RV-Archive.digest.vol-nf
August 04, 2002 - August 12, 2002
> I do not go on a cross-counrty without it. 3 RV'er from Chino (CNO) each
> purchased Aerox 13 cubic foot systems at AirVenture along with 1 RV'er from
>
> Cable (CCB). They thought the Aerox system was the best value as I did
> almost 5 years ago.
>
>
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> 1,160.1+ Flying Hours So. CA, USA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Calvert" <rv6(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Plexiglass safe thread locker? |
I am using screws to hold the rear window to the roll over bar on my tip
up canopy. Would like to use something on the screws to keep them from
backing out of the tapped holes.
Tested some threadlocker on a scrap piece of plexi. Drilled a hole and
dabbed some threadlocker around it and there were little cracks in the
plexi around the hole overnight.
I would like to find some of the stuff that is applied to the screw and
allowed to dry before the screw in screwed in.
Or is there some threadlocker that is applied when the screws are
screwed in that will not attack plexi.
Ideas?
Jerry Calvert
Edmond Ok -6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RGray67968(at)aol.com |
The plane is 'ready' to fly (yes it is now painted - I did a great job if I
do say so myself). Weighed in at 1038lbs with a Warnke/O-360 up front. Did
some taxi tests yesterday and Mr. FAA will be here Wednesday for the 'once
over'. More to come after Wednesday.
READ THIS: I put the batteries in the ACK ELT, set it on a blanket and then
went over to torque my prop bolts. Came back 10 minutes later and picked up
the ACK and it was 'red hot'. The batteries melted together and melted the
inner casing of the unit. Sure glad I didn't put the unit in the aircraft and
leave for the night - who knows what I'd have found the next day. I'll be
contacting the ACK folks in the morning for a new unit (read: 2nd chance).
Need it by Wednesday so I'm interested to see how they support their product.
Looks like a dead short somewhere, I'm sure they will want to see the unit.
CHECK YOUR UNIT BEFORE INSTALLATION. Mine sat for about a year before I used
it but was right out of the box.
Rick Gray RV6 (Ohio) at the Buffalo Farm - Final Inspection on Wednesday -
1st flight Wednesday - hmmmm, it could happen - I DO feel the butterflies!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RWood90641(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Mounting Gear Weldment |
I plan on mounting the gear weldment using the false spar method detailed by
Frank Justice.
Can anyone offer any pitfalls with this and what you would do different on
the go around. Thanks!
Any builders web sites detail the procedure?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Daniels <jwdanie(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Plexiglass safe thread locker? |
>
>I would like to find some of the stuff that is applied to the screw and
>allowed to dry before the screw in screwed in.
<http://www.ndindustries.com/vibratite.asp>
Available from most bolt vendors or
MSC #00250100 1oz bottle $12.50 (Yikes!)
Jim
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Constant Speed Installation |
In a message dated 8/4/2002 6:42:38 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com writes:
> The fitting at the governor is actually steel. Depending on if it is the
> old style with pipe threads or the new style that uses the same straight
> thread fitting as the fuel pump.
Gary-
No, it's actually brass on mine.
-GV (RV-6A N1GV 560hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Plexiglass safe thread locker? |
In a message dated 8/4/2002 4:15:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time, rv6(at)cox.net
writes:
> I would like to find some of the stuff that is applied to the screw and
> allowed to dry before the screw in screwed in.
What you want is called Vibra-Tite, available at most industrial fastener
supply outlets, including Olander. See Yeller Pages for contact info.
-GV (RV-6A N1GV 560hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
>
>I had planned on looking at and possibly purchasing an oxygen system at
>Oshkosh this year, but low ceiling turned it into IFRventure for me, and I
>couldn't make the trip.
Well, you are in luck! I have a Skyox system for sale!
Since I am selling my 1965 Beech Debonair for a mere $83000 I thought I
should probably sell its oxygen system which is even pre-named
"Oscar". Oscar is a big green steel dude with a sturdy jacket with a carry
handle. It has a four user, adjustable regulator, a mask and some
cannulas. You might be comfortable with just washing the cannulas in soapy
water or alcohol as all have been up someone's nose. New end parts are
$19.95 each from AC Spruce who also sells the systems. Mine is probably in
need of inspection and re-certification which I'll have done. It looks
new. This unit is 24 cu ft I believe. The bottle is not any size listed
in ACS. It is about 6.5 inches by about 18.
Such a system costs about $600 and I'll sell for $375. It might be best
shipped empty.
Anyone who owns an aircraft like an RV is "stupid" (oops, politically
incorrect!!) - sorry, I meant to say, "sub-optimizing his flight system" if
he does not have an oxygen system. It takes maybe 30 to 40 seconds to
figure out how to use it and then it is pure joy.
Coming back from Oshkosh on Tuesday, I came over the smoke in the southern
Sierras at a hair more than 16,500 ft. Keep on hummin' little Lyc! All I
could see was peaks sticking up. WIthout oxygen it would have been actual
IFR and too far to glide to anywhere. While Kings Canyon would be a
beautiful place to die, I'd sooner not.
Over nearly all of the country, flying at 16000 will let you glide to
either an airport, road or lake. So as some will say, "What's your life
worth?". Mine is worth enough that I bought a newer, lighter weight two
place system for the RV.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Constant Speed Installation |
Mine looks to be stainless steel too.
-
Larry Bowen
RV-8 canopy skirts
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Vanremog(at)aol.com
> Sent: Sunday, August 04, 2002 8:18 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Constant Speed Installation
>
>
>
> In a message dated 8/4/2002 6:42:38 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com writes:
>
>
> > The fitting at the governor is actually steel. Depending
> on if it is
> > the
> > old style with pipe threads or the new style that uses the
> same straight
> > thread fitting as the fuel pump.
>
> Gary-
>
> No, it's actually brass on mine.
>
> -GV (RV-6A N1GV 560hrs)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Furey" <john(at)fureychrysler.com> |
Sorry to hear of your problem but with the 4 planes that I have had
inspected an ELT has not been required. Only needed when you leave a 50 mile
radius.
----- Original Message -----
From: <RGray67968(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: ACK Warning
>
> The plane is 'ready' to fly (yes it is now painted - I did a great job if
I
> do say so myself). Weighed in at 1038lbs with a Warnke/O-360 up front. Did
> some taxi tests yesterday and Mr. FAA will be here Wednesday for the 'once
> over'. More to come after Wednesday.
> READ THIS: I put the batteries in the ACK ELT, set it on a blanket and
then
> went over to torque my prop bolts. Came back 10 minutes later and picked
up
> the ACK and it was 'red hot'. The batteries melted together and melted the
> inner casing of the unit. Sure glad I didn't put the unit in the aircraft
and
> leave for the night - who knows what I'd have found the next day. I'll be
> contacting the ACK folks in the morning for a new unit (read: 2nd chance).
> Need it by Wednesday so I'm interested to see how they support their
product.
> Looks like a dead short somewhere, I'm sure they will want to see the
unit.
> CHECK YOUR UNIT BEFORE INSTALLATION. Mine sat for about a year before I
used
> it but was right out of the box.
> Rick Gray RV6 (Ohio) at the Buffalo Farm - Final Inspection on Wednesday -
> 1st flight Wednesday - hmmmm, it could happen - I DO feel the
butterflies!!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Lewis" <timrv6a(at)earthlink.net> |
> READ
> THIS: I put the batteries in the ACK ELT, set it on a blanket and then
> went over to torque my prop bolts. Came back 10 minutes later and
> picked up the ACK and it was 'red hot'. The batteries melted together
> and melted the inner casing of the unit. Sure glad I didn't put the
> unit in the aircraft and leave for the night - who knows what I'd have
> found the next day. I'll be contacting the ACK folks in the morning
> for a new unit (read: 2nd chance). Need it by Wednesday so I'm
> interested to see how they support their product. Looks like a dead
> short somewhere, I'm sure they will want to see the unit. CHECK YOUR
> UNIT BEFORE INSTALLATION. Mine sat for about a year before I used it
> but was right out of the box. Rick Gray RV6 (Ohio) at the Buffalo Farm
> - Final Inspection on Wednesday - 1st flight Wednesday - hmmmm, it
> could happen - I DO feel the butterflies!!
Check the battery polarity to be sure they were put in the ACK unit
correctly. If the polarity of a couple of them are reversed it gets very
warm in a hurry. Ask me how I know ;<)
Tim
******
Tim Lewis -- HEF (Manassas, VA)
RV-6A N47TD - First Flight 18 Dec 99
http://www.geocities.com/timrv6a
******
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Constant Speed Installation |
It may be brass but it should be steel.
Check the link to the service instruction that "Larry Bowen"
posted. It show a part number and calls out steel on
page 2 of the SB488A
http://www.prime-mover.org/Aviation/Manuf_Page/sb488a-2.html Click on next
page to get to page 2 that has the part number of the fittings.
Yes this is a 12 year old Service Bulletin and may have been updated. Would
check it if I was at my hangar.
Gary
----Original Message Follows----
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Constant Speed Installation
Date: Sun, 4 Aug 2002 20:18:29 EDT
In a message dated 8/4/2002 6:42:38 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com writes:
> The fitting at the governor is actually steel. Depending on if it is the
> old style with pipe threads or the new style that uses the same straight
> thread fitting as the fuel pump.
Gary-
No, it's actually brass on mine.
-GV (RV-6A N1GV 560hrs)
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Knicholas2(at)aol.com |
For the vacuum system - since the regualtor has a filter on it, is it still
necessary to place another in-line filter for the vacuum system?
Kim Nicholas
RV9 finishing and wiring
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net> |
Yes, since the air supplied to the gyros is what needs to be filtered
air. The cheezy little filter on the regulator is only to keep chunks
from getting to the vacuum pump.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 183 hours
> For the vacuum system - since the regualtor has a filter on
> it, is it still
> necessary to place another in-line filter for the vacuum system?
>
> Kim Nicholas
> RV9 finishing and wiring
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Gray" <bruce.gray(at)snet.net> |
I'm sure others will disagree but an inline filter after the gyros and
before the pump will protect your instruments. Vacuum pumps have a
tendency to blow debris upstream when they fail. If the pump is replaced
without a complete cleaning of the upstream side (including the foam
filter behind the intake of some gyros) the new pump will just suck all
that dirt and fail in a few hundred hours.
Bruce
Glasair III
www.glasair.org
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Knicholas2(at)aol.com
Subject: RV-List: vacuum filter?
For the vacuum system - since the regualtor has a filter on it, is it
still
necessary to place another in-line filter for the vacuum system?
Kim Nicholas
RV9 finishing and wiring
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Divan" <mikedivan(at)adelphia.net> |
Hi,
I'm writing for my hubby who is interested in purchasing your tools (and
is at work today). Please email the inventory list when you get a
chance, so he can make a decision soon. Thanks very much!
Janet Divan
Thanks.
Mike Divan
mdivan(at)msn.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RGray67968(at)aol.com |
OK, was unaware of the 50 miles limit...........thanks - I'll still be
calling ACK in the morning (just found the receipt - it was purchased from
VANS for $219 Sept. 00). Tim Lewis (I'll be meeting up with you folks 'very
soon - big grin) thanks for the tip on the batteries - I did check and
recheck before I put them in - then again after the 'melt down'. I'm 'SURE
they were correct. I'll order the replacement but keep the 'bad' one on hand
in case I don't get one on time.
Rick Gray RV6 (Ohio) at the Buffalo Farm - Inspection in 3 days - Will
this plane that I built in my basement really fly?? :
)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
You might want to read the regs on that one. If the ELT regs for certified
birds apply to experimentals, the 50 mile radius is only true for flight
training. And, the reg says that you can operate within the 50 mile radius
but only for 90 days. After 90 days, no person may operate an aircraft
without an ELT. I know this just because I'm working on my commercial
rating and have been drilled with regs as of late. Again, this is for
certified birds, so some clarification may be necessary here as to if it
applies to experimentals as well.
Is "Das Fed" still on the list?
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Furey" <john(at)fureychrysler.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: ACK Warning
>
> Sorry to hear of your problem but with the 4 planes that I have had
> inspected an ELT has not been required. Only needed when you leave a 50
mile
> radius.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <RGray67968(at)aol.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: ACK Warning
>
>
> >
> > The plane is 'ready' to fly (yes it is now painted - I did a great job
if
> I
> > do say so myself). Weighed in at 1038lbs with a Warnke/O-360 up front.
Did
> > some taxi tests yesterday and Mr. FAA will be here Wednesday for the
'once
> > over'. More to come after Wednesday.
> > READ THIS: I put the batteries in the ACK ELT, set it on a blanket and
> then
> > went over to torque my prop bolts. Came back 10 minutes later and picked
> up
> > the ACK and it was 'red hot'. The batteries melted together and melted
the
> > inner casing of the unit. Sure glad I didn't put the unit in the
aircraft
> and
> > leave for the night - who knows what I'd have found the next day. I'll
be
> > contacting the ACK folks in the morning for a new unit (read: 2nd
chance).
> > Need it by Wednesday so I'm interested to see how they support their
> product.
> > Looks like a dead short somewhere, I'm sure they will want to see the
> unit.
> > CHECK YOUR UNIT BEFORE INSTALLATION. Mine sat for about a year before I
> used
> > it but was right out of the box.
> > Rick Gray RV6 (Ohio) at the Buffalo Farm - Final Inspection on
Wednesday -
> > 1st flight Wednesday - hmmmm, it could happen - I DO feel the
> butterflies!!
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Peter H. Blake" <pblake(at)epix.net> |
| Subject: | RE: Plexiglas-safe thread locker |
Jerry - I'm using Vibra-tite from ND Industries
www.ndindustries.com/vibratite.asp, a non-anaerobic thread locker that is
applied to the fastener and allowed to dry before use. You can find the
technical data sheets at their website. Best regards, Peter
Peter Blake
RV6 tilt-up
N899PB reserved
Canopy
Office: (610) 847-8478
Fax: (610) 847-8160
e-Mail: pblake(at)epix.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Aeroflash lights/strobes |
I'd appreciate any feed back on where some of you have installed your
Aeroflash power supplies...it looks like the best place may be the aft side
of the spar but I think I also could make a bracket to position it on the
outside leading edge rib. Also, did any of you get some small grommets to
place in the four mounting holes or just attach it directly...thanks for your
replies.
Doug Lomheim RV-9A
90116 Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
I discovered with the ACK that it is possible to put the batteries in
correctly but then rotate the two parts of the case 90 deg from the correct
position and (with a little force) reassembly the unit. The results are the
shorting out of the batteries and rapid heating of the case, fortunately I
still had it in my hand and noticed the growing heat and concluded that
something was amiss and took it apart before the case got too hot. So
sticking the batteries in correctly won't necessarily preclude the shorting
out scenario.
FWIW
Ed Anderson
Matthews, NC
----- Original Message -----
From: <RGray67968(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: ACK Warning
>
> OK, was unaware of the 50 miles limit...........thanks - I'll still be
> calling ACK in the morning (just found the receipt - it was purchased from
> VANS for $219 Sept. 00). Tim Lewis (I'll be meeting up with you folks
'very
> soon - big grin) thanks for the tip on the batteries - I did check and
> recheck before I put them in - then again after the 'melt down'. I'm 'SURE
> they were correct. I'll order the replacement but keep the 'bad' one on
hand
> in case I don't get one on time.
> Rick Gray RV6 (Ohio) at the Buffalo Farm - Inspection in 3 days -
Will
> this plane that I built in my basement really fly?? :
)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "FABIAN LEFLER" <FLEFLER(at)broward.org> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6-List: Aeroflash lights/strobes |
Doug,
I installed my Aeroflash power supplies vertically on the second to last rib. (first
bay from the wingtip). I thought about mounting them on the end rib like
you, but if you ever clip an parked airplane and/or object while taxing, you
may have to replace the power supply. Additionally, I didn't want to drill my
spars for any reason, so I installed the power supplies on the main rib using
nutplates. I can remove the power supplies through the large lightning holes
in the main ribs in less than two (2) minutes without much effort.
I'll send you some photos of the installation tonight.
Regards,
Fabian
RV-9A
Working on Fuselage
>>> DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com 08/05/02 07:58AM >>>
--> RV6-List message posted by: DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com
I'd appreciate any feed back on where some of you have installed your
Aeroflash power supplies...it looks like the best place may be the aft side
of the spar but I think I also could make a bracket to position it on the
outside leading edge rib. Also, did any of you get some small grommets to
place in the four mounting holes or just attach it directly...thanks for your
replies.
Doug Lomheim RV-9A
90116 Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
91.207(f)(4) says that an ELT is not required for "Aircraft while engaged in
flight operations incident to design and testing" and (5), "New aircraft while
engaged in flight operations incident to their manufacture, preparation, and
delivery). I think that this would apply in this case.
Also, the 90 day limitation appears to apply to ELT's removed for maintenance.
Dave -6 So Cal, TC, FA
Paul Besing wrote:
>
> You might want to read the regs on that one. If the ELT regs for certified
> birds apply to experimentals, the 50 mile radius is only true for flight
> training. And, the reg says that you can operate within the 50 mile radius
> but only for 90 days. After 90 days, no person may operate an aircraft
> without an ELT. I know this just because I'm working on my commercial
> rating and have been drilled with regs as of late. Again, this is for
> certified birds, so some clarification may be necessary here as to if it
> applies to experimentals as well.
>
> Is "Das Fed" still on the list?
>
> Paul Besing
> RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
> http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
> Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
> http://www.kitlog.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Furey" <john(at)fureychrysler.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: ACK Warning
>
> >
> > Sorry to hear of your problem but with the 4 planes that I have had
> > inspected an ELT has not been required. Only needed when you leave a 50
> mile
> > radius.
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <RGray67968(at)aol.com>
> > To:
> > Subject: RV-List: ACK Warning
> >
> >
> > >
> > > The plane is 'ready' to fly (yes it is now painted - I did a great job
> if
> > I
> > > do say so myself). Weighed in at 1038lbs with a Warnke/O-360 up front.
> Did
> > > some taxi tests yesterday and Mr. FAA will be here Wednesday for the
> 'once
> > > over'. More to come after Wednesday.
> > > READ THIS: I put the batteries in the ACK ELT, set it on a blanket and
> > then
> > > went over to torque my prop bolts. Came back 10 minutes later and picked
> > up
> > > the ACK and it was 'red hot'. The batteries melted together and melted
> the
> > > inner casing of the unit. Sure glad I didn't put the unit in the
> aircraft
> > and
> > > leave for the night - who knows what I'd have found the next day. I'll
> be
> > > contacting the ACK folks in the morning for a new unit (read: 2nd
> chance).
> > > Need it by Wednesday so I'm interested to see how they support their
> > product.
> > > Looks like a dead short somewhere, I'm sure they will want to see the
> > unit.
> > > CHECK YOUR UNIT BEFORE INSTALLATION. Mine sat for about a year before I
> > used
> > > it but was right out of the box.
> > > Rick Gray RV6 (Ohio) at the Buffalo Farm - Final Inspection on
> Wednesday -
> > > 1st flight Wednesday - hmmmm, it could happen - I DO feel the
> > butterflies!!
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bernie Kerr" <kerrbernie(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
>
>Over nearly all of the country, flying at 16000 will let you glide to
>either an airport, road or lake. So as some will say, "What's your life
>worth?". Mine is worth enough that I bought a newer, lighter weight two
>place system for the RV.
>
>K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
>RV6-a N7HK flying!
>PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
>
>
OK Hal! Thanks for convincing us all of the value of an O2 system. How about
letting us know what an experienced hand like you procured for your RVD??
Bernie Kerr, 6A,O-320,tipup,Sensenich metal,SE Fla
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
I was combining two regs here. I had a chance to look it up. With respect
to an ELT, the way I read it, is:
You do not have to have an ELT at all if the aircraft will always be
conducting training flights within a 50 nm radius. This really doesn't
apply here, as it appears to only apply to flight training aircraft, so
throw the 50 nm radius thing out the window.
You do not have to have an ELT installed while engaged in flight testing.
This applies, but it is not clear as to when flight testing is done, so I
would assume that when you sign off your phase 2, an ELT should be
installed.
With respect to the 90 day rule, that applies to an ELT being removed. The
reg states, "No person may operate the aircraft more than 90 days after the
ELT is initially removed from the aircraft;"
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aeroflash lights/strobes |
I installed mine on the outboard bay, on the forward side of the spar by the
wing tip. 4 bolts and that was it. Worked great. Many builder's have gone
this route.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Aeroflash lights/strobes
>
> I'd appreciate any feed back on where some of you have installed your
> Aeroflash power supplies...it looks like the best place may be the aft
side
> of the spar but I think I also could make a bracket to position it on the
> outside leading edge rib. Also, did any of you get some small grommets to
> place in the four mounting holes or just attach it directly...thanks for
your
>
> replies.
>
> Doug Lomheim RV-9A
> 90116 Wings
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Bowen <lcbowen(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
Where is the popular place to get the Ox bottles refilled? Medical supply?
Welding supply? FBO? Other?
====
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
http://health.yahoo.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
| From: | Larry Pardue <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
>
>
>Where is the popular place to get the Ox bottles refilled? Medical supply?
>Welding supply? FBO? Other?
>
>
There are some silly laws that apply. I used to get bottles filled with
welding oxygen but my local welding place won't do it anymore. My
current solution involves ripping the aviator label off the bottle and
getting a prescription for medical oxygen. The very idea of needing a
prescription for oxygen tells me we have WAY too much government.
FBO likely involves big bucks, but the convenience may be worth it to
some.
This thread will likely restart up the fictions about the differences in
oxygen from these sources. It is all the same now.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Plexiglass safe thread locker? |
In a message dated 8/4/02 4:15:09 PM Pacific Daylight Time, rv6(at)cox.net
writes:
<< Or is there some threadlocker that is applied when the screws are screwed
in that will not attack plexi. >>
You asked for ideas Jerry so here's mine. I coated the canopy screws with
Lexel, the same stuff that I and others have used to seal the canopy, and
installed them wet. Not flying yet so don't know how this will work in the
long run.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, electrical stuff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Brown" <nightmare(at)adelphia.net> |
Sunflower
Anybody interested in a Garmin 195 for 500.00?
Paul
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jerry Isler" <jlisler(at)surfsouth.com> |
| Subject: | Harmonic Balancer |
I am looking for a Landall harmonic balancer to go on a wooden prop, 0-320
combo. Anyone got one collecting dust?
Jerry Isler
RV-4 N455J
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
Just incase anyone is interested I have found the best system, all things
being equal, is the Mountain High, Electronic Delivery System. If you want
the best it is worth paying for it. I am sure glad I did.
Jon Johanson (just visiting the Master)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bobpaulo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Tools for Sale |
Here ya go, Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bobpaulo(at)aol.com |
I attempted to e mail all those interested in a detailed list of my tool
inventory. If not received contact me off list for... I hope to have this
stuff out of my garage by Sat.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
>
>Where is the popular place to get the Ox bottles refilled? Medical
supply?
>Welding supply? FBO? Other?
>
I have paid as little as $15 dollars to as much as $25 to get filled at
FBOs.
I now fill my own when at home from a 125 CU foot welding cylinder.
Ed Bundy showed me his system of doing this several years ago. I though it
was a good idea and have been doing this now for a year.
Check the archives for more info.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,159 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bettie Seitzer" <bseitzer(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | RE: RV-List Digest: 26 Msgs - 08/04/02 |
Hello! this will be another lurker heard from. I am planning to build an
RV 8, starting as soon as I can get my workshop cleaned out and set up. I
have a question for the group. Have any of you gone to the weekend RV
builders workshop at Osh Kosh? I would appreciate any comments you might
have on the usefulness of that workshop. There is one scheduled for
October and I am considering going to it (if it is not already full).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Textor" <jack(at)iajobs.com> |
Just a note, when filling oxygen cylinders, DON'T MIX WITH OIL, very
dangerous, explosive. Watched a 337 blow-up and burn to molten aluminum.
Luckily the pilot's door was open and he was thrown clear.
RV8
Jack Textor
DSM
>
>Where is the popular place to get the Ox bottles refilled? Medical
supply?
>Welding supply? FBO? Other?
>
I have paid as little as $15 dollars to as much as $25 to get filled at
FBOs.
I now fill my own when at home from a 125 CU foot welding cylinder.
Ed Bundy showed me his system of doing this several years ago. I though it
was a good idea and have been doing this now for a year.
Check the archives for more info.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,159 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.tripod.com
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard V. Reynolds" <rvreynolds(at)macs.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
> My nephew justed visited Norfolk, and we filled his 24 cuft cylinder for $10
> at the welding suppy shop. The counter man asked if we were going to use it
> for breathing. No (duh)!! Otherwise we would need a "prescription".
Richard Reynolds, Norfolk, VA, RV-6A almost
>
> >Where is the popular place to get the Ox bottles refilled? Medical
> supply?
> >Welding supply? FBO? Other?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: RV-List Digest: 26 Msgs - 08/04/02 |
If you've had no experience working with metal (i.e. drilling, deburring,
dimpling, riveting), the workshop is good. It also is a good overview re:
tools. However, if you have access to a fellow builder and can spend two
hours with him, you probably end up with the same amount of knowledge. (I
took the Sportaire version held at Aircraft Spruce).
Rick Jory
RV8A
----- Original Message -----
From: Bettie Seitzer <bseitzer(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: RE: RV-List Digest: 26 Msgs - 08/04/02
>
>
> Hello! this will be another lurker heard from. I am planning to build an
> RV 8, starting as soon as I can get my workshop cleaned out and set up. I
> have a question for the group. Have any of you gone to the weekend RV
> builders workshop at Osh Kosh? I would appreciate any comments you might
> have on the usefulness of that workshop. There is one scheduled for
> October and I am considering going to it (if it is not already full).
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | white papers on foams such as confor foam |
This company may make confor foam, the substance being used more and
more my people like Oregon Aero, Hi-Tech Foams, for seat materials.
At any rate, they have good info.
http://www.earsc.com/engineering/index.html
Barry Pote RV9a finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "chris mcgough" <rv6(at)ssc.net.au> |
| Subject: | Re: Aeroflash lights/strobes |
Forward side of spar last rib so if you take of tips you can work on them.
Chris and Susie
VH-MUM
----- Original Message -----
From: <DLOMHEIM(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Aeroflash lights/strobes
>
> I'd appreciate any feed back on where some of you have installed your
> Aeroflash power supplies...it looks like the best place may be the aft
side
> of the spar but I think I also could make a bracket to position it on the
> outside leading edge rib. Also, did any of you get some small grommets to
> place in the four mounting holes or just attach it directly...thanks for
your
>
> replies.
>
> Doug Lomheim RV-9A
> 90116 Wings
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
One lister asked me privately what performance I got at altitude. Others
can surely give better data than I since my RV6a still has no nose gear leg
fairing and has numerous truss head screws where most have cntrsnk screws
or rivets. I just installed the fat wheel pants and fairings and so the
prop is not fully loaded at 2700 rpm, a super climb prop but slow. I have
a Sensenich 72 inch aluminum prop pitched 81 inches.
Oxygen is best when combined with an IFR rating and aircraft since a lot of
WX can be topped by going to higher altitudes. There are many benefits
even when VFR such as my trip over the Sierra Nevada and the smoke. I
would not have attempted to pick my way thru canyons with such poor
visibility. Often, especially going east, it is possible to gain 20 or
more knots ground speed at higher altitudes. Up there is often less
turbulence so you fly faster and more comfortably. Finally, high up gives
a better chance of survival if an emergency landing is required.
Performance in real travel comes from working with the WX, selecting a
good route, going straight, planning approaches, selecting fast turn
airports and so on.
Going east over eastern Colorado at 15,500 I saw a GPS groundspeed of 177
kts. The wind was against me coming back at about 12 kts. down low. Up
high it was little different but very much smoother.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
>
>Just a note, when filling oxygen cylinders, DON'T MIX WITH OIL, very
>dangerous, explosive.
Just so people don't get confused and think that oxygen is dangerous. It
isn't but it does make everything that is on fire burn very much more
rapidly. It really makes an acetylene fire glow! By itself it will
neither burn nor explode.
But Jack is right to caution that, with oil etc it can be dangerous.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
not just oil but grease to !!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
| Subject: | English builders. |
I'm going to making a trip to the UK from Aug 14 to Sept 4 for family
reasons. I will be staying for most of this time in Brighton, Sussex.
I hope to visit the Shoreham Air Show at the end of the month and would
be very pleased to be able to meet up with any RV builders attending
this or living in the immediate area.
Anyone interested in meeting up can e-mail me up to departure time and
can reach me after this at 01273 508135 in England.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9 fuse. N919RV resvd.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charles Brame <charleyb(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Prop governor oil line |
I read with interest the messages regarding the prop governor oil line.
I think I will go with a #6 teflon lined, braided steel, flex line.
But that's not the point of this message.
My governor is installed and I am currently installing the operating
cable. However, I have decided my initial engine run and initial flight
will be with a fixed pitch prop. (Long story.) The plug is still
installed in the 0320 crankshaft. My question is: can I (should I) run
the engine with the governor installed and either the oil line
installed, or the governor oil fitting capped?
I can remove the governor for the initial run and flight, but hate to do
so if there is a safe and simpler way to do it.
Charlie Brame
RV-6A N11CB (Res.)
San Antonio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Carl Froehlich" <carlfro(at)erols.com> |
| Subject: | Prop governor oil line |
Under no circumstances should you fly this engine with a fixed pitch prop
without puncturing the inner crank oil seal (per the Lycoming instruction).
Then, do not run the engine with a fixed pitch prop with the governor
pumping oil against the outer seal. It will fail.
If you want to fly with the fixed pitch prop, do the oil seal modification.
Van's sells the seals for about $1.50, and the mod takes only a few minutes.
Going back to a constant speed prop seal arrangement is also straight
forward.
Carl Froehlich
RV-8A (flying)
Vienna, VA
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Charles Brame
Subject: RV-List: Prop governor oil line
I read with interest the messages regarding the prop governor oil line.
I think I will go with a #6 teflon lined, braided steel, flex line.
But that's not the point of this message.
My governor is installed and I am currently installing the operating
cable. However, I have decided my initial engine run and initial flight
will be with a fixed pitch prop. (Long story.) The plug is still
installed in the 0320 crankshaft. My question is: can I (should I) run
the engine with the governor installed and either the oil line
installed, or the governor oil fitting capped?
I can remove the governor for the initial run and flight, but hate to do
so if there is a safe and simpler way to do it.
Charlie Brame
RV-6A N11CB (Res.)
San Antonio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | Prop governor oil line |
By far the simpler thing to do is to take the governor off, provided you
have the cover for the hole in the crankcase. I've looked into this about a
year ago and there is some stuff in the archives... I've been told to NOT
run it with the governor and hose installed, but with the plug in crankshaft
installed.
I've converted a fixed pitch to a constant speed... it is a very simple
task, taking less than 1 hour to do EVERYTHING. Don't sweat taking the
governor off.
jim
tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Charles Brame
Subject: RV-List: Prop governor oil line
I read with interest the messages regarding the prop governor oil line.
I think I will go with a #6 teflon lined, braided steel, flex line.
But that's not the point of this message.
My governor is installed and I am currently installing the operating
cable. However, I have decided my initial engine run and initial flight
will be with a fixed pitch prop. (Long story.) The plug is still
installed in the 0320 crankshaft. My question is: can I (should I) run
the engine with the governor installed and either the oil line
installed, or the governor oil fitting capped?
I can remove the governor for the initial run and flight, but hate to do
so if there is a safe and simpler way to do it.
Charlie Brame
RV-6A N11CB (Res.)
San Antonio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Nightingale, Roger" <rnightingale(at)tycoint.com> |
We are in the process of selecting a fixed pitch prop for our RV 9A. Do any
of you have any suggestions or comments. We have been investigating Aymar
DeMuth,
Catto, and Sensenich, would appreciate any comments or experiences.
Thanks,
Roger & Mike Nightingale
Orion, Illinois
RV 9A
N194WE (reserved)
Thanks,
Rog
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
SNIP not just oil but grease to !!!! SNIP
Not just those but most anything containing carbon (fingerprints, cleaning alcohols,
paper, fuels, some gasket sealants, etc...) and many other things.
Another hazard, particularly if flammable gases are involved, is static electricity.
Ground everything so you don't get a spark.
There are some tragic stories (urban legends?) about workers who used an oxygen
hose to blow the dust off their coveralls. Static spark. POOOOF! Naked, burnt
guy.
We had an incident recently at a local hospital when the surgeon was using acetone
to wipe some adhesive tape residue from the patients face. Oxygen line nearby.
Spark. POOF! Very serious burns to the pt.
Be careful.
For this thread, and I can't say this with a straight face..... no flames intended.
Vince
USI Chemistry dep't
married to a medical dosimetrist
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Pat Perry" <pperryrv(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Oil cooler for sale |
I have a used oil cooler collecting dust in the garage that I have decided
to sell. I think it's the same model as the Positech sold through Van's.
It's dementions and mounting are the same and it looks like the same design.
With the ports plugged and 80psi air on it there were no leaks. It could
use a cleaning but appears is in good shape.
I'll send pictures to anyone interested and will take the best offer.
Pat Perry
Dallas, PA
RV-4 N154PK Flies great!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "F. Parker Thomas" <me(at)parkerthomas.com> |
| Subject: | Bahamas Pilot Guide |
Has anyone purchased the Bahamas Pilot Guide at
http://www.pilotpub.com/? Is the information in the book also contained
in charts? At 50$, I'd like to see if the info is available anywhere
else.
Thanks,
Parker Thomas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | Bahamas Pilot Guide |
I have the 2001 version, and it is full of great information. I've flown to
the Bahamas several times without it, and would have loved to had this
information with me. If you plan on going to any island other than the big
two or three, then this is a must have. Photos from the air of each Island,
and its airport is great for orientation.
Bottom line, if you are flying to the Bahamas, this is a must have. Well
worth the money.
Jim
Tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of F. Parker Thomas
Subject: RV-List: Bahamas Pilot Guide
Has anyone purchased the Bahamas Pilot Guide at
http://www.pilotpub.com/? Is the information in the book also contained
in charts? At 50$, I'd like to see if the info is available anywhere
else.
Thanks,
Parker Thomas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
What about the Prince P-Tip.
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (100+ hours)
>From: "Nightingale, Roger" <rnightingale(at)tycoint.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: "RV-LIST (E-mail)"
>Subject: RV-List: Date: Tue, 6 Aug 2002 08:46:37 -0400
>
>
>
>
>We are in the process of selecting a fixed pitch prop for our RV 9A. Do
>any
>of you have any suggestions or comments. We have been investigating Aymar
>DeMuth,
>Catto, and Sensenich, would appreciate any comments or experiences.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Roger & Mike Nightingale
>Orion, Illinois
>
>RV 9A
>N194WE (reserved)
>
>
>Thanks,
>Rog
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Boyd C. Braem" <bcbraem(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
And, grease, here, can also be lip-balm, Chap Stick or other facial
cosmetics.
ABAYMAN(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> not just oil but grease to !!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Bahamas Pilot Guide |
Being a rookie pilot I may have a dumb question. How do you guys fly to the
Bahamas with a single engine? Are there a few land masses along the way or
do you just pack a raft and pray for the engine not to fail?
Rob
RV7 waiting for the wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
Boyd,
I defer to your vast knowledge base here but I thought that the oil or
grease substance had to be petroleum based to self ignite in an oxygen rich
environment. Is lip balm a petroleum based lubricant? (I know Vasilene
is) AL
>
>And, grease, here, can also be lip-balm, Chap Stick or other facial
>cosmetics.
>
>ABAYMAN(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> >
> > not just oil but grease to !!!!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Hawkins <lhawkins(at)giant.com> |
| Subject: | Bahamas Pilot Guide |
I think this is a good question and also what about pilot rating? As in
"single engine land" How far can you wonder from the mainland?
Larry Hawkins, RV-4 Farmington, NM, N-345SL, Painting.
-----Original Message-----
From: IronRJE(at)aol.com [mailto:IronRJE(at)aol.com]
Subject: Re: RV-List: Bahamas Pilot Guide
Being a rookie pilot I may have a dumb question. How do you guys fly to the
Bahamas with a single engine? Are there a few land masses along the way or
do you just pack a raft and pray for the engine not to fail?
Rob
RV7 waiting for the wings
RE: RV-List: Bahamas Pilot Guide
I think this is a good question and also what about
pilot rating? As in single engine land How far can you
wonder from the mainland?
Larry Hawkins, RV-4 Farmington, NM, N-345SL,
Painting.
-----Original Message-----
From: IronRJE(at)aol.com [<A
HREF"mailto:IronRJE(at)aol.com">mailto:IronRJE(at)aol.com]
Sent: August 06, 2002 2:49 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Bahamas Pilot Guide
-- RV-List message posted by:
IronRJE(at)aol.com
Being a rookie pilot I may have a dumb
question. How do you guys fly to the
Bahamas with a single engine? Are there a few
land masses along the way or
do you just pack a raft and pray for the engine not
to fail?
Rob
RV7 waiting for the wings
http://www.matronics.com/subscription
Share: http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
List: http://www.matronics.com/browselist/rv-list
http://www.matronics.com/search
Archives: http://www.matronics.com/archives
http://www.matronics.com/rv-list
Lists: http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
http://www.matronics.com/
| From: | "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | Bahamas Pilot Guide |
Rob, Why would the engine fail? Running out of gas?
Yes we take a raft, and life jackets. There are usually other planes leaving
Florida for Bimini, so often you can ride alongside (near?) another plan (or
two-three---).
Flying in the Bahamas is some of the most beautiful flying a person can do.
You can't imagine the colors of blue.
Once you get to the first island (Bimini), you will never be out of site of
land--for nearly 1,500 miles-- to South America. Hundreds of islands, many
with airports. Just stop at an "entry" airport first (for customs), and then
you can go wherever you want to go.
jim
Tampa
6A N555JN almost flying.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of IronRJE(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Bahamas Pilot Guide
Being a rookie pilot I may have a dumb question. How do you guys fly to the
Bahamas with a single engine? Are there a few land masses along the way or
do you just pack a raft and pray for the engine not to fail?
Rob
RV7 waiting for the wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Bahamas Pilot Guide |
In a message dated 8/6/02 5:30:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
lhawkins(at)giant.com writes:
I think this is a good question and also what about pilot rating? As in
"single engine land" How far can you wonder from the mainland?
Larry Hawkins, RV-4 Farmington, NM, N-345SL, Painting.
-----Original Message-----
From: IronRJE(at)aol.com [mailto:IronRJE(at)aol.com]
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Bahamas Pilot Guide
Being a rookie pilot I may have a dumb question. How do you guys fly to the
Bahamas with a single engine? Are there a few land masses along the way or
do you just pack a raft and pray for the engine not to fail?
Rob
RV7 waiting for the wings >>
From Fort Lauderdale to the closest island is something like 37 nautical
miles. That's 15 minutes in RV-time, and if you fly at 10,000' or better,
you'll be within gliding distance of land the entire time barring adverse
winds. Proper route management can keep the over water distances even lower
as you move along the islands...
No special rating is required for overwater flights.
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gannon, Terence" <Terence.Gannon(at)trican.ca> |
Tedd -- if you're on the list, perhaps you could drop me a note, off list.
My mail to you is getting bounced, and I'm wondering if I have the wrong
one, or some such thing. Thanx...TCG
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Joe Hine" <joehine(at)nbnet.nb.ca> |
I would suggest you check out Colin Walker in Salmon Arm BC, he makes fine
props and sells them in Cdn. dollars...the 70 X 70 I have on my 160hp four
works fine and was 720cdn about two years ago. A very good deal for those
of you in the US.
Joe Hine
RV4 C-FYTQ
PS Sorry I don't have his phone or email here right now, but if you do an
archive search, you might find it there.
Joe
----- Original Message -----
From: "Nightingale, Roger" <rnightingale(at)tycoint.com>
Subject: RV-List:
>
>
> We are in the process of selecting a fixed pitch prop for our RV 9A. Do
any
> of you have any suggestions or comments. We have been investigating Aymar
> DeMuth,
> Catto, and Sensenich, would appreciate any comments or experiences.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Roger & Mike Nightingale
> Orion, Illinois
>
> RV 9A
> N194WE (reserved)
>
>
> Thanks,
> Rog
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Laird Owens <owens(at)aerovironment.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bahamas Pilot Guide |
Like everyone else has said, just island to island and fly with
friends. Our longest leg was 30 min or 80 miles, and at 10K only
about 15 min of that was out of gliding distance.
Flying the airplane I built in the Bahamas was one of the most
memorable things I have ever done.
For the new members of the list.....You can see my pictures at:
http://members3.clubphoto.com/socal230330/429055/guest.phtml
And for a story of the trip written by our lead pilot, see:
http://goodland.ixks.com/~vbaker/bahamas.htm
We had quite the adventure. Hope to do it again next Spring (without
the rain storm, thank you very much).
Laird RV-6
SoCal
>
>Being a rookie pilot I may have a dumb question. How do you guys fly to the
>Bahamas with a single engine? Are there a few land masses along the way or
>do you just pack a raft and pray for the engine not to fail?
>
>Rob
>RV7 waiting for the wings
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rob Prior <rv7(at)b4.ca> |
I'm pretty sure that Colin Walker hasn't moved from his nice home in
*Surrey*, BC. It must be Eustace Bowhay you're thinking of in Salmon
Arm, who put floats on his RV-6. But i'll pass on your note at our RAA
Meeting tonight, so he'll be ready for your call. You can reach him at
(604) 581-9602 (but not tonight, he'll be at a meeting).
Hope this helps,
Rob Prior
rv7 "at" b4.ca
RV-7 Empennage
Joe Hine wrote:
>
> I would suggest you check out Colin Walker in Salmon Arm BC, he makes fine
> props and sells them in Cdn. dollars...the 70 X 70 I have on my 160hp four
> works fine and was 720cdn about two years ago. A very good deal for those
> of you in the US.
>
> Joe Hine
> RV4 C-FYTQ
>
> PS Sorry I don't have his phone or email here right now, but if you do an
> archive search, you might find it there.
>
> Joe
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Nightingale, Roger" <rnightingale(at)tycoint.com>
> To: "RV-LIST (E-mail)"
> Subject: RV-List:
>
>
>
>>
>
>
>>
>>We are in the process of selecting a fixed pitch prop for our RV 9A. Do
>>
> any
>
>>of you have any suggestions or comments. We have been investigating Aymar
>>DeMuth,
>>Catto, and Sensenich, would appreciate any comments or experiences.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Roger & Mike Nightingale
>>Orion, Illinois
>>
>>RV 9A
>>N194WE (reserved)
>>
>>
>>Thanks,
>>Rog
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bernie Kerr" <kerrbernie(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bahamas Pilot Guide ( Gov. Red Tape) |
>
>From Fort Lauderdale to the closest island is something like 37 nautical
>miles. That's 15 minutes in RV-time, and if you fly at 10,000' or better,
>you'll be within gliding distance of land the entire time barring adverse
>winds. Proper route management can keep the over water distances even
>lower
>as you move along the islands...
>
>No special rating is required for overwater flights.
>
>Kyle Boatright
>0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
>Kennesaw, GA
>http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
>
Kyle,
Having sailed and flown to the Bahamas numerous times, I don't think we
should downplay the Gulfstream. It is more like 60 nautical miles and can be
a treacherous stretch of water. Once in the islands you can fly most places
and be fairly close to an island, but not necessarily the safest place to
ditch IMHO. I fly with an SOS on and if I have to ditch in water I would
like to have 30 to 60 feet depth. Ditching in shallow water I think is more
dangerous because if you flip in shallow water you can easily be trapped and
drown in 4-5 feet of water. We just lost two souls here in a grumman tiger
in the loxahaxee reserve with this senario.
The Bahamian government was going to remove the restriction on "exp"
airplanes a year and half ago but it has not happened as far as I know. You
are supposed to fax them a whole raft of info and have permission each time
you go. I tried to fax it and have it on file so that I could simply call up
and go, but no dice. You can probably land anywhere except Nassau and
Freeport with out much chance of being challenged.
The tourist aviation dept told me they would not like to be in that position
if you had a small problem and they realized you were there without the
permission. Very large chains on your RV. For this reason, I have only been
flying over with folks in certified AC. Yuk! but do not wish to have it
chained to an island.
Bernie Kerr, 6A,O-320,tipup,Sensenich metal,SE Fla
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
Let me get this straight. If I wear chapstick while flying in the winter
time at high altitudes, and use oxygen, my face will explode?
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Al Mojzisik" <prober(at)iwaynet.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Oxygen Systems
>
> Boyd,
>
> I defer to your vast knowledge base here but I thought that the oil or
> grease substance had to be petroleum based to self ignite in an oxygen
rich
> environment. Is lip balm a petroleum based lubricant? (I know Vasilene
> is) AL
>
> >
> >And, grease, here, can also be lip-balm, Chap Stick or other facial
> >cosmetics.
> >
> >ABAYMAN(at)aol.com wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > not just oil but grease to !!!!
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LeastDrag93066(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
I've heard even chapstick can be a problem.
Jim Ayers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LeastDrag93066(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
No. they won't explode. They'll just burn off. :-(
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | emrath <emrath(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Plane Registration |
With all the discussion on aircraft registrion, I got to wondering about
forming a Sub-S corp and putting the plane in the corporation as the
only asset. Registered in Del. Of course and then if I sell the plane,
do so by just selling the corporation (i.e. stock). Might have to pay
corp. registration or some such fee each year. Might shield one from
liabilities and perhaps from sales taxes on selling the corporation. Can
this be done? Any advice from the "listers"?
Marty in Brentwood, TN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
----Original Message Follows----
From: "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Oxygen Systems
Date: Tue, 6 Aug 2002 18:04:02 -0700
Let me get this straight. If I wear chapstick while flying in the winter
time at high altitudes, and use oxygen, my face will explode?
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Al Mojzisik" <prober(at)iwaynet.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Oxygen Systems
>
> Boyd,
>
> I defer to your vast knowledge base here but I thought that the oil or
> grease substance had to be petroleum based to self ignite in an oxygen
rich
> environment. Is lip balm a petroleum based lubricant? (I know Vasilene
> is) AL
>
> >
> >And, grease, here, can also be lip-balm, Chap Stick or other facial
> >cosmetics.
> >
> >ABAYMAN(at)aol.com wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > not just oil but grease to !!!!
> >
> >
>
It should not explode. Pure Oxygen could cause a burn (reddish skin) where
it contacts the oil. Burn does not necessary mean a fire or explosion.
People that have worn masks on long flights have had mild burns on the face
from where the oil from the skin and Oxygen in the mask would meet at the
location that the mask touches the skin.
Talk to some of the old WW II fighters that flew B-17s and had their Oxygen
mask on the entire flight.
Maybe someone with medical background will hop in and set the record
straight.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,159 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: re- Colin Walker |
Hi Rog,
I believe that you will find Colin Walker's phone number on the Delta
Heritage Airpark website at Http://home.istar.ca/~bb4/
look for his phone number at http://www.b4.ca/raa85/people.html This man
has a very good rep!.
Jim in Kelowna
>
> >
> >
> > We are in the process of selecting a fixed pitch prop for our RV 9A. Do
> any
> > of you have any suggestions or comments. We have been investigating
Aymar
> > DeMuth,
> > Catto, and Sensenich, would appreciate any comments or experiences.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Roger & Mike Nightingale
> > Orion, Illinois
> >
> > RV 9A
> > N194WE (reserved)
> >
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Rog
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | HalBenjamin(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Oxygen Systems |
In a message dated 08/06/2002 9:07:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
azpilot(at)extremezone.com writes:
> Let me get this straight. If I wear chapstick while flying in the winter
> time at high altitudes, and use oxygen, my face will explode?
>
Back in the olden days I ran a couple of oxygen plants....Made Liquid and
Gaseous oxygen. To show the new guys how dangerous O2 is, I would saturate a
cigarette filter with oxygen and then light it with a match. Normally a
cigarette filter doesn't burn, but in 98% O2 it burns like gun powder.
I'd skip the chapstick.
Hal Benjamin
RV-4, Fuselage crawling up the jig.
Long Island, NY
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
A friend of mine who has infrequent web access is in the finishing stage
of an RV4. He has a Warnke prop on order and some time ago I sent him a
copy of another lister's worries over slow delivery. I received this
from Mike today.
"Back when you sent me this, (the original enquiry), I was able to talk
to Margie Warnke and get status on my prop. She'd had a death in the
family and was temporarily out of touch. I've called from time to time
just to check status but havent pushed since I dont need the prop right
away.
Today I tried to call and the number is disconnected. There's a
forwarding number to a voice mail so I left a message. I know Margie
was planning a move to Alaska so maybe that's the story. But she'd told
me that she'd get my prop out before she moved.
I'm not currently on the RV list and dont want to subscribe because of
the massive amounts of mail. I checked the archive and there is no
recent news about the status of Warnke. Can you do me a favor and check
with the list to see if anyone knows what's going on?"
This sounds rather worrying. Does anyone on the list know whats
happening with Margie Warnke?
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A fuse. N919RV resvd.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us> |
Just to clarify a little,
Most organic materials when exposed to pure oxygen won't spontaneously
combust at ambient temperature and pressure. But if you raise the pressure
of the O2 the ambient temperature required for spontaneous combustion drops.
So if you need O2 and high pressure the only solution is to not have any
form of matter that will readily and rapidly combine with oxygen.
This also can include some metals such as titanium. Not sure what the
complete list is, but if its organic in origin or its titanium, keep it away
from pressureized O2.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eugene Williams" <Ewill177(at)hotmail.com> |
I had a 70 x72 Warnke prop on my Rv-6 O320 but I broke it when landing in four
foot tall grass. Bought a 68 x 74 from Demuth and I just don't like it. It was
his recommendation but I have a half inch of throttle left
when the engine overspeeds at 2700. The best airspeed I can get is about 180.
I talked to Demuth about repitching but just got all kinds of arguments why it
can't be done. I gave up and would like to get another Warnke if possible.
However, since I'm on the list now I wonder what others
are using that they are happy with. Any recommendations for a good cruisd : http://explorer.msn.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 8/6/02 10:46:49 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
Ewill177(at)hotmail.com writes:
<< I had a 70 x72 Warnke prop on my Rv-6 O320 but I broke it when landing in four
foot tall grass. Bought a 68 x 74 from Demuth and I just don't lik e it.
It was his recommendation but I have a half inch of throttle left
when the engine overspeeds at 2700. The best airspeed I can get is about 180.
I talked to Demuth about repitching but just got all kinds of argu ments why
it can't be done. I gave up and would like to get another Warn ke if possible.
However, since I'm on the list now I wonder what others
are using that they are happy with. Any recommendations for a good cruis d : http://explorer.msn.com >>
Unlike yours, my Aymar/Demuth prop is slightly overpitched. My plane has a
167 (+/-) knot (190 mph) max cruise, but I usually throttle back to 2350-2400
rpm, which is >150 knots. The difficulty comes at the low end of the speed
range, where I only get 2100 rpm or so on takeoff. After flying it that way
for almost a year, I called the factory and asked if they could do a slight
re-pitch to give an additional 100 rpm or so across the board.
When I bought the prop, the sales pitch was: "We're a machine shop and can
dial a prop in to whatever pitch range you want. We have a lot of control
over our process". When I asked for the repitch the story changed to "We
don't have enough process control to adjust your prop to deliver the
additional 100 rpm you want. To further discourage me, they quoted a 6-8
week turn time for repitching the prop. So far, I just have not had the
willpower to ground the airplane for long enough to have the prop repitched.
Most of the time, the low RPM on takeoff is only a slight inconvenience. The
airplane has a 400' ground roll on takeoff instead of 350', and only climbs
at 1000 fpm until I get it wound up to 130 knots (or 2300+ rpm) or so.
However, if I'm flying heavy (1675 lb), and the density altitude is up there,
the airplane's climb performance suffers.
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | tom sargent <sarg314(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | aeromedix escape tool |
I found an escape tool on the Aeromedix web site which apparently hasn't
been mentioned on the list before. At least I couldn't find any
reference to it with the search engine. It's made by Robin in Solingen
Germany. Looks like a scissors on steroids. See
www.aeromedix.com/uses/aviation.html
It's identified as the Robin "Safety Boy" Rescue Cutter, $65.
Does any one on the list have any experience with this product?
--
Tom Sargent.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Amit Dagan" <amitdagan(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Tail light wire routing |
For those building a 9 or 7, with the rudder light option:
How/where did you penetrate the F-711 and 712 bulkheads for routing the
wires ?
Thanks,
Amit.
amitdagan(at)hotmail.com
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Michael McGee <jmpcrftr(at)teleport.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Bahamas Pilot Guide |
>
>Being a rookie pilot I may have a dumb question. How do you guys fly to the
>Bahamas with a single engine? Are there a few land masses along the way or
>do you just pack a raft and pray for the engine not to fail?
>
>Rob
>RV7 waiting for the wings
A) The Pilot's Guide to the Bahamas and Caribbean is a must have for
flying between Florida and South America.
B) VFR flight in the Caribbean during the day, night flight is to be IFR.
C) It's a simple International Flight Plan on almost every flight,
something you get used to like position reporting and Estimated time to
______, (some of you guys remember position reporting?)
D) Now to toot my own horn...again, this (single engine) RV-4 made it
through the Caribbean to Venezuela and back. An airplane with no vacuum
pump (or AH or DG).
Here, click on the sunset or the drinking bird then follow the links to the
stories http://home.teleport.com/~jmpcrftr/Main.htm
or just go straight to the first installment
http://home.teleport.com/~jmpcrftr/Epilog/FandangoEpilogP1.htm
Flying in the Caribbean is the best flying I've done yet. Study, plan,
prepare, and enjoy. I had no hassles with customs or immigration or
fuel. Was with a group of 14 planes (only 3 twins) and can't wait to do it
again.
.."Beef Island Tower, RV 996RomeoVictor, ready for takeoff, VFR to
Guadeloupe, two souls and four hours of fuel".
"SixRomeoVictor cleared for takeoff, have a nice day"...
That was neat flying, had Jimmy Buffet songs running through my head for
months. I've been thinking about a 'round the Gulf Tour in 2004. East
coast of Mexico, Roatan, Trinidad, A-B-C's, Grenada, Martinique, BVI, La
Romana (Casa deCampo), Providentialles, Bahamas and back to Florida in
about three weeks. Maybe a half dozen to a dozen RV's.
Any takers?
MGM
Mike McGee, RV-4 N996RV, O320-E2G, Hillsboro, OR
13B in gestation mode
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated Tue, 6 Aug 2002 10:12:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, KBoatri144
writes:
> ". When I asked for the repitch the story changed to "We
> don't have enough process control to adjust your prop to deliver the
> additional 100 rpm you want. To further discourage me, they quoted a 6-8
> week turn time for repitching the prop. So far, I just have not had the
> willpower to ground the airplane for long enough to have
> the prop repitched.
IMHO you should talk with Clark Lydick at Performance Propeller. I don't have their
# handy but they usually have an ad in the back of SA.
I have one of their props on my Kitfox and I'm very happy with both the quality
and service.
My prop was over-pitched at first (my fault) and I sent it back and asked them
to give me 250 RPM more on takeoff. I had it back within 2 weeks and it turns
exactly 250 more.
I sent it back after 400 hrs for re-finish and again had it back in 2 weeks.
Danny Melnik
F1 #25
Melbourne (FL) Rocket Factory
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: aeromedix escape tool |
It says it "Smashes car and airplane windows". I don't think they realize
that airplane windows don't "smash" like glass does. I don't see how that
could have any leverage or weight necessary to break a canopy.
Not to open the "egress" thread again, but I still like the carrying a gun
option and shooting your way out :-)
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "tom sargent" <sarg314(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: aeromedix escape tool
>
> I found an escape tool on the Aeromedix web site which apparently hasn't
> been mentioned on the list before. At least I couldn't find any
> reference to it with the search engine. It's made by Robin in Solingen
> Germany. Looks like a scissors on steroids. See
>
> www.aeromedix.com/uses/aviation.html
>
>
> It's identified as the Robin "Safety Boy" Rescue Cutter, $65.
> Does any one on the list have any experience with this product?
>
> --
> Tom Sargent.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: SEAGER TRAINING @ 8th RV FORUM KFZY 9/7/02 |
Dave, I would also like to fly with Mike, My plane is finished, had the
inspection lastweek. I will be driving from NH so I can do later on friday
or early Sunday. Thanks, Ray Grenier
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill VonDane" <n8wv(at)hotmail.com> |
Give Ed Sterba a call... http://www.greatplainsas.com/ed.html
He make a good prop...
-Bill
http://vondane.com/rv8a
----- Original Message -----
From: <KBoatri144(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: propellers
In a message dated 8/6/02 10:46:49 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
Ewill177(at)hotmail.com writes:
<< I had a 70 x72 Warnke prop on my Rv-6 O320 but I broke it when landing
in four foot tall grass. Bought a 68 x 74 from Demuth and I just don't lik e
it. It was his recommendation but I have a half inch of throttle left
when the engine overspeeds at 2700. The best airspeed I can get is about 180.
I talked to Demuth about repitching but just got all kinds of argu ments why
it can't be done. I gave up and would like to get another Warn ke if possible.
However, since I'm on the list now I wonder what others
are using that they are happy with. Any recommendations for a good cruis d : http://explorer.msn.com >>
Unlike yours, my Aymar/Demuth prop is slightly overpitched. My plane has a
167 (+/-) knot (190 mph) max cruise, but I usually throttle back to
2350-2400
rpm, which is >150 knots. The difficulty comes at the low end of the speed
range, where I only get 2100 rpm or so on takeoff. After flying it that way
for almost a year, I called the factory and asked if they could do a slight
re-pitch to give an additional 100 rpm or so across the board.
When I bought the prop, the sales pitch was: "We're a machine shop and can
dial a prop in to whatever pitch range you want. We have a lot of control
over our process". When I asked for the repitch the story changed to "We
don't have enough process control to adjust your prop to deliver the
additional 100 rpm you want. To further discourage me, they quoted a 6-8
week turn time for repitching the prop. So far, I just have not had the
willpower to ground the airplane for long enough to have the prop repitched.
Most of the time, the low RPM on takeoff is only a slight inconvenience. The
airplane has a 400' ground roll on takeoff instead of 350', and only climbs
at 1000 fpm until I get it wound up to 130 knots (or 2300+ rpm) or so.
However, if I'm flying heavy (1675 lb), and the density altitude is up
there,
the airplane's climb performance suffers.
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Gordon" <dirtyrottenscoundrels(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Dimension Needed |
Hi,
Can someone help to save me an extra trip to the airport?
Does anyone have handy the center to center hole dimension for mounting
Van's ESM5-15OA adjustable voltage regulator. Mine recently failed and I
will be replacing it with a different style. I would like to make an
adapter mounting plate to accomodate the new one in the old holes. This
will save me an extra trip to the airport.
Thank you,
Glenn Gordon
N442E
55 hours.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Marvel <bmarvel(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Navaid autopilot |
Am looking for photos/drawings, etc. of the Navaid autopilot system in
an 8 or 8A. Anyone know of a web site that contains this info? Did not
find anything in the archives nor does Navaid have any information of
their own.
Bill Marvel
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Marvel <bmarvel(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Navaid autopilot |
Am looking for photos/drawings, etc. of the Navaid autopilot system in
an 8 or 8A. Anyone know of a web site that contains this info? Did not
find anything in the archives nor does Navaid have any information of
their own.
Bill Marvel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken Brooks" <kdbrv8r(at)charter.net> |
The recent thread about flammable oxygen made me recall an episode in the
Air Force that some of you may remember hearing about. Thankfully, I was
not on board that day, but except for the stroke of the scheduler's pen,
could have been.
Back in the mid 80s, a crew from my C-141 squadron in San Berdoo, CA was
merrily flying along headed east on an airdrop trip (in those days smoking
was still quite prevalent in the military), when one of the old heads
sitting in the jumpseat (an IP and Flight Examiner) lit up his stogie. One
of the two guys in the pilot seats at the time was an avid NON-smoker, and
after many protestations, all of which went unheeded, he donned his oxygen
mask to escape the noxious fumes.
Taking offense, and wishing to prove his superior intellect, the jump
seater disconnected the protestor's oxygen hose and blew a large amount of
cigar smoke into the disconnected end of the other guy's hose. While doing
so, an ember from the lit end of his stogie dropped into the business end of
the still-producing 100% O2 hose stub, instantly transforming it into a blow
torch.
Startled by the sudden flash and instant searing heat, he dropped the
end of the hose stub which began flailing about the cockpit like an
epileptic fire-breathing dragon which torched anything flammable in its
path. The cockpit filled with dense smoke almost immediately.
To make a long story short, the crew was able to get from 33,000 feet
over northern OK to Vance AFB in Enid, OK in about 7 minutes, land and
evacuate the airplane, and watch as millions of dollars of taxpayers' money
went up in smoke and flame.
During the subsequent investigation, the cockpit voice recorder and FAA
tapes were played back for the assembled crew and several of them wept
openly, their terror being rekindled by the mere playing of the tapes. They
all thought they were dead, including several in the back who didn't know
what was going on in the cockpit, only that the airplane was filling with
smoke and that the dive angle approached that of a water slide at
Aqua-World. It was a miracle that they all survived. The successful
approach and landing may have been the most impressive bit of airmanship
I've ever heard of, but the reason it was necessary in the first place is
among the most absurd.
FWIW. Just be careful with oxygen.
Ken in Roscoe
RV-8 Finish
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill VonDane" <n8wv(at)hotmail.com> |
rv-list(at)matronics.com
Anyone have a lead on a constant speed prop setup for an O320? I would need
everything...
Thanks...
-Bill
http://vondane.com/rv8a
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken Brooks" <kdbrv8r(at)charter.net> |
Since I have not yet decided on a prop for the -8, I talked with several
vendors at OSH and was pretty impressed with the new 2-blade offered by
Aero Composites. While quite pricey at $9500 for their CS, the design
tech was impressive and the experience of the designer (30 years with
Hamilton-Standard) was convincing that they have a better mouse-trap.
Anyone else who spoke with them at OSH have any thoughts?
See at: http://www.aerocomposites.com/html/index.html
Ken in Roscoe
RV-8 Finish
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Navaid autopilot |
I can send you something Friday if need be. I just put the servo on the
bottom skin (on brackets) behind the right foot well (so that the servo
clears the foot well). Since this positions the servo under the back
section of the cabin flooring, I cut the flooring and added a "cover" + nut
plates so that I can access the servo.
Rick Jory
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Marvel <bmarvel(at)cox.net>
Subject: RV-List: Navaid autopilot
>
> Am looking for photos/drawings, etc. of the Navaid autopilot system in
> an 8 or 8A. Anyone know of a web site that contains this info? Did not
> find anything in the archives nor does Navaid have any information of
> their own.
>
> Bill Marvel
>
> --
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "D. Wayne Stiles" <dwstiles(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re; supplemental O2 |
I have just sent an email to my sister-in-law who is a highly qualified
nurse-anesthetist about this O2 and face mask issue. I suspect that O2 used
in normal medical conditions is basically harmless. You see all sorts of
people using O2 bottles for breathing aid, including women wearing makeup.
100% O2 might be a bit different but only in degree. I too have seen many
WW II pilot and aircrew photos showing chapped and irritated facial areas;
but that could have been the result of the very dry bottled gas or air
mixture---more like a windburn than a heat burn. I doubt that anyone uses
100% O2 since it can be toxic in that concentration. Early divers learned
that the hard way.
Liquid O2 is REAL dangerous, but I doubt that most of the systems we would
use in a plane use the liquid form. Liquid O2 will cause instant oxidation.
In my volunteer fire fighting training we saw the results of several major
fire/explosions that resulted from liquid O2 getting dumped on asphault
paving. According to my HAZMAT instructor Liquid O2 haulers are a LOT more
hazardous that dynamite haulers. Gaseous O2 will help accellerate any
fire, but is not near as dangeous as the liquid form.
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Scott" <scott(at)hecenter.com> |
If your going to spend that much money, you should check out the MT
Propellers. I was watching an Aerobatic show on the "Wings" channel and just
about every plane had a MT prop on it...has to say something!
Scott
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Brooks" <kdbrv8r(at)charter.net>
Subject: RV-List: Propellers
>
> Since I have not yet decided on a prop for the -8, I talked with several
> vendors at OSH and was pretty impressed with the new 2-blade offered by
> Aero Composites. While quite pricey at $9500 for their CS, the design
> tech was impressive and the experience of the designer (30 years with
> Hamilton-Standard) was convincing that they have a better mouse-trap.
> Anyone else who spoke with them at OSH have any thoughts?
>
>
> See at: http://www.aerocomposites.com/html/index.html
>
> Ken in Roscoe
> RV-8 Finish
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Marvel <bmarvel(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Navaid autopilot |
Rick:
Would appreciate whatever you can send me. Am interested both for my -8A and
for a friend in Australia who wants to put a navaid in the -8 he is building.
FYI the guys at Navaid would appreciate it too. They have no feedback yet on
-8 installations.
Bill Marvel
Rick Jory wrote:
>
> I can send you something Friday if need be. I just put the servo on the
> bottom skin (on brackets) behind the right foot well (so that the servo
> clears the foot well). Since this positions the servo under the back
> section of the cabin flooring, I cut the flooring and added a "cover" + nut
> plates so that I can access the servo.
> Rick Jory
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)comcast.net> |
There is a lot of talk in the archives about seat foam and and making
seats, but not much talk about keeping them in place on the plane.
One person mentioned using velcro (sticky on the metal side and sewn on
on the fabric side).
My experience with the stick on is that summer heat melts the glue and
things move around.
How is everyone 'nailing' the seats down?
Barry Pote RV9a
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
Ken, Van's can supply you with a new Hartzell for alittle more than Half
the cost + governor. Ours has been great.
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (175kts and climbing)
>From: "Ken Brooks" <kdbrv8r(at)charter.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: "rv-list"
>Subject: RV-List: Propellers
>Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 10:51:23 -0500
>
>
>Since I have not yet decided on a prop for the -8, I talked with several
>vendors at OSH and was pretty impressed with the new 2-blade offered by
>Aero Composites. While quite pricey at $9500 for their CS, the design
>tech was impressive and the experience of the designer (30 years with
>Hamilton-Standard) was convincing that they have a better mouse-trap.
>Anyone else who spoke with them at OSH have any thoughts?
>
>
>See at: http://www.aerocomposites.com/html/index.html
>
>Ken in Roscoe
>RV-8 Finish
>
>
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: seat fasteners |
Barry,
Velcro is the way to go. Just epoxy the side to metal if your concerned.
You'll have alot of opportunities to talk the cushions out and put them back
- such is easy with velcor. In addition, once you're belted in (assume
you're going with the 5-point) the cushions aren't going to move anyways.
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (100+ hours)
>From: barry pote <barrypote(at)comcast.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: RV-List Digest List
>Subject: RV-List: seat fasteners
>Date: Wed, 07 Aug 2002 14:54:01 -0400
>
>
>There is a lot of talk in the archives about seat foam and and making
>seats, but not much talk about keeping them in place on the plane.
>
>One person mentioned using velcro (sticky on the metal side and sewn on
>on the fabric side).
>
>My experience with the stick on is that summer heat melts the glue and
>things move around.
>
>How is everyone 'nailing' the seats down?
>
>Barry Pote RV9a
>
>
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bert Forero" <bert6(at)mybluelight.com> |
Hi:
For those who answered my posting, for the videos,
I let you know I was on vacation. Return today
8/7/02.
I am responding to all, Friday., with details.
Thanks
Bert
Sign up for Internet Service under $10 dollars a month, at http://isp.BlueLight.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dale Hesselroth" <notice(at)dtgi.com> |
| Subject: | RV-7/7A Preview Plans Set/Construction Manual for sale |
Just a quick reminder (last message I promise!):
Regrettably, I'm going to be unable to start construction of an RV-7A for a
while, so I'm selling the preview plans on eBay. They're in perfect
condition, I just read/flipped through them once.
If you haven't used eBay before, it's a piece of cake. You can pay with
VIsa or Mastercard, or send a personal check.
Here's the link:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1553835753&rd=1
Thanks.
Dale
P.S. Here are Van's links about the manual:
http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/ppset.htm
http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/conmanul.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Louis Willig <larywil(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: seat fasteners and some other thoughts |
>
>There is a lot of talk in the archives about seat foam and and making
>seats, but not much talk about keeping them in place on the plane.
>
>One person mentioned using velcro (sticky on the metal side and sewn on
>on the fabric side).
>
>My experience with the stick on is that summer heat melts the glue and
>things move around.
The seat bottoms and backs don't get as hot as other areas that are exposed
to the sun's rays. If the glued on strip is wider (read that as "larger
area") than the strip that is sewn onto the seat cushion, the resistance
to tear away from the metal is reduced.
I actually don't trust any system of "nailing them down". When I fly solo,
my rear cushions go into the baggage compartment, which is then kept closed
by the rear seat belts. I once had an "adventure" while doing some
aerobatics. The rear seat bottom came loose and partially obstructed the
rear stick movement. I made an OK landing but it could have been a
disaster (read "FAA accident statistic").
I also no longer fly with the rear stick inserted. I fashioned an easy to
use hand screw so that if I am carrying a "competent passenger" I can
quickly replace the stick. When flying alone or with a non pilot passenger,
I can quickly remove the stick and put it in the baggage compartment.
You know, its the little things that take time to learn. You have to hope
you don't kill yourself by the time you get them sorted out and made part
of your flying discipline. I'm still having problems remembering to switch
tanks.
Louis
Louis I Willig
1640 Oakwood Dr.
Penn Valley, PA 19072
610 668-4964
RV-4, N180PF
190HP IO-360, C/S prop
255 exciting Hrs.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <terrywatson3(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: aeromedix escape tool |
>
> It says it "Smashes car and airplane windows". I don't think they realize
> that airplane windows don't "smash" like glass does. I don't see how that
> could have any leverage or weight necessary to break a canopy.
>
I noticed in the operator's manual for my friend's Cirrus SR-22 that it says
it has an 8 oz ball peen hammer for breaking out the windows in an
emergency. When we flew to lunch today, I took a look at it. Standard
hardware store fiberglass handled ball peen hammer. I think it said
"Roughneck" on the side.
It is possible that the ball peen would work better on the Cirrus than on an
RV, since the Cirrus has windows in the doors rather than a bubble canopy
like my 8A.
When we got back to Paine Field, Mike Robins was doing a run-up on his
beautiful RV-8 and the Mesherschmit ME-262 was doing high-speed taxi tests.
Terry
RV-8A #80729
canopy & skirts
Seattle
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Navaid autopilot |
> Am looking for photos/drawings, etc. of the Navaid autopilot system in
> an 8 or 8A. Anyone know of a web site that contains this info? Did not
> find anything in the archives nor does Navaid have any information of
> their own.
>
> Bill Marvel
Bill,
Try this...
http://www.rv-8.com/IdeasProducts.htm
Randy Lervold
RV-8, 234 hrs.
www.rv-8.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George McNutt" <gmcnutt(at)intergate.ca> |
| Subject: | Lightspeed Plug Inserts |
The setup - a single Lightspeed electronic ignition with automotive
sparkplugs in brass inserts, as per instructions, installed the brass
inserts into the cylinders dry and torqued to 25 ft/lbs, the plugs were
installed into the inserts with copperlube anti-sieze compound and torqued
to 15 ft/lb.
On removing the plugs for the first time all the brass inserts came out.
My question is this -
is copper based anti-sieze on the plugs incompatible with the brass insert
and if so what should be used?
George McNutt
Langley, B.C.
6A-60hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RGray67968(at)aol.com |
Folks,
RV6 N586RG is now official. FAA inspection was a little rough with the
AeroSport Power engine (Read 'Bart'). My data plate and logs all read
'Lycoming' and Mr. Inspector informed me that this was NOT a Lycoming
engine.......'See, look at the data plate on the engine'. Fortunately I had
another data plate on hand (can you believe that-who has a spare data plate?)
and scurried down to the engraver (1 hour round trip) while Mr. FAA looked
over the bird. Plus I had to notarize another 'I built the plane form' (had a
spare one of those too) because it read 'Lycoming'. The bird itself passed
with flying (no pun intended') colors - 3 hours total inspection/paperwork
time).
3 hours later and the plane was back together and YEEHAAAAA!!! First
flight at 1930 hours Eastern (Ohio Buffalo Farm time). What can I say - it
was a dream come true! Nervous? You bet!! A kiss and hug to the wife and
kids, a prayer at the hold line and a call to the tower and I was off. I
slowly advanced the throttle, felt the plane accelerate.............next
thing I know I looked down and was climbing at 140mph at 1600fpm with just
very slight backpressure. Circled the AP at 6000' and EVERYTHING was a - ok.
Oh yea, and this plane performs as advertised - FAST!! No GPS check but
initial (not confirmed) airspeed was 190mph at 23.5"mp and 2400rpm
(O-360/Warnke ACS). Hands off the stick and she was rock solid. I couldn't
believe that I was actually flying a plane that I built in my basement -
someone please pinch me!!! The landing??? The proverbial 'greaser' on the
numbers. It does not get any better folks!!! Can you tell I'm a little
exited?? Day night VFR, full insulation and interior, and the 'fat boy lay it
on heavy paint job' still came in at 1038lbs.
Special thanks to my wife and family, Bill Connelly, the Church
brothers, and of course - Paul (Rosie) Rosales (moral and tech support and a
GREAT friend) for making my dream come true!!!!
Can't wait to post the pictures - hang in there - more to come - off
to the airport in the morning (3 weeks vacation :
)) for flight #2 of the
'test program'.
Oh yea - KEEP POUNDING THOSE RIVETS - I couldn't wait to type that :
)
Rick Gray RV6 (Ohio) at the Buffalo Farm - this baby is now FLYING - Yee
haaaa!!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bud <RV-6(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Warnke Props BAD |
CONSIDERING A WARNKE PROP ?
I urge you to reconsider
I ordered a prop from Margie Warnke on 10/09/01. I was promised delivery
in 12 weeks. I made a special point of asking will I really have the
prop in 12 weeks because my airplane was grounded in the mean time. I
was assured I would have it in 12 weeks. It arrived on 5/2/02 seven
months later and four months over due. It wasn't supposed to take four
months from the beginning. And I was supposedly given special
consideration because I was grounded. She insists on full payment up
front so you have little recourse.
Margie Warnke is a horrible person to do business with. She continuously
lied about the progress of the prop. To the very end she told me on a
Friday it was done and would be shipped that day. Then I was told
whoever does her shipping missed the deadline so it didn't get shipped.
It wasn't shipped until Tuesday. That's a pretty big miss.
Of course when I got it, it wasn't finished. It had to be tried then
sent back for fine-tuning. When I shipped it back I was told I would
have it back in two weeks, it took four. Better than I expected.
But the worst part is when I got it back it was terrible. It shook the
airplane badly, even at idle. Initial acceleration was dismal and climb
was down 300 fpm. This was after she repitched it to increase the RPMs.
Now she won't return my calls.
After leaving several massages on her machine she had someone else call
me back to tell me she wasn't available for at least 45 days because
they are moving to Alaska. After a couple of weeks the message on her
machine hadn't changed (leave a message and I'll get back to you)
nothing about being unavailable or moving. So I decided to leave another
message with a different name and my cell number. What do you know she
call back the same day. Now she lies some more, claimes she hasn't
gotten the letter I sent over a month earlier with the performance
numbers and a request for my money back. She said it's because the mail
is being forwarded to Alaska but she called me from Arizona.
This tale could take up several pages. It's been a maddening experience
that I wouldn't wish on anybody.
Buyer beware.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Nellis" <mike(at)bmnellis.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Constant Speed |
What's the deal? You tired of that stick out front?
Hey, you made any progress on my publishing problem?
Thanks,
Mike
>
> Anyone have a lead on a constant speed prop setup for an O320? I would
need
> everything...
>
> Thanks...
>
> -Bill
> http://vondane.com/rv8a
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RGray67968(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Warnke Props BAD |
In a message dated 8/7/02 7:40:03 PM Pacific Daylight Time, RV-6(at)attbi.com
writes:
> This tale could take up several pages. It's been a maddening experience
> that I wouldn't wish on anybody.
Just had to respond to this one - My prop took 16 weeks for delivery (I was
told 12 weeks). This finished product is IMHO a work of art. Margie treated
me great and returned any and all calls I made. It sounds like 'your mileage
may vary'.
Rick Gray RV6 WARNKE and love it (Ohio) at the Buffalo Farm - FLYING!!!!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bobpaulo(at)aol.com |
The tools are sold. Thanks, Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bobpaulo(at)aol.com |
Thank you all for all the help that many of you have provided to me over the
past few years. I wish you all the best, and I hold highly the true
professionalism that most all here on the list exhibit.
There really is no reason for me to take up wave space here any longer being
that my "plane stuff" is now in the process of being sold.
I thank you all for the get well wishes, and phone calls over the past few
months.
I am still in the process of getting some new teeth and the burns are making
progress.
Who knows, perhaps someday I will want to build again. I wish you all the
best.
Thanks again,
Bob Paulovich, Bryant, Arkansas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
91.205 says, in part, IFR planes require
Gyroscopic direction indicator (directional gyro or equivalent).
What are some examples of what does and does not qualify as
equivalent....and who's to say?
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bobpaulo(at)aol.com |
I would like to thank you all for all the support and answers to my sometimes
dumb questions during the past couple of years. I really appreciate the
professionalism displayed by most everyone on the list. This forum is a true
help-as most of you know. There is no need for me to continue taking up space
here being that the kit is sold and appears that the tools will be gone
shortly. It's similar to burying a family member.
As for my condition, I am in the process of getting a few teeth and the burns
are healing. I am thankful to be alive, so I can't complain.
Again, it has been fun, and I wish each and everyone of you the best of luck.
Bob in Arkansas
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bud <RV-6(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: [Fwd: Re: EZ-List: Warnke Props BAD] |
-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: EZ-List: Warnke Props BAD
Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 20:43:45 -0700
From: "Marc" <borommarc(at)earthlink.net>
--> EZ-List message posted by: "Marc"
Things haven't changed.
I think it may be useful for some to learn of my experience with Margie
Warnke Propellers. The experience has been a very disappointing and
disturbing one. After four months of testing and tweaking without achieving
the claimed performance, Margie Warnke took the unfinished prop back with a
promise to refund my money. She has kept the unfinished prop and has kept
my money ($950). I just got a court judgment against her today for the full
amount plus court charges. This interaction has gone on for more than a
year and is not yet over. I still have neither a refund nor a prop.
I would, based on my experience, not recommend her services to anyone.
Here are some of the details.
In April of 2000 I talked with Margie Warnke of Tucson and she assured me
that her propeller could easily gain me 25 mph in speed over what I was
achieving with my Great American prop (now out of business). I said,
"Great. Let's do it.". Warnke advertises in Sport Aviation and touts a
"Satisfaction Guaranteed" offer.
Instead of the promised 5 week delivery, I finally received my prop (in a
rough state) for testing after waiting almost 16 weeks. Then came the
debacle of bolthole drilling. The first bolt circle was drilled too small.
The second bolt circle was drilled to the correct dimensions and offset by
30 degrees (are you counting? That's 12 holes in the hub). The 30 degree
offset prevented the spinner from fitting. A third bolt circle was drilled
with the correct dimensions and in the same alignment as the first and
smaller bolt circle. The drill wandered. The third bolt circle had to then
be drilled oversized, re-filled with epoxy and re-drilled to size. That's
18 holes in the same hub. I was assured by Warnke that this was
structurally sound. Who was I to say?? I am not a prop manufacturer.
My first takeoff was a near disaster. During static runup the prop achieved
2340 rpm, but it dropped to 2210 on roll out. The plane was reluctant to
rotate. After rotation, the plane initially climbed out at a scary 100 fpm.
Cruise speed was 150 kts - 5 kts less than my Great American. After two
prop "tweakings" the cruise speed got to 155 kts - equal to but not greater
than
the Great American, and certainly far below the promised speed increase of
25 mph. As I recalled, the test was going to be - take my Great American
off, and put her magic "Air Claw" on, and the improvement, with proper
tweaking, would be dramatic. Didn't work that way. I had gained access to
Warnke's physical worksite, and I thought our interactions had all been
cordial and mutually educational. She, however, ended up blaming the less
than dramatic performance of her prop on my "weak engine" and "draggy
airframe". I, however, think that 155 kts TAS cruise with a Lyc O-235C1 and
my old prop is not shabby for a "weak engine" and a "draggy airframe".
In November, 2000 Warnke said she wanted "her" prop back and that she would
return my money. I returned the prop and never received any refund. I
finally had to take her to court over the money and won a full judgment
against her on May 8, 2001 - more than a year after I first ordered the
prop. I had my checks to her sent to me and got her banking information as
to where she banks or what her social security number is. After I finally
garnisheed her bank account, she paid up.
I have heard similar stories from other people (out of state) who have dealt
with Warnke. Their problem is that
they can't take her to Small Claims court without filing in Tucson. I guess
you could say that the courts protect the accused even when they are the
offenders.
She ordinarily deals with her customers through a Mail Box Etc. mailing
address and a voice mail system. I
will never again deal with a manufacturer who has an unlisted manufacturing
site and an unlisted personal phone number and home address.
Caveat emptor.
Marc Borom
LongEZ
N966EZ
Ryan Field
Tucson, AZ
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bud"
Subject: EZ-List: Warnke Props BAD
> --> EZ-List message posted by: Bud
>
> CONSIDERING A WARNKE PROP ?
>
> I urge you to reconsider
>
>
> I ordered a prop from Margie Warnke on 10/09/01. I was promised delivery
> in 12 weeks. I made a special point of asking will I really have the
> prop in 12 weeks because my airplane was grounded in the mean time. I
> was assured I would have it in 12 weeks. It arrived on 5/2/02 seven
> months later and four months over due. It wasn't supposed to take four
> months from the beginning. And I was supposedly given special
> consideration because I was grounded. She insists on full payment up
> front so you have little recourse.
>
> Margie Warnke is a horrible person to do business with. She continuously
> lied about the progress of the prop. To the very end she told me on a
> Friday it was done and would be shipped that day. Then I was told
> whoever does her shipping missed the deadline so it didn't get shipped.
> It wasn't shipped until Tuesday. That's a pretty big miss.
>
> Of course when I got it, it wasn't finished. It had to be tried then
> sent back for fine-tuning. When I shipped it back I was told I would
> have it back in two weeks, it took four. Better than I expected.
>
> But the worst part is when I got it back it was terrible. It shook the
> airplane badly, even at idle. Initial acceleration was dismal and climb
> was down 300 fpm. This was after she repitched it to increase the RPMs.
> Now she won't return my calls.
>
> After leaving several massages on her machine she had someone else call
> me back to tell me she wasn't available for at least 45 days because
> they are moving to Alaska. After a couple of weeks the message on her
> machine hadn't changed (leave a message and I'll get back to you)
> nothing about being unavailable or moving. So I decided to leave another
> message with a different name and my cell number. What do you know she
> call back the same day. Now she lies some more, claimes she hasn't
> gotten the letter I sent over a month earlier with the performance
> numbers and a request for my money back. She said it's because the mail
> is being forwarded to Alaska but she called me from Arizona.
>
> This tale could take up several pages. It's been a maddening experience
> that I wouldn't wish on anybody.
>
> Buyer beware.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bud <RV-6(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Warnke Props BAD |
Rick
I'm glad to here you like your prop.
I have to admit the finish was beautiful except that the labels she put
on bubbled up under the finish.
Than I flew through a rain shower for about 15 minutes and the paint on
the leading edge chipped off in big chunks.
RGray67968(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>Just had to respond to this one - My prop took 16 weeks for delivery (I was
>told 12 weeks). This finished product is IMHO a work of art. Margie treated
>me great and returned any and all calls I made. It sounds like 'your mileage
>may vary'.
>Rick Gray RV6 WARNKE and love it (Ohio) at the Buffalo Farm - FLYING!!!!!!
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
I recently posted the following enquiry:
From: "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com>
Subject: RV-List: Warnke Props.
"A friend of mine who has infrequent web access is in the finishing
stage
of an RV4. He has a Warnke prop on order and some time ago I sent him a
copy of another lister's worries over slow delivery. I received this
from Mike today.
"Back when you sent me this, (the original enquiry), I was able to talk
to Margie Warnke and get status on my prop. She'd had a death in the
family and was temporarily out of touch. I've called from time to time
just to check status but havent pushed since I dont need the prop right
away.
Today I tried to call and the number is disconnected. There's a
forwarding number to a voice mail so I left a message. I know Margie
was planning a move to Alaska so maybe that's the story. But she'd told
me that she'd get my prop out before she moved.
I'm not currently on the RV list and don't want to subscribe because of
the massive amounts of mail. I checked the archive and there is no
recent news about the status of Warnke. Can you do me a favor and check
with the list to see if anyone knows what's going on?"
This sounds rather worrying. Does anyone on the list know whats
happening with Margie Warnke? "
He has since heard from her and all is well. The breakdown in
communications was due to her moving the business to a new location.
Thanks to all who contacted me.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A fuse. N919RV resvd.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Aero Composites props |
| From: | czechsix(at)juno.com |
I checked out the Aero Composites guys at OSH too, and was very
impressed. I think in terms of design they are about as advanced
anything in existence. There were a couple Lancair guys in the Aero
Composites booth when I stopped by and they told me that the performance
of the A.C. prop they had just tested on one of their factory demo
aircraft blew the Hartzell completely out of the water. The guy told me
that they saw a climb rate increase from typical 2150 fpm with the
Hartzell to 3000 fpm with the Aero Composites, and that it is so smooth
he thought on the first flight with it that the engine had quit because
the vibration was gone. That kind of change in climb performance sounds
a bit far-fetched to me but in principle it makes sense that Aero
Composites could be getting a very significant advantage due to lighter
weight, much thinner blades, and better airfoils and twist distribution
than a metal prop can achieve. I suspect it will also outperform the MT
series because they use wood cores and are therefore thicker than the
carbon fiber blades A.C. uses.
It'll be a long time before I'm sending Aero Composites my money (partly
because I'm conservative and would rather "wait and see" but more so
because I don't have $10K to spend on a C.S. prop right now : ) I think
for the price it's one of those items that you could never justify in
terms of bang for the buck, but if money's not a problem and you want the
absolute best performance, Aero Composites or Whirlwind probably has your
answer...
--Mark Navratil
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
RV-8A N2D fitting canopy....
_______
From: "Ken Brooks" <kdbrv8r(at)charter.net>
Subject: RV-List: Propellers
Since I have not yet decided on a prop for the -8, I talked with several
vendors at OSH and was pretty impressed with the new 2-blade offered by
Aero Composites. While quite pricey at $9500 for their CS, the design
tech was impressive and the experience of the designer (30 years with
Hamilton-Standard) was convincing that they have a better mouse-trap.
Anyone else who spoke with them at OSH have any thoughts?
See at: http://www.aerocomposites.com/html/index.html
Ken in Roscoe
RV-8 Finish
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug Gray <douggray(at)ihug.com.au> |
| Subject: | Re: Re; supplemental O2 |
I heard once and the truth of this needs to be tested, medical O2 is not
formally approved for use in aircraft due to a higher permitted moisture
content. Something about interfering with regulator operation at low
atmospheric pressure.
Regards,
Doug Gray
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stucklen" <wstucklen1(at)cox.net> |
Listers,
First, let me explain why I'm selling this wonderful plane. I have been
flying this aircraft for the last nine years, and building a second RV-6 for
the last four years. I've come to a point in the new aircraft construction
where I need to purchase the engine and avionics. Both will cost more than I
can current fund without raising some cash. And with the current employment
environment shaky at best, I'm not willing to borrow the money. So it's with
great hesitation that I'm putting this tried and true IFR aircraft up for
sale.
Here's the specifics:
1993 RV6A, 1987 TTAE, O-320-D1A 849 STOH, Sensenich Metal Prop, KX-125,
KY-97A, AT150 Xpdr, GX55 GPS, KR86 ADF, NAV 122A, KA134 Audio Panel, Shadin
"Mini-Flow" with GPS interface, Century I AP, SP400 intercom with stereo
interface, Electronics International RPM (R-1), Ultimate Scanner (US-8A),
Oil Press/temp (Opt-1), Volt/Amps (VA-1A-50), Electric trim/flaps, Impulse
Mag/Electronic Ignitions, 60 Amp Alternator, Alternate vacuum system, Dual
Brakes, Phlogiston Spar, always hangered. $55000 or best offer. More
pictures & documents at http://members.cox.net/rv6a4sale
email: rv6a4sale(at)cox.net
Fred Stucklen
N925RV
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | canopy breaking revisited |
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
SNIP It says it "Smashes car and airplane windows". I don't think they realize
that airplane windows don't "smash" like glass does. I don't see how that
could have any leverage or weight necessary to break a canopy.
Not to open the "egress" thread again, but I still like the carrying a gun
option and shooting your way out :-) SNIP
Here, here! I agree with that idea... unless you happen to fly to one of the more
backward states that won't recognize your carry permit.
My wife bought one of those "Smashes car and airplane windows" for me. It will
live under my work bench until my estate sale, which hopefully will be no sooner
than the year 2060!
Here's what I do. I carry a leatherman type pocket tool with me 100% of the time.
It's the lifetime guaranteed, longnose, locking pliers tool that you can get
at Autozone for $15. 30 seconds on the grinder and the longnose pliers will
have a nice canopy breaking point on them. And I ALWAYS know where they are.
And since I ALWAYS have them with me, they don't really add anything to the
empty weight of the plane, just to the bubba factor.
DO ARCHIVE!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: canopy breaking revisited |
I have a Gerber multi purpose tool, that I use quite frequently as well.
Come to think of it, it could be used as a canopy breaking (or cutting
tool). It has a hacksaw built into it, as well as other pointed items that
could do some damage to the canopy. Ok, I may have to cut my way out, but
come to think of it, I'm not gonna crash anyway, so what's the point?
....Of course I'm not serious.
Hey, how about we drum up a Leatherman vs. Gerber thread? My Gerber is
much nicer than the leading Leatherman brand, that's for sure :-)
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu>
Subject: RV-List: canopy breaking revisited
>
> SNIP It says it "Smashes car and airplane windows". I don't think they
realize
> that airplane windows don't "smash" like glass does. I don't see how that
> could have any leverage or weight necessary to break a canopy.
>
> Not to open the "egress" thread again, but I still like the carrying a gun
> option and shooting your way out :-) SNIP
>
> Here, here! I agree with that idea... unless you happen to fly to one of
the more backward states that won't recognize your carry permit.
>
> My wife bought one of those "Smashes car and airplane windows" for me. It
will live under my work bench until my estate sale, which hopefully will be
no sooner than the year 2060!
>
> Here's what I do. I carry a leatherman type pocket tool with me 100% of
the time. It's the lifetime guaranteed, longnose, locking pliers tool that
you can get at Autozone for $15. 30 seconds on the grinder and the
longnose pliers will have a nice canopy breaking point on them. And I
ALWAYS know where they are. And since I ALWAYS have them with me, they
don't really add anything to the empty weight of the plane, just to the
bubba factor.
>
> DO ARCHIVE!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: [Fwd: Re: EZ-List: Warnke Props BAD] |
Ever since Bernie died, it just hasn't been the same. Bernie would be
rolling over in his grave if he knew of this. I never had a "Bernie Warnke"
prop, but it is my understanding from people that knew him and his props
that they were first class.
Too bad Paul Irlbeck isn't making props anymore. His props are first class,
and he wouldn't even think twice about taking one back if you weren't happy.
I had one on my RV-6A and loved it. The smoothest running prop I've every
flown. Not to mention, I could climb out at 1800 FPM with a fixed pitch
wood prop!
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bud" <RV-6(at)attbi.com>
Subject: RV-List: [Fwd: Re: EZ-List: Warnke Props BAD]
>
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: EZ-List: Warnke Props BAD
> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 20:43:45 -0700
> From: "Marc" <borommarc(at)earthlink.net>
> To:
>
>
> --> EZ-List message posted by: "Marc"
>
> Things haven't changed.
>
> I think it may be useful for some to learn of my experience with Margie
> Warnke Propellers. The experience has been a very disappointing and
> disturbing one. After four months of testing and tweaking without
achieving
> the claimed performance, Margie Warnke took the unfinished prop back with
a
> promise to refund my money. She has kept the unfinished prop and has kept
> my money ($950). I just got a court judgment against her today for the
full
> amount plus court charges. This interaction has gone on for more than a
> year and is not yet over. I still have neither a refund nor a prop.
>
> I would, based on my experience, not recommend her services to anyone.
>
> Here are some of the details.
>
> In April of 2000 I talked with Margie Warnke of Tucson and she assured me
> that her propeller could easily gain me 25 mph in speed over what I was
> achieving with my Great American prop (now out of business). I said,
> "Great. Let's do it.". Warnke advertises in Sport Aviation and touts a
> "Satisfaction Guaranteed" offer.
>
> Instead of the promised 5 week delivery, I finally received my prop (in a
> rough state) for testing after waiting almost 16 weeks. Then came the
> debacle of bolthole drilling. The first bolt circle was drilled too
small.
> The second bolt circle was drilled to the correct dimensions and offset by
> 30 degrees (are you counting? That's 12 holes in the hub). The 30 degree
> offset prevented the spinner from fitting. A third bolt circle was
drilled
> with the correct dimensions and in the same alignment as the first and
> smaller bolt circle. The drill wandered. The third bolt circle had to
then
> be drilled oversized, re-filled with epoxy and re-drilled to size. That's
> 18 holes in the same hub. I was assured by Warnke that this was
> structurally sound. Who was I to say?? I am not a prop manufacturer.
>
> My first takeoff was a near disaster. During static runup the prop
achieved
> 2340 rpm, but it dropped to 2210 on roll out. The plane was reluctant to
> rotate. After rotation, the plane initially climbed out at a scary 100
fpm.
> Cruise speed was 150 kts - 5 kts less than my Great American. After two
> prop "tweakings" the cruise speed got to 155 kts - equal to but not
greater
> than
> the Great American, and certainly far below the promised speed increase of
> 25 mph. As I recalled, the test was going to be - take my Great American
> off, and put her magic "Air Claw" on, and the improvement, with proper
> tweaking, would be dramatic. Didn't work that way. I had gained access
to
> Warnke's physical worksite, and I thought our interactions had all been
> cordial and mutually educational. She, however, ended up blaming the less
> than dramatic performance of her prop on my "weak engine" and "draggy
> airframe". I, however, think that 155 kts TAS cruise with a Lyc O-235C1
and
> my old prop is not shabby for a "weak engine" and a "draggy airframe".
>
> In November, 2000 Warnke said she wanted "her" prop back and that she
would
> return my money. I returned the prop and never received any refund. I
> finally had to take her to court over the money and won a full judgment
> against her on May 8, 2001 - more than a year after I first ordered the
> prop. I had my checks to her sent to me and got her banking information
as
> to where she banks or what her social security number is. After I finally
> garnisheed her bank account, she paid up.
> I have heard similar stories from other people (out of state) who have
dealt
> with Warnke. Their problem is that
> they can't take her to Small Claims court without filing in Tucson. I
guess
> you could say that the courts protect the accused even when they are the
> offenders.
> She ordinarily deals with her customers through a Mail Box Etc. mailing
> address and a voice mail system. I
> will never again deal with a manufacturer who has an unlisted
manufacturing
> site and an unlisted personal phone number and home address.
>
> Caveat emptor.
>
> Marc Borom
> LongEZ
> N966EZ
> Ryan Field
> Tucson, AZ
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bud"
> To:
> Subject: EZ-List: Warnke Props BAD
>
>
> > --> EZ-List message posted by: Bud
> >
> > CONSIDERING A WARNKE PROP ?
> >
> > I urge you to reconsider
> >
> >
> > I ordered a prop from Margie Warnke on 10/09/01. I was promised delivery
> > in 12 weeks. I made a special point of asking will I really have the
> > prop in 12 weeks because my airplane was grounded in the mean time. I
> > was assured I would have it in 12 weeks. It arrived on 5/2/02 seven
> > months later and four months over due. It wasn't supposed to take four
> > months from the beginning. And I was supposedly given special
> > consideration because I was grounded. She insists on full payment up
> > front so you have little recourse.
> >
> > Margie Warnke is a horrible person to do business with. She continuously
> > lied about the progress of the prop. To the very end she told me on a
> > Friday it was done and would be shipped that day. Then I was told
> > whoever does her shipping missed the deadline so it didn't get shipped.
> > It wasn't shipped until Tuesday. That's a pretty big miss.
> >
> > Of course when I got it, it wasn't finished. It had to be tried then
> > sent back for fine-tuning. When I shipped it back I was told I would
> > have it back in two weeks, it took four. Better than I expected.
> >
> > But the worst part is when I got it back it was terrible. It shook the
> > airplane badly, even at idle. Initial acceleration was dismal and climb
> > was down 300 fpm. This was after she repitched it to increase the RPMs.
> > Now she won't return my calls.
> >
> > After leaving several massages on her machine she had someone else call
> > me back to tell me she wasn't available for at least 45 days because
> > they are moving to Alaska. After a couple of weeks the message on her
> > machine hadn't changed (leave a message and I'll get back to you)
> > nothing about being unavailable or moving. So I decided to leave another
> > message with a different name and my cell number. What do you know she
> > call back the same day. Now she lies some more, claimes she hasn't
> > gotten the letter I sent over a month earlier with the performance
> > numbers and a request for my money back. She said it's because the mail
> > is being forwarded to Alaska but she called me from Arizona.
> >
> > This tale could take up several pages. It's been a maddening experience
> > that I wouldn't wish on anybody.
> >
> > Buyer beware.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill VonDane" <n8wv(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Constant Speed |
Just want better performance...
Sorry about your site, I have been having a rough time lately. I had to
move this last weekend again. It's over between Debi and I...
Oh, and I got an IM from the guy that is hosting my server yesterday. He
didn't actually come out and say it, but I don't think his business is going
to be around for much longer. I am looking for alternative web hosting for
myself. I think I will be getting an account that will allow me to host
multiple domains, so maybe I can sill host yours...
I will let you know...
-Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Nellis" <mike(at)bmnellis.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Constant Speed
What's the deal? You tired of that stick out front?
Hey, you made any progress on my publishing problem?
Thanks,
Mike
>
> Anyone have a lead on a constant speed prop setup for an O320? I would
need
> everything...
>
> Thanks...
>
> -Bill
> http://vondane.com/rv8a
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | canopy breaking revisited |
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
SNIP It says it "Smashes car and airplane windows". I don't think they realize
that airplane windows don't "smash" like glass does. I don't see how that
could have any leverage or weight necessary to break a canopy.
Not to open the "egress" thread again, but I still like the carrying a gun
option and shooting your way out :-) SNIP
Here, here! I agree with that idea... unless you happen to fly to one of the more
backward states that won't recognize your carry permit.
My wife bought one of those "Smashes car and airplane windows" for me. It will
live under my work bench until my estate sale, which hopefully will be no sooner
than the year 2060!
Here's what I do. I carry a leatherman type pocket tool with me 100% of the time.
It's the lifetime guaranteed, longnose, locking pliers tool that you can get
at Autozone for $15. 30 seconds on the grinder and the longnose pliers will
have a nice canopy breaking point on them. And I ALWAYS know where they are.
And since I ALWAYS have them with me, they don't really add anything to the
empty weight of the plane, just to the bubba factor.
________________________________________________________________________________
jhoerste(at)ktc.com, elmcvay(at)ppco.com, wim(at)aaahawk.com
| Subject: | Instrument repairs |
| From: | Don Jordan <dons6a(at)juno.com> |
I am sending my Altimeter to JPM Instrument repair this week end. I think
this is going to be a good shop.
After I fix the altimeter & finished the flight test , I hope to have him
repaint the face of the airspeed.
I ask him a bunch of stupid questions & he answered all of them. Be sure
& tell him the RV list sent you so I can con him into a donation to
Matt's List.
JPM Instruments
1130 99th suite C
San Antonio, TX 78214
210-921-9211
pcapestany(at)jpmaircraftinstruments.com
Don Jordan - N6DJ - RV6A
Arlington, Tx
*******************************
--------- Forwarded message ----------
From: pcapestany(at)jpmaircraftinstruments.com
Date: Wed, 07 Aug 2002 18:25:01 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: list of problems
Message-ID:
<20020807182504.29179.h004.c001.wm(at)mail.jpmaircraftinstruments.com.critic
alpath.net>
Don,
You're welcome and when you have a chance we'd be
delighted to give you a tour of our shop.
The reason I have my own shop is because I was tired of
working for shops who are interested in making money
even if it took to rip their customers off. I was
taught "honesty is the best way to deal with people"
because in the long run people will respect you.
Since we opened our doors on June 28th of last year I
have done a few freebies for a 5 minute repair. (no
yellow tag because it was something external and didn't
have to open the instrument) It doesn't make sense to
be to a customer $65.00 (our hourly shop rate) for
taking his altimeter to zero feet, reset it, spot check
it at a couple of test points and give it back to him
knowing he will have to have a static check when it's
reinstalled in the airplane. Who would pay for a double
certification. I know I wouldn't. Sure it would be nice
to get a lot of those kinds of repairs and charge
$160.00 for an overhaul with a yellow tag and all but I
figure by doing this the customer will eventually come
back with peace of mind when something serious has
happened to his instrument. Doing this may not pay off
immediately but in time it will. We've had some who
we've done this and they have dropped off every
instrument from their panel for us to work on. Now if
the customer insist to have it certified then we do our
normal in depth inspection if it's just a functional
test only, that's what they will get, if it needs
repair, we tell them everything what was found, an
EXACT quote of the cost and we leave it up to them to
decide. If it's an overhaul, we give them an overhaul,
again we tell them exactly what was found and an exact
cost for them to decide. And by the way, if ANY parts
are replaced, you get the bad parts back for your
inspection and disposal. I can put my life right now
that NO OTHER SHOP will do that. I can even go as far
as no other shop will give you a 15 month warranty on
all their overhauls and a 4 month warranty on their
repairs. We have customers who are willing to vouch for
our work. Instruments that we have worked on are STILL
out there working like it was overhauled yesterday.
Well on that note, we'd be more than happy to check
your instruments and will give you a straight forward
answer what we found. If it was something simple that
took only 5 to 10 minutes it's free (no yellow tag).
But if it's more than that then we will quote you
exactly how much it will cost to repair if it needs
repair. As for the altimeter, if it checks out fine, it
will be certified, yellow tagged for $45.00 if it's a
20k foot altimeter.
We hope this will help you decide what you want to do
with your instruments and look forward in hearing from
you soon.
Best regards,
Phillip Capestany
General Manager
JPM Aircraft Instruments Service, Corp.
Visit our website for monthly specials at
www.jpmaircraftinstruments.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charles Brame <charleyb(at)earthlink.net> |
I've been interested in the Whirlwind 150 prop for some time. It is a
constant speed, composite, three blade that weighs about half that of a
2-blade Hartzell and is nearly ten pounds lighter than a three blade MT.
Its advertised price is about halfway between the 2-blade Hartzell and
an MT. However, the availability of the prop keeps slipping and is now
scheduled for sometime after the 1st of 2003. It was originally
scheduled for late 2001 and the excuse for that missed deadline was that
9/11 stopped their test flying. Supposedly, the prop is test flying on
several airplanes including several RV-8s, and, (I have been told) a
RV-6 .
Whirlwind Props is based in El Cajon, CA. They have been at Oshkosh in
previous years, but did not attend this year. They have a nice web
site:
http://www.whirlwindpropellers.com/html/aviation/aviation_150_series.shtml
Anybody have any first hand info on this prop. Are there design and/or
development problems we are not being told about? I'd be interested in
hearing from any of the test bed pilots - particularly those flying the
prop on an RV-6.
Charlie Brame
RV-6A N11CB - (Res.)
San Antonio
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
Rick,
CONGRATULATIONS and WELL DONE !!!
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A (100+hrs)
>From: RGray67968(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: YeeHaa
>Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 22:37:44 EDT
>
>
>Folks,
> RV6 N586RG is now official. FAA inspection was a little rough with
>the
>AeroSport Power engine (Read 'Bart'). My data plate and logs all read
>'Lycoming' and Mr. Inspector informed me that this was NOT a Lycoming
>engine.......'See, look at the data plate on the engine'. Fortunately I had
>another data plate on hand (can you believe that-who has a spare data
>plate?)
>and scurried down to the engraver (1 hour round trip) while Mr. FAA looked
>over the bird. Plus I had to notarize another 'I built the plane form' (had
>a
>spare one of those too) because it read 'Lycoming'. The bird itself passed
>with flying (no pun intended') colors - 3 hours total inspection/paperwork
>time).
> 3 hours later and the plane was back together and YEEHAAAAA!!!
>First
>flight at 1930 hours Eastern (Ohio Buffalo Farm time). What can I say - it
>was a dream come true! Nervous? You bet!! A kiss and hug to the wife and
>kids, a prayer at the hold line and a call to the tower and I was off. I
>slowly advanced the throttle, felt the plane accelerate.............next
>thing I know I looked down and was climbing at 140mph at 1600fpm with just
>very slight backpressure. Circled the AP at 6000' and EVERYTHING was a -
>ok.
>Oh yea, and this plane performs as advertised - FAST!! No GPS check but
>initial (not confirmed) airspeed was 190mph at 23.5"mp and 2400rpm
>(O-360/Warnke ACS). Hands off the stick and she was rock solid. I couldn't
>believe that I was actually flying a plane that I built in my basement -
>someone please pinch me!!! The landing??? The proverbial 'greaser' on the
>numbers. It does not get any better folks!!! Can you tell I'm a little
>exited?? Day night VFR, full insulation and interior, and the 'fat boy lay
>it
>on heavy paint job' still came in at 1038lbs.
> Special thanks to my wife and family, Bill Connelly, the Church
>brothers, and of course - Paul (Rosie) Rosales (moral and tech support and
>a
>GREAT friend) for making my dream come true!!!!
> Can't wait to post the pictures - hang in there - more to come -
>off
>to the airport in the morning (3 weeks vacation :
)) for flight #2 of the
>'test program'.
>Oh yea - KEEP POUNDING THOSE RIVETS - I couldn't wait to type that :
)
>Rick Gray RV6 (Ohio) at the Buffalo Farm - this baby is now FLYING - Yee
>haaaa!!!!
>
>
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Van Artsdalen, Scott" <svanarts(at)unionsafe.com> |
| Subject: | Re: [Fwd: Re: EZ-List: Warnke Props BAD] |
Shameless plug:
Craig Catto made my prop. The prop is first-rate and he is a helluva' nice
guy. I should be able to talk about the performance in a couple of months.
--
Scott VanArtsdalen, MCSE, CCNA
Network Manager
Union Safe Deposit Bank
209-946-5116
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Besing [mailto:azpilot(at)extremezone.com]
Subject: Re: RV-List: [Fwd: Re: EZ-List: Warnke Props BAD]
Ever since Bernie died, it just hasn't been the same. Bernie would be
rolling over in his grave if he knew of this. I never had a "Bernie Warnke"
prop, but it is my understanding from people that knew him and his props
that they were first class.
Too bad Paul Irlbeck isn't making props anymore. His props are first class,
and he wouldn't even think twice about taking one back if you weren't happy.
I had one on my RV-6A and loved it. The smoothest running prop I've every
flown. Not to mention, I could climb out at 1800 FPM with a fixed pitch
wood prop!
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bud" <RV-6(at)attbi.com>
Subject: RV-List: [Fwd: Re: EZ-List: Warnke Props BAD]
>
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: EZ-List: Warnke Props BAD
> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 20:43:45 -0700
> From: "Marc" <borommarc(at)earthlink.net>
> To:
>
>
> --> EZ-List message posted by: "Marc"
>
> Things haven't changed.
>
> I think it may be useful for some to learn of my experience with Margie
> Warnke Propellers. The experience has been a very disappointing and
> disturbing one. After four months of testing and tweaking without
achieving
> the claimed performance, Margie Warnke took the unfinished prop back with
a
> promise to refund my money. She has kept the unfinished prop and has kept
> my money ($950). I just got a court judgment against her today for the
full
> amount plus court charges. This interaction has gone on for more than a
> year and is not yet over. I still have neither a refund nor a prop.
>
> I would, based on my experience, not recommend her services to anyone.
>
> Here are some of the details.
>
> In April of 2000 I talked with Margie Warnke of Tucson and she assured me
> that her propeller could easily gain me 25 mph in speed over what I was
> achieving with my Great American prop (now out of business). I said,
> "Great. Let's do it.". Warnke advertises in Sport Aviation and touts a
> "Satisfaction Guaranteed" offer.
>
> Instead of the promised 5 week delivery, I finally received my prop (in a
> rough state) for testing after waiting almost 16 weeks. Then came the
> debacle of bolthole drilling. The first bolt circle was drilled too
small.
> The second bolt circle was drilled to the correct dimensions and offset by
> 30 degrees (are you counting? That's 12 holes in the hub). The 30 degree
> offset prevented the spinner from fitting. A third bolt circle was
drilled
> with the correct dimensions and in the same alignment as the first and
> smaller bolt circle. The drill wandered. The third bolt circle had to
then
> be drilled oversized, re-filled with epoxy and re-drilled to size. That's
> 18 holes in the same hub. I was assured by Warnke that this was
> structurally sound. Who was I to say?? I am not a prop manufacturer.
>
> My first takeoff was a near disaster. During static runup the prop
achieved
> 2340 rpm, but it dropped to 2210 on roll out. The plane was reluctant to
> rotate. After rotation, the plane initially climbed out at a scary 100
fpm.
> Cruise speed was 150 kts - 5 kts less than my Great American. After two
> prop "tweakings" the cruise speed got to 155 kts - equal to but not
greater
> than
> the Great American, and certainly far below the promised speed increase of
> 25 mph. As I recalled, the test was going to be - take my Great American
> off, and put her magic "Air Claw" on, and the improvement, with proper
> tweaking, would be dramatic. Didn't work that way. I had gained access
to
> Warnke's physical worksite, and I thought our interactions had all been
> cordial and mutually educational. She, however, ended up blaming the less
> than dramatic performance of her prop on my "weak engine" and "draggy
> airframe". I, however, think that 155 kts TAS cruise with a Lyc O-235C1
and
> my old prop is not shabby for a "weak engine" and a "draggy airframe".
>
> In November, 2000 Warnke said she wanted "her" prop back and that she
would
> return my money. I returned the prop and never received any refund. I
> finally had to take her to court over the money and won a full judgment
> against her on May 8, 2001 - more than a year after I first ordered the
> prop. I had my checks to her sent to me and got her banking information
as
> to where she banks or what her social security number is. After I finally
> garnisheed her bank account, she paid up.
> I have heard similar stories from other people (out of state) who have
dealt
> with Warnke. Their problem is that
> they can't take her to Small Claims court without filing in Tucson. I
guess
> you could say that the courts protect the accused even when they are the
> offenders.
> She ordinarily deals with her customers through a Mail Box Etc. mailing
> address and a voice mail system. I
> will never again deal with a manufacturer who has an unlisted
manufacturing
> site and an unlisted personal phone number and home address.
>
> Caveat emptor.
>
> Marc Borom
> LongEZ
> N966EZ
> Ryan Field
> Tucson, AZ
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bud"
> To:
> Subject: EZ-List: Warnke Props BAD
>
>
> > --> EZ-List message posted by: Bud
> >
> > CONSIDERING A WARNKE PROP ?
> >
> > I urge you to reconsider
> >
> >
> > I ordered a prop from Margie Warnke on 10/09/01. I was promised delivery
> > in 12 weeks. I made a special point of asking will I really have the
> > prop in 12 weeks because my airplane was grounded in the mean time. I
> > was assured I would have it in 12 weeks. It arrived on 5/2/02 seven
> > months later and four months over due. It wasn't supposed to take four
> > months from the beginning. And I was supposedly given special
> > consideration because I was grounded. She insists on full payment up
> > front so you have little recourse.
> >
> > Margie Warnke is a horrible person to do business with. She continuously
> > lied about the progress of the prop. To the very end she told me on a
> > Friday it was done and would be shipped that day. Then I was told
> > whoever does her shipping missed the deadline so it didn't get shipped.
> > It wasn't shipped until Tuesday. That's a pretty big miss.
> >
> > Of course when I got it, it wasn't finished. It had to be tried then
> > sent back for fine-tuning. When I shipped it back I was told I would
> > have it back in two weeks, it took four. Better than I expected.
> >
> > But the worst part is when I got it back it was terrible. It shook the
> > airplane badly, even at idle. Initial acceleration was dismal and climb
> > was down 300 fpm. This was after she repitched it to increase the RPMs.
> > Now she won't return my calls.
> >
> > After leaving several massages on her machine she had someone else call
> > me back to tell me she wasn't available for at least 45 days because
> > they are moving to Alaska. After a couple of weeks the message on her
> > machine hadn't changed (leave a message and I'll get back to you)
> > nothing about being unavailable or moving. So I decided to leave another
> > message with a different name and my cell number. What do you know she
> > call back the same day. Now she lies some more, claimes she hasn't
> > gotten the letter I sent over a month earlier with the performance
> > numbers and a request for my money back. She said it's because the mail
> > is being forwarded to Alaska but she called me from Arizona.
> >
> > This tale could take up several pages. It's been a maddening experience
> > that I wouldn't wish on anybody.
> >
> > Buyer beware.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
>
>91.205 says, in part, IFR planes require
>
>Gyroscopic direction indicator (directional gyro or equivalent).
>
>What are some examples of what does and does not qualify as
>equivalent
Vacuum DGs, electric DGs
>....and who's to say?
the Administrator, I''d guess. Surely not us. I doubt that Administrator
would accept duck and cat or Fido the bird dog
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6A for sale |
All,
I've had the pleasure of flying Fred's 6A and beside first rate constrctuion
it flys and handles exceptional well. Great 6A !
Chuck Rowbotham
RV-8A (flying)
>From: "Stucklen" <wstucklen1(at)cox.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: "RV-List"
>Subject: RV-List: RV6A for sale
>Date: Thu, 8 Aug 2002 07:57:09 -0400
>
>
>Listers,
>
> First, let me explain why I'm selling this wonderful plane. I have been
>flying this aircraft for the last nine years, and building a second RV-6
>for
>the last four years. I've come to a point in the new aircraft construction
>where I need to purchase the engine and avionics. Both will cost more than
>I
>can current fund without raising some cash. And with the current employment
>environment shaky at best, I'm not willing to borrow the money. So it's
>with
>great hesitation that I'm putting this tried and true IFR aircraft up for
>sale.
>
>Here's the specifics:
>
>1993 RV6A, 1987 TTAE, O-320-D1A 849 STOH, Sensenich Metal Prop, KX-125,
>KY-97A, AT150 Xpdr, GX55 GPS, KR86 ADF, NAV 122A, KA134 Audio Panel, Shadin
>"Mini-Flow" with GPS interface, Century I AP, SP400 intercom with stereo
>interface, Electronics International RPM (R-1), Ultimate Scanner (US-8A),
>Oil Press/temp (Opt-1), Volt/Amps (VA-1A-50), Electric trim/flaps, Impulse
>Mag/Electronic Ignitions, 60 Amp Alternator, Alternate vacuum system, Dual
>Brakes, Phlogiston Spar, always hangered. $55000 or best offer. More
>pictures & documents at http://members.cox.net/rv6a4sale
>email: rv6a4sale(at)cox.net
>
>Fred Stucklen
>N925RV
>
>
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Warnke Props BAD |
>
> CONSIDERING A WARNKE PROP ?
>
> I urge you to reconsider
>
This is really a shame. I bought my Warnke prop from Bernie a few years
before he died. He was easy to deal with, honest, talented, did what he said
he was going to do, was prompt, and got my order out within two or three
weeks. A real gentleman.
It's sorry to see a business that was built over many years based on
integrity and honesty slip into the abyss.
FWIW
John at Salida, Co
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Constant Speed |
THATS OK BILL
WE ARE ALL HERE FOR YOU.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
kempthornes wrote:
>
>
> >
> >91.205 says, in part, IFR planes require
> >
> >Gyroscopic direction indicator (directional gyro or equivalent).
> >
> >What are some examples of what does and does not qualify as
> >equivalent
>
> Vacuum DGs, electric DGs
>
> >....and who's to say?
>
> the Administrator, I''d guess. Surely not us. I doubt that Administrator
> would accept duck and cat or Fido the bird dog
>
> K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
> RV6-a N7HK flying!
> PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
I think what Larry is really aiming at with his question is "how do the
solid-state gyro gizmos fit into 91.205?".
This will be a valid question for those who are considering Blue Mtn,
Dynon, etc. equipment.
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us> |
Why doesn't someone just combine the escape tool with a fire extinguisher?
If there was a well bonded conical point on the bottom of the bottle, it
should have more than enough mass to punch through .032AL or .250 acryllic.
Just a thought to save some weight.
W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bruce Gray" <Bruce(at)glasair.org> |
I'm sure the FAA is struggling with this issue and may very well require
either a fully redundant second EFIS or a full steam gage backup for
approved IFR use.
Bruce
www.glasair.org
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam Buchanan
Subject: Re: RV-List: 91.205 DG
I think what Larry is really aiming at with his question is "how do the
solid-state gyro gizmos fit into 91.205?".
This will be a valid question for those who are considering Blue Mtn,
Dynon, etc. equipment.
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Bowen <lcbowen(at)yahoo.com> |
Thanks, but I already gathered that a vacuum/electric DG is equivalent to a
directional gyro! :)
Let me ask it a different way. Who on this list has an IFR capable plane
without a "traditional" DG? What do you have instead?
Mock HSI display on the handheld GPS?
Vertical card compass?
EFIS with compass tape (like BMA EFIS Lite)?
TruTrak digital mag heading display?
Flux gate compass like the blue Ritchie compass?
Are any of these valid "equivalents"?
-Larry
--- kempthornes wrote:
>
> >
> >91.205 says, in part, IFR planes require
> >
> >Gyroscopic direction indicator (directional gyro or equivalent).
> >
> >What are some examples of what does and does not qualify as
> >equivalent
>
> Vacuum DGs, electric DGs
>
> >....and who's to say?
>
> the Administrator, I''d guess. Surely not us. I doubt that Administrator
> would accept duck and cat or Fido the bird dog
>
>
> K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
> RV6-a N7HK flying!
> PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
HotJobs - Search Thousands of New Jobs
http://www.hotjobs.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Bowen <lcbowen(at)yahoo.com> |
The whickey compass doesn't qualify as backup?
Needle, ball and alcohol?
-Larry
--- Bruce Gray wrote:
>
> I'm sure the FAA is struggling with this issue and may very well require
> either a fully redundant second EFIS or a full steam gage backup for
> approved IFR use.
>
> Bruce
> www.glasair.org
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam Buchanan
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: 91.205 DG
>
>
>
> I think what Larry is really aiming at with his question is "how do the
> solid-state gyro gizmos fit into 91.205?".
>
> This will be a valid question for those who are considering Blue Mtn,
> Dynon, etc. equipment.
>
> Sam Buchanan
>
HotJobs - Search Thousands of New Jobs
http://www.hotjobs.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Larry Bowen <lcbowen(at)yahoo.com> |
You've mentioned previously that you were bringing your RV-6 up to IFR
standards --hopefully with the EFIS Lite as the centerpiece(I guess). What
backups are you planning on? Is it easier or harder to "get there" with your
initial, digital, VFR panel?
Thanks,
Larry
--- Sam Buchanan wrote:
>
>
> I think what Larry is really aiming at with his question is "how do the
> solid-state gyro gizmos fit into 91.205?".
>
> This will be a valid question for those who are considering Blue Mtn,
> Dynon, etc. equipment.
>
> Sam Buchanan
>
HotJobs - Search Thousands of New Jobs
http://www.hotjobs.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
The canopy buster in my RV-6 is the passenger side control stick. I
brief the passenger that if he/she has to break the canopy, pull out the
control stick, grab it with both hands, and have at it!
Didn't cost anything extra, no additional weight, and always on board.
Sam Buchanan
===============================
Wheeler North wrote:
>
>
> Why doesn't someone just combine the escape tool with a fire extinguisher?
>
> If there was a well bonded conical point on the bottom of the bottle, it
> should have more than enough mass to punch through .032AL or .250 acryllic.
>
> Just a thought to save some weight.
>
> W
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Aircraft Technical Book Co." <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
Sam,
What kind of quick disconnect fastener do you use to secure the 2nd stick in
place when you are not using it to bust the canopy?
Andy
>
>
> The canopy buster in my RV-6 is the passenger side control stick. I
> brief the passenger that if he/she has to break the canopy, pull out the
> control stick, grab it with both hands, and have at it!
>
> Didn't cost anything extra, no additional weight, and always on board.
>
> Sam Buchanan
>
> ===============================
>
> Wheeler North wrote:
> >
> >
> > Why doesn't someone just combine the escape tool with a fire extinguisher?
> >
> > If there was a well bonded conical point on the bottom of the bottle, it
> > should have more than enough mass to punch through .032AL or .250 acryllic.
> >
> > Just a thought to save some weight.
> >
> > W
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)msn.com> |
I'm using this same method. I use a clevis pin . . . obtained from my local
Ace Hardware. The pins have a hole in one in so you can insert/remove a
cotter pin designed for quick removal. It's a fairly simple set-up.
Rick Jory RV8A
----- Original Message -----
From: Aircraft Technical Book Co. <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Escape Tool
>
> Sam,
>
> What kind of quick disconnect fastener do you use to secure the 2nd stick
in
> place when you are not using it to bust the canopy?
>
> Andy
>
>
> >
> >
> > The canopy buster in my RV-6 is the passenger side control stick. I
> > brief the passenger that if he/she has to break the canopy, pull out the
> > control stick, grab it with both hands, and have at it!
> >
> > Didn't cost anything extra, no additional weight, and always on board.
> >
> > Sam Buchanan
> >
> > ===============================
> >
> > Wheeler North wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > Why doesn't someone just combine the escape tool with a fire
extinguisher?
> > >
> > > If there was a well bonded conical point on the bottom of the bottle,
it
> > > should have more than enough mass to punch through .032AL or .250
acryllic.
> > >
> > > Just a thought to save some weight.
> > >
> > > W
> > >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Laird Owens <owens(at)aerovironment.com> |
I did something similar to Sam.
I have a 2" long slug of steel that is turned to a sharp point
mounted in the bottom of the passenger stick (which is unsecured so I
can beat a wayward or hamfisted passenger). Probably weights 3-4 ozs.
I'm pretty sure it'll break a canopy, although I'm not willing to
test it on mine....
I do know that a hawk launched at sufficient speed will break a
canopy...hmmm...maybe a hawk launcher mounted behind flap brace.....
Hmmm....maybe not....environmentalists might get upset...then there's
the food bill and the hawk droppings.....but I digress....
Laird RV-6
SoCal
>
>The canopy buster in my RV-6 is the passenger side control stick. I
>brief the passenger that if he/she has to break the canopy, pull out the
>control stick, grab it with both hands, and have at it!
>
>Didn't cost anything extra, no additional weight, and always on board.
>
>Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
"Aircraft Technical Book Co." wrote:
>
>
> Sam,
>
> What kind of quick disconnect fastener do you use to secure the 2nd stick in
> place when you are not using it to bust the canopy?
>
> Andy
>
Andy, when I am not using the passenger control stick for bustin' the
canopy, driving in tie-down stakes, or beating off gorgeous wemin tryin'
to force themselves into the cabin, the control stick is either stowed
on the floorboard outboard of the passenger seat with broomclips, or is
merely slipped into the control stick, uh, socket. There is no fastener
for the stick, it just sits there waiting for the passenger to wiggle
it. I have not had anybody pull it out of the socket; maybe that is
because of the "Wing Removal Lever" inference in the passenger
briefing....... ;-)
Sam Buchanan (RV-6)
"The RV Journal" http://thervjournal.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bobpaulo(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Bob's Farewell... |
Thanks Jim, I shall take your advise. Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stucklen" <wstucklen1(at)cox.net> |
I don' use anything but friction to hold in the right side stick. Worked
just fine for the last 9 years ....
Fred Stucklen
N925RV
Flying with 1998 Hrs....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)msn.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Escape Tool
>
> I'm using this same method. I use a clevis pin . . . obtained from my
local
> Ace Hardware. The pins have a hole in one in so you can insert/remove a
> cotter pin designed for quick removal. It's a fairly simple set-up.
> Rick Jory RV8A
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
Larry Bowen wrote:
>
>
> You've mentioned previously that you were bringing your RV-6 up to IFR
> standards --hopefully with the EFIS Lite as the centerpiece(I guess). What
> backups are you planning on? Is it easier or harder to "get there" with your
> initial, digital, VFR panel?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Larry
Greg Richter called me last week and told me a new Lite was on the way,
but I have not yet received it. My intentions are to use the Lite (or
something similar) as the centerpiece of a simple IFR-capable panel. I
will retain the Navaid and RMI uEncoder as backups. I flew the RV-6
under the hood during my last BFR with only the Navaid, uEncoder, and
GPS, and while I hope I never have to do it in the clouds, I think I
could successfully get down with that very unconventional partial panel,
especially if I practice occassionally.
The uEncoder is actually a pretty nice backup instrument (airspeed,
altimeter, VSI) if you are already accustomed to flying per the little
numbers. It would be useless to somebody who had never flown the
instrument, but I have to use it often in our psuedo IFR skies here in
the muggy/hazy Southeast USA. In the course of the BFR, I quickly
determined that the first step if the main attitude stuff went down
would be to engage the Navaid; keeping the RV-6 pointed in the right
direction was much easier once I didn't have to concentrate of keeping
the wings level. The biggest problem I had was holding heading since the
Lowrance is mounted right of panel center in my plane, and having to
glance over to see heading was not good. I will strongly consider
getting the iPAQ/AnywhereMap closer to the center of my scan if IFR
flight becomes a possibility.
Personally, I consider a wing-leveler to be the most important backup in
a simple IFR panel. Being able keep the RV-6 in proper pitch trim is
also essential. Regardless of teh final configuration of the panel, I
will fly it many hours to work out the kinks (and regain my IFR
proficiency) before busting clouds.
As of now, the panel will consist of the BMA Lite, Navaid, RMI uEncoder,
Lowrance and AnywhereMap GPS's, KX125, and a digital chronometer. This
should be sufficient for punching through cloud layers, shooting VOR
approaches, and flying with confidence in marginal VFR.
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Garry LeGare <versadek(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Whirlwind Props |
I'm flying the RV6 testing for Whirlwind on the 150 series and have over 60
hrs on it so far. I know of three other 150 Series props flying, 2 on RV8s and
one on a Glasair. To the best of my knowledge no one has had any significant
problems regarding the prop.
If you asked me today, if I could exchange my Whirlwind for any other prop,
would I? Absolutely not! I never flow anything as smooth or as strong as this
prop.
Whirlwind has had props (not 150 Series) in aerobatic competition for a number
of years and know what it takes to make a great prop.
As far as selling props or taking deposits go, One of the reasons I got
involved with Whirlwind in the first place, was their commitment to not take
any deposits for the prop until they had completed significant testing. What
they do have is a waiting list for interested parties, and it doesn't require
a deposit to get on that list.
As others have said "beware of anybody, that asks for money," before they have
completed testing and manufacturing development.
Garry LeGare "Casper"
Charles Brame wrote:
>
> I've been interested in the Whirlwind 150 prop for some time. It is a
> constant speed, composite, three blade that weighs about half that of a
> 2-blade Hartzell and is nearly ten pounds lighter than a three blade MT.
Snip
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom Gummo" <t.gummo(at)verizon.net> |
Laird,
The Hawk methods works from the outside in but does it work from the inside
out??????
Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: "Laird Owens" <owens(at)aerovironment.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Escape Tool
>
> I did something similar to Sam.
>
> I have a 2" long slug of steel that is turned to a sharp point
> mounted in the bottom of the passenger stick (which is unsecured so I
> can beat a wayward or hamfisted passenger). Probably weights 3-4 ozs.
>
> I'm pretty sure it'll break a canopy, although I'm not willing to
> test it on mine....
>
> I do know that a hawk launched at sufficient speed will break a
> canopy...hmmm...maybe a hawk launcher mounted behind flap brace.....
>
> Hmmm....maybe not....environmentalists might get upset...then there's
> the food bill and the hawk droppings.....but I digress....
>
> Laird RV-6
> SoCal
>
>
> >
> >The canopy buster in my RV-6 is the passenger side control stick. I
> >brief the passenger that if he/she has to break the canopy, pull out the
> >control stick, grab it with both hands, and have at it!
> >
> >Didn't cost anything extra, no additional weight, and always on board.
> >
> >Sam Buchanan
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
And because your plane has already been inspected, the only person that
has to be satified that it meets 91.205 is you? Or does someone
official have to sign off on the new IFR capabilites? I would think an
inspector with a 1970's mind-set might give you a hard time, at best.
Excluding the fact that a clock is missing from this illustration, what
do y'all think if this for an IFR panel:
http://bowenaero.com/r.php?a=panel
Thanks.
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam Buchanan
> Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 5:26 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: 91.205 DG
>
>
>
>
> Larry Bowen wrote:
> >
> >
> > You've mentioned previously that you were bringing your
> RV-6 up to IFR
> > standards --hopefully with the EFIS Lite as the
> centerpiece(I guess).
> > What backups are you planning on? Is it easier or harder to "get
> > there" with your initial, digital, VFR panel?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Larry
>
>
> Greg Richter called me last week and told me a new Lite was
> on the way, but I have not yet received it. My intentions are
> to use the Lite (or something similar) as the centerpiece of
> a simple IFR-capable panel. I will retain the Navaid and RMI
> uEncoder as backups. I flew the RV-6 under the hood during my
> last BFR with only the Navaid, uEncoder, and GPS, and while I
> hope I never have to do it in the clouds, I think I could
> successfully get down with that very unconventional partial
> panel, especially if I practice occassionally.
>
> The uEncoder is actually a pretty nice backup instrument
> (airspeed, altimeter, VSI) if you are already accustomed to
> flying per the little numbers. It would be useless to
> somebody who had never flown the instrument, but I have to
> use it often in our psuedo IFR skies here in the muggy/hazy
> Southeast USA. In the course of the BFR, I quickly determined
> that the first step if the main attitude stuff went down
> would be to engage the Navaid; keeping the RV-6 pointed in
> the right direction was much easier once I didn't have to
> concentrate of keeping the wings level. The biggest problem I
> had was holding heading since the Lowrance is mounted right
> of panel center in my plane, and having to glance over to see
> heading was not good. I will strongly consider getting the
> iPAQ/AnywhereMap closer to the center of my scan if IFR
> flight becomes a possibility.
>
> Personally, I consider a wing-leveler to be the most
> important backup in a simple IFR panel. Being able keep the
> RV-6 in proper pitch trim is also essential. Regardless of
> teh final configuration of the panel, I will fly it many
> hours to work out the kinks (and regain my IFR
> proficiency) before busting clouds.
>
> As of now, the panel will consist of the BMA Lite, Navaid,
> RMI uEncoder, Lowrance and AnywhereMap GPS's, KX125, and a
> digital chronometer. This should be sufficient for punching
> through cloud layers, shooting VOR approaches, and flying
> with confidence in marginal VFR.
>
> Sam Buchanan
>
>
> ==========
> ==========
> ==========
> ==========
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
For an airplane, experimental or not, doesn't it have to be IFR certified to
fly IFR? Meaning, all IFR equipment to be used needs to be TSO'd, and you
need an IFR certification done on the aircraft?
I don't think most of these glass systems are TSO'd, so I don't think you
could "legally" fly IFR, even though the panel would be capable of it.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: 91.205 DG
>
> And because your plane has already been inspected, the only person that
> has to be satified that it meets 91.205 is you? Or does someone
> official have to sign off on the new IFR capabilites? I would think an
> inspector with a 1970's mind-set might give you a hard time, at best.
>
> Excluding the fact that a clock is missing from this illustration, what
> do y'all think if this for an IFR panel:
> http://bowenaero.com/r.php?a=panel
>
> Thanks.
>
> -
> Larry Bowen
> Larry(at)BowenAero.com
> http://BowenAero.com
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam Buchanan
> > Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 5:26 PM
> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: 91.205 DG
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Larry Bowen wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > You've mentioned previously that you were bringing your
> > RV-6 up to IFR
> > > standards --hopefully with the EFIS Lite as the
> > centerpiece(I guess).
> > > What backups are you planning on? Is it easier or harder to "get
> > > there" with your initial, digital, VFR panel?
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > > Larry
> >
> >
> > Greg Richter called me last week and told me a new Lite was
> > on the way, but I have not yet received it. My intentions are
> > to use the Lite (or something similar) as the centerpiece of
> > a simple IFR-capable panel. I will retain the Navaid and RMI
> > uEncoder as backups. I flew the RV-6 under the hood during my
> > last BFR with only the Navaid, uEncoder, and GPS, and while I
> > hope I never have to do it in the clouds, I think I could
> > successfully get down with that very unconventional partial
> > panel, especially if I practice occassionally.
> >
> > The uEncoder is actually a pretty nice backup instrument
> > (airspeed, altimeter, VSI) if you are already accustomed to
> > flying per the little numbers. It would be useless to
> > somebody who had never flown the instrument, but I have to
> > use it often in our psuedo IFR skies here in the muggy/hazy
> > Southeast USA. In the course of the BFR, I quickly determined
> > that the first step if the main attitude stuff went down
> > would be to engage the Navaid; keeping the RV-6 pointed in
> > the right direction was much easier once I didn't have to
> > concentrate of keeping the wings level. The biggest problem I
> > had was holding heading since the Lowrance is mounted right
> > of panel center in my plane, and having to glance over to see
> > heading was not good. I will strongly consider getting the
> > iPAQ/AnywhereMap closer to the center of my scan if IFR
> > flight becomes a possibility.
> >
> > Personally, I consider a wing-leveler to be the most
> > important backup in a simple IFR panel. Being able keep the
> > RV-6 in proper pitch trim is also essential. Regardless of
> > teh final configuration of the panel, I will fly it many
> > hours to work out the kinks (and regain my IFR
> > proficiency) before busting clouds.
> >
> > As of now, the panel will consist of the BMA Lite, Navaid,
> > RMI uEncoder, Lowrance and AnywhereMap GPS's, KX125, and a
> > digital chronometer. This should be sufficient for punching
> > through cloud layers, shooting VOR approaches, and flying
> > with confidence in marginal VFR.
> >
> > Sam Buchanan
> >
> >
> > ==========
> > ==========
> > ==========
> > ==========
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stan Blanton" <stanb(at)door.net> |
>
> For an airplane, experimental or not, doesn't it have to be IFR certified
to
> fly IFR? Meaning, all IFR equipment to be used needs to be TSO'd, and you
> need an IFR certification done on the aircraft?
>
> I don't think most of these glass systems are TSO'd, so I don't think you
> could "legally" fly IFR, even though the panel would be capable of it.
>
> Paul Besing
I was under the impression that with the exception of transponders and
appraoch approved GPSs Part 91 does not require TSOs for items such as
flight instruments and radios. Do you have the reg number handy that
requires TSOs?
Stan Blanton
stanb(at)door.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Aero Composites props |
I asked Aero Composites to compare their 2-blade prop with Whirlwind's
2-blade 200 series. I got an email response within 2 hours. I like that
kind of support responsiveness...or maybe it's just sales. But anyway,
here's what Harry Griswold from Aero Composites wrote:
Dan:
Thanks for your email. The Whirlwind propellers are hollow, pre-preg
composite where use is made of an internal bladder in production. As such
the blade are thicker than can be achieved with our RTM process. The
leading edge radius is 2 to 3 times as thick as on our blades. They have
had some problems with parts coming off in-flight. Safety is at the very
top of our list when designing our propellers. Our propellers are the very
best in General Aviation and are not going to hurt anyone in flight!
Harry Griswold
----- Original Message -----
From: Dan Checkoway
Subject: Re: AeroComposites Order Form
Thanks again for the time you spent on the phone with me yesterday. I've
been talking you up on the RV email lists.
Hey, another question...how would you say your 2-blade prop stacks up
against the Whirlwind 200C series?
http://www.whirlwindpropellers.com/html/aviation/aviation_200c_series.shtml
That prop is about $1000 cheaper than yours. Just curious how you'd justify
that extra expense.
Thanks,
)_( Dan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
Here we go again. You do not need TSO to fly IFR.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: 91.205 DG
For an airplane, experimental or not, doesn't it have to be IFR certified to
fly IFR? Meaning, all IFR equipment to be used needs to be TSO'd, and you
need an IFR certification done on the aircraft?
I don't think most of these glass systems are TSO'd, so I don't think you
could "legally" fly IFR, even though the panel would be capable of it.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: 91.205 DG
>
> And because your plane has already been inspected, the only person that
> has to be satified that it meets 91.205 is you? Or does someone
> official have to sign off on the new IFR capabilites? I would think an
> inspector with a 1970's mind-set might give you a hard time, at best.
>
> Excluding the fact that a clock is missing from this illustration, what
> do y'all think if this for an IFR panel:
> http://bowenaero.com/r.php?a=panel
>
> Thanks.
>
> -
> Larry Bowen
> Larry(at)BowenAero.com
> http://BowenAero.com
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam Buchanan
> > Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 5:26 PM
> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: RV-List: 91.205 DG
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Larry Bowen wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > You've mentioned previously that you were bringing your
> > RV-6 up to IFR
> > > standards --hopefully with the EFIS Lite as the
> > centerpiece(I guess).
> > > What backups are you planning on? Is it easier or harder to "get
> > > there" with your initial, digital, VFR panel?
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > > Larry
> >
> >
> > Greg Richter called me last week and told me a new Lite was
> > on the way, but I have not yet received it. My intentions are
> > to use the Lite (or something similar) as the centerpiece of
> > a simple IFR-capable panel. I will retain the Navaid and RMI
> > uEncoder as backups. I flew the RV-6 under the hood during my
> > last BFR with only the Navaid, uEncoder, and GPS, and while I
> > hope I never have to do it in the clouds, I think I could
> > successfully get down with that very unconventional partial
> > panel, especially if I practice occassionally.
> >
> > The uEncoder is actually a pretty nice backup instrument
> > (airspeed, altimeter, VSI) if you are already accustomed to
> > flying per the little numbers. It would be useless to
> > somebody who had never flown the instrument, but I have to
> > use it often in our psuedo IFR skies here in the muggy/hazy
> > Southeast USA. In the course of the BFR, I quickly determined
> > that the first step if the main attitude stuff went down
> > would be to engage the Navaid; keeping the RV-6 pointed in
> > the right direction was much easier once I didn't have to
> > concentrate of keeping the wings level. The biggest problem I
> > had was holding heading since the Lowrance is mounted right
> > of panel center in my plane, and having to glance over to see
> > heading was not good. I will strongly consider getting the
> > iPAQ/AnywhereMap closer to the center of my scan if IFR
> > flight becomes a possibility.
> >
> > Personally, I consider a wing-leveler to be the most
> > important backup in a simple IFR panel. Being able keep the
> > RV-6 in proper pitch trim is also essential. Regardless of
> > teh final configuration of the panel, I will fly it many
> > hours to work out the kinks (and regain my IFR
> > proficiency) before busting clouds.
> >
> > As of now, the panel will consist of the BMA Lite, Navaid,
> > RMI uEncoder, Lowrance and AnywhereMap GPS's, KX125, and a
> > digital chronometer. This should be sufficient for punching
> > through cloud layers, shooting VOR approaches, and flying
> > with confidence in marginal VFR.
> >
> > Sam Buchanan
> >
> >
> > ==========
> > ==========
> > ==========
> > ==========
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "George McNutt" <gmcnutt(at)intergate.ca> |
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Larry Bowen
Subject: RE: RV-List: 91.205 DG
And because your plane has already been inspected, the only person that
has to be satified that it meets 91.205 is you? Or does someone
official have to sign off on the new IFR capabilites? I would think an
inspector with a 1970's mind-set might give you a hard time, at best.
Excluding the fact that a clock is missing from this illustration, what
do y'all think if this for an IFR panel:
http://bowenaero.com/r.php?a=panel
Thanks.
-
Larry Bowen
----------------------------------------------------
Hi Larry
Nice looking panel, my comments about IFR with this panel - (based on my
assumption that the GPS is a VFR unit without RAIM alarm, and this is also
from my Canadian regulations viewpoint). A VFR GPS is not technically
capable (in Canada) of being used for locating IFR fixes, because I am led
to believe that under certain conditions they can be in error by several
miles.
It is interesting how many RAIM alarms I get here in the Vancouver B.C. area
with my IFR approved SL-60, enough that I have recently looked into adding
the altitude encoder input to the GPS to supplement the satellite signals
(not possible on the SL-60).
Your approach capability appears to be limited to VOR. A marker reciever
would be nice so you also have the capability of localizer approaches.
George McNutt
Langley, B.C.
6A with VFR restriction removed!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Empennage fairing |
> Paul Rosales (RV-6A, N628PV) and I both have over 1,000 hours each on
> Empennage fairings built and attached as Cash describes above.
> Gary A. Sobek
> "My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
> 1,159 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
> http://SoCAL_WVAF.rvproject.com
>
I confess!!!!!!!!!! I got the idea after looking at Gary and Paul's
airplanes.
Cash
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Fw: 200C vs Aero Composites 2-blade prop |
Here's some more info in the composite propeller saga... 8
)
)_( Dan
----- Original Message -----
From: "Whirl Wind Propellers" <wwpc(at)whirlwindpropellers.com>
Subject: RE: 200C vs Aero Composites 2-blade prop
> Hi Dan,
>
> Thank you for your interest in Whirl Wind. For your RV-7, the ideal
> propeller is not our 200C aerobatic propeller, but is the 150 Series sport
> plane propeller. The 200C is an all-composite unlimited aerobatic
propeller
> comparable to the Hartzell Claw. It has a wide blade & relatively thick,
> under cambered airfoil design for excellent low-end thrust required by
> competitive and airshow aerobatic pilots. This propeller is
> counter-weighted for aerobatics, and while the system would work well for
> your RV-7 with the IO-360 engine, it would probably be a bit overkill
> (heavier and more expensive).
>
> I don't know much about the Aero Composite's 2 blade propeller except that
> they are using the McCauley hub (like our 200C Series) for their IO-360
> engine application - which means their propeller will be nearly twice as
> heavy as our 150 Series. We did read their response that was posted to
the
> email list - and to set the record straight the only issue we have had was
a
> single isolated incident with the AN6 counter-weight bolt on the 200C.
>
> The Whirl Wind 150 Series on the other hand, was specifically designed for
> the RV sport plane to give quiet, efficient and smooth performance with
high
> cruise speeds. The 150 Series blade was designed for high-speed cruise
> which means a thin blade with proper twist distribution. The 150 Series
is
> a 3 blade, 68" diameter, 28 lb composite propeller - the world's lightest
> constant speed propeller. Comparative propeller flight test data has
shown
> the 150 Series propeller to have increased acceleration, climb and cruise
> performance. Flight testing for the 150 Series is currently in the final
> phase of the systems maturity test.
>
> Although the performance of the 150 Series is truly a strong point, the
most
> popular comment pilots mention is the improved smooth and quiet operation
> attained from this lightweight 3 blade propeller (when going from their
> previous 2 blade).
>
> Please let me know if I can answer any further questions for you. To
answer
> your IO-390 question, the 200C would be fine for the IO-390, however we
> would like to do some initial flight testing for the 150 Series with the
> IO-390 before we approve it for that engine.
>
> Sincerely,
> Patti
> Director, WWPC
> http://www.whirlwindpropellers.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dan Checkoway
> Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 12:21 PM
> To: wwpc(at)whirlwindpropellers.com
> Subject: 200C vs Aero Composites 2-blade prop
>
>
> Can you give me as much information as possible comparing your 200C
2-blade
> propeller (to be used on a Van's RV-7 with a Lycoming IO-360-A1B6 or
> IO-390-X) to the Aero Composites 2-blade prop?
>
> Also, is the engine horsepower range of 180-200hp (quoted on
>
http://www.whirlwindpropellers.com/html/aviation/aviation_200c_series.shtml)
> a per-blade limitation, or is 200hp the most power that the 2-blade prop
> setup will handle? I'm considering going with the IO-390-X, which is
about
> 210hp. I'm curious if that's pushing it or what...
>
> Thanks,
> )_( Dan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Fw: 200C vs Aero Composites 2-blade prop |
Sorry to keep doing this, but somebody besides me must be interested...this
is the latest response from Whirlwind. If their 3-blader produces higher
cruise than the Hartzell 2-blade aluminum, now we're talkin'.
)_( Dan
----- Original Message -----
From: "Whirl Wind Propellers"
Subject: RE: 200C vs Aero Composites 2-blade prop
> Hi Dan,
>
> Thank you for your email reply. Let me go ahead and answer the questions
> you have below:
>
> To date, Van's has not tested our 3 blade 150 Series propeller. In all of
> our comparative flight test data with the 2 blade Hartzell, the 150 Series
> has consistently shown a slightly faster cruise speed (5 to 7 knots).
>
> As mentioned in my previous email, the total assembled system weight of
the
> 150 Series is 28 lbs (this includes the blades, hub, hardware, and
spinner).
>
> The 150 Series has a patented blade retention system and manufacturing
> process that has been tested to a safety factor of over 6 times maximum
> operation loads.
>
> As noted on our website, Jihostroj is the manufacturer of the governor.
We
> manufacture the entire 150 Series propeller system ourselves in-house.
>
> Sincerely,
> Patti
> Director, WWPC
> http://www.whirlwindpropellers.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dan Checkoway
> Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 5:30 PM
> To: Whirl Wind Propellers
> Subject: Re: 200C vs Aero Composites 2-blade prop
>
>
> Patti,
>
> Thanks for the quick response. I'm not as interested in a 3-blade prop
due
> to lost high-end cruise speed. From what Van's told me, your 3-blade
setup
> was slower than the Hartzell aluminum 2-blade setup. Top end speed is as
> important to me as climb performance. That's why I assumed the 2-blade
> would be the way to go.
>
> How much does your 3-blade setup weigh? Aero Composites claims 7 pounds
per
> blade. I don't imagine 3 of your blades could weigh less than 14 pounds,
> let alone half that... 8
) From what I understand, Aero Composites'
blades
> are extremely thin due to their construction method, and thus very
> lightweight and very low drag.
>
> Can you comment on the design of your blade retention system? One factor
> that Aero Composites claims is that their wrap-around design at the blade
> base is the best in the business. I tend to agree that their design is
> excellent, but I'd like to hear your opinion...and learn about your
design.
>
> I've never heard of Jihostroj, the maker of your hubs. Can you give me
some
> background on why you picked that company versus a local (US) company?
>
> Again, if you can show me that one of your propellers will outperform the
> Hartzell aluminum 2-blade setup in cruise, that's really what I'm looking
> for.
>
> Thanks again,
> )_( Dan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
Thanks for the input. Yes, it's a VFR GPS, primarily for situational
awareness, but it does drive the AP too.
I'm not IFR rated, so forgive my ignorance, but couldn't a timer replace
the marker receiver -- or is that only if you have an ADF too.
Which marker receiver do you recommend, given my existing panel plans?
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of George McNutt
> Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 7:18 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV-List: 91.205 DG
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Larry Bowen
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RE: RV-List: 91.205 DG
>
>
>
> And because your plane has already been inspected, the only
> person that has to be satified that it meets 91.205 is you?
> Or does someone official have to sign off on the new IFR
> capabilites? I would think an inspector with a 1970's
> mind-set might give you a hard time, at best.
>
> Excluding the fact that a clock is missing from this
> illustration, what do y'all think if this for an IFR panel:
> http://bowenaero.com/r.php?a=panel
>
> Thanks.
>
> -
> Larry Bowen
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------
>
> Hi Larry
>
> Nice looking panel, my comments about IFR with this panel -
> (based on my assumption that the GPS is a VFR unit without
> RAIM alarm, and this is also from my Canadian regulations
> viewpoint). A VFR GPS is not technically capable (in Canada)
> of being used for locating IFR fixes, because I am led to
> believe that under certain conditions they can be in error by
> several miles.
>
> It is interesting how many RAIM alarms I get here in the
> Vancouver B.C. area with my IFR approved SL-60, enough that I
> have recently looked into adding the altitude encoder input
> to the GPS to supplement the satellite signals (not possible
> on the SL-60).
>
> Your approach capability appears to be limited to VOR. A
> marker reciever would be nice so you also have the capability
> of localizer approaches.
>
> George McNutt
> Langley, B.C.
> 6A with VFR restriction removed!
>
>
> ==========
> ==========
> ==========
> ==========
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV6A for sale |
Hey Fred,
Spoke to Adam, we would like to come up next week and show him N925RV, what
is your schedule like....
Later
Bill
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Fw: 200C vs Aero Composites 2-blade prop |
whirlwind info
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
Paul Besing wrote:
>
>
> For an airplane, experimental or not, doesn't it have to be IFR certified to
> fly IFR? Meaning, all IFR equipment to be used needs to be TSO'd, and you
> need an IFR certification done on the aircraft?
>
> I don't think most of these glass systems are TSO'd, so I don't think you
> could "legally" fly IFR, even though the panel would be capable of it.
>
> Paul Besing
> RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
> http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
> Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
> http://www.kitlog.com
This is has been thoroughly hashed out previously (check the RV-list
archives, and also the AeroElectric-list archives), but briefly stated,
there is no such animal as an IFR certified experimental aircraft!
The only instruments that must be TSO'ed in an experimental aircraft
intended for IFR ops is the transponder, encoder, and GPS if GPS
approaches are desired. Otherwise, satisfy FAR 91.205 as far as flight
instruments and nav equipment is concerned, and as long as the Flight
Limitations for the particular aircraft state it is approved for IFR ops
if equipped per 91.205, you are good to go.
Now.....the real question, as posed by Larry Bowen, is how your local
DAR is going to react when he looks at your panel and sees not good ol'
mechanical gyros, but.......gasp...........an electronic gizmo of some
sort that has automotive rate sensors in it to provide attitude
information!! Will this satisfy the requirement of 91.205 in regard to
"gyroscopic" flight instruments?
I don't know, and I suspect very few people do know at this point. The
EAA, AOPA and other alphabet organizations are going to have to put the
heat on the FAA to get this issue nailed down real soon because we are
within a year or so of seeing solid-state gyros proliferate at a huge
rate in the experimental community. I do know that there are no regs
that *prohibit* the use of AHRS platforms in experimental aircraft!
(AHRS.........whats that??????)
Before someone runs off to the FARs to see how the corporate jets get
certified with AHRS, keep in mind that we are not subject to Part 23.
This is a regulatory jungle on this point, and anyone about to get a new
RV signed off with only AHRS will need a sympathetic (or stupid) DAR.
My intentions, at this point, are to just fly under the radar on this
issue and not make a big deal out of it. Forgiveness might be easier
than permission at this point in time! :-)
Sam Buchanan (RV-6, soon to be equipped for IFR flight??)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stucklen" <wstucklen1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6A for sale |
Not going anywhere... I don't go back to work until 9/9/02..... Just give
me a heads up so I'm not out doing something else...
Fred
----- Original Message -----
From: <BSivori(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6A for sale
>
> Hey Fred,
>
> Spoke to Adam, we would like to come up next week and show him N925RV,
what
> is your schedule like....
>
> Later
>
> Bill
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
Van's used to recommend that the top of the RV-4 rollbar be left with sharp
edges , to break the canopy in case of rollover. I left mine that way.
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
I think that the insurance company would also be interested in
figuring out whether 91.205 was met or not if there ever was an
accident arising from an IFR flight. I wouldn't want to give them a
ready-made excuse not to pay, so I would want to meet 91.205 without
having to make a very creative interpretation of it.
AHRS type systems are accepted as being equivalent to a DG in type
certified aircraft. So, the various experimental AHRS systems coming
on the market should qualify, once they can be shown to consistently
work correctly. The systems that use GPS track to drive a simulated
DG type display would not qualify as meeting 91.205 for a type
certified aircraft, so I expect that they wouldn't be accepted in
homebuilts either.
Kevin Horton
>
>And because your plane has already been inspected, the only person that
>has to be satified that it meets 91.205 is you? Or does someone
>official have to sign off on the new IFR capabilites? I would think an
>inspector with a 1970's mind-set might give you a hard time, at best.
>
>Excluding the fact that a clock is missing from this illustration, what
>do y'all think if this for an IFR panel:
>http://bowenaero.com/r.php?a=panel
>
>Thanks.
>
>-
>Larry Bowen
>Larry(at)BowenAero.com
>http://BowenAero.com
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sam Buchanan
>> Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 5:26 PM
>> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: RV-List: 91.205 DG
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Larry Bowen wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > You've mentioned previously that you were bringing your
>> RV-6 up to IFR
>> > standards --hopefully with the EFIS Lite as the
>> centerpiece(I guess).
>> > What backups are you planning on? Is it easier or harder to "get
>> > there" with your initial, digital, VFR panel?
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> >
>> > Larry
>>
>>
>> Greg Richter called me last week and told me a new Lite was
>> on the way, but I have not yet received it. My intentions are
>> to use the Lite (or something similar) as the centerpiece of
>> a simple IFR-capable panel. I will retain the Navaid and RMI
>> uEncoder as backups. I flew the RV-6 under the hood during my
>> last BFR with only the Navaid, uEncoder, and GPS, and while I
>> hope I never have to do it in the clouds, I think I could
>> successfully get down with that very unconventional partial
>> panel, especially if I practice occassionally.
>>
>> The uEncoder is actually a pretty nice backup instrument
>> (airspeed, altimeter, VSI) if you are already accustomed to
>> flying per the little numbers. It would be useless to
>> somebody who had never flown the instrument, but I have to
>> use it often in our psuedo IFR skies here in the muggy/hazy
>> Southeast USA. In the course of the BFR, I quickly determined
>> that the first step if the main attitude stuff went down
>> would be to engage the Navaid; keeping the RV-6 pointed in
>> the right direction was much easier once I didn't have to
>> concentrate of keeping the wings level. The biggest problem I
>> had was holding heading since the Lowrance is mounted right
>> of panel center in my plane, and having to glance over to see
>> heading was not good. I will strongly consider getting the
>> iPAQ/AnywhereMap closer to the center of my scan if IFR
>> flight becomes a possibility.
>>
>> Personally, I consider a wing-leveler to be the most
>> important backup in a simple IFR panel. Being able keep the
>> RV-6 in proper pitch trim is also essential. Regardless of
>> teh final configuration of the panel, I will fly it many
>> hours to work out the kinks (and regain my IFR
>> proficiency) before busting clouds.
>>
>> As of now, the panel will consist of the BMA Lite, Navaid,
>> RMI uEncoder, Lowrance and AnywhereMap GPS's, KX125, and a
>> digital chronometer. This should be sufficient for punching
> > through cloud layers, shooting VOR approaches, and flying
>> with confidence in marginal VFR.
>>
>> Sam Buchanan
>>
>>
>> ==========
>> ==========
>> ==========
>> ==========
>>
>>
> >
>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stucklen" <wstucklen1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV6A for sale |
Bill,
Did you se what I sent out to the RV list? If not, it's attached below....
Check out the web site for more specifics....
Fred
Listers,
First, let me explain why I'm selling this wonderful plane. I have been
flying this aircraft for the last nine years, and building a second RV-6 for
the last four years. I've come to a point in the new aircraft construction
where I need to purchase the engine and avionics. Both will cost more than I
can current fund without raising some cash. And with the current employment
environment shaky at best, I'm not willing to borrow the money. So it's with
great hesitation that I'm putting this tried and true IFR aircraft up for
sale.
Here's the specifics:
1993 RV6A, 1987 TTAE, O-320-D1A 849 STOH, Sensenich Metal Prop, KX-125,
KY-97A, AT150 Xpdr, GX55 GPS, KR86 ADF, NAV 122A, KA134 Audio Panel, Shadin
"Mini-Flow" with GPS interface, Century I AP, SP400 intercom with stereo
interface, Electronics International RPM (R-1), Ultimate Scanner (US-8A),
Oil Press/temp (Opt-1), Volt/Amps (VA-1A-50), Electric trim/flaps, Impulse
Mag/Electronic Ignitions, 60 Amp Alternator, Alternate vacuum system, Dual
Brakes, Phlogiston Spar, always hangered. $55000 or best offer. More
pictures & documents at http://members.cox.net/rv6a4sale
email: rv6a4sale(at)cox.net
Fred Stucklen
N925RV
----- Original Message -----
From: <BSivori(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV6A for sale
>
> Hey Fred,
>
> Spoke to Adam, we would like to come up next week and show him N925RV,
what
> is your schedule like....
>
> Later
>
> Bill
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Phat Phil <phugoid(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Warnke Props BAD |
Bud
I was talking with my friend Jim today who lives in Tucson and he said
Margie is moving to Alaska to avoid litigation in Arizona.
You have to figure a person who has lived in Arizona all her life would
need a pretty compelling reason to move to Alaska.
Unfortunately the chance of you being reunited with your money are
pretty slim.
Bud wrote:
>
> CONSIDERING A WARNKE PROP ?
>
> I urge you to reconsider
>
>
> I ordered a prop from Margie Warnke on 10/09/01. I was promised delivery
> in 12 weeks. I made a special point of asking will I really have the
> prop in 12 weeks because my airplane was grounded in the mean time. I
> was assured I would have it in 12 weeks. It arrived on 5/2/02 seven
> months later and four months over due. It wasn't supposed to take four
> months from the beginning. And I was supposedly given special
> consideration because I was grounded. She insists on full payment up
> front so you have little recourse.
>
> Margie Warnke is a horrible person to do business with. She continuously
> lied about the progress of the prop. To the very end she told me on a
> Friday it was done and would be shipped that day. Then I was told
> whoever does her shipping missed the deadline so it didn't get shipped.
> It wasn't shipped until Tuesday. That's a pretty big miss.
>
> Of course when I got it, it wasn't finished. It had to be tried then
> sent back for fine-tuning. When I shipped it back I was told I would
> have it back in two weeks, it took four. Better than I expected.
>
> But the worst part is when I got it back it was terrible. It shook the
> airplane badly, even at idle. Initial acceleration was dismal and climb
> was down 300 fpm. This was after she repitched it to increase the RPMs.
> Now she won't return my calls.
>
> After leaving several massages on her machine she had someone else call
> me back to tell me she wasn't available for at least 45 days because
> they are moving to Alaska. After a couple of weeks the message on her
> machine hadn't changed (leave a message and I'll get back to you)
> nothing about being unavailable or moving. So I decided to leave another
> message with a different name and my cell number. What do you know she
> call back the same day. Now she lies some more, claimes she hasn't
> gotten the letter I sent over a month earlier with the performance
> numbers and a request for my money back. She said it's because the mail
> is being forwarded to Alaska but she called me from Arizona.
>
> This tale could take up several pages. It's been a maddening experience
> that I wouldn't wish on anybody.
>
> Buyer beware.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
I'm beavering away doing fibreglas work, using the West Systems
stuff. I had hoped to use the West Systems 410 Microlight filler to
fill pinholes, but it is not doing as good a job as I hoped. Each
pass fills some of the pin holes, but after sanding I see that there
are still a few left, so I do another coat and sand again, etc.
So, I'm looking for other options. I've searched the various list
archives, and many other products get mentioned, but there never
seems to be enough info to figure out whether any given product
addresses all my needs.
I'm looking for recommendations for a product to fill pin holes. I'm
looking for the following characteristics:
1. compatible with West Systems epoxy,
2. reasonably priced,
3. does not need to be sprayed (I only have a zip gun, plus I don't
want the mess and hassle of spraying),
4. can be sanded relatively quickly (overnight cure, or faster)
5. can be used in small batches (the West Systems pumps give a
minimum batch size, which means a lot of wastage).
6. not too heavy
Are there any products that meet all these criteria? If not, which
products come the closest to what I want?
Thanks,
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (fibreglas, yuck)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
kevin
use microballoons with the west epoxy system, mix it thin, squeege it on,
then take mek and wipe down the cowel. seemed to do the job for me.
scott
tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
Kevin,
UV Smooth Prime was recommended to me by couple of local plastic airplane
builders (no reflection on thier integrity!). It's water soluble, cleans up
easily and you can roll or spray it on. They all recommended rolling it for
the small areas we have to do. I just tried it on my empennage intesection
fairing this morning and will report back.
-Don
RV8 NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
Although I've only used a sprayer, I've heard K-36 or K-38 go on okay with a
squeegee or with a small "paint roller". The stuff fills well, sands great.
My PPG paint store caries it. Re: price, it is expensive (two part system .
. . about $50 for a quart, including the hardener, if memory serves me
correctly).
Rick Jory
----- Original Message -----
From: Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com>
Subject: RV-List: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy
>
> I'm beavering away doing fibreglas work, using the West Systems
> stuff. I had hoped to use the West Systems 410 Microlight filler to
> fill pinholes, but it is not doing as good a job as I hoped. Each
> pass fills some of the pin holes, but after sanding I see that there
> are still a few left, so I do another coat and sand again, etc.
>
> So, I'm looking for other options. I've searched the various list
> archives, and many other products get mentioned, but there never
> seems to be enough info to figure out whether any given product
> addresses all my needs.
>
> I'm looking for recommendations for a product to fill pin holes. I'm
> looking for the following characteristics:
>
> 1. compatible with West Systems epoxy,
> 2. reasonably priced,
> 3. does not need to be sprayed (I only have a zip gun, plus I don't
> want the mess and hassle of spraying),
> 4. can be sanded relatively quickly (overnight cure, or faster)
> 5. can be used in small batches (the West Systems pumps give a
> minimum batch size, which means a lot of wastage).
> 6. not too heavy
>
> Are there any products that meet all these criteria? If not, which
> products come the closest to what I want?
>
> Thanks,
> --
> Kevin Horton RV-8 (fibreglas, yuck)
> Ottawa, Canada
> http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Marvel <bmarvel(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
Keven:
Did you try the method discussed in the RVator? Although this was mentioned
for sealing the inside of the cowl, I don't know why it would not work
elsewhere. They just diluted the resin mix 50/50 with acetone and brushed it
on. I have not reached that point yet, but the process is written up in the
last issue of the magazine.
Bill Marvel
Kevin Horton wrote:
>
> I'm beavering away doing fibreglas work, using the West Systems
> stuff. I had hoped to use the West Systems 410 Microlight filler to
> fill pinholes, but it is not doing as good a job as I hoped. Each
> pass fills some of the pin holes, but after sanding I see that there
> are still a few left, so I do another coat and sand again, etc.
>
> So, I'm looking for other options. I've searched the various list
> archives, and many other products get mentioned, but there never
> seems to be enough info to figure out whether any given product
> addresses all my needs.
>
> I'm looking for recommendations for a product to fill pin holes. I'm
> looking for the following characteristics:
>
> 1. compatible with West Systems epoxy,
> 2. reasonably priced,
> 3. does not need to be sprayed (I only have a zip gun, plus I don't
> want the mess and hassle of spraying),
> 4. can be sanded relatively quickly (overnight cure, or faster)
> 5. can be used in small batches (the West Systems pumps give a
> minimum batch size, which means a lot of wastage).
> 6. not too heavy
>
> Are there any products that meet all these criteria? If not, which
> products come the closest to what I want?
>
> Thanks,
> --
> Kevin Horton RV-8 (fibreglas, yuck)
> Ottawa, Canada
> http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
>
--
Bill Marvel Home/office 310 832 7617
P.O. Box 784 Cell 310 293 2013
San Pedro, CA 90733 Fax 310 832 5334
One good deed beats 100 good intentions...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Marvel <bmarvel(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
Kevin:
Did you try the method discussed in the RVator? Although this was mentioned
for sealing the inside of the cowl, I don't know why it would not work
elsewhere. They just diluted the resin mix 50/50 with acetone and brushed it
on. I have not reached that point yet, but the processis written up in the
last issue of the magazine.
Bill Marvel
Kevin Horton wrote:
>
> I'm beavering away doing fibreglas work, using the West Systems
> stuff. I had hoped to use the West Systems 410 Microlight filler to
> fill pinholes, but it is not doing as good a job as I hoped. Each
> pass fills some of the pin holes, but after sanding I see that there
> are still a few left, so I do another coat and sand again, etc.
>
> So, I'm looking for other options. I've searched the various list
> archives, and many other products get mentioned, but there never
> seems to be enough info to figure out whether any given product
> addresses all my needs.
>
> I'm looking for recommendations for a product to fill pin holes. I'm
> looking for the following characteristics:
>
> 1. compatible with West Systems epoxy,
> 2. reasonably priced,
> 3. does not need to be sprayed (I only have a zip gun, plus I don't
> want the mess and hassle of spraying),
> 4. can be sanded relatively quickly (overnight cure, or faster)
> 5. can be used in small batches (the West Systems pumps give a
> minimum batch size, which means a lot of wastage).
> 6. not too heavy
>
> Are there any products that meet all these criteria? If not, which
> products come the closest to what I want?
>
> Thanks,
> --
> Kevin Horton RV-8 (fibreglas, yuck)
> Ottawa, Canada
> http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
>
--
Bill Marvel Home/office 310 832 7617
P.O. Box 784 Cell 310 293 2013
San Pedro, CA 90733 Fax 310 832 5334
One good deed beats 100 good intentions...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Marvel <bmarvel(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
Kevin:
Forgot to mention:
>
> 5. can be used in small batches (the West Systems pumps give a
> minimum batch size, which means a lot of wastage).
I never did get the West Systems pump. I just use the 5 to 1 volumes with
any convenient container. In fact, I bought a set of measuring spoons and
use that for very small quantities while still keeping the 5 to 1 ratio. You
can mix as little or as much as you want and it seems very tolerant of minor
ratio variations.
Bill Marvel
RV8A flying
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Eric.J.Henson(at)chase.com |
| Subject: | Re: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
10:01:03 AM
What about reducing West epoxy slightly with mek and just painting that
over the pin holes? Should do fine.
Eric
"Rick Jory" (at)matronics.com on 08/09/2002 09:25:18 AM
Please respond to rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent by: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: RV-List: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy
Although I've only used a sprayer, I've heard K-36 or K-38 go on okay with
a
squeegee or with a small "paint roller". The stuff fills well, sands
great.
My PPG paint store caries it. Re: price, it is expensive (two part system
.
. . about $50 for a quart, including the hardener, if memory serves me
correctly).
Rick Jory
----- Original Message -----
From: Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com>
Subject: RV-List: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy
>
> I'm beavering away doing fibreglas work, using the West Systems
> stuff. I had hoped to use the West Systems 410 Microlight filler to
> fill pinholes, but it is not doing as good a job as I hoped. Each
> pass fills some of the pin holes, but after sanding I see that there
> are still a few left, so I do another coat and sand again, etc.
>
> So, I'm looking for other options. I've searched the various list
> archives, and many other products get mentioned, but there never
> seems to be enough info to figure out whether any given product
> addresses all my needs.
>
> I'm looking for recommendations for a product to fill pin holes. I'm
> looking for the following characteristics:
>
> 1. compatible with West Systems epoxy,
> 2. reasonably priced,
> 3. does not need to be sprayed (I only have a zip gun, plus I don't
> want the mess and hassle of spraying),
> 4. can be sanded relatively quickly (overnight cure, or faster)
> 5. can be used in small batches (the West Systems pumps give a
> minimum batch size, which means a lot of wastage).
> 6. not too heavy
>
> Are there any products that meet all these criteria? If not, which
> products come the closest to what I want?
>
> Thanks,
> --
> Kevin Horton RV-8 (fibreglas, yuck)
> Ottawa, Canada
> http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com> |
OK, let me jump in here for just a moment. In an EXPERIMENTAL aircraft your
flight instruments do NOT have to be TSO'd products. They must have the
inspections required by 91 (ie. pitot-static and transponder) successfully
passed. The avionics are another matter. They must be compatible for the
intended use. This is all spelled out in 91.205 and other paragraphs in
subparts C and E of FAR 91.
But I won't kid you. Will some inspectors give you a hard time for not
having TSO'd instruments? Perhaps. Is it a good idea to have and use TSO'd
instruments for IFR? Probably. But there are some good non-TSO'd products
out there so let your building skills and conscious be your guide.
Mike Robertson
RV-8A, RV-6A, RV-9A
>From: "Stan Blanton" <stanb(at)door.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV-List: 91.205 DG
>Date: Thu, 8 Aug 2002 17:57:00 -0500
>
>
> >
> > For an airplane, experimental or not, doesn't it have to be IFR
>certified
>to
> > fly IFR? Meaning, all IFR equipment to be used needs to be TSO'd, and
>you
> > need an IFR certification done on the aircraft?
> >
> > I don't think most of these glass systems are TSO'd, so I don't think
>you
> > could "legally" fly IFR, even though the panel would be capable of it.
> >
> > Paul Besing
>
>
>I was under the impression that with the exception of transponders and
>appraoch approved GPSs Part 91 does not require TSOs for items such as
>flight instruments and radios. Do you have the reg number handy that
>requires TSOs?
>
>Stan Blanton
>stanb(at)door.net
>
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
You can use a light weight glazing filler like Pirhana putty or Evercoat.
Squeege it on like a thin layer of body filler, and it sands MUCH easier
than anything with epoxy it in it. I did the epoxy thing with microballoons
first, then quickly switched as the amount of sanding required for a thin
body puddy is much less.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (Waiting on the RV-10)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Pro Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Filling Pinholes in West System Epoxy |
I use West Systems for my #$4%
fibreglas stuff. I tried "Smooth Prime " from
A/C Spruce and it really worked great. I used the fine texture roller they
sell and that worked too. I hadn't found anything before that worked nearly
as well.
About $40 /Qt. but worth it !
Bob Olds RV-4, N1191X , flight testing now
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: canopy breaking tools |
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
SNIP Hey, how about we drum up a Leatherman vs. Gerber thread? My Gerber is
much nicer than the leading Leatherman brand, that's for sure :-) SNIP
If Gerber or Leatherman can beat Autozone's $15, lifetime guarantee (for $15 who
cares), locking (i.e. vise grip), long nose pliers, with knife , screwdrivers,
file, nylon belt holster, etc... I will personally be their "daisy".
Sears sells the identical tool for $70.
Vince Frazier
1946 Stinson, NC97535, flying
F-1H Rocket, "Six Shooter", N540VF reserved,
canopy installation stage
http://www.usi.edu/science/chemistry/vfrazier/page1.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: RV-List Digest: 58 Msgs - 08/08/02 |
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
SNIP Ever since Bernie died, it just hasn't been the same. Bernie would be
rolling over in his grave if he knew of this. I never had a "Bernie Warnke"
prop, but it is my understanding from people that knew him and his props
that they were first class. SNIP
I met Bernie in person and had his prop on my RV-4. Both were fabulous, IMHO.
All this crap with Margie makes me sad for him.
Vince
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steven Eberhart <newtech(at)newtech.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
I will second the Smooth Prime recommendation. I am finishing a carbon
fiber RV-7 R/C model. THe fuselage was vacuum bagged using West Systems
epoxy and 5 oz. carbon fiber. I used a greater vacuum than I usually
use so I would get the lightest fuselage possible. This resulted in
very light fuselage skins but ones that almost looked like carbon mesh
due to all of the pinholes. Smooth Prime was up to the task. I
followed the directions and rolled on, using a small foam roller, six
coats of Smooth Prime and sanded almost all of it off. A light coat of
primer followed by acrylic lacquer and the finish is beautiful. Give
Smooth Prime a try and I think you will like it.
Poly Fiber's epoxy based Super Fil is the best filler that I have found.
Use it just like "bondo" and you get a very light weight filler that
doesn't shrink, is completely compatible with the epoxies we use and
sands very easy. Again, if you try it I think you will lke it.
Now, how is my full size RV-7 project coming along? Not too bad. I am
sealing the first fuel tank. That should tell all RV builders exactly
where I am in the build process :-)
Steve Eberhart
Evansville, IN
RV-7A, empennage finished, working on wings
N14SE reserved
Rv8don(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Kevin,
>
> UV Smooth Prime was recommended to me by couple of local plastic airplane
> builders (no reflection on thier integrity!). It's water soluble, cleans up
> easily and you can roll or spray it on. They all recommended rolling it for
> the small areas we have to do. I just tried it on my empennage intesection
> fairing this morning and will report back.
>
> -Don
> RV8 NJ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
SNIP Van's used to recommend that the top of the RV-4 rollbar be left with sharp
edges , to break the canopy in case of rollover. I left mine that way. SNIP
Boy, I'm having fun replying to all these fun threads today! But this is one that
I can speak with complete authority about. Been there, done that.
Many of you know that my RV-4 was on it's back early on due to a fuel problem.
The rollbar will absolutely go through that plexi regardless of whether it is
sharp edged or not. The problem then is how to get enough of the remaining chunks
of plexi out of the way for egress from the back seat.
Back seat? YES! The back seat. IMHO, there isn't enough room for a full sized
guy to crawl out from the front seat unless he also has a shovel. However, based
on what I saw, if the pilot had known how to remove the front seat back,
he might have been able to wiggle out of the back seat.
The problem is that on soft ground the RV-4 rollbar will sink into the soft ground.
8" on my plane. Not much room left to crawl out. The pilot, who was uninjured,
was lucky that his neck wasn't broken. If he had pulled the pins holding
the front seat back, he might have been able to get himself out. But he didn't
know how. We had to lift the plane to get him out. Then he came out like
a greased pig.
Nonetheless, the rollbar ABSOLUTELY saved his life, IMHO. On my Rocket I plan
to make a 4" square 4130 pad on top of the roll bar. I can mount the GPS antenna
on it and it won't be as likely to sink in the soft dirt.
I can't speculate on the same situation on pavement, but my gut feeling is that
the situation would have been similar.
Vince
one bad day that could have been much worse.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
even with certified TSO is NOT required. Look at the King line of radios.
Many fly IFR with a KX-170 and it is NOT TSOed.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Robertson" <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: 91.205 DG
OK, let me jump in here for just a moment. In an EXPERIMENTAL aircraft your
flight instruments do NOT have to be TSO'd products. They must have the
inspections required by 91 (ie. pitot-static and transponder) successfully
passed. The avionics are another matter. They must be compatible for the
intended use. This is all spelled out in 91.205 and other paragraphs in
subparts C and E of FAR 91.
But I won't kid you. Will some inspectors give you a hard time for not
having TSO'd instruments? Perhaps. Is it a good idea to have and use TSO'd
instruments for IFR? Probably. But there are some good non-TSO'd products
out there so let your building skills and conscious be your guide.
Mike Robertson
RV-8A, RV-6A, RV-9A
>From: "Stan Blanton" <stanb(at)door.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: RV-List: 91.205 DG
>Date: Thu, 8 Aug 2002 17:57:00 -0500
>
>
> >
> > For an airplane, experimental or not, doesn't it have to be IFR
>certified
>to
> > fly IFR? Meaning, all IFR equipment to be used needs to be TSO'd, and
>you
> > need an IFR certification done on the aircraft?
> >
> > I don't think most of these glass systems are TSO'd, so I don't think
>you
> > could "legally" fly IFR, even though the panel would be capable of it.
> >
> > Paul Besing
>
>
>I was under the impression that with the exception of transponders and
>appraoch approved GPSs Part 91 does not require TSOs for items such as
>flight instruments and radios. Do you have the reg number handy that
>requires TSOs?
>
>Stan Blanton
>stanb(at)door.net
>
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sally and George" <aeronut58(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
Kevin:
Use UV Smooth Prime. It meets all of your listed objectives. Available
from Aircraft Spruce, among others.
Much more effective than West Systems epoxy with microballoons, but you'll
still need multiple applications to get the job done.
George
N888GK
Now 70+ hours
>From: Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com>
>Reply-To: rv8-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv8-list(at)matronics.com, rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com
>Subject: RV8-List: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy
>Date: Fri, 9 Aug 2002 07:48:51 -0400
>
>--> RV8-List message posted by: Kevin Horton
>
>I'm beavering away doing fibreglas work, using the West Systems
>stuff. I had hoped to use the West Systems 410 Microlight filler to
>fill pinholes, but it is not doing as good a job as I hoped. Each
>pass fills some of the pin holes, but after sanding I see that there
>are still a few left, so I do another coat and sand again, etc.
>
>So, I'm looking for other options. I've searched the various list
>archives, and many other products get mentioned, but there never
>seems to be enough info to figure out whether any given product
>addresses all my needs.
>
>I'm looking for recommendations for a product to fill pin holes. I'm
>looking for the following characteristics:
>
>1. compatible with West Systems epoxy,
>2. reasonably priced,
>3. does not need to be sprayed (I only have a zip gun, plus I don't
>want the mess and hassle of spraying),
>4. can be sanded relatively quickly (overnight cure, or faster)
>5. can be used in small batches (the West Systems pumps give a
>minimum batch size, which means a lot of wastage).
>6. not too heavy
>
>Are there any products that meet all these criteria? If not, which
>products come the closest to what I want?
>
>Thanks,
>--
>Kevin Horton RV-8 (fibreglas, yuck)
>Ottawa, Canada
>http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
>
>
http://www.hotmail.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave von Linsowe" <davevon(at)tir.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
I'll go along with the Smooth Prime too. I did a 44% G 202 bagged kevlar
fuse that was a nightmare! I squeegeed it to the pin holes.
Care needs to be taken with sanding too far into the surface coat of resin.
If you go too far more pin holes will appear!
Steve, what scale is the R/C RV-7?
Dave von Linsowe
RV-6 N98AR flying
> I will second the Smooth Prime recommendation. I am finishing a carbon
> fiber RV-7 R/C model. THe fuselage was vacuum bagged using West Systems
> epoxy and 5 oz. carbon fiber. I used a greater vacuum than I usually
> use so I would get the lightest fuselage possible. This resulted in
> very light fuselage skins but ones that almost looked like carbon mesh
> due to all of the pinholes.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
My 2 cents on pin hole filling:
Its really easy to open up more pin holes than you started with by sanding thru
the outer layer of resin.
For this reason I always clean/scuff the part and spray a medium coat of epoxy
primer BEFORE I start filling pin holes.
When the part is primed all the pins holes and voids will be easier to see. Then
you can fill using your favorite method. Just remember to stop sanding be before
you break thru the primer.
Danny Melnik
F1 #25
Melbourne (FL) Rocket Factory
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
In a message dated 8/9/02 12:38:15 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
planewiz(at)hotmail.com writes:
<< Sally and George:
I am also working with West Sysyems Epoxy. In working with the HS and
Elevator fairings, I have sanded off some of the white Gelcoat surface area.
Does this have to be regelcoated to protect against UV and if so, what
product is used to re apply the gelcoat?
Thanks
Dave Pohl
Bloomfield Hills, (Detroit)MI
RV7A >>
I'm neither Sally or George, but I can still answer this one... As long as
you use a finish paint system (or primer) with a UV blocker you won't need to
worry about UV damage. If you fly the plane for some time with the
fiberglass unfinished, you might see some loss of strength due to UV
exposure, but I'm aware of planes that have flown without paint or primer for
a long time with no apparent damage.
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steven Eberhart <newtech(at)newtech.com> |
| Subject: | RV-7 R/C model, was Smooth Prime |
Dave von Linsowe wrote:
>
> Steve, what scale is the R/C RV-7?
>
> Dave von Linsowe
> RV-6 N98AR flying
I haven't calculated the scale. The model has a 34" wingspan, is
powered with a Fox .15bb and has balsa covered foam wings. Hope to get
some other local fliers interrested so we can go pylon racing with them.
Half a dozen RV-7s racing around the pylons should be a blast.
I designed the model so it could be flown on anything from an .07 to .15
and it uses an airfoil designed by Dr. Michael Selig at the University
of Illinois. Just getting it ready for its first flight.
Steve Eberhart
RV-7A - building wings
N14SE reserved
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "James E. Clark" <jclark(at)conterra.com> |
| Subject: | RV-7 R/C model, was Smooth Prime |
I seemed to have missed it but was there a reference made earlier to RV-7
R/C model that is available??
I have a friend who is into RC and was just asking about the RV6/RV7. Any
link or any other info available??
James
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Steven Eberhart
> Sent: Friday, August 09, 2002 1:24 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: RV-7 R/C model, was Smooth Prime
>
>
> Dave von Linsowe wrote:
>
>
> >
> > Steve, what scale is the R/C RV-7?
> >
> > Dave von Linsowe
> > RV-6 N98AR flying
>
> I haven't calculated the scale. The model has a 34" wingspan, is
> powered with a Fox .15bb and has balsa covered foam wings. Hope to get
> some other local fliers interrested so we can go pylon racing with them.
> Half a dozen RV-7s racing around the pylons should be a blast.
>
> I designed the model so it could be flown on anything from an .07 to .15
> and it uses an airfoil designed by Dr. Michael Selig at the University
> of Illinois. Just getting it ready for its first flight.
>
> Steve Eberhart
> RV-7A - building wings
> N14SE reserved
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | sjhdcl(at)kingston.net |
| Subject: | RV-7 R/C model, was Smooth Prime |
Here is one:
http://www.hobbyhangar.com/test/new.htm
However, I saw Steve's RV-7 prototype R/C at Oshkosh and it looks great! Wait
for it to be sold. Maybe we can all get one painted the same as the real
aircraft.
Steve Hurlbut
RV-7A
Kingston, Ont
Quoting "James E. Clark" :
>
> I seemed to have missed it but was there a reference made earlier to RV-7
> R/C model that is available??
>
> I have a friend who is into RC and was just asking about the RV6/RV7. Any
> link or any other info available??
>
> James
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Steven Eberhart
> > Sent: Friday, August 09, 2002 1:24 PM
> > To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> > Subject: RV-List: RV-7 R/C model, was Smooth Prime
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Dave von Linsowe wrote:
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Steve, what scale is the R/C RV-7?
> > >
> > > Dave von Linsowe
> > > RV-6 N98AR flying
> >
> > I haven't calculated the scale. The model has a 34" wingspan, is
> > powered with a Fox .15bb and has balsa covered foam wings. Hope to get
> > some other local fliers interrested so we can go pylon racing with them.
> > Half a dozen RV-7s racing around the pylons should be a blast.
> >
> > I designed the model so it could be flown on anything from an .07 to .15
> > and it uses an airfoil designed by Dr. Michael Selig at the University
> > of Illinois. Just getting it ready for its first flight.
> >
> > Steve Eberhart
> > RV-7A - building wings
> > N14SE reserved
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steven Eberhart <newtech(at)newtech.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-7 R/C model, was Smooth Prime |
James E. Clark wrote:
>
> I seemed to have missed it but was there a reference made earlier to RV-7
> R/C model that is available??
>
> I have a friend who is into RC and was just asking about the RV6/RV7. Any
> link or any other info available??
>
> James
I don't like to sell futures but I am thinking about kitting my carbon
fiber/foam wing RV-7 model. You can see a picture of it at:
http://63.69.213.180/newtech/photos/P1010040.JPG
Steve Eberhart
RV-7A - working on wings
N14SE reserved
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
>
>Thanks, but I already gathered that a vacuum/electric DG is equivalent to a
>directional gyro! :)
I wasn't sure just what you had already gathered.
>Let me ask it a different way. Who on this list has an IFR capable plane
>without a "traditional" DG? What do you have instead?
>
>Mock HSI display on the handheld GPS?
>Vertical card compass?
>EFIS with compass tape (like BMA EFIS Lite)?
>TruTrak digital mag heading display?
>Flux gate compass like the blue Ritchie compass?
>
>Are any of these valid "equivalents"?
The requirement is for a "gyroscopic" device and none of the above seem to
me to be such. A digital device might be called a "gyroscope" by its
purveyors but calling it one doesn't make it one. (Calling an "expense" an
"investment" doesn't make it one.) Isn't a gyroscope with no moving parts
sort of like dehydrated water?
I do hope that the door is opening to some more modern alternatives. I
suspect that it is time to require an instrument that provides a
directional indication equivalent or superior to a gyro.... It seems to me
that the ideal is a damped magnetic compass which is what TruTrak uses I
guess. After all, a DG is useless without a magnetic compass.
You may want your IFR ship to meet three requirements:
1 - Functional - stays right side up etc.
2 - Legal - keeps you from being grounded, fined etc.
3 - Insured - does not cause you to have to bear lawsuits following incidents
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jordan, Mel" <jordan_mel(at)ti.com> |
| Subject: | TruTrak servo installation RV6(A) |
I have recently installed a TruTrak autopilot in my 6A and had some problems
with the installation of the wing servo. TruTrak provides a very nice
mount that is designed to be installed through the access cover in the wing
(either right or left, specify which you want when ordering). After
wrestling with this beast for a couple of hours to get it bolted in place, I
found that there was not sufficient clearance between the braces for the
aileron bellcrank rib and the servo motor. Of course, I first concluded
that I did it wrong or had the wrong mount, but after several hours of study
and then totally removing the mount, I concluded that it just would not work
and called TruTrak. Turns out that when they designed the mount, they
looked as several RV6s and engineered the mount accordingly. However,
somewhere in kit production, the rib brace moved forward in the wing (mine
is a quickbuild, so the brace was "factory" installed) to the point where
there is not sufficient room for the servo. Once I understood the problem,
the solution was quite simple. I simply drilled out the three rivets
holding the servo mount to the plate that attaches to the outboard rib and
moved the servo plate 3/4 inch forward on the rib plate. While I was at it,
I used nutplates on the rib plate in place of the rivets, which allowed me
to install the rib plate first and made the whole job about ten times
easier. TruTrak is working on understanding and re-engineering this mount,
but if anyone else is struggling with this little problem, I thought this
would help. By the way, the people at TruTrak have been very helpful and
always ready to discuss any issue. I am sure that they will fix this now
that it has been brought to their attention. They really have a great
product. Please feel free to contact me if you need a better explanation
of my solution.
Mel Jordan
Tucson, AZ
n6jx(at)earthlink.net
520 575 0738
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
Hiya,
I must be in limp home mode today. I had always thought Part 91.205
applied to all aircraft. Reading online today it rather clearly says:
"no person may operate a powered civil aircraft with a standard category
U.S. airworthiness certificate " without certain equipment. So, we don't
need to have a magnetic direction indicator since we have special category
U.S. airworthiness certificates?
One exception is for paragraph c3 which says anticollision lights are
required. The logic is twisted but it means to apply to all U.S. ...
aircraft. I suppose this was necessary because 91.209 (Lights) says only
that if anticollision lights are installed, they must be turned on except .....
Confused,
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Craig Chipley" <craigchipley(at)hotmail.com> |
Hello, I am looking for a short hop in a RV-8/8A. I live in St. Louis, MO.
Thanks, Craig
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | jollyd <jollyd(at)ipns.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: RV-8/8A |
so am I..
Craig Chipley wrote:
> --> RV8-List message posted by: "Craig Chipley"
>
> Hello, I am looking for a short hop in a RV-8/8A. I live in St. Louis, MO.
> Thanks, Craig
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wilson, James Mike" <james.mike.wilson(at)intel.com> |
| Subject: | Lightspeed Plug Inserts |
I use the Permatex anti sieze, its' silver, works great.
Also use it on me exhaust slip joints. Doesn't take much either.
Mike RV4
-----Original Message-----
From: George McNutt [mailto:gmcnutt(at)intergate.ca]
Subject: RV-List: Lightspeed Plug Inserts
The setup - a single Lightspeed electronic ignition with automotive
sparkplugs in brass inserts, as per instructions, installed the brass
inserts into the cylinders dry and torqued to 25 ft/lbs, the plugs were
installed into the inserts with copperlube anti-sieze compound and torqued
to 15 ft/lb.
On removing the plugs for the first time all the brass inserts came out.
My question is this - is copper based anti-sieze on the plugs incompatible
with the brass insert and if so what should be used?
George McNutt
Langley, B.C.
6A-60hrs
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
| Subject: | Horizontal Stab nose ribs. |
Matthew Brandes wrote...
My wife and I riveted in the HS nose ribs on one side of the HS and
ended up
with a horrible depression in the skin on the top side along the rivet
line.
(Why couldn't it have been the bottom.) After doing some reading online
it
appears to be a fairly common problem and I resolved not to let it
happen
again on the other side.
I too had the same problem and whilst Matthews suggestions will help I
would also recommend clecoing into place the HS904 main ribs. No need
to install the spar - having these ribs in place will stabilise the skin
and ensure that everything remains aligned with no tendency for the
unsupported skin to 'flap'.
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
Fuse N919RV resvd.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
>
>Hiya,
>
>I must be in limp home mode today. I had always thought Part 91.205
>applied to all aircraft. Reading online today it rather clearly says:
>
>"no person may operate a powered civil aircraft with a standard category
>U.S. airworthiness certificate " without certain equipment. So, we don't
>need to have a magnetic direction indicator since we have special category
>U.S. airworthiness certificates?
>
>One exception is for paragraph c3 which says anticollision lights are
>required. The logic is twisted but it means to apply to all U.S. ...
>aircraft. I suppose this was necessary because 91.209 (Lights) says only
>that if anticollision lights are installed, they must be turned on
>except .....
>
>Confused,
>
>K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
Dear Confused, :)
If you just go straight to 91.205, the wording quite clearly does not
apply to homebuilts. But, the curve ball is the wording in your
Operating Limitations. The standard wording is buried deeply within
FAA Order 8130.2D, which can be found from Jay Pratt's Homebuilt FAQ
site:
http://www.provide.net/%7Epratt1/ambuilt/faqhmblt.htm
FAA Order 8130.2D:
http://www.moneypit.net/~pratt/ambuilt/8130-2d.htm
The key line is:
(7) After completion of phase I flight testing, unless appropriately
equipped for night and/or instrument flight in accordance with
91.205, this aircraft is to be operated under day only VFR.
So, I agree the link is still a bit muddy, but the direct reference
to 91.205 is clearly intended to say that you must have the long list
of equipment called up there.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (fibreglas, yuck)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
>
>>
>>Thanks, but I already gathered that a vacuum/electric DG is equivalent to a
>>directional gyro! :)
>
>I wasn't sure just what you had already gathered.
>
>>Let me ask it a different way. Who on this list has an IFR capable plane
>>without a "traditional" DG? What do you have instead?
>>
>>Mock HSI display on the handheld GPS?
>>Vertical card compass?
>>EFIS with compass tape (like BMA EFIS Lite)?
>>TruTrak digital mag heading display?
>>Flux gate compass like the blue Ritchie compass?
>>
>>Are any of these valid "equivalents"?
>
>The requirement is for a "gyroscopic" device and none of the above seem to
>me to be such. A digital device might be called a "gyroscope" by its
>purveyors but calling it one doesn't make it one. (Calling an "expense" an
>"investment" doesn't make it one.) Isn't a gyroscope with no moving parts
>sort of like dehydrated water?
>
>I do hope that the door is opening to some more modern alternatives. I
>suspect that it is time to require an instrument that provides a
>directional indication equivalent or superior to a gyro.... It seems to me
>that the ideal is a damped magnetic compass which is what TruTrak uses I
>guess. After all, a DG is useless without a magnetic compass.
>
>You may want your IFR ship to meet three requirements:
>
>1 - Functional - stays right side up etc.
>2 - Legal - keeps you from being grounded, fined etc.
>3 - Insured - does not cause you to have to bear lawsuits following incidents
>
>K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
Actually, the door is already open for more modern alternatives. The
requirement is for "Gyroscopic direction indicator (directional gyro
or equivalent)". The "or equivalent" is there to allow for new
technology stuff such as ring-laser-"gyros", AHRS,
solid-state-"gyros" and the like. So, the rules allow us to use the
new stuff, once someone actually sells a system that consistently
works correctly, at a price we can afford.
And you don't need a magnetic compass - you need a "Magnetic
direction indicator". This wording opens the door to newer
technology stuff here too, in principle.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (fibreglas, yuck)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Craig Chipley" <craigchipley(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: RV-8/8A |
Well, I guess I didn't do that very well. For a long time I have wanted to
build. Finally time amd money allow me to. I have not yet had a ride in the
plane of my dreams, the RV-8/8A. I would very much like to see what it is
like before I get a lot of investment in. I will reimburse for any fuel/oil
pilot time etc. Thanks,
Craig Chipley
St. Louis, Mo
>From: "Craig Chipley" <craigchipley(at)hotmail.com>
>Reply-To: rv8-list(at)matronics.com
>To: RV8-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV8-List: RV-8/8A
>Date: Fri, 09 Aug 2002 18:26:18 -0500
>
>--> RV8-List message posted by: "Craig Chipley"
>
>
>Hello, I am looking for a short hop in a RV-8/8A. I live in St. Louis, MO.
>Thanks, Craig
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dana Overall" <bo124rs(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Horizontal Stab nose ribs. |
For anyone (yea, right.....as in most:-) who has once or twice ended up with
a dent from not holding the flush set square, here's your solution. Go to
your near new car dealer and find out what day of the week their "dent guy"
shows up (they usually show up once a week). They can take these out of
your skins in no time. Don't ask me how I know:-)
Dana Overall
Richmond, KY
http://rvflying.tripod.com
>with a horrible depression in the skin on the top side along the rivet
>line.
>(Why couldn't it have been the bottom.) After doing some reading
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Marvel <bmarvel(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: RV-8/8A |
Craig:
Too bad I live in L.A. or I would take you up tomorrow. FYI I have owned a
Grumman Tiger for 25 years, and still do. When I finally got the bug to build,
I picked an RV-8A and bought the QB version without having flown in any RV. I
bought the kit at Vans and they couldn't believe I didn't even want a demo ride
first. They talked me into it after I paid for the airplane, but I didn't need
the motivation.
That said, I now have 83 hours on my 8A and have flown to KC and back, to NE and
back and we're heading for MA next week. Send me your phone number and if I am
anywhere near STL (wx pending) I'll take you up. What airport is closest?
Also, I will send you two articles I wrote for the local RV gang here in So.
Cal. about these two trips. The airplane's performance is awesome and I
continue to be amazed by it. When you read these, I think you'll just buy the
plane and start banging rivets. I've had a lot of good fortune in my 56 years,
but my wife and I building this airplane ranks right up there with the best of
them.
Cheers,
Bill Marvel
Craig Chipley wrote:
> --> RV8-List message posted by: "Craig Chipley"
>
> Well, I guess I didn't do that very well. For a long time I have wanted to
> build. Finally time amd money allow me to. I have not yet had a ride in the
> plane of my dreams, the RV-8/8A. I would very much like to see what it is
> like before I get a lot of investment in. I will reimburse for any fuel/oil
> pilot time etc. Thanks,
>
> Craig Chipley
> St. Louis, Mo
>
> >From: "Craig Chipley" <craigchipley(at)hotmail.com>
> >Reply-To: rv8-list(at)matronics.com
> >To: RV8-list(at)matronics.com
> >Subject: RV8-List: RV-8/8A
> >Date: Fri, 09 Aug 2002 18:26:18 -0500
> >
> >--> RV8-List message posted by: "Craig Chipley"
> >
> >
> >Hello, I am looking for a short hop in a RV-8/8A. I live in St. Louis, MO.
> >Thanks, Craig
> >
> >
>
--
Bill Marvel Home/office 310 832 7617
P.O. Box 784 Cell 310 293 2013
San Pedro, CA 90733 Fax 310 832 5334
One good deed beats 100 good intentions...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
Regular listers will be aware that a few days ago I made an enquiry
regarding Warnke Props on behalf of a friend who had become a little
concerned about the company. This resulted in a series of mostly
negative responses about the company. To give Margie's point of view I
am posting below the email which she sent directly to me, without
further comment.
FYI
Dear Mr. Shipley,
I am responding to your recent rvlist@ matronics letter.
It would have been nice for Mr. Wills to have waited at least 24 hours,
for me to return his call, before he sent a message to you. Don't you
think you would have appreciated that courtesy. All along he said he
wasn't ready for his prop yet, with all the back log we had since my
mother's illness and death, I tried to work on those props that were
more urgently needed. The kind of quality work we do can not get
rushed.
Mr. Wills prop is on it's way now and was completed when he left that
message. We have been in the process of moving to Alaska and working in
between and have already taken one load and are preparing for the final
trip the end of this month.
It seems shocking to me the amount of fear that is inside of people now.
Maybe it is due to all the corporate scandals, I don't know. If people
only knew what it takes for us to make such integral product they would
be much more appreciative. We have had some hard times especially since
Sept. 11, and we have done without many "necessities" that you folks may
have not been willing to give up just so we could buy material to finish
our propellers.
Please keep these items in mind and know that the time it takes to
create such rare crafts as making exquisite aircraft propellers by hand
and this is not always a welcome thing in todays fast paced instantly
gratified world.
May you be well when this meets with you,
Margie Warnke
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A fuse N919RV resvd.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave von Linsowe" <davevon(at)tir.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV8-List: Filling pin holes in West Systems epoxy, etc. |
> Dave,
>
> I had no idea we had a TOC pro in our midst! Welcome. I'm an IMAC/TOC
nut
> and RV8 builder/flier. Folks, you can't get better help on fiberglass
work
> than from the RC community. The giant scale RC airplanes these days are
> making huge progress in airframe technology, with significant use of
> composites.
>
> Speaking of RV RC models, I wonder when a giant scale RV8 might show up
> somewhere?
>
> Brian Denk
> RV8 N94BD
> 296 hrs.
Hi Brain,
I'm a newbee RV'er.
I had a RV-4 kit in the create for 9 years while I was real heavy in the R/C
competition scene. I sold that and I've been flying a Pitts S-2A for the
last 7 years. Sold the Pitts this spring and have been shopping for a RV-6.
I finally found one and picked it up last week!
I'm really looking forward to tinkering on the RV to make it faster. I've
even done some preliminary design work on a new wing. I'll have to wait
until after the TOC to really dig into it. Although, the F-2 Rocket may be
the way to go!!!
If anyone has any info on any speed mods out there, pro or con, I'm all
ears!
Thanks,
Dave von Linsowe
RV-6 N98AR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Carter" <dcarter(at)datarecall.net> |
| Subject: | Fw: AeroElectric-List: Non Phillips Drive Screws (Torx drive) |
For the RV-list, this e-mail from the AeroElectric List is forwarded for
your info.
Over last 2 months, there was extensive exchange of info on machine screws
with "other than cross point/Phillips" drive. The e-mail below is
explanatory about new availability of Torx drive screws available in small
lots of 100 - never before available in such small, "home builder friendly"
quantities.
Does the AeroElectric List has an archives like the RV-list? If so, you can
access the prior posts.
If not, I've saved a lot of the e-mails on my hard drive and can forward
them to any RVers that are interested.
I believe two principle uses of these screws are 1) floors in baggage
compartment and cockpit, 2) fuel tank access plates. There are other places
where they could also be used where one might have worries or actual
experience with stripping out the Phillips head slots.
David Carter
----- Original Message -----
From: <BAKEROCB(at)aol.com>
;
Subject: AeroElectric-List: Non Phillips Drive Screws
> --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: BAKEROCB(at)aol.com
>
> 8/9/2002
>
> Hello Fellow Builders, You may recall that a few weeks back this subject
was
> discussed in some detail and John Fleisher of Micro Fasteners agreed to
> attempt to have some 8-32 X 5/8 inch long, 100 degree countersink, flat
head,
> stainless steel, Torx drive screws manufactured and stock them in
purchasable
> quantities by individual builders. A product like this had heretofore not
> been available except in very large special order quantities not feasible
for
> individual builders.
>
> John has now reported that he has these screws in stock. I will quote his
> email:
>
> "Subj: 8-32x5/8 100 degree flat head torx screwsThe subject screws, our
part
> number FCMXS0810, are now available. They are made from 302 stainless
steel
> and require a torx T20 driver.
>
> The price is $14.50/100 in packages of 100 only. Shipping for orders of up
to
> $100 is $5. If you would like to see samples first, send your mailing
address
> and we will send 6 pieces at no charge.
> You may order on our website at www.microfasteners.com, which we suggest
if
> you want to email credit card information. The screws are under the
"socket
> screw" category on the site.
> If you prefer to call or fax, use 800-892-6917 or
> 908-236-8120 for voice, 908-236-8721 for fax.
>
> Whether and when we order additional sizes will depend upon the response
to
> this message. If even 1/4 of those who have expressed interest order these
> screws we will order 6-32's and 10-32's immediately. Thanks for your
interest
> and for your patience. John Fleisher Micro Fasteners"
>
> If any of you are members of groups that you feel would benefit from
having
> this information please pass it on to them.
>
> I would like to express my appreciation to John for his efforts on our
> behalf. I had been attempting for 4 plus years to obtain such a product
> without success until now.
>
> 'OC' Baker, Builder of KIS TR-1 #116 4/14/97 - ?/?/?
>
> PS: Micro Fasteners also stocks a varitey of hex socket head drive screws
in
> alloy and stainless steel. I have made extensive use of these hex socket
head
> drive stainless steel fasteners in both button head and standard knurled
head
> configuration in my project. They are vastly superior to the Phillips
drive
> screws in speed and convenience of use.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dan Checkoway
>
> Textron Lycoming
> WILLIAMSPORT, PA 17701
> 800-258-3279
>
> Product Support:
> mcaldera(at)lycoming.textron.com
>
> )_( Dan
> do ___ archive
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re:RV6-List: Garmin 195 |
| From: | marsman17(at)juno.com |
Have you sold the Garmin 195 as yet??
Keith
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | glen j matejcek <aerobubba(at)compuserve.com> |
| Subject: | wheel pants and plenums |
-------------Forwarded Message-----------------
From: glen j matejcek, 110610,3305
Date: 08/09/2002 10:11 PM
RE: wheel pants and plenums
Does anyone have any comparative info on the Sam James wheel pants vs.
Van's pressure recovery pants? Are the James pants a hassle to mount?
Has anyone mounted a Sam James plenum in a Van's cowling, especially on an
-8? Was it worth the effort, or is an aluminum plenum a better way to go?
Glen Matejcek
RV-8 QB, wings and tail done, starting systems installation.
Near Indy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | KBoatri144(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: wheel pants and plenums |
In a message dated 8/10/02 3:41:03 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
aerobubba(at)compuserve.com writes:
<< RE: wheel pants and plenums
Does anyone have any comparative info on the Sam James wheel pants vs.
Van's pressure recovery pants? Are the James pants a hassle to mount?
Has anyone mounted a Sam James plenum in a Van's cowling, especially on an
-8? Was it worth the effort, or is an aluminum plenum a better way to go?
Glen Matejcek
RV-8 QB, wings and tail done, starting systems installation.
Near Indy >>
I've got Sam's wheelpants, which were easy enough to mount, although you will
need a metal brake to bend the attachment fittings, which (I think) are
prebent in Van's kit. If I was to do it again, I'd go with Van's wheelpants
for a couple of reasons: 1) The fit and finish on the Sam James pants
required quite a bit of work. 2) The wheel pants are very narrow. This
makes it difficult to make a cutout for the tire that provides adequate
clearance in the event of a hard landing that seriously flexes the tires.
Check the archives for info on the SJ cowling. I seem to remember that it
wasn't quite the plug and play installation some people expected.
As to the plenum, I doubt that a plenum will offer a measurable improvement
in cooling or speed over a properly sealed and installed set of baffles. My
baffles are darned near leak proof, and that's the real objective of a plenum
system. I'm sure there are differing opinions on this...
Kyle Boatright
0-320/Aymar Demuth RV-6 Slider
Kennesaw, GA
http://www.angelfire.com/my/rv6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | wheel pants and plenums |
<< RE: wheel pants and plenums
Does anyone have any comparative info on the Sam James wheel pants vs.
Van's pressure recovery pants? Are the James pants a hassle to mount?
Has anyone mounted a Sam James plenum in a Van's cowling, especially on an
-8? Was it worth the effort, or is an aluminum plenum a better way to go?
Glen Matejcek
RV-8 QB, wings and tail done, starting systems installation.
Near Indy >>
Glen,
check the archives, I've written a bit about the cowl and plenum, but for a
6 not an 8. I do not have Sam's wheel pants, so can't comment.
It is my opinion from extensive research on the topic, that a propper plenum
will be more efficient and thus allow more speed than even the tightest
baffle system. There is more to it than "leeky-ness" of the system. Amount
of air flow in, and the volume of the space are very important issues. Some
have reported measurable increases in speed by simply changing the position
of their plenum so that the volume is less.
As for Sam's plenum, it more-or-less is a bolt-in proposition, unless you
have an AirFlow Performance fuel injection unit, which will require you to
cut a clearance hole in the top of the plenum. You will still need Van's
baffle kit, but you just cut the baffles off about 2-3 inches below the top
so that it matches the profile of the plenum. Another issue is that you
will have to make a transition somehow from the rectangular inlets of Van's
cowl to the 4" round inlets of Sam's plenum.
Again, I've done this on a 6. There are a few out there who have done this
on an 8. The cowl, of course is a different animal all together, and my
experiences on the 6 will have no bearing on what you will get on an 8 cowl.
The end, result is an extremely good looking unit. The cost in time/effort
will vary with model, and the type of propeller and other engine accessories
you are using.
Jim
Tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | gert <gert(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: wheel pants and plenums |
Isn't that the Sam James plenum in the EAA rv8 video set ??
thought it looked familiar when I looked at the video.
Gert
Jim Norman wrote:
>
>
> << RE: wheel pants and plenums
>
> Does anyone have any comparative info on the Sam James wheel pants vs.
> Van's pressure recovery pants? Are the James pants a hassle to mount?
>
> Has anyone mounted a Sam James plenum in a Van's cowling, especially on an
> -8? Was it worth the effort, or is an aluminum plenum a better way to go?
>
> Glen Matejcek
> RV-8 QB, wings and tail done, starting systems installation.
> Near Indy >>
>
>
> Glen,
> check the archives, I've written a bit about the cowl and plenum, but for a
> 6 not an 8. I do not have Sam's wheel pants, so can't comment.
>
> It is my opinion from extensive research on the topic, that a propper plenum
> will be more efficient and thus allow more speed than even the tightest
> baffle system. There is more to it than "leeky-ness" of the system. Amount
> of air flow in, and the volume of the space are very important issues. Some
> have reported measurable increases in speed by simply changing the position
> of their plenum so that the volume is less.
>
> As for Sam's plenum, it more-or-less is a bolt-in proposition, unless you
> have an AirFlow Performance fuel injection unit, which will require you to
> cut a clearance hole in the top of the plenum. You will still need Van's
> baffle kit, but you just cut the baffles off about 2-3 inches below the top
> so that it matches the profile of the plenum. Another issue is that you
> will have to make a transition somehow from the rectangular inlets of Van's
> cowl to the 4" round inlets of Sam's plenum.
>
> Again, I've done this on a 6. There are a few out there who have done this
> on an 8. The cowl, of course is a different animal all together, and my
> experiences on the 6 will have no bearing on what you will get on an 8 cowl.
>
> The end, result is an extremely good looking unit. The cost in time/effort
> will vary with model, and the type of propeller and other engine accessories
> you are using.
>
> Jim
> Tampa
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Boyd C. Braem" <bcbraem(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Plane Registration |
There's a DYI booklet available at bookstores titled "Incorporate Yourself
Without A Lawyer" (or something very similar)--you use their tear-out sheets
and just fill in the blanks. The initial fee for Delaware registration is
$350 (IIRC) and you need to publish a "fictitious name" announcement in the
local newspaper. There after, there's a $50 annual fee to maintain the
corporate account. At least in Florida, you have to notify some government
entity that you're establishing an out of state corporation and they send
you a booklet to fill out the necessary info--a one time thing (they're
checking to see if you have any tax liability issues). The assets of the
corp. are the airplane and any significant aircraft parts that you want to
include. This does not necessarily give you blanket protection of your
beloved craft in the event of a lawsuit, so you may still want to consult an
appropriate attorney to make sure that the wording of the articles of
incorporation are correct.
Boyd
BB's Airshows, Inc.
emrath wrote:
>
> With all the discussion on aircraft registrion, I got to wondering about
> forming a Sub-S corp and putting the plane in the corporation as the
> only asset. Registered in Del. Of course and then if I sell the plane,
> do so by just selling the corporation (i.e. stock). Might have to pay
> corp. registration or some such fee each year. Might shield one from
> liabilities and perhaps from sales taxes on selling the corporation. Can
> this be done? Any advice from the "listers"?
> Marty in Brentwood, TN
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Plane Registration |
| From: | Tom Brandon <majortom(at)apex.net> |
Along the same lines, if I were to build an airplane in Canada, how
would I get it back into the US? Would I register it in Canada & fly it back
to the states and reregister it? Could I ferry it back to the states and
register it here? Would I have to register it in both countries?
Thanks
Tom Brandon
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | glen j matejcek <aerobubba(at)compuserve.com> |
Hi All-
A while back I addressed the issue of TSO / non-TSO with the local FSDO.
They indicated that Piper doesn't use TSO'ed equipment. They install
non-TSO'ed equipment, and then certify the whole airplane as one entity.
That being the case, our local feds are anxious / enthusiastic to see
whatever whiz-bangery I come up with that meets the fundamental operational
requirements for IFR flight. They are also very accessible and helpful.
Really!
Glen Matejcek
Indy RV-8 QB
wings and tail done, starting systems installations
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: [rv8list] Filling pin holes in West Systems expoxy |
Thanks to everyone who replied, on and off the lists. There were too
many responses to reply individually.
I'll order some UV Smoothprime. I'll move to fitting the spinner,
prop and cowling while I'm waiting for it to arrive. If the
Smoothprime still hasn't arrived, some folks gave me suggestions of
other things I can try to beat those pin holes - thin the West
Systems with acetone and roll it on to fill them. Or just use
straight West Systems epoxy and a heat gun to decrease the viscosity.
But, many, many people seemed to like the Smoothprime, so I'll give
it a go. Besides, it gives me a wonderful excuse to defer fibreglas
work for a week or two :)
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (fibreglas, yuck)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Plexiglass safe thread locker? |
> I am using screws to hold the rear window to the roll over bar on my tip
> up canopy. Would like to use something on the screws to keep them from
> backing out of the tapped holes.
Does anyone think a threadlocker is neccessary? I am just clocking all the
screws so the phillips crosses are lined up neat and tidy. Visual
inspections at frequent intervals are easily possible due to their location.
Any that are moving should be very noticable and I'll deal with them then
only if I have to.
The plans call for rivets here but I find the screws are much better
looking. Something about the sight of pop rivets just doesn't seat well on
the RV's. It is my opinion that the screws offer a more high tech/polished
factory look in this very visable location.
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Plane Registration |
speaking as president and sole stock holder of a florida corporation, i can
assure you you don't have any protection by incorporating. if you hold all
the stock , are the only officer, director, cheif, cook and bottle washer,
even with 30 employees, they see your corporation as an alter ego, and will
hold you personally responsible. being incorporated these days is a waste of
money and time. the lawyers can cut through that smoke screen in no time.
believe me when i say i know this is true.
scott
tampa
always being sued for some reason or another
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Whirlwind Props |
> I'm flying the RV6 testing for Whirlwind on the 150 series and have over
60
> hrs on it so far. I know of three other 150 Series props flying, 2 on RV8s
and
> one on a Glasair. To the best of my knowledge no one has had any
significant
> problems regarding the prop.
> If you asked me today, if I could exchange my Whirlwind for any other
prop,
> would I? Absolutely not! I never flow anything as smooth or as strong as
this
> prop.
> Whirlwind has had props (not 150 Series) in aerobatic competition for a
number
> of years and know what it takes to make a great prop.
> As far as selling props or taking deposits go, One of the reasons I got
> involved with Whirlwind in the first place, was their commitment to not
take
> any deposits for the prop until they had completed significant testing.
What
> they do have is a waiting list for interested parties, and it doesn't
require
> a deposit to get on that list.
> As others have said "beware of anybody, that asks for money," before they
have
> completed testing and manufacturing development.
> Garry LeGare "Casper"
But does it provide any speed improvement over the Hartzell?
Randy Lervold
RV-8, 234 hrs.
www.rv-8.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: wheel pants and plenums |
> Has anyone mounted a Sam James plenum in a Van's cowling, especially on an
> -8? Was it worth the effort, or is an aluminum plenum a better way to go?
>
> Glen Matejcek
> RV-8 QB, wings and tail done, starting systems installation.
Yes, see...
http://www.rv-8.com/Cowl.htm
Randy Lervold
RV-8, 234 hrs.
www.rv-8.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "hal merritt" <merritthal(at)hotmail.com> |
I 'm sorry to take up time on the list but I had advertized 8 potter-brumfield
breaker for sale a week ago and a lady asked about them. Would you please e-mail
me again if you are still interested in them. Thanks Hal
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: Click Here
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: List Weirdness |
Just went to your website but I can't seem to find the picture of your
panel????
Len
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
Regular listers will be aware that a few days ago I made an enquiry
regarding Warnke Props on behalf of a friend who had become a little
concerned about the company. This resulted in a series of mostly
negative responses about the company. To give Margie's point of view I
am posting below the email which she sent directly to me, without
further comment.
FYI
Dear Mr. Shipley,
I am responding to your recent rvlist@ matronics letter.
It would have been nice for Mr. Wills to have waited at least 24 hours,
for me to return his call, before he sent a message to you. Don't you
think you would have appreciated that courtesy. All along he said he
wasn't ready for his prop yet, with all the back log we had since my
mother's illness and death, I tried to work on those props that were
more urgently needed. The kind of quality work we do can not get
rushed.
Mr. Wills prop is on it's way now and was completed when he left that
message. We have been in the process of moving to Alaska and working in
between and have already taken one load and are preparing for the final
trip the end of this month.
It seems shocking to me the amount of fear that is inside of people now.
Maybe it is due to all the corporate scandals, I don't know. If people
only knew what it takes for us to make such integral product they would
be much more appreciative. We have had some hard times especially since
Sept. 11, and we have done without many "necessities" that you folks may
have not been willing to give up just so we could buy material to finish
our propellers.
Please keep these items in mind and know that the time it takes to
create such rare crafts as making exquisite aircraft propellers by hand
and this is not always a welcome thing in todays fast paced instantly
gratified world.
May you be well when this meets with you,
Margie Warnke
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A fuse N919RV resvd.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Horizontal Stab nose ribs. |
> My wife and I riveted in the HS nose ribs on one side of the HS and
> ended up
> with a horrible depression in the skin on the top side along the rivet
> line.
> (Why couldn't it have been the bottom.) After doing some reading online
> it
> appears to be a fairly common problem and I resolved not to let it
Matthew,
Drill out the rivets, cut some strips of alum 1/2" wide from your scrap, and
insert them inbetween the skin and the rib. They are called shims and are
the fix. Re-rivet with an apropriately longer rivet.
I found many places to put them when doing my RV6A non pre-punched fuselage.
I ended up with very nice flat skins. I learned the trick from this list a
few years back. I recall a lister claiming that this is how Boeing did it. I
would be interested in what the current thinking is from more experienced
builders, perhaps airframe engineers. I'd bet things have gotten alot more
precise with todays enviorment of computers controlling fancy hole punching
machines.
Norman Hunger
RV6A Delta BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: List weirdness |
I got one so long I didn't read all of it.
Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X , Flight testing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Horizontal Stab nose ribs. |
Norman, I also have used shims in a few places on my RV6A-QB especially on
the fuselage top skins with excellent results.
The shim procedure was OK with Vans and considered a
somewhat normal occurrence.
Tom
in Ohio (Testing circuits and final wiring)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Norman" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Horizontal Stab nose ribs.
>
> > My wife and I riveted in the HS nose ribs on one side of the HS and
> > ended up
> > with a horrible depression in the skin on the top side along the rivet
> > line.
> > (Why couldn't it have been the bottom.) After doing some reading online
> > it
> > appears to be a fairly common problem and I resolved not to let it
>
> Matthew,
>
> Drill out the rivets, cut some strips of alum 1/2" wide from your scrap,
and
> insert them inbetween the skin and the rib. They are called shims and are
> the fix. Re-rivet with an apropriately longer rivet.
>
> I found many places to put them when doing my RV6A non pre-punched
fuselage.
> I ended up with very nice flat skins. I learned the trick from this list a
> few years back. I recall a lister claiming that this is how Boeing did it.
I
> would be interested in what the current thinking is from more experienced
> builders, perhaps airframe engineers. I'd bet things have gotten alot more
> precise with todays enviorment of computers controlling fancy hole
punching
> machines.
>
> Norman Hunger
> RV6A Delta BC
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Earl Fortner <efortner(at)vnet.net> |
Ed Anderson , Eddie Fowlkes ,
Elena
| Subject: | [Fwd: FW: VOTE NO] |
From: "wam" <k4wam(at)webkorner.com>
Subject: FW: VOTE NO
Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2002 15:34:47 -0400
No name nor address asked---Just vote no!!!!
Please go to the web site and vote "NO " today!
USA Today is taking a vote on whether the words "Under
God" should be removed from the pledge of allegiance.
You can vote by going to the following web site:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2002/06/27/pledge-hold.htm
Thanks please... keep passing this one along
No name nor
address
asked---Just vote no!!!!
Please go to the web site
and vote
"NO " today!
USA Today is taking a
vote on
whether the words "Under
God" should be removed from the pledge
of
allegiance.
You can vote by going to the following web site:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2002/06/27/pledge-hold.htm
lang0 faceArial color#0000ff size2 FAMILY"SANSSERIF">
Thanks
please... keep passing this one along
---
[ This E-mail scanned for viruses by www.WebKorner.com ]
[ Now offering High Speed Internet Access - Get Caught Speeding! ]
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrownScottA(at)aol.com |
F-1 ROCKET KIT, ENGINE, PROP,INSTRUMENTS FOR SALE I have for sale an F-1
Rocket kit, a completely overhauled IO-540 C4B5 engine (overhauled by Don
George), and a new Hartzell 3-bladed prop. Instrumentation includes but not
limited to: new Garmin 250XL radio, fuel guages, fuel pressure, EI
volt/ammeter, manifold pressure guage, and more. Also included is a NavAid
autopilot unit. Unit servo is installed and attached to the torgue tube.
Wings are closed up and I have position and strobe lights as well as a tail
white light. Also included is a F-1 Rocket tailgroup. Skeleton is built,
ready to be skinned. This F-1 Rocket kit is extremely far along in its build.
Electrical sub-panel complete including all circuit breakers installed.
Interior Fuselage is complete. Fuel system complete with the exception of the
installation of the electric fuel pump (included). Engine has the airflow
performance kit, starter, alternator, Rose electronic ignition with the ring
gear for high powered engines. Master solenoid, starter solenoid are
included. Almost everything needed to complete rocket is included. Rocket
could be flying in approx 5 months with some effort. Will sell this plane at
an absolute steal at $70K!!!! I have much more than $70k in just parts for
this plane. This is your chance to get into a Rocket economically. Call
561-848-3418 or cell 561-373-3797.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Patrick Kelley" <webmaster(at)flion.com> |
After four years in storage, my RV-6A project (wings and tail) has been
moved from Chicago to Flagstaff. I've had time to get the pictures
developed and scanned and updated my website. Lots of new photos and
some new text, especially about the moving adventure. You can see it
all by going to www.flion.com <http://www.flion.com/> and clicking on
the RV picture. The fuselage kit is on order and updates for the
website should resume this winter; I'll keep the list posted.
Patrick Kelley - RV-6A - waiting on fuselage kit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Engine Selection |
I am sure a book could be written on this subject but in this case we
are talking about engines for the RV's.
A while back good part time Lycomings were not to hard to come by or
good time expired engines were available for a reasonable price and
overhauled. With the number of experimentals now being build that has
all changed and so has the cost. This has caused a few to try other
engines, mostly trying to adapt a automotive engine to the job.
To make it possible for a lot more people to build an RV we really need
an alternative engine that could be purchased say for half the cost of a
Lycoming. This is not likely to happen as ideally it would be an engine
basically the same as a Lycoming, horizontally opposed, direct drive
etc.
I admire those who are trying and some are showing signs of progress,
hopefully I will see it in what's left of my lifetime. The big hurdles
are developing an engine of the correct horse power that can be operated
for say 2000 hours without a failure and as light as a Lycoming.
For me safety has to take first priority so the only choice for me was
the Lycoming with it's proven record and of course the one the RV's are
designed around. My RV building has spanned twelve years so I have seen
the changes in the availability of engines. My RV 6 (1990-1992) was
initially equipped with a 0360 with only 180 hours on it purchased for
6500.00 US. My RV 6A has a 0360 with Bendix fuel injection purchased
from Aero Sport Power.
Aero Sport Power is a division of Progressive Air Service a long time
certified engine overhaul shop. Aero Sport is dedicated to providing
safe quality engines to the Experimental category aircraft and the
engines come with full warranty.
One of the big advantages for building engines in the Experimental
Category, it allows the engine builders to customize your engine. A
prime example is building a 0360 with 9.2 compression pistons (still
retaining the recommended 2000 hour O/H) , Bendix Fuel Injection,
Lightspeed Electronic Ignition. Equipped this way it will develop 200
HP, The end result it gives you an engine that is 35 lbs. lighter than a
I0360 angle valve and can be purchase new for $25,375 or overhauled
for$21,475. All prices are in US dollars.
During a recent visit to Aero Sport's facility an interesting
observation. Engines dismantled for overhaul showed less wear on the
main and rod bearings that were running constant speed props than those
running fixed pitch. I guess another plus for a constant speed if we can
afford it.
Eustace Bowhay, Blind Bay, B.C. Finishing the 6A.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
Larry wrote -
From: "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com>
Subject: RV-List: List Weirdness
Everytime I post to the list I get an email containing the
RV-LIST POLICIES AND FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS
Anyone else?
You bet - and I'll probably get another now!!!
Rob
Rob W M Shipley
RV9A fuse. N919RV resvd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary & Carolyn Zilik <zilik(at)bewellnet.com> |
Earl,
Just a little friendly reminder that the RV-list is not the forum for this
kind of subject.
Gary
Earl Fortner wrote:
>
> From: "wam" <k4wam(at)webkorner.com>
> To:
> Subject: FW: VOTE NO
> Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2002 15:34:47 -0400
>
> No name nor address asked---Just vote no!!!!
>
> Please go to the web site and vote "NO " today!
>
> USA Today is taking a vote on whether the words "Under
>
> God" should be removed from the pledge of allegiance.
>
> You can vote by going to the following web site:
>
> http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2002/06/27/pledge-hold.htm
>
> Thanks please... keep passing this one along
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> faceTahoma
> size2>
> No name nor
> address
> asked---Just vote no!!!! FAMILY"SANSSERIF">
FAMILY"SANSSERIF">
FAMILY"SANSSERIF">Please go to the web site
> and vote
> "NO " today!
color#000000 size2
> FAMILY"SANSSERIF">USA Today is taking a
> vote on
> whether the words "Under
God" should be removed from the pledge
> of
> allegiance.
You can vote by going to the following web site:
>
href"http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2002/06/27/pledge-hold.htm"><> FONT
> faceArial>http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2002/06/27/pledge-hold.h> tm lang0 faceArial color#0000ff size2 FAMILY"SANSSERIF">
>
Thanks
> please... keep passing this one along class929595012-11082002> color#000000>
> FAMILY"SANSSERIF"> class929595012-11082002>
> FAMILY"SANSSERIF">
>
> ---
> [ This E-mail scanned for viruses by www.WebKorner.com ]
> [ Now offering High Speed Internet Access - Get Caught Speeding! ]
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert Blum <bob(at)theblums.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Re:RV6-List: Garmin 195 |
Yes I Did.
----- Original Message -----
From: <marsman17(at)juno.com>
Subject: Re:RV6-List: Garmin 195
> --> RV6-List message posted by: marsman17(at)juno.com
>
> Have you sold the Garmin 195 as yet??
>
> Keith
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oil cooler for sale |
| From: | Michael D Hilger <rvsixer(at)juno.com> |
writes:
>
> How is the Aero classic doing? I need to decide which to get
> soon.....
>
> Thanks,
>
> -
> Larry Bowen
> RV-8 O-360, Finish
> Larry(at)BowenAero.com
> http://BowenAero.com
Just fine. It gave me about 15-20 degrees extra cooling which is
enough to give me some margin on the hottest days. The Niagara 7-row
cooler probably would have been okay had it been mounted on the baffling.
Mike Hilger
RV-6, N207AM
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bernie Kerr" <kerrbernie(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Engine Selection (rotary selection)(long) |
Eustace,
Thanks for stating the problem of where we are with the shortage of good
economical engines for RV's.
I am currently building a 9A that will be powered by a 13B mazda rotary.
Having been closely associated with the high time alternate engine guru ,
Tracy Crook, for lots of years( we both flew Kolb UL's back then); I beleive
this is possibly the answer to the problem. There are at least 5 RV's
currently flying long distances around the country with rotary power.
Based on my 33 years engineering at P&W, I think the rotary is the poor
man's turbine. I am not convinced that Williams will come thru with anything
that most folks would consider buying for an RV. The basic rotary engine is
about as bullet proof from an aviation safety standpoint as any thing out
there. It will continue to run with broken seals and comes with reduntant
ignition system. The crank is overengineered to run at the 5-6000 RPM where
we operate, that it is almost prime reliable.
The cost is reasonable. The engine that I purchased from Bruce Turrentine
with accessories was under $4000.(same guy that built Tracy's engine) Now
add to that the PSRU for $2850 and ECU/FI system for less than a thousand.
This is a reasonably priced system and now Tracy is starting to make motor
mounts for the RV series. Standby for about a year to get the first flight
test results :>)
The new matched punch kits are out of sight!! I have been in the hangar for
less than 30 days and am past the QB stage.
Bernie
>
>I admire those who are trying and some are showing signs of progress,
>hopefully I will see it in what's left of my lifetime. The big hurdles
>are developing an engine of the correct horse power that can be operated
>for say 2000 hours without a failure and as light as a Lycoming.
>
>For me safety has to take first priority so the only choice for me was
>the Lycoming with it's proven record and of course the one the RV's are
>designed around.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | BrownScottA(at)aol.com |
F-1 ROCKET KIT, ENGINE, PROP,INSTRUMENTS FOR SALE I have for sale an F-1
Rocket kit, a completely overhauled IO-540 C4B5 engine (overhauled by Don
George), and a new Hartzell 3-bladed prop. Instrumentation includes but not
limited to: new Garmin 250XL radio, fuel guages, fuel pressure, EI
volt/ammeter, manifold pressure guage, and more. Also included is a NavAid
autopilot unit. Unit servo is installed and attached to the torgue tube.
Wings are closed up and I have position and strobe lights as well as a tail
white light. Also included is a F-1 Rocket tailgroup. Skeleton is built,
ready to be skinned. This F-1 Rocket kit is extremely far along in its build.
Electrical sub-panel complete including all circuit breakers installed.
Interior Fuselage is complete. Fuel system complete with the exception of the
installation of the electric fuel pump (included). Engine has the airflow
performance kit, starter, alternator, Rose electronic ignition with the ring
gear for high powered engines. Master solenoid, starter solenoid are
included. Almost everything needed to complete rocket is included. Rocket
could be flying in approx 5 months with some effort. Will sell this plane at
an absolute steal at $70K!!!! I have much more than $70k in just parts for
this plane. This is your chance to get into a Rocket economically. Call
561-848-3418 or cell 561-373-3797.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve J Hurlbut" <sjhdcl(at)kingston.net> |
| Subject: | Spare Nutplates? |
Does anybody have some spare K2000-08 nutplates? They are the one lug anchor
nuts for #8 screws.
I need 6-8 of them. Ironically I received 2 packages from Aircraft Spruce
this week but forgot to order
them. Next time I'll order some, and mail them back to you.
Thankx
Steve Hurlbut
RV-7A
Fuselage
http://members.kingston.net/sjhdcl/rv7a.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Greg Hunsicker <gh2538(at)cjnetworks.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Warnke Props. |
>
>
>> In a message dated 8/9/2002 8:13:43 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
>> Warnkeairproduct writes:
>>
>>
>>> To All Concerned,
>>>
>>>
>>> I thought you might enjoy the other side of the coin.
>>>
>>> Mr. Bud Newhall has quite a few facts incorrectly stated.
>>> I am now in
>>> receipt of his letter. He appears to be comfortable writing on the
>>> net about
>>> his plans for a refund, so I did not think he would mind a reply in
>>> the same
>>> way. This way everyone can know the whole story. I don't normally
>>> write
>>> letters like this, but here goes.
>>>
>>>
>>> Mr. Newhall you will not receive a refund on your prop when it is
>>> out performing
>>> your previous prop in top speed and cruise at lower rpm and
>>> comparable with
>>> climb when looking at air temps and density altitude. Climb is affected
>>> by many factors, even our test pilot with almost 30,000 hours must
>>> be diligent
>>> when determining climb characteristics with different airplanes.
>>> Mr. Newhall,
>>> maybe you have not had enough happen in your life or maybe you have
>>> had to
>>> much, but this will be the last you will hear from me. I will not
>>> do business
>>> with you anymore.
>>>
>>>
>>> As all of you read on you will understand better:
>>>
>>> Sept. 11th hit all aviation businesses hard - including ours. Mr.
>>> Bud Newhall's order was received on 10/10/2001, we had no idea at
>>> that time
>>> the amount or effect of business that would be lost. For four
>>> months orders
>>> were way down and as a result of lower capitol we were not able to
>>> purchase
>>> materials to continue the manufacturing at the rate necessary for timely
>>> shipping. The Warnke name has not necessarily been known for it's
>>> timely
>>> delivery, but instead for the high quality and performance, so when
>>> people
>>> got the product they mostly felt it was worth the wait.
>>> The materials
>>> we needed to purchase are very expensive and require advance
>>> ordering. This
>>> is why we must have full payment up front. Being a small and rare
>>> business
>>> requires a lot of dedication, especially when making aircraft propellers
>>> for people who build their own very different planes!
>>> When were finally
>>> able to purchase our raw goods, we were behind on manufacturing
>>> certain items
>>> like blanks - which we make all our own from 1/12" pieces of the highest
>>> quality hard rock maple veneer - to be glued with resorcinol glue
>>> over 52
>>> layers high.
>>> About Dec. / Jan. things were improving slowly but we were
>>> definitely behind on production when my Mom became very ill and was then
>>> diagnosed with cancer. She passed away on Feb. 17th, I spent all
>>> that time
>>> caring for her and would do it again even though it greatly burdened
>>> an already
>>> suffering business. We miss her greatly and I was very close to
>>> her. My
>>> father, Bernie Warnke, died from cancer four years earlier.
>>> After her
>>> death, we had alot of things to take care of and I was exhausted as well
>>> as depressed from everything. It took another month and a half to
>>> complete
>>> most of the loose ends and I felt I was now ready to get back to work.
>>>
>>> For a period of about 1 1/2 months we did not answer phones but had
>>> a message stating what was happening. I apologize for the pressure that
>>> exerted on my customers and I know it was hard on them. The
>>> wonderful thing
>>> was that most of them were truly compassionate and caring and to
>>> them "Thank
>>> You" , they are the reason we are still here today.
>>>
>>> The first part of May 2002, Mr. Newhall received his prop in the sealer
>>> coat ( pilots may choose to have props sent in this manner so that
>>> the prop
>>> /engine combo can be matched up more closely, as there is a wide
>>> variance
>>> ) and called immediately upon initial flight to tell me he was
>>> worried about
>>> his manifold pressure being higher than his rpm. I told him that
>>> was okay
>>> and to get some more numbers first. He then expressed in a very
>>> unpleasant
>>> manner that he was afraid he would burn up his engine if he
>>> continued flying
>>> the prop like that. I had never heard a customer be afraid of something
>>> like this flying with similar numbers. I hesitated to have him send
>>> in the
>>> prop for me to repitch it so quickly without sufficient data( he
>>> wanted 100-
>>> 150 rpm increase). I told him he would lose a little speed if I
>>> repitched
>>> so I would to take-off blade area as well. I have found out that
>>> being rash
>>> to change something without looking at all the facts could cause the
>>> prop
>>> to be irreversible changed. I also told Mr. Newhall that our policy
>>> is to
>>> make appointments for the final finish process so that our schedule
>>> would
>>> not be delayed further.
>>> For instance, when 4 or 5 props are sent in for final finishing and
>>> people
>>> don't make appointments, that can put me back 5-6 weeks instantly!
>>> He became very pushy and arrogant saying he was afraid to fly like that
>>> and would try to get more data. Which he did not do. It seemed strange
>>> behavior to me.
>>> Needless to say he shipped his prop back and told me
>>> he needed it quickly to go to a Fly-in which he ended up not going
>>> to because
>>> he had a sinus infection. I worked backflips to get that prop out
>>> and keep
>>> up with the previous demands before his "problems".
>>>
>>> I now want to apologize to all the customers who got a further delay
>>> as a
>>> result of this. It will not happen like that any more and I will
>>> not stray
>>> from our policy, period.
>>>
>>> I have two data sheets from Mr. Newhall that I would be happy to send to
>>> anyone interested. Just go to our Web Park Page and click on the E-mail
>>> with your name address and telephone number and I will mail you copies.
>>> The first one was from when he sent his order in for October,
>>> showing three
>>> different Sterba props and the latest data sheet was sent with his
>>> most recent
>>> letter. It must be stated that the latest numbers do not coincide
>>> with the
>>> earlier numbers, and suddenly the previous Sterba props are 5
>>> m.p.h. faster.
>>> Here is an example: On the data for the initial trial of the Warnke
>>> "Air
>>> Claw" Propeller:
>>>
>>> static full power rpm: 2320
>>>
>>> top end full power rpm: 2520 rpm at speed of 196 mph TAS @ 3000'
>>> and pulling 27" manifold pressure
>>> climb out @ 2270 rpm : 1300 fpm @ 68 F @ 1000' with IAS of 120
>>> mph ( density altitude of 1400')
>>>
>>> The Sterba prop on this sheet has the following numbers:
>>>
>>> * Note: Sterba makes a great prop for the price. I am merely
>>> copying numbers from Bud's sheet.
>>> static full power rpm: 2460
>>>
>>> top end full power rpm: 2820 rpm at speed of 190 mph TAS @ 3000'
>>> and pulling 25" manifold pressure
>>> climb out @ 2390 rpm: 1400 fpm @ 64 F @ 1000' with IAS of 120 mph
>>> ( density altitude of 1200')
>>>
>>>
>>> Note the amount of speed increase at 300 rpm lower! That is very
>>> significant!
>>> The climbout can be a very tricky to determine based on how careful
>>> one holds
>>> the angle of attack, air temp ( which plays a big role ), up and
>>> down drafts,
>>> not to mention weight at time of flight.
>>>
>>>
>>> Here are the second data sheet numbers from the most recent letter:
>>>
>>> Warnke final with repitching:
>>> static full power rpm: 2420
>>>
>>> top end full power rpm: 2690 rpm at speed of 194 mph TAS @ 3000'
>>> and pulling 27" manifold pressure
>>> climb out @ 2430 rpm: 1000 fpm @ 65 F @ 1000' with IAS of 130mph (
>>> density altitude of 1400')
>>>
>>>
>>> As you can see the final prop is still quite a bit faster than
>>> previous prop
>>> and as far as climb it will be hard to tell when he climbs out at
>>> 130 mph
>>> instead of 120 like used in the previous two and the density altitude is
>>> supposedly higher when compared with the Sterba. He is still going
>>> faster
>>> then before with significantly lower rpm. Maybe he should try his climb
>>> out in winter. The part of California he lives in is typically at
>>> 100+ F
>>> in summer.
>>>
>>>
>>> Going back to the e-mail about vibration. Our props produce more
>>> thrust. That is evident in the above numbers.
>>> This can be compared to driving your car under a heavier load
>>> (the engine's
>>> potential power is being utilized vs. a coasting situation. Under a
>>> higher
>>> load deficiencies will become more apparent.
>>> Vibration can be caused by many things: Spinner wooble, crush plate on
>>> slightly different, dried up engine mounts, improper torquing of prop on
>>> flange (it takes very little to make a great change in the tips).
>>> Mr. Newhall's
>>> prop was tracked to .08" when it left my shop and balanced
>>> perfectly. Most
>>> customers enjoy how smooth these props really are.
>>>
>>> In regards to moving "my business" to Alaska, it is exactly that "my
>>> business" and not any of Mr. Newhall's. We have a cell phone that works
>>> in Alaska so we could get calls through our move and until we get
>>> totally
>>> set up - - - which will be the end of September.
>>>
>>> Where we have our business is not of any consequence except to us,
>>> this is all mail order and the last time I checked Alaska was part
>>> of the
>>> United States!
>>>
>>> We still have one final load to finish up the end of this month! We
>>> are looking forward to getting out of this heat.
>>>
>>> One last item I believe, Mr. Newhall FWD'ed a letter from a Marcus
>>> Borom, who unfortuneatly was a customer of ours. We are the ones that
>>> told him we did not want to do business with him and would sell his prop
>>> for him and refund his money. Meanwhile he has been paid. That
>>> happened
>>> over two years ago. The good that came of of this situation was we
>>> now have
>>> a waiver sheet to protect us from certain and few people who are
>>> never satisfied.
>>> Which Mr. Newhall has signed. In the past 5 years I have refunded
>>> back 2
>>> people.
>>>
>>> This is life and this is business. I can't please everyone all the
>>> time and this is an incredibly complex field of work. I also cannot
>>> afford
>>> to take unfair treatment and continue to create great propellers
>>> with all
>>> my passion and love.
>>>
>>> Our old number 520-884-8132 will give the new number 520-275-5992
>>> which is an Arizona area code with nationwide long distance. Once
>>> we get
>>> our new land line phone number in Alaska we will change that message for
>>> up to a year. Also our ad will change in sport aviation and our WEB
>>> site
>>> :
>>>
>>> www.warnkeairproducts.com has e-mail there to click on and will have
>>> the new address and phone number as well.
>>>
>>> I look forward to completing our move and getting a little r &
>>> r on the way, if that is possible during a move of this nature! We will
>>> have the phone on and with us during the move. If we don't answer,
>>> leave
>>> a message and we will call you back.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Gratefully yours,
>>>
>>>
>>> Margie Warnke
>>>
>>>
>>> Maybe the motto of this story is: GET THE FACTS before judging others!
>>>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Oil cooler for sale |
So on your next RV, are you going to go with the baffle mounted cooler,
or are you still fond of the firewall mount? Why?
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Michael D Hilger
> Sent: Sunday, August 11, 2002 8:56 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Oil cooler for sale
>
>
>
>
> writes:
> >
> > How is the Aero classic doing? I need to decide which to get
> > soon.....
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > -
> > Larry Bowen
> > RV-8 O-360, Finish
> > Larry(at)BowenAero.com
> > http://BowenAero.com
>
> Just fine. It gave me about 15-20 degrees extra
> cooling which is enough to give me some margin on the hottest
> days. The Niagara 7-row cooler probably would have been okay
> had it been mounted on the baffling.
>
> Mike Hilger
> RV-6, N207AM
> >
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Oil cooler for sale |
| From: | Michael D Hilger <rvsixer(at)juno.com> |
If I had to do it again I would put it on the firewall because of the
potential for cracked baffling and the tight fit behind #4 cyl. I would,
however, install a 9-row cooler the first time. The kind of arrangement I
favor also leaves more room on the firewall and less behind the #4
cylinder.
Mike Hilger
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Blue Mountain EFIS |
| From: | James Freeman <flyeyes(at)bellsouth.net> |
I have been following the Blue Mountain debate with some interest, since I
am an "early adopter," but have been quiet because I felt I really didn't
have anything to add.
I had disappointing results with my first flight tests (temporarily
installed in a C-150) with the artificial horizon performance, although my
problem seemed somewhat different than Sam's. The HSI and airdata sensors
performed flawlessly, and I didn't (yet) hook up the engine instruments. I
did find that placement of the magnetometer was critical to performance of
the HSI
Greg at Blue Mountain said the problem was due to the software version,
and cheerfully offered to demonstrate that the system worked in flight.
He mailed me the updated software, but when I had trouble getting it
installed I just packed everything up and flew to Copperhill.
Greg spent a couple of hours with me straightening out my system, and
flying with me with both an EFIS/One and an EFIS lite. Conditions were
less than ideal (marginal VFR, terrain, etc, so I devoted more time to
keeping out of the rocks than to studying the EFIS) but I could not
produce any anomalous indications with either unit in flight. The flying
included 720 degree turns, steep turns, chandelles, wingovers,
straight/level, and landing patterns,
Interestingly, I could produce a fault condition in taxi turns (i.e.
standing on one brake to turn the airplane around). Greg explained that
the software interprets the sustained high yaw rate without roll as
erroneous data. Units destined for helicopters need different software
because of this.
On the trip home, I kept the EFIS Lite powered up on the glareshield, and
it worked perfectly for nearly two hours of mostly straight and level
flight.
I'll try and get some inflight video this week I can post somewhere.
Bottom line is I think the stuff is still a little rough in spots, but it'
s for real. My ony real question was the horizon, and that seems to be
working well. The airdata and engine instruments, by comparison, are
relatively simple.
I do think Greg needs to be more realistic about delivery times, and what'
s actually ready, but basically I feel much better after today.
If anyone has suggestions for video, I'll be happy to try anything the I
deem rational in the C-150
James Freeman
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bud <RV-6(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Warnke Props. (Margie's responce) |
Well folks here we have it from Margie herself.
If you buy a prop from her you better hope you get a good one because if
your not satisfied she's not going to try to make it right.
She'll not return your calls. Maybe she thinks you'll give up and go away.
She'll keep your money and refuse to do business with you anymore.
And here's a news flash. She kept telling me she was behind schedule
because she had too much work, now I find out it was because she didn't
have enough orders.
Because of 9/11, how convenient. Now she doesn't have enough money to
buy wood and glue. Now wait a minute didn't I just send her $1250.
Shouldn't I expect that money to go toward material for my prop? And
with this sudden lack of work I ought to get my prop in half the time
promised.
At least she should have had time to clear up her backlog. Remember I
was promised a prop in 12 week and it took 7 months.
When I originally got the prop I thought it worked ok but had too much
pitch for my engine but that was OK, that's why it comes with only a
seal coat so it can be adjusted to fit your needs. When I told her it
was running over square in cruise she didn't know what I was talking
about she had never heard that term. I admit I was probably overly
concerned about this but as she says I simply wanted 100 to 150 more
RPM's out of it. Now she's saying she shouldn't have done it because it
"could cause the prop to be irreversible changed".
When I got the prop back the RPM's increased but climb decreased and
initial acceleration was noticeably sluggish. And it vibrated even at idle.
Well maybe my performance expectations were to high but this prop is
definitely not right. And if you believe her claim of 12 inches of pitch
change you should expect a lot.
All along I've simply wanted to reconcile this and she won't talk to me.
If she had maybe all this ugliness would have been avoided.
I apologies for bringing this bickering to this forum, that's not what
its for, but now you have two sides of the story. You be the judge.
Bud Newhall
>>>In a message dated 8/9/2002 8:13:43 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
>>>Warnkeairproduct writes:
>>>
>>>
>>>>To All Concerned,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I thought you might enjoy the other side of the coin.
>>>>
>>>>Mr. Bud Newhall has quite a few facts incorrectly stated.
>>>>I am now in
>>>>receipt of his letter. He appears to be comfortable writing on the
>>>>net about
>>>>his plans for a refund, so I did not think he would mind a reply in
>>>>the same
>>>>way. This way everyone can know the whole story. I don't normally
>>>>write
>>>>letters like this, but here goes.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Mr. Newhall you will not receive a refund on your prop when it is
>>>>out performing
>>>>your previous prop in top speed and cruise at lower rpm and
>>>>comparable with
>>>>climb when looking at air temps and density altitude. Climb is affected
>>>>by many factors, even our test pilot with almost 30,000 hours must
>>>>be diligent
>>>>when determining climb characteristics with different airplanes.
>>>>Mr. Newhall,
>>>>maybe you have not had enough happen in your life or maybe you have
>>>>had to
>>>>much, but this will be the last you will hear from me. I will not
>>>>do business
>>>>with you anymore.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>As all of you read on you will understand better:
>>>>
>>>>Sept. 11th hit all aviation businesses hard - including ours. Mr.
>>>>Bud Newhall's order was received on 10/10/2001, we had no idea at
>>>>that time
>>>>the amount or effect of business that would be lost. For four
>>>>months orders
>>>>were way down and as a result of lower capitol we were not able to
>>>>purchase
>>>>materials to continue the manufacturing at the rate necessary for timely
>>>>shipping. The Warnke name has not necessarily been known for it's
>>>>timely
>>>>delivery, but instead for the high quality and performance, so when
>>>>people
>>>>got the product they mostly felt it was worth the wait.
>>>>The materials
>>>>we needed to purchase are very expensive and require advance
>>>>ordering. This
>>>>is why we must have full payment up front. Being a small and rare
>>>>business
>>>>requires a lot of dedication, especially when making aircraft propellers
>>>>for people who build their own very different planes!
>>>>When were finally
>>>>able to purchase our raw goods, we were behind on manufacturing
>>>>certain items
>>>>like blanks - which we make all our own from 1/12" pieces of the highest
>>>>quality hard rock maple veneer - to be glued with resorcinol glue
>>>>over 52
>>>>layers high.
>>>>About Dec. / Jan. things were improving slowly but we were
>>>>definitely behind on production when my Mom became very ill and was then
>>>>diagnosed with cancer. She passed away on Feb. 17th, I spent all
>>>>that time
>>>>caring for her and would do it again even though it greatly burdened
>>>>an already
>>>>suffering business. We miss her greatly and I was very close to
>>>>her. My
>>>>father, Bernie Warnke, died from cancer four years earlier.
>>>>After her
>>>>death, we had alot of things to take care of and I was exhausted as well
>>>>as depressed from everything. It took another month and a half to
>>>>complete
>>>>most of the loose ends and I felt I was now ready to get back to work.
>>>>
>>>>For a period of about 1 1/2 months we did not answer phones but had
>>>>a message stating what was happening. I apologize for the pressure that
>>>>exerted on my customers and I know it was hard on them. The
>>>>wonderful thing
>>>>was that most of them were truly compassionate and caring and to
>>>>them "Thank
>>>>You" , they are the reason we are still here today.
>>>>
>>>>The first part of May 2002, Mr. Newhall received his prop in the sealer
>>>>coat ( pilots may choose to have props sent in this manner so that
>>>>the prop
>>>>/engine combo can be matched up more closely, as there is a wide
>>>>variance
>>>>) and called immediately upon initial flight to tell me he was
>>>>worried about
>>>>his manifold pressure being higher than his rpm. I told him that
>>>>was okay
>>>>and to get some more numbers first. He then expressed in a very
>>>>unpleasant
>>>>manner that he was afraid he would burn up his engine if he
>>>>continued flying
>>>>the prop like that. I had never heard a customer be afraid of something
>>>>like this flying with similar numbers. I hesitated to have him send
>>>>in the
>>>>prop for me to repitch it so quickly without sufficient data( he
>>>>wanted 100-
>>>>150 rpm increase). I told him he would lose a little speed if I
>>>>repitched
>>>>so I would to take-off blade area as well. I have found out that
>>>>being rash
>>>>to change something without looking at all the facts could cause the
>>>>prop
>>>>to be irreversible changed. I also told Mr. Newhall that our policy
>>>>is to
>>>>make appointments for the final finish process so that our schedule
>>>>would
>>>>not be delayed further.
>>>>For instance, when 4 or 5 props are sent in for final finishing and
>>>>people
>>>>don't make appointments, that can put me back 5-6 weeks instantly!
>>>>He became very pushy and arrogant saying he was afraid to fly like that
>>>>and would try to get more data. Which he did not do. It seemed strange
>>>>behavior to me.
>>>>Needless to say he shipped his prop back and told me
>>>>he needed it quickly to go to a Fly-in which he ended up not going
>>>>to because
>>>>he had a sinus infection. I worked backflips to get that prop out
>>>>and keep
>>>>up with the previous demands before his "problems".
>>>>
>>>>I now want to apologize to all the customers who got a further delay
>>>>as a
>>>>result of this. It will not happen like that any more and I will
>>>>not stray
>>>>from our policy, period.
>>>>
>>>>I have two data sheets from Mr. Newhall that I would be happy to send to
>>>>anyone interested. Just go to our Web Park Page and click on the E-mail
>>>>with your name address and telephone number and I will mail you copies.
>>>>The first one was from when he sent his order in for October,
>>>>showing three
>>>>different Sterba props and the latest data sheet was sent with his
>>>>most recent
>>>>letter. It must be stated that the latest numbers do not coincide
>>>>with the
>>>>earlier numbers, and suddenly the previous Sterba props are 5
>>>>m.p.h. faster.
>>>>Here is an example: On the data for the initial trial of the Warnke
>>>>"Air
>>>>Claw" Propeller:
>>>>
>>>>static full power rpm: 2320
>>>>
>>>>top end full power rpm: 2520 rpm at speed of 196 mph TAS @ 3000'
>>>>and pulling 27" manifold pressure
>>>>climb out @ 2270 rpm : 1300 fpm @ 68 F @ 1000' with IAS of 120
>>>>mph ( density altitude of 1400')
>>>>
>>>>The Sterba prop on this sheet has the following numbers:
>>>>
>>>>* Note: Sterba makes a great prop for the price. I am merely
>>>>copying numbers from Bud's sheet.
>>>>static full power rpm: 2460
>>>>
>>>>top end full power rpm: 2820 rpm at speed of 190 mph TAS @ 3000'
>>>>and pulling 25" manifold pressure
>>>>climb out @ 2390 rpm: 1400 fpm @ 64 F @ 1000' with IAS of 120 mph
>>>>( density altitude of 1200')
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Note the amount of speed increase at 300 rpm lower! That is very
>>>>significant!
>>>>The climbout can be a very tricky to determine based on how careful
>>>>one holds
>>>>the angle of attack, air temp ( which plays a big role ), up and
>>>>down drafts,
>>>>not to mention weight at time of flight.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Here are the second data sheet numbers from the most recent letter:
>>>>
>>>>Warnke final with repitching:
>>>>static full power rpm: 2420
>>>>
>>>>top end full power rpm: 2690 rpm at speed of 194 mph TAS @ 3000'
>>>>and pulling 27" manifold pressure
>>>>climb out @ 2430 rpm: 1000 fpm @ 65 F @ 1000' with IAS of 130mph (
>>>>density altitude of 1400')
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>As you can see the final prop is still quite a bit faster than
>>>>previous prop
>>>>and as far as climb it will be hard to tell when he climbs out at
>>>>130 mph
>>>>instead of 120 like used in the previous two and the density altitude is
>>>>supposedly higher when compared with the Sterba. He is still going
>>>>faster
>>>>then before with significantly lower rpm. Maybe he should try his climb
>>>>out in winter. The part of California he lives in is typically at
>>>>100+ F
>>>>in summer.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Going back to the e-mail about vibration. Our props produce more
>>>>thrust. That is evident in the above numbers.
>>>> This can be compared to driving your car under a heavier load
>>>>(the engine's
>>>>potential power is being utilized vs. a coasting situation. Under a
>>>>higher
>>>>load deficiencies will become more apparent.
>>>>Vibration can be caused by many things: Spinner wooble, crush plate on
>>>>slightly different, dried up engine mounts, improper torquing of prop on
>>>>flange (it takes very little to make a great change in the tips).
>>>>Mr. Newhall's
>>>>prop was tracked to .08" when it left my shop and balanced
>>>>perfectly. Most
>>>>customers enjoy how smooth these props really are.
>>>>
>>>>In regards to moving "my business" to Alaska, it is exactly that "my
>>>>business" and not any of Mr. Newhall's. We have a cell phone that works
August 04, 2002 - August 12, 2002
RV-Archive.digest.vol-nf