RV-Archive.digest.vol-dn
October 20, 1997 - October 24, 1997
and pushed a bit, etc. A short manual pushing operation would be preferable
to a repair bill for a cooked Lyc, as you are well aware of.
Doug Rozendaal: what happens to our oils at temps past 250F? Ouch, I'm sure.
My 2 cents, which by now leaves me short a few bucks....
Check six!
Mark
HR 2 185 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Hintenlang <dhinten(at)nervm.nerdc.ufl.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Florida builders |
Hi Tom!
Are you looking for a new project, or asking for the EAA Chapter? :-)
How's the KR-2? There are a few (at least 3) RV6 builders in the
Ocala area that I know of, but I don't know if they are on the list.
Dave Hintenlang
Tom Crawford wrote:
>
>
> Are there any RV builders on this list in the North or Central Florida
> area? Please E-Mail me privately.
>
> TIA,
>
> Tom Crawford
> Gainesville, FL
> tomc(at)afn.org
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
| Subject: | Mazda Rotary Power Plant and Two hours needed in RV- |
6
charset="iso-8859-1"
Ed,
I can't help you with air time. I'm still building the fuselage. I
can't wait to see your airplane, though. Fly up here to the northeast
when you can.
Steve Soule
Huntington, Vermont
<<<....Have completed an RV-6A powered with fuel
injected Mazda Rotary (Wankel) 13B engine. Awaiting FAA
inspection ....>>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sharlene Shipley or Bruce Knoll <snsbfk(at)mail.sage.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Edwards Air Force Base Open House |
>If anyone has any suggestion on operation of a HOT engine on the ground
>for extended waits, please advise.
Hi Gary,
The answer is to not be insuch a hurry. I was riding with John Morgan (from
Vans) at Osh on a demo ride and we had70+ aircraft ahead of us. When the
oil started to get hot, he said its not worth the trauma to the engine. We
pulled off to the side and waited for the line to shorten.
Bruce Knoll
Ordering the empennage today- 6A
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Anderson Ed" <AndersonE(at)bah.com> |
| Subject: | Mazda Rotary Power Plant and Two hours needed in RV- |
Hi Steve,
Appreciate the thought just the same. Probably won't be traveling afar
until next spring, but would love to see the leaves in Vermont in the fall.
If you get down to the Washington D.C. area, let me know.
Ed
----------
From: Stephen J. Soule
Subject: RE: RV-List: Mazda Rotary Power Plant and Two hours needed in RV-
Date: Monday, October 20, 1997 10:21AM
Ed,
I can't help you with air time. I'm still building the fuselage. I
can't wait to see your airplane, though. Fly up here to the northeast
when you can.
Steve Soule
Huntington, Vermont
<<<....Have completed an RV-6A powered with fuel
injected Mazda Rotary (Wankel) 13B engine. Awaiting FAA
inspection ....>>>
|
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Control stick |
| From: | n5lp <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
>
>With my fancy MAC control grips installed and flying in my garage, the
>control stick is very high and uncomfortable. Maybe this is the height of
>my seat or my height but I am considering cutting an inch or two off the
>stick. Does anyone have actual experience they can share with me and the
>group concerning this process.
>
>Regards,
>
>Charles Golden
Charles,
Maybe your Mac grips have extended the length of the sticks a significant
amount and it wouldn't hurt to do a little trimming, but be aware the
fabled RV feel is predicated on the standard stick length. A shorter
stick will mean higher control pressures and more sensitive controls; an
unhappy combination.
In cruise, where feel doesn't matter, it is always possible to grip the
stick down below the grip.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
Pacer N8025D
RV-6QME N441LP Reserved
Rudder Pedals and Stick
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Control stick |
>Charles Golden
For what it's worth, I had to cut my control stick down. I didn't use a
stick grip other than a bicycle sponge cover, but if the stick was moved all
the way forward, it would hit the bottom of the instr. panel. and not get
full movement. I figured with my poor flying, I would be doing a lot of
spin recoveries, so I cut it off short enough that with my thumb on top of
the stick, it would clear the bottom of the instr. panel. Worked for me.
John Darby
Stephenville TX
johnd@our-town.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrownTool(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Drill bits: was Tools |
<< All the bits I bought from my hardware store are 135 degrees, and only
about 50% of them are also split point. Hold one up and compare it to the
correct 118 degree drill bit and you can see that the 135 degree one is
quite a bit "blunter". >>
While we could go on for days about the technical descriptions of drill bits,
I think it is imortant for people to know, that MOST drill bits sold at
hardware stores are in fact 118 degree, typically if a 135 degree drill bit
is available at one of these stores, it is described as "heavy duty" and
comes with a premium price. While there are plenty of aircraft technicians
out there who prefer 118 degree by personal preference, I dare say the vast
majority prefer and recommend 135 degree split point drills. (By the way
drills smaller than 1/16" are typically not available in split point)
Perhaps those that are concerned about what type of drill to use should buy
one of each style and try them out on a scrap piece of aluminum and come up
with their own preference.
Not an Expert, just sharing my expereience,
Michael Brown
Brown Aviation Tool Supply Co.
BrownTool(at)aol.com
1-800-587-3883
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Gold Canopy Coating |
Back in January there were a couple messages from Jack Abell on a gold
and hard coating process for the canopy which was offered by Olen Nelson
of Aero Sound Shield in Van Nuys. Jack, you indicated you planned to do
it... did you? If so, how did it work out? Gil Alexander, the note
said you checked into it too... any comments? Has anyone else looked
into this coating or something similar? Any other sources? (Houston
area, NASA supplier maybe?) Any comments pro or con (I know it ain't
cheap:() are welcome.
--
Greg Young gyoung@cs-sol.com
Citabria N90AV
RV-6 s/n 23070 skinning fuselage,
starting to worry about rightside-up stuff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RELOSVCS!WESTREG!EHENSON(at)cldwell.attmail.com (Henson, Eric) |
| Subject: | Re: Emergency Slides? (chatter) |
>>How about airbags and ejection seats? Who makes these items, and should
we
add them to the Yeller Pages?
-GV
Gary the saying once went, "meet your maker in a Martin Baker". Probably was
a little harsh.
Eric Henson
once was a Marine Phantom seat mech.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bumflyer(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Control stick |
In a message dated 10/19/97 21:35:39, you wrote:
>but I am considering cutting an inch or two off the
>
>stick. Does anyone have actual experience they can share with me and the
>
>group concerning this process.
I love my MAC grips. While I flew with military grips for years, I find the
spongy MAC to be far superior, perhaps because I don't wear gloves while
flying any more. My only problem is the elevator trim buttons do not seem to
be in just the right place for easy thumb trimming on take off. Some day I
will try a different kind of button than the flush ones, but don't want to
screw with it right now for such a minor thing.
I cut about an inch and a quarter off each stick, but now after much trial
and observing others fly with my stick, I believe you will be happiest with
the MAC if you sit in the plane in a relaxed fecal position and see where
your flying hand naturally falls along the stick. The bottom ridge on the
grip makes a marvelous 'rest' for the bottom of your hand, so you want its
height to be the same as (or slightly higher than) the "at rest" position of
your hand.. You would then cut accordingly. BTW I use the forgoing
scientific term for the sitting position that one assumes for a bowel
movement while seated on an indoor facility.
Needless to say this is a very subjective view, but I must say all who have
tried my grips have remarked favorably.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <charliekuss(at)sprintmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Lessons in survival . . . |
Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:
snipped
> 4. I now suspected the rectifier diodes in the alternator.
> Removed alternator (discovered a cracked mounting bracket).
> Connected the D-Cell flashlight battery from the Field terminal
> to ground. Attached oscilloscope to output terminals, then
> spun the pulley with my Makita (knew that buffer pad attachment
> would come in handy some day). The output should look like
> series of contiguous humps. Instead, every-other hump (or was
> it every third?) was missing. Diode bridge is bad.
Bob,
Thank you for the great troubleshooting tip. I have one
comment/question. Most folks don't have oscilloscopes. On auto
alternators, I've accomplished the same test by opening up the
alternator and testing the diodes using an ohmmeter.
A good diode will show zero or low impedence in one direction, and high
impedence when the ohmmeter leads are reversed. A shorted diode will
read low in both directions. An open diode will read high in both
directions.
My question is: Having never disassembled a certified aircraft
alternator, can this process be used in that type of application also?
Charlie Kuss
RV-8 empennage
Boca Raton, Fl.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CHRIS.BROWNE(at)bge.com |
| Subject: | "Flattened dimple dies" |
I have seen dimple dies in Avery's with a flat side ground into them.
Where are these used, wing ribs? Can I live without them with a QB
kit while I do the empennage myself?
Chris Browne
Buying tools for 6A emp kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Edward Cole <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com> |
Does anyone know of a source for Military Paint or it's equivilent?
I'm looking for a grey to use on the instrument panel and would like to
simultate Military type grey panel.
Ed Cole
RV6A 24430 Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Ruddock <markr(at)iwl.net> |
| Subject: | Re: "Flattened dimple dies" |
Only needed when drilled hole is less than 1/4--1/8 inch or so from web or other
obstruction ( mostly caused by poor alignment of skin to rib. I have need them
on
the wing ribs in several places, damaged one rib beyond repair before I got the
special die ($10 for new rib). You may not need it with the QB and usually can
borrow one from a local builder or group for just the few places they are needed.
> I have seen dimple dies in Avery's with a flat side ground into them.
> Where are these used, wing ribs? Can I live without them with a QB
> kit while I do the empennage myself?
>
> Chris Browne
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Lessons in survival . . . |
>Thank you for the great troubleshooting tip. I have one
>comment/question. Most folks don't have oscilloscopes. On auto
>alternators, I've accomplished the same test by opening up the
>alternator and testing the diodes using an ohmmeter.
>A good diode will show zero or low impedence in one direction, and high
>impedence when the ohmmeter leads are reversed. A shorted diode will
>read low in both directions. An open diode will read high in both
>directions.
>My question is: Having never disassembled a certified aircraft
>alternator, can this process be used in that type of application also?
Sure . . . don't tell anybody . . . it's a state secret . . .
but there isn't a nickle's worth of difference between
"automotive" alternators and "certified" alternators
excecpt when there IS a difference, the automotive one
is better.
Yes, the ohmmeter check is equally valid on both styles
if one can deduce where to put the probes and assuming
the test points can be reached. The downside to the ohmmeter
check is a requirement to open the alternator and unhook
the stator leads from the diode stack before you probe
the individual diodes for testing. The d-cell/o'scope
test the writer described works on an assembled alternator.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com> |
| Subject: | Re: "Flattened dimple dies" |
> I have seen dimple dies in Avery's with a flat side ground into them.
> Where are these used, wing ribs? Can I live without them with a QB
> kit while I do the empennage myself?
>
> Chris Browne
Chris,
You can always grind down your regular dies for a custom fit, if and when
needed.
Bob Skinner RV-6 bskinr(at)trib.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Anderson Ed" <AndersonE(at)bah.com> |
| Subject: | "Flattened dimple dies" |
The flattened dimple dies are a nice to have, as they do make the job easier
in some areas such as near trailing edge of outside ribs on control
surfaces. I however, got one of the dimple die pliers and simple ground off
the nose portion for clearance needed. So nice to have but not essential
Ed
----------
From: bge.com!CHRIS.BROWNE
Subject: RV-List: "Flattened dimple dies"
Date: Monday, October 20, 1997 1:02PM
I have seen dimple dies in Avery's with a flat side ground into them.
Where are these used, wing ribs? Can I live without them with a QB
kit while I do the empennage myself?
Chris Browne
Buying tools for 6A emp kit
|
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Bibb <rbibb(at)fore.com> |
>
>Does anyone know of a source for Military Paint or it's equivilent?
>I'm looking for a grey to use on the instrument panel and would like to
>simultate Military type grey panel.
>Ed Cole
>RV6A 24430 Fuselage
>
I used Krylon Epoxy Gray Primer spray cans to do my interior. About $3 each
at Home Depot. Seems to be holding up well and has a nice low sheen to it
(almost flat). Other colors are available.
Richard E. Bibb
RV-4 N144KT
Oak Hill, VA
rbibb(at)fore.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne) |
| Subject: | Re: Alternators (was Survival...) |
I took the aftermarket alternator from my Debonair (it replaced the original generator)
to the auto parts store and lied to the counter man. I said, "This came off a
special machine (my Deb is very special to me!) do you have them and how much?"
He dug through the books and bingo! Nash Rambler of some years back. Motorola
made them for American Motors I believe.
Find a good auto electrics repair shop - especially when putting it into the
airplane, repairs are difficult and require special stuff. You can't really
"ohm out" a component of any kind without removing it from the circuit; in
alternators usually disconnecting one soldered joint. Stores wanted $75 for an
alternator for my 84 Mazda RX7. A shop repaired it (bearings) and checked it
out for about half that. Nice little Mitsubishi as I recall.
If your alternator is hooked up right and begins singing to your radio, its very
probably diode time.
Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- WANTED TO BUY - a used Chevy V-6 setup.
halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne) |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . . .Yeahbut.....] |
(The gear handle was jammed by luggage and popped the breaker...)
I don't unnderstand. Once the gear handle was clear of the unsecured baggage,
couldn't
you just crank the gear down?
On my Deb it is just 36 turns!
Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- WANTED TO BUY - a used Chevy V-6 setup.
halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | charles young <charles(at)onramp.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Alternators (was Survival...) |
Did the same thing to our Cherokee-6, about five years ago, the
replacement alternator was from a 1967 Chrysler and has happily lived
under the hood with the Lycoming every since!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John E. Musser" <jemusser(at)swbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Control stick |
>I believe you will be happiest with the MAC if you sit in the plane in a
relaxed >==>fecal<== position... (emphasis mine...)
Uh, I don't THINK the RVs have a use for this position... There are other
kits that are emminently more satifying for the purpose...
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Canopy, . . HELP!! |
My name is Rich. I have not written to the RV-list before. I guess I have
just been lucky dealing with the many problems along the way so far.
Thanks to the many who have given advice on the RV-list. I have enjoyed
reading the assorted e-mails for a year or so. I have learned a lot.
I am building an RV6A, slider (have been for two years now). I just
finished rough trimming my RV6A canopy and fitting it to the fuselage. My
first thought is that it would fit. It now appears that it won?t in the
front.
I did opt to do the option for added passenger height. The roll bar is
installed 1/4 inch higher, and 1/2 inch forward of the original position
per Van?s instructions.
Here is the problem:
Laying on the plane, the plexi fits well except two spots approximately 9?
to one foot in front of the roll bar. The Plexiglas is pulled away from
the fuselage on the left side 1". The right side is similar but with a
0.75" gap. The way these gaps appear presently, there is no way to glass
the front windshield in without a big bulge looking ugly! If I put
pressure on these areas, the Plexiglas pulls away from the rear of the
canopy. Presently, I see no way to eliminate these two gaps. Much
pressure is needed to push these in. (The canopy fits nice around the roll
bar, the front of the fuselage, and the rear canopy portion. Not many gaps
elsewhere. Can anyone help?
Another thought I had was to drill some initial holes in the top of the
roll bar first. This would fix the canopy in place. Then I would cut the
canopy in half. This way I could stretch the front portion around to the
side possibly eliminating these bulges, then drill the rest of the front
canopy portion to the roll bar. I would then have to trim the front
portion a little on the lower edges to allow the rear portion of the canopy
to slide up closer. I would then drill the rear canopy section to the rear
roll bar using shims to align it up with the windscreen.
What do you think, any other suggestions before I try to ruin the plexi??!!
I hope someone can help.
Thanks!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | charles(at)onramp.net (charles young) |
| Subject: | Re: Control stick |
Well I was wondering how to get the Martin Baker installed, but now the
FECAL position has complicated things, will an Eljer seat work for this?
And one guesses there is more use for a water system, which may justify the
Chevrolet V6 engine package?
---------
>
>>I believe you will be happiest with the MAC if you sit in the plane in a
>relaxed >==>fecal<== position... (emphasis mine...)
>
>Uh, I don't THINK the RVs have a use for this position... There are other
>kits that are emminently more satifying for the purpose...
>
>John
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Shelton <k.j.shelton(at)larc.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Gold Canopy Coating |
FYI
We found out that the gold coating on the F-16XL canopy prohibits EMI
relatively well. Not necessarily a good thing though.
We found out when a hand held GPS didn't work in the cockpit... say Oops.
Some of the guys knew, but wanted to watch us figure it out. !@#$%%&*
It would figure that any other hand held radio wouldn't work either
including an ELT! if so mounted.
Kevin
Kevin Shelton KA4UWE
NASA Langley Research Center, Hampton VA
(757) 864-4470 k.j.shelton(at)larc.nasa.gov
>
>Back in January there were a couple messages from Jack Abell on a gold
>and hard coating process for the canopy which was offered by Olen Nelson
>of Aero Sound Shield in Van Nuys. Jack, you indicated you planned to do
>it... did you? If so, how did it work out? Gil Alexander, the note
>said you checked into it too... any comments? Has anyone else looked
>into this coating or something similar? Any other sources? (Houston
>area, NASA supplier maybe?) Any comments pro or con (I know it ain't
>cheap:() are welcome.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Acker" <r.acker(at)thegrid.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Control Stick Grips |
> > At Copperstate, I saw a military style control grip that I liked on an
RV-6
> > (black, large 4-way coolie hat, two pushbuttons and one trigger switch,
> > symmetrical for comfortable operation in either hand)
Thanks to everyone for the responses. All the referrals were for
non-symmetrical grips though (except the Wag-Aero, but it did not have a
coolie hat). I'm still trying to find the symmetrical type.
For interested listers, Hyperion makes a downsized F-4 grip (RH only) for a
fraction of Infinity's price ($35 vs. $150). Check out
http://baste.magibox.net/~eracer/hyperion.htm. They are sending me a test
unit to determine suitability for the RV series, I'll post my findings to
the list.
Rob (RV-6Q)
Rancho Santa Margarita, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fesenbek, Gary" <gfesenbek(at)meridium.com> |
will an Eljer seat work for this?
And one guesses there is more use for a water system, which may
justify the
Chevrolet V6 engine package?
I have an Eljer, I use the extra water for H2O injection in my
GE J-79 engine and what do you know they threw in an F-4 control stick
for free with the purchase.
Gary, Got my 6A tail today
Roanoke,VA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne) |
| Subject: | Re: RG Batteries?? |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | sfink(at)Microchip.COM (Scott Fink) |
| Subject: | Left wing spar jig alignment holes |
I am building RV6 left wing and yes, I am stupid and didn't look
before drilling.
I searched the archives and couldn't find any info on this problem,
but I seem to remember it being discussed some time ago, maybe I
didn't use the right search words.
I sent this same question to Van's support people.
While drilling the jig alignment hole in the rear spar at 2.33" from
the top of the spar per the plans and 99" from the outboard end per
Hovan's instructions, the drill went through the edge of the spar
doubler (about 4/5 of the 1/8" hole is in the doubler). It is about
3" from the doubler plate, slightly after where the doubler bar starts
to taper.
My questions are:
1) Can I remove the doubler and cut away the material around the hole
to make a smooth transition, or would this weaken it too much? Should
I just order another doubler bar?
2) I know in the drawing that they say that the Y dimension is not
critical, but why isn't it centered (width wise) on the rear spar?
3) Should the bottom flange of the rear spar exactly line up with the
bottom edge of the front spar? I am at work and can't remember
whether the wing is exactly flat bottomed or not.
4) Is the pre-punched wing kit changed, did I mess up somewhere else,
or have other people had this problem following Hovan's instructions?
Scott Fink
scott.fink(at)microchip.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy, . . HELP!! |
> I am building an RV6A, slider (have been for two years now). I just
> finished rough trimming my RV6A canopy and fitting it to the fuselage. My
> first thought is that it would fit. It now appears that it won?t in the
> front.
[snip!]
Once you split the canopy, everything changes. Just get the canopy
aligned as best you can, and take the plunge. Hopefully you didn't cut
too much off the bottom of the windscreen already. The way it wants to
lie on the fwd top skin will change a surprising amount once you have
made this cut. But even if you did take too much off, once the cut is
made you can just tip the fwd edge of the windscreen down, closing the
gap, and trim a "wedge" off the aft edge. Adjusting the angle of the
windscreen a bit won't change the appearance noticably.
How do I know this? Because I did all of the above.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott A. Jordan" <SAJ_SLJ(at)compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | More fibreglass questions |
I sent this yesturday but haven't seen it come through the system, forgiv=
e
me if it gets double posted.
I have sanded the gel coat off the VS & elevator tips and fit them to thi=
er
respective assemblies. A neighbor who has extensive auto body background=
and now is a Sherwin-Williams auto paint rep was surprised that I sanded =
it
all off. No instructions came with the tail kit and I just assumed that =
it
should all come off. The parts will be painted and I saw no reason for t=
he
extra weight of the gel coat, also have heard of air bubbles under the ge=
l
coat that show up later. He said it was normal to just scuff the gel coa=
t
and paint. Should I have removed all the gel coat? It is not too late fo=
r
the VS & rudder tips.
He has also suggested that it might be a good idea to put a thin coat of
primer on the parts to prevent the absorbtion of moisture over the next
couple of years before they are painted, expecially where the part
underlaps the metal. Any thoughts here?
No he is not trying to sell me more primer at a large profit, he has been=
selling me thier two part epoxy primer and vari primer in a spray can at
his cost. Incidentally, I have been very happy with the coverage and
durability of these products, they do not rub off or scratch easily as so=
me
do.
Thanks
Scott A. Jordan
80331
N733JJ
fibreglass now, wings in the spring.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MoeJoe <moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net> |
That is a very valid concern for a garage installation. The lines in my
shop are 20ft overhead, and rubber hoses come down to the floor in all
but a few places. This installation has been in place for over 5 years,
and I've never had an explosion. If OSHA disapproves of this, it's the
first I've heard. Inspectors are in my plant at least once every year,
as well as the insurance inspector, and I have never had any problems.
My place isn't heated, and it gets as cold as 35deg on winter days. Like
I said though, I keep them up outa the way so they don't get bumped.
Maurice Colontonio
Cherry Hill, NJ
RV-8 (Put up shelves in my workshop today)
>
> If the pvc lines get cold and get bumped against
> they will explode I used to use them in my tire
> shop. OSHA also rules against that type. I've
> lost a couple over the years and decided to go to
> black pipe. I use copper soldered together at home
> it's permanent anyway.
>
> Mike Comeaux
>
> ----------
> > From: MoeJoe <bellatlantic.net!moejoe(at)matronics.com>
> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: Air Lines
> > Date: Sunday, October 19, 1997 7:22 PM
> >
> >
> > They want to sell you the more expensive metal and rubber tubing?
> >
> > FWIW I have PVC carrying air to 24,000 sq ft in my Paper Recycling
> > warehouse, with no problems. There are at least 5 plug in points on the
> > lines, the farthest being over 300 ft, and plenty of bends. The
> > compressor is 35 hp, but it's also running a Micropulse dust collecting
> > unit, and there's plenty left over for air tools. The only leakes I have
> > are in the rubber hoses. IMO PVC is the least expense, and the least
> > hassle. Don't be afraid to use it.
> >
> > Maurice Colontonio
> > Cherry Hill, NJ
> > -8 Tail (Tools ordered, starting this week)
> > >
> > > Even though PVC schedule 40 is rated for 175 psi it specifically states
> that
> > > it is not to be used for air lines. That is printed on every piece of
> PVC
> > > down at the local plumbing supply shop. Does anyone know why?
> > >
> > > Ray and Nancy Murphy
> > > murphy(at)mail.coos.or.us
> > > North Bend, OR
> > > RV6A empenage
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RBusick505(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Red/Orange Paint on Navy Jets |
I am curious as to why Navy jets have red/orange paint on the flaps and other
movable parts. You can see the paint when the flaps are down, but can not
see them when they are up. I like the way this looks, and I am thinking
about doing it for my RV? For those that think they need flap indicator
devices, this could be one technique. However, for many Navy AC, the pilot
can not see the flaps either up or down.
Any smart Naval Aviators, or other knowledgable people out there that can
explain the Navy's rationale.
Bob Busick
RV-6
Fremont CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Kitz <jkitz(at)greenapple.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Edwards Air Force Base Open House |
Gary A. Sobek wrote:
> If anyone has any suggestion on operation of a HOT engine on the ground
> for extended waits, please advise.
Gary, my Earl's oil cooler , about 4 inches by 5 inches, is mounted in
the baffeling just inside the cowling inlet. We waited for 58 minutes to
leave Oshkosh on Saturday morning and the oil temperature never got over
140 degrees F. I have been unable to get the temperature over 170
degrees, even on 90 degree days at high power settings. Last winter, I
had it taped over completely to get the temperature to 140. Other than
the firesleeve on the gas lines and a shrould around the gasculator, I
also have a curved shield clamped to the exhaust pipe to keep radiant
energy from hitting the gas lines, carburator, and fuel pump. I have ran
auto gas all summer with no problems.
John Kitz
N721JK
176 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Control Stick Grips |
I have put a picture of the stick grips I have for sale on my web page,
at www.edt.com/homewing/classifieds.html. These are real military
surplus grips, (no cheezy game sticks here! :-) They are set up for the
right hand and would be perfect for some -4 or -8 wannabee fighter jock.
But I'm building a -6 so I decided not to use them.
I have 2 I'll sell for $50 each.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | cecilth(at)juno.com |
<344AC054.5D8DFD61(at)bellatlantic.net>
Hi Ray,
I have a printing shop for 25 years now. For 15 or more of those
years I have used PVC 1" for my air. Its ran all over my shop . To both
roll up doors , upstairs as well as down. I am building my RV6A upstairs.
Just be sure to use the purple "primer" before the cement. The
compresser is located under a bench enclosed with a door.
Good Luck
Cecil
>>
>> Even though PVC schedule 40 is rated for 175 psi it specifically
>states that
>> it is not to be used for air lines. That is printed on every piece
>of PVC
>> down at the local plumbing supply shop. Does anyone know why?
>>
>> Ray and Nancy Murphy
>> murphy(at)mail.coos.or.us
>> North Bend, OR
>> RV6A empenage
>>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
>That is a very valid concern for a garage installation. The lines in my
>shop are 20ft overhead, and rubber hoses come down to the floor in all
>but a few places. This installation has been in place for over 5 years,
>and I've never had an explosion. If OSHA disapproves of this, it's the
>first I've heard. Inspectors are in my plant at least once every year,
>as well as the insurance inspector, and I have never had any problems.
>My place isn't heated, and it gets as cold as 35deg on winter days. Like
>I said though, I keep them up outa the way so they don't get bumped.
>
>Maurice Colontonio
fwiw, I put my air lines in and used 1" and 3/4 " sched 40 PVC. Why?
Because the local city building codes OK it for industrial use. I had
noticed that two welding shops, two tire shops, and a radiator repair shop
had it installed. I was about to pop for copper tubing along with black
iron, but having seen the PVC, I checked with the city code enforcer. It is
OK by the city code. Does that make it OK as for safety? I don't know. But
the locals bitch like hell because the city used some big cities codes for
our town, and they all say that the codes are too demanding.
Mine have been in since 1991, in TX weather in an unheated building where it
does get hot in the summer and cold (ignore that if you live up yonder!) in
the winter.
I take it from a discussion on the list about a year ago regarding PVC that
it is going to blow up and shatter me to pieces one of these days. But I'm
in the country where it will not hurt anyone else. Ce la vie!
________________________________________________________________________________
by a jealous boy friend (not my boy friend, the girls' boyfriend).
You pays your money and takes your chances.
John Darby
Stephenville TX
johnd@our-town.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy, . . HELP!! |
> Another thought I had was to drill some initial holes in the top of the
> roll bar first. This would fix the canopy in place. Then I would cut the
> canopy in half. This way I could stretch the front portion around to the
> side possibly eliminating these bulges, then drill the rest of the front
> canopy portion to the roll bar. I would then have to trim the front
> portion a little on the lower edges to allow the rear portion of the canopy
> to slide up closer. I would then drill the rear canopy section to the rear
> roll bar using shims to align it up with the windscreen.
>
It's not been that long since I finished my slider canopy, and in my
opinion your plan is exactly right. I think you'll be amazed at how
much better the canopy fits once you cut it in half.
One caution: be sure to leave enough edge distance between the roll
bar and the cut line. Later, if needed, you can always move the rear
portion of the canopy forward on the frame and trim as necessary to
achieve good edge distance on the rear canopy (slider) portion.
Good Luck!
Tim
------------------------------------
Tim Lewis
N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023
San Antonio TX
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or
timrv6a(at)iname.com
------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott) |
| Subject: | update on oil temp |
I know this is getting old but, for anyone who is interested here it
is. My oil cooling problem was corrected by removing my oil screen
housing that had no provisions for a vernatherm and replacing it with a
housing with a vernatherm. Oil temps now run between 180 and 200
degrees f. Much relief there. I took the felix prop (68 x 72) off
and installed a warnke 70 x 72. Climb loss was not noticable. Cruise
speed increased by 20 mph at 2500 rpm. I can now only get 2600 rpm
straight and level at 3000 feet. I was getting around 2900. I haven't
confirmed the air speed indications with a gps yet, maybe tomorrow.
For you guys that haven't done it yet, it is harder than you think it is
to fly off 40 hours within a 50 mile radius of one spot. I wanna go
somewhere. See ya.
Michael
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: "Flattened dimple dies" |
> > I have seen dimple dies in Avery's with a flat side ground into them.
> > Where are these used, wing ribs? Can I live without them with a QB
> > kit while I do the empennage myself?
>
I've finished nearly all sheet metal work on my QB. Didn't need 'em.
Tim
------------------------------------
Tim Lewis
N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023
San Antonio TX
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or
timrv6a(at)iname.com
------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Smidler <smidler(at)dcwi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy, . . HELP!! |
> I am building an RV6A, slider (have been for two years now). I just
> finished rough trimming my RV6A canopy and fitting it to the fuselage. My
> first thought is that it would fit. It now appears that it won?t in the
> front.
Rich, this is normal. What worked for me was to mark the cut line with
the canopy as near to the position as you can get it. Once the canopy
is cut apart (done on the airplane) the front windshield just relaxed
right into place. A little minor trimming on the front edge and sanding
a slight wedge off the rear lower cut line and it fit great. Don't
force it, cut it to relieve the molded in stresses first.
Frank Smidler
smidler(at)dcwi.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Edwards Air Force Base Open House |
Gary,
Your temps sound pretty good. Its not uncomon to have a little vapor locking
on the ground when things have had a chance to heat up a little. My
experience with clearance delivery is to contact them before ground. I call
clearance before I start up, once I get my clearance I start up and contact
ground.
Ryan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Barnhart <barnhart(at)a.crl.com> |
| Subject: | Hovan's Web Site |
Am I the only one having trouble getting to John Hovan's web site?
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com> |
| Subject: | Re: More fibreglass questions |
>also have heard of air bubbles under the gel
>coat that show up later. He said it was normal to just scuff the gel coat
>and paint. Should I have removed all the gel coat? It is not too late for
>the VS & rudder tips.
There can be some air pockets under the gel coat but they are usually easy
to detect and can be filled later. I wouldn't take the gel coat off, just
sand and prime & paint. You'll save a lot of time by not sanding the gel
coat off, stay healthier and keep your shop cleaner. I believe there might
be some UV protection afforded by the gel coat but probably the main reason
it is used is for a parting agent. BTW, I think the gel coat dust is really
nasty. Be sure to wear a mask. You should remove the gelcoat when bonding
fiberglass such as the installation of the cowl scoop. Layups done on
gelcoat will not bond as well.
>He has also suggested that it might be a good idea to put a thin coat of
>primer on the parts to prevent the absorbtion of moisture over the next
>couple of years before they are painted, expecially where the part
>underlaps the metal. Any thoughts here?
Never heard of anyone worrying about this. If you do prime the fiberglass
and let the part set, you'll have to sand and clean the part later to get
good adhesion of your finish coat.
Bob Skinner RV-6 380 hrs Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
<>
Nope, I just tried, and I can't get the server to hookup either. I had
problems with it the other day, too.
Wendell WBWard(at)AOL.COM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
>
>
>> > I have seen dimple dies in Avery's with a flat side ground
into them.
>> > Where are these used, wing ribs? Can I live without them with
a QB
>> > kit while I do the empennage myself?
>>
>
>I've finished nearly all sheet metal work on my QB. Didn't need 'em.
>
>Tim
I found a need for the small diameter die and the flat sided version as
well. A few of my HS rib rivets ended up rather tight against the rib
web. I suppose if one gets their rivet lines perfectly centered on the
flanges, the modified dies wouldn't be necessary. But, I'm not that good
yet!
Brian Denk
-8 #379 wing kit shipped today!
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bumflyer(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy, . . HELP!! |
The difficulty you describe and the solution suggested mirrors my experience
exactly. Worked good for me.
________________________________________________________________________________
>That is a very valid concern for a garage installation. The lines in my
>shop are 20ft overhead, and rubber hoses come down to the floor in all
>but a few places. This installation has been in place for over 5 years,
>and I've never had an explosion. If OSHA disapproves of this, it's the
>first I've heard. Inspectors are in my plant at least once every year,
>as well as the insurance inspector, and I have never had any problems.
>My place isn't heated, and it gets as cold as 35deg on winter days. Like
>I said though, I keep them up outa the way so they don't get bumped.
>
>Maurice Colontonio
fwiw, I put my air lines in and used 1" and 3/4 " sched 40 PVC. Why?
Because the local city building codes OK it for industrial use. I had
noticed that two welding shops, two tire shops, and a radiator repair shop
had it installed. I was about to pop for copper tubing along with black
iron, but having seen the PVC, I checked with the city code enforcer. It is
OK by the city code. Does that make it OK as for safety? I don't know. But
the locals bitch like hell because the city used some big cities codes for
our town, and they all say that the codes are too demanding.
Mine have been in since 1991, in TX weather in an unheated building where it
does get hot in the summer and cold (ignore that if you live up yonder!) in
the winter.
I take it from a discussion on the list about a year ago regarding PVC that
it is going to blow up and shatter me to pieces one of these days. But I'm
in the country where it will not hurt anyone else. Ce la vie!
________________________________________________________________________________
by a jealous boy friend (not my boy friend, the girls' boyfriend).
You pays your money and takes your chances.
John Darby
Stephenville TX
johnd@our-town.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wes Hays <whays(at)tenet.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
On Mon, 20 Oct 1997, Dave Barnhart wrote:
> Am I the only one having trouble getting to John Hovan's web site?
>
No. I have been trying to get in for several days now and was going to
post a message this morning asking the same question. Does anyone know
what the problem is, or is there another source for Frank Justice's
construction notes? (I tried a mirror site on the Houston RV page, but no
luck)
Wes Hays
N844WB (Reserved)
Jigging up Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Bibb <rbibb(at)fore.com> |
| Subject: | Paint shop in Maryland |
I'm looking for a paint shop for my RV. I remember stumbling onto a web
site about a place in Maryland but can't find it now. Any clues out there?
Anybody know of a good paint shop in the mid-atlantic area?
Thinking about getting a professional job done and my amateur version just
doesn't float my boat.
Richard
Richard E. Bibb
RV-4 N144KT
Oak Hill, VA
rbibb(at)fore.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jones, Bryan D. (LPT)" <JonesB(at)GEON.com> |
>fwiw, I put my air lines in and used 1" and 3/4 " sched 40 PVCJohn
Darby
>[SMTP:our-town.com!johnd(at)matronics.com]
John,
Regarding PVC piping, I had an experience that wasn't too pleasant. It
wasn't from utility air pressure, but gas overpressure which caused the
pipe to burst. It does produce effective shrapnel also - I have a scar
on my leg to prove it (off the job incident). Hope I am using this
E-mail system correctly - it is my first shot. By the way, how are
things in Stephenville? I'm from Granbury, but living in Houston making
PVC(!) with Geon (formerly BFGoodrich Vinyl division) and building an
RV-8.
Bryan Jones
Pearland, Texas
JONESB(at)GEON.COM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | charles(at)onramp.net (charles young) |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
Likewise, been trying for several weeks, no hook up to Hovan's server.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Ruddock <markr(at)iwl.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
Accessed this am (Tues) and got a msg that the site is moved, new address:
http://rv.austin.apple.com/jhovan/home.html
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick_Smith(at)brahms2.tivoli.com |
| Subject: | Re: COMPRESSED AIR LINE/NOISE REDUCERS |
I saw a novel solution. One local builder used a 12-foot long 6" diameter
PVC pipe in the attick of his shop for an air line with a outlet at each
end coming through the ceiling in each corner of the shop. This gained him
much needed tank capacity.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Anderson Ed" <AndersonE(at)bah.com> |
| Subject: | Paint shop in Maryland |
Richard,
This won't be much help, but I recall hearing about a shop in the
Cumberland MD area that does aircraft painting, but that's all I can recall.
Ed
----------
From: Richard Bibb
Subject: RV-List: Paint shop in Maryland
Date: Tuesday, October 21, 1997 9:13AM
I'm looking for a paint shop for my RV. I remember stumbling onto a web
site about a place in Maryland but can't find it now. Any clues out there?
Anybody know of a good paint shop in the mid-atlantic area?
Thinking about getting a professional job done and my amateur version just
doesn't float my boat.
Richard
Richard E. Bibb
RV-4 N144KT
Oak Hill, VA
rbibb(at)fore.com
|
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Harrill <KHarrill(at)OSA.STATE.SC.US> |
| Subject: | F-605 Modifications for Tall Pilots |
charset="iso-8859-1"
I am just starting on my F-605 bulkhead and want to move the upper cross
member (F-605 F seat back brace) toward the back for more room. There
were several postings regarding this change a few months ago. I plan to
flute the F-605 D vertical member near the bottom and notch it near the
top (per Doug Medema and Art Chard). I have a couple of questions:
1. Do you have to shorten the F-605 F seat back brace since the
fuselage is narrower as you move it back?
2. Do you have to lengthen the F-605 D vertical member?
3. Does this change affect the mounting of the electric flap
assembly?
Any help will be appreciated.
Ken Harrill
RV - 6, fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Wing kit arrival |
Greetings fellow rivet pounders!
My -8 wing kit is on the way and I wanted to get some feedback on
whether two guys...myself and the delivery driver, can safely get the
crates unloaded and into my shop. I know there are two, large
crates...one very long and the other much wider, (I suppose with the
skins in it). I could get another helper if it's really necessary...but
don't know if it will be possible during the work week when it's likely
to arrive. Any comments? Hey Kirkpatrick, I'll buy the pizza... *wink*
Brian Denk
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
| From: | "William H. Watson" <wmwatson(at)earthlink.net> |
>Am I the only one having trouble getting to John Hovan's web site?
Just speculation here, but I believe Apple has finally pulled the plug.
As best I know, John and I were layed off in May. I amazed it stayed up
so long. If anyone knows John's home phone, it would be nice to get the
Justice stuff moved to an active site.
RV-6A wings
William H. Watson
wmwatson(at)earthlink.net
H: 415 254-1656
W: 408 553-4225
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
>
>Accessed this am (Tues) and got a msg that the site is moved, new address:
> http://rv.austin.apple.com/jhovan/home.html
>
>Mark
>
I just tried this address and cannot connect up to the server. Same problem
all week. Also haven't been able to get to that control stick website
either. Has anyone gotten on to that site? I don't have the url here now. Al
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Alan Carroll <carroll(at)geology.wisc.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing kit arrival |
>My -8 wing kit is on the way and I wanted to get some feedback on
>whether two guys...myself and the delivery driver, can safely get the
>crates unloaded and into my shop. I know there are two, large
>crates...one very long and the other much wider, (I suppose with the
>skins in it). I could get another helper if it's really necessary...but
>don't know if it will be possible during the work week when it's likely
>to arrive. Any comments? Hey Kirkpatrick, I'll buy the pizza... *wink*
I had no trouble doing this with just me and the driver. We carried the
long box (with spars, control tubes, and fuselage longerons) off the truck
with no problem. The box with the skins is more awkward, but with the help
of a 2-wheel hand cart not a problem. Both boxes are heavy though, and if
you have back problems or other reasons to avoid heavy lifting you might
want another set of hands.
Alan Carroll
RV-8 #80177 (Wings)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
<< Does anyone know of a source for Military Paint or it's equivilent?
I'm looking for a grey to use on the instrument panel and would like to
simultate Military type grey panel. >>
Ed-
Check out Randolph in the ACS catalog. I think they can supply all the Fed
Spec colors used by the military. If not e-mail me back and I'll check for
another source.
BTW, I just took my 6A to the painters today, short only the wheel pants. I
expect it back in 2-3 weeks.
Getting so close,
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don McNamara <mcnamara(at)sbt.infi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing kit arrival |
Brian Denk wrote:
>
>
> Greetings fellow rivet pounders!
>
> My -8 wing kit is on the way and I wanted to get some feedback on
> whether two guys...myself and the delivery driver, can safely get the
> crates unloaded and into my shop. I know there are two, large
> crates...one very long and the other much wider, (I suppose with the
> skins in it). I could get another helper if it's really necessary...but
> don't know if it will be possible during the work week when it's likely
> to arrive. Any comments?
Brian--
The wing kit is crated in one 4' x 8' plywood crate and one long (15')
skinny crate. Both are pretty heavy, but manageable by two guys.
Unfortunately, when mine arrived, I wasn't home and the delivery guy
tried to carry them both to the basement by himself. He banged up
several walls, baseboards, doorways and the hardwood floor. But, since
he "wasn't supposed to put it anywhere but off the truck," and he helped
only with my wife's pleading, we couldn't file a complaint.
So, be present when it's delivered, preferably with a strong friend, and
NEVER put your wife in charge of handling the delivery!
Good luck!
--Don McNamara
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: F-605 Modifications for Tall Pilots |
>
> I am just starting on my F-605 bulkhead and want to move the upper cross
> member (F-605 F seat back brace) toward the back for more room. There
> were several postings regarding this change a few months ago. I plan to
> flute the F-605 D vertical member near the bottom and notch it near the
> top (per Doug Medema and Art Chard). I have a couple of questions:
>
> 1. Do you have to shorten the F-605 F seat back brace since the
> fuselage is narrower as you move it back?
I mounted the longerons on the jig before I made my modifications to F-605.
I moved the seat back brace back 1-1/2 inches. I think I had to angle the
ends of the brace but I don't remember shortening it since this would also
affect the rest of F-605.
>
> 2. Do you have to lengthen the F-605 D vertical member?
I did the calculations with the 1-1/2 inch setback and believe the difference
was about 1/16 of an inch. You can adjust where you drill the holes to
accommodate this.
>
> 3. Does this change affect the mounting of the electric flap
> assembly?
Can't help you here.
>
> Any help will be appreciated.
>
> Ken Harrill
> RV - 6, fuselage
>
This change, like almost any change, ripples a bit. In particular, you
will have to lengthen the arm rest and shorten the rib in the baggage
compartment. It's not a big deal, just adds some time.
Doug Medema
RV-6A fuse off jig.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Acker" <r.acker(at)thegrid.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
>
> all week. Also haven't been able to get to that control stick website
> either. Has anyone gotten on to that site? I don't have the url here now.
Al,
Which control stick website are you trying to get to? I know of
two...Infinity Aerospace at http://www.flash.net/~infaero, and Hyperion at
http://baste.magibox.net/~eracer/hyperion.htm. Hope this helps.
Rob (RV-6Q).
Rancho Santa Margarita, California
________________________________________________________________________________
at Oct 17, 97 10:27 am
| From: | Shirley Hobenshield <shobenshield(at)cmsd.bc.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Fixed or tail dragger |
>
>> Some of you might be interested in my experience in trying to
>> decide between the 6 and the 6A.
>
>Guess it wasn't as interesting as I thought.
>
>Tedd McHenry
>Surrey, BC
>
Of intrest, most of us started on trikes when we we kids, but all the
older kids rode 2 wheelers and I thought they were cool!
I know this will really heat things up, but what the heck XXG is happy in
the hanger today and always smiles at me the way only a tail wheeler can
when you approch one from the front!!!
( Flying is flying )
Good Luck Tedd.
Ed.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CHRIS.BROWNE(at)bge.com |
| Subject: | General comments on PVC for compressed air |
When the first question about installing an air system was posted by
Lothar Klingmuller, it never entered my mind to consider PVC, or any
other non-metallic option other than rubber hose, because I had never
seen it used. Granted, PVC would never suffice for HP applications,
but I think think that this is one of those issues that boils down to
acceptable risk.
Remember that PVC fails one way, catastrophically. It is brittle and
it snaps - you will never see it "bulge" or give a warning that it is
about to fail. In contrast, ductile materials like iron and copper
deform before they fail. As an example, the wing spar on your RV will
permanently bend long before it snaps if you exceed its G-rating. A
"plastic" (I'm not talking FRP) wing spar would simply bend and then
snap without any warning. Moreover, the failure in metals is going to
be characterized by a small crack which may not even propagate. The
violence of PVC pipe failure is exacerbated by the fact that air is a
compressible fluid. When a leak occurs in a water pipe, the pressure
in the immediate vicinity of the leak is ZERO as the "pressure" is
turned into "velocity". With a compressed gas the pressure drops as a
function of expansion (remember that water does not expand). This
means that the failed area continues to be stressed after the break
until the pressure in the pipe drops to a certain level, often
resulting a propogating failure (shattering). This likely reason that
someone pointed out the "no air" restriction printed on the PVC pipe
he encountered.
What does all this mean? You may never have a problem with a PVC air
system as long as you never exceed the design pressure limits and the
system is not subject to significant levels of shock, vibration, or
stress. Remember, PVC is BRITTLE, just like glass which,
incidentally, also has a high yield stress. As someone from Texas
said about this subject, "You pays your money and you takes your
chances." Just beware of the hazard. Code requirements are usually
written in blood, regardless of whether or not they have been adopted
by your local county.
Chris Browne
-6A emp next month
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Beaton <kevin.beaton(at)usaa.com> |
| Subject: | Fixed or tail dragger |
If a pilot were successful with taxi and takeoff via one wheel on the
nose and one on the tail, I would think they were cool too.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Shirley Hobenshield [SMTP:cmsd.bc.ca!shobenshield(at)matronics.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 1997 9:05 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Fixed or tail dragger
>
>
>
> >
> >> Some of you might be interested in my experience in trying to
> >> decide between the 6 and the 6A.
> >
> >Guess it wasn't as interesting as I thought.
> >
> >Tedd McHenry
> >Surrey, BC
> >
> Of intrest, most of us started on trikes when we we kids, but all
> the
> older kids rode 2 wheelers and I thought they were cool!
> I know this will really heat things up, but what the heck XXG is
> happy in
> the hanger today and always smiles at me the way only a tail wheeler
> can
> when you approch one from the front!!!
> ( Flying is flying )
> Good Luck Tedd.
>
> Ed.
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John B. Abell" <jbabell(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Gold Canopy Coating |
Greg Young wrote:
>
>
> Back in January there were a couple messages from Jack Abell on a gold
> and hard coating process for the canopy which was offered by Olen Nelson
> of Aero Sound Shield in Van Nuys. Jack, you indicated you planned to do
> it... did you? If so, how did it work out? Gil Alexander, the note
> said you checked into it too... any comments?
Greg,
I haven't gotten serious about a possible canopy coating yet; I'm still
working to finish my wings while my fuselage waits in storage. I still
intend to pursue the idea. Problem number one is light transmission. I
plan to measure it through the existing canopy before applying any gold
and hard coat. It will be several weeks before I can address this
issue.
Kevin Shelton's remarks about GPS reception were very interesting. I
had never thought of the possibility that reception might be inhibited
by the gold coating. If your antennae are external to the cockpit (as
mine will be, I think), it shouldn't be a problem, but it's something
else to think about. I guess it depends on where one lives (e.g.,
Seattle vs. Phoenix) how important gold coating is.
It would be helpful if you let us know what you find out if you contact
Aero Sound Shield.
Thanks, and good luck with your canopy.
Jack Abell
Los Angeles, Calif.
RV-6A N333JA (Reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jones, Bryan D. (LPT)" <JonesB(at)GEON.com> |
| Subject: | COMPRESSED AIR LINE/NOISE REDUCERS |
>I saw a novel solution. One local builder used a 12-foot long
6" diameter
PVC pipe in the attick of his shop for an air line with a outlet
at each
end coming through the ceiling in each corner of the shop. This
gained him
much needed tank capacity.
PVC pipe users - aside from the pipe bomb implications, the idea of
using PVC piping in air applications is interesting. I checked with an
industrial plastic piping components supplier regarding the advertised
pressure rating for 6" schedule 40 PVC and they said it would be good to
180-psi at 75-F (the brand they sold). The key here is that we are
talking about air (compressible fluid). I might be tempted to try the
idea but only with a relief device.
Bryan Jones
Pearland, Texas
jonesb(at)geon.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate |
The major focus in this whole debate has been on the issue of
resettability. My concern is more with having a visual indication of
which circuit had a problem and whether the breaker popped and took care
of it.
For example, say I'm flying at night, and my panel lights go out. "Oh
darn!" I say, and point my flashlight (of course I have it handy) at
the CB panel. Instantly I see the breaker popped and know that:
a) Whatever the problem was, it was isolated to that one circuit.
b) Whatever else was on that circuit is also out.
c) The breaker took care of it so I don't have to worry about that smoke
smell.
It took me 1 second to determine all of this and now I can just get back
to the business of flying the airplane without further distractions.
Yes you can get distracted with trying to reset a breaker, but I think
the bigger danger is getting distracted wondering just what is wrong and
what else might be wrong or be getting ready to go wrong. I think this
simple device can do a lot to minimize such distractions.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Nuckolls <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate |
>The major focus in this whole debate has been on the issue of
>resettability. My concern is more with having a visual indication of
>which circuit had a problem and whether the breaker popped and took care
>of it.
>
>For example, say I'm flying at night, and my panel lights go out. "Oh
>darn!" I say, and point my flashlight (of course I have it handy) at
>the CB panel. Instantly I see the breaker popped and know that:
>
>a) Whatever the problem was, it was isolated to that one circuit.
Suppose the breaker does NOT pop . . . now what do you know?
>
>b) Whatever else was on that circuit is also out.
>
Most people put too many things on one breaker because they're
expensive and/or they've run out of panel space. With multiple
slot fuseholders, protected circuits are $2 each and I encourage
people to design in 10-25% spare slots for future expansion to
avoid doubling up later. In order to meet that spares requirement,
I'll often double up a couple convenience items like a hobbs meter
and dome light . . .
>c) The breaker took care of it so I don't have to worry about that smoke
> smell.
The fuse never fails to work.
>It took me 1 second to determine all of this and now I can just get back
>to the business of flying the airplane without further distractions.
But suppose the breaker had not opened, did the bulb burn out? Dimmer
pot broken? Wire loose . . . what is the value of knowing why something
has quit? Your first indication that something is wrong is when
the thing ceased to behave as expected. At that point, I'll suggest
it's more helpful to shift to Plan B (if needed) for that piece of
equipment and fly on.
>Yes you can get distracted with trying to reset a breaker, but I think
>the bigger danger is getting distracted wondering just what is wrong and
>what else might be wrong or be getting ready to go wrong. I think this
>simple device can do a lot to minimize such distractions.
If it's one fuse per system then one failure doesn't cascade through
to any other system. This is the beauty of thoughtful, failure tolerant
design. All of the uncertainties you suffer flying contemporary
spam cans can and should go away.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Sears <sears(at)searnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
Hmmm. I just tried the new address and still got a failure. I checked
my favorites list and found the address to be the same as my old one
that doesn't work. Maybe you got lucky?
>Accessed this am (Tues) and got a msg that the site is moved, new
>address:
> http://rv.austin.apple.com/jhovan/home.html
>
>Mark
Jim Sears
RV-6A #22220 (struggling with the roll bar assembly, still)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Edward Cole <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: F-605 Modifications for Tall Pilots |
Ken Harrill wrote:
>
>
> I am just starting on my F-605 bulkhead and want to move the upper cross
> member (F-605 F seat back brace) toward the back for more room. There
> were several postings regarding this change a few months ago. I plan to
> flute the F-605 D vertical member near the bottom and notch it near the
> top (per Doug Medema and Art Chard). I have a couple of questions:
>
> 1. Do you have to shorten the F-605 F seat back brace since the
> fuselage is narrower as you move it back?
>
> 2. Do you have to lengthen the F-605 D vertical member?
>
> 3. Does this change affect the mounting of the electric flap
> assembly?
>
> Any help will be appreciated.
>
> Ken Harrill
> RV - 6, fuselage
>
>
Ken,
Tom Green at Van's has informaton on "tall pilot" modifications. As I recall
he is about 6'4".
Ed Cole
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | donspawn(at)juno.com (Don R. Jordan) |
I have dempled the skin, doulber, & ribs instead of c/s ing the doulbler
& leaving the ribs flat.
Should I rivet it down or de-demple the ribs & doulblers & c/s the
doubler ??
Don Jordan, RV-6A, #24330
Mansfield, Tx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
I've been trying to access this on and off for a while too. It seems
that John's machine is either down or disconnected from the Net, since
attempts to PING it fail. A few days ago I emailed
postmaster(at)austin.apple.com asking what had happened, but haven't
received a reply.
I'm also CC'ing this message to John. John, if you're there could you
please tell the RV-List what's happening?
Maybe we need some sort of backup facility for important resources like
Justice's notes?
Frank.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bjnash(at)connectnet.com (BJ Nash) |
| Subject: | Re: Salvage Yard List |
wrote:
>>Just a note:
>>
>>I took it upon my self to keep a list of salvage yards on my web site.
>>You can find it at:
>>
>>http://home.earthlink.net/~jaroot/htmls/sur.html
>>
>>Small list right now so if you have others let me know.
>>
You can get our list by email from salvage(at)pdsig.n2.net
It will be returned by auto-responder email.
bill nash
>>Jim :{)
Send email to infobot(at)pdsig.n2.net for a directory of interesting stuff!
("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._ Bill Nash
`6_ 6 ) `-. ( ).`-.__.`) Aircraft Remanufacturing Corp
(_Y_.)' ._ ) `._ `.``-..-' 1531 Avohill Dr
_..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,' Vista, Ca 92084 (760) 749 0239
(((),-'' (((),' (((.-' Email: bjnash(at)pdsig.n2.net
http://www.freeyellow.com/members/aircraft-reman/index.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
[snip!]
> Maybe we need some sort of backup facility for important resources like
> Justice's notes?
Since Frank Justice is a member the Portland RV builder's group (VAF
Home Wing), I guess it only makes sense to include his Supplemental
Instructions on the Home Wing Home Page. I'll check him about it, and
let the group know.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate |
All good responses from Bob (as I expected). That's what I get
for trying to go head-to-head with the expert.
I still think a visual indication of a failed circuit can be helpful,
even if it doesn't cover all the bases, which was the main point I was
trying to make. But I guess I have to admit that if you look at it from
the standpoint of developing a system that is much more robust in the
first place (through the use of a greater number of separate circuits
fuses which are more reliable), then it will tend to diminish the
usefulness of such diagnostic aids.
Good discussion, I'm glad Bob started it even though I am trailing
smoke as we speak :-)
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leo Davies <leo(at)icn.su.OZ.AU> |
| Subject: | Re: F-605 Modifications for Tall Pilots |
Ken,
I would first be sure that this is what you want to do. Most tall people
have a lot of their height in their legs. I am 6' 4" and have no problem
with head room in the standard setup even with nice thick cushions
(courtesy of Cleveland Tools). At least another 1.5" could be gained with
thinner cushions. The mod I made after seeing it in several RVs was to
raise the rudder pedals by about 1" plus put them forward .75". This gives
more leg room for pedal use and the higher pedals allow your feet forward
underneath them in cruise.
Cheers,
Leo Davies 6A engine stuff
>
>I am just starting on my F-605 bulkhead and want to move the upper cross
>member (F-605 F seat back brace) toward the back for more room. There
>Ken Harrill
>RV - 6, fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jay Humbard <jhumb(at)apexcorp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: PVC for compressed air |
Gentlemen,
We have used schedule 80 PVC for our shop air lines for many years at
100PSI. It is much easier to install than iron, as one might imagine,
and the schedule 80 pipe, which costs a bit more than schedule 40 is
very tough and rated for over 250PSI. We transition to iron for the
last few feet to any air-chucks, and anchor the iron pipe securely.
There are no warnings printed on the pipes regarding use for air
systems.
Our next door neighbor had a PVC air line explode in their shop and it
caused minor injuries to some employees. I am sure that they had not
used schedule 80, I believe that it was schedule 40.
If I were installing a PVC air system, I would use schedule 80. The
cost difference (over schedule 40) would not that great in a small shop,
and it is A LOT easier to install than iron.
Jay Humbard
www.controlvision.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy, . . HELP!! |
<< I am building an RV6A, slider (have been for two years now). I just
finished rough trimming my RV6A canopy and fitting it to the fuselage. My
first thought is that it would fit. It now appears that it won?t in the
front.
I did opt to do the option for added passenger height. The roll bar is
installed 1/4 inch higher, and 1/2 inch forward of the original position
per Van?s instructions. >>
I did the same thing only I moved the bar forward about 1.5", raised it 1/4"
and fluted the feet to point them further in.
You really need to establish the best position for the front part of the
canopy and mark a cut line along the rear of the bar. Once you cut it, it
will lay down much better, but you may still have to use some shims if your
bar is as badly shaped as mine was.
Then you will need to set up the rear part and determine how much of a wedge
you will need to cut from each side (wide at bottom, thin at top) to
compensate for the raising of the bar, considering that the rear needs to be
in the normal lower position. I had to have additional height welded onto my
roller brackets too.
Just take your time and proceed slowly.
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Bibb <rbibb(at)fore.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate |
>
>
>All good responses from Bob (as I expected). That's what I get
>for trying to go head-to-head with the expert.
>
Oh Randall, hold your head high. I'd score the round about 5-3 in favor of
Bob. It wasn't a knockout, but you did take a couple of falls....
I've got fuses in my -4 - too cheap and simple to pass up.
Richard E. Bibb
RV-4 N144KT
Oak Hill, VA
rbibb(at)fore.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wing Walk holes |
In a message dated 10/21/97 7:52:34 PM, you wrote:
> have dempled the skin, doulber, & ribs instead of c/s ing the doulbler
>& leaving the ribs flat.
I see nothing wrong with riveting as is.
Pat Allender -4 canopy.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
Well folks,
It looks like John Hovan perhaps doesn't work at Apple any more. My
previous message which I sent to hovan(at)apple.com bounced as follows:
(PDT)
from atapple1-smtp.apple.com [17.128.124.40]
----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors -----
noforwardingaddressavailable(at)apple.com.redirect
(expanded from: )
----- Transcript of session follows -----
551 noforwardingaddressavailable(at)apple.com.redirect... User has moved;
please try
A search of Whowhere.com finds hovan(at)apple.com's home phone number to be
(512) 908-8880 -- can someone who lives in that area (I assume its
Austin, TX from his machine's name, but I could be wrong) try phoning
him to find out what's up?
It also gave http://packlid.austin.apple.com/jhovan/home.html instead of
rv.austin.apple.com as the site of his home page, but that machine also
doesn't seem to be connected.
I also did an Alta Vista search for "John Hovan" AND RV, without getting
any good hits. Similarly, searching for "Frank Justice" AND RV didn't
find anything useful.
To avoid losing all the useful stuff (eg the Justice manual additions),
perhaps we need to ensure that everything is backed up somewhere?
Frank.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle 510-606-1001) |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
I would like to offer the resources of the matronics.com web and ftp server
as a new home for the Hovan pages if he has in fact stopped providing that
service. If someone does contact John Hovan, please let him know that
I would like to look into moving the data.
Matt Dralle
Matronics
dralle(at)matronics.com
>--------------
>
>Well folks,
>
>It looks like John Hovan perhaps doesn't work at Apple any more. My
>previous message which I sent to hovan(at)apple.com bounced as follows:
>
>(PDT)
>from atapple1-smtp.apple.com [17.128.124.40]
>
> ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors -----
>noforwardingaddressavailable(at)apple.com.redirect
> (expanded from: )
>
> ----- Transcript of session follows -----
>551 noforwardingaddressavailable(at)apple.com.redirect... User has moved;
>please try
>
>A search of Whowhere.com finds hovan(at)apple.com's home phone number to be
>(512) 908-8880 -- can someone who lives in that area (I assume its
>Austin, TX from his machine's name, but I could be wrong) try phoning
>him to find out what's up?
>
>It also gave http://packlid.austin.apple.com/jhovan/home.html instead of
>rv.austin.apple.com as the site of his home page, but that machine also
>doesn't seem to be connected.
>
>I also did an Alta Vista search for "John Hovan" AND RV, without getting
>any good hits. Similarly, searching for "Frank Justice" AND RV didn't
>find anything useful.
>
>To avoid losing all the useful stuff (eg the Justice manual additions),
>perhaps we need to ensure that everything is backed up somewhere?
>
>Frank.
>
>
>
>--------------
--
Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
510-606-1001 Voice | 510-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "I THINK, THEREFORE YOU ARE" <PKIRKPATRICK(at)FAB9.intel.com> |
Greetings fellow RV'ers,
The purpose of this message is to start a thread for our/my education on props.
This list is an incredible source of information and expertise/expierence. I
would appreciate sticking to the subject and not straying off into the
alternative power thread.
I am planning at this point to install a Mazda engine in my RV-6A. My question
arises around what is the best prop speed (RPM) to use. I have a choice of
speed reduction ratios and engine configurations to get my engine output at
180 horse power at whatever prop rpm. Here's the questions:
1. Is maximum prop RPM really gated by keeping tip speeds under supersonic?
Why?
2. Wouldn,t a prop turning at 2000 RPM (or slower) be more effiecent?
3. Is a 3 or 4 blade prop with a huge chord (like on c-130's) better than a
skinny 2 blade, and if so why are we not using them in G.A.?
4. Does anyone make props for slower turning engines?
5. A faster prop should create more drag robbing effective engine power. True?
6. What about these racing props turning 4000 plus RPM I've heard about?
I know, lots of questions but I need the education.
Thanks for the bandwidth,
Pat Kirkpatrick
RV-6A Fuse
N97WK (res)
Started kit 3/97, Should make Oshkosh '98. No its not a QB. Got more time and
kids than money.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Will Cretsinger <cretsinger(at)startext.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Edwards Air Force Base Open House |
John Kitz wrote:
>
>
> Gary A. Sobek wrote:
>
> > If anyone has any suggestion on operation of a HOT engine on the ground
> > for extended waits, please advise.
>
> Gary, my Earl's oil cooler , about 4 inches by 5 inches, is mounted in
> the baffeling just inside the cowling inlet. We waited for 58 minutes to
> leave Oshkosh on Saturday morning and the oil temperature never got over
> 140 degrees F. I have been unable to get the temperature over 170
> degrees, even on 90 degree days at high power settings. Last winter, I
> had it taped over completely to get the temperature to 140.
> John Kitz
> --+An expert
from Shell noted in the Sept Flying magazine that 170 oil temp for one hour
minimum time would boil the moisture out of the oil system but that 180 was desirable
for a minimum. He advised double checking that 180 on the gage was an accurate
reading.
I have read several postings about super efficient oil coolers yielding super
low oil
temperatures. Shouldn't these coolers be blanked off to yield 180 oil temp?
Will Cretsinger
-6A finish kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
>
>>
>> all week. Also haven't been able to get to that control stick website
>> either. Has anyone gotten on to that site? I don't have the url here now.
>
>Al,
>Which control stick website are you trying to get to? I know of
>two...Infinity Aerospace at http://www.flash.net/~infaero, and Hyperion at
>http://baste.magibox.net/~eracer/hyperion.htm. Hope this helps.
>
>Rob (RV-6Q).
>Rancho Santa Margarita, California
Rob,
Yea, I just tried both of those and it said "not found on that service". Al
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
iwaynet.net!prober(at)matronics.com wrote:
> >Infinity Aerospace at http://www.flash.net/~infaero, and Hyperion at
> >http://baste.magibox.net/~eracer/hyperion.htm.
> Yea, I just tried both of those and it said "not found on that service".
Huh??? I just tried them both, and both worked fine for me. Better check
with you ISP, Al.
Frank.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John McMahon <rv6(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | 3-M VHB 4930 TAPE |
Does any one know where I may purchase 1 or 2 rolls of 4930 3-M
tape.There was a person who responded with a Co name but
I lost it....... Oh well..
THANKS IN ADVANCE
John McMahon
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ShowCtrGuy(at)aol.com |
Ok, on the props.. I'm just a 16 year old airport kid... but I know my
fair share
>1. Is maximum prop RPM really gated by keeping tip speeds under supersonic?
Why?
This is because at supersonic speeds, the prop tips are losing efficiency
due to the shock waves created as the prop exceeds the speed of sound.
>2. Wouldn't a prop turning at 2000 RPM (or slower) be more effiecent?
Yes. -- slower is better..
>3. Is a 3 or 4 blade prop with a huge chord (like on c-130's) better than a
> skinny 2 blade, and if so why are we not using them in G.A.?
No, a one blade prop in theory is the best.. but then we have
problems with assymetrical thrust.. imbalances and such so 2 is the minimum..
each bblade has to travel through the turbulence created by the other
blade(s) and therefore with increasing numbers of blades, efficiency
decreases. 3 and 4 blade props are manily used when an issue susch as prop
clearance arises.. Amagine the -130 with 2 blade props..
>5. A faster prop should create more drag robbing effective engine power.
True?
> Can't really help ya here.. anyone else??
>6. What about these racing props turning 4000 plus RPM I've heard about?
I work with an Ex-racer from formula one class.. we're buildiing a
cassutt now, and I notice they are MUCH shorter.. the tips are not moving
much faster than the hub, so the supersonic problem isnt an issue..
I know that in some regards I may be wrong, but this is the best
that I understand things and I hope I was of help.
Jeremy King--RV4 3981 tailfeathers,
Carrollton, Ga
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site |
>Al,
>Which control stick website are you trying to get to? I know of
>two...Infinity Aerospace at http://www.flash.net/~infaero, and Hyperion at
>http://baste.magibox.net/~eracer/hyperion.htm. Hope this helps.
>
>Rob (RV-6Q).
>Rancho Santa Margarita, California
Rob,
I tried them again, this time I deleted the comma and period at the end of
the URL's and they worked. Thanks....................................... Al
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tom Goeddel <tgoeddel(at)monmouth.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Walk holes |
>
>I have dempled the skin, doulber, & ribs instead of c/s ing the doulbler
>& leaving the ribs flat.
>Should I rivet it down or de-demple the ribs & doulblers & c/s the
>doubler ??
If I understand what you are asking correctly, I think you are fine having
everything dimpled. All of the parts in the wing walk area are thin enough
to dimple, and dimpling should be a little stronger.
Tom Goeddel
RV-6a (somewhere on the fuse...)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
My latest Harbor Freight catalog has 50 foot, 1/2 OD air hoses for $17.99.
200 PSI Working Pressure, 600 PSI burst. Hard to beat that price!
800-423-2567
Dennis 6A seats Barrington, IL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Glenn & Judi <glenn(at)chocolatetruffles.com> |
| Subject: | Landing Light Kit |
Hi,
Can someone tell me who makes the landing/taxi light kit that uses an
automotive halogen bulb. Is this the same one that mounts in the wing
leading edge?
Thanks,
Glenn Gordon
Hanging Ailerons
--
MZ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Edwards Air Force Base Open House |
> I have read several postings about super efficient oil coolers yielding
super low oil
>temperatures. Shouldn't these coolers be blanked off to yield 180 oil temp?
>
>Will Cretsinger
Will,
Below 35-40 degrees F., I have my cockpit controlable oil door closed all
the way. The oil temps are around 160-170 F.
Bob Skinner RV-6 380 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Anthony Self" <CHEVY_TRUCK(at)classic.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Buying used Lycomings |
First of all, thanks to those of you who responded with advice about attending
the Avery metal working school. Think I'll go to it soon, sounds like a good
source of info.
I am planning to start building an RV6A early this spring, if not sooner. I am
collecting tools and reading everything I can get my hands on. I really would
like to buy an engine before anything else, because this is the most expensive
item for the plane. I am trying to find a used engine that isn't too much. If
I had to buy a brand new one, I don't think I could afford to build the plane,
so I'm trying to take care of that first. My questions about Lycomings are in
3 areas:
1) I see ads for engines like O320-E2D, O320-T10-540,O320B1A, O360-F1A6,
O360-E1A6D, etc. What do all these numbers mean? I see ads with every
suffix imaginable! I really prefer the 180hp O360, but how do you know what
you're getting with last four or five digits? Is there a Lycoming
spotter's guide or part # list to carry to the aircraft salvage
yards?
2) Also in the ads, are some terms which I really don't understand either?
Runout, SMOH, SOH, and Prop strike
3) What is considered really high hours on a Lycoming?
Should I find one "with" complete logs or does it really matter?
I hope these types of questions aren't too basic or make me appear any newer
to this than I am, but I can't seem to find any good info. on the subject.
Maybe there are a few other poeple out there with the same, or better,
questions.
Anthony K. Self
Ft. Smith, AR
RV6A this spring!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JamesCone(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Control stick |
Don't cut it off until you fly. You will be sorry if you do.
Jim Cone
RV-6A flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Smidler <smidler(at)dcwi.com> |
I have an O-360A1A engine and would like to use a McCauley B2D34C2 prop
that I have. Has anyone had experience installing one of these props on
a RV-6 or RV-4? My understanding is that the cowling will be pushed
back and bumps will have to be added to clear starter and/or
alternator. How was the spinner installed? Thanks for you insight.
Frank Smidler
RV6 still in basement but now it has the wings mounted.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrooksRV6(at)webtv.net (Chris Brooks) |
| Subject: | Re: Landing Light Kit |
Glenn, If you mean the light that uses a rectangular sealed beam :
Robert Olds 1025 Mott Airport Rd. Mt. Shasta CA 96067....(916) 926-5330.
Don Wentz makes the "Duckworks" kit in Vans catalog it uses a halogen
bulb and reflector from a Wal-mart Blazer driving light (very light
weight)
Steve Barnard has a light kit with a small round Halogen sealed beam.
RMD uses a round light mounted in a wingtip lens large enough to
contain the strobe ans position light also (503) 648-0331
Chris Brooks
Murfreesboro,TN
RV6, Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com> |
| Subject: | Re: fiberglass stuff |
>Psssst. This is a steal. Sign now before Bob wakes up!
>I laid up my own. It's a lot of work but VERY worth doing.
>As an empennage fairing, Van's fairing makes great landfill.
>I'd have given my eye teeth for a Skinner Floppy.
>Peter Bennett
>Sydney Australia
>RV6 doing the fiddly bits before engine
Peter,
I like it: Skinner Floppy. Sounds real "high tech". Mind if I use that
in my "advertising"?
I laid up a fairing today which reminded me that I agree with you. I
eally hate working with epoxy. May try vinyl ester resin on the next one.
It's much easier to work with.
I've had five orders, so far. If I get too many more, I think I'll raise
the price. It takes me about 1.75 hours to get all of the stuff out, cut
cloth and lay it up and then my shop smells bad for two days.
I enjoy helping fellow builders out but if I have to make too many, it
will cut into my building time (and trout fishing, next spring.)
Regards,
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "MVANY" <mvanyrv6(at)swlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Red/Orange Paint on Navy Jets |
this is so the LSO can check for proper flight configuration prior to
"crash" landng on a moving flight deck. check six
----------
> From: aol.com!RBusick505(at)matronics.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Red/Orange Paint on Navy Jets
> Date: Monday, October 20, 1997 5:11 PM
>
>
> I am curious as to why Navy jets have red/orange paint on the flaps and
other
> movable parts. You can see the paint when the flaps are down, but can
not
> see them when they are up. I like the way this looks, and I am thinking
> about doing it for my RV? For those that think they need flap indicator
> devices, this could be one technique. However, for many Navy AC, the
pilot
> can not see the flaps either up or down.
>
> Any smart Naval Aviators, or other knowledgable people out there that can
> explain the Navy's rationale.
>
> Bob Busick
> RV-6
> Fremont CA
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bjnash(at)connectnet.com (BJ Nash) |
| Subject: | Re: Need small sheet metal break |
On 20 Oct 1997 20:45:54 GMT, "David Webster"
wrote:
>>. I am
>>> looking for a small sheet metal break for production of lamp shades.
>>> I don't have room or tools to make my own break. Maximum length will
>>> probably be in the 48-inch range, and all material will be copper,
>>> tin, and steel, probably about .03 or less.
>
Welp, my own favorite is Aircraft Spruces "Economy Bending Brake"
(18"), for a mere $22.50 PN 12-02800 They are very nice fun folks
and can be reached at 1-800-824-1930 were they operate out of a brand
new "state-of-the-art" shipping facility! (Catalog- $5).
To see what a good deal this is, check out the offerings of Aircraft
Tool and Supply (ATS), : three versions from $34.95 to $69.95 18", 24"
and 36" widths. They can be reached at 1-800-248-0638
I favor Aircraft Spruce because there is never a question about the
quality of their offerings and they can take a joke!
Bill Nash
Send email to infobot(at)pdsig.n2.net for a directory of interesting stuff!
("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._ Bill Nash
`6_ 6 ) `-. ( ).`-.__.`) Aircraft Remanufacturing Corp
(_Y_.)' ._ ) `._ `.``-..-' 1531 Avohill Dr
_..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,' Vista, Ca 92084 (760) 749 0239
(((),-'' (((),' (((.-' Email: bjnash(at)pdsig.n2.net
http://www.freeyellow.com/members/aircraft-reman/index.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steve Kennedy <skennedy(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . . .Yeahbut.....] |
Hal Kempthorne wrote:
>
>
> (The gear handle was jammed by luggage and popped the breaker...)
>
> I don't unnderstand. Once the gear handle was clear of the unsecured baggage,
couldn't
> you just crank the gear down?
> ---Hal, the gear box was mostly cratered. The handle could not be engaged, but
when the motor cooled and we tried it again, enough gear
teeth engaged to get it down.
Thankfully, Steve Kennedy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: Buying used Lycomings |
classic.msn.com!CHEVY_TRUCK(at)matronics.com wrote:
> I am planning to start building an RV6A early this spring, if not sooner.
> I really would like to buy an engine before anything else, because this
> is the most expensive item for the plane.
This is a good reason for NOT buying the engine first.
When building an RV, the engine is one of the last things you attach.
So, you could tie your money up in an engine that's parked in the corner
of your garage for 5 years, or you could have it in the bank earning a
useful amount of interest. Or you could spend that money now on buying
kit parts and tools, and save up for the engine whilst you are building.
Also, unless it's carefully preserved, it's not good for an engine to
sit idle for long periods.
> I am trying to find a used engine that isn't too much.
> If I had to buy a brand new one, I don't think I could
> afford to build the plane, so I'm trying to take care
> of that first.
You could also consider an auto-conversion (eg Mazda 13B rotary or Chevy
Vortec V6). By all accounts it takes more time to get them flying, but
they're cheaper to buy and cheaper to overhaul.
> My questions about Lycomings are in 3 areas:
> 1) I see ads for engines like O320-E2D, O320-T10-540,O320B1A, O360-F1A6,
> O360-E1A6D, etc. What do all these numbers mean?
Greg Travis' engine page <http://gtravis.ucs.indiana.edu/Engines/> has
information on all this stuff.
> 2) Also in the ads, are some terms which I really don't understand either?
> Runout, SMOH, SOH, and Prop strike
Runout... engine has reached the end of it's life (nominally 2000 hours)
and needs an overhaul.
SMOH... Since Major OverHaul.
SOH... Since OverHaul
Prop strike -- the Prop has hit the ground/a fence/whatever. Because
it's attached directly to the crankshaft, this will probably involve
overhauling the engine.
> 3) What is considered really high hours on a Lycoming?
2000hrs is the normal TBO (Time Before Overhaul). It'll probably run OK
for a bit more than that (maybe as much as 3000hrs??? if it's looked
after and you're lucky, and feel like pushing that luck. It's also
common for an engine to NOT last all the way to TBO, especially if it's
only run occasionally.
> Should I find one "with" complete logs or does it really matter?
If an engine doesn't have logs you don't know its history. Because no
logs drops the value of an engine a lot, their absence possibly means
that someone somewhere is hiding something bad. Maybe *real* bad. Get
the engine real cheap, since you'll probably need to overhaul it. Engine
overhauls are very expensive.
> I hope these types of questions aren't too basic or make me appear any
> newer
> to this than I am, but I can't seem to find any good info. on the subject.
> Maybe there are a few other poeple out there with the same, or better,
> questions.
Nah... they're good questions. It's knowledge that you (and other RV
builders) will eventually need. Fire ahead. You could also ask on
rec.aviation.homebuilt -- there's some really clued-up engine guys that
hang out there.
Frank.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Control stick |
writes:
<<...sit in the plane in a relaxed fecal position...>>
Fecal? Now that's funny:)
Andy C
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Anthony Self" <CHEVY_TRUCK(at)classic.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Red/Orange Paint on Navy Jets |
I am curious as to why Navy jets have red/orange paint on the flaps and other
movable parts. You can see the paint when the flaps are down, but can not
see them when they are up.
I very well may be wrong, because I was in a Marine Corps squadron not a Navy.
But, I think they do that for accident studies. A lot of the time there are
flightline or carrier deck cameras rolling all the time. If a guy comes in and
crashes, they can review the tapes to analyze control surfaces, etc.
Flightline maintenance may even be observing these as well. I worked avionics
on F18s and our Marine birds didn't have these colors, we were ground based,
so it must be a carrier thing. Hope this idea isn't too far off.
Anthony K. Self
Starting RV6A in spring
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "mcomeaux" <mcomeaux(at)cmc.net> |
| Subject: | Aircraft Painting |
I have seen a couple of people inquiring about aircraft
painting. John Rogers is the gentleman that is respon-
sible for designing and painting a few of the Skystar
aircraft (Kitfoxs). He just opened a new paint shop in
Homedale Id. at the airport. Phone-(208)337-5506.
Business is called AeroColor----This guy is great.
Regards---Mike Comeaux
He did my last airplane and it sure got a lot of looks.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | sarg314(at)azstarnet.com (tom sargent) |
| Subject: | Re: Mazda Rotary Power Plant and Two hours needed in RV-6 |
>Hi,
> First time on the rv-list. Have completed an RV-6A powered with fuel
>injected Mazda Rotary (Wankel) 13B engine. Awaiting FAA inspection and plan
>to be in the air in November. Am looking to get two hours in an RV-6 for
>insurance purposes (does not need to be PIC time). Anyone in and around the
Ed:
Where did you get your 13b? Is it from PowerSport? What prop did
you choose?
---
Tom Sargent, sarg314(at)azstarnet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "mcomeaux" <mcomeaux(at)cmc.net> |
Look here:
http://www.prime-mover.org/Aviation/C172.ENGINES.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rscott(at)wnstar.com (Richard Scott) |
| Subject: | Re: PVC for compressed air |
Just checked at the local PVC pipe supply outlet. The next step up from
ordinary PVC is "Flow Guard Gold", a little more expensive, but printed on
the side it says, "100 PSI @ 180 degrees" and "400 PSI at 73degrees". 400
PSI is about 3 times the pressure rating my compressor has. Some regular
PVC also showed 2 strength ratings based on 73 degrees and a hotter temp
with different high temp ratings varying with the pipe manufacturer. So
perhaps if you don't run it thru hot areas you will be OK. Flow Guard is
supposed to stretch before bursting. Must use Flow Guard elbows,
connectors, etc. More speculation: If PVC is brittle, maybe that is why
some PVC says not for air--some air tools, such as impact hammers might put
a lot of vibration in the system. Using Flow Guard with secured metal
fittings sounds like a good way to go.
I used ordinary PVC for awhile & it did burst--turned out that one small
section of pipe was not schedule 40, but a lower strength rating & of
course, that's where it broke. It was exciting but no damage or injuries.
I would go with Flow Guard today.
Dick Scott
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Royce Craven <roycec(at)ozemail.com.au> |
OK, I give up.
How do you tighten the nuts on the VS rear spar/lower bolts where it mounts
to the last bulkhead at the rear of the RV-6A??????
Royce Craven
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RBusick505(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wing Walk holes |
I have dempled the skin, doulber, & ribs instead of c/s ing the doulbler
& leaving the ribs flat.
Should I rivet it down or de-demple the ribs & doulblers & c/s the
doubler ??
No just leave it as it is and rivet it together.
Bob Busick
RV-6
Fremont Ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CHRIS.BROWNE(at)bge.com |
| Subject: | Re: Buying used Lycomings |
...I see ads for engines like O320-E2D, O320-T10-540,O320B1A, O360-F1A6,
O360-E1A6D, etc. What do all these numbers mean? I see ads with every
suffix imaginable! I really prefer the 180hp O360, but how do you know
what
you're getting with last four or five digits? ...
Anthony,
See http://www.prime-mover.org/Engines/Lycoming/Lyc_Cert_list.html. The
whole list is there.
Chris Browne
RV-6A emp next month, buying tools
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Michael Irwin" <pcpms(at)leadbelt.com> |
| Subject: | Will the airport be ready for my RV? |
While my RV-8 project develops and grows, I would like to do what I can to
be sure the local airport will be there and in good shape when we are ready
to fly. I would appreciate any info that would help keep the local airport
alive and well. Input and suggestions of any kind will be useful. The
conditions are these: a single 50'x2700' aging asphalt runway, a pay phone
in a small wooden shelter, and a windsock. Nothing else. Built in '64,
and except for occasional grass cutting by city workers, it has been
virtually abandoned.
Please e-mail me off-list.
Michael Irwin
pcpms(at)leadbelt.com
Bonne Terre, MO
Readying workshop & tools for RV-8 project
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Buying used Lycomings |
>First of all, thanks to those of you who responded with advice about
attending
>the Avery metal working school. Think I'll go to it soon, sounds like a
good
>source of info.
>
>I am planning to start building an RV6A early this spring, if not
sooner. I am
>collecting tools and reading everything I can get my hands on. I really
would
>like to buy an engine before anything else, because this is the most
expensive
>item for the plane. I am trying to find a used engine that isn't too
much. If
>I had to buy a brand new one, I don't think I could afford to build the
plane,
>so I'm trying to take care of that first. My questions about Lycomings
are in
>3 areas:
>
>1) I see ads for engines like O320-E2D, O320-T10-540,O320B1A,
O360-F1A6,
>
> O360-E1A6D, etc. What do all these numbers mean? I see ads with
every
> suffix imaginable! I really prefer the 180hp O360, but how do you
know what
> you're getting with last four or five digits? Is there a
Lycoming
>spotter's guide or part # list to carry to the aircraft
salvage
>yards?
>
>2) Also in the ads, are some terms which I really don't understand
either?
> Runout, SMOH, SOH, and Prop strike
>
>3) What is considered really high hours on a Lycoming?
> Should I find one "with" complete logs or does it really matter?
>
>I hope these types of questions aren't too basic or make me appear any
newer
>to this than I am, but I can't seem to find any good info. on the
subject.
>Maybe there are a few other poeple out there with the same, or better,
>questions.
>
>
>Anthony K. Self
>Ft. Smith, AR
>RV6A this spring!
>
>
>
Anthony,
Lycoming nomenclature can be found on the web. I believe Hovan's RV
homepage has a link to such data. At any rate, it's out there
somewhere..I've seen it!
SOH=Since overhaul
SMOH=since MAJOR overhaul
Prop Strike=BAD NEWS!! The prop hit the ground when the engine was
running..can mean a bent crank, busted valves, etc.
"High" hours...depends on many things. Most can go 1800 to 2000 hours
before an overhaul..with religious oil changes and proper cooling.
A "runout" engine is one in need of overhaul..meaning that the
compression of each cylinder is no longer sufficient to generate rated
power. It also entails a thorough inspection of all the accessories,
alternator, ignition harness, plugs, mags, etc.
I'm planning on a mid-time (1000 hours or so) Lycoming IO-360 for my
RV-8...and will overhaul it myself when the time comes. I think I can
find one, with a fixed pitch prop for around 12-14K...(knock on wood).
So, for now..don't be overly concerned about it...build the airframe
first! It's all a matter of completing one small task at a time..then,
before you now it...you have an airplane!
Brian Denk
RV-8 #379
wings on the way!
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Buying used Lycomings |
> I am planning to start building an RV6A early this spring, if not sooner. I am
> collecting tools and reading everything I can get my hands on. I really would
> like to buy an engine before anything else, because this is the most expensive
> item for the plane. I am trying to find a used engine that isn't too much.
You may want to reconsider that plan. Building an RV takes quite a
bit of time (at least 18 months for my QB, longer for the standard RV
aircraft). If you buy an engine up front it will be sitting there
deteriorating (cylinder rusting for example) as you build the rest of
the plane. Even the factory preservative offered with the brand new
Lycoming is only warranteed for 6 months.
Tim
------------------------------------
Tim Lewis
N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023
San Antonio TX
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or
timrv6a(at)iname.com
------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JimNolan(at)mail.kconline.com |
Frank Smidler,
I believe John Marshall from the south side of Indianapolis ran
a McCauley constant speed on his RV-6. I understand he sold his 6 and
is now building an 8. I don't know his phone number but you could
find him through Van if you really want answers to your questions.
Jim Nolan
N444JN
Warsaw, In.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RMille6453(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Control stick |
Thats FETAL, not Fecal position! lol
Good info, thanks
Rob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net> |
simpsond(at)win.bright.net, brihal(at)execpc.com
| Subject: | Shipping via AIRBORNE |
Don't do it! I've been waiting for an inner tube for my Chief for 2
weeks. When calling the supplier, they told me it went out AIRBORNE the
day ordered. I called AIRBORNE with the tracking number and was told
they couldn't find the street address (NOT a Route & Box number!!) and
didn't bother to call to ask for direction. What an ideal way to run a
business...LONG LIVE UPS, they get the job done!
Scott, N4181E
--
Gotta Fly or
Gonna Die !
--Ask me about my
Aeronca Super Chief--
amended 8-29-97: Now after feeling the "Need for Speed", building an
RV-4!
No, the Super Chief is NOT for sale :)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Hovan's Web Site- Hovan located!! |
Hi All:
OK folks- wait a bit. I've contacted John (now working at Dell), and the page
will be up at a different address- probably Matt's (Mr. Generous)- soon. I
think the data is safe. Don't send any letter bombs....yet.
Check six!
Mark
HR2 185 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Anderson Ed" <AndersonE(at)bah.com> |
Royce,
I put platenuts on the bulkhead for the lower bolts which attached the
Vertical Stab spar to the bulkhead. Otherwise it will be a nightmare to try
to get the nut on the bolt anytime you may need to remove the VS.
Ed
----------
From: Royce Craven
Subject: RV-List: VS Mount
Date: Wednesday, October 22, 1997 3:52AM
OK, I give up.
How do you tighten the nuts on the VS rear spar/lower bolts where it mounts
to the last bulkhead at the rear of the RV-6A??????
Royce Craven
|
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Anderson Ed" <AndersonE(at)bah.com> |
make that nutplates vice platenuts for attaching bolts that hold VS to
bulkhead
Ed
----------
From: Royce Craven
Subject: RV-List: VS Mount
Date: Wednesday, October 22, 1997 3:52AM
OK, I give up.
How do you tighten the nuts on the VS rear spar/lower bolts where it mounts
to the last bulkhead at the rear of the RV-6A??????
Royce Craven
|
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Need small sheet metal break |
> >>. I am
> >>> looking for a small sheet metal break for production of lamp shades.
[snip]
>
> Welp, my own favorite is Aircraft Spruces "Economy Bending Brake"
[snip]
> To see what a good deal this is, check out the offerings of Aircraft
> Tool and Supply (ATS), : three versions from $34.95 to $69.95 18", 24"
> and 36" widths. They can be reached at 1-800-248-0638
>
> I favor Aircraft Spruce because there is never a question about the
> quality of their offerings and they can take a joke!
I tried both and found that the one that Aircraft Spruce sells, being
made from aluminum, is too flexible to do a decent job on more than the
smallest, thinnest parts. I sent it back and got one from ATS, which
is made from STEEL, and is beefier all around. A much better value
IMHO.
Randall
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | W B Ward <WBWard(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Shipping via AIRBORNE |
<< LONG LIVE UPS, they get the job done! >>
As long as they aren't out on strike, they do!!!
Regards
Wendell WBWard(at)AOL.COM (18 yrs as a FedEx A/C Mech.)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Landing Light Kit |
> Can someone tell me who makes the landing/taxi light kit that uses an
> automotive halogen bulb. Is this the same one that mounts in the wing
> leading edge?
A quick search for "LANDING" in my copy of the yeller pages
yields:
* DUCKWORKS (DON WENTZ) 503-543-2298 RV LANDING LIGHT KITS
* RICH KLEE 916-863-1927 LANDING LIGHT BLINKER
* OLDS ENTERPRISES 501-965-7835 RV LANDING LIGHT KITS
* RMD AIRCRAFT LIGHTING 503-681-0685 RV WING TIP LANDING LIGHTS
Builder's tip: download a copy of this web page, keep it around for
stuff like this. It's at http://www.sound.net/~hartmann/yelrpage.htm.
The Duckworks and Olds lights are leading edge kits, the RMDs are
wingtip kits. I have Duckworks kits, they're simple, light,
inexpensive, and easy to install. Oh yeah, and they use halogen bulbs.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Harrill <KHarrill(at)OSA.STATE.SC.US> |
| Subject: | 3-M VHB 4930 TAPE |
charset="iso-8859-1"
John,
I called a toll free number that I found on the 3M web page. The rep.
gave me the phone numbers of local vendors that sell the tape. The tape
comes in 72 yard rolls for about $60.
Ken Harrill
RV - 6, fuselage
Does any one know where I may purchase 1 or 2 rolls of 4930 3-M
tape.There was a person who responded with a Co name but
I lost it....... Oh well..
THANKS IN ADVANCE
John McMahon
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jones, Bryan D. (LPT)" <JonesB(at)GEON.com> |
| Subject: | Landing Light Kit |
>Glenn & Judi [SMTP:chocolatetruffles.com!glenn(at)matronics.com]
> Can someone tell me who makes the landing/taxi light kit that uses an
> automotive halogen bulb. Is this the same one that mounts in the wing
> leading edge?
>
Glen,
I made a landing light with four-way adjustment out of aluminum.
It only took 6 or 8 hours and uses the standard sealed automotive hi-lo
beam halogen light bulb. i also made the plexiglass (acrylic) cover for
the light. it worked out real well. The reason I made my own was: 1.
I wanted the sealed automotive bulb, 2. I didn't think the one sold
through Van's seemed very substantial (light output or size). My
judgement was made looking at one purchased by a fellow RV-8 builder.
Just some thoughts... If you would like, I can send you some
pictures of my installation. Let me know.
Bryan Jones
Pearland, Texas
JONESB(at)GEON.COM.
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gil Alexander <gila(at)flash.net> |
>
>OK, I give up.
>How do you tighten the nuts on the VS rear spar/lower bolts where it mounts
>to the last bulkhead at the rear of the RV-6A??????
>
Royce,
.... I made up an internal 0.032 plate with floating nutplates on
it. There have been some reports of the single layer rear bulkhead of the
-6A being a little weak, and having failures/distortion at the tiedown
bracket attachment. This internal plate also acts as a doubler as well as
removing the need for finding a midget with triple jointed arms to tighten
the nuts ...:^) The plate can be inserted through the large hole under the
HS and thne moved aft into it's final position.
Not an original idea ... I've seen others built this way ... and
I'm sure I'll be much happier at final assembly time.
Gil (big hands) Alexander
>
>Royce Craven
-------------------------------------------------------
mailto:gila(at)flash.net
Gil Alexander,
Los Angeles, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chester razer <crazer(at)egyptian.net> |
Royce Craven wrote:
>
> OK, I give up.
> How do you tighten the nuts on the VS rear spar/lower bolts where it
> mounts
> to the last bulkhead at the rear of the RV-6A??????
>
> Royce Craven
Through one of the inspection holes you placed at the aft end of your
fuselage. I made mine as big as possible but will still have to get
some help from someone with small hands to install the bolts. I plan on
installing the bolt with threads aft so I can easily inspect the
nut/thread relationship so the helper with small hands will have to
install the bolt and hold the wrench on the head while I torque the nut
with a washer under it.
--
Chet Razer
crazer(at)egyptian.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Nuckolls <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate |
>Good discussion, I'm glad Bob started it even though I am trailing
>smoke as we speak :-)
Gee . . . smoke? I JUST got out of a meeting with some of my
fellow technowienies at here at Raytheon (Beech) where we
are nearing conclusion of a design proposal on a new test-set
for the Navy . . . I was just thinking about how DIFFERENT the
product is now compared to my proposal in a kick-off paper
about 4 months ago. Many aspects of the design were not even
known when we started out and the knowledge base has expanded
in ways I could not have predicted. A tiny fraction of my
original work is still in place . . . yet I'm responsable for
some significant portions of the current work.
It happend because we talked . . . a lot . . . slept on it,
even pounded the table a bit. However, everyone walked out
of that meeting grinning . . . we're doing a good job and
we know it. The new product bears almost no resemblance to
the one we're replacing - there were no sacred cows to protect.
If I can share nothing else with this group it would be to
cultivate the idea of critical design review in search of an
optimized solution(s). BTW, the gentleman who was tasked to
head this group is a newbie at the head of the table. He's
stumbling around, shuffling through his papers a lot. The
grey-beards sitting around the table COULD give him a hard
time but we all remember our first time in that chair. Being
a leader doesn't mean you have to know it all, just hold up
the light and keep discussions focused. Our job in to make
him look good. You guys are all one-man airplane factories
and IMHO, everyone's job here on the list is to make YOU look good.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne) |
| Subject: | Re: 3-M VHB 4930 TAPE |
I bought a very large roll of 1/2 inch. $90. I don't need anywhere the full roll
so if you only want a small amount I'll spool some off for you. I think it is
about a buck a foot?
hal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Edward Cole <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: COMPRESSED AIR LINE/NOISE REDUCERS |
Jones, Bryan D. (LPT) wrote:
>
>
> >I saw a novel solution. One local builder used a 12-foot long
> 6" diameter
> PVC pipe in the attick of his shop for an air line with a outlet
> at each
> end coming through the ceiling in each corner of the shop. This
> gained him
> much needed tank capacity.
>
> PVC pipe users - aside from the pipe bomb implications, the idea of
> using PVC piping in air applications is interesting. I checked with an
> industrial plastic piping components supplier regarding the advertised
> pressure rating for 6" schedule 40 PVC and they said it would be good to
> 180-psi at 75-F (the brand they sold). The key here is that we are
> talking about air (compressible fluid). I might be tempted to try the
> idea but only with a relief device.
>
> Bryan Jones
> Pearland, Texas
> jonesb(at)geon.com
>
>
Ok, my 2 cents........
Personal injury aside, how much money is saved if the pipe lets go and sends a
piece
through a just completed wing panel or causes a huge dent??? It always amazes me
how we
are all spending $30-50 thousand dollars on these airplanes, but won't spring for
$20 worth of copper pipe!
Just my opinion, I could be wrong..
Ed Cole
RV6A Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Buying used Lycomings |
| From: | donspawn(at)juno.com (Don R. Jordan) |
>Anthony K. Self
>Ft. Smith, AR
>RV6A this spring!
>collecting tools
Go with bob avery. Mo's has good used stuff( find him at fly ins)
I bought an alegator type pnewmatic squeezer used . don't make that
mistake.
Avery's squeezer pushs straight & mainly is adjustable. I have to use
washer to adjust the depth. Avery's hand squeezer heads also fits the
pnewmatic.
>like to buy an engine before anything else
Don't worry about it yet. You will have to worry about storage & a jet
maybe available & cheaper in 3 years.
>1) I see ads for engines like O320-E2D, O320-T10-540,O320B1A,
. What do all these numbers mean?
Lyc service manual will show. All has to do with the accessories.
>2) Also in the ads, are some terms which I really don't understand
>Runout
reached their Time Between Overhaul
> SMOH
since major overhaul
> SOH
since overhaiul
> Prop strike
Run like &*^% , The material has been overstressed
& you are tested just when it is going to break.
>3) What is considered really high hours on a Lycoming?
Look for a fisrt generation. (about 2000 hrs)
>Should I find one "with" complete logs or does it really matter?
Without logs (good logs) you don't know what you have.
Don Jordan, RV-6A, #24330
Mansfield, Tx
Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Besing <rv(at)tppal.com> |
Hello all, my name is Paul Besing, I live in Scottsdale, Arizona, and I just
decided on buying an RV-6A after frustrating events with a Zenith Zodiac
601. I wanted REAL performance! I should take delivery in December or
January of a quick build kit, and with assistance with several others, I
hope to have it ready by Oshkosh '98 (probably not, but we'll see). I guess
it will depend on how much time saving help I get from all of you!
Here is some forseen equipment:
Lycoming 0-320 with cs prop
VFR (with reserved space for IFR if I need it)Panel with king or garmin
GPS/Comm with Moving map
Vision Micro engine monitor
Rocky mountain instruments VSI, Encoder
Sony CD player
Electric elevator and aileron trim
and any other goodies I find on the way.
I look forward to many helpful conversations with fellow RV builders.
Paul
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mauser(at)claris.com (Richard Chandler) |
| Subject: | Re: Buying used Lycomings |
> Nah... they're good questions. It's knowledge that you (and other
> RV builders) will eventually need. Fire ahead. You could also ask
> on rec.aviation.homebuilt -- there's some really clued-up engine guys
> that hang out there.
And then there's Paul Lamar.... :-)
--
Richard Chandler
RV-6: Garage bought and being finished, saving for tools and tail kit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mauser(at)claris.com (Richard Chandler) |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . . .Yeahbut.....] |
It strikes me that based on the examples and ancedotes, there are a few
systems where it is appropriate for breakers instead of fuses. I look at
these messages and I keep in mind Bob's point that circuit protection is to
protect the wire, not the device, and it's usually the device that fails.
Most electronic devices, when they fail, fail for good. One moment of the
wrong voltage across a chip and poof, it lets out all the magic smoke that
makes it work. Being able to reset won't help. However there are some
devices, like electric flap and gear motors which can fail temporarily, by
overheating, but be okay once they cool down. Devices like this should have
breakers because successfully resetting them is a possibility, and can be
crucial to flight safety.
(I was also stuck once in a spam can where the landing light would run for
about 5 minutes before popping the breaker. Resetability was kinda crucial
there.)
--
Richard Chandler
RV-6: Garage bought and being finished, saving for tools and tail kit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne) |
| Subject: | A cheap jet for my RV6 - was: Buying used Lycomings |
Hi,
Anthony Self thought he might buy the engine first and Don Jordan gives him a
several good reasons not to. One reason is a jet might be available cheaper!
Or maybe a turbo prop? Or an atomic thing of some sort? Or just a very light
and powerful engine of some other sort we can't even imagine now?
If we had an engine that was the size and weight of an O-320 but with twice the
power and half the BSFC and
Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- WANTED TO BUY - a used Chevy V-6 setup.
halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC
cost, would we accept it? It would surely be different and unproven. Would the
extra power make it dangerous? Would it rip up the airframe or cause the pilot
to get a nosebleed?
I am seriously interested in knowing what would be the effect of even 250 hp in
an RV6 while size and weight remain the same?
Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- WANTED TO BUY - a used Chevy V-6 setup.
halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mlfred <Mlfred(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: A cheap jet for my RV6 - was: Buying used Lycomings |
<< I am seriously interested in knowing what would be the effect of even 250
hp in
an RV6 while size and weight remain the same?
Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- WANTED TO BUY - a used Chevy V-6 setup.
halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC >>
Well, if you're REALLY interested, hop on up to Bakersfield, and talk to my
friend John Harmon. You may have already heard of him? You'll never be of the
same opinion after a ride in his bird....
Check six!
Mark
HR2 185 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mauser(at)claris.com (Richard Chandler) |
| Subject: | Re: A cheap jet for my RV6 - was: Buying used Lycomings |
> I am seriously interested in knowing what would be the effect of
> even 250 hp in an RV6 while size and weight remain the same?
Well, the ability to exceed VNE in level cruise is generally what we would
term as "bad". A lot of structural work needs to be done. Just ask the
Harmon Rocket guys. They've done something close to what you're talking
about.
--
Richard Chandler
RV-6: Garage bought and being finished, saving for tools and tail kit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Wills <willsm(at)nosc.mil> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . . |
.Yeahbut.....]
The rebuttal to this is: " Why did the landing light breaker trip? Why did
the flap motor overheat? The result of poor design or design error is the
answer. In a properly designed system should not experience these nuisance
trips."
I dont necessarily agree with the above. In a perfect world everything
would be properly designed the first time around, breakers/fuses would only
trip due to a genuine problem, and the pilot would never need to reset
because he would be assured that the trip was caused by real failure.
Unfortunately, design errors do occur, as do nuisance trips, even in the
homebuilt community. Of course when an inaccessable fuse blows in flight
because the flap motor overheated, thats not a nuisance trip, thats a real
failure because there is nothing the pilot can do about it.
Mike Wills
RV-4(wings)
willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil
>(I was also stuck once in a spam can where the landing light would run for
>about 5 minutes before popping the breaker. Resetability was kinda crucial
>there.)
>
>
>--
>Richard Chandler
>RV-6: Garage bought and being finished, saving for tools and tail kit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alan Davis" <aldavis(at)fair.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 3-M VHB 4930 TAPE |
John
You can order the VHB tape from: Resource Net International 612-636-8302
They quoted a price for VHB #4950 (45 mils thick, 3/4 inch wide, 36 yards
long) but must buy 3 rolls at 47.03 per roll. I believe #4930 is the same
except only 25 mils thick, maybe even for less!
Al Davis RV-6 (Slider Skirts #&?*!)
Jacksonville, FL
----------
> From: John McMahon <earthlink.net!rv6(at)matronics.com>
> To: RV-LIST
> Subject: RV-List: 3-M VHB 4930 TAPE
> Date: Tuesday, October 21, 1997 9:34 PM
>
>
> Does any one know where I may purchase 1 or 2 rolls of 4930 3-M
> tape.There was a person who responded with a Co name but
> I lost it....... Oh well..
> THANKS IN ADVANCE
> John McMahon
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4Brown(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Need small sheet metal break |
> >>. I am
> >>> looking for a small sheet metal break for production of lamp shades.
[snip] >>
Try 1 800 use enco. They carry a line of larger metal brakes at a reasonable
cost. Also there should be a good availabily in the used equipment market.
Check with your local machine dealers. The 48'" brake is large enough for
them to carry. Expect to pay $350 and up for 48" and larger. Watch the
capacity rating. Big difference between an aluminum sofit bender and a 1/4"
steel brake!
Tom Brown RV4 fuselage - canopy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4Brown(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | RV-4 wing/horizontal fixture, fuselage jig |
Gentlemen:
I have some RV-4 fixtures available. Horizontal/ wing fixture
constructed from 4" steel tubing. Fuselage jig constructed from plywood
laminations. Price is right. Located in South Eastern New York State.
Tom Brown - RV4 canopy
RV4Brown(at)AOL.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rbz1 <Rbz1(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | countersinking after dimpling |
Ive been reading about the weakness caused by countsinking .032 or less, but
what about dimpling and then a light c'sink to improve the finish. The matl
removed would be minimal. There is no mention of this in Van's manual. Any
opinions?
Rich Zeidman- 2weeks into the HS RV6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Nuckolls <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . . .Yeahbut.....] |
> I dont necessarily agree with the above. In a perfect world everything
>would be properly designed the first time around, breakers/fuses would only
>trip due to a genuine problem, and the pilot would never need to reset
>because he would be assured that the trip was caused by real failure.
>Unfortunately, design errors do occur, as do nuisance trips, even in the
>homebuilt community. Of course when an inaccessable fuse blows in flight
>because the flap motor overheated, thats not a nuisance trip, thats a real
>failure because there is nothing the pilot can do about it.
. . . but the pilot CAN do something about it. Thats the glowing
difference between our airplanes and spam-cans. With the
A-36, what you see is what you get. With an RV-6 you can do whatever
is necessary before the airplane is ever flown to (1) eliminate the
potential for problems or (2) make the problems no-sweat events.
That airplane in your shop lives in as close to a perfect world
as any airplane ever has . . .
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris Hinch <chris(at)dcc.govt.nz> |
| Subject: | countersinking after dimpling |
> what about dimpling and then a light c'sink to improve the finish. The
matl
> removed would be minimal. There is no mention of this in Van's manual.
Any
> opinions?
I recall seeing George Orndorf. (on his predrilled -8 empennage video)
presenting a technique where he dimples the skin, and then gives it a
couple of twists with a speed deburring hand tool to achvieve a better
"seat" for the rivet. George?
Chris Hinch
chris(at)dcc.govt.nz
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leo Davies <leo(at)icn.su.OZ.AU> |
Royce,
I took a tip from Jim Cone and made a little backing plate with plate nuts
to go inside the bulkhead. Took a couple of hours but the task is now a
breeze. If you don't have back copies of Jim's newsletter he will send them
to you for about $10.00. Worth it many times over.
Cheers,
Leo
>
>OK, I give up.
>How do you tighten the nuts on the VS rear spar/lower bolts where it mounts
>to the last bulkhead at the rear of the RV-6A??????
>
>
>Royce Craven
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Nuckolls <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | System reliability by design, not luck . . . |
> . . . . . However there are some
>devices, like electric flap and gear motors which can fail temporarily, by
>overheating, but be okay once they cool down. Devices like this should have
>breakers because successfully resetting them is a possibility, and can be
>crucial to flight safety.
>
>(I was also stuck once in a spam can where the landing light would run for
>about 5 minutes before popping the breaker. Resetability was kinda crucial
>there.)
No doubt people have suffered experiences where resetting the breaker was
useful . . . but ask yourself if the system involved was adequately
designed? One reader told of a case where a mechanical interference
of the partially deployed manual extension handle on a Bonanza's
gear system trashed the gizmo where it was no longer useful and repeated
resets of the breaker managed to put the gear down in spite of the damage.
I'm very familiar with the gear extension system on the Bonanza having
been both A-36 pilot and supplier of gear system components to Beech. The
system may have passed muster in 1950 but we can do much better than
that now. That system has potential single points of failure for both
electric and manual extension systems . . . and the pilot who wrote about
this case has discovered one of them. NOW . . . from the FAA's point of
view, the number of cases for this set of circumstances to occur may not
warrant an AD or even pressure to redesign the system.
We're not building certified Bonanzas, our airplanes should NOT suffer
the problems that were carried over from a 1950's design philosophy.
It's ESSENTIAL that all these stories be told, listened to and considered,
NOT to insure availability of the same band-aids, crowbars, and bubblegum -
but to DESIGN those kinds of features out of our current endeavors.
Oh yeah, you can't land without a landing light? Suppose the bulb was
burned out? As pilots we are part of the flight system hardware. If
we're comfortable with night landings sans lights on airplane, so be
it. If we're not . . . . there had better be TWO of them!
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Nuckolls <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Great smok'n breakers . . . |
>Good discussion, I'm glad Bob started it even though I am trailing
>smoke as we speak :-)
Gee . . . smoke? I JUST got out of a meeting with some of my
fellow technowienies at here at Raytheon (Beech) where we
are nearing conclusion of a design proposal on a new test-set
for the Navy . . . I was just thinking about how DIFFERENT the
product is now compared to my proposal in a kick-off paper
about 4 months ago. Many aspects of the design were not even
known when we started out and the knowledge base has expanded
in ways I could not have predicted. A tiny fraction of my
original work is still in place . . . yet I'm responsable for
some significant portions of the current work.
It happend because we talked . . . a lot . . . slept on it,
even pounded the table a bit. However, everyone walked out
of that meeting grinning . . . we're doing a good job and
we know it. The new product bears almost no resemblance to
the one we're replacing - there were no sacred cows to protect.
If I can share nothing else with this group it would be to
cultivate the idea of critical design review in search of an
optimized solution(s). BTW, the gentleman who was tasked to
head this group is a newbie at the head of the table. He's
stumbling around, shuffling through his papers a lot. The
grey-beards sitting around the table COULD give him a hard
time but we all remember our first time in that chair. Being
a leader doesn't mean you have to know it all, just hold up
the light and keep discussions focused. Our job in to make
him look good. You guys are all one-man airplane factories
and IMHO, everyone's job here on the list is to make YOU look good.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BARNES_ERIC(at)tandem.com |
Hal,
There is a guy in the Bay Area building a -6 and modifying it to be a
"Rocket". He's shortened the wings, and is now working on the fuselage
(don't know what mods he's doing), and is planning on an IO-540 I
believe. I'll see if I can get more details for you, and anyone else
interested.
EB
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: deciding between RV-4 and RV-8 |
| From: | tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com (John T. Craig-Stearman) |
Don,
The RV-8 is more expensive than the RV-4. You will have to make that
decision yourself. However, the RV-8 kit provides much more value for
the dollar. I have kept in touch with several friends building RV-8s,
and the kit improvements they report are well worth the price.
A strict comparison of the two airplanes convinces me that the RV-8 is
the better airplane. After all, it incorporates some twenty years of
experience in its design. Yes, the RV-4 is prettier, but the RV-8 has
been growing on me. The redesign of the production prototype, raising
the instrument panel slightly and enlarging the vertical stabilizer, does
much to improve the lines of the airplane. My next project will be the
RV-8.
Regards,
Tom Craig-Stearman
tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com
RV-4 installing systems
>i had thought i was pretty much decided to make an RV-8, but now i'm
>having
>second thoughts. i thought i might bounce some of the conflicting
>reasons
>off others who have gone through the same processs to see how much my
>expectations of different advantages or disadvantages of each match up
>with
>reality...
>
>RV-4:
>much prettier.
>
>RV-8:
>lower drag: higher top speed for same power engines.
>higher power engines available
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AIRPLANEIT(at)aol.com |
>3. Is a 3 or 4 blade prop with a huge chord (like on c-130's) better than a
> skinny 2 blade, and if so why are we not using them in G.A.?
-Jeremy King
Well Jeremy, I agree with you 97.374%. You mentioned how one prop blade
passes through the other's turbulence. With my experience (Limited, I am
again only 16, but then again....two 16 year old heads make up one 32 year
old's!) I believe that in normal cruising flight, a propellor's blades are
turning fast enough that as one blade passes through an area, the forward
motion of the plane is enough that when the next blade comes around, you are
a couple feet ahead of the turbulence caused by the first blade. This would
explain why all you pilots that try to pop helium balloons with your prop
(Who me!?!) don't get the balloon unless you squeeze it between the prop and
the cowl.
Also, the second number of a prop's size is the distance it travels in a
perfect fluid. So, let's say I have a 72x65 prop. It will travel 65 inches
per one revolution. Well, on a 2 blade prop, that will be......(E-6B is a
spinnin') 32.5 inches in forward motion till the next blade passes. And on a
3 blade prop, that would be 21.6 inches. Now, I know I haven't accounted for
air being a non-perfect fluid, but I hope this proves my theory close enough.
I still have algebra 2 homework to do, so I don't want to rack my brains too
hard :-)
-Nick Stolley
airplaneit(at)aol.com
Carl Goldberg Sophisticated Lady, one day...a
Northstar
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate |
| From: | gasobek(at)juno.com (Gary A. Sobek) |
On Wed, 22 Oct 1997 10:50:41 Bob Nuckolls
writes:
>
>
>>Good discussion,
---------- SNIP ----------
> Our job in to make
> him look good. You guys are all one-man airplane factories
> and IMHO, everyone's job here on the list is to make YOU look good.
WELL SAID Bob. That is what the CDR at work and the RV list is for.
Thanks. Please keep everyone thinking. Also, thanks for publishing your
work. I am an Electrical Engineer and knew the material in your book
before I read it. I have recommended it to may since I cannot explain it
as well as you did. Keep up the EXCELLENT work.
Gary A. Sobek
N157GS O-320 CS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin & Theresa Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> |
>
>
>1. Is maximum prop RPM really gated by keeping tip speeds under supersonic?
> Why?
I am not a prop expert, but I do have some theoretical knowledge.
If the prop tips are supersonic, or close to supersonic, the shock
waves cause a huge amount of drag. This reduces prop efficiency, and
hence the amount of thrust you get is reduced.
>
>2. Wouldn,t a prop turning at 2000 RPM (or slower) be more effiecent?
>
It depends. A slow turning prop either needs more blades, or greater
diameter to handle the same amount of horsepower. Extra blades hurt
efficiency because there is a greater tendency for each blade to be
operating in the wake of another blade. Larger diameter helps
efficiency at low speed, but hurts it at high speed. A large
diameter, two-bladed prop should improve take-off and climb
performance, but would probably hurt cruise performance.
>3. Is a 3 or 4 blade prop with a huge chord (like on c-130's) better than a
> skinny 2 blade, and if so why are we not using them in G.A.?
Basically you need a certain amount of blade area to handle a given
amount of horsepower. The C-130 has 3 or 4 blade props with wide
chords because it has 4,000 hp or more per engine. The only G.A.
guys that use such props are the air racers (check out Rare Bear - it
has 3 Electra blades).
>
>4. Does anyone make props for slower turning engines?
>
>5. A faster prop should create more drag robbing effective engine power. True?
>
Not necessarily. The blades would be shorter, so that would help.
The extra rpm hurts. The sum of the two could be good or bad.
>6. What about these racing props turning 4000 plus RPM I've heard about?
>
The racing guys turn up 4000 rpm because they get more horsepower
that way. The prop efficiency is probably hurt, but the extra
horsepower more than makes up for it. They might be better off with
a gearbox and a slightly slower, larger prop. But the rules don't
allow that.
>
>Pat Kirkpatrick
You might be better off with a slower, larger prop - if you could get
a well designed one. You would probably need to get it custom made.
But, the maker would not be able to take advantage of all his
experience with "normal" size props - this would likely cause the
prop efficiency to be less than optimum. Thus even if there was a
theoretical advantage to a large, slow prop (and it is not clear
whether there is or not), you probably would not be able to realize
this advantage without a lot of experimentation with the prop maker.
My advice - if you want to fly, chose a gearbox that gives a max rpm
of 2,800. This will let you find a cheap, good quality, high
efficiency prop. If you want to tinker and spend money on props,
then get a couple of different gear boxes, and start experimenting.
Note that a slower turning prop will need to be larger diameter, and
you will probably need longer landing gear legs (= more drag).
Take care,
Kevin Horton RV-8 80427 (just started tail kit)
khorton(at)cyberus.ca (613) 839-0228 (home)
Engineering Test Pilot (613) 952-4319 (work)
Transport Canada
Ottawa, Canada
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Landing Light Kit |
| From: | tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com (John T. Craig-Stearman) |
Glen,
I think you are asking about the Bob Olds landing light kit. It uses two
130 watt halogen automotive headlights, one in each outboard leading
edge. The high-beam/low-beam feature allows for both landing and taxi
lights. I have seen them in operation, and they are impressive. I have
them in my RV-4. Installation was fairly straightforward.
Regards,
Tom Craig-Stearman
tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com
RV-4 installing systems
>
>Can someone tell me who makes the landing/taxi light kit that uses an
>automotive halogen bulb. Is this the same one that mounts in the wing
>leading edge?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Barnhart <barnhart(at)a.crl.com> |
I've been holding off writing this for some time, but no more. Last week I
posted my good experiences with Lycon. Today, I'm posting my BAD
experience with Jerry Harrold.
Jerry has a reputation for making very high guality fiberglass parts. He
also has a reputation for being VERY SLOW to deliver.
I ordered a set of gear leg fairings (and sent him a check) on May 18, 1996
(That's right: 1996). I still don't have them. I have called Jerry
monthly for the past year with no results. Since July, I've been telling
him that I just want my money back. Still no results.
I'll be surprised if I EVER see my fairings or my money.
A word to the wise.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com (John T. Craig-Stearman) |
Nick,
Welcome to the RV List! I don't think I have seen your name before. I
suspect you fib slightly about your age. If not, it is a pleasure to see
that there is still a literate highschool student out there. And with an
E-6B, no less. And out chasing balloons in airplanes! There is hope for
us yet.
> I believe that in normal cruising flight, a propellor's blades
>are
>turning fast enough that as one blade passes through an area, the
>forward
>motion of the plane is enough that when the next blade comes around,
>you are
>a couple feet ahead of the turbulence caused by the first blade.
You are assuming that the effect of a propeller blade moving through the
air is limited strictly to the flight path of the blade. 'Taint so.
Find a photo of two like airplanes during air-to-air refueling (two
KC-10s, for instance). The receiver is traveling below the flight path
of the tanker. Both airplanes are traveling at the same speed, yet the
receiver is always at a significantly higher angle of attack than the
tanker. The receiver's wing is operating in the downwash created by the
tanker.
By the way, congratulations on your Sophisticated Lady. It is a great
glider. But what the dickens is a Northstar?
Regards,
Tom Craig-Stearman
tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com
RV-4 installing systems
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrooksRV6(at)webtv.net (Chris Brooks) |
I'm looking for suggestions on back drilling the aft fuselage turtle
deck skins. How have others done it? Did you have to crawl into the
fuselage? and if so, how did you prevent bending the bulkhead webs and
stringers? Right now I'm thinking I may have to throw some pillows in
there and stuff my 12 year old in with a drill!
Chris Brooks
Murfreesboro,TN
RV6, Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TPhilpin(at)aol.com |
<< This would
explain why all you pilots that try to pop helium balloons with your prop
(Who me!?!) don't get the balloon unless you squeeze it between the prop and
the cowl. >>
Experienced barn stormers will tell you balloon popping is only done on one
side of the prop, while if you try to break them with the other they are
fended off. But darn if I can remember which way is which.
Tony Philpin
Planning RV-8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne) |
| Subject: | Landing Light Kit |
Bryan Jones wrote:
>I wanted the sealed automotive bulb,
At first I thought, "Why have all the weight of the sealed beam?". After all,
the landing light is not subjected to the punishment that the auto lamp is.
These little halogen lights are incredible lumen makers and almost weightless so
why not use one of them.. My wife read something about how these little lamps
put oour like they do because they run much hotter and have been implicated in
many home fires. Hmmm. Maybe sealing them up is a good idea in an airplane.
Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- WANTED TO BUY - a used Chevy V-6 setup.
halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Kitz <jkitz(at)greenapple.com> |
| Subject: | Netscape bookmarks |
Hello builders;
As I read my 30 to 60 RV List messages every day, many messages list
homepages that I would like to visit later, but to copy them down is a
pain. Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
Thanks
John Kitz
N721JK
RV-4 176 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin & Theresa Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . . |
.Yeahbut.....]
>
<--stuff snipped-->
>However there are some
>devices, like electric flap and gear motors which can fail temporarily, by
>overheating, but be okay once they cool down. Devices like this should have
>breakers because successfully resetting them is a possibility, and can be
>crucial to flight safety.
>
>(I was also stuck once in a spam can where the landing light would run for
>about 5 minutes before popping the breaker. Resetability was kinda crucial
>there.)
>
>
>--
>Richard Chandler
>RV-6: Garage bought and being finished, saving for tools and tail kit.
>
Certainly a motor could overheat, and a breaker might be useful there.
However, if a flap motor or landing light is truly a flight critical
system, then you had better have two of them, on completely separate
circuits. Otherwise, what do you do if the motor or light fails?
I suspect that most of us could land without flaps, so I wouldn't
call a flap motor a critical system. Also, any of us that only have
one landing light, or two lights but on the same circuit, had better
practice lights out landings once in a while. Its not hard on a
lighted runway (at least with a tricycle gear).
Take care,
Kevin Horton RV-8 80427 (just started tail kit)
khorton(at)cyberus.ca (613) 839-0228 (home)
Engineering Test Pilot (613) 952-4319 (work)
Transport Canada
Ottawa, Canada
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Acker" <r.acker(at)thegrid.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
> pain. Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
> growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
John,
Assuming you are using Windows (3.1 or 95) on a PC, or a Mac, you have two
choices. Get a mail reader program that highlights a link in the posted
message, click on it, and save the bookmark in your web browser.
Otherwise, highlight the link, copy it, start your web browser, paste it in
the web address area, and save the link as a bookmark.
Rob (RV-6Q).
Rancho Santa Margarita, California
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Craig Hiers <craig-RV4(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Countersinking |
Bob Skinner wrote:
>
>
> >If you want to have a polished finish on your RV4, take care with the
> >countersinking process. I have the one-hole piloted countersink from Avery
> >and have rings around several rivets where the burr gets dragged around
> >thereby ripping the Alclad from the skin. I now give a short burst (
> >electric drill here ) then lift the countersink to clear the burr with my
> >finger, then finish the countersinking process. That initial burr is a nasty
> >little chunk of aluminum.
> >
> >How have others dealt with this situation ?
>
> >Mark McGee
>
> Mark,
> We deal with the situation my dimpling. I think most of the "old hands"
> on the list would agree. Dimple whenever possible. Uniformity, when machine
> countersinking, is a problem. Also, I think machine countersunk rivets are
> more likely to work loose such as in the belly area. One common problem is
> that some builders countersink too deep which means the force of the set
> does not hit the rivet like it should.
> As far as polished aircraft. What's the term? Masochist? I visited with
> Mrs. Dave Anders at a fly-in while she was polishing one of the most
> beautiful RVs I've ever seen. She was grumbling and told me that the RV-4
> was scheduled for the paint shop. She'd had about all of the polishing she
> wanted.
>
> Bob Skinner RV-6 bskinr(at)trib.com
>
Bob is right, your rivets will look more uniformed and you will save
a lot of time by dimpling.
Also, you will not turn into the karate kid by putting on polish
and taking it off. I know someone with a Globe Swift who regrets
polished alu every day.
Craig Hiers
RV-4 N143CH
Tallahassee, FL.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: System reliability by design, not luck . . . |
At 05:24 PM 10/22/97, you wrote:
> system may have passed muster in 1950 but we can do much better than
> that now. That system has potential single points of failure for both
> electric and manual extension systems . . . and the pilot who wrote about
> this case has discovered one of them. NOW . . . from the FAA's point of
> view, the number of cases for this set of circumstances to occur may not
> warrant an AD or even pressure to redesign the system.
> We're not building certified Bonanzas, our airplanes should NOT suffer
> the problems that were carried over from a 1950's design philosophy.
> Bob . . .
> AeroElectric Connection
Bob,
Once again you are absolutely Right ! My gear is gonna be down and WELDED
! ;-) Al RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr(at)netins.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
charset="iso-8859-1"
>Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
>growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
Download IE 4.0 with Outlook Express mail. Then you can click on the
www.???? address right from the mail program. If you like what you see you
can save it right to your RV folder on your favorites (bookmark) lists. I
have not seen the latest version of Netscape, but I think IE is great!
Some other things that are neat. In Outlook Express you can use inbox
assistant to send all of your RV-list msgs to your RV-list folder. This way
you can read your RV mail when you have time and deal with the other stuff
imeadiately ( or you can ignore your work related mail and read the RV list
first). You can also ckick on the subject header and have your mail
imeadiately sorted by the subject (thread). I think Microsoft has really
hit the nail with IE 4.0 and Outlook Express.
Tailwinds, N240 the pink panther
Doug Rozendaal
dougr(at)petroblend.com
www.petroblend.com/dougr
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: New RV Buyer |
Paul,
Hi my name is Ken I live in Chandler. After seeing the RV-6 at Copperstate
last week, I've got to have one. I'm also looking at the Quickbuild Kit
option. I ordered the info pack/ video yesterday and will start looking for
hanger space next week. ( I can't see building the plane without a hanger at
CHD to keep it after it's done.) All thats left is to convince myself that I
can tackle such a large project. How much time do you think it will take to
complete your project? Have you looked into the prefab instrument panels? Do
you have any experience with metalworking? I'd be interested in see your kit
when you get it. Keep me posted.
Ken Held
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)idacom.hp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
John:
John Kitz writes:
>
> Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
> growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
It's hard to answer your question without knowing what platform
and browser you're using (though you did mention Netscape). But
here are some possibilities.
(1) If you use your browser to read your email, the browser will
automatically convert the URL for the web page into a link. For
example, if someone writes "see my home page at
http://www.somewhere.com/" the 'http://www.somewhere.com/' part of
the message will become an active link to the web site. You can
just select it, jump to the site, and then select "Add to Bookmarks"
from the Bookmarks menu.
(2) Cut and past. Most platforms (Mac, Unix, or--ugh--Windows NT/95)
support cutting and pasting in one form or another. You can highlight
the text in the email, copy it, then paste it into the Location field
on your browser (the place you would normally type it).
(3) If you're on Unix (yeah), you can use a nifty program called
Hypermail to convert your email inbasket to a web page on your own
computer. You can then view the web page, sorted either by thread,
subject, date, or author. URLs (web addresses) that people put in
their messages automatically become links (as in #1, above).
I use Hypermail on unix, together with a mail filter called Procmail.
Together, they automatically send my RV List messages into a special
file, and turn the file into an organized web site that I read with
Netscape. This is _much_ better than sorting through the messages
with an email program.
I haven't used some of the more sophisticated email programs, such as
Eudora or CC:Mail. I think some of them combine email and browser
capabilities. You might want to investigate them.
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC
(picking up the -6 empennage kit this weekend, I hope)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott D. Morgan" <smorgan(at)pdq.net> |
ED,
I can supply you with several grey paint numbers. The standard is
FED-STD-595
You can obtain this from any government book store. Additionally, paint
vendors, especially automotive paint vendors can supply you with a custom
mix to this government spec.
Regards,
Scott Morgan (RV6A empannage fever)
----------
> From: Edward Cole <ix.netcom.com!emcole(at)matronics.com>
> To: rv-list
> Subject: RV-List: Paint.
> Date: Monday, October 20, 1997 11:48 AM
>
>
> Does anyone know of a source for Military Paint or it's equivilent?
> I'm looking for a grey to use on the instrument panel and would like to
> simultate Military type grey panel.
> Ed Cole
> RV6A 24430 Fuselage
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | charles(at)onramp.net (charles young) |
| Subject: | Re: Jerry Harrold |
It took me TWO years to get my parts and then only after a threatening
letter to turn him in for mail fraud!! Believe it or not!!
>
>I've been holding off writing this for some time, but no more. Last week I
>posted my good experiences with Lycon. Today, I'm posting my BAD
>experience with Jerry Harrold.
>
>Jerry has a reputation for making very high guality fiberglass parts. He
>also has a reputation for being VERY SLOW to deliver.
>
>I ordered a set of gear leg fairings (and sent him a check) on May 18, 1996
>(That's right: 1996). I still don't have them. I have called Jerry
>monthly for the past year with no results. Since July, I've been telling
>him that I just want my money back. Still no results.
>
>I'll be surprised if I EVER see my fairings or my money.
>
>A word to the wise.
>
>Best Regards,
>Dave Barnhart
>rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mauser(at)claris.com (Richard Chandler) |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . . .Yeahbut.....] |
> Certainly a motor could overheat, and a breaker might be useful there.
>
> However, if a flap motor or landing light is truly a flight
> critical system, then you had better have two of them, on
> completely separate circuits. Otherwise, what do you do if the motor
> or light fails?
Sometimes redundant systems cause more problems then they solve. (e.g. higher
accident rate with twins). And sometimes you just can't have a redundant
system (dual tails on an RV?)
> I suspect that most of us could land without flaps, so I wouldn't call
> a flap motor a critical system. Also, any of us that only have
> one landing light, or two lights but on the same circuit, had
> better practice lights out landings once in a while. Its not hard on
> a lighted runway (at least with a tricycle gear).
Maybe not on an RV, but some aircraft have a lot of trouble doing a go-around
with the flaps down.
--
Richard Chandler
RV-6: Garage bought and being finished, saving for tools and tail kit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AIRPLANEIT(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
Hello builders;
As I read my 30 to 60 RV List messages every day, many messages list
homepages that I would like to visit later, but to copy them down is a
pain. Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
Thanks
John Kitz
N721JK
RV-4 176 hours
>>
Yes sir. I'm hoping you have Windows 95 cause here goes! (I've suffered the
same problem)
-First, highlight the URL of the web site
-Next, right click and and from the menu that pops up, select, "Copy"
-Then, go to your desktop, and right click again. On the menu that pops up,
select "New" and then, from that menu, select "Shortcut".
-A type of Wizard will pop up. WHere it asks the location of the target, you
paste the URL there (Make sure it includes the prefix http://......)
-Once the URL is in, press "Next"
-Now type in the name you want to give the shortcut "make it obvious"
-press "finish"
-Viola, you have an internet shortcut.
-Now just double click on it and you go directly to the site! (Assuming you
are connected to the internet)
Hope that does it! E-mail if you need
more help
-Nick Stolley
airplaneit(at)aol.com
Carl Goldberg Gentle Lady....Deceased
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BobTrumpRV(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Shipping via AIRBORNE |
<< Don't do it! I've been waiting for an inner tube for my Chief for 2
weeks. When calling the supplier, they told me it went out AIRBORNE the
day ordered. I called AIRBORNE with the tracking number and was told
they couldn't find the street address (NOT a Route & Box number!!) and
didn't bother to call to ask for direction. What an ideal way to run a
business...LONG LIVE UPS, they get the job done!
Scott, N4181E
>>
I had the same problem when ordering something from Chief. I told them never
to send me anything via Airborne again. In my experience, Airborne was
incompetent and inconsiderate.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "les williams" <lesliebwilliams(at)classic.msn.com> |
I lay two 1" boards, one 10" wide X 5 or 6' long on one side and another 8"
wide X 3 or 4' long on the other side, both angled toward the rear. Works for
me and I'm not small.
Les Williams/RV-6AQ/Tacoma WA
I'm looking for suggestions on back drilling the aft fuselage turtle
deck skins. How have others done it? Did you have to crawl into the
fuselage? and if so, how did you prevent bending the bulkhead webs and
stringers? Right now I'm thinking I may have to throw some pillows in
there and stuff my 12 year old in with a drill!
Chris Brooks
Murfreesboro,TN
RV6, Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gil Alexander <gila(at)flash.net> |
>
>OK, I give up.
>How do you tighten the nuts on the VS rear spar/lower bolts where it mounts
>to the last bulkhead at the rear of the RV-6A??????
>
Royce,
.... I made up an internal 0.032 plate with floating nutplates on
it. There have been some reports of the single layer rear bulkhead of the
-6A being a little weak, and having failures/distortion at the tiedown
bracket attachment. This internal plate also acts as a doubler as well as
removing the need for finding a midget with triple jointed arms to tighten
the nuts ...:^) The plate can be inserted through the large hole under the
HS and thne moved aft into it's final position.
Not an original idea ... I've seen others built this way ... and
I'm sure I'll be much happier at final assembly time.
Gil (big hands) Alexander
>
>Royce Craven
-------------------------------------------------------
mailto:gila(at)flash.net
Gil Alexander,
Los Angeles, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Casey <caseyr(at)mail.firn.edu> |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
John Kitz wrote:
>
>
> Hello builders;
> As I read my 30 to 60 RV List messages every day, many messages list
> homepages that I would like to visit later, but to copy them down is a
> pain. Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
> growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
>
I'm assuming that you are using NetScape for both email and browsing.
If the posted homepage is actually a link (highlighted), you can click
on it to go there, add the bookmark (Ctrl-D, or Bookmark menu/Add
bookmark), switch back to email, and continue reading messages. If it
isn't a link, or if you don't want to wait for the page to display; you
can select the homepage reference by highlighting it with the mouse and
copying the text to the clipboard with the Copy command on the Edit menu
(or just type Ctrl-C). Then you can paste the text into your bookmark
file with the Paste command on the Edit menu (or type Ctrl-V). Just open
your bookmarks with a Ctrl-B from the Browser window (Bookmark menu, Go
to bookmarks); insert a new bookmark (Item menu, Insert bookmark); and
paste the text into the location field. You have a name and a
description available to you as well. This process is easier to do than
it is too describe, so don't let my long rambling directions throw you
off!!
Good luck!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: countersinking after dimpling |
<< Ive been reading about the weakness caused by countsinking .032 or less,
but
what about dimpling and then a light c'sink to improve the finish. The matl
removed would be minimal. There is no mention of this in Van's manual. Any
opinions?
Rich Zeidman- 2weeks into the HS RV6A >>
No countersinking dimpled skins or structural members. It is either or, but
not both. This is one of the reasons it is not mentioned in the manual.
Sounds as though you need a set of Cleveland Tool Co. dimple dies.
Regards
Wendell WBWard(at)AOL.COM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Besing <rv(at)tppal.com> |
| Subject: | standard vs. quick build |
Do any of you have any input on the quick build kits? I am one to value
opportunity cost, and would not mind paying the additional $8000, but I
would also like to complete the kit by myself. Any input?
thanks...
Paul Besing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Besing <zenith(at)tppal.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
John:
the best way to do that is to highlight the address and hit "edit" and then
"copy" or use the shortcut ctrl and c together (if you have a PC) and go to
Netscape and highlight everything in the whith "location" box at the top and
hit "edit" and "paste" or the shortcut ctrl and v together. then you can
just add a bookmark the way you normally do. this will save some typing
anyway..
Paul
>
>Hello builders;
>As I read my 30 to 60 RV List messages every day, many messages list
>homepages that I would like to visit later, but to copy them down is a
>pain. Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
>growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
>
>Thanks
>John Kitz
>N721JK
>RV-4 176 hours
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Jerry Harrold |
<< Jerry has a reputation for making very high guality fiberglass parts. He
also has a reputation for being VERY SLOW to deliver.
I ordered a set of gear leg fairings (and sent him a check) on May 18, 1996
(That's right: 1996). I still don't have them. I have called Jerry
monthly for the past year with no results. Since July, I've been telling
him that I just want my money back. Still no results.
I'll be surprised if I EVER see my fairings or my money.
A word to the wise.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB
>>
Dave:
I'll echo what you have said. Try talking to the Mrs.- she might be able to
get you what you want.
I have gear leg covers in stock, ready to ship. How many sets ya want?
Check six!
Mark
HR2 186 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . ..Yeahbut.....] |
Bob,
I tried sending this once before, but got no mail for 3 days and never saw
it when I started receiving it again. I am one of many who have electric
elevator trim. If you have a stuck switch or relay, in other words a runaway
trim. I for one would like to be able to reach over and pull the breaker
before the situation becomes critical. Now I suppose I could wire in a
cuttout switch if I wanted to, but that would fall under complicating the
system. I know for a fact if the trim were all the way to one extreme you
would have a hell of a time bringing the airplane back in one piece. I would
consider this a saftey of flight item.
Ryan RV4131RB
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: fuselage skins |
| From: | wstucklen1(at)juno.com (Frederic W Stucklen) |
Chris,
That's what I did! Now he's 18 and 6'2" and won't fit into the new
bird in the show. I'd suggest some planks on top of the stringers as it
makes it easier to the upper locations....
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
(Working on 2'd RV-6A - Chevy Powered!)
wstucklen1(at)juno.com
(Chris Brooks) writes:
>
>I'm looking for suggestions on back drilling the aft fuselage turtle
>deck skins. How have others done it? Did you have to crawl into the
>fuselage? and if so, how did you prevent bending the bulkhead webs and
>stringers? Right now I'm thinking I may have to throw some pillows in
>there and stuff my 12 year old in with a drill!
>
>Chris Brooks
> Murfreesboro,TN
>RV6, Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jerry Harrold |
> Today, I'm posting my BAD
> experience with Jerry Harrold.
>
> Jerry has a reputation for making very high guality fiberglass parts. He
> also has a reputation for being VERY SLOW to deliver.
>
> I ordered a set of gear leg fairings (and sent him a check) on May 18, 1996
> (That's right: 1996). I still don't have them. I have called Jerry
> monthly for the past year with no results. Since July, I've been telling
> him that I just want my money back. Still no results.
>
Thanks for honestly sharing your experiences. I'm trying to decide
from whom to order a set of fairings. I think you've saved me a lot
of grief.
Tim
------------------------------------
Tim Lewis
N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023
San Antonio TX
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or
timrv6a(at)iname.com
------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
John Kitz wrote:
>
>
> Hello builders;
> As I read my 30 to 60 RV List messages every day, many messages list
> homepages that I would like to visit later, but to copy them down is a
> pain. Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
> growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
>
> Thanks
> John Kitz
> N721JK
> RV-4 176 hours
>
click on the URL when you're reading the message to go quickly to the
site, then click on the bookmark on the top line of netscape, then click
on the "add to bookmark"...then you can just click on the "window" on the
title bar, then click on the "netscape mail" to return to reading your
mail.
Scott (Getting shop and tools ready for an RV-4)
--
Gotta Fly or
Gonna Die !
--Ask me about my
Aeronca Super Chief--
amended 8-29-97: Now after feeling the "Need for Speed", building an
RV-4!
No, the Super Chief is NOT for sale :)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: fuselage skins |
> I'm looking for suggestions on back drilling the aft fuselage turtle
> deck skins. How have others done it? Did you have to crawl into the
> fuselage? and if so, how did you prevent bending the bulkhead webs and
> stringers? Right now I'm thinking I may have to throw some pillows in
> there and stuff my 12 year old in with a drill!
>
> Chris Brooks
Chris,
I put a 1x10 board in there and just laid down on that. I needed to
put a couple of notches near the aft end of the board so it wouldn't
bend the sides of an aft bulkhead. I know it looks scarry to do
this, but it worked for me (160 lbs).
Tim
------------------------------------
Tim Lewis
N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023
San Antonio TX
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or
timrv6a(at)iname.com
------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Anderson Ed" <AndersonE(at)bah.com> |
Thanks Dave
I was on the verge of ordering his prop spinner and gear covers, have talked
to him several times and never quite got the impression of any real interest
in my order - so I procrastinated in sending in the check. Based on your
experience, I will look elsewhere or build them myself.
Thanks
Ed
----------
From: Dave Barnhart
Subject: RV-List: Jerry Harrold
Date: Wednesday, October 22, 1997 8:43PM
I've been holding off writing this for some time, but no more. Last week I
posted my good experiences with Lycon. Today, I'm posting my BAD
experience with Jerry Harrold.
Jerry has a reputation for making very high guality fiberglass parts. He
also has a reputation for being VERY SLOW to deliver.
I ordered a set of gear leg fairings (and sent him a check) on May 18, 1996
(That's right: 1996). I still don't have them. I have called Jerry
monthly for the past year with no results. Since July, I've been telling
him that I just want my money back. Still no results.
I'll be surprised if I EVER see my fairings or my money.
A word to the wise.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB
|
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | cecilth(at)juno.com |
| Subject: | Re: fuselage skins |
Hi Chris,
I'm at exactly the same place you are. And I'm doing it the very easy
way.
I have the fuselage on a spit ( like bar-b-q style) I simply rotate it to
the exact position I need and just lean inside to do the work.
I use a one inch pipe flange (the flange you can bolt to the ceiling then
screw the pipe into) one at each end of the fuselage (well actually I use
two at the rear). At the front I weld an elbow in place to fashion the
handle.
I drilled a hole through the handle, then tru the plywood backboard in
several places to make it stay in any one position or it can free wheel
if needed.
Cecil Hatfield
Thousand Oaks, California
(Chris Brooks) writes:
>
>I'm looking for suggestions on back drilling the aft fuselage turtle
>deck skins. How have others done it? Did you have to crawl into the
>fuselage? and if so, how did you prevent bending the bulkhead webs and
>stringers? Right now I'm thinking I may have to throw some pillows in
>there and stuff my 12 year old in with a drill!
>
>Chris Brooks
> Murfreesboro,TN
>RV6, Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick_Smith(at)brahms2.tivoli.com |
| Subject: | Re: countersinking after dimpling |
Morning all,
In the builders supplement Vans mentions that it is sometimes beneficial to
lightly touch dimpled holes with a countersink cutter to clean them up. I
have found that when dimpling sheets .032 and thicker it makes a big
difference in the finished surface. All it does is square up the sides of
the dimple to match the rivet heads. Do just enough to remove the finish
on the sheet but be carefull and practice first. As your dimple dies get
older, or if you are not using the $38.00 dimple dies to begin with, this
technique really makes a difference.
Hope it helps.
Rick (15,000 plus rivets and still building!)
aol.com!Rbz1(at)matronics.com on 10/22/97 05:00:41 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: countersinking after dimpling
Ive been reading about the weakness caused by countsinking .032 or less,
but what about dimpling and then a light c'sink to improve the finish. The
matl removed would be minimal. There is no mention of this in Van's manual.
Any opinions?
Rich Zeidman- 2weeks into the HS RV6A
|
|
"rv-list-request(at)matronics.com" | | & put the word "[un]subscribe" in the
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sharlene Shipley or Bruce Knoll <snsbfk(at)mail.sage.net> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . |
..Yeahbut.....]
Hi Ryan,
you said: I know for a fact if the trim were all the way to one extreme you
>would have a hell of a time bringing the airplane back in one piece. I would
>consider this a saftey of flight item.
I have no desire to have a trim or flap motor cause troubles in the air.
Odds are against it but it only takes once. Will be going with all manual
controls.
If you want the best of safety with electric trim motors, do like the RJ 50
seat jet flown by COMAIR. They have a system , with a flip of a switch,
which allows the left seat stick to control the levt elevator and the right
to control the right. just a thought.
Bruce Knoll
RV6A empennage ordered
>
>Bob,
> I tried sending this once before, but got no mail for 3 days and never saw
>it when I started receiving it again. I am one of many who have electric
>elevator trim. If you have a stuck switch or relay, in other words a runaway
>trim. I for one would like to be able to reach over and pull the breaker
>before the situation becomes critical. Now I suppose I could wire in a
>cuttout switch if I wanted to, but that would fall under complicating the
>system. I know for a fact if the trim were all the way to one extreme you
>would have a hell of a time bringing the airplane back in one piece. I would
>consider this a saftey of flight item.
> Ryan RV4131RB
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Craig Hiers <craig-RV4(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-LIST - LOW FUEL PRESSURE |
> I have an approximate 2" 90 degree pitot tube shaped vent on both tanks.
> The end toward the direction of flight is flared. There is a #50 drill
> hole in the back side incase of bugs. Fuel tanks were FULL. Fuel flow
Drilling the back side of thr vent tube is something I have never
encounterd before,is this a common practice? Sounds like a
great idea to me.
Is this list great or what!
Craig Hiers
RV-4 N143CH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Patrick E. Kelley" <patk(at)mail.ic.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
John Kitz wrote:
>
> Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
> growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
This method works for Netscape Navigator. I assume a similar method
would work for Communicator, but I don't want to load NC just to test
it. Anyway, highlight the url you wish to save and press Control-C to
copy to clipboard. Next, select the Window menuitem and bookmarks from
the submenu. In the bookmark window, select the Item menuitem and
Insert Bookmark from the submenu. In the Bookmark Properties window,
give the url a name, put the cursor in the url field, and press
Control-V to copy the url from the clipboard. Click on OK and then you
have the bookmark in your list with a little "?" over the icon to
indicate that you have not visited this bookmark. Then you can visit
the site anytime.
What I do instead is visit the site by clicking it and bookmarking only
if I find the site valuable. Otherwise, I end up cleaning out my
bookmarks frequently. Once I've visited the site, I can easily resume
reading my mail.
PatK - RV-6A - Getting ready to start on the right wing.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Reiff <Reiff(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Sherwin Williams self etching primer |
Guy #1 wrote:
> << This means that after you apply your self-etching primer you need
> to paint a topcoat over it. I may be wrong about some primers but most
> need a topcoat to be effective.
Guy #2 wrote:
> Don't believe it. Primers only need a top coat to be MOST effective. IMO
> non-topcoated chromate containing primers are still very effective in
> reducing corrosion on aluminum. For steel, use a strontium chromate epoxy
> primer. They are tighter and don't really need a topcoat to be fully
> effective.
I write:
Following are selected quotes from the Product Data for Sherwin Williams
GBP 980 and its aerosol equivalent 988:
PRODUCT DESCRIPTION
GBP is a two component, chromate containing self etching primer/filler
designed to eliminate the metal conditioning step. Etches the surface of
bare metal substrates to provide excellent paint adhesion and corrosion
resistance.
TECHNICAL DATA
Salt spray resistance: Excellent (500 hrs)
Humidity resistance: Excellent (500 hrs)
SURFACE PREPARATION
Bare metal: solvent clean
SUITABLE SUBSTRATES
Steel
Aluminum
Fiberglass
OEM enamels
OEM lacquers
Cured body filler
NOTES
- Min dry film thickness of 1.0 mils is required for corrosion
protection.
- Do not use GBP on large pre-painted surfaces.
- Sealing of GBP before topcoating is recommended due to some minor
chromate pigment bleed under light colors (my note: 980 is olive drab,
988 aerosol is gray, so this may be less relavent to 988).
- Do not wet sand.
- Do not apply over MET-L-MATE or similar conversion coatings.
- Do not re-coat with Vinyl Wash Primer E2-G973,zinc chromate primer, or
two component polyester based primers.
Hope the above is helpful. I've just switched from Marhyde to SW 988.
The 988 is easier to apply a nice even coat due to the spray nozzle
which produces a nice even vertical stream. It also seems a little
thicker so it's less prone to run. It's a darker shade of gray too, so
it's easier to see on aluminum.
Bob Reiff
RV4 #2646 O-360/CS, skinning fuselage
Reiff Preheat Systems
(FAA-PMA Aircraft engine preheaters, RV wing skin heaters)
http://www.execpc.com/reiff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gcomfo(at)tc3net.com (Gordon Comfort) |
| Subject: | Re: deciding between RV-4 and RV-8 |
John T. Craig-Stearman wrote:
>
> The RV-8 is more expensive than the RV-4. You will have to make that
> decision yourself. However, the RV-8 kit provides much more value for
> the dollar.
> Regards,
> Tom Craig-Stearman
> tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com
> RV-4 installing systems
>
> >i had thought i was pretty much decided to make an RV-8, but now i'm
> >having
> >second thoughts.
>
>Craig and Don: I agree with Craig that the RV-8 is a better buy. The performance
of the -4 and -8 in relation to HP is probably too near the same to swing
the decision either way. Appearance is subjective. What is not often mentioned
in such decisions is the mission the aircraft will be asked to perform. An
RV-4 with a light engine and prop will be a delight to operate in maneuvering
flight but will be less so for long cross country flight. My RV-4 with a passenger,
baggage and low fuel is more work to fly for long periods. Conversely,
with a heavy engine and prop, the long cross country will be more comfortable
but the maneuvering flight won't have the same charm. The RV-8 has the potential
to deal with these requirements because of its higher useful load and more
loading options. With the CG somewhat aft the -8 will do loops, immelmans,
split esses and the like with aplomb. When loaded for cross country it will
afford pitch stability the -4 cannot. Think hard about this one. It is why
I am bui
lding (albeit slowly) an RV-8.
Regarding the polishing comment from another thread: It takes me about
100 man hours per year to keep the -4 moderately well polished. If you
don't want to do this, forget about keeping is shiny. If you do want
one to be shiny, consider painting the bottom only. The underside takes
an awful beating and at least in the humid regions is a real bear to
maintain.
Gordon Comfort
N363GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: New RV Buyer |
Congratulations Paul!
I ordered a 6A QB two months ago-will be receiving kit in 3-4 weeks. Your
Oshkosh timetable may be a little optimistic. From talking to several
current QB builders it looks like a 1500 hour project if you don't make many
modifications. How about adding an inverted oil system to your list for some
real fun!
Regards,
Mike Kiess (RV 6A QB on the way!)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | catbird(at)taylortel.com (TTC Carroll A. Bird) |
| Subject: | Small Acorn Nuts |
I have a friend who has built an RV-4about 6 years ago. To
attach his canopy he used 6-32 screws with small cap nuts on the inside.
These nuts have a red plastic insert making up the "acorn" part. I also
seen an RV-4 at Kerrville last week that had the same nuts on the
canopy. They are very neat looking. My question is - does anyone know
where I can purchase these type nuts? I need about 60 of them.
Thanks in advance,
Carroll Bird,
RV-4 working on cowling.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Electric Trim Runaway |
> I tried sending this once before, but got no mail for 3 days and never saw
>it when I started receiving it again. I am one of many who have electric
>elevator trim. If you have a stuck switch or relay, in other words a runaway
>trim. I for one would like to be able to reach over and pull the breaker
>before the situation becomes critical. Now I suppose I could wire in a
>cuttout switch if I wanted to, but that would fall under complicating the
>system. I know for a fact if the trim were all the way to one extreme you
>would have a hell of a time bringing the airplane back in one piece. I would
>consider this a saftey of flight item.
>
Thanks for staying with it. The matronics.com URL fell of the edge
of the world a few days ago and everybody's input to the list
was bounced or disappeared. There are still some funny things going
on as I've had to post one or two pieces twice to get them through
the pipe. Computers is wunderful!
Here's a case where I think complicating the system has good foundation
in pilot versus airplane ergonomics.
Pulling a breaker on trim runaway is too time consuming and there's
a lot of window for error. If your trim breaker is located in a whole
nest of other breakers, the possiblity of pulling the wrong one in
time of "tense pilot response" is great. Pulling the wrong one may
no have electrical consequences for flight for inadvertently shutting
down another system but it adds still more delays in perception and
resolution of multiple problems . . . all design and/or pilot induced.
In any case, pulling the breaker is far more time consuming than some
alternatives. During trim runaway, time is of the essence. The longer
you delay in effecting shutdown, the further out-of-trim the airplane
is going to be when the motor stops running . . . we need to shave
tens of milliseconds off of the perception-reaction-action time needed
to bring things under control.
I'm working on an article that suggests powerful electric trim systems
should require two switch actuations for operation . . . not unlike
requiring your starter current to also pass through the battery contactor.
You have a way to deal with a stuck starter contactor by shutting
of the battery master.
Suppose you had a stick grip with the usual coolie-hat trim button and
a second, "arm" button for all electric trims. The arm button would have
positive control over electrical power to all trim systems and would
have to be held closed at the same time you are commanding trim. The
advantage is that you hand is already on the control necessary to
disable the trim when the runaway happens. Even if the trim relay
stuck at the conclusion of your last trim operation (latent, unannunciated
failure) then as soon as you pressed the "arm" button, you'd get an un-
expected trim operation and your reaction to release the button is
a few hundred milliseconds away from successful trim shutdown . . . you
can't do it any faster any other way.
For airplanes with autopilots and powerful servos, the situation
is a bit different. Here we have mulitiple, electrically driven systems
with the ability to drive flight controls. The common wisdom here is
to fit the aircraft with an "autopilot disconnect" button on the wheel
or stick. When you think about it, the pilot's first reaction to
countering
an unexpected input from electrically powered flight controls is to grab
the stick to keep the dirty side down and the pointy end forward. It
stands to reason that all the controls necessary to corral the runaway
system should be on the stick or wheel too . . . the "autopilot disconnect"
or "master trim disconnect" button would have positive control over all
electrical devices connnected to flight controls.
When things are back under control, the pilot may elect to experiment a
bit to see if it was trim or autopilot that caused the upset and shut
down the offending system (perferably with panel mounted, clearly labeled
switches . . . not little black buttons hiding in a flock of other little
black buttons).
>. . . I know for a fact if the trim were all the way to one extreme you
>would have a hell of a time bringing the airplane back in one piece.
If this is true, has your trim system been fully evaluated for both
speed and travel limits? I have several builders I'm working with now
trying to get them to revise the mechanism that connects servos to tabs.
Trims in a mechanical limit on these airplanes produces a barely flyable
airplane.
This conversation goes right to the issue I raised a few weeks ago with
the Great Breaker Debate . . . we've commonly viewed and many of us have
been REQUIRED to compensate for POOR SYSTEM DESIGN by fiddling with
breakers.
IMHO, no matter what fails or how it fails in your airplane, your
reaction should be no worse than, "Oh fudge . . . is that thing
broke again! I think I'm gonna have to find a better part." My brothers
in the certified world would like to design airplanes with that
philosophy but are prevented by a host of regulatory and bureaucratic
walls and mountains. Unencumbered by such obstacles here in
amateur-built world, we're going to build the best airplanes that have
ever existed.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: fuselage skins |
| From: | n5lp <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
>
>I'm looking for suggestions on back drilling the aft fuselage turtle
>deck skins. How have others done it? Did you have to crawl into the
>fuselage? and if so, how did you prevent bending the bulkhead webs and
>stringers?
I did this. I weigh 190 and did not have any problem. I threw a blanket
back there and was careful how I moved around. With a long drill bit it
was pretty easy.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
Pacer N8025D
RV-6QME N441LP Reserved
Rudder Pedals and Stick
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Wills <willsm(at)nosc.mil> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . . .Yeahbut.....] |
Bob,
I think you missed my point. You need to seperate the pilot from the
designer. Once the airplane is flying, with you at the controls, and a
failure occurs, you have to deal with it in real time as a pilot, not a
system designer.
I agree that as homebuilders we have every opportunity to design problems
out of our airplanes before they ever fly. In spite of our best efforts
design errors occur. You yourself described such an error earlier in this
thread (I believe it was in reference to an alternator field fuse which was
undersized, although I cant recall the details). If a system is under
engineered or improperly designed or constructed and is protected by an
inaccessible fuse, if/when that system fails in flight the pilot must live
without that system. Of course because that aircraft is a homebuilt, if/when
the pilot successfully lands that airplane he can re-engineer that system so
that hopefully that failure would not occur a second time.
I cant speak for you, or any of the other builders on this list, but I can
look back on the work that I have done on my RV to date and say that I am
not infallible. The potential for electrical system design errors in my
aircraft definitely exists but with help from others such as yourself I hope
to minimize those errors.
Mike Wills
RV-4(wings)
willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil
At 05:30 PM 10/22/97, you wrote:
>
> . . . but the pilot CAN do something about it. Thats the glowing
> difference between our airplanes and spam-cans. With the
> A-36, what you see is what you get. With an RV-6 you can do whatever
> is necessary before the airplane is ever flown to (1) eliminate the
> potential for problems or (2) make the problems no-sweat events.
> That airplane in your shop lives in as close to a perfect world
> as any airplane ever has . . .
>
>
> Bob . . .
> AeroElectric Connection
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . |
..Yeahbut.....]
I know for a fact if the trim were all the way to one extreme you
>would have a hell of a time bringing the airplane back in one piece. I would
>consider this a saftey of flight item.
> Ryan RV4131RB
If you can't overpower the electric trim, it doesn't belong in the
airplane. I had a trim
runaway one time and it was not fun but not terribly dangerous.
Along the same lines, I was planning to install a navaid autopilot in my
plane but am having 2nd thoughts. If the autopilot were to "wig out" while
cruising 50mph above manuevering speed, It might make an awful mess before
I can recover. I wouldn't even want to think about such an event occuring
in IMC. I know that all A/Ps are clutch driven, so overpowering it should
not be a problem. It's just a matter of what might happen in the 4 or 5
seconds it takes to get a grip on things.
Opinions??
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Moore <76147.3367(at)compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | RMI Engine Momitor |
Does anyone have any experience with the Rocky Mountain Instrument's
uMonitor? I've read about it on their website and it seems like a good
instrument with a lot of functions at about 1/3 the cost of Vison
Microsystem's instrument.
Thanks,
JP
RV8,Co.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . . |
.Yeahbut.....]
>Sometimes redundant systems cause more problems then they solve. (e.g.
higher
>accident rate with twins). And sometimes you just can't have a redundant
>system (dual tails on an RV?)
Then it's poor system design. For example, many people with two
engines on the light twins think they have redundant electrical
systems . . . when in fact, loss of a single battery contactor makes
use of both alternators a bit shakey if not impossible. Redundant
doesn't necessarily mean two of the same thing. I've submitted
an article for publication that does an alalysis on a pilot's
wing-and-a-prayer story. There were a number of problems with the
design of his electrical and gear system where unannunciated failures
could lurk. Further, his manual gear extension system was poorly
debugged.
I suggested in the article that the manual extension system should
be considered the "primary" extension system . . . the simple
system that should be expected to work EVERY time. The electrical
system was "secondary" and included only for pilot convenience.
I got my retract signoff in a Beech Sierra a few years back. I
LOVED the manual gear extension system in that airplane . . . open
a door in the floor at your feet, turn a valve and the gear falls
down and locks. You could blow open every hydraulic joint, smoke
every wire, lock up every motor in that airplane and guess what,
the wheels fall down and lock . . . . what a concept!
>
>Maybe not on an RV, but some aircraft have a lot of trouble doing a
go-around
>with the flaps down.
>
Back in the good ol days when Cessna was being praised for their
"barn door" flaps, the C-150 was unable to achieve level flight
at full gross with full flaps. It bit more than one student who
didn't know that a go-around maneuver took 50-100' of altitude. Once
you were below 50' AGL with 40 degrees of flaps, you were committed
to put wheels on the ground. Again (forgive me folks), let's not
put band-aids on poor designs by increasing pilot workload. If your
airplane won't climb on full flaps, then don't put down full flaps
until you are SURE that the comfortable arrival with the earth is
a done deal.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Admin Kit User <jerrydd(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: countersinking after dimpling |
Rbz1 wrote:
>
>
> Ive been reading about the weakness caused by countsinking .032 or less, but
> what about dimpling and then a light c'sink to improve the finish. The matl
> removed would be minimal. There is no mention of this in Van's manual. Any
> opinions?
> Rich Zeidman- 2weeks into the HS RV6A
>
Rich,
You are correct, you can lightly dimple the .032 and
then countersink. By doing this you will have a stronger rivet because
you will have removed less material than by countersinking alone. Good
luck. Jerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | caummisa(at)arn.net (Richard Caummisar) |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
Do like many other "older" computer users do, ask your kids to show
you how to do it.
. Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
>growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Wills <willsm(at)nosc.mil> |
| Subject: | Re: Jerry Harrold |
Tim,
Cant speak for his gear leg fairings, but I ordered a headset from Mark
Frederick right here on the list, and his customer service was top notch. He
got me a great price and I sent no money until I received the headset. If I
didnt like it I could send it back without spending any $. You might give
him a try.
Mike Wills
RV-4(wings)
willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil
>Thanks for honestly sharing your experiences. I'm trying to decide
>from whom to order a set of fairings. I think you've saved me a lot
>of grief.
>
>Tim
>------------------------------------
>Tim Lewis
>N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023
>San Antonio TX
>timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or
>timrv6a(at)iname.com
>------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com |
| Subject: | operational speeds |
Two quick questions for those with more RV time than my initial 20
hours.
First, what is the power off best glide speed in an RV, particularly an
RV-6A? How would the actual glide angle at that speed compare to an
engine off condition as compared to an engine at near idle?
Second, regarding Vans Vne of 210 mph. should I regard this as true or
indicated airspeed. In other words, at my normal flying altitudes of
11,000 - 12,000' (high country of Colorado), approximately 180 mph
indictated equates to 210 true. At this altitude, should I consider the
180 indicated as my actual Vne?
Andy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick_Smith(at)brahms2.tivoli.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass gear fairings |
All,
Anyone who has built their own fiberglass gear leg fairings, or metal for
that matter, and then looks at the composite ones Mark Frederick offers for
the Harmon Rockets will buy his fairings. I will use them on my second -6
and wish I used them on my first. At the Kerville fly in last week my wife
pointed out the kinked, one piece, metal fairings on the yellow RV-8
prototype and said "I hope OUR new plane doesn't look like that!" Talk
about pressure to do good work! Why did Vans use one piece metal fairings
on the gear legs?
Rick
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: fuselage skins |
----------
> From: Chris Brooks
> I'm looking for suggestions on back drilling the aft fuselage turtle
> deck skins. How have others done it?
-----------
Chris,
I laid boards and pillows and wrenched myself into place. I did it all
myself but if I were to do it again I would have someone on the outside
fitting the clecos and watching for any unwanted creep. I had to do mine
twice. I thought the skin was centered but after I had drilled it all, one
side didn't have enough edge distance. I couldn't see this from the inside
and because it was such a pain to crawl in and out, I didn't check this
enough. There is very little room for error as the skins are not oversized
at all.
To keep the bulkheads straight, many people attach plywood to them. Also,
be careful not to sinch the skins down to tight as this will cause the
bulkheads to bend and or cause small dents above the notches in the
bulkhead. Again, I was alone and used a ratcheted tiedown to keep the
skins tight....very easy to overtighten. The second time I just used lots
of duct tape.
Ross Mickey
canopy frame-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Cabe" <robert.cabe(at)usaa.com> |
I have an O-320 with bushings in the flange of the shaft for 3/8" prop
bolts. I understand that the 2 1/4" prop extension requires 7/16 prop
bolts. I must convert the flange bushings from 3/8" to 7/16".
1. How to I change the bushings?
2. Where can I get the 7/16" bushings?
3. How much will they cost?
4. Are there any alternatives that would allow me to use the 3/8" bushings
that are already installed?
Thanks for the help.
Bob Cabe
RV-6
San Antonio
---
"The opinions expressed herein are solely the author's
and are not necessarily the opinions of USAA."
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne) |
| Subject: | Re: standard vs. quick build |
Here's some input...send Van a check and get started!
With the QB you do every operation, even some that regular builders don't do.
You just don't do all of them ad nauseum.
Complete it yourself? You can do the following or hire it out legally:
Upholstery
Paint
Panel
Engine & prop get ready (install ?)
To me, QB just means I hired someone to do the repetitive work for $8 per hour.
Actually, building a fixture for the fuselage and starting it up still seems a
bit overwhelming.
Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- WANTED TO BUY - a used Chevy V-6 setup.
halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC
>
> Do any of you have any input on the quick build kits? I am one to value
> opportunity cost, and would not mind paying the additional $8000, but I
> would also like to complete the kit by myself. Any input?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fesenbek, Gary" <gfesenbek(at)meridium.com> |
| Subject: | standard vs. quick build |
I also, went through the same thought process. I decided after speaking
with Ken from Van's on the following. I would make my final decision on
this after completing the regular tail build kit. If you just order the
tail kit, Van's will deduct $2000 from the quickbuild if you later
decide that is what you want to do. I just got my tail in. This is my
first aircraft building experience. I have had some involvement with
the EAA and have heard the stories of people taking 10 years or more to
finish the kit. There is even a guy here in the local area that has had
the engine hung for ten years and he still is not done.
Please don't mis-understand. I think that a lot of the fun is also in
the journey, but for me actually completing it and spending some time
flying it is an important part of the journey for me. If you proceed the
way I have described, in a sense you can get your big toe in the pool by
building the tail and then decide on the way you would like to go. Also
because so many before me no doubt a bunch more experienced, with more
free time and more enthusiasm(this is hard to believe) on their hands
than me have gone before and failed, I tend to lean toward being
conservative. If you proceed this way it is not $8000 difference, but
only $6000 difference. If Van's numbers are accurate and it takes 2100
hours for the normal kit and 1100 hours for the quickbuild, you save
about 1000 hours (multiplied by any factor you feel is reasonable). For
me, that 1000 hours will translate to a year very easily, unless I
totally give up other aspects of my life. I do have a full time job.
This year may mean the difference in between me finishing it or not.
I may opt not to go the quickbuild after building the tail, but at this
moment it seems most appealing to me.
Gary
Tail in hand
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Besing [SMTP:tppal.com!rv(at)matronics.com]
Sent: Thursday, October 23, 1997 1:45 AM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: standard vs. quick build
Do any of you have any input on the quick build kits? I am one
to value
opportunity cost, and would not mind paying the additional
$8000, but I
would also like to complete the kit by myself. Any input?
thanks...
Paul Besing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | medadmin(at)aalborgkeystone.com (Dave Jones) |
| Subject: | heated pitot tubes |
Greetings,
I'm in the market for a heated pitot tube for an RV-6. Does anyone
have experiance with the procurement/installation/operation of this
device on an RV?
Thank you,
Dave Jones
Erie, Pa.
left wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | denis <denis.rolandoeugio(at)hol.fr> |
Hello
I'm a french hombuilder, new on the list and my english is poor (sorry):-(
I have bought a Lycoming O360A1AD for the RV4 I'm building (I LOVE this taildragger
!)
and the propeller wich was with it. They come from a Socata TB 10 (french made
plane).
My problem is that this propeller ( c/s Hartzell HC-C2YK-1BF )is 74.5 inch dia.
Vans
told me that he never exceded 72 inch in dia. Has anybody on this list encounter
the
same problem ? And is it really a problem ?
Many thanks
ROLANDO Denis
fuselage RV4 in progress
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CHRIS.BROWNE(at)bge.com |
| Subject: | Re: standard vs. quick build |
Paul,
I have been wringing my hands over this for months. I finally
compromised. I am building the empennage for the experience, then
ordering a QB. Van credits you $2000 against the QB kit if you do
this.
I am certain that I will get plently of "satisfaction" this way and a
belly full of riveting, although not as much as most out there.
Figuring (hoping) on 3 years or so to finish.
Chris Browne
Buying Tools, -6A emp next month
Do any of you have any input on the quick build kits? I am one to value
opportunity cost, and would not mind paying the additional $8000, but I
would also like to complete the kit by myself. Any input?
thanks...
Paul Besing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Besing <rv(at)tppal.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New RV Buyer |
Hi Ken:
I have experience only with a rudder from a Zenith Zodiac. I found out some
disturbing info, and decided to cancel my order. I am also currently in
chandler, but I am moving to Scottsdale in about 3 weeks. I plan on
building mine in my garage, as hanger space is pretty impossible to come by.
If I do the quick build kit, I am forecasting about 800 hours or so, just
because I am pretty handy, and have about 30 hours of metal experience with
my Zodiac.
I too just ordered the info pack and video two days ago. Our situations are
pretty similar, as I made my decision at Copperstate! Maybe we can work
through our building experiences together sometime. I plan on taking
delivery in December or January, and hope to have it completed by Oshkosh.
I am having a company called Aerotronics build my custom panel that I
designed. It looks to be about $16000. I am buying a factory rebuilt
Lycoming 0-320 from a company in Oklahoma for about $15000. Give me call
sometime if you want to talk about these kits. 413-9747
Paul
>
>Paul,
>
>Hi my name is Ken I live in Chandler. After seeing the RV-6 at Copperstate
>last week, I've got to have one. I'm also looking at the Quickbuild Kit
>option. I ordered the info pack/ video yesterday and will start looking for
>hanger space next week. ( I can't see building the plane without a hanger at
>CHD to keep it after it's done.) All thats left is to convince myself that I
>can tackle such a large project. How much time do you think it will take to
>complete your project? Have you looked into the prefab instrument panels? Do
>you have any experience with metalworking? I'd be interested in see your kit
>when you get it. Keep me posted.
>
>Ken Held
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James E. Clark" <James.E.Clark(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: standard vs. quick build |
Quick comments from a QB owner/builder ....
>
> Do any of you have any input on the quick build kits? I am one to value
> opportunity cost, and would not mind paying the additional $8000, but I
Worth every penny if you ask me.
> would also like to complete the kit by myself. Any input?
>
There is **MORE** than enough work to be done to give you the "I built it
myself" feeling. Probably one of the fastest QB efforts is taking at least
18 months (elapsed time) of work. I **KNOW** it will take me years. Now
maybe most QB buyers simply have less time or less skill ... I do know
about others, but I would put myself in that category. The QB made it
POSSIBLE for me to make the decision to build. Without it I would NOT have.
But, if you have *plenty* of time and really enjoy drilling every hole and
pounding every rivet, then you may not like it. If you are short of time
(or like me, time **and** skill ;-} ) and have a few extra $$, I highly
recommend the QB.
I bought mine last year and at OSHKOSH this year noticed a continued
improvement in the already high quality.
> thanks...
>
> Paul Besing
>
James
RV6AQ ... Wing closure this month????
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Corbitt" <donc(at)analogia.com> |
| Subject: | rec.aviation.homebuilt article on props |
charset="iso-8859-1"
[This seemed pretty interesting, or perhaps too good to be true
- Don Corbitt, donc(at)analogia.com]
Corky Scott wrote:
In this month's "Sport Aviation", in the photo section reviewing some
of the aircraft and displays from this years Oshkosh fly-in, was a
photo of a scimitar shaped prop on the nose of a wingless fuselage. I
was intrigued by the color and shape of the blades. They were bright
yellow and had a PRONOUNCED scimitar shape. I knew from past readings
that scimitar shaped props were designed that way to allow them to flex
in flight and assume some of the characteristics of constant speed
blades; they are deliberately pitched to a cruise (coarse) type pitch
and flatten out at slow speeds to allow the engine to spin up and
develop more power. At higher speeds and reduced throttle, they unbend
back to the coarse pitch. Or at least that's the idea. This is not a
new concept, it was first used in World War I. In those days, the
shape of the blade and the type of wood they used was mostly guesswork.
One of the scimitar shapes I've seen (EAA's Experimenter a month ago)
actually had a swept forward shape. Bob Whittier, the author of the
very informative article did not think the forward swept prop was very
successfull.
The blurb on this new prop claimed that it was computer designed to
predictably flatten out at slow speed/high power situations and then
unbend to a coarse pitch at higher speeds for good cruise by the use of
computer design and modern composites and resins. I was intrigued, I
called the number and talked with QCS. I spoke for about half an hour
with an individual (sorry, I didn't write his name down and I'm not
sure so I'd rather not guess) who said his expertise was in tooling
design. He told me that Sport Aviation had erred slightly with the
description in the photo, they called the prop a single piece type, it
isn't; the blades clamp to a steel hub. While the initial setting is
adjustable, customers do not get to change the pitch themselves.
Estimates are made as to what the initial pitch should be and the prop
is sent with two pairs of indexed clamps for the hub that, when clamped
around the prop bases, will give the prop the correct pitch. If, in
testing, it turns out that the prop needs to be repitched, one each of
the two sets of clamps are sent back and they are re-indexed by Global
QCS and returned to you. You re-clamp the prop and it now assumes the
new pitch. Other than that, there is no owner adjustment possible.
The rep talked about how they manufacture the blades so that there are
absolutely positively no voids in the composite blanks. The blades are
made of a composite of materials all predicted by computer design to
flex from 6 to 8 during flight. In other words, no guesswork. It
took them 18 months to model the first prop, and 9 months to complete
the second one. Engineers were hired from all over the space, aviation
industry and prop industry to put their collective minds behind this
project. Global successfully competed with other companies for NASA
SPIR funding with which to hire the many engineers who are working on
the research. If I'm remembering the conversation correctly the
president of Global, Michael Smith, had been wanting to pull together
all the various techniques and concepts of a fixed pitch constant speed
and combine them with state of the art composites and resins to create
this prop.
One thing he stressed over and over was that the airfoils were exactly
the same, one after the other. They come out of the molds that way.
He mentioned that they got a certified fixed pitch prop in their shop
for analysis and comparison and were surprised to find that the blades
were not the same one side to the other. "One side had a flat spot on
the airfoil not duplicated by the other blade" he said. QCS has
achieved precision repeatability, each blade is an exact duplicate of
all the others. I was told the blades are so light they were
considering adding some mass to them so that engines won't run rough at
slow speeds without the flywheel effect of a heavy prop to carry them
around in between power pulses.
The blades are molded to steel shanks and are currently being run on
the test stand at 135% rpm.
Yet another feature of the blades is that they incorporate modern
airfoils not used in props previously. Many certified props simply
have a flat back to them, possibly because of the difficulty of
manufacturing intricate shapes in metal. I've read elsewhere that
often the ubiquitous Clark-Y airfoil is what many props use. At QCS
the computer modeling suggested a turned down rear edge near the hub, a
"cusp" it was called which causes the top and bottom airflow off the
trailing edge to be more parallel which reduces turbulence.
Finally, I asked him if he minded if I posted this information to the
news group. He said he didn't mind but asked that I wait until he
could send me their information sheet so that I didn't get any of what
he was telling me wrong. So I waited and it arrived yesterday. You
see it complete below:
***Begin quote***
Global QCS Composite Propeller
"Global Aircraft Corporation has designed, fabricated and is currently
testing a flexible, quasi-constant speed, composite propeller for use
on General Aviation and Experimental aircraft. Initial production is
scheduled for January 1998 and FAA certification is anticipated by mid
1998.
The Global QCS Propeller Team has developed a unique propeller design
methodology that defines the geometric shape of the propeller blade.
Developed through cooperative research and development contracts with
NASA, the Global Quasi-Constant Speed (QCS) Propeller is the first
major improvement in fixed-pitch propellers for General Aviation
aircraft since the 1930's. Utilizing the integration of aerodynamics,
non-linear structural analysis, state-of-the-art aero-elastic analysis
and advanced composite manufacturing capability, the propeller design
process uses sound analytical approaches and Computational Fluid
Dynamic (CFD) simulation coupled with full-scale test verification.
The QCS Propeller is fabricated with advanced composite materials and
resin transfer molding processes in precision closed-cavity molds. The
revolutionary innovations of the Global QCS Propeller are its ability
to flex (change pitch) predictably under operating loads, performing
similarly to variable pitch propellers, and reduced noise levels
achieved through modern propeller acoustic design. Increased
performance and efficiency over fixed pitch propellers include 35%
reduction in take-off distance, 40% increase in rate-of-climb, and 10%
increase in cruise speed. The QCS Propeller retains the advantages of
a fixed pitch propeller, specifically, low cost, low weight, low
maintenance, and simple operation with no requirement for engine
pitch/speed control. No other fixed-pitch propeller demonstrates
comparable characteristics.
The Global QCS Propeller is currently being developed for 160 to 210
horsepower engines. Production of propellers for experimental
airplanes is scheduled for early 1998. Production of FAA certified
propellers for certified airplanes is scheduled for mid 1998. QCS
Propellers for special applications can be developed under special
agreement." *** end of quote***
Will this be what it appears it can be? Will this prop revolutionize
the propeller industry? I don't know but we will soon find out as the
first version for experimental aircraft is due to fly shortly.
And the cost? They really haven't gotten into production yet but were
forced to toss out some ballpark figures. They felt that $3500 for the
160 hp engine and $4500 for the 210 hp engine was a good starting
point.
My personal feeling, and I'm going out on a limb here, is that this is
a truly significant advancement in aviation. If it actually manages
the performance figures the computer modeling predicts, they will be
HUGELY successful. Imagine constant speed prop performance with a
lightweight fixed pitch prop. And while $3500 is not cheap, it's a
bunch less than a constant speed.
Actually, it doesn't end there. QCS is also computer modeling cowlings
for aircraft. He said that little work has been done on cowlings and
noise abatement and cooling design recently. Some cowlings act as a
drum, picking up the beat of the prop and amplifying it. This is
something that a properly designed and constructed cowling could
minimize. So my worry about a needing a slow turning prop to keep it
quiet may be over. If this prop can be quiet at 2500 to 2700 rpms
because of its accoustical design then little, if any sacrifice need be
made to performance. And that's STILL not all. They are working on a
prop for a direct drive engine, something that will be turning 4700
rpms on the formula one circuit. Owners of direct drive engines might
want to pay attention to this research.
Sure hope the testing verifies the computer model.
Corky Scott
PS, I was also warned that at least one manufacturer of composite props
appeared unable to make them without voids in the blades. He was of
the opinion that this is a dangerous practice.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James E. Clark" <James.E.Clark(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jerry Harrold |
Thanks for sharing this Dave.
And now for a DIFFERENT experience ...
> I ordered a set of gear leg fairings (and sent him a check) on May 18,
1996
> (That's right: 1996). I still don't have them. I have called Jerry
> monthly for the past year with no results. Since July, I've been telling
> him that I just want my money back. Still no results.
>
>
I ordered (by phone conversation) a set of gear leg fairings from Mark
("Check Six") and did NOT send him a check. I have them. They arrive BEFORE
he said they would (he said there *might* be a short delay .. there was
not). I did *NOT* have to call him about sending same.
And it gets better ..
I left the country on business for a while and had not sent the check
before leaving. Not a single complaint from Mark!! (Yes, I did get around
to sending it upon return).
I cannot compare the quality of the two sets of fairings, but I can say
that Mark delivered as promised.
Just FYI. (I have no other affiliation with Mark)
James
RV6AQ ... still on wings .. don't need those fairings yet.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Corbitt" <donc(at)analogia.com> |
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0274_01BCDFB7.5F633E40"
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_0274_01BCDFB7.5F633E40
charset="iso-8859-1"
I've been wondering about props.=20
1) How do people learn about them? Hangar discussions?
2) I've learned that you can have a "climb prop" and a "cruise prop" =
(change in pitch, I guess?), or a Constant Velocity (what I would have =
called a variable pitch) prop. Would a CV prop always climb as well as =
a "climb prop", and cruise as well as a "cruise prop"? Would it do =
better than both?
3) What is the typical improvement in cruise speed gained from a CV =
prop?
=20
4) Could someone guess at ballpark figures for this table? (I put in =
imaginary numbers)
[Use fixed pitch font so columns line up]
[Let's say RV-6A, 160 HP, 1650 lbs gross]
=20
Measurement Best Climb Cruise CV
Takeoff Dist (ft) 535 ?100% ?80% ?100%=20
Climb (fpm) 1450 ?100% ?80% ?100%=20
Ceiling (ft) 16,300 ?85% ?100% ?100%=20
Cruise 55% (mph) 169 ?85% ?100% ?100%=20
Cruise 75% (mph) 188 ?85% ?100% ?100%=20
Top Speed (mph) 199 ?85% ?100% ?100%=20
=20
OK, so the fake numbers I created above claim that a CV prop matches the =
'best' characteristics of a Climb and a Cruise prop. Is this accurate? =
Is it so dependent on the particular airplane that there is no point in =
trying to quantify things? Am I asking impossible questions?
--
Don Corbitt, donc(at)analogia.com.
------=_NextPart_000_0274_01BCDFB7.5F633E40
charset="iso-8859-1"
I've been wondering about props.
1) How do people learn about them? Hangar discussions?
2) I've learned that you can have a "climb prop" and a=20
"cruise prop" (change in pitch, I guess?), or a Constant =
Velocity=20
(what I would have called a variable pitch) prop. Would a CV prop =
always=20
climb as well as a "climb prop", and cruise as well as a =
"cruise=20
prop"? Would it do better than both?
3) What is the typical improvement in cruise speed gained from a CV =
prop?
4) Could someone guess at ballpark =
figures for=20
this table? (I put in imaginary numbers)
[Use fixed =
pitch font so=20
columns line up]
[Let's say RV-6A,=20
160 HP, 1650 lbs gross]
Measurement =
Best =20
Climb Cruise =
CV
Takeoff Dist (ft)=20
535 =
?100% =20
?80% ?100%
Climb =
(fpm) =20
1450 =
?100% =20
?80% ?100%
Ceiling (ft) =20
16,300 =
?85% =20
?100% ?100%
Cruise 55% (mph) =20
169 =
?85% =20
?100% ?100%
Cruise 75% (mph) =20
188 =
?85% =20
?100% ?100%
Top Speed (mph) =20
199 =
?85% =20
?100% ?100%
OK, so the fake numbers I =
created above=20
claim that a CV prop matches the 'best' characteristics of a Climb and a =
Cruise=20
prop. Is this accurate? Is it so dependent on the particular =
airplane that there is no point in trying to quantify things? Am I =
asking=20
impossible questions?
--
Don Corbitt,
donc(at)analogia.com.
------=_NextPart_000_0274_01BCDFB7.5F633E40--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Denman <mikedenman(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Master Solenoid and Starter Solenoid |
This is a Bob Nuckolls type question. (I have the Aero Connection book
and it is excellent) Is there any reason why you would or wouldn't use
a continuous duty solenoid for both the master and the starter other
than cost? Any advantages or disadvantages? B&C advertises a starter
solenoid that cost $40. Is this a type 2? Van's sells a starter
solenoid for less than $15. Something must be different between the
two. Has anyone had any bad experiences with the Van's version. Any
input would be appreciated.
Mike Denman
RV6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hasson R GS-12 355LG/AFETS <hassonr(at)lg355.dm.af.mil> |
Who and what is the RV-LIST?
Thanks,
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AIRPLANEIT(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Netscape bookmarks |
---------------------
Subj: Re: RV-List: Netscape bookmarks
Date: 97-10-22 23:09:06 EDT
From: AIRPLANEIT
Hello builders;
As I read my 30 to 60 RV List messages every day, many messages list
homepages that I would like to visit later, but to copy them down is a
pain. Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
Thanks
John Kitz
N721JK
RV-4 176 hours
>>
Yes sir. I'm hoping you have Windows 95 cause here goes! (I've suffered the
same problem)
-First, highlight the URL of the web site
-Next, right click and and from the menu that pops up, select, "Copy"
-Then, go to your desktop, and right click again. On the menu that pops up,
select "New" and then, from that menu, select "Shortcut".
-A type of Wizard will pop up. WHere it asks the location of the target, you
paste the URL there (Make sure it includes the prefix http://......)
-Once the URL is in, press "Next"
-Now type in the name you want to give the shortcut "make it obvious"
-press "finish"
-Viola, you have an internet shortcut.
-Now just double click on it and you go directly to the site! (Assuming you
are connected to the internet)
Hope that does it! E-mail if you need
more help
-Nick Stolley
airplaneit(at)aol.com
Carl Goldberg Gentle Lady....Deceased
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MoeJoe <moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . |
..Yeahbut.....]
Well, now if you had a breaker on that autopilot, you could just flip it
off in 2 seconds...
:)
Maurice Colontonio
Cherry Hill, NJ
RV-8 Emp
> Along the same lines, I was planning to install a navaid autopilot in my
> plane but am having 2nd thoughts. If the autopilot were to "wig out" while
> cruising 50mph above manuevering speed, It might make an awful mess before
> I can recover. I wouldn't even want to think about such an event occuring
> in IMC. I know that all A/Ps are clutch driven, so overpowering it should
> not be a problem. It's just a matter of what might happen in the 4 or 5
> seconds it takes to get a grip on things.
>
> Opinions??
>
> John
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)idacom.hp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: operational speeds |
>
>
> Second, regarding Vans Vne of 210 mph. should I regard this as true or
> indicated airspeed.
IAS is what the airframe experiences. That is, 210 IAS "feels" like
210 to the airframe, regardless of density altitude. So 210 IAS is
the Vne.
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC
(picking up -6 tail kit this weekend--I hope)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: fuselage skins |
In a message dated 10/23/97 1:02:47 AM, you wrote:
>I'm looking for suggestions on back drilling the aft fuselage turtle
>deck skins
On my -4 I cut a piece of plywood to fit in there. It gave me something to
lie on while drilling and bucking rivets. You can notch it to fit around the
bulkheads if you need to. Not much room in the tail of a -4.
Pat Allender - canopy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)idacom.hp.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
Doug Rozendaal writes:
>
> >Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
> >growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
>
>
> Download IE 4.0 with Outlook Express mail.
John, if you're a Netscape user I recommend you don't download
Microsoft Internet Explorer. I did, and it converted all my
Netscape bookmarks into Microsoft Internet Shorcuts--without
asking me. It took me ages to convert them back.
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC
(picking up -6 tail kit this weekend--I hope)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . ..Yeahbut.....] |
<< I know for a fact if the trim were all the way to one extreme you
would have a hell of a time bringing the airplane back in one piece. I would
consider this a saftey of flight item. >>
You should be able to control the a/c at the extremes of trim, otherwise you
have too much trim authority and this should be corrected. That is the
proper way to deal with this issue IMO.
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitch Faatz <mfaatz(at)sagenttech.com> |
| Subject: | standard vs. quick build |
>
>Do any of you have any input on the quick build kits? I am one
to value
>opportunity cost, and would not mind paying the additional
$8000, but I
>would also like to complete the kit by myself. Any input?
I wouldn't worry about "not getting the full building experience"
if you get the quickbuild. There is still more work than you can
possibly imagine (not to scare anybody off). I think the best
approach is building the tailkit to see how you like it (and
learning everything you need to know) and *then* plunk down
the big bucks for the QB. I did it this way, and I was real happy
I had done the tail before cutting into the fuselage skins, etc.
Mitch Faatz San Jose, CA N727MF (reserved)
RV-6AQME working on the sliding canopy...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass gear fairings |
> All,
> Anyone who has built their own fiberglass gear leg fairings, or metal for
> that matter, and then looks at the composite ones Mark Frederick offers for
> the Harmon Rockets will buy his fairings.
I just finished building my two-piece metal fairings and am in the
process of fitting the wheel pants. I am kind of reluctant to change at
this point, but I figure if I'm going to then I'd better do so before I
get into all the intersection fairing work. I am agonizing a bit over
whether to make this change. Can I hear a little more about these
fairings? Are they that much better? Do they attach the same way or
are they bonded on? Will they fit the same over my painstakingly
crafted wooden gear leg stiffeners?
I'm not that concerned about the cosmetic aspect, but if there's a
reasonable performance gain to be had, I may reconsider.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: heated pitot tubes |
> I'm in the market for a heated pitot tube for an RV-6. Does anyone
> have experiance with the procurement/installation/operation of this
> device on an RV?
I bought a used Piper Blade type from J.T Evans 1-800-421-1729. Also,
look in the yeller pages for someone who has a mounting kit. I did mine
before he developed it and it really wasn't all that hard but a kit may be
easier.
Ross Mickey
6A-Canopy frame
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Acker" <r.acker(at)thegrid.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RMI Engine Momitor |
>
> Does anyone have any experience with the Rocky Mountain Instrument's
> uMonitor? I've read about it on their website and it seems like a good
> instrument with a lot of functions at about 1/3 the cost of Vison
> Microsystem's instrument.
Jim,
There's a ton of information about the various electronic engine monitors
in the RV-archives, including a general comparison I did. Also, be aware
that the Vision comes with all necessary sensors, the RMI device does not
(which means the price is more like 1/2, not 1/3). Both very nice
instruments IMHO (flown with a vision, but not the RMI).
Regards,
Rob (Allegro M816 engine monitor).
Rancho Santa Margarita, California
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Ammeter <ammeterj(at)seanet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Prop Extensions |
>
>I have an O-320 with bushings in the flange of the shaft for 3/8" prop
>bolts. I understand that the 2 1/4" prop extension requires 7/16 prop
>bolts. I must convert the flange bushings from 3/8" to 7/16".
>
>1. How to I change the bushings?
You can pull the bushings out by using a socket and a 3/8" bolt. Put the
socket in back of the bushing and wrench away on the bolt. The bushing will
come out easily.
You can pull the new ones in the same way.
>2. Where can I get the 7/16" bushings?
I purchased used bushing for about $100 from a salvage outfit. New, they
cost about $30 each.
>3. How much will they cost?
See above.
>4. Are there any alternatives that would allow me to use the 3/8" bushings
>that are already installed?
Not that I know of.
>
>Thanks for the help.
>
>Bob Cabe
>RV-6
>San Antonio
>
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
Seattle WA USA
RV-6 N16JA
First flight August 1990
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne) |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . |
Navaid autopilots are not recommended by the vendor for use in IFR.
I was wondering if they would be legal - that is if the turn coordinator would
be acceptable for the IFR requirement? Would it be necessary to add a standard
TC or T&B?
John wrote:
> Along the same lines, I was planning to install a navaid autopilot in my
> plane but am having 2nd thoughts. If the autopilot were to "wig out" while
> cruising 50mph above manuevering speed, It might make an awful mess before
> I can recover. I wouldn't even want to think about such an event occuring
> in IMC.
Hal Kempthorne RV-6AQ -- WANTED TO BUY - a used Chevy V-6 setup.
halk(at)sybase.com Santa Clara, CA. Debonair N6134V @ SJC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brian Huffaker <huffaker(at)utw.com> |
| Subject: | Re: operational speeds |
On Thu, 23 Oct 1997 rkymtnhi.com!winterland(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
> Two quick questions for those with more RV time than my initial 20
> hours.
Have 0 RV time, but think I know the second question.
> Second, regarding Vans Vne of 210 mph. should I regard this as true or
> indicated airspeed. In other words, at my normal flying altitudes of
> 11,000 - 12,000' (high country of Colorado), approximately 180 mph
> indictated equates to 210 true. At this altitude, should I consider the
> 180 indicated as my actual Vne?
Vne (and other V speeds) are always indicated airspeeds. The indicated
speed is a measure of the force the air is putting on the plane, and so
aircraft behavior will vary much less with indicated speed than true
speed. As an example, the indicated stall speed will vary little with
altitude, but the true stall speed changes alot.
Brian Huffaker, DSWL (huffaker(at)utw.com)
President and Founder Friends of P-Chan
RV-8 80091 Deburring top wings skins (first wing)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Denny Harjehausen <harje(at)proaxis.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RMI Engine Momitor |
>
>Does anyone have any experience with the Rocky Mountain Instrument's
>uMonitor? I've read about it on their website and it seems like a good
>instrument with a lot of functions at about 1/3 the cost of Vison
>Microsystem's instrument.
>
I asked the same question. I got a lot of encouragement and positive
comments on both units as to useablity. I just finished the Encoder and am
just about finished with the Monitor. As I was told, anyone can assemble
them. And feel now that I qualify to be "Anyone". My first ever
electronics soldering.
Have a good one.
Denny RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | aol.com!KenHeld(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: New RV Buyer |
Paul,
Hi my name is Ken I live in Chandler. After seeing the RV-6 at Copperstate
last week, I've got to have one. I'm also looking at the Quickbuild Kit
option. I ordered the info pack/ video yesterday and will start looking for
hanger space next week. ( I can't see building the plane without a hanger at
CHD to keep it after it's done.) All thats left is to convince myself that I
can tackle such a large project. How much time do you think it will take to
complete your project? Have you looked into the prefab instrument panels? Do
you have any experience with metalworking? I'd be interested in see your kit
when you get it. Keep me posted.
Ken Held
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | "Doug Rozendaal" <netins.net!dougr(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
charset="iso-8859-1"
>Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
>growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
Download IE 4.0 with Outlook Express mail. Then you can click on the
www.???? address right from the mail program. If you like what you see you
can save it right to your RV folder on your favorites (bookmark) lists. I
have not seen the latest version of Netscape, but I think IE is great!
Some other things that are neat. In Outlook Express you can use inbox
assistant to send all of your RV-list msgs to your RV-list folder. This way
you can read your RV mail when you have time and deal with the other stuff
imeadiately ( or you can ignore your work related mail and read the RV list
first). You can also ckick on the subject header and have your mail
imeadiately sorted by the subject (thread). I think Microsoft has really
hit the nail with IE 4.0 and Outlook Express.
Tailwinds, N240 the pink panther
Doug Rozendaal
dougr(at)petroblend.com
www.petroblend.com/dougr
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Will Cretsinger <cretsinger(at)startext.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RMI Engine Momitor |
Jim Moore wrote:
>
>
> Does anyone have any experience with the Rocky Mountain Instrument's
> uMonitor? I've read about it on their website and it seems like a good
> instrument with a lot of functions at about 1/3 the cost of Vison
> Microsystem's instrument.
Have you looked at the Engine Information System (EIS) from Grand Rapids
for a lot less cost that RMI??? Looks good to me...
Will Cretsinger Arlington, Tx -6A Finish kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "les williams" <lesliebwilliams(at)classic.msn.com> |
Bob, I sent this once already but you must have missed it. If you don't know,
maybe someone else on the list does? Thanks.
Les Williams/RV-6AQ/Tacoma WA
----------
Sent: Sunday, October 19, 1997 11:01 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: Wire specs
Bob, is the insulation (crosslinked extruded polyalkene) on the AWG #2
M81044/9 surplus wire that you sell closely related to TFE (teflon)?
>
>Hello all:
>I am about to finish up the wiring for my left wing and have questions.
>
>Is it acceptable to use non-milspec wire for things like, landing
>lights, heated pitot tube, etc.?
>
>Thanks
>--
>Rick and Barbara Osgood
Why not use mil-spec? It doesn't take much and it's easy to get.
Mil-W-22759/16 wire is the wire of choice and sold by the foot
by Aircraft Spruce et. als. If you've got an avionics shop or
FBO with a good repair shop nearby, they may sell you short pieces
of the fatter wires for landing lights and pitot heat.
The problem with most other wires is their insulation. If not a
close cousin to teflon (22759 is Tefzel), the insulation gets
brittle with age and WILL be a problem at some time in the future.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: heated pitot tubes |
> I'm in the market for a heated pitot tube for an RV-6. Does anyone
> have experiance with the procurement/installation/operation of this
> device on an RV?
>
> Thank you,
>
> Dave Jones
> Erie, Pa.
> left wing
Warren Gretz (see the Yeller Pages 303-770-3811) makes a GREAT
mounting kit (no, I'm not in business with him) for a heated pitot or
pitot/static tube. I bought Warren's chrome plated mounting kit and
found it to be of high quality and easy to install. It was about the
only part of my kit that didn't take 3 times as long as I thought it
should... very well thought out and straight forward to install.
Warren exemplifies customer service. Give him a call.
Tim Lewis
Packing plane for move to D.C., then it's engine/gear mounting time.
------------------------------------
Tim Lewis
N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023
San Antonio TX
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or
timrv6a(at)iname.com
------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | claris.com!mauser(at)matronics.com (Richard Chandler) |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . . .Yeahbut.....] |
> Certainly a motor could overheat, and a breaker might be useful there.
>
> However, if a flap motor or landing light is truly a flight
> critical system, then you had better have two of them, on
> completely separate circuits. Otherwise, what do you do if the motor
> or light fails?
Sometimes redundant systems cause more problems then they solve. (e.g. higher
accident rate with twins). And sometimes you just can't have a redundant
system (dual tails on an RV?)
> I suspect that most of us could land without flaps, so I wouldn't call
> a flap motor a critical system. Also, any of us that only have
> one landing light, or two lights but on the same circuit, had
> better practice lights out landings once in a while. Its not hard on
> a lighted runway (at least with a tricycle gear).
Maybe not on an RV, but some aircraft have a lot of trouble doing a go-around
with the flaps down.
--
Richard Chandler
RV-6: Garage bought and being finished, saving for tools and tail kit.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-LIST - LOW FUEL PRESSURE |
<344EA3A7.2714(at)worldnet.att.net>
| From: | gasobek(at)juno.com (Gary A. Sobek) |
Craig:
It was suggested to drill the hole in the back from one of my fellow Tech
Counselors. He presently flies an Europa and had previously built a Long
Easy. He has more experience than me and it sounded good so I did it.
Most of the FAST RV like Dave Anders and Tracy Sailor both have flush
vents.
I had been climbing at full power with no boost pump on. This will give
me low fuel pressure. Lycoming recommends climbing with the boost pump
on unless airframe manufacturer recommends other wise. My operating
procedures have been revised to reflect this.
Gary A. Sobek
N157GS, RV-6 O-320 CS
Cable Airport, Upland, California USA
writes:
>
>
>> I have an approximate 2" 90 degree pitot tube shaped vent on both
>tanks.
>> The end toward the direction of flight is flared. There is a #50
>drill
>> hole in the back side incase of bugs. Fuel tanks were FULL. Fuel
>flow
>
>
>Drilling the back side of thr vent tube is something I have never
>encounterd before,is this a common practice? Sounds like a
>great idea to me.
>
>Is this list great or what!
>
>Craig Hiers
>RV-4 N143CH
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Full Trim Travel was Re: The great breaker debate |
64,66-69
| From: | gasobek(at)juno.com (Gary A. Sobek) |
On a solo flight, I usually land with FULL flaps and the trim tab is
ALMOST FULL nose up just to remove the control pressure. I have MANUAL
aileron trim, MANUAL elevator trim and MANUAL flaps. The bad thing about
the manual flaps is: Do not attempt to put in the final notch until
below 65 Kts. They go down at 70 but it is not worth the extra effort.
I have also done a go around with full flaps on my first flight. I was
not climbing as fast as I should because of the full flaps. I forgot to
put them up. When I reached 200 AGL, I retracted all the flaps at once.
I was climbing faster with full flaps than a Cessna 152 does under
perfect conditions. The RV-6 flys very well with full flaps up to 100
mph (87 Kts). I have not tried flying with full nose down trim but one
friend with a -4 has and said it can be done. He has the electric
elevator trim and did this as a failure mode test.
If failure mode analysis is done as Bob suggests, there will be a
procedure to cope with any failure. I have a basic IFR -6 and have
nothing electric in it that I cannot live without. Need to get the DAR
back out and pay the $75 fee to have operating limitations ammended for
IFR. He knew I wanted IFR when the original operating limitations were
issued. He would not issue IFR until after test flying was complete.
Gary A. Sobek
Electrical AeroSPACE Systems Engineer
FAA A & P
EAA Tech Counselor
RV-6 N157GS O-320 CS
>Hi Ryan,
>you said: I know for a fact if the trim were all the way to one extreme
you
>>would have a hell of a time bringing the airplane back in one piece. I
would
>>consider this a saftey of flight item.
>
>I have no desire to have a trim or flap motor cause troubles in the air.
>Odds are against it but it only takes once. Will be going with all
>manual controls.
>If you want the best of safety with electric trim motors, do like the RJ
50
>seat jet flown by COMAIR. They have a system , with a flip of a switch,
>which allows the left seat stick to control the levt elevator and the
right
>to control the right. just a thought.
>
>Bruce Knoll
>RV6A empennage ordered
>
>>
>>Bob,
>> I tried sending this once before, but got no mail for 3 days and never
saw
>>it when I started receiving it again. I am one of many who have
electric
>>elevator trim. If you have a stuck switch or relay, in other words a
runaway
>>trim. I for one would like to be able to reach over and pull the
breaker
>>before the situation becomes critical. Now I suppose I could wire in a
>>cuttout switch if I wanted to, but that would fall under complicating
the
>>system. I know for a fact if the trim were all the way to one extreme
you
>>would have a hell of a time bringing the airplane back in one piece.
>I would consider this a saftey of flight item.
>> Ryan RV4131RB
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | "Anderson Ed" <bah.com!AndersonE(at)matronics.com> |
Thanks Dave
I was on the verge of ordering his prop spinner and gear covers, have talked
to him several times and never quite got the impression of any real interest
in my order - so I procrastinated in sending in the check. Based on your
experience, I will look elsewhere or build them myself.
Thanks
Ed
----------
From: Dave Barnhart
Subject: RV-List: Jerry Harrold
Date: Wednesday, October 22, 1997 8:43PM
I've been holding off writing this for some time, but no more. Last week I
posted my good experiences with Lycon. Today, I'm posting my BAD
experience with Jerry Harrold.
Jerry has a reputation for making very high guality fiberglass parts. He
also has a reputation for being VERY SLOW to deliver.
I ordered a set of gear leg fairings (and sent him a check) on May 18, 1996
(That's right: 1996). I still don't have them. I have called Jerry
monthly for the past year with no results. Since July, I've been telling
him that I just want my money back. Still no results.
I'll be surprised if I EVER see my fairings or my money.
A word to the wise.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB
|
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joe Rex" <jfr(at)ix.netcom.com> |
,
| Subject: | Re: Shipping via AIRBORNE |
----------
> From: scott <mwt.net!acepilot(at)matronics.com>
> To:
> Cc: rv-list(at)matronics.com; Joe Belany, KB9IQR ;
simpsond(at)win.bright.net; brihal(at)execpc.com
> Subject: RV-List: Shipping via AIRBORNE
> Date: Tuesday, October 21, 1997 11:03 AM
>Scott,
Thanks for the compliment. As an RV builder/UPS Driver I can speak as one
who both orders and delivers parts. We aren't perfect, but I can tell you
this; in the 23 years that I have worked for UPS I have seen our company go
to extraordinary measures to see that a package is delivered on time.
Except for that unfortunate 3 weeks in August, we have been providing that
excellent service for 90 years. The only bad thing that I can say about
UPS is that all that overtimg that helps me afford airplane parts gives me
less time to work on the airplane. Kind of a "Catch 22" huh?
Joe Rex
> ...LONG LIVE UPS, they get the job done!
> Scott, N4181E
>
> --
> Gotta Fly or
> Gonna Die !
> --Ask me about my
> Aeronca Super Chief--
>
> amended 8-29-97: Now after feeling the "Need for Speed", building an
> RV-4!
> No, the Super Chief is NOT for sale :)
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Painting |
<<
I have seen a couple of people inquiring about aircraft
painting. John Rogers is the gentleman that is respon-
sible for designing and painting a few of the Skystar
aircraft (Kitfoxs). He just opened a new paint shop in
Homedale Id. at the airport. Phone-(208)337-5506.
Business is called AeroColor----This guy is great.
Regards---Mike Comeaux
He did my last airplane and it sure got a lot of looks. >>
Good to have a recommendation, but care to share the price?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Electric Trim Runaway |
Bob described two unhappy events: runaway trim, and runaway
autopilot. Here are my solutions, for what they're worth:
My RV-6 (panel finished, not flying yet) has electric trim, actuated
via a MAC G-9 stick grip. I've experimented with physically holding
down one trim button (simulating broken-closed switch). When I hit
the opposite direction trim switch the trim stops moving (I'm 99%
sure this is correct... I removed the tail in preparation for
shipping, and can't run out and test it again right now).
If one trim button fails (contacts closed) my normal reaction would
be to apply stick pressure and hit the other trim button. That
would stop the uncommanded trim tab movement. The trim tab wouldn't
move as long as I continued to hold the "opposite" trim button down.
The fact that my trim input had no impact on control pressure would
be my clue that the trim system was messed up, and I could then pull
the trim breaker to shut the system down. Then I would release the
"opposite" trim button.
I think I like Bob's button + coolie hat approach better. With Bob's
concept one just releases the "second" switch and the whole sytem
shuts down. Elegant.
Runaway autopilot: I'm using a Navaid devices autopilot. One of the
preflight actions is to ensure that the clutch is adjusted so that I
can overpower the servo. In addition, I've added a button on my
MAC-9 grip that controls a relay between the autopilot "brain" and
servo. With a press of the button I can kill the power to the servo,
then relax and turn off the autopilot switch (or pull the breaker).
A neat side effect of this arrangement is that I can temporarily
disable the servo in order to drop a wing if I'm scanning for
landmarks. As soon as I release the button the autopilot resumes its
duties without having to be reset.
Tim
------------------------------------
Tim Lewis
N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023
San Antonio TX
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or
timrv6a(at)iname.com
------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: the trouble with media . . . |
Sorry to take so long to get back to you . . . had a real flood
of busy-work . ..
>I think now I understand have a better understanding of your mission.
>Your's is much more narrowly focused than mine. I am not a builder, I never
>will be, I have neither the time nor the talent to undertake such a project.
>However I am deeply committed to all aspects of aviation including building.
>However, the Cessnas and the Raytheon's of the world play a just as
>important role.
They do now, but have you noticed? GA fleet is down by about 50,000
airplanes
in 10 years . . . 5,000 per year. Is the effort in Independence, KS going
to reverse or even slow that decline? I suspect not.
>I appreciate your "purest" view, and offer this comparison. Several years
>ago there was an Antique Flyin at Ottumwa Iowa. It was hosted by a guy
>named Taylor. It enjoyed some success. An air guard pilot from Wisconsin
>with a funny name was a regular attender. I don't know all the details but
>suffice it to say that air guard pilot took some ideas home and started
>something.
>If you go to Blakesburg Iowa on Labor Day weekend you will find the purest
>form of antique aviation on earth. Tricycle gear airplanes are allowed but
>not appreciated. Wheel landings are really frowned upon and you will see
>more "one of" fly, real antiques, OX-5 and all, than you ever will at Osh
>Kosh. It is like heaven on earth. No Blow up airplanes, No one selling
>water bottles on a string or Helicopter kites.
>There is everything anyone might ever want there except people. Maybe they
>will have 1500 or 2000 people there. They come from all over the country,
>but they are all pilots and already new about it. The Taylors have avoided
>all attempt towards commercialization and Robert Taylor states proudly that
>"Blakesburg is the anti-thesis of Osh Kosh." More power to Mr Taylor, but I
>am afraid that Mr Poberezny has attracted many orders of magnitude more
>people in to aviation than Taylor.
I'm not sure that's true but I cannot prove it. But consider this.
Of all the best engineers I have working with me at Raytheon, two
have degrees in engineering and they finished those AFTER they came
to work for us. I don't have a degree in anything. My best software
guy has a degree in chemical engineering. Our best electro-wienie has
a degree in photography!
I heard a thesis brought forward on the radio a few days ago that
zoos and botanicals are failing miserably in their goals to educate
and motivate people toward conservation . . . instead of teaching people
the joys of viewing nature in the wild, they seem instead to foster yet
more urges to put nature on display in cages and inner-city gardens.
It's these kinds of observations that make me wonder how many people
who walk through the gates at OSH are really motivated to become active
aviation participants in aviation at some later date? To be sure, from
the shear masses who attend every year, there are a lot but is the rate
of return on investment really there? We'll never really know any more
than we can demonstrate that the department of Health, Education and
Welfare ever improved the status of a single human being.
Something I do have confidence in is one-on-one contact with people
who show an interest. I think some people call it mentorship. It seems
like a waste of resources because you're concentrating on so very few
but you can certainly observe and record the results . . .
>I will rephrase only one comment from my previous post to clarify the
>difference in our objectives. I don't care if people want to fly Lear Jets,
>Spam Cans, Ultra-lites or homebuilts, I want to get more people in all
>aspects of aviation, that includes the corporate types. I want companies to
>use airplanes to promote their products like they do on race cars. I want
>people to percieve that aviation is more normal than driving. (It is you
>know, name an animal with wheels) . . .
That's a good one . . . I'll try to remember that!
> . . . . I still long for the Popular Science
>plan of an aircraft in every garage. I think someone will win the X-prize.
>I think in my lifetime I will be able to buy a ticket on a spaceship.
If it happens, it won't be from the efforts of C,B,P or M under the
tutilage of the FAA.
>Home building is only a small part of that vision and impatient people with
>limited time will not come to the airport for a seminar on rolling aluminum
>or pounding rivits. To accomplish my mission we need to be adding tens of
>thousands of pilots to the pilot roles. We need to make Planes more user
>friendly and that is starting to happen. (Look at the Cirrus SR-20)
An look at who developed it . . .
>The only way that I see to do that is to embrace the billions that the
>corporate world spends on Football and Golf etc. What do you think would
>happen to aviation, if you woke up monday and read that Nike had signed a
>$20 million contract with Sean Tucker to promote Tennis Shoes? You don't
>think kids would start getting interested in aviation. You would not be
>able to build airplane parts fast enough.
Hmmm . . .I'll have to think about that. I've got a teenager who spends
a LOT of time under his truck . . . he's motivated enough to spend the
time and effort when it comes to his basic needs . . and he does have
a fondness for cheap Chinese tennis shoes at $100/pair but when I offered
to pay for his flying lessons in the Beech flying club, he demured when
he browsed through the stack of books . . .
Do you thing there is a future for $150,000+ personally owned airplanes?
>I understand you purest point of view and there is a side of me that wishes
>that was the way the world worked. Unfortunately I have seen nothing that
>will convince me that we can sell aviation with out the T-shirts funny hats
>and helicopter kites.
A friend of mine made an interesting observation a few weeks ago. He
says we owe the Wright brothers a real debt of gratitude. I agreed but
I wasn't sure why he'd brought it up. He went on to explain that when
they beat Langley to the punch, it was demonstrated for all time that
ordinary
private citizens could take on a task an succeed even when a government
backed military organization lacked the vision and investment to
bring an idea to fruition. Had Langley been first, the government would
have put a regulatory lid on it (in the intereset of national security)
before private citizens could duplicate the work. The Wright brothers
were initial suppliers of technology to the military and set an
important
precedent. Amateur aviation showed us how to do it at the beginning and
I think we may have to depend on it to show us how to save it. Regulation
and corporate lethargy are killing GA as we've known if for 50 years.
>My wife's biggest complaint about airshows is that they are to boring, not
>enough excitement or action..... Those are the people we have got to figure
>out a way to sell.
>Many apoligies for the 2 long posts. I have stated my point and I will
>stop. I promise.
No, please don't! There's value in the exchange of views and ideas.
From inside the industry, I have a decidedly different viewpoint of
aviation's future. I must admit that right now, I don't put much
stock in the traditional sources of little airplanes filling the
gap between flight training and Kingairs. Independence KS is the
Jurasic Park of aviation . . . they're cloning dinosaurs in the
form of brand new, 40-year old airplanes . . . oh yes, they've
tinkered, prodded and put on new paint stripes but I was working
for them in 1965 when we were doing EXACTLY the same thing on
the almost EXACTLY the same airplanes . . . how much have cars
changed in 32 years?
If one wants value and modern technology in an airplane, he'll have
to build it. Aviation under the umbrella of TC/STC/PMA is dying
and I don't see needed changes coming from Washington -or- Wichita.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Benedict <billb(at)atheria.europa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass gear fairings |
>
>
>All,
>Anyone who has built their own fiberglass gear leg fairings, or metal for
>that matter, and then looks at the composite ones Mark Frederick offers for
>the Harmon Rockets will buy his fairings. I will use them on my second -6
>and wish I used them on my first. At the Kerville fly in last week my wife
>pointed out the kinked, one piece, metal fairings on the yellow RV-8
>prototype and said "I hope OUR new plane doesn't look like that!" Talk
>about pressure to do good work! Why did Vans use one piece metal fairings
>on the gear legs?
>Rick
Rick, I can answer that question. The plane is testing two different types
of gear leg fairings. With the new flat bar gear, Van did not know how
much they would flex and whether it would be stiff enough for an aluminum
fairing. Obviously, it flexes enough that the single piece fairing will
not work. The other gear leg fairing is made of fiberglass. It is also a
single piece but must flex enough with the leg. I do not know what type of
fairing Van will provide with the kit, but I can tell you one type of
fairing he will NOT provide! Bill
Bill
RV-4-180 flying. N894RV with over 400 hours behind a O-320, Over 1000 RV
flying hours.
These opinions are mine and do not necessarily represent the opinions or
position of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | juno.com!cecilth(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: fuselage skins |
Hi Chris,
I'm at exactly the same place you are. And I'm doing it the very easy
way.
I have the fuselage on a spit ( like bar-b-q style) I simply rotate it to
the exact position I need and just lean inside to do the work.
I use a one inch pipe flange (the flange you can bolt to the ceiling then
screw the pipe into) one at each end of the fuselage (well actually I use
two at the rear). At the front I weld an elbow in place to fashion the
handle.
I drilled a hole through the handle, then tru the plywood backboard in
several places to make it stay in any one position or it can free wheel
if needed.
Cecil Hatfield
Thousand Oaks, California
(Chris Brooks) writes:
>
>I'm looking for suggestions on back drilling the aft fuselage turtle
>deck skins. How have others done it? Did you have to crawl into the
>fuselage? and if so, how did you prevent bending the bulkhead webs and
>stringers? Right now I'm thinking I may have to throw some pillows in
>there and stuff my 12 year old in with a drill!
>
>Chris Brooks
> Murfreesboro,TN
>RV6, Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Gesele <scottg(at)icsnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RMI Engine Momitor |
>Does anyone have any experience with the Rocky Mountain Instrument's
>uMonitor? I've read about it on their website and it seems like a good
>instrument with a lot of functions at about 1/3 the cost of Vison
>Microsystem's instrument.
>
>Thanks,
>JP
>RV8,Co.
>
>
Jim,
I have one in my RV-6A and love it. The kit was easy to assemble. It is
very light and doesn't take up much panel space. The display is laid out
logically and is easy to interpret during flight. I really enjoy being able
to set the prop +/- 10 RPM and map +/- 0.1" Hg. Ok, I'm anal :)
Ron Mower from RMI is a great guy to work with. He stands by his product
and will openly admit and fix any known problems. His honestly and
commitment to customer service is second to none. I did something real
stupid during assembly and fried a few chips. It was all my fault, no ifs
ands or butts about it. The unit was shipped to RMI for diagnosis and
repair. They fixed it and paid for return shipping and didn't even send me
a bill.
I have no regrets by using this unit. Knowing what I know now, I would do
it all over again and would recommend this unit without hesitation. Can you
guess that I like it?
Let me know if you need any additional info.
Hope this helps.
Scott Gesele N506RV - Flying :))))
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Jerry Harrold |
<< Jerry has a reputation for making very high guality fiberglass parts. He
also has a reputation for being VERY SLOW to deliver. >>
Jerry is out of business! Van's will not deal with the guy anymore. I also
hear that he has had some problems with the tax-man so I doubt that you'll
every see your money, let alone your fairings.
Buy Mark's.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC - NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV- 6 Parts for sale |
| From: | daviddla(at)juno.com (Blah ba Blah) |
Dear listers; I saw and called on a RV-6 wing kit. In case anyone might
be interested,the ad reads RV6 wing and tail kits. Phlogiston
spar,tools,plans and videos.Tail 75% complete. Wings not started.
$4600.00 or trade for clean, late model mid-size motorcycle. (805)
569-5461 In talking to Norm I found out it is one of the last kits
before prepunched. He said the vertical and horz. stabs. are done,
elevators and wing untouched, rudder started. He lives in Santa
Barbara,Ca. This Ad is listed in the Pacific Flyer-Oct,97. I hope someone
can use this information. thanks, David Ahrens- working on tail and
wing kit due mid Nov.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Gesele <scottg(at)icsnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: operational speeds |
>Two quick questions for those with more RV time than my initial 20
>hours.
>
>First, what is the power off best glide speed in an RV, particularly an
>RV-6A? How would the actual glide angle at that speed compare to an
>engine off condition as compared to an engine at near idle?
>
I'm still trying to find this out myself.
>Second, regarding Vans Vne of 210 mph. should I regard this as true or
>indicated airspeed. In other words, at my normal flying altitudes of
>11,000 - 12,000' (high country of Colorado), approximately 180 mph
>indictated equates to 210 true. At this altitude, should I consider the
>180 indicated as my actual Vne?
All Vspeeds are traditionally given in Calibrated Airspeed (CAS). That is,
Indicated Airspeed (IAS) corrected for instrument errors. If you have
negligible instrument error, you should use 210 mph indicated as Vne
regardless of altitude or temp.
Hope this helps.
Scott Gesele N506RV - Flying :))
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Electric Trim Runaway |
<< Pulling a breaker on trim runaway is too time consuming and there's
a lot of window for error. If your trim breaker is located in a whole
nest of other breakers, the possiblity of pulling the wrong one in
time of "tense pilot response" is great. Pulling the wrong one may
no have electrical consequences for flight for inadvertently shutting
down another system but it adds still more delays in perception and
resolution of multiple problems . . . all design and/or pilot induced.
In any case, pulling the breaker is far more time consuming than some
alternatives. During trim runaway, time is of the essence. The longer
you delay in effecting shutdown, the further out-of-trim the airplane
is going to be when the motor stops running . . . we need to shave
tens of milliseconds off of the perception-reaction-action time needed
to bring things under control.
>>
Bob,
Come on now. Its time to give a little. The breaker for your electric trim
need not be mounted amongst all the others. One could easily be mounted it in
a handy location and even color coded if necessary. You are correct time is
of the essence, it doesent matter weather your flipping a switch or pulling a
breaker. The key is to identify and react. In other words you must always be
mentally prepared. I try to stay on my toe's and remember this especially
when it comes to my trim system. On two occasions I had the edge of my
sectional accidentally hit the cooly hat and begin driving my trim downward.
My first thought both times was to go for the breaker, however as soon as I
pulled my hand from under the sectional it stopped. whew releif ! It does get
your attention real quick. Keep pounding away Bob! I value your opinion, you
put out some great stuff but I think I like this one the way I did it.
Ryan RV4131RB
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <earthlink.net!timrv6a(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Jerry Harrold |
> Today, I'm posting my BAD
> experience with Jerry Harrold.
>
> Jerry has a reputation for making very high guality fiberglass parts. He
> also has a reputation for being VERY SLOW to deliver.
>
> I ordered a set of gear leg fairings (and sent him a check) on May 18, 1996
> (That's right: 1996). I still don't have them. I have called Jerry
> monthly for the past year with no results. Since July, I've been telling
> him that I just want my money back. Still no results.
>
Thanks for honestly sharing your experiences. I'm trying to decide
from whom to order a set of fairings. I think you've saved me a lot
of grief.
Tim
------------------------------------
Tim Lewis
N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023
San Antonio TX
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or
timrv6a(at)iname.com
------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: OOPS! Re: the trouble with media . . . |
Opps . . . sorry guys, I thought I was replying to Doug
directly . . . I didn't mean to dump that whole thing on
everybody!
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: operational speeds |
> ... At this altitude, should I consider the
> 180 indicated as my actual Vne?
>
Andy,
Vne and all the other V-speeds are based on the dynamic pressure of
the airflow and resulting aerodynamic forces. From a practical
standpoint this is your indicated airspeed (the difference between
pitot and static pressures), but for purists it is calibrated
airspeed (i.e. indicated corrected for pitot-static system errors).
If you've ever heard the term max-Q during a rocket launch, it's the
point of greatest dynamic pressure and is where the pressure buildup
from increasing speed is offset by the decrease in pressure due to
lowering air density with altitude. We get the same, albeit less
dramatic, effect of increasing true airspeed for the same dynamic
pressure as the altitude increases. Just think, the shuttle in orbit
has an indicated airspeed of zero;-)
Greg Young - gyoung@cs-sol.com
Citabria N90AV
RV-6 s/n 23070 - skinning fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | Tedd McHenry <idacom.hp.com!tedd(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
John:
John Kitz writes:
>
> Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
> growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
It's hard to answer your question without knowing what platform
and browser you're using (though you did mention Netscape). But
here are some possibilities.
(1) If you use your browser to read your email, the browser will
automatically convert the URL for the web page into a link. For
example, if someone writes "see my home page at
http://www.somewhere.com/" the 'http://www.somewhere.com/' part of
the message will become an active link to the web site. You can
just select it, jump to the site, and then select "Add to Bookmarks"
from the Bookmarks menu.
(2) Cut and past. Most platforms (Mac, Unix, or--ugh--Windows NT/95)
support cutting and pasting in one form or another. You can highlight
the text in the email, copy it, then paste it into the Location field
on your browser (the place you would normally type it).
(3) If you're on Unix (yeah), you can use a nifty program called
Hypermail to convert your email inbasket to a web page on your own
computer. You can then view the web page, sorted either by thread,
subject, date, or author. URLs (web addresses) that people put in
their messages automatically become links (as in #1, above).
I use Hypermail on unix, together with a mail filter called Procmail.
Together, they automatically send my RV List messages into a special
file, and turn the file into an organized web site that I read with
Netscape. This is _much_ better than sorting through the messages
with an email program.
I haven't used some of the more sophisticated email programs, such as
Eudora or CC:Mail. I think some of them combine email and browser
capabilities. You might want to investigate them.
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC
(picking up the -6 empennage kit this weekend, I hope)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert G. Miller, Jr." <rgmiller(at)sprintmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: PVC for compressed air |
I have used pvc for air lines for quite some time without an explosion
problem. However, I do recall an article in a woodworking magazine
warning against the dangers of pvc. As I recall an explosion occurred
in the magazine's workshop seriously injuring an employee. As with
everything, I guess you get what you pay for.
No one has mentioned a sagging problem. Down here it gets quite warm.
During the nine months of summer, the pvc saggs between straps and traps
water---only to blow out at the most inconvenient times. (Like when
spraying paint.) Eventually, I solved the problem by supporting the
entire legnth of pvc on a narrow wooden shelf.
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | Craig Hiers <worldnet.att.net!craig-RV4(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-LIST - LOW FUEL PRESSURE |
> I have an approximate 2" 90 degree pitot tube shaped vent on both tanks.
> The end toward the direction of flight is flared. There is a #50 drill
> hole in the back side incase of bugs. Fuel tanks were FULL. Fuel flow
Drilling the back side of thr vent tube is something I have never
encounterd before,is this a common practice? Sounds like a
great idea to me.
Is this list great or what!
Craig Hiers
RV-4 N143CH
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | aol.com!Mlfred(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: Jerry Harrold |
<< Jerry has a reputation for making very high guality fiberglass parts. He
also has a reputation for being VERY SLOW to deliver.
I ordered a set of gear leg fairings (and sent him a check) on May 18, 1996
(That's right: 1996). I still don't have them. I have called Jerry
monthly for the past year with no results. Since July, I've been telling
him that I just want my money back. Still no results.
I'll be surprised if I EVER see my fairings or my money.
A word to the wise.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB
>>
Dave:
I'll echo what you have said. Try talking to the Mrs.- she might be able to
get you what you want.
I have gear leg covers in stock, ready to ship. How many sets ya want?
Check six!
Mark
HR2 186 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | Gil Alexander <flash.net!gila(at)matronics.com> |
>
>OK, I give up.
>How do you tighten the nuts on the VS rear spar/lower bolts where it mounts
>to the last bulkhead at the rear of the RV-6A??????
>
Royce,
.... I made up an internal 0.032 plate with floating nutplates on
it. There have been some reports of the single layer rear bulkhead of the
-6A being a little weak, and having failures/distortion at the tiedown
bracket attachment. This internal plate also acts as a doubler as well as
removing the need for finding a midget with triple jointed arms to tighten
the nuts ...:^) The plate can be inserted through the large hole under the
HS and thne moved aft into it's final position.
Not an original idea ... I've seen others built this way ... and
I'm sure I'll be much happier at final assembly time.
Gil (big hands) Alexander
>
>Royce Craven
-------------------------------------------------------
mailto:gila(at)flash.net
Gil Alexander,
Los Angeles, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| Subject: | Re: fuselage skins |
| From: | juno.com!wstucklen1(at)matronics.com (Frederic W Stucklen) |
Chris,
That's what I did! Now he's 18 and 6'2" and won't fit into the new
bird in the show. I'd suggest some planks on top of the stringers as it
makes it easier to the upper locations....
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
(Working on 2'd RV-6A - Chevy Powered!)
wstucklen1(at)juno.com
(Chris Brooks) writes:
>
>I'm looking for suggestions on back drilling the aft fuselage turtle
>deck skins. How have others done it? Did you have to crawl into the
>fuselage? and if so, how did you prevent bending the bulkhead webs and
>stringers? Right now I'm thinking I may have to throw some pillows in
>there and stuff my 12 year old in with a drill!
>
>Chris Brooks
> Murfreesboro,TN
>RV6, Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | Craig Hiers <worldnet.att.net!craig-RV4(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Countersinking |
Bob Skinner wrote:
>
>
> >If you want to have a polished finish on your RV4, take care with the
> >countersinking process. I have the one-hole piloted countersink from Avery
> >and have rings around several rivets where the burr gets dragged around
> >thereby ripping the Alclad from the skin. I now give a short burst (
> >electric drill here ) then lift the countersink to clear the burr with my
> >finger, then finish the countersinking process. That initial burr is a nasty
> >little chunk of aluminum.
> >
> >How have others dealt with this situation ?
>
> >Mark McGee
>
> Mark,
> We deal with the situation my dimpling. I think most of the "old hands"
> on the list would agree. Dimple whenever possible. Uniformity, when machine
> countersinking, is a problem. Also, I think machine countersunk rivets are
> more likely to work loose such as in the belly area. One common problem is
> that some builders countersink too deep which means the force of the set
> does not hit the rivet like it should.
> As far as polished aircraft. What's the term? Masochist? I visited with
> Mrs. Dave Anders at a fly-in while she was polishing one of the most
> beautiful RVs I've ever seen. She was grumbling and told me that the RV-4
> was scheduled for the paint shop. She'd had about all of the polishing she
> wanted.
>
> Bob Skinner RV-6 bskinr(at)trib.com
>
Bob is right, your rivets will look more uniformed and you will save
a lot of time by dimpling.
Also, you will not turn into the karate kid by putting on polish
and taking it off. I know someone with a Globe Swift who regrets
polished alu every day.
Craig Hiers
RV-4 N143CH
Tallahassee, FL.
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | onramp.net!charles(at)matronics.com (charles young) |
| Subject: | Re: Jerry Harrold |
It took me TWO years to get my parts and then only after a threatening
letter to turn him in for mail fraud!! Believe it or not!!
>
>I've been holding off writing this for some time, but no more. Last week I
>posted my good experiences with Lycon. Today, I'm posting my BAD
>experience with Jerry Harrold.
>
>Jerry has a reputation for making very high guality fiberglass parts. He
>also has a reputation for being VERY SLOW to deliver.
>
>I ordered a set of gear leg fairings (and sent him a check) on May 18, 1996
>(That's right: 1996). I still don't have them. I have called Jerry
>monthly for the past year with no results. Since July, I've been telling
>him that I just want my money back. Still no results.
>
>I'll be surprised if I EVER see my fairings or my money.
>
>A word to the wise.
>
>Best Regards,
>Dave Barnhart
>rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Patrick E. Kelley" <patk(at)mail.ic.net> |
| Subject: | Re: heated pitot tubes |
Dave Jones wrote:
>
> I'm in the market for a heated pitot tube for an RV-6. Does anyone
> have experiance with the procurement/installation/operation of this
> device on an RV?
Check out my pages at http://ic.net/~patk/rv6a.htm and you will find
info on both my ad-hoc approach and Warren Gretz' nice mounting kit
though the info is slightly dated. (Yes, Warren, I got your recent
flyer and will be updating my site soon.) Warren's address is there so
you can contact him for more info on his mount. Hope this helps.
PatK
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Full Trim Travel was Re: The great breaker debate |
<< Need to get the DAR
back out and pay the $75 fee to have operating limitations ammended for
IFR. He knew I wanted IFR when the original operating limitations were
issued. He would not issue IFR until after test flying was complete. >>
As a businessman, I'd say the IFR update should be free. He knew about it
beforehand.
Check six!
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ed Zercher <ez(at)sensenich.com> |
>I have an O-320 with bushings in the flange of the shaft for 3/8" prop
>bolts. I understand that the 2 1/4" prop extension requires 7/16 prop
>bolts. I must convert the flange bushings from 3/8" to 7/16".
Bob,
Our propellers are available in 3/8" or 7/16" diameter hardware for both =
the 2.25" and 4.00" extensions. We have found no reason to bother =
changing the engine flange bushings.
Ed Zercher
Sensenich Propeller Mfg. Co.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Electric Trim Runaway |
Bob described two unhappy events: runaway trim, and runaway
autopilot. Here are my solutions, for what they're worth:
My RV-6 (panel finished, not flying yet) has electric trim, actuated
via a MAC G-9 stick grip. I've experimented with physically holding
down one trim button (simulating broken-closed switch). When I hit
the opposite direction trim switch the trim stops moving (I'm 99%
sure this is correct... I removed the tail in preparation for
shipping, and can't run out and test it again right now).
If one trim button fails (contacts closed) my normal reaction would
be to apply stick pressure and hit the other trim button. That
would stop the uncommanded trim tab movement. The trim tab wouldn't
move as long as I continued to hold the "opposite" trim button down.
The fact that my trim input had no impact on control pressure would
be my clue that the trim system was messed up, and I could then pull
the trim breaker to shut the system down. Then I would release the
"opposite" trim button.
I think I like Bob's button + coolie hat approach better. With Bob's
concept one just releases the "second" switch and the whole sytem
shuts down. Elegant.
Runaway autopilot: I'm using a Navaid devices autopilot. One of the
preflight actions is to ensure that the clutch is adjusted so that I
can overpower the servo. In addition, I've added a button on my
MAC-9 grip that controls a relay between the autopilot "brain" and
servo. With a press of the button I can kill the power to the servo,
then relax and turn off the autopilot switch (or pull the breaker).
A neat side effect of this arrangement is that I can temporarily
disable the servo in order to drop a wing if I'm scanning for
landmarks. As soon as I release the button the autopilot resumes its
duties without having to be reset.
Tim
------------------------------------
Tim Lewis
N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023
San Antonio TX
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or
timrv6a(at)iname.com
------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: heated pitot tubes |
> I'm in the market for a heated pitot tube for an RV-6. Does anyone
> have experiance with the procurement/installation/operation of this
> device on an RV?
>
> Thank you,
>
> Dave Jones
> Erie, Pa.
> left wing
Warren Gretz (see the Yeller Pages 303-770-3811) makes a GREAT
mounting kit (no, I'm not in business with him) for a heated pitot or
pitot/static tube. I bought Warren's chrome plated mounting kit and
found it to be of high quality and easy to install. It was about the
only part of my kit that didn't take 3 times as long as I thought it
should... very well thought out and straight forward to install.
Warren exemplifies customer service. Give him a call.
Tim Lewis
Packing plane for move to D.C., then it's engine/gear mounting time.
------------------------------------
Tim Lewis
N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023
San Antonio TX
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or
timrv6a(at)iname.com
------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | Richard Casey <mail.firn.edu!caseyr(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
John Kitz wrote:
>
>
> Hello builders;
> As I read my 30 to 60 RV List messages every day, many messages list
> homepages that I would like to visit later, but to copy them down is a
> pain. Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
> growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
>
I'm assuming that you are using NetScape for both email and browsing.
If the posted homepage is actually a link (highlighted), you can click
on it to go there, add the bookmark (Ctrl-D, or Bookmark menu/Add
bookmark), switch back to email, and continue reading messages. If it
isn't a link, or if you don't want to wait for the page to display; you
can select the homepage reference by highlighting it with the mouse and
copying the text to the clipboard with the Copy command on the Edit menu
(or just type Ctrl-C). Then you can paste the text into your bookmark
file with the Paste command on the Edit menu (or type Ctrl-V). Just open
your bookmarks with a Ctrl-B from the Browser window (Bookmark menu, Go
to bookmarks); insert a new bookmark (Item menu, Insert bookmark); and
paste the text into the location field. You have a name and a
description available to you as well. This process is easier to do than
it is too describe, so don't let my long rambling directions throw you
off!!
Good luck!
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | aol.com!BobTrumpRV(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: Shipping via AIRBORNE |
<< Don't do it! I've been waiting for an inner tube for my Chief for 2
weeks. When calling the supplier, they told me it went out AIRBORNE the
day ordered. I called AIRBORNE with the tracking number and was told
they couldn't find the street address (NOT a Route & Box number!!) and
didn't bother to call to ask for direction. What an ideal way to run a
business...LONG LIVE UPS, they get the job done!
Scott, N4181E
>>
I had the same problem when ordering something from Chief. I told them never
to send me anything via Airborne again. In my experience, Airborne was
incompetent and inconsiderate.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <earthlink.net!timrv6a(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: fuselage skins |
> I'm looking for suggestions on back drilling the aft fuselage turtle
> deck skins. How have others done it? Did you have to crawl into the
> fuselage? and if so, how did you prevent bending the bulkhead webs and
> stringers? Right now I'm thinking I may have to throw some pillows in
> there and stuff my 12 year old in with a drill!
>
> Chris Brooks
Chris,
I put a 1x10 board in there and just laid down on that. I needed to
put a couple of notches near the aft end of the board so it wouldn't
bend the sides of an aft bulkhead. I know it looks scarry to do
this, but it worked for me (160 lbs).
Tim
------------------------------------
Tim Lewis
N47TD (reserved) RV-6AQ #60023
San Antonio TX
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net or
timrv6a(at)iname.com
------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | aol.com!AIRPLANEIT(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: Netscape bookmarks |
Hello builders;
As I read my 30 to 60 RV List messages every day, many messages list
homepages that I would like to visit later, but to copy them down is a
pain. Is there any way to make a posted homepage a bookmark under my
growing aviation list short of writing it down and entering it manually?
Thanks
John Kitz
N721JK
RV-4 176 hours
>>
Yes sir. I'm hoping you have Windows 95 cause here goes! (I've suffered the
same problem)
-First, highlight the URL of the web site
-Next, right click and and from the menu that pops up, select, "Copy"
-Then, go to your desktop, and right click again. On the menu that pops up,
select "New" and then, from that menu, select "Shortcut".
-A type of Wizard will pop up. WHere it asks the location of the target, you
paste the URL there (Make sure it includes the prefix http://......)
-Once the URL is in, press "Next"
-Now type in the name you want to give the shortcut "make it obvious"
-press "finish"
-Viola, you have an internet shortcut.
-Now just double click on it and you go directly to the site! (Assuming you
are connected to the internet)
Hope that does it! E-mail if you need
more help
-Nick Stolley
airplaneit(at)aol.com
Carl Goldberg Gentle Lady....Deceased
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ShelbyRV6A(at)aol.com |
I am storing my engine(lycoming IO-360).
What I have done so far is:
pulled plugs and cranked engine to get oil circulated throughout
sprayed LPS 3 in the cylinders
filled with oil - 16 quarts so far. objective is to cover cam in oil(using
shell 15-50)
replaced top spark plugs with dehydrator plugs.
My questions are:
Should I remove any of the accessories - Mags, Vacuum pump?
Is it okay to store horizontally(currently hang from a hoist? I am
considering a stand where it would be mounted on the crankshaft upright with
the accessory case up.
Thanks in advance.
Shelby in Nashville.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gretz, Warren" <GretzW(at)tcplink.nrel.gov> |
| Subject: | Electric trim, Alternative placement |
I have been looking at placing my electric elevator trim servo in a
location other than in the left elevator. I have the manual trim
cable, have it routed and installed, but now think a better
solution
is to use the electric trim. I think it would be easier to install
the
servo now that the elevator is completed and on the plane by using
a
short push/pull control cable, from the trim tab, and run the cable
forward to just inside the fuselage where the trim servo could be
placed.
I do not want to cut up my new manual trim control cable, but would
rather find a short one to use. Has anyone else done this. What
cable
did you use and where did you get it? Also, how did you make the
connection from the short cable to the servo? Where did you place
your
servo inside the fuselage? Or did you place it in the area under
the
horizontal stabalizer/vertical stabalizer fairing?
Warren Gretz RV-6
gretzw(at)tcplink.nrel.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Nuckolls <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Trim Runaway . . . |
>I have done multiple takeoffs with the trim in the full nose up position
>(left over from the previous touch and go)and although the stick pressures
>are a little stiff, there isn't a problem flying the plane in that
>configuration. . . . . . .
> . . . . . My plane is very capable of
>flying with full up trim, with me forceably pushing the stick forward to
>get an adequate cruise to the closest field where I would land without
>problems.
>
>I am not saying that a trim runaway would not be a problem, I was taking
>issue with the fact that it would be difficult to land safely in one of
>these conditions. . . .
I am pleased that you have taken the time and trouble to explore
the corners of the envelope on your own terms. You have a distinct
advantage over many other pilots (1) you've acquired some knowlege
as to the boundries on problems you may be presented with in the
future (2) you have "flown" the airplane and convinced yourself
that pilot workload in any possible situation is reasonable and
(3) should the worst happen, it isn't a total surprise for which you
have no previously considered response. Plan B for that situation is
alive and well in your cockpit.
Would that all spam can pilots know their airplanes so well. Somebody
made a statement that their particular aircraft's out of trim limts
were no worse than a 172 and no big deal . . Hmmmm . . . There are
three models of 172 on the field where I fly most often . . . got
to fly Young Eagles out there next Sat . . . I think I'm going to
spend a few minutes in each of those airplanes and see if my own
calibration agrees with the statement.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | aol.com!RV4131rb(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . ..Yeahbut.....] |
Bob,
I tried sending this once before, but got no mail for 3 days and never saw
it when I started receiving it again. I am one of many who have electric
elevator trim. If you have a stuck switch or relay, in other words a runaway
trim. I for one would like to be able to reach over and pull the breaker
before the situation becomes critical. Now I suppose I could wire in a
cuttout switch if I wanted to, but that would fall under complicating the
system. I know for a fact if the trim were all the way to one extreme you
would have a hell of a time bringing the airplane back in one piece. I would
consider this a saftey of flight item.
Ryan RV4131RB
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| From: | brahms2.tivoli.com!Rick_Smith(at)matronics.com |
| Subject: | Re: countersinking after dimpling |
Morning all,
In the builders supplement Vans mentions that it is sometimes beneficial to
lightly touch dimpled holes with a countersink cutter to clean them up. I
have found that when dimpling sheets .032 and thicker it makes a big
difference in the finished surface. All it does is square up the sides of
the dimple to match the rivet heads. Do just enough to remove the finish
on the sheet but be carefull and practice first. As your dimple dies get
older, or if you are not using the $38.00 dimple dies to begin with, this
technique really makes a difference.
Hope it helps.
Rick (15,000 plus rivets and still building!)
aol.com!Rbz1(at)matronics.com on 10/22/97 05:00:41 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: countersinking after dimpling
Ive been reading about the weakness caused by countsinking .032 or less,
but what about dimpling and then a light c'sink to improve the finish. The
matl removed would be minimal. There is no mention of this in Van's manual.
Any opinions?
Rich Zeidman- 2weeks into the HS RV6A
|
|
"rv-list-request(at)matronics.com" | | & put the word "[un]subscribe" in the
|
|
________________________________________________________________________________
>Received: by matronics.com (4.1/SMI-4.1)
| Subject: | Re: fuselage skins |
| From: | n5lp <carlsbad.net!n5lp(at)matronics.com> |
>
>I'm looking for suggestions on back drilling the aft fuselage turtle
>deck skins. How have others done it? Did you have to crawl into the
>fuselage? and if so, how did you prevent bending the bulkhead webs and
>stringers?
I did this. I weigh 190 and did not have any problem. I threw a blanket
back there and was careful how I moved around. With a long drill bit it
was pretty easy.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
Pacer N8025D
RV-6QME N441LP Reserved
Rudder Pedals and Stick
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Nuckolls <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Runaway trim . . . |
>Bob,
>
>I think his statement about control may be valid for a Mark IV Kitfox
>as it uses a trim tab (i think). But a Series 5 uses the stab for
>trim control... This stab is much more powerful than a trim tab.
>I will try to do some testing in the next week and report my findings.
Very good! That's a most valuable service.
________________________________________________________________________________
>I think I have a reasonably fair general knowledge of flight
>characteristics even though I have not yet completed pilot training, but
>I am wondering about a comment you made in your most recent letter on
>>electric trim. You said "Trims in a mechanical limit on these airplanes
>produces a barely flyable airplane". Is it not true that trimming out an
>airplane should never require full range of operational limits?
I'd suggest that the converse argument be made. Mechnical stops
on pitch trim should be set to allow only necessary trim settings
to accomodate the airplane over it's speed/c.g. envelope.
>Or was
>that the point you were making when you were referring to the builders
>who connected the servos to the tabs? I would think it would be easy to
>design a bracket that would limit trim movement but not limit full range
>of motion for normal flying maneovers.
Exactly. One of the airplanes I'm working with was built with
6" wide tabs that run the full length of the elevators on BOTH
sides. The builders installed dual trim actuators. A common complaint
now is "Gee . . . I just barely touch the trim control and it moves
too far." Further investigation shows that the full range of
NEEDED trim is only about 10% of AVAILABLE trim. Electric actuators
on this airplane is an accident waiting for a place to happen.
Even if one sets good mechanical limits to cover the speed/c.g. envelope
it's still important to know how the airplane behaves should trim
be forced to either limit. I know that doing touch and go landings
in an A-36 can make the critter a handful if you don't give the trim
wheel about three good throws of nose down before you put power back
in for takeoff. Mechanical stops are a good thing but it's not the
whole answer . . . the whole discussiont about trim runaway is unresolvable
until the trim system is analyzed for EACH airframe.
Another ON-POINT comment:
>Most of the airplanes I've flown were still flyable with trim in both max up
>or down. The difference between the situation of Doug's and Graham's, is
>that Doug induced the situation, was expecting what would happen, and
>therefore was ready for it and was able to deal with it. In Graham's case,
>he was caught by surprise, had only milliseconds to make a decision, and
>elected to put it back on the ground. I've read several NTSB accident
>briefs that indicated that a pilot should have been able to handle a certain
>situation, ie., out of trim, etc., but for reasons of surprise and denial,
>wasn't able and either made the wrong decision or lost control of the
>aircraft. Had the pilot been expecting it the situation probably would have
>been easily overcome. I think the surprise and panic of a situation can put
>a person's brain into "lockup" momentarily which is all that it may take for
>disaster to occur. Fortunately, most of us will never be faced with having
>to find out what sort of ice we have in our veins.
>
No truer words spoken . . . see why I'm so rabid about cockpit simplicity
and architectures for Plan A/Plan B training? Look through any 100 NTSB
accident reports and compare numbers of accidents with human factors
contributions versus mechanical failures. Like people who write
regulations,
it's an easy knock-off to say we've deduced procedures or put tools in
place for every contingency . . . but you cannot regulate pilot attitudes,
perceptions and operating skills with an element of surprise. You can train
but who has the time or dollars and how many would submit to mandatory
training? Only I can take on responsability for how well I can perform.
In my limited experience in airplanes, my pucker-factor has peaked at over
100 psi on several occasions and none had anything to do with mechanics.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
| |
| Go ahead, make my day . . . . |
| Show me where I'm wrong. |
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steven Spruell" <spruell(at)qedsoln.com> |
| Subject: | Fuselage Jig Needed in Houston Area |
charset="iso-8859-1"
I'm really trying to avoid building one if I don't have to. If you are
nearly through with your fuse jig and you live in the greater Houston area,
please give me a call.
Steven Spruell
RV-6A
Houston Bay Area RVators - http://www.iwl.net/customers/markr/hbar
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gretz, Warren" <GretzW(at)tcplink.nrel.gov> |
| Subject: | Electric trim, Alternative placement |
I have been looking at placing my electric elevator trim servo in a
location other than in the left elevator. I have the manual trim
cable, have it routed and installed, but now think a better
solution
is to use the electric trim. I think it would be easier to install
the
servo now that the elevator is completed and on the plane by using
a
short push/pull control cable, from the trim tab, and run the cable
forward to just inside the fuselage where the trim servo could be
placed.
I do not want to cut up my new manual trim control cable, but would
rather find a short one to use. Has anyone else done this. What
cable
did you use and where did you get it? Also, how did you make the
connection from the short cable to the servo? Where did you place
your
servo inside the fuselage? Or did you place it in the area under
the
horizontal stabalizer/vertical stabalizer fairing?
Warren Gretz RV-6
gretzw(at)tcplink.nrel.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JamesCone(at)aol.com |
There was a very neat solution to this problem in an article in the
Tri-State Wing newsletter, with pictures to show how it was done. It allows
easy installation and removal from the outside. The back issues of the
newsletter as still available from the new editor, Kevin Lowery. If you are
interested, E-mail me and I will get the request to Kevin. The back issues
are $5.00 per year and 1995, 1996 and 1997 are available.
Jim Cone
jamescone(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JamesCone(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy, . . HELP!! |
The Tri-State Wing newsletter had a series of articles that described an easy
one man installation of the canopy. The back issues are still available for
$5.00 per year. 1995, 1996 and 1997 issues are available. If you are
interested, E-mail me and I will get the information to the new editor.
Jim Cone
jamescone(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: standard vs. quick build |
| From: | tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com (John T. Craig-Stearman) |
Paul,
Wow, the price is not a factor for you? Must be nice. My thoughts on
the quick-build: The work already done for you is certainly worth the
price if you can afford it. It took me three or four years to get
roughly to the point where the QB begins. The workmanship on the QB is
very good, unless you want to build a showplane.
On the downside: If this is your first project, you will find yourself
jumping right into the more difficult parts of the project without the
benefit of experience on the earlier parts. I screwed up several parts
in the tail kit and just ordered new ones at very little cost in money
and time. By now I am experienced enough that I make far fewer mistakes.
You will not have that luxury.
Finally, the newer kits for the RV-6 and RV-8 are so advanced that the
quickbuild versions offer relatively less advantage over the standard
kits. My next project will likely be a straight RV-8 kit, but I have not
ruled out a QB.
Regards,
Tom Craig-Stearman
tcraig-stearman(at)juno.com
RV-4 installing systems
>
>Do any of you have any input on the quick build kits? I am one to
>value
>opportunity cost, and would not mind paying the additional $8000, but
>I
>would also like to complete the kit by myself. Any input?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott) |
I got a new lowrance gps today. I really like it. It works great and
does everything it is supposed to do. After I looked at all the bells
and whistles I realized my old one without a moving map does jsut as
well. I tend not to use the map screen anyway, it is easier to read
when you just put all the pertinent info blocks on the screen without
the map. I think the screen is a little better than the skyblazer I was
borrowing. I definitely like the larger screen. It is a much bigger
screen than the gps-89 , 90 and skystar types. Just my 2 cents worth.
(not worth that much, with inflation). The special airspace warnings
are a nice feature, too. Okay, and sometimes when I am IFR it will be
nice to know what road I am following!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott) |
I talked to Mr Felix about my prop situation this morning. He seems to
want to be very helpful. He looked up the s/n from the prop and said it
was originally cut for a glasair with a 150 hp engine. He said I should
be getting 185 mph at 2850 rpm's. I told him I wanted to see about 175
at 2500 but was only getting 140, and I wanted to max out at 2700. He
said he didn't understand the problem unless the prop has been whittled
on by someone else. I didn't think it had been because the stickers are
still on the prop. He said to send it back and he would measure it to
see if it was original, and if it was he could cut it to give me the
numbers I want. I mentioned I was using a warnke right now and he said
Mr Warnke had cancer and he wasn't sure if he would be doing any more
prop work. Over all he seemed rather anxious to please. He also said
if the prop couldn't be cut he would give me 200 bucks for it outright
or towards another prop. His new props are 610 dollars. Sounds good to
me. . I did my first spins the other day. It spun at about 1 turn per
second, best I could tell. Maybe I did it wrong, but it seemed more
like a graveyard spiral, to me. Recovery was almost instant. My head
didn't recover so fast after the 3 turn ones, but I'm getting
better.Michael
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chester razer <crazer(at)egyptian.net> |
| Subject: | Rivet Gun Repair |
I can't believe it, after almost 3 years and anywhere between 14000 and
18000 rivets, my faithful Taylor 2X gun, purchased new from Cleveland
Aircraft Tools and well maintained, quit with only 3 rivets left to
drive. I blows air but the hammer action won't work. I took it
completely apart, including the trigger and cleaned and polished the
piston and sleeves and all other parts and still can't get it to work.
There was no rust or pitting or any signs of scoring.
Any suggestions regarding repair or should I just buy a new one.
--
Chet Razer
crazer(at)egyptian.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | pbennett(at)zip.com.au |
| Subject: | Re: fuselage skins |
> myself but if I were to do it again I would have someone on the outside
> fitting the clecos and watching for any unwanted creep.
I get a few of them in my shop from time to time too.
Peter Bennett
Sydney Australia
RV6 doing the fiddly bits before engine
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charles Woodson <woodson(at)soe.berkeley.edu> |
| Subject: | Building RV8 in garage/in hanger |
I am about to start building an RV8. My wife is not sympathetic to the
idea of me using the garage. Several builders have advised me that
building in the garage will go faster than building at the airport (8
miles away). I am trying to quantify this. I think a lot of time will
involve studying the plans, which I can do at home.
Can anyone offer me some estimates on the relative amounts of time these
alternatives would take?
Charles Woodson
http://socrates.berkeley.edu/~cw
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gretz, Warren" <GretzW(at)tcplink.nrel.gov> |
| Subject: | Electric trim, altermative placement |
I have been looking at placing my electric elevator trim servo in a
location other than in the left elevator. I currently have the
manual
trim cable, have it routed and installed, but now think a better
solution is to use the electric trim. I think it would be easier to
install the servo, now that the elevator is completed and on the
plane, by using a short push/pull control cable. This cable would
run
from the trim tab forward to just inside the fuselage where the
trim
servo could be placed.
I do not want to cut up my new manual trim control cable, but would
rather find a short one to use. Has anyone else done this? What
cable
did you use and where did you get it? Also, how did you made the
connecton from the short cable to the servo? Where did you place
your
servo inside the fuselage? Or did you place it in the area under
the
horizontal stabalizer/vertical stabalizer fairing?
Warren Gretz, RV-6
gretzw(at)tcplink.nrel.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gretz, Warren" <GretzW(at)tcplink.nrel.gov> |
| Subject: | Heated pitot tubes |
A post earlier today, before there was a problem with the system,
from
Dave Jones asked for information about a heated pitot tube
installation.
I can help with this request.
I make and sell a heated pitot tube mounting bracket kit for
installation on RV's and comes with all hardware and installation
instructions with photos. I also sell a heated pitot tube at
competitive prices. The pitot tub is the popular AN5814 (12 volt).
It
is the one that has the static port in it so there is no need to
install static lines running to the back of the fuselage. The
brackets
are available in a chrome finish to match the pitot tube, and are
also
availabe in a paintable version.
If you Dave, or anone else is interested in my products please
contact
me and I will send you a flyer on the products.
Warren Gretz
3664 East Lake Drive
Littlton, CO 80121
(303) 770-3811
gretzw(at)tcplink.nrel.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gil Alexander <gila(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Electric trim, Alternative placement |
>
> I have been looking at placing my electric elevator trim servo in a
>
> location other than in the left elevator. I have the manual trim
> cable, have it routed and installed, but now think a better
>solution
> is to use the electric trim. I think it would be easier to install
>the
> servo now that the elevator is completed and on the plane by using
>a
> short push/pull control cable, from the trim tab, and run the cable
>
> forward to just inside the fuselage where the trim servo could be
> placed.
>
> I do not want to cut up my new manual trim control cable, but would
>
> rather find a short one to use. Has anyone else done this. What
>cable
> did you use and where did you get it? Also, how did you make the
> connection from the short cable to the servo? Where did you place
>your
> servo inside the fuselage? Or did you place it in the area under
>the
> horizontal stabalizer/vertical stabalizer fairing?
>
> Warren Gretz RV-6
> gretzw(at)tcplink.nrel.gov
Warren ... check the archive from March 1997 ... Gil A.
********** repeated message *********************
>
>Jerry, Several people have decided to make the change after-the-fact. This
>can be easily done by using the RV-4 throttle cable in lieu of the trim
>cable. The throttle cable is 55" and will move the servo (MSTS-8) to the
>rear of the fuselage. Bill
>
>Bill
Guys,
.... there is another way that I think is a little cleaner and
certainly cheaper. The trouble with a throttle cable is it's length (and
it's $50 price), which ends up putting the servo in some way inaccessible
place in the aft fuselage with no good mounting surface handy. A much
shorter cable would put the servo on the flat F-614 deck under the tail
surfaces, where it would be accessible by removing the F-694B fiberglass
fairing. I was ready to special order a shorter cable, and then a catalog
arrived!
Airparts Inc., Kansas City 800-800-3229 (the ads with the lady in
the roll of aluminum ..:^) have surplus 24 inch push-pull cables on sale
for $4.20 each. These have 10-32 threaded, swivels at both ends and a
threaded mount at one end that will thread into Vans WD-415 weldment.
Sounded close to what I wanted. I bought one (well actually two, since
they have a $10 minimum order ..:^) They do not have a vinyl jacket like
Vans cables, but a couple of layers of 3/8 diameter heat shrink tubing gave
me a nice looking plastic jacket.
I mounted mine as shown in the plans on the elevator, and routed
the new trim cable basically as shown on the plans, but through the center
lightening hole in the HS-405 rib ibnstead of the forward one. This will
make the location of the servo closer to the centerline for easier access.
The 5/8 hole in the main horizontal stab. spar will now be 3.5 inches out
from the centerline. The moving portion will penetrate this hole, so I
will fabricate an angle bracket riveted to HS-405 and use a 1/4 inch Adel
clamp to solidly anchor the forward end of the trim cable. A mounting
plate needs to be fabricated to hold the servo about 1 inch (whatever
measurement it takes to keep the trim cable in a flat, horizontal plane)
above the F-614 deck.
I think this will be a cleaner system, with better
accessibility, than using a throttle cable that Bill B. describes. Don't
forget that the WD-415 trim cable anchor weldment (the nut on a I inch sq.
SS plate) is part of the finish kit, and you might need to order one
seperately from Vans ($6.09 last week).
FOR SLOW BUILDERS ONLY:
Those of you with old elevators - I'm a slow builder ..:^( will
have a royal pain in the ^&&%$ if you built before Rev 3 of sheet 5 (now
sheet 5a), and have to open up the 7/16 hole in the WD-405 elevator horn.
I managed to use a 1/2 inch Unibit on an extension, got a 1/2 hole and then
used a slightly modified SB-625-6 (not a -7 as now called out) plastic
bushing. No way could I work out how to get that hole to be enlarged to
5/8 working through the slot in the pop-riveted leading edge of the elevator.
Interestingly enough, I got one of these -6 bushings to fit into
the main spar of the horizontal stab. by filing off the "lip" on two sides.
I could get a 1/2 hole in my main stab. spar without hitting the spar
caps. Seems tidier than no bushing and using the RTV approach.
... hope this helps some others considering a hybrid trim
cable/servo approach.
..... Gil (fiddling with trim tabs) Alexander
-------------------------------------------------------
mailto:gila(at)flash.net
Gil Alexander,
Los Angeles, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Operational Speeds |
>Second, regarding Vans Vne of 210 mph. should I regard this as true or
>indicated airspeed?
Unless you're dealing with limiting mach numbers, VNE is indicated airspeed.
Kyle Boatright
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tim Bronson <70773.2700(at)compuserve.com> |
Hello out there!
Is it just me, or are the rest of you getting a lot of this:
<<< No Message Collected >>>
I'm also getting three and four of some messages that are several days old.
I have a sneaking suspicion that I'm missing out on a lot of good information.
I will post this only once, so if it shows up several times it's not me!
Tim - Pittsburgh
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RICKRV6 <RICKRV6(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Building RV8 in garage/in hanger |
No contest here. I built my -6 in my garage and am now building an -8 in an
airport hangar. Go with the garage, you will accomplish much more at home.
You'll be suprised how often you go out and only work for an hour or so. You
likely won't do that in your hangar.
Rick McBride
rv-6 N523JC sold
rv-8 80027
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Building RV8 in garage/in hanger |
Charles,
I would advise you build at home, unless you live close to the airport and
dont mind spending all of you free time there. It wont take a couple of weeks
before your wife is complaining that your never home. Compromise and build on
your cars side of the garage. I think you will find that the building process
will go a lot quicker this way. I was able to keep one car in the garage
throughout most of the project.
Ryan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Electric trim, Alternative placement |
Warren,
I have done a few retrofits for freinds in the area. Its not that difficult
to install the trim motor in the elevator even after the elevator has been
completed. Some people buy a short cable and install the trim unit back in
the rear of the fuselage somewhere. You could also use the long cable and
install the trim unit up front either mounting it on the sidewall or under
the floor someplace. Give me a call if you want, im home for the weekend.
Ive seen most of these posts about 3 times now. Whats up with that Matt? Not
that I mind we are stuck in winter hell this weekend, nothing else to
do.Denver wont say the airport is closed ( you all know this is the worlds
only all weather airport right?) The main road in is closed and all airlines
have cancelled all flights for today . Its not closed but no one can use it ,
get in or out of it ;<). Hope all in this area are home and warm!
Ryan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com |
| Subject: | fiberglass scraps anyone??? |
Does anybody have a few scraps of Vans' fiberglass pieces? Stuff lying
in your trash that you cut off from the raw cowl or rudder fairing or
whatever?
I need 3 or 4 small pieces perhaps 2"x3" which I want to use to do a
test of how ethanol enhanced auto fuel effects various types of
fiberglass composites.
Its not for an RV related project. However, other planes we fly use
fiberglass fuel tanks and auto gas. Some people have reported a
softening and delamination of their tanks and we suspect ethanol content
has something to do with it.
If anybody can stick a couple of scrap pieces in the mail to me I would
really appreciate it. I already have samples made up of auto parts store
type epoxy layups, however, I'd like to test with various types of
glass.
Thanks,
Andy Gold
PO Box 270
Tabernash, CO 80478
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb <RV4131rb(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . ..Yeahbut.....] |
<< I have no desire to have a trim or flap motor cause troubles in the air.
Odds are against it but it only takes once. Will be going with all manual
controls.
I >>
Bruce,
Normally I would agree with you. I to like manual controls. After seeing how
difficult it was to opperate the flap lever with a passenger in the 4 I
elected to go electric for room sake. The reason I chose the electric elevator
trim was the same, less clutter.
Ryan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb <RV4131rb(at)aol.com> |
Micheal,
I dont mean to be discouraging. Im sure Mr. Felix will try his best to give
you the performance you are asking for. I think you will find after a few
atempts you may not get what you hoped for. Ill bet the first thing he tells
you is either that prop has been worked on by someone else, or he cant bring
that prop to your requirement. Make sure if you send him that extra money that
he guarantees you will get what you asked for or your money back.
Ryan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb <RV4131rb(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The great breaker debate . ..Yeahbut.....] |
<< If you can't overpower the electric trim, it doesn't belong in the
airplane. >>
John,
I guess my meaning wasnt clear. I didnt mean that at full travel I could not
control the airpane. What I meant was it would be a handfull. Sure I could
maintain altitude for any length of time, but imagine how much fun the landing
flair would be. Once on the ground If one were to relax to soon. Well im sure
you get my drift.
Ryan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | denis <denis.rolandoeugio(at)hol.fr> |
Hello
I'm a french hombuilder, new on the list and my english is poor (sorry):-(
I have bought a Lycoming O360A1AD for the RV4 I'm building (I LOVE this taildragger
!)
and the propeller wich was with it. They come from a Socata TB 10 (french made
plane).
My problem is that this propeller ( c/s Hartzell HC-C2YK-1BF )is 74.5 inch dia.
Vans
October 20, 1997 - October 24, 1997
RV-Archive.digest.vol-dn