RV-Archive.digest.vol-iw

July 12, 2000 - July 19, 2000



      
      --
      Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE
      Network Administrator
      Union Safe Deposit Bank
      209-946-5116
      
                      -----Original Message-----
                      From:        Scott R McDaniels [mailto:smcdaniels(at)juno.com]
                      Sent:        Tuesday, July 11, 2000 8:03 PM
                      To:        rv-list(at)matronics.com
                      Subject:        RV-List: Re: Van's Aircraft Homecoming
      
      
      
      
                      Dave,
      
                      First of all we weren't there for the forum (s?) because of
      weather just
                      like Rion said.
      
                      As for the demonstrators being there... the only one you
      would have seen
                      before 11:00 AM was the RV-8A because it had been left there
      over night.
                      We pushed the RV-9A and the RV-6A into our display area at
      11:00 AM.
      
                      I think you must have misunderstood the info you got.  We
      did not "blow
                      off" the Forum  (I actually enjoy doing them).  You probably
      talked to
                      Rob, one of the newest guys at Van's (or if not then it
      wasn't a Van's
                      employee that you talked to because he was the only one
      there until
                      11:00AM).
      
                      I wish you had just come by the booth later in the day and
      personally
                      asked Tom or I what happened.  Regardless of what you think,
      everyone at
                      Van's takes our participation in fly ins seriously.  Check
      us out at OSH
                      some time.  We are at the tent longer hours than probably
      any other kit
                      vendor (sometimes until 7:00 PM, 2 hours past normal closing
      time).  We
                      give more "Free" demo rides than anyone.  We spend countless
      hours in the
                      sun giving everyone wanting to, a chance to "Try -on" one or
      all of the
                      airplanes on display, and talking non stop all day until we
      just about
                      lose our voice.
      
                      As for the Lycoming forum that I was supposed to do?????????
                      Seeing this in the archives was the first I had ever heard
      of it.
                      You must be mistaken me for another Scott, because I was
      never contacted
                      by anyone about doing a Lycoming engine forum.
      
                      About your orig. question, The fly-in is still planed for
      our new
                      facility at Aurora.  We are not yet moved in (should start
      in a week or
                      two) but since the fly-in is still about 7 weeks away we
      hope to be all
                      settled in by then.
      
                                                      
                      Scott McDaniels  
                      North Plains, OR
                      These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
                      reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
      
      
              
              
              
              
      
                      
      
      
      
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2000
From: Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net>
Subject: FAR Part 43, Appendix D
Ok, I give up. I've tried to find the text of that Appendix (or even the whole FAR) on the net! Where is it hiding? Seems to be important if one has to sign his name that one has done a condition inspection in accordance of the scope and detail of that Appendix. Finn Why pay for something you could get for free? ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2000
From: Charlie Kuss <chaskuss(at)miami.gdi.net>
Subject: Re: Locating parts for my air drill
> << Listers, > After 3 years, my Cleco air drill has started acting up. I need a new > seal for the throttle valve. I really like this drill. I need to find a > web site or snail mail address for Cleco Pneumatic. snipped > > CLECO Air Tool is now part of the Cooper Tools (Dotco, Buckeye,Rockwell) Air > Tool Family. You can call one of the below numbers and someone should be > able to connect you to a distributor or authorized repair center in your > area: > > ATLANTA > Ph: 770-446-0368 > Fax: 770-446-9630 > snipped Mr. Brown, Thank you for your help. I will certainly keep you in mind regarding future tool purchases. I had managed to discover that Cleco Air Tool was part of Cooper Industries yesterday on my own. Unfortunately, there was no web page for the Cleco Air Tool division. I did manage to contact them via email though. I called them a few minutes ago and spoke to Susan at the Atlanta office. She knew who I was immediately. She had been trying to fax me the needed info. Naturally, I was online looking for info. My computer and fax machine share a phone line. I now have the information I needed. That phone number really expedited matters. Thanks again. Charlie Kuss RV-8 wings Boca Raton, Fl. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Date: Jul 12, 2000
Subject: Re: IFR
A good engine *(multi-point) monitor ( GEM-INSIGHT,allegro,JPI). An engine monitor was moved up to my #1 purchase in my "'avionics"' pannel. Its insurance on the large ticket item in the plane ( My Butt & the engine)..........no kidding...... billshook(at)mindspring.com on 07/12/2000 10:40:12 AM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RV-List: IFR I am not an IFR pilot, however I have always intended to be once the plane is done and my financial status recovers. In any event, after a discussion with a friend of mine yesterday I have come to the conclusion that I do need light IFR capability in my RV-4 to fill its mission requirements. Not being IFR trained myself as of yet, I need to know from those with more knowledge than myself what exactly I NEED to have. I intend to have a Garmin 295 (or it's equivelant by that time) in the cockpit for normal navigation. Navaid wing leveler has always been on the list of necessities as well. In addition to that I am leaning in the direction of an Apollo SL-30 with it's matching GS indicator, Micro encoder as my Mode C, electric horizon and DG, and the completion of the six pack. Depressing that I can't go with the glass type instruments I really want... So, am I missing anything here? Thanks Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2000
Subject: Re: Rudder Cables
From: Don Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com>
Jerry: We do not have return springs on the rudder. THe cables attach at the rear & at the front. You can built new (front srtapes) to move your pettles if needed. You may want to spend the $55.00 & get van's pre-plains & instructions. It would be like a service manuel & parts detail on a certified. Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com ********************************************** writes: > > Hello all, > I purchased my RV already built and am ready to have the > annual inspection > Where is, or what is the proper adjustment of ,the rudder > cables..Are there > turn buckles? Where are they located? > Please email me direct and I want to have this adjustment > done tomorrow. > > Thanks Jerry Bryan > RV6 > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DWENSING(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 12, 2000
Subject: Re: lowering the air scoop on my RV-6A
In a message dated 7/11/00 2:29:43 PM Central Daylight Time, pcondon(at)csc.com writes: << Be sure the bolts and nuts that stick out below the filter can fit also....... >> What nuts and bolts are below the filter? Dale ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com>
Subject: Room at OSH available
Date: Jul 11, 2000
I've been forced to cancel my trip to OSH so the room I was going to stay in will be available. Its at someone's home, a room with a queen bed. The home has centeral air. Haven't stayed there before but they sound like nice folks on the phone. Anyone interested give them a call: Sharon Hawkins 920-232-8554 If someone grabs it please let me know. Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~100 hrs) Portland, OR http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
Subject: Re: FAR Part 43, Appendix D
Date: Jul 12, 2000
Here it is!!!! Courtesy of the Bellanca-Champion Club APPENDIX D TO PART 43 - SCOPE AND DETAIL OF ITEMS (AS APPLICABLE TO THE PARTICULAR AIRCRAFT) TO BE INCLUDED IN ANNUAL AND 100-HOUR INSPECTIONS (a) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall, before that inspection, remove or open all necessary inspection plates, access doors, fairing, and cowling. He shall thoroughly clean the aircraft and aircraft engine. (b) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall inspect (where applicable) the following components of the fuselage and hull group: (1) Fabric and skin - for deterioration, distortion, other evidence of failure, and defective or insecure attachment of fittings. (2) Systems and components - for improper installation, apparent defects, and unsatisfactory operation. (3) Envelope, gas bags, ballast tanks, and related parts - for poor condition. (c) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall inspect (where applicable) the following components of the cabin and cockpit group: (1) Generally - for uncleanliness and loose equipment that might foul the controls. (2) Seats and safety belts - for poor condition and apparent defects. (3) Windows and windshields - for deterioration and breakage. (4) Instruments - for poor condition, mounting, marking, and (where practicable) improper operation. (5) Flight and engine controls - for improper installation and improper operation. (6) Batteries - for improper installation and improper charge. (7) All systems - for improper installation, poor general condition, apparent and obvious defects, and insecurity of attachment. (d) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall inspect (where applicable) components of the engine and nacelle group as follows: (1) Engine section - for visual evidence of excessive oil, fuel, or hydraulic leaks, and sources of such leaks. (2) Studs and nuts - for improper torquing and obvious defects. (3) Internal engine - for cylinder compression and for metal particles or foreign matter on screens and sump drain plugs. If there is weak cylinder compression, for improper internal condition and improper internal tolerances. (4) Engine mount - for cracks, looseness of mounting, and looseness of engine to mount. (5) Flexible vibration dampeners - for poor condition and deterioration. (6) Engine controls - for defects, improper travel, and improper safetying. (7) Lines, hoses, and clamps - for leaks, improper condition and looseness. (8) Exhaust stacks - for cracks, defects, and improper attachment. (9) Accessories - for apparent defects in security of mounting. (10) All systems - for improper installation, poor general condition, defects, and insecure attachment. (11) Cowling - for cracks, and defects. (e) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall inspect (where applicable) the following components of the landing gear group: (1) All units - for poor condition and insecurity of attachment. (2) Shock absorbing devices - for improper oleo fluid level. (3) Linkages, trusses, and members - for undue or excessive wear fatigue, and distortion. (4) Retracting and locking mechanism - for improper operation. (5) Hydraulic lines - for leakage. (6) Electrical system - for chafing and improper operation of switches. (7) Wheels - for cracks, defects, and condition of bearings. (8) Tires - for wear and cuts. (9) Brakes - for improper adjustment. (10) Floats and skis - for insecure attachment and obvious or apparent defects. (f) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall inspect (where applicable) all components of the wing and center section assembly for poor general condition, fabric or skin deterioration, distortion, evidence of failure, and insecurity of attachment. (g) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall inspect (where applicable) all components and systems that make up the complete empennage assembly for poor general condition, fabric or skin deterioration, distortion, evidence of failure, insecure attachment, improper component installation, and improper component operation. (h) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall inspect (where applicable) the following components of the propeller group: (1) Propeller assembly - for cracks, nicks, binds, and oil leakage. (2) Bolts - for improper torquing and lack of safetying. (3) Anti-icing devices - for improper operations and obvious defects. (4) Control mechanisms - for improper operation, insecure mounting, and restricted travel. (i) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall inspect (where applicable) the following components of the radio group: (1) Radio and electronic equipment - for improper installation and insecure mounting. (2) Wiring and conduits - for improper routing, insecure mounting, and obvious defects. (3) Bonding and shielding - for improper installation and poor condition. (4) Antenna including trailing antenna - for poor condition, insecure mounting, and improper operation. (j) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall inspect (where applicable) each installed miscellaneous item that is not otherwise covered by this listing for improper installation and improper operation. Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact! (Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Finn Lassen" <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2000 10:35 AM Subject: RV-List: FAR Part 43, Appendix D > > Ok, I give up. I've tried to find the text of that Appendix (or even the > whole FAR) on the net! > > Where is it hiding? > > Seems to be important if one has to sign his name that one has done a > condition inspection in accordance of the scope and detail of that > Appendix. > > Finn > > > Why pay for something you could get for free? > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: lowering the air scoop on my RV-6A
Date: Jul 11, 2000
> The clearance problem I have is with the left exhaust > tube running very close to the cowl as it passes by the > scoop. I have Robin's heat muff installed on this pipe > and my clearance is about 3/8" from the cowl. I have SS > tape stuck on the cowl to help reflect the heat. Another good reason to offset the scoop if at all possible. But if its too late for that, there is a pretty easy fix. Rotate the pipes -- left side CW, right side CCW. This will give you more clearance with the scoop and bottom of the firewall. The negative is that the turndowns will end up toed in. I had the same clearance problem and adjusted the hangars so the muff wouldn't chafe on the cowl, but instead the pipes chafed on the bottom of the firewall and almost wore through (the pipes) before I caught it. I rotated the pipes and cut them off and put on some extensions, and was able to reorient them pointing aft. Vetterman has some nice extensions with less of a turndown that allegedly provide less drag/more thrust anyway, so there was a silver lining to the whole thing. Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~100 hrs) Portland, OR http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
Subject: Re: FAR Part 43, Appendix D
Date: Jul 12, 2000
It is hiding at ... http://www.faa.gov/avr/AFS/FARS/far-43.txt But I got mine from an Avantext CD! Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact! (Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Finn Lassen" <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2000 10:35 AM Subject: RV-List: FAR Part 43, Appendix D > > Ok, I give up. I've tried to find the text of that Appendix (or even the > whole FAR) on the net! > > Where is it hiding? > > Seems to be important if one has to sign his name that one has done a > condition inspection in accordance of the scope and detail of that > Appendix. > > Finn > > > Why pay for something you could get for free? > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2000
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: Re: FAR Part 43, Appendix D
> >Ok, I give up. I've tried to find the text of that Appendix (or even the >whole FAR) on the net! > >Where is it hiding? http://www.faa.gov/avr/AFS/FARS/far-43.txt Bob . . . -------------------------------------------- ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) ( and still understand nothing. ) ( C.F. Kettering ) -------------------------------------------- http://www.aeroelectric.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com>
Subject: lowering the air scoop on my RV-6A
Date: Jul 12, 2000
There are long AN-3 bolts that hold the K&N air filter assembly to the air box and carburetor. The bolts and nuts protrude about 1/4 to 1/2 inch below the air filter inside the air box. Steve Soule -----Original Message----- In a message dated 7/11/00 2:29:43 PM Central Daylight Time, pcondon(at)csc.com writes: << Be sure the bolts and nuts that stick out below the filter can fit also....... >> What nuts and bolts are below the filter? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy J. Pflanzer" <rpflanze(at)iquest.net>
Subject: Re: Room at OSH available
Date: Jul 12, 2000
Randall, I talked to Sharon and took your spot. She said that as soon as she receives my deposit, she'll return yours. I was almost ready to post a message to the list this morning looking for a room. I'm sorry you can't make it but I'm glad I was able to help you get your deposit at least. Randy Pflanzer N417G RV-6 (20.5 hours) Indianapolis (UMP) http://members.iquest.net/~rpflanze/ ----- Original Message ----- From: Randall Henderson <randallh(at)home.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2000 12:08 PM Subject: RV-List: Room at OSH available > > I've been forced to cancel my trip to OSH so the room I was going to stay in > will be available. Its at someone's home, a room with a queen bed. The home > has centeral air. Haven't stayed there before but they sound like nice folks > on the phone. > > Anyone interested give them a call: > > Sharon Hawkins > 920-232-8554 > > If someone grabs it please let me know. > > Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~100 hrs) > Portland, OR > http://www.edt.com/homewing > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Troy Whistman <TroyW(at)digitalmd.com>
Subject: FAR Part 43, Appendix D
Date: Jul 12, 2000
I find it humorous, that in the link to Appendix D that was just posted, they seem to have an error in identifying even themselves... I refer to Appendix B, paragraph b(4), where it describes the correct logbook statement for repairs: "...was repaired and inspected in accordance with current Regulations of the Federal Aviation Agency..." Shouldn't that be "Federal Aviation Administration", folks? Troy Whistman Ft. Worth, TX RV-8 gonna-be ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Date: Jul 12, 2000
Subject: Re: lowering the air scoop on my RV-6A
On the FAB-320 there is a oval alum. metal disk that seals the K&N filter bottom. Pinch bolts exit the bottom most oval disk and there are washers & nuts on the end of the bolts. The heads of the 4 inch long bolt(s) are on the carb. plate that bolts to the carb bottom. The FAB-360 is of a different design DWENSING(at)aol.com on 07/12/2000 01:00:53 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: RV-List: lowering the air scoop on my RV-6A In a message dated 7/11/00 2:29:43 PM Central Daylight Time, pcondon(at)csc.com writes: << Be sure the bolts and nuts that stick out below the filter can fit also....... >> What nuts and bolts are below the filter? Dale ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John" <fasching(at)amigo.net>
Subject: Re: FAR Part 43, Appendix D
Date: Jul 12, 2000
DO NOT POST Yes, it should read Federal Aviation Administration. The "Administration" handle was given when the FAA was put under control of the Transportation Department (A huge mistake....they inherited a '500-lb gorilla, and didn't know what to do with it except to take detailed control of a new unit which was larger than the entire Department.) When the FAA was an independent unit under the Executive Branch it was then properly called an "Agency" .... and worked with a lot less bureaucratic hindrance. FWW RV6A Flying Salida, CO ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2000
From: Jim Cimino <jcimino(at)epix.net>
Subject: Updated website
I have finally updated my website. I have added pictures of my instrument panel, engine plumbing, and cable brackets. Let me know what you think. Also, be advised of the new website address. Jim Cimino RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL Reserved http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo (570)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DWENSING(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 12, 2000
Subject: Re: lowering the air scoop on my RV-6A
In a message dated 7/12/00 1:25:49 PM Central Daylight Time, SSoule(at)pfclaw.com writes: << There are long AN-3 bolts that hold the K&N air filter assembly to the air box and carburetor. The bolts and nuts protrude about 1/4 to 1/2 inch below the air filter inside the air box. >> Thanks Steve. My FAB must be different or I've done it wrong. I have metal clips on the top plate that are to hold the filter in place I think. But will recheck. Dale Ensing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DWENSING(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 12, 2000
Subject: Re: lowering the air scoop on my RV-6A
In a message dated 7/12/00 3:01:59 PM Central Daylight Time, pcondon(at)csc.com writes: << On the FAB-320 there is a oval alum. metal disk that seals the K&N filter bottom. Pinch bolts exit the bottom most oval disk and there are washers & nuts on the end of the bolts. The heads of the 4 inch long bolt(s) are on the carb. plate that bolts to the carb bottom. The FAB-360 is of a different design >> Thank you. Yes, mine is a 360. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2000
From: Thomas McIntyre <bogeybrother(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: lowering the air scoop on my RV-6A
Ever think of installing the bolts from the bottom to the top? Tom DWENSING(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > In a message dated 7/12/00 1:25:49 PM Central Daylight Time, > SSoule(at)pfclaw.com writes: > > << > There are long AN-3 bolts that hold the K&N air filter assembly to the air > box and carburetor. The bolts and nuts protrude about 1/4 to 1/2 inch below > the air filter inside the air box. > >> > Thanks Steve. My FAB must be different or I've done it wrong. I have metal > clips on the top plate that are to hold the filter in place I think. But will > recheck. > Dale Ensing > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2000
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com>
Subject: Re: Arlington
If any of you are interested I put up a few photos of the many RVs that were in attendance at Arlington. I have not heard how many attended over the week but the RV parking area was full most of the time on Friday and Saturday. http://www.teleport.com/~jsflyrv/Arlington2000.html Jerry ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 12, 2000
Subject: Re: Arlington
From: "Shelby Smith" <shelbyrv6a(at)mindspring.com>
Thanks Jerry do no archive Shelby Smith shelbysmith(at)mac.com ---------- >From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com> >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV-List: Arlington >Date: Wed, Jul 12, 2000, 10:28 PM > > > If any of you are interested I put up a few photos of the many > RVs that were in attendance at Arlington. I have not heard > how many attended over the week but the RV parking area was full > most of the time on Friday and Saturday. > > http://www.teleport.com/~jsflyrv/Arlington2000.html > > Jerry ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Wing Gap Fairing (RV-6)
Date: Jul 11, 2000
> > 1. Should I continue the 2 1/2" Spacing on the platenuts? I didn't -- went with more like 5". May seem wide but its just a fairing, and I bent the edge down a little so it doesn't scallop. Came out fine. I used #6 screws although I thin Van's specifies #8s. > > 2. Is the fairing meant to end even with the aft end of the top wing > > skin, or is it meant to overlap the flap? As others have said, flush with the wing skin. > > 3. I will put platenuts on the edge of the fuel tank skin. Should the > > platenuts on the top wing skin be inline (laterally) with the fuel tank > > platenuts. If so they need to be inside the wing rather than on the > > edge of the wing in the area aft of the fuel tank. I put mine inboard of the rib or in the rib flange, don't remember which for sure. Also trimmed the outer edge of the fairing back so it didn't extend more than 3/4" outboard of the screw line. I did this because I figured with a lot of metal outside the screw line (and with widely spaced screws) it would have more of a tendency to scallop or lift in places. Made a gentle curve out where it has to go wider for the tank screws. The aft bottom part is somewhat tricky -- try to figure a way to get a small amount of the fairing to tuck under the wing skin or fuselage skin, or maybe even rivet on some sort of clip it could fit under. Can't remember exactly how I did this except that I did add a screw after the fact with a riv-nut (blind nut) because the aft end hung down. If I get out there soon I'll take some pictures and put them on the web. You're right, it would be nice to see pics of this. BTW I do have a web site with a number of construction details (mostly from later in the project) at http://www.edt.com/homewing/rhproject. Check it out! Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~100 hrs) Portland, OR http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Vacuum Instrument bashing!
Date: Jul 11, 2000
I've got vacum and kind of wish I had gone all electric, but at the time I was installing, the price kind of got in the way. Personally I'd feel more secure with a redundant electrical system such as Bob Nuckolls describes than I do with the vacum stuff. Big reason is the relatively low lifespan of the pump, and the possibility that the pump could take one or both vacum instruments with it if it goes. Jeez who needs that. Plus my rebuilt vac. DG crapped out 70 hours in. Don't know why but the best Mid-Continent (who did the rebuild) would do was sell me a new one for $100 or so off the new w/core price, since it was out of warranty. Seems there are still a lot of manufacturers who think its ok to have a calendar based, as opposed to hours-in-service based warranty. I recommend anyone purchasing instruments/avionics ask specifically which theirs is and tell them you're going elsewhere if they say calendar based (even if you have to crawl back to them later). We need to let companies know that homebuilts are becoming a big part of their business and require a different kind of warranty treatment. And yes I know about the shelf life of gyro instruments, and this unit was placed in service inside the manufacturer's recommended shelf life. Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~100 hrs) Portland, OR http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net>
Subject: Repairman Cert - Help!
I've just been told by the FAA inspector that he doesn't think I qualify for a repairman cert, as I didn't build the whole airplane. It was started by someone else back in '77. When I got it the wings were skinned, the fuselage had been jigged, firewall and bulkheads installed and side skins mostly riveted. The rear long bottom skin was there as well, but I've since replaced that. I built the emphenage and all control surfaces (the flaps and right elevator twice). I did the wing spar modification which included peeling back (almost removing) the bottom inner rear skins. I fabricated and welded up the missing tail spring mount, modified the engine mount and all the work involved in putting a Mazda 13B rotary engine in it. To me it looks like I've done a lot more work on the airframe that a current quick builder ever does, but how do I convince the FAA man about that? He also seems to think that the 51% rule only has to do with the certification of the aircraft as home built and almost said that a quickbuilder would not qualify for a repairman cert. Any ideas? Finn Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Repairman Cert - Help!
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Might I suggest a few well placed body shots followed by a good right to the kisser. :-) Obviously I'm kidding, but I can feel your frustration. That pencil pusher has no idea the amount of work involved in building that plane. Try asking him if he thinks there is an A&P out there that could work on your plane without asking YOU to explain the systems you put together. Explain that there simply is NOONE more qualified than you to service that aircraft and that 99% of the tractor...er I mean Lycoming mechanics out there couldn't find the proper end of an auto engine to place forward. NO-Way in the world is anyone else going to understand what you've done in there, unless you explain it or pay them per hour to figure it out. Tell him there is NO manual to explain to the A$P which wire is which, where to look for what or which way the engine turns. Without a manual, there is no A$P. If all logic fails, I revert to my original recommendation. I prefer to tap them with a left to get their attention...then follow with the right :-) Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "Finn Lassen" <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2000 9:16 AM Subject: RV-List: Repairman Cert - Help! > > I've just been told by the FAA inspector that he doesn't think I qualify > for a repairman cert, as I didn't build the whole airplane. It was > started by someone else back in '77. When I got it the wings were > skinned, the fuselage had been jigged, firewall and bulkheads installed > and side skins mostly riveted. The rear long bottom skin was there as > well, but I've since replaced that. I built the emphenage and all > control surfaces (the flaps and right elevator twice). I did the wing > spar modification which included peeling back (almost removing) the > bottom inner rear skins. I fabricated and welded up the missing tail > spring mount, modified the engine mount and all the work involved in > putting a Mazda 13B rotary engine in it. > > To me it looks like I've done a lot more work on the airframe that a > current quick builder ever does, but how do I convince the FAA man about > that? > > He also seems to think that the 51% rule only has to do with the > certification of the aircraft as home built and almost said that a > quickbuilder would not qualify for a repairman cert. > > Any ideas? > > Finn > > > Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: "Builder's Bookstore" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com>
Subject: Re: Repairman Cert - Help!
> He also seems to think that the 51% rule only has to do with the > certification of the aircraft as home built and almost said that a > quickbuilder would not qualify for a repairman cert. 1st, I believe that Vans has documentation from the FAA that the Quickbuild kit conforms to the 51% rule. Seems to me that you have done a lot more in building your craft than a Quickbuilder would do. 2nd, from what you said above, it is apparent that the inspector is not familiar with the rules. Is he an actual FAA employee, or is he a DAR? 3rd, it also sounds like the inspector is more worried about covering his own butt than in giving you a meaningful inspection. My suggestion; find a new DAR! Perhaps another local builder can recommend someone to you who believes that his job has more to do with safety than with paperwork. There are plenty out there who do; in fact probably the great majority. I have had bolt-together ultralights certificated with a repairman's certificate, one which I did not even build, but bought as a basket case and restored. My experiences with those and my RV have suggested that their are no hard rules; just prudence and common sense to be applied by the inspector. Get a new inspector. Andy Builder's Bookstore http://www.buildersbooks.com eCharts http://www.eCharts.cc ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: Re: FAR Part 43, Appendix D
> >Here it is!!!! Courtesy of the Bellanca-Champion Club > >APPENDIX D TO PART 43 - SCOPE AND DETAIL OF ITEMS (AS APPLICABLE TO THE >PARTICULAR AIRCRAFT) TO BE INCLUDED IN ANNUAL AND 100-HOUR INSPECTIONS >(a) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall, before >that inspection, remove or open all necessary inspection plates, access >doors, fairing, and cowling. He shall thoroughly clean the aircraft and >aircraft engine. Just curious . . . asside from being a reasonable starting point for a builder's maintenance checklist, how did FAR 43 (and in particular 100 hour inspections) find it's way into a discussion about amateur built aircraft? Bob . . . -------------------------------------------- ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) ( and still understand nothing. ) ( C.F. Kettering ) -------------------------------------------- http://www.aeroelectric.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: Re: Repairman Cert - Help!
> >I've just been told by the FAA inspector that he doesn't think I qualify >for a repairman cert, as I didn't build the whole airplane. It was >started by someone else back in '77. When I got it the wings were >skinned, the fuselage had been jigged, firewall and bulkheads installed >and side skins mostly riveted. The rear long bottom skin was there as >well, but I've since replaced that. I built the emphenage and all >control surfaces (the flaps and right elevator twice). I did the wing >spar modification which included peeling back (almost removing) the >bottom inner rear skins. I fabricated and welded up the missing tail >spring mount, modified the engine mount and all the work involved in >putting a Mazda 13B rotary engine in it. > >To me it looks like I've done a lot more work on the airframe that a >current quick builder ever does, but how do I convince the FAA man about >that? > >He also seems to think that the 51% rule only has to do with the >certification of the aircraft as home built and almost said that a >quickbuilder would not qualify for a repairman cert. > >Any ideas? > >Finn > Call the EAA and ask for Earl Lawrence. He's the EAA/FAA liason guy there. Don't wrestle with the local FAA guy, it's like spinning your wheels in the sand . . . the harder you try the deeper you sink. There are documents and precidents within the FAA that Earl can provide for you. Bob . . . -------------------------------------------- ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) ( and still understand nothing. ) ( C.F. Kettering ) -------------------------------------------- http://www.aeroelectric.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ken" <kgray(at)tca.net>
Subject: Re: Repairman Cert - Help!
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Try doing it as a group or team building the plane, listing you as the person doing the repairs. This is the same as several people building a plane and only one will get the repairman cert. Good luck. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2000 8:16 AM Subject: RV-List: Repairman Cert - Help! > > I've just been told by the FAA inspector that he doesn't think I qualify > for a repairman cert, as I didn't build the whole airplane. It was > started by someone else back in '77. When I got it the wings were > skinned, the fuselage had been jigged, firewall and bulkheads installed > and side skins mostly riveted. The rear long bottom skin was there as > well, but I've since replaced that. I built the emphenage and all > control surfaces (the flaps and right elevator twice). I did the wing > spar modification which included peeling back (almost removing) the > bottom inner rear skins. I fabricated and welded up the missing tail > spring mount, modified the engine mount and all the work involved in > putting a Mazda 13B rotary engine in it. > > To me it looks like I've done a lot more work on the airframe that a > current quick builder ever does, but how do I convince the FAA man about > that? > > He also seems to think that the 51% rule only has to do with the > certification of the aircraft as home built and almost said that a > quickbuilder would not qualify for a repairman cert. > > Any ideas? > > Finn > > > Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Greg Yotz" <gyachts(at)kans.com>
Subject: Re: Repairman Cert - Help!
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Is there a different FAA office fairly close that you can move your plane inside the service area? A lot of builders around KC have been bringing there planes southwest to get in the area serviced by Wichita. The Wichita office has inspectors that are much more understanding about homebuilts and what they go through. So, builders from other areas move there planes to airports inside the Wichita area so they can call Wichita instead of the KC office. Call other Chapters around and get their impression. We get two or three planes at our local airport a year doing this. After inspection and fly off they go home. Just a thought. Greg ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net>
Subject: Jon Johanson
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Jon arrived at Goose Bay, Labrador yesterday about 6 PM after what he said was a "fairly routine flight". He was on instruments about four hours between Scotland and Goose and did an ILS at Iceland. He will be heading for Colorado today about 14 hours flying time from Goose. Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: Bruce Gray <brucegray(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: FAR Part 43, Appendix D
Bob, All expermintal AW Certs contain the verbage that the aircraft must undergo an annual condition inspection that conforms to FAR 43, part D. Bruce "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" wrote: > > > > >Here it is!!!! Courtesy of the Bellanca-Champion Club > > > >APPENDIX D TO PART 43 - SCOPE AND DETAIL OF ITEMS (AS APPLICABLE TO THE > >PARTICULAR AIRCRAFT) TO BE INCLUDED IN ANNUAL AND 100-HOUR INSPECTIONS > >(a) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall, before > >that inspection, remove or open all necessary inspection plates, access > >doors, fairing, and cowling. He shall thoroughly clean the aircraft and > >aircraft engine. > > Just curious . . . asside from being a reasonable starting point > for a builder's maintenance checklist, how did FAR 43 (and in particular > 100 hour inspections) find it's way into a discussion about amateur > built aircraft? > > Bob . . . > -------------------------------------------- > ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) > ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) > ( and still understand nothing. ) > ( C.F. Kettering ) > -------------------------------------------- > http://www.aeroelectric.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net>
Subject: Re: FAR Part 43, Appendix D
AC 65-23A, Certification of Repainmen (Experimental Aircraft Builders) 10. Typical Aircraft Operating Limitations, "... in accordance with FAR Part 43, Appendix D...". Finn "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" wrote: Just curious . . . asside from being a reasonable starting point > for a builder's maintenance checklist, how did FAR 43 (and in particular > 100 hour inspections) find it's way into a discussion about amateur > built aircraft? > > Bob . . . ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
Subject: Re: Repairman Cert - Help!
Date: Jul 13, 2000
The repairman's certificate is always issued to one of the builders at certification WHEN requested. This makes it possible for partners or a school project to have a repairman among the builders. If you have ANY problems contact Earl Lawrence at EAA to straighten and clarify this. From the statement that a "quick builder" doesn't qualify show me he doesn't know what he is talking about and is doing a "local" interpretation of the regs. Earl can be contacted by e-mail at... elawrence(at)eaa.org Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact! (Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Finn Lassen" <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2000 8:16 AM Subject: RV-List: Repairman Cert - Help! > > I've just been told by the FAA inspector that he doesn't think I qualify > for a repairman cert, as I didn't build the whole airplane. It was > started by someone else back in '77. When I got it the wings were > skinned, the fuselage had been jigged, firewall and bulkheads installed > and side skins mostly riveted. The rear long bottom skin was there as > well, but I've since replaced that. I built the emphenage and all > control surfaces (the flaps and right elevator twice). I did the wing > spar modification which included peeling back (almost removing) the > bottom inner rear skins. I fabricated and welded up the missing tail > spring mount, modified the engine mount and all the work involved in > putting a Mazda 13B rotary engine in it. > > To me it looks like I've done a lot more work on the airframe that a > current quick builder ever does, but how do I convince the FAA man about > that? > > He also seems to think that the 51% rule only has to do with the > certification of the aircraft as home built and almost said that a > quickbuilder would not qualify for a repairman cert. > > Any ideas? > > Finn > > > Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
Subject: Re: Repairman Cert - Help!
Date: Jul 13, 2000
This is the link for the reg. http://www.faa.gov/avr/afs/faa/8300/8300_vol2/2_025_00.pdf You could claim a dissolved partnership, but all you have to show is a MAJORITY of the work via your work and picture logs. You can get a repairman's for a re-build is over 51% of the plane is rebuilt. Note the quote... "(1) The airworthiness inspector has knowledge that the aircraft was constructed by the individual builder. The inspector may accept information from another airworthiness inspector involved in the original aircraft certification and familiar with the builder's expertise." For what it is worth, the quick build option since it meets the 51% rule is eligible without question. Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact! (Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Finn Lassen" <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2000 8:16 AM Subject: RV-List: Repairman Cert - Help! > > I've just been told by the FAA inspector that he doesn't think I qualify > for a repairman cert, as I didn't build the whole airplane. It was > started by someone else back in '77. When I got it the wings were > skinned, the fuselage had been jigged, firewall and bulkheads installed > and side skins mostly riveted. The rear long bottom skin was there as > well, but I've since replaced that. I built the emphenage and all > control surfaces (the flaps and right elevator twice). I did the wing > spar modification which included peeling back (almost removing) the > bottom inner rear skins. I fabricated and welded up the missing tail > spring mount, modified the engine mount and all the work involved in > putting a Mazda 13B rotary engine in it. > > To me it looks like I've done a lot more work on the airframe that a > current quick builder ever does, but how do I convince the FAA man about > that? > > He also seems to think that the 51% rule only has to do with the > certification of the aircraft as home built and almost said that a > quickbuilder would not qualify for a repairman cert. > > Any ideas? > > Finn > > > Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
Subject: Re: FAR Part 43, Appendix D
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Bob, the person asked for it so I sent it. These are the things that an experimental aircraft inspection should do as well. Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact! (Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2000 9:39 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: FAR Part 43, Appendix D > > > > >Here it is!!!! Courtesy of the Bellanca-Champion Club > > > >APPENDIX D TO PART 43 - SCOPE AND DETAIL OF ITEMS (AS APPLICABLE TO THE > >PARTICULAR AIRCRAFT) TO BE INCLUDED IN ANNUAL AND 100-HOUR INSPECTIONS > >(a) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall, before > >that inspection, remove or open all necessary inspection plates, access > >doors, fairing, and cowling. He shall thoroughly clean the aircraft and > >aircraft engine. > > Just curious . . . asside from being a reasonable starting point > for a builder's maintenance checklist, how did FAR 43 (and in particular > 100 hour inspections) find it's way into a discussion about amateur > built aircraft? > > > Bob . . . > -------------------------------------------- > ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) > ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) > ( and still understand nothing. ) > ( C.F. Kettering ) > -------------------------------------------- > http://www.aeroelectric.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: clayfly(at)libertybay.com.Thu,
(EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id" <B0004149931@mail-2.lbay.net>; Thu, 13 Jul 2000 10:24:05.-0700(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re:First Flight of RV4 N854TB
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Congratulations Tom! Wow. 2000 fpm @ 120mph. That must have felt good. Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, will fly soon > ** Original Subject: RV-List: Re:First Flight of RV4 N854TB > ** Original Sender: RV4Brown(at)aol.com > ** Original Date: Tue, 11 Jul 2000 11:05:49 -0700 > ** Original Message follows... > > > Gentlemen: > > I just had to report that Van's gets to increase his Hobbs meter by one > RV4. After six years and two months of construction, my RV4 took to the > skies over Orange County, New York on July 10, 2000 at 7:45 PM. Everything > went extremely well. Power on takeoff was nothing short of awesome. Initial > climb at an indicated airspeed of 120 mph was 2,000 fpm. My thanks to all > those on the list that have helped and supported me through the building > process. It's so nice to finally begin the flying phase of owning an RV. > I'm sure most of you know that these projects just don't happen without the > dedicated support of a partner. My special thanks to my wife. I don't know > quite how I am going to repay her after all these years but I understand she > has a list. > The most amazing thing to me is that the darn thing came in little boxes > via the UPS truck. > > Tom Brown - RV4 FLYING Hobbs 4.8 hours and climbing > > > _- =========================================================== > _- =========================================================== > _- =========================================================== > _- =========================================================== > > >** --------- End Original Message ----------- ** > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: clayfly(at)libertybay.com.Thu,
(EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id" <B0004150828@mail-2.lbay.net>; Thu, 13 Jul 2000 11:02:48.-0700(at)matronics.com
Subject: Repairman Cert - Help!
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Finn, It's difficult to deal with a stubborn inspector. Did you ask him what you would need to do to convince him you had done 51%? My approach would be to compute your hours as compared to the "average" builder. Hopefully you have documented your hours. If so, find out the "average" number of hours it takes to build your model of RV (ask Van's) and do the arithmetic --- I'll bet you've done much more than 51% of most home builders (given all those things you mentioned). Good luck! Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, close to finished > > > I've just been told by the FAA inspector that he doesn't think I qualify > for a repairman cert, as I didn't build the whole airplane. It was > started by someone else back in '77. When I got it the wings were > skinned, the fuselage had been jigged, firewall and bulkheads installed > and side skins mostly riveted. The rear long bottom skin was there as > well, but I've since replaced that. I built the emphenage and all > control surfaces (the flaps and right elevator twice). I did the wing > spar modification which included peeling back (almost removing) the > bottom inner rear skins. I fabricated and welded up the missing tail > spring mount, modified the engine mount and all the work involved in > putting a Mazda 13B rotary engine in it. > > To me it looks like I've done a lot more work on the airframe that a > current quick builder ever does, but how do I convince the FAA man about > that? > > He also seems to think that the 51% rule only has to do with the > certification of the aircraft as home built and almost said that a > quickbuilder would not qualify for a repairman cert. > > Any ideas? > > Finn > > > Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 > > > _- =========================================================== > _- =========================================================== > _- =========================================================== > _- =========================================================== > > >** --------- End Original Message ----------- ** > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Japundza, Bob" <bjapundza(at)dowagro.com>
Subject: flap slop
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Listers, I have manual flaps on my plane...a few weeks ago before I took the wings off for paint I noticed some play in the flaps which amounted to about 3/8" overall in the neutral position. Most of the play seems to be coming from a very small amount of slop in the catch mechanism inside the flap handle. Scott @ Van's said it should be OK, that the flaps will "ride" to whatever position is neutral for them. I was thinking when I fly I should note their position and put in an a piece of angle along the side of the fuse over the flap to act as a stop, like many others have. Can anyone see having this much play in the flap mechanism causing any problems for the first few flights before I put the stop in? Bob Japundza RV-6 N244BJ FINAL assembly! Inspection 7/24 1:00pm Lets see, inspection on the 24th, OSH on the 26th, if I fly 8 hours a day...hmm ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca>
Subject: Re: flap slop
> >Listers, > >I have manual flaps on my plane...a few weeks ago before I took the >wings off for paint I noticed some play in the flaps which amounted >to about 3/8" overall in the neutral position. Most of the play >seems to be coming from a very small amount of slop in the catch >mechanism inside the flap handle. Scott @ Van's said it should be >OK, that the flaps will "ride" to whatever position is neutral for >them. I was thinking when I fly I should note their position and >put in an a piece of angle along the side of the fuse over the flap >to act as a stop, like many others have. Can anyone see having this >much play in the flap mechanism causing any problems for the first >few flights before I put the stop in? > >Bob Japundza >RV-6 N244BJ FINAL assembly! >Inspection 7/24 1:00pm >Lets see, inspection on the 24th, OSH on the 26th, if I fly 8 hours >a day...hmm Bob, Most production small aircraft that I look at have about that much slop in the flaps, and it doesn't seem to cause them any grief. Once you are flying, and there is an airload on them, they will ride up as far as possible, which will take out any slop. You need a small amount of play in the catch mechanism or it would tend to jam up on you anyway. Just based on your description, I'm not convinced you need to do anything at all. Good luck on the first flight. I'm leaving for Argentina in less than an hour, and will be off line for several weeks. -- Kevin Horton RV-8 (mounting elevators, etc) Ottawa, Canada http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "lucky macy" <luckymacy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: flap slop
Date: Jul 13, 2000
well, slop equals flutter potential. Ask Van's. Probaby within acceptable limits but never hurts to ask the source... >From: Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV-List: flap slop >Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 15:29:36 -0400 > > > > > > >Listers, > > > >I have manual flaps on my plane...a few weeks ago before I took the > >wings off for paint I noticed some play in the flaps which amounted > >to about 3/8" overall in the neutral position. Most of the play > >seems to be coming from a very small amount of slop in the catch > >mechanism inside the flap handle. Scott @ Van's said it should be > >OK, that the flaps will "ride" to whatever position is neutral for > >them. I was thinking when I fly I should note their position and > >put in an a piece of angle along the side of the fuse over the flap > >to act as a stop, like many others have. Can anyone see having this > >much play in the flap mechanism causing any problems for the first > >few flights before I put the stop in? > > > >Bob Japundza > >RV-6 N244BJ FINAL assembly! > >Inspection 7/24 1:00pm > >Lets see, inspection on the 24th, OSH on the 26th, if I fly 8 hours > >a day...hmm > >Bob, > >Most production small aircraft that I look at have about that much >slop in the flaps, and it doesn't seem to cause them any grief. Once >you are flying, and there is an airload on them, they will ride up as >far as possible, which will take out any slop. You need a small >amount of play in the catch mechanism or it would tend to jam up on >you anyway. Just based on your description, I'm not convinced you >need to do anything at all. > >Good luck on the first flight. > >I'm leaving for Argentina in less than an hour, and will be off line >for several weeks. > >-- >Kevin Horton RV-8 (mounting elevators, etc) >Ottawa, Canada >http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: clayfly(at)libertybay.com.Thu,
(EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id" <B0004154184@mail-2.lbay.net>; Thu, 13 Jul 2000 13:23:31.-0700(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: flap slop
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Hi Bob, Glad to hear you're getting close to flying your bird. As I recall from Van's written instructions, he says to make sure the flaps will extend at least 44 degrees (SINCE THE AIR PRESSURE WILL PUSH THEM BACK UP 3 OR 4 DEGREES). So it appears he is anticipating some slop in the mechanism. I have the electric flaps and they also have this wiggle in them. I went ahead and put some angle at the top to limit the flaps from going too far up. Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, getting close too > ** Original Subject: Re: RV-List: flap slop > ** Original Sender: "lucky macy" > ** Original Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 13:14:01 -0700 > ** Original Message follows... > > > well, slop equals flutter potential. Ask Van's. Probaby within acceptable > limits but never hurts to ask the source... > > > >From: Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> > >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > >Subject: Re: RV-List: flap slop > >Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 15:29:36 -0400 > > > > > > > > > > > >Listers, > > > > > >I have manual flaps on my plane...a few weeks ago before I took the > > >wings off for paint I noticed some play in the flaps which amounted > > >to about 3/8" overall in the neutral position. Most of the play > > >seems to be coming from a very small amount of slop in the catch > > >mechanism inside the flap handle. Scott @ Van's said it should be > > >OK, that the flaps will "ride" to whatever position is neutral for > > >them. I was thinking when I fly I should note their position and > > >put in an a piece of angle along the side of the fuse over the flap > > >to act as a stop, like many others have. Can anyone see having this > > >much play in the flap mechanism causing any problems for the first > > >few flights before I put the stop in? > > > > > >Bob Japundza > > >RV-6 N244BJ FINAL assembly! > > >Inspection 7/24 1:00pm > > >Lets see, inspection on the 24th, OSH on the 26th, if I fly 8 hours > > >a day...hmm > > > >Bob, > > > >Most production small aircraft that I look at have about that much > >slop in the flaps, and it doesn't seem to cause them any grief. Once > >you are flying, and there is an airload on them, they will ride up as > >far as possible, which will take out any slop. You need a small > >amount of play in the catch mechanism or it would tend to jam up on > >you anyway. Just based on your description, I'm not convinced you > >need to do anything at all. > > > >Good luck on the first flight. > > > >I'm leaving for Argentina in less than an hour, and will be off line > >for several weeks. > > > >-- > >Kevin Horton RV-8 (mounting elevators, etc) > >Ottawa, Canada > >http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html > > > > > > > _- =========================================================== > _- =========================================================== > _- =========================================================== > _- =========================================================== > > >** --------- End Original Message ----------- ** > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "EWSpears" <ewspears(at)peoplepc.com>
Subject: Avionics Wiring
Date: Jul 13, 2000
I'm having trouble determining the interconnects between some of my avionics. Has anyone else already wired the following set of components? RMI Microencoder, Garmin GNC 250XL(same as GNC 300XL), Navaid with Compass Option, and Transponder. All the preceding components have instruction manuels but they don't always use the same phraseology to describe their inputs and outputs. If anyone has any experience interconnecting these components Please send me an e-mail offlist. Many Thanks! Esten Spears 80922, Fuse ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rv660wm(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Subject: Re: flap slop
In a message dated 7/13/00 3:26:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time, bjapundza(at)dowagro.com writes: << Can anyone see having this much play in the flap mechanism causing any problems for the first few flights before I put the stop in? >> I have electric flaps and was equally concerned about the slop in them. I went around rattling folks flaps(with their permission) and it seems to be a common problem. Mine has 3/8 inch . I have seen 200 mph CAS without flutter which is the max. I can fly with my Sensenich metal prop(2600 RPM limited) Bernie Kerr, 6A N60WM Flying, SE Fla ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
Subject: Re: flap slop
"Japundza, Bob" wrote: > > > Listers, > > I have manual flaps on my plane...a few weeks ago before I took the wings off for paint I noticed some play in the flaps which amounted to about 3/8" overall in the neutral position. Most of the play seems to be coming from a very small amount of slop in the catch mechanism inside the flap handle. Scott @ Van's said it should be OK, that the flaps will "ride" to whatever position is neutral for them. I was thinking when I fly I should note their position and put in an a piece of angle along the side of the fuse over the flap to act as a stop, like many others have. Can anyone see having this much play in the flap mechanism causing any problems for the first few flights before I put the stop in? > > Bob Japundza > RV-6 N244BJ FINAL assembly! > Inspection 7/24 1:00pm > Lets see, inspection on the 24th, OSH on the 26th, if I fly 8 hours a day...hmm Bob, you have described exactly the situation with the manual flaps on my RV-6. The 3/8" slop presented no problems whatsoever in 150 hrs of flight. I just recently converted to electric flaps, and in spite of all my efforts to eliminate all play in the linkage, there is still a very small amount. The rod end bearings apparently allow a small amount of play, and the clearances accumulate enough to be noticeable. Be sure you have shimmed the flap link bearings at the flap torque rod if necessary so they can't slide back and forth on the bolt. Good luck with your upcoming test flights! Sam Buchanan (RV-6, 156 hrs) "The RV Journal" http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: Scott <acepilot(at)win.bright.net>
Subject: Re: FAR Part 43, Appendix D
Maybe because annual condition inspections are to encompass everything within Part 43 Appendix D? I think that's why the guy was asking. --Scott-- 1986 Corben Junior Ace N3642 http://corbenflyer.tripod.com/ RV-4 under construction (tail feathers) Gotta Fly or Gonna Die! "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" wrote: > > > > > >Here it is!!!! Courtesy of the Bellanca-Champion Club > > > >APPENDIX D TO PART 43 - SCOPE AND DETAIL OF ITEMS (AS APPLICABLE TO THE > >PARTICULAR AIRCRAFT) TO BE INCLUDED IN ANNUAL AND 100-HOUR INSPECTIONS > >(a) Each person performing an annual or 100-hour inspection shall, before > >that inspection, remove or open all necessary inspection plates, access > >doors, fairing, and cowling. He shall thoroughly clean the aircraft and > >aircraft engine. > > Just curious . . . asside from being a reasonable starting point > for a builder's maintenance checklist, how did FAR 43 (and in particular > 100 hour inspections) find it's way into a discussion about amateur > built aircraft? > > Bob . . . > -------------------------------------------- > ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) > ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) > ( and still understand nothing. ) > ( C.F. Kettering ) > -------------------------------------------- > http://www.aeroelectric.com > -- --Scott-- 1986 Corben Junior Ace N3642 http://corbenflyer.tripod.com/ RV-4 under construction (tail feathers) Gotta Fly or Gonna Die! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Kbeene(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Subject: transition training
I have finished RV-6A N94KB but the insurance company says I must have a CFI sign off training in type. Mike Seger is not available until mid August. Does anyone know of a CFI with an RV-6A that can provide some transition training? I have a couple of hours in the right seat of 6A put not with an instructor that can sign off. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: Re: DC Powered Vacuum Pump
>a while back somebody (I believe it was John) suggested a small electrical >driven compressor as an alternative to a vacuum pump or venturi. He >especially recommended the UNMP50 from KNF. Their brushless type (for >permanent operation) costs $ 213.00. The pump will make 2.7 l per min at 4 >Hg. I'm ready to order one from KNF, but I'm somewhat reluctant. Has anybody >tried such a pump yet? Is this for normal operations of vacuum instruments? I used to work for a company that sold STANDBY electrically driven vacuum pumps . . . they take a LOT of snort . . . like 125 to 300 watts. Got that much extra available full time from your alternator? . . . Found this on the internet: (3) Vacuum loads may be calculated as follows: (a) Gyroscopic instruments require optimum value of airflow to produce their rated rotor speed. For instance, a bank and pitch indicator requires approximately 2.30 cubic feet per minute for its operation . . . 2.3 cu feet per minute is about 65 liters per minute and a resistance or pressure drop of 4.00 inches Hg. Therefore, operating an instrument requiring 4.00 inches Hg from oneventuri would be marginal. Similarly, the directional gyro indicator consumes approximately 1.30 cubic feet per minute and a pressure drop of 4.00 in Hg. . . . It should be noted that the negative pressure air source must not only deliver the optimum value of vacuum to the instruments, but must also have sufficient volume capacity to accommodate the total flow requirements of the various instruments which it serves. . . . adding 1.3 cu-ft/min (37 more liters/min) brings the total up to more than 3.6 cu/ft or 100 liters per minute at 4 in-hg or better. Looking at KNF's website, the only pumps capable of this performance have to plug in the wall. It taks a LOT of suck to run a vacuum instrument. This may be why those little engine driven pumps in airplanes are so hard pressed to run for very long. . . . Bob . . . -------------------------------------------- ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) ( and still understand nothing. ) ( C.F. Kettering ) -------------------------------------------- http://www.aeroelectric.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com>
Subject: Re: flap slop
lucky macy wrote: > > > well, slop equals flutter potential. Ask Van's. Probaby within acceptable > limits but never hurts to ask the source... > Very slim chance of flaps ever fluttering. Some aircraft just have spring tension to hold flaps in up position. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rvmils(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Subject: air hammer vs rivet gun
Does anyone know the difference between a air hammer and a rivet gun? I know the hammers look the same and are a hell of a lot cheaper. carey mills ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rvmils(at)AOL.COM.Thu,
(EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id" <B0004160863@mail-2.lbay.net>; Thu, 13 Jul 2000 18:01:57.-0700(at)matronics.com
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Subject: air hammer vs rivet gun
Does anyone know the difference between a air hammer and a rivet gun? I know the hammers look the same and are a hell of a lot cheaper. carey mills ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com>
Subject: Re: flap slop
lucky macy wrote: > > > well, slop equals flutter potential. Ask Van's. Probaby within acceptable > limits but never hurts to ask the source... > Very slim chance of flaps ever fluttering. Some aircraft just have spring tension to hold flaps in up position. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: Louis Willig <larywil(at)home.com>
Subject: Domain Name
Dear Gang, I don't want to start a riot, fight, or war.....BUT I believe the domain names of www.RV-4.com and www.rv-4.com are available. I can't believe that one of you computer literate builders hasn't purchased this site address. I can't even spell www, so I'm excused. Louis Louis I. Willig larywil(at)home.com RV-4, N8ZW in my near future (610) 668-4964 Philadelphia, PA Louis I. Willig larywil(at)home.com RV-4, N8ZW in my near future (610) 668-4964 Philadelphia, PA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ENewton57(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Subject: Re: RV-8-8A FUEL TANK TAB
In a message dated 7/13/00 8:33:49 PM Central Daylight Time, willig10(at)yahoo.com writes: << My question to all you 8 builders is do you guys know what revision or is there one out there describing this? >> The slot is on my RV-6A plans and it says its to allow it to shear in case of accident otherwise the rib could pull loose and spray fuel everywhere. Not sure about the -8 Eric Newton - Long Beach, Mississippi RV-6A N57ME (Reserved) (wing leading edge skins) Eric's RV-6A Construction Page ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV8DRIVER(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Subject: Re: RV-8-8A FUEL TANK TAB
Glenn, this was originally in one of the RVator issues. It was done to allow the wing to depart the airframe in an accident without tearing apart the fuel tank. The tip bracket only carries shear loads, that is, up and down, not tension. Andy Johnson, deburring dem fuse parts ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV8DRIVER(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Subject: Re: air hammer vs rivet gun
Buy a 3x, you can use it for everthing. Inever use the 2x since I got the 3x. It also happens to be a better gun as well. Andy Johnson ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com>
Subject: RV-8-8A FUEL TANK TAB
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Issue #1, 1998 showed the revision. I'm not even sure it's an official revision...maybe just a option. I did it on mine. Larry Bowen RV-8 fuse Email: Larry(at)BowenAero.com Web:
http://BowenAero.com > -----Original Message----- > listers my a/c builder serial # is 80917 and I have a > question regarding the hand made L shaped bracket that > attaches the wing to the fuselage at the fwd side of > the wing. The reason I am asking is that I was at > Northwest regional the other day and two brand new > older serial # rv-8's had a slot cut to the bolt hole > diameter all the way through the tab. I have looked at > my plans and they say nothing about cutting this slot. > I asked the builders and they said it was on a plans > revision. However my serial number being a lot higher > than thiers I would have thought that the revision > would have been on my plans. My question to all you 8 > builders is do you guys know what revision or is there > one out there describing this? The builders said it > was designed in case of an accident that the fuel tank > would not be ripped open. Help > > Glenn ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 13, 2000
From: Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com>
Subject: Re: air hammer vs rivet gun
My air hammer is about the same size as my rivet gun and has about the same amount of force output. The big difference (besides quality) is in the trigger. My air hammer is on or off, nothing else. My rivet gun has a very nice feathering trigger. Just for fun I drove some test rivets using the air hammer and they turned out great. Seemed to take more hits so I would guess that the rivet is getting close to being overworked when set. Now with all that said, I would not use an air hammer to build my plane or anyone elses. Spend the bucks and get a good rivet gun, it is a tool that you will use a lot. Gary Zilik glenn williams wrote: > > an air hammer is not a rivet gun it is made to remove > ball joints etc from cars and the force it gives far > exceeds the rivet guns force unless you need a 10x > rivet gun stay away from an air hammer. go buy a 2x or > a 3x rivet gun > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Terry Watson" <tcwatson(at)seanet.com>
Subject: Re: RV-8-8A FUEL TANK TAB
Date: Jul 13, 2000
Glenn, Van's has a really cheap kit -- I think it is $3.00 or so, that includes some washers and platenuts for this option. I think it also includes the drawing. When I was doing mine, I couldn't find any dimensions on how deep to cut the slot so I called Van's. I was told to wait until I was installing the wings, contrary to the instructions that came with the kit. I cut the slot. I won't know for a long time if I got it right. Terry Watson RV-8A wings almost done Seattle ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HCRV6(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: air hammer vs rivet gun
In a message dated 7/13/00 7:47:42 PM Pacific Daylight Time, RV8DRIVER(at)AOL.COM writes: << Buy a 3x, you can use it for everthing. Inever use the 2x since I got the 3x. >> Me too! I struggled with -4 rivets through everything until halfway through the fuselage (not a QB) with a so-so 2X, then I bought a good 3X gun and use it for everything now. What a difference it makes in setting the bigger rivets! Harry Crosby -6 Finish kit ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Imfairings(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: trouble fitting emp fairing
Rollie, Send me your phone number, it would take me weeks to type in a reasonable answer, or call me 360 659 5055. Bob ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Imfairings(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: trouble fitting emp fairing
Tony, If your question was directed at Fairings Etc, it does fit the -6 & -6A . The cost is $115+ shipping. Mine has larger radiuses, is three part, and weighs under two pounds. If it does have problems we solve them or you return it. Bob ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CW9371(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: transition training
In a message dated 7/13/2000 6:04:08 PM Central Daylight Time, Kbeene(at)AOL.COM writes: << I have finished RV-6A N94KB but the insurance company says I must have a CFI sign off training in type. Mike Seger is not available until mid August. Does anyone know of a CFI with an RV-6A that can provide some transition training? I have a couple of hours in the right seat of 6A put not with an instructor that can sign off. >> WHich insurance company is this. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CW9371(at)AOL.COM.Fri,
(EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id" <B0004166833@mail-2.lbay.net>; Thu, 13 Jul 2000 23:18:05.-0700(at)matronics.com
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: transition training
In a message dated 7/13/2000 6:04:08 PM Central Daylight Time, Kbeene(at)AOL.COM writes: << I have finished RV-6A N94KB but the insurance company says I must have a CFI sign off training in type. Mike Seger is not available until mid August. Does anyone know of a CFI with an RV-6A that can provide some transition training? I have a couple of hours in the right seat of 6A put not with an instructor that can sign off. >> WHich insurance company is this. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Polenske, Eugene O" <Eugene.Polenske(at)PSS.Boeing.com>
Subject: RV-8 Panel drawing
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Does anyone out there have a cadd drawing file of an RV-8 panel? If you do I'd sure appreciate it if you would send me a copy. Thanks, Gene Polenske Things coming together nicely on the empenage. Wings ordered. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Fesenbek, Gary" <Gary.Fesenbek(at)marykay.com>
Subject: air hammer vs rivet gun
Date: Jul 14, 2000
>>Does anyone know the difference between a air hammer and a rivet gun? I know >>the hammers look the same and are a hell of a lot cheaper. Eight pounds of bondo on your typical Rv. Gary Fesenbek RV6A Dallas, TX ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: jaugilas <jaugilas(at)allways.net>
Subject: Re: air hammer vs rivet gun
How is that gun on those little bitty rivets. (3-/32's). Is low pressure good enough? and how low? Bill Jaugilas HCRV6(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > In a message dated 7/13/00 7:47:42 PM Pacific Daylight Time, > RV8DRIVER(at)AOL.COM writes: > > << > Buy a 3x, you can use it for everthing. Inever use the 2x since I got the > 3x. > >> > > Me too! I struggled with -4 rivets through everything until halfway through > the fuselage (not a QB) with a so-so 2X, then I bought a good 3X gun and use > it for everything now. What a difference it makes in setting the bigger > rivets! > > Harry Crosby > -6 Finish kit > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com>
Subject: carb throttle arm
Date: Jul 14, 2000
All three holes on my Marvel carburetor were sized to fit AN-3 bolts. That is, the middle one was the same size as the other two. Steve Soule -----Original Message----- The carb had a "home made" U shape bracket attached with 2 an-3 bolts, so I guess the Warrior got by with friction to hold it to gether. I removed the bracket cause I don't need it. Is the center hole bigger the standard or has someone been re engineering it? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: lm4(at)juno.com
Date: Jul 12, 2000
Subject: Re: new RV-6A flying
Ray, Sounds like a really neat set of systems. You mentioned water. What kind of engine do you have ? Larry Mac Donald Rochester N.Y. lm4(at)juno.com sales(at)powersportaviation.com> writes: Powersport's new RV-6A is flying Dear RV'ers, > Total weight is 1096 with oil and water. Also included is > 2 batteries, 55 amp alt, duel electrical buss, duel ECU's, > Ray ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy J. Pflanzer" <rpflanze(at)iquest.net>
Subject: Re: transition training
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Go to the Van's Airforce - World Wide Wing web site at http://www.metronet.com/~dreeves/vaf.htm. Doug has a list of CFI's that will provide training in RV's. You may have to travel to Texas, but at least it's available to you. Randy Pflanzer N417G RV-6 (20.5 hours) Indianapolis (UMP) http://members.iquest.net/~rpflanze/ > > I have finished RV-6A N94KB but the insurance company says I must have a CFI > sign off training in type. Mike Seger is not available until mid August. > Does anyone know of a CFI with an RV-6A that can provide some transition > training? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy J. Pflanzer" <rpflanze(at)iquest.net>
Subject: Re: Wire routing
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Harry, If I recall correctly, I ran the wires over to one side while under the baggage floor so that I could penetrate the rear spar in a spot where it didn't interfere with the spar reinforcing bars. I then followed one of the stiffeners all the way to the rear of the airplane. Randy Pflanzer N417G RV-6 (20.5 hours) Indianapolis (UMP) http://members.iquest.net/~rpflanze/ > > I'm wasting a lot of time trying to noodle out just how to run the wiring for > the electric flaps and rudder light. The problem I'm worrying about is that > if I run the wires down the center tunnel between the seats (RV-6), I'll have > to drill fairly large, like 5/16 or 3/8 holes in the bulkheads for the snap > bushings. I'm concerned about weakening the structure in places like the > rear spar carry through because there isn't enough space in those places to > get anywhere near normal (3D) edge distance from the cutouts for the elevator > push pull tube or from existing rivets. If anyone can figure out what I'm > trying to say and can offer any suggestions I'll sure be grateful. How did > you all do it? > > Harry Crosby > -6 Finish kit stuff ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: carb throttle arm
In a message dated 7/13/00 8:13:55 PM Pacific Daylight Time, dons6a(at)juno.com writes: << I have 3 holes in the throttle arm for my throttle. The outside two are 3/16. I need the center one which is .240 approx. Is there a bushing I order from Lyc to press in so the an-3 bolt will work? The carb had a "home made" U shape bracket attached with 2 an-3 bolts, so I guess the Warrior got by with friction to hold it together. I removed the bracket cause I don't need it. Is the center hole bigger the standard or has someone been re engineering it? >> Maybe it's a lightening hole. -GV (RV-6A N1GV) vanremog(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
Subject: Re: air hammer vs rivet gun
jaugilas wrote: > > > How is that gun on those little bitty rivets. (3-/32's). > > Is low pressure good enough? and how low? The 3X gun is just fine for the 3/32 rivets. I found 35 lbs to be the correct pressure for most small rivets. Sam Buchanan (RV-6 built entirely with 3X generic rivet gun) "The RV Journal" http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: carb throttle arm
The bushing you are refering to is for the mixture arm I think. I found a babbit/bronze bushing at the hobbie store model airplane section that fit the ID of the carb-arm-hole. I made a wood clamp to hold the little bushing to drill the hole for the AN-3 bolt. SSoule(at)pfclaw.com on 07/14/2000 08:05:45 AM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RE: RV-List: carb throttle arm All three holes on my Marvel carburetor were sized to fit AN-3 bolts. That is, the middle one was the same size as the other two. Steve Soule -----Original Message----- The carb had a "home made" U shape bracket attached with 2 an-3 bolts, so I guess the Warrior got by with friction to hold it to gether. I removed the bracket cause I don't need it. Is the center hole bigger the standard or has someone been re engineering it? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Repairman Cert - Help!
Date: Jul 13, 2000
> > fire the inspector and hire yourself a d.a.r The repairman cert. has to come from the FAA. I agree with Bob N. -- don't try to argue with a stubborn FSDO employee. Talk to EAA and they should be able to set you on the right path. Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~100 hrs) Portland, OR http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Wing Gap Fairing
Date: Jul 13, 2000
> RE: RV-6 wing gap fairing. > > I am on drawing 46 trying to find ANY specific information regarding the > placement and mounting of the Wing Gap Fairing. I took some pictures and put them on my web site at http://www.edt.com/homewing/rhproject/index.html. Feel free to have a look. Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~100 hrs) Portland, OR http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: WAYNE BONESTEEL <wayneb(at)oakweb.com>
Subject: Where's the metal
I have 9.4 hours on my RV-4 and going to do inspection and oil change. I would like to know where the particulates such as metal accumulate in the oil filter, any info would be appreciated. Wayne ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
Subject: Re: Repairman Cert - Help!
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Read back through the messages. When you hassled about the need for carburetor heat, you probably messed up the relationship. Some times it is better to say, Yes, I'll make your change or addition rather than arguing about it. Then when you need something, it might be easier to get. Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact! (Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com> Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2000 10:41 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Repairman Cert - Help! > > > > fire the inspector and hire yourself a d.a.r > > The repairman cert. has to come from the FAA. > > I agree with Bob N. -- don't try to argue with a stubborn FSDO employee. > Talk to EAA and they should be able to set you on the right path. > > Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~100 hrs) > Portland, OR > http://www.edt.com/homewing > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: John Kitz <jkitz(at)greenapple.com>
Subject: Re: carb throttle arm
pcondon(at)csc.com wrote: > > The bushing you are refering to is for the mixture arm I think. I found a > babbit/bronze bushing at the hobbie store model airplane section that fit the ID > of the carb-arm-hole. I made a wood clamp to hold the little bushing to drill > the hole for the AN-3 bolt. > I bought flanged bronze bushings from Boston, a well known bearing distributor in industry in the USA, and put them in all the pedal joints and other places. The flanges fit between the parts to act as a spacer like a washer. They are available very reasonable and available in 3/16" ID by 1/4" OD. John Kitz N721JK Ohio ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: David & Betty Burton <dburton(at)foxinternet.net>
Subject: tools
Hi listers, I'm looking for a hand squeezer. Would prefer Avery's (and am open to input if you have strong feelings about another brand) I've heard good things about the Avery squeezer, and am considering getting a pneumatic squeezer. I'm going to order a hand squeezer in a couple of days, as I need that, a rivet fan and some other misc. stuff. I thought I ask here first to see if anyone has an extra one, or maybe some other tools they would like to sell. Thanks, Dave Burton RV6A (wings) Seattle ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: Where's the metal-oil filter
You got to cut your filter can to remove the pleated material and cut the material to un-fold the pleated material-- looking into the folds for bits of metal or carbon. Carbon specs look like old coffee grinds. Metal flakes & slivers are to be eyed closely. A magnet will pickup ferrus metal and a mini-torch will ignite magnesium. Aluimun will react with a chemical that I forget....at any rate thats how to determin what is sheding metal. A good mechanic will ID the junk in the filter and will have a good idea from whence it came (piston plug, ring(s), case fretting, valve seat, vave guide.....most engine innerds are made up of specific metals and a good mechinal can narrow things down pretty quickly. A filter screen mostly picks up mostly oil sludge and lead slurry (gray stuff) and large carbon pieces. Mostly follow the above procedure for a screen also. I have found a good qualitity filter cutter, a seratted knife to cut the pleated cardboard and a few dental picks are what I need. A large cookie sheet and newspaper also help. Its messy but worth it. wayneb(at)oakweb.com on 07/14/2000 12:55:54 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RV-List: Where's the metal I have 9.4 hours on my RV-4 and going to do inspection and oil change. I would like to know where the particulates such as metal accumulate in the oil filter, any info would be appreciated. Wayne ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Cammed O-360?
Hi Folks, I recently read either a post (but can't find in archives) or a web site (stumbled onto, no doubt, and can't find again) where a fellow had an Aero Sport engine which Bart had cammed up to 195HP. I'm doing the engine search thing now, and sure would like to get in touch with this person. Anyone? Thanks. Mike Thompson Austin, TX -6 N140RV (Reserved) Fuselage ==== Michael E. Thompson (Grobdriver(at)yahoo.com) Austin, TX, USA RV-6 in progress, N140RV (Reserved) EX-AX1 Sub Hunter, P-3 (B/B-TACMOD/C) Orion Aircrew, PP-G,ASEL, Motorglider Driver and Unlimited Air Race Nut! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Subject: Re: Domain Name
Date: Jul 14, 2000
> I don't want to start a riot, fight, or war.....BUT I believe the domain > names of > www.RV-4.com and www.rv-4.com are available. I can't believe that one of > you computer literate builders hasn't purchased this site address. I can't > even spell www, so I'm excused. I registered, and am using for my own site, www.rv-8.com since I'm building an -8. A friend of mine got www.rv6.com, www.rv-6a.com, and www.rv-9a.com since he plans on building one of the two some day. Indeed it is an oversight on Van's part not to tie up these domains, but then Van has never focused on marketing issues at all -- engineers tend not to. Randy Lervold RV-8, #80500, cowling (probably forever) www.rv-8.com Home Wing VAF ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: Don McNamara <n8rv(at)gte.net>
Subject: Re: tools
David & Betty Burton wrote: ... I thought I ask here first to see if anyone has an extra one, or maybe some other tools they would like to sell. I noticed that Bill Pagan is parting with his tools. This might be a real help to someone starting out. So, if you're looking for tools, check out Bill's site at: http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/9749/william.html I don't know what tools he has left, but it might be worth contacting him if you're in the market. --Don McNamara N8RV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: tools
If you really want a pneumatic unit then get a hand squeezer that has interchangable yokes with your pneumatic unit so you can savo on monies. The fan spacer thingie you mention is pretty trick but I have used a fabric seamstress tape measure with good results, It does many things the fan thingie dosen't do. dburton(at)foxinternet.net on 07/14/2000 02:01:59 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RV-List: tools Hi listers, I'm looking for a hand squeezer. Would prefer Avery's (and am open to input if you have strong feelings about another brand) I've heard good things about the Avery squeezer, and am considering getting a pneumatic squeezer. I'm going to order a hand squeezer in a couple of days, as I need that, a rivet fan and some other misc. stuff. I thought I ask here first to see if anyone has an extra one, or maybe some other tools they would like to sell. Thanks, Dave Burton RV6A (wings) Seattle ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: barrys <barrys(at)viconet.com>
Subject: bolts position
We attended the Sportair class in Ga, last weekend. They said and I agree, bolt heads up, or front. It makes sense. If the nut comes loose and it is on top, the bolt falls out. Accelleration would do the same to a bolt that had the nut pointinf forward and it came off. Barry 666bp reserved unpacking tail to rv9a ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: tools
Date: Jul 14, 2000
In my world (far far from normal reality) I do not own a hand sqeezer and can not see any use for one. The pneumatic allows me to go down a spar, rib or whatever either squeezing or dimpling so fast you would be amazed. Watching the Orndorff videos and how slow the same process goes with the hand sqeezer I really can't say enough how happy I am with the pneumatic. Clamp it in a vice and run the stiffeners through it in about 10 seconds for dimples. I love this thing. I do have and extra 2.5 inch yoke if anyone wants it for half price. Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "David & Betty Burton" <dburton(at)foxinternet.net> Sent: Friday, July 14, 2000 2:01 PM Subject: RV-List: tools > > Hi listers, > > I'm looking for a hand squeezer. Would prefer Avery's (and am open to > input if you have strong feelings about another brand) I've heard good > things about the Avery squeezer, and am considering getting a pneumatic > squeezer. I'm going to order a hand squeezer in a couple of days, as I > need that, a rivet fan and some other misc. stuff. I thought I ask here > first to see if anyone has an extra one, or maybe some other tools they > would like to sell. > > Thanks, > Dave Burton > RV6A (wings) > Seattle > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com>
Subject: bolts position
Date: Jul 14, 2000
This is the rule I go with as it makes most sense. If the bolts go in sideways, then I place the nut where it is most easily accessed for inspection. -- Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE Network Administrator Union Safe Deposit Bank 209-946-5116 -----Original Message----- From: barrys [mailto:barrys(at)viconet.com] Sent: Friday, July 14, 2000 12:57 PM To: RV-List Digest Server Subject: RV-List: bolts position We attended the Sportair class in Ga, last weekend. They said and I agree, bolt heads up, or front. It makes sense. If the nut comes loose and it is on top, the bolt falls out. Accelleration would do the same to a bolt that had the nut pointinf forward and it came off. Barry 666bp reserved unpacking tail to rv9a ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: "James K. Hurd" <hurd(at)boernenet.com>
Subject: Chevy-Powered RV6 for Sale
Posting for my neighbor... RV6 completed in 1997 powered by 4.3L Chevrolet V6 with Airpower 1.43:1 belt-reduction drive. 150 hours on AC and engine. Three-bladed Warp Drive ground-adjustable prop. VFR panel and Orndorff interior. Always hangared in Texas Hill Country. This bird will do an honest 200MPH and has a nice blue metallic paint job with silver and gold trim. Owner/builder is selling to raise cash to build a 160HP RV9. $45,000 contact: Louis Hastings 830/537-4751 wwwbetty@gvtc Boerne, TX ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com>
Subject: tools
Date: Jul 14, 2000
I bought a pneumatic squeezer after I started my fuselage. Big mistake. I should have bought it from the get-go. However, I wouldn't trade my hand squeezers in. I've found that there are times when a hand squeezer will fit into some pretty tight spots that a pneumatic won't. Although, a better builder than I would build the airplane such that this situation never occurred. -- Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE Network Administrator Union Safe Deposit Bank 209-946-5116 -----Original Message----- From: Bill Shook [mailto:billshook(at)mindspring.com] Sent: Friday, July 14, 2000 2:16 PM To: rv-list(at)matronics.com; dburton(at)foxinternet.net Subject: Re: RV-List: tools In my world (far far from normal reality) I do not own a hand sqeezer and can not see any use for one. The pneumatic allows me to go down a spar, rib or whatever either squeezing or dimpling so fast you would be amazed. Watching the Orndorff videos and how slow the same process goes with the hand sqeezer I really can't say enough how happy I am with the pneumatic. Clamp it in a vice and run the stiffeners through it in about 10 seconds for dimples. I love this thing. I do have and extra 2.5 inch yoke if anyone wants it for half price. Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "David & Betty Burton" <dburton(at)foxinternet.net> To: Sent: Friday, July 14, 2000 2:01 PM Subject: RV-List: tools > > Hi listers, > > I'm looking for a hand squeezer. Would prefer Avery's (and am open to > input if you have strong feelings about another brand) I've heard good > things about the Avery squeezer, and am considering getting a pneumatic > squeezer. I'm going to order a hand squeezer in a couple of days, as I > need that, a rivet fan and some other misc. stuff. I thought I ask here > first to see if anyone has an extra one, or maybe some other tools they > would like to sell. > > Thanks, > Dave Burton > RV6A (wings) > Seattle > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: Denis Walsh <deniswalsh(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Where's the metal
WAYNE BONESTEEL wrote: > > I have 9.4 hours on my RV-4 and going to do inspection and oil change. > I would like to know where the particulates such as metal accumulate > in the oil filter, any info would be appreciated. > > Wayne > You should cut and unfurl the filter so as to view the outside. I use a magnifying glass and a strong light. DLW name="deniswalsh.vcf" filename="deniswalsh.vcf" begin:vcard n:Walsh;Denis adr:;;;;;; version:2.1 email;internet:deniswalsh(at)earthlink.net fn:Denis Walsh end:vcard ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "ray sheffield" <rv6a(at)prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: tools
Date: Jul 14, 2000
I built my rv-6a with an avery squeezer and wouldnot trade it for any others that I have tried. I sold my air squeezer no real reason for one. ray rv6a 112rs waiting for registration to clear ----- Original Message ----- From: David & Betty Burton <dburton(at)foxinternet.net> Sent: Friday, July 14, 2000 2:01 PM Subject: RV-List: tools > > Hi listers, > > I'm looking for a hand squeezer. Would prefer Avery's (and am open to > input if you have strong feelings about another brand) I've heard good > things about the Avery squeezer, and am considering getting a pneumatic > squeezer. I'm going to order a hand squeezer in a couple of days, as I > need that, a rivet fan and some other misc. stuff. I thought I ask here > first to see if anyone has an extra one, or maybe some other tools they > would like to sell. > > Thanks, > Dave Burton > RV6A (wings) > Seattle > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Cammed O-360?
Hi Folks, I recently read either a post (but can't find in archives) or a web site (stumbled onto, no doubt, and can't find again) where a fellow had an Aero Sport engine which Bart had cammed up to 195HP. I'm doing the engine search thing now, and sure would like to get in touch with this person. Anyone? Thanks. Mike Thompson Austin, TX -6 N140RV (Reserved) Fuselage ==== Michael E. Thompson (Grobdriver(at)yahoo.com) Austin, TX, USA RV-6 in progress, N140RV (Reserved) EX-AX1 Sub Hunter, P-3 (B/B-TACMOD/C) Orion Aircrew, PP-G,ASEL, Motorglider Driver and Unlimited Air Race Nut! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Subject: Re: Domain Name
Date: Jul 14, 2000
> I don't want to start a riot, fight, or war.....BUT I believe the domain > names of > www.RV-4.com and www.rv-4.com are available. I can't believe that one of > you computer literate builders hasn't purchased this site address. I can't > even spell www, so I'm excused. I registered, and am using for my own site, www.rv-8.com since I'm building an -8. A friend of mine got www.rv6.com, www.rv-6a.com, and www.rv-9a.com since he plans on building one of the two some day. Indeed it is an oversight on Van's part not to tie up these domains, but then Van has never focused on marketing issues at all -- engineers tend not to. Randy Lervold RV-8, #80500, cowling (probably forever) www.rv-8.com Home Wing VAF ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: Don McNamara <n8rv(at)gte.net>
Subject: Re: tools
David & Betty Burton wrote: ... I thought I ask here first to see if anyone has an extra one, or maybe some other tools they would like to sell. I noticed that Bill Pagan is parting with his tools. This might be a real help to someone starting out. So, if you're looking for tools, check out Bill's site at: http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/9749/william.html I don't know what tools he has left, but it might be worth contacting him if you're in the market. --Don McNamara N8RV ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com.Fri,
(EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id" <B0004180184@mail-2.lbay.net>; Fri, 14 Jul 2000 12:35:32.-0700(at)matronics.com
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: tools
If you really want a pneumatic unit then get a hand squeezer that has interchangable yokes with your pneumatic unit so you can savo on monies. The fan spacer thingie you mention is pretty trick but I have used a fabric seamstress tape measure with good results, It does many things the fan thingie dosen't do. dburton(at)foxinternet.net on 07/14/2000 02:01:59 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RV-List: tools Hi listers, I'm looking for a hand squeezer. Would prefer Avery's (and am open to input if you have strong feelings about another brand) I've heard good things about the Avery squeezer, and am considering getting a pneumatic squeezer. I'm going to order a hand squeezer in a couple of days, as I need that, a rivet fan and some other misc. stuff. I thought I ask here first to see if anyone has an extra one, or maybe some other tools they would like to sell. Thanks, Dave Burton RV6A (wings) Seattle ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: barrys <barrys(at)viconet.com>
Subject: bolts position
We attended the Sportair class in Ga, last weekend. They said and I agree, bolt heads up, or front. It makes sense. If the nut comes loose and it is on top, the bolt falls out. Accelleration would do the same to a bolt that had the nut pointinf forward and it came off. Barry 666bp reserved unpacking tail to rv9a ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: tools
Date: Jul 14, 2000
In my world (far far from normal reality) I do not own a hand sqeezer and can not see any use for one. The pneumatic allows me to go down a spar, rib or whatever either squeezing or dimpling so fast you would be amazed. Watching the Orndorff videos and how slow the same process goes with the hand sqeezer I really can't say enough how happy I am with the pneumatic. Clamp it in a vice and run the stiffeners through it in about 10 seconds for dimples. I love this thing. I do have and extra 2.5 inch yoke if anyone wants it for half price. Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "David & Betty Burton" <dburton(at)foxinternet.net> Sent: Friday, July 14, 2000 2:01 PM Subject: RV-List: tools > > Hi listers, > > I'm looking for a hand squeezer. Would prefer Avery's (and am open to > input if you have strong feelings about another brand) I've heard good > things about the Avery squeezer, and am considering getting a pneumatic > squeezer. I'm going to order a hand squeezer in a couple of days, as I > need that, a rivet fan and some other misc. stuff. I thought I ask here > first to see if anyone has an extra one, or maybe some other tools they > would like to sell. > > Thanks, > Dave Burton > RV6A (wings) > Seattle > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com>
Subject: bolts position
Date: Jul 14, 2000
This is the rule I go with as it makes most sense. If the bolts go in sideways, then I place the nut where it is most easily accessed for inspection. -- Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE Network Administrator Union Safe Deposit Bank 209-946-5116 -----Original Message----- From: barrys [mailto:barrys(at)viconet.com] Sent: Friday, July 14, 2000 12:57 PM To: RV-List Digest Server Subject: RV-List: bolts position We attended the Sportair class in Ga, last weekend. They said and I agree, bolt heads up, or front. It makes sense. If the nut comes loose and it is on top, the bolt falls out. Accelleration would do the same to a bolt that had the nut pointinf forward and it came off. Barry 666bp reserved unpacking tail to rv9a ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: "James K. Hurd" <hurd(at)boernenet.com>
Subject: Chevy-Powered RV6 for Sale
Posting for my neighbor... RV6 completed in 1997 powered by 4.3L Chevrolet V6 with Airpower 1.43:1 belt-reduction drive. 150 hours on AC and engine. Three-bladed Warp Drive ground-adjustable prop. VFR panel and Orndorff interior. Always hangared in Texas Hill Country. This bird will do an honest 200MPH and has a nice blue metallic paint job with silver and gold trim. Owner/builder is selling to raise cash to build a 160HP RV9. $45,000 contact: Louis Hastings 830/537-4751 wwwbetty@gvtc Boerne, TX ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com>
Subject: tools
Date: Jul 14, 2000
I bought a pneumatic squeezer after I started my fuselage. Big mistake. I should have bought it from the get-go. However, I wouldn't trade my hand squeezers in. I've found that there are times when a hand squeezer will fit into some pretty tight spots that a pneumatic won't. Although, a better builder than I would build the airplane such that this situation never occurred. -- Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE Network Administrator Union Safe Deposit Bank 209-946-5116 -----Original Message----- From: Bill Shook [mailto:billshook(at)mindspring.com] Sent: Friday, July 14, 2000 2:16 PM To: rv-list(at)matronics.com; dburton(at)foxinternet.net Subject: Re: RV-List: tools In my world (far far from normal reality) I do not own a hand sqeezer and can not see any use for one. The pneumatic allows me to go down a spar, rib or whatever either squeezing or dimpling so fast you would be amazed. Watching the Orndorff videos and how slow the same process goes with the hand sqeezer I really can't say enough how happy I am with the pneumatic. Clamp it in a vice and run the stiffeners through it in about 10 seconds for dimples. I love this thing. I do have and extra 2.5 inch yoke if anyone wants it for half price. Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "David & Betty Burton" <dburton(at)foxinternet.net> To: Sent: Friday, July 14, 2000 2:01 PM Subject: RV-List: tools > > Hi listers, > > I'm looking for a hand squeezer. Would prefer Avery's (and am open to > input if you have strong feelings about another brand) I've heard good > things about the Avery squeezer, and am considering getting a pneumatic > squeezer. I'm going to order a hand squeezer in a couple of days, as I > need that, a rivet fan and some other misc. stuff. I thought I ask here > first to see if anyone has an extra one, or maybe some other tools they > would like to sell. > > Thanks, > Dave Burton > RV6A (wings) > Seattle > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Emrath" <Emrath(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Repairman Cert - Help!
Date: Jul 14, 2000
However, I think I recall some other post that say you have to do 51% of the activities that it takes to build a plane, not have done 51% of the building time. I recall hearing on this list about a certain part on the QB that comes unformed because you need to do that forming to meet the 51% rule. (someone even commented they messed up the part and had to reorder it and they got the part already formed - imagine that). I believe, that's how groups can build a plane, like the EAA Young Eagles or H.S. shop classes (they still have these?), and then have someone apply and receive the repairman's certificate, like the owner or financier of the project. So if you can show you did 51% of the activities that are required, there is a list somewhere, to build a plane, you should be good to go. FWIW. Marty in Brentwood ----- Original Message ----- SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id ;Thu" <B0004150828@mail-2.lbay.net>; <13 Jul 2000 11:02:48.-0700(at)matronics.com> Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2000 1:15 PM Subject: re: RV-List: Repairman Cert - Help! > > Finn, > It's difficult to deal with a stubborn inspector. Did you ask him what you would need to do > to convince him you had done 51%? > > My approach would be to compute your hours as compared to the "average" builder. > Hopefully you have documented your hours. If so, find out the "average" number of hours it > takes to build your model of RV (ask Van's) and do the arithmetic --- I'll bet you've done > much more than 51% of most home builders (given all those things you mentioned). > > Good luck! > > Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, close to finished > > > > > > > > I've just been told by the FAA inspector that he doesn't think I qualify > > for a repairman cert, as I didn't build the whole airplane. It was > > started by someone else back in '77. When I got it the wings were > > skinned, the fuselage had been jigged, firewall and bulkheads installed > > and side skins mostly riveted. The rear long bottom skin was there as > > well, but I've since replaced that. I built the emphenage and all > > control surfaces (the flaps and right elevator twice). I did the wing > > spar modification which included peeling back (almost removing) the > > bottom inner rear skins. I fabricated and welded up the missing tail > > spring mount, modified the engine mount and all the work involved in > > putting a Mazda 13B rotary engine in it. > > > > To me it looks like I've done a lot more work on the airframe that a > > current quick builder ever does, but how do I convince the FAA man about > > that? > > > > He also seems to think that the 51% rule only has to do with the > > certification of the aircraft as home built and almost said that a > > quickbuilder would not qualify for a repairman cert. > > > > Any ideas? > > > > Finn > > > > > > Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 > > > > > > _- > =========================================================== > > _- > =========================================================== > > _- > =========================================================== > > _- > =========================================================== > > > > > > > >** --------- End Original Message ----------- ** > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: Repairmans certificate
From: Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com>
Finn, > > I've just been told by the FAA inspector that he doesn't think I qualify > for a repairman cert, as I didn't build the whole airplane. It was > started by someone else back in '77. When I got it the wings were > skinned, the fuselage had been jigged, firewall and bulkheads installed > and side skins mostly riveted. The rear long bottom skin was there as > well, but I've since replaced that. I built the emphenage and all > control surfaces (the flaps and right elevator twice). I did the wing > spar modification which included peeling back (almost removing) the > bottom inner rear skins. I fabricated and welded up the missing tail > spring mount, modified the engine mount and all the work involved in > putting a Mazda 13B rotary engine in it. > > To me it looks like I've done a lot more work on the airframe that a > current quick builder ever does, but how do I convince the FAA man about > that? > > He also seems to think that the 51% rule only has to do with the > certification of the aircraft as home built and almost said that a > quickbuilder would not qualify for a repairman cert. > > Any ideas? > > Finn > >Finn, >It's difficult to deal with a stubborn inspector. Did you ask him what you >would need to do >to convince him you had done 51%? >My approach would be to compute your hours as compared to the >"average" builder. >Hopefully you have documented your hours. If so, find out the >"average" number of hours it >takes to build your model of RV (ask Van's) and do the arithmetic --- I'll >bet you've done >much more than 51% of most home builders (given all those things you >mentioned). The number of hours a builder spends to complete a project has nothing to do with whether it complies with the major majority rule (commonly referred to as the 51% rule). Any project is judged by use of an FAA form 8000-38 (Fabrication Assembly Operation Checklist). A copy is provided in the front section of more recent construction manuals. This is the form that the FAA uses to determine whether a project will meet the requirements of the "51%" rule, and it is what was used to determine if a kit (quick build or otherwise) will be listed on the FAA's approved kit list. Example... Once a builder has constructed a wing rib, the FAA considers him to have received the education benefit with that one rib. He could purchase all the rest prefabricated and not be penalized. It is amazing that they have chosen to treat it that way, but fortunate for us that the do. This is how a kit like the Quick Build kit can be sold and still comply. It has absolutely nothing to do with the total # of hours required to build. Every one should pass the word around about this, because it is a very common misunderstanding. It is a list of about 130 different tasks that the FAA has broken an aircraft construction project down into. Their are two columns for check marks, work that the kit Mfr. did, and work that the builder did. After marking all of the columns appropriately (some will have checks in both boxes if both builder and Mfr. did some of that work), you add up the checks in each column. If the # for the "builder did" column is higher than the "Mfr did" column, then the project complies. By FAR 21, any builder that builds an aircraft that is eligible for an amateur built airworthiness cert., is then eligible to apply for and receive a repairmans cert. for that specific aircraft. Under the letter of the law, as long as all of the builders (assuming there have been more than one) have completed construction for their own "education and recreation" (meaning no unapproved hired help was attained) and you can prove it (previous builders log, photo's, etc.) then with the amount of work you have completed, you are entitled to a repairmans cert., even though you are not the only one who has done construction work. If it comes down to it... get a copy of form 8000-38 and ask him to do an evaluation with it. Even with the work already done when you started, it sounds like you would easily comply. Scott McDaniels North Plains, OR These opinions and ideas are my own and may not reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Beam me up Scotty
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Ok, It appears that MR. Scott R McDaniels is once again somewhat monitoring this list and I for one feel MUCH better with someone firmly 'in the know' hanging around. :-) Wooohhooooo Bill -4 plugging along > Scott McDaniels > North Plains, OR > These opinions and ideas are my own and may not > reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer. > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Polenske, Eugene O" <Eugene.Polenske(at)PSS.Boeing.com>
Subject: Re: Repairmans certificate
Date: Jul 14, 2000
It sure is nice to have you around Scott. You possess a wealth of information and common sense. Thanks for monitoring us, and answering the tuff questions. > ---------- > From: Scott R McDaniels[SMTP:smcdaniels(at)juno.com] > Reply To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Sent: Friday, July 14, 2000 6:36 PM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: Re: Repairmans certificate > > > Finn, > > > > I've just been told by the FAA inspector that he doesn't think I > qualify > > for a repairman cert, as I didn't build the whole airplane. It was > > started by someone else back in '77. When I got it the wings were > > skinned, the fuselage had been jigged, firewall and bulkheads installed > > and side skins mostly riveted. The rear long bottom skin was there as > > well, but I've since replaced that. I built the emphenage and all > > control surfaces (the flaps and right elevator twice). I did the wing > > spar modification which included peeling back (almost removing) the > > bottom inner rear skins. I fabricated and welded up the missing tail > > spring mount, modified the engine mount and all the work involved in > > putting a Mazda 13B rotary engine in it. > > > > To me it looks like I've done a lot more work on the airframe that a > > current quick builder ever does, but how do I convince the FAA man > about > > that? > > > > He also seems to think that the 51% rule only has to do with the > > certification of the aircraft as home built and almost said that a > > quickbuilder would not qualify for a repairman cert. > > > > Any ideas? > > > > Finn > > > >Finn, > >It's difficult to deal with a stubborn inspector. Did you ask him what > you >would need to do > >to convince him you had done 51%? > > >My approach would be to compute your hours as compared to the >"average" > builder. > >Hopefully you have documented your hours. If so, find out the > >"average" number of hours it > >takes to build your model of RV (ask Van's) and do the arithmetic --- > I'll >bet you've done > >much more than 51% of most home builders (given all those things you > >mentioned). > > The number of hours a builder spends to complete a project has nothing to > do with whether it complies with the major majority rule (commonly > referred to as the 51% rule). > Any project is judged by use of an FAA form 8000-38 (Fabrication Assembly > Operation Checklist). A copy is provided in the front section of more > recent construction manuals. This is the form that the FAA uses to > determine whether a project will meet the requirements of the "51%" > rule, and it is what was used to determine if a kit (quick build or > otherwise) will be listed on the FAA's approved kit list. > > Example... Once a builder has constructed a wing rib, the FAA considers > him to have received the education benefit with that one rib. He could > purchase all the rest prefabricated and not be penalized. It is amazing > that they have chosen to treat it that way, but fortunate for us that the > do. > This is how a kit like the Quick Build kit can be sold and still comply. > It has absolutely nothing to do with the total # of hours required to > build. > > Every one should pass the word around about this, because it is a very > common misunderstanding. > > It is a list of about 130 different tasks that the FAA has broken an > aircraft construction project down into. > Their are two columns for check marks, work that the kit Mfr. did, and > work that the builder did. > After marking all of the columns appropriately (some will have checks in > both boxes if both builder and Mfr. did some of that work), you add up > the checks in each column. > > If the # for the "builder did" column is higher than the "Mfr did" > column, then the project complies. > > By FAR 21, any builder that builds an aircraft that is eligible for an> > amateur built airworthiness cert., is then eligible to apply for and > receive a repairmans cert. for that specific aircraft. > > Under the letter of the law, as long as all of the builders (assuming > there have been more than one) have completed construction for their own > "education and recreation" (meaning no unapproved hired help was > attained) and you can prove it (previous builders log, photo's, etc.) > then with the amount of work you have completed, you are entitled to a > repairmans cert., even though you are not the only one who has done > construction work. > > If it comes down to it... get a copy of form 8000-38 and ask him to do an > evaluation with it. Even with the work already done when you started, it > sounds like you would easily comply. > > > Scott McDaniels > North Plains, OR > These opinions and ideas are my own and may not > reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer. > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Kbeene(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: transition training
Thanks to everyone who sent a response about transition training. The two companies that required CFI dual and written approval was AVEMCO and Nation Air (Vangard). Nation Air seemed to think Van had long list of available contacts -- Van's response was that they only knew of Mike. Mike leaves Sunday to provide some training prior to Oshkosh and will be in the RV-6. He is scheduled after Oshkosh until the third week of August. I had checked the vansairforce web site and did not find CFIs with RV-6As. I contacted the EAA to see who they had issued the exemptions required for CFIs to give training in experimentals and got the same list. Ken N94KB ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Kbeene(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: Converting 150 hp O-320 to 160 hp
In a message dated 7/11/00 9:07:49 PM Central Daylight Time, douggray(at)ihug.com.au writes: > > This front bearing issue is important. I'm not sure of the detail > however one conversion done by a very reputable engine shop in this part > of the world has a cracked crankcase following the conversion. (after > several hundred hours only) > > The conversion included a modification to the case (machining) to fit > the larger front bearing. The crack was most likely coincedental to the > conversion but get some advice before proceeding. RAM holds the STC (#SE3692SW) for converting the O-320-E2D to 160 HP. This STC does not call for any modification to the front main bearing. Is there an STC that requires machining the case? Ken ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com>
Subject: Re: Beam me up Scotty
Bill Shook wrote: > > > Ok, It appears that MR. Scott R McDaniels is once again somewhat monitoring > this list and I for one feel MUCH better with someone firmly 'in the know' > hanging around. :-) Wooohhooooo > > Bill > -4 plugging along > > > Scott McDaniels > > North Plains, OR > > These opinions and ideas are my own and may not > > reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer. > > > So what are you saying that the rest of us are know nothings? ;-) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Beam me up Scotty
Date: Jul 14, 2000
> So what are you saying that the rest of us are know nothings? ;-) Oh man....that really came out wrong. I meant...er...what I was trying to say was....um, well damn it's hard to talk with my foot in my mouth. :-) How about this - Scott.....it sure is nice to see you adding your wisdom to that of the other genius' in the group. whew..think I might have pulled that one out of the fire. ;-) Great weekend all. Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: PANELCUT(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: Re: RV Badges for Oshkosh Update Please Read
Listers I think I have completed all the badges that I received mailers for I have four that I still need some info on so if anyone knows these people tell them to contact me via e-mail. Gary E. Graham Glen Gordon & wife Carl J. Franz Gene Larson If i have missed someone PLEASE be patient I have been overwelmed with these things. I hope everyone is happy with the results and hope to see them all at Oshkosh. Steve Davis The Panel Pilot ________________________________________________________________________________
From: PANELCUT(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 14, 2000
Subject: RVList Badges
Cecil I'm sorry about the delay getting back to you but have been busy trying to straighten out what is left of the badges for Oshkosh. Yours went out in the mail today you should have them in a few days, please let me know when you receive them. I would like to get two seats for the Oshkosh dinner but I think it's to late to send you the money, I'm good for it if you do not mind I will pay you when I get there, if thats a problem I understand but would love to attend. Thanks Steve Davis The Panel Pilot ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 14, 2000
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com>
Subject: Re: transition training
Kbeene(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > > Thanks to everyone who sent a response about transition training. > > The two companies that required CFI dual and written approval was AVEMCO and > Nation Air (Vangard). Nation Air seemed to think Van had long list of > available contacts -- Van's response was that they only knew of Mike. Mike > leaves Sunday to provide some training prior to Oshkosh and will be in the > RV-6. He is scheduled after Oshkosh until the third week of August. > > I had checked the vansairforce web site and did not find CFIs with RV-6As. I > contacted the EAA to see who they had issued the exemptions required for CFIs > to give training in experimentals and got the same list. > > Ken > N94KB > Where do you live Ken and does it have to be the 6A I have done quite a bit of transitional training in my RV-6 and would be glad to help if you are near Oregon and can the RV-6 would count. I assure you that if you can fly the -6 the 6A is a walk in the park. Jerry Springer CFI ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KR2LARRY(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Subject: Re: hand vs neumatic
I just ordered a 6A quick-build.Since I won't be doing near the amount of riviting as a kit started from scratch would you still recommend neumatic squeezer. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CW9371(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Subject: Re: hand vs neumatic
In a message dated 7/15/2000 2:13:28 AM Central Daylight Time, KR2LARRY(at)AOL.COM writes: << I just ordered a 6A quick-build.Since I won't be doing near the amount of riviting as a kit started from scratch would you still recommend neumatic squeezer. >> its a nice thing to have it you have the extra 600 plus dollars. If you are going to get one get a avery hand squezer so the jaws are interchangable. For me my budget said NO to that tool. I had other tools that I wanted more. chris wilcox f1 rocket kit 000 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Are Barstad" <abarstad(at)bconnex.net>
Subject: Crak in rudder TE. How to fix?
Date: Jul 15, 2000
I accidentally slipped a bit with the dimple arbour while dimpling the very trailing edge hole of the rudder. I was able to fix it up pretty good and it doesn't look too bad, but there is a small crack there. Is there any way of being proactive and fix this now, or do I just wait until it develops to a larger crack and then drill a hole on the other end? I have even contemplated buying a new rudder skin. You can see a picture of the offending spot by clicking the link below. http://www.avsim.com/hangar/fly/hangar/oops.jpg Are RV-8 C-GQRV (reserved) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: RE Miller <rmill2000(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: hand vs neumatic
--- KR2LARRY(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > I just ordered a 6A quick-build.Since I won't be > doing near the amount of > riviting as a kit started from scratch would you > still recommend neumatic > squeezer. A pneumatic squeezer enables even a novice to produce professional looking rivets in a second. It's also very useful for dimpling. You will find yourself going to it whenever possible. I would recommend the Avery Squeezer with 4" jaws. A "MUST HAVE" in my humble book. RE Miller RV-8 Finishing Fuse ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: RE Miller <rmill2000(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Electric Horizon Wanted
My search for a 12V electric horizon has not been fruitful thus far. If anyone knows of a good lead or is using one as a paperweight please write. Thanks RE Miller RV-8 Finishing Fuse ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Calvert" <rv6bldr(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Crak in rudder TE. How to fix?
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Here is a fix that I could live with if it were me. I would go ahead and use about a 1/32" bit and drill a stop hole. Next, drill another rivet hole about 5/16" away from the offending rivet hole so another rivet could be added for additional strength in that area. When the skin is riveted, put some rtv or maybe even a little proseal between the cracked dimple and stiffner to subdue the vibration in that area. I think it would be just fine, and after painting, wouldn't be noticeable. Jerry Calvert Edmond ok -6 fuse ----- Original Message ----- From: Are Barstad <abarstad(at)bconnex.net> Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 2:36 AM Subject: RV-List: Crak in rudder TE. How to fix? > > I accidentally slipped a bit with the dimple arbour while dimpling the very > trailing edge hole of the rudder. I was able to fix it up pretty good and it > doesn't look too bad, but there is a small crack there. > > Is there any way of being proactive and fix this now, or do I just wait > until it develops to a larger crack and then drill a hole on the other end? > I have even contemplated buying a new rudder skin. > > You can see a picture of the offending spot by clicking the link below. > > http://www.avsim.com/hangar/fly/hangar/oops.jpg > > Are > RV-8 C-GQRV (reserved) > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: Tim Bronson <IMAV8N(at)compuserve.com>
Subject: User fees for email
Bill Dunbar , Cliff Fiscus , David Glick , Russell Hajek , Gary Hummel , John Igoe , Bill Lloyd , Jamie Perry , "INTERNET:rv-list(at)matronics.com" , "=?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCOS1FZzdQOlFCZzNYGyhK?=" Getlemen, I normally don't forward much in the way of unsolicited email I receive since there is a lot of electronic "junk mail" floating around out there. The following is a exception, in my opinion. I think this may be of interest to all of you who use this email stuff regularly. Thanks for your understanding. Tim RE: User fees for email Federal Bill 602P proposes 5-cents per E-mail Sent. It figures! No more free E-mail! We knew this was coming!! Bill 602P will permit the Federal Government to charge a 5-cent charge on every delivered E-mail. Please read the following carefully if you intend to stay online, and continue using E-mail. The last few months have revealed an alarming trend in the Government of the United States attempting to quietly push through legislation that will affect our use of the Internet. Under proposed legislation, the US Postal Service will be attempting to bill E-mail users out of "alternative postage fees". Bill 602P will permit the Federal Government to charge a 5-cent surcharge on every E-Mail delivered by billing Internet Service Providers at source. The consumer would then be billed in turn by the ISP. Washington DC lawyer Richard Stepp is working without pay to prevent this legislation from becoming law. The US Postal Service is claiming that lost revenue, due to the proliferation of E-mail, is costing nearly $230,000,000 in revenue per year. You may have noticed their recent ad campaign: "There is nothing like a letter." Since the average person received about 10 pieces of E-mail per day in 1998, the cost of the typical individual would be an additional 50 cents a day -- or over $180 per year -- above and beyond their regular Internet costs. Note that this would be money paid directly to the US Postal Service for a service they do not even provide. The whole point of the Internet is democracy and noninterference. You are already paying an exorbitant price for snail mail because of bureaucratic inefficiency. It currently takes up to 6 days for a letter to be delivered from coast to coast. If the US Postal Service is allowed to tinker with E-mail, it will mark the end of the "free" Internet in the United States. Our congressional representative, Tony Schnell (R) has even suggested a "$20-$40 per month surcharge on all Internet service" above and beyond the governments proposed E-mail charges. Note that most of the major newspapers have ignored the story -- the only exception being the Washingtonian - which called the idea of E-mail surcharge "a useful concept who's time has come." (March 6th, 1999 Editorial). Do not sit by and watch your freedom erode away! Send this to E-mail to EVERYONE on your list, and tell all your friends and relatives to write their congressional representative and say "NO" to Bill 602P. It will only take a few moments of your time and could very well be instrumental in killing a bill we do not want. ----------------------- Internet Header -------------------------------- (Vircom SMTPRS 4.2.181) with SMTP id ; Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 07:00:15 -0400 Bcrogan01(at)sceinet.com, Tcrogan3(at)aol.com, jeffed(at)fyi.net, jefflee(at)lm.com, airsick1(at)aol.com, skids(at)forcomm.net, R14(at)stargate.net, tsdam(at)datawise.net, JustinGalmish(at)hotmail.com, cwh(at)hvsu.com, RichardMe(at)worldnet.att.net, darden3(at)mindspring.com, c185girl(at)aol.com, TomHorne(at)peoplepc.com, From: Dan Baun <baun(at)cboss.com> Subject: User fees for email ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Calvert" <rv6bldr(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Electric Horizon Wanted
Date: Jul 15, 2000
I know your frustration! There is a gentleman from Canada who sells used electric AH's and DG's on ebay. Several guys on the list have been fortunate enough to be high bidders and get the gyros. But lately, bidders have been bidding the heck out of them and the gyros are demanding quite high prices. The last AH sold for over $1200 for a 6 year old unit! These were going for $800 to $950 on past auctions. I can get a sparkling new RC Allen for around $1600 give or take a few bucks. There was a thread on some Chinese units for around a $1000 from ACS( I think). You can search archives for info on these. I'm going all electric with aux alternator and I think I will swallow hard and order a new RC Allen and leave the DG cutout covered until my throat quits hurting and then swallow hard again for a new DG! Jerry Calvert Edmond Ok -6 fuse ----- Original Message ----- From: RE Miller <rmill2000(at)yahoo.com> Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 5:59 AM Subject: RV-List: Electric Horizon Wanted > > My search for a 12V electric horizon has not been > fruitful thus far. If anyone knows of a good lead or > is using one as a paperweight please write. Thanks > > RE Miller > RV-8 > Finishing Fuse > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: old ogre <jollyd(at)teleport.com>
Subject: Re: Crak in rudder TE. How to fix?
In a place like he rudder, where there is going to be a ot of stress, the only way to get rid of that crack is either to drill it out, and use a bigger rivet, or replace the skin.....what does AC 43-13 say about that?....jolly in aurora or. trying to find a RV to fit my budget Are Barstad wrote: > > I accidentally slipped a bit with the dimple arbour while dimpling the very > trailing edge hole of the rudder. I was able to fix it up pretty good and it > doesn't look too bad, but there is a small crack there. > > Is there any way of being proactive and fix this now, or do I just wait > until it develops to a larger crack and then drill a hole on the other end? > I have even contemplated buying a new rudder skin. > > You can see a picture of the offending spot by clicking the link below. > > http://www.avsim.com/hangar/fly/hangar/oops.jpg > > Are > RV-8 C-GQRV (reserved) > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: hand vs neumatic
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Chris, extra 600 plus dollars? No sir, but it is an extra $300 over the hand squeezer. Leave out the bandsaw ($20 die grinder and cut off wheel work excellent in it's place) and you have broken even with a much more useful tool. Bill > > its a nice thing to have it you have the extra 600 plus dollars. If you are > going to get one get a avery hand squezer so the jaws are interchangable. > For me my budget said NO to that tool. I had other tools that I wanted more. > > chris wilcox > f1 rocket kit 000 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Subject: Laser Electronic Ignition
Fellow Listers, Couple of quick questions: 1. Im in the process of looking at engines and am leaning towards a 160hp, O-320 from vans. They now sell these engines with an option for the Laser electronic ignition already installed at the factory. My question is: does anyone have any good/bad experiences with these systems? How much really does it improve starting and fuel economy? (most of my flying would be cross country) 2. With the electronic ignition what additional switches/indicators needed to be added to your panels to operate/monitor the system, or will it all operate with a normal OFF, L,R, BOTH mag type switch??? As always thanks..... Kurt, OKC, OK RV6A QB ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com>
Subject: Re: User fees for email
Tim Bronson wrote: > > > Getlemen, > > I normally don't forward much in the way of unsolicited email I receive since > there is a lot of electronic "junk mail" floating around out there. The > following is a exception, in my opinion. I think this may be of interest > to all of you who use this email stuff regularly. > > Thanks for your understanding. > > Tim > > RE: User fees for email > > Federal Bill 602P proposes 5-cents per > E-mail Sent. Same old hoax been around for ever ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Subject: Bulkhead Question
Another Question..... In the process of installing the second (forward most) aft top skin on the RV6A quickbuild. Had no problem with the installation of the first skin, but no matter how I strap, duct tape, tie, push, bend or maneuver the forward most aft bulkhead ( the one that has the aft baggage wall attached to it) it keeps wanting to bend and flex even with just slight pressure against it. Just wondering if anyone else has come up with a solution to this problem (if they have seen it) or if ya'll might think its ok to attach some .063x3/4x3/4 angle to stiffen it up a bit?? Any ideas welcome!! Thanks. Regards, Kurt, OKC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CW9371(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Laser Electronic Ignition
In a message dated 7/15/2000 9:22:52 AM Central Daylight Time, KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM writes: << 1. Im in the process of looking at engines and am leaning towards a 160hp, O-320 from vans. They now sell these engines with an option for the Laser electronic ignition already installed at the factory. My question is: does anyone have any good/bad experiences with these systems? How much really does it improve starting and fuel economy? (most of my flying would be cross country) >> Laser or the FADEC system. The FADEC is for more advanced and is a factory option also. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CW9371(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Subject: Re: hand vs neumatic
In a message dated 7/15/2000 9:26:44 AM Central Daylight Time, billshook(at)mindspring.com writes: << Chris, extra 600 plus dollars? No sir, but it is an extra $300 over the hand squeezer. Leave out the bandsaw ($20 die grinder and cut off wheel work excellent in it's place) and you have broken even with a much more useful tool. >> Where do you get a pnemanitic squezer for only 300 dollars. Or is it 300 more then a hand one. The cheapest one I saw was about 600 dollars. Next I would still need the hand as I like not having the compressor running all the time since I have neighbors who HATE it. Also you would need 2 jaws for it as you need up to the 3" for a rocket. You dont need a band saw when building a F1 rocket. chris ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Subject: Re: Crak in rudder TE. How to fix?
Date: Jul 15, 2000
> I accidentally slipped a bit with the dimple arbour while dimpling the very > trailing edge hole of the rudder. I was able to fix it up pretty good and it > doesn't look too bad, but there is a small crack there. > > Is there any way of being proactive and fix this now, or do I just wait > until it develops to a larger crack and then drill a hole on the other end? > I have even contemplated buying a new rudder skin. Are, Personally, I'd replace the skin. We are fortunate that Van's has these parts readily avialable and very affordable (my guess would be $30-40 for that skin). The rudder is usually the first place cracks develop if they are going to. This is the reason why they came up with the RTV blobs at the end of the trailing edges. FWIW, Randy Lervold RV-8, #80500, cowling (probably forever) www.rv-8.com Home Wing VAF ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Subject: Re: Laser Electronic Ignition
Date: Jul 15, 2000
> 1. Im in the process of looking at engines and am leaning towards a > 160hp, O-320 from vans. They now sell these engines with an option for the > Laser electronic ignition already installed at the factory. My question is: > does anyone have any good/bad experiences with these systems? How much > really does it improve starting and fuel economy? (most of my flying would > be cross country) > > 2. With the electronic ignition what additional switches/indicators > needed to be added to your panels to operate/monitor the system, or will it > all operate with a normal OFF, L,R, BOTH mag type switch??? Kurt, I can't answer #1 because I am not flying with mine yet, but to answer question #2, you use your normal switch or toggles to operate it just like mags. You will need an extra switch (suggest a breaker switch) to turn it off/on, and an indicator light which they do not provide (easy to find). After talking recently at the Arlington fly-in with several builders who have them I am still convinced it's a good way to go, just can't provide you with any personal figures. Be aware though that many have tried to cost-justify it and it usually becomes about a wash over the TBO of the engine. So if you do it don't do it for the $ saving, rather the performance benefits. Personally, I can't stand the notion of fixed timing! Randy Lervold RV-8, #80500, cowling www.rv-8.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: David & Betty Burton <dburton(at)foxinternet.net>
Subject: Yoke question
Hi listers, Can anyone tell me if the Avery yokes fit on the CP-214 pneumatic squeezer? This is the style squeezer that Cleaveland sells, also ATP (sometimes called a #114). Thanks Dave ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: Norhtern CA Seminar 2000 date set
We have enough interest in a northern California to set a date for a weekend seminar. The weekend of September 30/October 1 has been selected. The site will be in Santa Rosa, California. Builders and aircraft owners are invited to check over the course description found at http://www.aeroelectric.com/seminars.html Reservations for this presentation may be entered on the same page. Bob . . . -------------------------------------------- ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) ( and still understand nothing. ) ( C.F. Kettering ) -------------------------------------------- http://www.aeroelectric.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Carl Froehlich" <carlfro(at)erols.com>
Subject: Re: Laser Electronic Ignition
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Is Van's offering the FADEC now on new engines? Carl Froehlich RV-8A (finish kit) Vienna, VA ----- Original Message ----- From: <CW9371(at)AOL.COM> Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 11:43 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Laser Electronic Ignition > > In a message dated 7/15/2000 9:22:52 AM Central Daylight Time, > KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM writes: > > << 1. Im in the process of looking at engines and am leaning towards a > 160hp, O-320 from vans. They now sell these engines with an option for the > Laser electronic ignition already installed at the factory. My question is: > > does anyone have any good/bad experiences with these systems? How much > really does it improve starting and fuel economy? (most of my flying would > be cross country) > >> > > > Laser or the FADEC system. The FADEC is for more advanced and is a factory > option also. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: Glenn & Judi <foxinsocks(at)mediaone.net>
Subject: Re: RV Badges for Oshkosh Update Please Read
PANELCUT(at)aol.com wrote: > > Listers > > I think I have completed all the badges that I received mailers for I have > four that I still need some info on so if anyone knows these people tell them > to contact me via e-mail. > > Gary E. Graham > Glen Gordon & wife > Carl J. Franz > Gene Larson > > If i have missed someone PLEASE be patient I have been overwelmed with these > things. I hope everyone is happy with the results and hope to see them all at > Oshkosh. > > Steve Davis > The Panel Pilot > Hi Steve, This is Glenn Gordon with 2 "N"s on Glenn. My wifes name is Judi. What other information can I provide you with? Glenn Gordon & Judi Gordon 421 West Thompson Blvd Buffalo Grove, IL 60090 EAA Chapter 790 Building RV-6 foxinsocks(at)mediaone.net Thanks again, Glenn Gordon ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: Matthew Gelber <mgelber(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: EPIC engine control
Since someone has mentioned the LASAR and FADEC systems, I wanted to add the supposedly Unison and Lycoming are making good progress on the EPIC system, which would digitally control the prop pitch as well as the mixture- giving you a one-control power system instead of three-control. I was just looking at the Unison and Lycoming web sites and the latest mention of it was the end of April. They were predicting it would be available at the end of 2000. Sounds like a great idea if they can keep the cost down, I'm going to delay the engine buy until last minute to see how this pans out. I think it would only work on injected engines, though... sure would be nice to get rid of those damn prop and mixture controls... I'll call around on Monday and then post back what I find out, I expect others would be interested as well. Matthew -8A 48PP ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Richard Sipp" <rsipp(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Laser Electronic Ignition
Date: Jul 15, 2000
On 7/15 Kurt asked: > Couple of quick questions: > > 1. Im in the process of looking at engines and am leaning towards a > 160hp, O-320 from vans. They now sell these engines with an option for the > Laser electronic ignition already installed at the factory. My question is: > does anyone have any good/bad experiences with these systems? How much > really does it improve starting and fuel economy? (most of my flying would > be cross country) > > 2. With the electronic ignition what additional switches/indicators > needed to be added to your panels to operate/monitor the system, or will it > all operate with a normal OFF, L,R, BOTH mag type switch??? > > As always thanks..... > > Kurt, OKC, OK > RV6A QB Kurt, et al, I now have 150 hours on a Laser Electronic ignition system on an O-320-D3G in a 4. I am very happy with its operation and service. The engine is significantly smoother particularly at idle. Starting has never been a problem ether. I am realizing at least the 7-10% fuel burn reductions they claim, particularly at higher altitudes (9000 +). If I remember correctly a jumper is needed on the standard ignition switch as both electronic mags are operating on startup. Instructions were included. I also added the optional panel indicator light that signals when the electronic controls are off and the mags are operating in the backup mode. This is checked on the run up. There is a point where battery voltage might be low enough to just crank the engine slowly but to low to get the ignition controller on line. In this case the engine won't start. Once running, in the event of total electrical failure the mags revert to conventional operation and require no external electrical power. Dick Sipp RV4-250DS 180 hours ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Calvert" <rv6bldr(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Bulkhead Question
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Kurt, Most of us used a piece of plywood with large hole cut in to get c-clamps through and clamped it to that flimsy bulkhead. I was looking at a QB6a in Ft Worth and it had J-stringer scraps riveted to the vertical sides of the bulkhead to stiffen it. Of course the top horizontal part of bulkhead was still a little flimsy, but plywood could be used up there to stiffen. Sounds like you are making good progress. I'm going to have to come by sometime and take a look. Jerry Calvert Edmond Ok -6 fuse ----- Original Message ----- From: <KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM> Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 9:30 AM Subject: RV-List: Bulkhead Question > > Another Question..... > > In the process of installing the second (forward most) aft top skin on > the RV6A quickbuild. Had no problem with the installation of the first skin, > but no matter how I strap, duct tape, tie, push, bend or maneuver the forward > most aft bulkhead ( the one that has the aft baggage wall attached to it) it > keeps wanting to bend and flex even with just slight pressure against it. > Just wondering if anyone else has come up with a solution to this problem (if > they have seen it) or if ya'll might think its ok to attach some .063x3/4x3/4 > angle to stiffen it up a bit?? Any ideas welcome!! Thanks. > > Regards, > > Kurt, OKC > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Mitch Faatz <mfaatz(at)avidyne.com>
Subject: hand vs neumatic
Date: Jul 15, 2000
>Where do you get a pnemanitic squezer for only 300 dollars. >Or is it 300 more then a hand one. The cheapest one I saw >was about 600 dollars. Next I would still need the hand as >I like not having the compressor running all the time since >I have neighbors who HATE it. I found a used pneumatic squeezer for ~$300 without trying very hard, no problem. I still have the hand squeezer for the "odd squeeze" or two. The compressor has hardly anything to do with it - it uses about three tablespoons of air per squeeze or something, so it rarely cycles the compressor. If you've got $300 bucks for one I wouldn't hesitate in a second. No clamping, one-handed squeeze, perfect dimple or rivet every time, much better chance of hitting it square, etc. Once you go around the edge of a wing skin dimpling a 100 holes in a couple of minutes and you'll understand what a great tool it is if you can afford it. Mitch Faatz RV-6AQ Finish Kit Bedford, MA (for now) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: hand vs neumatic
Date: Jul 15, 2000
> I just ordered a 6A quick-build....... would you still recommend neumatic > squeezer. Depends on how much cash you can tie up. When the project is done you can sell the pneumatic - easily! I am finishing up my RV6a quickbuild and wish I would have saved time with that investment. The question is just one of available cash. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HCRV6(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Bulkhead Question
In a message dated 7/15/00 7:33:56 AM Pacific Daylight Time, KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM writes: << it keeps wanting to bend and flex even with just slight pressure against it. >> I cut out a panel of 1/4 plywood that fit about 1 in. inside the F-606 bulkhead all around to stiffen it (on the back side so that it did not interfere with drilling and clecoing. It was held in place by #30 clecos through the same holes that were later enlarged for the #8 screws that hold the rear baggage panels in place. That worked OK but next time (HAH!) I would use 1/2 in. or even 3/4 in. plywood because I still got a little flexing when I pulled the straps down to snug the skin. As a result I have a small forward sweep in the rivet line that I will later swear was intentional. Harry Crosby -6 finish kit (worrying about where to run wiring) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Crak in rudder TE. How to fix?
Date: Jul 15, 2000
> I accidentally slipped a bit with the dimple Only you can decide if you can stand the repair you would make following AC43.13. If possible, leave it and move on to the rest of the airplane. After you gain more experience and make more serious booboos, you will have a better feel for how to deal with this. IMHO, creating a perfect machine can prevent on from ever creating a machine at all. This is your first, surely, so consider it a "student project" and move on. Make a note on the rudder skin with a magic marker. Hal Kempthorne RV6a N7HK ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com>
Subject: Oil pressure
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Maybe I can be enlightened on this subject: I have a relatively new overhauled engine, after engine start the idle oil pressure is 55-60 psi (OAT is 80-90'f). During take-off the oil pressure is 75 psi but after a few minutes (when the oil has heated up to 180'f it slowly begins to fall to 60-63 psi (bottom of the green arc) and just stays there, max oil temps are 210'f. I have turned the pressure relief spring in to its limit (this brought it up to its current reading). I am running a constant speed prop on a 200HP lycoming and the oil pressure pickup (electric) is on the front of the case on the other side of the govenor. The oil is 50 weight....I think I am going to try to get a stronger relief spring. On other airplanes I have flown I have not seen such a drastic drop of oil pressure as the oil heats up...when I taxi in the pressure is 45 psi at 900 rpm's. Does the location of the oil pressure transducer effect the pressure reading very much ( I assume it does to a point) ? Oil quantity is fine. This is not critical but I would feel better if the pressure was in the 80 psi range. THX ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Bulkhead Question
Date: Jul 15, 2000
> In the process of installing the second (forward most) aft top skin on > the RV6A quickbuild. Had no problem with the installation of the first skin, > but no matter how I strap, duct tape, tie, push, bend or maneuver ......... I think there are three problems with this part of the QB kit. First, this is a difficult thing to make with no more experience than one has gotten at this point in the project and the instructions are not very good. Second, the bulkheads are far from perfect. Third, the bulkheads are too soft and floppy for the method suggested. I did my second try with this large piece only after making plywood bulkhead stiffeners. I cut them approximately and roughly to shape and clecoed them to the bulkheads. This keeps the bulkheads flat. Then, strap the sheet down near the bulkheads and duct tape the straps in place. Check to be sure the bulkheads are staanding straight too. When you have it all clecoed up, check with a skimming light to see where shims are needed. Before you close it up you might put in wiring, seat belts, etc. Hal Kempthorne 2578 Elliot Court Santa Clara, CA 95051-1849 408.244.4984 CELL 408.230.0891 RV6a N7HK 99% 1965 Debonair for sale! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: hand vs neumatic
Date: Jul 15, 2000
> Where do you get a pnemanitic squezer for only 300 dollars. Or is it 300 > more then a hand one. The cheapest one I saw was about 600 dollars. I did indeed mean 300 over the hand squeezer. > Next I > would still need the hand as I like not having the compressor running all the > time since I have neighbors who HATE it. Compressor noise is a concern, if you have an oil free version. Keep in mind though the squeezer uses VERY little air. It's only a tiny pshhhh between rivets so even a small tank wouldn't run all that much due to the squeezer. > Also you would need 2 jaws for it > as you need up to the 3" for a rocket. If you need two jaws for the pneumatic, then you need them for the handheld as well. I have not needed more than one, but I could see the use for a thin nose no hole version. > You dont need a band saw when > building a F1 rocket. No sir....but you do need one seriously deep wallet. :-) Just don't smoke past me too badly....I'm kinda sensitive about speed and might burst into tears on the radio. You don't want to listen to that now do you? It's a miserable cloudy mess of a day here in Central Florida. As soon as I finish the crown moulding in the master, I'll be building airplane all day Woohooo. I love standing in the garage building a time machine when it's raining like hell out. Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Bulkhead Question
Jerry, Thanks for the note. Ive put in some hours, but have only really finished that rear skin, seats, bagage bin and seat floors, electric flaps, and will start the controls next week if I can get the other skin going and can stand to be in the garage when its 100 degrees!!!! How is your kit going? Have you passed me up yet?? I havent touched the wings yet...think I'll go as far as I can on the fuse, then hit the wings. Drop by anytime. I get home on Monday night and will be in town until the 23rd of the month, so drop by....address is 5216 SE 88th Street, just off of I-240 and sooner road. Number is 670-6240home/203-0874cell. Ive been distracted most of last month with both of my rental properties so I have been negligent in my building duties.....as I remember your familiar with that so you can relate!!! Also, say Hi to all the EAA folks.....as usual Im working this Sunday, but I guess you can assure them that Im low maintenance since I never get to the meetings, but I do keep up with the emails that Sid and Dianne send me. Also...Im still trying to unload a King KMA-24 with MB that I have, so if anyone in the Chapter is looking for one I can make them a good deal!! Its yellow tagged and still in the box. I paid about $850 a year ago, but with prices going down I would take $750 if I didnt' have to mail it. If not I may try e-bay. Also have a splitter that I was going to use to tie two nav radios into a single nav ant. I think Im going to go with just one nav radio and a gps. Let me know if anyone is looking for something like that..... Take care and keep building.... Kurt ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Christopher: Your readings sound about right to me given my experience on the 0-320 in my RV-4. I mounted my transducer on a port near the pressure relief spring on top of the engine. I did this for convenience (after counsulting with Lycoming). I believe the technician said the oil pressure can vary about 10 psi from back to front of the engine with the highest reading in the accessory section near the oil pump. My oil pressure reading is about 5 psi lower than normal probably due to the location of the transducer. You might check with Lycoming. I don't know why, but my engine came straight from Lycoming with this port (a small allen plug), while I have yet to see another 0-320 with this port near the pressure relief valve. Pat Hatch RV-4, N17PH @ VRB RV-6, Fuselage. ----- Original Message ----- From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com> Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 11:49 AM Subject: RV-List: Oil pressure > > Maybe I can be enlightened on this subject: I have a relatively new > overhauled engine, after engine start the idle oil pressure is 55-60 psi > (OAT is 80-90'f). During take-off the oil pressure is 75 psi but after a > few minutes (when the oil has heated up to 180'f it slowly begins to fall > to 60-63 psi (bottom of the green arc) and just stays there, max oil temps > are 210'f. I have turned the pressure relief spring in to its limit (this > brought it up to its current reading). I am running a constant speed prop > on a 200HP lycoming and the oil pressure pickup (electric) is on the front > of the case on the other side of the govenor. The oil is 50 weight....I > think I am going to try to get a stronger relief spring. On other airplanes > I have flown I have not seen such a drastic drop of oil pressure as the oil > heats up...when I taxi in the pressure is 45 psi at 900 rpm's. Does the > location of the oil pressure transducer effect the pressure reading very > much ( I assume it does to a point) ? Oil quantity is fine. This is not > critical but I would feel better if the pressure was in the 80 psi range. > > THX > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Bulkhead Question
next time I'll check the sent to box.....=( ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com>
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
It is true that pressure well very from front to back. My concern here is that you or anyone is mounting the transducer to the engine itself this is not a good thing. I know that lot of people have done it and have had no problems but the posibility is there that the vibration can cause fatigue and break the transducer off. Most applacations are installed using a flex line to the transducer mounted on the firewall in some type of manifold or bracket to hold it. I have seen what is left of a Questar Venture after the oil transducer broke off, not a pretty sight. Pat Hatch wrote: > > > Christopher: > > Your readings sound about right to me given my experience on the 0-320 in my > RV-4. I mounted my transducer on a port near the pressure relief spring on > top of the engine. I did this for convenience (after counsulting with > Lycoming). I believe the technician said the oil pressure can vary about 10 > psi from back to front of the engine with the highest reading in the > accessory section near the oil pump. My oil pressure reading is about 5 psi > lower than normal probably due to the location of the transducer. You might > check with Lycoming. > > I don't know why, but my engine came straight from Lycoming with this port > (a small allen plug), while I have yet to see another 0-320 with this port > near the pressure relief valve. > > Pat Hatch > RV-4, N17PH @ VRB > RV-6, Fuselage. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com> > To: > Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 11:49 AM > Subject: RV-List: Oil pressure > > > > > Maybe I can be enlightened on this subject: I have a relatively new > > overhauled engine, after engine start the idle oil pressure is 55-60 psi > > (OAT is 80-90'f). During take-off the oil pressure is 75 psi but after a > > few minutes (when the oil has heated up to 180'f it slowly begins to fall > > to 60-63 psi (bottom of the green arc) and just stays there, max oil temps > > are 210'f. I have turned the pressure relief spring in to its limit (this > > brought it up to its current reading). I am running a constant speed prop > > on a 200HP lycoming and the oil pressure pickup (electric) is on the front > > of the case on the other side of the govenor. The oil is 50 weight....I > > think I am going to try to get a stronger relief spring. On other > airplanes > > I have flown I have not seen such a drastic drop of oil pressure as the > oil > > heats up...when I taxi in the pressure is 45 psi at 900 rpm's. Does the > > location of the oil pressure transducer effect the pressure reading very > > much ( I assume it does to a point) ? Oil quantity is fine. This is not > > critical but I would feel better if the pressure was in the 80 psi range. > > > > THX > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: bcbraem(at)home.com.with.ESMTP (InterMail vM.4.01.02.00 201-229-116)
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Lasar Electronic Ignition
Unison cleared up the low voltage starting problem with their newer STC'd units, ala the Katana/Diamond DA-40 > > > On 7/15 Kurt asked: > > snip > > snip > There is a point where battery voltage might be low enough to just crank > the engine slowly but to low to get the ignition controller on line. In > this case the engine won't start. Once running, in the event of total > electrical failure the mags revert to conventional operation and require no > external electrical power. > > Dick Sipp > RV4-250DS 180 hours > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: Charlie and Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com>
Subject: Re: User fees for email
Tim Bronson wrote: > > > Getlemen, > > I normally don't forward much in the way of unsolicited email I receive since > there is a lot of electronic "junk mail" floating around out there. The > following is a exception, in my opinion. I think this may be of interest > to all of you who use this email stuff regularly. > > Thanks for your understanding. > > Tim > > RE: User fees for email > > Federal Bill 602P proposes 5-cents per > E-mail Sent. It figures! No more free E-mail! We knew this was coming!! > Bill 602P will permit the Federal Government to charge a 5-cent charge > From: Dan Baun <baun(at)cboss.com> > Subject: User fees for email Tim, Are you trolling, or did you just get hooked? :-> The Postal Service has repeatedly denied any interest in this, and has repeatedly said that it has no intention to ask for this. They even had a denial posted on their web site for awhile. It might interest you to know that the USPS receives NO tax money at all. If you are interested, I can supply you with a lot more info. Just email me off-list. Charlie flying -4 USPS employee ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Sally and George" <aeronut58(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Okay, I'm being paranoid, but please help. I'm fitting the canopy and have trimmed to the lines scribed on the canopy at Van's. The front of the canopy is the prescribed 3 1/4" back from the reference point, per the drawings. The fit is nearly perfect at front, rear and sides, but the top is about 1" too high for the roll bar to which it's to be rivetted. Obviously the thing has to be lowered. I could cut some off the bottom or I could move the canopy to the rear, but I'm concerned that there's that much clearance when I've reached the line Van's says is about as far as I should go. Everything else on this plane has been pretty much dead on to Van's dimensions. Has anyone else experienced this? Any suggestions before I apply a cut-off wheel to my $800 hunk of plastic? George Kilishek N888RV ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: gert <gert(at)execpc.com>
Subject: Re: hand vs neumatic
Last year in the oshkosh flymarket $320 with 4" yoke, rebuild. Gert CW9371(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > > In a message dated 7/15/2000 9:26:44 AM Central Daylight Time, > billshook(at)mindspring.com writes: > > << Chris, > > extra 600 plus dollars? No sir, but it is an extra $300 over the hand > squeezer. Leave out the bandsaw ($20 die grinder and cut off wheel work > excellent in it's place) and you have broken even with a much more useful > tool. > >> > > Where do you get a pnemanitic squezer for only 300 dollars. Or is it 300 > more then a hand one. The cheapest one I saw was about 600 dollars. Next I > would still need the hand as I like not having the compressor running all the > time since I have neighbors who HATE it. Also you would need 2 jaws for it > as you need up to the 3" for a rocket. You dont need a band saw when > building a F1 rocket. > > chris > -- Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227, any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500 US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: Garry Legare <versadek(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Crak in rudder TE. How to fix?
Hal, great advise couldn't have said it better myself. Way to many projects never get finished because of the perceived perfection required. If this is your first project, take a few hours off, go to airport and look at the factory spam cans. Look real close at some of the details, then go home, relax and build your airplane. Nuff preaching. Garry "6" finishing and finishing. kempthornes wrote: > > > I accidentally slipped a bit with the dimple > > Only you can decide if you can stand the repair you would make following > AC43.13. > > If possible, leave it and move on to the rest of the airplane. After you > gain more experience and make more serious booboos, you will have a better > feel for how to deal with this. > > IMHO, creating a perfect machine can prevent on from ever creating a machine > at all. This is your first, surely, so consider it a "student project" and > move on. Make a note on the rudder skin with a magic marker. > > Hal Kempthorne > RV6a N7HK > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "gertivs" <gertivs(at)netzero.net>
Subject: Re: Elevator cracks/kinks
Date: Jul 15, 2000
I have been reading with interest listers descriptions of cracks in the elevators/rudders, particularly at the stiffeners. Yes I have developed the cracks too. But unfortunately my left elevator has begun a new problem; kinks in the trailing edge. Not down as you would think but bending UP?! First one then two and now three kinks in the outboard 1/3 of the trailing edge. After a lot of headscratching I think that during high G up elevator the counterbalance downward pressure is stronger than the trailing edge can stand so that the edge is actually bending up against the wind. I fixed the first one by cutting away cracked metal with a halfmoon and filling with an aluminum filler. Since then two more kinks. Obviously not a solution. I am now considering rebuilding both elevators. I do not think the goop in the trailing edge will have any affect on the kinks. Would simply building with heavier skins solve everything? Paul Vander Schuur -4 at 270 hours Why pay for something you could get for free? ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Jerry, Maybe I am confusing terminology. The gauge is a combination Westach oil pressure/temp gauge (seems to work/ got it cheap) and the "transducer"?? is alittle bigger than a .45 cal handgun casing which screwed into the case with the leads attached. It is a electric gauge and the leads("wires") certainly seem flexible.......certainly more flexible then the steel braided line for my fuel flow (attached to the flow divider). This is the way the instructions depicted it......is this a bad set-up??? Seems airworthy. Chris ---------- > From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > Date: Saturday, July 15, 2000 3:01 PM > > > It is true that pressure well very from front to back. My concern here > is that you or anyone is mounting the transducer to the engine itself > this is not a good thing. I know that lot of people have done it > and have had no problems but the posibility is there that the vibration > can cause fatigue and break the transducer off. Most applacations > are installed using a flex line to the transducer mounted on the > firewall in some type of manifold or bracket to hold it. > I have seen what is left of a Questar Venture after the oil > transducer broke off, not a pretty sight. > > > Pat Hatch wrote: > > > > > > Christopher: > > > > Your readings sound about right to me given my experience on the 0-320 in my > > RV-4. I mounted my transducer on a port near the pressure relief spring on > > top of the engine. I did this for convenience (after counsulting with > > Lycoming). I believe the technician said the oil pressure can vary about 10 > > psi from back to front of the engine with the highest reading in the > > accessory section near the oil pump. My oil pressure reading is about 5 psi > > lower than normal probably due to the location of the transducer. You might > > check with Lycoming. > > > > I don't know why, but my engine came straight from Lycoming with this port > > (a small allen plug), while I have yet to see another 0-320 with this port > > near the pressure relief valve. > > > > Pat Hatch > > RV-4, N17PH @ VRB > > RV-6, Fuselage. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com> > > To: > > Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 11:49 AM > > Subject: RV-List: Oil pressure > > > > > > > > Maybe I can be enlightened on this subject: I have a relatively new > > > overhauled engine, after engine start the idle oil pressure is 55-60 psi > > > (OAT is 80-90'f). During take-off the oil pressure is 75 psi but after a > > > few minutes (when the oil has heated up to 180'f it slowly begins to fall > > > to 60-63 psi (bottom of the green arc) and just stays there, max oil temps > > > are 210'f. I have turned the pressure relief spring in to its limit (this > > > brought it up to its current reading). I am running a constant speed prop > > > on a 200HP lycoming and the oil pressure pickup (electric) is on the front > > > of the case on the other side of the govenor. The oil is 50 weight....I > > > think I am going to try to get a stronger relief spring. On other > > airplanes > > > I have flown I have not seen such a drastic drop of oil pressure as the > > oil > > > heats up...when I taxi in the pressure is 45 psi at 900 rpm's. Does the > > > location of the oil pressure transducer effect the pressure reading very > > > much ( I assume it does to a point) ? Oil quantity is fine. This is not > > > critical but I would feel better if the pressure was in the 80 psi range. > > > > > > THX > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Carl Froehlich" <carlfro(at)erols.com>
Subject: Re: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check
Date: Jul 15, 2000
George, I just did this today. You're right that it still needs to come down. Focus more on the front at first, then the back as needed to keep it off the skin. The sides need not be touched until the end (except to trim around the canopy latch tube). Remember that once your on the rollbar you'll need to get someone inside to raise the canopy frame up (sliding on the roller attachment tubes) until it is flush with the canopy. Carl Froehlich RV-8A Vienna VA ----- Original Message ----- From: Sally and George <aeronut58(at)hotmail.com> Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 6:20 PM Subject: RV-List: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check > > Okay, I'm being paranoid, but please help. > > I'm fitting the canopy and have trimmed to the lines scribed on the canopy > at Van's. > > The front of the canopy is the prescribed 3 1/4" back from the reference > point, per the drawings. The fit is nearly perfect at front, rear and > sides, but the top is about 1" too high for the roll bar to which it's to be > rivetted. > > Obviously the thing has to be lowered. I could cut some off the bottom or I > could move the canopy to the rear, but I'm concerned that there's that much > clearance when I've reached the line Van's says is about as far as I should > go. Everything else on this plane has been pretty much dead on to Van's > dimensions. > > Has anyone else experienced this? Any suggestions before I apply a cut-off > wheel to my $800 hunk of plastic? > > George Kilishek > N888RV > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rv660wm(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Where's the metal
In a message dated 7/14/00 8:39:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, deniswalsh(at)earthlink.net writes: << WAYNE BONESTEEL wrote: > > I have 9.4 hours on my RV-4 and going to do inspection and oil change. > I would like to know where the particulates such as metal accumulate > in the oil filter, any info would be appreciated >> An old hand at this,(actually he's younger than me, but been doing this for a long time) cut the end off, then he pulled the two internal end caps. He laid out the filter paper on some paper towels (much like my wife when she's doing beacon in the microwave), the next morning he looked at it in the sunlight. Any metal particles stood right out like points of light. The real question is how many is too many. We only saw a couple and he said this was probably on the low side for a first oil change! Has anyone got any pro or con comments on the opener that Avery sells compared to the more expensive ones I've seen in other catalogs? Bernie Kerr, 6A flying, SE Fla ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net>
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Hi Chris: I would take Jerry's advice and move your transducer to the fire wall. I know of three incidents of a failed transducer due to vibration. The failure that Jerry is referring to is not the wires but the transducer itself, they fail in the threads were it screws into the engine. When this happens it doesn't give you a lot of time until all the oil is pumped overboard. It does sound like yours is smaller than the one's I am used to but I would still be uncomfortable with any of them screwed directly into the engine. Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C. -----Original Message----- From: christopher huey <clhuey(at)sprynet.com> Date: Saturday, July 15, 2000 6:19 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > >Jerry, > >Maybe I am confusing terminology. The gauge is a combination Westach oil >pressure/temp gauge (seems to work/ got it cheap) and the "transducer"?? is >alittle bigger than a .45 cal handgun casing which screwed into the case >with the leads attached. It is a electric gauge and the leads("wires") >certainly seem flexible.......certainly more flexible then the steel >braided line for my fuel flow (attached to the flow divider). This is the >way the instructions depicted it......is this a bad set-up??? Seems >airworthy. > >Chris > >---------- >> From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com> >> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >> Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure >> Date: Saturday, July 15, 2000 3:01 PM >> >> >> It is true that pressure well very from front to back. My concern here >> is that you or anyone is mounting the transducer to the engine itself >> this is not a good thing. I know that lot of people have done it >> and have had no problems but the posibility is there that the vibration >> can cause fatigue and break the transducer off. Most applacations >> are installed using a flex line to the transducer mounted on the >> firewall in some type of manifold or bracket to hold it. >> I have seen what is left of a Questar Venture after the oil >> transducer broke off, not a pretty sight. >> >> >> Pat Hatch wrote: >> > >> > >> > Christopher: >> > >> > Your readings sound about right to me given my experience on the 0-320 >in my >> > RV-4. I mounted my transducer on a port near the pressure relief >spring on >> > top of the engine. I did this for convenience (after counsulting with >> > Lycoming). I believe the technician said the oil pressure can vary >about 10 >> > psi from back to front of the engine with the highest reading in the >> > accessory section near the oil pump. My oil pressure reading is about >5 psi >> > lower than normal probably due to the location of the transducer. You >might >> > check with Lycoming. >> > >> > I don't know why, but my engine came straight from Lycoming with this >port >> > (a small allen plug), while I have yet to see another 0-320 with this >port >> > near the pressure relief valve. >> > >> > Pat Hatch >> > RV-4, N17PH @ VRB >> > RV-6, Fuselage. >> > >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com> >> > To: >> > Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 11:49 AM >> > Subject: RV-List: Oil pressure >> > > >> > > >> > > Maybe I can be enlightened on this subject: I have a relatively new >> > > overhauled engine, after engine start the idle oil pressure is 55-60 >psi >> > > (OAT is 80-90'f). During take-off the oil pressure is 75 psi but >after a >> > > few minutes (when the oil has heated up to 180'f it slowly begins to >fall >> > > to 60-63 psi (bottom of the green arc) and just stays there, max oil >temps >> > > are 210'f. I have turned the pressure relief spring in to its limit >(this >> > > brought it up to its current reading). I am running a constant speed >prop >> > > on a 200HP lycoming and the oil pressure pickup (electric) is on the >front >> > > of the case on the other side of the govenor. The oil is 50 >weight....I >> > > think I am going to try to get a stronger relief spring. On other >> > airplanes >> > > I have flown I have not seen such a drastic drop of oil pressure as >the >> > oil >> > > heats up...when I taxi in the pressure is 45 psi at 900 rpm's. Does >the >> > > location of the oil pressure transducer effect the pressure reading >very >> > > much ( I assume it does to a point) ? Oil quantity is fine. This is >not >> > > critical but I would feel better if the pressure was in the 80 psi >range. >> > > >> > > THX >> > > >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com>
Subject: Vertical Card Compass
Date: Jul 14, 2000
I've flown planes with vertical card compasses and never had one work right, so I never considered putting one in my plane, and instead went with a traditional whiskey compass. Well I was just searching (surfing) the web looking for some unrelated stuff about compasses and came across an interesting article about why vertical card compasses are so notoriously unreliable. In a nutshell, if you use a steel screwdriver that is even moderately magnetized to install the compass, the pin that holds the magnet can and often does get pulled out by the magnetism of the installing tool, and the thing will of course be way off after that. Easy to fix by taking it apart and putting the pin back, and to avoid by using a non-magnetic screwdriver. The article was written by an avionics shop and they said they can't modify the compass so it won't happen but it seems to me that would be SIMPLE too. I recommend anyone who hs a VCC or is considering getting one take a look. Maybe this problem is known by now and the manufacturers have fixed it but anyway it seems worth knowing about. The article is at http://avionicswest.com/articles.htm. Still wondering about my original question however, which is, how do I swing the compass in my taildragger -6? I've been told and it seems reasonable that I can't get an accurate reading with the engine running on the ground since it won't be at a level flight attitude. A couple of people told me to line up on section lines but that only gives N S E W (and are the section lines true?) Must be some way to use GPS but that's only going to be accurate in a calm wind, right? Or am I missing something. What say the gurus? Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~100 hrs) Portland, OR http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JDaniel343(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Portland, OR visit
Hi, Contact Jerry Springer, a really nice guy. There are plenty of RV's at the Hillsbourogh (I know I spelt that wrong) where he is hangered. I was just there the weekend of the 4th. Give him a call, I don't have his number sorry. Say John Danielson gave you his name. John Danielson Fuselage ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check
Date: Jul 15, 2000
> > >Okay, I'm being paranoid, but please help. > >I'm fitting the canopy and have trimmed to the lines scribed on the canopy >at Van's. > >The front of the canopy is the prescribed 3 1/4" back from the reference >point, per the drawings. The fit is nearly perfect at front, rear and >sides, but the top is about 1" too high for the roll bar to which it's to >be >rivetted. > >Obviously the thing has to be lowered. I could cut some off the bottom or >I >could move the canopy to the rear, but I'm concerned that there's that much >clearance when I've reached the line Van's says is about as far as I should >go. Everything else on this plane has been pretty much dead on to Van's >dimensions. > >Has anyone else experienced this? Any suggestions before I apply a cut-off >wheel to my $800 hunk of plastic? > >George Kilishek >N888RV George, Paranoia is quite common when installing the canopy. Still, it really isn't that bad. Now, it appears you are very close to the point where I boldly ventured into the unknown and cut the windscreen free from the rest of the canopy. Once you have the front end trimmed to an approximate fit around the front deck as you have done, the whole job becomes much easier once the two sections are separated. This allows you to fit each piece for the best fit. I think I would make one more pass around the windscreen portion bottom edge, and take off maybe another 1/2". I positioned the front edge of the windscreen right where the plans show it should be and trimmed enough so that the canopy would just barely touch the top of the rollbar. Don't worry about how it conforms to the sides right now, that will be taken care of once the separation cut is made. Once this is done, cut that canopy loose and set 'em free! Hellelujah. There are some additional tips on mine and Randy Lervold's website which you might want to look at as well. Hang in there. Brian Denk RV8 N94BD 110 hrs. Paint job time! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net>
Subject: Re: Vertical Card Compass
Date: Jul 15, 2000
> > >Still wondering about my original question however, which is, how do I swing >the compass in my taildragger -6? I've been told and it seems reasonable >that I can't get an accurate reading with the engine running on the ground >since it won't be at a level flight attitude. A couple of people told me to >line up on section lines but that only gives N S E W (and are the section >lines true?) Must be some way to use GPS but that's only going to be >accurate in a calm wind, right? Or am I missing something. What say the >gurus? Randall, I like the swing-it-in-the-air method. Line up on the section lines and set your DG, taking into account variation. Swing it in the conventional manor but using the DG now instead of pavement markings. Keep checking the DG with the section lines. It worked well for me and it is hard to simulate the flight condition any better than actually being in flight. Use caution in Texas, some of their section lines don't line up with anything; very disorienting (maybe they are lined up with magnetic directions). Larry Pardue Carlsbad, NM RV-6 N441LP Not flying while I wait for Lamar to figure out a way to keep the rear starter bearing from continually falling out. http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Michael J. Robbins" <kitfox(at)gte.net>
Subject: Re: Laser Electronic Ignition
Date: Jul 15, 2000
----- Original Message ----- From: <KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM> I really can't add anything that hasn't already been said except to say that I ordered this system for my O-360, which I just picked up from Van's on Tuesday (with a BIG dent in the left forward rocker box cover!). Ordered it for most of the same reasons Randy did. Anybody know if there is a Lycoming rep in the Seattle area? Mike Robbins RV8Q 80591 on the gear, about to mount the wings ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Subject: Re: Elevator cracks/kinks
In a message dated 7/15/00 8:48:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time, gertivs(at)netzero.net writes: << I have been reading with interest listers descriptions of cracks in the elevators/rudders, particularly at the stiffeners. Yes I have developed the cracks too. But unfortunately my left elevator has begun a new problem; kinks in the trailing edge. Not down as you would think but bending UP?! First one then two and now three kinks in the outboard 1/3 of the trailing edge. After a lot of headscratching I think that during high G up elevator the counterbalance downward pressure is stronger than the trailing edge can stand so that the edge is actually bending up against the wind. I fixed the first one by cutting away cracked metal with a halfmoon and filling with an aluminum filler. Since then two more kinks. Obviously not a solution. I am now considering rebuilding both elevators. I do not think the goop in the trailing edge will have any affect on the kinks. Would simply building with heavier skins solve everything? Paul Vander Schuur -4 at 270 hours Why pay for something you could get for free? >> Paul, The way I read your post, it sounds like you are cutting away small sections of the trailing edge of your elevator. If you've done this, I'd recommend calling the factory before flying the aircraft again. I have no idea how much of a safety factor was designed into the elevators, but if you've cut away any part of the trailing edge, you've considerably reduced the torsional rigidity of your elevator. Since you're already seeing deformation in this area, I really, really think this could be a safety issue for you. Kyle Boatright ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: glenn williams <willig10(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Vertical Card Compass
okay here is how we do it in the real world. If you want the truest reading you can get this is how. 1. get a piece of scrap brass rod and use a die grinder or bench grinder and make it into a screwdriver. 2. take your airplane to a compass rose. 3. take with you a saw horse that will put the airplane in a level flight attitude. 4. turn on all electrical equipment. Your engine does not need to be running 5. start at North and tap your compass (lightly with your hand) with the airplane in a level flight attitude adjust as neccessary with your new brass screw driver. Tap it again and make sure the adjustment has held. 6. repeat as above for all headings 7. turn off all electrical equipment (dont want to drain your battery) 8 remove saw horse (take it back to the hangar) 9. check your oil 10. go fly Glenn --- Randall Henderson wrote: > > > I've flown planes with vertical card compasses and > never had one work right, > so I never considered putting one in my plane, and > instead went with a > traditional whiskey compass. Well I was just > searching (surfing) the web > looking for some unrelated stuff about compasses and > came across an > interesting article about why vertical card > compasses are so notoriously > unreliable. In a nutshell, if you use a steel > screwdriver that is even > moderately magnetized to install the compass, the > pin that holds the magnet > can and often does get pulled out by the magnetism > of the installing tool, > and the thing will of course be way off after that. > Easy to fix by taking it > apart and putting the pin back, and to avoid by > using a non-magnetic > screwdriver. The article was written by an avionics > shop and they said they > can't modify the compass so it won't happen but it > seems to me that would be > SIMPLE too. I recommend anyone who hs a VCC or is > considering getting one > take a look. Maybe this problem is known by now and > the manufacturers have > fixed it but anyway it seems worth knowing about. > > The article is at > http://avionicswest.com/articles.htm. > > Still wondering about my original question however, > which is, how do I swing > the compass in my taildragger -6? I've been told and > it seems reasonable > that I can't get an accurate reading with the engine > running on the ground > since it won't be at a level flight attitude. A > couple of people told me to > line up on section lines but that only gives N S E W > (and are the section > lines true?) Must be some way to use GPS but that's > only going to be > accurate in a calm wind, right? Or am I missing > something. What say the > gurus? > > Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~100 hrs) > Portland, OR > http://www.edt.com/homewing > > > > through > > http://www.matronics.com/archives > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > Matronics! > > > > ==== Glenn Williams 8A A&P ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 15, 2000
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com>
Subject: Re: Portland, OR visit
JDaniel343(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > > Hi, > Contact Jerry Springer, a really nice guy. There are plenty of RV's at the > Hillsbourogh (I know I spelt that wrong) where he is hangered. I was just > there the weekend of the 4th. > Give him a call, I don't have his number sorry. Say John Danielson gave you > his name. > > John Danielson > Fuselage > Gee John I am blushing:-) Glad you liked your ride. Jerry ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Ronvandervort(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Subject: Re: Laser Electronic Ignition
Kurt, I have the Lasar as purchased new from Van's on an 0-360. With 318 hours on it my experience is: 1. Great starting, but in Seattle area that is no problem from the cold anyway. 2. Unable to hand prop because of no impulse coupling, so I was not able to fly with a failed starter solenoid. Same with dead battery. 3. At approx. 300 hrs the left mag failed. Unison sent me a new left and right mag at no cost to install as the early ones had failing relay problems. (that is suspected to be my problem.) At this time I do not know yet what the diagnosis is on my failed mag as Unison hasn't had the chance to sort it all out due to the key person having been on vacation. 3. Yes you should install either a switch, or a breaker that you can pull as a switch, to the Lasar system. Reason being that if at cold cranking the Lasar system senses too low a voltage/or current avail, it takes itself out of the operation ie. if the black box doesn't get proper voltage or current it shuts down. By having a switch you can have the Lasar off until after the initial cranking, and turn it on once the engine has started to rotate and the initial voltage/current drain from the starter has passed. It is rarely needed here in Seattle, but in colder climes I would guess it would be most appreciated. 4. There is an option also to install a warning lite that illuminates when the Lasar system is not the primary system, ie. a failure or shut down of some sort. I recommend the warning lite. I put a little pea size lite in that takes up no space at all. It will help in the diagnosis of my mag failure problem from the operators standpoint at least. I hope this helps, Ron Vandervort, Seattle area, RV-6 318 hours ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Subject: Re: RV-List:Pneumatic VS Hand
Ok, now you guys got me wanting an air squeezer. My tool lust hormones are running rampant after a 12 hour day in the shop anyway. Does anyone have one for sale? Kevin Shannon -9 Wings ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com>
Subject: Bulkhead Question
Date: Jul 16, 2000
I did this too, on my slow-build RV-6A. I still had to shim the skin on both sides at the main longeron to make it lie smooth. Steve Soule Huntington, Vermont -----Original Message----- Kurt, Most of us used a piece of plywood with large hole cut in to get c-clamps through and clamped it to that flimsy bulkhead. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 2000
From: John Lawson <jwlawson(at)hargray.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List Digest: 64 Msgs - 07/15/00
> > From: Tim Bronson <IMAV8N(at)compuserve.com> > Subject: RV-List: User fees for email > > Getlemen, > > I normally don't forward much in the way of unsolicited email I receive since > there is a lot of electronic "junk mail" floating around out there. The > following is a exception, in my opinion. I think this may be of interest > to all of you who use this email stuff regularly. > > Thanks for your understanding. > > Tim > > RE: User fees for email > > Federal Bill 602P proposes 5-cents per > E-mail Sent. It figures! No more free E-mail! We knew this was coming!! > Bill 602P will permit the Federal Government to charge a 5-cent charge > on every delivered E-mail. On the theory that an ounce of prevention is worth a ton of cure...I saw that this has been addressed already by others (including Tim), but this is a site worth going to when you want to check out other possible hoaxes: http://www.urbanlegends.com/ One of the pages that addresses this particular hoax is http://www.urbanlegends.com/ulz/emailtax.html Semper Fi John ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robynne" <robynne(at)harare.iafrica.com>
Subject: Re: hand vs neumatic
Date: Jul 16, 2000
posted by: RE Miller > > > --- KR2LARRY(at)AOL.COM> > A pneumatic squeezer enables even a novice to produce > professional looking rivets in a second. It's also > very useful for dimpling. You will find yourself > going to it whenever possible. I would recommend the > Avery Squeezer with 4" jaws. A "MUST HAVE" in my > humble book. > > RE Miller > RV-8 Finishing Fuse > > I have had only the pneumatic squeezer from the start and would not want to be without it It saves time and fatigue The 4" yoke is probably a bit to flexible for 1/8" rivets and weight is also to be considered I have made myself 4 extra yokes, including several no hole yokes, as the need arose , and consider it money and effort well worth it Jan Rijkers > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Pat Hatch" <pat_hatch(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Chris: I agree with Jerry Springer and Eustace that the transducer should be mounted on the firewall, probably even the small one that you have. I should have clarified this in my message...I mounted mine on the engine some 10 years ago before I knew better. And it is on my list of things "to do." Same goes for the fuel pressure transducer and oil temp. Van sells a small manifold for this purpose that mounts on the firewall and has three ports for transducers. Probably the way to go. Pat Hatch RV-4, N17PH @ VRB RV-6, Fuselage ----- Original Message ----- From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com> Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 6:50 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > > Jerry, > > Maybe I am confusing terminology. The gauge is a combination Westach oil > pressure/temp gauge (seems to work/ got it cheap) and the "transducer"?? is > alittle bigger than a .45 cal handgun casing which screwed into the case > with the leads attached. It is a electric gauge and the leads("wires") > certainly seem flexible.......certainly more flexible then the steel > braided line for my fuel flow (attached to the flow divider). This is the > way the instructions depicted it......is this a bad set-up??? Seems > airworthy. > > Chris > > ---------- > > From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com> > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > > Date: Saturday, July 15, 2000 3:01 PM > > > > > > It is true that pressure well very from front to back. My concern here > > is that you or anyone is mounting the transducer to the engine itself > > this is not a good thing. I know that lot of people have done it > > and have had no problems but the posibility is there that the vibration > > can cause fatigue and break the transducer off. Most applacations > > are installed using a flex line to the transducer mounted on the > > firewall in some type of manifold or bracket to hold it. > > I have seen what is left of a Questar Venture after the oil > > transducer broke off, not a pretty sight. > > > > > > Pat Hatch wrote: > > > > > > > > > Christopher: > > > > > > Your readings sound about right to me given my experience on the 0-320 > in my > > > RV-4. I mounted my transducer on a port near the pressure relief > spring on > > > top of the engine. I did this for convenience (after counsulting with > > > Lycoming). I believe the technician said the oil pressure can vary > about 10 > > > psi from back to front of the engine with the highest reading in the > > > accessory section near the oil pump. My oil pressure reading is about > 5 psi > > > lower than normal probably due to the location of the transducer. You > might > > > check with Lycoming. > > > > > > I don't know why, but my engine came straight from Lycoming with this > port > > > (a small allen plug), while I have yet to see another 0-320 with this > port > > > near the pressure relief valve. > > > > > > Pat Hatch > > > RV-4, N17PH @ VRB > > > RV-6, Fuselage. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com> > > > To: > > > Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 11:49 AM > > > Subject: RV-List: Oil pressure > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe I can be enlightened on this subject: I have a relatively new > > > > overhauled engine, after engine start the idle oil pressure is 55-60 > psi > > > > (OAT is 80-90'f). During take-off the oil pressure is 75 psi but > after a > > > > few minutes (when the oil has heated up to 180'f it slowly begins to > fall > > > > to 60-63 psi (bottom of the green arc) and just stays there, max oil > temps > > > > are 210'f. I have turned the pressure relief spring in to its limit > (this > > > > brought it up to its current reading). I am running a constant speed > prop > > > > on a 200HP lycoming and the oil pressure pickup (electric) is on the > front > > > > of the case on the other side of the govenor. The oil is 50 > weight....I > > > > think I am going to try to get a stronger relief spring. On other > > > airplanes > > > > I have flown I have not seen such a drastic drop of oil pressure as > the > > > oil > > > > heats up...when I taxi in the pressure is 45 psi at 900 rpm's. Does > the > > > > location of the oil pressure transducer effect the pressure reading > very > > > > much ( I assume it does to a point) ? Oil quantity is fine. This is > not > > > > critical but I would feel better if the pressure was in the 80 psi > range. > > > > > > > > THX > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "lothar klingmuller" <lothark(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Laser Electronic Ignition /What if?
Date: Jul 16, 2000
> 2. Unable to hand prop because of no impulse coupling, so I was not able >to fly > with a failed starter solenoid. Same with dead battery. The lack of the impulse coupling is IMHO a NOT SO GOOG feature. If I had known that, I would not have ordered the Lazar ingition. My engine arrived a week ago, so now I have to live with this "handicap" of not being able to handcranck the engine.. I just hope I will not get stuck at some lonesome AP or isolated strip!! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 2000
From: pdsmith <pdsmith(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: Yoke question
Yes they do fit just fine. Phil, 80691 ----- Original Message ----- From: David & Betty Burton <dburton(at)foxinternet.net> Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 8:56 AM Subject: RV-List: Yoke question > > Hi listers, > > Can anyone tell me if the Avery yokes fit on the CP-214 pneumatic squeezer? > This is the style squeezer that Cleaveland sells, also ATP (sometimes called a > #114). Thanks > > Dave > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Emrath" <Emrath(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: hand vs neumatic
Date: Jul 16, 2000
I purchased a used one with 2.5" Yoke from "The Yard" last October. I haven't used it much, you do have to hold tight when riveting 1/8 rivets as the tool twists in your hand. You also need an adjustable set like Avery sells, or a set of dies with various thicknesses as there is no adjustment on the tool for the amount of squeeze delivered. I agree it works great for dimpling things but haven't finished my fuselage structure to try it out upon. Look'en forward to that however. I set my compressor for 90 lbs. for this tool, but it doesn't use much air. Go to www.yardstore.com or call 1-800-888-8991 in K.C. Good Luck, and for you fishermen out there, "and Keep a Tight Line". Marty in Brentwood, TN ----- Original Message ----- From: "gert" <gert(at)execpc.com> Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 6:34 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: hand vs neumatic > > Last year in the oshkosh flymarket $320 with 4" yoke, rebuild. > > Gert > > CW9371(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > > > > > In a message dated 7/15/2000 9:26:44 AM Central Daylight Time, > > billshook(at)mindspring.com writes: > > > > << Chris, > > > > extra 600 plus dollars? No sir, but it is an extra $300 over the hand > > squeezer. Leave out the bandsaw ($20 die grinder and cut off wheel work > > excellent in it's place) and you have broken even with a much more useful > > tool. > > >> > > > > Where do you get a pnemanitic squezer for only 300 dollars. Or is it 300 > > more then a hand one. The cheapest one I saw was about 600 dollars. Next I > > would still need the hand as I like not having the compressor running all the > > time since I have neighbors who HATE it. Also you would need 2 jaws for it > > as you need up to the 3" for a rocket. You dont need a band saw when > > building a F1 rocket. > > > > chris > > > > -- > > Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227, > any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address > is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500 > US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gardner, Douglas (GA01)" <douglas.gardner(at)honeywell.com>
Subject: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Hi George... My -8A came together with out any major problems also, but that canopy really had me concerned, I was so afraid of cracking it when attaching the plexi to the steel frame. And that's exactly what I did, twice when pop riveting the plexi to the frame prior to fitting the skirt. They call for 3 rivets on each side as temps to hold the canopy in place. I must have cut that plexi 20 times fitting it to the proper dimensions. If your holes are not drilled exactly at 90 deg, a stress happens when you squeeze the pop. My cracks were one inch long going up which I stop drilled, so my skirt will cover that portion. Several suggestions I've learned from others I'll comment on; 1. Drill thru both plexi and frame and install No. 6 screws w/ capnuts on the plexi part 21 holes on each side. 2. Proseal any irregularities where plexi meets steel (Charlie Kuss) 3. Mixed in the bag of pop rivets for the canopy were steel shanked rivets mixed in. Use magnet to separate. 4. I talked to the maunf of the canopy in Ohio, his comments were to not use pop rivets.. Incidentally, my skirt fit like a glove, no need to cut it in half, as so many have done. Seems like all these "big" deals on this project turn out really well, that's why so many build again I guess. Regards, Doug Gardner 8A #80717 Palm Harbor Fla -----Original Message----- From: Sally and George [mailto:aeronut58(at)hotmail.com] Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 6:21 PM Subject: RV-List: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check Okay, I'm being paranoid, but please help. I'm fitting the canopy and have trimmed to the lines scribed on the canopy at Van's. T= Subscription: http://www.matronics.com/subscribe ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 2000
From: Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com>
Subject: Re: Laser Electronic Ignition /What if?
Not to long ago in one of the "What's New" sections of one of the aviation mags I get there was a blurb that Unison is now producing the Lasar system with impulse couplings. This would be a must have feature if I were to use the Lasar system. I am leaning towards Jeff Rose's system or Lightspeeds. More bang for the buck and I keep one of my impulse coupled mags if the electronic fails. Also one of the local 6A's Lasar failed after 15 hours. Could not get his engine to start one morning and finally called Unison. They sent him two new mags and said it was something about a failed relay. Another local builder who is not flying yet called Unison and they sent him two new mags without question after he mentioned the above 15 hour failure. It would seem that Unison is having problems with the system and is not telling anybody except those that call. Gary Zilik RV-6A still flying with old tractor ignition. lothar klingmuller wrote: > The lack of the impulse coupling is IMHO a NOT SO GOOG feature. If I had > known that, I would not have ordered the Lazar ingition. My engine arrived > a week ago, so now I have to live with this "handicap" of not being able to > handcranck the engine.. I just hope I will not get stuck at some lonesome > AP or isolated strip!! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: cecilth(at)juno.com
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Subject: RVList Badges - - - Oshkosh Table
PLEASE don't anyone send me any money. Purchasing tickets to the banquet is to be thru Barbara at Vans. After settling with her you pick up your tickets at Vans Booth at Oshkosh. Just be aware that for years there has only been 300 tickets to be had. And more and more people are building these great machines than ever, so logic seems to say that they will sell out earlier each year. While on the subject, Here is the list of people I have down for the Banquet. 1. Tom Clark 2. Joe Morin 3. Frank Sykes 4. Kevin Horton 5. Al Mojzisik 6. Louise Coats 7. Maria Styles/Heleborus 8. Len Leggette 9. Jack Fromm 10.Larry Bowen 11.Jim PIckrell 12.Jeff Orear 13.Steve Eberhart 14.Larry Helming 15. Steve Davis When you get to the lawn area between 6pm and 7pm when we go into the banquet, look for the 'RV List' Group hanging out on the East side of the group, this is the side closest to the lake. I hope to be able to fashion a sign or helium balloon or something to indicate that area for the List people. Once inside we can only really talk to our immediate neighbors at the table. If I didn't get your name on the list, let me know. Cecil Hatfield > > Cecil > > I'm sorry about the delay getting back to you but have been busy > trying to straighten out what is left of the badges for Oshkosh. Yours went > out in the mail today you should have them in a few days, please let me know > when you receive them. I would like to get two seats for the Oshkosh dinner > but I think it's to late to send you the money, I'm good for it if you do > not mind I will pay you when I get there, if thats a problem I understand but > would love to attend. > > Thanks > Steve Davis > The Panel Pilot > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Noel" <bnoel(at)ausa.net>
Subject: Re: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check
Date: Jul 16, 2000
It helps to make holes bigger than fasteners. Not just for install, but due to expansion. Use washer under buck tail to make up for larger hole, and use proseal. The proseal is a great adhesive and allows plastic to float. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gardner, Douglas (GA01)" <douglas.gardner(at)honeywell.com> Sent: Sunday, July 16, 2000 11:18 AM Subject: RE: RV-List: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check > > Hi George... My -8A came together with out any major problems also, but that > canopy really had me concerned, I was so afraid of cracking it when > attaching the plexi to the steel frame. And that's exactly what I did, twice > when pop riveting the plexi to the frame prior to fitting the skirt. They > call for 3 rivets on each side as temps to hold the canopy in place. I must > have cut that plexi 20 times fitting it to the proper dimensions. If your > holes are not drilled exactly at 90 deg, a stress happens when you squeeze > the pop. My cracks were one inch long going up which I stop drilled, so my > skirt will cover that portion. Several suggestions I've learned from others > I'll comment on; > 1. Drill thru both plexi and frame and install No. 6 screws w/ capnuts on > the plexi part 21 holes on each side. > 2. Proseal any irregularities where plexi meets steel (Charlie Kuss) > 3. Mixed in the bag of pop rivets for the canopy were steel shanked rivets > mixed in. Use magnet to separate. > 4. I talked to the maunf of the canopy in Ohio, his comments were to not use > pop rivets.. > > Incidentally, my skirt fit like a glove, no need to cut it in half, as so > many have done. Seems like all these "big" deals on this project turn out > really well, that's why so many build again I guess. > Regards, > Doug Gardner 8A #80717 Palm Harbor Fla > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sally and George [mailto:aeronut58(at)hotmail.com] > Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 6:21 PM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: RV-List: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check > > > Okay, I'm being paranoid, but please help. > > I'm fitting the canopy and have trimmed to the lines scribed on the canopy > at Van's. > > T= Subscription: http://www.matronics.com/subscribe > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: bcbraem(at)home.com.with.ESMTP (InterMail vM.4.01.02.00 201-229-116)
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Subject: Re: LASAR Electronic Ignition /What if?
The LASAR ignition systems that come installed on the Lycomings DO NOT have the low voltage starting problem and can be hand cranked. They had to fix that problem to get their spam can STC from the FAA. If they are having a problem with some of their magnetos, it's not enough to worry Lycoming, Diamond Aircraft, Piper or Cessna (or Van's). Lycoming and Unison (LASAR) have teamed up to produce and engine/prop control system, EPiC that is similar to Continental's FADEC with an all-in-one engine control lever, but cannot be retrofitted (or so they say!). for a quick overview, see Private Pilot, 8/2000, pg. 74. LightSpeed installation instructions (1998) specify a non-impulse coupled magneto. This is a problem, and I will be replacing my LightSpeed system with the LASAR when finances permit. I have no first-hand info on the Jeff Rose system. Boyd > > > Not to long ago in one of the "What's New" sections of one of the aviation mags I > get there was a blurb that Unison is now producing the Lasar system with impulse > couplings. This would be a must have feature if I were to use the Lasar system. I > am leaning towards Jeff Rose's system or Lightspeeds. More bang for the buck and I > keep one of my impulse coupled mags if the electronic fails. > >snip > Gary Zilik > RV-6A still flying with old tractor ignition. > > lothar klingmuller wrote: > > > The lack of the impulse coupling is IMHO a NOT SO GOOG feature. If I had > > known that, I would not have ordered the Lazar ingition. My engine arrived > > a week ago, so now I have to live with this "handicap" of not being able to > > handcranck the engine.. I just hope I will not get stuck at some lonesome > > AP or isolated strip!! > > o ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Laser Electronic Ignition
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Local Lycoming rep hangs out in Seattle. Lyc sent him here to inspect the very minor shipping damage to my new Lycoming. New rocker boxes. Shipping crate is inadequate IMHO. Hal Kempthorne 2578 Elliot Court Santa Clara, CA 95051-1849 408.244.4984 CELL 408.230.0891 RV6a N7HK 99% 1965 Debonair for sale! ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Robbins <kitfox(at)gte.net> Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 8:50 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Laser Electronic Ignition > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM> > > I really can't add anything that hasn't already been said except to say that > I ordered this system for my O-360, which I just picked up from Van's on > Tuesday (with a BIG dent in the left forward rocker box cover!). Ordered it > for most of the same reasons Randy did. Anybody know if there is a Lycoming > rep in the Seattle area? > > Mike Robbins > RV8Q 80591 > on the gear, about to mount the wings > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check
Date: Jul 16, 2000
I am not being critical of anything Van did, just reporting on what several ancient builders and A&Ps said when I mentioned the pop rivets holding the plexiglass -- "Pop rivets in plexiglass???" I just had the windshield in my Debonair replaced. Screws #6, I think, in 3/16 holes. Installation instructions from Cee Bailey, maker of handmade plexi parts, warns against use of several chemicals, cleaners etc as they destroy plexi - making it crack. Vinyl is especially bad, they say, and a vinyl glareshield can crack the windshield in less than a year. This probably explains why my Deb had cracked windshield when I bought it in 1992 and again this year. I don't know if Proseal is okay or not. Bailey's supplied some very sticky black stuff. ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Noel <bnoel(at)ausa.net> Sent: Sunday, July 16, 2000 10:27 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check > > It helps to make holes bigger than fasteners. Not just for install, but due > to expansion. Use washer under buck tail to make up for larger hole, and use > proseal. The proseal is a great adhesive and allows plastic to float. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gardner, Douglas (GA01)" <douglas.gardner(at)honeywell.com> > To: > Sent: Sunday, July 16, 2000 11:18 AM > Subject: RE: RV-List: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check > > > > > > > Hi George... My -8A came together with out any major problems also, but > that > > canopy really had me concerned, I was so afraid of cracking it when > > attaching the plexi to the steel frame. And that's exactly what I did, > twice > > when pop riveting the plexi to the frame prior to fitting the skirt. They > > call for 3 rivets on each side as temps to hold the canopy in place. I > must > > have cut that plexi 20 times fitting it to the proper dimensions. If your > > holes are not drilled exactly at 90 deg, a stress happens when you squeeze > > the pop. My cracks were one inch long going up which I stop drilled, so my > > skirt will cover that portion. Several suggestions I've learned from > others > > I'll comment on; > > 1. Drill thru both plexi and frame and install No. 6 screws w/ capnuts on > > the plexi part 21 holes on each side. > > 2. Proseal any irregularities where plexi meets steel (Charlie Kuss) > > 3. Mixed in the bag of pop rivets for the canopy were steel shanked rivets > > mixed in. Use magnet to separate. > > 4. I talked to the maunf of the canopy in Ohio, his comments were to not > use > > pop rivets.. > > > > Incidentally, my skirt fit like a glove, no need to cut it in half, as so > > many have done. Seems like all these "big" deals on this project turn out > > really well, that's why so many build again I guess. > > Regards, > > Doug Gardner 8A #80717 Palm Harbor Fla > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Sally and George [mailto:aeronut58(at)hotmail.com] > > Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 6:21 PM > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > Subject: RV-List: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check > > > > > > > > Okay, I'm being paranoid, but please help. > > > > I'm fitting the canopy and have trimmed to the lines scribed on the canopy > > at Van's. > > > > T= Subscription: http://www.matronics.com/subscribe > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Christopher Huey wrote: > I think I am going to try to get a stronger relief spring. I don't think you understand the function of the relief spring. Okay, one of us doesn't! Hal Kempthorne (I'm not sure I understand all I know about it.) 2578 Elliot Court Santa Clara, CA 95051-1849 408.244.4984 CELL 408.230.0891 RV6a N7HK 99% 1965 Debonair for sale! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Subject: Re: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check
In a message dated 7/16/00 7:55:35 PM Eastern Daylight Time, kempthornes(at)home.com writes: << I am not being critical of anything Van did, just reporting on what several ancient builders and A&Ps said when I mentioned the pop rivets holding the plexiglass -- "Pop rivets in plexiglass???" >> Hal's exactly right. You're running a risk by putting pop rivets (even the soft ones Van supplies for the canopies) into plexi. Mark Friedricks, as I recall, suggested oversizing the holes in the plexi, then countersinking, then using #6 tinnermans between the rivets and the plexi in areas where you have to use pop rivets. This distributes the loads much better than the pop rivets alone. Kyle Boatright ________________________________________________________________________________
From: cecilth(at)juno.com
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Subject: Oshkosh Table
Here is the revised Table List. Am I up to date? Cecil 1. Tom Clark 2. Joe Morin 3. Frank Sykes 4. Kevin Horton, RV-8 (cockpit stuff) 5. Al Mojzisik 6. Louise Coats, (New Zealand) 7. Maria Styles/Heleborus, (Australia) 8. Len Leggette, RV-8A North Carolina 9. Jack Fromm 10. Larry Bowen 11. Jim PIckrell, RV-8 12. Jeff Orear 13. Steve Weddle 14. Steve Davis, Panel Pilot 15. Steve Davis Friend 16. Bruce Knoll 17. Bruce Knoll friend 18. Les Rowles, Traralgon Australia. 19.Tom Velvick, rv-6a 20. Kellen Velvick 21. John Fasching, RV6A Salida CO 22. Jim Farmer ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Carl Froehlich" <carlfro(at)erols.com>
Subject: Re: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check
Date: Jul 16, 2000
With the help of two good fellow RV-8 builders I was able to fit and drill the canopy on this weekend. Highly recommend the drilling technique offered by Scott McDaniels in his 31 July 1999 post about drilling the frame with #40 bits, then drilling the canopy into the hole already in the frame. The trick is to use masking tape lightly held on the frame, then clamp the canopy on. The canopy/frame contact point comes out as a thin line on the tape. Use this to mark the positions of the holes, drill, then put the canopy back on. Worked like a champ. Carl Froehlich RV-8A (finish kit) Vienna, VA ----- Original Message ----- From: <KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM> Sent: Sunday, July 16, 2000 8:05 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check > > In a message dated 7/16/00 7:55:35 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > kempthornes(at)home.com writes: > > << I am not being critical of anything Van did, just reporting on what > several > ancient builders and A&Ps said when I mentioned the pop rivets holding the > plexiglass -- "Pop rivets in plexiglass???" >> > > > > Hal's exactly right. You're running a risk by putting pop rivets (even the > soft ones Van supplies for the canopies) into plexi. Mark Friedricks, as I > recall, suggested oversizing the holes in the plexi, then countersinking, > then using #6 tinnermans between the rivets and the plexi in areas where you > have to use pop rivets. This distributes the loads much better than the pop > rivets alone. > > Kyle Boatright > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Hal, Lycoming produces different tension springs to adjust for installation differences. The engine shop at my airport had part numbers for atleast 3 spring tensions. Also I have been told you can use washers (even with the screw type adjustment) but the preferred way is to change out the springs. I can tell you with complete certainty that when you turn the adjustment screw clockwise the oil pressure goes up. I am going to look into this subject further...(call Lycoming, company that made the pressure sender, etc....) and will be glad to share any info I learn. Sincerely, Chris ---------- > From: kempthornes <kempthornes(at)home.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > Date: Sunday, July 16, 2000 6:52 PM > > > Christopher Huey wrote: > > I think I am going to try to get a stronger relief spring. > > I don't think you understand the function of the relief spring. Okay, one > of us doesn't! > > Hal Kempthorne (I'm not sure I understand all I know about it.) > 2578 Elliot Court > Santa Clara, CA 95051-1849 > 408.244.4984 CELL 408.230.0891 > RV6a N7HK 99% > 1965 Debonair for sale! > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: N-Number Application
Date: Jul 16, 2000
I'm ready to get my N-number and I've reviewed the archives. I believe the process is to call 405-954-3116 and find out what's available. Then I send in a letter (Randy's form) and $10. I did not see any mention in the archives of an FAA application form nor a bill of sale. I have a bill of sale from Van's and I assume it is required along with the application letter. If anyone can offer any words of wisdom I'd appreciate it! Dennis Persyk getting closer Hampshire, IL C38 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Craig Hiers" <craig-rv4(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Brakes
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Listers For all you brake guru's........ I departed TLH this morning flew for about 1 hour, returned landed everything was great. About 2 hours later I was going up to Quincy,FL to hang out with the local airport bum's. I get in the plane, go through the RV ritual of getting everything in order, put my feet on the brakes prior to starting the engine and the right pedel goes down about three times as far as normal. I peel myself out of the plane ( heat index112 degree's ), and start looking for something obvious. Well just my luck, nothing looks out of wack. Brake reservoir full, no leaks anywhere. The local guy's say air has infiltrated the system. I'm not sure how this could happen.......but what do I know! I guess it's either air or the pedel cylinder has gone belly up. Anyone have any idea's or similar experience? Craig Hiers ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 2000
From: Wayne and Cindy <rwayne(at)gamewood.net>
Subject: RV-8A Aileron Misalignment
Dear RV-8A Quickbuilders: I have run into a problem and wonder if any other QBers have found same, if so, how did you fix it? As you know the aileron bracket and hinge is all prepunched, both rivet and bolts holes, as well as the rivet holes in the rear spar. Therefore there is no way to adjust or align aileron placement. My ailerons are both exactly 3/16" too low. This leaves a larger than normal gap at the leading edge and a very noticeable step-off at the flap. The only 'fix' I can come up with is to install new aileron brackets (not predrilled) and move the bolt holes accordingly. (By the way, I did send back to Van's to get the newly designed flap braces, so alignment here was not a problem; ie. the flaps are correctly positioned). Thanks. Wayne Williams RV-8A QB ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 2000
From: Denny Harjehausen <harje(at)proaxis.com>
Subject: In Line Filters?
I have decided to install in-line filters from each tank. I have a couple of filters that Spruce sells that use a hose and clamp over a barbed tube for connection. I have looked for a fitting that could connected to the aluminum tubing with barbs for the filter hose end. No luck thus far. I am assuming that it is not a wise move to slip the hose over the aluminum tubing with a clamp to secure it. Or Is It? Anyone have any experience in this area? All ideas welcome! Good Day to You! Denny- RV-6 Lebanon, OR ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 2000
From: Tim Bronson <IMAV8N(at)compuserve.com>
Subject: N-Number Application
RE: RV-List: N-Number Application "Dennis Persyk" wrote: Date: Jul 16, 2000
From: Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
Subject: Re: N-Number Application
Dennis Persyk wrote: > > > I'm ready to get my N-number and I've reviewed the archives. I believe the > process is to call 405-954-3116 and find out what's available. Then I send > in a letter (Randy's form) and $10. I did not see any mention in the > archives of an FAA application form nor a bill of sale. I have a bill of > sale from Van's and I assume it is required along with the application > letter. > If anyone can offer any words of wisdom I'd appreciate it! The info you need is here: http://home.HiWAAY.net/~sbuc/journal/register.html Hope you get your favored number! Sam Buchanan "The RV Journal" http;//home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Adjusting your relief spring will make the release pressure higher IF THE OIL PUMP can provide the higher pressure. Why can't the oil pump provide higher pressures?? 1. The pump is worn letting pressure escape. 2. The bearing clearances are worn so that the pump cannot build up pressure 3. The oil is TOO HOT so that the pump cannot overcome both the wear in the pump and the wear in the bearings. If you have low pressure at idle, turning up the relief valve will NOT correct this. Generally, when the engine is cool, the oil pressure gage tells you the pressure setting. If it remains there at cruise then your engine clearances are good. If the cruise pressure drops when the oil is hot, then you can try increasing the pressure, but I am willing to say that it will increase the cold pressures but the hot pressure is limited by the pump and bearing clearances. I even put in a High volume oil pump to quiet some noisy lifters in a Chevy V-8. Helped but didn't cure the loose front cam bearing. Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact! (Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com) ----- Original Message ----- From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com> Sent: Sunday, July 16, 2000 5:59 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > > Hal, > > Lycoming produces different tension springs to adjust for installation > differences. The engine shop at my airport had part numbers for atleast 3 > spring tensions. Also I have been told you can use washers (even with the > screw type adjustment) but the preferred way is to change out the springs. > I can tell you with complete certainty that when you turn the adjustment > screw clockwise the oil pressure goes up. I am going to look into this > subject further...(call Lycoming, company that made the pressure sender, > etc....) and will be glad to share any info I learn. > > Sincerely, > > Chris > > ---------- > > From: kempthornes <kempthornes(at)home.com> > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > > Date: Sunday, July 16, 2000 6:52 PM > > > > > > Christopher Huey wrote: > > > I think I am going to try to get a stronger relief spring. > > > > I don't think you understand the function of the relief spring. Okay, > one > > of us doesn't! > > > > Hal Kempthorne (I'm not sure I understand all I know about it.) > > 2578 Elliot Court > > Santa Clara, CA 95051-1849 > > 408.244.4984 CELL 408.230.0891 > > RV6a N7HK 99% > > 1965 Debonair for sale! > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ted Lumpkin" <tlump(at)mediaone.net>
Subject: Re: In Line Filters?
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Denny, I have installed K&N 'billet" fuel filters in my RV-4 (not flying yet). These filters are aluminum and have a 37 degree, 3/8 tube flare on each end. Mine were about $50 each. I don't like the idea of using rubber tubing and hose clamps in an aircraft fuel system. Ted -----Original Message----- From: Denny Harjehausen <harje(at)proaxis.com> Date: Sunday, July 16, 2000 8:04 PM Subject: RV-List: In Line Filters? > >I have decided to install in-line filters from each tank. >I have a couple of filters that Spruce sells that use a >hose and clamp over a barbed tube for connection. I have >looked for a fitting that could connected to the aluminum >tubing with barbs for the filter hose end. No luck thus far. > >I am assuming that it is not a wise move to slip the hose over >the aluminum tubing with a clamp to secure it. Or Is It? > >Anyone have any experience in this area? > >All ideas welcome! > > >Good Day to You! >Denny- RV-6 >Lebanon, OR > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
Subject: Re: In Line Filters?
Date: Jul 16, 2000
You need to get a Parker tubing beader to do it right. Why are you going to a non-standard fuel system? One which the FAA will not approve for certified? There is a reason for the gascolator and not a filter system. Filter the gas as you put it in on the ground not when you take it out in the air. Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact! (Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Denny Harjehausen" <harje(at)proaxis.com> Sent: Sunday, July 16, 2000 9:59 PM Subject: RV-List: In Line Filters? > > I have decided to install in-line filters from each tank. > I have a couple of filters that Spruce sells that use a > hose and clamp over a barbed tube for connection. I have > looked for a fitting that could connected to the aluminum > tubing with barbs for the filter hose end. No luck thus far. > > I am assuming that it is not a wise move to slip the hose over > the aluminum tubing with a clamp to secure it. Or Is It? > > Anyone have any experience in this area? > > All ideas welcome! > > > Good Day to You! > Denny- RV-6 > Lebanon, OR > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 2000
From: Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com>
Subject: Re: Brakes
Sounds to me like you had an air bubble in just the right place and it entered the pressure side of the system on your last stop. The only recourse is to bleed the brakes again. Gary Zilik Craig Hiers wrote: > > Listers > > For all you brake guru's........ > > I departed TLH this morning flew for about 1 hour, returned landed > everything was great. > > About 2 hours later I was going up to Quincy,FL to hang out with the local > airport bum's. > > I get in the plane, go through the RV ritual of getting everything in order, > put my feet on the > brakes prior to starting the engine and the right pedel goes down about > three times as far as normal. > I peel myself out of the plane ( heat index112 degree's ), and start looking > for something obvious. > Well just my luck, nothing looks out of wack. Brake reservoir full, no leaks > anywhere. > > The local guy's say air has infiltrated the system. I'm not sure how this > could > happen.......but what do I know! > > I guess it's either air or the pedel cylinder has gone belly up. > > Anyone have any idea's or similar experience? > > Craig Hiers > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 2000
From: Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org>
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
All, I think you'll find that the oil temp transducer will not work if it's at the end of a hose. The oil out there is going to be kind of cool, especially without any flow. Also if the transducer is no bigger than my temp unit, it will probably be less prone to failure when mounted on the engine than the hoses and connections. Dave , RV6 Waiting for the DAR Pat Hatch wrote: > > Chris: > > I agree with Jerry Springer and Eustace that the transducer should be > mounted on the firewall, probably even the small one that you have. I > should have clarified this in my message...I mounted mine on the engine some > 10 years ago before I knew better. And it is on my list of things "to do." > Same goes for the fuel pressure transducer and oil temp. Van sells a small > manifold for this purpose that mounts on the firewall and has three ports > for transducers. Probably the way to go. > > Pat Hatch > RV-4, N17PH @ VRB > RV-6, Fuselage > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com> > To: > Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 6:50 PM > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > > > > > Jerry, > > > > Maybe I am confusing terminology. The gauge is a combination Westach oil > > pressure/temp gauge (seems to work/ got it cheap) and the "transducer"?? > is > > alittle bigger than a .45 cal handgun casing which screwed into the case > > with the leads attached. It is a electric gauge and the leads("wires") > > certainly seem flexible.......certainly more flexible then the steel > > braided line for my fuel flow (attached to the flow divider). This is the > > way the instructions depicted it......is this a bad set-up??? Seems > > airworthy. > > > > Chris > > > > ---------- > > > From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com> > > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > > > Date: Saturday, July 15, 2000 3:01 PM > > > > > > > > > It is true that pressure well very from front to back. My concern here > > > is that you or anyone is mounting the transducer to the engine itself > > > this is not a good thing. I know that lot of people have done it > > > and have had no problems but the posibility is there that the vibration > > > can cause fatigue and break the transducer off. Most applacations > > > are installed using a flex line to the transducer mounted on the > > > firewall in some type of manifold or bracket to hold it. > > > I have seen what is left of a Questar Venture after the oil > > > transducer broke off, not a pretty sight. > > > > > > > > > Pat Hatch wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Christopher: > > > > > > > > Your readings sound about right to me given my experience on the 0-320 > > in my > > > > RV-4. I mounted my transducer on a port near the pressure relief > > spring on > > > > top of the engine. I did this for convenience (after counsulting with > > > > Lycoming). I believe the technician said the oil pressure can vary > > about 10 > > > > psi from back to front of the engine with the highest reading in the > > > > accessory section near the oil pump. My oil pressure reading is about > > 5 psi > > > > lower than normal probably due to the location of the transducer. You > > might > > > > check with Lycoming. > > > > > > > > I don't know why, but my engine came straight from Lycoming with this > > port > > > > (a small allen plug), while I have yet to see another 0-320 with this > > port > > > > near the pressure relief valve. > > > > > > > > Pat Hatch > > > > RV-4, N17PH @ VRB > > > > RV-6, Fuselage. > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com> > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 11:49 AM > > > > Subject: RV-List: Oil pressure > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe I can be enlightened on this subject: I have a relatively new > > > > > overhauled engine, after engine start the idle oil pressure is 55-60 > > psi > > > > > (OAT is 80-90'f). During take-off the oil pressure is 75 psi but > > after a > > > > > few minutes (when the oil has heated up to 180'f it slowly begins to > > fall > > > > > to 60-63 psi (bottom of the green arc) and just stays there, max oil > > temps > > > > > are 210'f. I have turned the pressure relief spring in to its limit > > (this > > > > > brought it up to its current reading). I am running a constant speed > > prop > > > > > on a 200HP lycoming and the oil pressure pickup (electric) is on the > > front > > > > > of the case on the other side of the govenor. The oil is 50 > > weight....I > > > > > think I am going to try to get a stronger relief spring. On other > > > > airplanes > > > > > I have flown I have not seen such a drastic drop of oil pressure as > > the > > > > oil > > > > > heats up...when I taxi in the pressure is 45 psi at 900 rpm's. Does > > the > > > > > location of the oil pressure transducer effect the pressure reading > > very > > > > > much ( I assume it does to a point) ? Oil quantity is fine. This is > > not > > > > > critical but I would feel better if the pressure was in the 80 psi > > range. > > > > > > > > > > THX > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Ferdfly(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
In a message dated 7/16/00 8:15:31 PM Pacific Daylight Time, cgalley(at)qcbc.org writes: << Why can't the oil pump provide higher pressures?? 1. The pump is worn letting pressure escape. 2. The bearing clearances are worn so that the pump cannot build up pressure 3. The oil is TOO HOT so that the pump cannot overcome both the wear in the pump and the wear in the bearings. >> OR Possibly The GAGE isn`t accurate...........Fred LaForge RV-4 ----------- ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 16, 2000
From: Fred Kunkel <rvator(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Tool Misconceptions - Squeezers - Long
In talking w/ Tom Green & Scott McDaniels at the factory & the prototype shop last week I learned that Van's is currently shipping approximately 200 sub kits, the equivalent of 50 complete airplanes, per month. After reading all the recent posts on squeezers, having rebuilt a number of squeezers for users and answering numerous questions for others, I decided to post the following primarily for the new builders. Hopefully it will prove useful information for all. By way of explanation, the term "production quality" refers to a tool that a major aerospace company would put on the production line. FACTS: * Van's should be commended for their efforts at minimizing the tools required by their builders. It is only w/ the inception of the CNC tooling & the RV8 kits that tools such as right angle drills been required or highly recommended. * If you talk w/ Ken Scott, he'll tell you don't need & he wouldn't buy a pneumatic squeezer to build any RV kit. If you talk w/ Scott McDaniels, he'll tell you that it's the best investment that you could make when building a kit. Both are correct. * I've never seen the equivalent of a pair of vice grips or crescent wrenches in the production aircraft tool business. Each tool is made for a specific purpose. The weight and balance of a tool are strongly considered. Likewise, the Tatco hand squeezer, the Avery hand squeezer, and the pneumatic squeezer each have their specific strengths and weaknesses. * The Tatco hand squeezer is a production quality light to medium duty tool w/ a maximum capacity of a 1/8" rivet. Weight wise, it is a light tool to use, the yokes are approximately 1/3 - 1/2 the size of pneumatic squeezer yokes. It has the ability to fit into places that pneumatic squeezer yokes cannot. You will start to get yoke deflection with 1/8" rivets on yokes that have a 3" reach or greater, although I have a Tatco yoke that has a 4.5" gap & a 10" reach that will not deflect :). It is the most economical of the squeezers. * The Avery hand rivet squeezer is a finely crafted tool with a maximum capacity of a 5/32" rivet. It accepts the pneumatic squeezer yokes. It is longer, heavier, and provides more leverage than the Tatco hand squeezer. I don't know if Bob markets these tools to Boeing or other companies, but it is certainly of the quality to do so. It is also more expensive than the Tatco hand squeezer. I don't know of any place this tool would work that a pneumatic squeezer with an equivalent yoke would not. The advantage of this tool seems to be the leverage over the Tatco & the cost compared to a pneumatic. * The most common pneumatic squeezer, often referred to as the CP-214, provides 3000 lbs. of force & is designed to squeeze up to a 1/8" rivet. This tool has been made by a number of companies and all the different models are production quality tools. With few exceptions, the parts are interchangeable between all the different models. The yokes should all be interchangeable. There is no torque with this tool, all the force is in a single direction. Contrary to an earlier post, you shouldn't have to hold it very tightly to squeeze a rivet. Avery, Cleaveland, and I get our new squeezers from the same company, and that company sells directly to Boeing and others. The disadvantage of this tool is the initial cost. The advantages of this tool are numerous, including the fact that you will never lose money on a pneumatic squeezer - if you ever decide to sell it. MISCONCEPTIONS: Good Deals: Good deals are out there and you can sometimes find them. Looking for the "Good Deal" is also an American obsession, and if you are not intimately familiar w/ aircraft tools you can easily be fooled. But Oshkosh is coming up so those in the market might take note of the following: * The pneumatic squeezer is packed with grease. The piston is greased and there are a large number of needle bearings inside the tool that are greased. It takes an average of four (4) hours to disassemble, clean, check, and rebuild a pneumatic squeezer. Labor and parts are expensive, so what are some common ways to get around this? Pump the tool full of oil. This loosens old, hardened grease & allows the tool to function - for a while. Offer the tool in an "As Is" condition. Offer a 30 day money back guarantee. Offer a liberal exchange policy. Sooner or later the buyer will find a tool they think is working great & keep it. * What to look for if you're out shopping: Take the yoke off the tool. The cam, bearings, and wedge inside the two side plates should be clean of all debris and freshly greased. You just can't clean the tool properly with a Q tip, you have to completely take it apart. Look for an abundance of oil indicating the tool was sticking while operating and oiled to loosen it up. Look at the back of the tool between the air fitting and the body. Is it clean indicating that the tool has been completely disassembled and reassembled? Look at the screws on the back of the squeezer. Are they & the holes they sit in clean? These are some basics. PERSONAL OPINION: If there is one failing in our industry, it is in educating builders about the different tools, how to use them, and what the options are. Each of the above listed tools has built a number of RV's. One could ask why, if you've just spent $20,000 on a quick build kit, you would hesitate to buy a pneumatic squeezer. Conversely, it takes about 3 seconds to set a rivet with a bucking bar and rivet gun. Bottom line, all the choices are good ones and it's up to the individual to make the choice that's best for them. Personally I'd rather hear more posts about builder's experiences, including their retrospective, constructive recommendations based on that experience, than individuals who give a single minded or absolute response. Blue Skies! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: N-Number Application
Date: Jul 16, 2000
Dennis, If you are reserving your 'N' number then you only need the letter and the $10. When you are going to asctually register your aircraft then you need the Bill of Sale and the application for registration. If, after July 28th, you haven't decided, or found, your requested 'N' number then drop me a line here and I will run it through the computer data base for you. Sorry it can't be until then but I am still on vacation and not neat my terminal. Mike Robertson Rv-8A >From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >To: "rv-list" >Subject: RV-List: N-Number Application >Date: Sun, 16 Jul 2000 20:13:40 -0500 > > >I'm ready to get my N-number and I've reviewed the archives. I believe the >process is to call 405-954-3116 and find out what's available. Then I send >in a letter (Randy's form) and $10. I did not see any mention in the >archives of an FAA application form nor a bill of sale. I have a bill of >sale from Van's and I assume it is required along with the application >letter. >If anyone can offer any words of wisdom I'd appreciate it! > >Dennis Persyk getting closer >Hampshire, IL C38 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
Date: Jul 15, 2000
Sounds like there is probably some misunderstanding here. The typical oil PRESSURE transducer is roughly cylindrical, about 1.25" dia. and the same high, with a pipe thread nipple coming out one end. The oil TEMPERATURE transducer is usually a bullet sized/shaped thing that screws down into the engine with only the top hex portion and lead terminals sticking out. What Chris is describing sounds like the latter. I've never seen a combination transducer such as you describe but if its like a typical oil TEMP transducer then it would be correct to install it in the engine. And as Dave said it wouldn't read right if it was off on a hose. Chris are you sure you didn't get mixed up that since this is a combination GAUGE it isn't still supposed to have two transducers? Or is this really called out in the instructions as a combination transducer as well as gauge? Jus' tryin' to help! :-) Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~100 hrs) Portland, OR http://www.edt.com/homewing ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Bristol" <bj034(at)lafn.org> Sent: Sunday, July 16, 2000 9:05 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > > All, > I think you'll find that the oil temp transducer will not work if it's at the > end of a hose. The oil out there is going to be kind of cool, especially without > any flow. Also if the transducer is no bigger than my temp unit, it will > probably be less prone to failure when mounted on the engine than the hoses and > connections. > > Dave , RV6 Waiting for the DAR > > Pat Hatch wrote: > > > > > Chris: > > > > I agree with Jerry Springer and Eustace that the transducer should be > > mounted on the firewall, probably even the small one that you have. I > > should have clarified this in my message...I mounted mine on the engine some > > 10 years ago before I knew better. And it is on my list of things "to do." > > Same goes for the fuel pressure transducer and oil temp. Van sells a small > > manifold for this purpose that mounts on the firewall and has three ports > > for transducers. Probably the way to go. > > > > Pat Hatch > > RV-4, N17PH @ VRB > > RV-6, Fuselage > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com> > > To: > > Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 6:50 PM > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > > > > > > > > Jerry, > > > > > > Maybe I am confusing terminology. The gauge is a combination Westach oil > > > pressure/temp gauge (seems to work/ got it cheap) and the "transducer"?? > > is > > > alittle bigger than a .45 cal handgun casing which screwed into the case > > > with the leads attached. It is a electric gauge and the leads("wires") > > > certainly seem flexible.......certainly more flexible then the steel > > > braided line for my fuel flow (attached to the flow divider). This is the > > > way the instructions depicted it......is this a bad set-up??? Seems > > > airworthy. > > > > > > Chris > > > > > > ---------- > > > > From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com> > > > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > > > > Date: Saturday, July 15, 2000 3:01 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > It is true that pressure well very from front to back. My concern here > > > > is that you or anyone is mounting the transducer to the engine itself > > > > this is not a good thing. I know that lot of people have done it > > > > and have had no problems but the posibility is there that the vibration > > > > can cause fatigue and break the transducer off. Most applacations > > > > are installed using a flex line to the transducer mounted on the > > > > firewall in some type of manifold or bracket to hold it. > > > > I have seen what is left of a Questar Venture after the oil > > > > transducer broke off, not a pretty sight. > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
In a message dated 7/16/00 10:02:31 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Ferdfly(at)AOL.COM writes: << Why can't the oil pump provide higher pressures?? 1. The pump is worn letting pressure escape. 2. The bearing clearances are worn so that the pump cannot build up pressure 3. The oil is TOO HOT so that the pump cannot overcome both the wear in the pump and the wear in the bearings. >> OR Possibly The GAGE isn`t accurate. >> Or the oil is too low a viscosity. Multivis will generally read lower that straight weight 100W. -GV (RV-6A N1GV) vanremog(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Subject: Re: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check
>recall, suggested oversizing the holes in the plexi, then countersinking, >then using #6 tinnermans between the rivets and the plexi in areas where you Please pardon my ignorance. What's a tinnerman? I heard this same story but it also included some tubing used as bushings on the #6 screws to add some expansion and contraction space. Anyone know what size tubing to use? It was my understanding that the fuel line that R/C airplanes use is idea for this application but I have no idea where to get some. Thx, - Jim RV-8AQ ( wiring and more wiring ) N89JA ( reserved ) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 2000
From: Doug Gray <douggray(at)ihug.com.au>
Subject: Re: Vertical Card Compass
> >A couple of people told me to > >line up on section lines but that only gives N S E W (and are the section > >lines true?) Must be some way to use GPS but that's only going to be > >accurate in a calm wind, right? Your quite right, you can use your GPS to do this job. Some time ago I put together a short paper describing how to determine TAS from three GPS runs in different directions. By solving the vector triangles for these runs and assuming the wind direction and speed is unchanged it is possible to resolve the TAS. But, to answer your question, a by-product of this calculation is that the 'true' headings for each run can also be resolved (that is unless you are flying in a constant yaw). These can be compared with the compass heading to prepare a deviation chart. I have spelled this out in this paper and suggest you take a look. Kevin Horton has this paper on his website although I am not sure of the web address. That said, a compass swing on the ground would be quicker, easier, cheaper to do; and if you've already got the GPS how often will you be looking at the compass? Doug Gray ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check
Date: Jul 17, 2000
George . . . trust me, the canopy will drop into place as you properly trim it. This is sort of hard to describe, but for the front portion of the canopy I made a "guide" using a piece of angle with a hole drilled in it to hold a marker. I run the guide along the metal skin, with the marker leaving a mark onto the canopy. In effect, this makes the mark on the canopy perfectly parallel to the contour of the metal skin. I then trim halfway to the mark. As for trimming, for big stuff I used the die grinder, however from another posting I learned that a hand operated belt sander does a good job to. For the "finer" stuff I use the edge scraping tool I think from Avery. Anyway, I started with about an inch clearance from the canopy to the frame/roll bar . . . after triming things down, particularly the front, this puppy sits there perfectly. I was amazed at how much material I had to remove--not too much in the back, a bit in the front, but maybe 1/2" on both sides. Good luck, you'll see that it will work. Rick Jory, RV8A QB -----Original Message----- From: Sally and George <aeronut58(at)hotmail.com> Date: Saturday, July 15, 2000 4:29 PM Subject: RV-List: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check > >Okay, I'm being paranoid, but please help. > >I'm fitting the canopy and have trimmed to the lines scribed on the canopy >at Van's. > >The front of the canopy is the prescribed 3 1/4" back from the reference >point, per the drawings. The fit is nearly perfect at front, rear and >sides, but the top is about 1" too high for the roll bar to which it's to be >rivetted. > >Obviously the thing has to be lowered. I could cut some off the bottom or I >could move the canopy to the rear, but I'm concerned that there's that much >clearance when I've reached the line Van's says is about as far as I should >go. Everything else on this plane has been pretty much dead on to Van's >dimensions. > >Has anyone else experienced this? Any suggestions before I apply a cut-off >wheel to my $800 hunk of plastic? > >George Kilishek >N888RV > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 2000
From: Tim Lewis <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: In Line Filters?
> I have decided to install in-line filters from each tank. > I have a couple of filters that Spruce sells that use a > hose and clamp over a barbed tube for connection. I have > looked for a fitting that could connected to the aluminum > tubing with barbs for the filter hose end. No luck thus far. > > I am assuming that it is not a wise move to slip the hose over > the aluminum tubing with a clamp to secure it. Or Is It? I use Fram G-3 filters (automotive) with installation similar to what you describe. A filter is installed between each tank and the fuel selector. My filters are installed under the landing gear weldment of my RV-6A. The Fram filters come with hose which fits very tightly on to the filter and over the stock RV fuel system tubing. I used small hose clamps for added security. I have no significant concern about the security of the filters attached to the aluminum tubing using the supplied hose. It is next to impossible to get the hose off the aluminum tubing once it is installed. I have a 3rd Fram G-3 filter between the fuel flow transducer and the fuel pump. This acts as an isolator to reduce fuel system pulses degrading the fuel flow transducer's accuracy. If I had it to do over again, I'd try to install the first two filters between the tank and the fuselage (outside the cockpit), because changing the filters in their present location guarantees some gas spilling inside the plane, which has to be cleaned up. >You need to get a Parker tubing beader to do it right. That would be nice, perhaps, but in my experience it's not needed, at least with the hose that comes with the Fram G-3 filter. It holds to the aluminum tubing tenaciously. >Why are you going to a non-standard fuel system? One which >the FAA will not approve for certified? There is a reason for >the gascolator and not a filter system. Excellent! A little humor to start off the work week! Tim ****** Tim Lewis -- Springfield VA RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99 TimRV6A(at)earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check
Date: Jul 17, 2000
> > >Please pardon my ignorance. What's a tinnerman? A tin smith who is male. ! *rimshot* Sorry Jim. > >I heard this same story but it also included some tubing used as bushings >on the >#6 screws to add some expansion and contraction space. Anyone know what >size >tubing to use? It was my understanding that the fuel line that R/C >airplanes >use is idea for this application but I have no idea where to get some. > Silicone fuel tubing can be found at any local hobby shop. It can be had in various wall thicknesses and outer diameters, and can also be found in black rubber for use in the gasoline powered models vs. the methanol powered ones. I have lots of both and it's mighty handy stuff to have for chafing protection on tubing and wires, grommeting large holes and for use around the edge of the big rectangular hole cut in the panel for the nav/com. Glue in place with shoe goo, also great stuff. Brian Denk RV8 N94BD ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jack Textor" <pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com>
"RV-8-List (E-mail)"
Subject: RTV sealer
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Good morning friends, Working on my -8- rudder, cut stiffeners last night :( . As you know Van's specifies using RTV sealer in the trailing edge of rudder and elevators. Which sealer is best? Blue? Black? Also, learned today that if you use acetone, make sure it's "virgin", not recycled. If recycled it apparently is acidic. Thanks! Jack ________________________________________________________________________________
From: A20driver(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Subject: Re: Brakes
Craig: Check the pedal-cylinders!! The spring side of the cylinder must be on top..This allows air in the cylinder to pass to the lines where bleeding removes it from the system..Had this problem with my 4...Jim Brown, NJ... ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com>
Subject: Fuel tank caps loose and corroded
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Hi, Checked fuel system for leaks by placing small amount of vacuum on system which leaked readily at fuel tank caps. Caps are actually loose in the holes as if they are too small or the hole too large. One person suggested larger O rings. On removal of O ring, cap is found to be heavily corroded and sticking. One cap has already a broken roll pin. Oiling good cap and retrying it now fits securely. Suggest checking caps on receipt of kit!! Hal Kempthorne 2578 Elliot Court Santa Clara, CA 95051-1849 408.244.4984 CELL 408.230.0891 RV6a N7HK 99% 1965 Debonair for sale! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net>
Subject: PayPal
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Started reading the terms of their agreement in order to sign up and was stopped when reading that one has to be a resident of the US. so looks like it won't work for me. To bad. Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DWENSING(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Subject: RV builder selling Smyth Sidewinder
Posting for a fellow RV builder who is not on the list. He is selling the Smyth Sidewinder built before building his RV-4. Please contact him directly. FOR SALE: Smyth Sidewinder with 160HP O-320-D2C TT engine and airframe 500 hours 33 gal fuel capacity Top speed at altitude 180MPH+ Stall speed 61 MPH gyro panel, 810 com, RNAV-30A loran, Terra xponder w/encoder Imron paint - 5 time award winner Always hangered (3CK) Lake in the Hills Illinois $36,000 firm George F. Brunkalla Roselle Illinois Home 630 529-5944 Shop 847 678-3033 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 2000
From: David Roseblade <davidagr(at)emirates.net.ae>
Subject: RV Badges for Oshkosh Update Please Read
Listers, I am traveling from the UAE (Persian Gulf) to be at Osh for the first time. Any RV events going on please can you let me know ahead of time. I will be traveling unaccompanied. Look forward to meeting any fellow Lister. David Roseblade RV6A wings, deburring and dimpling.... Fuselage on it's way - 'Yike' United Arab Emirates -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Glenn & Judi Sent: Saturday, July 15, 2000 8:26 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: RV Badges for Oshkosh Update Please Read PANELCUT(at)aol.com wrote: > > Listers > > I think I have completed all the badges that I received mailers for I have > four that I still need some info on so if anyone knows these people tell them > to contact me via e-mail. > > Gary E. Graham > Glen Gordon & wife > Carl J. Franz > Gene Larson > > If i have missed someone PLEASE be patient I have been overwelmed with these > things. I hope everyone is happy with the results and hope to see them all at > Oshkosh. > > Steve Davis > The Panel Pilot > Hi Steve, This is Glenn Gordon with 2 "N"s on Glenn. My wifes name is Judi. What other information can I provide you with? Glenn Gordon & Judi Gordon 421 West Thompson Blvd Buffalo Grove, IL 60090 EAA Chapter 790 Building RV-6 foxinsocks(at)mediaone.net Thanks again, Glenn Gordon ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Subject: Re: Brakes
>>>>Craig: Check the pedal-cylinders!! The spring side of the cylinder must be on top..This allows air in the cylinder to pass to the lines where bleeding removes it from the system..Had this problem with my 4<<<<<< IS the spring side the hollow cylinder or the actual rod....i.e. does the rod go up or does the rod go down ??? A20driver(at)aol.com on 07/17/2000 10:43:27 AM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: RV-List: Brakes Craig: Check the pedal-cylinders!! The spring side of the cylinder must be on top..This allows air in the cylinder to pass to the lines where bleeding removes it from the system..Had this problem with my 4...Jim Brown, NJ... ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pichon.dean(at)ADLittle.com
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Subject: In-line filter vs. gascolator
I am in the process of installing an Airflow Performance fuel injection system in an 0-360 A1A (in my -4). I have not decided whether to use the in-line filter supplied by Airflow Performance or an Andair gascolator. I would appreciate any feedback from other builders who have already made this decision. Thanks for the help. Dean Pichon Arlington, MA RV-4 **** This message is from Arthur D. Little, Inc. and may contain confidential business information. It is intended for the addressee only and may not be copied without our permission. If you are not the intended recipient please contact the sender as soon as possible.**** ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Subject: Re: In-line filter vs. gascolator
There is verry little( if any ) room for a gascolator in the traditional space under the cowl. If you were to find any room there is very little area that the exhaust pipes wont interfer. This coupled with the engine mount cross member and the holes in the fire wall for the control cables.....I Just couldnot find the room. Others have . I used a Morosso filter prior to the Andair furl selector to filter the fuel. Sumping for water.......the gascolater would not be at the low point if I placed it in the traditional place unser the cowl anyway. The low points are in the wing tank vents anyway. Lots of builders have used the Airflow performance filters or the Morosso inline filters in my area. There is a past thread on this subject also. pichon.dean(at)adlittle.com on 07/17/2000 02:29:33 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RV-List: In-line filter vs. gascolator I am in the process of installing an Airflow Performance fuel injection system in an 0-360 A1A (in my -4). I have not decided whether to use the in-line filter supplied by Airflow Performance or an Andair gascolator. I would appreciate any feedback from other builders who have already made this decision. Thanks for the help. Dean Pichon Arlington, MA RV-4 **** This message is from Arthur D. Little, Inc. and may contain confidential business information. It is intended for the addressee only and may not be copied without our permission. If you are not the intended recipient please contact the sender as soon as possible.**** ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com>
Subject: PayPal
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Yes, someone pointed that out to me earlier today. I appologize for not seeing it sooner. Nevertheless, I'll send you a check on 7/22 for all money raised via referals from those in the US. Thanks, Larry Bowen RV-8 Fuse Email: Larry(at)BowenAero.com Web: http://BowenAero.com > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Eustace Bowhay > Sent: Monday, July 17, 2000 12:19 PM > To: rv list > Subject: RV-List: PayPal > > > Started reading the terms of their agreement in order to sign up and was > stopped when reading that one has to be a resident of the US. so > looks like > it won't work for me. To bad. > > Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: A20driver(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Subject: Re: Brakes
The rod goes up...JB ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com>
Subject: EAA Memorial Wall Ceremony
Date: Jul 17, 2000
FYI - From Van's web site: -------------------------- EAA Memorial Wall Ceremony The year 2000 EAA Memorial Wall ceremony will be held at 11:00 am on Monday, July 31st at the Fergus Chapel near the EAA Museum. Bill and Jeremy Benedicts names will be on the plaque that will be dedicated at that time. All RV builders/pilots/friends who would like to attend would be most welcome. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4Brown(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Subject: Re: Brakes
I installed the brakes on my RV4 with the spring down to allow for clearances on the center bulkhead. Bleeding the brakes when installed in this manner requires that the brake cylinder be disconnected from the pedal and inverted during the bleeding process. It sounds worse than it is. There was an article in the RVator a while back with some pictures. I haven't had any trouble with my brakes. They are rock solid. Tom Brown - N854TB RV4 flying ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 2000
From: Carroll Bird <catbird(at)taylorelectric.com>
Subject: Re: Laser Electronic Ignition /What if?
Gary Zilik wrote: > > I am leaning towards Jeff Rose's system or Lightspeeds. More bang for the buck and > I keep one of my impulse coupled mags if the electronic fails. > I have Jeff Rose' system on my -4 for 95 hours now. No problems at all with it at all. Carroll Bird Buffalo Gap, TX leaving for OSH Thu. Doing some visiting on the way. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 17, 2000
Subject: Re: RV-8 Canopy: Sanity Check
In a message dated 7/17/00 3:25:34 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com writes: << >recall, suggested oversizing the holes in the plexi, then countersinking, >then using #6 tinnermans between the rivets and the plexi in areas where you Please pardon my ignorance. What's a tinnerman? >> A dimpled washer made to go between a countersunk screw and the outside surface. Tinnerman washers are often used as part of the hardware that attaches wingtips, cowls, and inspection panels on aircraft. They come in various sizes (-6, -8, -10, etc) to match screw sizes. All the ones I've seen are stainless steel. All of the major airplane parts suppliers stock them. Kyle ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 2000
From: Tim Lewis <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: IFR
> Navaid wing leveler - consider an STEC 20 (I think - $2995) > as it has an > IFR legal turn coordinator. The Navaid wing leveler also contains an IFR legal turn coordinator. The FAR requires a gyroscopic turn coordinator, which the Navaid unit has. The FAR does not specify digital (Navaid) or analog (STEC) display. My RV-6A, with Navaid autopilot/turn coordinator, is certified for IFR flight, per the operating limitations. My FAA inspector went so far as to circle "IFR" on the operating limitations before he signed them. Tim Lewis RV-6A N47TD 87 hours, including some IFR ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 17, 2000
From: "Gary A. Sobek" <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: RV6 Slider handles photos
> > > Gary can you get a picture posted to someone's www > site so we all can see > how this is done? > Marty in Brentwood, TN > ----- Original Message ----- > Sent: Monday, July 10, 2000 9:00 PM > Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6 Slider handles > > > > > > I put the handles on my RV-6 slider windshild bow > and > > after 600 hours in less than 3 years of flying, > would > > not be without them. IMHO, they are a must have. Marty: I placed the photos you requested in the SoCAL Wing Van's Air Force photo album. http://members3.clubphoto.com/socal230330/RV-6_Builders_album/ Hope this helps. If the address is on two lines, you will need to copy and past it on one line. The airplane will be at Oshkosh AirVenture 2000 parked next to Paul Rosales just completed RV-6A. Feel free to stop by and take a look. There will be 6 RVs that I know of from the SoCAL Wing at OSH. Due to FFI check rides, I may not head east till Monday. ==== Gary A. Sobek "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell, Flying So. CA, USA http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: LASAR Electronic Ignition /What if?
Date: Jul 17, 2000
-----Original Message----- From: InterMail vM.4.01.02.00 201-229-116 <bcbraem(at)home.com.with.ESMTP> Date: Sunday, July 16, 2000 4:44 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: LASAR Electronic Ignition /What if? 201-229-116) with ESMTP > >The LASAR ignition systems that come installed on the Lycomings DO NOT >have the low voltage starting problem and can be hand cranked. They had >to fix that problem to get their spam can STC from the FAA >Boyd I'd like to add a warning regarding hand proping a dead LASAR system. According to the tech who led the LASAR installation seminar at Sun&Fun 2000 and my IA friend, hand proping a mag with no impulse coupler is dangerous. In addition to providing a hot spark at very low rotational rates (the "impulse") the main function of the impulse-coupled mag is to retard the spark to prevent kick-back. Even if you could spin the crank fast enough to get a good spark, the kick-back could be dangerous. This is why the non-impulse mag is shorted out during the start cycle. The kick-back usually damages the starter, which is not the issue here, of course. Unless something has changed in the design of the LASAR recently, I would caution against hand proping. Dennis Persyk getting close Hampshire, IL C38 >> >> >> Not to long ago in one of the "What's New" sections of one of the aviation mags I >> get there was a blurb that Unison is now producing the Lasar system with impulse >> couplings. This would be a must have feature if I were to use the Lasar system. I >> am leaning towards Jeff Rose's system or Lightspeeds. More bang for the buck and I >> keep one of my impulse coupled mags if the electronic fails. >> >>snip >> Gary Zilik >> RV-6A still flying with old tractor ignition. >> >> lothar klingmuller wrote: >> >> > The lack of the impulse coupling is IMHO a NOT SO GOOG feature. If I had >> > known that, I would not have ordered the Lazar ingition. My engine arrived >> > a week ago, so now I have to live with this "handicap" of not being able to >> > handcranck the engine.. I just hope I will not get stuck at some lonesome >> > AP or isolated strip!! >> >> o > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "christopher huey" <clhuey(at)sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Oil pressure
Date: Jul 17, 2000
First off thank you all to responding to my question. Let me clear a few thinks up......I am talking about a oil pressure transducer not a combination temp/press. I talked with a Lycoming rep and he informed me that the oil pressure difference between the front of the case and rear case can be different by up to 10 psi but 5-6 psi is more typical. I never had oil pressure that was really low......just not where I would like to see it, around 70-80 psi in cruse flight was my target(oil heated up). The lower pressure readings that I saw were simply due to the location I was reading my oil pressure from.....Now when someone pointed out that locating the sender on the engine was not a good idea...I decide to call up both Westach and Electronics International and see what they had to say. I have gauges from both companies and both responded quickly to my questions. Westach basically said that they were not aware of any senders failing (oil loss) but it would be a good idea to mount the sender on the firewall due to heat and vibration. Electronic International came right to the point by saying that it has had failures (oil loss) and if the sender is mounted on the engine it would be just a matter of time before failure (100- 1000+ hrs who knows?). That was all I needed to hear......my sender will have a new home on the firewall. Thank you again for all the info. Chris ---------- > From: Ferdfly(at)AOL.COM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil pressure > Date: Sunday, July 16, 2000 11:15 PM > > > In a message dated 7/16/00 8:15:31 PM Pacific Daylight Time, cgalley(at)qcbc.org > writes: > > << > Why can't the oil pump provide higher pressures?? > 1. The pump is worn letting pressure escape. > 2. The bearing clearances are worn so that the pump cannot build up pressure > 3. The oil is TOO HOT so that the pump cannot overcome both the wear in the > pump and the wear in the bearings. >> > OR Possibly The GAGE isn`t accurate...........Fred LaForge RV-4 > ----------- > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Joe Hine" <joehine(at)nbnet.nb.ca>
Subject: Re: RV-8A Aileron Misalignment
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Hi Wayne When I finished my 4, I had one misaligned aileron and the fix that Van gave me was to take the brackets off the aileron and file the hole oblong to a slot(in your case make the hole 3/16" longer in the right direction) and reinstall the aileron. Worked like a charm for me and is still working well. Joe Hine RV4 C-FYTQ > Dear RV-8A Quickbuilders: > > I have run into a problem and wonder if any other QBers have found same, if > so, how did you fix it? As you know the aileron bracket and hinge is all > prepunched, both rivet and bolts holes, as well as the rivet holes in the > rear spar. Therefore there is no way to adjust or align aileron placement. > My ailerons are both exactly 3/16" too low. This leaves a larger than > normal gap at the leading edge and a very noticeable step-off at the flap. > The only 'fix' I can come up with is to install new aileron brackets (not > predrilled) and move the bolt holes accordingly. (By the way, I did send > back to Van's to get the newly designed flap braces, so alignment here was > not a problem; ie. the flaps are correctly positioned). Thanks. > > Wayne Williams > RV-8A QB > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net>
Subject: Oil check tube
Date: Jul 17, 2000
How much torque should one apply to the oil filler tube into the crankcase? It is the filled plastic one, with some sort of cork like gasket. And, where would one find that information? Alex Peterson Maple Grove, MN 6A ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - $7.99/mo! ------ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 2000
From: Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca>
Subject: Re: Vertical Card Compass
> >> >A couple of people told me to >> >line up on section lines but that only gives N S E W (and are the section >> >lines true?) Must be some way to use GPS but that's only going to be >> >accurate in a calm wind, right? > >Your quite right, you can use your GPS to do this job. > >Some time ago I put together a short paper describing how to determine >TAS from three GPS runs in different directions. By solving the vector >triangles for these runs and assuming the wind direction and speed is >unchanged it is possible to resolve the TAS. But, to answer your >question, a by-product of this calculation is that the 'true' headings >for each run can also be resolved (that is unless you are flying in a >constant yaw). These can be compared with the compass heading to >prepare a deviation chart. > >I have spelled this out in this paper and suggest you take a look. Kevin >Horton has this paper on his website although I am not sure of the web >address. > >That said, a compass swing on the ground would be quicker, easier, >cheaper to do; and if you've already got the GPS how often will you be >looking at the compass? > >Doug Gray > > I finally figured out how to get internet access down here in southern Argentina, so I'll add my two cents worth. Prop aircraft pretty much always are flying with a bit of sideslip. If the fuselage is exactly aligned with the relative wind (zero sideslip), the prop wash is hitting one side of the vertical tail, and putting a sideforce on it. This sideforce would put the ball out to one side, and cause the aircraft to do a slow turn if the wings were level. We end up putting in some rudder to bring the ball in the centre, which stops the turn, but gives us a small amount of sideslip. Note - this whole story does not apply to multi-engine types with contra-rotating props. However, the amount of sideslip involved is probably small enough in cruise conditions to be neglibible as far as using Doug's GPS method to swing a compass. Doug's method would be very difficult to use though. You would have to fly three legs, noting GPS track, ground speed, and compass heading on each. Then you have to put all the numbers in the spreadsheet, and it spits out the true heading for each leg. You add or subtract the variation to get the magnetic heading (assuming zero sideslip). Now you know the compass error on each leg. So, go flying again, make small adjustments to the compass and repeat the process. It could take many, many flights to sort this out. It would be quicker with a helper in the other seat with a laptop computer to crunch the numbers in-flight, but it would still not be too practical. Now, if you want to determine your TAS, Doug's method is probably the best one out there. The info is on my web site, in the Flight Test, Determing TAS from GPS, section of my RV-links page: http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rvlinks.html Take care, Kevin Horton RV-8 (cockpit stuff) khorton(at)cyberus.ca (613) 821-7862 (home) Ottawa, Canada (613) 952-4319 (work) http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Greg Yotz" <gyachts(at)kans.com>
Subject: RV-6 Panel Dwg
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Can anyone point me to some resources for RV-6 and RV-8 Panel ACAD drawings and Instrument drawings on the web?? I have Panel Planner but was looking for a little more along with some structural. Thanks Greg ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 2000
From: Jim Cimino <jcimino(at)epix.net>
Subject: Flap position Indicator
I installed a flap position indicator for my electric flaps on my -8. Does anyone know what type of sensor would be hooked up to make the indicator work? Jim Cimino RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL Reserved http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo (570)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Wiring in wings
Date: Jul 18, 2000
I am getting close to sealing my wings up. Am I correct in assuming that 14 guage is correct for landing lights and 18 gauge is fine for the strobe/nav/postion lights on the wingtips (aeroflash)? I can see a problem trying to use a primed before assembly wing structure as a ground so think I want to run ground wires as well (damn weight). Can I use one ground wire for all of them...say the 14 guage for the lights? I want all of that worked out and installed before I put the skins on...just easier that way. Bill -4 the wings don't fly yet...but the neighbors are pretty curious - ARE THOSE AIRPLANE WINGS?? :-) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Wiring in wings
Date: Jul 18, 2000
I am getting close to sealing my wings up. Am I correct in assuming that 14 guage is correct for landing lights and 18 gauge is fine for the strobe/nav/postion lights on the wingtips (aeroflash)? I can see a problem trying to use a primed before assembly wing structure as a ground so think I want to run ground wires as well (damn weight). Can I use one ground wire for all of them...say the 14 guage for the lights? I want all of that worked out and installed before I put the skins on...just easier that way. Bill -4 the wings don't fly yet...but the neighbors are pretty curious - ARE THOSE AIRPLANE WINGS?? :-) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Donald Karl <karl@dg-rtp.dg.com>
Subject: RV6A tail kit for sale.
Date: Jul 18, 2000
RV6A tailkit for sale. Except for unpacking, it hasn't been touched and is in perfect condition. The kit includes the thicker skins and electric trim. This kit is not prepunched; I bought it just before prepunching started. Will sell for best offer. Raleigh, NC. Shipping isn't out of the question. Respond via email or phone, not list; I no longer follow the list. Don Karl karl(at)dg.com (919)248-5915 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 2000
From: Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Wiring in wings
--- Bill Shook wrote: > I am getting close to sealing my wings up. Am I correct in assuming > that 14 > guage is correct for landing lights and 18 gauge is fine for the > strobe/nav/postion lights on the wingtips (aeroflash)? I can see a > problem > trying to use a primed before assembly wing structure as a ground so > think I want to run ground wires as well (damn weight). I think you will find that the wing spar _will_ make a great electrical ground - together with a bonding wire from the spar root to the ground bus. Just use a star washer when you attach the component's ground (mine is Aeroflash stobes and Navaid servo on the wing tip) to chew through the primer and make a "gas tight seal" with the aluminum. Also at the root end. Should be some archive info on this... Mike Thompson Austin, TX -6 N140RV (Reserved) Fuselage ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 2000
From: Matthew Gelber <mgelber(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: Wiring in wings
I don't think using the airframe as a ground would be a problem, resistance-wise. I have an overprimed (too-heavy coat of AZKO) wing skeleton and skins and the resistance from the inboard to the outboard rib is (I just went out and measured it) is 0.3 ohms, which is as close to zero as you'll find, I think. You might want to try the same thing. The same would be true of the fuselage, so the only potential low resitance point would be the electrical connection from the spar to the fuselage, which I'm sure would be fine. If it wasn't it would be a lot easier to jumper the spar to the fuse than to run many grounds. Note I'm no engineer, just a guy with an ohmmeter... Matthew Gelber -8A wings -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bill Shook Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2000 11:42 AM Subject: RV-List: Wiring in wings I am getting close to sealing my wings up. Am I correct in assuming that 14 guage is correct for landing lights and 18 gauge is fine for the strobe/nav/postion lights on the wingtips (aeroflash)? I can see a problem trying to use a primed before assembly wing structure as a ground so think I want to run ground wires as well (damn weight). Can I use one ground wire for all of them...say the 14 guage for the lights? I want all of that worked out and installed before I put the skins on...just easier that way. Bill -4 the wings don't fly yet...but the neighbors are pretty curious - ARE THOSE AIRPLANE WINGS?? :-) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 2000
From: Chuck Weyant <chuck(at)chuckdirect.com>
Subject: Re: For Sale
Troy Whistman wrote: > details about what happened to Bill and his RV at his > website; the address is > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/9749/william.html > Thanks Troy but I've been there and couldn't find anything about the accident in text. Chuck Weyant EMail Me: chuck(at)chuckdirect.com WebSite: http://www.chuckdirect.com Santa Maria, CA 805 347-8882 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Carter" <jcarter8(at)midsouth.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Wiring in wings
Date: Jul 18, 2000
> > I am getting close to sealing my wings up. Am I correct in assuming that 14 > guage is correct for landing lights and 18 gauge is fine for the > strobe/nav/postion lights on the wingtips (aeroflash)? I can see a problem > trying to use a primed before assembly wing structure as a ground so think I > want to run ground wires as well (damn weight). Can I use one ground wire > for all of them...say the 14 guage for the lights? I want all of that > worked out and installed before I put the skins on...just easier that way. > > Bill > -4 the wings don't fly yet...but the neighbors are pretty curious - ARE > THOSE AIRPLANE WINGS?? :-) > > Hmmm, I think I hear Electric Bob clearing his throat! :>) You might want to check out an article at www.aeroelectric.com/articles.html on wire sizing that will answer your question. But basically, you just add up the length of the wire run and figure out how much power (amps) is going to the lights and do the arithmetic to figure out the right wire size. Most of us use a local ground for the lights in the wings because of the length of the run - I did, even though I installed Bob's firewall ground block. Just sand down to metal to insure a good contact with the ground terminal. Good luck! Jerry Carter Memphis, TN My RV-8A website: http://rv8asite.homestead.com/mainpage.html ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CTonnini(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Subject: Remove from list
Please remove my email adress from your list Thank you Claudio Tonnini ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4Brown(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Subject: Re: Flap position Indicator
Hi Jim, Mac sells a linear indicator device that can be used in conjunction with the position indicator. The indicator will typically only move 1.25 to 1.5". Therefore you have to install the linear position indicator at a point on the flap actuator where 1.5" equals full movement of the flaps from the up to the down position. On my RV4, I mounted my indicator on the actuator arm between the flap motor and the center bulkhead. It has worked just fine. Tom Brown - RV4 flying ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jim Bower" <rvbuilder(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Flap position Indicator
Date: Jul 18, 2000
FWIW, I would like to pass on advice from the great Jim Cone (he built two RV-6As, and wrote the definitive treatise on sliding canopy installation). I asked him about a flap position indicator, and he said that you can see out the canopy where the flaps are, but more to the point they only provide drag, and the various positions don't do much for you as they do in a Cessna. Therefore, the only two positions you need to be concerned about are fully up and fully down. >From: Jim Cimino <jcimino(at)epix.net> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV-List: Flap position Indicator >Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 13:55:35 -0400 > > >I installed a flap position indicator for my electric flaps on my -8. Does >anyone know what type of sensor would be hooked up to make the indicator >work? > > >Jim Cimino >RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL Reserved >http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo >(570)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "marcel de ruiter" <marcelderuiter(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: Wiring in wings
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Normal practise with "the big boys" is to remove enough primer to make an electrical ground. do this where spar comes close to your fuselage and use a ground wire. do the same at your appliance. this will save you the ground wires. Marcel de Ruiter RV4/G-RVMJ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rick Caldwell" <racaldwell(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Wiring in wings
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Bill, I primed mine before riveting and installed the grd. by drilling a hole in the tip rib and riveting the ring terminal to it. Both grds go to the same rivet, but two wires are used. I think the wire guage is similar to what yo're thinking. I put the snap bushings in the ribs before closing but wired after the wings were closed. No prblems getting the wire through. Also, I didn't use conduit; the wire is open between ribs. All works well. Rick Caldwell Melbourne, FL 108 hrs -6 >From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >To: >Subject: RV-List: Wiring in wings >Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 14:41:30 -0400 > > >I am getting close to sealing my wings up. Am I correct in assuming that >14 >guage is correct for landing lights and 18 gauge is fine for the >strobe/nav/postion lights on the wingtips (aeroflash)? I can see a problem >trying to use a primed before assembly wing structure as a ground so think >I >want to run ground wires as well (damn weight). Can I use one ground wire >for all of them...say the 14 guage for the lights? I want all of that >worked out and installed before I put the skins on...just easier that way. > >Bill >-4 the wings don't fly yet...but the neighbors are pretty curious - ARE >THOSE AIRPLANE WINGS?? :-) > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Nellis" <mnellis(at)emailusa.net>
Subject: Re: For Sale
Date: Jul 18, 2000
You have to look under the words ACCIDENT :) Here's a direct http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/9749/accident.html Mike Nellis RV-6 Wings - Plainfield, IL http://mnellis.jnet.net/rv-6_page ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Weyant" <chuck(at)chuckdirect.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2000 2:37 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: For Sale > > Troy Whistman wrote: > > > details about what happened to Bill and his RV at his > > website; the address is > > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Launchpad/9749/william.html > > > > Thanks Troy but I've been there and couldn't find anything about the accident in > text. > > Chuck Weyant > EMail Me: chuck(at)chuckdirect.com > WebSite: http://www.chuckdirect.com > Santa Maria, CA > 805 347-8882 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Subject: Re: For Sale
>You have to look under the words ACCIDENT :) Mike, Looks like your missing the point here. We would like to know ( how it happened ) not what the aftermath looked like. When I go out to an NTSB site and read about an accident, I learn something. With any luck I will remember what I learned and not repeat the mistake myself. You know the old adage, "those who don't learn from history..." All I learned from the pictures at the link you provided is that storing my plane in an upside down configuration is not advisable :-) - Jim RV-8AQ ( wiring ) N89JA (reserved ) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Jul 18, 2000
From: gert <gert(at)execpc.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel tank caps loose and corroded
I had similar problem, called mfg. Was told the caps will not seal properly if the o-rings are not lubed properly !! Also lost roll pin before I found out. oiled second one before trail, no leaks. Gert kempthornes wrote: > > > Hi, > > Checked fuel system for leaks by placing small amount of vacuum on system > which leaked readily at fuel tank caps. Caps are actually loose in the > holes as if they are too small or the hole too large. One person suggested > larger O rings. On removal of O ring, cap is found to be heavily corroded > and sticking. One cap has already a broken roll pin. Oiling good cap and > retrying it now fits securely. > > Suggest checking caps on receipt of kit!! > > Hal Kempthorne > 2578 Elliot Court > Santa Clara, CA 95051-1849 > 408.244.4984 CELL 408.230.0891 > RV6a N7HK 99% > 1965 Debonair for sale! > -- Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227, any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500 US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RVHI(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Subject: Re: For Sale
Try this link for the report, if you havn't already http://www.ntsb.gov/Aviation/NYC/00A107.htm L.Adamson RV6A finish ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dave Hyde" <nauga(at)brick.net>
Subject: Dynafocal bushings
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Folks, No joy in the archives - I've seen the dynafocal bushings in the accy catalog, and I've seen similar bushings in the Wicks catalog for about 1/2 the price. Anyone know the difference? And thanks to Kyle Boatright for showing off his -6 last weekend. Dave 'donut boy' Hyde nauga(at)brick.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Subject: Throttle Cable Question
Listers, I'm using Van's green sheathed cables for throttle and mixture control. At each end of of the sheath, there is a threaded metal end that gets clamped to a bulkhead or to the cable bracket using two nuts and a toothed washer. My question is: Which side of the bulkhead (or throttle cable bracket) does the toothed washer go on, and what's to keep the nut on the other side from working loose? Thanks in advance, Kyle Boatright ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net>
Subject: Johanson Fund
Date: Jul 18, 2000
I have been asked to post the names of the contributors. The following is the list to date in the order received. BRIAN ECKSTEIN DOUGLAS WEILER WESLEY HAYS JOHN JOHNSON LARRY PARDUE CRAIG HIERS JOHN LEE JIM ANDREWS ROBERT MOORE DR. KLINGMULLER DON JORDON EARL FORTON JOHN HOMGREEN LAWRENCE GREENO RAYMOND GRENIER ROBERT HALL THOMAS SARGENT JERRY CARTER ROBERT MARSHALL CICIL HATFIELD JR. RION BOURGEOIS KEN HOSHOWSKI DALE WOTRING W.B. CRETSINGER K.H. KEMPTHORNE BILLY WILSON TERRENCE WATSON MIKE HAWKS KEVIN HORTON ROBERT BOWER JR. JAMES JEWELL JOHN FROMM MICHAEL HARTMAN ALEX PETERSON HARRY CROSBY JOHN BRICK RONALD EAGLESTON JERRY CALVERT For a total of 39 since June 27/00 or just under 2 per day and today being the first day we have drawn a blank. On the up side some of these have contributed as high as $100.00. I apologize if I have misspelled anyone's name and thank those who have contributed. Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Eaves" <doneaves(at)bigfoot.com>
Subject: Throttle Cable Question
Date: Jul 18, 2000
The toothed washer is the lock washer - Put it under the nut - It keeps the nut from backing off. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2000 6:46 PM Subject: RV-List: Throttle Cable Question Listers, I'm using Van's green sheathed cables for throttle and mixture control. At each end of of the sheath, there is a threaded metal end that gets clamped to a bulkhead or to the cable bracket using two nuts and a toothed washer. My question is: Which side of the bulkhead (or throttle cable bracket) does the toothed washer go on, and what's to keep the nut on the other side from working loose? Thanks in advance, Kyle Boatright ________________________________________________________________________________
From: PANELCUT(at)AOL.COM
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Subject: Re: RV-6 Panel Dwg
Greg I'm real sorry I forgot to e-mail those drawings to you...I will do it tomorrow it slipped my mind. Steve Davis The Panel Pilot ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net>
Subject: Re: Throttle Cable Question
Date: Jul 18, 2000
> Listers, > > I'm using Van's green sheathed cables for throttle and mixture control. At > each end of of the sheath, there is a threaded metal end that gets clamped > to > a bulkhead or to the cable bracket using two nuts and a toothed washer. > > My question is: Which side of the bulkhead (or throttle cable bracket) does > the toothed washer go on, and what's to keep the nut on the other side from > working loose? > > Thanks in advance, > > Kyle Boatright Need two star washers, one on each side. My cables came with two. Alex Peterson ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - $7.99/mo! ------ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Greg Yotz" <gyachts(at)kans.com>
Subject: Re: RV-6 Panel Dwg
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Thanx Steve. Greg ________________________________________________________________________________ User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022
Date: Jul 18, 2000
Subject: Air Filter Maintenance?
From: Don Diehl <ddiehl(at)silverlink.net>
I installed Van's carb air cleaner kit on my RV-4 a year/120 hours ago and am pleased to see how much stuff did not get into the engine. It has the K&N oil type element. Now, it's time to clean and re-oil the filter element but I can't find the instruction sheet. Can anyone provide the maintenance procedure. Many thanks. Don Diehl N28EW ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gregory Young" <gyoung@cs-sol.com>
Subject: Throttle Cable Question
Date: Jul 19, 2000
I recently replaced the throttle cable on my Citabria and the star washers were outside the brackets. Both the original cable (in place for 26 years) and the genuine, certified, "direct-from-the-factory with a QC stamp on an ACS part at twice the price" replacement had only one star washer for each end.


July 12, 2000 - July 19, 2000

RV-Archive.digest.vol-iw