RV-Archive.digest.vol-jn
October 24, 2000 - October 31, 2000
>the cover off the battery box (a moot point if you have an aux power plug),
>and 2) reducing firewall clutter. I'm sure there are good reasons to do
>otherwise (check the archives -- I remember numerous discussions about this
>in the past), but I put mine inside for the above reasons -- above and to
>the right of the battery box.
Don't forget that the purpose of the Battery Contactor
is to provide a disconnect for as much of the electrical system
as possible which includes wires at risk of faults to ground.
The ideal battery/relay setup is realized with an RG battery
(no battery box) adjacent to the contactor without making the
wire penetrate the firewall or any other structure. Locating
the Battery Contactor on the other side of the firewall from
the battery isn't a terrible thing to contemplate but special
attention should be paid to support and electrical insulation
of the wire as it passes through the firewall as it is
ALWAYS HOT and no way to shut it off.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Lancaster CA seminar - Postponed |
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
I'm sorry to have to announce that only 5 of the ordiginal
35 people who signed up for the Lancaster program have
confirmed their resesrvations. I'm now past the deadline
for getting inexpensive airfares and renting the meeting
room facilities.
We'll be e-mailing all of the confirmed reservation holders
today. I'm going to pick a new date after the first of
the year and see what happens the second time around.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy J. Pflanzer" <rpflanze(at)iquest.net> |
| Subject: | Arizona Story and Pictures |
Fellow listers,
Doug Reeves was kind enough to post my story and pictures of my recent trip
from Indianapolis to Mesa, Arizona and back. You can find it at:
http://www.metronet.com/~dreeves/rv_travel/copperstate2000/RandyPflanzer/cop
perstate2000.htm
Thanks to Doug for his work and assistance.
Randy Pflanzer N417G
RV-6 (85 hours)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Degradation of Alclad Surface w/ Scotchbrite |
10/24/2000 09:13:51 AM
Mount a scotchbrite pad on a jitterbug palm sander and scuff away. Wait
untill you see how the painter preps your plane. It looks like the painter
used a chunk of asphalt to rough sand my plane. He is a award winning plane
painter so he knows what hes doing. This(painting prep) is akin to
sausage and laws....you probably don't want to know the details.......
Marty Santic (at)matronics.com on 10/23/2000 10:25:31 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com; Please respond to Marty Santic
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV-List: Degradation of Alclad Surface w/ Scotchbrite
I am to the point where I am ready to prime the HS for the RV-9A. Some
have told me to scuff the Alclad surface prior to priming but I am
concerned that I will degrade the Alclad coating?
Will I degrade the Alclad coating? Is it better to lightly scuff the
surface for better adhesion?
I will be using the SW wash primer and plan to clean all oils and dirt
from the surfaces with naptha (Coleman fuel).
Any thoughts would be appreciated wither direct or via the list.
Marty Santic RV-9A Empennage
Davenport, IA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Knicholas2(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Panel Dimmer... |
In a message dated 10/23/2000 11:07:43 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net writes:
<< I have Bob's 5.0 A dimmer and l like it >>
...WHO'S "BOB"???
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Fran Malczynski" <ebafm(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Degradation of Alclad Surface w/ Scotchbrite |
Sausage and laws?,,,sure, how about the details.
DNA
Fran Malczynski
Olcott, NY
RV6 (finish)
0360-A1A, Perf Prop Inc prop planned
----- Original Message -----
From: <pcondon(at)csc.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2000 09:14
Subject: Re: RV-List: Degradation of Alclad Surface w/ Scotchbrite
>
> Mount a scotchbrite pad on a jitterbug palm sander and scuff away. Wait
> untill you see how the painter preps your plane. It looks like the painter
> used a chunk of asphalt to rough sand my plane. He is a award winning
plane
> painter so he knows what hes doing. This(painting prep) is akin to
> sausage and laws....you probably don't want to know the details.......
>
>
> Marty Santic (at)matronics.com on 10/23/2000 10:25:31 PM
>
> Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com; Please respond to Marty Santic
>
>
> Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
>
> To: RV LIST
> cc:
>
> Subject: RV-List: Degradation of Alclad Surface w/ Scotchbrite
>
>
> I am to the point where I am ready to prime the HS for the RV-9A. Some
> have told me to scuff the Alclad surface prior to priming but I am
> concerned that I will degrade the Alclad coating?
>
> Will I degrade the Alclad coating? Is it better to lightly scuff the
> surface for better adhesion?
>
> I will be using the SW wash primer and plan to clean all oils and dirt
> from the surfaces with naptha (Coleman fuel).
>
> Any thoughts would be appreciated wither direct or via the list.
>
> Marty Santic RV-9A Empennage
> Davenport, IA
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: gasleakproofscrews |
10/24/2000 09:13:18 AM
I made my own. I used hex head S/S screws, a hand fill of very small "O"
rings and a step unibit drill. I drilled into the aluimun with the step
drill to provide a shouldered recess. Rolled the "O" rings down the screws,
used thread lube and gently torqued up the plate.......worked great.....
joe wiza (at)matronics.com on 10/23/2000 07:14:21 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com; Please respond to joe wiza
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV-List: gasleakproofscrews
Does anyone know where the gas leak proof screws (the
kind with a rubber type gasket)that mount the plates
to the root of the fuel tank can be purchased
thanks ahead.
do not archieve
RV6A 110 hrs due for annual
Joe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KostaLewis <mikel(at)dimensional.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Parking Brake |
><< I am working on the Sliding Canopy and while I still have easy access
> to the firewall was debating whether to add a Parking Brake? It seems like
> a lot of money and work for something I never used even when learning to
> fly. >>
I have this ever-present memory of seeing the Cub slowly rolling from the
fuel pumps towards a hanger in my (very) early days of flying. Only needed
to happen once. If you don't have it, you will make do with just jumping
out and chocking the wheels. If you have it you will set the break and not
worry about where the airplane is going to go.
Michael
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy J. Pflanzer" <rpflanze(at)iquest.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Degradation of Alclad Surface w/ Scotchbrite |
There are two things in life that you never want to know:
1) How your Government works (laws)
2) How sausage is made.
----- Original Message -----
From: Fran Malczynski <ebafm(at)yahoo.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2000 12:08 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Degradation of Alclad Surface w/ Scotchbrite
>
> Sausage and laws?,,,sure, how about the details.
>
> DNA
>
> Fran Malczynski
> Olcott, NY
> RV6 (finish)
> 0360-A1A, Perf Prop Inc prop planned
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <pcondon(at)csc.com>
> To: ; "Marty Santic"
> Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2000 09:14
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Degradation of Alclad Surface w/ Scotchbrite
>
>
> >
> > Mount a scotchbrite pad on a jitterbug palm sander and scuff away. Wait
> > untill you see how the painter preps your plane. It looks like the
painter
> > used a chunk of asphalt to rough sand my plane. He is a award winning
> plane
> > painter so he knows what hes doing. This(painting prep) is akin to
> > sausage and laws....you probably don't want to know the details.......
> >
> >
> > Marty Santic (at)matronics.com on 10/23/2000 10:25:31
PM
> >
> > Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com; Please respond to Marty Santic
> >
> >
> > Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> >
> >
> > To: RV LIST
> > cc:
> >
> > Subject: RV-List: Degradation of Alclad Surface w/ Scotchbrite
> >
> >
> >
> > I am to the point where I am ready to prime the HS for the RV-9A. Some
> > have told me to scuff the Alclad surface prior to priming but I am
> > concerned that I will degrade the Alclad coating?
> >
> > Will I degrade the Alclad coating? Is it better to lightly scuff the
> > surface for better adhesion?
> >
> > I will be using the SW wash primer and plan to clean all oils and dirt
> > from the surfaces with naptha (Coleman fuel).
> >
> > Any thoughts would be appreciated wither direct or via the list.
> >
> > Marty Santic RV-9A Empennage
> > Davenport, IA
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Ginn" <ginnwj(at)ozemail.com.au> |
| Subject: | Empennage - Rivet Hole Edge Distance HS-404 |
Thanks for the replies on the rivet hole edge distance. Vans suggested
drill another hole nearby that would provide the edge distance. Similar
advice to what was provided by other builders. It worked well, thanks for
the advice.
Bill
-6A Sydney Australia
----- Original Message -----
From: <Bobpaulo(at)aol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2000 2:14 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Empennage - Rivet Hole Edge Distance HS-404
> which plane you building? if you mean that you have a hole that violates
the
> 2x, move forward. only a problem if you have many in a row. i had similar
> prob. bob in arkansas doing wings
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "<Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com> |
(Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with SMTP id
for" ;
Tue,
24 Oct 2000 13:58:36.-0400(at)matronics.com
| Subject: | Re: Panel Dimmer... |
24 Oct 2000 13:58:36.-0400(at)matronics.com
Knicholas2(at)AOL.COM on 10/24/2000 11:58:39 AM
Please respond to rv-list%matronics.com; Please respond to Knicholas2(at)AOL.COM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Panel Dimmer...
In a message dated 10/23/2000 11:07:43 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net writes:
>>>>>>...WHO'S "BOB"???<<<<<
My Son, sit down let me tell you a story. It happend on a list long, long ago.
In a far off distant land called .......Kansas...........
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Joe.Whelen(at)ual.com |
hello,listers
i dimpled my elevator trim tab spar and skin. the plans call for
machine countersinking
the spar. with my screwup will dimpling the hinge work or should i
replace the spar?
thanks
joe
(Shelbyville, IN)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
"'Joe.Whelen(at)ual.com'"
Can you countersink the hinge to accept the dimples?
Steve Soule
Huntington, VT
-----Original Message-----
i dimpled my elevator trim tab spar and skin. the plans call for
machine countersinking
the spar. with my screwup will dimpling the hinge work or should i
replace the spar?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Im7shannon(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: trim tab spar |
I would just "un-dimple" the spar with flush rivet sets in the c-frame. Just
my opinion
Kevin
-9A waiting for fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ripsteel(at)edge.net (Mark Phillips) |
| Subject: | Re: Panel Dimmer... |
Knicholas2(at)AOL.COM wrote:
> << I have Bob's 5.0 A dimmer and l like it >>
>
> ...WHO'S "BOB"???
Bob NUCKOLLS - THE aviation 'lectric guru... and if you don't buy his
book your airplane will fall from the sky! ;<)
...just kidding, of course. Stick around, you will learn much from this
man. His book is "The AeroElectric Connection" and is as essential a
read as the Bingelis books. Now who is Bingelis? Wrote the books on...
Contact BOB @ "nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com" for your own copy!
Welcome!
From the PossumWorks in TN
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
"'Joe.Whelen(at)ual.com'"
Joe,
Dimple the hinge. Be careful not to smash the eyelets with the dimple die.
Dimpling will tend to curve the hinge over the length, but should not
be a factor on this short hinge.
Ed Cole
RV6A Canopy Carving
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joe.Whelen(at)ual.com [SMTP:Joe.Whelen(at)ual.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2000 12:20 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: trim tab spar
>
>
> hello,listers
>
> i dimpled my elevator trim tab spar and skin. the plans call for
> machine countersinking
> the spar. with my screwup will dimpling the hinge work or should i
> replace the spar?
>
>
> thanks
>
> joe
> (Shelbyville, IN)
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Textor" <pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com> |
I have tried the site a couple times today with no luck, did you have
trouble Mark?
Jack
RV8
Des Moines
Hey Listers's!
I found this E6-B flight computer on the web.
I have been using it for flight planning & flight data analysis.
Enjoy.....Mark
http://mail.oit.osshe.edu/~kempaj/e6b/download.htm
Mark Steffensen
RV8A, Dallas, TX
Flying 60 Hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Builder's Bookstore" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV Weigh Free Crash Tool (crash ax) |
"Builder's Bookstore"
pcondon(at)csc.com wrote:
>
> Clipped this out of a post to the group from 'mark & Sue'.......its a
> idea to use the passanger control stick (with slight mods) as a crash tool.
> Its "weight free " in that you drag it around with you alll the time
> anyway.... and it doubles as a crash tool when you need it. It sure beats
> using your hands..... here it is..........
>
This is a great idea. I'm going to make one. If you don't mind sacrificing a
little weight, it might be worthwhile to weld in a plug with a sharp point. You
can also pour some lead in to increase it's inertia. Any volunteers to test one
out?
As far as installation, ultralighters used to have these quick disconnect pip
pins that easily pull out with one hand. I like that better than attaching the
stick with a thin breakable piece of safety wire.
Another ultralighter I knew crashed his plane when his stick grip came off the
stick on climbout. he was left with the handle in his hand when he pulled back
after a low pass. The grip came off. The stick went forward. The plane nosed in
destroying itself. The very "lucky" pilot walked away with little more than
very sore bones.
Andy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Constant speed prop - worth it? |
>
> >
> > If I may comment on the constant speed prop question. My newly purchased
> > RV-4 has a C/S prop and an 0-360. My friend Tom has a 180 hp RV-6 with a
> > Sensenich metal fixed pitch prop. Now granted the RV-4 may be just a
>little
> > faster than an RV-6, but I do know Tom's RV-6 is a particular fast
>example.
> > Today we were flying side-by-side, both with the same IAS of 180 mph. He
> > was turning 2500 rpm and 24" MP. I was at 21" and 2350 rpm. Same speed
>in
> > the RV-4 for considerably less power. I made today's trip of 224 nm at
>this
> > speed (around 5000' msl most of the time) for an average of 7.8 gph!!!
> >
> > Plus it takes off like a dragster and climbs like an F-16!!
> >
> > But the excitement does come at a price!
> >
> >
> > Doug Weiler
>
>
>Doug, This makes no sense. You are saying that the Sensenich was running
>at
>over 75% while you were at less than 65%. I have flown my RV6 with both
>props
>and found no difference in speed for a given amount of power.
>
I haven't checked the percent powers that Terry calculated, but I must say
that his point is valid. The info I have is that the Sensenich and the
Hartzell C/S have about the same efficiency. So, they should have about
the same max speed, if you have the optimum pitch on the FP prop. Mind
you, the CS prop has much better climb, and you can do 65% cruise at much
lower rpm (=less noise).
The difference in speed that Doug saw could be due to a lot of other
things. Different RVs have different amounts of drag. I've seen
significant errors in both tachometers and manifold pressure gauges.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Constant speed prop - worth it? |
In a message dated 10/24/2000 10:27:10 PM Central Daylight Time,
khorton(at)cyberus.ca writes:
> I haven't checked the percent powers that Terry calculated, but I must say
> that his point is valid. The info I have is that the Sensenich and the
> Hartzell C/S have about the same efficiency. So, they should have about
> the same max speed, if you have the optimum pitch on the FP prop. Mind
> you, the CS prop has much better climb, and you can do 65% cruise at much
> lower rpm (=less noise).
Now i thought the lower rpm would result in less fuel burn also, or am i
mistaken, which would make the plane cheaper to fly
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Panel Dimmer... |
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
>
>Kurt:
>
>I'm using the dimmer kit from Van's accessories catalog and am quite happy
>with it. It will only handle 6 or 7 instruments, though, so with one UMA
>light and two radio light panels on the control, I only have capacity for 3
>or 4 internally lit instruments. That's enough (just), but there are some
>instruments which could be internally illuminated which won't be.
>
>George Kilishek
>N888GK (reserved)
Check out a range of dimmers from 0.5A to 5.0A at
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Catalog/lighting/lighting.html#dim50-14
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Wingtip Lens Installation |
> I am installing Van's small (cheap) wingtip lens kit. The instructions
> say to set the lens back approx. 10" but mine seem to fit better with an
> 8" setback. Has anyone else had this problem?
Sounds like you're trying to get it to fit snug between the top and bottom
skin? I'm pretty sure it was designed to have a little "slop" to make it
easier to install and adjust. The gaps might also help keep it from getting
too hot in the enclosure, but thats only speculation on my part. In any case
it works fine when installed as designed. I suppose it could give an
improved spread on the beam if moved forward. Could also make it worse
though too.
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~175 hrs)
Portland, OR
http://www.edt.com/homewing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gusndale(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Lasar Tachometer Signal/Rocky Mountain Micromonitor |
In a message dated 10/23/00 5:27:51 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
borgny(at)rconnect.com writes:
<< I have the same set-up as you, ie RMI monitor and Lasar ignition. I called
Ron at
RMI and he said to short out R3 resistor.
John Lee >>
John,
Thanks for the reply. Just to be sure I know what you mean, do you just
clip off one of the leads of R3 to "short out R3 resistor" or am I
misunderstanding something?
Thanks for your help.
Dale Wotring
Vancouver, WA
RV6A,
Lycoming 0-360A2A
Sensennich Fixed Pitch (84)
working on panel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank and Dorothy <frankv(at)infogen.net.nz> |
| Subject: | Re: RV Weigh Free Crash Tool (crash ax) |
pcondon(at)csc.com wrote:
> Clipped this out of a post to the group from 'mark & Sue'.......its a
> idea to use the passanger control stick (with slight mods) as a crash tool.
> Its "weight free " in that you drag it around with you alll the time
> anyway.... and it doubles as a crash tool when you need it. It sure beats
> using your hands..... here it is..........
Another thought I had... (thankfully) the only times I've ever seen a
"crash axe" being used was to bang tie-downs into the ground.
It occured to me that the ideal tool would have a hammer head for
tie-downs, a spike for breaking perspex, and a short handle with a grip
and thong for easy holding. And then it occurred to me that this exactly
resembles an ice-hammer, as used by mountain climbers. Not the great big
ice-axe that's a metre or so long, but a short-handled hammer, about 12"
long.
You can see a photo of one on this page
http://reserveamerica.altrec.com/shop/detail/4864/0
Frank.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Lee <borgny(at)rconnect.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Lasar Tachometer Signal/Rocky Mountain Micromonitor |
Gusndale(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
> In a message dated 10/23/00 5:27:51 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> borgny(at)rconnect.com writes:
>
> << I have the same set-up as you, ie RMI monitor and Lasar ignition. I called
> Ron at
> RMI and he said to short out R3 resistor.
> John Lee >>
>
> John,
>
> Thanks for the reply. Just to be sure I know what you mean, do you just
> clip off one of the leads of R3 to "short out R3 resistor" or am I
> misunderstanding something?
> Dale
Sorry for my poor answer. Just take a bare piece of wire and solder it on each
end of the R3 resistor so you are in effect taking the resistor out of the
circuit. The only reason you leave the resistor in is if in case you want to go
back to the original system. Of course you hook up the Lasar brown lead to the
correct pin on the RMI monitor.
John Lee
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> Dale Wotring
> Vancouver, WA
> RV6A,
> Lycoming 0-360A2A
> Sensennich Fixed Pitch (84)
> working on panel
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV Weigh Free Crash Tool (crash ax) |
While not "Free Weight", the crash tool that I believe meets the need is a
$10.00 item from Harbor Freight called an Emergency Glass Hammer. It weighs
around a pound, is shaped like a dual headed hammer with flat on one side of
the head (for pounding ground stakes), shaped to a point on the other side
of the head (for breaking Plexiglas) and has a serrated knife edge (probably
would work well for cutting a jammed seat belt). It is about 9" long, is
red, comes with a mounting bracket.
I am not certain whether they are still in stock.
Ed Anderson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Williams Hildred" <WilliamsHildred(at)JohnDeere.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Match drilling the Wd-605 to the E-902 spar |
"Williams Hildred"
How do you match drill the Wd-605 to the E-902 after the upper E-901
elevator skin is attached ??
On page 6-7 and 6-8, of the RV-9A construction manual, there appears to be
a mis-statement.
After the skin is attached to the E-901, the pre-punched holes of the Wd-605
can not be reached.
Did anyone else see this as a problem??
Do you have any suggestions as how to get past this problem??
Hildred Williams
WilliamsHildred(at)JohnDeere.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bruce Meacham <bruceme(at)exmsft.com> |
About a month ago I started getting a very small amount of slop in the
elevator. I immediately grounded the plane and tracked down the problem. It's
where the stick attaches to the control mixer. The bushing welded to the stick
is allowed to slide about 1/2 inch allong the pin it attaches to. I don't
think it used to do this. Has anyone else seen this? Is it a cotter pin?
Bruce Meacham
bruceme(at)exmsft.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: control slop |
10/25/2000 10:30:15 AM
Not sure where/what the control mixer is.........I assume its not the bell
crank half way down the tail section of the fuselage. If the area of
concern is right at the pilot/copilot area (RV-4 ? RV-6 ?) then the
weldment should have a babbit/brass sleeve that a #3 bolt rides on (to
pivot)........did your weldment give way ? Is your weldment sliding on the
babbit/brass bushing ??
Bruce Meacham (at)matronics.com on 10/25/2000 02:38:40 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com; Please respond to Bruce Meacham
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV-List: control slop
About a month ago I started getting a very small amount of slop in the
elevator. I immediately grounded the plane and tracked down the problem.
It's
where the stick attaches to the control mixer. The bushing welded to the
stick
is allowed to slide about 1/2 inch allong the pin it attaches to. I don't
think it used to do this. Has anyone else seen this? Is it a cotter pin?
Bruce Meacham
bruceme(at)exmsft.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com> |
| Subject: | Lasar Tachometer Signal/Rocky Mountain Micromonitor |
"Van Artsdalen, Scott"
Shorting the resistor could be either soldering a wire from one lead of the
resistor to the other leaving the resistor in place, or removing it entirely
and soldering a wire in it's place. What you describe is opening the
resistor.
Personally, I would solder a wire across the resistor first, leaving the
resistor in place and make sure that RMI's suggested fix works. Make sure
the wire is about as thick as the resistor leads. Then if it works I would
desolder the resistor and solder a clipped lead in its place. This lead
could come from the clippings of your other resistors or caps or a solid
wire that is about the same thickness as the leads on the resistor.
--
Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE, CCNA
Network Administrator
Union Safe Deposit Bank
209-946-5116
-----Original Message-----
From: Gusndale(at)AOL.COM [mailto:Gusndale(at)AOL.COM]
Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2000 10:53 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Lasar Tachometer Signal/Rocky
Mountain Micromonitor
In a message dated 10/23/00 5:27:51 AM Pacific Daylight
Time,
borgny(at)rconnect.com writes:
<< I have the same set-up as you, ie RMI monitor and Lasar
ignition. I called
Ron at
RMI and he said to short out R3 resistor.
John Lee >>
John,
Thanks for the reply. Just to be sure I know what you
mean, do you just
clip off one of the leads of R3 to "short out R3 resistor"
or am I
misunderstanding something?
Thanks for your help.
Dale Wotring
Vancouver, WA
RV6A,
Lycoming 0-360A2A
Sensennich Fixed Pitch (84)
working on panel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Hawkins <lhawkins(at)giant.com> |
| Subject: | RV-4 floor pan stiffener rivets |
I am making the floor pans (skins). the plan calls for flush rivets. There
are about a hundred rivets for the stiffeners. Why go to all the trouble of
dimpling for flush rivets here, they are certainly not in the slip stream.
Why not use universal head rivets, and save the effort for something more
important. Maybe I was too tired last night and read the plan wrong, if
so.... never mind!!!!
L Hawkins, RV-4 (FMN) fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Sticking relay with B&C starter. |
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
>Benoit
>
>There are two parts to a relay and these must not be confused.
>
>1) a coil - to activate a high current switch
>2) the high current switch
>
>The diode is used on the coil to stop the reverse current pulse, this only
happens when the coil is released and does not effect the switch part of
the relay.
>
>If the switch part of the relay cannot handle the current being drawn
>by the starter it will have a tendency to weld close or stick.
Not the whole story. It's true that contacts overheat
and degrade when loaded with too much current but 90%
of the time it's not an overcurrent issue. As I write
these words, I've got a test setup running on my workbench
to deduce the reason for sticking relays in the roll trim
system of a bizjet . . . current rating: 5A, motor draw: 1A
life of relay in service: 100-200 hrs and then they stick.
>The best option my be to get a relay with a higher current rating.
>Check the current rating of the starter and multiply this by 1.5 to 2
>(Safety factor), then look for a relay to handle this current.
I've had customers force me to drop a 5A relay in a slot
where I had tested and qualified a 2A relay to tens of thousands
of cycles over full temperature range for the system. My protests
went unheaded and the government blessed DER's signed off on the
change without further testing. They reasoned that if 2A was
"good", 5A was "better".
Within weeks of delivery of first units to the customer and before
the airplanes could be delivered to customers, 5A relays began to
stick . . .
Here's what started this thread . . . .
>>>> Benot LECOQ <lecoqben@club-internet.fr> 10/25/00 11:30AM >>>
> Hello from France
>
> I still get lots of fun flying around my new Cozy and everything is fine.
>
> Nevertherless there a few squawks that come up from time to time.The biggy
>for me is the starter relay that is sticking after releasing the start push
>button after engine start from time to time.This of course keeps the starter
>engaged with the engine running and you have to shut everything down to
>avoid any damage.Up to now, I had no real trouble with coping with that but
>it starts to be a real hassle.
> Here is what I tried:
> - Apply aeroelectric connection recommandations: big cable gauge and a
>diode to minimize the spark.
> - Change the relay a few time but after a while it starts again.
> The configuration is :
> - Lycoming O360 A3a,
> - Lightweight BC starter, wiring for the start part per Nat's
>recommandations including aeroelectric connection features,
> - 2 switches for the ignition system: one is grounding a magnetoand the
>other one switching on and off a Jeff rose electronic ignition.
> - A push button triggering the starter relay.
> I hear from a friend that the BC starter is pulling a lot more amps on
the
>battery than other starters and occasionnally triggers a big spark inside
>the relay that would lead quickly to a sticking relay.
> As I said I included a diode between the ground and the output of the
relay
>toward the starter (obviously in the inverted direction )to try to minimize
>the spark inside the relay. It looks like it does not play its role.
I don't have enough information yet.
Scenario 1: Is the sticking "relay" a starter contactor with fat wires
to carry starter current and light wiring to accept control voltage via
the start switch? What kind of contactor? Did you purchase it from either
B&C or from AeroElectric Connection? Is the system wired such that the
built in into the B&C starter is jumpered to the main terminal as-supplied
from B&C?
If the the "relay" being discussed is a starter contactor external
to the B&C starter then I suspect it's not a device purchased from
either Bill or myself and is not rated for the task. The contactors
we sell have been installed by the hundreds and I'm yet to be notified
of any sticking problems . . . although it CAN happen, we would not
expect it in less than hundreds of hours of service.
Scenario 2: Is the "relay" an auxiliary device used to take advantage
of the starter's built in contactor? Many folk have used some 30A
rated, plastic relays as an amplifier to buffer the built in starter
contactor's horrible inrush currents. See:
www.aeroelectric.com/articles/strtctr.pdf
Even tho these relays are rated sufficiently to withstand the high
inrush requirements, the load they switch is VERY inductive and has
a strong potential for burning the contacts of the aux control
relay. Going to a 70A rated relay would not solve the problem.
Missing or in-appropriately applied arc suppression is the
cause of problems.
Both problems are easy to fix. Benot, it would help if you could
fax me a sketch of your wiring so that I can accurately deduce
the problem and recommend a solution. Send it to 316.685.8617
and I'll publish the diagnosis and prescription on the lists.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jon Saulsgiver <jms(at)eznet.net> |
| Subject: | deadblow hammers for dimpling |
is there any consensus on the ideal weight for a deadblow
hammer to use when dimpling with the C-frame tool? I've come to the
conclusion that the cheap rubber mallet I'm using isn't giving
me enough impulse to make consistently good dimples. my
first HS skin came out pretty well, using four hits per hole.
I went to three hits on the second skin, and now I'm seeing
rivets that aren't as flush, and a lot more distortion around
the rivets.
Harbor Freight sells them (cheap!) in a variety of weights:
1,2,3 pound, etc, for way less than the usual RV tool outfits.
I'm thinking a two-pounder might be good. any suggestions?
The HF hammers also have rubber coatings on the striking
surfaces, where the Avery/Cleaveland seem to have metal faces.
is this difference significant?
-Jon Saulsgiver
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bruce Meacham <bruceme(at)exmsft.com> |
| Subject: | Re: control slop |
> Not sure where/what the control mixer is.........I assume its not the bell
> crank half way down the tail section of the fuselage.
Nope, not the crank.
> If the area of concern is right at the pilot/copilot area.
Yup.
> weldment should have a babbit/brass sleeve that a #3 bolt rides on (to
> pivot)........
Yup.
> did your weldment give way ?
No, it's all secure.
> Is your weldment sliding on the
> babbit/brass bushing ??
Yes. There's a gap that it slides back and forth on. I don't recall it doing
this when I helped do the anual. What is supposed to keep this in place?
Bruce
Meacham
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
"'Larry Hawkins'"@matronics.com
| Subject: | RV-4 floor pan stiffener rivets |
It's your airplane, build it the way you want! Or.....wait until your full
of piss and vinegar and then
do it right.
Ed Cole
RV6A Canopy
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Larry Hawkins [SMTP:lhawkins(at)giant.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2000 8:00 AM
> To: 'rv-list(at)matronics.com '
> Subject: RV-List: RV-4 floor pan stiffener rivets
>
>
> I am making the floor pans (skins). the plan calls for flush rivets.
> There
> are about a hundred rivets for the stiffeners. Why go to all the trouble
> of
> dimpling for flush rivets here, they are certainly not in the slip stream.
> Why not use universal head rivets, and save the effort for something more
> important. Maybe I was too tired last night and read the plan wrong, if
> so.... never mind!!!!
>
> L Hawkins, RV-4 (FMN) fuse
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Fuel pressure fitting; fuel injected |
For you fellows running fuel injected IO360 engines---Where are you pulling
your fuel pressure from? Between the mechanical pump and servo? At the fuel
distributor block/rail? My engine from Bart has a restrictor fitting in the
distributor right next to the inlet from the servo (Bendix). The only reason
I can think of for it being there is for fuel pressure measurement.
Scratching my head over plumbing
Keith
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Dudley <rhdudley(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: deadblow hammers for dimpling |
Jon,
So far through all dimpling of empennage and wings I have used a
lightweight plastic hammer with my Avery C-frame. With the thinner (.016
or .025) sheet, a single blow. With the thicker (.032) sometimes it
takes 2 blows to be sure with the solid sound of "deformation complete".
Richard Dudley
RV-6A wings finished, starting fuselage
FL
Jon Saulsgiver wrote:
>
>
> is there any consensus on the ideal weight for a deadblow
> hammer to use when dimpling with the C-frame tool? I've come to the
> conclusion that the cheap rubber mallet I'm using isn't giving
> me enough impulse to make consistently good dimples. my
> first HS skin came out pretty well, using four hits per hole.
> I went to three hits on the second skin, and now I'm seeing
> rivets that aren't as flush, and a lot more distortion around
> the rivets.
>
> Harbor Freight sells them (cheap!) in a variety of weights:
> 1,2,3 pound, etc, for way less than the usual RV tool outfits.
>
> I'm thinking a two-pounder might be good. any suggestions?
> The HF hammers also have rubber coatings on the striking
> surfaces, where the Avery/Cleaveland seem to have metal faces.
> is this difference significant?
>
> -Jon Saulsgiver
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steve Judd <sjudd(at)ffd2.com> |
| Subject: | Re: back riveting help/advice please) |
Hi Eric,
On Mon, 23 Oct 2000 ENewton57(at)AOL.COM wrote:
> Are you using the AN426 3-3 rivets? The 3.5 ones are too long for the thin
> skin of the rudder. The other thing I found id that if I press down too
Is this correct? I use the 1.5 x diameter rule in selecting rivets, and
have been wondering what a -3 rivet can possibly be used for -- by my
measurement, the shank length is just about 1.5*diameter, leaving about
one skin-thickness to the top of the head.
Am I missing something/being abnormally clueless?
Thanks!
-Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve DiNieri" <capsteve(at)wzrd.com> |
If anyone has downloaded a copy of the 2000 catalog in pdf before vans
removed it from their website, could I persuade you to e-mail me a copy.
Thanks in advance...
Steven DiNieri
capsteve(at)wzrd.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bruce Meacham <bruceme(at)exmsft.com> |
| Subject: | Re: control slop |
Here's Philips' private response
> If the weldment tubular shaft (that has the brass/babbet on its interior)
> is sliding along the brass/babbet sleeve then thats wrong. You should not
> see any brass/babbet......... the #3 bolt acts as a pinch bolt to pinch
> the receiving weldment to the babbet shaft and the smaller tubular
> weldments floats around the babbet. Possibly your situation was wrong
> from the start and with use it freeded up....... Should be a easy fix. If
> you get new babbet sleeves from Vans, ream them size so the #3 bolt works
> correctly. Don't drill....ream if you can.. Cut to correct length and
> install....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles E. Brame" <charleyb(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Regulated Alternator |
Listers, and particularly Electric Bob,
I just purchased a ND 55 amp alternator. Originally destined for an '89
Suzuki Samurai. After getting it home I noted on the warranty info that
it was INTERNALLY REGULATED. Supposedly the voltage is set for 14.9 volts.
The AEROELECTRIC CONNECTION seems to recommend an EXTERNALLY REGULATED alternator.
My questions:
Can I simply install an external regulator adjusted to 13.8 volts and
press on, (i.e., keep the internal regulator) OR do I have to unregulate
the alterator?
If I have to unregulate the alternator, how is it done?
OR, should I just return the alternator and start looking for an
equivalent unregulated alternator? If so, what should I look for. (Auto
shops want an auto make, model and year.)
I wanted the higher amp capable altenator to run a full IFR panel, plus
pitot heater, strobes, landing lights, etc.
Charlie Brame
RV-6A QB, On the gear
San Antonio, TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: trim tab spar |
In a message dated 10/24/00 12:30:47 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
Joe.Whelen(at)ual.com writes:
<< will dimpling the hinge work >>
I'd try dimpling the hinge first with a hinge wire in and mated to the other
hinge section. If the hinge still works smoothly and you can pull the wire
in and out fairly easily I don't see any reason that it won't work unless,
I'm missing something.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, working on canopy installation
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steve Judd <sjudd(at)ffd2.com> |
| Subject: | Re: deadblow hammers for dimpling |
Hi Jon,
On Wed, 25 Oct 2000, Jon Saulsgiver wrote:
> is there any consensus on the ideal weight for a deadblow
> hammer to use when dimpling with the C-frame tool? I've come to the
After using a $50 dead-blow hammer for dimpling, I've come to the
conclusion that a $5 16 oz. hammer from the Home Despot will work just
as well. The main advantage of a dead-blow hammer is that it has a cool
sounding name.
> first HS skin came out pretty well, using four hits per hole.
Four hits! Those rubber-coated hammers are made for pounding out dents in
fenders. I think you'll find that you can basically just dead-drop a
regular old hammer onto it and get a great dimple.
One other suggestion: grab the shank and hold the dies together before
hitting. If there's already a solid die-skin-die connection, I think
you'll find that a fairly mundane hit is all that is needed (especially on
the thinner skins).
Of course, as the Worst RV Builder Ever, maybe my advice should be viewed
with skepticism!
-S
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bruce Gray <brucegray(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pressure fitting; fuel injected |
Keith,
Most spam can fuel flow meters are a pressure gage that reads fuel distributor
spider pressure and are calibrated in GPH/PPM rather than PSI. If you are using
a pressure type fuel flow gage, this outlet is it's connection point. If you're
using a true flow meter, the turbine wheel sensor should go on the line between
the distributor spider and the servo, and I would just cap off that extra
outlet on your distribution spider.
The fuel pressure sensor should go on the line between the engine fuel pump and
the servo.
Bruce
Glasair III
RKOdell(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
> For you fellows running fuel injected IO360 engines---Where are you pulling
> your fuel pressure from? Between the mechanical pump and servo? At the fuel
> distributor block/rail? My engine from Bart has a restrictor fitting in the
> distributor right next to the inlet from the servo (Bendix). The only reason
> I can think of for it being there is for fuel pressure measurement.
>
> Scratching my head over plumbing
> Keith
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Karl Schilling" <k_schilling(at)iquest.net> |
| Subject: | RV-4 floor pan stiffener rivets |
It's so you don't wear holes thru your carpet as you get in and out.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Lasar Tachometer Signal/Rocky Mountain Micromonitor |
In a message dated 10/24/00 10:56:18 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
Gusndale(at)AOL.COM writes:
<< clip off one of the leads of R3 to "short out R3 resistor >>
I'm not John but be careful, "clipping off' and "shorting out" are two very
different things.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, working on canopy installation
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RWINGSPAN(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: deadblow hammers for dimpling |
<< Hi Jon,
> is there any consensus on the ideal weight for a deadblow
> hammer to use when dimpling with the C-frame tool? I've come to the
After using a $50 dead-blow hammer for dimpling, I've come to the
conclusion that a $5 16 oz. hammer from the Home Despot will work just
as well. >>
Have to second that motion...after having my dead blow hammer crack, I've
found a single hit with a regular hammer works better and faster, (cheaper
too). IMHO save your money.
Rich Greener
RV-8 (closing wings)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don Winters <dwinters(at)acraline.com> |
"'Steve Judd'"@matronics.com
| Subject: | Re: back riveting help/advi |
ce please)
I bought a set of rivet set/length gages from cleaveland tool. It is a
height gage for picking the right rivet, and a diameter/height gage for
checking the size after setting.
They are worth 10 times what they cost. Wish I had used them from the
start.
Don
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Judd [mailto:sjudd(at)ffd2.com]
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2000 11:42 AM
Subject: Usefulness of AN3-3 (was Re: RV-List: back riveting help/advice
please)
Hi Eric,
On Mon, 23 Oct 2000 ENewton57(at)AOL.COM wrote:
> Are you using the AN426 3-3 rivets? The 3.5 ones are too long for the
thin
> skin of the rudder. The other thing I found id that if I press down
too
Is this correct? I use the 1.5 x diameter rule in selecting rivets, and
have been wondering what a -3 rivet can possibly be used for -- by my
measurement, the shank length is just about 1.5*diameter, leaving about
one skin-thickness to the top of the head.
Am I missing something/being abnormally clueless?
Thanks!
-Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: back riveting help/advice please) |
In a message dated 10/25/00 9:45:30 AM Pacific Daylight Time, sjudd(at)ffd2.com
writes:
<< the shank length is just about 1.5*diameter >>
Countersunk rivet length includes the depth of the factory head. -3s work
well for two 0.016 skins.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, working on canopy installation
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | deadblow hammers for dimpling |
Good luck getting a consensus:) I've been using a wooden maple mallet I got
from Sears for about $8. It's light so it's easy on the arm for extended
use. Seems a good compromise for force transfer, rebound absorption and
noise deadening. I use 3 med taps on skins, 2 heavy on nutplates. Both faces
are beat to hell but I only use it on the C-frame and it's lasted for my
whole project. If it ever splits and becomes unusable, I'll get another.
Regards,
Greg Young
RV-6 N6GY Houston (DWH) wiring & systems
is there any consensus on the ideal weight for a deadblow
hammer to use when dimpling with the C-frame tool? I've come to the
conclusion that the cheap rubber mallet I'm using isn't giving
me enough impulse to make consistently good dimples. my
first HS skin came out pretty well, using four hits per hole.
I went to three hits on the second skin, and now I'm seeing
rivets that aren't as flush, and a lot more distortion around
the rivets.
Harbor Freight sells them (cheap!) in a variety of weights:
1,2,3 pound, etc, for way less than the usual RV tool outfits.
I'm thinking a two-pounder might be good. any suggestions?
The HF hammers also have rubber coatings on the striking
surfaces, where the Avery/Cleaveland seem to have metal faces.
is this difference significant?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | deadblow hammers for dimpling |
Thread-Topic: RV-List: deadblow hammers for dimpling
Thread-Index: AcA+rL85ty/EXEFeQnSmBHUjvIsgtQAAKnyA
| From: | "Bob Japundza" <Bob.Japundza(at)realmed.com> |
I agree with Steve. I found the best looking dimples were the ones I
did with just a regular hammer, with two light swings. The first blow
will sound like "cha", the next one will sound like "chink".
Bob Japundza
RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying 53 hours
I get my prop back next week!!!
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Judd [mailto:sjudd(at)ffd2.com]
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2000 12:02 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: deadblow hammers for dimpling
Hi Jon,
On Wed, 25 Oct 2000, Jon Saulsgiver wrote:
> is there any consensus on the ideal weight for a deadblow
> hammer to use when dimpling with the C-frame tool? I've come to the
After using a $50 dead-blow hammer for dimpling, I've come to the
conclusion that a $5 16 oz. hammer from the Home Despot will work just
as well. The main advantage of a dead-blow hammer is that it has a cool
sounding name.
> first HS skin came out pretty well, using four hits per hole.
Four hits! Those rubber-coated hammers are made for pounding out dents
in
fenders. I think you'll find that you can basically just dead-drop a
regular old hammer onto it and get a great dimple.
One other suggestion: grab the shank and hold the dies together before
hitting. If there's already a solid die-skin-die connection, I think
you'll find that a fairly mundane hit is all that is needed (especially
on
the thinner skins).
Of course, as the Worst RV Builder Ever, maybe my advice should be
viewed
with skepticism!
-S
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <tcwatson(at)seanet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: deadblow hammers for dimpling |
I agree with Steve's comments about holding the die and shank together
before whacking it, but I spent about three minutes bandsawing a handle out
of a maple 2x4 about 14" long for a whacker. It has lasted through the tail
and wings, might make it through the fuselage. It sheds a little wood fiber
on each whack, but the sound is much less annoying than metal on metal. I
tried a dead blow (I don't remember how heavy), but I didn't like it for
dimpling.
Terry Watson
RV-8A #80729
Seattle
Subject: Re: RV-List: deadblow hammers for dimpling
> > is there any consensus on the ideal weight for a deadblow
> > hammer to use when dimpling with the C-frame tool>
> One other suggestion: grab the shank and hold the dies together before
> hitting. If there's already a solid die-skin-die connection, I think
> you'll find that a fairly mundane hit is all that is needed (especially on
> the thinner skins).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | deadblow hammers for dimpling |
--- Gregory Young <gyoung@cs-sol.com> wrote:
>
> Good luck getting a consensus:) I've been using a wooden maple mallet
> I got
> from Sears for about $8. It's light so it's easy on the arm for
> extended use.
This is an important consideration! Take it from one who had Carpal
Tunnel surgery before closing my wings!
Afterwards, I couldn't use the hammer I had used for more than a few
blows. A dead blow hammer allowed me to continue working on the
project.
I recommend to everyone - ignore the expense and get:
Dead blow hammer
Pneumatic squeezer
Pneumatic cleco "pliers"
Use weight lifting gloves when riveting to help absorb shock.
You don't know (really, you don't!) the value of your hands until you
don't have the use of them!
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX
-6 N140RV (Reserved)
Fuselage
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Tanner" <gtanner(at)bendcable.com> |
| Subject: | deadblow hammers for dimpling |
I went a step furthur. Imade my own c-frame dimpler. It's a heavy duty unit
made from 4" channel with 3/16 plate sandwiched in between in the shape of a
C. I mounted a 1/2 ton arbor press upside down and drilled a 3/16 hole in
the arbor to accept the die. I can dimple up to pretty heavy material quite
easily and very consistent. Just pull on the handle until it seats and it's
done. I'll send a link to a picture of it as soon as I get film developed.
Greg Tanner
RV-9A Empennage
SER #90186 N80BR RESERVED
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mike Thompson
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2000 11:35 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: deadblow hammers for dimpling
--- Gregory Young <gyoung@cs-sol.com> wrote:
>
> Good luck getting a consensus:) I've been using a wooden maple mallet
> I got
> from Sears for about $8. It's light so it's easy on the arm for
> extended use.
This is an important consideration! Take it from one who had Carpal
Tunnel surgery before closing my wings!
Afterwards, I couldn't use the hammer I had used for more than a few
blows. A dead blow hammer allowed me to continue working on the
project.
I recommend to everyone - ignore the expense and get:
Dead blow hammer
Pneumatic squeezer
Pneumatic cleco "pliers"
Use weight lifting gloves when riveting to help absorb shock.
You don't know (really, you don't!) the value of your hands until you
don't have the use of them!
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX
-6 N140RV (Reserved)
Fuselage
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Burns" <hsierra(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Regulated Alternator |
1978 or 1979 honda civic or accord. it has a 55 or 60 amp externally
regulated ND alternator.
find a good autoparts store that still has a few parts books around, they
list all the specs on the alternators.
R. Burns
RV-4 s/n 3524 N82RB
----- Original Message -----
From: "Charles E. Brame" <charleyb(at)earthlink.net>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2000 11:59 AM
Subject: RV-List: Regulated Alternator
>
> Listers, and particularly Electric Bob,
>
> I just purchased a ND 55 amp alternator. Originally destined for an '89
> Suzuki Samurai. After getting it home I noted on the warranty info that
> it was INTERNALLY REGULATED. Supposedly the voltage is set for 14.9 volts.
>
> The AEROELECTRIC CONNECTION seems to recommend an EXTERNALLY REGULATED
alternator.
>
> My questions:
>
> Can I simply install an external regulator adjusted to 13.8 volts and
> press on, (i.e., keep the internal regulator) OR do I have to unregulate
> the alterator?
>
> If I have to unregulate the alternator, how is it done?
>
> OR, should I just return the alternator and start looking for an
> equivalent unregulated alternator? If so, what should I look for. (Auto
> shops want an auto make, model and year.)
>
> I wanted the higher amp capable altenator to run a full IFR panel, plus
> pitot heater, strobes, landing lights, etc.
>
> Charlie Brame
> RV-6A QB, On the gear
> San Antonio, TX
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "rlluster" <rlluster(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: deadblow hammers for dimpling |
The benefit to using the dead blow hammer is that it will not damage the end
of your dimpler. You will also find the dead blow is very useful in working
around aluminum, plus many other uses.
Richard Luster
Maryville, Wa
RV9, wings
----- Original Message -----
From: <RWINGSPAN(at)AOL.COM>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2000 10:18 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: deadblow hammers for dimpling
>
>
> << Hi Jon,
>
> > is there any consensus on the ideal weight for a deadblow
> > hammer to use when dimpling with the C-frame tool? I've come to the
>
> After using a $50 dead-blow hammer for dimpling, I've come to the
> conclusion that a $5 16 oz. hammer from the Home Despot will work just
> as well. >>
>
> Have to second that motion...after having my dead blow hammer crack, I've
> found a single hit with a regular hammer works better and faster, (cheaper
> too). IMHO save your money.
>
> Rich Greener
> RV-8 (closing wings)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bobpaulo(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: deadblow hammers for dimpling |
i hate to cloud this. sounds like one of those primer threads. i use a wooden
i got from orndorrf and it works just fine. bob in arkansas doing the wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV4Brown(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pressure fitting; fuel injected |
Hi Keith,
The fitting at the fuel distribution block will not give you a useful
reading. The fuel pressure needs to be installed between the mechanical pump
and the air metering servo on the bottom of the engine. Van's sells a T
fitting that mounts right on the fuel pump that is tapped for a 1/8" fitting.
Tom Brown RV4 flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cliff Begnaud" <shoeless(at)barefootpilot.com> |
| Subject: | Re: deadblow hammers for dimpling |
I too have been using a dead blow hammer. Got it at Oskosh in the flymarket
for $3.
Works great.
Cliff
Erie, CO
RV9A Riveting empennage
> This is an important consideration! Take it from one who had Carpal
> Tunnel surgery before closing my wings!
> Afterwards, I couldn't use the hammer I had used for more than a few
> blows. A dead blow hammer allowed me to continue working on the
> project.
>
> I recommend to everyone - ignore the expense and get:
> Dead blow hammer
> Pneumatic squeezer
> Pneumatic cleco "pliers"
> Use weight lifting gloves when riveting to help absorb shock.
>
> You don't know (really, you don't!) the value of your hands until you
> don't have the use of them!
>
> Mike Thompson
> Austin, TX
> -6 N140RV (Reserved)
> Fuselage
>
>
> Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | Re: control slop |
Bruce Meacham wrote:
> --> Is your weldment sliding on the
> > babbit/brass bushing ??
> Yes. There's a gap that it slides back and forth on. I don't recall it doing
> this when I helped do the anual. What is supposed to keep this in place?
I've got a bunch of washers on each side.
Finn
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pressure fitting; fuel injected |
If you have a Bendix injector then the fuel pressure port is just above and
aft of the fuel inlet port on the unit. But you could also install a tee in
the line between the engine driven fuel pump and the inlet to the injector.
Mike Robertson
RV-8A N809RS
>From: RKOdell(at)AOL.COM
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com, RKOdell(at)AOL.COM
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com, bruceme(at)exmsft.com
>Subject: RV-List: Fuel pressure fitting; fuel injected
>Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2000 12:37:20 EDT
>
>
>For you fellows running fuel injected IO360 engines---Where are you pulling
>your fuel pressure from? Between the mechanical pump and servo? At the fuel
>distributor block/rail? My engine from Bart has a restrictor fitting in the
>distributor right next to the inlet from the servo (Bendix). The only
>reason
>I can think of for it being there is for fuel pressure measurement.
>
>Scratching my head over plumbing
>Keith
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re:Regulated Alternator |
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
>> I wanted the higher amp capable altenator to run a full IFR panel, plus
>> pitot heater, strobes, landing lights, etc.
How does this add up to "higher amp" ????
If you turned EVERYTHING on how much current does it draw?
Then decide what combinations of things you would operate.
For example, nav lights and strobes in clouds are useless
and perhaps dangerous. Pitot heat doesn't need to be on
if you're not flying in cloud or freezing precip. Landing
lights don't NEED to be on until you're in the clear
meaning that pitot heat is probably off. If you DO need
pitot heat on all the way to the runway, you're in an
IFR environement and no landing light is needed until just
before touchdown.
If you do a critical analysis of the real energy budget
to run an airplane, you find that the standard 60A
alternator that the spam cans bought by the carload
are way more than what's needed. You can't add up the
breakers or fuses. Get out the specs for critters
you plan to install and do the operational matrix.
Last full-up airplane I did the job for could fly
quite nicely on a 35 amp alternator.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Regulated Alternator |
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
>
>Listers, and particularly Electric Bob,
>
>I just purchased a ND 55 amp alternator. Originally destined for an '89
>Suzuki Samurai. After getting it home I noted on the warranty info that
>it was INTERNALLY REGULATED. Supposedly the voltage is set for 14.9 volts.
>
>The AEROELECTRIC CONNECTION seems to recommend an EXTERNALLY REGULATED
alternator.
>
>My questions:
>
>Can I simply install an external regulator adjusted to 13.8 volts and
>press on, (i.e., keep the internal regulator) OR do I have to unregulate
>the alterator?
You can run the alternator as-is. We recommend adding external
OV ptrotection as shown in:
www.aeroelectric.com/articles/bleadov.pdf
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Sticking relay with B&C starter. |
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
>There are two more considerations in connection with solenoids that you
>should be aware of.
>1) If you have low battery voltage, like too much resistance in the line,
>or maybe one of the old-style lead-acid batteries, or do too much
>cranking, you can weld the contacts together.
Quite true . . . and it can happen to ANY style contactor.
>2) The commonly used solenoids (Wicks et al) have bolt heads inside for the
>contacts. If you twist the posts by tightening the electrical cables too
>tight on the outside, the bolt head on the inside can turn, so instead of
>the contacts being the flat of the bolthead, it is one of the points, and
>that greatly reduces the contact area, and could cause welding of the
>contacts.
Not sure about what Wicks is selling if it looks like:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Catalog/switch/s701-1l.jpg
then IT IS important to hold the nut up next to the contactor
shell and keep it from turning while you tighten the wiring
nut. ANY rotation of the threaded stud will render the contactor
trash.
If the contactor looks like:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/Catalog/switch/s702-1l.jpg
Then the studs are captive in the contactors molded housing.
With this style, twisting the stud will break the housing
but at least you KNOW when you've cranked down on it too hard.
>B and C Specialties has a special contactor where the posts can't turn, and
>it avoids this problem. Benoit, would you like Bill Bainbridge to send you
>one of these which is garaunteed not to stick?
Don't know about "guaranteed" but they're really hard to stick.
However, starters with failed wiring inside or low battery
voltage can weld the best contactor . . .
> To amplify what I said in one of my earlier posts, the battery
>solenoid is energized when you turn on the master switch, and nothing else
>should be on at that time, so you aren't switching any current.
Most airplanes have several amps of things that are on all the
time but a battery contactor is generally rated to SWITCH 70
amps or better. Normal bus loads don't errode the battery
master contactor to any significant degree.
> . . . .But when
>you energize the starter solenoid, you could be switching as much as 600
>amps, which is the cranking power of the battery. That is why the starter
>circuit goes directly from the battery to the starter . . .
This is not recommended. All of our drawings and virtually every
certified airplane takes starter current through the battery master
contactor . . . if the starter contactor DOES stick, then the
battery master gives you a way to shut things down. While a battery
master contactor is rated to SWITCH 70 amps, it will nicely CARRY
the 200-250 amps common to starting an engine. I've had builders
try to use one of my S701-1 battery contactors as a starter contactor and
didn't get very good service life . . . however the battery contactor
was ALWAYS there to bring a potentially bad situation under control.
> . . . and not through the power bus and the 50 amp circuit breaker.
Not sure what breaker this is . . . some folks have a fat breaker
in their alternator b-lead output to the bus. By-in-large, there's
no practical application for fat breakers anywhere else in the system.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Sticking Contactors . . . |
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
>There is something else to consider in installing solenoids (besides making
>sure you have the right one in each application). You should install them
>so that gravity assists the magnetic force in holding the contacts
>together. Do not install them upside down!
I recall a story circulated around OSH about ten years ago. Seems
some show pilot landed and found a chewed up starter ring
gear and his starter contactor was stuck shut. Some arm-chair
engineering on the spot deduced that high g-loading during aerobatic
maneuvers were responsible for "teasing" the contacts in flight
and causing welding much like low battery voltage. The word
went out like wildfire . . . tho shalt mount thy contactors
UPSIDE down so that positive g-loading would not tend to close
an open relay.
The physics don't bear out any particular admonitions for orientation
in the airplane. Once energized, a contactor has about 10x the force
holding it closed than it takes to first move the contacts from a fully
open position. Since a battery contact is ALWAYS closed, it's likely
that you'll pull the wings off your airplane before you force the
contactor open during a flight maneuver.
Starter contactors (like our S702-1) have extra heavy springs
to open them (to offset sticking tendencies) and extra heavy
coils to close them (to offset contact bounce and subsequent
damage from arcing while closing the high current load). G-loading
effects on these contactors is even less significant than for
the S701-1 continuous duty part. Further, starter contactors are
normally mounted on firewall with base on vertical plane. This
orientation puts g-loading sensitivity parallel to the longtitudinal
axis of the airplane . . . don't fly into the side of a mountain, you
might cause your starter contactor to close when you didn't want it
to.
By in large, all of the stories being circulated about contactor
orientation and are not founded in the application or physics of
the matter. IF the airshow pilot was using a poorly choosen device
as a starter contactor (like our S701-1) AND it was oriented
such that gravity helps close or keep the contacts closed, then
it's thinkable that a 10g maneuver might have teased his starter
contacts closed in flight. If he were using a REAL starter
contactor installed accoding to recommendations, it would never
happen. Maneuvering g-loads in airplanes you and I like to fly
are not a risk to your various contactors.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | glenn williams <willig10(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Four Questions |
I have responded on this issue before. (it may be in
the archives) But yes I work for Bombardier and work
on the Challenger fleet of business Jets and we use
proseal extensively for anything that has a gap.
(prior to paint) we mask off about an 1/8" with
masking tape on both sides and then insert proseal
into the gap after that is is smoothed out with a
popsicle stick or a nylon spatula. Immediately after
you remove the tape use palmolive in water on your
hands to smooth out the roughness left behind from
pulling the tape off. Archive this one
Glenn Williams
--- Scott Pittman wrote:
>
>
> I have never actually done it myself but I know that
> business jets use 890
> PRC (tank sealant). The skin gaps are often 1/8
> inch wide. Works great.
> As nasty as it is, PRC is really pretty good stuff.
>
> http://www.prc-desoto.com/index.taf
>
> Scott Pittman
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Dustin Norlund <dustin_norlund(at)geotec.net>
> To: ; RV-List Digest Server
>
> Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2000 9:58 PM
> Subject: RV-List: Four Questions
>
>
>
> >
> >
> > I have a small gap between couple of my wing skins
> running down the spar.
> > This is not a big problem just a small gap that
> needs to be filled for
> > painting. What should i use to fill it? Has
> anyone used a filler here in
> > the past with good results? I saw a RV at Oshkosh
> that had the same
> error,
> > the wings were filled in the same area.
> >
> > Dustin Norlund rv6
> >
> >
>
>
>
> through
>
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
> Matronics!
>
>
>
>
>
====
Glenn Williams
8A
A&P
N81GW
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Terminaltown(at)AOL.COM |
zenith-list(at)matronics.com, lanceair-list@matronics, glasair-list@matronics
Hello Lister:
In my research on various Home Builts going on around Seattle I've run into
many questions and one that I can answer now in the HOW TO area of our site.
I am still working on others and will post soon.
It is an easy solution to preventing chafing when running wire through some
of the larger holes in the bulkheads. Holes to big for snap in plastic
grommets or rubber grommets.
Go to http://www.terminaltown.com/Pages/Page110.html or click here Terminal Town's
/Electrical Connector/Cat Track
John @ Terminal Town
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Blake" <danblake(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | RV8-List: Completed RV-8 Tail for sale |
I'm loosing my workshop for a few years, and have decided to sell my
completed RV-8 empennage. Veriprime interior and electric trim installed.
Located in the Atlanta area. Workmanship is near flawless. Built with the
help of experienced builder and EAA tech advisor. Spare uncut instrument
panel.
Preview plans, serial number.
Asking $2200.
Details:
dan(at)thrutech.com
or
(770) 451-8976
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: want plan for spinner with hidden screws |
Mike did yhou ever get an answer to your question to hiden spinner screws?
If so I would like to have a copy.
Thanks
Rollie & Rod
6A Finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Constant speed prop - worth it? |
Speaking of rpm, power . . . is anyone using the instrument from Technology
Kitchen called the "Power Monitor". It is a digital display of RPM,
manifold pressure, and a calculation (and display) of % power. This looks
reasonably priced and of value (for example, high density altitude
operations). If anyone has experience this let me know. Thanks.
rickjory(at)msn.com
Rick Jory
----- Original Message -----
From: <CW9371(at)AOL.COM>
Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2000 9:29 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Constant speed prop - worth it?
>
> In a message dated 10/24/2000 10:27:10 PM Central Daylight Time,
> khorton(at)cyberus.ca writes:
>
>
> > I haven't checked the percent powers that Terry calculated, but I must
say
> > that his point is valid. The info I have is that the Sensenich and the
> > Hartzell C/S have about the same efficiency. So, they should have about
> > the same max speed, if you have the optimum pitch on the FP prop. Mind
> > you, the CS prop has much better climb, and you can do 65% cruise at
much
> > lower rpm (=less noise).
>
> Now i thought the lower rpm would result in less fuel burn also, or am i
> mistaken, which would make the plane cheaper to fly
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "rvpilot" <rvpilot(at)coollink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Constant speed prop - worth it? |
Rick,
I am using it and am very happy with it. It works great and is easily worth
the $. Besides reading % of power directly, it also replaces the Tach.,M.P.
& O.A.T. with the added bonus of reading out density altitude and pressure
altitude.
Best Regards,
Bill RV-8 N48WD
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)email.msn.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2000 7:27 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Constant speed prop - worth it?
>
> Speaking of rpm, power . . . is anyone using the instrument from
Technology
> Kitchen called the "Power Monitor". It is a digital display of RPM,
> manifold pressure, and a calculation (and display) of % power. This looks
> reasonably priced and of value (for example, high density altitude
> operations). If anyone has experience this let me know. Thanks.
> rickjory(at)msn.com
> Rick Jory
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <CW9371(at)AOL.COM>
> To: ;
> Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2000 9:29 PM
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Constant speed prop - worth it?
>
>
> >
> > In a message dated 10/24/2000 10:27:10 PM Central Daylight Time,
> > khorton(at)cyberus.ca writes:
> >
> >
> > > I haven't checked the percent powers that Terry calculated, but I must
> say
> > > that his point is valid. The info I have is that the Sensenich and
the
> > > Hartzell C/S have about the same efficiency. So, they should have
about
> > > the same max speed, if you have the optimum pitch on the FP prop.
Mind
> > > you, the CS prop has much better climb, and you can do 65% cruise at
> much
> > > lower rpm (=less noise).
> >
> > Now i thought the lower rpm would result in less fuel burn also, or am i
> > mistaken, which would make the plane cheaper to fly
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ENewton57(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: back riveting help/advice please) |
In a message dated 10/25/00 11:45:52 AM Central Daylight Time, sjudd(at)ffd2.com
writes:
<< Is this correct? I use the 1.5 x diameter rule in selecting rivets, and
have been wondering what a -3 rivet can possibly be used for -- by my
measurement, the shank length is just about 1.5*diameter, leaving about
one skin-thickness to the top of the head.
>>
Hi Steve,
When measuring flush head rivets measure from the top of the head to the end
of the rivet. Also, check out this interesting page by Gil Alexander that
shows the proper way to measure the shop head of a flush rivet in a dimpled
skin -http://home.flash.net/~gila/
Good luck,
Eric
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joe Hine" <joehine(at)nbnet.nb.ca> |
Listers
I found this on the web last night and although I would like to go after
this myself, I don't think I can right now so I thought I would share it
with you all.
go to
http://biensdelacouronne.tpsgc.gc.ca/text/pacific/plane-e.htm
This airplane was seized under Canada's "proceeds of crime" legislation. I
have no idea what the licensing implications would be either in Canada or
the us. But it might be a good deal for someone. The airplane appears to
have been first flown in 1991.
Joe Hine
RV4 C-FYTQ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Orear" <jorear(at)mari.net> |
| Subject: | Firewall recess box fit |
Fellow listers:
Just got my premade firewall recess box the other day and have a problem.
Per the Justice notes, I tried the fit of it by inserting it through the
firewall cutout from the engine side. Unfortunately, the box is about
1/16th of an inch too wide to make it through the cutout. I would simply
trim the cutout, but the vertical siffeners on each side come right to the
present edge of the cutout. As the flange of these stiffeners faces the
cutout, I can't trim them also.
I have read that it is best to leave this recess box off until the rudder
peddle bracket is installed. If this is done, is it possible to install it
on the cabin side of the firewall sandwiched between the firewall and the
stiffeners?? I can't see how this could be done. As I stated earlier, the
Justice manual says that the flanges go on the engine side of the firewall.
Can't do that with my recess box.
Anyone else have this problem lately?
Thanks gang
Regards,
Jeff Orear
RV6A
fuse
Peshtigo, WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Sticking relay |
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
> Thanks for the overwhelming quantity of answers. It looks like it might
be
>a real problem.
> I will answer to everybody in one message.
> To be more precise on my configuration:
> - The first starter relay I was using was the one sold by ACS (p/n 22735
on
>their catalog) for homebuilders .It started to stick lets say after 3 months
>of my initial testing ( I was already flying by that time) and was the one
>used for the initial start of the engine when it was sometime a bit
>difficult to start with a low battery.
> - The second relay was bought in France to a company called Aerostock
in Le
>bourget airport. It started sticking after 15 days of use. I am now flying
>quite often and the engine is firing very quickly and very nicely due to the
>jeff rose ignition with a fully loaded battery ( I am flying a lot).
> -I took it out and found out it a was a 24v relay. So I went back to
>Aerostock and they changed it for a 12v one. The one I got looks very much
>alike the master relay ( p/n 111-226 in ACS catalog). It started not doing
>its job after a week.
This explains it. NONE of heavy duty contactors in that package
are suited to starter contactor service . . . for a time,
RBM Controls, later White-Rogers, now Stancore built a series of
intermittant duty relays with heavier coil wires and stronger closure
forces but the way that contactor is designed internally, it just
doesn't get the contact PRESSURE that modern automotive starter
contactors enjoy.
The contactor we sell (S702-1) is of this family of devices.
> I know have two plans to attack that problem:
> 1-A friend of mine gave me a brand new ACS 22735 relay he had in his
>hangar. I might put that one on and keep the diodes that I had added on the
>previous relay ( The first relay had a diode between the coil and ground but
>not between the output and ground).
Our conactor has the arc supression diode built into the contactor
coil assembly.
> 2-I recently bought a renault truck starter relay which looks impressive
>(not to say massive) and very strong. I did not use it yet because I
>measured the coil resistance and found out that it was 4 ohms. This would
>mean that I would be pulling at least 3 amps through the triggering push
>button and given the size of that button this would be way too much. So I
>can decide to use it but I would have to trigger the coil of that new relay
>through another relay, maybe the previous one that could accept that 3 amp
>current easily. Is this overkill?
No, the fact that you read the low resistance is FIRST indication that
this is an intermittant duty contactor probably designed for higher
contact pressures therefore much more suited to working with starters.
Our S702-1 contactor is also a 4 ohm coil . . . The starter push-button
we recommend is heaftier than most . . . or you can rig your magnetos
to use switches and built the starter function into the switches. This
is illustrated several ways in the diagrams at:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/errata/R9Z_0400.pdf
> I would like to thank for the LED advice. It is a very good one because
I
>had already implemented that in my bird and this is what allowed me to do
>the identification of the problem.In fact , every switch has a Led that
>lights up when it is on and the information is picked up trough a wire that
>is coming from the back of the equipment the given switch is supposed to
>energise.I like that set up a lot because I have an emergency power switch
>that power a very minimum of what is needed ( to cover the alternator
>failure) and when the switch is on "alternate" the LED's give me exactly
>what is on.
Do you also have some form of automatic disabling of the alternator
in case of a failed regulator runaway? This needs to be an automatic
function that operates in tens of milliseonds. Pilot monitoring of
any instrumentation with the hope of adequately controlling a runaway
> Well, this is were I am . It is late now and I am going to bed as you
guys
>are now working.
> May be I will find out more to morrow morning with maybe a direct advice
>from Bill bainbridge. Just burry in mind that I am now so happy to fly that
>bird that waiting 3 or more days for a part coming from the states is too
>much. I want to fly to-morrow except if the wheather is bad (it might
>happen).
Bill is going to tell you that you need a REAL starter contactor like
his, like mine or probably like the one you just bought . . . however,
it's possible that our contactors are smaller and lighter. My S701-1
is 280 gm and fits inside a 6 x 6 x 6 cm cube. Bill's is very close
to the same dimensions.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Constant speed prop - worth it? |
>
>In a message dated 10/24/2000 10:27:10 PM Central Daylight Time,
>khorton(at)cyberus.ca writes:
>
>
> > I haven't checked the percent powers that Terry calculated, but I must say
> > that his point is valid. The info I have is that the Sensenich and the
> > Hartzell C/S have about the same efficiency. So, they should have about
> > the same max speed, if you have the optimum pitch on the FP prop. Mind
> > you, the CS prop has much better climb, and you can do 65% cruise at much
> > lower rpm (=less noise).
>
>Now i thought the lower rpm would result in less fuel burn also, or am i
>mistaken, which would make the plane cheaper to fly
You may get very slightly less fuel burn at the same percent power, but the
difference will be extremely small (I think). I doubt you would ever be
able to make up the extra cost of the CS prop. Of course if the cost of
flying was your prime motivation, you would buy a 40 year old 172. So,
make the plane the way you want, and tell your wife that the real reason
you bought the CS prop was to save money on gas. And make sure she knows
how much cheaper those O-540s are than a four cylinder engine :-) I'm
already practicing my line for the next project "I'm putting in one of
those Russian radials because they are so cheap".
Take care,
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
"'Jeff Orear'"@matronics.com
| Subject: | Firewall recess box fit |
Jeff,
It seems like another lifetime, but as I recall I had this exact situation.
I understood from Van's that the location of the stiffeners, the size of the
cutout and the size of the box had all changed minutely from the earlier
kits. This means that Frank Justice did not have exactly the same pieces
that you and I have, so we can't follow his instructions to the letter. I
believe that I put the box flanges on the cabin side of the firewall between
the firewall and the stiffener.
Steve Soule
Huntington, VT
RV=6A in wooden cradle for the second fitting of the wings for rigging
purposes.
-----Original Message-----
Just got my premade firewall recess box the other day and have a problem.
Per the Justice notes, I tried the fit of it by inserting it through the
firewall cutout from the engine side. Unfortunately, the box is about
1/16th of an inch too wide to make it through the cutout. I would simply
trim the cutout, but the vertical siffeners on each side come right to the
present edge of the cutout. As the flange of these stiffeners faces the
cutout, I can't trim them also.
I have read that it is best to leave this recess box off until the rudder
peddle bracket is installed. If this is done, is it possible to install it
on the cabin side of the firewall sandwiched between the firewall and the
stiffeners?? I can't see how this could be done. As I stated earlier, the
Justice manual says that the flanges go on the engine side of the firewall.
Can't do that with my recess box.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bcbraem(at)home.com |
| Subject: | Re: Constant speed prop - worth it? |
If you fly at the same power setting (55 - 65 - 75%) and in the same
mixture range (best economy - best power - full rich), if you decrease
prop rpm you have to increase manifold pressure, which will keep your
fuel consumption stable. I went out a flew around for an hour, today,
checking different rpm/MAP settings to fuel flow, just to be sure. So,
you can lower prop rpm with the C/S prop
but fuel consumption = power (thrust) remains the same because of
increased MAP.
At least, I think that's what you were trying to get at.
Boyd
N600SS
220 hrs.
SW Florida
>
>
> In a message dated 10/24/2000 10:27:10 PM Central Daylight Time,
> khorton(at)cyberus.ca writes:
>
> > I haven't checked the percent powers that Terry calculated, but I must say
> > that his point is valid. The info I have is that the Sensenich and the
> > Hartzell C/S have about the same efficiency. So, they should have about
> > the same max speed, if you have the optimum pitch on the FP prop. Mind
> > you, the CS prop has much better climb, and you can do 65% cruise at much
> > lower rpm (=less noise).
>
> Now i thought the lower rpm would result in less fuel burn also, or am i
> mistaken, which would make the plane cheaper to fly
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Harvey Sigmon" <flyhars(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Firewall recess box fit |
Jeff: I found that the opening for the firewall opening box was a little
tight, a little filing the on the vertical supports the box will go in. As
the instruction stated with the box it needs to be installed from the engine
firewall side. as you indicated the rudder pedal center support needs to be
riveted in using flush rivets so the box will go into the opening easier. My
install was a quickbuilt which had the opening already cut out. The box
needs to be sealed with some sort of sealer when installing. Hope this
helps.
Harvey Sigmon - RV-6AQB - Engine stuff
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Orear" <jorear(at)mari.net>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2000 11:25 PM
Subject: RV-List: Firewall recess box fit
>
> Fellow listers:
>
> Just got my premade firewall recess box the other day and have a problem.
> Per the Justice notes, I tried the fit of it by inserting it through the
> firewall cutout from the engine side. Unfortunately, the box is about
> 1/16th of an inch too wide to make it through the cutout. I would simply
> trim the cutout, but the vertical siffeners on each side come right to the
> present edge of the cutout. As the flange of these stiffeners faces the
> cutout, I can't trim them also.
>
> I have read that it is best to leave this recess box off until the rudder
> peddle bracket is installed. If this is done, is it possible to install
it
> on the cabin side of the firewall sandwiched between the firewall and the
> stiffeners?? I can't see how this could be done. As I stated earlier,
the
> Justice manual says that the flanges go on the engine side of the
firewall.
> Can't do that with my recess box.
>
> Anyone else have this problem lately?
>
> Thanks gang
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Jeff Orear
> RV6A
> fuse
> Peshtigo, WI
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carroll Bird <catbird(at)taylorelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: back riveting help/advice |
please)
ENewton57(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
> In a message dated 10/25/00 11:45:52 AM Central Daylight Time, sjudd(at)ffd2.com
> writes:
>
> << Is this correct? I use the 1.5 x diameter rule in selecting rivets, and
> have been wondering what a -3 rivet can possibly be used for -- by my
> measurement, the shank length is just about 1.5*diameter, leaving about
> one skin-thickness to the top of the head.
> >>
>
How do you figure this? A -3 rivets diameter is 3/32" that is 0.09375"
The length is 3/16" that is 0.1875" . 0.09375* 1.5 = 0.140625 Subtract this
from 0.1875 and you come up with 0.46875 This measuurement is equavilent to
more that the thickness of two peices of 0.020 sheet metal, so you could rivet
two peices of 0.020 with a -3 rivet.
Carroll Bird Buffalo Gap TX.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tom Gesele <tgesele(at)usa.net> |
| Subject: | F623 Rib Attach Question |
Listers,
I'm sure I'm missing something obvious, but I can't seem to find a
good way to tie the -623 rib into the F606 bulkhead and the
corresponding J-Channel. I'd appreciate any suggestions anyone has..
Thanks,
Tom Gesele
RV-6 Fuselage.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jon Saulsgiver <jms(at)eznet.net> |
many thanks to all the listers who replied about my question
on hammers. turns out that it looks like my real problem
(OK, a rubber mallet was a poor choice, too) is that I'd
set up the c-frame and carpeted table on top of a steel
office-type table, and so there wasn't adequate support.
every time a blow was struck, the thin steel tabletop would
flex, absorbing most of the energy.
many thanks to Eric Henson for turning on the lightbulb!
he strongly suggests using the c-frame against a concrete floor,
which makes perfect sense, once considered!
-Jon Saulsgiver
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: F623 Rib Attach Question |
In a message dated 10/26/00 8:08:29 AM Pacific Daylight Time, tgesele(at)usa.net
writes:
<< I'm sure I'm missing something obvious, but I can't seem to find a good
way to tie the -623 rib into the F606 bulkhead and the corresponding
J-Channel. I'd appreciate any suggestions anyone has.. >>
I had the same concern Tom. I couldn't live with leaving the -623s just
floating until the skins anchored them so I fabricated some lop sided "T"
shaped clips from scrap 0.032 and riveted them at each end to secure them
before the skins went on. Worked good for me.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, working on canopy installation
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Some thoughts spike catcher diodes . . . |
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
A reader comments on the practice of putting diodes across the coil
of a contactor . .
> A diode connected in this way is usually suggested to clamp the inductive
> voltage spike resulting from de-energizing the relay coil. The problem is
> that it provides a path for the current caused by the collapsing magnetic
> field. The net result is that the amount of time it takes to open the
> relay *increases*. This exacerbates the issue of a sticking relay in that
> a slower release time causes more arcing at the contacts.
Yeeeaaahhh BUT . . . I've never been able to document much change
in the contact spreading velocity of the contactors we sell and
recommend when a diode is included in the contactor's coil circuit.
I have been able to document wear and tear on the switch that controls
the contactor and it's much worse if the diode is left off.
On starter contactors, the spring tension that opens contacts
is MUCH larger than for the continuous duty contacts. Further,
given the higher coil current, it's more important that this
stored energy be calmly dealt with than with battery contactors.
Hence, our starter contactors come with the diode BUILT IN. I
have to believe that the folks who make these by the millions
for ground based vehicles find this a useful thing to do.
Battery contactors are generally opened up with VERY mild loads
on the main terminals . . . so again, it's more useful to tame
the contactor's stored coil energy than to be concerned with
contact opening velocity.
> A better way is to dump the current of the collapsing field into the
> battery. You can do this by connecting the diode across the starter
> switch (cathode band to the battery side of the switch) rather than the
> coil. This is a higher impedance path, and it allows the coil magnetic
> field to collapse faster while still clamping the voltage.
Not so. I've done an article on spike catching diodes and posted
it to:
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/spikecatcher.pdf
It's rather large (500K .pdf file) and I appologize for the
size but it has 4 pictures of oscilloscope traces taken from
test setups on my bench this morning. If you want to get the
straight skinny on this topic, I'll suggest it's worth the
download time.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Performance deltas WAS: Constant speed prop - worth it? |
Why one RVnn performs different from another that seems just the same?I
wouldn't be surprised to find that different individual engines of the exact
same build (like O360A1A) put out different amounts of power. One might put
out 175hp, the other 185.
Right?
hal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: F623 Rib Attach Question |
--- Tom Gesele wrote:
>
> Listers,
>
> I'm sure I'm missing something obvious, but I can't seem to find a
> good way to tie the -623 rib into the F606 bulkhead and the
> corresponding J-Channel. I'd appreciate any suggestions anyone has..
Have you read the following from Frank Justice?
"Attach the F-623 ribs to the F-605 and F-606 using a lap attach at the
forward end as shown in section H-H' in drawing #32 and a butt attach
at the rear as shown in I-I'.
You could use a butt attach at the forward end to avoid the slight jog
in the skin there but it is not worth the trouble for the average
builder. The rib is usually too short to
do a lap attach at both ends. Note that a J-stringer will be attached
later at the rear end using the same rivet. Mark the rivet holes for
countersinking or dimpling as appropriate."
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX
-6 N140RV (Reserved)
Fuselage
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <dane3(at)ATTGLOBAL.NET> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pressure fitting; fuel injected |
I just went through this problem last week. I was
informed by Bob at RLB, the best place to take the
fuel pressure is on the fitting on the backside for the
Bendix servo. I asked him why? His reply was if you
take off back of the Bendix you know fuel is getting to
the servo and past the screen inside the servo. As for
the fitting on the spider on top he told me to cap it
off.
So you say who is this Bob guy ? What makes him an
expert? While I was there picking up my fuel lines
he had made, I saw government license plate on a
vehicle out front. Well it belonged to couple of boys
from the NTSB who were bringing Bob a mag to tear down
to see if it was the cause of an accident. Bob at RLB
is evidently an expert on carbs, fuel injection, mags,
etc. Good resource if anybody needs work done on these
items. Turns out one of the NTSB guys is building a RV
6.
(I have no interest in RLB just thought it might help
some one.)
Dane Sheahen
RV8a (baffles are next)
RLB is located in Addison IL. near Chicago.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bcbraem(at)home.com |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Power Monitor: was Constant speed prop |
bcbraem(at)home.com wrote:
re-posted for archival search
I was real interested in this product when it first came out.
As I read their product info and have talked to TechnoKitchen over the
phone, the problem with the EPM is that is uses
the overly optimistic, generic manufacturers' performance tables for a
specific engine, and, does not take into account fuel flow info.
So if your engine is in any way non-standard, has more or less
accessories or -EXP, your getting no more than an educated guess from
the instrument--and that probably
applies to even a stock engine, given the known inaccuracies of
performance data tables. It's probably more accurate with a FP prop, in
cruise, but not in climb, because the prop is "slipping" or "stalled"
until it gets up to engine cruise rpm. But, if your engine's power
settings don't
exactly match the performance tables programmed in the EPM, it's still a
crap shoot, just easier and quicker to see than opening up your POH and
going to the printed tables and from what I can tell from their product
info, you can't adjust the engine data points to make a closer fit to
your engine if you notice any variables from the standard tables. Tho,
it "almost" sounds like you may be able to send it back to them for recalibration
if you can document any discrepancies and they can re-adjust the
"standard" curve that was originally installed.
In other words, the EPM calculates the density pressure from its OAT
probe and a patch into the transponder encoder. But, it interpolates a
graph of % engine power based on data points provided by the engine
manufacturer and programmed into the unit. The engine performance
numbers are essentially an advertisement for the engine to exaggerate
its power vs. its fuel consumption (but the EPM doesn't include fuel
consumption in its "calculation") to entice more people and airframe
manufacturers to buy it. Typically, this is done by running the
engine without any accessories attached and sometimes by using blended
fuels that have a higher octane rating than will be used in the field
but are not available to the general public. They can also be run with
special exhaust systems and use an air intake that is non-filtered.
Read Larry Pardue's posts on how he tried to fit his engine's
performance tables into the real world.
Besides, if you're cruising along, what do you really want to know:
your track; your TAS; your fuel flow (gal/hr)--what does % power level
mean if it's not linked to fuel flow--you wanna know how long you can
fly at this particular power setting, whatever it is and the EPM doesn't
tell you that.
IMHO, I can't see that it's worth the money.
Just tape the manufacturers' performance tables over the hole you'd put
the EPM in and have at it:)--and save $700.
Jeez, I feel like Dennis Miller! Whoo, Whoo!!!
I'll probably regret this post.
Boyd.
N600SS
> >
> > Speaking of rpm, power . . . is anyone using the instrument from Technology
> > Kitchen called the "Power Monitor". It is a digital display of RPM,
> > manifold pressure, and a calculation (and display) of % power. This looks
> > reasonably priced and of value (for example, high density altitude
> > operations). If anyone has experience this let me know. Thanks.
> > rickjory(at)msn.com
> > Rick Jory
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RobHickman(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Engine Power Monitor (JPI) |
Anyone tried the one from JPI?
They claim that you do a test run on the ground to program the unit and it
does not need the engine model?
Rob Hickman
RV-4 N401RH ~100hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Burch" <rv6man(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: new 5th point belt won't latch |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael G. McGee" <jmpcrftr(at)teleport.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2000 11:02 PM
Subject: RV-List: new 5th point belt won't latch
>
> Has anyone added a 5th point belt to their plane and the buckle for the 4
> point belts didn't work? Is the male side a different part number for 5
> belts that I need to get also? Or did you just grind enough off to
> work.? This is consistent with both sets on the plane.
> Thanks, Mike
>
> Mike McGee, RV-4 N996RV, O320-E2G, Aurora, OR
>
> Mike, this cracks me up! Van has been selling that crotch strap for years
knowing full well that it doesnt work. There is no belts from Van that will
make it work.
I broke down and bought real acro belts.Terry
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Houg <thoug(at)ATTGLOBAL.NET> |
| Subject: | Double flush riveting |
OK, all you RV-9A builders, what are the secret's for getting good double
flush rivets on the trailing edge's of the rudder and elevator?
I haven't started the riveting on these yet, but will be soon. Any good
pointers or suggestions?
I've read the most recent RV-ator article on this, has any one else used a
looong back rivet plate to do the entire trailing edge like thie article
recommends?
Thanks,
Todd Houg
St. Francis, MN
Prepping the rudder, HS and VS for primer . . .
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Firewall recess box fit |
Joe,We lef the box off until we got ready to install the engine and it helped
us reach into the fuselage and work on the brakes and rudder pedals as well
as working on the control weldements and battery box installation . Our box
also fit hard. We used a dead hammer and with a few blows we were able to
reshape it enough to get it into the firewall. The worst part for us was
the messy pro seal.
Good luck
Rollie & Rod
6A finishing kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Power Monitor (JPI) |
> Anyone tried the one from JPI?
They are not the sort of people with whom I'll do business, ever. Look
up "JPI & Matronics" in the archives to see the whole sordid story of
JPI's underhanded attack on Matt Dralle, host of the RV list.
Unforgivable.
Tim "No JPI stuff in my airplane" Lewis
******
Tim Lewis -- Springfield VA
RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
TimRV6A(at)earthlink.net
http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net> |
| Subject: | RV6 Slider Rail Fairing |
List: I just got an E-Mail from Gary VanRemortel and the Slider Rail
Fairing is no longer available do to the lack of access to a 30 ton press
used in there manufacture.
Gary says he will make more (Sold the original 100) if he can find a
press. How many other builders could use this product? Maybe with enough
customers for Gary we could speed up the search for an available press?
Perhaps another builder has a line on a press?
Tom in Ohio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gordon or Marge Comfort" <gcomfo(at)tc3net.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Power Monitor: was Constant speed prop |
: Thursday, October 26, 2000 6:18 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Engine Power Monitor: was Constant speed prop
>
>bcbraem(at)home.com wrote:
>
> I was real interested in this product when it first came out.
> As I read their product info and have talked to TechnoKitchen over the
> phone, the problem with the EPM is that is uses
> the overly optimistic, generic manufacturers' performance tables for a
> specific engine, and, does not take into account fuel flow info.
> So if your engine is in any way non-standard, has more or less
> accessories or -EXP, your getting no more than an educated guess from
> the instrument--and that probably
> applies to even a stock engine, given the known inaccuracies of
> performance data tables. It's probably more accurate with a FP prop, in
> cruise, but not in climb, because the prop is "slipping" or "stalled"
> until it gets up to engine cruise rpm. But, if your engine's power
>settings don't
> exactly match the performance tables programmed in the EPM, it's still a
> crap shoot, just easier and quicker to see than opening up your POH and
> going to the printed tables and from what I can tell from their product
> info, you can't adjust the engine data points to make a closer fit to
> your engine if you notice any variables from the standard tables. Tho,
> it "almost" sounds like you may be able to send it back to them for
recalibration
> if you can document any discrepancies and they can re-adjust the
> "standard" curve that was originally installed.
>
>In other words, the EPM calculates the density pressure from its OAT
>probe and a patch into the transponder encoder. But, it interpolates a
>graph of % engine power based on data points provided by the engine
>manufacturer and programmed into the unit. The engine performance
>numbers are essentially an advertisement for the engine to exaggerate
>its power vs. its fuel consumption (but the EPM doesn't include fuel
>consumption in its "calculation") to entice more people and airframe
>manufacturers to buy it. Typically, this is done by running the
>engine without any accessories attached and sometimes by using blended
>fuels that have a higher octane rating than will be used in the field
>but are not available to the general public. They can also be run with
>special exhaust systems and use an air intake that is non-filtered.
>
>Read Larry Pardue's posts on how he tried to fit his engine's
>performance tables into the real world.
>
>Besides, if you're cruising along, what do you really want to know:
>your track; your TAS; your fuel flow (gal/hr)--what does % power level
>mean if it's not linked to fuel flow--you wanna know how long you can
>fly at this particular power setting, whatever it is and the EPM doesn't
>tell you that.
>
> IMHO, I can't see that it's worth the money.
> Just tape the manufacturers' performance tables over the hole you'd put
> the EPM in and have at it:)--and save $700.
>
> Jeez, I feel like Dennis Miller! Whoo, Whoo!!!
>
> I'll probably regret this post.
>
> Boyd.
> N600SS
>
>> >
>> > Speaking of rpm, power . . . is anyone using the instrument from
Technology
>> > Kitchen called the "Power Monitor". It is a digital display of RPM,
>> > manifold pressure, and a calculation (and display) of % power. This
looks
I concur with the things Boyd has said. Additionally, the power curves
developed by the engine mfr are developed in a test cell and while they may
be reduced to sea level standard conditions, are certainly done with
different inlet and exhaust conditions than we have and while not turning an
alternator. So we really have only a vague idea of our power available in
our individual installations. If one could develop a torque sensing system
that was practical and relatively inexpensive then power could be
determined. Some time back the CAFE foundation tried a system that sensed
pressure in the cylinder and attempted to determine power using a summation
of the pressure variations. We've not heard much about it lately and in any
case might lead to "indicated horsepower". It still would not address
friction and mechanical losses. The auto racing industry is developing
torque sensing systems using new technology but it may not be applicable to
our systems.
I believe we do not know what horsepower the propellers are receiving. I
sure wish we did. I would appreciate someone who knows more about it than I
do giving a little treatise on the subject.
Gordon Comfort
N363GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net> |
| Subject: | Amp Meter Question |
List: I have the Vans Amp Meter and a 40 Amp Shunt. Can I run my 55 Amp
Alternator with this setup or do I need a 60 Amp Shunt?
Vans doesn't list a 60 Amp Shunt and I was wondering if there is a
compatible source?
Tom in Ohio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Luster" <rlluster(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Double flush riveting |
A couple of things I did were:
1) Alternated the direction of the rivets.
2) make sure your stiffener is properly aligned, or you will get a curve. I
noticed it on one of my elevators, but was able to alter it prior to
riveting.
The standard backplate worked well, just take one rivet at a time and it
comes out pretty good.
Richard Luster
Marysville, WA
wing, clecoing on the skins
RV9, 90111
----- Original Message -----
From: Todd Houg <thoug(at)ATTGLOBAL.NET>
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2000 6:20 PM
Subject: RV-List: Double flush riveting
>
> OK, all you RV-9A builders, what are the secret's for getting good double
> flush rivets on the trailing edge's of the rudder and elevator?
>
> I haven't started the riveting on these yet, but will be soon. Any good
> pointers or suggestions?
> I've read the most recent RV-ator article on this, has any one else used a
> looong back rivet plate to do the entire trailing edge like thie article
> recommends?
>
> Thanks,
> Todd Houg
> St. Francis, MN
> Prepping the rudder, HS and VS for primer . . .
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | glenn williams <willig10(at)yahoo.com> |
listers I have an idea, but before I implement it, I
want your input. I am wanting to mount the 8A rear
step weldment (the square piece) on the inside of the
fuselage and have only the step and leg showing from
outside the fuselage. Once riveted together I will
proseal the leg to keep moisture out. Any ideas on
this area? I will call Vans tomorrow and also talk
with My Bombardier engineers here in house to see if
this area needs to be beefed up to make this happen.
But that said I think this would be a neat way of
making this step look pretty and not such an eye sore.
What say you?
Glenn Williams
====
Glenn Williams
8A
A&P
N81GW
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Crash Tool (crash ax) |
Check out this escape tool:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/taf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=40610
Ten bucks and not very heavy at all. But I do like the bottom of the
co-pilots stick idea too.
Norman
> > Clipped this out of a post to the group from 'mark & Sue'.......its a
> > idea to use the passanger control stick (with slight mods) as a crash
tool.
> > Its "weight free " in that you drag it around with you alll the time
> > anyway.... and it doubles as a crash tool when you need it. It sure
beats
> > using your hands..... here it is..........
________________________________________________________________________________
Jim,
Nice looking installation, very clean and simple. I don't see the beldon
cable activate/deactivate mechanism though. What cable did you use, and how
did you install it?
Thanks,
Randy Lervold
RV-8, N558RL, painting
www.rv-8.com
I have it installed in my -8, I think it is going to be worth the weight
and it was not hard to install. There are pictures on my web page.
Jim Cimino
RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL Reserved
http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo
(570)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Degradation of Alclad Surface w/ Scotchbrite |
Todd & Marty,
Be careful, you're in a topic for which no concensus exists!
After being on this list for nearly three years now, studying everything in
the archives, discussing priming with countless people, and having finished
the airframe on my RV-8, I would indeed do exactly as Todd describes below.
Note that I did the interior of my airframe with the SW wash primer, but I'm
now using the PPG DX1791 on my outside skins prior to painting and love it.
Based on how it looks, how it shoots, and the fact that PPG does say
"excellent corrosion resistance" right in their documentation, there is no
question I will use it as my interior primer for any future planes I build
(yes, I'm sure I'll build another some day). I wish I had taken the time to
investigate it when I got started... my own stupidity as Van's did list it
as one of their suggested primers in the manual in 1997 when I started...
duh.
That said, I readily acknowledge this is NOT the ultimate in corrosion
protection and is not a true moisture barrier. The ultimate would probably
be to Scotchbrite, acid etch, alodine, and use Deft primer. But do you know
how much longer this will take? Personally, I wouldn't make the time
tradeoff unless I was building a seaplane.
And yes, I Scotchbrite before using either primer. There is no question that
it provides superior adhesion of the primer.
FWIW,
Randy Lervold
RV-8, #80500, painting
www.rv-8.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Todd Houg
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2000 9:22 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: Degradation of Alclad Surface w/ Scotchbrite
Marty,
I'm in the same position you're in right now, I've got my RV-9 HS and VS
ready for priming. I've chosen to use a PPG DX 1791 self etching wash
primer similar to the SW wash primer. PPG claims excelent corrosion
resistance and recommends cleaning, sanding and then cleaning the surface
again prior to application - surface treatment is optional (i.e. alodine).
I can't speak to the effect the scotchbrite would have on the alclad, but I
would expect it to be minimal. Even if it scuffed it all off, I would feel
better about having some bite for the primer to adhere to. I plan on using
PPG DX330 (I believe) wax and grease remover, it's designed for pre-paint
cleaning. Then a light to moderate scuffing with scotchbrite followed by
another wipe down of the cleaner. Between the scuffing and self etching
properties of the primer there should be a good solid bond.
I believe Randy Lervold has used this same approach and recommends it on
his website (http://www.rv-8.com/pgPainting.htm), maybe he'll add a few
details regarding his preperation and application (hint, hint ;).
Of course there are many opinions as to the best way to prime, but, like
you I chose a simple one application approach that I feel will suit my
needs.
Todd Houg
St. Francis, MN
RV-9A HS and VS ready to prime - starting on the rudder
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis" <mnellis(at)emailusa.net> |
| Subject: | Washer Specifications |
Can someone point me in the right direction here. Frequently in the plans
an AN washer is specified but I can't find any reference as to what type of
washer I should be looking for in my selection of washers. I can certainly
make a pretty good guess but I was hoping to be more accurate than that.
The washer that I'm questioning this time is for the bell crank bearing.
For example, in the preview plans (might not be the same on the actual
plans) calls for 5702-95-30.
Where would I go to look up that number to get the right size washer.
Mike Nellis - RV-6 Wings N699BM (res)
Plainfield, IL
http://mnellis.jnet.net/rv-6_page
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Power Monitor: was Constant speed prop |
>
>
>I concur with the things Boyd has said. Additionally, the power curves
>developed by the engine mfr are developed in a test cell and while they may
>be reduced to sea level standard conditions, are certainly done with
>different inlet and exhaust conditions than we have and while not turning an
>alternator. So we really have only a vague idea of our power available in
>our individual installations. If one could develop a torque sensing system
>that was practical and relatively inexpensive then power could be
>determined. Some time back the CAFE foundation tried a system that sensed
>pressure in the cylinder and attempted to determine power using a summation
>of the pressure variations. We've not heard much about it lately and in any
>case might lead to "indicated horsepower". It still would not address
>friction and mechanical losses. The auto racing industry is developing
>torque sensing systems using new technology but it may not be applicable to
>our systems.
>
>I believe we do not know what horsepower the propellers are receiving. I
>sure wish we did. I would appreciate someone who knows more about it than I
>do giving a little treatise on the subject.
>
>Gordon Comfort
Well, you are 100% right, but you are asking for too much. There is simply
no way you are going to know how much power your engine is producing under
all conditions with the level of technology available to you and I. Not
possible, so give up thinking about it. But, the good news is that
practically speaking, we don't really need to know the absolute amount of
power being produced. We can live quite nicely with a way to set
consistent power levels, and know relatively speaking how much our power
changes when we change conditions.
So, from a performance point of view, the manufacturer's power curves are
the best thing we will have, unless we have dyno data to use to tweak the
curves to make them better match our engine. The important thing is to be
able to consistently set the same power, so we can get predictable
performance. Also, if we measure aircraft performance under one set of
conditions, we can use the curves to help us predict aircraft performance
under another set of conditions. If our engine is stock, the
manufacturer's curves should be pretty close in predicting the percentage
increase or decrease as we change conditions, even if the absolute values
are off a bit. E.g., if our engine is a strong one, producing 5 hp more
than the nominal engine, it should still have the same percentage increase
in power for a certain change in atmospheric conditions as a stock engine
would.
Now, if you have a modified engine, the manufacturer's curves may not be as
good, but they are still better than nothing, which is the only alternative
that many people have.
Take care
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C J Heitman" <cjh(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Double flush riveting |
Before dimpling, I would run a seam roller along the edges of both skins.
This helps to keep the trailing edge tight.
As far as riveting goes, I got better results by using a long bar as a back
rivet plate and using lead shot bags to hold the entire control surface
perfectly flat while back riveting. If the surface that you are working on
is warped, you will also lock a warp into your control surface. I used this
method on my ailerons and flaps. These came out better than my rudder and
elevators. (I guess this proves that practice makes perfect.)
Now that I have my trim tab mounted, its bent trailing edge looks
out-of-place. Has anyone tried to build a trim tab using the AEX wedge?
(Perhaps this would be a strength issue since the large trim tab requires
high torsional stiffness.)
Chris Heitman
Dousman WI
RV-9A N94ME (reserved)
Fuselage kit shipped today!
http://www.execpc.com/~cjh/rv9a.html
-----Original Message-----
OK, all you RV-9A builders, what are the secret's for getting good double
flush rivets on the trailing edge's of the rudder and elevator?
I haven't started the riveting on these yet, but will be soon. Any good
pointers or suggestions?
I've read the most recent RV-ator article on this, has any one else used a
looong back rivet plate to do the entire trailing edge like thie article
recommends?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Sheet Metal Weight |
I knew I had seen it some where. Thanks Finn and Cy.....Norman........Do not
archive
> Aircraft Spruce and Specialty lists 0.0201 Aluminum 1100 sheet as
weighing
> .2834 pounds per square foot.
>
> Wicks lists 2024-T3 as being 0.291 6061-T6 as .282
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <tcwatson(at)seanet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A rear step |
Glenn,
I found an item in the archives, dated 7/23/00 I think, by abayman(at)aol.com.
He was talking about doing the same thing you are, mounting the bracket
inside the skin, but his was on a 6A. I believe he said the results were
fantastic. I will be interested to hear what you come up with.
Terry
RV-8A #80729 center section completed today
Seattle
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Sheet Metal Weight |
In a message dated 10/26/00 6:53:27 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
nhunger(at)sprint.ca writes:
<< how much one square foot of .020 weighs >>
12 in. x 12 in. x 0.020 in. x .01 lb. /cubic in. = 0.0288 lb. (app., Al.
alloys weigh 0.01 #/cubic in. +/- 0.005 #).
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, working on canopy installation
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Aerodine's Pilot Travel Guide |
> I have received in the mail an advertisement for subject book...US$41
> including S&H. Touts info on over 1300 fly-in restaurants and resorts
> among other info.
>
> Has anyone used it? Is it worth the cost?
Sounds tempting but kind of pricy. Most of those airport restaurants will be
listed in the Flight Guide...................Norman..............Do not
archive.............
________________________________________________________________________________
OOPS! now I am red faced. guess it's too late at night! What I meant to say
was 12 in. x 12 in. x 0.020 x 0.10 lb./cubic in. = 0.288 lb. Sorry!
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, working on canopy installation
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug Gray <douggray(at)ihug.com.au> |
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
| Subject: | Re: New Power Distribution Diagram |
Bob,
I have taken a look at the recent 'list posting of a circuit titled
"Z-14". I like this circuit but have some comments/questions.
Did you intend to omit the protection on the starter slave/run-on relay
contacts? I would usee a diode for the flyback voltage.
I would connect the 'hot' side of the starter slave/run-on relay
contacts (fuselink on the diagram) to the battery contactor and locate
the relay under the panel.
Is the Alternator 0 volt disconnect relay in place to add protection to
the batteries? I understand that this is a poor mans all electric panel
design but I will be installing a simple VFR type panel. If I omit the
aux battery and contactor, low volage monitor circuit and electronic
ignition, what value is there for the Alternator disconnect relay?
How have you determined the size for the fusible link wires? I saw some
information which came across my desk today which suggested 110 Amps per
square millimeter, which approximates what you are recommending, but is
this rule accurate enough?
Doug Gray
Sydney,
Australia
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Carter" <jcarter8(at)midsouth.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A rear step |
>
> listers I have an idea, but before I implement it, I
> want your input. I am wanting to mount the 8A rear
> step weldment (the square piece) on the inside of the
> fuselage and have only the step and leg showing from
> outside the fuselage. Once riveted together I will
> proseal the leg to keep moisture out. Any ideas on
> this area?
Glenn,
Great idea, but this thing was a pain for me installing it the way the plans
indicated. Also, watch out for the clearance of the inside part from the
rudder cable. Mine rubbed, and I ended up clamping a piece of rubber hose to
the tube on the step so that I would not have metal on metal.
Jerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A rear step |
10/27/2000 09:02:14 AM
Wouldn't the rivet heads still show....the RV-6 has a slew of them
there.......
"Terry Watson" (at)matronics.com on 10/27/2000 01:11:14
AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com; Please respond to "Terry Watson"
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV-8A rear step
Glenn,
I found an item in the archives, dated 7/23/00 I think, by abayman(at)aol.com.
He was talking about doing the same thing you are, mounting the bracket
inside the skin, but his was on a 6A. I believe he said the results were
fantastic. I will be interested to hear what you come up with.
Terry
RV-8A #80729 center section completed today
Seattle
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DWENSING(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: RV6 Slider Rail Fairing |
In a message dated 10/26/00 9:35:49 PM Central Daylight Time,
tcervin(at)valkyrie.net writes:
<< the Slider Rail
Fairing is no longer available >>
Please describe the fairing for me....where does it go? I may be interested.
Dale Ensing Cary Illinois
RV-6A O-360 project temporarily on hold
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)email.msn.com> |
FWIW, www.aeroplanner.com looks interesting (and its free).
Rick Jory, Highlands Ranch, CO RV8A QB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Andy <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aerodine's Pilot Travel Guide |
> I have received in the mail an advertisement for subject book...US$41
> > including S&H. Touts info on over 1300 fly-in restaurants and resorts
> > among other info.
> >
> > Has anyone used it? Is it worth the cost?
>
A couple of weeks ago I saw what I though was their web page. Sorry but I don't
remember where. (It might have been a link from somewhere in the Van's Airforce
page)
The page listed, by state, what they called "fly-in" restaurants, resorts, and
golf courses. The problem was, their definition of "fly-in" and mine are very
different. Very few are actually on the airports. Just about all of the listings
included advice on the availability of courtesy cars, taxis, or rental cars to
get you to the place that thought you were going to be able to taxi your plane
too.
Andy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Knicholas2(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Double flush riveting |
In a message dated 10/26/2000 6:33:31 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
thoug(at)ATTGLOBAL.NET writes:
> OK, all you RV-9A builders, what are the secret's for getting good double
> flush rivets on the trailing edge's of the rudder and elevator?
>
I recently finished this step and it was surprisingly easy. Just tape the
rivet in the hole (like you did with the stiffeners) and use your back rivet
set with your rivet gun on a low setting. The shop head does not "fill" the
entire dimpled hole but it is flush and doesn't look bad. I alternated the
rivets (left side, right side) to give a more balanced look. Don't stress
about this one - it was easier than some of the larger rivets in hard to
reach places!
Kim Nicholas
RV 9A - final assembly of elevators
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Amp Meter Question |
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
>
>List: I have the Vans Amp Meter and a 40 Amp Shunt. Can I run my 55 Amp
>Alternator with this setup or do I need a 60 Amp Shunt?
> Vans doesn't list a 60 Amp Shunt and I was wondering if there is a
>compatible source?
I have 60A shunts . . . how are you using the ammeter?
Is it a minus-0-plus reading meter for use as a battery
ammeter or are you going to put it in the alternator's
b-lead? How is the ammeter marked on the front? Does it
have any kind of calibration numbers that would be
misleading if you changed the shunt size?
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Ludwig" <ludwig(at)azstarnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Parking Brake |
Sorry to jump in here, Randy, but I have a tidbit for you on the cable. On
mine, I wanted to the brake to 'pull' on and push 'off'. I also wanted the
cable to come in from above instead of from the bottom. To make this
happen, I had to make a modification to the brake arm. If you want a pic,
let me know.
- Bill in Tucson
-----Original Message-----
From: Randy Lervold <randy@rv-8.com>
Date: Thursday, October 26, 2000 8:45 PM
Subject: RE: RV-List: Parking Brake
>
>Jim,
>
>Nice looking installation, very clean and simple. I don't see the beldon
>cable activate/deactivate mechanism though. What cable did you use, and how
>did you install it?
>
>Thanks,
>Randy Lervold
>RV-8, N558RL, painting
>www.rv-8.com
>
>
>I have it installed in my -8, I think it is going to be worth the weight
>and it was not hard to install. There are pictures on my web page.
>Jim Cimino
>RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL Reserved
>http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo
>(570)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ray Richardson Jr." <ray(at)powersportaviation.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Power Monitor: |
"Ray Richardson Jr."
Dear RV'ers
The engine monitor system you are requesting is
similar to the system we have developed.
With the current sensors we already have in our
stock engine package, add the next upgrade we
will not only deliver the information but we are able
to record the entire flight to be played back at any time,
Engine RPM, Throttle Position, gives us engine load, injector
open time, barometric pressure, oil temp. water temp. ect.
from this we can deliver fuel burn, GPH/GPM,
We also deliver GPS, or any other PC. program
you wish to use at the same time on a 10.4" bright screen.
Check out www.powersportaviation.com
and click on Multi-Function Display
We now have 85 hours on our RV-6A in 10 weeks
215 hp rotary engine package.
Cruise 190 mph indicated at 2300 prop speed
and exceptional climb rates.
Ray Richardson
the overly optimistic, generic manufacturers' performance tables for a
>> specific engine, and, does not take into account fuel flow info.
>> So if your engine is in any way non-standard, has more or less
>> accessories or -EXP, your getting no more than an educated guess from
>> the instrument--and that probably
>> applies to even a stock engine, given the known inaccuracies of
>> performance data tables. It's probably more accurate with a FP prop, in
>> cruise, but not in climb, because the prop is "slipping" or "stalled"
>> until it gets up to engine cruise rpm. But, if your engine's power
>>settings don't
>> exactly match the performance tables programmed in the EPM, it's still a
>> crap shoot, just easier and quicker to see than opening up your POH and
>> going to the printed tables and from what I can tell from their product
>> info, you can't adjust the engine data points to make a closer fit to
>> your engine if you notice any variables from the standard tables. Tho,
>> it "almost" sounds like you may be able to send it back to them for
>recalibration
>> if you can document any discrepancies and they can re-adjust the
>> "standard" curve that was originally installed.
>>
>>In other words, the EPM calculates the density pressure from its OAT
>>probe and a patch into the transponder encoder. But, it interpolates a
>>graph of % engine power based on data points provided by the engine
>>manufacturer and programmed into the unit. The engine performance
>>numbers are essentially an advertisement for the engine to exaggerate
>>its power vs. its fuel consumption (but the EPM doesn't include fuel
>>consumption in its "calculation") to entice more people and airframe
>>manufacturers to buy it. Typically, this is done by running the
>>engine without any accessories attached and sometimes by using blended
>>fuels that have a higher octane rating than will be used in the field
>>but are not available to the general public. They can also be run with
>>special exhaust systems and use an air intake that is non-filtered.
>>
>>Read Larry Pardue's posts on how he tried to fit his engine's
>>performance tables into the real world.
>>
>>Besides, if you're cruising along, what do you really want to know:
>>your track; your TAS; your fuel flow (gal/hr)--what does % power level
>>mean if it's not linked to fuel flow--you wanna know how long you can
>>fly at this particular power setting, whatever it is and the EPM doesn't
>>tell you that.
>>
>> IMHO, I can't see that it's worth the money.
>> Just tape the manufacturers' performance tables over the hole you'd put
>> the EPM in and have at it:)--and save $700.
>>
>> Jeez, I feel like Dennis Miller! Whoo, Whoo!!!
>I concur with the things Boyd has said. Additionally, the power curves
>developed by the engine mfr are developed in a test cell and while they may
>be reduced to sea level standard conditions, are certainly done with
>different inlet and exhaust conditions than we have and while not turning an
>alternator. So we really have only a vague idea of our power available in
>our individual installations. If one could develop a torque sensing system
>that was practical and relatively inexpensive then power could be
>determined. Some time back the CAFE foundation tried a system that sensed
>pressure in the cylinder and attempted to determine power using a summation
>of the pressure variations. We've not heard much about it lately and in any
>case might lead to "indicated horsepower". It still would not address
>friction and mechanical losses. The auto racing industry is developing
>torque sensing systems using new technology but it may not be applicable to
>our systems.
>
>I believe we do not know what horsepower the propellers are receiving. I
>sure wish we did. I would appreciate someone who knows more about it than I
>do giving a little treatise on the subject.
>
>Gordon Comfort
>N363GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob Busick" <panamared(at)brier.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6 Slider Rail Fairing |
I have one for sale. I don't need it since I made my rear canopy skirts out
of fiberglass.
Contact me off the list if you want it, $10.00 plus shiping $2.50
Bob Busick
----- Original Message -----
From: Tom & Cathy Ervin <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net>
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2000 7:40 PM
Subject: RV-List: RV6 Slider Rail Fairing
>
> List: I just got an E-Mail from Gary VanRemortel and the Slider Rail
> Fairing is no longer available do to the lack of access to a 30 ton press
> used in there manufacture.
> Gary says he will make more (Sold the original 100) if he can find
a
> press. How many other builders could use this product? Maybe with enough
> customers for Gary we could speed up the search for an available press?
> Perhaps another builder has a line on a press?
> Tom in
Ohio
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net> |
"Robert L. Nuckolls, III"
| Subject: | Re: Amp Meter Question |
Bob: 1) The Vans Amp Gauge is marked from -40 to +40 on the face.
2) Vans shows it conected to the Alternator via the shunt through
the Main Buse.
What do you think would be the best approach as I have all Vans
Gauges and want to keep my panel as is ?
Thanks Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: Robert L. Nuckolls, III <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
Sent: Friday, October 27, 2000 10:13 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Amp Meter Question
>
> >
> >List: I have the Vans Amp Meter and a 40 Amp Shunt. Can I run my 55 Amp
> >Alternator with this setup or do I need a 60 Amp Shunt?
> > Vans doesn't list a 60 Amp Shunt and I was wondering if there is
a
> >compatible source?
>
> I have 60A shunts . . . how are you using the ammeter?
> Is it a minus-0-plus reading meter for use as a battery
> ammeter or are you going to put it in the alternator's
> b-lead? How is the ammeter marked on the front? Does it
> have any kind of calibration numbers that would be
> misleading if you changed the shunt size?
>
>
> Bob . . .
> --------------------------------------------
> ( Knowing about a thing is different from )
> ( understanding it. One can know a lot )
> ( and still understand nothing. )
> ( C.F. Kettering )
> --------------------------------------------
> http://www.aeroelectric.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gordon or Marge Comfort" <gcomfo(at)tc3net.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Power Monitor: was Constant speed prop |
-From: Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca>
Date: Thursday, October 26, 2000 11:49 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Engine Power Monitor: was Constant speed prop
>>
>>I concur with the things Boyd has said. Additionally, the power curves
>>developed by the engine mfr are developed in a test cell and while they
may
>>be reduced to sea level standard conditions, are certainly done with
>>different inlet and exhaust conditions than we have and while not turning
an
>>alternator. So we really have only a vague idea of our power available in
>>our individual installations. If one could develop a torque sensing
system
>>that was practical and relatively inexpensive then power could be
>>determined. Some time back the CAFE foundation tried a system that sensed
>>pressure in the cylinder and attempted to determine power using a
summation
>>of the pressure variations. We've not heard much about it lately and in
any
>>case might lead to "indicated horsepower". It still would not address
>>friction and mechanical losses. The auto racing industry is developing
>>torque sensing systems using new technology but it may not be applicable
to
>>our systems.
>>
>>I believe we do not know what horsepower the propellers are receiving. I
>>sure wish we did. I would appreciate someone who knows more about it than
I
>>do giving a little treatise on the subject.
>>
>>Gordon Comfort
>
>
>Well, you are 100% right, but you are asking for too much. There is simply
>no way you are going to know how much power your engine is producing under
>all conditions with the level of technology available to you and I. Not
>possible, so give up thinking about it. But, the good news is that
>practically speaking, we don't really need to know the absolute amount of
>power being produced. We can live quite nicely with a way to set
>consistent power levels, and know relatively speaking how much our power
>changes when we change conditions.
>
>So, from a performance point of view, the manufacturer's power curves are
>the best thing we will have, unless we have dyno data to use to tweak the
>curves to make them better match our engine. The important thing is to be
>able to consistently set the same power, so we can get predictable
>performance. Also, if we measure aircraft performance under one set of
>conditions, we can use the curves to help us predict aircraft performance
>under another set of conditions. If our engine is stock, the
>manufacturer's curves should be pretty close in predicting the percentage
>increase or decrease as we change conditions, even if the absolute values
>are off a bit. E.g., if our engine is a strong one, producing 5 hp more
>than the nominal engine, it should still have the same percentage increase
>in power for a certain change in atmospheric conditions as a stock engine
>would.
>
>Now, if you have a modified engine, the manufacturer's curves may not be as
>good, but they are still better than nothing, which is the only alternative
>that many people have.
>
>Take care
Kevin: I understand what you are saying and perhaps I'm just dreaming, but
I'm a bit more hopeful than you. If torque sensing can be achieved it may
come down from the auto industry. The racing applications I referred to
are commented on in the Nov 2000 issue of Road and Track magazine, page
132-3. Currently torque is determined by sensing the twist in a half shaft.
A different idea involves the relationship of the magnetic properties and
the elastic properties of a shaft. Still a different idea involves the
application of a neural network to receive the inputs of various parameters,
from which network then "learns" to deliver the appropriate output. If the
auto industry finds a use for torque information then the hardware and
software might be available at a reasonable cost.
If the CAFE concept referred to earlier is functionally ok, that is, the
pressure variations can be reliably sensed and reported out, then someone
with access to a dyno might be able to calibrate the system to provide a
pretty good result--horsepower direct. If Lycoming or Continental could be
convinced to test all their production engines that way perhaps a
sufficiently large data base could be created to be useful for stock
engines.
As I said, I like to dream a bit.
Gordon
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A rear step |
| From: | Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com |
10/27/2000 01:33:57 PM
>Great idea, but this thing was a pain for me installing it the way the
plans
>indicated. Also, watch out for the clearance of the inside part from the
>rudder cable. Mine rubbed, and I ended up clamping a piece of rubber hose
to
>the tube on the step so that I would not have metal on metal.
>Jerry
Jerry: I ended up wrapping mine in UHMW tape from Van's for the same
reason.
Say, aren't all the rivets and most of the weldment covered by the flap
fairing anyway?
- Jim Andrews
RV-8A ( cowl )
O-360 Sensenich 85
N89JA reserved
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | WCruiser1(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Sheet Metal Weight |
to calculate the weight of aluminum multiply the length in inches time the
width in inches time the thickness in inches and then multiply that number by
.10.
Most aluminum densities depending on alloy are between .101 and .098 per
cubic inch.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Cimino <jcimino(at)epix.net> |
Randy,
I have yet to install a cable. The way it is located, I can easily reach
the lever by hand. All I need is some simple lock mechanism to keep it
from vibrating to the on position.
Jim Cimino
RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL Reserved
http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo
(570)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | glenn williams <willig10(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A rear step |
what I want to do is machine countersink the steel
plate and dimple the skin and use countersunk rivets
on the outside of the skin
Glenn
--- pcondon(at)csc.com wrote:
>
> Wouldn't the rivet heads still show....the RV-6 has
> a slew of them
> there.......
>
>
> "Terry Watson" (at)matronics.com
> on 10/27/2000 01:11:14
> AM
>
> Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com; Please
> respond to "Terry Watson"
>
>
> Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
>
> To: , "glenn williams"
>
> cc:
>
> Subject: Re: RV-List: RV-8A rear step
>
>
>
>
> Glenn,
>
> I found an item in the archives, dated 7/23/00 I
> think, by abayman(at)aol.com.
> He was talking about doing the same thing you are,
> mounting the bracket
> inside the skin, but his was on a 6A. I believe he
> said the results were
> fantastic. I will be interested to hear what you
> come up with.
>
> Terry
> RV-8A #80729 center section completed today
> Seattle
>
>
>
> through
>
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
> Matronics!
>
>
>
>
>
====
Glenn Williams
8A
A&P
N81GW
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A rear step |
Glen,
I'm not familar with the step on an RV-8, but that is what I did with
the step on my RV-6A. I placed the steel plate on the inside after
countersinking the holes and belveling the edges of the steel plate. So far
over two years of frequent climbs up and down and its holding up fine.
Ed Anderson
Matthews, NC
RV-6A N494BW
>
> what I want to do is machine countersink the steel
> plate and dimple the skin and use countersunk rivets
> on the outside of the skin
>
> Glenn
>
> --- pcondon(at)csc.com wrote:
> >
> > Wouldn't the rivet heads still show....the RV-6 has
> > a slew of them
> > there.......
> >
> >
> > "Terry Watson" (at)matronics.com
> > on 10/27/2000 01:11:14
> > AM
> >
> > Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com; Please
> > respond to "Terry Watson"
> >
> >
> > Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> >
> >
> > To: , "glenn williams"
> >
> > cc:
> >
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: RV-8A rear step
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Glenn,
> >
> > I found an item in the archives, dated 7/23/00 I
> > think, by abayman(at)aol.com.
> > He was talking about doing the same thing you are,
> > mounting the bracket
> > inside the skin, but his was on a 6A. I believe he
> > said the results were
> > fantastic. I will be interested to hear what you
> > come up with.
> >
> > Terry
> > RV-8A #80729 center section completed today
> > Seattle
> >
> >
> >
> > through
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> >
> > Matronics!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ====
> Glenn Williams
> 8A
> A&P
> N81GW
>
> Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | glenn williams <willig10(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A rear step |
thanks
Glenn
--- Ed Anderson wrote:
>
>
>
> Glen,
> I'm not familar with the step on an RV-8, but
> that is what I did with
> the step on my RV-6A. I placed the steel plate on
> the inside after
> countersinking the holes and belveling the edges of
> the steel plate. So far
> over two years of frequent climbs up and down and
> its holding up fine.
>
> Ed Anderson
> Matthews, NC
> RV-6A N494BW
>
>
>
> >
> > what I want to do is machine countersink the steel
> > plate and dimple the skin and use countersunk
> rivets
> > on the outside of the skin
> >
> > Glenn
> >
> > --- pcondon(at)csc.com wrote:
> > >
> > > Wouldn't the rivet heads still show....the RV-6
> has
> > > a slew of them
> > > there.......
> > >
> > >
> > > "Terry Watson"
> (at)matronics.com
> > > on 10/27/2000 01:11:14
> > > AM
> > >
> > > Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com; Please
> > > respond to "Terry Watson"
> > >
> > >
> > > Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > >
> > >
> > > To: , "glenn williams"
> > >
> > > cc:
> > >
> > > Subject: Re: RV-List: RV-8A rear step
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Glenn,
> > >
> > > I found an item in the archives, dated 7/23/00 I
> > > think, by abayman(at)aol.com.
> > > He was talking about doing the same thing you
> are,
> > > mounting the bracket
> > > inside the skin, but his was on a 6A. I believe
> he
> > > said the results were
> > > fantastic. I will be interested to hear what
> you
> > > come up with.
> > >
> > > Terry
> > > RV-8A #80729 center section completed today
> > > Seattle
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > through
> > >
> > > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> > >
> > > Matronics!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > ====
> > Glenn Williams
> > 8A
> > A&P
> > N81GW
> >
> > Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's
> FREE.
> >
> >
>
>
>
> through
>
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
> Matronics!
>
>
>
>
>
====
Glenn Williams
8A
A&P
N81GW
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6 Slider Rail Fairing |
Dale: The Canopy Fairing fits in the center and aft of the canopy to smooth
the transition when the canopy jumps up to open or down to close. Keeps side
to side motion to a minimum.
Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: <DWENSING(at)AOL.COM>
Sent: Friday, October 27, 2000 9:24 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6 Slider Rail Fairing
>
> In a message dated 10/26/00 9:35:49 PM Central Daylight Time,
> tcervin(at)valkyrie.net writes:
>
> << the Slider Rail
> Fairing is no longer available >>
> Please describe the fairing for me....where does it go? I may be
interested.
>
> Dale Ensing Cary Illinois
> RV-6A O-360 project temporarily on hold
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A rear step |
Mine is on the inside of the skin and the outside has a flairing around
where the shaft comes out of the fuselage. All rivets are flush.
I found that to get the step nuetral in the airflow, I had to twist both
steps a little. It looked to me like the step would act as a slight down
trim tab in flight without some dutch.
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
>
> I found an item in the archives, dated 7/23/00 I think, by
abayman(at)aol.com.
> He was talking about doing the same thing you are, mounting the bracket
> inside the skin, but his was on a 6A. I believe he said the results were
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A rear step |
Jerry, The UHMW tape is the way to go as it is very tough and won't wear any
where near as fast as rubber. I would use a plastic tie strap to ensure the
tape never comes off....................Norman................
> Mine rubbed, and I ended up clamping a piece of rubber hose
> to
> >the tube on the step so that I would not have metal on metal.
>
> >Jerry
>
>
> Jerry: I ended up wrapping mine in UHMW tape from Van's for the same
> reason.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Moshe Lichtman" <moshe_lichtman(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Looking to buy a RV6 or trade with my RV6A |
I have a fixed-pitch O360 RV-6A in great shape. I would like to buy or trade
with a fuel injected, constant-speed O360 RV-6. Excellent workmanship and
recent build are a must. Contact me off list if you're interested.
Thanks,
Moshe
RV-6A, 1996
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A rear step |
| From: | Scott R McDaniels <smcdaniels(at)juno.com> |
From: glenn williams <willig10(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: RV-List: RV-8A rear step
listers I have an idea, but before I implement it, I
want your input. I am wanting to mount the 8A rear
step weldment (the square piece) on the inside of the
fuselage and have only the step and leg showing from
outside the fuselage. Once riveted together I will
proseal the leg to keep moisture out. Any ideas on
this area? I will call Vans tomorrow and also talk
with My Bombardier engineers here in house to see if
this area needs to be beefed up to make this happen.
But that said I think this would be a neat way of
making this step look pretty and not such an eye sore.
What say you?
Glenn Williams
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I think you will find that after installing the step and then the
flap/fuselage intersection fairing the step "is" totally inside (of the
intersection fairing, not the fuselage) with just the leg portion
sticking out. You are probably thinking of the step installation on an
RV-6/6A.
Scott McDaniels
North Plains, OR
These opinions and ideas are my own and may not
reflect the opinions or ideas of my employer.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Pro Seal Questions!! |
Well, I started sealing one tank tonight and after reading some archives on
tank sealing I guess I misunderstood some stuff.
How long does Pro Seal last at room temp?? I was under the impression I'd
have at least 12-24 hours before it started to set up..... Well, after about
4 hours it started to set up, and after about 6 it was set up enough to be
almost unusable any further. I mixed the whole pint can figuring I had
tonight and tomorrow am to use it. I got all the ribs installed and
(hopefully) sealed to the skin, I'll buy another can and put the tank baffle
in tomorrow.
I noticed a lot of rivets are not as flush as could be. It appears that the
pro seal under the rivets prevented it to fully sit flush when bucked. Don't
get me wrong, they are flush, but round out a bit more than the other skin
rivets where there is no Pro Seal. Is this normal?
Are there any tricks putting the baffle in? I just plan to goop the stuff in
everywhere, pound the rivets, then goop more on. Sound good?? Any other
advice??
I seemed to get a lot of Pro Seal on the inside of the tank from the bucking
bar, the back of my hand, etc. is this a problem??
I Pro Sealed the tank access doubler plate and the nut plates then drove
bolts thru the nut plates to clean out. Should I use the cork gasket by
itself, or Pro Seal the cork gasket to the cover and all the bolts?? How
about the fuel float assy, should I Pro Seal it in, or just us the rubber
gasket??
Any other tips or advice would be greatly appreciated. Also any idea's on
leak checking once I finally complete it. How long should I wait until I do
leak check?
Thanks for all your help answering any or all these questions!!
-Mike
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
"'N8292W(at)AOL.COM'"(at)matronics.com
| Subject: | Pro Seal Questions!! |
Mike,
I had many of the same experiences as you. I found that the sealant set up
after about 4 hours, so I mixed only as much as I could use in about a two
hour time. The sealant under the rivets does keep the heads a little
higher. I think the problem will disappear when the plane is painted. The
heads aren't all THAT high.
The baffle seems to wipe of the sealer, so be careful when you put it in
place. Put a dot of sealer on the outside of the holes that get pulled
rivets. Then the pulled rivets will be set in goop.
Pro-seal comes off with acetone.
Steve Soule
Huntington, Vermont
-----Original Message-----
Well, I started sealing one tank tonight and after reading
some archives on
tank sealing I guess I misunderstood some stuff.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A rear step |
On the the 8A that I am building I welded half of a 1" 4130 tube were the
rudder cable would have rubbed then I applied the tape UHMW thru the releif
created by the 1" tubing so the only time the cable is in contact with the
step is when no presure is applied to the rudder pedal.
Pat 80536 the canopy is next if you would like photo's of the tube
contact off list
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Carter" <jcarter8(at)midsouth.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A rear step |
>
> Scott thanks for the input I havent gotten to the step
> as of yet but looking at the drawings I thought this
> might be a cosmetic issue. If the flap fairing covers
> this I will leave it be. Thanks again.
>
> Glenn Williams
Glenn,
To see what the step looks like, go to my page at
http://rv8asite.homestead.com/stepfairing.html. You will see that part of
the weldment on the step IS exposed outside of the fairing. There are also
a number of universal head rivets on the weldment. Ken Kruger (sp?) at Van's
told me during my installation that I could substitute flush rivets here,
but I had already installed the round ones and decided not to drill them
out. Also, he pointed out to me that the step as installed per plans is
actually different from the one on Van's prototype 8A, where the fairing
does cover the weldment.
Jerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Carroll Bird <catbird(at)taylorelectric.com> |
I Have a question. Not about RV's in particular but about flying.
Will a GPS set itself to the time being brodcast by the sattilites?
If so it should be very accurate time.
Carroll Bird RV-4 125 hours. Buffalo Gap TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro Seal Questions!! |
Mike, you might want to check out the fuel tank section in my
construction log:
http://home.HiWAAY.net/~sbuc/journal/tanks.html
You will find a way to neatly seal the rivet shop heads in the tank, and
also be introduced to fuel tank dimple dies which resolve the issue of
"slightly high" rivet heads.
Good luck with your project,
Sam Buchanan (RV-6, 205 hrs)
http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal
==================
N8292W(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
>
> Well, I started sealing one tank tonight and after reading some archives on
> tank sealing I guess I misunderstood some stuff.
>
> How long does Pro Seal last at room temp?? I was under the impression I'd
> have at least 12-24 hours before it started to set up..... Well, after about
> 4 hours it started to set up, and after about 6 it was set up enough to be
> almost unusable any further. I mixed the whole pint can figuring I had
> tonight and tomorrow am to use it. I got all the ribs installed and
> (hopefully) sealed to the skin, I'll buy another can and put the tank baffle
> in tomorrow.
>
> I noticed a lot of rivets are not as flush as could be. It appears that the
> pro seal under the rivets prevented it to fully sit flush when bucked. Don't
> get me wrong, they are flush, but round out a bit more than the other skin
> rivets where there is no Pro Seal. Is this normal?
>
> Are there any tricks putting the baffle in? I just plan to goop the stuff in
> everywhere, pound the rivets, then goop more on. Sound good?? Any other
> advice??
>
> I seemed to get a lot of Pro Seal on the inside of the tank from the bucking
> bar, the back of my hand, etc. is this a problem??
>
> I Pro Sealed the tank access doubler plate and the nut plates then drove
> bolts thru the nut plates to clean out. Should I use the cork gasket by
> itself, or Pro Seal the cork gasket to the cover and all the bolts?? How
> about the fuel float assy, should I Pro Seal it in, or just us the rubber
> gasket??
>
> Any other tips or advice would be greatly appreciated. Also any idea's on
> leak checking once I finally complete it. How long should I wait until I do
> leak check?
>
> Thanks for all your help answering any or all these questions!!
> -Mike
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com |
| Subject: | Elevator (Electric Trim Install) |
Friends,
Getting readt to install the electric trim servo to the E616 cover plate. Will
I have to trim the
z shaped supports extensively to fit? They appear quite long.
Thanks in advance!
Jack
Des Moines, IA
RV8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
I use my C-frame tool on a very sturdy workbench. When I rivet I drag it
over to a corner where it is a little stiffer. When I was riveting my main
3/16 wing spar rivets I moved out to my garage and did it on the concrete
floor. Piece of cake.
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
> I'd
> set up the c-frame and carpeted table on top of a steel
> office-type table, and so there wasn't adequate support.
> every time a blow was struck, the thin steel tabletop would
> flex, absorbing most of the energy.
> many thanks to Eric Henson for turning on the lightbulb!
> he strongly suggests using the c-frame against a concrete floor,
> which makes perfect sense, once considered!
>
> -Jon Saulsgiver
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Calvert" <rv6bldr(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro Seal Questions!! |
----- Original Message -----
From: <N8292W(at)AOL.COM>
Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2000 1:02 AM
Subject: RV-List: Pro Seal Questions!!
>
> Well, I started sealing one tank tonight and after reading some archives
on
> tank sealing I guess I misunderstood some stuff.
>
> How long does Pro Seal last at room temp?? I was under the impression I'd
> have at least 12-24 hours before it started to set up..... Well, after
about
> 4 hours it started to set up, and after about 6 it was set up enough to be
> almost unusable any further. I mixed the whole pint can figuring I had
> tonight and tomorrow am to use it. I got all the ribs installed and
> (hopefully) sealed to the skin, I'll buy another can and put the tank
baffle
> in tomorrow.
It depends on the temperature, but there is usually just a couple of hours
to use the mixture before it starts setting up. The darker the mixture, the
quicker it will set up. I started out mixing it 10 to 1 by weight and
eventually, I could eyeball it and come real close. Mix an amount that can
be used up in a couple of hours and then mix more as needed. I used lacquer
thinner to clean up messes and it works very well. I tried Sam's method of
adding a few drops of MEK to the mixture to thin it and it spread much
easier.
> I noticed a lot of rivets are not as flush as could be. It appears that
the
> pro seal under the rivets prevented it to fully sit flush when bucked.
Don't
> get me wrong, they are flush, but round out a bit more than the other skin
> rivets where there is no Pro Seal. Is this normal?
>
If you know another builder who has tank dies, you might see if you can
borrow them to do the other tank and it will take care of the proud rivet
problem.
> Are there any tricks putting the baffle in? I just plan to goop the stuff
in
> everywhere, pound the rivets, then goop more on. Sound good?? Any other
> advice??
>
Just be sure to tape off the tank skin where it will overlap the spar so
proseal doesn't get on it. Easier than trying to clean off the proseal.
Seal the blind rivet heads real well. Also, after prosealing was completed,
I placed saran wrap over the spar and screwed the tank in position on the
spar and let it set for a few days. This allowed it to cure to an exact fit
to the wing.
> I seemed to get a lot of Pro Seal on the inside of the tank from the
bucking
> bar, the back of my hand, etc. is this a problem??
>
No, clean it if you like or leave it.
> I Pro Sealed the tank access doubler plate and the nut plates then drove
> bolts thru the nut plates to clean out. Should I use the cork gasket by
> itself, or Pro Seal the cork gasket to the cover and all the bolts?? How
> about the fuel float assy, should I Pro Seal it in, or just us the rubber
> gasket??
>
Many different thoughts here. I just prosealed both sides of the gasket and
screwed it together. If the cover needs to come off, a putty knife can be
slid into the cork to break the seal. If a cork seal is not used, it would
be difficult to get apart. Some builders coat the gasket with fuel lube and
don't proseal it.
> Any other tips or advice would be greatly appreciated. Also any idea's on
> leak checking once I finally complete it. How long should I wait until I
do
> leak check?
>
> Thanks for all your help answering any or all these questions!!
> -Mike
>
>
Good luck!
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok
-6 fuselage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RE Miller <rmill2000(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator (Electric Trim Install) |
Yes Jack
Trimming is necessary and the job is a little tedious but not bad. Lots
of trial fitting.
Rob Miller
80153 Finishing
> Friends,
> Getting readt to install the electric trim servo to the E616 cover
> plate. Will I have to trim the
> z shaped supports extensively to fit? They appear quite long.
> Thanks in advance!
> Jack
> Des Moines, IA
> RV8
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)AOL.COM |
In a message dated 10/28/00 6:47:44 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
catbird(at)taylorelectric.com writes:
<< Will a GPS set itself to the time being broadcast by the satellites? >>
Yes. Many of the units need an initial rough position to be established on
startup and whenever they have been significantly moved positionally in their
off state, but will update once they capture the satellite signal(s).
-GV (RV-6A N1GV)
vanremog(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Glenn & Judi <foxinsocks(at)mediaone.net> |
| Subject: | PVA mold release |
Is PVA mold release safe to use on the acrylic canopy?
Thanks
-Glenn Gordon
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 10/28/00 9:47:49 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
catbird(at)taylorelectric.com writes:
> If so it should be very accurate time
It has an internal clock that helps it to locate the first satellite. Once it
locates one and starts receiving a signal, it gets the time from the
satellite and is very accurate. I do not remember where I picked this info up
and hope it is reliable.
Bernie Kerr , 6A 50 hours and down for painting, my painter is in the hangar
at this moment shooting final primer and will spray final paint tomorrow.
Hope to get airborne by next weekend.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ed Wischmeyer <edwisch(at)aa.net> |
| Subject: | RV-8, more than QuickBuild, for sale or trade |
RV-8, more than QuickBuild, for sale or trade
Here's a real good deal for somebody. We're trading our flying RV-4 for
an RV-8 project, but we'd prefer a nosewheel so my wife (currently a
student pilot) can move up to the RV more easily. So, we're looking to
trade the RV-8 project for a quickbuild RV-8A (or maybe an RV-6A slider
or just maybe an RV-6 slider), or maybe even sell it outright. We might
even trade up to a completed airplane.
The RV-8 has the sheet metal work beautifully done by Martin Sutter, who
has taught RV construction for Avery. Essentially all the sheet metal
work is done, whereas an out of the box QuickBuild requires you to build
the tail section, close up the wings, and do some fuselage work - and
that's all done already on this plane. The engine installation, panel,
and canopy are yet to be done. (The present canopy isn't up to the
excellence of the sheet metal and should come off, but new bubble and
skirts are included). The RV-8 also has electric trim, wiring and
lighting, and some other goodies.
In addition to the airframe, we've also got for sale:
* IO-360-A3B6D first runout from a Mooney, including
* a brand new Ayars-Demuth prop
* some "as is" instruments from a Cessna 172
* some "as is" radios -- a set of Collins nav/comms, a Cessna nav/com,
and a Northstar Loran.
But wait, there's still more! If we get in contact before November 6, we
can possibly deliver between the midwest and the northwest. Since we'll
be on the road soon, best to reply by phone, not email.
Ed Wischmeyer
425 898-9856
--
NOTE: 5% of messages sent to me don't make it, so use a return receipt to
insure delivery. The phone company system drops packets.
- - - - - - - -
Ed Wischmeyer
Web page: http://members.aa.net/~edwisch
Email: edwisch(at)alum.mit.edu
name="edwisch.vcf"
filename="edwisch.vcf"
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email;internet:edwisch(at)alum.mit.edu
fn:Ed Wischmeyer
end:vcard
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Pro Seal Questions!! |
In a message dated 10/28/00 10:47:45 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
rv6bldr(at)home.com writes:
> > I Pro Sealed the tank access doubler plate and the nut plates then drove
> > bolts thru the nut plates to clean out. Should I use the cork gasket by
> > itself, or Pro Seal the cork gasket to the cover and all the bolts?? How
> > about the fuel float assy, should I Pro Seal it in, or just us the rubber
> > gasket??
> >
>
> Many different thoughts here. I just prosealed both sides of the gasket
and
> screwed it together. If the cover needs to come off, a putty knife can be
> slid into the cork to break the seal. If a cork seal is not used, it would
> be difficult to get apart. Some builders coat the gasket with fuel lube
and
> don't proseal it.
The folks I know who went the fuel lube route eventually had leaks. I'm sure
there are those who succeeded using fuel lube, but, if you had a leak,
getting at those tank access plates once the wings are on wouldn't be fun...
Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA
RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Thomas McIntyre <bogeybrother(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Fuel tank access plate |
Here's another man' s soulition.
I used 1/16 thick paper gasket from Kragen Auto, cut to size, undersize
drilled the mounting holes and sealed with Non Hardening gasket maker.
5 years, 780 hours later no leaks yet. I pull the tanks every annual.
Good Luck
Tom McIntyre
RV3 978TM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | glenn williams <willig10(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro Seal Questions!! |
Okay before you proseal the gasket (cork ) you need to
screw it together and see if it leaks. If it does
instead of using proseal on the cork use gastight.
This way if you need back into the tank you will be
able to reuse the cork gasket. This will also work for
the fuel sender rubber gasket as well. Please do
yourself a favor and do not proseal anything that you
will need access to later on, as far as the fuel tanks
go. If you need more info e-mail me at
willig10(at)yahoo.com I do this for a living
Glenn Williams
--- KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
> In a message dated 10/28/00 10:47:45 AM Eastern
> Daylight Time,
> rv6bldr(at)home.com writes:
>
> > > I Pro Sealed the tank access doubler plate and
> the nut plates then drove
> > > bolts thru the nut plates to clean out. Should
> I use the cork gasket by
> > > itself, or Pro Seal the cork gasket to the
> cover and all the bolts?? How
> > > about the fuel float assy, should I Pro Seal it
> in, or just us the rubber
> > > gasket??
> > >
> >
> > Many different thoughts here. I just prosealed
> both sides of the gasket
> and
> > screwed it together. If the cover needs to come
> off, a putty knife can be
> > slid into the cork to break the seal. If a cork
> seal is not used, it would
> > be difficult to get apart. Some builders coat
> the gasket with fuel lube
> and
> > don't proseal it.
>
> The folks I know who went the fuel lube route
> eventually had leaks. I'm sure
> there are those who succeeded using fuel lube, but,
> if you had a leak,
> getting at those tank access plates once the wings
> are on wouldn't be fun...
>
>
> Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA
> RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth
>
>
>
> through
>
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
> Matronics!
>
>
>
>
>
====
Glenn Williams
8A
A&P
N81GW
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
>
> I Have a question. Not about RV's in particular but about flying.
>
> Will a GPS set itself to the time being brodcast by the sattilites?
> If so it should be very accurate time.
>
> Carroll Bird RV-4 125 hours. Buffalo Gap TX
>
The GPS time will set itself but that does not mean the displayed time is
very accurate. One reason is that sometimes the time display is given a low
priority in the software that makes it lag. It can easily display a time
that is more than a second off.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Sears <sears(at)searnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: OK... I'm stumped... |
>So how about I mount the rear tie down on the aft side of the F-811
>bulkhead instead of the F-812, and use the existing hole instead of
>drilling another one? It would be real easy to do...
My -6A has the ring attached to the -811. I got a kit from the
Orndorffs. It's a block of aluminum and a tie down ring.
The only problem I've had with this placement was when I stalled
about a foot off the runway and banged the tail. I'd never done
something like that before and thought I'd torn the tail off it. I had hit
the ring and took some paint off the rudder. That was it. Had the
ring been placed on the -812, I would not have hurt the rudder skin;
but, I may have bent the ring enough to jamb the rudder. Needless
to say, I analyzed what I did wrong and fixed that problem. My pride
was hurt far more than the airplane. Anyway, I'd mount it on the -811
and be happy with it. Be sure to use a good ring, though. Those
cheap hardware store rings are too soft. Remember, you may bang
the tail. :-)
BTW, the reason I banged the tail was that I was looking down the
side of the airplane instead of over the top of the panel. I had let that
little habit slip in and hadn't paid any attention to it. By doing that, I
had let the nose come up too far during those final feet and got that
stall just before touch down. The tail came down quickly. If one
keeps his eyes over the panel, it doesn't happen. Once I realized
what I did wrong, I never let that happen again.
Jim Sears in KY
RV-6A N198JS (74.8 on the tach)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | EARL FORTNER <e.fortner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | RV4 motormount platenuts |
On the RV4 top longeron where the motormount is attached with rivets
do you also install a platenut for the front of F421 front top deck?
Would it be OK to just leave the four inches or so unsecured?
Earl RV4
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gardner, Douglas (GA01)" <douglas.gardner(at)honeywell.com> |
"Gardner, Douglas (GA01)"
Glenn.. My -8A weldment was not perfectly formed to match the curvature
of the outside skin. I had to make some very custom spacers to fit between
the weldment and skin. I don't think I could have kept that outside skin
straight by mounting the step through the inside. make sure it matched the
curve first. I sure would not like to tear that skin. FWIW.
Doug Gardner #80717 Final wiring
Palm harbor Fla.
-----Original Message-----
From: glenn williams [mailto:willig10(at)yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2000 11:02 PM
Subject: RV-List: RV-8A rear step
listers I have an idea, but before I implement it, I
want your input. I am wanting to mount the 8A rear
step weldment (the square piece) on the inside of the
fuselage and have only the step and leg showing from
outside the fuselage. Once riveted together I will
proseal the leg to keep moisture out. Any ideas on
this area? I will call Vans tomorrow and also talk
with My Bombardier engineers here in house to see if
this area needs to be beefed up to make this happen.
But that said I think this would be a neat way of
making this step look pretty and not such an eye sore.
What say you?
Glenn Williams
====
Glenn Williams
8A
A&P
N81GW
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Lawson <jwlawson(at)hargray.com> |
| Subject: | Information on washers and other hardware...Skybolt |
Aeromotive...cowling fasteners
RV-List Digest Server
When I was looking for a source for dimpled platenuts, a member of the RV list
suggested I contact
Skybolt Aeromotive http://www.skybolt.com . I called them, they were very helpful (even tho the order
was miniscule). I'd recommend calling them if you have any hardware needs or questions,
they also
sell sheet-metal tools.
Another lister was looking for a good reference on washers. I'd suggest getting
Skybolt's catalog,
they have a drawing of each piece of hardware they sell (VERY handy!). They also
sell a wide range of
fasteners (again, with a drawing for each), it'd be a good resource for anyone
needing a graphic to
distinguish between types of hardware.
And finally...they have cowling fastener kits for production aircraft and for RV-4s,
6s, and 8s. I
was curious...has anyone used one of these kits on their project, and if so, how
the fasteners are
working out? The catalog shows how they were installed on an RV-4 cowling, complete
with photos. The
installation looked pretty good to me, but I'm not much of a judge, since I'm still
working on the
tail control surfaces.
Semper Fi
John
RV-6 (progress temporarily halted on those control surfaces...in-laws in town...)
PS 12 more days till the Marine Corps Birthday!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV4 motormount platenuts |
In a message dated 10/29/00 4:15:38 AM Pacific Standard Time,
e.fortner(at)worldnet.att.net writes:
> On the RV4 top longeron where the motormount is attached with rivets
> do you also install a platenut for the front of F421 front top deck?
> Would it be OK to just leave the four inches or so unsecured?
> Earl RV4
>
>
>
Earl, I just drilled and tapped those holes 8-32, it works fine.
Fred LaForge RV-4 EAA Tech C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bcbraem(at)home.com |
| Subject: | Canopy Open in Flight |
Gentle Listers:
I can happily(???) report that a well built and installed RV-6 slider
canopy can be flow in the open position | Date: | Oct 29, 2000 |
| From: | Ed Wischmeyer <edwisch(at)aa.net> |
| Subject: | Need shipping box for IO-360 |
Folks -
Anybody got a shipping box for an IO-360, as it comes from Lycoming?
Need one pretty quick!
thanks
Ed Wischmeyer
--
NOTE: 5% of messages sent to me don't make it, so use a return receipt to
insure delivery. The phone company system drops packets.
- - - - - - - -
Ed Wischmeyer
Web page: http://members.aa.net/~edwisch
Email: edwisch(at)alum.mit.edu
name="edwisch.vcf"
filename="edwisch.vcf"
begin:vcard
n:Wischmeyer;Ed
tel;fax:425 898-9566
tel;home:425 898-9856
adr:;;;;;;
version:2.1
email;internet:edwisch(at)alum.mit.edu
fn:Ed Wischmeyer
end:vcard
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Pro-seal questions!! |
I cleaned the area around the cover as well as the top edge of the cover
with lacquer thinner then installed the cork gasket dry and screwed the
cover down as tight as possible without putting waves in it. Then put a
small bead of pro-seal around the edge of the cover, just enough to seal the
cover to the tank like 1/4 inch wide, then a small amount around each screw
head
Had the covers off two years later when I had the slosh problem. All that
was involved to remove the covers was to cut through the proseal around the
edge into the cork gasket with a razor blade knife and clean enough off the
heads of the screws to be able to turn them out with the screw driver and
reinstalled them using a new gasket and same method. This has worked well
for me, tanks have been in service since 1992 without any leaks.
Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV8DRIVER(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Pro-seal questions!! |
After tank construction, I installed the cover plates with just the cork
composition gasket, no sealer of any kind. The assembly was air-tested at
2psi (enough to slightly bulge the bottom of the tank between the ribs) over
night with out loss of pressure. Since air will leak from a joint that
gasoline won't due to the difference in molecular size, I'm confident in
believing that no sealer is necessary. Andy Johnson, fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle) |
yak-list(at)matronics.com, rv6-list(at)matronics.com, rv8-list(at)matronics.com
| Subject: | List REPLY-TO Fuction Restored... |
Hi Listers,
I noticed a bit of discussion on the List regarding how the Reply-To
field was working and there appeared to be some confusion. A couple of
months ago I got this great idea to change the way the Reply-To email
header was configured so that when a person did a Reply to a message
they received from the List, it would by default go back to 1) The List,
and 2) the Poster. This would mean in most cases the poster would get
two copies of the message. The reason it seemed like a good idea was in
the case where someone posted a message to another list that they
weren't subscribed to, they would still get a reply back. (You only
have to be subscribed to one List to be able to post to any of them.)
Anyway, it seemed like a good idea at the time, but it seems to have
caused a lot more confusion than it was worth. So, I've returned the
configuration back to the way it used to be where a reply will just go
back to the List.
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
--
Matt G. Dralle | Matronics | P.O. Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 Voice | 925-606-6281 FAX | dralle(at)matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ W.W.W. | Featuring Products For Aircraft
Great minds discuss ideas,
Average minds discuss events,
Small minds discuss people...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Bauman <303print(at)northrim.net> |
| Subject: | Subaru EJ25 SOHC 165 hp |
I'm not an RV'er, but thought I would pass this along.
http://www.geocities.com/subarustork/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BPattonsoa(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Pro-seal questions!! |
I used fuel lube on the cork gasket, and the fuel sender. There was leakage
from the start. I used stainless allen head screws with washers to hold on
the cover, so am able to get to the screws with the wing root cover removed.
The minor leakage was solved by going over the screws in the area of the
leak, very carefully increasing the torque. After several tries the leakage
was stopped.
Not using Pro Seal was a wonderful thing when my right fuel tank float sank
and I had to remove the tank and fuel sender. I had to go over the screws
several times to stop all the leaks.
In my opinion (a dangerous statement), the fuel tank cover needs a doubler,
about 3/4-1 inch wide to distribute the pressure from the screws. It should
be Pro Sealed to the cover, and then a generous coating of fuel lube used on
the gasket. They you could just torque up the screws and forget all the
problems.
Bruce Patton
-6A 596S
160 hours and climbing fast
s
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill VonDane" <n8vd(at)peoplepc.com> |
| Subject: | -8A Rear Tie-down... |
Hi all... I decided I didn't want to waste a perfectly good hole and drill
another for the rear tie-down, so I decided to move it from the F-812 to the
F-811...
I made the tie-down mount as per the plans exept that the threaded AL block
is flush with the aft side of the bracket (away from the -811), and mounted
it to the -811 instead of the -812. I will mount it using 470AD4 rivets...
I will probably make a doubler for the -812 where the VS mounts at the
bottom where the bolts go through becasue normally you would have either the
tailwheel weldment or the tie-down brackets there to act as a doubler...
I will put some pictures on my web site on Monday, but for now I have posted
a couple pictures here:
http://www.egroups.com/files/rv8list/-8A+Rear+Tie-down+Mod/
Bill VonDane, Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A, N8VD, Fuselage
http://vondane.com/rv8a/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Lawson <jwlawson(at)hargray.com> |
| Subject: | RV-6 Trim Tab construction |
RV-List Digest Server
I've seen or received a couple of suggestions that when building the trim tab,
to fabricate ribs for
the ends of it, vice bending the ends down (I'd surmise that you'd have to do the
same to the outboard
end of the trim tab cutout for the elevator). I've found the previous messages
on this subject in the
archives, and I'm not quite clear on several items...
1) OK to go with .020 thickness aluminum for the ribs? Or should I use .032?
2) Better to go with flanges out, or flanges in?
3) If it's "flanges in", what type of pop rivets?
John Lawson
RV-6 (tail control surface stuff)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New Power Distribution Diagram |
>
>Bob,
>
>I have taken a look at the recent 'list posting of a circuit titled
>"Z-14". I like this circuit but have some comments/questions.
>
>Did you intend to omit the protection on the starter slave/run-on relay
>contacts? I would use a diode for the flyback voltage.
I've modified the diagram to consider data published
in the article on spike-catcher diodes. You might wish
to retrieve the latest version.
>I would connect the 'hot' side of the starter slave/run-on relay
>contacts (fuselink on the diagram) to the battery contactor and locate
>the relay under the panel.
I'd put the relay as close to the starter as practical . . . it
wouldn't hurt it to be out on the firewall with the fusible
link at the starter. However if your battery contactor and
battery are on the forward side of the firewall, then what you
propose is 6 of one, half dozen of the other. While fusible links
WILL do the job of clearing hard faults in wiring, they DO smoke
and the more we can keep them out of the cabin, the better.
Having said that, understand also that the probability of that
fusible link EVER having to carry out the task if clearing a
fault is VERY low given the modern materials, and the care
with which I'm sure you will install and maintain it.
>
>Is the Alternator 0 volt disconnect relay in place to add protection to
>the batteries? I understand that this is a poor mans all electric panel
>design but I will be installing a simple VFR type panel. If I omit the
>aux battery and contactor, low volage monitor circuit and electronic
>ignition, what value is there for the Alternator disconnect relay?
No, the alternator disconnect relay is to protect the rest of
the electrical system in an OV condition. Do you NEED all of the
features of Z-14 . . . have you looked over features of other
diagrams in Appendiz Z?
>How have you determined the size for the fusible link wires? I saw some
>information which came across my desk today which suggested 110 Amps per
>square millimeter, which approximates what you are recommending, but is
>this rule accurate enough?
A fusible link is a weak link in an electrical "chain" . . . as a
rull of thumb, the link is 4AWG wire steps or more SMALLER than
the wire to be protected. My personal preference is that no system
use a fusible link larger than 20AWG in size and 22 is better. These
are for special cases where we would enjoy the extra reliablity and
lower parts count for special cases . . . like the alternate feed
to the E-bus where a 22AWG link on an 18AWG or fatter wire makes
more sense than an in-line fuse. Or, as I've shown on Z-14 protecting
a very short and preferably under-the-cowl starter circuit.
Where are you contemplating the use of a fusible link in your
airplane?
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro-seal questions!! |
> I cleaned the area around the cover as well as the top edge of the cover
> with lacquer thinner then installed the cork gasket dry and screwed the
> cover down as tight as possible without putting waves in it. Then put a
> small bead of pro-seal around the edge of the cover, just enough to seal
the
> cover to the tank like 1/4 inch wide, then a small amount around each
screw
> head
>
Great idea, the best one I've heard yet. However, lacquer thinner should be
avoided, as it contains a small amount of some sort of oil. Better is
acetone or naphtha.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
6A
------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $7.99/mo! ------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Pro-seal questions!! |
>Since air will leak from a joint that
> gasoline won't due to the difference in molecular size, I'm confident in
> believing that no sealer is necessary
Air doesn't change the gasket like fuel will. Also, the compressive
pressure on the cork will decay over time. Seems like others have done what
you did and have had problems later. Additionally, fuel is motivated to
"crawl" into small gaps due to capillary forces. Eustace's solution is the
best one I've heard yet, I'm going to do it.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
6A
------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $7.99/mo! ------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorton(at)cyberus.ca> |
>
>I hope I don't come across as a nut case here but I could use some advice.
>I am having a grand time building the tail section of an RV9-A. (Wings are
>on order) I am an expert woodworker - so I am not new to tools or
>craftsmanship. However, as I build this plane I catch myself becoming
>paranoid about the quality and safety of what I am doing. With each hole I
>drill and rivit I place, following the plans to the letter, I get tense that
>if I screw up, someone could die. Is this normal? Will it settle down as I
>get more into the project? I am trying to get a local EAA tech. advisor to
>check out my work but logistics have been a problem so far. Has anyone else
>felt this way or should we all just pretend that I never posted this and I'll
>crawl back to the shop.....
>
>Kim Nicholas
>Seattle
>
Well, you do want to exercise a reasonable amount of care, especially
on highly stressed parts (spars, etc). But, over 2500 RVs have been
completed, by people of varying backgrounds, with varying quality.
These things aren't falling from the sky, so I have to conclude that
the basic design has enough margin to tolerate typical builder errors.
Now, as to whether your concerns are normal or not - I'm not a
psychologist. Given that we all want to live a nice long time, I
would say it is normal to fret over the imperfections in our work.
But, given what I said in my first paragraph, I think we have to keep
things in perspective.
If you can't get together with the tech counsellor, maybe you can
find a couple of local experienced RV builders to look things over.
Get back in the shop,
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (fuselage 95% done)
Ottawa, Canada
http://eccentrix.com/misc/rv8/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RE Miller <rmill2000(at)yahoo.com> |
Come now Kim, what's the worst that could happen? . . . Your right, but
that's gonna happen sooner or later anyway. Don't let the fear of dying
keep you from living.
Rob Miller
Finishing (carefully) ;)
--- Knicholas2(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
> I hope I don't come across as a nut case here but I could use some
> advice.
> I am having a grand time building the tail section of an RV9-A. (Wings
> are
> on order) I am an expert woodworker - so I am not new to tools or
> craftsmanship. However, as I build this plane I catch myself becoming
> paranoid about the quality and safety of what I am doing. With each
> hole I
> drill and rivit I place, following the plans to the letter, I get tense
> that
> if I screw up, someone could die. Is this normal? Will it settle down
> as I
> get more into the project? I am trying to get a local EAA tech. advisor
> to
> check out my work but logistics have been a problem so far. Has anyone
> else
> felt this way or should we all just pretend that I never posted this and
> I'll
> crawl back to the shop.....
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
"RV List"
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Amp Meter Question |
>Bob: 1) The Vans Amp Gauge is marked from -40 to +40 on the face.
> 2) Vans shows it conected to the Alternator via the shunt through
>the Main Buse.
If this instrument (set up to be a -0+ battery ammeter) is
connected as you describe, then it will allways read only
on the + side of the scale to show present alternator load.
This instrument was designed to be a battery ammeter . . . which
is not practical to use with any of the wiring diagrams we've
published.
> What do you think would be the best approach as I have all Vans
>Gauges and want to keep my panel as is ?
>
You can wire your airplane like a Cessna 172 - insert the ammeter
shunt in the feedwire between the bus and the battery . . . you'll
also have to bring your alternator b-lead feeder into the cockpit
for attachement to the bus.
You you can use the instrument as an alternator loadmeter as you
described and leave the 40A shunt in place. It will read off scale
+ on some occasions when the alternator is working hard to charge
the battery but it won't hurt it.
Bob . . .
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Robert L. Nuckolls, III <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
>To: ; Tom & Cathy Ervin
>Sent: Friday, October 27, 2000 10:13 AM
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Amp Meter Question
>
>
>
>>
>> >
>> >List: I have the Vans Amp Meter and a 40 Amp Shunt. Can I run my 55 Amp
>> >Alternator with this setup or do I need a 60 Amp Shunt?
>> > Vans doesn't list a 60 Amp Shunt and I was wondering if there is
>a
>> >compatible source?
>>
>> I have 60A shunts . . . how are you using the ammeter?
>> Is it a minus-0-plus reading meter for use as a battery
>> ammeter or are you going to put it in the alternator's
>> b-lead? How is the ammeter marked on the front? Does it
>> have any kind of calibration numbers that would be
>> misleading if you changed the shunt size?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com> |
--- Knicholas2(at)AOL.COM wrote:
>
> I hope I don't come across as a nut case here but I could use some
> advice.
> I am having a grand time building the tail section of an RV9-A.
> (Wings are
> on order) I am an expert woodworker - so I am not new to tools or
> craftsmanship. However, as I build this plane I catch myself
> becoming
> paranoid about the quality and safety of what I am doing.
Fear not, Kim, you are normal.
The empennage kit is a great place to find out about ourselves: Can we
read plans, follow directions, be patient, and ask for help when
necessary.
I would suggest that the person who blows through one of these kits and
_doesn't_ have the concerns you voice is the _really_ dangerous one!
Getting a Technical Counselor to visit is the best first step. When
they look at work you thought was marginal, and tell you you're "doing
OK, keep at it" - well, that does wonders for the confidence. Even
another builder (a little more experienced) can address this by
stopping by and visiting.
You will learn what to sweat and what not to. When to re-do and when a
so-so rivet is OK.
I'm a part-time cabinet maker myself, and believe me - if you can do a
nice entertainment center or chest-of-drawers where the face frames are
flush, the drawers don't bind and the carcass is square, you can build
this plane!
Your woodworking standards are much higher than necessary for these
projects... you may be getting frustrated that you can't meet them in
metal. It's a different medium and you'll have to learn to work it in
a different way.
BTDT!!!
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX
-6 N140RV (Reserved)
Fuselage
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
>I hope I don't come across as a nut case here but I could use some advice.
>I am having a grand time building the tail section of an RV9-A. (Wings are
>on order) I am an expert woodworker - so I am not new to tools or
>craftsmanship. However, as I build this plane I catch myself becoming
>paranoid about the quality and safety of what I am doing. With each hole I
>drill and rivit I place, following the plans to the letter, I get tense
that
>if I screw up, someone could die. Is this normal?
I open my weekend seminars with the observation that amateur
airplane builders are fabricating the finest airplanes to have
ever flown. I support that statment as follows:
The folk pounding rivets on an assembly line of an airplane
factory would love to be doing anything DIFFERENT that what
they are doing now. If something gets bent, a little whack here
or some prybar there might make that rivet go into the hole
with a few SMALL hammer whacks . . . if someting breaks,
two supervisors and three inspectors will stand around discussing
the MINIMUM effort needed to LEAGALY push that airplane out the
door.
I've visted some builder's shops where the airplane under
construction had some pretty scary craftsmanship . . . further,
the builder was making modifications to "correct some perceived
screwups in the original design." I'm pleased to note that after
10 or 12 years, those airplanes are STILL under construction
and not much further along than when I last saw them.
You guys are doing a good job because you DO worry. If you don't
know about some aspect of the task, you get on the list, call
another bulder, call the factory, etc. etc. IF and WHEN your
airplane breaks ground for the first time, the MAJOR risks
to it's success will be from silly mistakes (cotter key left
out, fuel line fitting not tightened, pilot skills poorly
adapted to type, etc.) . . . your risk to suffering an
consequence of poor craftsmanship is nil.
The mechanics of putting an airplane together is very conducive
to the "look and feel" method of inspection. If it's smooth,
went together without hammering or sawing, then the completed
task is 100% likely to meet the intent of the designer.
It's right that you question what you don't understand. At some
time in the past we were all right where you are. You're
in right crowd for acquiring understanding and your going
to do just fine. At some time in the future, I predict
your biggest "worry" is picking the right color scheme for
paint and upholstery . . . after all you don't want a machine
of this caliber pulling up to the ramp looking like a teenager's
street rod . . .
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Canopy Open in Flight |
In a message dated 10/29/00 7:01:58 AM Pacific Standard Time,
bcbraem(at)home.com writes:
<< I can happily(???) report that a well built and installed RV-6 slider
canopy can be flow in the open position >
O.K., I have to ask, was it open when you took off or just unlatched and if
unlatched how far did it open?
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, working on canopy installation
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 10/29/00 9:06:16 AM Pacific Standard Time,
Knicholas2(at)AOL.COM writes:
<< Is this normal? >>
Sounds pretty normal to me. I think you will be amazed later on how your
confidence will increase as you gain more experience working with aluminum
aircraft structures. Being cautious and trying to do the job well beats the
heck out of an "oh well, thats probably good enough" attitude. The life you
save may well be your own
:-).
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, working on canopy installation
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Pro-seal questions!! |
I used fuel lube on the gasket. It passed the soapy water & balloon leak
test. Two weeks later I had two open them up to install the anti-roation
bracket -- I was glad I hadn't used proseal. Hopefully they will hold up
once flying....
Larry Bowen
RV-8 fuse
Email: Larry(at)BowenAero.com
Web: http://BowenAero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
Yo Kim,
You will get used to doing aircraft quality work and lose that awful
sensation. After a few years of making parts (and throwing away some of
them) you will become somewhat confident. At that point, in my opinion, you
may begin to be dangerous. Make every little piece to aircraft standards
and the big picture should take care of itself.
"Aircraft quality" and "aircraft standard" is not the same as "perfection."
I read a quote from a Russian general that "better is the enemy of good
enough." I didn't understand what that meant until I started this project.
In the beginning I felt like you do now. Then I learned that all I had to
do was to follow the plans and FAA Bible. Those documents set the standard
for our planes. If your work meets the aircraft standard, then it is good
enough, you're finished and you should move on to the next step.
Steve Soule
Five years into the RV-6A
Trial fitting wings to rig the plane and watching the snow come down in
Huntington, Vermont
-----Original Message-----With each hole I
drill and rivit I place, following the plans to the letter, I get tense
that
if I screw up, someone could die. Is this normal? Will it settle down as I
get more into the project?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Burch" <rv6man(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: PVA mold release |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn & Judi" <foxinsocks(at)mediaone.net>
Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2000 2:30 PM
Subject: RV-List: PVA mold release
>
> Is PVA mold release safe to use on the acrylic canopy?
>
> Thanks
> -Glenn Gordon
>
> Glenn, I wouldnt try it. If you are trying to use it to release
The fiberglass fairing, here is what I do. First , put down good 3M
masking tape.
Then, put down clear packing tape. The glue on the packing tape is to
aggressive.
That is the reason for the masking tape. Make sure it is high quality 3M
tape or it will leave a residue.
Terry
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mark Steffensen" <steffco1(at)home.com> |
Lister's,
I am continuing to work on decreasing the overall drag on my 8A.
I flew the test period with just the main wheel pants on & have since added
all of the intersection & main gear fairings & the nose wheel pant. I have
seen my indicated airspeeds rise from 150kts to 178kts, true airspeed
depends on conditions etc, but I have seen 185kts. I am finding speeds very
close to the CAFE 8A report in Sport Aviation.
Before I go to paint, I want to make all the mod necessary to reduce as
much drag as possible. I today constructed rudder cable fairings as were
described in the Rvator. I will report on performance gain once finished.
I have a IO360 A1A spinning a Hartzell up front. I have good oil temps 180 -
210 & I think low CHT's, 300 - 325 degrees, in the summer CHT 350 degrees. I
am thinking of reducing the size of the cool air intakes in the cowl
similar to the Sam James design. Does anyone know what the advertised speed
gain is for his cowl?
I have 2 antenna's on the belly, Com & transponder blade. I don't plan on
changing those. I have a cat whisker in the VS for the ILS & GS, & will
leave it as is.
Has anyone experimented with gap seals, or air seals & can report on gains.
Is there any measurable gains from a unpainted airframe to finished filled &
painted.
Thanks...........Mark
Mark Steffensen
8A Dallas, TX 62 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis" <mnellis(at)emailusa.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6 Trim Tab construction |
John, I couldn't bend those tabs sharp and crisp without cracking the
corners so I went ahead and made some ribs along with some other mods to the
trim.
They can be seen here. http://mnellis.jnet.net/RV-6_Page/elevator_4.htm
Dennis Persyk made his own ribs as well and there is a picture here:
http://mnellis.jnet.net/RV-6_Page/images/DCP00835.JPG
I used .020 and placed the ribs with the flange towards the outside. I
chose this was because......well, just because! I don't think it matters
either way, it's whatever floats your boat. With the flanges out you
obviously have to use blind rivets and I chose to dimple and use a flush
"pop" rivet (can't remember the number off the top of my head). I also
chose to use the blind rivets because every time I try to use solid rivets
at the end of ribs I screw things up.
>
> I've seen or received a couple of suggestions that when building the trim
tab, to fabricate ribs for
> the ends of it, vice bending the ends down (I'd surmise that you'd have to
do the same to the outboard
> end of the trim tab cutout for the elevator). I've found the previous
messages on this subject in the
> archives, and I'm not quite clear on several items...
>
> 1) OK to go with .020 thickness aluminum for the ribs? Or should I use
.032?
> 2) Better to go with flanges out, or flanges in?
> 3) If it's "flanges in", what type of pop rivets?
>
> John Lawson
> RV-6 (tail control surface stuff)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8 Speed Mods |
--- Mark Steffensen wrote:
>
> Lister's,
>
> I am continuing to work on decreasing the overall drag on my 8A.
Mark,
There is a very good book from which you might get some ideas:
Speed with Economy
By Kent Paser.
http://www.buildersbooks.com/speed_with_economy.htm
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX
-6 N140RV (Reserved)
Fuselage
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8 Speed Mods |
>
>Is there any measurable gains from a unpainted airframe to finished filled
>&
>painted.
>
>Thanks...........Mark
>
>Mark Steffensen
>8A Dallas, TX 62 hours
>
Mark,
I can't comment on most of your questions, but the before and after paint I
can. I found no difference at all. It just LOOKS faster...which is worth
something I suppose. ;) Randy Lervold should have some speed data pretty
soon with Sam James cowl. Get busy Randy!
Brian Denk
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dave ford" <dford(at)michweb.net> |
"RV-List Digest Server"
| Subject: | storing engine parts |
I have a disassembled O360 that I will be storing until assembly winter of
2001--one year plus. Its been recommended to oil up crankshaft, rods,
lifters for this length of storage. Is there a particular oil I should use?
I know some leave a waxy oil film--is there a brand one could recommend?
Dave Ford
RV6 fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug Gray <douggray(at)ihug.com.au> |
> Will a GPS set itself to the time being brodcast by the sattilites?
> If so it should be very accurate time.
>
"Very accurate time"...this is a relative term, difficult to know how
accurate you mean.
The receiver will set itself to GPS time which is very accurate but
differs from UTC (the world time-stamp) by varying amounts. I would
suppose that the difference is constant but would step when leap seconds
are added to UTC or when the GPS time corrections are applied.
Doug Gray
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaskuss(at)miami.gdi.net> |
| Subject: | Re: storing engine parts |
Dave
I would suggest using a product called LPS-3. This product sprays on (aerosol
can) as a thin oil to penatrate tight areas. It then sets up as a waxy grease,
similar to motorcycle chain lube (which also works well). This will stay on the
parts for extended periods much better than motor oils. LPS-3 can be found at
quality hardware stores.
Charlie Kuss
RV-8A hanging ailerons & flaps
Boca Raton, Fl.
dave ford wrote:
>
> I have a disassembled O360 that I will be storing until assembly winter of
> 2001--one year plus. Its been recommended to oil up crankshaft, rods,
> lifters for this length of storage. Is there a particular oil I should use?
> I know some leave a waxy oil film--is there a brand one could recommend?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gummos" <tg1965(at)linkline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy Open in Flight |
Boyd,
(For the Hard core RV's, please delete NOW.) Flying story to follow!
I haven't any real experience with open cockpit flying but I had my
backseater lose his canopy on T.O. in the F-4G. He was pretty scaried for a
couple of minutes as we had a backseater killed a couple of months earlier,
when he lost his canopy and the wind ripped open the parachute bag (It was
not installed properly.) and pulled him out while still strapped in the
seat.
However, I knew all was well when I saw him playing with the wind like a kid
does by sticking his hand into the wind out the window while a car is
driving down the road. It was just a pain to slow flight for about an hour
to burn down the gas to a point that I could safely land.
Of course, it was my fault that the GIB (Guy in Back) didn't check his
canopy to insure it was closed properly. It is the USAF way to always blame
the pilot for everything. Did the Wing Commander really believe that I
would T.O. if I saw a warning light on?
Anyway, glad you didn't have an control problems or lose control while
trying to fix the problem.
Work continues on my RV-4S. If you get out here after X-mas 2000, please
stop by and we will have to do some side-by-side comparisons (my IO-540 is
stock 250 HP, so it may not be a real test of your RV-S6).
Tom Gummo
Apple Valley, CA
Hoping to fly by X-mas 2000, down to those last few tasks which take forever
to complete.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Bower" <rvbuilder(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator (Electric Trim Install) |
Jack,
You will probably need to trim some material off those supports; I did.
Also, I had to cut some slots in the doubler that gets riveted inside the
skin. I ran the trim servo up and back, and made sure I could remove the
servo and cover assembly no matter what position the servo rod was in. If I
hadn't cut those slots and my servo motor died in a fully extended position,
it would have been impossible to remove it. Food for thought.
Jim Bower
St. Louis
RV-6A Wings
>From: pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com, pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Elevator (Electric Trim Install)
>Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2000 09:58:31 -0400 (EDT)
>
>
>Friends,
>Getting readt to install the electric trim servo to the E616 cover plate.
>Will I have to trim the
>z shaped supports extensively to fit? They appear quite long.
>Thanks in advance!
>Jack
>Des Moines, IA
>RV8
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV8 Speed Mods |
10/30/2000 09:15:20 AM
On your quest for drag reduction.......gap seals are frequently mis-used on
RV's. At Oshgosh and other fly-ins I've seen RV's with gap sealing tape
over the aileron upper surface wing gap or riveted extentions to the
aileron to seal this gap.......This aileron in a Freese (speeeling ?) type
and is required to have this gap. I am not implying that you are going to
seal this gap seal
"Mark Steffensen" (at)matronics.com on 10/29/2000 06:37:44
PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV-List: RV8 Speed Mods
Lister's,
I am continuing to work on decreasing the overall drag on my 8A.
I flew the test period with just the main wheel pants on & have since added
all of the intersection & main gear fairings & the nose wheel pant. I have
seen my indicated airspeeds rise from 150kts to 178kts, true airspeed
depends on conditions etc, but I have seen 185kts. I am finding speeds very
close to the CAFE 8A report in Sport Aviation.
Before I go to paint, I want to make all the mod necessary to reduce as
much drag as possible. I today constructed rudder cable fairings as were
described in the Rvator. I will report on performance gain once finished.
I have a IO360 A1A spinning a Hartzell up front. I have good oil temps 180
-
210 & I think low CHT's, 300 - 325 degrees, in the summer CHT 350 degrees.
I
am thinking of reducing the size of the cool air intakes in the cowl
similar to the Sam James design. Does anyone know what the advertised speed
gain is for his cowl?
I have 2 antenna's on the belly, Com & transponder blade. I don't plan on
changing those. I have a cat whisker in the VS for the ILS & GS, & will
leave it as is.
Has anyone experimented with gap seals, or air seals & can report on gains.
Is there any measurable gains from a unpainted airframe to finished filled
&
painted.
Thanks...........Mark
Mark Steffensen
8A Dallas, TX 62 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Our website is down . . . |
Our website was mis-behaving off and on several days last week
and now has been down 100% since late Saturday night. I've been
getting a ton of e-mail from folks who have been trying to access
it unsuccessfully. I'll publish a notice when we're back up.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
| Subject: | RE: RV-List Digest: 39 Msgs - 10/29/00 |
I've seen or received a couple of suggestions that when building the
trim tab, to fabricate ribs for
the ends of it, vice bending the ends down (I'd surmise that you'd have to
do the same to the outboard
end of the trim tab cutout for the elevator). I've found the previous
messages on this subject in the
archives, and I'm not quite clear on several items...
1) OK to go with .020 thickness aluminum for the ribs? Or should I use
.032?
2) Better to go with flanges out, or flanges in?
3) If it's "flanges in", what type of pop rivets?
I just finished my HRII trim tab last week. I made simple form blocks for
the end rib by bandsawing a scrap of wood to size and sanding the edges
round as needed. I bent one edge in a padded vise then slipped the form
block in. Next clamp the whole thing in a vise and tap the other edge down.
Some adjustments were made using the seaming pliers. Quite easy.
You will have to make a different block for each rib since the rib will have
a different angle at each station.
I used .020 skin, same as my elevators are made from. I turned the flanges
inward and used MK391BS pop rivets. I was pleased with the way it turned
out.
Vince in Indiana
Harmon Rocket II
http://www.usi.edu/CHEM/FACULTY/vfrazier/page1.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
"'John Lawson'"@matronics.com
| Subject: | Information on washers and other hardware...Skybolt |
Aeromotive...cowling fasteners
You might also want to pick up a copy of the" Aircraft Standards "manual.
Van's carries
them. The Builder's Bookstore might also carry them. It is reasonably
priced.
Ed Cole
RV6A Rear half of the canopy cut and cleco'd !!!
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Lawson [SMTP:jwlawson(at)hargray.com]
> Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2000 6:10 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com; RV-List Digest Server
> Subject: RV-List: Information on washers and other hardware...Skybolt
> Aeromotive...cowling fasteners
>
>
> When I was looking for a source for dimpled platenuts, a member of the RV
> list suggested I contact
> Skybolt Aeromotive http://www.skybolt.com . I called them, they were very
> helpful (even tho the order
> was miniscule). I'd recommend calling them if you have any hardware needs
> or questions, they also
> sell sheet-metal tools.
>
> Another lister was looking for a good reference on washers. I'd suggest
> getting Skybolt's catalog,
> they have a drawing of each piece of hardware they sell (VERY handy!).
> They also sell a wide range of
> fasteners (again, with a drawing for each), it'd be a good resource for
> anyone needing a graphic to
> distinguish between types of hardware.
>
> And finally...they have cowling fastener kits for production aircraft and
> for RV-4s, 6s, and 8s. I
> was curious...has anyone used one of these kits on their project, and if
> so, how the fasteners are
> working out? The catalog shows how they were installed on an RV-4
> cowling, complete with photos. The
> installation looked pretty good to me, but I'm not much of a judge, since
> I'm still working on the
> tail control surfaces.
>
> Semper Fi
> John
> RV-6 (progress temporarily halted on those control surfaces...in-laws in
> town...)
> PS 12 more days till the Marine Corps Birthday!
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <menavrat(at)collins.rockwell.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-List Digest: 39 Msgs - 10/29/00 |
5.0.3 (Intl)|21 March 2000) at 10/30/2000 10:16:12 AM
Dave, use LPS-3. It comes in a spray can and dries in a sticky, waxy
finish that won't run off like a coat of oil will. It is specifically
designed for heavy-duty corrosion protection. I recently got a
disassembled O-360 and have preserved the engine with LPS-3 as I will
probly not be putting it back together for at least a year. Make sure to
store the parts in an area where they can 'breathe' so moisture does not
condense or accumulate on the pieces, and you should be fine.
Most hardware stores carry LPS products, my local store had to order it in
(BTW, LPS-1 and LPS-2 are NOT the same thing as -3.....you want -3 for
heavy duty corrosion protection, whereas -1 and -2 are for lubricating
controls surfaces and misc moving parts on the airframe).
--Mark Navratil
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
RV-8A ailerons, O-360-A4A overhauling, fuse on order
From: "dave ford" <dford(at)michweb.net>
"RV-List Digest Server"
Subject: RV-List: storing engine parts
I have a disassembled O360 that I will be storing until assembly winter of
2001--one year plus. Its been recommended to oil up crankshaft, rods,
lifters for this length of storage. Is there a particular oil I should
use?
I know some leave a waxy oil film--is there a brand one could recommend?
Dave Ford
RV6 fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | need help on bleeding the brakes |
I've been pumping the fluid up from the bottom of the caliper till it over
flows from the reservoir. With the clear lines I can positively see that
there is no air in the lines, but every time I close off the nipple about one
inch of air appears in the high pressure line just above the master
cylinders. Any idea how to fix? I've already been through one quart of
fluid and ordering another today.
Blue Skies,
Carey Mills
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | A20driver(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: need help on bleeding the brakes |
What model of RV Carey??? Jim Brown,RV - 3 & 4, NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Terminaltown(at)AOL.COM |
lancair-list(at)matronics.com, rocket-list(at)matronics.com,
rv-list(at)matronics.com, zenith-list(at)matronics.com
Hello Listers:
Several new pages are up. One Multiple Push Ons and another which I call the
Bargain Basement...Stuff with special pricing. Maybe worth a look.
They are listed in the NEW STUFF section on our Home Page Terminal Town
or http://www.terminaltown.com
Best regards,
John @ Terminal Town
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
Many of us are always looking for cool ways to show everyone that we fly
the best aircraft in existence. A product recently came to my attention
that may interest many listers. Aero Graphics offers beautiful leather
name tags that can be attached to various means of apparel.
I just happen to have a product review here:
http://home.HiWAAY.net/~sbuc/journal/aerographics.html
Please attempt some resemblance of humility if you wear these tags in
the presence of pilots of lesser aircraft..... ;-)
Sam Buchanan (RV-6)
"The RV Journal" http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DWENSING(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Need shipping box for IO-360 |
In a message dated 10/29/00 9:02:38 AM Central Standard Time, edwisch(at)aa.net
writes:
<< Anybody got a shipping box for an IO-360, as it comes from Lycoming?
Need one pretty quick!
thanks
Ed Wischmeyer
>>
Ed, Where are located?
Dale Ensing Cary Illinois
RV-6A O-360 (finishing details)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charles Brame <charleyb(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Amp Meter & the VM-1000 |
Electric Bob recommends an Amp Meter that reads +&- from a centered zero position.
Can anyone tell me how the VM-1000 amp meter reads?
Charlie Brame
RV-6A QB, On the gear
San Antoni, TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: need help on bleeding the brakes |
Carey,
Are you closing the nipple before pulling off the pump line? If you are
pulling off the line before closing the nipple then you need to put the
wrench on the nipple first, then put the line on the nipple and pump it up,
then close the nipple, then remove the line.
I hope that helps.
Mike Robertson
RV-8A N809RS
>From: Rvmils(at)AOL.COM
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
>Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 11:27:15 EST
>
>
>I've been pumping the fluid up from the bottom of the caliper till it over
>flows from the reservoir. With the clear lines I can positively see that
>there is no air in the lines, but every time I close off the nipple about
>one
>inch of air appears in the high pressure line just above the master
>cylinders. Any idea how to fix? I've already been through one quart of
>fluid and ordering another today.
>Blue Skies,
>Carey Mills
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charles Brame <charleyb(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6 Trim Tab construction |
For those with the older RV-6/6A kits including Quick builds, Van now
provides a prepunched, precut elevator trim tab that is a snap to
assemble. Cost was about $16 I think and worth every penny. The more
recent kits come with the prepunched tab included.
Charlie Brame
RV-6A QB, On the gear
San Antonio, TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Burns" <hsierra(at)flash.net> |
| Subject: | Re: need help on bleeding the brakes |
unbolt th cyl from its mounts, leaving the lines on and turn it horizonal or
upside down so the air can flow out. also, go the autoparts store and get a
brake bleeder screw that is pipe thread and fits in the res top. hook a
length of tubing to it and let the fluid run back in to a can and reuse the
fluid.
R. Burns
RV-4 s/n 3524 N82RB
----- Original Message -----
From: <Rvmils(at)AOL.COM>
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2000 10:27 AM
Subject: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
>
> I've been pumping the fluid up from the bottom of the caliper till it over
> flows from the reservoir. With the clear lines I can positively see that
> there is no air in the lines, but every time I close off the nipple about
one
> inch of air appears in the high pressure line just above the master
> cylinders. Any idea how to fix? I've already been through one quart of
> fluid and ordering another today.
> Blue Skies,
> Carey Mills
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
Does anyone know the gap required/specified/suggested between the forward
and aft canopy halves
on the tip up model ?
Thanks in advance
Ed Cole
RV6A Canopy sliced and rear window cleco'd in place !
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
| Subject: | Photos on the WWW of installing RV-6A wings? |
Hello all,
Anyone out there in cyberspace know of a web site that depicts a RV-6A
fuselage up on supports while the wings are being installed?
Steve Soule
Huntington, VT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | bcbraem(at)home.com |
| Subject: | Re: Amp Meter & the VM-1000 |
Charlie--
The VM-1000
Voltmeter reads Alternator to Main bus to Battery in 0.1 volt steps. If
your voltage regulator is set at 13.8 or 14.2 volts, that's what it will
read if everything is working as it should.
Ammeter reads the total bus load, ie, amperage increases as you turn on
additional equipment, again in 0.1 amp steps. You cross check with the
voltmeter as the amp load increases to insure that the alternator is
supporting the load (voltage should stay the same as amp load increases).
Works great for me.
Boyd Braem
N600SS
>
>
> Electric Bob recommends an Amp Meter that reads +&- from a centered zero position.
>
> Can anyone tell me how the VM-1000 amp meter reads?
>
> Charlie Brame
> RV-6A QB, On the gear
> San Antoni, TX
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Photos on the WWW of installing RV-6A wings? |
i have pix of my rv6a on a stand while mounting the wings so i could mount
the gear legs, is this what you want to see? the rv is upside down on the jig
at that time.
scott
tampa rv6a tipper finishing & finishing & finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sandra Baggett <accuracy(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | RV-6A wings for sale |
I have a set of RV-6A wings for sale. Wings are 99% finished. All
control surfaces are finished. Built by a experienced builder. Complete
with some fuselage parts. $4800.00
I am located 30 miles North of Nashville Tn.
Please respond off list to accuracy(at)earthlink.net or call 615-643-1030
anytime.
Thanks
Bob Baggett
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Amp Meter & the VM-1000 |
Charlie,
The VM-1000 works on a system total load basis. Not + or -.
Mike Robertson
RV-8A N809RS
>From: Charles Brame <charleyb(at)earthlink.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: RV List
>Subject: RV-List: Amp Meter & the VM-1000
>Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 12:13:24 +0000
>
>
>Electric Bob recommends an Amp Meter that reads +&- from a centered zero
>position.
>
>Can anyone tell me how the VM-1000 amp meter reads?
>
>Charlie Brame
>RV-6A QB, On the gear
>San Antoni, TX
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: need help on bleeding the brakes |
After re-reading your note a couple of times I read something else into it.
So let me try again. If you are still getting bubbles in the clear line
above the master cylinders then you haven't gotten all the air out of the
master cylinder. Probably the best way is after you have pumped enough fuid
through the lines to that it appears to be bubble free pump the brakes a few
times then check the clear lines again. If you are getting bubbles there,
which you are. then from the bottom pump more fluid into the system until
those bubbles are gone and then pump the master cylinders again. Keep doing
that until all the bubbles are gone. There are small areas inside the
master that like to trap bubbles and it sometimes takes a while to work them
out. Keep at it, you'll get it.
Mike
>From: "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
>Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 08:13:30 HST
>
>
>Carey,
>
>Are you closing the nipple before pulling off the pump line? If you are
>pulling off the line before closing the nipple then you need to put the
>wrench on the nipple first, then put the line on the nipple and pump it up,
>then close the nipple, then remove the line.
>I hope that helps.
>
>Mike Robertson
>RV-8A N809RS
>
>
> >From: Rvmils(at)AOL.COM
> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >Subject: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
> >Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 11:27:15 EST
> >
> >
> >I've been pumping the fluid up from the bottom of the caliper till it
>over
> >flows from the reservoir. With the clear lines I can positively see that
> >there is no air in the lines, but every time I close off the nipple about
> >one
> >inch of air appears in the high pressure line just above the master
> >cylinders. Any idea how to fix? I've already been through one quart of
> >fluid and ordering another today.
> >Blue Skies,
> >Carey Mills
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sandra Baggett <accuracy(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | trade wings for CS Propeller |
WILL TRADE COMPLETED RV-6A WINGS, TAIL AND CONTROL SURFACES FOR CS
PROPELLER TO FIT IO360 LYCOMING. BUILT BY EXPERIENCED BUILDER
I AM LOCATED 30 MILES NORTH OF NASHVILLE, TN.
PLEASE RESPOND OFF LIST TO accuracy(at)earthlink.net OR CALL 615-643-1030.
THANKS
BOB BAGGETT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Builder's Bookstore" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
"Cole, Ed" wrote:
>
> Does anyone know the gap required/specified/suggested between the forward
> and aft canopy halves on the tip up model ?
I think my gap between the plexi on the front and rear fixed canpoy pieces
was about 1/16- 1/8th", or about as tight as I could make it without worrying
about it binding on itself.
But the I covered that ugly gap by fiberglassing a 2" strip to the top rear
of the front piece which then overhangs the gap and about an inch of the rear
canopy piece. Besides looking good, this probably eliminates some turbulent
drag too.
Andy
________________________________________________________________________________
Hi Ed,
I have 1/8 inch between the two halves. I decided to use a .032 aluminum
Targa Strip, so I could have opened up the space a little.
Cash Copeland
QB #60075
RV6 N46FC (Reserved)
Oakland, Ca
In a message dated 10/30/00 10:44:51 AM Pacific Standard Time,
Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com writes:
<<
Does anyone know the gap required/specified/suggested between the forward
and aft canopy halves
on the tip up model ?
Thanks in advance
Ed Cole
RV6A Canopy sliced and rear window cleco'd in place ! >>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
| Subject: | Photos on the WWW of installing RV-6A wings? |
Scott,
No, but thanks. I have the plane right side up on its gear with the engine
and canopy on. I need to support it again so that I can wiggle the wings
on, bolt them in place, drill the rear spar, fit the front wing supports,
rig the ailerons and flaps, etc. I had the plane jacked up with a custom
saw horse under the F-604 and DID NOT LIKE THE WAY IT LOOKED at all! I put
it back down on the wheels and thought I ought to see how somebody else did
it.
The advice I got last week was to hoist the plane by the engine mount and
put a sawhorse under the F-605. This is the way I am currently going to go.
I'm building the hoist now out of 2x4 and 2x6 lumber. I don't quite see how
I could support the fuselage at the F-605, but I am going to have a shot at
it.
Van's says that they jack the plane under the F-604, so I assume that my
first method would have worked. I just would like to see it. I don't want
to bend the machine at this point. It took five years to get here.
Also, the manual does not address how to put wings on the RV-6A at all. The
instructions in my manual are for the RV-6. Does anyone have a more recent
RV-6A construction manual that imparts this info?
Steve Soule
Huntington, VT
-----Original Message-----
i have pix of my rv6a on a stand while mounting the wings so i could mount
the gear legs, is this what you want to see? the rv is upside down on the
jig
at that time.
scott
tampa rv6a tipper finishing & finishing & finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: need help on bleeding the brakes |
10/30/2000 04:02:13 PM
What are you'all using for a pump.......my small oil can pumper needs
constant filling and my hand hurts after pump the oil can for awhile.....
"Mike Robertson" (at)matronics.com on 10/30/2000
03:05:29 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
After re-reading your note a couple of times I read something else into it.
So let me try again. If you are still getting bubbles in the clear line
above the master cylinders then you haven't gotten all the air out of the
master cylinder. Probably the best way is after you have pumped enough
fuid
through the lines to that it appears to be bubble free pump the brakes a
few
times then check the clear lines again. If you are getting bubbles there,
which you are. then from the bottom pump more fluid into the system until
those bubbles are gone and then pump the master cylinders again. Keep
doing
that until all the bubbles are gone. There are small areas inside the
master that like to trap bubbles and it sometimes takes a while to work
them
out. Keep at it, you'll get it.
Mike
>From: "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
>Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 08:13:30 HST
>
>
>Carey,
>
>Are you closing the nipple before pulling off the pump line? If you are
>pulling off the line before closing the nipple then you need to put the
>wrench on the nipple first, then put the line on the nipple and pump it
up,
>then close the nipple, then remove the line.
>I hope that helps.
>
>Mike Robertson
>RV-8A N809RS
>
>
> >From: Rvmils(at)AOL.COM
> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >Subject: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
> >Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 11:27:15 EST
> >
> >
> >I've been pumping the fluid up from the bottom of the caliper till it
>over
> >flows from the reservoir. With the clear lines I can positively see
that
> >there is no air in the lines, but every time I close off the nipple
about
> >one
> >inch of air appears in the high pressure line just above the master
> >cylinders. Any idea how to fix? I've already been through one quart of
> >fluid and ordering another today.
> >Blue Skies,
> >Carey Mills
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
| Subject: | Looking for a Kitfox |
Listers,
I have a friend who lives on a lake in Montana and is looking for a
Kitfox (I know....I know) preferably on floats. He is back and forth
between the SF Bay area and Montana so location of the aircraft
for sale is not too critical.
Please respond off list if you have any leads.
Thanks
Ed Cole
RV6A Canopy Installing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Calvert" <rv6bldr(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | F632a channel on tip up |
The plans call for the F632A (the channel that connects the top of the cabin
frame to the baggage bulk head) to be 19 1/4" long. That's too long for me.
Has anyone else had to trim it shorter?
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok
-6 fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jlock(at)centurytel.net |
Tail and wing kit for sale. I acquired the kit about eight years ago from
a
friend in Iowa city during my imprisonment at dental school. Completed
items include: HS, VS, rudder, elevators, trim tab, flaps, aileron, right
wing with fuel tank, firewall, leading edge lights, Phlogiston spar. The
left wing needs the fuel tank, pitot plumbing, and skins riveted (holes
prepunched). I have done 99% work myself. It was pseudo inspected twice by
builder Lyle Hefel and a few times by A&P mechanics at the local airport.
Documentation includes my dated notes and photographs. I have not set a
rivet in 2.5 years. I'm located on the eastern border of Minnesota in
LaCrescent, MN. Asking price $7000.
Thanks
Jeff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary A. Sobek" <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Photos on the WWW of installing RV-6A wings? |
>
> Hello all,
>
> Anyone out there in cyberspace know of a web site that depicts a
> RV-6A
> fuselage up on supports while the wings are being installed?
>
> Steve Soule
> Huntington, VT
Steve:
There are photos of Paul and Victoria Rosales' Oshkosh AirVenture 2000
Award Winning RV-6A getting its wings installed in the SoCAL Wing Van's
Air Force photo album. A direct link to the photos of N628PV is:
http://members3.clubphoto.com/socal230330/Paul_and_Victorias_RV-6A/
Since July, N628PV has flown over 180 hours. They have been flying as
much or more than my plane has in the same time frame.
====
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
720+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "D. Anderson" <dlanderson69(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-List Digest: 39 Msgs - 10/29/00 |
My apologies to the List. Apparently I inadvertantly set a reply to a List
digest posted in Hotmail, and it quoted the entire digest post. I was in
the process of cutting and pasting the rv-list address to the filter
utility, and my fat fingers must have gotten the Enter key instead.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: need help on bleeding the brakes |
I use a pressure bleeder that I got from Harbor Freight, or someone like
that. It takes a gallon of fluid, then just pressurize it from your
compressor. I got real sore using the hand pump, like you said.
Mike Robertson
RV-8A N809RS
>From: pcondon(at)csc.com
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
>Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 16:04:15 -0500 10/30/2000 04:02:13 PM
>
>
>What are you'all using for a pump.......my small oil can pumper needs
>constant filling and my hand hurts after pump the oil can for awhile.....
>
>
>"Mike Robertson" (at)matronics.com on 10/30/2000
>03:05:29 PM
>
>Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
>Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
>
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>cc:
>
>Subject: Re: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
>
>
>After re-reading your note a couple of times I read something else into it.
>So let me try again. If you are still getting bubbles in the clear line
>above the master cylinders then you haven't gotten all the air out of the
>master cylinder. Probably the best way is after you have pumped enough
>fuid
>through the lines to that it appears to be bubble free pump the brakes a
>few
>times then check the clear lines again. If you are getting bubbles there,
>which you are. then from the bottom pump more fluid into the system until
>those bubbles are gone and then pump the master cylinders again. Keep
>doing
>that until all the bubbles are gone. There are small areas inside the
>master that like to trap bubbles and it sometimes takes a while to work
>them
>out. Keep at it, you'll get it.
>
>Mike
>
>
> >From: "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com>
> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
> >Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 08:13:30 HST
> >
> >
> >Carey,
> >
> >Are you closing the nipple before pulling off the pump line? If you are
> >pulling off the line before closing the nipple then you need to put the
> >wrench on the nipple first, then put the line on the nipple and pump it
>up,
> >then close the nipple, then remove the line.
> >I hope that helps.
> >
> >Mike Robertson
> >RV-8A N809RS
> >
> >
> > >From: Rvmils(at)AOL.COM
> > >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > >To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > >Subject: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
> > >Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 11:27:15 EST
> > >
> > >
> > >I've been pumping the fluid up from the bottom of the caliper till it
> >over
> > >flows from the reservoir. With the clear lines I can positively see
>that
> > >there is no air in the lines, but every time I close off the nipple
>about
> > >one
> > >inch of air appears in the high pressure line just above the master
> > >cylinders. Any idea how to fix? I've already been through one quart
>of
> > >fluid and ordering another today.
> > >Blue Skies,
> > >Carey Mills
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Amp Meter & the VM-1000 |
At 10:08 AM 10/30/00 HST, you wrote:
>
>The amp probe does not read reverse current, like if you were to install it
>backwards. How do I know???? Miss one little simple sentence in the
>install manual and you also will find out.
Are you sure it won't read minus too? I can't think of any
reason why they would not provide that capability. In any
case, hooking it up backwards wouldn't hurt it and if
it's incapable of negative readings then it will probably
"stick" at zero . . . just unbolt the wire, turn the
sensor around.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Amp Meter & the VM-1000 |
>>Electric Bob recommends an Amp Meter that reads +&- from a centered zero
>>position.
Actually, not true. The -0+ meter is one of several
configurations discussed in our book. However, to
take advantages of the simpler, quieter architecture
illustrated in most of our power distribution diagrams,
the -0+ battery ammeter cannot be easly configured.
Our diagrams show an ammeter shunt in the alternator b-lead
driving either an ammeter with a full scale reading equal
to or a little larger than the alternatorm, or a
generic ammeter calibrated as percent (like the one in
our website catalog). The VM-1000 sensor can be
placed on the alternator b-lead as well.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "kogrh" <kogrh(at)willinet.net> |
We have found here, that a good way to jack any RV is to buy two tall
hydraulic jacks and make a larger base out of channel iron so that they will
stand along very well. Then make a couple of pipe adapters with hook so
that it will slip over the extended shaft so that you may use the lower
engine mount to jack on. You will find that you will use the jacks often
and will get the plane in flight position with a prop under the tail. The
jacks are very important here for all of us to use them. Just take off the
cowl and you are ready to jack safely. It was one of our best investments
and have used them on nine RVs in our area. We have used them on most
models
Buzz of "Cleaveland Tool", made the jacks with stands years ago and I am
sure that if you
need more information you can call him. You might get him to provide plans
or
making the base for the jacks or the complete unit if there is enough of the
builders
were to ask for a safe way to lift your plane. Ask him and if he is not
interested in building
them, get back to me and if there is enough interest for the jacks I can
look into the costs
and see what we can come up with. They really do take care of all the
jacking problems.
Ralph Koger
RV-6A N16RK
kogrh(at)willinet.net
Boone, IA
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV8 Speed Mods |
Quartinator
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BSEckstein(at)cs.com |
| Subject: | Re: Photos on the WWW of installing RV-6A wings? |
I recently fit the wings with an automotive style floor jack, a plastic
cooler and a piece of styrofoam. Put the styrofoam on top of the cooler and
jack the cooler up under the entire area. Keep the jack well off to the side
that you're inserting or you'll pick up both sides at the same time. Crude,
but it worked just fine.
Brian Eckstein
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "kogrh" <kogrh(at)willinet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: need help on bleeding the brakes |
I also always pump the fluid from the bottom of the calipers, using a clear
plastic or rubber hose on the end of a larger pump oil can. But it is often
necessary to loosen each fitting nut from the bottom up so that you do get
the trapped air out. Then lock and go to the next up to the reservoir.
I have had some that took some time but by pumping from the bottom slowly
and cracking the fittings nuts it will work. Then wait a day or so and see
if and where the air is and do it again for when you are filling the system
you are pumping a little air suspended in the fluid also. Remember to start
with fluid and no air at end of hose, then crack fitting to pump oil in and
close fitting before letting up on pump to get another pump filled. I know
this sounds from square one, but the little things you miss can and do make
a difference. Ralph Koger RV-6A
----- Original Message -----
From: <Rvmils(at)AOL.COM>
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2000 10:27 AM
Subject: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
>
> I've been pumping the fluid up from the bottom of the caliper till it over
> flows from the reservoir. With the clear lines I can positively see that
> there is no air in the lines, but every time I close off the nipple about
one
> inch of air appears in the high pressure line just above the master
> cylinders. Any idea how to fix? I've already been through one quart of
> fluid and ordering another today.
> Blue Skies,
> Carey Mills
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Amp Meter & the VM-1000 |
Bob,
You're right in that it didn't hurt it. The digital readout doesn't read
negative numbers for whatever reason. After I re-read the manual and
figured out it was backwards I just turned it around and it worked
perfectly.
Mike Robertson
>From: "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Amp Meter & the VM-1000
>Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 18:47:42 -0600
>
>
>
>At 10:08 AM 10/30/00 HST, you wrote:
> >
> >The amp probe does not read reverse current, like if you were to install
>it
> >backwards. How do I know???? Miss one little simple sentence in the
> >install manual and you also will find out.
>
> Are you sure it won't read minus too? I can't think of any
> reason why they would not provide that capability. In any
> case, hooking it up backwards wouldn't hurt it and if
> it's incapable of negative readings then it will probably
> "stick" at zero . . . just unbolt the wire, turn the
> sensor around.
>
>
> Bob . . .
> --------------------------------------------
> ( Knowing about a thing is different from )
> ( understanding it. One can know a lot )
> ( and still understand nothing. )
> ( C.F. Kettering )
> --------------------------------------------
> http://www.aeroelectric.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Hunger" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Ski Rack Pictures |
Here are some pictures and description of my RV6A second luggage
compartment.
http://www.metronet.com/~dreeves/BuilderMods/NormanHunger/luggagecompartment
_skirack.htm
The origional idea was to carry skis but this one can carry much more. The
weight of all the extra peices came to about 3 lbs. I ran weight and balance
calculations (based on the speculated final weight of a fully equipped IFR
360cs RV6A) and found that I will be able to carry quite a bit back there.
Even a couple of pairs of huge old downhill skis won't be a problem. When I
am ready I will flight test progessivly. First with one pair, then two, then
two with baggage and so on.
Big thanks to Doug Reeves who has put my story and pictures up for the world
to see. He has built an incredible RV website. I'm in a new section called
builders mods.
So much fun, so little time...
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: need help on bleeding the brakes |
I observed exactly the same effect with my 6A dual brake system. The bubble
takes overnight to appear. I have consulted several local RV flyers and
builders and they have pumped my brakes and concur that there is no undue
sponginess. I can see the bubble shrink when I apply brakes.
I use the same technique for the brake lines in my C172 and I have firm
brakes, but with the certificated brake lines, one can't see bubbles. My
theory is that there are probably bubbles in most brake systems, but those
of us with clear lines get to see them.
Dennis Persyk N600DP O360A1A/Hartzell 0.0 Hours
Hampshire, IL C38
-----Original Message-----
From: Rvmils(at)AOL.COM <Rvmils(at)AOL.COM>
Date: Monday, October 30, 2000 10:37 AM
Subject: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
>
>I've been pumping the fluid up from the bottom of the caliper till it over
>flows from the reservoir. With the clear lines I can positively see that
>there is no air in the lines, but every time I close off the nipple about
one
>inch of air appears in the high pressure line just above the master
>cylinders. Any idea how to fix? I've already been through one quart of
>fluid and ordering another today.
>Blue Skies,
>Carey Mills
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | old ogre <jollyd(at)teleport.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Looking for a Kitfox |
try barnstormers...I saw a lot of them there
"Cole, Ed" wrote:
>
> Listers,
> I have a friend who lives on a lake in Montana and is looking for a
> Kitfox (I know....I know) preferably on floats. He is back and forth
> between the SF Bay area and Montana so location of the aircraft
> for sale is not too critical.
>
> Please respond off list if you have any leads.
> Thanks
>
> Ed Cole
> RV6A Canopy Installing
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Amp Meter & the VM-1000 |
It reads alternator output. This gets some getting used to. For my ground
runs I would record the all the min/max parameter values after shutdown. I
was quite surprised to see 37A max current, as I didn't have much turned on.
This was, of course, the peak charging current, just after startup.
I'm using a B&C alternator (60A) and B&C regulator, with undervoltage
warning light. It, along with the LASAR warning light, constitute a neat
"turn-off-the-master-switch" reminder. However, they are very bright and
would be a considerable distraction at night. I will probably change them
to the mechanical iris push-to-test lights when I get to night flying.
Dennis Persyk 6A N600DP O360A1A/Hartzell 0.0 hours
Hampshire, IL C38
-----Original Message-----
From: Charles Brame <charleyb(at)earthlink.net>
Date: Monday, October 30, 2000 12:19 PM
Subject: RV-List: Amp Meter & the VM-1000
>
>Electric Bob recommends an Amp Meter that reads +&- from a centered zero
position.
>
>Can anyone tell me how the VM-1000 amp meter reads?
>
>Charlie Brame
>RV-6A QB, On the gear
>San Antoni, TX
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "THOMAS SOBOTA" <TSOBOTA(at)worldnet.att.net> |
I hav ebeen considering installing an electric primer using a solinoid valve
from aircraft spruce. I would appriciate any comments and suggestions.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: need help on bleeding the brakes |
In a message dated 10/30/00 8:53:05 PM Eastern Standard Time,
dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net writes:
> I observed exactly the same effect with my 6A dual brake system. The bubble
> takes overnight to appear. I have consulted several local RV flyers and
> builders and they have pumped my brakes and concur that there is no undue
> sponginess. I can see the bubble shrink when I apply brakes.
Isn't this bubble between the cylinder(s) and the reservoir? This would
place it on the low pressure side of the system, and it wouldn't cause any
spongienesss at all.
I got one too...
Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA
RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Michael J. Robbins" <kitfox(at)gte.net> |
| Subject: | Re: storing engine parts |
>
> dave ford wrote:
>
> >
> > I have a disassembled O360 that I will be storing until assembly winter
of
> > 2001--one year plus. Its been recommended to oil up crankshaft, rods,
> > lifters for this length of storage. Is there a particular oil I should
use?
> > I know some leave a waxy oil film--is there a brand one could recommend?
> >
The Lycoming field rep unofficially recommends a mixture of 80% engine oil
and 20% STP for coating engine internals. I have a new O-360 in the box
and, although it was coated with preservative oil at the factory, he
recommended that I fill the crankcase with this mixture as well as pour it
in all the cylinders if I'm not going to run it for awhile, but cautioned me
NOT to move the crank until the oil is drained.
Mike Robbins
RV8Q 80591 starting panel
Seattle area
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Yotz" <gyachts(at)kans.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stranger on the field |
What a wonderful story!
I must go build, build, build.
The wind is right, the sky is blue, build, build, build.
The sky is calling, I must build, build, build.
Thanks for sharing that Austin.
Greg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrownTool(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Spring Cleco SALE - Advertisement |
ADVERTISEMENT
Just a quick note to let our RV customers know that our Standard Spring
Clecos are on sale through December 31st for only .29 each! This includes
all four standard sizes: 3/32-#40, 1/8-#30, 5/32-#21, and 3/16-#10.
Our Clecos are manufactured by Zephyr in the USA and are the highest quality!
We are one of the largest distributors of cleco temporary fastening products
in the world and currently have over 1/2 million pieces in stock!!!
You may order on-line at: www.browntool.com or you can call us tollf ree at
1-800-587-3883.
Note: Our Clecos are listed in the "Kwik-Lok Temporary Fastener" section of
our on line catalog.
Many other items are currently on sale, if you are not on our mailing list
and did not receive the recent sale flyer that was mailed out, please visit
our website and sign up for our mailing list.
We SINCERELY appreciate your business.
Best Regards,
Michael Brown
Brown Aviation Tool Supply Co.
3801 S. Meridian Ave. ( Just one mile from the FAA :-) )
Oklahoma City, OK 73119
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Imfairings(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: PVA mold release |
Glen,
I'm not sure. The thinner is alcohol and the green 'stuff' that forms the
barrier is vegetable matter. It used to come from the bottom of wine vats. If
you have a scrap of plexi. try a spot and see what happens. I suspect it
would work just fine.
Something that should work is wax and lay up right over the Plexiglas. I've
done that twice with vinylester and had no problem. Again, a test patch first
is wise.
Bob
Fairings Etc.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ed Holyoke <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net> |
Hey all you guys flying the VM-1000 - - -
How does it look in bright sunlight?
Ed Holyoke
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Cimino <jcimino(at)epix.net> |
| Subject: | Updated pictures |
I just finished updating my web page. I added some new pictures, mostly in
the finishing area. (Canopy, skirt, windscreen, etc.) Hope you like them.
Jim Cimino
RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL Reserved
http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo
(570)842-4057 N.E. Pennsylvania
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Yotz" <gyachts(at)kans.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Stranger on the field |
What a wonderful story!
I must go build, build, build.
The wind is right, the sky is blue, build, build, build.
The sky is calling, I must build, build, build.
Thanks for sharing that Austin.
Greg
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrownTool(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Spring Cleco SALE - Advertisement |
ADVERTISEMENT
Just a quick note to let our RV customers know that our Standard Spring
Clecos are on sale through December 31st for only .29 each! This includes
all four standard sizes: 3/32-#40, 1/8-#30, 5/32-#21, and 3/16-#10.
Our Clecos are manufactured by Zephyr in the USA and are the highest quality!
We are one of the largest distributors of cleco temporary fastening products
in the world and currently have over 1/2 million pieces in stock!!!
You may order on-line at: www.browntool.com or you can call us tollf ree at
1-800-587-3883.
Note: Our Clecos are listed in the "Kwik-Lok Temporary Fastener" section of
our on line catalog.
Many other items are currently on sale, if you are not on our mailing list
and did not receive the recent sale flyer that was mailed out, please visit
our website and sign up for our mailing list.
We SINCERELY appreciate your business.
Best Regards,
Michael Brown
Brown Aviation Tool Supply Co.
3801 S. Meridian Ave. ( Just one mile from the FAA :-) )
Oklahoma City, OK 73119
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: Amp Meter & the VM-1000 |
In a message dated 10/30/00 10:19:34 AM Pacific Standard Time,
charleyb(at)earthlink.net writes:
<< Electric Bob recommends an Amp Meter that reads +&- from a centered zero
position. >>
I don't think this is true. I think Bob recommends a loadmeter which reads
only positive Amps to indicate percentage of alternator utilization.
-GV (RV-6A N1GV)
vanremog(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Burch" <rv6man(at)earthlink.net> |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Holyoke" <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net>
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2000 11:40 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: VM-1000
>
>
> Hey all you guys flying the VM-1000 - - -
>
> How does it look in bright sunlight?
>
> Ed Holyoke
>
> Ed, I've flown with the VM1000 in at 10 different planes and it is great.
Just dont put it to low
as in the bottom of the RV8 panel. Terry
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Strobe Power Supplies |
| From: | czechsix(at)juno.com |
Listers,
I've been trying to figure out what strobe system I want to use on my RV.
The archives seem to have more questions than answers. There's a number
of systems on the market for aviation and non-aviation use, but many of
them don't have good specs for comparison.
I have a combination tail nav/strobe light that I was given and would
like to get a single power supply that will drive 3 strobes (tail and
both wingtips). Whelen has one that Vans sells (around $400 IIRC). I
found a supply on Whelen's website (not designed for aircraft) called
model SPS-660 at http://www.whelen.com/vpps26c.htm that drives up to 6
strobes with either Cometflash or Doubleflash patterns for $267. It's
rated 60 watts and on their spec page it says energy is 11/5/5/5 joules
(typ). I assume this is the joules for each of the 4 flashes in the
Cometflash pattern although I'm not sure about this....and have no way of
comparing it to the aviation system Vans sells. Flash rate is 140 per
min....is this too fast?
The archives contain posts about Galls and ISSPRO systems that use a
single power supply to drive 4 strobes but I haven't found specs on these
either.
If anyone has found something that will work for 3 bulbs, and has specs,
let me know.
--Mark Navratil
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
RV-8A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Aeroflash light assemblies needed without power supply |
| From: | czechsix(at)juno.com |
Listers,
Does anyone know where I could get the Aeroflash strobe/nav light units
WITHOUT the power supplies? I'd like to use these on my wingtips and all
the companies I've called (including AC Spruce) will sell the whole
system, but not the lights by themselves. What do you do if you break a
lens on an Aeroflash system.....buy a whole new system? I called
Aeroflash and they said they don't sell stuff directly, and told me to
call AC Spruce!
Whelen sells their light assemblies separately from the power supplies
but I'm assuming the Aeroflash units will be cheaper, IF I can buy them
somewhere.
Thanks,
--Mark Navratil
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
RV-8A
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Dimpled Nut Plate Question |
I am looking for a one sided or a 90 degree angle dimpled nut plate. I have
a hole close to a rib that I need to have a countersunk nut plate under
(like
a K1100-08, but this is straight, I need an angled one or a one sided one).
Does anyone know who sells these or how to get around this? Thanks
-Mike Kraus
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Carter" <jcarter8(at)midsouth.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Updated pictures |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Cimino" <jcimino(at)epix.net>
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2000 9:02 PM
Subject: RV-List: Updated pictures
>
> I just finished updating my web page. I added some new pictures, mostly
in
> the finishing area. (Canopy, skirt, windscreen, etc.) Hope you like
them.
Jim...
Good work! Please tell us how you like the camlock fasteners. I'm ready to
start on my cowl, and I've been tossing this idea back and forth.
Jerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gordon or Marge Comfort" <gcomfo(at)tc3net.com> |
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: primer |
-----Original Message-----
From: THOMAS SOBOTA <TSOBOTA(at)worldnet.att.net>
Date: Monday, October 30, 2000 9:58 PM
Subject: RV-List: rv-list: primer
>
>I hav ebeen considering installing an electric primer using a solinoid
valve
>from aircraft spruce. I would appriciate any comments and suggestions.
I have such a system on my RV-4 and it works just fine. Originally it was
set up to supply fuel to all 4 cylinders but later one cylinder line was
removed in favor of a line for a manifold pressure gauge. Works better with
3 cylinders being primed. I think the low pressure electric pump (in
conjunction with small primer lines) didn't supply fuel adequately to all 4.
Suggest you be sure that the valve you select is designed to close under
line pressure so that if the closing spring fails the system pressure will
not cause fuel flow through the priming system. If you live or fly in a
cold climate a primer is important. I have a friend who set fire to his 150
Lyc (without a priming system) when attempting a cold start with only the
carb accelerator pump to help. My valve was made by Acorn.
Gordon Comfort
N363GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Karl Schilling" <k_schilling(at)iquest.net> |
I have one on my RV-8, 130 plus hours, works great. I used a solinoid from
a nitrous oxide system. The primer line only goes to one cyl. Karl 711KN
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary A. Sobek" <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: storing engine parts |
> > >
> > > I have a disassembled O360 that I will be storing until assembly
> winter
> of
> > > 2001--one year plus. Its been recommended to oil up crankshaft,
> rods,
> > > lifters for this length of storage. Is there a particular oil I
> should
> use?
> > > I know some leave a waxy oil film--is there a brand one could
An old A & P, IA recommended LPS 3. I stored my disassembled engine
parts 3 years with no signs of rust. That was almost 10 years ago.
====
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
720+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jlock(at)centurytel.net |
| Subject: | RV-list Tail & Wing for sale |
Tail and wing kit for sale. I acquired the kit about eight years ago from
a friend in Iowa city during my imprisonment at dental school. Completed
items include: HS, VS, rudder, elevators, trim tab, flaps, aileron, right
wing with fuel tank, firewall, leading edge lights, Phlogiston spar. The
left wing needs the fuel tank, pitot plumbing, and skins riveted (holes
prepunched). I have done 99% work myself. It was pseudo inspected twice by
builder Lyle Hefel and a few times by A&P mechanics at the local airport.
Documentation includes my dated notes and photographs. I have not set a
rivet in 2.5 years. I'm located on the eastern border of Minnesota in
LaCrescent, MN. Asking price $7000.
Thanks
Jeff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimpled Nut Plate Question |
I've got a catalog and a local supplier. Let him know what the rest of your
needs are too. I think that you're looking for NAS685A08 this has a dimple
for the screw - add the suffix K to the end and you'll have one dimpled for
the rivets also.
The place is called Aircraft Supply Co. It's in Dallas. 214-688-0549.
Tell Alvin that I sent you through the RV-List.
He's hooked me up...
Ralph Capen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy J. Pflanzer" <rpflanze(at)iquest.net> |
| Subject: | Yesterday's Trip |
Listers,
Just a quick motivational note on a trip I took yesterday. If not
interested, hit DELETE now.
I received a nice e-mail from Tom and Cathy Ervin in Millersburg, Ohio about
my paint scheme. They were interested in more pictures, etc. It was a
great looking day outside, I wasn't busy at work, so......I dropped them a
line and said I could be there by 3:00 pm. Called the wife to let her know
the plans. ("Yea, I know. You're going flying again aren't you?")
It's 200 nm from Indy to Millersburg (60 miles NE of Columbus). I hopped
into N417G, punched in 10G (Holmes Country) and blasted off. 165 KTS cruise
at about 3000', smooth as a baby's behind, and I was there in an hour and
ten minutes. The countryside was beautiful as I observed the farmers
furiously running their combines to gather in their crops before the rains
later this week. I could see little dust storms dotted all over the horizon
from their machines.
Holmes county is a neat airport, situated up on top of a small hill. It
kind of reminded me of Sedona. Great FBO and cheap fuel ($2.15/gallon).
Tom met me at the airport, took some pictures, and we went back to his house
to view his RV-6A QB project. (I still say the QB kit is cheating ;>) His
wife Cathy came home early from work so she could check out the interior and
take a few pictures. They were very gracious hosts and offered me dinner
for my troubles. I had to decline as I needed to get back before dark.
Departed Holmes at 5:00 pm and headed west, right into the lowering sun.
Ouch!! Once past the Dayton airspace I dropped down to 1200' and weaved
around the fields and stands of woods the rest of the way home. I even
managed a wave from a group of farmers offloading their combine's harvest
into a semi. The evening was smooth and I could even smell the fall air
inside my cockpit. I just love this airplane.
As I was landing, I could hear Wayne Ray in his Guernsey Cow spotted RV-6A
(See last month's Rvaitor) landing at Mt. Comfort and Karl Schilling in his
beautiful RV-8 landing at Franklin. Seems a lot of the RVers were up and
heading back home.
These airplanes are really amazing and I'm enjoying this so much more than I
even thought possible. 400 nm in 2.5 hours and back home in time for dinner
and Monday Night Football. Keep building 'em. You are just going to love
it to pieces when you get done.
Randy Pflanzer N417G
RV-6 Indianapolis (93 hours since June)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)AOL.COM |
In a message dated 10/30/00 8:54:20 PM Pacific Standard Time,
bicyclop(at)pacbell.net writes:
<< Hey all you guys flying the VM-1000 - - -
How does it look in bright sunlight? >>
Great. It is always extremely visible in the daylight and did have to tone
it way down at night. It glows like a TV set raster on hi.
-GV (RV-6A N1GV)
vanremog(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: primer |
In a message dated 10/30/00 6:32:28 PM Pacific Standard Time,
TSOBOTA(at)worldnet.att.net writes:
<< I have been considering installing an electric primer using a solenoid
valve
from aircraft spruce. I would appreciate any comments and suggestions. >>
Yes. Works well and no wet lines in the cabin. Many builders have this
system. Mine feeds jugs 1,2 & 4.
-GV (RV-6A N1GV)
vanremog(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Donald Mei" <don_mei(at)hotmail.com> |
Not necessarily RV related, but close. Back in the 1970s and 80s one of the
top privateer tuners for guys who roadraced motorcycles professionally was a
guy named Kevin Cameron. Masters in Engineering, PhD Harvard in Physics,
the guy was brilliant. He could eyeball a 2 stroke expansion chamber and
tell you where the power peak would be. Anyway, he was a friend of my
fathers and he was over the house one evening while I was working on my
racebike. I was having a hell of a time getting all of the air out of the
brakes. So I asked him:
Kevin, what is the best way to assemble a brake system so there are no
bubbles in it. His answer was typical:
In a swimming pool full of brake fluid, but thats impossible, so lets work
backwards from there. I guess everything is a compromise. KEEP PUMPING.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: primer |
The electric solenoid primer from AS is the one that I have installed on my
plane. It goes to three cylinders. Here in the Texas panhandle I find that if
I just pump the throttle a couple of times she starts fine. Don't know if I
would use it again on the O320 After the first week or so of flying and
numerous flooding experiences. I learned how to start the engine without
using the primer. Would I do it again? HUM. Probably not. Terry E. Cole
N468TC
________________________________________________________________________________
Can see mine just fine in the day light, and mine is on the far right side
of the panel. You will love it. Just install it where you want it. Remember
that you will have to replace the battery in the DPU in about 3 years so make
it kinda accessable.
Terry E. Cole N468TC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Dimpled Nut Plate - the clever way |
10/31/2000 09:47:39 AM
When I needed dimpled nut plates (only 3 or 4 time in the whole project) I
didn't want to stall my progress making my framstat or widget (usually 2
weeks when I order something, wait for delivery, pay 10x more for delivery
then the part was worth, then forget why I ordered it anyway.......) I made
my own in about 3 minutes. I simply took a piece of 24 or 30 thousands
scrap stock, mounted the standard nutplate with C/S rivets, then drilled
new #40 holes about 1/8 inch away on the same radius, hand C/S the new
holes with the hand tool, then dressed the assembly on my scotchbrite
wheel ( looks count ) and installed on my project. Actually took less time
making it then describing it here.............well very close.
"Ralph E. Capen" (at)matronics.com on 10/31/2000
08:18:12 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: Dimpled Nut Plate Question
I've got a catalog and a local supplier. Let him know what the rest of
your
needs are too. I think that you're looking for NAS685A08 this has a dimple
for the screw - add the suffix K to the end and you'll have one dimpled for
the rivets also.
The place is called Aircraft Supply Co. It's in Dallas. 214-688-0549.
Tell Alvin that I sent you through the RV-List.
He's hooked me up...
Ralph Capen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dennis Persyk" <dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: need help on bleeding the brakes |
-----Original Message-----
From: KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM <KBoatri144(at)AOL.COM>
Date: Monday, October 30, 2000 9:16 PM
Subject: Re: RV-List: need help on bleeding the brakes
>
>In a message dated 10/30/00 8:53:05 PM Eastern Standard Time,
>dpersyk(at)worldnet.att.net writes:
>
>> I observed exactly the same effect with my 6A dual brake system. The
bubble
>> takes overnight to appear. I have consulted several local RV flyers and
>> builders and they have pumped my brakes and concur that there is no
undue
>> sponginess. I can see the bubble shrink when I apply brakes.
>
>Isn't this bubble between the cylinder(s) and the reservoir? This would
>place it on the low pressure side of the system, and it wouldn't cause any
>spongienesss at all.
>
>I got one too...
>
>Kyle Boatright - Kennesaw, GA
>RV-6 Slider, O-320/Aymar-Demuth
The bubble is on the high pressure side of a dual brake system, ref 6A
Drawing 49, R4, in the vicinity of the 44 NSR tube callout. The bubble is
at the top of the arc of the lines connecting the cylinders.
Dennis Persyk
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Thanks to everyone who gave back riveting help! (Here's what |
worked for me)
Thanks for all the advice re. back riveting skin stiffeners!
After reading all the pointers and suggestions here is what worked for me:
Changed to -3-3 rivets from -3-3.5
Removed the spring loaded plastic portion from my back rivet set and used my
fingers to press the parts together and hold the set still as I drove the
rivet.
Used about 23 PSI with my 3X gun
Thanks again to everyone who replied, its really nice to know there is all
that support out there.
Now on to the elevators!
Tracy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pat_hatch" <pat_hatch(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Jacking a RV6A |
I would affirm Ralph's message on jacking. Early on during the contruction
of my RV-4 (1989) I rigged up a couple of surplus Learjet jacks to raise the
RV-4 at the wing tie-down points. I made up a couple of jackpads to screw
into the tiedown points on the wings using a couple of steel carriage bolts
that I cut to proper length so they would screw all the way into the tiedown
blocks. The carriage bolt "shoulder" served two purposes, one as a stop
against the wing skin and also to serve as a means to remove the bolt using
a thin box wrench. The carriage head fit perfectly into the cup of the wing
jack pad so that it is impossible for the jack to slip off and God forbid go
through the wing.
Also, you will need a tail stand that attaches to the tail spring (tiedown
for the "A's") and will need to have some weight attached to prevent the
tail from rising. Works great and makes maintenance very convenient.
Pat Hatch
RV-4, N17PH @ VRB, 700 hours TT
O-320, Hartzell C/S
RV-6, Fuselage
----- Original Message -----
From: "kogrh" <kogrh(at)willinet.net>
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2000 8:01 PM
Subject: RV-List: Jacking a RV6A
>
> We have found here, that a good way to jack any RV is to buy two tall
> hydraulic jacks and make a larger base out of channel iron so that they
will
> stand along very well. Then make a couple of pipe adapters with hook so
> that it will slip over the extended shaft so that you may use the lower
> engine mount to jack on. You will find that you will use the jacks often
> and will get the plane in flight position with a prop under the tail. The
> jacks are very important here for all of us to use them. Just take off
the
> cowl and you are ready to jack safely. It was one of our best investments
> and have used them on nine RVs in our area. We have used them on most
> models
>
> Buzz of "Cleaveland Tool", made the jacks with stands years ago and I am
> sure that if you
> need more information you can call him. You might get him to provide
plans
> or
> making the base for the jacks or the complete unit if there is enough of
the
> builders
> were to ask for a safe way to lift your plane. Ask him and if he is not
> interested in building
> them, get back to me and if there is enough interest for the jacks I can
> look into the costs
> and see what we can come up with. They really do take care of all the
> jacking problems.
>
> Ralph Koger
> RV-6A N16RK
> kogrh(at)willinet.net
> Boone, IA
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "skybolt-aviator" <skybolt-aviator(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: primer |
If you live in cold country I think you should.
Ollie&Lorene Washburn
RV6-A,N795LW,@FD77.
O-360,180HP,C/S,300+hrs./with elec prime.
----- Original Message -----
From: <TColeE(at)AOL.COM>
Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2000 9:25 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: rv-list: primer
>
> The electric solenoid primer from AS is the one that I have installed on
my
> plane. It goes to three cylinders. Here in the Texas panhandle I find that
if
> I just pump the throttle a couple of times she starts fine. Don't know if
I
> would use it again on the O320 After the first week or so of flying and
> numerous flooding experiences. I learned how to start the engine without
> using the primer. Would I do it again? HUM. Probably not. Terry E. Cole
> N468TC
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimpled Nut Plate Question |
I believe Van has them in stock as several were included in my 6A kit.
Eustace Bowhay
-----Original Message-----
From: N8292W(at)AOL.COM <N8292W(at)AOL.COM>
Date: Tuesday, October 31, 2000 3:57 AM
Subject: RV-List: Dimpled Nut Plate Question
>
>I am looking for a one sided or a 90 degree angle dimpled nut plate. I
have
> a hole close to a rib that I need to have a countersunk nut plate under
>(like
>a K1100-08, but this is straight, I need an angled one or a one sided one).
>Does anyone know who sells these or how to get around this? Thanks
>-Mike Kraus
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Amp Meter & the VM-1000 |
At 03:33 PM 10/30/00 HST, you wrote:
>
>Bob,
>
>You're right in that it didn't hurt it. The digital readout doesn't read
>negative numbers for whatever reason. After I re-read the manual and
>figured out it was backwards I just turned it around and it worked
>perfectly.
>
Great . . .
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Open Barrel Pin Connectors |
My 4 month arm-wrestling match with the supplier
has ended in victory . . . the tools we thought we
were going to get back in August are here. Whether
you use our tool or not, here's a comic book on
installing the open barrel pins as used in Mate-n-Lock,
Molex, and D-subminature connectors.
http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/matenlok/matenlok.html
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: rv-list: primer |
10/31/2000 10:36:08 AM
Are you using restrictor orfices on the cylinder......there needs to be
restrictor fittings at the output end on the primmer lines (both manual
plunger type and the elect. type.). This might be obvious to some folks....
but it might be news to some of our builders......
TColeE(at)AOL.COM@matronics.com on 10/31/2000 09:25:27 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: rv-list: primer
The electric solenoid primer from AS is the one that I have installed on my
plane. It goes to three cylinders. Here in the Texas panhandle I find that
if
I just pump the throttle a couple of times she starts fine. Don't know if
I
would use it again on the O320 After the first week or so of flying and
numerous flooding experiences. I learned how to start the engine without
using the primer. Would I do it again? HUM. Probably not. Terry E. Cole
N468TC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Use of Proximity type switches in aircraft? |
>Good-day all- looking to the many fabulous engineering talents within this
>forum- Does anyone have any experience with inductive proximity switches
>used as limit switches within an aircraft? Wondering if anyone who has
>tried prox switches in aircraft if they have ever had interference with the
>performance of the switch while operating radio or other equipment? I have
>experience using these switches in the development of tooling and machines
>within a dirty and vibrating environment but not around other possible noise
>creators like radios or the like.
I think your risks are low. I've used these devices
for decades in some hi-end aircraft and industrial
applications with no difficulties . . . however,
having said that, I've NOT tested any of these things
in the RF lab . . . The major threat is from transmitters.
Play with one on the bench while irradiating it with
a hand-held and rubber-duck antenna from about a foot away.
If keying the transmitter doesn't affect operation, it's
probably going to be just fine in your airplane. This
kind of exposure from a handheld is MUCH more than
it would see in a typical installation.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | A20driver(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | Re: thanks; bleeding brakes |
Carey: Early plans show plungers down -- later plans show plungers up...Jim
Brown, 3&4, NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Ski Rack Pictures |
Hello, Norm:
You sent a notice to the RV-List about your Ski Rack solution. It is no
longer available.
I am interested in a similar modification. I am more interested in storing
light but bulky items for backpacking/camping - sleeping bags, small nylon
tent, fishing poles, etc. I am not fussy about wing tip lockers.
Ernest Kells
RV-9A - Building Wings EAA: #430137
Plan: O-235/Wood Prop RAA:
Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario Email:
ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Tanner" <gtanner(at)bendcable.com> |
| Subject: | Ski Rack Pictures |
Go to www.vansaircraft.net and you'll find a link to the site that shows his
storage.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Ernest Kells
Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2000 7:59 AM
Subject: Re: RV-List: Ski Rack Pictures
Hello, Norm:
You sent a notice to the RV-List about your Ski Rack solution. It is no
longer available.
I am interested in a similar modification. I am more interested in storing
light but bulky items for backpacking/camping - sleeping bags, small nylon
tent, fishing poles, etc. I am not fussy about wing tip lockers.
Ernest Kells
RV-9A - Building Wings EAA: #430137
Plan: O-235/Wood Prop RAA:
Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario Email:
ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: 90 degree Nut Plate - the clever way |
10/31/2000 11:15:33 AM
BTW I made my 90 degree nut plates the same way.......only needed 2 or
three of em in my whole project..........
---------------
When I needed dimpled nut plates (only 3 or 4 time in the whole project) I
didn't want to stall my progress making my framstat or widget (usually 2
weeks when I order something, wait for delivery, pay 10x more for delivery
then the part was worth, then forget why I ordered it anyway.......) I made
my own in about 3 minutes. I simply took a piece of 24 or 30 thousands
scrap stock, mounted the standard nutplate with C/S rivets, then drilled
new #40 holes about 1/8 inch away on the same radius, hand C/S the new
holes with the hand tool, then dressed the assembly on my scotchbrite
wheel ( looks count ) and installed on my project. Actually took less time
making it then describing it here.............well very close.
"Ralph E. Capen" (at)matronics.com on 10/31/2000
08:18:12 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: Dimpled Nut Plate Question
I've got a catalog and a local supplier. Let him know what the rest of
your
needs are too. I think that you're looking for NAS685A08 this has a dimple
for the screw - add the suffix K to the end and you'll have one dimpled for
the rivets also.
The place is called Aircraft Supply Co. It's in Dallas. 214-688-0549.
Tell Alvin that I sent you through the RV-List.
He's hooked me up...
Ralph Capen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
| Subject: | thanks; bleeding brakes |
Cy,
Why do the plans show mounting with the plunger down, then? I am puzzled
most of the time, it seems. I don't want to deviate from the plans, but
would like to understand why the plans are the way they are.
Steve Soule
Huntington, VT
RV-6A
-----Original Message-----
From: Cy Galley [mailto:cgalley(at)qcbc.org]
Yes, and If you point the plungers down, you WILL have problems bleeding the
brakes. At Emergency Aircraft Repair at Oshkosh we have at least one person
come in with air in their brakes on an RV. They work and they slave a
couple of days, dump a lot of red fluid, UNTIL they remount the master
cylinders with the plunger up. 10 minutes later, they are all smiles.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Use of Proximity type switches in aircraft? |
Bob,
Proximity switches have been used the Falcon 50 aircraft for well over 20
years, with great success. The landing gear/air ground logic uses no less
than 8 "air ground proximity switches". They have a distinct advantage over
conventional "micro switches" especially in the harsh environment of the
landing gear/wheel wells.
Regards,
Bill Mahoney
Sherman, CT
RV-6 N747W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "pat_hatch" <pat_hatch(at)email.msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: thanks; bleeding brakes |
Steve:
Early RV-4's were built with the plungers down to avoid interference with
the floor web in this area. It was felt that the only way to fit the pedals
and master cylinders was to turn them "upside down." A lot of people have
since modified their pedals and turned the master cylinders around. I have
an article that explains how I did it, with drawings, if anyone is
interested. At some point Vans made the change in their plans/kits.
Pat Hatch
RV-4, N17PH @ VRB, 700 hours TT
O-320, Hartzell C/S
RV-6, Fuselage
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2000 11:52 AM
Subject: RE: RV-List: thanks; bleeding brakes
>
> Cy,
>
> Why do the plans show mounting with the plunger down, then? I am puzzled
> most of the time, it seems. I don't want to deviate from the plans, but
> would like to understand why the plans are the way they are.
>
>
> Steve Soule
> Huntington, VT
> RV-6A
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Cy Galley [mailto:cgalley(at)qcbc.org]
> Yes, and If you point the plungers down, you WILL have problems bleeding
the
> brakes. At Emergency Aircraft Repair at Oshkosh we have at least one
person
> come in with air in their brakes on an RV. They work and they slave a
> couple of days, dump a lot of red fluid, UNTIL they remount the master
> cylinders with the plunger up. 10 minutes later, they are all smiles.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com> |
| Subject: | Re: ELT Installation |
>I have a question concerning the ELT installation. The installation manual
>for our Ameri-King Model AK-450 ELT says "The Antenna must be within 20
>degrees of vertical when the aircraft is in a normal flight attitude." It
>goes on to say "The Antenna should be placed a minimum distance of 3 feet (1
>meter) from any vertically polarized communication Antennas (i.e. Antennas
>radiating in the 118-137 MHz band)."
>My understanding of the ELT use is that it would never be used in flight so
>then why would their be a requirement for it to be installed "within 20
>degrees of vertical"? Further, it is not likely that the aircraft would be
>in such an attitude when use of the ELT was necessary.
On top of that, a recent article in AOPA Pilot suggests that
ELTs figure in a TINY percentage of aircraft accidents wherein
lives are saved . . . like under 10% if I recall. The numbers
COULD be better but the hardware reliability is poor and the
technology used to track downed aircraft is antiquated.
>The other question is why should it be placed 3 feet from the VHF antenna?
>Again, the VHF antenna would presumably not be used at the same time as the
>ELT antenna.
>
>I would presume that the ELT installation requirements would be only for
>certificated aircraft and not applicable to home-builts. However, some
times
>there may be some wisdom in certification requirements.
Excellent critical review questions. In my not so humble opinion,
install it any way that works but plan your actions such that
you don't need to depend on the system to be useful.
Bob . . .
--------------------------------------------
( Knowing about a thing is different from )
( understanding it. One can know a lot )
( and still understand nothing. )
( C.F. Kettering )
--------------------------------------------
http://www.aeroelectric.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com> |
| Subject: | thanks; bleeding brakes |
I think it is just for ease of mounting and clearance. That's the way mine
are mounted because that's the only way I could see to make them fit with
the proper clearances. But then, I haven't put the brake fluid in yet...
--
Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE, CCNA
Network Administrator
Union Safe Deposit Bank
209-946-5116
-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen J. Soule [mailto:SSoule(at)pfclaw.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2000 8:52 AM
To: 'rv-list(at)matronics.com'
Subject: RE: RV-List: thanks; bleeding brakes
Cy,
Why do the plans show mounting with the plunger down, then?
I am puzzled
most of the time, it seems. I don't want to deviate from
the plans, but
would like to understand why the plans are the way they are.
Steve Soule
Huntington, VT
RV-6A
-----Original Message-----
From: Cy Galley [mailto:cgalley(at)qcbc.org]
Yes, and If you point the plungers down, you WILL have
problems bleeding the
brakes. At Emergency Aircraft Repair at Oshkosh we have at
least one person
come in with air in their brakes on an RV. They work and
they slave a
couple of days, dump a lot of red fluid, UNTIL they remount
the master
cylinders with the plunger up. 10 minutes later, they are
all smiles.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Open Barrel Pin Connectors |
| From: | Don Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> |
Real good article. What do they cost? Do the type 1 that I bought do part
of this one.?
Don Jordan - RV6A - Arlington, Tx - finish
*************************************************
writes:
>
>
> My 4 month arm-wrestling match with the supplier
> has ended in victory . . . the tools we thought we
> were going to get back in August are here. Whether
> you use our tool or not, here's a comic book on
> installing the open barrel pins as used in Mate-n-Lock,
> Molex, and D-subminature connectors.
>
> http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/matenlok/matenlok.html
>
>
> Bob . . .
> --------------------------------------------
> ( Knowing about a thing is different from )
> ( understanding it. One can know a lot )
> ( and still understand nothing. )
> ( C.F. Kettering )
> --------------------------------------------
> http://www.aeroelectric.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SALNED71(at)AOL.COM |
| Subject: | test pilot schools |
Is there a list of test pilot schools we can attend
before we test our airplanes.
Thanks...........Ed Kowalski ...Finishing our RV-8
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | While were on the subject of RF... |
| From: | Jim_Andrews(at)tivoli.com |
10/31/2000 01:28:32 PM
Has anyone had any problems with RF from their com getting into their
dimmers? I'm using the stock dimmer unit from Van's and every time I key
my mic my cabin/instrument lights go out. Obviously the signal from the
transmitter is swamping the dimmer transistor but it all appears to be
grounded properly. Lots of power from the battery and nice big wires
feeding the dimmer unit. Do I need to put the dimmer in a metal box?
I just love this stuff,
- Jim Andrews
RV-8A ( cowl and systems check out )
O-360 Sensenich 85
N89JA reserved
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: test pilot schools |
I don't know about others but the EAA offers a course.
Mike Robertson
October 24, 2000 - October 31, 2000
RV-Archive.digest.vol-jn