RV-Archive.digest.vol-hp
December 23, 1999 - December 30, 1999
majority have TCAS
>now) or an airliner expect it to climb or descend to avoid
you. The best
>bet for a small aircraft is usually to turn because you can
be pretty sure
>you won't turn into him. If you climb or descend you have
a 50-50 chance
>of initiating the same avoidance manuver he does.
>
>Fly Safe
>
>Scott A. Jordan
>G-IV, CL-60 TCAS equiped
>80331 windscreen support
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Keith Hughes <rv6tc(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: N94BD first flight pics |
Brian,
Congratulations, and great pictures. Can't wait to see more!
Keith Hughes
Parker, CO
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hal Kempthorne <kempthorne(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Balancing & Fit |
>perfect thickness spacers between them, they stiffened up due to some
>misalignment. The solution was to use a drilled bolt, castle nut and cotter
>key, and not tighten it against the bearing. Not very elegant, but that's
>what they used to do before they made a bearing. And hey, it worked -- the
>elevators move very freely.
This is what I did, castle nut and cotter. I never thought of it as
"inelegant". Don't get me started on 'perfect'!
What is not elegant is a solution that does not work or that is unreliable
or that requires the waste of many hours doing what could have been done
much more easily with a better solution.
There is a still better solution waiting to be found. There always
is! Once we suck on to the idea that the design cannot be improved, better
is dead.
Someone told me the other day that Van does not like our "messing" with his
design. I doubt that is true since 'messing with' the designs of others
is how Van came to create the RV series.
hal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hal Kempthorne <kempthorne(at)earthlink.net> |
Seasonings and greesings!
In the San Francisco Bay Area, there is sometimes rather heavy
traffic. Often it is hard to get in a word edgewise with the sector
controller, especially when someone comes in from the farm, hemming,
hawwing and slow talking. More especially if they come unannounced and
squawking 1200 with no altitude encoder. Controller then tells
me, "traffic at 12 oclock, two miles, altitude unknown". Now, I am
chugging along at 150 K and looking hard. I call and say "negative
contact". Contoller may or may not be able to get back to me with "one
mile now may be manouvering" . Meandering is more likely. I grew up on a
farm and I done all that.
Most unprofessional and dangerous. In the boonies maybe you don't need an
altitude encoder but in high density areas it is a different game. Here,
you will want to be either IFR or getting flight following. The
controllers are not the evil empire prying into our affairs but part of a
dance team that gets us all home safely.
Yes, you need an altitude encoder.
hal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Oregon Aero Seats |
Try your local Yellow Pages under Auto Upholstery. Ask if they sell a kit to
retro-fit heated seats into an existing car. You want the kit that uses
carbon fiber pads that are only a net of material. This way you won't be
able to tell that they are installed until you turn them on. The ones I
found here come with an elegant lighted switch that has a high and a low
heat position.
If you still draw a blank then try phoning on of the better car dealers and
ask where they send their new cars to have heated seats retro-fitted in. The
place here in Vancouver that I found does installs for many of the local
dealers on new cars. If you still draw a blank I will ask the local outfit
here if they will mail order internationally.
Are there any other people wanting this option and having trouble finding a
kit? Can some one search the JC Whittny and Summit catalogs and report?
For me this is a wife insist option. She wants to learn to fly so that means
I have to put them in both seats. I bought her a new car last year that has
heated seats and now I'm afraid she is spoiled. She claims she will never
own another car without them. Her factory installed seats create the first
glimmer of heat within five seconds of starting the car no matter how cold
it is outside. They are toasty warm within one minute. She can't understand
why all cars sold in Canada don't have them.
A few points:
-They are physically just a light netting of carbon fiber with wires
attached. They can be trimmed to fit.
-They weigh next to nothing.
-Current draw is four amps per seat on high heat setting.
-The rocker switch is provided. It is a round pop into hole type with
internal lighting. It is about 1/2 inch round. The manufacture claims that
the brightness has been tested so that it is not too bright to be a
distraction in a car at night.
-These can be installed into any seat immediately under the top covering
surface.
-Americans should be able to find these for around $100 to $150 per seat.
They are $225 uninstalled here in Canada.
Regards,
Norman Hunger
> Could you share the name of the seatcover place with us. I haven't seen
that
> available here yet.
>
> If anyone has heard of others, I would be looking for someone in the
Chicago
> area.
>
> > I haven't chosen a covering yet but I do know that I will add heated
seat
> > pads to all four cushions. They do not affect the feel of the seat. They
use
> > 4 amps each on high setting and cost $450 Canadian for all four pads
needed.
> > They are available locally at a car seatcover place.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> |
>
>Someone does make a "Poor mans" TCAS. I can't recall the name of the
>company right now but an RV-6 builder near me has purchased one. It does
>not have a fishfinder display but it does report how close the traffic is.
>I'll try to find more info if anyone's interested. This may jog someone
>else's memory and perhaps they can supply the name of the company and the
>info.
>--
>Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE
You are probably thinking of the Ryan TCAD system. I flew several
cross countries with an older Ryan TCAD, and it worked great. It
picks up the replies from the transponders on other aircraft,
compares the altitude to your altitude, and estimates the range based
on the strength of the signal. If the other aircraft is close to
you, and the altitude is close to yours, the TCAD alerts you. I
picked up a lot of traffic that I probably would have missed without
it. It is not as good as TCAS, but it is much, much cheaper. See
http://www.ryan-tcad.com/ and
http://www.easternavionics.com/collis.html for more info.
Kevin Horton RV-8 (wings skinned, getting ready to do fuselage)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DAVENDANA1(at)aol.com |
One company is Ryan International who makes the TCAD. It's still a little pricey.
Dave Funk
The pain........
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | donspawn(at)juno.com |
albqpop1.albq.uswest.net with SMTP; 22 Dec 1999
21":29:30.-0000(at)matronics.com writes:
>
>I'm thinking of purchasing a Transponder,is a encoder neccessary?What
>is a Blind Encoder?
The Transponer is one of your radios that the Radar intarigates. It can
transmit 4096 codes to the controller. He now knows where you are.
The Mode C encoder ( that was part of your Altimeter [big $]) transmits
your altitude to ATC. When they took it out of the Alt & put it in its
own box, it became a Blind encoder.
need to check the FAR's, but I think you need it in A,B,C airspace &
above 10,000 feet. With a RV, I think you will need sometime.
Merry Christmas
Don Jordan ~ 6A fuselage ~ Arlington,Tx ~ donspawn(at)juno.com
*****************************************************************************
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | donspawn(at)juno.com |
| Subject: | Re: First flight, RV8 N94BD (long) |
writes:
>Greetings all!
>
>Today, December 22, 1999, my RV8, N94BD saw LOTS of air under it's
>tires for the first time. Yes, it IS awesome, and yes I'm grinning in a
huge
>way.
*************************************************************************
Congratulations!!!! 1500 fpm is far out @ that altitude.
dna
Don Jordan ~ 6A fuselage ~ Arlington,Tx ~ donspawn(at)juno.com
*****************************************************************************
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
Have fun with these links.
Bye.
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JHeadric(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV er's in Orlando area |
Is the Fantasy of 'Flight Museum any good?
Just about the best you'll ever see! It's great.
Jim in Oregon RV6A flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | glenn williams <willig10(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: N94BD first flight pics |
Brian. I would like to offer you congradulations on
your completion and subsequent first flight, you
inspire us all, please keep in touch from time to time
and let us know of your progression. Once again
congrads and be safe out there
Glenn Williams
8A wings Ft. Worth Texas
--- Keith Hughes wrote:
>
>
> Brian,
>
> Congratulations, and great pictures. Can't wait to
> see more!
>
> Keith Hughes
> Parker, CO
>
>
>
> through
>
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
>
> Settlement...
> http://www.matronics.com/jpi.html
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Learning experience... |
Well, I finally got my compressor hooked up this afternoon. Since the rear
spar of my horizontal stabilizer has been waiting patiently for rivets for
almost two weeks, I thought I'd better take care of it. I learned several
things:
1) How to work my pneumatic squeezer
2) How to recognize good rivets
3) How to drill out bad rivets
All in all, a productive day. Sorry for such a trivial post, but I needed to
share this with someone who understood and/or gave a damn. My wife sure
doesn't. She's supportive, but not very interested, if you know what I mean.
Oh, well. She won't have to fly in it for a year or so.
Regards,
Ken Balch
Ashland, MA
RV-8 #81125
working on the horiz. stab.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | glenn williams <willig10(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Learning experience... |
I can surely understand the suport issue with the wife
mine is the same way she supports me as far as "glad
your getting to build your airplane" but that is as
far as it goes. And she will never fly with me "hope
she changes her mind" but hey good luck and press on
wait till you get to your wings good luck
Glenn Williams
8A wings
Ft. Worth, Texas
--- Kbalch1(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Well, I finally got my compressor hooked up this
> afternoon. Since the rear
> spar of my horizontal stabilizer has been waiting
> patiently for rivets for
> almost two weeks, I thought I'd better take care of
> it. I learned several
> things:
>
> 1) How to work my pneumatic squeezer
> 2) How to recognize good rivets
> 3) How to drill out bad rivets
>
> All in all, a productive day. Sorry for such a
> trivial post, but I needed to
> share this with someone who understood and/or gave a
> damn. My wife sure
> doesn't. She's supportive, but not very interested,
> if you know what I mean.
> Oh, well. She won't have to fly in it for a year
> or so.
>
> Regards,
> Ken Balch
> Ashland, MA
> RV-8 #81125
> working on the horiz. stab.
>
>
>
> through
>
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
>
> Settlement...
> http://www.matronics.com/jpi.html
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Phillips" <mphill(at)fgi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Learning experience... |
ah ken,sounds familiar,my wife is petrified of the idea of a airplane in the
garage,let alone still being a student pilot,just hope they come around with
time,hehe,Just completed the empennage and getting ready to order the wing
kit. In the mean time i'm cleaning the garage out. Good luck with your
project
----- Original Message -----
From: <Kbalch1(at)aol.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 23, 1999 5:04 PM
Subject: RV-List: Learning experience...
>
> Well, I finally got my compressor hooked up this afternoon. Since the
rear
> spar of my horizontal stabilizer has been waiting patiently for rivets for
> almost two weeks, I thought I'd better take care of it. I learned several
> things:
>
> 1) How to work my pneumatic squeezer
> 2) How to recognize good rivets
> 3) How to drill out bad rivets
>
> All in all, a productive day. Sorry for such a trivial post, but I needed
to
> share this with someone who understood and/or gave a damn. My wife sure
> doesn't. She's supportive, but not very interested, if you know what I
mean.
> Oh, well. She won't have to fly in it for a year or so.
>
> Regards,
> Ken Balch
> Ashland, MA
> RV-8 #81125
> working on the horiz. stab.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Balancing & Fit |
| From: | Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com> |
> >I have thought I have assembled my elevators for the last time but
> that
> >probably isn't true. I have slight resistence now everything is
> tightened.
>
>
> I was looking for Scott McDaniels to respond to this, but if he did
> I didn't
> see it... he helped me with mine
-
I was waiting for you to respond to it Randall... :-)
-
-- both my elevators and rudder
> were a bit
> stiff when I tightened the bolts. I spent a long time working to
> alleviate
> this with coaching from Scott, as he told me I could have problems
> with
> "wandering" trim if I didn't fix it.
>
> The first thing he told me is that ANY misalignment of the attach
> angles
> with respect to the rod end bearings will cause the ball to be
> pressed
> against the side of the bearing and resulting stiffness. So I spent
> a long
> time tweaking the attach angles so the bearings would slide in
> easily
> without any preload on any of the angles. You definitely do need to
> shim out
> any gap between the elevator horns and the bearing or they will
> bind, for
> the same reason.
>
> Then there's alignment. A little misalignment of the holes shouldn't
> cause
> them to bind, but
> if its significant then they will, and you'll have to figure out
> some way to
> remedy it. My elevators were stiff and I tried EVERYTHING. Both
> would move
> freely by themselves but once I tightened the center bolt, even with
> the
> perfect thickness spacers between them, they stiffened up due to
> some
> misalignment. The solution was to use a drilled bolt, castle nut and
> cotter
> key, and not tighten it against the bearing. Not very elegant, but
> that's
> what they used to do before they made a bearing. And hey, it worked
> -- the
> elevators move very freely.
>
It is important to remove any friction from the elevator control system
(and ailerons also for that matter).
If there is friction it will make it difficult for the elevators to
return to the same trimmed point each time that they are displaced (such
as in turbulence, bumping the stick in the cockpit, etc.).
When the elevators are properly balanced and the control system is
assembled as it should be, you should be able to "Flip" an elevator up or
down and have it bounce/oscillate up and down a couple of times before it
stops. If it stops quickly the airplane is safe to fly but it will be
much better if you solve the friction problem.
It can be caused any where in the system from the stick on back.
As Randall mentioned, you need to avoid putting any amount of side load
on any of the bearings. This includes the forward bearings that the
control column pivots on. Use spacer washers as necessary.
Slightly bend all of the stabilizer steel hinge brackets so that they
exactly align with trod bearing hinges on the rudder and elevators.
You need to be able to fit the rudder or elevators without bending the
brackets to one side. This prevents side loading the rod bearing.
Of course it is also important that the hinge line be straight. If a
thread pulled through all of the hinge points on the vertical or
horizontal stab is not centered in every hole... you will likely have a
friction problem to some degree. If you have friction, Isolate the
system by disconnecting the push rod from the elevator horns. If there
is still friction in the elevator movement then it is being caused at the
elevators. If not, then it is being caused somewhere in the control
system.
An RV with the surfaces properly balanced (ailerons are fine with just
the supplied weight, elevators should be done as close to 100 % as
possible)
and with no perceptible friction, has the best possible pitch stability
(assuming a proper C.G. location) and nicest handling qualities.
The unfortunate thing is that since many builders haven't really flown an
RV much before there own, they just don't know the difference (same goes
with the difference between an RV built light, and one that is a bit
chubby).
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Elevator Balancing & Fit |
| From: | Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com> |
> There is a still better solution waiting to be found. There always
> is! Once we suck on to the idea that the design cannot be improved,
> better
> is dead.
>
> Someone told me the other day that Van does not like our "messing"
> with his
> design. I doubt that is true since 'messing with' the designs of
> others
> is how Van came to create the RV series.
-
I think this idea of how Van feels is often not seen in the "correct
light"
He (and myself) knows what "home building" is all about, but if you put
yourself in his shoes (or any other designer / kit seller) for a moment
you can see what the issue is.
Maybe you have to take my word for it (but believe me you should) there
are many RV builders that have made modifications to RV's that likely
make them more dangerous airplanes. They felt that they were entirely
qualified to make the changes, but very often, after talking to them, it
is obvious they have no idea how many structural, aerodynamic, or flight
quality issues they may have effected with there "seemingly" innocent
modification.
Assuming that no one that is thinking sensibly would make a modification
if they didn't feel qualified to do so. We then can see why most
designers don't seem very excited when someone makes a modification.
There is no real good way to determine if someone is qualified, or maybe
likely to hurt them self (because everyone doing is qualified...in there
eyes anyway). When we make design changes or "improvements" it is with
the combined experience of many people and they are carefully evaluated
for what effect they have on anything else.
It is true that many builder improvements and design innovations of
builders have found there way into the all of the RV models, but usually
only after a lot of evaluation and testing.
Scott McDaniels
North Plains, OR
These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "InfoAv Corp - Jeremy Benedict" <list(at)infoav.com> |
--> RV-List message really posted by: jeremy(at)infoav.com (not the above!)
Hi Bill,
SourceRV.com is in a "phase-in period" right now. If you want to do any
comparisions, make sure to do them after our site is fully up and running.
If you don't like what you see at that point, give me a call and we'll take
care of it.
For the benefit of anyone who hasn't read the SourceRV.com update e-mail
message, here's what's up:
"We recently discovered several errors in our technical material. Upon
reviewing our acquisition process, we discovered the errors came
primarily from the Abode Acrobat software package. Our spot checks
had not uncovered the problems. We feel some of the errors could
compromise the purpose of providing the material. An example would
be where the optical character recognition process changed numbers
in technical specifications."
These difficulties have resulted in a restructuring of the introduction date
to a "phase-in period" as we reacquire and review the material. The promised
material should be available by about Jan 15. Of course, subscription terms
won't start until the material is actually there. Until then, it's free
access with a prepaid subscription.
Thanks,
Jeremy Benedict jeremy(at)infoav.com
InfoAv Corporation
> I signed up...on the website there are the 1995 and 1996 RVators. That's
> it... So far, I'm thinking I should have bought that 18 years of the
> RVator book and I would have been better off. I guess time will tell
> whether or not the promised 'indispensable' information is going to show
up.
>
> Bill
> >
> >So, has anybody signed on with SourceRV so they can tell us how things
> >do/don't work at this site??
> >Jim Nice
________________________________________________________________________________
to all you rv3'ers have a happy and safe hoilday.
dan carley
rv3a-148cw
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Shook" <skydiven(at)bellsouth.net> |
Jeremy,
Please, don't take what I said personally. The original poster asked what
the SourceRv site was like, and I told him what was there. Words like 'so
far' were meant to indicate that I am patiently waiting to see what appears
(though it may not have come across that way - hazard of the typed word).
Rest assured, if I had an issue to take with you, I would do so with you
directly (and I do not at this time). As I said, don't take offense, I was
merely answering the man's question.....and I am waiting patiently.
Bill
>
>Hi Bill,
>
>SourceRV.com is in a "phase-in period" right now. If you want to do any
>comparisions, make sure to do them after our site is fully up and running.
>If you don't like what you see at that point, give me a call and we'll take
>care of it.
>
>For the benefit of anyone who hasn't read the SourceRV.com update e-mail
>message, here's what's up:
>"We recently discovered several errors in our technical material. Upon
>reviewing our acquisition process, we discovered the errors came
>primarily from the Abode Acrobat software package. Our spot checks
>had not uncovered the problems. We feel some of the errors could
>compromise the purpose of providing the material. An example would
>be where the optical character recognition process changed numbers
>in technical specifications."
>
>These difficulties have resulted in a restructuring of the
>introduction date
>to a "phase-in period" as we reacquire and review the material.
>The promised
>material should be available by about Jan 15. Of course, subscription terms
>won't start until the material is actually there. Until then, it's free
>access with a prepaid subscription.
>
>Thanks,
>Jeremy Benedict jeremy(at)infoav.com
>InfoAv Corporation
>
>> I signed up...on the website there are the 1995 and 1996 RVators. That's
>> it... So far, I'm thinking I should have bought that 18 years of the
>> RVator book and I would have been better off. I guess time will tell
>> whether or not the promised 'indispensable' information is going to show
>up.
>>
>> Bill
>> >
>> >So, has anybody signed on with SourceRV so they can tell us how things
>> >do/don't work at this site??
>> >Jim Nice
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Edward Cole" <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: merry christmas |
So....the rest of us RVer's can go to hell?????? ;
)
----- Original Message -----
From: <DFCPAC(at)aol.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 23, 1999 5:02 PM
Subject: RV-List: merry christmas
>
> to all you rv3'ers have a happy and safe hoilday.
>
> dan carley
> rv3a-148cw
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net> |
Cy...
Probably a typo on your post, but you don't need any transponder to
enter U.S. Class D airspace...only communications :)
Scott
Cy Galley wrote:
>
>
> So what are the other positives, besides getting to go into controlled areas
> with controller's permission? Doesn't really sound that good, does it?
>
> First, because you can fly into C and D airspace, you don't have to deviate.
--
--Scott--
1986 Corben Junior Ace N3642
RV-4 under construction (tail feathers)
Gotta Fly or Gonna Die!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mel Jordan" <tmjordan(at)flash.net> |
I have reserved an N number and know that each year you have to pay a fee to
keep the reservation. However, as this will be the first year for me, how
do you know it is time to pay the renewal fee. Does the FAA send you a
renewal fee to hold the number for another year?
Thanks,
Mel Jordan RV6A
N6JX reserved
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gummos" <tg1965(at)linkline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: merry christmas |
If there are rivets and RV's can I go too. :-)
Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: Edward Cole <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 23, 1999 5:33 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: merry christmas
>
> So....the rest of us RVer's can go to hell?????? ;
)
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <DFCPAC(at)aol.com>
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, December 23, 1999 5:02 PM
> Subject: RV-List: merry christmas
>
>
> >
> > to all you rv3'ers have a happy and safe hoilday.
> >
> > dan carley
> > rv3a-148cw
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch(at)email.msn.com> |
Mel:
Yes, you will get a notice from the FAA (post card) to pay your $10 bucks
for the next year about a month before it is due. I would keep a copy as a
sort of "tickler" for the next time.
Pat Hatch
RV-4 N17PH @ INT
RV-6 Wing Kit
-----Original Message-----
From: Mel Jordan <tmjordan(at)flash.net>
Date: Thursday, December 23, 1999 9:21 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: N numbers
>
>I have reserved an N number and know that each year you have to pay a fee
to
>keep the reservation. However, as this will be the first year for me, how
>do you know it is time to pay the renewal fee. Does the FAA send you a
>renewal fee to hold the number for another year?
>
>
>Thanks,
>Mel Jordan RV6A
>N6JX reserved
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | glenn williams <willig10(at)yahoo.com> |
just a hint guys: if you get a bill of sale from vans
and get the faa letter notorized send in an additional
5 dollars they will issue the n number and you won,t
have to pay the annual renewal due to the fact that
the number is issued
Glenn Williams
8A wings
Ft. Worth Texas
--- Pat Hatch wrote:
>
>
> Mel:
>
> Yes, you will get a notice from the FAA (post card)
> to pay your $10 bucks
> for the next year about a month before it is due. I
> would keep a copy as a
> sort of "tickler" for the next time.
>
> Pat Hatch
> RV-4 N17PH @ INT
> RV-6 Wing Kit
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mel Jordan <tmjordan(at)flash.net>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Thursday, December 23, 1999 9:21 PM
> Subject: Re: RV-List: N numbers
>
>
>
> >
> >I have reserved an N number and know that each year
> you have to pay a fee
> to
> >keep the reservation. However, as this will be the
> first year for me, how
> >do you know it is time to pay the renewal fee.
> Does the FAA send you a
> >renewal fee to hold the number for another year?
> >
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Mel Jordan RV6A
> >N6JX reserved
> >
> >
>
>
>
> through
>
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
>
> Settlement...
> http://www.matronics.com/jpi.html
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)accessus.net> |
I think I wanted to say B and C. If I didn't, my error.
Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact!
(Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com)
-----Original Message-----
From: Scott <acepilot(at)mwt.net>
Date: Thursday, December 23, 1999 8:14 PM
Subject: Re: RV4-List: Re: RV-List: encoders
>
>Cy...
>Probably a typo on your post, but you don't need any transponder to
>enter U.S. Class D airspace...only communications :)
>Scott
>
>
>Cy Galley wrote:
>>
>
>>
>> So what are the other positives, besides getting to go into controlled
areas
>> with controller's permission? Doesn't really sound that good, does it?
>>
>> First, because you can fly into C and D airspace, you don't have to
deviate.
>
>--
>--Scott--
>1986 Corben Junior Ace N3642
>RV-4 under construction (tail feathers)
>
>Gotta Fly or Gonna Die!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Lkyswede(at)aol.com |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LeastDrag(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV3-List: merry christmas |
In a message dated 12/23/99 5:04:33 PM Pacific Standard Time, DFCPAC(at)aol.com
writes:
<< --> RV3-List message posted by: DFCPAC(at)aol.com
to all you rv3'ers have a happy and safe hoilday.
dan carley
rv3a-148cw >>
Absolutely. To everyone. Have a happy and safe holiday.
Jim Ayers
RV-3 N47RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George True <true(at)uswest.net> |
So the RMI uEncoder has a mode C encoder built into it doesn't it? As
such, you wouldn't need a "blind" encoder, would you, if you have the
RMI in your panel? So am I correct in assuming there would be no
difference in functionality between a blind encoder and an altimeter
encoder?
George True
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: First flight, RV8 N94BD (long) |
Brian,
CONGRATULATIONS & WELL DONE !!!!
Thanks for the pictures - they were great!
Best Wishes,
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (canopy)
Niantic, CT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: First Flight - N47TD |
Tim,
CONGRATULATIONS & WELL DONE !!
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (canopy)
Niantic, CT
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 12/23/1999 9:17:00 PM Eastern Standard Time,
tmjordan(at)flash.net writes:
<< reserved an N number and know that each year you have to pay a fee to
keep the reservation. >>
Why not register your airplane and avoid worrying about the fee?
david faile, fairfield, ct
mcfii/a&p faa aviation safety counselor
eaa technical counselor/flight advisor
christen eagle ii since '82 (n13bf)
rv6 (n44df) started
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Learning experience... |
you have been this long with out a compressor? sounds like you receive an
early Christmas present. How were you able to waitsoooo long. You have got
to try to get her a ride if at all possible. and explain how you and her will
be able to take off on a romantic weekend. Will be able to go see her mother
and it wont cost very much, That way there will be more money for her
shoes,jewelry,clothes,ect. just an Idea. isn't the aircompressor fun?
N468TC to the airport after Christmas weekend.
________________________________________________________________________________
Yes, they will send a renewal notice, at least they did me. N468TC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 12/24/99 7:53:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, DFaile(at)aol.com
writes:
<< << reserved an N number and know that each year you have to pay a fee to
keep the reservation. >>
Why not register your airplane and avoid worrying about the fee? >>
Here in Georgia, registering the aircraft is the event which triggers the
local Tax Commissioner to send you a bill... This bill is typically many
times the size of the annual N-number reservation fee.
KB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mitch Robbins" <robm(at)am2.com> |
That's correct. However, encoding altimeters fall into the big $ category.
Suitable encoders combined with an altimeter are relatively inexpensive. An
inexpensive alternative can be found at
http://www.am2.com/nonlinear/altdec.htm
> So the RMI uEncoder has a mode C encoder built into it doesn't it? As
> such, you wouldn't need a "blind" encoder, would you, if you have the
> RMI in your panel? So am I correct in assuming there would be no
> difference in functionality between a blind encoder and an altimeter
> encoder?
>
> George True
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EARL FORTNER <e.fortner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Learning experience... |
Am I missing something? Sounds like you guys are married to my wife's
twin sisters if she had any. donotarchive
glenn williams wrote:
>
>
> I can surely understand the suport issue with the wife
> mine is the same way she supports me as far as "glad
> your getting to build your airplane" but that is as
> far as it goes. And she will never fly with me "hope
> she changes her mind" but hey good luck and press on
> wait till you get to your wings good luck
> Glenn Williams
> 8A wings
> Ft. Worth, Texas
>
> --- Kbalch1(at)aol.com wrote:
> >
> > Well, I finally got my compressor hooked up this
> > afternoon. Since the rear
> > spar of my horizontal stabilizer has been waiting
> > patiently for rivets for
> > almost two weeks, I thought I'd better take care of
> > it. I learned several
> > things:
> >
> > 1) How to work my pneumatic squeezer
> > 2) How to recognize good rivets
> > 3) How to drill out bad rivets
> >
> > All in all, a productive day. Sorry for such a
> > trivial post, but I needed to
> > share this with someone who understood and/or gave a
> > damn. My wife sure
> > doesn't. She's supportive, but not very interested,
> > if you know what I mean.
> > Oh, well. She won't have to fly in it for a year
> > or so.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Ken Balch
> > Ashland, MA
> > RV-8 #81125
> > working on the horiz. stab.
> >
> >
> >
> > through
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> >
> > Settlement...
> > http://www.matronics.com/jpi.html
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Priming "Back-drop" |
Listers, FWIW, on the QB 8A kit some of the parts come in a relatively long,
durable cardboard box that's only a couple of inches high. When priming my
parts using a spray gun, I take the top or bottom of this box, set it on two
saw horses . . . . run either plastic paint drop sheets or even black
plastic garbage bags along the bottom and sides of this box . . . and "hold"
the plastic down with push pins. I spray . . . if need be on something like
stiffeners, I set this "angled" where they are leaning against the side of
the box. When done, I remove the push pins, throw away the plastic . . .
and repeat the process next go around. There is absolutely no mess, it is
convenient, reusable, and easy to set out of the way when not being used (I
store this box on top of the crate the wings came in). Anyway, that's my
Christmas gift to the list. Not much, but, hey, I didn't get into a
discussion on primers!
Rick Jory
Highlands Ranch, Co
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Priming "Back-drop" |
Listers, FWIW, on the QB 8A kit some of the parts come in a relatively long,
durable cardboard box that's only a couple of inches high. When priming my
parts using a spray gun, I take the top or bottom of this box, set it on two
saw horses . . . . run either plastic paint drop sheets or even black
plastic garbage bags along the bottom and sides of this box . . . and "hold"
the plastic down with push pins. I spray . . . if need be on something like
stiffeners, I set this "angled" where they are leaning against the side of
the box. When done, I remove the push pins, throw away the plastic . . .
and repeat the process next go around. There is absolutely no mess, it is
convenient, reusable, and easy to set out of the way when not being used (I
store this box on top of the crate the wings came in). Anyway, that's my
Christmas gift to the list. Not much, but, hey, I didn't get into a
discussion on primers!
Rick Jory
Highlands Ranch, Co
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Edward Cole" <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com> |
Mel,
The FAA will send out a postcard for your renewal.
Ed Cole
Too much holidays, too little building !
Merry Christmas to all!!!
----- Original Message -----
From: Mel Jordan <tmjordan(at)flash.net>
Sent: Thursday, December 23, 1999 6:20 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: N numbers
>
> I have reserved an N number and know that each year you have to pay a fee
to
> keep the reservation. However, as this will be the first year for me, how
> do you know it is time to pay the renewal fee. Does the FAA send you a
> renewal fee to hold the number for another year?
>
>
> Thanks,
> Mel Jordan RV6A
> N6JX reserved
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Keith Marsland" <marsman(at)flash.net> |
Jim
I've signed up. I figure the more information about building the better. I
am open to any and all imput that I can recieve to see that my RV6A gets
flying.
Regards,
Keith Marsland
RV6AQB Austin, Tx
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of bobdz
Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 1999 7:24 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: SourceRV
>
> So, has anybody signed on with SourceRV so they can tell us how things
> do/don't work at this site??
> Jim Nice
Jim
I've signed up. The free access period has been extended to January 15th. So
far there are just a few back issues of Van's newsletter. It does sound like
it will be worth the money. Time will tell.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hal Kempthorne <kempthorne(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | R & R the RV6a lower cowl -how?? |
Ho, ho, ho!
How do I remove and refit the lower cowl without a helper??? Ho, ho, ho huh?
Since my air scoop has not yet been glassed on, why not put it on with
screws my helper asked. Then I could, all by my lonesome, get at
carburetor, air filter etc etc just by removing 25 or 30 screws.
Has anyone done this? Anyone see any downsides? Will my plane spin violently?
hal
________________________________________________________________________________
I just got my reservation renewal notice and was planning to just register
it instead. The packet I got from FAA when I reserved says all I need is a
notarized affidavit of ownership (they provided a sample), the registration
form and $5. The letter was specific to amateur-built registration and
dated Jan. 1998. The affidavit for amateur-builts would seem to be
analogous to a bill-of-sale for production types. Has anyone used the
affidavit or has it been superceded in the last 2 years?
Regards,
Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
RV-6 N6GY (reserved) finishing kit
> >
> >just a hint guys: if you get a bill of sale from vans
> >and get the faa letter notorized send in an additional
> >5 dollars they will issue the n number and you won,t
> >have to pay the annual renewal due to the fact that
> >the number is issued
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | F1Rocket(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Merry Christmas from Team Rocket |
Hello Listers,
It's that time of year again when most of us can stop our busy schedules and
reflect back on the year just ending. Team Rocket would like to thank all of
you for your encouraging words and support during the passed year. As the new
year is just around the corner, Mark and I hope that this year was a great
year for all of you and that next year brings more joys than ever. We wish
you all a very Merry Christmas and a happy new year!
Mark Frederick
Scott Brown
Team Rocket, Inc.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
| Subject: | R & R the RV6a lower cowl -how?? |
Hal,
Good idea (I think). Will you please post any private replies that you get
so that all of us become wiser people. I still don't have my scoop attached
yet either. I love riveting platenuts but I hate that fiberglass!
Steve Soule
Brown Christmas in the valley, white Christmas in the mountains
-----Original Message-----Since my air scoop has not yet
been glassed on, why not put it on with
screws my helper asked. Then I could, all by my lonesome,
get at
carburetor, air filter etc etc just by removing 25 or 30
screws.
Has anyone done this? Anyone see any downsides? Will my
plane spin violently?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gert <gert(at)execpc.com> |
Glen
Does Van's send a Bill of sales *before* you bought all the kit parts ??
On the FAA form it asks for the type (?) and serial # of the engine. Can
I still register and leave those lines blank ??
To me there is an additional bonus to having it registered if what Mike
(Das Fed") sais is true ( I believe him)
-------------quote----------------
Gert,
The 'N' number has to actually be assigned to that airframe and be
registered
(same thing). You do not have to have had an airworthiness certificate
issued yet.
Mike Robertson
RV-8A QB
"Das Fed"
----------end quote-----------------
Be nice to get whoever is dicking in my garage if I ever catch him on a
additional federal offence of messing with an aircraft. Maybe, just
maybe, it will inspire the local constabulate to take it more serious
other than a "Oh well, we'll write a report but ya probably won't get
yer stuff back!"
Gert
glenn williams wrote:
>
>
> just a hint guys: if you get a bill of sale from vans
> and get the faa letter notorized send in an additional
> 5 dollars they will issue the n number and you won,t
> have to pay the annual renewal due to the fact that
> the number is issued
> Glenn Williams
> 8A wings
> Ft. Worth Texas
>
> --- Pat Hatch wrote:
> >
> >
> > Mel:
> >
> > Yes, you will get a notice from the FAA (post card)
> > to pay your $10 bucks
> > for the next year about a month before it is due. I
> > would keep a copy as a
> > sort of "tickler" for the next time.
> >
> > Pat Hatch
> > RV-4 N17PH @ INT
> > RV-6 Wing Kit
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Mel Jordan <tmjordan(at)flash.net>
> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > Date: Thursday, December 23, 1999 9:21 PM
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: N numbers
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >I have reserved an N number and know that each year
> > you have to pay a fee
> > to
> > >keep the reservation. However, as this will be the
> > first year for me, how
> > >do you know it is time to pay the renewal fee.
> > Does the FAA send you a
> > >renewal fee to hold the number for another year?
> > >
> > >
> > >Thanks,
> > >Mel Jordan RV6A
> > >N6JX reserved
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > through
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> >
> > Settlement...
> > http://www.matronics.com/jpi.html
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
--
Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227,
any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Garry Legare <versadek(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: R & R the RV6a lower cowl -how?? |
Hal, I have been considering doing exactly what you suggest only using Camlocs
instead of screws. You must have one of the new cowls as well, because this appears
to be fairly easy to do with the new cowl ,not so easy with the old one. I'm
probably going to go ahead and do it as the pluses you mention greatly outweigh
the
minus (slight weight increase, possible slight decrease in rigidity).
Garry LeGare, RV6 Finishing.
TC4212
Hal Kempthorne wrote:
>
> Ho, ho, ho!
>
> How do I remove and refit the lower cowl without a helper??? Ho, ho, ho huh?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 12/24/1999 11:03:28 AM Central Standard Time,
gyoung@cs-sol.com writes:
<< I just got my reservation renewal notice and was planning to just register
it instead. The packet I got from FAA when I reserved says all I need is a
notarized affidavit of ownership (they provided a sample), the registration
form and $5. The letter was specific to amateur-built registration and
dated Jan. 1998. The affidavit for amateur-builts would seem to be
analogous to a bill-of-sale for production types. Has anyone used the
affidavit or has it been superceded in the last 2 years?
Regards,
Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
RV-6 N6GY (reserved) finishing kit
>>
just modify the form as nessesary to register a home build. I am doing it
now for a F-1 Rocket
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DAVENDANA1(at)aol.com |
Harmon Rocket for sale. Almost ready to fly, Everything is there!
Contact Trent Johnson at 209-522-3628 for further details
Thanks and Merry Christmas
The Funk Family
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott A. Jordan" <SAJ_SLJ(at)compuserve.com> |
Message text written by Gert
>Does Van's send a Bill of sales *before* you bought all the kit parts ??<
I called them earlier this week to gett one. I haven't ordered my finish
kit yet but they said it would be no problem.
>On the FAA form it asks for the type (?) and serial # of the engine. Can
I still register and leave those lines blank ??<
Get a copy of Advisory Circular 20-27d for info on regeristing a homebuilt.
Available free from the GPO or
www.faa.gov/fsdo/orl/files/ADVCIR/ac20-27d.asc
Scott A. Jordan
80331
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MRawls3896(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Van's identity revealed |
Man did you hit the nail on the head. I got my wing kit this week (Dec.
22) and did I have fun opening it. Merry Christmas to all.
Mike Rawls
Starting wing kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | glenn williams <willig10(at)yahoo.com> |
I called and asked for a bill of sale and recieved it
even though I only have the tail and wings at this
point
Glenn Williams
8A wings
Ft. Worth Texas
--- "Scott A. Jordan" wrote:
>
>
> Message text written by Gert
> >Does Van's send a Bill of sales *before* you bought
> all the kit parts ??<
>
> I called them earlier this week to gett one. I
> haven't ordered my finish
> kit yet but they said it would be no problem.
>
> >On the FAA form it asks for the type (?) and serial
> # of the engine. Can
> I still register and leave those lines blank ??<
>
> Get a copy of Advisory Circular 20-27d for info on
> regeristing a homebuilt.
> Available free from the GPO or
> www.faa.gov/fsdo/orl/files/ADVCIR/ac20-27d.asc
>
> Scott A. Jordan
> 80331
>
>
>
> through
>
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
>
> Settlement...
> http://www.matronics.com/jpi.html
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gert <gert(at)execpc.com> |
Scott
Unless i need my glasses adjusting again, i did find no specific mention
of the engine serial no. Of course my brain could defenitely be fogged
up from christmas drink testing ;-)
Anyhow, I wish You all a very mery Christmas.
Gert
> >On the FAA form it asks for the type (?) and serial # of the engine. Can
> I still register and leave those lines blank ??<
>
> Get a copy of Advisory Circular 20-27d for info on regeristing a homebuilt.
> Available free from the GPO or
> www.faa.gov/fsdo/orl/files/ADVCIR/ac20-27d.asc
>
> Scott A. Jordan
> 80331
>
Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227,
any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <rv8er(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Your fuselage engine stand |
Hey Dale, I thought I recognized your name..you had an engine stand for your
RV in Sport Aviation last year or so....great idea..I did the same thing
after that article....thanks for using your noggin!
Paul Besing
RV-6A (197AB) Arizona
http://members.home.net/rv8er
Finish Kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott A. Jordan" <SAJ_SLJ(at)compuserve.com> |
Message text written by Gert:
>Unless i need my glasses adjusting again, i did find no specific mention
of the engine serial no.<
AC20-27D says that to register a homebuilt you must submit an Affidavit of
Ownership on AC Form 8050-88 _and_ a bill of sale (para 8 b. on page 6).
This form requests many items such as type engine & serial number. When I
wrote to the FAA and asked for all the forms I would need I did not get
8050-88. I plan on calling OK City next week to see if they really want
both. They are used to establish ownership and I would think a bill of
sale would be sufficient.
Of course, Advisory Circulars are not regulatory but you'll have a hard
time convincing many feds of that.
Scott A. Jordan
80331
too cold to work on the baggage door today
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bert F. Murillo" <bertrv(at)intellistar.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RST audio panel |
Grey:
I do not have it right in from, but I got it from any of the aviation
publications, such as the Sport Aviation; ;Kit Planes: Custum Planes
etc. I subscribe to all, and all these info is in their advertising..
Happy Happy holidays
Bert Murillo
rv6a
Dpo Not archive
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Steffensen" <steffco1(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | IO360 200hp Exhaust System |
Lister's,
I have installed the Vettermann crossover exhaust on my IO 360 200hp engine.
I have bought the Van's heat muff 9 inch version & cannot get it to fit.
With all of the bends in the exhaust system there just doesn't seem to be a
long enough straight run for the muff.
Am I missing something here? or do I need to use the shorter 6 inch version?
If I use the shorter version will this supply enough cabin heat?
Lately I seem to be ordering & sending things back to Van's because they
don't fit or I am sent the wrong size.
I am spending more time waiting for parts than working on the airplane.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JDaniel343(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | RV-List:Merry Christmas to all |
Just wanted to wish everyone on the list a MERRY CHRISTMAS and a HAPPY NEW
YEAR.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <rv8er(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: IO360 200hp Exhaust System |
My heat muff was too long for the straight stretch in the exhaust. I spoke
with Larry Vetterman about it, and he basically said to get the Robbin's
muff. It is far superior in quality, and is made to perfectly fit Larry's
exhaust....I have not yet received my heat muff from Robbins, but I did send
the one back to Van's..
Paul Besing
RV-6A (197AB) Arizona
http://members.home.net/rv8er
Finish Kit
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Steffensen" <steffco1(at)email.msn.com>
Sent: Friday, December 24, 1999 6:32 PM
Subject: RV-List: IO360 200hp Exhaust System
>
> Lister's,
>
> I have installed the Vettermann crossover exhaust on my IO 360 200hp
engine.
>
> I have bought the Van's heat muff 9 inch version & cannot get it to fit.
>
> With all of the bends in the exhaust system there just doesn't seem to be
a
> long enough straight run for the muff.
>
> Am I missing something here? or do I need to use the shorter 6 inch
version?
>
> If I use the shorter version will this supply enough cabin heat?
>
> Lately I seem to be ordering & sending things back to Van's because they
> don't fit or I am sent the wrong size.
>
> I am spending more time waiting for parts than working on the airplane.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: R & R the RV6a lower cowl -how?? |
| From: | Wes Hays <whays(at)juno.com> |
>Since my air scoop has not yet been glassed on, why not put it on with
>screws my helper asked. Then I could, all by my lonesome, get at
>carburetor, air filter etc etc just by removing 25 or 30 screws.
>
Hal,
FWIW, I fitted my air scoop to the carb just the way you described except
I used clecos. I do have the S-Cowl though and it is much more rigid than
the polyester. It might or might not work quite as well. So far
everything seems to fit great.
Also a note to the S-cowl folks. I couldn't get enough clearance between
the cowl and the #2 ball joint and exhaust pipe. I called Larry Vetterman
and he said that he had designed a new exhaust system for the S-cowl for
those who did not mount the air scoop "off center". I really can't say
enough good things about Larry. He traded exhaust with me since I had not
drilled the EGT probe holes and the new one fits great. If you have a
problem fitting this area, give Larry a call. I'll wager he can help you
fix it.
Regards and Merry Christmas.
Wes Hays
RV6-A (Finally finished systems and avionics wiring)
Rotan, TX
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris & Kellie Hand" <ckhand(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | free-standing wing jig available |
I am done with my free-standing wing jig, if anybody is interested in using
it you can have it. (no charge, it was given to me and would like to pass
it on if it would be helpful to any other RVers) I got it from a local A&P
who built it and used it to build an RV-8 emp and set of wings. My RV-6A
emp was done before I moved to CA but I used this jig to build both wings
(one at a time).
It is braced using aircraft cable and turnbuckles to hold the up-rights in
place. If your work area makes the standard jig difficult (or impossible)
then this jig might be useful to you.
The guy I got it from was building in a giant, old Army hanger at a former
Army air base. Since he couldn't possibly have reached the hanger roof with
4x4's, he needed a free-standing jig. I built my wings in a spare bedroom
with hardwood floors and didn't want to attach 4x4's to the house
(especially since I don't own it), so this jig worked out well for me.
I live on the Monterey Peninsula in CA. Please contact me off-list if you
are interested.
I don't have a web site, but can scan and e-mail pictures if you want to see
the setup.
Happy Holidays,
Chris Hand
RV-6A, finishing up wing kit,
fuselage starting after move to Indiana!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Harrill <KHarrill(at)osa.state.sc.us> |
| Subject: | Cowling Question |
To those who have finished their cowling (RV-6), is it necessary to have
the exhaust system installed on the engine in order to fit the cowling
to the fuselage?
Ken Harrill
RV-6
South Carolina
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <rv8er(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowling Question |
If you have the 0-360 and the S cowl, then yes. You have to make sure that
there will be sufficient clearance below the #1 cylinder. Some have been
known to contact the cowl, which requires a modification of the placement of
the scoop, or a modification of the exhaust. If you have the old cowl, or
an O-320, then it should not be a problem.
Paul Besing
RV-6A (197AB) Arizona
http://members.home.net/rv8er
Finish Kit
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Harrill" <KHarrill(at)osa.state.sc.us>
Sent: Friday, December 24, 1999 10:27 PM
Subject: RV-List: Cowling Question
>
> To those who have finished their cowling (RV-6), is it necessary to have
> the exhaust system installed on the engine in order to fit the cowling
> to the fuselage?
>
>
> Ken Harrill
> RV-6
> South Carolina
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Greener" <rgreener(at)micron.net> |
| Subject: | RE: RV3-List: merry christmas |
Hello RV 3er's
MERRY CHRISTMAS TO YOU ALL.
For all on the RV List, who will get a copy of this message, A MERRY
CHRISTMAS TOO.
Rob G. (RV-3B Fuselage almost (?) out of the jig).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net> |
To List : Since Greentree financed some of my kit they handled the
registration of my RV6A-QB with new 0-360-A1A. I received the registration
of N362CT 2 days before my kit arrived on 12-22-99 !! Even though i had the
engine serial number all the FAA required was a Bill of Sale to register.
PS : In Ohio if you build from a kit of raw materials Tax is due
only on materials bought and consumed in Ohio.Since i am the manufacture on
the registration tax is due if i sell to a consumer. The State will
sometimes try to collect but legally can't !!!!
Merry Christmas Tom in Ohio
----------
> From: Scott A. Jordan <SAJ_SLJ(at)compuserve.com>
> To: INTERNET:rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: N numbers
> Date: Friday, December 24, 1999 7:05 PM
>
>
> Message text written by Gert:
>
> >Unless i need my glasses adjusting again, i did find no specific mention
> of the engine serial no.<
>
> AC20-27D says that to register a homebuilt you must submit an Affidavit
of
> Ownership on AC Form 8050-88 _and_ a bill of sale (para 8 b. on page 6).
> This form requests many items such as type engine & serial number. When
I
> wrote to the FAA and asked for all the forms I would need I did not get
> 8050-88. I plan on calling OK City next week to see if they really want
> both. They are used to establish ownership and I would think a bill of
> sale would be sufficient.
>
> Of course, Advisory Circulars are not regulatory but you'll have a hard
> time convincing many feds of that.
>
> Scott A. Jordan
> 80331
> too cold to work on the baggage door today
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob Acker" <racker(at)cyberhighway.net> |
| Subject: | G-Meter (sale or trade) |
I have a brand new unused 2 1/4" G-meter, that I would like to either trade
for a 3 1/8" G-meter or sell outright. Please contact me off-list if
interested.
Rob Acker (RV-6Q, working on panel, http://fp1.cyberhighway.net/~racker)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TRAASHMAN(at)webtv.net (Joe Waltz) |
| Subject: | Re: IO360 200hp Exhaust System |
I used the 8" Rick Robbins muff on the crossover portion of the 3/4
pipes. Works great and Rick was a good guy to deal with. IO-360, RV-8,
standard cowl.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | GLPalinkas(at)aol.com |
Tom, I did the same thing and my registration is on the wall of my shop as we
speak.
Listers: Tom is getting a huge (4 boxes) Xmas present this week (already
there...waiting to be picked up) Have fun. Merry Xmas.
Gary Palinkas
Parma, Ohio
RV6 QB Panel stuff
<<<>>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dfmorrow(at)aol.com |
FYI a company called Monroy Aerospace produces a TCAS type product for $895.
It appears to give distance to other transponder equiped aircraft but not
bearing or altitude. Their web address is www.monroyaero.com. I have no
personal experience with the product.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WILLMINCEY(at)aol.com |
I have a friend that is trying to find an rv3. Non acro (spar mods not
required), day VFR (read minimum guages/gadgets). Wants low to mid time
engine in good condition with no damage history. Delivery to (MAO) S.
Carolina a Plus. If you have or know who does - a reply sent will be
forwarded to him
Thanks
Will Mincey
RV3A 81TD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DAVENDANA1(at)aol.com |
Shop heater here :-)
Dave
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry & Karen Gooding <GOODING(at)hargray.com> |
His & hers Seaplane ratings... we're off to Brown's in the morning.
Larry Gooding
(wings)
Karen Gooding
(bucking bar queen)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
>From: DAVENDANA1(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Santa
>Date: Sat, 25 Dec 1999 18:20:50 EST
>
>
>Shop heater here :-)
>
>Dave
Also a shop heater for me. 155,000 btu's of soul warming heat to fend off
the chill when the icy cold air goes zipping through the airdrill. Brr!
Highly recommended for those cold days in the hangar. Even runs on Jet fuel.
Just go siphon a Lear. hehe.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
flying! Two hours and still grinnin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HAROLD1339(at)aol.com |
I have a very nice RV4 for sale, if interested, I will send spec sheet. Not
cheap, but quality never is.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | RV8 N94BD flight data |
Listers,
I took a short flight to a local airport as my second venture into the wild
blue. I had more time to relax (ok, grin, giggle, hoot and hollar) and note
some flight data.
Two-way GPS run average ground speed (no gear leg fairings, pants or paint
yet): 167mph@2550rpm and 9,000'msl, which is all the Sensenich 83 inch pitch
will give me. Overpitched? Hmmm. Will verify tach readings with an optical
tachometer soon. It sure sounds like it's turning much faster.
Oil temp: 160 degrees. It's cold out there! Might have to mask off some oil
cooler area. Gotta cook off that water. Don't want to corrode my Lycosaur.
Oil pressure: 75psi on Aeroshell 15W-50.
Cylinder heat temp #3cyl: 475 degrees on steep, full power climbs. It
settles down to about 350 in cruise.
General observations:
1. The oil filler door puckers up when you're going fast. It needs to be
stiffened up a bit with either carbon or some sort of rib.
2. It's LOUD inside without acoustical insulation of some sort. With noise
attenuating headsets, it's much more tolerable. The floor under my feet seem
to resonate the exhaust note quite a bit, and it changes with rpm. There's a
"sweet spot" where it calms down which seems to be about 2400 rpm. I do
plan to have the prop/spinner/flywheel dynamically balanced.
3. Handling qualities. PURE SEX with wings. Nuff said.
4. Landing technique: 80mph over the fence, with a tailwheel low wheelie
touchdown as the end result. Without aft ballast, three pointers are pretty
challenging. After the mains touch, I reduce the pull and let the nose drop
a bit, which plants the gear firmly. The tail drops on it's own soon after
that. Works fine. I will work on full stall landings when I get some weight
in the baggage hold.
5. Max altitude so far: 13,800'!! Man, this thing climbs! Those accustomed
to flying spam will have to get used to the sight picture over the nose in
level flight. The cowl is waaay below the horizon. So, it's easy to find
yourself holding a climb attitude without even thinking about it.
6. Ground handling: if you can handle a Citabria, you can handle a -8. It
does nothing unusual and the rudder is very...VERY effective. Keep your
heels on the floor since the brake pedals are rock solid (sensitive) and you
don't want to inadvertantly apply brake when you don't want it.
That's all I can think of right now. The weather turned sour and shut me
down. Drat! Just when I was starting to have fun!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Thomas McIntyre <bogeybrother(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8 N94BD flight data |
Brian
what size engine are you using?
Tom
Brian Denk wrote:
>
> Listers,
>
> I took a short flight to a local airport as my second venture into the wild
> blue. I had more time to relax (ok, grin, giggle, hoot and hollar) and note
> some flight data.
>
> Two-way GPS run average ground speed (no gear leg fairings, pants or paint
> yet): 167mph@2550rpm and 9,000'msl, which is all the Sensenich 83 inch pitch
> will give me. Overpitched? Hmmm. Will verify tach readings with an optical
> tachometer soon. It sure sounds like it's turning much faster.
>
> Oil temp: 160 degrees. It's cold out there! Might have to mask off some oil
> cooler area. Gotta cook off that water. Don't want to corrode my Lycosaur.
>
> Oil pressure: 75psi on Aeroshell 15W-50.
>
> Cylinder heat temp #3cyl: 475 degrees on steep, full power climbs. It
> settles down to about 350 in cruise.
>
> General observations:
>
> 1. The oil filler door puckers up when you're going fast. It needs to be
> stiffened up a bit with either carbon or some sort of rib.
>
> 2. It's LOUD inside without acoustical insulation of some sort. With noise
> attenuating headsets, it's much more tolerable. The floor under my feet seem
> to resonate the exhaust note quite a bit, and it changes with rpm. There's a
> "sweet spot" where it calms down which seems to be about 2400 rpm. I do
> plan to have the prop/spinner/flywheel dynamically balanced.
>
> 3. Handling qualities. PURE SEX with wings. Nuff said.
>
> 4. Landing technique: 80mph over the fence, with a tailwheel low wheelie
> touchdown as the end result. Without aft ballast, three pointers are pretty
> challenging. After the mains touch, I reduce the pull and let the nose drop
> a bit, which plants the gear firmly. The tail drops on it's own soon after
> that. Works fine. I will work on full stall landings when I get some weight
> in the baggage hold.
>
> 5. Max altitude so far: 13,800'!! Man, this thing climbs! Those accustomed
> to flying spam will have to get used to the sight picture over the nose in
> level flight. The cowl is waaay below the horizon. So, it's easy to find
> yourself holding a climb attitude without even thinking about it.
>
> 6. Ground handling: if you can handle a Citabria, you can handle a -8. It
> does nothing unusual and the rudder is very...VERY effective. Keep your
> heels on the floor since the brake pedals are rock solid (sensitive) and you
> don't want to inadvertantly apply brake when you don't want it.
>
> That's all I can think of right now. The weather turned sour and shut me
> down. Drat! Just when I was starting to have fun!
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | 6A Wing Root Fairings |
I started to install the 6A wing root fairings -- P/N WRFxx1 (I can't read
the xx stamped on the part) and I can't find a drawing depicting the
installation. I am particularly wondering about the arc length across the
tank: Are there platenuts in the tank root section holding the fairing on?
Section 8-20 of my instructions describes how esthetically pleasing they are
but gives no clue as to how to mount them.
Dennis Persyk 6A finishing kit
Hampshire, IL C38
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV6A Intersection Fairings are HERE!!!! |
| From: | Anthony J Castellano <tcastella(at)juno.com> |
Do you also have fairings for the RV6?
Tony Castellano
tcastella(at)juno.com
Hopewell Junction, NY
RV-6
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John B. Holmgreen" <j32619(at)innova.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 6A Wing Root Fairings |
Dennis,
I can't find the placement directions either. To answer your question,
yes you do install platenuts to the tank portion of the wing. I seem to
recall a caution to plan your spacing to avoid the inboard rib flutes.
Mine worked out well or maybe I'm too easy to please!
John Holmgreen
Clinton, SC
RV-6A First flight from 27J on Dec 16, 1999 and like all before have said,
"Great Bird"!!!
----- Original Message -----
From: Dennis Persyk <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
Sent: Saturday, December 25, 1999 8:43 PM
Subject: RV-List: 6A Wing Root Fairings
>
> I started to install the 6A wing root fairings -- P/N WRFxx1 (I can't read
> the xx stamped on the part) and I can't find a drawing depicting the
> installation. I am particularly wondering about the arc length across the
> tank: Are there platenuts in the tank root section holding the fairing on?
> Section 8-20 of my instructions describes how esthetically pleasing they
are
> but gives no clue as to how to mount them.
>
> Dennis Persyk 6A finishing kit
> Hampshire, IL C38
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Baker" <gtbaker(at)bright.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8 N94BD flight data |
Brian,
A late congratulations on the first ( and second flight)!! Wish I were
anywhere close to that stage!
As an EAA Flight Advisor, I would like to know (both of you and anyone else
who has had a recent first flight or an upcoming one): What do your flight
plans for the first 10-20 hours of flight look like? How fast are you
stretching the aircraft's envelope (range of speeds/maneuvers/etc?)
I would also like to ask a favor of those of you who report aircraft speeds:
Could you also give a report of what the true air speed is during your
trials? This number would give me a better number to use for comparison to
other aircraft and, hopefully, my own in the future. Thanks.
Happy Holidays to Everyone! And thanks for all of the time everyone takes to
reply to the wide and varied subjects that come up on this List!
Gary Baker
RV-6 (Working on wings)
N4GB (Reserved)
Medina, OH
>
> Listers,
>
> I took a short flight to a local airport as my second venture into the
wild
> blue. I had more time to relax (ok, grin, giggle, hoot and hollar) and
note
> some flight data.
>
> Two-way GPS run average ground speed (no gear leg fairings, pants or paint
> yet): 167mph@2550rpm and 9,000'msl, which is all the Sensenich 83 inch
pitch
> will give me. Overpitched? Hmmm. Will verify tach readings with an optical
> tachometer soon. It sure sounds like it's turning much faster.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8 N94BD flight data |
>
>Listers,
>
>I took a short flight to a local airport as my second venture into the wild
>blue. I had more time to relax (ok, grin, giggle, hoot and hollar) and note
>some flight data.
>
>Two-way GPS run average ground speed (no gear leg fairings, pants or paint
>yet): 167mph@2550rpm and 9,000'msl, which is all the Sensenich 83 inch pitch
>will give me. Overpitched? Hmmm. Will verify tach readings with an optical
>tachometer soon. It sure sounds like it's turning much faster.
>
Hi Brian,
Congrats on the first flight! I'm very jealous.
While I would certainly check the tach accuracy, it is way too early
to be worrying about whether the prop is pitched right. You'll pick
up quite a few knots once you put on the fairings, wheel pants, etc.
This will let the engine turn up some more, which will let it make
more power, which will speed you up, etc. I'm betting you'll pick up
at least 100 rpm once you clean everything up.
Have fun.
Kevin Horton RV-8 (wings skinned, getting ready to do fuselage)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)accessus.net> |
Don't laugh. I have a 55 gallon barrel of Jet - A that I got free as
"sumpings" from a large operation of Citations. Works great! They were
glad to get rid of it otherwise they would have to pay hazardous waste fees.
Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact!
(Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com)
-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Denk <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Date: Saturday, December 25, 1999 7:01 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Santa
>
>
>>From: DAVENDANA1(at)aol.com
>>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>>Subject: Re: RV-List: Santa
>>Date: Sat, 25 Dec 1999 18:20:50 EST
>>
>>
>>Shop heater here :-)
>>
>>Dave
>
>
>Also a shop heater for me. 155,000 btu's of soul warming heat to fend off
>the chill when the icy cold air goes zipping through the airdrill. Brr!
>Highly recommended for those cold days in the hangar. Even runs on Jet
fuel.
>Just go siphon a Lear. hehe.
>
>Brian Denk
>RV8 N94BD
>flying! Two hours and still grinnin.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <tcwatson(at)seanet.com> |
>
> >Question; Is there an RV-8A finish kit video?
I asked George a week or two ago if he was going to do one, and he said no.
He also said to put the prop on the front and the wheels on the bottom, and
everything would turn out fine.
Hope he's right.
Terry Watson
RV-8A sealing tanks
Seattle
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | VP4SkyDoc(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 12/24/1999 4:51:45 PM Tokyo Standard Time, true(at)uswest.net
writes:
> So the RMI uEncoder has a mode C encoder built into it doesn't it? As
> such, you wouldn't need a "blind" encoder, would you, if you have the
> RMI in your panel? So am I correct in assuming there would be no
> difference in functionality between a blind encoder and an altimeter
> encoder?
>
This is true, George True. And the RMI has added benifit of reading out the
pressure alt that it is sending, making calibration a little easier.
Dave Leonard
6QB wings
Mazda 13B Rotary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> |
| Subject: | Reporting airspeeds, was: RV8 N94BD flight data |
>
>I would also like to ask a favor of those of you who report aircraft speeds:
>Could you also give a report of what the true air speed is during your
>trials? This number would give me a better number to use for comparison to
>other aircraft and, hopefully, my own in the future. Thanks.
>
Hi Gary,
I certainly agree that posters should be very clear in what type of
airspeed they are reporting. But we all need to realize that it is
very difficult to determine an accurate true airspeed, at least until
everything has been calibrated. For example, a recent post reported
an airspeed indicator that was found to have more than a 10 mph error
during a bench calibration. Each aircraft has a different static
system position error, which could easily make the indicated
airspeeds be in error by several mph. And finally, to convert to
true airspeed you need to know the outside air temperature. Many
builders install temperature probes in the NACA inlets that provide
fresh air to the cabin. However, these probes often are mounted from
the cabin, into the inlet, and can be affected by the heated air in
the cabin warming the back side of the probe.
So, even if a lister reports a TAS calculated from indicated
airspeed, I would be suitably suspicious unless you know that the
instrument was calibrated, the position error was determined, and the
temperature probe is actually measuring the true outside air
temperature.
Probably the best info we will get is GPS ground speed, averaged over
a number of directions to take out the wind. Doug Gray has a
spreadsheet to take data from three GPS tracks and calculate the TAS,
available at: http://www.hlos.com.au/~doug.gray/home.html
Take care,
Kevin Horton RV-8 (wings skinned, getting ready to do fuselage)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8 N94BD flight data |
>
>Brian
>what size engine are you using?
>Tom
>
>Tom,
O-360A4J, 180hp. Prop is Sensenich 72FM8S9-83.
Vetterman exhaust.
Brian Denk
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chester razer <razer(at)midwest.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Reporting airspeeds, was: RV8 N94BD flight data |
I have my temp probe installed in my pilot side NACA inlet and it seems
as though it reads a few degrees high during flight. I suspect it is
being heated from the back side by cockpit air. I think Ill squirt a
little "great stuff" insulation on the back side and see if that helps
the problem
chet
>
> I certainly agree that posters should be very clear in what type of
> airspeed they are reporting. But we all need to realize that it is
> very difficult to determine an accurate true airspeed, at least until
> everything has been calibrated. For example, a recent post reported
> an airspeed indicator that was found to have more than a 10 mph error
> during a bench calibration. Each aircraft has a different static
> system position error, which could easily make the indicated
> airspeeds be in error by several mph. And finally, to convert to
> true airspeed you need to know the outside air temperature. Many
> builders install temperature probes in the NACA inlets that provide
> fresh air to the cabin. However, these probes often are mounted from
> the cabin, into the inlet, and can be affected by the heated air in
> the cabin warming the back side of the probe.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8 N94BD flight data |
>
>Brian,
>
>A late congratulations on the first ( and second flight)!! Wish I were
>anywhere close to that stage!
>
>As an EAA Flight Advisor, I would like to know (both of you and anyone else
>who has had a recent first flight or an upcoming one): What do your flight
>plans for the first 10-20 hours of flight look like? How fast are you
>stretching the aircraft's envelope (range of speeds/maneuvers/etc?)
>
>I would also like to ask a favor of those of you who report aircraft
>speeds:
>Could you also give a report of what the true air speed is during your
>trials? This number would give me a better number to use for comparison to
>other aircraft and, hopefully, my own in the future. Thanks.
>
>Happy Holidays to Everyone! And thanks for all of the time everyone takes
>to
>reply to the wide and varied subjects that come up on this List!
>
>Gary Baker
>RV-6 (Working on wings)
>N4GB (Reserved)
>Medina, OH
Gary,
My test regime isn't very scientific, at least not yet. I'm just trying to
get friendly with it and figure out what works best for takeoff and landing.
My only speed concern is how much ground I'm covering, which is why true
airspeed hasn't come into play. The GPS is telling me what I need to know.
At this stage, engine parameters and airframe integrity are my primary
concerns. Safety first, now and always.
I'll be working up to steeper turns and higher G loadings gradually. A full
stall series with various flap positions will be done next weekend...as long
as the Earth doesn't explode on New Years. In which case, ALL of our
RV's...finished or not..will be flying. ! ;)
Brian Denk
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8 N94BD flight data |
>From: Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: RV8 N94BD flight data
>Date: Sat, 25 Dec 1999 22:12:09 -0500
>
>
>
> >
> >Listers,
> >
> >I took a short flight to a local airport as my second venture into the
>wild
> >blue. I had more time to relax (ok, grin, giggle, hoot and hollar) and
>note
> >some flight data.
> >
> >Two-way GPS run average ground speed (no gear leg fairings, pants or
>paint
> >yet): 167mph@2550rpm and 9,000'msl, which is all the Sensenich 83 inch
>pitch
> >will give me. Overpitched? Hmmm. Will verify tach readings with an
>optical
> >tachometer soon. It sure sounds like it's turning much faster.
> >
>Hi Brian,
>
>Congrats on the first flight! I'm very jealous.
>
>While I would certainly check the tach accuracy, it is way too early
>to be worrying about whether the prop is pitched right. You'll pick
>up quite a few knots once you put on the fairings, wheel pants, etc.
>This will let the engine turn up some more, which will let it make
>more power, which will speed you up, etc. I'm betting you'll pick up
>at least 100 rpm once you clean everything up.
>
>Have fun.
>
>Kevin Horton RV-8 (wings skinned, getting ready to do
>fuselage)
>Ottawa, Canada
>http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html
Kevin,
Thanks! If I do pick up that extra 100rpm with the fairings on, then the
prop will be just about perfect. I'm pleased with it so far. It accelerates
well on takeoff, hauls it aloft then yanks it forward very well without a
tendency to overspeed, nor does it lug the engine down. All things
considered, I think Sensenich did a fine job. The engine/prop make a good
combination for the airframe.
Now this makes me want to get those fairings done! Ick...fiberglass.
Brian Denk
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chester razer <razer(at)midwest.net> |
| Subject: | Sam James Wing Root Fairings |
wing root fairings on a 6 or 6A how much top end speed improvement you
have noticed.
chet and Miss Chiq.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | pagan <pagan(at)cboss.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8 N94BD flight data |
Hi Gary,
I pretty much plan on following the flight test guidelines in AC 90-89A.
On my first flight I just climbed to 4,000 msl and then did a check of all
the flight controls gradually increasing the angles 5 degrees, 10 degrees
and didn't go beyond 20 degrees. I then did a series of stalls to
pre-stall buffet. One of my stalls I hung on a little too long and did a
full stall unintentionally. Then I just flew around a while and enjoyed.
I never went over 140 mph IAS and I never left sight of the airport on the
first flight. If I ever get the chance to fly this plane again (Holidays,
Family and Weather) I plan on the second flight being a ditto of the first.
Always keeping in mind a quote from the AC "Go from known to the
unknown....slowly!"
For anyone who doesn't know, FAA Advisory Circular AC 90-89A is the FAA
flight testing handbook which you can get from your local FSDO. The copy I
have is dated 5/24/95.
Bill Pagan
RV-8A N565BW First flight 12/19/99
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/9749/william.html
>
>Brian,
>
>A late congratulations on the first ( and second flight)!! Wish I were
>anywhere close to that stage!
>
>As an EAA Flight Advisor, I would like to know (both of you and anyone else
>who has had a recent first flight or an upcoming one): What do your flight
>plans for the first 10-20 hours of flight look like? How fast are you
>stretching the aircraft's envelope (range of speeds/maneuvers/etc?)
>
>I would also like to ask a favor of those of you who report aircraft speeds:
>Could you also give a report of what the true air speed is during your
>trials? This number would give me a better number to use for comparison to
>other aircraft and, hopefully, my own in the future. Thanks.
>
>Happy Holidays to Everyone! And thanks for all of the time everyone takes to
>reply to the wide and varied subjects that come up on this List!
>
>Gary Baker
>RV-6 (Working on wings)
>N4GB (Reserved)
>Medina, OH
>
>>
>> Listers,
>>
>> I took a short flight to a local airport as my second venture into the
>wild
>> blue. I had more time to relax (ok, grin, giggle, hoot and hollar) and
>note
>> some flight data.
>>
>> Two-way GPS run average ground speed (no gear leg fairings, pants or paint
>> yet): 167mph@2550rpm and 9,000'msl, which is all the Sensenich 83 inch
>pitch
>> will give me. Overpitched? Hmmm. Will verify tach readings with an optical
>> tachometer soon. It sure sounds like it's turning much faster.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com> |
>
>
> I have nothing bad to say about Cleveland since I bought all of my
> tools
> from Avery. All I can say is that the Averys are among the nicest
> people in
> the world to deal with, so I always lobby for builders to buy from
> them.
I'll second this notion. Doesn't hurt that they are 2.5 hours by car,
considerably less by rented spam can, for those NIRTS situations.
:)
One thought - The air squeezer you lust after will be compatible with
yokes which fit the Avery hand squeezer (included in tool kit A). I
don't believe the same interchangability can be said of the Cleveland
tool. And believe me, you can't always get that fat pneumatic body in
where you need it!
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX
-6 N140RV
Wings (but not many Need It Right This Second events lately)
====
Michael E. Thompson (Grobdriver(at)yahoo.com)
Austin, TX, USA
RV-6 in progress, N140RV (Reserved)
EX-AX1 Sub Hunter, P-3 (B/B-TACMOD/C) Orion Aircrew,
PP-G,ASEL, Motorglider Driver and Unlimited Air Race Nut!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8 N94BD flight data |
>
>Listers,
>
>I took a short flight to a local airport as my second venture into the wild
>blue. I had more time to relax (ok, grin, giggle, hoot and hollar) and note
>some flight data.
>
>Two-way GPS run average ground speed (no gear leg fairings, pants or paint
>yet): 167mph@2550rpm and 9,000'msl, which is all the Sensenich 83 inch
pitch
>will give me. Overpitched? Hmmm. Will verify tach readings with an optical
>tachometer soon. It sure sounds like it's turning much faster.
>
Brian,
I wouldn't make any prop decisions until all the fairings are on. As you go
faster the prop unloads more.
When I was flying without wheelpants but with gear leg fairings I was still
able to readline the engine in level flight but not near as easily. I know
on the 6 the gear leg fairings are more important than wheel pants, don't
know about the 8.
Your speed is certainly low enough that it is either fairings or prop
overpitch or both but if that is really the same prop I have I can't really
imagine it being overpitched on your airplane. Anyway, you are working on
it with your idea to check the tach.
I think another way to check the tach is to fly with someone else and have
them look at your prop through theirs. I haven't tried this but have read
about it.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <rv8er(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Reporting airspeeds, was: RV8 N94BD flight data |
If the flyer is using a GPS, (which most are by now, it seems) Why don't we
just report ground speeds? After all, airspeeds from the airspeed indicator
are really only good for two things, take off and landing. It only shows
the speed that the plane is moving relative to the air not the ground. I
would think Ground Speed would be much more valuable information.
Paul Besing
RV-6A (197AB) Arizona
http://members.home.net/rv8er
Finish Kit
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kevin Horton" <khorton(at)cyberus.ca>
Sent: Sunday, December 26, 1999 5:18 AM
Subject: RV-List: Reporting airspeeds, was: RV8 N94BD flight data
>
> >
> >I would also like to ask a favor of those of you who report aircraft
speeds:
> >Could you also give a report of what the true air speed is during your
> >trials? This number would give me a better number to use for comparison
to
> >other aircraft and, hopefully, my own in the future. Thanks.
> >
> Hi Gary,
>
> I certainly agree that posters should be very clear in what type of
> airspeed they are reporting. But we all need to realize that it is
> very difficult to determine an accurate true airspeed, at least until
> everything has been calibrated. For example, a recent post reported
> an airspeed indicator that was found to have more than a 10 mph error
> during a bench calibration. Each aircraft has a different static
> system position error, which could easily make the indicated
> airspeeds be in error by several mph. And finally, to convert to
> true airspeed you need to know the outside air temperature. Many
> builders install temperature probes in the NACA inlets that provide
> fresh air to the cabin. However, these probes often are mounted from
> the cabin, into the inlet, and can be affected by the heated air in
> the cabin warming the back side of the probe.
>
> So, even if a lister reports a TAS calculated from indicated
> airspeed, I would be suitably suspicious unless you know that the
> instrument was calibrated, the position error was determined, and the
> temperature probe is actually measuring the true outside air
> temperature.
>
> Probably the best info we will get is GPS ground speed, averaged over
> a number of directions to take out the wind. Doug Gray has a
> spreadsheet to take data from three GPS tracks and calculate the TAS,
> available at: http://www.hlos.com.au/~doug.gray/home.html
>
> Take care,
>
> Kevin Horton RV-8 (wings skinned, getting ready to do
fuselage)
> Ottawa, Canada
> http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> |
| Subject: | AC 90-89A, was: RV8 N94BD flight data |
>
>For anyone who doesn't know, FAA Advisory Circular AC 90-89A is the FAA
>flight testing handbook which you can get from your local FSDO. The copy I
>have is dated 5/24/95.
>
AC90-89A is also available on the web as an Adobe Acrobat file, for
free, at: ftp://ftp.fedworld.gov/pub/faa-oai/90-89a.pdf
This, and a whole bunch of other flight test related links, are is my
RV Links page, at: http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rvlinks.html
Take care,
Kevin Horton RV-8 (wings skinned, getting ready to do fuselage)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | OrndorffG(at)aol.com |
Yes there is a finish kit video - it was done on an -8, but mostly everything
is the same. If you have questions, give us a call.
And, by the way, the man with the builder assist shop who has built and
helped with numerous RVs also got tools for XMAS - a socket light and a snake
driver and clench wrenches. Guess what - you never have enough tools!
Becki Orndorff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WAYNE BONESTEEL <wayneb(at)oakweb.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8 N94BD flight data |
Brian Denk wrote:
>
> Two-way GPS run average ground speed (no gear leg fairings, pants or paint
> yet): 167mph@2550rpm and 9,000'msl, which is all the Sensenich 83 inch pitch
> will give me. Overpitched? Hmmm. Will verify tach readings with an optical
> tachometer soon. It sure sounds like it's turning much faster.
Brian
I havn't flown my RV4 yet, just taxi, but my static run up was 2000 RPM so I
checked with prop tach at 2220 RPM. My tach is one from Vans (made in China)
its only mechanical they have so got another from them, will try today to see if
its
ok, if not I will will go to Spruce or Chief.
Wayne RV4 wing fairing.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Evan&Megan Johnson" <evmeg(at)snowcrest.net> |
| Subject: | New Address for fuel tank builder |
Just a quick announcement. Some of you are already aware that I have moved
shop from Portland to Redding CA. but to the others, this is how you find
me. Due to increasing demand, I have decided to try building fuel tanks as a
full time job. As always, I am looking for new projects, and any of you who
would like to skip the task of dealing with the pro seal are encouraged to
call. Also remember that advise is always free. If you are building your own
tanks and get stuck (maybe literally) feel free to call.....I'll help if I
can.
Evan Johnson
1736 Garden Ave.
Redding CA 96001
(530) 945-9308
evmeg(at)snowcrest.net
Much Thanks......Evan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Lawrence08(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List Digest: 12/25/99 |
Please delete me from this RV8 list digest. Thanks--Jim Lawrence
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris & Kellie Hand" <ckhand(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Avery's, was Santa thread |
Bill,
I haven't bought anything from Cleveland so can't speak on their quality or
service, but I don't remember hearing or seeing anything negative about
them.
Having used Avery's for most of my tools, I can say that their tools are of
good quality and their customer service is nothing short of outstanding. In
particular, their C-frame and hand squeezer are very sturdy and do nice
work. I would buy from them again if I were starting over.
Chris Hand
RV-6A, finishing up wing kit
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Shook <skydiven(at)bellsouth.net>
Sent: Saturday, December 25, 1999 7:33 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: Santa
>
> I got tools for christmas. I even gave her the Avery catalog and showed
her
> which pages the RV kits are on. :) Then there was the gift certificates
> from family (all tool oriented). And of course, I have bought myself
> several as of late just for fun. Now I get to call Cleveland tools this
> week and order the rest of what I don't have. Oh, speaking of which, in
> comparing the cleveland tool kits to Avery's I find that cleveland
includes
> many more tools and is in general cheaper on most things, so I'm buying
from
> them....anyone feel that Avery's are that much better than cleveland
> (C-frame, dimples, that sort of thing....). I think I'm going to buy the
> total airframe kit from cleveland minus what I already have (rivet gun,
> bucking bars, drills) and I'm getting a pneumatic sqeezer from Kunkle if I
> can ever get him to email me back.
>
> Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Louis Willig <larywil(at)home.com> |
Well, I must have been a bad boy this year.... but my best flying buddy was
a good boy. Yesterday, Christmas Day, my friend Bill Nelson took my RV-4,
N8ZZ, for a quick flight to relax his nerves. He is the Cheif Flight
Instructor at Philadelphia's largest flight School. Bill has an open
invitation to fly 8ZZ any time he wants. It was the only way I could pay
him back for the instruction and companionship he has always provided over
the years. After 10 minutes or so, he felt a severe vibration from the
engine or prop and tried to nurse the aircraft back to a safe area. He
eventually was forced to put down in a rough cornfield. The plane is pretty
much wiped out from the front seat forward. Bill walked away without a
scratch. He spent five hours in the cornfield with the Police, FAA, and a
tow truck operator and proceeded to remove the wings so the craft could be
removed and impounded for inspection by the FAA. Neither Bill nor I slept
very well last night, but we met for breakfast and I decided that he was a
better pilot than he will ever admit to, and he decided that the RV-4 is a
better plane than the Spamanufacturers will ever admit to. When we first
flew 8ZZ a year ago, we immediately concluded the RV-4 was the most honest
and fun aircraft either of us ever flew. We can now be thankful that the -4
was also a well built aircraft.
I'll probably start crying tomorrow over this whole event, but I'll be
looking for a new RV-4 to replace 8ZZ by Tuesday.
Louis I. Willig, RV-4 - N8ZZ
larywil(at)home.com
(610) 668-4964
Philadelphia, PA
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: f-680 flap block |
merry christmas listers
i am attempting to mount the electric flaps on a 6a . the center plastic
block ( 680 ) how does the hole mount, ( lower toward the floor or higher
away from the floor ) also is the hole closer to the rear of the plane or
toward the front. plans aren't clear on this, thanks
scott
tampa
rv6a innerds
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EARL FORTNER <e.fortner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | [Fwd: Kent v concord - news flash] |
Wonder if anyone else has had this problem with an airport. Kent is
the president of EAA chapter 309. Also the lead builder of an RV6
the chapter is building.
by mtiwgwc24.worldnet.att.net
(InterMail vM.4.01.02.07 201-229-116-107) with ESMTP
Date: Sun, 26 Dec 1999 11:54:16 -0500
From: kent ashton <kjashton(at)vnet.net>
Jim Minewiser , Bill Milburn ,
Bill Repucci , Charlie Hall ,
Don Koch , Earl Fortner ,
Fred Darnell ,
Howard Cochran , Jeff Bond <70773.2670(at)compuserve.com>,
Jerry Langley , John Lake ,
Tom Dills , Wally Overton ,
Ronnie Brown ,
John Wigney ,
Mike Munn , Paige Straley ,
Phillip Kumalae ,
Ray Petty ,
Robert Burkhardt ,
Sam Stewart ,
Tim Good , Mark Hall ,
bob cotton , bob dobbins ,
joe steffen ,
Steve Blanchard ,
richard harn
Subject: Kent v concord - news flash
For those of you not fortunate enough to receive the Concord Independent
Tribune, this article forwarded for your info:
>From the Concord N.C. INDEPENDENT TRIBUNE, December 26, 1999:
CONCORD REGIONAL EVICTS PILOT
--By Nancy McGinn, Staff Writer
CONCORD - An airplane owner who keeps his plane in a rented hangar at the
Concord Regional Airport is being asked to leave and take his aircraft with him.
Kent Ashton of Harrisburg owns what City Manager Brian Hiatt terms an
experimental airplane, but it is not the aircraft itself which has Ashton in turbulence.
Hiatt said the problems with Ashton have been going on throughout the year.
They pertain to the rules and regulations which are part of the lease
agreement with the owners of aircraft at the airport, Hiatt said.
Ashton disagrees.
"This is just a retaliation for the lawful complaint that I made against
the
city with the Federal Aviation Administration," Ashton said.
Ashton said the city waited until the day after the FAA "closed the docket"
on the investigation of his complaints because the eviction would have looked
bad for the city. The results of the investigation are expected to be
available within a few weeks.
Hiatt said the airport established rules so that dangerous situations would
not arise from certain types of heavy maintenance and the storage of fuels and
combustibles.
The airport has built a self maintenance hangar equipped to handle these
situations and Hiatt said Ashton had expressed to the authorities at the
airport that he did not have to comply with the rules and that he had filed a
complaint with the FAA.
The real issue in the dispute, Ashton said, is whether the city is actually
operating a "public" facility as it agreed to in receiving federal funds.
"This case is like the libraian at the public library telling you, you
may
not come into my public library anymore," Ashton said.
Hiatt said Ashton took it upon himself to investigate what he thought were
other violators at the airport by talking with them and photographing their
apparent violations, which he would then forward to the city manager.
According to a complaint filed by Ashton in district court on Sept. 21,
the
airport and the city management began in March to restrict his movement in the
airport area as well as verbally harassing him.
Ashton also sought an injunction against Aviation Director John Crosby
and
the city to prevent them from restricting his access to the airport areas.
That injunction request was dismissed in superior court.
On Sept. 20 Ashton was cited for trespassing on airport property by the
Concord Police Department and was convicted of that offense last week.
Ashton said he plans to appeal and he will comply with the courts, but
he may
seek other legal remedies.
Hiatt said Ashton's lease has expired and that he has been sent a notice
by
the city attorney to remove his aircraft. He has until the end of the month
to remove his aircraft.
The type of aircraft Ashton has listed on his lease agreement with the
airport says the plane is a 1989 two-passenger Cozy.
[Mark Plemmons contributed to this article.]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EARL FORTNER <e.fortner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
It sure would be nice if Santa came up with a finish kit video for the
RV-4 but I doubt if his elves will ever find the time.
OrndorffG(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
> Yes there is a finish kit video - it was done on an -8, but mostly everything
> is the same. If you have questions, give us a call.
>
> And, by the way, the man with the builder assist shop who has built and
> helped with numerous RVs also got tools for XMAS - a socket light and a snake
> driver and clench wrenches. Guess what - you never have enough tools!
>
> Becki Orndorff
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gerti Vander Schuur" <gertivs(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | Want to buy an RV-4 |
A friend wants to buy a completed RV-4. Is a high time Champ pilot/owner.
Give me a shout if you are interested in selling or know of someone who
might. Located in central California.
do not archieve Paul RV-4 4480S
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Caldwell" <racaldwell(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowling Question |
Ken, No. I just finished my exhaust and cowl has been fitted & painted
earlier.
Rick Caldwell
RV-6
Melbourne, FL
>From: Ken Harrill <KHarrill(at)osa.state.sc.us>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: "'rv-list(at)matronics.com'"
>Subject: RV-List: Cowling Question
>Date: Sat, 25 Dec 1999 00:27:39 -0500
>
>
>To those who have finished their cowling (RV-6), is it necessary to have
>the exhaust system installed on the engine in order to fit the cowling
>to the fuselage?
>
>
>Ken Harrill
>RV-6
>South Carolina
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | George McNutt <gmcnutt(at)intergate.bc.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: f-680 flap block |
ABAYMAN(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
> merry christmas listers
> i am attempting to mount the electric flaps on a 6a . the center plastic
> block ( 680 ) how does the hole mount, ( lower toward the floor or higher
> away from the floor ) also is the hole closer to the rear of the plane or
> toward the front. plans aren't clear on this, thanks
> scott
> tampa
> rv6a innerds
Higher off floor with hole towards front on my installation.
George McNutt
Langley, B.C.
6-A-Canopy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Armstrong <robert.armstrong(at)wcom.com> |
| Subject: | Avery's, was Santa thread |
I have purchased tools from both Avery and Cleveland and have been
very satisfied with every tool received from both companies. Both are
top-notch in my book, and I can be very fussy about my tools ;-)
Bob
RV-8AQ (Finally finished the HS)
===========
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Flying -8A's |
Hello:
My 8a has been flying about 3 months now. Will be happy to exchange notes
with you.
Off list address is hilljw(at)aol.com
Jimmy Hill
n72JH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BSEckstein(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | 6A Nosewheel Preload |
I'm in the process of setting the 22lb of tension needed to move the
nosewheel on my 6A and I'm finding that is appears that no matter how much I
load up the spring washers, it moves smoothly at about 19lb. That is after a
high 20's (27-29lb) tug to break it loose. Are we supposed to set the
preload for the force needed to break it loose, or the steady state movement?
Thanks
Brian Eckstein
6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mel Jordan" <tmjordan(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Avery's, was Santa thread |
Brown Aviation Tools is also very good, I have gotten several items from
them and found their service and prices quite good. I guess we are pretty
lucky to have such good suppliers that we can count on.
Mel Jordan
RV6A
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Armstrong" <robert.armstrong(at)wcom.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 26, 1999 4:04 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: Avery's, was Santa thread
>
> I have purchased tools from both Avery and Cleveland and have been
> very satisfied with every tool received from both companies. Both are
> top-notch in my book, and I can be very fussy about my tools ;-)
>
> Bob
> RV-8AQ (Finally finished the HS)
> ===========
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dustin Norlund <dustin(at)busprod.com> |
It seems as though I am ready to buy a prop for a RV6. I always thought
that i would want to go with a sensenich fixed pitch. BUT..first.. I
thought i may ask for everyones opinion. What other FIXED PITCH props
has anyone had good luck with on a 6 using an 150 hp 0320? Would be
interested in purchasing a used one if anyone is selling!
--
Dustin Norlund
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Low Fuel Pressure |
Listers,
I'm stumped by the fuel pressure readings I'm getting during my flight
test program. With only the Lycoming mechanical fuel pump (boost
pump turned off) I get fuel pressure indications that decline with
altitude:
Altitude Fuel Pressure (psi)
0 6.5
3000 4.8
5000 3.3
9000 0
Despite the indication of zero fuel pressure, the engine runs fine at all
these altitudes, and continues to run fine in climb or cruise all the way
up to 14,500', even with the boost pump turned off.
If I bring the Facet electric pump on line, I get the following:
Altitude Pressure
0 6.5
3000 5.3
5000 4.5
9000 2.3
10,500 1.9
12,000 2.1
13,000 2.3
14,500 2.7
To make matters even more confusing, if the boost pump is off the fuel
pressure indication goes to zero any time I climb at 10 degrees nose up
(even at sea level), but the engine runs fine. Turning the boost pump
on brings the fuel pressure indication up the the level indicated above.
Thoughts: A 10 degree pitch up raises the fuel pump about a foot
with respect to the fuel tank, which should result in a pressure change
of about 1/2 psi, but I'm finding that at sea level the fuel pressure
indication drops from over 5 psi to zero when I pitch up 10 degress.
Weird.
Equipment:
EIS 4000 engine monitor with westach fuel pressure transducer (VDO
1-30 psi sender)
Things I've done to troubleshoot:
- Check that tank vents are clear (I can blow air from the vents into the
fuel tanks)
- switch tanks
- Check to see that the fuel transducer output (resistance) is
independant of tilt
What fuel pressure levels are others seeing at altitude? Any ideas on
my problem?
Other than that, this thing flies even better than I hoped. It climbs at
over 1000' a minute up in the teens! Climb to 14,000 in no time, engine
temps in the green, impressive roll rate, easy to land. 3 way GPS
verified speeds at 195 mph at 4500' density altitude.
Thanks,
Tim Lewis
******
Tim Lewis -- Springfield VA
RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
TimRV6A(at)earthlink.net
http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Chris Good <chrisjgood(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
>
>Listers,
>
>I'm stumped by the fuel pressure readings I'm getting during my flight
>test program. With only the Lycoming mechanical fuel pump (boost
>pump turned off) I get fuel pressure indications that decline with
>altitude:
Tim,
I'm still working on instrumentation, so I only have theory for you.
I'm using the same VDO 0-30psi sensor with an EIS-4000. I've set it up,
per the instructions, to read 0-10psi. It needed to be wired as follows
4.8v excitation voltage (blue pin 25) from EIS-4000 to a 200ohm resistor.
The other side of the resistor to an EIS aux input & to one terminal
of the VDO sender.
The other VDO sender terminal to ground.
Then the EIS-4000 Aux SF value was set to 250, & the AuxOff value to 47.
I remember reading that you upgraded to the EIS-4000 at some point - maybe
the wiring/setup was different on the earlier model.
Anyway, that's how mine is set up, but untested. I'd certainly like to know
if this does not give correct results!
Congratulations on your first flight! I've been following your progress
on your web pages since starting my QB.
Regards,
Chris Good, http://www.slinger.net/rv-6a/
West Bend, WI
RV6A-QB N-86CG, O-360 installation
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
>
>
>Listers,
>
>I'm stumped by the fuel pressure readings I'm getting during my flight
>test program. With only the Lycoming mechanical fuel pump (boost
>pump turned off) I get fuel pressure indications that decline with
>altitude:
>
>Altitude Fuel Pressure (psi)
>0 6.5
>3000 4.8
>5000 3.3
>9000 0
>
>Despite the indication of zero fuel pressure, the engine runs fine at all
>these altitudes, and continues to run fine in climb or cruise all the way
>up to 14,500', even with the boost pump turned off.
>
>If I bring the Facet electric pump on line, I get the following:
>
>Altitude Pressure
>0 6.5
>3000 5.3
>5000 4.5
>9000 2.3
>10,500 1.9
>12,000 2.1
>13,000 2.3
>14,500 2.7
>
>To make matters even more confusing, if the boost pump is off the fuel
>pressure indication goes to zero any time I climb at 10 degrees nose up
>(even at sea level), but the engine runs fine. Turning the boost pump
>on brings the fuel pressure indication up the the level indicated above.
>
>Thoughts: A 10 degree pitch up raises the fuel pump about a foot
>with respect to the fuel tank, which should result in a pressure change
>of about 1/2 psi, but I'm finding that at sea level the fuel pressure
>indication drops from over 5 psi to zero when I pitch up 10 degress.
>Weird.
>
>Equipment:
>EIS 4000 engine monitor with westach fuel pressure transducer (VDO
>1-30 psi sender)
>
>Things I've done to troubleshoot:
>- Check that tank vents are clear (I can blow air from the vents into the
>fuel tanks)
>- switch tanks
>- Check to see that the fuel transducer output (resistance) is
>independant of tilt
>
>What fuel pressure levels are others seeing at altitude? Any ideas on
>my problem?
>
>Other than that, this thing flies even better than I hoped. It climbs at
>over 1000' a minute up in the teens! Climb to 14,000 in no time, engine
>temps in the green, impressive roll rate, easy to land. 3 way GPS
>verified speeds at 195 mph at 4500' density altitude.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Tim Lewis
Tim,
Most bizarre! Kinda like the puzzling lack of speed of my RV8. I gotta get
those fairings on!
Anyway, I get about 5psi at all times without the Facet pump energized. It
goes to 7 or a bit higher with the pump switched on. I have a dual, manifold
pressure/fuel pressure gauge, and the fuel pressure is plumbed direct to the
gauge. I get the same readings on either tank and at all normal (whatever
that is) flight attitudes. Could your hose or tubing that is providing the
fuel to the sender become kinked or distorted during flight? There's a lot
of air moving in there. Besides doing a full calibration with a known
pressure source from the end of the hose or tube through the system, I can't
think of anything else that might be causing the problem.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | VP4SkyDoc(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
In a message dated 12/27/1999 11:12:53 AM Tokyo Standard Time,
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net writes:
>
> What fuel pressure levels are others seeing at altitude? Any ideas on
> my problem?
>
> Other than that, this thing flies even better than I hoped. It climbs at
> over 1000' a minute up in the teens! Climb to 14,000 in no time, engine
> temps in the green, impressive roll rate, easy to land. 3 way GPS
> verified speeds at 195 mph at 4500' density altitude.
>
Wow! Great hear that your performance is so good. I would also be interested
in hearing what pressures other people are seeing. Especially Injected
systems. I am trying to see what kind of FP transducer I will need with a
typical injected system.
Have you tried calibrating your transducer with a water column?
Dave Leonard
6QB wings
Mazda 13B
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
Tim: Just a crazy idea, but is the sensor vented? it sounds like the vent
is plugged and as you climb with the pressure change causes an imbalance in
Sensor affecting the reading to go toward negative. Large airplanes have a
similar problem if the pressure transmitter vent is plugged. Just an old
Flight Engineer talking.
Harvey Sigmon RV6-AQB (N602RV Reserved)
----- Original Message -----
From: Tim Lewis <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net>
Sent: Sunday, December 26, 1999 8:44 PM
Subject: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure
>
> Listers,
>
> I'm stumped by the fuel pressure readings I'm getting during my flight
> test program. With only the Lycoming mechanical fuel pump (boost
> pump turned off) I get fuel pressure indications that decline with
> altitude:
>
> Altitude Fuel Pressure (psi)
> 0 6.5
> 3000 4.8
> 5000 3.3
> 9000 0
>
> Despite the indication of zero fuel pressure, the engine runs fine at all
> these altitudes, and continues to run fine in climb or cruise all the way
> up to 14,500', even with the boost pump turned off.
>
> If I bring the Facet electric pump on line, I get the following:
>
> Altitude Pressure
> 0 6.5
> 3000 5.3
> 5000 4.5
> 9000 2.3
> 10,500 1.9
> 12,000 2.1
> 13,000 2.3
> 14,500 2.7
>
> To make matters even more confusing, if the boost pump is off the fuel
> pressure indication goes to zero any time I climb at 10 degrees nose up
> (even at sea level), but the engine runs fine. Turning the boost pump
> on brings the fuel pressure indication up the the level indicated above.
>
> Thoughts: A 10 degree pitch up raises the fuel pump about a foot
> with respect to the fuel tank, which should result in a pressure change
> of about 1/2 psi, but I'm finding that at sea level the fuel pressure
> indication drops from over 5 psi to zero when I pitch up 10 degress.
> Weird.
>
> Equipment:
> EIS 4000 engine monitor with westach fuel pressure transducer (VDO
> 1-30 psi sender)
>
> Things I've done to troubleshoot:
> - Check that tank vents are clear (I can blow air from the vents into the
> fuel tanks)
> - switch tanks
> - Check to see that the fuel transducer output (resistance) is
> independant of tilt
>
> What fuel pressure levels are others seeing at altitude? Any ideas on
> my problem?
>
> Other than that, this thing flies even better than I hoped. It climbs at
> over 1000' a minute up in the teens! Climb to 14,000 in no time, engine
> temps in the green, impressive roll rate, easy to land. 3 way GPS
> verified speeds at 195 mph at 4500' density altitude.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tim Lewis
>
>
> ******
> Tim Lewis -- Springfield VA
> RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
> TimRV6A(at)earthlink.net
> http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
>
>
>It seems as though I am ready to buy a prop for a RV6. I always thought
>that i would want to go with a sensenich fixed pitch. BUT..first.. I
>thought i may ask for everyones opinion. What other FIXED PITCH props
>has anyone had good luck with on a 6 using an 150 hp 0320? Would be
>interested in purchasing a used one if anyone is selling!
>
Dustin,
The Sensenich is the ONLY fixed pitch metal prop designed for your
combination. Any other metal prop would be really really experimental and
probably dangerous. When you get into wood props there are very many
possibilities and it tends to be harder to choose one that is optimum on the
first try.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP (O-360/Sensenich 72FM8-83)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | chester razer <razer(at)midwest.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 6A Nosewheel Preload |
Break it loose,
BSEckstein(at)cs.com wrote:
>
>
> I'm in the process of setting the 22lb of tension needed to move the
> nosewheel on my 6A and I'm finding that is appears that no matter how much I
> load up the spring washers, it moves smoothly at about 19lb. That is after a
> high 20's (27-29lb) tug to break it loose. Are we supposed to set the
> preload for the force needed to break it loose, or the steady state movement?
>
> Thanks
> Brian Eckstein
> 6A
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary A. Sobek" <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure (me too) |
--- Tim Lewis wrote:
>
>
> Listers,
>
> I'm stumped by the fuel pressure readings I'm
> getting during my flight
> test program. With only the Lycoming mechanical
> fuel pump (boost
> pump turned off) I get fuel pressure indications
> that decline with
> altitude:
>
> Altitude Fuel Pressure (psi)
> 0 6.5
> 3000 4.8
> 5000 3.3
> 9000 0
>
> Despite the indication of zero fuel pressure, the
> engine runs fine at all
> these altitudes, and continues to run fine in climb
> or cruise all the way
> up to 14,500', even with the boost pump turned off.
>
>
> If I bring the Facet electric pump on line, I get
> the following:
>
> Altitude Pressure
> 0 6.5
> 3000 5.3
> 5000 4.5
> 9000 2.3
> 10,500 1.9
> 12,000 2.1
> 13,000 2.3
> 14,500 2.7
>
> To make matters even more confusing, if the boost
> pump is off the fuel
> pressure indication goes to zero any time I climb at
> 10 degrees nose up
> (even at sea level), but the engine runs fine.
> Turning the boost pump
> on brings the fuel pressure indication up the the
> level indicated above.
>
> Thoughts: A 10 degree pitch up raises the fuel pump
> about a foot
> with respect to the fuel tank, which should result
> in a pressure change
> of about 1/2 psi, but I'm finding that at sea level
> the fuel pressure
> indication drops from over 5 psi to zero when I
> pitch up 10 degress.
> Weird.
>
> Equipment:
> EIS 4000 engine monitor with westach fuel pressure
> transducer (VDO
> 1-30 psi sender)
>
> Things I've done to troubleshoot:
> - Check that tank vents are clear (I can blow air
> from the vents into the
> fuel tanks)
> - switch tanks
> - Check to see that the fuel transducer output
> (resistance) is
> independant of tilt
>
> What fuel pressure levels are others seeing at
> altitude? Any ideas on
> my problem?
>
> Other than that, this thing flies even better than I
> hoped. It climbs at
> over 1000' a minute up in the teens! Climb to
> 14,000 in no time, engine
> temps in the green, impressive roll rate, easy to
> land. 3 way GPS
> verified speeds at 195 mph at 4500' density
> altitude.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tim Lewis
>
>
> ******
> Tim Lewis -- Springfield VA
> RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
> TimRV6A(at)earthlink.net
> http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
Tim:
I have the RMI microMonitor and it also registers 0
fuel pressure on climb when using only the mechanical
pump. It also uses the VDO sender. I have been
flying 485 hours with first flight September 1997.
With the boost pump OFF and nose up 10 degrees or
better, I get ZERO fuel pressure at around 6,000.
Since I have fuel flow, I can see that I have 14.5 GPH
fuel flow and keep on going. This is with an O-320
Constant Speed prop.
A little research, I found that Lycoming recommends
(from the "Lycoming Flyer Key Reprints") using the
boost pump for, 1. Take-off, 2. Climb, 3. switching
fuel tanks, 4. Landing. UNLESS airframe manufacturer
recommends otherwise. There may be a 5th point but I
do not remember. I think that they (I know I do)
recommend boost pump on anytime below 500 AGL. With
the boost pump on, I never drop below 1 psi even with
the nose up over 30 degrees (65 KIAS) full power.
With the boost pump off, any time that fuel pressure
drops below 1 psi, I turn the boost pump on. This
applies to carb only. Many of the fuel injection
systems that I have seen in RVs will flood with the
boost pump on.
I have not tried to check calibration of the VDO
pressure sender at low pressure. Your results are
close to mine (going from memory) but I did not record
the data. I am thinking that the VDO sender may not
be accurate below 1 psi.
I have been following the Lycoming recommendation
about the boost pump from about 15 flight hours on.
Having flown mostly high wing aircraft before the RV,
the use of a boost pump and fuel pressure were new for
me.
As for speed: See my results in Sport Aviation for
the Copperstate Dash. We had headwinds all the way.
My 160 was faster than one of the 180 RVs. Today, at
2,500 feet and 26 squared, I had 175 KTAS with a 175 -
177 Kt GPS ground speed (This was not full throttle).
Dwain Harris in RV-6 N164DH (180 HP) was right behind
me and can verify the speed. Flying with a C210, I
found a new favorite power setting. 23 squared. 160
KTAS and 7 GPH. This is at 7,500 where I am full
throttle. My economy power setting is 22 inches 2100
RPM which yields 135-140 KTAS and fuel flow of 6 GPH.
====
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
So. CA, USA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
| Subject: | R & R the RV6a lower cowl -how?? |
Is this true for both the O-320 and the O-360? I ordered my Vetterman
exhaust system from Van's and there was no mention of the exhaust system not
fitting the newer S-type cowl. I went ahead on plunked the exhaust system
on, but haven't begun to fit the cowl yet. I may not be able to send the
exhaust back.
Bummer.
Steve Soule
Huntington, Vermont
RV-6A panel wiring
-----Original Message-----
Also a note to the S-cowl folks. I couldn't get enough
clearance between
the cowl and the #2 ball joint and exhaust pipe. I called
Larry Vetterman
and he said that he had designed a new exhaust system for
the S-cowl for
those who did not mount the air scoop "off center". I really
can't say
enough good things about Larry. He traded exhaust with me
since I had not
drilled the EGT probe holes and the new one fits great. If
you have a
problem fitting this area, give Larry a call. I'll wager he
can help you
fix it.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott Johnson" <scottjohnson345(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure (me too) |
My 6A does the exact same thing !
Scott Johnson
----- Original Message -----
From: Gary A. Sobek <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com>
Sent: Monday, December 27, 1999 4:52 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure (me too)
>
> --- Tim Lewis wrote:
> >
> >
> > Listers,
> >
> > I'm stumped by the fuel pressure readings I'm
> > getting during my flight
> > test program. With only the Lycoming mechanical
> > fuel pump (boost
> > pump turned off) I get fuel pressure indications
> > that decline with
> > altitude:
> >
> > Altitude Fuel Pressure (psi)
> > 0 6.5
> > 3000 4.8
> > 5000 3.3
> > 9000 0
> >
> > Despite the indication of zero fuel pressure, the
> > engine runs fine at all
> > these altitudes, and continues to run fine in climb
> > or cruise all the way
> > up to 14,500', even with the boost pump turned off.
> >
> >
> > If I bring the Facet electric pump on line, I get
> > the following:
> >
> > Altitude Pressure
> > 0 6.5
> > 3000 5.3
> > 5000 4.5
> > 9000 2.3
> > 10,500 1.9
> > 12,000 2.1
> > 13,000 2.3
> > 14,500 2.7
> >
> > To make matters even more confusing, if the boost
> > pump is off the fuel
> > pressure indication goes to zero any time I climb at
> > 10 degrees nose up
> > (even at sea level), but the engine runs fine.
> > Turning the boost pump
> > on brings the fuel pressure indication up the the
> > level indicated above.
> >
> > Thoughts: A 10 degree pitch up raises the fuel pump
> > about a foot
> > with respect to the fuel tank, which should result
> > in a pressure change
> > of about 1/2 psi, but I'm finding that at sea level
> > the fuel pressure
> > indication drops from over 5 psi to zero when I
> > pitch up 10 degress.
> > Weird.
> >
> > Equipment:
> > EIS 4000 engine monitor with westach fuel pressure
> > transducer (VDO
> > 1-30 psi sender)
> >
> > Things I've done to troubleshoot:
> > - Check that tank vents are clear (I can blow air
> > from the vents into the
> > fuel tanks)
> > - switch tanks
> > - Check to see that the fuel transducer output
> > (resistance) is
> > independant of tilt
> >
> > What fuel pressure levels are others seeing at
> > altitude? Any ideas on
> > my problem?
> >
> > Other than that, this thing flies even better than I
> > hoped. It climbs at
> > over 1000' a minute up in the teens! Climb to
> > 14,000 in no time, engine
> > temps in the green, impressive roll rate, easy to
> > land. 3 way GPS
> > verified speeds at 195 mph at 4500' density
> > altitude.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Tim Lewis
> >
> >
> > ******
> > Tim Lewis -- Springfield VA
> > RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
> > TimRV6A(at)earthlink.net
> > http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
>
> Tim:
>
> I have the RMI microMonitor and it also registers 0
> fuel pressure on climb when using only the mechanical
> pump. It also uses the VDO sender. I have been
> flying 485 hours with first flight September 1997.
> With the boost pump OFF and nose up 10 degrees or
> better, I get ZERO fuel pressure at around 6,000.
> Since I have fuel flow, I can see that I have 14.5 GPH
> fuel flow and keep on going. This is with an O-320
> Constant Speed prop.
>
> A little research, I found that Lycoming recommends
> (from the "Lycoming Flyer Key Reprints") using the
> boost pump for, 1. Take-off, 2. Climb, 3. switching
> fuel tanks, 4. Landing. UNLESS airframe manufacturer
> recommends otherwise. There may be a 5th point but I
> do not remember. I think that they (I know I do)
> recommend boost pump on anytime below 500 AGL. With
> the boost pump on, I never drop below 1 psi even with
> the nose up over 30 degrees (65 KIAS) full power.
> With the boost pump off, any time that fuel pressure
> drops below 1 psi, I turn the boost pump on. This
> applies to carb only. Many of the fuel injection
> systems that I have seen in RVs will flood with the
> boost pump on.
>
> I have not tried to check calibration of the VDO
> pressure sender at low pressure. Your results are
> close to mine (going from memory) but I did not record
> the data. I am thinking that the VDO sender may not
> be accurate below 1 psi.
>
> I have been following the Lycoming recommendation
> about the boost pump from about 15 flight hours on.
> Having flown mostly high wing aircraft before the RV,
> the use of a boost pump and fuel pressure were new for
> me.
>
> As for speed: See my results in Sport Aviation for
> the Copperstate Dash. We had headwinds all the way.
> My 160 was faster than one of the 180 RVs. Today, at
> 2,500 feet and 26 squared, I had 175 KTAS with a 175 -
> 177 Kt GPS ground speed (This was not full throttle).
> Dwain Harris in RV-6 N164DH (180 HP) was right behind
> me and can verify the speed. Flying with a C210, I
> found a new favorite power setting. 23 squared. 160
> KTAS and 7 GPH. This is at 7,500 where I am full
> throttle. My economy power setting is 22 inches 2100
> RPM which yields 135-140 KTAS and fuel flow of 6 GPH.
>
>
> ====
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> So. CA, USA
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | OrndorffG(at)aol.com |
Earl,
The elves are busy making seats. Perhaps someday....Becki
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carroll Bird <catbird(at)taylorelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure (me too) |
Scott Johnson wrote:
>
> My 6A does the exact same thing !
>
> Scott Johnson
>
So does my -4.
Carroll Bird
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike.Nellis(at)mcd.com |
| Subject: | Re: Learning experience... |
Man, I'm having flashbacks here. I had the same problem but I fixed it. The
problem of not liking airplanes along with a couple of other issues caused me to
get another wife. I remarried this past June and not only does she like to fly
with me and navigate, but she's pretty good at drilling holes and bucking
rivets!
Mike Nellis
http://mnellis.jnet.net
From: EARL FORTNER <e.fortner(at)worldnet.att.net> on 12/24/99 08:31 AM
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: Learning experience...
Am I missing something? Sounds like you guys are married to my wife's
twin sisters if she had any. donotarchive
glenn williams wrote:
>
>
> I can surely understand the suport issue with the wife
> mine is the same way she supports me as far as "glad
> your getting to build your airplane" but that is as
> far as it goes. And she will never fly with me "hope
> she changes her mind" but hey good luck and press on
> wait till you get to your wings good luck
> Glenn Williams
> 8A wings
> Ft. Worth, Texas
>
> --- Kbalch1(at)aol.com wrote:
> >
> > Well, I finally got my compressor hooked up this
> > afternoon. Since the rear
> > spar of my horizontal stabilizer has been waiting
> > patiently for rivets for
> > almost two weeks, I thought I'd better take care of
> > it. I learned several
> > things:
> >
> > 1) How to work my pneumatic squeezer
> > 2) How to recognize good rivets
> > 3) How to drill out bad rivets
> >
> > All in all, a productive day. Sorry for such a
> > trivial post, but I needed to
> > share this with someone who understood and/or gave a
> > damn. My wife sure
> > doesn't. She's supportive, but not very interested,
> > if you know what I mean.
> > Oh, well. She won't have to fly in it for a year
> > or so.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Ken Balch
> > Ashland, MA
> > RV-8 #81125
> > working on the horiz. stab.
> >
> >
> >
> > through
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> >
> > Settlement...
> > http://www.matronics.com/jpi.html
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
Tim:
OK, I'm going to take a shot at this although I don't claim to fully
understand the physics.
I have had the exact experience with low fuel pressure on my RV-4 for the
past 10 years. When I researched it, as I recall, anything over .5 psi is
OK, in fact, the green arc on my gauge is from .5 to 7.5 psi. I think what
is going on here is that the output (fuel flow) of the mechanical pump
barely keeps up with the draw from the carburator. This is aggravated at
the higher pitch attitudes due to the lack of the gravity component. While
disconcerting at first, I am now completely used to it and recognize this as
a normal condition.
I have the boost pump on anytime below 3,000 agl and while switching fuel
tanks. Never had so much as a hickup in 10 years flying, 600+ hours even
when I have forgotten to turn the boost pump on before takeoff. I normally
see right at .5 psi in the climb (looks like zero on my gauge) which will
eventually increase to about 4 -5 psi in level flight at altitude (with the
boost pump off). O-320 engine with Hartzel c/s prop.
Pat Hatch
RV-4, N17PH @ INT
RV-6, Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net>
Sent: Sunday, December 26, 1999 8:44 PM
Subject: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure
>
> Listers,
>
> I'm stumped by the fuel pressure readings I'm getting during my flight
> test program. With only the Lycoming mechanical fuel pump (boost
> pump turned off) I get fuel pressure indications that decline with
> altitude:
>
> Altitude Fuel Pressure (psi)
> 0 6.5
> 3000 4.8
> 5000 3.3
> 9000 0
>
> Despite the indication of zero fuel pressure, the engine runs fine at all
> these altitudes, and continues to run fine in climb or cruise all the way
> up to 14,500', even with the boost pump turned off.
>
> If I bring the Facet electric pump on line, I get the following:
>
> Altitude Pressure
> 0 6.5
> 3000 5.3
> 5000 4.5
> 9000 2.3
> 10,500 1.9
> 12,000 2.1
> 13,000 2.3
> 14,500 2.7
>
> To make matters even more confusing, if the boost pump is off the fuel
> pressure indication goes to zero any time I climb at 10 degrees nose up
> (even at sea level), but the engine runs fine. Turning the boost pump
> on brings the fuel pressure indication up the the level indicated above.
>
> Thoughts: A 10 degree pitch up raises the fuel pump about a foot
> with respect to the fuel tank, which should result in a pressure change
> of about 1/2 psi, but I'm finding that at sea level the fuel pressure
> indication drops from over 5 psi to zero when I pitch up 10 degress.
> Weird.
>
> Equipment:
> EIS 4000 engine monitor with westach fuel pressure transducer (VDO
> 1-30 psi sender)
>
> Things I've done to troubleshoot:
> - Check that tank vents are clear (I can blow air from the vents into the
> fuel tanks)
> - switch tanks
> - Check to see that the fuel transducer output (resistance) is
> independant of tilt
>
> What fuel pressure levels are others seeing at altitude? Any ideas on
> my problem?
>
> Other than that, this thing flies even better than I hoped. It climbs at
> over 1000' a minute up in the teens! Climb to 14,000 in no time, engine
> temps in the green, impressive roll rate, easy to land. 3 way GPS
> verified speeds at 195 mph at 4500' density altitude.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tim Lewis
>
>
> ******
> Tim Lewis -- Springfield VA
> RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
> TimRV6A(at)earthlink.net
> http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | mikel(at)dimensional.com |
>Christmas Day, my friend took my RV-4, N8ZZ, for a quick flight. After 10
>minutes or so, he felt a severe vibration from the engine or prop and tried
to >nurse the aircraft back to a safe area. He eventually was forced to put
down in >a rough cornfield. The plane is pretty much wiped out from the
front seat >forward. Bill walked away without a scratch.
Hey, Louis: SO sorry to hear about 8ZZ; so glad to hear about Bill! For the
education of the members of The List, please let us know if you find out
what caused the problem. Also: did 8ZZ stop upright? What caused so much
damage? Did you have a 5 point harness system? How did your insurance
company react? And anything else you think would help us learn.
>We decided that the RV-4 is a better plane than the Spamanufacturers will
ever >admit to.
Guess we knew that all along. Wish you hadn't had to prove it to us. It is
nice to know ol' 8ZZ gave herself up to protect Bill.
Thanks for the info: it may help to protect other pilots.
Michael
RV-4 N232 Suzie Q
I can't believe this is December weather..............
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Learning experience... |
Yes indeed! Wife support is a MUST. Without it, getting an RV airborne will
be just about impossible, or at least unpleasant. Who needs that? My
sweetie simply kept the end result in mind whenever she had a problem with
the project or my time spent with it: it will be our "magic carpet" to take
us to the beach, Vegas, or where ever WE want to go. In following one of
Stephen Covey's tenets, we always BEGIN WITH THE END IN MIND. The little
hardships along the way become even more trivial by doing this.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
flying, and we BOTH love it.
>
>
>Man, I'm having flashbacks here. I had the same problem but I fixed it.
>The
>problem of not liking airplanes along with a couple of other issues caused
>me to
>get another wife. I remarried this past June and not only does she like to
>fly
>with me and navigate, but she's pretty good at drilling holes and bucking
>rivets!
>
>Mike Nellis
>http://mnellis.jnet.net
>
>
>From: EARL FORTNER <e.fortner(at)worldnet.att.net> on 12/24/99 08:31 AM
>
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com@SMTP@McGate
>cc:
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Learning experience...
>
>
>Am I missing something? Sounds like you guys are married to my wife's
>twin sisters if she had any. donotarchive
>
>glenn williams wrote:
> >
> >
> > I can surely understand the suport issue with the wife
> > mine is the same way she supports me as far as "glad
> > your getting to build your airplane" but that is as
> > far as it goes. And she will never fly with me "hope
> > she changes her mind" but hey good luck and press on
> > wait till you get to your wings good luck
> > Glenn Williams
> > 8A wings
> > Ft. Worth, Texas
> >
> > --- Kbalch1(at)aol.com wrote:
> > >
> > > Well, I finally got my compressor hooked up this
> > > afternoon. Since the rear
> > > spar of my horizontal stabilizer has been waiting
> > > patiently for rivets for
> > > almost two weeks, I thought I'd better take care of
> > > it. I learned several
> > > things:
> > >
> > > 1) How to work my pneumatic squeezer
> > > 2) How to recognize good rivets
> > > 3) How to drill out bad rivets
> > >
> > > All in all, a productive day. Sorry for such a
> > > trivial post, but I needed to
> > > share this with someone who understood and/or gave a
> > > damn. My wife sure
> > > doesn't. She's supportive, but not very interested,
> > > if you know what I mean.
> > > Oh, well. She won't have to fly in it for a year
> > > or so.
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > Ken Balch
> > > Ashland, MA
> > > RV-8 #81125
> > > working on the horiz. stab.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > through
> > >
> > > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > >
> > > Settlement...
> > > http://www.matronics.com/jpi.html
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "H. Martin Sutter" <hmsutter(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
----- Original Message -----
From: Pat Hatch <pat_hatch(at)email.msn.com>
Sent: Monday, December 27, 1999 9:12 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure
After seeing all the posts regarding low fuel pressure I would like to add
my experience regarding this subject:
My RV6, 180HP, fixed pitch prop, exhibited the same problem from it's first
flight. At about 400hrs I experienced an engine failure on a steep
climb-out with the boost pump on. Fortunately power came back after
lowering the nose in a glide and before reaching terra firma. A thorough
investigation revealed that the Facet pump Van sells has a very restrictive
flow thru area. My pump had a small piece of tank slosh lodged in it and
since the pump is in line with the engine driven pump, it impeded the fuel
flow. After that I decided to copy the Piper Cherokee fuel system using an
aircraft boost pump plumbed parrallel to the engine driven pump. As a
surprising byproduct of this change my fuel pressure now remains at 3 to 5
psi under all conditions, even with the electric pump off on take-off.
Martin Sutter N868CM 1,550hrs>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark D. Dickens" <mddickens(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Learning experience... |
OK, had to respond...I guess my wife is so numbed by 20 years of
spending time and money on flying, she just goes along with whatever I
do...not necessarily enthusiastic about it, but not negative either
(unless you want to count her statement that after I build this, she
won't let me fly it!). The biggest pushback is my daughter who wants to
use the workshop (second garage) to park her car in. My wife sees
flying as a means to an end (getting to the beach in FL)...it's just a
vehicle to her. Fortunately, she has no dislike of flying.
Mark Dickens
Germantown, TN
Just got wing kit inventoried...still got that @#$%
trim tab to finish
and then emp kit will be done
----- Original Message -----
From: Brian Denk <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Monday, December 27, 1999 9:35 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Learning experience...
>
>
> Yes indeed! Wife support is a MUST. Without it, getting an RV airborne
will
> be just about impossible, or at least unpleasant. Who needs that? My
> sweetie simply kept the end result in mind whenever she had a problem
with
> the project or my time spent with it: it will be our "magic carpet" to
take
> us to the beach, Vegas, or where ever WE want to go. In following one
of
> Stephen Covey's tenets, we always BEGIN WITH THE END IN MIND. The
little
> hardships along the way become even more trivial by doing this.
>
> Brian Denk
> RV8 N94BD
> flying, and we BOTH love it.
>
> >
> >
> >Man, I'm having flashbacks here. I had the same problem but I fixed
it.
> >The
> >problem of not liking airplanes along with a couple of other issues
caused
> >me to
> >get another wife. I remarried this past June and not only does she
like to
> >fly
> >with me and navigate, but she's pretty good at drilling holes and
bucking
> >rivets!
> >
> >Mike Nellis
> >http://mnellis.jnet.net
> >
> >
> >From: EARL FORTNER <e.fortner(at)worldnet.att.net> on 12/24/99 08:31 AM
> >
> >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com@SMTP@McGate
> >cc:
> >Subject: Re: RV-List: Learning experience...
> >
> >
> >Am I missing something? Sounds like you guys are married to my wife's
> >twin sisters if she had any. donotarchive
> >
> >glenn williams wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > I can surely understand the suport issue with the wife
> > > mine is the same way she supports me as far as "glad
> > > your getting to build your airplane" but that is as
> > > far as it goes. And she will never fly with me "hope
> > > she changes her mind" but hey good luck and press on
> > > wait till you get to your wings good luck
> > > Glenn Williams
> > > 8A wings
> > > Ft. Worth, Texas
> > >
> > > --- Kbalch1(at)aol.com wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Well, I finally got my compressor hooked up this
> > > > afternoon. Since the rear
> > > > spar of my horizontal stabilizer has been waiting
> > > > patiently for rivets for
> > > > almost two weeks, I thought I'd better take care of
> > > > it. I learned several
> > > > things:
> > > >
> > > > 1) How to work my pneumatic squeezer
> > > > 2) How to recognize good rivets
> > > > 3) How to drill out bad rivets
> > > >
> > > > All in all, a productive day. Sorry for such a
> > > > trivial post, but I needed to
> > > > share this with someone who understood and/or gave a
> > > > damn. My wife sure
> > > > doesn't. She's supportive, but not very interested,
> > > > if you know what I mean.
> > > > Oh, well. She won't have to fly in it for a year
> > > > or so.
> > > >
> > > > Regards,
> > > > Ken Balch
> > > > Ashland, MA
> > > > RV-8 #81125
> > > > working on the horiz. stab.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > through
> > > >
> > > > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > > >
> > > > Settlement...
> > > > http://www.matronics.com/jpi.html
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Von Dane <bvondane(at)atmel.com> |
| Subject: | Those Pesky Inside Rivets... |
Hi Gang... I hope you all got what you wanted for x-mas!
Over the holiday weekend I finally figured out a way to rivet the two inside
rivets on the rudders horn bottom. I have posted the "tip" on my web site
for your viewing pleasure...
http://vondane.tripod.com/logbook/emp/rudder6.htm
-Bill Von Dane - Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A N912V res., waiting for wings
http://vondane.tripod.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bryan E. Files" <BFiles(at)corecom.net> |
The McCauley 1A170 propeller is also used on the 320's 150 and 160 HP. We
use them on cubs 8242 length/pitch but that is for climb performance. You
can twist it to get more speed.
**** Bryan E. Files ****
Ever Fly Maintenance
Palmer, Alaska
A&P, IA, FAA Safety Counselor
mailto:BFiles(at)corecom.net
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Pardue <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net>
Sent: Sunday, December 26, 1999 6:53 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Prop on a 6
>
> >
> >
> >It seems as though I am ready to buy a prop for a RV6. I always thought
> >that i would want to go with a sensenich fixed pitch. BUT..first.. I
> >thought i may ask for everyones opinion. What other FIXED PITCH props
> >has anyone had good luck with on a 6 using an 150 hp 0320? Would be
> >interested in purchasing a used one if anyone is selling!
> >
>
>
> Dustin,
>
> The Sensenich is the ONLY fixed pitch metal prop designed for your
> combination. Any other metal prop would be really really experimental and
> probably dangerous. When you get into wood props there are very many
> possibilities and it tends to be harder to choose one that is optimum on
the
> first try.
>
> Larry Pardue
> Carlsbad, NM
>
> RV-6 N441LP (O-360/Sensenich 72FM8-83)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <tcwatson(at)seanet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
>
> Please describe how you plumbed the two pump-driven lines in parallel.
>
Page 145 of "Tony Bingelis on Engines" has a diagram of what I think is an
RV-6 fuel system showing the auxillary fuel pump installed in parallel with
a one-way check valve.
Very good book that suffers from lousey editing. Lots of RV stuff,
including tanks, fuel systems, baffles and great photos and diagrams.
Terry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Christie" <billc(at)dancris.com> |
Here in Arizona, it triggers the tax types also, but when they sent me the
pile of forms, I just called them back and explained that my "recently
purchased airplane" was a pile of aluminum. They laughed and said to give
them a call when I got it built. Evidently, no proof required!
Bill C. RV8A, Black Death all over tanks!
----- Original Message -----
From: <KBoatri144(at)aol.com>
Sent: Friday, December 24, 1999 7:05 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: N numbers
>
> In a message dated 12/24/99 7:53:02 AM Eastern Standard Time,
DFaile(at)aol.com
> writes:
>
> << << reserved an N number and know that each year you have to pay a fee
to
> keep the reservation. >>
>
> Why not register your airplane and avoid worrying about the fee? >>
>
> Here in Georgia, registering the aircraft is the event which triggers the
> local Tax Commissioner to send you a bill... This bill is typically many
> times the size of the annual N-number reservation fee.
>
> KB
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Garry Legare <versadek(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
I think that this is a thread that Scott really needs to address, sorry Scott,
but this is an area where a critical system design, seems to have a built in
flaw or is at least very intolerant of minor irregularities.
I have flow in excess of 475 hrs in an aircraft (Q2), that used the Facet pump
as the primary pump from lower tank to header, then gravity to the engine, plus
close to another 500 hrs where the Facet was the back up pump in a system
similar to Vans. I had one unexplained engine stoppage on climb out at 300 ft
just after take. I didn't have a fuel pressure gauge in any of these aircraft.
So have no information as to fuel pressure. Was I flirting with disaster? Are
the hundreds no make that thousands of RV enthusiast just seconds from
disaster? I don't think so, but I think it needs to be pointed out that the
standard RV fuel system is not very tolerant to debris in it. This is primarily
because of the Facet pumps small passageways, and check valve design. Last week
I helped a couple of fellows troubleshoot a Facet pump in a Caviler (wing tip
tanks) that wasn't working at all. Upon disassembly it was found to have a
small circular piece of plastic bag material about 1/4 of inch in diameter
covering the check valve. The airplane had fuel filters (the glass bodied ones
Spruce sells) installed right at the tanks and the were clean. The fellows were
completely shocked when I pulled out the piece of plastic and at a loss to
explain how it got there. The lesson to be learned from this long post is, If
your going to use the Vans system as designed. Flush your fuel systems a number
of times and install see through fuel filters on the outlets of both tanks. I
would also recommend one just before the Facet Pump inlet. That's what I have
on my 6. Hope I helped a little. Happy New Year to you and yours.
Garry LeGare, EAA94585
TC 4212, RV6, 180 Lyc.,Sensenich Flying in Spring, Maybesooner if I get off my
lasey butt
H. Martin Sutter wrote:
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Pat Hatch <pat_hatch(at)email.msn.com>
> To:
> Sent: Monday, December 27, 1999 9:12 AM
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure
>
> After seeing all the posts regarding low fuel pressure I would like to add
> my experience regarding this subject:
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick McBride <rickrv8(at)qwestinternet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure (me too) |
I may as well chime also. My RV-6 with Rochester guage and sending unit also
did the same. It took some getting used to but I never had a bit of problem in
over 500 hours.
Rick McBride
-6 N523JC
-8 80027
Centreville, VA (right down the street from you Tim)
Carroll Bird wrote:
>
> Scott Johnson wrote:
>
> >
> > My 6A does the exact same thing !
> >
> > Scott Johnson
> >
>
> So does my -4.
>
> Carroll Bird
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott A. Jordan" <SAJ_SLJ(at)compuserve.com> |
It is time to start work on Tony C's RV-6 panel and I need to start
plannign my RV-8 panel. We have tried using Panel Planer software many
times and have been very dissapointed. At times it fails to run at all,
sometimes it locks up. We were upgrded from version 2.0 to 2.7 but
problems persist. Currently, the program can't find the equipment
database. I have "changed" the data base path several times but it still
can't gets it's act together. In short, we have given up on {anel Planner
and have decided to do it the old fashioned way.
Does anyone know where we can get some accurate sized templates and / or
diagrams of instruments and radios to aide in our planning? If all else
fails we will get out the compass and square but I figure there must be
someone who can supply accurate templates.
Thanks
Scott A. Jordan
80331
baggage door
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Panel Planning |
You might want to contact gulf coast avionics. They have a kit for doing
your panel. I am not sure if they will do mine or not, but they certainly
give you alot of stuff to use and also a free cad cam print out. It cant
hurt to talk to them.
takes about 2 weeks for all the stuff to arrive. I got mine today and I am
impressed. I am still waiting for the stuff from eastern avionics though.
Chris Wilcox
F-1 Rocket
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KAKlewin(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Houston RVers.... |
Hello...
Down in Houston for some training for work and am staying next to Houston
Hobby airport....if there are any Houston RV folks with a project or flying
RV at Hobby or nearby ( as Im car less....!!!)....I have a day off on
Wednesday if it works...take care...
Kurt, OKC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 0-320 for sale |
What are the #'s on the engine (A1A), I know a gut looking for a dyanfocal
160hp.
CTM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV6BLDR <calverjl(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 0-320 for sale |
Rvmils(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
> What are the #'s on the engine (A1A), I know a gut looking for a dyanfocal
> 160hp.
Don't know anything about it. The guys email address is at the end of
his ad.
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok -6 fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
My sincere thanks to all who wrote to share their similar fuel pressure
experiences. I'm now not afraid to continue flying my plane, as my
symptoms seem to be fairly common.
Special thanks to Martin Sutter (who taught me sheet metal work 3.5
years ago at the Avery shop) for shedding light on a likely cause for
the low pressure indications.
My inclination at this point is to purchase a check valve and install it
in parallel to the Facet pump, as Terry mentioned. McMaster Carr has
a bronze/stainless/teflon check valve with .5psi cracking pressure that
looks like it will fit the bill. The part number is K7715K22 at
http://www.mcmaster.com , and the price is $12.22.
Other suggestions?
Thanks,
Tim Lewis
N47TD - Flying
******
Tim Lewis -- Springfield VA
RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
TimRV6A(at)earthlink.net
http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Louis Willig <larywil(at)home.com> |
>Hey, Louis: SO sorry to hear about 8ZZ; so glad to hear about Bill! For the
>education of the members of The List, please let us know if you find out
>what caused the problem. Also: did 8ZZ stop upright? What caused so much
>damage? Did you have a 5 point harness system? How did your insurance
>company react? And anything else you think would help us learn.
>
>
>Thanks for the info: it may help to protect other pilots.
>
>Michael
>RV-4 N232 Suzie Q
>I can't believe this is December weather..............
Mike,
At this time, I have no facts, results, or info to provide. The aircraft
has been impounded by the FAA with the hope of finding the cause of the
mishap. However, since no one was injured, they may not put much energy
into this investigation.
8ZZ was upright when she finally came to a stop. The rough field caused her
mains to collapse immediately upon touchdown, The wooden prop
disintegrated, and the wings belly and Firewall forward suffered damage.
Since I may not touch the aircraft now that it is impounded, I don't know
the full extent of the damage. From the limited views I have seen, I am
pessimistic at this time.
Bill was wearing Van's standard 4 point harness. He has the bad habit of
keeping it loose while flying, but he tightened up before impact.
I have no info from the insurance company at this time. Bill and I are both
covered pilots under the policy. But the insurance company has not yet seen
the aircraft.
I will keep the list informed as the facts come in. Thanks for your
thoughts and interest.
Louis
Louis I. Willig, RV-4 - N8ZZ
larywil(at)home.com
(610) 668-4964
Philadelphia, PA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gert <gert(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Plane crazy video |
Does anybody have a copy of the Plane Crazy video with bob cringeley
where he tries to build a plane in 30 days ??
My son really likes to watch it and it got erased
Gert
--
Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227,
any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
In a message dated 12/27/1999 8:52:35 PM Eastern Standard Time,
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net writes:
> My sincere thanks to all who wrote to share their similar fuel pressure
> experiences. I'm now not afraid to continue flying my plane, as my
> symptoms seem to be fairly common.
The low pressure experience really puzzles me, as I have the stock 6A fuel
system and Grand Rapids Technologies engine monitor with fuel pressure
transducer Tee'd in from the extra port on the banjo fitting coming out of
the engine-driven pump, and I never see any number other than 4 or 5 psi in
all attitudes with one or both pumps running. (Yes, it reads zero with the
engine off.) Strange forces are at work here...
Bill B
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Learning experience... |
In a message dated 12/23/99 6:45:43 PM Eastern Standard Time, mphill(at)fgi.net
writes:
> ah ken,sounds familiar,my wife is petrified of the idea of a airplane in the
> garage,let alone still being a student pilot,just hope they come around
with
> time,hehe,Just completed the empennage and getting ready to order the wing
> kit. In the mean time i'm cleaning the garage out. Good luck with your
> project
Hi Mark,
My wife is also petrified, to the point of sometimes flying along with her
whole face scrunched up and tears streaming from her eyes. Other times she's
just fine; follows along on the chart, spots other traffic, tunes radios,
reads instruments, and can hold a heading and altitude well enough that I can
look at a chart for a moment or two. The fact that I'm a CFI hasn't seemed
(to me) to make much difference to her comfort level.
Having just returned today from FL, I'm ready to dive into my empennage kit
and get it finished off in the next couple of weeks. My wing kit arrived
last Thursday and I'm anxious to keep the ball rolling, as it were.
Regards,
Ken Balch
Ashland, MA
RV-8 #81125
working on the horiz. stab.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frank A. Reed" <fareed(at)ibm.net> |
| Subject: | Two excellent companies |
Fellow listers,
I recently have done business with two very fine companies and thought I
should share the information with all of you. The first is Rocky Mountain
Instrument, manufacturer of the MicroMonitor and the MicroEncoder.
(www.rkymtn.com) I bought an RV-6A that had the Monitor in it. The builder
had a friend assemble the Monitor and he did not do it properly. It worked
but things were wrong. I called RMI and spoke to Ron Mowrer who gave me
good advice on how to solve some of the problems but we finally decided
that there was enough wrong with this unit to justify sending it back.
That meant the bird was down and Ron told me he'd turn it around in one day
which he did. I never missed a weekend of flying and the unit performs
flawlessly now. And the repair cost was VERY reasonable. My next purchase
will probably be the Encoder.
The second company is Symtec, Inc. in Minnesota. They manufacture sump
heaters for virtually all a/c engines and I ordered one for the 6A without
first checking just how much room I had. When it arrived I did not get to
install it for about two weeks and when I pulled the cowlings I discovered
that I just did not have enough room. Jack Benson, their sales manager,
was very helpful on the telephone and when we determined that it was
probably best not to try a sump heater he very willingly refunded my entire
purchase price. In fact, he just tore up my check and would have let the
cost of shipping the unit to me go by if I had not noticed it. I'm sorry
that I could not use it because the unit looked excellent--very high
quality. Web site is www.symtec-inc.com
In a time when customer service consists of "have a nice day", these two
firms prove that they know what it really means.
Frank Reed
Hudson, NH
RV-6A N89PC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: R & R the RV6a lower cowl -how?? |
| From: | Wes Hays <whays(at)juno.com> |
Steve,
I can't speak for the O-320. It might just be a problem on the O-360, or
I just have missed something on the installation. However, Larry seemed
to have faced this issue before.
Wes .
writes:
>
>Is this true for both the O-320 and the O-360? I ordered my
>Vetterman
>exhaust system from Van's and there was no mention of the exhaust
>system not
>fitting the newer S-type cowl. I went ahead on plunked the exhaust
>system
>on, but haven't begun to fit the cowl yet. I may not be able to send
>the
>exhaust back.
>
>Bummer.
>
>Steve Soule
>Huntington, Vermont
>RV-6A panel wiring
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> Also a note to the S-cowl folks. I couldn't get
>enough
>clearance between
> the cowl and the #2 ball joint and exhaust pipe. I
>called
>Larry Vetterman
> and he said that he had designed a new exhaust system
>for
>the S-cowl for
> those who did not mount the air scoop "off center". I
>really
>can't say
> enough good things about Larry. He traded exhaust with
>me
>since I had not
> drilled the EGT probe holes and the new one fits
>great. If
>you have a
> problem fitting this area, give Larry a call. I'll
>wager he
>can help you
> fix it.
>
>
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
> The low pressure experience really puzzles me, as I have the stock 6A fuel
> system and Grand Rapids Technologies engine monitor with fuel pressure
> transducer Tee'd in from the extra port on the banjo fitting coming out of
> the engine-driven pump, and I never see any number other than 4 or 5 psi
> in all attitudes with one or both pumps running. (Yes, it reads zero with
> the engine off.) Strange forces are at work here...
Hmmm, that's interesting. My entire fuel system is pretty stock:
From each tank aluminum line runs into the cockpit, thru a fuel filter, to
the stock Van's valve, to Grand Rapids fuel flow sensor, to Facet fuel
pump, thru firewall, to ACS gascolator, to mechanical fuel pump, and
my fuel flow sensor is atached by hose to the port on the special "sold
by Van's" fuel pump output fitting that leads to the carb.
Do all of us who experience low fuel pressure have any non-stock
component in common, such as in-line filter, the flow transducer, or
the gascolator?
Tim Lewis
******
Tim Lewis -- Springfield VA
RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
TimRV6A(at)earthlink.net
http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Bower <jimbower(at)sprintmail.com> |
| Subject: | Cockpit insulation |
I'm a long way from this step, but I
was wondering about the pros and
cons of insulating the floor and
sides of the cockpit against the
cold. Even with a good heater
blasting away, I really don't want
to spend a couple of hours with my
arm next to aluminum which is
radiating the outside temperature.
A person could cook at one end and
freeze at another! A lot of the RV
photos I've seen show the inside of
the cockpit seemingly innocent of
side panels. What's up? All
experiences would be welcome, as I
couldn't find anything in the
archives about this (only firewall
insulation).
Jim Bower
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
In a message dated 12/27/99 5:52:35 PM Pacific Standard Time,
timrv6a(at)earthlink.net writes:
<< My inclination at this point is to purchase a check valve and install it
in parallel to the Facet pump, as Terry mentioned. McMaster Carr has
a bronze/stainless/teflon check valve with .5psi cracking pressure that
looks like it will fit the bill. The part number is K7715K22 at
http://www.mcmaster.com , and the price is $12.22.
Other suggestions? >>
Tim-
I really question the readings folks are getting with some of these monitors.
Either that or I question the readings I'm getting with my VM1000. They
can't both be right. I for one would sure like to see a corroborating
pressure check of the alleged low readings using some other independent
monitor (know accurate sensitive direct reading dial gauge teed into line
only for the duration of the test -- use a safety shut off valve to the gauge
and FCS don't start a cockpit fire!!).
As for check valves, Earl's has P/N 250006 with -6 JIC 37 deg flare fittings.
ACS has P/N 10630 which appears identical to the Earl's part for $23.20.
ACS sells the Andair as P/N 05-29555 for $43.75.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
In a message dated 12/27/99 6:46:41 PM Pacific Standard Time,
SportAV8R(at)aol.com writes:
<< The low pressure experience really puzzles me, as I have the stock 6A fuel
system and Grand Rapids Technologies engine monitor with fuel pressure
transducer Tee'd in from the extra port on the banjo fitting coming out of
the engine-driven pump, and I never see any number other than 4 or 5 psi in
all attitudes with one or both pumps running. (Yes, it reads zero with the
engine off.) >>
Same here folks, only I'm using the Vision Microsystems VM1000 fuel pressure
and flow system. Indicated fuel pressure is rock solid at 4 psi with just
engine mechanical pump and 5 psi with boost on from seal (sic) level all the
way up to 8000 ft regardless of attitude (mine and/or the plane's). Above
8000 ft indications drop off about 1 psi for both cases.
-GV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "H. Martin Sutter" <hmsutter(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
>
> >
> > Please describe how you plumbed the two pump-driven lines in parallel.
I removed the Facet pump from it's original location and inserted a coupling
in it's spot. Then I installed a T at the gascolator outlet and ran a line
to the engine driven pump and a seperate line to the electric pump. The
output lines from both pumps come together into another T before the fuel
reaches the carburetor. Exact copy of Piper Cherokee, late sixties vintage.
I also equipped both pumps and the gascolator with cooling blast tubes
Martin Sutter N868CM 1,550hrs >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Olson <lolson(at)doitnow.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Plane crazy video |
I thought that was a info-mercial for the Fisher company. ;)
>Does anybody have a copy of the Plane Crazy video with bob cringeley
>where he tries to build a plane in 30 days ??
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 6A Nosewheel Preload |
| From: | Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com> |
> nosewheel on my 6A and I'm finding that is appears that no matter
> how much I
> load up the spring washers, it moves smoothly at about 19lb. That
> is after a
> high 20's (27-29lb) tug to break it loose. Are we supposed to set
> the
> preload for the force needed to break it loose, or the steady state
> movement?
>
-
I think the manual describes it as a breakout force which means the
amount of force required to get it to move.
BTW... This adjustment will change when you start flying the airplane.
It should be checked periodically during the flight test period. Then
maybe at 75 and then 150 hrs. Usually yearly is sufficient after that.
Scott McDaniels
North Plains, OR
These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: R & R the RV6a lower cowl -how?? |
| From: | Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com> |
>
> Is this true for both the O-320 and the O-360? I ordered my
> Vetterman
> exhaust system from Van's and there was no mention of the exhaust
> system not
> fitting the newer S-type cowl. I went ahead on plunked the exhaust
> system
> on, but haven't begun to fit the cowl yet. I may not be able to
> send the
> exhaust back.
>
> Bummer.
>
-
Old RV bulders proverb says
"Don't believe everything you read on the RV list" :-)
To be honest... the High Country exhaust has always been quite close to
the cowl on the left side. Even with the old cowl on airplanes finished
in the early 90's.
The systems have occasionaly varied slightly from one to another which
can also sometimes amplify the problem.
Scott McDaniels
North Plains, OR
These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
| From: | Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com> |
> I think that this is a thread that Scott really needs to address,
> sorry Scott,
> but this is an area where a critical system design, seems to have a
> built in
> flaw or is at least very intolerant of minor irregularities.
-
I don't really have an answer to the reduced pressure issue, but I will
tell you what I do know.
I know that there are hundreds of RV's flying with the stock fuel system
installed that have steady pressure at all times, in any attitude, and at
all altitudes.
I don't believe the Facet pump (in a general sense) is the cause of
reduced fuel pressure. Yes it is slightly restrictive but so is the
flowscan
flow transducer that is most commonly used in all aircraft fuel flow
instruments.
It is possible that a small # of the Facet pumps have caused pressure
reductions. Every fuel pressure problem that I have ever worked on was
either a weak output from the mechanical pump or the pressure instrument
or sensor was faulty.
It seems that most of the electric pumps used in aircraft either work or
they don't.
All of the carb. equipped airplanes at Van's that I fly run pressures
between
4 - 6 PSI at all times.
My personal RV-6A had a standard fuel system except for a fuel flow
transducer mounted about 10 inches fwd of the electric boost pump.
Pressure measured at the carb inlet was always 4 - 6 PSI except in very
hot PHX summer weather it would sometimes be down to 3 - 4 PSI.
But always steady and never effected by attitude or altitude.
As already mentioned... a lot of the electrical transducers have a small
vent port on them. Very often it is near/adjacent to the wire terminal
connections. If some type of sealant is used to protect the connections,
it can seal the vent.
If I were trouble shooting this type of problem (and the engine seemed to
be performing normally) I would first connect a temporary fuel pressure
gage and verify that I see the same type of symptoms and pressure
readings using the entirely independent gage system.
Before any one panics.... Please remember... There are now over 2300
RV's flying. A major portion of those have a fuel system as prescribed
in the plans. I have not spoken with lots of people that are flying
around with there fuel pressure reading at or near zero every time they
climb or cruise in the upper altitudes.
Scott McDaniels
North Plains, OR
These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott Johnson" <scottjohnson345(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
Hi Scott,
As a matter of record, my fuel system is built exactly according to plans
and with Vans parts.
It does exhibit the condition a number of people have mentioned: lower
pressure at higher altitudes during increased angle of attack.
I would highly recommend that Vans aircraft invest in upgrading their
current fuel system to a parallel system like the cherokee. It would be
nice to have a factory authorized set of plans for this upgrade. This would
improve the safety and redundancy of delivering fuel to the engine.
Granted, there are 2300 RV's flying around and they are not falling out of
the skys, but if this upgrade could save 1 life because of something
blocking the small facet pump hole, wouldn't it be worth it.
I know engineering is always a matter of trade offs, and if we were making
everything as safe and redundant as could be, the plane would be to heavy
and expensive to get airborne,
However,
In this instance, we can significantly improve safety without adding
significant time, money, or weight !
Please forward this idea to the ones who could make it happen in your
company.
Thanks !
----- Original Message -----
From: Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 5:04 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure
>
> > I think that this is a thread that Scott really needs to address,
> > sorry Scott,
> > but this is an area where a critical system design, seems to have a
> > built in
> > flaw or is at least very intolerant of minor irregularities.
> -
> I don't really have an answer to the reduced pressure issue, but I will
> tell you what I do know.
>
> I know that there are hundreds of RV's flying with the stock fuel system
> installed that have steady pressure at all times, in any attitude, and at
> all altitudes.
>
> I don't believe the Facet pump (in a general sense) is the cause of
> reduced fuel pressure. Yes it is slightly restrictive but so is the
> flowscan
> flow transducer that is most commonly used in all aircraft fuel flow
> instruments.
>
> It is possible that a small # of the Facet pumps have caused pressure
> reductions. Every fuel pressure problem that I have ever worked on was
> either a weak output from the mechanical pump or the pressure instrument
> or sensor was faulty.
>
> It seems that most of the electric pumps used in aircraft either work or
> they don't.
>
> All of the carb. equipped airplanes at Van's that I fly run pressures
> between
> 4 - 6 PSI at all times.
>
> My personal RV-6A had a standard fuel system except for a fuel flow
> transducer mounted about 10 inches fwd of the electric boost pump.
> Pressure measured at the carb inlet was always 4 - 6 PSI except in very
> hot PHX summer weather it would sometimes be down to 3 - 4 PSI.
> But always steady and never effected by attitude or altitude.
>
> As already mentioned... a lot of the electrical transducers have a small
> vent port on them. Very often it is near/adjacent to the wire terminal
> connections. If some type of sealant is used to protect the connections,
> it can seal the vent.
>
> If I were trouble shooting this type of problem (and the engine seemed to
> be performing normally) I would first connect a temporary fuel pressure
> gage and verify that I see the same type of symptoms and pressure
> readings using the entirely independent gage system.
>
> Before any one panics.... Please remember... There are now over 2300
> RV's flying. A major portion of those have a fuel system as prescribed
> in the plans. I have not spoken with lots of people that are flying
> around with there fuel pressure reading at or near zero every time they
> climb or cruise in the upper altitudes.
>
>
> Scott McDaniels
> North Plains, OR
> These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
> reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
>
> YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
> Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
> http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
| Subject: | Low Fuel Pressure |
OK, thanks. Is the Facet fuel pump now located foreword of the firewall?
If so, did you bolt it to the firewall?
Steve
-----Original Message-----
I removed the Facet pump from it's original location and
inserted a coupling
in it's spot. Then I installed a T at the gascolator outlet
and ran a line
to the engine driven pump and a seperate line to the
electric pump. The
output lines from both pumps come together into another T
before the fuel
reaches the carburetor. Exact copy of Piper Cherokee, late
sixties vintage.
I also equipped both pumps and the gascolator with cooling
blast tubes
Martin Sutter N868CM 1,550hrs >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fesenbek, Gary" <fesenbek(at)marykay.com> |
I wanted to pass on something that I think is interesting regarding ELTs.
I was testing my ELT last week and accidentally left it on. Since my RV
lives at a towered airport, I called the tower prior to beginning my test
and then after I thought I was completed testing. A few hours later the FAA
showed up and told me that I was still transmitting. After dope slapping
them, I checked and found out that they were right. The funny thing is that
I was in my all metal hangar with the doors closed. The tower is about a
mile away from me so that is still pretty close. But... it is interesting
that they were able to still pick up the signal when inside a metal
building. Of course this forced a battery change for the unit. I am using
an Ameri-King aK-450 by the way.
Gary Fesenbek
RV6A
N152
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Low Fuel Pressure |
Where can one get specs for the Cherokee-like system, if one was interested
in investigating/pursuing that option?
Larry Bowen
RV-8 Tanks
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Scott Johnson
> Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 1:29 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure
>
>
> Hi Scott,
>
> As a matter of record, my fuel system is built exactly according to plans
> and with Vans parts.
>
> It does exhibit the condition a number of people have mentioned: lower
> pressure at higher altitudes during increased angle of attack.
>
> I would highly recommend that Vans aircraft invest in upgrading their
> current fuel system to a parallel system like the cherokee. It would be
> nice to have a factory authorized set of plans for this upgrade.
> This would
> improve the safety and redundancy of delivering fuel to the engine.
>
> Granted, there are 2300 RV's flying around and they are not falling out of
> the skys, but if this upgrade could save 1 life because of something
> blocking the small facet pump hole, wouldn't it be worth it.
>
> I know engineering is always a matter of trade offs, and if we were making
> everything as safe and redundant as could be, the plane would be to heavy
> and expensive to get airborne,
>
> However,
>
> In this instance, we can significantly improve safety without adding
> significant time, money, or weight !
>
> Please forward this idea to the ones who could make it happen in your
> company.
>
> Thanks !
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com>
> To:
> Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 5:04 AM
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure
>
>
> >
> > > I think that this is a thread that Scott really needs to address,
> > > sorry Scott,
> > > but this is an area where a critical system design, seems to have a
> > > built in
> > > flaw or is at least very intolerant of minor irregularities.
> > -
> > I don't really have an answer to the reduced pressure issue, but I will
> > tell you what I do know.
> >
> > I know that there are hundreds of RV's flying with the stock fuel system
> > installed that have steady pressure at all times, in any
> attitude, and at
> > all altitudes.
> >
> > I don't believe the Facet pump (in a general sense) is the cause of
> > reduced fuel pressure. Yes it is slightly restrictive but so is the
> > flowscan
> > flow transducer that is most commonly used in all aircraft fuel flow
> > instruments.
> >
> > It is possible that a small # of the Facet pumps have caused pressure
> > reductions. Every fuel pressure problem that I have ever worked on was
> > either a weak output from the mechanical pump or the pressure instrument
> > or sensor was faulty.
> >
> > It seems that most of the electric pumps used in aircraft either work or
> > they don't.
> >
> > All of the carb. equipped airplanes at Van's that I fly run pressures
> > between
> > 4 - 6 PSI at all times.
> >
> > My personal RV-6A had a standard fuel system except for a fuel flow
> > transducer mounted about 10 inches fwd of the electric boost pump.
> > Pressure measured at the carb inlet was always 4 - 6 PSI except in very
> > hot PHX summer weather it would sometimes be down to 3 - 4 PSI.
> > But always steady and never effected by attitude or altitude.
> >
> > As already mentioned... a lot of the electrical transducers have a small
> > vent port on them. Very often it is near/adjacent to the wire terminal
> > connections. If some type of sealant is used to protect the
> connections,
> > it can seal the vent.
> >
> > If I were trouble shooting this type of problem (and the engine
> seemed to
> > be performing normally) I would first connect a temporary fuel pressure
> > gage and verify that I see the same type of symptoms and pressure
> > readings using the entirely independent gage system.
> >
> > Before any one panics.... Please remember... There are now over 2300
> > RV's flying. A major portion of those have a fuel system as prescribed
> > in the plans. I have not spoken with lots of people that are flying
> > around with there fuel pressure reading at or near zero every time they
> > climb or cruise in the upper altitudes.
> >
> >
> > Scott McDaniels
> > North Plains, OR
> > These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
> > reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Zaloom" <czaloom(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cockpit insulation |
Weight is the reason. Bare metal is light (fast).
If you're going to violate Van's prime directive (keep it light!) and add
insulation, you may consider the kind with sound insulating properties
(Dynamat?) and kill two birds with one stone.
I have an old C180 so take my advice with suspicion since weight is
culturally less an anethma to 180 owners (as is speed ;). I can't add the
stuff to my cert'd plane, but I'd sure love to. It'd be warmer and they say
headphones become optional....ahhhh. I'd paper the entire interior. I
think it is a bit heavy, though.
-Charlie Zaloom
RV list lurker
F1 Rocket Dreamer/Schemer
Mattituck, NY
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Bower <jimbower(at)sprintmail.com>
Sent: Monday, December 27, 1999 10:17 PM
Subject: RV-List: Cockpit insulation
>
> I'm a long way from this step, but I
> was wondering about the pros and
> cons of insulating the floor and
> sides of the cockpit against the
> cold. Even with a good heater
> blasting away, I really don't want
> to spend a couple of hours with my
> arm next to aluminum which is
> radiating the outside temperature.
> A person could cook at one end and
> freeze at another! A lot of the RV
> photos I've seen show the inside of
> the cockpit seemingly innocent of
> side panels. What's up? All
> experiences would be welcome, as I
> couldn't find anything in the
> archives about this (only firewall
> insulation).
>
> Jim Bower
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pat_hatch" <pat_hatch(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
Tim:
My system is stock per the plans...my understanding is that all stock fuel
systems experience this low pressure phenom and is considered to be normal.
I suspect that the output of the mechanical pump is flow-limited, not a
pressure problem per se. Has Scott McDaniels weighed in on this?
Pat Hatch
RV-4, N17PH @ INT
RV-6, Wings, N44PH reserved.
----- Original Message -----
From: Tim Lewis <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net>
Sent: Monday, December 27, 1999 10:10 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure
>
> > The low pressure experience really puzzles me, as I have the stock 6A
fuel
> > system and Grand Rapids Technologies engine monitor with fuel pressure
> > transducer Tee'd in from the extra port on the banjo fitting coming out
of
> > the engine-driven pump, and I never see any number other than 4 or 5 psi
> > in all attitudes with one or both pumps running. (Yes, it reads zero
with
> > the engine off.) Strange forces are at work here...
>
> Hmmm, that's interesting. My entire fuel system is pretty stock:
>
> From each tank aluminum line runs into the cockpit, thru a fuel filter, to
> the stock Van's valve, to Grand Rapids fuel flow sensor, to Facet fuel
> pump, thru firewall, to ACS gascolator, to mechanical fuel pump, and
> my fuel flow sensor is atached by hose to the port on the special "sold
> by Van's" fuel pump output fitting that leads to the carb.
>
> Do all of us who experience low fuel pressure have any non-stock
> component in common, such as in-line filter, the flow transducer, or
> the gascolator?
>
> Tim Lewis
> ******
> Tim Lewis -- Springfield VA
> RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
> TimRV6A(at)earthlink.net
> http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Shook" <skydiven(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | pneumatic squeezers? |
To those who have purchases pneumatic squeezers in lieu of hand squeezers,
can you email me and tell me where you got them and how much they were.
There was a post about Kunkle having them for $195, but that is not the
case. They are $325 from him and if a better deal is out there I would like
to take a look at it. If not, I'll buy his.
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "H. Martin Sutter" <hmsutter(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
----- Original Message -----
From: Stephen J. Soule <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 6:48 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure
>
> OK, thanks. Is the Facet fuel pump now located foreword of the firewall?
> If so, did you bolt it to the firewall?
>
> Steve
Yes, it is mounted to the engine mount via a plate in the left lower corner.
Martin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "H. Martin Sutter" <hmsutter(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Bowen <Larry(at)bowenaero.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 7:31 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure
>
> Where can one get specs for the Cherokee-like system, if one was
interested
> in investigating/pursuing that option?
>
> Larry Bowen
> RV-8 Tanks
> Larry(at)BowenAero.com
> http://BowenAero.com
I got mine out of the Cherokee shop manual and the aircraft I owned for 17
years.
Martin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | n5lp <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
Listers,
I was hoping someone would come to my defense on this but no one has. In
the interest of correcting what I consider to be potentionally dangerous
information in the archives I quote from my RV-6 builders manual. No
disrespect is intended.
"As of April 1992, however, the Sensenich Propeller Corporation had
developed a fixed pitch metal propeller specifically for aircraft in the
RV class and speed range. This is the ONLY fixed pitch metal prop that
is suitable for the RV series. Contact VAN's for performance data and
ordering information.
All of the fixed pitch metal props previously manufactured were designed
for much slower airplanes so their pitch angles are much too low to be
effective at the RV-6's cruise speed. While it is true that metal props
can be re-pitched for more or less speed, they cannot be re-pitched to
the extent needed for the RV-6. In addition to a loss of efficiency
incurred through excessive re-pitching, the stress on the metal renders
them unsafe for use. The stresses on metal props are very involved, and
the most insidious of these are harmonic vibrational stresses which are
not detectable through vibrations which can be felt by the pilot.
Extensively reworked metal props have a history of losing sections of
their blades which can easily result in catastrophic imbalances capable
of tearing the engine completely free of the mount and airframe."
Pretty sobering for me!
Larry Pardue
>
>
>The McCauley 1A170 propeller is also used on the 320's 150 and 160 HP. We
>use them on cubs 8242 length/pitch but that is for climb performance. You
>can twist it to get more speed.
>**** Bryan E. Files ****
>Ever Fly Maintenance
>Palmer, Alaska
>A&P, IA, FAA Safety Counselor
>mailto:BFiles(at)corecom.net
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Larry Pardue <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net>
>To:
>Sent: Sunday, December 26, 1999 6:53 PM
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Prop on a 6
>
>
>>
>> >
>> >
>> >It seems as though I am ready to buy a prop for a RV6. I always thought
>> >that i would want to go with a sensenich fixed pitch. BUT..first.. I
>> >thought i may ask for everyones opinion. What other FIXED PITCH props
>> >has anyone had good luck with on a 6 using an 150 hp 0320? Would be
>> >interested in purchasing a used one if anyone is selling!
>> >
>>
>>
>> Dustin,
>>
>> The Sensenich is the ONLY fixed pitch metal prop designed for your
>> combination. Any other metal prop would be really really experimental and
>> probably dangerous. When you get into wood props there are very many
>> possibilities and it tends to be harder to choose one that is optimum on
>the
>> first try.
>>
>> Larry Pardue
>> Carlsbad, NM
>>
>> RV-6 N441LP (O-360/Sensenich 72FM8-83)
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <fasching(at)amigo.net> |
My RV-6A fuel system is exactly per plans. With electric boost pump on I
show about 6lbs fuel pressure. When turned off in flight after take off the
indication stays about the same....no noticeable drop in indicated pressure
measured at the input to the carb. Always rock solid. FWIW
RV-6A Salida, CO
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
-----Original Message-----
From: Fesenbek, Gary <fesenbek(at)marykay.com>
Date: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 7:05 AM
Subject: RV-List: ELT Info
>
>I wanted to pass on something that I think is interesting regarding ELTs.
>
>I was testing my ELT last week and accidentally left it on. Since my RV
>lives at a towered airport, I called the tower prior to beginning my test
>and then after I thought I was completed testing. A few hours later the
FAA
>showed up and told me that I was still transmitting. After dope slapping
>them, I checked and found out that they were right. The funny thing is
that
>I was in my all metal hangar with the doors closed. The tower is about a
>mile away from me so that is still pretty close. But... it is interesting
>that they were able to still pick up the signal when inside a metal
>building. Of course this forced a battery change for the unit. I am using
>an Ameri-King aK-450 by the way.
>
>Gary Fesenbek
>RV6A
>N152
The ELT signal's escape from your metal hangar is expected behavior from
electro-magnetic wave physics. The 243 MHz signal (probably the one they
detected) has a wavelength of about 48 inches, and a hole 1/20 of a
wavelength -- about 2 1/2 inches -- passes lots of radio power. The
mechanisms for the escape are called Fresnel diffraction and reflection.
Any small holes or slots (like cloth seals around doors) allow escape of the
radio waves.
These mechanisms are why the placement of the ELT antenna in the baggage
area is not so critical -- the radio waves are going to get out and reflect
to the satellite even if the plane is upside down.
Dennis Persyk amateur radio N9DP 6A finishing kit
Hampshire, IL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DAVENDANA1(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: pneumatic squeezers? |
Check out "The Tard" The address is
www.surplusaircrafttools.com
dave Funk
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kathy & Bill Peck" <peck(at)amigo.net> |
| Subject: | Dash layout technique |
Scott (& the list) -
I saw your note in the RV list asking about techniques for laying out a
dash. Kathy and I used a pretty "low-tech" approach (even though I have
access to AutoCAD!) to do this.
We photocopied pictures of the instruments we wanted to use out of various
catalogs (Chief had the most face-on pictures that were reasonably sharp and
large, if I remember correctly). Then used the "zoom" feature on the copier
until the size matched the common instrument cut-put sizes in the Aircraft
Spruce catalog (or mfr's dims, on non-standard size items like radios, etc.)
Next step was to make a life-size cardboard dash template, and then play
"paper dolls" until we like the arrangement. Lightly tape the instruments
in place, then install the entire dash in the fuselage & sit in it & make
airplane noises. Now you can make sure everything's in sight, in reach,
etc.
We ended up with a slightly non-conventional panel by doing this - the
engine instruments and radio stack are swapped, putting gauges in the center
of the dash and the radios directly in front of the right-seater (and tilted
about 1/2" - thickness of the faceplate) toward the left side. We proved to
ourselves that this wasn't an ergonomic problem for us and went ahead with
it using the above design technique. Haven't proved it in the air yet
(maybe next week!), but I think it'll work well for us.
I think there are two major advantages from using this approach - it's
cheap, and it lets you see/feel it in place to check the real ergonomics for
yourself (and make changes quickly!)
Bill & Kathy Peck - RV-6A(Q), cleaning up details for the airworthiness
inspection next week!
htt
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cockpit insulation |
In a message dated 12/28/1999 7:43:58 AM Central Standard Time,
czaloom(at)worldnet.att.net writes:
<< Weight is the reason. Bare metal is light (fast).
If you're going to violate Van's prime directive (keep it light!) and add
insulation, you may consider the kind with sound insulating properties
(Dynamat?) and kill two birds with one stone.
As some one who was heavily into car audio I would not use dynamat on my F-1
Rocket. Its to heavy and it also has a problem when it gets really cold. It
would mostly vibrate the adhesive right off if you used it in a state like
wisconsin and flew in the window. There is to much vibration.
Also dynamat is great but for it to truely be effective you need to cover
everything and the weight would be to much.
I would be more inclined to use some of the newer products that you spray on.
Easier to work with, the vibration would not effect them nor would the cold.
Also you would not have any gaps so overall your sound proofing would be
better. In the area you rest you arms I am going to look at the sheets of
sound proofing heat reflective material and see how that will work. There is
a lot of stuff out there, but remember the most of the sheets are asphalt or
lead based. heavy and not the thing you want if you have a aircraft fire.
Hope this helps and you can make since of it since I am not awake yet.
Chris Wilcox
F-1 Rocket
I have an old C180 so take my advice with suspicion since weight is
culturally less an anethma to 180 owners (as is speed ;). I can't add the
stuff to my cert'd plane, but I'd sure love to. It'd be warmer and they say
headphones become optional....ahhhh. I'd paper the entire interior. I
think it is a bit heavy, though.
-Charlie Zaloom
RV list lurker
F1 Rocket Dreamer/Schemer
Mattituck, NY
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Edward Cole" <emcole(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: pneumatic squeezers? |
Try Action Airparts in Detroit. Check the Archives for the phone #
Typical price is $250 with a smal yoke.
Ed Cole
----- Original Message -----
From: <DAVENDANA1(at)aol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 8:43 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: pneumatic squeezers?
Check out "The Tard" The address is
www.surplusaircrafttools.com
dave Funk
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Von Dane <bvondane(at)atmel.com> |
| Subject: | Dash layout technique |
I have been playing with possible panels for my -8A as well, and I am not
using Panel Planner... I do however use the blank panel for panel planner,
and can use any of the gauges that Panel Planner uses... You can see some
of my panels here: http://vondane.tripod.com/logbook/panel/
Contact me offline for more information...
-Bill Von Dane - Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A N912V res., waiting for wings
http://vondane.tripod.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Kathy & Bill
Peck
Sent: December 28, 1999 10:08 AM
Subject: RV-List: Dash layout technique
Scott (& the list) -
I saw your note in the RV list asking about techniques for laying out a
dash. Kathy and I used a pretty "low-tech" approach (even though I have
access to AutoCAD!) to do this.
We photocopied pictures of the instruments we wanted to use out of various
catalogs (Chief had the most face-on pictures that were reasonably sharp and
large, if I remember correctly). Then used the "zoom" feature on the copier
until the size matched the common instrument cut-put sizes in the Aircraft
Spruce catalog (or mfr's dims, on non-standard size items like radios, etc.)
Next step was to make a life-size cardboard dash template, and then play
"paper dolls" until we like the arrangement. Lightly tape the instruments
in place, then install the entire dash in the fuselage & sit in it & make
airplane noises. Now you can make sure everything's in sight, in reach,
etc.
We ended up with a slightly non-conventional panel by doing this - the
engine instruments and radio stack are swapped, putting gauges in the center
of the dash and the radios directly in front of the right-seater (and tilted
about 1/2" - thickness of the faceplate) toward the left side. We proved to
ourselves that this wasn't an ergonomic problem for us and went ahead with
it using the above design technique. Haven't proved it in the air yet
(maybe next week!), but I think it'll work well for us.
I think there are two major advantages from using this approach - it's
cheap, and it lets you see/feel it in place to check the real ergonomics for
yourself (and make changes quickly!)
Bill & Kathy Peck - RV-6A(Q), cleaning up details for the airworthiness
inspection next week!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Builders Bookstore <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cafe prop testing |
> About 5 or 6 years ago CAFE ran a test on about six or seven props using
> Van's RV-6......I need to find that article....
It's in 18 YEARS OF THE RV-ATOR on pages 201-203.
It was originally published in the June 1990 RV-ator.
Andy Gold
Builder's Bookstore
http://www.buildersbooks.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken Hoshowski" <ve7fp(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cockpit insulation |
>
SNIP>
Even with a good heater
>blasting away, I really don't want
>to spend a couple of hours with my
>arm next to aluminum which is
>radiating the outside temperature.
>
Jim, I have made up fitted side panels that match my upholstery
and are attached with velcro and also have carpet on the floor, but I did it
more for looks than heat retention. In my opinion if you are concerned
about heat loss and comfort in cold flying conditions you should put some
light nylon boots on the aileron push rods where they enter the fuselage.
At 180 mph a fair bit of air gets in around the wing fairings and comes out
under the seat pans and up the control sticks.
Ken Hoshowski RV6 C-FKEH
Salmon Arm B.C. First flight Sept. 8,1993
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Dash layout technique |
I used Panel planner and had very good results. I found it "user friendly"
(whatever that really means) and it worked in my Pentium 90 without
glitches. I did not use the coordinates as my cutting template, but used
them as a reference only. I just didn't feel comfortable cutting into the
panel without manually laying out my own measurements on it. The software
was great for visualizing the many iterations of instrument placements I
came up with. The final positioning of the holes was done by drawing a
vertical and horizontal centerline on the panel, then placing the basic six
instrument cluster by equidistant measurements in a symmetrical manner about
the intersection of the X and Y lines. I'm a real fan of symmetry. Must be
why I picked the RV8...CENTERLINE SEATING.
The actual cutting was done the old fashioned way...fly cutter and hand
filing to fit each instrument. I think it all came out looking great and
wasn't hard at all. It was actually a lot of fun!
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
2 hours on the tach.
>
>
>I have been playing with possible panels for my -8A as well, and I am not
>using Panel Planner... I do however use the blank panel for panel planner,
>and can use any of the gauges that Panel Planner uses... You can see some
>of my panels here: http://vondane.tripod.com/logbook/panel/
>
>Contact me offline for more information...
>
>-Bill Von Dane - Colorado Springs, CO
>RV-8A N912V res., waiting for wings
>http://vondane.tripod.com
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Kathy & Bill
>Peck
>Sent: December 28, 1999 10:08 AM
>To: SAJ_SLJ(at)compuserve.com
>Subject: RV-List: Dash layout technique
>
>
>Scott (& the list) -
>
>I saw your note in the RV list asking about techniques for laying out a
>dash. Kathy and I used a pretty "low-tech" approach (even though I have
>access to AutoCAD!) to do this.
>
>We photocopied pictures of the instruments we wanted to use out of various
>catalogs (Chief had the most face-on pictures that were reasonably sharp
>and
>large, if I remember correctly). Then used the "zoom" feature on the
>copier
>until the size matched the common instrument cut-put sizes in the Aircraft
>Spruce catalog (or mfr's dims, on non-standard size items like radios,
>etc.)
>
>Next step was to make a life-size cardboard dash template, and then play
>"paper dolls" until we like the arrangement. Lightly tape the instruments
>in place, then install the entire dash in the fuselage & sit in it & make
>airplane noises. Now you can make sure everything's in sight, in reach,
>etc.
>
>We ended up with a slightly non-conventional panel by doing this - the
>engine instruments and radio stack are swapped, putting gauges in the
>center
>of the dash and the radios directly in front of the right-seater (and
>tilted
>about 1/2" - thickness of the faceplate) toward the left side. We proved
>to
>ourselves that this wasn't an ergonomic problem for us and went ahead with
>it using the above design technique. Haven't proved it in the air yet
>(maybe next week!), but I think it'll work well for us.
>
>I think there are two major advantages from using this approach - it's
>cheap, and it lets you see/feel it in place to check the real ergonomics
>for
>yourself (and make changes quickly!)
>
> Bill & Kathy Peck - RV-6A(Q), cleaning up details for the airworthiness
>inspection next week!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Garry Legare <versadek(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Cockpit insulation |
I hesitate to address this post because some people on the list may accuse me of
blatant commercialism, but here is what I'm going to use for sound deadening,
insulation and aesthetics. It's called Versadek. It was originally designed as
a
slip-resistant covering for wood, concrete or metal decks on boats. It has
evolved into a very versatile covering that is light (18.4 oz per square yd)
fire-resistant (class A-can be used in elevators, hospitals, schools) easy to
use (comes in rolls like vinyl upholstery) and relatively inexpensive. It is used
by many boat manufacturers for its insulating effect on the outside walls of
aluminum or fiberglass boats. There are two thicknesses, regular Versadek for use
on walls or floor panels and Versadek Ultra for heavy wear areas like under the
rudder peddles. Check the web site at www.versadek.com. The office is closed
until the New Year. If you would like more information or samples just send an
email from our website. RV builders will be given special pricing.
P.S. We also have a dark blue that is not on the website.
Garry LeGare, RV6
CW9371(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 12/28/1999 7:43:58 AM Central Standard Time,
> czaloom(at)worldnet.att.net writes:
>
> << Weight is the reason. Bare metal is light (fast).
>
> If you're going to violate Van's prime directive (keep it light!) and add
> insulation, you may consider the kind with sound insulating properties
> (Dynamat?) and kill two birds with one stone.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cockpit insulation |
--- CW9371(at)aol.com wrote:
> I would be more inclined to use some of the newer products that you
> spray on.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Be _very_ careful with spray insulation products. _Highly_ flammable!!
Read the label closely.
I have a friend who lost a camper van to fire when a hot plate ignited
some sprayed insulation. The fire was very hot and spread very
quickly!
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX
-6 N140RV (Reserved)
Wings
Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.
http://messenger.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oregon Aero Seats |
I rejected the Oregon Aero product because of the WEIGHT & COST. They weighed
over 4x the seats from DJ Lorxxxxxxxxx.
nhunger(at)sprint.ca on 12/22/99 12:30:16 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: Oregon Aero Seats
Product Report: Oregon Aero Seats RV6A
I just received my box from Oregon Aero. Four hunks of foam and a catalog
that shows how they are made. It appears to be quite a process as layers of
temper-foam are built up in a mold and trimmed to shape. The finished
product is a fully contoured cushion. The seats are uncovered.
These are probable the most expensive seats available for the RV. Cost was
conversion to Canadian dollars came to a whopping $900 Canadian. But before
you go shaking your head, try one out at the next fly-in. They are
remarkable. If you live near-by you can come over and try mine. I intend my
aircraft to be primarily a cross country machine and therefore justify the
cost of comfort.
I haven't chosen a covering yet but I do know that I will add heated seat
pads to all four cushions. They do not affect the feel of the seat. They use
4 amps each on high setting and cost $450 Canadian for all four pads needed.
They are available locally at a car seatcover place.
I plan to secure them with 2" wide velcro to the aircraft and each one will
have a plug for the electric heat to make the seats removable.
Norman Hunger
Working too much to build these last two months.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cockpit insulation |
My interior insulation & material weighs less than 3 lbs...total....I used the
flame proof
camping mat that is 3/16 in. thick & material that resembles rat skin/fuzz.
Really classy
looking & cheap & weight is of no concern at 3#.....in a rv-4...
CW9371(at)aol.com on 12/28/99 12:12:07 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Cockpit insulation
In a message dated 12/28/1999 7:43:58 AM Central Standard Time,
czaloom(at)worldnet.att.net writes:
<< Weight is the reason. Bare metal is light (fast).
If you're going to violate Van's prime directive (keep it light!) and add
insulation, you may consider the kind with sound insulating properties
(Dynamat?) and kill two birds with one stone.
As some one who was heavily into car audio I would not use dynamat on my F-1
Rocket. Its to heavy and it also has a problem when it gets really cold. It
would mostly vibrate the adhesive right off if you used it in a state like
wisconsin and flew in the window. There is to much vibration.
Also dynamat is great but for it to truely be effective you need to cover
everything and the weight would be to much.
I would be more inclined to use some of the newer products that you spray on.
Easier to work with, the vibration would not effect them nor would the cold.
Also you would not have any gaps so overall your sound proofing would be
better. In the area you rest you arms I am going to look at the sheets of
sound proofing heat reflective material and see how that will work. There is
a lot of stuff out there, but remember the most of the sheets are asphalt or
lead based. heavy and not the thing you want if you have a aircraft fire.
Hope this helps and you can make since of it since I am not awake yet.
Chris Wilcox
F-1 Rocket
I have an old C180 so take my advice with suspicion since weight is
culturally less an anethma to 180 owners (as is speed ;). I can't add the
stuff to my cert'd plane, but I'd sure love to. It'd be warmer and they say
headphones become optional....ahhhh. I'd paper the entire interior. I
think it is a bit heavy, though.
-Charlie Zaloom
RV list lurker
F1 Rocket Dreamer/Schemer
Mattituck, NY
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Sam James Wing Root Fairings |
I have the root fairings & I cannot determine a acceptable way to put on the
aircraft.
Screws pucker too much & I want a easy way to check below at annual time so
perminant
mount is unacceptable also.....any ideas????
chester razer on 12/26/99 09:23:07 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: Sam James Wing Root Fairings
wing root fairings on a 6 or 6A how much top end speed improvement you
have noticed.
chet and Miss Chiq.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
You might check your fule tank vent lines if you have not already done so.
If partially plugged you might be trying to overcome a negative pressure
differential in the tank.
Ed Anderson
Matthews NC
> > I think that this is a thread that Scott really needs to address,
> > sorry Scott,
> > but this is an area where a critical system design, seems to have a
> > built in
> > flaw or is at least very intolerant of minor irregularities.
> -
> I don't really have an answer to the reduced pressure issue, but I will
> tell you what I do know.
>
> I know that there are hundreds of RV's flying with the stock fuel system
> installed that have steady pressure at all times, in any attitude, and at
> all altitudes.
>
> I don't believe the Facet pump (in a general sense) is the cause of
> reduced fuel pressure. Yes it is slightly restrictive but so is the
> flowscan
> flow transducer that is most commonly used in all aircraft fuel flow
> instruments.
>
> It is possible that a small # of the Facet pumps have caused pressure
> reductions. Every fuel pressure problem that I have ever worked on was
> either a weak output from the mechanical pump or the pressure instrument
> or sensor was faulty.
>
> It seems that most of the electric pumps used in aircraft either work or
> they don't.
>
> All of the carb. equipped airplanes at Van's that I fly run pressures
> between
> 4 - 6 PSI at all times.
>
> My personal RV-6A had a standard fuel system except for a fuel flow
> transducer mounted about 10 inches fwd of the electric boost pump.
> Pressure measured at the carb inlet was always 4 - 6 PSI except in very
> hot PHX summer weather it would sometimes be down to 3 - 4 PSI.
> But always steady and never effected by attitude or altitude.
>
> As already mentioned... a lot of the electrical transducers have a small
> vent port on them. Very often it is near/adjacent to the wire terminal
> connections. If some type of sealant is used to protect the connections,
> it can seal the vent.
>
> If I were trouble shooting this type of problem (and the engine seemed to
> be performing normally) I would first connect a temporary fuel pressure
> gage and verify that I see the same type of symptoms and pressure
> readings using the entirely independent gage system.
>
> Before any one panics.... Please remember... There are now over 2300
> RV's flying. A major portion of those have a fuel system as prescribed
> in the plans. I have not spoken with lots of people that are flying
> around with there fuel pressure reading at or near zero every time they
> climb or cruise in the upper altitudes.
>
>
> Scott McDaniels
> North Plains, OR
> These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
> reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
>
> YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
> Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
> http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce B. Bell" <rv4bell(at)door.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Sam James Wing Root Fairings |
I have the same root fairings and plan to use #6 nutplates and Countersunk
washers on the screws. Saw this at Burlington and it looked ok to me.
Bruce Bell
Lubbock, Texas
----- Original Message -----
From: <pcondon(at)csc.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 12:30 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Sam James Wing Root Fairings
>
>
> I have the root fairings & I cannot determine a acceptable way to put on
the
> aircraft.
> Screws pucker too much & I want a easy way to check below at annual time
so
> perminant
> mount is unacceptable also.....any ideas????
>
>
> chester razer on 12/26/99 09:23:07 AM
>
> Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
> Subject: RV-List: Sam James Wing Root Fairings
>
>
> wing root fairings on a 6 or 6A how much top end speed improvement you
> have noticed.
>
> chet and Miss Chiq.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fesenbek, Gary" <fesenbek(at)marykay.com> |
| Subject: | Carbon Monoxide Detector |
Hi All!
Just wanted to pass on some information on Carbon Monoxide Detectors. There
was a post to the list a month or so ago about an AVWeb article that
recommended the AIM CO detector. I had used a Nighthawk version previously
and wanted to try the AIM unit out because I liked the fact that it offered
six second updates. I got my unit in shortly after Thanksgiving and
installed it in the airplane. It worked great (I think) for a week or two.
I have a gas generator to light my hangar and I did notice higher levels of
CO dislayed when the generator was close to the airplane. After a week or
two the unit that I got quit working. It displayed Err in the window and
would Beep every minute. As you can imagine this was very annoying. I took
this as an opportunity to read the manual and saw in the book that they do
not recommend the unit for use in Airplanes (of course that's what the
Fawcett Fuel pump says too....) and do not expose to temperatures below 40
deg F as I recall. Well I live in Dallas and the weather does get below 40
here in the winter so I thought that might be the cause. I contacted the
AVWeb site that I purchased the unit from and they sent a replacement out
right away without even asking for me to return the original unit. When the
new unit came there was a large sticker on the outside that talked about the
things in the manual about not recommended for Aviation use and the temp
extreme stuff. The note said that these units are distributed by power
companies and they keep them on their trucks for weeks at a time in
uncovered and unheated parking and there are not any problems with the temp
extremes. Also, the note said that they needed to put "Not for Aviation
Use" to get UL certification. The note said that a similar warning is on
the Nighthawk unit although I have not verified this.
Anyway, I just wanted to pass this on in case others are thinking about
making such a purchase.
Happy New Year!
Gary Fesenbek
N152
RV6A
Dallas, TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick McBride <rickrv8(at)qwestinternet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dash layout technique |
You may want to check the accuracy of the RV-8 template dimensions. I have been
using Panel Planner to layout my panel and have found the template to be larger
(in height) than the actual panel. I've tried to modify the template using
AutoCAD LT and importing back into Panel Planner but haven't had any luck. I
will probably end up doing the layout the old fashioned way, which worked well
on my -6.
Rick McBride
Bill Von Dane wrote:
>
> I have been playing with possible panels for my -8A as well, and I am not
> using Panel Planner... I do however use the blank panel for panel planner,
> and can use any of the gauges that Panel Planner uses... You can see some
> of my panels here: http://vondane.tripod.com/logbook/panel/
>
> Contact me offline for more information...
>
> -Bill Von Dane - Colorado Springs, CO
> RV-8A N912V res., waiting for wings
> http://vondane.tripod.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Kathy & Bill
> Peck
> Sent: December 28, 1999 10:08 AM
> To: SAJ_SLJ(at)compuserve.com
> Subject: RV-List: Dash layout technique
>
>
> Scott (& the list) -
>
> I saw your note in the RV list asking about techniques for laying out a
> dash. Kathy and I used a pretty "low-tech" approach (even though I have
> access to AutoCAD!) to do this.
>
> We photocopied pictures of the instruments we wanted to use out of various
> catalogs (Chief had the most face-on pictures that were reasonably sharp and
> large, if I remember correctly). Then used the "zoom" feature on the copier
> until the size matched the common instrument cut-put sizes in the Aircraft
> Spruce catalog (or mfr's dims, on non-standard size items like radios, etc.)
>
> Next step was to make a life-size cardboard dash template, and then play
> "paper dolls" until we like the arrangement. Lightly tape the instruments
> in place, then install the entire dash in the fuselage & sit in it & make
> airplane noises. Now you can make sure everything's in sight, in reach,
> etc.
>
> We ended up with a slightly non-conventional panel by doing this - the
> engine instruments and radio stack are swapped, putting gauges in the center
> of the dash and the radios directly in front of the right-seater (and tilted
> about 1/2" - thickness of the faceplate) toward the left side. We proved to
> ourselves that this wasn't an ergonomic problem for us and went ahead with
> it using the above design technique. Haven't proved it in the air yet
> (maybe next week!), but I think it'll work well for us.
>
> I think there are two major advantages from using this approach - it's
> cheap, and it lets you see/feel it in place to check the real ergonomics for
> yourself (and make changes quickly!)
>
> Bill & Kathy Peck - RV-6A(Q), cleaning up details for the airworthiness
> inspection next week!
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel flow transducer mounting |
Fellow Listers:
I am installing an EI fuel computer in my RV-4. EI's instructions call for
mounting the transducer between the fuel pump and the carb. This is a very
tight installation in the RV-4. I called EI and proposed installing the
transducer forward of the fuel selector prior to the boost pump as I have
seen others do (and as Matt does with the FuelScan). They said it had not
been tested this way so really couldn't support this one way or another.
Has anyone had any experience with mounting an EI transducer in the cabin
instead of in the engine compartment and has this compromised the accuracy
of the unit (I know, I probably should have bought a FuelScan to begin
with... forgive me Matt).
Doug
===========
Doug Weiler
Hudson, WI
715-386-1239
dougweil(at)pressenter.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Von Dane <bvondane(at)atmel.com> |
| Subject: | Dash layout technique |
I modified the -8 panel I downloaded from Panel Planner to as close as I
could get it to real, but I am not sure it is perfect... I can do it for
your -6 panel as well if you can send me exact dimensions...
-Bill Von Dane - Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A N912V res., waiting for wings
http://vondane.tripod.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Rick McBride
Sent: December 28, 1999 3:43 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Dash layout technique
You may want to check the accuracy of the RV-8 template dimensions. I have
been
using Panel Planner to layout my panel and have found the template to be
larger
(in height) than the actual panel. I've tried to modify the template using
AutoCAD LT and importing back into Panel Planner but haven't had any luck.
I
will probably end up doing the layout the old fashioned way, which worked
well
on my -6.
Rick McBride
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott A. Jordan" <SAJ_SLJ(at)compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | Dash layout technique |
Message text written by Brian Denk
>I used Panel planner and had very good results. I found it "user friendly"
(whatever that really means) and it worked in my Pentium 90 without
glitches. <
I'm going to reload the program (again) tonight, sit down with a couple
beers and see what I can do.
We made the initial layout on the -6 today. Measured the instruments and
radios we had and drew outlines on the panel. Cutouts would have sped up
the process of moving things around but this worked fine for the initial
fitting. We put the panel back in the plane to check for ergonomics and
any fitting issues we missed (lots of constraints with hinges etc on the -6
/ tip up).
Scott
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott A. Jordan" <SAJ_SLJ(at)compuserve.com> |
Once again I have installed Panel Planner 2.7 and it has failed. The
program can not find the euipment graphic directory even though it is in
the default drive (the CD). I have even "changed" the equipment directory
to the CD to no avail. I get a message to check that I have the CD in the
drive (it is) or to copy the files to my hard drive.
All in all it is junk!!
For sale to highest bidder.
Scott A. Jordan
80331
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Dent in skin from dimple die |
Help! While dimpling the hole closest to the leading edge of my horizontal
stabilizer, the round edge of the die left a dent in the skin. Is there a
way to fix this?
Thanks,
Mark Schrimmer
RV9A Tail Kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Carbon Monoxide Detector |
| From: | "James Freeman" <cd005677(at)mindspring.com> |
----------
>From: "Fesenbek, Gary" <fesenbek(at)marykay.com>
>To: "'rv-list(at)matronics.com'"
>Subject: RV-List: Carbon Monoxide Detector
>Date: Tue, Dec 28, 1999, 4:16 PM
>
> Hi All!
>
> Just wanted to pass on some information on Carbon Monoxide Detectors. There
> was a post to the list a month or so ago about an AVWeb article that
> recommended the AIM CO detector. I had used a Nighthawk version previously
> and wanted to try the AIM unit out because I liked the fact that it offered
> six second updates. I got my unit in shortly after Thanksgiving and
> installed it in the airplane. It worked great (I think) for a week or two.
> I have a gas generator to light my hangar and I did notice higher levels of
> CO dislayed when the generator was close to the airplane.
I have been very interested in these, as I had CO problems in another
airplane several years ago (A Navion). In that airplane, the CO was
entering the cabin through the gear wells and aft wing root fairings at high
angles of attack. On my -8, I'm paying particular attention to all the
holes and seams in the lower fuselage.
Anyway, we've been using two of these for a year and I'm completely sold on
them. They live in my usually unheated hangar (in Memphis) and are exposed
to temperature and humidity extremes with no apparent problems. I was
carrying one in our C-337 on a recent trip (to an RV fly-in with two other
listers) and had the baggage door pop open on climbout. In the 337, the
baggage door is on the aft end of the cabin, is hinged in front, and hangs
open 1-2 inches in trail in flight. Unless a nervous passenger is in the
seat, this is normally ignored until landing. Usually, you don't even know
unless you happen to turn around and look for some reason. We weren't using
the heat IIRC.
The CO detector started beeping in cruise, and took us several minutes to
figure out what it was. Initially it was under the left front seat. We
found that very high CO levels existed near the floor, but very low levels
at "head height." By bending over, we could smell exhaust faintly. The
detector responded almost immediately and repeatably to small changes in
position. It read "0" directly in front of the fresh air vent.
I now have more respect for this detector, and check it more frequently in
flight, as well as when using my kerosene heater in the hangar. I have also
(finally) fixed the latch on the baggage door.
James Freeman
RV-8QB back seat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | aquila33(at)webtv.net (dann mann) |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon Monoxide Detector |
What is the effect of CO if you inhale small amounts. Does it make you
lose concentration or do you feel euphoric?
Thanks
Dan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)accessus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon Monoxide Detector |
You get tired quicker, and sometimes a headache accompanies. The CO
attaches itself to hemoglobin of the blood just like oxygen but then it
can't oxidize to produce energy.
Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact!
(Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com)
-----Original Message-----
From: dann mann <aquila33(at)webtv.net>
Date: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 7:13 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Carbon Monoxide Detector
>
>What is the effect of CO if you inhale small amounts. Does it make you
>lose concentration or do you feel euphoric?
>Thanks
>Dan
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)accessus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dent in skin from dimple die |
Take a spoon and rub the back of the sheet to reduce the size of the dent.
Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact!
(Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com)
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 6:20 PM
Subject: RV-List: Dent in skin from dimple die
>
>Help! While dimpling the hole closest to the leading edge of my horizontal
>stabilizer, the round edge of the die left a dent in the skin. Is there a
>way to fix this?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Mark Schrimmer
>RV9A Tail Kit
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon Monoxide Detector |
>
>What is the effect of CO if you inhale small amounts. Does it make you
>lose concentration or do you feel euphoric?
>Thanks
>Dan
>
Apparently, the first symptom is a headache. Eventually you will
lose consciousness. It's nasty stuff.
There is lots of info on the web. See:
http://www.coalarm.com/aboutco.htm
http://www.tcfreenet.org/people/guestb/pubed/cofaq.html
Take care,
Kevin Horton RV-8 (wings skinned, getting ready to do fuselage)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Oregon Aero Seats |
The following is not true. It would be impossible for them to weigh more
than four times that of a DJ seat. Impossible. Got any numbers to back up
this statement? Oregon Aero seats are just hunks of temperfoam no bigger
than stock size. It's not like their dipped in plastic or have some kind of
frame. They are just formed hunks of temperfoam. I have mine here and they
don't seem unusually heavy at all. The following statement is not true.
Norman
>
> I rejected the Oregon Aero product because of the WEIGHT & COST. They
weighed
> over 4x the seats from DJ Lorxxxxxxxxx.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuel flow transducer mounting |
| From: | Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com> |
> I am installing an EI fuel computer in my RV-4. EI's instructions
> call for
> mounting the transducer between the fuel pump and the carb. This is
> a very
> tight installation in the RV-4. I called EI and proposed installing
> the
> transducer forward of the fuel selector prior to the boost pump as I
> have
> seen others do (and as Matt does with the FuelScan).
-
This has been done by many RV builders with success.
It works fine with the E.I. gage because it has an adjustable K-factor
value so that you can fine tune the readings to be very accurate
regardless of were the transducer is. (I think Matt's system has this
also but I can't remember).
A draw back is that when ever the electric boost pump is on it causes the
fuel flow to read higher than actual (but the error will always keep you
safe to the conservative side on total fuel used.
The main negative is that the fuel is not filtered before it passes
through the transducer since the gascolator is usually up stream in the
engine compartment (unless you install an in line filter in the cockpit
prior to the transducer).
If you are using a fuel pickup tube in each tank with a filter screen on
it
this doesn't seem to be a problem.
Scott McDaniels
North Plains, OR
These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com> |
> I was hoping someone would come to my defense on this but no one
> has. In
> the interest of correcting what I consider to be potentionally
> dangerous
> information in the archives I quote from my RV-6 builders manual.
> No
> disrespect is intended.
>
> "As of April 1992, however, the Sensenich Propeller Corporation had
> developed a fixed pitch metal propeller specifically for aircraft in
> the
> RV class and speed range. This is the ONLY fixed pitch metal prop
> that
> is suitable for the RV series. Contact VAN's for performance data
> and
> ordering information.
>
> All of the fixed pitch metal props previously manufactured were
> designed
> for much slower airplanes so their pitch angles are much too low to
> be
> effective at the RV-6's cruise speed. While it is true that metal
> props
> can be re-pitched for more or less speed, they cannot be re-pitched
> to
> the extent needed for the RV-6. In addition to a loss of efficiency
>
> incurred through excessive re-pitching, the stress on the metal
> renders
> them unsafe for use. The stresses on metal props are very involved,
> and
> the most insidious of these are harmonic vibrational stresses which
> are
> not detectable through vibrations which can be felt by the pilot.
> Extensively reworked metal props have a history of losing sections
> of
> their blades which can easily result in catastrophic imbalances
> capable
> of tearing the engine completely free of the mount and airframe."
>
>
Larry,
After all of these years I guess we all assume that the extreme danger of
using a cut down or modified metal prop are well know.
With all of the new builders out there that may not be the case.
Thanks for posting this info.
Scott McDaniels
North Plains, OR
These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
| From: | Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com> |
-
Warning... Got carried awy with the length of the post.
-
> As a matter of record, my fuel system is built exactly according to
> plans
> and with Vans parts.
>
> It does exhibit the condition a number of people have mentioned:
> lower
> pressure at higher altitudes during increased angle of attack.
-
I wasn't meaning to imply that any one that had this problem likely had a
non standard fuel system.
All I meant to say was that hundreds are flying "Without" the problem.
It is possible that you have a faulty Facet pump as received from vans,
or that there is a problem with your engine driven pump. I don't really
know.
As I mentioned in my other post, It is important to determine if you
really have a lowering fuel pressure.
This next line is not meant as a slam to any one; certainly not you, but
saying that my airplane is built exactly to Van's plans doesn't mean much
to my unless I can actually look at it.
You have no idea how many pre purchase inspections I have done on RV's
that were "Professionally built", or "show quality", or even "built by an
A&P", that the buyer passed on because of safety (and quality) issues.
All I am meaning to say in a generic sense is that here on the list every
one is an expert, and every one has built a perfect airplane... until you
actually see it.
I hope this doesn't offend anyone, it is just presented as a "something
to think about". I am certainly no expert... I have learned "A Lot"
from many of the other people that are active on the list.
But I have also gotten a lot of practice separating the wheat from the
chafe.
Sorry for the off subject chatter... I am home sick, bored, and have had
that on my mind for a while...Back to the subject...
If you really do have low pressures it would be prudent to find out why.
I don't think this can be blamed on the fuel system. It has proven to be
rather trouble free for many years.
This does not mean that it can't be improved, and any builder that feels
that there is a "better way" they have the right under the experimental
category to do so (except some of the over sea's builders that are bound
by the "original design")
If a builder uses pick up tubes that have a filter screen on them this
should catch any material large enough to clog the boost pump.
The gascolator (or other like devices) will be filtering to a small
enough size that it should prevent clogging of a carb jet .
As a final precaution all carburetors and injection fuel servos have a
very fine filter at the inlet point to catch any small particle that may
have gotten by everything else.
-
>
> I would highly recommend that Vans aircraft invest in upgrading
> their
> current fuel system to a parallel system like the cherokee. It
> would be
> nice to have a factory authorized set of plans for this upgrade.
-
I believe a good part of the reason a Cherokee fuel system is designed
as it is, is because the Facet pump they use will not free flow fuel
through it when it is turned off. It has been a long time since I did
any work on a Cherokee so I might be wrong but this is what I remember.
There are many other certified aircraft that have fuel systems very
similar to an RV. The FAA has not determined from accident data over
many years that these aircraft should be modified (and you can be sure
they would have if data showed it).
This may be considered a lame answer but it is valid.
-
> This would
> improve the safety and redundancy of delivering fuel to the engine.
>
> Granted, there are 2300 RV's flying around and they are not falling
> out of
> the skys, but if this upgrade could save 1 life because of something
> blocking the small facet pump hole, wouldn't it be worth it.
>
> I know engineering is always a matter of trade offs, and if we were
> making
> everything as safe and redundant as could be, the plane would be to
> heavy
> and expensive to get airborne,
>
> However,
>
> In this instance, we can significantly improve safety without adding
> significant time, money, or weight !
>
-
As you alluded too... everything is a trade off.
I am not convinced that with a modification we would "significantly"
improve safety. There are failure modes in everything. If we add a check
valve in parallel around the boost pump it itself could get a piece of
crud stuck in it which could then cause a reverse flow path. Should your
engine drive pump ever fail at in inopportune time, you then would have
a boost pump just pumping fuel in a loop around it self with very little
pressure getting to the carb.
Or a builder could install the check valve backwards and maybe not ever
detect it until the engine driven pump failed. This would give you the
same scenario as above.
Another negative with using a system exactly like the Cherokee is that
you must move the boost pump into the engine compartment. This then
negates the safety gain of having it always primed with cool fuel. I
believe this has probably already saved some RV's. When an RV pilot
experiences a vapor lock engine stoppage it can be caused by the engine
driven pump trying to pump vapor (doesn't work very well).
If the boost pump is in the engine compartment also, it could be
suffering the same problem.
If the boost pump is in the cockpit area you have a chance to purge the
vapor using fuel pressure that can be provided by the boost pump.
So... I guess my position on this is that each builder needs to evaluate
their own skills and abilities in regards to re engineering the fuel
system and then decide for them selves.
No flame intended by the way...
This is just how I happen to feel about it.
Scott McDaniels
North Plains, OR
These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Throttle Quadrant |
Here's a company that makes throttle quadrants for certified aircraft. This
page has two models, the top is for a turbo-prop twin and the bottom would
be suitable for an RV. Let the page load for awhile as there are lots of
pictures.
http://mypage.ihost.com/beechhurst/OEM_Quadrants5.html
Kind of pricey at $450 and there's also a list of options.
Slotted cover $80
Friction Adjustable Knob $50
Longer Throttle Knob $45
The one thing I like the best is the way each lever knob has a different
shape. Once familiar, one would never mistake the prop for the mixture.
Does anyone know of any other throttle quadrants?
I've been waiting for the Infinity people to release their throttle
quadrant. They have been hinting at one "coming soon". I've sent them an
email and will report back when they answer me. Check them out at:
http://www.flash.net/~infaero/
Go down the page about 3/4 and look for the yellow "coming soon" banner on
the left.
Here's their link to their stick grips:
http://www.flash.net/~infaero/infgrip.htm
Very cool grip but $150 dollars each, yikes!
Best wishes for the holidays,
Norman Hunger
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Lightweight Throttle Quadrant |
Check this out for a lightweight, small throttle quadrant. Comes in left or
right offset.
http://mypage.ihost.com/beechhurst/Specialized_Products8.html
At the bottom of the page are all of the drawings to build and install one
of these units.
Norman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Denton Harjehausen <harje(at)proaxis.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Sam James Wing Root Fairings |
I installed them on My -6. They did fit at all. I found out after the
fact they were moulded for the RV-4. With a bunch of cutting and patching
they fit. But it was a lot of work.
Have a great Day!
Denny Harjehausen
Lebanon, OR
RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Krhooper(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | WD-421 Bellcrank Brass Bushing |
Putting together the aileron bellcrank assembly for my RV-8. The brass
bushing fits the metal tube just fine. My problem is the inside diameter is
to small for the AN4-32a bolt. There is to much material for a simple pass
with a drill.
Anyone had this. Any suggestions before I call Van's.
Randy Hooper
Nashville
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott Johnson" <scottjohnson345(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
Hi Scott,
Thanks for taking the time to respond thoughtfully to the low fuel pressure
issue. I appreciate Vans aircraft very much, and the staff that runs it.
Your input has given me things to consider. I am not planning on modifying
my fuel system, because I built it according to Vans plans and I have a high
regard for their engineering.
The plans discuss how you can make a fuel strainer ( cuts in the botton of
the aluminum fuel line pickups ) or optionally you can use the fuel
strainers Vans sells for the fuel pickups. After all this discussion about
blockage, I am beginning to think it might be a safer practice to use the
screen netting over the fuel pickups because it can screen out smaller
particles than the cuts in the aluminum fuel tubing pickups.
I have not seen this issue discussed yet so I am wondering if you or anybody
else has comments on that ?
I am currently building and RV8A so I am always interested in improving my
engineering.
Thanks Again and Happy Holidays !
Scott Johnson RV6A n345RV 150TT, RV8A in progress
----- Original Message -----
From: Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 2:35 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure
>
> -
> Warning... Got carried awy with the length of the post.
> -
> > As a matter of record, my fuel system is built exactly according to
> > plans
> > and with Vans parts.
> >
> > It does exhibit the condition a number of people have mentioned:
> > lower
> > pressure at higher altitudes during increased angle of attack.
> -
> I wasn't meaning to imply that any one that had this problem likely had a
> non standard fuel system.
> All I meant to say was that hundreds are flying "Without" the problem.
> It is possible that you have a faulty Facet pump as received from vans,
> or that there is a problem with your engine driven pump. I don't really
> know.
> As I mentioned in my other post, It is important to determine if you
> really have a lowering fuel pressure.
>
> This next line is not meant as a slam to any one; certainly not you, but
> saying that my airplane is built exactly to Van's plans doesn't mean much
> to my unless I can actually look at it.
> You have no idea how many pre purchase inspections I have done on RV's
> that were "Professionally built", or "show quality", or even "built by an
> A&P", that the buyer passed on because of safety (and quality) issues.
>
> All I am meaning to say in a generic sense is that here on the list every
> one is an expert, and every one has built a perfect airplane... until you
> actually see it.
>
> I hope this doesn't offend anyone, it is just presented as a "something
> to think about". I am certainly no expert... I have learned "A Lot"
> from many of the other people that are active on the list.
> But I have also gotten a lot of practice separating the wheat from the
> chafe.
>
> Sorry for the off subject chatter... I am home sick, bored, and have had
> that on my mind for a while...Back to the subject...
>
> If you really do have low pressures it would be prudent to find out why.
> I don't think this can be blamed on the fuel system. It has proven to be
> rather trouble free for many years.
> This does not mean that it can't be improved, and any builder that feels
> that there is a "better way" they have the right under the experimental
> category to do so (except some of the over sea's builders that are bound
> by the "original design")
>
> If a builder uses pick up tubes that have a filter screen on them this
> should catch any material large enough to clog the boost pump.
> The gascolator (or other like devices) will be filtering to a small
> enough size that it should prevent clogging of a carb jet .
> As a final precaution all carburetors and injection fuel servos have a
> very fine filter at the inlet point to catch any small particle that may
> have gotten by everything else.
> -
> >
> > I would highly recommend that Vans aircraft invest in upgrading
> > their
> > current fuel system to a parallel system like the cherokee. It
> > would be
> > nice to have a factory authorized set of plans for this upgrade.
> -
> I believe a good part of the reason a Cherokee fuel system is designed
> as it is, is because the Facet pump they use will not free flow fuel
> through it when it is turned off. It has been a long time since I did
> any work on a Cherokee so I might be wrong but this is what I remember.
> There are many other certified aircraft that have fuel systems very
> similar to an RV. The FAA has not determined from accident data over
> many years that these aircraft should be modified (and you can be sure
> they would have if data showed it).
>
> This may be considered a lame answer but it is valid.
> -
>
> > This would
> > improve the safety and redundancy of delivering fuel to the engine.
> >
> > Granted, there are 2300 RV's flying around and they are not falling
> > out of
> > the skys, but if this upgrade could save 1 life because of something
> > blocking the small facet pump hole, wouldn't it be worth it.
> >
> > I know engineering is always a matter of trade offs, and if we were
> > making
> > everything as safe and redundant as could be, the plane would be to
> > heavy
> > and expensive to get airborne,
> >
> > However,
> >
> > In this instance, we can significantly improve safety without adding
> > significant time, money, or weight !
> >
> -
> As you alluded too... everything is a trade off.
> I am not convinced that with a modification we would "significantly"
> improve safety. There are failure modes in everything. If we add a check
> valve in parallel around the boost pump it itself could get a piece of
> crud stuck in it which could then cause a reverse flow path. Should your
> engine drive pump ever fail at in inopportune time, you then would have
> a boost pump just pumping fuel in a loop around it self with very little
> pressure getting to the carb.
> Or a builder could install the check valve backwards and maybe not ever
> detect it until the engine driven pump failed. This would give you the
> same scenario as above.
> Another negative with using a system exactly like the Cherokee is that
> you must move the boost pump into the engine compartment. This then
> negates the safety gain of having it always primed with cool fuel. I
> believe this has probably already saved some RV's. When an RV pilot
> experiences a vapor lock engine stoppage it can be caused by the engine
> driven pump trying to pump vapor (doesn't work very well).
> If the boost pump is in the engine compartment also, it could be
> suffering the same problem.
> If the boost pump is in the cockpit area you have a chance to purge the
> vapor using fuel pressure that can be provided by the boost pump.
>
> So... I guess my position on this is that each builder needs to evaluate
> their own skills and abilities in regards to re engineering the fuel
> system and then decide for them selves.
>
> No flame intended by the way...
>
> This is just how I happen to feel about it.
>
>
> Scott McDaniels
> North Plains, OR
> These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
> reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | porterbob(at)juno.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV6a lower cowl/high Country exhaust fit |
I just called Larry Vetterman yesterday and ordered an exhaust system for
my 6A. Larry indicates his current product was made to fit inside the
new cowls. He indicated he did have to adjust his measurements to make
it fit. I told him I had the older polyester cowl and he indicated his
new product will work fine inside the older cowls.
( $595 direct from Vetterman, he pays shipping and supplies all mounting
hardware, gaskets. Also leave your American Express card home as he
does not take credit cards)
bob porter -RV6A Finishing
> > Is this true for both the O-320 and the O-360? I ordered my
> > Vetterman
> > exhaust system from Van's and there was no mention of the exhaust
> > system not
> > fitting the newer S-type cowl. I went ahead on plunked the
> exhaust
> > system
> > on, but haven't begun to fit the cowl yet. I may not be able to
> > send the
> > exhaust back.
> >
> > Bummer.
> >
> -
> Old RV bulders proverb says
>
> "Don't believe everything you read on the RV list" :-)
>
> To be honest... the High Country exhaust has always been quite close
> to
> the cowl on the left side. Even with the old cowl on airplanes
> finished
> in the early 90's.
>
> The systems have occasionaly varied slightly from one to another
> which
> can also sometimes amplify the problem.
>
>
> Scott McDaniels
> North Plains, OR
> These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
> reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
On 27 Dec 99, at 21:04, Scott R McDaniels wrote:
> If I were trouble shooting this type of problem (and the engine
>seemed to be performing normally) I would first connect a temporary
>fuel pressure gage and verify that I see the same type of symptoms
>and pressure readings using the entirely independent gage system.
Good suggestion. I plumbed in a mechanical fuel gauge in parallel
with the VDO transducer. The gauges were calibrated using a water
column (assuming .45 psi per foot of water). The mechanical gauge
read about .5 psi low in the 0-2 psi range.
Altitude Fuel Pressure (mechanical gauge)
0 4.psi (engine driven pump only)
0 4.5 psi (engine driven plus boost pump)
0 3 psi (reading at later time, still on ground)
3000' 3 psi (level flight)
3500' (climbing) 1 psi
6000' (climbing) 1 psi
7500' (slow speed, low fuel flow) 2 psi
7500' (22" MP) 2-3 psi
8000' (level) 2 psi
8000' (level) 4 psi (with boost pump on)
8500' climbing 1/2 psi
9000 level 1 psi
9500' level full power 1.5 psi
9500' lower power level flight test 2 - 2.5 psi
10,000' climbing 1.5 psi
11,000' level 1.5 -2 psi
11,000 level 3 psi (with boost pumpt)
8500 descending 3.5 psi
7000' descending 4.5 psi
EIS fuel pressure indications were similar to what I noted in my earlier
email - generally zero fuel pressure indicated during climbs and above
9000' (with an exception at the slow 9500' test, where the EIS showed
1.3-2.3 psi). Ground tests with the water column indicate that there is
significant hysteresis in the 0-30 PSI VDO transducer, and it
repeatedly gives the same readout for all pressures in the 0 - 1.5 psi
range. This despite our efforts to tape the side of the unit while
changing pressure and while holding various reference pressure
levels. In other words, it can't tell the difference between 0 and 1.3 psi.
Yuk.
Conclusions:
- On my RV-6A with O-360 A1A and Facet fuel pump the fuel pressure
as measured at the mechanical fuel pump output varies from 1 to 4.5
psi as a function of altitude and fuel flow.
- At higher altitudes the pressure is lower, and is lower still when high
power (high fuel flow) is used.
- The 0-30 VDO sender I have is wholly inadequate for this application
> I know that there are hundreds of RV's flying with the stock fuel system
> installed that have steady pressure at all times, in any attitude, and at
> all altitudes.
I wish mine were one of them!
> It is possible that a small # of the Facet pumps have caused pressure
> reductions. Every fuel pressure problem that I have ever worked on was
> either a weak output from the mechanical pump or the pressure instrument
> or sensor was faulty.
I think I've eliminated the sensor problem by calibrating and installing
a mechanical fuel pressure sensor (which looks truly ridiculous duct
taped to the fuselage, but it works great). The mechanical fuel pump
works fine on the ground. Any suggestions on testing it? Any
suggestions on any other tests?
> All of the carb. equipped airplanes at Van's that I fly run pressures
> between 4 - 6 PSI at all times.
>
> My personal RV-6A had a standard fuel system except for a fuel flow
> transducer mounted about 10 inches fwd of the electric boost pump.
> Pressure measured at the carb inlet was always 4 - 6 PSI except in very
> hot PHX summer weather it would sometimes be down to 3 - 4 PSI. But always
> steady and never effected by attitude or altitude.
Do Van's planes have gascolators? I have the ACS gascolator. I'm
looking for more data to try to isolate the problem.
Thanks,
Tim
Thanks,
Tim Lewis
******
Tim Lewis -- Springfield VA
RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
TimRV6A(at)earthlink.net
http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy Lervold" <randyl(at)pacifier.com> |
| Subject: | Re: WD-421 Bellcrank Brass Bushing |
> Putting together the aileron bellcrank assembly for my RV-8. The brass
> bushing fits the metal tube just fine. My problem is the inside diameter
is
> to small for the AN4-32a bolt. There is to much material for a simple
pass
> with a drill.
> Anyone had this. Any suggestions before I call Van's.
>
> Randy Hooper
> Nashville
Randy,
I tell you in the manual that the brass piece needs to be reamed to 3/8".
You can do this either very carefully with a drill bit, some lubricant, and
a vice, or you can do it with a reamer and get a really nice finish inside
of it. If you're new to reamers as I was, you can get them from any tool
supply place, but Avery or Cleaveland is probably the easiest since you're
likely already buying tools there.
Regards,
Randy Lervold
RV-8, #80500
www.pacifier.com/~randyl
Home Wing VAF
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: WD-421 Bellcrank Brass Bushing |
Mine was tight, but I used Marvel Tool Oil and Boelube and it went in. Good
luck.
Rick Jory, Highlands Ranch, 8A QB
-----Original Message-----
From: Krhooper(at)aol.com <Krhooper(at)aol.com>
Date: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 8:59 PM
Subject: RV-List: WD-421 Bellcrank Brass Bushing
>
>Putting together the aileron bellcrank assembly for my RV-8. The brass
>bushing fits the metal tube just fine. My problem is the inside diameter
is
>to small for the AN4-32a bolt. There is to much material for a simple pass
>with a drill.
>Anyone had this. Any suggestions before I call Van's.
>
>Randy Hooper
>Nashville
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "zilik(at)bewellnet.com |
by webmail.bwn.net with SMTP; 29 Dec 1999 05":04:23.-0000(at)matronics.com
| Subject: | Re: WD-421 Bellcrank Brass Bushing |
URL: http://www.bewell.net/
A 0.250" reamer would would work well.
>
> Putting together the aileron bellcrank assembly
for my RV-8. The brass
> bushing fits the metal tube just fine. My
problem is the inside diameter is
> to small for the AN4-32a bolt. There is to much
material for a simple pass
> with a drill.
> Anyone had this. Any suggestions before I call
Van's.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: WD-421 Bellcrank Brass Bushing |
| From: | Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com> |
> > Putting together the aileron bellcrank assembly for my RV-8. The
> brass
> > bushing fits the metal tube just fine. My problem is the inside
> diameter
> is
> > to small for the AN4-32a bolt. There is to much material for a
> simple
> pass
> > with a drill.
> > Anyone had this. Any suggestions before I call Van's.
> >
> > Randy Hooper
> > Nashville
>
>
> Randy,
> I tell you in the manual that the brass piece needs to be reamed to
> 3/8".
-
Woops
It is a AN4 bolt so I think Randy meant 1/4". A .251" or .252" reamer
works well.
Scott McDaniels
North Plains, OR
These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
| From: | Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com> |
> The plans discuss how you can make a fuel strainer ( cuts in the
> botton of
> the aluminum fuel line pickups ) or optionally you can use the fuel
> strainers Vans sells for the fuel pickups. After all this
> discussion about
> blockage, I am beginning to think it might be a safer practice to
> use the
> screen netting over the fuel pickups because it can screen out
> smaller
> particles than the cuts in the aluminum fuel tubing pickups.
-
Actually I think the cuts in the tube are on the top side.
I personally would use the screen type pick up. Either buying the one
from Van's or they would be easy to make your self. My first RV had the
cuts in the tubes but I would do the screens from now on.
>
> I have not seen this issue discussed yet so I am wondering if you or
> anybody
> else has comments on that ?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Garry Legare <versadek(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
Tim, now that you have eliminated gauge error, at this point I would flow test
your fuel system. Undo the fuel line at the inlet connection to the carb and
hook up the inlet side of a high capacity temp fuel pump to the fuel line with
the pumps outlet emptying into a grounded gas can. At full power your engine
will burn a given amount of fuel in an hour, this number is available from the
engine manufacture. Divide this number by 60 to get fuel flow per minute.
Multiply this number by 150% and that's what you should get in your can with the
pump turned on for one minute. If you don't, start removing items from the fuel
system one at a time. Obviously you'll want to put in a temp piece to bridge the
gap left when you remove each piece. If this problem is caused by a restriction
in the system, this will show you where it is. I would start with the Facet
pump. Don't get me wrong, I like these little pumps, but I have found they can
malfunction when even a small amount of debris is present. The secret to living
with the little Facet is filter, not screen, the fuel before it gets to the
pump.
Other thoughts: A faulty flexible fuel line collapsing from the extra suction at
higher fuel flows.
A defective fuel filter element.
A problem with the engine pumps diagram chamber
drain/vent being plugged or having high pressure air forced into it.
Hope this helps you sort this out. Good Luck
Garry LeGare, RV6, flying this spring, hope, hope, hope.
Tim Lewis wrote:
>
> On 27 Dec 99, at 21:04, Scott R McDaniels wrote:
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Brick" <jbrick(at)wolfenet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
What about orientation or location of the fuel tank vents beneath the
fuselage? If pointed forward like the pitot tube, the tanks would get some
increased dynamic pressure. If pointed aft, probably some negative pressure.
Static pressure in the tanks would change with altitude. Pitch attitude
could affect the dynamic pressure due to change in the relative airflow
across the vent opening.
jb
RV-4 fuselage
Tacoma
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gerti Vander Schuur" <gertivs(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon Monoxide Detector |
All the previous traffic assumes we are standing on the ground. At cruise
altitude in particular, CO poisoning becomes much more serious. Alcohol,
smoking, CO poisoning, altitude; each limits the bodies ability to absorb
oxygen. Combine any two and "see" what happens. I said "see" because
reduced visual acuity is one of the first symptoms.
Paul
-----Original Message-----
From: dann mann <aquila33(at)webtv.net>
Date: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 5:31 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Carbon Monoxide Detector
>
>What is the effect of CO if you inhale small amounts. Does it make you
>lose concentration or do you feel euphoric?
>Thanks
>Dan
>
>
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gerti Vander Schuur" <gertivs(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon Monoxide Detector |
The previous traffic assumes we are standing on the ground. CO poisoning is
much more serious at altitude. Alcohol, smoking, CO, altitude; each
restricts the bodies ability to absorb oxygen, Combine any two wouldn't be
fun. For night flyers remember one of the FIRST symptoms is loss of visual
acuity.
Paul
-----Original Message-----
From: dann mann <aquila33(at)webtv.net>
Date: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 5:31 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Carbon Monoxide Detector
>
>What is the effect of CO if you inhale small amounts. Does it make you
>lose concentration or do you feel euphoric?
>Thanks
>Dan
>
>
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy J. Pflanzer" <rpflanze(at)iquest.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dent in skin from dimple die |
Mark,
Don't worry too much about it right now. Unfortunately, this likely won't
be the last dent your bird sees before it is finished. When you are
finishing and painting, you can go around and fix these little mistakes all
at the same time. It's not much trouble to do using any kind of filler. I
found some really light weight stuff at an automobile paint specialty store.
Randy Pflanzer N417G RV-6
"Painting"
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Schrimmer <mschrimmer(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 7:50 PM
Subject: RV-List: Dent in skin from dimple die
>
>Help! While dimpling the hole closest to the leading edge of my horizontal
>stabilizer, the round edge of the die left a dent in the skin. Is there a
>way to fix this?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Mark Schrimmer
>RV9A Tail Kit
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kathy & Bill Peck" <peck(at)amigo.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel systems/pumps |
Just a FWIW comment about the discussion regarding fuel systems with
parallel vs. series (in-line) pumps. Our '79 Warrior II has a fuel system
plumbed like Van's design, as opposed to the "Cherokee style" parallel
systems being discussed. Possibly Piper decided Van was right and changed
somewhere over the years? (Actually, it would really be interesting to hear
from a spam-can builder how they make that decision, what with all the
cost/reliability/liability factors and just plain engineering judgement that
can get thrown into the mix.)
One other item to think about (and this is hearsay, so take it with a grain
of salt) - a friend with a Comanche (that is plumbed with parallel pumps)
has commented that it is recommended to minimize the amount of time the
electric pump is running. This is reportedly because with it powered up,
the mechanical pump doesn't move any fuel, and can get warm and vapor lock
(internally to the pump). That could sure cause an adrenaline surge when
you turned off the boost pump! (like I said, this one's hearsay...)
One thing for sure, though - I know that after this discussion, I'll sure
keep a close eye on my fuel pressure when we get to make that first flight
pretty soon! I sure do appreciate all of you on the list!
Bill & Kathy Peck - RV-6A(Q), just about ready to join you guys reporting on
first flights
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: pneumatic squeezers? |
Bill,
Got mine from Action Air Parts Nov, 20, 98.
106 North Airport Dr.
Port Huron, Michigan 48060
313-364-5885
1 Ea. CP214-c squeezer with longeron yoke & quick change pins.
$330+ 12 UPS= 342.00. This model has a button that allows you to
retract the ram after squeezing.
Larry Mac Donald lm4(at)juno.com
snip
>To those who have purchases pneumatic squeezers
>can you email me and tell me where you got them and how much they
>were.
>Bill
snip
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Keith Marsland" <marsman(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6a lower cowl/high Country exhaust fit |
Bob,
Where are you located? I have the RV6A old cowl. I bought my kit from
another builder. I have not ordered the exhaust yet from Vetterman. Maybe
if you are close to Texas, you might consider a trade of cowls?
Regards,
Keith Marsland
RV6AQB Austin, Tx
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
porterbob(at)juno.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 9:43 PM
Subject: RV-List: Re: RV6a lower cowl/high Country exhaust fit
I just called Larry Vetterman yesterday and ordered an exhaust system for
my 6A. Larry indicates his current product was made to fit inside the
new cowls. He indicated he did have to adjust his measurements to make
it fit. I told him I had the older polyester cowl and he indicated his
new product will work fine inside the older cowls.
( $595 direct from Vetterman, he pays shipping and supplies all mounting
hardware, gaskets. Also leave your American Express card home as he
does not take credit cards)
bob porter -RV6A Finishing
> > Is this true for both the O-320 and the O-360? I ordered my
> > Vetterman
> > exhaust system from Van's and there was no mention of the exhaust
> > system not
> > fitting the newer S-type cowl. I went ahead on plunked the
> exhaust
> > system
> > on, but haven't begun to fit the cowl yet. I may not be able to
> > send the
> > exhaust back.
> >
> > Bummer.
> >
> -
> Old RV bulders proverb says
>
> "Don't believe everything you read on the RV list" :-)
>
> To be honest... the High Country exhaust has always been quite close
> to
> the cowl on the left side. Even with the old cowl on airplanes
> finished
> in the early 90's.
>
> The systems have occasionaly varied slightly from one to another
> which
> can also sometimes amplify the problem.
>
>
> Scott McDaniels
> North Plains, OR
> These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
> reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BumFlyer(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
In a message dated 12/28/99 20:48:49, timrv6a(at)earthlink.net writes:
<<
Do Van's planes have gascolators? I have the ACS gascolator. I'm
looking for more data to try to isolate the problem.
Thanks,
Tim
Thanks,
Tim Lewis >>
That' s a good question! All the Vams carb planes I've seen do have
gascolators.
My plane is O-360 A1A carb and facet, but I do not have a gascolator or fuel
flow sensor. I do see variations (on my direct reader gage) just as you
describe except the excursions in pressures are not as great. Bottom on mine
is about two or three psi. I do have automotive pyrex in line fuel filters
mounted before the selector switch.In normal operation level flight, it is
difficult to note the difference between boost pump on and off pressures
which are less than 1/2 psi, at around 5 to 6.
I am more than willing to argue either side of the gascolator decision, but
even if I had one, I would still use the in line filters upstream of the
selector and pumps.
Let us know the results of the gascolator bypass, as I know you will not be
able to resist testing it.
I am very opinionated on fuel system design. Having read everything I can
get my hands on and listened a lot for the last eight years, it is my
opiniion that van's system is as good as you can get in every respect. It is
simple, elegant, user friendly and trouble free with minimum maintenance. A
fregging idiot could learn to use it in two minutes. Those who have tried to
improve it have invented new ways ot kill themselves. This (usually ) done
in the pursuit of a way of not haveing to switch tanks in flight!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BumFlyer(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
p. s I am going out to fly now and I wll duplicate your profile and get some
readings to compare. Since my field is 5500 feet I will only be able to get
the higher alt readings.
I would be wary of reports from old timers like me, since once you get past
the flight test most people only look at the fuel press when switching tanks,
take off, engine start, etc. and not at all the times you list.
P P PS I am happy you are not treating this as a trivial problem. For what
it's worth, I have observed the engine will indeed run on zero fuel pressure.
Mine is measued at teh output of the mech pump. When I have deliberately
run a tank dry (while watching the fuel pressure like a hawk!) I have been
amazed at how long the engine keeps on ticking smoothly as it empties out
the line and teh carb bowl. If I let it go dry and quit, it takes perhaps 5
seconds to restart after switching. If you switch when the press drops (like
you should) you will achieve a dry tank and no loss of power whatsoever.
Disclaimer. This is not to say I routinely run tanks dry. I do not. It is
an emergency procedure, and should be part of your flight test, at least.
After you land you can fill up and know your useable fuel to a gnats patootie.
D Walsh.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)accessus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
Been watching this thread through many messages. It sounds like an
obstruction to fuel flow. Since the pressure drops with the engine pump but
returns with the tank pump, there is probably an obstruction between the
two. Has the screen in the Gascolator been checked recently???
Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact!
(Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com)
-----Original Message-----
From: BumFlyer(at)aol.com <BumFlyer(at)aol.com>
Date: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 9:18 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Low Fuel Pressure
>
>
>In a message dated 12/28/99 20:48:49, timrv6a(at)earthlink.net writes:
>
><<
>Do Van's planes have gascolators? I have the ACS gascolator. I'm
>looking for more data to try to isolate the problem.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Tim
>
>
>Thanks,
>
>Tim Lewis >>
>
>That' s a good question! All the Vams carb planes I've seen do have
>gascolators.
>
>My plane is O-360 A1A carb and facet, but I do not have a gascolator or
fuel
>flow sensor. I do see variations (on my direct reader gage) just as you
>describe except the excursions in pressures are not as great. Bottom on
mine
>is about two or three psi. I do have automotive pyrex in line fuel filters
>mounted before the selector switch.In normal operation level flight, it is
>difficult to note the difference between boost pump on and off pressures
>which are less than 1/2 psi, at around 5 to 6.
>
>I am more than willing to argue either side of the gascolator decision, but
>even if I had one, I would still use the in line filters upstream of the
>selector and pumps.
>
>Let us know the results of the gascolator bypass, as I know you will not be
>able to resist testing it.
>
>I am very opinionated on fuel system design. Having read everything I can
>get my hands on and listened a lot for the last eight years, it is my
>opiniion that van's system is as good as you can get in every respect. It
is
>simple, elegant, user friendly and trouble free with minimum maintenance.
A
>fregging idiot could learn to use it in two minutes. Those who have tried
to
>improve it have invented new ways ot kill themselves. This (usually ) done
>in the pursuit of a way of not haveing to switch tanks in flight!!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BumFlyer(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
In a message dated 12/28/99 20:31:49, scottjohnson345(at)home.com writes:
Hi Scott,
Thanks for taking the time to respond thoughtfully to the low fuel pressure
issue. I appreciate Vans aircraft very much, and the staff that runs it.
Your input has given me things to consider. I am not planning on modifying
my fuel system, because I built it according to Vans plans and I have a high
regard for their engineering.
The plans discuss how you can make a fuel strainer ( cuts in the botton of
the aluminum fuel line pickups ) or optionally you can use the fuel
strainers Vans sells for the fuel pickups. After all this discussion about
blockage, I am beginning to think it might be a safer practice to use the
screen netting over the fuel pickups because it can screen out smaller
particles than the cuts in the aluminum fuel tubing pickups.
I have not seen this issue discussed yet so I am wondering if you or anybody
else has comments on that ?
>>
I started with the slots which I recall were on the top of the tube, and
switched to the screens. My thinking was not the size of the holes, which
were smaller in the slots, but the area available to pick up fuel in case of
debris, which is greater in the screen.
No matter which you use I would recommend unscrewing the drain and flushing
out every hundred hours to see if you have any sediment or debris and to get
rid of it.
D Walsh
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "IEN YOE" <PAUL.AND.IEN(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon Monoxide Detector |
If anyone is interested there is a LONG article by Linda D. Pendleton, an
expert on hypoxia, etc. and high altitude flying at the AVWeb site.
Log into www.avweb.com, select "Aeromedical Articles" and her article
is titled: "When Humans Fly High". We've been using portable CO detectors
for our club planes for about a year now.....and especially with cold wx
flying and the use of heaters common during this time of the year, having
a detector on board lets us fly with more assurance that the heated air is
not deteriorating our performance as pilots.
Paul Bilodeau
PS The article probably contains more than you wanted to know about
high altitude phenomena....and well worth your time IMHO.
> The previous traffic assumes we are standing on the ground. CO poisoning
is
> much more serious at altitude. Alcohol, smoking, CO, altitude; each
> restricts the bodies ability to absorb oxygen, Combine any two wouldn't
be
> fun. For night flyers remember one of the FIRST symptoms is loss of
visual
> acuity.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: pneumatic squeezers? |
>To those who have purchases pneumatic squeezers in lieu of hand squeezers,
>can you email me and tell me where you got them and how much they were.
>There was a post about Kunkle having them for $195, but that is not the
>case. They are $325 from him and if a better deal is out there I would
like
>to take a look at it. If not, I'll buy his.
$325 is a decent price.
I bought mine for $325 5 years ago. At that time I promised myself (and my
wife) that I'd sell it when the plane was done. It was difficult to part
with it but I did and got $300 for it. Thats a lot of rivets squeezed for
$25...!
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~50 hrs)
Portland, OR
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike.Nellis(at)mcd.com |
| Subject: | Primer/Paint Booth update |
I finished building my basement primer booth the other night and last night I
had a chance to use it for the first time when priming some parts for the
rudder. The finished booth did a nice job of getting rid of the fumes and
keeping them out of the house. The only problem I have is that the basement
window where the exhaust fan is located is near the vent for the kitchen stove
exhaust and, as it turns out, my wife was cooking dinner about the time I was
priming. The kitchen vent was not turned on so some of the odor crept into the
kitchen. Turning on the kitchen exhaust vent kept the odors from getting in.
I also found the answer to my problem with cleaning up my spray gun after
priming. In the past when cleaning up the spray gun, I've had nothing but
problems with the primer "balling up" when trying to clean things. In my
stupidity I thought that Naptha would work just fine since it was a solvent and
cleaned everything else.......wrong. I used basic lacquer thinner this time and
the clean up was a breeze.
Anyway, I've update the web site with pictures and descriptions so feel free to
have a look. After reading it again this morning I realized how late it must
have been last night because there are lots of typos. Please gloss over those
and I'll fix them this evening.
Mike
http://mnellis.jnet.net.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Denny Harjehausen <harje(at)proaxis.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel systems/pumps |
For airplanes with fuel flow indicators, wouldn't flow be down
considerably if the pressure was zero? By that wouldn't they have some
relationship in the below exceptable numbers of pressure?
Have a good day!
Denny Harjehausen
RV-6 EAA 1183 OR.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fesenbek, Gary" <fesenbek(at)marykay.com> |
| Subject: | Sam James Wing Root Fairing |
I have the root fairing & I cannot determine a acceptable way to put on the
aircraft. Screws pucker too much & I want a easy way to check below at
annual time so
permanent mount is unacceptable also.....any ideas????
I purchased the Sam James Wing Root Fairing and installed it on my 6A.
While the fairings are quite well made they are as was mentioned made for
the RV4. There was a mark on the fairing for the place to cut a V in the
fairing to fit it on the RV6/6A. On mine this mark was on very near the
main spar. I did not cut mine there though. The fairing fit pretty well
up to the point on the rear spar of the fuselage. On the 6/6A this is the
point where the fuselage starts to taper back. This is the point that I
cut the V and I got a fairly good fit. The very aft portion where the
fairing trails out I got an okay fit. I don't think you could get a much
better fit without plenty of cutting and remolding. Make sure you have a
real heat gun. A hair dryer won't be of much use in some of the bending
that you will have to do. It is definitely the case this is not a part that
you will just take out of the box and bolt on to the airplane. I used
mostly number 8 screws with nutplates to attach the fairing. I only
attached the fairing to the fuselage and left it free to move on the wing.
As far as inspection goes. I installed mine so that I could easily remove
the lower side fasteners and the fairing will flex some so that you can
check the fuel vent line and the sender and fuel line. The only other thing
I can think that you would want to inspect would be the rear spar attach
bolt. This will be more difficult and in my installation I will have to
take many fasteners off to get to where I can see that bolt. I'll only
check it at annual time though.
A local (at that time) RV builder showed me the fairing that he made himself
and when he went through all he did with the clay molding and tube-sanding
and what not. Well... the next day I ordered the Sam James fairing. Until
someone else creates a fairing that is custom fit for the 6/6A, I think the
Sam James fairing is a workable solution.
Just FYI,
Gary Fesenbek
N152
RV6A
Dallas, TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <bskinner(at)vcn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowling Question |
>To those who have finished their cowling (RV-6), is it necessary to have
>the exhaust system installed on the engine in order to fit the cowling
>to the fuselage?
>Ken Harrill
>RV-6
>South Carolina
Ken,
I would have the exhaust system installed before fitting the cowl scoop to
the bottom cowl. The old style Vetterman exhaust is kind of a tight fit and
the cowl scoop can be postioned for best clearance of the exhaust pipes AND
cabin heat muffs. It sounds like the newer Vetterman exhaust system is
designed to fit the new "S" cowl a little better.
Bob Skinner Buffalo, WY (1995 RV6 sold after 4 years & 470 hrs) EAA
Tech Counselor # 3726
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <bskinner(at)vcn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: R & R the RV6a lower cowl -how?? |
>
>Ho, ho, ho!
>
>How do I remove and refit the lower cowl without a helper??? Ho, ho, ho huh?
>
>Since my air scoop has not yet been glassed on, why not put it on with
>screws my helper asked. Then I could, all by my lonesome, get at
>carburetor, air filter etc etc just by removing 25 or 30 screws.
>
>Has anyone done this? Anyone see any downsides? Will my plane spin
violently?
>
>hal
Hi, Hal,
If you wish to remove and re-install your bottom cowl without the
attendant dings in the paint, I would recommend a helper. Making the cowl
scoop removable seems like a lot of extra work for not much gain. You
increase weight and build time. You have more fiberglass to machine
countersink which, on the new cowls, is a problem due to the thin material.
Just gaining access to the FAB box and part of the carb would not justify
the extra work, to me. On your initial 50-100 hours, I'm sure you will
want to have the lower cowl completely removed for detailed inspection.
Just being able to access the FAB box is not that much of an advantage
because the filter element doesn't need much attention.
A few tips to make the bottom cowl easier to remove. I made removable,
lower cowl-horizontal baffles that are attached to the lower horizontal
engine baffles with a couple of 6 screws, each. I also attached only the
top portion of the baffle seal material to the FAB airbox. The "U" portion
of the seal material was attached to the curved portion of the cowl inlet
that you fabricate. This eleminates trying to get the cowl on while
fighting the seal material on the airbox.
Bob Skinner Buffalo, WY (1995 RV6 sold after 4 years & 470 hrs) EAA
Tech Counselor # 3726
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <rv8er(at)home.com> |
I noticed that my airbox was already cut to the length shown on the plans,
so I didn't cut it. Well, after I finished it, and put the cowl on, there
is about a 1" gap between the scoop and the front of the airbox. How the
heck am I going to glass in the tunnel to the airbox now? Should I just use
the existing tunnel that is on the scoop?
Paul Besing
RV-6A (197AB) Arizona
http://members.home.net/rv8er
Finish Kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | empennage fairing mold |
| From: | "Louis Cappucci" <N32LC(at)worldnet.att.net> |
listers (and bob skinner in particular)
does anyone out there have a male mold for the empennage fairing which they
would be willing to loan to me?
a while back, bob skinner posted that he might have one to be passed around
from one builder to the next, as is commonly done with jigs, etc.
bob, if you are out there, is it available? i tried mailing direct to
"bskinr(at)trib.com" but got bounced
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TRAASHMAN(at)webtv.net (Joe Waltz) |
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Pressure |
Interesting thread.
I have an Airflow Perf. injected system and their pump package is
plumbed parallel as some have suggested for the Facet set up. The pump
is inside the aircraft (-8) per the plans however I moved the provided
filter (no gascolator) to just below the Andair fuel selector. Factory
plans show it mounted vertically on the front side of the gear tower but
that requires a lot of reversals and difficult servicing. I was able to
get a straight line from filter out, through the elec. pump to the
firewall fitting.
BTW, I was wondering about the people with the pressure problems and how
many 90 degree AN fittings they have in their system. Each of these
turns restricts the flow somewhat and can add up if you have a lot of
them. I have been advised and have elected to use "full flow" fittings
where ever able. These are the ones that look like a piece of tubing
between the flared end and the tube end. ACS only sells the 45 & 90
degree version but the Aeroquip AQP line has 45,90,135 & 180 degree
versions. These are available from Summit Racing with the AQP hose
being the same as Aero 601 or Stratoflex 156. Someone else mentioned
Earl's racing hose & fittings as being used and these are also available
with the variety of full flow fittings.
Hope my orders stay in the computer over the 1st. Anybody using Y2K in
their tail number?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TRAASHMAN(at)webtv.net (Joe Waltz) |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel flow transducer mounting |
Similar problem with the VM-1000. I'm mounting it in a fuel injected
setup. They say to mount the supplied "Flowscan" fuel flow transducer
in a horizontal orientation on the metered side of the fuel controller
at least 5 inches downstream from any flow disturbing connections (i.e.
90 deg. AN fittings). I have a forward facing fuel controller and the
metered #4 line comes out the right side via a 90 deg. banjo fitting and
goes up between the #3 & #4 cylinders, through the inter-cylinder baffle
and then into the fuel distribution can. No horizontal runs available.
I called the Vision Microsystem and Flowscan people and found them
helpful but they confirmed the need for a horizontal application. VM
e-mailed me a picture of a certified application inline in the hose
between the eng. pump and the fuel controller (as opposed to their
instructions to place it downstream from the controller).
Does anyone with an injected engine have any experience with this setup?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TRAASHMAN(at)webtv.net (Joe Waltz) |
| Subject: | Re: Throttle Quadrant |
I've got two Infinity grips in my 8 and they do a great job of providing
a good feeling grip with lots of usefull switches available to declutter
the panel and give easier access. Be sure to factor in the price of
switches in your decision.
They have been working on the throttle for a long time. When I called
him he said that it's only $20,000 away from reality. Whenever he gets
an investor or the money he can do it. He measures progress in $ not
time.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TRAASHMAN(at)webtv.net (Joe Waltz) |
| Subject: | Re: Throttle Quadrant |
Nice looking quadrant but I agree on it being a little pricey. Really,
all the Vans model needs is better grips. The round knobs are very
basic and don't provide a different feel for the different controls like
a stock plane. Anyone know where to get some better knobs?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TRAASHMAN(at)webtv.net (Joe Waltz) |
| Subject: | Re: WD-421 Bellcrank Brass Bushing |
Drill it out to proper size with multiple size drills. Use a reamer for
final sizing if you have one.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Oregon Aero Seats |
pcondon(at)csc.com writes:
<< I rejected the Oregon Aero product because of the WEIGHT & COST. They
weighed
over 4x the seats from DJ Lorxxxxxxxxx.
>>
I built my own from 3 layers of Temperfoam for the bottoms, one layer of
Sunmate over sculpted 3" medium-density poly foam for the backs, upholstered
by a friend using some fuzzy and somewhat heavy upholsterers fabric...
moderately expensive overall, but quite comfortable.
My A&P has expressed disapproval of the heft of these seat cushions, and I
find that the two bottoms and backs weigh a total of 7 lbs, IIRC. How does
this stack up against DJ's seats? Would appreciate real numbers for
comparison.
Bill B
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Carbon Monoxide Detector |
In a message dated 12/28/1999 10:09:06 PM Eastern Standard Time,
jorear(at)mari.net writes:
<< Gotta add that the hemoglobin is then unable to rid itself of the CO like
it
does CO2.
>>
Well, not quite. CO2 is not transported on the hemoglobin molecule, rather
dissolved in the plasma. Being unable to shed the CO makes the Hgb
unavailable for oxygen transport, its primary job, so eventually you die. So
who cares, really. Point is, we should all have CO detection in our
airplanes, and I need to quit preachin' and order mine!
Bill B
________________________________________________________________________________
Hi R Vers
I have an RV-6A
for sale. must sell to finish my two other projects, an RV6 and
RV-3B. It is a VFR aircraft. 330 hrs.on 1st. run engine built by Don George
of Orlando.For particulars call Tom Benton 561-466-3536 S.E. Florida.
$48,000 regards
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dgmurray" <dgmurray(at)telusplanet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: airbox length |
Subject: RV-List: airbox length
>I noticed that my airbox was already cut to the length shown on the plans,
>so I didn't cut it. Well, after I finished it, and put the cowl on, there
>is about a 1" gap between the scoop and the front of the airbox. How the
>heck am I going to glass in the tunnel to the airbox now? Should I just
use
>the existing tunnel that is on the scoop?
>
>Paul Besing
>RV-6A (197AB) Arizona
>http://members.home.net/rv8er
>Finish Kit
Paul - In with your air box/ filter kit there should be a pink foam block
that is almost the size of a brick. File or cut it to fit into the inside of
the scoop behind the air intake. Stick it in with bondo. Put your lower cowl
on and file out the center so that every thing lines up nice. Fiberglas the
inside of the hole to extend the scoop and then chisel out the foam block
when it has set up. Van should have included the instructions with the air
box.
Hope this helps.
Doug Murray RV-6 Cutting foam of the seats.
Southern Alberta
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Terry Jantzi <tjantzi(at)netrover.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel flow transducer mounting |
Joe Waltz wrote:
>
>
> Similar problem with the VM-1000. I'm mounting it in a fuel injected
> setup. They say to mount the supplied "Flowscan" fuel flow transducer
> in a horizontal orientation on the metered side of the fuel controller
> at least 5 inches downstream from any flow disturbing connections (i.e.
> 90 deg. AN fittings). I have a forward facing fuel controller and the
> metered #4 line comes out the right side via a 90 deg. banjo fitting and
> goes up between the #3 & #4 cylinders, through the inter-cylinder baffle
> and then into the fuel distribution can. No horizontal runs available.
>
> I called the Vision Microsystem and Flowscan people and found them
> helpful but they confirmed the need for a horizontal application. VM
> e-mailed me a picture of a certified application inline in the hose
> between the eng. pump and the fuel controller (as opposed to their
> instructions to place it downstream from the controller).
>
> Does anyone with an injected engine have any experience with this setup?
>
I have a Shadin fuel flow setup on my injected engine. I didn't want to
run the -4 line out of the fuel controller up between the cylinders. I
ran a length of hose aft and straight up to the rear baffle. I mounted
the tranducer on a custom bulkhead fitting high on the rear baffle. The
-4 hose is connected to the transducer with a 90 degree elbow. Its not
supposed to work .... but it does. I am getting about 1% accuracy from
fillup to fillup. Early on in the flight testing phase I was getting
occasional very high readings. I suspected there was vapor bubbles
forming in either the elbow or tranducer and then collapsing when
flowing into the much cooler enviroment on top of the engine during
flight. I installed a small blast cooling tube to the transducer about
525 hours ago and the problem hasn't re-surfaced. I purchased a 45
degree steel fitting many moons ago just in case the additional cooling
didn't solve the problem.
Terry Jantzi
RV-6 C-GZRV
Kitchener, ON
--
http://www.netrover.com/~tjantzi/terry/
http://exn.ca/FlightDeck/Aviators/AviationCockpit.cfm?ID=19991021-52
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Throttle Quadrant |
As far as grips are concerned, using Van's standard quadrant, I took a scrap
piece of 3/4 inch aluminum tubing left over from fabricating a control
pushrod and make a fairly decent looking throttle handle. Put a cap in the
end and you've got a place for an extra switch for something as well. Rivet
a platenut to the existing aluminum throttle lever, drill a hole in the
underside of the new handle and away you go.
-Don
RV-8 NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
| Subject: | Aeroelectric wiring question |
Listers,
Did any of you wire your planes according to drawing Z-1 in the Aeroelectric
Connection? If so, how did you wire the silicon rectifier diode depicted in
drawing Z-1? I can see that I should run a wire from the "+" terminal on
the diode assembly to the essential bus, but (a) where does the wire from
the battery contactor connect, and (b) does the diagram depict a jumper
across the remaining two terminals?
Steve Soule
Didn't take circuit diagram reading in high school (but now wish I had)
RV-6A panel stuff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <rv8er(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: airbox length |
I know about this, and have seen it done on the Orndorff tapes...the problem
is that there is not enough room between the box and the scoop to fiberglass
in a scoop and use the airseal fabric. As it sits now, there is barely
enough room to put the airseal fabric on. Looks like some creative
fiberglass work is going to have to take place.
Paul Besing
RV-6A (197AB) Arizona
http://members.home.net/rv8er
Finish Kit
----- Original Message -----
From: "dgmurray" <dgmurray(at)telusplanet.net>
Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 12:58 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: airbox length
>
> Subject: RV-List: airbox length
>
>
> >I noticed that my airbox was already cut to the length shown on the
plans,
> >so I didn't cut it. Well, after I finished it, and put the cowl on,
there
> >is about a 1" gap between the scoop and the front of the airbox. How the
> >heck am I going to glass in the tunnel to the airbox now? Should I just
> use
> >the existing tunnel that is on the scoop?
> >
> >Paul Besing
> >RV-6A (197AB) Arizona
> >http://members.home.net/rv8er
> >Finish Kit
>
>
> Paul - In with your air box/ filter kit there should be a pink foam block
> that is almost the size of a brick. File or cut it to fit into the inside
of
> the scoop behind the air intake. Stick it in with bondo. Put your lower
cowl
> on and file out the center so that every thing lines up nice. Fiberglas
the
> inside of the hole to extend the scoop and then chisel out the foam block
> when it has set up. Van should have included the instructions with the
air
> box.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> Doug Murray RV-6 Cutting foam of the seats.
> Southern Alberta
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle) |
| Subject: | Cable Length Question... |
Hi Listers,
I'm working on the engine controls on my RV-4 and have a question
regarding cable lengths. I am mounting the Mixture control and Prop
control on bulkhead F402BL and am wondering if anyone could give me the
cable length requirements for each of these? The engine is Van's
O360A1A with standard carb and either a Woodward or McCauley rear
mounted prop governor. I don't have the engine mounted yet but would
like to purchase the Mixture and Prop Vernier controls. ACS shows the
A-750 in standard lengths of 3'/4'/5'/6'/7'/8'. Will one of these work
or do I need a 'special' length?
Thanks for the help,
Matt Dralle
RV-4 Builder #1763
--
Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <tcwatson(at)seanet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Throttle Quadrant |
----- Original Message -----
From: Joe Waltz <TRAASHMAN(at)webtv.net>
Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 10:35 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Throttle Quadrant
>
> Nice looking quadrant but I agree on it being a little pricey. Really,
> all the Vans model needs is better grips. The round knobs are very
> basic and don't provide a different feel for the different controls like
> a stock plane. Anyone know where to get some better knobs?
>
I hesitate to mention this, 'cause it's from a game controller, but ...
Sytech of England sells a throttle quadrant for flight simulators that is
quite exceptional in its ergonomics. It is big, angled to fit the hand
comfortably, and is loaded with switches, buttons, and knobs. I have toyed
with the idea of taking the grip off of it and putting it on a more
conventional throttle quadrant built for a real airplane, not a game
controller. But I am a long ways away from needing one, and I figure one of
these companies like Infinity will have one by the time I get ready for it.
Has anyone else seen this thing?
Terry Watson
RV-8A wings (tank sealing)
Seattle
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | donspawn(at)juno.com |
| Subject: | Dash layout technique |
>>Next step was to make a life-size cardboard dash template, and then
>play "paper dolls" until we like the arrangement. Lightly tape the
>instruments in place, then install the entire dash in the fuselage & sit
in it &
>make airplane noises.
I used Reamit Tech Co. to watercut the panel for $30.00
They have a web at
Chuck Rearic .or. Kevin wright
817-461-8048
FAX = 8049
Arlington, Tx
Don Jordan ~ 6A fuselage ~ Arlington,Tx ~ donspawn(at)juno.com
******************************************************************************
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: airbox length |
| From: | n5lp <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
>
>I know about this, and have seen it done on the Orndorff tapes...the problem
>is that there is not enough room between the box and the scoop to fiberglass
>in a scoop and use the airseal fabric. As it sits now, there is barely
>enough room to put the airseal fabric on. Looks like some creative
>fiberglass work is going to have to take place.
>
Cut off as much of the airbox nose as necessary to make it work.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Skinner <bskinner(at)vcn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: empennage fairing mold |
>
>listers (and bob skinner in particular)
>
>does anyone out there have a male mold for the empennage fairing which they
>would be willing to loan to me?
>
>a while back, bob skinner posted that he might have one to be passed around
>from one builder to the next, as is commonly done with jigs, etc.
>
>bob, if you are out there, is it available? i tried mailing direct to
>"bskinr(at)trib.com" but got bounced
Louis,
Yes, we had one. I have no idea where it is. One builder shipped it to
the next and the last person to receive the mold never sent it back & I
don't know who it was. I posted to the list awhile back to try & locate it
but received no response. What is the saying, "no good deed goes unpunished"?
If some lister would devote their fairing to the cause and allow it to be
used for a mold, everyone else could receive credit for their Van's
fairing. Better yet, Van's could supply an epoxy, one layer laminate
fairing that builders could use to obtain a better fit.
I did have another mold but trash-canned it. Got tired of F.G.:)
Bob Skinner Buffalo, WY (1995 RV6 sold after 4 years & 470 hrs) EAA
Tech Counselor # 3726
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <rv8er(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: empennage fairing mold |
Are you saying that you would make the mold if someone donated it? I have
not yet touched mine, and would be willing to donate mine for the cause,
especially if I ended up with a better fairing.
Paul Besing
RV-6A (197AB) Arizona
http://members.home.net/rv8er
Finish Kit
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Skinner" <bskinner(at)vcn.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 4:39 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: empennage fairing mold
>
> >
> >listers (and bob skinner in particular)
> >
> >does anyone out there have a male mold for the empennage fairing which
they
> >would be willing to loan to me?
> >
> >a while back, bob skinner posted that he might have one to be passed
around
> >from one builder to the next, as is commonly done with jigs, etc.
> >
> >bob, if you are out there, is it available? i tried mailing direct to
> >"bskinr(at)trib.com" but got bounced
>
> Louis,
>
> Yes, we had one. I have no idea where it is. One builder shipped it to
> the next and the last person to receive the mold never sent it back & I
> don't know who it was. I posted to the list awhile back to try & locate
it
> but received no response. What is the saying, "no good deed goes
unpunished"?
> If some lister would devote their fairing to the cause and allow it to
be
> used for a mold, everyone else could receive credit for their Van's
> fairing. Better yet, Van's could supply an epoxy, one layer laminate
> fairing that builders could use to obtain a better fit.
> I did have another mold but trash-canned it. Got tired of F.G.:)
>
December 23, 1999 - December 30, 1999
RV-Archive.digest.vol-hp