >Rob Miller >RV8 wing #2 >Fuse OTW Hi Rob and all, I was just as excited when I first heard of the Zoche engine. The 25 inch diameter of the radial engine would just fit in a RV-3, even if I had to use the 300 Hp version to get the weight and balance to come out right. However, I found that the Zoche was going to sell for the same price as a Lycoming of the same horsepower. We are not talking Van's price, we're talking retail Lycoming prices. Maybe it's not that way now. :-) Jim Ayers ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: "Roger Healy" <Max_Throttle(at)classic.msn.com>
Subject: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
I had a big argument with my wife about the reason for the term "hard boil" used in cookbooks. I discovered using a candy thermometer that even at a hard boil the temp. indicated only 200 degrees, since it registers the average of the pan, not the actual boiling water molecules. If this is true then this calibration method could be off by 12 degrees. Kevin, What altitude are you at? Water boils at 212 degrees F only at sea level and at standard pressure. As your altitude increases, the boiling temperature decreases. In Denver, the boiling point is approximately 195 degrees (if I remember correctly). At a hard boil, the temperature throughout the water is essentially uniform. The water vapor is carrying heat away from the liquid water as the burner is adding heat so that the liquid temperature is constant and uniform at the boiling point. Obviously, the thermometer could also be inaccurate, as has been suggested. Looking for RV-8 preview plans (and a certified Zoche would be nice, as well) Roger Healy ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: Dennis Jackson <denny@tms-usa.com>
Subject: Re: Lycoming IO320
Leif wrote: > > > Hi folks! I have a question about a IO320 for sale. The price is right, > 2500$, but the engine has a problem. Its a Dynafocal 2, 18degr. mount, > and the injector is aprox. 45 degr. backw. what kind of modification do > I need to do? The engine came from a Twin Comanche, 1800 hour. > > Leif Stener, RV-6 in Sweden. > Leif: If this is the same engine I used (IO320-B1C) in my RV-4, then there are some mods that you will have to do. First of all, the rear mounted injector interferes with the engine mount on the -4, I don't know about the -6. Also the front and rear intake risers are different lengths and staggered so that the rear risers interfered with the bottom cowling on the -4, again I don't know about the -6 since it is wider. What I had to do was to get a sump and intake risers from and engine with a bottom-mounted carb or injector (they are the same mounting). Look around for a good used sump since the price of a new one is about the same price as the entire engine that you're getting ($2500). The other major difference is that the mounting bosses where you bolt the engine to the shock mounts are countersunk and have special transition spacers which put the engine about 1" (25mm) farther forward than the engines with flat bosses. This actually helps the c.g. a little on the -4, but means that you will probably have to add a little extra length to the rear of your cowling to make up for it, at least that's what I had to do. It isn't hard, just a little more fiberglass work. That's really about all there is to it. What I am wondering is what is really wrong with the engine that someone would be selling it at that price. You can't even get the accessories for that price. Let me know if you don't want it 'cause I'd snap it up in a Stockholm minute. DJ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Btinn(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Subject: Re: Rivet tape idea
Brian, You said you used "el cheapo electrical tape" to do your back riveting. I am curious to know if the tape was thick enough and soft enough that you had trouble seating the rivets flush with the skin surface. Did any of them rise above the surface before they expanded and flattened in the hole ????? Bob Tinnell Salem, OR RV-6A wings ________________________________________________________________________________
From: MAlexan533(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Subject: Canopy Paint Removal
My RV-4 has a fine fog coat of paint on the canopy; apparently the previous owner failed to mask adequately. Question; What chemical, if any, can be used to clean this off? I've used scratch removal compound, but this is a very slow process. Any better ideas? Am guessing laquer thinner would remove it, but would probably attack the plastic too. Unrelated Tip; For outside air temp, I used one of those $1.99 stick-on thermometer strips that changes color. I put it right against the skin on the inside of my RV-4, out of the direct path of vents, etc. Aluminum transfers outside air temperature so well, that this strip, even though inside, seems to give me a reasonably accurate idea of the outside temperature. Might not work on those aircraft with heaters, mine doesn't have one, but for $1.99, what the heck, right? Happy flying Von Alexander N107RV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pbennett(at)zip.com.au
Date: Sep 02, 1997
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
> I discovered using a candy thermometer that even at a > hard boil the temp. indicated only 200 degrees, since it registers the > average of the pan, not the actual boiling water molecules. If this is true > then this calibration method could be off by 12 degrees. More likely your candy thermometer was made by Isspro....... Peter Bennett Sydney Australia RV6 engine arrived! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net>
Subject: Re: cleco substitute.
David Moore wrote: > > > chocolatetruffles.com!glenn(at)matronics.com on 09/01/97 06:48:42 PM > > Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > cc: (bcc: David Moore/CPSES/Texas Utilities) > Subject: RV-List: cleco substitute. > > Hi, > I am in the process of fitting the forward top skin (just forward of the > canopy frame) onto my RV-6 Tip-up project. I need to tip up the canopy > to check clearance, however the clecos on the mentioned skin are in the > way. edited.... Just a thought, as I'm only in the plans stage of an RV-4, but could you use an appropriate size machine screw and nut to temporarily go in the rivet holes such as a 4-40 size screw and nut? Scott -- Gotta Fly or Gonna Die ! --Ask me about my Aeronca Super Chief-- amended 8-29-97: Now after feeling the "Need for Speed", building an RV-4! No, the Super Chief is NOT for sale :) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: catbird(at)taylortel.com (TTC Carroll A. Bird)
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
aol.com!Cafgef(at)matronics.com wrote: > Accurate thermometers are expensive. > > Gene cafgef(at)aol.com > Where can you buy an accurate one at any price? Carroll ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Ken_Hitchmough(at)magic.ca (Ken Hitchmough)
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Subject: Re: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy
I suggest that you try and get a ride in both types. The slider is sexy on the ground but who wants to stay on the ground. ;-) he tip up is also easier to get in and out, the negative of exposed instruments is also a positive when it comes to working on them. Ken RV6A flying (tip up) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mlfred(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Subject: Aeromatic prop info
<< You might want to contact Kent Paser. >> I sat across from Kent on one of the OSH busses this year. I asked him about his phone being disconnected, and he said that the Ford Motor Co had a # very close to his, so he had his changed to something less conspicuous. I didn't get the new #- sorry. Please post this new #, if you get it...... A local IA loaned me his Aeromatic Service book for reading once. I'm sure he still has it, as his Bellanca has one mounted on it.....Very interseting operational concepts..... Seems owners carried extra counterweight washers to adjust their props while traveling from the plains to the mountains & back. I don't remember the speed range of these units. Could be that the available travel or blade twist isn't quite up to what we need. Email me off the list for his #. Check six! Mark ________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy
From: wstucklen1(at)juno.com (Frederic W Stucklen)
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Anthony, What's opticaly incorrect about the tip up?? There certainly isn't anything obstructing ones view (like the roll bar in the slider. As far as the "exposed instruments" is concerned, I've never had a water leak while flying (967 hrs in four years). I did put a velcroed water proof fabric over the instruments so that water doesn't get in when I open the canopy when it's raining. I've never had any water related instrument failures. It's also easier to get in/out of a tip up vs a slider... you don't have to step on the seats. In RV-6's, I've always stepped on the spar box. In my -6A i step onto the landing gear bracket, never the seat...... And you're correct, the tip up seals better. It's cold in New England in the winter also. I don't have any problems heating the cabin in the winter.... Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV (Working on 2'd RV-6A - Chevy Powered!) wstucklen1(at)juno.com writes: > >Hello Folks, > >Having visited Oshkosh last month, I finally settled on an RV-6A as >apposed to an RV-6. Now I have another problem. > >I'm about to order my kit and I'm at a loss as to weather or not I >should order the sliding canopy or the tip-up canopy. > >The way I see it, the tip-up canopy has two downfalls. >1) Optically incorrect. >2) Exposed instrumentation. > >The sliding canopy also has two issues that I'm aware of: >1) Draft eminating from the rear of the canopy (I live in a rather >cold >climate - Calgary, Alberta & this would be unacceptable), >2) More difficult to install (so I'm told). > >I would appreciate any feedback on this subject including work-arounds >to the various short-comings. Is there other factors I should be >considering? > >Thanks for your assistance. > >Anthony Wiebe >Calgary, Alberta, Canada > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: KOZINSKI GARY <kozinski(at)symbol.com>
Subject: Tank Sealant mixing
Here is an easier way to mix the tank sealant material that comes in the caulk style tube that worked great for me. This is for the two part mix with the part B mix in the plunger with the mixing blade inside the tube. 1. Use a drill press and slow it down to its slowest speed. 2. Push the Part B mix of the sealant into the main chamber. 3. Cut the round head off the plunger so that only the 1/4 inch shaft is exposed. (The shaft should be connected to the mixing blade on the inside of the tube.) 4. Insert the shaft into the drill chuck. 5. Hold onto the tube and start the drill press. As the drill in running, you can move the tube up and down the shaft so that the Part A and B mix are completely mixed. I found that by using this method, the mix was very complete and could be done in about 1-2 minutes giving you more time to apply the sealant. Every seconds counts once part A and B mix. I did each tank in two steps; first the inner ribs to the skins then the outer two ribs and base plate to the skin. The key is to have at least one extra set of hands, acetone to clean up the mess and guarantee everything, including your tools and spares, are all laid out and ready to go. Going to the bathroom midstream with this stuff on your hands can lead to some embarrassing moments. Once the sealant begins to set, STOP! Its all done and use the remaining minutes to clean up the skins. Acetone works great and what you don't remove immeadiately will set in place forever. I used the two hour mix from Aircraft Spruce, which gives you two hours of working time... no more, no less. Good luck. Gary in NY, Project in MA RV-6 s/n 20038 final assy - 10+ years in construction and still going strong ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: Shirley Hobenshield <shobenshield(at)cmsd.bc.ca>
Subject: Re: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy
> > Now I have another problem. > > I >should order the sliding canopy or the tip-up canopy. > > the tip-up canopy has two downfalls. >1) Optically incorrect. >2) Exposed instrumentation. > >The sliding canopy also has two issues that I'm aware of: >1) Draft eminating from the rear of the canopy (I live in a rather cold >climate - Calgary, Alberta & this would be unacceptable), >2) More difficult to install (so I'm told). > Is there other factors I should be >considering? >Optically incorrect? Thats a new one. >There was an excellent thread on this subject not long ago. If you cannot >research it, contact me e-mail. Is Calgary north of Smithers B.C? Not to be rude Anthony, but RV-6 ( C-FXXG ) loves these ice mountians Ed. > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: "Jim Tennison" <jtennison.cmrl(at)veda.com>
Subject: No RV financing! - to Ken
This message is for Ken. We met at the Van's tent outside with the RV-8 kit prototype on Saturday morning. You didn't give me your email address! I decided to take the chance of getting some listers upset by trying to locate you on the list. (I'm also doing this from work - also not a good idea.) I want to send you that information on the plan I have for paying off all of your debts, including your mortgage, in 5-7 years using the money you already make. I'll also enclose the info on the home-based business in which you can earn between $8K and $10K per month in residual income. ("Homebuilders do it at home!") I know this will really make getting that RV-6QB a sounder financial achievement especially once you've paid off your mortgage, and you won't be paying all that interest to the finance company as well. Remember, do not use your credit cards. Get rid of them. Cut em up! I've also got some demo debt elimination and wealth building software that I'll email you. Ken, please reply to tennison(at)west.net. If any one else is curious, you can email me too if you want. (Sorry about this guys. Please disregard. And, I know... I'm bound to get flames! It will not happen again.) Jim RV-4 - finishing up the left elevator ________________________________________________________________________________
From: winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Subject: Re: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy
> The way I see it, the tip-up canopy has two downfalls. > 1) Optically incorrect.absolutely irrelevant; I can't imagine a situation where even if this is so, it would matter > 2) Exposed instrumentation.This is a benefit not a downfall. The biggest problem with the slider is that it is very difficult to get to your instruments when you need to inspect or service them > The sliding canopy also has two issues that I'm aware of: > 1) Draft eminating from the rear of the canopy (I live in a rather cold > climate - Calgary, Alberta & this would be unacceptable),There are ways to seal the canopy, although I must say that with my tilt-up there are no drafts what-so-ever >More difficult to install (so I'm told).I was told this too and it is the reason why I built mine with a tilt up. After doing mine, and helping my neighbor with his slider, I no longer believe this to be true. In fact it may be just the opposite. The tilt up is no joy either. Another benefit of the slider is to be able to open it up while taxiing on the ground. It does get hot in there. The tilt-up has a latch to hold it open a couple of inches when taxiing, but the full slider would be even nicer, yep, even in Canada. If I did it again, I would do the slider with the additional modification of a large removable panel in the front skin for access to the back of the panel. Andy Gold Winter Park, CO elevation-9100 (just as cold as Canada) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Subject: Re: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy
<< The sliding canopy also has two issues that I'm aware of: 1) Draft eminating from the rear of the canopy (I live in a rather cold climate - Calgary, Alberta & this would be unacceptable), 2) More difficult to install (so I'm told). >> I would disagree that the slider is more difficult than the tip-up. The draft issue can be dealt with. -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Subject: Re: the real squeaky brake solution
<< If this is new to everyone, does anybody have the phone numebr for the Cleaveland Brakes Company so i can call them? >> Check the Yeller Pages at http://www.sound.net/~hartmann/yelrpage.htm -GV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Cafgef(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Subject: Re: the real squeaky brake solution
<< re-lubed the pins with a powder graphite type lubricant. >> Graphite will make a battery with almost anything. The anything is sacraficial to the graphite. In otherwords ---> graphite will cause corrosion<----- especially with cad and zinc plating. I would advise getting the graphite off as soon as possible. Do not use it on anything!!. Please!! On the other hand some stuff that looks like graphite and is almost as good a lubricant is molybdenum disulfide. Moly will not cause corrosion. I am not sure that I would want much lub around brakes, though. Check with someone who knows about the proper lub for the brakes. Probably Cleavland would know. Gene francis cafgef(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: Mike Hartmann <hartmann(at)sound.net>
Subject: Re: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy
>The way I see it, the tip-up canopy has two downfalls. >1) Optically incorrect. >2) Exposed instrumentation. > >The sliding canopy also has two issues that I'm aware of: >1) Draft eminating from the rear of the canopy (I live in a rather cold >climate - Calgary, Alberta & this would be unacceptable), >2) More difficult to install (so I'm told). The debate continues. If the tip-up is optically incorrect, then so is the slider. They are the same canopy, cut differently for installation. The instrumentation is only 'exposed' on the tip-up when the canopy is open or removed. Many builders fabricate a simple lightweight shroud to offer protection when the canopy must be opened in the rain. Either canopy either leaks or doesn't - the responsibility for crafting an acceptable fit is left to the builder. Reports from other builders indicate that neither canopy is particularly difficult or easy to install. My advice is to follow Van's advice. Choose the canopy style you like best, or that best suits your intended use of the aircraft. In my opinion the slider looks better on the ground, the tip-up offers less restricted vision when in the air. Do you plan to park it, or fly it? - Mike hartmann(at)sound.net http://www.sound.net/~hartmann ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: Mark Reisdorfer <Reisdorfer(at)compuserve.com>
Subject: RV-8 fuselage jig for sale
Louis, I am interested in your jig. I left a message on your machine today. I wi= ll be on the road the rest of this week so e-mail may be the best way to communicate. What size is it and can I take it apart to transport? Let me know if it is still available. Thx Mark Reisdorfer 73101.73(at)compuserve.com or reisdorfer(at)compuserve.com 812-923-5059 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: fuel line routing
Date: Sep 03, 1997
I will also be deviating from the plans but will be copying a builder who will be flying way sooner than I will. The main problem with the plans is that it leaves a loop of fuel line which can not be drained and therefore represents a possible location for water accumulation and the problems which come with that. This loop is between the fuel selector valve and the firewall. I will be running my lines so they are downhill from the fuel selector to the firewall (gasolator). This puts the low points at the fuel drain on the tanks and the gasolator with no "dead" area in-between. I am building a 6A so this requires routing the lines through the web of the gear legs. I will also be mounting the boost pump almost level. I don't know why Van calls for the 45 degree angle or why he designed this routing with an area where water can accumulate. Ross Mickey rmickey@ix,netcom.com ---------- > I would like some advice on fuel line routing for the RV-6. For various > reasons I am considering a different routing from the selector valve and > the firewall than what is shown on the plans. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson)
Subject: Re: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy
My .02 on the tip-up vs slider question: 1) Optically incorrect -- how so? Whether you use the slider or the tip-up, you start with the exact same bubble. And with the tip-up, you don't have any roll bar in your line of sight, just unbroken sky. 2) Exposed instrumentation. This can be easily remedied by making a cover out of some waterproof cloth or something Most people actually consider this an advantage since you have much easier access to the back of the panel for maintenance than with the slider. 3) Sliding canopy draft -- I haven't actually flown mine so I can't really give advice on how to minimize or eliminate this, but I have flown many hours in sliding canopy RV-6s, up high and in winter, and either the builders dealt with it successfully or else it wasn't a problem to begin with, because I never got uncomfortable (except once when the heater failed!) 4) More difficult to install -- I only know about the slider which was no picnic, but tip-up types also cuss about it, so who knows. I think the slider may be more difficult but it's like hitting yourself on the head with a hammer 10 times instead of 9. I chose the slider, just because I like the way it works. I have flown many cross-country hours in (other people's) RVs , both sliders and tip-ups, and I just plain like the slider better, in spite of the main disadvantage of having the roll bar in your field of vision. But it really does just come down to a personal choice. A tip-up may in fact be better in colder climes as it is probably easier to seal against the cold and you don't care as much about keeping cool when taxiing. As for how best to build it -- there is lots of info in the rv-list archives about canopy construction techniques. When you get to that point search the archives, and feel free to email me if you do a slider and I'll try to help out however I can. Randall Henderson, RV-6 (about ready to buy/install the engine) randall(at)edt.com http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson)
Subject: Re: Canopy Paint Removal
> My RV-4 has a fine fog coat of paint on the canopy; apparently the previous > owner failed to mask adequately. Question; What chemical, if any, can be used > to clean this off? I used Naptha (after talking to Van's) to remove excess sealant around the fairing, worked great. Don't know about paint though. I'm pretty sure lacquer thinner and acetone are no-nos. The scratch removal (e.g. Micromesh) I'd think would be a last resort. I would worry about it removing unevenly around the different hardness paint/plexi, and causing distortion. Belive me, you can create distortion pretty easly with this stuff (little ripples in the surface), just by not working perpendicular to the previous step every time. I'd be afraid the paint might aggrivate this. Randall Henderson, RV-6 randall(at)edt.com http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Todd Webb <toddwe(at)MICROSOFT.com>
Subject: Suggestions for posting messages
Date: Sep 03, 1997
It would easier to sort through the emails if everyone would use a common syntax for the subject line: ie. RV6: Wing skin installation question RV6: Punch line needed RV8: Empennage construction GEN: Rivet tape suggestion We could hash out a concensus on the alias as what syntax to use? Todd Webb RV8-Waiting for my tail... ________________________________________________________________________________
From: dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle 510-606-1001)
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Subject: Re: Canopy Paint Removal
>-------------- >> My RV-4 has a fine fog coat of paint on the canopy; apparently the previous >> owner failed to mask adequately. Question; What chemical, if any, can be used >> to clean this off? > >I used Naptha (after talking to Van's) to remove excess sealant around >the fairing, worked great. Don't know about paint though. I'm pretty sure >lacquer thinner and acetone are no-nos. >-------------- I've used excessive amounts of lacquer thinner on two different canopys now and have had no problems what-so-ever. Cleans up the overspray very nicely (depending on what the spray is). Since there is no real 'standard' for lacquer thinner formula, I would experiment on a test piece of plexi first... Matt -- Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 510-606-1001 Voice | 510-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV6AIR(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Subject: Re: Harbor Freight HVLP Spray Gun
Von: That's good information. Thanks. What are the air requirements. Most of us have 25 gallon tanks with 3.5 HP compressors. I understand hose diameter may also be critical Bob Lovering RV-6 N7LA Getting ready to go to the airport. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JimNolan(at)mail.kconline.com
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Subject: Electronic Ignition
Rusty Gossard or anyone, Dave Ross and myself were discussing the installation of (one) Electronic Ingnition module and keeping the other stock slick mag. When you do this. 1. Does the slick mag stay at 25 degrees 2. Does the Electronic module (fire) at a different time than the slick mag. 3. Does this hurt the engine or make it run rough at any given speed. 4. When the engine is at idle how do you get optimum smoothness when one set of plugs are igniting the fuel at the old 25 degree setting. 5. It's not that we're dumb, we just don't know. Jim Nolan N444JN ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson)
Subject: Re: Fuel Tank Fabrication
> 2. Install the stiffeners backwards so the rivets are visible. > > I will call Van's on number 2 unless there are responses on the list > that it's a well known technique, since it does represent a deviation > from the plans. I did this on recommendation from a guy who builds RV wings for a living. It was just to make it easier to rivet the stiffeners on. I can't see any reason why it would make a difference structurally. Randall Henderson, RV-6 randall(at)edt.com http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4Brown(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 03, 1997
Subject: Re: painting
Charles: There must be 3 megabytes of information in the RV archives on primers, compressors, HVLP paint systems vs conventional paint sprayers, various paint systems and brand name recommendations. Suggest you might take a look. Tom Brown - RV4 fuselage in jig ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: John McMahon <rv6(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Would you use better engine oil?
Doug Rozendaal wrote: > > Well here goes, > > I have received several replies off the list about the oils I am > always > talking about. I have been doing some thinking, (we all know how > dangerous that is...) If I were to formulate an metalic detergent > based > engine oil based on the latest additive technology how many would be > interested in it? > > This would not be something I dream up in our lab, it would be > formulated > using the experience of major lubricant additive manufacters. And I > don't > mean Slick 50. It would not have Teflon, and it would not allow you > to run > your engine for an hour without any oil. Nothing magic or too good to > be > true. Just a way to reduce the rate at which the valve train and the > cylinder walls eat themselves. We are not talking about 4000 hour > TBO's > either. Just a statistically significant reduction in engine wear. > > I would fund the oil and oil analysis on these engines. I could not > warranty anything, but it would further the knowledge pool. I am > certain > that the majors are not going down this road because the market is > just not > there. I am not promising anything at this point but if you are > interested > drop me a note off-list at dougr(at)petroblend.com. > > I would need to first find some high timers that were using some oil > to > find out if it would plug up the valve guides. I have less concern > about > the rings. But would want to watch them as well. Obviously this > would be > a blind test and some of the engines would get the same oil they are > currently using. > > I would put in my 200 hr IO-320 160 hp. It burns less than a quart to > 20 > hours. If we could get some success on the oil burners we could > expand > into the lower timers. > > Please include: Engine > Hrs SMOH, STOH > Oil consumption > Filter or Screen > Drain Interval > Current Oil, brand, Viscosity grade, AD or mineral > Hours flown per month > Are you currently doing oil analysis? > > Also if you are happy with the oils you are using tell me that too, > that is > just as important. > > I have been harping on this subject for years, maybe it is time to put > up > or shut up.. I am about half afraid to push send but here goes.... > > Tailwinds, N240 the pink panther > Doug Rozendaal > dougr(at)netins.net > www.petroblend.com/dougr > > PS See more about the company at www.petroblend.com > Doug.... What is your findings on using Mobil 1 in Aircraft eng to date ? Much Thanks in Advance John McMahon E-Mail=rv6(at)earthlink.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: John McMahon <rv6(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: No RV financing! - to Ken
Jim Tennison wrote: > > > This message is for Ken. We met at the Van's tent outside with the > RV-8 kit > prototype on Saturday morning. You didn't give me your email > address! I > decided to take the chance of getting some listers upset by trying to > locate > you on the list. (I'm also doing this from work - also not a good > idea.) > > I want to send you that information on the plan I have for paying off > all of > your debts, including your mortgage, in 5-7 years using the money you > already > make. I'll also enclose the info on the home-based business in which > you can > earn between $8K and $10K per month in residual income. ("Homebuilders > do it > at home!") > > I know this will really make getting that RV-6QB a sounder financial > achievement especially once you've paid off your mortgage, and you > won't be > paying all that interest to the finance company as well. Remember, do > not > use your credit cards. Get rid of them. Cut em up! > > I've also got some demo debt elimination and wealth building software > that > I'll email you. > Ken, please reply to tennison(at)west.net. > If any one else is curious, you can email me too if you want. > > (Sorry about this guys. Please disregard. And, I know... I'm bound > to get > flames! It will not happen again.) > > Jim > RV-4 - finishing up the left elevator > Jim Lets here about this plan you wrer talking about John McMahon E-Mail=rv6(at)earthlink.net ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: Shirley Hobenshield <shobenshield(at)cmsd.bc.ca>
Subject: Re: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy
> >I suggest that you try and get a ride in both types. The slider is sexy on >the ground but who wants >to stay on the ground. ;-) >he tip up is also easier to get in and out, the negative of exposed >instruments is also a positive >when it comes to working on them. > >Ken >Right on Ken, > RV-6 Flying ( tip up ) > Ed. >RV6A flying (tip up) > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: mauser(at)claris.com (Richard Chandler)
Subject: Re: No RV financing! - to Ken
I hope none of this involves sending out letters that start off "Hi, my name is Dave Rhodes" because it sure sounds like that kind of stuff. -- Richard Chandler RV-6: Garage bought and being finished, saving for tools and tail kit. l info Sir, thank you for your e-mail. So far we have accumulated over 2500 hours of bench testing, in January 1995 we began with the testing of engines assembled out of quantity production components. In order to develop firewall-forward solutions we are operating cowled engines in our own windtunnel. The first fixed-wing aircraft to use our engines will be the aerobatic competition aircraft EXTRA 300 which is scheduled to fly the ZO 02A. We are currently in the concurrent JAR-E (European) and FAR 33 certification program. The usual way would have been to address the European (JAR-E) certification first before handling the US (FAR 33) certification procedure. With both the German and US aviation authorities having agreed upon a concurrent certification, we expect to have both Type Certificates available during 1998 - but, as with any leading edge technology, precise schedules are difficult to predict. It is part of our company policy to sell certified engines only; we consider the certification as a further proof of the design validity and production quality. We expect to ship certified engines in two years. Prices will be competitive to e.g. Lycoming engines of similar horsepower output, but there is no final price list yet. To obtain further data you might want to poll our brochure from our fax (++49 89 342451) or visit our webpage at: http://www.zoche.de Sincerely, Dr. Stefan Ittner ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Lothar Klingmuller <lothark(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Canopy Paint Removal
Date: Sep 04, 1997
> >My RV-4 has a fine fog coat of paint on the canopy; apparently the previous >owner failed to mask adequately. Question; What chemical, if any, can be used >to clean this off? Try a very clean cotton rag with acetone. This worked of my C175 windshield some years agoe when I had some overspray. Lothar* Klingmuller | lothark(at)worldnet.att.net | Denver (303) 922-2329 h & FAX ||6A: continueing w/ fuse'ge when garage is build || *(pron'd: "low-TARR") ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: Temple Ingram <tbingram(at)huntleigh.net>
Subject: Other Engine Alternatives
I am a lurker until now. I am working on the stabilizer of a 6A, so I am a long way from needing an engine. The October, 1997 Kitplanes has a short story on turboprop engines "available now" from Gateway Aviation, Mike and John Sprouse for homebuilts. They are "U.S.-manufactured industrial turbine engines" which the Sprouses will "turn into compact, light-weight and affordable turbine powerplants for aviation experimenters." "Factory-rated 225 shaft horsepower, 215 pounds with starter, generator, and gearbox, 180 w/o gearbox, $19,500 without gearbox." One downside is the minimum fuel burn listed is 16 gallons/hour, which is a lot more than the 260 hp IO540 in my Comanche burns. Anyway, I was wondering if anyone has any thoughts/reactions to the article? Although I have no experience or knowledge about turbines, I have always thought it would be nice to have a competitively priced turboprop as an alternative to consider. Now I'll go back to lurking. Temple Ingram ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: Bill Pace <wbpace(at)adnc.com>
Subject: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys)
Although not directly RV related, this really is a terribly important topic so I have chosen to respond both "on-list" and directly to Dick Knapinski. I apologize in advance for the long post. >I think one comment that said the Board really doesn't care about the >homebuilders or other groups within EAA is mistaken. The Board is >certainly open to ideas from any part of the membership. That's not to >say that every idea will be adopted, but I can say that all are >considered at a Board or administrative level. >To that end, what programs or activities do you think would be valuable >for homebuilders to erase the impression stated by some that the >organization "doesn't care"? I'm EAA, but not a chapter member so some of this may be out of line. Anyway, here's my $0.02. I suspect that one major reason people feel left out is that they do not have any personal contact with EAA executives. There is really no good forum for debate within the organization that includes the faithful on a regular basis. The flow of information is primarily one way, with EAA presenting the party line in Sport Aviation. AOPA's Phil Boyer makes a substantial effort to reach members by traveling all over the country for his Town Meetings. He seems to come by San Diego every two years or so. Tom Poberezny needs to build a personal relationship with his members and would be well advised to institute a similar program. He and his VPs and possibly Board Members should consider making visits to Chapter meetings all over the US on a regular and continual basis. In this way can they start to meet those who cannot (or will not) go to the annual convention. And only in this way can the masses get the undivided attention of these men for a few hours at a time, something which is impossible in the Oshkosh setting. I also read another post where the author suggested grants for Chapter homebuilding projects, YE and the like. This touches directly on the issue of the "Big Money" being made by the convention. As far as I can see, most if not all of this money stays in Wisconson. HQ needs to find ways to funnel some of these profits back to the grassroots rather than just make the convention bigger and bigger (which does _not_ help anyone not living around Oshkosh very much). Programs which support chapter building through targeted grants should be seriously considered. For example, one of the strongest recruiting elements a chapter could have is ownership of a hanger. A program to provide a little seed or matching money to help build or purchase this hanger could greatly strengthen a chapter. More direct support for YE flights is not a bad idea either, although (I believe) not as effective in chapter building. In any case, the aforementioned meeting program would allow HQ to gather the information it needs to create effective programs. To paraphrase other sentiments, I would rather save EAA than quit it. It is a worthy organization, it just needs a little help in getting closer to it's members. I'm appalled at the voting process as much as the next guy, but that can be reformed if we can get HQ to improve communications. EAA and AOPA are the only real influence we have on government policy and replacing that with a new or different and just-as-effective organization is very difficult at the least. My two cents. ----- Bill Pace wbpace(at)adnc.com RV-6A Wings in jigs ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com>
Subject: Re: Electronic Ignition
>Electronic Ingnition module and keeping the other stock slick mag. > When you do this. >1. Does the slick mag stay at 25 degrees >2. Does the Electronic module (fire) at a different time than the >slick mag. >3. Does this hurt the engine or make it run rough at any given speed. >4. When the engine is at idle how do you get optimum smoothness when >one set of plugs are igniting the fuel at the old 25 degree setting. > Jim Nolan N444JN Jim, I'm using Jeff Rose's electronic ignition on my O-320. I replaced the right mag and have a Bendix mag with impulse on the left. The mag timing stays at spec. (on my engine, 25 degrees). The electronic stays at 25 degrees at full power, take off. The advance comes in to play at reduced manifold pressure due to either reduced throttle or higher altitude. At idle , the electronic stays at 25 degrees and the engine runs very smoothly. The only downside to the Rose ignition is the attachment of the automotive type spark plug wires, a rubber grommet that squeezes down on the wire when the nut is tightened. You can get carried away torquing the nut down and you can break the wire. I prefer to tighten the nut down solid, which you can't do with the auto wires/nuts. I wish he'd come up with a similar setup to what we're all familiar with. Otherwise, I'm very satisfied with the unit which bolts into the right mag hole (as opposed to those systems with gears and a pick up on the front of the engine. Bob Skinner RV-6 bskinr(at)trib.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com>
Subject: Re: the real squeaky brake solution
>Graphite will make a battery with almost anything. >Do not use it on anything!!. Please!! > >On the other hand some stuff that looks like graphite and is almost as good a >lubricant is molybdenum disulfide. Moly will not cause corrosion. I am not >sure that I would want much lub around brakes, though. >Check with someone who knows about the proper lub for the brakes. Probably >Cleavland would know. I use Moly on the pins on my brakes and have had no problems. Of course, I never had any problems with any of the other airplanes that I've owned, either. I know some mechanics spray WD40 on the pins but I don't like to do this as it invites dust to stick and gum things up. It seems that in all of the brake systems that I've serviced at annual (mechanics little helper, I'm not an A&P or IA---just did the distasteful jobs for them---my winter job) that have been sprayed with WD40 did get gummy with dirt. The spray planes were the worst. If an airplane was flown on pavement and/or infrequently, the pins generally stayed fairly clean. Anyway, On my RV-6, I lightly Scotchbrited the holes and the pins, de-greased and applied a very light coating of Moly---very light. You really don't need to use very much. There should be no visible "gobs" of the stuff on the pins. Just use enough so that the metal changes color. I use Moly on all of my hinges, as well. For the horizontal cowl pins, I polished the pins, applied Moly and slid them in and out of the hinge loops to transfer some Moly. My pins now easily slide in and out of the cowl. I do clean the hinge pin every once in awhile and apply a small amount of Moly. Bob Skinner RV6 bskinr(at)trib.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: "Mark D Hiatt" <OttoPilot_MSN(at)classic.msn.com>
Subject: RE: Gen: Suggestions for posting messages
I like the idea, Todd, except that the airplanes each have so much in common with one another that it's hard to say what *really* doesn't apply. There are things about -3s that would appeal to -4, -6 and -8 builders. I'd hate to miss out on something because someone had tagged it as being about the RV8 and I'd been in a hurry that day only read RV6 messages. And you're going to get posts that straddle the line. The riveting technique portion would apply to all airplanes, but the RV8 cowling discussion would be of little interest to the -4 builders, etc. I think it would be easier to split the list up into an RV-General list, an RV-8 List, RV-6 list, and so forth. And even then, I'm not sure I'd want to give up hearing so much good stuff from so many good people (about such good airplanes!). I'm not even sure folks would go along with it, though--look how many requests we still get to be removed or added to the list, and how many people still quote whole messages, even though the new Matronics tag asks us not to. Mark D Hiatt Visit us on MSN v2! OttoPilot_MSN@msn.com http://Forums.msn.com/Aviation Aviation Forum Manager, AvChat Mondays 10pm Eastern The Microsoft Network mic://Chat.msn.com/AvChat It would easier to sort through the emails if everyone would use a common syntax for the subject line: ie. RV6: Wing skin installation question RV6: Punch line needed RV8: Empennage construction GEN: Rivet tape suggestion We could hash out a consensus on the alias as what syntax to use? Todd Webb ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: "les williams" <lesliebwilliams(at)classic.msn.com>
Subject: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy
Anthony, 1. The optics would be the same as the same type canopy is used on either one. I don't believe it is optically incorrect. The tip-up offers visibility without the roll-bar and center support tube. 2. The exposed area behind the instrument panel on the tip-up gives better accessability to some things, which is a plus in my opinion. It does offer the potential of getting things wet if not opened quickly when water is standing on the canopy unless an inner cover is installed. 3. The tip-up offers better egress than the slider, neither is bad. 4. I believe the tip-up is a little lighter, overall. 5. The tip-up is a little cheaper ($120, last I checked). 6. The slider offers a cooler look when it's open, some also say when closed. 7. The slider offers cooler occupants when open in the parked or taxi mode. 8. Air leaks are not a problem with the tip-up, but there are some with the slider. 9. Both are considered by most to be one of the more challenging items to build. The majority of the builders I've talked with that have done both, say the slider is more difficult but that may be because, like me, it was a while between planes and I seem to have forgotten a lot of the frustrations I had with my first. I think that about covers it (pun intended). Good luck! Les Williams/RV-6AQ/N24LW (RES) ---------- From: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com on behalf of Anthony Wiebe Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 1997 8:26 PM Subject: RV-List: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy I would appreciate any feedback on this subject including work-arounds to the various short-comings. Is there other factors I should be considering? Thanks for your assistance. Anthony Wiebe Calgary, Alberta, Canada ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: Ronald Vandervort <rvanderv(at)linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>
Subject: Re: Another Fuel Line Reroute.....?
Why do we never see the fuel line to firewall along the right side? Seems to me with the engine fuel pump inlet on the right side of pump and outlet on the left side of pump it would be more direct to go along the right side with boost pump and fuel line, through the firewall on the right side, on the way to engine driven pump. I know the blue prints show the left side, and that probably is the reason most lines are run on the left....The side of the "Pied Piper"! Am I missing something? By the way, my neighbor reversed the inlet and outlet on his pump...; just rotate the sandwitched plate 180 degrees. With that situation then the outlet of the pump is pointing east when the carb inlet is pointing east so still not the as straight as running line along right side . Ron Vandervort, RV-6Q mounting engine ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)idacom.hp.com>
Subject: Re: Suggestions for posting messages
Date: Sep 04, 1997
Another nice touch is if people use the reply feature of their email program when replying to a posting. I have all my RV-List messages automatically sorted to an HTML file, so I can scan them by subject thread or author. This works great when all the replies to a topic are true replies (that is, have "Re:" preppended to the subject line). Don't forget to check the address, though. Tedd McHenry Surrey, BC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)idacom.hp.com>
Subject: Oshkosh Stats(EAA Proxys)
Date: Sep 04, 1997
I think the EAA is a great organization, of which we all (the members) should be proud. The EAA has real influence on aviation policy. Speaking without any real knowledge, I'll bet few countries outside of the US and Canada have private aviation organizations that have that much influence over aviation policy, and can effectively promote sport aviation regulations that are as progressive as ours (again, both Canada and the US). Work at improving it, to be sure. But also appreciate how good it already is. Someone mentioned that members were too isolated from the executive. How about an email listserver for the EAA? Perhaps it would be too big and impersonal. Tedd McHenry Surrey, BC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)idacom.hp.com>
Subject: Re: Other Engine Alternatives
Date: Sep 04, 1997
Temple Ingram writes: > > The October, 1997 Kitplanes has a short story on turboprop engines > "available now" from Gateway Aviation, Mike and John Sprouse for > homebuilts. I had a look at some turboprops like these at Arlington--not sure if they were the Gateway ones or not. They are built from surplus GPU engines, or something like that. They looked a bit cobby, but sound (so far as my naked eye can tell, which isn't very far). Yes, the fuel burn is a big problem. Also, I didn't see any in the right hp range. There was one in the 100-hp range, and one in the well-over-200-hp range, but nothing in the 150-200-hp range. With the fuel burn, you definitely wouldn't want to use more engine than you needed. I would think that the best approach, for a turboprop on an RV, would be to have about 150 shp, and cruise at 90 percent power (or 90 percent torque, depending on how it's instrumented). Turbines a nice to fly, for sure. But the fuel burn would be a real detractor, unless you flew long cross countries almost exclusively. And then there's all the engineering of a unique installation. Tedd McHenry Surrey, BC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pbennett(at)zip.com.au
Date: Sep 04, 1997
Subject: Re: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy
> In my opinion the > slider looks better on the ground, the tip-up offers less restricted vision > when in the air. Do you plan to park it, or fly it? I selected the slider because it can be opened for partial vision on approach if you should ever get an oil leak which covers the windscreen. It has happened. Before selecting I checked with Van's that this is safe. Below 100mph it is safe and the slider sits a few inches open quite happily. The sex appeal comes free with the safety. I'm just finishing mine and can attest that it is fiddly but not really difficult. Peter Bennett Sydney Australia RV6 engine arrived! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: Tom Martin <fairlea(at)execulink.com>
Subject: fuel cross tube
I know two RV-4s that are using a cross tube between their fuel tanks. The one pilot never moves his fuel selector and says that the fuel is always balanced between tanks. Now I have heard the stories about uneven fuel feed and running one tank dry but having the other full, but this system has worked for these pilots for years and hundreds of hours. There are also lots stories of pilots who forget to change tanks and have problems as well! Has any one any opions about this. As well they plumb their return fuel line to this cross over tube. Tom Martin RV-4 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: jbalbierer(at)nysyr.ang.af.mil
Date: Sep 04, 1997
Subject: Canopy Paint Removal
charset=US-ASCII LP Aero Plastics puts out a pamphlet on working with your plexi canopy. There is a world of information in their literature. I had sticky tape residue on my canopy. I looked for that pamphlet and found that isopropal alcohol and kerosene were recommended. I used kerosene. It worked fine with no harm to the plastic. I polished it soon after with mirror glaze because the kerosene dried the plastic and created much static. Warm water after the kerosene helps too. John Balbierer ------------- Original Text ________________________________________________________________________________ My RV-4 has a fine fog coat of paint on the canopy; apparently the previous owner failed to mask adequately. Question; What chemical, if any, can be used to clean this off? I've used scratch removal compound, but this is a very slow process. Any better ideas? Am guessing laquer thinner would remove it, but would probably attack the plastic too. Unrelated Tip; For outside air temp, I used one of those $1.99 stick-on thermometer strips that changes color. I put it right against the skin on the inside of my RV-4, out of the direct path of vents, etc. Aluminum transfers outside air temperature so well, that this strip, even though inside, seems to give me a reasonably accurate idea of the outside temperature. Might not work on those aircraft with heaters, mine doesn't have one, but for $1.99, what the heck, right? Happy flying Von Alexander N107RV | | ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 02, 1997
From: Tom Lempicke <tlempicke(at)InfoAve.Net>
Subject: getting on list
I would like to be added to your list. What is the proceedure? -- Tom Lempicke Country Squire Airport Squire Road and Falls Road Rock Hill, S. C. 29730 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: rust47rg(at)one.net
Date: Sep 04, 1997
Subject: Re: Electronic Ignition
> >Rusty Gossard or anyone, > Dave Ross and myself were discussing the installation of (one) >Electronic Ingnition module and keeping the other stock slick mag. > When you do this. >1. Does the slick mag stay at 25 degrees >2. Does the Electronic module (fire) at a different time than the >slick mag. >3. Does this hurt the engine or make it run rough at any given speed. >4. When the engine is at idle how do you get optimum smoothness when >one set of plugs are igniting the fuel at the old 25 degree setting. >5. It's not that we're dumb, we just don't know. > Jim Nolan N444JN > Jim: The stock mag stays at 25 degrees. The Electroair fires at a different time (earlier as manifold pressure dereases) It helps the engine at all settings. The plugs fired by the electronic side are igniting the burn at the optimum time resulting in a more complete burn and better flame pattern in the cylinder. Actually when you do your run up there is no drop when you shut off the mag as the electronic side is so efficient. I am also told the electronic has a more accurate trigger so the unit fires +- 1/2 degree vs. +-2 degrees for the mag. Regards: Rusty Gossard N47RG RV-4 Flying since 8-94 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Glen Watson" <gtwatson(at)students.wisc.edu>
Subject: Re: RV-4 wing spar question
Date: Sep 04, 1997
I don't see any reference to a 2" hole for the heat hose in the plans. Where does this hole go? Glen ---------- From: aol.com!Mlfred(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: RV-List: RV-4 wing spar question Date: Tuesday, September 02, 1997 7:56 AM Do this at the same time that you're building up the #4 blkhd. It's easy then, diffucult later. BTW, cut the 2" hole for the heat hose at this time, too. Check six! Mark ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: "JHTH " <JHTH(at)classic.msn.com>
Subject: Suggestions for posting messages
Todd - Great idea! John Hall ---------- From: owner-rv-list(at)matronics.com on behalf of Todd Webb Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 1997 12:31 PM Subject: RV-List: Suggestions for posting messages It would easier to sort through the emails if everyone would use a common syntax for the subject line: ie. RV6: Wing skin installation question RV6: Punch line needed RV8: Empennage construction GEN: Rivet tape suggestion We could hash out a concensus on the alias as what syntax to use? Todd Webb RV8-Waiting for my tail... ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 03, 1997
From: Shirley Hobenshield <shobenshield(at)cmsd.bc.ca>
Subject: Re: No RV financing! - to Ken
> >If any one else is curious, you can email me too if you want. > > > >Jim >RV-4 - finishing up the left elevator > .I'm listening Jim. . Ed. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: Don McNamara <mcnamara(at)sbt.infi.net>
Subject: Re: No RV financing! - to Ken
Jim Tennison wrote: > > I want to send you that information on the plan I have for paying off all of > your debts, including your mortgage, in 5-7 years using the money you already > make. I'll also enclose the info on the home-based business in which you can > earn between $8K and $10K per month in residual income. ("Homebuilders do it > at home!") > > I know this will really make getting that RV-6QB a sounder financial > achievement especially once you've paid off your mortgage, and you won't be > paying all that interest to the finance company as well. Remember, do not > use your credit cards. Get rid of them. Cut em up! Just out of curiosity---if this is so great, how come you're building an RV instead of flying one of your warbirds?? :) --Don ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bumflyer(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 04, 1997
Subject: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy one more 2 cents
All of the RV options can spark a lively discussion. I think the slider debate is second only to the tail dragger vs. 6A. It is truly a personal choice thing. I feel all Van's canopy designs are elegant engineering accomplishments which are unmatched by the competition. Not bashful about my opinion, so here it is. The tip up is faster, cheaper, easier to build, has better visibility and is lighter. I've found agreement among all builders on these points. I would personally disagree that the slider is harder to build, with the caveat that you read Jim Cone's hints and use the Orndorff tape. So I say build a slider if you like it better. None of these considerations are huge differences. I did and I love my slider. It does not leak air in the rear. It is not harder to get in although I thought it would be. The lack of access to the instruments is a major pain in the back but can be addressed by holding off on the top forward skin until everything is in place on the panel and checked out. If you are still torn, ask someone who has experienced both, like George Orndorff. Would you go back to the tip up, George? All you listers get out to Burlington and ask the builders and see for yourself. If it's half as good as last year, it will be marvelous. RV's of all types and lots of builders on hand to talk to. If you can't get a ride in one, I'll eat my hat. If Jim Cone shows up you ought to be able to get two rides. Since Burlington is practically on his extended down wind he should be there unless he has to work for a living that weekend. D Walsh, RV-6A 53 Hrs. Getting ready to paint someday. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com>
Subject: Re: Another Fuel Line Reroute.....?
>Why do we never see the fuel line to firewall along the right side? >Seems to me with the engine fuel pump inlet on the right side of pump and >outlet on the left side of pump it would be more direct to go along >the right side with boost pump and fuel line, through the >firewall on the right side, on the way to engine driven pump. >Ron Vandervort, RV-6Q mounting engine Ron, This is how I routed my fuel line and it works fine. I'll do the same routing on my next RV. My reasoning was the same as yours, a straight shot at the mechanical fuel pump from the gascolator on the right side of the firewall. This eleminates a bend in a fuel line and lessens the clutter in the engine compartment. Speaking of gascolators, I'm thinking of going to a filter installation on the next six and eliminating the gascolator Speaking of clutter, when you first hang the engine, there looks like there is so much "open space" on the firewall. It's surprising how cramped things get by the time the engine installation is completed. Bob Skinner RV-6 bskinr(at)trib.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4131rb(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 04, 1997
Subject: Re: Canopy Paint Removal
<< My RV-4 has a fine fog coat of paint on the canopy; apparently the previous owner failed to mask adequately. Question; What chemical, if any, can be used to clean this off? >> Von, Most wont agree with this but I used accetone to clean the overspray off of mine with no negative affects. You might try it in a corner area thats unnoticeable. Ryan ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim Sears <sears(at)searnet.com>
Subject: RV-6A Gear leg mounts
Date: Sep 04, 1997
Listers, I'm in the process of drilling the gear legs. I need to drill for the = bolts on the side of the fuselage. For those who have drilled the mounts, you = know there are 3 bolts that you can't drill from the inside. Per the manual, the tanks have been removed which gives a clean shot at the side of the fuselage for drilling. The problem is the amount= of work needed to remove the tanks. Per George Orndorff, wait until the wings come off and drill the bolts = at that time. The problem is, I'm afraid the mount may shift a little when = the bolts are removed from the mount and wings. I looked at the Justice method and got the impression he did his with the wings off. Mine are in place. Looking at the archives was a joke. = Getting the note ot match the title was a farce and a wast of valuable = time. So, listers who've gone through this, what did you do? Jim Sears RV-6A #22220 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mlfred(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 04, 1997
Subject: Re: RV-4 wing spar question
<> page 40. Watch the floor rib & floor support angle placements on BOTH sides of the #4 blkhd. It's tight, but do-able. Check six & keep warm! Mark ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mitch Faatz <mfaatz(at)sagenttech.com>
Subject: Tip-up VS. Sliding Canopy
Date: Sep 04, 1997
>The debate continues. >... > >In my opinion the slider looks better on the ground, >the tip-up offers >less restricted vision when in the air. Do you plan to park it, or fly it? My reasoning for going with the slider was this: the slider offers much better cooling while sitting in my plane fiddling around, taxiing, etc. Once in the air either plane will be sufficiently cool because the vents do a decent job. I hate being hot. If I lived in Canada I might have gone with the tip-up. If you can swing it, get a ride in both styles before deciding like I did. Mitch Faatz San Jose, CA N727MF (reserved) RV-6AQME fitting rudder pedals / brakes and starting canopy (yikes!) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson)
Subject: Re: fuel line routing
[snip!] > I don't > know why Van calls for the 45 degree angle or why he designed this routing > with an area where water can accumulate. Actually the 45 degree angle is per Facet's instruction sheet. They don't explain why -- I'm going to give them a call and ask them about it. Regarding the low spot -- I hadn't thought of this. I suppose a quick drain at the low spot would probably not be a bad idea either....? Another question (in case I don't get ahold of Facet) -- does anyone know how many amps this thing draws? The instructions say to use a 16ga wire or greater (!!!) but don't specify amperage. Bob Nuckolls expressed surprise at this when I asked him, he seemed to think it would only draw a couple of amps. I am at a loss as to how big a breaker to put on it. Randall Henderson, RV-6 randall(at)edt.com http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: UFOBUCK(at)aol.com
Date: Sep 04, 1997
Subject: Re: No RV financing! - to Ken
To Anyone who Is Interested In This Kind Of Come-On : Grab your cheeks and spread wide because you are about to get the shaft. B.Clary ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: Denny Harjehausen <retflygtiger(at)proaxis.com>
Subject: Re: fuel cross tube
> >I know two RV-4s that are using a cross tube between their fuel tanks. The >one pilot never moves his fuel selector and says that the fuel is always >balanced between tanks. Now I have heard the stories about uneven fuel feed >and running one tank dry but having the other full, Reasons to think about before making two tanks into one big tank is a major leak in one tank or separate source in case of a remote possiblity of contaminates in one tank. This was address in the Rvator a few years ago. The article had other reasons also that I do not recall now. Have a good one! Denny, RV-6 (R)N641DH Fuselage-top side Lebanon, OR ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: Denny Harjehausen <retflygtiger(at)proaxis.com>
Subject: Re: Suggestions for posting messages
> >It would easier to sort through the emails if everyone >would use a common syntax for the subject line: ie. > >RV6: Wing skin installation question >RV6: Punch line needed >RV8: Empennage construction >GEN: Rivet tape suggestion > >We could hash out a concensus on the alias as what >syntax to use? > >Todd Webb >RV8-Waiting for my tail... Todd, I agree. There always some blurb about the Archive, which would be a great tool if we would follow the suggestion you made. Have a good one! Denny, RV-6 (R)N641DH Fuselage-top side Lebanon, OR ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: Scott Gesele <scottg(at)icsnet.com>
Subject: Re: fuel line routing
>Another question (in case I don't get ahold of Facet) -- does anyone >know how many amps this thing draws? The instructions say to use a >16ga wire or greater (!!!) but don't specify amperage. Bob Nuckolls >expressed surprise at this when I asked him, he seemed to think it >would only draw a couple of amps. I am at a loss as to how big a breaker >to put on it. During installation, I put an ammeter on mine. It draws about 1.5A. I used a 5 amp breaker and ran 22 gauge wire to it. During test runs and taxi tests the breaker didn't trip. Hope this helps. Scott Gesele N506RV (getting close to FAA inspection :)) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: Rob Hatwell <hatters(at)overvne.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Is 210 Degrees Engine Oil Temp To Hot ?
In message <970902222459_533839307(at)emout11.mail.aol.com>, aol.com!RVator(at)matronics.com writes >Steve Schmitz wrote. > I discovered quite by accident that by turning off my Loran, My electric >oil temp guage would indicate about 10 degrees cooler. Turned my radio off >and it dropped another 5 or so, turned the transponder off and the reading >dropped another 3 degrees or so. > Obviously I have a wireing "guage" glitch or some other anomoly, but you >might check it out and recieve some cheap peace of mind. > IMHO the above are classic symtoms for wire resistance/poor joint/earthing problems. If you have used either the airframe or separate wires as the return i.e. 0V path, you have either a poor joint somewhere or the wire size is not big enough for the current and it is developing a potential (voltage) across the resistence on this path. This also applies to the power side, 12V. V=IR (voltage=current*resistance) Each time you switch a device on due to the path resistance approximately no more current will flow and it will rob power from the other devices which equates in lower voltage to the other devices which shows up as a temp change on your oil temp. I reckon Steve if you measure the supply voltage on the back of the temp gauge it will alter as you switch each other device on or off especially the large power items. I would suspect the biggest voltage change would be the loran (10deg temp change) Just a point to note: Check the volt drop per length of wire at the amps you are going to draw for a particular piece of equipment and make sure the volt drop is acceptable. You might have to go to a larger wire. My 2d (tupence to the dollar lot) worth RV8 80274 -- Rob Hatwell ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: Sharlene Shipley or Bruce Knoll <snsbfk(at)mail.sage.net>
Subject: Re: No RV financing! - to Ken
WE ARE ALL WAITING FOR THIS FINANCIAL SOLUTION TO ALL OUR PROBLEMS. Please send info to the list quickley Bruce Knoll > >Jim Tennison wrote: >> >> I want to send you that information on the plan I have for paying off all of >> your debts, including your mortgage, in 5-7 years using the money you already >> make. I'll also enclose the info on the home-based business in which you can >> earn between $8K and $10K per month in residual income. ("Homebuilders do it >> at home!") >> >> I know this will really make getting that RV-6QB a sounder financial >> achievement especially once you've paid off your mortgage, and you won't be >> paying all that interest to the finance company as well. Remember, do not >> use your credit cards. Get rid of them. Cut em up! > > >Just out of curiosity---if this is so great, how come you're building an >RV instead of flying one of your warbirds?? :) > >--Don > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Sep 04, 1997
From: Jim Cimino <jcimino(at)epix.net>
Subject: No RV-financing
Can we leave the Spam for the newsgroups? If you want to talk get rich quick, do it on personal e-mail. Jim Cimino RV-8 sn 80039 http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/5771 (717)842-4057 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Chris Hinch <chris(at)dcc.govt.nz>
Subject: Re: Suggestions for posting messages
Date: Sep 05, 1997
Great idea, Todd. I hope you don't mind, I put together a possible starting point. It's probably not a good idea to have too many categories (I think I've got too many here ...), and adherence could be on a best individual effort basis, rather than strictly enforced?

August 27, 1997 - September 04, 1997

RV-Archive.digest.vol-dh