RV-Archive.digest.vol-jc
August 19, 2000 - August 24, 2000
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
>
>I am thinking of putting O2 bottles in each wingtip. I know the arguments
>about roll rates etc. The bottles are removable if I want to do acro. If
I
>remember correctly, we gain about 2% ground speed and fuel efficiency per
>thousand feet. I only have 172 time, which means I don't have any
>experience with this issue. Does anyone out there have any experience with
>O2? Do you really use it or is it a waste of time? How often will the few
>thousand feet get you up above the weather or mountain turbulence?
>
I have O2 in my airplane and am very glad I do. It is not very often that
the trip is long enough and the tailwind strong enough to warrant climbing
to the 18,000 foot area but it is fun when that is appropriate. It probably
isn't worth the expense on any rational basis though.
My question is why do you want to put all that plumbing in the wings and
then into the fuselage then up to the lungs? The O2 bottle fits well on the
back of the electric flap housing and no plumbing is necessary.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Dudley <rhdudley(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tank Leak Test - long |
ENewton57(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
>
> I thought I would share my fuel tank test episode with the group. Its long
> so delete now if you're not interested.
My experience parallels Eric's with some variations that might be of use
to someone.
FWIW
I did my preliminary leak check of my tanks using a homemade water
manometer. It is made of 3/8" I.D. vinyl tubing attached to a 4' plywood
board with cable ties through holes in the board. The vinyl tubing went
direct to the tank vent line and was secured with a hose clamp. I
applied pressure with my own breath through the fuel pickup line via a
piece of the vinyl tubing clamped to a piece of 3/8 aluminum tubing
flared and an flare fitting. Food coloring made the water in the
manometer easy to see.
With my breath, I could apply a pressure of the order of 35" of water
which translates to about 1.2 psi gage pressure. Even small leaks were
readily detected by visible movement of the manometer column. Very small
leaks required checking the manometer over a period of minutes.
A major obstacle to locating tank leaks were leaks around and through
the fuel filler cap. I tried taping over it a variety of ways that did
not work. The final solution was the use of a plumber's "Test Ball" plug
that I got at a plumber's supply. This is a small rubber ball with a
valve stem. It is meant to be inserted into a pipe and inflated with a
tire pump. This eliminated all leaking from the filler neck.
I checked for leaks using a solution of a few drops of dishwashing
liquid in a cup of water. A paint brush made lots of bubbles as it is
dragged along over rivets, confusing the checking process. A medical
syringe allowed the solution to be placed at suspect locations without
bubbles unless there was a real leak.
I found leaks around the BNC connectors for my capacitance fuel gage.
This was readily solved by opening the access plate and applying more
sealant around the backsides of the BNC connectors. The only other real
leak was from the flush side of one rivet on the edge of a baffle flange
on one tank. A little tightening of the rivet eliminated the bubbles and
the manometer change.
When those leaks were fixed, the manometer remained steady for as long a
3 days (the length of the test) except for its following the shop
temperature. There was a very strong correlation between the temperature
and the manometer indication. Pressure went up with increase in
temperature and down with temperature decrease. Pressure predictably
returned to the same level at the same temperature.
Of course, the pressure test is just a pressure test and the real test
will be when I put fuel into the tank. I'll report those results when I
have them.
By-the-way, my access plates are sealed with Tite Seal. That is yet to
be tested with fuel.
Richard Dudley
RV-6A completing wings
Fuselage waiting
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Oil Filter Access |
The filter on my O320 (rv4) is difficult to get to - I have mangled many
filters trying to get them on and off, till I found a "crows foot" type tube
wrench that fits a 3/8 square drive torque wrench. Put the wrench on the
torque wrench at slightly less than (one or two clicks) 90 degrees to the
handle this will give you very close to the same reading as a socket (you
perfectionists can figure out the exact angle). The tube wrench is an S-K
#42232. It is not cheap! But it does work. I have also had oil spilling out
when removing the filter - I made a drain tube from 1 1/2 inch PVC pipe by
24 inches long. Slot at one end (fits under the filter). It isn't perfected
yet, but works better than a bunch of rags!
RV4 1322D flying since 1989
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rockymountain Instrument |
Bill Shook wrote:
>
>
> One question I've always had about the Rocky Mountain encoder is how
> readable is the airspeed when it's changing rapidly. Like coming down the
> back side of a loop....can you read the airspeed when you're in a dive or is
> it just a blur of numbers?
I have never come down the backside of a loop in my RMI-equipped RV-6
(my inner ears just aren't plumbed very well for aerobatics) but I have
never had any problems reading the airspeed, even when it is changing
quite rapidly.
The airspeed updates every second and there is no blurring of digits.
This assumes, of course, that you have flown with the uEncoder long
enough to acclimate to the digital display. It does take some time to
transition from seeing needles.
Sam Buchanan (RV-6 getting new pressure recovery pants and Team Rocket
gear fairings...you NEVER finish one of these airplanes!)
"The RV Journal" http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rockymountain Instrument |
bert murillo wrote:
>
>
> Hi:
>
> Question concerning the Rockymountain Instrument;
> if one has an eletrical failure , one would be
> without any of the information needed, for a safe
> flight.
>
> Should one get, redundancy, by buying individual
> gauges, at least, for some of the most important
> units ? Oil presure, Temp etc...
>
> Would like to hear from any of you that have any
> of the systems available, what installation did
> you have.
My RV-6 has only the RMI uMonitor for all engine instruments. As other
listers have stated, you can include a backup battery in the system if
you wish. I don't have the battery because the loss of the uMonitor will
not prevent me from safely completing the flight. The engine will
continue to produce RPM and oil pressure whether I know how much or not.
:-)
Sam Buchanan
"The RV Journal http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil Filter Access |
richard george wrote:
>
>
> The filter on my O320 (rv4) is difficult to get to - I have mangled many
> filters trying to get them on and off, till I found a "crows foot" type tube
> wrench that fits a 3/8 square drive torque wrench. Put the wrench on the
> torque wrench at slightly less than (one or two clicks) 90 degrees to the
> handle this will give you very close to the same reading as a socket (you
> perfectionists can figure out the exact angle). The tube wrench is an S-K
> #42232. It is not cheap! But it does work. I have also had oil spilling out
> when removing the filter - I made a drain tube from 1 1/2 inch PVC pipe by
> 24 inches long. Slot at one end (fits under the filter). It isn't perfected
> yet, but works better than a bunch of rags!
George, you might want to try the zip-lock bag trick when removing the
filter.
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John B. Abell" <jbabell(at)mediaone.net> |
I was surprised by the idea to install oxygen bottles in the wingtips. Such an
idea would never have occurred to me. I installed my bottle on brackets I
designed and riveted to the aft face of the flap housing, similar to Larry
Pardue's suggestion. This installation shortens everything for me. I have an
oxygen pressure gauge in my instrument panel and an EDS unit on each cockpit
sidewall, so those lines are all shortened. Moreover, I can see my pressure
gauge without having to turn my head to check it. I can also turn off the
oxygen supply simply by reaching over my shoulder. My tank and EDS units will
deliver 48 manhours of oxygen at 15,000 feet. Thus, I will be able to pretty
much fly as I please and will rarely, if ever, have to refill the oxygen tank
will cross country. All of the components for my oxygen system came from Rocky
Mountain; their stuff is top quality and I wouldn't try to save a few nickels on
my oxygen system. Oxygen systems can kill you.
I have seldom used oxygen in a light, GA airplane, but its utility in your RV
depends on the kind of flying you plan to do. I anticipate lots of high
altitude IFR flights over substantial distances so I think oxygen is not only
nice to have but imperative. I'd definitely rethink the wingtip idea if I were
you.
Best wishes,
Jack Abell
George Armstrong wrote:
>
> I am thinking of putting O2 bottles in each wingtip. I know the arguments
> about roll rates etc. The bottles are removable if I want to do acro. If I
> remember correctly, we gain about 2% ground speed and fuel efficiency per
> thousand feet. I only have 172 time, which means I don't have any
> experience with this issue. Does anyone out there have any experience with
> O2? Do you really use it or is it a waste of time? How often will the few
> thousand feet get you up above the weather or mountain turbulence?
>
> Thanks,
> George Armstrong
> RV6A wings.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Are Barstad" <abarstad(at)bconnex.net> |
| Subject: | TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock |
I spent a long time looking at RV's at Oshkosh and at my local airport when
building my empennage. I wasn't sure how to best lock the trimtab hinge pin.
The archive provided me with some ideas but I still wanted to see it myself
on a real RV.
I saw many different ways at Oshkosh but the best by far was one I saw at my
local airport at Brampton (Ontario, Canada). Subsequently I used this same
method and I think it looks and works great with material supplied in the
kit. I simply used a part of the hinge that I cut and riveted it on the left
elevator. Note that you have to pay attention in order to get the required
edge distances on the 'mini-hinge'.
It's a bit hard to explain so I supplied a couple of pictures here if you
are interested.
http://www.bconnex.net/~abarstad/hinge.html
Are
RV-8
Waiting for Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Rabaut" <crabaut(at)coalinga.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Award for Dumbest Blunder |
Bill,
Where's this 4? If you got any info on the owner/builder, I'll pull
the engine.
Chuck
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Award for Dumbest Blunder |
Yeah...like I didn't already think of THAT? Get in line buddy. :-) Of
course, I'm not at the front of that line either.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chuck Rabaut" <crabaut(at)coalinga.com>
Sent: Saturday, August 19, 2000 8:46 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Award for Dumbest Blunder
>
> Bill,
>
> Where's this 4? If you got any info on the owner/builder, I'll pull
> the engine.
>
> Chuck
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ENewton57(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock |
In a message dated 8/19/00 9:56:43 PM Central Daylight Time,
abarstad(at)bconnex.net writes:
<< Subsequently I used this same
method and I think it looks and works great with material supplied in the
kit. I simply used a part of the hinge that I cut and riveted it on the left
elevator. Note that you have to pay attention in order to get the required
edge distances on the 'mini-hinge'.
>>
Are,
That is a great idea. I just finished my flaps and was contemplating how to
secure that hinge pin as well as the elevator trim tab hinge. Now I have my
answer. Thanks for the great tip.
Eric Newton - Long Beach, Mississippi
RV-6A N57ME (Reserved) (wing skinning)
Eric's RV-6A
Construction Page
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary & Tena Strong" <gstrong(at)uswest.net> |
| Subject: | F-633 Control Column mount |
Taking all the suggestions, I took that challenge today. After Charles
Brame's suggestion on hole distance being less than the 1/2" Van's suggests,
I decided to make some small changes to the F-633 mount. If you make the
top distance more like 1/4" then the mount is too long and hits the bottom
of the bulkhead. (Van's original 1/2" doesn't allow the control tube to
move freely without cutting out the floor ribs.) I decided to cut about
3/16" off the bottom of F-633 and round the bottom so that it could fit the
bottom of the bulkhead curvature. I then held the control column full
forward, raised the control column up until it just touched the floor rib
cuttouts (I didn't modify/cut out the original ribs whatsoever), then
clamped and drilled the F-633 mounts. Everything seems to move freely now
and now and I feel a little better that I didn't have to cut the ribs
(although cutting them probably wouldn't have made any difference).
Hopefully this would create any problems later on, and this may be another
method for someone that hasn't yet started the mount installation.
Gary S. - 6AQB fuselage control sticks - soon moving to brakes & rudder
peddles
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | which cyl for RMI probe |
I have the RMI monitor and was wondering which cylinder to hook the one probe
too.
Carey Mills
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Point <jpoint(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Tapping Aluminum |
Any one have experience tapping thicker aluminum for small screws (#6 or
8)? Does 2024 or 6061 work better, or are both too soft? Any other
advice?
Jeff Point
-6 wings
Milwaukee, WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RVer273sb(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Tapping Aluminum |
Jeff
They both tap fine.. Rule of thumb is you need at least
one thread diameter of metal thickness to get threads
that will hold torque. Use a good tap lube for clean threads.
Stewart RV4 CO.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JDaniel343(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Award for Dumbest Blunder |
Been there, done that.
You'll come up with better ones before your finished.
John Danielson
Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Ludwig" <ludwig(at)azstarnet.com> |
| Subject: | B & C Specialty Web Site? |
Have been unable to locate the B & C Specialty web site. Does one exist?
- Bill in Tucson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gert <gert(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tapping Aluminum |
Jeff.
It is well worth it to find tap fluid for alu. It will give a lot
cleaner thread.
However, it appears that kerosene also works excelent as an aluminum
tapping fluid. (Don't smoke though ;-)
Gert
RVer273sb(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
>
> Jeff
> They both tap fine.. Rule of thumb is you need at least
> one thread diameter of metal thickness to get threads
> that will hold torque. Use a good tap lube for clean threads.
> Stewart RV4 CO.
>
--
Pursuant to US Code, Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, '227,
any and all nonsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
US. E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Conical Engine Mounts |
Looking for specifications on replacing the rubber inserts on straight
conical engine mounts for a O320. Thanks!
Richard George rv4 1322D
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <tcwatson(at)seanet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Award for Dumbest Blunder |
I heard about a guy who couldn't get the primer to stick to his empenage
parts until he removed the vinyl, but he made me promise not to disclose his
name.
Terry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Christie" <billc(at)dancris.com> |
Bob,
I traveled there from Phoenix and found it very worthwhile. I had not done
sheet metal before and was amazed at the different mistakes I could make. My
"lab" partner had already built his empennage and he was happy with it also.
Finally, my wife came a long as far as Atlanta and spent the weekend with
her old girlfriends, so both of us made out. I just finished the second wing
(RV8A - non QB) and have only drilled out a total of 7 rivets so far. I
shudder to think what it could have been!.
Bill Christie, RV8A, Phoenix, Fuselage jig!
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Waalkes <waalkes(at)netnitco.net>
Sent: Friday, August 18, 2000 9:55 AM
Subject: RV-List: workshops
>
> I am interested in doing an RV workshop and I've seen one advertised by
> Sportair in Griffin, GA in October. Has anyone on the list done this
> workshop and found it worthy? I will need to travel across the country to
> attend and want to make sure the value is there. I've also heard rumors
of
> a workshop in Maryland in April. Does anyone have info on that one? I
> would rather go there (closer - I live in Indiana). Thanks for the help.
>
> Bob Waalkes
> RV-8 Waiting on Emp.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles E. Brame" <charleyb(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | F-633 Control Column Mount |
Gary et.al.,
Glad my post helped. I querried Van about the problem but haven't had a
response yet. I have about decided to reorder new F-633 mounts and do
exactly as you did - cut about 1/4" off the bottom of the mounts and
move the whole affair down as far as it will go. My eyeball tells me
this still won't be enough clearance between the torque tube and the
ribs, but so far this seems the best (only) solution.
One question. Did moving the control mounts down cause any clearance
problems between the arm that connects the F-689 elevator control rod
and the floor, and/or any clearance problems for the F-689 where it
passes through the bottom of the F-604 bulkhead?
Thanks for posting.
Charlie Brame
RV-6A QB, On the gear
San Antonio, TX
------------------------------------------
> From: "Gary & Tena Strong" <gstrong(at)uswest.net>
> Subject: RV-List: F-633 Control Column mount
>
>
> Taking all the suggestions, I took that challenge today. After Charles
> Brame's suggestion on hole distance being less than the 1/2" Van's suggests,
> I decided to make some small changes to the F-633 mount. If you make the
> top distance more like 1/4" then the mount is too long and hits the bottom
> of the bulkhead. (Van's original 1/2" doesn't allow the control tube to
> move freely without cutting out the floor ribs.) I decided to cut about
> 3/16" off the bottom of F-633 and round the bottom so that it could fit the
> bottom of the bulkhead curvature. I then held the control column full
> forward, raised the control column up until it just touched the floor rib
> cuttouts (I didn't modify/cut out the original ribs whatsoever), then
> clamped and drilled the F-633 mounts. Everything seems to move freely now
> and now and I feel a little better that I didn't have to cut the ribs
> (although cutting them probably wouldn't have made any difference).
>
> Hopefully this would create any problems later on, and this may be another
> method for someone that hasn't yet started the mount installation.
>
> Gary S. - 6AQB fuselage control sticks - soon moving to brakes & rudder
> peddles
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tapping Aluminum |
Use "Tap Magic for Aluminum" (Cleaveland sells it), good quality tap
(General, or taps from Avery) and blow out hole frequently.
Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP O360A1A, Hartzell
Hampshire, IL C38
-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Point <jpoint(at)execpc.com>
Date: Sunday, August 20, 2000 4:02 AM
Subject: RV-List: Tapping Aluminum
>
>Any one have experience tapping thicker aluminum for small screws (#6 or
>8)? Does 2024 or 6061 work better, or are both too soft? Any other
>advice?
>
>Jeff Point
>-6 wings
>Milwaukee, WI
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | IO- Versus O- (longish) |
"engine-list(at)matronics.com
Mark Fredrick" ,
Stu McCurdy
Hi All,
This note summons the List.Wisdom on engines, injected versus normally
aspirated.
For my RV-6, I have been searching for an O-360 for a couple of months
now. I have found several along the lines of stored-for-5-years and
4,000+ hours, that kind of thing.
Recently, though, I have had hits on HIO-360's, one a B1A and the other
a C1A, both models being parallel-valve. Gadzooks! I didn't know
there was such an animal!
The B1A makes 180 HP at 2900 RPM, the C1A makes 205 HP at 2900 RPM.
We all know of the problems fitting an angle-valve engine under the
hood of a -6, so I haven't even been looking at them... but now I have
these possibilities.
The bottom line question is, given two engines of equal HP (an O-360A2A
and the HIO-360B1A, for instance) the same compression (8.5:1) and
similar weight (A2A-257#, B1A-261#) one has to ask oneself:
Do I want injected or normally aspirated?
As always, examine the mission:
A lot of cross countries.
A lot of Young Eagle flying.
Some aerobatics
I didn't put flop tubes in because I didn't intend to get an injected
engine, so no factor (no inverted oil, anyway)
IO - 0
O - 0
I'm concerned about flying Y.E. because the only other injected
aircraft I have flown (Decathlon) has exhibited some problems with warm
starts.
Flying Y.E. you're starting and stopping and re-starting constantly...
Now maybe I just didn't have an owner's touch with the Decathlon (I
rent), but maybe also injection is more sensitive to heat under the
hood...?
IO - 0
O - 1
I do understand (I think) the inherent qualities of better fuel
efficiency with injected engines, so cross countries would maybe be its
strong suit.
IO - 1
O - 0
So the score is tied, 1-1. I'm too ignorant to break it and am asking
for a little help. Owners of both types comment?
Education is what "Experimental" is all about, right?
:)
And if you're still with me, thanks...
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX
-6 N140RV (Reserved)
Fuselage (and engine-less)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: F-633 Control Column mount |
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary & Tena Strong <gstrong(at)uswest.net>
Date: Sunday, August 20, 2000 12:28 AM
Subject: RV-List: F-633 Control Column mount
>
>Taking all the suggestions, I took that challenge today. After Charles
>Brame's suggestion on hole distance being less than the 1/2" Van's
suggests,
>I decided to make some small changes to the F-633 mount. If you make the
>top distance more like 1/4" then the mount is too long and hits the bottom
>of the bulkhead. ----->>>>(Van's original 1/2" doesn't allow the control
tube to
>move freely without cutting out the floor ribs <<<<----
>Gary S. - 6AQB fuselage control sticks - soon moving to brakes & rudder
>peddles
I can't speak for the QB, but my slow build instructions specifically call
out relieving the ribs for control tube clearance. I believe this is a
normal and required exercise in installing the control system. There are
pictures in past RVAtors on the subject. I would tread cautiously on
relocating the F633s for a couple of reasons:
1) RV controls should be silky-smooth with no change in force required to
achieve displacement until you reach the hard stops and you hear and feel a
resounding clunk.
2) You will have no clue as to the amount of clearance required for the
control assembly until you have mounted elevators and ailerons and rigged
the controls to provide the specified deflections. I thought I had
everything working smoothly but when I finally torqued the bolts on the
aileron bellcranks, I had some interference with the rod end bearing and the
bellcrank. I had never seen it before because I just dropped in the AN3
bolts and didn't put on nuts. I solved the problem with the special little
0.062 thick washers for rod end bearing use. I use this as an example to
illustrate that at the stage of installing the F633s there is alot more
ahead of you.
Please proceed with caution -- control systems are very critical.
Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP O360A1A Hartzell 0.0 hours
Hampshire, IL C38
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: IO- Versus O- (longish) |
In a message dated 8/20/2000 1:55:57 PM Central Daylight Time,
grobdriver(at)yahoo.com writes:
<< So the score is tied, 1-1. I'm too ignorant to break it and am asking
for a little help. Owners of both types comment?
Education is what "Experimental" is all about, right?
:)
And if you're still with me, thanks...
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX >>
Mike, one thing you forgot, no carb ice with an injected engine. I know in
texas its not much of a problem, but for your cross countrys it can be.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary & Tena Strong" <gstrong(at)uswest.net> |
| Subject: | F-633 Control Column Mount |
Moving the F-633 mounts down about 3/16" provides complete stop to stop
rotation of the control column without interference with the ribs. The top
of the F-633 is about 1 1/2" from the top of F-604 bulkhead. Basically when
you rotate to the upper limit, there is still a few thousanths clearance
before hitting the factory rib cuttouts. I put a piece of conduit through
F-605 and F-606 (I assume you meant F-605 since I don't see where it passes
through F-604) and it appears that there will be no problems connecting the
F-689 rudder control with the control column. There is about 1 1/2" from
the bottom of the fuselage and the bottom of the control column piece that
attaches to F-689. Only time will tell if this will work, but looking and
measuring everything I can think of it appears fine. I definately hear the
caution of Dennis, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed.
On another note, Charlie do you have your wings & rudder mounted? If so you
may find out how it all fits together prior to me, and if so I'd welcome
your thoughts as you connect all the control tubes together.
Gary S. - RV6AQB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | B & C Specialty Web Site? |
>
>Have been unable to locate the B & C Specialty web site. Does one exist?
>
>- Bill in Tucson
Yes . . .
They have a work-in-progress at:
http://www.BandCspecialty.com
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different than )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com |
| Subject: | blind/pop rivet # LP4-3 |
Hello friends,
On my RV8 rudder, to rivet the rudder horn to the brace r410 Van's calls for using
an470ad4-6 or
if your chicken like me the LP4-3 blind rivet which wasn't included in the kit.
I can't find any
reference to this rivet in any of my catalogs. Anybody have an idea on what blind
rivet will
work?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: IO- Versus O- (longish) |
>So the score is tied, 1-1. I'm too ignorant to break it and am asking
>for a little help. Owners of both types comment?
>Education is what "Experimental" is all about, right?
>:)
>And if you're still with me, thanks...
>
>
>Mike Thompson
>Austin, TX
>-6 N140RV (Reserved)
>Fuselage (and engine-less)
Mike,
I chose a carbureted engine (O-360A4J, 180hp with updraft sump conversion).
Reasons:
1. Primary mission is fun flying, including Young Eagles with associated hot
starts.
2. No sustained inverted operations, just positively loaded "gentleman
aerobatics".
3. Simplicity. I can understand a carburetor. A fuel injector servo...well,
hmm, dunno.
4. No high pressure fuel pump required, nor skinny spider lines running on
the top of the (hot) engine cylinders.
5. I could not find an injected, low time, running engine anywhere and coud
not afford a freshly rebuilt or new one. I did find a few low time O-360's
to choose from, but it took many months. Patience and advance planning is
key here.
I finally found a low time (300 hrs. SMOH) engine out of a regularly
operated airplane that was storm wrecked. It suited my needs and wallet, and
the deal was made. I've been very happy with the decision and would do the
same if I were building another RV. (Yikes!)
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
113 hrs.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Are Barstad" <abarstad(at)bconnex.net> |
| Subject: | blind/pop rivet # LP4-3 |
You're right about the LP4-3's. There may not be a reference to them in the
catalog but I was able to order them from Van's. They have them in stock.
I haven't used mine yet though and bought a yoke for my squeezer at Oshkosh
that I think may work. Hopefully I can get away without using them but it
doesn't really matter. Make sure you make a couple of extra holes though if
you decide to not use the solid rivets.
Are
RV-8
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com
Sent: August 20, 2000 6:50 PM
Subject: RV-List: blind/pop rivet # LP4-3
Hello friends,
On my RV8 rudder, to rivet the rudder horn to the brace r410 Van's calls for
using an470ad4-6 or
if your chicken like me the LP4-3 blind rivet which wasn't included in the
kit. I can't find any
reference to this rivet in any of my catalogs. Anybody have an idea on what
blind rivet will
work?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Powder Coater in Chicago area |
Don,
Try Pro-Coat Powder Systems. They are located in Naperville west of hwy 59.
I'm sorry I don't have their phone number or address. They are in the phone
book under coatings. They did parts for my -8 when I lived in the Chicago
area.
Rick McBride
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "rvpilot" <rvpilot(at)coollink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: IO- Versus O- (longish) |
Mike,
If you factor in price, the carburetor wins both in initial cost and at
overhaul time.
If you factor in the ability to lean to peak and beyond, the F. I. wins. I
like the more even fuel distribution.
The hot start problems can be made more manageable by installing a purge
valve such as Airflow Performance sells.
I vote for F.I.
Bill RV-8 N48WD
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Thompson" <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com>
; "Stu McCurdy"
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2000 2:40 PM
Subject: RV-List: IO- Versus O- (longish)
>
> Hi All,
>
> This note summons the List.Wisdom on engines, injected versus normally
> aspirated.
> For my RV-6, I have been searching for an O-360 for a couple of months
> now. I have found several along the lines of stored-for-5-years and
> 4,000+ hours, that kind of thing.
> Recently, though, I have had hits on HIO-360's, one a B1A and the other
> a C1A, both models being parallel-valve. Gadzooks! I didn't know
> there was such an animal!
>
> The B1A makes 180 HP at 2900 RPM, the C1A makes 205 HP at 2900 RPM.
>
> We all know of the problems fitting an angle-valve engine under the
> hood of a -6, so I haven't even been looking at them... but now I have
> these possibilities.
>
> The bottom line question is, given two engines of equal HP (an O-360A2A
> and the HIO-360B1A, for instance) the same compression (8.5:1) and
> similar weight (A2A-257#, B1A-261#) one has to ask oneself:
> Do I want injected or normally aspirated?
>
> As always, examine the mission:
>
> A lot of cross countries.
> A lot of Young Eagle flying.
> Some aerobatics
>
> I didn't put flop tubes in because I didn't intend to get an injected
> engine, so no factor (no inverted oil, anyway)
> IO - 0
> O - 0
>
> I'm concerned about flying Y.E. because the only other injected
> aircraft I have flown (Decathlon) has exhibited some problems with warm
> starts.
> Flying Y.E. you're starting and stopping and re-starting constantly...
> Now maybe I just didn't have an owner's touch with the Decathlon (I
> rent), but maybe also injection is more sensitive to heat under the
> hood...?
> IO - 0
> O - 1
>
> I do understand (I think) the inherent qualities of better fuel
> efficiency with injected engines, so cross countries would maybe be its
> strong suit.
> IO - 1
> O - 0
>
> So the score is tied, 1-1. I'm too ignorant to break it and am asking
> for a little help. Owners of both types comment?
> Education is what "Experimental" is all about, right?
> :)
> And if you're still with me, thanks...
>
>
> Mike Thompson
> Austin, TX
> -6 N140RV (Reserved)
> Fuselage (and engine-less)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Mac Servo/Switch Question... |
Folks,
A quick question for those in the know. Im wiring the Mac Trim serve
that is on my elevator to my Infinity control stick and have a bit of a
question...!! The servo has 5 wires comming out of it: 2 control the
forward/backward (up/down) movement of the trim servo screw..these are both
white in color. The other 3, Blue/Green/and Orange connect into the position
indicator to indicate servo movement. The control stick that I am using has
3 wires (from the coolie hat control) that control pitch trim. The middle
wire (and center postion on the switch) is a ground (black wire) The other
two wires are Brown and Solid Blue and control up down movement. My question
is how does the servo get 12V power? I have wired everything per the plans
of both the Mac servo and the control grip. I have checked the switches and
wires with a volt/ohm meter and connections are good. The serve motor moves
when directly attached to the battery. The only 12V input to the system is
the Red/white stripped wire comming from the position indicator (light).
Obviously I am missing something in the wiring setup or some additional part
is required. I know it doesnt work because it isn't getting any 12V
power.....just wondering how it is supposed to get that power or if maybe the
control stick is not compatible with the MAC servo. As always thanks ahead
of time for your responses. Take care and happy building/flying!!!
Kurt, OKC, OK
6A QB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John McMahon <rv6(at)earthlink.net> |
I have a new Ed Sterba 68/70 3/8 bolt size for sale...
I'm getting a C/S 180 HP Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
$525.00 and you pay shipping.........
First one to my E-Mail off the list please
Thanks
John McMahon
Gallatin,Tn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John McMahon <rv6(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Video "BEEN THERE" |
Has anyone on the list seen or own the video's
BEEN THERE ...It is a four tape set on building
an award RV.............How good is the tape???
Thanks
John McMahon (rv6 side skins)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Mac Servo/Switch Question... |
In a message dated 8/20/00 10:05:59 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM writes:
<< Folks,
A quick question for those in the know. Im wiring the Mac Trim serve
that is on my elevator to my Infinity control stick and have a bit of a
question...!! The servo has 5 wires comming out of it: 2 control the
forward/backward (up/down) movement of the trim servo screw..these are both
white in color. The other 3, Blue/Green/and Orange connect into the
position
indicator to indicate servo movement. The control stick that I am using
has
3 wires (from the coolie hat control) that control pitch trim. The middle
wire (and center postion on the switch) is a ground (black wire) The other
two wires are Brown and Solid Blue and control up down movement. My
question
is how does the servo get 12V power? I have wired everything per the plans
of both the Mac servo and the control grip. I have checked the switches and
wires with a volt/ohm meter and connections are good. The serve motor moves
when directly attached to the battery. The only 12V input to the system is
the Red/white stripped wire comming from the position indicator (light).
Obviously I am missing something in the wiring setup or some additional part
is required. I know it doesnt work because it isn't getting any 12V
power.....just wondering how it is supposed to get that power or if maybe
the
control stick is not compatible with the MAC servo. As always thanks ahead
of time for your responses. Take care and happy building/flying!!!
Kurt, OKC, OK
6A QB >>
Kurt,
On my installation, I supplied power to the system through the position
indicator. Check your wiring diagram, or, do like I did, and call the
factory. (The old wiring diagrams I had were pretty bad. According to the
folks at MAC, they have been updated since then.)
Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA
RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth
To the Airport by Labor Day!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | meketa <acgm(at)gvtc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Mac Servo/Switch Question... |
Kurt and others,
The stick control switch has either a ground output or 12 volt output
depending on which way you wire it. The servo requires both a ground and
a 12 volt input which is reversed to go in the opposite direction. It is
some times advised to keep a ground on both servo wires in the off
position to prevent motor run on and instantly stop the motor when the
switch is released. The MAC trim motor travels slowly so this may not be
a problem. This can easily be done with a servo relay deck which MAC can
supply. Van also sells a relay for the flaps which would work on the
trim, but I do not know if will ground the motor inputs to stop the
motor run on. You can also install two 12 volt relays which will do the
same thing. The same setup will be used for the electric flaps when
using an Infinity grip or any small low amp switches. I do not know if
the MAC relay deck can handle the higher amp draw of the flap motor when
used in this application. Hope this helps.
George Meketa
RV-8 IO360 CS ,oil cooler and engine control cables
> A quick question for those in the know. Im wiring the Mac Trim serve
> that is on my elevator to my Infinity control stick and have a bit of a
> question...!! The servo has 5 wires comming out of it: 2 control the
> forward/backward (up/down) movement of the trim servo screw..these are both
> white in color. The other 3, Blue/Green/and Orange connect into the
> position
> indicator to indicate servo movement. The control stick that I am using
> has
> 3 wires (from the coolie hat control) that control pitch trim. The middle
> wire (and center postion on the switch) is a ground (black wire) The other
> two wires are Brown and Solid Blue and control up down movement. My
> question
> is how does the servo get 12V power? I have wired everything per the plans
> of both the Mac servo and the control grip. I have checked the switches and
> wires with a volt/ohm meter and connections are good. The serve motor moves
> when directly attached to the battery. The only 12V input to the system is
> the Red/white stripped wire comming from the position indicator (light).
> Obviously I am missing something in the wiring setup or some additional part
> is required. I know it doesnt work because it isn't getting any 12V
> power.....just wondering how it is supposed to get that power or if maybe
> the
> control stick is not compatible with the MAC servo. As always thanks ahead
> of time for your responses. Take care and happy building/flying!!!
>
> Kurt, OKC, OK
> 6A QB >>
>
> Kurt,========
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Camille Hawthorne" <camillehawthorne(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Any builders in Boise? |
I'll be moving with a bunch of greenish airplane pieces to the Boise Idaho
area from Delaware in October. I was wondering if any of you are building
there, as I have a lot of questions and few answers.
Camille
N5YR reserved
wish I'd saved those boxes
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Builder's Bookstore" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Video "BEEN THERE" |
John McMahon wrote:
>
> Has anyone on the list seen or own the video's
> BEEN THERE ...It is a four tape set on building
> an award RV.............How good is the tape???
I've seen them. We considered adding them to our catalog. The guy tours
you around his finished plane showing you features that he installed and
some of the techniques he used while building. He did some nice things
that are fun to see; and then there is the fact that there is no such
thing as "too much knowledge". However, $180 is sort of pricey and I
felt that too many customers would have been dissappointed at what they
got for the money; so we chose not to carry it. I believe the Orndorff
tapes are far superior for learning to build your plane.
Andy
Builder's Bookstore
http://www.buildersbooks.com
eCharts
http://www.eCharts.cc
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John B. Abell" <jbabell(at)mediaone.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Mac Servo/Switch Question... |
Hi Kurt,
The trim switch in your stick grip is a SPDT switch and needs a relay deck in
order to operate with a MAC servo. MAC also makes the relay deck. DC power
connects to the trim system through a circuit breaker and the relay deck. Call
MAC and ask them about this if you have any more questions. BTW, you will need
one relay deck for pitch trim and one for roll trim, i.e., if you're going to use
electric roll trim.
Best wishes,
Jack Abell
KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
> Folks,
>
> A quick question for those in the know. Im wiring the Mac Trim serve
> that is on my elevator to my Infinity control stick and have a bit of a
> question...!! The servo has 5 wires comming out of it: 2 control the
> forward/backward (up/down) movement of the trim servo screw..these are both
> white in color. The other 3, Blue/Green/and Orange connect into the position
> indicator to indicate servo movement. The control stick that I am using has
> 3 wires (from the coolie hat control) that control pitch trim. The middle
> wire (and center postion on the switch) is a ground (black wire) The other
> two wires are Brown and Solid Blue and control up down movement. My question
> is how does the servo get 12V power? I have wired everything per the plans
> of both the Mac servo and the control grip. I have checked the switches and
> wires with a volt/ohm meter and connections are good. The serve motor moves
> when directly attached to the battery. The only 12V input to the system is
> the Red/white stripped wire comming from the position indicator (light).
> Obviously I am missing something in the wiring setup or some additional part
> is required. I know it doesnt work because it isn't getting any 12V
> power.....just wondering how it is supposed to get that power or if maybe the
> control stick is not compatible with the MAC servo. As always thanks ahead
> of time for your responses. Take care and happy building/flying!!!
>
> Kurt, OKC, OK
> 6A QB
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Mac Servo/Switch Question... |
> A quick question for those in the know. Im wiring the Mac Trim serve
>that is on my elevator to my Infinity control stick and have a bit of a
>question...!! The servo has 5 wires comming out of it: 2 control the
>forward/backward (up/down) movement of the trim servo screw..these are both
>white in color. The other 3, Blue/Green/and Orange connect into the
position
>indicator to indicate servo movement. The control stick that I am using
has
>3 wires (from the coolie hat control) that control pitch trim. The middle
>wire (and center postion on the switch) is a ground (black wire) The other
>two wires are Brown and Solid Blue and control up down movement. My
question
>is how does the servo get 12V power? I have wired everything per the plans
>of both the Mac servo and the control grip. I have checked the switches and
>wires with a volt/ohm meter and connections are good. The serve motor moves
>when directly attached to the battery. The only 12V input to the system is
>the Red/white stripped wire comming from the position indicator (light).
>Obviously I am missing something in the wiring setup or some additional part
>is required. I know it doesnt work because it isn't getting any 12V
>power.....just wondering how it is supposed to get that power or if maybe
the
>control stick is not compatible with the MAC servo. As always thanks ahead
>of time for your responses. Take care and happy building/flying!!!
MAC uses a permanent magnet motor where direction of rotation is determined
by polarity of the applied voltage . . . I've complained to MAC folks
at OSH booth many times about the two WHITE wires . . . they could be
different colors where on color is (+) extend and (+) retract . . . I
could put out ACCURATE wiring diagrams for their product. Two white wires
just doesn't cut . . .
Gunching aside, the trim swich in an Infinity grip will not directly
interface with a MAC servo. MAC sells a "relay deck" for this purpose.
You can also use a two pole, double throw, center off (on)-off-(on) rocker
switch to directly drive the servo's PM motor. The wiring with a
relay deck is shown at . . .
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/trim.pdf
If you want to build your own relay deck, two small relays
wired as shown in . . .
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/trim2.pdf
will do the trick.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different than )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Mac Servo/Switch Question... |
Kurt,
The servo gets +12V (and ground) through the switch when you use the original
switch. If you are using the switch on a stick grip then you usually must use a
relay stack and the +12V and ground will be supplied through the relays.
Dave Bristol, still waiting for the prop governer and the first flight at CMA
SoCal
KAKlewin(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
> Folks,
>
> A quick question for those in the know. Im wiring the Mac Trim serve
> that is on my elevator to my Infinity control stick and have a bit of a
> question...!! The servo has 5 wires comming out of it: 2 control the
> forward/backward (up/down) movement of the trim servo screw..these are both
> white in color. The other 3, Blue/Green/and Orange connect into the position
> indicator to indicate servo movement. The control stick that I am using has
> 3 wires (from the coolie hat control) that control pitch trim. The middle
> wire (and center postion on the switch) is a ground (black wire) The other
> two wires are Brown and Solid Blue and control up down movement. My question
> is how does the servo get 12V power? I have wired everything per the plans
> of both the Mac servo and the control grip. I have checked the switches and
> wires with a volt/ohm meter and connections are good. The serve motor moves
> when directly attached to the battery. The only 12V input to the system is
> the Red/white stripped wire comming from the position indicator (light).
> Obviously I am missing something in the wiring setup or some additional part
> is required. I know it doesnt work because it isn't getting any 12V
> power.....just wondering how it is supposed to get that power or if maybe the
> control stick is not compatible with the MAC servo. As always thanks ahead
> of time for your responses. Take care and happy building/flying!!!
>
> Kurt, OKC, OK
> 6A QB
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob DiMeo - Oracle <dimeob(at)powertel.com.au> |
Hal,
You can turn off strobes but not position lights during night operations,
VFR or IFR. The FAA will not take the excuse that they were "disturbing"
you.
Bob
RV8#423
> ----------
> From: kempthornes
> Sent: Friday, August 18, 2000 09:33 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: alternators
>
>
> > If you're in a cloud night IFR and don't have your nav lights on the FAA
> will bust you.
>
> FAR number violated please? Are you the Administrator?
>
> I believe that, as PIC, I have the right to turn off position lites (if
> that is what you ean by 'nav lites') if they disturb me.
>
> Hal Kempthorne
> 2578 Elliot Court
> Santa Clara, CA 95051-1849
> 408.244.4984 CELL 408.230.0891
> RV6a N7HK 99%
> 1965 Debonair for sale!
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Video "BEEN THERE" |
I have the tape and found it useful. It is, however, expensive and a random
walk. It concentrates mainly on final assembly and engine compartment
details. The video technique is excellent. If you have George's tapes,
then this is a good follow-on.
Dennis Persyk 6A N600 DP O320A1A Hartzell 0.0 hours
Hampshire, IL C38
-----Original Message-----
From: John McMahon <rv6(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Sunday, August 20, 2000 9:07 PM
Subject: RV-List: Video "BEEN THERE"
>
>Has anyone on the list seen or own the video's
>BEEN THERE ...It is a four tape set on building
> an award RV.............How good is the tape???
>
> Thanks
> John McMahon (rv6 side skins)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | probes for RMI (need help) |
I need some input on where these things go. I have only one cht and egt for
a RV4 O-360 and I'm trying to find out the best location on the exhaust and
which cylinder. What's up with the MP sensor, it's looks incomplete and
straight from Napa? I also think my monitor is incomplete, does it come with
a molex connector to attach to the back of the unit or do I build my own.
Carey Mills
Fire wall forward &
1 week left in US Army Flight School, check ride Tues night.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | nowakod(at)us.ibm.com |
| Subject: | Cables through firewall? |
Folks, I am ready to route the cables (throttle, mixture, carb heat)
through the firewall on my -6. I am totally confused on the subject of
clamping them at the firewall. I don't think I need the eyeball passthrus
as my cables will not be making any sharp bends. I think I need the bukhead
connections as shown on page 150 or 151 of ACS catalog but I don't know how
they work. The large threaded end of the cable has to pass through
them...are they big enough? are they split? Any education on this subject
would be appreciated. If you have info on where to buy and what part
number, you would be my hero....thanks in advance.....don
( oh yeah, My carb heat cable is a Bowden, .188 inches, My throttle is the
same size as the Trim tab cable (I think .375 inches) and the mixture cable
is .250 inches.)
P.S. after I get through this obstacle I have to figure out what kind of
bracket to use at the engine/carb. Heard good and bad about the Van's
bracket. Any advice here would also be appreciated.
Don Nowakowski...FWF....RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | old ogre <jollyd(at)teleport.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cables through firewall? |
I have used vans brackets, and pass thrus, for my mustang-II and they work
fine...they don't know they are in a mustang...believe me, at least I THINK
that unless you want to pay more money, youcan't go wrong on a proven design,
and van has sold a lot of the parts...of course I could be wrong...jolly in
aurora, selling mustang-II (i hope) for a RV8A...
nowakod(at)us.ibm.com wrote:
>
> Folks, I am ready to route the cables (throttle, mixture, carb heat)
> through the firewall on my -6. I am totally confused on the subject of
> clamping them at the firewall. I don't think I need the eyeball passthrus
> as my cables will not be making any sharp bends. I think I need the bukhead
> connections as shown on page 150 or 151 of ACS catalog but I don't know how
> they work. The large threaded end of the cable has to pass through
> them...are they big enough? are they split? Any education on this subject
> would be appreciated. If you have info on where to buy and what part
> number, you would be my hero....thanks in advance.....don
>
> ( oh yeah, My carb heat cable is a Bowden, .188 inches, My throttle is the
> same size as the Trim tab cable (I think .375 inches) and the mixture cable
> is .250 inches.)
>
> P.S. after I get through this obstacle I have to figure out what kind of
> bracket to use at the engine/carb. Heard good and bad about the Van's
> bracket. Any advice here would also be appreciated.
>
> Don Nowakowski...FWF....RV-6
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jaugilas <jaugilas(at)mediaone.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tapping Aluminum |
In the old days, we just used kerosene.
Bill Jaugilas
Dennis Persyk wrote:
>
> Use "Tap Magic for Aluminum" (Cleaveland sells it), good quality tap
> (General, or taps from Avery) and blow out hole frequently.
> Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP O360A1A, Hartzell
> Hampshire, IL C38
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jeff Point <jpoint(at)execpc.com>
> To: RV List
> Date: Sunday, August 20, 2000 4:02 AM
> Subject: RV-List: Tapping Aluminum
>
> >
> >Any one have experience tapping thicker aluminum for small screws (#6 or
> >8)? Does 2024 or 6061 work better, or are both too soft? Any other
> >advice?
> >
> >Jeff Point
> >-6 wings
> >Milwaukee, WI
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Conical Engine Mounts |
08/21/2000 09:19:33 AM
I found some useful data on the conical mount (like torque, part numbers,
sag, washer location(s)) from the Wag Aero catalog and the piper pa-20 &
22 pacer series aircraft. They used conicals and I read the piper
maintenance manual on these aircraft...refering to the engine mount
section. Basically, not rocket science....no surprises.
"richard george" <rag43_@hotmail.com>@matronics.com on 08/20/2000 12:57:43
PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV-List: Conical Engine Mounts
Looking for specifications on replacing the rubber inserts on straight
conical engine mounts for a O320. Thanks!
Richard George rv4 1322D
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: IO- Versus O- (longish) |
08/21/2000 09:51:31 AM
Carb. for me also. The high pressure elect. fuel pump was 450.00$, the FI
system was 2800.00$. My brand new carb was 495.00. Also my mission and need
and wallet went with the Carb. Agree with all of Brian comments. Review
your needs and talk with folks on both sides of the fence....
"Brian Denk" (at)matronics.com on 08/20/2000 06:56:22 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: IO- Versus O- (longish)
>So the score is tied, 1-1. I'm too ignorant to break it and am asking
>for a little help. Owners of both types comment?
>Education is what "Experimental" is all about, right?
>:)
>And if you're still with me, thanks...
>
>
>Mike Thompson
>Austin, TX
>-6 N140RV (Reserved)
>Fuselage (and engine-less)
Mike,
I chose a carbureted engine (O-360A4J, 180hp with updraft sump conversion).
Reasons:
1. Primary mission is fun flying, including Young Eagles with associated
hot
starts.
2. No sustained inverted operations, just positively loaded "gentleman
aerobatics".
3. Simplicity. I can understand a carburetor. A fuel injector servo...well,
hmm, dunno.
4. No high pressure fuel pump required, nor skinny spider lines running on
the top of the (hot) engine cylinders.
5. I could not find an injected, low time, running engine anywhere and coud
not afford a freshly rebuilt or new one. I did find a few low time O-360's
to choose from, but it took many months. Patience and advance planning is
key here.
I finally found a low time (300 hrs. SMOH) engine out of a regularly
operated airplane that was storm wrecked. It suited my needs and wallet,
and
the deal was made. I've been very happy with the decision and would do the
same if I were building another RV. (Yikes!)
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
113 hrs.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: probes for RMI (need help) |
Rvmils(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
>
> I need some input on where these things go. I have only one cht and egt for
> a RV4 O-360 and I'm trying to find out the best location on the exhaust and
> which cylinder.
Carey, I did what many RVers do and put the probes on #3.
What's up with the MP sensor, it's looks incomplete and
> straight from Napa?
It is indeed straight from NAPA but is all you need. Follow the
instructions in the manual and it will work fine.
I also think my monitor is incomplete, does it come with
> a molex connector to attach to the back of the unit or do I build my own.
No Molex included, and you don't have to use one unless you really want
to. I terminated all the ground shields on a terminal strip which was
velcroed to the tray, and the hot leads go straight to the connector on
the tray.
I considered a master connector but decided against it in favor of
simplicity. You will like the uMonitor, it is a very nice unit.
Good luck with your check ride!
Sam Buchanan RV-6, monitored via RMI units)
http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)accessus.net> |
How will they know if you are in the soup???
Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact!
(Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob DiMeo - Oracle" <dimeob(at)powertel.com.au>
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2000 10:27 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: alternators
>
> Hal,
>
> You can turn off strobes but not position lights during night
operations,
> VFR or IFR. The FAA will not take the excuse that they were "disturbing"
> you.
>
> Bob
> RV8#423
>
> > ----------
> > From: kempthornes
> > Sent: Friday, August 18, 2000 09:33 PM
> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: alternators
> >
> >
> > > If you're in a cloud night IFR and don't have your nav lights on the
FAA
> > will bust you.
> >
> > FAR number violated please? Are you the Administrator?
> >
> > I believe that, as PIC, I have the right to turn off position lites (if
> > that is what you ean by 'nav lites') if they disturb me.
> >
> > Hal Kempthorne
> > 2578 Elliot Court
> > Santa Clara, CA 95051-1849
> > 408.244.4984 CELL 408.230.0891
> > RV6a N7HK 99%
> > 1965 Debonair for sale!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Craig Hiers" <craig-rv4(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: probes for RMI (need help) |
Cary
Put the egt and cht on the #4 cylinder as it's usually the hottest.
Also, you can get a multiplex switch and buy 6 more probes ( 3cht,3egt )
and be able to monitor all cylinders.
Ron at RMI can tell you where to get the switches.
Craig
> I need some input on where these things go. I have only one cht and egt
for
> a RV4 O-360 and I'm trying to find out the best location on the exhaust
and
> which cylinder.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Eaves" <doneaves(at)bigfoot.com> |
| Subject: | Cables through firewall? |
I used them & if I had it to do again I would use the firewall Shields on
page 251 with the proper size grommets. Use Vans bracket at the Carb and
that will hold the ends in place for proper operation.
Don Eaves - RV6 - Memphis - Installing Wings Today -
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
nowakod(at)us.ibm.com
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 6:37 AM
Subject: RV-List: Cables through firewall?
Folks, I am ready to route the cables (throttle, mixture, carb heat)
through the firewall on my -6. I am totally confused on the subject of
clamping them at the firewall. I don't think I need the eyeball passthrus
as my cables will not be making any sharp bends. I think I need the bukhead
connections as shown on page 150 or 151 of ACS catalog but I don't know how
they work. The large threaded end of the cable has to pass through
them...are they big enough? are they split? Any education on this subject
would be appreciated. If you have info on where to buy and what part
number, you would be my hero....thanks in advance.....don
( oh yeah, My carb heat cable is a Bowden, .188 inches, My throttle is the
same size as the Trim tab cable (I think .375 inches) and the mixture cable
is .250 inches.)
P.S. after I get through this obstacle I have to figure out what kind of
bracket to use at the engine/carb. Heard good and bad about the Van's
bracket. Any advice here would also be appreciated.
Don Nowakowski...FWF....RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy J. Pflanzer" <rpflanze(at)iquest.net> |
| Subject: | Rivet Motivation - Long Post |
This is a flying story to possibly help motivate you to keep pounding those
rivets. If not interested, hit DELETE now.
This weekend, as happens most weekends here and around the country, a bunch
of us RV'ers headed to a local airport breakfast fly-in. For the
Indianapolis First Air Force, the Sunday destination was the LaPorte County
Breakfast and Aviation day. The high stratus moved off to the south and the
day developed into gorgeous sunshine, 60 degree temps, and unlimited
visibilities. Just the kind of flying day I needed after a busy week of
work, thunderstorms, and a teardown/replacement of my magnetos.
As is our custom, we meet up in the air and start monitoring the "RV
frequency" (122.75). I departed Indianapolis Metro airport and swung
northwest. I just love flying early in the morning. A touch of ground haze
and the low light angles soften the features of the patchwork fields
surrounded by bedroom communities. The air is still and the frequencies are
quiet with just the low drone of my engine to keep me company. Before long,
I realize that the rest of the RV family is airborne too. A flight of three
are just ahead of me as I try like heck to catch them, but even at 160 KTS,
I trailed just behind the whole way. The air is smooth and the views joyous
as we all cruised north, jabbering and taunting each other as we went. We
also heard some Cessna folks on the frequency as they headed to northern IL
for a breakfast flight. They talked about having to SLOW DOWN from 120 KTS
so some guys could catch them. I glanced down at my GPS, which was
indicating 178 KTS groundspeed and just smiled. Man, life is good.
Once on the ground at LaPorte, we were given front row parking to show off
our birds. Two other RVs were already there and two more came in shortly
after we landed. We all met up and I enjoyed one of the best fly-in
breakfasts I've had. After a little more visiting, the four of us departed
in formation and headed out in our own directions.
Bob Japundza and I flew formation back to Indy. As we were cruising along
just above a few small cumulous clouds that had begun to pop up, I thought
about the fact that four months ago, both Bob and I had our birds in our
garages as we struggled to get the last details finished. Now, we're
cruising the countryside, in formation, on a beautiful day, doing better
that 200 MPH over the ground.
Bob peeled off to visit another friend and I dropped down to pattern
altitude and greased on a wheel landing in a quartering crosswind. One of
my most favorite parts of any trip is rolling back the canopy and cruising
back to the hanger with arms over the side and hair (what's left of it)
blowing in the wind. All that excitement and it's not even 11:30 am yet.
I polish off the bugs and place my baby back in her bed for the next time.
I'm just like the 18 wheeler drivers who always look back at their rig when
they walk away. I step back to look at my rig sitting in the hanger, all
polished up, gleaming in the mid-morning sun, just begging to go back up
again. Sadly, I turn out the lights and lower the door on another fabulous
flying day.
I've come to understand why I pounded rivets for almost seven years. It's
for days just like Sunday.
Randy Pflanzer N417G
RV-6 (46 hours)
http://members.iquest.net/~rpflanze
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis" <mnellis(at)emailusa.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Sheared Wing Tips |
You sure can mount the Landing Light in the sheared tips. Bernie Kerr down
in Florida did it with his. I've got a picture some where...shuffle,
shuffle......around....shuffle shuffle.....here....shuffle....ah! Here it
is!. I'll post it on my web site later today.
Mike Nellis - RV-6 Wings N699BM (res)
Plainfield, IL
http://mnellis.jnet.net/rv-6_page
----- Original Message -----
From: <CW9371(at)AOL.COM>
Sent: Saturday, August 19, 2000 3:57 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Sheared Wing Tips
>
> In a message dated 8/19/2000 11:55:04 AM Central Daylight Time,
> pdsmith(at)pacbell.net writes:
>
> << Rob:
>
> Price is $475 for both tips -the lighting is in both tips - but Scott
told
> me that the lens is too small to hold the landing lights. You'd have to
cut
> those into the wings. I got my hot tips from Dan & Oliver in BFL (see
Yeller
> pages).
>
> Phil Smith, 80691 >>
>
>
> Phil,
> Well its been a while since you have talked to team rocket as scott has
long
> been gone for a long long times, which is good since he didnt know what he
> was talking about.
> You can mount landing lights in the wing tip under the lexan tip. However
> the have to be the small round 55 watt driving light style.
> If you want to mount the duckworks landing light they have to go in the
wing
> You do have to buy the strobes and the landing lights, they are not
included.
>
>
> chris wilcox
> f1 rocket kit 000
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pat Perry" <pperryrv(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Award for Dumbest Blunder |
Oh! have I got one for this.
I built my wings on a free standing wing jig in my garage right in front of
the garage door. Since the garage is under the house it has a low ceiling
and there are two I beams that hang 6" lower than the rest of the ceiling.
As I was completeing the fit on the fuel tanks and fighting with the 3"
space under the beam I decided it would be much easier to work if the jig
was back about 3' farther from the door and out from under the low hanging
beam. This would put the other end of the wing under the other beam but
that didn't matter, I was done with that end.
I figured the easiest way to move the complete jig (about 400#) with two 90%
completed wings still atached would be to just shove it with the front of my
truck. As you can see it was late and my mind was tired!
I pulled the truck in the door slowly tapped the push-bar to the frame of
the jig. The push went well for about 2' then the jig came to a
stop..."must of hit that seam in the concrete" I thought as I jently gave it
a little more force. The second try yeilded a chirp from the tires so I
backed off to take a look. Thats when I realized I had Hit the leading edge
of the right wing on the beam I thought it would fit right under.
Fortunatly the tiny lip of the spar that holds the wing on the jig was
clamped tight enough to keep the wing from falling off the jig and the beam
flange fit perfect to the end of the leading edge so there was very little
deformation.
The shock of how close I came to destroying my wings sent a chill through me
like no other. It took weeks for the horrible thoughts of a wing falling to
the floor to stop haunting me every time I worked on the project.
Pat Perry
Dallas, PA
RV-4 N154PK wiring and pre paint finish work.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
| Subject: | Flap push rod tubes |
F659A being the little bitty hunk of tubing that you make the flap rod
pushers out of.
First off, how many of you can drill it straight and clean by eyeball so it
threads without a wobble, like mine does ?
I also thought that Van's part left much to be desired. I made my flap push
tubes from a larger piece (1/2" or so) of aluminum tubing that I got from
the local ultralight builder. He also had the threaded inserts that fit the
tubing and mated to the rod end.
You can see similar items on the top of page 156 in your 2000 Wicks catalog,
or the bottom of page 135 in your 1998-99 ACS catalog. Make your own if
you've got access to a lathe.
Vince Frazier
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles E. Brame" <charleyb(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | F-633 Control Column Mount |
Not to keep beating a dead horse, but....
For Dennis: I concur that installation and operation of the controls
should be silky smooth - and that's part of the problem. As I said in a
previous post, my control column mounts are currently installed as per
the plans and but the control torque tube will only rotate up (nose
down) a few degrees from the full nose up position before contacting the
inside of the ribs - and that's before connecting any of the push rods.
If the control movement is severly restricted even before connecting the
rods, you can understand my concern.
The QB version has all of the floor ribs already installed with large
egg shaped holes cut out to accept the control torque tube. With my
F-633 mounted as the plans specify, I will have to relieve nearly an
additional inch of the inside of four ribs, leaving less than a 1/2 inch
of metal at the top of each rib - a pretty significant reduction in rib
strength. Thus my concern. IMHO, moving the control mounts down a 1/4
inch should make very little difference in the feel of the controls, and
will cause no problems on the aileron push rods. But still waiting on
confirmation from Van. Meanwhile, I checked all my RVators for the
article you mentioned but couldn't find it. Any suggestions? Thanks for
the comments.
For Gary: I have completed the empannage and the wings, but have not
mounted either to the fuselage as of yet. I have installed the elevator
bell crank and connected both the F-689 and F690 rods to the bell crank.
It looks like lowering the control mount will have no effect on the
elevator connections. I will admit that I had not considered clearances
on the aileron push rod connections, so will investigate that.
Charlie Brame
RV-6A QB, On the gear
San Antonio, TXl
> >
> >Taking all the suggestions, I took that challenge today. After Charles
> >Brame's suggestion on hole distance being less than the 1/2" Van's
> suggests,
> >I decided to make some small changes to the F-633 mount. If you make the
> >top distance more like 1/4" then the mount is too long and hits the bottom
> >of the bulkhead. ----->>>>(Van's original 1/2" doesn't allow the control
> tube to
> >move freely without cutting out the floor ribs <<<<----
> >Gary S. - 6AQB fuselage control sticks - soon moving to brakes & rudder
> >peddles
>
> I can't speak for the QB, but my slow build instructions specifically call
> out relieving the ribs for control tube clearance. I believe this is a
> normal and required exercise in installing the control system. There are
> pictures in past RVAtors on the subject. I would tread cautiously on
> relocating the F633s for a couple of reasons:
> 1) RV controls should be silky-smooth with no change in force required to
> achieve displacement until you reach the hard stops and you hear and feel a
> resounding clunk.
> 2) You will have no clue as to the amount of clearance required for the
> control assembly until you have mounted elevators and ailerons and rigged
> the controls to provide the specified deflections. I thought I had
> everything working smoothly but when I finally torqued the bolts on the
> aileron bellcranks, I had some interference with the rod end bearing and the
> bellcrank. I had never seen it before because I just dropped in the AN3
> bolts and didn't put on nuts. I solved the problem with the special little
> 0.062 thick washers for rod end bearing use. I use this as an example to
> illustrate that at the stage of installing the F633s there is alot more
> ahead of you.
>
> Please proceed with caution -- control systems are very critical.
>
> Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP O360A1A Hartzell 0.0 hours
> Hampshire, IL C38
>
>
------------------------------------------
> From: "Gary & Tena Strong" <gstrong(at)uswest.net>
> Subject: RE: RV-List: F-633 Control Column Mount
>
>
> Moving the F-633 mounts down about 3/16" provides complete stop to stop
> rotation of the control column without interference with the ribs. The top
> of the F-633 is about 1 1/2" from the top of F-604 bulkhead. Basically when
> you rotate to the upper limit, there is still a few thousanths clearance
> before hitting the factory rib cuttouts. I put a piece of conduit through
> F-605 and F-606 (I assume you meant F-605 since I don't see where it passes
> through F-604) and it appears that there will be no problems connecting the
> F-689 rudder control with the control column. There is about 1 1/2" from
> the bottom of the fuselage and the bottom of the control column piece that
> attaches to F-689. Only time will tell if this will work, but looking and
> measuring everything I can think of it appears fine. I definately hear the
> caution of Dennis, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed.
>
> On another note, Charlie do you have your wings & rudder mounted? If so you
> may find out how it all fits together prior to me, and if so I'd welcome
> your thoughts as you connect all the control tubes together.
>
> Gary S. - RV6AQB
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Award for Dumbest Blunder |
Oh my God! Man, I was reading that and thought I was reading a story about
how you managed to build two sets of wings. Glad to hear it didn't go
completely wrong. I did hear a story a little while back from a builder who
dropped one of his wings on the floor. Caved it in about 10 inches between
two of the ribs on the leading edge...but some brilliant body work and you'd
never know it if he didn't tell you. Name witheld to protect the innocent.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Pat Perry" <pperryrv(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 11:41 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Award for Dumbest Blunder
>
> Oh! have I got one for this.
>
> I built my wings on a free standing wing jig in my garage right in front
of
> the garage door. Since the garage is under the house it has a low ceiling
> and there are two I beams that hang 6" lower than the rest of the ceiling.
> As I was completeing the fit on the fuel tanks and fighting with the 3"
> space under the beam I decided it would be much easier to work if the jig
> was back about 3' farther from the door and out from under the low hanging
> beam. This would put the other end of the wing under the other beam but
> that didn't matter, I was done with that end.
>
> I figured the easiest way to move the complete jig (about 400#) with two
90%
> completed wings still atached would be to just shove it with the front of
my
> truck. As you can see it was late and my mind was tired!
>
> I pulled the truck in the door slowly tapped the push-bar to the frame of
> the jig. The push went well for about 2' then the jig came to a
> stop..."must of hit that seam in the concrete" I thought as I jently gave
it
> a little more force. The second try yeilded a chirp from the tires so I
> backed off to take a look. Thats when I realized I had Hit the leading
edge
> of the right wing on the beam I thought it would fit right under.
> Fortunatly the tiny lip of the spar that holds the wing on the jig was
> clamped tight enough to keep the wing from falling off the jig and the
beam
> flange fit perfect to the end of the leading edge so there was very little
> deformation.
>
> The shock of how close I came to destroying my wings sent a chill through
me
> like no other. It took weeks for the horrible thoughts of a wing falling
to
> the floor to stop haunting me every time I worked on the project.
>
>
> Pat Perry
> Dallas, PA
> RV-4 N154PK wiring and pre paint finish work.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RGray67968(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Introduction & question |
Hi Folks,
Been on the list for about 1 year now. I sold my beloved Kitfox 912 about
a month ago which has given me even more motivation towards my RV6 QB that I
received 3 months ago. Ordered my engine from Bart (O-360), delivery expected
in November. I went to Osh Kosh for the 1st time this year and met many of
the listers, Paul Rosolas, Chris Good, Sam Buchannon, and Gary Sobek to name
a few...........what a GREAT bunch.
Question (verification) (only 1 hit in the archives): I'm attaching my
forward to skin (F-6106). The top edges of the forward side skins have been
pre-drilled and dimpled from the factory but rivets have been installed from
the F-6105 back (along both F-6110's). Do I remove the rivets and back drill
the lower side edges of my top skin or do I drill and countersink the top
skin in this area between the existing rivets? Or am I missing the whole
picture?
Thanks in advance.
Rick Gray RV6QB
Ohio (Blue Skies today at the Buffalo Farm)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DAVE BERGH" <dbergh(at)micron.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Any builders in Boise? |
Hello Camille,
I am not sure how many builders are actually at Boise but I do Know of
quite a few in the Nampa/Caldwell area which is just a few miles down the
road. I am in Mtn Home which is 40 miles east of Boise. You should be in
good hands with the number of builders within a 30 minute drive. Welcome to
Idaho. Please Bring some rain with you before we burn up the entire state!
Dave Bergh
RV 6 Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: Camille Hawthorne <camillehawthorne(at)hotmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2000 8:58 PM
Subject: RV-List: Any builders in Boise?
>
>
> I'll be moving with a bunch of greenish airplane pieces to the Boise Idaho
> area from Delaware in October. I was wondering if any of you are building
> there, as I have a lot of questions and few answers.
>
> Camille
> N5YR reserved
> wish I'd saved those boxes
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Hello Listers
How far from the sidewalls or how far apart have you placed the fuel tank
vent line bulkhead fittings in the belly? After drilling the holes for the
fittings it looks like they might interfere with the landing gear
intersection fairing. I didn't think about the fairing location while
drilling the holes from the inside. Hopefully I will not have to plug the
holes. I hate the idea of patches on the airplane. If I do have to patch
the holes this is another example of drilling holes without thinking ahead.
Cash Copeland
QB #60075
RV-6 N46FC (Reserved)
Oakland, Ca
Cash Copeland
RV-6 N46FC (Reserved)
Oakland, Ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
Hal,
Let me jump in here. I'm not flaming or pointing any fingers here. Take a
look at FAR 91.209. It clearly states that the position lights must be on
from sunset to sunrise when operating. It is the anticollision light that
can be turned off if necessary. Although, being realistic, I don't see that
there is going to be an FAA inspector in the same clouds at the same time.
But it is a safety factor to make sure you are seen if some idiot is up
there in the same airspace.
Mike Robertson
"Das Fed"
RV-8A
>From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV-List: alternators
>Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2000 18:33:49 -0700
>
>
> > If you're in a cloud night IFR and don't have your nav lights on the FAA
>will bust you.
>
>FAR number violated please? Are you the Administrator?
>
>I believe that, as PIC, I have the right to turn off position lites (if
>that is what you ean by 'nav lites') if they disturb me.
>
>Hal Kempthorne
>2578 Elliot Court
>Santa Clara, CA 95051-1849
>408.244.4984 CELL 408.230.0891
>RV6a N7HK 99%
>1965 Debonair for sale!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis" <mnellis(at)emailusa.net> |
| Subject: | Re: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock |
Are,
How will you secure the piece of hinge? Will you rivet it or use a screw.
If you use a screw, then there is the problem of taking the screw out and
chipping the paint after it's painted. If you rivet it in place, then how
do you remove it?
I got the idea I used from my friend Paul Golias and modified it to use a
piece of hinge like yours but in a difference location. Just another way of
doing the same thing.
http://mnellis.jnet.net/RV-6_Page/elevator_4.htm#TrimHingeSecure
Mike Nellis - RV-6 Wings N699BM (res)
Plainfield, IL
http://mnellis.jnet.net/rv-6_page
----- Original Message -----
From: "Are Barstad" <abarstad(at)bconnex.net>
Sent: Saturday, August 19, 2000 10:46 PM
Subject: RV-List: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock
>
> I spent a long time looking at RV's at Oshkosh and at my local airport
when
> building my empennage. I wasn't sure how to best lock the trimtab hinge
pin.
> The archive provided me with some ideas but I still wanted to see it
myself
> on a real RV.
>
> I saw many different ways at Oshkosh but the best by far was one I saw at
my
> local airport at Brampton (Ontario, Canada). Subsequently I used this same
> method and I think it looks and works great with material supplied in the
> kit. I simply used a part of the hinge that I cut and riveted it on the
left
> elevator. Note that you have to pay attention in order to get the required
> edge distances on the 'mini-hinge'.
>
> It's a bit hard to explain so I supplied a couple of pictures here if you
> are interested.
>
> http://www.bconnex.net/~abarstad/hinge.html
>
> Are
> RV-8
> Waiting for Wings
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary A. Sobek" <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Vent Lines |
--- JusCash(at)AOL.COM wrote:
> Hello Listers
>
> How far from the sidewalls or how far apart have you
> placed the fuel tank
> vent line bulkhead fittings in the belly? After
> drilling the holes for the
> fittings it looks like they might interfere with the
> landing gear
> intersection fairing. I didn't think about the
> fairing location while
> drilling the holes from the inside. Hopefully I
> will not have to plug the
> holes. I hate the idea of patches on the airplane.
> If I do have to patch
> the holes this is another example of drilling holes
> without thinking ahead.
>
> Cash Copeland
> QB #60075
> RV-6 N46FC (Reserved)
> Oakland, Ca
Cash:
Very good observation. If they are in too close, the
intersection fairings will cover the fitting. It is
possible to put a hole in the fairing and it will
still work. I think my vents are about 6 - 8 " in
from the side. This allow a lot of clearance from
the fairing but does not interfere with the brakes.
You saw my RV-6 at HAF and missed the chance to
measure it then. You will get another chance to
measure it at RHV if you show up for the RV forum on 7
September 2000. Expect to see my RV-6 in, out, and
around the Bay Area for about 6 weeks starting 7
September.
====
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
650+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
"I never knew what real happiness was until I got married; and then it was too
late..." - Jack Handey
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis" <mnellis(at)emailusa.net> |
I've been remiss lately in updating my web site. I've put some pictures of
a trip to Florida and associated RV pics.
There is Bernie Kerrs sheared wing tips with landing light and other nice
RV's at Sebring, FL
Boyd's Super Six
Trim Tab modifications
The start of my wings.
I've got some more wing stuff to come in the next few days.
Mike Nellis - RV-6 Wings N699BM (res)
Plainfield, IL
http://mnellis.jnet.net/rv-6_page
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com> |
Dave Bristol pointed me to 91.209 and Bob DiMeo wrote:
> You can turn off strobes but not position lights during night
operations,
> VFR or IFR. The FAA will not take the excuse that they were "disturbing"
> you.
I seem to learn something every day!
Thanks,
Hal Kempthorne
RV6a N7HK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flap push rod tubes |
> F659A being the little bitty hunk of tubing that you make the flap
rod
> pushers out of.
> I also thought that Van's part left much to be desired.
I haven't heard of many of them failing in service. They would be most
likely to fail while raising flaps while on the ground since they are in
compression when lowering and always when in the air.
hal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larygagnon(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | J stringer and F611/F612 |
Can someone clarify how the J stringer is trimmed at the rear most bulkheads
for an RV 6. I can't find a plan sheet that shows this area in any detail.
The longeron is trimmed around the the bars that later attach the tailwheel
and stab. The rear bulkheads have a joggle in them that leads me to believe
the J stringers are notched around both bulkheads. Orendorfs video and the
pictures in the construction manual seem to show the bulkheads are cut out in
that area for the stringer. Should I be cutting the bulkheads to accept the
stringer or am I correct in trimming the stringer. Thanks in advance for any
advice.
Larry Gagnon
RV6 Fuselage N6LG (reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | 45 degree flaring tool |
Hi guys
Thanks for all the input on flaring tools, I thought the 8 degree diference
would not matter on non pressurized aluminum tubing, apparently this is WAY
not acceptable. So I officially retired my $12 flaring tool, used only on
interior tank vent lines. (bought prefabbed pickup tubes )
Have any luck finding one Bert? Want to sell it to me when youre done?
Kevin Shannon
-9A wings
anxiously waiting for fuse kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
Fellow Listers:
I need some advice from the glass experts. I am just beginning the cowling
of my RV-4. First step is to fit the spinner. My C/S spinner is epoxy and
in it's virgin state, shows a lot of the cloth structure. What process to
you recommend to smooth this out? My thoughts are to sand smooth and then
apply a thin coat of Fiber Fill (of which I have 1 quart purchased
previously but never used). Then they recommend a non-sanding sealer. I do
not plan to paint the aircraft until after the test phase so I will likely
need to apply some type of primer to the Fiberglas parts (cowl, etc) that
will suffice for the test period.
Thanks
Doug
================
Doug Weiler
Hudson, WI
715-386-1239
dougweil(at)pressenter.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com> |
| Subject: | Van's New Factory |
I'd advise anyone that needs to call Van's for anything to hold off for
another week or so. I called to ask about the status of my backordered
Cleaveland wheels and brakes. After being bounced from one extension to the
next for 15 min. I got a cranky clerk who barked at me that they aren't
shipping orders yet. I barked back and told him that I figured as much I
just wanted a status! He calmed down and said things are very hectic and
then tried to show a little of that good customer service I remember by
taking my serial number and name and telling me he'd make sure my order got
expedited. I don't know if it will or not but it made me feel better.
Anyway, I think they need a little more time to settle in.
--
Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE
Network Administrator
Union Safe Deposit Bank
209-946-5116
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Vent Lines |
Gary
Thanks for the info. I will patch the holes and move the vents inboard.
When I fabricate the intersection fairing I'll make them wide enough to cover
the patch.
I will be at RHV for the RV forum then on to Van's for the homecoming.
Cash Copeland
RV-6 N46FC (Reserved)
Oakland, Ca
In a message dated 8/21/00 2:31:43 PM Central Daylight Time,
rv6flier(at)yahoo.com writes:
<<
Cash:
Very good observation. If they are in too close, the
intersection fairings will cover the fitting. It is
possible to put a hole in the fairing and it will
still work. I think my vents are about 6 - 8 " in
from the side. This allow a lot of clearance from
the fairing but does not interfere with the brakes.
You saw my RV-6 at HAF and missed the chance to
measure it then. You will get another chance to
measure it at RHV if you show up for the RV forum on 7
September 2000. Expect to see my RV-6 in, out, and
around the Bay Area for about 6 weeks starting 7
September.
====
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
650+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com >>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: J stringer and F611/F612 |
> Should I be cutting the bulkheads to accept the
> stringer or am I correct in trimming the stringer.
You are correct to be trimming the J-stringer to fit. Back there it
will take more trimming than you will initially feel comfortable with,
but it must be done.
The F611 cutout will be larger because you'll have to allow space to
put the J-stringer in its slots, then push it back to feed the face
over F612.
I have seen several different methods of fitting the area and I don't
think there's a right or wrong way. Just make it fit so that it gives
the skin someplace to attach to.
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX
-6 N140RV (Reserved)
Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Edward Hicks <EdHicks(at)compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Award for Dumbest Blunder |
Listers,
>>I think we should come up with an award for the dumbest blunder a builder
does each year<<
Here's my submission for dumbest blunder, in the category of "mistakes
before the kit is even opened".
An RV-6A Quickbuilder I know took delivery of an airframe and finish kit a
couple of weeks back. About five minutes after the truck had left, as he
was surveying his prized acquisition, he realised that the name and address
on the boxes wasn't his. Then came the realisation that he had taken
delivery of someone else's kit! The kit was a couple of hundred miles from
it's intended owner. I understand the shippers were not happy, though some
part of it must have been their fault.
It says something about the quantity of RV's being shipped around the world
if you can get someone else's airplane.
Best wishes,
Ed Hicks.
RV-6 QB 3808 (Wondering how to safely store that expensive canopy bubble)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Vent Lines |
In a message dated 8/21/00 2:18:33 PM Eastern Daylight Time, JusCash(at)AOL.COM
writes:
<< Hello Listers
How far from the sidewalls or how far apart have you placed the fuel tank
vent line bulkhead fittings in the belly? >>
4" inboard from the fuselage sides works just fine on a -6.
Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA
RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth
To the Airport by Labor Day!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Calvert" <rv6bldr(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: J stringer and F611/F612 |
I notched the stringer.
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok -6 fuse
----- Original Message -----
From: <Larygagnon(at)AOL.COM>
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 3:33 PM
Subject: RV-List: J stringer and F611/F612
>
> Can someone clarify how the J stringer is trimmed at the rear most
bulkheads
> for an RV 6. I can't find a plan sheet that shows this area in any
detail.
> The longeron is trimmed around the the bars that later attach the
tailwheel
> and stab. The rear bulkheads have a joggle in them that leads me to
believe
> the J stringers are notched around both bulkheads. Orendorfs video and
the
> pictures in the construction manual seem to show the bulkheads are cut out
in
> that area for the stringer. Should I be cutting the bulkheads to accept
the
> stringer or am I correct in trimming the stringer. Thanks in advance for
any
> advice.
>
>
> Larry Gagnon
> RV6 Fuselage N6LG (reserved)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | J stringer and F611/F612 |
| From: | Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> |
I notched them to fit the BH's . I think I used hidden rivets until I got
the skin drilled.
Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com
**********************************************
>
> Can someone clarify how the J stringer is trimmed at the rear most
> bulkheads
> for an RV 6.
> snipped............................
> Larry Gagnon
> RV6 Fuselage N6LG (reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel Vent Lines |
JusCash(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
>
> Hello Listers
>
> How far from the sidewalls or how far apart have you placed the fuel tank
> vent line bulkhead fittings in the belly? After drilling the holes for the
> fittings it looks like they might interfere with the landing gear
> intersection fairing. I didn't think about the fairing location while
> drilling the holes from the inside. Hopefully I will not have to plug the
> holes. I hate the idea of patches on the airplane. If I do have to patch
> the holes this is another example of drilling holes without thinking ahead.
>
> Cash Copeland
> QB #60075
> RV-6 N46FC (Reserved)
> Oakland, Ca
>
> Cash Copeland
> RV-6 N46FC (Reserved)
> Oakland, Ca
>
They well work fine with holes drilled in them. Had holes drilled in
my upper gear leg farings for over 11 years now and no problems with
the vents. Infact I did it intentionally that way.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Are Barstad" <abarstad(at)bconnex.net> |
| Subject: | TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock |
I planned to rivet it in with an AN 3-4.5 rivet and drill it out if I ever
have to remove the trim tab. Hopefully I will never have to replace the
trimtab though and even if I do, it shouldn't be much wear replacing it and
even drilling it out a second time for a _third_ trimtab. If I still need to
replace the trimtab a fourth time, I should look for another hobby or a
hangar with a door and padlock :)
I noticed that Van's RV-8A at Oshkosh had a longer hinge pin and bent two or
three different directions and then secured with safety wire to a little
hole on the elevator spar (I think this is right). This is great too and
makes the trimtab replacements easier.
Regards,
Are
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mike Nellis
Sent: August 21, 2000 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock
Are,
How will you secure the piece of hinge? Will you rivet it or use a screw.
If you use a screw, then there is the problem of taking the screw out and
chipping the paint after it's painted. If you rivet it in place, then how
do you remove it?
I got the idea I used from my friend Paul Golias and modified it to use a
piece of hinge like yours but in a difference location. Just another way of
doing the same thing.
http://mnellis.jnet.net/RV-6_Page/elevator_4.htm#TrimHingeSecure
Mike Nellis - RV-6 Wings N699BM (res)
Plainfield, IL
http://mnellis.jnet.net/rv-6_page
----- Original Message -----
From: "Are Barstad" <abarstad(at)bconnex.net>
Sent: Saturday, August 19, 2000 10:46 PM
Subject: RV-List: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock
>
> I spent a long time looking at RV's at Oshkosh and at my local airport
when
> building my empennage. I wasn't sure how to best lock the trimtab hinge
pin.
> The archive provided me with some ideas but I still wanted to see it
myself
> on a real RV.
>
> I saw many different ways at Oshkosh but the best by far was one I saw at
my
> local airport at Brampton (Ontario, Canada). Subsequently I used this same
> method and I think it looks and works great with material supplied in the
> kit. I simply used a part of the hinge that I cut and riveted it on the
left
> elevator. Note that you have to pay attention in order to get the required
> edge distances on the 'mini-hinge'.
>
> It's a bit hard to explain so I supplied a couple of pictures here if you
> are interested.
>
> http://www.bconnex.net/~abarstad/hinge.html
>
> Are
> RV-8
> Waiting for Wings
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
I have seen a couple of RVs With fuel vent lines connected together then one
line going down in the center of aircraft just below bottom of cowl. Anyone
see anything wrong with this?
Tom Benton RV3B
Do not
archive
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)teleport.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel vent lines |
TMB1564(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
>
> I have seen a couple of RVs With fuel vent lines connected together then one
> line going down in the center of aircraft just below bottom of cowl. Anyone
> see anything wrong with this?
> Tom Benton RV3B
> Do not
> archive
>
Yes, if by chance a vent should become plugged you would
still have the other one. You may not know it is plugged
until you have been flying for a while and see a vacuum
on the tank or the engine quits from not being able to
draw fuel.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel vent lines |
If the fuel vent gets clogged fuel cannot transfered from the tank. If both
tanks are on the same vent then fuel cannot be drawn from either tank.
> I have seen a couple of RVs With fuel vent lines connected together then one
> line going down in the center of aircraft just below bottom of cowl. Anyone
> see anything wrong with this?
> Tom Benton RV3B
>
> --
> Gary Zilik - Pine Junction, Colorado
> RV-6A N99PZ Flying
> Engine: Aerosport Power O-360-A1A with H2AD Pistons
> Prop: Sensenich 72FM8S9-1-83
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Harvey Sigmon" <flyhars(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: IO- Versus O- (longish) |
Phil: I am looking for a MA4-SPA for my 160 LYC, where did you find the
carb, for your project. I have to buy one very soon. Thanks
Harvey Sigmon RV-6AQB - Cowl Fiberglas Hell DNA
----- Original Message -----
From: <pcondon(at)csc.com>
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: IO- Versus O- (longish)
>
> Carb. for me also. The high pressure elect. fuel pump was 450.00$, the FI
> system was 2800.00$. My brand new carb was 495.00. Also my mission and
need
> and wallet went with the Carb. Agree with all of Brian comments. Review
> your needs and talk with folks on both sides of the fence....
>
>
> "Brian Denk" (at)matronics.com on 08/20/2000 06:56:22 PM
>
> Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
> Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> cc:
>
> Subject: Re: RV-List: IO- Versus O- (longish)
>
>
>
> >So the score is tied, 1-1. I'm too ignorant to break it and am asking
> >for a little help. Owners of both types comment?
> >Education is what "Experimental" is all about, right?
> >:)
> >And if you're still with me, thanks...
> >
> >
> >Mike Thompson
> >Austin, TX
> >-6 N140RV (Reserved)
> >Fuselage (and engine-less)
>
> Mike,
>
> I chose a carbureted engine (O-360A4J, 180hp with updraft sump
conversion).
>
> Reasons:
>
> 1. Primary mission is fun flying, including Young Eagles with associated
> hot
> starts.
>
> 2. No sustained inverted operations, just positively loaded "gentleman
> aerobatics".
>
> 3. Simplicity. I can understand a carburetor. A fuel injector
servo...well,
> hmm, dunno.
>
> 4. No high pressure fuel pump required, nor skinny spider lines running on
> the top of the (hot) engine cylinders.
>
> 5. I could not find an injected, low time, running engine anywhere and
coud
> not afford a freshly rebuilt or new one. I did find a few low time
O-360's
> to choose from, but it took many months. Patience and advance planning is
> key here.
>
> I finally found a low time (300 hrs. SMOH) engine out of a regularly
> operated airplane that was storm wrecked. It suited my needs and wallet,
> and
> the deal was made. I've been very happy with the decision and would do the
> same if I were building another RV. (Yikes!)
>
> Brian Denk
> RV8 N94BD
> 113 hrs.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Flap push rod tubes |
08/21/2000 02:04:46 PM
Didn't like Vans Flap Rods either. I made mine out of 2024t3 solid rod.
Used Vans bearing ends...... however I thougt the hollow tubes a bit
cheesie. A local builder used the thingies from the aileron (little one)
push tube ends. He simply made little (6 inch or so)
aileron tubes for his flap acc. tubes
"Frazier, Vincent A" (at)matronics.com on 08/21/2000
11:46:02 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV-List: Flap push rod tubes
F659A being the little bitty hunk of tubing that you make the flap
rod
pushers out of.
First off, how many of you can drill it straight and clean by eyeball so it
threads without a wobble, like mine does ?
I also thought that Van's part left much to be desired. I made my flap
push
tubes from a larger piece (1/2" or so) of aluminum tubing that I got from
the local ultralight builder. He also had the threaded inserts that fit
the
tubing and mated to the rod end.
You can see similar items on the top of page 156 in your 2000 Wicks
catalog,
or the bottom of page 135 in your 1998-99 ACS catalog. Make your own if
you've got access to a lathe.
Vince Frazier
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel vent lines |
> I have seen a couple of RVs With fuel vent lines connected together then
one
> line going down in the center of aircraft just below bottom of cowl.
Anyone
> see anything wrong with this?
>
> Tom Benton RV3B
>
Tom: I think the weight and cost savings are small. there is a slight
chance of cross-feeding in unbalanced flight with full-ish tanks, again a
small concern.
My biggest worry with what you are proposing is the possibility that a mud
dauber nest in the fuel vent line will render both tanks inoperable by the
time you notice the sputtering engine and dropping fuel pressure. Redundancy
might just save your hide.
Let me relate my brief experience with these pests: a year ago, when
temporarily storing my RV-6A outside at the neighbors's private strip, _his_
mud daubers made themselves at home in one of my tank vent lines in the space
of one afternoon. I noticed a vacuum "hiss" as I opened the fuel cap to
visually verify fuel level on pre-flight between my morning and afternoon
flights. Hmmm, better investigate. I found the nest WAY UP in the tube,and
it took a long piece of safety wire to ream the mud and caterpillar guts out
of my vent line. I have since pro-sealed screen mesh over the vents to
correct this vulnerability.
Meanwhile, back at the ranch (over at my strip, where the plane stays
indoors) I found the hard way yesterday that _my_ mud daubers are just as
impudent as the neighbor's... this time they got my pitot tube, causing an
aborted takeoff at midfield with the ASI reading zero, and causing my wife,
who was bending over in the garden picking vegetables, to have a cardiac
arrhythmia when she heard me chop power and the Lycoming after-firing. {I
don't want to start a thread on how real men can fly RV's without an ASI; I
prefer not to operate from a short grass strip without a critical flight
instrument!}
I found the offending matter once again far up in the stainless tube, beyond
the bend and completely hidden from view on pre-flight. Moral: these pests
are very resourceful and can ruin your day in several ways; always leave
yourself an out. I'd vote for retaining two separate vents, although a
screen over a single vent might eliminate the risk almost completely. It's
your call.
Bill Boyd
RV-6A O-320/Senseninch FP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob DiMeo - Oracle <dimeob(at)powertel.com.au> |
| Subject: | TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock |
I made my hinge pin shorter than the length of the hinge and secured it by
drilling a small hole at each end of the hinge and putting in a cotter pin.
I plan to do that with my Flap hinges as well.
Bob
RV 8#423
> ----------
> From: Are Barstad
> Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 05:59 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV-List: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock
>
>
> I planned to rivet it in with an AN 3-4.5 rivet and drill it out if I ever
> have to remove the trim tab. Hopefully I will never have to replace the
> trimtab though and even if I do, it shouldn't be much wear replacing it
> and
> even drilling it out a second time for a _third_ trimtab. If I still need
> to
> replace the trimtab a fourth time, I should look for another hobby or a
> hangar with a door and padlock :)
>
> I noticed that Van's RV-8A at Oshkosh had a longer hinge pin and bent two
> or
> three different directions and then secured with safety wire to a little
> hole on the elevator spar (I think this is right). This is great too and
> makes the trimtab replacements easier.
>
> Regards,
> Are
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mike Nellis
> Sent: August 21, 2000 12:52 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock
>
>
>
> Are,
>
> How will you secure the piece of hinge? Will you rivet it or use a screw.
> If you use a screw, then there is the problem of taking the screw out and
> chipping the paint after it's painted. If you rivet it in place, then how
> do you remove it?
>
> I got the idea I used from my friend Paul Golias and modified it to use a
> piece of hinge like yours but in a difference location. Just another way
> of
> doing the same thing.
>
> http://mnellis.jnet.net/RV-6_Page/elevator_4.htm#TrimHingeSecure
>
> Mike Nellis - RV-6 Wings N699BM (res)
> Plainfield, IL
> http://mnellis.jnet.net/rv-6_page
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Are Barstad" <abarstad(at)bconnex.net>
> To:
> Sent: Saturday, August 19, 2000 10:46 PM
> Subject: RV-List: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock
>
>
> >
> > I spent a long time looking at RV's at Oshkosh and at my local airport
> when
> > building my empennage. I wasn't sure how to best lock the trimtab hinge
> pin.
> > The archive provided me with some ideas but I still wanted to see it
> myself
> > on a real RV.
> >
> > I saw many different ways at Oshkosh but the best by far was one I saw
> at
> my
> > local airport at Brampton (Ontario, Canada). Subsequently I used this
> same
> > method and I think it looks and works great with material supplied in
> the
> > kit. I simply used a part of the hinge that I cut and riveted it on the
> left
> > elevator. Note that you have to pay attention in order to get the
> required
> > edge distances on the 'mini-hinge'.
> >
> > It's a bit hard to explain so I supplied a couple of pictures here if
> you
> > are interested.
> >
> > http://www.bconnex.net/~abarstad/hinge.html
> >
> > Are
> > RV-8
> > Waiting for Wings
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Eaves" <doneaves(at)bigfoot.com> |
| Subject: | Bolt Torque RV6 Wing Bolts. |
Anyone have the torque for the RV6 wing bolts?
Thanks in advance
Don Eaves
RV6 - Installing Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Award for Dumbest Blunder |
Here's a neat one, just experienced tonight:
When I built my engine, I never got around to installing the pushrods, valve
rockers, etc in the cylinder heads. In fact, I put it off until tonight only
to discover that a fully installed set of baffles completely blocks
installing the valve rocker shafts (and therefore the valve rockers) in the
rear two cylinders.
So... Unbolt the baffles, demount the baffle mounted oil cooler, cut loose
the safety wire that holds the cylinder baffles in place, then finish the
engine, and reinstall all the above. Effectively, this turns a 2 hour job
(max) into an all night effort.
And things were going sooo well.
Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA
RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth
To the Airport by Labor Day!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Calvert" <rv6bldr(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | wultrad turn coordinator |
Is the Wultrad turn coordinator Van carries worth the $$ or should I spend a
little more on another brand?? Who makes a good TC?
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok -6 fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Shook" <billshook(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Short field performance |
Just a stupid question for the flying in this bunch. I am considering
building my next home off the beaten path a bit and would like a sod strip
'out back'. What experience do the listers have with length of said strip.
How short is too short? Come on...most any condition, how short do you
regularly have that puppy stopped in? Here's your chance to brag it
up....cause I'm asking. :-)
Bill Shook
RV-4 wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Stuart B McCurdy <sturdy(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Antennae in the wingtips |
Listers,
Awhile back someone mentioned putting antennae in the wingtips. I can't
find the archive on it. Can Comm and VOR antennae be put in the
wingtips to reduce drag and is there an impact on transmission or
reception? Is there an impact by having the local strobe power packs on
the end rib in each wing also?
Stu McCurdy
RV-3, Building RV-8 QB
________________________________________________________________________________
User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022
| Subject: | Re: wultrad turn coordinator |
| From: | James Freeman <flyeyes(at)bellsouth.net> |
> From: "Jerry Calvert" <rv6bldr(at)home.com>
> Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 21:28:34 -0500
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: wultrad turn coordinator
>
> Is the Wultrad turn coordinator Van carries worth the $$ or should I spend a
> little more on another brand?? Who makes a good TC?
Seems to work OK, just flew behind one this afternoon that's been in my
friend's Cessna 140 for about a year. I would probably put one in my -8
except that I'll have the Navaid (or similar) instead. I'm installing one I
bought from another RV builder in my Dad's AirCam this week.
James Freeman
RV-8Q fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Emrath" <Emrath(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: J stringer and F611/F612 |
I just did this last weekend. Justice's notes say to notch the J Stringer.
Thats what I did. I also appears that I will have minimal edge distance on
the Stringer to Bulkhead cross points at F607 and F608 :-(
Marty in Brentwood TN
----- Original Message -----
From: <Larygagnon(at)AOL.COM>
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 3:33 PM
Subject: RV-List: J stringer and F611/F612
>
> Can someone clarify how the J stringer is trimmed at the rear most
bulkheads
> for an RV 6. I can't find a plan sheet that shows this area in any
detail.
> The longeron is trimmed around the the bars that later attach the
tailwheel
> and stab. The rear bulkheads have a joggle in them that leads me to
believe
> the J stringers are notched around both bulkheads. Orendorfs video and
the
> pictures in the construction manual seem to show the bulkheads are cut out
in
> that area for the stringer. Should I be cutting the bulkheads to accept
the
> stringer or am I correct in trimming the stringer. Thanks in advance for
any
> advice.
>
>
> Larry Gagnon
> RV6 Fuselage N6LG (reserved)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Bundy" <ebundy(at)micron.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Short field performance |
Not stupid at all. I think most people would love to live with their
airplane and not fight with homeowner associations at a skypark. (don't get
me started...)
There are a lot of variables here. A lot depends on the kind of elevation,
typical summer temperatures, and approach ends. IF you have completely
clear approaches on both ends, I'd say 2000 would be the absolute minimum
that *I* would be comfortable with from "my" elevation (2500'). Even then,
if it were me, I would try to find a piece of property that would allow at
least 2500'. If I lived at sea level and the temps never got above 80F
2000' would be dandy.
I can get my 6a in and out of back-country strips as short as 1500' or less
if necessary, but there is NO way I would want to do it on any kind of
regular basis.
I operate out of a 3000' paved strip and that is a GREAT length. Even with
5-10' obstructions on both ends you can land and roll out while barely
touching the brakes. With a sod strip your rollout will be even less (but
then, your takeoff distance will be more). However, there is also some
extra room for a less than perfect landing, or less than perfect speed
control on final. There is some extra room for an aborted takeoff, etc.
You want to look at the shortest strip you will be comfortable with under
the worst possible conditions, because you may have to land there under
them. (Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?)
Ed Bundy - Eagle, ID
RV6A, 0320-D1a (160hp)
Sensenich 70x78, N427EM, 350+hrs.
ebundy(at)micron.net
> Just a stupid question for the flying in this bunch. I am considering
> building my next home off the beaten path a bit and would like a sod strip
> 'out back'. What experience do the listers have with length of said
strip.
> How short is too short? Come on...most any condition, how short do you
> regularly have that puppy stopped in? Here's your chance to brag it
> up....cause I'm asking. :-)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Subie Lyc Engine Systems |
might want to look at powersport avaition. Seems they are supply reduction
drives to most companies.
www.powersportaviation.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ted Lumpkin" <tlump(at)mediaone.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Van's New Factory |
I'm amazed you got through. I have been trying for several days and
just end up in an endless loop within their new phone system. I need to
order some 3/4 X 3/4 X .032 sheet angle. I can't find it anywhere else.
Everybody else has extruded angle with min. thickness .062. I guess I could
just make some myself out of sheet, but would rather not. Does anyone know
where you can get this angle?
Ted Lumpkin
-----Original Message-----
From: Van Artsdalen, Scott <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com>
Date: Monday, August 21, 2000 2:06 PM
Subject: RV-List: Van's New Factory
>
>I'd advise anyone that needs to call Van's for anything to hold off for
>another week or so. I called to ask about the status of my backordered
>Cleaveland wheels and brakes. After being bounced from one extension to
the
>next for 15 min. I got a cranky clerk who barked at me that they aren't
>shipping orders yet. I barked back and told him that I figured as much I
>just wanted a status! He calmed down and said things are very hectic and
>then tried to show a little of that good customer service I remember by
>taking my serial number and name and telling me he'd make sure my order got
>expedited. I don't know if it will or not but it made me feel better.
>Anyway, I think they need a little more time to settle in.
>--
>Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE
>Network Administrator
>Union Safe Deposit Bank
>209-946-5116
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Phillips" <mphill(at)fgi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet Motivation - Long Post |
Randy,very well put,I envy you, Pounding rivets in the wing at this time.
Hope to see your plane at a breakfast one of these days. Located in
Springfield,Illinois, so your not that far away. Of course ,thats in RV time
thou,hehehe. Happy Flyin!!!!!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randy J. Pflanzer" <rpflanze(at)iquest.net>
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 11:25 AM
Subject: RV-List: Rivet Motivation - Long Post
>
> This is a flying story to possibly help motivate you to keep pounding
those
> rivets. If not interested, hit DELETE now.
>
> This weekend, as happens most weekends here and around the country, a
bunch
> of us RV'ers headed to a local airport breakfast fly-in. For the
> Indianapolis First Air Force, the Sunday destination was the LaPorte
County
> Breakfast and Aviation day. The high stratus moved off to the south and
the
> day developed into gorgeous sunshine, 60 degree temps, and unlimited
> visibilities. Just the kind of flying day I needed after a busy week of
> work, thunderstorms, and a teardown/replacement of my magnetos.
>
> As is our custom, we meet up in the air and start monitoring the "RV
> frequency" (122.75). I departed Indianapolis Metro airport and swung
> northwest. I just love flying early in the morning. A touch of ground
haze
> and the low light angles soften the features of the patchwork fields
> surrounded by bedroom communities. The air is still and the frequencies
are
> quiet with just the low drone of my engine to keep me company. Before
long,
> I realize that the rest of the RV family is airborne too. A flight of
three
> are just ahead of me as I try like heck to catch them, but even at 160
KTS,
> I trailed just behind the whole way. The air is smooth and the views
joyous
> as we all cruised north, jabbering and taunting each other as we went. We
> also heard some Cessna folks on the frequency as they headed to northern
IL
> for a breakfast flight. They talked about having to SLOW DOWN from 120
KTS
> so some guys could catch them. I glanced down at my GPS, which was
> indicating 178 KTS groundspeed and just smiled. Man, life is good.
>
> Once on the ground at LaPorte, we were given front row parking to show off
> our birds. Two other RVs were already there and two more came in shortly
> after we landed. We all met up and I enjoyed one of the best fly-in
> breakfasts I've had. After a little more visiting, the four of us
departed
> in formation and headed out in our own directions.
>
> Bob Japundza and I flew formation back to Indy. As we were cruising along
> just above a few small cumulous clouds that had begun to pop up, I thought
> about the fact that four months ago, both Bob and I had our birds in our
> garages as we struggled to get the last details finished. Now, we're
> cruising the countryside, in formation, on a beautiful day, doing better
> that 200 MPH over the ground.
>
> Bob peeled off to visit another friend and I dropped down to pattern
> altitude and greased on a wheel landing in a quartering crosswind. One of
> my most favorite parts of any trip is rolling back the canopy and cruising
> back to the hanger with arms over the side and hair (what's left of it)
> blowing in the wind. All that excitement and it's not even 11:30 am yet.
>
> I polish off the bugs and place my baby back in her bed for the next time.
> I'm just like the 18 wheeler drivers who always look back at their rig
when
> they walk away. I step back to look at my rig sitting in the hanger, all
> polished up, gleaming in the mid-morning sun, just begging to go back up
> again. Sadly, I turn out the lights and lower the door on another
fabulous
> flying day.
>
> I've come to understand why I pounded rivets for almost seven years. It's
> for days just like Sunday.
>
> Randy Pflanzer N417G
> RV-6 (46 hours)
> http://members.iquest.net/~rpflanze
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM |
I bought a wrecked (went in the ditch while being trailered) fiberglass boat
about 6 years ago and rebuilt it in my garage that winter. Some of the things
I learned a la hard way are coming back to me now while working on my
wingtips. There are two additives you can put in resin to make it do what you
want it to do. One is a real fine powdery stuff I think it was called "Flox"
that thickens the resin. The other was a waxy liquid that is added when
mixing that makes it a whole lot easier to sand, doesnt gum up the paper,
ect.
There is also some stuff on the market now I found called fiberglass jel that
is already thick. Now if I could just find that stuff that made it easier to
sand.... Check local fiberglass supply house, they should know. I wouldnt
try to sand the spinner in its present state, might wind up with little
fuzzys of fiber sticking up everywhere.
Hope this helps.
Kevin Shannon
-9A wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary A. Sobek" <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Antennae in the wingtips |
--- Stuart B McCurdy wrote:
>
> Listers,
>
> Awhile back someone mentioned putting antennae in
> the wingtips. I can't
> find the archive on it. Can Comm and VOR antennae
> be put in the
> wingtips to reduce drag and is there an impact on
> transmission or
> reception? Is there an impact by having the local
> strobe power packs on
> the end rib in each wing also?
>
> Stu McCurdy
> RV-3, Building RV-8 QB
Stu:
Bob Archer in Torrance California designed the
antennas that are shown on page 423 of the 2000-2001
Aircraft Spruce Catalog. The Model 1 VOR Antenna
works great in my RV-6 with wingtip mounted strobe
power supplies. Jim Ayers has them in his RV-3 and
the model 2 comm in the tail cap. His comm works
great.
Bob makes a model 1A Wing Tip comm antenna. I do not
have one. It is reported to work well but does not
have the range as an external or Bob's Model 2 Tail
cap comm antenna. I may be wrong but it could be
possible becasue it is not vertically polorized. If I
remember correctly, there is about a 3 dB loss of
signal when you change from horizontal to vertical
polorization. 3dB equals a 1/2 signal loss. Since
the side of the wing tip is on about a 45, you may
only have a 1 dB loss which would be acceptable but it
is a loss.
====
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
650+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
"I never knew what real happiness was until I got married; and then it was too
late..." - Jack Handey
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Imfairings(at)AOL.COM |
Doug,
I would sand with about 220 grit dry paper. The idea is to get the shine off
and provide 'tooth' for the primer. I would prime with a good sandable primer
that is compatible with the paint you are going to use. Use 320-400 grit
wet/dry paper before painting. If you are going to paint fairly soon I would
leave the spinner unpainted. Oil will soak into primer. The small amount of
UV you will get [assuming you're hangered] won't cause a problem.
Bob
Fairings Etc.
IMFAIRINGS(at)AOL.COM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael McGee <jmpcrftr(at)teleport.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Short field performance |
I am based at an airport with a turnoff at 900 feet from the south end
(Aurora, OR). I'm flying a 150hp RV-4 with a wood prop. I can almost
always make the turnoff using the brakes and I rarely get the wheels on the
ground at the numbers. I need more room for takeoff at full gross as I
have a cruise prop (Warnke 71x72, 2550 WFO @ 6500 (I haven't flown with my
new MP gauge yet)). Know your plane, practice, in all load configurations,
particularly a small tandem like a -4.
Mike
>
>Just a stupid question
>>>NOT<<<
>for the flying in this bunch. I am considering
>building my next home off the beaten path a bit and would like a sod strip
>'out back'. What experience do the listers have with length of said strip.
>How short is too short? Come on...most any condition, how short do you
>regularly have that puppy stopped in? Here's your chance to brag it
>up....cause I'm asking. :-)
>
>Bill Shook
>RV-4 wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Imfairings(at)AOL.COM |
The filler I like to use is Evercoat, I remember the part number as 100400.
It is a 'bodyputty' for composites. It hardens quick and sands easy. I have
done repairs that got banged and broke the 'glass but not the Evercoat. It
stays flexible and bonds to epoxy and 'easter resins. It can be gotten in
most automotive paint stores.
Another product is Dureteck {spelling} . It is the same sort of stuff,
different name.
Bob
Fairings Etc.
IMFAIRINGS(at)AOL.COM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Ludwig" <ludwig(at)azstarnet.com> |
If you want to thicken fiberglass resin, use Cabosil - available .
Regarding gumming of sandpaper, there are two different polyester resins.
One is a LAMINATING resin used for laying up multiple layers when curing
between layers is desired. The surface stays sticky with this resin. The
other is FINISHING resin that has wax mixed in it. The wax floats to the
surface during cure, creating a thin film that promotes surface cure. I use
epoxy resins (like West Systems, also from Aircraft Spruce) which can be
used for laminating or finishing. Epoxies are also more durable and are
more tolerant to flexing.
- Bill in Tucson
-----Original Message-----
From: Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM <Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM>
Date: Monday, August 21, 2000 9:43 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Fiberfill
>
>I bought a wrecked (went in the ditch while being trailered) fiberglass
boat
>about 6 years ago and rebuilt it in my garage that winter. Some of the
things
>I learned a la hard way are coming back to me now while working on my
>wingtips. There are two additives you can put in resin to make it do what
you
>want it to do. One is a real fine powdery stuff I think it was called
"Flox"
>that thickens the resin. The other was a waxy liquid that is added when
>mixing that makes it a whole lot easier to sand, doesnt gum up the paper,
>ect.
>There is also some stuff on the market now I found called fiberglass jel
that
>is already thick. Now if I could just find that stuff that made it easier
to
>sand.... Check local fiberglass supply house, they should know. I wouldnt
>try to sand the spinner in its present state, might wind up with little
>fuzzys of fiber sticking up everywhere.
>Hope this helps.
>Kevin Shannon
>-9A wings
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
| Subject: | flap rod push tube |
> F659A being the little bitty hunk of tubing that you make the flap
rod
> pushers out of.
> I also thought that Van's part left much to be desired.
I haven't heard of many of them failing in service. They would be most
likely to fail while raising flaps while on the ground since they are in
compression when lowering and always when in the air.
I have never heard of many (any?) of them failing either. However, the
slightly larger tube I used will have a much better column bending
resistance (compression strength) than the skinny tube Van provides. The
tube inserts eliminate the drilling and threading problem that I and others
have had.
I wasn't too keen on the standard parts. They seemed unnecessarily weakened
even when made perfectly.
Regardless, having a push tube fail on final would be more excitement than I
can stand. That's why I changed to a different tube that met my comfort
level. It was one of a very few places where I digressed from Van's stock
RV-4 design.
Another thing, since the flaps don't really have an "up" stop, if the tube
did fail due to sloppy thread cutting or whatever, you'd certainly have an
unusual situation going on up there as the free flap floated around loosely.
Dangerous? Who knows?
I don't have a picture of mine. My flap rods look similar to the other
control push tubes, only much smaller, of course. I wonder why Van didn't
do them similarly?
Vince Frazier
RV-4 flying
HRII under construction
Mount Vernon, Indiana
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
I have seen a couple of RVs With fuel vent lines connected together
then one
line going down in the center of aircraft just below bottom of cowl. Anyone
see anything wrong with this?
If that single vent gets plugged by a spider, mud dauber, or whatever....
well, switching tanks won't help for long. Two vents with screens to keep
out the big stuff for my plane!
Vince Frazier
Mount Vernon, Indiana
RV-4 flying
HRII under construction
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rwayne(at)gamewood.net |
| Subject: | type of molex connector |
Dear Listers:
I see from the archives builders are using a molex connector at the trim servos.
Well, when I look up "molex" in a supplier catalog, its not there! I see more
"pinned connectors" than I can count.
Can someone give me more specifics on just what I need to be ordering to get a
locking plug for the elevator and aileron trim servos? Do I need to get a tool
to crimp these?
What are people using to make the wiring connections at the wing junction? Should
this be a plug or solid connectors?
Thanks, in advance!
Wayne Williams
RV-8A QB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | OrndorffG(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | GBI New Facility |
72104.231(at)compuserve.com, truckerjake(at)netscape.net,
cynthia_burnham(at)iwhs.org, sirs(at)neosoft.com, DFlood1867(at)AOL.COM,
Tom(at)unityhunt.com, Mlfred(at)AOL.COM, jglader(at)gladders.com,
sgross(at)imagin.net, SPLITS(at)flash.net, Michaeljhundley(at)cs.com,
glp(at)gj.net, dreeves(at)metronet.com, bsaxon(at)bellatlantic.net,
saxonl(at)ssims.nci.nih.gov, m.silva(at)accountingteam.com,
Gsmithtex(at)AOL.COM, ron(at)css.ncifcrf.gov, vetxaust(at)gwtc.net,
71663.226(at)compuserve.com
We are pleased to announce our new facility in Justin, Texas. It is
located at Propwash Airport, a private 3000' paved strip. Our address is now
15647 Cessna Road, Justin, Texas 76247 and our new phone number is
940-648-0841. We have updated our web page, www.fly-gbi.com with the new
information and a map (including long-lat) to locate us.
We appreciate everyone's support and patience for the past couple months
and for the next couple months while we make the transition complete. We
hope to be completely moved within 60 days - as soon as the house is
finished. It is moving along quickly - under roof in 5 days!
Stop by to see us - just give us a call first to let us know you are
coming! We hope to have an open house this fall after we are settled.
George and Becki Orndorff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary A. Sobek" <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Short field performance |
> >
> >Just a stupid question
> >for the flying in this bunch. I am considering
> >building my next home off the beaten path a bit and
> would like a sod strip
> >'out back'. What experience do the listers have
> with length of said strip.
> >How short is too short? Come on...most any
> condition, how short do you
> >regularly have that puppy stopped in? Here's your
> chance to brag it
> >up....cause I'm asking. :-)
> >
> >Bill Shook
> >RV-4 wings
Bill:
I regularly take-off and land with not much more than
500 ground roll. Field elevation 1,440 in Southern
California heat. I have a laning ground roll of about
800 feet when I do not use the brakes. I would not
have a problem going anywhere that there is 1,000
feet. This is assuming field elevation no higher than
2,000 and no elevated temperatures. That is 1,000
runway with clear at each end.
If I owned the property, I would try to build at least
2,000 and would prefer 2,500. I want it long enough
that my friends can come visit. (Yes I do have a few
friends and some of them do not have RVs.) :-)
====
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
650+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
"I never knew what real happiness was until I got married; and then it was too
late..." - Jack Handey
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott <acepilot(at)win.bright.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Antennae in the wingtips |
Actually, it is more on the order of -20 dB, which equates to 1/100th
ERP (Effective Radiated Power) when you rotate polarization 90 degrees,
so a 1 Watt transmitter effectively radiates like a 10 milliwatt
transmitter. And that's not including any loss in the coax!
Scott
Amateur radio op N0EDV
"Gary A. Sobek" wrote:
>
>
> --- Stuart B McCurdy wrote:
> >
> > Listers,
> >
> > Awhile back someone mentioned putting antennae in
> > the wingtips. I can't
> > find the archive on it. Can Comm and VOR antennae
> > be put in the
> > wingtips to reduce drag and is there an impact on
> > transmission or
> > reception? Is there an impact by having the local
> > strobe power packs on
> > the end rib in each wing also?
> >
> > Stu McCurdy
> > RV-3, Building RV-8 QB
>
> Stu:
>
> Bob Archer in Torrance California designed the
> antennas that are shown on page 423 of the 2000-2001
> Aircraft Spruce Catalog. The Model 1 VOR Antenna
> works great in my RV-6 with wingtip mounted strobe
> power supplies. Jim Ayers has them in his RV-3 and
> the model 2 comm in the tail cap. His comm works
> great.
>
> Bob makes a model 1A Wing Tip comm antenna. I do not
> have one. It is reported to work well but does not
> have the range as an external or Bob's Model 2 Tail
> cap comm antenna. I may be wrong but it could be
> possible becasue it is not vertically polorized. If I
> remember correctly, there is about a 3 dB loss of
> signal when you change from horizontal to vertical
> polorization. 3dB equals a 1/2 signal loss. Since
> the side of the wing tip is on about a 45, you may
> only have a 1 dB loss which would be acceptable but it
> is a loss.
>
> ====
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> 650+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
> http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
>
> "I never knew what real happiness was until I got married; and then it was too
late..." - Jack Handey
>
--
--Scott--
1986 Corben Junior Ace N3642
http://corbenflyer.tripod.com/
RV-4 under construction (tail feathers)
Gotta Fly or Gonna Die!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Chesteen" <bchesteen(at)planetc.com> |
Well guess what even with the move, 1/2 of my Emp kit arrived on Monday! It
was the box with the hardware and most of the parts, still waiting on the
skins and spars. The box has box 1 of 2 written on it so I expect that I
will get the other box today. I checked everything out inside and it is
perfect! I checked all the hardware and it was perfect! I was reading the
archives about primers Monday and I was relieved to see that all the steel
parts that everyone had to corrode, were beautifully powder coated.
Thanks for the help! I can't wait to get home tonight!
Brian Chesteen
RV-6 (Emp)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Van's New Factory |
08/22/2000 11:44:11 AM
Try A local RV-X builder. I get my stuff raided periodically & I raid
their stock periodically. We allways re-order to replace our "swiped from
each other" stuff. The nice thing about this method is hardly no one is at
the same point in their project...so whether the thingie sits on the shelf
or gets loaned out, the replacement shows up a few weeks later. Keep a
"loan-out" chart.......
"Ted Lumpkin" (at)matronics.com on 08/22/2000 12:05:27 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: Van's New Factory
I'm amazed you got through. I have been trying for several days and
just end up in an endless loop within their new phone system. I need to
order some 3/4 X 3/4 X .032 sheet angle. I can't find it anywhere else.
Everybody else has extruded angle with min. thickness .062. I guess I
could
just make some myself out of sheet, but would rather not. Does anyone know
where you can get this angle?
Ted Lumpkin
-----Original Message-----
From: Van Artsdalen, Scott <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com>
Date: Monday, August 21, 2000 2:06 PM
Subject: RV-List: Van's New Factory
>
>I'd advise anyone that needs to call Van's for anything to hold off for
>another week or so. I called to ask about the status of my backordered
>Cleaveland wheels and brakes. After being bounced from one extension to
the
>next for 15 min. I got a cranky clerk who barked at me that they aren't
>shipping orders yet. I barked back and told him that I figured as much I
>just wanted a status! He calmed down and said things are very hectic and
>then tried to show a little of that good customer service I remember by
>taking my serial number and name and telling me he'd make sure my order
got
>expedited. I don't know if it will or not but it made me feel better.
>Anyway, I think they need a little more time to settle in.
>--
>Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE
>Network Administrator
>Union Safe Deposit Bank
>209-946-5116
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Billy Dollarhide" <dollarhide(at)ti.com> |
| Subject: | type of molex connector |
Look for Molex/GC/Waldom(http://www.molex.com/). Try
http://www.digikey.com/. They may have
what you want. Many electronic supply houses carry
Molex/GC/Waldom/ connectors.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
rwayne(at)gamewood.net
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2000 8:30 AM
Subject: RV-List: type of molex connector
Dear Listers:
I see from the archives builders are using a molex connector at the trim
servos. Well, when I look up "molex" in a supplier catalog, its not there! I
see more "pinned connectors" than I can count.
Can someone give me more specifics on just what I need to be ordering to get
a locking plug for the elevator and aileron trim servos? Do I need to get a
tool to crimp these?
What are people using to make the wiring connections at the wing junction?
Should this be a plug or solid connectors?
Thanks, in advance!
Wayne Williams
RV-8A QB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "EWSpears" <ewspears(at)peoplepc.com> |
> F659A being the little bitty hunk of tubing that you make the flap
rod pushers out of.
> I also thought that Van's part left much to be desired.
>I haven't heard of many of them failing in service. They would >be most
>likely to fail while raising flaps while on the ground since they >are in
>compression when lowering and always when in the air.
I know of one failure on a 6A that was built locally. It caused a "split
flap" on approach and could have been a real problem had the pilot not
immediately noticed it and retracted flaps.
Myself and several other builders here on Leeward Air Ranch are making
the tubes out of 4130 in the same dim. as called for in 6061-T6 (5/16 X
.058wall). This way we don't have to carve huge holes in the floor and skin
as would be neccessary for big dia. aluminum tube.
Esten Spears, RV8AQB, 80922, Fuse Floors & Flap Rods
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Caldwell" <racaldwell(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wultrad turn coordinator |
Jerry,
My Wultrand TC from Van's works just fine.
Rick Caldwell
-6 122 hrs since 1/16/00
Melbourne, FL
>From: "Jerry Calvert" <rv6bldr(at)home.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: wultrad turn coordinator
>Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 21:28:34 -0500
>
>
>Is the Wultrad turn coordinator Van carries worth the $$ or should I spend
>a
>little more on another brand?? Who makes a good TC?
>
>Jerry Calvert
>Edmond Ok -6 fuse
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com> |
| Subject: | Van's New Factory |
Yeah, their phone system is a complete mess. I just waited until it said to
contact the operator press 0. So I did and then she put me through. Even
at that I still didn't get hold of who I needed to. They just need more
time to get settled in. I know how much chaos my house is in for the first
six months after I move. I can't imagine moving a business. Hopefully in
another week or two they will settle in and find all those things that
somehow wind up missing during a move. Including the instructions for the
voicemail system!
--
Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE
Network Administrator
Union Safe Deposit Bank
209-946-5116
-----Original Message-----
From: Ted Lumpkin [mailto:tlump(at)mediaone.net]
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 9:05 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Van's New Factory
I'm amazed you got through. I have been trying for
several days and
just end up in an endless loop within their new phone
system. I need to
order some 3/4 X 3/4 X .032 sheet angle. I can't find it
anywhere else.
Everybody else has extruded angle with min. thickness .062.
I guess I could
just make some myself out of sheet, but would rather not.
Does anyone know
where you can get this angle?
Ted Lumpkin
-----Original Message-----
From: Van Artsdalen, Scott <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com>
To: Rv-List (E-mail)
Date: Monday, August 21, 2000 2:06 PM
Subject: RV-List: Van's New Factory
>
>I'd advise anyone that needs to call Van's for anything to
hold off for
>another week or so. I called to ask about the status of my
backordered
>Cleaveland wheels and brakes. After being bounced from one
extension to
the
>next for 15 min. I got a cranky clerk who barked at me that
they aren't
>shipping orders yet. I barked back and told him that I
figured as much I
>just wanted a status! He calmed down and said things are
very hectic and
>then tried to show a little of that good customer service I
remember by
>taking my serial number and name and telling me he'd make
sure my order got
>expedited. I don't know if it will or not but it made me
feel better.
>Anyway, I think they need a little more time to settle in.
>--
>Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE
>Network Administrator
>Union Safe Deposit Bank
>209-946-5116
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken" <kgray(at)tca.net> |
| Subject: | Re: ED STERBA PROP |
John, I would like to purchase the Prop, If I am quick enough before someone
else.
Ken Gray
979 776 3033
Bryan, Tx
----- Original Message -----
From: John McMahon <rv6(at)earthlink.net>
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2000 8:55 PM
Subject: RV-List: ED STERBA PROP
>
> I have a new Ed Sterba 68/70 3/8 bolt size for sale...
> I'm getting a C/S 180 HP Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
> $525.00 and you pay shipping.........
> First one to my E-Mail off the list please
>
> Thanks
> John McMahon
> Gallatin,Tn
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Donald Mei" <don_mei(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Technology Kitchen EPM |
Dear Listers,
Some of you may recall reading a very favorable review of Technology
Kitchen's EPM in a recent issue of the RVator. I thought it was an
interesting and usefull instrument, particularly for someone with a RV-4 or
RV-8 without a lot of panel real estate. I plan on purchasing one of these
shortly. I wondered if I could use the MASSIVE power of the Matronics list
to try to work a deal on this item. (Espescially since it does not compete
with any of Matt's products) I sent an email to Technology Kitchen and
mentioned the list. This was my reply. If you have an intrest in
purchasing this item, just mention the list to get the special price. (It's
not a huge difference, but $70 buys 4+ hrs of fuel)
Don Mei
Dear Mr. Mei,
We would be happy to promote our EPM on the RV builders list with a 10%
discount for a 3 month time period.
We certainly appreciate your willingness to assist in getting this onto the
list. Please let me know what we need to do in order to make this happen.
Best Regards,
Brad Claflin
Technology Kitchen
1-800-654-7222 voice/fax
www.technologykitchen.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Donald Mei [mailto:don_mei(at)hotmail.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, August 09, 2000 3:24 PM
> To: information(at)technologykitchen.com
> Subject: EPM for RV List
>
>
> Dear Sirs,
>
> As I'm sure you know your EPM product received a favorable review in the
> RVator. I have spoken with a couple people on the Matronics RV list and
> several are interested in your product. The RV list has over 1000
> participants who have either flying RVs or are building.
>
> Several relatively small companies have gotten BIG sales boosts
> by offering
> their products for sale at special pricing to list members. It usually
> works out pretty well. We get a useful tool (toy, sometimes) for a good
> price, and you get access to a pretty good market with no cost to
> you other
> than the product discount. If you would have an interest in
> coming up with
> some kind of promotion, i would be happy to assist in getting it onto the
> list.
>
> As for me, I will end up buying your product within the next couple of
> months even without any "special deal" pricing. Regardless, I am
> sure that
> an RV list promotion would go over very well and be mutually
> beneficial to
> you and the many RV builders on the list. I am interested in
> your thoughts.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Don Mei
> RV-4 N92CT (Flying)
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: wultrad turn coordinator |
Do NOT buy Wultrad. They do not stand behind their products. If something
goes wrong you eat the instrument. Amy at Wultrad said there is NO guarantee.
Ed Storo RV-8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <fasching(at)amigo.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Technology Kitchen EPM |
I must have missed this...what is the EPM?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Carter" <jcarter8(at)midsouth.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: type of molex connector |
> Dear Listers:
>
> I see from the archives builders are using a molex connector at the trim
servos. Well, when I look up "molex" in a supplier catalog, its not there! I
see more "pinned connectors" than I can count.
>
> Can someone give me more specifics on just what I need to be ordering to
get a locking plug for the elevator and aileron trim servos? Do I need to
get a tool to crimp these?
>
> What are people using to make the wiring connections at the wing junction?
Should this be a plug or solid connectors?
> Thanks, in advance!
>
> Wayne Williams
> RV-8A QB
Wayne...
I liked the molex connectors by Waldom because they come in different sizes,
i.e., 1 circuit, 2 circuit, 6 circuit, etc. They're good for wires from 18
ga through 24 ga. These all have part numbers beginning with 1625, such as
1625-9PRT for the nine circuit connector. I used a large one (21 circuits,
I think) for my Infinity grip. You could use a two circuit one (Waldom part
no. 1625-2PRT) for the wing lights or a larger one if you wanted to run more
wires out to the wing. These have a nice, snug fit, but for added security
you could put a plastic tie-wrap around it to hold it together. I did not
use a special crimp tool to connect the wires to the pins- I found it
easiest to put a tiny bit of solder on the wire-pin connection and crimp it
with needle nose pliers.
Alternatively, you could use "knife splices" where you want to connect
individual wires. I used these where I wanted a more secure connection and
put a piece of heat shrink over the connection. To unhook it you just have
to cut the heat shrink. Put it back together and put more heatshrink over it
or tie a short length of clear vinyl tubing over it. I guess the type of
connector you use depends on how often you anticipate unhooking the
connection.
D-sub connectors work well in these areas, too. I used a 9 pin D-sub to
connect the elevator trim servo to the 5 wire strand which runs forward to
the relay.
Good luck.
Jerry Carter
Memphis, TN
My RV-8A website:
http://rv8asite.homestead.com/mainpage.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuel vent lines |
08/22/2000 02:24:34 PM
Has anyone used a short piece of tubing with a flair pointed into the
wind..using a elbo on the vent lines ? I've seen this on quite a few RV's
at Lakeland & Oshgosh. Any rhyme or reason for this??
zilik(at)bewellnet.com on 08/21/2000 08:35:33 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel vent lines
If the fuel vent gets clogged fuel cannot transfered from the tank. If both
tanks are on the same vent then fuel cannot be drawn from either tank.
> I have seen a couple of RVs With fuel vent lines connected together then
one
> line going down in the center of aircraft just below bottom of cowl.
Anyone
> see anything wrong with this?
> Tom Benton RV3B
>
> --
> Gary Zilik - Pine Junction, Colorado
> RV-6A N99PZ Flying
> Engine: Aerosport Power O-360-A1A with H2AD Pistons
> Prop: Sensenich 72FM8S9-1-83
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com> |
This may come under the category of dumb builder's question but... Does
anyone know where I can get the plastic tubing that Van uses on the rudder
cables? There are two short lengths for where the rudder cables exit the
fuse and one long length to protect the left rudder cable from the manual
trim lever in the -4. I was thinking that I would like to buy lengths of
this stuff to run my rudder cable through for the length of the cabin. To
protect the cables and to protect the passenger from seeing the "guts" of
the plane. Is there a better alternative?
--
Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE
Network Administrator
Union Safe Deposit Bank
209-946-5116
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com |
| Subject: | Van's technical support |
My 2 cents.
I have been on a self inducted accelerated schedule with my RV-8A for medical
reasons which I won't go into but it's just the sort of thing that makes tempers
rise and shipment deadlines seem like life or death experience. This is
compounded by the fact that I live in a nonaviation supported town thousands of
miles away from the factory were even simple stuff like AN bolts must reach me
through the post. I too have been quick to snipe at Van's whenever things don't
go my way.
In my ten months of building my quick build kit I have encountered everything
from damaged shipments to missing parts but Van's has always been there for me
with big brother like concern and sound advice whenever I needed it. I work in
the software industry where free technical support for more than a year is a
joke at best. At Van's they not only support their product with a team of
trained "experienced" experts but continue this free support for the many many
years that it often takes to finish up a scratch build kit.
For all you lurkers out there who are sitting on the fence, just let me say that
Van's support is second to none.
- Jim Andrews
RV-8A ( engine )
O-360 ( N89JA )
Please archive.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Antennae in the wingtips |
08/22/2000 03:44:19 PM
Scott's reply is mathematically right on. In the work-a-day real world
effective radiated power----as read with a signal strength meter, on 8
watts PEP radiated (transmitted) from both verticle & horz. quarter wave
diapole (aircraft 10.00 dollar 18 inch stainless VHF antenna from the
salvage yard) at 1 mile distance, the miliwatt signal received was the
same. Voice was 5/5 (not distorted). Net result....in EE school I would
give the text book answer but being a amatuer radio person I soon found
theory and practical need sometimes diverge.
Scott (at)matronics.com on 08/22/2000 07:25:45 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: Antennae in the wingtips
Actually, it is more on the order of -20 dB, which equates to 1/100th
ERP (Effective Radiated Power) when you rotate polarization 90 degrees,
so a 1 Watt transmitter effectively radiates like a 10 milliwatt
transmitter. And that's not including any loss in the coax!
Scott
Amateur radio op N0EDV
"Gary A. Sobek" wrote:
>
>
> --- Stuart B McCurdy wrote:
> >
> > Listers,
> >
> > Awhile back someone mentioned putting antennae in
> > the wingtips. I can't
> > find the archive on it. Can Comm and VOR antennae
> > be put in the
> > wingtips to reduce drag and is there an impact on
> > transmission or
> > reception? Is there an impact by having the local
> > strobe power packs on
> > the end rib in each wing also?
> >
> > Stu McCurdy
> > RV-3, Building RV-8 QB
>
> Stu:
>
> Bob Archer in Torrance California designed the
> antennas that are shown on page 423 of the 2000-2001
> Aircraft Spruce Catalog. The Model 1 VOR Antenna
> works great in my RV-6 with wingtip mounted strobe
> power supplies. Jim Ayers has them in his RV-3 and
> the model 2 comm in the tail cap. His comm works
> great.
>
> Bob makes a model 1A Wing Tip comm antenna. I do not
> have one. It is reported to work well but does not
> have the range as an external or Bob's Model 2 Tail
> cap comm antenna. I may be wrong but it could be
> possible becasue it is not vertically polorized. If I
> remember correctly, there is about a 3 dB loss of
> signal when you change from horizontal to vertical
> polorization. 3dB equals a 1/2 signal loss. Since
> the side of the wing tip is on about a 45, you may
> only have a 1 dB loss which would be acceptable but it
> is a loss.
>
> ====
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> 650+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
> http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
>
> "I never knew what real happiness was until I got married; and then it
was too late..." - Jack Handey
>
--
--Scott--
1986 Corben Junior Ace N3642
http://corbenflyer.tripod.com/
RV-4 under construction (tail feathers)
Gotta Fly or Gonna Die!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Carter" <jcarter8(at)midsouth.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Plastic tubing |
Does
> anyone know where I can get the plastic tubing that Van uses on the rudder
> cables
Home Depot has it - look in the plumbing section.
Jerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bill.e.esther(at)exgate.tek.com |
| Subject: | Fuel cap etching |
-----Original Message-----
From: Malcolm L Harper [mailto:mlharper(at)mindspring.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 6:25 PM
Subject: RV-List: Fuel cap etching
What's the latest source to have fuel caps etched? I tried the guy at panel
cut but have received no answer.
Hello RV-List
I CNC my fuel caps for 1949 Ercoupe, and would considerate doing for
other's.
You can e-mail @ bill.e.esther(at)exgate.tek.com
Hope this helps
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bill.e.esther(at)exgate.tek.com |
| Subject: | Fuel cap etching |
-----Original Message-----
From: Malcolm L Harper [mailto:mlharper(at)mindspring.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 6:25 PM
Subject: RV-List: Fuel cap etching
What's the latest source to have fuel caps etched? I tried the guy at panel
cut but have received no answer.
Hello RV-List
I CNC my fuel caps for 1949 Ercoupe, and would considerate doing for
other's.
You can e-mail @ bill.e.esther(at)exgate.tek.com
Hope this helps
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Owens, Laird" <Owens(at)aerovironment.com> |
Has anyone used a short piece of tubing with a flair pointed into the
wind..using a elbo on the vent lines ? I've seen this on quite a few RV's
at Lakeland & Oshgosh. Any rhyme or reason for this??
Don,
Why would you want to add cost, weight, complexity and drag to your airplane?
Just to get a more(?) efficient vent system?
I think this is a case of adding crap just because you can.
Come on now.....get back to building.
To steal somebody else's line "Your going to love this airplane", but only if it's
flying!
No flame intended.
Laird RV-6 N515L
O-360/Sensenich
72 hrs
SoCal
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock |
08/22/2000 02:34:32 PM
How would you reach the long hinge(to take it out for maintenance or
painting) pin once you tap it in to the last eye 1/4 inch for the
mini-cotter pin ? You can't tap the hinge pin from the fuse side 'cause the
fuselage is there ??? Such a long pin needs a drill spin to put in & pull
out for me.......?????
dimeob(at)powertel.com.au on 08/21/2000 09:14:14 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: RV-List: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock
I made my hinge pin shorter than the length of the hinge and secured it
by
drilling a small hole at each end of the hinge and putting in a cotter pin.
I plan to do that with my Flap hinges as well.
Bob
RV 8#423
> ----------
> From: Are Barstad
> Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 05:59 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV-List: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock
>
>
> I planned to rivet it in with an AN 3-4.5 rivet and drill it out if I
ever
> have to remove the trim tab. Hopefully I will never have to replace the
> trimtab though and even if I do, it shouldn't be much wear replacing it
> and
> even drilling it out a second time for a _third_ trimtab. If I still need
> to
> replace the trimtab a fourth time, I should look for another hobby or a
> hangar with a door and padlock :)
>
> I noticed that Van's RV-8A at Oshkosh had a longer hinge pin and bent two
> or
> three different directions and then secured with safety wire to a little
> hole on the elevator spar (I think this is right). This is great too and
> makes the trimtab replacements easier.
>
> Regards,
> Are
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mike Nellis
> Sent: August 21, 2000 12:52 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock
>
>
> Are,
>
> How will you secure the piece of hinge? Will you rivet it or use a
screw.
> If you use a screw, then there is the problem of taking the screw out and
> chipping the paint after it's painted. If you rivet it in place, then
how
> do you remove it?
>
> I got the idea I used from my friend Paul Golias and modified it to use a
> piece of hinge like yours but in a difference location. Just another way
> of
> doing the same thing.
>
> http://mnellis.jnet.net/RV-6_Page/elevator_4.htm#TrimHingeSecure
>
> Mike Nellis - RV-6 Wings N699BM (res)
> Plainfield, IL
> http://mnellis.jnet.net/rv-6_page
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Are Barstad" <abarstad(at)bconnex.net>
> To:
> Sent: Saturday, August 19, 2000 10:46 PM
> Subject: RV-List: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock
>
>
> >
> > I spent a long time looking at RV's at Oshkosh and at my local airport
> when
> > building my empennage. I wasn't sure how to best lock the trimtab hinge
> pin.
> > The archive provided me with some ideas but I still wanted to see it
> myself
> > on a real RV.
> >
> > I saw many different ways at Oshkosh but the best by far was one I saw
> at
> my
> > local airport at Brampton (Ontario, Canada). Subsequently I used this
> same
> > method and I think it looks and works great with material supplied in
> the
> > kit. I simply used a part of the hinge that I cut and riveted it on the
> left
> > elevator. Note that you have to pay attention in order to get the
> required
> > edge distances on the 'mini-hinge'.
> >
> > It's a bit hard to explain so I supplied a couple of pictures here if
> you
> > are interested.
> >
> > http://www.bconnex.net/~abarstad/hinge.html
> >
> > Are
> > RV-8
> > Waiting for Wings
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mitch Faatz <mfaatz(at)avidyne.com> |
-----Original Message-----
From: Owens, Laird [mailto:Owens(at)aerovironment.com]
>>Has anyone used a short piece of tubing with a flair pointed into the
>>wind..using a elbo on the vent lines ? I've seen this on quite a few RV's
>Why would you want to add cost, weight, complexity and drag
>to your airplane? Just to get a more(?) efficient vent system?
>
>I think this is a case of adding crap just because you can.
Before we jump on somebody for asking a valid question, let's remember that
not more than a few months ago *many* people were complaining about very low
fuel pressure. It's quite possible flaring the vent intakes boosts the fuel
pressure to some degree, I'd like to hear more about it.
Mitch Faatz RV-6A Finish Kit
Bedford, MA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Antennae in the wingtips |
I agree that theory and practice diverge in this example. For a living
proof, consider the handhelds that receive horizontally-polarized VOR
signals with a vertical, stubby antenna. For further proof, just rotate your
handheld 90 degrees while receiving a signal. Not much difference.
Dennis Persyk Amateur Radio N9DP RV6A N600DP O360A1A Hartzell
Hampshire, IL C38
-----Original Message-----
From: pcondon(at)csc.com <pcondon(at)csc.com>
Date: Tuesday, August 22, 2000 2:51 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Antennae in the wingtips
>
>Scott's reply is mathematically right on. In the work-a-day real world
>effective radiated power----as read with a signal strength meter, on 8
>watts PEP radiated (transmitted) from both verticle & horz. quarter wave
>diapole (aircraft 10.00 dollar 18 inch stainless VHF antenna from the
>salvage yard) at 1 mile distance, the miliwatt signal received was the
>same. Voice was 5/5 (not distorted). Net result....in EE school I would
>give the text book answer but being a amatuer radio person I soon found
>theory and practical need sometimes diverge.
>
>
>Scott (at)matronics.com on 08/22/2000 07:25:45 AM
>
>Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
>Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
>
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>cc:
>
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Antennae in the wingtips
>
>
>Actually, it is more on the order of -20 dB, which equates to 1/100th
>ERP (Effective Radiated Power) when you rotate polarization 90 degrees,
>so a 1 Watt transmitter effectively radiates like a 10 milliwatt
>transmitter. And that's not including any loss in the coax!
>
>
>Scott
>Amateur radio op N0EDV
>
>
>"Gary A. Sobek" wrote:
>>
>>
>> --- Stuart B McCurdy wrote:
>> >
>> > Listers,
>> >
>> > Awhile back someone mentioned putting antennae in
>> > the wingtips. I can't
>> > find the archive on it. Can Comm and VOR antennae
>> > be put in the
>> > wingtips to reduce drag and is there an impact on
>> > transmission or
>> > reception? Is there an impact by having the local
>> > strobe power packs on
>> > the end rib in each wing also?
>> >
>> > Stu McCurdy
>> > RV-3, Building RV-8 QB
>>
>> Stu:
>>
>> Bob Archer in Torrance California designed the
>> antennas that are shown on page 423 of the 2000-2001
>> Aircraft Spruce Catalog. The Model 1 VOR Antenna
>> works great in my RV-6 with wingtip mounted strobe
>> power supplies. Jim Ayers has them in his RV-3 and
>> the model 2 comm in the tail cap. His comm works
>> great.
>>
>> Bob makes a model 1A Wing Tip comm antenna. I do not
>> have one. It is reported to work well but does not
>> have the range as an external or Bob's Model 2 Tail
>> cap comm antenna. I may be wrong but it could be
>> possible becasue it is not vertically polorized. If I
>> remember correctly, there is about a 3 dB loss of
>> signal when you change from horizontal to vertical
>> polorization. 3dB equals a 1/2 signal loss. Since
>> the side of the wing tip is on about a 45, you may
>> only have a 1 dB loss which would be acceptable but it
>> is a loss.
>>
>> ====
>> Gary A. Sobek
>> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
>> 650+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
>> http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
>>
>> "I never knew what real happiness was until I got married; and then it
>was too late..." - Jack Handey
>>
>
>--
>--Scott--
>1986 Corben Junior Ace N3642
>http://corbenflyer.tripod.com/
>RV-4 under construction (tail feathers)
>
>Gotta Fly or Gonna Die!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Antennae in the wingtips |
>Bob Archer in Torrance California designed the
>antennas that are shown on page 423 of the 2000-2001
>Aircraft Spruce Catalog. The Model 1 VOR Antenna
>works great in my RV-6 with wingtip mounted strobe
>power supplies. Jim Ayers has them in his RV-3 and
>the model 2 comm in the tail cap. His comm works
>great.
>
>Bob makes a model 1A Wing Tip comm antenna. I do not
>have one. It is reported to work well but does not
>have the range as an external or Bob's Model 2 Tail
>cap comm antenna. I may be wrong but it could be
>possible becasue it is not vertically polorized. If I
>remember correctly, there is about a 3 dB loss of
>signal when you change from horizontal to vertical
>polorization. 3dB equals a 1/2 signal loss. Since
>the side of the wing tip is on about a 45, you may
>only have a 1 dB loss which would be acceptable but it
>is a loss.
I think losses due to cross polarization are generally
much greater . . . but Bob's wing-tip comm antenna
is designed to put the major e-field component vertically
oriented. Due to limited vertical height under the tip
fairing, the APERTURE of this antenna is somewhat
reduced with respect to a free standing whisker
on the fuselage . . . so it's maximum performance
straight off the wing tip will be deminished over
the free-and-clear whisker.
Further, the aircraft shadows the antenna for communications
on the off-side and performance will be further reudced.
Unless you routinely talk to RCO facilities on long
cross-country trips, you may well not notice this antenna's
short-comings.
I've had builders install the tip antennas for routine
local joy riding and then screw a full sized whisker
into a flush receptacle for trips over the wastlands.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different than )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Plastic tubing |
> This may come under the category of dumb builder's question but... Does
> anyone know where I can get the plastic tubing that Van uses on the rudder
> cables? There are two short lengths for where the rudder cables exit the
> fuse and one long length to protect the left rudder cable from the manual
> trim lever in the -4. I was thinking that I would like to buy lengths of
> this stuff to run my rudder cable through for the length of the cabin. To
> protect the cables and to protect the passenger from seeing the "guts" of
> the plane. Is there a better alternative?
Scott,
Go to a marine supply store that sells sailing gear (West Marine is a good
one). Take a look at some of the plastic sheathing that is used to cover
sailboat mast wires... should work great.
Randy Lervold
RV-8, #80500, cowling
www.rv-8.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Glenn & Judi <foxinsocks(at)mediaone.net> |
| Subject: | Performance Propellers |
Hi,
Can anyone share any experiences (good or bad) they have had with
Performance Propellers wood props?
Thanks,
Glenn Gordon
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <fasching(at)amigo.net> |
| Subject: | S-TEC System 30 ALT |
If any lister has an S-TEC System 30 ALT, single axis 'auto pilot' installed
in his RV please contact me off list...I have questions about that system.
Thank you.
RV6A Flying
Salida, CO
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | joe wiza <jwiza1(at)yahoo.com> |
Listers
I have an 0360 A1D. My DG and AH gyros quit operating.
No suction on suction gage. How can I tell if it's my
suction pump or regulator. Shall I use past presidence
and assume it's the more expensive of the two???
second question not RV related. I have a Celebrity bi
plane with a C85 hp. The top plugs are the unshielded
type M41E. I am replacing the ignition wire harness
and am trying to find the old type clips to attach to
the top plug wires. (not enough room for shielded
plugs)ACFT Spruce does not have any. any help on the
above would be appriciated. Please answer off net.
Do not archieve
Joe RV6A 105hrs looking good
jwiza1(at)yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clayfly(at)libertybay.com.Tue, |
(EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id" <B0005184142@mail-2.lbay.net>;
Tue,
22 Aug 2000 14:56:37.-0700(at)matronics.com
| Subject: | 72FM8 Sensenich Propellers |
Hello fellow builders,
I'm still waiting for my FAA examiner to set a date for my inspection, but it could
be the first
of next week. I have a question for those of you who are flying behind an O-360
with the
new Sensenich 72FM8 metal prop. Since Sensenich is still working with the FAA
to
establish a type certificate for this prop, I assume I will be assigned a 40 hour
test period. Is
that what you have experienced? If not, what kind of bogus, er, paperwork did
you use to
satisfy the examiner?
Thanks,
Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, taxi testing --- it drives great
Indiana
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 72FM8 Sensenich Propellers |
>
>Hello fellow builders,
>I'm still waiting for my FAA examiner to set a date for my inspection, but
>it could be the first
>of next week. I have a question for those of you who are flying behind an
>O-360 with the
>new Sensenich 72FM8 metal prop. Since Sensenich is still working with the
>FAA to
>establish a type certificate for this prop, I assume I will be assigned a
>40 hour test period. Is
>that what you have experienced? If not, what kind of bogus, er, paperwork
>did you use to
>satisfy the examiner?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, taxi testing --- it drives great
>Indiana
Clay,
I had a very cool FAA inspector sign off my airplane and I got 40 hours.
This is one area where there is no room for interpretation of the rules. At
least he gave me a HUGE operating area to play in so those 40 hours were
spent visiting lots of different places. Ask for all the room you can get.
It makes a difference.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Antennae in the wingtips |
Has anyone tried the "advanced aircraft electronics" high gain antenna system
in A/C Spruce that claim to out perform anything on the market, and can be
mounted in fiberglass tips of metal aircraft?
Also, the Archer Model 2 tail cap com antenna needs an area 10" high and 12"
long, does this fit down inside of the rudder?
Thanks, working on wing and emp fiberglass, so need to decide on antenna
placement
Kevin Shannon
-9A Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Denny Harjehausen <harje(at)proaxis.com> |
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Owens, Laird [mailto:Owens(at)aerovironment.com]
>
>>>Has anyone used a short piece of tubing with a flair pointed into the
>>>wind..using a elbo on the vent lines ? I've seen this on quite a few RV's
>
>>Why would you want to add cost, weight, complexity and drag
>>to your airplane? Just to get a more(?) efficient vent system?
>>
>>I think this is a case of adding crap just because you can.
>
>
>Before we jump on somebody for asking a valid question, let's remember that
>not more than a few months ago *many* people were complaining about very low
>fuel pressure. It's quite possible flaring the vent intakes boosts the fuel
>pressure to some degree, I'd like to hear more about it.
>
>
>Mitch Faatz RV-6A Finish Kit
>Bedford, MA
I was having a problem of indicating lower and lower fuel pressures
as I climbed. I copied the bent tube idea from another RV that,
if you will, gets a blast of air. It indicates 2 psi now as
opposed to 0 at 7500 ft. These are indications from a digital
fuel pressure gauge. Obviously the engine was getting fuel,
as it was still running. What concerned me is how much pressure
I was getting and was it really getting less pressure as I climbed.
And if so at what altitude would it quit.
At any rate it looks better on the guage now!
Have a wonderful Day!
Denny Harjehausen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Knicholas2(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | a simple corrosion question |
Please don't flame me for asking a simple question that I could not find on
the archives.
I am starting the emp. kit for a RV9 and since I live in the pacific
NOrthwest, I need/want maximum corroision protection. I can't get any
chromate paint anymore, so I had palnned to use alumiprep -> alodine ->
variprime. I want to save weight, so is the variprime needed? Can I just
use the prep and alodine and maintain good protection?
Kim Nicholas
Kent (Seatttle) WA
RV9A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DWENSING(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel vent lines |
In a message dated 8/22/00 3:52:07 PM Central Daylight Time,
Owens(at)aerovironment.com writes:
<< "Your going to love this airplane", but only if it's flying! >>
Not necessarily so..........building the RV has been my passion, my
relaxation, and my escape for sometime now. I am eager to finish it, maybe
later this year, but I wonder what I'll do when it is done. Maybe I am more
into airplanes than I am into flying!??
Dale Ensing RV6A finishing stuff.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Bundy" <ebundy(at)micron.net> |
| Subject: | Re: a simple corrosion question |
Hi Kim, It's unfortunate that people have to post to this list with
requests to not be flamed. I feel the need to do it too, and I wish people
would be a little less aggressive.
Anyway, I didn't alumiprep or alodine anything, and I only primed parts that
*I* (no flame asterisks) felt critical, (spars and the like) or flashing
areas, (any place that two pieces touch) or anything that wasn't Alclad.
However, I live in a very dry area.
If I lived in the Pacific Northwet I would prime everything.
Ed Bundy - Eagle, ID
RV6A, 0320-D1a (160hp)
Sensenich 70x78, N427EM, 350+hrs.
ebundy(at)micron.net
> Please don't flame me for asking a simple question that I could not find
on
> the archives.
>
> I am starting the emp. kit for a RV9 and since I live in the pacific
> NOrthwest, I need/want maximum corroision protection. I can't get any
> chromate paint anymore, so I had palnned to use alumiprep -> alodine ->
> variprime. I want to save weight, so is the variprime needed? Can I
just
> use the prep and alodine and maintain good protection?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 72FM8 Sensenich Propellers |
>
>
>>
>>Hello fellow builders,
>>I'm still waiting for my FAA examiner to set a date for my inspection, but
>>it could be the first
>>of next week. I have a question for those of you who are flying behind an
>>O-360 with the
>>new Sensenich 72FM8 metal prop. Since Sensenich is still working with the
>>FAA to
>>establish a type certificate for this prop, I assume I will be assigned a
>>40 hour test period. Is
>>that what you have experienced? If not, what kind of bogus, er, paperwork
>>did you use to
>>satisfy the examiner?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, taxi testing --- it drives great
>>Indiana
>
>Clay,
>
>I had a very cool FAA inspector sign off my airplane and I got 40 hours.
>This is one area where there is no room for interpretation of the rules.
I agree that this is an area that is clear in the rules however I know a
woman who got a 25 hour test period with an uncertified wood prop and an
O-320. Go figure! As has been pointed out, there can be many
interpretations.
I really didn't mind my 40 hour test period with a 72FM8 and Aerosport Power
engine but I think it is closer to a certified combo than hers was.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scott <acepilot(at)win.bright.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Antennae in the wingtips |
Because rubber duckies (dummy loads) suck no matter which way they're
pointed ;)
Scott (N0EDV)
do no archive
Dennis Persyk wrote:
>
>
> I agree that theory and practice diverge in this example. For a living
> proof, consider the handhelds that receive horizontally-polarized VOR
> signals with a vertical, stubby antenna. For further proof, just rotate your
> handheld 90 degrees while receiving a signal. Not much difference.
> Dennis Persyk Amateur Radio N9DP RV6A N600DP O360A1A Hartzell
> Hampshire, IL C38
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pcondon(at)csc.com <pcondon(at)csc.com>
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Tuesday, August 22, 2000 2:51 PM
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Antennae in the wingtips
>
> >
> >Scott's reply is mathematically right on. In the work-a-day real world
> >effective radiated power----as read with a signal strength meter, on 8
> >watts PEP radiated (transmitted) from both verticle & horz. quarter wave
> >diapole (aircraft 10.00 dollar 18 inch stainless VHF antenna from the
> >salvage yard) at 1 mile distance, the miliwatt signal received was the
> >same. Voice was 5/5 (not distorted). Net result....in EE school I would
> >give the text book answer but being a amatuer radio person I soon found
> >theory and practical need sometimes diverge.
> >
> >
> >Scott (at)matronics.com on 08/22/2000 07:25:45 AM
> >
> >Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >
> >Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> >
> >
> >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >cc:
> >
> >Subject: Re: RV-List: Antennae in the wingtips
> >
> >
> >
> >Actually, it is more on the order of -20 dB, which equates to 1/100th
> >ERP (Effective Radiated Power) when you rotate polarization 90 degrees,
> >so a 1 Watt transmitter effectively radiates like a 10 milliwatt
> >transmitter. And that's not including any loss in the coax!
> >
> >
> >Scott
> >Amateur radio op N0EDV
> >
> >
> >"Gary A. Sobek" wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> --- Stuart B McCurdy wrote:
> >> >
> >> > Listers,
> >> >
> >> > Awhile back someone mentioned putting antennae in
> >> > the wingtips. I can't
> >> > find the archive on it. Can Comm and VOR antennae
> >> > be put in the
> >> > wingtips to reduce drag and is there an impact on
> >> > transmission or
> >> > reception? Is there an impact by having the local
> >> > strobe power packs on
> >> > the end rib in each wing also?
> >> >
> >> > Stu McCurdy
> >> > RV-3, Building RV-8 QB
> >>
> >> Stu:
> >>
> >> Bob Archer in Torrance California designed the
> >> antennas that are shown on page 423 of the 2000-2001
> >> Aircraft Spruce Catalog. The Model 1 VOR Antenna
> >> works great in my RV-6 with wingtip mounted strobe
> >> power supplies. Jim Ayers has them in his RV-3 and
> >> the model 2 comm in the tail cap. His comm works
> >> great.
> >>
> >> Bob makes a model 1A Wing Tip comm antenna. I do not
> >> have one. It is reported to work well but does not
> >> have the range as an external or Bob's Model 2 Tail
> >> cap comm antenna. I may be wrong but it could be
> >> possible becasue it is not vertically polorized. If I
> >> remember correctly, there is about a 3 dB loss of
> >> signal when you change from horizontal to vertical
> >> polorization. 3dB equals a 1/2 signal loss. Since
> >> the side of the wing tip is on about a 45, you may
> >> only have a 1 dB loss which would be acceptable but it
> >> is a loss.
> >>
> >> ====
> >> Gary A. Sobek
> >> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> >> 650+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
> >> http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
> >>
> >> "I never knew what real happiness was until I got married; and then it
> >was too late..." - Jack Handey
> >>
> >
> >--
> >--Scott--
> >1986 Corben Junior Ace N3642
> >http://corbenflyer.tripod.com/
> >RV-4 under construction (tail feathers)
> >
> >Gotta Fly or Gonna Die!
> >
> >
>
--
--Scott--
1986 Corben Junior Ace N3642
http://corbenflyer.tripod.com/
RV-4 under construction (tail feathers)
Gotta Fly or Gonna Die!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Mac Servo/Switch Question... |
| From: | Wes Hays <whays(at)juno.com> |
I used the MKIII Governor for my trim. I think our very own Matt Dralle
still handles them. They worked great and he provided excellent technical
assistance for an electrically challenged builder. I used two. One for
the aileron trim and one for the elevator trim. Matt used to have them on
his web page.
http://www.matronics.com
Please check it out if you are interested.
Keep your airspeed up.
Wes Hays
Rotan, TX
RV6-A, 0-360 w/CS (Hartzell)
N844WB, Painting and Final Assembly
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Plastic tubing |
| From: | Wes Hays <whays(at)juno.com> |
Scott,
FWIW, a friend of mine told me about the sheaths they use on sailboats
that are split and slide over the cables. I got mine from West Marine.
They really work well and you don't hear the cables grinding on the
bushings when the cables work. Makes the rudders smooth.
Wes Hays
Rotan, TX
RV6-A, 0-360 w/CS (Hartzell)
N844WB, Painting and Final Assembly
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: a simple corrosion question |
Knicholas2(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
>
> Please don't flame me for asking a simple question that I could not find on
> the archives.
This is actually not a simple question. If you search for primer in the
archives you will get 2451 hits. There has been many a war fought about
how we should go about protecting our planes from the environment. Spend
some time and read through some of the wars, there is a lot of knowleged
to be gained.
>
> I am starting the emp. kit for a RV9 and since I live in the pacific
> NOrthwest, I need/want maximum corroision protection. I can't get any
> chromate paint anymore, so I had palnned to use alumiprep -> alodine ->
> variprime.
Variprim contains Zinc Chromate in some small amount, so says the label
on my can so ther is some sacrificial element in the primer.
My wings have only the spars and non alcalad parts primed. The ribs and
skins are all alumiprep and alodine. Will this work, who knows, only
time will tell. My fuselage is primed with variprime with no surface
prep except for cleaning (soap water/scotch brite), even the skins are
primed. My empenage is primed with Mar-Hyde self etch primer.
One thing I learned from the primer wars is that most primers, including
variprime, form no moisture barrier and must be top coated for proper
corrosion protection. There are some two part epoxy primers that
builders use that form this barrier and may be better suited to the
NorthWet. Even the trusted Zinc Chromate primers of yesteryear formed no
vapor barrier, the zinc is slowley sacrificed to save the aluminum. I
would think the corrosion protection would slowly dissapear in a few
years.
> I want to save weight, so is the variprime needed? Can I just
> use the prep and alodine and maintain good protection?
I don't think the weight savings of omitting the variprime is much. If
your like me the "bubba factor" is the greatest weight penalty.
Would I prime again? I switch back and forth on this one but were I to
build another metal plane I would clean and prime all parts as they came
out of the box durring inventory. Well today that is. Just my $0.02
worth.
--
Gary Zilik - Pine Junction, Colorado
RV-6A N99PZ Flying
Engine: Aerosport Power O-360-A1A with H2AD Pistons
Prop: Sensenich 72FM8S9-1-83
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | marksnow(at)cavemen.net (Mark Snow) |
| Subject: | Re: Performance Propellers |
>I had Clark Lydick Build me a prop for my airplane (not an rv). Clark
>told me that his prop would weigh about the same as the prop that it would
>replace. When I received the prop it weighed 40% more than the old prop.
>When I confronted Clark with this he told me that as far as he was
>concerned 40% heavier was acceptable and that I should quit whining. I'am
>now $850 poorer, have the orgional prop still on my airplane and Clark's
>prop hangs on my shop wall.
Mark Snow 48rv
>Hi,
>
>Can anyone share any experiences (good or bad) they have had with
>Performance Propellers wood props?
>
>Thanks,
>Glenn Gordon
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 72FM8 Sensenich Propellers |
>
> Hello fellow builders,
> I'm still waiting for my FAA examiner to set a date for my inspection, but it
could be the first
> of next week. I have a question for those of you who are flying behind an O-360
with the
> new Sensenich 72FM8 metal prop. Since Sensenich is still working with the FAA
to
> establish a type certificate for this prop, I assume I will be assigned a 40
hour test period. Is
> that what you have experienced? If not, what kind of bogus, er, paperwork did
you use to
> satisfy the examiner?
>
> Thanks,
>
>
I got a 40 hr test period, but then again my engine has a big dataplate
that says EXPERIMENTAL ENGINE in big letters. 40 hours seems like a long
time but actually passed very quickley. Getting a large test area is of
more importance. If you have a 50 mile box with no airports except your
home field then even 25 hrs is an eternaty. I have heard horror stories
of builders with the test box just mentioned. I was asigned all of NE
colorado including DIA with words to the affect about trying to fly into
DIA, what he would do to me..... I am at 75 hrs and am still collecting
data. The testing never ends
--
Gary Zilik - Pine Junction, Colorado
RV-6A N99PZ Flying
Engine: Aerosport Power O-360-A1A with H2AD Pistons
Prop: Sensenich 72FM8S9-1-83
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaskuss(at)miami.gdi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: a simple corrosion question |
Kim
Do not use Veriprime over an Alodined surface. The "self etching" acid in the
Veriprime will attack the Alodine. You will end up with less protection, not
more. I suggest you use one of the Mil-spec epoxy primers over the Alodine. To
learn more about this subject go to EAA Chapter 1000's excellent web site. Here
is the index to all the corrosion protection articles on the site.
http://www.eaa1000.av.org/technicl/corrosion/corridx.htm
I have saved a lot of info on this subject which I'd be happy to send you
directly. It's in HTML, which the list doesn't like.
Charlie Kuss
RV-8 wings
Boca Raton, Fl.
> Please don't flame me for asking a simple question that I could not find on
> the archives.
>
> I am starting the emp. kit for a RV9 and since I live in the pacific
> NOrthwest, I need/want maximum corroision protection. I can't get any
> chromate paint anymore, so I had palnned to use alumiprep -> alodine ->
> variprime. I want to save weight, so is the variprime needed? Can I just
> use the prep and alodine and maintain good protection?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | marksnow(at)cavemen.net (Mark Snow) |
| Subject: | Re: Performance Propellers |
>I had Clark Lydick Build me a prop for my airplane (not an rv). Clark
>told me that his prop would weigh about the same as the prop that it would
>replace. When I received the prop it weighed 40% more than the old prop.
>When I confronted Clark with this he told me that as far as he was
>concerned 40% heavier was acceptable and that I should quit whining. I'am
>now $850 poorer, have the orgional prop still on my airplane and Clark's
>prop hangs on my shop wall.
Mark Snow 48rv
>Hi,
>
>Can anyone share any experiences (good or bad) they have had with
>Performance Propellers wood props?
>
>Thanks,
>Glenn Gordon
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | old ogre <jollyd(at)teleport.com> |
| Subject: | Re: a simple corrosion question |
columbia airmotive still has it..in the spray,or in bulk....troutdale ore.
Knicholas2(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
> Please don't flame me for asking a simple question that I could not find on
> the archives.
>
> I am starting the emp. kit for a RV9 and since I live in the pacific
> NOrthwest, I need/want maximum corroision protection. I can't get any
> chromate paint anymore, so I had palnned to use alumiprep -> alodine ->
> variprime. I want to save weight, so is the variprime needed? Can I just
> use the prep and alodine and maintain good protection?
>
> Kim Nicholas
> Kent (Seatttle) WA
> RV9A
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | marksnow(at)cavemen.net (Mark Snow) |
| Subject: | Re: Performance Propellers |
>I had Clark Lydick Build me a prop for my airplane (not an rv). Clark
>told me that his prop would weigh about the same as the prop that it would
>replace. When I received the prop it weighed 40% more than the old prop.
>When I confronted Clark with this he told me that as far as he was
>concerned 40% heavier was acceptable and that I should quit whining. I'am
>now $850 poorer, have the orgional prop still on my airplane and Clark's
>prop hangs on my shop wall.
Mark Snow 48rv
>Hi,
>
>Can anyone share any experiences (good or bad) they have had with
>Performance Propellers wood props?
>
>Thanks,
>Glenn Gordon
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Vacum/ignition |
> I have an 0360 A1D. My DG and AH gyros quit operating.
> No suction on suction gage. How can I tell if it's my
> suction pump or regulator. Shall I use past presidence
> and assume it's the more expensive of the two???
My system test method was to apply suction to the vacuum port of
the regulator by using a vacuum cleaner. Mine only pulled about 3
inches, but it was enough to test the system. That seems like a simple
way to start isolating your problem. You could have a kinked hose in
the system.
Tim
******
Tim Lewis -- Springfield VA
RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
TimRV6A(at)earthlink.net
http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Performance Propellers |
Since wooden props weigh around 10 pounds, 14 pounds doesn't sound very bad.
Cy Galley - Editor, B-C Contact!
(Click here to visit our Club site at http://www.bellanca-championclub.com)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Snow" <marksnow(at)cavemen.net>
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2000 9:08 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Performance Propellers
>
>
> >I had Clark Lydick Build me a prop for my airplane (not an rv). Clark
> >told me that his prop would weigh about the same as the prop that it
would
> >replace. When I received the prop it weighed 40% more than the old prop.
> >When I confronted Clark with this he told me that as far as he was
> >concerned 40% heavier was acceptable and that I should quit whining. I'am
> >now $850 poorer, have the orgional prop still on my airplane and Clark's
> >prop hangs on my shop wall.
>
> Mark Snow 48rv
>
>
> >Hi,
> >
> >Can anyone share any experiences (good or bad) they have had with
> >Performance Propellers wood props?
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Glenn Gordon
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RVPilot4(at)webtv.net (BOBE.) |
| Subject: | Re: Performance Propellers |
I have bought two propellars from Clark Lydick.He makes a great
prop.About weight, they are very very light compared to a fixed metal or
constant speed. Actually my 68x72 is so light that weight is just not a
factor.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Short field performance |
GARY EIGHT YEARS WE HAVE BEEN OPERATING 2 RV4S 180HP C/S PROP FROM 1400FOOT
SOD STRIP ON MY FARM.ELV 1020FT. WE ONLY USE ABOUT 800FT REGARDS TOM
Thomas M. Whelan
Whelan Farms Airport
Post Office Box 426
249 Hard Hill Road North
Bethlehem, CT 06751
PH 203-266-5300
FAX 203-266-5140
e-mail wfact01(at)aol.com
EAA Chapter 1097, President
RV-8 IO-540 LYC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob Newman" <newmanb(at)rocketmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: a simple corrosion question |
For maximum corrosion protection use an epoxy polyimide primer that meets
MIL-P-23377. Akzo from AC Spruce is one excellent choice. US Paint
(Awlgrip) 30-Y-94 is another and it may be locally available from a US Paint
marine distributor. Sterling U1201 is yet another choice. Variprime and
wash primers do not meet this spec and they are intended to be used with a
top coat, not as a corrosion preventative. Nevertheless, they are somewhat
effective in moderate climates. If you can, find a local source as the hazmat
fees on shipping paint are outrageous.
Regards,
Bob
>
> I am starting the emp. kit for a RV9 and since I live in the pacific
> NOrthwest, I need/want maximum corroision protection. I can't get any
> chromate paint anymore, so I had palnned to use alumiprep -> alodine
> -> variprime. I want to save weight, so is the variprime needed? Can
> I just use the prep and alodine and maintain good protection?
>
> Kim Nicholas
> Kent (Seatttle) WA
> RV9A
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Short field performance |
I fly the 150 hp 6A out of 2100 feet at elevation of 1040 MSL. I have never
used more than 2/3 of this distance for landing, even with a high or hot
approach occasionally (but I will go around if it looks way overshot), and I
try to stay off the brakes. Takeoff at 1630 lbs on a warm moist morning with
short grass a few weeks back involved maybe 900 feet of ground roll. The
runway is free of obstacles at either end. If proficient with your plane, I
predict complete satisfaction with any home airport over say 1400 feet as
long as the ends are open and the over-run is surviveable. One thing is for
certain; as the owner, _you_ will control the height of the grass!
Bill Boyd
RV-6A O-320/FP Sensenich
Hop-Along Airfield - 12VA --mowed today for the umteenth time
Clifton Forge, VA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: a simple corrosion question |
Hi Kim, I too live in the PNW (Bremerton) and agonized over all the info
about priming. I finally just asked Van's (PNW environment too) what primer
they use, and turned out to be the same stuff I was using which is Sherwin
Williams Industrial Wash Primer P 60 G2 thinned 2:1. applied very thin, just
enough to get it wet. Well there's my story, donning my asbestos underwear
now for flame job to follow.
Kevin Shannon
-9A
anxiously waiting for fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Vacum/ignition |
Joe,
You can disconnect the hose from the vacuum pump and connect a vacuum
cleaner hose to it. You won't see much suction but there should be an
inch or so. Also look at your pump and see if the shear coupling is
gone, they tend to get rotten and fall apart.
Dave RV-6 STILL waiting for a prop governor
joe wiza wrote:
>
> Listers
>
> I have an 0360 A1D. My DG and AH gyros quit operating.
> No suction on suction gage. How can I tell if it's my
> suction pump or regulator. Shall I use past presidence
> and assume it's the more expensive of the two???
>
> second question not RV related. I have a Celebrity bi
> plane with a C85 hp. The top plugs are the unshielded
> type M41E. I am replacing the ignition wire harness
> and am trying to find the old type clips to attach to
> the top plug wires. (not enough room for shielded
> plugs)ACFT Spruce does not have any. any help on the
> above would be appriciated. Please answer off net.
> Do not archieve
>
> Joe RV6A 105hrs looking good
> jwiza1(at)yahoo.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JDaniel343(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: a simple corrosion question |
I started out using Variprime and really do like it but somewhere along the
line after the the tail feather were complete I switched to Marhyde (in the
spray cans) self etching primer. The cans I believe are 20 oz., cost about
$12-13 a can. This may seem high but the cost of a quart of Variprime with
activator was costing me $65-70.
I get the convience of being able to spray when I feel like it and there is
no cleanup and that is a big time saver in my book.
To prep the parts I just scotchbrite and clean parts with Naptha. Use Naptha
to clean parts as Mek and Acetone leave a residue.
John Danielson
Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Derrick L. Aubuchon" <n184da(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Performance Propellers |
I have nothing but praise for Clark and his propellers.
He fabricated a three blade for my RV-4 and throughout the entire
process, he has been more than helpful and informative. The propeller
meets all of my expected performance requirements.
I had the prop made several years ago and as part of the initial
purchase agreement, the price included any pitch adjustments that may
be required after the first few hours. So, after having flown the
airplane for about 25 or so hours, I decided that the prop was just a
bit too coarse so I shipped it back and it was returned with it's
final paint and finish, along with the necessary adjustments.
I have had several long discussions with Clark regarding torquing
techniques, maintenance, hardware, etc., and he has always been very
willing to assist me with any questions.
So A+++ for customer support.
Just my 4 cents worth.
>
>Hi,
>
>Can anyone share any experiences (good or bad) they have had with
>Performance Propellers wood props?
>
>Thanks,
>Glenn Gordon
Derrick L. Aubuchon
RV-4 N184DA
n184da(at)pacbell.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Michael J. Robbins" <kitfox(at)gte.net> |
| Subject: | Re: a simple corrosion question |
Kim;
Give me a call; I'll tell you how what my idea is of maximum corrosion
protection.
Mike Robbins
Sammamish (was Issaquah)
425-392-9260 home
206-662-7863 work (Boeing Training Center Long Acres) (but I won't be at
work until Thursday)
----- Original Message -----
From: <Knicholas2(at)AOL.COM>
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2000 3:45 PM
Subject: RV-List: a simple corrosion question
>
> Please don't flame me for asking a simple question that I could not find
on
> the archives.
>
> I am starting the emp. kit for a RV9 and since I live in the pacific
> NOrthwest, I need/want maximum corroision protection. I can't get any
> chromate paint anymore, so I had palnned to use alumiprep -> alodine ->
> variprime. I want to save weight, so is the variprime needed? Can I
just
> use the prep and alodine and maintain good protection?
>
> Kim Nicholas
> Kent (Seatttle) WA
> RV9A
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C J Heitman" <cjh(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | a simple corrosion question |
<>
I agree completely. I have added a page to my website which shows where I
was able to purchase MIL-P-23377 primer and how I prepped the parts. Here is
the link: http://www.execpc.com/~cjh/primer.html
Chris Heitman
RV-9A N94ME (reserved)
Flaps
Dousman WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PANELCUT(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Anyone wanting Fuel Caps Engraved (Please Read) |
Listers
I have not gone anywhere!! I'm still here...... I will be doing another
run of Cap Engraving if anyone is interested. I have had a few ask about it.
I will do the same deal as last time both caps engraved and sent back to you
for $24.00. Send me your Caps with a check and type of airplane you have and
your return address Ship to the address below.. Respond to me off-list if you
are interested so I can have some idea when to expect them and plan a start
date.
Steve Davis
339 Madison Avenue
Memphis, TN 38103
Steve Davis
The Panel Pilot
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: ck ride tues night! |
Hey Randy,
Went great, just got home and it's 0300 in the morning. Tough conditions
tonight, we had zero lum and lux was 11%, that moon is a great asset when
flying under goggles and I sure could have used some tonight. Next stop WOBC
then off to the UH-60 Blackhawk transition.
Blue Skies,
Carey Mills
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JOHN CRATE <JOHN.CRATE(at)encode.com> |
| Subject: | F-6105 - Subpanel (RV6 Slider) |
Hi
Can someone please explain how the F-6105 (subpanel) gets notched to accept
the center rib F-6108. I know it shows it in the plans, DWG SC-3 (Section
B-B'), but I'll be darned if I can figure out. I read the Justice notes,
and obviously it didn't help. BTW,I have the newer F-6105's with the
overlapping tabs.
Thanks
John Crate
RV6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Performance Propellers |
Everyone who has looked at my Performance Prop have been impressed with
the quality, especially the number of laminates.
When I ordered the prop, I asked Clark to err on the side of cruise prop.
What I got is a 68x74 prop. The only problem I've experienced so far is
what appears as flutter at 2070 RPM during static run-up. I haven't
noticed it once the plane starts moving through the air.
Finn
Glenn & Judi wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Can anyone share any experiences (good or bad) they have had with
> Performance Propellers wood props?
>
> Thanks,
> Glenn Gordon
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary A. Sobek" <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Antennae in the wingtips |
Not sure if this made it to the list. I had Bob on
the cc: to my origional message.
--- Bob Archer wrote:
> Reply-to: "Bob Archer"
> From: "Bob Archer" <bobsantennas(at)earthlink.net>
> To: "Gary A. Sobek"
> CC:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Antennae in the wingtips
> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2000 21:27:23 -0700
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Gary A. Sobek <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com>
> To:
> Cc:
> Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 21:14
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Antennae in the wingtips
>
>
> Hi Gary and Listers;
>
> My name is Bob Archer and I do antennas. Internal
> antennas only. Gary is
> correct on every thing except the signal loss with
> cross polarization. If
> the antennas are cross polarized at 45 degrees you
> lose 3dB which is half
> power. At 90degrees the loss could be as great as 40
> dB if there is very
> pure polarization, which is impossible on an
> aircraft because of all the odd
> angles, but about 20dB is more common. So for every
> 10 dB of signal loss
> the signal received is reduced 90%. So at 20 dB loss
> the signal is .01 of
> what it should be. The wing tip VOR antennas work
> very well. RV fliers
> report that they can depend on always receiving VOR
> signals well over a
> hundred miles at any decent altitude. The COM
> antennas cannot be as good
> because of the limited amount of vertical
> polarization available. These
> antennas must be installed so that the maximum spar
> depth can be used for
> the vertical polarization. So they are installed on
> the bottom inside
> surface of the tip and swept up to the outer edge of
> the tip. I don't have
> this type of aircraft so I have not flight tested
> them.
>
> I am including an attachment of an article I wrote
> that was sent out on the
> list acouple of years ago by Jim Ayers giving the
> history of wing tip
> antennas. From my perspective any way.
>
> If anyone has any further questions just give a
> holler.
>
> Bob
>
>
>
>
> > --- Stuart B McCurdy wrote:
> > >
> > > Listers,
> > >
> > > Awhile back someone mentioned putting antennae
> in
> > > the wingtips. I can't
> > > find the archive on it. Can Comm and VOR
> antennae
> > > be put in the
> > > wingtips to reduce drag and is there an impact
> on
> > > transmission or
> > > reception? Is there an impact by having the
> local
> > > strobe power packs on
> > > the end rib in each wing also?
> > >
> > > Stu McCurdy
> > > RV-3, Building RV-8 QB
> >
> > Stu:
> >
> > Bob Archer in Torrance California designed the
> > antennas that are shown on page 423 of the
> 2000-2001
> > Aircraft Spruce Catalog. The Model 1 VOR Antenna
> > works great in my RV-6 with wingtip mounted strobe
> > power supplies. Jim Ayers has them in his RV-3
> and
> > the model 2 comm in the tail cap. His comm works
> > great.
> >
> > Bob makes a model 1A Wing Tip comm antenna. I do
> not
> > have one. It is reported to work well but does
> not
> > have the range as an external or Bob's Model 2
> Tail
> > cap comm antenna. I may be wrong but it could be
> > possible becasue it is not vertically polorized.
> If I
> > remember correctly, there is about a 3 dB loss of
> > signal when you change from horizontal to vertical
> > polorization. 3dB equals a 1/2 signal loss.
> Since
> > the side of the wing tip is on about a 45, you may
> > only have a 1 dB loss which would be acceptable
> but it
> > is a loss.
> >
> >
> >
> > ====
> > Gary A. Sobek
> > "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> > 650+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
> > http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
> >
> > "I never knew what real happiness was until I got
> married; and then it was
> too late..." - Jack Handey
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> anywhere!
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> 4@
>
>
> Word 6.0
> Document
>
>
>
>
>
> ARCHER HEADING
> Archer
> Archer
>
>
> ARCHERSPORTCRAFT ANTENNAS
21818 Ocean> Avenue
Torrance, California 90503
Tel.> 310-316-8796
TENNA TIP #6
WING TIP ANTENNAS FOR> METAL
and/or
CONDUCTIVE AIRCRAFT
The highest> performance internal / flush aircraft
antennas
> available at any price.
What? Are you crazy?> Everyone knows that wing tip
antennas have never,
> will never and cannot ever be made to work !!!
> (Semi close to actual quote by semi-famous antenna
> guru who shall remain anonymous.)
The above quote> is absolutely true for antennas that
are designed
> the traditional way; (of course the meaning of
> "works" is subjective, some people think an antenna
> "works" if they can communicate with the tower while
> being parked at the base ) by connecting a conductor
> longer than a quarter wave length to the center
> conductor of a coaxial cable, with the outer
> conductor connected to a ground plane and then
> trimming the antenna element until you get the
> lowest VSWR. Doing this in a fiber glass wing tip on
> the end of a conductive wing leads to several
> problems. The end of a conductive wing is not a
> "plane", as in a large flat surface, against which
> monopole type antennas are normally meant to work.
> Also to get a quarter wave antenna element in wing
> tip the antenna normally will have to be bent or
> swept back in order to fit into the tip and this
> causes more capacitance between the element and the
> end of the wing than the antenna can use. And then
> we have the wing tip lights and wires which also
> cause more capacitance and on top of that the wires
> are a very low impedance for the RF energy to ground
> and they tend to bleed off antenna energy to
> ground.
With these problems to work with a fellow> worker and
I, from TRW in Redondo Beach where we
> were employed as antenna designers and developers
> for space craft, were hired to develop internal
> zero drag antennas for the "Derringer", a two place
> twin engined aircraft being developed by the High
> Shear Corp. at the time. (Early sixties). The
> antennas we developed were COM, VOR and Marker
> beacon, they worked very well and had good VSRW but
> were very complicated and hard to install in the
> wing tips. The COM in particular, it had both series
> and parallel capacitors with a very critical
> inductive element. The workers in the plant never
> did build one that worked even after we showed them
> how three times. So they put external antennas on
> their airplanes. Easier. In the aftermath a friend
> with a Bonanza, with a rabbit ears type of VOR
> antenna under the tail, complained that he only had
> a reception range of about 35 miles. So we modified
> the existing wing tip antenna design to make it
> easier to install, certified some fiberglass wing
> tips and tried to sell the tips with antennas to
> Bonanza owners. The friend installed a set on his
> airplane and informed us that he could get a full
> flag from the SFO VOR over Gorman at 13000 feet. I
> didn't witness it but I do know they worked well.
> Beechcraft didn't make them though so Bonanza owners
> weren't much interested. So my partner quit leaving
> me the business and I modified the antennas some
> more deciding they had to be stand alone items so
> that I had total control over all the parameters and
> would fit into any wing tip that is large enough. I
> sold T-18 builders quite a few wingtip VOR antennas
> over the years and added a tail top COM antenna to
> my product line in the early seventies. In the early
> nineties people were becoming more aware of the drag
> penalties of external antennas so they were coming
> to me for help more often. Also composite aircraft
> were becoming more popular so I expanded into
> internal dipole antennas also. At this time I have
> probably sold more VOR wing tip antennas to Lancair
> IV builders than any other type of aircraft. One
> builder told me he has a VOR reception range of 200
> miles. It is pressurized and he flies high but still
> that is pretty good. RV builders tell me that they
> can always depend on well over a hundred miles if
> they are at any kind of decent altitude. I recently,
> by popular request, came out with a wing tip COM
> antenna that seems to work pretty well, though not
> as well as the tail top COM, with users reporting
> communication ranges of greater than fifty miles.
>
Most of the antennas I make use a device that is>
called a "Gamma Match" to feed the antennas and
> match the impedances. I use this device because I
> then have control over all the parameters of the
> antenna and allows the matching of impedance to a
> high level across the frequency band. I can control
> the over all length of the elements, can feed the
> antenna at the fifty ohm point of the elements and
> can vary the inductances and capacitances to the
> point where they operate at the point of the best
> possible performance.
A note of caution. The same> noted antenna guru as
noted above recommends
> connecting two wing tip antennas together through a
> two set coupler and then dividing the signal again
> through another coupler to two receivers in order to
> attain better coverage all the way around the
> aircraft. Though this sounds like a logical thing to
> do it is very poor antenna practice. Unless you
> REALLY know what you are doing I would say NEVER
> connect two antennas together in a way that would
> sum the signals. Because of the distance between the
> wing tips as the aircraft rotates about its vertical
> axis the distance from the antennas to the station
> will change causing the signal to arrive at the
> antennas at different times. There will therefore be
> times when the signals arrive at the antennas with
> zero difference in time and are then said to be in
> phase and the signals will add, but there will be
> angles where the signals will arrive at times when
> the signals are a half a wave different and they
> will then be 180 degrees out of phase and they will
> add negatively and there will be no net signal. The
> radiation pattern will then look very much like the
> petals of a daisy. I once had a customer that had
> hooked his antennas together as mentioned above and
> his Localizer had a null right on the nose. Very
> difficult to follow with the needle swinging back
> and forth and the signal dropping out. The two
> element dipole antenna should have a balun installed
> for proper operation. By this I mean a REAL balun.
> NOT a wadded up ball of steel wool, NOT a couple of
> ferrite beads and not a ferrite transformer balun.
> All of these things will "WORK" of course but not at
> a performance level that good antenna designs work
> at. A proper balun does the following jobs: 1.
> Matches the impedance of a 50 ohm transmission line
> to the nominal 150 ohms of the two element dipole.
> 2. Balances the RF currents on the antenna elements
> so that the radiation pattern is not squashed and
> deformed. 3. Provides a quarter wave RF choke that
> prevents any energy that is reflected back down the
> outside of the RF cable, because of high VSWR, from
> radiating and adding, positively and negatively, to
> the radiated energy and also prevents the RF from
> traveling to the area behind the instrument panel
> and causing all kinds of gremlins.
I have had many> people with the above kinds of
gremlins in their
> airplanes install my antenna designs in place of the
> copper strip type with the result that the gremlins
> all left in a hurry. I have also had people that
> installed proper baluns on their copper strip
> antennas with very good results. I will send a balun
> drawing to anyone that sends a SASE to me. Its isn't
> a very pretty drawing but it does get the idea
> across.
Below are terms frequently used in antenna> parlance
with short definitions.
Active Elements? > The part of the antenna that
actually does the
> radiating or the receiving of the RF
> energy.
Aperture? The capture area of the antenna.> On a
dipole or monopole it is the overall dimension
> of the active elements, on dish antennas it is the
> diameter of the dish. On an aircraft the largest
> conductive dimension.
Feed point? Generally the> point at which the coaxial
cable attaches to the
> antenna but could be where the feed device attaches
> to the active elements
VSWR? Voltage Standing Wave> Ratio. The measurement
of the ratio of incident to
> reflected RF energy. An indication of the quality of
> energy transference. The lower the number the
> better. 1:1 is perfect. 2:1 is good ,3:1 is OK, 4:1
> and up is poor to terrible.
Radiation Pattern? A> pattern showing the relative
signal level around an
> antenna. Signal strength can be severely reduced in
> particular directions by other antennas, vertical
> stabilizers, landing gears etc.
Balun? A device> that converts a balanced
transmission line (such as
> TV lead in) to a coaxial line which is an unbalanced
> line. Provides balanced currents on dipole antennas
> while matching the 50 ohm line to the nominally 150
> ohm antenna.
Polarization? The plane in which RF> energy is
radiated. Normally either vertical, such
> as COM, or horizontal, such as VOR, or any angle in
> between, such as bent COM antennas. There is also
> circular polarization, which is used in most
> spacecraft antennas.
I will answer any antenna> questions you might have
either by snail mail,
> telephone or by E mail at
> 74301.1665(at)compuserve.com
>
> Word
> 6.0
>
>
>
>
> %&
>
> c Paragraph
> Font
>
> Bob ArcherC:\WORDX\TIP6A.DOC
> Bob ArcherC:\WORDX\TIP6A.TXT@Brother
> Multi-Function Center
> Multi-Function Center
> #D
>
>
> Multi-Function Center
> #D
>
>
> New Roman
> Rmn
> ARCHER HEADING
> Bob Archer
> Bob Archer
====
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
650+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
"I never knew what real happiness was until I got married; and then it was too
late..." - Jack Handey
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carroll Bird <catbird(at)taylorelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 72FM8 Sensenich Propellers |
> I have a question for those of you who are flying behind an O-360 with the
> > new Sensenich 72FM8 metal prop.
> >>
>
> I got a 40 hr test period, but then again my engine has a big dataplate
> that says EXPERIMENTAL ENGINE in big letters.
> Gary Zilik - Pine Junction, Colorado
They gave me a 40 hour test period also. But I requested and got a 150NM radius
of ABI to do my
test flying.
Carroll Bird, Buffalo Gap, TX RV-4 114hours .
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Ford <dford(at)michweb.net> |
I am just setting up fuselage bulkheads in fuse jig, clamping to
longeron and am wondering how to get a smooth transition for skin at
f604 to longeron. All other bulkheads are stepped except f605 which is
notched. Can someone give insight to this?
Dave Ford
RV6 fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | clayfly(at)libertybay.com.Wed, |
(EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id" <B0005204863@mail-2.lbay.net>;
Wed,
23 Aug 2000 07:17:52.-0700(at)matronics.com
| Subject: | Flight Test Program |
Hi Listers,
Seeing as how I'm going to likely have a 40 hour flight test time, I've created
a rather
extensive flight test program which I created based on Advisory Circular: 90-89A
and
chapter 15 of Van's builder instructions. If you would like have a copy in MS
Word, just
drop me an e-mail and I'll send you a copy.
I make no warranties, guaranties, or claim any expertise whatsoever. But it might
be a good
starting point for you if you want to develop your own thorough test plan. I'm
still making
changes to it --- but by and large it's what I plan to do with my 40 hours.
Regards,
Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, inspection soon
Indiana
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: a simple corrosion question |
| From: | Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> |
I think Dupont will tell you that the Variprime is self etching & you
don'
t need the alodine. I used Variprime & I would recommend for about the
same $, the epoxy.
If you go with the color you like, It is like finished. The varipirme
loves oil & dirt.
Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com
**********************************************
>
> I am starting the emp. kit for a RV9 and since I live in the pacific
>
> NOrthwest, I need/want maximum corroision protection. I can't get
> any
> chromate paint anymore, so I had palnned to use alumiprep ->
> alodine ->
> variprime. I want to save weight, so is the variprime needed? Can
> I just
> use the prep and alodine and maintain good protection?
>
> Kim Nicholas
> Kent (Seatttle) WA
> RV9A
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Vacum/ignition |
08/23/2000 10:41:35 AM
Home Depo sells a vacuum kit for 8 dollars or so that adapts various hose
ends (sizes) all the way down to 1/4 inch. A very neat kit. I used pieces
of this adaptor kit to power up my gyros in the past to shoot problems in
my system (turned out the pump trashed itself).
Dave Bristol (at)matronics.com on 08/23/2000 12:31:38 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: Vacum/ignition
Joe,
You can disconnect the hose from the vacuum pump and connect a vacuum
cleaner hose to it. You won't see much suction but there should be an
inch or so. Also look at your pump and see if the shear coupling is
gone, they tend to get rotten and fall apart.
Dave RV-6 STILL waiting for a prop governor
joe wiza wrote:
>
> Listers
>
> I have an 0360 A1D. My DG and AH gyros quit operating.
> No suction on suction gage. How can I tell if it's my
> suction pump or regulator. Shall I use past presidence
> and assume it's the more expensive of the two???
>
> second question not RV related. I have a Celebrity bi
> plane with a C85 hp. The top plugs are the unshielded
> type M41E. I am replacing the ignition wire harness
> and am trying to find the old type clips to attach to
> the top plug wires. (not enough room for shielded
> plugs)ACFT Spruce does not have any. any help on the
> above would be appriciated. Please answer off net.
> Do not archieve
>
> Joe RV6A 105hrs looking good
> jwiza1(at)yahoo.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Testing Gyro Systems |
08/23/2000 10:46:55 AM
Renamed same reply for future e-searching the archives
---------------
Home Depo sells a plastic vacuum kit for 8 dollars or so that adapts
various hose ends (sizes) all the way down to 1/4 inch. A very neat kit. I
used pieces of this adaptor kit to power up my gyros with a Hoover Vaccum
in the past to shoot problems in my system (turned out the pump trashed
itself). Also used this system to set my regulator......I was able to pull
3.5 inches. The system pretty much sucked. (that was good)
Dave Bristol (at)matronics.com on 08/23/2000 12:31:38 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: Vacum/ignition
Joe,
You can disconnect the hose from the vacuum pump and connect a vacuum
cleaner hose to it. You won't see much suction but there should be an
inch or so. Also look at your pump and see if the shear coupling is
gone, they tend to get rotten and fall apart.
Dave RV-6 STILL waiting for a prop governor
joe wiza wrote:
>
> Listers
>
> I have an 0360 A1D. My DG and AH gyros quit operating.
> No suction on suction gage. How can I tell if it's my
> suction pump or regulator. Shall I use past presidence
> and assume it's the more expensive of the two???
>
> second question not RV related. I have a Celebrity bi
> plane with a C85 hp. The top plugs are the unshielded
> type M41E. I am replacing the ignition wire harness
> and am trying to find the old type clips to attach to
> the top plug wires. (not enough room for shielded
> plugs)ACFT Spruce does not have any. any help on the
> above would be appriciated. Please answer off net.
> Do not archieve
>
> Joe RV6A 105hrs looking good
> jwiza1(at)yahoo.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Van's technical support |
08/23/2000 11:15:20 AM
And he is still there to support us.(24 years and counting-I think) Think
of the poor Stoddart/Hamilton Glasair builders left in the cold when the
company (very quickly) went out of business......
Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com@matronics.com on 08/22/2000 03:43:25 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV-List: Van's technical support
My 2 cents.
I have been on a self inducted accelerated schedule with my RV-8A for
medical
reasons which I won't go into but it's just the sort of thing that makes
tempers
rise and shipment deadlines seem like life or death experience. This is
compounded by the fact that I live in a nonaviation supported town
thousands of
miles away from the factory were even simple stuff like AN bolts must reach
me
through the post. I too have been quick to snipe at Van's whenever things
don't
go my way.
In my ten months of building my quick build kit I have encountered
everything
from damaged shipments to missing parts but Van's has always been there for
me
with big brother like concern and sound advice whenever I needed it. I
work in
the software industry where free technical support for more than a year is
a
joke at best. At Van's they not only support their product with a team of
trained "experienced" experts but continue this free support for the many
many
years that it often takes to finish up a scratch build kit.
For all you lurkers out there who are sitting on the fence, just let me say
that
Van's support is second to none.
- Jim Andrews
RV-8A ( engine )
O-360 ( N89JA )
Please archive.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Thomas Nguyen" <TNGUYEN(at)oss.oceaneering.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Pushrods |
Just out of curiosity, I calculated the Pcr (buckling load) for the flap pushrod
using the following information:
Rod O.D = 0.3125" Wall Thickness = 0.058"
Assume the effective length (Hole to Hole distance - Le) = 6 inches
Using the Euler's method the Pcr can be calculated as follow:
Pcr = Pi
2*E*I/Le
2
With E (Young Modulus) = 10.7*10
6 psi for aluminum
I (Cross Sectional Moment Inertia) = 3.94953*10
-4
The Pcr is calculated to be 1,158 lbs for the Flap Pushrod. With a safety factor
of 2.0, this would bring the allowable load down to 579 lbs. This is to show
that Van's design on the flap push rod is a sound design and any modifications
to it would be unnecessary if you want to keep the weight down. The tension
load on the pushrod is very minimal (dead weight of the flaps and hinge friction
loads when you retract the flaps on ground. In the air, it's all compressive
load)
My two cents.
T.Nguyen
RV-6A
N747TN (reserved)
Finishing Instrument Panel then out to the hangar
>>> ewspears(at)peoplepc.com 08/22/00 10:42AM >>>
> F659A being the little bitty hunk of tubing that you make the flap
rod pushers out of.
> I also thought that Van's part left much to be desired.
>I haven't heard of many of them failing in service. They would >be most
>likely to fail while raising flaps while on the ground since they >are in
>compression when lowering and always when in the air.
I know of one failure on a 6A that was built locally. It caused a "split
flap" on approach and could have been a real problem had the pilot not
immediately noticed it and retracted flaps.
Myself and several other builders here on Leeward Air Ranch are making
the tubes out of 4130 in the same dim. as called for in 6061-T6 (5/16 X
.058wall). This way we don't have to carve huge holes in the floor and skin
as would be neccessary for big dia. aluminum tube.
Esten Spears, RV8AQB, 80922, Fuse Floors & Flap Rods
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Thanks from Jon Johanson |
Hi!
For a number of years now I have been talking with Eustace and planing my
around the world northbound flight. As we all know having someone with the
knowledge and experience of Eustace to help keep us on the right track is
invaluable and I can't thank him enough for his help and guidance in just
about all of my flying.
Being one of lifes gentlemen Eustace was not content to just give me advise,
he is close enough to my planing to recognize the importance of every dollar
and see just how tight things are for me - from an economical point of view
what I am doing is just plane foolish. When he asked me if he could ask
those on the RV list to contribute I had two distinct feelings : I am
uncomfortable taking money from others but at the same time I recognize how
much of a help even five dollars is. : Being able to help even in a small
way is one of lifes pleasures and plays a very big part in my own life.
I explained my feelings to Eustace who felt that apart from the obvious
financial needs many people would want to be involved in some way with my
flight so it was for that reason that I agreed.
I find it difficult to put into words my gratitude for the help I have
received from the RV list team. Thank you some how doesn't seem to say
enough but as that is the best English has to offer I would like to say
again THANK YOU. I don't think you will ever fully realize how much of a
help every single dollar is and believe me they are all very much valued.
I will be leaving this part of the world on Friday and heading to Van's for
a few days before heading east and aiming for Africa. Unfortunately I will
not be able to make it to the home coming - it is getting late in the season
and I want to get the North Atlantic behind me - I will be in the Fort
Collins area for a few days on my way east then Kirksville Missouri and
Bangor Maine before heading for the Azores. If anyone would like to catch up
with me in any of these areas I will be more than happy to do so if
possible.
Once again a big thank you to you all.
Keep smiling,
Jon Johanson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Parker43rp(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Conical Engine Mounts |
Richard George:
Several of us found that the all-rubber conical mounts commonly used on
Lycoming conical mount engines are less than satisfactory because of engine
vibrations at various power settings. We replaced the rubber mounts with
Lord J-6230-1 mounts, and the previous vibrations were remarkably reduced.
The Lord J-6230-1 mounts cost about $300 from Chief A/C for a set of 4,
expensive ----- but I think---- worth it. They are of an unique design and
require a particular orientation for each mount pair. Van's engine mount has
a small hole drilled in the face of each mount bushing which matches a
locater hole in the Lord mount to preserve the orientation.
You can check the Archives of a couple years back for a discussion of this
subject.
Ray Parker
RV-6 N84RP
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bcbraem(at)home.com.with.ESMTP (InterMail vM.4.01.03.00 201-229-121) |
| Subject: | Re: Flight Test Program |
I don't mean to dissuade anyone from putting together a program like
Clay did, because it is a valuable exercise and learning tool in itself.
However, for
those who don't want to reinvent the wheel, I have used 2 books and one
computer program that have been invaluable to me because I have an
experimental engine and a modified RV airframe, so I had to come up with
my own Vx, Vy, Vs, best glide speed, best range, engine performance and
fuel data, etc.
1. Flight Test Checklist: Homebuilder's Flight Test Guide by Jerry Milek
JaviFix, Inc.
Trenton Centre PO Box 22092
Trenton Centre, Ontario K8V 6S3
Canada, eh!
http://www.reach.net/~javifix
This is a very concise and practical book for data collection and later
data reduction along with many useful tips and comments on flight test
technique.
$14.72 US/$22.44 CAN
2. Flight Testing Homebuilt Aircraft by Vaughan Askue
Iowa State University Press
2121 S. State Avenue
Ames. Iowa 50014
1.800.862.6657
can't remember the price, but not that expensive
This is more of an explanatory textbook type covering the why's and
theory behind a proper flight test program, aerodynamics, more testing
technique and some guidelines on correcting problems found in test flying.
3. Benchmark: Aircraft performance testing analysis for single- and
multi-engine aircraft using constant-speed propellers. (started in 1986
and still being developed by Alfred Scott)
Sequoia Aircraft
2000 Tomlynn Street
Richmond, Virginia 23230
1.804.359..2618
approx. $200.00 US
This program (Macintosh) is for modeling the performance characteristics
of your specific aircraft using a set number of data points. Depending
on how you build your RV and any mods to the engine or airframe, the
performance numbers from Van's and/or Lycoming could be inaccurate. It
is still being updated, but quite useable as it is. In fact, when I
complete the entire profile showing "good" data, even though different
from Van's numbers, AVEMCO has "hinted" that they may provide motion
hull insurance on a plane they otherwise wouldn't insure.
Harman Rocket
builders take note! Many insurers, I have found out, use some twisted
logic to insist that Van's Aircraft is the "manufacturer" of the plane
and not the builder. Try that argument when a liability issue comes up!
Boyd
RV-S6
still writing down numbers and redoing flight profiles (turbulence, bad
lapse rates, etc.)
clayfly(at)libertybay.com.Wed, "23 Aug 2000 07:19:03
> Hi Listers,
> Seeing as how I'm going to likely have a 40 hour flight test time, I've created
a rather
> extensive flight test program which I created based on Advisory Circular: 90-89A
and
> chapter 15 of Van's builder instructions. If you would like have a copy in MS
Word, just
> drop me an e-mail and I'll send you a copy.
>
> I make no warranties, guaranties, or claim any expertise whatsoever. But it
might be a good
> starting point for you if you want to develop your own thorough test plan. I'm
still making
> changes to it --- but by and large it's what I plan to do with my 40 hours.
>
> Regards,
>
> Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, inspection soon
> Indiana
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Vacum/ignition |
Joe,
I can help you a little with the first one. What I have done in the past to
isolate where the failure is in the vacumn system is to take out all spark
plugs, and detact the vacumn hose(s) from the vacumn pump. Then while you
carefully stand next to the engine have someone hit the starter (remember,
the spark plugs must be out) and put your finger over the vacumn side of the
pump and see if there is any draw. If there is not a noticable draw then
you know the problem is right there.
I hate being next to the prop when it is turning even when there are no
plugs installed but sometimes there is not other way.
Mike Robertson
RV-8A
>From: joe wiza <jwiza1(at)yahoo.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Vacum/ignition
>Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2000 14:56:50 -0700 (PDT)
>
>
>Listers
>
>I have an 0360 A1D. My DG and AH gyros quit operating.
>No suction on suction gage. How can I tell if it's my
>suction pump or regulator. Shall I use past presidence
>and assume it's the more expensive of the two???
>
>second question not RV related. I have a Celebrity bi
>plane with a C85 hp. The top plugs are the unshielded
>type M41E. I am replacing the ignition wire harness
>and am trying to find the old type clips to attach to
>the top plug wires. (not enough room for shielded
>plugs)ACFT Spruce does not have any. any help on the
>above would be appriciated. Please answer off net.
>Do not archieve
>
>Joe RV6A 105hrs looking good
>jwiza1(at)yahoo.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Vacum/ignition |
Joe,
I can help you a little with the first one. What I have done in the past to
isolate where the failure is in the vacumn system is to take out all spark
plugs, and detact the vacumn hose(s) from the vacumn pump. Then while you
carefully stand next to the engine have someone hit the starter (remember,
the spark plugs must be out) and put your finger over the vacumn side of the
pump and see if there is any draw. If there is not a noticable draw then
you know the problem is right there.
I hate being next to the prop when it is turning even when there are no
plugs installed but sometimes there is not other way.
Mike Robertson
RV-8A
>From: joe wiza <jwiza1(at)yahoo.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Vacum/ignition
>Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2000 14:56:50 -0700 (PDT)
>
>
>Listers
>
>I have an 0360 A1D. My DG and AH gyros quit operating.
>No suction on suction gage. How can I tell if it's my
>suction pump or regulator. Shall I use past presidence
>and assume it's the more expensive of the two???
>
>second question not RV related. I have a Celebrity bi
>plane with a C85 hp. The top plugs are the unshielded
>type M41E. I am replacing the ignition wire harness
>and am trying to find the old type clips to attach to
>the top plug wires. (not enough room for shielded
>plugs)ACFT Spruce does not have any. any help on the
>above would be appriciated. Please answer off net.
>Do not archieve
>
>Joe RV6A 105hrs looking good
>jwiza1(at)yahoo.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | AV8TURDON(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Thanks from Jon Johanson |
Yes Jon,
Living in New Hampshire and about 2 Hrs from Bangor I would consider
it a privilage to see you off on your trip home. If by chance you have an
aprroximate day that you'll be there and on your way, I'll meet you with some
cookies to keep you alert.
Don Champagne
N767DC RV-6QB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> |
Dave:
all others all plumb too. Not the f604. Look close at the joint. It sets
on top of the longeron (in the jig).
I bet that solves your problem. It will get a inside lap piece that ties
the longeron to the 604. They want about one degree tilt for the angle of
incidence later when you drill the rear spar to the f605 clevisssss.
Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com
**********************************************
>
> I am just setting up fuselage bulkheads in fuse jig, clamping to
> longeron and am wondering how to get a smooth transition for skin at
> f604 to longeron. All other bulkheads are stepped except f605 which
> is
> notched. Can someone give insight to this?
>
> Dave Ford
> RV6 fuselage
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Will Cretsinger <cretsinger(at)arlington.net> |
Bruce, I don't know how flying would be with a -3 since I have a -6A. I
returned home yesterday from a trip to visit RV-Lister Bob Bristol in
Canada...was gone eight nights and saw a lot of country including the
Statue of Liberty and New York City...and Niagra Falls. Great trip and
visited a lot of wonderful people who made us feel welcome. My wife
will not fly with me so my cobuilder and I have to suffer alone on these
trips! It is very helpful to have another pilot in the plane. I have
something over 5000 hours so I navigate and handle the radios and my
newly licensed friend operates the autopilot...make a good combination.
Will Cretsinger, Arlington, Texas
RV-6A flying past 275 hours
Bruce Stewart wrote:
>
>
> Hi All,
>
> in an attempt to liven this list up a bit more
> I'm just curious as to what sort of touring
> you guys have done in your RV 3's?
>
> Here in Australia theres lotsa things to do but
> flying in America seems pretty good after having
> a quick look at the map and hearing/ reading a few stories
> about what its like over there.
>
> Bruce Stewart
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DWENSING(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Pushrods |
In a message dated 8/23/00 1:11:18 PM Central Daylight Time,
TNGUYEN(at)oss.oceaneering.com writes:
<< This is to show that Van's design on the flap push rod is a sound design
and any modifications to it would be unnecessary >>
Thank you! Sure helps to have knowledge like yours on the list.
Dale Ensing 6A forever finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | joe wiza <jwiza1(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Vacum/ignition |
Thanks Dave
But where is the shear coupling what does it look
like
Thanks Joe
--- Dave Bristol wrote:
>
>
> Joe,
> You can disconnect the hose from the vacuum pump and
> connect a vacuum
> cleaner hose to it. You won't see much suction but
> there should be an
> inch or so. Also look at your pump and see if the
> shear coupling is
> gone, they tend to get rotten and fall apart.
> Dave RV-6 STILL waiting for a prop governor
>
> joe wiza wrote:
>
>
> >
> > Listers
> >
> > I have an 0360 A1D. My DG and AH gyros quit
> operating.
> > No suction on suction gage. How can I tell if it's
> my
> > suction pump or regulator. Shall I use past
> presidence
> > and assume it's the more expensive of the two???
> >
> > second question not RV related. I have a Celebrity
> bi
> > plane with a C85 hp. The top plugs are the
> unshielded
> > type M41E. I am replacing the ignition wire
> harness
> > and am trying to find the old type clips to attach
> to
> > the top plug wires. (not enough room for shielded
> > plugs)ACFT Spruce does not have any. any help on
> the
> > above would be appriciated. Please answer off net.
> > Do not archieve
> >
> > Joe RV6A 105hrs looking good
> > jwiza1(at)yahoo.com
> >
>
>
>
> through
>
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
> Matronics!
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | joe wiza <jwiza1(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Vacum/ignition |
Thanks Dave
But where is the shear coupling what does it look
like
Thanks Joe
--- Dave Bristol wrote:
>
>
> Joe,
> You can disconnect the hose from the vacuum pump and
> connect a vacuum
> cleaner hose to it. You won't see much suction but
> there should be an
> inch or so. Also look at your pump and see if the
> shear coupling is
> gone, they tend to get rotten and fall apart.
> Dave RV-6 STILL waiting for a prop governor
>
> joe wiza wrote:
>
>
> >
> > Listers
> >
> > I have an 0360 A1D. My DG and AH gyros quit
> operating.
> > No suction on suction gage. How can I tell if it's
> my
> > suction pump or regulator. Shall I use past
> presidence
> > and assume it's the more expensive of the two???
> >
> > second question not RV related. I have a Celebrity
> bi
> > plane with a C85 hp. The top plugs are the
> unshielded
> > type M41E. I am replacing the ignition wire
> harness
> > and am trying to find the old type clips to attach
> to
> > the top plug wires. (not enough room for shielded
> > plugs)ACFT Spruce does not have any. any help on
> the
> > above would be appriciated. Please answer off net.
> > Do not archieve
> >
> > Joe RV6A 105hrs looking good
> > jwiza1(at)yahoo.com
> >
>
>
>
> through
>
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
> Matronics!
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Textor" <pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com> |
"RV-List (E-mail)"
Hello,
Yesterday there was post regarding running the tail light wire in the front
of the rudder bottom. Could the individual who did that contact me re how
it was done and how it exited the fuselage. Like a dummy I didn't make
provisions for it before closing my VS and Rudder.
Thanks,
Jack Textor
RV8
Des Moines, IA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: F-6105 - Subpanel (RV6 Slider) |
In a message dated 8/23/00 12:39:32 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
JOHN.CRATE(at)encode.com writes:
<< Hi
Can someone please explain how the F-6105 (subpanel) gets notched to accept
the center rib F-6108. I know it shows it in the plans, DWG SC-3 (Section
B-B'), but I'll be darned if I can figure out. I read the Justice notes,
and obviously it didn't help. BTW,I have the newer F-6105's with the
overlapping tabs.
Thanks
John Crate
RV6A >>
The center rib has a "C" shaped cross section. The flanges of the "C" point
to the right side of the airplane. So, notch the top of the right subpanel
so the rib flange will fit flush with the top of the sub-panel. This
probably involves cutting away 3/4 inch or so of the flange on the top of the
sub panel. Then, cut away an opening in the left subpanel to accept the
rib's other flange. Trim the tab on the left sub panel half so it fits
against the rib. Add a couple of pieces of 90 degree angle to brace things
together. Don't forget to trim an opening in the left subpanel for the angle
brace that rivets to the center rib and firewall, and terminates at the
slider brace.
Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA
RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth
To the Airport by Labor Day!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM |
In a message dated 8/23/00 12:42:50 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
dford(at)michweb.net writes:
<< I am just setting up fuselage bulkheads in fuse jig, clamping to
longeron and am wondering how to get a smooth transition for skin at
f604 to longeron. All other bulkheads are stepped except f605 which is
notched. Can someone give insight to this? >>
In the jig, the F-604 sits on top of the longeron. There are a couple of
splice plates that attach the longeron and bulkhead. Look way in the corner
(or in some unexpected area) of the plans and you'll probably find this
detail.
Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA
RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth
To the Airport by Labor Day!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Log Book Entries |
I would like to make some logbook entries but I have not yet applied for my
repairman's certificate.
My questions are:
1) Can I make such entries?
2) How do sign the entries?
3) Have those with Bart's engine continued using the 81/2 by 11 engine book
or have you started a smaller one?
Thanks.
Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP O360A1A Hartzell 0.0 hours
Hampshire, IL C38
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JNice51355(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: -Van's service |
In a message dated 08/22/2000 3:08:11 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
bertrv6(at)yahoo.com writes:
<< But if the boss, never walks into the office,
and check what the office people are doing...things
will never improve.. >>
Bert(and fellow RVers)
Geez, it's just the opposite where I work. The less we see of the boss, the
more gets done.
Jim Nice
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Christie" <billc(at)dancris.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Pushrods |
Being a EE and not an ME, I had to go get an old text to look it up. I agree
that the allowable load looks good, but I'm now curious - what did you
calculate for an actual worst case load and what assumptions did you make in
doing it?
Thanks,
Bill Christie, RV8A, Phoenix
----- Original Message -----
From: <DWENSING(at)AOL.COM>
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2000 1:36 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Flap Pushrods
>
> In a message dated 8/23/00 1:11:18 PM Central Daylight Time,
> TNGUYEN(at)oss.oceaneering.com writes:
>
> << This is to show that Van's design on the flap push rod is a sound
design
> and any modifications to it would be unnecessary >>
> Thank you! Sure helps to have knowledge like yours on the list.
> Dale Ensing 6A forever finishing
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: TIP: Trimtab Hinge Lock |
One of you wrote:
> Right now the wings are hung in the cellar with the control surfaces off
Suggestion from one who wishes he had gotten it - keep those hinges busy!
Best is to keep parts connected together. Better is to keep pins (full
size) in all hinges. The reason is that individual hinge eyes will be less
likely to get bumped out of alignment. Vast oceans of frustration accompany
dinged hinges!
Hal Kempthorne
RV6a N7HK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8 Tail light |
That might have been me in response to a question concerning connectors. To
clarify my comment on connectors . . . I got mine from RadioShack . . . but
not the "typical" or "standard" store . . . the big store (Denver has one)
that might be referred to as RadioShack.COM. With regards to the wiring, I
ran two wires . . . they go at the very bottom of the fuselage (at the aft
end of the fuselage), under the structure that supports the tie down and the
vertical stabilizer. After these wires have been strung and exit the
fuselage, I attached a connector on each one. I then have a hole about in
the middle of the fiberglass rudder bottom (where the light is). I feed the
wire into this hole, one by one (by the way, this hole has a grommet on it).
The mating connectors have been installed on the tail light, and of course
these get threaded through the large opening that the tail light gets placed
into. The wires from the fuselage are long enough so that I can plug in the
tail light with all of the connectors hanging outside the rudder bottom . .
. then I push the wires back through and screw the tail light on.
Rick Jory
-----Original Message-----
From: Jack Textor <pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com>
Date: Wednesday, August 23, 2000 3:36 PM
Subject: RV-List: RV8 Tail light
>
>Hello,
>Yesterday there was post regarding running the tail light wire in the front
>of the rudder bottom. Could the individual who did that contact me re how
>it was done and how it exited the fuselage. Like a dummy I didn't make
>provisions for it before closing my VS and Rudder.
>Thanks,
>Jack Textor
>RV8
>Des Moines, IA
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Hurlbut" <shurlbut(at)island.net> |
I'm using CherryMax rivet in a couple places. If the plans call for a
AN470AD4-7 rivet should I use a 4-7 CherryMax rivet? They seem too long. Is
there any way to confirm that the CherryMax rivet is a 4-7? You can't
measure them as you can normal rivets. As well, can I use a normal rivet
tool to pop them?
Steve Hurlbut
shurlbut(at)island.net
RV-6 emp
C-FSND
Comox, BC, Canada
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Log Book Entries |
The initial logbook entry in the Airframe Logbook should be something to the
tune of: "I have inspected this aircraft in accordance with the requirements
of a yearly condition inspection and found it to be in a condition for safe
operation." Then sign it, add your SSN and the word "Builder". That should
satisfy your local inspector. If he's real nice he may issue you your
repairman's certificate early.
Mike Robertson
RV-8A
Das Fed
>From: "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: "rv-list"
>Subject: RV-List: Log Book Entries
>Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2000 17:38:01 -0500
>
>
>I would like to make some logbook entries but I have not yet applied for my
>repairman's certificate.
>My questions are:
>1) Can I make such entries?
>2) How do sign the entries?
>3) Have those with Bart's engine continued using the 81/2 by 11 engine book
>or have you started a smaller one?
>
>Thanks.
>
>Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP O360A1A Hartzell 0.0 hours
>Hampshire, IL C38
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
Steve,
Cherrymax rivets and regualr rivet sizes do not necessarily correlate. A -4
Cherrymax rivet is larger in diameter by about 1/16". The length also do
not match. The best way is to use the same dash size but for length you
should get a cherry max depth gauge that is available from the same folks
that sell you the Cherrymax rivets.
Mike Robertson
RV-8A
>From: "Steve Hurlbut" <shurlbut(at)island.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: CherryMax
>Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2000 16:52:30 -0700
>
>
>I'm using CherryMax rivet in a couple places. If the plans call for a
>AN470AD4-7 rivet should I use a 4-7 CherryMax rivet? They seem too long. Is
>there any way to confirm that the CherryMax rivet is a 4-7? You can't
>measure them as you can normal rivets. As well, can I use a normal rivet
>tool to pop them?
>
>Steve Hurlbut
>shurlbut(at)island.net
>RV-6 emp
>C-FSND
>Comox, BC, Canada
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV8DRIVER(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Electronic Ignition Choice |
>I believe that the Lasar system is the only one which advances both the
sparks in each cylinder, unless dual electric and dual ignition systems are
employed with the other two. Given the huge bore of these engines, that
could make a difference in performance given the time it takes the flame
front to cross the cylinder. Maybe the systems compensate somewhat for this
by additional advance; I don't know.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
6A O360, Airflow, CS
may fly in '01<
Just an aside on this topic, in 1966 I had an Alfa Romeo GTA that had a dual
plug ignition system. In that hemi-head engine the park plug timing differed
by 5 degrees and it was noticeable when this difference changed due to point
wear. I believe that the magneto is fixed to fire at 25 degrees advance, and
the CDI will suposedly seek an optimum timing advance. I have heard up to 38
deg. Has anyone with a mixed system noticed improved running with both mag
and CDI operating? Andy Johnson, fuselage parts prep.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob DiMeo - Oracle <dimeob(at)powertel.com.au> |
| Subject: | Flight Test Program |
Clay,
ship me one.
Regards,
Bob
> ----------
> From: clayfly(at)libertybay.com.Wed
> Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2000 12:22 AM
> To: RV List
> Subject: RV-List: Flight Test Program
>
>
> Hi Listers,
> Seeing as how I'm going to likely have a 40 hour flight test time, I've
> created a rather
> extensive flight test program which I created based on Advisory Circular:
> 90-89A and
> chapter 15 of Van's builder instructions. If you would like have a copy
> in MS Word, just
> drop me an e-mail and I'll send you a copy.
>
> I make no warranties, guaranties, or claim any expertise whatsoever. But
> it might be a good
> starting point for you if you want to develop your own thorough test plan.
> I'm still making
> changes to it --- but by and large it's what I plan to do with my 40
> hours.
>
> Regards,
>
> Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, inspection soon
> Indiana
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Hurlbut" <shurlbut(at)island.net> |
| Subject: | CherryMax rivets |
Figured it out. Can not necessarily use a 4-7 CherryMax rivet where one
would use a 4-7 regular rivet.
Must first calculate thickness of material and this becomes the max grip of
the CherryMax rivet. If thickness of material is 5/16 then the largest
CherryMax rivet you can use is 4-5. I should learn to read more before
attempting things. Going to drill out a $1.09 CherryMax rivet.
Steve Hurlbut
shurlbut(at)island.net
RV-6 emp
C-FSND
Comox, BC, Canada
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Thomas McIntyre <bogeybrother(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Performance Propellers |
Finn
You should give a few more details as I understand your's is a
non standard engine/prop combination.
Tom
do not archiev
Finn Lassen wrote:
>
> Everyone who has looked at my Performance Prop have been impressed with
> the quality, especially the number of laminates.
>
> When I ordered the prop, I asked Clark to err on the side of cruise prop.
> What I got is a 68x74 prop. The only problem I've experienced so far is
> what appears as flutter at 2070 RPM during static run-up. I haven't
> noticed it once the plane starts moving through the air.
>
> Finn
>
> Glenn & Judi wrote:
>
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > Can anyone share any experiences (good or bad) they have had with
> > Performance Propellers wood props?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Glenn Gordon
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Bell" <rv4bell(at)door.net> |
| Subject: | Conical Engine Mounts |
Lycomimg made two types of conical engines. The early O-320 in the Piper
Tri-pacers used the same bushing as the O-290. The two are different and
not interchangeable. Make sure of what you need before you order. I have one
of these early O-320 engines in my RV4.
Bruce Bell
RV4 landing gear fairings in progress
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John McMahon <rv6(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flight Test Program |
Clay
When you get a chance send me a copy please...
John McMahon
(rv6,Fuse side skins)
SMTP id ; Wed", 23, Aug, 2000, 07:17:52.-0700(at)matronics.com wrote:
>
> Hi Listers,
> Seeing as how I'm going to likely have a 40 hour flight test time, I've created
a rather
> extensive flight test program which I created based on Advisory Circular: 90-89A
and
> chapter 15 of Van's builder instructions. If you would like have a copy in MS
Word, just
> drop me an e-mail and I'll send you a copy.
>
> I make no warranties, guaranties, or claim any expertise whatsoever. But it
might be a good
> starting point for you if you want to develop your own thorough test plan. I'm
still making
> changes to it --- but by and large it's what I plan to do with my 40 hours.
>
> Regards,
>
> Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, inspection soon
> Indiana
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "edperry64" <edperry64(at)netzero.net> |
I am building a RV8 but just to be fair I thought I would tell you all about
today. I am 6'2" 225# today I went for a ride in an RV8. My most recent
experiences have been in RV8a's. I have never found it difficult to get in
and out of either one but today I started thinking that it was much easier
to exit the rear seat of the RV8A. The angle the RV8 sits at with the tall
landing gear may make it difficult for someone less agile to get in and
out...Just something to think about...
Ed Perry
edperry64(at)netzero.net
RV8QB 180hp/CS
Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | A20driver(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Performance Propellers |
Have a 3 bladed prop from Clark on my RV-3, 160 hp.Great prop...Craftmanship
is so good most people can't believe its a wood prop...Asked for 2700 wide
open and came out with 2725...Speed at 500ft ...218mph...Cruise 75% at 75 -
8000-- 214....R of C -- 2400 at 100mph...Ellison Carb and crossover
exhaust.... Jim Brown, NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | Wing incidence/twist |
Well, I finally being forced to deal with a problem I've postponed.
Both my wings were built with twists in them (inadvertently, I'm sure),
the right wing more than the left.
For reasons best known to whatever I was thinking when I drilled the
rear spar attach holes last year, I set the incidence at both wings to 1
degree positive at their roots.
That means that the incidence of the outer left wing edge is 0 degrees
and 2 to 2.5 degrees (positive) at the outer right wing edge.
I'd half forgotten this, and didn't notice it again until I reached
higher speeds. At 185 mph I have to apply substantial right stick
pressure to keep wings level, and also left rudder to keep ball
centered.
The question of course is: what to do about it?
The easiest would be to add substantial aileron trim tab(s) -- just
squeezing the aileron trailing edge is not going to cut it.
I see two areas of concern:
1) added induced drag at higher speeds
2) right wing stalling first (which in retrospect is noticeable when
doing near full stall landings)
Should I change the right wing incidence so I have 1 degree at the wing
midpoint (and .25 at root and + 1.75 at tip) and handle the rest by
aileron trim?
I'll be happy to hear suggestions and reasonings for possible solutions.
(No, I'm not going to rebuild wings at this time.)
(Yes, that's the risk of buying a project started by someone else, when
you don't know what to look for).
For those concerned, I have kept my speed up at 80 mph or more in my
flight testing so far (except when just over the runway and touchdown).
I haven't done slow flight testing even at altitude yet. Everything
would seem to indicate that the right wing will drop like a rock at
stall speeds, and stall testing may quickly turn into either spin
testing or (spiral) dive testing.
Finn
Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Antennae in the windscreen fairing |
The recent thread about antennae in the wingtips got me to thinking -- what
about an antenna embedded in the windscreen fairing (RV-6 slider)? I suppose
the close proximity (less than 1") to the steel roll bar would mess it up...
or would it? How about in the fiberglass gear leg fairing? I think I've
heard of people putting it there, anyone on the list do that, and how does
it work?
Just curious. Too late for me to do the first, and the second.... well,
maybe if I ever get tired of my draggy metal fairings....
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~125 hrs)
Portland, OR
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM |
In a message dated 8/23/00 11:52:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
shurlbut(at)island.net writes:
<< I'm using CherryMax rivet in a couple places. If the plans call for a
AN470AD4-7 rivet should I use a 4-7 CherryMax rivet? They seem too long. Is
there any way to confirm that the CherryMax rivet is a 4-7? You can't
measure them as you can normal rivets. As well, can I use a normal rivet
tool to pop them?
Steve Hurlbut >>
Steve,
Do you have an Aircraft Spruce catalog? In there, the correct grip length is
given for different thicknesses of structure. Also, they sell a gauge that
measures the hole depth and tells you which length rivet to use.
Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA
RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth
To the Airport by Labor Day!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: flap rod push tube |
> Another thing, since the flaps don't really have an "up" stop, if the tube
> did fail due to sloppy thread cutting or whatever, you'd certainly have an
> unusual situation going on up there as the free flap floated around
loosely.
A piece of angle riveted to the fuselage as a flap/fuselage gap fairing like
a lot of people do will also act as a nice up-stop.
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~125 hrs)
Portland, OR
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Cantrell <kcflyrv(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Pushrods |
I appreciate the technical information but what about a negative G load? I'd
hate to lose a flap pushrod (ever) and even though I don't plan doing
negative G maneuvers, I'd like to feel comfortable hanging from my belt on
occassion.
Ken Cantrell - 6
engine arriving next month
-----------------------------------------------------
Click here for Free Video!!
http://www.gohip.com/free_video/
----- Original Message -----
From: Thomas Nguyen <TNGUYEN(at)oss.oceaneering.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2000 8:19 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Flap Pushrods
>
> Just out of curiosity, I calculated the Pcr (buckling load) for the flap
pushrod using the following information:
>
> Rod O.D = 0.3125" Wall Thickness = 0.058"
>
> Assume the effective length (Hole to Hole distance - Le) = 6 inches
>
> Using the Euler's method the Pcr can be calculated as follow:
>
> Pcr = Pi
2*E*I/Le
2
>
> With E (Young Modulus) = 10.7*10
6 psi for aluminum
> I (Cross Sectional Moment Inertia) = 3.94953*10
-4
>
> The Pcr is calculated to be 1,158 lbs for the Flap Pushrod. With a safety
factor of 2.0, this would bring the allowable load down to 579 lbs. This is
to show that Van's design on the flap push rod is a sound design and any
modifications to it would be unnecessary if you want to keep the weight
down. The tension load on the pushrod is very minimal (dead weight of the
flaps and hinge friction loads when you retract the flaps on ground. In the
air, it's all compressive load)
>
> My two cents.
>
> T.Nguyen
> RV-6A
> N747TN (reserved)
> Finishing Instrument Panel then out to the hangar
>
>
> >>> ewspears(at)peoplepc.com 08/22/00 10:42AM >>>
>
> > F659A being the little bitty hunk of tubing that you make the flap
> rod pushers out of.
> > I also thought that Van's part left much to be desired.
>
> >I haven't heard of many of them failing in service. They would >be most
> >likely to fail while raising flaps while on the ground since they >are in
> >compression when lowering and always when in the air.
>
> I know of one failure on a 6A that was built locally. It caused a
"split
> flap" on approach and could have been a real problem had the pilot not
> immediately noticed it and retracted flaps.
> Myself and several other builders here on Leeward Air Ranch are making
> the tubes out of 4130 in the same dim. as called for in 6061-T6 (5/16 X
> .058wall). This way we don't have to carve huge holes in the floor and
skin
> as would be neccessary for big dia. aluminum tube.
> Esten Spears, RV8AQB, 80922, Fuse Floors & Flap Rods
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com> |
I got Hypoxia once WHILE using Oxygen (it wasn't turned up enough) at 14,500
a couple of years ago in a C-182. That convinced me. I bought an O2 bottle
before my trip to OSH this year, and used it going over the Bitterroot range
and also much of Montana at 12,500-13,500. Last weekend my wife and I went
to Idaho and spent around 2.5 hours on O2 as we flew over the Wallowas, the
Sawtooths, the White clouds, etc. Those are big jaggy mountains and I like
to have plenty of altitude when I fly over them! Plus going east, well,
those 30+ kt tailwinds can be nice!
Mine isn't plumbed in to the plane and I don't even have brackets for it
yet -- just set it between the seats leaned up against the flap housing.
Will make some brackets to hold it soon and possibly plumb it in to the
plane eventually. Wingtip mounting seems like more effort/plumbing than its
worth IMHO.
An important decision is how big of a bottle to get. I have a 14 cu ft. one
which is really larger than one needs for a 2 seater. However, fills are
generally a fixed cost no matter how big the tank is, so its financially
beneficial to have a larger one. Plus its nice to know you have enough to
last for a long trip and not worry about having to stop at a place that can
fill you up with gas AND O2.
Check out the Nelson Oxygen systems' web site, they have a good table that
shows how much time you can expect to get out of each system.
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~125 hours)
Portland, OR
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Morrissey, John" <John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au> |
| Subject: | RE: RV3-List: Wing incidence/twist |
Hi Finn,
Just wind down one flap a half a turn or so. I saw a really rough aircraft
built here in OZ that flew fine after this was done. You could actually see
the amount of twist in the wing.
Good luck
John
-----Original Message-----
From: Finn Lassen [mailto:finnlassen(at)netzero.net]
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2000 1:37 PM
Subject: RV3-List: Wing incidence/twist
--> RV3-List message posted by: Finn Lassen
Well, I finally being forced to deal with a problem I've postponed.
Both my wings were built with twists in them (inadvertently, I'm sure),
the right wing more than the left.
For reasons best known to whatever I was thinking when I drilled the
rear spar attach holes last year, I set the incidence at both wings to 1
degree positive at their roots.
That means that the incidence of the outer left wing edge is 0 degrees
and 2 to 2.5 degrees (positive) at the outer right wing edge.
I'd half forgotten this, and didn't notice it again until I reached
higher speeds. At 185 mph I have to apply substantial right stick
pressure to keep wings level, and also left rudder to keep ball
centered.
The question of course is: what to do about it?
The easiest would be to add substantial aileron trim tab(s) -- just
squeezing the aileron trailing edge is not going to cut it.
I see two areas of concern:
1) added induced drag at higher speeds
2) right wing stalling first (which in retrospect is noticeable when
doing near full stall landings)
Should I change the right wing incidence so I have 1 degree at the wing
midpoint (and .25 at root and + 1.75 at tip) and handle the rest by
aileron trim?
I'll be happy to hear suggestions and reasonings for possible solutions.
(No, I'm not going to rebuild wings at this time.)
(Yes, that's the risk of buying a project started by someone else, when
you don't know what to look for).
For those concerned, I have kept my speed up at 80 mph or more in my
flight testing so far (except when just over the runway and touchdown).
I haven't done slow flight testing even at altitude yet. Everything
would seem to indicate that the right wing will drop like a rock at
stall speeds, and stall testing may quickly turn into either spin
testing or (spiral) dive testing.
Finn
Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Aronson <aronsond(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: airflow 0360 installation |
Listers:
I am finally installing the airflow performance system on my 0360. I would
appreciate anyone who has finished this installation and has a picture of
the
throttle body and orientation of the mounting plates and cables. I am
having a brain freeze. I have it all laid out and the brackets that came
with the system seem big and don't work as well as something that could be
fabricated out of smaller angle. I think I have things turned around and a
picture of an installation would sure help. The pictures in the
documentation (which is very thourough) are not representative of the 0360.
Mainly need the orientation of the cables for throttle and mixture.
Thanks
Dave Aronson
RV4 N504RV
Firewall foreward at last!!
Finn Lassen wrote:
>
> Well, I finally being forced to deal with a problem I've postponed.
>
> Both my wings were built with twists in them (inadvertently, I'm sure),
> the right wing more than the left.
>
> For reasons best known to whatever I was thinking when I drilled the
> rear spar attach holes last year, I set the incidence at both wings to 1
> degree positive at their roots.
>
> That means that the incidence of the outer left wing edge is 0 degrees
> and 2 to 2.5 degrees (positive) at the outer right wing edge.
>
> I'd half forgotten this, and didn't notice it again until I reached
> higher speeds. At 185 mph I have to apply substantial right stick
> pressure to keep wings level, and also left rudder to keep ball
> centered.
>
> The question of course is: what to do about it?
>
> The easiest would be to add substantial aileron trim tab(s) -- just
> squeezing the aileron trailing edge is not going to cut it.
>
> I see two areas of concern:
>
> 1) added induced drag at higher speeds
> 2) right wing stalling first (which in retrospect is noticeable when
> doing near full stall landings)
>
> Should I change the right wing incidence so I have 1 degree at the wing
> midpoint (and .25 at root and + 1.75 at tip) and handle the rest by
> aileron trim?
>
> I'll be happy to hear suggestions and reasonings for possible solutions.
>
> (No, I'm not going to rebuild wings at this time.)
>
> (Yes, that's the risk of buying a project started by someone else, when
> you don't know what to look for).
>
> For those concerned, I have kept my speed up at 80 mph or more in my
> flight testing so far (except when just over the runway and touchdown).
>
> I haven't done slow flight testing even at altitude yet. Everything
> would seem to indicate that the right wing will drop like a rock at
> stall speeds, and stall testing may quickly turn into either spin
> testing or (spiral) dive testing.
>
> Finn
>
> Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: M2 electronic compass |
> For those of you who were waiting for the arrival of the black-faced M2
> electronic compass from Ritchie, it looks like they have changed their
mind and
> are not going to produce it. Below is my correspondence with Ritchie.
I thought there are a few places around that paint instruments. When I first
started building I inquired about changing every instrument to white faced
to follow the latest trend in sports cars and speed boats. The first add I
tried said they could do it except for the AH. I have since gotten over that
bit of foolishness.
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Flight Test Program |
| From: | Lawrence J Greeno <greenrv(at)juno.com> |
Clay - please send me a copy; appreciate your offer to do so.
Lawrence J. Greeno - greenrv(at)juno.com
RV-6A (Finishing)
07:17:52.-0700(at)matronics.com writes:
>
> Hi Listers,
> Seeing as how I'm going to likely have a 40 hour flight test time,
> I've created a rather
> extensive flight test program which I created based on Advisory
> Circular: 90-89A and
> chapter 15 of Van's builder instructions. If you would like have a
> copy in MS Word, just
> drop me an e-mail and I'll send you a copy.
>
> I make no warranties, guaranties, or claim any expertise whatsoever.
> But it might be a good
> starting point for you if you want to develop your own thorough test
> plan. I'm still making
> changes to it --- but by and large it's what I plan to do with my 40
> hours.
>
> Regards,
>
> Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, inspection soon
> Indiana
>
>
>
>
>
Lawrence J. Greeno - greenrv(at)juno.com
24 Gilead Hill Road, N.Chili, NY 14514
716-594-0883
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Denny Harjehausen <harje(at)proaxis.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Conical Engine Mounts |
>
>Lycomimg made two types of conical engines. The early O-320 in the Piper
>Tri-pacers used the same bushing as the O-290. The two are different and
>not interchangeable. Make sure of what you need before you order. I have one
>of these early O-320 engines in my RV4.
>
>Bruce Bell
>RV4 landing gear fairings in progress
I have an early Apachi, 1950s, O-320. Where would I find out which is which
for Lord bushings? Is there any change in the engine for and aft position.
My plane is flying.
Have a wonderful Day!
Denny Harjehausen
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Vacum/ignition |
| From: | Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> |
Check mags off & have a buddy pull the prop through as you look down on
the gap just in front of the vac pump. It is built out of plastic & has
about 8 tits that fit in a plastic hub. When the vac pump locks up, it is
post to die for the benefit of the engine.
Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com
**********************************************
> Thanks Dave
> But where is the shear coupling what does it look like
> Thanks Joe
> --- Dave Bristol wrote:
> >
> >
> > Joe,
> > You can disconnect the hose from the vacuum pump and
> > connect a vacuum
> > cleaner hose to it. You won't see much suction but
> > there should be an
> > inch or so. Also look at your pump and see if the
> > shear coupling is
> > gone, they tend to get rotten and fall apart.
> > Dave RV-6 STILL waiting for a prop governor
> >
> > joe wiza wrote:
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Listers
> > >
> > > I have an 0360 A1D. My DG and AH gyros quit
> > operating.
> > > No suction on suction gage. How can I tell if it's
> > my
> > > suction pump or regulator. Shall I use past
> > presidence
> > > and assume it's the more expensive of the two???
> > >
> > > second question not RV related. I have a Celebrity
> > bi
> > > plane with a C85 hp. The top plugs are the
> > unshielded
> > > type M41E. I am replacing the ignition wire
> > harness
> > > and am trying to find the old type clips to attach
> > to
> > > the top plug wires. (not enough room for shielded
> > > plugs)ACFT Spruce does not have any. any help on
> > the
> > > above would be appriciated. Please answer off net.
> > > Do not archieve
> > >
> > > Joe RV6A 105hrs looking good
> > > jwiza1(at)yahoo.com
> > >
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Thomas Nguyen" <TNGUYEN(at)oss.oceaneering.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flap Pushrods |
Hi Ken,
Since you're asking, let's take a quick look at the tensile load capacity of the
Pushrods.
First, I would assume that one would follows proper instructions and tapped the
pushrod correctly (1/4" -28) and have at least 2 D threads engagement. With
the OD diameter of 0.3125" and ID of 0.25" that would give us a minimum net cross
sectional area of 0.0276 in square.
For 6061-T6 aluminum, the maximum ultimate tensile stress is 38 ksi (A basis) and
that would give us a ( 38 ksi * 0.0276 in
2) 1049 lbs ultimate tensile strength. With the safety factor of 2.0, it would
give us 525 lbs allowable load on the pushrod.
Let's say the flap weighs approximately 10 lbs (total) and you're pulling -4.0
g's, that would put 40 lbs tensile load on the push rod + the aerodynamic loads
(flaps are retracted - let's say it 20 lbs). The total tensile load on the
flap push rod would be 60 lbs. This would leave us a big margin of safety.
Threads stripping is another concern, but with enough threads engagement it would
take care the problem itself.
Please treat this as discussion information only and leave it just that.
T.Nguyen
RV-6A
N747TN (reserved)
Finishing Instrument Panel
>>> kcflyrv(at)pacbell.net 08/23/00 11:35PM >>>
I appreciate the technical information but what about a negative G load? I'd
hate to lose a flap pushrod (ever) and even though I don't plan doing
negative G maneuvers, I'd like to feel comfortable hanging from my belt on
occassion.
Ken Cantrell - 6
engine arriving next month
-----------------------------------------------------
Click here for Free Video!!
http://www.gohip.com/free_video/
----- Original Message -----
From: Thomas Nguyen <TNGUYEN(at)oss.oceaneering.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2000 8:19 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Flap Pushrods
>
> Just out of curiosity, I calculated the Pcr (buckling load) for the flap
pushrod using the following information:
>
> Rod O.D = 0.3125" Wall Thickness = 0.058"
>
> Assume the effective length (Hole to Hole distance - Le) = 6 inches
>
> Using the Euler's method the Pcr can be calculated as follow:
>
> Pcr = Pi
2*E*I/Le
2
>
> With E (Young Modulus) = 10.7*10
6 psi for aluminum
> I (Cross Sectional Moment Inertia) = 3.94953*10
-4
>
> The Pcr is calculated to be 1,158 lbs for the Flap Pushrod. With a safety
factor of 2.0, this would bring the allowable load down to 579 lbs. This is
to show that Van's design on the flap push rod is a sound design and any
modifications to it would be unnecessary if you want to keep the weight
down. The tension load on the pushrod is very minimal (dead weight of the
flaps and hinge friction loads when you retract the flaps on ground. In the
air, it's all compressive load)
>
> My two cents.
>
> T.Nguyen
> RV-6A
> N747TN (reserved)
> Finishing Instrument Panel then out to the hangar
>
>
> >>> ewspears(at)peoplepc.com 08/22/00 10:42AM >>>
>
> > F659A being the little bitty hunk of tubing that you make the flap
> rod pushers out of.
> > I also thought that Van's part left much to be desired.
>
> >I haven't heard of many of them failing in service. They would >be most
> >likely to fail while raising flaps while on the ground since they >are in
> >compression when lowering and always when in the air.
>
> I know of one failure on a 6A that was built locally. It caused a
"split
> flap" on approach and could have been a real problem had the pilot not
> immediately noticed it and retracted flaps.
> Myself and several other builders here on Leeward Air Ranch are making
> the tubes out of 4130 in the same dim. as called for in 6061-T6 (5/16 X
> .058wall). This way we don't have to carve huge holes in the floor and
skin
> as would be neccessary for big dia. aluminum tube.
> Esten Spears, RV8AQB, 80922, Fuse Floors & Flap Rods
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Thread-Topic: RV-List: RE: RV3-List: Wing incidence/twist
Thread-Index: AcAN3vzQpJmK72bDQsODEDtAJKF5eQAAKiVw
| From: | "Bob Japundza" <Bob.Japundza(at)realmed.com> |
| Subject: | Wing incidence/twist |
Finn,
Have you tried squeezing the light aileron yet? You won't know unless
you try. You'll be surprised how effective it is. I don't think you'll
gain much with the flap adjustment as you will with squeezing the
ailerons. Do the simple things first. Solve the heavy wing problem, do
some stalls, then tackle the ball being in the center. One thing at a
time. Do some stalls after you have some hours on the airplane and when
you are less apprehensive and more comfortable flying the airplane.
Don't be afraid of getting out of control; you have so much control
authority at stall speeds that I'd say it would be almost impossible to
go out of control. You barely have to push on the stick to bring it out
of a stall. Go out and carefully have some fun first; you deserve
it--get comfortable. You are getting back down in one piece so that's
the most important part. So what if you lose a knot or two because
you're airplane is mis-rigged? As long as you can make it fly straight
your OK. When squeezing the ailerons, do a little at a time, fly, do a
little more, fly, lather, rinse, repeat. Enjoy.
How are you planning to readjust your incidence? You could use a larger
hole/bolt, but MAKE SURE you have the proper edge distance.
Bob Japundza
RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying 21 hrs
-----Original Message-----
From: Morrissey, John [mailto:John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au]
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2000 12:40 AM
Subject: RV-List: RE: RV3-List: Wing incidence/twist
Hi Finn,
Just wind down one flap a half a turn or so. I saw a really rough
aircraft
built here in OZ that flew fine after this was done. You could actually
see
the amount of twist in the wing.
Good luck
John
-----Original Message-----
From: Finn Lassen [mailto:finnlassen(at)netzero.net]
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2000 1:37 PM
Subject: RV3-List: Wing incidence/twist
--> RV3-List message posted by: Finn Lassen
Well, I finally being forced to deal with a problem I've postponed.
Both my wings were built with twists in them (inadvertently, I'm sure),
the right wing more than the left.
For reasons best known to whatever I was thinking when I drilled the
rear spar attach holes last year, I set the incidence at both wings to 1
degree positive at their roots.
That means that the incidence of the outer left wing edge is 0 degrees
and 2 to 2.5 degrees (positive) at the outer right wing edge.
I'd half forgotten this, and didn't notice it again until I reached
higher speeds. At 185 mph I have to apply substantial right stick
pressure to keep wings level, and also left rudder to keep ball
centered.
The question of course is: what to do about it?
The easiest would be to add substantial aileron trim tab(s) -- just
squeezing the aileron trailing edge is not going to cut it.
I see two areas of concern:
1) added induced drag at higher speeds
2) right wing stalling first (which in retrospect is noticeable when
doing near full stall landings)
Should I change the right wing incidence so I have 1 degree at the wing
midpoint (and .25 at root and + 1.75 at tip) and handle the rest by
aileron trim?
I'll be happy to hear suggestions and reasonings for possible solutions.
(No, I'm not going to rebuild wings at this time.)
(Yes, that's the risk of buying a project started by someone else, when
you don't know what to look for).
For those concerned, I have kept my speed up at 80 mph or more in my
flight testing so far (except when just over the runway and touchdown).
I haven't done slow flight testing even at altitude yet. Everything
would seem to indicate that the right wing will drop like a rock at
stall speeds, and stall testing may quickly turn into either spin
testing or (spiral) dive testing.
Finn
Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles E. Brame" <charleyb(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Antennae in the wingtips |
With reference to the VOR antennae in the wingtips, will they fit if one
already has the RMD lights in the wingtip.
Charlie Brame
RV-6A QB, On the gear
San Antonio, TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wultrad turn coordinator |
> Is the Wultrad turn coordinator Van carries worth the $$ or should I spend
a
> little more on another brand?? Who makes a good TC?
I've had 2 gyros go out in the first year and neither was under warranty
(one was a no-brand chinese TC from Vans, the other an O/H vacum DG with
only a 90 day warranty). Definitely take the warranty into account when
buying this stuff.
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~125 hrs)
Portland, OR
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Parker43rp(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Conical Engine Mounts |
I would call Lycoming and/or Lord to find out if ypu are in doubt.
Ray
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | re-flight test data |
In a message dated 8/24/2000 3:15:31 AM Central Daylight Time,
MAILER-DAEMON(at)aol.com writes:
<< Drop me a copy if ya don't mind.
Thanks,
Carey Mills >>
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Flight Test Program |
Clay,
I would love to have a copy too.
Carey Mills
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Squeezing Light Aileron To Correct Heavy Wing |
08/24/2000 01:22:43 PM
Reposted for easier e-searching
Bob.Japundza(at)realmed.com on 08/24/2000 11:51:35 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: RV-List: Wing incidence/twist
Finn,
Have you tried squeezing the light aileron yet? You won't know unless
you try. You'll be surprised how effective it is. I don't think you'll
gain much with the flap adjustment as you will with squeezing the
ailerons. Do the simple things first. Solve the heavy wing problem, do
some stalls, then tackle the ball being in the center. One thing at a
time. Do some stalls after you have some hours on the airplane and when
you are less apprehensive and more comfortable flying the airplane.
Don't be afraid of getting out of control; you have so much control
authority at stall speeds that I'd say it would be almost impossible to
go out of control. You barely have to push on the stick to bring it out
of a stall. Go out and carefully have some fun first; you deserve
it--get comfortable. You are getting back down in one piece so that's
the most important part. So what if you lose a knot or two because
you're airplane is mis-rigged? As long as you can make it fly straight
your OK. When squeezing the ailerons, do a little at a time, fly, do a
little more, fly, lather, rinse, repeat. Enjoy.
How are you planning to readjust your incidence? You could use a larger
hole/bolt, but MAKE SURE you have the proper edge distance.
Bob Japundza
RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying 21 hrs
-----Original Message-----
From: Morrissey, John [mailto:John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au]
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2000 12:40 AM
Subject: RV-List: RE: RV3-List: Wing incidence/twist
Hi Finn,
Just wind down one flap a half a turn or so. I saw a really rough
aircraft
built here in OZ that flew fine after this was done. You could actually
see
the amount of twist in the wing.
Good luck
John
-----Original Message-----
From: Finn Lassen [mailto:finnlassen(at)netzero.net]
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2000 1:37 PM
Subject: RV3-List: Wing incidence/twist
--> RV3-List message posted by: Finn Lassen
Well, I finally being forced to deal with a problem I've postponed.
Both my wings were built with twists in them (inadvertently, I'm sure),
the right wing more than the left.
For reasons best known to whatever I was thinking when I drilled the
rear spar attach holes last year, I set the incidence at both wings to 1
degree positive at their roots.
That means that the incidence of the outer left wing edge is 0 degrees
and 2 to 2.5 degrees (positive) at the outer right wing edge.
I'd half forgotten this, and didn't notice it again until I reached
higher speeds. At 185 mph I have to apply substantial right stick
pressure to keep wings level, and also left rudder to keep ball
centered.
The question of course is: what to do about it?
The easiest would be to add substantial aileron trim tab(s) -- just
squeezing the aileron trailing edge is not going to cut it.
I see two areas of concern:
1) added induced drag at higher speeds
2) right wing stalling first (which in retrospect is noticeable when
doing near full stall landings)
Should I change the right wing incidence so I have 1 degree at the wing
midpoint (and .25 at root and + 1.75 at tip) and handle the rest by
aileron trim?
I'll be happy to hear suggestions and reasonings for possible solutions.
(No, I'm not going to rebuild wings at this time.)
(Yes, that's the risk of buying a project started by someone else, when
you don't know what to look for).
For those concerned, I have kept my speed up at 80 mph or more in my
flight testing so far (except when just over the runway and touchdown).
I haven't done slow flight testing even at altitude yet. Everything
would seem to indicate that the right wing will drop like a rock at
stall speeds, and stall testing may quickly turn into either spin
testing or (spiral) dive testing.
Finn
Request a CDROM 1-800-333-3633
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | larry laporte <llapo(at)dmv.com> |
please un-subscribe to all mail list thank you
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
Just out of curiosity, I calculated the Pcr (buckling load) for the
flap pushrod.... is calculated to be 1,158 lbs for the Flap Pushrod. With a
safety factor of 2.0, this would bring the allowable load down to 579 lbs.
This is to show that Van's design on the flap push rod is a sound design and
any modifications to it would be unnecessary if you want to keep the weight
down. The tension load on the pushrod is very minimal (dead weight of the
flaps and hinge friction loads when you retract the flaps on ground. In the
air, it's all compressive load)
Yes, but it's still a pain in the butt to drill and tap and looks crappy.
Another lister mentioned one failure of this tube. That's one too many.
I'll use the 1/2 tubing and proper fittings again. It may be overkill, but
it's elegant, strong, and easier to make.
It's good to know that the stock ones will support 579+ pounds. How much
pressure is put on the flaps at 100 mph or so? Hmmmm, my head's starting to
hurt. I better go lie (lay?) down!
Vince in Indiana
RV-4 flying
HRII underway
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Foelker David J LtCol 50FTS/ADO <david.foelker(at)columbus.af.mil> |
| Subject: | RE: Czech-List: Unsubscribe |
Please unsubscribe me from Czech-List.
V/R,
David Foelker
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 8/23/00 11:57:53 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
shurlbut(at)island.net writes:
<< You can't measure them as you can normal rivets >>
That is correct. You really should invest 10 bucks and get a Cherry rivet
gauge from ACS or elsewhere. There may be a way to get the right size
Cherrymax without one but I'm not sure I'd depend on it.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, working on canopy installation
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing incidence/twist |
Yes that is a problem. 1 degree comes out to .432 inches, so a bigger bolt
won't cut it.
The only solution I have is to fill the wing spar 1/4" hole with a 1/4" long
piece of a 1/4" bolt and then drill the new hole. I have the beefed-up
version of the rear spar attach: 1/8 + 1/8 sandwiched between 1/8" and 1/8"
fuselage angle and bar. Of course I'll have to observe the 2x edge clearance
from bottom edge to center of new hole. Problem is I'd probably have to pull
the wing out a bit to get to the existing hole -- not something I'm looking
forward to. Thus I welcome all alternatives, be it squeezing/bumping the
ailerons, added aileron trim tabs, off-setting flaps and/or a combination of
all. But 2.5 degrees of difference tip to other tip is quite a lot.
Finn
Bob Japundza wrote:
> How are you planning to readjust your incidence? You could use a larger
> hole/bolt, but MAKE SURE you have the proper edge distance.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary A. Sobek" <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Antennae in the wingtips |
--- "Charles E. Brame" wrote:
>
> With reference to the VOR antennae in the wingtips,
> will they fit if one
> already has the RMD lights in the wingtip.
>
>
> Charlie Brame
> RV-6A QB, On the gear
> San Antonio, TX
>
Charlie:
I have the RMD lights and Bob Archer's antennae. Yes.
2 VOR antennae. One is for the FM stereo
entertainment system and the other for the VOR. Works
great.
I will have the airplane at the Homecoming, then at
RHV RV Forum on 7 September, and the Golden West
Fly-in September 9 and,or 10. If you are in the area,
stop by.
Install the RMD lights then follow Bob directions as
close to as you can. Yes the RMD lights are in the
way but the antenna still out performs friends that
have the "cat whiskers" on the tail.
====
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
650+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
"I never knew what real happiness was until I got married; and then it was too
late..." - Jack Handey
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Flight Test Program |
| From: | Lawrence J Greeno <greenrv(at)juno.com> |
Clay - please send me a copy; appreciate your offer to do so.
Lawrence J. Greeno - greenrv(at)juno.com
RV-6A (Finishing)
07:17:52.-0700(at)matronics.com writes:
>
> Hi Listers,
> Seeing as how I'm going to likely have a 40 hour flight test time,
> I've created a rather
> extensive flight test program which I created based on Advisory
> Circular: 90-89A and
> chapter 15 of Van's builder instructions. If you would like have a
> copy in MS Word, just
> drop me an e-mail and I'll send you a copy.
>
> I make no warranties, guaranties, or claim any expertise whatsoever.
> But it might be a good
> starting point for you if you want to develop your own thorough test
> plan. I'm still making
> changes to it --- but by and large it's what I plan to do with my 40
> hours.
>
> Regards,
>
> Clay Smith, RV-4, N9X, inspection soon
> Indiana
>
>
>
>
>
Lawrence J. Greeno - greenrv(at)juno.com
24 Gilead Hill Road, N.Chili, NY 14514
716-594-0883
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Denny Harjehausen <harje(at)proaxis.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Conical Engine Mounts |
>
>Lycomimg made two types of conical engines. The early O-320 in the Piper
>Tri-pacers used the same bushing as the O-290. The two are different and
>not interchangeable. Make sure of what you need before you order. I have one
>of these early O-320 engines in my RV4.
>
>Bruce Bell
>RV4 landing gear fairings in progress
I have an early Apachi, 1950s, O-320. Where would I find out which is which
for Lord bushings? Is there any change in the engine for and aft position.
My plane is flying.
Have a wonderful Day!
Denny Harjehausen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Bundy" <ebundy(at)micron.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Wing incidence/twist |
I would highly recommend you consult with Van if you decide to do this.
This is one of the most critical points on the airframe from a safety
standpoint, and most of the spar failures that have occurred were linked to
a problem with that area.
Ed Bundy - Eagle, ID
RV6A, 0320-D1a (160hp)
Sensenich 70x78, N427EM, 350+hrs.
ebundy(at)micron.net
> The only solution I have is to fill the wing spar 1/4" hole with a 1/4"
long
> piece of a 1/4" bolt and then drill the new hole. I have the beefed-up
> version of the rear spar attach: 1/8 + 1/8 sandwiched between 1/8" and
1/8"
> fuselage angle and bar. Of course I'll have to observe the 2x edge
clearance
> from bottom edge to center of new hole
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Vacum/ignition |
| From: | Don R Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> |
Check mags off & have a buddy pull the prop through as you look down on
the gap just in front of the vac pump. It is built out of plastic & has
about 8 tits that fit in a plastic hub. When the vac pump locks up, it is
post to die for the benefit of the engine.
Don Jordan -- 6a finish -- Arlington, Tx -- dons6a(at)juno.com
**********************************************
> Thanks Dave
> But where is the shear coupling what does it look like
> Thanks Joe
> --- Dave Bristol wrote:
> >
> >
> > Joe,
> > You can disconnect the hose from the vacuum pump and
> > connect a vacuum
> > cleaner hose to it. You won't see much suction but
> > there should be an
> > inch or so. Also look at your pump and see if the
> > shear coupling is
> > gone, they tend to get rotten and fall apart.
> > Dave RV-6 STILL waiting for a prop governor
> >
> > joe wiza wrote:
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Listers
> > >
> > > I have an 0360 A1D. My DG and AH gyros quit
> > operating.
> > > No suction on suction gage. How can I tell if it's
> > my
> > > suction pump or regulator. Shall I use past
> > presidence
> > > and assume it's the more expensive of the two???
> > >
> > > second question not RV related. I have a Celebrity
> > bi
> > > plane with a C85 hp. The top plugs are the
> > unshielded
> > > type M41E. I am replacing the ignition wire
> > harness
> > > and am trying to find the old type clips to attach
> > to
> > > the top plug wires. (not enough room for shielded
> > > plugs)ACFT Spruce does not have any. any help on
> > the
> > > above would be appriciated. Please answer off net.
> > > Do not archieve
> > >
> > > Joe RV6A 105hrs looking good
> > > jwiza1(at)yahoo.com
> > >
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
Thread-Topic: RV-List: RE: RV3-List: Wing incidence/twist
Thread-Index: AcAN3vzQpJmK72bDQsODEDtAJKF5eQAAKiVw
| From: | "Bob Japundza" <Bob.Japundza(at)realmed.com> |
| Subject: | Wing incidence/twist |
Finn,
Have you tried squeezing the light aileron yet? You won't know unless
you try. You'll be surprised how effective it is. I don't think you'll
gain much with the flap adjustment as you will with squeezing the
ailerons. Do the simple things first. Solve the heavy wing problem, do
some stalls, then tackle the ball being in the center. One thing at a
time. Do some stalls after you have some hours on the airplane and when
you are less apprehensive and more comfortable flying the airplane.
Don't be afraid of getting out of control; you have so much control
authority at stall speeds that I'd say it would be almost impossible to
go out of control. You barely have to push on the stick to bring it out
of a stall. Go out and carefully have some fun first; you deserve
it--get comfortable. You are getting back down in one piece so that's
the most important part. So what if you lose a knot or two because
you're airplane is mis-rigged? As long as you can make it fly straight
your OK. When squeezing the ailerons, do a little at a time, fly, do a
little more, fly, lather, rinse, repeat. Enjoy.
How are you planning to readjust your incidence? You could use a larger
hole/bolt, but MAKE SURE you have the proper edge distance.
Bob Japundza
RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying 21 hrs
-----Original Message-----
From: Morrissey, John [mailto:John.Morrissey(at)its.csiro.au]
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2000 12:40 AM
Subject: RV-List: RE: RV3-List: Wing incidence/twist
Hi Finn,
Just wind down one flap a half a turn or so. I saw a really rough
aircraft
built here in OZ that flew fine after this was done. You could actually
see
the amount of twist in the wing.
Good luck
John
-----Original Message-----
From: Finn Lassen [mailto:finnlassen(at)netzero.net]
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2000 1:37 PM
Subject: RV3-List: Wing incidence/twist
--> RV3-List message posted by: Finn Lassen
Well, I finally being forced to deal with a problem I've postponed.
Both my wings were built with twists in them (inadvertently, I'm sure),
the right wing more than the left.
For reasons best known to whatever I was thinking when I drilled the
rear spar attach holes last year, I set the incidence at both wings to 1
degree positive at their roots.
That means that the incidence of the outer left wing edge is 0 degrees
and 2 to 2.5 degrees (positive) at the outer right wing edge.
I'd half forgotten this, and didn't notice it again until I reached
higher speeds. At 185 mph I have to apply substantial right stick
pressure to keep wings level, and also left rudder to keep ball
centered.
The question of course is: what to do about it?
The easiest would be to add substantial aileron trim tab(s) -- just
squeezing the aileron trailing edge is not going to cut it.
I see two areas of concern:
1) added induced drag at higher speeds
2) right wing stalling first (which in retrospect is noticeable when
doing near full stall landings)
Should I change the right wing incidence so I have 1 degree at the wing
midpoint (and .25 at root and + 1.75 at tip) and handle the rest by
aileron trim?
I'll be happy to hear suggestions and reasonings for possible solutions.
(No, I'm not going to rebuild wings at this time.)
(Yes, that's the risk of buying a project started by someone else, when
you don't know what to look for).
For those concerned, I have kept my speed up at 80 mph or more in my
flight testing so far (except when just over the runway and touchdown).
I haven't done slow flight testing even at altitude yet. Everything
would seem to indicate that the right wing will drop like a rock at
stall speeds, and stall testing may quickly turn into either spin
testing or (spiral) dive testing.
Finn
August 19, 2000 - August 24, 2000
RV-Archive.digest.vol-jc