RV-Archive.digest.vol-lp
September 28, 2001 - October 03, 2001
| Subject: | Re: RV-List Digest: 81 Msgs - 09/27/01 |
I truly detest "Hanoi Jane", but this is a hoax. The POW's involved said it never
happened.
Semper Fi
John
RV-6 (left wing in jig..in a holding pattern while on this FAA-mandated exercise
program of running around in
circles and jumping through hoops)
>
> From: Jim Duckett <perfeng(at)3rivers.net>
> Subject: RV-List: Hanoi Jane
>
>
> Guys,
> While we're on this thread of folks not understanding things...A buddy
> just sent this to me. I'd like to add this under the "Let's Remember"
> File. I know I'll never forget or forgive what she did!!!!
>
> Sorry not true RV stuff but, important none the less...!
>
> Jim Duckett, Nam Vet and RV-7A Builder
>
> >From - Thu Sep 27 22:29:14 2001
> (envelope-from pbparker@in-tch.com)
> From: Pat and Becky Parker <pbparker@in-tch.com>
> Brent and Tonya Weninger ,
> Clifford Garness <cliffman@in-tch.com>,
> Cliff Garness <cliff@sletten-inc.com>,
> Cody Parker ,
> Cory Koterba ,
> Dave Parker , Dean Taylor ,
> Hall Hugg ,
> Heather Topp ,
> Jim Duckett , Jim Mills ,
> Karen & Dan Griffin ,
> Karla Mills ,
> Kelly Weinberger ,
> Rick Nowaski , Robert Morgan ,
> Scott &Irene Pocklington ,
> Scott Weinberger ,
> Steve Shovlin ,
> Tracey Wagner , Walt ,
> Wayne Thomas
> Subject: Hanoi Jane
>
> >
> > >> KEEP THIS MOVING ACROSS AMERICA HONORING A TRAITOR
> > >>
> > >>This is for all the kids born in the 70's that do not
> > >>remember this, and didn't have to bear the burden, that
> > >>our fathers, mothers, and older brothers and sisters had to bear.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RGray67968(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Cowl/air box seal |
Folks,
Has anyone installed the cowl to air box seal material other than 'by
the plans'? Not sure I want to see the shop head of the rivets when looking
into the cowl air scoop.
Yea, I know...........I need to 'move on' and 'get a life,' but I was
looking for an idea that was a little 'cleaner.'
Thanks in advance and by all means..............archive.
Rick Gray (Ohio) RV6 .....the last minute finish stuff takes longer than
building the thing!
________________________________________________________________________________
i'm afraid it is factual, as she admitted it on a barbara walters interview
back in the early 90's. she claimed she was young and nieve, and thought the
tiny pieces of paper were some sort of vietnamese tradition, or some sort of
gifts to her from the men, which she had no interest of keeping, and turned
them over to be thrown away, rather than rat them out., i saw the interview,
although it makes since what she said, i still have my reserves as if that
story wasn't created to restore her face in america's eyes.
just my nickles worth
scott
tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eric Newton" <enewton57(at)cableone.net> |
| Subject: | Old Ground School Question |
Since the list seems a little slow, I thought I would ask a question. I
have noticed that some builders use list three weight configurations on
the max. gross weight for their plane.
1. Aerobatic
2. Utility
3. Normal
My question was probably taught to me in ground school back in 1973 but
I can't remember it. What is the difference between "Utility" category
and "Normal" category?
Thanks,
Eric Newton - Long Beach, MS
RV-6A N57ME (FAA inspection scheduled for Oct 5th or 19th?)
www.ericsrv6a.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken Stribling" <bbattery(at)bendcable.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowl/air box seal |
I just cut a hole in some thick foam and put it over the air horn like a big
ring, simple and quick
first official flight last week-end 4.7 hours and still flying it's great.
Ken S. waiting for the weekend
----- Original Message -----
From: <RGray67968(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Cowl/air box seal
>
> Folks,
> Has anyone installed the cowl to air box seal material other than
'by
> the plans'? Not sure I want to see the shop head of the rivets when
looking
> into the cowl air scoop.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | False spar for RV-8 QB |
| From: | "Todd Wenzel" <TWenzel(at)hsdinc.com> |
Thanks for the effort Michael - a picture is worth a thousand words, and
you just saved the list from archiving 5000 words! :-)
Your site is very helpful!
Todd Wenzel (building false spars and stands this weekend)
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Stephan [mailto:mstephan(at)shr.net]
Subject: Re: RV-List: False spar for RV-8 QB
Todd,
I threw together a webpage with my fuselage cart and pictures of the
false
spars. If you remember from the crate the false spars are just multiple
plywood layers about a 1.25" thick. They are fastened to the spar carry
though with two bolts on each side. Use also used the bolts that came
in
the crate. They had a plastic protective sleeve. I guess to protect
the
holes drilled in the spar. I did not tighten the nuts. The nuts just
keep
them captured so they don't slip out. The only difficulty in making a
new
pair is getting the holes drilled accurately enough without damaging the
holes in the spar attach point. But they do not have to be perfect.
They
just have to support the fuselage. So elongated or oversize holes may
not
hurt. I would just mark the blank, take it out and drill it on a drill
press.
http://www.shrc.com/rv8/fuselagecart.html
hope it helps.
--
Michael Stephan
----------
>From: "Todd Wenzel" <TWenzel(at)hsdinc.com>
>To:
>Subject: RE: RV-List: False spar for RV-8 QB
>Date: Thu, Sep 27, 2001, 2:29 PM
>
> I would like to see pictures if you could Michael. I remember removing
> the false spars from my QB, then promptly tossing them out - I guess I
> should have thought about it a little first. Right now my Fuse is on
> sturdy homemade saw horses with a wide top (about 12") with Styrofoam
> between from the QB crating. I strapped the tail down to one saw horse
> to keep it secure. I also put wheels on the saw horses so I could roll
> the fuse around. The biggest problem I have is the fuse is a little
too
> high to easily work on the internals without standing on a small
stool.
>
> Todd Wenzel
> twenzel(at)hsdinc.com
> Delafield, Wisconsin
> RV-8AQB, Fuse (on my tippy-toes)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Old Ground School Question |
Eric,
I wish all questions were this easy. Section 23.3 of the FARs gives pretty
exact descriptions for all categories. Below is the exerpt for Normal,
Utility, and Acrobatic categories.
Mike Robertson
RV-8A
Sec. 23.3 Airplane categories.
(a) The normal category is limited to airplanes that have a seating
configuration, excluding pilot seats, of
nine or less, a maximum certificated takeoff weight of 12,500 pounds or
less, and intended for
nonacrobatic operation. Nonacrobatic operation includes:
(1) Any maneuver incident to normal flying;
(2) Stalls (except whip stalls); and
(3) Lazy eights, chandelles, and steep turns, in which the angle of bank is
not more than 60 degrees.
(b) The utility category is limited to airplanes that have a seating
configuration, excluding pilot seats, of nine
or less, a maximum certificated takeoff weight of 12,500 pounds or less, and
intended for limited
acrobatic operation. Airplanes certificated in the utility category may be
used in any of the operations
covered under paragraph (a) of this section and in limited acrobatic
operations. Limited acrobatic
operation includes:
(1) Spins (if approved for the particular type of airplane); and
(2) Lazy eights, chandelles, and steep turns, or similar maneuvers, in
which the angle of bank is more
than 60 degrees but not more than 90 degrees.
(c) The acrobatic category is limited to airplanes that have a seating
configuration, excluding pilot seats, of
nine or less, a maximum certificated takeoff weight of 12,500 pounds or
less, and intended for use
without restrictions, other than those shown to be necessary as a result of
required flight tests.
>From: "Eric Newton" <enewton57(at)cableone.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: "RV-List"
>Subject: RV-List: Old Ground School Question
>Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2001 08:34:56 -0500
>
>
>Since the list seems a little slow, I thought I would ask a question. I
>have noticed that some builders use list three weight configurations on
>the max. gross weight for their plane.
>1. Aerobatic
>2. Utility
>3. Normal
>My question was probably taught to me in ground school back in 1973 but
>I can't remember it. What is the difference between "Utility" category
>and "Normal" category?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Eric Newton - Long Beach, MS
>RV-6A N57ME (FAA inspection scheduled for Oct 5th or 19th?)
>www.ericsrv6a.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Zilik" <zilik(at)bewellnet.com> |
| Subject: | Must be nice to be able to fly; was Cowl/air box seal |
Oh what I would give to be able to fly whenever I wanted. My home field FTG is
located within DEN Enhanced Class B and there is still no VFR flight allowed
unless for instructional purposes. At least my wife is getting to fly and
enjoys the the empty pattern.
Gary
PS I installed by FAB seal just like in the plans and have them ugly pop rivets
showing.
Ken Stribling wrote:
>
> I just cut a hole in some thick foam and put it over the air horn like a big
> ring, simple and quick
>
> first official flight last week-end 4.7 hours and still flying it's great.
>
> Ken S. waiting for the weekend
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <RGray67968(at)aol.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Cowl/air box seal
>
> >
> > Folks,
> > Has anyone installed the cowl to air box seal material other than
> 'by
> > the plans'? Not sure I want to see the shop head of the rivets when
> looking
> > into the cowl air scoop.
>
> _-
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
| Subject: | RE: Washington Post article |
Mr. Kinney,
Nothing in your article made any sense. There are many easier ways to
destroy persons and places than what you describe.
Perhaps I should write an equally uninformed article for my newspapers about
the dangers of ex-Marines since they too have been occasionally involved in
mayhem. No, I don't think I will because that would be a disservice to
99.9999% of the honorable Marines out there.
You have maligned the entire GA industry with your swill. I doubt that you
could possibly find a more caring and patriotic group than pilots. On there
behalf, I'll just say I hope your article made you feel good. I wouldn't be
able to stand myself if I had insulted several million people like you have.
As Abe Lincoln allegedly said: "Better to remain silent and be thought a
fool than to speak up and remove all doubt." With your article you removed
all doubt.
Thanks for stirring up trouble where none was warranted. I only hope that
some day I have an opportunity to thoughtlessly skewer the industry that
provides your livelihood.
In the mean time... you're still an idiot.
Vince Frazier
-----Original Message-----
From: Joseph Kinney [mailto:jakinney(at)earthlink.net]
Subject: Re: Washington Post article
Thanks, Mr. Frazier. You obviously don't know what you are talking about.
There are lots of explosives that could be placed in a small plane with
devastating effects. Here is a general response:
Dear Friend:
The purpose of this communication is to respond to the many messages that I
have received concerning the article I wrote on general aviation security.
I regret this impersonal way of responding, but I simply do not have the
time to respond to every email in a detailed way.
Our world has changed since the Boeing airliners crashed in the World Trade
Center and Pentagon. We are fighting a clever and nearly invisible enemy
and this task will take our creative energy and hard-thinking if we are to
achieve success.
There are a number of things that I would like to say.
I apologize for the language "clog our skies." This was unfair and I am
sorry. I note that this characterization came from a USAF pilot but I am
responsible.
There are many threats to our national security. Our world was changed on
September 11. General aviation is just one potential area of concern. But
there are many valid scenarios that suggest that GA aircraft could be used
to inflict serious harm on the American public. As some of you know, a
16-year old boy flying with an instructor buzzed the Fayette, Georgia, fair,
nearly hitting a Ferris wheel and frightening fair goers. There are
numerous scenarios that could be proffered of small aircraft harming
hundreds of innocent people.
From a security professionals perspective, general aviation airfield
security in many locations is often very weak. There are 19,119 airports in
America with 219,464 planes. I suspect that larger GA facilities have some
security but many, probably a majority, have no security at all. Any one
can drive through open gates (if they exist at all) right up to a plane.
While many pilots lock and secure their planes, many do not.
There is technology available that could be developed to make it virtually
impossible for an unauthorized user to operate a plane. I think that this
technology is worth exploring.
The long-term response to our enemy will come through (1) better
intelligence and (2) pre-emptive strikes that will destroy those who oppose
us. In other words, we need to identify our enemy and destroy him before he
has the chance to harm us. I advocate a no-prisoners policy, which is a
departure from our historic practice. Americans who aid our enemy should
likewise be incarcerated as a threat to our security.
The general aviation is a valuable industry and it should be restored to
flying at the earliest possible time. I would like to see this industry
grow and prosper and would oppose any measures that would harm it.
I find it interesting that only a handful of correspondents have asked me to
identify ways that security professionals could help make this industry more
secure. Frankly, I do not have the time to provide the type of study that
can and should be done beyond what I have done here.
I would like to tell you about me personally. I have benefited from the
enormous contributions that general aviation provides. I think, for
example, of the mercy flights that corporations make for sick children. I
once had a child who was sick in a hospital for nearly two months 2,010
miles from home. He could not be stabilized and eventually died after 47
days in a hospital.
I grew up in the heart of the general aviation industry in Wichita, Kansas.
I had five brothers and at one time or another they worked for Beech,
Cessna, Lear Jet, and Boeing. One brother, now deceased, was an
aeronautical engineer and another brother is a GA pilot.
It saddens me to realize how many people have personalized what I have
written as a personal attack from me upon them. It is equally distressing
to realize that many individuals believe that I am writing about them and
their personal aircraft. Many GA pilots see flying as a cherished right,
not a privilege. I think that the events of September 11 may change that
once and for all.
Finally, I am a former Marine who has fought and nearly died for this
country. A number of people have made especially offensive comments to me
that make me wonder what motivates some of you. We need to place our
nations interests first, not those of our personal agenda.
In closing, we will require Gods grace and wisdom to handle this crisis.
Our President has said we are at war. Lets think about our nation, and
pray for Gods help.
Sincerely,
JOSEPH A. KINNEY
----------
>From: "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu>
>To: "'jakinney(at)earthlink.net'"
>Subject: Washington Post article
>Date: Fri, Sep 28, 2001, 11:02 AM
>
> Dear Mr. Kinney,
>
> This is a small portion of the swill you printed in the Washington Post:
>
> "General aviation, which serves business and recreational fliers,
> encompasses 7,120 jets and about 25,000 multi-engine aircraft flown by
about
> 200,000 pilots who have instrument ratings. Each of these larger planes
> could easily be transformed into a weapon of mass destruction if it were
> laden with explosives"
>
> You're an idiot.
>
> Vince Frazier
> pp-sel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bvondane(at)cso.atmel.com> |
| Subject: | Prop Flange Bushings... |
The prop flange bushings that came with the engine were 3/8", and the
prop and associated hardware that came with my prop is all 7/16".
In looking for a solution I came up with two alternatives; Get new
bushings from Lycoming for around $350, or send my 3/8" bushings off to
Aero Sport Power (Bart Lalonde, 800-667-0522 250-376-2955
proair(at)mail.ocis.net) and he would drill and tap them to 7/16". I
decided on the latter due to the fact it was about 10 times cheaper...
So.....on the way to the hanger I stopped in to see one of the A&P's out
at the airport for help in getting the old ones out, and as luck would
have it, he not only had some bolts I could use to remove the old ones,
he also had two sets of 7/16" bushings, but no 3/8", so he swapped me...
Once again I have to say how great the support from the local builders,
mechanics, & pilots has been at my airport.....Thanks!!
I have added a couple pictures of the bushing swap, as well as a
description of how I did it on my web site...
http://vondane.com/rv8a/engine/engine1.htm
I also mounted the engine on my Progress page.....Take a look!
http://vondane.com/rv8a/progress/index.htm
-Bill VonDane
Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A - N8VD
http://vondane.com/rv8a/
mailto:bill(at)vondane.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Zilik" <zilik(at)bewellnet.com> |
| Subject: | VM 1000 intallation question |
I want to mount the fuel flow transducer in the line between the
electric boost pump and the firewall. The VM1000 manual says I gota put
it between the engine driven pump and the carb. I can see no reason why
the xducer can't be mounted after the boost pump. Only problem would be
pulsing when the boost pump is on.
Where have you flying guys/gals installed the transducer and how well
does it work. Pictures would sure be great.
Gary Zilik
RV-8A (helping)
RV-6 (finish kit)
RV-6A N99PZ (Flying, Well actually only my wife is allowed to fly, so
says the FAA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Zilik" <zilik(at)bewellnet.com> |
"rv-list(at)matronics.com"
| Subject: | just off the press, Does this mean I can fly |
7. EXCEPT FOR THE BOSTON ENHANCED CLASS B AIRSPACE AREA AND
EXCEPT FOR OPERATIONS WITHIN THE TEMPORARY FLIGHT
RESTRICTION AREAS FOR THE NEW YORK AND WASHINGTON DC
AREAS
INSIDE "ENHANCED CLASS B AIRSPACE" EXCEPT FOR THE
FOLLOWING: NEWS REPORTING OPERATIONS AND TRAFFIC WATCH
FLIGHT OPERATIONS, CIVIL AIRCRAFT BANNER TOWING
OPERATIONS, SIGHTSEEING OPERATIONS (IN ROTORCRAFT AND
AIRPLANES) CONDUCTED FOR COMPENSATION OR HIRE (UNDER
PART 91, PURSUANT TO THE EXCEPTION IN 119.1(E)(2)), AND
AIRSHIP/BLIMP OPERATIONS.
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question |
O.K, I have made clay forms for the roll your own fairings between the wheel
fairings and gear leg fairings on my -6. Now I'm staring at them wondering
how the heck to go about laying fiberglass on them. Because of the very
compound curved shape did you guys lay them up using many small pieces of
glass cloth, or?? Any and all suggestions welcomed. Also, the manual says
to cut them along the wheel pant split line but I have seen many that don't
have a split, at least on top. How'd you do it? Thanks.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, finish kit stuff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Bower" <rvbuilder(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | The latest insanity |
From AOPA's website:
"9/28/01 3:21:20 PM, ET The FAA has just issued a new notam, consolidating
and clarifying a number of previous notams governing operations in the
nation's airspace.
The new notam now says that supervised student solo flight (in
piston-powered aircraft with a gross weight of less than 6,000 pounds) is
permitted in enhanced Class B airspace (except in the Boston enhanced Class
B and the Washington and New York TFRs), but VFR flight by certificated
pilots is still prohibited you read that correctly."
I can't help but feel we're being punished for something.
Jim Bower
St. Louis, MO
RV-6A N143DJ
Wings (Fuselage parts inventoried and waiting)
>From: "Gary Zilik" <zilik(at)bewellnet.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: "Denis Walsh" , "rv-list(at)matronics.com"
>
>Subject: RV-List: just off the press, Does this mean I can fly
>Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2001 12:24:18 -0600
>
>
>7. EXCEPT FOR THE BOSTON ENHANCED CLASS B AIRSPACE AREA AND
>
> EXCEPT FOR OPERATIONS WITHIN THE TEMPORARY FLIGHT
>
> RESTRICTION AREAS FOR THE NEW YORK AND WASHINGTON DC
>AREAS
>
>
> INSIDE "ENHANCED CLASS B AIRSPACE" EXCEPT FOR THE
>
> FOLLOWING: NEWS REPORTING OPERATIONS AND TRAFFIC WATCH
>
> FLIGHT OPERATIONS, CIVIL AIRCRAFT BANNER TOWING
>
> OPERATIONS, SIGHTSEEING OPERATIONS (IN ROTORCRAFT AND
>
> AIRPLANES) CONDUCTED FOR COMPENSATION OR HIRE (UNDER
>
> PART 91, PURSUANT TO THE EXCEPTION IN 119.1(E)(2)), AND
>
> AIRSHIP/BLIMP OPERATIONS.
>
>Gary
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question |
Rip the clay off and buy the intersection fairings from Team Rocket. It
will save you hundreds of hours of work. They are beautiful and fit very
well, right out of the box.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <HCRV6(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question
O.K, I have made clay forms for the roll your own fairings between the wheel
fairings and gear leg fairings on my -6. Now I'm staring at them wondering
how the heck to go about laying fiberglass on them. Because of the very
compound curved shape did you guys lay them up using many small pieces of
glass cloth, or?? Any and all suggestions welcomed. Also, the manual says
to cut them along the wheel pant split line but I have seen many that don't
have a split, at least on top. How'd you do it? Thanks.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, finish kit stuff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wilson, James Mike" <james.mike.wilson(at)intel.com> |
| Subject: | Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question |
Do a one on two layer flash lay-up. After it cures, clean everything up, fit
it in place and add mode material to gain strength and attachment. Clean up
with sand paper and/or file. lay one more outer layer. After the last layer
cures finish with micro in consistency of wet peanut butter. Finish and
paint using multi coats of filler primer then paint.
Wilson RV4
-----Original Message-----
From: HCRV6(at)aol.com [mailto:HCRV6(at)aol.com]
Subject: RV-List: Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question
O.K, I have made clay forms for the roll your own fairings between the wheel
fairings and gear leg fairings on my -6. Now I'm staring at them wondering
how the heck to go about laying fiberglass on them. Because of the very
compound curved shape did you guys lay them up using many small pieces of
glass cloth, or?? Any and all suggestions welcomed. Also, the manual says
to cut them along the wheel pant split line but I have seen many that don't
have a split, at least on top. How'd you do it? Thanks.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, finish kit stuff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Owens, Laird" <Owens(at)aerovironment.com> |
| Subject: | VM 1000 intallation question |
Gary,
I put the transducer on the firewall after the boost pump and gascolator and before
the engine driven pump. I have the E.I. fuel computer. (A fuel flow computer
is by far the most valuable "gizmo" engine instrument on the panel, IMHO).
The only problem I have is that the fuel flow reads high (by 2-3 gph) when the
boost pump is on. So I put the computer on FF mode on takeoff. Usually the first
time I look at the FF and see the high readings, it reminds me to turn the
boost pump off.
If I leave the boost pump on, the fuel totals will be off.
Laird
RV-6 360 hrs
SoCal
From: rv-list(at)matronics.com on Fri, Sep 28, 2001 11:53 AM
Subject: RV-List: VM 1000 intallation question
I want to mount the fuel flow transducer in the line between the
electric boost pump and the firewall. The VM1000 manual says I gota put
it between the engine driven pump and the carb. I can see no reason why
the xducer can't be mounted after the boost pump. Only problem would be
pulsing when the boost pump is on.
Where have you flying guys/gals installed the transducer and how well
does it work. Pictures would sure be great.
Gary Zilik
RV-8A (helping)
RV-6 (finish kit)
RV-6A N99PZ (Flying, Well actually only my wife is allowed to fly, so
says the FAA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Caldwell" <racaldwell(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question |
100's of hours, yea, right. I had mine formed with clay and
fiberglassed/epoxied in one afternoon. The filling and sanding was another
story. Harry, the trick in laying up fiberglass around compound curves is
to cut the cloth on the bias. That means cut the strips out at 45 degrees to
the threads. This will allow the cloth to stretch in any direction. I used
about 3 plies of 5.7 oz. cloth. And extra couple plies around the edges. I
split mine at the trailing edge only. One #6 screw holds it on in front (on
the front wheel pant.) Three more screws hold it on to the rear wheel pant.
Top gear leg fairings are the same with a split in the rear.
Rick Caldwell
-6 Melbourne, FL
>From: "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question
>Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2001 13:12:19 -0700
>
>
>Rip the clay off and buy the intersection fairings from Team Rocket. It
>will save you hundreds of hours of work. They are beautiful and fit very
>well, right out of the box.
>
>Paul Besing
>RV-6A N197AB Arizona
>http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
>Flying
>Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
>http://www.kitlog.com
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <HCRV6(at)aol.com>
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question
>
>
>O.K, I have made clay forms for the roll your own fairings between the
>wheel
>fairings and gear leg fairings on my -6. Now I'm staring at them wondering
>how the heck to go about laying fiberglass on them. Because of the very
>compound curved shape did you guys lay them up using many small pieces of
>glass cloth, or?? Any and all suggestions welcomed. Also, the manual says
>to cut them along the wheel pant split line but I have seen many that don't
>have a split, at least on top. How'd you do it? Thanks.
>
>Harry Crosby
>Pleasanton, California
>RV-6, finish kit stuff
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bvondane(at)cso.atmel.com> |
| Subject: | Bendix RT221 Comm Wiring Diagram |
Anyone have a wiring diagram for a Bendix RT221 Comm?
Thanks...
-Bill VonDane
Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A - N8VD
http://vondane.com/rv8a/
mailto:bill(at)vondane.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Bell" <dbell(at)manisteenational.com> |
If anyone would be remotely interested, We have a very well done panel for
an 8 for sale. We ended up buying three before we ended up just where we
wanted to. It is set up very centerline oriented and we were going to use
the micro air transponder and tranceiver. All the holes were cut on a
bridgeport mill with an expert at the controls....If anyone is interested in
seeing it, I will attempt to get a pic this weekend and post of forward to
anyone interested.
Doug Bell
8qb
Panel painted and done,
(#3 that is)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Arthur Glaser <airplane(at)megsinet.net> |
Charles Reeves--dec 99 ,
Colin Koebel , dhoop ,
doc , earl stark ,
Gary Glaser , greg ,
Jaugilas , Kurt Faron ,
marsha schwarz , miles jacobs ,
"PascomCorp(at)aol.com" ,
"Pegit2(at)aol.com" , Phil Branshaw ,
shakib a qutob , Sherry Berman-Robinson ,
"SSBubbe(at)aol.com" , sue gregor ,
"rv-list(at)matronics.com"
| Subject: | [Fwd: [Fwd: Fw: Fw: [Fwd: FW: (Fwd) Fw: Gold Star Mothers.......... |
vs
Hillary Clinton(fwd)]]]
> HANOI HILLIARY?
>
> > > >Subject: Re: [Fwd: FW: (Fwd) Fw: Gold Star Mothers.......... vs Hillary
> > > >Clinton (fwd)]
> > >>
> > > > > > > >Gold Star Mothers is an organization made up of women whose sons
> > > >were
> > > > > > > >killed in military combat during service in the United States
> > armed
> > > > > > > >forces. Recently a delegation of New York State Gold Star Mothers
> > > >made a
> > > > > > > >trip to Washington, DC to discuss various concerns with their
> > > >elected
> > > > > > > >representatives. According to newsMax.com there was only one
> > > >politician
> > > > > > > >in DC who refused to meet with these ladies. Can you guess which
> > > > > > > >politician that might be? Was it New York Senator Charles
> > Schumer?
> > > >Nope,
> > > > > > > >he met with them. Try again. Do you know anyone serving in the
> > > >Senate
> > > > > > > >who has never showed anything but contempt for our military? Do
> > you
> > > > > > > >happen to know the name of any politician in Washington who's
> > > >husband
> > > > > > > >once wrote of his loathing of the military? Now you're getting
> > > >warm!
> > > >You
> > > > > > > >got it! None other than the Queen herself, Hillary Clinton. She
> > > >refused
> > > > > > > >repeated Requests to meet with the Gold Star Mothers. Now ---
> > > >please
> > > > > > > >don't tell me you're surprised.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >This woman wants to be president of the United States --- and
> > there
> > > >is a
> > > > > > > >huge percentage of the voters who are anxious to help her achieve
> > > >that.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >Sincerely, Cdr Hamilton McWhorter
> > > > > > > >USN(ret)
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >Please forward this to as many people as you can. We don't want
> > > >this
> > > > > > > >woman to even think of running for President.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > David Szumowski
> > > > > > > dszumow(at)attglobal.net
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _________________________________________________________________
> > >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | doyal plute <dplute(at)onemain.com> |
With the abundance of late model wrecked cars in the salvage yards with
perfectly good seat belts, has anyone used them in R.V. aircraft? If
so, how good was the outcome?
Also, attaching the wingtips on a RV 6 A, either pop rivet, screws with
nutplates or glue on with proseal. What seems to work the best?
Sincerely:
D Plute
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Re: VM 1000 intallation question |
Gary,
I think the reason is that fuel pumps don't "suck" very well, they're good
at pushing fuel but not so good at pulling it. So, putting the transducer in
the inlet side of the pump is adding a another restriction on the weak side
of the pump which causes the pump to have to work harder at something it
doesn't like.
Personally, I like to keep my fuel pump happy!
Dave -6 SoCal
Gary Zilik wrote:
>
> I want to mount the fuel flow transducer in the line between the
> electric boost pump and the firewall. The VM1000 manual says I gota put
> it between the engine driven pump and the carb. I can see no reason why
> the xducer can't be mounted after the boost pump. Only problem would be
> pulsing when the boost pump is on.
>
> Where have you flying guys/gals installed the transducer and how well
> does it work. Pictures would sure be great.
>
> Gary Zilik
> RV-8A (helping)
> RV-6 (finish kit)
> RV-6A N99PZ (Flying, Well actually only my wife is allowed to fly, so
> says the FAA)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Re: just off the press, Does this mean I can fly |
You missed one important thing: "NOTAM, PART 91 "(IFR)" OPERATIONS ARE
AUTHORIZED"
Dave
Gary Zilik wrote:
>
> 7. EXCEPT FOR THE BOSTON ENHANCED CLASS B AIRSPACE AREA AND
>
> EXCEPT FOR OPERATIONS WITHIN THE TEMPORARY FLIGHT
>
> RESTRICTION AREAS FOR THE NEW YORK AND WASHINGTON DC
> AREAS
>
>
> INSIDE "ENHANCED CLASS B AIRSPACE" EXCEPT FOR THE
>
> FOLLOWING: NEWS REPORTING OPERATIONS AND TRAFFIC WATCH
>
> FLIGHT OPERATIONS, CIVIL AIRCRAFT BANNER TOWING
>
> OPERATIONS, SIGHTSEEING OPERATIONS (IN ROTORCRAFT AND
>
> AIRPLANES) CONDUCTED FOR COMPENSATION OR HIRE (UNDER
>
> PART 91, PURSUANT TO THE EXCEPTION IN 119.1(E)(2)), AND
>
> AIRSHIP/BLIMP OPERATIONS.
>
> Gary
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "jayeandscott" <jayeandscott(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question |
Split my lower fairings horizontally aft of the gear leg. I noticed that
even on the new RV-7 demonstrator that vertical split causes the aft
section's forward edge to curl out into the airflow and stay that way...
Scott in Vancouver
----- Original Message -----
From: Wilson, James Mike <james.mike.wilson(at)intel.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question
>
> Do a one on two layer flash lay-up. After it cures, clean everything up,
fit
> it in place and add mode material to gain strength and attachment. Clean
up
> with sand paper and/or file. lay one more outer layer. After the last
layer
> cures finish with micro in consistency of wet peanut butter. Finish and
> paint using multi coats of filler primer then paint.
>
> Wilson RV4
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: HCRV6(at)aol.com [mailto:HCRV6(at)aol.com]
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question
>
>
> O.K, I have made clay forms for the roll your own fairings between the
wheel
>
> fairings and gear leg fairings on my -6. Now I'm staring at them
wondering
> how the heck to go about laying fiberglass on them. Because of the very
> compound curved shape did you guys lay them up using many small pieces of
> glass cloth, or?? Any and all suggestions welcomed. Also, the manual
says
> to cut them along the wheel pant split line but I have seen many that
don't
> have a split, at least on top. How'd you do it? Thanks.
>
> Harry Crosby
> Pleasanton, California
> RV-6, finish kit stuff
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Harvey Sigmon" <flyhars(at)earthlink.net> |
--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---
text/html
--- StripMime Errors ---
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resend the email using plaintext formatting
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Thomas Mosher" <tmosher(at)gbronline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: The latest insanity |
We're being punished for electing a stupid government.
Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Bower" <rvbuilder(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: The latest insanity
>
> >From AOPA's website:
>
> "9/28/01 3:21:20 PM, ET The FAA has just issued a new notam,
consolidating
> and clarifying a number of previous notams governing operations in the
> nation's airspace.
>
> The new notam now says that supervised student solo flight (in
> piston-powered aircraft with a gross weight of less than 6,000 pounds) is
> permitted in enhanced Class B airspace (except in the Boston enhanced
Class
> B and the Washington and New York TFRs), but VFR flight by certificated
> pilots is still prohibited you read that correctly."
>
>
> I can't help but feel we're being punished for something.
>
> Jim Bower
> St. Louis, MO
> RV-6A N143DJ
> Wings (Fuselage parts inventoried and waiting)
>
>
> >From: "Gary Zilik" <zilik(at)bewellnet.com>
> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >To: "Denis Walsh" , "rv-list(at)matronics.com"
> >
> >Subject: RV-List: just off the press, Does this mean I can fly
> >Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2001 12:24:18 -0600
> >
> >
> >7. EXCEPT FOR THE BOSTON ENHANCED CLASS B AIRSPACE AREA AND
> >
> > EXCEPT FOR OPERATIONS WITHIN THE TEMPORARY FLIGHT
> >
> > RESTRICTION AREAS FOR THE NEW YORK AND WASHINGTON DC
> >AREAS
> >
> >
> > INSIDE "ENHANCED CLASS B AIRSPACE" EXCEPT FOR THE
> >
> > FOLLOWING: NEWS REPORTING OPERATIONS AND TRAFFIC WATCH
> >
> > FLIGHT OPERATIONS, CIVIL AIRCRAFT BANNER TOWING
> >
> > OPERATIONS, SIGHTSEEING OPERATIONS (IN ROTORCRAFT AND
> >
> > AIRPLANES) CONDUCTED FOR COMPENSATION OR HIRE (UNDER
> >
> > PART 91, PURSUANT TO THE EXCEPTION IN 119.1(E)(2)), AND
> >
> > AIRSHIP/BLIMP OPERATIONS.
> >
> >Gary
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Brian Huffaker <bifft(at)xmission.com> |
,
Roberta Hood ,
| Subject: | A slap in the face. |
I've been patient. We all knew after the attack that there would be
poorly thought out over-reactions, but was confident that eventually
reason would prevail.
But this is just too much. To be told that student pilots can solo
in "extended class B", but that I am still too much of a threat to
national security to be allowed off the ground is beyond insulting.
It wasn't terrorists who did this to me, it was my own government. I'm
tired of being treated like the enemy. Earlier on the RV-List someone
(I don't remember who) proffered the idea of a little civil disobedience.
At the time, I thought it was a good idea, but a bit premature. Even
now, I think it is too early (hopefully somebody will explain to the NSC
how stupid this is).
However it is something we need to start thinking about. When is it
time to stop obeying a unjust rule, and start doing something more than
complain? There is a long tradition of peaceful civil disobedience in
this country, this isn't being unpatriotic. It's time to start talking
about this.
Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com)
RV-8A 80091 Skinning fuse.
1/4 Starduster II N23UT not flying :(
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard D. Fogerson" <rickf(at)velocitus.net> |
| Subject: | Inadvertant flying in clouds |
I'm giving some thought to a strictly VFR day instrument panel for my
RV-3 and wanted the opinion of some of you, especially those with
experience with the Navaid auto-pilot. I put a turn and bank in an
RV-6A with the thought that if I somehow couldn't avoid entering a
cloud, I would be able to get through it right side up. I never did
have to but came close from time to time punching through a hole in the
clouds with marginal climb cabability. I'm considering doing the same
thing again or perhaps biteing the bullet and putting in a artificial
horizon. I have decided already that a Navaid would be very useful in a
single seat cross-country airplane but I'm also wondering if it could be
switched on if entering a cloud is unavoidable to get thru it once again
right side up and thus eliminate the considerable cost of the AH or the
T&B. I would appreciate any opinions.
Rick Fogerson, RV-3 empenage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "dave ford" <dford(at)michweb.net> |
I've had my sliding canopy completed for a month or so now and had left
the plastic sheeting on most of the plexiglass just to protect it as
much as possible. As I peeled back the top and bottom to get an idea
what it was really going to look like peering through the canopy I
noticed what at first I thought was some Lexel overflow that I used to
seal the canopy side skirts. After seeing that it wouldn't come off it
took quite a while to convince myself that I had a crack forming on my
canopy. Above the side skirt at the first forward screw up 1/4 inch
and diagonally aft 1/2 inch is the offender. I see in the archives that
methylene chloride, Weldon 3 or 5, is what has been used to "fuse" the
crack together. For those who know, is it best to stop drill if using
this method or is it just best to stop drill period?
Dave Ford
RV6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wvu(at)mail.ameritel.net |
| Subject: | Re: N602RV flies |
Congrats, Harvey!!!
Where did you find a test pilot?
Anh
>
>--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---
>text/html
>--- StripMime Errors ---
>A message with no text/plain section was received.
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>resend the email using plaintext formatting
>---
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | old ogre <jollyd(at)ipns.com> |
| Subject: | does anyone know |
will the gear fairings for the RV6 fit on the RV8?...thanks...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | czechsix(at)juno.com |
Guys, I looked at the pictures of the gascolator / fuel pump setups in
the wingroot referenced below. I have a few comments for those of you
considering going this route. On the setup shown for Rob Acker's
aircraft, the fuel line between the pump and gascolator is quite short
and has only a single bend of about 45 deg. or less. Generally on
aircraft it is desirable to have a greater bend and/or a longer section
of fuel line between to flared fittings. This is to allow some flexing
between components, and allows the fuel line to be properly tightened
without creating undue stress on the line or fittings. In Rob Acker's
installation, IMHO, it is somewhat marginal and could lend to fatigue
cracks, leaks, etc. It might never cause a problem, but to be on the
safe side, the other picture showing Don Hughes installation is more
ideal from the perspective of fuel line routing. The potential downside
is a lot more twists and turns (one reason to consider the cylindrical
Facet pump which makes the fuel line routing much less contorted). If I
remember right from A&P school I think AC43.13 has some guidelines to
follow for fluid line routing, and the principles behind the guidelines.
If Das Fed or anyone who has looked at it more recently wants to pipe up,
feel free....
No Flame Intended against Rob or Don, hopefully their installations will
never cause trouble but I just wanted to provide some pointers for
consideration....
Regards,
--Mark Navratil
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
RV-8A fuselage...
--------
From: Charlie Kuss <chaskuss(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RE:Gascolators
Martin
You can find better photos of Don Hughes setup of both the gascolator and
Facet
fuel pump in the wing root at the link below. We also have photos of Rob
Ackers
version of this setup as well.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SEFlaRVbuilders/files/Fuel%20System%20Photo
s%20%26%20Drawings/
Charlie Kuss
RV-8A fuselage on hiatus till the heat dies down next month
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Gascolators and Fuel Pumps in Wing Root |
| From: | czechsix(at)juno.com |
Jim,
I know it's been a couple days since this post but I wanted to clarify a
couple things since your response was to my post on putting my Facet pump
and gascolator in the wing root.
First of all, you mention that you "see places for problems" and ask why
not follow Van's plans....and mention the case of "one glorified system
that didn't work". Can you elaborate on what went wrong with this system
so we can benefit from the specifics of this case you're referring to?
I have seen some potential problems with other installations, especially
when trying to cram the square Facet pump Vans sells into the wingroot
with the gascolator (more on that in separate post...).
In my case, with the cylindrical Facet pump, none of the bends in the
fuel system are any tighter than what I see in Van's design (although
there may be one or two extra bends if you add them up). I have spent
some time thinking about it and can't see any problems with putting the
pump and gascolator in the wing root this way. As an engineer by trade I
agree that any deviation from the tried and true may cause unforseen
problems, but when it is done carefully and methodically, it can also be
safe and even an improvement. My specific reason for going this route is
for several reasons. One is that I want to run autofuel in my airplane
eventually, and after discussions with Todd Peterson who holds STC's for
numerous spam cans for autofuel conversions, he said to avoid vaporlock
problems during the most extreme hot weather conditions, it's best to put
the pump as close to the fuel tanks as possible, and keep both the pump
and gascolator as cool as possible. Putting them both in the wingroot
keeps them well away from the hot engine compartment and puts the pump
inlet within an inch of the bottom of the fuel tank, and the gascolator
at the lowest point in the system. My decision to use the cylindrical
Facet pump is twofold....because it makes the routing of the fuel lines
in the wingroot MUCH easier, and because it has a good-sized inlet filter
element that's easy to clean and inspect. And it has worked well on
thousands of Piper aircraft.
If you have specific issues with my proposal that scare you, or if you
can point out any places for problems, I'd be seriously interested in
hearing them. It's always good to have a second opinion, as long as the
advice is objective. Just because I can't see a problem with it doesn't
mean there isn't one. They didn't think the Titanic could sink but
obviously they didn't think of everything.... : )
Regards,
-Mark Navratil
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
RV-8A fuselage.....waiting to see if I can keep my job before ordering
the Finish Kit....
From: "Jim Sears" <sears(at)searnet.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Gascolators and Fuel Pumps in Wing Root
I'm reading some methods of installing gascolators and pumps that simply
scare me. I know you guys think you have safe systems, and may have;
but, I
sure do see places for problems. Have you ever thought of just following
Van's plans and going with something that already works? Sorry; but,
Pat
Patterson and I have already seen one glorified system that didn't work
and
spent a lot of time rebuilding the results of that system. Yeah, it
worked
for a while; but, it had many places to invite trouble. It eventually
did
have trouble and suffered for it. It took us quite a while to rebuild
that
airplane.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wvu(at)mail.ameritel.net |
| Subject: | Re: A slap in the face. |
Brian,
I feel for all of you who are stuck in the extended Class B's. I think it
is hard to separate you from the threat, rather than targeting you as a
threat.
Is it possible to haul your plane 20 miles or so so that you'd be outside
of the extended Class B?
N985VU
Maryland
>
> I've been patient. We all knew after the attack that there would be
>poorly thought out over-reactions, but was confident that eventually
>reason would prevail.
>
> But this is just too much. To be told that student pilots can solo
>in "extended class B", but that I am still too much of a threat to
>national security to be allowed off the ground is beyond insulting.
>
> It wasn't terrorists who did this to me, it was my own government. I'm
>tired of being treated like the enemy. Earlier on the RV-List someone
>(I don't remember who) proffered the idea of a little civil disobedience.
>At the time, I thought it was a good idea, but a bit premature. Even
>now, I think it is too early (hopefully somebody will explain to the NSC
>how stupid this is).
>
> However it is something we need to start thinking about. When is it
>time to stop obeying a unjust rule, and start doing something more than
>complain? There is a long tradition of peaceful civil disobedience in
>this country, this isn't being unpatriotic. It's time to start talking
>about this.
>
> Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com)
> RV-8A 80091 Skinning fuse.
> 1/4 Starduster II N23UT not flying :(
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Gascolators and Fuel Pumps in Wing Root |
how does the round pump, pipe better in the wing root. where can i see a
picture of this pump?
scott
tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Cantrell <kcflyrv(at)pacbell.net> |
Hello fellow listers,
I'm well along the home stretch of finishing my RV6 QB. I just finished
bonding my wind screen to the foward top skin and roll bar. I'm happy
with the results. What I just discovered has made me soooo depressed.
I took my canopy down from the loft in my shop and noticed that one
ofthe rivets along the front bow did not hold. It appeared that the
rivet was not long enough to go through the needed spacers and the
canopy frame. I should have simply ordered some longer rivets but for
whatever reason I decided to tap the hole and install a flathead #6
screw. So far so good. I thought it would be a good idea to put some
lock-tight tokeep it tight. WRONG!
A few days later I was sickened to see a star of
cracks surrounding the screw. I was careful not to over tighten the
screw so I knew this was not the cause. When I called Van's this morning
to ask for a miracle, I was told that the lock-tight can cause a
reaction to the plexiglass and this was likely what happened. I was told
that sometimes the cracks don't grow too far but I somehow don't think
I'll be that lucky. I'm really not looking forward to another canopy job
but if I must, it will be done. I know there is some one out there who
has been down this road before. I would really appreciate any advice or
suggestions. At this point the cracks go out from the edge of the hole
about 3/8 to 1/2 inch. Is it time to order a new one?
Ken Cantrell
N34KC reserved
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question |
Take a look at http://www.edt.com/homewing/rhproject/fairings.html. Might be
helpful -- you can kind of see how I split the upper fairing at the trailing
edge, and overlapped the two halves so I only had to use one screw at the
back and one at the front. Wheel pant fairings might not be as useful since
mine are the old style. I used multiple strips to build up 4-5 layers of
glass. Did it in two stages like some others have suggested. The thicker
layup made it more forgiving -- allowed me to sand more aggressively to make
a smooth shape (I'm not that good at making a really smooth clay mold.) I
did have a 3rd and 4th step laying up little pieces to make the overlap for
the screw at the trailing edge.
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~280 hrs)
Portland, OR
www.vanshomewing.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Inadvertant flying in clouds |
[snip]
> I have decided already that a Navaid would be very useful in a
> single seat cross-country airplane but I'm also wondering if it could be
> switched on if entering a cloud is unavoidable to get thru it once again
> right side up and thus eliminate the considerable cost of the AH or the
> T&B. I would appreciate any opinions.
My opinion is, go for it. I don't see the sense in loading up your panel
with heavy and high-maintenance vacum gyros if you're only going to go VFR.
A Navaid, on the other hand, is useful VFR and could also be used to get you
out of a jamb in inadvertant IMC. If you didn't have an RV-3 I would have
suggested also going out and practicing such a scenario under the hood, but
I would recommend trying some "pretend" VFR into IMC -- go up and pretend
you flew into a cloud and think through what you'd do beyond just switching
on the Navaid: trim for climb? Pick a direction -- how? Call for help?
Transponder to 7600? What frequency? etc. There's a lot more to flying IFR,
especially if you're not ready for it, than just keeping the plane right
side up (though of course that's the MAIN thing).
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~280 hrs)
Portland, OR
www.vanshomewing.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George McNutt" <gmcnutt(at)intergate.ca> |
A few days later I was sickened to see a star of
cracks surrounding the screw. I was careful not to over tighten the
screw so I knew this was not the cause.
At this point the cracks go out from the edge of the hole
about 3/8 to 1/2 inch. Is it time to order a new one? (Windshield)
------------------------------------------------------
Hi Ken
I am not sure if you have crazing from the locktite or cracks in the plexi.
If it was my windshield I would clean the area where the locktite contacted
the plexi and leave it a few weeks to see if the crazing progresses any
further. If it has run it's course the outside cap strip will cover the
crazing. On the inside I would run a (full length) bead of proseal to bond
the plexi to the roll bar, (in case some of the other rivets are weak) then
paint a strip of the plexi wide enough to cover both the proseal and
crazing.
This is an opinion only as I have not had this problem, however I did have
to use up to 1/4 inch spacers on the canopy forward bow and used screws, I
filled the gap with proseal - good luck!
George McNutt - 6A
Langley, B.C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
I used screws and nutplates so I could removed them later.
Steve Soule
RV-6A
Huntington, Vermont
-----Original Message-----With the abundance of late model
wrecked cars in the salvage yards with
perfectly good seat belts, has anyone used them in R.V.
aircraft? If
so, how good was the outcome?
Also, attaching the wingtips on a RV 6 A, either pop rivet,
screws with
nutplates or glue on with proseal. What seems to work the
best?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Lawson <jwlawson(at)hargray.com> |
| Subject: | Jane FOnda urban legends |
Guys: take a look at
http://www.snopes2.com/inboxer/outrage/fonda.htm
and
http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/weekly/aa110399b.htm?once=true&
She did more than enough to sully her name forever. As one of the POWs said, "She
did enough to place her name in the trash bin of history," [Larry} McGrath
explained. "None of us need to make up stories on her."
Semper Fi
John
RV-6 (left wing in jig...headed to work...boot-camp work hours these days...sheesh)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Graham Murphy <jgmurphy(at)xtra.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Aileron Bellcrank Installation |
Folks
Am setting up the modifications to the Rib at wing sta 73.5 for the
aileron support structure and noticed two bad design details on the
drgs.
1. Mismatch
The fore/aft 0.125" thick angles sit on the rib at their fwd end but
sits on the 0.063" vertical angles at their aft ends. This means that
the fore/aft angles dont sit flat on the ribs. This should means using a
shim to eliminate the mismatch. I suspect that most builders dont bother
with a shim and just pull the rib up to the angle with the rivets.
Any comments??
2. Rivet location.
The aft rivet thru the overlap of the horizontal and vertical angles
falls smack in the middle of the beadied reinforcement around the
lightening hole. This is just plain stupid detail design.
What are people doing to accomodate this?? I am tempted to move the
vertical angle aft but will have to be careful with the rivet immediatly
above. Of course I have cut the 9.5" long angles already!!!
How are u guys (and gals) making this detail ??
Thanks a million.
We were privileged to dine at the top of the WTC a couple of years ago
and enjoy NYC's amazing hospitality during several visits whilst working
in CT.
Our country is horrified,please accept accept our deepest condolences
from the South pacific.
Graham Murphy
-6a in Blenheim New Zealand.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman, MD" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
Ken,
Let me ditto what George has said regarding the fix, but I know from first
hand experience.
I did all of my forward screws the way you said. I had a "perfect" canopy
that I was very proud of for about 4-5 days, then, within 2 or 3 days EVERY
hole cracked the way you have described. I think you will find that it is
not crazing from LockTite (which I used just like you) but real cracks in
the Plexi.
I did what George suggested, plus a little that you suggested: I took all
the screws out, then made sure the screw holes were drilled out one size
larger (to make sure it wasn't the change in temperature, etc, which caused
binding/cracking), then used some "WELD-ON 3" I bought from ACS. Here is
what the label says "Clear, water thin, very fast curing solvent cement for
joining Acrylic" This has to be put on with care... I used a toothpick,
because even a whole drop may run and make a mark on the "good" part of the
canopy. Once I cemented every crack in every hole about 4-5 times to make
sure I got everything I could, I then used a bead of "Goop" to help seal the
canopy to the frame (I could have used ProSeal, but I didn't). The idea was
to spread the attaching load across the entire length of the canopy/frame
interface instead of 16 or so individual spots. As noted by others along
this thread, I now have to paint a "trim line" on the canopy so the ugly
Goop is not seen. This paint stripe will be hidden under the front
windshield fiberglass bow when the canopy is closed.
Results? Well, you can still see all of my hundreds of little cracks (I
haven't painted the trim stripe yet), but over the past 6-7 months (since I
did this), they have not gotten any larger, and I have forgotten about them
and moved on. I think the biggest key is spreading the load across the
entire length of the canopy with some form of sealant/adhesive.
Don't fret too bad, as I see it, my problem was 16 times worse than yours,
and mine is fine (I think).
jim
Tampa
6A slider, finishing (two solid months of daily work into Sam James Cowl
which does not fit an RV6 in any way shape or form)
A few days later I was sickened to see a star of
cracks surrounding the screw. I was careful not to over tighten the
screw so I knew this was not the cause.
At this point the cracks go out from the edge of the hole
about 3/8 to 1/2 inch. Is it time to order a new one? (Windshield)
------------------------------------------------------
Hi Ken
I am not sure if you have crazing from the locktite or cracks in the plexi.
If it was my windshield I would clean the area where the locktite contacted
the plexi and leave it a few weeks to see if the crazing progresses any
further. If it has run it's course the outside cap strip will cover the
crazing. On the inside I would run a (full length) bead of proseal to bond
the plexi to the roll bar, (in case some of the other rivets are weak) then
paint a strip of the plexi wide enough to cover both the proseal and
crazing.
This is an opinion only as I have not had this problem, however I did have
to use up to 1/4 inch spacers on the canopy forward bow and used screws, I
filled the gap with proseal - good luck!
George McNutt - 6A
Langley, B.C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ripsteel(at)edge.net (Mark Phillips) |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Bellcrank Installation |
Graham Murphy wrote:
> Am setting up the modifications to the Rib at wing sta 73.5 for the
> aileron support structure and noticed two bad design details on the
> drgs.
>
> 1. Mismatch
> The fore/aft 0.125" thick angles sit on the rib at their fwd end but
> sits on the 0.063" vertical angles at their aft ends. This means that
> the fore/aft angles dont sit flat on the ribs. This should means using a
> shim to eliminate the mismatch. I suspect that most builders dont bother
> with a shim and just pull the rib up to the angle with the rivets.
> Any comments??
File or mill (preferred) the aft end of the long .125" thick angles to
create a recess that the .063 angles will lay in. Be careful to provide as
smooth a radius as possible where the 2 different thicknesses meet. This
will allow both angles to lay flat on the rib.
> 2. Rivet location.
> The aft rivet thru the overlap of the horizontal and vertical angles
> falls smack in the middle of the beadied reinforcement around the
> lightening hole.
Cut away the area of the reinforcing ring to allow access to the rivet (just
rivet the two angles together)- after the rib is "split" between the
lightening holes, this area of the rib becomes non-structural and the angle
assembly is much stronger anyway. If you want a picture I "may" have one
showing this. Contact me off-list if interested.
>
> Thanks a million.
No problem- that's what we're here for, right? (well, most of the time
anyway)
From The PossumWorks in TN
Mark Phillips -6A, still skinning fuse...
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Gascolators and Fuel Pumps in Wing Root |
| From: | czechsix(at)juno.com |
Scott,
If you look back about 3 or 4 days ago in the archives, I wrote a verbal
description of my proposed installation. Since I haven't completed it
yet, I don't have a picture but when I get it done I'll try to get some
pics of it. To see a picture of the pump, you can go to
http://members6.clubphoto.com/doug412210/503738/guest.phtml to see Rich
Rudolph's installation done at RV Central (look at the 4th, 6th, and 9th
pics on the page). His installation has the pump on the firewall, like
Piper does it, but you'll be able to see what the pump looks like. BTW,
if you do decide to use this pump, you will HAVE to mount it either in
the wingroot or on the firewall, because you need to be able to pull the
bottom off it to service the filter occasionally, and you wouldn't want
to have to do that inside the cockpit where Van locates the pump.
Regards,
--Mark Navratil
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
RV-8A fuselage...
From: ABAYMAN(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Gascolators and Fuel Pumps in Wing Root
how does the round pump, pipe better in the wing root. where can i see a
picture of this pump?
scott
tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Gascolators and Fuel Pumps in Wing Root |
| From: | czechsix(at)juno.com |
Thanks for the input Jim. I have debated a lot over the gascolator.....I
don't need it for the filtration, and it does add complexity, weight,
points of failure, etc. So the only reason I keep it is for the water
trap function. I know that most if not all the water in the tanks could
be drained when you sump the tanks on preflight. My concern has always
been that if you filled the tanks somewhere and there was a significant
amount of water in the fuel, or perhaps due to rain getting in, you end
up with water in the tank. It could take some time and vibration for all
the water to work it's way from the filler down through all the baffle
holes to the pickup. So you might not catch it on a preflight
immediately after fueling but if it works its way through the system in
flight......I know it's probly just paranoia, but all it takes is ONCE
and Murphy's Law being what it is, it'll happen on that night flight over
the mountains, etc etc.....
So with some reluctance I'll probably stick with the ancient, outdated,
but time-proven gascolator. BTW, I am using an Andair unit so I'm fairly
confident of the security and sturdiness compared with the older type
where the bowls were more likely to come loose and leak.
Regards,
--Mark Navratil
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
RV-8A fuselage....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David White" <dwhite17(at)columbus.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: A slap in the face. |
Don't over react. Most airspace is coming back to all levels of GA in
steps. Do something like disobey the airspace restrictions, and you'll be
sure to have all such privileges revoked for everyone.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Huffaker" <bifft(at)xmission.com>
Hood" ;
Subject: RV-List: A slap in the face.
>
> I've been patient. We all knew after the attack that there would be
> poorly thought out over-reactions, but was confident that eventually
> reason would prevail.
>
> But this is just too much. To be told that student pilots can solo
> in "extended class B", but that I am still too much of a threat to
> national security to be allowed off the ground is beyond insulting.
>
> It wasn't terrorists who did this to me, it was my own government. I'm
> tired of being treated like the enemy. Earlier on the RV-List someone
> (I don't remember who) proffered the idea of a little civil disobedience.
> At the time, I thought it was a good idea, but a bit premature. Even
> now, I think it is too early (hopefully somebody will explain to the NSC
> how stupid this is).
>
> However it is something we need to start thinking about. When is it
> time to stop obeying a unjust rule, and start doing something more than
> complain? There is a long tradition of peaceful civil disobedience in
> this country, this isn't being unpatriotic. It's time to start talking
> about this.
>
> Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com)
> RV-8A 80091 Skinning fuse.
> 1/4 Starduster II N23UT not flying :(
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eric Newton" <enewton57(at)cableone.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Bellcrank Installation |
Hi Graham,
I'm going from memory (which is poor) here so hopefully someone will correct
me if I'm wrong. My manual is at the hangar and I'm home so I can't look it
up right now. I think the manual calls for you to notch the .125 " angles
to fit around the vertical angle. That solves both problems as you don't
have to put a rivet at the intersection. The purpose of the vertical angle
is to reinforce the rib where it was cut to accommodate the bellcrank. The
purpose of the two .125" horizontal angles is to provide an attach point for
the aileron bellcrank. There is a picture of mine on the "Wings - Page 1"
of my website (listed below).
I will be going to the hangar today. When I get home I will write again and
verify if I'm correct or not.
Eric Newton - Long Beach, MS
RV-6A N57ME (FAA inspection scheduled for Oct.2, 2001)
www.ericsrv6a.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Graham Murphy <jgmurphy(at)xtra.co.nz>
Subject: RV-List: Aileron Bellcrank Installation
>
> Folks
>
> Am setting up the modifications to the Rib at wing sta 73.5 for the
> aileron support structure and noticed two bad design details on the
> drgs.
>
> 1. Mismatch
> The fore/aft 0.125" thick angles sit on the rib at their fwd end but
> sits on the 0.063" vertical angles at their aft ends. This means that
> the fore/aft angles dont sit flat on the ribs. This should means using a
> shim to eliminate the mismatch. I suspect that most builders dont bother
> with a shim and just pull the rib up to the angle with the rivets.
> Any comments??
>
> 2. Rivet location.
> The aft rivet thru the overlap of the horizontal and vertical angles
> falls smack in the middle of the beadied reinforcement around the
> lightening hole. This is just plain stupid detail design.
> What are people doing to accomodate this?? I am tempted to move the
> vertical angle aft but will have to be careful with the rivet immediatly
> above. Of course I have cut the 9.5" long angles already!!!
> How are u guys (and gals) making this detail ??
>
> Thanks a million.
>
> We were privileged to dine at the top of the WTC a couple of years ago
> and enjoy NYC's amazing hospitality during several visits whilst working
> in CT.
> Our country is horrified,please accept accept our deepest condolences
> from the South pacific.
>
> Graham Murphy
> -6a in Blenheim New Zealand.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mel Jordan" <n6jx(at)earthlink.net> |
I ended up doing a modification to my false spar on the RV6A that I
would like to pass on. As I started doing the wiring, I wanted to run
wires through the two (I made a second per Van's approval) holes in the
spar web. Van's has also approved that the spar web on the wings can
be slotted between these holes and the edge, permitting the wings to
slide into place with the wire bundles already run. So accordingly, I
made my false spar in two pieces, split in the middle as the wing spars
would be, and notched the false spar like the wing spars. This way I
can run all my wires with the false spar(s) in place and then easily
remove them without disturbing any wires.
Mel Jordan
Tucson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Rabaut" <crabaut(at)coalinga.com> |
| Subject: | Inadvertant flying in clouds |
Rick,
Maybe my "style" of flyin' is different than yours... but I would
strongly recommend AT A MINIMUM to have an A.H. and a turn/bank. God knows
I (and alot of others out there) would have been toast several times
without such devices; despite our efforts to maintain "VFR".
Chuck
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard D. Fogerson <rickf(at)velocitus.net>
Subject: RV-List: Inadvertant flying in clouds
>
> I'm giving some thought to a strictly VFR day instrument panel for my
> RV-3 and wanted the opinion of some of you, especially those with
> experience with the Navaid auto-pilot. I put a turn and bank in an
> RV-6A with the thought that if I somehow couldn't avoid entering a
> cloud, I would be able to get through it right side up. I never did
> have to but came close from time to time punching through a hole in the
> clouds with marginal climb cabability. I'm considering doing the same
> thing again or perhaps biteing the bullet and putting in a artificial
> horizon. I have decided already that a Navaid would be very useful in a
> single seat cross-country airplane but I'm also wondering if it could be
> switched on if entering a cloud is unavoidable to get thru it once again
> right side up and thus eliminate the considerable cost of the AH or the
> T&B. I would appreciate any opinions.
>
> Rick Fogerson, RV-3 empenage
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Aileron Bellcrank Installation |
graham,
before you rivit the angles to the rib, build up your belcrank assebly. then
get the proper spacers and washers. sit the belcrank between the 2 angles and
clamp them together. makes sure the bolt head or nut doesn't come closer to
1/8 of an inch from your angles. many builders followed the plans and the nut
just bearly misses the angle, and if the wing flexes in flight, just might
jam. i had to locate a thin locking nut to give adaquate spacing.
just givin you a heads up.
thanks for the kind remarks
scott
tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy disaster |
Jim's right..if you can get some Weldon-3 or Weldon-5 that will stop
everything. Jim suggested using a toothpick. Even better, if you can get a
syringe with a small needle, that will work even better. I recall a plastic
shop using a glass horse syringe. I think you would need to use glass to
keep the Weldon from reacting.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Norman, MD" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Canopy disaster
Ken,
Let me ditto what George has said regarding the fix, but I know from first
hand experience.
I did all of my forward screws the way you said. I had a "perfect" canopy
that I was very proud of for about 4-5 days, then, within 2 or 3 days EVERY
hole cracked the way you have described. I think you will find that it is
not crazing from LockTite (which I used just like you) but real cracks in
the Plexi.
I did what George suggested, plus a little that you suggested: I took all
the screws out, then made sure the screw holes were drilled out one size
larger (to make sure it wasn't the change in temperature, etc, which caused
binding/cracking), then used some "WELD-ON 3" I bought from ACS. Here is
what the label says "Clear, water thin, very fast curing solvent cement for
joining Acrylic" This has to be put on with care... I used a toothpick,
because even a whole drop may run and make a mark on the "good" part of the
canopy. Once I cemented every crack in every hole about 4-5 times to make
sure I got everything I could, I then used a bead of "Goop" to help seal the
canopy to the frame (I could have used ProSeal, but I didn't). The idea was
to spread the attaching load across the entire length of the canopy/frame
interface instead of 16 or so individual spots. As noted by others along
this thread, I now have to paint a "trim line" on the canopy so the ugly
Goop is not seen. This paint stripe will be hidden under the front
windshield fiberglass bow when the canopy is closed.
Results? Well, you can still see all of my hundreds of little cracks (I
haven't painted the trim stripe yet), but over the past 6-7 months (since I
did this), they have not gotten any larger, and I have forgotten about them
and moved on. I think the biggest key is spreading the load across the
entire length of the canopy with some form of sealant/adhesive.
Don't fret too bad, as I see it, my problem was 16 times worse than yours,
and mine is fine (I think).
jim
Tampa
6A slider, finishing (two solid months of daily work into Sam James Cowl
which does not fit an RV6 in any way shape or form)
A few days later I was sickened to see a star of
cracks surrounding the screw. I was careful not to over tighten the
screw so I knew this was not the cause.
At this point the cracks go out from the edge of the hole
about 3/8 to 1/2 inch. Is it time to order a new one? (Windshield)
------------------------------------------------------
Hi Ken
I am not sure if you have crazing from the locktite or cracks in the plexi.
If it was my windshield I would clean the area where the locktite contacted
the plexi and leave it a few weeks to see if the crazing progresses any
further. If it has run it's course the outside cap strip will cover the
crazing. On the inside I would run a (full length) bead of proseal to bond
the plexi to the roll bar, (in case some of the other rivets are weak) then
paint a strip of the plexi wide enough to cover both the proseal and
crazing.
This is an opinion only as I have not had this problem, however I did have
to use up to 1/4 inch spacers on the canopy forward bow and used screws, I
filled the gap with proseal - good luck!
George McNutt - 6A
Langley, B.C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene Polenske" <RV8TOR(at)centurytel.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Garman 295 Color GPS Hard To See |
Was your sunglasses polarized? If so that might be the problem.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan DeNeal" <rv6apilot(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: RV-List: Garman 295 Color GPS Hard To See
>
> I had a chance to use my Garman 295 for the first time
> flying to Lebanon, TN this past weekend with my
> friend.
>
> It worked great!!! Except for the fact I could not see
> the screen with my sunglasses on. The only way I could
> really see the screen in the bright daylight and
> cockpit was to put the GPS down in the shadows, not up
> where I really would like to have had it. I played
> with the bright and dim feature but to no avail. I
> even changed the batteries to see if that would make a
> difference.
>
> Anybody else had any experience with the 295 color
> map?
>
> Dan DeNeal
> Trying to finish this 6A
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sally and George" <aeronut58(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: does anyone know |
No.
>From: old ogre <jollyd(at)ipns.com>
>Reply-To: rv8-list(at)matronics.com
>To: "RV-8-List (E-mail)"
>Subject: RV8-List: does anyone know
>Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2001 21:33:26 -0700
>
>--> RV8-List message posted by: old ogre
>
>will the gear fairings for the RV6 fit on the RV8?...thanks...
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com> |
> Also, attaching the wingtips on a RV 6 A, either pop rivet, screws with
> nutplates or glue on with proseal. What seems to work the best?
I don't think Proseal alone would be a good idea. You'd need a way to keep
the tips pressed against the skins while it cured, and I can only think of 2
ways to do that -- an inside bulkhead (foam or other) which would have to
stay in there, or drill and cleco while drying which might as well end up
being rivet holes.
As for the other two -- personal preference. If you have strobe power
supplies, antennas, etc. in the wingtips, then you're probably going to want
screws (or an access plate underneath) so you can get in for maintenance.
Otherwise it's just whether you want to go to the work of installing all
those nutplates or just take a chance on having to drill out the pop rivets
if you ever need to get the tips off. I don't have anything in there I
really need to get at, but I chose the screws anyway. Looks fine and works
but it was a lot more work. If you use screws I'd recommend #6s. #8s are
bigger than needed and #4s are so small they can be difficult to install
(that's just my humble opinion, I know a lot of people have used #4s.)
If you do pop-rivet the tips on, don't forget to put the aileron push tubes
in before you either install the tips or install the wings on the plane!
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~280 hrs)
Portland, OR
www.vanshomewing.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Cradling/supporting HS |
Last night I completed my RV-7's horizontal stab. Woohoo! Now I need to
get it the heck out of the way. I wanted to get various opinions about the
preferred way to store it while I move on to other things.
Put it on a shelf? Support it on a wall by the exposed mid-section of the
spar(s)? Hang it on a wall via hold-down straps? Make a gigantic
weathervane on top of my house?
Any suggestions are appreciated.
)_( Dan
RV-7 N747DC
dan(at)rvproject.com
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: VM 1000 intallation question |
> I want to mount the fuel flow transducer in the line between the
> electric boost pump and the firewall. The VM1000 manual says I gota put
> it between the engine driven pump and the carb. I can see no reason why
> the xducer can't be mounted after the boost pump. Only problem would be
> pulsing when the boost pump is on.
>
> Where have you flying guys/gals installed the transducer and how well
> does it work. Pictures would sure be great.
>
> Gary Zilik
> RV-8A (helping)
> RV-6 (finish kit)
> RV-6A N99PZ (Flying, Well actually only my wife is allowed to fly, so
> says the FAA)
Gary,
I have mine installed exactly as you describe and it works very well. I
researched this whole thing pretty thoroughly and also tried other
locations. I've documented my experience on my web site...
http://www.rv-8.com/FirewallForward.htm#Fuel%20system
Hope this helps.
Randy Lervold
RV-8, N558RL, 130 hrs
www.rv-8.com
Home Wing VAF
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don Hyde <DonH(at)axonn.com> |
| Subject: | Cradling/supporting HS |
At the Home Despot, I found large padded screw hooks in various shapes that
were being sold as hangers for bicycles and such. I put a couple of
L-shaped ones into studs on the wall, and my HS has been hanging proudly on
the wall of my workshop for all to admire since. The VS and rudder are
nearby with a similar arrangement. I even used some of them to hang up
garden implements and such.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dan Checkoway [mailto:dan(at)rvproject.com]
> Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2001 11:12 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com; rv7-list(at)matronics.com;
> SoCAL-RVlist(at)yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RV-List: Cradling/supporting HS
>
>
>
> Last night I completed my RV-7's horizontal stab. Woohoo!
> Now I need to
> get it the heck out of the way. I wanted to get various
> opinions about the
> preferred way to store it while I move on to other things.
>
> Put it on a shelf? Support it on a wall by the exposed
> mid-section of the
> spar(s)? Hang it on a wall via hold-down straps? Make a gigantic
> weathervane on top of my house?
>
> Any suggestions are appreciated.
>
> )_( Dan
> RV-7 N747DC
> dan(at)rvproject.com
> http://www.rvproject.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Inadvertant flying in clouds |
I don't know how much you're planning to spend, but you might consider the
EFIS-D10 from Dynon Development (www.dynondevelopment.com). Gives you an
AI, T&B, ASI, VSI, ALT, AOA, plus some other stuff, on a single EFIS
display, for $1,995.
For what it's worth, I worry that there's a fine line between planning for
inadvertent IFR and not trying hard enough to remain VMC. Superior
judgement vs. superior skill, and all that. At the moment I fly with a
skid ball only, and I think that's fine for day VFR.
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question |
In a message dated 9/28/01 11:14:22 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
randallh(at)home.com writes:
<< Take a look at http://www.edt.com/homewing/rhproject/fairings.html. Might
be
helpful >>
Thanks Randall. By the way, I am using your suggestion to lay my engine
mount on my workbench horizontally and level it to do the work on the gear
leg, wheel and intersection fairings and it works slick. Thanks for the idea.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, finish kit stuff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | TwoAviators <TwoAviators(at)lexcominc.net> |
| Subject: | Canopy skirt fitting?? |
I am beginning to fit the canopy skirt to my -8, and find it looks like it
will need to be split in the rear and then bridged with more fiberglass.
The tailgroup and wheel fairings fit fairly well.
thoughts?
Thanks.
Dan RV8, N417SN reserved
Engine running, fitting canopy and nose fairing last.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Cradling/supporting HS |
My entire tail is hanging from the garage ceiling by house wire through the
steel hinge brackets. Very out of the way for over four years now. Norman
Hunger
> Last night I completed my RV-7's horizontal stab. Woohoo! Now I need to
> get it the heck out of the way. I wanted to get various opinions about
the
> preferred way to store it while I move on to other things.
>
> Put it on a shelf? Support it on a wall by the exposed mid-section of the
> spar(s)? Hang it on a wall via hold-down straps? Make a gigantic
> weathervane on top of my house?
>
> Any suggestions are appreciated.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "R Colman" <ronincolman(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | RE: RV8-List: Canopy skirt fitting?? |
On my RV-8 and two others of looked at during the building process, the fit
of the rear of the canopy skirt was consistent, and really bad. My guess is
that who ever is making these for Van's is simply unaware of the bad fit.
One local RV-8 builder removed the rear part of the skirt and did it in
aluminum.
--> RV8-List message posted by: TwoAviators
I am beginning to fit the canopy skirt to my -8, and find it looks like it
will need to be split in the rear and then bridged with more fiberglass.
The tailgroup and wheel fairings fit fairly well.
thoughts?
Thanks.
Dan RV8, N417SN reserved
Engine running, fitting canopy and nose fairing last.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Canopy skirt fitting?? |
> I am beginning to fit the canopy skirt to my -8, and find it looks like it
> will need to be split in the rear and then bridged with more fiberglass.
> The tailgroup and wheel fairings fit fairly well.
Ah yes, welcome to what may be the toughest part of the plane to build
properly. We have all struggled with this, you can read about my own battle
at...
http://www.rv-8.com/Canopy.htm
Mine required being cut up the back to fit properly. Haven't seen one yet
that didn't have to be cut in at least one place, some require several cuts.
Van's now ships them in two pieces.
Randy Lervold
RV-8, N558RL, 130 hrs
www.rv-8.com
Home Wing VAF
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman, MD" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
\"Duane Bentley \(GEAE\)\""
| Subject: | Sam James RV6A Cowl |
Norman,
There are very Sam James Cowls actually flying. There are a few on RV-8's
being flown (remember that they are different for each), and Randy Lervold
has documented problems with the 8 model. The 6 has problems which are MUCH
more severe.
There have been only 4 sold for the 6 model: One is flying (Rich Jankowski)
which took lots of mods. Mine is next closest t flying (its installed), and
then two have been delivered and have not been installed yet. Duane Bentley
(Cincinnati, Ohio) has one of these that have been delivered, but not
installed. Duane flew to Tampa 2 weekends ago just to see my Sam James Cowl
and to see why it doesn't fit. He has taken dozens of pictures and written
an extensive letter documenting the problems which he submitted to Sam last
week. Sam came to my house last weekend and has seen all the problems. Sam
has no fixes, except that "the cowl will work if you use a 4" prop
extension". This is probably correct by the way I view it (and Duane
agrees), however, if you want less than a 4" prop extension, or want to run
a CS prop (C2YK), it WILL NOT FIT. Possibly (and I repeat, possibly), some
of it will work if you use the extend hub CS prop that Van's sells, however
this is an additional $900, and is not aerobatic (limited to 3.1 Gs). This
extended hub prop in my opinion will fix the problems at the firewall (the
cowl is 1.25 inches too small in height for the firewall if a standard C2YK
prop is used), but it will NOT fix the problems with the induction system.
The cowl bottom will still hit the bottom of the scoop requiring the scoop
to be removed and lowered. Also, the enclosed induction/filter assembly
will not fit unless you have a 4" prop extension (the extended hub CS
Hartzell is extended 2 inches over a C2YK).
Duane and I have been discussing how and when to let the rest of the world
know about the problems, so others do not spend upwards of $1350 on
something that absolutely does not fit this bird. We have not decided quite
how to let the world know yet, although it looks like I am doing so now!
I will ask Duane (cc'd directly on this email) if he wants to submit his
documentation and opinions to the list. They are very well written, and
accompanied by many photos.
In a nut shell, I consider myself an expert in fiberglass, and actually
enjoy it. However, this was much more than I envisioned and I have had to
modify EVERY aspect of this cowl: Sides, bottom, inlets, air scoop...
everything. And, that is after I purchased all of the "special" AirFlow
Performance injection materials which where "made" for this application. The
bottom line: nobody has done this before. I am the first one to actually use
the "special" stuff from Air Flow Performance. Things are supposed to work,
and they do not. They are not even close.
Remember also, people like Rich Jankowski use the basic Sam James Cowl, but
do not use his plenum, do not use his induction system (cause it doesn't
work), had to re-invent the scoop, etc, etc.
Pictures and complete details forthcoming. Stay tuned.
jim
Tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Norman
Subject: RV-List: Sam James RV6A Cowl
> jim
> Tampa
> 6A slider, finishing (two solid months of daily work into Sam James Cowl
> which does not fit an RV6 in any way shape or form)
Hey Jim, I'm planning one of these cowls for my RV6A. Please tell us more.
How much hassle and is it worth it.
Anybody flying with a Sam James cowl: there must be a least a dozen flying
by now, any one on the List? Do you beleive that this cowl makes your
airplane faster than if you had the factory cowl?
Thank-you,
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Sam James RV6A Cowl |
I just took delivery of one of these cowls with plenum for my 6A which I
have an MT 3 blade for.
He said that he was putting one of those props on his plane and it fit
great.
I really hope that this isn't one of those horror stories that I've seen
before. I got the impression that they would be willing to work with me to
solve any problems.
Ralph Capen
________________________________________________________________________________
> A $2000 EFIS display with mega features. Wow does this look interesting.
> Available soon. What do you guys think?
> http://www.dynondevelopment.com/
> Norman Hunger
Anyone heard the latest on WHEN this thing will be available? This is just
what I'm looking for in the next iteration of my panel.
Randy Lervold
www.rv-8.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy Griffin" <skydog-8(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy skirt fitting?? |
What Randy forgot to mention is that while Van's does indeed ship them in
two pieces now,
the right side fits pretty good but you will still have to cut the left side
to get it to fit.
Randy Griffin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Canopy skirt fitting??
>
> > I am beginning to fit the canopy skirt to my -8, and find it looks like
it
> > will need to be split in the rear and then bridged with more fiberglass.
> > The tailgroup and wheel fairings fit fairly well.
>
>
> Ah yes, welcome to what may be the toughest part of the plane to build
> properly. We have all struggled with this, you can read about my own
battle
> at...
> http://www.rv-8.com/Canopy.htm
>
> Mine required being cut up the back to fit properly. Haven't seen one yet
> that didn't have to be cut in at least one place, some require several
cuts.
> Van's now ships them in two pieces.
>
> Randy Lervold
> RV-8, N558RL, 130 hrs
> www.rv-8.com
> Home Wing VAF
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug's Mail" <dougr(at)petroblend.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Inadvertant flying in clouds |
When I bought the panther, it had nothing at all for gyro instruments. I
promptly installed a bat & ball because I have been known to fly over a deck
of clouds. If the fire went out, I wanted to have a way to get down. I take
a FAR 135 checkride from the FAA every 6 months that includes partial panel
flying and I have no problem with that.
I have practiced needle, ball, & airspeed, in the RV-4 and it's a real
challenge. It certainly can be done but I would NEVER allow myself to end
up in a cloud planning to turn around and fly it out. IF I got in the soup,
and I NEVER have, and I NEVER plan to, I believe one's toilet habits would
be altered for some time. A VFR pilot wouldn't have a chance and an IFR
pilot who was rusty on partial panel would be in a world of hurt. If the
fire goes out and I have to decend through a deck, it will be a wings level
operation, no turning, no navigating, pure concentration on keeping the
wings level till I break out or hit something.
I won't tell you I have never punched through a deck instead of scud running
in an airplane that was not IFR certified, (standard statute of limitations
disclaimer applies here, of course) and flown ontop to better weather. I
would not recommend that in any airplane with only a bat & ball, (turn
coodinator for the new folks) and I would NEVER do it in an RV.
NO Partial panel IFR in an RV for me!
Tailwinds,
Doug Rozendaal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman, MD" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | Sam James RV6A Cowl |
Sorry, but this is Bull SH$T.
He is waiting for his prop. He does not have it yet, anticipates it coming
in another month or so.
ALSO, he as an RV-4, NOT a 6.
Sorry listers, you all need to know. There are not any of these with MT
props. There aren't any that work like they should. Please wait to see
Duane's comments.
jim
Tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Ralph E. Capen
Subject: Re: RV-List: Sam James RV6A Cowl
I just took delivery of one of these cowls with plenum for my 6A which I
have an MT 3 blade for.
He said that he was putting one of those props on his plane and it fit
great.
I really hope that this isn't one of those horror stories that I've seen
before. I got the impression that they would be willing to work with me to
solve any problems.
Ralph Capen
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sally and George" <aeronut58(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Canopy skirt fitting?? |
Dan:
My canopy fit perfectly at the rear. I think it was a matter of blind luck,
because I know of several builders here in the Dallas area who had to split
and rebridge that area.
Do what you have to do.
George Kilishek
N888GK
Getting ready for airworthiness inspection
>From: TwoAviators <TwoAviators(at)lexcominc.net>
>Reply-To: rv8-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv8-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV8-List: Canopy skirt fitting??
>Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2001 14:52:41 -0400
>
>--> RV8-List message posted by: TwoAviators
>
>I am beginning to fit the canopy skirt to my -8, and find it looks like it
>will need to be split in the rear and then bridged with more fiberglass.
>The tailgroup and wheel fairings fit fairly well.
>
>thoughts?
>
>Thanks.
>
>Dan RV8, N417SN reserved
>Engine running, fitting canopy and nose fairing last.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | "Post Maintenance" VFR flight in Class B airspace |
Per the latest NOTAM on the topic of VFR
flight, FDC 1/0617,
" 11. Post maintenance, manufacturer production, and acceptance
flight test operations are authorized for U.S. registered aircraft with a
maximum certificated takeoff gross weight of 95,000 pounds or less,
within "enhanced class b" airspace areas, except the boston
enhanced class b airspace area and except for operations within the
temporary flight restriction areas for the New York and Washington
DC areas established by notam."
Hmmm. My plane is based at Manassas, which is within the DC Class
B, but is not within the DCA TFR area. Therefore, it appears that I
may conduct "post maintenance" operations VFR within the class B. I
think I need to tighten some screws on my RV-6A, and go fly VFR
tomorrow.
Tim Lewis
********************************
The DCA Infinite TCA...
"America's Southern No Fly Zone"
********************************
Tim Lewis -- Fairfax, VA
RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
******
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Duane Bentley" <dbentley(at)fuse.net> |
| Subject: | RV6 & Sam James Cowl |
Since Jim Norman opened the door, I might as well put this on the RV list
rather that get inquiries for weeks. I had sent e-mail and telephone
exchanges with Jim, who finally suggested I catch a flight from Cincinnati
to Tampa to understand his problems. I had not started the installation of
the Sam James cowl on my RV6, but had all the products purchased, including
the Air Flow Performance fuel injection and Vetterman 4 exhaust pipes.
(Cross over will not fit with the Airflow System modified for the Sam James
cowl.) The notes below came out of a letter I sent to Sam, a week after
visiting Jim in Florida. Sam called me the day he received the letter, said
he didn't understand the magnitude of the problem, and told me he was going
up to visit Jim Norman himself. Three days after that visit, Sam contacted
me with his evaluation. In the end, the question was whether this cowling
is worth in performance improvement and esthetics, the substantial amount of
work it will take to modify it to fit. Add that evaluation to the comments
from a phone call I had with Rich Jankowski, some three weeks ago....." If
you don't install it right, you may not see any performace increase, maybe
even a decrease....."
I'm two weeks away from putting on the engine and seeing if the cowl comes
any closer to fitting that Jim's did. Preliminary measurements off my RV6
firewall and cowling tell me that there is no difference in Jim's
configuration and mine. I concluded the technical summary of my letter with
an offer to work with Sam, even invest, to produce a cowling that fits the
more "standard" RV6, e.g. 0-360, C2YK C/S prop, Airflow Performance fuel
injection. Sam countered by offering to work with me to address how to make
the current cowl fit the airplane, if I decided to continue with his
cowling. Sam offered to send the next RV6 cowl buyer to me if I wanted to
sell it and go back to Van's original. I told him I'd let him know in a
couple of weeks. In any case, I can not, with any integrity sell this
cowling to another RV6 builder without outlining the magnitude of the work
ahead. If there is someone out there who wants to consider it, and is
looking for a deal, send me a note off line.
Here is the detailed analysis part of the letter I sent to Sam. I don't
have a web site, but will gladly send the digital photos to anyone if
requested:
1. Vans Aircraft with Hartzell Propeller, offers a standard C/S prop
C2YK, and an optional propeller with a longer hub - M2YR. The longer hub
propeller is not approved for aerobatic flight, is limited to 3.8gs, and is
approximately $950 more than the C2YK propeller. Installing this or any
owner fabricated prop spacer is not a good solution for an aircraft that was
designed for the RV6 mission. Unfortunately, this information was not
common knowledge when many of us purchased your cowling design.
2. As measured from my Sam James cowling, the cowling comes out of the
mold with a total length of approximately 37 inches. With the 0-360A1A
engine installed on the RV6 (A) aircraft, and the Hartzell C/S C2YK
propeller, the measured distance from the aircraft forward firewall to the
back of the propeller spinner plate is approximately 34 inches. Allowing
a maximum gap of inch between the spinner back plate and the leading edge
of the cowling, the result is 34 inches of maximum allowable cowl length.
This difference in dimension dictates the removal of approximately 3 inches
off the back of the Sam James Cowling. Photo 1 shows both cowls installed
and the excess material sitting on top of the forward top skin. Jim is
holding the excess material in Photo 2.
3. In addition, the cross section drawing you provided with the
cowling, showing the proposed air intake system, depicts a dimension of
4.125 inches between the spinner back plate and the engine flywheel. With a
standard C2YK C/S prop, that dimension measured approximately 2.125 inches.
This again confirms that without a prop extension, the engine moves forward
within the cowl envelope approximately 2 3 inches.
4. Now, the slope of both the bottom and top cowls substantially
impacts the available volume within the installation, since a cut has been
made at the back of the cowling.
5. The Sam James Plenum can still be installed, but material must be
removed from the front of the plenum to fit it lower onto the engine and
under the top cowling. See Photos 3 and 4. In addition, a blister above
the AFP purge must still be installed. See Photo 5. With the unique AFP
purge valve configuration (valve bracketing change) for the Sam James Cowl,
there is still an interference with the plenum if the blister is not added.
Again, this as a result of the forward transfer of the engine within the top
cowl and its descending outline to the propeller.
6. The bottom cowl is where the majority of the modifications are
required. Removing a 3-inch axial cut off the rear end of the cowl forces
the aircraft firewall into the upslope portion of the bottom cowling.
Installing the bottom cowl with no modification results in an gap, fore to
aft, at the intersection of the upper and lower cowl hinge lines, increasing
from zero at the front to over 1 inches at the rear. Given a choice of
adding material at the hinge line intersection or splitting the bottom
cowling, Jim Norman chose the latter, and cut the bottom cowl into three
pieces. See Photos No 6, 7, and 8.
7. This splits the bottom cowling into left and right side panels, and
a bottom portion. After putting the top cowling in place, Jim fitted the
left and right side panels to the top cowl at the hinge line. He then
secured the bottom section, then laminated fiberglass onto the three bottom
pieces to reform the bottom cowl into one piece.
8. Unfortunately, more modification is required. From Photo No. 9, you
can see that the entire air intake for the fuel injection system is too far
forward and will not fit. In addition, the bottom of the air intake is
against the bottom of the cowl. Jim cut the intake tube twice to reduce its
length. See Photo 10 and 11. In Photo 11, under his right index finger you
will see that Jim completely removed the mounting flange on the fiberglass
intake tube to fit it up to the cowling. From Photo 12, you can see that
the air filter is also too large, both in outer diameter and length. K&N
Airfilters do not come in a smaller outer diameter, according to the
company. I also question the impact on the intake airflow with the same
volume of air needing to be pulled through a smaller length filter. The
aluminum baffle recommended in your drawing will definitely not fit in the
cavity.
9. My recommendation to Jim was to cut the air intake out of the cowl
and extend and reattach it approximately inch below the bottom cowl to
allow the engine mounted intake to come close to fitting in the cowling. A
similar cut will need to be made to the rear of the bottom cowling to fare
into the forward extension. Your intake tube will have to be glassed into
the cowling and some sort of baffling fabricated to seal it to the air
injector, still allowing for relative movement between the engine and the
cowling.
10. Jim has yet to address the installation of the 4-pipe exhaust system
and its proximity to the cowling walls with the reduced volume.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Canopy skirt fitting?? |
It's the skirt everyone is having problems with.
> Dan:
>
> My canopy fit perfectly at the rear. I think it was a matter of blind
luck,
> because I know of several builders here in the Dallas area who had to
split
> and rebridge that area.
>
> Do what you have to do.
>
> George Kilishek
> N888GK
> Getting ready for airworthiness inspection
>
>
> >From: TwoAviators <TwoAviators(at)lexcominc.net>
> >Reply-To: rv8-list(at)matronics.com
> >To: rv8-list(at)matronics.com
> >Subject: RV8-List: Canopy skirt fitting??
> >Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2001 14:52:41 -0400
> >
> >--> RV8-List message posted by: TwoAviators
> >
> >I am beginning to fit the canopy skirt to my -8, and find it looks like
it
> >will need to be split in the rear and then bridged with more fiberglass.
> >The tailgroup and wheel fairings fit fairly well.
> >
> >thoughts?
> >
> >Thanks.
> >
> >Dan RV8, N417SN reserved
> >Engine running, fitting canopy and nose fairing last.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | old ogre <jollyd(at)ipns.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Canopy skirt fitting?? |
if you really want to work work work..leave it as it is....otherwise split it
in back...it's the only way I got mine to fit...sort-of...{:~)
N-82ME
TwoAviators wrote:
> --> RV8-List message posted by: TwoAviators
>
> I am beginning to fit the canopy skirt to my -8, and find it looks like it
> will need to be split in the rear and then bridged with more fiberglass.
> The tailgroup and wheel fairings fit fairly well.
>
> thoughts?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Dan RV8, N417SN reserved
> Engine running, fitting canopy and nose fairing last.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Russell Duffy" <rv82(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | RE: RV8-List: Canopy skirt fitting?? |
We have two RV-8's at my airport, with two different skirts. They obviously
came from different molds. My buddy's fit perfectly, but was very rough in
texture. Mine was smooth as silk, but fit like crap. I cut mine in three
places, and one side still fits like crap. Fortunately, it doesn't bother
me that much. Like someone said, it's luck of the draw.
Rusty
Navarre, FL
80587, N174KT, flying 75 hrs.
> I am beginning to fit the canopy skirt to my -8, and find it looks like it
> will need to be split in the rear and then bridged with more fiberglass.
> The tailgroup and wheel fairings fit fairly well.
>
> thoughts?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "R Colman" <ronincolman(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | RE: RV8-List: Canopy skirt fitting?? |
Now that's pretty interesting. Mine (and the other's) are dead smooth -
maybe "pre-preg" They fit fine along the front 2/3 or so, then a gap.
Van's does so much so very well, it really makes the few flaws jump out -
like the RV-8 overheating problem the factory guys still contend does not
exist.
Ronin
N591RC @ 50+
--> RV8-List message posted by: "Russell Duffy"
We have two RV-8's at my airport, with two different skirts. They obviously
came from different molds. My buddy's fit perfectly, but was very rough in
texture. Mine was smooth as silk, but fit like crap. I cut mine in three
places, and one side still fits like crap. Fortunately, it doesn't bother
me that much. Like someone said, it's luck of the draw.
Rusty
Navarre, FL
80587, N174KT, flying 75 hrs.
> I am beginning to fit the canopy skirt to my -8, and find it looks like it
> will need to be split in the rear and then bridged with more fiberglass.
> The tailgroup and wheel fairings fit fairly well.
>
> thoughts?
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Inadvertant flying in clouds |
In a message dated 9/29/2001 7:48:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net writes:
> I would only say to anyone that puts gyros in their airplane to make
> them
> selves feel better IN CASE you get caught in weather, you could be
> kidding
> yourselves unless you also know how to use them in a real situation.
>
i agree with Jerry. i equiped my rv6a with ifr insruments and have just
started my ifr training. tonight while my instructor had me doing holding
patterns, he wondered why i was doing so well, having not being under a hood
in 10 years. i guess i can only attribute it MicroSoft Flite Simulater 2000.
you can learn, and stay profficiant in the scanning of the instruments. we
were doing real well until we were asked to assist in a downed aircraft, by
reporting ELT transmittions to ATC. what an awful sound. we had a 40 knot
wind at 3000 ft, at the surface it was about 20 gusting to 35. i don't know
what caused the crash or if it was survivable, i guess i'll find out on the
news tomorrow.
scott
tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sally and George" <aeronut58(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Canopy skirt fitting?? |
Right Randy. I meant to say that my skirt fit perfectly.
George
>From: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
>Reply-To: rv8-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV8-List: Canopy skirt fitting??
>Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2001 17:28:01 -0700
>
>--> RV8-List message posted by: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
>
>It's the skirt everyone is having problems with.
>
>
> > Dan:
> >
> > My canopy fit perfectly at the rear. I think it was a matter of blind
>luck,
> > because I know of several builders here in the Dallas area who had to
>split
> > and rebridge that area.
> >
> > Do what you have to do.
> >
> > George Kilishek
> > N888GK
> > Getting ready for airworthiness inspection
> >
> >
> > >From: TwoAviators <TwoAviators(at)lexcominc.net>
> > >Reply-To: rv8-list(at)matronics.com
> > >To: rv8-list(at)matronics.com
> > >Subject: RV8-List: Canopy skirt fitting??
> > >Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2001 14:52:41 -0400
> > >
> > >--> RV8-List message posted by: TwoAviators
> > >
> > >I am beginning to fit the canopy skirt to my -8, and find it looks like
>it
> > >will need to be split in the rear and then bridged with more
>fiberglass.
> > >The tailgroup and wheel fairings fit fairly well.
> > >
> > >thoughts?
> > >
> > >Thanks.
> > >
> > >Dan RV8, N417SN reserved
> > >Engine running, fitting canopy and nose fairing last.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Who Is Going to SERFI? |
Who out there in RV-land is going to SERFI? I'm thinking about heading down
late Friday, camping, then returing home sometime Saturday.
Assuming you're not trapped in the *&!$#!! "Enhanced Class B", this is the
perfect time in the South to go fly... The weather is cooling off and the
flying is great! No more haze, my oil temps are much happier, and I can peg
the VSI at 2000 FPM on partial tanks.
On the other hand, I did make a godawful landing this morning... Maybe I
shouldn't have drank all that cough syrup before I went flying ;-).
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Moshe Lichtman" <moshe_lichtman(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Aircraft Painters in Washington or Oregon - Looking for Recommendations |
Greetings folks,
Next week I will finish flying the 40 hour test period on my new RV6. I
would like to get it painted as soon as possible. Appreciate any
experiences out there with painters in northern Oregon and/or Washington
state. I'm looking for high quality work only and willing to pay a bit
more for a great finish. Reply to me off-list
if you prefer.
Thanks,
Moshe Lichtman
RV6 N57GR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Painters in Washington or Oregon - Looking for Recommendations |
Craig Roberts. Ask Randall Henderson about his work.
(503) 678-3001
Not cheap, but very good work. I plan on hiring him to paint mine after I
save a few bucks.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Moshe Lichtman" <moshe_lichtman(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: Aircraft Painters in Washington or Oregon - Looking for
Recommendations
Greetings folks,
Next week I will finish flying the 40 hour test period on my new RV6. I
would like to get it painted as soon as possible. Appreciate any
experiences out there with painters in northern Oregon and/or Washington
state. I'm looking for high quality work only and willing to pay a bit
more for a great finish. Reply to me off-list
if you prefer.
Thanks,
Moshe Lichtman
RV6 N57GR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis" <mnellis(at)peoplepc.com> |
| Subject: | Ailerons and Gap Seal Installed |
Thanks again to everyone for the advice and ideas on installing the
aileron gap seal. I ended up back riveting it and it turned out fine.
I've documented the process on my web site and I've also started
installing the flaps. http://bmnellis.com
I'm now having problems with the flap being to close to the rear spar
and the flap skin butts up to the wing skin when the flap is lined up
with the aileron. I'll figure out how to work this out but to quote
Rosanne, Rosanne Adanna......"it's always something! If it's not one
thing its another...."
Mike Nellis - http://bmnellis.com
Plainfield, IL
RV6 N699BM Reserved
Mounting Control Surfaces
Stinson 108-2 N9666K
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RV6 & Sam James Cowl |
When Steve Barnard was selling this cowl (it's his design and molds that Sam
James is selling), Steve was very clear that the M2YK prop was required and
that it was not rated for akro . Also that it was designed
around the angle-valve IO-360 but "should" accommodate the parallel-valve
O-360. When I talked to him he really tried to talk me into the angle-valve
and M2YK. IIRC he even had a page on his web site talking about his views on
how the M2YK was still OK for limited RV akro. I forget the rationale but
think it revolved around the actual G-loads at the prop vs the airframe
G-loads. The extended cowl length which required the M2YK was part of his
aerodynamic analysis and worked in concert with his inlet design. I'm not
surprised that the performance gains disappear when the cowl is shortened
and the inlets modified. It looks like most of the problems with Jim and
Duane's installation stem from not using the combo that the cowl was
originally designed for, or at least the M2YK. If Sam James is not noting
the M2YK as a requirement he is doing a real dis-service to his customers.
Regards,
Greg Young
RV-6 N6GY Houston (DWH) sold to the insurance co.
Going to look at a Navion if I can get out of this #@(*@ Class B
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Norman
> Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2001 7:43 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6 & Sam James Cowl
>
>
> Duane and Jim, thank-you guys for outlining these problems
> with the SJ Holy
> Cowl on the RV6A. I hope Sam makes a new model soon. It
> doesn't seem right
> to continue selling a product that won't work.
>
> Norman
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Inadvertant flying in clouds |
I am sure that most of you have read this article, but if you have not
please go to this location and read the report.
Jerry S
http://www.ronleon.com/178seconds.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George McNutt" <gmcnutt(at)intergate.ca> |
| Subject: | Inadvertent flying in clouds(long) |
Inadvertant Flight Into Cloud (long)-------------------------
I believe the question was what equipment to install - please put in a
Navaid or even a better wing leveler, it gives you a turn & bank instrument
and something to keep the wings level if you accidentally get into cloud.
I see many statements from very experienced pilots stating that no pilot
should ever inadvertently get into cloud when operating VFR. You can limit
your flying somewhat and make this possible. Eliminate night flight and
only fly in good weather. In recent years Transport Canada has pushed this
idea with pilot "Decision Making" training.
Now allow me to get on my soapbox for a minute, if you don't have a few
minutes - please delete Now!
In my opinion Transport Canada, FAA, AOPA, EAA, and everyone else involved
with aviation safety has completely missed the real reason why pilots
inadvertently fly into cloud.
In my early years as a pilot I always read the accident reports and wondered
how those dumb pilots could ever fly into bad weather conditions, get into
cloud and crash. I would never be so dumb.
As I matured and gained experience I realized that I had been into some bad
weather myself, in fact some of it was so bad that a 180 degree turn didn't
seem like a good idea, - what! go back through that stuff - must be better
ahead.
I was fortunate to get a airline job and spend a lot of time inside and near
cloud. Sometimes when we had a holding clearance we would get a block of
altitudes and see if we could put the bottom of the aircraft in the cloud
and keep the windshield out of it - what a rush, great sensation of speed.
For the next twenty years I thought about the VFR into IFR problem, on
several occasions I took my IFR equipped Cessna out and deliberately did
scud running, all recorded by motor driven Nikon.
On at least three occasions I followed lower time VFR pilots and watched as
they went into cloud, twice in valleys with 8000 foot mountains around
requiring a climb to on-top, I also rode with VFR pilots who inadvertently
flew into cloud.
What I learned from these incidents is that VFR pilots, who normally stay
far away from cloud, do not realize just how close they are getting to cloud
when the weather deteriorates or a cloud deck slopes down.
Compounding the problem is as tension mounts in a pilot the muscle's tense
(shorten) and the aircraft tends to climb.
In many, but not all instances IFR pilots have a distinct advantage in
judging distance from cloud in poor VFR weather simply because they are
often up close and personal with clouds.
With time some clues to the VFR into IFR -started to gel and a simple idea
started to form.
Our company had pilots who swore they saw a flying saucer on a long night
flight from South America, and on many occasions I have been between diffuse
cloud layers where it was impossible to tell if you were in or out of cloud,
should that engine anti-ice be on or off?
And suddenly, after 20,000 plus hours and twenty plus years of puzzling over
the VFR into IFR question, the thought struck me - there are many situations
where the human visual system is totally inadequate. Our visual system is
the weak link in the VFR chain.
Two conditions have been recognized for years, the glassy water landing
problem, which causes a loss of depth perception and over a large body of
water can cause loss of situational awareness.
Here in the great white North we also have "white out" conditions, a problem
that occurs in light snow over snow covered ground with diffuse cloud. Loss
of horizon, depth perception and situational awareness (a new buzzword term
used by Transport Canada).
There is a third yet unrecognized condition that I have named "gray-out".
Gray-out causes pilots to inadvertently fly into cloud and also causes
drivers to enter dense fog banks on highways often causing multi car chain
reaction accidents. These are not stupid people, they are people who are not
aware of the limitations of their visual system, a system that was designed
for speeds of up twelve MPH, well maybe a short burst to 18.
Grey-out occurs in low or reduced light levels when there is a loss of
contrast, no contrast = no vision!
Look up through a skylight on a cloudy day, (no trees or anything else in
your field of vision) if the clouds have outlines (contrast) you can
probably guestimate if you could go to the airport and fly. If the cloud
above your skylight are like a gray blanket with no contrast you will not be
able to tell how far the cloud is from you.
This is basically the situation in the cockpit when you get close to cloud
in low light conditions. Thick cloud above you can reduce the light level
dramatically, you never really notice because your visual system adjusts
automatically.
Our visual system has many interesting limitations.
When I sit on the threshold of runway 01 at Langley I see the far end of the
runway 2100 feet away, I see a ridge with trees 3 miles ahead and I see 5500
foot mountains 8 miles away, but did you know that depth perception only
works as far as the next runway lights (200 ft).
If you had never seen a motor vehicle larger than a Volkswagen, and you were
wanting to pass a Volkswagen ahead but there was a Greyhound buss coming
towards you which still appeared about the size of a dinkey toy, you would
not be able to determine if it was safe to pass the car ahead. Calculations
of size & closing rate beyond your depth perception distance are made by the
brain based on prior experience.
This is why flatlanders are nervous about flying in the mountains, they
cannot tell how close they are to the mountain or if there is enough room to
turn around in a valley, that knowledge comes from experience, not the eye.
A Hawk has about 10 times better vision than you, can you spot a mouse in
the grass from 300 feet?
Anyway its getting late so I will get off my soap box with the advice that
anyone can inadvertantly fly into cloud in low contrast conditions so equip
your aircraft accordingly.
Drive safely,
George McNutt
Langley, B.C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
Hey Listers:
The project that began with laying strips of aluminum on a horizontal 4x4 in
November, 1995, took to the air on September 29, 2001 at the Shelburne
Airport in Shelburne, Vermont (9B3.) N227RV flies! The first flight lasted
30 minutes (plus or minus). The oil temperature stayed at 190 degrees,
Fahrenheit; the cylinder head temps stayed in the low part of the green arc.
The plane comes off the ground very fast, climbs like a rocket and sinks
pretty fast when you pull the power off. It needs a lot of right rudder at
full power and at high angles of attack ... much more than a Cessna 150.
We've got a Lycoming O-320 D1A with an Aymar-Demuth prop. The aircraft is
day-VFR only ... no lights, no vacuum system.
Steve Soule
RV-6A, Huntington, Vermont
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Lawson <jwlawson(at)hargray.com> |
| Subject: | Cradling/supporting HS (and other parts) |
Dan:
I put up racks under the ceiling of my garage. I bought a bunch of 1 1/2" angle
from Home Depot and used wood screws (big 'uns) to attach short pieces of angle
to the ceiling...then cut more short lengths of angle and used nuts/bolts
to hang them from the short pieces...then attached long pieces to them for my
HS, VS, etc, to sit on. I put lengths of shelf material up there for the airplane
parts to sit on. I also put the material up there that I haven't used yet
(aluminum sheets, leading edges, etc).
From the end, the whole installation looks like this:
__________________________________________ceiling
--------- ------------
short angles attached to ceiling
|
|
|
| <------------ vertical angles
_|_______________________________________ |___ long angle attached to vertical
angles
place boards on top of the long angle
From the garage floor looking up, the whole thing looks like this:
garage door (2-car garage)
_____________________ | ___________________
|
|
_____________________ | ___________________
|
|
_____________________ | ___________________
_____________________ ___________________
The line in the middle represents the track for the garage door opener.
Works for me. On one side, I've stored the HS, VS, elevators, and rudder...on
the other side, the stock (sheet aluminum and leading edges) for my wings.
Semper Fi
John
RV-6 (still working my cheeks off at the airports)
>
> From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
>
> Subject: RV-List: Cradling/supporting HS
>
>
> Last night I completed my RV-7's horizontal stab. Woohoo! Now I need to
> get it the heck out of the way. I wanted to get various opinions about the
> preferred way to store it while I move on to other things.
>
> Put it on a shelf? Support it on a wall by the exposed mid-section of the
> spar(s)? Hang it on a wall via hold-down straps? Make a gigantic
> weathervane on top of my house?
>
> Any suggestions are appreciated.
>
> )_( Dan
> RV-7 N747DC
> dan(at)rvproject.com
> http://www.rvproject.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Lawson <jwlawson(at)hargray.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cradling/supporting HS (and other parts) |
"jwlawson(at)hargray.com"
<3BB70690.9F94BF7(at)hargray.com>
sheesh...that didn't come out very well. Email me if you'd like a couple of photos.
Semper Fi
John
John Lawson wrote:
> Dan:
> I put up racks under the ceiling of my garage. I bought a bunch of 1 1/2" angle
from Home Depot and used wood screws (big 'uns) to attach short pieces of
angle to the ceiling...then cut more short lengths of angle and used nuts/bolts
to hang them from the short pieces...then attached long pieces to them for my
HS, VS, etc, to sit on. I put lengths of shelf material up there for the airplane
parts to sit on. I also put the material up there that I haven't used
yet (aluminum sheets, leading edges, etc).
>
> >From the end, the whole installation looks like this:
>
> __________________________________________ceiling
> --------- ------------
short angles attached to ceiling
> |
|
> |
| <------------ vertical angles
> _|_______________________________________ |___ long angle attached to vertical
angles
> place boards on top of the long angle
>
> >From the garage floor looking up, the whole thing looks like this:
>
> garage door (2-car garage)
>
> _____________________ | ___________________
> |
> |
> _____________________ | ___________________
> |
> |
> _____________________ | ___________________
>
> _____________________ ___________________
>
> The line in the middle represents the track for the garage door opener.
>
> Works for me. On one side, I've stored the HS, VS, elevators, and rudder...on
the other side, the stock (sheet aluminum and leading edges) for my wings.
>
> Semper Fi
> John
> RV-6 (still working my cheeks off at the airports)
>
> >
> > From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
> >
> > Subject: RV-List: Cradling/supporting HS
> >
> >
> > Last night I completed my RV-7's horizontal stab. Woohoo! Now I need to
> > get it the heck out of the way. I wanted to get various opinions about the
> > preferred way to store it while I move on to other things.
> >
> > Put it on a shelf? Support it on a wall by the exposed mid-section of the
> > spar(s)? Hang it on a wall via hold-down straps? Make a gigantic
> > weathervane on top of my house?
> >
> > Any suggestions are appreciated.
> >
> > )_( Dan
> > RV-7 N747DC
> > dan(at)rvproject.com
> > http://www.rvproject.com
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Painters in Washington or Oregon - Looking for Recommen... |
Moshe:
Sunquest at Paine Field does outstanding work, they are a little more
expensive, but they stand behind their work.
Henry H.
RV6, KAWO
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "EWSpears" <ewspears(at)peoplepc.com> |
| Subject: | Loctite Crazing Canopy ? |
I've read the recent posts about Locktite causing crazing and cracks in
canopies with great interest since I'm planning to use Riv-nuts & #6 SS CS
Screws to attach Canopy to Roll Bar and Sliding Frame. Since I'll drill the
holes oversize and then just barely snug them up I expect something like
Loctite will be neccessary to keep them from backing out.
A week ago I smeared red (bearing mount) Loctite on the as yet still
attached canopy flanges. I've seen no reaction whatsoever. I'm inclined to
think that Loctite causing crazing on Plexi is an "old wives tale" but I'm
not yet sure enough to want to risk a $700 canopy. Any enlightenment from
the List would be appreciated.
Esten Spears, RV8A, 80922, Leeward Air Ranch, Ocala, FL. Working on
Finishing Kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy skirt fitting?? |
>
>
>I am beginning to fit the canopy skirt to my -8, and find it looks like it
>will need to be split in the rear and then bridged with more fiberglass.
>The tailgroup and wheel fairings fit fairly well.
>
>thoughts?
>
Absolutely. Cut it now and fit two, separate pieces. I understand that
Van's now ships them this way. I had to cut mine and do mucho hacking and
whacking to get them to fit.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eric Newton" <enewton57(at)cableone.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Who Is Going to SERFI? |
Kyle,
Weather permitting I'll be there on Saturday. I was talking with John
Henson about transition training and he invited me to ride to SERFI with him
in his RV-6 and do some transition training along the way. Excellent idea!
This is going to be a great week!!! My plane gets it's FAA inspection is on
Tuesday October 2nd. I'm flying with John to SERFI on Saturday and
hopefully accomplishing first flight of N57ME on Sunday or Monday (weather
permitting). Did I already say "this a going to be a great week" or what?
Eric Newton -Long Beach, MS
RV-6A - N57ME (FAA inspection on Tuesday)
www.ericsrv6a.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <KBoatri144(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Who Is Going to SERFI?
>
> Who out there in RV-land is going to SERFI? I'm thinking about heading
down
> late Friday, camping, then returing home sometime Saturday.
>
> Assuming you're not trapped in the *&!$#!! "Enhanced Class B", this is the
> perfect time in the South to go fly... The weather is cooling off and the
> flying is great! No more haze, my oil temps are much happier, and I can
peg
> the VSI at 2000 FPM on partial tanks.
>
> On the other hand, I did make a godawful landing this morning... Maybe I
> shouldn't have drank all that cough syrup before I went flying ;-).
>
> Kyle Boatright
> 0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
> Kennesaw, GA
> http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Joseph Czachorowski <midnight(at)UDel.Edu> |
| Subject: | RV Fly-In in Maryland |
RVers,
Come out and enjoy a nice fall get together of RV's on October
13th. Hosted by the MidAtl RV Wing, Check out Doug Reeves Site at...
http://www.metronet.com/~dreeves/vaf.htm or...
the MidATl RV Wing Site (message board) at....
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Mid-AtlRVwing/messages
Joe Czachorowski
RV8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Will Cretsinger <cretsinger(at)ticnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass (ARRGGHH!) question |
Harry, It seems you have plenty of answers to make up your mind on how
to make those pant-leg fairings. I will give you my method so you can
be more confused!
I covered with brown packaging tape the pant area and the leg area which
would be covered by the fairing...and about two inches more to allow
overlap of initial layups. Play-dough was used to then shape the
fairing with about a quarter-inch clearance of the brake lines. A bunch
of four to six inch strips were cut from the two-inch fiberglass tape
which I use for all fiberglass work. I then used a one-inch brush with
bristles cut to one-inch length to apply and work resin into each strip
when placed on a piece of wax paper. My partner then placed each strip
to cover the area, eventually about three ply. Surface smoothness is
not a concern...that can be achieved later with a filler of any kind.
After curing, a small Dremel cutting wheel made a small cut along the
aft edge of the fairing to permit removal. The perimeter of the fairing
was cut to the shape desired...and the job is largely licked! I
installed two fasteners, one on each side of the aft split to hold the
fairing. No fasteners are needed elsewhere.
I disagree with the gent who advocated five ply or more...three or four
ply is more than rugged enough. You want flexibility in order to spread
the fairing for removal.
This is brief but hope you can use some nugget of info...
Will Cretsinger, Arlington, Texas
-6A flying past 425 hours
HCRV6(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
> O.K, I have made clay forms for the roll your own fairings between the wheel
> fairings and gear leg fairings on my -6. Now I'm staring at them wondering
> how the heck to go about laying fiberglass on them. Because of the very
> compound curved shape did you guys lay them up using many small pieces of
> glass cloth, or?? Any and all suggestions welcomed. Also, the manual says
> to cut them along the wheel pant split line but I have seen many that don't
> have a split, at least on top. How'd you do it? Thanks.
>
> Harry Crosby
> Pleasanton, California
> RV-6, finish kit stuff
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman, MD" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | RV6 & Sam James Cowl |
Sorry Listers, I've got to respond.
Please, we must realize that there are "Sam James Cowls" for the RV4, 6, and
8. NONE of cowls currently produced are using the mold that came from the
original Bernard cowl. PLEASE, read that sentence again so I don't have to
say it over and over. Do we really think that one cowl fits all three
airplanes? I've been to their shop, I've seen the molds (both old and new),
I've seen the cowls made.
So I would appreciate if the rest of you "experts" who claim know all about
the Sam James Cowl would keep in mind that things have changed. There are
new molds, new inlet designs for the filter, new filter induction designs,
etc, etc. If you don't have one of these on your plane, and/or have not
actually been to the shop to see the molds, then please stop pretending to
be an expert. This issue is too confusing in the archives for this reason.
Please everybody, realize that the hub "thickness" is the biggest problem
for the RV 6 cowl (it makes it so that the cowl is not big enough at the
fire wall...it is 1.25 inches too short). HOWEVER, the prop thickness will
not have a major effect on the induction/filter system. Claims that AirFlow
Performance has a setup for this cowl is nonsense. I'm the first to install
it, and it doesn't work. Do you also know that there are no provisions for
throttle and mixture cables on this hardware? A prop will not address the
induction issues.
And finally, the plenum will not work with the AirFlow Performance fuel
spider and purge valve system. Yep, there is one of these made by AFP which
is to work with the Sam James Cowl, but it does not, and it requires that a
"blister" be built into the plenum. Again, prop hub thickness will not
address this issue (Rich Jankowski does not use Sam's plenum), and I have at
least 2-3 weeks of work into mine to make it work correctly.
I cannot address the ability of the Sam James Cowl to fit an RV-4 or 8,
however, regardless of the birthplace of the 6 cowl, its current (and ONLY)
configuration will NOT fit an RV-6 without MAJOR fiberglass work, regardless
of which prop is used. Yes, and extended hub prop will fix some of the
problems, but not even half.
Regarding the statement below "I'm not surprised that the performance gains
disappear when the cowl is shortened and the inlets modified", please, lets
not tell Rich Jankowski this. Neither he nor Tracy Salor have the "extended"
cowl that Greg is discussing... both have a C2YK (although neither have a
"standard" Sam James Cowl... BECAUSE ONE DOES NOT EXIST FOR THE RV-6!!!.
Again, there is a lot of miss-information floating around on this topic.
Duane Bently and I have spend a LOT of time documenting the problems for the
6 model, and so if you don't have one of these, please, stay on the
sidelines.
respectfully
jim
Tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Greg Young
Subject: RE: RV-List: RV6 & Sam James Cowl
When Steve Barnard was selling this cowl (it's his design and molds that Sam
James is selling), Steve was very clear that the M2YK prop was required and
that it was not rated for akro . Also that it was designed
around the angle-valve IO-360 but "should" accommodate the parallel-valve
O-360. When I talked to him he really tried to talk me into the angle-valve
and M2YK. IIRC he even had a page on his web site talking about his views on
how the M2YK was still OK for limited RV akro. I forget the rationale but
think it revolved around the actual G-loads at the prop vs the airframe
G-loads. The extended cowl length which required the M2YK was part of his
aerodynamic analysis and worked in concert with his inlet design. I'm not
surprised that the performance gains disappear when the cowl is shortened
and the inlets modified. It looks like most of the problems with Jim and
Duane's installation stem from not using the combo that the cowl was
originally designed for, or at least the M2YK. If Sam James is not noting
the M2YK as a requirement he is doing a real dis-service to his customers.
Regards,
Greg Young
RV-6 N6GY Houston (DWH) sold to the insurance co.
Going to look at a Navion if I can get out of this #@(*@ Class B
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Norman
> Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2001 7:43 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6 & Sam James Cowl
>
>
> Duane and Jim, thank-you guys for outlining these problems
> with the SJ Holy
> Cowl on the RV6A. I hope Sam makes a new model soon. It
> doesn't seem right
> to continue selling a product that won't work.
>
> Norman
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eric Newton" <enewton57(at)cableone.net> |
| Subject: | Re: N227RV flies |
Steve,
Congratulations!!! I am right behind you.
Eric Newton - Long Beach, MS
RV-6A - N57ME (FAA inspection scheduled for Tuesday)
www.ericsrv6a.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Stephen J. Soule <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com>
Subject: RV-List: N227RV flies
>
> Hey Listers:
>
> The project that began with laying strips of aluminum on a horizontal 4x4
in
> November, 1995, took to the air on September 29, 2001 at the Shelburne
> Airport in Shelburne, Vermont (9B3.) N227RV flies! The first flight lasted
> 30 minutes (plus or minus). The oil temperature stayed at 190 degrees,
> Fahrenheit; the cylinder head temps stayed in the low part of the green
arc.
> The plane comes off the ground very fast, climbs like a rocket and sinks
> pretty fast when you pull the power off. It needs a lot of right rudder at
> full power and at high angles of attack ... much more than a Cessna 150.
>
> We've got a Lycoming O-320 D1A with an Aymar-Demuth prop. The aircraft is
> day-VFR only ... no lights, no vacuum system.
>
> Steve Soule
> RV-6A, Huntington, Vermont
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KAKlewin(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Loctite Crazing Canopy ? |
18 years of the RV-ATOR also mentions several runied canopies from use of
lock-tight. I havent tried so I dont know...but I guess its been going on
since 1997.
Kurt in OKC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Rabaut" <crabaut(at)coalinga.com> |
| Subject: | Inadvertent flying in clouds(long) |
George,
Excellent observations, analogies, and analysis on this subject.
Chuck
----- Original Message -----
From: George McNutt <gmcnutt(at)intergate.ca>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Inadvertent flying in clouds(long)
>
>
> Inadvertant Flight Into Cloud (long)-------------------------
>
>
> I believe the question was what equipment to install - please put in a
> Navaid or even a better wing leveler, it gives you a turn & bank
instrument
> and something to keep the wings level if you accidentally get into cloud.
>
> I see many statements from very experienced pilots stating that no pilot
> should ever inadvertently get into cloud when operating VFR. You can limit
> your flying somewhat and make this possible. Eliminate night flight and
> only fly in good weather. In recent years Transport Canada has pushed this
> idea with pilot "Decision Making" training.
>
> Now allow me to get on my soapbox for a minute, if you don't have a few
> minutes - please delete Now!
>
> In my opinion Transport Canada, FAA, AOPA, EAA, and everyone else involved
> with aviation safety has completely missed the real reason why pilots
> inadvertently fly into cloud.
>
> In my early years as a pilot I always read the accident reports and
wondered
> how those dumb pilots could ever fly into bad weather conditions, get into
> cloud and crash. I would never be so dumb.
>
> As I matured and gained experience I realized that I had been into some
bad
> weather myself, in fact some of it was so bad that a 180 degree turn
didn't
> seem like a good idea, - what! go back through that stuff - must be better
> ahead.
>
> I was fortunate to get a airline job and spend a lot of time inside and
near
> cloud. Sometimes when we had a holding clearance we would get a block of
> altitudes and see if we could put the bottom of the aircraft in the cloud
> and keep the windshield out of it - what a rush, great sensation of speed.
>
> For the next twenty years I thought about the VFR into IFR problem, on
> several occasions I took my IFR equipped Cessna out and deliberately did
> scud running, all recorded by motor driven Nikon.
> On at least three occasions I followed lower time VFR pilots and watched
as
> they went into cloud, twice in valleys with 8000 foot mountains around
> requiring a climb to on-top, I also rode with VFR pilots who inadvertently
> flew into cloud.
>
> What I learned from these incidents is that VFR pilots, who normally stay
> far away from cloud, do not realize just how close they are getting to
cloud
> when the weather deteriorates or a cloud deck slopes down.
> Compounding the problem is as tension mounts in a pilot the muscle's tense
> (shorten) and the aircraft tends to climb.
>
> In many, but not all instances IFR pilots have a distinct advantage in
> judging distance from cloud in poor VFR weather simply because they are
> often up close and personal with clouds.
>
> With time some clues to the VFR into IFR -started to gel and a simple idea
> started to form.
>
> Our company had pilots who swore they saw a flying saucer on a long night
> flight from South America, and on many occasions I have been between
diffuse
> cloud layers where it was impossible to tell if you were in or out of
cloud,
> should that engine anti-ice be on or off?
>
> And suddenly, after 20,000 plus hours and twenty plus years of puzzling
over
> the VFR into IFR question, the thought struck me - there are many
situations
> where the human visual system is totally inadequate. Our visual system is
> the weak link in the VFR chain.
>
> Two conditions have been recognized for years, the glassy water landing
> problem, which causes a loss of depth perception and over a large body of
> water can cause loss of situational awareness.
> Here in the great white North we also have "white out" conditions, a
problem
> that occurs in light snow over snow covered ground with diffuse cloud.
Loss
> of horizon, depth perception and situational awareness (a new buzzword
term
> used by Transport Canada).
>
> There is a third yet unrecognized condition that I have named "gray-out".
>
> Gray-out causes pilots to inadvertently fly into cloud and also causes
> drivers to enter dense fog banks on highways often causing multi car chain
> reaction accidents. These are not stupid people, they are people who are
not
> aware of the limitations of their visual system, a system that was
designed
> for speeds of up twelve MPH, well maybe a short burst to 18.
>
> Grey-out occurs in low or reduced light levels when there is a loss of
> contrast, no contrast = no vision!
>
> Look up through a skylight on a cloudy day, (no trees or anything else in
> your field of vision) if the clouds have outlines (contrast) you can
> probably guestimate if you could go to the airport and fly. If the cloud
> above your skylight are like a gray blanket with no contrast you will not
be
> able to tell how far the cloud is from you.
> This is basically the situation in the cockpit when you get close to cloud
> in low light conditions. Thick cloud above you can reduce the light level
> dramatically, you never really notice because your visual system adjusts
> automatically.
>
> Our visual system has many interesting limitations.
>
> When I sit on the threshold of runway 01 at Langley I see the far end of
the
> runway 2100 feet away, I see a ridge with trees 3 miles ahead and I see
5500
> foot mountains 8 miles away, but did you know that depth perception only
> works as far as the next runway lights (200 ft).
>
> If you had never seen a motor vehicle larger than a Volkswagen, and you
were
> wanting to pass a Volkswagen ahead but there was a Greyhound buss coming
> towards you which still appeared about the size of a dinkey toy, you would
> not be able to determine if it was safe to pass the car ahead.
Calculations
> of size & closing rate beyond your depth perception distance are made by
the
> brain based on prior experience.
> This is why flatlanders are nervous about flying in the mountains, they
> cannot tell how close they are to the mountain or if there is enough room
to
> turn around in a valley, that knowledge comes from experience, not the
eye.
>
> A Hawk has about 10 times better vision than you, can you spot a mouse in
> the grass from 300 feet?
>
> Anyway its getting late so I will get off my soap box with the advice that
> anyone can inadvertantly fly into cloud in low contrast conditions so
equip
> your aircraft accordingly.
>
> Drive safely,
>
> George McNutt
> Langley, B.C.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6 & Sam James Cowl |
Duane,
Where can we see all of these pictures?
I would like to know what I'm up against...
Ralph Capen
Snip
> off the back of the Sam James Cowling. Photo 1 shows both cowls installed
> and the excess material sitting on top of the forward top skin. Jim is
> holding the excess material in Photo 2.
>
Snip
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Moshe Lichtman" <moshe_lichtman(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Painters in Washington or Oregon - Looking for Recommen... |
thanks, i will check them out.
----- Original Message -----
From: <N8335E(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Aircraft Painters in Washington or Oregon - Looking
for Recommen...
>
> Moshe:
>
> Sunquest at Paine Field does outstanding work, they are a little more
> expensive, but they stand behind their work.
>
> Henry H.
> RV6, KAWO
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Moshe Lichtman" <moshe_lichtman(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Painters in Washington or Oregon - Looking for Recommendations |
thanks, i'll give him a call
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Aircraft Painters in Washington or Oregon - Looking
for Recommendations
>
> Craig Roberts. Ask Randall Henderson about his work.
>
> (503) 678-3001
>
> Not cheap, but very good work. I plan on hiring him to paint mine after I
> save a few bucks.
>
> Paul Besing
> RV-6A N197AB Arizona
> http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
> Flying
> Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
> http://www.kitlog.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Moshe Lichtman" <moshe_lichtman(at)hotmail.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Aircraft Painters in Washington or Oregon - Looking for
> Recommendations
>
>
>
> Greetings folks,
>
> Next week I will finish flying the 40 hour test period on my new RV6. I
> would like to get it painted as soon as possible. Appreciate any
> experiences out there with painters in northern Oregon and/or Washington
> state. I'm looking for high quality work only and willing to pay a bit
> more for a great finish. Reply to me off-list
> if you prefer.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Moshe Lichtman
> RV6 N57GR
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gert <gert(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Loctite Crazing Canopy ? |
Give it time, give it time !!
crazing does not magically appear when you smear locktite on it.
Locktite alters, OVER TIME, the canopee material, causing internal
stresses. It's the localized altered stesses which will give you the
crazing.
Same goes for the non-approved cleaners. the first time you use a
cleaner detriment to the canopee, nothing will happen to the eye. Just
keep going and observe the result over time. One of those days you will
be flying into a sunset and you lost all visibility to the outside world
due to the microscopic onset of crazing.
Gert
KAKlewin(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
> 18 years of the RV-ATOR also mentions several runied canopies from use of
> lock-tight. I havent tried so I dont know...but I guess its been going on
> since 1997.
>
> Kurt in OKC
>
>
--
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Daniels <jwdanie(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Loctite Crazing Canopy ? |
>
> I've read the recent posts about Locktite causing crazing and cracks in
>canopies with great interest since I'm planning to use Riv-nuts & #6 SS CS
>Screws to attach Canopy to Roll Bar and Sliding Frame. Since I'll drill the
>holes oversize and then just barely snug them up I expect something like
>Loctite will be neccessary to keep them from backing out.
How about Vibra-Tite? Since it has to completely dry before installation
it might prove to be better to the plexi. Available at many industrial
fastener stores.
http://www.ndindustries.com/vibratite.asp
Jim
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy Griffin" <skydog-8(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Loctite Crazing Canopy ? |
It sounds to me, that what you did was to simply apply "red" loctite
(possibly 471 ?) to an unstressed portion of the canopy.
Now go back and drill a hole here and then smear some loctite inside the
hole, at this piont "your milage may vary".
Randy (no loctite near my $700, 60 hour canopy) Griffin.
----- Original Message -----
From: "EWSpears" <ewspears(at)peoplepc.com>
Subject: RV-List: Loctite Crazing Canopy ?
>
> I've read the recent posts about Locktite causing crazing and cracks
in
> canopies with great interest since I'm planning to use Riv-nuts & #6 SS CS
> Screws to attach Canopy to Roll Bar and Sliding Frame. Since I'll drill
the
> holes oversize and then just barely snug them up I expect something like
> Loctite will be neccessary to keep them from backing out.
> A week ago I smeared red (bearing mount) Loctite on the as yet still
> attached canopy flanges. I've seen no reaction whatsoever. I'm inclined to
> think that Loctite causing crazing on Plexi is an "old wives tale" but I'm
> not yet sure enough to want to risk a $700 canopy. Any enlightenment from
> the List would be appreciated.
> Esten Spears, RV8A, 80922, Leeward Air Ranch, Ocala, FL. Working on
> Finishing Kit
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Arthur Glaser <airplane(at)megsinet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Free the GA 41000 |
My flight instructor came up with an interesting slogan which come from Exodus
and refers to another group that was enslaved. Often the idea is that we are a
small group and we can be controlled.
In addition to Free the Ga 4100, he said Let My People Go! Perhaps this should
be added to letters? I am waiting to see what happens with the AOPA and the Feds
tomorrow when talking continues.
We are planning to do some training today and are under class b. We will either
file ifr or log a training flight as required. As I understand, with the
instructor on board, we call fss and can go vfr.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <terrywatson3(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cradling/supporting HS (and other parts) |
My tail, complete with rudder and elevators, has been "flying" suspended
from my 18' living room ceiling for a couple of years now. It's a great
reminder of what's waiting for me out in the shop. So far it has been out
of harm's way. The most action it has seen was the earthquake back in
February. It developed a pretty good swing but it didn't hit anything.
It's about time to take it down and fit it to the fuselage.
Terry
Seattle
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie and Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com> |
| Subject: | [Fwd: A liberated plane and a lifted spirit] |
Setting aside very important civil liberties issues for the
moment, those of you still trapped under Class B who have
storage options elsewhere might consider this immediate
solution, posted on RAH.
Charlie
Dave O wrote:
>
> Ever since that horrific Tuesday, I have been somewhat stranded some
> 320 nm from home under Cincinnati E-Class B airspace with my VFR Long
> EZ. Several days ago, I took some 'flight training' in accordance
> with FDC 1/0345 and liberated my plane. The CFI refused to charge me
> and refused my offers of payment, simply saying, "I enjoyed the
> flight". Our 20 mile trek out of E-Class B was his first ride in a
> Long EZ. I let him have the stick for a while after we cleared
> E-Class B. The FBO where my plane had been parked charged me a
> whopping $15 for the 20 days I had been tied down there. The airport
> that I relocated to offered me a T-Hangar, free of charge, until my
> planned departure a few days later.
>
> After the terrible events of 9/11, and the constant reminders and
> visuals on TV of the very worst of mankind, it was a pleasure to be
> among my friendly aviation peers again. And how fantastically
> liberating it was to slip the surly bonds of earth once again.
>
> It takes about two hours to fly between home and Cincinnati and I do
> it often enough that the trip had become rather mundane and sometimes
> just plain boring. My flight back home yesterday, however, was one of
> my most enjoyable flights ever -- I savored every minute.
>
> The air was crystal clear at 10,500' but cold, much colder than the
> summery weather of my last flight just weeks earlier, a flight that
> now seems of a different time. Strange how things can change so
> quickly. The cloudless sunset was particularly golden.
>
> Here's hoping that all those still grounded in E-Class B or TFR
> airspace find a way out soon.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Dave O
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cradling/supporting HS |
In a message dated 9/29/01 9:15:40 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
dan(at)rvproject.com writes:
<< Support it on a wall by the exposed mid-section of the spar(s) >>
That's what I have done with my RV-6 horizontal stab. It takes up no shop
space that way and is easy to get at when I need to have it in place, like
for fitting the empennage fairing.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, finish kit stuff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Boyd C. Braem" <bcbraem(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Inadvertant flying in clouds |
There have been numerous comments about "flying IFR" on this list and I
think some clarification is in order (I know, I know--I can already hear
everybody groaning!).
1. filing and flying IFR: if you pick your course and altitude(s)
carefully, you could possibly fly hundreds of flights without
encountering IMC. Remember that a controller's assignment of a heading
and altitude is just a "suggestion" until you verbally accept it.
2. flying on instruments: a) under the hood; b) on a simulator: if
you get nervous, unsure, scared or panicky under the hood, you can
always cheat--even a brief glance outside can reorient your senses; you
know that you cannot die while flying a simulator; you can become
proficient flying instruments with these two methods but it is NOT the
same as flying in IMC.
3. the only way to train for IMC flight is to fly in IMC. I know that
I did all my night flight training during the daytime:)
4. there is no "LIGHT IFR" equipment or flying; IMC flight means no
horizon and you must be prepared for icing; you cannot cheat, you could
die, if you panic your decision making skills are gone, ie, you could
die. Are Barsted's account of his first IMC flight should be required
reading for all pilots. Getting your IFR "ticket" with the intention of
ONLY getting to VFR-on-top is a fool's errand--remember, if your
somewhere agl you still have to get back down to the ground--hopefully
to some place with a runway.
5. if you're not at least nervous about flying a single engine airplane
with minimal anti-icing equipment into IMC, there's something seriously
wrong with you. A Cat III capable auto-pilot is useless if icing turns
your wings into dead weight.
Boyd.
RV-Super 6 (day VFR/acro and loving it)
Jerry Springer wrote:
>
>
> I am sure that most of you have read this article, but if you have not
> please go to this location and read the report.
>
> Jerry S
>
> http://www.ronleon.com/178seconds.html
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Who Is Going to SERFI? |
Kyle, looks like some of the Decatur, AL RV gang may be going down to
SERFI Saturday morning.
Hope to see you there!
Sam Buchanan (RV-6)
"The RV Journal" http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal
=========================
KBoatri144(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
> Who out there in RV-land is going to SERFI? I'm thinking about heading down
> late Friday, camping, then returing home sometime Saturday.
>
> Assuming you're not trapped in the *&!$#!! "Enhanced Class B", this is the
> perfect time in the South to go fly... The weather is cooling off and the
> flying is great! No more haze, my oil temps are much happier, and I can peg
> the VSI at 2000 FPM on partial tanks.
>
> On the other hand, I did make a godawful landing this morning... Maybe I
> shouldn't have drank all that cough syrup before I went flying ;-).
>
> Kyle Boatright
> 0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
> Kennesaw, GA
> http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert McCallum <robert.mccallum2(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Loctite Crazing Canopy ? |
Loctite is detrimental to "most" plastics, Plexiglas included. Loctite is an
anaerobic sealant intended for use on metals. (i.e. steel, stainless steel,
brass etc. nuts, bolts, screws, pipe fittings etc.) If the intervening
material being attached by these fasteners is contacted by the Loctite, and is
a material attacked by Loctite, at some point in the future the detrimental
results will appear. If you want to see what happens try gently screwing down
some lexan (supposedly indestructible) after applying Loctite to the screw. The
crazing is almost instantaneous and it develops very rapidly into cracks. I
found out the hard way when installing lexan windshields in race cars. Don't
use Loctite in contact with plastic. Use mechanical locking methods instead.
My humble $.02 worth
Bob McC
EWSpears wrote:
>
> I've read the recent posts about Locktite causing crazing and cracks in
> canopies with great interest since I'm planning to use Riv-nuts & #6 SS CS
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: RV-List Digest: 53 Msgs - 09/28/01 |
| From: | "Martin Hone" <martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au> |
Re the Gascolator/pump in the wing root saga - much thanks to Mark,
Charlie and everyone else that replied with suggestions and advice.
After checking the archives, I saw that this issue has been visited many
times before, and ultimately it is down to each individual to satisfy
themselves that they have eliminated all potential problems. Provided
care is taken with the short pipe connecting the gascolator and pump to
eliminate stress, I think I will go with putting the lot in the wing
root.
Another matter. I removed the fuel pick-up tube from the tank (RV6 -
QB)to make the anti-rotation mod and was surprised that the only form of
filtration was a few hacksaw cuts with the tip closed over. I would
prefer to have a finger screen made of wire mesh as suggested by
Bingellis. I figure making up a mesh sock and slipping it over the end.
Any thoughts?
Cheers
Martin in Oz
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman, MD" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | RV6 & Sam James Cowl |
Norman,
Sam James has sold a few sets of the round inlets that he uses, and I've
actually seen two of them flying on planes where the people have done just
as you suggested... putting the round inlets into Van's cowl. They look
good, and of course, that is where this entire concept was born, a new front
grafted on to the rear section (about half way back) of Van's standard cowl.
One plane was beautiful, the other looked like he got tired of the
glassing/sanding part... if you know what I mean!
There is a lot of work to do it the way you suggest, and of course, you will
have to do work on both the top and bottom part of Van's cowl to put in the
round inlets. If you look back through this entire thread, you will note
that the current Sam James Cowl for the 6 requires absolutely no
modifications to the top part of the cowl. This is beautiful fiberglass with
beautiful lines. Really top quality glass. All the work has to be done on
the bottom part of the cowl.
If you go with the AirFlow Performance FI system, you have committed
yourself to inventing the filter system. Sam's ideas in this regard are
really neat, its just that they won't fit. Others (ie, Rich Jankowski) have
the AFP FI system, but use the standard down draft version and not the
forward facing system that AFP sells to "fit" Sam's cowl (I have the forward
facing system). Rich has invented his induction system and it works well,
but it is nothing like mine. You will be faced with this decision... having
to "invent" the filter and air inflow system. If you enjoy this part of
building/fabricating (I actually do), then its ok.
That is the only point that Duane and I are trying to get across with this
thread... that people know what they are getting into, and are aware that it
takes a LOT of work to make the Sam James Cowl work for an RV-6.
jim
Tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Norman
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6 & Sam James Cowl
Jim, I really appreciate your comments on this very expensive option for
RV6's and RV6A's. I would like to go this route yet it is still new and
obviously troubled. I will let the dust settle for around a month then
contact Sam directly and ask him if he has made any changes to make his cowl
fit an RV6A with a CS prop and no acro limiting extended prop mounting
situation. I will also contact Airflow Performance as I have already
installed their fuel pump in my fuselage. This commits me to their entire
system, a decision I made about a year ago. I like the idea of no carb ice
and I like the purge system (mine T's into the right fuel vent line).
I am going to start thinking about doing my own plenum off Van's baffle kit
and using Sam's round inlets grafted into one of Van's cowls. Do you have
any comments on this set up?
Again it's an O-360 A1A with Van's recommended constant speed prop and the
full Airflow Performance fuel injection system.
Thanks Jim for your time, very voluble to me and I'll bet many other RV6/RV7
builders out there.
Norman Hunger
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob A" <racker(at)rmci.net> |
| Subject: | RE: RV-List Digest: 53 Msgs - 09/28/01 |
> themselves that they have eliminated all potential problems. Provided
> care is taken with the short pipe connecting the gascolator and pump to
> eliminate stress, I think I will go with putting the lot in the wing
> root.
Martin,
I saw the post regarding stress in this area, and possibly not being able to
properly tighten the AN hardware.
The sequence of assembly in my fuel pump/gascolator wing root install was as
follows:
1) Fabricate tubing with flare nut ends running between fuel pump and
gasolator.
2) Lay assembly on flat table. Hand tighten pump and gascolator flare nuts,
keeping things straight. "Properly" tighten each using proper technique,
ensure both still lay flat on table. No stress here, both joints properly
tightened.
3) Fasten both fuel pump and gascolator to fuselage, tied into bottom and
next higher longeron. No stress, no relative movement between fuse,
tubing, pump, and gascolator (i.e. no flexing)
4) Fasten 90 deg. AN fittings to fuel inlet and gascolator, run other tubing
per plans.
I can't see where any fittings have not been properly torqued or are
stressed (sheesh, the aluminum brake tubing going to the gears *really* gets
flexed around). And, you have eliminated two possible leak points in the
cockpit. No one way is perfect, still can't see why this is so wrong.
Good luck,
Rob Acker (RV-6, STILL wiring).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis" <mnellis(at)peoplepc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6 & Sam James Cowl |
Hi Jim, I've been following this thread closely since I was planning on
doing the same thing as Norman (i.e. AFP FI, CS Prop, Sam James plenum and
Cowl). I didn't realize that Jankowski and Bernie weren't using the
plenums.
I look forward to seeing how things turn out.
You can see pictures of Rich Jankowski and Bernie Kerrs Cowls on my web site
from Pictures I took during my honeymoon in June 1999.
http://bmnellis.com/FlyIns/Florida%20RV's.htm
Mike Nellis - http://bmnellis.com
Plainfield, IL
RV6 N699BM Reserved
Mounting Control Surfaces
Stinson 108-2 N9666K
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Norman, MD" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: RV6 & Sam James Cowl
>
> Norman,
> Sam James has sold a few sets of the round inlets that he uses, and I've
> actually seen two of them flying on planes where the people have done just
> as you suggested... putting the round inlets into Van's cowl. They look
> good, and of course, that is where this entire concept was born, a new
front
> grafted on to the rear section (about half way back) of Van's standard
cowl.
> One plane was beautiful, the other looked like he got tired of the
> glassing/sanding part... if you know what I mean!
>
> There is a lot of work to do it the way you suggest, and of course, you
will
> have to do work on both the top and bottom part of Van's cowl to put in
the
> round inlets. If you look back through this entire thread, you will note
> that the current Sam James Cowl for the 6 requires absolutely no
> modifications to the top part of the cowl. This is beautiful fiberglass
with
> beautiful lines. Really top quality glass. All the work has to be done on
> the bottom part of the cowl.
>
> If you go with the AirFlow Performance FI system, you have committed
> yourself to inventing the filter system. Sam's ideas in this regard are
> really neat, its just that they won't fit. Others (ie, Rich Jankowski)
have
> the AFP FI system, but use the standard down draft version and not the
> forward facing system that AFP sells to "fit" Sam's cowl (I have the
forward
> facing system). Rich has invented his induction system and it works well,
> but it is nothing like mine. You will be faced with this decision...
having
> to "invent" the filter and air inflow system. If you enjoy this part of
> building/fabricating (I actually do), then its ok.
>
> That is the only point that Duane and I are trying to get across with this
> thread... that people know what they are getting into, and are aware that
it
> takes a LOT of work to make the Sam James Cowl work for an RV-6.
>
> jim
> Tampa
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Norman
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6 & Sam James Cowl
>
>
> Jim, I really appreciate your comments on this very expensive option for
> RV6's and RV6A's. I would like to go this route yet it is still new and
> obviously troubled. I will let the dust settle for around a month then
> contact Sam directly and ask him if he has made any changes to make his
cowl
> fit an RV6A with a CS prop and no acro limiting extended prop mounting
> situation. I will also contact Airflow Performance as I have already
> installed their fuel pump in my fuselage. This commits me to their entire
> system, a decision I made about a year ago. I like the idea of no carb ice
> and I like the purge system (mine T's into the right fuel vent line).
>
> I am going to start thinking about doing my own plenum off Van's baffle
kit
> and using Sam's round inlets grafted into one of Van's cowls. Do you have
> any comments on this set up?
> Again it's an O-360 A1A with Van's recommended constant speed prop and the
> full Airflow Performance fuel injection system.
>
> Thanks Jim for your time, very voluble to me and I'll bet many other
RV6/RV7
> builders out there.
>
> Norman Hunger
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman, MD" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | RV6 & Sam James Cowl |
This is correct. Rich does not use Sam's air inlets (Rich made some smaller
ones), and does not use Sam's scoop... he used a Vans scoop and changed the
front to a round opening.
Why? Because there is no Sam James Cowl that fits an RV-6.
Rich also has an aluminum plenum.
jim
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mike Nellis
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6 & Sam James Cowl
Hi Jim, I've been following this thread closely since I was planning on
doing the same thing as Norman (i.e. AFP FI, CS Prop, Sam James plenum and
Cowl). I didn't realize that Jankowski and Bernie weren't using the
plenums.
I look forward to seeing how things turn out.
You can see pictures of Rich Jankowski and Bernie Kerrs Cowls on my web site
from Pictures I took during my honeymoon in June 1999.
http://bmnellis.com/FlyIns/Florida%20RV's.htm
Mike Nellis - http://bmnellis.com
Plainfield, IL
RV6 N699BM Reserved
Mounting Control Surfaces
Stinson 108-2 N9666K
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Norman, MD" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: RV6 & Sam James Cowl
>
> Norman,
> Sam James has sold a few sets of the round inlets that he uses, and I've
> actually seen two of them flying on planes where the people have done just
> as you suggested... putting the round inlets into Van's cowl. They look
> good, and of course, that is where this entire concept was born, a new
front
> grafted on to the rear section (about half way back) of Van's standard
cowl.
> One plane was beautiful, the other looked like he got tired of the
> glassing/sanding part... if you know what I mean!
>
> There is a lot of work to do it the way you suggest, and of course, you
will
> have to do work on both the top and bottom part of Van's cowl to put in
the
> round inlets. If you look back through this entire thread, you will note
> that the current Sam James Cowl for the 6 requires absolutely no
> modifications to the top part of the cowl. This is beautiful fiberglass
with
> beautiful lines. Really top quality glass. All the work has to be done on
> the bottom part of the cowl.
>
> If you go with the AirFlow Performance FI system, you have committed
> yourself to inventing the filter system. Sam's ideas in this regard are
> really neat, its just that they won't fit. Others (ie, Rich Jankowski)
have
> the AFP FI system, but use the standard down draft version and not the
> forward facing system that AFP sells to "fit" Sam's cowl (I have the
forward
> facing system). Rich has invented his induction system and it works well,
> but it is nothing like mine. You will be faced with this decision...
having
> to "invent" the filter and air inflow system. If you enjoy this part of
> building/fabricating (I actually do), then its ok.
>
> That is the only point that Duane and I are trying to get across with this
> thread... that people know what they are getting into, and are aware that
it
> takes a LOT of work to make the Sam James Cowl work for an RV-6.
>
> jim
> Tampa
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Norman
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6 & Sam James Cowl
>
>
> Jim, I really appreciate your comments on this very expensive option for
> RV6's and RV6A's. I would like to go this route yet it is still new and
> obviously troubled. I will let the dust settle for around a month then
> contact Sam directly and ask him if he has made any changes to make his
cowl
> fit an RV6A with a CS prop and no acro limiting extended prop mounting
> situation. I will also contact Airflow Performance as I have already
> installed their fuel pump in my fuselage. This commits me to their entire
> system, a decision I made about a year ago. I like the idea of no carb ice
> and I like the purge system (mine T's into the right fuel vent line).
>
> I am going to start thinking about doing my own plenum off Van's baffle
kit
> and using Sam's round inlets grafted into one of Van's cowls. Do you have
> any comments on this set up?
> Again it's an O-360 A1A with Van's recommended constant speed prop and the
> full Airflow Performance fuel injection system.
>
> Thanks Jim for your time, very voluble to me and I'll bet many other
RV6/RV7
> builders out there.
>
> Norman Hunger
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill VonDane" <n8vd(at)earthlink.net> |
"Rv-List(at)Matronics.Com"
Hi all...
Has anyone drawn an updated FWF plumbing diagram that includes the use of an
electronic engine monitor's transducers and Van's transducer manifold? How
about an electric primer?
Thanks...
-Bill VonDane
Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A - N8VD
http://vondane.com/rv8a/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Eaves" <doneaves(at)midsouth.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Free the GA 41000 |
> We are planning to do some training today and are under class b. We will
either
> file ifr or log a training flight as required. As I understand, with the
> instructor on board, we call fss and can go vfr.
Was informef by some who had done it already:
Just load up the 2 of you - Squawk 1200 - follow all the procedures you did
for VFR in the past -and go fly.
Watched a Student with his ball cap turned backwards preflight a 172, call
clear, taxi out take off, and have fun Anyway they returned, as have
several without a challenge from a F16, Police Helicopter or Cop Car -
Go Figure -
I bet - As soon as I shouted clear the storm troopers would appear with M16
at then shoulder shouting:
HOLD IT TRADER - You Can't Fly We Gotts OurSelves a National Emergency
Here -Boy you sure looked like an ERB wit dat white cap on backwards - You
Get on out out a there and put that thang up til da Pres says you can fly -
Well a 54 year old would look out of place with a Vans RV6 Cap on
backwards - A sure giveaway.
Darn I want to fly - Come On Mr. President - Let Our People Go!!!!!!
Don Eaves - RV6 - Which Rudder do we push on take off???
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "EWSpears" <ewspears(at)peoplepc.com> |
| Subject: | Loctite Crazing Plexiglass |
Thanks to all that responded. This list is great, probably saved my $700
Canopy!
Esten Spears, RV8A, 80922, Leeward Air Ranch, Ocala, FL. Working on
Finishing Kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: N227RV flies |
Steve,
CONGRATULATIONS and WELL DONE !!!
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A - Niantic, CT (Westerly airport)
p.s. send me you phone number (off line)
We'll try and fly up for a visit next month.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carlfro(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | How to use Van's AMP meter |
All,
I have a Van's amp meter with a shunt installed on the ground side of
each battery (switch selects which battery the meter is reading). Van's
instructions call for the shunt to be installed on the positive side of the
battery. The 4 terminals on the meter are +, - (leads from the shunt),
ground and +12 volts. The meter does not work with the shunt on the ground
side of the battery so I assume there is a bridge network of some kind
internal to the meter that is looking for a voltage drop across the shunt on
the positive side (i.e. same voltage drop across the shunt, just biased up
to the battery terminal voltage).
Anyone know how I can wire the amp meter to work with the shunts on the
ground side of the battery?
Carl Froehlich
RV-8A (moving to the hanger this month)
Vienna, VA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "J Andrews" <rv8a(at)lycos.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Inadvertant flying in clouds |
Rick,
This is try number two since my emailer ate my other response.
Do it! The Navaid is worth it's weight in gold. Just try and look at a map or
anything else for that matter that takes longer than thirty seconds while flying
with your knees on the stick. I go into a dive every time. The wing leveler
feature is great!
- Jim Andrews
N89JA (Flying!)
--
On Fri, 28 Sep 2001 22:58:16
Richard D. Fogerson wrote:
>
>I'm giving some thought to a strictly VFR day instrument panel for my
>RV-3 and wanted the opinion of some of you, especially those with
>experience with the Navaid auto-pilot. I put a turn and bank in an
>RV-6A with the thought that if I somehow couldn't avoid entering a
>cloud, I would be able to get through it right side up. I never did
>have to but came close from time to time punching through a hole in the
>clouds with marginal climb cabability. I'm considering doing the same
>thing again or perhaps biteing the bullet and putting in a artificial
>horizon. I have decided already that a Navaid would be very useful in a
>single seat cross-country airplane but I'm also wondering if it could be
>switched on if entering a cloud is unavoidable to get thru it once again
>right side up and thus eliminate the considerable cost of the AH or the
>T&B. I would appreciate any opinions.
>
>Rick Fogerson, RV-3 empenage
>
>
Make a difference, help support the relief efforts in the U.S.
http://clubs.lycos.com/live/events/september11.asp
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV6 & Sam James Cowl |
| From: | "Stephen C. MacInnis" <stevemac1(at)juno.com> |
I have the Steve Barnard Cowl and Sam James Plenum installed on my RV-6.
Both fit fine, though the plenum did require some cut an paste to create
a blister over the fuel spider. Steve Barnard was quite specific when he
was selling his product. It required (and I have) an IO-360 A1B6 or
A3B6(D) engine and the M hub prop. Installation was no more difficult
than Van's cowling and the quality of the parts was of higher quality
than Van's original cowlings. I will be flying shortly so I'll try to
keep the list informed. It's too bad we ran off Steve Barnard, his
expertise and input would be welcome on the subject.
Waiting for Inspection
Steve MacInnis RV-6 200+hp
writes:
>
>When Steve Barnard was selling this cowl (it's his design and molds
>that Sam
>James is selling), Steve was very clear that the M2YK prop was
>required and
>that it was not rated for akro . Also that it was
>designed
>around the angle-valve IO-360 but "should" accommodate the
>parallel-valve
>O-360. When I talked to him he really tried to talk me into the
>angle-valve
>and M2YK. IIRC he even had a page on his web site talking about his
>views on
>how the M2YK was still OK for limited RV akro. I forget the rationale
>but
>think it revolved around the actual G-loads at the prop vs the
>airframe
>G-loads. The extended cowl length which required the M2YK was part of
>his
>aerodynamic analysis and worked in concert with his inlet design. I'm
>not
>surprised that the performance gains disappear when the cowl is
>shortened
>and the inlets modified. It looks like most of the problems with Jim
>and
>Duane's installation stem from not using the combo that the cowl was
>originally designed for, or at least the M2YK. If Sam James is not
>noting
>the M2YK as a requirement he is doing a real dis-service to his
>customers.
>
>Regards,
>Greg Young
>RV-6 N6GY Houston (DWH) sold to the insurance co.
>Going to look at a Navion if I can get out of this #@(*@ Class B
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Norman
>> Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2001 7:43 PM
>> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6 & Sam James Cowl
>>
>>
>>
>> Duane and Jim, thank-you guys for outlining these problems
>> with the SJ Holy
>> Cowl on the RV6A. I hope Sam makes a new model soon. It
>> doesn't seem right
>> to continue selling a product that won't work.
>>
>> Norman
>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
In a message dated 9/28/01 3:38:00 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
dplute(at)onemain.com writes:
>
> --> RV6-List message posted by: doyal plute
>
> With the abundance of late model wrecked cars in the salvage yards with
> perfectly good seat belts, has anyone used them in R.V. aircraft? If
> so, how good was the outcome?
> Also, attaching the wingtips on a RV 6 A, either pop rivet, screws with
> nutplates or glue on with proseal. What seems to work the best?
> Sincerely:
> D Plute
>
>
>
Some advice.....stay away from the salvage yards "don't go there" stay away.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Dickson" <bubba(at)coastalnet.com> |
I received my exhaust system for my O-360 a few months ago from Vans. It
includes a heat muff. My questions are: Is this the famous Robbins heat
muff? How would I know? Is there any problem with this heat muff, or what
makes a Robbins muff better? The archive indicates that Van's muff was
inferior and I'm wondering if this is different now that they're including
the muff with the exhaust.
As you can tell, I'm basically ignorant on this subject. I'm thinking of
dual heat muffs and dual heat boxes (I don't like to be cold and I like to
fly high) and want to make an informed decision.
TIA
Robert Dickson
Fayetteville NC
RV-6A QB, O-360, Hartzell CS, firewall foreward (and backward)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
| Subject: | How to use Van's AMP meter |
On the same note, my Van's ammeter once worked but no longer does. One day
while transmitting on the radio, the ammeter needle swung completely around
the dial. It never worked after that. Electrical gurus out there care to
speculate on what happened and whether it can be fixed?
Steve Soule
Huntington, Vermont
-----Original Message-----
From: Carl Froehlich [mailto:carlfro(at)erols.com]
aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: How to use Van's AMP meter
All,
I have a Van's amp meter with a shunt installed on the ground side of
each battery (switch selects which battery the meter is reading). Van's
instructions call for the shunt to be installed on the positive side of the
battery. The 4 terminals on the meter are +, - (leads from the shunt),
ground and +12 volts. The meter does not work with the shunt on the ground
side of the battery so I assume there is a bridge network of some kind
internal to the meter that is looking for a voltage drop across the shunt on
the positive side (i.e. same voltage drop across the shunt, just biased up
to the battery terminal voltage).
Anyone know how I can wire the amp meter to work with the shunts on the
ground side of the battery?
Carl Froehlich
RV-8A (moving to the hanger this month)
Vienna, VA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: N227RV flies |
In a message dated 9/30/01 2:13:31 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
SSoule(at)pfclaw.com writes:
> Hey Listers:
>
> The project that began with laying strips of aluminum on a horizontal 4x4 in
> November, 1995, took to the air on September 29, 2001 at the Shelburne
> Airport in Shelburne, Vermont (9B3.) N227RV flies! The first flight lasted
> 30 minutes (plus or minus). The oil temperature stayed at 190 degrees,
> Fahrenheit; the cylinder head temps stayed in the low part of the green arc.
> The plane comes off the ground very fast, climbs like a rocket and sinks
> pretty fast when you pull the power off. It needs a lot of right rudder at
> full power and at high angles of attack ... much more than a Cessna 150.
>
> We've got a Lycoming O-320 D1A with an Aymar-Demuth prop. The aircraft is
> day-VFR only ... no lights, no vacuum system.
>
> Steve Soule
> RV-6A, Huntington, Vermont
>
>
>
Congrats for the first flight......now its time to have some fun---go fly!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | How to use Van's AMP meter |
| From: | "Todd Wenzel" <TWenzel(at)hsdinc.com> |
Carl,
I think you are out of luck here. If I were you, I would put the shunt
on the + side of the battery since putting the shunt on the negative
side would actually shift the battery's ground ABOVE the "ground" (i.e.
chassis) of the rest of the aircraft. This could potentially cause
problems down the road with various instrumentation. The ground terminal
on the battery should be tied directly to the chassis of the aircraft,
in a similar fashion to how it you your car.
Todd Wenzel
RV-8AQB (fuse)
-----Original Message-----
From: Carl Froehlich [mailto:carlfro(at)erols.com]
aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: How to use Van's AMP meter
All,
I have a Van's amp meter with a shunt installed on the ground side
of
each battery (switch selects which battery the meter is reading). Van's
instructions call for the shunt to be installed on the positive side of
the
battery. The 4 terminals on the meter are +, - (leads from the shunt),
ground and +12 volts. The meter does not work with the shunt on the
ground
side of the battery so I assume there is a bridge network of some kind
internal to the meter that is looking for a voltage drop across the
shunt on
the positive side (i.e. same voltage drop across the shunt, just biased
up
to the battery terminal voltage).
Anyone know how I can wire the amp meter to work with the shunts on
the
ground side of the battery?
Carl Froehlich
RV-8A (moving to the hanger this month)
Vienna, VA
________________________________________________________________________________
Yes these are the Robbins Muffs. I've got two in parallel and don't have too
much heat. If you want to stay warm put on the aileron tube boots as detailed
on Sam Bs site and the dual muffs . Also look for other sources for air leaks
and seal them as well.
Garry "Casper"
My daughter Andrea (12 going on 18) had her first ride on Saturday, after she
asked if we could go flying tomorrow. Even got into some moderate turb and
she just rode it out. Talk about lucky both my girls love flying.
Robert Dickson wrote:
>
> I received my exhaust system for my O-360 a few months ago from Vans. It
> includes a heat muff. My questions are: Is this the famous Robbins heat
> muff? How would I know? Is there any problem with this heat muff, or what
> makes a Robbins muff better? The archive indicates that Van's muff was
> inferior and I'm wondering if this is different now that they're including
> the muff with the exhaust.
> As you can tell, I'm basically ignorant on this subject. I'm thinking of
> dual heat muffs and dual heat boxes (I don't like to be cold and I like to
> fly high) and want to make an informed decision.
>
> TIA
>
> Robert Dickson
> Fayetteville NC
> RV-6A QB, O-360, Hartzell CS, firewall foreward (and backward)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dfmorrow(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | NTSB report on RV9 Prototype crash |
The NTSB has released their final report on the RV9 Prototype crash on
4/2/00. See "www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id 001212X20806&key=1". Their
conclusion was that the cause was flight into IFR when neither pilot or
aircraft were IFR capable.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Zeidman, Richard B" <richard.b.zeidman(at)boeing.com> |
| Subject: | Van's oil pressure gauge |
> Listers,
> Have any of you flying with Van's electric oil pressure gauge had a
> problem with high pressure readings? I have changed the sending unit and
> gauge 2 times and still have high readings at cruise (over 100 psi).I
> tried an automotive mechanical gauge and the pressures are normal
> (75-80psi) just to verify that the engine was ok. I'm about to throw the
> electric stuff in the trash and buy a mechanical gauge that will fit.
> Any of you out there had similar problems?
> Rich Zeidman
> RV6A 160 hours since 1-7-2001
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Zilik" <zilik(at)bewellnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: N227RV flies |
Steve,
Great work, I know you'll love your new RV. Sure wish I could fly
Gary (stuck in Class Bravo) Zilik
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
Hello Larry,
The heat muff that came with your Larry Vetterman exhaust system is made by
him and is supplied with the exhaust systems.
The Robbins heat muff is different manufacturer.
I have the older Heat muff that Van's supplied some years ago. It will fit
on the left side but not the right side exhaust pipe. So far as I can see
that is the only thing negative re-this heat muff .
I also have the Vetterman heat muff and will in all likelihood use it as
well. I intend to use the Vetterman unit first, then if I want more heat I
will utilize the second muff.
YW
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Dickson" <bubba(at)coastalnet.com>
Subject: RV-List: heat muffs
>
> I received my exhaust system for my O-360 a few months ago from Vans. It
> includes a heat muff. My questions are: Is this the famous Robbins heat
> muff? How would I know? Is there any problem with this heat muff, or what
> makes a Robbins muff better? The archive indicates that Van's muff was
> inferior and I'm wondering if this is different now that they're including
> the muff with the exhaust.
> As you can tell, I'm basically ignorant on this subject. I'm thinking of
> dual heat muffs and dual heat boxes (I don't like to be cold and I like to
> fly high) and want to make an informed decision.
>
> TIA
>
> Robert Dickson
> Fayetteville NC
> RV-6A QB, O-360, Hartzell CS, firewall foreward (and backward)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | You can now order 'Remember' memorial patches/stickers |
| From: | "Reeves, Doug" <Douglas.Reeves(at)archongroup.com> |
Hi gang,
We are taking orders now for patches and stickers of David Paranteau's
'Remember' image.
Everything's just about in place. Patches and stickers are now being
made (500 patches / 2500 stickers). Orders are being taken. Go to
http://www.metronet.com/~dreeves/david_paranteaus_remember_patch.htm.
On these two items ALL proceeds go to the American Red Cross.
Distribution is being coordinated by Austin, TX RV-6 builder Mike
Thompson, who is a very swell guy in my book.
Mike forwarded me a link to a web site selling T-shirts (I included a
link to it on the page above).
Best,
Doug Reeves
Van's Air Force - World Wide Wing
http://www.vansaircraft.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
Van's heat muffs won't fit. They are too long to fit on the straight
portion of the pipe. They even know this. I had one and called them up and
said, "hey I got this heat muff," and they interrupted me and said, "it
doesn't fit" . Why they sell a product that doesn't fit is beyond me,
especially when they know it doesn't fit.
Send it back, get credit, and order the Robbins muff. It is far superior in
quality and IT FITS!!
The way you can tell, is the Van's muff is hinged on one side. The Robbins
muff has screws that come out of the ends.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Dickson" <bubba(at)coastalnet.com>
Subject: RV-List: heat muffs
I received my exhaust system for my O-360 a few months ago from Vans. It
includes a heat muff. My questions are: Is this the famous Robbins heat
muff? How would I know? Is there any problem with this heat muff, or what
makes a Robbins muff better? The archive indicates that Van's muff was
inferior and I'm wondering if this is different now that they're including
the muff with the exhaust.
As you can tell, I'm basically ignorant on this subject. I'm thinking of
dual heat muffs and dual heat boxes (I don't like to be cold and I like to
fly high) and want to make an informed decision.
TIA
Robert Dickson
Fayetteville NC
RV-6A QB, O-360, Hartzell CS, firewall foreward (and backward)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | heat muff confusion |
| From: | "Robert Dickson" <bubba(at)coastalnet.com> |
The heat muff that came with your Larry Vetterman exhaust system is made by
him and is supplied with the exhaust systems.
The Robbins heat muff is different manufacturer.
Yes these are the Robbins Muffs. I've got two in parallel and don't have too
much heat. If you want to stay warm put on the aileron tube boots as
detailed
on Sam Bs site and the dual muffs . Also look for other sources for air
leaks
and seal them as well.
----------------------------------
wow! I don't know what to think! I believe it's time to Call Van's. On the
other hand, if the muff I have was made/supplied by Mr. Vetterman, it's got
to fit. If everything on an RV was as easy to fit as his exhaust, I'd be
flying by now.
Robert Dickson
RV-6A thinkin' about muffs ;-)
________________________________________________________________________________
LAIRD.
he said it had better vision, not a bigger brain. :-)
scott
tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
Ordered a set of Desser retreads for the RV and was astonished at their heft:
the bathroom scales (beam type) indicated 12-3/4 lbs for the pair of tires.
A call to Desser indicated that's due to the better rubber which should give
longer life... sheesh, I'm a grass strip man, mostly, so if possible I'd opt
for lighter weight, versus super long life. Salesman didn't have exact
figures, but claimed all 5.00x5 4-ply tires were going to come in within 1/2
lb. of his retreads. My gut says he's wrong; anybody have weight info on
other tires, like the McCreary Air Hawks I was considering? Unable to locate
this info on the web or in the archives, but I think I've seem it somewhere
before.
Thanks in advance. ***Free the GA 41,000.
-Bill B
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
"AeroElectric List"
This product is a glass attitude EFIS with tape strip displays of airspeed,
heading,
altitude, angle of attack, VSI, voltmeter, G meter, clock, ball and slip,
all on the
primary display page.
I phoned Gillian today for more information. They are in flight testing
with a C-180 on floats and a Beaver on floats. They are behind in
their schedule and they have been held up by recent events. They
now expect to begin deliveries early next year.
http://www.dynondevelopment.com/
Gillian C. Torode
Dynon Development Inc.
19501 144th Ave NE
Suite C-500
Woodinville, WA 98072
(425)402-4404 Phone (425)984-1751 Fax
Pricing will start at around $2000 including probes. Add $200 for a heated
pitot tube that will run the Angle of Attack bar graph next to your airspeed
bar graph. This pitot tube is supposed to be the standard size, I should be
able to retrofit it into my existing mast. Also available is a standby
battery
that automatically charges and gives you three hours running time.
One concern for RV'ers is the ability for it to be bright enough. The two
aircraft
in Dynon's test fleet don't sport the bubble canopy that requires the
brightest
of displays. This is a big unanswered question.
Gillian reported that they have now had close to 1000 enquiries but are not
actually taking orders. They are planning an engine monitor next, then some
form of moving map and a HSI. All modules will be able to link to each
other.
A few more companies like this and we will soon have affordable glass
cockpits.
I like the idea of an affordable EFIS, I might just get one.......
In shuffling the panel I think the EFIS will replace the Attitude, and the
Attitude
will replace the DG which I will lose altogether. At least one of my moving
map
systems will have the common electronic HSI.
Stay tuned......
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Christie" <billc(at)dancris.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6 & Sam James Cowl |
Listers,
Does anyone know whether there is a similar problem with an RV8A? I spoke
with Sam at Osh while looking at an RV8 and nothing was mentioned. I am not
a fibreglass expert and would not care to go through this.
Bill Christie, RV8A, Phoenix
----- Original Message -----
From: "Duane Bentley" <dbentley(at)fuse.net>
Subject: RV-List: RV6 & Sam James Cowl
>
> Since Jim Norman opened the door, I might as well put this on the RV list
> rather that get inquiries for weeks. I had sent e-mail and telephone
> exchanges with Jim, who finally suggested I catch a flight from Cincinnati
> to Tampa to understand his problems. I had not started the installation
of
> the Sam James cowl on my RV6, but had all the products purchased,
including
> the Air Flow Performance fuel injection and Vetterman 4 exhaust pipes.
> (Cross over will not fit with the Airflow System modified for the Sam
James
> cowl.) The notes below came out of a letter I sent to Sam, a week after
> visiting Jim in Florida. Sam called me the day he received the letter,
said
> he didn't understand the magnitude of the problem, and told me he was
going
> up to visit Jim Norman himself. Three days after that visit, Sam
contacted
> me with his evaluation. In the end, the question was whether this cowling
> is worth in performance improvement and esthetics, the substantial amount
of
> work it will take to modify it to fit. Add that evaluation to the
comments
> from a phone call I had with Rich Jankowski, some three weeks ago....." If
> you don't install it right, you may not see any performace increase, maybe
> even a decrease....."
>
> I'm two weeks away from putting on the engine and seeing if the cowl comes
> any closer to fitting that Jim's did. Preliminary measurements off my RV6
> firewall and cowling tell me that there is no difference in Jim's
> configuration and mine. I concluded the technical summary of my letter
with
> an offer to work with Sam, even invest, to produce a cowling that fits the
> more "standard" RV6, e.g. 0-360, C2YK C/S prop, Airflow Performance fuel
> injection. Sam countered by offering to work with me to address how to
make
> the current cowl fit the airplane, if I decided to continue with his
> cowling. Sam offered to send the next RV6 cowl buyer to me if I wanted to
> sell it and go back to Van's original. I told him I'd let him know in a
> couple of weeks. In any case, I can not, with any integrity sell this
> cowling to another RV6 builder without outlining the magnitude of the work
> ahead. If there is someone out there who wants to consider it, and is
> looking for a deal, send me a note off line.
>
> Here is the detailed analysis part of the letter I sent to Sam. I don't
> have a web site, but will gladly send the digital photos to anyone if
> requested:
> 1. Vans Aircraft with Hartzell Propeller, offers a standard C/S prop
> C2YK, and an optional propeller with a longer hub - M2YR. The longer hub
> propeller is not approved for aerobatic flight, is limited to 3.8gs, and
is
> approximately $950 more than the C2YK propeller. Installing this or any
> owner fabricated prop spacer is not a good solution for an aircraft that
was
> designed for the RV6 mission. Unfortunately, this information was not
> common knowledge when many of us purchased your cowling design.
>
> 2. As measured from my Sam James cowling, the cowling comes out of
the
> mold with a total length of approximately 37 inches. With the 0-360A1A
> engine installed on the RV6 (A) aircraft, and the Hartzell C/S C2YK
> propeller, the measured distance from the aircraft forward firewall to the
> back of the propeller spinner plate is approximately 34 inches. Allowing
> a maximum gap of inch between the spinner back plate and the leading edge
> of the cowling, the result is 34 inches of maximum allowable cowl length.
> This difference in dimension dictates the removal of approximately 3
inches
> off the back of the Sam James Cowling. Photo 1 shows both cowls installed
> and the excess material sitting on top of the forward top skin. Jim is
> holding the excess material in Photo 2.
>
> 3. In addition, the cross section drawing you provided with the
> cowling, showing the proposed air intake system, depicts a dimension of
> 4.125 inches between the spinner back plate and the engine flywheel. With
a
> standard C2YK C/S prop, that dimension measured approximately 2.125
inches.
> This again confirms that without a prop extension, the engine moves
forward
> within the cowl envelope approximately 2 3 inches.
>
> 4. Now, the slope of both the bottom and top cowls substantially
> impacts the available volume within the installation, since a cut has been
> made at the back of the cowling.
>
> 5. The Sam James Plenum can still be installed, but material must be
> removed from the front of the plenum to fit it lower onto the engine and
> under the top cowling. See Photos 3 and 4. In addition, a blister above
> the AFP purge must still be installed. See Photo 5. With the unique AFP
> purge valve configuration (valve bracketing change) for the Sam James
Cowl,
> there is still an interference with the plenum if the blister is not
added.
> Again, this as a result of the forward transfer of the engine within the
top
> cowl and its descending outline to the propeller.
>
> 6. The bottom cowl is where the majority of the modifications are
> required. Removing a 3-inch axial cut off the rear end of the cowl forces
> the aircraft firewall into the upslope portion of the bottom cowling.
> Installing the bottom cowl with no modification results in an gap, fore to
> aft, at the intersection of the upper and lower cowl hinge lines,
increasing
> from zero at the front to over 1 inches at the rear. Given a choice of
> adding material at the hinge line intersection or splitting the bottom
> cowling, Jim Norman chose the latter, and cut the bottom cowl into three
> pieces. See Photos No 6, 7, and 8.
>
> 7. This splits the bottom cowling into left and right side panels,
and
> a bottom portion. After putting the top cowling in place, Jim fitted the
> left and right side panels to the top cowl at the hinge line. He then
> secured the bottom section, then laminated fiberglass onto the three
bottom
> pieces to reform the bottom cowl into one piece.
>
>
> 8. Unfortunately, more modification is required. From Photo No. 9,
you
> can see that the entire air intake for the fuel injection system is too
far
> forward and will not fit. In addition, the bottom of the air intake is
> against the bottom of the cowl. Jim cut the intake tube twice to reduce
its
> length. See Photo 10 and 11. In Photo 11, under his right index finger
you
> will see that Jim completely removed the mounting flange on the fiberglass
> intake tube to fit it up to the cowling. From Photo 12, you can see that
> the air filter is also too large, both in outer diameter and length. K&N
> Airfilters do not come in a smaller outer diameter, according to the
> company. I also question the impact on the intake airflow with the same
> volume of air needing to be pulled through a smaller length filter. The
> aluminum baffle recommended in your drawing will definitely not fit in the
> cavity.
>
> 9. My recommendation to Jim was to cut the air intake out of the cowl
> and extend and reattach it approximately inch below the bottom cowl to
> allow the engine mounted intake to come close to fitting in the cowling.
A
> similar cut will need to be made to the rear of the bottom cowling to fare
> into the forward extension. Your intake tube will have to be glassed into
> the cowling and some sort of baffling fabricated to seal it to the air
> injector, still allowing for relative movement between the engine and the
> cowling.
>
> 10. Jim has yet to address the installation of the 4-pipe exhaust system
> and its proximity to the cowling walls with the reduced volume.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
Also look at www.icarusinstruments.com They have a package available
now using the IPAQ pocket PC as the display. Prices start at $1450
and go up from there for various options.
Ed Cole
RV6A N2169D Flying
RV6A N648RV Finishing
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Norman [SMTP:nhunger(at)sprint.ca]
> Sent: Monday, October 01, 2001 1:53 PM
> To: RV List; rocket-list(at)matronics.com; AeroElectric List
> Subject: RV-List: Dynon EFIS-D10
>
>
> This product is a glass attitude EFIS with tape strip displays of
> airspeed,
> heading,
> altitude, angle of attack, VSI, voltmeter, G meter, clock, ball and slip,
> all on the
> primary display page.
>
> I phoned Gillian today for more information. They are in flight testing
> with a C-180 on floats and a Beaver on floats. They are behind in
> their schedule and they have been held up by recent events. They
> now expect to begin deliveries early next year.
>
> http://www.dynondevelopment.com/
> Gillian C. Torode
> Dynon Development Inc.
> 19501 144th Ave NE
> Suite C-500
> Woodinville, WA 98072
> (425)402-4404 Phone (425)984-1751 Fax
>
> Pricing will start at around $2000 including probes. Add $200 for a heated
> pitot tube that will run the Angle of Attack bar graph next to your
> airspeed
> bar graph. This pitot tube is supposed to be the standard size, I should
> be
> able to retrofit it into my existing mast. Also available is a standby
> battery
> that automatically charges and gives you three hours running time.
>
> One concern for RV'ers is the ability for it to be bright enough. The two
> aircraft
> in Dynon's test fleet don't sport the bubble canopy that requires the
> brightest
> of displays. This is a big unanswered question.
>
> Gillian reported that they have now had close to 1000 enquiries but are
> not
> actually taking orders. They are planning an engine monitor next, then
> some
> form of moving map and a HSI. All modules will be able to link to each
> other.
> A few more companies like this and we will soon have affordable glass
> cockpits.
>
> I like the idea of an affordable EFIS, I might just get one.......
> In shuffling the panel I think the EFIS will replace the Attitude, and the
> Attitude
> will replace the DG which I will lose altogether. At least one of my
> moving
> map
> systems will have the common electronic HSI.
>
> Stay tuned......
> Norman Hunger
> RV6A Delta BC
>
>
>
>
>
>
Maxim Home Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com
Products Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
New Products:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
Datasheets:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
The information contained in this message is confidential
and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Nancy Jean Burkholder" <nancyb(at)mninter.net> |
| Subject: | RV-6A QB for sale |
I have an RV-6A, tip-up canopy, quickbuild for sale:
Delivered in August, 2000. Includes the following:
* Empennage about 1/2 completed, some work completed on the fuselage
* 2 wing landing lights
* Passenger and pilot steps
* Dual vent system
* Electric flaps, elevator and aileron trim systems
* Capacitive fuel probes
* Welded SS firewall box, recessed for CS propeller govenor/oil filter.
$14,000. I live in Minneapolis.
I'm selling the kit becuz I bought Terry Jantzi's RV-6 at the Red Wing
forum in April. At the time I thought that flying an RV while building
one would provide a great opportunity to dial-in some customization
ideas. Then I decided to buy a house in the Twin Cities and it does not
have adequate build space. I also realize that my life is very busy and
I'm having a hard time finding time to devote to building. All things
considered, I realize this is not the right time in my life to build my
airplane.
nancy b. "Good people are always so sure they're right."
Barbara Graham's last words
Executed June 5, 1955 at San Quentin
________________________________________________________________________________
He(the hawk) ended up there casue he wanted a ride so he could have that RV
or Rocket grin
chris wilcox
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Re: How to use Van's AMP meter |
Carl,
The shunt needs to be on the positive side of the battery in series with the
buss. If it's on the negative side your starter will draw current through it and
probably make it smoke. The ammeter doesn't care where the shunt is - it only
reads the current flowing through it. The meter's leads would however have to be
reversed if the shunt is in the ground wire (assuming a standard type of meter).
The voltage at the shunt makes no difference to the ammeter since all it's doing
is reading the voltage drop across the shunt..
Dave
Carl Froehlich wrote:
>
> All,
>
> I have a Van's amp meter with a shunt installed on the ground side of
> each battery (switch selects which battery the meter is reading). Van's
> instructions call for the shunt to be installed on the positive side of the
> battery. The 4 terminals on the meter are +, - (leads from the shunt),
> ground and +12 volts. The meter does not work with the shunt on the ground
> side of the battery so I assume there is a bridge network of some kind
> internal to the meter that is looking for a voltage drop across the shunt on
> the positive side (i.e. same voltage drop across the shunt, just biased up
> to the battery terminal voltage).
>
> Anyone know how I can wire the amp meter to work with the shunts on the
> ground side of the battery?
>
> Carl Froehlich
> RV-8A (moving to the hanger this month)
> Vienna, VA
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV6 & Sam James Cowl |
> Listers,
> Does anyone know whether there is a similar problem with an RV8A? I spoke
> with Sam at Osh while looking at an RV8 and nothing was mentioned. I am
not
> a fibreglass expert and would not care to go through this.
>
> Bill Christie, RV8A, Phoenix
Bill,
I guess i would qualify as the only person with experience here with the
RV-8. First off you should read my cowl/plenum chronicle at...
http://www.rv-8.com/Cowl.htm
Then it depends on what engine and prop you will be using as well. Will you
be installing an angle valve or parallel valve, and if parallel valve,
Carbureted or injected? Fixed pitch or c/s?
Randy Lervold
RV-8, #80500, 131 hrs.
www.rv-8.com
Home Wing VAF
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Pullin' G's.. A little Help Please |
Whenever I pull more than a couple of G's, my headset starts to slide off my
head. This is probably aggravated by my tendancy to look "up" into a turn or
loop, which makes my headset to want to slide off backwards - down the back
of my neck... This is distracting at best.
How do the "real" acro pilots out there in RV-land prevent this?
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: heat muff confusion |
Robert and others, whom are commenting on this issue.
Let me clarify my earlier post. The heat muffs supplied with the Vetterman
System are Robbins Wings heat muffs. Larry started supplying them as part of
his system about a year ago. Before this if you ordered a heat muff from Larry
it was also a Robbins Wings muff. He has never supplied any other brand of heat
muff. Larry is the one who got Rick started in the business and he occasionally
works for Larry, when Larry gets swamped. To quote Larry," Rick welds better
than I do".
Garry " Casper"
Robert Dickson wrote:
>
>
> The heat muff that came with your Larry Vetterman exhaust system is made by
> him and is supplied with the exhaust systems.
> The Robbins heat muff is different manufacturer.
>
>
> Yes these are the Robbins Muffs. I've got two in parallel and don't have too
> much heat. If you want to stay warm put on the aileron tube boots as
> detailed
> on Sam Bs site and the dual muffs . Also look for other sources for air
> leaks
> and seal them as well.
>
> ----------------------------------
>
> wow! I don't know what to think! I believe it's time to Call Van's. On the
> other hand, if the muff I have was made/supplied by Mr. Vetterman, it's got
> to fit. If everything on an RV was as easy to fit as his exhaust, I'd be
> flying by now.
>
> Robert Dickson
> RV-6A thinkin' about muffs ;-)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pullin' G's.. A little Help Please |
>
>
>Whenever I pull more than a couple of G's, my headset starts to slide off
>my
>head. This is probably aggravated by my tendancy to look "up" into a turn
>or
>loop, which makes my headset to want to slide off backwards - down the back
>of my neck... This is distracting at best.
>
>How do the "real" acro pilots out there in RV-land prevent this?
>
>Kyle Boatright
>0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Duct tape. :)
Ok, maybe not. But, the acro nuts I hang with often use cloth helmets, which
integrate the headset into a cloth headcover with a chinstrap. You'll look
like Snoopy, but it's very effective. I don't use one, and just set my
headset for a firm fit, so it won't go anywhere. I pull up to 4G and it
hasn't caused any problems. It might just have to do with the type of
headset you have, and the shape of your noggin. I've seen Patty Wagstaff
with a regular (Bose, I think) headset, with a chinstrap attached to the
earcups or the frame in some manner. Seems to keep it in place even with
all that hair flyin' all over the blessed place.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don Hyde <DonH(at)axonn.com> |
| Subject: | Pullin' G's.. A little Help Please |
I think their headsets are attached to their helmets...
> -----Original Message-----
> From: KBoatri144(at)aol.com [mailto:KBoatri144(at)aol.com]
> Sent: Monday, October 01, 2001 5:48 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Pullin' G's.. A little Help Please
>
>
>
>
> Whenever I pull more than a couple of G's, my headset starts
> to slide off my
> head. This is probably aggravated by my tendancy to look
> "up" into a turn or
> loop, which makes my headset to want to slide off backwards -
> down the back
> of my neck... This is distracting at best.
>
> How do the "real" acro pilots out there in RV-land prevent this?
>
> Kyle Boatright
> 0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
> Kennesaw, GA
> http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Dickson" <bubba(at)coastalnet.com> |
well, to finish up this thread, I just spent some time with this muff that
came with the vetterman exhaust and this is what I've come up with:
- it doesn't have a hinge on the side
- it does have 2 stainless rods that extend through asymmetrical ends and
attach with screws
- the instructions indicate that there is a 9" model for the left side, but
that I got an 8" model for the right side
- the instructions are very specific as to the placement of the muff in
relation to the ball joint and rotation to clear the cowl
if this isn't the Robbins muff it sure sounds just like it. I think I'll
keep it. Thanks to everyone who replied.
Robert Dickson
RV-6A QB, handlin' muffs in Fayette-stan
----------
>From: "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com>
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV-List: heat muffs
>Date: Mon, Oct 1, 2001, 3:03 PM
>
>
> Van's heat muffs won't fit. They are too long to fit on the straight
> portion of the pipe. They even know this. I had one and called them up and
> said, "hey I got this heat muff," and they interrupted me and said, "it
> doesn't fit" . Why they sell a product that doesn't fit is beyond me,
> especially when they know it doesn't fit.
>
> Send it back, get credit, and order the Robbins muff. It is far superior in
> quality and IT FITS!!
>
> The way you can tell, is the Van's muff is hinged on one side. The Robbins
> muff has screws that come out of the ends.
>
> Paul Besing
> RV-6A N197AB Arizona
> http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
> Flying
> Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
> http://www.kitlog.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Robert Dickson" <bubba(at)coastalnet.com>
> To: "rv list"
> Subject: RV-List: heat muffs
>
>
> I received my exhaust system for my O-360 a few months ago from Vans. It
> includes a heat muff. My questions are: Is this the famous Robbins heat
> muff? How would I know? Is there any problem with this heat muff, or what
> makes a Robbins muff better? The archive indicates that Van's muff was
> inferior and I'm wondering if this is different now that they're including
> the muff with the exhaust.
> As you can tell, I'm basically ignorant on this subject. I'm thinking of
> dual heat muffs and dual heat boxes (I don't like to be cold and I like to
> fly high) and want to make an informed decision.
>
> TIA
>
> Robert Dickson
> Fayetteville NC
> RV-6A QB, O-360, Hartzell CS, firewall foreward (and backward)
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
>
>Hi folks,
>
>My insurance is up at the end of this month and my broker (skysmith) has
>been getting new quotes from the insurance carriers...and the one
>they've gotten so far from my current carrier (AIG) is almost $400
>higher! Since I have 225 hours in my bird this year it should have went
>down--not up. Scott said that this is fallout from the WTC disaster,
>according to what the carriers are telling him; and the quotes he's been
>getting have been generally higher from the insurance companies since
>Sept. 11. He did ask them to requote it. Is anyone else out there
>experiencing this?
>
>This is complete bullshit. Then it will be your car insurance, your
>homeowners, etc. And I know this is a very small thing given the
>greater scope of what's happening in the world right now, but I've come
>to the realization that we all will be paying for the damage. Anyone
>know how to lay a claim on the now-frozen assets of islamic terrorist
>groups?
>
>Bob Japundza
>RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying
Oh good freakin' grief. Why am I not surprised. I'm due for renewal with
Nationair in December and will let ya'll know how it goes. I'll have
probably 280 hours on the RV by then. My rate went down about $200 for last
year's renewal. I now fully expect it will go back up that amount and maybe
more. I could just scream. Gotta get back to work on my napalm racks and
looooong range tanks. Taliban gonna hafta pay...in a BIG way.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 10/1/2001 6:57:04 PM Central Daylight Time,
ABAYMAN(at)aol.com writes:
> i wonder if they will let YOU prorate your premium since the aircraft have
> been grounded. fat chance, althought they don't have a problem when its in
> there favor.
> scott
> tampa
>
its still insured when its on the ground
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Winters" <dtw_rv6(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | AN3 bolt hole size |
You should use the numbered drill size that is bigger than the bolt size
(unless the prints call for close tolerance bolts). In this case, a #12 is
correct.
Welcome to the list!
Don Winters - RV6
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of james freeman
Subject: Re: RV-List: AN3 bolt hole size
on 9/23/01 5:23 PM, Steve Struyk at RV8Striker(at)hotmail.com wrote:
> This is my first posting. Hope I'm doing it right.
Yep
>
> What I need to know is what size hole to drill for an AN3 bolt.
#12 drill bit
I'm
> ready to place my horizontal Stab. in my jig but don't see anywhere the
> correct hole size for the hinges or brackets on the jig. It seems to be
> a number 12 drill bit or 3/16th (same as the bolt) but I want to get it
> right.
Always check if you're not sure, but this will become simple very quickly.
There are many good references available, including the Orndorf videos which
will pretty much hold you by the hand and lead you along, especially on the
empennage.
>
> Thanks in advance
No problem. Welcome aboard
> Steve Struyk
> RV8
James Freeman
RV8Q fuse/finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary A. Sobek" <rv6flier(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pullin' G's.. A little Help Please |
-- KBoatri144(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>
> Whenever I pull more than a couple of G's, my headset starts to slide
> off my
> head. This is probably aggravated by my tendancy to look "up" into a
> turn or
> loop, which makes my headset to want to slide off backwards - down
> the back
> of my neck... This is distracting at best.
>
> How do the "real" acro pilots out there in RV-land prevent this?
>
> Kyle Boatright
> 0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
> Kennesaw, GA
> http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
Kyle:
I pull 4G on a regular basis. My LightSpeed XL-25 stay on without a
problem. I always lock my head straight. Every time I turn my head or
look up, I end up pulling a neck muscle and hurt for 3 or 4 days.
The real Acro guys will have some kind of strap to hold them on for
negative Gs.
====
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
944.5 Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
http://phone.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Knicholas2(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | do you prime inside fuse sides? |
PLEASE no flame mail. I know that the prime vs. no prime have been discussed
to death but I do have a question. I have etched, alodined and primed all of
the tail section, wing and fuse spars. Any piece that I cannot see/inspect
or has metal to metal contact has been primed. What do you guys think of
leaving the inside of the fuse skins bare to save weight? The spars and
bulkheads are treated (metal to metal) and the inside skins will be visable
for inspection.
Any thoughts?
Kim Nicholas
RV9 fuse
Seattle
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | wvu(at)mail.ameritel.net |
| Subject: | VAL 760 LED Display Fix |
Listers,
Certain LED segments of my VAL 760 Comm display are burning out again only 3
months since I last sent it to VAL Avionics. I called them up and was told
that the company found a problem that would be fixed at no cost to you. If
you have one of these comm radios, give them a call and send the unit back
to be fixed. Give it some time so that they'd fix mind first ok?
Anh
N985VU
-6
Maryland
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bobby Hester <bhester(at)apex.net> |
RV-List
| Subject: | Elevator rivets? |
I'm ready to layout my elevator stiffener rivets. I've got a rivet fan.
1/4" from the spar end and 3/4" from the trailing edge end, 1-1/2 inch
max spacing. How do I layout the rivets and get them spaced evenly
lengthwise and crosswise like the rudder rivets are? At first I just
thought I had the put the first fan hole on the first rivet then open
the fan to 1-1/2" then close it down to fit the first rivet on the other
end. That spaces them evenly length wise but then they will not be even
crosswise on the elevator. I'm I missing something here or am I correct
and that is just the way it is?
--
Surfing the Web from Hopkinsville, KY
Visit my web site at: http://www.geocities.com/hester-hoptown/RVSite/
Finishing RV7A empannage :-)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator rivets? |
In a message dated 10/1/01 11:13:50 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
bhester(at)apex.net writes:
<< I'm ready to layout my elevator stiffener rivets. I've got a rivet fan.
1/4" from the spar end and 3/4" from the trailing edge end, 1-1/2 inch
max spacing. How do I layout the rivets and get them spaced evenly
lengthwise and crosswise like the rudder rivets are? At first I just
thought I had the put the first fan hole on the first rivet then open
the fan to 1-1/2" then close it down to fit the first rivet on the other
end. That spaces them evenly length wise but then they will not be even
crosswise on the elevator. I'm I missing something here or am I correct
and that is just the way it is? >>
I spaced all of mine at 1.5", except the rivet nearest the trailing edge,
where I went with whatever spacing under 1.5" worked. That way, all of the
rivets except the last one line up in both directions. By the way, I liked
using a steel ruler much better than my rivet fan, which I thought was a
fairly expensive answer to a question easily answered by a $3.00 ruler.
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
| From: | "Tedd McHenry" <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
>--> RV6-List message posted by: MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com
>
>Some advice.....stay away from the salvage yards "don't go there" stay away.
>
Why?
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Thomas Mosher" <tmosher(at)gbronline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
1. Belts usually exposed to weather
2. condition of belts unknown
3. possibility of being exposed to excessive stress - did you know that it
is recommended that you replace your car's seatbelts after an accident? They
are usually stretched out from restraining you in the crash?
4. age of belts unknown
5. you going to trust something you got on the cheap to restrain you in an
accident?
Tom
N787RV (reserved)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tedd McHenry" <tedd(at)vansairforce.org>
Subject: Re: RV6-List: seat belts
> --> RV6-List message posted by: "Tedd McHenry"
>
> >--> RV6-List message posted by: MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com
> >
> >Some advice.....stay away from the salvage yards "don't go there" stay
away.
> >
>
> Why?
>
> Tedd McHenry
> Surrey, BC
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Elevator rivets?) |
> By the way, I liked
> using a steel ruler much better than my rivet fan, which I thought was a
> fairly expensive answer to a question easily answered by a $3.00 ruler.
After you've laid out a couple dozen rivet lines, you'll start to see the
value in a rivet fan. Saves a lot of time. (except maybe with the new -7
and -9A kits....)
I picked up a trick from someone somewhere along the way -- pull the spacer
out to the different spacings (1", 1 1/8", 1 1/4", etc) and make marks on
the spacer to indicate where it is at each spacing. Beats holding it aginst
a ruler to figure it out every time.
There's also the old "underwear" trick -- take the band from a pair of
underwear, mark 1" spacings on it, then stretch it to whatever spacing is
desired. I've never used this since I had a fan spacer but have heard of
others doing so. Would be by far the cheapest!
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~280 hrs)
Portland, OR
www.vanshomewing.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Instrument Holes |
---I'm looking at Aircraft Spruce page 359 instrument templates. The one
for an altimeter (bottom right corner) shows the mounting holes to be
0.1695
Can I make these 3/16?
No. 3/16 is too big anyway. The largest you should ever go is #8.
Otherwise the mounting hole will be too close to the instrument hole.
If you don't have your altimeter yet, I wouldn't do it. I think my altimer
has #8 screws in it.
---My Navaid is a few years old. The mounting holes in the case are very
small. Are these pilot holes I am to upsize to 3/16?
No. I think these are #6's They should have nuts on the back of it.
----Are most toggle switches 1/2" or can you make them a little smaller to
be snugger?
Depends on the toggle. You don't need to go smaller, because you tighten it
to the panel. Even if you had a little slop in the hole, you could still
get it tight.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pullin' G's.. A little Help Please |
> >Whenever I pull more than a couple of G's, my headset starts to slide off
> >my
> >head. This is probably aggravated by my tendancy to look "up" into a
turn
> >or
> >loop, which makes my headset to want to slide off backwards - down the
back
> >of my neck... This is distracting at best.
> >
> >How do the "real" acro pilots out there in RV-land prevent this?
Probably depends on what headsets you have. My Peltors are easy to adjust
the tension -- just bend the wire headband and make them clamp on tighter. I
actually have them pretty loose since I don't like too much pressure, but
the last time I did a Cuban eight they fell off into the baggage compartment
when I tipped my head back to find the ground on the way over the top. Good
test of one's ability to ignore distractions at critical times! :-)
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~280 hrs)
Portland, OR
www.vanshomewing.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
To be legal you need a seat belt and shoulder harness. You will not find
equipment from a wrecking yard which will attach to the longerons as required
for strength.
T.T.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vincent S. Himsl" <vhimsl(at)turbonet.com> |
| Subject: | do you prime inside fuse sides? |
Question:
What do you guys think of leaving the inside of the fuse skins bare to save
weight?
My Reply:
1. The skins are already alodined. I left the plastic on the sides except
for where the bulkheads and stringers are. Before mounting, I primed the
rivet lines and then removed the plastic.
2. If the particular piece is already corrosion proofed, i.e. alodined, I
only spray it with NAPA 7220 self etching primer, (which others on list say
is Sherwin Williams spelled NAPA)but only if I have scuffed it up pretty bad
in the construction process and where it is specifically recommended.
3. If the piece is non alodined aluminum, I alodine and then prime.
I am getting tired of this project and I want to get back in the air. Paint
is really heavy, takes a lot of time and is in my opinion not necessary
except as above or where VAN's specifically tells me to do it. You can
always paint it later when you invert the canoe, which I hope to do in about
a couple of weeks.
Regards
Vince Himsl
RV8 Fuselage
Moscow, ID USA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stucklen, Frederic IFC" <stuckle(at)ifc.utc.com> |
| Subject: | Pitot heat controller |
PWM creates noise ONLY when the signal edge rise/fall times are to sharp.
That's another advantage of MOSFET technologies, one can easily slow them
down... I've got a simple home made 15A panel dimmer that switches with no
radio noise what-so-ever....
Fred Stucklen
N925RV (1850 hrs/8 Yrs)
E. Windsor, CT 06088
WK Email: stuckle(at)ifc.utc.com
Hm/Travel Email: wstucklen1(at)juno.com
From: ET - #PU <psi(at)hillweb.com>
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Pitot heat controller
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: ET - #PU
PWM could create a lot of noise. Need to have linear regulator or have
good shielding all way around. Also most noise will come via power lines,
so need to have good filtration on power line as well.
With current drainage on most HPT around 10A and more it is hell a
lot of capacitors and inductors.... The simplest way I think, to have
mechanical
thermo-relay similar to hot-iron or coffee-maker. But for some reason,
HPT manufacturing company do not do that. Why?
Vlad
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Rabaut" <crabaut(at)coalinga.com> |
| Subject: | Inadvertent flying in clouds(long) |
Geeez That's easy... he was watchin' the mouse!
> A Hawk has about 10 times better vision than you, can you spot a mouse in
> the grass from 300 feet?
> snip
>
> George McNutt
> Langley, B.C.
>
>
> Hey George,
>
> If a hawk has such good vision, how did one end up in the cockpit with me
(after entering thru the front windshield)????? ;-)
>
> Laird
> RV-6 (Hawk Killer)
> SoCal
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: heat muff confusion |
| From: | "Robert Dickson" <bubba(at)coastalnet.com> |
and to absolutely lay this to rest, read my reply directly from Mr.
Vetterman himself:
I am answering your questions regarding heat muffs. The muff you received
with your exhaust is a Robbins, which is the best. I personally packed this
muff with the exhaust. What makes it better. They are trouble free and are
of the best quality,ie stainless steel end plates and look at the welding on
the inlet and outlets.regarding any other questions please feel free to call
me at any time. Larry at Vetterman Exhaust.
Robert Dickson
RV-6A proud owner of a Robbins heat muff
----------
>From: Garry LeGare <"versadek"@earthlink.net>
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: heat muff confusion
>Date: Mon, Oct 1, 2001, 6:58 PM
>
>
> Robert and others, whom are commenting on this issue.
> Let me clarify my earlier post. The heat muffs supplied with the Vetterman
> System are Robbins Wings heat muffs. Larry started supplying them as part of
> his system about a year ago. Before this if you ordered a heat muff from Larry
> it was also a Robbins Wings muff. He has never supplied any other brand of
heat
> muff. Larry is the one who got Rick started in the business and he
occasionally
> works for Larry, when Larry gets swamped. To quote Larry," Rick welds better
> than I do".
> Garry " Casper"
>
> Robert Dickson wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> The heat muff that came with your Larry Vetterman exhaust system is made by
>> him and is supplied with the exhaust systems.
>> The Robbins heat muff is different manufacturer.
>>
>>
>> Yes these are the Robbins Muffs. I've got two in parallel and don't have too
>> much heat. If you want to stay warm put on the aileron tube boots as
>> detailed
>> on Sam Bs site and the dual muffs . Also look for other sources for air
>> leaks
>> and seal them as well.
>>
>> ----------------------------------
>>
>> wow! I don't know what to think! I believe it's time to Call Van's. On the
>> other hand, if the muff I have was made/supplied by Mr. Vetterman, it's got
>> to fit. If everything on an RV was as easy to fit as his exhaust, I'd be
>> flying by now.
>>
>> Robert Dickson
>> RV-6A thinkin' about muffs ;-)
>>
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
This is an airplane. Probably $40,000 at least. Buy some aircraft
seatbelts. $150 from Van's shouldn't set you back much if you are spending
this much on an airplane. Or if you really want slick seatbelts, spend $300
(still a bargain, IMHO) on some hooker harnesses.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tedd McHenry" <tedd(at)vansairforce.org>
Subject: Re: RV6-List: seat belts
--> RV6-List message posted by: "Tedd McHenry"
>--> RV6-List message posted by: MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com
>
>Some advice.....stay away from the salvage yards "don't go there" stay
away.
>
Why?
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr(at)petroblend.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pullin' G's.. A little Help Please |
Most "real" acro types wear a cloth helmet. you can get them for Dave
Clarks and the copies at Flight Suits Inc. for $34.
http://www.flightsuits.com/open_cloth.html
Some folks fashion a velcro strap, but the cloth helmet is a better choice.
Doug Rozendaal
> >
> >
> > Whenever I pull more than a couple of G's, my headset starts
> > to slide off my
> > head. This is probably aggravated by my tendancy to look
> > "up" into a turn or
> > loop, which makes my headset to want to slide off backwards -
> > down the back
> > of my neck... This is distracting at best.
> >
> > How do the "real" acro pilots out there in RV-land prevent this?
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: do you prime inside fuse sides? |
Your skins came alodined????
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Vincent S. Himsl" <vhimsl(at)turbonet.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: do you prime inside fuse sides?
Question:
What do you guys think of leaving the inside of the fuse skins bare to save
weight?
My Reply:
1. The skins are already alodined. I left the plastic on the sides except
for where the bulkheads and stringers are. Before mounting, I primed the
rivet lines and then removed the plastic.
2. If the particular piece is already corrosion proofed, i.e. alodined, I
only spray it with NAPA 7220 self etching primer, (which others on list say
is Sherwin Williams spelled NAPA)but only if I have scuffed it up pretty bad
in the construction process and where it is specifically recommended.
3. If the piece is non alodined aluminum, I alodine and then prime.
I am getting tired of this project and I want to get back in the air. Paint
is really heavy, takes a lot of time and is in my opinion not necessary
except as above or where VAN's specifically tells me to do it. You can
always paint it later when you invert the canoe, which I hope to do in about
a couple of weeks.
Regards
Vince Himsl
RV8 Fuselage
Moscow, ID USA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Helms" <jhelms(at)i1.net> |
Brian,
Relax, no change in the VanGuard Program's rates yet or in the foreseeable
future.
Yes, all insurance (boats, homes, cars, business, aviation) is likely to
increase slightly due to the disaster (or whatever the politically correct
term for Sept. 11th is). This is due to the re-insurance companies getting
hit so hard.
Yes, I know that someone will respond that this is Bullsh*t. But, before
you do that. Take a step back and remember how insurance works.
Everyone who wants it puts money into a pot. People who injure someone, or
their plane (boat, house, etc) are paid out of that pot. When 50 BILLION $
(according to some estimates) comes out of the pot, more has to go in to
make up for that.
(Anticipating someones irate flame.) I know you don't even own a building,
or a boat so why should you pay? Each domestic insurance carrier re-insures
to protect itself. This means that they (sort of) buy insurance. The
domestic insurance company promises to pay small physical damage claims (for
example all aircraft damage claims up to $300,000) and small liability
claims (perhaps up to claims of $500,000). Above that they ask a
reinsurance company to pay, and they pay them for that. This spreads the
risk.
The reason that ALL types of insurance will be affected (IMHO) is that the
re-insurance companies reinsure lots of different stuff. And their rates
going up is most of what is going to incease premiums.
John "JT" Helms
Branch Manager
NationAir Pleasure and Business Branch
(extremely angry and frustrated pilot and former soldier)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: insurance
>
>Hi folks,
>
>My insurance is up at the end of this month and my broker (skysmith) has
>been getting new quotes from the insurance carriers...and the one
>they've gotten so far from my current carrier (AIG) is almost $400
>higher! Since I have 225 hours in my bird this year it should have went
>down--not up. Scott said that this is fallout from the WTC disaster,
>according to what the carriers are telling him; and the quotes he's been
>getting have been generally higher from the insurance companies since
>Sept. 11. He did ask them to requote it. Is anyone else out there
>experiencing this?
>
>This is complete bullshit. Then it will be your car insurance, your
>homeowners, etc. And I know this is a very small thing given the
>greater scope of what's happening in the world right now, but I've come
>to the realization that we all will be paying for the damage. Anyone
>know how to lay a claim on the now-frozen assets of islamic terrorist
>groups?
>
>Bob Japundza
>RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying
Oh good freakin' grief. Why am I not surprised. I'm due for renewal with
Nationair in December and will let ya'll know how it goes. I'll have
probably 280 hours on the RV by then. My rate went down about $200 for last
year's renewal. I now fully expect it will go back up that amount and maybe
more. I could just scream. Gotta get back to work on my napalm racks and
looooong range tanks. Taliban gonna hafta pay...in a BIG way.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Louis I. Willig" <larywil(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pullin' G's.. A little Help Please |
Kyle,
I've been a starter at the Pennsylvania Championships ( IAC Chapter 58) for
the past 5 years and have seen a lot of different solutions to the the
problem you are having. Many of the unlimited competitors use helmets with
headsets in them. But the most prevalent solution is the old fashioned
headset cap. A previous post mentioned this item. It looks like an old
fashioned snoopy hat ('cause that's what it is) with holes cut out and
straps sewn in to fit aroud your headset. These are made of a soft leather,
or more ofter, a lightweight duck cloth.A newer model of this is made of a
nylon fishnet material which seems to be much cooler.(It looks like your
wearing a male bikini jockstrap on your head.... so watch out for the
women). HOWEVER, many of the competitors (especially in the lower
categories) use Velcro straps. Essentially, they apply round or square
patches of the stiff (hook) Velcro to their earpieces, and use a strap of
the soft (loop) Velcro to run from one earpiece to under-the-chin, and back
to the other earpiece. This is really a simple, cheap, and effective way to
solve your problem. Now, here is one more hint: Some of the competitors have
found that the Velcro strap still allows the headset to slide backwards. So
they place a patch of velcro on the top of a baseball cap. They then place a
strip of opposite Velcro to the underneath of the earcup crossbar. This
keeps the headset from sliding back.
Everyone's head and comfort factor vary, so have fun trying different
solutions and post your results to the list.
Louis
Louis I. Willig
Penn Valley, PA
RV-4, IO-360, C/S 160 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
| Subject: | FW: Rocket-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 10/01/01 |
From: "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu>
Subject: Rocket-List: parts for sale
--> Rocket-List message posted by: "Frazier, Vincent A"
Listers,
Les Featherston has the following items for sale. Don't contact me, I'm
just posting them as a favor.
Jon Johansen, 8.5 gallons each, RV style wingtip tanks, $1400
stock RV-4 wingtips, 10% off of Van's price... (neither one of us knew what
they cost!) Call him.
Harmon Rocket II cowling, $550
Contact Les Featherston about selling those legs (he's the owner) at
417-466-4663
Thanks,
Vince Frazier
Harmon Rocket II ... the fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."
http://www.usi.edu/science/chemistry/vfrazier/page1.html
****************************************************************************
*
Oops, I should've snipped out the part about "the legs". I'm the one who
has a set of Harmon gear legs to sell, not Les. And I forgot to put " do
not archive ". It was just one of those days.
Sorry if this caused any confusion for Les.
Vince
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stan Blanton" <stanb(at)door.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Toggle Switch Holes |
> snip
>
> When testing them in a 1/2 inch hole they seem a little sloppy. Will
> this be OK after paint or should they be 7/16?
>
>
As I recall the diameter is most likely 15/32".
Stan Blanton
RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stan Blanton" <stanb(at)door.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Instrument Holes |
> snip
> ---I'm looking at Aircraft Spruce page 359 instrument templates. The one
> for an altimeter (bottom right corner) shows the mounting holes to be
> 0.1695
> Can I make these 3/16?
>
>
Almost all the standard instruments use #6 screws.
Stan Blanton
RV-6
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
| From: | "Tedd McHenry" <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
>--> RV6-List message posted by: "Thomas Mosher"
>
>1. Belts usually exposed to weather
>2. condition of belts unknown
>3. possibility of being exposed to excessive stress - did you know that it
>is recommended that you replace your car's seatbelts after an accident? They
>are usually stretched out from restraining you in the crash?
>4. age of belts unknown
>5. you going to trust something you got on the cheap to restrain you in an
>accident?
Right, but any intelligent person knows those things. So I take it you're
saying there's nothing wrong with buying from a wrecker, assuming you can
satisfactorily answer those questions? That takes us back to my original
question, "Why a blanket statement against buying from a wrecker?"
Tedd
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
| From: | "Tedd McHenry" <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
>--> RV6-List message posted by: "Paul Besing"
>
>This is an airplane. Probably $40,000 at least. Buy some aircraft
>seatbelts. $150 from Van's shouldn't set you back much if you are spending
>this much on an airplane. Or if you really want slick seatbelts, spend $300
>(still a bargain, IMHO) on some hooker harnesses.
Perhaps I should clarify. I'm not necessarily promoting the idea of buying
seat belts from an auto wrecker. Personally, I don't want automotive-style
inertia-reel seat belts (although nothing in the discussion so far has said
we're not talking about buying a set of brand-new four- or five-point
harnesses that were in the trunk of a wrecked car, still in their origianl
package). The blanket statement that was made was, "stay away from the
salvage yards `don't go there' stay away." That's quite an emphatic and
all-encompassing statement, which presumably covers aircraft salvage yards
as well. In fact, looking at the statement again it appears that it might
have meant aircraft salvage yards specifically. So, again, why?
Tedd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
I have been able to (somewhat) answer my own question with a little more
research. There is information in the Aircraft Spruce catalog, although I
cannot know for certain how accurate it is, on the net weight of some of the
aircraft tires they sell. Unfortunately, it is an incomplete list.
Here is what I have found so far: the Michelin Air retreads from Desser weigh
6 lbs 3 oz each. (6.2 lbs in decimal). This weight was determined on my
electronic infant scales at work, so I believe it.
According to the AC Spruce 1998 catalog, the 4 ply rated 5.00x5 tires have
the following weight:
Goodyear Flight Custom... 4.8 lbs.
Flight Special... 4.1 lbs.
McCreary Air Trac... 4.4 lbs.
Air Hawk... 3.8 lbs.
I stand to save anywhere from 2.8 to 4.8 lbs of empty aircraft weight just by
selecting from these few tire models for which the catalog lists a weight
figure. Now I need to decide whether the weight savings is worth the penalty
of possibly shorter tire life (but on turf this is less of an issue) and the
differential price of the tires plus the cost of returning the retreads to
Desser. I made so many decisions while building (thinner washers, extra
lightening holes, thinner paint application, etc) and since then (Odyssey
battery and no battery box to shed 10.75 lbs vs the Concorde) that I hate to
give up hard-won ground like this, but everything is a trade-off. Shoot, the
weight we're talking about here is equivalent 1/2 to one gallon of fuel taken
or left behind, but once installed, it becomes a permanent part of the basic
empty weight, and I hate that!
I'd welcome advice and thoughts, but I am all but determined to let the
weight be the deciding factor.
-Bill B
RV-6A flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Murphy, Richard James (Rick)" <rjmurphy1(at)lucent.com> |
| Subject: | Pullin' G's.. A little Help Please |
Dave Clark makes a canvas flying helmet (ala WWII type) that will mount your
headset and keep it afixed to your swivel. RJM
> ----------
> From: Gary A. Sobek[SMTP:rv6flier(at)yahoo.com]
> Reply To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Sent: Monday, October 01, 2001 8:35 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Pullin' G's.. A little Help Please
>
>
> -- KBoatri144(at)aol.com wrote:
> >
> >
> > Whenever I pull more than a couple of G's, my headset starts to slide
> > off my
> > head. This is probably aggravated by my tendancy to look "up" into a
> > turn or
> > loop, which makes my headset to want to slide off backwards - down
> > the back
> > of my neck... This is distracting at best.
> >
> > How do the "real" acro pilots out there in RV-land prevent this?
> >
> > Kyle Boatright
> > 0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
> > Kennesaw, GA
> > http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
>
> Kyle:
>
> I pull 4G on a regular basis. My LightSpeed XL-25 stay on without a
> problem. I always lock my head straight. Every time I turn my head or
> look up, I end up pulling a neck muscle and hurt for 3 or 4 days.
>
> The real Acro guys will have some kind of strap to hold them on for
> negative Gs.
>
>
> ====
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> 944.5 Flying Hours So. CA, USA
> http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
>
> http://phone.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "EXT-Richard, Emmanuelle J" <emmanuelle.j.richard(at)boeing.com> |
| Subject: | Looking for new job |
Guys,
I'm one of the 30 000 layoffs annonced by Boeing. Youngest one (28) in the
group gets to go first, regardless of performance. I have been handling
retrofit activities for commercial airplanes propulsion systems lately.
What I really want to get into is flight test - first as an engineer, and
then as a pilot. Of course, considered the situation, you can't be too
picky - I have a bachelor in math, a masters in aeronautical engineering and
commercial multi IFR pilot ratings, did some electrical/avionics design on
the BBJ and other jobs. Anybody who's company is looking for a
pilot-engineer? I will send my resume to serious inquiries.
On the bright side, my RV4 is going for DAR inspection on thursday. We're
under the Seattle Class B - as far as I know there is still no VFR
authorized. Has anybody in the same situation had authorization from the
tower to do a flight test above their airport? Could that be considered a
'post-maintenance' flight?
Emmanuelle J. Richard
Retrofit Engineer
Propulsion - 747/767/777
Tel (425) 294 4635
Fax (425) 266 5028 M/C 04-AF
Email emmanuelle.j.richard(at)boeing.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
>Brian,
>
>Relax, no change in the VanGuard Program's rates yet or in the foreseeable
>future.
JT,
Just to make sure I'm understood, I'm not blaming anyone in the insurance
biz. I'm am, however, totally p*ssed at the scumbags who decided to rock
the entire world just because they hate their own lowly existences. I've
had nothing but great service from Nationair and I recommend my flying
friends to you often. In fact, a Mooney owner was referred to you last
week.
Let's all hope we can weather the storm financially, emotionally and
aeronautically. The first item and the last item are closely related,
naturally.
Best of luck to you and all of us in dealing with this trauma,
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Looking for new job |
Since you are considered the "Manufacture" of your aircraft by the FAA, it
would appear, according to the notams that you are legally authorized to
conduct Post Maintenance Flight checks. Also, if you have a Repairman's
certificate, you are probably on even safter legal ground in doing this.
If this ban goes on much longer, my aircraft will make some "Maintenance
test flights". But, best is to talk to your local Fed types and explain
what you intend to do. But, be aware, the controller types are heavily over
loaded by the increase in VFR flight plans and descrete beacon code
requirements and may not be as cooperative as they usually are. I have
heard that several pilots have received the dreaded "Call the tower"
directive because they were doing "Business as Usual" and things are not as
"usual".
Perhaps some of our FED brethen on the list could comment.
Ed Anderson
Matthews, NC
>
> Guys,
> I'm one of the 30 000 layoffs annonced by Boeing. Youngest one (28) in
the
> group gets to go first, regardless of performance. I have been handling
> retrofit activities for commercial airplanes propulsion systems lately.
> What I really want to get into is flight test - first as an engineer, and
> then as a pilot. Of course, considered the situation, you can't be too
> picky - I have a bachelor in math, a masters in aeronautical engineering
and
> commercial multi IFR pilot ratings, did some electrical/avionics design on
> the BBJ and other jobs. Anybody who's company is looking for a
> pilot-engineer? I will send my resume to serious inquiries.
>
> On the bright side, my RV4 is going for DAR inspection on thursday. We're
> under the Seattle Class B - as far as I know there is still no VFR
> authorized. Has anybody in the same situation had authorization from the
> tower to do a flight test above their airport? Could that be considered a
> 'post-maintenance' flight?
>
> Emmanuelle J. Richard
> Retrofit Engineer
> Propulsion - 747/767/777
> Tel (425) 294 4635
> Fax (425) 266 5028 M/C 04-AF
> Email emmanuelle.j.richard(at)boeing.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
Bill,
I admire your weight conservation but at a conservative fuel burn of 8
gallons per hour,
your going to burn 1 gallon (6lbs) of fuel off in 7.5 minutes. Roughly your
taxi and
climb out.
Secondly, lay off those 2 bean burrito lunches and lose the weight of the
tires ;
)
Ed Cole
RV6A N2169D Flying
RV6A N648RV finishing
> -----Original Message-----
> From: SportAV8R(at)aol.com [SMTP:SportAV8R(at)aol.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2001 7:20 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: tire weight
>
>
> I have been able to (somewhat) answer my own question with a little more
> research. There is information in the Aircraft Spruce catalog, although I
>
> cannot know for certain how accurate it is, on the net weight of some of
> the
> aircraft tires they sell. Unfortunately, it is an incomplete list.
>
> Here is what I have found so far: the Michelin Air retreads from Desser
> weigh
> 6 lbs 3 oz each. (6.2 lbs in decimal). This weight was determined on my
> electronic infant scales at work, so I believe it.
>
> According to the AC Spruce 1998 catalog, the 4 ply rated 5.00x5 tires have
>
> the following weight:
>
> Goodyear Flight Custom... 4.8 lbs.
> Flight Special... 4.1 lbs.
>
> McCreary Air Trac... 4.4 lbs.
> Air Hawk... 3.8 lbs.
>
> I stand to save anywhere from 2.8 to 4.8 lbs of empty aircraft weight just
> by
> selecting from these few tire models for which the catalog lists a weight
> figure. Now I need to decide whether the weight savings is worth the
> penalty
> of possibly shorter tire life (but on turf this is less of an issue) and
> the
> differential price of the tires plus the cost of returning the retreads to
>
> Desser. I made so many decisions while building (thinner washers, extra
> lightening holes, thinner paint application, etc) and since then (Odyssey
> battery and no battery box to shed 10.75 lbs vs the Concorde) that I hate
> to
> give up hard-won ground like this, but everything is a trade-off. Shoot,
> the
> weight we're talking about here is equivalent 1/2 to one gallon of fuel
> taken
> or left behind, but once installed, it becomes a permanent part of the
> basic
> empty weight, and I hate that!
>
> I'd welcome advice and thoughts, but I am all but determined to let the
> weight be the deciding factor.
>
> -Bill B
> RV-6A flying
>
>
>
>
>
>
Maxim Home Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com
Products Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
New Products:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
Datasheets:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
The information contained in this message is confidential
and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
Randy,
Speaking of the next iteration. Have you been able to finish the gear leg
fairings yet??
>From: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: ,
>Subject: RV-List: Re: EFIS-D10
>Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2001 14:54:58 -0700
>
>
> > A $2000 EFIS display with mega features. Wow does this look interesting.
> > Available soon. What do you guys think?
> > http://www.dynondevelopment.com/
> > Norman Hunger
>
>Anyone heard the latest on WHEN this thing will be available? This is just
>what I'm looking for in the next iteration of my panel.
>
>Randy Lervold
>www.rv-8.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pullin' G's.. A little Help Please |
In a message dated 10/1/01 3:51:13 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
KBoatri144(at)aol.com writes:
>
>
>
> Whenever I pull more than a couple of G's, my headset starts to slide off
> my
> head. This is probably aggravated by my tendancy to look "up" into a turn
> or
> loop, which makes my headset to want to slide off backwards - down the back
> of my neck... This is distracting at best.
>
> How do the "real" acro pilots out there in RV-land prevent this?
>
>
7-10" of duct tape works well
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
In a message dated 10/1/01 9:16:24 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
tedd(at)vansairforce.org writes:
> --> RV6-List message posted by: "Tedd McHenry"
>
> >--> RV6-List message posted by: MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com
> >
> >Some advice.....stay away from the salvage yards "don't go there" stay
> away.
> >
>
> Why?
>
> Tedd McHenry
> Surrey, BC
>
>
>
Wrecked car parts do not belong on aircraft.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
In a message dated 10/2/01 7:03:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
tedd(at)vansairforce.org writes:
> >This is an airplane. Probably $40,000 at least. Buy some aircraft
> >seatbelts. $150 from Van's shouldn't set you back much if you are spending
> >this much on an airplane. Or if you really want slick seatbelts, spend
> $300
> >(still a bargain, IMHO) on some hooker harnesses.
>
> Perhaps I should clarify. I'm not necessarily promoting the idea of buying
> seat belts from an auto wrecker. Personally, I don't want automotive-style
> inertia-reel seat belts (although nothing in the discussion so far has said
> we're not talking about buying a set of brand-new four- or five-point
> harnesses that were in the trunk of a wrecked car, still in their origianl
> package). The blanket statement that was made was, "stay away from the
> salvage yards `don't go there' stay away." That's quite an emphatic and
> all-encompassing statement, which presumably covers aircraft salvage yards
> as well. In fact, looking at the statement again it appears that it might
> have meant aircraft salvage yards specifically. So, again, why?
>
> Tedd
>
>
>
Tedd let me cairify my statement; "stay away from the salvage yards `don't
go there' stay away" I was meaning "Car salvage" not aircraft salvage. Hell I
bought a couple of throttle knobs from an aircraft salvage yard for my plane.
I just have a hard time imagining that a builder that would spend the time &
money for tools, airframe & engine would try to save a buck or two buying
seat belts and other used or wrecked car parts for his plane. Maybe an
alternator core but that is about it. But the wonderful thing about building
an experimental is you can build, buy, and use what ever you want. I choose
to stay with all quality aircraft parts, but that's just me.
Tim Barnes
N39TB
RV-4
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Stolen Instuments |
I just got back from vacation to find my newly overhauled electric RC Allen
DG and electric BF Goodrich Artificial Horizon and my Rocky Mountain
Micro-encoder stolen. They didn't take any of the paperwork so I still have
the yellow tags. Let me know if you see these items on the various internet
auctions or elsewhere.
RC Allen Electric Directional Gyro P/N RCAA15AK-2 S/N 96B0095
BF Goodrich Electric Attitude Horizon P/N 5040033943 S/N 25119
I don't have the serial number for the miroencoder here but I will post
later.
These are still in the shrink wrap that Gyro House uses after overhaul.
Ross Mickey
RV6-A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Rudder control horn -- bogus instructions |
This message is just to bitch about how bad Van's instructions were for the
RV-7 rudder skeleton construction. I think there's a good chance I missed
something simple, but here goes.
Obviously in the RV-7, the spar and reinforcement plates come pre-drilled.
So this should be trivial. But the lower rib flange does not. Here's my
gripe.
The instructions say to put a 3/8" bolt through the control horn and the
spar, leaving it finger tight. Then, get this...it says to just "slide" the
rib flange under there and drill. What the #@*(&?! Whatever. How are you
supposed to slide the flange in there when a 3/8" bolt is blocking the way?
Duh.
Before you answer, here's what I did...whether it's wrong or not, it worked.
First, I clecoed the upper row of 3 holes of the reinforcement plate to the
spar. I put the bolt through the plate, spar, and horn, and tightened
it...tight, not finger tight, so that the horn wouldn't rotate on it. Since
the horn didn't come pre-drilled, there was no way to cleco it. Just clamps
and the bolt. I then drilled the 1/8" rivet holes through the control horn
using the plate as a template, clecoing as I went. Once that was done, I
disassembled all of this.
I drew a centerline along the rib flange and clamped it to the spar, as if
none of the other components would go there. I drilled the 4 holes through
those parts (two outer rivet holes plus two holes where the nut plate goes).
While I was at it, I "traced" the outline of the 3/8" hole onto the rib
flange.
Now, 20-20 hindsight...I figure I could have just trimmed away enough
material from the rib flange where the bolt goes so that it *could* have
slid under the control horn and around that bolt hole. That would have
alleviated all these steps. But at this point I had gone so far to get the
bolt hole in the flange, etc. So I drilled out the center of the 3/8" hole
on the rib and used a unibit to step it out to just over 3/8".
Ok...then there's the issue of the .032" spacer. The instructions don't say
diddly about it. Not that it was difficult to figure it out, but I was a
little frustrated with all this ambiguity in one spot.
Anyway, that's my deal. I got through it no problem, but it was a little
confusing at first. Ok, now I'm open for slapping around. Feel free to
tell me there's something completely obvious that I missed. 8
)
)_( Dan
dan(at)rvproject.com
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
I believe there is an issue with automotive belts being difficult to release
when a person is hanging from them. I say believe because, I know there was
an issue with older cars. As a ex Paramedic, We almost always had to cut the
belts to extract people when inverted. The newer auto belts may have been
changed. I don't know.
Just like everyone else who posts to this list, I have an opinion. By the
best quality safety equipment you can afford, even if it means doing without
the latest dazzling piece of electronics.
Garry "Casper" RV6, Scroth quick release 5 point belts and shoulder harness.
MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com wrote:
> --> RV6-List message posted by: MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com
>
> In a message dated 10/1/01 9:16:24 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
> tedd(at)vansairforce.org writes:
>
> > --> RV6-List message posted by: "Tedd McHenry"
> >
> > >--> RV6-List message posted by: MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com
> > >
> > >Some advice.....stay away from the salvage yards "don't go there" stay
> > away.
> > >
> >
> > Why?
> >
> > Tedd McHenry
> > Surrey, BC
> >
> >
> >
>
> Wrecked car parts do not belong on aircraft.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Looking for new job |
I find out things faster by checking with AOPA and AERO-NEWS websites than I
do through our own channels so I don't have any helpful comments either.
Mike Robertson
DAS FED
RV-8A
>From: "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Looking for new job
>Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2001 11:26:21 -0400
>
>
> Since you are considered the "Manufacture" of your aircraft by the FAA,
>it
>would appear, according to the notams that you are legally authorized to
>conduct Post Maintenance Flight checks. Also, if you have a Repairman's
>certificate, you are probably on even safter legal ground in doing this.
>If this ban goes on much longer, my aircraft will make some "Maintenance
>test flights". But, best is to talk to your local Fed types and explain
>what you intend to do. But, be aware, the controller types are heavily
>over
>loaded by the increase in VFR flight plans and descrete beacon code
>requirements and may not be as cooperative as they usually are. I have
>heard that several pilots have received the dreaded "Call the tower"
>directive because they were doing "Business as Usual" and things are not as
>"usual".
>
>Perhaps some of our FED brethen on the list could comment.
>
>Ed Anderson
>Matthews, NC
>
>
>
> >
> > Guys,
> > I'm one of the 30 000 layoffs annonced by Boeing. Youngest one (28) in
>the
> > group gets to go first, regardless of performance. I have been handling
> > retrofit activities for commercial airplanes propulsion systems lately.
> > What I really want to get into is flight test - first as an engineer,
>and
> > then as a pilot. Of course, considered the situation, you can't be too
> > picky - I have a bachelor in math, a masters in aeronautical engineering
>and
> > commercial multi IFR pilot ratings, did some electrical/avionics design
>on
> > the BBJ and other jobs. Anybody who's company is looking for a
> > pilot-engineer? I will send my resume to serious inquiries.
> >
> > On the bright side, my RV4 is going for DAR inspection on thursday.
>We're
> > under the Seattle Class B - as far as I know there is still no VFR
> > authorized. Has anybody in the same situation had authorization from
>the
> > tower to do a flight test above their airport? Could that be considered
>a
> > 'post-maintenance' flight?
> >
> > Emmanuelle J. Richard
> > Retrofit Engineer
> > Propulsion - 747/767/777
> > Tel (425) 294 4635
> > Fax (425) 266 5028 M/C 04-AF
> > Email emmanuelle.j.richard(at)boeing.com
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bryan Jones" <rv_8pilot(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Looking for new job - air marshall?! |
You might consider the new Federal Air Marshal openings. I know it's
totally out of your field, but it might be interesting for a year or two,
then you could drop back into aviation when things settle down, if you
wanted. Here's the job description. The only serious downside would be
traveling several weeks at a time.
http://jobforms.faa.gov/CIVIL_AVIATION_SECURITY.htm
Bryan Jones -8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scot Stambaugh <sstambaugh(at)qualcomm.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pullin' G's.. A little Help Please |
I went flying with Air Combat USA in Fullerton about a month ago and they
used the cloth helmet things you describe below. They worked very well at
5 G's in an Extra 300L. Very comfortable but a bit dorky looking. The
leather ones would probably look better but would most likely be a bit warm
on a sunny day.
scot
>
>
> >
> >
> >Whenever I pull more than a couple of G's, my headset starts to slide off
> >my
> >head. This is probably aggravated by my tendancy to look "up" into a turn
> >or
> >loop, which makes my headset to want to slide off backwards - down the back
> >of my neck... This is distracting at best.
> >
> >How do the "real" acro pilots out there in RV-land prevent this?
> >
> >Kyle Boatright
> >0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
>
>Duct tape. :)
>
>Ok, maybe not. But, the acro nuts I hang with often use cloth helmets, which
>integrate the headset into a cloth headcover with a chinstrap. You'll look
>like Snoopy, but it's very effective. I don't use one, and just set my
>headset for a firm fit, so it won't go anywhere. I pull up to 4G and it
>hasn't caused any problems. It might just have to do with the type of
>headset you have, and the shape of your noggin. I've seen Patty Wagstaff
>with a regular (Bose, I think) headset, with a chinstrap attached to the
>earcups or the frame in some manner. Seems to keep it in place even with
>all that hair flyin' all over the blessed place.
>
>Brian Denk
>RV8 N94BD
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bryan Jones" <rv_8pilot(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Fwd: seat belts, salvage parts |
I've found quite a few good deals at aircraft salvage operations
(EnParts - engine parts, Lancaster, TX, Air Salvage of Dallas, Gulf
Central Aviation, LaPorte, local A&P left overs, to name a few). A
blanket statement of staying away from these places is OK if you
have a lot of money to throw at your airplane project. Otherwise,
just turn on your brain and look around for some bargains,
understanding that you have to make the final judgement on
installing a used part in your plane.
I've bought parts for my plane at auto supply stores. I can also imagine a
situation where I'd consider a part from an auto salvage yard (voltage
regulator, alternator, battery cables, or whatever).
As for a plane in an aircraft salvage yard having experienced severe impact
forces, I'd bet half or less ended their life in this maner. Wind damage,
flip-overs on off-field landings, abandoned/derelict, etc. accounts for a
lot of the planes/parts you'll find there.
my 2 cents
Bryan Jones -8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
Has anybody financed their project? If so, how and through whom?
)_( Dan
dan(at)rvproject.com
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Reeves, Doug" <Douglas.Reeves(at)archongroup.com> |
Dan, I can recommend http://www.airloans.com/
Regards,
Doug Reeves
-----Original Message-----
From: Dan Checkoway [mailto:dan(at)rvproject.com]
Subject: RV-List: financing
Has anybody financed their project? If so, how and through whom?
)_( Dan
dan(at)rvproject.com
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Scot Stambaugh <sstambaugh(at)qualcomm.com> |
Is there a web site or a place to see some pictures of the Robbins Muff?
scot
F1 Rocket #19
>
>well, to finish up this thread, I just spent some time with this muff that
>came with the vetterman exhaust and this is what I've come up with:
>- it doesn't have a hinge on the side
>- it does have 2 stainless rods that extend through asymmetrical ends and
>attach with screws
>- the instructions indicate that there is a 9" model for the left side, but
>that I got an 8" model for the right side
>- the instructions are very specific as to the placement of the muff in
>relation to the ball joint and rotation to clear the cowl
>
>if this isn't the Robbins muff it sure sounds just like it. I think I'll
>keep it. Thanks to everyone who replied.
>
>Robert Dickson
>RV-6A QB, handlin' muffs in Fayette-stan
>
>----------
> >From: "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com>
> >To:
> >Subject: Re: RV-List: heat muffs
> >Date: Mon, Oct 1, 2001, 3:03 PM
> >
>
> >
> > Van's heat muffs won't fit. They are too long to fit on the straight
> > portion of the pipe. They even know this. I had one and called them
> up and
> > said, "hey I got this heat muff," and they interrupted me and said, "it
> > doesn't fit" . Why they sell a product that doesn't fit is beyond me,
> > especially when they know it doesn't fit.
> >
> > Send it back, get credit, and order the Robbins muff. It is far
> superior in
> > quality and IT FITS!!
> >
> > The way you can tell, is the Van's muff is hinged on one side. The Robbins
> > muff has screws that come out of the ends.
> >
> > Paul Besing
> > RV-6A N197AB Arizona
> > http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
> > Flying
> > Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
> > http://www.kitlog.com
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Robert Dickson" <bubba(at)coastalnet.com>
> > To: "rv list"
> > Subject: RV-List: heat muffs
> >
> >
> >
> > I received my exhaust system for my O-360 a few months ago from Vans. It
> > includes a heat muff. My questions are: Is this the famous Robbins heat
> > muff? How would I know? Is there any problem with this heat muff, or what
> > makes a Robbins muff better? The archive indicates that Van's muff was
> > inferior and I'm wondering if this is different now that they're including
> > the muff with the exhaust.
> > As you can tell, I'm basically ignorant on this subject. I'm thinking of
> > dual heat muffs and dual heat boxes (I don't like to be cold and I like to
> > fly high) and want to make an informed decision.
> >
> > TIA
> >
> > Robert Dickson
> > Fayetteville NC
> > RV-6A QB, O-360, Hartzell CS, firewall foreward (and backward)
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
| From: | tom j powers <tompowersrv6(at)juno.com> |
writes:
> --> RV6-List message posted by: "Tedd McHenry"
>
>
> >--> RV6-List message posted by: "Paul Besing"
>
> >
> >This is an airplane. Probably $40,000 at least. Buy some aircraft
> >seatbelts. $150 from Van's shouldn't set you back much if you are
> spending
> >this much on an airplane. Or if you really want slick seatbelts,
> spend $300
> >(still a bargain, IMHO) on some hooker harnesses.
>
> Perhaps I should clarify. I'm not necessarily promoting the idea of
> buying
> seat belts from an auto wrecker. Personally, I don't want
> automotive-style
> inertia-reel seat belts (although nothing in the discussion so far
> has said
> we're not talking about buying a set of brand-new four- or
> five-point
> harnesses that were in the trunk of a wrecked car, still in their
> origianl
> package). The blanket statement that was made was, "stay away from
> the
> salvage yards `don't go there' stay away." That's quite an emphatic
> and
> all-encompassing statement, which presumably covers aircraft salvage
> yards
> as well. In fact, looking at the statement again it appears that it
> might
> have meant aircraft salvage yards specifically. So, again, why?
>
> Tedd
>
>
> _ Tedd another thing to think about is you are the manufacture of your
aircraft when you sell your airplane
you could be held liable if someone has an accident and is hurt or
killed and they find that the seat belts
were not aircraft quality. Ask Piper about the famous Piper Cub law
suit. (read EAAS selling your homebuilt)
Tom Powers N5UA
RV-6 Aircraft belts installed
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Modern Seat Belts - Scrotch |
All,
Hooker offers the Scrotch seat belts. We ordered them thru Team Rocket the
(5) point for our RV-8A were $499 (Total for the 2-sets).
This was significantly less than from Scrotch Distributor.
They are worth the $$.
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (Flying)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Dickson" <bubba(at)coastalnet.com> |
go to Van's site. the muff they show is the one I got with my exhaust
system, which as we all now know is a Robbins muff
Robert Dickson
----------
>From: Scot Stambaugh <sstambaugh(at)qualcomm.com>
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: heat muffs
>Date: Tue, Oct 2, 2001, 2:48 PM
>
>
> Is there a web site or a place to see some pictures of the Robbins Muff?
>
> scot
> F1 Rocket #19
>
>>
>>well, to finish up this thread, I just spent some time with this muff that
>>came with the vetterman exhaust and this is what I've come up with:
>>- it doesn't have a hinge on the side
>>- it does have 2 stainless rods that extend through asymmetrical ends and
>>attach with screws
>>- the instructions indicate that there is a 9" model for the left side, but
>>that I got an 8" model for the right side
>>- the instructions are very specific as to the placement of the muff in
>>relation to the ball joint and rotation to clear the cowl
>>
>>if this isn't the Robbins muff it sure sounds just like it. I think I'll
>>keep it. Thanks to everyone who replied.
>>
>>Robert Dickson
>>RV-6A QB, handlin' muffs in Fayette-stan
>>
>>----------
>> >From: "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com>
>> >To:
>> >Subject: Re: RV-List: heat muffs
>> >Date: Mon, Oct 1, 2001, 3:03 PM
>> >
>>
>> >
>> > Van's heat muffs won't fit. They are too long to fit on the straight
>> > portion of the pipe. They even know this. I had one and called them
>> up and
>> > said, "hey I got this heat muff," and they interrupted me and said, "it
>> > doesn't fit" . Why they sell a product that doesn't fit is beyond me,
>> > especially when they know it doesn't fit.
>> >
>> > Send it back, get credit, and order the Robbins muff. It is far
>> superior in
>> > quality and IT FITS!!
>> >
>> > The way you can tell, is the Van's muff is hinged on one side. The Robbins
>> > muff has screws that come out of the ends.
>> >
>> > Paul Besing
>> > RV-6A N197AB Arizona
>> > http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
>> > Flying
>> > Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
>> > http://www.kitlog.com
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Robert Dickson" <bubba(at)coastalnet.com>
>> > To: "rv list"
>> > Subject: RV-List: heat muffs
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I received my exhaust system for my O-360 a few months ago from Vans. It
>> > includes a heat muff. My questions are: Is this the famous Robbins heat
>> > muff? How would I know? Is there any problem with this heat muff, or what
>> > makes a Robbins muff better? The archive indicates that Van's muff was
>> > inferior and I'm wondering if this is different now that they're including
>> > the muff with the exhaust.
>> > As you can tell, I'm basically ignorant on this subject. I'm thinking of
>> > dual heat muffs and dual heat boxes (I don't like to be cold and I like to
>> > fly high) and want to make an informed decision.
>> >
>> > TIA
>> >
>> > Robert Dickson
>> > Fayetteville NC
>> > RV-6A QB, O-360, Hartzell CS, firewall foreward (and backward)
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Frank Dombroski <f_dombroski(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pullin' G's.. A little Help |
I use Bose headsets in a high +&- G environment (G202
Unlimited). We simply attached a velcro chin strap to
the pax headset, one small self adhesive square on
each side, with the softer material as the chin strap.
The piolt set has a nylon strap that loops over the
ear cup/band intersection, and snaps together under
the chin. I can email a picture if desired.
Regards
Frank
> >Whenever I pull more than a couple of G's, my
headset starts to slide off
> >my
> >head. This is probably aggravated by my tendancy
to look "up" into a
turn
> >or
> >loop, which makes my headset to want to slide off
backwards - down the
back
> >of my neck... This is distracting at best.
> >
> >How do the "real" acro pilots out there in RV-land
prevent this?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <enewton57(at)cableone.net> |
| Subject: | FAA Inspection N57ME |
N57ME has it's airworthiness certificate!!! Just got finished with my FAA inspection.
The FAA Inspector was very thorough and spent about three hours total
with me. About 1 1/2 hours was spent reviewing my builders log, engine logs,
etc. and going over the paperwork. Then about 1 1/2 hours inspecting the airplane
with a mirror and flashlight. He looked in every nook and cranny, crawling
under and inside and around. At the end he told me that my workmanship was
outstanding. He only found one minor squawk which I fixed while he was there.
One self locking nut on the rod end bearing for the flap actuator was flush
with the end of the bolt and no threads were showing. I replaced the fat washer
with a skinny one and viola` one thread showing.
He was happy with everything else and I'm now legal to go flying.
By the way, I called J.T. at Nation Air (877) 475-5860 for my insurance and got
the same quote for the insurance as he had quoted me several months ago. Super
nice guy to deal with if you are still shopping insurance.
Well none of this is political so its a little boring, but I just had to share
my excitment with a group that would understand. Thanks for listening (uh...er...reading).
Eric Newton - Long Beach, MS
N57ME - First flight will be right after SERFI (I hope)
www.ericsrv6a.com
Eric Newton - Long Beach, MS
RV-6A - N57ME (fiberglass stuff)
www.ericsrv6a.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn & Judi" <dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Setting Gross Weight |
Hi,
What are builders generally setting as their gross weight on an RV-6? Are
they going with Van's numbers, or setting it higher than that?
-Glenn Gordon
N442E (reserved)
painting
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Boyd C. Braem" <bcbraem(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Setting Gross Weight |
Glenn--
You need to start out with the paper work (spreadsheet makes it easy)
and calculate all the permutations of weight added for max front and
rear cg. Then, keep increasing the weight and see where it runs off the graph.
Next, get some concrete bags, lead bars, etc, place it in various
locations and gradually build up to your paper calculation limits.
Build up to max weight and then take a look at your take-off, climb,
trimmed cruise and landing configurations and get an idea of how the
airplane handles.
If satisfied with performance, at this point, then increase the weight
(in small increments!) and repeat the take-off, climb, cruise, landing
profiles and see how the plane handles.
Then, as the manufacturer, it's up to you to make the final decision.
Boyd
RV-Super 6 (GW 2,000 lbs)
Glenn & Judi wrote:
>
>
> Hi,
> What are builders generally setting as their gross weight on an RV-6? Are
> they going with Van's numbers, or setting it higher than that?
>
> -Glenn Gordon
> N442E (reserved)
> painting
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Setting Gross Weight |
In a message dated 10/2/01 5:40:15 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)home.com writes:
<< Hi,
What are builders generally setting as their gross weight on an RV-6? Are
they going with Van's numbers, or setting it higher than that?
-Glenn Gordon
N442E (reserved)
painting >>
I set mine at 1675 lb. It allows me to fly with a 180 lb passenger, full
fuel, and 75 lb of baggage. Of course, I do need to land while I've still
got 50 lb of fuel or so (note, this isn't an exact figure...), because the CG
moves aft as I burn fuel.
One thing I avoid is landing above Van's published weight.
Something I've noticed is that the airplane seems to land better at heavy
weights and a (relatively) aft CG. At light weights and a forward CG, the
airplane floats and floats, and I have more difficulty getting the tail down
for three pointers. At heavy weights (1500 - 1600 lb), the airplane flares,
then just settles in nicely. Anyone else experience this?
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Setting Gross Weight |
> Hi,
> What are builders generally setting as their gross weight on an RV-6?
> Are they going with Van's numbers, or setting it higher than that?
I set my -6A at 1850 lbs. I flight tested at that weight... high sink rate,
otherwise no problem. I certainly wouldn't want to land on a rough
field at that weight.
Tim
********************************
The DCA Infinite TCA...
"America's Southern No Fly Zone"
********************************
Tim Lewis -- Fairfax, VA
RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
******
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill Christie" <billc(at)dancris.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6 & Sam James Cowl |
Randy,
Your article was quite interesting. I am getting a parallel valve unit with
the airflow fuel injection. It appears that two of the biggest problems you
ran into should be alleviated in my case. Since I have an 8A and am putting
on a fixed prop, I might see a few other "opportunities to excel".
Thanks,
Bill Christie
----- Original Message -----
From: Randy Lervold <randy@rv-8.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6 & Sam James Cowl
>
> > Listers,
> > Does anyone know whether there is a similar problem with an RV8A? I
spoke
> > with Sam at Osh while looking at an RV8 and nothing was mentioned. I am
> not
> > a fibreglass expert and would not care to go through this.
> >
> > Bill Christie, RV8A, Phoenix
>
>
> Bill,
> I guess i would qualify as the only person with experience here with the
> RV-8. First off you should read my cowl/plenum chronicle at...
> http://www.rv-8.com/Cowl.htm
>
> Then it depends on what engine and prop you will be using as well. Will
you
> be installing an angle valve or parallel valve, and if parallel valve,
> Carbureted or injected? Fixed pitch or c/s?
>
> Randy Lervold
> RV-8, #80500, 131 hrs.
> www.rv-8.com
> Home Wing VAF
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
Tedd McHenry wrote:
>
>
> >--> RV6-List message posted by: "Paul Besing"
> >
> >This is an airplane. Probably $40,000 at least. Buy some aircraft
> >seatbelts. $150 from Van's shouldn't set you back much if you are spending
> >this much on an airplane. Or if you really want slick seatbelts, spend $300
> >(still a bargain, IMHO) on some hooker harnesses.
>
> Perhaps I should clarify. I'm not necessarily promoting the idea of buying
> seat belts from an auto wrecker. Personally, I don't want automotive-style
> inertia-reel seat belts (although nothing in the discussion so far has said
> we're not talking about buying a set of brand-new four- or five-point
> harnesses that were in the trunk of a wrecked car, still in their origianl
> package). The blanket statement that was made was, "stay away from the
> salvage yards `don't go there' stay away." That's quite an emphatic and
> all-encompassing statement, which presumably covers aircraft salvage yards
> as well. In fact, looking at the statement again it appears that it might
> have meant aircraft salvage yards specifically. So, again, why?
>
> Tedd
>
>
I am sure different inspector have different opinions but when I had my
airplane inspected 12 years ago I had to show my FAA inspector that the
seat belts were aircraft quality . He was very adamant that they were
not automotive. YMMV
Jerry S
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn & Judi" <dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)home.com> |
| Subject: | Video Camera Mounting |
Hi,
I would like to build a small mount for a camcorder to attach to the roll
bar brace on my RV-6 (tip-up).
Question 1.
Is the airframe vibration going to interfere with the video quality? Do I
need to have rubber isolation mounts, or are they more likely to amplify the
vibrations rather than dampen them?
Question 2.
My camera does not have an auxiliary audio input. I would like to record
the radio & intercom onto the video. I was thinking about havine a "Y" on
the passenger headphone audio jack which would branch to a small speaker
mounted in front of the camcorder microphone. I realize this is sort of a
rube-goldberg setup, but will it work? What kind of speaker would be
compatable with the type found in headsets?
Thanks,
Glenn Gordon
N442E (reserved)
painting
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)home.com> |
As I told my check ride person , when she asked what would I do if I
were 12 pounds over when doing my weight and balance thing?....
let 12 pounds of air out of the tires.
Barry Pote RV 9a fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Approach Plate Holder |
That's it!!! Thanks Randall, I thought it was one of us Lister regulars.
Ross
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)home.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Approach Plate Holder
>
> Sounds like mine. I started with a basic kneeboard from sporty's, and cut
it
> down a bit so it was just the size of the approach plates. Tapered the top
> too so it didn't stick up as much. The mounting "post", I riveted to the
> back is more like 7" long by 1.5" wide, .063 AL. Took some trial and error
> to bend it for the desired angle but I got it eventually. To attach to the
> plane, I made a U shaped piece out of .032 that fit over the wing
> bulkhead -- drilled out a couple of pop rivets each side and put it on
there
> with enough of a gap for the tongue of the "post" to slip into. Works
great.
> I'll try to get pictures.
>
> Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~280 hrs)
> Portland, OR
> www.vanshomewing.org
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Approach Plate Holder
>
>
> >
> > Thanks, Ed. The one I saw was a metal clipboard about the size of an
> > approach plate that was riveted to a approximately 12 inch long by 2
inch
> > wide piece of what looked like heavy aluminum sheet metal that was
> slightly
> > twisted so the clip board was at a 45 degree angle at the far left of
the
> > instrument panel. I couldn't see how the end of the sheet metal "post"
> was
> > attached to the fuse. If I can't find out whose it is, I may just rivet
a
> > small "pocket" to the side of the fuse that I could insert the end of
the
> > sheet metal "post."
> >
> > Ross
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Ed Bundy" <ebundy(at)velocitus.net>
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: Approach Plate Holder
> >
> >
> > >
> > > It may have been mine - it's pretty simple, but I use it all the time.
> I
> > > didn't want to tear up a kneeboard, so I bought a suitable approach
> plate
> > > clip that just happened to be a attached to a $1.00 Walmart clipboard.
> It
> > > was held on with two rivets which were drilled out. It was then a
> simple
> > > matter of using the two existing holes to drill through the formed
> channel
> > > (the one that rests on the main longerons) at a suitable location and
> > > securing it with a couple of pop rivets.
> > >
> > > I can get a picture of it if you want, but there really isn't much
else
> to
> > > it.
> > >
> > > Ed Bundy - RV6A N427EM 400+ hours
> > > 160hp 0320 w/Sensenich 70x78
> > > Eagle, ID
> > > ebundy(at)velocitus.net
> > >
> > > > When I was at Van's Homecoming, I saw a plane with an approach plate
> > > holder
> > > > attached to the left side of the fuselage. Any idea who it is and if
> > there
> > > > are pictues available? Because the canopy was closed, i couldn't
see
> > how
> > > it
> > > > was attached.
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ed Holyoke <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | do you prime inside fuse sides? |
I think he probably means alclad.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Paul Besing
Subject: Re: RV-List: do you prime inside fuse sides?
Your skins came alodined????
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "res0hxvf" <res0hxvf(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Video Camera Mounting |
Glen-
I installed my video camera, a Canon ZR-10 using the top section of a tripod
that was zip tied to a piece of aluminum channel. The channel was then
c-clamped to the cross bar. The camera has an built-in electronic anti shake
system (most camcorders do these days)- no shaking was noticed.
One item I would recommend is a wide angle adapter (I did not use one, but
wished I had).
You can see the video at http://Robin.getbiz.net
Robin Wessel
RV-6A 43 hrs
Tigard, Oregon
> Question 1.
> Is the airframe vibration going to interfere with the video quality? Do I
> need to have rubber isolation mounts, or are they more likely to amplify
the
> vibrations rather than dampen them?
>
>
> Question 2.
> My camera does not have an auxiliary audio input. I would like to record
> the radio & intercom onto the video. I was thinking about havine a "Y" on
> the passenger headphone audio jack which would branch to a small speaker
> mounted in front of the camcorder microphone. I realize this is sort of a
> rube-goldberg setup, but will it work? What kind of speaker would be
> compatable with the type found in headsets?
>
> Thanks,
> Glenn Gordon
> N442E (reserved)
> painting
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Michael J. Robbins" <kitfox(at)gte.net> |
| Subject: | Schroth Seat Belts |
I have a set of the Schroth five point belts. I haven't installed them yet,
but they are really top of the line. Made in Germany and TSOd. Very
expensive, but I'm worth it.
Mike Robbins
RV8Q 80591 N88MJ painting the big stuff
Seattle area
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
I went with Greentree. Now it is Textron Financial. My loan actually got
sold to Conseco, who is ok, but they are not in the aircraft lending
business. Textron seems to own everything nowadays, so I bet they have
money to lend.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
Subject: RV-List: financing
Has anybody financed their project? If so, how and through whom?
)_( Dan
dan(at)rvproject.com
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Setting Gross Weight |
In a message dated 10/2/01 2:39:39 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)home.com writes:
<< What are builders generally setting as their gross weight on an RV-6? Are
they going with Van's numbers, or setting it higher than that? >>
1900 lb for mine (tested with two economy sized adults, full fuel and 100 lb
of sand in the baggage compartment), but we have a local guy with an RV-6
equipped with a long distance fuselage tank who set his gross weight at 2200
lb.
-GV (RV-6A N1GV)
vanremog(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Setting Gross Weight |
Gross weight on my RV-6A is set at 1800 lbs gross, I've flown it weighing
1720lbs with no problems.
Ed Anderson
Matthews, NC
----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn & Judi" <dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)home.com>
Subject: RV-List: Setting Gross Weight
>
> Hi,
> What are builders generally setting as their gross weight on an RV-6? Are
> they going with Van's numbers, or setting it higher than that?
>
> -Glenn Gordon
> N442E (reserved)
> painting
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
| From: | "Tedd McHenry" <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
>Wrecked car parts do not belong on aircraft.
That's just a platitude. Why not wrecked car parts on an airplane? I can
think of quite a few parts from a wrecked car I'd be willing to use on an
airplane:
seats, seat material, carpeting and other interior trim
sound insulation
engine instruments
engine long block (suitably overhauled)
alternator
starter
ventilation system components
power locks
glove box light switch and socket
interior light switch and socket
cigar lighter
stereo or speakers
rear-view mirror
AC compressor and condensor
Thanks to everyone who answered regarding seat belts. For the record, I
plan to use brand-new belts suitable for aerobatics in my -6. Seat belts
aren't the issue for me in this thread, salvaged parts are.
Tedd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | RV6-7-9 Navaid Servo Arm Lengthen Mod |
For those of you that have their Navaid wing leveler under the passenger
seat, and who have got it hooked up by a long rod over to the bottom of
the left joystick, what did you use to make the rod?
I'm looking at Van's catalog at the Rigid Tube AT6-065x3/8x36 is this
the stuff?
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com |
07:51:37 AM
Dan, I just checked into the loan process with First National Bank of
Prior, Oklahoma. The officers are all aviation buffs and they like to make
airplane loans. They love RV's by the way.
http://www.1st-of-pryor.com/
Eric
"Dan Checkoway" (at)matronics.com on 10/02/2001 02:12:20 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV-List: financing
Has anybody financed their project? If so, how and through whom?
)_( Dan
dan(at)rvproject.com
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Helms" <jhelms(at)i1.net> |
Lots of my customers seem to like NAFCO. They broker the loans to Citizens
National of Laurel, MD and Terrace Bank of Florida. My customers have only
said good things about them and they are easy for me to deal with (Textron
is not very easy for us.)
John "JT" Helms
Branch Manager
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: financing
I went with Greentree. Now it is Textron Financial. My loan actually got
sold to Conseco, who is ok, but they are not in the aircraft lending
business. Textron seems to own everything nowadays, so I bet they have
money to lend.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
Subject: RV-List: financing
Has anybody financed their project? If so, how and through whom?
)_( Dan
dan(at)rvproject.com
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larygagnon(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Strong Double Sided Tape |
Any auto parts store or auto paint store should carry 3M Scotch-Mount brand
tape in a variety of sizes. #06382 is 1/2 inch by 20 yd by .045 thick. It's
used to hold most of the emblems and moldings on newer cars these days.
Larry Gagnon
RV6 Finishing Kit N6LG (reserved)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill VonDane" <n8vd(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Schroth Seat Belts |
On the subject of seat belts... I got a pair of 4 point harnesses from
LiteAir Industries in Canada... They are very nice, very heavy duty, and
the cost was only $55 per seat... The last time I talked to then they said
they would have a crotch strap for me soon...
You can see pix of my harnesses here:
http://vondane.com/rv8a/finish/finish4.htm
-Bill VonDane
Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A - N8VD
http://vondane.com/rv8a/
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Michael J.
Robbins
Subject: RV-List: Schroth Seat Belts
I have a set of the Schroth five point belts. I haven't installed them yet,
but they are really top of the line. Made in Germany and TSOd. Very
expensive, but I'm worth it.
Mike Robbins
RV8Q 80591 N88MJ painting the big stuff
Seattle area
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Toggle Switch Holes |
--- Norman wrote:
>
> > As I recall the diameter is most likely 15/32".
>
> Thanks Stan, I am coming to this conclusion too. Now off I go to try
> and
> find a 15/32 drill bit. I might try a Unibit #1 Step Drill located in
> the
> Aircraft Spruce catalog on page 459 p/n 12-03700. It will make 13
> different
> holes in 1/32nd increments from 1/8" to 1/2" for $14.95
Norman, I'm betting you already have the tool you need for this.
I have switches from three different sources - and they all fit a
slightly different hole. I started with a 1/2 inch bit and then you
can use your swivel deburring tool - the one you used to debur rib
lightening holes - to open up the hole until the switch threads just
fit into it. For some it doesn't take much, for other brands it took
more.
I never did have a problem with elongation - even for the ones I had to
work on more.
Try it on scrap and see what you think b4 you spend more money!
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX
-6 N140RV (Reserved)
Firewall Forward
http://phone.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Discounted Schroth Seat Belts |
All,
Check out Team Rocket - They have the Hooker Belts with Schroth buckles - 5
point for $250 a set.
Chuck Rowbotham
RV-8A (Flying)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | CS spinner plate |
| From: | "Robert Dickson" <bubba(at)coastalnet.com> |
is the small filler plate on a constant speed spinner the same as the plans
show for the fixed pitch, but smaller? Should it extend all the way acroos
the gap behind the prop?
TIA
Robert Dickson
Fayetteville NC
RV-6A, 180 w/cs prop
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: FAA Inspection N57ME |
Eric,
Congratulations - we look forward to hearing of your first flight.
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (Flying)
Niantic, CT (Westerly airport)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Builder's Bookstore" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
Just in case anybody has any lingering doubts about whether we picked the right
planes, read below what I just pulled off the Lancair list.. Yep, those 4Ps
might be pretty sexy, and are undoubtedly thought of as some kind of status
symbol. But there's not much status in being a smoking hole in the ground.
I'll post again if any more details are given.
Andy
RV-6A - (flying - 200+ hrs)
RV-10 - (shop ready, 16' shed built, air tools oiled)
>
>yes I know, it is not rated for this manuver, but has anybody intentionaly
>or Inadvertently done a spin in the IV P,
>if so, can you share the experiance
One or so years ago, on this list, someone reported doing a spin in a
IV. I don't remember the exact information but because of what I do
remember I thought that I had better put something in writing right
now.
The spin started at 20,000 ft. They tried everything that they could
and finally recovered at 2,000 ft.
If I were you I would start at 40,000 ft with a forward center of
gravity. With experience, you should be able to work down from there.
Don't forget your parachute. What the heck you can always build(buy)
another one.
Good Luck,
Lorn H. 'Feathers' Olsen, DynaComm, Corp.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: seat belts |
In a message dated 10/2/01 11:11:19 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
tedd(at)vansairforce.org writes:
> --> RV6-List message posted by: "Tedd McHenry"
>
> >Wrecked car parts do not belong on aircraft.
>
> That's just a platitude. Why not wrecked car parts on an airplane? I can
> think of quite a few parts from a wrecked car I'd be willing to use on an
> airplane:
>
> seats, seat material, carpeting and other interior trim
> sound insulation
> engine instruments
> engine long block (suitably overhauled)
> alternator
> starter
> ventilation system components
> power locks
> glove box light switch and socket
> interior light switch and socket
> cigar lighter
> stereo or speakers
> rear-view mirror
> AC compressor and condensor
>
> Thanks to everyone who answered regarding seat belts. For the record, I
> plan to use brand-new belts suitable for aerobatics in my -6. Seat belts
> aren't the issue for me in this thread, salvaged parts are.
>
> Tedd
>
>
>
Go for it Tedd, what is great to may not be that choice to other
builder/pilots but it is your choice.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Discounted Schroth Seat Belts |
Huh???? I just paid $300 for 5 point hookers with the hooker hardware.
Isn't the Shroth hardware more expensive?
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: Discounted Schroth Seat Belts
All,
Check out Team Rocket - They have the Hooker Belts with Schroth buckles - 5
point for $250 a set.
Chuck Rowbotham
RV-8A (Flying)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Toggle Switch Holes |
This is where a complete set of numbered drill bits come in handy. I have
#1-64 I think, plus A-Z sizes and fractional. Harbor Freight has a titanium
set for around $50. They aren't the best drill bits in the world, but to
have the entire set and that many numbered drill bits to get your hole size
correct in applications like these are worth it.
Paul Besing
RV-6A N197AB Arizona
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Flying
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Thompson" <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Toggle Switch Holes
--- Norman wrote:
>
> > As I recall the diameter is most likely 15/32".
>
> Thanks Stan, I am coming to this conclusion too. Now off I go to try
> and
> find a 15/32 drill bit. I might try a Unibit #1 Step Drill located in
> the
> Aircraft Spruce catalog on page 459 p/n 12-03700. It will make 13
> different
> holes in 1/32nd increments from 1/8" to 1/2" for $14.95
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman, Jim" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | RE: Landing Lights made from Auto lights |
Listers, Since my post yesterday about using lights from an Acura Integra I
received a handful of questions off line, so I am putting this on the list
for all to see.
I'm not using HID lights.. Way too expensive at this time (many hundreds and
possibly a thousand dollars?). Thus, no transformers, less weight, and not
expensive.
I'm using the typical halogen ones from an Acura Integra. LOTS of cars have
these little lights now which aren't HID. Mine are exactly 2" in diameter,
so I cut a hole in each wing leading edge about 4" from the end of the metal
part of the wing. Making a bracket was simple, just riveted some angles
between the end rib of the wing (to stiffen it) and then others over to the
mounting plate of the light. Truly one of the easiest mods I've made to my
plane. By tightening or loosening one of the mounting bolts, I can aim them
up and down.
For the Plexiglas, I bought the plexi that van's sells for that HUGE
Duckworth landing light. I cut the plexi in half....so I could use it for
both wing lights. Its about 10 inches long, so cut in half it easily covers
both of the 2" holes I cut in each wing. Mounting this plexi from inside
was straightforward with mounting plates and countersunk #6 screws as
typical for these implementations.
The ones I am using had 55 Watt bulbs in them, which I promptly changed for
100 W by going to the local auto parts store. About $6 each. They do get
hot, but its not any hotter than the halogen lights that everybody else
uses... its the same thing... the difference is possibly in 3 ways: The
wattage of the bulb you use, the amount of area that the heat is spread out
(smaller reflector, vs. large reflector and large piece of plastic), and how
close you mount it to the front of the wing/plexi. I considered mounting
the light with its glass sticking through the wing about 1/2 inch with no
plexi covering it (its round, but not the same shape as the leading edge of
the wing)... .. It looked cool, but I was afraid that I was disturbing the
air flow over the wing... too close to the wing tip, etc, etc. etc. I am
using a relay for these.
Since they are typical halogen, the current draw and the ability to flash
(Wig Wag) would be no different than the other lights sold for Vans
applications. Finally, I'm not flying yet so I don't know how it all works,
but how bad can it be? Besides, the two little round holes are dark.. you
can't see the bulb inside the glass, so they look like machine guns!
jim
Tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: ripsteel(at)edge.net [mailto:ripsteel(at)edge.net]
Subject: Landing Lights
Howdy Jim-
I have been planning on the small (high intensity discharge?) lights as
you have used but am not yet to the point of actually implementing
this. I would be very interested in how they have worked out so far,
such as special mounting considerations (susceptible to vibration?), do
they generate a lot of heat, how much current draw, do they require
components other than just the lamps and receptacles (transformers or
special control circuits etc.) and just how much light do they produce.
Also curious about whether they can be cycled on/off continuously for
wig-wag type function. Where did you mount them (if you got any photos,
would love to see 'em!)
Thanks for your time and any information!
From the PossumWorks in TN
Mark Phillips
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Zilik" <zilik(at)bewellnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: CS spinner plate |
Robert Dickson wrote:
>
> is the small filler plate on a constant speed spinner the same as the plans
> show for the fixed pitch, but smaller? Should it extend all the way acroos
> the gap behind the prop?
Yes it should extend acroos the gap
>
>
> TIA
>
> Robert Dickson
> Fayetteville NC
> RV-6A, 180 w/cs prop
>
> _
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Textor" <pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | RE: Landing Lights made from Auto lights |
Listers,
At AirVenture this year the Team Rocket boys had a similar set-up on their
A/C. I did take a picture if anyone wants a copy send me an email so I can
reply.
Jack
DSM
RV8
pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Norman, Jim
Subject: RV-List: RE: Landing Lights made from Auto lights
Listers, Since my post yesterday about using lights from an Acura Integra I
received a handful of questions off line, so I am putting this on the list
for all to see.
I'm not using HID lights.. Way too expensive at this time (many hundreds and
possibly a thousand dollars?). Thus, no transformers, less weight, and not
expensive.
I'm using the typical halogen ones from an Acura Integra. LOTS of cars have
these little lights now which aren't HID. Mine are exactly 2" in diameter,
so I cut a hole in each wing leading edge about 4" from the end of the metal
part of the wing. Making a bracket was simple, just riveted some angles
between the end rib of the wing (to stiffen it) and then others over to the
mounting plate of the light. Truly one of the easiest mods I've made to my
plane. By tightening or loosening one of the mounting bolts, I can aim them
up and down.
For the Plexiglas, I bought the plexi that van's sells for that HUGE
Duckworth landing light. I cut the plexi in half....so I could use it for
both wing lights. Its about 10 inches long, so cut in half it easily covers
both of the 2" holes I cut in each wing. Mounting this plexi from inside
was straightforward with mounting plates and countersunk #6 screws as
typical for these implementations.
The ones I am using had 55 Watt bulbs in them, which I promptly changed for
100 W by going to the local auto parts store. About $6 each. They do get
hot, but its not any hotter than the halogen lights that everybody else
uses... its the same thing... the difference is possibly in 3 ways: The
wattage of the bulb you use, the amount of area that the heat is spread out
(smaller reflector, vs. large reflector and large piece of plastic), and how
close you mount it to the front of the wing/plexi. I considered mounting
the light with its glass sticking through the wing about 1/2 inch with no
plexi covering it (its round, but not the same shape as the leading edge of
the wing)... .. It looked cool, but I was afraid that I was disturbing the
air flow over the wing... too close to the wing tip, etc, etc. etc. I am
using a relay for these.
Since they are typical halogen, the current draw and the ability to flash
(Wig Wag) would be no different than the other lights sold for Vans
applications. Finally, I'm not flying yet so I don't know how it all works,
but how bad can it be? Besides, the two little round holes are dark.. you
can't see the bulb inside the glass, so they look like machine guns!
jim
Tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: ripsteel(at)edge.net [mailto:ripsteel(at)edge.net]
Subject: Landing Lights
Howdy Jim-
I have been planning on the small (high intensity discharge?) lights as
you have used but am not yet to the point of actually implementing
this. I would be very interested in how they have worked out so far,
such as special mounting considerations (susceptible to vibration?), do
they generate a lot of heat, how much current draw, do they require
components other than just the lamps and receptacles (transformers or
special control circuits etc.) and just how much light do they produce.
Also curious about whether they can be cycled on/off continuously for
wig-wag type function. Where did you mount them (if you got any photos,
would love to see 'em!)
Thanks for your time and any information!
From the PossumWorks in TN
Mark Phillips
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis" <mnellis(at)peoplepc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: Landing Lights made from Auto lights |
Hey Jack, I'd love to see the picture of the landing light option.
Mike Nellis - http://bmnellis.com
Plainfield, IL
RV6 N699BM Reserved
Mounting Control Surfaces
Stinson 108-2 N9666K
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack Textor" <pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: RE: Landing Lights made from Auto lights
>
> Listers,
> At AirVenture this year the Team Rocket boys had a similar set-up on their
> A/C. I did take a picture if anyone wants a copy send me an email so I
can
> reply.
> Jack
> DSM
> RV8
> pincjt(at)ix.netcom.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
September 28, 2001 - October 03, 2001
RV-Archive.digest.vol-lp