RV-Archive.digest.vol-nd
July 17, 2002 - July 26, 2002
-----Original Message-----
| From: | owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com |
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of 3 rotor
| Subject: | Re: OSH planning |
Randy - We stayed in Grand Rapids at a historic hotel downtown(FDR stayed
there when dedicating Mt Rushmore). It was quite reasonable price. The
local firehouse brew pub was excellent. What else could one want? See
Homewing article :-) Kevin
I have also spent 3 days in Hettinger ND, nice courtesy truck, cheap
motels and food. Ground fog their specialty!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bobpaulo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fatal Crash Update |
Mark, You post exactly what I think happened to us. Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: matco tailwheel |
Up at Arlington last week I noticed that Matco has a tailwheel that appears
to be the same dimensons as the Van's wheel we use on our planes, with a
solid rubber tire and plastic wheel, that's 1 lb lighter than Van's standard
wheel. Has anyone used this, and if so what were your results? I saw one
posting from 1997 in the archives but that was before he even flew it I
think. The specs on the Matco are:
Wheel p/n WHLP406-WD
- 1.725 lbs (vs 2.754 for vans wheel)
- Takes a 1/2" axle bolt -- I think they use a bushing to make that work so
we'd need a thicker bushing to use the Van's std 3/8" bolt (or drill out for
the larger bolt?)
- 450 lb weight rating -- comparable to van's
- The bad news: $67.48 vs $27 for van's std wheel.
I'd be interested in hearing from anyone who's used this wheel or has any
information as to why it would/wouldn't work as a replacement. Always
looking for ways to save weight y'know (even though I don't really need to
save it back there on my plane!)
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~400 hrs)
Portland, OR
www.vanshomewing.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
Somebody on a local email list was looking for a detail about a particular
model Lycoming engine. That got me thinking about this and I downloaded the
TCDS from the FAA for the most common certified engines and props for RVs.
In case you need more specs than you know what to do with, I figured I'd
forward this link to some of the "big" lists:
http://www.rvproject.com/tcds/
Enjoy...
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D (wings)
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robert Di Meo" <bdimeo(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | RV-8 for sale... |
Bummer Ken!!!!! That sure is a nice airplane.
So you going to take some of the money and start another RV?
How are the plans for an RV workshop coming? I sure hope you're going to
stay around and help grow our budding RV Wing.
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Ken Balch
Subject: RV-List: RV-8 for sale...
After much soul-searching, pressing financial concerns require that I
put RV-8 #81125 (N118KB) up for sale.
The specifics:
RV-8 27TT - empty weight 1110 - built from a standard kit
IO-360-A1B6 27SMOH by Bart Lalonde (AeroSport Power) - the case & crank
were certified by Bart to conform to new limits or better and everything
else is new
Hartzell C2YK prop - new from Van's
Airflow Performance fuel injection system with purge valve
Lightspeed electronic ignition system
Vetterman crossover exhaust
Denso 35amp alternator
SkyTec lightweight starter
Stewart Warner oil cooler - new from Pacific Oil Cooler
Fuel tanks professionally built by Evan Johnson with flop tube in left
tank
Infinity grip with PTT, coolie hat two-axis trim, start button, flap
switch & two unassigned buttons
Deluxe throttle quadrant from Van's
All instruments & avionics brand new:
UMA airspeed indicator - knots
SigmaTek attitude indicator - vacuum
Altimeter - 20K'
Turn coordinator
SigmaTek directional gyro - vacuum
RMI uEncoder
Manifold pressure - Van's
Tachometer - Van's
Oil temp - Van's
Oil pressure - Van's
EGT - Van's (one channel - cylinder #3)
CHT - Van's (one channel - Cylinder #3)
G meter
Clock - Electronics International
Volt/Ammeter - Electronics International
Magnetic compass - S.I.R.S.
Fuel computer - Electronics International
Dual fuel gauge - Electronics International
suction gauge
digital trim indicators (two-axis)
PS Engineering intercom
Hobbs meter
toggle switches for magneto & electronic ignition
Electrical system & wiring per Van's plans and utilizing Van's harness
kit
ACK ELT
Brake reservoirs on pedals with no low pressure plastic tubing.
Cowling installed with Camlocs. No hinges fwf.
The plane is currently unpainted. The wheel pants & gear leg fairings
are installed, but the intersection fairings have not been fabricated.
Switches, wiring & strobe power packs are installed for Whelen three-way
wingtip lights, but the lights themselves have not been installed.
Switches & wiring are installed for RMD wingtip landing & taxi lights,
but the kits have not been installed.
The plane flies like any other RV: easy to handle on the ground and a
dream in the air.
Price: $130K and worth every penny...
Pictures available for those seriously interested...
Best Regards,
Ken Balch
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ken Balch <kbalch1(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-8 for sale... |
I'll definitely be staying in the RV community. I'm either going to buy a
completed -6 or build a -7qb in the near future. In the meanwhile, I'll just
be driving to wing events... :-)
Look for my FOR SALE sign as OSH next week...
Ken
Robert Di Meo wrote:
>
> Bummer Ken!!!!! That sure is a nice airplane.
>
> So you going to take some of the money and start another RV?
> How are the plans for an RV workshop coming? I sure hope you're going to
> stay around and help grow our budding RV Wing.
>
> Bob
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Ken Balch
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: RV-8 for sale...
>
>
> After much soul-searching, pressing financial concerns require that I
> put RV-8 #81125 (N118KB) up for sale.
>
> The specifics:
>
> RV-8 27TT - empty weight 1110 - built from a standard kit
>
> IO-360-A1B6 27SMOH by Bart Lalonde (AeroSport Power) - the case & crank
> were certified by Bart to conform to new limits or better and everything
> else is new
>
> Hartzell C2YK prop - new from Van's
>
> Airflow Performance fuel injection system with purge valve
>
> Lightspeed electronic ignition system
>
> Vetterman crossover exhaust
>
> Denso 35amp alternator
>
> SkyTec lightweight starter
>
> Stewart Warner oil cooler - new from Pacific Oil Cooler
>
> Fuel tanks professionally built by Evan Johnson with flop tube in left
> tank
>
> Infinity grip with PTT, coolie hat two-axis trim, start button, flap
> switch & two unassigned buttons
>
> Deluxe throttle quadrant from Van's
>
> All instruments & avionics brand new:
>
> UMA airspeed indicator - knots
> SigmaTek attitude indicator - vacuum
> Altimeter - 20K'
> Turn coordinator
> SigmaTek directional gyro - vacuum
> RMI uEncoder
> Manifold pressure - Van's
> Tachometer - Van's
> Oil temp - Van's
> Oil pressure - Van's
> EGT - Van's (one channel - cylinder #3)
> CHT - Van's (one channel - Cylinder #3)
> G meter
> Clock - Electronics International
> Volt/Ammeter - Electronics International
> Magnetic compass - S.I.R.S.
> Fuel computer - Electronics International
> Dual fuel gauge - Electronics International
> suction gauge
> digital trim indicators (two-axis)
> PS Engineering intercom
> Hobbs meter
> toggle switches for magneto & electronic ignition
>
> Electrical system & wiring per Van's plans and utilizing Van's harness
> kit
>
> ACK ELT
>
> Brake reservoirs on pedals with no low pressure plastic tubing.
>
> Cowling installed with Camlocs. No hinges fwf.
>
> The plane is currently unpainted. The wheel pants & gear leg fairings
> are installed, but the intersection fairings have not been fabricated.
> Switches, wiring & strobe power packs are installed for Whelen three-way
> wingtip lights, but the lights themselves have not been installed.
> Switches & wiring are installed for RMD wingtip landing & taxi lights,
> but the kits have not been installed.
>
> The plane flies like any other RV: easy to handle on the ground and a
> dream in the air.
>
> Price: $130K and worth every penny...
>
> Pictures available for those seriously interested...
>
> Best Regards,
> Ken Balch
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Al Grajek" <algrajek(at)msn.com> |
rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com, rv-list(at)matronics.com
| Subject: | Flap Actuator brackets |
Vans Drawing is a bit vague regarding the fabrication and installation of
the FL406 a,b,and c.Does the 406A actually get bent to 88 degrees? How? Also
it seems that the 406C Tapered angle must get tbent or it will not fity
flush on the 406B and the bottom of the rib? Thanks
Al Grajek.
RV8 Wings(still)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RobHickman(at)aol.com |
Anyone carry Oxygen with a passenger in an RV-4?
If so, how and what size bottle?
Thanks
Rob Hickman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Michael J. Robbins" <michael.j.robbins(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Tail Wheel Options/ was matco tailwheel |
Randall and other tail draggers;
Also at Arlington I learned of another tail wheel that we might
consider. It sits higher giving more ground clearance. Apparently there
was a case where someone with the standard wheel fell through a crack in on
a runway (literally) and tore out the aft bulkhead. Many of the Blackjack
guys up here have the higher wheel on their tail draggers. I'll find out
the name and where to get it and post the information. It won't save
weight but may save a lot of grief.
Mike Robbins
RV8Q N88MJ 29.7 hours
Seattle area
>
>Up at Arlington last week I noticed that Matco has a tailwheel that appears
>to be the same dimensons as the Van's wheel we use on our planes, with a
>solid rubber tire and plastic wheel, that's 1 lb lighter than Van's standard
>wheel. Has anyone used this, and if so what were your results? I saw one
>posting from 1997 in the archives but that was before he even flew it I
>think. The specs on the Matco are:
>
>Wheel p/n WHLP406-WD
>- 1.725 lbs (vs 2.754 for vans wheel)
>- Takes a 1/2" axle bolt -- I think they use a bushing to make that work so
>we'd need a thicker bushing to use the Van's std 3/8" bolt (or drill out for
>the larger bolt?)
>- 450 lb weight rating -- comparable to van's
>- The bad news: $67.48 vs $27 for van's std wheel.
>
>I'd be interested in hearing from anyone who's used this wheel or has any
>information as to why it would/wouldn't work as a replacement. Always
>looking for ways to save weight y'know (even though I don't really need to
>save it back there on my plane!)
>
>Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~400 hrs)
>Portland, OR
>www.vanshomewing.org
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gannon, Terence" <Terence.Gannon(at)trican.ca> |
| Subject: | Flap Actuator brackets |
Al -- I ran into the same thing -- I was a little confused on these points,
and got in touch with Van's, and they confirmed both of the bends that you
mention below. The actuator arm must be bent so that when you assemble
with the right angle, the 'other' side of the right angle seats properly on
the front of the flap spar. On mine, I also had to file the top and the
bottom of the right angle so that it fit between the spar flanges --
remember, the top of the actuator 'leans' out a little, so the flap spar
side of the right angle will actually be in the shape of a parallelogram
once you're done with it. You may also have to relieve the area where the
right angle where it come into contact with the flap hinge and the radii for
the flanges -- I did, at least.
As for the tapered right angle, that has to bent, as well, to an angle
slightly more acute than 90 degrees. This accommodates the 'lean' that I
described above. In the case of both bends, I used an inexpensive hydraulic
press (y'know, the type made with a car jack, mounted upside down), and then
jigged the parts with flat steel stock and angle iron in such a way that the
plunger applied pressure to make the bends. The main advantage of the press
is that you can proceed in a very slow, controlled manner, as opposed to
clamping it in a vise and belting it with a hammer, which is what I believe
Van's suggested. (!)
One other tip -- there are four or five blind rivets spec'd for riveting the
botton skin, rib and tapered angle together. Van's suggested drilling #30,
and dimpling #40 -- that combo provided a very nice final fit for these
rivets. HTH and FWIW.
Cheers...
Terry in Calgary
RV-6 S/N 24424
"Wings"
-----Original Message-----
From: Al Grajek [mailto:algrajek(at)msn.com]
rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com; rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: Flap Actuator brackets
Vans Drawing is a bit vague regarding the fabrication and installation of
the FL406 a,b,and c.Does the 406A actually get bent to 88 degrees? How? Also
it seems that the 406C Tapered angle must get tbent or it will not fity
flush on the 406B and the bottom of the rib? Thanks
Al Grajek.
RV8 Wings(still)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "flamini2" <flamini2(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel pump problem |
i flew from Chicago to St Louis yesterday in 90 deg humid and hazy
conditions. No problems on the way there but on the return i decided to
climb to 14,500' to get on top of the haze and avoid towering Q's in the
area. While climbing with fuel injected 0-360 and mech pump the engine
quit at about 13,000' and i had to turn the boost pump on to get it to
run. i leveled off at 14,500 and continued on with the boost pump and
dialed in the nearest airports on the way. i tried to turn off the boost
twice with same results. The third time it ran ok on the mech pump and i
continued home without any problems. Has anyone else had this problem? i
am thinking it was the heat and altitude that vapor locked the mech
pump. N564DF race #53 Chicago.
Dennis and Fran
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Boyd C. Braem" <bcbraem(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tail Wheel Options/ was matco tailwheel |
Here's a post from a while back that may be of interest.
RVer273sb(at)aol.com wrote: (14 May, 2001)
>
> Bob,
> I use the GEN 21506-88 sealed bearings I got from
> Whistler Bearing here in Denver. The smallest i/d they come in
> is 1/2 inch so a full length bushing is required for the 3/8 axle
> bolt. I have 340 hrs on mine without a problem. I have sent them
> to others on a limited basis with a bushing. Some tail wheel units
> require that you remove the taper from the casting bore so these
> bearings seat fully as they have a longer stepped portion.
> Easily done with a drill press and a 1 in. sanding drum by spinning
> the drum with the wheel lying on the table so the drum removes
> the material from the center only.. The wheel is rotated against the
> rotation of the drum.
> Stewart RV4 CO. N273SB.
"Michael J. Robbins" wrote:
>
> Randall and other tail draggers;
>
> Also at Arlington I learned of another tail wheel that we might
> consider. It sits higher giving more ground clearance. Apparently there
> was a case where someone with the standard wheel fell through a crack in on
> a runway (literally) and tore out the aft bulkhead. Many of the Blackjack
> guys up here have the higher wheel on their tail draggers. I'll find out
> the name and where to get it and post the information. It won't save
> weight but may save a lot of grief.
>
> Mike Robbins
> RV8Q N88MJ 29.7 hours
> Seattle area
>
> >
> >Up at Arlington last week I noticed that Matco has a tailwheel that appears
> >to be the same dimensons as the Van's wheel we use on our planes, with a
> >solid rubber tire and plastic wheel, that's 1 lb lighter than Van's standard
> >wheel. Has anyone used this, and if so what were your results? I saw one
> >posting from 1997 in the archives but that was before he even flew it I
> >think. The specs on the Matco are:
> >
> >Wheel p/n WHLP406-WD
> >- 1.725 lbs (vs 2.754 for vans wheel)
> >- Takes a 1/2" axle bolt -- I think they use a bushing to make that work so
> >we'd need a thicker bushing to use the Van's std 3/8" bolt (or drill out for
> >the larger bolt?)
> >- 450 lb weight rating -- comparable to van's
> >- The bad news: $67.48 vs $27 for van's std wheel.
> >
> >I'd be interested in hearing from anyone who's used this wheel or has any
> >information as to why it would/wouldn't work as a replacement. Always
> >looking for ways to save weight y'know (even though I don't really need to
> >save it back there on my plane!)
> >
> >Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~400 hrs)
> >Portland, OR
> >www.vanshomewing.org
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Biddle" <d_biddle(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel pump problem |
I have about 100 hours now on my RV-6A. Twice*, both on the ground at high
temperature and high altitudes, the engine quit and was difficult to get
started again. I assume it is vapor lock and have the cowl off now to
install firesleeve on the two exposed 5" sections of aluminum fuel line, put
a blast tube on the fuel pump, and wrap the exhaust.
Are there any pictures online of a fuel pump shroud or sources to get one?
*First vapor lock - about 100 degrees and 5700 feet was after a quick
turnaround fuel stop at St Johns, AZ. as I was taxiing for takeoff.
The second, last friday was again over 100 degrees and 5200 feet but
happened during taxi off the runway about 5000' after landing. Using the
primer, I was able to keep the engine running after restart.
This was in Jackpot Nevada. Eating at Cactus Pete's Casino Restaurant a
short walk from the fuel pump, I overheard talk between two tables about
troubles with vapor lock they were having with their Road RV's.
After the first time, I thought if I kept the boost pump on after startup
until after takeoff, that it would not happen again, I did shut off the
boost pump after landing in Jackpot. I only use 100LL, new O-360 engine.
I have not had any problems in Phoenix, the elevation is 1100-1500, but the
temps get well over 100.
Dave Biddle
RV-6A
Phoenix, AZ
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of flamini2
Subject: RV-List: Fuel pump problem
i flew from Chicago to St Louis yesterday in 90 deg humid and hazy
conditions. No problems on the way there but on the return i decided to
climb to 14,500' to get on top of the haze and avoid towering Q's in the
area. While climbing with fuel injected 0-360 and mech pump the engine
quit at about 13,000' and i had to turn the boost pump on to get it to
run. i leveled off at 14,500 and continued on with the boost pump and
dialed in the nearest airports on the way. i tried to turn off the boost
twice with same results. The third time it ran ok on the mech pump and i
continued home without any problems. Has anyone else had this problem? i
am thinking it was the heat and altitude that vapor locked the mech
pump. N564DF race #53 Chicago.
Dennis and Fran
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen in RV-4? |
I have oxygen for my RV6a. Using an RVn to travel and not having oxygen is
...
Oh, but you were asking about oxygen in an RV4.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pump problem |
I've had the vapor lock problem at our nearby 3800 MSL airport on quick turn
fuel stops and warm days... very cantankerous restart and trouble with
keeping the engine going once restarted... in my experience, double blast
tubes to the fuel pump have NOT alleviated the problem. My FWF fuel lines
are already fire-sleeved. I think the best prevention is to prop the oil
filler door open during refueling to provide some convective cooling of the
enging compartment (or install one of those fancy drop-open doors in the top
cowling that shuts itself under ram pressure in flight.) I must admit that I
never remember to do the oil door thing when refueling, and sometimes regret
it.
Even avgas is subject to vapor lock under the wrong conditions.
-Bill B
RV-6A O-320 E2D 240 hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Fairy" <matthew.fairy(at)panamtrading.com> |
Hello RVer's newbie here........
Does anyone have photo's or installation advice I purchased round inlets
for my RV4 cowling , installation info and photos that come with the
product are a little sketchy if your a rookie like me. I know I I'm not
the only one who's done them - I've seen them at OSH and S& F
I am also look for one of those nice round roll-over bars I think the
only ugly thing about the RV4 is the triangular roll over bar that comes
with the kit any (nice) advice anyone??
I d appreciate any help!
thanks and regards,
Matt
Matthew Fairy
President
Pan American Worldwide Trading LTD.
www.panamtrading.com
125 Main Street Suite 360
Westport CT 06880
(P) 203-221-9026 (F) 203-221-9027
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Arthur Glaser <airplane(at)megsinet.net> |
| Subject: | rv-4 engine installation pictures |
I plan to be at Oshkosh on Wed. Is there anyone who will be there with
a 4 and fixed pitch prop that would be willing to pull their cowl and
allow me to photograph the engine and cooler installation?
Thanks
Art Glaser
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn P. Wilkinson" <gpw(at)accucomm.net> |
Thanks to everyone who sent e-mail about my brake line question. I got a lot
of good advice.
Thanks again for the help!
Glenn Wilkinson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard V. Reynolds" <rvreynolds(at)macs.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-6A Surface Area - For Painting |
Jim,
I calculated the RV-6A areas as follows:
Fuselage, 118.4 sqft
Wings, 181.1 sqft
Empanage, 62.8 sqft
Fairings (fiberglastips, cowls, wheels, etc.), ??
Fairings (aluminum wing roots, etc.), ??
Richard Reynolds, wings painted!
Jim Oke wrote:
>
> I'm to starting thinking about painting - meaning the end of all those endless
little details is in sight.
>
> Most paint supplier quote in sq. ft. coverage per gallon (generally the 32 oz.
US gallon and not the 40 oz. imp gallon that we dare no longer speak of except
in whispers in out of the way places due to government edict here in Canada.)
So the question becomes what is the surface area of an RV-6A that needs paint
?
>
> Van's claims a wing area of 110 sq. ft. Doubling that (top and bottom is 220
sq ft. A simple wag places the fuse and tail surfaces at about the same or another
220 sq ft. So, call it 440 sq ft, round up to 450 sq ft and order paint accordingly
?? Any better theories or info than this ??
>
> Jim Oke
> Winnipeg, MB
> RV-6A
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Birkelbach" <phil(at)petrasoft.net> |
Okay, now I am confused. What do the words "BUILT IN DIGITAL SLAVED
DIRECTIONAL GYRO" mean. I would think that with the magnetometer in the
unit it could figure out which direction it was going and then use the gyros
to keep going in that direction with a little correction from the
magnetometer here and there. What am I missing?
Godspeed,
Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas
RV-7 N727WB (Reserved)
http://www.myrv7.com
Fuselage
Airplanes never win battles with the ground. The best the airplane can hope
for is a draw.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Sam Buchanan" <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak
>
> Ollie, the DigiTrak does indeed need GPS for functionality. The GPS is
> what tells the DigiTrak where it is in relationship to the heading you
> have punched into the unit. The DigiTrak does not fly a GPS ground track
> in the same sense as the Navaid.
>
> With the Navaid, you can punch "Go To" on your GPS (if it is slaved to
> the Navaid) and it will follow the ground track to the waypoint.
>
> With the DigiTrak, you punch in a heading (which may or may not be
> precisely to your waypoint). The unit then uses GPS to maintain the
> heading you have selected. You will need to buy a GPS such as the very
> good Garmin GPS-35 if you plan to install the DigiTrak.
>
> If GPS is lost, the unit uses an internal magnetometer that "sorta"
> follows the heading (with decreased precision due to errors introduced
> by roll and pitch), and you lose the DG display on the unit.
>
> The Navaid and the Digitrak process info in very different ways. The
> Navaid is admittedly "old tech" but is based on a mechanical gyro and
> input from a GPS for tracking or heading info. The Digitrak depends on
> GPS for functionality and tracks a heading, not a GPS route. It is also
> based on new solid state sensors (magnetometer and gyro) similar (but
> less $$$$) to what is found in the new EFIS type stuff.
>
> As I stated before in regard to the Blue Mtn/Dynon/etc instruments, this
> is new stuff, and has very little field history. Just keep that in mind
> before biting off a big chew......
>
> This is another a case where a great deal of homework needs to be
> conducted before cutting holes in your panel. The electronically
> challenged builder is possibly going to be bewildered by the new stuff
> unless a lot of research if done.
>
> Sam Buchanan
>
> ======================
>
> Ollie Washburn wrote:
> >
> >
> > An autopilot does not need gps to work,it' only for tracking.The NAV-AID
> > works same way.
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "gert" <gert(at)execpc.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak
> >
> > >
> > > Hmmm, a quick look at your website does not reveal the need for a
> > > functional GPS for your AutoPilots to be functional. Am I wrong and
> > > missed it somehow ??
> > >
> > > What if all I have is a handheld GPS ??
> > >
> > > Is this an ommision ?? Sounds like a big one to me......be nice if
that
> > > was mentioned, at least in the FAQ page !!
> > >
> > > What happens if the GPS cannot lock on to the satelites, your
AutoPilot
> > > becomes obsolete, non-functional or does the build-in solid state
gyro's
> > > keep the plane right side up and flying in about the correct way ??
> > > does your "not just a wing leveler" become "just a wing leveler" ??
> > >
> > > Don't get me wrong, I am (or was) planning on installing your
autopilot,
> > > I really like your system, but it having to rely on an outside source,
> > > which might not always be available, seems very scary and will make me
> > > rethink my strategy.
> > >
> > > Does this also hold true for your new DigiTrack system, it does not
> > > function correctly WITHOUT a GPS signal and to buy the DigiTrack
system
> > > I would also have to buy a GPS, either from you or somebody else which
> > > would effectively raise the the prise as advertised from $1495 to 1495
> > > plus 175 or about $1670.
> > >
> > > Or, does the advertised OSH special price of $1495 include the garmin
> > > to make a fully functional wingleveler, comparable to the NavAid,
which
> > > does not need anything auxiliary but does come with the GPS tracking
> > > option as an add-on.
> > >
> > > Gert
> > >
> > > TruTrak Flight Systems wrote:
> > >
> >
> > > >
> > > > The TruTrak does not have a built in GPS, the GPS steering is an add
on
> > > > that gives the user the ability to couple to a GPS that provides GPS
> > > > steering, for example the Garmin 430 or the Apollo GX 60. You do
need a
> > > > GPS for the system, we do sell a Garmin 35, which is an antenna, and
> > > > receiver in one package for $175.00. This would get you all of the
> > > > functionality needed for the Autopilot to function.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pump problem |
In a message dated 7/17/02 4:01:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
SportAV8R(at)aol.com writes:
<< I've had the vapor lock problem at our nearby 3800 MSL airport on quick
turn
fuel stops and warm days... very cantankerous restart and trouble with
keeping the engine going once restarted... in my experience, double blast
tubes to the fuel pump have NOT alleviated the problem. My FWF fuel lines
are already fire-sleeved. I think the best prevention is to prop the oil
filler door open during refueling to provide some convective cooling of the
enging compartment (or install one of those fancy drop-open doors in the top
cowling that shuts itself under ram pressure in flight.) I must admit that
I
never remember to do the oil door thing when refueling, and sometimes regret
it.
Even avgas is subject to vapor lock under the wrong conditions.
-Bill B
RV-6A O-320 E2D 240 hrs >>
I think there is a market out there for a fan that can be inserted in the oil
door for just the situation you describe. Provide a convienient plug in for
it so it can run off the airplane's battery and use it to suck air through
the engine compartment on those hot days. On cooler days, it could stay at
home, or sit in the baggage compartment.
I've had the occasional hot start and/or vapor lock problem, and make a
practice of opening the oil door on hot days. It does help. On the other
hand, it is aggravating to climb in the airplane, strap in, and start the
engine, then realize the oil door is flapping open.
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Arthur Glaser <airplane(at)megsinet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: rv-4 engine installation pictures |
Correction, I should be there Wed through Sun. Art
Arthur Glaser wrote:
>
> I plan to be at Oshkosh on Wed. Is there anyone who will be there with
> a 4 and fixed pitch prop that would be willing to pull their cowl and
> allow me to photograph the engine and cooler installation?
>
> Thanks
>
> Art Glaser
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Birkelbach" <phil(at)petrasoft.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fatal Crash Update |
I have always argued that solo flight in a sailplane should be a requirement
for any fixed wing aircraft rating. I soloed a glider as a teenager and
piddled around for a few years. A few years ago I decided to get my SEL.
The first time the instructor pulled the throttle on me in the pattern my
instinct to push the nose down bordered on being violent. He was very
impressed and I didn't even have to think about it. He said "your flying a
glider now" and that was the most relaxed I had been during the whole
flight.
I am also a SCUBA diver. One of the things that I noticed about diving is
that there is nothing involved that requires any skill or intelligence.
Just about anybody now days can be a diver. The reason there is so much
training involved is so that the actions required during an emergency become
instinct. They are very simple things but the simplest thing becomes very
complex when the adrenaline starts flowing. If another diver kicks the
regulator out of your mouth it is a very simple task to reach back, grab it,
put it in your mouth, clear it and continue breathing, but people have
panicked and drown because they couldn't figure out what to do in that
situation. You shouldn't have to figure it out. It should be so ingrained
in your Psyche that you don't even realize that you did it until after it is
all over.
My point is not that we should all solo a glider or learn to dive, but that
practice to the point of making these things instinctual could very well
save our lives. I have not yet had enough time to practice that much in an
airplane because I started building my RV-7 right after my checkride but
once my plane is built, I intend to spend entire weekends practicing engine
failures so that the day my number comes up I'll be prepared.
BTW something else that I heard once that makes a lot of sense is, when the
big fan on the front quits you have met your deductable. That airplane now
belongs to the insurance company, your only job as PIC is to save the souls
on board, don't worry about that airplane.
Ranting complete.
Godspeed,
Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas
RV-7 N727WB (Reserved)
http://www.myrv7.com
Fuselage
Airplanes never win battles with the ground. The best the airplane can hope
for is a draw.
----- Original Message -----
From: <czechsix(at)juno.com>
Subject: RV-List: Re: Fatal Crash Update
>
> Guys, one important thing to keep in mind regarding the post crash
speculation about the RV-4 accident Bob was involved in is that the RV is
capable of very high descent rates even when NOT in a stall or nosedown
attitude. All aircraft are susceptible to this to some extent or another.
I know a pilot who broke his back and is paralyzed from the waist down due
to such an accident in a Helio Courier which has superb STOL performance and
is virtually unstallable. But when it's behind the power curve there's a
lot of drag at low speed and high AOA, if the engine quits it drops like a
rock even though the wing is not stalled. The guy I know was involved in
this unfortunate scenario...low and slow, the engine quit, and the airplane
pancaked into the ground very hard resulting in serious injury.
>
> The RV can do the same thing and may be worse than a lot of spam cans in
this regard because of the low aspect ratio wing. Go flying some time and
at altitude pull the power to idle...trim it nose up (the way you would in
the pattern) and hold the stick back a bit to keep it in a more or less
level flight attitude. As you slow down watch the vertical speed. You can
get some pretty impressive sink rates even though the airplane is not
stalled and you feel like you're 'straight and level'. That's why when
you're climbing out in the RV at a few hundred feet above the runway and 70
mph and the engine quits, you have to get the nose pushed over RIGHT NOW to
maintain enough airspeed for a safe flare to a survivable touchdown. Fiddle
around for a few seconds and you may find yourself dropping like a rock with
no energy margin for recovery. By the time you are dropping fast enough to
realize how quickly the ground is rushing up at you, it's too late...you
don't have enough alt!
> it!
> ude left to push the nose over to build airspeed for the flare. This is
basically what happens in wind sheer situations too...you are low and slow
on approach or climbout, suddenly the wind shifts and your airspeed
decreases, and you start to drop rapidly. In this case assuming your engine
is running you can use a combination of full power and a bit of nose down if
necessary to recover, but if it's severe enough you may still end up in the
scenario described above where you're too low and too slow to recover from
your excessive sink rate.
>
> Anybody who hasn't explored this scenario in whatever aircraft you fly
should do so...it's a real eye opener.
>
> --Mark Navratil
> Cedar Rapids, Iowa (Montreal this week)
> RV-8A N2D finish kit
>
> P.S.--Got my O-360 back from Aerosport a couple weeks ago, painted red and
black with dual crank-triggered Lightspeeds....a real beauty. Wish I were
at home so I could hang it on the airplane...
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Collins <bcollins747_1999(at)yahoo.com> |
Folks:
I know a lot of folks are driving to and back from
OSH. I'm heading back from OSH to the Twin Cities on
Sunday. If anyone from then on needs a place to stay
on a long drive -or flight - home, consider yourself
invited. Just drop me an e-mail.
I'm East of St. Paul, just 2 miles south of I-94.
Airport wise...I'm near Lake Elmo (21D), South St.
Paul and St. Paul.
I can't vouch for the accomodations, but the
atmosphere is friendly.
Bob Collins
Woodbury, Minn.
http://autos.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LarryRobertHelming" <lhelming(at)sigecom.net> |
Here is an earlier reply from TruTrak I got to the same question:
The Built-in Digital Slaved Directional Gyro is an internal solid state gyro
that is slaved to GPS track. This means that the internal gyro takes the
GPS track, that is only updated once a second, and makes it gyroscopically
smooth, so that it can be displayed as the correct track. The display does
not replace a DG, but when the unit is in use, it can be used as the means
of selecting track. The reason that we say that it is not a replacement for
a DG is that it relies partially on GPS, we therefore do not recommend that
it be used as a primary DG. The DG being digital is also not as easily
interpreted by some, even though the information flow is just as smooth.
Larry in Indiana -- working on the fuselage
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phil Birkelbach" <phil(at)petrasoft.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak
>
> Okay, now I am confused. What do the words "BUILT IN DIGITAL SLAVED
> DIRECTIONAL GYRO" mean. SNIP
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re:sailplanes/scuba diving |
hi phil
while i never hardly disagree with anyone on this list as i feel i'm always
learning from the collective knowledge always present on this list. but i
have to put my 2.75 cents into your comments about sailplanes and scuba
diving.
1st. sailplanes and prop planes have a much differant gliding behavior. if
you get proffecient dead stick landing a sailplane, chances are you will come
up short of the threshold in a prop plane. my advise is to practice in the
plane you will be dead stick landing in. perferably at altitude.
2nd. being a scuba diver myself with over 1400 dives, i can tell you that it
does take some skill and intelligence. sure you can learn the basics and not
get into too much trouble as long as your in 1 atmosphere (35ft) of water.
but the 2 & 3 atmosphere levels can kill you quick if your not intelligent.
nitrogen norcosis, the bends, lung rupture, eardrum rupture, not to mention
your timing and dive charts, mixed gases. flying too soon after a dive can
get you to.
not a flame, i just don't want some over confident uncertified wanta be
scubadiver go get themselves killed, because they think there is nothing to
it.
and to make this rv related, don't fly your rv for 12 hours after a dive!
take care.
scott
tampa
rv6a flying
lobster diving mini season next week, whooo hooooo
darn, i have to work
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pump problem |
My -4 has an AEIO-360 with the RSA (Bendix) fuel injection system. I have
really had no problems ever with low fuel pressure at high altitudes. I
have been as high as 13,500 but it was not hot (mid winter flying over New
Mexico). I have noticed sometimes that after a hot start while taxiing out
the pressure may read around 10 psi (down from it's usual 18 psi). Turning
on the fuel pump restored the pressure. There are no blast tubes on the
fuel pump but all hoses are firesleeved. Wish I had a quick answer, but it
does sound like some type of vapor lock.
Doug Weiler
RV-4s, 4EM and 22DW
-----
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pump problem |
>
>I've had the vapor lock problem
When it is real hot and you are in for a quick turnaround, cool it all you
can. As you say, open the oil door. Also, point it into the wind and turn
the prop vertical. I think someone once said firesleeve just helps hold
the heat in the line and in the fuel that is in it.
Bonanzas and Debonairs (mine is FOR SALE!!!) terrible actors for this kind
of problem. They are injected and there is a right way to start them when
hot. They do have a fuel return line.
I have not had any problem starting my non-injected RV6a when hot. For the
Beechies the procedure is basically mixture full lean, throttle full open,
no boost pump starter then after a few turns, mixture rich, throttle to
usual (cracked+) and boost on, all while cranking. This procedure needs
many hands which is why they make the aircraft with four seats . They also
make them with aluminum tubing fuel lines fwf and no firesleeve.
Fly early when it is cool and TSTMs haven't started their day yet.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pump problem |
| From: | Denis Walsh <deniswalsh(at)earthlink.net> |
This sounds a lot like Stew's problem with his injected O-320. It gave him
fits for months. He is a hell of a mechanic and very tenacious, and finally
decided it was traced to the purge system on the airflow. Hopefully he will
chime in soon. He usually monitors the list.
Denis
> From: "flamini2" <flamini2(at)attbi.com>
> Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 12:10:33 -0500
> To: ,
> Subject: RV-List: Fuel pump problem
>
>
> i flew from Chicago to St Louis yesterday in 90 deg humid and hazy
> conditions. No problems on the way there but on the return i decided to
> climb to 14,500' to get on top of the haze and avoid towering Q's in the
> area. While climbing with fuel injected 0-360 and mech pump the engine
> quit at about 13,000' and i had to turn the boost pump on to get it to
> run. i leveled off at 14,500 and continued on with the boost pump and
> dialed in the nearest airports on the way. i tried to turn off the boost
> twice with same results. The third time it ran ok on the mech pump and i
> continued home without any problems. Has anyone else had this problem? i
> am thinking it was the heat and altitude that vapor locked the mech
> pump. N564DF race #53 Chicago.
> Dennis and Fran
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: hot oil temps |
| From: | Michael D Hilger <rvsixer(at)juno.com> |
My RV-6 has an O-360-A1A with the Sensenich FP prop. I started out with
Van's Niagara 7-row oil cooler and it was only okay. No margin for
extreme conditions. It's mounted on the firewall fed by 3" SCAT. I
swapped it out for an Aero-classic 9-row oil cooler from Pacific Oil
Cooler. It's P/N 8000074, $205.00. So far I am getting 15 degrees lower
temps for the same conditions, 205-208F max. Just what I needed. This
cooler is PMA'd for a/c with 235 HP Lycomings. Pacific was excellent to
deal with, also.
Mike Hilger
N207AM, 270 hours
Inver Grove Hgts, MN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
How does one decide between the firewall mounted cooler and the baffle
mounted position? I like the firewall, but can't justify why. I'll
need to decide soon, I think ....
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
>
> My RV-6 has an O-360-A1A with the Sensenich FP prop.
> I started out with Van's Niagara 7-row oil cooler and it was
> only okay. No margin for extreme conditions. It's mounted on
> the firewall fed by 3" SCAT. I swapped it out for an
> Aero-classic 9-row oil cooler from Pacific Oil Cooler. It's
> P/N 8000074, $205.00. So far I am getting 15 degrees lower
> temps for the same conditions, 205-208F max. Just what I
> needed. This cooler is PMA'd for a/c with 235 HP Lycomings.
> Pacific was excellent to deal with, also.
>
> Mike Hilger
> N207AM, 270 hours
> Inver Grove Hgts, MN
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: hot oil temps |
thanks guys for all the info on oil cooling.
vans told me to contact positech, which i did and they informed me the new
style cooler will cool 40 degrees cooler than the hot climate cooler vans
sells. they even will trade it for me no money exchange. but, i'll take
everyones recomendation and test the guage and sender 1st.
scott
tampa
taming oil temps
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pump problem |
08:11:07 AM
On the subject of venting the hot engine compartment, a friend of mine has
a boat engine compartment blower installed in his cockpit vent system. With
the prop stopped, it will push a nice breeze on both occupants. Turned off,
in flight, it does not hinder the ram air flow. It would be easy to rig one
of these to sit on the oil access door and pull the hot air out. You could
put a simple recepticle inside the cowl for power. Might make a difference,
would be innexpensive as well.
Eric
KBoatri144(at)aol.com@matronics.com on 07/17/2002 05:56:54 PM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel pump problem
In a message dated 7/17/02 4:01:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
SportAV8R(at)aol.com writes:
<< I've had the vapor lock problem at our nearby 3800 MSL airport on quick
turn
fuel stops and warm days... very cantankerous restart and trouble with
keeping the engine going once restarted... in my experience, double blast
tubes to the fuel pump have NOT alleviated the problem. My FWF fuel lines
are already fire-sleeved. I think the best prevention is to prop the oil
filler door open during refueling to provide some convective cooling of
the
enging compartment (or install one of those fancy drop-open doors in the
top
cowling that shuts itself under ram pressure in flight.) I must admit
that
I
never remember to do the oil door thing when refueling, and sometimes
regret
it.
Even avgas is subject to vapor lock under the wrong conditions.
-Bill B
RV-6A O-320 E2D 240 hrs >>
I think there is a market out there for a fan that can be inserted in the
oil
door for just the situation you describe. Provide a convienient plug in
for
it so it can run off the airplane's battery and use it to suck air through
the engine compartment on those hot days. On cooler days, it could stay at
home, or sit in the baggage compartment.
I've had the occasional hot start and/or vapor lock problem, and make a
practice of opening the oil door on hot days. It does help. On the other
hand, it is aggravating to climb in the airplane, strap in, and start the
engine, then realize the oil door is flapping open.
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Hanson <rv8tor(at)comcast.net> |
It just so happens that my local EAA chapter (868) has arranged for Jim Younkin
from Trutrak to visit us during our August meeting. If any of you can get to
the Kansas City (OJC) you're more than welcome to come and talk with him. He
is flying in his RV9 from Fayettville, AR. which has the system installed.
DETAILS:
EAA 868 August Chapter Meeting - Special guest speaker Jim Younkin - subject, trutrak autopilots (www.trutrakflightsystems.com)
Date: Saturday August 10th, 2002 - weather permitting (Jim is flying his RV9
from Fayettville, AR)
Time: 10:00 A.M.
Place: OJC - Johnson County Executive Airport - Kansas City Aviation Center
Hope some of you can make it. Let me know and if I can provide any help or more
info.
Kevin
rv8 - tail
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Michael Sices
Subject: RE: RV-List: TruTrak
As I understand it, the Trutrak as well as Navaid systems are functional and
currently flying without problem in a number of aircraft including RV's. Of
course one should know what one is buying (at least a little understanding
of the technology) and be willing to accept its limitations (STEC, Navaid,
Century all have different problems). The only question then is ... does
the thing really work (and how well) in real world flight conditions.
Unlike most EFIS systems, if Trutrak goes out or becomes less stable because
of loss of GPS or some other failure, the loss is not an emergency. Just
fly the airplane yourself. If the autopilot is that important to safe
flight for you, you might plan an IFR GPS in your panel (you can now get
KLN89 and 90s on Ebay for a little over $1000). In this instance, the GPS
will, at least, alert you to loss of signal. You are then free to turn the
GPS and/or autopilot off and use other navigation ... VOR/ILS. Its not as
thought the Trutrak will go berserk. You will still have a wing leveler and
alt hold if so equipped.
Mike Sices
RV8 Kenosha, WI
Finishing
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Sam Buchanan
Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak
Ollie, the DigiTrak does indeed need GPS for functionality. The GPS is
what tells the DigiTrak where it is in relationship to the heading you
have punched into the unit. The DigiTrak does not fly a GPS ground track
in the same sense as the Navaid.
With the Navaid, you can punch "Go To" on your GPS (if it is slaved to
the Navaid) and it will follow the ground track to the waypoint.
With the DigiTrak, you punch in a heading (which may or may not be
precisely to your waypoint). The unit then uses GPS to maintain the
heading you have selected. You will need to buy a GPS such as the very
good Garmin GPS-35 if you plan to install the DigiTrak.
If GPS is lost, the unit uses an internal magnetometer that "sorta"
follows the heading (with decreased precision due to errors introduced
by roll and pitch), and you lose the DG display on the unit.
The Navaid and the Digitrak process info in very different ways. The
Navaid is admittedly "old tech" but is based on a mechanical gyro and
input from a GPS for tracking or heading info. The Digitrak depends on
GPS for functionality and tracks a heading, not a GPS route. It is also
based on new solid state sensors (magnetometer and gyro) similar (but
less $$$$) to what is found in the new EFIS type stuff.
As I stated before in regard to the Blue Mtn/Dynon/etc instruments, this
is new stuff, and has very little field history. Just keep that in mind
before biting off a big chew......
This is another a case where a great deal of homework needs to be
conducted before cutting holes in your panel. The electronically
challenged builder is possibly going to be bewildered by the new stuff
unless a lot of research if done.
Sam Buchanan
======================
Ollie Washburn wrote:
>
>
> An autopilot does not need gps to work,it' only for tracking.The NAV-AID
> works same way.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "gert" <gert(at)execpc.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak
>
> >
> > Hmmm, a quick look at your website does not reveal the need for a
> > functional GPS for your AutoPilots to be functional. Am I wrong and
> > missed it somehow ??
> >
> > What if all I have is a handheld GPS ??
> >
> > Is this an ommision ?? Sounds like a big one to me......be nice if that
> > was mentioned, at least in the FAQ page !!
> >
> > What happens if the GPS cannot lock on to the satelites, your AutoPilot
> > becomes obsolete, non-functional or does the build-in solid state gyro's
> > keep the plane right side up and flying in about the correct way ??
> > does your "not just a wing leveler" become "just a wing leveler" ??
> >
> > Don't get me wrong, I am (or was) planning on installing your autopilot,
> > I really like your system, but it having to rely on an outside source,
> > which might not always be available, seems very scary and will make me
> > rethink my strategy.
> >
> > Does this also hold true for your new DigiTrack system, it does not
> > function correctly WITHOUT a GPS signal and to buy the DigiTrack system
> > I would also have to buy a GPS, either from you or somebody else which
> > would effectively raise the the prise as advertised from $1495 to 1495
> > plus 175 or about $1670.
> >
> > Or, does the advertised OSH special price of $1495 include the garmin
> > to make a fully functional wingleveler, comparable to the NavAid, which
> > does not need anything auxiliary but does come with the GPS tracking
> > option as an add-on.
> >
> > Gert
> >
> > TruTrak Flight Systems wrote:
> >
>
> > >
> > > The TruTrak does not have a built in GPS, the GPS steering is an add
on
> > > that gives the user the ability to couple to a GPS that provides GPS
> > > steering, for example the Garmin 430 or the Apollo GX 60. You do need
a
> > > GPS for the system, we do sell a Garmin 35, which is an antenna, and
> > > receiver in one package for $175.00. This would get you all of the
> > > functionality needed for the Autopilot to function.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Hanson <rv8tor(at)comcast.net> |
By the way, Jim's bio can be read here:
http://www.trutrakflightsystems.com/aboutus.html
Kevin
-----Original Message-----
From: Kevin Hanson [mailto:rv8tor(at)comcast.net]
Subject: RE: RV-List: TruTrak
It just so happens that my local EAA chapter (868) has arranged for Jim Younkin
from Trutrak to visit us during our August meeting. If any of you can get to
the Kansas City (OJC) you're more than welcome to come and talk with him. He
is flying in his RV9 from Fayettville, AR. which has the system installed.
DETAILS:
EAA 868 August Chapter Meeting - Special guest speaker Jim Younkin - subject, trutrak autopilots (www.trutrakflightsystems.com)
Date: Saturday August 10th, 2002 - weather permitting (Jim is flying his RV9
from Fayettville, AR)
Time: 10:00 A.M.
Place: OJC - Johnson County Executive Airport - Kansas City Aviation Center
Hope some of you can make it. Let me know and if I can provide any help or more
info.
Kevin
rv8 - tail
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Michael Sices
Subject: RE: RV-List: TruTrak
As I understand it, the Trutrak as well as Navaid systems are functional and
currently flying without problem in a number of aircraft including RV's. Of
course one should know what one is buying (at least a little understanding
of the technology) and be willing to accept its limitations (STEC, Navaid,
Century all have different problems). The only question then is ... does
the thing really work (and how well) in real world flight conditions.
Unlike most EFIS systems, if Trutrak goes out or becomes less stable because
of loss of GPS or some other failure, the loss is not an emergency. Just
fly the airplane yourself. If the autopilot is that important to safe
flight for you, you might plan an IFR GPS in your panel (you can now get
KLN89 and 90s on Ebay for a little over $1000). In this instance, the GPS
will, at least, alert you to loss of signal. You are then free to turn the
GPS and/or autopilot off and use other navigation ... VOR/ILS. Its not as
thought the Trutrak will go berserk. You will still have a wing leveler and
alt hold if so equipped.
Mike Sices
RV8 Kenosha, WI
Finishing
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Sam Buchanan
Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak
Ollie, the DigiTrak does indeed need GPS for functionality. The GPS is
what tells the DigiTrak where it is in relationship to the heading you
have punched into the unit. The DigiTrak does not fly a GPS ground track
in the same sense as the Navaid.
With the Navaid, you can punch "Go To" on your GPS (if it is slaved to
the Navaid) and it will follow the ground track to the waypoint.
With the DigiTrak, you punch in a heading (which may or may not be
precisely to your waypoint). The unit then uses GPS to maintain the
heading you have selected. You will need to buy a GPS such as the very
good Garmin GPS-35 if you plan to install the DigiTrak.
If GPS is lost, the unit uses an internal magnetometer that "sorta"
follows the heading (with decreased precision due to errors introduced
by roll and pitch), and you lose the DG display on the unit.
The Navaid and the Digitrak process info in very different ways. The
Navaid is admittedly "old tech" but is based on a mechanical gyro and
input from a GPS for tracking or heading info. The Digitrak depends on
GPS for functionality and tracks a heading, not a GPS route. It is also
based on new solid state sensors (magnetometer and gyro) similar (but
less $$$$) to what is found in the new EFIS type stuff.
As I stated before in regard to the Blue Mtn/Dynon/etc instruments, this
is new stuff, and has very little field history. Just keep that in mind
before biting off a big chew......
This is another a case where a great deal of homework needs to be
conducted before cutting holes in your panel. The electronically
challenged builder is possibly going to be bewildered by the new stuff
unless a lot of research if done.
Sam Buchanan
======================
Ollie Washburn wrote:
>
>
> An autopilot does not need gps to work,it' only for tracking.The NAV-AID
> works same way.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "gert" <gert(at)execpc.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: TruTrak
>
> >
> > Hmmm, a quick look at your website does not reveal the need for a
> > functional GPS for your AutoPilots to be functional. Am I wrong and
> > missed it somehow ??
> >
> > What if all I have is a handheld GPS ??
> >
> > Is this an ommision ?? Sounds like a big one to me......be nice if that
> > was mentioned, at least in the FAQ page !!
> >
> > What happens if the GPS cannot lock on to the satelites, your AutoPilot
> > becomes obsolete, non-functional or does the build-in solid state gyro's
> > keep the plane right side up and flying in about the correct way ??
> > does your "not just a wing leveler" become "just a wing leveler" ??
> >
> > Don't get me wrong, I am (or was) planning on installing your autopilot,
> > I really like your system, but it having to rely on an outside source,
> > which might not always be available, seems very scary and will make me
> > rethink my strategy.
> >
> > Does this also hold true for your new DigiTrack system, it does not
> > function correctly WITHOUT a GPS signal and to buy the DigiTrack system
> > I would also have to buy a GPS, either from you or somebody else which
> > would effectively raise the the prise as advertised from $1495 to 1495
> > plus 175 or about $1670.
> >
> > Or, does the advertised OSH special price of $1495 include the garmin
> > to make a fully functional wingleveler, comparable to the NavAid, which
> > does not need anything auxiliary but does come with the GPS tracking
> > option as an add-on.
> >
> > Gert
> >
> > TruTrak Flight Systems wrote:
> >
>
> > >
> > > The TruTrak does not have a built in GPS, the GPS steering is an add
on
> > > that gives the user the ability to couple to a GPS that provides GPS
> > > steering, for example the Garmin 430 or the Apollo GX 60. You do need
a
> > > GPS for the system, we do sell a Garmin 35, which is an antenna, and
> > > receiver in one package for $175.00. This would get you all of the
> > > functionality needed for the Autopilot to function.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Odyssey battery heads up |
I didn't think they could still supply at this price, but I received
a PC625 Odyssey battery today from Battery Specialists, Greenville SC,
800.952.6462 for $73.95 and FREE shipping.
I thought I would pass on a heads up to those that may be about ready to
buy.
Barry Pote RV9a finish kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | P M Condon <pcondon(at)mitre.org> |
| Subject: | GARMIN-196 EFIS & Topo-Terrain Mapping & GPSMAP for 800 dollars |
http://www.garmin.com/specs/mapsource.pdf and
http://www.garmin.com/products/gpsmap196/index.html# are the links to
the 196 GPS. You can see the picture of the EFIS like display of flight
instruments at the URL I enclosed. Also, with the MAP software option
(Topology) you can have ground terrain as the background on the moving
map option. There are 4 or 5 map options available along with the
Topology option. For the plus side of 800 dollars, this unit seems
great. Check out the EFIS option and terrain mapping (ground height
depiction) option along with the regular options this unit has. One
nice feature is automatic flight logging option that will download your
route of flight, or keep in memory for later transfer to a log book.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Matthew Fairy" <matthew.fairy(at)panamtrading.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Odyssey battery heads up |
do you know if its the right part number for an RV 4 also?
Matthew Fairy
President
Pan American Worldwide Trading LTD.
www.panamtrading.com
125 Main Street Suite 360
Westport CT 06880
(P) 203-221-9026 (F) 203-221-9027
----- Original Message -----
From: "barry pote" <barrypote(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RV-List: Odyssey battery heads up
>
> I didn't think they could still supply at this price, but I received
> a PC625 Odyssey battery today from Battery Specialists, Greenville SC,
> 800.952.6462 for $73.95 and FREE shipping.
>
> I thought I would pass on a heads up to those that may be about ready to
> buy.
>
> Barry Pote RV9a finish kit
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Don McNamara <N8RV(at)gte.net> |
| Subject: | Oshkosh Meetings |
LAST OFFICIAL NOTICE:
I'm leaving for Oshkosh tomorrow, so this will serve as the last
official invitation for all RV-8 and RV-8A builders, pilots, interested
parties and gorgeous blondes to attend the informal gatherings in the
Theater in the Woods on Thursday and Sunday mornings. OK, you gorgeous
brunettes and redheads can come, too.
Thursday, July 25th, 9:00am
Sunday, July 28th, 9:00am
I had every intention of making a really big, garish sign announcing our
presence, but once again ran out of time. Heck, I can't even find the
"HELLO, MY NAME IS ..." nametags that I've used lo these many years.
I'll go out an buy some new ones today, but I may have to pass the hat.
Hope to see a whole bunch of new faces this year! And I suppose a few
of the older ones are unavoidable. : )
And, just in case anyone cares, I'm planning on camping in my usual
spot, somewhere in or near 38th Street in Camp Scholler, right behind
the First Aid building. That's intentional. I'll have a few extra
cigars (cheap ones if I don't know you or like you) and quite possibly
some libations. You'd be wise to bring your own if you're picky.
See you at Oshkosh!
--Don McNamara
N8RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill VonDane" <n8wv(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Odyssey battery heads up |
This is the same one I have in my -8A...
http://vondane.com/rv8a/finish/finish3.htm
-Bill VonDane
RV-8A 45 hrs
----Original Message Follows----
From: "Matthew Fairy" <matthew.fairy(at)panamtrading.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Odyssey battery heads up
Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 11:26:22 -0400
do you know if its the right part number for an RV 4 also?
Matthew Fairy
President
Pan American Worldwide Trading LTD.
www.panamtrading.com
125 Main Street Suite 360
Westport CT 06880
(P) 203-221-9026 (F) 203-221-9027
----- Original Message -----
From: "barry pote" <barrypote(at)comcast.net>
Subject: RV-List: Odyssey battery heads up
>
> I didn't think they could still supply at this price, but I received
> a PC625 Odyssey battery today from Battery Specialists, Greenville SC,
> 800.952.6462 for $73.95 and FREE shipping.
>
> I thought I would pass on a heads up to those that may be about ready to
> buy.
>
> Barry Pote RV9a finish kit
>
>
>
>
>
>
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Generator for sale. |
Carl, Bring it along, You may need it. Or Maybe I will need it. See you
up North. Wayne
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Phil Sisson <sisson(at)mcleodusa.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Odyssey battery heads up |
Also dont overlook the valve regulated, gas recombinant batteries for
motorcycles.
We took one that cost $59, was in srvice for a year on a Harley FXR, hooked
up jumpers and spun a mooney 10 times with mixture pulled to prevent starts.
We spun it approximately 15 seconds and stopped to let starter cool. Then
repeated it. At end of test the battery was showing no signs of weakening.
This is about a 15 or 16 AH maintenance free battery that weighs 14 lbs.
With the low drain aviaonics in use today, these batteries will do just fine
in experimental planes. My opinion. The main thing is to study the charge
requirements to prevent gassing...
barry pote wrote:
>
> I didn't think they could still supply at this price, but I received
> a PC625 Odyssey battery today from Battery Specialists, Greenville SC,
> 800.952.6462 for $73.95 and FREE shipping.
>
> I thought I would pass on a heads up to those that may be about ready to
> buy.
>
> Barry Pote RV9a finish kit
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Phil Sisson <sisson(at)mcleodusa.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Odyssey battery heads up |
Also dont overlook the valve regulated, gas recombinant batteries for
motorcycles.
We took one that cost $59, was in srvice for a year on a Harley FXR, hooked
up jumpers and spun a mooney 10 times with mixture pulled to prevent starts.
We spun it approximately 15 seconds and stopped to let starter cool. Then
repeated it. At end of test the battery was showing no signs of weakening.
This is about a 15 or 16 AH maintenance free battery that weighs 14 lbs.
With the low drain aviaonics in use today, these batteries will do just fine
in experimental planes. My opinion. The main thing is to study the charge
requirements to prevent gassing...
barry pote wrote:
>
> I didn't think they could still supply at this price, but I received
> a PC625 Odyssey battery today from Battery Specialists, Greenville SC,
> 800.952.6462 for $73.95 and FREE shipping.
>
> I thought I would pass on a heads up to those that may be about ready to
> buy.
>
> Barry Pote RV9a finish kit
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pat Perry" <pperryrv(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | RV-4 exhaust support |
Does anyone have any good descriptions or pictures of the support structure
for the exhaust on an RV-4?
Pat Perry
Dallas, PA
RV-4 N154PK Flies great!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "KostaLewis" <mikel(at)dimensional.com> |
| Subject: | RV-4 exhaust support |
>Does anyone have any good descriptions or pictures of the support
structure
>for the exhaust on an RV-4?
What kind of exhaust? Who made it?
Michael
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mitch Robbins" <robm(at)am2.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-4 exhaust support |
The simplest is a length of steel about 1/8" by 1" and about 12 " long.
Drill a hole in one end and bend about 1" at each end slightly so it looks
like an open "z" with a long center. One end bolts through an oil pan bolt
and the other end clamps to the exhaust. (crossover exhaust).
.----- Original Message -----
From: "Pat Perry" <pperryrv(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: RV-4 exhaust support
>
>
> Does anyone have any good descriptions or pictures of the support
structure
> for the exhaust on an RV-4?
>
>
> Pat Perry
> Dallas, PA
> RV-4 N154PK Flies great!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Schilling Karl <Karl.Schilling(at)ssfhs.org> |
| Subject: | Generator for sale. |
I just sold it on E-bay! See you there.
-----Original Message-----
From: CPS7185(at)aol.com [mailto:CPS7185(at)aol.com]
Subject: Re: RV-List: Generator for sale.
Carl, Bring it along, You may need it. Or Maybe I will need it. See you
up North. Wayne
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | More Blue Mountain feedback |
This message from Lancair appeared this morning on the Blue Mountain
Avionics forum. I am posting it here in order to add to the knowledge
base concerning my experiences with the EFIS/Lite.
Sam Buchanan (RV-6)
"The RV Journal" http://thervjournal.com
---------------
-------- Original Message -------- Subject: [LML] Blue Mountain EFIS
Testing
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 16:14:05 -0400
From: "Kirk Hammersmith"
I know a lot of builders out there are considering the Blue Mountain
EFIS-One because I continue to receive many questions and comments about
the system. In case you aren't aware, I committed to testing this
system over a year ago and report the results back to the list. Now OSH
2002 is upon us and I am sure many of you are wondering how the
"testing" is going, so I've decided to comment our reaction to the
inexpensive EFIS system, partly due to some of the comments we've read
on Greg Richters discussion board. He has led people to believe that
Lancair Avionics is currently flight testing the system and that we are
happy with it. We are not. We don't have a system. The (third) system
was returned to him some time ago. He also mentions that Aerotronics
has a complete system. I can't speak for them but I would be suprised
if they have had success with the Blue Mountain EFIS One and would be
suprised that a shop of Aerotronics' caliber would sell the system
without
testing it completely as well.
First, let me state that we have NOT sucessfully tested the EFIS One.
As with any new product on the market, problems are to be expected. I
will not go into the details of various equipment/software problems but
will say that we will NOT be supportting the Blue Mountain EFIS System
until we see significant improvements, sucessfully flight test the
system, and develope a track record of reliable operation. I can't
think of one reputable shop out there that would recommend ANY new
product at any cost (especially EFIS) without first testing the
equipment or having some reasonable assurance that it is designed to
work properly in an aircraft environment (certified equipment for
instance).
Seeing this system "work" on the bench or in some sort of display is
one thing. Putting the system in a Lancair, installed as prescribed in
Blue Mountains installation instructions, testing functionality at slow,
cruise, and high speeds, at altitude, etc i
s another. For example,
right out of Blue Mountains "hard specs" (www.bluemountainavionics.com),
the thermal operating range is 0-60 degrees C. So then, what can you
expect at altitude in a IV when things get chilly at 24,000' ?? What
about HERF testing?? What effect does airframe vibration and harmonic
frequencies have on the computer-style dvd drive that you are supposed
to mount? The install instructions say "Mounting the DVD drive is a
matter of taste. Keep it within four (4) feet of the processor, and put
it wherever you like. On the panel looks good, or in a bulkhead nearby"
These are the types of things we test before selling to our customers.
Safety and reliability is paramount with any product we offer.
According to Greg Richter at Blue Mountain, Gulf Coast Avionics is
selling his system like hotcakes. Although I haven't talked with them,
I suspect they haven't fully tested t
he system. I don't think ANYONE
has or Greg would have put me in touch with the results. I haven't even
seen the system fly in a demo environment. Every EFIS manufacturer I've
dealt with has put me in an aircraft to show off their system except
Blue Mountain.
So here is where things are: Greg Richter promised to deliver a new
and improved unit on July 5th for me to install in our company aircraft
which I was to fly for evaluation to OSH. It didn't show up. Greg was
on the West Coast the following week and didn't bring it then either. I
spoke with him yesterday (7/16) and he admitted it wasn't ready to ship
on the 5th but promised he would hand-deliver the test unit to me at
OSH.
Since we are trying to evaluate this product as thouroughly as
possible, I've also been in conversation with Bob Nuckolls of Aero
Electric Connection (www.aeroelectric.com). Bob does failure analysis
and product e
valuations for Ratheon and is a technical writer for
various magazines. He is interested in doing a technical evaluation
with Blue Mountain and will be contacting Greg after OSH. If any of you
are interested in contacting Bob, his email address is
nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com He also does aircraft wiring/design
seminars for experimental aircraft builders which has been invaluable to
some of the builders out there.
If anyone has any positive or negative experience with the Blue
Mountain system, I would love to talk with you about it. I'm interested
in talking with those that have purchased, taken delivery and installed
the Blue Mountain system. Of course, we'll be at OSH under the Lancair
tent and displaying some new equipment we are currently testing as well
as the time proven, tested and rock-solid Chelton Flight Systems EFIS.
Fly Safe!
Kirk Hammersmith
Lancair Avionics, Inc.
www.lancairavionics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stephen J. Soule" <SSoule(at)pfclaw.com> |
Scott,
Who did you talk to at Positech about this new oil cooler and the exchange
at no cost?
Steve Soule
N227RV RV-6A flying ....
-----Original Message-----
thanks guys for all the info on oil cooling.
vans told me to contact positech, which i did and they informed me the new
style cooler will cool 40 degrees cooler than the hot climate cooler vans
sells. they even will trade it for me no money exchange. but, i'll take
everyones recomendation and test the guage and sender 1st.
scott
tampa
taming oil temps
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrownScottA(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Rocket for sale or trade |
F-1 ROCKET KIT, ENGINE, PROP,INSTRUMENTS FOR SALE I have for sale an F-1
Rocket kit, a completely overhauled IO-540 C4B5 engine (overhauled by Don
George), and a new Hartzell 3-bladed prop. Instrumentation includes but not
limited to: new Garmin 250XL radio, fuel guages, fuel pressure, EI
volt/ammeter, manifold pressure guage, and more. Also included is a NavAid
autopilot unit. Unit servo is installed and attached to the torgue tube.
Wings are closed up and I have position and strobe lights as well as a tail
white light. Also included is a F-1 Rocket tailgroup. Skeleton is built,
ready to be skinned. This F-1 Rocket kit is extremely far along in its build.
Electrical sub-panel complete including all circuit breakers installed.
Interior Fuselage is complete. Fuel system complete with the exception of the
installation of the electric fuel pump (included). Engine has the airflow
performance kit, starter, alternator, Rose electronic ignition with the ring
gear for high powered engines. Master solenoid, starter solenoid are
included. Almost everything needed to complete rocket is included. Rocket
could be flying in approx 5 months with some effort. Will consider the first
$79k. Please no tire kickers. Call 561-848-3418 or cell 561-373-3797. Will
also consider a trade for a flying RV6 or RV4. Must have 180hp and c/s prop.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: More Blue Mountain feedback |
Sounds like they need another couple of years to get things ironed out
before it is a proven product. I wouldn't jump the gun and by one, that's
for sure. Good thing the -10 is at least a year away. Maybe by then Blue
Mountain will have everything worked out, and there can be sufficient
customer installations. Even then, I may still go with the 'ole proven
vacuum system that has worked for the last 75 years.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Sam Buchanan" <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
Subject: RV-List: More Blue Mountain feedback
>
> This message from Lancair appeared this morning on the Blue Mountain
> Avionics forum. I am posting it here in order to add to the knowledge
> base concerning my experiences with the EFIS/Lite.
>
> Sam Buchanan (RV-6)
> "The RV Journal" http://thervjournal.com
>
>
> ---------------
>
> -------- Original Message -------- Subject: [LML] Blue Mountain EFIS
> Testing
> Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 16:14:05 -0400
> From: "Kirk Hammersmith"
> To: (Lancair Mailing List)
>
>
> I know a lot of builders out there are considering the Blue Mountain
> EFIS-One because I continue to receive many questions and comments about
> the system. In case you aren't aware, I committed to testing this
> system over a year ago and report the results back to the list. Now OSH
> 2002 is upon us and I am sure many of you are wondering how the
> "testing" is going, so I've decided to comment our reaction to the
> inexpensive EFIS system, partly due to some of the comments we've read
> on Greg Richters discussion board. He has led people to believe that
> Lancair Avionics is currently flight testing the system and that we are
> happy with it. We are not. We don't have a system. The (third) system
> was returned to him some time ago. He also mentions that Aerotronics
> has a complete system. I can't speak for them but I would be suprised
> if they have had success with the Blue Mountain EFIS One and would be
> suprised that a shop of Aerotronics' caliber would sell the system
> without
> testing it completely as well.
>
> First, let me state that we have NOT sucessfully tested the EFIS One.
> As with any new product on the market, problems are to be expected. I
> will not go into the details of various equipment/software problems but
> will say that we will NOT be supportting the Blue Mountain EFIS System
> until we see significant improvements, sucessfully flight test the
> system, and develope a track record of reliable operation. I can't
> think of one reputable shop out there that would recommend ANY new
> product at any cost (especially EFIS) without first testing the
> equipment or having some reasonable assurance that it is designed to
> work properly in an aircraft environment (certified equipment for
> instance).
>
> Seeing this system "work" on the bench or in some sort of display is
> one thing. Putting the system in a Lancair, installed as prescribed in
> Blue Mountains installation instructions, testing functionality at slow,
> cruise, and high speeds, at altitude, etc i
> s another. For example,
> right out of Blue Mountains "hard specs" (www.bluemountainavionics.com),
> the thermal operating range is 0-60 degrees C. So then, what can you
> expect at altitude in a IV when things get chilly at 24,000' ?? What
> about HERF testing?? What effect does airframe vibration and harmonic
> frequencies have on the computer-style dvd drive that you are supposed
> to mount? The install instructions say "Mounting the DVD drive is a
> matter of taste. Keep it within four (4) feet of the processor, and put
> it wherever you like. On the panel looks good, or in a bulkhead nearby"
> These are the types of things we test before selling to our customers.
> Safety and reliability is paramount with any product we offer.
> According to Greg Richter at Blue Mountain, Gulf Coast Avionics is
> selling his system like hotcakes. Although I haven't talked with them,
> I suspect they haven't fully tested t
> he system. I don't think ANYONE
> has or Greg would have put me in touch with the results. I haven't even
> seen the system fly in a demo environment. Every EFIS manufacturer I've
> dealt with has put me in an aircraft to show off their system except
> Blue Mountain.
>
> So here is where things are: Greg Richter promised to deliver a new
> and improved unit on July 5th for me to install in our company aircraft
> which I was to fly for evaluation to OSH. It didn't show up. Greg was
> on the West Coast the following week and didn't bring it then either. I
> spoke with him yesterday (7/16) and he admitted it wasn't ready to ship
> on the 5th but promised he would hand-deliver the test unit to me at
> OSH.
>
> Since we are trying to evaluate this product as thouroughly as
> possible, I've also been in conversation with Bob Nuckolls of Aero
> Electric Connection (www.aeroelectric.com). Bob does failure analysis
> and product e
> valuations for Ratheon and is a technical writer for
> various magazines. He is interested in doing a technical evaluation
> with Blue Mountain and will be contacting Greg after OSH. If any of you
> are interested in contacting Bob, his email address is
> nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com He also does aircraft wiring/design
> seminars for experimental aircraft builders which has been invaluable to
> some of the builders out there.
>
> If anyone has any positive or negative experience with the Blue
> Mountain system, I would love to talk with you about it. I'm interested
> in talking with those that have purchased, taken delivery and installed
> the Blue Mountain system. Of course, we'll be at OSH under the Lancair
> tent and displaying some new equipment we are currently testing as well
> as the time proven, tested and rock-solid Chelton Flight Systems EFIS.
>
>
> Fly Safe!
>
> Kirk Hammersmith
> Lancair Avionics, Inc.
> www.lancairavionics.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-List:positech oil cooler |
hi steve
the guys name was bryan, i have his extension # at the office and will post
it in the am. by the way, the even exchange program has to be the right
sequence of serial #'s. not all apply.
scott
tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gordon or Marge Comfort" <gcomfo(at)tc3net.com> |
| Subject: | Re: rv-4 engine installation pictures |
: Re: RV-List: rv-4 engine installation pictures
>
> Correction, I should be there Wed through Sun. Art
>
> Arthur Glaser wrote:
>
> >
> > I plan to be at Oshkosh on Wed. Is there anyone who will be there with
> > a 4 and fixed pitch prop that would be willing to pull their cowl and
> > allow me to photograph the engine and cooler installation?
Art: Talk to me when you can. I expect to be there during some of the time
you describe and if the gods smile, perhaps the cowl can be removed from
363GC. Understand, I do not have a typical installation. My induction
system is altogether different and my fuel system has the pumps plumbed in
parallel, not in series. The oil cooler is mounted on the rear baffle on
the left side. I also have a few more fastenings than some others do. My
ship is polished metal with silver paint on the fiberglass parts.
Gordon Comfort
N363GC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Taylor" <david(at)hom.net> |
I am anxious to build an RV-7 and I hope to start in the next 3 to 6
months. My question is what are the minimum tools I need get started
building the tail kit? As I am just getting started I don't have many of
the tools I'm sure that is necessary for building and have to buy a
little at a time. I'm looking for the bare necessities to get started.
I'll buy the nice to have items later as I can afford them. So far I
have bought an air compressor and rivet gun with #3 and #4 straight and
offset rivet sets as well as a flush rivet set. What other items are
absolutely must haves to get started?
Thanks,
-David Taylor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tommy Walker" <twsurveyor(at)msn.com> |
David, I understand your concern about sinking a lot of money in aircraft tools
on the front end! My advise is to save up and buy your tools first before you
start you tail kit. The "nice to have" stuff will save you from making a mess
of your tail kit. There are some tools you use every day and there are some that
may only get used a few times during construction of the whole plane, but
you got to have em if you want to build a quality RV.
Look at page 3 of the Avery catalog. Do yourself and your plane a favor and "bite
the bullet"! These are the basic hand tools you'll need. You'll
probably spend another two or three hundred bucks along the way for the "really,
really nice to have" stuff. As far as big tools I'd advise you to get a drill
press, band saw, an air powered die grinder and a quality spray gun.
Hope this helps and doesn't discourage you too much. This is just one man's opinion,
I'm sure others will jump on this thread too.
Tommy Walker
6A Finishing
Ridgetop, TN
----- Original Message -----
From: David Taylor
Subject: RV-List: Tools
I am anxious to build an RV-7 and I hope to start in the next 3 to 6
months. My question is what are the minimum tools I need get started
building the tail kit? As I am just getting started I don't have many of
the tools I'm sure that is necessary for building and have to buy a
little at a time. I'm looking for the bare necessities to get started.
I'll buy the nice to have items later as I can afford them. So far I
have bought an air compressor and rivet gun with #3 and #4 straight and
offset rivet sets as well as a flush rivet set. What other items are
absolutely must haves to get started?
Thanks,
-David Taylor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
I agree with Tommy. Get the basic tool set from Avery (less the rivet gun
you already have) and you will have enough tools to build your tail kit. If
that is too much to get you going consider the following:
air drill
plenty of #30, #40 bits
cut off wheels (The good ones from Van's or Cleaveland)(use them in your
drill if you don't have a die grinder)
The miniature bucking bar that Cleveland sells. I used this bar on 90% of
my airplane.
Sharpies
Good quality steel rulers, 6", 24"
Debur tool
Scotchbrite wheel on bench grinder or small wheel on die grinder
100 of each cleco
cleco pliers
countersink tool
dimple dies
This the bare minimum that I would start with. Come to think of it, the
tool packages from Cleveland or Avery probably will contain most of these.
You might just go ahead and get the kit, come to think of it. Then you will
add tools from there. Building an airplane is not a cheap endeavor. Even
Bill Vondane had to shell out some cash, and he's probably got the least
expensive RV-8 out there. (That's a compliment, Bill, don't even think
about a flame!)
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Taylor" <david(at)hom.net>
Subject: RV-List: Tools
>
> I am anxious to build an RV-7 and I hope to start in the next 3 to 6
> months. My question is what are the minimum tools I need get started
> building the tail kit? As I am just getting started I don't have many of
> the tools I'm sure that is necessary for building and have to buy a
> little at a time. I'm looking for the bare necessities to get started.
> I'll buy the nice to have items later as I can afford them. So far I
> have bought an air compressor and rivet gun with #3 and #4 straight and
> offset rivet sets as well as a flush rivet set. What other items are
> absolutely must haves to get started?
>
> Thanks,
>
> -David Taylor
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
Dave,
I too am a first time RV 7 builder, currently working on the fuselage.
Do yourself a favor and buy the RV tool kit from Avery tools, it will save
you money in the long run. Their kit is well thought out. You'll use every
tool in the kit on the emp and want more. Avery has been excellent in
service and answering questions (including stupid ones from new builders like
me)
I'm not connected to Avery tools in any way except as a more than satisfied
customer.
The Avery web site is Avery Tools -
Quality Aircraft Tools or http://www.averytools.com
John McDonnell (RV7A fuselage)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
Here Here!,to the recent tool lists,
Please add this electric power tool.
Although this single electric tool suggestion might cost a bit, do get a
small belt sander I paid $105.00 Canadian dollars (Metric Bucks) :-)!,
I bought a bench top Delta 1" X 30" belt sander with a 5" disk. I bought it
after having built all of the empennage and much of the wings. within hours
of buying the belt grinder I was, and still am convinced that it is one of
the most valuable additions to my shop.
When I took the sander out of the box and set it up. I thought that it's
look and the cheap price I paid for might reflect it's quality and it's
usefulness. Now after 3 or 4 years the only reason I would take twice what I
paid for it would be that I could then go out and buy two more of the little
beauties.
The guys who designed this low price range tool did not put any extra
strength or real high grade materials into this unit.
With a just less than brutish approach in using it, I'm sure it will become
one of the last tools that you will be willing to loan out.
I rarely use the disk sander but that 1" wide belt gets lots of exercise.
Happy learning,
Jim
>
> I agree with Tommy. Get the basic tool set from Avery (less the rivet gun
> you already have) and you will have enough tools to build your tail kit.
If
> that is too much to get you going consider the following:
>
> air drill
> plenty of #30, #40 bits
> cut off wheels (The good ones from Van's or Cleaveland)(use them in your
> drill if you don't have a die grinder)
> The miniature bucking bar that Cleveland sells. I used this bar on 90% of
> my airplane.
> Sharpies
> Good quality steel rulers, 6", 24"
> Debur tool
> Scotchbrite wheel on bench grinder or small wheel on die grinder
> 100 of each cleco
> cleco pliers
> countersink tool
> dimple dies
>
> This the bare minimum that I would start with. Come to think of it, the
> tool packages from Cleveland or Avery probably will contain most of these.
> You might just go ahead and get the kit, come to think of it. Then you
will
> add tools from there. Building an airplane is not a cheap endeavor. Even
> Bill Vondane had to shell out some cash, and he's probably got the least
> expensive RV-8 out there. (That's a compliment, Bill, don't even think
> about a flame!)
> >
> > I am anxious to build an RV-7 and I hope to start in the next 3 to 6
> > months. My question is what are the minimum tools I need get started
> > building the tail kit? As I am just getting started I don't have many of
> > the tools I'm sure that is necessary for building and have to buy a
> > little at a time. I'm looking for the bare necessities to get started.
> > I'll buy the nice to have items later as I can afford them. So far I
> > have bought an air compressor and rivet gun with #3 and #4 straight and
> > offset rivet sets as well as a flush rivet set. What other items are
> > absolutely must haves to get started?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > -David Taylor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "BRUNO" <rv4(at)videotron.ca> |
| Subject: | RV-4 Rear Seat Cooling |
Hello listers
Tonight for the second time I had my most valuable co-pilot in
the rear seat of my RV-4 ( My wife ) Hey I had to say that, she's
watching.To make a long story short the flight finished like the first one,
10 minutes in the air and a hurried arrival, my prefered co-pilot was not
longer up to the task.She complainted of being to hot in the back so I'm
wondering how you guys are managing the rear seat heat problems on your
RV-4s.
I saw a picture of an RV-4 with a vent installed "like the
RV-8"in front of the rear control column.My question is:How can you route a
scat tube to the rear seat of an RV-4 as there isn't a lot of room back
there.
Thank you ladies and gentlemen for your imputs.
Bruno Dionne
C-GDBH RV-4
rv4(at)videotron.ca
P.S# Pictures will be appreciated.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
Dave,
I'd also get a few #31 and #41 drill bits with the punch set so you can
drill out rivets (probably won't be many, but when you need it you need it.
Re: the steel rulers the 12" should be one with a centering scale on one
side so you can measure equally.
Also Cleaveland's edge roller (comes attached to vice grip frame, to provide
a clean edge when riveting sheet Alu pieces. Also when you are ready for
installing nut plates: Avery's nutplate tool will save you much grief and
give you a quality means of drilling nutplate tools. You'll also find a
rivet fan invaluable.
While you can get by without a pnumatic squeezer w/ micro adjuster. It will
save you many hours and more importantly give you consistently professional
quality work.
With all that said - If your budget is tight and you standards are high
(which they should be since your tail is in the seat). Talk to members of
your local EAA chapter they may have some of these tools (certainly with the
squeezer they will probably have infrequestly used yokes that you may be
able to borrow).
Good Building,
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (80hrs)- Westerly airport
>From: "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Tools
>Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 19:13:08 -0700
>
>
>I agree with Tommy. Get the basic tool set from Avery (less the rivet gun
>you already have) and you will have enough tools to build your tail kit.
>If
>that is too much to get you going consider the following:
>
>air drill
>plenty of #30, #40 bits
>cut off wheels (The good ones from Van's or Cleaveland)(use them in your
>drill if you don't have a die grinder)
>The miniature bucking bar that Cleveland sells. I used this bar on 90% of
>my airplane.
>Sharpies
>Good quality steel rulers, 6", 24"
>Debur tool
>Scotchbrite wheel on bench grinder or small wheel on die grinder
>100 of each cleco
>cleco pliers
>countersink tool
>dimple dies
>
>This the bare minimum that I would start with. Come to think of it, the
>tool packages from Cleveland or Avery probably will contain most of these.
>You might just go ahead and get the kit, come to think of it. Then you
>will
>add tools from there. Building an airplane is not a cheap endeavor. Even
>Bill Vondane had to shell out some cash, and he's probably got the least
>expensive RV-8 out there. (That's a compliment, Bill, don't even think
>about a flame!)
>
>Paul Besing
>RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
>http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
>Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
>http://www.kitlog.com
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "David Taylor" <david(at)hom.net>
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: Tools
>
>
> >
> > I am anxious to build an RV-7 and I hope to start in the next 3 to 6
> > months. My question is what are the minimum tools I need get started
> > building the tail kit? As I am just getting started I don't have many of
> > the tools I'm sure that is necessary for building and have to buy a
> > little at a time. I'm looking for the bare necessities to get started.
> > I'll buy the nice to have items later as I can afford them. So far I
> > have bought an air compressor and rivet gun with #3 and #4 straight and
> > offset rivet sets as well as a flush rivet set. What other items are
> > absolutely must haves to get started?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > -David Taylor
> >
> >
>
>
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
DAve,
Forgot two items:
1) Avery will give his kit discount (10%) if your mix and match order is
over $700 (i think).
2) a super valuable tool is the small pnumatic angle grinder (Home Depot -
$50). This together with the 3M rotolock kit (Home Depot - $9) and fine -
med - course rotolocks (NAPA - $1 ea) allows you to debur the edges on ALU
part in three quick passes.
Good Building,
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A
>From: "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Tools
>Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:47:22 -0700
>
>
>Here Here!,to the recent tool lists,
>
>Please add this electric power tool.
>
>Although this single electric tool suggestion might cost a bit, do get a
>small belt sander I paid $105.00 Canadian dollars (Metric Bucks) :-)!,
>I bought a bench top Delta 1" X 30" belt sander with a 5" disk. I bought it
>after having built all of the empennage and much of the wings. within hours
>of buying the belt grinder I was, and still am convinced that it is one of
>the most valuable additions to my shop.
>When I took the sander out of the box and set it up. I thought that it's
>look and the cheap price I paid for might reflect it's quality and it's
>usefulness. Now after 3 or 4 years the only reason I would take twice what
>I
>paid for it would be that I could then go out and buy two more of the
>little
>beauties.
>The guys who designed this low price range tool did not put any extra
>strength or real high grade materials into this unit.
>With a just less than brutish approach in using it, I'm sure it will become
>one of the last tools that you will be willing to loan out.
>I rarely use the disk sander but that 1" wide belt gets lots of exercise.
>
>Happy learning,
>
>Jim
>
>
> >
> > I agree with Tommy. Get the basic tool set from Avery (less the rivet
>gun
> > you already have) and you will have enough tools to build your tail kit.
>If
> > that is too much to get you going consider the following:
> >
> > air drill
> > plenty of #30, #40 bits
> > cut off wheels (The good ones from Van's or Cleaveland)(use them in your
> > drill if you don't have a die grinder)
> > The miniature bucking bar that Cleveland sells. I used this bar on 90%
>of
> > my airplane.
> > Sharpies
> > Good quality steel rulers, 6", 24"
> > Debur tool
> > Scotchbrite wheel on bench grinder or small wheel on die grinder
> > 100 of each cleco
> > cleco pliers
> > countersink tool
> > dimple dies
> >
> > This the bare minimum that I would start with. Come to think of it, the
> > tool packages from Cleveland or Avery probably will contain most of
>these.
> > You might just go ahead and get the kit, come to think of it. Then you
>will
> > add tools from there. Building an airplane is not a cheap endeavor.
>Even
> > Bill Vondane had to shell out some cash, and he's probably got the least
> > expensive RV-8 out there. (That's a compliment, Bill, don't even think
> > about a flame!)
> > >
> > > I am anxious to build an RV-7 and I hope to start in the next 3 to
>6
> > > months. My question is what are the minimum tools I need get started
> > > building the tail kit? As I am just getting started I don't have many
>of
> > > the tools I'm sure that is necessary for building and have to buy a
> > > little at a time. I'm looking for the bare necessities to get started.
> > > I'll buy the nice to have items later as I can afford them. So far I
> > > have bought an air compressor and rivet gun with #3 and #4 straight
>and
> > > offset rivet sets as well as a flush rivet set. What other items are
> > > absolutely must haves to get started?
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > > -David Taylor
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | P M Condon <pcondon(at)mitre.org> |
| Subject: | RV-4 Rear Seat Cooling - vent location idea |
I installed 2 NACA scoops, one under EACH wing (about midway back from
the leading edge and about 2 or 3 ribs out toward the tip from the
fuse.) The scat tube ran from the NACA scoop, thru the lightning holes
in the rib and thru the fuse skin to a eyeball vent I placed below the
floor skins (actually, I do not have floor skins there at all) This
setup is great in that BOTH the pilot and copilot in the RV-4 can reach
and adjust the eyeball vents. I placed my vents below the floor skin
line & within the "wing-shape" thickness.....you have about 4 inches of
"thickness" that is actually the thickness of the wing as the wing bumps
up against the fuse. I placed the vents about 2 inches aft of where a
line would be if you followed your front pilot seat BACK-section all the
way down to just below the floor skin (just aft of where your elbos
would be when flying the RV-4 and drop a visual line down (from your
elbos) to just below the floor skin.....this location is where the vents
are) Pilot and passanger can reach BOTH vents for adjustment while
strapped in....pilot reaches down to grasp the vents and the passanger
leans forward and reaches down to about where the heels of the feet
would be and adjusts the flow rate and direction of the air streem.
I find that the best air flow is directly up for both vents. The air
circulates up and around the canopy and both occupants get a steady flow
of fresh air. Seeya
Subject: RV-List: RV-4 Rear Seat Cooling
Hello listers
Tonight for the second time I had my most valuable co-pilot
in
the rear seat of my RV-4 ( My wife ) Hey I had to say that, she's
watching.To make a long story short the flight finished like the first
one,
10 minutes in the air and a hurried arrival, my prefered co-pilot was
not
longer up to the task.She complainted of being to hot in the back so I'm
wondering how you guys are managing the rear seat heat problems on your
RV-4s.
I saw a picture of an RV-4 with a vent installed "like the
RV-8"in front of the rear control column.My question is:How can you
route a
scat tube to the rear seat of an RV-4 as there isn't a lot of room back
there.
Thank you ladies and gentlemen for your imputs.
Bruno Dionne
C-GDBH RV-4
rv4(at)videotron.ca
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Collins <bcollins747_1999(at)yahoo.com> |
I know there's a little gathering of RV7 fans near the
TOTW on Friday morning at 8. I hope to get there but
there's an EAA newsletter editor workshop at 8:30.
Some of you may have seen this posted on the VAF list
but I'm also inviting RV7 fans to stop by the campsite
near the West End store at 5pm on Friday for a little
pot luck.
Now, for the record, that's as organized as I've
gotten. Bring a chair, bring conversation, bring
whatever you want to drink. We'll try to fire up the
stove.
You'll find us - hopefully - in the field between the
West End store and the showers on Stits Ave. We're
usually about 3 "blocks" in from Stits...halfway
between those two "waypoints."
You'll find a Eureka tan and green tent with a blue
and white striped awning set up in front...and a tiki
torch burning.
Lots of people may show up. Nobody may show up. But
you're invited to stop by and rest from a busy day.
Friday at 5pm.
Bob Collins
St. Paul
http://autos.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | More Blue Mountain feedback |
| From: | "Bob Japundza" <Bob.Japundza(at)realmed.com> |
What bothers me is these guys are trying to sell these products before they are
ready for the market. That's a big no-no, IMO. Because if it don't work and
ain't ready yet, customers will just get ticked off and will give them a bad
rap. And in the aviation world a bad reputation tends to stick, whether its merited
or not.
Bob Japundza
RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying 340 hours
F1 QB under const.
> From: Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
> Subject: RV-List: More Blue Mountain feedback
>
>
> This message from Lancair appeared this morning on the Blue Mountain
> Avionics forum. I am posting it here in order to add to the knowledge
> base concerning my experiences with the EFIS/Lite.
>
> Sam Buchanan (RV-6)
> "The RV Journal" http://thervjournal.com
>
>
> ---------------
>
> -------- Original Message -------- Subject: [LML] Blue Mountain EFIS
> Testing
> From: "Kirk Hammersmith"
>
>
> I know a lot of builders out there are considering the Blue Mountain
> EFIS-One because I continue to receive many questions and
> comments about
> the system. In case you aren't aware, I committed to testing this
> system over a year ago and report the results back to the
> list. Now OSH
> 2002 is upon us and I am sure many of you are wondering how the
> "testing" is going, so I've decided to comment our reaction to the
> inexpensive EFIS system, partly due to some of the comments
> we've read
> on Greg Richters discussion board. He has led people to believe that
> Lancair Avionics is currently flight testing the system and
> that we are
> happy with it. We are not. We don't have a system. The (third) system
> was returned to him some time ago. He also mentions that Aerotronics
> has a complete system. I can't speak for them but I would be suprised
> if they have had success with the Blue Mountain EFIS One and would be
> suprised that a shop of Aerotronics' caliber would sell the system
> without
> testing it completely as well.
>
> First, let me state that we have NOT sucessfully tested the EFIS One.
> As with any new product on the market, problems are to be expected. I
> will not go into the details of various equipment/software
> problems but
> will say that we will NOT be supportting the Blue Mountain
> EFIS System
> until we see significant improvements, sucessfully flight test the
> system, and develope a track record of reliable operation. I can't
> think of one reputable shop out there that would recommend ANY new
> product at any cost (especially EFIS) without first testing the
> equipment or having some reasonable assurance that it is designed to
> work properly in an aircraft environment (certified equipment for
> instance).
>
> Seeing this system "work" on the bench or in some sort of display is
> one thing. Putting the system in a Lancair, installed as
> prescribed in
> Blue Mountains installation instructions, testing
> functionality at slow,
> cruise, and high speeds, at altitude, etc i
> s another. For example,
> right out of Blue Mountains "hard specs"
> (www.bluemountainavionics.com),
> the thermal operating range is 0-60 degrees C. So then, what can you
> expect at altitude in a IV when things get chilly at 24,000' ?? What
> about HERF testing?? What effect does airframe vibration and harmonic
> frequencies have on the computer-style dvd drive that you are
> supposed
> to mount? The install instructions say "Mounting the DVD drive is a
> matter of taste. Keep it within four (4) feet of the
> processor, and put
> it wherever you like. On the panel looks good, or in a
> bulkhead nearby"
> These are the types of things we test before selling to our
> customers.
> Safety and reliability is paramount with any product we offer.
> According to Greg Richter at Blue Mountain, Gulf Coast Avionics is
> selling his system like hotcakes. Although I haven't talked
> with them,
> I suspect they haven't fully tested t
> he system. I don't think ANYONE
> has or Greg would have put me in touch with the results. I
> haven't even
> seen the system fly in a demo environment. Every EFIS
> manufacturer I've
> dealt with has put me in an aircraft to show off their system except
> Blue Mountain.
>
> So here is where things are: Greg Richter promised to deliver a new
> and improved unit on July 5th for me to install in our
> company aircraft
> which I was to fly for evaluation to OSH. It didn't show up. Greg was
> on the West Coast the following week and didn't bring it then
> either. I
> spoke with him yesterday (7/16) and he admitted it wasn't
> ready to ship
> on the 5th but promised he would hand-deliver the test unit to me at
> OSH.
>
> Since we are trying to evaluate this product as thouroughly as
> possible, I've also been in conversation with Bob Nuckolls of Aero
> Electric Connection (www.aeroelectric.com). Bob does failure analysis
> and product e
> valuations for Ratheon and is a technical writer for
> various magazines. He is interested in doing a technical evaluation
> with Blue Mountain and will be contacting Greg after OSH. If
> any of you
> are interested in contacting Bob, his email address is
> nuckolls(at)aeroelectric.com He also does aircraft wiring/design
> seminars for experimental aircraft builders which has been
> invaluable to
> some of the builders out there.
>
> If anyone has any positive or negative experience with the Blue
> Mountain system, I would love to talk with you about it. I'm
> interested
> in talking with those that have purchased, taken delivery and
> installed
> the Blue Mountain system. Of course, we'll be at OSH under
> the Lancair
> tent and displaying some new equipment we are currently
> testing as well
> as the time proven, tested and rock-solid Chelton Flight
> Systems EFIS.
>
>
> Fly Safe!
>
> Kirk Hammersmith
> Lancair Avionics, Inc.
> www.lancairavionics.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bartrim, Todd" <sbartrim(at)mail.canfor.ca> |
Hi David;
Invariably these tool questions end off with long list of
suggestions of tools that you simply can't build an RV without. While I am a
tool junkie and don't need any excuse to spend money on tools (I can justify
anything), You don't need to have the best of everything before you start,
but it is important to have the right tool for the job. Many RV projects
never get started because of the imposing list of tools that you "must"
have. Just buy Avery's basic tool set (minus the tools you already have) and
get started. Forget about the pneumatic squeezers, 10hp-65gal compressors,
etc.. There is lots of stuff that is nice to have that will break the bank
before you get started.
Once you are under way, you will either find that this isn't your
bag (there are many abandoned tail kits out there) in which case you haven't
invested too much in tools, or will become totally obsessed (like me) at
which time you will do whatever it takes to get the money for the tools &
parts that you want (sell a kidney, be a man-whore, etc... whatever).
Most important thing is JUST GET STARTED. Don't wait for the perfect
assortment of tools. Good luck.
S. Todd Bartrim
13B rotary powered
RV-9endurance (finish kit)
C-FSTB (reserved)
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
RE: RV-List: Tools
Hi David;
Invariably these tool questions end off with long list
of suggestions of tools that you simply can't build an RV without.
While I am a tool junkie and don't need any excuse to spend money on
tools (I can justify anything), You don't need to have the best of
everything before you start, but it is important to have the right tool
for the job. Many RV projects never get started because of the imposing
list of tools that you must have. Just buy Avery's basic
tool set (minus the tools you already have) and get started. Forget
about the pneumatic squeezers, 10hp-65gal compressors, etc.. There is
lots of stuff that is nice to have that will break the bank before you
get started.
Once you are under way, you will either find that this
isn't your bag (there are many abandoned tail kits out there) in which
case you haven't invested too much in tools, or will become totally
obsessed (like me) at which time you will do whatever it takes
to get the money for the tools parts that you want (sell a
kidney, be a man-whore, etc... whatever).
Most important thing is JUST GET STARTED. Don't wait for
the perfect assortment of tools. Good luck.
S. Todd Bartrim
13B rotary powered
RV-9endurance (finish kit)
C-FSTB (reserved)
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bartrim, Todd" <sbartrim(at)mail.canfor.ca> |
| Subject: | More Blue Mountain feedback |
> What bothers me is these guys are trying to sell these products before
> they are ready for the market. That's a big no-no, IMO. Because if it
> don't work and ain't ready yet, customers will just get ticked off and
> will give them a bad rap. And in the aviation world a bad reputation
> tends to stick, whether its merited or not.
>
> Bob Japundza
> RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying 340 hours
> F1 QB under const.
>
>
While I agree with this and am not intending to make excuses for
anyone, I would imagine that they are having a difficult financial time in
developing this product. The Chelton system(formerly Sierra Flight) is a
good example of what happens when a big company develops a system. They have
almost unlimited resources to develop a beautiful system that works
flawlessly, but what good does it do for most of us? Who can afford it?
Certainly not me.
Greg Richter, on the other hand is a regular guy who is working hard
to develop a system that the working man can afford, but with limited
resources. By this stage of development he must be in desperate need of cash
flow to continue operations. Still this is not much comfort to those that
are still waiting on their units after paying for them, only to wonder if
they will even work as advertised. When you consider all that this unit may
be capable of and then look at its price in comparison to the Chelton
system, one may expect a few bugs in the system. Everything that I've heard
so far indicates that Greg is working hard to fix existing customer units,
just not as successfully as they would like.
While I hope that Greg gets the bugs worked out soon, I certainly
would not expect to just plug this system into my panel & happily head off
into the clouds. After all I can't think of any time that I came up with a
new idea and got it right on the first try, or the second, third,
fourth.....
I wish Greg the utmost of luck in this endeavor and hope everyone
can be patient while he gets all the bugs out.
S. Todd Bartrim
13B rotary powered
RV-9endurance (finish kit)
C-FSTB (reserved)
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
RE: RV-List: More Blue Mountain feedback
What bothers me is these guys are
trying to sell these products before they are ready for the
market. That's a big no-no, IMO. Because if it don't work
and ain't ready yet, customers will just get ticked off and will give
them a bad rap. And in the aviation world a bad reputation tends
to stick, whether its merited or not.
Bob Japundza
RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying 340
hours
F1 QB under const.
While I agree with this and am not intending to make
excuses for anyone, I would imagine that they are having a difficult
financial time in developing this product. The Chelton system(formerly
Sierra Flight) is a good example of what happens when a big company
develops a system. They have almost unlimited resources to develop a
beautiful system that works flawlessly, but what good does it do for
most of us? Who can afford it? Certainly not me.
Greg Richter, on the other hand is a regular guy who is
working hard to develop a system that the working man can afford, but
with limited resources. By this stage of development he must be in
desperate need of cash flow to continue operations. Still this is not
much comfort to those that are still waiting on their units after
paying for them, only to wonder if they will even work as advertised.
When you consider all that this unit may be capable of and then look at
its price in comparison to the Chelton system, one may expect a few
bugs in the system. Everything that I've heard so far indicates that
Greg is working hard to fix existing customer units, just not as
successfully as they would like.
While I hope that Greg gets the bugs worked out soon, I
certainly would not expect to just plug this system into my panel
happily head off into the clouds. After all I can't think of any time
that I came up with a new idea and got it right on the first try, or
the second, third, fourth.....
I wish Greg the utmost of luck in this endeavor and hope
everyone can be patient while he gets all the bugs out.
S. Todd Bartrim
13B rotary powered
RV-9endurance (finish kit)
C-FSTB (reserved)
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
| Subject: | More Blue Mountain feedback |
Todd,
I think we all wish Greg well in his endeavor, however, as Sam B. pointed
out, failure of this unit in an IFR condition could flat out kill you.
A unit such as this needs to be rock solid before letting it loose on the
public.
One good law suite would bankrupt Greg forever.
Ed Cole
RV6A N2169D Flying
RV6A N648RV Finishing
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bartrim, Todd [SMTP:sbartrim(at)mail.canfor.ca]
> Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 9:11 AM
> To: 'rv-list(at)matronics.com'
> Subject: RE: RV-List: More Blue Mountain feedback
>
>
> > What bothers me is these guys are trying to sell these products before
> > they are ready for the market. That's a big no-no, IMO. Because if it
> > don't work and ain't ready yet, customers will just get ticked off and
> > will give them a bad rap. And in the aviation world a bad reputation
> > tends to stick, whether its merited or not.
> >
> > Bob Japundza
> > RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying 340 hours
> > F1 QB under const.
> >
> >
> While I agree with this and am not intending to make excuses for
> anyone, I would imagine that they are having a difficult financial time in
> developing this product. The Chelton system(formerly Sierra Flight) is a
> good example of what happens when a big company develops a system. They
> have
> almost unlimited resources to develop a beautiful system that works
> flawlessly, but what good does it do for most of us? Who can afford it?
> Certainly not me.
> Greg Richter, on the other hand is a regular guy who is working
> hard
> to develop a system that the working man can afford, but with limited
> resources. By this stage of development he must be in desperate need of
> cash
> flow to continue operations. Still this is not much comfort to those that
> are still waiting on their units after paying for them, only to wonder if
> they will even work as advertised. When you consider all that this unit
> may
> be capable of and then look at its price in comparison to the Chelton
> system, one may expect a few bugs in the system. Everything that I've
> heard
> so far indicates that Greg is working hard to fix existing customer units,
> just not as successfully as they would like.
> While I hope that Greg gets the bugs worked out soon, I certainly
> would not expect to just plug this system into my panel & happily head off
> into the clouds. After all I can't think of any time that I came up with a
> new idea and got it right on the first try, or the second, third,
> fourth.....
> I wish Greg the utmost of luck in this endeavor and hope everyone
> can be patient while he gets all the bugs out.
>
> S. Todd Bartrim
> 13B rotary powered
> RV-9endurance (finish kit)
> C-FSTB (reserved)
> http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
>
>
>
Maxim Home Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com
Products Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
New Products:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
Datasheets:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
The information contained in this message is confidential
and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bartrim, Todd" <sbartrim(at)mail.canfor.ca> |
| Subject: | More Blue Mountain feedback |
Hi Ed;
Agreed, it could result in disaster, however I don't believe he is
currently claiming IFR capability with these units. While I hope that it
will soon achieve these requirements, right now I think it would be foolish
to fly into the soup with only this for instrumentation.
Aaahh, if only we could get rid of the lawyers then stupid people
would just die, instead of spreading their genes. Then Greg could just
concentrate on developing his product, without worrying about lawsuits from
people foolish enough to blindly trust their lives with a single new
product.
Sorry for the rant, but its a slow day at work ;-)
S. Todd Bartrim
13B rotary powered
RV-9endurance (finish kit)
C-FSTB (reserved)
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Cole, Ed [SMTP:Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com]
> Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 10:28 AM
> To: 'rv-list(at)matronics.com'
> Subject: RE: RV-List: More Blue Mountain feedback
>
>
> Todd,
> I think we all wish Greg well in his endeavor, however, as Sam B. pointed
> out, failure of this unit in an IFR condition could flat out kill you.
> A unit such as this needs to be rock solid before letting it loose on the
> public.
> One good law suite would bankrupt Greg forever.
>
> Ed Cole
> RV6A N2169D Flying
> RV6A N648RV Finishing
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Bartrim, Todd [SMTP:sbartrim(at)mail.canfor.ca]
> > Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 9:11 AM
> > To: 'rv-list(at)matronics.com'
> > Subject: RE: RV-List: More Blue Mountain feedback
> >
> >
> > > What bothers me is these guys are trying to sell these products before
> > > they are ready for the market. That's a big no-no, IMO. Because if
> it
> > > don't work and ain't ready yet, customers will just get ticked off and
> > > will give them a bad rap. And in the aviation world a bad reputation
> > > tends to stick, whether its merited or not.
> > >
> > > Bob Japundza
> > > RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying 340 hours
> > > F1 QB under const.
> > >
> > >
> > While I agree with this and am not intending to make excuses for
> > anyone, I would imagine that they are having a difficult financial time
> in
> > developing this product. The Chelton system(formerly Sierra Flight) is a
> > good example of what happens when a big company develops a system. They
> > have
> > almost unlimited resources to develop a beautiful system that works
> > flawlessly, but what good does it do for most of us? Who can afford it?
> > Certainly not me.
> > Greg Richter, on the other hand is a regular guy who is working
> > hard
> > to develop a system that the working man can afford, but with limited
> > resources. By this stage of development he must be in desperate need of
> > cash
> > flow to continue operations. Still this is not much comfort to those
> that
> > are still waiting on their units after paying for them, only to wonder
> if
> > they will even work as advertised. When you consider all that this unit
> > may
> > be capable of and then look at its price in comparison to the Chelton
> > system, one may expect a few bugs in the system. Everything that I've
> > heard
> > so far indicates that Greg is working hard to fix existing customer
> units,
> > just not as successfully as they would like.
> > While I hope that Greg gets the bugs worked out soon, I
> certainly
> > would not expect to just plug this system into my panel & happily head
> off
> > into the clouds. After all I can't think of any time that I came up with
> a
> > new idea and got it right on the first try, or the second, third,
> > fourth.....
> > I wish Greg the utmost of luck in this endeavor and hope
> everyone
> > can be patient while he gets all the bugs out.
> >
> > S. Todd Bartrim
> > 13B rotary powered
> > RV-9endurance (finish kit)
> > C-FSTB (reserved)
> > http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "KostaLewis" <mikel(at)dimensional.com> |
| Subject: | Flying into OSH (long, for those going) |
OK: some last minute advice for those heading for OSH. I should have
done this long ago, but got busy. Read the archives for the article
about staying at OSH posted earlier. This is pretty much for those
flying in. It is still a be-prepared-and-expect-anything note. PLAN YOUR
FLIGHT, FLY THE PLAN. Go with enough gas in your aircraft you don't have
to land somewhere you hadn't planned. Have your maps and printed NOTAM
sheets handy.
Speaking of gas, it is a GAS flying into OSH. If you have an airplane,
you must fly it there at some time or another. Might as well be this
year.
Go to the EAA web site www.eaa.org and READ THE NOTAM. Let me say that
again. READ THE NOTAM. OK. You do not need to read the whole thing, just
those parts that apply to you. Not going IFR? Forget the IFR parts. Have
a radio? Forget the no radio procedures. It isn't for you if you lose
your radio on the way. That's when you take you your handheld. You do
carry a spare, don't you? How are you going to listen to the Air Boss
during the airshow without your handheld.
You also do not need to print the whole NOTAM unless you just like to
have it lying around. Go to the section listing and print just those
sections that apply to you. You will need to know the NOTAM to get there
AND to depart, so print out a copy of what you need and take it with
you. I have mine trimmed down to almost fit my knee board.
OK: so here you come towards OSH, already WATCHING FOR OTHER AIRPLANES.
Actually you are not going towards, OSH, you are going towards the town
of Ripon (pronounced RIPon), because that is where everyone starts.
Program the lat/long of Ripon into your GPS: N43deg 50.29 W88deg 50.68.
It also is in the upper right hand corner of the NOTAM map. About 50
miles out (!) turn on your landing lights. Tune your radio to 125.9 and
start trying to pick up ATIS, which you won't get clearly until 20-25
miles out but you won't need it until you start to get close. They will
tell you the usual: wind, altimeter, etc., and WHAT FLOW PATTERN COLOR
they are currently using: RED, BLUE, PURPLE or YELLOW. These are
different approach patterns they are using this year but are colored for
the first time to make the maps easier to use. Pull out that map of
Whitman field that corresponds to that color and look (again; you did
review it before you left didn't you) to see where you will need to be
going.
WATCH FOR OTHER AIRPLANES. But you are 30 miles from Ripon. 13,000
airplanes will be arriving during the course of the convention. They
will at one time or another be converging on Ripon. You are only one of
them and no one else is going to see them or tell you where they are but
you. And your passengers.
As you approach, and have ATIS info, retune to 120.7 to monitor the Fisk
controllers. These are first contact controllers at the town of Fisk
between Ripon and OSH. The town of Ripon begins to appear; it has a
large crme colored water tower somewhere in town. As you approach, you
want to be about 2000msl as you will be at 1800msl when you get to
Ripon. If traffic is heavy, Fisk controllers will tell you and advise
you to enter a holding pattern. If you are not at Ripon yet, just start
circling somewhere using LEFT turns, again WATCHING FOR TRAFFIC. LOOK
BEFORE YOU ENTER THE TURN. You will be advised when you can again begin
to approach Ripon. Sometimes you have to hold over Ripon, again circling
with LEFT turns, or over Rush Lake, just north of Ripon.
Fisk will then let you know when to proceed. There are a set of railroad
tracks that take off north east out of Ripon towards Fisk. Get in line
with whoever is in front of you, always looking left and right for other
airplanes doing the same. Be polite. Let other people in. You follow the
railroad tracks at 1800msl at 90 knots (or 2300msl at 135kts). As you
near Fisk, you will see a miniature "rabbit", a set of I believe three
strobes flashing. Keep following the rail road tracks which bear to the
right some at Fisk; DO NOT FLY OVER THE STROBES. The Fisk controllers
will be taking about a thousand miles an hour if it is busy and you JUST
LISTEN. They will identify you by your airplane type (low wing, high
wing), color, or who you are following. Unless asked, you DO NOT TALK TO
THEM. Sometimes they will ask you where you are going on the field or
other questions. BRIEF answers are best; don't use your call sign, just
answer them. It will be WAY too busy for you to chat with them.
When they call your type ("OK, I see a white low wing following the blue
twin rock your wings so I can see you OK that's a great wing rock you
will be following that twin we are using the RED flow pattern today
everyone keep your speed up there is a high wing maybe a Maule following
the low wing rock your wings OK you will be following the low
wing............") It will floor you the way they smoothly handle
things. As an aside, this is a treasured assignment for the controllers
to work OSH during the convention and the waiting list is long. And they
are GOOD. It is the world's busiest airport at the time of the
convention.
And suddenly you're in line, heading for OSH and, yikes, there it is you
were so busy you didn't even see it and it is coming up there, by the
lake man the lake looks really close OK 90kts 1800. The Fisk controllers
will hand you off to tower, the frequency depends on what runway you are
being assigned to; 9/27: 118.5; 18/36: 126.6. It is on your COLORED
arrival card you printed from the NOTAM.
As you get there, there are actually 3 runways: 36L/18R is the main
north/south runway. 36R/18L, is actually a taxyway turned into a runway.
27/9 is the main (only) east/west runway. 36/18 is the closest to the
Vintage/Showplane parking and camping, 9/27 to the spam can
parking/camping but as long as you get on the field and have your
destination card handy, you will be directed as to where to go.
(Destination card?)
NOTE: There are two taxi ways paralleling 36/18. It is the EAST one (on
the lake side of the main runway, and also near a bunch of hangers) that
is the temporary runway. If you see a bunch of people standing around,
green machines and motor bikes driving and airplanes taxiing where you
are about to land, GO AROUND. You are about to land on the WEST most
taxiway which is a taxiway, not a runway. The taxiway/runway will also
be numbered, the taxiway will (may) have a big yellow X on it. Why am I
saying this? At least one airplane lands on the taxiway every year. No
one has been hurt yet due to the diligence of the parking crew to get
out of the way.
If you are asked to land on 9/27, the tower controllers will ask you to
land on one of several circles (white, orange or green) that are painted
on the runway. Get as close to the circle as you can as there are either
people landing at the same time behind or in front of you. DO WHAT THE
CONTROLLER TELLS YOU. You may be asked to expedite your presence off the
runway, even onto the grass along side the runway. Miss the runway
lights and get off the runway. DO WHAT THEY TELL YOU, if you can. There
is someone landing behind you and you may be in the way.
OK, that being said: this is your first time at OSH and things are
happening at a rapid rate and seem to be getting out of hand. This is
NOT your first flight in your airplane. Fly the airplane. Monitor your
airspeed, fuel, traffic and all the other things you monitor on any
other flight to any other airport. Thats all this is, after all:
another landing at another airport. If things do not look good (I'm
going to land on top of that other airplane if I do what he tells me) go
around. Be safe. You are the pilot in command and it is your job to
conduct a safe flight, even in the strange environment of OSH. Fly safe.
Like you always do. I can tell you stories of VERY experienced pilots
flying onto OSH and doing things they THOUGHT the controller was telling
them, even when they thought it wasn't right. PAY ATTENTION. It isn't
that hard. It is just like flying into any other busy airport. Almost.
Destination card? Yes. PLEASE MAKE A DESTINATION CARD NOW and take it
with you. Otherwise, you may be taxiing longer than your flight to get
there to find a place to park. Go to the EAA web site, look up
Airventure 2002 and go to Aircraft Parking Status; there is a list of
what you put on your card there, depending on where you are headed. Make
the sign LARGE ( at least 8X10) and in bold black letters. The letters
"HBP" is homebuilt parking without camping, "HPC" is homebuilt parking
with camping. Others are listed on the web site. DO NOT put it on a 3X5
card in pencil. You will just jamb up the works. How do I know? I help
park the Vintage aircraft and every year dozens of pilots have no card,
or it was hurriedly made on final approach. That means someone has to
stop traffic, walk out to the pilot and ask where they are going. Don't
be stupid: make a card.
On the ground, you will be directed by first flagmen then you will be
assigned a biker on a small motor scooter who will park you in your
spot. Thank them all for getting you to OSH and parked as they are
tireless volunteers and do it for the love of the job, seeing airplanes
like yours and meeting people like you. If things go bad, you aren't
parked where you want, you were directed all over the airport before you
got parked, DO NOT YELL AT A VOLUNTEER. This is a part time job and the
person you are yelling at had probably nothing to do with your problem.
Thank them, get out, sit down and realize you are at the worlds'
greatest flying event. Then fix your problem.
TAKE YOUR TIEDOWNS. Every year, someone doesnt bring theirs. If yours
happen to fall out of your airplane on the way over, there are a limited
number of sets available. BRING YOUR OWN. Nuff said.
Departure. Do not ask a volunteer what the departure frequency is.
First, they are not departing, you are. Second: this is just an
admission that you did not plan your flight with all the information
available to you and didn't read the NOTAM. Bad idea. READ THE NOTAM.
Including the part about departing. You will need to depart at some time
or another, after all. PRINT THE DEPARTURE INFORMTION also. A briefing
is available on the field if the information blew out of your airplane
as you were taxiing (I could tell you stories).
Bottom line: yes, it is the biggest collection of airplanes on the
planet. Yes, it does get busy. Yes, it is a little freaky to fly in for
the first time. But everyone that is there flew in for the first time
once. It's not that hard. You can do it. 13,000 or so other people will
also do it during the course of the convention. It is a system that has
been polished for years and works well. It will work for you. Have fun.
FLY TO OSH.
This is by no means everything you need to know about getting to OSH,
but should help some. You are responsible to make sure you get there
safely. This is just a little more information than you had before.
See you there.
Michael
RV-4 N232 Suzie Q
Archive this sucker
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
| Subject: | Chrome Rocker Covers |
Fellow Listers:
I have a brand new set of chrome rocker box covers (and screws) for sale.
They are ECI units off my Aerosport O-360. Will sell for 1/2 price. $80.
Will have them at OSH Monday-Thurs if anyone is there. Or contact me off
list.
Thanks
Doug Weiler
Mn Wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: More Blue Mountain feedback |
"Bartrim, Todd" wrote:
>
>
> Hi Ed;
> Agreed, it could result in disaster, however I don't believe he is
> currently claiming IFR capability with these units.
Say whaaaaaat?
If the EFIS/One is not intended for IFR use, then why are the low
altitude enroute charts and approaches included on the map DVD????
And......if it is not intended for IFR use, then why is the EFIS/Lite
sold as a backup to the EFIS/One? If it is intended for VFR only, you
don't need a backup.
You will not find ANY info in the Blue Mountain publications saying the
EFIS/One and EFIS/lite are for VFR only.
Sam Buchanan (RV-6)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
| Subject: | Control Vision-AnywhereMap review..Long |
The following is an equipment review for the RV list and of course is just
one man's opinion.
I hope it will benefit anyone considering purchase of the software/system.
I don't have anything to do with the company, so take it for what it is
worth.
I recently returned from a two week cross-country jaunt with a close friend
of mine
in which we flew for close to 40 hrs covering as much of the country as we
could
while avoiding the thunderstorms that covered most of the country.
During these flight hours I was able to thoroughly check out my Control
Vision
Anywhere Map software using the IPAQ hand held computer. On board the RV6A
we
had 3 GPS's between us. A Lowrance Airmap 100, a panel mounted Garmin GPS95
(1995 technology), and the Anywhere Map. The Anywhere map won hands down
IMHO.
Control Vision has recently introduced a plastic knee board and a device
called the "Sleeve Lock"
which protects the IPAQ's com port connector and assures a reliable
connection of the GPS and
power to the IPAQ.
The Knee Board (overpriced at $45) was extremely useful and gave me a
convenient place to put
the unit. It Velcro's securely around your leg an you can angle it easily. I
had purchased a RAM mount
for the IPAQ but could never find an out of the way place to mount it in the
crowded RV6A cockpit.
The Sleeve Lock($25) comes with part of a metal yoke mount and allows you to
fasten the sleeve lock
connector to the metal yoke mount. What I did was to remove the brackets
from the back of the yoke
mount and Velcro the assembly to the knee board. This gave me a nice solid
mount for the IPAQ.
A small spot of Velcro on the back of the IPAQ gave me a unit that would not
disconnect even in
the worst of turbulence.
The IPAQ display thrives on bright light so the display was very easy to
see. When the sun was low
in the sky, the display was darker, but easily readable.
The features of the Anywhere Map software made navigation a breeze. The
ability to display rivers
and lakes, terrain height, terrain elevation, obstacles, cones of safety,
and TFR's in addition to all normal
GPS functions really impressed me. We flew most of the Midwest at 2500 ft
due to low clouds and haze
from the high humidity restricting forward visibility to 5-7 miles. The
terrain height was very handy to have
here.
Choosing and changing waypoints was made simple by just tapping on the
screen and having large
keyboard keys appear. All functions are available by tapping the screen
so you do not have to scroll cross hairs to program in the next waypoint as
required with the Lowrance.
The unit performed flawlessly for the entire trip and would acquire
satellites immediately
upon turning on the unit. I never lost the GPS signal once during the
flight.
The Garmin GPS antenna was Velcroed to the dash and the cable was fed back
behind the panel
and out the bottom to the IPAQ. I used it in both the left and right seats
with no
problem.
This is a serious GPS and warrants a look at. The AOPA data base is
extremely handy to have
approaching an airport. Control Vision is constantly updating the features
of there software and are coming
out with an electronic checklist that looks handy.
Monthly updates are available on a yearly subscription of $115.
If you're interested, you can download the manual from there website.
If you have specific questions, email off the list.
Ed Cole
RV6A N2169D Flying
RV6A N648RV Finishing
Maxim Home Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com
Products Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
New Products:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
Datasheets:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
The information contained in this message is confidential
and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Neil McLeod" <bedrock(at)theriver.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Chrome Rocker Covers |
I'll buy em, How do you want to do it?
Neil McLeod
RV-7
----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com>
Subject: RV-List: Chrome Rocker Covers
>
> Fellow Listers:
>
> I have a brand new set of chrome rocker box covers (and screws) for sale.
> They are ECI units off my Aerosport O-360. Will sell for 1/2 price. $80.
> Will have them at OSH Monday-Thurs if anyone is there. Or contact me off
> list.
>
> Thanks
>
> Doug Weiler
> Mn Wing
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tlutgring(at)juno.com |
Along with all the other good advice you've been getting, Here is my
two cents. Go beyond the names on Vans web site, Avery and Cleaveland
tools. Check out some of the tool dealers in tradeaplane. Shop around you
can find better deals and often free shipping. When you get to your fuel
tank and need tubing bender, Do not buy the one from Cleaveland for
$34.00, Go to Home Depot and buy the exact same bender from their
plumbing department for $10.00.
I do still buy tools from Cleaveland and Avery, they are good sources,
and have alot of RV specific tool needs. The key is to shop around.
Tom, Ohio RV-9A,
wings
packing for
Oshkosh
======================================================================
>
> messages.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Birkelbach" <phil(at)petrasoft.net> |
| Subject: | Re: More Blue Mountain feedback |
Acutally on the FAQ on their website they talk specifically about using the
unit FOR IFR. He discusses adding some other instruments for redundancy but
it is considered an IFR capable device by Blue Mountain.
http://www.bluemountainavionics.com/efisone/questions.html
Having said that my gripe with the EFIS One has always been the DVD. Isn't
the whole point of going to solid state systems to get rid of the high rpm
spinning things. :-) I like the EFIS Lite, in theory, but the one that they
had at SnF had something wrong with the screen, it had holes in the side of
it and if you turned it the DG (err compass) didn't move. The AI part of it
did seem to work, but they had no pressure inputs supplied to simulate
airspeed, altitude etc. I just was not impressed.
I hope Dynon Development gets theirs ready to go. They seem to be doing it
right. Start with something simple and perfect it then move on to other
things.
Godspeed,
Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas
RV-7 N727WB (Reserved)
http://www.myrv7.com
Fuselage
Airplanes never win battles with the ground. The best the airplane can hope
for is a draw.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Sam Buchanan" <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: More Blue Mountain feedback
>
>
> "Bartrim, Todd" wrote:
> >
> >
> > Hi Ed;
> > Agreed, it could result in disaster, however I don't believe he
is
> > currently claiming IFR capability with these units.
>
>
>
> Say whaaaaaat?
>
> If the EFIS/One is not intended for IFR use, then why are the low
> altitude enroute charts and approaches included on the map DVD????
>
> And......if it is not intended for IFR use, then why is the EFIS/Lite
> sold as a backup to the EFIS/One? If it is intended for VFR only, you
> don't need a backup.
>
> You will not find ANY info in the Blue Mountain publications saying the
> EFIS/One and EFIS/lite are for VFR only.
>
>
> Sam Buchanan (RV-6)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com> |
| Subject: | Control Vision - Anywwhere Map (AWM) Review |
I also have the AWM with the Gramin GPS 35 and they work great. Ed's
comments are what I would have said if asked. There is one thing that does
somewhat bother me however. I am using an iPAQ 3650, supplied with the
system by Control Vision, and the screen is a blast when in full sunlight.
Very bright.
But in an RV with the full canopy you will probably be wearing sun glasses.
Then the screen is ONLY visible when in full sun light. You will have to
keep putting it in the sun, or take off you sun glasses to see the display.
Control Vision is said to have a new model of iPAQ which they should have at
OSH and that new one may cure the problem.
For now, I gave up and use "flip-up" sun glasses over my prescription lens.
That way I can flip the cheaters and see the screen even if the light is
dim.
That's my ONLY complaint about the entire system. (But if I were trying to
couple the system to the NavAid wing leveler I would have some negative
thoughts due to the awkward mechanical way it would have to be connected. My
old Lowrance still handles that job,)
FWIW
John at Salida, CO
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Chrome Rocker Covers |
Covers are sold to Neil. Amazing the power of the List!!
Thanks all,
Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com>
Subject: RV-List: Chrome Rocker Covers
>
> Fellow Listers:
>
> I have a brand new set of chrome rocker box covers (and screws) for sale.
> They are ECI units off my Aerosport O-360. Will sell for 1/2 price. $80.
> Will have them at OSH Monday-Thurs if anyone is there. Or contact me off
> list.
>
> Thanks
>
> Doug Weiler
> Mn Wing
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rob Prior <rv7(at)b4.ca> |
Hear, hear. I'm up to about 8 different sources for tools (9 if you
count the scotchbrite wheel I bought from Vans along with my tail kit),
although the majority of them did come from the holy triumvirate of
Avery, Brown, and Cleveland. If you want an example of where tools can
come from, you can look at my page at http://www.b4.ca/rv7/, and click
on the "Tools" link on the left side. There's also a copy of Van's
recommended tools, interspersed with comments from some local builders
on whether you need them or not (mostly, you do).
-RB4
RV-7 Empennage
tlutgring(at)juno.com wrote:
>
> Along with all the other good advice you've been getting, Here is my
> two cents. Go beyond the names on Vans web site, Avery and Cleaveland
> tools. Check out some of the tool dealers in tradeaplane. Shop around you
> can find better deals and often free shipping. When you get to your fuel
> tank and need tubing bender, Do not buy the one from Cleaveland for
> $34.00, Go to Home Depot and buy the exact same bender from their
> plumbing department for $10.00.
> I do still buy tools from Cleaveland and Avery, they are good sources,
> and have alot of RV specific tool needs. The key is to shop around.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bartrim, Todd" <sbartrim(at)mail.canfor.ca> |
| Subject: | More Blue Mountain feedback |
Ok, I stand corrected on his IFR claims. Actually this somewhat surprises me
since although he obviously wants this unit to be a complete replacement for
gyro instruments, I would think he wouldn't claim it as such until it had
proven itself, if only to protect himself from lawsuits.
Still I believe you get what you pay for, so if you want an EFIS
system that can currently take you into IMC, than you'd better save your
pennies for Cheltons system. I'll save mine for BMA's or Dynon's and proceed
very cautiously.
I've gotta go home now, I can't find my asbestos suit ;-)
S. Todd Bartrim
13B rotary powered
RV-9endurance (finish kit)
C-FSTB (reserved)
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Phil Birkelbach [SMTP:phil(at)petrasoft.net]
> Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 1:55 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: More Blue Mountain feedback
>
>
> Acutally on the FAQ on their website they talk specifically about using
> the
> unit FOR IFR. He discusses adding some other instruments for redundancy
> but
> it is considered an IFR capable device by Blue Mountain.
>
> http://www.bluemountainavionics.com/efisone/questions.html
>
> Having said that my gripe with the EFIS One has always been the DVD.
> Isn't
> the whole point of going to solid state systems to get rid of the high rpm
> spinning things. :-) I like the EFIS Lite, in theory, but the one that
> they
> had at SnF had something wrong with the screen, it had holes in the side
> of
> it and if you turned it the DG (err compass) didn't move. The AI part of
> it
> did seem to work, but they had no pressure inputs supplied to simulate
> airspeed, altitude etc. I just was not impressed.
>
> I hope Dynon Development gets theirs ready to go. They seem to be doing
> it
> right. Start with something simple and perfect it then move on to other
> things.
>
> Godspeed,
>
> Phil Birkelbach - Houston Texas
> RV-7 N727WB (Reserved)
> http://www.myrv7.com
> Fuselage
>
> Airplanes never win battles with the ground. The best the airplane can
> hope
> for is a draw.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Sam Buchanan" <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: More Blue Mountain feedback
>
>
> >
> >
> > "Bartrim, Todd" wrote:
> > >
>
> > >
> > > Hi Ed;
> > > Agreed, it could result in disaster, however I don't believe
> he
> is
> > > currently claiming IFR capability with these units.
> >
> >
> >
> > Say whaaaaaat?
> >
> > If the EFIS/One is not intended for IFR use, then why are the low
> > altitude enroute charts and approaches included on the map DVD????
> >
> > And......if it is not intended for IFR use, then why is the EFIS/Lite
> > sold as a backup to the EFIS/One? If it is intended for VFR only, you
> > don't need a backup.
> >
> > You will not find ANY info in the Blue Mountain publications saying the
> > EFIS/One and EFIS/lite are for VFR only.
> >
> >
> > Sam Buchanan (RV-6)
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | JRC Handheld Review |
Well, I got the JRC JHP-500 handheld and took it for a spin today.
Here is what I found. While driving to the airport, I turned it on to
hear the ATIS and tower communication. I was about 2 miles away before
I really could make out what was being said. I remember my ICOM that I
had months ago was about double that. From my car, I called ground when
I was about 1 mile away. I had line of sight to the tower. Ground
said, "scratchy, barely readable." Not a good sign, as my ICOM in the
past would double this but get a "loud and clear" response. Also,
while listening to Phoenix Approach in my back yard, a motorcycle drove
by on the street adjacent to my house. The JRC picked up the engine
noise somehow, and played it over the speaker!
Next, I went flying. When 2 miles from the airport (almost entering a
pattern) I called tower for a radio check. "Last calling Chandler
Tower, broken and unreadable". I tried with and without the headset
adapter. Also, it was picking up engine noise as well.
2 miles from the airport at 2000 feet with a direct shot at the tower,
and it was unreadable? This product is in the box on it's way back to
JA Air Center, where they agreed to a return without a hitch.
I guess some things you do get what you pay for.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
Ebay is another great source. I've seen all kinds of good deals on tools
and hardware. Sometimes people don't know what they have, and the stuff
goes for really cheap.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Prior" <rv7(at)b4.ca>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Tools
>
> Hear, hear. I'm up to about 8 different sources for tools (9 if you
> count the scotchbrite wheel I bought from Vans along with my tail kit),
> although the majority of them did come from the holy triumvirate of
> Avery, Brown, and Cleveland. If you want an example of where tools can
> come from, you can look at my page at http://www.b4.ca/rv7/, and click
> on the "Tools" link on the left side. There's also a copy of Van's
> recommended tools, interspersed with comments from some local builders
> on whether you need them or not (mostly, you do).
>
> -RB4
> RV-7 Empennage
>
> tlutgring(at)juno.com wrote:
>
> >
> > Along with all the other good advice you've been getting, Here is my
> > two cents. Go beyond the names on Vans web site, Avery and Cleaveland
> > tools. Check out some of the tool dealers in tradeaplane. Shop around
you
> > can find better deals and often free shipping. When you get to your fuel
> > tank and need tubing bender, Do not buy the one from Cleaveland for
> > $34.00, Go to Home Depot and buy the exact same bender from their
> > plumbing department for $10.00.
> > I do still buy tools from Cleaveland and Avery, they are good sources,
> > and have alot of RV specific tool needs. The key is to shop around.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Control Vision - Anywwhere Map (AWM) Review |
| From: | cecilth(at)juno.com |
John, At Oshkosh a couple years ago I found sunglasses with the readers
at the bottom for $15.00, The dark part faded down to the readers so that
the readers were about clear. May be just the ticket for your problem.
Cecil Hatfield
>
> I also have the AWM with the Gramin GPS 35 and they work great. Ed's
> comments are what I would have said if asked. There is one thing
> that does
> somewhat bother me however. I am using an iPAQ 3650, supplied with
> the
> system by Control Vision, and the screen is a blast when in full
> sunlight.
> Very bright.
> But in an RV with the full canopy you will probably be wearing sun
> glasses.
> Then the screen is ONLY visible when in full sun light. You will
> have to
> keep putting it in the sun, or take off you sun glasses to see the
> display.
>
> Control Vision is said to have a new model of iPAQ which they should
> have at
> OSH and that new one may cure the problem.
>
> For now, I gave up and use "flip-up" sun glasses over my
> prescription lens.
> That way I can flip the cheaters and see the screen even if the
> light is
> dim.
>
> That's my ONLY complaint about the entire system. (But if I were
> trying to
> couple the system to the NavAid wing leveler I would have some
> negative
> thoughts due to the awkward mechanical way it would have to be
> connected. My
> old Lowrance still handles that job,)
>
> FWIW
>
> John at Salida, CO
>
>
>
>
> messages.
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "robert burns" <rv4n82rb(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-4 exhaust support |
take a look at the one i made for my vetterman exhaust 4 pipe on my web page
www.flash.net/~hsierra
bob burns
RV-4 N82RB
>From: "Pat Perry" <pperryrv(at)hotmail.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: RV-4 exhaust support
>Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 17:48:18 +0000
>
>
>Does anyone have any good descriptions or pictures of the support structure
>for the exhaust on an RV-4?
>
>
>Pat Perry
>Dallas, PA
>RV-4 N154PK Flies great!
>
>
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim's Hotmail" <rv8apilot(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
Neat little unit. I like the WAAS capability and the faster scrolling...
way cool!
Do a little more reading before sell your 195 however.
A quick product comparison using the Garmin site reveals that the display is
actually almost two square inches smaller than the 195. Those simulated
instruments would have to be about the size of a nickel to all fit on that
tiny screen. That picture on their site is really deceiving without a
scale. I guess they need the higher pixel density just to be able to display
so much on such a small screen.
Bummer, I was really getting worked up there for a minute.
- Jim Andrews
rv8a.tripod.com
>
> http://www.garmin.com/products/gpsmap196/
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Keith Hughes" <rv6tc(at)earthlink.net> |
Since he's too shy (shy?!?) to announce it himself.....
Colorado builder and Tech Consoler, Mark Delano fired up his engine for the
first time today. Mark is building an RV-6A (Wimp!!!) and re-built the
O-320 in his basement. It fired on the third blade and ran smoothly. At
this pace, I would say that he will be adding one to the skies of Colorado
soon, in our humble attempt to catch up with all those guys up in Oregon.
Though, to be fair..... Since we spot them about 200-230 days of rain and
drizzle each year (prime building time!) we may never take the lead.
Mark, (A.K.A. "Mr. Happy") can be reached at: DELANO60(at)email.msn.com
Feel free to Spam him with porno and "get rich quick" ideas.
Respectfully submitted,
Keith Hughes
whimpering, engine-less, sad builder of the slowest-build RV-6 (real man!!)
in the world!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
| Subject: | Re: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
>
> Neat little unit. I like the WAAS capability and the faster scrolling...
> way cool!
>
> Do a little more reading before sell your 195 however.
>
> A quick product comparison using the Garmin site reveals that the display
is
> actually almost two square inches smaller than the 195. Those simulated
> instruments would have to be about the size of a nickel to all fit on that
> tiny screen. That picture on their site is really deceiving without a
> scale. I guess they need the higher pixel density just to be able to
display
> so much on such a small screen.
>
> Bummer, I was really getting worked up there for a minute.
>
> - Jim Andrews
> rv8a.tripod.com
To clarify some questions that came up a few days ago I scanned through the
196 manual that is on the Garmin website. The 196 does not display
indicated or true airspeed. The 196 does not display indicated altitude.
The 196 does not display heading. The 196 does not display any sort of
attitude information.
There is a page that makes it look like the 196 does these things. That
page is deceptive.
It does have an E6B function where you can calculate TAS by inputting the
relative data.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Garth Shearing" <garth(at)Islandnet.com> |
| Subject: | Marvel-Schebler MA3-SPA Carb Parts |
Can anyone tell me the differences between the following parts:
Nozzle: What are the differences between 46-851, 46-850, and 46-852.
There are probably differences in the size of the jet hole, but anything
else?
Venturi: The single piece venturi 46-F11 (old main venturi is 46-A65) is
1 5/8 inches inside the throat but I don't know what the throat dimension is
in 46-F12 (old main venturi is 46-A70). Any differences in the primary
venturi?
The Internet doesn't provide the detail I need. I'm trying to set up my
MA3-SPA carb for a 100 HP engine (not standard) on which another carb is
installed but it doesn't work very well.
I know most builders don't have the time or inclination to worry about this
kind of thing, but I thought I would give it a shot anyway!
Garth Shearing
VariEze and 80% RV6A
Victoria BC Canada
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PLTDBEEZER(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pump problem |
I did a modification recently that seemed to help my vaper lock problems. I
installed a y duct just prior to the heat muff and diverted 1/2 of the air
that goes to the heat muff to some scat tube that I pointed at my bendix fuel
injector. I made a butterfly valve that I can reach thru the oil door to
shut it off in winter. I was having problems in the pattern at idle before -
this seems to have helped.
Dave Beizer
RV6A - IO-320
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
With the RV7, is there anything to do besides drill holes, debur and rivet?
Extend your left hand and say "money" then extend your right hand and say
"time". Now bounce your hands up and down while saying "time", "money".
Seriously, your tool needs for doing an RV7 tail are really
minimal. About the only power tool you really must have is a cheap
electric drill. An air drill is much faster. Files and sandpaper are both
necessary and sufficient. An electric wheel with a grind wheel on one side
and a Scotch Brite on the other. I still want a tiny Delta belt
sander. I have a box full of sheet metal shears but only use the Prosnip
offset Red.
Quality comes from craftsmanship, not expensive tools tho they can make it
easier and faster.
Above all, find other builders to talk to, watch, help, advise and maybe
even trade the use of.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gordon Robertson" <res0rlvx(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Tone generator and buzzer. |
>> Does anyone have a *simple* schematic for a tone generator?....I was
thinking about hooking that wire to a
tone generator and using it as a "master caution".
You can buy buzzers already set up. Try
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p.pgm?Q=1&I=LXBFS0&P=7 or
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p.pgm?Q=1&I=LXKN37&P=7
In my airomodelling days, I used one in a RC airplane so that I could find
it if it crashed in the trees. Turn off the radio transmitter and the
buzzer would come on. It could be heard for 20 yards!
Gordon Robertson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck Weyant" <chuck(at)chuckdirect.com> |
| Subject: | Panels, inexpensive |
Getting ready to put the instrument panel together on my 9A. Think I'm
going to use Van's prepunched instrument panel. Have to buy a
transceiver, gps, and flight instruments. Has anyone out there put
together a 'sweet', inexpensive day/night VFR panel that works for them?
If so, what are you using, how much $$, and where'd you find the stuff?
I need flight instruments too, but not engine as I have already
purchased all Van's engine instruments. I'd might consider rebuilt or
used too
Chuck Weyant
RV9A Finish Kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MASONINTL(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Rocket for sale or trade |
May I ask why the sale of such a kit that is that far along? A F1
"want-a-be"!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vincent Welch" <welchvincent(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | RV-8A And The IO 360 Engine |
Just thought I'd post the resolution of my problems for other 8A builders.
When I ordered my engine I simply (some might say stupidly) said that I
needed an IO 360 for a RV-8A. It seems that the "A" series sumps are in
short supply at this time. So the builder took a sump that was on an IO
360-C1C which has a rear entrance and blocked it off and machined a front
entrance to the sump. This sump is physically larger than the "A" series.
If I were building a RV-8 it probably would have been ok. However, the nose
gear support braces that run from the dynafocal ring on the 8A interfere
with the sump. What I should have done was specified an IO 360-A1A when
ordering the engine.
After spending two days on the phone, the best price I could find for a used
sump and the four intake tubes is $1200. If I return the sump and intake
tubes currently on my engine to the builder he will "generously" refund
$500! So, this little miscommunication is going to cost me $700 and more
irration that you can imagine.
Hopefully, this note will help future 8A builders.
Vince Welch
Wiser but poorer
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vincent Welch" <welchvincent(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pump problem |
When you say that you directed air to the fuel injector, are you referring
to the distribution block (spider) or the throttle body?
Vince
>From: PLTDBEEZER(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Fuel pump problem
>Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 10:50:12 EDT
>
>
>I did a modification recently that seemed to help my vaper lock problems.
>I
>installed a y duct just prior to the heat muff and diverted 1/2 of the air
>that goes to the heat muff to some scat tube that I pointed at my bendix
>fuel
>injector. I made a butterfly valve that I can reach thru the oil door to
>shut it off in winter. I was having problems in the pattern at idle before
>-
>this seems to have helped.
>
>Dave Beizer
>RV6A - IO-320
>
>
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Puckett <rv8er(at)concentric.net> |
| Subject: | AE701-10 Bend Radius? |
Does anyone know what the minimum bend radius is for Aeroquip 601/701
hose in a -10 size?
I'm really hoping it's in the 3-4" neighborhood range.
Thanks,
Greg Puckett
RV-80081 slooow build
engine and electric's
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Panels, inexpensive |
Chuck, we need you on the RV-9 list also. I have one of Vans prepunched
IP's and my main objection is that there is no place for a large CDI on it.
Other than that it also has 12 small holes for engine gages which is more
than I need. Because I like the way the flight instruments are grouped I'm
thinking of using it to layout the holes on my blank panel and then return
it to Vans for the 60 bucks.
Albert Gardner
Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
Working on firewall forward
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chuck Weyant" <chuck(at)chuckdirect.com>
Subject: RV-List: Panels, inexpensive
>
> Getting ready to put the instrument panel together on my 9A. Think I'm
> going to use Van's prepunched instrument panel. Have to buy a
> transceiver, gps, and flight instruments. Has anyone out there put
> together a 'sweet', inexpensive day/night VFR panel that works for them?
> If so, what are you using, how much $$, and where'd you find the stuff?
>
> I need flight instruments too, but not engine as I have already
> purchased all Van's engine instruments. I'd might consider rebuilt or
> used too
>
> Chuck Weyant
> RV9A Finish Kit
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Panels, inexpensive |
I would just copy the whole kit then send it all back :)
Jerry Springer
Albert Gardner wrote:
>
>
> Chuck, we need you on the RV-9 list also. I have one of Vans prepunched
> IP's and my main objection is that there is no place for a large CDI on it.
> Other than that it also has 12 small holes for engine gages which is more
> than I need. Because I like the way the flight instruments are grouped I'm
> thinking of using it to layout the holes on my blank panel and then return
> it to Vans for the 60 bucks.
> Albert Gardner
> Yuma, AZ
> RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
> Working on firewall forward
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Chuck Weyant" <chuck(at)chuckdirect.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Panels, inexpensive
>
> >
> > Getting ready to put the instrument panel together on my 9A. Think I'm
> > going to use Van's prepunched instrument panel. Have to buy a
> > transceiver, gps, and flight instruments. Has anyone out there put
> > together a 'sweet', inexpensive day/night VFR panel that works for them?
> > If so, what are you using, how much $$, and where'd you find the stuff?
> >
> > I need flight instruments too, but not engine as I have already
> > purchased all Van's engine instruments. I'd might consider rebuilt or
> > used too
> >
> > Chuck Weyant
> > RV9A Finish Kit
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard V. Reynolds" <rvreynolds(at)macs.net> |
| Subject: | Re: AE701-10 Bend Radius? |
The minimum bend radius is 5.5 inches (to the centerline of the hose). In
considering tight bend radii, consider the installation problems of the side
forces on the fittings and the chance to cross thread the fittings.
Richard Reynolds, RV-6A, painting
Greg Puckett wrote:
>
> Does anyone know what the minimum bend radius is for Aeroquip 601/701
> hose in a -10 size?
>
> I'm really hoping it's in the 3-4" neighborhood range.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Greg Puckett
> RV-80081 slooow build
> engine and electric's
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PLTDBEEZER(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel pump problem |
In a message dated 7/20/2002 3:01:00 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
welchvincent(at)hotmail.com writes:
> When you say that you directed air to the fuel injector, are you referring
> to the distribution block (spider) or the throttle body?
>
> Vince
>
The bendix servo (On bottom of engine)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "russ(at)maui.net" <drdestructo(at)livedoor.com> |
| Subject: | Re: More Blue Mountain feedback |
I requested a refund on the deposit I had paid on my EFIS lite. Following
is my response from Blue Mountain:
__________________________
Russ
We have one person with one problem and Lancair spreading rumors as fast as
they can make them up. I flew the box about 30 minutes ago and it works
very well. We;re going back up again after lunch flying the terrain
system. It's what we do.
Rumors are just that. When we have a few dozen people flying and you are
comfortable that everything is as it really is, we'll look forward to
hearing back from you.
-Greg
>Shelia,
>
>Thank you for the reply. I'll take care of that today on my end.
>
>I really hope you get the product worked out. If and when that happens,
>I'll be back with another order. In the mean time, you guys need to let
>people what is REALLY going on and trust that they will be patient. Untrue
>claims won't win happy customers.
>
>My understanding is that the ahrs unit is a big part of the problem. For
>what it's worth, I'd pay another $2000 for a reliable sensor if that would
>make the product stable. Sometimes the cheap way to go just doesn't make
>sense.
>
>Russ
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Engine mount and slider canopy |
I had an accident with my RV6A and need an engine mount for a 0-320
dynafocal1 and a slider canopy. Any one who can help me please contact me
at:
RQuinn1(at)aol.com
Thanks Rollie & Rod
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Orear" <jorear(at)new.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Blue Mountain Discussion |
List:
Has anyone heard about the Crossbow solid state gyro?? They have been
out since 1998, apparently used in unmanned applications. Plenty of
info on it can be found at:
www.xbow.com
They will be at Oshkosh, Hangar D, booth 4160. I hope I don't need a
reservation to talk with these guys!
Boy am I glad I'm not ready for my panel. I can sit back and let the
dust settle on this one!
Regards,
Jeff Orear
RV6A
fuse skins
Peshtigo, WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stuart Driver" <sdrivers(at)aaahawk.com> |
| Subject: | Wag Areo ICS Plus Radio/Vor Receiver |
Has anyone figured out how to increase the display illumination on this
unit. I have just purchased an RV4 with this unit installed and my old
eyes don't seem to up to it! Please feel free to reply off list. Do not
archive TIA SSD
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re:Installation of Vans Starter Solenoid |
The 3/16 terminal labeled " S " is connected to your starter switch.
The " I " terminal has no connection , this is only for electrical ignition
in start mode.
I need to find out the Diode connection too - Help someone !
Bob Olds RV-4 N1191X
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Cimino" <jcimino(at)echoes.net> |
| Subject: | Duckworth replacement bulbs |
Does anyone know what the replacement bulb is for the Duckworth Landing
Lights?
Jim Cimino
Jim Cimino
RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL 50+ Hrs.
http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo/
(570)842-4057
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Duckworth replacement bulbs |
You can use a Sylvania halogen 12V bulb. They're made in several wattages.
I found them at OSH for about $5 and change. You can probably find 'em at
just about any auto parts stores. You'll probably have to solder one pin to
the base and the other to the positive lead wire if you want to use an
existing base.
The Duckworks kits also come with a parts list/order form of their own. The
55W bulbs cost $6 plus $5 shipping per order. I assume those bulbs come
pre-soldered to the base and lead wire, but I'm not sure.
Here's the contact info on their instructions:
Duckworks Experimental Aircraft Parts
50641 Firridge Ave.
Scappoose, OR 97056
503-543-3653
jwentz@columbia-center.org
Hope this helps,
)_( Dan
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Cimino" <jcimino(at)echoes.net>
Subject: RV-List: Duckworth replacement bulbs
>
> Does anyone know what the replacement bulb is for the Duckworth Landing
> Lights?
> Jim Cimino
>
> Jim Cimino
> RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL 50+ Hrs.
> http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo/
> (570)842-4057
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Duckworth replacement bulbs |
Forget what I said before...why bother soldering if you can get the H3 base
pre-wired for the same price! 8
)
http://store.yahoo.com/rodi/hellah3.html ($3.49 for 55w, $5.99 for 100w)
http://lampstore.peclamp.com/sku4-04.html ($5.00 for 55w)
http://www.4by4connection.com/h3bulbs.html ($7.95 for 55w or 100w)
)_( Dan
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Cimino" <jcimino(at)echoes.net>
Subject: RV-List: Duckworth replacement bulbs
>
> Does anyone know what the replacement bulb is for the Duckworth Landing
> Lights?
> Jim Cimino
>
> Jim Cimino
> RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL 50+ Hrs.
> http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo/
> (570)842-4057
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Kohser" <dckoh(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re:Installation of Vans Starter Solenoid |
I believe that on the starter relay the side of the diode with the red band
is connected to the small starter switch terminal and the other end goes to
ground..........
Doug Kohser
RV-6A (cowling)
Marietta, GA
----- Original Message -----
From: <Oldsfolks(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Re:Installation of Vans Starter Solenoid
>
> The 3/16 terminal labeled " S " is connected to your starter switch.
> The " I " terminal has no connection , this is only for electrical
ignition
> in start mode.
> I need to find out the Diode connection too - Help someone !
>
> Bob Olds RV-4 N1191X
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Earl Fortner <efortner(at)vnet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Duckworth replacement bulbs |
The Duckworth landing lights I purchased a few years ago came in a Toyoto
Box and even the Toyota parts that were discarded were included. If it has
not changed Toyota and auto parts houses should have the bulb.
Earl RV4
Dan Checkoway wrote:
>
> You can use a Sylvania halogen 12V bulb. They're made in several wattages.
> I found them at OSH for about $5 and change. You can probably find 'em at
> just about any auto parts stores. You'll probably have to solder one pin to
> the base and the other to the positive lead wire if you want to use an
> existing base.
>
> The Duckworks kits also come with a parts list/order form of their own. The
> 55W bulbs cost $6 plus $5 shipping per order. I assume those bulbs come
> pre-soldered to the base and lead wire, but I'm not sure.
>
> Here's the contact info on their instructions:
>
> Duckworks Experimental Aircraft Parts
> 50641 Firridge Ave.
> Scappoose, OR 97056
> 503-543-3653
> jwentz@columbia-center.org
>
> Hope this helps,
> )_( Dan
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jim Cimino" <jcimino(at)echoes.net>
> To: "RV-LIST"
> Subject: RV-List: Duckworth replacement bulbs
>
> >
> > Does anyone know what the replacement bulb is for the Duckworth Landing
> > Lights?
> > Jim Cimino
> >
> > Jim Cimino
> > RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL 50+ Hrs.
> > http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo/
> > (570)842-4057
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Wheel Pants On > OSH |
All,
N712CR's wheel pants and fairings were finally completed and installed on
SUnday (7/21). Made a couple of speed runs at 4500 and 6500 ft 24 square and
showed an IAS of 175kts.
Dave left for OSH this morning (7/22) and expects to be there around 3-4 PM.
Look fot the Blue Angles RV-8A.
Chuck Rowbotham
N712CR - RV-8A
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com |
| Subject: | Re: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
09:49:53 AM
Did I see a T&B indicator on it? Now, how do it know?
"Larry Pardue" (at)matronics.com on 07/20/2002 12:04:45 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
> Neat little unit. I like the WAAS capability and the faster scrolling...
> way cool!
>
> Do a little more reading before sell your 195 however.
>
> A quick product comparison using the Garmin site reveals that the display
is
> actually almost two square inches smaller than the 195. Those simulated
> instruments would have to be about the size of a nickel to all fit on
that
> tiny screen. That picture on their site is really deceiving without a
> scale. I guess they need the higher pixel density just to be able to
display
> so much on such a small screen.
>
> Bummer, I was really getting worked up there for a minute.
>
> - Jim Andrews
> rv8a.tripod.com
To clarify some questions that came up a few days ago I scanned through the
196 manual that is on the Garmin website. The 196 does not display
indicated or true airspeed. The 196 does not display indicated altitude.
The 196 does not display heading. The 196 does not display any sort of
attitude information.
There is a page that makes it look like the 196 does these things. That
page is deceptive.
It does have an E6B function where you can calculate TAS by inputting the
relative data.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
| From: | Larry Pardue <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
>
>
>Did I see a T&B indicator on it? Now, how do it know?
>
>
More like a pseudo turn coordinator. One thing a GPS can do is sense
rate of turn.
Course there is also a pseudo airspeed indicator and this unit has no way
of knowing anything at all about airspeed.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
| From: | Denis Walsh <deniswalsh(at)earthlink.net> |
This is all assumption and guesswork, but that is what the LIST is all about
usually.
Since it knows the course and updates more often than once per second, it
could calculate the rate of turn and direction. The display looks like a
Turn Coordinator to me.
> From: Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com
> Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 09:51:18 -0400 09:49:53 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
>
> Did I see a T&B indicator on it? Now, how do it know?
>
>
> "Larry Pardue" (at)matronics.com on 07/20/2002 12:04:45 AM
>
> Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
>
> Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
>
> To:
> cc:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
>
>
>>
>> Neat little unit. I like the WAAS capability and the faster scrolling...
>> way cool!
>>
>> Do a little more reading before sell your 195 however.
>>
>> A quick product comparison using the Garmin site reveals that the display
> is
>> actually almost two square inches smaller than the 195. Those simulated
>> instruments would have to be about the size of a nickel to all fit on
> that
>> tiny screen. That picture on their site is really deceiving without a
>> scale. I guess they need the higher pixel density just to be able to
> display
>> so much on such a small screen.
>>
>> Bummer, I was really getting worked up there for a minute.
>>
>> - Jim Andrews
>> rv8a.tripod.com
>
> To clarify some questions that came up a few days ago I scanned through the
> 196 manual that is on the Garmin website. The 196 does not display
> indicated or true airspeed. The 196 does not display indicated altitude.
> The 196 does not display heading. The 196 does not display any sort of
> attitude information.
>
> There is a page that makes it look like the 196 does these things. That
> page is deceptive.
>
> It does have an E6B function where you can calculate TAS by inputting the
> relative data.
>
> Larry Pardue
> Carlsbad, NM
>
> RV-6 N441LP Flying
> http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Haan <bhaan(at)easystreet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Duckworth replacement bulbs |
Jim,
NAPA Auto parts
100 Watts = STK NO. BP1210/H3 Priced from $6.00 to $7.50
55Watts similar STK NO. same shelf
Bob
>
>Does anyone know what the replacement bulb is for the Duckworth Landing
>Lights?
>Jim Cimino
>
>Jim Cimino
>RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL 50+ Hrs.
>http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo/
>(570)842-4057
>
>
Bob
RV6A almost
http://easystreet.com/~bhaan/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com |
| Subject: | Re: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
10:31:11 AM
Would it keep you pseudo upright out of gas descending through a layer
looking for a place to commit controlled crash. <;-)
Sure never thought I'd see THAT in a GPS.
Eric
Larry Pardue (at)matronics.com on 07/22/2002 10:09:41 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
>Did I see a T&B indicator on it? Now, how do it know?
>
>
More like a pseudo turn coordinator. One thing a GPS can do is sense
rate of turn.
Course there is also a pseudo airspeed indicator and this unit has no way
of knowing anything at all about airspeed.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net> |
| Subject: | New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
OK
The instument panel display shows everything you can get from GPS position
data --
Ground track (DG type display)
Ground speed (ASI type display)
GPS Altitude (altimeter type display)
GPS Vertical speed (VSI type display)
Turn and bank display shows an airplane tilted if the ground track is
changing...no turn coordinator (slip skid, or ball)
3.8" diagonal (square) sounds bigger than a 195 to me
It suffered from a poor description by a tropic aero ad writer who didn't
understand.
I think it is a neat device!
John RV8qb almost done.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
Did I see a T&B indicator on it? Now, how do it know?
"Larry Pardue" (at)matronics.com on 07/20/2002 12:04:45 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
> Neat little unit. I like the WAAS capability and the faster scrolling...
> way cool!
>
> Do a little more reading before sell your 195 however.
>
> A quick product comparison using the Garmin site reveals that the display
is
> actually almost two square inches smaller than the 195. Those simulated
> instruments would have to be about the size of a nickel to all fit on
that
> tiny screen. That picture on their site is really deceiving without a
> scale. I guess they need the higher pixel density just to be able to
display
> so much on such a small screen.
>
> Bummer, I was really getting worked up there for a minute.
>
> - Jim Andrews
> rv8a.tripod.com
To clarify some questions that came up a few days ago I scanned through the
196 manual that is on the Garmin website. The 196 does not display
indicated or true airspeed. The 196 does not display indicated altitude.
The 196 does not display heading. The 196 does not display any sort of
attitude information.
There is a page that makes it look like the 196 does these things. That
page is deceptive.
It does have an E6B function where you can calculate TAS by inputting the
relative data.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: hot oil temps |
hi all
the guy at positech is bryan at ext. 29. he is on a 10 day biz trip, i
suspect oshkosh, but his staff is supposed to take his orders.
scott
tampa
new oil cooler on order
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
Doing a little research on wing levelers and GPS and I have found a number
of cases where a relative cheap (but high drift) piezo gyro is used to
provide short term roll information and the GPS is used to provide long term
yaw (heading) correction information to the wing leveler. Since the GPS can
tell you if your heading is changing during a turn (which likely means the
aircraft has rolled into a bank - whether sensed by the cheap gyro or not) ,
it would appear that it would not be too hard to design a turn indicator
using that information.
Ed Anderson
>
>
> Would it keep you pseudo upright out of gas descending through a layer
> looking for a place to commit controlled crash. <;-)
>
> Sure never thought I'd see THAT in a GPS.
>
> Eric
>
>
> Larry Pardue (at)matronics.com on 07/22/2002 10:09:41 AM
>
> Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
>
> Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
>
> To:
> cc:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
> >
> >
> >
> >Did I see a T&B indicator on it? Now, how do it know?
> >
> >
>
> More like a pseudo turn coordinator. One thing a GPS can do is sense
> rate of turn.
>
> Course there is also a pseudo airspeed indicator and this unit has no way
> of knowing anything at all about airspeed.
>
> Larry Pardue
> Carlsbad, NM
>
> RV-6 N441LP Flying
> http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
| Subject: | New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
All indicators are "derived" from the GPS info according to the latest
write-up on the Propwash
website. All of the gauges shown can be and are derived from gps info. Think
about it!
Ed Cole
RV6A N2169D Flying
RV6A N648RV Finishing
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Huft [SMTP:rv8tor(at)lazy8.net]
> Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 7:50 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
> OK
>
> The instument panel display shows everything you can get from GPS position
> data --
>
> Ground track (DG type display)
> Ground speed (ASI type display)
> GPS Altitude (altimeter type display)
> GPS Vertical speed (VSI type display)
> Turn and bank display shows an airplane tilted if the ground track is
> changing...no turn coordinator (slip skid, or ball)
>
> 3.8" diagonal (square) sounds bigger than a 195 to me
> It suffered from a poor description by a tropic aero ad writer who didn't
> understand.
>
> I think it is a neat device!
>
> John RV8qb almost done.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
>
>
> Did I see a T&B indicator on it? Now, how do it know?
>
>
> "Larry Pardue" (at)matronics.com on 07/20/2002 12:04:45 AM
>
> Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
>
> Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
>
> To:
> cc:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
>
>
> >
> > Neat little unit. I like the WAAS capability and the faster
> scrolling...
> > way cool!
> >
> > Do a little more reading before sell your 195 however.
> >
> > A quick product comparison using the Garmin site reveals that the
> display
> is
> > actually almost two square inches smaller than the 195. Those simulated
> > instruments would have to be about the size of a nickel to all fit on
> that
> > tiny screen. That picture on their site is really deceiving without a
> > scale. I guess they need the higher pixel density just to be able to
> display
> > so much on such a small screen.
> >
> > Bummer, I was really getting worked up there for a minute.
> >
> > - Jim Andrews
> > rv8a.tripod.com
>
> To clarify some questions that came up a few days ago I scanned through
> the
> 196 manual that is on the Garmin website. The 196 does not display
> indicated or true airspeed. The 196 does not display indicated altitude.
> The 196 does not display heading. The 196 does not display any sort of
> attitude information.
>
> There is a page that makes it look like the 196 does these things. That
> page is deceptive.
>
> It does have an E6B function where you can calculate TAS by inputting the
> relative data.
>
> Larry Pardue
> Carlsbad, NM
>
> RV-6 N441LP Flying
> http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
>
>
>
>
>
Maxim Home Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com
Products Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
New Products:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
Datasheets:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
The information contained in this message is confidential
and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re:Installation of Vans Starter Solenoid |
didn't you get a schematic with the solenoid? if not let me know, i'll try
and find mine and fax it to you.
scott
tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Andrews" <rv8apilot(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
Don't get folks hopes up John. Check out the comparison page on the Garmin
website as I mentioned earlier.
195 display size 3.6 X 2.4 ( 8.64 inches squared )
196 display size 2.27 X 3.02 ( 6.85 inches squared )
One of the purposes of this list is to cut through the marketing hype and
get the straight scoop. let's not buy into smoke and mirrors.
Also, if anyone is going to use this for the Guy In Back, please for Gods
sake inform the non pilots about the difference between airspeed and ground
speed. If they know what the landing speed is and find themselves in a
position to land the plane if the pilot is incapacitated, it would be a
fatal mistake to confuse the two in a tail wind landing situation.
- Jim Andrews
rv8a.tripod.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
> OK
>
> The instument panel display shows everything you can get from GPS position
> data --
>
> Ground track (DG type display)
> Ground speed (ASI type display)
> GPS Altitude (altimeter type display)
> GPS Vertical speed (VSI type display)
> Turn and bank display shows an airplane tilted if the ground track is
> changing...no turn coordinator (slip skid, or ball)
>
> 3.8" diagonal (square) sounds bigger than a 195 to me
> It suffered from a poor description by a tropic aero ad writer who didn't
> understand.
>
> I think it is a neat device!
>
> John RV8qb almost done.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
> Did I see a T&B indicator on it? Now, how do it know?
>
>
> "Larry Pardue" (at)matronics.com on 07/20/2002 12:04:45 AM
>
> Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
>
> Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
>
> To:
> cc:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
> >
> > Neat little unit. I like the WAAS capability and the faster
scrolling...
> > way cool!
> >
> > Do a little more reading before sell your 195 however.
> >
> > A quick product comparison using the Garmin site reveals that the
display
> is
> > actually almost two square inches smaller than the 195. Those simulated
> > instruments would have to be about the size of a nickel to all fit on
> that
> > tiny screen. That picture on their site is really deceiving without a
> > scale. I guess they need the higher pixel density just to be able to
> display
> > so much on such a small screen.
> >
> > Bummer, I was really getting worked up there for a minute.
> >
> > - Jim Andrews
> > rv8a.tripod.com
>
> To clarify some questions that came up a few days ago I scanned through
the
> 196 manual that is on the Garmin website. The 196 does not display
> indicated or true airspeed. The 196 does not display indicated altitude.
> The 196 does not display heading. The 196 does not display any sort of
> attitude information.
>
> There is a page that makes it look like the 196 does these things. That
> page is deceptive.
>
> It does have an E6B function where you can calculate TAS by inputting the
> relative data.
>
> Larry Pardue
> Carlsbad, NM
>
> RV-6 N441LP Flying
> http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net> |
| Subject: | New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
Sorry Jim, I had in my mind's eye a GPS III rather than the 195, when I made
the comparison in display size.
I apologize profusely for spreading mis-information (dis-information?).
I still like it.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim Andrews
Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
Don't get folks hopes up John. Check out the comparison page on the Garmin
website as I mentioned earlier.
195 display size 3.6 X 2.4 ( 8.64 inches squared )
196 display size 2.27 X 3.02 ( 6.85 inches squared )
One of the purposes of this list is to cut through the marketing hype and
get the straight scoop. let's not buy into smoke and mirrors.
Also, if anyone is going to use this for the Guy In Back, please for Gods
sake inform the non pilots about the difference between airspeed and ground
speed. If they know what the landing speed is and find themselves in a
position to land the plane if the pilot is incapacitated, it would be a
fatal mistake to confuse the two in a tail wind landing situation.
- Jim Andrews
rv8a.tripod.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
> OK
>
> The instument panel display shows everything you can get from GPS position
> data --
>
> Ground track (DG type display)
> Ground speed (ASI type display)
> GPS Altitude (altimeter type display)
> GPS Vertical speed (VSI type display)
> Turn and bank display shows an airplane tilted if the ground track is
> changing...no turn coordinator (slip skid, or ball)
>
> 3.8" diagonal (square) sounds bigger than a 195 to me
> It suffered from a poor description by a tropic aero ad writer who didn't
> understand.
>
> I think it is a neat device!
>
> John RV8qb almost done.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
> Did I see a T&B indicator on it? Now, how do it know?
>
>
> "Larry Pardue" (at)matronics.com on 07/20/2002 12:04:45 AM
>
> Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
>
>
> Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>
>
> To:
> cc:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
> >
> > Neat little unit. I like the WAAS capability and the faster
scrolling...
> > way cool!
> >
> > Do a little more reading before sell your 195 however.
> >
> > A quick product comparison using the Garmin site reveals that the
display
> is
> > actually almost two square inches smaller than the 195. Those simulated
> > instruments would have to be about the size of a nickel to all fit on
> that
> > tiny screen. That picture on their site is really deceiving without a
> > scale. I guess they need the higher pixel density just to be able to
> display
> > so much on such a small screen.
> >
> > Bummer, I was really getting worked up there for a minute.
> >
> > - Jim Andrews
> > rv8a.tripod.com
>
> To clarify some questions that came up a few days ago I scanned through
the
> 196 manual that is on the Garmin website. The 196 does not display
> indicated or true airspeed. The 196 does not display indicated altitude.
> The 196 does not display heading. The 196 does not display any sort of
> attitude information.
>
> There is a page that makes it look like the 196 does these things. That
> page is deceptive.
>
> It does have an E6B function where you can calculate TAS by inputting the
> relative data.
>
> Larry Pardue
> Carlsbad, NM
>
> RV-6 N441LP Flying
> http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
Have the purge valve installed on both of my aircraft, they are equipped
with the Bendix system, The purge valve and the fuel flow divider on the
top of the engine are combined into a single unit, this was done by Aero
Sport at the time of the overhaul. Having the purge valve located here
means that the entire system gets purged with the exception of the
injector lines going to the cylinders.The control for the purge valve is
a push pull the same as my alternate air control and I have spring
loaded the arm on the purge valve so that it will be kept in the closed
position in the event of a control failure.
With the purge valve open, no fuel can enter the flow divider so I go
full throttle, mixture full rich and boost pump on, this will give the
highest volume of fuel through the system. I have found thirty seconds
or so is sufficient to clear the system, then boost pump off,mixture
back to idle cut off, throttle closed and purge valve closed. The fuel
that is circulated throughout the system is returned to my left tank
with a dedicated line, by leaving the fuel down a half inch or so below
the filler neck when refueling overflowing is not a problem.
I use the purge valve on every start, this makes sure the system is full
and on a cold start priming seems to be more accurate. I am sure
everyone has a different way of starting but what works best for me is
on a cold start with the system purged I open the throttle about
half,boost pump on, mixture full rich and count to around ten, then
mixture back to ICO and throttle cracked. Start cranking then mixture
rich and crank till it starts.
A lot of variables here depending on temperature, boost pump pressure
etc.
Hot starts like a quick turn around , purge the system and then no
priming and make sure that the mixture is not moved to rich until the
engine is cranking. The advent of the light weight starters and the
higher cranking speeds has really helped these hot starts.
Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Andrews" <rv8apilot(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
Yeah, me too.
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
> Sorry Jim, I had in my mind's eye a GPS III rather than the 195, when I
made
> the comparison in display size.
>
> I apologize profusely for spreading mis-information (dis-information?).
>
> I still like it.
>
> John
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim Andrews
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
> Don't get folks hopes up John. Check out the comparison page on the
Garmin
> website as I mentioned earlier.
>
> 195 display size 3.6 X 2.4 ( 8.64 inches squared )
> 196 display size 2.27 X 3.02 ( 6.85 inches squared )
>
> One of the purposes of this list is to cut through the marketing hype and
> get the straight scoop. let's not buy into smoke and mirrors.
>
> Also, if anyone is going to use this for the Guy In Back, please for Gods
> sake inform the non pilots about the difference between airspeed and
ground
> speed. If they know what the landing speed is and find themselves in a
> position to land the plane if the pilot is incapacitated, it would be a
> fatal mistake to confuse the two in a tail wind landing situation.
>
> - Jim Andrews
> rv8a.tripod.com
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net>
> To:
> Subject: RE: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
>
>
> >
> > OK
> >
> > The instument panel display shows everything you can get from GPS
position
> > data --
> >
> > Ground track (DG type display)
> > Ground speed (ASI type display)
> > GPS Altitude (altimeter type display)
> > GPS Vertical speed (VSI type display)
> > Turn and bank display shows an airplane tilted if the ground track is
> > changing...no turn coordinator (slip skid, or ball)
> >
> > 3.8" diagonal (square) sounds bigger than a 195 to me
> > It suffered from a poor description by a tropic aero ad writer who
didn't
> > understand.
> >
> > I think it is a neat device!
> >
> > John RV8qb almost done.
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> > Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com
> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Did I see a T&B indicator on it? Now, how do it know?
> >
> >
> > "Larry Pardue" (at)matronics.com on 07/20/2002 12:04:45
AM
> >
> > Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >
> >
> > Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> >
> >
> > To:
> > cc:
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Neat little unit. I like the WAAS capability and the faster
> scrolling...
> > > way cool!
> > >
> > > Do a little more reading before sell your 195 however.
> > >
> > > A quick product comparison using the Garmin site reveals that the
> display
> > is
> > > actually almost two square inches smaller than the 195. Those
simulated
> > > instruments would have to be about the size of a nickel to all fit on
> > that
> > > tiny screen. That picture on their site is really deceiving without a
> > > scale. I guess they need the higher pixel density just to be able to
> > display
> > > so much on such a small screen.
> > >
> > > Bummer, I was really getting worked up there for a minute.
> > >
> > > - Jim Andrews
> > > rv8a.tripod.com
> >
> > To clarify some questions that came up a few days ago I scanned through
> the
> > 196 manual that is on the Garmin website. The 196 does not display
> > indicated or true airspeed. The 196 does not display indicated
altitude.
> > The 196 does not display heading. The 196 does not display any sort of
> > attitude information.
> >
> > There is a page that makes it look like the 196 does these things. That
> > page is deceptive.
> >
> > It does have an E6B function where you can calculate TAS by inputting
the
> > relative data.
> >
> > Larry Pardue
> > Carlsbad, NM
> >
> > RV-6 N441LP Flying
> > http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | ANUNNELEE(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: More Blue Mountain feedback |
Greg states he has one person with one problem. I am more interested in the
person with no problems, if that person exists. Greg has been claiming since
Oshkosh last year he was shipping units. Has anyone got a functioning unit
and can recommend this product??? I don't think so!!!
I also put deposits up in January and got nothing but promises. However, I
hope Greg does get it together, as I have decided to go a different route and
have a set of Blue Mountain autopilot servos for sale CHEAP!
BUYER BEWARE
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Duckworth replacement bulbs |
Answers to most questions can be found at the new Duckworks site...
www.duckworksaviation.com
Randy Lervold
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Duckworth replacement bulbs
>
> You can use a Sylvania halogen 12V bulb. They're made in several
wattages.
> I found them at OSH for about $5 and change. You can probably find 'em at
> just about any auto parts stores. You'll probably have to solder one pin
to
> the base and the other to the positive lead wire if you want to use an
> existing base.
>
> The Duckworks kits also come with a parts list/order form of their own.
The
> 55W bulbs cost $6 plus $5 shipping per order. I assume those bulbs come
> pre-soldered to the base and lead wire, but I'm not sure.
>
> Here's the contact info on their instructions:
>
> Duckworks Experimental Aircraft Parts
> 50641 Firridge Ave.
> Scappoose, OR 97056
> 503-543-3653
> jwentz@columbia-center.org
>
> Hope this helps,
> )_( Dan
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jim Cimino" <jcimino(at)echoes.net>
> To: "RV-LIST"
> Subject: RV-List: Duckworth replacement bulbs
>
>
> >
> > Does anyone know what the replacement bulb is for the Duckworth Landing
> > Lights?
> > Jim Cimino
> >
> > Jim Cimino
> > RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL 50+ Hrs.
> > http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo/
> > (570)842-4057
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carlfro(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | Duckworth replacement bulbs |
I picked up a pair at Walmart - $2.50 each, replacing the 55w bulbs with
100w units. They have the 55w ones as well.
Carl Froehlich
RV-8A (flying)
Vienna, VA
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim Cimino
Subject: RV-List: Duckworth replacement bulbs
Does anyone know what the replacement bulb is for the Duckworth Landing
Lights?
Jim Cimino
Jim Cimino
RV-8 sn 80039 N7TL 50+ Hrs.
http://www.geocities.com/jcimino.geo/
(570)842-4057
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
I agree with the previous posts but a few adds I found useful.
After building part of an RV-6 on the cheap I am now building a 9. I bought
a hydraulic squeezer to help save my wrists from the repetitive motion
problems I was having by hand squuezing all those dimpled holes and rivets.
I love it. I also bought a small very cheap electric screwdriver that I use
for my deburring. Saves all the little twisting of the deburring tool- Not
a small task when working on the wing skins.
Not sure it was mentioned but it may be in the Avery kit- a Scotchbrite
wheel is absolutely essential. I use mine all the time- probably in some
places where one post mentioned he used the sander.
I had a cheap band saw but I broke too many blades.Go for the better model
or stay with a hack saw. Teh band saw works great for stiffeners and such,
but I did do mine with the hacksaw this time. I may still go out and buy a
band saw though.
I used a cheap dixie cup sprayer for the primer. not sure I agree with
getting a good one. Teh quality isn't that important for the primer. The
dixie cup unit is a throwaway and all you clean up is the little suction
tube. I have to admit I'm having trouble finding the little cups that fit
and did buy a cheap $20 sprayer just in case.
I did both wings at one time and kept buying more clecoes. I bet I have
about 600 of the 3/32" now. I'm still glad I am working on both at once even
if it's just cool with both wings spread out in my basement.
You will need lots of drill bits and various lengths to get at stuff. I use
the 6" quite often.
For the small areas in the tail and the wings the Avery dimple set built on
to a vise grip is wonderful if not essential.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings
1968 Mustang 302 convertible
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Taylor" <david(at)hom.net>
Subject: RV-List: Tools
>
> I am anxious to build an RV-7 and I hope to start in the next 3 to 6
> months. My question is what are the minimum tools I need get started
> building the tail kit? As I am just getting started I don't have many of
> the tools I'm sure that is necessary for building and have to buy a
> little at a time. I'm looking for the bare necessities to get started.
> I'll buy the nice to have items later as I can afford them. So far I
> have bought an air compressor and rivet gun with #3 and #4 straight and
> offset rivet sets as well as a flush rivet set. What other items are
> absolutely must haves to get started?
>
> Thanks,
>
> -David Taylor
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Brick" <jbrick(at)wolfenet.com> |
Lycoming 0320H2AD
1100 SMOH at Mattituck airbase
Running engine with logs
Includes mechanical fuel pump (new)
Mag, wire harness and plugs
Marvel Carb
Stock Starter
All accessories in running condition
Engine has been in dry long term storage
5900.00/ obo
Lance Newman
Maple Valley, WA
425-413-1764
mailto:lance.newman(at)sms.siemens.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Garth Shearing" <garth(at)Islandnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: New Garman GPSMAP 196 - EFIS Wanabe - Nice Unit |
A GPS receiver can only measure one thing - time, albeit very accurately.
The GPS receiver is basically measuring the time it takes the radio signal
to get from a satellite to your receiver, and it does this to an accuracy
down to around one billionth of a second. In this length of time, a radio
signal travels about one foot, hence the basis for the accuracy of GPS.
Now, if the receiver measures the time it takes to get from several
satellites, you have the means to calculate where you are in space by
"triangulation" because the satellites give you their known location and an
exact measurement of absolute time. (It's nice to know what time it is down
to a billionth of a second, isn't it?)
So the first calculation, from the above "triangulation in space" using a
little spatial trigonometry built into the program of the receiver, gives
you your location in terms of latitude, longitude, and altitude.
When you make another measurement as above a little while later, you can
calculate, using program software, your speed, direction, and change in
altitude. The information up to this point is usually made available to
outside equipment through a connector. If you make another measurement a
little while later again, you can calculate the rate of turn, again using
program software. (Actually there are several measurements made to smooth
out errors.)
I guess the important thing about this info is that most of the information
is calculated using fundamental math using basic sequential positional
information. The GPS receiver cannot provide attitude information which is
required for safe IFR operation. For a simple example, if you put an
airplane into a descending coordinated sideslip, your gyro-type instruments
will show a bank and yaw at the same time, with no change in direction, and
the VSI will show the rate of descent. The GPS receiver cannot show you the
bank and yaw.
Garth Shearing
VariEze and 80% RV6A
Victoria BC Canada
> All indicators are "derived" from the GPS info according to the latest
> write-up on the Propwash
> website. All of the gauges shown can be and are derived from gps info.
Think
> about it!
>
> Ed Cole
> RV6A N2169D Flying
> RV6A N648RV Finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pete Bodie" <rv6apjb(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re:Installation of Vans Starter Solenoid |
I bought my kit from another builder and there wasn't any paper work for the
starter solenoid. Thank you for the offer but I have received several
answers and the great thing is they all agree.
Thank You again.
----- Original Message -----
From: <ABAYMAN(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Re:Installation of Vans Starter Solenoid
>
> didn't you get a schematic with the solenoid? if not let me know, i'll try
> and find mine and fax it to you.
> scott
> tampa
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
> I bought
> a hydraulic squeezer to help save my wrists from the repetitive motion
> problems I was having by hand squuezing all those dimpled holes and
rivets.
I found that a single not too hard hit from a plastic hammer with Cleaveland
dimple dies in an Avery C frame tool make for nicer dimples. I could not get
the finished surface (after riveting) as flat when making dimples with the
squeezer.
> I used a cheap dixie cup sprayer for the primer. not sure I agree with
> getting a good one. Teh quality isn't that important for the primer. The
> dixie cup unit is a throwaway and all you clean up is the little suction
> tube.
No luck with the Dixie cup sprayer for me. Tossed it out. Started using a
$50 (Canadian) cheapie sprayer for most of the wings and was happy. Later
began using a $400 car painters spray gun just because I had it. Later
started using the HVLP sprayer that I aquired. It never ends......
The two tools I would buy before building again:
1 Pneumatic Squeezer from Cleaveland - it will sell used for more than half
what it costs.
2 SCH-22 "Main Sqeeze" - this is a new technology hand squeezer that has a
way of increasing the power of the squeeze as you squeeze. Hard to describe
but those 1/8 rivets have never been so easy. This tool makes the
traditional squeezers by Tatco and Avery obsolete.
If you buy both squeezers from Cleaveland, the yokes are quick changeble
between both.
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
Back at work from a five week holiday. Here we go again...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Amit Dagan" <amitdagan(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | building tips - bulkheads |
For those of you about to start on the firewall of the -7 (and I guess the
same goes for the -9 as well), be sure to look at the drawing for the
battery box installation ! some of the rivets should not be installed !
On the next bulkhead, F-705 on the "7", the bars that need triming are the
tapered doublers, not the main one as stated in the manual.
"ALL" The rivets that need a countersink on this bar (AN426) - well, there
are just two of them that I found,
and be sure not to drill through the doubler for the one rivet that only
goes through the bottom main bar, where the doubler joggles.
Hope this helps.
Maybe someone from VAN's is reading this and will add a caution line the
manual.
Amit
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Graham Murphy <jgmurphy(at)xtra.co.nz> |
| Subject: | Ribs 1 to 5 Fit to spar |
Folks
I am currently starting on my RV-6 wing, and when trial fitting the main
ribs to spar found that the first 5 ribs have about 0.06 to 0.08" gap
between the joggled rib flange and spar web flange, whereas all the
other ribs fitted real snug.
Has anybody els struck this and overcome it?? I emailed vans thinking
that the walkway reinforcement might be meant to be joggled at the fwd
end as the drgs dont clearly show it's installation. Vans say to dress
the rib joggles to eliminate the gap, but that will take some care as
the rib flanges must fit flush to the spar web flanges.
Any feedback out there??
Graham Murphy
Blenheim
New Zealand.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-8A And The IO 360 Engine |
In a message dated Sat, 20 Jul 2002 1:42:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, welchvincent(at)hotmail.com
writes:
> Just thought I'd post the resolution of my problems for other 8A builders.
>
> When I ordered my engine I simply (some might say stupidly) said that I
> needed an IO 360 for a RV-8A. It seems that the "A" series sumps are in
> short supply at this time. So the builder took a sump that was on an IO
> 360-C1C which has a rear entrance and blocked it off and machined a front
> entrance to the sump. This sump is physically larger than the "A" series.
> If I were building a RV-8 it probably would have been ok. However, the nose
> gear support braces that run from the dynafocal ring on the 8A interfere
> with the sump. What I should have done was specified an IO 360-A1A when
> ordering the engine.
>
> After spending two days on the phone, the best price I could find for a used
> sump and the four intake tubes is $1200. If I return the sump and intake
> tubes currently on my engine to the builder he will "generously" refund
> $500! So, this little miscommunication is going to cost me
> $700 and more
> irration that you can imagine.
>
> Hopefully, this note will help future 8A builders.
>
> Vince Welch
> Wiser but poorer
Vince,
If you haven't committed, I have an A series sump (used but it very good shape,
1100 hours) I will sell at a very reduced rate. I'm using the Sky Dynamics sump
and accordingly don't need the stock sump and risers. I won't have internet
access until this Friday so if you respond and don't get an answer you'll know
why.
Rick McBride
rickrv6(at)aol.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gannon, Terence" <Terence.Gannon(at)trican.ca> |
| Subject: | Ribs 1 to 5 Fit to spar |
Graham -- I'm having a little trouble visualizing the exact condition you're
describing...are you saying that the joggle is apparently a little too big
on the five ribs in question? Assuming that's the case, I would try
temporarily clamping the spar flange to the five ribs and see if it
significantly distorts or twists the flange where it transitions from the
five ribs to the other ribs on your wing. If it does, then perhaps some
sort of shim is in order. If it doesn't then if it were my plane, I would
simply continue. Personally, I've found in my '96 vintage wing kit that
while the stampings are very good, slight variations such as what you
describe are inevitable.
As far as the wing walk is concerned, the forward edge of my wing walk butts
up against the aft edge of the spar flange. Geez, I hope that's right?!!
Cheers...
Terry in Calgary
RV-6 S/N 24414
"Wings"
(Left Signed Off For Close, Last Night)
-----Original Message-----
From: Graham Murphy [mailto:jgmurphy(at)xtra.co.nz]
Subject: RV-List: Ribs 1 to 5 Fit to spar
Folks
I am currently starting on my RV-6 wing, and when trial fitting the main
ribs to spar found that the first 5 ribs have about 0.06 to 0.08" gap
between the joggled rib flange and spar web flange, whereas all the other
ribs fitted real snug.
Has anybody els struck this and overcome it?? I emailed vans thinking that
the walkway reinforcement might be meant to be joggled at the fwd end as the
drgs dont clearly show it's installation. Vans say to dress the rib joggles
to eliminate the gap, but that will take some care as the rib flanges must
fit flush to the spar web flanges.
Any feedback out there??
Graham Murphy
Blenheim
New Zealand.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Darn Potholes |
Might be Darn Trainer Wheel ??
Bob Olds RV-4
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob Blum <bob(at)theblums.net> |
| Subject: | Garmin III Pilot |
I have a gps 3 pilot and a 295. One feature on the little Pilot that is
lacking on the 295 (and 195 for that matter) is What I call "the little
idiot arrow". It is quire simply an arrow at the bottom of the map display
that depicts the bearing to the next waypoint. You jes line up the arrow
with the nose.
I realize that HSI does the same thing, albiet with a lot more clutter. On
the IIIp you get the moving map, idiot arrow, ete and distance to waypoint,
all on one screen. kinda handy.
Bob Blum
N710EH
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "3 rotor" <rv8r300(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | flaring technique |
I recently bought my own flaring tool and for unknown reasons decided to
look at the instructions. I built my entire -6A incorrectly and thought
perhaps others might want to learn or laugh at me.
The tool is the type that has sliding blocks that hold the tubing
while flaring. I found that this type was far more versital than the
big turret type. What I didn't realize is that the flare is formed
completely above the blocks, they do not form the backside of the flare.
So you extend the tubing 5/16ths" and after the cone makes contact,
turn the handle 6-7 half turns, THAT'S ALL. The tool I used before had
some flare to the blocks and I assumed (wrongly) that they were used to
form the backside of the flare. So the flare doesn't have marks on it
from the blocks and if you don't reef on the blocks, the tubing doesn't
get marks in it either.
I suppose this is all A&P 101 stuff along with safety wiring
techniques, but I thought I'd pass on what I learned, or find out that
I'm still doing it wrong. Kevin N3773 -6A and now a -8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Textor" <jack(at)iajobs.com> |
| Subject: | flaring technique |
Good info Kevin. Is it 5/16th and the same amount of turns mo matter the
tubing size?
Jack Textor
Packing for OSH
Subject: RV-List: flaring technique
I recently bought my own flaring tool and for unknown reasons decided to
look at the instructions. I built my entire -6A incorrectly and thought
perhaps others might want to learn or laugh at me.
The tool is the type that has sliding blocks that hold the tubing
while flaring. I found that this type was far more versital than the
big turret type. What I didn't realize is that the flare is formed
completely above the blocks, they do not form the backside of the flare.
So you extend the tubing 5/16ths" and after the cone makes contact,
turn the handle 6-7 half turns, THAT'S ALL. The tool I used before had
some flare to the blocks and I assumed (wrongly) that they were used to
form the backside of the flare. So the flare doesn't have marks on it
from the blocks and if you don't reef on the blocks, the tubing doesn't
get marks in it either.
I suppose this is all A&P 101 stuff along with safety wiring
techniques, but I thought I'd pass on what I learned, or find out that
I'm still doing it wrong. Kevin N3773 -6A and now a -8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Donald Mei" <don_mei(at)hotmail.com> |
Just a couple of points on the GPS 196. I first saw this hardware first
hand over the winter. I've also seen the successor to the 295. How, do you
ask, simple, I visited a marine store. Garmin since it started doing
aviation hand helds has based them on existing marine hardware. The 175
->195, GPS 3 ->GPS 3 Pilot, Street Pilot -> GPS 295, GPSMap 176 ->196. The
marine market is much larger so they get the cool hardware first. Then 6
months to a year later, that same hardware comes out as an aviation model.
Go here to check out the marine predecesor to the 196 and also to see what
the new 295 will look like:
http://www.garmin.com/products/gpsmap176C/
I haven't actually seen the 196, but based on the marine model and the 295,
its main advantage over the 195 will be its ability to redraw the screen in
a timely way. I've owned a 195 for 2 years and it is the only annoying
thing about this unit. (sometimes very annoying)
Re the 196 display, it is hype but may make things a little easier. My RV 4
has no gyros. With the airspeed indicator, turn coordinator (the little
ball is the turn coordinator, not the airplane) altimiter and my Garmin 195
set to show the HSI display, I can keep the plane right side up. (I
practiced it for 2 hrs during a Wings achievement program with an
instructor) The HSI measures heading and heading change. This is VERY
close to measuring yaw. It does not measure bank.
I agreed with almost everything a previous poster said, but with all good
intentions I must agree with this comment he made:
-------
If you put an airplane into a descending coordinated sideslip, your
gyro-type instruments will show a bank and yaw at the same time, with no
change in direction, and the VSI will show the rate of descent. The GPS
receiver cannot show you the bank and yaw.
--------
There is no such thing as a coordinated side slip. If you hold the plane
yawed with the rudder, the turn coordinator will betray you. If you
coordinate the turn, the GPS will show a heading change which you could
infer as banked wings. There is no way around it.
Like I said, I agree with most everything else written by this gentleman.
All of the info is derivative info. By the way it is no diferent than the
info presented by a 195, 3 pilot, or 295. It just has a marketing spin.
All offer altitude, groundspeed and heading info. The rate of climb and
turn and bank indicators on the 196 are just derivatives of alt and heading
info. No magic, no new info.
The thing I like best about the 196 is the ability to offer a map and hsi on
the same page, and the quicker redraw. If you need a unit with a reasonable
battery life, this is the way to go. Remember that color screens, for all
their beauty use batteries faster then black and white screens. For me,
I'll wait for the 295's successor to arive.
Don Mei
RV-4
3B9 - Chester, CT
Americans used to roar like lions for liberty: Now they bleat like sheep for
security
Norman Vincent Peale
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
>
> Like I said, I agree with most everything else written by this gentleman.
> All of the info is derivative info. By the way it is no diferent than the
> info presented by a 195, 3 pilot, or 295. It just has a marketing spin.
> All offer altitude, groundspeed and heading info. The rate of climb and
> turn and bank indicators on the 196 are just derivatives of alt and
heading
> info. No magic, no new info.
>
At the risk of being picky, none of these units, including the 196, show
heading information. They do show an altitude, but it is not the same as
what an altimeter would show.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Kitz" <JKITZ1(at)columbus.rr.com> |
Had anyone found a web cam for OSH? Jealous minds just want to know.
John Kitz
N721JK
Ohio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott Baldwin" <n728p(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Panther Electronics Headsets ? |
I have seen ads for Panther Electronics C.A.T. system ( replaces a regular
headset with small ear-pieces ). Is anyone using this system in their RV ?
If so , are they as good as the literature claims ?
Any info would be appreciated .
Scott Baldwin
RV-6 120 HRS.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Donald Mei" <don_mei(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | gps 196 - heading |
Your right, I mis-spoke. GPS doesn't show heading, but shows ground track.
At RV speeds these are for all intents and purposes the same thing, as our
wind correction angles (crab into wind) are minimal.
Americans used to roar like lions for liberty: Now they bleat like sheep for
security
Norman Vincent Peale
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "3 rotor" <rv8r300(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: flaring technique |
apparently so, according to the instructions. Considering the fact that we
are only flaring 1/4 and 3/8 this seems reasonable. The jaws of the cone
portion of the flaring tool have a 5/16ths" offset to gauge the starting
point with.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jack Textor" <jack(at)iajobs.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: flaring technique
>
> Good info Kevin. Is it 5/16th and the same amount of turns mo matter the
> tubing size?
> Jack Textor
> Packing for OSH
>
> Subject: RV-List: flaring technique
>
>
> I recently bought my own flaring tool and for unknown reasons decided to
> look at the instructions. I built my entire -6A incorrectly and thought
> perhaps others might want to learn or laugh at me.
> The tool is the type that has sliding blocks that hold the tubing
> while flaring. I found that this type was far more versital than the
> big turret type. What I didn't realize is that the flare is formed
> completely above the blocks, they do not form the backside of the flare.
> So you extend the tubing 5/16ths" and after the cone makes contact,
> turn the handle 6-7 half turns, THAT'S ALL. The tool I used before had
> some flare to the blocks and I assumed (wrongly) that they were used to
> form the backside of the flare. So the flare doesn't have marks on it
> from the blocks and if you don't reef on the blocks, the tubing doesn't
> get marks in it either.
> I suppose this is all A&P 101 stuff along with safety wiring
> techniques, but I thought I'd pass on what I learned, or find out that
> I'm still doing it wrong. Kevin N3773 -6A and now a -8
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
| Subject: | Bleating or Roaring? --off topic, delete if not ble |
ating--
While were on the subject, I saw this quote on a plaque outside the
Airforce Museum in Dayton, Ohio while on my cross country trip..
"For those who fight for them. Life and Liberty have a different flavor
the protected and indifferent never know" --ANON
Ed Cole
RV6A N2169D Flying
RV6A N648RV Finishing
Maxim Home Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com
Products Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
New Products:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
Datasheets:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
The information contained in this message is confidential
and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Andrews" <rv8apilot(at)hotmail.com> |
Where's the big coverage on AirVenture?
There is nothing new on either avweb.com or landings.com since this last
weekend.
I'm starved for NEWS!
Thx,
- Jim Andrews
rv8a.tripod.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <nauga(at)brick.net> |
| Subject: | Prestolite starter question |
While I'm (still) waiting for local mechanics to return
calls maybe y'all can help - I've got a nice
yellow-tagged Prestolite starter (the big'un)
that came with my engine but not mounted. I've
got a 149-tooth flywheel (ring gear) and the
starter pinion has 9 teeth. Is there an easy
way to tell the pitch of the pinion? The starter's
got a P-lite part no., and the Lyc. manual references
Lycoming part nos, not Prestolite. Looks to me
like the starter is the wrong pitch, which is why I
had trouble mounting it.
If it *is* the wrong pitch, what's the least painless
way to correct it, mod the starter, replace the starter,
or replace the ring gear?
I've searched the archives, and there seems to be some
conflicting info there. Time for another go-'round?
Dave 'crosspost' Hyde
nauga(at)brick.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Shelby Smith <rvaitor(at)comcast.net> |
I think EAA site has some stuff. I glanced at it this morning.
--
Shelby Smith
> From: Jim Andrews <rv8apilot(at)hotmail.com>
> Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 14:38:21 -0500
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: AirVenture
>
>
> Where's the big coverage on AirVenture?
>
> There is nothing new on either avweb.com or landings.com since this last
> weekend.
>
> I'm starved for NEWS!
>
> Thx,
>
> - Jim Andrews
> rv8a.tripod.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Firewall forward |
| From: | "Martin Hone" <martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au> |
Seems like a quiet day on the list so I will ask this question.
I am doing the firwall forward thing at present, and measuring up for
fuel and oil hoses. Given that the fuel pump and carb are solidly fixed
to the engine (O-320) with no relative movement, is there any reason
why a firesleeved aluminum fuel pipe could not be run between them,
instead of the usual flexible Aeroquip-type hose ?
Cheers
Martin in Oz - where the sheep are nervous
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Firewall forward |
In a message dated 7/24/02 7:50:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au writes:
<< Seems like a quiet day on the list so I will ask this question.
I am doing the firwall forward thing at present, and measuring up for
fuel and oil hoses. Given that the fuel pump and carb are solidly fixed
to the engine (O-320) with no relative movement, is there any reason
why a firesleeved aluminum fuel pipe could not be run between them,
instead of the usual flexible Aeroquip-type hose ?
Cheers
Martin in Oz - where the sheep are nervous >>
Not to say your idea won't work perfectly for 50 years, but I imagine there
will be a small amount of relative motion between the pump and the carb.
These engines do vibrate a bit... A few hundred hours of vibration could do
bad things to hard piped lines.
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Starn" <jhstarn(at)earthlink.net> |
"
\"Dotty Ray\""
This for the followers of the list that recall my search of
information on behalf of one of my EAA Chapter members. Byron Cannon,
the N-11 builder, is fading fast. As you know the chapter members put
the finishing touchs on his plane and attempted to fly it at least once
while he could still get to the airport to see it. He had used a VW
engine for power and during taxi tests one of the spoke wheels folded
under due to side stress. The second attempt was to fly with repaired
gear only to have the tail wheel prove to be ineffected in control and
some damage was done to its attaching points. The plane was taken back
to the hanger without flying with yet another folded wheel..
That was several weeks ago and now it appears to be too late to get
in a flight for him. His family would like to sell and/or donate the
plane for display. We have new wheels (light motorcycle) for the plane.
If you have or know of who would be interested in obtaining a
beautiful N-11 please advise on-line.
We at the chapter are planning a service and missing man flight for
his family. Byron was one of the C-46 pilots that flew CAF's China Doll
in Southeast Asia when they were both in the service of their country.
KABONG
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Larsen" <larsenj(at)minot.ndak.net> |
How about streaming audio of the approach frequency?
Jim
6-Wings
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Kitz" <JKITZ1(at)columbus.rr.com>
Subject: RV-List: Web cam
>
> Had anyone found a web cam for OSH? Jealous minds just want to know.
> John Kitz
> N721JK
> Ohio
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Firewall forward |
Hello Martin,
These engines do move quite a bit during startup and shutdown.
although a solid aluminum line might last quite a while the flexline will
almost always last longer.
The enemy here is high frequency vibration. the flex line can soak up a lot
of this type of abuse and will not be as suseptible to heat.
Also the failure mode with the solid line could well be breakage that might
result in full flow of fuel onto hot exhaust system. (:-(!
The flex line is at the very least a bit less likely to fail in the same
way.
In short, use the suggested fuel lines.
Happy building
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Martin Hone" <martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au>
Subject: RV-List: Firewall forward
>
> Seems like a quiet day on the list so I will ask this question.
> I am doing the firwall forward thing at present, and measuring up for
> fuel and oil hoses. Given that the fuel pump and carb are solidly fixed
> to the engine (O-320) with no relative movement, is there any reason
> why a firesleeved aluminum fuel pipe could not be run between them,
> instead of the usual flexible Aeroquip-type hose ?
>
> Cheers
> Martin in Oz - where the sheep are nervous
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "chris mcgough" <rv6(at)ssc.net.au> |
| Subject: | Re: Firewall forward |
Vibration....Use a hose they are proven and one less thing to go wrong.
Chris and Susie
VH-MUM
----- Original Message -----
From: "Martin Hone" <martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au>
Subject: RV-List: Firewall forward
>
> Seems like a quiet day on the list so I will ask this question.
> I am doing the firwall forward thing at present, and measuring up for
> fuel and oil hoses. Given that the fuel pump and carb are solidly fixed
> to the engine (O-320) with no relative movement, is there any reason
> why a firesleeved aluminum fuel pipe could not be run between them,
> instead of the usual flexible Aeroquip-type hose ?
>
> Cheers
> Martin in Oz - where the sheep are nervous
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | David Aronson <aronsond(at)pacbell.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Panther Electronics Headsets ? |
Scott:
I am using the Panther system in my Citabria 7ECA-150. I am building an
RV4. The system lives up to everything they say. The Citabria is every bit
as noisy as any RV and I can hear perfectly and everyone reads me load and
clear. My first set would require a full squelch and fed back engine noise.
I was directed to send back with new impressions. I received them a week
ago and have flown three times. Much improved, quieter that my David
Clarks. You need to realize that you will hear in one ear and the mic
receiver is in the other ear. No chance for stereo. If you are looking for
comfort and a quiet ride with no headsets, this may be the product for you.
I would do it again.
Dave Aronson
RV4 N504RV
----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Baldwin" <n728p(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: Panther Electronics Headsets ?
>
> I have seen ads for Panther Electronics C.A.T. system ( replaces a regular
> headset with small ear-pieces ). Is anyone using this system in their RV ?
> If so , are they as good as the literature claims ?
> Any info would be appreciated .
>
> Scott Baldwin
> RV-6 120 HRS.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Burton" <dburton(at)nwlink.com> |
- Original Message -----
> Where's the big coverage on AirVenture?
This is the best I know of....
http://www.avweb.com/oshkosh/osh2002/
Gary Sobek has a posting to Doug's site:
http://www.metronet.com/~dreeves/vaf.htm
Anybody else?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Garth Shearing" <garth(at)Islandnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firewall forward |
I don't have our 0360 in front of me at the moment, but isn't Lycoming using
aluminum tubes as oil return lines from the rockers to sump? If so, this is
a similar application.
Garth Shearing
VariEze and 80% RV6A
Victoria BC Canada
> In a message dated 7/24/02 7:50:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au writes:
>
> << Seems like a quiet day on the list so I will ask this question.
> I am doing the firwall forward thing at present, and measuring up for
> fuel and oil hoses. Given that the fuel pump and carb are solidly fixed
> to the engine (O-320) with no relative movement, is there any reason
> why a firesleeved aluminum fuel pipe could not be run between them,
> instead of the usual flexible Aeroquip-type hose ?
>
> Cheers
> Martin in Oz - where the sheep are nervous >>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bobby Hester <bhester(at)apex.net> |
Jim Larsen wrote:
>
> How about streaming audio of the approach frequency?
> Jim
> 6-Wings
>
http://www.airventure.org/ has everything your looking for about Oshkosh-Air
Venture including streaming audio of the approach frequency
--
Surfing the Web from Hopkinsville, KY
Visit my web site at: http://www.geocities.com/hester-hoptown/RVSite/
RV7A Working on the wings :-)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Garth Shearing" <garth(at)Islandnet.com> |
My old instructor referred to a coordinated side slip as one where roll
(aileron) and opposite yaw (rudder) are applied so that track does not
change. Maybe the term is incorrect or confusing. For example, this is
used in a flapless airplane to get a higher sink rate on final approach if
required while maintaining a constant airspeed.
The turn and bank instrument will show the turn needle on one side and the
ball on the opposite side. As a result of the applied yaw, the heading will
change (not shown by the GPS) but the actual track remains the same as shown
by the GPS. The turn needle position will not be repeated on the GPS
either.
I hope this is clearer.
Garth Shearing
VariEze and 80% RV6A
Victoria BC Canada
> I agreed with almost everything a previous poster said, but with all good
> intentions I must agree with this comment he made:
> -------
> If you put an airplane into a descending coordinated sideslip, your
> gyro-type instruments will show a bank and yaw at the same time, with no
> change in direction, and the VSI will show the rate of descent. The GPS
> receiver cannot show you the bank and yaw.
> --------
> There is no such thing as a coordinated side slip. If you hold the plane
> yawed with the rudder, the turn coordinator will betray you. If you
> coordinate the turn, the GPS will show a heading change which you could
> infer as banked wings. There is no way around it.
>
> Like I said, I agree with most everything else written by this gentleman.
> All of the info is derivative info. By the way it is no diferent than the
> info presented by a 195, 3 pilot, or 295. It just has a marketing spin.
> All offer altitude, groundspeed and heading info. The rate of climb and
> turn and bank indicators on the 196 are just derivatives of alt and
heading
> info. No magic, no new info.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "3 rotor" <rv8r300(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Firewall forward |
I don't see where a gravity feed oil return line and a pressurized fuel line
are interpreted as similar. Granted, the failure of either one will
eventually lead to engine stoppage, but, the fuel line is FAR more
important. I believe the oil return lines are linked to the sump via small
sections of rubber hose. Vibration wise, this would be different than a
solid plumbed line, I would guess.
I might add that when building your plumbing for your engine, don't
think that it would be smart to make everything the absolute shortest it can
be in order to save weight. This is a bad place to try to save weight.
Lines need length to assure there isn't tension when tightened, and some
extra length comes in handy when you decide to reroute or repair a worn end.
DAMHIK (don't ask me how I know!) Kevin -6A 800+hrs
----- Original Message -----
From: "Garth Shearing" <garth(at)Islandnet.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Firewall forward
>
> I don't have our 0360 in front of me at the moment, but isn't Lycoming
using
> aluminum tubes as oil return lines from the rockers to sump? If so, this
is
> a similar application.
>
> Garth Shearing
> VariEze and 80% RV6A
> Victoria BC Canada
>
> > In a message dated 7/24/02 7:50:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> > martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au writes:
> >
> > << Seems like a quiet day on the list so I will ask this question.
> > I am doing the firwall forward thing at present, and measuring up for
> > fuel and oil hoses. Given that the fuel pump and carb are solidly fixed
> > to the engine (O-320) with no relative movement, is there any reason
> > why a firesleeved aluminum fuel pipe could not be run between them,
> > instead of the usual flexible Aeroquip-type hose ?
> >
> > Cheers
> > Martin in Oz - where the sheep are nervous >>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Firewall forward |
Hi Garth,
Yes, a vaguely similar application but far different:
Not carrying fuel.
Carrying a lower volume and flow rate.
Very short runs.
Mounted at ends in rubber which tends to absorb the dreaded vibration .
Jim in Kelowna
>
> I don't have our 0360 in front of me at the moment, but isn't Lycoming
using
> aluminum tubes as oil return lines from the rockers to sump? If so, this
is
> a similar application.
>
> Garth Shearing
> VariEze and 80% RV6A
> Victoria BC Canada
>
> > In a message dated 7/24/02 7:50:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> > martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au writes:
> >
> > << Seems like a quiet day on the list so I will ask this question.
> > I am doing the firwall forward thing at present, and measuring up for
> > fuel and oil hoses. Given that the fuel pump and carb are solidly fixed
> > to the engine (O-320) with no relative movement, is there any reason
> > why a firesleeved aluminum fuel pipe could not be run between them,
> > instead of the usual flexible Aeroquip-type hose ?
> >
> > Cheers
> > Martin in Oz - where the sheep are nervous >>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Hawkins <lhawkins(at)giant.com> |
| Subject: | Firewall forward |
My tech advisor who is an A&P with IA said to never use aluminum for fuel
lines in fire wall forward.
Larry Hawkins, RV-4 Farmington, NM, N-345SL, finishing.
-----Original Message-----
From: Martin Hone [mailto:martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au]
Subject: RV-List: Firewall forward
Seems like a quiet day on the list so I will ask this question.
I am doing the firwall forward thing at present, and measuring up for
fuel and oil hoses. Given that the fuel pump and carb are solidly fixed
to the engine (O-320) with no relative movement, is there any reason
why a firesleeved aluminum fuel pipe could not be run between them,
instead of the usual flexible Aeroquip-type hose ?
Cheers
Martin in Oz - where the sheep are nervous
RE: RV-List: Firewall forward
My tech advisor who is an AP with IA said to
never use aluminum for fuel lines in fire wall forward.
Larry Hawkins, RV-4 Farmington, NM, N-345SL,
finishing.
-----Original Message-----
From: Martin Hone [<A
HREF"mailto:martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au">mailto:martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au]
Sent: July 24, 2002 5:49 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV-List: Firewall forward
-- RV-List message posted by: Martin
Hone martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au
Seems like a quiet day on the list so I will ask this
question.
I am doing the firwall forward thing at
present, and measuring up for
fuel and oil hoses. Given that the fuel pump and
carb are solidly fixed
to the engine (O-320) with no relative
movement, is there any reason
why a firesleeved aluminum fuel pipe could not be
run between them,
instead of the usual flexible Aeroquip-type hose
?
Cheers
Martin in Oz - where the sheep are nervous
http://www.matronics.com/subscription
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| Date: | Jul 25, 2002 |
| From: | Phil Sisson <sisson(at)mcleodusa.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Prestolite starter question |
Call P-lite and ask them what gear pitch this starter is for.
most cant be made to fit because of the height from mounting base to pinion.
On sky tech starters, it is about .060 difference . The ring gear can be
changed though. It would be best to trade it back in for the one you need or
buy a new one and sell that one on ebay..
phil
nauga(at)brick.net wrote:
>
> While I'm (still) waiting for local mechanics to return
> calls maybe y'all can help - I've got a nice
> yellow-tagged Prestolite starter (the big'un)
> that came with my engine but not mounted. I've
> got a 149-tooth flywheel (ring gear) and the
> starter pinion has 9 teeth. Is there an easy
> way to tell the pitch of the pinion? The starter's
> got a P-lite part no., and the Lyc. manual references
> Lycoming part nos, not Prestolite. Looks to me
> like the starter is the wrong pitch, which is why I
> had trouble mounting it.
> If it *is* the wrong pitch, what's the least painless
> way to correct it, mod the starter, replace the starter,
> or replace the ring gear?
>
> I've searched the archives, and there seems to be some
> conflicting info there. Time for another go-'round?
>
> Dave 'crosspost' Hyde
> nauga(at)brick.net
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Irvine <wgirvine(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Aluminum fuel and oil lines |
> Seems like a quiet day on the list so I will ask
> this question.
> I am doing the firwall forward thing at present, and
> measuring up for fuel and oil hoses. Given that the
> fuel pump and carb are solidly fixed to the engine
> (O-320) with no relative movement, is there any
> reason why a firesleeved aluminum fuel pipe could
> not be run between them, instead of the usual
> flexible Aeroquip-type hose ?
I don't claim to be an expert, but as an aerospace
engineer and an A&P, let me assure you that this is a
VERY bad idea. The engine actually moves quite a bit.
The shaking at start-up/shut-down, and vibratiion
while running will very quickly fatique and crack the
aluminum lines. It won't be a matter of "500 hours",
it will be more like 25 hours. Maybe less.
And for the other poster who wondered if this wasn't
the same thing as the Lycoming rocker box oil return
lines... no, it's not the same at all. These oil
return lines are mounted at both ends to the engine,
so therefore practically no movement.
While "The Flaming RV" might be an interesting stunt
show, I don't think this is what you had in mind.
Please don't even think of using aluminum line instead
of rubber hose between the engine and structure.
Bill Irvine
C-310
http://health.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
| Subject: | Firewall forward |
The oil return lines are joined to the engine through a section of rubber
hose.
The prop governor line, however, is connected from the back of the engine to
the front.
It is a high pressure line which I believe is stainless steel.
Ed Cole
RV6A N2169D Flying
RV6A N648RV Finishing
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Garth Shearing [SMTP:garth(at)Islandnet.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 7:41 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Firewall forward
>
>
> I don't have our 0360 in front of me at the moment, but isn't Lycoming
> using
> aluminum tubes as oil return lines from the rockers to sump? If so, this
> is
> a similar application.
>
> Garth Shearing
> VariEze and 80% RV6A
> Victoria BC Canada
>
> > In a message dated 7/24/02 7:50:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> > martin.hone(at)tradergroup.com.au writes:
> >
> > << Seems like a quiet day on the list so I will ask this question.
> > I am doing the firwall forward thing at present, and measuring up for
> > fuel and oil hoses. Given that the fuel pump and carb are solidly fixed
> > to the engine (O-320) with no relative movement, is there any reason
> > why a firesleeved aluminum fuel pipe could not be run between them,
> > instead of the usual flexible Aeroquip-type hose ?
> >
> > Cheers
> > Martin in Oz - where the sheep are nervous >>
>
>
>
>
>
Maxim Home Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com
Products Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
New Products:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
Datasheets:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
The information contained in this message is confidential
and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
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or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "D. Wayne Stiles" <dwstiles(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | bigger engines in RVs |
My buddy and I are about to take the plunge and start our RV7 this fall.
I've been reading all the "tools" posts with avid interest, particularly any
used tool sets that become available. He's at Oshkosh--I couldn't go this
year and I would not be shocked to find that he's ordered the tailfeathers
kit while up there, especially if Vans is using the 7 for demo rides this
year.
Eventually we plan on putting it on floats and will be building it with that
in mind. Because of the extra drag etc they will cause we are interested in
something more than a 200hp 360 engine. We have looked at the various alt
engines, Subbies and Mazdas as well as the Ford & Chev v6 & small v8
packages. Nothing seems quite "right" at this time. We are contemplating
the use of a 540 and would be interested in hearing form or corresponding
with anyone who has hung a 540 on their RV6. I know we are a year or two
out from the point where it will be needed but we tend to do a lot of
thinking, research and planning before we jump. Any information or advice
would be very appreciated. D. Wayne Stiles
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: bigger engines in RVs |
In a message dated 7/25/02 11:52:01 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
dwstiles(at)hotmail.com writes:
<< Eventually we plan on putting it on floats and will be building it with
that
in mind. Because of the extra drag etc they will cause we are interested in
something more than a 200hp 360 engine. We have looked at the various alt
engines, Subbies and Mazdas as well as the Ford & Chev v6 & small v8
packages. Nothing seems quite "right" at this time. We are contemplating
the use of a 540 and would be interested in hearing form or corresponding
with anyone who has hung a 540 on their RV6. I know we are a year or two
out from the point where it will be needed but we tend to do a lot of
thinking, research and planning before we jump. Any information or advice
would be very appreciated. D. Wayne Stiles >>
There was an extensive article 2-3 years ago in Sport Aviation on a modified
RV-6 with an IO540. The key here is MODIFIED. They replaced many of the
fuselage skins with heavier skins, lengthened the rear fuselage, modified the
wings, and made many more changes in an effort to make the airplane match an
engine it wasn't designed for.
Tom Hallendorf was the builder of that airplane. Here's a 3 year old e-mail
address for him. I have no idea if it is good today: n888th(at)flash.net
By the way, if you're really interested in floats, I believe there are better
airframes than the short winged RV's. Because of induced drag, the short
wing RV's are very draggy in low speed flight, and floats will make that
situation worse. Eustace Bowhay, who sometimes comments in this space, could
offer advice on how suitable RV's are for floats. He built one. His e-mail
is: ebowhay(at)jetstream.net
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gannon, Terence" <Terence.Gannon(at)trican.ca> |
Listers -- I'm trying to plan finances a little, and I'm putting together a
budget for the engine...as a point of reference, I'm using all new prices
from the Van's catalogue. I was just wondering if there was any major
expense that I'm missing. Comments welcome and appreciated!
Pt. No. Description
Cost
EA O-360-A1A Lycoming, 180 HP $
21,850
PROP C2YK Hartzell Constant Speed Prop $
4,975
FF-7 O-360 Firewall Forward Installation Kit $
4,275
Total, US Dollars
$ 31,100
Total, Canadian Dollars
>$1,000,000
Terry in Calgary
RV-6 S/N 24414
"Wings"
PS. Note, this is really not intended to open/re-open the debate on O-320
vs. O-360, new vs. overhauled, fixed pitch vs. constant speed, etc. or any
of that. It's really more just a question of establishing a target cost,
which will allow me to come up with a plan to meet the cost over the
completion of the remaining work. Thanx again..
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "3 rotor" <rv8r300(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: bigger engines in RVs |
it's been done, but low wing planes make lousy float planes, something about
wings and docks and no brakes. A Glastar or Murphy Rebel/Moose would make a
better float plane. There are several 540-s at this point, although the
engineering of them has various opinions. Kevin
----- Original Message -----
From: "D. Wayne Stiles" <dwstiles(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: bigger engines in RVs
>
> My buddy and I are about to take the plunge and start our RV7 this fall.
> I've been reading all the "tools" posts with avid interest, particularly
any
> used tool sets that become available. He's at Oshkosh--I couldn't go this
> year and I would not be shocked to find that he's ordered the tailfeathers
> kit while up there, especially if Vans is using the 7 for demo rides this
> year.
>
> Eventually we plan on putting it on floats and will be building it with
that
> in mind. Because of the extra drag etc they will cause we are interested
in
> something more than a 200hp 360 engine. We have looked at the various alt
> engines, Subbies and Mazdas as well as the Ford & Chev v6 & small v8
> packages. Nothing seems quite "right" at this time. We are contemplating
> the use of a 540 and would be interested in hearing form or corresponding
> with anyone who has hung a 540 on their RV6. I know we are a year or two
> out from the point where it will be needed but we tend to do a lot of
> thinking, research and planning before we jump. Any information or
advice
> would be very appreciated. D. Wayne Stiles
>
>
> MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
> http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wilson, James Mike" <james.mike.wilson(at)intel.com> |
| Subject: | bigger engines in RVs |
You may want to seek out John Harmon (Harmon Rocket II, RV4 with IO540). He
can probably help you understand concerns and give ideas.
Wilson RV-4, 200HP
-----Original Message-----
From: D. Wayne Stiles [mailto:dwstiles(at)hotmail.com]
Subject: RV-List: bigger engines in RVs
My buddy and I are about to take the plunge and start our RV7 this fall.
I've been reading all the "tools" posts with avid interest, particularly any
used tool sets that become available. He's at Oshkosh--I couldn't go this
year and I would not be shocked to find that he's ordered the tailfeathers
kit while up there, especially if Vans is using the 7 for demo rides this
year.
Eventually we plan on putting it on floats and will be building it with that
in mind. Because of the extra drag etc they will cause we are interested in
something more than a 200hp 360 engine. We have looked at the various alt
engines, Subbies and Mazdas as well as the Ford & Chev v6 & small v8
packages. Nothing seems quite "right" at this time. We are contemplating
the use of a 540 and would be interested in hearing form or corresponding
with anyone who has hung a 540 on their RV6. I know we are a year or two
out from the point where it will be needed but we tend to do a lot of
thinking, research and planning before we jump. Any information or advice
would be very appreciated. D. Wayne Stiles
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Budget |
> It's really more just a question of establishing a target cost,
> which will allow me to come up with a plan to meet the cost over the
> completion of the remaining work. Thanx again..
Whatever you come up with, double it - and you'll get close.
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX
-6 N140RV (Reserved)
FWF
http://health.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bartrim, Todd" <sbartrim(at)mail.canfor.ca> |
| Subject: | bigger engines in RVs |
Hi Wayne;
When I began my project, floats were ( & still are) my main
objective. I was looking at the RV-6 (there was no "7") as the "9" was
considered to be the "little brother". After speaking with Eustace Bowhay
who has put his "6" on floats, he expressed his opinion that the "9" would
be far better suited for use on floats, so I went down & took a close look
at the factory "9". It was easy to see that it was no little brother to any
of the other RV's. I bought my kit & am just finishing it now. I hope to fly
this fall & begin work on floats next winter. As Kyle has suggested there
are better airframes for floats, if that is all you want, but I wanted also
wanted a plane that would make a great cross country cruiser with economical
operation. The RV-9 is a great compromise. Eustace monitors this list, so he
will likely offer some of his own advice.
As far as the larger engine, Boyd ?___?, has put a 540 in his "6",
so maybe he can give a little info. I am using the Mazda rotary and expect
180-200 hp with a turbo for normalization only (live in the mountains). This
is greater than Van's recommended max of 160hp, but for T/O performance on
floats I wanted a little more (attn. list police -- save your breath, I've
already heard it). I feel that this will be far more than enough, and I have
extra fuel capacity to pack around as well. If you really want more the 13B
rotary can be reliably turbo charged to 250hp. Or you can use the 20B, but
even I feel this is a little much for this airframe.
You will undoubtedly get advice to use another plane for floats,
such as Murphy, but the "Moose' for example is far more expensive to build &
operate. While it would make a great commercial bush plane, this is not
permitted in the experimental category, not to mention that Murphy's
customer service really sucks & I've heard bad things about the kit quality
from a local builder (I'm Canadian & would like to be proud of a Canadian
product, I'm afraid that their attitude towards the customer is terrible).
For the best advice on the float issue, you would be best to ignore most
advice from this list (including mine) & talk directly to Eustace Bowhay.
Good Luck
S. Todd Bartrim
13B rotary powered
RV-9endurance (finish kit)
C-FSTB (reserved)
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
> -----Original Message-----
> From: KBoatri144(at)aol.com [SMTP:KBoatri144(at)aol.com]
> Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 9:09 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: bigger engines in RVs
>
>
> In a message dated 7/25/02 11:52:01 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> dwstiles(at)hotmail.com writes:
>
> << Eventually we plan on putting it on floats and will be building it with
>
> that
> in mind. Because of the extra drag etc they will cause we are interested
> in
> something more than a 200hp 360 engine. We have looked at the various
> alt
> engines, Subbies and Mazdas as well as the Ford & Chev v6 & small v8
> packages. Nothing seems quite "right" at this time. We are
> contemplating
> the use of a 540 and would be interested in hearing form or corresponding
>
> with anyone who has hung a 540 on their RV6. I know we are a year or two
>
> out from the point where it will be needed but we tend to do a lot of
> thinking, research and planning before we jump. Any information or
> advice
> would be very appreciated. D. Wayne Stiles >>
>
> There was an extensive article 2-3 years ago in Sport Aviation on a
> modified
> RV-6 with an IO540. The key here is MODIFIED. They replaced many of the
> fuselage skins with heavier skins, lengthened the rear fuselage, modified
> the
> wings, and made many more changes in an effort to make the airplane match
> an
> engine it wasn't designed for.
>
> Tom Hallendorf was the builder of that airplane. Here's a 3 year old
> e-mail
> address for him. I have no idea if it is good today: n888th(at)flash.net
>
> By the way, if you're really interested in floats, I believe there are
> better
> airframes than the short winged RV's. Because of induced drag, the short
> wing RV's are very draggy in low speed flight, and floats will make that
> situation worse. Eustace Bowhay, who sometimes comments in this space,
> could
> offer advice on how suitable RV's are for floats. He built one. His
> e-mail
> is: ebowhay(at)jetstream.net
>
>
> Kyle Boatright
> 0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
> Kennesaw, GA
> http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Boyd C. Braem" <bcbraem(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: bigger engines in RVs |
The Sport Aviation article on the Super 6 is 12/98. Bart Dalton and John Nys
built the RV-6 Plus, a 4-seater with a stock I0-540 (Kitplanes, 8/99). Tom
Hallendorf and his aeronautical engineering buddies did a superb job designing
the Super 6. I had to replace the 0.016 elevator and rudder skins with 0.020
because they were cracking from the vibration and prop wash during engine
run-up. However, with the modifications, the aircraft IS DESIGNED for a
high-horsepower I0-540 and the combination of the two is pure Kismet. Destined
by the Gods. Ecstasy, Oh, Ecstasy!!! Who needs a wife! After 400 hrs I still
get the same thrill (well, almost) as strapping on a Navy jet. People who have
ridden in the Super 6 not only get the RV "grin" but they get the Super 6 "jaw
drop".
It would be much harder to put a -540 in a -7 because all the
pre-built/pre-drilled parts would make it more difficult to modify the airframe.
If I were starting a new project, today, I would go with a 20B Mazda rotary with
turbos.
See Tracy Crook's stuff: http://www.rotaryaviation.com
Tom Hallendorf: thallendorf(at)yahoo.com (look him up on a Google search--he's
also an accomplished mountain climber)
Also, contact Tom Whelan: WFACTO1(at)aol.com (he's on the List) about putting an
I0-540 in an -8.
As Kyle mentioned, Eustace Bowhay is THE source for info on RV-6 on floats.
http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/amphib.htm
There are quite a few float planes flying with 200 hp or less.
If you want to reduce low speed drag in a RV, vortex generators are the
ticket--plus much better aileron control.
Boyd
RV-Super 6
KBoatri144(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 7/25/02 11:52:01 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> dwstiles(at)hotmail.com writes:
>
> << Eventually we plan on putting it on floats and will be building it with
> that
> in mind. Because of the extra drag etc they will cause we are interested in
> something more than a 200hp 360 engine. We have looked at the various alt
> engines, Subbies and Mazdas as well as the Ford & Chev v6 & small v8
> packages. Nothing seems quite "right" at this time. We are contemplating
> the use of a 540 and would be interested in hearing form or corresponding
> with anyone who has hung a 540 on their RV6. I know we are a year or two
> out from the point where it will be needed but we tend to do a lot of
> thinking, research and planning before we jump. Any information or advice
> would be very appreciated. D. Wayne Stiles >>
>
> There was an extensive article 2-3 years ago in Sport Aviation on a modified
> RV-6 with an IO540. The key here is MODIFIED. They replaced many of the
> fuselage skins with heavier skins, lengthened the rear fuselage, modified the
> wings, and made many more changes in an effort to make the airplane match an
> engine it wasn't designed for.
>
> Tom Hallendorf was the builder of that airplane. Here's a 3 year old e-mail
> address for him. I have no idea if it is good today: n888th(at)flash.net
>
> By the way, if you're really interested in floats, I believe there are better
> airframes than the short winged RV's. Because of induced drag, the short
> wing RV's are very draggy in low speed flight, and floats will make that
> situation worse. Eustace Bowhay, who sometimes comments in this space, could
> offer advice on how suitable RV's are for floats. He built one. His e-mail
> is: ebowhay(at)jetstream.net
>
> Kyle Boatright
> 0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
> Kennesaw, GA
> http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Budget |
Don't forget avionics. Even vacuum gyros are a bit spendy for new, engine
gages add some and radios take it over the top. I agree, make a budget,
tell the wife that's all it will cost and then plan on spending much, much
more.
Albert Gardner
Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
Working on firewall forward
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Budget |
Hi Terry,
I know that your question was aimed at estimating engine costs. I have
included some other info as well as my try at an answer for your question:
Some items that will grab the budget and give it a shake:
Paint- materials plus labor if you decide to hire out the job, prices range
a lot. Decals can cut this cost a bit
Upholstery- do your own or go for the best, again the price range is an
option.
Radios, transponders and electronics in general- VFR. low end cost, IFR high
end, pricey.
Instruments- the costs here will tie into the above VFR IFR choice.
Wiring- all the latest do-dads will add to this cost as well.
Optional engine equipment- Electronic ignition, full flow oil filter,
Inverted oil system, fuel injection etc.
Optional piloting aids- Portable Nav-Com, Headsets, standard or ANR, A
portable palmtop or PDA with lots of flight oriented programs and more stuff
I'm forgetting at the moment.
As you can see, after the dust settles the budget will reflect your
preferences. For this reason estimating a finished RV project is right next
door to guessing for most folks.
This is only a hunch, I think the majority of builders opt for night flight
capability. It might be wise to plan on that as a starting point, this will
offer a reasonable cross country ride with optimum safety and can be added
to later per choice. At any rate, pricing out using this as a base line
should get you onto the target area budget wise.
It is not uncommon for engines to come available at prices that will make
room in the budget for the better instruments or what have you.
Bart lalonde at aero(at)mail.ocis.net will be sure to treat you right should
you find a core engine to rebuild or a low timer that just needs checking
out.
If after research you find this idea to be the way to go, he will build you
a Superior O-360-A1A with some extras for a very good price.
Keep in mind that I never Make misstreaks;
I'm not sure what aircraft you are planning on building but it seems to me
that the $1,000,000 Canadian should just about do the job!. That is if you
plan on building your own airport to go with the aircraft.{:-)!!!
I'm sure you meant to budget less than that, unless of course the bottom
really fell out of the Loonie today. Yikes! What a thought!!!!
Anyhow the total project budget for an RV8 should ballpark near but below
$100,000 our "metric bucks"
I hope this helps,
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gannon, Terence" <Terence.Gannon(at)trican.ca>
Subject: RV-List: Engine Budget
>
> Listers -- I'm trying to plan finances a little, and I'm putting together
a
> budget for the engine...as a point of reference, I'm using all new prices
> from the Van's catalogue. I was just wondering if there was any major
> expense that I'm missing. Comments welcome and appreciated!
>
> Pt. No. Description
> Cost
>
> EA O-360-A1A Lycoming, 180 HP
$
> 21,850
> PROP C2YK Hartzell Constant Speed Prop
$
> 4,975
> FF-7 O-360 Firewall Forward Installation Kit
$
> 4,275
>
> Total, US Dollars
> $ 31,100
> Total, Canadian Dollars
> >$1,000,000
>
> Terry in Calgary
> RV-6 S/N 24414
> "Wings"
>
> PS. Note, this is really not intended to open/re-open the debate on O-320
> vs. O-360, new vs. overhauled, fixed pitch vs. constant speed, etc. or any
> of that. It's really more just a question of establishing a target cost,
> which will allow me to come up with a plan to meet the cost over the
> completion of the remaining work. Thanx again..
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Taylor" <david(at)hom.net> |
Thanks to everyone who gave me advice about tools. Sounds like it can get
pretty expensive. I am slowly building my tool box and I think I'll be able
to borrow some of the more expensive tools.
-David Taylor
RV-7 tail
feathers (wanna be :) )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Taylor" <david(at)hom.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Budget |
>>FF-7 O-360 Firewall Forward Installation Kit
$4,275
Is this an extra kit you need to buy on top of the finishing kit? If I buy
an engine with all accessories will I need this kit? I checked Vans site but
I don't see the information on this kit.
-David Taylor
RV-7 tailfeathers (wanna
be :) )
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gannon, Terence" <Terence.Gannon(at)trican.ca>
Subject: RV-List: Engine Budget
>
> Listers -- I'm trying to plan finances a little, and I'm putting together
a
> budget for the engine...as a point of reference, I'm using all new prices
> from the Van's catalogue. I was just wondering if there was any major
> expense that I'm missing. Comments welcome and appreciated!
>
> Pt. No. Description
> Cost
>
> EA O-360-A1A Lycoming, 180 HP
$
> 21,850
> PROP C2YK Hartzell Constant Speed Prop
$
> 4,975
> FF-7 O-360 Firewall Forward Installation Kit
$
> 4,275
>
> Total, US Dollars
> $ 31,100
> Total, Canadian Dollars
> >$1,000,000
>
> Terry in Calgary
> RV-6 S/N 24414
> "Wings"
>
> PS. Note, this is really not intended to open/re-open the debate on O-320
> vs. O-360, new vs. overhauled, fixed pitch vs. constant speed, etc. or any
> of that. It's really more just a question of establishing a target cost,
> which will allow me to come up with a plan to meet the cost over the
> completion of the remaining work. Thanx again..
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "3 rotor" <rv8r300(at)attbi.com> |
I was looking at the latest plane being built over at Emerald
Aircrafters, a Glasair III. It has molded flex lines, where the lines,
instead of the firesleeve, are molded with a solid blue silicon. They
look real nice and very durable. They said that the entire set ran
around $250 for maybe 8 hoses. Inside they are the std s/s flex hoses.
Definitely don't have the WWII look like mine, where I got surplus
firesleeve dirt cheap. Kevin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mike Thompson <grobdriver(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Budget |
--- David Taylor wrote:
>
> >>FF-7 O-360 Firewall Forward Installation Kit
> $4,275
>
> Is this an extra kit you need to buy on top of the finishing kit? If
> I buy
> an engine with all accessories will I need this kit?
Oh yes. This and more. This kit will get you all the "little" things
that others of us ordered separately, sometimes as we needed them
because we didn't know we needed them.
Hoses, clamps, fittings, oil cooler, electric goodies, cables, more
fittings, fuel sleeve, clamps, did I mention fittings? Hoses, baffle
kit, more clamps, cabin heat flapper, more fittings.
The kit will help avoid getting on a first name basis with the UPS
driver, having to bookmark ACS or Chief or whomever you like, wearing
out your VISA card, $200.00 per on-line visit (they make it so easy!).
This way you can just get an equity loan and be done with it.
Mike Thompson
Austin, TX
-6 N140RV (Reserved)
FWF
http://health.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis" <mike(at)bmnellis.com> |
| Subject: | Re: bigger engines in RVs |
And if you want to see what an RV6 on steroids looks like have a gander at
the following link. A shave is probably needed though (Boyd not the RV :) )
http://bmnellis.com/FlyIns/Florida%20RV's.htm
Mike
>
> The Sport Aviation article on the Super 6 is 12/98. Bart Dalton and John
Nys
> built the RV-6 Plus, a 4-seater with a stock I0-540 (Kitplanes, 8/99).
Tom
> Hallendorf and his aeronautical engineering buddies did a superb job
designing
> the Super 6. I had to replace the 0.016 elevator and rudder skins with
0.020
> because they were cracking from the vibration and prop wash during engine
> run-up. However, with the modifications, the aircraft IS DESIGNED for a
> high-horsepower I0-540 and the combination of the two is pure Kismet.
Destined
> by the Gods. Ecstasy, Oh, Ecstasy!!! Who needs a wife! After 400 hrs I
still
> get the same thrill (well, almost) as strapping on a Navy jet. People who
have
> ridden in the Super 6 not only get the RV "grin" but they get the Super 6
"jaw
> drop".
>
> It would be much harder to put a -540 in a -7 because all the
> pre-built/pre-drilled parts would make it more difficult to modify the
airframe.
>
> If I were starting a new project, today, I would go with a 20B Mazda
rotary with
> turbos.
> See Tracy Crook's stuff: http://www.rotaryaviation.com
> Tom Hallendorf: thallendorf(at)yahoo.com (look him up on a Google
search--he's
> also an accomplished mountain climber)
> Also, contact Tom Whelan: WFACTO1(at)aol.com (he's on the List) about
putting an
> I0-540 in an -8.
> As Kyle mentioned, Eustace Bowhay is THE source for info on RV-6 on
floats.
> http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/amphib.htm
>
> There are quite a few float planes flying with 200 hp or less.
>
> If you want to reduce low speed drag in a RV, vortex generators are the
> ticket--plus much better aileron control.
>
> Boyd
> RV-Super 6
>
>
> KBoatri144(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> >
> > In a message dated 7/25/02 11:52:01 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> > dwstiles(at)hotmail.com writes:
> >
> > << Eventually we plan on putting it on floats and will be building it
with
> > that
> > in mind. Because of the extra drag etc they will cause we are
interested in
> > something more than a 200hp 360 engine. We have looked at the various
alt
> > engines, Subbies and Mazdas as well as the Ford & Chev v6 & small v8
> > packages. Nothing seems quite "right" at this time. We are
contemplating
> > the use of a 540 and would be interested in hearing form or
corresponding
> > with anyone who has hung a 540 on their RV6. I know we are a year or
two
> > out from the point where it will be needed but we tend to do a lot of
> > thinking, research and planning before we jump. Any information or
advice
> > would be very appreciated. D. Wayne Stiles >>
> >
> > There was an extensive article 2-3 years ago in Sport Aviation on a
modified
> > RV-6 with an IO540. The key here is MODIFIED. They replaced many of
the
> > fuselage skins with heavier skins, lengthened the rear fuselage,
modified the
> > wings, and made many more changes in an effort to make the airplane
match an
> > engine it wasn't designed for.
> >
> > Tom Hallendorf was the builder of that airplane. Here's a 3 year old
e-mail
> > address for him. I have no idea if it is good today: n888th(at)flash.net
> >
> > By the way, if you're really interested in floats, I believe there are
better
> > airframes than the short winged RV's. Because of induced drag, the
short
> > wing RV's are very draggy in low speed flight, and floats will make that
> > situation worse. Eustace Bowhay, who sometimes comments in this space,
could
> > offer advice on how suitable RV's are for floats. He built one. His
e-mail
> > is: ebowhay(at)jetstream.net
> >
> > Kyle Boatright
> > 0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
> > Kennesaw, GA
> > http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gannon, Terence" <Terence.Gannon(at)trican.ca> |
David -- if you go to Van's website, click on the online shopping link, and
then download the accessories catalogue, it's virtually the first thing in
the book. As they say in the catalogue, it's supposed to be the (long) list
of things you need (beside the engine and prop, of course) that you require
to complete FWF. I guess in a way, that's really the question I'm
asking...for those of you who have been through the process, is Van's FWF
kit really complete, or should I assume additional powerplant related costs
in addition to this kit. The page in the accessories catalogue has a very
detailed listing of what's included, and it looks complete, but...y'know how
it goes.
Thanks to all that have responded so far...it's all very helpful
information. Best regards...
Terry in Calgary
RV-6 S/N 24414
"Wings (Final Top Skin on Right Wing)
-----Original Message-----
From: David Taylor
Subject: Re: RV-List: Engine Budget
>>FF-7 O-360 Firewall Forward Installation Kit
$4,275
Is this an extra kit you need to buy on top of the finishing kit? If I
buy
an engine with all accessories will I need this kit? I checked Vans site
but
I don't see the information on this kit.
-David Taylor
RV-7 tailfeathers
(wanna
be :) )
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | UPSAT GX60 -- 4G maximum?! |
In the specs for the UPSAT GX60 IFR GPS/Comm, it says:
"Acceleration 4G maximum"
Anybody know what the deal is with this? Is this horizontal acceleration?
)_( Dan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Albert Gardner" <albert.gardner(at)worldnet.att.net> |
The FWF kit for the RV-9A was very complete. It was not available when I
started finishing my 9A and so I had already bought some of the items such
as FAB, spinner, etc. When I ordered the FWF kit I asked Van's to deduct the
specific items I had previously purchased and they did.
Albert Gardner
Yuma, AZ
RV-9A: N872RV (Reserved)
Working on firewall forward
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ian Scott" <jabiru22(at)yahoo.com.au> |
| Subject: | Re: bigger engines in RVs |
what about a turbo 360?
----- Original Message -----
From: <KBoatri144(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: bigger engines in RVs
>
> In a message dated 7/25/02 11:52:01 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> dwstiles(at)hotmail.com writes:
>
> << Eventually we plan on putting it on floats and will be building it with
> that
> in mind. Because of the extra drag etc they will cause we are interested
in
> something more than a 200hp 360 engine. We have looked at the various
alt
> engines, Subbies and Mazdas as well as the Ford & Chev v6 & small v8
> packages. Nothing seems quite "right" at this time. We are
contemplating
> the use of a 540 and would be interested in hearing form or corresponding
> with anyone who has hung a 540 on their RV6. I know we are a year or two
> out from the point where it will be needed but we tend to do a lot of
> thinking, research and planning before we jump. Any information or
advice
> would be very appreciated. D. Wayne Stiles >>
>
> There was an extensive article 2-3 years ago in Sport Aviation on a
modified
> RV-6 with an IO540. The key here is MODIFIED. They replaced many of the
> fuselage skins with heavier skins, lengthened the rear fuselage, modified
the
> wings, and made many more changes in an effort to make the airplane match
an
> engine it wasn't designed for.
>
> Tom Hallendorf was the builder of that airplane. Here's a 3 year old
e-mail
> address for him. I have no idea if it is good today: n888th(at)flash.net
>
> By the way, if you're really interested in floats, I believe there are
better
> airframes than the short winged RV's. Because of induced drag, the short
> wing RV's are very draggy in low speed flight, and floats will make that
> situation worse. Eustace Bowhay, who sometimes comments in this space,
could
> offer advice on how suitable RV's are for floats. He built one. His
e-mail
> is: ebowhay(at)jetstream.net
>
>
> Kyle Boatright
> 0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
> Kennesaw, GA
> http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
>
>
- Get the best out of your PC!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "davefried" <davefried(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aluminum fuel and oil lines |
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Irvine <wgirvine(at)yahoo.com>
Subject: RV-List: Aluminum fuel and oil lines
>
>
> > Seems like a quiet day on the list so I will ask
> > this question.
> > I am doing the firwall forward thing at present, and
> > measuring up for fuel and oil hoses. Given that the
> > fuel pump and carb are solidly fixed to the engine
> > (O-320) with no relative movement, is there any
> > reason why a firesleeved aluminum fuel pipe could
> > not be run between them, instead of the usual
> > flexible Aeroquip-type hose ?
>
> I don't claim to be an expert, but as an aerospace
> engineer and an A&P, let me assure you that this is a
> VERY bad idea. The engine actually moves quite a bit.
> The shaking at start-up/shut-down, and vibratiion
> while running will very quickly fatique and crack the
> aluminum lines. It won't be a matter of "500 hours",
> it will be more like 25 hours. Maybe less.
>
> And for the other poster who wondered if this wasn't
> the same thing as the Lycoming rocker box oil return
> lines... no, it's not the same at all. These oil
> return lines are mounted at both ends to the engine,
> so therefore practically no movement.
>
> While "The Flaming RV" might be an interesting stunt
> show, I don't think this is what you had in mind.
> Please don't even think of using aluminum line instead
> of rubber hose between the engine and structure.
>
> Bill Irvine
> C-310
>
> http://health.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Budget |
FWIW, I'll probably only build one airplane in my lifetime. And I plan on
having the plane for the rest of my life. If I spread the cost out over
time, it's not too painful. Unfortunately, people that sell avionics,
tools, Lycomings, etc. operate where they want their money now, not ten
years from now. Having said all of this, I opened a line of credit on the
equity in my house. I can write checks as I need to. Yes, I'm going into
debt . . . but I figure this allows me to finish my project and have a plane
now, not twenty years from now. So, bottom line on this lengthy message, if
there's a way to find a source of funding, do so . . . create the
plane/panel/engine/prop, etc. that you'll be pleased with. Good luck.
Rick Jory RV8A
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Jewell <jjewell(at)telus.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Engine Budget
>
> Hi Terry,
>
> I know that your question was aimed at estimating engine costs. I have
> included some other info as well as my try at an answer for your question:
>
> Some items that will grab the budget and give it a shake:
>
> Paint- materials plus labor if you decide to hire out the job, prices
range
> a lot. Decals can cut this cost a bit
> Upholstery- do your own or go for the best, again the price range is an
> option.
> Radios, transponders and electronics in general- VFR. low end cost, IFR
high
> end, pricey.
> Instruments- the costs here will tie into the above VFR IFR choice.
> Wiring- all the latest do-dads will add to this cost as well.
> Optional engine equipment- Electronic ignition, full flow oil filter,
> Inverted oil system, fuel injection etc.
> Optional piloting aids- Portable Nav-Com, Headsets, standard or ANR, A
> portable palmtop or PDA with lots of flight oriented programs and more
stuff
> I'm forgetting at the moment.
>
> As you can see, after the dust settles the budget will reflect your
> preferences. For this reason estimating a finished RV project is right
next
> door to guessing for most folks.
> This is only a hunch, I think the majority of builders opt for night
flight
> capability. It might be wise to plan on that as a starting point, this
will
> offer a reasonable cross country ride with optimum safety and can be added
> to later per choice. At any rate, pricing out using this as a base line
> should get you onto the target area budget wise.
>
> It is not uncommon for engines to come available at prices that will make
> room in the budget for the better instruments or what have you.
>
>
> Bart lalonde at aero(at)mail.ocis.net will be sure to treat you right should
> you find a core engine to rebuild or a low timer that just needs checking
> out.
> If after research you find this idea to be the way to go, he will build
you
> a Superior O-360-A1A with some extras for a very good price.
>
> Keep in mind that I never Make misstreaks;
> I'm not sure what aircraft you are planning on building but it seems to me
> that the $1,000,000 Canadian should just about do the job!. That is if you
> plan on building your own airport to go with the aircraft.{:-)!!!
> I'm sure you meant to budget less than that, unless of course the bottom
> really fell out of the Loonie today. Yikes! What a thought!!!!
>
> Anyhow the total project budget for an RV8 should ballpark near but below
> $100,000 our "metric bucks"
>
> I hope this helps,
>
> Jim in Kelowna
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gannon, Terence" <Terence.Gannon(at)trican.ca>
> To: "'RV-LIST'"
> Subject: RV-List: Engine Budget
>
>
>
> >
> > Listers -- I'm trying to plan finances a little, and I'm putting
together
> a
> > budget for the engine...as a point of reference, I'm using all new
prices
> > from the Van's catalogue. I was just wondering if there was any major
> > expense that I'm missing. Comments welcome and appreciated!
> >
> > Pt. No. Description
> > Cost
> >
> > EA O-360-A1A Lycoming, 180 HP
> $
> > 21,850
> > PROP C2YK Hartzell Constant Speed Prop
> $
> > 4,975
> > FF-7 O-360 Firewall Forward Installation Kit
> $
> > 4,275
> >
> > Total, US Dollars
> > $ 31,100
> > Total, Canadian Dollars
> > >$1,000,000
> >
> > Terry in Calgary
> > RV-6 S/N 24414
> > "Wings"
> >
> > PS. Note, this is really not intended to open/re-open the debate on
O-320
> > vs. O-360, new vs. overhauled, fixed pitch vs. constant speed, etc. or
any
> > of that. It's really more just a question of establishing a target
cost,
> > which will allow me to come up with a plan to meet the cost over the
> > completion of the remaining work. Thanx again..
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
I put a couple notes from my short visit to OSH on my website.
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
======================================
Jim wrote:
Subject: AirVenture
From: Jim Andrews (rv8apilot(at)hotmail.com)
Date: Wed Jul 24 - 12:38 PM
Where's the big coverage on AirVenture?
There is nothing new on either avweb.com or landings.com since this last
weekend.
I'm starved for NEWS!
Thx,
- Jim Andrews
rv8a.tripod.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Blue Mountain mis-information |
I recently returned from OSH and wish to correct some mis-information
that is being circulated by Greg Richter at Blue Mountain Avionics
concerning the EFIS/lite installation in my RV-6. The points I am about
to address were stated to me both by Greg himself and by Greg in his
forum which I attended Tuesday afternoon.
Greg is stating that the problems I experienced with the three
EFIS/Lites I flew in my plane were due to magnetometer installation
errors/problems. He correctly states that the magnetometer needs to be
mounted well clear of iron and electrical circuits; consequently, I
mounted the mag in the tail of the RV-6 on the horizontal deck beneath
the vertical stabilizer. This is the same location he suggested to the
audience at the OSH forum. The mag is secured with nylon cable ties. I
was concerned about the proximity to the steel tailwheel spring, but the
magnetometer worked very nicely and accurately displayed headings on the
display of the Lite.
Greg stated that the magnetometer was causing the AHRS errors I observed
in the Lites. I find this explanation a bit implausible since the AHRS
errors occurred even with the magnetometer disconnected. Matter of fact,
the first unit I had was flown before the magnetometer was even
installed! When the second unit displayed AHRS errors, I disconnected
the magnetometer, rebooted the Lite, and the AHRS errors persisted. This
error pattern was consistent and repeatable. Unit number three displayed
the same problems.
Greg was at DCU on the Friday before OSH to install new software in the
RV-6 that is flying his EFIS/One. The pilot/owner told me following a
0.5 hr test flight that it appeared the AHRS situation was greatly
improved (since he is not an instrumented-rated pilot, he hoped I would
be able to further test the AHRS soon), and I sincerely hope this is the
case. However, I am very disappointed that Greg Richter decided to place
the blame for the problems I experienced on installation/magnetometer
error.
Greg laughed off the Lite problems by making the statement at the forum
that I had thrown him a curve because I installed the Lite in a metal
plane......and his test flying was in a glass plane.
Think about that statement for a few moments!!!! ;-)
I hope the AHRS problems are indeed solved; Greg has promised me another
Lite soon. Once the unit arrives I will thoroughly test it to see if
AHRS issues remain that would effect IFR flight.
Sam Buchanan (RV-6)
"The RV Journal" http://thervjournal.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
When faced with similar decisions I keep this in mind:
You can borrow money, you can't borrow time.
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Jory
> Sent: Friday, July 26, 2002 9:21 AM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Engine Budget
>
>
>
> FWIW, I'll probably only build one airplane in my lifetime.
> And I plan on having the plane for the rest of my life. If I
> spread the cost out over time, it's not too painful.
> Unfortunately, people that sell avionics, tools, Lycomings,
> etc. operate where they want their money now, not ten years
> from now. Having said all of this, I opened a line of credit
> on the equity in my house. I can write checks as I need to.
> Yes, I'm going into debt . . . but I figure this allows me to
> finish my project and have a plane now, not twenty years from
> now. So, bottom line on this lengthy message, if there's a
> way to find a source of funding, do so . . . create the
> plane/panel/engine/prop, etc. that you'll be pleased with.
> Good luck. Rick Jory RV8A
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris & Kellie Hand" <ckhand(at)kiva.net> |
| Subject: | Re: moving wings |
Thanks to all that gave me feedback on my question below - consensus (from
Van's as well) was that I went a little overboard on the padding and that
the leading edge is plenty strong enough to support the wing.
In any case, I just returned to Indiana after delivering my 6A parts to our
home in Washington state and thought I'd get a note into the archives for
any that have to do this in the future...
I used a 6' x 12' U-Haul trailer towed w/ my F150 pickup. Wings strapped to
the walls with weight supported by leading edges (taped 4' long body
pillows, 2 each wing, to leading edges and set wings on 12" wide foam strips
sitting on floor of trailer). Got most of the fuselage parts, including
some partially assembled sections, back into the original fuselage kit
shipping crate and that slid in right between the wings. Rest of the parts
(firewall assembly, F-604 & F-605 bulkhead assemblies, and all control &
tail surfaces, etc) were wrapped in blankets and set on top of the crate or
on top of other cargo in the back of the pickup.
Got everything there and unpacked with no damage. Only problem was slight
shifting of the fuselage crate during the drive - it slid ~6 - 8 inches
backwards towards the trailer door on an upslope - should have secured it
better but as heavy as it was I didn't think it would move. Had to stop and
brace the crate better using wood pieces from the jigs.
Thanks again for your help!
Chris Hand
RV-6A
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris & Kellie Hand" <ckhand(at)kiva.net>
Subject: RV-List: moving wings
>
> I'm moving my RV6A project and am trying to decide how to package/protect
> the wings.
> I sent the note below to Van's and will see what they say, but are there
> others out there that have successfully moved RV wings by setting them in
a
> trailer/truck leading edge down?
> How are the QB wings packaged for delivery?
>
> Thanks for your input, and here's the note with the details that I sent
> Van's asking about this:
>
> I'm prepping for the 3rd x-ctry u-haul move of my RV6A project due to
> another military move (this move completes first round trip for the tail
> section as I'm moving back into my house from 2 tours ago...). This is a
> ~2500 mile trip from Indiana to Washington state.
>
> My question is on moving the wings. Last time I moved them both
> horizontally w/ bottoms resting on foam padding. This time I'd like to
> stand them up vertical against the walls of the u-haul, resting them on
the
> leading edges. Is there adequate strength in the leading edge to support
> the wing if I load and protect the wing as described below?
>
> Plan is to tape pillows along the length of leading edges (two body-length
> pillows per wing), then with padding on top & bottom sides of wing (thin
> foam b/w wing and trailer walls), set the wings leading edge down on 5" HD
> foam. The 5" foam would be 12 inch wide strips with a 5&1/2 foot length
> under the inboard 5&1/2 feet of the leading edge with another 15 inch long
> piece at the outboard end.
>
> If the leading edge down method is likely to damage the wings then I will
> find a way to do it horizontally again.
> Thanks for your help,
>
> Chris Hand
> RV-6A, #23559
> ckhand(at)kiva.net
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
Fellow Listers:
I recently read a letter to the editor in Sport Aviation referring to the
need to install a diode across a solenoid to prevent a negative spike when
the solenoid field collapses. Van's calls for such a diode installation for
the starter solenoid.
I have a small Parker Hannifin solenoid used for the electric primer on my
nearly completed -4. When I activate the solenoid and as the push button is
released, my EI engine instruments go crazy. Is this the dreaded negative
spike? If so, can one of the electrical wizards out there give this
electrical dummy some specific instructions on how to install such a diode
(if that is the problem, which I think it is). This needs to be in the
language a "pilot" understands!! (wiring connections, size of diode, where
to obtain it, etc. etc)
Many thanks
Doug Weiler
Hudson, WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Boyd C. Braem" <bcbraem(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: UPSAT GX60 -- 4G maximum?! |
"rocket-list(at)matronics.com"
Dan--
Obviously, you've never operated a high-energy particle accelerator! Ah, the
memories of Brookehaven and Switzerland at CERN. Electrons have mass (let's
say about 10 GeV (giga electron-volts) and mass is affected by gravity. We
also know that a GPS receiver is nothing more than a VERY sensitive clock.
Now, then, when you exceed 4 g, the electons get bogged down in the GPS
receiver and get out just a tad slower--but slow enough to be detected by the
GPS clock. If you're tracking more than four GPS satellites, some of them
will be to the West and some of them to the East of you. The slow electrons
will make the GPS clock think that you are farther away from the westerly
satellites and perversely conversely farther away from the easterly
satellites so that the triangulation calculations in the software will not
reconcile. GPS receivers that are rated for aerobatics have thicker wires
and a series of small op-amps that will "accelerate" the electrons depending
on the internal g-meter reading (manufacturers call this "g-force electron
drift"). This is why airplanes such as the Extra 300 cost so much more. You
also made a major mistake in actually reading one of the manuals for
electronic equipment, since they have to be back-translated from Chinese
character figures--what's the Chinese character for electron-volts?
Just trying to help.
Boyd.
Dan Checkoway wrote:
>
> In the specs for the UPSAT GX60 IFR GPS/Comm, it says:
>
> "Acceleration 4G maximum"
>
> Anybody know what the deal is with this? Is this horizontal acceleration?
>
> )_( Dan
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tommy Walker" <twsurveyor(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Budget |
David, Yes you do need the firewall forward kit. It consists of things like the
oil cooler and oil lines, exhaust system, engine baffle kit, fuel
hoses and fire sleeve, heat muff, carb air box, throttle & mixture & carb heat
cables, heat controls and cable, brackets and all misc. fittings &
hardware, Gascolator, Engine mount bolts & rubber mounts, alternator & mount hdw,
Prop governor, etc., etc. etc......... You can deduct about $1400 from the
price if your using a fixed pitch prop!
All in all just another reason why you'll spend a minimum of $40K to $50K to build
one of these things! Look at Van's "cost estimator" on the web
site. I've found it to be pretty accurate except it doesn't include paint cost
(another $4-$6K)
Tommy Walker
Ridgetop, TN
6A Finishing
----- Original Message -----
From: David Taylor
Subject: Re: RV-List: Engine Budget
>>FF-7 O-360 Firewall Forward Installation Kit
$4,275
Is this an extra kit you need to buy on top of the finishing kit? If I buy
an engine with all accessories will I need this kit? I checked Vans site
but
I don't see the information on this kit.
-David Taylor
RV-7 tailfeathers (wanna
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: UPSAT GX60 -- 4G maximum?! |
| From: | Denis Walsh <deniswalsh(at)earthlink.net> |
Hell I bought in to the whole thing until I found you spelled "electron"
wrong.
> From: "Boyd C. Braem" <bcbraem(at)comcast.net>
> Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 14:52:50 -0400
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com, "rocket-list(at)matronics.com"
>
> Subject: Re: RV-List: UPSAT GX60 -- 4G maximum?!
>
>
> Dan--
>
> Obviously, you've never operated a high-energy particle accelerator! Ah, the
> memories of Brookehaven and Switzerland at CERN. Electrons have mass (let's
> say about 10 GeV (giga electron-volts) and mass is affected by gravity. We
> also know that a GPS receiver is nothing more than a VERY sensitive clock.
> Now, then, when you exceed 4 g, the electons get bogged down in the GPS
> receiver and get out just a tad slower--but slow enough to be detected by the
> GPS clock. If you're tracking more than four GPS satellites, some of them
> will be to the West and some of them to the East of you. The slow electrons
> will make the GPS clock think that you are farther away from the westerly
> satellites and perversely conversely farther away from the easterly
> satellites so that the triangulation calculations in the software will not
> reconcile. GPS receivers that are rated for aerobatics have thicker wires
> and a series of small op-amps that will "accelerate" the electrons depending
> on the internal g-meter reading (manufacturers call this "g-force electron
> drift"). This is why airplanes such as the Extra 300 cost so much more. You
> also made a major mistake in actually reading one of the manuals for
> electronic equipment, since they have to be back-translated from Chinese
> character figures--what's the Chinese character for electron-volts?
>
> Just trying to help.
>
> Boyd.
>
>
> Dan Checkoway wrote:
>
>>
>> In the specs for the UPSAT GX60 IFR GPS/Comm, it says:
>>
>> "Acceleration 4G maximum"
>>
>> Anybody know what the deal is with this? Is this horizontal acceleration?
>>
>> )_( Dan
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Garth Shearing" <garth(at)Islandnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Solenoid diode? |
The current rating of the diode should be a little more than the current
drawn by the solenoid when turned on. Or you can use Ohms Law to determine
current draw from the solenoid's measured resistance. The current drawn
will be 14.4 divided by the measured resistance. If the solenoid draws 1
amp., get a power diode with a 2 amp rating or more. The voltage rating
should be about three or more times the operating voltage, say 50 volts for
a 12 volt system - this is usually very easy to get. Hook up the diode with
the cathode connected to the positive terminal of the solenoid. The other
end of the diode is obviously connected to the negative terminal of the
solenoid. The arrow in the symbol on the diode points to the cathode end.
Place the diode right on the solenoid terminals if you can.
If the diode is connected backwards, it will go "poof" the first time power
is applied! No damage to anything, but you'll have to get another one.
Garth Shearing
VariEze and 80% RV6A
Victoria BC Canada
> I recently read a letter to the editor in Sport Aviation referring to the
> need to install a diode across a solenoid to prevent a negative spike when
> the solenoid field collapses. Van's calls for such a diode installation
for
> the starter solenoid.
>
> I have a small Parker Hannifin solenoid used for the electric primer on my
> nearly completed -4. When I activate the solenoid and as the push button
is
> released, my EI engine instruments go crazy. Is this the dreaded negative
> spike? If so, can one of the electrical wizards out there give this
> electrical dummy some specific instructions on how to install such a diode
> (if that is the problem, which I think it is). This needs to be in the
> language a "pilot" understands!! (wiring connections, size of diode, where
> to obtain it, etc. etc)
>
> Many thanks
>
> Doug Weiler
> Hudson, WI
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Source for rebuilt TC? |
Turn coordinators where a little more expensive than I expected at OSH,
and Van's no longer sells 'em. Can anyone recommend a good source for a
quality rebuilt TC?
Thanks,
-
Larry Bowen
RV-8 canopy/panel/fwf
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Ross Schlotthauer <rdschlotthauer(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: TURBO 360, was bigger engines in RVs |
Ian and list,
Have you looked into this at all. I have been
wondering if anyone has put a continental TSIO-360 in
an RV.
Any one else
--- Ian Scott wrote:
>
>
> what about a turbo 360?
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <KBoatri144(at)aol.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: bigger engines in RVs
>
>
> >
> > In a message dated 7/25/02 11:52:01 AM Eastern
> Daylight Time,
> > dwstiles(at)hotmail.com writes:
> >
> > << Eventually we plan on putting it on floats and
> will be building it with
> > that
> > in mind. Because of the extra drag etc they will
> cause we are interested
> in
> > something more than a 200hp 360 engine. We have
> looked at the various
> alt
> > engines, Subbies and Mazdas as well as the Ford
> & Chev v6 & small v8
> > packages. Nothing seems quite "right" at this
> time. We are
> contemplating
> > the use of a 540 and would be interested in
> hearing form or corresponding
> > with anyone who has hung a 540 on their RV6. I
> know we are a year or two
> > out from the point where it will be needed but we
> tend to do a lot of
> > thinking, research and planning before we jump.
> Any information or
> advice
> > would be very appreciated. D. Wayne Stiles >>
> >
> > There was an extensive article 2-3 years ago in
> Sport Aviation on a
> modified
> > RV-6 with an IO540. The key here is MODIFIED.
> They replaced many of the
> > fuselage skins with heavier skins, lengthened the
> rear fuselage, modified
> the
> > wings, and made many more changes in an effort to
> make the airplane match
> an
> > engine it wasn't designed for.
> >
> > Tom Hallendorf was the builder of that airplane.
> Here's a 3 year old
> e-mail
> > address for him. I have no idea if it is good
> today: n888th(at)flash.net
> >
> > By the way, if you're really interested in floats,
> I believe there are
> better
> > airframes than the short winged RV's. Because of
> induced drag, the short
> > wing RV's are very draggy in low speed flight, and
> floats will make that
> > situation worse. Eustace Bowhay, who sometimes
> comments in this space,
> could
> > offer advice on how suitable RV's are for floats.
> He built one. His
> e-mail
> > is: ebowhay(at)jetstream.net
> >
> >
> > Kyle Boatright
> > 0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
> > Kennesaw, GA
> > http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
> >
> >
>
> - Get the best out of your PC!
>
>
>
> Contributions of
> any other form
>
> latest messages.
> other List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/search
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
http://health.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gordon Lomoth" <rv7canuck(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: bigger engines in RVs |
Hello Wayne
If you want an RV with a bigger engine build an F1 or F2 rocket, it has been
engineered for it. I am sticking with an IO360 for my RV7, it should be
lots of power for me.
Gord Lomoth
RV7 wings
>From: "D. Wayne Stiles" <dwstiles(at)hotmail.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: bigger engines in RVs
>Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 11:50:12 -0400
>
>
>My buddy and I are about to take the plunge and start our RV7 this fall.
>I've been reading all the "tools" posts with avid interest, particularly
>any
>used tool sets that become available. He's at Oshkosh--I couldn't go this
>year and I would not be shocked to find that he's ordered the tailfeathers
>kit while up there, especially if Vans is using the 7 for demo rides this
>year.
>
>Eventually we plan on putting it on floats and will be building it with
>that
>in mind. Because of the extra drag etc they will cause we are interested
>in
>something more than a 200hp 360 engine. We have looked at the various alt
>engines, Subbies and Mazdas as well as the Ford & Chev v6 & small v8
>packages. Nothing seems quite "right" at this time. We are contemplating
>the use of a 540 and would be interested in hearing form or corresponding
>with anyone who has hung a 540 on their RV6. I know we are a year or two
>out from the point where it will be needed but we tend to do a lot of
>thinking, research and planning before we jump. Any information or advice
>would be very appreciated. D. Wayne Stiles
>
>
>MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
>http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JVanLaak(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Aluminum fuel lines |
Listers,
As a young lad I flew a Globe Swift that had aluminum lines from the engine
mounted fuel pump to the carburetor. When I was taking off for what I hoped
would be my first Oshkosh flyin (1973), the line broke at the carburetor end.
I was about 100 feet in the air with the gear coming up. I pushed the nose
over and bellied it in. Neither I nor my passenger were hurt, but the
airplane burned to the ground. The FAA inspector found the metal fatigued
line and cleared me of any fault. He also said I did OK for a 110 hour
private pilot.
Aluminum lines anywhere on the engine or its mount are a bad idea.
Jim
RV-3 N112V
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Tiny torque values |
What is everyone using for smaller torque values, those less than 25
in/lbs? The screw on the mags call for 12 in/lbs. Prop. gov. screws
are 18-20 in/lbs. Etc. First glance at torque screwdrivers that do
~5-25 in/lbs range in price from $150 to $1000. I don't recall anyone
else on the list complaining about the need to buy these pricey
screwdrivers before, so I assume everyone is guessing as they tighten
these...or what?
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ian Scott" <jabiru22(at)yahoo.com.au> |
| Subject: | Re: TURBO 360, was bigger engines in RVs |
NOt really but somone selld turbo upgrades,
I would imagine if you wanted a ground boosting setup you would be looking
at new pistons (to lower compression)
turbo, wastegate and some form of wastegate controll (i would prefer fully
automatic, like in a car) and then an uprated fuel system (maybe just bigger
injectors) and mods to the ignition system. (to adjust timing).
On the other and if you just wanted altitude sompensating then no fuel mods
are required or ignition as the engine is just seeing sea level MP all the
way to 20'000feet
July 17, 2002 - July 26, 2002
RV-Archive.digest.vol-nd