RV-Archive.digest.vol-eh
February 21, 1998 - February 27, 1998
didnt say why the prop was on the wall instead of on his airplane and I didnt
ask. But he did say he purchased a heat gun to take off the tape.
Ryan Bendure
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Nutritional aluminum? |
Gary V wrote:
<< What you're really doing IMO is breathing the finely divided dust. >>
My opinion exactly. Snot analysis should settle this once and for all - If GV
will post his mailing address, we can each send him a mucus sample in a small
plastic film can (the type used by RV builders to obtain useful quantities of
fuel lube from hapless builders who own far more of the substance than they
can use in three lifetimes....) Gary could then send our pooled resources
under some pretense to one of those outfits that does engine oil analysis and
let us all know our average aluminum content, and also if any of us was about
to spin a bearing "upstairs." I've sometimes wondered if my own rings seated
properly in early childhood...
Hey- this issue i snot funny! what with the proposed link between aluminum
and Alzheimer's disease, we could all end up just as looney as Gary describes.
This aluminum is too dangerous for me. My next plane will DEFINITELY be
epoxy!
(See? I'm going crazy already!)
Bill B
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: More info on dimple tape |
<< It turns out
his was the airplane in the article in sport aviation. The prop is hanging on
the wall in his hangar. I inquired about the speed increase with the tape and
the claims that the magazine article made. He told me that he didnt know how
they came up with those numbers and that the whole thing was a bunch of BS.
>>
If someone had written false claims about MY airplane in Sport Aviation, I
would feel compelled to send the magazine a written denial and insist they
publish it. I'd love to believe the tape works as promoted, but I tend toward
skepticism. If it's (not) true, we shouldn't have to wait long to see Mr.
Smith's denial in Sport Aviation.
Bill Boyd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George McNutt <GMcNutt(at)compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel Tank Rivets |
I picked up a Loctite catalogue today and will call their tech support
people Monday. However in the meantime I was wondering if anyone on the
List has investigated, or tried using any of the Loctite products on their
fuel tank rivets instead of the recommended ProSeal type sealers.
Some completed RV's have ugly tank rivets sitting up out of the dimple. It
seems to me that a lower porosity sealant around the fuel tank rivets might
give a better appearing rivet and also a structurally stronger rivet
because it would be better seated in the hole.
The Loctite catalogue states their threadlockers will; seal against fluid
leakage between threads; prevent corrosion between threads; withstand most
solvents, chemicals and other harsh environments; cure only after assembly.
In addition Loctite Wicking Threadlocker (Green) "can also be used as a
porosity and weld seam sealant".
I am really looking for something that states it is impervious to fuels.
Any comments appreciated and I will report back what I find out from their
technical people.
George McNutt, Langley B.C.
6A - Wings.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrownTool(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | 1998 Tool Catalog |
They have finally arrived !!! Our new 1998 catalogs just came back from the
printer on Friday. If you have already requested a copy, they will be mailing
out this coming Monday and Tuesday. If you have not requested a FREE copy,
and you would like to do so, please E-Mail your name and address to:
BrownTool(at)aol.com
or, visit our website and request a copy on our web page at:
http://www.browntool.com
Thank You and Best Regards,
Michael Brown
Brown Aviation Tool Supply Co.
Bethany, Oklahoma USA
1-800-587-3883
405-495-4991
BrownTool(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass Tips |
<< How might one go about closing the fiberglass tips on the elevators/rudder
if one were uncomfortable with fiberglass? >>
Find someone who likes to work in fiberglass and pay them, or alternately do
reciprocal work for them that you enjoy. This is the greatest thing about the
pooling of talent amongg homebuilders.
Much of my fiberglass (short of the final sanding and filling) was done by my
friends who are building a Wheeler Express. They actually enjoy composite
work (go figure).
I, on the other hand, enjoy electrical system design and panel wiring (among
other things) so I did this for them in exchange.
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JNice51355(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Nutritional aluminum? |
<< I do
often and it makes me pretty certain I am absorbing it thru my skin. >>
Don't know about the hazard involved with absorbtion of aluminum through the
skin.
However, if you can stand the Latex smell, Latex gloves would keep you from
tasting
aluminum, but you may taste Latex instead.
Jim Nice
RV6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JNice51355(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Windshield Antenna |
<< There are no data whatever on injuries from RF levels
associated with com radios. >>
I am not saying that there is a risk involved with RF, but the Insurance
Companies would only keep records and statistics on it if it cost the company
money, which it does not.
Jim Nice
RV6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Faster RVs Part 3 |
| From: | ron.taborek(at)flight642.com (RON TABOREK) |
ANALYSIS
In Part 2 a procedure was described for doing flight tests to get data
on the effect of a mod on the speed of your RV. This note describes how
to analyse the data and find out if the Framus makes you go faster.
Do the following calculation for each of your test points.
1) To get TAS, wind speed and direction, use the procedure outlined by
Fox in the Feb 1995 issue of Kitplanes, page 49. For TAS, calculate:
a) the square of the ground speed on the first track,
b) the square of the ground speed on the second track,
c) the square of the ground speed on the third track,
d) multiply a) by c) and divide by b),
e) add a) + b) + c) + d),
f) take the square root of e) and divide by 2. This is TAS.
At this point you will have TAS data before and after the mod, but it
will not be corrected for differences in BHP, weight, atmosphere and
prop efficiency.
2) To get the BHP during the test, use RPM, MP, OAT and altitude with
the power/altitude charts for your engine to get BHP. At this point you
can plot the BHP/TAS points before the mod on a graph and join the
points. Do the same for the points after the mod. You can then read
the change in speed for the same power. However, you have still not
corrected for differences in weight, atmosphere or prop efficiency.
3) As a side benefit, you can use IAS, OAT, altitude and TAS from 1) to
calibrate your ASI error. Calculate the ratio of air density during the
test to sea level standard by:
a) multiply your test altitude by 6.875 and divide by one million,
b) subtract the result from 1.000,
c) calculate b) raised to the power 4.2561. This is the density ratio.
d) take the square root of c). This is the square root of the density
ratio.
e) multiply TAS by d). This is CAS.
f) comparing CAS in e) with IAS gives your ASI error.
4) Calculate the aircraft weight during your test by using the take-off
weight, typical fuel consumption and and the time of the tests.
a) calculate how many minutes after take-off each test was done,
b) calculate approximate lb of fuel burn to that time = .5 times BHP
times a) divided by 60,
c) weight at each test = take-off weight - b),
d) divide the aircraft gross weight by the test weight c),
e) take the square root of d). This is the square root of the weight
ratio.
5)Use the procedure outined by Ribbens in the Experimenter magazine of
Aug 1993, page 31, to standardize the weights and atmosphere for
tests before and after the mod. If your before and after conditions
were much the same these corrections will be small.
a) take the TAS calculated in 1f) above and multiply it by the square
root of the density ratio, calculated in 3d), and the square root of the
weight ratio, calculated in 4e). This standardizes your test speeds to
gross weight, sea level, standard day conditions.
b) take the BHP determined in 2) above and multiply it by the square
root of the density ratio, calculated in 3d), and multiply it three
times by the square root of the weight ratio, calculated in 4e), ( that
is cubed). This standardizes the power.
You can now plot standardized BHP and TAS as in 2) above and get the
speed benefit of the Framus. This is the number you brag, cry or lie
about.
There are circumstances where the prop efficiency may change as a result
of your mod. If you have a constant speed prop or a fixed pitch prop
and the speed change isn't that much, I don't think you have to worry
about it. If that isn't the case or if your Framus is a prop mod, you
have to look at relative prop efficiency. But enough is enough for now.
Since this effort is a stretch for the old grey matter, I'd appreciate
those of you familiar with these procedures to look over what I've done
to see if I've got it right. If people don't want to wade through these
calcs, I, and I,m sure others, wouldn't mind doing them for them.
Hopefully we can learn a bit about what speed mods really work.
ron.taborek(at)flight642.com RV-4 Installing O-320 Toronto.
---
{ Presentation of the preceding message was made possible by Flight 642 }
{ BBS. Canada's Aviation and Simulation connection. (905)642-2993 }
{ WEB Page: http://www.flight642.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Baffle Ignition Wire Seals |
<< I used a large grommet (AN931-4-16, if I remember correctly). I elongated
the center hole so that two wires would fit through it, and slit one side so
I could get it over the wires. After installation, I sealed all the gaps
with high temperature silicon. It is not as pretty as the high priced
seals, but it was easy to install and seems to work well. >>
I did the same except I used a grommet for each wire at a cost of about $1
each. Just cut a slot in the grommet so you can get the nut through. I
sealed them with hi-temp RTV.
BTW, have you seen the really cool stand-offs you can custom make using a
piece of hose and tie-raps. I have these all over my aircraft on just about
everything. Each is a perfect fit and they cost pennies (and take seconds)
each to make.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC -NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: FEMALE BUILDERS |
My wife drive just about all of the rivets on my wings and fuselage. I would
do all of the prep work and wait (and wait) for my wife to put our son to go
to bed. Then she'd come down to the garage and help me out. She doesn't even
like to fly that much and has only flown in the RV once.....hey, maybe she
knows something that I don't :)
What a babe.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC - NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jonh J Banks <tinmanjj(at)ptd.net> |
| Subject: | rv wings,fitting the ribs to the rear spar. |
first make sure that the top flanges of the main ribs are 90 degrees to
the vertical, Then clamp a strip of scrap aluminum obout .040 or plywood
or apopsicle stick to the top rib flange with two clamps about 2in
apart then use one clamp on the top flange of the rear spar. Do not
clamp the bottom flange , Let it ride wherever it wants to. Now you can
drill the rivet holes in the rear spar and ribs, Shims can be used
between the bottom rib flanges and the spar if needed. This way you will
have great looking top wing skin with no deflection upward at the rear
spar area
tinmanjj@ptd net
RV 4 37JJ RV4 3oGB RV6 839 S RV8 Left wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | marc hanson <paintbox(at)rconnect.com> |
| Subject: | Still tooling up |
It seems that you just about have the tools that you need and then...!
I'm at the HS forward spar and see that I need to purchase a drill
press. I've been looking at various bench top models (Sears 1/3
hp-8in.,etc.), and am wondering if these are big enough for the needs of
the pre-punched kits. Any help appreciated once again.Thanks in advance.
Marc R. Hanson
paintbox(at)rconnect.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Aileron pushrod air seals |
A few nights ago, when just about to take the scissors to a beautiful and
expensive chamois, I had a sudden inspiration which netted me a refund at the
auto parts store and a significant time and weight savings on the plane. Over
in the corner of the shop I noticed a forlorn pair of Tyvek coveralls lying in
a heap. (I keep a messy shop.) I considered that Tyvek is cheap, abundant,
airtight, lightweight, easily cut, and in this case, presewn into a tube
(a.k.a. a sleeve.) Did I mention that it was cheap? Anyway, it took only a
moment to chop off a 6 inch length of sleeve from each arm and fasten these
over the push tubes to the fuselage sidewalls using 3M spray adhesive. Voila!
Add a cable tie just behind the elastic wristband when the wings go on for the
last time and we are set to keep the cold breezes off the derriere.
I obtain these coveralls used from the local hospital O. R., but anyone can
get them at a hardware or paint supply store for a few dollars. They should
hold up well in this application. Wear them for painting and retire them
later as control tube boots. One pair yields four cuffs, and the additional
sleeve material would work just as well without the elastic; I just liked the
"effect."
If folks are patient, I could get some for interested listers as they come
available (for an S.A.S.E.)
Bill Boyd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | tip up canopy stiffening |
An RV-6A Tip-up question:
Has the foam/fiberglass/epoxy stiffener proven necessary in actual operational
experience? I am at the point where if I'm going to do that, the time is now.
Advice from flying listers appreciated.
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jerry calvert <calverjl(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Still tooling up |
marc hanson wrote:
>
>
> It seems that you just about have the tools that you need and then...!
> I'm at the HS forward spar and see that I need to purchase a drill
> press. I've been looking at various bench top models (Sears 1/3
> hp-8in.,etc.), and am wondering if these are big enough for the needs of
> the pre-punched kits. Any help appreciated once again.Thanks in advance.
>
> Marc R. Hanson
> paintbox(at)rconnect.com
Marc,
I have a tabletop 10" band saw(tradesman(single speed)) with a
non-ferrous metal cutting blade that works great on aluminum. I also
have a tabletop 10" drill press(Ryobi) and it works great too. I
wouldn't want to make the HS610 & HS614 without them! Mine came out real
nice :-)
The band saw made short work of cutting the 6" slant on the rudder
stiffners too. I would guess that these two tools are not absolutely
necessary, but they have saved me a lot of time and I plan on using them
whenever I can.
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok
-6a emp
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott) |
Can anyone who has boosted their 150 hp 0-320 to 160 h.p, give me
an estimate on total cost. I have to pull the engine to remove
the accessory case to change the oil pump and check things out so
figured this would be a good time to up the hp. Thanks.
Michael.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JDaniel343(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Still tooling up |
Hi Marc,
I think a small bench mounted drill press is fine. Lookl for something that
will give you 300 to 400 RPM on the slowest setting. Mine actually only does
650 RPM and I dont have problems but get the slowest you can afford.
John L. Danielson
JLD AirCraft Tools
Riveting Spars / Rebuilding Trim Tab
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Derek Reed <dreed(at)cdsnet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Still tooling up |
marc hanson wrote:
>
>
> I'm at the HS forward spar and see that I need to purchase a drill
> press.
Whatever you get check the run out with the spindle fully extended,grip
the chuck and see if there is any free play in the quill.If there is,
forget it ,it's probably a cheapy from Harbor Freight or like the one I
bought from Tool Town[Made in China] all holes guaranteed to be within +
or - .030 !!
D.Reed RV6A OR .
>
>
> Marc R. Hanson
> paintbox(at)rconnect.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JRWillJR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Nutritional aluminum? |
I think you are probably tasting the fine dust. You may well absorb some
through your skin, mucous membranes and lungs. For heavy grinding wear a mask
and use gloves. Avoid transfer from hands to mouth--wash up! There maybe some
reson for concern as a safety issue--remember the link between Alum. cooking
pans and alzhiemers and brain necrosis. Lots of bad chemicals in this airplane
building--use common sense and you will be okay. I have been messing around
with alum. for sometime and I am still pretty smart ( some might say
smart---). JR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JRWillJR(at)aol.com |
Is there a Glastar list--I have a friend whom I was unable to talk into a RV
who has started a Glastar with my help. If there is a list he would like to
get on it --does anyone know?? Thanks JR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Craig Hiers <craig-RV4(at)worldnet.att.net> |
An odd thing happen to me today, I go to start up
the -4 and the battery does not have enough umph
to start it, when I return the key to the off
position the starter keeps right on going. the
prop was turning real slow as the battery was going
down fast. I had to stop the thing by turning off
the master switch. It has an ACS starter switch,
and a wicks starter relay. I took the starter
cable off of the starter and tryed to duplicate
the problem but everthing worked just fine.
Any thoughts, ideas, or comments. I cannot have
the starter turning while the motor is running.
Craig Hiers
RV-4 N143CH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Aileron Gap Seal Question |
<< Where the aileron gap seals attach to the rear spar, there are the
universal
head 470 rivet heads (attaching the ribs) preventing the gap seal from laying
flat against the rear spar. Do I just attach the thin (.020) gap seal by
just
bending it over the protruding rivets and riveting in between? >>
Boy, should you have bought the Orndorff Videos. The rivets along the gap
seal area are supposed to be 426's so the gap seal can lay flat (tangent).
-GV
ing that you all will
die horribly, but not anytime soon, so quit worrying.
Boyd, you numbskull... I ought to backrivet your scrotum to an anvil and dump
you out over Lake Winnebago.
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: What's the Average Completion Cost for Night VFR RV |
<34EDAEB7.6C7A7ECE(at)ecentral.com>
| From: | wstucklen1(at)juno.com (Frederic w Stucklen) |
writes:
**** SNIP ***
>As for my 'options'. None of them are frills and would highly recommend
>them all to anyone who can find a way to afford them. On the other hand
>I have included operating expense to show you that no sane person can
>afford to own one of these things anyway!
>
>D Walsh
Guess "you" might have to conclude that we're all insane then. But I
sure am
having a aterrible amoount of insane fun........ :-)
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
(Working on second RV-6A - Chevy Powered!)
wstucklen1(at)juno.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JimNolan" <JimNolan(at)kconline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 150 to 160 hp |
> Can anyone who has boosted their 150 hp 0-320 to 160 h.p, give me
> an estimate on total cost.
Michael,
From what I understand, all you need to change is the pistons. I bought 4
Millennium cylinders a couple years ago in anticipation of overhauling my 150
hp,
and I bought the 160 hp cylinders. At that time, Mattituck told me the only
difference was the pistons and I wouldn't have to change anything else
Jim
N444JN
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Wingtip Antenna Part I (Long) |
BOB ARCHER
SPORTCRAFT ANTENNAS
21818 Ocean Avenue
Torrance, California 90503
Tel. 310-316-8796
WING TIP ANTENNAS FOR METAL and/or CONDUCTIVE AIRCRAFT
The highest performance internal / flush aircraft antennas available at any
price.
What? Are you crazy? Everyone knows that wing tip antennas have never, will
never and cannot ever be made to work!!!
(Semi close to actual quote by semi-famous antenna guru who shall remain
anonymous.)
(Of course, the meaning of "works" is subjective. Some people think an
antenna "works" if they can communicate with the tower while being parked at
the base of the tower.)
The above quote is absolutely true for antennas that are designed the
traditional way; by connecting a conductor longer than a quarter wave length
to the center conductor of a coaxial cable, with the outer conductor connected
to a ground plane and then trimming the antenna element until you get the
lowest VSWR. Doing this in a fiber glass wing tip on the end of a conductive
wing leads to several problems. The end of a conductive wing is not a "plane",
as in a large flat surface, against which monopole type antennas are normally
meant to work. Also to get a quarter wave antenna element in wing tip the
antenna normally will have to be bent or swept back in order to fit into the
tip and this causes more capacitance between the element and the end of the
wing than the antenna can use. And then we have the wing tip lights and wires,
which also cause more capacitance, and on top of that the wires have a very
low impedance for the RF energy to ground and they tend to bleed off antenna
energy to ground.
With these problems to work with, a fellow worker and I from TRW in Redondo
Beach (where we were employed as antenna designers and developers for space
craft) were hired to develop internal zero drag antennas for the "Derringer",
a two place twin engine aircraft being developed by the High Shear Corp. at
the time. (Early sixties). The antennas we developed were COM, VOR and Marker
beacon; they worked very well and had good VSRW but were very complicated and
hard to install in the wing tips. The COM in particular; it had both series
and parallel capacitors with a very critical inductive element. The workers
in the plant never did build one that worked even after we showed them how
three times. So they put external antennas on their airplanes. Easier. In
the aftermath a friend with a Bonanza, with a rabbit ears type of VOR antenna
under the tail, complained that he only had a reception range of about 35
miles. So we modified the existing wing tip design to make it easier to
install, certified some fiberglass wing tips and tried to sell the tips with
antennas to Bonanza owners. The friend installed a set on his airplane and
informed us that he could get a full flag from the SFO VOR over Gorman at
13000 feet. I didn't witness it but I do know they worked well. Beechcraft
didn't make them though so Bonanza owners weren't much interested. So my
partner quit leaving me the business and I modified the antennas some more
deciding they had to be stand alone items so that I had total control over all
the parameters and would fit into any wing tip that is large enough. I sold
T-18 builders quite a few wingtip VOR antennas over the years and added a tail
top COM antenna to my product line in the early seventies. In the early
nineties people were becoming more aware of the drag penalties of external
antennas so they were coming to me for help more often. Also composite
aircraft were becoming more popular so I expanded into internal dipole
antennas also. At this time I have probably sold more VOR wing tip antennas to
Lancair IV builders than any other type of aircraft.
One builder told me he has a VOR reception range of 200 miles. It is
pressurized and he flies high but still that is pretty good. RV builders tell
me that they can always depend on well over a hundred miles if they are at any
kind of decent altitude. I recently, by popular request, came out with a wing
tip COM antenna that seams to work pretty well, though not as well as the tail
top COM, with users reporting communication ranges of greater than fifty
miles.
Most of the antennas I make use a device that is called a "Gamma Match" to
feed the antennas and match the impedances. I use this device because I then
have control over all the parameters of the antenna and allows the matching of
impedance to a high level across the frequency band. I can control the over
all length of the elements, can feed the antenna at the fifty-ohm point of the
elements and can vary the inductances and capacitances to the point where they
operate at the point of the best possible performance.
(To be continued)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron pushrod air seals |
<< A few nights ago, when just about to take the scissors to a beautiful and
expensive chamois, I had a sudden inspiration which netted me a refund at the
auto parts store and a significant time and weight savings on the plane.
Over
in the corner of the shop I noticed a forlorn pair of Tyvek coveralls lying
in
a heap. (I keep a messy shop.) I considered that Tyvek is cheap, abundant,
airtight, lightweight, easily cut, and in this case, presewn into a tube
(a.k.a. a sleeve.) Did I mention that it was cheap? >>
Bill-
I likewise had problems with the chamois idea, but not due to the expense. I
reasoned that if the chamois got wet from washing the plane or flying in the
rain and then if I flew it into a small thunderhead (just for fun), the
chamois would supercool and subsequently freeze, rendering the stick useless
for aileron control. I truly wanted something that would not saturate with
water.
I ended up using urethane coated ripstop nylon (read rain poncho) and RTV'd it
to some aluminium rings. Worked great and it's got everything going for it
that the Tyvek has, except cost. The poncho cost $15, but the good news is
that I have enough poncho left for those of you that are poncho challenged.
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Stick Angular Displacement 6A |
I measured the control stick angular displacement as Doug asked. For those of
you needing to plan for control stick clearances from panels, consoles and
just those who want to know what to expect, the following are the stick angles
(from neutral) my 6A required to get elevator (+28/-22 degrees) and aileron
(+28/-15 degrees) travel. Also listed is the rudder cable travel (from
center) needed to achieve rudder (33 degrees) travel.
23 degrees, side-to-side stick for ailerons
+20 degrees back stick (up elevator), -16 degrees forward stick (down
elevator)
Center is about 2 degrees forward of normal with the water-line, and the
reverser bellcrank is vertical.
2" front to back rudder cable travel (sorry... my back didn't want me to
climb under the panel again to measure the angle of the hanging pedals)
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: That priming thing.... |
| From: | smcdaniels(at)juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS) |
>
>In a message dated 2/20/98 9:17:32 PM Eastern Standard Time,
>sbuc(at)traveller.com writes:
>
><< Sam Buchanan (assembling both wing skeletons)
> sbuc(at)traveller.com >>
>Sam-----
>I do'nt think your wing ribs are ALCLAD!!!!
>Dave
>
>
>
Yup, they are alclad, but unlike a lot of other RV parts they were heat
treated for press forming which does cause a slight coloration change.
Scott McDaniels RV-6A N64SD 560+ Hrs. Finally Sold!
These opinions and ideas are my own
and do not necessarily reflect the opinions
of my employer.
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Shirley Hobenshield <shobenshield(at)cmsd.bc.ca> |
| Subject: | Starting 160 0-320 |
Would like so imfo from those who may have some exp. with problem starting
the 160 hp 320. Mine fowls plugs 25 hrs on 100LL, cranks longer than I
think it should and then back-fires when It catches.
I have 3 lines on the electric primer, and after turning the elect. fuel
pump on for some 5 to 10 sec. I usually hold the primer for 3 sec if the
outside temp is 50 to 70 deg. I also have my throttle set at 1000rpm.
I do lean on all flights above 3000ft .
As I am not into timing, I trusted an AME to set the timing.
The cyl heads are normal and so are the egts. Sometimes I wonder if I
should be running the engine harder as I am somewhat under proped???,
Usually get a cruise of 140kts 3000ft and 2350rpm ( GPS ).
Thanks for input in advance. Ed Hobenshield RV-6 Flying
PS- have 6 gal imp. burn average over 60 hrs,
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 150 to 160 hp |
| From: | smcdaniels(at)juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS) |
>Can anyone who has boosted their 150 hp 0-320 to 160 h.p, give me
>an estimate on total cost. I have to pull the engine to remove
>the accessory case to change the oil pump and check things out so
>figured this would be a good time to up the hp. Thanks.
>Michael.
>
>
>
Requires only a change of the pistons and the piston pins.
Sorry, I don't know what the current parts prices are.
If you also follow the convention used by most mechanics (not wanting to
take a chance on not having rings fully seat and needing to do the work
over) you have the cylinders surface honed and install new rings any time
the piston is removed from the cylinder.
Scott McDaniels RV-6A N64SD 560+ Hrs. Finally Sold!
These opinions and ideas are my own
and do not necessarily reflect the opinions
of my employer.
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Barry/Shelly Hirschberg <hrschbrg(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | RV-6, partially comleted |
Partially completed RV-6 for sale. Kit is in good condition but I do
not have any more time to devote to this project. Empennage is complete
except for glass tip sections. Both wing spars are complete. Right
wing has leading edge completed and mounted including landing light.
Right wing tank completed with minor sealing remaining. Right flap
mostly completed and right aileron skeleton completed with aileron skin
back-riveted. This kit is prior to the pre-punched edition. I do not
have the fuselage or finishing kits. Many tools also available.
Projected is located about 20 miles south of San Francisco. Asking
$7000 OBO. Serious inquiries only please with phone number and best
time to call.
Barry Hirschberg
hrschbrg(at)ix.netcom.com
650-359-3952
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Ammeter <ammeterj(at)seanet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
My guess is that the start relay contacts became 'welded' together. Simply
replace the start relay and you should be ok. I had exactly the same thing
happen to me several years ago. The contacts had stuck together and kept
the circuit closed; starter kept turning after the start key was put back to
off.
Do you have the original starter? I found that, with my gell cell battery
and original starter, that I had to hold the switch on 'start' long enuf for
the prop to go through at least one or two revolutions (very slowly) before
it would fire. That tends to fry the start contacts.
After I replaced the starter with a lightweight starter from that guy in
Florida (name escapes me right now) and replaced the gell cell with an RG
battery the engine turns over much much faster and starts virtually
instantly. Much less stress to the start relay, IMHO.
>
>An odd thing happen to me today, I go to start up
>the -4 and the battery does not have enough umph
>to start it, when I return the key to the off
>position the starter keeps right on going. the
>prop was turning real slow as the battery was going
>down fast. I had to stop the thing by turning off
>the master switch. It has an ACS starter switch,
>and a wicks starter relay. I took the starter
>cable off of the starter and tryed to duplicate
>the problem but everthing worked just fine.
>Any thoughts, ideas, or comments. I cannot have
>the starter turning while the motor is running.
>
>Craig Hiers
>RV-4 N143CH
>
>
>
>
>
John Ammeter
ammeterj(at)seanet.com
Seattle WA USA
1974 1/2 JH-5
RV-6 N16JA (FOR SALE--- Call 206-525-5445 or email for details)
First flight August 1990
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jelford(at)TRANSPORT.COM (Jon Elford) |
| Subject: | Shimming elevator rib |
Listers,
Did anyone else have to build a shim to put between the left elevator root
rib and the rear spar? I fit my elevator skeletons today and mine required
a .063" shim to come out just right. Just curious, but with the shim in
there everything lines up perfect.
Jon Elford
RV6 #25201
Finishing up empennage-
WINGS ON THE WAY!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JDAviator(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
Sounds to me like your stater relay contacts stuck shut, but then dropped out
after you got the power removed.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: More info on dimple tape |
<< I'd love to believe the tape works as promoted, but I tend toward
skepticism. If it's (not) true, we shouldn't have to wait long to see Mr.
Smith's denial in Sport Aviation.
>>
Bill,
I dont recall Mr. Smiths airplane or his name mentioned in the article.
I dont think you have to worry about seeing anything retracted in the sport
aviation magazine regarding this article.Hal isnt the type to bother. I only
call em as I see em. This one came straight from the horses mouth, you can
beleive what you want.
Ryan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
I made little plugs out of plywood and held them in place with West
epoxy.
Steve Soule
RV-6A fuselage in the jig
-----Original Message-----
How might one go about closing the fiberglass tips on the
elevators/rudder
if one were uncomfortable with fiberglass?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
On the same subject ... Can a 160 hp engine run on auto gas?
Steve Soule
RV-6A fuselage forward side skins
Huntington, Vermont
-----Original Message-----
From: lottmc(at)datastar.net [SMTP:lottmc(at)datastar.net]
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 1998 9:49 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: 150 to 160 hp
Can anyone who has boosted their 150 hp 0-320 to 160 h.p, give
me
an estimate on total cost.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug Gray <doug.gray(at)hlos.com.au> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Baffle Ignition Wire Seals |
> BTW, have you seen the really cool stand-offs you can custom make using a
> piece of hose and tie-raps. I have these all over my aircraft on just about
> everything. Each is a perfect fit and they cost pennies (and take seconds)
> each to make.
OK you've got my attention, so tell us more.
Maybe this is another tip I can add to the many I have learned from the
rv-list.
Doug Gray
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fran Malczynski <fmalczy(at)ibm.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Aileron Gap Seal Question |
MAlexan533(at)aol.com wrote:
> Where the aileron gap seals attach to the rear spar, there are the universal
> head 470 rivet heads (attaching the ribs) preventing the gap seal from laying
> flat against the rear spar.
Von, I removed the AD470 rivets that interfered with the aileron gap
fairing; drilled thru the fairing and then put a rivet back in the
holes. Looks a lot nicer then bending that thin aluminum over the rivet
heads. I went back and checked the instructions to see if I could find
where it told me not to put the rivets in until the fairing was
installed, but I couldn't find it anywhere.
Also, the ends of the fairing are supposed to step up onto the brackets.
In my case I cut away about 5/8's on the outboard end, 1/4 on the
inboard end and 1 3/16's deep to have the fairing step up on the
brackets and miss the first two rivets.
Hope this helps.
Fran Malczynski
RV6 (Wings)
Olcott, NY
________________________________________________________________________________
Has anyone thought of or tried riveting strips of .040 to the fuse and lower
cowl. Then rivet nutplates to the top side and screw the upper cowl on.
By the way does anyone have a # where I can order rvator.
installing seats
carey mills
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Lott, Michael" <Michael.Lott(at)ssc.nasa.gov> |
One more question. Once you boost up to 160 from 150 h.p., is it still
legal to run mogas? Thanks.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wingtip Antenna Part I (Long) |
May a non-guru type say something about this comm ant. stuff? I don't know
a thing about radios, ant., lead wires, ground effect etc. but I did install
an ant. on my right wing tip and it worked.
Sometime in about 1992 or 3, a guy that said he designed ant. had an article
in Sports Aviation. He said a cheap bulkhead fitting from Radio Shack, a
piece of coat hanger cut to X length, and a cable from radio shack was all
that was needed. Since I was attempting to see how little I would spend on
my a/c rather than how much, I decided to try it.
Now to show you how dumb I am about this stuff. I hooked up the radio (a
MK11) to the battery, and hooked up what I had hoped to be a push to talk
switch I was going to install on the stick top. When I touched the ptt, the
radio went off as if the power was disconnected. My first thought was that
I had fried the radio. A call to the manuf. and they asked me what kind of
ant did I have on it. None. They laughed at my ignorance and said it had
to have an ant., that to turn the radio off and back on and it would be OK.
I hooked up my coat hanger ant. out of the top of my sheet metal work room.
Expecting full well that all reception would be inverted or backwards,
because all ant that I had seen were pointed down rather than up. Well, I
could talk to people in the traffic pattern at a place 65 miles away, that
seemed good to me.
I installed it in the wing tip and thought that I would be smart for a
change. Bend the wire backwards but leave it so that the wing tip would
compress it about 1 and 1/2 inch so that the crease in the tip would 'hold'
it so that it would not vibrate and cause stress where it was soldered into
the bulkhead fitting. The solder broke because I could not get a good
solder joint with the coat hanger. Got a copper colored welding rod, got a
good joint, installed it. Worked fine. It is still in the a/c.
How well does it do? The best test I've had on it was one day I was south
bound, (ant. on rt. tip) and I talked and received clearly with some one in
the traffic pattern at a field that was 95 miles to the east of me. That is
good enough for me.
Total cost of wire, connector at wing root, bulkhead fitting and welding
rod, about 10.00.
This information of course is for those who are trying to save money on
their a/c, and is definitely not for those who consider the more it cost the
better it is.
Please don't flame me over this as I have no idea why it works, how much
better it would be if I had a 500.00 ant. etc.
If any one is interested in the stock numbers etc of the stuff, let me know
off line and I will try to find the article and post it to you.
And for Bob. I'm not trying to knock what you have said, I feel sure that
there are many who wouldn't think of using a piece of wire for an ant. And
more power to them. Business keeps the world going.
John C Darby Jr.
RV6 N61764 sold
Stephenville TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Blake Harral <bharral(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Aileron Gap Seal Question |
Jim Cimino wrote:
> Von,
> The ribs are supposed to have 426 rivets where the gap seal passes over
> them, you will have to drill out the rivets and install 426's. As far as
> the aileron braket, I left mine long on top and cut it at an angle on the
> end so it would not rest on the braket. Hope this helps.
I did this on my RV-4 - works great. However, if it is not convenientto replace
the universal head rivets, do as shown on early RV-4 plans
and cut relief holes (where the 470 rivet heads will protrude) in the aileron
gap seal.
engine run smooth in cruise? Does it seem to get smoother
on one mag only? Try to isolate the problem.
As far as priming goes, I, nor the other RV's in my hangar have a primer
installed. I never have trouble starting (with a little pre heat) in the
winter. After the engine is cranking I just give a little push on the
throttle and the engine fires.
All RV owners in my hangar have all found the same thing in that you have to
run the engine hard and lean aggressively to avoid plug fouling. What heat
range plugs are you using?
Gary Corde
RV-^ N211GC - NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jpl(at)showpg.mn.org (Joe Larson) |
| Subject: | Re: Still tooling up |
>
> It seems that you just about have the tools that you need and then...!
> I'm at the HS forward spar and see that I need to purchase a drill
> press. I've been looking at various bench top models (Sears 1/3
> hp-8in.,etc.), and am wondering if these are big enough for the needs of
> the pre-punched kits. Any help appreciated once again.Thanks in advance.
I'm building a -6A, not an -8, and mine tail feathers weren't pre-punched.
However, I didn't buy a drill press until I got to the wing, and I only
bought it then 'cause I was having trouble doing a decent job drilling
some of the parts due to my own meager abilities. I'm not sure why you
think you need a drill press.
If it's for lightening holes, you *can* do these with a hand drill IF the
hand drill is variable speed and you can run it pretty slow. Clamp the
work down solidly and work with care.
But I did eventually get a drill press and I love it! It's reasonably
quiet and I can drill better holes.
A lot of guys have said that a bench-top model is good enough. I got a floor
stand model. The variable-height stand can be useful a variable-height table
to hold the other end of your spars when you're working on them. And I
figured if I was going to spend a bunch of money, I might as well get
something that I thought would be more versatile.
I bought mine from Sears. I'm happy with it. It's not a professional grade
drill, but it does a nice job for me.
-Joe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Edward Cole <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutritional aluminum? |
DenClay(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Hi folks
> Now that I have your attention, I am wondering if any of you
> experience the
> taste of aluminum after, say, scotchbriteing by hand for five
> minutes. I do
> often and it makes me pretty certain I am absorbing it thru my skin.
> Metals
> in the bod not good I think. Any Docs out there with an oppinion?
>
Den,
I'm not a doctor but....
I would strongly suggest you wear a good dust mask while scotchbriting
and sanding.
The taste is coming from the dust in the air. The stuff coming off the
scothbrite wheel
is not good to inhale. (I've heard it is a silica) Check you
handkerchief after a short scothbrite session and see what your
nose has filtered out for you!!
Ed Cole
RV6A Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mgilbert(at)ix.netcom.com |
| Subject: | Tool Use Guidance |
I would like some guidance regarding my 2X rivet gun and my Sears 10" variable
power band saw.
I am working on the empenage of my RV6A and am starting on the rudder. Regarding
the 2X gun, I am wondering if I am using the correct air pressure at 55psi.
Unless I slip a piece of paper or rivet tape over the rivet area, I tend to
get a "rash" (not a smiley) on the skin after riveting. I'm guessing that the
"rash" is caused by very slight bouncing of the flush head on the skin. I've
used both the swivel flush head and the fixed one with the rubber edges to the
same effect. Am I using too much air pressure - I would like some guidelines
on that if someone can help.
My other issue relates to the use of the band saw to trim small pieces of aluminum
sheet. The blade (metal 14 teeth per inch) tends to catch the edge of the
sheet just as it is exiting, janking the edge down and distorting it. I had
planned to use the band saw to cut the angles on the stiffners, but now I'm not
sure. I believe the problem is that the sheet is not adequately supported over
the hole where the band saw exits. Any solutions for this problem?
Thanks
Mark Gilbert
Sacramento
RV6A empennage
mgilbert(at)ix.netcom.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bs(at)cbtek.com (Bill Shaw) |
>
> One more question. Once you boost up to 160 from 150 h.p., is it still
> legal to run mogas? Thanks.
Hi Mike -
You can run any kind of fuel you want in an experimental aircraft. However,
the 160HP O-320 is a high compression engine and was designed for 100
octane aviation grade fuel. Sorry about that!
Bill Shaw
ore, CA area
who is doing a lot of rework to his -6A.
He commented on installing the stiffener that you mention and said it
really did provide more strength,
stability and less flexing when it was open. He was glad he did it!
Ed Cole
RV6A Fuselage
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Still tooling up |
-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Larson <jpl(at)showpg.mn.org>
Date: Sunday, February 22, 1998 10:23 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Still tooling up
>
>>
>> It seems that you just about have the tools that you need and then...!
>> I'm at the HS forward spar and see that I need to purchase a drill
>> press. I've been looking at various bench top models (Sears 1/3
>> hp-8in.,etc.), and am wondering if these are big enough for the needs of
>> the pre-punched kits. Any help appreciated once again.Thanks in advance.
>
>I'm building a -6A, not an -8, and mine tail feathers weren't pre-punched.
>However, I didn't buy a drill press until I got to the wing, and I only
>bought it then 'cause I was having trouble doing a decent job drilling
>some of the parts due to my own meager abilities. I'm not sure why you
>think you need a drill press.
>
>-Joe
I bought a real cheap (around $200) floor model "Cal Hawk" drill press at
Menards. A recent post said you should grasp the chuck with quill fully
extended and note side play. My cheapy press has a split bushing with set
screw adjust on the quill so one can take up play -- a nice touch, I think.
A chucked dowel pin indicated a runout of 0.002 which is good enough for me.
There is no appreciable increase in runout with side thrust applied. The
runout is probably all in the chuck and could be fixed with a $250 Alrecht
chuck!
When you get to the fuselage kit you will have instances when you must drill
long (2 inch or more) holes through UHMW plastic blocks, and as usual, the
edge distance is marginal. This will have to be done in someone's drill
press. The recommended technique is to do a very carrel layout job, then
drill half way through from each side. Otherwise the bit wanders through
the plastic. That requires a drill press.
I have to walk into the basement to get to the drill press now, but I still
find myself doing so frequently in spite of having a good assortment of
drill guides for critical holes that need to be perpendicular.
Dennis (tool junkie) Persyk 6A finishing kit
Barrington, IL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Shirley Hobenshield <shobenshield(at)cmsd.bc.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: tip up canopy stiffening |
>
>An RV-6A Tip-up question:
>
>Has the foam/fiberglass/epoxy stiffener proven necessary in actual operational
>experience? I am at the point where if I'm going to do that, the time is now.
>Advice from flying listers appreciated.
>
>Bill
>
>When we were building, we checked out all the tip-ups we could, and after
>seeing those at Vans fly in and comparing, went with the stiffener as we
>felt it added to the structures strength, and included lift struts.
It may not be nessary, but the one time I forgot to lock the canopy and it
popped open on take-off gave me added faith in in its strength. After this
I check the lock faithfuly although It really was not that big a deal. Once
I got the stick between my legs and used both hands to close it I was glad
it was reinforced and would take a good shot of pull!! (I think an open or
partical opening of the canapy acts as an elevator)
Anyway, this is added weight but it has'nt hurt, as a bit of extra
thickness makes a lot less flimzee ness. Good luck!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
-----Original Message-----
From: mgilbert(at)ix.netcom.com <mgilbert(at)ix.netcom.com>
Date: Sunday, February 22, 1998 10:51 AM
Subject: RV-List: Tool Use Guidance
>
>My other issue relates to the use of the band saw to trim small pieces of
aluminum sheet. The blade (metal 14 teeth per inch) tends to catch the edge
of the sheet just as it is exiting, janking the edge down and distorting it.
I had planned to use the band saw to cut the angles on the stiffners, but
now I'm not sure. I believe the problem is that the sheet is not adequately
supported over the hole where the band saw exits. Any solutions for this
problem?
>
>Mark Gilbert
Mark,
I had the same problem with my band saw! I cut a 3/4 plywood piece same
size as table and ran it halfway through so the slot was just one kerf-width
wide. I screwed it to the table with flathead screws and no more grabbing
of thin sheet!
Dennis Persyk 6A finishing kit
Barrington, IL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4flyer(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
As far as your bandsaw is concerned I was tought that the rule of thumb is 1
and 1/2 teeth must be in your material to prevent this. I us about 35 lbs for
my gun .
Eli Lewis Venice, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George McNutt <GMcNutt(at)compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | Tool Use Guidance |
My other issue relates to the use of the band saw to trim small pieces of
aluminum sheet. The blade (metal 14 teeth per inch) tends
to catch the edge of the sheet just as it is exiting, janking the edge down
and distorting it. I had planned to use the ban!
d saw to cut the angles on the stiffners, but now I'm not sure. I believe
the problem is that the sheet is not adequately supported
over the hole where the band saw exits. Any solutions for this problem?
Hi Mark
I also have the Craftsman 10 inch variable speed bandsaw. Other than a lack
of power I have not had any problems with the saw or cutting materials. I
suspect your problem is occuring only on thin (.016) material, one solution
might be to stop the cut about 1/4 inch from the end, turn the material
around and cut in from the other edge to the point where you stopped.
Thicker materials and stiffners should be ok.
Get some scrap aluminum, evestrough facia material or whatever and do some
riveting tests at lower pressures with your 2X gun, try 30 psi. Pressure
gauges may not be very accurate.
Following the plans is great, however overcoming your first mistakes is
what will really give you confidence to finish the project (replacing the
first mis-drilled rib flanges etc etc).
George McNutt, Langley B.C.
6A - Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chester razer <razer(at)midwest.net> |
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
Had exactly the same thing happen to me on a test run of the engine
prior to first flight. I ordered a replacement starter solenoid and
have had no problems since.
chet razer 16.4 hours
--
Abby Razer
Barbara Razer
Molly the Dog and
Chet Razer
razer(at)midwest.net
http://scribers.midwest.net/razer/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Denis Walsh <dwalsh(at)ecentral.com> |
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
I had this happen on my ford ranger pick up which has a very similar
starter to my sky tec. I replaced the starter relay to no avail, I
took the starter to a local rebuild shop and he replaced the solenoid on
the starter. It now works great. Seems to me it would be worth your
while to get the starter checked. There is a great place in Denver.
D Walsh
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Haan <bobh(at)cdac.com> |
| Subject: | Straightening Soft AL Tube |
Does anyone have some tips for how to straighten the soft AL tube used for
the brake lines, fuel vents, etc. You can, of course, do this by hand and
eye ball and the result is ok, but, if there is a better method or process
that yields very straight lengths of this tubing, I would do it.
Bob Haan
bobh(at)cdac.com
Portland, OR
RV6A 24461 Fuse out of jig, working on brakes
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 150 to 160 hp |
Mike,
I just recently overhauled and increased by engine to 160 hp (plain steel
cylinders). The pistons required for a 160 hp O-320 are the same as used on
the O-360. It is possible to replace the old pistons without boring the
cylinders but the high compression pistons are designed to work in choke-bored
cylinders. Since you will need them crosshatched anyway - might as well choke
them. You should check to make sure the cylinders can be bored to only 0.010
over before you order your parts. The 150 hp engines are not choke bored. If
you have the thick-walled piston pins, you might be able to use them -
otherwise get new pins. You will also need some new gaskets. The overhaul
set was $101.
pistons 145
piston pin 130
comp ring (8) Chrome 352
oil ring (4) 71
grind .010 oversize & crosshatch 276
Ken Beene
Burnsville, MN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)traveller.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
mgilbert(at)ix.netcom.com wrote:
>
>
> I would like some guidance regarding my 2X rivet gun and my Sears 10" variable
power band saw.
>
> I am working on the empenage of my RV6A and am starting on the rudder. Regarding
the 2X gun, I am wondering if I am using the correct air pressure at 55psi.
Mark,
55 psi is MUCH too high! For the AD3 rivets, try about 30 lbs. For the
AD4's, 40-45 should be plenty.
> Unless I slip a piece of paper or rivet tape over the rivet area, I tend to
get a "rash" (not a smiley) on the skin after riveting. I'm guessing that the
"rash" is caused by very slight bouncing of the flush head on the skin. I've
used both the swivel flush head and the fixed one with the rubber edges to the
same effect. Am I using too much air pressure - I would like some guidelines
on that if someone can help.
Unless the skin is getting beat up, don't worry about cosmetic blemishes
due to riveting. You know what the first step is for most paint methods?
Scotchbrite. Yep, you are going to rub the entire plane with Scotchbrite
pads and all those blems are going to dissappear. Don't get too torqued
about how the skin looks to the RV "inspectors" that wander into the
shop! :-)
> My other issue relates to the use of the band saw to trim small pieces of aluminum
sheet. The blade (metal 14 teeth per inch) tends to catch the edge of the
sheet just as it is exiting, janking the edge down and distorting it. I had
planned to use the band saw to cut the angles on the stiffners, but now I'm
not sure. I believe the problem is that the sheet is not adequately supported
over the hole where the band saw exits. Any solutions for this problem?
I cut my stiffeners with snips, angles and all. Make one stiffener as a
pattern, trace the outline on the angle stock, and cut out with snips. A
few seconds of deburring with the Scotchbrite wheel, and the stiffeners
are completed. Using the saw seems like a lot of work.
You may want to check out the photos in my construction log:
http://www.ath.tis.net/~sbuc/rv6
Good luck!
Sam Buchanan
sbuc(at)traveller.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Starting 160 0-320 |
<<
Would like so imfo from those who may have some exp. with problem starting
the 160 hp 320. Mine fowls plugs 25 hrs on 100LL, cranks longer than I
think it should and then back-fires when It catches.
I have 3 lines on the electric primer, and after turning the elect. fuel
pump on for some 5 to 10 sec. I usually hold the primer for 3 sec if the
outside temp is 50 to 70 deg. I also have my throttle set at 1000rpm.
I do lean on all flights above 3000ft .
As I am not into timing, I trusted an AME to set the timing.
The cyl heads are normal and so are the egts. Sometimes I wonder if I
should be running the engine harder as I am somewhat under proped???,
Usually get a cruise of 140kts 3000ft and 2350rpm ( GPS ).
Thanks for input in advance. Ed Hobenshield RV-6 Flying
>>
ED,
For starters recheck that timming. Second you need to make sure that you
are starting on the LH mag only! The right Mag should be inhibited durring the
start if it isnt you will get kick back or backfiring. Next if you are running
a carburated engine you shouldnt require any prime at those temps. If you do
require a prime 3 seconds is to much. I usually give it a one second burst and
if it doesent take the first time give it another 1 second shot. If your plugs
are fowling in 25 hrs you first need to make sure you have the right plugs for
your engine. Next you need to make sure they are gapped properly . If you do
and they are you may want to consider a little more agressive leaning
especially at that low RPM setting. Good luck Ed, hopefully this will steer
you in the right dirrection.
Ryan Bendure
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jelford(at)TRANSPORT.COM (Jon Elford) |
| Subject: | Tool Use Guidance |
>I am working on the empenage of my RV6A and am starting on the rudder.
Regarding the 2X gun, I am wondering if I am using the correct air pressure
at 55psi. Unless I slip a piece of paper or rivet tape over the rivet area,
I tend to get a "rash" (not a smiley) on the skin after riveting. I'm
guessing that the "rash" is caused by very slight bouncing of the flush head
on the skin. I've used both the swivel flush head and the fixed one with
the rubber edges to the same effect. Am I using too much air pressure - I
would like some guidelines on that if someone can help.
Mark,
Are you front-riveting your stiffener to the rudder skin? If so, I would
strongly recommend that you back-rivet them. The .016" skin is sooo thin
and it is easy to damage it. Besides, back-riveting on the control surface
skins is extremely easy, fool-proof and you get no rash like you describe.
As for the air pressure, it sound pretty high. I don't have a gauge on my
air system, but I set my air pressure so that my gun will set the rivet with
about a 1 second drive time on the -3 rivets when back-riveting. You want
to set the rivet as quickly as is practical so as not to work-harden it by
excessive drive time, but 55 psi SOUNDS a bit high. I could be way out in
left field on this, though because I don't have a gauge on my air lines.
Mine is a Taylor 3X gun also, so maybe a 2X does require more pressure.
Jon Elford
RV6 #25201
Finishing up empennage-
WINGS ON THE WAY!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ray Murphy, Jr." <murphy(at)mail.coos.or.us> |
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
My wife got me a CP 214 Pneumatic squeezer for my birthday. It is the
double piston one and I should be able to squeeze the wing spar rivets with
it. My question is what working pressure should I use with it? She bought
me a used one and it did not come with any instructions. I've done some
practice rivets with it using 90psi. I also purchased the avery adjustable
squeezer set for the pneumatic squeezer. It works great!! Any help will be
appreciated.
Ray and Nancy Murphy
murphy(at)mail.coos.or.us
RV6A empenage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "robert dziewiontkoski" <dzflyer(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Straightening Soft AL Tube |
Try this: place the aluminum tubing on a flat work bench. On top of the
tubing place a long enough piece of 1x6 or 1x8. Roll the board back and
forth over the work bench (and tubing) applying just enough pressure to
straighten the tubing with out crushing it.. Hope this helps.
-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Haan <bobh(at)cdac.com>
Date: Sunday, February 22, 1998 1:01 PM
Subject: RV-List: Straightening Soft AL Tube
>
>Does anyone have some tips for how to straighten the soft AL tube
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Straightening Soft AL Tube |
BOB. WHEN I BUILT MY RV4 I WOULD STRAIGHTEN THE TUBE AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE BY
HAND. THEN I WOULD LAY IT ON THE KITCHEN COUNTER WITH A SMOOTH BOARD ON TOP
OF IT TO SANDWICH THE TUBE BETWEEN THE COUNTER TOP AND THE BOARD. THEN ROLL
IT BACK AND FORTH TILL IT IS WHERE YOU WANT IT. ONE WORD OF CAUTION :::::
THIS CAN BE VERY HAZARDOUS TO YOUR HEALTH IF YOU DO IT IN THE PRESENCE OF YOUR
WIFE. WAIT TILL SHE IS GONE SHOPPING, AND IF SHE SAYS SOMETHING ABOUT THE
SCRATCHES BLAME IT ON THE CAT. RICK BELL RV4 #729 N83RB "AIR MARGARITAVILLE
EXPRESS".
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Tie-wrap stand-offs |
Gary,
This is an old UL trick and it works great even with a 2 stroker rattling at
6000 RPM. I had a friend who just finished his kitfox an the inspector did
like tie wraps anywhere!
I think this is dumb, has anyone else run into this?
Bernie Kerr, fuselage 6A, SE Fla
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bryan93095(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
>>My wife got me a CP 214 Pneumatic squeezer for my birthday. It is the
double piston one and I should be able to squeeze the wing spar rivets with
it. My question is what working pressure should I use with it?>>
Ray, I'm not sure why you would want anything but the full pressure available
to you from your system. You want the squeezer to make a full stroke each
time for consistancy. You will set the resulting height of your rivet with
the adjustable set. Start wide and adjust down so you don't overset. I agree
they really work great.
Jim Bryan RV-4 Canopy Frame (*%$#@).
Bryan93095(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
Phil,
I made the change from tip-up to slider at the stage when my fusulage was
about to be talen off the jig.
No major problems in the switch, but you have to check the parts needed
yourself.
As well as the canopy frame , you deed top decking , ribs and new panel, plus
other bits and pieces.
I'm sure there is an aftermarket by now for Van to supply the conversion kit
against one part number !
RV6a/O-360, well on the way.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
On a normal length hose 50 Ft I use about 28 to 35 lbs of pressure for flush
rivets
on the skins. Give the lower pressure a try - use a peice of scrap to
practice.
Good Luck
BSivori(at)AOL.COM
N929 RV ( Reserved )
Wing's in the Jigs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JNice51355(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Tie-wrap stand-offs |
<< Put a wire/hose on one side of the stand-off hose and the
other wire/hose on the other side. Take a tie-wrap and run it over the
wire/hose, through the insde of the stand-off hose, around the other
wire/hose
and back through the inside of the stand-off hose. >>
Not to be a smart alec, but those using tie wraps, please use caution(check
their condition regularly) They do not do well around solvents, oils, and
especially UV rays.
Jim Nice
RV6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joe Rex" <jfr(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Vertical Card Compass |
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At the risk of bringing up a subject well discussed on the list, I am =
seeking opinions on the vertical card compass. A search of the archive =
netted mixed reviews, with some of the postings being fairly old. I =
would be especially interested in the experiences of anyone who has =
panel mounted the compass in the -4. Thank you.
Joe Rex
RV-4 Fuselage
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bringing up a subject well=20
discussed on the list, I am seeking opinions on the vertical card =
compass.+ACY-nbsp+ADs-=20
A search of the archive netted mixed reviews, with some of the postings =
being=20
fairly old.+ACY-nbsp+ADs- I would be especially interested in the =
experiences of anyone=20
who has panel mounted the compass in the -4.+ACY-nbsp+ADs- Thank =
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jerry calvert <calverjl(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
mgilbert(at)ix.netcom.com wrote:
>
>
> I would like some guidance regarding my 2X rivet gun and my Sears 10" variable
power band saw.
>
> I am working on the empenage of my RV6A and am starting on the rudder. Regarding
the 2X gun, I am wondering if I am using the correct air pressure at 55psi.
Unless I slip a piece of paper or rivet tape over the rivet area, I tend to
get a "rash" (not a smiley) on the skin after riveting. I'm guessing that the
"rash" is caused by very slight bouncing of the flush head on the skin. I've
used both the swivel flush head and the fixed one with the rubber edges to
the same effect. Am I using too
>
> My other issue relates to the use of the band saw to trim small pieces of aluminum
sheet. The blade (metal 14 teeth per inch) tends to catch the edge of the
sheet just as it is exiting, janking the edge down and distorting it. I had
planned to use the band saw to cut the angles on the stiffners, but now I'm
not sure. I believe the problem is that the sheet is not adequately supported
over the hole where the band saw exits. Any solutions for this problem?
>
> Thanks
>
> Mark Gilbert
> Sacramento
> RV6A empennage
> mgilbert(at)ix.netcom.com
>
Mark,
I use a single speed 10" band saw(Tradesman) with the Sears 14 teeth per
inch non-ferrous metal blade and do not have the problem that you are
experiencing. If you have tried to cut a harder metal with that blade,
it may have dulled some teeth and they may be grabbing instead of
cutting. If the blade is not the problem, try cutting at full speed
which is what mine does without any problem. I recently cut my rudder
stiffners and have no distortion.
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok
-6a Emp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wingtip Antenna Part II (long) |
<< the nominal
150 ohms of the two-element dipole. >>
I don't doubt from the foregoing discussion that you are in a position to know
what you are talking about on the subject of antennas. But: two-element
dipole sounds redundant, and 150 ohms sounds wrong. When I took my amateur
exams 20 yrs ago the correct answer for the characteristic impedance of a
dipole was 72 ohms, a quarter-wave monopole half that at 36 ohms, and a single
element full wave loop was 300 or so. Start adding passive elements and the
numbers do weird things, and 150 ohms may be among them, but I don't think
you'll encounter this value on the feedpoint side of an aviation antenna of
ordinary design. Standard disclaimer applies: "correct me if I'm wrong." My
construction experience is limited to the spectrum from 1.8 to 432 Mhz at 14
elements or less...
Bill B
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pmartin Compaq" <martin(at)gbonline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass Tips |
Dear Bill,
I am building an RV8,currently at final fuselage stage, however when I
finished my empennage, I had to wait about a month form my wing kit. I did
not like the fiberglass tips Van supplied, so I made a set of aluminum tips
for my empennage. It is not difficult, but does take a little time.
Following is a brief description, If you would like complete details, call
me and I will explain in complete detail. Begin by making a hardwood male
form that is exactly the size of the finished tip less the thickness of the
metal used. 032 type 3003 (ordinary sheetmetal shop aluminum) works well.
After you have the wood form made, you hand form the aluminum over the wood
form. You have to slit the leading edge parallel to the line of flight,
because you can't form it over that short of a radius. You will have to
heat and anneal the aluminum several times inorder to shrink the bulges out
that will result from forming. After it is formed you must weld the
leading edge where it was slit. When welding is complete, you will have to
grind off excess weld and also trim tip to final shape. The tips are butted
to the empennage and attached with 4-40 screws and blind nuts. It was a
fun project and the aluminum tips look and fit better that any fiberglass
tips I have seen. For more detailed info call me at number listed.
Dick Martin
RV8 N233M Fuselage almost done received finish kit last wednesday
920 432 4845 Mornings cst
----------
> From: pagan <pagan(at)CBOSS.COM>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Fiberglass Tips
> Date: Sunday, February 22, 1998 7:45 AM
>
>
> How might one go about closing the fiberglass tips on the
elevators/rudder
> if one were uncomfortable with fiberglass? I've been playing around with
> an aluminum cap but it is difficult at best to form and then what? rivet
in
> place? How about some discussion....inquiring minds want to know!!!
>
> Bill Pagan
> 80555
> waiting on the wings
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BStobbe <coro_01(at)weblabs.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wingtip Antenna Part I (Long) |
>May a non-guru type say something about this comm ant. stuff? I don't know
>a thing about radios, ant., lead wires, ground effect etc. but I did install
>an ant. on my right wing tip and it worked.
snip
John,
This is *exactly* what I've been looking for. Can you provide some details
as to the length of wire you used for the antennna and the geometry of it's
mounting, etc.?
Also, do you remember if there were any problems with reception either way
if the station was directly in front of, or behind you?
If the article is not too long, or if interest is sufficient, maybe you
could post it to the list. Otherwise, please email me the article if you
are able to find it. Thanks.
Bruce Stobbe
RV-6
rigging rudder pedals/cables
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JDaniel343(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | New Tool Company |
My Name is John L Danielson and I would like to take this time to introduce
you to JLD AirCraft Tools. JLD AirCraft Tools is a small startup mail-order
company located in Burnsville, MN and is dedicated to providing quality new
and pre-owned specialty tools used in the construction of experimental
aircraft.
JLD AirCraft Tools provides the builder of experimental aircraft a shopping
source for tools required during the construction process of aluminum kit and
plan built aircraft
JLD AirCraft Tools intends to target the builder of kits produced by Vans
AirCraft, Inc., the Glasstar produced by Stoddard-Hamilton, Zenair line of
AirCraft and plan built AirCraft such as the Thorp T-18 and S-18, and the
Mustang II to name just a few, but our main focus is on RV Aircraft. I myself
am an RV-6A builder.
A list of some of the tools offered by JLD AirCraft Tools is shown below. A
sampling of these tools include assorted pneumatic drills, pneumatic rivet
guns, pneumatic rivet squeezers, counter sink cages, countersink cutters and
various de-burring tools, clecos, cleco clamps, and drill bits.
JLD AirCraft Tools is setting itself apart from other companies in that we
will be offering quality pre-owned tools when they are available. Quality
pneumatic drills, pneumatic rivet guns and pneumatic rivet squeezers can be
priced out of the reach of most aircraft builders. RV builders are trying to
save money not invest large sums on the purchase of tools to build one
aircraft.
As an example a quality new Souix Pneumatic 1/4" or 3/8" drill can cost
between $250.00 and $300.00, a Cleco brand pneumatic rivet gun can run $250.00
to $350.00 new, and a Chicago Pneumatic brand rivet squeezer can run $850.00
to $1000.00. JLD AirCraft Tools can sell a quality pre-owned tool as described
above for far less than what a new tool will sell for. An example would be a
Chicago Pneumatic Rivet Sqeezer which retails for $899.00, JLD AirCraft Tools
can provide a serviceable tools to builders for $250.00 to $350.00.
As one can see, JLD AirCraft Tools can provide quality pre-owned tools to its
customers at a substantial savings. The tools sold are in serviceable
condition. These tools may not be suitable for production line assembly work
but are more than adequate for the minimal use by builders constructing one or
two aircraft
JLD AirCraft Tools also has tools for rent, such as a 5X Rivet Gun ($25.00 per
2 weeks), Large Pneumatic Squeezer ($40.00 for 2 weeks), both for doing wing
spars. I also will rent the small #214 Type Pneumatic Rivet Squeezer (general
purpose) for ($30.00 per 2 weeks). This gives the builder a chance to try
before you buy. All rental payments will go toward the purchase of these
tools.
Another consideration is to shipping costs. If you live in the Minneapolis
area
JLD AirCraft Tools will deliver your order personally to your door.
JLD Aircraft Tools
13020 Welcome Lane
Burnsville, MN 55337
1-612-808-9718
Fax: 1-612-808-9718
E-mail : Jdaniel343(at)aol.co
PNEUMATIC TOOLS
2x or 3x Taylor Rivet Gun (new) $165.00
1X or 2X Rivet Gun (used ) $75.00
3X Rivet Gun (used ) $110.00
5X Rivet Gun (used ) $115.00
1/4" Nova Drill 1.25lbs. (2800 rpm) $120.00
1/4" Drill (used ) $75.00
1/4" Taylor Mini Palm Drill 1.25 lbs. $100.00
3/8" Taylor Drill (new ) $60.00
1/4" Taylor Die Grinder (new ) $50.00
1/4" Taylor 90 deg. Die Grinder $80.00
USED PNEUMATIC RIVET SQUEEZERS
#214 Type w/yoke $275.00
#351 Type w/yoke $300.00
RIVET SETS
New Used
3" Straight or Offset $7.50 $3.50
5" Straight or Offset $10.00 $5.00
7" Straight or Offset $10.00 $5.00
Flush Set w/Rubber Guard $11.00
Squeeze Set (#40,#30,#21,#10,1/4" & Flush ) $21.00
CLECO AND CLECO TOOLS
Cleco Pliers $5.00
Clecos #40, #30, #21, #10 & 1/4" (new per. Doz ) $4.80
Clecos #40, #30, #21, #10 & 1/4" (used per. Doz ) $3.80
Side Clamp Cleco's (1 inch) $2.00 ea.
DRILLING TOOLS
Drill Stop Set (#40, #30, #21, #10 & 1/4") $8.00
Drill Stops Indvidual (#40, #30, #21, #10 & 1/4") $2.00
Piloted Countersinks (#40, #30, #21, #10 & 1/4") $14.50
Piloted Countersinks (above sizes - used ) $2.00
Micro-Stop Countersink Cage w/Nylon Foot $23.00
Heavy Duty Micro-Stop Countersink Cage $41.00
Stop Countersink Cage wo/Nylon Foot $20.00
DRILL BITS
JOBBER LENGTH NATIONAL AEROSPACE STD. 907
TYPE J COBALT - 135 DEG. SPLIT POINT
#41 $1.00
#40 $1.00
#30 $1.15
#21 $1.20
#10 $1.50
3/16" $1.40
.1/4 " $1.85
All Sizes Available - Please Call For Pricing
6" AND 12" TYPE J COBALT - 135 DEG. SPLIT POINT
6" 12"
#40 $2.00 $ 5.00
#30 $2.10 $ 5.00
#21 $2.50 $ 5.00
#10 $2.75 $ 5.60
3/16" $2.50 $ 5.00
.1/4" $3.00 $ 6.00
All items are sold with the understanding that the end user shall determine
suitability of the product for his or her intended use and assume all risk and
liability in connection with that use.
Pricing in this list is good for 30 days, availability will be determined at
time of order.
Please E-mail Jdaniel343(at)aol.com for a Free Brochure.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: N1GV First Flights |
<< OK, Gary,
I see where you snuck in a comment about "only one hour in the air" in a
posting.
Don't hold back! You've had three possible days to dodge rain showers.
How did she fly? I can guess from your workmanship that she flew without
a hitch. Correct?? >>
Ed-
My test pilot (Ken Coe) took it up last Wed and flew the first hour. I got
another 1.3 hr on it today (Sun). It is such a cool plane and it handles so
well that I'm still up there in the clouds. There were only little glitches
that were cleared up yesterday and, now that I've done the first oil change
today, there's not much to do for the next 23.7 hrs but fly the heck out of
it.
The plane is everything you've heard and then some. Thanks for your support
and now get to work on your beast. I'll let you know when the test period is
over.
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Straightening Soft AL Tube |
<< if there is a better method or process
that yields very straight lengths of this tubing, I would do it. >>
You can buy straight lengths of 5052-0 tubing from ACS. I don't like to use
the coiled 3003-0 Versatube. I tossed it.
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MoeJoe <moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net> |
| Subject: | Oh no, not another primer question! |
I finally got around to finishing my HS tonight, and I noticed alot of
scuff marks on the interior skeleton while inspecting with a mirror.
These marks were no doubt caused by my clumsy bucking bar beating the
hell out of the interior. I keep telling it about leaping out of my
hand, but I think it's afraid of the rivet gun. What do all the primer
gurus do about these scuff marks? Do you just leave them bare, or do you
try to shoot more primer inside? Since I'm using spray cans, I chose the
latter, but what about the guys who have to drag out the hoses and
mixing cans? Or am I the only one who is a total clutz with the bucking
bar?
Anyone have any thoughts on storing my first real airplane part? Should
I just hang it on the wall, or should I take it home and put it in the
attic? Should I attach antlers to it and hang it over the mantle? When
should I attach my fiberglass tips?
BTW, I squeeze the last rivet, and start peeling off the plastic wrap
with the aid of a hairdryer, anxious to see how shiny and neat it will
look, and my compressor kicks on, tripping a breaker somewhere and the
lights go out. I'm renting space in a printshop, so I didn't want to go
flipping switches, so it looks like I'll have to wait until tommorrow.
Just my luck...
Moe Colontonio
RV-8 VS :)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles T. Brietigam" <brietig(at)ibm.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
Ray Murphy, Jr. wrote:
>
>
> My wife got me a CP 214 Pneumatic squeezer for my birthday. .
>
> Ray and Nancy Murphy
> murphy(at)mail.coos.or.us
> RV6A empenage
> Ray, I would strongly recommend not using more than 100 PSI. Doing so
> may cause your wonderful wife's gift to come apart. You may find many
> needle bearings laying around your work area. Trust me, I have
> personal experience in this area.
Chuck Brietigam, RV-3 nearing paint
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Flying Phil's Circus" <sisson(at)ctnet.net> |
RVGEM(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Phil,
>
> I made the change from tip-up to slider at the stage when my fusulage
> was
> about to be talen off the jig.
>
> No major problems in the switch, but you have to check the parts
> needed
> yourself.
>
> As well as the canopy frame , you deed top decking , ribs and new
> panel, plus
> other bits and pieces.
>
> I'm sure there is an aftermarket by now for Van to supply the
> conversion kit
> against one part number !
>
> RV6a/O-360, well on the way.
>
thanks for the reply, I'm gonna do it, Phil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles T. Brietigam" <brietig(at)ibm.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 150 to 160 hp |
Michael C. Lott wrote:
>
> Can anyone who has boosted their 150 hp 0-320 to 160 h.p........
> Thanks.
> Michael.
> Michael, if you're considering pumping up your horse power, you might
> look at using H2AD pistons. They have a 9.0 compression ratio but
> require 100LL. The standard 160 HP pistons have 8.5 CR while your
> 150HP pistons have 7.0 CR .
> Chuck Brietigam. RV-3 nearing paint.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David A. Barnhart" <barnhart(at)a.crl.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tie-wrap stand-offs |
>This is an old UL trick and it works great even with a 2 stroker rattling at
>6000 RPM. I had a friend who just finished his kitfox an the inspector did
>like tie wraps anywhere!
>I think this is dumb, has anyone else run into this?
I'm a little confused as to what is being referred to here as 'dumb'. The
tie-wraps and stand-offs or the inspector?
As for the technique described by Gary Corde of using a short length of
hose between tie-wraps as a stand-off, it is a valid, accepted practice.
It works well for preventing two adjacent lines, hoses, etc from chafing.
Yes, you need to inspect the tie wraps regularly, but the same thing can be
said for everything else in the engine compartment.
Best Regards,
dave Barnhart
RV-6 sn 23744 N601DB
almost flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Aileron pushrod air seals |
| From: | ebundy(at)juno.com (Ed Bundy) |
>A few nights ago, when just about to take the scissors to a beautiful
>and expensive chamois, I had a sudden inspiration which netted me a
refund
>a heap. (I keep a messy shop.) I considered that Tyvek is cheap,
>abundant, airtight, lightweight, easily cut, and in this case, presewn
into a
I think Tyvek would be a good material for this. I have heard people
mention chamois in the past, but I have to wonder whether moisture might
get into this area when flying in the rain. I wouldn't want chamois
soaking up moisture and getting heavy, or trapping moisture against the
control rod, or freezing - yikes!
I ended up using nylon fabric that is termed "F111" by the parachute
industry. It is extremely light, waterproof and virtually airtight (it's
used to make parachutes) I have access to scraps of this material, but
I've also seen it at Walmart in the sale fabric bin for $1/yd. I've
finished sewing the boots (thanks Fred) and I plan to install them this
week. If you go looking for it, The Walmart fabric lady probably will
have no idea what F111 is, so just look for a very sheer, single color
nylon fabric with a tightly spaced horizontal/vertical grid of fibers
running through it.
Ed Bundy RV6A - Eagle, ID - first flight 11/20/96
ebundy@juno.com - http://members.aol.com/rv67em/
--
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JamesCone(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
You can cut the stiffeners with a heavy duty pair of sissors just like paper.
Nothing to it.
Jim Cone
jamescone(at)aol.com
RV-6A flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WILLMINCEY(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
Craig,
funny you should have the identical problem i had on saturday with my glasair
w/150 lyco. I tapped the starter relay and that solved the problem, i think.
I did get a new relay but i flew/cranked the engine 5-6 times today and it
worked great. I won't replace the relay unless it bites me again.
will mincey @ aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
<< From: mgilbert(at)ix.netcom.com
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: Tool Use Guidance
Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 10:41:40 -0600 (CST)
Message-ID: <1998221204245741(at)ix.netcom.com>
I would like some guidance regarding my 2X rivet gun and my Sears 10"
variable power band saw.
I am working on the empenage of my RV6A and am starting on the rudder.
Regarding the 2X gun, I am wondering if I am using the correct air
pressure at 55psi. (snip)
Am I using too much air pressure - I would like some guidelines on that if
someone
can help.>>
What worked best for me was five hits of the rivet gun to set the rivet. Set
the regulator pressure on your air line to the rivet gun so you get the five
hits with the trigger full squeezed, and the rivet is properly set. With my
rivet gun on a 3/32" rivet, it's 30 psi. On a 1/8" rivet, it's 35 psi.
The pressure you set it at will depend on your gun and pressure gage.
BTW, I already know that Van, and others, don't recommend it this way. It's a
technique that was developed, and apparently forgotten, before their time.
<<
My other issue relates to the use of the band saw to trim small pieces of
aluminum sheet. The blade (metal 14 teeth per inch) (Snip)
Any solutions for this problem?
Thanks
Mark Gilbert
Sacramento
RV6A empennage
mgilbert(at)ix.netcom.com >>
Aluminum saws best with a skip-tooth blade. I'm using a blade with 6 teeth
per inch. Cuts thin sheet or extrusions without loading up. Use beewax to
help there. And wear hearing protection. It's very noisey.
Jim Ayers
LesDrag(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Starting 160 0-320 |
| From: | rvpilot(at)juno.com (William R. Davis Jr) |
ED,
The guys have sent you a lot of good advice, I would just like to add a
couple of points,
Two strokes of the throttle should be plenty of prime at those temps. Lay
off the primer unless it gets really cold. As for the plug fouling, I
think it would benefit you to lean much more agressivly. Forget about
that" textbook" 3000', you can lean at any altitude after you have
leveled out and set up for cruising. Most of all, leave your mixture at
the leaned out setting when decending to land, right up to the time when
you shut her down ( unless of course you have to go around- then
immediate full rich ).
Best regards, Bill , RV4, N66WD, A&P
_____________________________________________________________________
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leo Davies <leo(at)icn.su.OZ.AU> |
| Subject: | aluminium/alzheimers/RF/brain tumour |
Dear List,
I hesitate to reply to someone's request about these topics and would hate
to soak up a lot of bandwidth. The issues are complex and emotive. What I
can say is that based on my reading of the literature,
1. I don't worry about aluminium and Alzheimer's disease
2. I don't worry about RF radiation and brain tumours.
I am an academic neurologist with teaching hospital and university
appointments in Australia, US training and appointments at Harvard/MGH.
I do wear safety glasses. I do wear a dust mask when I'm making a lot of dust.
Happy building,
Leo Davies
r. Do I just attach the thin (.020) gap seal by
just
bending it over the protruding rivets and riveting in between? Hope you can
make sense of this. Also on the ends, the gap seal rests up on the aileron
brackets. The plans call for 52" on the gap seal, the part is actually 52
1/4". Is it supposed to rest on these brackets?
Thanks.
Von Alexander
RV-8#544
MAlexan533(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Straightening Soft AL Tube |
| From: | smcdaniels(at)juno.com (SCOTT R MCDANIELS) |
>
>Does anyone have some tips for how to straighten the soft AL tube used
>for
>the brake lines, fuel vents, etc. You can, of course, do this by hand
>and
>eye ball and the result is ok, but, if there is a better method or
>process
>that yields very straight lengths of this tubing, I would do it.
>
>
>Bob Haan
>bobh(at)cdac.com
>Portland, OR
>RV6A 24461 Fuse out of jig, working on brakes
>
>
>
What I do is take the roll and unroll it against the floor or a table
top.
This will leave a slight curve in the tube. To remove this you put a
small rag around the tube and then your hand on the rag.
Draw the tube through your hand a couple of times while you put bending
pressure on it in the direction to straighten it, and it will
you can make it look like it was never rolled.
Scott McDaniels RV-6A N64SD 560+ Hrs. Finally Sold!
These opinions and ideas are my own
and do not necessarily reflect the opinions
of my employer.
_____________________________________________________________________
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "JimNolan" <JimNolan(at)kconline.com> |
People,
I need to know something. Can I use the long reach Spark Plugs designed
to reduce lead fouling in 150 hp lycomings using 100ll, in my 160 hp lycoming
after I do the overhaul.
I used to get lead fouling in my 150 hp until I went to these plugs. (
forget
the number) Will these plugs work in a 160 hp engine. Thanks
Jim ( I think it had a BY37 in the number)
N444JN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Graham Jones <gratech(at)acslink.aone.net.au> |
| Subject: | Re: Still tooling up |
Marc,
When I asked my Tech Counsellor about a drill press he recommended one that turned
as low as 200-220 RPM as this is the best speed to cut large holes in alloy sheet
with a fly cutter/hole saw. When looking for one I saw lots that went down to
4-500 and 600 RPM but eventually one that went to 250 RPM. They all go plenty
fast enough at the other end of the scale.....
Hope this helps
Graham Jones
-6A Empennage & Tool room set up....
marc hanson wrote:
> I'm at the HS forward spar and see that I need to purchase a drill
> press. I've been looking at various bench top models
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pmartin Compaq" <martin(at)gbonline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Straightening Soft AL Tube |
Dear Bob,
Simply lay the tube on any large flat surface, (table, floor etc) and then
lay a long board (3/4" x 6") parallel to the tube and move the board back
and forth at right angles to the tube and press down at the same time.
After a couple of these motions you will notice that the tube will be
almost perfectly straight.
Dick Martin
RV8 N233M fuselage almost done
----------
> From: Bob Haan <bobh(at)cdac.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Straightening Soft AL Tube
> Date: Sunday, February 22, 1998 12:51 PM
>
>
> Does anyone have some tips for how to straighten the soft AL tube used
for
> the brake lines, fuel vents, etc. You can, of course, do this by hand
and
> eye ball and the result is ok, but, if there is a better method or
process
> that yields very straight lengths of this tubing, I would do it.
>
>
> Bob Haan
> bobh(at)cdac.com
> Portland, OR
> RV6A 24461 Fuse out of jig, working on brakes
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott) |
| Subject: | Re: Vertical Card Compass |
I just panel mounted a vertical card compass in my -4 a few weeks
ago. I was hesitant to do it because I heard so much negative
talk from people. Mine vibrates a little bit, but, not enough to
hinder the readings at all. It follows normal rate turns very
well with no noticable lead or lag. When you stop a turn it is
"right there". If I do steep turns, then it has a tendency to
hang and try to catch up when I level off. I am glad I got it.
It is replacing a dg in my panel. It is the non tso'd version
Gulf Coast Avionics sell for 190.00. It doesn't seem to be
affected at all from the electrical items in the plane. It is
100 times better than the regular compass I had before.
Sometimes you have to listen to others advice,then make up your
own mind. See ya. Michael
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott) |
Thanks to all who responded to my h.p. boost question. Michael
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott) |
| Subject: | Re: 150 to 160 hp |
Hi Charles,
I have a H2AD sitting in my shop for possible later use. I would
have to get the books out to see if any of those parts (pistons,
etc.) are interchangable. Thanks. Michael
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Boris <smbr(at)digital.net> |
Carey,
I have seen this on several -4's and -6's and plan to screw on the top
cowl. It isn't as pretty as the smoother wire & hinges. But, I want to
be able to easily open up the top for inspection. The lower cowl will
attatch to the fuse by wire & hinge.
Boris Robinson
RV-4 drilling fuse skins.
> Has anyone thought of or tried riveting strips of .040 to the fuse and lower
> cowl. Then rivet nutplates to the top side and screw the upper cowl on.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Louis Willig <larywil(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Starting 160 0-320 |
>--> RV-List message posted by: rvpilot(at)juno.com (William R. Davis
Jr)
Most of all, leave your mixture at the leaned out setting when
descending to land, right up to the time when you shut her down ( unless
of course you have to go around- then immediate full rich ).
>
>Best regards, Bill , RV4,=A0 N66WD, A&P
Bill,
I have never heard of doing this and, in fact, was taught to work back to
full rich as I descend to land. My experiences have shown that I
can do what you say. Its just my phantom instructors who
make me push the red knob all thew way in. Is your advice an accepted,
approved procedure?
Also, it should be noted that the term fouled plugs should include
the type of fouling. If your fouling is of the carbon variety, then you
should lean more aggressively. If the fouling is from metal (lead) you
may be pushing in the throttle too rapidly. A quick push of the throttle
leaves a lead residue that does not have time to burn off , and very well
may never burn off.=20
Louis I. Willig
larywil(at)home.com
(610) 668-4964
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Tie-wrap stand-offs |
<< Not to be a smart alec, but those using tie wraps, please use caution(check
their condition regularly) They do not do well around solvents, oils, and
especially UV ray >>
Thats an interesting observation. Maybe I've just been lucky with tie wraps,
but I've used them to attach fiberglass engine baffles where it is warm( not
hot, hot), oily, abrasive, and a ton of mechanical excitation and they seem to
last forever.
Bernie Kerr
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Tie-wrap stand-offs |
<< I'm a little confused as to what is being referred to here as 'dumb'. The
tie-wraps and stand-offs or the inspector? >>
Sorry for the vague answer. I thought it was clear that I thought the tie
wraps worked in a lot of places and it was Dumb for the inspector to be so
adamant about making stand offs.
Bernie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carroll Bird <catbird(at)taylortel.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Straightening Soft AL Tube |
> Does anyone have some tips for how to straighten the soft AL tube used for
>
Try pushing a .090 hingepin through the 1/4" tube as you straighen it. On the 3/8"
tube I had a peice of 3/16" cold rolled rod laying around, and it works well for
this. There will be some ripples in the tube but it is good enough for fuel lines
etc.Carroll---
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Shimming elevator rib |
| From: | lm4(at)juno.com (Larry Mac Donald) |
Listers,
Did anyone else have to build a shim to put between the left elevator
root rib and the rear spar? I fit my elevator skeletons today and mine
required a .063" shim to come out just right. Just curious, but with the
shim in there everything lines up perfect.
>Jon Elford
Yes John,
The exact same condition on my kit. Exact same solution.
Larry Mac Donald
_____________________________________________________________________
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Harrill <KHarrill(at)osa.state.sc.us> |
Steve,
The 160 HP O-320 engines are certified to use 91 octane aviation fuel,
except for the "H" engine. Some 160 HP engine/airframe combinations
have STC's to use premium auto fuel, e.g. some models of Piper
Tripacers. IMHO, premium auto fuel should work fine.
Ken Harrill
RV - 6 fuselage
-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen J. Soule [SMTP:SSoule(at)pfclaw.com]
Sent: Sunday, February 22, 1998 4:41 AM
To: 'rv-list(at)matronics.com'
Subject: RE: RV-List: 150 to 160 hp
On the same subject ... Can a 160 hp engine run on auto gas?
Steve Soule
RV-6A fuselage forward side skins
Huntington, Vermont
-----Original Message-----
From: lottmc(at)datastar.net [SMTP:lottmc(at)datastar.net]
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 1998 9:49 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: 150 to 160 hp
Can anyone who has boosted their 150 hp 0-320 to 160
h.p, give
me
an estimate on total cost.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Bibb <rbibb(at)fore.com> |
Before you abandon the idea of attaching the top cowl via hinge pins know
that it only takes about 5 minutes to completely remove my cowl that is
attached via pins. I made a small access cover at the center the top
cowling that covers access to the two top rear pins that is held with one
screw. Installation of the rear pins takes 30 sec. The two side pins take
30 secs. the most time in spent screwing in the 6 screws holding the front
by the prop spinner.
BTW - I originally had the rear top cowling held by camlocs but changed
after 25 hours cause I didn't like the way it looked.
My 2 cents....
>
>Carey,
>
>I have seen this on several -4's and -6's and plan to screw on the top
>cowl. It isn't as pretty as the smoother wire & hinges. But, I want to
>be able to easily open up the top for inspection. The lower cowl will
>attatch to the fuse by wire & hinge.
>
>Boris Robinson
>RV-4 drilling fuse skins.
>
>
>> Has anyone thought of or tried riveting strips of .040 to the fuse and lower
>> cowl. Then rivet nutplates to the top side and screw the upper cowl on.
>
>
>
>
>
Richard E. Bibb Direct: 703-245-4505
Vice President, Federal Operations Main: 703-245-4544
Fore Systems Federal, Inc. FAX: 703-245-4500
1595 Spring Hill Road Pager: 800-719-1246
5th Floor
Vienna, VA 22182
We're from Pittsburgh, we make networks that last.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Wing Top Skins |
>I gently (hand pressure only) bent the trailing edge skin to conform
>to airfoil shape aft of the spar, and relocated the aileron gap seal
>to hold it there. Now fits fine, except for a small discontinuity at
>the spar flange.
>
>Lesson for all: check the angle of the rear spar flanges before
>riveting skins on: they can be corrected with hand seamer at that
>point, but only with great difficulty later.
>
>It may not be such a big deal as I thought, anyway. Following is
>Van's take on the matter (from Ken):
>
>Subject: Re: RV-8 wing top skin
>
> I have seen many RVs where the skin flares back a little aft of rear
>spar.
>I have never detected any difference in flight characteristics.
>About the
>only solution I can see is to use hand seamers to bend the rear spar
>flange
>to a little steeper angle.
To all concerned,
I just dealt with this myself, The inboard skin was already on, so I
just tweaked the skin down with a flat piece of particle board. For the
outboard skin, (not installed yet) I used the hand seamers to bend the
spar flange down a bit, and it helped..but didn't totally correct the
situation. I found that the ribs, either due to dimensional
characteristics, or because I didn't fit them to the rear spar perfectly
(most likely), were sitting just a wee bit too far towards the bottom of
the spar, and the skin sorta "levers" on the radius of the bent spar
flange. So, as the bottom most rib rivets are set, it pulls the skin
down tight, and thus the skin trailing edge lifts up slightly. After
both skins were on for good, I touched it up again with the piece of
board and some gentle hand bending. It looks fine, and, as Ken says,
isn't uncommon in these airplanes.
Hope this helps, and I've explained it sufficiently.
Brian Denk
-8 #379
rigging flaps and ailerons.
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Duberstein, Allen" <allen.duberstein(at)intel.com> |
| Subject: | Starting 160 0-320 |
boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD4068.31E0D122"
This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.
------ =_NextPart_000_01BD4068.31E0D122
I would caution against using the accelerator pump as a
primer....that's what pumping the throttle does. This will put raw
fuel into the carb. If the engine is not cranking this fuel will run
down and out collecting in the filter (or other duct work). A
backfire can light it off and that would not be fun.
Lycomings inject fuel right at the intake valves on 3 cylinders....a
much safer place for it.
If you must prime with the throttle, crank the engine while you do
this.
regards
allen
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com AT SMTPGATE on 02/22/98 10:57
Subject: Re: RV-List: Starting 160 0-320
ED,
The guys have sent you a lot of good advice, I would just like to add
a
couple of points,
Two strokes of the throttle should be plenty of prime at those temps.
Lay off the primer unless it gets really cold. As for the plug
fouling, I think it would benefit you to lean much more agressivly.
Forget about that" textbook" 3000', you can lean at any altitude after
you have leveled out and set up for cruising. Most of all, leave your
mixture at the leaned out setting when decending to land, right up to
the time when you shut her down ( unless of course you have to go
around- then immediate full rich ).
Best regards, Bill , RV4, N66WD, A&P
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
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------ =_NextPart_000_01BD4068.31E0D122
name="External.TXT"
filename="External.TXT"
The following mail header is for administrative use
and may be ignored unless there are problems.
***IF THERE ARE PROBLEMS SAVE THESE HEADERS***.
From: rvpilot(at)juno.com (William R. Davis Jr)
Subject: Re: RV-List: Starting 160 0-320
Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 22:57:38 -0500
by thalia.fm.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA27890
ST)
[132.233.247.11]) by fmm ail.fm.intel.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id
WAA18112 for <Allen_Duberstein@ccm.
------ =_NextPart_000_01BD4068.31E0D122--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "mcomeaux" <mcomeaux(at)cmc.net> |
I'm looking for a picture of the floorboards on a 6A unable to find.
Question on the f-639 & f-640 when you alter that corner for the
bulkhead to fit in do you take the whole corner or Slot it out.
Reagards an still determined----Mike Comeaux
mcomeaux(at)cmc.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wingtip Antenna Part II (long) |
| From: | wstucklen1(at)juno.com (Frederic W Stucklen) |
Les,
Nice article on Antennas... Hope it dispells some of the doubt that
exists on the list.
I'm in the process of getting ready to close up my wings on the second
RV-6A. I'm planning a full IFR panel with dual GS and two com's. What
products, and at what price, do you have to support this application with
no external anntennas?
Fred
>I will answer any antenna questions you might have either by snail mail,
>telephone or by Email at 74301.1665(at)compuserve.com
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
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________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
FYI, a leading cause of engine compartment fire is automobiles is the starter remaining
engaged while the engine is running. This heats the starter up beyond
what it can take. If this can go undetected in a quiet automobile, it stands
to reason that it can happen in a loud airplane.
Brian Eckstein
6A fuselage delivery in late march
----------
. I won't replace the relay unless it bites me again.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: aluminium/alzheimers/RF/brain tumour |
I heard something interesting on NPR a few days ago. Apparently, some deodorants
or some other topical ointments contain aluminum. Some chemical/medical expert
was discussing this and mentioned that the skin absorption of aluminum was
not a concern because the aluminum molecule is too large to penetrate the epidermous.
I am not an expert on this. Does anyone know enough to respond?
Brian Eckstein
6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Tool Use Guidance - pneumatic squeezer |
Ray,
I, too, have a pneumatic squeezer and I quickly learned one lesson
after "pancaking" a few rivets. It is pointless to try and adjust
the inlet pressure in order to get the proper shop head since the
force developed increases with the ram travel. The ram must go to
it's full travel in order to work properly. If you look at the
internals, you'll see that the squeezer only develops full force near
the end of the stroke. Therefore, use full pressure (90 psi or
whatever the low pressure setpoint is for you compressor) and adjust
the ram travel to the final rivet length.
Chris Browne
-6 emp
Atlanta
______________________________ Reply Separator ____________________________
_____
Subject: Re: RV-List: Tool Use Guidance
Date: 2/22/98 1:09 PM
My wife got me a CP 214 Pneumatic squeezer for my birthday. It is the
double piston one and I should be able to squeeze the wing spar rivets with
it. My question is what working pressure should I use with it? She bought
me a used one and it did not come with any instructions. I've done some
practice rivets with it using 90psi. I also purchased the avery adjustable
squeezer set for the pneumatic squeezer. It works great!! Any help will
be appreciated.
Ray and Nancy Murphy
murphy(at)mail.coos.or.us
RV6A empenage
"rv-list-request(at)matronics.com"
subject.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Still tooling up |
Marc -
I, too, agonized over a drill press. After giving myself a headache
over it, I bought a 15" floor model from Sears. I considered a
smaller unit, but most are very poor quality unless you get over $200.
Then, you are in the range for a floor model which doesn't take up
space on the work bench. Go with the bigger unit. The heavier, more
stable, and more powerful press is capable of low speeds for a fly
cutter, will do the entire plane and everything else you may ever
need. I just started, but I find a drill press invaluable since it
takes the stress out of drilling small parts accurately. The bit
won't walk and the hole is at 90 degrees guaranteed.
Chris Browne
-6 emp
Atlanta
______________________________ Reply Separator ____________________________
_____
Subject: RV-List: Still tooling up
Date: 2/21/98 7:25 PM
It seems that you just about have the tools that you need and then...!
I'm at the HS forward spar and see that I need to purchase a drill press.
I've been looking at various bench top models (Sears 1/3 hp-8in.,etc.),
and am wondering if these are big enough for the needs of the pre-punched
kits. Any help appreciated once again.Thanks in advance. Marc R. Hanson
paintbox(at)rconnect.com
"rv-list-request(at)matronics.com"
subject.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | New Article Formats |
All new articles and threads posted on our site will take
advantage of Adobe standards for exchange of printed documents.
As time permits, old articles will be converted to .PDF
format also. To view or print .PDF files, you must download
a free copy of Adobe Acrobat Reader at:
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It's a hassle compared to viewing .HTML files in your browser.
We've made this move in response to feedback about the way
different browsers print our documents . . . especially the
graphics. Check out the recent additions using the free
software from Adobe. Print paper copies and note the crisp,
finely detailed graphics and nicely formated pages. We trust
you'll find the inconveniences worth the effort.
Bob . . .
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
< If you do, >
< What you've always done, >
< You will be, >
< What you've always been. >
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrooksRV6(at)webtv.net (Chris Brooks) |
Moe, Wrap 2 layers of Duct-Tape or some other suitable cushioning
material around the unused surfaces of your bucking bar to prevent the
marring.
Chris Brooks
RV6 Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Wingtip Antenna Part I (Long) |
For those of you not interested, please forgive. But I had enough response
that it's getting to me to answer each with this long message. Therefore
here is to the group.
Some one also asked if any dead spots. Not that I ever encountered, other
than between the earphones.
The guy that bought the plane said he had some problems to his wing man on
his right side going to Las Vegas. We thought maybe it was a dead spot off
of the tip of the ant. However, it turned out that the radio was going bad
on his trip. Made me feel like a honest john used car salesman. But he
agreed that the radio was fine when we flew it before his departure.
If any want a copy of the actual article, let me know off line and I'll get
some copies made and mail to you. It does have one simple diagram in it,
all it shows is the cable coming out of the outer rib, goes forward of the
spar, back into the inside of the rib, and connection to the bulkhead
fitting, then that the ant. wire is bent backwards along the fiberglass tip.
He also states that you can call him at 206/353-4342 for questions, but you
can't see the installation---it's hidden in the wing tip!
Any other questions for me and I'll try to answer.
John C Darby Jr.
RV6 N61764 sold
Stephenville TX
-----Original Message-----
From: John Darby <johnd@our-town.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Wingtip Antenna Part I (Long)
>
>The article is in the Oct 92 Sport Aviation, page 105. It is by Greg
>Rainwater of 2518 80 Pl., SE, Everett, WA 96203
>
>Says there are 4 parts needed: a length of RG-58 coax cable, one SO-239
coax
>connector, one PL-259 coax connector, and one coat hanger. I got all of my
>stuff from the very small Radio Shack here in town. I think RS has a cable
>with connectors already installed that comes in 20 or 24 ft length, long
>enough. As I said before, I couldn't get a good solder joint with the coat
>hanger, so I used a piece of copper colored welding rod, just a little
>smaller in diam. than the coat hanger.
>The SO-239 is a female, bulkhead type, coax connector and requires one
large
>hole and 4 mounting screw holes. He and I placed the location on the outer
>right(but either one is OK) wing rib, forward of the spar part. The
center of the
>coax cable is soldered to the center pin of the connector. The shield is
>tied to one of the flange mounting screws using a terminal lug and a piece
>of sleeving to prevent it from touching the center pin. The coat hanger is
>cut 22.9 inches long. The PL-259 is a connector that connects to the SO
>one, and has a center part that will receive the coat hanger. If you solder
like I do, be careful here as you may let the solder make contact with the
outer portion of the fitting. That wont do, will ground it out. He says
that
>he has flash power units mounted in the tips and gets no interference, but
>with a central power unit, you may get pulsing if the ant. and power cord
>are run closely to each other. My power unit was in the tail as was the
>light, and I had no pulsing.
>I got fancy and put a connector on the cable between the wing root and the
>fus., but you don't really need that. Just have the cable long enough to
go
>to the radio and feed it through the hole in the fus. and then use a rubber
>grommet around the hole. That is what I had to do to the cable anyway.
Had
>to cut a hole in the fus. large enough for the connector to go through.
>Then I cut a rubber grommet from the outer edge to the inner hole, put it
>over the cable, ran the connector and cable through the hole in the fus.
and
>then fit the grommet in place. Then it dawned on me that I could have done
>that without splicing the cable.
>
>
>John C Darby Jr.
>RV6 N61764 sold
>Stephenville TX
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Scott VanArtsdalen <svanarts(at)jps.net>
>To: johnd@our-town.com
>Date: Sunday, February 22, 1998 11:55
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Wingtip Antenna Part I (Long)
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Starting 160 0-320 |
>Two strokes of the throttle should be plenty of prime at those temps. Lay
>off the primer unless it gets really cold. As for the plug fouling, I
>think it would benefit you to lean much more agressivly. Forget about
>that" textbook" 3000', you can lean at any altitude after you have
>leveled out and set up for cruising. Most of all, leave your mixture at
>the leaned out setting when decending to land, right up to the time when
>you shut her down ( unless of course you have to go around- then
>immediate full rich ).
>Best regards, Bill , RV4, N66WD, A&P
Very good advice, Bill. I lean my 150 hp Lyc after start up, when
taxiing, at cruise & letdown and on the way back to the hanger. Any time
that you are not making 75% power or more, you can lean aggressively without
harm to the engine. Also, I have read the recommendation that, before
shutdown, you operate the engine at 1,200 rpms for 30 seconds before going
to idle cut off. This produces a temp. that allows the lead to be scavanged
from the fuel. Since I've started using this procedure, I've had only a
couple of small bits of crud in a couple of the bottom plugs in 50 hours of
operation. The top plugs are as clean as a whistle. I haven't serviced the
plugs since going to the REM37BY plugs & Rose electronic ignition so it will
be interesting to see what the plugs look like with this new configuration.
Bob Skinner RV-6 400 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: aluminium/alzheimers/RF/brain tumour |
<< 1. I don't worry about aluminium and Alzheimer's disease
2. I don't worry about RF radiation and brain tumours.
I am an academic neurologist with teaching hospital and university
appointments in Australia, US training and appointments at Harvard/MGH.
I do wear safety glasses. I do wear a dust mask when I'm making a lot of
dust. >>
Leo-
Is it better to walk under or around ladders? How about sleeping under the
electric blanket when it's on and the whole electric field thing? What's up
with that?
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Drilling the HS 404 to the forward spar |
I was about to drill the holes in the forward spar for the HS-404 when
I looked at the upper flange on the HS-405. After a few measurements,
it became obvious to me that a rivet hole properly centered in the
HS-610 would miss the proper edge distance for the upper flange on the
HS-405. Moving the hole inward toward the center of the spar without
violating the edge distance for the HS-610 looks dicey, at best. This
is not a problem on the other side, since the HS-614 is wider. Should
I center the rivet in the HS-610 inline with the other rivets and
maintain the edge distance there or go for a hole that meets the edge
distance on the flange for the HS-405? They look mutually exclusive
to me.
Thanks,
Chris Browne
RV-6 25313
Atlanta
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fesenbek, Gary" <gfesenbek(at)Meridium.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Nutritional aluminum? |
Try taking Malox about an hour before. It's loaded with Alumnium. That
way you won't really notice a change when you buff.
Kidding aside. I normally do alumiprep on my scotch bright pad and as
such always have gloves on.
Gary RV 6A
Ronaoke, VA
-----Original Message-----
From: DenClay(at)aol.com [SMTP:DenClay(at)aol.com]
Sent: Friday, February 20, 1998 11:38 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: Re: Nutritional aluminum?
Hi folks
Now that I have your attention, I am wondering if any of you
experience the
taste of aluminum after, say, scotchbriteing by hand for five
minutes. I do
often and it makes me pretty certain I am absorbing it thru my
skin. Metals
in the bod not good I think. Any Docs out there with an
oppinion?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "robert dziewiontkoski" <dzflyer(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Still tooling up |
RE: Drill Press Speeds
Anyone with a belt driven drill press (mine is a WWII vintage Delta)that is
not turning slow enough, here is a simple fix - change the pulleys.
Example: with a 1750 rpm motor and wanting 400 rpm, you need a reduction
factor of about 4.4 (1750/400 = 4.38), that would require a ry large pulley
on the quill and a small pulley on the motor. An 8" pulley on the quill and
a 1.75" pulley on the motor would give a reduction of 4.57.
Hope that helps someone (much cheaper than buying an expensive drill press)
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Hawkins <jah(at)adobe.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
>
>My other issue relates to the use of the band saw to trim small pieces of
>aluminum sheet. The blade (metal 14 teeth per inch) tends
>to catch the edge of the sheet just as it is exiting, janking the edge down
>and distorting it. I had planned to use the ban!
>d saw to cut the angles on the stiffners, but now I'm not sure. I believe
>the problem is that the sheet is not adequately supported
>over the hole where the band saw exits. Any solutions for this problem?
>
Hi Mark
You might try using a piece of plywood to make a new table top for
the band saw. This will allow support for the work piece right up
to the blade. Just cut the plywood to the same size of the old table
top and screw it to the old one from the under side. To cut the slot
for the blade just turn on the band saw, line up the new table with
the old one and slide it on while it cuts it's own slot.
This also has the added benefit of keeping your aluminum parts from
being scratched while you cut them from the standard metal tables that
come with the band saws.
I also made a wood table for my belt sander which works well too.
Jeff Hawkins
Suwanne, Georgia
RV-8 #563
Left Elevator almost done. Waiting for wings.
________________________________________________________________________________
Thanks, it's looks like I'm going to do it that way.
installing flap motor...
carey
________________________________________________________________________________
I'm not as worried about how long it takes to take it off as I'm about the
hinge rods cracking and hinges up near the front where the cowl is curved.
Carey
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BStobbe <coro_01(at)weblabs.com> |
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
22>
>
>FYI, a leading cause of engine compartment fire is automobiles is the
starter remaining >engaged while the engine is running. This heats the
starter up beyond what it can take. >If this can go undetected in a quiet
automobile, it stands to reason that it can happen in a >loud airplane.
snip
This seems to be a common problem with these airplanes from the amount of
discussion going on about stuck starter relays.
I'm considering putting a small light in my panel that will be connected to
the output side of the starter relay to show when power is being applied to
the starter. That way, I never have to worry about being "bitten" by this
particular gremlin.
Bruce Stobbe
RV-6
canopy frame
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brant Adornato <badornato(at)argotech.com> |
| Subject: | 1998 Tool Catalog |
Brant Adornato
34567 Melissa Terrace
Fremont, CA 94555
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BrownTool(at)aol.com [SMTP:BrownTool(at)aol.com]
> Sent: Saturday, February 21, 1998 1:54 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: 1998 Tool Catalog
>
>
> They have finally arrived !!! Our new 1998 catalogs just came back
> from the
> printer on Friday. If you have already requested a copy, they will be
> mailing
> out this coming Monday and Tuesday. If you have not requested a FREE
> copy,
> and you would like to do so, please E-Mail your name and address to:
>
> BrownTool(at)aol.com
>
>
> or, visit our website and request a copy on our web page at:
>
> http://www.browntool.com
>
> Thank You and Best Regards,
>
> Michael Brown
> Brown Aviation Tool Supply Co.
> Bethany, Oklahoma USA
> 1-800-587-3883
> 405-495-4991
> BrownTool(at)aol.com
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
| From: | brucegreen(at)juno.com (Bruce Green) |
when I return the key to the off
position the starter keeps right on going
I had this happen once and after tapping the starter relay, it unstuck
and worked normally. I replaced it anyway and also installed a light
next to the starter switch that is powered from the starter side of the
starter relay. This way I will know if there is power to the starter
after engine start. I don't believe that the master relay (continuous)
is made to connect/disconnect with that much current going through it, so
you don't want to have to use it to disconnect the starter too often.
Bruce Green
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Tie-wrap stand-offs |
| From: | brucegreen(at)juno.com (Bruce Green) |
Not to be a smart alec, but those using tie wraps, please use
caution(check
their condition regularly) They do not do well around solvents, oils,
and
especially UV ray
I have used tie-wraps for years and have never had one break. There are
two things to beware of however, the first is that some sort of standoff
should always be used. I have had parts tie-wraped together chaf against
one another despite the tie-wrap being tight. When one of the items is a
stainless braided hose, you get to see just how abrasive they can be. I
usuall use a second tie-wrap as a standoff and sometimes i use a piece of
hose or plastic tubing which can be cut to any lenth.
The other thing is that when tie-wraping to steel tubing, a piece of tape
should be wraped around the tubing first. The tie-wrap itself is not
abrasive, however add a little oil and some sand and you now have a
device that wil saw through your engine mount.
Bruce Green
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
<< I have seen this on several -4's and -6's and plan to screw on the top
cowl. It isn't as pretty as the smoother wire & hinges. But, I want to
be able to easily open up the top for inspection. >>
Boris,
I hate to tell you this but. Using the hinges per plans is not only
faster for removal but makes uncowling easier also. It only takes a couple of
seconds to pull 2 hinge pins vs several minuets to remove many screws. IMHO it
looks alot beter to.
Ryan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Unistar Computers <unistar(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
>I am working on the empenage of my RV6A and am starting on the rudder.
Regarding the 2X gun, I am wondering if I am using the correct air pressure
at 55psi. Unless I slip a piece of paper or rivet tape over the rivet
area, I tend to get a "rash" (not a smiley) on the skin after riveting.
I'm guessing that the "rash" is caused by very slight bouncing of the flush
head on the skin. I've used both the swivel flush head and the fixed one
with the rubber edges to the same effect. Am I using too much air pressure
- I would like some guidelines on that if someone can help.
55 psi sounds too high. Are you measuring at the compressor? at the gun?
30 psi is more like it. It should take 5-7 "taps" of the rivet gun to set
a rivet. More taps causes work hardening, less taps gives control
problems. Try adjusting your gun and riveting some scrap until you can set
them with 5-7 taps at *FULL TRIGGER*. Don't feather the trigger, line up
on the rivet, tease the trigger to hear the gun "tap" solidly through the
rivet to the bucking bar. Got a "good" sound? Pull the trigger all the
way and count the taps. Stop after 5 or 6, does the rivet look OK? If
over driven, reduce pressure and try a new rivet. If under driven try a
new rivet with *MORE* pressure. Look OK now? Repeat until you can drive 5
or 6 in a row with no adjustment to the gun.
>My other issue relates to the use of the band saw to trim small pieces of
aluminum sheet. The blade (metal 14 teeth per inch) tends to catch the
edge of the sheet just as it is exiting, janking the edge down and
distorting it. I had planned to use the band saw to cut the angles on the
stiffners, but now I'm not sure. I believe the problem is that the sheet
is not adequately supported over the hole where the band saw exits. Any
solutions for this problem?
>Thanks
>Mark Gilbert
The rule of thumb is to have 1.5-2 teeth engaged in the material at all
times. That means that a 14 teeth/inch blade would be suitable for
materials 0.107" and above (1"/14 teeth x 1.5). For "thin" material you
want at least 32 teeth per inch, and more teeth if you can get them!!
(1"/32 teeth x 1.5 = 0.046") (1"/48 teeth x 1.5 = 0.031")
Bob Steward, A&P IA
AA-1B N8978L
AA-5A N1976L
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wayne bonesteel <wayneb(at)oakweb.com> |
Would some of you guys (or gals) that have been there done that please
express your opinions how and why you drilled your fuselage skins the
way you did and what problems you encountered. I am nearing this project
and wondering if I should draw the skeleton and drill the skins or back
drill thru the bulkheads and longerons.
thanks Wayne Bonesteel
rv-4 fuselage skeleton in fixture.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | emcole(at)ix.netcom.com (Edward Cole) |
| Subject: | Re: Tool Use Guidance |
You wrote:
>
>
>You can cut the stiffeners with a heavy duty pair of sissors just like
paper.
>Nothing to it.
>
>Jim Cone
>jamescone(at)aol.com
>RV-6A flying
The trick I used for cutting the stiffners was to use
an ordinary paper cutter. It has no problem cutting the
thin material. I screwed down a piece of board to get the correct
angle and cut away! It is quick, and does a nice job.
Ed Cole
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
<< An odd thing happen to me today, I go to start up
the -4 and the battery does not have enough umph
to start it, when I return the key to the off
position the starter keeps right on going. >>
Craig:
I sure hope tht you have fixed this! You may not know, but the starter sol is
a Ford style item, available at most parts stores. After you make dang sure it
isn't the switch sticking, (we use one of those big, hard to push starter
buttons) I'd chuck the defective unit you have now- stuck starters suck all
available electrons out of the system v fast...Bennair, Dunnatt. The a/c I was
flying had a master sol controlling the starter- not good, Mav.
Check six!
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George McNutt <GMcNutt(at)compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel Tank Rivets (Loctite) |
I picked up a Loctite catalogue today (Saturday) and will call their tech
support people Monday. However in the meantime I was wondering if anyone
on the List has investigated, or tried using any of the Loctite products
on their fuel tank rivets (rivet shanks only) instead of the recommended
ProSeal type sealers.
-----------------------------------------------
Called Loctite in Toronto this morning (Monday) and talked to Jerry
Berchard in Tech Support, learned the following.
Loctite Threadlockers are thermoset plastic which harden in the absence of
air and in contact with most metals but not pure aluminum.
There is enough copper alloy in 2024 aluminum to cause the threadlocker to
set up in the rivet hole, however the alclad on the dimple might be a
problem unless removed.
Threadlocker has good resistance to leaded and unleaded gasoline and most
chemicals. It is a skin irritant. Shelf life 1 year.
Recommends using the thicker #271 or #277 product for assembly or the
wicking #290 for post assembly sealing.
Jury is still out - I would have liked to talk to their tech support people
in USA but that 800 number does not work from Canada.
Canada 1-800-263-5043
USA - 1-800-Loctite (562-8483)
Any chemical engineers out there with advice?
George McNutt, Langley B.C.
6A - Wings & thinking about fuel tanks!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don Diehl <ddiehl(at)silverlink.net> |
I inherited a Chicago Pneumatic CP-214C squeezer that works great for
dimpling and squeezing No. 3 rivets.
Its old and tired so wont set a No. 4. Air pressure is all the way up
to 130 p.s.i.
Does anyone know where I can get it overhauled?
Don Diehl
RV-4, 3rd owner, rebuilding
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage skins |
Wayne,
I found on the 4 it was easiest for me to strap the skins on and
draw marks around the skeleton (like georges video shows). Then I removed the
skins drew up my rivet spacing and drilled the skins. Restrap the skins to the
fueselage and drill the skings to the formers. This works very well.
Ryan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jpl(at)showpg.mn.org (Joe Larson) |
| Subject: | Re: Still tooling up -- Drill Press Tips |
> I just started, but I find a drill press invaluable since it
> takes the stress out of drilling small parts accurately. The bit
> won't walk and the hole is at 90 degrees guaranteed.
A friend of mine who used to work at a machine shop gave me some tips
shortly after I bought my drill press. (I was still having accurracy
problems -- the tip WAS wandering.)
1. Make sure your drill tips are clean. As you drill, the tip may get
encased in a bit of the aluminum you're drilling. Check your bit
with some frequency.
2. Do not use worn bits. They're cheap -- buy new ones as frequently
as required to always be using a sharp bit.
3. Insert the bits in the chuck all the way. They should bottom out.
If you only insert them part way (to make them stick out further),
you may not get them straight. He told me the bit should always
bottom out in the chuck, as the shape of the jaws didn't guarantee
a completely-centered bit otherwise. For small bits, this may be
impractical, but I try to follow this rule as best I can.
-Joe
________________________________________________________________________________
Read-Receipt-To: "flipside"
| From: | "flipside" <flipside(at)global.co.za> |
please include on subscription list
thanks
flipside(at)global.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack K. Holley" <jkholley(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | aluminum/alzheimers/RF/brain tumour |
Importance: Normal
> I heard something interesting on NPR a few days ago. Apparently,
> some deodorants or some other topical ointments contain aluminum.
> Some chemical/medical expert was discussing this and mentioned that
> the skin absorption of aluminum was not a concern because the
> aluminum molecule is too large to penetrate the epidermous. I am not
> an expert on this. Does anyone know enough to respond?
>
A few years ago there was a big hoopla in the alternative medicine field
about this. Almost got aluminum banned in deodorants, etc. Don't hear about
it anymore. No conclusive support for absorption through the skin in any
research.
Use reasonable protection (mask when generating dust or particles, etc.) and
keep building.
Jack K. Holley
tooling up for RV6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
Wayne,
I'm doing this now on my RV-6A. I laid out my rivet spacing on the
skeleton and drilled 1/16 pilot holes. Then I taped the skin in place
and back-drilled as much as I could from inside the fuselage. There is
a lot of flimsy stuff under that skin and I was afraid it would move
around if I tried drilling from the outside. In some places you just
can't back drill. I left those until after I had all the backdrilling
done. then it was comparatively easy to drill from the outside and hit
the hidden target.
I have one side skin left to do. Even though it is upside down and has
clecoes sticking out all over, believe me it looks really nice to see an
airplane shape in the shop where there used to be a lot of aluminum
sheets and bulkheads. You will love how it looks.
By the way, there are a lot of different rivets used in the fuselage
skin and a lot of different rivet spacing. Go slow and try to get it
right the first time.
Steve Soule
Huntington, Vermont
RV-6A fuselage in the jig
-----Original Message-----
Would some of you guys (or gals) that have been there done that
please
express your opinions how and why you drilled your fuselage
skins the
way you did and what problems you encountered. I am nearing this
project
and wondering if I should draw the skeleton and drill the skins
or back
drill thru the bulkheads and longerons.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
<< I'm considering putting a small light in my panel that will be connected to
the output side of the starter relay to show when power is being applied to
the starter. >>
Actually its not necessary. From what I have been told, your amp gauge will
go off the charts if the starter remains engaged (you are installing amp and
volt gauges, right?). When this happens the starter acts as a alternator
putting out mega amps.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC - NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BStobbe <coro_01(at)weblabs.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage skins |
>
>Would some of you guys (or gals) that have been there done that please
>express your opinions how and why you drilled your fuselage skins the
>way you did and what problems you encountered. I am nearing this project
>and wondering if I should draw the skeleton and drill the skins or back
>drill thru the bulkheads and longerons.
I used the tracing method (draw outline of skeleton on back of skin) and
drilled the skins with them off of the fuse skeleton. I like this method
and would use it again because I think it's easier to lay out the holes for
consistent spacing using this method since the skin is out in the open on
your bench, and you don't need a helper to keep the skin in place while you
drill.
Bruce Stobbe
RV-6
canopy frame
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Toad <toad(at)favorites.com> |
The chat room can be accessed from the web for java chat users
http://www.rconline.com find your way to java chat then join the rv chat
room by typing; /join #rvchat
To access the chat room via a chat program like mIRC or pirch,
point your software to server; rco.iglobal.net port 6667
to download a chat software for the mac or for clones, engine search
mIRC or pirch. AOLer's can dl mIRC into the aol software, then fire it
up when connected. Once connected to rco.iglobal.net type /join #rvchat
to access the room. we have a good group meeting there each night approx
at 7:00pm pst
anyone one can use the server for chatting about rv stuff at any time
though, sure beats correspondance by email! come join the fun!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
>> I'm considering putting a small light in my panel that will be connected to
>> the output side of the starter relay to show when power is being applied to
>> the starter.
>
>Actually its not necessary. From what I have been told, your amp gauge will
>go off the charts if the starter remains engaged (you are installing amp and
>volt gauges, right?). When this happens the starter acts as a alternator
>putting out mega amps.
I think starters as a rule all have overrun clutches else
they would not survive a stuck solenoid scenario. Consider that if
the starter cranks the engine at approx 300 rpm and features an
internal gear reduction on the order of 25:1, what happens to the
armature when engine RPMs come up to 1000-1500 RPM? 1000 RPM
times 25 is 25,000 RPM . . . guaranteed to throw ALL of the wire
out of the slots if it doesn't take gear teeth off first. The
late model Skytecs with the plastic gears wouldn't take it for
a second.
The reason the ammeter reads higher than usual is because the
alternator's voltage regulator has no way to tell if the extra load
on the bus is from LOTS of goodies turned on, VERY depleted battery,
starter STILL running or a combination of the three. Hence, the
alternator goes to full output and pretty much stays there.
The starter is running but only at the speed it would normally run
with NO load . . . since the output shaft is essentially disconnected
by virtue of the overrunning clutch. Being the horribly inefficient
motors they are, a starter with zero mechanical load will still draw
50-100 amps but at no time does the starter become a generator. Even
if it DID, you would not be able to read it's contribution to system
electrical energy . . . ammeters are wired to read flow out of
alternator (Loadmeter) or from bus to battery (minus-0-plus battery
ammeter). The battery and starter are in parallel with each other
downstream of the ammeter. If the starter were actually supplying
power to the bus, the regulator would sense TOO much bus voltage and
shut the alternator down. Power flow from starter to bus would make
a battery ammeter read DOWNSCALE and an alternator loadmeter read
ZERO.
A common myth well circulated that's not well undestood. A "Starter
Engaged" light is indeed a good idea. Many Beech products had them
at least as an option for several years.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
==========o00o=(_)=o00o==========
< If you do, >
< What you've always done, >
< You will be, >
< What you've always been. >
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Unistar Computers <unistar(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: aluminium/alzheimers/RF/brain tumour |
22>
<3.0.1.16.19980223175152.308736f8(at)koala.icn.su.oz.au>
<3.0.1.16.19980223175152.308736f8(at)koala.icn.su.oz.au>
>I heard something interesting on NPR a few days ago. Apparently, some
deodorants or some other topical ointments contain aluminum. Some
chemical/medical expert was discussing this and mentioned that the skin
absorption of aluminum was not a concern because the aluminum molecule is
too large to penetrate the epidermous. I am not an expert on this. Does
anyone know enough to respond?
>Brian Eckstein
Not a chemist, but read the label on my deodorant, it says: Aluminum
Chlorhydrate (whatever that is) as an "Active Ingredient".
Bob Steward, A&P IA
AA-1B N8978L
AA-5A N1976L
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rvpilot(at)juno.com (William R. Davis Jr) |
Jim,
The REM37BY plug is approved for use in the 160 HP Lyc. and it does help
to reduce lead fouling.
Regards, Bill, RV4, N66WD, A&P
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris Ruble <cruble(at)cisco.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Still tooling up -- Drill Press Tips |
I don't think this is a good idea. The shank of a drill bit is not
hardened like the twist portion. Chucking the bit within .25" of
the twist will not provide a good grip. If the bit is wandering,
there is some other problem.
Chris
>
> 3. Insert the bits in the chuck all the way. They should bottom out.
> If you only insert them part way (to make them stick out further),
> you may not get them straight. He told me the bit should always
> bottom out in the chuck, as the shape of the jaws didn't guarantee
> a completely-centered bit otherwise. For small bits, this may be
> impractical, but I try to follow this rule as best I can.
>
> -Joe
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re:Engine leaning |
| From: | rvpilot(at)juno.com (William R. Davis Jr) |
Sorry, I inadvertently deleted the name of the lister who questioned
this. The answer is Yes, it is an accepted practice although not by all.
Old habits die hard. One additional benefit of keeping your engine lean
during decent & landing is that it helps prevent shock cooling which of
course leads to cracked Cyl. heads.
Regards, Bill, N66WD, A&P
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
Listers:
I picked up my finish kit for my 6A last Friday. It's a big
box compared to the other 3 kits (ok, so it's small compared
to the QB crate). I inventoried it on Saturday morning.
There is one very interesting aspect to this kit: where is
all of the aluminum?!?! This is the first kit that isn't
90% aluminum pieces. It's pretty neat seeing wheels, brakes,
tires, canopy, cowling, engine mount, front gear, etc. A
whole lot of fiberglass. That new cowling is sure light.
My wife thinks the tires are "cute." What can I say?
I also stopped at Art Chard's place for awhile. Art is a great
guy, always interesting to stop in there. He is currently
working on an -8 right now. His big news was that he and
his wife are moving to Montana, about 25 miles south of
Missoula to a town called Stevensville I believe. They
bought property on Wind Sock lane close to the airport.
I also stopped at the prototype shop and talked to them
about moving the battery in front of the firewall. After
sitting in my plane at various times, I just can't bear to
give up that space (I'm 6'6"). The -8 mounts the battery
on the firewall and it looks like I'll be able to directly
use the -8 mount on my -6A.
Doug Medema, RV-6A, working on the top forward structure.
P.S. I doubt if it matters, but the Zip Code listed for
Greg Rainwater in an earlier post is incorrect. It
should be 98203. Greg lives about a mile from me.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage skins |
>Would some of you guys (or gals) that have been there done that please
>express your opinions how and why you drilled your fuselage skins the
>way you did and what problems you encountered. I am nearing this project
>and wondering if I should draw the skeleton and drill the skins or back
>drill thru the bulkheads and longerons.
>
>thanks Wayne Bonesteel
Wayne,
On my RV-6, I did all of the drilling through the skin into the bulkheads,
j channels and ribs. I just got back from a two week RV-6 building marathon
where we pre-drilled the bulkheads and j channels and back drilled. There
were two of us and this operation went very fast. We did trace the seat rib
oulines onto the bottom skin and predrilled the skins as the rib flanges
make it hard to get the long bit on straight. In two weeks, we had the jig
set up, all the bulkheads assembled, including the firewall and all of the
skins drilled on except for the forward side skins. It seems that it took
me 8-10 months to get to this point when I built my six. That extra set of
hands comes in really handy.
This brings up a question that I would like to post to the list as to how
other builders are doing their fuselages, or wings, for that matter. The
guy that I'm helping and I have decided to drill on all of the skins and fit
the 6A main gear weldments while everything is clecoed together with #40
clecoes. When I built my six, I had all of the ribs riveted to the various
bulkheads and everything turned out fine. It seems that if we have
everything drilled on, including the gear leg weldments and then drill all
required rivet holes out to #30 and dis-assemble that this method might be a
lot quicker. Then we can debur, dimple and (prime) and do the final rivet
job. This method could save dis-assembly and re-assembly time. At first, I
thought possibly that the parts might swell over the length of the fuselage
with drilling chips, but #40 drilling doesn't produce as many chips as #30.
When I was building the Glastar, I was surprised that the manual called for
drilling the skins on the elevator while the skeleton (front & rear spars,
12 nose ribs & 12 main ribs) were clecoed together. The Glastar H.S. uses
.020" aluminum, by the way, which is a little delicate to work with when
compared to our "beefy" skins. Anyway, the H.S. turned out great, so I was
less hesitant to use this procedure on the 6A we're building now. (Of
course, we're experimenting on someone else's kit but the owner agreed that
this made sense.)
Bob Skinner RV-6 400 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Starting 160 0-320 |
I AGREE WITH BILL.
RICK BELL, RV4 N83RB A&P CS&MELI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Daniel H. Morris III" <Morristec(at)icdc.com> |
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0083_01BD4092.17BE6B00"
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_0083_01BD4092.17BE6B00
To all,
I hope that this post doesn't draw loud protest, but I thought that this =
would be useful to the listers. =20
I Represent Schroth Seatbelts for Sport Aviation and have 4 point =
seatbelts custom configured for the RV-6/6A. They are 4 or optionally 5 =
point with a center turn buckle. The belts are TSO C-114 approved. =
Custom sizes and colors are available. I also have a crotch strap kit =
available to install an attachment point for the crotch strap. If belts =
are purchased I will supply the plans for the crotch attachment for =
free. =20
Please Email me off list at Morristec(at)icdc.com. I can Email photos, or =
respond with a literature package.
Dan Morris
RV-6 in paint
(610) 524-4153
------=_NextPart_000_0083_01BD4092.17BE6B00
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
To all,
I hope that this post doesn't draw loud protest, but =
I thought=20
that this would be useful to the listers.
I Represent Schroth Seatbelts for Sport Aviation and =
have 4=20
point seatbelts custom configured for the RV-6/6A. They are 4 or=20
optionally 5 point with a center turn buckle. The belts are TSO =
C-114=20
approved. Custom sizes and colors are available. I also have =
a=20
crotch strap kit available to install an attachment point for the crotch =
strap. If belts are purchased I will supply the plans for the =
crotch=20
attachment for free.
Please Email me off list at Morristec(at)icdc.com. I can =
Email=20
photos, or respond with a literature package.
Dan Morris
RV-6 in paint
(610) 524-4153
------=_NextPart_000_0083_01BD4092.17BE6B00--
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage skins |
I DREW THE SKELETON AND THEN BACK DRILLED THROUGH THE BULKHEADS AND LONGERONS.
I USED THE SKELETON LINES TO KEEP THE BULKHEADS STRAIGHT . WORKED FINE
....THAT WAS 600 FLIGHT HOURS AGO.....
RICK BELL A&P RV4 #729 N83RB " MARGARITAVILLE AIR EXPRESS"
________________________________________________________________________________
CAN'T GET ANY EASIER THAN THE HINGES AND PINS. A FRIEND WHO IS BUILDING A
GLASSTAR WATCH ME PULL MINE OFF THE OTHER DAY...3 MIN. MAX. NEVER HAD A
PROBLEM WITH THEM IN 600 HRS OF FLIGHT TIME.
RICK BELL A&P RV4 N83RB "MARGARITAVILLE AIR EXPRESS"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
On my print (rv-6) Dwg. 37 shows it cut out (not slotted) in
a couple of views.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
> I'm looking for a picture of the floorboards on a 6A unable to find.
> Question on the f-639 & f-640 when you alter that corner for the
> bulkhead to fit in do you take the whole corner or Slot it out.
> Reagards an still determined----Mike Comeaux
> mcomeaux(at)cmc.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitch Faatz <mfaatz(at)SagentTech.com> |
| Subject: | Re:Engine leaning |
>Sorry, I inadvertently deleted the name of the lister who questioned
>this. The answer is Yes, it is an accepted practice although not by
all.
>Old habits die hard. One additional benefit of keeping your engine lean
>during decent & landing is that it helps prevent shock cooling which of
>course leads to cracked Cyl. heads.
>
>Regards, Bill, N66WD, A&P
And here I was taught that a *rich* mixture helps cool the engine...
Go figure.
Mitch Faatz San Jose, CA N727MF (reserved)
RV-6AQME working on the sliding canopy...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Bowen <larry(at)bowen.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Specific primer question |
Thanks to all those who replied on this topic. I have since found a
"S-W Commercial" store who carries the Sherwin Williams Wash Primer
#P60G2 and Catalyst Reducer #R7K44. So I thought I would return the E2G973
Vinyl
Etch Primer and R7K242 Reducer to the S-W Automotive store. After talking
to the "Commercial" folks though, I decided to stay with the E2G973. They
said the P60G2 needed to be primered or top coated within hours of
application, while the E2G973 did not. Any thoughts?
Larry
larry(at)bowen.com
Advance, NC
RV-8 Emp.
-----Original Message-----
From: Leslie B Williams [SMTP:lesliebwilliams(at)email.msn.com]
Sent: Thursday, February 19, 1998 12:28 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Specific primer question
I was told by my local distributor that these are one and the same. It
also
looks the same as the QB primer when applied, if mixed at the 2-1 ratio
Van's suggests. If you don't put enough reducer in it, it will come out
stringy.
Les Williams/RV-6AQ/Tacoma WA
>
>All,
>
>I decided to go with the Sherwin Williams Wash Primer #P60G2 and Catalyst
Reducer #R7K44, largely because it is listed in the RV-8 construction
manual
as being acceptable. When I went to the local S/W Automotive store (the
same store where I was able to find the elusive GBP988 rattle-can primer),
they didn't recognize these specific products by name. After some
discussion they happily sold me some "E2G973 Vinyl Etch Primer" and "R7K242
Reducer".
>
>Does anyone have experience with, or opinions on these products?
[SNIP]
Larry
larry(at)bowen.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | gear leg fairing's |
I'm looking for those one piece fairing's. I have heard of the harmon rocket
guy and two other people by the name of Tracy and Mike I think. I need #'s
and advice, can anyone help?
66 more days till wheels up...
Carey Mills
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don McCall <mccall(at)cayman.ds.boeing.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Primers / Corrosion |
Lots of good information on the list lately regarding priming, and the
reasons why it's all so unnecessary. Just to play devil's advocate (I'm not
necessarily subscribing to either viewpoint, yet) let's think about the flip
side of the coin...
If I were going to build an RV, fly it till I retire, and then junk it...
then of course, why bother priming at all? It'll last that long, just
trusting to the bare alclad, easily...
But consider this --
Corrosion is somewhat a random process, and nobody can predict EXACTLY under
what conditions an airplane will be stored and maintained, or whether (or how
soon) corrosion will become a problem under those conditions. So, if I do
nothing, and there's a 99% chance that corrosion won't be a problem, is that
acceptable?
Perhaps; perhaps not. If I can virtually GUARANTEE no corrosion for as long
as I own the airplane (100%, not 99%, or 90%, or whatever the true, unknown,
number is) for the added cost of maybe $150 and 100 hours, is it unreasonable
to take those precautions? And what if I fully intend to keep the airplane
for only 5-10 years (say, until I lose my medical, or build something else)
and then sell it to somebody ELSE who plans to have it for a long time, or
what if one of my sons decides to take flying lessons and ends up flying HIS
kids in the airplane 30 years from now? Sure, maybe the thing will last that
long regardless. But, isn't aviation all about accepting a REASONABLE level
of risk, but doing everything possible to manage and minimize that risk?
Seems to me like there's plenty of room for both viewpoints...
My fiftieth of a buck...
Don McCall
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MoeJoe <moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Drilling the HS 404 to the forward spar |
I had this same problem. I called Vans, and they said to drill the hole
in-between. In other words, get as close to the proper edge distance as
possible on both parts. It turned out ok for me, as I just barely made
it on both parts. You do have some room to work with on the 610. If you
measure, you can drill that hole inboard by about 1/16" and still be ok.
Remeber that "barely" making it is still good enough. If I had to
violate edge distance, it would probably be on the rib flange, not the
610. The rib has all those skin rivets holding it firmly in place. Email
me privately if you need anymore info. I panicked at first when I got to
this point, but it turned out to be no big deal.
Moe Colontonio
RV-8 VS
moejoe(at)bellatlantic.net
Christopher E Browne wrote:
>
>
> I was about to drill the holes in the forward spar for the HS-404 when
> I looked at the upper flange on the HS-405. After a few measurements,
> it became obvious to me that a rivet hole properly centered in the
> HS-610 would miss the proper edge distance for the upper flange on the
> HS-405. Moving the hole inward toward the center of the spar without
> violating the edge distance for the HS-610 looks dicey, at best. This
> is not a problem on the other side, since the HS-614 is wider. Should
> I center the rivet in the HS-610 inline with the other rivets and
> maintain the edge distance there or go for a hole that meets the edge
> distance on the flange for the HS-405? They look mutually exclusive
> to me.
>
> Thanks,
> Chris Browne
> RV-6 25313
> Atlanta
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Craig Hiers <craig-RV4(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
Mlfred(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
>
> << An odd thing happen to me today, I go to start up
> the -4 and the battery does not have enough umph
> to start it, when I return the key to the off
> position the starter keeps right on going. >>
> Craig:
> I sure hope tht you have fixed this! You may not know, but the starter sol is
> a Ford style item, available at most parts stores. After you make dang sure it
> isn't the switch sticking, (we use one of those big, hard to push starter
> buttons) I'd chuck the defective unit you have now- stuck starters suck all
> available electrons out of the system v fast...Bennair, Dunnatt. The a/c I was
> flying had a master sol controlling the starter- not good, Mav.
>
> Check six!
> Mark
>
Mark
I cannot reproduce the problem now, after much trying.
I started it up today with no problems. I did wire a light
to the starter side of the starter relay, just to be sure.
Craig Hiers
RV-4 N143CH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
>An odd thing happen to me today, I go to start up
>the -4 and the battery does not have enough umph
>to start it, when I return the key to the off
>position the starter keeps right on going. the
>prop was turning real slow as the battery was going
>down fast. I had to stop the thing by turning off
>the master switch. It has an ACS starter switch,
>and a wicks starter relay. I took the starter
>cable off of the starter and tryed to duplicate
>the problem but everthing worked just fine.
>Any thoughts, ideas, or comments. I cannot have
>the starter turning while the motor is running.
Starter contactors have to carry a LOT of current
for a short period of time . . . they sandbag
their task by using a whole lot MORE coil current
(5-8 amps) than a battery contactor (.5-1 amp).
When you first hit the starter switch and you fail
to get a snappy starter action, the battery is either
tired or discharged. Under this low voltage condition,
the starter contactor's pull in force is severely
reduced thus increasing probability of poor contact
force . . . hence burning and/or welding of contacts.
On the first clue that the battery is not up to it's
usual duties, I recommend jumpering from another
vechicle or battery cart . . .
see <http://www.aeroelectric.com/gnd_powr.html>
or putting the battery on charger for awhile, or
hand proping the airplane to allow the alternator
time to restore the battery's snort. If it happens
more than once when the battery should be charged
(i.e. you didn't go off and leave the master switch
on) then it's probably time to replace the battery
(in fact, it's been time to replace it for a LONG
time).
Bob . . .
////
(o o)
===========o00o=(_)=o00o=========
< If you do, >
< What you've always done, >
< You will be, >
< What you've always been. >
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | less_drag(at)juno.com |
| Subject: | Re: Wingtip Antenna Part II (long) |
<19980223.093229.11950.2.wstucklen1(at)juno.com>
Stucklen) writes:
>Stucklen)
>
>Les,
>
> Nice article on Antennas... Hope it dispells some of the doubt that
exists on the list.
>
> I'm in the process of getting ready to close up my wings on the
second
>RV-6A. I'm planning a full IFR panel with dual GS and two com's. What
>products, and at what price, do you have to support this application
with
>no external anntennas?
>
>Fred
Hello Fred,
Bob Archer has a Dual COM Switch, which allows you to use only one COM
antenna.
So, You can install the wingtip COM antenna in one wingtip, and a
wingtip NAV antenna and Marker Beacon antenna in the other wingtip. The
GS can be split off of the NAV antenna.
The COM and NAV antenna's are $55 each. The Marker Beacon antenna kit is
$25. The Dual COM Switch is $135.
There is also a COM antenna for the vertical stabilizer, but there is NOT
a fairing for it, yet. I have this antenna on my RV-3. I replaced the
2" high standard fairing with a 10" high COM antenna fairing that extends
over the rudder.
Jim Ayers
Maroon Marauder RV-3 N47RV
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com> |
| Subject: | Carb-160hp Lycoming |
A friend, with a new, really light, RV-6A (1006 lbs, if I remember
correctly) called and asked me about a carb problem that he was having and I
told him I'd ask the list.
First, he's not getting a rpm increase of 50 rpms at idle cut-off. He's
turned the adjustment screw quite a ways to the left (lean ?) to where he
feels the screw is about to come out. I think he went about 1 1/2 turns
counter clockwise. Will these screws fall out if turned too far? I've
never turned mine out that far so don't know. I told him that I thought he
needed to enrichen the mixture (clockwise.)
The other problem is that he can only pull his mixture control out 1/4" or
so before the engine starts running rough. At our altitude of around 4,500
feet my mixture is out about 1 1/2 inchs before the engine starts to
roughen. This is on the MA 4 SPA carb. Any ideas?
He's cruising at 190 mph at full throttle at 7,500 feet based on GPS runs.
I can't believe that his 6A is so light, with a full gyro and upholstery.
One guy I won't race with, that's for sure.
Bob Skinner RV-6 400 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John M. Denman" <mikedenman(at)earthlink.net> |
I am going to buy the device that you use to time magnetos. The
question is, what type and brand is "best". ACS, Avery, Chief etc. all
carry the same 3 models and range in price from $40 to $80 dollars. The
$80 dollar model makes claims that it is safer. Is it? Any other
thoughts from people who have bought a timing device and have had some
experience with them. Also advertised is an "external pointer" for the
Lycoming engines that clips to the ring gear. Is it necessary or worth
the money?
All comments are welcome.
Mike Denman
"Pay attention to the details...Sweat the small shit!"
RV6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Martin Quartim <martinq(at)cris.com> |
| Subject: | RV-9, yeah RV-NINE |
I called Van's Aircraft to ask a few questions about the RV-8 and during
the conversation, an RV-9 was mentioned. I immediately tried to get more
info about it but the person told me that it was just a unimportant
prototype just for them to fly and bla bla... I don't know about that.
Does anybody has more details on the RV-9 ?
martin
RV-8-dreaming
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James E. Clark" <James.E.Clark(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9, yeah RV-NINE |
----------
> From: Martin Quartim <martinq(at)cris.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: RV-9, yeah RV-NINE
> Date: Tuesday, February 24, 1998 1:01 AM
<>
See recent RVator article.
Not right before me but ( as I recall) it is basically an RV6-style
(actual??) fuselage with different wing and smaller engine. Closer to a
trainer in handling I seem to also recall. Thy are using it to "test"
stuff.
'Twas made clear that this is NOT something on the immediate drawing board
as a kit.
James
RV6A-QB
> Does anybody has more details on the RV-9 ?
>
> martin
> RV-8-dreaming
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jelford(at)TRANSPORT.COM (Jon Elford) |
| Subject: | Re: Drilling the HS 404 to the forward spar |
>
>
>
>
> I was about to drill the holes in the forward spar for the HS-404 when
> I looked at the upper flange on the HS-405. After a few measurements,
> it became obvious to me that a rivet hole properly centered in the
> HS-610 would miss the proper edge distance for the upper flange on the
> HS-405. Moving the hole inward toward the center of the spar without
> violating the edge distance for the HS-610 looks dicey, at best. This
> is not a problem on the other side, since the HS-614 is wider. Should
> I center the rivet in the HS-610 inline with the other rivets and
> maintain the edge distance there or go for a hole that meets the edge
> distance on the flange for the HS-405? They look mutually exclusive
> to me.
>
> Thanks,
> Chris Browne
> RV-6 25313
> Atlanta
>
Chris,
Is the overall vertical dimension for the HS610 & HS614 (from HS614 lower
flange to HS610 upper flange) exactly the 3.25" called for in the plans? If
you're too tall here, the HS610/Fwd Spar/HS405 junction will suffer like you
describe. I looked at mine (which I painstakingly set up at exactly 3.25")
and the HS405 has good edge distance. There's not a lot to spare, but it is
certainly within adequate tolerances.
Press on......
>
>
>
>
Jon Elford
RV6 #25201
Finishing up empennage-
WINGS ON THE WAY!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: starter blues |
<< I'm considering putting a small light in my panel that will be connected to
the output side of the starter relay to show when power is being applied to
the starter. >>
Just connect the lamp between the "I" terminal on the starter contactor (Cole-
Hersee or Federal-Mogul type phenolic case) and ground. The "I" terminal
connects to the slug in the contactor.
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oh no, not another primer question! |
> BTW, I squeeze the last rivet, and start peeling off the plastic wrap
> with the aid of a hairdryer
Moe, I do hope you didn't rivet your skins with the plastic still on! And don't
worry so much about the primer, no one will see it and even scuffed it offers more
protection than the bare aluminum. I hung my parts on the wall with some old rags
between the wall and the part.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "L. Coats" <lcoats(at)wave.co.nz> |
Hi Dan,
I am interested in sourcing a lighter set of seatbelts than the set that
Van's offers. Do you know the weight of the whole set up for one seat?
Also, what is the price of your seat belt?
Can you include the prices of the 5 point and 4 point systems.
Thank-you
Louise Coats
>To all,
>
>I hope that this post doesn't draw loud protest, but I thought that this
would be useful to the listers.
>
>I Represent Schroth Seatbelts for Sport Aviation and have 4 point seatbelts
custom configured for the RV-6/6A. They are 4 or optionally 5 point with a
center turn buckle. The belts are TSO C-114 approved. Custom sizes and
colors are available. I also have a crotch strap kit available to install
an attachment point for the crotch strap. If belts are purchased I will
supply the plans for the crotch attachment for free.
>
>Please Email me off list at Morristec(at)icdc.com. I can Email photos, or
respond with a literature package.
>
>Dan Morris
>RV-6 in paint
>
>(610) 524-4153
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>To all,
>
>I hope that this post doesn't draw loud protest, but I
thought
>that this would be useful to the listers.
>
>I Represent Schroth Seatbelts for Sport Aviation and have 4
>point seatbelts custom configured for the RV-6/6A. They are 4 or
>optionally 5 point with a center turn buckle. The belts are TSO C-114
>approved. Custom sizes and colors are available. I also have a
>crotch strap kit available to install an attachment point for the crotch
>strap. If belts are purchased I will supply the plans for the crotch
>attachment for free.
>
>
>
>Dan Morris
>RV-6 in paint
>
>(610) 524-4153
>
>
>
L. Coats ZK-RVL RV6 flying :-) 229hr
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Graham Jones <gratech(at)acslink.aone.net.au> |
| Subject: | Re: Still tooling up -- Drill Press Tips |
Joe,
I agree on the first two points you make but take exception to the
third. I
think you or your friend might have miss-stated what you/he meant to say
- please
dont take this as a personal flame. Most chucks I've used can take
small to
medium size drill bits and "swallow" them past the point where the
fluting starts
thus inserting them 'all the way' or 'bottoming them out' is highly
undesirable.
My toolmaker father taught me to only insert the shank of the drill, up
to around
3/16" or 1/4" short of the flutes, into the chuck as the unevenness of
the
fluting on the sides of the drill reduces the contact area and thus
security of
the drill in the chuck. Certainly insert the drill to just short of the
full
extent of the shank - the more grip the chuck has the better. Also the
load that
the chuck will need to exert on the drill to hold by the flutes will
also stress
the bit so that if any thing causes it to jam its almost certain that
the drill
will snap. (As MarkF said in another post, Bennair, Dunnat). The
small
distance between the flutes and the chuck gives the stresses time to
"spread out"
through the metal of the shank. It won't always stop a breakage but
should reduce
them in many cases
The fact that the outer edges of the flutes are a different diameter to
the shank
and twisted also increases the chance that the drill will be
misaligned. If the
shape of the jaws is such that they don't guarantee a centered bit get a
new
chuck! When we made a chuck in machine shop class more than 50% of
the time was
spent just machining the jaws to ensure they were ABSOLUTELY EXACTLY the
same
thickness and size etc. to ensure the drill was held on center. Now
days they buy
them in to save time and effort (read wastage of the material......).
The method I use to see if the bit is aligned is to slowly (relatively)
bring the
jaws into contact with the bit while gently rotating the bit in your
fingers as
the jaws grip it until tight. then check it by rotating the chuck and
tighten it
to the full extent. Eyeballing the bit as it rotates before applying
it to metal
will also add firemans braces to you trouser belt :-}.
Graham Jones
-6A Emp.
Joe Larson wrote:
> 3. Insert the bits in the chuck all the way. They should bottom out.
> If you only insert them part way (to make them stick out further),
> you may not get them straight. He told me the bit should always
> bottom out in the chuck, as the shape of the jaws didn't guarantee
> a completely-centered bit otherwise. For small bits, this may be
> impractical, but I try to follow this rule as best I can.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Louis Willig <larywil(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tie-wrap stand-offs |
>--> RV-List message posted by: brucegreen(at)juno.com (Bruce
Green)
>The other thing is that when tie-wraping to steel tubing, a piece of
tape
>should be wraped around the tubing first.=A0 The tie-wrap itself is
not
>abrasive, however add a little oil and some sand and you now have
a
>device that wil saw through your engine mount.
>
>Bruce Green
>
Bruce,
Tie-wraps are very abrasive. They are usually made
of a nylon polymer that can slowly cut through seemingly harder
substances such as engine mounts, fuel lines and other minor
items. It doesn't seem possible, but it happens this way. I believe that
Tony B. goes into this matter in Firewall Forward.
As far as tie-wraps breaking, well... some of them last forever and some
eventually go to tie-wrap heaven. . They are fairly resistant to many
solvents and oils. But UV will get to them(Thats why you have to replace
nylon lines aboard boats so often if they are left on deck.) Otherwise,
they do last a fairly long time, but should be inspected as should any
other connector in your a/c.
Louis I. Willig
larywil(at)home.com
(610) 668-4964
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Boris <smbr(at)digital.net> |
I agree that it comes apart much easier. But, watching a few people try
to put the pins back, especially the top curve on the -4, made me want
something better.
What's the trick for getting it (with pins) back together quickly?
> I hate to tell you this but. Using the hinges per plans is not only
> faster for removal but makes uncowling easier also. It only takes a couple of
> seconds to pull 2 hinge pins vs several minuets to remove many screws. IMHO it
> looks alot beter to.
> Ryan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Reiff <Reiff(at)execpc.com> |
> Would some of you guys (or gals) that have been there done that please
> express your opinions how and why you drilled your fuselage skins the
> way you did and what problems you encountered. I am nearing this project
> and wondering if I should draw the skeleton and drill the skins or back
> drill thru the bulkheads and longerons.
The method I used on the wing and fuselage skins is:
1) backdrill just the end holes of each rib/bulkhead/longeron segment
2) draw a line on the outside of the skin connecting the two backdrilled
holes
3) mark rivet spacing along the line
4) drill the remainder of the holes from the outside
Bob Reiff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | OrndorffG(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet Squeezer |
Don,
Give me a call I can look at that squezzer for you ....George Orndorff
817-439-3280
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Cabe" <robert.cabe(at)usaa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage skins |
----------
> > wondering if I should draw the skeleton and drill the skins or back
> >drill thru the bulkheads and longerons.
I used both methods on various parts of the fuselage. Greatly prefer the
back drill method. If you drill your bulkhead flange first, you are
absolutely sure of the spacing and you will not have to worry about being
too close to the edge of the flange or too close to the radius of the
flange.
It does take two people.
Bob Cabe
San Antonio
Engine Baffles on an RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Carb-160hp Lycoming |
Bob Skinner wrote:
>
> The other problem is that he can only pull his mixture control out 1/4" or
> so before the engine starts running rough. At our altitude of around 4,500
> feet my mixture is out about 1 1/2 inchs before the engine starts to
> roughen. This is on the MA 4 SPA carb. Any ideas?
> He's cruising at 190 mph at full throttle at 7,500 feet based on GPS runs.
> I can't believe that his 6A is so light, with a full gyro and upholstery.
> One guy I won't race with, that's for sure.
>
> Bob Skinner RV-6 400 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com
>
Bob
Has he checked the finger screen going into the carb? It sounds like
a fuel restriction somewhere in the system. What is his fuel burn?
His airplane does sound light for full gyros and upholstery, sure his
scales were right?
Jerry
--
Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS First flight July 14, 1989 :-) Hillsboro, OR
jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Isler" <jlisler(at)surfsouth.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wingtip Antenna Part I (Long) |
For what it's worth Kitplanes had the following articles on antennas:
September 1994 page 61 --- Com antennas
October 1994 page 74 --- Nav antennas
All use the standard coat hanger technology.
Jerry Isler
RV4 #1070
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: gear leg fairing's |
| From: | rvpilot(at)juno.com (William R. Davis Jr) |
Carey,
Call Tracy Sayor 805-933-8225. He's in Santa Paula. The other supplier
is Mark Frederick, dont have his phone No. but he is on this list and
will surely reply (check six).
Regards, Bill RV4, N66WD
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Carb-160hp Lycoming |
| From: | rvpilot(at)juno.com (William R. Davis Jr) |
Bob,
Sounds as if your friends float level might be low. When you have 2
problems at the same time, they are often connected. Low float level
would explain both of those symptoms. An induction leak is another
possibilty.
Regards, Bill, RV4, N66WD, A&P
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "VanArtsdalen, Scott" <scott.vanartsdalen(at)lmco.com> |
| Subject: | RV-9, yeah RV-NINE |
Someone just sent an email about this a month ago or so. Explained what the
RV-9 was developed for what it's future was, etc. As I recall it was
basically an RV-6A with longer wings and lower hp engine, possibly geared
toward the trainer market. The idea was abandoned.
You should be able to find it in the archives (very recent).
----------
From: Martin Quartim[SMTP:martinq(at)cris.com]
Reply To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, February 23, 1998 10:01 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: RV-9, yeah RV-NINE
I called Van's Aircraft to ask a few questions about the RV-8 and
during
the conversation, an RV-9 was mentioned. I immediately tried to get
more
info about it but the person told me that it was just a unimportant
prototype just for them to fly and bla bla... I don't know about
that.
Does anybody has more details on the RV-9 ?
martin
RV-8-dreaming
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-9, yeah RV-NINE |
| From: | lm4(at)juno.com (Larry Mac Donald) |
writes:
RV-List message posted by: Martin Quartim I called
Van's Aircraft to ask a few questions about the RV-8 and duringthe
conversation, an RV-9 was mentioned. I immediately tried to get more
info about it but the person told me that it was just a unimportant
prototype just for them to fly and bla bla... I don't know about that.
Does anybody has more details on the RV-9 ?
martin RV-8-dreaming
Martin,
If I have my number designations right the 9 is a six with a longer wing
span. It's wing loading has been changed and uses an engine of much less
horsepower. It will, supposedly, be sold in Australia as a club trainer.
Larry Mac Donald
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gregory R. Travis" <greg(at)ciswired.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Timing Magnetos |
On Mon, 23 Feb 1998, John M. Denman wrote:
>
> I am going to buy the device that you use to time magnetos. The
> question is, what type and brand is "best". ACS, Avery, Chief etc. all
> carry the same 3 models and range in price from $40 to $80 dollars. The
> $80 dollar model makes claims that it is safer. Is it? Any other
> thoughts from people who have bought a timing device and have had some
> experience with them. Also advertised is an "external pointer" for the
> Lycoming engines that clips to the ring gear. Is it necessary or worth
> the money?
> All comments are welcome.
> Mike Denman
> "Pay attention to the details...Sweat the small shit!"
> RV6
A few years ago I bought the fancy, CHEAP ($40?), electronic model that's
about the size of a pack of cigarettes. It has three (?) LEDs on the front
and a little buzzer. You attach it via alligator clips.
It worked great for about a year then promptly failed. I bought the
$80 mechanical "buzzer" unit, the one the size of a small lunchpail,
with the gas-discharge glow lamps and mechanical buzzer. That was about
four years ago. It's still going strong and the only thing wrong
with it was when I had to open it up and readjust the buzzer contacts
with a little bending.
You don't need the external pointer for your typical Lycoming O-320/O-360. Go
off of the marks on the ring gear.
greg
greg travis greg@ciswired.com http://www.prime-mover.org/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fesenbek, Gary" <gfesenbek(at)Meridium.com> |
> Would some of you guys (or gals) that have been there done
that please
> express your opinions how and why you drilled your fuselage
skins the
> way you did and what problems you encountered. I am nearing
this project
> and wondering if I should draw the skeleton and drill the
skins or back
* drill thru the bulkheads and longerons.
I used the backdrill method as follows:
1. Mark the longerons and ribs with the appropriate spacing.
2. Drill the holes in the longerons and ribs.
3. Attach the skin
4. Get inside with the drill w/ normal 3/32 drill. You may need a
6" drill in some spots.
5. Backdrill while coordinating with your buddy who will backup
your drill with a 4 by 4 block.
It took me and my helper about three hours to do this for both aft
fuselage skins. As mentioned by others, when you drill the longerons
you don't have to worry about edge distance, flutes, etc. It's dirt
simple.
Have fun.
Gary Fesenbek
RV6AQ, installing flap actuator
Roanoke, VA
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Carb-160hp Lycoming |
Bob;
John C Darby Jr.
RV6 N61764 sold
Stephenville TX
-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com>
Date: Tuesday, February 24, 1998 01:52
Subject: RV-List: Carb-160hp Lycoming
> First, he's not getting a rpm increase of 50 rpms at idle cut-off.
I could never get this on mine either. Maybe what I thought was a slight
rise, but maybe a rise due to hopefullness.
Will these screws fall out if turned too far?
Mine would.
> The other problem is that he can only pull his mixture control out 1/4"
or
>so before the engine starts running rough
To me this is a separate problem since the first is a tapered needle and
hole where as this is a shaft (in a different hole) with a flat spot on it.
I think the overhaul handbook has the degrees of angle that the arm is
suppose to rotate to be correct, it seems that it is about 76degrees and 30
minutes. (I cheated and looked!) If the cutout down on the shaft is in
correct alignment with the arm at the top, this would provide movement from
full open to completely closed. As you probably know, this shaft has a
cutout in it, about half way thru the diam. of it. This cutout rotates
around and over a hole in the wall of the hole the shaft is in. As it
closes it acts as a gate valve to close off the hole, therefore cutting off
the flow of fuel. Was his carb yellow tagged? Reason I ask, it is possible
someone 'manufactured' a shaft for the mix. cut off and got the register
flat on the top(to the lever arm, but I've seen some with a pin in it) out
of alignment to the flat spot (to the fuel hole) down on the shaft. But I
am assuming that the arm at the top is all proper, aligned and the correct
lenght and the cable end is connected correctly.
He could take the arm off of the shaft and relocate in a twisting motion,
but this gets a little touchy.
> He's cruising at 190 mph at full throttle at 7,500 feet based on GPS
runs.
Maybe it would be best to accept what he has, to hell with the cutoff rise
and just be more careful in the mix. leaning and keep going like hell!!!!!
8<) But there I go being a shade tree mech. again.
Incidentally, I was never able to isolate that 'smoothout' change in my
engine on the way back from Burleson two (or three?) years ago, so, so much
for my mech. ability.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Unistar Computers <unistar(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Timing Magnetos |
>I am going to buy the device that you use to time magnetos. The
>question is, what type and brand is "best". ACS, Avery, Chief etc. all
>carry the same 3 models and range in price from $40 to $80 dollars. The
>$80 dollar model makes claims that it is safer. Is it? Any other
>thoughts from people who have bought a timing device and have had some
>experience with them.
I have used most of the units on the market, and finally built my own with
a few parts from Radio Shack. They are *SO* simple inside that it really
is a crime to charge $40-$80 for them. All work fine.
>Also advertised is an "external pointer" for the Lycoming engines that
clips >to the ring gear. Is it necessary or worth the money?
>All comments are welcome.
>Mike Denman
>"Pay attention to the details...Sweat the small shit!"
Well from reading your tag line... I'd say, YES its worth it, especially if
you sweat the small shit. You can rig up a pointer for the flywheel and
use Lycoming's mass produced timing mark, or you can find your own timing
mark with the pointer and piston stop (don't forget to buy one of them!).
If you were a hot rodder at heart, you'd know that you can never trust the
factory timing mark. Always locate your own and time your engine
appropriately. It is quite possible to locate the TDC point and then
correct Lycoming's mark as needed with only the piston stop and a pointer
(small wire secured on the engine pointing to the back side of the
flywheel), its just a bit more work, and for those who are uncertain about
*WHAT* it is that they are doing, it is more confusing to not have the
timing degree wheel to look at.
Bob Steward, A&P IA
AA-1B N8978L
AA-5A N1976L
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Reiff <Reiff(at)execpc.com> |
Thought I would add a couple more details to my earlier posting:
The method I used on the wing and fuselage skins is:
1) With the skin clamped onto the structure, backdrill just the end
holes of each rib/bulkhead/longeron segment. The end 2 holes in the
rib, bulkhead, and longeron segments may be predrilled from the outside
before clamping the skin on so backdrilling only requires drilling the
skin.
2) With the skin still clamped in place, draw a staight line on the
outside of the skin connecting the two backdrilled holes.
3) Mark rivet spacing along the line.
4) Drill the remainder of the holes from the outside.
The advantages of this method are that you only have to clamp the skin
on once, and you can do it all yourself. Backdrilling all the holes
usually requires a helper to hold a block of wood against the outside of
the skin.
Bob Reiff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Harrill <KHarrill(at)osa.state.sc.us> |
| Subject: | Battery Location |
Doug & others,
I, too, am considering the placement of the battery forward of the
firewall. At Lakeland last year, there were two RV - 6's with the
batteries mounted on the firewall. They used 17AH batteries that are
not as wide (deep?) as a standard battery. The effect was a much more
spacious looking cabin, at least under the panel. The only downside is
shorter service in the event of alternator failure.
Ken Harrill
RV - 6, fuselage
-----Original Message-----
From: dougm@physio-control.com [SMTP:dougm@physio-control.com]
Sent: Monday, February 23, 1998 6:39 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: Finish kit
Medema)
I also stopped at the prototype shop and talked to them
about moving the battery in front of the firewall. After
sitting in my plane at various times, I just can't bear to
give up that space (I'm 6'6"). The -8 mounts the battery
on the firewall and it looks like I'll be able to directly
use the -8 mount on my -6A.
Doug Medema, RV-6A, working on the top forward structure.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | armstpat(at)wellsfargo.com |
| Subject: | Builder's Groups |
Does anyone know of a RV builder's group in the SF Bay area?
Patrick Armstrong
pat.armstrong(at)wellsfargo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuselage skins |
>The method I used on the wing and fuselage skins is:
>1) backdrill just the end holes of each rib/bulkhead/longeron segment
>2) draw a line on the outside of the skin connecting the two backdrilled
>holes
>3) mark rivet spacing along the line
>4) drill the remainder of the holes from the outside
>Bob Reiff
The one area where this may not work well would be on the flanges of the
fuselage bulkheads. I'm thinking here of the curved flanges on 606, 607 &
608. Sometimes, the curved portion has to be moved fore or aft to flush up
to the curved portions of the rear, side skins. And, there is the problem
of dead-centering the tabs of the bulkhead. If you are back drilling in this
area, it is easy for the driller to slide the tabs up flush to the skin & drill.
Bob Skinner RV-6 400 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Gesele <scottg(at)icsnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oh no, not another primer question! |
>I finally got around to finishing my HS tonight, and I noticed alot of
>scuff marks on the interior skeleton while inspecting with a mirror.
>These marks were no doubt caused by my clumsy bucking bar beating the
>hell out of the interior. I keep telling it about leaping out of my
>hand, but I think it's afraid of the rivet gun. What do all the primer
>gurus do about these scuff marks? Do you just leave them bare, or do you
>try to shoot more primer inside? Since I'm using spray cans, I chose the
>latter, but what about the guys who have to drag out the hoses and
>mixing cans? Or am I the only one who is a total clutz with the bucking
>bar?
With the exception of the area in contact with the rivet, try a couple of
layers of duct tape on the bucking bar. This will keep those scuff marks
down to a minimum. I hit the areas where the primer was rubbed off with
some more primer shot from a hobby airbrush. It worked well during the
entire construction process.
Hope this helps.
Scott Gesele N506RV - Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | dual COM/one antenna |
Bob Archer (Sportcraft Antenna) has a product I already bought for my two
place RV that I don't have, yet.
Bob makes a dual COM antenna switch. This allows you to use one antenna for
two COM radios. It doesn't matter if the antenna is in the wingtip, external
on top of the fuselage, or external on the bottom of the fuselage. You'll
only need one antenna.
BTW, I hope some questions have been answered by Bob Archer writing about his
wingtip antenna design. If, as usually happens, the answers have led to more
questions, please feel free to contact Bob Archer directly.
BOB ARCHER
SPORTCRAFT ANTENNAS
21818 Ocean Avenue
Torrance, California 90503
Tel. 310-316-8796
Email at 74301.1665(at)compuserve.com
Jin Ayers
Maroon Marauder RV-3 N47RV
LOM M332A engine Ivoprop Magnum 68" VP prop
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David L. Macintire" <dave_mac(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pop Dimplers |
Sam Buchanan wrote:
> You are probably referring to the tip rivet holes on aileron and
> elevator ribs, etc. The method I use is to just bend the rib flanges
> apart enough to insert the nail. Set both opposing dimples, remove the
> nail, then use the hand seamer to realign the flanges as necessary. I
> have been able to reach all rivet holes using this method.
>
> Crude but effective....
>
> Sam Buchanan
> JDaniel343(at)aol.com wrote:
> >
> >
> > I have a question for you users of the dimplers.
> > They are suppose to get into tight areas but if thats so how do you install
> > the nail?
> > The nail is a good 1" or longer, with that much room needed I can get my
> > regular dimpler in these tight places. Please help. Am I doing something
> > wrong?
> >
> > John L. Danielson
John,
Sam has a good suggestion. Let me try one, too. To overcome the nail
length problem, take a copper nail (supplied with the pop dimple set or
obtained at a PPG paint/body store) and bend the copper nail. Thread it
through the female die and then the hole. Thread on the male die. Now
straighten it out with your hand or a pair of pliers. It doesn't have
to be very straight, just enough to get it in the pop riveter. The
riveter will straighten it the rest of the way. Now, use the pop riveter
and the nail will break off making it easy to take the rivet dies out.
You should have a fairly nice dimple, but the regular die set still is
superior if used in the squeezer or C-frame tool. Now you have a
problem of how to set the rivet. If you use a gun carefully and a large
chisel to buck the #3 rivet, you should be okay. Good luck, hope this
helps.
Dave Macintire
RV-6 LE
Orlando
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
<< I agree that it comes apart much easier. But, watching a few people try
to put the pins back, especially the top curve on the -4, made me want
something better.
What's the trick for getting it (with pins) back together quickly?
>>
Boris,
I cant speak for everyone else but my cowl goes together just as
easy as it comes appart. After your cowl has broken in or when the engine has
run and the cowl has been heated up say 15hrs worth of flying time, the pins
will move in and out much more freely. Its not uncommon for people to use a
drill to install and remove hinge pins when the cowl is new. After break in
time they can be removed and installed by hand without any difficulty. The
other trick if you havent already is to install a smaller diameter hinge pin
on the upper curved surface hinges.
Ryan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9, yeah RV-NINE |
> Does anybody has more details on the RV-9 ?
Check out Van's web page, specifically their "Updates and News"
section, at http://www.vansaircraft.com/sections/spe-upda.htm.
There's a whole press-release on it in there.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Haan <bobh(at)cdac.com> |
| Subject: | Grommet building tips? |
Does anyone have some building tips for how to get grommets to easily snap
into their retaining holes?
Can a slot, the width of the diameter of the tube to be supported, be cut
from the edge of the bracket to the hole holding the grommet so that the
grommet and this tube can be push through this slot into this hole?
Is it ok to slice the grommet so that it can be slipped around the tube?
Bob Haan
bobh(at)cdac.com
Portland, OR
RV6A 24461 Fuse out of jig, working on brakes
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Reiff <Reiff(at)execpc.com> |
> The one area where this may not work well would be on the flanges of the
> fuselage bulkheads. I'm thinking here of the curved flanges on 606, 607 &
> 608. Sometimes, the curved portion has to be moved fore or aft to flush up
> to the curved portions of the rear, side skins. And, there is the problem
> of dead-centering the tabs of the bulkhead. If you are back drilling in this
> area, it is easy for the driller to slide the tabs up flush to the skin & drill.
Yes, the notched sections need to be backdrilled, so you don't hit a
notch. I just backdrilled one hole on either side of each notch, ie.
consider each notched section as a "segment" as I referred to in the
earlier posting.
Bob Reiff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Wampler <jwampler(at)cisco.com> |
| Subject: | RV-4 weight and balance? |
Hi,
I'm looking for numbers for the moment arms in a typical RV-4 for
fuel, pilot and passenger. For comparson it would be interesting to
see the numbers for a 320 with wood prop and with a CS prop, so
distance from CG to prop would also be nice.
Thanks for any help,
- Jim Wampler -
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Randy Lervold <RLervold(at)compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | Shimming elevator rib |
Message text written by INTERNET:rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Did anyone else have to build a shim to put between the left elevator root
rib and the rear spar? I fit my elevator skeletons today and mine required
a .063" shim to come out just right. Just curious, but with the shim in
there everything lines up perfect.<
Hi Jon,
No, I didn't. Everything seemed to line up fine for me without it. Would be
curious to take a look though.
How did you do on bending the tabs on the left elevator next to the trim
tab? Mine came out terrible so I used a tip I picked up here on the list...
cut off the ears and fabricate a little rib to go in that space. Worked
great, and looks a little higher tech also.
My trim tab is also done and is not bad, but I am still not comfortable
with it and have ordered new parts. Did you put RTV in the trailing edge of
your trim tab? I will definitely put it in my replacement version.
Also, how did you rivet the trim tab hinge to the rear elevator spar? I was
trying to avoid dissassembling the hinge but it looks like that is the only
way.
I've been talking with Don Wentz and Randall Henderson a bit about getting
involved with the Home Wing newsletter. After Don's plea at the last
meeting and the decided lack of response in the room it kind of made me
feel guilty. These groups never work unless people pitch in, so we're going
to discuss it at the 3/7 pancake breakfast. If I do take over the
newsletter would you mind contributing occasionally? I've noticed that
you're quite articlulate here on the list.
See you at the next breakfast?
Randy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Shirley Hobenshield <shobenshield(at)cmsd.bc.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Starting 160 0-320 |
>
>ED,
>
>The guys have sent you a lot of good advice,
>Two strokes of the throttle should be plenty of prime at those temps. Lay
>off the primer unless it gets really cold. , I
>think it would benefit you to lean much more agressivly. Forget about
>that" textbook" 3000', you can lean at any altitude after you have
>leveled out and set up for cruising. Most of all, leave your mixture at
>the leaned out setting when decending to land, right up to the time when
>you shut her down ( unless of course you have to go around- then
>immediate full rich ).
>
Thanks Bill & others,
I have never leaned to such a degree as you suggest and agree with your
practices. Its nice to hear it from someone else.
The 118 0-235 I flew years ago in a Piper Tomahawk, I thought might be
similar to operate, as all the other airplanes I've operated were
Continentals. I never really got off on the Tomahawk but should have
learned something about Lycomings.
I will recheck my timing anyway and clean all plugs before next flight.
Seems there was a jumper installed across a couple off the starter switch
terminals to prevent kick-back. Sure forget some of the things we did past
3 years.
This is my plan, 1. check timing.
2. clean plugs
3. on start-up, fuel pump on some 15 sec.
4. crank over with throttle set at 1000 to 1200 rpm
5. if not firing soon - a few secounds of prime.
Should work?
Once running, lean every chance you get ( at under 75% power )
Make it work and quit babying it.
Thanks again for the respose recieved from those pilots out there.
Good imfo always appreciated! Ed Hobenshield.
Obviously this would never get the air out of that master cylinder, which must
hold over 1,000,000 air bubbles. Once I finally got pure fluid that far, I
hooked the line back up and had my assistant do the same thing at the brake
bleeder valve while I worked the pilot side brake. We finally achieved
success, but it took all evening to do one side. Tonight I fiberglassed;
maybe tomorrow I'll test the learning curve on the other brake ...
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JNice51355(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9, yeah RV-NINE |
<< an RV-6A with longer wings and lower hp engine, possibly geared
toward the trainer market. The idea was abandoned. >>
SNIP
I am not so sure the idea was abandoned. The wings were longer, but they were
actually a different airfoil. Stall speed was "really" low, and top speed was
150MPH+. It had been said that for the short-term, this airplane was only
being used for research, but I'm not so sure you could consider it abandoned.
Jim Nice
RV6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitch Faatz <mfaatz(at)SagentTech.com> |
| Subject: | Countersinking plexi |
For those of you who have finished your canopy successfully:
How did you countersink the plexiglass? Did you dimple the top strip
and
side skirts and c/s the plexi? What kind of c/s bit did you use? I
have my
normal 4-blade c/s bit with microstop cage, but I also have a
single-flute
countersink/debur bit and a 4-blade hand countersink/debur tool.
I've made it to the very end with no cracks or chips, I'd hate to blow
it now!
TIA,
Mitch Faatz San Jose, CA N727MF (reserved)
RV-6AQME working on the sliding canopy...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Grommet building tips? |
>
>Is it ok to slice the grommet so that it can be slipped around the tube?
it's commonly done even in certified airplanes. slice
the grommet using a very sharp knife (X-acto no. 11
blade?) making the cut TANGENT to the center hole.
A cut grommet can be installed around a tube or wire
bundle that's already threaded through a bulkhead.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
==========o00o=(_)=o00o==========
< If you do, >
< What you've always done, >
< You will be, >
< What you've always been. >
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | donspawn(at)juno.com |
| Subject: | Grommet building tips? |
Bob:
I don't know what or where you are working on, but I will try.
>Does anyone have some building tips for how to get grommets to easily
>snap into their retaining holes?
On my 6A wings, I don't care for them, but the plastic grommets came
with the kit so I used them.
>Can a slot, the width of the diameter of the tube to be supported, be
>cut from the edge of the bracket to the hole holding the grommet so that
>the grommet and this tube can be push through this slot into this hole?
>Is it ok to slice the grommet so that it can be slipped around the tube?
NO. The plastic don't move to well. I installed the grommets & sled the
1/2 Al pipe through them. Most normal people use plastic hose. If you
cut them, they will not be acceptable. Likely fall out.
If you got to, use rubber grommets & cut to slip around your conduit . It
is soft enough & it will stay.
Don Jordan~6A wings~Arlington,Tx
donspawn(at)juno.com
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Olaus Walsh" <olaus(at)linkport.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9, yeah RV-NINE |
-----Original Message-----
From: Martin Quartim <martinq(at)cris.com>
Date: Monday, February 23, 1998 10:20 PM
Subject: RV-List: RV-9, yeah RV-NINE
go to the vans Aircraft home page at www.vansaircraft.com there is a qute
extensive article on the RV9 in the "Special Section: Updates"it is about
three articles down, from what i read it is a trainer. It has much the same
shape and style as the ' 6A but much lighter and new with several very
exstensive mods such as slited flaps, new wing shape and other trainee
frendly items. The ' 9 wieghs in at 991 pounds without paint but read for
yourself.
just a kid looking in
Oli
>
>
>I called Van's Aircraft to ask a few questions about the RV-8 and during
>the conversation, an RV-9 was mentioned. I
>Does anybody has more details on the RV-9 ?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "VanArtsdalen, Scott" <scott.vanartsdalen(at)lmco.com> |
| Subject: | RV-9, yeah RV-NINE |
THATS where I saw it!!!
----------
From: randall(at)edt.com[SMTP:randall(at)edt.com]
Reply To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 1998 10:23 AM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV-9, yeah RV-NINE
> Does anybody has more details on the RV-9 ?
Check out Van's web page, specifically their "Updates and News"
section, at http://www.vansaircraft.com/sections/spe-upda.htm.
There's a whole press-release on it in there.
Randall Henderson, RV-6
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitch Faatz <mfaatz(at)SagentTech.com> |
| Subject: | Builder's Groups |
I'm working on setting up a Bay Area RV group for builders and flyers.
Sharing of knowledge, tools to loan, and visiting member's projects,
etc. I'm in the process of formalizing some of the processes and will
definitely contact you in a couple of weeks once I get things nailed
down a little better.
Have you started building an RV yet or just thinking about it?
Mitch Faatz San Jose, CA N727MF (reserved)
RV-6AQME working on the sliding canopy...
> -----Original Message-----
> From: armstpat(at)wellsfargo.com
> Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 1998 8:11 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Builder's Groups
>
>
> Does anyone know of a RV builder's group in the SF Bay area?
> Patrick Armstrong
> pat.armstrong(at)wellsfargo.com
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: gear leg fairing's |
<< I'm looking for those one piece fairing's. I have heard of the harmon
rocket
guy and two other people by the name of Tracy Saylor and Mark Frederick. I
need #'s and advice, can anyone help? >>
Let me be one to welcome you new guys (and gals) aboard, but this is info that
is readily available in the Yeller Pages hosted on Mike Hartmann's URL at
http://www.sound.net/~hartmann/yelrpage.htm
We are also linked from Van's site. Please print out a copy and keep it near
you at all times. Our you can go to it and click on the hypertext links. I
try to update and correct with known new suppliers, errors or new #s as I am
madfe aware of them (usually bimonthly). I think you will agree that it is a
good resource.
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com |
I've been reading a series of older RV-ator articles where Van's seems
very concerned about canopy cracking due expansion and contraction due
to changing temperatures. He outlined some fairly elaporate procedures
apart from what is in the manual to protect the plexiglass by giving it
lots of free space for what he said was up to 5-6" of expected expansion
and contaction. He also then warned about the use of special plexiglass
drill bits, and then about heat buildup causing stress point cracking
from a less than 100% perfect technique when using a cut-off wheel for
initial installation and trimming.
________________________________________________________________________________
half the canopies in the country either already have or will imminently
suffer sudden and catastrophic cracking.
I had a lot of help finishing my plane, and when it came to the canopy,
I was little more than the gopher. I do not know, but would have to
guess that the guy who helped me did not take extra-ordinary steps to
allow for future canopy movement. (I'd call him if I could, but he's now
off and homeless, touring the country for a year in a motorhome)
Therefore, I am considering tearing out my canopy (of my flying RV-6A)
before it becomes damaged to make the modifications. This is not exactly
how I want to spend my summer vacation and hope that I can determine
that it is not necessary. But, I suppose I would rather do it now, with
a still good, uncracked, already fitted canopy in the comfort of my home
hangar, than wake up some time to a big nasty surprise 1000 miles from
home.
My questions are these. How many people out there have suffered
temperature related canopy cracking on an RV-6 tip up style
installations?
When this does happen, does the cracking tend to start off small
allowing a few hours of continued flight; or is a sudden large crack
going to decimate the integrity of the canopy requiring immediate
replacement?
Andy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Marty Sailer <mwsailer(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Shimming elevator rib |
Jon Elford wrote:
>
>
> Listers,
>
> Did anyone else have to build a shim to put between the left elevator root
> rib and the rear spar?
Jon;
I also had to shim the root rib. I did it at the main spar. When I
tried to slide the rear spar into position (elevator in jig) it was
about 3/16 to wide at the tip end. I talked to another builder who
excepted a bulge. I decided to make another rear spar, It turned out
great. I received my emp kit in July 96. I hope this has been fixed.
MARTY RV-6A/N464MS Erwinna, Pa.
starting fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Webb <toddwe(at)MICROSOFT.com> |
| Subject: | Issue with HS411PP bearing assy. |
When I drilled the #12 hole through the HS411's my bit wasn't long enough it
appears that the holes are slightly out of round. Is this reason enough to
rebuild the whole thing HS609's and all?
Thanks,
Todd Webb
RV-8 HS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eric.Henson(at)cendantmobility.com |
| Subject: | 4 Sale-Piper Pitot |
Anyone needing a VFR pitot? I have a blade type Piper pitot w/out the
heating element. First $50.00 takes it. All reports I have from the list
gives very reliable performance on RV's. I decided to go full IFR so I can't
use this one. Please respond off list.
Eric Henson
eric.henson(at)cendantmobility.com
________________________________________________________________________________
I ask about this using 040 and nut plates a few days ago because I was worried
about the hinges cracking. Wendell Hall, who has 60hrs on his RV4 used nut
plates because of cracking problems with the pino hinges. I'm not worried
about how hard or easy things are (I just installed one piece alum fuel lines
from root to selector) I just want to do the practical thing.
65 more days...
Carey Mills
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JRWillJR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9, yeah RV-NINE,not |
The RV-9 is in Vans latest newsletter--it is a 6 based Trainer with long wings
to take advantage of the 0235 lower output. I think the long, narrow wings are
ugly and take away much from its looks. The Grumman 2 place Yankees used those
0235 and could have used a longer wing for the same reason. I do not think it
is time to start selling your RV-8 tailkits so as to hop on to the 9. I for
one , hope Vans does not mess with the wing--taper it, lenghten it or anything
else. RV's original recipe. JR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jelford(at)TRANSPORT.COM (Jon Elford) |
>Van's Aircraft to ask a few questions about the RV-8 and duringthe
>conversation, an RV-9 was mentioned. I immediately tried to get more
>info about it but the person told me that it was just a unimportant
>prototype just for them to fly and bla bla... I don't know about that.
>Does anybody has more details on the RV-9 ?
>martin RV-8-dreaming
>
As per Ken Scott and Bill Benedict at our Home Wing meeting in January, the
RV9 is simply a test bed for some new ideas. It started life as -6A, but
ran into some interference with a raspberry patch when the engine quit on
short final into Van's strip. They rebuilt much of the airplane, including
a completely new set of wings. The airplane also sports an O-235 Lycoming
and a Sensenich metal prop. The wings are noticably different than the
"production" RV wings. They are longer, have a shorter chord, swept back
wing tips, noticably more camber on the top and very long flaps. I may be
wrong, but I gathered from Ken that this particular airfoil planform had
never been flown before. Someone please correct me if I am wrong. Van
decided to try them. The plane is the master of the slow flight. Van has
had it as slow as 43mph IAS. On one flight he reportedly had a GPS ground
speed of -15mph (stiff headwind)!
As of that meeting, Van had no plans of adding this type of setup to the RV
kits. As Ken said, "in this business you can go forward and you can go
backwards, but you can't stand still."
That's about all I know....
Jon Elford
RV6 #25201
Finishing up empennage-
WINGS ON THE WAY!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Timing Magnetos |
In a message dated 2/24/98 11:09:19 AM Eastern Standard Time,
unistar(at)mindspring.com writes:
> I have used most of the units on the market, and finally built my own with
> a few parts from Radio Shack. They are *SO* simple inside that it really
> is a crime to charge $40-$80 for them. All work fine.
>
Bob,
Do you have or know where I can get the schematic for the magneto timing
device so I can make my own as you did ?
Mark McGee
RV 4, waiting for NY weather to get warm enough to paint main spars.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Carb-160hp Lycoming |
<< First, he's not getting a rpm increase of 50 rpms at idle cut-off. He's
turned the adjustment screw quite a ways to the left (lean ?)>>
I believe this is the rich direction. Right?
<< to where he
feels the screw is about to come out. I think he went about 1 1/2 turns
counter clockwise. Will these screws fall out if turned too far? I've
never turned mine out that far so don't know. I told him that I thought he
needed to enrichen the mixture (clockwise.)
The other problem is that he can only pull his mixture control out 1/4" or
so before the engine starts running rough. At our altitude of around 4,500
feet my mixture is out about 1 1/2 inchs before the engine starts to
roughen. This is on the MA 4 SPA carb. Any ideas?
He's cruising at 190 mph at full throttle at 7,500 feet based on GPS runs.
I can't believe that his 6A is so light, with a full gyro and upholstery.
One guy I won't race with, that's for sur >>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Carb-160hp Lycoming |
Bob,
If you remember from two years ago I had the same problem with my engine.
<>
If he has a new engine he might not see the rpm drop as the engine is still
too tight. Does he have a wood prop? Wood props don't due much of the 50 rpm
thing because of the poor flywheel effect.
<>
The mixture screw is an idle circuit and has no effect on the mixture in
cruise.
<>
Not only do I have an idea, I have the answer. There are four models of the
MA4-SPA carbs that run too lean on our RV's. I have one. It has something to
due with our airbox and the additional airflow from the ram-air effect. Not
only could I not lean the engine in cruise, my temps were into the red line on
climb. I tried many solutions but the only one that works is to drill the main
jet. It really isn't such a big deal. If my memory is correct my jet was a
#41 (drill bit size) and I took it to a # 38 or #37. I did it one size at a
time until I got it right. What you are looking for is an 80 to 100 degree
spread between rich and lean in cruise.
Check the archives as I made a lot of posts on this subject. Like I said, I
tried every crazy idea out there but this was the one that worked.
If your friend wants to talk about it, have him give me a call.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC - NJ
(908) 537-7550 home
(212) 441-1225 work
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael V Seager <rv6cfi(at)vernonia.com> |
Boris wrote:
>
>
> I agree that it comes apart much easier. But, watching a few people try
> to put the pins back, especially the top curve on the -4, made me want
> something better.
>
> What's the trick for getting it (with pins) back together quickly?
>
> > I hate to tell you this but. Using the hinges per plans is not only
> > faster for removal but makes uncowling easier also. It only takes a couple
of
> > seconds to pull 2 hinge pins vs several minuets to remove many screws. IMHO
it
> > looks alot beter to.
> > Ryan
>My vote is for screws and nut plates, holds the cowl tight and does not wear out
and you do not burn your hands decowling a hot airplane. Replaced too many
broken hinges. Mike
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: canopy cracking |
<< From the seriousness that these articles suggested, I would suspect that
half the canopies in the country either already have or will imminently
suffer sudden and catastrophic cracking. >>
Andy,
Are you crazy??? Have you ever heard the term If it aint broke dont
fix it? Unless thier is some other reason you want to replace your canopy I
would recomend you leave it alone. I have seen and fly with many RV's and I
have not seen very many with cracked canopies. I think I would wait you may be
pleasantly surprised.
Ryan Bendure
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Royce Craven <roycec(at)ozemail.com.au> |
Has anyone any suggestions for the removal of the screw in the carb where
the carb temp probe is inserted?
Another builder gave up trying when he broke the edge of the brass screw slot.
I have tried my yet, but I was wondering if there is a substance to soften
the thread sealant used on the new carb.
Thanks
Royce Craven
RV-6A Melbourne Oz
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BStobbe <coro_01(at)weblabs.com> |
| Subject: | Re: drill guards bent? |
<34F29539.C7F100AC(at)acslink.aone.net.au>
>
>I use those little spring drill stops, or guards, or whatever you call
>them. You know, the things Avery sells that keeps you from drilling too
>far. Tonight I noticed that on the thinner bits, like #40, the guard was
>causing the bit to bend at the tip, and wobble. When I took the guard
>off, I noticed that it was bent slightly, and upon checking, realized
>all my guards are bent a little. Is this normal? If it is, how the heck
>do you drill a round hole with them?
I noticed the same thing and found that the wobble is affected by how tight
you make the set screw in the top collar. If you only lightly snug the
screw the wobble doesn't seem to occur - at least on my drill stops.
You're right though, if you take the stop off of the bit you can see that
there is a definite side load being applied by the spring.
Bruce Stobbe
RV-6
canopy frame
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oshkosh Housing |
<< Does anyone have the phone numbers for housing at Oshkosh? We are
interested
in single family housing and the dorms. Thanks!!
Becki Orndorff
>>
I tried to get a room for this year upon arrival last year, and we were told
that all were taken. This was the day before opening!
Check six!
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | CHUCKD(at)pasco.lib.fl.us |
| Subject: | Re: RV-9, yeah RV-NINE |
part a small amout of heat will do it. I just had to take one
out on a new carb on a friend's o-360a1a on his Glasstar. I did his by
drilling down through the center of the brass plug (not all the way through)
and using an "easy out" to remove it.
Rick Bell A&P RV4 N83RB "Margaritaville Air Express"
them. You know, the things Avery sells that keeps you from drilling too
> far. Tonight I noticed that on the thinner bits, like #40, the guard was
> causing the bit to bend at the tip, and wobble. When I took the guard
> off, I noticed that it was bent slightly, and upon checking, realized
> all my guards are bent a little. Is this normal? If it is, how the heck
> do you drill a round hole with them?
>
> Moe Colontonio
> RV-8 VS
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SAVOYINTL(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Oshkosh Housing |
Oshkosh housing hotline is available at 920-235-3007. Hours are 9-4 Central
time, Mon-Fri. Housing list will not be available until after March 3rd.
Lloyd Morris
Lago Vista, TX
RV-6, Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gcomfo(at)tc3net.com (Gordon Comfort) |
I ask about this using 040 and nut plates a few days ago because I was
worried
> about the hinges cracking.
> Carey Mills
Carey: The hinges can be made to work very well. Cracking might be
caused by inadequate clearances, either between the cowl halves or
between individual eyelets if they are misaligned. On the curved upper
hinges, an undersize pin is used and it helps to make the fitup a little
loose. The hinges can be attached to the fiberglass using a combination
of Hysol epoxy adhesive thickened with either flock or CaboSil and soft
AN 426 rivets. These will form nicely without crushing the fiberglass.
Good preparation will ensure adhesion. I personally think it is a good
idea to use platenuts and screws behind the spinner because that area
seems to be stressed quite a bit more. I remove and install the curved
upper pins through the oil filler hole without undue difficulty.
Gordon Comfort
N363GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeffrey Davis" <jdavis1(at)ford.com> |
This is a non-RV question but one I need help with.
I have an A65 in my Sunday flyer (1946 Luscombe 8A - no primer!!) and am having
the following problem.
At annual this year my mech replaced a cyl and the primer fitting at the
engine. Now the engine will not start when hot. It starts fine cold (first
pull) but will not start hot. Prior to the annual it started 1st. pull hot or
cold. My IA can not find the problem. Any suggestions.
--
Jeffrey S. Davis
Senior Research Engineer
Advance Vehicle Technology
Ford Motor Company
Phone (313)845-5224 Fax (313)845-4781
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sharlene Shipley or Bruce Knoll <snsbfk(at)mail.sage.net> |
| Subject: | Re: drill guards bent? |
<34F29539.C7F100AC(at)acslink.aone.net.au>
Hi Moe,
I had the same problem, Two choices and both work. You can bend the guards
to align them with the bit. Otherwise, you can enlarge the distal hole so
the guard doesn't bend the bit. This works because the guard is only to
prevent you from going too far once the bit breaks thru the material to be
drilled.
Keep plugging away,
Bruce Knoll
snsbfk(at)mail.sage.net
>
>I use those little spring drill stops, or guards, or whatever you call
>them. You know, the things Avery sells that keeps you from drilling too
>far. Tonight I noticed that on the thinner bits, like #40, the guard was
>causing the bit to bend at the tip, and wobble. When I took the guard
>off, I noticed that it was bent slightly, and upon checking, realized
>all my guards are bent a little. Is this normal? If it is, how the heck
>do you drill a round hole with them?
>
>Moe Colontonio
>RV-8 VS
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fesenbek, Gary" <gfesenbek(at)Meridium.com> |
| Subject: | drill guards bent? |
>>I noticed that it was bent slightly, and upon checking, realized
>>all my guards are bent a little.
I find that a " duct tape wrapped around the drill on the chuck end,
(about four wraps) does the trick for me.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JDaniel343(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Still tooling up -- Drill Press Tips |
I aggree with Graham Jones previous post,
You also don't want to put the flutes into the chuck because this will not
allow shavings from drilling to be expelled, it is also hard on the chuck if
these chips are forced into the chuck. This is a good way to destroy a chuck.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Timing Magnetos |
Mark,
One of the Sports Aviation a whaile back had the 'how to' build a cheap mag
timer. Sort of like one of Bob Nuckols articles, may have been one of his.
If you don't get it any where else, let me know and I'll try to look it up .
John C Darby Jr.
RV6 N61764 sold
Stephenville TX
>Do you have or know where I can get the schematic for the magneto timing
>device so I can make my own as you did ?
>
>Mark McGee
Then I put
nut plates on them. I used some screws that the FBO had, stainless steel
and had a washer that was almost impossible to get off. If I remember
correctly (which is doubtful) I had 13 screws in the cowl. But I didn't use
a flange strip all the way across, just these tab like things.
Some say do not use countersinks on this fiberglass cowl. Maybe not, but I
did and never had a crack nor beginning of one. I did at one time use some
screws and a raised washer, sort of like a uphostry washer, chrome plated,
looked good and didn't need any countersink in the fiberglass.
Results--it took me far less time to install these screws than it did to
install the hinge pin of the hor. side pins. And a lot less messey, since I
always had to lube the side pins to get them in, resulting in that
grey-black slimey stuff that alum and oil exposed to vibration always gives
you.
Press on friend, it will work.
John C Darby Jr.
RV6 N61764 sold
Stephenville TX
>I ask about this using 040 and nut plates a few days ago because I was
worried
>about the hinges cracking. Wendell Hall, who has 60hrs on his RV4 used nut
>plates because of cracking problems with the pino hinges. I'm not worried
>about how hard or easy things are (I just installed one piece alum fuel
lines
>from root to selector) I just want to do the practical thing.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Patrick Kelley <patk(at)mail.ic.net> |
| Subject: | Re: HS603PP, dimpled before deburred :( |
It is generally unnecessary to deburr dimpled holes; the dies remove any
burrs. However, remove any noticeable flash or curls of aluminum before
you dimple; I find a pass with a shop rag snags aluminum shavings still
attached to the hole and removes them. Also, many builders lightly
deburr dimpled holes, not to remove burrs but to make the rivets seat
better. If you do this, it requires a very light touch, practice on
scrap first.
PatK - RV-6A
Larry Bowen wrote:
>
> I dimpled the HS603PP before I deburred. According to the manual, this wrong.
What should I do?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | armstpat(at)wellsfargo.com |
Would any of you lucky people already flying an RV6 share your power-off
glide ratio stats at a given weight?
d most of the units on the market, and finally built my own with
>>a few parts from Radio Shack. They are *SO* simple inside that it really
>>is a crime to charge $40-$80 for them. All work fine.
>
>I would like to make one. Do you have any instructions, or know where I
>could get instructions?
>Thanks,
>Mark Nielsen
>RV-6 flying, 166 hrs.
>Do you have or know where I can get the schematic for the magneto timing
>device so I can make my own as you did ?
>
>Mark McGee
>RV 4, waiting for NY weather to get warm enough to paint main spars.
I made it with a small beeper that RS sold and a 9V battery and 2 LEDs.
Right off the top of my head I don't have the circuit or parts call out for
it, but I did a hand out for our EAA chapter 6-8 years ago with all the
details. If I can find a copy of that I'd be happy to mail it or send it
as an attachment.
I'm getting requests like this, so maybe I'll have to put up a web page to
show how its done...
Bob Steward, A&P IA
AA-1B N8978L
AA-5A N1976L
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott Gesele <scottg(at)icsnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Carb Temp Probe |
>Has anyone any suggestions for the removal of the screw in the carb where
>the carb temp probe is inserted?
>Another builder gave up trying when he broke the edge of the brass screw slot.
>I have tried my yet, but I was wondering if there is a substance to soften
>the thread sealant used on the new carb.
>
>
>Thanks
>
>Royce Craven
>RV-6A Melbourne Oz
I didn't have any problems getting mine out of the carb. The engine was new
from Van's, so the screw never had a chance to get "frozen" in the hole.
Just ensure that you screwdriver fits properly in the slot (correct size
screwdriver) and the whole assembly is at room temp (I had nasty problems
removing the primer plugs when the engine was ice cold .... that's a whole
other story). Hold the screwdriver in the slot with a fair amount of
pressure and give it a quick, sharp twist. The brass screw should come
right out, at least it did for me.
Hope this helps.
Scott Gesele N506RV - Flying :)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ronald Vandervort <rvanderv(at)linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us> |
| Subject: | Mike and Headset Jacks...? |
Here's a question on jack installation;
I have a neighbor who is quite knowledgable on avionics and
electrical stuff. He says the jacks should be mounted with a fibre
washer/bushing to insulate the jack from the aircraft.
1) I just received four new jacks from aircraft spruce. They had
no special washers included in the package for such a mounting.
2) With the antirotate tab built into the jacks, it doesn't look
like the manufacturer is expecting the mount to be insulated.
What say you yee oh wise-men of cyber space? To insulate or not
to insulate the jacks from the airframe?
Ron Vandervort, RV-6Q, wiring
Seattle area
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Starter Overspeed . . . |
>Bob- Just read your thoughts on starters being engaged. Assuming that
>there is power applied to the starter due to some fault in the system, and
>assuming the starter is not actually engaged on the flywheel, the starter
>would freewheel, right?
Not exactly. On all exept the old bendix geared Prestolite pigs
the starter pinion gear is pushed out to engage the engine ring
gear by the same solenoid actuator that closes the electrical
circuit between battery and motor. If the engine is running, the
starter is essentially free-wheeling because the overrunning clutch
prevents the rapidly spinning pinion shaft from feeding engergy
back INTO the slower running starter.
Assuming electrical power is applied to the motor but NOT providing
torque to the engine (for what ever reason) then the armature indeed
climbs to some practical, terminal velocity. With the permanent
magnet starters, terminal velocity is quite sedate . . . when
BACK EMF in the armature (wires rotating rapidly in a FIXed field)
approaches applied voltage (BATTERY) the speed increases no further.
For series wound starters like the B&C and the Prestolite, there is
no theroetical limit for no-load speed EXCEPT that friction and
windage provides a modicum of load that prevents the armature
speed from going clear to the moon. None the less, the terminal
velocity for these starters is MUCH higher than for the PM
motor devices and overspeed damage is much more likely.
>In this case, is there likely to be any damage
>done to the starter itself? If so, how long would you suppose this
>condition could prevail without causing damage? Would the type of starter
>be a factor?
Sure, and for the reasons I've outlined above. Now . . . someone
is CERTAIN to suggest the PM motor starter is a better choice
because it's overspeed failure probability is lower. Folks should
know that the REASON B&C choose to stay with series field motors
is because field flux in a series wound motor goes UP as load
on the motor goes up . . . they peform better in heavy torque
applications like cranking engines. This means the motor
IS LESS EFFICIENT (heating losses in series windings not present
in fixed magnets) but efficiency is not an issue for a motor that
runs 3-8 seconds per flight cycle. It's ability to get the engine
running over the widest envelope of conditions (temperature,
battery condition, engine tune-up, etc). The decision NOT to
go PM was not a trivial consideration . . . PM motors are cheaper
to build. But their inrush currents are higher which increases
probability of contactor sticking . . . EVERY design decision
is a trade-off.
So, the long answer to your short question is, "yes, unloaded
starters are stressed pretty hard by overspeeding operation -
some starters worse than others." But I would add that the
likelyhood of a starter coming to grief for this reason does
not figure strongly in choices of design for reasons of
performance under normal operating conditions.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
==========o00o=(_)=o00o==========
< If you continue to do, >
< What you've always done, >
< You will continue to be, >
< What you've always been. >
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6junkie(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | The true cost of building an RV |
Maybe there is something to the question of health concerns for those of us
who choose to build our own aircraft. I don't want to bring anybody down, but
here's my story...
I started building my aircraft in October of 1990. I can say without
reservation that I had no idea what I was doing. I would spray Veriprime
using a simple cotton mask and no glasses. Back then I primed everything.
Three coats! My shop was a one car garage with a closed door. I used MEK and
Dupont Equipment cleaner like it was wash water with no precautions. After
about six months I got a little smarter and got a good respirator and goggles
for painting and wore gloves. I used solvents more sparingly.
In this time frame my wife got pregnant with our first child. Kyle was born
with Spina Bifida and a host of other neurological defects. Now, neuro-tube
defects can happen for any reason but Ill always wonder if my use of
chemicals contributed to this. About six months after Kyles birth I stopped
priming alclad aluminum altogether.
In March of 1993 I removed my fuselage from the jig and started installing the
floors of the plane. I was bent over at the waist during this entire
installation. After about a week the floors were completed. I stood up after
installing the last screw (I used screws instead of rivets) and blew out a
disk in my back (L3/L4). I had 3 months of physical therapy and couldnt go
to work. I didnt work on the plane for six months.
So what did my night IFR RV6 cost me? More than money! Im sure that
everyone who creates a homebuilt aircraft has a similar story to tell (epoxy
allergy, latex allergy, blown out knees, lost fingers, lost eye, divorce). My
point is, dont discount the true cost of building an aircraft. It is a
tremendous undertaking for you and your family.
I don't regret building my plane but if I could I would do things differently.
That's the price of experience.
Gary Corde
RV-6 N211GC - NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | randall(at)edt.com (Randall Henderson) |
| Subject: | Re: Grommet building tips? |
> >Is it ok to slice the grommet so that it can be slipped around the tube?
>
> it's commonly done even in certified airplanes. slice
> the grommet using a very sharp knife (X-acto no. 11
> blade?) making the cut TANGENT to the center hole.
> A cut grommet can be installed around a tube or wire
> bundle that's already threaded through a bulkhead.
I have seen this before and have emulated it without knowing
why. Can you tell me the reason for cutting it at a tangent
to the hole? Perhaps I'm dumb, but I it isn't obvious to
me.
Randall Henderson
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)traveller.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Primers / Corrosion |
Don McCall wrote:
> But consider this --
>
> Corrosion is somewhat a random process, and nobody can predict EXACTLY under
> what conditions an airplane will be stored and maintained, or whether (or how
> soon) corrosion will become a problem under those conditions. So, if I do
> nothing, and there's a 99% chance that corrosion won't be a problem, is that
> acceptable?
>
> Perhaps; perhaps not. If I can virtually GUARANTEE no corrosion for as long
> as I own the airplane (100%, not 99%, or 90%, or whatever the true, unknown,
> number is) for the added cost of maybe $150 and 100 hours, is it unreasonable
> to take those precautions? And what if I fully intend to keep the airplane
> for only 5-10 years (say, until I lose my medical, or build something else)
> and then sell it to somebody ELSE who plans to have it for a long time, or
> what if one of my sons decides to take flying lessons and ends up flying HIS
> kids in the airplane 30 years from now? Sure, maybe the thing will last that
> long regardless. But, isn't aviation all about accepting a REASONABLE level
> of risk, but doing everything possible to manage and minimize that risk?
> Seems to me like there's plenty of room for both viewpoints...
Just one more comment on this subject (I hear the groans now...) ;-)
To totally prevent corrosion (100% guarantee?), we need to realize that
anyplace a rivet penetrates the skin or other part, corrosion has a
place to start. This means that to "guarantee" that there will be no
corrosion, we need to wait until ALL drilling is completed on the
airframe before primer is applied!
Can you image an RV airframe with 13,500 clecoes in it?
To assure that all surfaces that were not alclad are protected (which is
any hole that penetrates an alclad part) we need to dip each rivet in
primer and insert the wet rivet in the hole. Also, any scratches
incurred in the construction process must be treated.
Obviously, we can carry this whole scenario to absurdity. The point
being, there is no "guarantee" against corrosion at some point in time
and under some conditions. As Don pointed out, we all have to determine
how much risk we are willing to assume.
I think my chances of messing up a crosswind landing are much higher
than falling victim to the insidiousness of corrosion....
Sam Buchanan (already spent way more than my $.02 worth)
sbuc(at)traveller.com
"The RV Journal" http://www.ath.tis.net/~sbuc/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Oshkosh Housing |
Becky,
If you call the EAA (the number is on your membership card) they
will give you the correct numbers to call.
Ryan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Diamond Aviation <SQL(at)best.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Carb-160hp Lycoming |
Definately he should get his idle mixture screw close but he may
not be able to notice a 50 rpm rise if he's running a lightweight
wood prop with a strong compression engine. Not enough enertia
at the prop. I spent a year and a half figuring that one out.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Bibb <rbibb(at)fore.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Mike and Headset Jacks...? |
Makes for a less noisy installation as you avoid potential ground loops when
you insulate.
It will work without them but at the risk of picking up noise.
I'm sure Bob Nuckells can illuminate this better than I.
Richard
>Here's a question on jack installation;
>
> I have a neighbor who is quite knowledgable on avionics and
>electrical stuff. He says the jacks should be mounted with a fibre
>washer/bushing to insulate the jack from the aircraft.
Richard E. Bibb
RV-4 N144KT
Oak Hill, VA
rbibb(at)fore.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank van der Hulst <frankv(at)pec.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: HS603PP, dimpled before deburred :( |
patk(at)mail.ic.net wrote:
> It is generally unnecessary to deburr dimpled holes; the dies remove any
> burrs. However, remove any noticeable flash or curls of aluminum before
> you dimple; I find a pass with a shop rag snags aluminum shavings still
> attached to the hole and removes them. Also, many builders lightly
> deburr dimpled holes, not to remove burrs but to make the rivets seat
> better. If you do this, it requires a very light touch, practice on
> scrap first.
> Larry Bowen wrote:
> >
> > I dimpled the HS603PP before I deburred. According to the manual, this
> wrong. What should I do?
I agree with Pat.
Check it carefully. If it looks OK, move on. If there's some little
lumps or whatever in the bottom of the dimples, give them a light
deburr and move on.
Don't do it again!
Frank.
PS: Rather than just give the part number (eg HS603PP), could people
please also give the part description. It's been a while since I
worked on my HS, and I can't really remember what an HS603 is (rear
spar?)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RBusick505(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Question (Humor only) |
<< I have an A65 in my Sunday flyer (1946 Luscombe 8A - no primer!!) and am
having
the following problem. >>
Sorry I can't resist, but the obvious problem is the lack of primer.
I live in the SF Bay area and we blame everything on El Nino. Accordingly, I
have begun to blame every RV problem on... you guesed it "Primer".
My apologies to Jeffrey S. Davis, I do not mean to make light of your problem,
and I do hope someone has a solution.
Bob Busick
RV-6
Fremont CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fesenbek, Gary" <gfesenbek(at)Meridium.com> |
| Subject: | Primers / Corrosion |
>>To assure that all surfaces that were not alclad are protected (which
is any hole that >>penetrates an alclad part) we need to dip each rivet
in primer and insert the wet >>rivet in the hole.
Oh no, not the primer wars again!!!!
Actually the mil-spec suggests that for riveting dissimilar metals the
paint dipping should be done. I guess I win the ANAL award for today,
because that is actually the way that I do it. (Only on the dissimilar
metals that is).
It's quite easy to do and I always have some left-over paint in the
fridge (Mason Jar) ready to do just this.
Gary, RV6AQ
Roanoke, VA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fesenbek, Gary" <gfesenbek(at)Meridium.com> |
| Subject: | Grommet building tips? |
If you don't, your wires will be able to work their way against the
metal easier that if you choose tangent. Avoid cutting at all if you
can, but sometimes you can't.
Gary, RV6AQ
Roanoke, VA
-----Original Message-----
From: randall(at)edt.com [SMTP:randall(at)edt.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 1998 12:30 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Grommet building tips?
Henderson)
> >Is it ok to slice the grommet so that it can be slipped
around the tube?
>
> it's commonly done even in certified airplanes. slice
> the grommet using a very sharp knife (X-acto no. 11
> blade?) making the cut TANGENT to the center hole.
> A cut grommet can be installed around a tube or wire
> bundle that's already threaded through a bulkhead.
I have seen this before and have emulated it without knowing
why. Can you tell me the reason for cutting it at a tangent
to the hole? Perhaps I'm dumb, but I it isn't obvious to
me.
Randall Henderson
randall(at)edt.com
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Acker" <n164ra(at)mindspring.com> |
For those of you pondering engine monitors, I just came across a sidebar on
the Allegro M816 or "Lynx" unit in the latest Sport Aviation. Mike
Melville used one on his 'round the world LongEZ trip.
Rob (RV-6Q).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Mike and Headset Jacks...? |
>
>Makes for a less noisy installation as you avoid potential ground loops when
>you insulate.
>
>It will work without them but at the risk of picking up noise.
>
>I'm sure Bob Nuckells can illuminate this better than I.
>
>Richard
>
>
>>Here's a question on jack installation;
>>
>> I have a neighbor who is quite knowledgable on avionics and
>>electrical stuff. He says the jacks should be mounted with a fibre
>>washer/bushing to insulate the jack from the aircraft.
That's exactly right. Now . . . there are lots of jacks mounted
solid to airfram in thousands of airplanes. The systems don't
have enough noise to be noticed or objectionable. However, if you're
beginning to chase down cause for complaint of (1) alternator
whine in your headsets or (2) alternator whine on your transmitted
signal to other stations, then insulating the jacks from local
ground is one of the FIRST things to consider.
I have the washer kits in stock. $1.00/kit. 1 kit for each
headset or microphone jack.
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
==========o00o=(_)=o00o==========
< If you continue to do, >
< What you've always done, >
< You will continue to be, >
< What you've always been. >
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paul Besing <rv8er(at)doitnow.com> |
| Subject: | Arizona Builder's Group |
Any builders from Arizona that would be interested in forming a builder's
group?
Paul Besing
RV-6A QB (197AB)
Building up the tools....
Still waiting on kit.....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | re: grommett cutting . . . |
>>Do you mean the cut is radial making a slit from the outside edge of the
>>grommet to the hole in the grommet on a line thru the center of the hole or
>>do you really mean tangent to the hole which would cut a notch out of the
>>grommet.
>
Not radially . . . the bundle or tube being protected can wedge itself
into the cut and spread the grommet material. Pressure against the
tangental cut tends to close the slice . . . not open it.
>
> Sorry to question, but describing this in words is difficult and
> I want to get this right.
>
No problem. I've put a sketch up on our website describing the
technique at:
<http://www.aeroelectric.com/grommet.pdf>
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
==========o00o=(_)=o00o==========
< If you continue to do, >
< What you've always done, >
< You will continue to be, >
< What you've always been. >
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dr. John Cocker" <jcocker(at)istar.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: The true cost of building an RV |
Gary, I am really sorry about what happened to your child, but I think
you are worrying about cause and effect where there is no evidence to
link the two together.
As far as your back is concerned, I too had back trouble after bending
double and riveting all day - I couldn't move for two days - so I
watched Georges Video's instead. In fact it was useful as I found a
mistake. I managed to install the frame whch accepts the main spar in
backwards. This is very difficult to do, and should only be attempted by
those with superior mechanical skills. Watching the video made it all
come clear, and I was able to correct it.
Has anyone else done this - or do I go into the RV / Guiness Book of
Records ?
Oh - the point I was trying to make is - if your back is going to go, it
will go, whatever you are doing. My partner prolapsed a disc picking up
the newspaper, and that is hardly a high risk occupation.
Best wishes,
John Cocker RV 6A Flying with 110 hours since July.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dr. John Cocker" <jcocker(at)istar.ca> |
| Subject: | Wanting to purchase a completed RV 6 |
I have a friend who would like to puchase an RV 6, please contact him
directly :
Jim Kingsley
519 942 2379
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JNice51355(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: HS603PP, dimpled before deburred :( |
<< I dimpled the HS603PP before I deburred. According to the manual, this
wrong. What should I do? >>
Deburr now.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JNice51355(at)aol.com |
Awhile back, someone posted the list to ask how to De-Magnetize an engine
mount. He was having all kinds of problems after an annual inspection. Does
anyone know what the final outcome was?
Jim Nice
RV6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Graham Jones <gratech(at)acslink.aone.net.au> |
| Subject: | Re: drill guards bent? |
<34F29539.C7F100AC(at)acslink.aone.net.au> <3.0.1.32.19980225090645.00a22038(at)mail.sage.net>
Moe,
A suggestions made to me after I showed my shiny new guards to a
friend.... He picked
up a length of small rubber fuel line lying on my bench, the sort that
M/cycles use, and
slipped it over the drill bit.....It fit pefect and for the smaller
drills, if there's no
smaller hose, either use tape or a loop or two of tie wire to hold it in
place...
As Bruce Knoll said "the guard is only to prevent you from going too far
once the bit
breaks thru the material to be drilled."
GRRR! The wisdom of hindsight.....
Graham Jones
-6A Emp
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oshkosh Housing |
Sounds like someone (other than me! I sleep under the wing!) should write to
Tom Poberezny-(whew, hope that's right)!!!!!!!!!!! If anyone can work out
additional housing he should be the one!!!!! If you want to break a million
youv'e got to find a place for them to stay!!!!
Dave Pann
150 Present-RV6 this year.(I hope)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | spencer <dspencer(at)kiva.net> |
| Subject: | Re: bleeding brake lines!#*!*# |
This WILL work if nothing else has for you -guaranteed (I learned
through much experimentation with several planes over several years -and
coined several new and different verbal expressions in the process).
DISCONNECT the master cylinders from their MECHANICAL attachments (i.e.
the rudder pedal assy and/or f'wall bracket) so that you can turn the
things to such angles that AIR BUBBLES cannot lodge anywhere (the top
end typically -gravity being what it is). Hopefully you have enough
slack in your flexible lines to do this. Then while you are holding the
cyl in whatever orientation have your helper (supermodel, eh?) pressure
bleed from the bottom up.
Scott (an A&P)
N4ZW
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WstcttPrss(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: HS603PP, dimpled before deburred :( |
In a message dated 2/24/98 10:26:03 PM, you wrote:
<>
Larry-
Keep building. Check the holes for any sharp edges and deburr if you have
any. Generally speaking, dimpling does alot of the deburring all by itself.
You may find you prefer this way of working.
Jeff Carpenter
RV-6
Altadena, CA
wstcttprss(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | spencer <dspencer(at)kiva.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 4 Sale-Piper Pitot |
Eric.Henson(at)cendantmobility.com wrote:
>
>
> Anyone needing a VFR pitot? I have a blade type Piper pitot w/out the
> heating element. I decided to go full IFR so I can't
> use this one.
they sell a kit for adding the heating element(s) to this pitot. If the
pitot has the 'holes' for the elements already I guess it's not too
difficult.
Scott
N4ZW
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: canopy cracking |
winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com wrote:
>
>
>
> >From the seriousness that these articles suggested, I would suspect that
> half the canopies in the country either already have or will imminently
> suffer sudden and catastrophic cracking.
>
> Andy
>
Andy
I did mine 8 years ago per the plans and it has not cracked, I sure
would not tear it apart if it was mine.
--
Jerry Springer RV-6 N906GS First flight July 14, 1989 :-) Hillsboro, OR
jsflyrv(at)ix.netcom.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | skimura(at)dnc.net (Steve Kimura) |
| Subject: | Primer end-all :-) |
I just got a NASA blurb talking about a new patent awarded to some
employees for creating a new primer (corrosion resistant coating)! Check
it out at www.dnc.net/eaa/eaa-tech.htm
Steve Kimura skimura(at)dnc.net
RV6A 24376 VS
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Kitz <jkitz(at)greenapple.com> |
Some time ago, someone mentioned putting in a panel light from Vans with
a potentiometer for dimming and I am ready to order one from Vans.
Which one is it? There is an eyeball cockpit light for 12.95 and a
rotating map/panel light for 40.00 in the catalog.
Thanks.
John kitz
N721JK
Ohio
2.4 hours today and was it ever beautiful for February!!
________________________________________________________________________________
I have a low time io-360 which will be overhauled soon. Am wondering about
using the high compression pistons (10:1). What plusses or minuses do you
engine gurus know about doing that? ie, added power?? reduced tbo????
Thanks.
hilljw(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jerry calvert <calverjl(at)flash.net> |
Hey guys,
Is the va-146 bearing(HS411PP hinge) supposed to be primered? If so, is
it ok if primer gets on the black plastic seal?
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok
-6a Emp cleaned & alodined...ready to shoot primer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Alex Peterson <alexpeterson(at)MCI2000.com> |
Per the plans, the outside surface of the plexiglas is about lined up in
the vertical plane with the outboard surface of the side bars of the slider
frame (the jog in the side skirt allows this). However, at its aft end,
the plexiglas inside surface rests on the outboard surface of the rear bows
of the slider frame. Due to this, the joint where the side rails meet the
rear bows should have a jog of one plexiglas thickness (the rear bow should
be inboard about 3/16" from the side rail). Mine were welded flush. I
plan to cut them and move them inboard the appropriate amount. Am I
missing something? What have others done?
Thanks in advance,
Alex Peterson
6A, Maple Grove, MN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MAlexan533(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Pro-Seal Mix Ratio? |
I am getting ready to seal my RV-8 tanks, and the Sealant can says the ratio
is 100:10 PBW; 100:7.6 PBV. What is the proper ratio? And what do you use to
meter the proper amount for the proper ratio? Any techniques here? Thanks.
Von Alexander
RV-8 #80544
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MAlexan533(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Bottom Wing Skin Overlap |
My RV-8 manual says to overlap the outboard top skins over the inboard skins,
but says nothing about the bottom skins. The plans show the opposite for the
bottom skins, inboard over outboard. Which is correct?
Von Alexander
RV-8#80544
Closing the Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pmartin Compaq" <martin(at)gbonline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Question |
Dear Jeff,
I have a Luscombe 8C with A 75, have also had and 8 A with a A65. The
problem you are haveing probably has nothing to do with the annual. I
believe that is just coincidental. The problem you describe, "difficult
start when warm or hot " is usually caused by bad condensor and or bad
coils in the magnetos. Also if you have the old original magnetos, you may
also have weak rotating magnets in the magnetos. You can get the parts at
reasonable prices from Fresno Airparts. They aalways advertise in Traade a
Plane. If you have to send out the magnetos for repair, consider replacing
them with new Slick Mags with impulse couplings. The price will be about
the same and you will notice a dramatic improvement in starting.
Dick Martin
RV8 N233M
Meyers OTW
Luscombe 8C
----------
> From: Jeffrey Davis <jdavis1(at)ford.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Engine Question
> Date: Wednesday, February 25, 1998 9:15 AM
>
>
> This is a non-RV question but one I need help with.
> I have an A65 in my Sunday flyer (1946 Luscombe 8A - no primer!!) and am
having
> the following problem.
> At annual this year my mech replaced a cyl and the primer fitting at the
> engine. Now the engine will not start when hot. It starts fine cold
(first
> pull) but will not start hot. Prior to the annual it started 1st. pull
hot or
> cold. My IA can not find the problem. Any suggestions.
>
> --
> Jeffrey S. Davis
> Senior Research Engineer
> Advance Vehicle Technology
> Ford Motor Company
> Phone (313)845-5224 Fax (313)845-4781
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)traveller.com> |
| Subject: | Re: HS603PP, dimpled before deburred :( |
WstcttPrss(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
> In a message dated 2/24/98 10:26:03 PM, you wrote:
>
> < wrong. What should I do?>>
Standard Aircraft Handbook (every RV builder should have a copy)
re: Drilling and Countersinking, deburring, page 54:
"Deburring shall not be performed on predrilled holes that are to be
subsequently form countersunk (dimpled)."
I find a couple of passes with a Scotchbrite pad gets rid of nearly all
burrs prior to dimpling.
Sam Buchanan
sbuc(at)traveller.com
"The RV journal" http://www.ath.tis.net/~sbuc/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Leslie B. Williams" <lesliebwilliams(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: canopy cracking |
Andy, I haven't heard of anyone's already successfully installed, flying
canopy cracking except from some object striking it. Maybe there's someone
else on the list who has. I know of several who had cracks develop during
installation, one of which had to be replaced. It was being drilled in a
very cold garage at the time. On my first tip-up, I pretty much followed
the instructions and had no problems. Although I haven't yet fiberglassed
the front down on my second tip-up, it hasn't cracked either. I did have
problems fitting the newer type canopy using the older type (current)
instructions and ended up trimming the front more than I am proud of which
I'm still not sure that I can live with.
If you drill out a pop rivet or two on the rear glass and around the bow,
and remove a few screws on the side skirts, you should be able to tell if
the holes are drilled oversize per instructions. If they are not, it isn't
that difficult to remove the pop rivets and drill out the holes in the rear
section. The main canopy bow can also be removed likewise fairly easily and
the holes enlarged. Hopefully this would be enough so that you wouldn't
have to completely remove the whole canopy, if it's neccessary at all.
Les Williams/RV-6AQ/Tacoma WA
>I've been reading a series of older RV-ator articles where Van's seems
>very concerned about canopy cracking due expansion and contraction due
>to changing temperatures.
>From the seriousness that these articles suggested, I would suspect that
>half the canopies in the country either already have or will imminently
>suffer sudden and catastrophic cracking.
>My questions are these. How many people out there have suffered
>temperature related canopy cracking on an RV-6 tip up style
>installations?
>
>When this does happen, does the cracking tend to start off small
>allowing a few hours of continued flight; or is a sudden large crack
>going to decimate the integrity of the canopy requiring immediate
>replacement?
>
>Andy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Bottom Wing Skin Overlap |
>My RV-8 manual says to overlap the outboard top skins over the inboard skins,
>but says nothing about the bottom skins. The plans show the opposite for the
>bottom skins, inboard over outboard. Which is correct?
>Von Alexander
>RV-8#80544
>Closing the Wings
Von, the answer is: It depends.
Since the outboard skin is thinner than the inboard skin, you will have a
smaller step-up at the overlap if you put the outer skins under the inboard
skins, giving you a neater looking seam. This is the preferred method on the
bottom skins.
On the top skins, the outer skin is lapped over the inner skin to do a better
job of keeping rain water from running down the wing into the seam. The top
skins can be done either way, depending on whether you are more concerned
about the appearance of the seam or the possibility of water getting into
your wing (you primed it, right...).
Kyle Boatright
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael V Seager <rv6cfi(at)vernonia.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Primers / Corrosion |
Fesenbek, Gary wrote:
>
>
> >>To assure that all surfaces that were not alclad are protected (which
> is any hole that >>penetrates an alclad part) we need to dip each rivet
> in primer and insert the wet >>rivet in the hole.
>
> Oh no, not the primer wars again!!!!
>
> Actually the mil-spec suggests that for riveting dissimilar metals the
> paint dipping should be done. I guess I win the ANAL award for today,
> because that is actually the way that I do it. (Only on the dissimilar
> metals that is).
>
> It's quite easy to do and I always have some left-over paint in the
> fridge (Mason Jar) ready to do just this.
>
Only if you want to store it in a wharehouse for 30 years with no
corrosion
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JRWillJR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Timing Magnetos-easy |
Hello, you do not need an elaborate Magneto timer--in fact you can probably
build a nice one for cheap. You simply need a circuit that will indicate to
you when the points just begin to open. Attach one end to the p-lead and the
other to ground--perhaps a battery and lightbulb . You do not need the Pointer
you mentioned. We A&Ps usually make our own with a protractor and a coffe
can---however, if on the Lycoming engine your starter ring has not been
modified to eliminate the indexing feature you can find the compression stroke
on number one--put the finger over the plug hole and feel for it--- and align
the index marks to the case split or the mark at the starter. At this piont
your indicator should show the points just opening. Some timing indicators the
light goes out at this point--others it comes on at this point so make sure of
which type you have --loosen the magnetos and slowly move them till this
happens at the indexed point--be carefull that the impulse coupling is not
cocked or your setting will be incorrect. Also--be sure to remove the top
plugs so that the engine cannot start. If that impulse coupling pops and the
mags are hot or the p-leads are not grounded it will START, if only
momentarily, and you will not be happy. JR, A&P, plain and simple
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pro-Seal Mix Ratio? |
<< I am getting ready to seal my RV-8 tanks, and the Sealant can says the
ratio
is 100:10 PBW; 100:7.6 PBV. What is the proper ratio? And what do you use to
meter the proper amount for the proper ratio? Any techniques here? Thanks.
Von Alexander >>
Von, 100:10 pbw I believe means parts by weight in other words if you are
using grams then it would be 100 grams of 1 can and 10 grams of the other. If
you want less you could cut that in half and use 50 grams and 5 grams.
100:7.6 pvb is Parts by Volume. In other words using the same teqnique as
above you might use ounces or something along those lines for volumetric
measurment rather than weight.
A small kitchen type food scale would work well for what your doing.
Ryan
t need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro-Seal Mix Ratio? |
>
>
> I am getting ready to seal my RV-8 tanks, and the Sealant can says the ratio
> is 100:10 PBW; 100:7.6 PBV. What is the proper ratio? And what do you use to
> meter the proper amount for the proper ratio? Any techniques here? Thanks.
>
Von,
100:10 PBW is 100 parts of Pro Seal to 10 parts of catalist by weight. or 10 to
1.
This can be done on any accurate scale.
100:7.6 PBV. is by volume. This is a little tougher to do, but if you make a pile
of pro seal and then a pile of catalist about 10 times smaller the mix will be
close. Too much catalist and the mix sets up to a little faster while to little
causes a slower cure time.
I had a triple beam scale and used the by weight ratio.
Hope this helps
Gary Zilik
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tom Glover <tglovebox(at)bc.sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: 4 Sale-Piper Pitot |
> >
> > Anyone needing a VFR pitot? I have a blade type Piper pitot w/out the
> > heating element. I decided to go full IFR so I can't
> > use this one.
>
> they sell a kit for adding the heating element(s) to this pitot. If the
> pitot has the 'holes' for the elements already I guess it's not too
> difficult.
>
> Scott
> N4ZW
>
>WHO is "they"? I could repair the "OK" one I bought.
73
Tom Glover VE7DQ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Blake Harral <bharral(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro-Seal Mix Ratio? |
-- Sealant can says the ratio is 100:10 PBW; 100:7.6 PBV. What is the proper
ratio?
No doubt they are both correct ratios 100:10 by weight or 100:7.6 by volume.
So you could acheive the proper ratio by either of the following methods
By Weight -
10 oz of the white and 1 oz of the black
(oz of weight, not liquid oz - that would be volume)
By Volume -
100 teaspoons of the white and 7.6 teaspoons of the black
You can make a simple ratio balance to establish the 100:10 weight ratio.
Think of a see-saw with one "arm" ten times the length of the other.
Now put some of the white stuff on the 'short' end of the see-saw,
and then add enough black stuff at the other end until the see-saw
just balances. I hope this crude description gets the idea across.
I bought some polyester auto body filler the other day. It came with
a plastic spreader that was pink. The instructions simply said to add
enough of the 'red' hardener to the 'white' filler until the mixture was the
color of the spreader. A clever idea not requiring any additional
measuring devices!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oshkosh Housing |
Hey Guys,
Last year 97 we were the guests of SODER-IT ( The guy doing the demo''s on
light material sodering ) He has been staying with the same family for the
past 4 years.
about 3 minutes from the OSH. The EAA has a complete list of people that are
willing to turn there home into a Bed & Breakfast during the show. I never
thought I would enjoy staying with complete strangers, but it was a great
time & going back next year, I learned more about Wisconson & The Green Bay
Packers & the real impact that the Air Show has on that town.
So give it a try.
BSivori(at)AOL.COM
N929RV ( Reserved )
Wings in Jigs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | lottmc(at)datastar.net (Michael C. Lott) |
| Subject: | Re: Mike and Headset Jacks...? |
I will definitely install some of these in my plane, since they
help to avoid ground loops!
________________________________________________________________________________
Any suggestion on where I can find a good first run 0-360? I'm in Michigan.
Thanks in advance
Brian Eckstein
eckstein@net-link.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: engine overhaul |
>
>I have a low time io-360 which will be overhauled soon. Am wondering
about
>using the high compression pistons (10:1). What plusses or minuses do
you
>engine gurus know about doing that? ie, added power?? reduced tbo????
>Thanks.
>hilljw(at)aol.com
Overhauling a LOW time engine??!? Well, if it's got compression
problems, then maybe so. Anyway, high compression cylinders can be more
fuel sensitive, and generally do not extend TBO, often shortening it by
a couple hundred hours. The aerobatic engines, which are often tweaked
to the max, rarely if ever exceed TBO.
I'm planning on a basic, 180 hp IO-360 in my -8, as the higher
compression 200 hp versions have track records (at least in my area) of
being more finicky and shorter lived.
Just my opinions and observations, and I don't claim to be an "engine
guru" by any means! Besides, "guru" type people tend to get surrounded
by the feds and hassled for weeks on end. :)
Best of luck to you!
Brian Denk
-8 #379
rigging left aileron and flap
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Carb Temp Probe |
| From: | wstucklen1(at)juno.com (Frederic W Stucklen) |
My carb has two brass plugs in the same area near the venturi. Neather
has screwdriver slots. Which one is the correct one for the probe, and
how do I get it out?
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
(Working on 2'd RV-6A - Chevy Powered!)
wstucklen1(at)juno.com
>
>If the carb is apart a small amout of heat will do it. I just had to
take one
>out on a new carb on a friend's o-360a1a on his Glasstar. I did his by
>drilling down through the center of the brass plug (not all the way
through)
>and using an "easy out" to remove it.
>Rick Bell A&P RV4 N83RB "Margaritaville Air Express"
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Cabe" <robert.cabe(at)usaa.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro-Seal Mix Ratio? |
I made small amounts. Used a very simple postage scale that I got at
Office Max for one U.S. dollar.
After a batch or two, you'll find that you will know if you have it right
by the color. If it's too grey, you need more of the "black stuff".
Bob
RV-6 engine baffles
----------
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Mike and Headset Jacks...? |
Ron;
It corrected some playback noise in my radio. An MX11. Sounded very mushy
when tramx. Sent to who I bought it from. Their correction was to send me
the 2 washers per jack. One is flat, other has raised portion that fits in
the hole plus over the flat surface. Fixed that problem. They did not come
with the radio nor with the jacks. I've never seen them advertised until
Bob says he has them.
As for your last question. If the radio works fine, don't insulate. If it
has queer noises in it, try insulation.
I ain't very wise, but it is my suggestion.
John C Darby Jr.
RV6 N61764 sold
Stephenville TX
>electrical stuff. He says the jacks should be mounted with a fibre
>washer/bushing to insulate the jack from the aircraft.
> 1) I just received four new jacks from aircraft spruce. They had
> no special washers included in the package for such a mounting.
> 2) With the antirotate tab built into the jacks, it doesn't look
> like the manufacturer is expecting the mount to be insulated.
>
> What say you yee oh wise-men of cyber space? To insulate or not
>to insulate the jacks from the airframe?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Homepage RV8 pics |
G'day listers,
I've posted a few new pics on my homepage. Give it time to load, it's
Geocities, but it's free! Gotta save my pennies for that engine, ya
know.
Best wishes to all,
Brian
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/9656/akroshomepage.htm
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: engine overhaul |
| From: | brucegreen(at)juno.com (Bruce Green) |
>>>>>I have a low time io-360 which will be overhauled soon. Am wondering
about using the high compression pistons (10:1). What plusses or
minuses do
you engine gurus know about doing that? ie, added power?? reduced
tbo????<<<<<
I spoke with the people at Firewall Forward in Colorado who hold an STC
for the higher compression pistons at least in the 200hp engines and he
said the chief disadvantage was increased oil consumption. A quart every
4-5 hours instead of every 9-10 hours. Many of the 200hp engines with
low compression use a quart every 4-5 hours anyway, so I elected to stay
with stock pistons.
Bruce Green
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Unistar Computers <unistar(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Timing Magnetos-easy |
>Hello, you do not need an elaborate Magneto timer--in fact you can probably
>build a nice one for cheap. You simply need a circuit that will indicate to
>you when the points just begin to open. Attach one end to the p-lead and the
>other to ground--perhaps a battery and lightbulb.
Unfortunately, the simple battery, bulb and wire device described above
will *NOT* work at all. The points and the coil in a magnetos are in
PARALLEL, so when the points open the coil still completes the circuit!
The reason we have to use a $40-$80 vibrating mag timer is that the pulsing
current is partially blocked by the inductance of the coil in the magneto,
and one can hear (and see) the indication of when the points open by the
change in pitch of the buzzer and the change in the light(s).
I went looking for my mag timer building instructions from my EAA newletter
article last night. No luck yet, but then I've moved to larger housing
*TWICE* since I wrote it, so did I really think it was going to be easy to
find?
I'll put the drawing on the Web as soon as I can find it. And *YES* you
can build it for cheap! Seems like I spent less than $10 for my parts
including the battery!
Bob Steward, A&P IA
AA-1B N8978L
AA-5A N1976L
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Unistar Computers <unistar(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: HS603PP, dimpled before deburred :( |
>Standard Aircraft Handbook (every RV builder should have a copy)
>re: Drilling and Countersinking, deburring, page 54:
>
>"Deburring shall not be performed on predrilled holes that are to be
>subsequently form countersunk (dimpled)."
>
>I find a couple of passes with a Scotchbrite pad gets rid of nearly all
>burrs prior to dimpling.
>Sam Buchanan
>sbuc(at)traveller.com
>"The RV journal" http://www.ath.tis.net/~sbuc/rv6
Sam,
I was taught in school to de-burr *BEFORE* dimpling! The reason was that
the stretching operation of dimpling would stress the "rough" edge of the
metal left by the drill bit. When a hole is drilled in a material which
yields like AL does, the bit pushes the metal out the back of the hole as
it breaks through. This leaves a ring of highly stressed metal around the
exit hole which has plastic deformed ahead of the drill bit. Proper
de-burr removes this edge and lets the metal return to its normal state,
thus reducing the chance of cracking. The de-burr *BEFORE* dimpling
reduces the stress and allows the metal to be formed again without further
stretching the metal "plowed up" by the bit.
The way I've seen some folks de-burr I don't doubt it shouldn't be done
*THEIR* way before (or after dimpling)! Some local builders including 1
RV-4 wanted to put tiny "countersunk" de-burrs on every hole. In 0.020"
stock they would "de-burr" so deeply as to enlarge the hole! These were
the same builders who were taking pride in how much "better" they were
building their planes than the factory workers built the spam cans. The
factory couldn't "afford" to do such nice work on the de-burr....
The idea is just to remove the raised edge where the drill bit broke
through the metal, not to have visible chamfering of the hole edge. For
those who don't subscibe to the theory that one should de-burr the holes
since you will "pound a rivet in the hole", consider that pounding that
rivet enlarges the hole, and that same stretching operation is what causes
the very cracks we are concerned about from dimpling.
Bob Steward, A&P IA
AA-1B N8978L
AA-5A N1976L
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: engine overhaul |
I thought about this and my "engine guy" talked me out of it on one point:
I'd have to give up the auto fuel option. That convinced me...
Bill B
Not yet flying
Stayed wth 150 hp pistons and don't anticipate any regrets
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Mike and Headset Jacks...? |
<< I will definitely install some of these in my plane, since they
help to avoid ground loops!
>>
Just FWIW, Jim at RST Engineering told me on two occasions when I asked about
this NOT to isolate the jacks from ground for his intercom/audio panel kits.
He's the only "guru" that I've ever heard give this advice, and it may be
specific to his product. Though I did it the way he said to, I admit to an
ongoing uneasiness about how it will work in practice. Since I have decided
not to use my RST unit, I may be ordering the washer kits from AreoElectric.
Bill B
finishing up panel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Samuel Steele <steele(at)loyno.edu> |
| Subject: | Magellan GPSFOR SALE |
I have a hand held Magellan GPS made in 1993, serial number 4B000142,
approximately 4" x 8". Asking $200.00. Works on battery or the main
battery.
Sam Steele
1321 Aztec Avenue
Metairie, LA 70005
Sam Steele e-mail: steele(at)beta.loyno.edu
Physics Dept. Machinist
Loyola Univ. N.O.
(504) 865-3646
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Wills <willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro-Seal Mix Ratio? |
Von,
I made a simple balance beam scale that uses disposable unwaxed paper cups
to put the 2 parts in. Only took about 15 minutes to make and gives you an
opportunity to exercise your brain a little doing a simple weight and
balance calc.
Mike Wills
RV-4 (fuse ordered)
willsm(at)manta.nosc.mil
>
>I am getting ready to seal my RV-8 tanks, and the Sealant can says the ratio
>is 100:10 PBW; 100:7.6 PBV. What is the proper ratio? And what do you use to
>meter the proper amount for the proper ratio? Any techniques here? Thanks.
>Von Alexander
>RV-8 #80544
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Webb <toddwe(at)MICROSOFT.com> |
| Subject: | Magellan GPSFOR SALE |
What model? I was just looking for a GPS III Pilot,
but $700 is a little much for me right now...
Todd Webb
Microsoft
-----Original Message-----
From: Samuel Steele [mailto:steele(at)loyno.edu]
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 1998 7:33 AM
Subject: RV-List: Magellan GPSFOR SALE
I have a hand held Magellan GPS made in 1993, serial number 4B000142,
approximately 4" x 8". Asking $200.00. Works on battery or the main
battery.
Sam Steele
1321 Aztec Avenue
Metairie, LA 70005
Sam Steele e-mail: steele(at)beta.loyno.edu
Physics Dept. Machinist
Loyola Univ. N.O.
(504) 865-3646
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Webb <toddwe(at)MICROSOFT.com> |
| Subject: | Magellan GPSFOR SALE |
Expiry-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 08:37:57 -0800
Todd Webb would like to recall the message, "RV-List: Magellan GPSFOR SALE".
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris Ruble <cruble(at)cisco.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Timing Magnetos-easy |
For the cheap-skates in the croud;
There's no need to buy an expensive timing box for your mags. What you need is
1. A hack-saw blade (no bends please)
2. A pack of zig-zag (or other brand) rolling papers.
Place the hack-saw blade on the case at the seam in the center as a pointer to
the timing mark on the crank. Use a zig-zag as feeler-guage in the points.
Set the crank to the timing mark and the points should be just opening and will
allow the paper to slide out with very little effort. This has the added
advantage of flushing out pitted points, as the paper will not pull through the
points of they are pitted. 600 grit emery cloth will fix the pitting.
Recheck the timing with your choice of expensive test units to shake any
remaining doubt.
This trick was passed to me by an old & grizzled A&E before he got his permanent
wings mounted.
Chris
>
>
> >Hello, you do not need an elaborate Magneto timer--in fact you can probably
> >build a nice one for cheap. You simply need a circuit that will indicate to
> >you when the points just begin to open. Attach one end to the p-lead and the
> >other to ground--perhaps a battery and lightbulb.
>
>
> Unfortunately, the simple battery, bulb and wire device described above
> will *NOT* work at all. The points and the coil in a magnetos are in
> PARALLEL, so when the points open the coil still completes the circuit!
> The reason we have to use a $40-$80 vibrating mag timer is that the pulsing
> current is partially blocked by the inductance of the coil in the magneto,
> and one can hear (and see) the indication of when the points open by the
> change in pitch of the buzzer and the change in the light(s).
>
> I went looking for my mag timer building instructions from my EAA newletter
> article last night. No luck yet, but then I've moved to larger housing
> *TWICE* since I wrote it, so did I really think it was going to be easy to
> find?
>
> I'll put the drawing on the Web as soon as I can find it. And *YES* you
> can build it for cheap! Seems like I spent less than $10 for my parts
> including the battery!
>
> Bob Steward, A&P IA
> AA-1B N8978L
> AA-5A N1976L
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pro-Seal Mix Ratio? |
| From: | seaok71302(at)juno.com (mike a adams) |
>I am getting ready to seal my RV-8 tanks, and the Sealant can says the
ratio is 100:10 PBW; 100:7.6 PBV. What is the proper ratio? And what do
you use to meter the proper amount for the proper ratio? Any techniques
here?
>Thanks.
>Von Alexander
>RV-8 #80544
>
>
100:10 is the ratio by weight PBW W=weight
100:7.6 is ratio by volume PBV V=volume
to use the weight method build a small balance scale 2" and 20" from the
fulcrum
to use the volume method ( the one I prefer ) get a small set of kitchen
measuring spoons with ml ( mine have 1, 2, 5, 15 ml )
Cut out the table below and tape it to the big can:
5= .38
10= .76
15=1.14
20=1.52
25=1.90
30=2.28
35=2.66
40=3.04
45=3.42
50=3.80
55=4.18
60=4.56
65=4.94
70=5.32
75=5.70
80=6.08
85=6.46
90=6.84
95=7.22
100=7.60
With the ml spoons & table I can quickly mix any quantity of seal.
example (2) 15ml level scoops(big can) =30ml plus a slightly overfull 2ml
scoop(small can) = approx 2.28ml, 4 15ml+5ml scoops(big can) =65ml plus
a 5ml scoop(small can)=4.94ml.
mix on a scrap piece of Al. Enjoy with milk and cookies!
( point of interest... Boeing uses seal between any dissimilar metal
joins... ala wing center section splice plates on the 4 or 6, I'm not
sure if the 8 has steel plates )
mike adams
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: engine overhaul- increase comp to 10:1? |
>I have a low time io-360 which will be overhauled soon. Am wondering
about using the high compression pistons (10:1). What plusses or
minuses do
you engine gurus know about doing that? ie, added power?? reduced
tbo????<<<<<
>>
Most who have met me would agree the I have no problem with an a/c having "too
much" power. (insert Tim Taylor grunting here) That being said, here are a
few things to consider about running compressions higher than 9.0:1.
With the higher HP 4 cyl engines, you have larger pulses (amplititude) at the
same freq as the 0-320. This adds some degree of "shake" to the airframe. If I
recall correctly, the 200 hp -8 has a counterweighted engine- (Scott McD can
confirm or deny this)- this engine operated very smooth in the Omega II when I
got a hop in that plane. Also, I don't think that all IO-360's are
counterweighted- Can another lister confirm this?
So I suppose my point is: With a non-counterweighted engine, you could be
adding a vibration to the airframe that might no be necessary, and could be
somewhat destructive. This could be similiar to the primer factor- it keeps a
50 yr airframe from lasting that long, but it could go 45 yrs instead. Big
deal.
I'd say that the first signs would show up on the elevators and rudder, due to
the counterweights on these surfaces. Your instrument life might not be what
it would be in a smoother airframe, also. I would suppose that crankshaft
counterweights would dampen some of the increased amplitude out, but not all.
This increased vibration is the case with Rockets running 10.0:1 compression,
and all 540's are counter-weighted.
The folks at Lycon said they restricted chrome cyls to 9.0:1, due to the
higher heat from the higher comp (= higher power) peeling the chrome from the
cyl walls. 10.0:1 and up would require steel cyl assys- usually more $$$.
So it would seem that there is more to this story than simply a piston change
equalling higher power and efficiency- there are strings attached. I wouldn't
worry about TBO or oil consumption- these factors don't really have a large
effect on operating costs of the a/c that fly 100 hrs/yr or so- insurance and
hangar fees are the big factors.
I would welcome input from any who have made this compression change *after*
having flown their a/c.
Check six!
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne) |
| Subject: | Re: engine overhaul |
Here is a minus and a plus to using higher compression pistons in *ANY* engine:
Plus: You get more power/torque which is obviously nice.
Minus: You get more power/torque which places a greater strain on the bottom
end - the rods, crankshaft, case etc. Probably changes torsional
vibration characteristics too.
Basically what you are doing is what auto enthusiasts call "souping it up" or in
Britain they call it "tuning". It lowers engine life and probably reliability.
I assume Lycoming uses these in some engine - does they continue to use the same
lower end components?
hal
>
> I have a low time io-360 which will be overhauled soon. Am wondering about
> using the high compression pistons (10:1). What plusses or minuses do you
> engine gurus know about doing that? ie, added power?? reduced tbo????
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Luker, Michael G." <luker.michael(at)mayo.edu> |
| Subject: | Starter Solonoids. |
I just recently had the same problem as some of you have indicated. My
starter solonoid is from a reputabal aircraft supply store. WHile
flying back from another airport 40 miles away, I failed to realize my
starter was still engaged. About 15 miles from the airport I noticed
that my alternator was putting out to many amps, I started shuting
things down and this did not help. Then my RMI engine analyzer went
blank, my radio wouldn't work etc etc. When I landed at the home base
I took off the cowl saw my starter was still engaged, and my battery
was dead. realized that my starter solonoid was stuck. I got a new
solonoid, tried to start the airplane to no avail. Because the starter
solonoid stuck I burned up my starter, and ruined my battery. THis is my
third solonoid from this supply store. I wonder if there is a problem
with the supplier of these solonoids. theres a lot of people
experiencing this problem, it cost me a lot of money. I usually buy
things from Wicks.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Primer end-all :-) |
| From: | wstucklen1(at)juno.com (Frederic W Stucklen) |
Steve,
While this is very interesting, it seems to be a totaly new protection
approach. It may be years before we actually "see" the product in the
market place. One question I have is how does it applied weight compare
to current products in the marketplace. Another is how it has to be
applied.
I guess all good thing come in time..... For those that didn't see
it on the web, I've tacked it onto the end of this message.....
Fred Stucklen RV-6A N925RV
(Working on 2'd RV-6A - Chevy Powered!)
wstucklen1(at)juno.com
>
>I just got a NASA blurb talking about a new patent awarded to some
>employees for creating a new primer (corrosion resistant coating)!
Check
>it out at www.dnc.net/eaa/eaa-tech.htm
>
>Steve Kimura skimura(at)dnc.net
>RV6A 24376 VS
NASA News
National Aeronautics and
Space Administration
John F. Kennedy Space Center
Kennedy Space Center, Florida 32899
Jan. 29, 1998
KSC Release No. 15 - 98
TWO KSC EMPLOYEES RECEIVE DISTINGUISHED PATENT AWARD
An innovative approach to combating the corrosive seaside environment
at Kennedy Space Center has led to a prestigious award for two KSC
employees. Karen Thompson and Coleman Bryan, both chemists for NASA at
the space center, are members of a team recently honored with the 1997
Distinguished Patent Award by the Department of Energy's Los Alamos
National Laboratory (LANL).
"It was very rewarding to have our patent chosen as the patent of the
year from the many significant inventions that were brought to fruition
at the LANL this year," observed Bryan after returning from an awards
ceremony at Los Alamos.
U.S. Patent 5,658,649, entitled Corrosion Resistant Coating, was
selected as the top patent from the 41 patents issued at LANL in 1997.
The formula for the coating features polyaniline as its active
ingredient. Polyaniline is a polymer made by connecting many hundreds of
molecules of aniline end-to-end by means of a chemical reaction.
The environment at KSC is one of the most corrosive in the continental
United States. The two Space Shuttle launch pads are less than a mile
from the Atlantic Ocean and are exposed daily to salt spray and high
humidity. Compounding the corrosive effect is hydrochloric acid and
intense heat generated from a Space Shuttle launch, which attacks
protective coatings on structures and machinery at the pads.
In 1986, KSC set out to formulate a conductive polymer coating that
would be more protective than current materials. NASA KSC contracted
with the Department of Energy's Los Alamos National Laboratory for
assistance in the development work. The conductive polymer development
effort has exceeded expectations and could revolutionize the coatings
industry.
The idea of using conductive polymers to form corrosion-inhibiting
coatings is very novel. Leaders in the field of electrically conductive
polymers were initially skeptical about the concept of attempting to
make coatings of such polymers, since their molecular structure makes it
difficult to produce them in a form that can be sprayed or brushed onto
a surface.
Also novel is the idea of using such materials to protect a substrate
from corrosion. In fact, university experts specializing in the field of
conductive polymers are working with NASA to better understand one test
result, called "throwing power." Areas on metal samples coated with the
new conductive polymer coating were scratched through to the bare metal
and the samples immersed in aerated hydrochloric acid for 12 weeks.
Despite the rugged exposure, the bare metal showed very little
corrosion. This throwing power of the new coating has been of great
interest to industry and NASA KSC is working with an industry partner to
further develop the new coating.
While the new conductive polymer coating was first developed for the
space program, it may find applications around the world. The Navy is
interested in the coating for submarine and aircraft carrier uses. The
Admiral of the Pacific Fleet in charge of maintenance received a
briefing on the new technology from Thompson, and the Navy has joined
the project team and is funding additional testing for Navy
applications.
The new coating could also yield environmental and economic benefits
for the United States. Most protective coatings manufactured today
contain chromium and Europe currently commands the chromate coating
market.
The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency and its European equivalents
are expected to ban the use of all coatings containing chromium by the
year 2000 because of environmental concerns. The work being conducted at
KSC in developing conductive-polymer coatings work represents the
forefront of chromium-free coating technology. If the resultant coatings
are able to replace chromium-containing coatings, benefits to the U.S.
economy could be substantial.
As current coatings are banned from use (as planned) or restricted, the
new conductive polymer coating will provide corrosion protection while
reducing pollution. The new conductive coating does not contain metals
and doesn't pollute soils. In contrast, current repair procedures
involving metal-containing coatings can result in pollution of soils due
to sandblasting debris. Also, controlling sandblast debris is very
costly when large structures are involved.
"We hope that coatings are developed which fulfill the needs identified
by the Office of Space Flight (NASA's sponsor for the effort)-- as well
as many additional needs throughout NASA. We also hope that the coatings
developed will solve many needs identified throughout the country and
the world. It has been rewarding to work with partners in two other
government agencies, industry, and several universities in an effort
where all team members have contributed in several areas of expertise to
develop such a novel technology," Thompson said.
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Russell Duffy" <rad(at)pen.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Homepage RV8 pics |
>I've posted a few new pics on my homepage. Give it time to load, it's
Looks somewhat familiar :-)
Rusty
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <bskinr(at)trib.com> |
>Is the va-146 bearing(HS411PP hinge) supposed to be primered? If so, is
>it ok if primer gets on the black plastic seal?
>Jerry Calvert
Jerry,
I primed mine with a small brush using left over primer. That way is
easier than masking & you can keep the primer off the seal. The aluminum
for the bearings don't look to be alclad so it would seem that they could
benifit from a little corrosion protection.
Bob Skinner RV-6 400 hrs. Buffalo, WY bskinr(at)trib.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris Ruble <cruble(at)cisco.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Starter Solonoids. |
I seem to remember that the is some service (lube?) that is to be completed
every 60 Hrs. of operation. It's something that I have never done besause
it's such a royal PITA to get the starter out to get the bendex out. I
have replaced more than one bendex over the years.
I've never had one stick and not notice it. That little starter has to
be turning pretty fast at TO RPM. There's about an 11 to 1 ratio for
the gear set (149/13). At 2500 RPM... well, you do the math.
Don't forget that there's another gear set in some starters as well.
Chris
>
>
> I just recently had the same problem as some of you have indicated. My
> starter solonoid is from a reputabal aircraft supply store. WHile
> flying back from another airport 40 miles away, I failed to realize my
> starter was still engaged. About 15 miles from the airport I noticed
> that my alternator was putting out to many amps, I started shuting
> things down and this did not help. Then my RMI engine analyzer went
> blank, my radio wouldn't work etc etc. When I landed at the home base
> I took off the cowl saw my starter was still engaged, and my battery
> was dead. realized that my starter solonoid was stuck. I got a new
> solonoid, tried to start the airplane to no avail. Because the starter
> solonoid stuck I burned up my starter, and ruined my battery. THis is my
> third solonoid from this supply store. I wonder if there is a problem
> with the supplier of these solonoids. theres a lot of people
> experiencing this problem, it cost me a lot of money. I usually buy
> things from Wicks.
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Starter Solonoids. |
>I just recently had the same problem as some of you have indicated. My
>starter solonoid is from a reputabal aircraft supply store. WHile
>flying back from another airport 40 miles away, I failed to realize my
>starter was still engaged. About 15 miles from the airport I noticed
>that my alternator was putting out to many amps, I started shuting
>things down and this did not help. Then my RMI engine analyzer went
>blank, my radio wouldn't work etc etc. When I landed at the home base
>I took off the cowl saw my starter was still engaged, and my battery
>was dead. realized that my starter solonoid was stuck. I got a new
>solonoid, tried to start the airplane to no avail. Because the starter
>solonoid stuck I burned up my starter, and ruined my battery. THis is my
>third solonoid from this supply store. I wonder if there is a problem
>with the supplier of these solonoids. theres a lot of people
>experiencing this problem, it cost me a lot of money. I usually buy
>things from Wicks.
These situations are generally driven by a combination of small
things as opposed to a single defficiency or failure. For example,
those cheap *ss contactors Cessna has used for years is absolutely
the lowest dollar devices on the market. My wholesale in 100 lots
is under $10. Unsuited to the task? They've been used in over
100,000 Cessnas and as parts go, they're pretty low on the list
of priority problems.
None the less, there are conditions which tend to promote
contactor sticking like battery nearing end of life, battery
capacity too small for task, battery technology not the best
for the application, wire sizing between battery and starter,
whether the starter is PM or series wound field, tightness
of engine, condition of engine tune-up, condition of starter
switch (whether key type or push-button), pilot technique,
etc.
No single factor will guarantee you a stuck contactor. Three
or more factors stacked on top of each other will markedly
increase probability of a stuck contactor. Let me set up
the conditions and I'll show you how to stick a brand new
$150 Cutler-Hammer contactor.
Obviously there are no simple answers here. Changing brand
or style of contactor might seem to be a good idea but then
you're already going to put in a new battery and starter. Perhaps
doing just this and using the original type contactor would run
okay for several hundred hours . . . until the stack of
stressful conditions gets too high again . . .
We tend to run things electrical until they die . . . or stick
and kill other things. Most of the time, we get away with
it and only the dead thing needs replacment. But we replace
oil filters before they're clogged, spark plugs before they're
burned to a nub, tires before they're bald . . . . why is it
that we'll to preventative maintenance on these kinds of
things and let things electric go until they croak?
I've fielded some flack about the idea of putting a new
battery every year into dual battery systems. Let me add
fuel to the fire, how about a new starter contactor for
$15 every two years . . . or perhaps after 200 starts?
None of these things is very expensive to do in the light
of total dollars required to own and operate an airplane.
But simple preventative maintenance on highly stressed
components can influence probability for problems in
very useful ways . . . I don't care if it IS a certified
part from some other airplane . . . all things break
eventually, some things faster than others . . . Soggy
batteries have more to do with sticking contactors
than any single cause . .
Bob . . .
AeroElectric Connection
////
(o o)
==========o00o=(_)=o00o==========
< If you continue to do, >
< What you've always done, >
< You will continue to be, >
< What you've always been. >
=================================
<http://www.aeroelectric.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | shelbyrv6a(at)mindspring.com (Shelby Smith) |
| Subject: | Re: engine overhaul- increase comp to 10:1? |
Also, I don't think that all IO-360's are
>counterweighted- Can another lister confirm this?
>Check six!
>Mark
This is correct IO-360 ---"6" inidcates counterweighting. I have the
non-counterweighted version. I also am interested in information on
rebuilding an engine like this yourself as well as the practical issue
related to converting(by exchanging the crankshaft) to counterweighted. The
non-counterweighted engine is 325 lbs. dry and the CW'd engine is 333 dry.
Shelby in Nashville.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV 4 Pat A <RV4PatA(at)aol.com> |
Does anyone know what the difference, if any, is between wiring the ignition
of an engine with regular mags and one with the Lasar electronic ignition
mags? Do you need a separate switch for the electronic part? How about for
starting? Is there an impulse coupling on one mag like the standard ones?
I'm pretty much in the dark on such subjects. Any enlightenment would be
appreciated.
Pat Allender
Iowa City
Panel stuff-4
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Cimino <jcimino(at)epix.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro-Seal Mix Ratio? |
Von,
It is 10:1 by weight. Ten ounces to one once. I used a diet scale and
for part of it, a mail scale. Both worked well.
>
>
>
>>I am getting ready to seal my RV-8 tanks, and the Sealant can says the
>ratio is 100:10 PBW; 100:7.6 PBV. What is the proper ratio? And what do
>you use to meter the proper amount for the proper ratio? Any techniques
>here?
>
>>Thanks.
>>Von Alexander
>>RV-8 #80544
>>
>>
>100:10 is the ratio by weight PBW W=weight
>
>100:7.6 is ratio by volume PBV V=volume
>
>to use the weight method build a small balance scale 2" and 20" from the
>fulcrum
>
>to use the volume method ( the one I prefer ) get a small set of kitchen
>measuring spoons with ml ( mine have 1, 2, 5, 15 ml )
>
>Cut out the table below and tape it to the big can:
>
> 5= .38
> 10= .76
> 15=1.14
> 20=1.52
> 25=1.90
> 30=2.28
> 35=2.66
> 40=3.04
> 45=3.42
> 50=3.80
> 55=4.18
> 60=4.56
> 65=4.94
> 70=5.32
> 75=5.70
> 80=6.08
> 85=6.46
> 90=6.84
> 95=7.22
> 100=7.60
>
>With the ml spoons & table I can quickly mix any quantity of seal.
>example (2) 15ml level scoops(big can) =30ml plus a slightly overfull 2ml
>scoop(small can) = approx 2.28ml, 4 15ml+5ml scoops(big can) =65ml plus
>a 5ml scoop(small can)=4.94ml.
>
>mix on a scrap piece of Al. Enjoy with milk and cookies!
>
>( point of interest... Boeing uses seal between any dissimilar metal
>joins... ala wing center section splice plates on the 4 or 6, I'm not
>sure if the 8 has steel plates )
>
>mike adams
>
>_____________________________________________________________________
>You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
>Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
>Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
>
>
>
>
>
>
Jim Cimino
RV-8 sn 80039
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/5771
(717)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitch Faatz <mfaatz(at)SagentTech.com> |
| Subject: | LightBlue-grey epoxy paint? |
A while back John Morrissey said:
> >Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 08:48:42 +1000From: John Morrissey
> >The last couple of RV's I've worked on, we painted the inside with a
> lightBlue-grey epoxy paint.
> Are you still out there John? Did your email address change from
> 'John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au' ?
> I was wonder what epoxy paint did you use? I have been looking for
> this color for the inside of my cockpit and instrument panel, but have
> only seen the flat grey's. I would love to hear what brand you are
> using!
> Thanks, Mitch
> Mitchell Faatz N727MF (reserved) RV-6AQME
> San Jose, CA Final touches on canopy construction...
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | halk(at)sybase.com (Hal Kempthorne) |
| Subject: | Re: Slider frame ? |
Alex wrote:
>
> Per the plans, the outside surface of the plexiglas is about lined up in
> the vertical plane with the outboard surface of the side bars of the slider
> frame (the jog in the side skirt allows this). However, at its aft end,
> the plexiglas inside surface rests on the outboard surface of the rear bows
> of the slider frame. Due to this, the joint where the side rails meet the
> rear bows should have a jog of one plexiglas thickness (the rear bow should
> be inboard about 3/16" from the side rail). Mine were welded flush. I
> plan to cut them and move them inboard the appropriate amount. Am I
> missing something? What have others done?
>
I too am building a 6A slider and getting ready to do canopy. I can't make
sense of these comments so I need some help.
My canopy frame consists of a front bow and a rear bow connected by two side
rails and a center rail. I say this by way of defining terms. I believe it is
the manual write up that uses at least three different terms one of the canopy
parts.
My front bow is 3/8 longer on the left than on the right so I cut out that
amount from the bow near where the center rail attaches. I imagined that the
side rails would need to be even with or inside a line extended vertically from
the outside of the skin at the upper longeron. Then the canopy plexiglass
(plexy from now on) will have its inside flush with aluminum skirt and the side
rail to which it fastens.
Relative to the outside surface of the skin, at the heighth of the top longeron,
just aft the roll over bar (windshield frame) - where should the plexy inner
surface be?
I suppose there is a sketch somewhere that I have forgotten.
hal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Leslie B. Williams" <lesliebwilliams(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Lasar ignition |
Pat, LASAR Service Letter SL 1-96, is what you need. My new engine with
LASAR did not include this as the literature advises that you should have
the latest edition. You can contact them by phone at 815-965-4700 or FAX
815-965-2457 and they will send you one. It shows the wiring schematic for
the controller, magnetos, and the ACS/Gerdes and TCM/Bendix ignition
switches.
Les Williams/RV-6AQ/Tacoma WA
>
> Does anyone know what the difference, if any, is between wiring the
ignition
>of an engine with regular mags and one with the Lasar electronic ignition
>mags? Do you need a separate switch for the electronic part? How about for
>starting? Is there an impulse coupling on one mag like the standard ones?
> I'm pretty much in the dark on such subjects. Any enlightenment would be
>appreciated.
> Pat Allender
> Iowa City
> Panel stuff-4
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog <Vanremog(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Starter Solonoids. |
<< Because the starter
solonoid stuck I burned up my starter, and ruined my battery. THis is my
third solonoid from this supply store. I wonder if there is a problem
with the supplier of these solonoids. theres a lot of people
experiencing this problem, it cost me a lot of money. I usually buy
things from Wicks. >>
I'd like to see if we can identify which brand(s) of starter contactors seem
to be the bad actor(s). If possible, those of you who have first hand
knowledge of starter contactor failures, both from "not de-energizing" and
"not energizing", please post info. All are designed only for "intermittent
duty". It doesn't have to be from an RV as long as you can ID the
manufacturer.
Wag-Aero and Wicks both supply White-Rogers P/N 70-111225-5 (aka Stancor
70-914)
ACS P/N 22735 is actually Federal-Mogul P/N 7000022735 (aka Capsonic 227035)
Van's supplies Cole-Hersee P/N 24022
Okay, folks. These are the major horses in this race. Since I proposed this
"Consumer Reports" of sorts, I'll keep score. Post directly to me. Let's see
if we can discover a trend here.
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jerry calvert <calverjl(at)flash.net> |
I thought long and hard before deciding on what primer system to use.
Searched the archieve, watched the heated primer debate(last one had
some great info) and finially decided on AKZO. I sprayed the emp today
using tips received from Gil Alexander(thanks Gil) and I am totally
impressed with AKZO. It sprays beautifully! I want to share what I
have learned on preparing and primering so the AKZO primers to be will
have a little more info that may help. I mix Metalprep 79 in a plastic
spray bottle according to instructions then spray and scrub(scotchbrite
pad) the aluminum. I spray off using a water hose with a spray nozzle.
Next, I spray with Alodine(gold toned) while part is still damp and work
it in with a small sponge. Keep part wet with Alodine for a couple of
minutes then rinse with hose. Part should have a gold tone if alcad and
a VERY gold tone if not alcad. Make sure parts are dry(blow dry with
air hose) and spray with AKZO. It sprays very easy and coverage is
superb. Resist the tendency to spray too much! Dries fast. I used a
small airbrush but plan on using a small touch-up spray gun for larger
jobs. I am letting it cure overnight before assembly.
Yes, there are less time consuming ways to prime, but I have the piece
of mind that I want with a fluid resistant interior epoxy primer. It's
probably overkill, but again, I will never wonder about corrosion and
wish I had done it differently. After all, we are building
"experimentals" for educational purposes which means there's many
different ways of doing something. So PLEASE don't fire back in
rebuttal and fuel another primer war! Besides, I think the great
"deburring" war has just escalated to the front.
Thanks for all the good advice,
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok
-6a emp (past the priming "thing")
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gasobek(at)juno.com |
My 160 oil consumption is not that high. Since the last oil change, I
have used three-fourths (3/4) of a quart of oil in 20 hours. I rebuilt
(overhauled to new specs) the engine 70 hours ago. TTSN = 3340+70
AFSN = 70.
Gary A. Sobek
RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell
So. CA, USA
>>>>> I spoke with the people at Firewall Forward in Colorado who hold
an STC for the higher compression pistons at least in the 200hp engines
and he said the chief disadvantage was increased oil consumption. A
quart every 4-5 hours instead of every 9-10 hours. Many of the 200hp
engines with low compression use a quart every 4-5 hours anyway, so I
elected to stay with stock pistons.
Bruce Green
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Morrissey, John" <John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au> |
| Subject: | LightBlue-grey epoxy paint? |
Hi Mitch,
Yep still here!!
To answer your question I went down to the local Auto paint store and
got them to mix me up a litre. The Australian brand was Dulux 2K and the
colour I used was a Mazda "Cecile grey"
This stuff is as tough as nails, which is good when the aircraft has
some wear and tear on it.
Happy building
John Morrissey
Canberra Australia
37 Deg Celsius today
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mitch Faatz [SMTP:mfaatz(at)SagentTech.com]
> Sent: Friday, February 27, 1998 11:33 AM
> To: 'RV-List'
> Subject: RV-List: LightBlue-grey epoxy paint?
>
>
> A while back John Morrissey said:
> > >Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 08:48:42 +1000From: John Morrissey
> > >The last couple of RV's I've worked on, we painted the inside with
> a
> > lightBlue-grey epoxy paint.
> > Are you still out there John? Did your email address change from
> > 'John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au' ?
> > I was wonder what epoxy paint did you use? I have been looking for
> > this color for the inside of my cockpit and instrument panel, but
> have
> > only seen the flat grey's. I would love to hear what brand you are
> > using!
> > Thanks, Mitch
> > Mitchell Faatz N727MF (reserved) RV-6AQME
> > San Jose, CA Final touches on canopy construction...
> >
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Mike and Headset Jacks...? |
| From: | ebundy(at)juno.com (Ed Bundy) |
>It corrected some playback noise in my radio. An MX11. Sounded very
>mushy when tramx. Sent to who I bought it from. Their correction was
to
>send me the 2 washers per jack. I've never seen them advertised
>until Bob says he has them.
My intercom recommended the use of them. I couldn't find any place to
get them short of a "mounting kit" that cost around $30 or so. I ended
up using suitably sized rubber grommets. Fit the grommet through the
(larger than normal) mounting hole, the install the jack through the
grommet and gently tighten. This insulates it nicely from the panel and
it works just as well as the fiber washers.
Now that Bob has them it's not as big a deal, but the rubber grommets are
still cheaper and easier to find locally. I have a kit of lots of
different sizes and was able to fix it up quickly.
Ed Bundy RV6A - Eagle, ID - first flight 11/20/96
ebundy@juno.com - http://members.aol.com/rv67em/
-
_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4Brown <RV4Brown(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Timing Magnetos-easy |
Bob Stewart,
I have tried to e-mail you off list several times but the letters keep
bouncing. I just want to thank you for taking the time to provide
constructive and informative posts to the rv-list! I for one really
appreciate the quality of your posts. Keep up the good work!
Thanks
Tom Brown RV4 - fuselage on gear
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kbeene <Kbeene(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Slider frame ? |
<< Per the plans, the outside surface of the plexiglas is about lined up in
the vertical plane with the outboard surface of the side bars of the slider
frame (the jog in the side skirt allows this). However, at its aft end,
the plexiglas inside surface rests on the outboard surface of the rear bows
of the slider frame. Due to this, the joint where the side rails meet the
rear bows should have a jog of one plexiglas thickness (the rear bow should
be inboard about 3/16" from the side rail). Mine were welded flush. I
plan to cut them and move them inboard the appropriate amount. Am I
missing something? What have others done? >>
Hi Alex,
I attempted to use Frank Justice's recommendation. This is described in step
3 under "Completing the Canopy Assembly". He suggests grinding out a
depression on the inside of the Plexiglas to recess the canopy into the rear
bow near the connection to the side tube. I don't have much of a problem with
a bulge at this point, however, it is difficult to get the trailing edge of
the rear skirt to contact the fuselage ( 0.15 inch gap). I may try a metal
tab extending from the rear of the frame near the hold down block to the skirt
to pull this a little tighter.
Ken Beene
Burnsville, MN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David A. Barnhart" <barnhart(at)a.crl.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tie-wrap stand-offs |
Bernie and other listers:
With regards to tie-wrap stand off, I wrote:
><< I'm a little confused as to what is being referred to here as 'dumb'. The
> tie-wraps and stand-offs or the inspector? >>
Bernie was kind enough to clarify:
>Sorry for the vague answer. I thought it was clear that I thought the tie
>wraps worked in a lot of places and it was Dumb for the inspector to be so
>adamant about making stand offs.
I would really hesitate to just tie-wrap a pair of oil lines together
without a stand-off, for example. At the point where the two lines touch
(where the tie-wrap is) the two lines will wear. I have seen this many
times, even with steel-braided lines.
On the other hand, if you are using tie-wraps to secure a couple of wires
to some structure, there is no need for the stand-off. I have a spot in my
engine compartmeent where an oil line and the throttle cable are in close
proximity to each other (maybe 1/2-inch apart). That is the perfect spot
for a tie-wrap and stand-off.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB
almost flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David A. Barnhart" <barnhart(at)a.crl.com> |
For all of you contemplating installing those wingtip lenses from Chief, or
the ones that Van sells:
My advice is "Don't Do it."
Not only was it a lot of work to put them in, The strobes illuminate the
entire lens. It is VERY distracting from the cockpit. I'll have to build
a little 'fence' just inboard of each lens to block the lenses from my view.
Best Regards,
dave Barnhart
rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB
ntercom. The Bose and Dave
Clark were also tried with my PS Engineering PM2000 stereo intercom.
In all cases, the Bose was noticably quieter than the other two headsets.
The absence of low frequency roar/rumble was dramatic when compared to the
Dave Clark.
Surprisingly, when attached to the Flightcom intercom, the Bose's audio
volume was significantly lower than the other two headsets.
When attached to the PM2000, the Bose sounded significantly better than the
other two headsets. This also surprised me. I have always felt that the
audio quality of my DC was great, but the Bose was significantly better.
(the CD in the stereo sounded a lot better too)
just for some background info, the audio in my RV-6 consists of:
King KLX-135A GPS/COM
Baupunkt FM/CD player
PS Engineering PM2000 Stereo interom.
Best Regards,
Dave Barnhart
rv-6 sn 23744 N601DB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog <Vanremog(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Lasar ignition |
<< Does anyone know what the difference, if any, is between wiring the
ignition
of an engine with regular mags and one with the Lasar electronic ignition
mags? Do you need a separate switch for the electronic part? How about for
starting? Is there an impulse coupling on one mag like the standard ones? >>
Why not get it straight from the horse's mouth. Call Unison. The number is
in the Yeller Pages at http://www.sound.net/~hartmann/yelrpage.htm
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Starter Solonoids. |
>Because the starter
>solonoid stuck I burned up my starter, and ruined my battery. THis is my
>third solonoid from this supply store. I wonder if there is a problem
>with the supplier of these solonoids. theres a lot of people
>experiencing this problem, it cost me a lot of money. I usually buy
>things from Wicks.
>
>
I used an industrial heavy-duty contactor (Stancor 120-901; available from
Newark for $16) for my starter circuit. The connection is made by a movable
bus bar with silver contacts instead of the copper disk that is used in most
aircraft contactors. I have had no problems in 166 hours of service.
Mark
RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Moore <76147.3367(at)compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | Allegro Avionics |
Does anyone know the phone number and/or the address for Allegro? I'm
interested in their engine monitor and analyzer. Any comparisons to the
RMI monitor. Thanks.
Jim Moore
RV8 fuse.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4131rb <RV4131rb(at)aol.com> |
| Subject: | Re: engine overhaul- increase comp to 10:1? |
OK Mark,
I tried not to get involved in this one but you just had to go
and drag me in. I hate to burst your buble or anyone elses but! I have been
running 10:1 compression on my engine since I overhauled it 450hrs ago. My
engine runs as smooth as any I have sat behind (knock on wood). I throw in a
quart of oil about every 13 hrs. I have chrome cylinders and deffinately have
not had any of the linning comming off. I truley believe that if I had steel
cylinders my oil burn would be better than it is. Others I fly with with 10:1
are getting as many as 22hrs before having to add a quart. I regularly check
my oil filter at every oil change and have never had any metal. This may not
be for everyone but my guess is that my engine will make TBO just as easily as
the guy with 7.5:1 compression. We have at least 4 RV4's in the area running
10:1 compression all 0320's and all are satisfied so far.
Ryan Bendure
February 21, 1998 - February 27, 1998
RV-Archive.digest.vol-eh