RV-Archive.digest.vol-mv
May 12, 2002 - May 22, 2002
> 80mph and couldn't figure
> > out why the thing wouldn't stop flying.
> >
> > Ed Bundy - RV6A N427EM 450+ hours
> > 160hp 0320 w/Sensenich 70x78
> > Eagle, ID
> > ebundy(at)velocitus.net
> >
> >> So, if all research and flight testing shows that
> 80 IAS really is a good
> >> "nominal" value for final approach, then the
> issue of "floating" seems to
> >> boil down to: A normal practice of gliding in on
> final at 80 IAS . . .
> >> aiming at the very end of the runway . . . (with
> due consideration of wind
> >> down the runway & obstacles) - or some point a
> little short of the end.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> Contributions of
> any other form
>
> latest messages.
> other List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/search
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
http://launch.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Puckett <rv8er(at)concentric.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Airflow Perf fuel pump amperage? |
Kevin,
The document that came with my Airflow Performance boost pump says the
following:
"This pump package will draw 5 amps at 12VDC. The pump should be
protected by a 7 to 10 amp circuit breaker. Electrical wiring to the
pump should be a minimum of 16 gauge stranded wire."
BTW, I think I need a good picture of exactly how you routed your inv.
oil lines and where/how you secured them. Specifically the line that
goes from the bottom of the oil separator to the left fwd. sump fitting.
I can't picture how I'm going to get this line around the fuel servo
cleanly. Also, did your motor come with a breather fitting that accepts
3/4" ID hose? The Christen doc say's I need a special lycoming fitting
to do this. I was hoping I could find some sort of AN/MS fitting that
would work.
Thanks,
Greg Puckett
Elizabeth, CO
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Airflow Perf fuel pump amperage? |
>
>I am temporarily unsure of the position of the documentation that
>came with my Airflow Performance electric fuel pump. I need to know
>how many amps the pump draws so I can sort out wire size, fuse size,
>relay rating, etc.
>
>Thanks,
>
>--
>Kevin Horton
I got the answer I needed from a couple of people - AFP claims a 5
amp current draw. I suspect there will be a bit more current as the
pump starts up, so I'm going to size the wire, fuse and relay to
handle 10 amps.
I expected my AFP docs to show up as soon as I posted the first
question, but they are still hiding. If they don't show up in a few
days I may have to post some really stupid questions to flush them
out of hiding. :)
Thanks,
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (installing engine & electrics)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
http://eccentrix.com/misc/rv8/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frank Marlowe" <fmarlowe(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings (was Re: |
RV-List: Test Flight Data))
Hi,
I'm not a physics grad or an aviation expert, but from what I learned in
school I would expect once the engine shut down, that the "engine/prop"
system would find it's least energetic level ("windmilling" i.e. if the
least energetic (with regard to air resistance) situation for the prop was
to be static then it would find that position instead of windmilling).
I have trouble believing a windmilling prop would have the equivalent drag
of a flat stationary disk the diameter of the prop. That would probably be
more drag than dropping the flaps (considering total square inches and angle
of disk to direction of flight).
Also, if there is any chance the engine will start back up, you won't find
out without windmilling or hitting the starter. And finally, I have no idea
what the difference between "windmill stop speed" and "stall speed" on my
aircraft is. I would consider it a risky proposition to try and find out.
These are just my opinions, I don't have hard facts to back them up. However
if anyone out there has real data and explanations, I would love to hear it.
Frank Marlowe
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Rob Prior
Subject: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings (was
Re: RV-List: Test Flight Data))
On a (mostly) related note, one thing we did waaaay back in university
was show that in the event of an engine failure, if you wanted maximum
distance travelled per feet of altitude lost, then you'll want to bring
the nose up enough to stop the prop from windmilling before establishing
your best glide speed. Windmilling props provide the equivalent drag of
having a flat stationary disk the diameter of the prop mounted on the
front of your airplane.
-RB4
RV-7 Empennage
David Carter wrote:
>
>Has anyone flight tested to find the "best glide speed" for an RV-6, i.e,
>most fwd distance traveled per feet of altitude lost, at some given weight?
>If it is less than 80 mph or kias, then that would seem to be a good
pattern
>speed for idle pattern & landing and should replace the "80 IAS is better
if
>the engine quits" thing.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | Re: New Warnke prop concerns |
Does he have all fairings (gearleg, wheel pants, etc.) installed?
If not, he can inspect RPM to increase (and the plane go faster) once he
installs them.
Also, we really need the full throttle at 8000' density altitude.
Finn
Ken Cantrell wrote:
>
> Listers..
> A good friend of mine (not on the RV list) just received and installed a
> new Warnke wood prop on his O-320 powered RV6. He has serious concerns
> on the relatively low RPM results he is getting so far. He would like to
> get some input from those of you who may have information to offer.
> These are some numbers he is getting with the new prop.
>
> Initial climb out...(sea level)...2270 RPM & 28" M.P.
> Low altitude cruise...2300 RPM & 25" M.P.
> Full throttle @ 3000'....2520 RPM & 27" M.P.
>
> Thanks for your replies...
>
> Ken Cantrell
> RV6 flying!!!
> 29 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Earl Fortner <efortner(at)vnet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-4 Ailerons |
If both have the same amount of bow in the same direction it should not be a
problem.
"Ross A. Scroggs" wrote:
>
> Need some advice,
> I just finished riveting my left aileron. When I look down the
> trailing edge from end to end, I have
> a slight bow about midway down the edge which is about 1/8-3/16 out of
> alignment. There is no
> twist at all. I can only assume that this was a result of only having a
> single pipe clamp on my
> trailing edge bender, which was set in the middle.
> My question is, should I worry about this or is it just cosmetic?
> The aileron looks great otherwise.
> I have not riveted my right aileron yet but I can tell it has the same
> bow as the left.
>
> In search of the perfect plane,
>
> Ross Scroggs
> Conyers, Ga.
> RV-4 #3911
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings |
(was Re: RV-List: Test Flight Data))
>
>Hi,
> I'm not a physics grad or an aviation expert, but from what
>I learned in
>school I would expect once the engine shut down, that the "engine/prop"
>system would find it's least energetic level ("windmilling" i.e. if the
>least energetic (with regard to air resistance) situation for the prop was
>to be static then it would find that position instead of windmilling).
Nope, not that simple. If you glide at a constant airspeed, the
engine will settle down and windmill at a particular rpm. If the
engine happens to slow down a bit, that puts the prop blades at a
higher angle of attack (or more negative angle of attack, depending
on your frame of reference), and they produce more torque on the
crankshaft, and the engine accelerates back to the previous rpm. The
engine/prop has no way of knowing that there might be a "less
energetic" state if it happened to stop turning.
Slowing down and opening the throttle to full (makes the engine
compress more air, and makes it harder to turn over) may cause the
prop to stop turning, and improve your glide performance. Obviously
you don't do this until you've given up on restarting the engine.
> I have trouble believing a windmilling prop would have the
>equivalent drag
>of a flat stationary disk the diameter of the prop. That would probably be
>more drag than dropping the flaps (considering total square inches and angle
>of disk to direction of flight).
I suspect the drag is a it less than a flat stationary disk,
especially at the rpm that the prop will be turning. But it will
still be a lot more drag than a stopped prop.
Prop drag can be huge in some cases though. I have a friend who had
an engine failure and prop runaway in an S-2 Tracker many years ago.
The prop on the failed engine couldn't be feathered, and the prop was
locked in a very fine pitch, with the engine rpm driven well over
redline by the windmilling prop. He put full power on the other
engine and slowed down to just above the stall (less airflow to drive
the windmilling prop), but was still coming down like a rock. He was
lucky the failure happened close to the airport, as he barely made
the runway.
> Also, if there is any chance the engine will start back up,
>you won't find
>out without windmilling or hitting the starter. And finally, I have no idea
>what the difference between "windmill stop speed" and "stall speed" on my
>aircraft is. I would consider it a risky proposition to try and find out.
>These are just my opinions, I don't have hard facts to back them up. However
>if anyone out there has real data and explanations, I would love to hear it.
>
>Frank Marlowe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dag adamson <dag_adamson(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Strategy and timing for wing attachment - I am moving from Boston |
to Colorado
Simultaneous to finishing the -8A fuse, my wife and I
have decided to move from Boston to Grand Junction
Colorado. We'll be moving in July.
I have not received my finish kit yet - but the finish
kit is ready for shipment. I was hoping to get some
opinions on some strategies on what do over the next
couple of months, yet minimize the amount of stuff
shipped here to Boston.
STRATEGY 'A'
I was thinking about hulking the fuse out of my one
car garage to a friend's two car garage to attach the
wings. The manual discusses attaching the wings
before the landing gear. Is it a good idea to attach
the main gear and then attach the wings? Do I need the
nose gear on?
I can basically get the gear shipped to Boston and
then have the canopy etc shipped to Colorado.
STRATEGY 'B'
Hold off on the wings - start working on the panel.
Get some of the wiring done. Paint the cockpit.
All ideas are welcome.
BTW- any builders out there on the Western Colorado?
Thanks
Dag
====
*****************
Dag Adamson
617 513 1182
Natick, MA
RV-8A Fuselage
*****************
http://launch.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Shelby Smith <rvaitor(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Skylane Flyin? |
I took a couple of pictures. We were there in my Musketeer. Carl's plane was
nice. Don't know whether you heard or not, but Evansville approach gave the
folks at Skylane a call after your departure. Skylane is carved out of their
Class C airspace and I guess you guys got a little closer than they like. It
was a nice fly-by.
We enjoyed the hospitality at Skylane. Great place and lots of nice folks.
--
Shelby Smith
rvaitor(at)comcast.net
RV6A - Fuse in Jig
N95EB - reserved
> From: Ted Gauthier <tgauthier(at)comcast.net>
> Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Sun, 12 May 2002 07:21:07 -0400
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Skylane Flyin?
>
>
> Carl Franz invited me to ride along in his beautiful RV-6. We departed
> from Livingston County, Michigan around 7:30am and arrived at Skylane 2
> hours later. When we arrived the runway was very wet on the west side
> however we no problems. Once we got out of the RV we were greeted by a
> dozen or more of the nicest people. At least a half dozen are building RV's
> in the area. The sky was clear with great visibility however the weather
> several miles to the west was threatening rain and storms. We looked at the
> weather channel located in their beautiful new building and saw that all
> that weather was moving across the Midwest. We only stayed for 2 hours and
> headed home because this weather was moving in. Our flight home was VFR all
> the way without any problems. The skies were dark and buildups high to west
> almost the entire trip home. Just a beautiful day for us, wish we could of
> stayed longer. I felt sorry for the organizers because we were the only RV
> there at the time. Only about six planes total. We took off on the dry side
> of the runway with no problems. Once in flight we did hear another RV on
> the radio state his intentions to land at Skylane. The people there were
> great and I hope the weather is better for them next year.
>
> Ted Gauthier- DAR
> RV-6, Finishing
> Just hung my Superior SL-0360
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bobby Hester" <bhester(at)apex.net>
> To: "RV7and7A" ; "RV-List"
>
> Subject: RV-List: Skylane Flyin?
>
>
>>
>> Anybody make it to the RV Fly-in at Skylane beside Evensville, IN?
>> I had to work and did not get to go :-(
>> Any pictures?
>>
>> --
>> Surfing the Web from Hopkinsville, KY
>> Visit my web site at: http://www.geocities.com/hester-hoptown/RVSite/
>> RV7A Working on the wings :-)
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eric Newton" <enewton57(at)cableone.net> |
Data)
Nels,
Do you use any flaps for your short field takeoff?
Thanks,
Eric
----- Original Message -----
From: "Nels Hanson" <pa201950(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Final approach speed and landings (was Re: RV-List: Test Flight
Data)
>
> I fly an RV-6 into my farm strip,which is 1,050 ft. in
> length. Last time I landed there I measured my
> stopping place,and it was 650 ft. from the end of the
> runway,not where my wheels touched. I bring it in no
> faster than 60 IAS or I float too much. Getting out of
> the strip(solo only),I use about half of the strip
> with a gentle breeze and about 700 ft. with no wind.
> The length of the grass is a determining factor as
> well as knowledge of when it rained there last. I do
> a lot of practice "stalling" to get the "feel" of my
> plane. Wouldn't recommend starting out at a grass
> strip this short. I knew what I could do by setting
> stakes alongside of a grass strip and measuring my
> takeoffs/landings before I even built this short
> strip. The RV is the only plane that can come and go
> in this distance and still get you there at 170 mph.
> --- Denis Walsh wrote:
> >
> >
> > I agree with this summary completely. My indicated
> > stall speeds are the
> > same. My 6A has a C/S prop on it so I still use 80
> > until on final, 70-74
> > over the fence and then all the same as Ed. When I
> > do fly the Sens planes I
> > always float too much and am sure I would go to 65
> > on short final if I had a
> > chance to practice.
> >
> > I do almost all "long field" landings. When I do
> > short field landings, I
> > use 65, and start flare over the end of the runway.
> > As Ed says you gotta be
> > right (even righter with the C/S and a low idle
> > set!!), so it is well worth
> > practicing fairly often. It is a real satisfying
> > thing to do this and note
> > the really short roll out. It is also fun to do the
> > Squeaker landings which
> > I usually do with a non pilot passenger, or an
> > airline guy.
> >
> > DLW RV-6A 180HP, C/S 1850 landings so far (approx)
> >
> > > From: "Ed Bundy" <ebundy(at)velocitus.net>
> > > Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > > Date: Sat, 11 May 2002 18:41:04 -0600
> > > To:
> > > Subject: Re: Final approach speed and landings
> > (was Re: RV-List: Test Flight
> > > Data)
> > >
> >
> > >
> > > I'd like to add a couple of data points to the
> > mix. I do a lot of flying
> > > into back-country airports in my 6A, and I feel
> > very comfortable with steep
> > > approaches and short field landings. My RV stalls
> > at 52mph/57mph IAS
> > > (solo/gross). Unless I'm at or near full gross I
> > use 55mph as Vso. My home
> > > field is 3000' long at 2250msl. Not short by any
> > means but I use it to
> > > practice short field landings and I can stop
> > before the end without touching
> > > the brakes. I fly short field approaches at
> > 1.2Vso, or 65mph. I use just a
> > > touch of power on short final (I don't use any
> > power if it's a very short
> > > field, but the descent rate is quite steep) and
> > pull it off at about 8-10'
> > > agl then a very slight back pressure on the stick
> > and you touch down quite
> > > nose-high with almost no float. The transition
> > from a steep approach to
> > > touchdown in this configuration is very brief and
> > you only get one shot at a
> > > smooth touchdown, but it isn't difficult. I've
> > even slowed to 60mph over
> > > the fence on very short, rough fields, but the
> > landing is more of an arrival
> > > than a touchdown, and I don't recommend anything
> > less than 1.2Vso unless
> > > absolutely necessary.
> > >
> > > For longer runways I'll come in at 70mph (1.3Vso)
> > and by contrast, there is
> > > a lot more float. I'll usually bring it in with a
> > little power, level out
> > > at a foot above the runway, and ease the power out
> > to make contact with the
> > > ground. You can make really nice
> > "kiss-the-ground" landings this way.
> > > Personally, I don't bother with any approach
> > speeds faster than this. I
> > > made my first few landings at an approach speed of
> > 80mph and couldn't figure
> > > out why the thing wouldn't stop flying.
> > >
> > > Ed Bundy - RV6A N427EM 450+ hours
> > > 160hp 0320 w/Sensenich 70x78
> > > Eagle, ID
> > > ebundy(at)velocitus.net
> > >
> > >> So, if all research and flight testing shows that
> > 80 IAS really is a good
> > >> "nominal" value for final approach, then the
> > issue of "floating" seems to
> > >> boil down to: A normal practice of gliding in on
> > final at 80 IAS . . .
> > >> aiming at the very end of the runway . . . (with
> > due consideration of wind
> > >> down the runway & obstacles) - or some point a
> > little short of the end.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > Contributions of
> > any other form
> >
> > latest messages.
> > other List members.
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> > http://www.matronics.com/search
> > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> http://launch.yahoo.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David L. Grebe" <davegrebe(at)pond.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Airflow Perf fuel pump amperage? |
The info I rec'd shows 5 amps @ 12 volts.
David
>--> RV8-List message posted by: Kevin Horton
>
>I am temporarily unsure of the position of the documentation that
>came with my Airflow Performance electric fuel pump. I need to know
>how many amps the pump draws so I can sort out wire size, fuse size,
>relay rating, etc.
>
David Grebe
RV-8 #80354...North Wales, PA
Starting Finishing Kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie and Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings |
(was Re:
RV-List: Test Flight Data))
Frank Marlowe wrote:
>
>
> Hi,
> I'm not a physics grad or an aviation expert, but from what I learned
in
> school I would expect once the engine shut down, that the "engine/prop"
> system would find it's least energetic level ("windmilling" i.e. if the
> least energetic (with regard to air resistance) situation for the prop was
> to be static then it would find that position instead of windmilling).
> I have trouble believing a windmilling prop would have the equivalent
drag
> of a flat stationary disk the diameter of the prop. That would probably be
> more drag than dropping the flaps (considering total square inches and angle
> of disk to direction of flight).
> Also, if there is any chance the engine will start back up, you won't
find
> out without windmilling or hitting the starter. And finally, I have no idea
> what the difference between "windmill stop speed" and "stall speed" on my
> aircraft is. I would consider it a risky proposition to try and find out.
> These are just my opinions, I don't have hard facts to back them up. However
> if anyone out there has real data and explanations, I would love to hear it.
>
> Frank Marlowe
>
snipped
I share your lack of credentials, but maybe I can shed some
light on the drag issue anyway. My favorite analogy is the
autogyro or gyroplane. consider that 'drag' on the rotor
supplies the energy to create the thrust holding the gyro in
the air. If you stop the drag of the spinning rotor, guess
what happens.
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Aronson <aronsond(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Airflow Perf fuel pump amperage? |
Kevin:
On page A1 it says:
"This pump package will draw 5 amps at 12 VDC. The pump should be protected
by a 7 to 10 amp circuit breaker. Electrical wiring to the pump should be a
minimum of 16 guage stranded wire."
This was a 2000 version of the pump and I know of no updates to this
information. Hope it helps
Dave Aronson
RV4 N504RV
Wiring the beast
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kevin Horton" <khorto1537(at)rogers.com>
Subject: RV-List: Airflow Perf fuel pump amperage?
>
> I am temporarily unsure of the position of the documentation that
> came with my Airflow Performance electric fuel pump. I need to know
> how many amps the pump draws so I can sort out wire size, fuse size,
> relay rating, etc.
>
> Thanks,
>
> --
> Kevin Horton RV-8 (installing engine & electrics)
> Ottawa, Canada
> http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
> http://eccentrix.com/misc/rv8/rv8.html
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gert <gert(at)execpc.com> |
rv-list
| Subject: | possible spam/virus |
has anybody on the list received email from
jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net
with the only thing showing at little immage a few pixels square??
I received several lately, just thought the sending address, which seems
to be bogus, appears to have fly rv in it.........
None of these came for either RV list !!!!!
Gert
--
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "mike" <msutto(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: possible spam/virus |
This afternoon I received a message from an "Angel Torres" which had a virus
attached to it. Norton caught it but as far as
which list it came from....Matronics vs RV8 list, I don't know. It
quarentined it and sure enough....this one was REAL. Just a
heads up....the actual execute file was put on the hardrive automatically
without me opening the message.
----- Original Message -----
From: "gert" <gert(at)execpc.com>
Subject: RV-List: possible spam/virus
>
> has anybody on the list received email from
>
> jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net
>
>
> with the only thing showing at little immage a few pixels square??
>
> I received several lately, just thought the sending address, which seems
> to be bogus, appears to have fly rv in it.........
>
> None of these came for either RV list !!!!!
>
> Gert
> --
> is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard V. Reynolds" <rvreynolds(at)macs.net> |
Does any one have a current email/phone number for Jim Cone?
Richard Reynolds
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dana Overall" <bo124rs(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings |
(was Re: RV-List: Test Flight Data))
I can't give RV testimony as my emp. is sitting in my office at this time
but I can relate Bonanza related facts. When I was doing my commercial
training we played around a lot in that "best glide" envelope. Now I'll
give you that the prop was not windmilling,as we didn't want to make the
examples that real, simply had the power back. The difference was amazing
at how far down you had to have to nose to achieve best glide with the prop
full or nearly flat. During this exercise,I could ease out on the prop and
there was a point where the airplane felt like it tried to slide out from
under me. Substantial difference when you eased the prop back in (felt like
instant speed brake) to start your powerup.
Dana Overall
Richmond, KY
http://rvflying.tripod.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jakent(at)unison.ie |
| Subject: | Oddball Idea of the day / Canopy / Rivnuts |
I am getting to the stage where I have to attach the canopy to the frame of my
RV-4. I like the idea of rivnuts, but want to avoid the countersunk variety to
preserve the pull-out strength. I am not overly fond of the idea of the flat
head rivnuts which leave the perspex supported only on the rivnut heads.
Soooooo..... Inspiration!!
How about the following:
1: find where the canopy touches the tubular frame.
2: drill pilot holes perpendicularly straight through the
tube along this line.
3: use the holes to mark/drill the perspex.
4: open the holes out enough to take the screws.
5: open the holes on the inside to take the rivnuts.
6: instal the rivnuts on the inside
7: use slightly longer screws(only if necessary)
This method would allow the perspex to be supported all along the length of the
frame tube, and avoid any pull-out worries. I plan to use keyed rivnuts to avoid
any tendency for them to work loose and spin in case I ever have to disassemble
the canopy.
Has anyone already tried this method? Any comments? BTW thanks to Laird for the
reply about the MAC trim indicator.
Thanks .... John Kent (Ireland)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | philip condon <pcondon(at)mitre.org> |
| Subject: | Pattern speeds, approach speeds, landing speeds |
Flight training Mike Seager RV speeds flight testing Pattern speeds,
approach speeds, landing speeds
(repost with keywords in title for easier e-searching with the archive
search option)
From: "David Carter" <dcarter(at)datarecall.net>
Subject: Final approach speed and landings (was Re: RV-List: Test Flight
Data)
Bill, and others,
The basic rule for calculating final approach speed is 1.3 X Vstall
(CAS),
and adjust CAS to get IAS.
- If the RV-6 stalls at 50 mph CAS at a given wt, then final would
be
flown at 50+15=65 IAS.
I had 1.3 hours dual with Mike in Oregon. He taught me to fly 80 MPH(?)
patterns, with basic philosophy which I like, that one should be able to
glide to a safe on-field landing if engine quits in the pattern or on
final.
- Rationale was that the RV-6 has a low aspect ratio wing and has a
higher sink rate below 80. I'm not sure he worded it exactly that way,
but
that was the implication.
Has anyone flight tested to find the "best glide speed" for an RV-6,
i.e,
most fwd distance traveled per feet of altitude lost, at some given
weight?
If it is less than 80 mph or kias, then that would seem to be a good
pattern
speed for idle pattern & landing and should replace the "80 IAS is
better if
the engine quits" thing.
Looking at the performance curves in the Van's "Info Pack" (next to last
page in my copy), the "Power Required Curve" for RV-6 shows minimum
brake
horsepower required for level flt to occur at 80 to 85 mph (pretty flat
in
that area), which may be the source of Mike's choice of 80 as a good
power
off glide speed - makes sense to me.
- It looks like 65 would definitely be "flying on the back side of
the
power curve", not best for gliding.
- In that info pack, there is a "Descent Rate (Idle Power)" curve
for
the RV-3 but not the RV-6. That is what I'd like to see.
So, if all research and flight testing shows that 80 IAS really is a
good
"nominal" value for final approach, then the issue of "floating" seems
to
boil down to: A normal practice of gliding in on final at 80 IAS . . .
aiming at the very end of the runway . . . (with due consideration of
wind
down the runway & obstacles) - or some point a little short of the end.
This point would be such as to result in a touchdown at a safe distance
down
the runway - a conscious choice of where you personally choose to safely
touchdown day after day in regular proficiency flying and preparing for
the
day when you have to do it "for real" with an engine failure - in which
case
you'd probably aim "that distance short" of a point 1/3 down the runway
instead of trying to make a "spot landing" near the end.
David Carter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill VonDane" <n8wv(at)earthlink.net>
; "rv-list"
Subject: RV-List: Test Flight Data
> Hi All...
>
> I did some more flyig this morning,
I then descended to the pattern for some T&G's... I made a total of 5
landings and taxied back... The plane will float for a long time if I
come
in at 80 mph on final... Next time out I will try some 70 - 75 mph
final
approaches...
>
>
> -Bill VonDane, Colorado Springs, CO
> RV-8A - N8WV
> http://vondane.com/rv8a/
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Flight Data)
| From: | Denis Walsh <deniswalsh(at)earthlink.net> |
I am strongly opinionated that it is better to take off with 10 degrees,
(1/4) flap for all take offs.
DLW
> From: "Eric Newton" <enewton57(at)cableone.net>
> Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Sun, 12 May 2002 19:55:11 -0500
> To:
> Subject: Re: Final approach speed and landings (was Re: RV-List: Test
> Flight Data)
>
>
> Nels,
> Do you use any flaps for your short field takeoff?
> Thanks,
> Eric
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
Data)
Denis Walsh wrote:
>
>
> I am strongly opinionated that it is better to take off with 10 degrees,
> (1/4) flap for all take offs.
>
> DLW
Why?
Inquiring minds............ :-)
Sam Buchanan (RV-6)
"The RV Journal" http://thervjournal.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Oddball Idea of the day / Canopy / Rivnuts |
I suppose using the rivnuts backwards is o.k. BUT! I have never liked
rivnuts even when used as designed. They are very light duty with a very
soft aluminum that galls and then will spin despite the key which will
shear. They might be o.k. for light duty but you are going to use them for
structure.
Further one of the assets is that if you tighten the screw, they tend to
tighten them selves in the hole. If you install backwards they will tend to
loosen. When you go back to tighten, you will undo the upset even more. Of
course, one doesn't have to upset the rivnut at all as the head is exposed
and the key might keep it from rotating. The upset just makes it a little
more convenient.
Some builder's have used regular nuts on the inside.Remember that the
plastic expands and contracts a lot more than the frame so you need to make
the holes in the plastic over size and NOT over tighten the screws. Make
sure that you lightly chamfer the edge of the hole on both sides. The
plastic is very notch sensitive and will crack at any rough edge, even at a
drilled hole.
Another trick to minimize stress risers is to lightly apply a coat of
plastic solvent to "solvent polish" the inside of each hole. Use a Q-tip
and be careful as too much solvent can run down and ruin the smooth optics
of the canopy.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: <jakent(at)unison.ie>
Subject: RV-List: Oddball Idea of the day / Canopy / Rivnuts
I am getting to the stage where I have to attach the canopy to the frame of
my RV-4. I like the idea of rivnuts, but want to avoid the countersunk
variety to preserve the pull-out strength. I am not overly fond of the idea
of the flat head rivnuts which leave the perspex supported only on the
rivnut heads.
Soooooo..... Inspiration!!
How about the following:
1: find where the canopy touches the tubular frame.
2: drill pilot holes perpendicularly straight through the
tube along this line.
3: use the holes to mark/drill the perspex.
4: open the holes out enough to take the screws.
5: open the holes on the inside to take the rivnuts.
6: instal the rivnuts on the inside
7: use slightly longer screws(only if necessary)
This method would allow the perspex to be supported all along the length of
the frame tube, and avoid any pull-out worries. I plan to use keyed rivnuts
to avoid any tendency for them to work loose and spin in case I ever have to
disassemble the canopy.
Has anyone already tried this method? Any comments? BTW thanks to Laird for
the reply about the MAC trim indicator.
Thanks .... John Kent (Ireland)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RVer273sb(at)aol.com |
Data)
As for best glide speeds, I follow what I learned flying
sailplanes. That is flying the variometer (rate of climb)
for the exhisting conditions. That is to fly whatever speed
that gives you the least rate of sink for exhisting atmospheric
and other conditions. Flying faster thru sinking air gives a lower
net loss for distance traveled.
Syewart RV4 273SB
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | New Warnke prop concerns |
You wrote:
>A good friend of mine (not on the RV list) just received and installed a
>new Warnke wood prop on his O-320 powered RV6. He has serious concerns
>on the relatively low RPM results he is getting so far. He would like to
>get some input from those of you who may have information to offer.
>These are some numbers he is getting with the new prop.
>Initial climb out...(sea level)...2270 RPM & 28" M.P.
>Low altitude cruise...2300 RPM & 25" M.P.
>Full throttle @ 3000'....2520 RPM & 27" M.P
I'd check first for full throttle at 8000ft. If the prop is pitched for
cruise, it should give
close to 2700 rpm at that altitude.
I'd check the tachometer next to make sure it's accurate. The manifold
pressure looks
reasonable. If it reads atmospheric pressure when the engine is not running,
it's probably ok.
Are wheel pants and fairings installed? If not, the extra drag might cause
the problem.
This would leave the possibility of either wrong propeller pitch or engine
not making enough
power. If the engine was performing ok with its previous prop, then the
engine is probably
ok.
Last possibility is wrong propellor pitch. You would have to discuss that
with the propellor
manufacturer.
Dan Morrow
RV8A - building empenage slowly
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Merced/ Bakersfield |
In a message dated 5/10/2002 9:59:45 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
owens(at)aerovironment.com writes:
> RV-List message posted by: Laird Owens
>
> Lunch is still on at Bakersfield, 6/1. Catered this year by Outback.
>
> See you there.
>
> Laird
>
You and Springer try to hook up with the Meangreen Pilot when your there.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rob Prior <rv7(at)b4.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings (was Re: |
RV-List: Test Flight Data))
Frank Marlowe wrote:
> I'm not a physics grad or an aviation expert, but from what I learned
in
> school I would expect once the engine shut down, that the "engine/prop"
> system would find it's least energetic level ("windmilling" i.e. if the
> least energetic (with regard to air resistance) situation for the prop was
> to be static then it would find that position instead of windmilling).
It's not intuitive, is it? Nobody in our aerodynamics class thought so
either, and three of us were pilots. The math gets involved, but an
easy demo may suffice... If you have one handy, take one of the balsa
wood stick airplanes from your kid's toyroom, and remove the rubber band
from the propeller. Toss it hard enough to get it to glide with the
propeller spinning, and watch how fast it comes down. Then fix the prop
so it won't rotate and toss it again. It'll glide a fair bit better now.
> I have trouble believing a windmilling prop would have the equivalent
drag
> of a flat stationary disk the diameter of the prop. That would probably be
> more drag than dropping the flaps (considering total square inches and angle
> of disk to direction of flight).
This, too, wasn't intuitive, but the theory says it's about equal.
(someone else replied and said they thought it would be a little less
than equal, and he's actually right, it's about 90% of the drag of a
flat disk, in theory). In practise though, there are usually other
losses (interaction effects with fuselage, etc.) that may actually raise it.
> Also, if there is any chance the engine will start back up, you won't
find
> out without windmilling or hitting the starter.
I would presume that you would try to restart first, and when that
possiblity is exhausted in your mind, you'd want best glide to your
point of soft landing.
> And finally, I have no idea
> what the difference between "windmill stop speed" and "stall speed" on my
> aircraft is. I would consider it a risky proposition to try and find out.
I know from experience that with a Lycoming O-235 and a wooden prop, it
stops windmilling almost instantly at about 75mph indicated on the
wooden homebuilt I fly. On a Cessna 152 Aerobat, with a metal prop (not
sure what engine it had now) the prop will stop windmilling at about
65mph indicated, but you have to hold it there for a few seconds while
it loses inertia.
> These are just my opinions, I don't have hard facts to back them up. However
> if anyone out there has real data and explanations, I would love to hear it.
As before, I've never had to try this in an actual emergency, nor have I
done any practical testing to confirm the increase in range by stopping
the prop. But all the theory seems to indicate that I might be better
off (and hey, I might save my prop... 8-).
> Frank Marlowe
-RB4
rv7 "at" b4.ca
RV-7 Empennage
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing lubrication? |
| From: | Bbbb Green <rvinfo(at)juno.com> |
I use white grease for this. It comes in an aerosol can and seems to
penetrate well and then turn into grease. I was told that oil type
lubricants (wd-40 specifically) just wash out what grease is left.
writes:
>
> LPS-1, LPS-2, or LPS-3? Each is quite different. Concensus from
> other
> builders seem to point to LPS-2, although it seems anything handy
> would
> work. Still, I'd like to use the optimum lubricant and at this point
> it
> sounds like LPS-2 is probably best suited. Any dissenting opinions?
>
> Randy Lervold
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dana Overall" <bo124rs(at)hotmail.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Rod end bearing lubrication?
>
>
>
> >
> > Randy,
> >
> > I don't believe you have received much comment on this publically
> but we
> use
> > LPS on the Bonanza on a regular basis. Seems to work quite well.
> >
> > Dana Overall
> > Richmond, KY
> > http://rvflying.tripod.com
> >
> > >From: "Randy Lervold" <randy@rv-8.com>
> > >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > >To: ,
> > >Subject: RV-List: Rod end bearing lubrication?
> > >Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 15:31:03 -0700
> > >
> > >
> > >As I dive into my first yearly Condition Inspection I'd like to
> know if
> > >those who have gone before recommend lubricating all the rod end
> bearings
> > >in
> > >any way. LPS-2? Boeshield? WD-40? Nothing at all? This would be a
> good
> one
> > >for the archives also.
> > >
> > >Thanks,
> > >Randy Lervold
> > >RV-8 #80500, 154 hrs
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> messages.
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DJ & LM Tennant" <dltenno(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | RV 6 tail weight |
hi
I am trying to get an idea of how my RV6 balances so i can position items to
maintanin the best balance.
can anyone tell me how much weight is on the tailwheel when the plane is
level ( 0320,wood prop no fuel)
naturally i will get a full weight and balance done when the plane is
finished i just want an idea at this stage so if i need to i can change the
position of the battery or other components to improve the balance. I think
i will be tail heavy just worried about how much.
Dave Tennant
RV 6 final fit out
dltenno(at)hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings |
(was Re: RV-List: Test Flight Data))
> Anyone who has any doubt should get in a plane with a constant speed prop,
> bring the engine to idle at best glide speed then pull the prop governor
all the
> way back and note the speed increase with the engine still at full idle.
It will
> be like taking your foot off the brakes going down hill.
I've been feeling guilty about not completing some of the tests I had
orignally planned for my test period, and a derivative of this was on the
list. Because another builder has tentatively asked me to do his first
flight, and because I have never done a dead-stick landing in my RV-8, I
plan to complete the following test soon: go to altitude, trim for 85 (best
glide, or close thereto) and record the rate of descent at engine idle both
fine and course pitch, and then pull the nose up, shut off the engine, and
measure the VSI again at 85 with the prop stopped. That will give me three
different VSIs at the same airspeed and should be invaluable data. Yes, this
will be done directly over an airport at 6-8k feet. I'm still contemplating
whether or not I should dead-stick it all the way in as practice for a real
live engine out.
I know, deliberately shutting off a perfectly running engine may sound
questionable. But it has been running great for over 150 hours how, and I
would ONLY do it directly above the airport. Frankly, I think the data
gained from this drill would be worth the small incremental risk. Oh, and I
would only do this solo.
I'll post the results in a few weeks when I get time to do the test.
Randy Lervold
RV-8, N558RL
www.rv-8.com
Home Wing VAF
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Crosley, Rich" <RCROSLEY(at)HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM> |
| Subject: | RV-8 Front Baggage Door |
Has any one got a clever way to get the baggage door on an "8" to fit well
or are the Van's instructions sufficient?
Rich Crosley
RV-8 fuselage
Palmdale, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV 6 tail weight |
In a message dated 5/13/02 4:38:01 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
dltenno(at)hotmail.com writes:
<< hi
I am trying to get an idea of how my RV6 balances so i can position items to
maintanin the best balance.
can anyone tell me how much weight is on the tailwheel when the plane is
level ( 0320,wood prop no fuel)
naturally i will get a full weight and balance done when the plane is
finished i just want an idea at this stage so if i need to i can change the
position of the battery or other components to improve the balance. I think
i will be tail heavy just worried about how much.
Dave Tennant
RV 6 final fit out
dltenno(at)hotmail.com >>
Mine had/has 68 pounds in that configuation. Total weight is 1040 lb.
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings |
(was Re: RV-List: Test Flight Data))
Randy,
I would encourage you to do this test but to also include fine and coarse
pitch with the ignition off and the prop windmilling. I asked for
comparative numbers after my accident but no one volunteered them. I can
tell you that my prop continued to windmill at 80mph in fine pitch and I
dropped like a stone. It would be nice to know what you can gain by pulling
the prop back to coarse pitch in an engine out. It might provide someone
else an option if they lose it at low altitude.
Regards,
Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
RV-6 N6GY ...project Phoenix
Navion N5221K
>
> > Anyone who has any doubt should get in a plane with a
> constant speed prop,
> > bring the engine to idle at best glide speed then pull the
> prop governor
> all the
> > way back and note the speed increase with the engine still
> at full idle.
> It will
> > be like taking your foot off the brakes going down hill.
>
> I've been feeling guilty about not completing some of the tests I had
> orignally planned for my test period, and a derivative of
> this was on the
> list. Because another builder has tentatively asked me to do his first
> flight, and because I have never done a dead-stick landing in
> my RV-8, I
> plan to complete the following test soon: go to altitude,
> trim for 85 (best
> glide, or close thereto) and record the rate of descent at
> engine idle both
> fine and course pitch, and then pull the nose up, shut off
> the engine, and
> measure the VSI again at 85 with the prop stopped. That will
> give me three
> different VSIs at the same airspeed and should be invaluable
> data. Yes, this
> will be done directly over an airport at 6-8k feet. I'm still
> contemplating
> whether or not I should dead-stick it all the way in as
> practice for a real
> live engine out.
>
> I know, deliberately shutting off a perfectly running engine may sound
> questionable. But it has been running great for over 150
> hours how, and I
> would ONLY do it directly above the airport. Frankly, I think the data
> gained from this drill would be worth the small incremental
> risk. Oh, and I
> would only do this solo.
>
> I'll post the results in a few weeks when I get time to do the test.
>
> Randy Lervold
> RV-8, N558RL
> www.rv-8.com
> Home Wing VAF
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <fasching(at)amigo.net> |
| Subject: | M-20 Air/Oil Separator |
I said a while back that I would fill my Lycoming O-320 to a full 8-quarts
of oil upon the next oil change and see if the advertised ability of the
M-20 separator to keep the oil in the engine, and not on the belly of the
plane, was true.
I did so. The M-20 does as claimed; no oil on the belly even with the full
8-quarts. I was interested in the full 8-quart fill up to verify if the
added oil volume does indeed aid in engine cooling (seems it should) and I
also noted that Sky Ranch Engineering said that it should also improve
lubrication - hard to prove one way or the other; Lycoming says even as low
as 2-quarts is "OK."
Anyway, the M-20 does keep the oil in the plane's engine, rather than on the
belly.
FWIW John at Salida, CO
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Front Baggage Door |
>
>Has any one got a clever way to get the baggage door on an "8" to fit well
>or are the Van's instructions sufficient?
>
>
>Rich Crosley
>RV-8 fuselage
>Palmdale, CA
A couple of techniques that have been utilized:
Tape the clecoed door assembly in place into the fuselage and use structural
epoxy to glue the thing together, then rivet it after it cures on the bench.
(MUCH easier than riveting it from the inside, on your back, in the dark.)
Or, make an entirely new door from carbon fiber, if you're really feeling
adventurous.
Van's procedure is OK, but certainly not the only way to do it. If you find
a technique that works better for you, then go for it. I kinda like the
epoxy idea. Whatever you do, you MUST also install a hold-open device, as
pictured on Randy's website. Jeff Ludwig first came up with it, and it can
save your door from being mangled from a stiff gust on the ramp. It's the
best $2 you'll ever spend on your RV.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
283 hrs.
baggage door fits so-so, but shoulda spent more time on it. Ah ta heck with
it...plane flies great anyway.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Cimino" <jcimino(at)echoes.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Front Baggage Door |
I followed the instruction, but I shrunk down the edge by the latch and then
filled the marks from the shirker.
Jim
Jim Cimino
RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL 50+ Hrs.
http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo/
(570)842-4057
----- Original Message -----
From: "Crosley, Rich" <RCROSLEY(at)HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
Subject: RV-List: RV-8 Front Baggage Door
>
> Has any one got a clever way to get the baggage door on an "8" to fit well
> or are the Van's instructions sufficient?
>
>
> Rich Crosley
> RV-8 fuselage
> Palmdale, CA
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings |
(was Re: RV-List: Test Flight Data))
>
>I've been feeling guilty about not completing some of the tests I had
>orignally planned for my test period, and a derivative of this was on the
>list. Because another builder has tentatively asked me to do his first
>flight, and because I have never done a dead-stick landing in my RV-8, I
>plan to complete the following test soon: go to altitude, trim for 85 (best
>glide, or close thereto) and record the rate of descent at engine idle both
>fine and course pitch, and then pull the nose up, shut off the engine, and
>measure the VSI again at 85 with the prop stopped. That will give me three
>different VSIs at the same airspeed and should be invaluable data. Yes,
>this
>will be done directly over an airport at 6-8k feet. I'm still contemplating
>whether or not I should dead-stick it all the way in as practice for a real
>live engine out.
>
My dead stick experience (check the archives folks) showed me that a metal
fixed pitch prop won't do much of anything to descent rate or airspeed once
it stops turning. My engine was barely sputtering for what seemed like an
eternity, then it finally stopped completely on final. The plane didn't do
anything strange once I saw that blade standing straight up in front of me.
Yeah, it got my attention for sure.
Practice this kind of emergency overhead a not-busy airport, self announce
your intentions during the process, and make sure you know how to slip the
airplane to bleed off excess altitude without gaining speed. Slipping is
pretty much my standard approach profile anyway, as I try to come in high
around base just in case the mill quits and the headwind picks up. One
thing I really hate doing is dragging it in with power in a flat, airliner
type of approach.
My final approach speed is typically 70-75mph indicated. 80mph is too fast,
and burns up too much runway. Dropping even one MPH below 70mph
dramatically increases the descent rate. It still has enough lift energy
for the flare, but man you gotta have great timing to avoid arriving in a
controlled crash. It's easy to whack the tailwheel down first if you're not
extra careful.
I've also felt a bit guilty for not doing more emergency procedure practice
on a regular basis. I found that when the heat is on, and you HAVE to get
it right....you'll do so...as long as you've practiced it a few times and
know your airplane. My pooped out engine experience started at about
10,000' MSL and ended on the runway at a field elevation of about 6,500'
MSL. I had some time to think it over that's for sure. Bottom line: trim
it for best glide, FLY THE PLANE, watch the wind sock for wind speed and
trends, and FLY THE DAMN PLANE! We're all just flying gliders with the
luxury of having an engine attached.
I'm done.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
283 hrs.
One deadstick landing.
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Hall" <robjhall(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV 6 tail weight |
> can anyone tell me how much weight is on the tailwheel when the plane is
> level ( 0320,wood prop no fuel)
65 lbs at 1019 lbs empty wt on mine
Bob Hall,
Colorado Springs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Scott <rscott(at)cascadeaccess.com> |
| Subject: | Corrosion from bird poop |
OK, so I find a buy on a started tail section that I can't pass up, even
though I am not ready to start work yet. So I hang the completed
horizontal stab in my hangar. Months later I notice there is a
considerable amount of bird poop on the H.S. (Birds have not been pooping
on my plane, 6 ft. away.) Cleaning the poop off with water gets most of it
off, but not all and there is a little corrosion.
So, Scotch Brite to clean off the rest of the poop & corrosion a good plan?
I am still not ready to spray yet. I have some 2 part primer I intend to
use, but no place to spray. Is there a good way to prevent further
corrosion from the elements? Boeshield? Something else? If I spray
Boeshield, can I get it off when it comes time to prime?
Thanks.
Dick Scott
RV-6A, to be 7A.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dana Overall" <bo124rs(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings |
(was Re: RV-List: Test Flight Data))
I send a message on this earlier but never saw it so I must have one hanging
out there in cyberspace.
When I was doing my commercial training my Bonanza, the difference in nose
down attitude is remarkable with the prop in fine pitch and course pitch.
Best glide speed with the prop fine is like coming down without a chute.
You are looking straight down. At this point ease the prop control back but
be ready to pull the nose up, you will feel like someone pulled a rug out
from under you. Let's put it this way, the VSI is pegged going down to
maintain best glide speed at fine pitch. Wherever the engine stops, look
straight down because that is where you are landing with fine pitch. At
power up, ease the control in but be ready to put the nose down to keep the
speed and...add the fuel.
Dana Overall
Richmond, KY
http://rvflying.tripod.com
> >
> > I would encourage you to do this test but to also include fine and
>coarse
> > pitch with the ignition off and the prop windmilling. I asked for
> > comparative numbers after my accident but no one volunteered them. I can
> > tell you that my prop continued to windmill at 80mph in fine pitch and I
> > dropped like a stone. It would be nice to know what you can gain by
>pulling
> > the prop back to coarse pitch in an engine out. It might provide someone
> > else an option if they lose it at low altitude.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
> > RV-6 N6GY ...project Phoenix
> > Navion N5221K
> >
> >
> > >
> > > > Anyone who has any doubt should get in a plane with a
> > > constant speed prop,
> > > > bring the engine to idle at best glide speed then pull the
> > > prop governor
> > > all the
> > > > way back and note the speed increase with the engine still
> > > at full idle.
> > > It will
> > > > be like taking your foot off the brakes going down hill.
> > >
> > > I've been feeling guilty about not completing some of the tests I had
> > > orignally planned for my test period, and a derivative of
> > > this was on the
> > > list. Because another builder has tentatively asked me to do his first
> > > flight, and because I have never done a dead-stick landing in
> > > my RV-8, I
> > > plan to complete the following test soon: go to altitude,
> > > trim for 85 (best
> > > glide, or close thereto) and record the rate of descent at
> > > engine idle both
> > > fine and course pitch, and then pull the nose up, shut off
> > > the engine, and
> > > measure the VSI again at 85 with the prop stopped. That will
> > > give me three
> > > different VSIs at the same airspeed and should be invaluable
> > > data. Yes, this
> > > will be done directly over an airport at 6-8k feet. I'm still
> > > contemplating
> > > whether or not I should dead-stick it all the way in as
> > > practice for a real
> > > live engine out.
> > >
> > > I know, deliberately shutting off a perfectly running engine may sound
> > > questionable. But it has been running great for over 150
> > > hours how, and I
> > > would ONLY do it directly above the airport. Frankly, I think the data
> > > gained from this drill would be worth the small incremental
> > > risk. Oh, and I
> > > would only do this solo.
> > >
> > > I'll post the results in a few weeks when I get time to do the test.
> > >
> > > Randy Lervold
> > > RV-8, N558RL
> > > www.rv-8.com
> > > Home Wing VAF
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New Warnke prop concerns |
I didn't have a Warnke, but I had RPM issues even though MAP was ok. The
problem was airbox leaks. When I sealed it up, the RPM's came up.
Paul Besing
RV-6A (Sold)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <DanFM01(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: New Warnke prop concerns
>
> You wrote:
>
> >A good friend of mine (not on the RV list) just received and installed a
> >new Warnke wood prop on his O-320 powered RV6. He has serious concerns
> >on the relatively low RPM results he is getting so far. He would like to
> >get some input from those of you who may have information to offer.
> >These are some numbers he is getting with the new prop.
>
> >Initial climb out...(sea level)...2270 RPM & 28" M.P.
> >Low altitude cruise...2300 RPM & 25" M.P.
> >Full throttle @ 3000'....2520 RPM & 27" M.P
>
> I'd check first for full throttle at 8000ft. If the prop is pitched for
> cruise, it should give
> close to 2700 rpm at that altitude.
>
> I'd check the tachometer next to make sure it's accurate. The manifold
> pressure looks
> reasonable. If it reads atmospheric pressure when the engine is not
running,
> it's probably ok.
> Are wheel pants and fairings installed? If not, the extra drag might
cause
> the problem.
>
> This would leave the possibility of either wrong propeller pitch or engine
> not making enough
> power. If the engine was performing ok with its previous prop, then the
> engine is probably
> ok.
>
> Last possibility is wrong propellor pitch. You would have to discuss
that
> with the propellor
> manufacturer.
>
> Dan Morrow
> RV8A - building empenage slowly
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry & Karen Gooding <GOODING(at)hargray.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flying Spouse |
>1) Will she have the guts to stick through the private pilot program?<
Oh, please. Women put up with more aggrivation that that just getting
their kids registered for preschool. You're scared she's going to solo
earlier than you did and blow your written score away. Prepare yourself
now, pal, chances are good both events will come true.
>2) What happens when she gets lost the first time and freaks out?<
SHE will be capable of landing and asking directions!
>3) What if she hates flying after getting a taste of it?<
What if you hate having her in control, you mean? You'll be fine with it,
trust me. Just don't get between her and the Fly Mart at Sun n Fun. And -
brace yourself for this one - she may decide she wants her own durn plane.
Karen Gooding
PA-17 J-3s
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings |
(...
In a message dated 5/13/02 7:34:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
akroguy(at)hotmail.com writes:
<< My final approach speed is typically 70-75mph indicated. 80mph is too
fast,
and burns up too much runway. Dropping even one MPH below 70mph
dramatically increases the descent rate. It still has enough lift energy
for the flare, but man you gotta have great timing to avoid arriving in a
controlled crash. It's easy to whack the tailwheel down first if you're not
extra careful. >>
Of course all of these discussions revolve around the Pitot/static system in
each individual airplane. My ASI is optimistic above 100 knots, and may be
pessimistic below 60 knots. All I can say is that I tend to fly a 70 knot
final (80 mph), and decelerate once I've "made the field". I usually end up
in ground effect at 60 knots indicated, and at that speed and light weight,
my airplane floats forever. I do have a bunch of pitch on the prop, but it
idles at 700 rpm, so I'm not getting a huge amount of thrust. Of course,
with the 23 series airfoil, once the floating is over, it comes down fairly
quickly. I'm a bit busy about then, and have no idea what the indicated
airspeed is... ;-)
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Blake Harral" <bharral(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Miami area RV'ers - Engine Inspection Help |
Any RV'ers close to the Miami Area?
Someone is offering an engine core for sale in the Miami Area.
This engine is an Continental IO-470L and not suited for RV's
I'm a long way away in Phoenix. Wonder if anybody would like to have
expenses
covered to fly their RV somewhere near the Miami International Airport and
have a look at this engine for me.
I am interested in a quick visual inspection only. Basically, I want to
know if
it looks like it has been crashed or in the water. Don't need compression
checks
or Crankshaft runout measurements. If the engine appears suitable, I might
request
some assistance in arranging shipment to AZ - I would be willing to pay a
reasonable
fee for that assistance.
I don't personally know the seller, so I don't want to send anybody anywhere
that
is not a public place of business.
Please contact me off list if interested at bharral(at)cox.net
Thanks,
Blake Harral RV-4 N72RV 460 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Canopy Rivnuts |
In a message dated 5/13/2002 7:28:49 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
cgalley(at)qcbc.org writes:
> I suppose using the rivnuts backwards is o.k. BUT! I have never liked
> rivnuts even when used as designed. They are very light duty with a very
> soft aluminum that galls and then will spin despite the key which will
> shear. They might be o.k. for light duty but you are going to use them for
> structure.
I'm inclined to second this. However, there is a solution. Use steel
Rivnuts in lieu of aluminum. Find a source in your area that sells them
(they were made by BF Goodrich but have been acquired by Bollhoff in
Germany). Cardinal Components in WI is just one stocking distributor. Just
punch "Rivnut" into your favorite search engine and you will find all kinds
of sources for these. One of the cheap nutsert installation mandrels
available at your nearest OSH hardware store could be used for installing the
few that you will need but proper installation tools make the job easier
(especially when using the steel ones). I also prefer using the keyed type,
as they won't rotate during service.
-GV (N1GV)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steve Prull <sprull(at)bendcable.com> |
| Subject: | Empennage kit for sale |
My completed RV8 empennage kit is for sale once again. I thought I had
it sold to a gentleman in California, but he backed out ( remodeling the
kitchen won!). The kit is complete except for the attachment of the
fiberglass tips. Excellent workmanship, checked early on by A&P with
favorable feedback. Primed internally. My son needs to paint his car -
really need to sell it this time! $1000 OBO. Located in Bend,
Oregon. Have lots of digital pics.
Steve Prull
541-383-8277
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "kevin lane" <n3773(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Miami area RV'ers - Engine Inspection Help |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Blake Harral" <bharral(at)cox.net>
Subject: RV-List: Miami area RV'ers - Engine Inspection Help
>
> Any RV'ers close to the Miami Area?
>
> Someone is offering an engine core for sale in the Miami Area.
> This engine is an Continental IO-470L and not suited for RV's
>
> I'm a long way away in Phoenix. Wonder if anybody would like to have
> expenses
> covered to fly their RV somewhere near the Miami International Airport and
> have a look at this engine for me.
>
> I am interested in a quick visual inspection only. Basically, I want to
> know if
> it looks like it has been crashed or in the water. Don't need compression
> checks
> or Crankshaft runout measurements. If the engine appears suitable, I
might
> request
> some assistance in arranging shipment to AZ - I would be willing to pay a
> reasonable
> fee for that assistance.
>
> I don't personally know the seller, so I don't want to send anybody
anywhere
> that
> is not a public place of business.
>
> Please contact me off list if interested at bharral(at)cox.net
>
> Thanks,
> Blake Harral RV-4 N72RV 460 hrs
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ted Lumpkin" <tlump(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | RV-6 Bolt-on Cowl Scoop |
A friend who is building an RV-6 requested that I post this question to the
RV-list.
He is wondering if anyone has modified the RV-6 tri-gear cowl to have a bolt
on air scoop. He is trying to ease the process of installing and removing
the lower cowl for maintenance.
Thanks,
Ted (RV-4)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "kevin lane" <n3773(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6 Bolt-on Cowl Scoop |
change the narrow slot to be a large triangle that encompasses the entire
scoop. This won't show since it is underneath. Prevents scratching the
gear leg fairing. Kevin -6A 800hrs
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Lumpkin" <tlump(at)attbi.com>
Subject: RV-List: RV-6 Bolt-on Cowl Scoop
>
> A friend who is building an RV-6 requested that I post this question to
the
> RV-list.
> He is wondering if anyone has modified the RV-6 tri-gear cowl to have a
bolt
> on air scoop. He is trying to ease the process of installing and removing
> the lower cowl for maintenance.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ted (RV-4)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Oil cooler used for cabin heat |
| From: | Joseph J Hasper <j1j2h3(at)juno.com> |
Does an oil cooler put out enough heat to use for cabin heat? I was
wondering whether I could do this to avoid the danger of CO leaks in a
heat muff.
Jim Hasper - RV-7 builder
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob Hodgson" <bob(at)hodgson252.freeserve.co.uk> |
| Subject: | Re: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings) |
I've tried throttle-closed glides in a TB10 with prop fine and coarse but
couldn't detect much difference; maybe because there is not enough oil
pressure to maintain coarse pitch at idle - or is there a snag on this
particular example ?
I believe aerobatic propellers have counterweights to force them to coarse
pitch if the engine fails - why not ordinary spam props ? Maximising the
glide performance if the engine stops must be first priority for all
aircraft ?
BTW I haven't noticed "Propeller . . . . . select coarse pitch" in
any GA engine failure checklists I've seen - is the oil px issue the reason
?
If we ever get any smooth air over here I'll try some more glides with
coarse pitch selected and various low power settings to find out what rpm /
oil px is needed to coarsen the prop.
Bob H (UK)
RV3B fuselage
------ Original message ------
> I would encourage you to do this test but to also include fine and coarse
> pitch with the ignition off and the prop windmilling. I asked for
> comparative numbers after my accident but no one volunteered them. I can
> tell you that my prop continued to windmill at 80mph in fine pitch and I
> dropped like a stone. It would be nice to know what you can gain by
pulling
> the prop back to coarse pitch in an engine out. It might provide someone
> else an option if they lose it at low altitude.
>
> Regards,
> Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
> RV-6 N6GY ...project Phoenix
> Navion N5221K
>
>
> >
> > > Anyone who has any doubt should get in a plane with a
> > constant speed prop,
> > > bring the engine to idle at best glide speed then pull the
> > prop governor
> > all the
> > > way back and note the speed increase with the engine still
> > at full idle.
> > It will
> > > be like taking your foot off the brakes going down hill.
> When I was doing my commercial training my Bonanza, the difference in nose
> down attitude is remarkable with the prop in fine pitch and course pitch.
> Best glide speed with the prop fine is like coming down without a chute.
> You are looking straight down. At this point ease the prop control back
but
> be ready to pull the nose up, you will feel like someone pulled a rug out
> from under you. Let's put it this way, the VSI is pegged going down to
> maintain best glide speed at fine pitch. Wherever the engine stops, look
> straight down because that is where you are landing with fine pitch. At
> power up, ease the control in but be ready to put the nose down to keep
the
> speed and...add the fuel.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dana Overall" <bo124rs(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings) |
Bob, in my Bonanza the emergency procedure with failed restart is to set
best glide. Best glide procedure includes the step of "full course prop".
With fine pitch...........you come down like a sack of hammers.
Like I said, during my commercial training part of the pre flight briefing
sheet for the examiner was "when you pull the power, give me sufficient time
at the bottom to come in with the prop before power, none of this "in the
dirt" stuff.
Dana Overall
Richmond, KY
http://rvflying.tripod.com
>
>BTW I haven't noticed "Propeller . . . . . select coarse pitch" in
>any GA engine failure checklists I've seen - is the oil px issue the reason
>?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ollie Washburn" <skybolt-aviator(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Best Glide Speed (was Re:Final approach speed and landings |
(was Re: RV-List: Test Flight Data))
Go for it although imho it would be best to restart the eng. Never
know,someone might pull onto runway in front of you.Very tough to go around
with no eng.
Ollie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | philip condon <pcondon(at)mitre.org> |
| Subject: | Re: RPM RPM's Low RPM Airbox Leaks |
RPM RPM's Low RPM Airbox Air Leaks
From: "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: New Warnke prop concerns
I didn't have a Warnke, but I had RPM issues even though MAP was ok.
The
problem was airbox leaks. When I sealed it up, the RPM's came up.
Paul Besing
RV-6A (Sold)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Finn Lassen <finnlassen(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Corrosion from bird poop |
I would recommend alu-prep and aludine.
Finn
Richard Scott wrote:
>
> OK, so I find a buy on a started tail section that I can't pass up, even
> though I am not ready to start work yet. So I hang the completed
> horizontal stab in my hangar. Months later I notice there is a
> considerable amount of bird poop on the H.S. (Birds have not been pooping
> on my plane, 6 ft. away.) Cleaning the poop off with water gets most of it
> off, but not all and there is a little corrosion.
>
> So, Scotch Brite to clean off the rest of the poop & corrosion a good plan?
>
> I am still not ready to spray yet. I have some 2 part primer I intend to
> use, but no place to spray. Is there a good way to prevent further
> corrosion from the elements? Boeshield? Something else? If I spray
> Boeshield, can I get it off when it comes time to prime?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | philip condon <pcondon(at)mitre.org> |
| Subject: | Re: 3 (three) RV accidents |
http://www.faa.gov/avr/aai/M_0513_N.txt
May 13 2002 . I stopped looking afvter I looked at the FIRST record.
Somehow I couldn't look back more then ONE day...... Guys, this is one
days' record of reported mishaps.....
********************************************************************************
** Report created 05/14/2002 Record
3 **
********************************************************************************
IDENTIFICATION
Regis#: 6579B Make/Model: EXP Description: EXP-1991 RV-4
Date: 05/12/2002 Time: 2315
Event Type: Accident Highest Injury: None Mid Air: N Missing:
N
Damage: Destroyed
LOCATION
City: SANTA YNEZ State: CA Country: US
DESCRIPTION
EXPERIMENTAL ACFT LOST CONTROL DURING A GO-AROUND AND CRASHED 50 TO
100
YARDS SOUTH OF RWY 26, THE ACFT WAS DESTROYED, OTHER CIRCUMSTANCES ARE
UNKNOWN, SANTA YNEZ, CA.
INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 0
# Crew: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
# Pass: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
# Grnd: Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
WEATHER: UNKN
OTHER DATA
Activity: Pleasure Phase: Other Operation: General Aviation
Departed: SANTA YNEZ, CA Dep Date: 05/12/2002 Dep.
Time: 2245
Destination: SANTA YNEZ, CA Flt Plan: NONE Wx
Briefing: N
Last Radio Cont: UNKN
Last Clearance: UNKN
FAA FSDO: VAN NUYS, CA (WP01) Entry date: 05/13/2002
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
********************************************************************************
** Report created 05/14/2002 Record
4 **
********************************************************************************
IDENTIFICATION
Regis#: 9136R Make/Model: RV6 Description: EXP 2000 RV6A
Date: 05/11/2002 Time: 1840
Event Type: Accident Highest Injury: Minor Mid Air: N
Missing: N
Damage: Unknown
LOCATION
City: POMONA PARK State: FL Country: US
DESCRIPTION
AIRCRAFT FLIPPED OVER ON LANDING, POMONA PARK, FL
INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 0
# Crew: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 1
Unk:
# Pass: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 1
Unk:
# Grnd: Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
WEATHER: METAR KGNV 111853Z 20011G18KT 10SM CLR 32/17 A3021
OTHER DATA
Activity: Unknown Phase: Landing Operation: General Aviation
Departed: UNKN Dep Date: Dep. Time:
Destination: UNKN Flt Plan: UNK Wx
Briefing: N
Last Radio Cont: NONE
Last Clearance: NONE
FAA FSDO: ORLANDO, FL (SO15) Entry date: 05/13/2002
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
********************************************************************************
** Report created 05/14/2002 Record
1 **
********************************************************************************
IDENTIFICATION
Regis#: 106RJ Make/Model: EXP Description: EXP-1994 RV-6
Date: 05/11/2002 Time: 1810
Event Type: Incident Highest Injury: None Mid Air: N Missing:
N
Damage: Minor
LOCATION
City: PHOENIX State: AZ Country: US
DESCRIPTION
EXPERIMENTAL ACFT LOST POWER ON FINAL APPROACH AND SUBSEQUENTLY
SUSTAINED
MINOR DAMAGE, OTHER CIRCUMSTANCES ARE UNKNOWN, PHOENIX, AZ.
INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 0
# Crew: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
# Pass: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
# Grnd: Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
WEATHER: KDVT 111810Z 23009G15KT 10SM CLR 26/M08 A2981
OTHER DATA
Activity: Pleasure Phase: Approach Operation: General
Aviation
Departed: WILCOX, AZ Dep Date: 05/11/2002 Dep.
Time: 1700
Destination: PHOENIX, AZ Flt Plan: NONE Wx
Briefing: N
Last Radio Cont: 1 MILE FINAL APCH
Last Clearance: CLRD TO LAND
FAA FSDO: SCOTTSDALE, AZ (WP07) Entry date: 05/13/2002
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Knoll" <tripodcat(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oil cooler used for cabin heat |
Hi Joe,
Try the archives. use oil cooler&cabin heat for the search string.
BFK
----- Original Message -----
From: Joseph J Hasper
Subject: RV-List: Oil cooler used for cabin heat
Does an oil cooler put out enough heat to use for cabin heat? I was
wondering whether I could do this to avoid the danger of CO leaks in a
heat muff.
Jim Hasper - RV-7 builder
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Nose down full trim |
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
I took a friend to a neighboring airport 60 miles distant to pick up some
parts. Nice rip over, upon landing I found that my electric trim was
stuck in a full nose down. So after taking off very carefully with a lot
of back pressure the airplane was flown back at 140 MPH took forever and
upon landing I had a very tired arm. (I know it should have been fixed it
before flight.)The plane can been flown but I wouldn't recommend a long
flight or higher speed. (I used 24rpm 17in).
Using a volt meter I get 9 volts on nose down 0 volts on nose up
at the servo. Both controls have the trim installed with a splitter.
Anyone encounter this problem.
PS What I should have done was disconnect the control linkage from the
trim tab turned in the linkage until neutral then reconnected for the
flight home. Oh well.
RV6A
Joe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve J Hurlbut" <sjhdcl(at)kingston.net> |
I've noticed several cockpits that have the Garmin Pilot III mounted
in the dash. It sticks out about 1/4 inch. How are you guys mounting these?
Are you taking the case apart and mounting it over some 0.063 then
screwing it into the panel. I plan on mounting the Garmin GPS II Plus which
is the same size and shape as the Pilot III.
Thankx
Steve Hurlbut
RV-7A
O-360 A1A
Fuselage
http://members.kingston.net/sjhdcl/rv7a.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Mounting GPS |
> I've noticed several cockpits that have the Garmin Pilot III mounted
> in the dash. It sticks out about 1/4 inch. How are you guys mounting
these?
> Are you taking the case apart and mounting it over some 0.063 then
> screwing it into the panel.
Yes. In order to do this though you must trim off some small plastic tabs
one the GPS case to let it rest on the flat aluminum. The .063 plate does
take some time to shape just right. The case lip is very small so the
cut-out must be precise and takes a while to file it out. Also, you will
need to procure some longer screws.
Although I've now removed the Pilot III and installed a 295, a pic of the
Pilot III installation can be seen at...
http://www.rv-8.com/Pictures/Mvc-525x.jpg
BTW, I just love that Pilot III. It does everything you need, has great
operating logic, and provides built-in battery backup.
Randy Lervold
RV-8, N558RL
www.rv-8.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Konrad Werner" <Connywerner(at)wans.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6 Bolt-on Cowl Scoop |
Dear Ted,
There is a RV-6 builder here in the Albuquerque area, who did just that.
Screwed on is the only way to go, mainly for maintenance reasons, he says.
Looks great, and I will build my 6A-Cowling the same way!
Konrad
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Lumpkin" <tlump(at)attbi.com>
Subject: RV-List: RV-6 Bolt-on Cowl Scoop
>
> A friend who is building an RV-6 requested that I post this question to
the
> RV-list.
> He is wondering if anyone has modified the RV-6 tri-gear cowl to have a
bolt
> on air scoop. He is trying to ease the process of installing and removing
> the lower cowl for maintenance.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ted (RV-4)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rob Prior <rv7(at)b4.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Mounting GPS |
I've seen a number of them mounted without modifying the case at all,
into a triangle-shaped "dent" in the panel. Sort of the shape of a
Toblerone chocolate bar, if that means anything to you. Velcro in the
bottom of the hole will retain the GPS quite nicely, and if you set it
up right, you can have all the power, data, and antenna connections
automatically connect/disconnect on insertion/removal.
That's what i'm planning right now for the RV-7 panel, but there's a few
years yet before i'll get to that point... 8-)
-RB4
rv7 "at" b4.ca
RV-7 Empennage
Randy Lervold wrote:
>
>>I've noticed several cockpits that have the Garmin Pilot III mounted
>>in the dash. It sticks out about 1/4 inch. How are you guys mounting
>>
> these?
>
>>Are you taking the case apart and mounting it over some 0.063 then
>>screwing it into the panel.
>>
>
> Yes. In order to do this though you must trim off some small plastic tabs
> one the GPS case to let it rest on the flat aluminum. The .063 plate does
> take some time to shape just right. The case lip is very small so the
> cut-out must be precise and takes a while to file it out. Also, you will
> need to procure some longer screws.
>
> Although I've now removed the Pilot III and installed a 295, a pic of the
> Pilot III installation can be seen at...
> http://www.rv-8.com/Pictures/Mvc-525x.jpg
>
> BTW, I just love that Pilot III. It does everything you need, has great
> operating logic, and provides built-in battery backup.
>
> Randy Lervold
> RV-8, N558RL
> www.rv-8.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <enewton57(at)cableone.net> |
********************************************************************************
** Report created 05/14/2002 Record 1 **
********************************************************************************
IDENTIFICATION
Regis#: 106RJ Make/Model: EXP Description: EXP-1994 RV-6
Date: 05/11/2002 Time: 1810
Event Type: Incident Highest Injury: None Mid Air: N Missing: N
Damage: Minor
LOCATION
City: PHOENIX State: AZ Country: US
DESCRIPTION
EXPERIMENTAL ACFT LOST POWER ON FINAL APPROACH AND SUBSEQUENTLY SUSTAINED
MINOR DAMAGE, OTHER CIRCUMSTANCES ARE UNKNOWN, PHOENIX, AZ.
INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 0
# Crew: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
# Pass: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
# Grnd: Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
WEATHER: KDVT 111810Z 23009G15KT 10SM CLR 26/M08 A2981
OTHER DATA
Activity: Pleasure Phase: Approach Operation: General Aviation
Departed: WILCOX, AZ Dep Date: 05/11/2002 Dep. Time: 1700
Destination: PHOENIX, AZ Flt Plan: NONE Wx Briefing: N
Last Radio Cont: 1 MILE FINAL APCH
Last Clearance: CLRD TO LAND
FAA FSDO: SCOTTSDALE, AZ (WP07) Entry date: 05/13/2002
** Report created 05/14/2002 Record 3 **
********************************************************************************
IDENTIFICATION
Regis#: 6579B Make/Model: EXP Description: EXP-1991 RV-4
Date: 05/12/2002 Time: 2315
Event Type: Accident Highest Injury: None Mid Air: N Missing: N
Damage: Destroyed
LOCATION
City: SANTA YNEZ State: CA Country: US
DESCRIPTION
EXPERIMENTAL ACFT LOST CONTROL DURING A GO-AROUND AND CRASHED 50 TO 100
YARDS SOUTH OF RWY 26, THE ACFT WAS DESTROYED, OTHER CIRCUMSTANCES ARE
UNKNOWN, SANTA YNEZ, CA.
INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 0
# Crew: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
# Pass: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
# Grnd: Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
WEATHER: UNKN
OTHER DATA
Activity: Pleasure Phase: Other Operation: General Aviation
Departed: SANTA YNEZ, CA Dep Date: 05/12/2002 Dep. Time: 2245
Destination: SANTA YNEZ, CA Flt Plan: NONE Wx Briefing: N
Last Radio Cont: UNKN
Last Clearance: UNKN
FAA FSDO: VAN NUYS, CA (WP01) Entry date: 05/13/2002
********************************************************************************
** Report created 05/14/2002 Record 4 **
********************************************************************************
IDENTIFICATION
Regis#: 9136R Make/Model: RV6 Description: EXP 2000 RV6A
Date: 05/11/2002 Time: 1840
Event Type: Accident Highest Injury: Minor Mid Air: N Missing: N
Damage: Unknown
LOCATION
City: POMONA PARK State: FL Country: US
DESCRIPTION
AIRCRAFT FLIPPED OVER ON LANDING, POMONA PARK, FL
INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 0
# Crew: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 1 Unk:
# Pass: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 1 Unk:
# Grnd: Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
WEATHER: METAR KGNV 111853Z 20011G18KT 10SM CLR 32/17 A3021
OTHER DATA
Activity: Unknown Phase: Landing Operation: General Aviation
Departed: UNKN Dep Date: Dep. Time:
Destination: UNKN Flt Plan: UNK Wx Briefing: N
Last Radio Cont: NONE
Last Clearance: NONE
FAA FSDO: ORLANDO, FL (SO15) Entry date: 05/13/2002
Eric Newton - Long Beach, MS
RV-6A - N57ME
www.ericsrv6a.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane<n8wv(at)earthlink.net> |
rv8list , rv-list ,
sonex builders
| Subject: | Garmin Pilot III |
I am in the market for a used Garmin Pilot III GPS... If you have one, or know
someone who has one they want to sell, please contact me off list...
-Bill
bill(at)vondane.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Garmin Pilot III |
In a message dated 5/14/2002 5:36:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
n8wv(at)earthlink.net writes:
> n8wv(at)earthlink.net (Bill)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | davepetrv6(at)comcast.net |
| Subject: | Deburring and polishing |
The main reason for removing sharp edges, corners, putting a radius on inside corners
and deburring holes is that it substantially increases the fatigue life
- i.e. eliminates points at which cracking can start - in the Aluminum alloys
that we use. The other reason for deburring is to get the rivets to seat correctly.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Mounting GPS |
Steve,
We cut out a section of the glare shield and made a mounting block that which we
attached our 295 mount to. The Garmin 295 snaps into place and is easily removed.
We also installed the hockey puck GPS ant just in front of the 295 and hard
wired the external power cable to the fuse block. The 295 right in the middle
and does not block the front windscreen of the instuments on the panel. It's
almost like having a headsup display.
Good Building - It's really worth it!
Chuck Dave Rowbotham
RV8A - Westerly Airport
From: "Steve J Hurlbut" <SJHDCL(at)KINGSTON.NET>
Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
To:
Subject: RV-List: Mounting GPS
Date: Tue, 14 May 2002 12:54:19 -0500
-- RV-List message posted by: "Steve J Hurlbut"
I've noticed several cockpits that have the Garmin Pilot III mounted
in the dash. It sticks out about 1/4 inch. How are you guys mounting these?
Are you taking the case apart and mounting it over some 0.063 then
screwing it into the panel. I plan on mounting the Garmin GPS II Plus which
is the same size and shape as the Pilot III.
Thankx
Steve Hurlbut
RV-7A
O-360 A1A
Fuselage
http://members.kingston.net/sjhdcl/rv7a.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 Front Baggage Door |
I know with mine it was very helpful to roll the curve into the top skin to
match the fus. This relived the stress on the ribs and provided for a
better fit though not perfect.
Wayne Couture
8A qb
----- Original Message -----
From: "Crosley, Rich" <RCROSLEY(at)HRTEXTRON.TEXTRON.COM>
Subject: RV-List: RV-8 Front Baggage Door
>
> Has any one got a clever way to get the baggage door on an "8" to fit well
> or are the Van's instructions sufficient?
>
>
> Rich Crosley
> RV-8 fuselage
> Palmdale, CA
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
| Subject: | Weight for steps |
"Gene" asked -
Subject: RV9-List: Steps
Does anyone have these steps not installed so they could be weighed. I
remember them being very heavy.
I've just weighed mine. Please note these are primed and top coated
with enamel paint. Total weight for the pair is 3 1/2 lbs. This
doesn't seem heavy for a pair of steel steps to me.
Quality of construction seems excellent. At first I was displeased to
find these had not been powder coated until I realised that we would all
be choosing different paint schemes and that this would be pointless.
Simple strong and a fair price.
Rob
RV9A fuse. N919RV resvd
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Tip-up vs. sliding canopy |
| From: | Joseph J Hasper <j1j2h3(at)juno.com> |
I'm pretty well settled on using the sliding canopy on my RV-7, but am
wondering if I could make the front portion tip-up instead of fixed to
get better access to the back of the instruments.
Has anyone tried this?
Jim Hasper - RV-7 just starting tail feathers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com |
| Subject: | Re: Tip-up vs. sliding canopy |
08:06:34 AM
Just finishing the canopy is a major effort, having just finished one I
would highly recommend you don't make it any harder on yourself. Make the
panel removable or use sub panels. How often you going to need to be back
there? Canopys are like walking by the mean dog in the neighborhood when
you were a kid. Just get by quickly and quietly and don't rile him. You'll
probably be OK. Screw with the pooch and you'll be sorry.
Eric
Joseph J Hasper (at)matronics.com on 05/15/2002 12:45:40 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: RV-List: Tip-up vs. sliding canopy
I'm pretty well settled on using the sliding canopy on my RV-7, but am
wondering if I could make the front portion tip-up instead of fixed to
get better access to the back of the instruments.
Has anyone tried this?
Jim Hasper - RV-7 just starting tail feathers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tip-up vs. sliding canopy |
I agree with Eric. Don't mess with it. Other things to change on the RV is
fine, but if you mess with the canopy, you are asking for trouble. I
already made a $1000 mistake on my first canopy. Not a good memory.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph J Hasper" <j1j2h3(at)juno.com>
Subject: RV-List: Tip-up vs. sliding canopy
>
> I'm pretty well settled on using the sliding canopy on my RV-7, but am
> wondering if I could make the front portion tip-up instead of fixed to
> get better access to the back of the instruments.
>
> Has anyone tried this?
>
> Jim Hasper - RV-7 just starting tail feathers
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frank, Dan" <DFrank(at)dfwairport.com> |
| Subject: | RE: Mounting GPS |
Steve,
Take a look at my web page, http://www.homestead.com/n808vr/instpanel.html ,
showing how I installed my Pilot III. It is mounted on a removable panel
using the plastic glareshield bracket that came with the unit. I bolted
this bracket to a piece a aluminum angle that was riveted to the removable
panel. I cut the instrument panel so I could later add a AI and DG. The
photo shows the antenna still attached. I have since removed it and
attached a remote antenna on the glareshield. If you have any questions
email me directly.
Dan Frank
RV-8 Moving to the airport in two weeks
From: "Steve J Hurlbut" <sjhdcl(at)kingston.net>
Subject: RV-List: Mounting GPS
I've noticed several cockpits that have the Garmin Pilot III mounted
in the dash. It sticks out about 1/4 inch. How are you guys mounting these?
Are you taking the case apart and mounting it over some 0.063 then
screwing it into the panel. I plan on mounting the Garmin GPS II Plus which
is the same size and shape as the Pilot III.
Thankx
Steve Hurlbut
RV-7A
O-360 A1A
Fuselage
http://members.kingston.net/sjhdcl/rv7a.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bartrim, Steve" <sbartrim(at)mail.canfor.ca> |
| Subject: | Tip-up vs. sliding canopy |
Hi Jim;
I like your idea and I believe it could be done, but it would be far
more difficult than it would appear at first thought, not to mention heavy.
With care you could design this without too much modification to the plexi
itself, so that if it didn't work out you could still mount it normally. You
could order the forward top skins for the tip-up, along with the hardware. I
would discuss this idea with Scott Risen at Van's. Scott is pretty open &
fair to those that are thinking outside the box.
I have modified my front deck to be removed ahead of the sub-panel.
This required repositioning the leading edge of the canopy behind the
subpanel rivet line in much the same position as the tip-up. It worked out
very well & gives me access to the back side of the firewall.
Working on the canopy isn't really all that bad, just like the fuel
tanks, it is blown all out of proportion. I recently cut mine and had no
troubles. I had the woodstove in my shop on high and the temp in the shop
was 40 Celsius (104 F). At this temp the plexi was so flexible I almost
could cut it with a knife.
Now while the other advice given to you on this subject is sound,
don't forget that you are building an experimental plane and that means that
you can experiment. On the other hand you must remember that you will be
messing with a $1000 chunk of plastic, so you must decide how much you can
afford to experiment. I'd like to see you succeed as this is something I
would consider on a future project if it works out for you.
S. Todd Bartrim
13B rotary powered
RV-9endurance (finish kit)
C-FSTB (reserved)
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Paul Besing [SMTP:azpilot(at)extremezone.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2002 6:20 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Tip-up vs. sliding canopy
>
>
> I agree with Eric. Don't mess with it. Other things to change on the RV
> is
> fine, but if you mess with the canopy, you are asking for trouble. I
> already made a $1000 mistake on my first canopy. Not a good memory.
>
> Paul Besing
> RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
> http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
> Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
> http://www.kitlog.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Joseph J Hasper" <j1j2h3(at)juno.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Tip-up vs. sliding canopy
>
>
> >
> > I'm pretty well settled on using the sliding canopy on my RV-7, but am
> > wondering if I could make the front portion tip-up instead of fixed to
> > get better access to the back of the instruments.
> >
> > Has anyone tried this?
> >
> > Jim Hasper - RV-7 just starting tail feathers
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us> |
| Subject: | Merced and Altitude hold |
I believe Merced's rule is the first full weekend of June, which includes
Friday, Saturday and Sunday, as that's when the airshow is open.
Too bad about the BFL dinner as I wanted to go, but I have to work at the
RNM airshow that weekend. But I'm glad about the Merced date as I now get to
go to both airshows. I know, its a hard life, but somebody has to be me, so
it might as well be me who does it.
Been waiting on the LTC 1298 A/D converter for two weeks now, sure glad the
rest of my RV parts didn't take this long. Got it Monday night, plugged it
in and went flying with the system in plane but not installed. Seems to be
very responsive, starts trying to fix an alt change in about 20ft.
Still waiting on the Gretz package to arrive, he had some back ordered
items.
Now for my next trick, I think I can use an Op Amp to couple the 150mV
up/down data from the glide slope to the input of the 1298 A/D converter. I
don't yet know how to bias this circuit so that it produces roughly the same
V range as the Motorola pressure sensor, but it must be possible. Any whiz
geniuses out there have experience with Op Amps. I seem to be a little slow
in getting their functionality straight in my head.
The goal here is to take two 0-150mV signal lines and bias the Op Amp such
that 0 mV from both signals is 2.5 V outout. Any rise in either causes it to
swing high (non inverted) or low (inverted) of 2.5V. This 2.5 bias could
probably be off by some, as the sampling software that Cliff used just picks
the current value from the ADC and trys to keep the plane there. If the V
centering is too far off though there might not be adequate range in that
direction.
One major problem I have with these fancy ICs is how the heck do you
engineer types know what each one does??
So, what the heck, if it only takes one more chip and a SPDT mini switch to
make a GS coupling, then why not?
W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
| Subject: | Merced and Altitude hold |
Wheeler,
why not use a comparator for your glideslope circuit ?
LTC is one of our competitors, we have all the same parts and more.
go to www.maxim-ic.com and look for application notes on comparators.
Ed Cole
Maxim Integrated Products
Bldg. 120 Ext. 6605
RV6A N2169D Flying
RV6A N648RV Finishing
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Wheeler North [SMTP:wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2002 9:12 AM
> To: 'RV-List Digest Server '
> Subject: RV-List: Merced and Altitude hold
>
>
> I believe Merced's rule is the first full weekend of June, which includes
> Friday, Saturday and Sunday, as that's when the airshow is open.
>
> Too bad about the BFL dinner as I wanted to go, but I have to work at the
> RNM airshow that weekend. But I'm glad about the Merced date as I now get
> to
> go to both airshows. I know, its a hard life, but somebody has to be me,
> so
> it might as well be me who does it.
>
> Been waiting on the LTC 1298 A/D converter for two weeks now, sure glad
> the
> rest of my RV parts didn't take this long. Got it Monday night, plugged it
> in and went flying with the system in plane but not installed. Seems to be
> very responsive, starts trying to fix an alt change in about 20ft.
>
> Still waiting on the Gretz package to arrive, he had some back ordered
> items.
>
> Now for my next trick, I think I can use an Op Amp to couple the 150mV
> up/down data from the glide slope to the input of the 1298 A/D converter.
> I
> don't yet know how to bias this circuit so that it produces roughly the
> same
> V range as the Motorola pressure sensor, but it must be possible. Any whiz
> geniuses out there have experience with Op Amps. I seem to be a little
> slow
> in getting their functionality straight in my head.
>
> The goal here is to take two 0-150mV signal lines and bias the Op Amp such
> that 0 mV from both signals is 2.5 V outout. Any rise in either causes it
> to
> swing high (non inverted) or low (inverted) of 2.5V. This 2.5 bias could
> probably be off by some, as the sampling software that Cliff used just
> picks
> the current value from the ADC and trys to keep the plane there. If the V
> centering is too far off though there might not be adequate range in that
> direction.
>
> One major problem I have with these fancy ICs is how the heck do you
> engineer types know what each one does??
>
> So, what the heck, if it only takes one more chip and a SPDT mini switch
> to
> make a GS coupling, then why not?
>
> W
>
>
>
>
>
Maxim Home Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com
Products Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
New Products:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
Datasheets:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
The information contained in this message is confidential
and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Laird Owens <owens(at)aerovironment.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tip-up vs. sliding canopy |
Considering that a lot of people think the canopy is one of the most
challenging tasks of building, be sure to think about it before going
down that path.....
Another alternative would be putting removable panels in the
instrument panel like I did. See it at:
http://www.planes-wings-things.com/rv-6_panel.htm
Ok, so it's a cheap ploy to advertise my sexy molded instrument panel
for RV-6, 7's, and 9's, but what the heck....
Even if you don't use my exotic molded panel, the removable panel
concept is still valid. And it's a whole lot simpler than tipping up
the fixed section of the canopy. Just another alternative for you to
think about.
Laird RV-6
SoCal
>
>I'm pretty well settled on using the sliding canopy on my RV-7, but am
>wondering if I could make the front portion tip-up instead of fixed to
>get better access to the back of the instruments.
>
>Has anyone tried this?
>
>Jim Hasper - RV-7 just starting tail feathers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Merced and Altitude hold |
Hi Ed,
Interesting to see that you are with Maxim. I am building a my own
design air/fuel ration indicator -fuel flow/totalizer circuit for my RV-6A.
I have the first prototype built and installed and then decided to revamp
the design using Maxim's ICM7217 Counter/BCD/7 Seg chips for added
capability. Some neat IC products you folks make/market.
Ed Anderson
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Merced and Altitude hold
>
> Wheeler,
> why not use a comparator for your glideslope circuit ?
> LTC is one of our competitors, we have all the same parts and more.
>
> go to www.maxim-ic.com and look for application notes on comparators.
>
> Ed Cole
> Maxim Integrated Products
> Bldg. 120 Ext. 6605
>
> RV6A N2169D Flying
> RV6A N648RV Finishing
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Wheeler North [SMTP:wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us]
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2002 9:12 AM
> > To: 'RV-List Digest Server '
> > Subject: RV-List: Merced and Altitude hold
> >
> >
> > I believe Merced's rule is the first full weekend of June, which
includes
> > Friday, Saturday and Sunday, as that's when the airshow is open.
> >
> > Too bad about the BFL dinner as I wanted to go, but I have to work at
the
> > RNM airshow that weekend. But I'm glad about the Merced date as I now
get
> > to
> > go to both airshows. I know, its a hard life, but somebody has to be me,
> > so
> > it might as well be me who does it.
> >
> > Been waiting on the LTC 1298 A/D converter for two weeks now, sure glad
> > the
> > rest of my RV parts didn't take this long. Got it Monday night, plugged
it
> > in and went flying with the system in plane but not installed. Seems to
be
> > very responsive, starts trying to fix an alt change in about 20ft.
> >
> > Still waiting on the Gretz package to arrive, he had some back ordered
> > items.
> >
> > Now for my next trick, I think I can use an Op Amp to couple the 150mV
> > up/down data from the glide slope to the input of the 1298 A/D
converter.
> > I
> > don't yet know how to bias this circuit so that it produces roughly the
> > same
> > V range as the Motorola pressure sensor, but it must be possible. Any
whiz
> > geniuses out there have experience with Op Amps. I seem to be a little
> > slow
> > in getting their functionality straight in my head.
> >
> > The goal here is to take two 0-150mV signal lines and bias the Op Amp
such
> > that 0 mV from both signals is 2.5 V outout. Any rise in either causes
it
> > to
> > swing high (non inverted) or low (inverted) of 2.5V. This 2.5 bias could
> > probably be off by some, as the sampling software that Cliff used just
> > picks
> > the current value from the ADC and trys to keep the plane there. If the
V
> > centering is too far off though there might not be adequate range in
that
> > direction.
> >
> > One major problem I have with these fancy ICs is how the heck do you
> > engineer types know what each one does??
> >
> > So, what the heck, if it only takes one more chip and a SPDT mini switch
> > to
> > make a GS coupling, then why not?
> >
> > W
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> Maxim Home Page:
> http://www.maxim-ic.com
> Products Page:
> http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
> New Products:
> http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
> Datasheets:
> http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
> The information contained in this message is confidential
> and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
> solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
> recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
> or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
> If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
> by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Merced and Altitude hold |
>Now for my next trick, I think I can use an Op Amp to couple the 150mV
>up/down data from the glide slope to the input of the 1298 A/D converter. I
>don't yet know how to bias this circuit so that it produces roughly the same
>V range as the Motorola pressure sensor, but it must be possible. Any whiz
>geniuses out there have experience with Op Amps. I seem to be a little slow
>in getting their functionality straight in my head.
>
>The goal here is to take two 0-150mV signal lines and bias the Op Amp such
>that 0 mV from both signals is 2.5 V outout. Any rise in either causes it to
>swing high (non inverted) or low (inverted) of 2.5V. This 2.5 bias could
>probably be off by some, as the sampling software that Cliff used just picks
>the current value from the ADC and trys to keep the plane there. If the V
>centering is too far off though there might not be adequate range in that
>direction.
>
Wheeler,
The trick for the glideslope function will be to deal with the way
the glideslope signal tightens up as you get closer to the ground.
The signal is sort of cone shaped, so 1mV of error means a lot more
feet altitude error when you are 5 miles back than it does when you
are approaching minimums. So you'll find that the effective gain of
your system increases throughout the approach.
Many large aircraft autopilots use a radalt input to tell the
autopilot to vary the gain of the glideslope function. If the radalt
dies, I am aware of some autopilots that use a timer to slowly
decrease the gain of the glideslope function. You might also be able
to do some tricks using the altitude data. E.g. make an assumption
that the glideslope will be intercepted at about 2,000 ft AGL. Once
the aircraft is coming down hill on the glideslope, watch the amount
that the altitude has decreased from where it was when the glideslope
was captured and decrease the gain based on that. Of course this
approach assumes a digital system with software. Looks like you are
thinking analog, so I have no idea how to deal with that.
Good luck,
Kevin
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (installing engine & electrics)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
http://eccentrix.com/misc/rv8/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | ACK E-01 ELT remote control head dimensions |
I'm getting ready to hack some holes in the right side of the
instrument panel for my RV-8. I had hoped my ACK E-01 ELT would be
here by now so I could see how big the remote control head was.
I would appreciate it if someone could send me the following dimensions:
1. overall dimensions of the remote control head, and
2. dimensions of the hole you need to put in the panel.
Thanks,
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (installing engine & electrics)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
http://eccentrix.com/misc/rv8/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Stark Avionics |
| From: | James Freeman <flyeyes(at)bellsouth.net> |
On Wednesday, May 1, 2002, at 01:55 PM, Wayne R. Couture wrote:
> How can I get in touch with John? The Matronics site is down and I
> can't
> search the archives.
From the "Yeller Pages:"
STARK AVIONICS (JOHN STARK) 706-321-1008 jts7(at)mindspring.com
http://www.mindspring.com/~jts7/starkav.html DISCOUNT AVIONICS
His shop is at CSG, about 120 miles southwest of Atlanta.
*
> Does he sell avionis cheaper than Van's?
I haven't compared everything, but he was cheaper on the items I priced
James Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LeastDrag93066(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | ELT Antenna Location |
Hi All,
A wingtip COM Antenna, like Sportcraft Antenna's, would make an excellent ELT
antenna in a location that works for aircraft communications, and is
excellent for communicating with satellite ELT receivers.
Just thinking about how internally mounted antenna's perform better that the
external "shrubbery" antenna's. :-)
Jim Ayers
leastdrag93066(at)aol.com
RV-3 N47RV (no ELT required.) (I normally fly with a second aircraft.)
RV-4 sn 2708 (I need to mount an ELT in this one.)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
I know the first one. He has a hanger just a row over from me. He and his
passenger are OK. The plane's gear is tweaked pretty bad, a hole punched in
the bottom of one wing, and some dings from brush hitting the wing. The
intake scoop, spinner, and prop were also trashed. He did a great job
putting it down out in the desert. Both walked away without a scratch.
Paul Besing
RV-6A (Sold)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <enewton57(at)cableone.net>
Subject: RV-List: Bad RV day
>
>
****************************************************************************
****
> ** Report created 05/14/2002 Record 1
**
>
****************************************************************************
****
>
> IDENTIFICATION
> Regis#: 106RJ Make/Model: EXP Description: EXP-1994 RV-6
> Date: 05/11/2002 Time: 1810
>
> Event Type: Incident Highest Injury: None Mid Air: N Missing: N
> Damage: Minor
>
> LOCATION
> City: PHOENIX State: AZ Country: US
>
> DESCRIPTION
> EXPERIMENTAL ACFT LOST POWER ON FINAL APPROACH AND SUBSEQUENTLY
SUSTAINED
> MINOR DAMAGE, OTHER CIRCUMSTANCES ARE UNKNOWN, PHOENIX, AZ.
>
> INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 0
> # Crew: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
> # Pass: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
> # Grnd: Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
>
> WEATHER: KDVT 111810Z 23009G15KT 10SM CLR 26/M08 A2981
>
> OTHER DATA
> Activity: Pleasure Phase: Approach Operation: General Aviation
>
> Departed: WILCOX, AZ Dep Date: 05/11/2002 Dep. Time:
1700
> Destination: PHOENIX, AZ Flt Plan: NONE Wx
Briefing: N
> Last Radio Cont: 1 MILE FINAL APCH
> Last Clearance: CLRD TO LAND
>
> FAA FSDO: SCOTTSDALE, AZ (WP07) Entry date: 05/13/2002
>
> ** Report created 05/14/2002 Record 3
**
>
****************************************************************************
****
>
> IDENTIFICATION
> Regis#: 6579B Make/Model: EXP Description: EXP-1991 RV-4
> Date: 05/12/2002 Time: 2315
>
> Event Type: Accident Highest Injury: None Mid Air: N Missing: N
> Damage: Destroyed
>
> LOCATION
> City: SANTA YNEZ State: CA Country: US
>
> DESCRIPTION
> EXPERIMENTAL ACFT LOST CONTROL DURING A GO-AROUND AND CRASHED 50 TO 100
> YARDS SOUTH OF RWY 26, THE ACFT WAS DESTROYED, OTHER CIRCUMSTANCES ARE
> UNKNOWN, SANTA YNEZ, CA.
>
> INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 0
> # Crew: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
> # Pass: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
> # Grnd: Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
>
> WEATHER: UNKN
>
> OTHER DATA
> Activity: Pleasure Phase: Other Operation: General Aviation
>
> Departed: SANTA YNEZ, CA Dep Date: 05/12/2002 Dep. Time:
2245
> Destination: SANTA YNEZ, CA Flt Plan: NONE Wx
Briefing: N
> Last Radio Cont: UNKN
> Last Clearance: UNKN
>
> FAA FSDO: VAN NUYS, CA (WP01) Entry date: 05/13/2002
>
>
****************************************************************************
****
> ** Report created 05/14/2002 Record 4
**
>
****************************************************************************
****
>
> IDENTIFICATION
> Regis#: 9136R Make/Model: RV6 Description: EXP 2000 RV6A
> Date: 05/11/2002 Time: 1840
>
> Event Type: Accident Highest Injury: Minor Mid Air: N Missing:
N
> Damage: Unknown
>
> LOCATION
> City: POMONA PARK State: FL Country: US
>
> DESCRIPTION
> AIRCRAFT FLIPPED OVER ON LANDING, POMONA PARK, FL
>
> INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 0
> # Crew: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 1
Unk:
> # Pass: 1 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 1
Unk:
> # Grnd: Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0
Unk:
>
> WEATHER: METAR KGNV 111853Z 20011G18KT 10SM CLR 32/17 A3021
>
> OTHER DATA
> Activity: Unknown Phase: Landing Operation: General Aviation
>
> Departed: UNKN Dep Date: Dep. Time:
> Destination: UNKN Flt Plan: UNK Wx
Briefing: N
> Last Radio Cont: NONE
> Last Clearance: NONE
>
> FAA FSDO: ORLANDO, FL (SO15) Entry date: 05/13/2002
>
>
> Eric Newton - Long Beach, MS
> RV-6A - N57ME
> www.ericsrv6a.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim's Hotmail" <rv8apilot(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | RV-8A upper intersection fairings |
Does anyone know of a shop that makes intersection fairings for the 8A?
I can find lots for the 6A but none for the 8A. I made the lower gear leg
fairings and that cured me of wanting to do the upper fairings. Also tried
to make 6A fairings fit with no luck.
Many thanks in advance,
- Jim Andrews
RV-8A flying again after three weeks of fairing work...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Schaefer" <dschaefer1(at)kc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | 6AQB Fuse Support |
What is the "best" way and where to support the fuse on a 6AQB and be able
to move it around etc. while I work on it?
Thanks...
David
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: 6AQB Fuse Support |
I put my RV on an engine stand. You can see it on my website. It worked
well. I have also seen people make a stand connected to the false spar, put
some casters on it, and made another stand for the tail with a wheel on it.
Essentially you just made a 6A a 6 while it is in your garage!
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Schaefer" <dschaefer1(at)kc.rr.com>
Subject: RV-List: 6AQB Fuse Support
>
> What is the "best" way and where to support the fuse on a 6AQB and be
able
> to move it around etc. while I work on it?
>
> Thanks...
>
> David
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A upper intersection fairings |
Isn't Team Rocket making fairings for the -8? If not give Mark Frederick
there a call and tell him you want some and maybe he'll get busy making a
mold. His fairings are top quality.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim's Hotmail" <rv8apilot(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: RV-8A upper intersection fairings
>
> Does anyone know of a shop that makes intersection fairings for the 8A?
>
> I can find lots for the 6A but none for the 8A. I made the lower gear leg
> fairings and that cured me of wanting to do the upper fairings. Also
tried
> to make 6A fairings fit with no luck.
>
> Many thanks in advance,
>
> - Jim Andrews
> RV-8A flying again after three weeks of fairing work...
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
rv-6 for sale
about 700 hrs on airframe
about 1700hrs on 0320
sensenich metal prop
great flying cross country plane
$48,000
e-mail me direct for any questions
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | ELT Antenna Location |
If the antenna cable is more than a couple feet or it passes through any
structure it stands a good chance of being severed in any crash where you
really need it. Also consider accessibility to the ELT after all the sheet
metal deforms from the crash. e.g. the floor panels and baggage bulkhead on
a -6 can crumple to prevent access without cutting tools. Choose your
locations based on whether you absolutely, positively want it to work or if
you just want to satisfy the regs while minimizing drag and CG impact. My
vote for the most survivable, minimum risk location would be far aft in the
tail just ahead of the HZ with the antenna mounted on the upper skin just
above it. Of course that adds drag, shifts the CG aft and plays hell with
access. Everything is a tradeoff.
Regards,
Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
RV-6 N6GY - project Phoenix
Navion N5221K - a size XXL RV-6A
>
>
>
> OK, so you crash and the wing comes off...or the feedline is ripped off of
> the antenna...then what?
>
> Mark Dickens
> -8 Fuse
>
> >
> > Hi All,
> >
> > A wingtip COM Antenna, like Sportcraft Antenna's, would make an
> excellent
> ELT
> > antenna in a location that works for aircraft communications, and is
> > excellent for communicating with satellite ELT receivers.
> >
> > Just thinking about how internally mounted antenna's perform better that
> the
> > external "shrubbery" antenna's. :-)
> >
> > Jim Ayers
> > leastdrag93066(at)aol.com
> > RV-3 N47RV (no ELT required.) (I normally fly with a second aircraft.)
> > RV-4 sn 2708 (I need to mount an ELT in this one.)
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LeastDrag93066(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: ELT Antenna Location |
In a message dated 05/15/2002 5:44:39 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
mddickens(at)mindspring.com writes:
> OK, so you crash and the wing comes off...or the feedline is ripped off of
> the antenna...then what?
>
> Mark Dickens
> -8 Fuse
>
The answer is the same, no matter where you mount the antenna.
IMHO, a broken coax for an antenna would work as well as an ELT antenna
mounted against the rollover bar like I've seen on at least one RV-4. Or a
fuselage top mounted antenna resting on the ground.
Having the ELT accessible with a separate antenna for handheld use would seem
important considerations.
I'm not asking anyone to like my suggestion. I'm just introducing a possible
solution that might have been overlooked.
An ELT COM antenna for 121.5 MHz is still within the 118 to 136 MHz frequency
band of a COM antenna.
Jim Ayers
leastdrag93066(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George McNutt" <gmcnutt(at)intergate.ca> |
| Subject: | Electronic Ignition Problem |
I am posting this for the archives in case someone else runs into this
problem.
Prior to my first flight in Underdog the Lightspeed electronic ignition
seemed OK on runup, however when the Magneto was turned off in flight there
was a 200 RPM drop and rough operation when running on the Lightspeed
ignition.
Postflight The Lightspeed sounded like it was only firing three cylinders
during runup.
The problem turned out to be the air gap between the rotating magnet and
electronic pickup in the Hall effect sensor. The spacing should be 10 to 70
thousand's and mine was over 100.
Fix was to add another washer under the rotating arm that supports the
magnet.
This problem is currently not covered in the Lightspeed manual.
George McNutt
Langley, B.C.
C-GJTY - "Underdog", defender of the Airways - flying again!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | e-mail and web page change |
We finally got high speed internet out here in the sticks, so we're
changing ISPs.
Our new e-mail address is khorton(at)rogers.com (the one this message
came from is only used for e-mail lists).
My RV-8 page is now at http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html.
The old page at Eccentrix will stay up for awhile, until I decide it
is too much of a pain to maintain two sites.
My RV Links page is now at
http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rvlinks.html. The old page at
Cyberus is dead.
My Flight Test Links page is now at
http://members.rogers.com/khorton/ftlinks.html . The old page at
Cyberus is dead.
Take care,
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (installing engine & electrics)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
http://eccentrix.com/misc/rv8/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Gordon" <dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Pic of finished RV-6 |
Here is a picture of my RV-6. I have just finished installing the vinyl
graphics.
http://vondane.com/rv8a/otherpix/glenngordon.jpg
-Glenn Gordon
N442E (21 hours)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ron Bloomgren" <rwboo(at)hotmail.com> |
Hello Dave,
It was nice to see you at the forum. Will you be in town this weekend?
I would like to check your plane out. I thought you had some that was
interested in purchasing your plane. I realize I have a long way to go
to building my own plane. I might consider purchasing in the mean time.
Let me know your schedule. E-mail or call wk 612 721-5711, h 612
824-5876
Ron Bloomgren
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of pierson's
Subject: RV-List: rv-6 for sale
rv-6 for sale
about 700 hrs on airframe
about 1700hrs on 0320
sensenich metal prop
great flying cross country plane
$48,000
e-mail me direct for any questions
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: ACK E-01 ELT remote control head dimensions |
Sure. A kind lister e-mailed me a scan of an installation drawing.
According to the drawing, the overall dimensions are a bit less than
2.25" wide and 0.875" high and it is 2.172 inches long. It mounts
behind the panel, and needs a hole in the panel about 1.5" wide and
0.66" high. I certainly won't make the hole in the panel until I
have the unit in my hand, as it'll look a lot better if the hole
closely matches the recess in the unit. But, these dimensions should
allow you to reserve enough panel space for the control head.
Kevin
>
>The info might be important to others. Could you share?
>Barry RV9a
>
>Kevin Horton wrote:
>>
>>
>> A lister sent me the info I needed.
>>
>> Thanks so much,
>>
> > Kevin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Graham Jones" <gratech(at)bigpond.com> |
| Subject: | Pre and Post Oshkosh sightseeing - Not directly RV related. |
Listers,
I'd like to receive some of your collective wisdom, please.
A mate I will be heading to Oshkosh this year (1st timers) and will be
spending the weekend prior in LasVegas.
Apart from the joys of The Strip we would like to take in the Grand Canyon,
Hoover Dam, Lake Mead, etc. and due to the short time we have available (Sat
and most of Sun) we think we probably should book a tour from here to ensure
we can get the seats we want.
I would like to hear your opinions as to who is the best Canyon Tour
operator, either at McCarran or elsewhere near Vegas. Heli is preferred so
we can land in the Canyon but a fixed wing/heli mixed flight seems an
option(??). Cost is not the sole criteria as, in my view, true value in this
sort of thing is given when we see all that there is in a way that we can
take it in and remember it.
We will have a car to get around in but do not want to drive the 5 + hrs to
the Rim unless it was REALLY worth it -what goes out must come back :-{.
After OSH we are heading to the Big Apple for about a week and would be
interested in hearing from any builders in and around the town.
Please Reply off list.
Cheers
Graham Jones
Kilmore, Australia
RV6a Wings next...
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Electronic Ignition Problem |
GEORGE-the install manual section 2.3 covers the GAP-0.020 TO 0.070-TOM
Thomas M. Whelan
Whelan Farms Airport
Post Office Box 426
249 Hard Hill Road North
Bethlehem, CT 06751
PH 203-266-5300
FAX 203-266-5140
e-mail wfact01(at)aol.com
EAA Chapter 1097, President
RV-8 IO-540 LYC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Bell" <rv4bell(at)door.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: ACK E-01 ELT remote control head dimensions |
I might add: The unit has a small battery in it that might require
replacement. If installed behind the panel, as I did, make sure you can get
at it. Several in Lubbock with RV6A's have installed it from the front of
the panel for an easier get at.
Bruce Bell
Lubbock, Texas
RV4 # 2888
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kevin Horton" <khorto1537(at)rogers.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RE: ACK E-01 ELT remote control head dimensions
>
> Sure. A kind lister e-mailed me a scan of an installation drawing.
> According to the drawing, the overall dimensions are a bit less than
> 2.25" wide and 0.875" high and it is 2.172 inches long. It mounts
> behind the panel, and needs a hole in the panel about 1.5" wide and
> 0.66" high. I certainly won't make the hole in the panel until I
> have the unit in my hand, as it'll look a lot better if the hole
> closely matches the recess in the unit. But, these dimensions should
> allow you to reserve enough panel space for the control head.
>
> Kevin
>
> >
> >The info might be important to others. Could you share?
> >Barry RV9a
> >
> >Kevin Horton wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> A lister sent me the info I needed.
> >>
> >> Thanks so much,
> >>
> > > Kevin
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: ELT Antenna Location |
| From: | <racker(at)rmci.net> |
>
> Having the ELT accessible with a separate antenna for handheld use
> would seem important considerations.
Very good point, glad someone brought it up. My ELT has voice capability
with a seperate antenna, and is mounted just forward of the fuel selector
on my RV-6 (along with the fire extinguisher, handheld com, survival kit).
I figured if the airplane is so badly damaged that the ELT gets physically
wiped out in that location, I am probably gone as well. If not, I can grab
all the survival essentials quickly and get out of there.
I also needed as much weight forward as possible for CG considerations.
Rob Acker (RV-6).
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Strategy and timing for wing attachment - I am moving from |
Bosto...
Dag:
As I sit at Logan Airport waiting for my flight back to sunny North Carolina
I want to first congratulate you on your move .... Colorado ... good choice
and good RV territory !!
I would go with Plan B. There is lots of wiring things to be done and
fitting the wings now is not critical. The wiring will take a lot longer
than you think !!
Len Leggette RV-8A
N901LL (res)
Greensboro, N.C.
Hanger # 23 at INT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane<n8wv(at)earthlink.net> |
rv8list , rv-list ,
sonex builders
| Subject: | Air Show - Colorado Springs |
EAA Chapter 72 In Colorado Springs is sponsoring the "In Their Honor" Air Show
this weekend... We'll have WWII and Active Military aircraft, as well as Antiques
and Experimentals...
All are welcome...
More info: http://www.eaa72.org/stuff/airshow.pdf
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Price difference RV-6 vs RV-8 |
| From: | "Kendall R. Simmons" <ken(at)truckstop.com> |
I was hoping someone could help me understand the big difference in list
prices for completed RV-6's and RV-8's. The 6's seem to list mostly in
the 50-60K range while the 8's list in the 80-100K range. From
everything I've read the 6 is much more popular than the 8. Are people
selling them at a lower price in favor of building a 7?
I would rather be flying, but can't see spending 100K for a completed 8,
that's why I've started building. I've always heard that you shouldn't
build to save money because you can't. In the case of the 8 it seems
you can save money. Especially after reading about Bill VonDane's
frugal efforts. I know that Bill has a smaller engine than most 8's
I've seen, but not 50K worth.
So, am I missing something here? Should I go ahead and cough up the
100K and fly now or spend the next several years building an 8 and
flying...cough...Cessna's?
Ken
RV-8 (empennage)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Konrad Werner" <Connywerner(at)wans.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Price difference RV-6 vs RV-8 |
Dear Ken,
Why don't you cough up just 50K & buy yourself a good RV-6 to fly for right
now!
With the other 50K you then build yourself the RV-8 (on these rainy
NON-flying the -6 kinda days).
Once the -8 is ready to fly, then you decide which one you may sell
(Warning: You might want to keep both!!).
But this way you spare yourself from flying SPAM.
Konrad
> I was hoping someone could help me understand the big difference in list
> prices for completed RV-6's and RV-8's. The 6's seem to list mostly in
> the 50-60K range while the 8's list in the 80-100K range. From
> everything I've read the 6 is much more popular than the 8. Are people
> selling them at a lower price in favor of building a 7?
>
> I would rather be flying, but can't see spending 100K for a completed 8,
> that's why I've started building. I've always heard that you shouldn't
> build to save money because you can't. In the case of the 8 it seems
> you can save money. Especially after reading about Bill VonDane's
> frugal efforts. I know that Bill has a smaller engine than most 8's
> I've seen, but not 50K worth.
>
> So, am I missing something here? Should I go ahead and cough up the
> 100K and fly now or spend the next several years building an 8 and
> flying...cough...Cessna's?
>
> Ken
> RV-8 (empennage)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
| Subject: | Price difference RV-6 vs RV-8 |
Ken, buy a -6 now to fly while your building your -8. The -6 is a great
airplane
and performance wise very little difference. How the -8 guys get 100k is
beyond me
as they don't spend much more building it than the other types.
I bought a -6a after spending 5 yrs on my -6a project. Wish I would have
done it sooner.
I'll sell it for what I paid for it when I finish the other one.
You can get a nice one for $55-62K
It's more fun flying than building and paying for the annual is no big deal.
Ed Cole
RV6A N2169D Flying
RV6A N648RV Finishing
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kendall R. Simmons [SMTP:ken(at)truckstop.com]
> Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2002 9:34 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Price difference RV-6 vs RV-8
>
>
> I was hoping someone could help me understand the big difference in list
> prices for completed RV-6's and RV-8's. The 6's seem to list mostly in
> the 50-60K range while the 8's list in the 80-100K range. From
> everything I've read the 6 is much more popular than the 8. Are people
> selling them at a lower price in favor of building a 7?
>
> I would rather be flying, but can't see spending 100K for a completed 8,
> that's why I've started building. I've always heard that you shouldn't
> build to save money because you can't. In the case of the 8 it seems
> you can save money. Especially after reading about Bill VonDane's
> frugal efforts. I know that Bill has a smaller engine than most 8's
> I've seen, but not 50K worth.
>
> So, am I missing something here? Should I go ahead and cough up the
> 100K and fly now or spend the next several years building an 8 and
> flying...cough...Cessna's?
>
> Ken
> RV-8 (empennage)
>
>
>
>
>
Maxim Home Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com
Products Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
New Products:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
Datasheets:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
The information contained in this message is confidential
and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George McNutt" <gmcnutt(at)intergate.ca> |
| Subject: | Electronic Ignition Problem |
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of WFACT01(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Electronic Ignition Problem
GEORGE-the install manual section 2.3 covers the GAP-0.020 TO 0.070-TOM
Thomas M. Whelan
-------------------------------------------------------
Hi Thomas
I stand by my statement!
Section 2.3 of the install manual is for the crankshaft trigger which is a
different beast. Those of us that are electrically challenged may or may not
know if those section 2.3 dimensions apply to the Lightspeed Hall effect
trigger. The Hall effect trigger should have been properly set by Lightspeed
before it left the shop.
George McNutt
Lngley B.C.
Underdog is having heavy right wing corrected today.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie and Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com> |
| Subject: | Re: ELT Antenna Location |
"Mark D. Dickens" wrote:
>
>
> OK, so you crash and the wing comes off...or the feedline is ripped off of
> the antenna...then what?
>
> Mark Dickens
> -8 Fuse
>
Pretty much the same thing that happens when the elt is in
the fuse: the satellite tells them to look for you 3 or 4
counties away from where you are.
:-)
Charlie
been there, done that
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Pic of finished RV-6 |
Hi Glenn,
Your airplane looks great! Where did you get your graphics and what kind of
art work is needed by the manufacture?
Cash Copeland
dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)attbi.com writes:
> dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)attbi.com>
>
> Here is a picture of my RV-6. I have just finished installing the vinyl
> graphics.
>
> http://vondane.com/rv8a/otherpix/glenngordon.jpg
>
> -Glenn Gordon
> N442E (21 hours)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)attbi.com |
| Subject: | Re: Pic of finished RV-6 |
I made the artwork on CorelDRAW and had a local sign
shop cut the vinyl. Most sign shops can work with most
formats of VECTORIZED graphic files. E-mail me back if
you need more info.
-Glenn Gordon
>
> Hi Glenn,
> Your airplane looks great! Where did you get your graphics and what kind of
> art work is needed by the manufacture?
> Cash Copeland
>
> dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)attbi.com writes:
>
>
> > dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)attbi.com>
> >
> > Here is a picture of my RV-6. I have just finished installing the vinyl
> > graphics.
> >
> > http://vondane.com/rv8a/otherpix/glenngordon.jpg
> >
> > -Glenn Gordon
> > N442E (21 hours)
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DPrestonsr(at)aol.com |
Hi RV'rs. I will be in Roanoke, VA Friday evening til Sunday afternoon. Would
enjoy seeing projects and if possible getting a ride in RV-8. Appreciate any
info to my email....dprestonsr(at)aol.com. Be staying by ROA airport.
Thanks,
Doug Preston
RV-7A fuselage.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Laird Owens <owens(at)aerovironment.com> |
| Subject: | Re: building a panel with access... |
Todd,
Thanks for the comment about the panel. (You can see an exterior shot
of my RV in this years calendar, month of Dec....not that I'm proud
or anything.... :-)
Am I SURE it'll fit in a -7???? Yes, as sure as I can be without
having done it once myself.
I've had one customer install one in an RV-9 (which I understand is
the same as the -7) and had no problems (that I heard about). And I
have the RV-7 preview plans in front of me and I as far as I can tell
from the drawings (and reading drawings "is" one of the duties of my
day job) the installation should be exactly the same as the RV-6.
So, yes, it'll fit.
The only thing I can see has to do with the prepunched top skin. My
panel rivets to the perimeter of the panel just like Van's does. But
mine does protrude out of (the instrument panel) plane and rivets to
the skin in those places. You would need to drill new holes for
those attachments and fill (with rivets) the unused holes. And there
may be other holes that Van's punched that may not be in exactly the
same spot for where I've suggested holes should go where the rest of
the panel attaches. That is the only thing I can see that would need
to be alert for when installing my panel.
But if you've gotten to the fuselage stage, you've probably learned
how to improvise in areas like this anyway.
Free free to contact me off line if you have any other questions.
Laird RV-6
SoCal
owens(at)aearovironment.com
>
>Laird - I have seen your panel before, BEAUTIFUL! Does it for sure fit the
>RV7?
>I know they (RV-6, 7) are sister ships and I getting serious about
>instruments now.
>I have been sitting on the question of interchangeability of the panel and
>some of
>the Rocket pieces for some time now. Whazzz-up
>
>======================
>Snip from Laird here...
>Another alternative would be putting removable panels in the
>instrument panel like I did. See it at:
>http://www.planes-wings-things.com/rv-6_panel.htm
>
>Ok, so it's a cheap ploy to advertise my (Laird) sexy molded instrument
>panel
>for RV-6, 7's, and 9's, but what the heck....
>======================
>
>--
>Todd Cameron (stockpiling cool aluminum stuff around the garage)
>toddc.cameron(at)powertechgroup.com
>--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ollie Washburn" <skybolt-aviator(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Price difference RV-6 vs RV-8 |
Ken-------
I have also wondered why the big price difference especially when the build
cost is about same.I guess one reason is that there is far less 8's flying
than 6's.
Ollie-----RV6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard D. Fogerson" <rickf(at)velocitus.net> |
Hi All,
I think I read somewhere that an ELT was not required in a single place
airplane. Anyone know the real story?
Thanks,
Rick Fogerson
RV3 fuselage
Boise, ID
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Price difference RV-6 vs RV-8 |
> I was hoping someone could help me understand the big difference in list
> prices for completed RV-6's and RV-8's.
Simple supply and demand. There are more -6s than -8s around, and perhaps more
buyers want -8s. Now "why do so many buyers want -8s" is an interesting
question. Perhaps because there's no certified plane that's even remotely
similar (whereas a -6 isn't so totally different from a few of the certified
designs).
Tedd McHenry
Surrey, BC
RV-6 wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Laird Owens <owens(at)aerovironment.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Merced/ Bakersfield |
Len,
If your flying, it's L45, Bakersfield Muni, on the south side of
town, SE of Shafter VOR.
If your Driving from LA, it:
North on I-5
North on 99
Exit Whites lane, turn east
Turn North on S. Union.
The EAA chapter hangar is on the corner of S. Union and Louise.
For more info see below contact.
Hope to see you there.
Laird
Bakersfield EAA 71 annual BBQ Fly-In @ (L45) will be on June 1st, 2002
All food will be catered by the Getaway Cafe & the Outback Restaurant
In addition to all of the awesome experimental aircraft on display,
there will be a custom hot rod and motorcycle display
Live music all day long
Info: call John Harmon (611) 836-1028 or e-mail hr2pilot(at)aol.com
or
Tim Barnes (661) 393-4100 or e-mail EAABKFD71(at)aol.com
>
>Can you tell me exactly where the fly-in will be held? I will be in
>California on June 1 wondering how I was going to spend the day !!
>
>Len Leggette RV-8A
>N901LL (res)
>Greensboro, N.C.
>Hanger # 23 at INT
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Price difference RV-6 vs RV-8 |
I've watched this thread now and still haven't seen anyone hit the real
reason that 8's sell for so much money............It's because people pay
it. As long as sellers keep the price high, people will have to (and DO)
pay that price to own that airplane or build it themselves. That's just
part of the supply and demand equation. When more 8's become available and
some people HAVE to sell them (because they're getting married, or they are
having a ('nother) kid then the prices MAY go down. But as long as people
are paying that price because they don't have choice, it will stay high.
(even as the supply increases.) AL
>
>Ken-------
> I have also wondered why the big price difference especially when the build
>cost is about same.I guess one reason is that there is far less 8's flying
>than 6's.
> Ollie-----RV6A
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Price difference RV-6 vs RV-8 |
If you just have a flying bug and not an RV bug, then just by yourself a
Cessna 140 or something. (That's what I did when I sold my 6A). You can
fly for dirt cheap, allowing you to spend money on the project. Or, if you
do have the extra cash to spend, go ahead and get you an RV-6(A) for $50K or
so and fly it. When you need an engine and panel, sell the RV-6 and put
that money into the engine and panel, and off you go to finish your
airplane.
I wish I had an airplane to fly while building mine. It would have made the
project alot less stressful :-)
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kendall R. Simmons" <ken(at)truckstop.com>
Subject: RV-List: Price difference RV-6 vs RV-8
>
> I was hoping someone could help me understand the big difference in list
> prices for completed RV-6's and RV-8's. The 6's seem to list mostly in
> the 50-60K range while the 8's list in the 80-100K range. From
> everything I've read the 6 is much more popular than the 8. Are people
> selling them at a lower price in favor of building a 7?
>
> I would rather be flying, but can't see spending 100K for a completed 8,
> that's why I've started building. I've always heard that you shouldn't
> build to save money because you can't. In the case of the 8 it seems
> you can save money. Especially after reading about Bill VonDane's
> frugal efforts. I know that Bill has a smaller engine than most 8's
> I've seen, but not 50K worth.
>
> So, am I missing something here? Should I go ahead and cough up the
> 100K and fly now or spend the next several years building an 8 and
> flying...cough...Cessna's?
>
> Ken
> RV-8 (empennage)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Price difference RV-6 vs RV-8 |
guys
i agree with al, lets all agree right now that no one will sell thier rv for
less than 100k, those that do will be black balled in the rv community and
this list. they want even be invited to vans homecoming. :-)
scott
tampa
rv6a for sale 110k
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Duane Bentley" <dbentley(at)fuse.net> |
For those of you who have installed the LASAR system on your Lycoming, I
have a question relative to the low voltage control harness. I decided to
check the archives relative to where some builders put the box on the
firewall. One of the responses back was someone who said he could only
install it on one side due to the length (short) LV control harness. I had
ordered my engine from Vans (new 0-360) over a year ago, with the LASAR
system installed. After mounting the engine months ago and now just
finishing up the wiring, I find that the LASAR harness leads are nearly 36"
in length! I could install this thing anywhere and assuming I mount it on
the firewall as would normally be expected, will have to coil up and secure
probably two feet of coil length.
Is this typical or should I call Unison and ask if they originally sent me
the wrong length leads?
Thanks
Duane Bentley
RV6 (Finishing, still)
West Chester, OH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Perri <jperri(at)aros.net> |
I know this one has been beat to death but, I just got my renewal notice
from Avemco.. Wow! 30+% what an increase. Is this what others are
seeing? I remember Skysmith and one other company being recommended by
the group. What seems to be the consensus on the best company to insure
my 6?
Thanks
JMP RV-6 700hrs.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
I use Skysmith and my already reasonable rates went DOWN this year for full
coverage. No complaints here.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
>
> I know this one has been beat to death but, I just got my renewal notice
> from Avemco.. Wow! 30+% what an increase. Is this what others are
> seeing? I remember Skysmith and one other company being recommended by
> the group. What seems to be the consensus on the best company to insure
> my 6?
>
> Thanks
>
> JMP RV-6 700hrs.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Les Rowles <lmrowles(at)netspace.net.au> |
Hello to all,
I have standard wing tips and wish to install the flush type nav and strobe
lights. My question is can you make a decent job of cutting the tips
yourself and fabricating them to accept the flush light kit? Too lazy and
lousy to send back to USA (Vans)for the correct tips. I suspect it can be
done, and would like comments, from those who may have gone down this path.
Best regards.
Les Rowles.
Traralgon Australia.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gar & Jan Pessel" <pessel(at)ptialaska.net> |
| Subject: | Re: LASAR Harness |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Duane Bentley" <dbentley(at)fuse.net>
Subject: RV-List: LASAR Harness
>
> For those of you who have installed the LASAR system on your Lycoming, I
> have a question relative to the low voltage control harness. I decided to
> check the archives relative to where some builders put the box on the
> firewall. One of the responses back was someone who said he could only
> install it on one side due to the length (short) LV control harness. I
had
> ordered my engine from Vans (new 0-360) over a year ago, with the LASAR
> system installed. After mounting the engine months ago and now just
> finishing up the wiring, I find that the LASAR harness leads are nearly
36"
> in length! I could install this thing anywhere and assuming I mount it on
> the firewall as would normally be expected, will have to coil up and
secure
> probably two feet of coil length.
>
This is apparently typical. I got the engine with the Lasar installed, and
looped the leads on the firewall with adel clamps. The installation is
clean. My airplane is just finished and not flown yet. However, on first
try for start up, it coughed and came to life without a problem. After all
the other troubles on this airplane, I was, needless to say, astonished.
First flight should be this weekend, weather permitting.
Incidentally, my installation came without a warning light for ignition
failure. I found out that one was offerred by Unison, so I made two phone
calls to Texas and got the light for 37 bucks plus shipping. It turned out
to be one of those push to test warning lights you can buy from Aircraft
Spruce for 17 bucks. Oh well. Gar Pessel, Fairbanks, AK
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
John,
No. Highly recommend Scott Smith - SkySmith.Very good rates and Excellent service.
Chuck Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (flying-Westerly , RI)
From: John Perri <JPERRI(at)AROS.NET>
Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
To: RV List
Subject: RV-List: insurance
Date: Thu, 16 May 2002 19:20:34 -0600
-- RV-List message posted by: John Perri
I know this one has been beat to death but, I just got my renewal notice
from Avemco.. Wow! 30+% what an increase. Is this what others are
seeing? I remember Skysmith and one other company being recommended by
the group. What seems to be the consensus on the best company to insure
my 6?
Thanks
JMP RV-6 700hrs.
Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. Click Here
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flush lights. |
Les,
We went with RMD lights - Not difficult to cutin and fit. Excellent service.
Chuck Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (flying-Westerly, RI)
From: Les Rowles <LMROWLES(at)NETSPACE.NET.AU>
Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: Flush lights.
Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 12:11:08 +1000
-- RV-List message posted by: Les Rowles
Hello to all,
I have standard wing tips and wish to install the flush type nav and strobe
lights. My question is can you make a decent job of cutting the tips
yourself and fabricating them to accept the flush light kit? Too lazy and
lousy to send back to USA (Vans)for the correct tips. I suspect it can be
done, and would like comments, from those who may have gone down this path.
Best regards.
Les Rowles.
Traralgon Australia.
Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. Click Here
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Price difference RV-6 vs RV-8 |
Ollie and other Listers:
> I have also wondered why the big price difference especially when the
build
> cost is about same.I guess one reason is that there is far less 8's
flying
> than 6's.
Personally, when it comes to price I think that we are comparing different
airplanes (no pun intended). I believe that if you build an RV-8x the same
way as you would an RV-6x then the cost would be similar. However, it seems
to me that the RV-8x is being built by those pent-up performance types that
want power, speed, aerobatics, IFR, centre line balance, etc. On the
average they seem to contain 180HP, variable prop, and lots of expensive
goodies. On the other hand it seems like the average RV-6x - over the
years, has about 150HP, fixed prop, VFR, etc. I was going to build an
minimal RV-6A but at the last minute the RV-9A was announced with an O-235.
I would have skewed the average even more. Actually, the RV-8x has been so
successful that Van should derive from it a single seater using an M14P
radial - call it the RV-47 Thunderbolt. Just my opinion, FWIW obviously do
not archive
Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop
Finish Kit 15% Complete
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ernest Kells" <ernest.kells(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Flush lights. |
Hello, Les:
The shipping cost to Australia will kill you. Wing tips are big! Vans has
some after market solutions available, depending on what project you are
building. Look on-line - or on P47 and P 48 of the latest catalogue.
> I have standard wing tips and wish to install the flush type nav and
strobe
> lights. My question is can you make a decent job of cutting the tips
> yourself and fabricating them to accept the flush light kit? Too lazy and
> lousy to send back to USA (Vans)for the correct tips. I suspect it can be
> done, and would like comments, from those who may have gone down this
path.
> Best regards.
> Les Rowles.
> Traralgon Australia.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: right brake cylinders |
same master cylinders on both sides. The dual brake system can also be filled
by pumping brake fluid into the system using the bleeder valve on the wheel
cylinders.
Best to do it this way.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: LASAR Harness |
I would contact Harry Fenton if I had a question about ANY Unison product.
harry(at)unisonindustries.com Any answers from others may be pure speculation.
Harry is their engineer.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Duane Bentley" <dbentley(at)fuse.net>
Subject: RV-List: LASAR Harness
For those of you who have installed the LASAR system on your Lycoming, I
have a question relative to the low voltage control harness. I decided to
check the archives relative to where some builders put the box on the
firewall. One of the responses back was someone who said he could only
install it on one side due to the length (short) LV control harness. I had
ordered my engine from Vans (new 0-360) over a year ago, with the LASAR
system installed. After mounting the engine months ago and now just
finishing up the wiring, I find that the LASAR harness leads are nearly 36"
in length! I could install this thing anywhere and assuming I mount it on
the firewall as would normally be expected, will have to coil up and secure
probably two feet of coil length.
Is this typical or should I call Unison and ask if they originally sent me
the wrong length leads?
Thanks
Duane Bentley
RV6 (Finishing, still)
West Chester, OH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net> |
There are different length harnesses available. I have the shortest ones,
they are about 12" long (actually, the left mag harness is a little longer
than the right). I mounted the box on the upper right firewall, and I still
had to loop the harnesses a little.
John Huft
RV8qb Pagosa Spring, CO
www.lazy8.net/rv8.htm
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Duane Bentley
Subject: RV-List: LASAR Harness
For those of you who have installed the LASAR system on your Lycoming, I
have a question relative to the low voltage control harness. I decided to
check the archives relative to where some builders put the box on the
firewall. One of the responses back was someone who said he could only
install it on one side due to the length (short) LV control harness. I had
ordered my engine from Vans (new 0-360) over a year ago, with the LASAR
system installed. After mounting the engine months ago and now just
finishing up the wiring, I find that the LASAR harness leads are nearly 36"
in length! I could install this thing anywhere and assuming I mount it on
the firewall as would normally be expected, will have to coil up and secure
probably two feet of coil length.
Is this typical or should I call Unison and ask if they originally sent me
the wrong length leads?
Thanks
Duane Bentley
RV6 (Finishing, still)
West Chester, OH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DAN TOUPAL" <Daedalys(at)starband.net> |
| Subject: | RV6 Wing and Empennage for sale |
I have an RV6(A) wing kit and 2 empennage kits for
sale as a package. Wing kit includes prebuilt spars
(anodized) and fuel tanks (already sealed). Ribs are
located to spars and skins drilled to ribs and spars. One
empennage kit completed less assembly. The other kit has
not been worked on and includes the 0.020 skins. As well,
I have a jig built from 4" square tubing with welded base
and cross-member. Jig is rigged for both wings and wings
are currently loaded so I can send pictures or see
www.toupal.com. Look under INTERESTS. Kits are complete
including all hardware, prints, manuals, and receipts.
Pictures on request. Asking $4000 OBO for everything. I
am in the Southern California area. Please email for
further information.
Daedalys(at)starband.net
Regards,
Dan Toupal
Dan <><
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gert <gert(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: right brake cylinders |
So, what prevents the pilot side reservoir from filling up when you step
on the copilot brake ?? assuming separate reservoirs for the story here.
kinda like, i pump fluid from the wheel to both brake cylinders and both
brake cylinder reservoirs fill up and because the lines are T'ed
somewhere, the fluid passes through each brake cylinder, pilot and
copilot side so to speak. ( assuming each side has it's own reservoir
here for a sec.)
Now, isn't this the same as, you step on the pilot brake, displacing
fluid which goes to the brake and, because the lines are T'ed together
somewhere, through the copilot brake cylinder into the copilot reservoir
side. Never to build up pressure as the fluid passes freely through the
non active cylinder into that reservoir. Just as if you where pumping it
frome the wheel brake up to bleed the system.
To my simple brains, there must be a checkvalve somewhere in each
cylinder, preventing fluid from going through the master brake cylinder,
not being stepped on. but then, you also could not back bleed.
The only way I can see this work if the brake cylinders are not T'ed but
sit in series. I.e. the reservoir side of the pilot side goes to the
brake side of the copilot side. now when you step on the copilot side
the pressure builds up through the pilot side to the brake.
The pilot side brake gets is fluid from the copilot reservoir.
Hmmmmmmmm]
Gert
Rv6238(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> same master cylinders on both sides. The dual brake system can also be filled
> by pumping brake fluid into the system using the bleeder valve on the wheel
> cylinders.
> Best to do it this way.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Merced/ Bakersfield |
Can you tell me exactly where the fly-in will be held? I will be in
California on June 1 wondering how I was going to spend the day !!
Len Leggette RV-8A
N901LL (res)
Greensboro, N.C.
Hanger # 23 at INT
Double Tree Hotel has also blocked off 60-70 very nice rooms for this event
at $ 59.00 per night, Transportation to and from will be provided.
Bakersfield is located approximately 100 miles south of Los Angeles in the
southern tip of the San Joaquin Valley.
If you like RV-3, 4, 6, and the Rockets this is the place to be. Please come
and meet the pilots and see their planes
Bakersfield EAA 71 annual BBQ Fly-In @ (L45) will be on June 1st, 2002
All food will be catered by the Getaway Cafe & the Outback Restaurant
In addition to all of the awesome experimental aircraft on display,
there will be custom hot rod and motorcycle display
Live music all day long
Info: call John Harmon (611) 836-1028 or e-mail hr2pilot(at)aol.com
or
Tim Barnes (661) 393-4100 or e-mail EAABKFD71(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
Anyone interested in a H2AD first run zero time since overhaul contact
me off-list.
Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C.
Do not achieve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane<n8wv(at)earthlink.net> |
rv8list , rv-list
| Subject: | RV-8(A) Map Pockets... |
I have just posted some pictures of the map pockets I made and installed in my
-8A... If you looking for more places to put stuff, you should have a look...
I go the idea from Stu McCurdy's RV-8...
http://vondane.com/rv8a/finish/finish10.htm - bottom of the page...
-Bill VonDane, Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A - N8WV
http://vondane.com/rv8a/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Danclovic" <pauldan(at)mindspring.com> |
Hey all,
I have an 8A and the gear mount weldment has a lug on the
forward attach arm and I can't seem to figure out what goes on it.
The plans show the lug, but nothing bolted to it. What's it for?
Thanks
Paul Danclovic
8A just received finish kit
Fayetteville GA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane<n8wv(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Gear leg mount |
It's probably the mount point for the rear seat rudder pedal pivot...
Hey all,
I have an 8A and the gear mount weldment has a lug on the
forward attach arm and I can't seem to figure out what goes on it.
The plans show the lug, but nothing bolted to it. What's it for?
Thanks
Paul Danclovic
8A just received finish kit
Fayetteville GA
-Bill VonDane, Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A - N8WV
http://vondane.com/rv8a/
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RV-8(A) Map Pockets... |
They look great Bill!
Will any water find its way into those pockets from the canopy/skirt
junction?
Todd Wenzel
Delafield, WI USA
RV-8AQB - Finish Kit
TWenzel@Heartland-Software.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill VonDane [mailto:n8wv(at)earthlink.net]
Subject: RV-List: RV-8(A) Map Pockets...
I have just posted some pictures of the map pockets I made and installed
in my -8A... If you looking for more places to put stuff, you should
have a look... I go the idea from Stu McCurdy's RV-8...
http://vondane.com/rv8a/finish/finish10.htm - bottom of the page...
-Bill VonDane, Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A - N8WV
http://vondane.com/rv8a/
________________________________________________________________________________
That's for mounting an idler arm for the rear seat rudder "pedals" if
you bought that option.
Todd Wenzel
Delafield, WI USA
RV-8AQB - Finish Kit
TWenzel@Heartland-Software.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Danclovic [mailto:pauldan(at)mindspring.com]
Subject: RV-List: Gear leg mount
Hey all,
I have an 8A and the gear mount weldment has a lug on the forward attach
arm and I can't seem to figure out what goes on it. The plans show the
lug, but nothing bolted to it. What's it for? Thanks
Paul Danclovic
8A just received finish kit
Fayetteville GA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane<n8wv(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | RV-8(A) Map Pockets... |
Never thought of that... But, not if you goop the seam with something... You
could run a bead of silicone on the inside...
wrote:
They look great Bill!
Will any water find its way into those pockets from the canopy/skirt
junction?
Todd Wenzel
Delafield, WI USA
RV-8AQB - Finish Kit
TWenzel@Heartland-Software.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill VonDane [mailto:n8wv(at)earthlink.net]
Subject: RV-List: RV-8(A) Map Pockets...
I have just posted some pictures of the map pockets I made and installed
in my -8A... If you looking for more places to put stuff, you should
have a look... I go the idea from Stu McCurdy's RV-8...
http://vondane.com/rv8a/finish/finish10.htm - bottom of the page...
-Bill VonDane, Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A - N8WV
http://vondane.com/rv8a/
-Bill VonDane, Colorado Springs, CO
RV-8A - N8WV
http://vondane.com/rv8a/
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | right brake cylinders |
You're right, what makes sense IS the way it works. The 2 master cylinders
for each wheel are in series. Either cylinder can pressurize the downstream
line to the brake. The master cylinder acts like a pump when depressed, with
a pressure relief when extended so the brake puck can back off.
Regards,
Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
RV-6 N6GY ...project Phoenix
Navion N5221K - size XXL RV-6A
>
> So, what prevents the pilot side reservoir from filling up
> when you step
> on the copilot brake ?? assuming separate reservoirs for the
> story here.
>
>
> kinda like, i pump fluid from the wheel to both brake
> cylinders and both
> brake cylinder reservoirs fill up and because the lines are T'ed
> somewhere, the fluid passes through each brake cylinder, pilot and
> copilot side so to speak. ( assuming each side has it's own reservoir
> here for a sec.)
>
> Now, isn't this the same as, you step on the pilot brake, displacing
> fluid which goes to the brake and, because the lines are T'ed
> together
> somewhere, through the copilot brake cylinder into the
> copilot reservoir
> side. Never to build up pressure as the fluid passes freely
> through the
> non active cylinder into that reservoir. Just as if you where
> pumping it
> frome the wheel brake up to bleed the system.
>
> To my simple brains, there must be a checkvalve somewhere in each
> cylinder, preventing fluid from going through the master
> brake cylinder,
> not being stepped on. but then, you also could not back bleed.
>
> The only way I can see this work if the brake cylinders are
> not T'ed but
> sit in series. I.e. the reservoir side of the pilot side goes to the
> brake side of the copilot side. now when you step on the copilot side
> the pressure builds up through the pilot side to the brake.
>
> The pilot side brake gets is fluid from the copilot reservoir.
>
>
> Hmmmmmmmm]
>
> Gert
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Bower" <rvbuilder(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
I have seen some preliminary reports about the -4 which crashed near
Jonesboro, Arkansas. Somebody speculated that perhaps mud daubers got into
the fuel tank vent line, causing fuel starvation.
My question is: Can a metal screen be used over the vent lines to keep
insects out?
Jim Bower
St. Louis, MO
RV-6A Fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Arthur and Christine" <act1(at)reap.org.nz> |
Finally got organized and made up a website for our RV-8 project down here
in Kiwiland (New Zealand).
Anyone that maybe interested the address is
www.airchartertaupo.co.nz/rv8.htm
Cheers
Chris & Arthur
info(at)airchartertaupo.co.nz
RV8 getting ready for paint
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Paulbaird(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: ELT Antenna Location |
We got the AK-350 which came with an antenna. We put the antenna under the
empenage fairing. No drag and I guess the tail is more likely to stay on
than a wing in a crash landing.
Paul
RV-9A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
In a message dated 5/17/02 3:43:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
rvbuilder(at)hotmail.com writes:
<< My question is: Can a metal screen be used over the vent lines to keep
insects out?
Jim Bower
St. Louis, MO
RV-6A Fuse >>
Jim,
Somewhere in the plans (maybe a sketch), it shows doing exactly what you
mention.
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
I saw an RV-8 on the way to SNF that had the little flapper valves on
the vent lines that you often see on Super Cub pitot tubes. The ones
that are hinged and blow open once you have some speed. I thought it
was a neat alternative to the screens.
-
Larry Bowen
RV-8 fuse
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Bower
> Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 3:42 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas
>
>
>
> I have seen some preliminary reports about the -4 which crashed near
> Jonesboro, Arkansas. Somebody speculated that perhaps mud
> daubers got into
> the fuel tank vent line, causing fuel starvation.
>
> My question is: Can a metal screen be used over the vent
> lines to keep
> insects out?
>
> Jim Bower
> St. Louis, MO
> RV-6A Fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carlfro(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
I used screens. I made a transition from 1/4" to 3/8" tube for about the
last 10" of run. I did a 45 degree cut on the end of the 3/8" tube, then
used JB Weld to epoxy on a small piece of aluminum screen. After the JB
weld cures, a quick touch on the scotch brite wheel to buff off any excess
epoxy and/or screen and you are done.
Carl Froehlich
RV-8A (first engine start last week)
Vienna, VA
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Larry Bowen
Subject: RE: RV-List: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas
I saw an RV-8 on the way to SNF that had the little flapper valves on
the vent lines that you often see on Super Cub pitot tubes. The ones
that are hinged and blow open once you have some speed. I thought it
was a neat alternative to the screens.
-
Larry Bowen
RV-8 fuse
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Bower
> Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 3:42 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas
>
>
> I have seen some preliminary reports about the -4 which crashed near
> Jonesboro, Arkansas. Somebody speculated that perhaps mud
> daubers got into
> the fuel tank vent line, causing fuel starvation.
>
> My question is: Can a metal screen be used over the vent
> lines to keep
> insects out?
>
> Jim Bower
> St. Louis, MO
> RV-6A Fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick DeCramer" <diesel(at)rconnect.com> |
| Subject: | ELT Antenna Location |
Paulbaird(at)aol.com placed his under the empenage fairing which meant it
had to lay horizontal. I know of others who have done the same but I
question if it will give a good directional signal in this position. As
an ATC controller in my past life I tracked many ELTs and one in
particular was in a Cessna 421 which crashed in the woods of Northern
Wisconsin. We had F4's overhead within minutes of the crash which we
watched take place on radar while talking to the pilot so we had a
location but the F4's came up empty. After 24 hours of searching an
area were we knew he went down someone found the wreckage between trees
lying on its side destorting the ELT return so it could only be recieved
from directly overhead. We now are dealing with new generation ELTs.
Does that problem go away with this new equipment? Can we get the
performance out of antennae mounted horizontal? I will mount mine
horizontal if someone with the knowledge says performance will not be
significantly hampered as I don't wish external drag either. If not, I
will mount mine in the baggage area under the plexiglas canopy.
Ameriking was not very helpful when I questioned them on this same
subject. Do we have a good Avionics person who can shed light on this?
Dick DeCramer
Minnesota
RV6 wiring
N500DD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | ELT Antenna Location |
Geeez,
I try to stay on the sidelines, but its early in the am I can't resist.
How do we know what position our airplane will be resting when it has been
wrecked? If you mount yours vertical in the baggage area and your plane ends
up on its side (as you suggest in your note below), then it will be
horizontal just like the one that is mounted under the rear empenage
fairing.
If you want to make an argument about not putting it under the empenage
fairing (where mine is, and where it will stay), then argue that the
surrounding metal of the vertical and horizontal stab, and the underlying
tailcone of the fuselage will greatly decrease the radiation pattern of the
antenna's signal... That is the issue, not the fact that its laying on its
side.
Jim
Tampa
(happy with an invisible ELT antenna)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Dick DeCramer
Subject: RV-List: ELT Antenna Location
Paulbaird(at)aol.com placed his under the empenage fairing which meant it
had to lay horizontal. I know of others who have done the same but I
question if it will give a good directional signal in this position. As
an ATC controller in my past life I tracked many ELTs and one in
particular was in a Cessna 421 which crashed in the woods of Northern
Wisconsin. We had F4's overhead within minutes of the crash which we
watched take place on radar while talking to the pilot so we had a
location but the F4's came up empty. After 24 hours of searching an
area were we knew he went down someone found the wreckage between trees
lying on its side destorting the ELT return so it could only be recieved
from directly overhead. We now are dealing with new generation ELTs.
Does that problem go away with this new equipment? Can we get the
performance out of antennae mounted horizontal? I will mount mine
horizontal if someone with the knowledge says performance will not be
significantly hampered as I don't wish external drag either. If not, I
will mount mine in the baggage area under the plexiglas canopy.
Ameriking was not very helpful when I questioned them on this same
subject. Do we have a good Avionics person who can shed light on this?
Dick DeCramer
Minnesota
RV6 wiring
N500DD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tom sargent <sarg314(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: ELT Antenna Location |
Jim Norman wrote:
> Geeez,
> I try to stay on the sidelines, but its early in the am I can't resist.
>
Me too, Jim.
Here's what I did: On the advice of Gus (I think it was Gus) at Van's I
put my ELT AND its antenna in the wingtip. The antenna mounts next to
the ELT perpendicular to the end rib which serves as its ground plane.
It's longer than the space in the wing tip. but it's flexible and just
leans over like a bent whip - which it is exactly. The reasoning is
that it's fairly likely to remain intact (probably not as likely as in
the empenage), and if it does remain intact, the transmission pattern
will be superior to one with it's antenna buried in an empenage or
fuselage location. Any location you pick, represents a collection of
trade-offs and guesses. I just couldn't see placing an antenna under
all that close fitting sheet metal and still expect it to work worth a
darn.
--
Tom Sargent. RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken Brooks" <kdbrv8r(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Pacific Oil Cooler |
Dear List-ers,
I was one who called Pacific Oil Cooler right away when another
builder reported that the prices were going up on their beautifully
built 9-row cooler for my I0-360. It was obvious that I was not the
first to call, as the person with whom I spoke lamented the "beating" he
was taking from the many of us who were hoping to get the non-certified
version for $205 (It was not Skid Saurenman). After the dust settled,
the best price I could get was $250, so I paid by CC and got the oil
cooler a few days later. It is gorgeous (never thought I'd use that
adjective for a hunk of aluminum, other than my RV-8 of course!) To
make a long story short, read the e-mail I got back...
From: "SKID SAURENMAN" <pacificoilcooler(at)hotmail.com>
> Ken,
> I took time to look up your invoice and you are correct about being
charged
> the wrong price. You were charged as you said $250.00 however you
should
> have been charged 205.00. We are going to credit your account this
afternoon
> and send you the credit slip. Sorry for the mix up and we appreciate
your
> business.
> Sincerely Skid Saurenman
> Pacific Oil Cooler Service inc.
In my humble opinion, we should honor this type of commitment to
customer satisfaction with our business. The product is first rate and
he's willing to forego potential profit for sales volume and customer
satisfaction -- SMART!! Please Archive.
Ken in Roscoe, IL
RV-8, staring at the uncut canopy and getting ready to order engine by
Bart
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Calvert" <rv6(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: ELT Antenna Location |
Nice....where was the test button mounted?
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok RV6
----- Original Message -----
From: "tom sargent" <sarg314(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: ELT Antenna Location
>
> Jim Norman wrote:
> > Geeez,
> > I try to stay on the sidelines, but its early in the am I can't resist.
> >
>
> Me too, Jim.
> Here's what I did: On the advice of Gus (I think it was Gus) at Van's I
> put my ELT AND its antenna in the wingtip. The antenna mounts next to
> the ELT perpendicular to the end rib which serves as its ground plane.
> It's longer than the space in the wing tip. but it's flexible and just
> leans over like a bent whip - which it is exactly. The reasoning is
> that it's fairly likely to remain intact (probably not as likely as in
> the empenage), and if it does remain intact, the transmission pattern
> will be superior to one with it's antenna buried in an empenage or
> fuselage location. Any location you pick, represents a collection of
> trade-offs and guesses. I just couldn't see placing an antenna under
> all that close fitting sheet metal and still expect it to work worth a
> darn.
> --
> Tom Sargent. RV-6A
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
I'd use the screens. You want air to be able to go both directions when it's
sitting on the ramp and the flapper could act like a check valve.
"DESCRIPTION
WITNESS DESCRIBED HEARING A LOUD "POP" AFTER THE EXPERIMENTAL ACFT TOOK
OFF, ..." Doesn't sound like bugs in the vent to me.
Dave -6 So Cal
Larry Bowen wrote:
>
> I saw an RV-8 on the way to SNF that had the little flapper valves on
> the vent lines...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net> |
| Subject: | 8th Annual Twin Cities RV Forum |
For anyone interested in seeing pictures from our RV Forum of a couple
weeks ago, there are two photo albums on the following website (thanks
to Jim Wittman who took the photos and to Doug Weiler for posting them):
<http://members5.clubphoto.com/douglas349694/owner-a591-1.phtml>
http://members5.clubphoto.com/douglas349694/owner-a591-1.phtml
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 146 hours
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
> I have seen some preliminary reports about the -4 which crashed near
> Jonesboro, Arkansas. Somebody speculated that perhaps mud daubers got into
>
> the fuel tank vent line, causing fuel starvation.
>
> My question is: Can a metal screen be used over the vent lines to keep
> insects out?
>
I tried this after mud daubers plugged one of the vents on my -6A, which
happily I discovered on preflight. The screens wouldn't stay stuck. I used
pro-seal rather than JB weld, so maybe that was the problem. My fix, which
is simple and quick in the extreme, was to take a piece of safety wire about
6 inches long and bend a wavy "crinkle" in it for most of its length, and a
loop in the end. This causes it to be a snug friction fit in the
fitting/tubing. It will stay in place and come out with a gentle pull. It
seems more than sufficient to keep the crtitters out, since there is no room
for them to get by with the wire in place. Air breathes into and out of the
tank just fine. Quick and simple item on preflight: remove wire, inspect for
bug guts or mud particles, re-insert until loop is flush against the fitting.
I have used this for three years now with no mud daubers and no missing
pieces lost in flight, etc. I have snagged my shirt a few times on the loops
when crawling around under the cowling, so be careful to shape the loops just
right. YMMV.
-Bill B
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net> |
| Subject: | Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
This reminds me of a new Cessna 182 I saw (oooh, did I say that word?) that
used plastic pot scrubbers (the ones that look like steel wool) to keep bugs
out of the cabin air intakes. I wonder if those would work here, or if the
daubers would think that was a good start on a nest.
I had plans to use the sintered metal plugs that Van's sells for the brake
master cylinder vents...any comments on that idea?
I have posted new pictures of my Sam James plenum installation at
http://www.lazy8.net/fwf2.html
John Huft RV8qb
Pagosa Springs, CO
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
SportAV8R(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas
> I have seen some preliminary reports about the -4 which crashed near
> Jonesboro, Arkansas. Somebody speculated that perhaps mud daubers got
into
>
> the fuel tank vent line, causing fuel starvation.
>
> My question is: Can a metal screen be used over the vent lines to keep
> insects out?
>
I tried this after mud daubers plugged one of the vents on my -6A, which
happily I discovered on preflight. The screens wouldn't stay stuck. I used
pro-seal rather than JB weld, so maybe that was the problem. My fix, which
is simple and quick in the extreme, was to take a piece of safety wire about
6 inches long and bend a wavy "crinkle" in it for most of its length, and a
loop in the end. This causes it to be a snug friction fit in the
fitting/tubing. It will stay in place and come out with a gentle pull. It
seems more than sufficient to keep the crtitters out, since there is no room
for them to get by with the wire in place. Air breathes into and out of the
tank just fine. Quick and simple item on preflight: remove wire, inspect
for
bug guts or mud particles, re-insert until loop is flush against the
fitting.
I have used this for three years now with no mud daubers and no missing
pieces lost in flight, etc. I have snagged my shirt a few times on the
loops
when crawling around under the cowling, so be careful to shape the loops
just
right. YMMV.
-Bill B
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
John, clever idea about using the brake fluid tank cap on the fuel vents.
One thing I can think of is to check whether the caps would support the
amount of airflow through the vent when the fuel tank is being sucked on by
the engine. While the cap sits on the brake fluid tank it has plenty of
time for air to seep through to balance and pressure differential caused by
the slow loss of brake fluid. The question is (and I have no idea of how
much resistance the cap offers to airflow) whether it would impede
equalization of pressure in the fuel tank. I would assume if you can blow
through the cap without much resistance that would be good enough.
The only other thing is the Sinterer cap appears to have a number of small
holes for air pressure equalization. Could they easily be plugged by a
splash of mud on the cap?
All I can think of that you might want to check.
Ed Anderson
Matthews, NC
eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas
>
> This reminds me of a new Cessna 182 I saw (oooh, did I say that word?)
that
> used plastic pot scrubbers (the ones that look like steel wool) to keep
bugs
> out of the cabin air intakes. I wonder if those would work here, or if the
> daubers would think that was a good start on a nest.
>
> I had plans to use the sintered metal plugs that Van's sells for the brake
> master cylinder vents...any comments on that idea?
>
> I have posted new pictures of my Sam James plenum installation at
>
> http://www.lazy8.net/fwf2.html
>
> John Huft RV8qb
> Pagosa Springs, CO
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> SportAV8R(at)aol.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas
>
>
> > I have seen some preliminary reports about the -4 which crashed near
> > Jonesboro, Arkansas. Somebody speculated that perhaps mud daubers got
> into
> >
> > the fuel tank vent line, causing fuel starvation.
> >
> > My question is: Can a metal screen be used over the vent lines to keep
> > insects out?
> >
>
> I tried this after mud daubers plugged one of the vents on my -6A, which
> happily I discovered on preflight. The screens wouldn't stay stuck. I
used
> pro-seal rather than JB weld, so maybe that was the problem. My fix,
which
> is simple and quick in the extreme, was to take a piece of safety wire
about
> 6 inches long and bend a wavy "crinkle" in it for most of its length, and
a
> loop in the end. This causes it to be a snug friction fit in the
> fitting/tubing. It will stay in place and come out with a gentle pull.
It
> seems more than sufficient to keep the crtitters out, since there is no
room
> for them to get by with the wire in place. Air breathes into and out of
the
> tank just fine. Quick and simple item on preflight: remove wire, inspect
> for
> bug guts or mud particles, re-insert until loop is flush against the
> fitting.
> I have used this for three years now with no mud daubers and no missing
> pieces lost in flight, etc. I have snagged my shirt a few times on the
> loops
> when crawling around under the cowling, so be careful to shape the loops
> just
> right. YMMV.
>
> -Bill B
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tom sargent <sarg314(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: ELT Antenna Location |
Jerry:
I have the ACK ELT. It has a little remote control panel with manual
"on" and "off" switches and an indicator light. I'll mount that in the
instrument panel. Otherwise. access is by removing the umpteen screws
that hold the wingtip on.
--
Tom Sargent.
Jerry Calvert wrote:
>
> Nice....where was the test button mounted?
>
> Jerry Calvert
> Edmond Ok RV6
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "tom sargent" <sarg314(at)earthlink.net>
>
> > Here's what I did: On the advice of Gus (I think it was Gus) at Van's I
> > put my ELT AND its antenna in the wingtip.
> > --
> > Tom Sargent. RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charles Brame <charleyb(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Engine Run Without Wings |
Stein,
I am approaching my first engine run and like you, I plan to do it at
home in my driveway and without the wings attached. In fact, I would
even like to taxi it up and down the street in front of the house (I've
been jokingly telling my neighbors of the plan for a year or so now and
now they are expecting and even looking forward to the event.
Question: How did you supply the fuel?
Charlie
RV-6A N11CB (Res.)
San Antonio
Wiring and plumbing.
---------------------------------------------
> From: "Stein Bruch"
> Subject: RV-List: First Engine Run & new RV6 project!
>
>
> Hi All,
>
> I just wanted to report a singificant step (in my eyes) towards completion
> of my plane. I can't imagine what kind of grin I'll have after the first
> flight, because today's engine run was pretty exciting!
>
> We just ran the engine for the first time today.
>
---------------snip----------------------
> Anyway, I know you're wondering where I ran it. I ran it in my driveway (no
> wings, sandbags in the baggage/passenger seat, and helping hand with fire
> extinguisher,holding the tail, and looking for leaks) in a townhouse
> development. The whole neighboorhood heard, and it drew some comments
> like..."We never thought we'd see the day" from neighboors!
>
-------------------------snip----------------
Cheers,
Stein Bruch, Minneapolis
RV6 N664SB,
Windshield fairing and cowling finishing.
RV6 number 2,
Fuselage being skinned in Jig.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pete Bodie" <rv6apjb(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Terminal lugs for #8 cable |
I have been looking all over for A terminal lug for a #8 cable with a
5/16 hole. Can anybody please direct me to a web page or other source.
Pete Bodie
RV6A N164PD
Hooking up engine
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV4" <VansRV4GRVMJ(at)btinternet.com> |
Hi,
Can anyone with an O -320 partscatalog tell me the partnumber for a Camshaft
with integral gear for an O -320 E2A?
Marcel
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Terminal lugs for #8 cable |
In a message dated 5/19/2002 10:54:22 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
rv6apjb(at)attbi.com writes:
>
>
>
>
>
> I have been looking all over for A terminal lug for a #8 cable with a
> 5/16 hole. Can anybody please direct me to a web page or other source.
>
> Pete Bodie
> RV6A N164PD
> Hooking up engine
>
I got mine at West Marine
Cash
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jonathan Weiswasser <jonweisw(at)rcn.com> |
Dear List:
I am having a little trouble understanding the placement of the F-855
gusset, which stabilizes the lower longeron to the firewall angle. The
plans/drawings are extremely vague. Specifically:
1) Where does the gusset sit? It seems that DWG 30, fig X-X' depicts it
as outside the firewall angle - but does it sit between the aux longeron
and the weldment or between the skin and the longeron?
2) The manual references holes drilled in the gusset from both the F-843
and F-844 longerons. How can that be? The gusset does not have enough
length to reach around and cover both longerons. I can't tell from the
plans if it is supposed to or not. Do I have it oriented incorrectly?
3) There are pre-punched holes which do not correspond to any in the
angle on the firewall, or any in the prepunched skins, etc... Is this
correct?
Any help is greatly appreciated.
Jon Weiswasser
N898JW
Fuselage
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Builder's Bookstore" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Question about Systems video |
> The Orndorff Systems video covers the following systems on an RV-6A with a
> carbureted 0-360.
ENGINE SYSTEMS
1] Engine cooling systems. (assembling baffles and fitting them to the cowl)
2] Oil cooler placement and installation, including oil lines
3] Accessory cooling tube placement and installation
4] Throttle, mixture and prop control cables
5] Engine instrument sender installations
6] Vacuum pump installation
7] Fuel system. (gascolator, primer, fuel lines, firesleeve, etc...)
8] Cabin heat baffles and control
9] Constructing hoses
ELECTRICAL & PANEL
1] Construction of the panel and a dampened sub-panel
2] Placing and mounting instruments, switches, and circuit breakers
3] Electrical systems wiring and good connectors
4] Wiring the ignition, starter systems, and solenoids
5] Antenna place
OTHER SYSTEMS
1] Bleeding brakes
2] Sound proofing
3] Cabin ventilation system
4] A little on paint prep, painting, and striping
Here is the direct link to the detail and order page on Builder's Bookstore
Andy
> Hi listers,
> I have the Orndorf videos for most everything except the systems tape. I am
> now at that stage of construction. Being that airplanes are so widely
> different and the tape is $ 40. Could somebody who has it give me an idea
> of the systems it covers. I have a VM1000 and a carburated 0-360 aerosport.
> RV-6 pretty standard.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Engine Run Without Wings |
| From: | Joe Wiza <planejoel(at)juno.com> |
Van's say's don't do it with out the wings on
Joe
RV6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Builder's Bookstore" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
| Subject: | Systems video question - correction |
The Orndorff Systems video covers the following systems on an RV-6A with a
carbureted 0-360.
ENGINE SYSTEMS
1] Engine cooling systems. (assembling baffles and fitting them to the cowl)
2] Oil cooler placement and installation, including oil lines
3] Accessory cooling tube placement and installation
4] Throttle, mixture and prop control cables
5] Engine instrument sender installations
6] Vacuum pump installation
7] Fuel system. (gascolator, primer, fuel lines, firesleeve, etc...)
8] Cabin heat baffles and control
9] Constructing hoses
ELECTRICAL & PANEL
1] Construction of the panel and a dampened sub-panel
2] Placing and mounting instruments, switches, and circuit breakers
3] Electrical systems wiring and good connectors
4] Wiring the ignition, starter systems, and solenoids
5] Antenna place
OTHER SYSTEMS
1] Bleeding brakes
2] Sound proofing
3] Cabin ventilation system
4] A little on paint prep, painting, and striping
Here is the direct link to the detail and order page on Builder's Bookstore:
http://buildersbooks.com/aircraft_engine_systems.htm
Andy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Pacific Oil Cooler |
From the RV Yeller Pages:
# PACIFIC OIL COOLER SERVICE 800-866-7335 http://www.oilcoolers.com/ OIL
COOLER SALES AND SERVICE
The Yeller Pages is a great list of supplier info, updated regularly.
http://www.sound.net/%7Ehartmann/yelrpage.htm
Kevin Horton
>
>Do you have a 1-800 number for these guys. I need an oil cooler.
>
>Steve Hurlbut
>RV-7A
>O-360 A1A
>Fuselage
>http://members.kingston.net/sjhdcl/rv7a.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RV8DRIVER(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: F-855 Gussets |
Jon, the F-855 goes inside everthing, weldment and F-844 angle, and the
bottom p/p holes should line up with the 5 1/8" holes you drilled from the
skin through the weldment and the F-844. The F-855 does not connect to the
F-843. Look at view C-C' in the lower left corner of the dwg for
clarification.
Good luck, Andy Johnson
________________________________________________________________________________
unsubcribe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Run Without Wings |
In a message dated 5/19/2002 12:58:05 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
planejoel(at)juno.com writes:
> Van's say's don't do it with out the wings on
> Joe
-GV (N1GV)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net> |
| Subject: | Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
Thanks, Ed
I tried blowing through the cap, and it passes air quite well, surely enough
to vent the tank. I am thinking a splash of mud might affect any low wing,
it sounds pretty unlikely. So, I guess I will give it a try.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Ed Anderson
Subject: Re: RV-List: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas
John, clever idea about using the brake fluid tank cap on the fuel vents.
One thing I can think of is to check whether the caps would support the
amount of airflow through the vent when the fuel tank is being sucked on by
the engine. While the cap sits on the brake fluid tank it has plenty of
time for air to seep through to balance and pressure differential caused by
the slow loss of brake fluid. The question is (and I have no idea of how
much resistance the cap offers to airflow) whether it would impede
equalization of pressure in the fuel tank. I would assume if you can blow
through the cap without much resistance that would be good enough.
The only other thing is the Sinterer cap appears to have a number of small
holes for air pressure equalization. Could they easily be plugged by a
splash of mud on the cap?
All I can think of that you might want to check.
Ed Anderson
Matthews, NC
eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas
>
> This reminds me of a new Cessna 182 I saw (oooh, did I say that word?)
that
> used plastic pot scrubbers (the ones that look like steel wool) to keep
bugs
> out of the cabin air intakes. I wonder if those would work here, or if the
> daubers would think that was a good start on a nest.
>
> I had plans to use the sintered metal plugs that Van's sells for the brake
> master cylinder vents...any comments on that idea?
>
> I have posted new pictures of my Sam James plenum installation at
>
> http://www.lazy8.net/fwf2.html
>
> John Huft RV8qb
> Pagosa Springs, CO
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> SportAV8R(at)aol.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas
>
>
> > I have seen some preliminary reports about the -4 which crashed near
> > Jonesboro, Arkansas. Somebody speculated that perhaps mud daubers got
> into
> >
> > the fuel tank vent line, causing fuel starvation.
> >
> > My question is: Can a metal screen be used over the vent lines to keep
> > insects out?
> >
>
> I tried this after mud daubers plugged one of the vents on my -6A, which
> happily I discovered on preflight. The screens wouldn't stay stuck. I
used
> pro-seal rather than JB weld, so maybe that was the problem. My fix,
which
> is simple and quick in the extreme, was to take a piece of safety wire
about
> 6 inches long and bend a wavy "crinkle" in it for most of its length, and
a
> loop in the end. This causes it to be a snug friction fit in the
> fitting/tubing. It will stay in place and come out with a gentle pull.
It
> seems more than sufficient to keep the crtitters out, since there is no
room
> for them to get by with the wire in place. Air breathes into and out of
the
> tank just fine. Quick and simple item on preflight: remove wire, inspect
> for
> bug guts or mud particles, re-insert until loop is flush against the
> fitting.
> I have used this for three years now with no mud daubers and no missing
> pieces lost in flight, etc. I have snagged my shirt a few times on the
> loops
> when crawling around under the cowling, so be careful to shape the loops
> just
> right. YMMV.
>
> -Bill B
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
In a message dated 5/19/02 7:24:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time, rv8tor(at)lazy8.net
writes:
<< Thanks, Ed
I tried blowing through the cap, and it passes air quite well, surely enough
to vent the tank. I am thinking a splash of mud might affect any low wing,
it sounds pretty unlikely. So, I guess I will give it a try.
John >>
One of the most common (the most common?) cause of engine stoppage in
experimental aircraft is fuel system problems. Van's has cautioned
repeatedly not to modify the standard fuel system. Despite that, people
continue to "improve" on a good design.
If you must try this modification to the fuel tank vent system, do it on one
tank only. Then, take off and fly on the other tank until you've achieved
sufficient altitude to make a safe restart or to glide back to a safe
landing. After you switch tanks, fly at full power for a length of time,
watching fuel pressure and carefully monitoring engine function.
Personally, I'm not sure the brake reservour cap will give enough airflow to
provide adequate ventilation. A 160 HP engine can consume up to 15 GPH
running rich at full power and low altitude. A few years ago, the Questair
Venture that won the Sun 100 race had an intermittant engine stoppage during
the race, which was only solved by switching tanks every 30 seconds or so.
The problem? Inadequate fuel tank vents, leading to negative pressure in the
tanks, which starved the engine of fuel and caused it to cut.
Be very, very careful...
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vincent Welch" <welchvincent(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Terminal lugs for #8 cable |
Try Terminal Town. They are listed in the "Yeller Pages."
Vince
>From: "Pete Bodie" <rv6apjb(at)attbi.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: Terminal lugs for #8 cable
>Date: Sun, 19 May 2002 10:52:50 -0700
>
>
>I have been looking all over for A terminal lug for a #8 cable with a
>5/16 hole. Can anybody please direct me to a web page or other source.
>
>Pete Bodie
>RV6A N164PD
>Hooking up engine
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary & Carolyn Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com> |
| Subject: | LSE Installation |
I am currently installing dual LSE Plasma II ignitions and am just wondering
where people have installed the control boxes? The plane is a RV-6 with
tip-up canopy and O-360/CS. Also, where might be a good place to install the
coils for the bottom plugs. If anyone has pictures please point me to the web
site.
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jonathan Weiswasser <jonweisw(at)rcn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: F-855 Gussets |
Andy-
Thanks SO MUCH for the reply. This kind of help is what maked this list
so valuable. How could you build these before the internet?
Anyway, I have included some pix - I hope the didn't take too long to
download. The first depicts how assume it is supposed to be installed
- the bent tab (which has a little gap between it and the weldment as
seen in pix 2) lies inside everything including the weldment. The pp
holes, however, are on the other tab - the one that lies on the fw
angle. If I reverse the orientation and put the tab with the holes on
the weldment, you get picture 3, which clearly has something wrong with it.
If I use the orientation in picture 1, I end up having to center it over
the already drilled 1/8" holes and then bending the tab back a little to
mate flush. DOes that look right?
Thanks again,
Jon
RV8DRIVER(at)aol.com wrote:
>--> RV8-List message posted by: RV8DRIVER(at)aol.com
>
>Jon, the F-855 goes inside everthing, weldment and F-844 angle, and the
>bottom p/p holes should line up with the 5 1/8" holes you drilled from the
>skin through the weldment and the F-844. The F-855 does not connect to the
>F-843. Look at view C-C' in the lower left corner of the dwg for
>clarification.
>Good luck, Andy Johnson
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RVer273sb(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
Listers,
One problem I see with the vented brake reservoir plug
for a fuel tank vent is moisture/ water. I believe you will
find if the stintered filter gets wet it will further restrict air
flow. Now what if that moisture/ water freezes? Not worth
the risk.. The vent system as designed induces some restriction
as it is with the long length and bends. Try blowing thru your vents!
You will be surprised how much resistance there is even in the stock
vent system.
Stewart RV4
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Rauch <rbr(at)apcon.com> |
| Subject: | Electrical CAD drawings |
Would anyone have some CAD drawings of their electrical systems that they might
share. I have seen a number of HTML and PDF drawings of electrical systems but
I would prefer not to recreate them from scratch.
Richard B. Rauch
Email: rbr(at)apcon.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <terrywatson3(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Electrical CAD drawings |
Richard,
Go to Bob Nuckoll's web site at www.aeroelectric.com/ and poke around. He
has CAD files for most or all of the electrical drawings in his book, plus
the CAD blocks that he created to make the drawings.
Terry
>
> Would anyone have some CAD drawings of their electrical systems that they
might share. I have seen a number of HTML and PDF drawings of electrical
systems but I would prefer not to recreate them from scratch.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JVanLaak(at)aol.com |
In general I agree that Van's fuel system works well and any changes are
likely to go in the wrong direction unless very carefully thought through.
However, there are some opportunities to address potential problems.
About 20 years ago I had a forced landing in a midget mustang because of a
mud dauber making a home in a vent line that was marginal to begin with. The
solution I came up with (after going to the next larger size of tubing) was
to make a small fiberglass scoop that both increased the tank head pressure
and incorporated a screen across the 1/2 square inches or so that were its
front opening. I also vented it in the back (also covered with screen) to
keep from overboosting the tank and to protect for the case where the front
might be splashed with mud or grass or something. It is an easy and very
effective solution.
(The accident occured when I took off to chase a Cessna 185 jump plane from a
drop zone 5 miles from my strip and chased them up to 7500 feet. After
watching the jumpers go I pulled the power back and circled down. The engine
quit high enough for me to get back to my place, a 1500 foot strip with
obstacles at both ends, but only for a downwind landing. Had it been an RV-3
I would have made an easy landing, but since it was the Mustang, I ended up
on the nose 20 feet from a stone fence, but with very little damage.)
Jim Van Laak
RV-3 N112RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "kevin lane" <n3773(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Run Without Wings |
I have read that it is possible to flip the fuse over from engine torque
when the wings are not attached because of the lack of outboard weight.
That would make any builder cry, (and neighbor laugh)!
I have bought junk yard engines that have been run with the fuel line
hanging in a coffee can of gas, it's that easy, though obviously dangerous
too. Kevin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Charles Brame" <charleyb(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: Engine Run Without Wings
>
> Stein,
>
> I am approaching my first engine run and like you, I plan to do it at
> home in my driveway and without the wings attached. In fact, I would
> even like to taxi it up and down the street in front of the house (I've
> been jokingly telling my neighbors of the plan for a year or so now and
> now they are expecting and even looking forward to the event.
>
> Question: How did you supply the fuel?
>
> Charlie
> RV-6A N11CB (Res.)
> San Antonio
>
> Wiring and plumbing.
>
> ---------------------------------------------
>
> > From: "Stein Bruch"
> > Subject: RV-List: First Engine Run & new RV6 project!
> >
> >
> > Hi All,
> >
> > I just wanted to report a singificant step (in my eyes) towards
completion
> > of my plane. I can't imagine what kind of grin I'll have after the
first
> > flight, because today's engine run was pretty exciting!
> >
> > We just ran the engine for the first time today.
> >
> ---------------snip----------------------
>
> > Anyway, I know you're wondering where I ran it. I ran it in my driveway
(no
> > wings, sandbags in the baggage/passenger seat, and helping hand with
fire
> > extinguisher,holding the tail, and looking for leaks) in a townhouse
> > development. The whole neighboorhood heard, and it drew some comments
> > like..."We never thought we'd see the day" from neighboors!
> >
> -------------------------snip----------------
>
> Cheers,
> Stein Bruch, Minneapolis
> RV6 N664SB,
> Windshield fairing and cowling finishing.
> RV6 number 2,
> Fuselage being skinned in Jig.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Terminal lugs for #8 cable |
Pete.
Try Bob Nuckolls' AreoElectric web page - see Yeller pages.
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (Westerly, RI airport)
>From: "Pete Bodie" <rv6apjb(at)attbi.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: Terminal lugs for #8 cable
>Date: Sun, 19 May 2002 10:52:50 -0700
>
>
>I have been looking all over for A terminal lug for a #8 cable with a
>5/16 hole. Can anybody please direct me to a web page or other source.
>
>Pete Bodie
>RV6A N164PD
>Hooking up engine
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: First Flight for Farthest North RV6 |
GAR,
CONGRATULATIONS & WELL DONE !!!
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (Westerly, RI airport)
>From: "Gar & Jan Pessel" <pessel(at)ptialaska.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: First Flight for Farthest North RV6
>Date: Sun, 19 May 2002 11:35:34 -0800
>
>
>After several minor glitches and false starts, N443JG flew for the first
>time at 4:30AM this morning. The airplane was constructed on the north
>side of Fairbanks Alaska.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Draper <mdraper(at)nww.com> |
"BostonRVBuilders (E-mail)" ,
"RV-List Server (E-mail)"
| Subject: | June 1 RV Fly-in and Forum at KASH (Nashua, NH) |
The New England wing of Van's Air force will be conducting its first annual
RV fly-in on June 1, 2002 at Nashua Airport (KASH). BBQ, seminars, rides
and good company will be the order of the day.
Additional information can be found at http://www.eaa279.org/rv/kash.htm
Schedule is as follows:
Seminars
Getting your Airworthiness Certificate
- Ms. Susan Fournier 10:00-11:30
Flight Testing
- Mr. Joe Gauthier 1:00- 2:30
Condition Inspection
- Mr. Dave Pepple 2:30-4:00
Cookout: 11:30-12:30
Hamburgers, hot dogs, Italian Sweet Sausage. Nominal fee
Rides:
Weather permitting and pilot availability
Dinner:
The Midfield Caf will be open on Saturday night for Fly-In attendees.
Limited seating. Reservations can be made by calling the organizers.
Bob Di Meo E-mail bdimeo(at)attbi.com
Phone: 603-622-0099
Ken Balch E-mail Kbalch1(at)attbi.com
Ray Grenier E-mail grenier(at)aol.com
Phone: 603 889 3728
IN Case of Rain- Seminars and Cookout will still be held.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "hal merritt" <merritthal(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | fuel vent covers |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Shane Summerhays" <ssummerhays(at)attbi.com> |
Dear friends, I am considering counter sinking the rear spar at the
aileron attach doubblers, no dimple here. It sounds like the best bet
given the thickness of the two materials. Does anyone have any
comments or suggestions
Shane Summerhays
rv8
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Terminal lugs for #8 cable |
Pete:
Go here: http://www.terminaltown.com/Pages/Page18.html
Regards,
Gaylen Lerohl
www.terminaltown.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Pete Bodie <rv6apjb(at)attbi.com>
Subject: RV-List: Terminal lugs for #8 cable
>
> I have been looking all over for A terminal lug for a #8 cable with a
> 5/16 hole. Can anybody please direct me to a web page or other source.
>
> Pete Bodie
> RV6A N164PD
> Hooking up engine
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Harrill <KHarrill(at)osa.state.sc.us> |
| Subject: | LSE Installation |
Gary,
I have one LSE on my engine. After discussing it with Klaus, I mounted the
box high on the engine side of the firewall just under the top flange. Heat
at this location is apparently acceptable. I only have a few hours on it,
but so far no problems.
Ken Harrill
RV-6, flying
I am currently installing dual LSE Plasma II ignitions and am just wondering
where people have installed the control boxes? The plane is a RV-6 with
tip-up canopy and O-360/CS. Also, where might be a good place to install
the
coils for the bottom plugs. If anyone has pictures please point me to the
web
site.
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net> |
Jim, good that you changed the subject line :o)
These mud daubers are a real problem!
Stewart makes a good point about icing. I think this is why Van put the
vents in the path of cooling air (hot air) coming from the engine
compartment. One of the many little details that make these such good
airplanes.
I guess I am not going to loose too much sleep about this. I always use a
pitot cover, just for such reasons, but I have never covered my fuel vent
tubes before, and I have never had a problem with a nest in them. I know
this does not mean I never could. The chance must be pretty small that both
vents get plugged at the same time, and the first act upon engine failure
should be a tank change, so ...
Onward...John
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of JVanLaak(at)aol.com
Subject: RV-List: Fuel vents
In general I agree that Van's fuel system works well and any changes are
likely to go in the wrong direction unless very carefully thought through.
However, there are some opportunities to address potential problems.
About 20 years ago I had a forced landing in a midget mustang because of a
mud dauber making a home in a vent line that was marginal to begin with.
The
solution I came up with (after going to the next larger size of tubing) was
to make a small fiberglass scoop that both increased the tank head pressure
and incorporated a screen across the 1/2 square inches or so that were its
front opening. I also vented it in the back (also covered with screen) to
keep from overboosting the tank and to protect for the case where the front
might be splashed with mud or grass or something. It is an easy and very
effective solution.
(The accident occured when I took off to chase a Cessna 185 jump plane from
a
drop zone 5 miles from my strip and chased them up to 7500 feet. After
watching the jumpers go I pulled the power back and circled down. The engine
quit high enough for me to get back to my place, a 1500 foot strip with
obstacles at both ends, but only for a downwind landing. Had it been an
RV-3
I would have made an easy landing, but since it was the Mustang, I ended up
on the nose 20 feet from a stone fence, but with very little damage.)
Jim Van Laak
RV-3 N112RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
> The chance must be pretty small that both
> vents get plugged at the same time,
Don't bet on it! (I know, I jumped on the bait.) The day the daubers
blocked my fuel vents, they got both sides AND the pitot. So glad I found
this on the ground. They've gotten my pitot more than once, when I forget to
reinstall the cover. The safety wire insert that I use in the fuel vents now
doubles nicely as a probe for checking the pitot on preflight. Use a wire
that will reach a minimum of 6 inches in; those daubers can work at amazing
depths while leaving no outward signs until they've packed you full!
-Bill B
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joe Hine" <joehine(at)nbnet.nb.ca> |
| Subject: | Fuel Vent discussion |
Hi List
I thought I would just add my comments on the fuel vent discussion that has
been going on. I have had experiance with bugs in the fuel vent as well as
my airspeed probe. I now keep the probe covered with a tube with flag
attached, and I have an old piece of antenna (elt I think) that I check the
vents under the aircraft during preflight. I keep my aircraft at a little
airport in the boonies and we have lots of bugs and wildlife around, so
checking for things like this is a everyday necessity.
If you do get daubers in your vents a very slick method of getting them out
is to use a piece of clear tubing (long...to avoid getting things in you
mouth), put one end over the vent and suck. It generally sucks the eggs,
and the mud all out togeather. If you tanks are full, and you can cover the
end inside the tank by leaning on a wing tip, you can also suck some fuel
into the tube to flush any debris out of the vent line.
I was flying with a friend once and the tank we were using had a plugged
vent, we noticed in flight, before the engine quit that the tank skin
between the ribs was noticeably being suck in from the negative pressure.
Fly safe
Joe Hine
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick DeCramer" <diesel(at)rconnect.com> |
In reference to question by Shane Summerhays. The rule says if you have
.032 or more you can Countersink OR dimple when using 3/32" rivets
except when the plans call for one procedure or the other. I dimpled as
much as I could as it is stronger but doesn't look quite as good. One
individual who produces tapes on Rv construction says if the aluminum
"stacks" up to .032" or more then you can CS...this is against the rule
since a thin top sheet will have a very large hole and little bearing
surface for the rivet. My RV6 rear spars are .040" and I dimpled them
just fine and they could have been CS. Greater than .040" becomes a
problem to dimple so that stock is usually CS. Apply this rule and you
can't go wrong as far as mechanical integrity.
Dick DeCramer
RV6 N500DD
wiring
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Konrad Werner" <Connywerner(at)wans.net> |
I have a few questions about this mud dauber problem?
What IS a mud dauber? (as I have never heard of them before)
And in what climate do they exist, (i.e.Where do you all live that had
problems with these buggers?)
Humid or Dry / Coast or Desert / Hot or Cold?
Thanks for enlightening me!
Konrad
----- Original Message -----
From: <SportAV8R(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel vents
>
>
> > The chance must be pretty small that both
> > vents get plugged at the same time,
>
> Don't bet on it! (I know, I jumped on the bait.) The day the daubers
> blocked my fuel vents, they got both sides AND the pitot. So glad I found
> this on the ground. They've gotten my pitot more than once, when I forget
to
> reinstall the cover. The safety wire insert that I use in the fuel vents
now
> doubles nicely as a probe for checking the pitot on preflight. Use a wire
> that will reach a minimum of 6 inches in; those daubers can work at
amazing
> depths while leaving no outward signs until they've packed you full!
>
> -Bill B
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com> |
| Subject: | ELT Antenna Location |
What about mounting the antenna in the gear leg fairings? Anyone done that?
--
Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE, CCNA
Network Administrator
Union Safe Deposit Bank
209-946-5116
-----Original Message-----
From: tom sargent [mailto:sarg314(at)earthlink.net]
Subject: Re: RV-List: ELT Antenna Location
Jerry:
I have the ACK ELT. It has a little remote control panel with manual
"on" and "off" switches and an indicator light. I'll mount that in the
instrument panel. Otherwise. access is by removing the umpteen screws
that hold the wingtip on.
--
Tom Sargent.
Jerry Calvert wrote:
>
> Nice....where was the test button mounted?
>
> Jerry Calvert
> Edmond Ok RV6
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "tom sargent" <sarg314(at)earthlink.net>
>
> > Here's what I did: On the advice of Gus (I think it was Gus) at Van's I
> > put my ELT AND its antenna in the wingtip.
> > --
> > Tom Sargent. RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV_8 Pilot" <rv_8pilot(at)hotmail.com> |
Keep the vents covered while on the ground! Anyone had a problem with
covered vents? I've done mine this way for two years with no problems so
far.
Bryan Jones -8
Pearland, Texas
>From: SportAV8R(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel vents
>Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 09:39:08 EDT
>
>
> > The chance must be pretty small that both
> > vents get plugged at the same time,
>
>Don't bet on it! (I know, I jumped on the bait.) The day the daubers
>blocked my fuel vents, they got both sides AND the pitot. So glad I found
>this on the ground. They've gotten my pitot more than once, when I forget
>to
>reinstall the cover. The safety wire insert that I use in the fuel vents
>now
>doubles nicely as a probe for checking the pitot on preflight. Use a wire
>that will reach a minimum of 6 inches in; those daubers can work at amazing
>depths while leaving no outward signs until they've packed you full!
>
>-Bill B
>
>
Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com> |
| Subject: | Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
I had one on my pitot tube on my old Champ. Worked great! Thanks for
reminding us of those little gizmos. I'm going to order three!
--
Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE, CCNA
Network Administrator
Union Safe Deposit Bank
209-946-5116
-----Original Message-----
From: Larry Bowen [mailto:Larry(at)bowenaero.com]
Subject: RE: RV-List: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas
I saw an RV-8 on the way to SNF that had the little flapper valves on
the vent lines that you often see on Super Cub pitot tubes. The ones
that are hinged and blow open once you have some speed. I thought it
was a neat alternative to the screens.
-
Larry Bowen
RV-8 fuse
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Bower
> Sent: Friday, May 17, 2002 3:42 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas
>
>
>
> I have seen some preliminary reports about the -4 which crashed near
> Jonesboro, Arkansas. Somebody speculated that perhaps mud
> daubers got into
> the fuel tank vent line, causing fuel starvation.
>
> My question is: Can a metal screen be used over the vent
> lines to keep
> insects out?
>
> Jim Bower
> St. Louis, MO
> RV-6A Fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: The "canopy" revisited.... |
>
>I am at the very scary stage of cutting & fitting the canopy.
Not too soon I hope! I suggest waiting with the plexi till there is
nothing else left to do. Seriously, do the plexi last as no other activity
will have to wait for it. Furthermore, panel work will be easier and
damage less likely.
Check the archives. Jim Cone wrote a good piece as did others.
hal - RV6a flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve J Hurlbut" <sjhdcl(at)kingston.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimple or CS? |
Does this apply to the forward bottom skin as well?
Mine is F772 and it is 0.040.
I'm still undecided whether to dimple it or countersink. If I dimple it then
I'll also going
to have to dimple the centre bottom skin at the lap joint and both F704s.
So dimple or countersink forward bottom skin?
Steve Hurlbut
RV-7A
O-360 A1A
Fuselage
http://members.kingston.net/sjhdcl/rv7a.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dick DeCramer" <diesel(at)rconnect.com>
Subject: RV-List: Dimple or CS?
>
> In reference to question by Shane Summerhays. The rule says if you have
> .032 or more you can Countersink OR dimple when using 3/32" rivets
> except when the plans call for one procedure or the other. I dimpled as
> much as I could as it is stronger but doesn't look quite as good. One
> individual who produces tapes on Rv construction says if the aluminum
> "stacks" up to .032" or more then you can CS...this is against the rule
> since a thin top sheet will have a very large hole and little bearing
> surface for the rivet. My RV6 rear spars are .040" and I dimpled them
> just fine and they could have been CS. Greater than .040" becomes a
> problem to dimple so that stock is usually CS. Apply this rule and you
> can't go wrong as far as mechanical integrity.
>
> Dick DeCramer
> RV6 N500DD
> wiring
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Dimple or CS? |
In a message dated 5/20/2002 9:41:11 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
sjhdcl(at)kingston.net writes:
>
> Does this apply to the forward bottom skin as well?
>
> Mine is F772 and it is 0.040.
> I'm still undecided whether to dimple it or countersink. If I dimple it
> then
> I'll also going
> to have to dimple the centre bottom skin at the lap joint and both F704s.
>
> So dimple or countersink forward bottom skin?
>
> Steve Hurlbut
> RV-7A
> O-360 A1A
> Fuselage
>
Has the term "Smoking Rivet" come up in these dimple or countersink post?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vincent Welch" <welchvincent(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimple or CS? |
I dimpled then gave each hole a few turns with a hand deburring tool. That
seemed to make the rivet sit down in the dimpled hole much nicer.
Vince
RV-8A Finish Kit
>From: "Dick DeCramer" <diesel(at)rconnect.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: Dimple or CS?
>Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 09:09:05 -0500
>
>
>In reference to question by Shane Summerhays. The rule says if you have
>.032 or more you can Countersink OR dimple when using 3/32" rivets
>except when the plans call for one procedure or the other. I dimpled as
>much as I could as it is stronger but doesn't look quite as good. One
>individual who produces tapes on Rv construction says if the aluminum
>"stacks" up to .032" or more then you can CS...this is against the rule
>since a thin top sheet will have a very large hole and little bearing
>surface for the rivet. My RV6 rear spars are .040" and I dimpled them
>just fine and they could have been CS. Greater than .040" becomes a
>problem to dimple so that stock is usually CS. Apply this rule and you
>can't go wrong as far as mechanical integrity.
>
>Dick DeCramer
>RV6 N500DD
>wiring
>
>
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Phillips <ripsteel(at)edge.net> |
Here in TN mud daubers are a major pest. Something I thought I might try
(haven't installed vents yet) is the following- let me know if anyone thinks
this a bad idea, or if it's been done before:
Build the vents like shown on dwg.49 (RV-6A set) with the 45 deg. angle.
From the front of the vent and perpendicular to the tube, drill a small hole in
the rear wall of the tube near the bottom
Take a 3 or 4 inch long piece of fairly stiff wire, insert it up into to tube
and bend a small "J-hook" at the bottom that would be stuck into the small hole
you drilled, enough that the wire would be retained in the vent tube, but still
a little loose.
This might make bug entry difficult, and by wiggling it around a little during
pre-flight, you could determine that the vent is free of the nasty little
buggers... Mark (Fredrick?) posted back in early '99 (Jan, 09 in the archives)
that he'd take a piece of .040 safety wire bent into a "U" and stick it up into
the vents and was happy with the results.
On another note, and maybe just unwarranted paranoia on my part- Is there any
potential danger of the vapors igniting in the vent tubes (and then the whole
tank!) in the event of flaming materials exiting the cowl outlet in an engine
fire? This assumes the vents are located closer to centerline, as opposed to on
the outboard sides of the fuse as shown in the plans?
From The PossumWorks
Mark - fuselage (pull stick back, elevators go up! - finish kit due soon...)
John Huft wrote:
>
> Jim, good that you changed the subject line :o)
>
> These mud daubers are a real problem!
>
> ============================
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vincent Welch" <welchvincent(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Vertical Compass Card |
Hey guys, looking for some input. I just received a PAI700 vertical compass
card. I was planning on mounting the unit in my panel. The instructions
clearly state that the unit SHOULD NOT be rigidly mounted in a panel. I
have seen several pictures of these units mounted in panels (look at the
recent Twin Cities RV Forum pictures for a few).
My question is, to those of you that have mounted these units in panels,
have you had any problems? Can you swing the compass to a reasonable degree
of accuracy? Has the compass just become a useless ornament?
As a last resort, I can mount the unit on the glare shield but I would
prefer not. This will be a VFR bird with a GPS and EFIS Lite with magnetic
heading, I know that this configuration doesn't require a compass but I
would still like to have one as a backup. If I do have to mount it on the
glare shield will it interfere with my forward vision any (I haven't been in
a RV-8A so I am not sure)?
Vince Welch
RV-8A Finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Duberstein, Allen" <allen.duberstein(at)intel.com> |
| Subject: | Vertical Compass Card |
I have one on my RV6A. It's mounted on the glare shield. I used no
vibration isolation material. The glare shield seems to dampen enough
vibration since the compass works just fine.
regards
allen
Allen Duberstein
Potomac Program Manager
503-712-2323
allen.duberstein(at)intel.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Vincent Welch [mailto:welchvincent(at)hotmail.com]
Subject: RV-List: Vertical Compass Card
Hey guys, looking for some input. I just received a PAI700 vertical compass
card. I was planning on mounting the unit in my panel. The instructions
clearly state that the unit SHOULD NOT be rigidly mounted in a panel. I
have seen several pictures of these units mounted in panels (look at the
recent Twin Cities RV Forum pictures for a few).
My question is, to those of you that have mounted these units in panels,
have you had any problems? Can you swing the compass to a reasonable degree
of accuracy? Has the compass just become a useless ornament?
As a last resort, I can mount the unit on the glare shield but I would
prefer not. This will be a VFR bird with a GPS and EFIS Lite with magnetic
heading, I know that this configuration doesn't require a compass but I
would still like to have one as a backup. If I do have to mount it on the
glare shield will it interfere with my forward vision any (I haven't been in
a RV-8A so I am not sure)?
Vince Welch
RV-8A Finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
You should really try to dimple this skin - it's tough but possible using
the C-frame. It is subject to a lot of vibration due to prop wash and engine
exhaust pulses. There have been many reports of smoking rivets on this skin.
The dimpling will provide additional mechanical anchoring to help keep the
rivets from working. At the suggestion of others I also used all 1/8" rivets
on it.
Regards,
Greg Young - Houston (DWH)
RV-6 N6GY ...project Phoenix
Navion N5221K - just an XXL RV-6A
>
>
> Does this apply to the forward bottom skin as well?
>
> Mine is F772 and it is 0.040.
> I'm still undecided whether to dimple it or countersink. If I
> dimple it then
> I'll also going
> to have to dimple the centre bottom skin at the lap joint and
> both F704s.
>
> So dimple or countersink forward bottom skin?
>
> Steve Hurlbut
> RV-7A
> O-360 A1A
> Fuselage
> http://members.kingston.net/sjhdcl/rv7a.htm
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LSE Installation |
Gary,
I mounted mine (one) with nutplates to the rib between the subpanel and
firewall on the passenger side.
Ross Mickey
N9PT RV6A
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary & Carolyn Zilik" <zilik(at)bewellnet.com>
Subject: RV-List: LSE Installation
> I am currently installing dual LSE Plasma II ignitions and am just
wondering
> where people have installed the control boxes? The plane is a RV-6 with
> tip-up canopy and O-360/CS. Also, where might be a good place to install
the
> coils for the bottom plugs. If anyone has pictures please point me to the
web
> site.
>
> Gary
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Oke <wjoke(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimple or CS? |
Hi Steve;
I did the F672 skins on a RV-6A a few months back myself. This is apparently
a pretty high stress area on the -6 and -7 so it is well worth dimpling. I
also went to 426-4-x rivets along the lower firewall and floor stiffener
angles to avoiding the "smoking" or loose rivets syndrome in this area.
I drilled everything, then took the 672 skins off and dimpled them using a
hefty steel block with a 1/8" hole drilled it which I then chamfered with a
100 deg countersink to provide the right size "dimple pocket. Used a bunch
of extra 426-4 rivets and my flush rivet set to do the dimpling. I then
countersunk the 1/8x3/4/3/4 and 1/16x3/4x3/4 to accommodate the dimples in
the skins. Back on the fuselage the riveting went quite easily.
Similar arrangements at the aft edge of the 672 although I used 3/32
dimpling dies there in a hand squeezer.
Cheers, Jim Oke
Winnipeg, MB
RV-6A - wiring underway...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve J Hurlbut" <sjhdcl(at)kingston.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Dimple or CS?
>
> Does this apply to the forward bottom skin as well?
>
> Mine is F772 and it is 0.040.
> I'm still undecided whether to dimple it or countersink. If I dimple it
then
> I'll also going
> to have to dimple the centre bottom skin at the lap joint and both F704s.
>
> So dimple or countersink forward bottom skin?
>
> Steve Hurlbut
> RV-7A
> O-360 A1A
> Fuselage
> http://members.kingston.net/sjhdcl/rv7a.htm
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dick DeCramer" <diesel(at)rconnect.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Dimple or CS?
>
>
> >
> > In reference to question by Shane Summerhays. The rule says if you have
> > .032 or more you can Countersink OR dimple when using 3/32" rivets
> > except when the plans call for one procedure or the other. I dimpled as
> > much as I could as it is stronger but doesn't look quite as good. One
> > individual who produces tapes on Rv construction says if the aluminum
> > "stacks" up to .032" or more then you can CS...this is against the rule
> > since a thin top sheet will have a very large hole and little bearing
> > surface for the rivet. My RV6 rear spars are .040" and I dimpled them
> > just fine and they could have been CS. Greater than .040" becomes a
> > problem to dimple so that stock is usually CS. Apply this rule and you
> > can't go wrong as far as mechanical integrity.
> >
> > Dick DeCramer
> > RV6 N500DD
> > wiring
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick DeCramer" <diesel(at)rconnect.com> |
In response to Steve Hurlbut question to Dimple or CS F772 which is the
bottom forward fyselage skin and is .040. I can't say about the RV7 but
the Rv6 had problems with smoking (working) rivets where that skin meets
the firewall. Van's had owners of flying aircraft put 1/8" button head
rivets between the original 3/32" rivets as a fix and those under
construction were to use 1/8" DIMPLED rivets instead of the 3/32" flush.
I dimpled my entire sheet...both 1/8 and 3/32 rivets...with a big
hammer with my C frame arbor and did each hole twice. It looks good but
remember, this is under the aircraft and aft of the exhaust and won't be
seen unless you are laying down. I would think Van's has done something
to the RV 7 to correct this problem so a quick message to
support(at)vansaircraft.com may answer that. Also someone else mentioned a
procedure where you dimple followed by a machine countersink to get the
rivet to sit nice does well without removing much stock which I have
done in places. I am also aware of many builders in attempt to get the
award winning project have CS everything but there is a risk of smoking
rivets after a few years. It is a trade-off you have to make. I chose
mechanical integrity first as I want to fly mine for years and have no
cracked body putty, filled seams, loose rivets...just nice straight rows
of even rivets with straight, flat seams and no plastic. If you want a
glass plane then build one!!!
Dick DeCramer
N500DD
Wiring
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie and Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com> |
John Huft wrote:
>
>
> Jim, good that you changed the subject line :o)
>
> These mud daubers are a real problem!
>
> Stewart makes a good point about icing. I think this is why Van put the
> vents in the path of cooling air (hot air) coming from the engine
> compartment. One of the many little details that make these such good
> airplanes.
>
> I guess I am not going to loose too much sleep about this. I always use a
> pitot cover, just for such reasons, but I have never covered my fuel vent
> tubes before, and I have never had a problem with a nest in them. I know
> this does not mean I never could. The chance must be pretty small that both
> vents get plugged at the same time, and the first act upon engine failure
> should be a tank change, so ...
>
> Onward...John
>
FWIW:
I purchased a -4 in 1994. it had a flapper pitot cover &
1/8" ID tubing turned into the wind for fuel vents. The
tubing was cut with a tubing cutter, so the actual hole size
was much smaller than 1/8". I flew the plane for 4 or 5
years, never using vent covers.
One day after a 10 minute return flight from a friend's
flyin, I heard that sucking sound as I walked away from the
plane. Tank sheet metal on the right tank was noticably
caved in between the ribs. Opening the filler cap relieved
the vacuum without any damage.
When I checked the vent lines, I had 'stuff' over a foot up
the right tank vent, & about 6" up the left.
I don't know if the vac sucked it up that high, or if the
wasp actually built up there.
Here's my point: If daubers are active, there is actually a
rather high probability that they will fill several
available holes on the plane in a short period of time.
If you live somewhere other than the deep south, this might
not apply to you, but down here we have several species in
varying sizes & I learned not to underestimate their
abilities.
Charlie
RV-4 (sold)
RV-2+2 (sold)
still looking for a -6 or project
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Vertical Compass Card |
I have asked this same question to other RV owners and the answer usually is
that you will have to find the best spot yourself. Two problems that exist
are the rollover bar and other instraments, like the electric turn and bank.
Don't scrimp on the T & B because the cheaper one's don't shield there
motors well. If you put the compass in the panel, try covering the case
with lead tape to shield it from outside sources. Generally, the farther
from the rollover bar the better. I hear it can swing a compass 10 deg or
more!
Wayne C.
RV-8A qb
----- Original Message -----
From: "Vincent Welch" <welchvincent(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: Vertical Compass Card
>
> Hey guys, looking for some input. I just received a PAI700 vertical
compass
> card. I was planning on mounting the unit in my panel. The instructions
> clearly state that the unit SHOULD NOT be rigidly mounted in a panel. I
> have seen several pictures of these units mounted in panels (look at the
> recent Twin Cities RV Forum pictures for a few).
>
> My question is, to those of you that have mounted these units in panels,
> have you had any problems? Can you swing the compass to a reasonable
degree
> of accuracy? Has the compass just become a useless ornament?
>
> As a last resort, I can mount the unit on the glare shield but I would
> prefer not. This will be a VFR bird with a GPS and EFIS Lite with
magnetic
> heading, I know that this configuration doesn't require a compass but I
> would still like to have one as a backup. If I do have to mount it on the
> glare shield will it interfere with my forward vision any (I haven't been
in
> a RV-8A so I am not sure)?
>
> Vince Welch
> RV-8A Finishing
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Todd Cameron" <toddc(at)powertechgroup.com> |
| Subject: | To flute or not to flute |
Dan -
W-408-1 L & R are the most inboard leading edge ribs, just outboard of the
tanks. They didn't come pre-punched in my kit. I'm not upset about that,
but I'm kind of confused about how to go about fluting those 2 ribs to
straighten them.
(Todd)======
Here are some of my thoughts:
You can just lay the ribs on the same drawing and flute them. They are
drilled
just a little different from the other ribs because of the joining plate for
the fuel tanks. Fluting from the plans worked out just fine for me, but
Van's
would have had to have a different hole pattern (slightly).
With the joining strips I did measure and found the same problem mentioned
by
David when he said they would have had to be trimmed. I slid them in just a
bit
deeper into the outboard leading edge, no trimming. (just another way to do
things).
(Snip from David)===============
By the way the precision of the fluting of your wing ribs determines the
ease of skin to frame mating at a later stage. I was given this tip by a RV6
builder (yes those dinosaurs are still in production, so I went back and
re-fluted to the very best standard I could. Even so I still cold have paid
more attention to making sure the flanges are 90 degrees to the web.
(Todd)======
I built a jig from articles to do the 90% flange. From the RV aviator. I do
not think this was worth while. My ribs were however exactly 90% it is
important. I also spent a whole lot of time making the rib lie flat.
That was a waste of time. The holes need to line up (or center line) but
that
is about it. If you look carefully you will see that Van's drilled the skins
with the hole at the tip (leading edge) off the straight line from the other
holes aft of it. Nice touch!
(Snip from David)===============
It paid off, all my skins went on first time, no trouble. The only oops was
my first try to fit a skin went bad because the mid-span jack under the rear
spar was not adjusted enough to take the sag out. After a bit of head
scratching I just upped the jack and voila, perfect fit first time.
(Todd)======
I mentioned this problem before. Take note of the sag. I used a laser level
and directed the beam through the tooling holes to line it all up. You can
check each rib by placing a piece of paper behind the rib and seeing how it
lines up. (overkill). Do the check for twist with the plumb bob from the
spar
and against the trailing edge. NO TWIST!!! I can tell you some stories about
this but make it straight.
(Snip from David)===============
Also I got mediocre riveting results on the first thick skin, and also on
the curved leading edge skins, so I re-dimpled with tank dies, much better
outcome.
(Todd)======
I did not use the tank dies on anything but the tanks. I think it might set
the
rivets too low. I love how the rivets came out on the outboard sections. The
tanks I am simply happy to have done. I am not sure I needed the tank dies
there.
The EAA counselor said they looked a bit deep. I did some arm waiving in
exasperation and he said they were lovely. Use the tank dies. and make sure
that
you keep pressure on the rivet so they do not set proud. You know what I
mean or
you will.
OH YES and on the leading edge take note to peen or be sure there are no
sharp
pressure points on the rib. I have one I must have missed. I can see it. It
jumps
out at me although no one else has seen it yet. There is a little hard spot
on the
skin at that point. All the old timers (before prepunch ) seem to know
this.
We do need to pay attention to them occasionally.
Go for it Checkster | From: | "Steve J Hurlbut" <sjhdcl(at)kingston.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dimple or CS #2 |
That is what I plan to do as well. Install 1/8 rivets dimpled along the
firewall
and the centre spar. I have posted an email to Van's about this but no
response yet.
I'll let you know if anything specific comes of it.
Great info guys,
Steve
RV-7A
fuse
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dick DeCramer" <diesel(at)rconnect.com>
Subject: RV-List: Dimple or CS #2
>
> In response to Steve Hurlbut question to Dimple or CS F772 which is the
> bottom forward fyselage skin and is .040. I can't say about the RV7 but
> the Rv6 had problems with smoking (working) rivets where that skin meets
> the firewall. Van's had owners of flying aircraft put 1/8" button head
> rivets between the original 3/32" rivets as a fix and those under
> construction were to use 1/8" DIMPLED rivets instead of the 3/32" flush.
> I dimpled my entire sheet...both 1/8 and 3/32 rivets...with a big
> hammer with my C frame arbor and did each hole twice. It looks good but
> remember, this is under the aircraft and aft of the exhaust and won't be
> seen unless you are laying down. I would think Van's has done something
> to the RV 7 to correct this problem so a quick message to
> support(at)vansaircraft.com may answer that. Also someone else mentioned a
> procedure where you dimple followed by a machine countersink to get the
> rivet to sit nice does well without removing much stock which I have
> done in places. I am also aware of many builders in attempt to get the
> award winning project have CS everything but there is a risk of smoking
> rivets after a few years. It is a trade-off you have to make. I chose
> mechanical integrity first as I want to fly mine for years and have no
> cracked body putty, filled seams, loose rivets...just nice straight rows
> of even rivets with straight, flat seams and no plastic. If you want a
> glass plane then build one!!!
>
> Dick DeCramer
> N500DD
> Wiring
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Question related to RV-4 accident in Arkansas |
HI-the flapper valve with the boost pump on will be sucked shut-NO
FUEL-VACUUM
DONT DO IT -TOM
Thomas M. Whelan
Whelan Farms Airport
Post Office Box 426
249 Hard Hill Road North
Bethlehem, CT 06751
PH 203-266-5300
FAX 203-266-5140
e-mail wfact01(at)aol.com
EAA Chapter 1097, President
RV-8 IO-540 LYC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Spin Testing?? |
In a message dated 5/20/02 8:57:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
sjhdcl(at)kingston.net writes:
<< Can someone summarize the article on spin testing the RV-7 to us
non-subscribers to the RVator.
I used to subscribe, but it would only arrive 75% of the time and had
limited info as I remember. This
however sounds very interesting.
Thinking about subscribing again,
Steve
RV-7A >>
Essentially, the RVator said they had "mocked up" an RV-6a, using their RV-6a
with extended wingtips and both flavors of vertical stab and rudder (the old
"short" type, and the current "tall" type, like has been in the kits (-6 and
-7) for a couple of years. This was prior to building the first -7.
Their mock-up testing showed acceptable results. Howerver, when they did
spin testing with a "real" RV-7, with the longer fuse, span, etc. it's
characteristics were not as good as in a stock RV-6a. They had expected
better characteristics than on the -6a, because of the longer tail moment.
In the article, they made a relative comparison on the RV-6a and RV-7,
concluding that the neither the -6a or -7 meet aerobatic category spin
certification requirments, but both meet standard category spin requirements,
with the -6A having better characteristics than the -7.
They are preparing to try a larger rudder "to enhance spin recovery
authority."
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Avemco Insurance |
Just got my Avemco Insurance renewal. Was planning on switching due to the
fact that they had temporary stopped insuring "homebuilt" aircraft. My
rate went DOWN $25 dollars from last year. $1,000,000 Liability with
$100,000 / person is being billed at $385 / year.
I do NOT have hull coverage. Liability only! The money I am saving is in
the bank as a down payment toward repairs, purchase a replacement flying RV,
or a new RV kit.
Still plan to call JT back early next month to get a written quote before I
mail a check.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,040.0+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Spin Testing?? |
>
> Can someone summarize the article on spin testing the RV-7 to us
> non-subscribers to the RVator.
>
Van's thought the RV-7 would have better spin characteristics than the
RV-6x, based on some testing they had done on a modified 6A. The actual
RV-7 has poorer characteristics than the (already, not very good) 6x. Van's
does not recommend recreational spins in the 7. It meets FAA requirements
for standard category aircraft but not the standards for aerobatic aircraft.
There was not a lot of detail about exactly how it spins. I am supposing it
is the recovery characteristics that are not too good, based on the
statement that they will try a larger rudder and see if it enhances "spin
recovery authority."
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net> |
| Subject: | Vertical Compass Card |
I think mostly so.
FWIW, I would say that the PAI700 is nice from a viewpoint that it
cannot leak juice (dry type), but it wanders around almost as much as a
whiskey compass. I must confess that I've never properly swung it,
something on my list to do.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 150 hours
>Has the compass just become a useless ornament?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Helms" <jhelms(at)i1.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Avemco Insurance |
Very important distinction he put in there.... per PERSON... AVEMCO is the
only company that sub-limits bodily injury even for those persons injured
outside the airplane. All other companies write their sublimits as per
PASSENGER. Example: you crash on a road and hit a car killing the driver.
That persons family sues you for $250,000 for that persons death. Would you
rather have AVEMCO (who would only pay the first $100,000) or coverage that
would cover the entire amount?
And by the way, the minimum premium for the VanGuard Program would likely
apply ($350) to your liability only if quoted thru the program.
John "JT" Helms
Branch Manager
NationAir Pleasure and Business Branch
----- Original Message -----
From: "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: Avemco Insurance
Just got my Avemco Insurance renewal. Was planning on switching due to the
fact that they had temporary stopped insuring "homebuilt" aircraft. My
rate went DOWN $25 dollars from last year. $1,000,000 Liability with
$100,000 / person is being billed at $385 / year.
I do NOT have hull coverage. Liability only! The money I am saving is in
the bank as a down payment toward repairs, purchase a replacement flying RV,
or a new RV kit.
Still plan to call JT back early next month to get a written quote before I
mail a check.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,040.0+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Stuart B McCurdy <sturdy(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | RV Formation at Oshkosh |
Listers,
You may remember that I, along with Wes Schierman of the Blackjacks,
organized and led the 25-ship formation at Oshkosh in 1997 to honor
Van's Aircraft 25th Anniversary of first participating in Oshkosh. Well
it's five years later and I am working on a 30-ship formation. I have
discussed it with Van and the Flyby leadership at AirVenture.
I am now looking for highly qualified RV formation pilots to
participate. Presently, I plan to group six 5-ship formations in
various shapes for several flyby passes. The 5-ships will be tight, but
the spacing between the 5-ships will be loose. I would like to hear
from the leaders of formation groups who regularly fly formation and who
would like to participate with your groups. If I don't have enough from
regular groups, I will then need individuals for fill in.
The kicker is that, since the whole Oshkosh airspace is under waiver,
all formation pilots will need formation cards. To get a formation
card, I will have to evaluate each pilot, preferably in your groups,
using Formation Flying, Inc (FFI) criteria. The evaluation must be in
at least a 4-ship conducting briefing, taxi, formation takeoff,
climbout, radio discipline, maneuvering (45* of bank, 30* of pitch) in
fingertip, trail, and diamond, echelon turns, pitchouts and rejoins,
descent to the traffic pattern, pitchouts to land, and debrief.
There is not enough time to go around the country to each group, so I
will select a site to conduct the evaluations and any group or
individual wishing to participate will need to come. I am undecided as
to whether we will do this between now and Oshkosh (say 6-7 July) or the
weekend before Oshkosh near Oshkosh. Suggestions accepted.
So, let me hear (email off line) from any of you
formation leaders or individuals and I will see if we have enough who
desire to get a card and participate in the 30-ship. If there are
listers out there who know of formation groups who might be interested,
please pass this along to them.
Stu McCurdy
Formation Flying, Inc (FFI)
RV-8, N78TX (Flying)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dan DeNeal <rv6apilot(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Visiting Nashville TN this weekend. Any RV's in the area? |
My son has been living in Nashville, TN (Antioch, TN)
for the last year and my wife and I have been down
several times (driving). My rv6a is getting close to
finish and sense I can't work on mine this weekend I
need to stop the "withdrawals". I would love to visit
with anybody in the area.
Dan DeNeal
Hoopeston, Illinois
http://launch.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Miller Robert <rmiller3(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Spin Testing?? |
I have not yet seen the RVator article. It sounds as if it is only directed at
the 7.
However, some months ago I did have an opportunity to e-mail Van's regarding
spin characteristics for the 9a, (which my son and I will build).
If it is helpful, this was the reply:
The RV-9 was spin tested and here is a brief summary of the
results:
We tested at various CG locations and used various recovery
techniques. The aircraft takes some effort to get into a spin and
once established in the spin takes about three turns to become
developed. Recovery is conventional but not immediate if the spin
is developed. Recovery takes longer with the CG further aft.
The low speed handling characteristics are such that inadvertent
spin entry should not be a problem. The RV-9 ailerons remain
effective throughout the stall, there is pre-stall buffet, also there is
little tendency for the aircraft to drop one wing when the stall
occurs.
Ken Krueger, Engineer
Van's Aircraft
KBoatri144(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 5/20/02 8:57:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> sjhdcl(at)kingston.net writes:
>
> << Can someone summarize the article on spin testing the RV-7 to us
> non-subscribers to the RVator.
>
> I used to subscribe, but it would only arrive 75% of the time and had
> limited info as I remember. This
> however sounds very interesting.
>
> Thinking about subscribing again,
> Steve
> RV-7A >>
>
> Essentially, the RVator said they had "mocked up" an RV-6a, using their RV-6a
> with extended wingtips and both flavors of vertical stab and rudder (the old
> "short" type, and the current "tall" type, like has been in the kits (-6 and
> -7) for a couple of years. This was prior to building the first -7.
>
> Their mock-up testing showed acceptable results. Howerver, when they did
> spin testing with a "real" RV-7, with the longer fuse, span, etc. it's
> characteristics were not as good as in a stock RV-6a. They had expected
> better characteristics than on the -6a, because of the longer tail moment.
>
> In the article, they made a relative comparison on the RV-6a and RV-7,
> concluding that the neither the -6a or -7 meet aerobatic category spin
> certification requirments, but both meet standard category spin requirements,
> with the -6A having better characteristics than the -7.
>
> They are preparing to try a larger rudder "to enhance spin recovery
> authority."
>
> Kyle Boatright
> 0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
> Kennesaw, GA
> http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Condrey, Bob" <bob.condrey(at)baesystems.com> |
| Subject: | RE: June 1 RV Fly-in and Forum at KASH (Nashua, NH) |
I will be in Nasua on business the week prior to the show and unfortunately
have to fly back home Saturday AM. I won't have any time Saturday but I'd
love to see some planes/projects or help out prior to the show. I'm not yet
a builder but it probably wouldn't take much of a push to get me over the
hump. Of course, I'd wipe up my own drool...
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dick DeCramer" <diesel(at)rconnect.com> |
| Subject: | Terminal Lugs #8 AWG |
In response to Pete Bodie on where to get #8 Cable lugs. I found all
required in Wicks, Aircraft Spruce, and local "Car Quest Auto Parts"
(had to special order here) but I could not find all sizes at one place
which meant Multiple orders.
Dick DeCramer
N500DD
Wiring
Northfield, Minnesota
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Camshaft number |
| From: | Don Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> |
My PC-103, fig 1-4, shows a 76097 for the E2A.
Don Jordan - N6DJ - RV6A
Arlington, Tx
*******************************
writes:
>
> Hi,
>
> Can anyone with an O -320 partscatalog tell me the partnumber for a
> Camshaft
> with integral gear for an O -320 E2A?
>
> Marcel
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: unusable fuel |
dear listers
getting ready to do the weighing of N747ES, RV6A 0360 C/S. my question is, is
unusable fuel what is left after the plug is removed from the tank bottom and
all fuel is drained, with no fuel in the lines. or is it fuel that is left in
the tank and the lines when the engine quits?
scott
tampa
tring to make since of it all
1st flight comming soon, whoooo hooooo
there really is a light at the end of the tunnel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Builder's Bookstore" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: unusable fuel |
> getting ready to do the weighing of N747ES, RV6A 0360 C/S. my question is, is
> unusable fuel what is left after the plug is removed from the tank bottom and
> all fuel is drained, with no fuel in the lines. or is it fuel that is left in
> the tank and the lines when the engine quits?
It's whats left in the Tank when the engine quits. Your lines will already be
empty, not that any fuel in the lines would weigh enough to matter anyway.
Andy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "C. Rabaut" <crabaut(at)coalinga.com> |
Scott,
According to my local AP-IA... it is what's left when the big fan stops.
Chuck
----- Original Message -----
From: <ABAYMAN(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: unusable fuel
>
> dear listers
> getting ready to do the weighing of N747ES, RV6A 0360 C/S. my question is,
is
> unusable fuel what is left after the plug is removed from the tank bottom
and
> all fuel is drained, with no fuel in the lines. or is it fuel that is left
in
> the tank and the lines when the engine quits?
> scott
> tampa
> tring to make since of it all
> 1st flight comming soon, whoooo hooooo
> there really is a light at the end of the tunnel
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rob Prior <rv7(at)b4.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Spin Testing?? |
About now i'm thinking i'm glad I didn't start my Vertical stab first,
despite some of the recommendations here on the Forum. I wonder if Vans
will exchange my unbuilt VS pieces for the new design when it comes
available?
Since aerobatics are something I *do* plan on in my -7 (not
competitively or anything, but I *do* want the capability), i'd be quite
put out to find that it "wasn't recommended" to do spins in it.
-RB4
rv7 "at" b4.ca
RV-7 Empennage (Horizontal Stab)
Larry Pardue wrote:
> Van's thought the RV-7 would have better spin characteristics than the
> RV-6x, based on some testing they had done on a modified 6A. The actual
> RV-7 has poorer characteristics than the (already, not very good) 6x. Van's
> does not recommend recreational spins in the 7. It meets FAA requirements
> for standard category aircraft but not the standards for aerobatic aircraft.
>
> There was not a lot of detail about exactly how it spins. I am supposing it
> is the recovery characteristics that are not too good, based on the
> statement that they will try a larger rudder and see if it enhances "spin
> recovery authority."
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <enewton57(at)cableone.net> |
| Subject: | RE: RV-List usable fuel |
Hi Scott,
It is the fuel left over after all fuel has been pumped out by the fuel pump.
I did mine by disconnecting the inlet to the carb and then turned on the elect.
fuel pump until the tank ran dry and then did the same on the other side.
After completing the weight & balance, I drained the remaining fuel to see how
much was left over and it amounted to about 1 cup of fuel out of each tank. I
guess the anti-rotation brackets kept my fuel puick up tubes in place.
Regards,
Eric Newton - Long Beach, MS
RV-6A - N57ME (Flying)
www.ericsrv6a.com
<>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie and Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Avemco Insurance |
Independent observation: John is telling the truth about
liability coverage. Call & ask them direct questions about
it.
In addition, I called Avemco last week to check on rate
difference between trigear & tailwheel on the -6 project I'm
considering buying. They told me (I've been insured with
them in the past) that there would be no difference in
premium, but that $50k of hull + the almost worthless
liability would cost $2,500 per year. $30k hull would be
$2100/yr, & (worthless) liability !only! would be
$1200/year. This is more than I paid Avemco for liability +
hull on my -4 a few years ago.
The 'agent' tried to tell me that they are paying out dollar
for dollar for every premium they get right now. However, he
didn't offer to show me their books.
The only remaining reason to take business to Avemco,
alternative engines, has also disappeared.
FWIW,
Charlie
John Helms wrote:
>
>
> Very important distinction he put in there.... per PERSON... AVEMCO is the
> only company that sub-limits bodily injury even for those persons injured
> outside the airplane. All other companies write their sublimits as per
> PASSENGER. Example: you crash on a road and hit a car killing the driver.
> That persons family sues you for $250,000 for that persons death. Would you
> rather have AVEMCO (who would only pay the first $100,000) or coverage that
> would cover the entire amount?
>
> And by the way, the minimum premium for the VanGuard Program would likely
> apply ($350) to your liability only if quoted thru the program.
>
> John "JT" Helms
> Branch Manager
> NationAir Pleasure and Business Branch
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Avemco Insurance
>
>
> Just got my Avemco Insurance renewal. Was planning on switching due to the
> fact that they had temporary stopped insuring "homebuilt" aircraft. My
> rate went DOWN $25 dollars from last year. $1,000,000 Liability with
> $100,000 / person is being billed at $385 / year.
>
> I do NOT have hull coverage. Liability only! The money I am saving is in
> the bank as a down payment toward repairs, purchase a replacement flying RV,
> or a new RV kit.
>
> Still plan to call JT back early next month to get a written quote before I
> mail a check.
>
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> 1,040.0+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
> http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Earl Fortner <efortner(at)vnet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Visiting Nashville TN this weekend. Any RV's in the area? |
There used to be some posting on the list from some folks near Nashville.
Don't
remember the name of the airport but I beleive there is quite a bit of RV
activity in the area.
Dan DeNeal wrote:
>
> My son has been living in Nashville, TN (Antioch, TN)
> for the last year and my wife and I have been down
> several times (driving). My rv6a is getting close to
> finish and sense I can't work on mine this weekend I
> need to stop the "withdrawals". I would love to visit
> with anybody in the area.
>
> Dan DeNeal
> Hoopeston, Illinois
>
> http://launch.yahoo.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Keith Vasey/Galvin Flying Svc" <keith(at)galvinflying.com> |
| Subject: | Avemco Insurance |
Charlie and Tupper England wrote:
The 'agent' tried to tell me that they are paying out dollar
for dollar for every premium they get right now. However, he
didn't offer to show me their books.
As I understand it, the underwriters are very profitable if their
premium/payout ratio is in the 1.0 range. That's because they (generally)
make their money on their investment portfolio they are required to keep in
reserve.
Keith Vasey
Seattle
RV-8
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Avemco Insurance |
In a message dated 5/21/2002 1:56:52 PM Central Daylight Time,
keith(at)galvinflying.com writes:
> The 'agent' tried to tell me that they are paying out dollar
> for dollar for every premium they get right now. However, he
> didn't offer to show me their books.
>
> As I understand it, the underwriters are very profitable if their
> premium/payout ratio is in the 1.0 range. That's because they (generally)
> make their money on their investment portfolio they are required to keep in
> reserve.
>
> Keith Vasey
> Seattle
> RV-8
>
For an insurance company to be profitable there loss ratio has to be under 1
to 1. The companies would like to see .95 or better to 1. This means there
only paying out 95 cents for every dollar of premium that comes in. Actually
alot of companies including the non avation companies are paying out better
then 1 dollar for every dollar in premium. I have the numbers for the top
100 insurance companies in the us and i know that most arent under 1 to 1.
This is why insurance costs are going up, a few years ago this was ok when
the stock market was making 30% a year, but know its not so..... rates go
up.
In fact one of my agencies best used property and casuality companies paid
out $1.78 for every $1.00 taken in last year in commercial insurance.
Personal lines they were at .98 i beleive.
So yes those numbers are right on, yes a company can make a profit even
though they pay out more then they take in but they need the liberal
accounting laws there allowed and a good investment market and we dont have
that right now
chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Avemco Insurance |
In a message dated 5/21/2002 1:14:52 PM Central Daylight Time,
cengland(at)netdoor.com writes:
> ey told me (I've been insured with
> them in the past) that there would be no difference in
> premium, but that $50k of hull + the almost worthless
> liability would cost $2,500 per year. $30k hull would be
> $2100/yr, & (worthless) liability !only! would be
> $1200/year. This is more than I paid Avemco for liability +
> hull on my -4 a few years ago.
>
> The 'agent' tried to tell me that they are paying out dollar
> for dollar for every premium they get right now. However, he
> didn't offer to show me their books.
worthless liability, well not quite, look at your auto policy, most
personal auto policies pay out in a per person, per accident and property
damage limits. There not a CSL limit. Yes i do agree i would not use avemco
for liabiltiy do to there limits but i dont think its worthless.
Look avemco up on am best or one of the other rating services. If you want
to pay to have the full report it will show there loss history. It is public
record. You can do this with any insurance company.
chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Helms" <jhelms(at)i1.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Avemco Insurance |
I would not (and did not) call it worthless. It is just not as good as a
per passenger limit. And I did not even mention AVEMCO's family sub-limits.
(25% of the sublimit)
John "JT" Helms
----- Original Message -----
From: <CW9371(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Avemco Insurance
In a message dated 5/21/2002 1:14:52 PM Central Daylight Time,
cengland(at)netdoor.com writes:
> ey told me (I've been insured with
> them in the past) that there would be no difference in
> premium, but that $50k of hull + the almost worthless
> liability would cost $2,500 per year. $30k hull would be
> $2100/yr, & (worthless) liability !only! would be
> $1200/year. This is more than I paid Avemco for liability +
> hull on my -4 a few years ago.
>
> The 'agent' tried to tell me that they are paying out dollar
> for dollar for every premium they get right now. However, he
> didn't offer to show me their books.
worthless liability, well not quite, look at your auto policy, most
personal auto policies pay out in a per person, per accident and property
damage limits. There not a CSL limit. Yes i do agree i would not use
avemco
for liabiltiy do to there limits but i dont think its worthless.
Look avemco up on am best or one of the other rating services. If you want
to pay to have the full report it will show there loss history. It is
public
record. You can do this with any insurance company.
chris
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Spin Testing?? |
In a message dated 5/21/02 1:34:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time, rv7(at)b4.ca writes:
<< About now i'm thinking i'm glad I didn't start my Vertical stab first,
despite some of the recommendations here on the Forum. I wonder if Vans
will exchange my unbuilt VS pieces for the new design when it comes
available?
Since aerobatics are something I *do* plan on in my -7 (not
competitively or anything, but I *do* want the capability), i'd be quite
put out to find that it "wasn't recommended" to do spins in it.
-RB4
rv7 "at" b4.ca
RV-7 Empennage (Horizontal Stab) >>
Just to clear up any confusion:
Vans hasn't said anything about changing the vertical stab on the RV-7. They
have mentioned that they are experimenting with a larger rudder...
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ted Gauthier <tgauthier(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Balloons & RV's in Puerto Rico |
Out of curiosity, does anyone know if there are any RV's in Puerto Rico? I am
will be flying my hot air balloon in Puerto Rico the first 10 days of June and
I was wondering if there are any RV's or builders in the area?
Ted Gauthier
Pontiac, Mi
RV-6, firewall forward
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie and Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Avemco Insurance |
'Worthless' was my word, not John's.
I admit, I was exaggerating for effect. The proper thing to
say would be, "If you injure or kill someone on the ground &
are sued for say, $1,000,000, your $1,000,000 liability
policy will be worth $100,000 to you."
(You can handle the other $900,000, right?)
Charlie
John Helms wrote:
>
>
> I would not (and did not) call it worthless. It is just not as good as a
> per passenger limit. And I did not even mention AVEMCO's family sub-limits.
> (25% of the sublimit)
>
> John "JT" Helms
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <CW9371(at)aol.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Avemco Insurance
>
>
> In a message dated 5/21/2002 1:14:52 PM Central Daylight Time,
> cengland(at)netdoor.com writes:
>
> > ey told me (I've been insured with
> > them in the past) that there would be no difference in
> > premium, but that $50k of hull + the almost worthless
> > liability would cost $2,500 per year. $30k hull would be
> > $2100/yr, & (worthless) liability !only! would be
> > $1200/year. This is more than I paid Avemco for liability +
> > hull on my -4 a few years ago.
> >
> > The 'agent' tried to tell me that they are paying out dollar
> > for dollar for every premium they get right now. However, he
> > didn't offer to show me their books.
>
> worthless liability, well not quite, look at your auto policy, most
> personal auto policies pay out in a per person, per accident and property
> damage limits. There not a CSL limit. Yes i do agree i would not use
> avemco
> for liabiltiy do to there limits but i dont think its worthless.
>
> Look avemco up on am best or one of the other rating services. If you want
> to pay to have the full report it will show there loss history. It is
> public
> record. You can do this with any insurance company.
>
> chris
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hose Finishing Help |
>
> I am sorry for the re-post, but did not get much response.
>
> I am looking for help finding someone to secure my fireshield to my hoses
and
> pressure test them. I have Stratoflex lines with the proper hose clamps,
but
> not the special tool to pull them tight. I called Vaargair and they
wanted
> $35 per hose (with me supplying all the components). That seems high to
me.
> Does anyone have any other suggestions on where I can get some help?
> Thanks
Mike, I can't help you on the testing. Maybe check with the local
hydraulics shop?
As for the clamps, no special tools are really needed. I used another
lister's method of a vise and visegrips and it worked fine. It just takes
more force than you would think. Put the clamp in place on the hose then
tighten the vise on the edges of the portion of the clamp where the strap
goes through. Pull like crazy on the strap using the visegrips on the end
of the strap. I don't have the proper vocabulary to describe it clearly,
but now that you know it is possible, it shouldn't be too hard.
It is a good idea to dip the end of the firesleeve in some of that liquid
plastic, for tool handle coating, before you install the clamp. Looks nice
and keeps oil from wicking in.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Puckett <rv8er(at)concentric.net> |
| Subject: | RV-8 IO360 Throttle cable |
Listers,
I have installed a 200hp IO-360 with bendix injection in my RV-8 with a
Vetterman exhaust using Van's throttle cable and attach bracket. I'm
concerned about the proximity of this cable with the ball joint in the
exhaust under the sump. I'm guessing the cable is about 5/8" from the
exhaust. I installed a heat shield on the exhaust and the cable is now
just barely not touching the shield. I bought some firesleeve to install
over the cable but as it stands now that firesleeve would be in contact
with the shield.
Is this OK???
In the picture that came with the throttle cable attach hardware it show
what appears to be the same condition. However, I'm concerned this will
damage the cable.
What have others done here?
Anybody out there with a flying ship using this setup that could report
on the condition of the cable after use.
Any idea on what the temperature rating is of that cable?
Thanks,
Greg Puckett (engine/panel/wiring)
Elizabeth, Colorado
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eric" <enewton57(at)cableone.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hose Finishing Help |
Hi Mike,
I took all of my hoses to a local hydraulics shop and they pressure tested
them for about $2.50 a piece. Check your local car parts places for any
hydraulics shops. Custom car places sometimes have the equipment.
The fire sleeve on mine was secured with some stainless steel safety wire
twisted around. Crude but effective.
Hope this helps some.
Eric Newton - Long Beach, MS
RV-6A - N57ME (Flying)
www.ericsrv6a.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <N8292W(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Hose Finishing Help
>
> I am sorry for the re-post, but did not get much response.
>
> I am looking for help finding someone to secure my fireshield to my hoses
and
> pressure test them. I have Stratoflex lines with the proper hose clamps,
but
> not the special tool to pull them tight. I called Vaargair and they
wanted
> $35 per hose (with me supplying all the components). That seems high to
me.
> Does anyone have any other suggestions on where I can get some help?
> Thanks
> -Mike Kraus
> Finishing wiring, finishing FWF, dreading fiberglass......
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | windsaloft(at)rmisp.com (Terri Watson) |
| Subject: | RV-7 emp kit for sale |
I have an RV-6 emp kit with the RV-7 "conversion" kit for sale --- so it is
an RV-7 emp that will be the start for the rest of the -7. It comes with
the electric trim option. Through some strategic wing kit acquisitions, I
now have TWO emp kits, but only want to build one airplane......so, need to
get this one on to a new builder. No problem working with Van's to get this
assigned to a new builder.
The horizontal stabilizer rear spar is complete, and the forward spar just
begun (spar tabs cut and drilled, angle pieces fabricated, but no riveting.
All kit pieces deburred and scotch-brited, only assembled piece is primed.
Rest of kit is untouched, workmanship on parts completed is excellent --
overseen by IA/Builder.
Basically, a new emp kit with a few hours head start for you. All plans,
drawings, hardware lists, invoices, etc. included.
New RV-7 Emp kit is $1370 new, plus $25 crating, plus freight.
Buy this one for $900 plus freight. Come pick it up and I'll take $50 off
b/c I don't have to pack it.
I'll guarantee, in writing, that all the parts, hardware, etc. are there.
Need to get this moved on out so I can order the fuselage kit next......
REPLY OFF-LINE, email: windsaloft(at)rmisp.com
Terri Watson, Lander, Wyoming
RV-7
Wings...........
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Phat Phil <phugoid(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Hose Finishing Help |
Larry Pardue wrote:
>
>Mike, I can't help you on the testing. Maybe check with the local
>hydraulics shop?
>
>As for the clamps, no special tools are really needed. I used another
>lister's method of a vise and visegrips and it worked fine. It just takes
>more force than you would think. Put the clamp in place on the hose then
>tighten the vise on the edges of the portion of the clamp where the strap
>goes through. Pull like crazy on the strap using the visegrips on the end
>of the strap. I don't have the proper vocabulary to describe it clearly,
>but now that you know it is possible, it shouldn't be too hard.
>
>It is a good idea to dip the end of the firesleeve in some of that liquid
>plastic, for tool handle coating, before you install the clamp. Looks nice
>and keeps oil from wicking in.
>
>Larry Pardue
>Carlsbad, NM
>
>RV-6 N441LP Flying
>http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
>
Isn't that liquid plastic flammable?
Doesn't seem like a good thing to put on fire sleeve.
Phil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Aronson <aronsond(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Balloons & RV's in Puerto Rico |
Ted:
You're a hard guy to like. Pueto Rico? Wow... Have fun and take pictures.
Project going OK?
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Gauthier" <tgauthier(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RV-List: Balloons & RV's in Puerto Rico
>
> Out of curiosity, does anyone know if there are any RV's in Puerto Rico?
I am will be flying my hot air balloon in Puerto Rico the first 10 days of
June and I was wondering if there are any RV's or builders in the area?
>
> Ted Gauthier
> Pontiac, Mi
> RV-6, firewall forward
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
| Subject: | Hose Finishing Help |
I used safety wire to secure the fireshield to my hoses.
Stephen Soule
Huntington, Vermont
RV-6A N227RV
-----Original Message-----
I am sorry for the re-post, but did not get much response.
I am looking for help finding someone to secure my fireshield to my hoses
and
pressure test them. I have Stratoflex lines with the proper hose clamps,
but
not the special tool to pull them tight
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)attbi.com |
Here is a helpful link to Lycoming regarding all sorts
of useful stuff relating to the care and feeding of your
Lycoming engine.
http://www.lycoming.textron.com/support/publications/inde
x.html
-Glenn Gordon
N442E
(28 hours)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Krhooper(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Visiting Nashville TN this weekend. Any RV's in the area? |
Dan, If you are interested, I am building an RV-8. Currently in the
fuselage on the gear boxes. I am located between Percy Priest Lake and Mt.
Juliet. Drop me a line if you would like to visit.
Randy Hooper
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane<n8wv(at)earthlink.net> |
vansairforce ,
rv8list , rv-list
| Subject: | Traffic Proximity Alert System |
Anyone have any feedback on this or other similar units?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane<n8wv(at)earthlink.net> |
vansairforce" ,
rv8list
| Subject: | Re: Traffic Proximity Alert System |
Anyone have any feedback on this or other similar units?
http://www.surecheckaviation.com/tpas/index.html
-Bill VonDane
RV-8A N8WV
http://vondane.com/rv8a
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Hose Finishing Help |
StratoFlex sells a product to dip the hose ends in to seal and is fireproof.
Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Hose Finishing Help
>
> I used safety wire to secure the fireshield to my hoses.
>
> Stephen Soule
> Huntington, Vermont
> RV-6A N227RV
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> I am sorry for the re-post, but did not get much response.
>
> I am looking for help finding someone to secure my fireshield to my hoses
> and
> pressure test them. I have Stratoflex lines with the proper hose clamps,
> but
> not the special tool to pull them tight
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve J Hurlbut" <sjhdcl(at)kingston.net> |
| Subject: | Fuselage riveting questions |
I'm about to rivet the fuselage together including the F770 side skins, F772
bottom skin, centre
fuselage section (F704s) and all the angles and gussets. A few questions:
1. I guess I dimple the firewall now? If I dimple it now the cowling hinge
may be
hard to fit later. If I don't dimple it access will be hard because the
steel brackets will be riveted in place.
I'm assuming the cowling hinge gets countersunk later. Does the 0.020 shim
on the cowling hinge in drawing 45 (section R-R)
get dimpled later as well? Can't find any direction on this.
2. The fuel tank attachment brackets. Do I drill those now or later?
3. I plan on riveting the forward bottom skin stiffeners on before putting
the fuselage back together.
I should be able to slip the stiffener over the F704, clecoe the floor in
place and then put the firewall in place.
Anybody else tried this?
4. On drawing 28 where it says "see Tri-gear gear attach dwg 34" and there
are 5 rivets indicated as AN426AD4-7.
Drawing 34 shows these as AN3-6A bolts, not rivets. I'll leave these holes
alone for now. There are 5 bolts in this area
that attaches the landing gear mount right? Easily covered with gear
fairings later I guess.
Is it just me or do the instruction get worse the further along you get?
Steve Hurlbut
RV-7A
O-360 A1A
Fuselage in pieces, again.
http://members.kingston.net/sjhdcl/rv7a.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Hall" <robjhall(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Traffic Proximity Alert System |
> Anyone have any feedback on this or other similar units?
>
> http://www.surecheckaviation.com/tpas/index.html
>
I just saw a report in Aviation Consumer comparing this unit and the Monroy
ATD-200. The gist of the story was that the Monroy was more accurate and
much smaller, but slightly more expensive. More info here:
http://www.avionix.com/collis.html
Bob Hall, RV-6
Colorado Springs
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Avemco Insurance |
I just had my plane inspected this morning by a local tech counsler, he gave
me a ticket but informed me that avemeco doesn't care to see these anymore,
and they have become very difficult to deal with, . he suggested Vangard,
which is Nation air JT Helms etc... which i already have coverage with. so
the little inspection slips are worthless to me. but i did want experienced
eyes looking over my project before the big inspection. he only found a
couple things. i should use black tye wraps in the engine compartment for
heat, some of the bolts vans palns call out don't leave enough threads
sticking out of the bolts. how many threads is good enough?
scott
tampa
working at the speed of light
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com> |
| Subject: | Traffic Proximity Alert System |
I tell you what... the SureCheck unit sure has a nicer "female" voice.
--
Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE, CCNA
Network Administrator
Union Safe Deposit Bank
209-946-5116
-----Original Message-----
From: Robert Hall [mailto:robjhall(at)adelphia.net]
Subject: Re: RV-List: Traffic Proximity Alert System
> Anyone have any feedback on this or other similar units?
>
> http://www.surecheckaviation.com/tpas/index.html
>
I just saw a report in Aviation Consumer comparing this unit and the Monroy
ATD-200. The gist of the story was that the Monroy was more accurate and
much smaller, but slightly more expensive. More info here:
http://www.avionix.com/collis.html
Bob Hall, RV-6
Colorado Springs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | wing-walk removal |
Anyone have any suggestions on a safe, easy way to remove well-stuck on wing
walk material (the kind that comes in a roll, not the brush-on stuff) without
damaging or lifting the polyurethane beneath?
I used white wing walk from ACS on my mostly white wings... the stuff turned
gray from dirt almost immediately and does not come clean with aggressive
cleaning, so I want to start over with black. However, it's stuck quite
tightly, and I think a solvent will be necessary. Ideas?
Bill B
RV-6A - 4 years, 230 hrs, DuPont basecoat/clearcoat
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net> |
| Subject: | wing-walk removal |
Did you try heat? Most things with stick 'em will significantly weaken
with heat.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 150 hours
> Anyone have any suggestions on a safe, easy way to remove
> well-stuck on wing
> walk material (the kind that comes in a roll, not the
> brush-on stuff) without
> damaging or lifting the polyurethane beneath?
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: wing-walk removal |
have you tried a hair dryer to warm and remove?
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
May 12, 2002 - May 22, 2002
RV-Archive.digest.vol-mv