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RV-Archive.digest.vol-jb
August 11, 2000 - August 19, 2000

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From: "Jim Bower" <rvbuilder(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Spacing between elevator horn and HS skin
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Are, I think I am the one who posed the latest question on this subject. I e-mailed Van's about those gaps (I have about 0.2" on each side). Basically, they are ok with anything you can do to bridge that gap, for example, washers. I got a stack of stainless steel washers with a 1/4" hole and will use a series of them to compensate for the gap. A longer bolt is also needed. Van's said to measure your distance and order the right bolt. I really don't know how the gap happened, as I am using the same basic empennage as you are (-6/-6A is now using the -8 emp). Hope this helps Jim Bower St. Louis, MO RV-6A N143DJ Working on wings >From: "Are Barstad" <abarstad(at)bconnex.net> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >To: >Subject: RV-List: Spacing between elevator horn and HS skin >Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2000 10:54:27 -0400 > > >Even after looking at RV's at Oshkosh I missed these details - argh! > >I just completed the right elevator to the point of inspection (Canadian >reg's). I then test fitted it to the HS and found that I have a 3/16 inch >gap between the elevator horn skin and the HS. I gather this must be right >since I'm building with pre-punched parts. It just seems a lot and I can't >think of any way to narrow the gap. > >Also, does anyone cover up the inside of the horn where one of the counter >balance weights is? It looks very 'open' by just leaving it this way. > >Are >RV-8 >Wings on order > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DWENSING(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Subject: Re: Electric Horizons
In a message dated 8/9/00 6:39:59 PM Central Daylight Time, jcarter8(at)midsouth.rr.com writes: << Any other ideas for an electric horizon? Jerry Carter Memphis, TN >> Jerry, try Kelley Instruments in Wichita KS. Phone nbr. is 800 835-1054 or 316 945-7171. If you buy one, remember to indicate it is for an 8 degree tilt panel if for an RV-6 or 6A. Not sure what the tilt the others RV's have....... Dale Ensing 6A finishing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Chief86249(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Subject: Re: Wentworth
I have purchased several items, in fact drove there and picked them up. YOu ca't believe the place. Indescribable. Completey satisfied and will go back. Rick ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DWENSING(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Subject: Re: Newspaper
In a message dated 8/11/00 10:54:42 AM Central Daylight Time, nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com writes: << The only way to avoid this is to get personally involved in the whole production effort for the piece. Left to their own devices, media reporters and writers are dismal purveyors of fact. Give the reporter a couple of issues of Sport Aviation to read. >> The Company magazine where I worked did a story on the first plane I built and when I was just starting on my RV. Even they could not get the facts straight and they had to reason to angle the story. Dale Ensing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "jim jewell" <jjewell(at)okanagan.net>
Subject: Re: Spacing between elevator horn and HS skin
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Hello Jim, I think Are is referring to the outboard gaps at the stab tips. Regarding the inboard horn gaps; I Had the same problem with mine as have others before us. Instead of washers: I made two spacers approximately 1 3/8' x 1/2' from some 1/4' aluminum 6061 stock, 2024 would also do. If your fit requires a different thickness file, grind or use appropriate thickness material. I drilled one end to fit the required 1/4" hole. I tapered the other end to about 1/4" to reduce weight. I then fit the spacer with a 1/4" bolt to it's position. I oriented the tapered end toward the center of the circular weld that holds the horn to it's tubular shaft. Surrounded by welded material this area should be safe structurally. I drilled two 1/8" holes through the Spacer and the horn into the area in the center of the round welded area. Two 1/8" pop rivets hold the spacer in place for assembly eliminating the need to try to fit washers in a very restricted blind area later on. If this is unclear I will make an effort to explain further on request. I do have drawings that I could send via email or fax jim in Kelowna BC. RV6a finish kit. ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Bower <rvbuilder(at)hotmail.com> Sent: Friday, August 11, 2000 9:05 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Spacing between elevator horn and HS skin > > Are, > > I think I am the one who posed the latest question on this subject. I > e-mailed Van's about those gaps (I have about 0.2" on each side). > Basically, they are ok with anything you can do to bridge that gap, for > example, washers. I got a stack of stainless steel washers with a 1/4" hole > and will use a series of them to compensate for the gap. A longer bolt is > also needed. Van's said to measure your distance and order the right bolt. > I really don't know how the gap happened, as I am using the same basic > empennage as you are (-6/-6A is now using the -8 emp). Hope this helps > > Jim Bower > St. Louis, MO > RV-6A N143DJ > Working on wings > > > >From: "Are Barstad" <abarstad(at)bconnex.net> > >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > >To: > >Subject: RV-List: Spacing between elevator horn and HS skin > >Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2000 10:54:27 -0400 > > > > > >Even after looking at RV's at Oshkosh I missed these details - argh! > > > >I just completed the right elevator to the point of inspection (Canadian > >reg's). I then test fitted it to the HS and found that I have a 3/16 inch > >gap between the elevator horn skin and the HS. I gather this must be right > >since I'm building with pre-punched parts. It just seems a lot and I can't > >think of any way to narrow the gap. > > > >Also, does anyone cover up the inside of the horn where one of the counter > >balance weights is? It looks very 'open' by just leaving it this way. > > > >Are > >RV-8 > >Wings on order > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy J. Pflanzer" <rpflanze(at)iquest.net>
Subject: Re: RV-4 cowling installation
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Doug, Have you run the engine yet? If you can do so, it helps to get the mounts to settle somewhat. I don't have the same set up as you (RV-6, 160 hp, fixed pitch) but I would mount the cowling to the way the engine hangs right now. If it does happen to sag a little later, you can place a thick washer between the engine and the mount on the lower mounts to raise the engine just a tad. I received extra washers with my mounts. Randy Pflanzer N417G RV-6 (40 hours) ----- Original Message ----- From: Doug Weiler <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> Sent: Friday, August 11, 2000 9:58 AM Subject: RV-List: RV-4 cowling installation > > Fellow Listers: > > For those with a flying RV I have a question. I am about to begin > installation of the cowling on my -4 (180 hp, C/S prop). Is it advisable to > set the cowling slightly "low" relative to the prop spinner to allow for > engine "sag" in the future? Is this really a significant problem. I have > Lord engine mounts instead of the Barry mts. > > Thanks, > > Doug > > > ================ > Doug Weiler > Hudson, WI > 715-386-1239 > dougweil(at)pressenter.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 11, 2000
From: EARL FORTNER <e.fortner(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Wentworth
I bought a O-320-E2D and am satisfied although it has not been run yet. Earl RV4 "EXT-Richard, Emmanuelle J" wrote: > > > > Anybody bought used parts (Bendix fuel injection or anything else) from Wentworth in MSP? Satisfied? Comments? > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 11, 2000
From: Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: 5 hour report
--- Bob Japundza wrote: > > > Listers, > > I wanted to briefly outline some observations during flight testing > of my -6. Coolness, Bob. Makes me want to leave work early and go dimple more fuse skin holes! Keep it up! Mike Thompson Austin, TX -6 N140RV (Reserved) Fuselage ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 11, 2000
From: "Owens, Laird" <Owens(at)aerovironment.com>
Subject: Electrical Bonding of Controls
Hi all, So...how many of you have electrical bonding straps between the your airframe and the control surfaces. Don't think you need them???? Check out: http://lightning.pwr.eng.osaka-u.ac.jp/lrg/temp/plane.html Simply awesome! I understand a lightening strike can weld the heim joints together. Now I know what your thinking, I never fly in that kind of weather.....but you never know. Fly safely out there, Laird RV-6 (I'm going put them in) SoCal (but then again it never rains in California ;-) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Subject: rear wing spar construction question (rv-6)
in drilling the doubler and spar flanges the directions say NOT to drill the holes that attach the wing ribs until rib assembly. there are 5 stations of 2 holes (10 all together). of course this is up at the inboard area. however the plans say NOT to rivet these ten holes, which are marked with a circle around the X's until ribs are attached. yes, i know not to put rivets in until ribs are ... but should i not drill holes or not?????? or drill and back drill on to ribs when that time comes. ordorff videos have drilled but no rivets-for what that's worth. i tried calling vans and the phones being installed at the new facility. thanx, bob in arkansas ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Subject: rear wing spar construction ealier post
in looking at the photos in plans these are the 5 ribs that are the walk way. also earlier i should have said the spar flange STRIPS. thanx again ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Subject: Removable Tail Tie Down
Hi All....(again..), I remember reading/seeing somewhere that there was a removable tail tie down sold by someone for the 6A.......anyone have any info....? Kurt, OKC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ENewton57(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Subject: Re: rear wing spar construction question (rv-6)
In a message dated 8/11/00 5:47:55 PM Central Daylight Time, Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM writes: << in drilling the doubler and spar flanges the directions say NOT to drill the holes that attach the wing ribs until rib assembly. there are 5 stations of 2 holes (10 all together). of course this is up at the inboard area. however the plans say NOT to rivet these ten holes, which are marked with a circle around the X's until ribs are attached. yes, i know not to put rivets in until ribs are ... but should i not drill holes or not?????? or drill and back drill on to ribs when that time comes. ordorff videos have drilled but no rivets-for what that's worth. i tried calling vans and the phones being installed at the new facility. thanx, bob in arkansas >> Hi Bob, The ribs will end up with three holes each at the rear spar end. The hole to not drill yet are the center ones. You should go ahead a drill the outer two holes in the rear spar with the flanges. Then when you attach the ribs, back drill the ribs (outer holes) through the holes in the spar and then drill the center hole in each rib through the spar. Hope this makes some sense. If not contact me off line and I'll try to help. Eric Newton Long Beach, MS RV-6A N57ME (reserved) (Flaps) Eric's RV-6A Construction Page ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Subject: Re: rear wing spar construction question (rv-6)
eric, i do not see the third hole. yes it makes sense if, but remember this is where the flap brace will go (middle of spar). i am up at the walk area, and on the flange strips. guess i need to study plans more. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CW9371(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Subject: a funny
<< During taxi, the crew of a US Air departure flight to Ft. Lauderdale, made a wrong turn and came nose to nose with a United 727. The irate ground controller lashed out at the US Air crew, screaming "US AIR 2771, WHERE ARE YOU GOING? I TOLD YOU TO TURN RIGHT ON "CHARLIE" TAXIWAY; YOU TURNED RIGHT ON "DELTA." STOP RIGHT THERE. I KNOW IT'S DIFFICULT TO TELL THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN Cs AND Ds, BUT GET IT RIGHT!!!" Continuing her lashing to the embarrassed crew, she was now shouting hysterically, "GOD, YOU'VE SCREWED EVERYTHING UP; IT'LL TAKE FOREVER TO SORT THIS OUT. YOU STAY RIGHT THERE AND DON'T MOVE UNTIL I TELL YOU TO. YOU CAN EXPECT PROGRESSIVE TAXI INSTRUCTIONS IN ABOUT A HALF HOUR, AND I WANT YOU TO GO EXACTLY WHERE I TELL YOU, WHEN I TELL YOU, AND HOW I TELL YOU! YOU GOT THAT, US AIR 2771??!!" The humbled crew responded, "Yes, Ma'am." Naturally, the "Ground Control" frequency went terribly silent after the verbal bashing of US Air Flight 2771. No one wanted to engage the irate ground controller in her current state. Tension in every cockpit at LGA was running high. Shortly after the controller finished her heated admonishment of the US Air crew, an unknown pilot broke the silence and asked, "Wasn't I married to you once???" >> ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "pat_hatch" <pat_hatch(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: RV-4 cowling installation
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Doug: My engine has sagged only a very small amount in 10 years, about 3/16" or so at the spinner. I would build the cowl about 1/8" low to compensate. I compensated by about 1/4" but it's probably a little too much. O-320 engine on Lord mounts. Pat Hatch RV-4, N17PH @ VRB RV-6, Fuselage ----- Original Message ----- From: Doug Weiler <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> Sent: Friday, August 11, 2000 10:58 AM Subject: RV-List: RV-4 cowling installation > > Fellow Listers: > > For those with a flying RV I have a question. I am about to begin > installation of the cowling on my -4 (180 hp, C/S prop). Is it advisable to > set the cowling slightly "low" relative to the prop spinner to allow for > engine "sag" in the future? Is this really a significant problem. I have > Lord engine mounts instead of the Barry mts. > > Thanks, > > Doug > > > ================ > Doug Weiler > Hudson, WI > 715-386-1239 > dougweil(at)pressenter.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 11, 2000
From: RE Miller <rmill2000(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: 8 Degree Tilt?
There have been a number references to RV panels and their 8 degree tilt. My panel measures at 6.3 degrees. Does anyone else have some variation here and does it matter? Rob Miller 80153 90% done 56.4% to go ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 11, 2000
From: Jim Cimino <jcimino(at)epix.net>
Subject: Re: Wentworth
I bought an IO-360 from them complete, when the engine showed up, some parts were missing. (flywheel, vac pump, I think) They were a little careless in there crating, the harness and the fuel injection lines were ruined. The engine also included free shipping, except when it showed up the driver would not leave it until I gave him a check for shipping. They were very good about replacing the missing items and exchanged even-up my sump for a different one (although they stripped it first). Getting my money back took for the shipping took about six months and I finally had to talk to the owner (Steve, I think) He was very concerned about making things right. I started the engine last week for the first time, and it sounds good. They are very straight forward on what they are selling, they seem to tell it like it is. The engine I bought had about 100 hrs on it and they said it had a "prop drag". The log books confirmed the overhaul and hours, Mattituck confirmed what parts where replaced during the overhaul, (including the ignition harness) and the NTSB Report confirmed the "Prop Drag". All in all, I am happy with what I got for the price I paid. Just be sure to be specific and take the name of who you deal with. > > >> Anybody bought used parts (Bendix fuel injection or anything else) from Wentworth in MSP? Satisfied? Comments? >> > > Jim Cimino RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL Reserved http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo (570)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 11, 2000
From: Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com>
Subject: Re: 8 Degree Tilt?
My 6A was 7.5 degrees Gary Zilik > > There have been a number references to RV panels and > their 8 degree tilt. My panel measures at 6.3 > degrees. Does anyone else have some variation here > and does it matter? > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: RV-4 cowling installation
Date: Aug 11, 2000
> My engine has sagged only a very small amount in 10 years, about 3/16" or so > at the spinner. I would build the cowl about 1/8" low to compensate. My experience is similar. Has sagged about 1/8" in 125 hrs. Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~125 hrs) Portland, OR http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chuck Rabaut" <crabaut(at)coalinga.com>
Subject: Re: RV-4 cowling installation
Date: Aug 11, 2000
Are Lord Mounts better than Barry Mounts? Do they permit "sagging" after a few years or what? (I already bought Barry Mounts). Chuck ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Steven DiNieri" <capsteve(at)adelphia.net>
Subject: Removable Tail Tie Down
Date: Aug 12, 2000
> Hi All....(again..), > > I remember reading/seeing somewhere that there was a > removable tail tie > down sold by someone for the 6A.......anyone have any info....? > > Kurt, OKC > Give George Orndorff a call. he's got the tie down rings and a drilled and tapped block for the tail tie down. was very reasonable...... capsteve(at)adelphia.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Calvert" <rv6bldr(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: rear wing spar construction question (rv-6)
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Bob, Pay attention to the holes on plans that are for attaching the flap brace. Don't drill them until you are attaching the flap brace! If you drill them in advance, more than likely they won't line up with the brace quite right. When the brace is being attached, drill through the brace into the spar and into the rib flange. Just make sure you're hitting the rib flange properly. The other rib holes I drilled in advance and just back drilled through the rib flange. Don't forget that some of the rivets that attach the ribs to the rear spar need to be flush rivets. Check the plans closely. The other rivets are universal head. You might want to download Will's wing instructions and read them over. They will save you a few headaches!! Jerry Calvert Edmond Ok -6 fuse ----- Original Message ----- From: <Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM> Sent: Friday, August 11, 2000 5:34 PM Subject: RV-List: rear wing spar construction question (rv-6) > > in drilling the doubler and spar flanges the directions say NOT to drill the > holes that attach the wing ribs until rib assembly. there are 5 stations of 2 > holes (10 all together). of course this is up at the inboard area. however > the plans say NOT to rivet these ten holes, which are marked with a circle > around the X's until ribs are attached. yes, i know not to put rivets in > until ribs are ... but should i not drill holes or not?????? or drill and > back drill on to ribs when that time comes. ordorff videos have drilled but > no rivets-for what that's worth. i tried calling vans and the phones being > installed at the new facility. thanx, bob in arkansas > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com>
Subject: Re: RV-4 cowling installation
Date: Aug 12, 2000
> > Are Lord Mounts better than Barry Mounts? Do they permit "sagging" after a > few years or what? (I already bought Barry Mounts). > > Chuck The only reason I used Lord mounts was on the recommendation of a local RV-4 pilot who was having a rather unusual and persistent high frequency vibration in his airplane. It was a 160 hp with a C/S prop. He even talked with the people at Hartzell about it. He finally changed his engine mounts from Barry to Lord and it went away. The Lord mounts have a "gel" filled type of bushing which may absorb vibration better. The down side is they are not cheap!! Doug Weiler ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com>
Subject: Tailwheel endorsement - really required?
Date: Aug 12, 2000
I'd say that if the other guys in the club feel you're ready then you probably are. I think the important thing is to learn the idiosyncrasies of the particular conventional geared aircraft that you are going to fly. For instance, all my tailwheel time is in Aeronca Champs. I would not even consider trying to jump into a Starduster without some dual. It is best to learn them from someone who already knows the plane's gotcha's. Better yet if that person is a CFI. But my opinion is that anyone who has substantial time in the aircraft working with you is far better than trying to learn on your own. -- Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE Network Administrator Union Safe Deposit Bank 209-946-5116 -----Original Message----- From: Brian Huffaker [mailto:bifft(at)xmission.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 09, 2000 6:29 PM To: rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: RV-List: Tailwheel endorsement - really required? >Not to beat a dead horse but... If you don't have a tailwheel endorsement, >I don't believe you are ready to fly a high performance tail dragger. I >don't have one as I am "grandfathered." I don't have as many TW hours as >Scott but still enough to know from experience that a TW can bite you when >you least expect it. Scott has the right approach. Ok, what about my current situation. Been getting dual in the Starduster for a while now, up to about 20 hours. But, the guys I have been getting dual from are just the other guys in the partnership. (mostly with an ex-AF pilot 5000+hours). They feel that I'm ready to solo the plane. None of them are CFI's. I can't find anybody in the state of Utah who does tailwheel instruction (two months of trying has resulted in only one person who would even return my call to say he couldn't do it). So, no endorsement. Hearing that it may be legal, I'm going to have to go check the documents to see if it has the operating restriction. Would be tairing my hair out of this if I had any left. Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com) President and Founder Friends of P-Chan RV-8 80091 Riviting fuel tanks. 1/5 Starduster II N23UT flying ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Aerosport Power Flyoff Period
Date: Aug 12, 2000
I have an Aerosport Power Limited (Bart LaLonde) O360-A1A and Hartzell constant speed prop on my 6A. In discussing flyoff period with the local FISDO, the rep said that flyoff period would depend on the logbook entries made by Bart. My question: Has anyone on the list secured a 25 hour flyoff period with one of Bart's engines? Dennis Persyk 6A Hampshire, IL C38 ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Subject: Removable Tail Tie Down
From: Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com>
George & Becky O. (GBI.com) in Ft worth. Install on the F611 in lieu of the F612. Don't get into the rudder that way if it bends Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com ********************************************** > Hi All....(again..), > > I remember reading/seeing somewhere that there was a removable > tail tie > down sold by someone for the 6A.......anyone have any info....? > > Kurt, OKC > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 12, 2000
From: Steve Judd <sjudd(at)ffd2.com>
Subject: Re: Free Standing Jig ?
Hi Sam, On Mon, 7 Aug 2000, Sam Cherroff wrote: > > I've seen a lot of pictures on the various constructors web pages of the > assembly jig that is used during construction of all of the surfaces. In every > case the jig is apparently attached to the ceiling. > > My shop has a 16' ceiling and so anchoring the jigs this way would be > problematic. Are there plans for a free standing jig? Can anyone point me to > a site that has pictures? I built one using a long 2x6, sandwiched between 2x4's at each end, using 2x4 cross-braces and such, built to minimize the possibility of twisting, warping, etc. over time. All this is pretty straightforward, and I bet if you just start building you'll figure it out. BUT -- most pictures I've seen show the jig with long boards or long pieces of plywood for feet. I could not get the jig to be stable with this kind of setup. My final solution was to use 1/2-inch lag screws as feet, screwed into some 2x4's of modest length -- that is, the only part of the jig that touches the floor are those lag screws. They are simple, make the jig rock-solid, and the jig can be leveled by simply adjusting the bolts. I do have some pictures, but they're still in the camera. -Steve ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Subject: Re: rear wing spar construction question (rv-6)
will's instructions? i need the addy. thanx, bob ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Subject: rear wing spar construction
sorry guys. one question, do i drill holes in spar flange strips now or when attaching ribs? ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Subject: 8 Degree Tilt?
From: Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com>
Subject: RV-List: 8 Degree Tilt? There have been a number references to RV panels and their 8 degree tilt. My panel measures at 6.3 degrees. Does anyone else have some variation here and does it matter? Rob Miller 80153 90% done 56.4% to go --------------------- Rob, This post isn't directed at you; but the list in general. So please don't be offended. I just wanted to point out a problem that exists to varying degrees because of the large # of different RV models and options available. Because of the large # of Models and options, a lot of what gets posted from one person to another (if they are building a different models) is not at all relevant. A lot of the issues are very similar from one model to another, but a lot of it isn't. Particularly as the evolutionary spread gets bigger between what 2 different builders are building. Example: Even though the RV-4 and RV-8 are both tandem seating airplanes their are probably more construction similarities between the RV-4 and the RV-6 then their are between the RV-4 and the RV-8. Now we throw the RV-9A in the picture... It is almost in a world all of its own and it is likely difficult for someone to give (detailed) construction advice without having built one. When builders start installing systems (engine, etc.) the info starts to become much more generic and interrelated, but their are still many differences. For instance... an oil cooler installation on an O-320 powered RV-4 which causes oil temps that are too low, may not be adequate on an O-320 powered RV-6A that is operated in a warmer environment. Everyone should keep this in mind when posting to a question, or when reading posts that have been made. At times I see a lot of bandwidth wasted with posts that wouldn't be relevant to the original question. More important than the wasted band width though, is that it is very difficult for new builders to differentiate and decipher all of this information. It can easily raise the question...Is any of it right? Something that I would really like to see on the List is that anyone (and many do already) that makes a post (question, answer, or otherwise) signs it with a signature that states: Name, City/State, RV-model, Engine model, Prop. model, N-number/flight hours (showing if it is flying). Any other info could be added that you choose. If you are not at the point of having an engine or prop yet, that info can just be left off (or you could write "planning for O-360 with Sensenich fixed metal prop., etc.) All of the E-mail programs I am familiar with allow you to pre make up a signature and add it to the end of any message (like the one I have on the end of this message) with only a Ctrl/something key stroke. If you don't know how to do it on yours, I'm sure someone here on the list could help. What does everyone think of the idea? I think it would make the information on the list much more valuable. Scott McDaniels North Plains, OR These opinions and ideas are my own and may not reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 12, 2000
From: Michael McGee <jmpcrftr(at)teleport.com>
Subject: Re: Aerosport Power Flyoff Period
The new 9A got 15 hours but it was factory built. It has an Aerosport engine with the MT prop. Sounds possible. Mike, RV-4, N996RV, Aurora, OR > >I have an Aerosport Power Limited (Bart LaLonde) O360-A1A and Hartzell >constant speed prop on my 6A. In discussing flyoff period with the local >FISDO, the rep said that flyoff period would depend on the logbook entries >made by Bart. My question: Has anyone on the list secured a 25 hour flyoff >period with one of Bart's engines? >Dennis Persyk 6A >Hampshire, IL C38 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 12, 2000
From: Denny Harjehausen <harje(at)proaxis.com>
Subject: Re: Navaid servo shaking
>Sam Buchanan (RV-6 faithfully guided by Navaid and Lowrance AirMap 100) >"The RV Journal" http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal Sam your just the man I need to talk to. I have the same setup you have, Lowrance Airmap 100. Is there something I have to program into the lowrance to get it send info to the NavAid? I havee with this off and on quite awhile with now success. Could talk me throught the step you took? Thanks! Have a good one, Denny RV-6 Lebanon, OR ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Carter" <jcarter8(at)midsouth.rr.com>
Subject: Re: RV-8 Wiring Drawings & kit...
Date: Aug 12, 2000
> I have the RV-8 wiring drawings from Van's, but have not ordered the wiring > kit yet... Has anyone ordered the kit from Van's? If so, was it a good > deal? Was it pretty complete? Do you have an inventory of what came in the > kit? > If you're planning on using Van's plan for wiring, then go ahead and get the kit. I bought the kit, then ended up using Bob Nuckoll's plans, including the firewall ground block, so the precut wires were wrong for me in most cases. I still used a lot of the wire, especially the larger guage wires, but, if I had it to do over again, I would just order the wire, contactors and everything else from Bob or Spruce. The kit has wires that are labeled as per their plans, which is nice, but you can do something similar with clear heatshrink and a printer. If you would like, email me off list and I will be happy to fax you the inventory of what's in their kit. Jerry Carter Memphis, TN My RV-8A website: http://rv8asite.homestead.com/mainpage.html ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Carter" <jcarter8(at)midsouth.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Aerosport Power Flyoff Period
Date: Aug 12, 2000
> >I have an Aerosport Power Limited (Bart LaLonde) O360-A1A and Hartzell > >constant speed prop on my 6A. In discussing flyoff period with the local > >FISDO, the rep said that flyoff period would depend on the logbook entries > >made by Bart. My question: Has anyone on the list secured a 25 hour flyoff > >period with one of Bart's engines? > >Dennis Persyk 6A > >Hampshire, IL C38 > >> Ed Storo and Frank Hoover both got 25 hour flyoff periods with Aerosport 0-360 A1A's. Jerry ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mark Steffensen" <steffco1(at)home.com>
Subject: Van's Alternator
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Lister's, I have 17 hours on my 8A and all is going well. Today, my alternator stopped working. My amp meter showed several wild fluctuations & then started to discharge. I secured all non-essential electrical gear & headed home about 30 mins. I checked all the wiring looking for grounds etc, the contiinuity was good. I took off the Van's alternater to inspect & several peices of solder fell out of the unit. I am planning on sending back to Van's for replacement. Have any of you had the any expeirencewith the Van's alternator, or did I just get a bad one? Not to happy to have the A/C out of service for several days, but still smiling.....Mark Mark Steffensen 8A Dallas, TX Flying 17 hours ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Subject: Re: Van's Alternator
In a message dated 8/12/00 3:25:07 PM Eastern Daylight Time, steffco1(at)home.com writes: << Lister's, I have 17 hours on my 8A and all is going well. Today, my alternator stopped working. My amp meter showed several wild fluctuations & then started to discharge. I secured all non-essential electrical gear & headed home about 30 mins. I checked all the wiring looking for grounds etc, the contiinuity was good. I took off the Van's alternater to inspect & several peices of solder fell out of the unit. I am planning on sending back to Van's for replacement. Have any of you had the any expeirencewith the Van's alternator, or did I just get a bad one? Not to happy to have the A/C out of service for several days, but still smiling.....Mark Mark Steffensen 8A Dallas, TX Flying 17 hours >> There are quite a few stories in the archives about Van's alternators. Some experiences have been good, some bad. I know that Mike Seager carries a spare alternator with him on his travels in the factory RV-6 (to me, this indicates a bit of a reliablility problem). Also, I know that both the in-service and spare alternator died on his visit to Lebanon TN last year. This indicates a bigger problem. As Bob Nuckolls suggests, I spent the big $ and got the one from B&C. KB ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "pat_hatch" <pat_hatch(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: Standard Signature
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Great idea, Scott. I think Matt has been trying to get everyone to standardize their signatures for some time. Anyway, for those who want to create a signature on Outlook Express, go to the Tools menu, Options, Signature, and create your signature. Then before you send a new message go to Insert and add your signature. Pat Hatch RV-4, N17PH @ VRB, 700 hours TT O-320, Hartzell C/S RV-6, Fuselage ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com> Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2000 12:26 PM Subject: RE: RV-List: 8 Degree Tilt? > > Subject: RV-List: 8 Degree Tilt? > > > There have been a number references to RV panels and > their 8 degree tilt. My panel measures at 6.3 > degrees. Does anyone else have some variation here > and does it matter? > > Rob Miller > 80153 90% done 56.4% to go > > --------------------- > > Rob, > This post isn't directed at you; but the list in general. So please > don't be offended. I just wanted to point out a problem that exists to > varying degrees because of the large # of different RV models and options > available. > > Because of the large # of Models and options, a lot of what gets posted > from one person to another (if they are building a different models) is > not at all relevant. A lot of the issues are very similar from one model > to another, but a lot of it isn't. Particularly as the evolutionary > spread gets bigger between what 2 different builders are building. > > Example: Even though the RV-4 and RV-8 are both tandem seating airplanes > their are probably more construction similarities between the RV-4 and > the RV-6 then their are between the RV-4 and the RV-8. > > Now we throw the RV-9A in the picture... It is almost in a world all of > its own and it is likely difficult for someone to give (detailed) > construction advice without having built one. > > When builders start installing systems (engine, etc.) the info starts to > become much more generic and interrelated, but their are still many > differences. For instance... an oil cooler installation on an O-320 > powered RV-4 which causes oil temps that are too low, may not be > adequate on an O-320 powered RV-6A that is operated in a warmer > environment. > > Everyone should keep this in mind when posting to a question, or when > reading posts that have been made. At times I see a lot of bandwidth > wasted with posts that wouldn't be relevant to the original question. > More important than the wasted band width though, is that it is very > difficult for new builders to differentiate and decipher all of this > information. > It can easily raise the question...Is any of it right? > > Something that I would really like to see on the List is that anyone (and > many do already) that makes a post (question, answer, or otherwise) signs > it with a signature that states: > > Name, City/State, RV-model, Engine model, Prop. model, N-number/flight > hours (showing if it is flying). > > Any other info could be added that you choose. If you are not at the > point of having an engine or prop yet, that info can just be left off (or > you could write "planning for O-360 with Sensenich fixed metal prop., > etc.) > > All of the E-mail programs I am familiar with allow you to pre make up a > signature and add it to the end of any message (like the one I have on > the end of this message) with only a Ctrl/something key stroke. If you > don't know how to do it on yours, I'm sure someone here on the list could > help. > > What does everyone think of the idea? I think it would make the > information on the list much more valuable. > > > Scott McDaniels > North Plains, OR > These opinions and ideas are my own and may not > reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ENewton57(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Subject: Re: rear wing spar construction
In a message dated 8/12/00 11:45:25 AM Central Daylight Time, Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM writes: << sorry guys. one question, do i drill holes in spar flange strips now or when attaching ribs? >> Now. Drill the holes in the spar flange strips and spar. When you install the ribs, back drill through the flange strips and into the ribs. Just don't drill the middle holes until you install the flap brace. That way you know it will line up correctly. Eric Newton - Long Beach, Mississippi RV-6A N57ME (Reserved) (wing skinning) Eric's RV-6A Construction Page ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 12, 2000
From: Warren Gretz <warrengretz(at)gretzaero.com>
list-aviation , list-avionics , list-ez , list-glasair , list-lancair , list-rocket
Subject: Heated pitot tubes
Hello builders, I currently have a large stock of Heated Pitot Tubes in the popular PH502-12 CR (formaly AN5812) and the AN5814 which has a heated static source built in to it. Both of these pitot tubes are 12 volt. I also have heated pitot tube mounting bracket kits for the above pitot tubes. There are other items that may be of interest to you for your project. To see the above mentioned pitot tubes and mouting brackets and all the rest of my products, look at my website at http://www.gretzaero.com You may contact me by phone in the evenings and on weekends. You may also send me your order by way of my website. Warren Gretz Gretz Aero 303-770-3811 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HCRV6(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Subject: Re: 8 Degree Tilt?
In a message dated 8/11/00 8:10:10 PM Pacific Daylight Time, rmill2000(at)yahoo.com writes: << Does anyone else have some variation here >> Mine is 7 degrees and I triple checked all the dimensions before I nailed things down. Go figure. Harry Crosby -6 finish kit stuff ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4Brown(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Subject: Re: idiot light switches
Check the archives. There are several sources for dual contact pressure switches i.e. NO & NC. I purchased a 6 psi switch from Chief that is working fine on my oil system. I don't have a low pressure fuel light, just the VM1000 pressure gauge. Tom Brown RV4 flying 26 hours RV4Brown(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4Brown(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Subject: Re: Aerosport Power Flyoff Period
I will be very interested in knowing what type of sign off is required in the logbooks to be entitled to the 25 hour test period using an Aerosport derivative Lycoming engine. I have an Aero-Sport O-360 that is non-certified. The placard on the engine says it is an Aero Sport not a Lycoming. I have been assigned the forty hour test period, no landings at any other airport unless it is an emergency, no night flight, and no passengers. The propellor is a new Hartzell CS. I have flown 26 of the forty hours plus a few hours of preflight taxi time. I don't feel the time has been wasted and I am surprised how fast it goes by. If you go through a thorough methodical process of testing the airplane in different weight configurations, ( the 4 is a different airplane with the back seat loaded),determining the best rate of glide, determining glide rates at different weights and air speeds, charting speeds versus power settings via 3 turn GPS procedures at different altitudes, stall speeds at different weight configurations, spins left and right, performing whatever aerobatics are going to be signed off in the logbook, rate of climb at various airspeeds, and performing operational checks on the various systems and radios, you are going to need the time. In addition, while doing the above, especially in my case, I have managed to regain some of my flying skills which were badly neglected during the six year building process. I think I built a pretty good airplane. However, I have found I have spent at least three hours of tinkering and making small changes and checking things out for every hour in the air. With all that stated, I am ready to get out of the box, go somewhere, and take some well deserving folks for a ride. Nothing has happened to date that has put either me or the airplane in peril, but I think it has been good that I have done this alone for the first 25 hours. I am not sure how I will feel after flying the next fourteen. So far it continues to be an enjoyable learning experience. I gain more respect for the design with each flight. I do wish I had a cloaking device to hide a few of my takeoffs and landings. It does handle different loaded. Tom Brown RV4 flying 26 hours RV4brwon(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 12, 2000
From: Will Cretsinger <cretsinger(at)arlington.net>
Subject: Re: rear wing spar construction question (rv-6)
RV-6/6A WING CONSTRUCTION NOTES: Frank Justice Supplemental Instructions: http://www.edt.com/homewing/justice/index.html Will Cretsinger Wing/Tilt Canopy Notes: <http://www.flash.net/~gila> Frank van der Hulst wing notes: Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > > will's instructions? i need the addy. thanx, bob ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 12, 2000
From: gert <gert(at)execpc.com>
Subject: RV8 F804H
Hi folks Just started working on the spar cary through. looking at the F804-H which according to the drawing has a dimension of 24 21/32. the flat plates which came with the center section and which are marked F804-H are only 23 31/32 long. Is the missing 22/32 a problem or a dimensional oops on the drawing. Gert -- Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227, any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500 US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ENewton57(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Subject: Re: Standard Signature
In a message dated 8/12/00 4:31:04 PM Central Daylight Time, HCRV6(at)AOL.COM writes: << Anyone know how to do this on AOL? >> Hi Harry, On AOL click on "Mail Center" at the top of the page. Then click on "Set Up Mail Signatures." A little box comes up. Click on "Create." In the signature name put what ever you want to call the signature. In the space below type in your signature that want. (See mine below for what it looks like.) When you are satisfied with it click "OK." The original box comes back. Click on the button that says "Default ON/OFF" and this signature you just created will pop up automatically on every email you generate (for that screen name only). Hope this helps, Eric Newton - Long Beach, Mississippi RV-6A N57ME (Reserved) (wing skinning) Eric's RV-6A Construction Page ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy J. Pflanzer" <rpflanze(at)iquest.net>
Subject: Re: Aerosport Power Flyoff Period
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Yes, I got only 25 hours but only after an AP signed my logbook that all the applicable ADs had been complied with. (Even though the engine has an experimental data tag.) (And even though experimentals don't need to show compliance with ADs). However, if you don't do it, you are guaranteed 40 hours. Randy Pflanzer N417G RV-6 (42 hours) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2000 10:07 AM Subject: RV-List: Aerosport Power Flyoff Period > > I have an Aerosport Power Limited (Bart LaLonde) O360-A1A and Hartzell > constant speed prop on my 6A. In discussing flyoff period with the local > FISDO, the rep said that flyoff period would depend on the logbook entries > made by Bart. My question: Has anyone on the list secured a 25 hour flyoff > period with one of Bart's engines? > Dennis Persyk 6A > Hampshire, IL C38 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 12, 2000
From: Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca>
Subject: Re: RV8 F804H
> >Hi folks > >Just started working on the spar cary through. > >looking at the F804-H which according to the drawing has a dimension of >24 21/32. the flat plates which came with the center section and which >are marked F804-H are only 23 31/32 long. > > >Is the missing 22/32 a problem or a dimensional oops on the drawing. > > >Gert >-- Gert, I just measured my fuselage to refresh my memory - 24 21/32 is what my plans say, and that looks just about perfect on my fuselage. I recall I had to trim it very slightly in length so it wouldn't interfere with the upper longeron - less than 1/16 was removed. Something is wrong here - I would talk to Van's and get them to send new parts, or a drawing change to match your parts. -- Kevin Horton RV-8 (mounting elevators, etc) Ottawa, Canada http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 12, 2000
From: Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com>
Subject: Burlington Colorado Flyin
Listers, It is hard to believe but a year has almost past and it is again time for the RV Builder's Dream Event in Burlington, Colorado. The 5th Annual Burlington RV Flyin happens this year September 22nd-24th at ITR in Eastern Colorado. Events this year include a Poker Run and for you real competitive guys a Speed Race. Awards judging also takes place so bring your pride and Joy and take home a beautiful trophy. Burlington is not for flying RV's only. No matter how you get there there are forums on how to make it go faster and for the builders amongst us lots of airplanes to look at and builder/flyers to answer questions. If you have MS-WORD http://www.geocities.com/zilik/Burlington.doc has all the info. For those who do not have MS-WORD I have converted (poorly mind you) the word document to html and this can be viewed by going to: http:www.geocities.com/zilik/Burlington.html So mark you calendars and come and visit us in Burlington, Colorado. The best RV flyin in the US. Gary Zilik RV-6A - 0-360-A1A 75 hrs and counting. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 12, 2000
From: Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
Subject: Re: Navaid servo shaking
Denny Harjehausen wrote: > > > > >Sam Buchanan (RV-6 faithfully guided by Navaid and Lowrance AirMap 100) > >"The RV Journal" http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal > > Sam your just the man I need to talk to. I have the same setup you have, > Lowrance Airmap 100. Is there something I have to program into the lowrance > to get it send info to the NavAid? > > I havee with this off and on quite awhile with now success. Could talk me > throught the step you took? > > Thanks! Denny, I messed around with my Navaid for over six months before I got it to track the Lowrance. However, the problem was not with the Lowrance but a lapse in Navaid's documentation. Fellow Alabama Redneck and RV-6A driver Bob Butler installed a Navaid in his plane ( http://home.HiWAAY.net/~sbuc/journal/navaid.html ) and the thing worked perfectly with his Lowrance Airmap 300 right out of the box. This was really irritating to me since I had been flying my Navaid for six months with no tracking. One day Bob casually mentioned the jumpers on the back of his Navaid connector. "Jumpers? What jumpers?" Seems that Navaid included a note in the documentation newer than my unit that if you are using a handheld GPS only, that you need to include a couple of jumpers to replace the switch that was formerly used to select either panel nav radio or handheld GPS. Since I don't have a panel mounted nav, and the notes weren't in my diagram, I hadn't installed the jumpers. Once the jumpers were plugged in, the system immediately began to track the Lowrance! Needless to say I was a bit miffed at Navaid for leaving me dangling for six months. I called them and the answer I got was "Yeah, I decided that I had better put that note in the diagram." ??!!????? An astute electrical type individual would have picked up on the need for the jumpers after carefully tracing the wiring through the switch, but I missed it. So, make sure you have two jumpers on the Navaid connector if you are using the Smart Coupler with a handheld GPS and no other nav radios. I don't have the pinout info in front of me, reply if you need more details or call Navaid. Yeah.....call Navaid. Let them know that they messed up another builder by not sending complete documentation. The GPS only needs to have the NMEA string activated along with the RMC and RMB sentences. You find these switches in the NMEA setup menu. That should get you going. If you can't get a green light on the Smart Coupler then the data isn't getting to the Navaid. Unless.............you have a bad Smart Coupler. The original coupler on my unit had a hard time consistently reading data from the Lowrance. I will spare you the details, but there were several contacts with Navaid concerning this issue, each time they INSISTED that the coupler was good and that my wiring had mysteriously gone bad. It wasn't. I finally got them to replace it at Sun-N-Fun (the coupler checked good on their test rig) and now it works perfectly. The same thing has happened to fellow redneck Robin Hunt's Airmap 100 in his RV-8, Navaid insisted the unit was good, and it wasn't. Apparently some Smart Couplers have problems reading the Airmap 100. So if all else looks good, INSIST that Navaid replace the coupler in your unit (they will do so only after telling you that there HAS to be a problem in your airplane..(tell them Sam Buchanan sent ya)....we proved them wrong by switching units between planes.) Good luck with your installation. The Navaid works beautifully once you get it going, and I suspect the Lowrance Airmap 100 issue is pretty rare. Sam Buchanan (RV-6, 165 hrs) "The RV Journal" http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 12, 2000
Subject: Re: 8 Degree Tilt?
In a message dated 8/12/00 10:19:37 AM Pacific Daylight Time, smcdaniels(at)juno.com writes: << There have been a number references to RV panels and their 8 degree tilt. My panel measures at 6.3 degrees. Does anyone else have some variation here and does it matter? >> Measuring the panel angle as it sits on the ground is fine only if you intend to drive it on roads. I prefer to fly mine, so it is important that it reflect a cruise flight attitude. This is 8-10 degrees forward tilt. The instrument allows for some adjustment. -GV (RV-6A N1GV) vanremog(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 12, 2000
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: Re: idiot light switches
> >I need to find the sensor switches for the low oil & low fuel pressure >lights??? Our website catalog has a single pole, double throw pressure switch suitable for a combination oil-pressure warning and hourmeter control. See http://www.aeroelectric.com/Catalog/catalog.html Bob . . . //// (o o) ===========o00o=(_)=o00o======== < Independence Kansas: the > < Jurassic Park of aviation. > < Your source for brand new > < 40 year old airplanes. > ================================ http://www.aeroelectric.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 13, 2000
From: Frank and Dorothy <frankvdh(at)ihug.co.nz>
Subject: Re: Bunny's Guide is moving... was Re: rear wing spar construction
question (rv-6) Will Cretsinger wrote: > RV-6/6A WING CONSTRUCTION NOTES: > Frank Justice Supplemental Instructions: > http://www.edt.com/homewing/justice/index.html > > Will Cretsinger Wing/Tilt Canopy Notes: <http://www.flash.net/~gila> > > Frank van der Hulst wing notes: Thanks for the plug Will. But... I'm changing ISPs, and therefore moving my homepage... the one you quoted will disappear in a week or so. The Bunny's Guide pages are also available at <http://members.xoom.com/frankv> The new version isn't quite done yet, but pretty much everything is available now via <http://fly.to/bunnysguide>. That address should (in theory) remain valid forever... whenever I move my pages I'll be able to point the fly.to address at the new location. The downside of this redirection is that fly.to adds a pop-up window. That's not a huge pain, especially if you have something like PopupHunter to automatically kill their popup window. For those who prefer to go more directly, the new Bunny's Guide pages will reside at <http://gringo.whanganui.ac.nz/personal/frankv> for the foreseeable future. At some time in the distant, unforeseeable future they will probably move again. Those people with links to my pages, please update. Thanks! For the newer list members, the Bunny's Guide to RV Building is my self-imposed task to provide a central clearing house for exchanging what we learn about RV building. In practise, it's mostly stuff I've written, plus some notes provided to the Guide by various people, plus a fair number of posts copied from the RV-list. Since I'm building a non-QB RV-6 with tip-up canopy, stuff that's specific to other models, specific to the QB, or to the slider canopy probably isn't present. Having said that, there's still a lot of common ground for most RV builders. I welcome submissions to the Bunny's Guide any time (especially submissions relating to stuff I haven't done myself yet!). The submitter may choose to have their submission included in the Guide either anonymously or with due credit. Frank Marton NZ RV-6 tip-up, building canopy ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV8 Flap Brace Installation - Results
Date: Aug 13, 2000
What was the final word on the flap brace tread from March. We have the same problem, are getting a small concave bowing of the wing skin - due to the inboard buildup of the doublers(proper word). Was the resolution just to live with it? Has anyone received an answer from Van's? Thanks & Good Building, Chuck & Dave Rowbotham RV-8Aqb Niantic, CT ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 13, 2000
From: gert <gert(at)execpc.com>
Subject: Re: RV8 Flap Brace Installation - Results
I got new flap braces from Van's, took some doing as the first person I talked to insisted nothing changed Finally this person looked in the drawing and told me the angles changed and i should just re-bent the ones I had (WHAT ???!!!??). I told hime the dimensions changed also as there is less lenght between the 2 bends. He finally agreed to send me one new one as the first was allready installed. I bowed the installed brace slightly and that pulled the skin back in line. Gert Charles Rowbotham wrote: > > > What was the final word on the flap brace tread from March. > > We have the same problem, are getting a small concave bowing of the wing > skin - due to the inboard buildup of the doublers(proper word). > > Was the resolution just to live with it? > > Has anyone received an answer from Van's? > > Thanks & Good Building, > > Chuck & Dave Rowbotham > RV-8Aqb > Niantic, CT > -- Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227, any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500 US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 13, 2000
From: Andy <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com>
Subject: scale on pistons
During my annual with all the plugs removed I shone a light into the cylinder and looked in at the top of the piston. About 30-40% of each piston top is covered by a dry flacky scale. Is this normal? How much build-up is acceptable. The Sky Ranch book says that the absense of build-up is a sign that the engine is running too hot and has melted it off. However with all the recent talk about stuck valves, I can easily imagine some of this scale breaking free and getting into the valve seat. All else looked good. The plugs were relatively clean with very little or no build-up down near the ceramic piece. There was also a small sheen of oil in each cylinder. Andy ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 13, 2000
Subject: F-690/Elev Push Tube
Hey Folks, Its been one of those weekends.....just when it all seems to be going together so well.....!!! I assembled the F-690 push tube per the plans, with out making any cuts or trimming, leaving it at 78" in length. Mounted the HS and Elevators and went to make the final cut/adjustments and wouldn't ya know it...its about 1" too short. I checked everything I could think of: I got the right tube...1 1/2 x 78", The bellcrank is in the proper location, bellcrank is in the proper position, the controls were locked in the neutral position, with the elevators in trail (neutral). The bellcrank in the center was positioned almost vertically (when neutral)....so Im kind of at a loss what is going on....hmmmmm....any ideas??? Obviously I need a new tube....but logic would tell me that the folks at vans would make it a bit long to start and leave a bit to be trimmed. I building a QB, 6A......hey maybe I got the "SF" version (streched fuselage). Help!!! Kurt, OKC, OK RV 6A QB ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chuck Spaur" <Chuck(at)spaur.com>
Subject: Re: F-690/Elev Push Tube
Date: Aug 13, 2000
Kurt, I spent my weekend doing the same thing - working on the F-690 and F-689. Don't toss your F-690 yet. Have you fitted your F-689? The way I read it you start with the eye-bolts extended to about their max extension on the F-690 and then fit your F-689. With the elevators in full "nose-up" (stick-back) position you need about 1/8" clearance from the control arm to the main spar. I ended up with about 1/4" which means I can shorten my F-690 (taking up some treads) to get the full stick travel. I did it this way because determining the controls neutral position seemed to be more error prone. Maybe someone that's flying can shed some more light on this for us... Chuck RV-6 QB ----- Original Message ----- From: <KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM> Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2000 3:44 PM Subject: RV-List: F-690/Elev Push Tube > > Hey Folks, > > Its been one of those weekends.....just when it all seems to be going > together so well.....!!! I assembled the F-690 push tube per the plans, > with out making any cuts or trimming, leaving it at 78" in length. Mounted > the HS and Elevators and went to make the final cut/adjustments and wouldn't > ya know it...its about 1" too short. I checked everything I could think of: > I got the right tube...1 1/2 x 78", The bellcrank is in the proper location, > bellcrank is in the proper position, the controls were locked in the neutral > position, with the elevators in trail (neutral). The bellcrank in the center > was positioned almost vertically (when neutral)....so Im kind of at a loss > what is going on....hmmmmm....any ideas??? Obviously I need a new > tube....but logic would tell me that the folks at vans would make it a bit > long to start and leave a bit to be trimmed. I building a QB, 6A......hey > maybe I got the "SF" version (streched fuselage). Help!!! > > Kurt, OKC, OK > RV 6A QB > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 14, 2000
From: Bruce Stewart <bruce@triton-dive.com>
Subject: Re:Travelling
Hi All, in an attempt to liven this list up a bit more I'm just curious as to what sort of touring you guys have done in your RV 3's? Here in Australia theres lotsa things to do but flying in America seems pretty good after having a quick look at the map and hearing/ reading a few stories about what its like over there. Bruce Stewart ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net>
Subject: Re: F-690/Elev Push Tube
Date: Aug 13, 2000
check the archives with the following search string, and you'll find more info on this. alex & elevator & bellcrank Alex Peterson Maple Grove, MN 6A O360, Airflow, CS may fly in '01 ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $7.99/mo! ------ ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 13, 2000
From: Louis Willig <larywil(at)home.com>
Subject: Fold-up motor scooter
Hi gang, Has anyone on the list tried out the DiBlasi folding motor scooter? I saw it at 'Kosh and have been considering trying one out. If it fits in the back seat of a -4 it would be a great companion on long trips. Louis Louis I. Willig larywil(at)home.com RV-4, N180PF, 30 hrs. I0-360, Hartzell C/S (610) 668-4964 Philadelphia, PA ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 13, 2000
Subject: Re: F-690/Elev Push Tube/FIXED!!!!
Thanks for all the emails guys.....by doing some more head scraching.....and adjusting of my Rod End Bearings I was able to make it work and still keep the Rod End Bearings half way or more engaged. Sure is fun to move the stick and finally see something move...... Thanks again, Kurt ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 13, 2000
Subject: Re: Homecoming Q's
In a message dated 8/13/00 4:47:49 PM Pacific Daylight Time, akroguy(at)hotmail.com writes: << We'll be flying up the California coast from Corona after picking it up from the painter. You guys know of any northern California coastal airports that offer great views and food for us to visit on the way? >> Shelter Cove is a nice place. -GV (RV-6A N1GV) vanremog(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 13, 2000
From: RE Miller <rmill2000(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Homecoming Q's
> Howdy folks, > > Since I've never been to the Aurora/Portland area, > how long a drive is it to > get to the beach? My wife would like to get in some > quiet time while I'm > immersed in RV heaven. ;) Are there any cheap but > clean hotels near the > beach and is the climate conducive to sunning or is > it cool and cloudy most > of the time? Gotta keep my sweetie happy...without > her I wouldn't be flying > an RV! The homecoming will be the first major RV > gathering for my freshly > painted RV8. We'll be flying up the California > coast from Corona after > picking it up from the painter. You guys know of > any northern California > coastal airports that offer great views and food for > us to visit on the way? > > Thanks, > > Brian Denk > RV8 N94BD Hi Brian Half Moon Bay has a nice stroll into town--Barbara's Fish Trap is one of my favorites. Shelter Cove also has a good Seafood restaurant. Rob Miller The statements and opinions are mine and EXACTLY reflect those of my employer. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Sally and George" <aeronut58(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV8 F804H
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Gert: Shouldn't be a problem. Use what you have. George Kilishek RV8 N888GK (reserved) ----- Original Message ----- From: gert <gert(at)execpc.com> Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2000 5:12 PM Subject: RV-List: RV8 F804H > > Hi folks > > Just started working on the spar cary through. > > looking at the F804-H which according to the drawing has a dimension of > 24 21/32. the flat plates which came with the center section and which > are marked F804-H are only 23 31/32 long. > > > Is the missing 22/32 a problem or a dimensional oops on the drawing. > > > Gert > -- > > Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227, > any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address > is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500 > US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms. > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 14, 2000
From: "Bob U." <rv3(at)swbell.net>
Subject: Re: RV3-List: Re:Travelling
> Hi All, > > in an attempt to liven this list up a bit more > I'm just curious as to what sort of touring > you guys have done in your RV 3's? > > Here in Australia theres lotsa things to do but > flying in America seems pretty good after having > a quick look at the map and hearing/ reading a few stories > about what its like over there. > > Bruce Stewart ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I bought my RV-3 in Seattle, Washington and flew it back to Kansas City, Missouri via..... 1. Portland, Oregon and the Columbia River Gorge 2. Twin Falls, Idaho 3. Jackpot, Nevada 4. Wendover Utah (Bonneville Salt Flats) 5. Provo, Utah (Great Salt Lake area) 6. Interstate 80 across Wyoming to Cheyenne 7. Direct to Russell, Kansas via a small corner of Colorado 8. Direct to Grain Valley, Missouri I'd guess this round about route exceeded 2000 miles in a strange plane over some of the toughest country that the USA has to offer. It was the most memorable trip I've ever made since my first x-country in 1954. Bob Urban - N863WL ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bruce Meacham" <bruceme(at)seanet.com>
Subject: Re: RV3-List: Re:Travelling
Date: Aug 13, 2000
I'm going X-Country from Paine Field Everette, WA to Lawrence, MA at the end of the month. 2500nm+ total distance in a week. How's that? Great circle is over Mountana, North Dakota, Nebraska, Wisconsin, Michagan, Toronto and upstate New York. I just added the RMI fuel flow meter to my MicroMonitor. It helps plan fuel stops more accurately en-route. So far it's worked great! I'm still calobrating, so my fuel numbers aren't perfect yet. Soon I'll post my accurate performance numbers as promised. Bruce Meacham ----- Original Message ----- From: Bruce Stewart <bruce@triton-dive.com> Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2000 6:19 PM Subject: RV3-List: Re:Travelling > --> RV3-List message posted by: Bruce Stewart <bruce@triton-dive.com> > > Hi All, > > in an attempt to liven this list up a bit more > I'm just curious as to what sort of touring > you guys have done in your RV 3's? > > Here in Australia theres lotsa things to do but > flying in America seems pretty good after having > a quick look at the map and hearing/ reading a few stories > about what its like over there. > > Bruce Stewart ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 14, 2000
From: "Bob U." <rv3(at)swbell.net>
Subject: Re: RV3-List: Re:Travelling
Bruce Meacham wrote: > > --> RV3-List message posted by: "Bruce Meacham" > > I'm going X-Country from Paine Field Everette, WA to Lawrence, MA at the end > of the month. 2500nm+ total distance in a week. How's that? Great circle > is over Mountana, North Dakota, Nebraska, Wisconsin, Michagan, Toronto and > upstate New York. Hi Gang. IFR, not great circle, was/is my choice over tough/barren country. IFR = I Follow Roads - Interstate my specialty. GPS certainly beckons me to fly great circle routes, but Murphy's Law keeps me thinking... 'WHAT IF'. This is one reason why my 'lil RV is named 'Serendipity'. Going down in the middle of hostile nowhere with just my tennies and tooth- brush would not make for a good day... even with cell phone and ELT aboard. > I just added the RMI fuel flow meter to my MicroMonitor. It helps plan fuel > stops more accurately en-route. So far it's worked great! I'm still > calobrating, so my fuel numbers aren't perfect yet. > Soon I'll post my accurate performance numbers as promised. A MicroMonitor will get into my panel someday, too. Fuel flow can sure add fun, mental comfort and SAFETY of things. As it is, I like to keep an hour reserve. With my RV3 holding only 25 gallons, I figured I might have problems, but it turns out 2 hours is all I care to fly in one sitting. My kidneys do fine, but not these damn old bones. I once had visions of wing + header tank for some super serious non-stop, long X-countries. Not anymore. It's hell getting old, kids. Ya know.... As fast as our RV3's fly, it's good to stop often... Just to see if the folks down below still speak English. Be well, Bob Urban ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 13, 2000
From: Doug Gray <douggray(at)ihug.com.au>
Subject: Re: rear wing spar construction
> << sorry guys. one question, do i drill holes in spar flange strips now or > when > attaching ribs? >> > > Now. Drill the holes in the spar flange strips and spar. When you install > the ribs, back drill through the flange strips and into the ribs. I did the opposite preferring to not assume that the ribs would end up in precisely the position I had drilled. In cases such as this I pilot drilled the rib flange then back drilled through this pilot hole into the spar. So to clarify, I omitted the holes where the ribs would attach during the initial rear spar assembly. Doug Gray, Sydney, Australia, RV6 skinning right wing....... ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV8 Flap Brace Installation - Results
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Gert, Thanks for the info. We have installed both our braces and they don't look to bad. We had better luck with the second one: since we drilled the brace to the skin - then the hinge to the skin - then riveted the three together. I think we'll wait and see how it flys and bow the brace if we need to. Thanks again for the info. Chuck & Dave Rowbotham RV-8A (wings on in 2 weeks) Niantic, CT >From: gert <gert(at)execpc.com> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV-List: RV8 Flap Brace Installation - Results >Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 12:38:28 -0500 > > >I got new flap braces from Van's, took some doing as the first person I >talked to insisted nothing changed > >Finally this person looked in the drawing and told me the angles >changed and i should just re-bent the ones I had (WHAT ???!!!??). > >I told hime the dimensions changed also as there is less lenght between >the 2 bends. > >He finally agreed to send me one new one as the first was allready >installed. I bowed the installed brace slightly and that pulled the skin >back in line. > > >Gert > >Charles Rowbotham wrote: > > > > > > > What was the final word on the flap brace tread from March. > > > > We have the same problem, are getting a small concave bowing of the wing > > skin - due to the inboard buildup of the doublers(proper word). > > > > Was the resolution just to live with it? > > > > Has anyone received an answer from Van's? > > > > Thanks & Good Building, > > > > Chuck & Dave Rowbotham > > RV-8Aqb > > Niantic, CT > > > >-- > >Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227, >any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address >is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500 >US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Subject: Re: Engine Mounts, Barry Mounts , Lord Mounts
Date: Aug 14, 2000
08/14/2000 09:04:16 AM Reposted for Electronic Searching dougweil(at)pressenter.com on 08/12/2000 10:11:30 AM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: RV-List: RV-4 cowling installation > > Are Lord Mounts better than Barry Mounts? Do they permit "sagging" after a > few years or what? (I already bought Barry Mounts). > > Chuck The only reason I used Lord mounts was on the recommendation of a local RV-4 pilot who was having a rather unusual and persistent high frequency vibration in his airplane. It was a 160 hp with a C/S prop. He even talked with the people at Hartzell about it. He finally changed his engine mounts from Barry to Lord and it went away. The Lord mounts have a "gel" filled type of bushing which may absorb vibration better. The down side is they are not cheap!! Doug Weiler ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "EXT-Richard, Emmanuelle J" <Emmanuelle.Richard(at)PSS.Boeing.com>
Subject: Re: Newspaper
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Dealt with the press at several occasions regarding sports and aviation related projects. From my experience: Same experience as previously reported by other listers with "newpaper" type press. I won't talk to them at all unless you personnally know the journalist or you are trying to promote a personal project, get some coverage for sponsors or free advertising. If you decide to do it. Write the article for them, give them the technical information (not too tech), the numbers etc so they dont get it wrong. Remember they will be very flattering and agreeable to anything until they get the material they are seeking. Don't assume they will keep the promises they make. After they have left your hangar, you have no control over the information anymore, it might be even difficult to get a hold of them. Watch what you say: especially if you are talking with somebody who does not have a clue about aviation, if you don't want to see it come up in the article, don't even mention/imply it. Don't say anything negative or that can be interpreted in the wrong way, that's what they will remember. Don't answer the question they ask you, use it as an opportunity to talk about what you want to convey. Their job is to sell newspapers, not to promote aviation - they will talk about what sells. Writers specialized in the field you are dealing with do usually a pretty decent job as they have some understanding of the subject and their audience is different. Still, doing the work for them is a good way to get a decent outcome. Good luck ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Subject: Re: Van's Alternator
>I have 17 hours on my 8A and all is going well. Today, my alternator stopped >working. My amp meter showed several wild fluctuations & then started to They sent me one with the wrong core. Tried to fit it to the engine but no luck. It was a whole inch out of alignment. Looks like they need to find a new supplier for alternators. Ether that or develop some kind of simple acceptance test to weed out the boogers. - Jim RV8A ( engine stuff ) N89JA (reserved) ________________________________________________________________________________ Thread-Topic: RV-List: Van's Alternator Thread-Index: AcAGAK5UNrPt+1hDSMWn5qFhz6IVzAAABRqQ
From: "Bob Japundza" <Bob.Japundza(at)realmed.com>
Subject: Van's Alternator
Date: Aug 14, 2000
When I was installing my Van's alternator, I had it on the edge of the workbench and mysteriously it found its way to the concrete floor, putting a nice crack in it. Rather than getting another one from Van's, I ventured down to the local autoparts store (Advance Auto Parts) with my ailing alternator in tow and asked the person at the counter for a replacement. Long story short (the usual "its outta a what? Did you say an airplane?"), he ran the numbers stamped on the alternator and found that it was from an 81 Honda. He could have a rebuilt one to me in a day. Cost was $45. I came back the next day, exchanged for the new one, opened the box, and was pleasantly surprised. The quality of the rebuild was MUCH better than what Van's sells. The replacement alternator came with a sheet of detailed test data/graphs showing various voltages and currents at different alternator RPM's, along with some care and feeding info. I did have to swap pulleys and remove the fan. It puts out 40 amps. I'll dig up the paperwork tonight to find out who the remanufacturer is and their part number and post it to the list. So far my alternator is working well, without any additional cooling. Bob Japundza RV-6 N244BJ 180-CS 13.5 hours -----Original Message----- From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com [mailto:Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com] Sent: Monday, August 14, 2000 9:17 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Van's Alternator >I have 17 hours on my 8A and all is going well. Today, my alternator stopped >working. My amp meter showed several wild fluctuations & then started to They sent me one with the wrong core. Tried to fit it to the engine but no luck. It was a whole inch out of alignment. Looks like they need to find a new supplier for alternators. Ether that or develop some kind of simple acceptance test to weed out the boogers. - Jim RV8A ( engine stuff ) N89JA (reserved) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John" <fasching(at)amigo.net>
Subject: Van's Alternators
Date: Aug 14, 2000
I have had good service from Mark Landall in Oklahoma City (or thereabouts) with his alternator..no problems in over 5-years...did have a solid-state regulator burn up, and he mailed me a replacement the same day I called, and sent it only on my promise to mail him a check... He has an ad in Sport Aviation each month... FWIW RV6A Flying Salida, CO ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV8DRIVER(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Subject: Re: Fold-up motor scooter
I briefly tried the DiBlasi scooter at his hanger at LNA, and true to first impressions, its pretty squirelley handling-wise. As an long time mo'sicle rider, I personally would not ride it much farther than I can walk. I guess you could get used to it, but not for what he wants for it as far as I'm concerned. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Subject: Re: Van's Alternators
Date: Aug 14, 2000
08/14/2000 01:42:06 PM I can second Mark Landrol's systems. He also has a light-weight Aluimum pulley that spins the alternator a little slower too. He also has a Toyota (or Datsun) starter that I am using on my Lycoming. I know many of these starters in the field & mine has been running for over 6 years. It is also lightweight and many hundreds of dollars cheaper then the other brands. I purchased a junk starter from the junk yard (for 4 dollars) that was the same make & model of the new one I got from Mark. (I wanted spare parts and probably had nothing better to do that Saturday). I took the junk starter apart & was very impressed with the pin bearings & overall qualitity of the unit. (Didn't want to take my new one apart) "John" (at)matronics.com on 08/14/2000 12:47:56 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com cc: Subject: RV-List: Van's Alternators I have had good service from Mark Landall in Oklahoma City (or thereabouts) with his alternator..no problems in over 5-years...did have a solid-state regulator burn up, and he mailed me a replacement the same day I called, and sent it only on my promise to mail him a check... He has an ad in Sport Aviation each month... FWIW RV6A Flying Salida, CO ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JusCash(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Subject: Re: Tailwheel endorsement - really required?
I thought this issue had been resolved. The exceptions in (k) do apply. It clearly states in (k) Exceptions. (2) The rating limitations of this section do not apply to-- (iii) The holder of a pilot certificate when operating an aircraft under the authority of an experimental or provisional aircraft type certificate; Now lets get back to building. Cash Copeland RV-6 N46FC (Reserved) Oakland, Ca In a message dated 8/14/00 1:40:24 PM Central Daylight Time, bj034(at)lafn.org writes: << Although this does not apply to me (30 plus years in tailwheels), my new operating limitations (1 day old) state: "The pilot in command of this aircraft SHALL hold a category/class rating, or an authorized instructor's logbook endorsement. The pilot in command MUST meet the requirements of 61.31 (e), (f), (g), (h), (i), and (j) as appropriate." (emphasis added) This tells me that the restrictions in (i) DO pertain to my aircraft and the exceptions in (k) do not apply. I think this is pretty clear and not open to interpretation. Dave Bristol RV-6 and pilot ready to fly, prop governor not glenn williams wrote: >> ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pichon.dean(at)ADLittle.com
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Subject: Attachment of cowl cheeks
I'm getting ready to install the cheek pieces on my -4 and would appreciate recommendations on whether or not to use an adhesive in addition to rivets. Also, if I use Pro-Seal, do any Listers have experience with its ability to take paint? Thanks in advance for the help. Dean Pichon Arlington, MA **** This message is from Arthur D. Little, Inc., and/or one of Arthur D. Little's subsidiaries or affiliates and may contain confidential business information. It is intended for the addressee only and may not be copied without our permission. If you are not the intended recipient please contact the sender as soon as possible.**** ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Subject: Wire mounting in FWF
Can someone tell me if you need to use a special type of tywrap ( high temperature ) to secure wires when organizing the mass of sensor wires fire wall forward? I currently use the "black" UV protected tywraps everywhere else on the plane. Thanks, Jim Andrews RV-8A ( engine stuff ) 180 HP ( O-360 ) Fixed pitch Sensenich (85) Austin, Texas N89JA (reserved) blood type A- mothers maiden name "Roach" member in good standing of the "Book of the month club" ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gardner, Douglas (GA01)" <douglas.gardner(at)honeywell.com>
Subject: Lycoming Service School
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Anyone been to the Lycoming engine service school ?? It's 4 days in Williamsport Pa. I'm ready to order my new 0-360 from Van's for my -8A and thought this training would be invaluable. Any comments ?? Thanks, Doug Gardner -8A 80717 Painting interior Palm Harbor Fla ________________________________________________________________________________
From: clayfly(at)libertybay.com.Mon,
(EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id" <B0004967128@mail-2.lbay.net>; Mon, 14 Aug 2000 14:57:39.-0700(at)matronics.com
Subject: Attachment of cowl cheeks
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Well Dean, I'll give you my 2-cents worth. Unless you are 100% absolutely sure those cowl cheeks will never ever need to come off --- I would just rivet them. It doesn't take many rivets to attach those cheeks. I have learned to delay final assembly of items as long as possible. The cheeks were a case in point. After the cheeks were positioned with clekos and the cowling was fitted, I decided to attach the cheeks with a few screws & nutplates. To make a long story short, I remove my cheeks to pull my cowling hinge pins. I also have my adjustable voltage regulator behind one of the cheeks. Anyway, I recommend you just put a few rivets in there --- your cheeks won't pucker. Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, waiting for an inspector Indiana > > I'm getting ready to install the cheek pieces on my -4 and would appreciate > recommendations on whether or not to use an adhesive in addition to rivets. > Also, if I use Pro-Seal, do any Listers have experience with its ability to take > paint? > > Thanks in advance for the help. > > Dean Pichon > Arlington, MA > > **** This message is from Arthur D. Little, Inc., and/or one of > Arthur D. Little's subsidiaries or affiliates and may contain > confidential business information. It is intended for the addressee > only and may not be copied without our permission. If you are not > the intended recipient please contact the sender as soon as possible.**** > > > _- =========================================================== > _- =========================================================== > _- =========================================================== > _- =========================================================== > > >** --------- End Original Message ----------- ** > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Troy Whistman <TroyW(at)digitalmd.com>
Subject: Lycoming Service School
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Never heard of it, but it sounds like it would be worthwhile... do you have a link to a web page describing the course and its cost? Troy Whistman -----Original Message----- From: Gardner, Douglas (GA01) [mailto:douglas.gardner(at)honeywell.com] Sent: Monday, August 14, 2000 3:59 PM Subject: RV-List: Lycoming Service School Anyone been to the Lycoming engine service school ?? It's 4 days in Williamsport Pa. I'm ready to order my new 0-360 from Van's for my -8A and thought this training would be invaluable. Any comments ?? Thanks, Doug Gardner -8A 80717 Painting interior Palm Harbor Fla ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gordon or Marge Comfort" <gcomfo(at)tc3net.com>
Subject: Re: Van's Alternator
Date: Aug 14, 2000
-From: Bob Japundza <Bob.Japundza(at)realmed.com> Subject: RE: RV-List: Van's Alternator I did have to swap pulleys and remove the >fan. > >Bob Japundza >RV-6 N244BJ 180-CS 13.5 hours Bob: Why did you remove the fan? Gordon Comfort RV-4 N363GC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)accessus.net>
Subject: Re: Lycoming Service School
Date: Aug 14, 2000
There is an article by Vicki Kruse in Aug 2000 Private pilot on the school. Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact! (Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gardner, Douglas (GA01)" <douglas.gardner(at)honeywell.com> Sent: Monday, August 14, 2000 3:58 PM Subject: RV-List: Lycoming Service School > > Anyone been to the Lycoming engine service school ?? It's 4 days in > Williamsport Pa. I'm ready to order my new 0-360 from Van's for my -8A and > thought this training would be invaluable. Any comments ?? > > Thanks, > Doug Gardner -8A 80717 > Painting interior > Palm Harbor Fla > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 14, 2000
From: bramsec <bramsec(at)idirect.com>
Subject: Vacuum Gyros
What is the difference between an Artificial Horizon set up for 8 degree panel ? AHI's still work if the aircraft is climbing or diving (more than 8 degrees), if the AHI has an adjustable "little aeroplane"(zero pitch adjust knob) shouldn't this be adequate? Also is there any cheap commercial product that can regulate the vaccum to the required two inches or so? Regards Peter (Toronto Canada) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "The Stribling's" <bbattery(at)bendcable.com>
Subject: Re: Starters
Date: Aug 14, 2000
> > > I can second Mark Landrol's systems. He also has a light-weight Aluimum > pulley that spins the alternator a little slower too. He also has a Toyota > (or Datsun) starter that I am using on my Lycoming. I know many of these > starters in the field & mine has been running for over 6 years. It is also > lightweight and many hundreds of dollars cheaper then the other brands. I > purchased a junk starter from the junk yard (for 4 dollars) that was the > same make & model of the new one I got from Mark. (I wanted spare parts and > Just bought a 160 lycoming with out a starter do you know what kind of starter or the numbers on case so I can save a buck or two for seats Thanks Ken S. waiting for finishing kit 6-A ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 14, 2000
From: Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com>
Subject: Re: Vacuum Gyros
bramsec wrote: > > > What is the difference between an Artificial Horizon set up for 8 degree > panel ? > > AHI's still work if the aircraft is climbing or diving (more than 8 > degrees), if the AHI has an adjustable "little aeroplane"(zero pitch > adjust knob) shouldn't this be adequate? > > Also is there any cheap commercial product that can regulate the vaccum > to the required two inches or so? > > Regards Peter (Toronto Canada) > Peter I don't have the tilt built into my AH. It still works fine but I have to have the adjustment all the way to the top to get the horizion lined up with the "little airplane" in level flight. Jerry ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4Brown(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Subject: Re: Bart aerosport eng.
Aero Sport Power 2965 Airport Drive Kamloops, B.C V2B 7W8 phone (250) 376-2955 fax (250) 376-1995 They also have a web page Tom Brown RV4 flying with a Bart LaBlonde ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4Brown(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Subject: Re: Vacuum Gyros
Hi Peter, I didn't get the 8 degree tilt in my attitude indictor on my RV4 (yet). The A/I works just fine except the segment that indicates the horizontal attitude is about 3/8" higher than the markings in the surrounding casing that indicate a horizontal position in normal flight. (Tough to describe) If the airplane wasn't adjusted upward and I didn't know better, one would think I was in a serious climb. The airplane can be adjusted up to meet the horizon. In my opinion, it functions OK but looks stupid. Everytime I look at it I think "Hey idiot, why didn't you buy one with the 8 degree tilt?" The price for ignorance can be high! Someday, I will remove it and take it to a shop to be modified. Before I do that, I will make sure 8 degrees is the right number. Tom Brown - RV4 flying ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Subject: dimpled platenuts
i am looking for dimpled or countersunk platenuts. i tried wicks, avery, vans, and many of the tool suppliers. does anyone know of WHERE i can locate. thanx, bob in arkansas ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 14, 2000
From: Fred Kunkel <rvator(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: dimpled platenuts
Bob, pls. contact me off-list. I have a large number of different dimpled nutplates. Depends on which ones you're looking for. Blue Skies! Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > i am looking for dimpled or countersunk platenuts. i tried wicks, avery, > vans, and many of the tool suppliers. does anyone know of WHERE i can locate. > thanx, bob in arkansas > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Chuck Rabaut" <crabaut(at)coalinga.com>
Subject: Re: Homecoming Q's
Date: Aug 14, 2000
Brian, Fly into "Oceano", good food, great view, and it's on the way... Chuck ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Wire mounting in FWF
Date: Aug 14, 2000
> Can someone tell me if you need to use a special type of tywrap ( high > temperature ) to secure wires when organizing the mass of sensor wires fire wall > forward? > > I currently use the "black" UV protected tywraps everywhere else on the plane. I Pulled this out of the archives (Bob Nuckolls, July 00): The white guys are subject to ultra-violet degredation . . . they also don't take kindly to hyro-carbon and ozone exposure both of which are found in fair quantity under the cowl. Ty-wraps treated for better resistance to environmental stresses are always colored . . . most of the ones I've seen are either dark green or black. However, it's possible to make a ty-wrap from funky plastic of ANY color. When you buy them new in original manufacturer's packaging, it will state on the lable whether or not the critter is resistant to UV and/or chemical attack. My personal preference under the cowl is MS21919DGxx clamps and/or Dacron flat-lace (string) . . . I've seen both of these products work well for decades under the cowl. I would add that there are high-temp tie wraps, which are aqua in color. I got some of these from AAMR/Air Core (John Caldwell) but unfortunately he's gone out of business. I'm sure they're overkill plus they cost almost a buck a piece (!). Just FYI. Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~125 hrs) Portland, OR http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 15, 2000
From: Larry Bowen <lcbowen(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: dimpled platenuts
> > i am looking for dimpled or countersunk platenuts. i tried wicks, avery, > vans, and many of the tool suppliers. does anyone know of WHERE i can locate. > > thanx, bob in arkansas > Below is a 1/25/2000 order of mine from Wicks. Their web search thingy doesn't pick up on the part numbers. Don't know if that's because they don't carry them any more or because their search engine stinks. Maybe if you call them with this info...... Product ID Product Name Price Quantity Total MS21047-L08K MS21047-L08K $0.23 25 $5.75 MS21049-L08K MS21049-L08K $0.27 50 $13.50 Tax NC $0.00 Shipping Later Charge $0.00 Total $19.25 ==== Larry Bowen Larry(at)BowenAero.com http://BowenAero.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 15, 2000
From: Charlie Kuss <chaskuss(at)miami.gdi.net>
Subject: Re: dimpled platenuts
Bob, I've purchased them from Wicks. They are a special order item from them. (They have to order them in) It took about 2 weeks to get them from Wicks. SkyBolt in Florida also carries them. See Gary Van Remortal's "Yeller Pages" for their address & phone number. Charlie Kuss > > i am looking for dimpled or countersunk platenuts. i tried wicks, avery, > vans, and many of the tool suppliers. does anyone know of WHERE i can locate. > thanx, bob in arkansas ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rv8don(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Century I wing-leveler gyro pinout
Don, I found the info on th Century page to be just what I needed. Thanks! -Don RV8 NJ In a message dated 8/11/00 12:31:50 PM Eastern Daylight Time, dons6a(at)juno.com writes: << When you get to Centtry look for diagrams, them 69D875-2 for Century I. Hope my rambling helped. >> ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jim Bower" <rvbuilder(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: dimpled platenuts
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Try calling Wick's 800 number. I have found them VERY helpful. Jim Bower St. Louis, MO RV-6A N143DJ >From: Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RV-List: dimpled platenuts >Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2000 23:22:25 EDT > > >i am looking for dimpled or countersunk platenuts. i tried wicks, avery, >vans, and many of the tool suppliers. does anyone know of WHERE i can >locate. >thanx, bob in arkansas > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Subject: Re: Starters
Date: Aug 15, 2000
08/15/2000 09:01:00 AM I think your problem will be the mount casting or weldment...depending on which mount you buy. The Starter is a Datsun 810 starter for Mark Landrols unit & I think the Toyota starter is used in the Aircraft Spruce mount. Getting the starter is not the issue its the mount. I am using Mark Landrols weldment version and am happy with it. Contact Mark from the Ad in the back og EAA Sport Aviation Mag. ( I met him I got my pulley & starter asembly from him at Oshgosh). Likewise investigate Spruces casting........let me know what you end up doing. bbattery(at)bendcable.com on 08/14/2000 09:42:38 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: RV-List: Starters > > > I can second Mark Landrol's systems. He also has a light-weight Aluimum > pulley that spins the alternator a little slower too. He also has a Toyota > (or Datsun) starter that I am using on my Lycoming. I know many of these > starters in the field & mine has been running for over 6 years. It is also > lightweight and many hundreds of dollars cheaper then the other brands. I > purchased a junk starter from the junk yard (for 4 dollars) that was the > same make & model of the new one I got from Mark. (I wanted spare parts and > Just bought a 160 lycoming with out a starter do you know what kind of starter or the numbers on case so I can save a buck or two for seats Thanks Ken S. waiting for finishing kit 6-A ________________________________________________________________________________
From: GRENIER(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Lycoming Service School
I took the training a couple of years ago and enjoyed it a great deal. It is a great help to someone who has little experience with the insides of an engine -- goes into each system in some detail and provides a complete overview of the entire product line. Included in he cost is a complete set of service bulletins and a great deal of other relevant and useful material. The also have a follow on course that I understand is now available to graduates that provides actual hands on experience breaking down and building up an engine. I feel it was worth the money and time. Ray Grenier RV-4 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: dimpled platenuts
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Aircraft Supply Co in Dallas... 214-637-3598 Aviation fasteners - you name 'em they got 'em... Ralph Capen ________________________________________________________________________________ Thread-Topic: RV-List: Van's Alternator Thread-Index: AcAGTvcam3YmunQxSqGNrVzblpYGgAAcLN/w
From: "Bob Japundza" <Bob.Japundza(at)realmed.com>
Subject: Van's Alternator
Date: Aug 15, 2000
I removed the fan because it turns in the wrong direction when mounted on an aircraft. On cars it rotates to the left. Van's alternator also has the fan removed. Bob Japundza RV-6 N244BJ O-360CS 15.1 hours Bob: Why did you remove the fan? Gordon Comfort RV-4 N363GC ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bruce Meacham" <bruceme(at)seanet.com>
Subject: Electronic Ignition Choice
Date: Aug 15, 2000
There are currently three choices for electronic ignition: Lasar http://www.unisonindustries.com Lightspeed http://www.lsecorp.com ElectroAir http://www.fly-gbi.com/eis.htm The primary differences that I can tell are in the level of redundancy and the timing mechanism. Can anyone discuss the pros and cons of these systems? Why did you choose the system you have (if you have)? Bruce Meacham ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ed Bundy" <ebundy(at)micron.net>
Subject: Re: Lycoming Service School
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Another similar idea is to buy Mattituck's engine rebuilding video. While it certainly isn't as in-depth as Lycoming's school, I found it invaluable to see what was going on inside the case. It has some general rebuilding info, and takes some of the "magic" out of what's inside that amazingly expensive hunk of metal. For around $25 I feel it's a great investment. I would like to go to Lycoming's school, but felt the cost was a little overdone. Ed Bundy - Eagle, ID RV6A, 0320-D1a (160hp) Sensenich 70x78, N427EM, 350+hrs. ebundy(at)micron.net > I took the training a couple of years ago and enjoyed it a great deal. It is > a great help to someone who has little experience with the insides of an > engine -- goes into each system in some detail and provides a complete ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pichon.dean(at)ADLittle.com
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Electronic Ignition Choice
I chose the Lasar ignition because it is a certified system and is available as factory-installed equipment. In case something goes awry, I want to be able to work with a single supplier (Lycoming) to limit finger-pointing. Also, I am concerned that an "un-certified" system might increase the number of flight hours required before sign-off and limit the engine's resale value since it would probably be labeled "for experimental use only". Having said all that, I will add the caveat that I have not yet flown the aircraft (-4). I hope to be ready for taxi tests by the end of the year... Dean Pichon Arlington, MA "Bruce Meacham" on 08/15/2000 10:35:43 AM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com To: rv-list(at)matronics.com cc: (bcc: Dean Pichon/ADLittle) Subject: RV-List: Electronic Ignition Choice There are currently three choices for electronic ignition: Lasar http://www.unisonindustries.com Lightspeed http://www.lsecorp.com ElectroAir http://www.fly-gbi.com/eis.htm The primary differences that I can tell are in the level of redundancy and the timing mechanism. Can anyone discuss the pros and cons of these systems? Why did you choose the system you have (if you have)? Bruce Meacham ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com>
Subject: Lycoming Service School
Date: Aug 15, 2000
George Orndorff also sells a good video on the tear down and assembly of a Lycoming. It's inexpensive, and a good visual tool. I bought a copy to use as an EAA Chapter Program. Ed Cole RV6A Forever Finishing > -----Original Message----- > From: Ed Bundy [SMTP:ebundy(at)micron.net] > Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2000 7:47 AM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Lycoming Service School > > > Another similar idea is to buy Mattituck's engine rebuilding video. While > it certainly isn't as in-depth as Lycoming's school, I found it invaluable > to see what was going on inside the case. It has some general rebuilding > info, and takes some of the "magic" out of what's inside that amazingly > expensive hunk of metal. For around $25 I feel it's a great investment. > > I would like to go to Lycoming's school, but felt the cost was a little > overdone. > > Ed Bundy - Eagle, ID > RV6A, 0320-D1a (160hp) > Sensenich 70x78, N427EM, 350+hrs. > ebundy(at)micron.net > > > I took the training a couple of years ago and enjoyed it a great deal. > It > is > > a great help to someone who has little experience with the insides of an > > engine -- goes into each system in some detail and provides a complete > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: RV4Brown(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Electronic Ignition Choice
Hi Bruce, I made my choice several years ago and without taking a lot of time to really evaluate the other systems available. My reasoning for choosing a Lasar system was as follows: - It was recommended by the firm assembling my engine. They installed it, set it up and gave me a good price on the system at the time. - The system was certified at the time. To me that meant that it had gone through at least some formal testing protocol and was qualified to some standard. I admit I don't know exactly what those tests and standards consisted of. - I felt Unison had been in business for some time and would be there for parts and service when the system broke down. In today's business world there are some excellent products that have a short life due to the parent company closing its doors. - I liked the concept that the Lasar system was a third redundant ignition system. When it fails or turns off, the system defaults to the old dual mag system that has worked reliably for decades. You don't have to remove one mag to install the lasar system. - The Lasar system as I understand it is a little more conservative in its performance and spark advance than some of the other alternatives. The earlier Lasar systems, mine included are dealing with some software and hardware modifications. The people on the list that commented about he Lasar seems to be satisfied with Unison's response to the concerns and operations difficulties. I have 32 hours time on my unit which was produced three years ago. The unit turns itself on and off at random apparently due to a relay built inside the mags on the earlier systems. There is also a software glitch that can turn the off indicator light on without turning the Lasar ignition system off. IMO the product is professionally constructed for aircraft usage. The later versions of the documentation and systems have been improved. According to the testing and literature from Unison, most of the real benefit to the system occur during startup and at altitudes above 6000 feet. I can't really answer the question as to whether I would bother to put electronic ignition on again or not. I haven't really had the opportunity to explore the performance at altitude yet and my system hasn't operated on a consistent basis. If I was on a tighter budget and endurance or performance wasn't a high priority, I would probably leave it off. Now, if some of the other systems are reliable and can be purchased at near the cost of an equivalent mag system, there is no doubt that I would put one on. Hope this is helpful. Tom Brown RV4 flying RV4Brown(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Lycoming Service School
Date: Aug 15, 2000
ALRIGHT ALREADY! Geeze, all this talk about how much it costs and not a single one of you has stated how MUCH that is. I'm going to die or curiousity here..... meow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ed Bundy" <ebundy(at)micron.net> Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2000 10:46 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Lycoming Service School > > Another similar idea is to buy Mattituck's engine rebuilding video. While > it certainly isn't as in-depth as Lycoming's school, I found it invaluable > to see what was going on inside the case. It has some general rebuilding > info, and takes some of the "magic" out of what's inside that amazingly > expensive hunk of metal. For around $25 I feel it's a great investment. > > I would like to go to Lycoming's school, but felt the cost was a little > overdone. > > Ed Bundy - Eagle, ID > RV6A, 0320-D1a (160hp) > Sensenich 70x78, N427EM, 350+hrs. > ebundy(at)micron.net > > > I took the training a couple of years ago and enjoyed it a great deal. It > is > > a great help to someone who has little experience with the insides of an > > engine -- goes into each system in some detail and provides a complete > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy J. Pflanzer" <rpflanze(at)iquest.net>
Subject: Re: Electronic Ignition Choice
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Well Bruce, that sound you hear through the speakers of your PC is a big, fat can of worms being opened. Many will debate the pro's and con's of each system. My reasons for selecting the LASAR system were simple. I wanted a certified system that my FBO would work on and I felt more comfortable dealing with Unison, who I believe will be around as long as my RV-6 is. I admit that I didn't give much consideration to the other systems. I'll state the biggest con right now and that's cost. This system is not likely to cost justify itself in the next 10 years, but that's not why I have it. I can't cost justify my DIGITAL transponder either. I made the choice that for me, the extra money was worth the certification, field service availability, and company reputation to stand behind the product. That's not to imply that the others won't do the same. I just felt that Unison was a better bet for me. The LASAR system works very well and the fuel economy, engine smoothness, and easy starting have been as advertised. When my engine is warm, I can idle at 400 RPM and it's as smooth as a sewing machine. I like the idea of the magneto redundancy and the fact that my FBO will work on it. In addition, the Unison folks have been responsive to a problem I had and they shipped me out two new magnetos free of charge with a loaner timing light. I have no doubt that they are committed to their product. From what I've seen on the List over the years, I think the other systems are good systems too. I think it's just a matter of balancing the $$$ with the other factors. Randy Pflanzer N417G RV-6 (43 hours) > The primary differences that I can tell are in the level of redundancy and > the timing mechanism. > > Can anyone discuss the pros and cons of these systems? Why did you choose > the system you have (if you have)? > > Bruce Meacham ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Static system
Date: Aug 15, 2000
> > >I have the poly flow installed from Van's for the static system. >Trying to decide what to use behind the panel. I have figured the poly >flow with the nylon fittings & the AN fittings with 3/16 alumimun tubing. >Just can't decide. Could someone help with what they went with & weather >they were happy or not.?? > > >Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com Don, I used polyflow tubing all the way to the instruments. I used plastic tubing fittings from Parker Fitting. I also converted the pitot tubing from the kit supplied aluminum to plastic via a metal to plastic coupler that Parker also sells. Routing the plastic up through the cockpit and behind the panel is made very simple with the plastic tubing. Brian Denk RV8 N94BD ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "John" <fasching(at)amigo.net>
Subject: Electronic Ignition Choice
Date: Aug 15, 2000
I would not argue with anyone's decision on this....you pays your money, and takes your choice, as they say, BUT I attended a presentation on the Lasar system...looked good, but you have the disadvantages of two magnetos to service/repair/replace, plus the electronics...more stuff, more to go wrong. Also Unison said the ONLY reason they have the regular mags is because it was the only way the FAA would give them an STC for the system. But for the FAA they would have left the mags out of the system. I choice the Lightspeed unit, replaced only the right mag....simple, far less expensive than the Lasar, and less machinery to go wrong. The single electronic unit makes starting really quick, and when the left mag is shut off, there is absolutely NO drop in engine RPM. Installation is REALLY simple, you pull the mag, put the drive gear from the mag on the electronic unit, loosely bolt it on, turn it till a light on the back of the unit comes one, (engine with nr1 cylinder at TDC) and tighten it down. That's it! Also one other reason I chose the Lightspeed unit was its maker, Claus Saviur (Spelling) - I listened to one of his presentations, and I think the guy is a near genius...very impressive. But like women, airplanes, TV shows, etc, do what you like.... RV6A Flying, Salida, CO ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Electronic Ignition Choice
One of the units (not the LASAR system) dos not have sensors to determine detonation margin. They claimed spark advance but I was unable to assertion the level of cut-off or their method of determination of engine operating parameters to ensure there was no detonation occurring........ rpflanze(at)iquest.net on 08/15/2000 02:13:49 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: RV-List: Electronic Ignition Choice Well Bruce, that sound you hear through the speakers of your PC is a big, fat can of worms being opened. Many will debate the pro's and con's of each system. My reasons for selecting the LASAR system were simple. I wanted a certified system that my FBO would work on and I felt more comfortable dealing with Unison, who I believe will be around as long as my RV-6 is. I admit that I didn't give much consideration to the other systems. I'll state the biggest con right now and that's cost. This system is not likely to cost justify itself in the next 10 years, but that's not why I have it. I can't cost justify my DIGITAL transponder either. I made the choice that for me, the extra money was worth the certification, field service availability, and company reputation to stand behind the product. That's not to imply that the others won't do the same. I just felt that Unison was a better bet for me. The LASAR system works very well and the fuel economy, engine smoothness, and easy starting have been as advertised. When my engine is warm, I can idle at 400 RPM and it's as smooth as a sewing machine. I like the idea of the magneto redundancy and the fact that my FBO will work on it. In addition, the Unison folks have been responsive to a problem I had and they shipped me out two new magnetos free of charge with a loaner timing light. I have no doubt that they are committed to their product. From what I've seen on the List over the years, I think the other systems are good systems too. I think it's just a matter of balancing the $$$ with the other factors. Randy Pflanzer N417G RV-6 (43 hours) > The primary differences that I can tell are in the level of redundancy and > the timing mechanism. > > Can anyone discuss the pros and cons of these systems? Why did you choose > the system you have (if you have)? > > Bruce Meacham ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Static system
Date: Aug 15, 2000
-----Original Message----- From: Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> Date: Tuesday, August 15, 2000 12:01 PM Subject: RV-List: Static system > >I have the poly flow installed from Van's for the static system. >Trying to decide what to use behind the panel. I have figured the poly >flow with the nylon fittings & the AN fittings with 3/16 alumimun tubing. >Just can't decide. Could someone help with what they went with & weather >they were happy or not.?? > > >Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com >********************************************** I used 1/8 ID Ace hardware rubber fuel line and Ace brass and plastic tees and barb fittings. Then I plumbed a accessible test point for system certification, which is plugged with a 5/32 rivet stem. I have 18-inch service loops on the static and vacuum lines so I can pull the panel sections out and work on them without crawling under the panel. I tested the static system by sealing off the static ports with plastic sheet discs held by electrical tape. Next, I gently sucked on the test line, keeping IAS in the green, until I reached 2000 feet and 145 KIAS, whereupon I clamped it off. After 45 minutes the altitude was 1980 feet, and the system continued to lose altitude at a rate of 0.48 feet per minute for the next 1035 minutes. Part of the altitude loss was due to temperature change during the test. The system is leak tight! I used Century rebuilt gyros and VSI, ASI and altimeter from Van's (United). I am familiar with the arguments against using rubber in the gyro lines due to particulate matter failure and therefore I ran the vacuum lines with Ace vinyl tubing. It will not collapse at 5.2 inches differential pressure at temperatures below 150 F. Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP Hampshire, IL C38 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Static system
Date: Aug 15, 2000
-----Original Message----- From: Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> Date: Tuesday, August 15, 2000 12:01 PM Subject: RV-List: Static system > >I have the poly flow installed from Van's for the static system. >Trying to decide what to use behind the panel. I have figured the poly >flow with the nylon fittings & the AN fittings with 3/16 alumimun tubing. >Just can't decide. Could someone help with what they went with & weather >they were happy or not.?? > > >Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com >********************************************** I used 1/8 ID Ace hardware rubber fuel line and Ace brass and plastic tees and barb fittings. Then I plumbed a accessible test point for system certification, which is plugged with a 5/32 rivet stem. I have 18-inch service loops on the static and vacuum lines so I can pull the panel sections out and work on them without crawling under the panel. I tested the static system by sealing off the static ports with plastic sheet discs held by electrical tape. Next, I gently sucked on the test line, keeping IAS in the green, until I reached 2000 feet and 145 KIAS, whereupon I clamped it off. After 45 minutes the altitude was 1980 feet, and the system continued to lose altitude at a rate of 0.48 feet per minute for the next 1035 minutes. Part of the altitude loss was due to temperature change during the test. The system is leak tight! I used Century rebuilt gyros and VSI, ASI and altimeter from Van's (United). I am familiar with the arguments against using rubber in the gyro lines due to particulate matter failure and therefore I ran the vacuum lines with Ace vinyl tubing. It will not collapse at 5.2 inches differential pressure at temperatures below 150 F. Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP Hampshire, IL C38 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Wire mounting in FWF
>I Pulled this out of the archives (Bob Nuckolls, July 00): > The white guys are subject to ultra-violet degredation . . . > they also don't take kindly to hyro-carbon and ozone exposure > both of which are found in fair quantity under the cowl. Randall and all, Thanks, I also found this in the archives. Unfortunately this is only one mans opinion. I was hoping I could hear from folks that have used tywraps ( black or whatever ) FWF who are flying and have had some experience with how well they hold up under general use. Thanks, - Jim RV-8AQ ( 81102 ) FWF O-360 N89JA (reserved) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Static system
Date: Aug 15, 2000
-----Original Message----- From: Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> Date: Tuesday, August 15, 2000 12:01 PM Subject: RV-List: Static system > >I have the poly flow installed from Van's for the static system. >Trying to decide what to use behind the panel. I have figured the poly >flow with the nylon fittings & the AN fittings with 3/16 alumimun tubing. >Just can't decide. Could someone help with what they went with & weather >they were happy or not.?? > > >Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com >********************************************** I used 1/8 ID Ace hardware rubber fuel line and Ace brass and plastic tees and barb fittings. Then I plumbed a accessible test point for system certification, which is plugged with a 5/32 rivet stem. I have 18-inch service loops on the static and vacuum lines so I can pull the panel sections out and work on them without crawling under the panel. I tested the static system by sealing off the static ports with plastic sheet discs held by electrical tape. Next, I gently sucked on the test line, keeping IAS in the green, until I reached 2000 feet and 145 KIAS, whereupon I clamped it off. After 45 minutes the altitude was 1980 feet, and the system continued to lose altitude at a rate of 0.48 feet per minute for the next 1035 minutes. Part of the altitude loss was due to temperature change during the test. The system is leak tight! I used Century rebuilt gyros and VSI, ASI and altimeter from Van's (United). I am familiar with the arguments against using rubber in the gyro lines due to particulate matter failure and therefore I ran the vacuum lines with Ace vinyl tubing. It will not collapse at 5.2 inches differential pressure at temperatures below 150 F. Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP Hampshire, IL C38 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Van's Alternator
I'm in the process of mounting my replacement Van's alternator and I find that no matter what I do, my pulley is out of alignment by about an eighth of an inch in the aft direction. Also the adjustment arm rests behind the alternator not in front as I would expect. Is this typical? Thanks, - Jim RV-8AQ ( 81102 ) FWF ( O-360 ) N89JA ( reserved ) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Wire mounting in FWF
Date: Aug 15, 2000
I have found over the years that what Bob Nuckols stated was, and is, correct. Before I become a Fed I turned wrenches and fly for several years. Every year when it came time to do an Annual I would dig out a handful of tie wraps knowing I would have to replace many....and it was almost always the clear/opaque ones. Yes the black/colored ones to get brittle and crack but not nearly as fast as the clear ones. Actually the best method is to use the wire bundle lace cord. It also has the added benefit of not having those sharp little edges from the cut-off ends. But it is rather time consuming to do that so I must admit that I also use the tie-wraps. Mike Robertson "Das Fed" RV-8A >From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV-List: Wire mounting in FWF >Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000 13:55:05 -0500 > > > >I Pulled this out of the archives (Bob Nuckolls, July 00): > > > The white guys are subject to ultra-violet degredation . . . > > they also don't take kindly to hyro-carbon and ozone exposure > > both of which are found in fair quantity under the cowl. > > >Randall and all, > >Thanks, I also found this in the archives. Unfortunately this is only one >mans >opinion. I was hoping I could hear from folks that have used tywraps ( >black or >whatever ) FWF who are flying and have had some experience with how well >they >hold up under general use. > >Thanks, > >- Jim >RV-8AQ ( 81102 ) >FWF O-360 >N89JA (reserved) > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Wire mounting in FWF
Date: Aug 15, 2000
I have found over the years that what Bob Nuckols stated was, and is, correct. Before I become a Fed I turned wrenches and flew for several years. Every year when it came time to do an Annual I would dig out a handful of tie wraps knowing I would have to replace many....and it was almost always the clear/opaque ones. Yes the black/colored ones do get brittle and crack but not nearly as fast as the clear ones. Actually the best method is to use the wire bundle lace cord. It also has the added benefit of not having those sharp little edges from the cut-off ends. But it is rather time consuming to do that so I must admit that I also use the tie-wraps. Mike Robertson "Das Fed" RV-8A >From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: Re: RV-List: Wire mounting in FWF >Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000 13:55:05 -0500 > > > >I Pulled this out of the archives (Bob Nuckolls, July 00): > > > The white guys are subject to ultra-violet degredation . . . > > they also don't take kindly to hyro-carbon and ozone exposure > > both of which are found in fair quantity under the cowl. > > >Randall and all, > >Thanks, I also found this in the archives. Unfortunately this is only one >mans >opinion. I was hoping I could hear from folks that have used tywraps ( >black or >whatever ) FWF who are flying and have had some experience with how well >they >hold up under general use. > >Thanks, > >- Jim >RV-8AQ ( 81102 ) >FWF O-360 >N89JA (reserved) > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Van's Alternator
Date: Aug 15, 2000
> > >I'm in the process of mounting my replacement Van's alternator and I find >that >no matter what I do, my pulley is out of alignment by about an eighth of an >inch >in the aft direction. Also the adjustment arm rests behind the alternator >not >in front as I would expect. > >Is this typical? > >Thanks, > >- Jim >RV-8AQ ( 81102 ) >FWF ( O-360 ) >N89JA ( reserved ) > Jim, Yes, sounds pretty typical. Bend a jog in the mounting arm to position the alternator pulley in alignment with the flywheel. Run the tension adjustment bolt in from the rear, through the slotted arm and into the threaded alternator case. Works fine. Trust me. Have I ever lied to ya? 'Course not. :) Brian Denk RV8 N94BD ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 15, 2000
From: gert <gert(at)execpc.com>
Subject: RV8 spar center section
hi y'all on the rv8 spar center section, how much oversized did you make your filler pieces as place holders for the spars ?? Gert -- Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227, any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500 US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net>
Subject: Re: Electronic Ignition Choice
Date: Aug 15, 2000
> > There are currently three choices for electronic ignition: > > Lasar http://www.unisonindustries.com > Lightspeed http://www.lsecorp.com > ElectroAir http://www.fly-gbi.com/eis.htm > > The primary differences that I can tell are in the level of redundancy and > the timing mechanism. > > Can anyone discuss the pros and cons of these systems? Why did you choose > the system you have (if you have)? > > Bruce Meacham > I believe that the Lasar system is the only one which advances both the sparks in each cylinder, unless dual electric and dual ignition systems are employed with the other two. Given the huge bore of these engines, that could make a difference in performance given the time it takes the flame front to cross the cylinder. Maybe the systems compensate somewhat for this by additional advance; I don't know. Alex Peterson Maple Grove, MN 6A O360, Airflow, CS may fly in '01 ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $7.99/mo! ------ ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Rv660wm(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Subject: Re: Wire mounting in FWF
In a message dated 8/15/00 3:33:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com writes: << FWF who are flying and have had some experience with how well they hold up under general use. >> I have had "regular" airplane mechanics belittle tie wraps, but I have seen them go hundreds of hours on a Kolb Firestar that I was a partner . We used the white ones extensively on some very hot parts and in a very high vibratory environment. They are setting right out in the open, so they are certainly exposed to more UV than under my 6 cowl. I have used them extensively for securing wiring, etc. under the cowl, but will watch them carefully. Bernie Kerr, 6A 40 hours, SE Fla ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Subject: Re: RV8 spar center section
Date: Aug 15, 2000
> on the rv8 spar center section, how much oversized did you make your > filler pieces as place holders for the spars ?? .005", machined from aluminum, worked perfectly when I mounted the wings. Randy Lervold RV-8 #80500, cowling www.rv-8.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 15, 2000
From: Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca>
Subject: Re: RV8 spar center section
> >hi y'all > >on the rv8 spar center section, how much oversized did you make your >filler pieces as place holders for the spars ?? > >Gert >-- Gert, Scott McDaniels from Vans posted about this back in April 99. He said to make the spacer the same thickness as the spar. He says that you can put some Boelube or candle wax on the spar to help slip it in place when the time comes. You may need to file a slight bevel on the corners of the spar end. Go to the archives and search on mcdaniels & RV-8 & spar -- Kevin Horton RV-8 (cockpit stuff) Ottawa, Canada http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 15, 2000
From: gert <gert(at)execpc.com>
Subject: Re: RV8 spar center section
Did you machine each piece individuallly for each corner ?? Just been miking the 4 corners and there is a .002 to .005 deviation between each of the four corner pieces. I machined some stock 'under' and was going to use shims. found some old email in the archives indicating .002 to .003. (per Van's) Heck some of my spar pieces have that much deviation between the end of the spar and between the 2 big holes. Gert Randy Lervold wrote: > > > > on the rv8 spar center section, how much oversized did you make your > > filler pieces as place holders for the spars ?? > > .005", machined from aluminum, worked perfectly when I mounted the wings. > > Randy Lervold > RV-8 #80500, cowling > www.rv-8.com > -- Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227, any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500 US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Subject: Airseal Fabric
Listers, With two thousand five hundred or so flying RV's out there, I'll toss out an easy one that I couldn't find in the archives... I've got a standard "finger width" (3/8" - 1/2") between my baffles and cowl. So, how far should the airseal fabric extend beyond the baffles? One inch? Two inches? Thanks in advance, Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth To the Airport by Labor Day! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 15, 2000
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: Van's Alternator
>I removed the fan because it turns in the wrong direction when mounted >on an aircraft. On cars it rotates to the left. Van's alternator also >has the fan removed. > It is not generally necessary to remove fans when they're turned "the wrong direction" . . . centrifugal fans on the front of alternators run only slightly less efficiently than when turned the right direction. Alternators with external fans are at risk for overheat when running without the fan . . . you may want to do some simple in-flight cooling tests to make sure there's enough ambient air flow . . .. Nipon-Dienso alternators have internal fans . . . Bob . . . -------------------------------------------- ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) ( and still understand nothing. ) ( C.F. Kettering ) -------------------------------------------. http://www.aeroelectric.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 15, 2000
From: Denis Walsh <deniswalsh(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Airseal Fabric
KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > Listers, > > With two thousand five hundred or so flying RV's out there, I'll toss out an > easy one that I couldn't find in the archives... > > I've got a standard "finger width" (3/8" - 1/2") between my baffles and > cowl. So, how far should the airseal fabric extend beyond the baffles? One > inch? Two inches? > > Thanks in advance, > > Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA > RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth > To the Airport by Labor Day! > Yes I would say that's about right. Worked for me D Walsh ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 15, 2000
From: Denis Walsh <deniswalsh(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: eight degrees of tilt
Jerry Springer wrote: > > bramsec wrote: > > > > > > What is the difference between an Artificial Horizon set up for 8 degree > > panel ? > > > > AHI's still work if the aircraft is climbing or diving (more than 8 > > degrees), if the AHI has an adjustable "little aeroplane"(zero pitch > > adjust knob) shouldn't this be adequate? > > > > Also is there any cheap commercial product that can regulate the vaccum > > to the required two inches or so? > > > > Regards Peter (Toronto Canada) > > > > Peter I don't have the tilt built into my AH. It still works > fine but I have to have the adjustment all the way to the top > to get the horizion lined up with the "little airplane" in level > flight. > > Jerry I never heard of the tilt thing when I bought mine so it has none. It is a sigma tek. It seems to have about + or - 14 degrees of "little airplane" adjustment. I typically use about 10 degrees of up to get level flight indicated, so I usually have only a couple degrees remaining. So I would say it is well worth ordering if you can; however if you have a regular one it works ok. D Walsh name="deniswalsh.vcf" filename="deniswalsh.vcf" begin:vcard n:Walsh;Denis adr:;;;;;; version:2.1 email;internet:deniswalsh(at)earthlink.net fn:Denis Walsh end:vcard ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Subject: Re: RV8 spar center section
Date: Aug 15, 2000
Gert, No, our measurements showed the spar stubs to not vary measureably. Now when you're down around one or two thousands maybe we didn't catch it, but at five thousands undersized the wings went in snugly but easily... perfect. Randy > Did you machine each piece individuallly for each corner ?? > > Just been miking the 4 corners and there is a .002 to .005 deviation > between each of the four corner pieces. > > I machined some stock 'under' and was going to use shims. > found some old email in the archives indicating .002 to .003. (per > Van's) > Heck some of my spar pieces have that much deviation between the end of > the spar and between the 2 big holes. > > Gert > > Randy Lervold wrote: > > > > > > > on the rv8 spar center section, how much oversized did you make your > > > filler pieces as place holders for the spars ?? > > > > .005", machined from aluminum, worked perfectly when I mounted the wings. > > > > Randy Lervold > > RV-8 #80500, cowling > > www.rv-8.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Vanremog(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 16, 2000
Subject: Re: Airseal Fabric
In a message dated 8/15/00 7:26:37 PM Pacific Daylight Time, KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM writes: << I've got a standard "finger width" (3/8" - 1/2") between my baffles and cowl. So, how far should the airseal fabric extend beyond the baffles? One inch? Two inches? >> It depends on the airseal material. Some of the material has a natural roll/curve in it so don't try to fight it. Push it up against a flat surface (to simulate the cowling) allowing it to curve the direction it will and determine the proper distance to just achieve tangency with the curve. If you make the airseal too short it can flip and blow out under pressure. If you make it too long it will hang past tangency and airflow could lift it away from the surface. -GV (RV-6A N1GV) vanremog(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2000
From: Bruce Stewart <bruce@triton-dive.com>
Subject: Re: RV3-List: Re:Travelling
3 ER's Whats the story if one flies over the border from Canada to the US? do you have to go thru the immigration stuff and customs/ quarantine checks or is it a bit more lax? as I've not been over there this may sound a bit dumb. Bruce >--> RV3-List message posted by: "Bob U." > > >Bruce Meacham wrote: > > > > --> RV3-List message posted by: "Bruce Meacham" > > > > I'm going X-Country from Paine Field Everette, WA to Lawrence, MA at > the end > > of the month. 2500nm+ total distance in a week. How's that? Great circle > > is over Mountana, North Dakota, Nebraska, Wisconsin, Michagan, Toronto and > > upstate New York. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2000
From: Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca>
Subject: Re: RV8 spar center section
Gert, On my spar, the thinner pieces of material were not quite tight against the spar bars at the root end. Once I clamped things together (like they will be once you tighten up the bolts after sliding them into the fuselage), the thickness was exactly 1.437 (1 7/16) everywhere that I measured. Kevin Horton RV-8 (cockpit stuff) Ottawa, Canada http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html > >Did you machine each piece individuallly for each corner ?? > >Just been miking the 4 corners and there is a .002 to .005 deviation >between each of the four corner pieces. > >I machined some stock 'under' and was going to use shims. >found some old email in the archives indicating .002 to .003. (per >Van's) >Heck some of my spar pieces have that much deviation between the end of >the spar and between the 2 big holes. > >Gert > >Randy Lervold wrote: >> >> >> > on the rv8 spar center section, how much oversized did you make your >> > filler pieces as place holders for the spars ?? >> >> .005", machined from aluminum, worked perfectly when I mounted the wings. >> > > Randy Lervold ________________________________________________________________________________
From: lm4(at)juno.com
Date: Aug 16, 2000
Subject: Re: RV-List:Wing box measurement
Listers, Can anyone tell me what the lenght of the long box is for the wing kit ? Larry Mac Donald Rochester N.Y. lm4(at)juno.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2000
From: Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net>
Subject: RV-3 airspeed numbers
About to do the first official flight. Gross weight will be approx 1000 lbs, CG near forward limit. Prop clearance: tail down: 14", level: 6". Any RV-3 flyers care to post some recommended airspeed numbers? Near tail down take-off speed? Flaps recommended? Climb-out speed? Turn to base speed? On final speed? Flap setting on final? Over the numbers speed? Any other hints? Finn Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Ludwig" <ludwig(at)azstarnet.com>
Subject: WTB RV-4...
Date: Aug 16, 2000
Anybody know of an RV-4 that I can buy to fly while I'm building my RV-8? Nothing fancy, but well built - around $40k. Reply directly to ludwig(at)azstarnet.com. Thanks, - Bill in Tucson ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bruce Meacham" <bruceme(at)seanet.com>
Subject: Re: RV3-List: Re:Travelling
Date: Aug 16, 2000
I won't be stopping in Canada. Just a very long overfly ~3hrs. There are no customs issues for overflights. I will file a flight plan and get VFR flight following in case they think I'm running drugs or something. Bruce Meacham ----- Original Message ----- From: Bruce Stewart <bruce@triton-dive.com> Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 1:41 AM Subject: Re: RV3-List: Re:Travelling > --> RV3-List message posted by: Bruce Stewart <bruce@triton-dive.com> > > 3 ER's > > Whats the story if one flies over the border from Canada to the US? > do you have to go thru the immigration stuff and customs/ quarantine checks > or is it a bit more lax? as I've not been over there this may sound a bit > dumb. > > Bruce > > > >--> RV3-List message posted by: "Bob U." > > > > > >Bruce Meacham wrote: > > > > > > --> RV3-List message posted by: "Bruce Meacham" > > > > > > I'm going X-Country from Paine Field Everette, WA to Lawrence, MA at > > the end > > > of the month. 2500nm+ total distance in a week. How's that? Great circle > > > is over Mountana, North Dakota, Nebraska, Wisconsin, Michagan, Toronto and > > > upstate New York. > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bruce Meacham" <bruceme(at)seanet.com>
Subject: Re: RV3-List: RV-3 airspeed numbers
Date: Aug 16, 2000
I don't know your experience level, so I must assume that your transitioning from GA like I did, so bare with me if your more experienced than I give you credit for. First I want to say: If your active with your EAA club I suggest you talk with your flight advisor and setup a training regiment. I didn't do it, but I wish I had. How much flying have you done in the last thirty days? I would recomend at least twenty hours in as many different airplanes as possible. Most of that should be in taildraggers. Flying different airplans gets you used to unusual flight envirnoments. If you can find someone in the area to give you some back seat time in an RV-4, it has an uncany resemblence to the -3's control feel and it will make a world of difference. RV's are so easy to fly, but they have a very light and responsive touch that's easy to over control. You really should have familiarity with this before test flying your aircraft. > Gross weight will be approx 1000 lbs, CG near forward limit. My plane is near forward limit too. You will loose elevator effectiveness and have difficulty doing good three point landing, but forward is always better than rearward. > Prop clearance: tail down: 14", level: 6". Tail down prop clearance doesn't meen much. I have a good 6" tail up. The angle that's required to scrub the prop is very high. > Near tail down take-off speed? Flaps recommended? Assuming enough runway (at least 5,000' I hope for a first flight) I recomend a zero flap take-off. Take off will happen very fast, twice as faster as any spam can I know. Keep it simple no flaps. I recomend a normal two point takeoff. Nothing fancy. Briskly put the power. Not too fast, but too slow and you'll be airborn before full throttle. Gently lift the tail off once you have about 30 mph, don't force it off, it will come up on it's own. Once you have 70mph gently lean back and you've slipped the searly bonds once again... > Climb-out speed? Slowly transition from 70mph takeoff to 110-120mph. This means keeping pulling the airplane back as the airspeed builds will you stabalize at 110-120. 110-120 should be faster than best climb, but a good speed for forward visability and cooling. Anticipate the climb angle to be 25-35 degrees (very steep) at this airspeed. Scan your gauges on climb out. If it's going well climb to a known practice area 3,000' AGL. Do a clearing turn. Power down and do a couple power off stalls. If those go without an misbehavior, dropping wings or loss of positive control, Attempt a power on using 1700 rpm. I don't recomend full throttle power on stalls at this stage. They can be pretty harry. > Turn to base speed? > On final speed? > Over the numbers speed? > Flap setting on final? > Flap setting on final? Just like any other plane. Here are my numbers, your RPMs will likely be different, but this is probably a good ballpark. -on downwind stabalize airpspeed at 100mph ~1600 rpm with carb heat out. -10 flaps throttle back to 1100 rpm pitch for 90 -turn base 20 degrees flaps pitch for 85 -turn base 30 degrees flaps pitch for 80. 80 is right on best glide speed and a very comfortable place to be on final. -flare and hold off ignore the airspeed, just keep a continous back motion on the stick till it hits the stop and do your best to be 1" off the ground and well aligned. > > Any other hints? Don't get behind the power curve (slower than 70mph) on final. Below 70mph and drag comes on like an avalanche, much more than most GA aircraft. Pitch over to build airspeed and set power to compensate for any altitude loss. Cross winds: RVs are good in cross winds (plenty of rudder and nimble) but they take practice. So hold off for now. Two point landings are prefered on smooth runways. But near impossible on anything with bumps. So if you have a smooth runway in your flight test area, when your comfortable level is higher. Still full flaps recomended. Don't get too worked up before takeoff. Don't invite everyone you know. Just one or two trusted advisors. Say go when you are ready to go. Have everything setup and in order before approaching the plane. Just relax and visualize your flight. Think about emergency proceedures, where your going to land out should your engine fail. Good luck! Have fun it's a blast! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Van's Alternator
Date: Aug 16, 2000
Bob, I bought a Nippon-Denso 60 amp laternator that you recommended to me several months ago. It has an external fan just under the pulley. Do I understand you correctly here in that you are saying that it also has an internal fan and I could remove the external fan if I have a little clearence problem witth the lower cowling? Mike Robertson RV-8A >From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >Subject: RE: RV-List: Van's Alternator >Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000 21:44:36 > > > > > >I removed the fan because it turns in the wrong direction when mounted > >on an aircraft. On cars it rotates to the left. Van's alternator also > >has the fan removed. > > > It is not generally necessary to remove fans when they're > turned "the wrong direction" . . . centrifugal fans on the > front of alternators run only slightly less efficiently than > when turned the right direction. > > Alternators with external fans are at risk for overheat > when running without the fan . . . you may want to do some > simple in-flight cooling tests to make sure there's enough > ambient air flow . . .. > > Nipon-Dienso alternators have internal fans . . . > > > Bob . . . > -------------------------------------------- > ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) > ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) > ( and still understand nothing. ) > ( C.F. Kettering ) > -------------------------------------------. > http://www.aeroelectric.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2000
From: Andrew Bond <ahb(at)cisco.com>
Subject: Re: Lycoming Service School
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Lycoming Service School > > >ALRIGHT ALREADY! Geeze, all this talk about how much it costs and not a >single one of you has stated how MUCH that is. I'm going to die or >curiousity here..... > >meow > > It doesn't seem very expensive to me! Cheers, ahb... From: http://www.lycoming.textron.com/main.html Piston Engine Service School A mechanics' refresher course on Lycoming's current production engines, covering: * Engine construction * Theory of operation * Engine servicing * Inspection, servicing and troubleshooting of related components Course consists of four seven-hour days, from 8:00 am to 4:00 pm, with a one-hour lunch break. Tuition for the Service School is $480 (US) per student. Tuition includes all course materials and a one-year subscription to all Textron Lycoming service bulletins, letters and instructions Disassembly/Reassembly Course This hands-on course is conducted seven hours a day, for three consecutive weekdays, immediately following the Piston Engine Service School. Class size consists of two-student teams, each working on 4- or 6- cylinder Lycoming engines, learning proper procedures for engine disassembly and reassembly. To qualify for this course, students must have completed the Service School. Individuals who have previously completed the Service School may also attend Tuition for the Disassembly/Reassembly Course is $500 (US) per student. Tuition includes all course materials. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Subject: Re: Static system
Date: Aug 16, 2000
08/16/2000 03:01:46 PM your reply of----- >>>>Next, I gently sucked on the test line, keeping IAS in the green, until I reached 2000 feet and 145 KIAS, whereupon I clamped it off. After 45 minutes the altitude was 1980 feet, and the system continued to lose altitude at<<<<<<< I am a little confused. Where did you apply the suction ? The pitot is ram air pressure......... "Dennis Persyk" (at)matronics.com on 08/15/2000 02:16:31 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com cc: Subject: Re: RV-List: Static system -----Original Message----- From: Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> Date: Tuesday, August 15, 2000 12:01 PM Subject: RV-List: Static system > >I have the poly flow installed from Van's for the static system. >Trying to decide what to use behind the panel. I have figured the poly >flow with the nylon fittings & the AN fittings with 3/16 alumimun tubing. >Just can't decide. Could someone help with what they went with & weather >they were happy or not.?? > > >Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com >********************************************** I used 1/8 ID Ace hardware rubber fuel line and Ace brass and plastic tees and barb fittings. Then I plumbed a accessible test point for system certification, which is plugged with a 5/32 rivet stem. I have 18-inch service loops on the static and vacuum lines so I can pull the panel sections out and work on them without crawling under the panel. I tested the static system by sealing off the static ports with plastic sheet discs held by electrical tape. Next, I gently sucked on the test line, keeping IAS in the green, until I reached 2000 feet and 145 KIAS, whereupon I clamped it off. After 45 minutes the altitude was 1980 feet, and the system continued to lose altitude at a rate of 0.48 feet per minute for the next 1035 minutes. Part of the altitude loss was due to temperature change during the test. The system is leak tight! I used Century rebuilt gyros and VSI, ASI and altimeter from Van's (United). I am familiar with the arguments against using rubber in the gyro lines due to particulate matter failure and therefore I ran the vacuum lines with Ace vinyl tubing. It will not collapse at 5.2 inches differential pressure at temperatures below 150 F. Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP Hampshire, IL C38 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Subject: Re: Flight Training-Hints
Date: Aug 16, 2000
08/16/2000 03:53:41 PM "Bruce Meacham" (at)matronics.com on 08/16/2000 02:31:20 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com cc: Subject: RV-List: Re: RV3-List: RV-3 airspeed numbers I don't know your experience level, so I must assume that your transitioning from GA like I did, so bare with me if your more experienced than I give you credit for. First I want to say: If your active with your EAA club I suggest you talk with your flight advisor and setup a training regiment. I didn't do it, but I wish I had. How much flying have you done in the last thirty days? I would recomend at least twenty hours in as many different airplanes as possible. Most of that should be in taildraggers. Flying different airplans gets you used to unusual flight envirnoments. If you can find someone in the area to give you some back seat time in an RV-4, it has an uncany resemblence to the -3's control feel and it will make a world of difference. RV's are so easy to fly, but they have a very light and responsive touch that's easy to over control. You really should have familiarity with this before test flying your aircraft. > Gross weight will be approx 1000 lbs, CG near forward limit. My plane is near forward limit too. You will loose elevator effectiveness and have difficulty doing good three point landing, but forward is always better than rearward. > Prop clearance: tail down: 14", level: 6". Tail down prop clearance doesn't meen much. I have a good 6" tail up. The angle that's required to scrub the prop is very high. > Near tail down take-off speed? Flaps recommended? Assuming enough runway (at least 5,000' I hope for a first flight) I recomend a zero flap take-off. Take off will happen very fast, twice as faster as any spam can I know. Keep it simple no flaps. I recomend a normal two point takeoff. Nothing fancy. Briskly put the power. Not too fast, but too slow and you'll be airborn before full throttle. Gently lift the tail off once you have about 30 mph, don't force it off, it will come up on it's own. Once you have 70mph gently lean back and you've slipped the searly bonds once again... > Climb-out speed? Slowly transition from 70mph takeoff to 110-120mph. This means keeping pulling the airplane back as the airspeed builds will you stabalize at 110-120. 110-120 should be faster than best climb, but a good speed for forward visability and cooling. Anticipate the climb angle to be 25-35 degrees (very steep) at this airspeed. Scan your gauges on climb out. If it's going well climb to a known practice area 3,000' AGL. Do a clearing turn. Power down and do a couple power off stalls. If those go without an misbehavior, dropping wings or loss of positive control, Attempt a power on using 1700 rpm. I don't recomend full throttle power on stalls at this stage. They can be pretty harry. > Turn to base speed? > On final speed? > Over the numbers speed? > Flap setting on final? > Flap setting on final? Just like any other plane. Here are my numbers, your RPMs will likely be different, but this is probably a good ballpark. -on downwind stabalize airpspeed at 100mph ~1600 rpm with carb heat out. -10 flaps throttle back to 1100 rpm pitch for 90 -turn base 20 degrees flaps pitch for 85 -turn base 30 degrees flaps pitch for 80. 80 is right on best glide speed and a very comfortable place to be on final. -flare and hold off ignore the airspeed, just keep a continous back motion on the stick till it hits the stop and do your best to be 1" off the ground and well aligned. > > Any other hints? Don't get behind the power curve (slower than 70mph) on final. Below 70mph and drag comes on like an avalanche, much more than most GA aircraft. Pitch over to build airspeed and set power to compensate for any altitude loss. Cross winds: RVs are good in cross winds (plenty of rudder and nimble) but they take practice. So hold off for now. Two point landings are prefered on smooth runways. But near impossible on anything with bumps. So if you have a smooth runway in your flight test area, when your comfortable level is higher. Still full flaps recomended. Don't get too worked up before takeoff. Don't invite everyone you know. Just one or two trusted advisors. Say go when you are ready to go. Have everything setup and in order before approaching the plane. Just relax and visualize your flight. Think about emergency proceedures, where your going to land out should your engine fail. Good luck! Have fun it's a blast! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: JusCash(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 16, 2000
Subject: Fuel Vent Lines
Listers How far from the sidewalls or how far apart have you placed the fuel tank vent lines in the belly? I am trying to get as close as possible to the landing intersection fairing. Cash Copeland RV-6 N46FC (Reserved) Oakland, Ca ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org>
Subject: Re: Static system
Date: Aug 16, 2000
There is also a static port which is the reference pressure for altitude. I don't know why he is listing am air speed. The rest is all referenced to altitude. Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact! (Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com) ----- Original Message ----- From: <pcondon(at)csc.com> Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 1:56 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Static system > > your reply of----- > > >>>>Next, I gently sucked on the test > line, keeping IAS in the green, until I reached 2000 feet and 145 KIAS, > whereupon I clamped it off. After 45 minutes the altitude was 1980 feet, > and the system continued to lose altitude at<<<<<<< > > > I am a little confused. Where did you apply the suction ? The pitot is ram > air pressure......... > > > "Dennis Persyk" (at)matronics.com on 08/15/2000 > 02:16:31 PM > > Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com > > Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com > > > To: > cc: > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Static system > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Date: Tuesday, August 15, 2000 12:01 PM > Subject: RV-List: Static system > > > > > >I have the poly flow installed from Van's for the static system. > >Trying to decide what to use behind the panel. I have figured the poly > >flow with the nylon fittings & the AN fittings with 3/16 alumimun tubing. > >Just can't decide. Could someone help with what they went with & weather > >they were happy or not.?? > > > > > >Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com > >********************************************** > I used 1/8 ID Ace hardware rubber fuel line and Ace brass and plastic tees > and barb fittings. Then I plumbed a accessible test point for system > certification, which is plugged with a 5/32 rivet stem. I have 18-inch > service loops on the static and vacuum lines so I can pull the panel > sections out and work on them without crawling under the panel. > > I tested the static system by sealing off the static ports with plastic > sheet discs held by electrical tape. Next, I gently sucked on the test > line, keeping IAS in the green, until I reached 2000 feet and 145 KIAS, > whereupon I clamped it off. After 45 minutes the altitude was 1980 feet, > and the system continued to lose altitude at a rate of 0.48 feet per minute > for the next 1035 minutes. Part of the altitude loss was due to > temperature > change during the test. The system is leak tight! I used Century rebuilt > gyros and VSI, ASI and altimeter from Van's (United). > > I am familiar with the arguments against using rubber in the gyro lines due > to particulate matter failure and therefore I ran the vacuum lines with Ace > vinyl tubing. It will not collapse at 5.2 inches differential pressure at > temperatures below 150 F. > > Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP > Hampshire, IL C38 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "alain nantel" <alain_nantel(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: dimpled platenuts
Date: Aug 16, 2000
>From: Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >i am looking for dimpled or countersunk platenuts. i tried wicks, avery, >vans, and many of the tool suppliers. does anyone know of WHERE i can >locate. >thanx, bob in arkansas Bob Why don't you make your own? All that is required is to use your dimple set you probably have already. You need to make one small modification to the female die by grinding it up to the countersink edge to create one flat side, followed by a good polishing using your scotch brite wheel. NOTE: The dimple dies still works great even if it's modified this way, it's also usefull in thight places like when you drill to close to the web on ribs, etc. Hope this helps Alain_Nantel(at)hotmail.com RV-6 C-GGRS 90% done 90% to go ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2000
From: Bruce Stewart <bruce@triton-dive.com>
Subject: Re: RV3-List: RV-3 airspeed numbers
Hi All, some friends out here used other pilots to do the first flight for half an hour or so. This may sound a bit odd however it seems OK to me after spending 10 years and wads of money the pressure is certainly very high. Recently my flying instructor finished his Europa and took it to the local Air Forse base and used their runway and spent allot of time just working up speed and feel until he was satisfied that he had it just right then peeled it of for a short first flight, I should say though the person in question has lots of hours every week in different aircraft and in total. Good luck and let us know how it all goes. Bruce >--> RV3-List message posted by: Finn Lassen > >About to do the first official flight. > >Gross weight will be approx 1000 lbs, CG near forward limit. > >Prop clearance: tail down: 14", level: 6". > >Any RV-3 flyers care to post some recommended airspeed numbers? > >Near tail down take-off speed? Flaps recommended? > >Climb-out speed? > >Turn to base speed? > >On final speed? > >Flap setting on final? > >Over the numbers speed? > >Any other hints? > >Finn > > >Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2000
From: Dan & Patty Krueger <pndkrueg(at)gulfsurf.infi.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List:Wing box measurement
For the RV-6 wing kit box it is 172 inches. Finally something I can answer with authority. Dan Krueger Wiring and plumbing engine > > Can anyone tell me what the lenght of the long box > is for the wing kit ? > > Larry Mac Donald ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Subject: Re: RV flying - basic training
Date: Aug 16, 2000
08/16/2000 03:57:01 PM "Bruce Meacham" (at)matronics.com on 08/16/2000 02:31:20 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com cc: Subject: RV-List: Re: RV3-List: RV-3 airspeed numbers I don't know your experience level, so I must assume that your transitioning from GA like I did, so bare with me if your more experienced than I give you credit for. First I want to say: If your active with your EAA club I suggest you talk with your flight advisor and setup a training regiment. I didn't do it, but I wish I had. How much flying have you done in the last thirty days? I would recomend at least twenty hours in as many different airplanes as possible. Most of that should be in taildraggers. Flying different airplans gets you used to unusual flight envirnoments. If you can find someone in the area to give you some back seat time in an RV-4, it has an uncany resemblence to the -3's control feel and it will make a world of difference. RV's are so easy to fly, but they have a very light and responsive touch that's easy to over control. You really should have familiarity with this before test flying your aircraft. > Gross weight will be approx 1000 lbs, CG near forward limit. My plane is near forward limit too. You will loose elevator effectiveness and have difficulty doing good three point landing, but forward is always better than rearward. > Prop clearance: tail down: 14", level: 6". Tail down prop clearance doesn't meen much. I have a good 6" tail up. The angle that's required to scrub the prop is very high. > Near tail down take-off speed? Flaps recommended? Assuming enough runway (at least 5,000' I hope for a first flight) I recomend a zero flap take-off. Take off will happen very fast, twice as faster as any spam can I know. Keep it simple no flaps. I recomend a normal two point takeoff. Nothing fancy. Briskly put the power. Not too fast, but too slow and you'll be airborn before full throttle. Gently lift the tail off once you have about 30 mph, don't force it off, it will come up on it's own. Once you have 70mph gently lean back and you've slipped the searly bonds once again... > Climb-out speed? Slowly transition from 70mph takeoff to 110-120mph. This means keeping pulling the airplane back as the airspeed builds will you stabalize at 110-120. 110-120 should be faster than best climb, but a good speed for forward visability and cooling. Anticipate the climb angle to be 25-35 degrees (very steep) at this airspeed. Scan your gauges on climb out. If it's going well climb to a known practice area 3,000' AGL. Do a clearing turn. Power down and do a couple power off stalls. If those go without an misbehavior, dropping wings or loss of positive control, Attempt a power on using 1700 rpm. I don't recomend full throttle power on stalls at this stage. They can be pretty harry. > Turn to base speed? > On final speed? > Over the numbers speed? > Flap setting on final? > Flap setting on final? Just like any other plane. Here are my numbers, your RPMs will likely be different, but this is probably a good ballpark. -on downwind stabalize airpspeed at 100mph ~1600 rpm with carb heat out. -10 flaps throttle back to 1100 rpm pitch for 90 -turn base 20 degrees flaps pitch for 85 -turn base 30 degrees flaps pitch for 80. 80 is right on best glide speed and a very comfortable place to be on final. -flare and hold off ignore the airspeed, just keep a continous back motion on the stick till it hits the stop and do your best to be 1" off the ground and well aligned. > > Any other hints? Don't get behind the power curve (slower than 70mph) on final. Below 70mph and drag comes on like an avalanche, much more than most GA aircraft. Pitch over to build airspeed and set power to compensate for any altitude loss. Cross winds: RVs are good in cross winds (plenty of rudder and nimble) but they take practice. So hold off for now. Two point landings are prefered on smooth runways. But near impossible on anything with bumps. So if you have a smooth runway in your flight test area, when your comfortable level is higher. Still full flaps recomended. Don't get too worked up before takeoff. Don't invite everyone you know. Just one or two trusted advisors. Say go when you are ready to go. Have everything setup and in order before approaching the plane. Just relax and visualize your flight. Think about emergency proceedures, where your going to land out should your engine fail. Good luck! Have fun it's a blast! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Lkyswede(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 16, 2000
Subject: Flying 6A For Sale
Flying 6A , Seattle, For Sale. Reply off list for details ________________________________________________________________________________
From: BillyRV6(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 16, 2000
Subject: Pitot tube & drilling holes in rib angle 73.5, 71.5
Hello I'm just getting ready to rivet the skin to the leading edge ribs. the two ribs 73.5 & 71.5 need 7/16 holes for the 1/4 inch snap rings for the pitot tube. On the drawing they show it going throw the 3/4 angle that is attach to the ribs. By the time you drill the 7/16 hole you don't have a lot of angle left about 1/8 and the hole is on the edge of the cut out on the ribs that is made to miss the main spare stiffeners. In anther word the 7/16 hole is a semi circle on the rib metal. no metal all the way around the hole. Just wondering what others have done. Thanks Bill H. Pembroke Ma. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2000
From: Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com>
Subject: Re: Van's Alternator
> > I bought a Nippon-Denso 60 amp laternator that you recommended to me several > months ago. It has an external fan just under the pulley. Do I understand > you correctly here in that you are saying that it also has an internal fan > and I could remove the external fan if I have a little clearence problem > witth the lower cowling? > If the alternator has an external fan then it most likely does not have an internal fan. The 40 amp ND on my 6A has internal fans, one at each end. The 60 amp ND on my wife's Isuzu also has two internal fans. The fans are clearly visable through the slots in the case. FWIW my alternator came with my engine and was supplied to Bart from Canadian Aero. This is a brand new ND 40 amp alt with mounting hardware for U$200.00. They also sell a 60 amp version. Gary Zilik RV-6A 75 hrs and climbing. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ENewton57(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 16, 2000
Subject: Re: Pitot tube & drilling holes in rib angle 73.5, 71.5
In a message dated 8/16/00 5:40:23 PM Central Daylight Time, BillyRV6(at)AOL.COM writes: << Hello I'm just getting ready to rivet the skin to the leading edge ribs. the two ribs 73.5 & 71.5 need 7/16 holes for the 1/4 inch snap rings for the pitot tube. On the drawing they show it going throw the 3/4 angle that is attach to the ribs. By the time you drill the 7/16 hole you don't have a lot of angle left about 1/8 and the hole is on the edge of the cut out on the ribs that is made to miss the main spare stiffeners. In anther word the 7/16 hole is a semi circle on the rib metal. no metal all the way around the hole. Just wondering what others have done. >> Hi Bill, I drilled mine just above the angle and routed the tube up and through the two ribs. You can see a picture of it by going here: http://members.aol.com/shannancmt/pitotube.html Eric Newton Long Beach, MS RV-6A N57ME (reserved) (Flaps) Eric's RV-6A Construction Page ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Static system
Date: Aug 16, 2000
-----Original Message----- From: pcondon(at)csc.com <pcondon(at)csc.com> Date: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 2:47 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Static system > > your reply of----- > >>>>>Next, I gently sucked on the test >line, keeping IAS in the green, until I reached 2000 feet and 145 KIAS, >whereupon I clamped it off. After 45 minutes the altitude was 1980 feet, >and the system continued to lose altitude at<<<<<<< > > >I am a little confused. Where did you apply the suction ? The pitot is ram >air pressure......... The suction was applied to the static system via a Tee that I have plumbed in to facillitate static system checking. The pitot tube is capped off with a 1/4 ID rubber hose segment with a plug in it. The ASI has two ports: Pitot and static. It measures the differential pressure between the two. Thus as the static system is pumped down (sucked on), the ASI responds with a reading. Sucking on the static port is the same as pressurizing the pitot port as far as the ASI is concerned in this test. If you have ever assisted in a static system check or watched one, you would see that one guy mans the pump and the other calls out airspeed and altitude, as both are varying with pumpdown. This seems confusing when you read it, so just do it in your own plane and it will become clearer. I did the check so that when I have the static system checked I know there will be no leaks. Many shops will ding you for the whole cost of the check even though they determine in the first few minutes that the system leaks like a sieve. You don't want to pay shop rate to have a technicial find leaks in the system that you can find on your own beforehand. Hope this clears things up a bit. Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP Hampshire, IL C38 >"Dennis Persyk" (at)matronics.com on 08/15/2000 >02:16:31 PM > >Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com > >Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com > > >To: >cc: > >Subject: Re: RV-List: Static system > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >Date: Tuesday, August 15, 2000 12:01 PM >Subject: RV-List: Static system > > >> >>I have the poly flow installed from Van's for the static system. >>Trying to decide what to use behind the panel. I have figured the poly >>flow with the nylon fittings & the AN fittings with 3/16 alumimun tubing. >>Just can't decide. Could someone help with what they went with & weather >>they were happy or not.?? >> >> >>Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com >>********************************************** >I used 1/8 ID Ace hardware rubber fuel line and Ace brass and plastic tees >and barb fittings. Then I plumbed a accessible test point for system >certification, which is plugged with a 5/32 rivet stem. I have 18-inch >service loops on the static and vacuum lines so I can pull the panel >sections out and work on them without crawling under the panel. > >I tested the static system by sealing off the static ports with plastic >sheet discs held by electrical tape. Next, I gently sucked on the test >line, keeping IAS in the green, until I reached 2000 feet and 145 KIAS, >whereupon I clamped it off. After 45 minutes the altitude was 1980 feet, >and the system continued to lose altitude at a rate of 0.48 feet per minute >for the next 1035 minutes. Part of the altitude loss was due to >temperature >change during the test. The system is leak tight! I used Century rebuilt >gyros and VSI, ASI and altimeter from Van's (United). > >I am familiar with the arguments against using rubber in the gyro lines due >to particulate matter failure and therefore I ran the vacuum lines with Ace >vinyl tubing. It will not collapse at 5.2 inches differential pressure at >temperatures below 150 F. > >Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP >Hampshire, IL C38 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2000
From: bert murillo <bertrv6(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: alternators
HI: I will have to get an alternator, for my lycoming 320, rebuilt. I see that some of you, up for a auto alternator; my question, I have read, that you cannot use a auto alt., because,... something to do with the direction of rotation....hope someon clarify this for me. I do not know the type of alternators Van's sell I understand the 30 app. is enough for almost any rv... Thanks in advance for replies... Don not archive Bert rv6a Fitting wing..... ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2000
From: Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com>
Subject: Re: alternators
bert murillo wrote: > > HI: > > I will have to get an alternator, for my > lycoming 320, rebuilt. In an earlier post you mentioned the possability of getting an Aerosport Power engine. A 40 amp ND automotive alternator is standard on this engine. There is also a 60 amp option or you can choose to delete the alternator from the engine if you have your own unit already. > > > I see that some of you, up for a auto alternator; > my question, I have read, that you cannot use > a auto alt., because,... something to do with the > direction of rotation....hope someon clarify this > for me. You cant believe everything you read. Alternators really don't care which way they rotate. > > I do not know the type of alternators Van's sell Big clunky automotive units. > > I understand the 30 app. is enough for almost > any rv... 30 amps may be a little small if you gots lots of toys and fly at night. I would think a 40 amp unit would be enough for most RV's. Gary Zilk RV-6A 75 hrs ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2000
From: EARL FORTNER <e.fortner(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: F-690/Elev Push Tube
Feel confident that you are not the only one who has a spare push tube just a tad short, and that you will also discover other parts that are not quite what they should be after the cut has been made. Earl, RV-4 praying that I don't do the same with the canopy. KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > > Hey Folks, > > Its been one of those weekends.....just when it all seems to be going > together so well.....!!! I assembled the F-690 push tube per the plans, > with out making any cuts or trimming, leaving it at 78" in length. Mounted > the HS and Elevators and went to make the final cut/adjustments and wouldn't > ya know it...its about 1" too short. I checked everything I could think of: > I got the right tube...1 1/2 x 78", The bellcrank is in the proper location, > bellcrank is in the proper position, the controls were locked in the neutral > position, with the elevators in trail (neutral). The bellcrank in the center > was positioned almost vertically (when neutral)....so Im kind of at a loss > what is going on....hmmmmm....any ideas??? Obviously I need a new > tube....but logic would tell me that the folks at vans would make it a bit > long to start and leave a bit to be trimmed. I building a QB, 6A......hey > maybe I got the "SF" version (streched fuselage). Help!!! > > Kurt, OKC, OK > RV 6A QB > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2000
From: Malcolm L Harper <mlharper(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Fuel cap etching
What's the latest source to have fuel caps etched? I tried the guy at panel cut but have received no answer. Mal RV-6 finishing kit ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2000
From: Bruce Gray <brucegray(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel cap etching
Try Wayne at, http;//www.engravers.net Bruce Glasair III Malcolm L Harper wrote: > > What's the latest source to have fuel caps etched? I tried the guy at panel > cut but have received no answer. > > Mal > RV-6 finishing kit > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Greg Yotz" <gyachts(at)kans.com>
Subject: Re: Fuel cap etching
Date: Aug 16, 2000
The Panel Cut guy may have fell of the face of the earth, I have a total of 6 unanswered emails. We've decided to have our two panels done at a local print shop that has a laser engraver. I'll ask about gas caps. Though I think the only reason this guy is doing it is because my partners business does allot of work with them. He didn't seem to eager when he found out it was for 'experimental airplanes'. Greg > What's the latest source to have fuel caps etched? I tried the guy at panel > cut but have received no answer. > > Mal > RV-6 finishing kit > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 16, 2000
From: Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net>
Paul , info(at)vansaircraft.com
Subject: RV-3 N993FL SN 488 finally flies
This bird was started by Charlie Dorris of Richardson, TX in July 1977! I picked it up in January 1996. And it finally flew this evening! 23 years old before allowed to fly! This official first flight was just a very quick flight around a tight pattern, although I reached 1200' and 120 mph before catching it. Successful landing by a beginner's standard, just a bounce or two. This first flight was preceded by several high speed taxi runs, the last of which was really a low flight just above the runway. After more than 4 hours in a Decathlon over the past week, the RV-3 felt quite different, in spite of the many hours of taxiing it previously. Unless you have a new engine that needs full power run-in, I'm a strong advocate for taxi runs prior to first flight. If you can't control it during high speed taxiing, how can you hope to control it during your first landing? I guess an experienced test pilot would describe the flight as "uneventful". Interestingly, most of my attention was on the engine (experimental 13B Mazda Mikuni carburated rotary installation, with a Ross 2.17-1 re-drive, swinging a Performance Prop's 68x74 prop - pitched towards cruise) during climb to pattern altitude. I have not yet installed the cowl cheek extensions. A good deal of heat comes out that way (left side is where the muffler/exhaust is). This made the side skin where my hand rests on the throttle(s) noticeably hot to the point where I had to peek over the side to make sure it wasn't on fire (again), and made me decide to tighten the pattern. I'd be hard pressed to give any hard numbers. I'm not sure if I applied full throttle (I have static run-up prop flutter at 4500 RPM, so intended to limit RPM to below that). I think max RPM was somewhere between 4200 and 4700. Temperatures were not a problem. even on this 92F day. Highest oil temperature I noticed was 198F and water probably 190F. Yes, this bird does pick up speed easily, so after reducing speed to 100 mph, I applied one notch of flaps, making a marked pitch change, but easily corrected with a flick of the trim tab switch. I did notice what I perceived as engine roughness or surging when I reduced power (~2700 RPM) and pointed the nose down a bit - possibly a re-drive phenomena (didn't apply carb heat, so could also have been that). Didn't have "time" to look at EGT and mixture (oxygen sensor readout) numbers. More later for those who may be interested. Finn Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Don Eaves" <doneaves(at)bigfoot.com>
Subject: Fuel cap etching
Date: Aug 17, 2000
The Panel Guy Steve Davis is alive & well - He must have a lot to do lately - This work is aside from his main income - I dropped off my caps there last week - I will call to see what's up. Don Eaves - Memphis... -----Original Message----- From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Greg Yotz Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 9:40 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel cap etching The Panel Cut guy may have fell of the face of the earth, I have a total of 6 unanswered emails. We've decided to have our two panels done at a local print shop that has a laser engraver. I'll ask about gas caps. Though I think the only reason this guy is doing it is because my partners business does allot of work with them. He didn't seem to eager when he found out it was for 'experimental airplanes'. Greg > What's the latest source to have fuel caps etched? I tried the guy at panel > cut but have received no answer. > > Mal > RV-6 finishing kit > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Carter" <jcarter8(at)midsouth.rr.com>
Subject: Re: alternators
Date: Aug 17, 2000
> I will have to get an alternator, for my > lycoming 320, rebuilt. > > I see that some of you, up for a auto alternator; > my question, I have read, that you cannot use > a auto alt., because,... something to do with the > direction of rotation....hope someon clarify this > for me. > I do not know the type of alternators Van's sell > I understand the 30 app. is enough for almost > any rv... > Bert, I would suggest a 40 amp B&C alternator without internal voltage regulator - the ones from Aerosport come with the internal regulator. I bought one from Bob Nuckolls and added his voltage regulator and overvoltage protection systems. I did this for peace of mind. A voltage regulator does not protect you from overvoltage which could fry all your fancy avionics. Jerry ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2000
From: Ken Balch <kbalch1(at)mediaone.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel cap etching
I've repeatedly had trouble reaching him. He's responded to only two emails from me out of at least five or six over the past six months or so. It's now been at least three weeks since he informed me that my name badge was ready and requested that I send him a stamped envelope, which I did. No response and no badge. I understand that he's done good quality work for other people and that he may be very busy, but his responsiveness to me has not been what I would characterize as good service. Originally, I emailed him requesting information on his panels, which, as paying business, should have elicited an immediate and enthusiastic response, even if the name badge didn't. I'll never pay him a dime for any goods or services. As far as I'm concerned, regardless of the quality of his work, he can't be trusted to be 'reachable' or responsive. -- Regards, Ken Balch Ashland, MA RV-8 #81125 N118KB (reserved) cockpit stuff Don Eaves wrote: > > The Panel Guy Steve Davis is alive & well - > He must have a lot to do lately - > This work is aside from his main income - > I dropped off my caps there last week - > I will call to see what's up. > Don Eaves - Memphis... > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Greg Yotz > Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 9:40 PM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel cap etching > > > The Panel Cut guy may have fell of the face of the earth, I have a total of > 6 unanswered emails. We've decided to have our two panels done at a local > print shop that has a laser engraver. I'll ask about gas caps. Though I > think the only reason this guy is doing it is because my partners business > does allot of work with them. He didn't seem to eager when he found out it > was for 'experimental airplanes'. > > Greg > > > What's the latest source to have fuel caps etched? I tried the guy at > panel > > cut but have received no answer. > > > > Mal > > RV-6 finishing kit > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Reeves, Doug" <Douglas.Reeves(at)archongroup.com>
Subject: Van's WWW site
Date: Aug 17, 2000
No. I believe they must be moving the server to the new location. Their site said a few days ago that the server would move soon. Doug Reeves www.vansairforce.net > -----Original Message----- > From: Stephen J. Soule [SMTP:SSoule(at)pfclaw.com] > Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2000 8:21 AM > To: Rv-List (E-mail) > Subject: RV-List: Van's WWW site > > > I tried to access Van's web site this morning to order some hardware. I > got > a message from their server that I did not have privileges to access Van's > site. I used the address www.vansaircraft.com. Has the address changed? > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Subject: Re: Fuel cap etching
someone help this dumb a.... hillbilly. explain etch for fuel caps. thanx bob in arkansas-doing wings. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CW9371(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Subject: Re: Van's WWW site
In a message dated 8/17/2000 8:36:06 AM Central Daylight Time, SSoule(at)pfclaw.com writes: << I tried to access Van's web site this morning to order some hardware. I got a message from their server that I did not have privileges to access Van's site. I used the address www.vansaircraft.com. Has the address changed? Steve Soule >> Arent they closed and moving this week. If they have there server on site it would explain why its down. Or the server might just be done. It happens, I know I have lost my site several times. chris ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Subject: Re: Van's WWW site
i ordered a piece tues and one of the gals said if they did not send tue it would not be sent until next week due to moving all the "stuff".bob ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2000
From: bert murillo <bertrv6(at)yahoo.com>
________________________________________________________________________________ Thread-Topic: electronic ignition questions Thread-Index: AcAIfQGBcZ961lYiTtqNxi2A8smOsw=
From: "Bob Japundza" <Bob.Japundza(at)realmed.com>
Subject: electronic ignition questions
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Listers, I just ordered the Electroair electronic ignition to replace my right mag from George Orndorff. I want to get my fuel burn down at altitude. I have a few questions for you guys running the Electroair or Lightspeed ignitions: 1. Which plugs are you running the electronic ignition on? Jeff Rose says to run them on the bottom (reduce fouling), George says to run one side top--the other side on bottom just like the mags do. 2. What plugs are you using on the electronic ignition? Jeff says run Autolite spark plugs on the bottom, George says stick with the aircraft plugs--they are less prone to fouling, and he's had problems with the boots coming off on the automotive spark plugs. 3. Anyone running autogas with electronic ignition? I've been thinking about running autogas in cruise off one tank and avgas in the other for takeoffs/landings. I'm thinking the engine will run on autogas better with the electronic ignition. 4. Does the electronic ignition make your engine run noticeably smoother? 5. How much of a reduction in fuel consumption do you typically see? Just trying to get a game plan going so I can spend a minimum amount fixing and the maximum amount flying. This weekend I'm having the propeller dynamically balanced. We'll see how much that does to keep the floor from vibrating. Bob Japundza RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying 16.5 hours ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2000
From: bert murillo <bertrv6(at)yahoo.com>
________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Subject: Century Manuels
From: Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com>
Repost for the acchive: writes: > > On the Century web site... > http://www.centuryflight.com/pricing/frame/manual.htm > Note! you can download for free the owners operating manual. > > Operation & Maintenance Manuals List Price > 68S54 Century II and III $ 200.00 > 68S73 Century I $ 45.00 > 68S89 Century IV/Flight Director $ 200.00 > 68S90 1C651 Yaw Damper $ 45.00 > 68S94 Electronic Trim Amplifier 1C709-() $ 45.00 > 68S304 NSD360A/NSD1000 Horizontal Situation Indicator $ 325.00 > 68S307 Electronic Altitude Hold 1C727 $ 85.00 > 68S652 Gyro Slaving Amplifier, and Bootstrap Synchro 1C714/1D755 $ > 70.00 > 68S653 Century 41 Annunciator/Programmer $ 100.00 > 68S655 Navigation Data Processor $ 110.00 > 68S656 1C753-() Yaw Damper $ 195.00 > 68S1025 Century 21 Service Manual $ 200.00 > 68S1026 Century 31 Service Manual $ 200.00 > 68S1027 Century 41 Service Manual $ 200.00 > 68S1034 Century 2000 Service Manual $ 200.00 > 68S1072 Yaw Damper, 1C753-100/200 Series $ 80.00 > Test Manuals > 68S371 Century II, III, and IV Test Console (66D1000) $ 200.00 > 68S1029 Century 2000, 21, 31, and 41 Test Drawer (66D1000-14) $ > 200.00 > Operator's Manuals > *68S72 Century I (196K) $ 20.00 > *68S75 Century IIB (134K) $ 20.00 > *68S25 Century III (210K) $ 20.00 > 68S82 Century IV $ 20.00 > *68S1035 Century 2000 (ZIP file) $ 20.00 > *68S1035 Century 2000 (pdf. file) $20.00 > *68S85 NSD (750K) $ 20.00 > 68S805 Century 21 $ 20.00 > *68S803 Century 41 (851K) $ 20.00 > 68S1024 Century 31 $ 20.00 > Installation Manuals > Bulletin No. ( ) (English) $ 130.00 > STC $ 1,000.00 > (non discountable) > > *Now available on our web site for you to print free of charge > > Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact! > (Click here to visit our Club site at > http://www.bellanca-championclub.com) > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2000
From: Bill VonDane <bvondane(at)atmel.com>
Subject: Not building related, but cool...
I found a real cool site the other day... Check it out: http://www.terraserver.com/index.asp -Bill ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Subject: Plane Chute
Dose anyone have any knowledge of any RV builder that has installed a Ballistic Recovery System in their RV??? Like the ones advertised in Aircraft Spruce. A builder's wife brought up the fact that an RV-8 might not be a safe place for the kiddies, so I was wondering if this is a viable alternative or not. My wife really warmed up to the idea when she understood what it meant. "You mean that I won't have to bail out if some catastrophic air frame failure occurs?" As remote a possibility as this is... I rather like the idea of having a personal parachute ride down to safety but my wife finds this so inconvenient :-) - Jim RV-8A ( engine stuff ) 0-360 (N89JA) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: The panel pilot
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Aw come on guys. You'll feel like a real heel if you find out he's been with his wife in the hospital for the last 2 weeks. I hope that is not the case, but I've had quite some dealings with Steve (never in a business sense, and he's never made a dime off of me) and I feel he's one of the nicest guys you could hope to meet. I don't know what has happened in his life to cause any perceived lack of attention, but I doubt it is intentional. Have you tried calling him? Some people are not as 'net oriented' as some of us. I noticed his email address is @aol.com. Anyone who has used that service can attest to the REDICULOUS amount of junk mail. Maybe your domain name is in a filter file used to can some of his junk mail. I don't know...but my dealings with him have gone amazingly well....and like I said...he never made a penny. Give him the benefit of the doubt....and pick up the phone. I just did so and he picked up on the second ring. Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ken Balch" <kbalch1(at)mediaone.net> Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2000 9:57 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel cap etching > > I've repeatedly had trouble reaching him. He's responded to only two emails > from me out of at least five or six over the past six months or so. It's now > been at least three weeks since he informed me that my name badge was ready and > requested that I send him a stamped envelope, which I did. No response and no > badge. > > I understand that he's done good quality work for other people and that he may > be very busy, but his responsiveness to me has not been what I would > characterize as good service. Originally, I emailed him requesting information > on his panels, which, as paying business, should have elicited an immediate and > enthusiastic response, even if the name badge didn't. > > I'll never pay him a dime for any goods or services. As far as I'm concerned, > regardless of the quality of his work, he can't be trusted to be 'reachable' or > responsive. > > -- > Regards, > Ken Balch > Ashland, MA > RV-8 #81125 N118KB (reserved) > cockpit stuff > > > Don Eaves wrote: > > > > > The Panel Guy Steve Davis is alive & well - > > He must have a lot to do lately - > > This work is aside from his main income - > > I dropped off my caps there last week - > > I will call to see what's up. > > Don Eaves - Memphis... > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Greg Yotz > > Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 9:40 PM > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel cap etching > > > > > > The Panel Cut guy may have fell of the face of the earth, I have a total of > > 6 unanswered emails. We've decided to have our two panels done at a local > > print shop that has a laser engraver. I'll ask about gas caps. Though I > > think the only reason this guy is doing it is because my partners business > > does allot of work with them. He didn't seem to eager when he found out it > > was for 'experimental airplanes'. > > > > Greg > > > > > What's the latest source to have fuel caps etched? I tried the guy at > > panel > > > cut but have received no answer. > > > > > > Mal > > > RV-6 finishing kit > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2000
From: Steve Judd <sjudd(at)ffd2.com>
Subject: Re: Plane Chute
Hi Jim, On Thu, 17 Aug 2000 Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com wrote: > > > Dose anyone have any knowledge of any RV builder that has installed a Ballistic > Recovery System in their RV??? Like the ones advertised in Aircraft Spruce. I believe Van wrote an article on this subject in the RVator. You're taking an awful risk believing my memory, but the gist is roughly as follows: - The parachute does not guarantee a soft touchdown -- just something less than terminal velocity. - Pretty much all serious airplane accidents happen on takeoff or landing (if your engine quits at altitude, you deadstick onto a field or a road). Thus, in the vast majority of potential airplane accidents, the brs does you no good -- there's no time or opportunity to deploy it. - As such, the brs offers a false sense of security, and if this causes you to start slacking off on your emergency procedures/skills then you are less safe. It is better to _be_ safe than to _feel_ safe. The BRS seemed neat to me, but only until I read the article. -S ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Subject: Re: RV Flight Speeds
Date: Aug 17, 2000
08/17/2000 04:30:56 PM repost for future electronic searching "Bruce Meacham" (at)matronics.com on 08/16/2000 02:31:20 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com cc: Subject: RV-List: Re: RV3-List: RV-3 airspeed numbers I don't know your experience level, so I must assume that your transitioning from GA like I did, so bare with me if your more experienced than I give you credit for. First I want to say: If your active with your EAA club I suggest you talk with your flight advisor and setup a training regiment. I didn't do it, but I wish I had. How much flying have you done in the last thirty days? I would recomend at least twenty hours in as many different airplanes as possible. Most of that should be in taildraggers. Flying different airplans gets you used to unusual flight envirnoments. If you can find someone in the area to give you some back seat time in an RV-4, it has an uncany resemblence to the -3's control feel and it will make a world of difference. RV's are so easy to fly, but they have a very light and responsive touch that's easy to over control. You really should have familiarity with this before test flying your aircraft. > Gross weight will be approx 1000 lbs, CG near forward limit. My plane is near forward limit too. You will loose elevator effectiveness and have difficulty doing good three point landing, but forward is always better than rearward. > Prop clearance: tail down: 14", level: 6". Tail down prop clearance doesn't meen much. I have a good 6" tail up. The angle that's required to scrub the prop is very high. > Near tail down take-off speed? Flaps recommended? Assuming enough runway (at least 5,000' I hope for a first flight) I recomend a zero flap take-off. Take off will happen very fast, twice as faster as any spam can I know. Keep it simple no flaps. I recomend a normal two point takeoff. Nothing fancy. Briskly put the power. Not too fast, but too slow and you'll be airborn before full throttle. Gently lift the tail off once you have about 30 mph, don't force it off, it will come up on it's own. Once you have 70mph gently lean back and you've slipped the searly bonds once again... > Climb-out speed? Slowly transition from 70mph takeoff to 110-120mph. This means keeping pulling the airplane back as the airspeed builds will you stabalize at 110-120. 110-120 should be faster than best climb, but a good speed for forward visability and cooling. Anticipate the climb angle to be 25-35 degrees (very steep) at this airspeed. Scan your gauges on climb out. If it's going well climb to a known practice area 3,000' AGL. Do a clearing turn. Power down and do a couple power off stalls. If those go without an misbehavior, dropping wings or loss of positive control, Attempt a power on using 1700 rpm. I don't recomend full throttle power on stalls at this stage. They can be pretty harry. > Turn to base speed? > On final speed? > Over the numbers speed? > Flap setting on final? > Flap setting on final? Just like any other plane. Here are my numbers, your RPMs will likely be different, but this is probably a good ballpark. -on downwind stabalize airpspeed at 100mph ~1600 rpm with carb heat out. -10 flaps throttle back to 1100 rpm pitch for 90 -turn base 20 degrees flaps pitch for 85 -turn base 30 degrees flaps pitch for 80. 80 is right on best glide speed and a very comfortable place to be on final. -flare and hold off ignore the airspeed, just keep a continous back motion on the stick till it hits the stop and do your best to be 1" off the ground and well aligned. > > Any other hints? Don't get behind the power curve (slower than 70mph) on final. Below 70mph and drag comes on like an avalanche, much more than most GA aircraft. Pitch over to build airspeed and set power to compensate for any altitude loss. Cross winds: RVs are good in cross winds (plenty of rudder and nimble) but they take practice. So hold off for now. Two point landings are prefered on smooth runways. But near impossible on anything with bumps. So if you have a smooth runway in your flight test area, when your comfortable level is higher. Still full flaps recomended. Don't get too worked up before takeoff. Don't invite everyone you know. Just one or two trusted advisors. Say go when you are ready to go. Have everything setup and in order before approaching the plane. Just relax and visualize your flight. Think about emergency proceedures, where your going to land out should your engine fail. Good luck! Have fun it's a blast! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: PANELCUT(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Subject: To all List Members!!!
Listers I have just read an email that was left on this forum about MY SERVICES. As everyone knows, I was doing the BADGES for the members to have a way for all of us to meet and know each other at events. I apparently did something wrong according to one member. I have no control over the mail service. I will finish the badges I have in house and take care of the one that didn't arrive, but feel I have to quit. I didn't deserve the remarks that were made about me. I try to respond to every email but some fall through the cracks. I'm human! .This person has only contacted me twice and I responded both times, as far as services go everything he has gotten or not gotten was FREE. Steve Davis The Panel Pilot ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Subject: Re: The panel pilot
Date: Aug 17, 2000
08/17/2000 04:21:14 PM Also, If he went to Oshgosh I would think he had a busy work week there..... and not a vacation week . He may need time to sort things out........He may have a new e-mail server or new proxy server that isn't forwarding like it should (I've been there)...... "Bill Shook" (at)matronics.com on 08/17/2000 03:36:19 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com cc: Subject: RV-List: The panel pilot Aw come on guys. You'll feel like a real heel if you find out he's been with his wife in the hospital for the last 2 weeks. I hope that is not the case, but I've had quite some dealings with Steve (never in a business sense, and he's never made a dime off of me) and I feel he's one of the nicest guys you could hope to meet. I don't know what has happened in his life to cause any perceived lack of attention, but I doubt it is intentional. Have you tried calling him? Some people are not as 'net oriented' as some of us. I noticed his email address is @aol.com. Anyone who has used that service can attest to the REDICULOUS amount of junk mail. Maybe your domain name is in a filter file used to can some of his junk mail. I don't know...but my dealings with him have gone amazingly well....and like I said...he never made a penny. Give him the benefit of the doubt....and pick up the phone. I just did so and he picked up on the second ring. Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ken Balch" <kbalch1(at)mediaone.net> Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2000 9:57 AM Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel cap etching > > I've repeatedly had trouble reaching him. He's responded to only two emails > from me out of at least five or six over the past six months or so. It's now > been at least three weeks since he informed me that my name badge was ready and > requested that I send him a stamped envelope, which I did. No response and no > badge. > > I understand that he's done good quality work for other people and that he may > be very busy, but his responsiveness to me has not been what I would > characterize as good service. Originally, I emailed him requesting information > on his panels, which, as paying business, should have elicited an immediate and > enthusiastic response, even if the name badge didn't. > > I'll never pay him a dime for any goods or services. As far as I'm concerned, > regardless of the quality of his work, he can't be trusted to be 'reachable' or > responsive. > > -- > Regards, > Ken Balch > Ashland, MA > RV-8 #81125 N118KB (reserved) > cockpit stuff > > > Don Eaves wrote: > > > > > The Panel Guy Steve Davis is alive & well - > > He must have a lot to do lately - > > This work is aside from his main income - > > I dropped off my caps there last week - > > I will call to see what's up. > > Don Eaves - Memphis... > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Greg Yotz > > Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 9:40 PM > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > > Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel cap etching > > > > > > The Panel Cut guy may have fell of the face of the earth, I have a total of > > 6 unanswered emails. We've decided to have our two panels done at a local > > print shop that has a laser engraver. I'll ask about gas caps. Though I > > think the only reason this guy is doing it is because my partners business > > does allot of work with them. He didn't seem to eager when he found out it > > was for 'experimental airplanes'. > > > > Greg > > > > > What's the latest source to have fuel caps etched? I tried the guy at > > panel > > > cut but have received no answer. > > > > > > Mal > > > RV-6 finishing kit > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Subject: Re: Plane Chute
Date: Aug 17, 2000
08/17/2000 04:22:53 PM From your posting I gather you plan to wear a 'chute all the time ? Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com@matronics.com on 08/17/2000 03:36:17 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com cc: Subject: RV-List: Plane Chute Dose anyone have any knowledge of any RV builder that has installed a Ballistic Recovery System in their RV??? Like the ones advertised in Aircraft Spruce. A builder's wife brought up the fact that an RV-8 might not be a safe place for the kiddies, so I was wondering if this is a viable alternative or not. My wife really warmed up to the idea when she understood what it meant. "You mean that I won't have to bail out if some catastrophic air frame failure occurs?" As remote a possibility as this is... I rather like the idea of having a personal parachute ride down to safety but my wife finds this so inconvenient :-) - Jim RV-8A ( engine stuff ) 0-360 (N89JA) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2000
From: Ken Balch <kbalch1(at)mediaone.net>
Subject: Re: To all List Members!!!
Listers, It seems that Steve has decided to compound the poor service I received by making false assertions in public about the number of emails from me that went unanswered by him. I never made any claim to have paid him for any goods or services whatsoever. He sent me a private email almost an hour ago containing these same assertions, as well as an unkind personal remark, and my response went out to him approximately half an hour ago. Perhaps he hasn't received it yet. Since he's chosen to call me a liar in public, I feel perfectly free to publish his email to me and my response to him here. --------------------------------------------------- Steve, I can appreciate that you have no control over the US Mail. I can certainly sympathize with this, as can we all. I look forward to receiving the badge. My original emails to you were indeed regarding the possibility of your doing my panel. You were recommended to me by Paul Besing. When I got no response to the first email, I sent the second. These date back to late last year or very early this year. I've since changed my email service and my copies of earlier emails have, unfortunately, been purged. I also sent at least one email requesting information about having my fuel caps added to the last run and received no reply to that message either. I can understand that you don't receive all emails addressed to you (what service provider is perfect, after all), but find it a little hard to believe that all of my emails fell through the proverbial cracks. As far as handling things like a 'man', there's nothing to handle. As far as I was concerned, I wasn't looking for a response from you. I was willing (and fully expecting) to just let the whole thing drop entirely, since all I'd actually invested was one set of round-trip postage. When I saw the message on the list this morning, I decided to simply post my experience as a counterpoint to the rest. I don't find anything unmanly or even confrontational/contentious about that. If you do, get over it. One person's perfectly civil commentary on the service he feels he's received (or not) is not a personal attack. It's just one more opinion added to the rest. I have no problem with you personally, as we've never met or even spoken (to the best of my recollection), so unkind personal remarks on your part are uncalled for and do not speak well of you. As far as your getting out of the name badge business, that's certainly up to you, but I believe that it's a valuable service unanimously appreciated by all who've received the badges, as well as those of us still eagerly anticipating the arrival of ours. I'm sorry for any part I may have inadvertently played in generating any ill will. With no hard feelings... Best Regards, Ken Balch PANELCUT(at)aol.com wrote: > Ken > > I sent the badge out via US Mail. I have no control over their service. I > have only received TWO emails from you in response to the badge and responded > both times. > I will take care of this BADGE but give me a little slack I have NO CONTROL > over the postal service. I was on vacation for a week took a little time to > go to Oshkosh so I might have missed a few but I can only respond to what I > receive and I try to do that, sometimes I do not get all my emails but have > no control over that as well. Sorry your so damm unhappy with my services, > the damm badges were free but thanks to you I will give that up as well. > Somebody on the list told me I should have charged for them but I thought I > was doing the list members a favor. Another thing you have never asked me > about a PANEL the only thing we have ever discussed was the badge. Next time > handle it like a man and let me know if there is a problem, don't get on a > public forum to get a response. > > Steve Davis > The Panel Pilot -------------------------------------------- I sincerely hope that this will be the end of this minor debacle. I have no hard feelings toward anyone, however deserved they may be at this point. In the future, I'll keep my opinions to myself, however valuable they may be to other builders. -- Regards, Ken Balch Ashland, MA RV-8 #81125 N118KB (reserved) cockpit stuff PANELCUT(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > Listers > > I have just read an email that was left on this forum about MY SERVICES. As > everyone knows, I was doing the BADGES for the members to have a way for all > of us to meet and know each other at events. I apparently did something wrong > according to one member. I have no control over the mail service. I will > finish the badges I have in house and take care of the one that didn't > arrive, but feel I have to quit. I didn't deserve the remarks that were made > about me. I try to respond to every email but some fall through the cracks. > I'm human! .This person has only contacted me twice and I responded both > times, as far as services go everything he has gotten or not gotten was FREE. > > Steve Davis > The Panel Pilot ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DJB6A(at)cs.com
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Subject: Re: To all List Members!!!
Heck guys done it again! Really seem to know how to chase away the good guys like Steve, Scott Mc Daniels, Brian Lloyd to name but a few. This list is a wonderful relatively FREE service, we all need to be polite and repectful. I know it is all email and impersonal, but there REAL people on the receiving end. I deal with the same insensitivity at work everyday and if I didn't depend on the pay check at the end of the month to pay for the RV I would tell them to go to hell as well. I am really sorry that Steve has decided to take this to heart, he did my caps and they are great. Missed getting the Badge prior to Oshkosh and was really sorry I didn't, they looked great and the fellows wearing them did so with pride. Now go ahead and flame me. Dave Burnham Finishing wings. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: FK27Bob(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Subject: Re: Plane Chute
The Minnesota RV Wing had a great meeting earlier this year at the BRS factory in South St. Paul, MN. The folks at BRS gave us a great tour and said they get more requests to develop a system for the RV than any other aircraft. They have a great background in Ballistic parachutes and they are the ones that developed a system for the Cirrus. They are working on designs for the RV's, but there are some major engineering factors to consider: First is the large performance envelope for the RV's. How do you design a chute that will work at speeds from 70 to 200 mph? Second, how do you support a low wing design where all the strength is in the fuselage, and then run straps along the fuselage of an aluminum aircraft. It's relatively easy for a composite aircraft, just form some strap channels and cover them with a layup of fiberglass. Third, weight considerations. A system for the RV would probably weigh in the 50 to 80 pound range. And would you be willing to give up space for the system. Fourth, but less of a concern to the BRS folks....cost. They are estimating a price of about $6,000 to $8,000 dollars. Insurance policy is the way I see it. Give them a call and let them know what you think. They are a smallish company and are driven largely by customer demand. Hope that helps, they're great folks. Bob Moser ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Subject: Re: Agle of incidence
Date: Aug 17, 2000
> IN measuring the angle of incidence on the wings, > what is the best way to do it; I tried with a piece > of wood, a la, triangle... is hard to get the 3-1/32 > and then one must cut off the small angle, to be > perpendicular to the wing no? > > Maybe I should use a piece or aluminum angle? > > Bert > rv6a Bert, I used a 48" carpenter's level. The forward part rested on the main spar, then I used a piece of .063 made into an "L" which I used a cleco side clamp to clamp onto the carpenter's level for the rear spar. The L was adjusted with the grinder to exactly the right length. Put your SmartLevel on top of the carpenter's level, rest the whole thing with the straight part of the L resting on the rear spar rivet line and the front part of the level on the main spar and voila, you have a trick leveling device. BTW, be sure and measure at several points along the spar and average the readings. Remember also that the wing walk doubler throws the measurements off so don't measure too far inboard. Randy Lervold RV-8, #80500, cowling www.rv-8.com Home Wing VAF ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Terry Watson" <tcwatson(at)seanet.com>
Subject: Panel Pilot
Date: Aug 17, 2000
I have to agree with Bill Shook's comments about Steve at Panel Pilot. I am one of those who has this great badge with my name and the type of RV I am building engraved on it, for free, from Steve. No cost, just as a service he gave to the RV list, at a significant cost to himself in time and effort. I had never been particularly interested in engraved panels, but I want to do business with the Panel Pilot, so I may well have one. I also run a one-man business. I know that sometimes no matter how much effort I put into it, someone is going to be unsatisfied sometime which what I have done or not done for them. My experience over many years has shown me that the best way to deal with that is to try to give superior service all the time. That means that most are satisfied with my work, and when they aren't, they tend to cut me some slack because they know that there was either a very good reason, or that it will get straightened out, or both. Those that get bent out of shape about it probably have a problem that has nothing to do with me or what I did for them. We all have our priorities. I am confident from what I know of Steve's service that either the word isn't getting to him, or something high priority is getting in the way of responding to the inquiries. I am quite sure he subscribes to the RV list, so he will get the word. I just want to be sure that when he reads the negative comments on the list, he understands that many of us are more than satisfied with his work, and hope to do business with him in the future. I wish him the best. Terry Watson RV-8A wings Seattle ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Subject: Re: Plane Chute
Why yes, actually. There is a gentleman who has a flying RV-8 near me that has incorporated the "Silver" brand chute with a lambs wool cover as the permanent seat back cushion of both is front and back seats. I plan on following suit. Please don't misunderstand my intention here. I'm sure that my RV is well built ( I know the builder well :-) I'm sure that it's safe. I just believe that it's better to have a back up plan for EVERY contingency than to be up there wishing that I had installed that fire suppression system ( yes I'm installing a halon system ) or brought along a chute and not have one. I don't want ANY regrets. - Jim RV-8A ( engine stuff ) O-360 ( N89JA ) pcondon(at)csc.com on 08/17/2000 03:17:45 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: RV-List: Plane Chute From your posting I gather you plan to wear a 'chute all the time ? Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com@matronics.com on 08/17/2000 03:36:17 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com cc: Subject: RV-List: Plane Chute Dose anyone have any knowledge of any RV builder that has installed a Ballistic Recovery System in their RV??? Like the ones advertised in Aircraft Spruce. A builder's wife brought up the fact that an RV-8 might not be a safe place for the kiddies, so I was wondering if this is a viable alternative or not. My wife really warmed up to the idea when she understood what it meant. "You mean that I won't have to bail out if some catastrophic air frame failure occurs?" As remote a possibility as this is... I rather like the idea of having a personal parachute ride down to safety but my wife finds this so inconvenient :-) - Jim RV-8A ( engine stuff ) 0-360 (N89JA) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ed Bundy" <ebundy(at)micron.net>
Subject: Re: Plane Chute
Date: Aug 17, 2000
These are all valid concerns. I used to have a 2 seat ultralight that I used for instruction. The BRS made some of the students (primarily some of the student's *wives*) more comfortable. Bear in mind also that there is also a significant weight penalty involved. My ultralight's gross weight was about 700lbs. The BRS required for that weight with a maximum deployment speed of 70mph weighed around 15lbs including mounting hardware. It also costs (today) around $2000 This was for an airframe that was already designed for a parachute and needed no structural modifications. I would hazard a guess that a BRS sized for a 2 place RV and with a speed rating high enough to do any good would weigh around 30-40 pounds, and cost a small wad of cash. Maybe another 10-20lbs for airframe beef-up. That would shave off most of your baggage compartment utility. IIRC, the Cirrus installation added about 60lbs to the airframe. Safety is a good thing, but personally, I don't think a proven design like an RV really benefits from a ballistic chute, especially in light of the weight and cost penalty. Ed Bundy - Eagle, ID RV6A, 0320-D1a (160hp) Sensenich 70x78, N427EM, 350+hrs. ebundy(at)micron.net > > Dose anyone have any knowledge of any RV builder that has installed a Ballistic > > Recovery System in their RV??? Like the ones advertised in Aircraft Spruce. > - The parachute does not guarantee a soft touchdown -- just something > less than terminal velocity. > > - Pretty much all serious airplane accidents happen on takeoff or landing > (if your engine quits at altitude, you deadstick onto a field or a > road). Thus, in the vast majority of potential airplane accidents, the > brs does you no good -- there's no time or opportunity to deploy it. > The BRS seemed neat to me, but only until I read the article. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: lm4(at)juno.com
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Subject: Re: Fuel cap etching
Bob, Their talking about having their fuel caps machine engraved with "100 low lead" or "100 octane only" or their iniatials,etc.etc. Larry Mac Donald Rochester N.Y. > > someone help this dumb a.... hillbilly. explain etch for fuel caps. > thanx bob > in arkansas-doing wings. > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rob Reece" <ReeceRV3(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: RV3-List: RV-3 N993FL SN 488 finally flies
Date: Aug 17, 2000
!!!!!!!!CONGRATULATIONS FINN!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please keep up the posting as you continue to expand your flight envelope. I think there may be interest in hearing more about your experiences with alternative powerplant applications! RV-3's forever!!! Rob Reece ----- Original Message ----- From: "Finn Lassen" <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> ; Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 10:25 PM Subject: RV3-List: RV-3 N993FL SN 488 finally flies > --> RV3-List message posted by: Finn Lassen > > This bird was started by Charlie Dorris of Richardson, TX in July 1977! > I picked it up in January 1996. And it finally flew this evening! 23 > years old before allowed to fly! > > This official first flight was just a very quick flight around a tight > pattern, although I reached 1200' and 120 mph before catching it. > Successful landing by a beginner's standard, just a bounce or two. > > This first flight was preceded by several high speed taxi runs, the last > of which was really a low flight just above the runway. After more than > 4 hours in a Decathlon over the past week, the RV-3 felt quite > different, in spite of the many hours of taxiing it previously. Unless > you have a new engine that needs full power run-in, I'm a strong > advocate for taxi runs prior to first flight. If you can't control it > during high speed taxiing, how can you hope to control it during your > first landing? > > I guess an experienced test pilot would describe the flight as > "uneventful". > > Interestingly, most of my attention was on the engine (experimental 13B > Mazda Mikuni carburated rotary installation, with a Ross 2.17-1 > re-drive, swinging a Performance Prop's 68x74 prop - pitched towards > cruise) during climb to pattern altitude. I have not yet installed the > cowl cheek extensions. A good deal of heat comes out that way (left side > is where the muffler/exhaust is). This made the side skin where my hand > rests on the throttle(s) noticeably hot to the point where I had to peek > over the side to make sure it wasn't on fire (again), and made me decide > to tighten the pattern. > > I'd be hard pressed to give any hard numbers. I'm not sure if I applied > full throttle (I have static run-up prop flutter at 4500 RPM, so > intended to limit RPM to below that). I think max RPM was somewhere > between 4200 and 4700. Temperatures were not a problem. even on this 92F > day. Highest oil temperature I noticed was 198F and water probably 190F. > > Yes, this bird does pick up speed easily, so after reducing speed to 100 > mph, I applied one notch of flaps, making a marked pitch change, but > easily corrected with a flick of the trim tab switch. > > I did notice what I perceived as engine roughness or surging when I > reduced power (~2700 RPM) and pointed the nose down a bit - possibly a > re-drive phenomena (didn't apply carb heat, so could also have been > that). > > Didn't have "time" to look at EGT and mixture (oxygen sensor readout) > numbers. > > More later for those who may be interested. > > Finn > > > Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Rob Reece" <ReeceRV3(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: RV3-List: RV-3 N993FL SN 488 finally flies
Date: Aug 17, 2000
!!!!!!!!CONGRATULATIONS FINN!!!!!!!!!!! Please keep up the posting as you continue to expand your flight envelope. I think there may be interest in hearing more about your experiences with alternative powerplant applications! RV-3's forever!!! Rob Reece ----- Original Message ----- From: "Finn Lassen" <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> ; Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 10:25 PM Subject: RV3-List: RV-3 N993FL SN 488 finally flies > --> RV3-List message posted by: Finn Lassen > > This bird was started by Charlie Dorris of Richardson, TX in July 1977! > I picked it up in January 1996. And it finally flew this evening! 23 > years old before allowed to fly! > > This official first flight was just a very quick flight around a tight > pattern, although I reached 1200' and 120 mph before catching it. > Successful landing by a beginner's standard, just a bounce or two. > > This first flight was preceded by several high speed taxi runs, the last > of which was really a low flight just above the runway. After more than > 4 hours in a Decathlon over the past week, the RV-3 felt quite > different, in spite of the many hours of taxiing it previously. Unless > you have a new engine that needs full power run-in, I'm a strong > advocate for taxi runs prior to first flight. If you can't control it > during high speed taxiing, how can you hope to control it during your > first landing? > > I guess an experienced test pilot would describe the flight as > "uneventful". > > Interestingly, most of my attention was on the engine (experimental 13B > Mazda Mikuni carburated rotary installation, with a Ross 2.17-1 > re-drive, swinging a Performance Prop's 68x74 prop - pitched towards > cruise) during climb to pattern altitude. I have not yet installed the > cowl cheek extensions. A good deal of heat comes out that way (left side > is where the muffler/exhaust is). This made the side skin where my hand > rests on the throttle(s) noticeably hot to the point where I had to peek > over the side to make sure it wasn't on fire (again), and made me decide > to tighten the pattern. > > I'd be hard pressed to give any hard numbers. I'm not sure if I applied > full throttle (I have static run-up prop flutter at 4500 RPM, so > intended to limit RPM to below that). I think max RPM was somewhere > between 4200 and 4700. Temperatures were not a problem. even on this 92F > day. Highest oil temperature I noticed was 198F and water probably 190F. > > Yes, this bird does pick up speed easily, so after reducing speed to 100 > mph, I applied one notch of flaps, making a marked pitch change, but > easily corrected with a flick of the trim tab switch. > > I did notice what I perceived as engine roughness or surging when I > reduced power (~2700 RPM) and pointed the nose down a bit - possibly a > re-drive phenomena (didn't apply carb heat, so could also have been > that). > > Didn't have "time" to look at EGT and mixture (oxygen sensor readout) > numbers. > > More later for those who may be interested. > > Finn > > > Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: PANELCUT(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Subject: Apology to Ken and the List
Listers This is the last response I will make. I have jumped the gun on this subject and owe this list an apology and Ken Balch as well. I have had a heck of a time doing these badges and trying to keep them straight. I do not expect everyone to understand and let it get to me. The thing that has gotten to me the most was Ken's last email displaying my letter to him. I was angry and should have never sent it I am truly sorry and please except it. I have to learn to let things roll off my back, I can't expect someone to have respect for me if I can't do the same for them. I will try in the future to not jump so fast and to let it GO. Thanks Steve Davis ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Robert Greener" <rgreener(at)micron.net>
Subject: RE: RV3-List: RV-3 N993FL SN 488 finally flies
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Hello Finn, Congratulations on the first flight of your 3. Wish mine was ready to fly - I'll just have to work harder. Glad everything went OK. Regards. Rob (RV-3B N418RL Reserved)) rgreener(at)micron.net ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Plane Chute
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Hey man, don't sweat it. If you ever regret not having that chute with you....you won't be regretting it for very long. :-) Bill I love to skydive almost as much as I love to fly.....but both in one flight I don't want. ----- Original Message ----- From: <Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com> Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2000 5:42 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: Plane Chute > > > Why yes, actually. > > There is a gentleman who has a flying RV-8 near me that has incorporated the > "Silver" brand chute with a lambs wool cover as the permanent seat back cushion > of both is front and back seats. I plan on following suit. > > Please don't misunderstand my intention here. I'm sure that my RV is well built > ( I know the builder well :-) I'm sure that it's safe. I just believe that > it's better to have a back up plan for EVERY contingency than to be up there > wishing that I had installed that fire suppression system ( yes I'm installing a > halon system ) or brought along a chute and not have one. I don't want ANY > regrets. > > - Jim > RV-8A ( engine stuff ) > O-360 ( N89JA ) > > > pcondon(at)csc.com on 08/17/2000 03:17:45 PM > > Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Plane Chute > > > From your posting I gather you plan to wear a 'chute all the time ? > > > Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com@matronics.com on 08/17/2000 03:36:17 PM > > Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com > > Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com > > > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > cc: > > Subject: RV-List: Plane Chute > > > Dose anyone have any knowledge of any RV builder that has installed a > Ballistic > Recovery System in their RV??? Like the ones advertised in Aircraft > Spruce. > > A builder's wife brought up the fact that an RV-8 might not be a safe place > for > the kiddies, so I was wondering if this is a viable alternative or not. My > wife > really warmed up to the idea when she understood what it meant. "You mean > that > I won't have to bail out if some catastrophic air frame failure occurs?" > > As remote a possibility as this is... I rather like the idea of having a > personal parachute ride down to safety but my wife finds this so > inconvenient > :-) > > - Jim > RV-8A ( engine stuff ) > 0-360 (N89JA) > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: To all List Members!!!
Date: Aug 17, 2000
The only thing I would add to this fascinating discussion is that something done for FREE is not a service, it's a gift. Brings to mind a saying my dear old grand pappy used to say about a gift horse and it's mouth. Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ken Balch" <kbalch1(at)mediaone.net> Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2000 5:20 PM Subject: Re: RV-List: To all List Members!!! > > Listers, > > It seems that Steve has decided to compound the poor service I received by making > false assertions in public about the number of emails from me that went > unanswered by him. I never made any claim to have paid him for any goods or > services whatsoever. He sent me a private email almost an hour ago containing > these same assertions, as well as an unkind personal remark, and my response went > out to him approximately half an hour ago. Perhaps he hasn't received it yet. > Since he's chosen to call me a liar in public, I feel perfectly free to publish > his email to me and my response to him here. > > --------------------------------------------------- > > Steve, > > I can appreciate that you have no control over the US Mail. I can certainly > sympathize with this, as can we all. I look forward to receiving the badge. > > My original emails to you were indeed regarding the possibility of your doing my > panel. You were recommended to me by Paul Besing. When I got no response to the > > first email, I sent the second. These date back to late last year or very early > this year. I've since changed my email service and my copies of earlier emails > have, unfortunately, been purged. I also sent at least one email requesting > information about having my fuel caps added to the last run and received no reply > > to that message either. I can understand that you don't receive all emails > addressed to you (what service provider is perfect, after all), but find it a > little hard to believe that all of my emails fell through the proverbial cracks. > > As far as handling things like a 'man', there's nothing to handle. As far as I > was concerned, I wasn't looking for a response from you. I was willing (and > fully expecting) to just let the whole thing drop entirely, since all I'd > actually invested was one set of round-trip postage. When I saw the message on > the list this morning, I decided to simply post my experience as a counterpoint > to the rest. I don't find anything unmanly or even confrontational/contentious > about that. If you do, get over it. One person's perfectly civil commentary on > the service he feels he's received (or not) is not a personal attack. It's just > one more opinion added to the rest. I have no problem with you personally, as > we've never met or even spoken (to the best of my recollection), so unkind > personal remarks on your part are uncalled for and do not speak well of you. > > As far as your getting out of the name badge business, that's certainly up to > you, but I believe that it's a valuable service unanimously appreciated by all > who've received the badges, as well as those of us still eagerly anticipating the > > arrival of ours. I'm sorry for any part I may have inadvertently played in > generating any ill will. > > With no hard feelings... > > Best Regards, > Ken Balch > > PANELCUT(at)aol.com wrote: > > > Ken > > > > I sent the badge out via US Mail. I have no control over their service. I > > have only received TWO emails from you in response to the badge and responded > > both times. > > I will take care of this BADGE but give me a little slack I have NO CONTROL > > over the postal service. I was on vacation for a week took a little time to > > go to Oshkosh so I might have missed a few but I can only respond to what I > > receive and I try to do that, sometimes I do not get all my emails but have > > no control over that as well. Sorry your so damm unhappy with my services, > > the damm badges were free but thanks to you I will give that up as well. > > Somebody on the list told me I should have charged for them but I thought I > > was doing the list members a favor. Another thing you have never asked me > > about a PANEL the only thing we have ever discussed was the badge. Next time > > handle it like a man and let me know if there is a problem, don't get on a > > public forum to get a response. > > > > Steve Davis > > The Panel Pilot > > -------------------------------------------- > > I sincerely hope that this will be the end of this minor debacle. I have no hard > feelings toward anyone, however deserved they may be at this point. In the > future, I'll keep my opinions to myself, however valuable they may be to other > builders. > > -- > Regards, > Ken Balch > Ashland, MA > RV-8 #81125 N118KB (reserved) > cockpit stuff > > > PANELCUT(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > > > > Listers > > > > I have just read an email that was left on this forum about MY SERVICES. As > > everyone knows, I was doing the BADGES for the members to have a way for all > > of us to meet and know each other at events. I apparently did something wrong > > according to one member. I have no control over the mail service. I will > > finish the badges I have in house and take care of the one that didn't > > arrive, but feel I have to quit. I didn't deserve the remarks that were made > > about me. I try to respond to every email but some fall through the cracks. > > I'm human! .This person has only contacted me twice and I responded both > > times, as far as services go everything he has gotten or not gotten was FREE. > > > > Steve Davis > > The Panel Pilot > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "EXT-Richard, Emmanuelle J" <Emmanuelle.Richard(at)PSS.Boeing.com>
Subject: Plane Chute
Date: Aug 17, 2000
I *vaguely* remember so beware. Maybe worth your time to do some research on this company - now you know it is out there somewhere. About 5 months ago, meet a couple people in Van Nuys, CA involved in a company developping recovery chutes. Don't remember their names. They said they were working with a russian company who was prime in research, development and manufacturing of parachutes type recovery systems for russian military jets and x-planes for many many years. Their idea was to use this proven technology and expertise for the GA market. As far as performance, it seemed very attractive: chute usable throughout the flight envelope (speed, altitude, attitude), system was something like 3-5% of the aircraft weight, around the $10 000 area, some sort of pyrotechnic extration device, reliability 100%. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2000
From: Ken Balch <kbalch1(at)mediaone.net>
Subject: Re: Apology to Ken and the List
Gladly and gratefully accepted. I'm sure we've all done and said things when angry that we wish we could take back later. I know that I have and that email just makes it that much easier to do so. Your public apology shows real class, at least in my book. Best Regards, Ken PANELCUT(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > Listers > > This is the last response I will make. I have jumped the gun on this > subject and owe this list an apology and Ken Balch as well. I have had a heck > of a time doing these badges and trying to keep them straight. I do not > expect everyone to understand and let it get to me. The thing that has gotten > to me the most was Ken's last email displaying my letter to him. I was angry > and should have never sent it I am truly sorry and please except it. I have > to learn to let things roll off my back, I can't expect someone to have > respect for me if I can't do the same for them. I will try in the future to > not jump so fast and to let it GO. > > Thanks > Steve Davis ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2000
From: EARL FORTNER <e.fortner(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Apology to Ken and the List
Well said. I think it's only human to jump the gun sometimes. I stand with you Earl RV-4 PANELCUT(at)AOL.COM wrote: > > > Listers > > This is the last response I will make. I have jumped the gun on this > subject and owe this list an apology and Ken Balch as well. I have had a heck > of a time doing these badges and trying to keep them straight. I do not > expect everyone to understand and let it get to me. The thing that has gotten > to me the most was Ken's last email displaying my letter to him. I was angry > and should have never sent it I am truly sorry and please except it. I have > to learn to let things roll off my back, I can't expect someone to have > respect for me if I can't do the same for them. I will try in the future to > not jump so fast and to let it GO. > > Thanks > Steve Davis > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "skybolt-aviator" <skybolt-aviator(at)email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: To all List Members!!!
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Steve---I for one appreciate very much what you did and I,m sure the majority of the listers feel the same. Don,t let one or two get you down.Ollie&Lorene Washburn RV6-A,N795LW@FD77,300+Hrs. O-360,180HP,HartzellC/S ----- Original Message ----- From: <PANELCUT(at)AOL.COM> Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2000 4:51 PM Subject: RV-List: To all List Members!!! > > Listers > > I have just read an email that was left on this forum about MY SERVICES. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: clayfly(at)libertybay.com.Thu,
(EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id" <B0005065293@mail-2.lbay.net>; Thu, 17 Aug 2000 18:54:37.-0700(at)matronics.com
Subject: Taxi Test (long)
Date: Aug 17, 2000
Fellow Listers, Thought some of you might be interested in hearing about my first taxi test. It was lots of fun to release the brakes and taxi for the first time. Following are my observations: - My RV-4 has a light tail --- 42 lbs. at empty weight. This was pretty noticeable when I gave it a little throttle to turn it around at the end of the taxiway. Maybe it was my imagination, but I don't think so --- it felt like the tail got really light: Important safety tip, keep that stick back when goosing it. - My Skyforce III GPS was difficult to see in the sunlight with my sunglasses on. After the taxi test I tore into the panel and mounted the GPS at an angle so it tilts up directly at my face. This fixed the problem. - Still no vacuum on my indicator, but the one gyro I have (attitude indicator) spooled up and seemed to work. Hmmm. I've diddled with this problem for a week. Maybe I'll try adjusting the regulator's knob the other way this time. - My oil filter goobered all over the bottom of my airplane again. I've fiddled with this quite a bit. First I thought it was too loose, then too tight. So, I pulled it off and I'm trying another one. Unfortunately, I can't get a torque wrench in there to torque it to specs, so it's just a guess at how tight it must be. We'll see if I got it right with this second one. - I didn't hear a peep out of my radio. My home field is a quiet place, but I have yet to hear a thing. I'm really not looking forward to figuring that problem out. So, as with every other aspect of progress on this project, I continue to have plenty of challenges to keep me busy. Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, waiting for an inspection Indiana ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2000
From: Charlie and Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com>
Subject: Re: Plane Chute
"EXT-Richard, Emmanuelle J" wrote: > > > I *vaguely* remember so beware. Maybe worth your time to do some research on this company - now you know it is out there somewhere. > > About 5 months ago, meet a couple people in Van Nuys, CA involved in a company developping recovery chutes. Don't remember their names. They said they were working with a russian company who was prime in research, development and manufacturing of parachutes type recovery systems for russian military jets and x-planes for many many years. Their idea was to use this proven technology and expertise for the GA market. As far as performance, it seemed very attractive: chute usable throughout the flight envelope (speed, altitude, attitude), system was something like 3-5% of the aircraft weight, around the $10 000 area, some sort of pyrotechnic extration device, reliability 100%. > Haven't heard this, but an aero engineer friend with a Yak 52 told me that they are working on a G.A. EJECTION SEAT for about that price. Charlie ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Gary & Tena Strong" <gstrong(at)uswest.net>
Subject: F-633 Control Column mount
Date: Aug 17, 2000
I'm installing the F-633 control column mounts, but I'm a little confused in looking at the drawing and the tape. It says to put them in place against bulkhead F-604, clamp and then drill the holes but doesn't give any specific measurements on how to locate the mount. Drawing 47 shows approx. measurements, but I'm confused on what is the proper way to do this. Is there a measurement that I should check it side against? Is this just not critical and as long as I align to Drawing 47 approx. measurements (5/8" from top and 1/2" from flange side via eyeball estimate) and everything will be ok? help!! I checked the archives and couldn't find an answer. -- Gary S. RV6AQB - fuselage ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Ed Bundy" <ebundy(at)micron.net>
Subject: Re: Taxi Test (long)
Date: Aug 17, 2000
I can't get a wrench on mine either. Before I installed the engine I torqued the filter and found that it went from 15/16 - 1 turn to reach torque from the point that the gasket first touched the plate. It may not be very scientific, but it should get you in the ballpark. Ed Bundy - Eagle, ID RV6A, 0320-D1a (160hp) Sensenich 70x78, N427EM, 350+hrs. ebundy(at)micron.net > - My oil filter goobered all over the bottom of my airplane again. I've fiddled with this quite a > bit. First I thought it was too loose, then too tight. So, I pulled it off and I'm trying another > one. Unfortunately, I can't get a torque wrench in there to torque it to specs, so it's just a > guess at how tight it must be. We'll see if I got it right with this second one. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 17, 2000
From: meketa <acgm(at)gvtc.com>
Subject: Re: To all List Members!!!
Hello Yall I had Steve cut my RV-8 panel and am very happy with the quality of the work and the price. I can not imagine the time it would of taken to do the same thing by hand. I am expecting the first editions of my custom armrest overlays tomorrow or maybe Monday. It will likely take one more clear set before the final cutting. This type of work takes a lot of time to do right. Steve has a real job to support himself and the equipment. When he gets busy at work it sometimes takes the priority that it should. When I get no return call I know he is busy and just call back in a couple of days. Steve enjoys doing the panels for people and takes great pride in his work. Please, let's not remove the fun and run him off like the other talented people who have quit the list. Thanks Steve. George Meketa RV-8 \ oil cooler and control cables ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HCRV6(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: Re: F-633 Control Column mount
In a message dated 8/17/00 9:31:00 PM Pacific Daylight Time, gstrong(at)uswest.net writes: << I'm installing the F-633 control column mounts, but I'm a little confused in looking at the drawing and the tape. >> Gary: This had me a little confused also so what I did was to assemble the mounts with the control stick torque tube and then clamped the assembly in place against F-604. Locate the mounts by shifting as required so that each mount will be secured with a vertical pair of -10 bolts through holes that are predrilled in F-604 for the wing spar attach bolts. You can adjust the position of the mounts slightly in or out by using a different number of washers as spacers on each side. Use the plan dimensions as your guide to get the assembly located in approximately the right spot. This seemed to work for me but I'm a long ways from flying yet and for darn sure no expert. Harry Crosby Pleasanton, California RV-6, working on canopy installation ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: alternators
Date: Aug 17, 2000
I second the plug for B&C alternator. And solid state regulator. These are expensive but very high quality. No mucking around with disabling internal regulators or finding brackets that work either. The regulator includes overvoltage protection too, so you just bolt on and go. Very nice. Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~130 hrs) Portland, OR http://www.edt.com/homewing ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Grking3(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: F-805EPP ?
I can't find my F-805EPP's. Does anyone remember if they came in one of the bags, or in the big box of parts (quickbuild) ? They are the two little hangers for the rudder cables under the floorboards. I can't find them on the inventory sheet. I would just make some new ones, but I am not sure how much spare scrap .063 I have and I don't want to start hacking holes in my instrument panel (to get scrap.063) just yet :). Thanks, Greg King RV-8 QB looking for elusive parts ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
From: Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca>
Subject: Re: F-805EPP ?
> >I can't find my F-805EPP's. Does anyone remember if they came in one of the >bags, or in the big box of parts (quickbuild) ? They are the two little >hangers for the rudder cables under the floorboards. I can't find them on >the inventory sheet. I would just make some new ones, but I am not sure how >much spare scrap .063 I have and I don't want to start hacking holes in my >instrument panel (to get scrap.063) just yet :). > >Thanks, >Greg King Greg, On my slowbuild, they came in one of the bags. -- Kevin Horton RV-8 (cockpit stuff) Ottawa, Canada http://members.xoom.com/kevinhorton/rv8.html ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Jerry Carter" <jcarter8(at)midsouth.rr.com>
Subject: Re: F-805EPP ?
Date: Aug 18, 2000
> > I can't find my F-805EPP's. Does anyone remember if they came in one of the > bags, or in the big box of parts (quickbuild) ? They are the two little > hangers for the rudder cables under the floorboards. I can't find them on > the inventory sheet. I would just make some new ones, but I am not sure how > much spare scrap .063 I have and I don't want to start hacking holes in my > instrument panel (to get scrap.063) just yet :). > Greg.... Now that you mention it, they did not send them to me either. As I recall, I got two of them from a friend, to whom Van's had sent a number of extra ones! I think that I would just ask Vans to send them to you. If you make them, just use a small piece of straight stock from the kit - you can always replace a small piece of .063 later. Jerry Carter Memphis, TN Drilling the canopy in 102 degree heat :>( My RV-8A website: http://rv8asite.homestead.com/mainpage.html ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
From: Carroll Bird <catbird(at)taylorelectric.com>
Subject: Re: electronic ignition questions
Bob Japundza wrote: > > Listers, > > > 1. Which plugs are you running the electronic ignition on? I run mine on the bottom like Jeff Rose suggests. > > 2. What plugs are you using on the electronic ignition? I talked to Jeff about this by phone. At that time he suggested the REM 37BY Champion plugs. > > 3. Anyone running autogas with electronic ignition? > Can't help you with this one I use 100LL > > 4. Does the electronic ignition make your engine run noticeably > smoother? > I think that it runs smoother at idle. However I have never run the engine without the electronic ignition. > > 5. How much of a reduction in fuel consumption do you typically see? > At altitude I run 2400 RPM and burn 7.5 GPH At that RPM I cruise at 153 K. > Hope this helps. Carroll Bird, Buffalo Gap, TX RV-4 114 hours. > - ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Lenleg(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: Re: To all List Members!!!
You know this is the type of crap that makes me want to drop off this list. Here is a guy that is doing a great service to the list only to be flamed. I very much appreciate the badges from Steve and at Oshkosh I met several people from the list just because of the badge. Thanks Steve for my badge and I look forward to working with you on my panel !! Len, RV-8A (N901LL) Fuselage North Carolina ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
From: Larry Bowen <lcbowen(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: M2 electronic compass
FYI - For those of you who were waiting for the arrival of the black-faced M2 electronic compass from Ritchie, it looks like they have changed their mind and are not going to produce it. Below is my correspondence with Ritchie. Larry Bowen RV-8 fuse...slowly --- Jonathan Sherman wrote: > Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 15:21:12 -0400 > From: Jonathan Sherman <Jon.Sherman(at)Ritchienavigation.com> > To: Larry(at)BowenAero.com > Subject: Re: M2 > > Larry, > > I'm sorry to say I have some bad news for you. Some circumstances arose > that prevented us from creating the M-Series with a black dial. Sorry > about that. I wish we could have done it. > > Jon > > Larry Bowen wrote: > > > Jon - > > > > How is the progress on the black-faced M-2? I'd like to get one if it's > > available. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Larry Bowen > > Email: Larry(at)BowenAero.com > > Web: http://BowenAero.com > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Jonathan Sherman [mailto:Jon.Sherman(at)Ritchienavigation.com] > > > Sent: Friday, March 24, 2000 4:35 PM > > > To: Larry Bowen > > > Subject: Re: M2 > > > > > > > > > Dear Larry, > > > > > > The M-2 is not yet available in black but we plan to have it > > > out in about 2 > > > months. West Marine should have it when we come out with it. > > > You can either > > > check with them or with me as to when you can get it. > > > > > > Jon Sherman > > > > > > Larry Bowen wrote: > > > > > > > I like the M2, but want a black card, not a blue one. Does it > > > exist? Where > > > > can I get it? > > > > > > > > Thx, > > > > > > > > Larry Bowen > > > > Larry(at)BowenAero.com > > > > http://BowenAero.com Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
From: "jah" <jah(at)abraxis.com>
Subject: Re: F-805EPP ?
I'm doing a slow build -8 and mine where in a zip lock type bag with other small pre-cut parts like the inspection covers for the fuselage tail etc. -Jeff ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Grking3(at)AOL.COM Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2000 02:34:56 EDT > >I can't find my F-805EPP's. Does anyone remember if they came in one of the >bags, or in the big box of parts (quickbuild) ? They are the two little >hangers for the rudder cables under the floorboards. I can't find them on >the inventory sheet. I would just make some new ones, but I am not sure how >much spare scrap .063 I have and I don't want to start hacking holes in my >instrument panel (to get scrap.063) just yet :). > >Thanks, >Greg King >RV-8 QB >looking for elusive parts > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Boalty(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: Gretz servo kit mount
Just looking for a little confirmation before I drill some holes. I'm working on the Gretz-Aero elevator trim kit for my RV-4. Looks to me like the only way to fit it is to run the cable through the aft most lightening hole in the elev. web, resulting in the cable/servo crossing the rear deck at a 45 degree angle. This obviously puts a good bend in the cable, but it seems to actuate freely nonetheless. So- who's done it, and how?..... Bruce Hukari RV-4 finishing forever ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: Re: Flaring tool
Bert, I bought one at eagle hardware for $12, works great on alum. tubing. Kevin closing wings ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Subject: Re: RV-3 First Flight Report
Date: Aug 18, 2000
08/18/2000 10:00:25 AM ReeceRV3(at)email.msn.com on 08/17/2000 06:45:28 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: RV-List: Re: RV3-List: RV-3 N993FL SN 488 finally flies !!!!!!!!CONGRATULATIONS FINN!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please keep up the posting as you continue to expand your flight envelope. I think there may be interest in hearing more about your experiences with alternative powerplant applications! RV-3's forever!!! Rob Reece ----- Original Message ----- From: "Finn Lassen" <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> ; Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 10:25 PM Subject: RV3-List: RV-3 N993FL SN 488 finally flies > --> RV3-List message posted by: Finn Lassen > > This bird was started by Charlie Dorris of Richardson, TX in July 1977! > I picked it up in January 1996. And it finally flew this evening! 23 > years old before allowed to fly! > > This official first flight was just a very quick flight around a tight > pattern, although I reached 1200' and 120 mph before catching it. > Successful landing by a beginner's standard, just a bounce or two. > > This first flight was preceded by several high speed taxi runs, the last > of which was really a low flight just above the runway. After more than > 4 hours in a Decathlon over the past week, the RV-3 felt quite > different, in spite of the many hours of taxiing it previously. Unless > you have a new engine that needs full power run-in, I'm a strong > advocate for taxi runs prior to first flight. If you can't control it > during high speed taxiing, how can you hope to control it during your > first landing? > > I guess an experienced test pilot would describe the flight as > "uneventful". > > Interestingly, most of my attention was on the engine (experimental 13B > Mazda Mikuni carburated rotary installation, with a Ross 2.17-1 > re-drive, swinging a Performance Prop's 68x74 prop - pitched towards > cruise) during climb to pattern altitude. I have not yet installed the > cowl cheek extensions. A good deal of heat comes out that way (left side > is where the muffler/exhaust is). This made the side skin where my hand > rests on the throttle(s) noticeably hot to the point where I had to peek > over the side to make sure it wasn't on fire (again), and made me decide > to tighten the pattern. > > I'd be hard pressed to give any hard numbers. I'm not sure if I applied > full throttle (I have static run-up prop flutter at 4500 RPM, so > intended to limit RPM to below that). I think max RPM was somewhere > between 4200 and 4700. Temperatures were not a problem. even on this 92F > day. Highest oil temperature I noticed was 198F and water probably 190F. > > Yes, this bird does pick up speed easily, so after reducing speed to 100 > mph, I applied one notch of flaps, making a marked pitch change, but > easily corrected with a flick of the trim tab switch. > > I did notice what I perceived as engine roughness or surging when I > reduced power (~2700 RPM) and pointed the nose down a bit - possibly a > re-drive phenomena (didn't apply carb heat, so could also have been > that). > > Didn't have "time" to look at EGT and mixture (oxygen sensor readout) > numbers. > > More later for those who may be interested. > > Finn > > > Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633 > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV-3 N993FL SN 488 finally flies
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Finn, CONGRATULATIONS !! & WELL DONE !! Chuck & Dave Rowbotham (almost ready to mount wings) Nianitic, CT >From: Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com >To: rv3-list(at)matronics.com, Tracy Crook , Paul >, info(at)vansaircraft.com >Subject: RV-List: RV-3 N993FL SN 488 finally flies >Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 23:25:36 -0400 > > >This bird was started by Charlie Dorris of Richardson, TX in July 1977! >I picked it up in January 1996. And it finally flew this evening! 23 >years old before allowed to fly! > >This official first flight was just a very quick flight around a tight >pattern, although I reached 1200' and 120 mph before catching it. >Successful landing by a beginner's standard, just a bounce or two. > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Subject: Re: Oil Filter -Torque Problems
Date: Aug 18, 2000
08/18/2000 10:44:16 AM Repost for future e-searching ebundy(at)micron.net on 08/17/2000 11:56:16 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Subject: Re: RV-List: Taxi Test (long) I can't get a wrench on mine either. Before I installed the engine I torqued the filter and found that it went from 15/16 - 1 turn to reach torque from the point that the gasket first touched the plate. It may not be very scientific, but it should get you in the ballpark. Ed Bundy - Eagle, ID RV6A, 0320-D1a (160hp) Sensenich 70x78, N427EM, 350+hrs. ebundy(at)micron.net > - My oil filter goobered all over the bottom of my airplane again. I've fiddled with this quite a > bit. First I thought it was too loose, then too tight. So, I pulled it off and I'm trying another > one. Unfortunately, I can't get a torque wrench in there to torque it to specs, so it's just a > guess at how tight it must be. We'll see if I got it right with this second one. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com>
Subject: Flaring tool
Date: Aug 18, 2000
a 37 degree flaring tool ???? For $12, you probably have a 45 degree standard type. Ed Cole > -----Original Message----- > From: Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM [SMTP:Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM] > Sent: Friday, August 18, 2000 7:30 AM > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com > Subject: Re: RV-List: Flaring tool > > > Bert, > I bought one at eagle hardware for $12, works great on alum. tubing. > Kevin > closing wings > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: Re: To all List Members!!!
well this is all very mind boggling to me, if I wanted to fan my desire to be argumentive it would be easier to just call one of my ex-wives. Lets get back to talking about building RVs . I had a little problem with oil canning in one of the bays in my left wing, and am working thru a solution. (I think) ANY SUGGESTIONS? Kevin -9A closing wings ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: Re: F-805EPP ?
Greg and all, I looked for three hours through every little brown bag until I was going crosseyed. I checked the parts list. I wasted an entire evening looking for that part. I was pissed. I called Van's the next day and talked to Tom. He told me that the "pp" on the part designation indicated that it was prepunched and should be in the bags, although he had no idea which bag. The long and the short of it was that I finally just made them myself. Since they are a prepunched part the dimensions are not on the drawing. Just measure the snap bushing that goes in the hole and use your unibit to cut the hole. The rest you can extrapolate by just measuring the drawing it's self. I think it's at half scale if my memory serves me right. The whole process took me 30 minutes. The one big point that I have learned on my one year of continuous building experience is..."Van's occasionally screws up. That's life, get over it, take up the slack and keep on trucking." It will all be worth it in the end. - Jim RV-8A quick ( engine stuff ) O-360 ( N89JA ) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com>
Subject: San Jose RV Forum
Date: Aug 18, 2000
To all listers within traveling distance... San Jose, CA's EAA Chapter 62 will be presenting it's 3rd annual RV Builders Forum on Thursday Sept 7th. Location will be at Reid Hill View Airport (RHV) in Vern Miller's Maintenance Hanger. Guest Speaker is Ken Krueger from Van's Aircraft. Ken will arrive in the new RV9 and will present a slide show on Van's new facility in Aurora, Or. as well as speaking about the RV9. Cleveland Tools, Avery Tools, and The Builders Bookstore have all contributed door prizes and catalogs. The prizes so far include hand tools, 18 Years of the RVator, and a Canopy Cover for the RV series aircraft. We will have aircraft on Display along with tool displays, and member's projects in various stages. The fun starts at 6:30 p.m. with the hot dog and hanger flying hour. The meeting will begin promptly at 7:30. If your interested in displaying your aircraft, or would like to participate in any manner, please contact me off-line For more details contact Ed Cole 408-530-6605 W 408-257-3281 H edwardmcole(at)home.com (home email address) Ed Cole Maxim Integrated Products Bldg. 120 Ext. 6605 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Troy Whistman <TroyW(at)digitalmd.com>
Subject: Baggage in the wing...
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Forgive what may be a stupid question... Is there any reason why someone could not build a baggage compartment into the wing? Say a hinged compartment providing a storage place between two ribs and the forward and rear spar? Or is it just the danger of losing the baggage compartment door and thus disrupting airflow? Troy Whistman P.S.--Not planning to do this!! Just wondering! Don't flame! :-) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Bob Waalkes" <waalkes(at)netnitco.net>
Subject: workshops
Date: Aug 18, 2000
I am interested in doing an RV workshop and I've seen one advertised by Sportair in Griffin, GA in October. Has anyone on the list done this workshop and found it worthy? I will need to travel across the country to attend and want to make sure the value is there. I've also heard rumors of a workshop in Maryland in April. Does anyone have info on that one? I would rather go there (closer - I live in Indiana). Thanks for the help. Bob Waalkes RV-8 Waiting on Emp. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Troy Whistman <TroyW(at)digitalmd.com>
Subject: Baggage in the wing...
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Forget it... I know why. Structural strength depends on the skin. Duh! I realized it right after I posted. -----Original Message----- From: Troy Whistman [mailto:TroyW(at)digitalmd.com] Sent: Friday, August 18, 2000 11:34 AM Subject: RV-List: Baggage in the wing... Forgive what may be a stupid question... Is there any reason why someone could not build a baggage compartment into the wing? Say a hinged compartment providing a storage place between two ribs and the forward and rear spar? Or is it just the danger of losing the baggage compartment door and thus disrupting airflow? Troy Whistman P.S.--Not planning to do this!! Just wondering! Don't flame! :-) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
Subject: Re: alternators
>> >> I understand the 30 app. is enough for almost >> any rv... > >30 amps may be a little small if you gots lots of toys and fly at night. >I would think a 40 amp unit would be enough for most RV's. A full up IFR load with EVERYTHING running is less than 30A . . . and if you're in a cloud, you don't run exterior lights AND pitot heat. Ergo, the maximum running load for full IFR or Nite/VFR is about 20 amps. A 30A machine would probably do you just fine . . . Bob . . . -------------------------------------------- ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) ( and still understand nothing. ) ( C.F. Kettering ) -------------------------------------------- http://www.aeroelectric.com ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
From: Bruce Gray <brucegray(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: alternators
If you're in a cloud night IFR and don't have your nav lights on the FAA will bust you. Now strobes is different matter. Pitot heat depends on the temperature. Bruce "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" wrote: > > >> > >> I understand the 30 app. is enough for almost > >> any rv... > > > >30 amps may be a little small if you gots lots of toys and fly at night. > >I would think a 40 amp unit would be enough for most RV's. > > A full up IFR load with EVERYTHING running is less than 30A . . . > and if you're in a cloud, you don't run exterior lights AND > pitot heat. Ergo, the maximum running load for full IFR or Nite/VFR is > about 20 amps. A 30A machine would probably do you just > fine . . . > > Bob . . . > -------------------------------------------- > ( Knowing about a thing is different than ) > ( understanding it. One can know a lot ) > ( and still understand nothing. ) > ( C.F. Kettering ) > -------------------------------------------- > http://www.aeroelectric.com > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: pcondon(at)csc.com
Subject: Baggage in the wing...
Date: Aug 18, 2000
08/18/2000 02:22:20 PM Lots of folks have placed baggage lockers in the wing tips. Lots of room there. Use a doubler and install a door about 10 by 18 inches and you have a great place to store junque. Check the archives. There was considerable talk about this in the past. I've seen many versions of the wing tip locker at the airshows.....Remember Phil's rule: Every little mod takes one month (on average) to complete and keeps you out of the air by a equal amount.....I shoulda listened to myself....... Troy Whistman (at)matronics.com on 08/18/2000 01:29:15 PM Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com cc: Subject: RE: RV-List: Baggage in the wing... Forget it... I know why. Structural strength depends on the skin. Duh! I realized it right after I posted. -----Original Message----- From: Troy Whistman [mailto:TroyW(at)digitalmd.com] Sent: Friday, August 18, 2000 11:34 AM Subject: RV-List: Baggage in the wing... Forgive what may be a stupid question... Is there any reason why someone could not build a baggage compartment into the wing? Say a hinged compartment providing a storage place between two ribs and the forward and rear spar? Or is it just the danger of losing the baggage compartment door and thus disrupting airflow? Troy Whistman P.S.--Not planning to do this!! Just wondering! Don't flame! :-) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Russ Werner" <russ(at)maui.net>
Subject: KMT-112 and KG-102A Remote Compass Installation
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Listers, Looking for anyone with information regarding the installation of a Remote Compass in an RV, specifically how they installed the KMT-112 in the wing. Aloha, Russ Werner Maui ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
From: Tim Lewis <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: alternators
>A full up IFR load with EVERYTHING running is less than >30A . . . >and if you're in a cloud, you don't run exterior lights AND >pitot heat. Ergo, the maximum running load for full IFR or >Nite/VFR is about 20 amps. A 30A machine would probably do you >just Depends on the avionics and lighting setup. My ammeter indicates in the 40+ Amp range with full load turned on, probably a bit more when the radio is transmitting (although I've not checked the ammeter to be sure). I fly with both landing lights on day or night when in the vicinity of the airport to increase my visibility to other traffic, and I run pitot heat when in or near the clouds, so 40+ amps current consumption on a day IMC approach is a likely scenario for my ship. Tim Lewis N47TD 103 Hours ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: F-633 Control Column mount
From: Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com>
Gary: I got old plans but I will try & help. Starting in drg 47 draw a line appr 5/8 from the Inside face on the f633, then draw your 2 horz line appo 6 3/16 (centered along the length), Now we got cross hairs on both of them. On the top view of drwg 40 ( which I think is right) shows the feet point in. the lower left side view that shows them pointing out I think is wrong. Now look at drwg 41 that shows from the center of the weldment to the edge of the ears of the F633 is 8 3/8's. If i havn't lost you by now, find the spar holes that will best fit all that & use them to backdrill the F633 at their cross-hairs. You will later use washers to fill in the fit of the weldment ears to the rod ends. I am confissed, I wrote this. Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com ********************************************** writes: > > > I'm installing the F-633 control column mounts, but I'm a little > confused in > looking at the drawing and the tape. It says to put them in place > against > bulkhead F-604, clamp and then drill the holes but doesn't give any > specific > measurements on how to locate the mount. Drawing 47 shows approx. > measurements, but I'm confused on what is the proper way to do this. > Is > there a measurement that I should check it side against? Is this > just not > critical and as long as I align to Drawing 47 approx. measurements > (5/8" > from top and 1/2" from flange side via eyeball estimate) and > everything will > be ok? help!! I checked the archives and couldn't find an answer. > > -- Gary S. RV6AQB - fuselage > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: Re: KMT-112 and KG-102A Remote Compass Installation
From: Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com>
I built a bracket just behind the f606 in the tail, up high away from the steel parts for the flux detector. The amp is up front on the left side. I havn't flown it yet so I don't know if I did good. Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com ********************************************** > > Listers, > > Looking for anyone with information regarding the installation of a > Remote > Compass in an RV, specifically how they installed the KMT-112 in the > wing. > > Aloha, > > Russ Werner > Maui > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
From: EARL FORTNER <e.fortner(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: workshops
If it's the eaa group in Fredrick, Md. putting it on go there. You will get more out of it and it will cost much less. The Sportair workshops that I have attended were very basic and would be great for a beginner but if you have built the stab already don't waste your money. Earl Bob Waalkes wrote: > > > I am interested in doing an RV workshop and I've seen one advertised by > Sportair in Griffin, GA in October. Has anyone on the list done this > workshop and found it worthy? I will need to travel across the country to > attend and want to make sure the value is there. I've also heard rumors of > a workshop in Maryland in April. Does anyone have info on that one? I > would rather go there (closer - I live in Indiana). Thanks for the help. > > Bob Waalkes > RV-8 Waiting on Emp. > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: HCRV6(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: -6 Canopy advice needed
I am trimming the canopy for my RV-6 and have reached a point that has me stymied. The canopy is down snug to the windshield frame and seems to be contacting the forward canopy frame pretty well also. The problem is that the canopy seems to be wider than the fuselage where the windshield comes around the lower corners. At the junction of the windshield and canopy it bulges out on both sides by almost two inches. When I press the lower corners of the windshield in to get anywhere near a close fit to the forward top skin at the lower corners, particularly on the left side, the rear of the canopy bulges out of shape. It looks like I will have to cut the windshield and canopy apart before I can start to drill and cleco point but I'm reluctant to do that until I hear what some of you guys who have been there and done that have to suggest. By the way, I just received my finish kit late last year so this must be one of the newer canopies. All suggestions will be appreciated. Harry Crosby Pleasanton, California RV-6, working on canopy installation ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 19, 2000
From: Frank and Dorothy <frankvdh(at)ihug.co.nz>
Subject: Re: F-633 Control Column mount
Gary & Tena Strong wrote: > I'm installing the F-633 control column mounts, but I'm a little confused in > looking at the drawing and the tape. It says to put them in place against > bulkhead F-604, clamp and then drill the holes but doesn't give any specific > measurements on how to locate the mount. Drawing 47 shows approx. > measurements, but I'm confused on what is the proper way to do this. Is > there a measurement that I should check it side against? Is this just not > critical and as long as I align to Drawing 47 approx. measurements (5/8" > from top and 1/2" from flange side via eyeball estimate) and everything will > be ok? help!! I checked the archives and couldn't find an answer. Gary, The important thing is that the mounts be exactly the right sitance apart as per the length of the hexagonal torque tube that connects the two sticks together. If the distance apart is wrong, your sticks won't be parallel. Don't ask me how I know this! Frank. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: AV8TURDON(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: Re: -6 Canopy advice needed
If this is a slider. I suggest you cut it to fit more realistically. I had the same problem with mine and the Factory said cut it and go on from there. So I picked the mid point between the windshield frame and the canopy roller and made the cut. Viola the canopy sat on the frame and then required final trimming around the outside to fit it. Some shimming was also used on the roll bar to make it seem as on piece again. Good Luck and go slow. Don RV-6 QB N767DC O-360...C/S 112 TAE ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
From: "Charles E. Brame" <charleyb(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: F633 Control column Mount
Gary, Boy, was your post timely. I just came in from my garage in a tizzy over the control column mounts. Been working on the damn things all day. Decided to peruse the RV-List and found your post. The plans leave a lot to be desired. First. Each mount flange goes outboard versus inboard as shown on DWG 40. Note #3 mentions that it is reversed! Second: I used the "1/2" approx" dimension shown on DWG 47 to postion and drill the 3/16" hole in the top of each mount. I then fastened the mounts on the bulkhead using a bolt through the top hole, made sure the mounts were aligned vertically and back drilled the 1/4" hole in the bottom of the mount. BUT - SOMETHING IS WRONG. When I installed the control column torque tube on the mounts, the tube hits the top inside of the ribs with only a small amount of stick forward rotation. My only conclusion is that the mounts are installed too high. The "approx 1/2" dimension should have been closer to 1/4" and I am not sure even then that the torque tube will clear the rib. I'm not sure what my next step will be. Wish I had connected the torque tube to the mounts before drilling to see what was required to have torque tube clearance. May order new mounts and redrill using the 1/4" dimension. May also have to cut out the ribs. May have to do both. Two small steps forward - one giant leap backwards. &%#@*& ~&%#! Charlie Brame RV-6A QB, On the gear San Antonio, TX > From: "Gary & Tena Strong" <gstrong(at)uswest.net> > Subject: RV-List: F-633 Control Column mount > > > I'm installing the F-633 control column mounts, but I'm a little confused in > looking at the drawing and the tape. It says to put them in place against > bulkhead F-604, clamp and then drill the holes but doesn't give any specific > measurements on how to locate the mount. Drawing 47 shows approx. > measurements, but I'm confused on what is the proper way to do this. Is > there a measurement that I should check it side against? Is this just not > critical and as long as I align to Drawing 47 approx. measurements (5/8" > from top and 1/2" from flange side via eyeball estimate) and everything will > be ok? help!! I checked the archives and couldn't find an answer. > > -- Gary S. RV6AQB - fuselage ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DLCousins(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: Sourcerv.com
Has anyone else had trouble logging on to the website SourceRV.com? I've been gone for a month and when I tried to access the logon screen, I received a screen that said access was Forbidden. When I tried to email the site, my email was returned. Thanks. DLCousins(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: Baggage in the wing...
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Why not? You are building an experimental airplane. Just remember that mod like this take a lot of time - you may want to do it once you are flying. I am putting a camera in the right wing, cutting a hole in the lower skin etc. Lotsa work. My hangar mate is a retired UAL sheet metal mechanic, a master! He told me that I should put a 'ring' all the way around the opening using material at least as heavy as the skin. If the ring is not all one piece, it should be jointed between corners, not at the corners. The corners are the most stressed and must have continuous reinforcement. I have seen many reinforcements on RVs that are not continous at the corners and hence, nearly useless. If yours are like that, go back and add a corner reinforcement. You can get them at your hardware store but you might do better to make them of 2024T3. Hal Kempthorne RV6a N7HK ----- Original Message ----- From: Troy Whistman <TroyW(at)digitalmd.com> Sent: Friday, August 18, 2000 9:34 AM Subject: RV-List: Baggage in the wing... > > Forgive what may be a stupid question... > > Is there any reason why someone could not build a baggage compartment into > the wing? Say a hinged compartment providing a storage place between two > ribs and the forward and rear spar? > > Or is it just the danger of losing the baggage compartment door and thus > disrupting airflow? > > Troy Whistman > > P.S.--Not planning to do this!! Just wondering! Don't flame! :-) > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Grking3(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: F-805EPP ?--Thanks
Thanks for all the help. I have my custom F-805's primed and installed. They took a lot less time to build then they took to look for :) do not archive Thanks again, Greg King RV-8 QB (Fuselage floor) ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: alternators
Date: Aug 18, 2000
> If you're in a cloud night IFR and don't have your nav lights on the FAA will bust you. FAR number violated please? Are you the Administrator? I believe that, as PIC, I have the right to turn off position lites (if that is what you ean by 'nav lites') if they disturb me. Hal Kempthorne 2578 Elliot Court Santa Clara, CA 95051-1849 408.244.4984 CELL 408.230.0891 RV6a N7HK 99% 1965 Debonair for sale! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Ski2001a(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: RV-8 Spar mounting holes
List, I need help with a few dimensions ASAP. I am making up the spar stubs that mount into the fuselage (RV-8) that act as spacers for the spar during construction. I need the measurements between the mounting holes between the 1/4 inch holes and the 7/16 holes in order to fabricate the spacers. I am currently a couple of hours away from my project but have access to a bridgeport and material and need the dimentions to fabricate the parts before I head back in the morning. If someone could measure up their spar with a vernier caliper and send me the center dimensions or even the web dimensions between the holes I can make the spacers in the AM. Help!! Tom Clark 800525 Ski2001a(at)aol.com ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: -6 Canopy advice needed
Date: Aug 18, 2000
I wonder which canopy is under construction here?????? Assume slider. In any case, don't start hacking plexi till the metal fits and operates perfectly. Imagine that the glass is so clean it is invisible and you can almost see it with just the metal parts working - sliding, tipping, locking etc. Then, set the plexi on and eyeball it to the best possible position. You might want to do wingtips, cowl, fairings etc first to develop a feel for "nailing jelly to a tree" which I believe is an art. You can even taxi without the plexi, you know. You could do it just before you fly. You can not begin to ATTACH windshield or canopy till you SEPARATE them. Hal Kempthorne RV6a N7HK ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "RION BOURGEOIS" <rion(at)worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Sourcerv.com
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Jeremy Benedict, the website creator and administrator of RVSource, is deceased. They posted how to get a refund for subscribers, and if they didn't hear from subscribers, they were going to give it to charity, his school if I recall. Rion ----- Original Message ----- From: <DLCousins(at)AOL.COM> Sent: Friday, August 18, 2000 3:21 PM Subject: RV-List: Sourcerv.com > > Has anyone else had trouble logging on to the website SourceRV.com? I've > been gone for a month and when I tried to access the logon screen, I received > a screen that said access was Forbidden. When I tried to email the site, my > email was returned. Thanks. > > DLCousins(at)aol.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DLCousins(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: SourceRV.com
My sincerest apologies. I had not made the connection. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: FK27Bob(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: Re: Award for Dumbest Blunder
________________________________________________________________________________
From: KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: Re: Gretz servo kit mount
In a message dated 8/18/00 10:45:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Boalty(at)AOL.COM writes: << Just looking for a little confirmation before I drill some holes. I'm working on the Gretz-Aero elevator trim kit for my RV-4. Looks to me like the only way to fit it is to run the cable through the aft most lightening hole in the elev. web, resulting in the cable/servo crossing the rear deck at a 45 degree angle. This obviously puts a good bend in the cable, but it seems to actuate freely nonetheless. So- who's done it, and how?..... Bruce Hukari RV-4 finishing forever >> Check the archives... Search for my name and Mlfred... You should see a couple of ideas. As it turned out, I installed it per plans, but I've got the same (seemingly) acute bend you describe. Kyle Boatright Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth To the Airport by Labor Day! ________________________________________________________________________________
From: KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Subject: Re: -6 Canopy advice needed
In a message dated 8/18/00 6:29:06 PM Eastern Daylight Time, AV8TURDON(at)AOL.COM writes: << If this is a slider. I suggest you cut it to fit more realistically. I had the same problem with mine and the Factory said cut it and go on from there. So I picked the mid point between the windshield frame and the canopy roller and made the cut. >> This is good advise. One caution - you may not want to cut the canopy exactly at the gap between the roll bar and the slider canopy. If you do, you'll end up with a much smaller edge distance on the screws/rivets on the slider front bow compared to the edge distance for the screws in the roll bar (ask me how I know).. You may want to cut it a little in front of the gap - say 1/8 - 3/16". Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth To the Airport by Labor Day! ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
From: Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com>
Subject: Re: Award for Dumbest Blunder
Ted French wrote: > > I flew for 10 hrs with my magnetic pickup sitting on top of the bottom > bolt > holding the rudder on. Looked all over for it. > > Ted > Heck, thats nuthin, I flew the homebuilt airplane I built in my garage. That has got to be the dumbest blunder there ever was -- Gary Zilik - Pine Junction, Colorado RV-6A N99PZ Flying Engine: Aerosport Power O-360-A1A with H2AD Pistons Prop: Sensenich 72FM8S9-1-83 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Mark Steffensen" <steffco1(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: RV-8 Spar mounting holes
Date: Aug 18, 2000
Tom, There are mechanical drawings at Randy's site: http://www.rv-8.com/pgRandyGriffin.htm Mark Steffensen 8A Flying 21 hours Dallas, TX ----- Original Message ----- From: <Ski2001a(at)AOL.COM> Sent: Friday, August 18, 2000 8:27 PM Subject: RV-List: RV-8 Spar mounting holes > > List, > I need help with a few dimensions ASAP. I am making up the spar stubs that > mount into the fuselage (RV-8) that act as spacers for the spar during > construction. I need the measurements between the mounting holes between the > 1/4 inch holes and the 7/16 holes in order to fabricate the spacers. I am > currently a couple of hours away from my project but have access to a > bridgeport and material and need the dimentions to fabricate the parts before > I head back in the morning. If someone could measure up their spar with a > vernier caliper and send me the center dimensions or even the web dimensions > between the holes I can make the spacers in the AM. Help!! > > Tom Clark 800525 Ski2001a(at)aol.com > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 18, 2000
From: Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org>
Subject: Re: alternators
Perhaps 91.209? kempthornes wrote: > > > If you're in a cloud night IFR and don't have your nav lights on the FAA > will bust you. > > FAR number violated please? Are you the Administrator? > > I believe that, as PIC, I have the right to turn off position lites (if > that is what you ean by 'nav lites') if they disturb me. > > Hal Kempthorne > 2578 Elliot Court > Santa Clara, CA 95051-1849 > 408.244.4984 CELL 408.230.0891 > RV6a N7HK 99% > 1965 Debonair for sale! > ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 19, 2000
Subject: -9 Wing oil canning
Hi all, I had a bay in my left wing upper skin that oil canned slightly, this I decided was just not acceptable, searched the archives and did not find much as far as repairs, so devised my own. I laminated a doubler skin to the underside of the offending skin with pro seal, using a garbage bag with about 10 pounds of water in it to hold everything in the "pillowed out" position until the pro seal cured. This worked very well for me, Im wondering if anyone else has tried similar fixes, and what were the successes or failures? Kevin Shannon -9A closing wings ________________________________________________________________________________
From: DWENSING(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 19, 2000
Subject: Re: Award for Dumbest Blunder
In a message dated 8/18/00 5:38:17 PM Central Daylight Time, mphill(at)fgi.net writes: << I finished my rear stablizer,and was very proud of the workmanship that I test flew it in the yard with all the neighbors watching >> .........don't let the Feds know you got airborne without the paper work...... ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: -9 Wing oil canning
Date: Aug 19, 2000
> > >Hi all, >I had a bay in my left wing upper skin that oil canned slightly, this I >decided was just not acceptable, searched the archives and did not find >much >as far as repairs, so devised my own. I laminated a doubler skin to the >underside of the offending skin with pro seal, using a garbage bag with >about >10 pounds of water in it to hold everything in the "pillowed out" position >until the pro seal cured. This worked very well for me, Im wondering if >anyone else has tried similar fixes, and what were the successes or >failures? >Kevin Shannon >-9A closing wings Kevin, Use caution when adding modifications to structural areas such as this. Also keep in mind you now have a bit more weight in this wing versus the other one, which might give you a heavy wing in flight, but then again it may actually help your trim situation when it's flying. Can't say for sure right now. It's a roll of the aerodynamic dice. ;) Oil canning in the wing upper surfaces WILL happen no matter what you do. When you're in flight, the wings flex under load and you'll have some canning going on. Don't worry about it, and move on. It's perfectly normal for the skins to do this. They will also expand and contract due to temperature changes. You may be cruising along some day through a very cool air mass, with nice snug skins. Then, you land, it sits in the sun while hordes of RV dreamers and doers are admiring your airplane, and the skins start puckering up in the heat. Such is life with a metal airplane. Have fun. Brian Denk RV8 N94BD 113 hrs. Down for paint. Still. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 19, 2000
From: RE Miller <rmill2000(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Sheared Wing Tips
Dear Listers I've heard some conflicting (mis)information on the sheared wingtips Team Rocket sells and Van's will soon be selling for all models. Claims of anywhere from +6 to 0 knots increase in groundspeed are out there. There has also been mention of decreasing stall speed. I believe Team Rocket sells their tips for $475 including the lighting lens but dont know if that is for one or both tips. Can anyone clear this up? The archives are no help on this one. Rob Miller Still Finishing after all these years. Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. ________________________________________________________________________________
From: "George Armstrong" <armstrong(at)coastside.net>
Subject: Oxygen
Date: Aug 19, 2000
I am thinking of putting O2 bottles in each wingtip. I know the arguments about roll rates etc. The bottles are removable if I want to do acro. If I remember correctly, we gain about 2% ground speed and fuel efficiency per thousand feet. I only have 172 time, which means I don't have any experience with this issue. Does anyone out there have any experience with O2? Do you really use it or is it a waste of time? How often will the few thousand feet get you up above the weather or mountain turbulence? Thanks, George Armstrong RV6A wings. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 19, 2000
From: pdsmith <pdsmith(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: Sheared Wing Tips
Rob: Price is $475 for both tips -the lighting is in both tips - but Scott told me that the lens is too small to hold the landing lights. You'd have to cut those into the wings. I got my hot tips from Dan & Oliver in BFL (see Yeller pages). Phil Smith, 80691 Fairfax, CA RV8, 0-320, Hartzell prop, installing electrical ________________________________________________________________________________
From: ammeterj(at)home.com (John Ammeter)
Subject: Re: Oxygen
Date: Aug 19, 2000
> >I am thinking of putting O2 bottles in each wingtip. I know the arguments >about roll rates etc. The bottles are removable if I want to do acro. If I >remember correctly, we gain about 2% ground speed and fuel efficiency per >thousand feet. I only have 172 time, which means I don't have any >experience with this issue. Does anyone out there have any experience with >O2? Do you really use it or is it a waste of time? How often will the few >thousand feet get you up above the weather or mountain turbulence? > >Thanks, >George Armstrong >RV6A wings. > I don't have personal experience with O2 but a friend of mine markets a very lightweight oxygen system. Another friend has used it extensively in his RV-6 as he lives in Las Vegas, is over 50 years old (age does affect your ability to function at altitude), and regularly flies over 12,000 feet. I suggest you contact Ric Lee at: Ric Lee He'll be able to answer any/all questions you may have. BTW, don't expect to get a bargain basement product. Ric won't sell a product unless it's 100% perfect. But, remember you get what you pay for, too. John Ammeter 1975 Jensen Healey RV-6 (sold 4/98) EAA Technical Counselor NRA Life Member Council Member, Snohomish Indian Tribe http://members.home.net/ammeterj ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CW9371(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 19, 2000
Subject: Re: Sheared Wing Tips
In a message dated 8/19/2000 10:46:56 AM Central Daylight Time, rmill2000(at)yahoo.com writes: << I've heard some conflicting (mis)information on the sheared wingtips Team Rocket sells and Van's will soon be selling for all models. Claims of anywhere from +6 to 0 knots increase in groundspeed are out there. There has also been mention of decreasing stall speed. I believe Team Rocket sells their tips for $475 including the lighting lens but dont know if that is for one or both tips. Can anyone clear this up? The archives are no help on this one. >> According to Mark the speed increase is from 0-6 depending on the aircraft and also how much the owner has had to drink or wants to stretch the truth. The main reason they would be faster is no drag as the strobes are enclosed under a lexan. The price is 475 for the pair. I have never heard anything about decreasing the stall speed chris wilcox f1 builder ________________________________________________________________________________
From: CW9371(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 19, 2000
Subject: Re: Sheared Wing Tips
In a message dated 8/19/2000 11:55:04 AM Central Daylight Time, pdsmith(at)pacbell.net writes: << Rob: Price is $475 for both tips -the lighting is in both tips - but Scott told me that the lens is too small to hold the landing lights. You'd have to cut those into the wings. I got my hot tips from Dan & Oliver in BFL (see Yeller pages). Phil Smith, 80691 >> Phil, Well its been a while since you have talked to team rocket as scott has long been gone for a long long times, which is good since he didnt know what he was talking about. You can mount landing lights in the wing tip under the lexan tip. However the have to be the small round 55 watt driving light style. If you want to mount the duckworks landing light they have to go in the wing You do have to buy the strobes and the landing lights, they are not included. chris wilcox f1 rocket kit 000 ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com
Date: Aug 19, 2000
Subject: VM 1000 manifold pressure sensor
Howdy all, Has anyone mounted their VM1000 manifold pressure sensor forward of the firewall in a flying RV? Just looking for a short cut. Thanks, - Jim RV-8A ( engine stuff ) O-360 ( N89JA ) ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 19, 2000
From: Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Rockymountain Instrument
--- Bill Shook wrote: > > > One question I've always had about the Rocky Mountain encoder is how > readable is the airspeed when it's changing rapidly. Like coming > down the > back side of a loop....can you read the airspeed when you're in a > dive or is > it just a blur of numbers? You're looking at the _airspeed_ on the backside of a loop?!?!? :) Mike Thompson Austin, TX -6 N140RV (Reserved) Fuselage ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 19, 2000
From: Jim Cimino <jcimino(at)epix.net>
Subject: Re: VM 1000 manifold pressure sensor
I mounted my sensor on the top forward part of the firewall in a manifold with the oil pressure sensor and the fuel pressure sensor. There are pictures on my page. I have not flown it yet, but I do know some people have done it also. > > >Howdy all, > >Has anyone mounted their VM1000 manifold pressure sensor forward of the firewall >in a flying RV? > >Just looking for a short cut. > >Thanks, > >- Jim >RV-8A ( engine stuff ) >O-360 ( N89JA ) > > Jim Cimino RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL Reserved http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo (570)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 19, 2000
From: Jim Cimino <jcimino(at)epix.net>
Subject: Re: Award for Dumbest Blunder
Not much of an entry, but, I drilled my knuckle once (you only do it once), so I decided to bolt my prop on (Hartzell C/S) and made sure the rear spinner bulkhead was ready, even set it on top of the engine so I would not forget it...I did. Had to take the prop off and do it again. I'm sure I've done worse...but my mind has blocked out the memories. Jim Cimino RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL Reserved http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo (570)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania ________________________________________________________________________________
From: Ferdfly(at)AOL.COM
Date: Aug 19, 2000
Subject: Re: Rockymountain Instrument
In a message dated 8/19/00 9:21:25 AM Pacific Daylight Time, bertrv6(at)yahoo.com writes: << Question concerning the Rockymountain Instrument; if one has an eletrical failure , one would be without any of the information needed, for a safe flight. >> NOT TRUE my engine monitor has a gell cell that runs 8 hrs after you loose power, Thr monitor has a trickle charger circuit that keeps the gell cell topped off. Fred LaForge RV-4 EAA Tech C. ________________________________________________________________________________
Date: Aug 19, 2000
From: Jim Cimino <jcimino(at)epix.net>
Subject: Airspeed indicator for sale
I have a new UMA airspeed indicator for sale. MPH on outside, knots on inside, un-lighted, 0-240, and does not have any operating range markings. If anyone is interested, contact me off line. I would like $100.00, and I'll pay the shipping. Jim Cimino RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL Reserved http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo (570)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania

August 11, 2000 - August 19, 2000

RV-Archive.digest.vol-jb