RV-Archive.digest.vol-nr
October 23, 2002 - October 28, 2002
Dick Tasker, 90573
Albert Gardner wrote:
>--> RV9-List message posted by: "Albert Gardner"
>
>Hey Steve, welcome to the list. You may or may not know but many builders of
>the pre-punched kits are skipping the step of putting the parts together and
>then opening up the 3/32" holes with a #40 drill. They first dimple the
>individual parts (which opens up the holes slightly) and then clecoe it up
>and set the rivets. I know of several guys who built wings without even
>thinking about twist while building. After the skins were riveted on they
>checked and found out there was zero twist. In any case you are going to
>have fun.
>Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
>RV-9A: N872RV
>(After 2 years I can see the end from here.)
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "RV9" <rv9(at)charter.net>
>To:
>Subject: RV9-List: New Builder introduction
>
>
>
>
>>--> RV9-List message posted by: RV9
>>
>>
>>Hello,
>>
>>My name is Steve Mottin and I'm the proud owner of RV-9 empennage kit
>>number 609 which I received on the 10th of October. I've finished all
>>of the prep work on the HS and I'm awaiting better weather here in
>>North Texas (Granbury) before priming my HS parts. I've also begun work
>>on the VS.
>>
>>I have a very crude (in comparison to some of you guys) website that's
>>intended to allow my non-builder friends and relatives to track my
>>progress. You are, of course, welcome to visit. Comments, suggestions,
>>motiviations, etc. are all welcome.
>>
>>http://webpages.charter.net/smottin
>>
>>Steve Mottin
>>RV-9A Empennage
>>Granbury, Texas mailto:rv9(at)charter.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rob ray <smokyray(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV4-List: ivo propeller |
Linc;
How are they holding up? Of course MT and Hoffman
were trying to sell me a prop, but spoke of
cracking/delaminating blades near the hub on the WD as
well.
The only Carbon Graphite C/S prop/hub arrangement I
have seen (So Far) that I really like is the Whirlwind
Prop and it uses a Hartzell hub...
RR
--- flyseaplane wrote:
> --> RV4-List message posted by: "flyseaplane"
>
>
> Rob Ray,
>
> "MT and Hoffman both had enough doubts about the
> hubs on Warp Drive props
> holding up on Lycomings early on."
> All the guys I know with Warp Drive Props on
> Lycomings have the "High Horse
> Power" blade hub.
>
> Maybe "early on" there was an issue, I think Warp
> fixed it with the HHP hub.
>
> Later,
> Linc
>
> -------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> Contributions of
> any other form
>
> latest messages.
> other List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/search
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
> Sky Dynamics http://www.skydynamics.com/ has had a cool air system for
some
> time.
On this note...is anybody out there using the Maxi-Sump from Sky Dynamics?
Sure seems to make sense given that it'll shave about 8 pounds off the 200hp
IO-360 plus theoretically provide better oil circulation.
I'm curious if this is a popular option and if anybody out there thinks it's
worth the extra bucks...or whether people have steered clear of it for some
reason.
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D (fuselage)
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder introduction) |
Hi John,
It has to be forced through.
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
>
> Wondering about this...are the pre-punched holes large enough to admit the
> pilot shaft of the dimple die, or does the pilot have to be "forced"
through
> the hole?
>
> John Huft, RV8 (drilled em all)
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Drill and dimple vs just dimple |
| From: | "Adam Boggs" <boggs(at)cs.colorado.edu> |
Interesting, I talked to Ken at Van's once about using a #41 bit instead
of #40 (at the EAA tech councellor's advice). His response, as others
have stated, was "we've been building with #40 for many many years, it's
proven technology." As for WHY #40 is standard, I've heard that much of
the rivet strength comes from the fact that as it is crushed it expands
inside the hole to fill the empty space. A certain amount of expansion
is actually good to ensure a nice tight grip (and proper mechanical
hardening of the rivet?). The rivet should not be snug in the hole when
you squeeze it. With a smaller hole, the rivet isn't allowed to expand
into it as much, and is maybe not as strong. I'm a novice builder and
not an aircraft designer, so take my understanding with a grain of salt.
(We'll all justify our own practices in our own ways!)
The other point related to drilling smaller holes, or not drilling at
all, was that the dimple dies are designed for #40 holes, and smaller
holes may cause microfractures around the hole due to the dimple die
spreading it out more than it was designed to. Maybe #41 is ok, and #42
is too small, or maybe it's fine with no drilling at all. My plane will
be built on the designer's recommendation and a long history of
functionally successful aircraft built that way.
Then again, the joy of an experimental aircraft is that you can do it
however you want! And, you get to be the test pilot too! :)
-Adam Boggs
Boulder, CO
Elevators almost done
ps. nice job on starting the war, Sam. :)
"Bill" wrote:
>
> I talked to someone at Van's about this once, and they said it would be "no
> problem" to skip the match drilling, as the dimpling process would open the
> holes up enough to accept the rivets...
>
> I also recall reading in one of the RVators that VANS built the first
> matched hole "kit" wings for the 9 "without picking up a drill"...
>
> FWIW
>
> -Bill VonDane
> RV-8A ~ 71 hours
> www.vondane.com
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder
> introduction)
>
>
>
> Hi Sam,
>
> WasamaterSamduh%$#kofyemakerbroke?!! :-)!
>
> Jim in Kelowna
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Sam Buchanan" <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder
> introduction)
>
>
> >
> >
> > Jim Jewell wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > Hello Richard,
> > >
> > > The pre-punched holes will fit the clekoes and should assure exact parts
> > > alignments during the drilling stage.
> > > The pre-drilling of assembled parts that will receive flush rivets is
> (in my
> > > opinion) a must!.
> > > The suggested pre-drilling removes enough material from the hole center
> to
> > > allow the dimpling process to take place without excess stretching
> around
> > > the hole. Excess stretch in this area 'could' translate out as minute
> stress
> > > relief cracks. This might not happen, but the extra drilling effort
> helps to
> > > preclude such eventualities
> >
> > I'm feeling grumpy this afternoon.......since my 6-month plans for LRU
> > may get flushed away by rogue low pressure systems.....
> >
> > > Keep in mind that the procedure described has been more than Seventy
> years
> > > in development. You can bet that a lot of attention has been paid in the
> > > past to the area we are discussing here. I seriously doubt that this is
> an
> > > area that needs any fine tuning by aircraft kit builders such as us.
> > >
> >
> > Maybe folks have been drilling holes in metal skins for seventy years,
> > but they have been riveting together CAD designed and punched RV kits
> > for only a couple of years!
> >
> > I have to wonder how far back in the past it would have been deemed
> > "acceptable" to skip the drilling stage if drills were not necessary to
> > make the holes in the first place. Would we have seen "undrilled" B-17's
> > or P-51's??? I bet the folks trying to force every plane possible into
> > the sky during WWII would have gladly skipped the drilling process if
> > CAD punched skins were available.
> >
> > And..........if that had happened, would it now be "acceptable" to skip
> > the drilling step without fear of "stretching" the holes???
> >
> > Just tryin' to stir up a rip-roarin', flat-out flame-throwin' war on
> > this here list......
> >
> > Sam Buchanan
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill" <n8wv(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
I want to run something by the list...
I have been reading the messages in the archives about exhaust pipe wraps and coatings...
I was just thinking that the exhaust pipes run very close to the intake
runners and it seems to me that it would heat up the air/fuel mixture on
it's way up to the cylinders... Now I have read that wrapping the exhaust pipes
has all kinds of different benefits, and also has cause some people all kinds
of problems... But what about simply wrapping the intake runners to minimize
the heat transfer from the exhaust pipes? Seems to me it would work... You
have cool air coming in from the snorkel/airbox... Of course, once the air
goes through the carb and sump, it's probably heated up already anyway...
What do you all think?
-Bill VonDane
RV-8A ~ 71 hours
www.vondane.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Huft" <rv8tor(at)lazy8.net> |
| Subject: | Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder introduction) |
Well, then, I would sure drill them out. Aluminum is not the most malleable
of metals, especially all the different tempers Van's uses, and just
dimpling is some stress.
Really, this drilling and deburring and dimpling is a small percentage of
the work to build one of these things. Wait 'till you get to fiberglass!!
The last thing you would want is to see cracking and smoking rivets after a
year or two of flying.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim Jewell
Subject: Re: RV-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder
introduction)
Hi John,
It has to be forced through.
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
>
> Wondering about this...are the pre-punched holes large enough to admit the
> pilot shaft of the dimple die, or does the pilot have to be "forced"
through
> the hole?
>
> John Huft, RV8 (drilled em all)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV4" <VansRV4GRVMJ(at)btinternet.com> |
Hi,
are there any suggestions for a fixed pitch propeller for a 200HP (IO-360
A1AD) RV7?
does anyone know where I can get a three blade wood prop for this engine?
thanks
marcel
vansrv4grvmj(at)btinternet.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie and Tupper England <cengland(at)netdoor.com> |
| Subject: | warp drive (was: ivo propeller) |
flyseaplane wrote:
>
>
> Jim Ayers - - -
>
> Sorry to all that this is the RV list - I have never heard of anyone having
> problems with their Warp Drive on a Lycoming. That is, the ground adjustable
> ones. What have you heard?? I know a guy who has one on a 160 HP and has had
> no problems for the six years that it has been flying (about 800 hours now)
>
> Thanks,
> Linc
>
> > RV-3 N47RV
> > LOM M332A engine
> > Ivoprop Magnum electric prop flown since Dec. 1995 very nervously.
> > I believe Ivo hasn't sold his prop for Lycoming engines for a couple
> years.
> > Warp drive wasn't successful on a Lycoming, either. Makes me wonder about
> > the new CS props using Warp drive blades. Anyone have any history on the
> new
> > CS props with the Warp drive blades on a Lycoming?
>
About 10 years ago an aquaintance in OK City tried a ground-adjust WarpDrive on
a 160 Lyc in a small 2 seat all metal plane called a Skeeter. After around 25
hrs of operation he noticed 'feathers' of broken carbon fiber showing on the
edges of the blades. He returned the prop to WarpDrive.
About 8 years ago I called them & asked about a prop for a 160 Lyc. At that time
they would not sell me a prop for a Lyc.
I haven't talked with them since, so they could have made major changes since
that time.
Charlie
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Todd Rudberg <todd_rudberg(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Manual Trim Cable for sale. |
RVList
I will sell my manual trim cable for $15 ($90 from
Van's) plus shipping to whomever wants it. I will
throw in that piece of crap bolt welded to a plate as
well (it fits in the elevator). I installed mine and
decided I did not like it. I am doing electric trim
now.
Todd.
www.rvwoody.com
www.acubedllc.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Williams" <frate.dawg(at)attglobal.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: RV9-List: Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...) |
Don't Forward! Thanx, Freightdog
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
rv6-list(at)matronics.com; rv7-list(at)matronics.com; rv8-list(at)matronics.com;
rv9-list(at)matronics.com; rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV9-List: Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...)
--> RV9-List message posted by: Matt Dralle
Thanks Scott! The votes are still trickling in and its a REALLY, REALLY
close race. If you have a preference and haven't yet voted, it so close
that one or two votes could actually make the difference. PLEASE only
vote
once, though! To be fair, multiple votes from the same email address
will
not be counted.
Matt
At 07:07 AM 10/19/2002 Saturday, you wrote:
>
>Matt,
>
>You're doing a great job managing this.
>
>Chris
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com>
>Subject: RV-List: Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...)
>
>
> > --> RV10-List message posted by: dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle)
> >
> >
> > Kevin's right, except for the RV7, RV9, and RV10 Lists. The way its
> > been set up is when someone posts to the RV3, RV4, RV6, and RV8
Lists
> > a copy is automatically sent to the RV-List too. For some reason,
the
> > 7/9/10 lists weren't configured that way; probably because I added
> > them later and forgot that about the forwarding.
> >
> > In anycase, for now I've added the forward feature the 7/9/10 Lists
to
>keep
> > everything consistant.
> >
> > However, I don't have a stong preference either way, actually. I
can
> > see pros and cons to each. Would people prefer the not-forwarding
> > operation? Sounds like it they might...
> >
> > So let's vote! Drop me an email at:
> >
> > dralle(at)matronics.com
> >
> > with a simple:
> >
> > "Forward"
> > or
> > "Don't Forward"
> >
> > in the Subject Line. I'll added up the votes in a couple of days
and
> > announce the new method.
> >
> >
> > Matt Dralle
> > List Admin.
> >
> >
> > >--------------
> > >
> > >Gary,
> > >
> > >Sorry, I have to respectfully disagree here. I am a member of
Matt's
> > >RV8-list and the RV-list. If I post a message to the RV8-list, I
get
> > >two copies - one that comes from the RV8-list, and a copy that
comes
> > >across on the main RV-list.
> > >
> > >I just checked my Out Box - my message to Steve was sent to the
> > >RV4-List only. The copy you replied too seems to have come from
the
> > >main RV-List.
> > >
> > >Search the RV-List archives for the text " New Specific RV Lists
Auto
> > >Forwarded to RV-List" (don't include the quote marks. You'll find
> > >Matt's description of how the system works. I believe it causes
> > >confusion, because a lot of people on the main RV-List don't
> > >understand that they need study the original message to see where
it
> > >originated, and send their response to the message to the correct
> > >list. Otherwise, the original poster may not see the response.
But,
> > >Matt likes it the way it is, and these are his lists.
> > >
> > >Kevin
> > >
> > >>
> > >>Kevin.....actually, messages posted to model-specific Matronics
> > >>lists do not automatically post to the RV list. You can post to
any
> > >>list or combination of lists you like, but you have to send it to
> > >>the ones you want it to show up on.
> > >>
> > >>Gary
> > >>
> > >>From: Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com>
> > >>Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: RV4-List: Bleeding Brakes
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>Steve,
> > >>
> > >>.................. Any message posted to one of the RV model
specific
> > >>list also gets posted to the main RV List. Any responses to the
copy
> > >>of the message that goes to the main RV List only go to the main
RV
> > >>List - they don't go back to the RV model specific list,
...............
> > >
> > >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
I have seen wooden 3 bladed props but I always wondered how they are kept in
balance.
2 bladed props are always stored horizontal so the moisture remains the same
in each blade.
If they are stored vertically, the moisture migrates and make one blade
heavier. This upsets the balance and the prop vibrates and shakes from the
imbalance.
So how do you store a 3 bladed wood prop so they stay in balance?
Cy Galley
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "RV4" <VansRV4GRVMJ(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: RV-List: RV7 prop
>
> Hi,
>
> are there any suggestions for a fixed pitch propeller for a 200HP (IO-360
> A1AD) RV7?
>
> does anyone know where I can get a three blade wood prop for this engine?
>
> thanks
>
> marcel
> vansrv4grvmj(at)btinternet.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
Bill,
I'm with you. There is not a race car in the world (or other high
performance vehicle with an internal combustion engine) that has exhaust
headers so close to intakes.
I've ceramic coated my exhaust, and you can grab and hold onto them about 20
seconds after the engine is turned off. If you study the theory behind
this, you will see that the heat is taken out of the end of the exhaust...
that heat which is otherwise radiated from the pipes. CHT and EGT does NOT
go up. ALL race cars do this these days (as you know!).
As far as wrapping the intakes... I've seen this done on several "fast" RVs,
and other high performance airplanes. I haven't done this yet, but plan to
do so in the near future. As you know, there is material made specifically
for this. As you mentioned... Lycoming has seen to it that the intake air is
already heated by running through the sump... but it can only get hotter
once it leaves the sump and goes through those hot intake pipes.
Do this for us... Take some good numbers (which I know you can do) and then
wrap 'em and take more numbers. The theoretical gain in HP could be as much
as 10 or more... so you may be able to see a difference. I know Sam James
has his intakes wrapped and he swares by it.
jim
tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bill
Subject: RV-List: Exhaust Pipe Wrap...
I want to run something by the list...
I have been reading the messages in the archives about exhaust pipe wraps
and coatings... I was just thinking that the exhaust pipes run very close
to the intake runners and it seems to me that it would heat up the air/fuel
mixture on it's way up to the cylinders... Now I have read that wrapping
the exhaust pipes has all kinds of different benefits, and also has cause
some people all kinds of problems... But what about simply wrapping the
intake runners to minimize the heat transfer from the exhaust pipes? Seems
to me it would work... You have cool air coming in from the
snorkel/airbox... Of course, once the air goes through the carb and sump,
it's probably heated up already anyway...
What do you all think?
-Bill VonDane
RV-8A ~ 71 hours
www.vondane.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom Gummo" <t.gummo(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
Jim,
Do the coatings help with HOT STARTS?
Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Exhaust Pipe Wrap...
>
> Bill,
> I'm with you. There is not a race car in the world (or other high
> performance vehicle with an internal combustion engine) that has exhaust
> headers so close to intakes.
>
> I've ceramic coated my exhaust, and you can grab and hold onto them about
20
> seconds after the engine is turned off. If you study the theory behind
> this, you will see that the heat is taken out of the end of the exhaust...
> that heat which is otherwise radiated from the pipes. CHT and EGT does NOT
> go up. ALL race cars do this these days (as you know!).
>
> As far as wrapping the intakes... I've seen this done on several "fast"
RVs,
> and other high performance airplanes. I haven't done this yet, but plan
to
> do so in the near future. As you know, there is material made
specifically
> for this. As you mentioned... Lycoming has seen to it that the intake air
is
> already heated by running through the sump... but it can only get hotter
> once it leaves the sump and goes through those hot intake pipes.
>
> Do this for us... Take some good numbers (which I know you can do) and
then
> wrap 'em and take more numbers. The theoretical gain in HP could be as
much
> as 10 or more... so you may be able to see a difference. I know Sam James
> has his intakes wrapped and he swares by it.
>
> jim
> tampa
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bill
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com; rv8list(at)yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RV-List: Exhaust Pipe Wrap...
>
>
> I want to run something by the list...
>
> I have been reading the messages in the archives about exhaust pipe wraps
> and coatings... I was just thinking that the exhaust pipes run very close
> to the intake runners and it seems to me that it would heat up the
air/fuel
> mixture on it's way up to the cylinders... Now I have read that wrapping
> the exhaust pipes has all kinds of different benefits, and also has cause
> some people all kinds of problems... But what about simply wrapping the
> intake runners to minimize the heat transfer from the exhaust pipes?
Seems
> to me it would work... You have cool air coming in from the
> snorkel/airbox... Of course, once the air goes through the carb and sump,
> it's probably heated up already anyway...
>
> What do you all think?
>
> -Bill VonDane
> RV-8A ~ 71 hours
> www.vondane.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV7-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple |
(was:New Builder introduction)
>
> If there are no drawbacks to this
>approach, then it would get us flying sooner!
Go for it! All too many builders give up due to time pressures, fatigue
etc. Don't use up all your juice agonizing over the precise and perfect
way to do it.
There is still a long way to go to the first flight!
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene" <gene(at)nvaircraft.com> |
| Subject: | Re: [RV-9A] cleco's |
I knew I was saving these little buggers for a reason ! Of my broken Clecos :
8 were Cleco brand
22 were Kwik Lok, and 104 were Wedge Lock. I know I got some from ATS while at
Oshkosh in '99 and some from Vans'. What brand does Brown Tool Co. sell Gary
? I will order the next ones from them.
Gene N557RV (res.)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Williams" <frate.dawg(at)attglobal.net> |
| Subject: | RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
Dick: A couple of years ago, it was fashionable among some of the
"trophy hunter" guys to underdrill the holes while match drilling, using
say, a #41 bit instead of a #40 bit for skins. This, they reasoned, made
for a "tighter fit" of the rivet in the hole, and a prettier finish.
Deburring, does, in fact enlarge the hole slightly, but that's what it
is actually supposed to do. When you drill, you leave very small ridges,
tears, and sharp pointed edges in the inside edges of the hole. A
deburring cutter actually shaves these away, for the most part, so that
there will not later be stress cracks spidering out from the hole. Even
though they are small, and you probably couldn't see them without a
magnifying glass, they are there, and you should do whatever you can to
alleviate them.
You shouldn't have to "push" or tap or otherwise force a rivet into the
hole. It should slide in easily or "drop right in" from above. The hole
you drill and dimple really is not "oversize", because the first
half-dozen blows of the rivet gun cause the shank to compress along its
length, and "fatten" outwards to grip the edge of the hole, immobilizing
the rivet, without making minute tears or fissures around the hole
because the rivet shaft was already too tight against the edge of the
hole. I absolutely cannot imagine setting rivets in holes that are
underdrilled, nor can I fathom why anyone would set a rivet in a
non-deburred hole, when so much collective wisdom over the years
dictates otherwise. The constant airloads, vibration, and stress forces
over time will result in a "do it over again" job, with loose rivets,
wrinkled skin, and additional rivets inserted where you have had to
"stop-drill" the aforementioned spider cracks, tears, etc.
The textbook process works great, provides strength and safety, and
lasts for years. Yeah, it takes a lot of time to do it this way, but
that is why you can have a 200 mph, economical, great-flying airplane
for a quarter of the cost of a new spam can, and half the cost of a used
one. You provide the time and the labor---and it is definitely
labor-intensive. The process works great. If it ain't broke, don't fix
it. Follow the instructions.
John Williams
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Tasker
Subject: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder
introduction)
--> RV9-List message posted by: Richard Tasker
I am currently finishing up my RV9 empennage kit and expect to get the
wing kit in a few weeks.
I have noticed while building the empennage that the pre-punched holes
always line up so all you are really seem to be doing is just enlarging
the holes with the "match" drilling. Furthermore, when you dimple the
drilled hole, the resulting hole is actually a little oversize for the
rivet (per standard rivet specifications). Dimpling the existing holes
would actually create a better fit to the rivet.
I would like to solicit opinions as to the procedure noted below. That
is, what are the advantages and drawbacks of following the instructions
to drill then dimple vs just dimple as is. Of course, it goes without
saying that your dimple tool should fit into the existing holes before
dimpling (which might require slight grinding of the dimple tool pilot
shaft).
Dick Tasker, 90573
Albert Gardner wrote:
>--> RV9-List message posted by: "Albert Gardner"
>
>Hey Steve, welcome to the list. You may or may not know but many
builders of
>the pre-punched kits are skipping the step of putting the parts
together and
>then opening up the 3/32" holes with a #40 drill. They first dimple the
>individual parts (which opens up the holes slightly) and then clecoe it
up
>and set the rivets. I know of several guys who built wings without
even
>thinking about twist while building. After the skins were riveted on
they
>checked and found out there was zero twist. In any case you are going
to
>have fun.
>Albert Gardner, Yuma, AZ
>RV-9A: N872RV
>(After 2 years I can see the end from here.)
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "RV9" <rv9(at)charter.net>
>To:
>Subject: RV9-List: New Builder introduction
>
>
>
>
>>--> RV9-List message posted by: RV9
>>
>>
>>Hello,
>>
>>My name is Steve Mottin and I'm the proud owner of RV-9 empennage kit
>>number 609 which I received on the 10th of October. I've finished all
>>of the prep work on the HS and I'm awaiting better weather here in
>>North Texas (Granbury) before priming my HS parts. I've also begun
work
>>on the VS.
>>
>>I have a very crude (in comparison to some of you guys) website that's
>>intended to allow my non-builder friends and relatives to track my
>>progress. You are, of course, welcome to visit. Comments, suggestions,
>>motiviations, etc. are all welcome.
>>
>>http://webpages.charter.net/smottin
>>
>>Steve Mottin
>>RV-9A Empennage
>>Granbury, Texas mailto:rv9(at)charter.net
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: New Builder introduction |
...and many builders are adhering to proper practices of aircraft construction
rather than cutting corners!
Welcome Steve! You'll find lots of opinions, free advice, good debate, and
comradery, 24x7, at no cost.
And when you've been around long enough to pass your wisdom along, you'll find
a
beautiful RV9 in your
hangar! Gotta love it...
Gary N
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill VonDane" <n8wv(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
Hey Jim... Do you have any information on the "material made specifically
for this"?
-Bill VonDane
RV-8A ~ 71 hrs
www.vondane.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Exhaust Pipe Wrap...
Bill,
I'm with you. There is not a race car in the world (or other high
performance vehicle with an internal combustion engine) that has exhaust
headers so close to intakes.
I've ceramic coated my exhaust, and you can grab and hold onto them about 20
seconds after the engine is turned off. If you study the theory behind
this, you will see that the heat is taken out of the end of the exhaust...
that heat which is otherwise radiated from the pipes. CHT and EGT does NOT
go up. ALL race cars do this these days (as you know!).
As far as wrapping the intakes... I've seen this done on several "fast" RVs,
and other high performance airplanes. I haven't done this yet, but plan to
do so in the near future. As you know, there is material made specifically
for this. As you mentioned... Lycoming has seen to it that the intake air is
already heated by running through the sump... but it can only get hotter
once it leaves the sump and goes through those hot intake pipes.
Do this for us... Take some good numbers (which I know you can do) and then
wrap 'em and take more numbers. The theoretical gain in HP could be as much
as 10 or more... so you may be able to see a difference. I know Sam James
has his intakes wrapped and he swares by it.
jim
tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bill
Subject: RV-List: Exhaust Pipe Wrap...
I want to run something by the list...
I have been reading the messages in the archives about exhaust pipe wraps
and coatings... I was just thinking that the exhaust pipes run very close
to the intake runners and it seems to me that it would heat up the air/fuel
mixture on it's way up to the cylinders... Now I have read that wrapping
the exhaust pipes has all kinds of different benefits, and also has cause
some people all kinds of problems... But what about simply wrapping the
intake runners to minimize the heat transfer from the exhaust pipes? Seems
to me it would work... You have cool air coming in from the
snorkel/airbox... Of course, once the air goes through the carb and sump,
it's probably heated up already anyway...
What do you all think?
-Bill VonDane
RV-8A ~ 71 hours
www.vondane.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Electric Flight Instruments |
| From: | Tom Brandon <rv7atb(at)mars.ark.com> |
I'm looking for a source for an electric attitude indicator &
directional gyro. Any suggestions?
Tom Brandon
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
Tom,
In theory, they will. In reality, I'm not sure. My experience is with
racing cars, not airplanes... until now.
-j
SNIP>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Jim,
Do the coatings help with HOT STARTS?
Tom
SNIP>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
"Standard Aircraft Handbook, Sixth Edition" (...should be on everyone's coffee
table)
Page 77, "Although drilling holes seems a simple task, it requires a great deal
of knowledge and skill to do it properly and in accordance with specifications.
It is one of the most important operations performed by riveters or
mechanics...."
"Preparing holes to specifications requires more than just running a drill
through a piece of metal..."
Page 92, "Coin dimpling [i.e. dimple-dies] does not bend or stretch the
material, as did the now-obsolete radius dimpling system, and the dimple
definition is almost as sharp as that of a machine countersink."
Page 94, "Preparation of holes for form countersinking ["form countersinking" is
another term for dimpling] is of great importance because improperly drilled
holes result in defective dimples. Holes for solid-shank rivets must be size
drilled, before dimpling, by using the size drills recommended for regular
holes. .... Do not burr holes to be form countersunk, except on titanium."
[general procedures list]
1. Fit skin in place on substructure.
2. Pilot drill to proper size for dimpling: final size for conventional rivets;
predrill size for all other rivets [size-drilled after dimpling].
...
[my comments]
There are several problems with just ramming the dimple die through the predrill
holes. First, there is no arguing that you are stretching the metal when you
force the die pilot through a hole which is smaller than the die pilot. See
comment above ref Page 92. On a scale smaller than you'll see with you naked
eye, you have stretched the metal around the perimeter of the rivet hole. This
can lead to stress cracking around the rivets over time. It also has the
effect of slightly thinning the metal in this critical area.
Next, the proper drill size for standard rivets is considered in the design of
the dimple die. Thus, you start with the specified "final" drill size, then the
dimple die opens it to the expected size. If you omit this step, you are
starting with the predrill size, stretching it to something less than specified.
See general procedures step 2 above. This is OK for "other" types of rivets
because you post-drill to final size for these softer types of rivets.
Next, and arguably the most important reason for match-drilling ALL the holes,
despite the wonderful advancement of punch machining, there are inevitable
variations in fit which are introduced by bending, forming, painting,
temperature effects, and simple positional errors which can accumulate as you
walk down a row of rivets during the dimpling and riveting process. If you were
to stack two or three layers of pre-punched holes on top of each other as you
would before riveting, then closely observe each hole with a magnifying glass,
you would see slight variations in alignment, especially evident when the sheets
are following a curved surface. While you may still be able to press a rivet
into these misaligned holes, as you drive the rivets, the individual misaligned
sheets can create scores in the shank of the rivets, leading to undue stresses
and potential rivet failure under loads. If you follow proper procedures and
match-drill these holes, you would see a much cleaner set of holes in perfect
alignment.
Keep in mind that all aircraft are flexible. Wings bow up and down several
inches across their span and fuselage panels visibly shake (especially you
Lycosaur fliers ;
). Look out across the top surface of a wing when flying and
you'll see visible wrinkles in the skins. What is taking up the stress when a
wing surface bows upward by lift and downward by weight? The rivets! And if
these rivets were installed in improperly stretched and thinned holes which were
misaligned then fastened with rivets which were scored during assembly. Do you
really think they will be as strong as "specification"? NOT...
That said.... Yep, these corners have been cut, and these not-built-to-spec
planes are not exactly falling out of the sky (or are they?). This is probably
just a matter of over-engineering covering up for poor construction practices.
Perhaps if you re-examine one of these birds after several years of turbulent
flying, you would see rivet heads popping through the paint job or stress
cracks. Either way, why would you knowingly bypass time-proven practices?
Simply put... ITS A FLYING MACHINE, BUILD IT WRIGHT!!!!!!!! Cut corners when
mowing your lawn, not building your plane.
Hey, you asked.......
Gary N.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Spinner cut out |
Hi Vincent:
My pattern is for the Hartzell Model HC-C2YK-1BF, will probably be the same
for the IO-360.
Will send you a pattern, need your mailing address.
Eustace
----- Original Message -----
From: "Vincent Welch" <welchvincent(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Spinner cut out
>
> Is this the same pattern for a Hartzell with an IO-360? If so, I would
love
> one.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Vince
>
>
> >From: "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net>
> >Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> >To: "rv list"
> >Subject: RV-List: Spinner cut out
> >Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 08:51:49 -0700
> >
> >
> >
> >I have patterns for the cut outs for Van's fiberglass spinner for the
> >Hartzell constant speed prop (0360) if anyone would like a copy.
> >
> >Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C.
> >
> >
>
>
> Internet access plans that fit your lifestyle -- join MSN.
> http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Re: [RV-9A] cleco's |
Browns sells Kwik-Loc brand. Vans sells Wedge-Loc which break too easy. Your
numbers confirm this quite well.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Point" <jpoint(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Tip up gas struts |
Here's a question often asked, but never answered, in the archives:
Does anyone know of a local source (Autozone etc) for the RV-6 tip up gas
struts? One of mine died (canopy not even finished yet!) and a trip to one
local autoparts store was no luck.
Jeff Point
RV-6 finish kit
Milwaukee WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John <jleclercq(at)charter.net> |
I have recently recieved both "kwik-loc" and "cleco-loc from Brown.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "3 rotor" <rv8r300(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
so, unless we are building with titanium, we SHOULDN'T be deburring? Guess
I never read the book, even though I have a copy somewhere, I'll check the
coffee table. So what are all these arguments about 70 years of building
practices and always deburring? Personally, I used structural adhesive
along with rivets. Why not spread the stress and vibration to 100% of the
rib, rather than a few specific points? I didn't bother match drilling
stiffeners, they fit perfectly, but did drill them before dimpling.
kevin -8
>by using the size drills recommended for regular
> holes. .... Do not burr holes to be form countersunk, >except on
titanium."
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson(at)mcleodusa.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tip up gas struts |
Jeff Point wrote:
>
> Here's a question often asked, but never answered, in the archives:
>
> Does anyone know of a local source (Autozone etc) for the RV-6 tip up gas
> struts? One of mine died (canopy not even finished yet!) and a trip to one
> local autoparts store was no luck.
>
> Jeff Point
> RV-6 finish kit
> Milwaukee WI
>
You might try a web search on YAHOO ... Gas struts
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson(at)mcleodusa.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tip up gas struts |
Jeff Point wrote:
>
> Here's a question often asked, but never answered, in the archives:
>
> Does anyone know of a local source (Autozone etc) for the RV-6 tip up gas
> struts? One of mine died (canopy not even finished yet!) and a trip to one
> local autoparts store was no luck.
>
> Jeff Point
> RV-6 finish kit
> Milwaukee WI
>
I got thousands of links just now for gas struts and more for gas springs
Phil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LessDragProd(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: RV4-List: ivo propeller |
If the Warp Drive Company is selling their prop for Lycoming's, then they
must have fixed their problem.
They weren't selling their prop to any four cylinder four cycle engine, at
one time.
Jim Ayers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
| Subject: | Re: warp drive (was: ivo propeller) |
> > Sorry to all that this is the RV list - I have never heard of anyone having
> > problems with their Warp Drive on a Lycoming. That is, the ground
> adjustable
> > ones. What have you heard?? I know a guy who has one on a 160 HP and
> has had
> > no problems for the six years that it has been flying (about 800 hours now)
> >
>About 8 years ago I called them & asked about a prop for a 160 Lyc. At
>that time
>they would not sell me a prop for a Lyc.
>
>I haven't talked with them since, so they could have made major changes since
>that time.
I talked to them last week, and they said they didn't sell Warp props for
Lycs. They said the Lycs "shake too much" Without getting into a Lyc vs
your favorite engine contest (I hope) any prop manufacturer who says that
worries me, regardless of the brand of internal *combustion* engine
used. Maybe they just want to stick to ultralights.
Gary Liming
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
Can someone get a piece of rib (like we all have these laying around) or
some scrap and do 5 the right way and 5 the 'wrong' way and then drill two
of each out and tell us what they find? Also put a couple drilled and
dimpled and a couple dimpled but not drilled with no rivet inside it to
check for problems before the rivet even goes in. Be careful when you drill
so you don't damage the hole and obscure the evidence. If nobody has the
equipment you can send it to me and I'll take it over to one of our science
depts and check it under a high power microscope and post the results.
Pictures too, probably.
I see a lot of speculating and reasoning but I like to see tests. Many
times the thing that we reason to be true turns out to not be the case.
Marcus Ward
New to list.
No airplane.
No kit.
Working on license.
Lots of dreams.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mike" <mike(at)bmnellis.com> |
| Subject: | Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
http://www.highlifter.com/store/Heat-Shield-Kit.html
Tom,
In theory, they will. In reality, I'm not sure. My experience is with
racing cars, not airplanes... until now.
-j
SNIP>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Jim,
Do the coatings help with HOT STARTS?
Tom
SNIP>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Russ Werner" <russ(at)maui.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tip up gas struts |
Don't know the specifics of the RV6 strut, the ones NAPA carries are listed
at:
http://spdhardware.com/gs2.htm
Russ Werner
HR II
----- Original Message ----- > Does anyone know of a local source (Autozone
etc) for the RV-6 tip up gas
> struts? One of mine died (canopy not even finished yet!) and a trip to
one
> local autoparts store was no luck.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Karie Daniel" <karied4(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Electric Flight Instruments |
Try http://www.chiefaircraft.com/ get them to send you a free catalog also. They seem to have a good selection of all instruments and RV panel packages. Just one site there are more, I'll send you the links if I can ever find them again.
Karie Daniel
Maple Valley, WA
RV-7A (empennage in progress)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Brandon" <>
Subject: RV-List: Electric Flight Instruments
>
> I'm looking for a source for an electric attitude indicator &
> directional gyro. Any suggestions?
> Tom Brandon
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Sears" <sears(at)searnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
I've been following this thread with interest because I'm planning on
building a RV-7A, or RV-10, in the near future. I've already built a RV-6A
and had to mark, drill, debur, and dimple all of the holes that required it.
Other than the firewall, that was all of the holes in the skins, etc.,
folks. Now, I'm helping another RVer build his RV-9A. Because of what
I've read from Van's about not having to use a drill, and have learned from
others, I've been dimpling without drilling. Because I wanted to do it
right, we deburred the holes before dimpling; but, we did not match drill.
I was afraid that any drilling would defeat the purpose of having the
prepunched holes, that is the lack of the need for jigs. To me, drilling
would lead to the need for jigs to make sure things still stayed aligned in
the drilling process. I'm sure none of us are perfect at drilling holes.
Call this a carry over from the RV-6A. :-) To be sure I wasn't doing
something totally wrong, I did look at and feel the dimples I made using the
shortcut vs the old method of doing all of the work required for a good
dimple. For the life of me, I could not feel the difference in the dimples.
I guess you researchers know a lot more than I do because you've studied the
texts and such; but, I'll be darned if I can tell the difference in real
life. Anyway, I armed my friend with the pros and cons I've learned about
the two methods and left the decision to him. His decision was to use the
shortcut method on his RV-9A.
You know, I may be totally wrong in all of this; but, I can think of only a
few cases where a RV came apart in the air. Most of those were RV-3s with
bad rear attach points in the wings. That problem has since been fixed.
The other was the RV-8 demonstrator that was overstressed. I'm sure there
were others; but, I can't think of any, at the moment. About all I've read
about were due to stupid things like running into mountains in IFR
conditions, mechanical failures, etc. The only smoking rivets I've seen, or
heard about, were those just behind the firewall on the bottom skins. I've
seen a lot of RVs at fly-ins and haven't seen signs of cracking skins,
smoking rivets, etc. Believe me, I've seen some really bad RVs mixed in
with some beautiful examples. I have seen bubbles from what could be
leaking rivets; but, it could also have been the proseal gassing just like
I've experienced with mine. Now, that's a story, in itself. What with over
3000 of our RVs flying, one would think that some of this skin cracking,
etc., would be showing up, by now. Goodness knows that most of us, if not
all of us, have not built perfect airplanes. I've never seen the first
crack in a skin, anywhere. Wait a minute, I've heard about skins cracking
in the trailing edges of control surfaces; but, that has nothing to do with
rivets. That was from bends.
At the moment, I'm planning on following the ritual I've been using on the
RV-9A. I plan to debur and dimple each hole without match drilling. That
may be totally wrong; and, I may have my airplane come apart in 50 years, or
so. I look at some of the old birds like the DC-3s that were built for the
big war and wonder how many of those birds were fussed over as we're fussing
over our RVs. Those airplanes are still flying, today! Granted, aircraft
with pressurized systems may have the problems your discussing what with
skins that crack because of the pressure cycles and the wear and tear that
can create; but, we aren't talking about those kinds of stresses, folks.
We're also talking about RVs that have enough rivets that one knows there is
a great deal of overkill built in. Well, I do have to admit that my RV-6A's
spars do give me more comfort than the little stubs that stick into the
center sections of the newer wings; that has nothing to do with rivets. :-)
Please, don't follow my example because I sound like I know something. I'm
no expert and don't want any of you to follow my lead because you think I
am; but, I do have to admit that some of what I've read in theory just
doesn't seem to work out in real life. It kind of reminds me of all of that
theory stuff I read while I was getting my math degree in college. I have
yet to use that stuff in real life. :-) We have two local RVs, that I'm
aware of, that have not been match drilled. One has just passed inspection
and is about to take to the air. The other is the one I'm working on. I'm
betting neither will fall apart in the air; and, I would ride in either one.
With that, I'm betting my own theory is correct and am willing to put my
life on the line to prove it. Well, that sounds good; but, I'm not that
brave. :-) I know the builders and trust their work. Time will tell if
I'm wrong. I'm betting I won't live long enough to see the book theories
come to pass on this one. What do you think?
Jim Sears in KY
RV-6A N198JS
EAA Tech Counselor
________________________________________________________________________________
Maybe folks have been drilling holes in metal skins for seventy years,
but they have been riveting together CAD designed and punched RV kits
for only a couple of years!
I have to wonder how far back in the past it would have been deemed
"acceptable" to skip the drilling stage if drills were not necessary to
make the holes in the first place. Would we have seen "undrilled" B-17's
or P-51's??? I bet the folks trying to force every plane possible into
the sky during WWII would have gladly skipped the drilling process if
CAD punched skins were available.
And..........if that had happened, would it now be "acceptable" to skip
the drilling step without fear of "stretching" the holes???
Just tryin' to stir up a rip-roarin', flat-out flame-throwin' war on
this here list......
Sam Buchanan
I agree with Sam. As recently as 5 years ago, one of the reasons for
pre-drilling was touted as "making sure the holes line up" on parts that
were machined by hand on old fashioned machinery. Nobody had the ability to
make holes line up reliably. That reason (at least) is gone now, and that
opens up the question. The seventy-year-old reasons carry at least a little
less weight now.
Ed Winne
RV9A
Heshey (soon to be Jonestown) PA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | A Riveting subject |
Hello folks,
Go to http://www.flash.net/~gila/rivet_spec/rivet_a.htm
By the way, the above web address was reached by going to:
http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/wwwlinks.htm and scrolling down to the
heading near the bottom of the page titled; Other RV/Aviation Information,
click on MIL-R-471-96A
Jim in Kelowna
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV Fuel Injection Help |
>
>My problem is this. While flying near Sylvania Airport in Wisconsin in my
>new RV8a (50 hrs) I had a total loss of power. The engine (IO-360a, Bendix
>Servo) was coughing, sputtering backfiring & wind milling all the way down
>to airport that I just happened to be near. As I rolled out on the runway
>the prop quit turning. I tried to restart on the runway and flooded it.
>
>In the air I did the following:
>
>Fly the plane & head for airport (alt. 1500 agl)
>Fuel pump on
>Circuit breaker check
>Full power throttle on
>Full rich
>Did not switched tanks but it was full
>Missed Semi-Truck on highway near the approach and landed the plane.
>
Great job getting the plane on the ground without hurting yourself or it!.
One comment, offered in the spirit of trying to learn as much from
this as possible - there are failures that can cause fuel feed
problems from a tank, even though there is lots of fuel in that tank.
E.g. fuel vent problem, blocked fuel pickup, air leak in fuel feed
line, etc. So it is a good idea to change tanks when responding to
an engine failure, even if you know there is lots of fuel in the tank
that is currently feeding.
Probably the only time it isn't a good idea to change tanks when
responding to an engine failure is when you have already run the
other tank completely dry (i.e. you used that tank until the engine
quit).
I doubt changing tanks would have helped in your case, given all the
other info you provided. Please don't take this comment as an attack
on you - I am simply trying to help us all learn the best way to
respond to engine problems so that we have the best chance to get
safely on the ground. You certainly had your priorities right - fly
the plane first, sort the problem out in your spare time.
As far as the cause of your problem, I'm no expert on fuel injection,
but I have to suspect the fuel servo. Please let us what you find so
we all can learn from it.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (cowling, wing tip lights)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug Gray <dgra1233(at)bigpond.net.au> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Re: [RV-9A] cleco's |
I suspect clecos may be a moveable feast, manufacturers may have good and bad
batches or quality levels. I'd be interested to know, certainly my experience
suggests it is a bit of a lottery.
CLEKOLOCK from US industrial: 3/32 " are oversize (unusable) and do not fit into
the #40 holes , no problem with the 1/8" no failures.
KWIK LOK from a local supplier - 3/32" perfect and no failures but I have very
few of these.
WEDGELOCK from Avery - 3/32" perfec, no failures out of 200
Doug Gray
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mitch Robbins" <robm(at)am2.com> |
| Subject: | For sale - Lycoming O-320E2D |
I'm planning a move and am cleaning up some of the toys and extras. I have an
O-320E2D for sale. It's 2nd run about 350 hours since major overhaul. It is
already converted for a fuel pump and includes all other accessories. Outright
sale - no core required. It's located near Minneapolis. Please email me off
list if you're interested. Thanks.
Mitch Robbins
robm(at)am2.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com> |
| Subject: | Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
>
>Bill,
>I'm with you. There is not a race car in the world (or other high
>performance vehicle with an internal combustion engine) that has exhaust
>headers so close to intakes.
>
>I've ceramic coated my exhaust, and you can grab and hold onto them about 20
>seconds after the engine is turned off. If you study the theory behind
>this, you will see that the heat is taken out of the end of the exhaust...
>that heat which is otherwise radiated from the pipes. CHT and EGT does NOT
>go up. ALL race cars do this these days (as you know!).
>
How much did the ceramic coating cost? Do you know if it can be done
on an exhaust system that has already been in service? I don't think
I'll do it now, but I might be interested in trying it after I've
been flying and have some baseline performance numbers to compare too.
--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (cowling, wing tip lights)
Ottawa, Canada
http://members.rogers.com/khorton/rv8.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Phillips <ripsteel(at)edge.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Tip up gas struts |
Go to: http://www.mcmaster.com/ and type part # "9416K17" in the little box under the
"products" tab, hit "find", then click on ">Catalog Page" just below to display
the page- this
should take you to page 1029 of their catalog, look down at the bottom of the page-
the part #
cited above has a .3" shorter stroke and is about an inch shorter than the struts
I received with
my kit and cost $8.28 each- you could possibly use a slightly longer pair if your
hinges and top
skins allow...
Not local, but I get stuff from their warehouse in Atlanta often the next day UPS...
Happy hunting from the PossumWorks in TN
Mark
> > Does anyone know of a local source (Autozone etc) for the RV-6 tip up gas
> > struts? One of mine died (canopy not even finished yet!) and a trip to one
> > local autoparts store was no luck.
> >
> > Jeff Point
> > RV-6 finish kit
> > Milwaukee WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Peter H. Blake" <pblake(at)epix.net> |
| Subject: | Deburring & dimpling |
I was just reading my new Standard Aircraft Handbook, 6th edition (I just
updated from my old third edition), and was quite surprised at what it says
about deburring. It's been my practice to deburr everything (slow-build
RV6), however the Handbook says (p. 87):
"Burrs under either head of a rivet do not, in general, result in
unacceptable riveting. The burrs do not have to be removed if the material
is to be used immediately; however, sharp burrs must be removed, if the
material is to be stored or stacked, to prevent scratching of adjacent parts
or injury to personnel."
Further (and which would have saved me a ton of work): "Deburring shall not
be performed on predrilled holes that are to be subsequently form
countersunk."
It seems to me that this would apply to pre-punched and matched-hole
materials as well. Am I interpreting this correctly??
Best regards
Peter Blake
RV6, firewall forward
New engine arrived last night!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | P M Condon <pcondon(at)mitre.org> |
| Subject: | Maxi-Sump (aluminum weight vrs. magnesium weight) |
Dan, I looked into this last year. The 8 lbs. savings comes from
comparing a lycoming aluminum sump with one of their special sumps. If
you compare a lycoming magnesium sump, there is little to no weight
difference.
From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
Subject: RV-List: Maxi-Sump
> Sky Dynamics http://www.skydynamics.com/ has had a cool air system for
some
> time.
On this note...is anybody out there using the Maxi-Sump from Sky
Dynamics?
Sure seems to make sense given that it'll shave about 8 pounds off the
200hp
IO-360 plus theoretically provide better oil circulation.
I'm curious if this is a popular option and if anybody out there thinks
it's
worth the extra bucks...or whether people have steered clear of it for
some
reason.
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D (fuselage)
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple |
(was:New Builder introduction)
Markus,
With all do respect to your idea, I would suggest you add about 1000 hours
of varying vibration frequencies and some varying lateral stress to your
samples to get a closer idea of what the outcome of such methods might
be. There are a whole lot of variables in this equation so I wouldn't be
too definitive with your results. A simple "pull" test would not really
address the problems of stress risers that has been presented in some of
the theories here. Just something to think about before the big November
RV-List fund raiser starts.............groan....... ;-( AL
>
>Can someone get a piece of rib (like we all have these laying around) or
>some scrap and do 5 the right way and 5 the 'wrong' way and then drill two
>of each out and tell us what they find? Also put a couple drilled and
>dimpled and a couple dimpled but not drilled with no rivet inside it to
>check for problems before the rivet even goes in. Be careful when you drill
>so you don't damage the hole and obscure the evidence. If nobody has the
>equipment you can send it to me and I'll take it over to one of our science
>depts and check it under a high power microscope and post the results.
>Pictures too, probably.
>
>I see a lot of speculating and reasoning but I like to see tests. Many
>times the thing that we reason to be true turns out to not be the case.
>
>Marcus Ward
>
>New to list.
>No airplane.
>No kit.
>Working on license.
>Lots of dreams.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple |
(was:New Builder introduction)
Jim,
You probably picked the worst example for a riveted airplane in the book as
it relates to this discussion......All the DC-3's I've ever seen have round
head rivets nearly everywhere and they don't come apart even after tens of
thousands of hours and many overloaded flights. In fact I think they can be
used as an example to prove the point for de-burring and countersinking
since their riveting technique does not add more stresses to the
skins. Maybe???? AL
(BIG SNIP)
> I look at some of the old birds like the DC-3s that were built for the
>big war and wonder how many of those birds were fussed over as we're fussing
>over our RVs. Those airplanes are still flying, today!
(Another BIG SNIP)
>Jim Sears in KY
>RV-6A N198JS
>EAA Tech Counselor
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill" <n8wv(at)hotmail.com> |
Anyone know where to get small naca scoops that work with 1" scat tubes?
-Bill VonDane
RV-8A ~ 71 hours
www.vondane.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
I realize it doesn't address load and stress cycles. I was just going to
look for minute cracks that result from dimpling and riveting without
drilling. Some data is better than no data - then you're making educated
guesses and not complete guesses. I am sure I could set up something to
duplicate loading cycles without too much difficulty. I work for a
university with a rather extensive aviation program and part of the program
is a class on testing methods for aviation.
How big are the prepunched holes before drilling?
Thanks,
Marcus
----- Original Message -----
From: "Al Mojzisik" <prober(at)iwaynet.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New
Builder introduction)
>
> Markus,
>
> With all do respect to your idea, I would suggest you add about 1000 hours
> of varying vibration frequencies and some varying lateral stress to your
> samples to get a closer idea of what the outcome of such methods might
> be. There are a whole lot of variables in this equation so I wouldn't be
> too definitive with your results. A simple "pull" test would not really
> address the problems of stress risers that has been presented in some of
> the theories here. Just something to think about before the big November
> RV-List fund raiser starts.............groan....... ;-( AL
>
> >
> >Can someone get a piece of rib (like we all have these laying around) or
> >some scrap and do 5 the right way and 5 the 'wrong' way and then drill
two
> >of each out and tell us what they find? Also put a couple drilled and
> >dimpled and a couple dimpled but not drilled with no rivet inside it to
> >check for problems before the rivet even goes in. Be careful when you
drill
> >so you don't damage the hole and obscure the evidence. If nobody has the
> >equipment you can send it to me and I'll take it over to one of our
science
> >depts and check it under a high power microscope and post the results.
> >Pictures too, probably.
> >
> >I see a lot of speculating and reasoning but I like to see tests. Many
> >times the thing that we reason to be true turns out to not be the case.
> >
> >Marcus Ward
> >
> >New to list.
> >No airplane.
> >No kit.
> >Working on license.
> >Lots of dreams.
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Bibb" <richard.bibb(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
I'd be concerned about effecting the life of the exhaust pipes and not being
able to see any deterioation until it was too late. A crack in an exhaust
pipe can start a fire quickly. Since the pipes would not be able to be
inspected I'd worry about knowing their status. Also, wouldn't the wrap
absorb oil, etc. and over time become a fire hazard just from that alone?
Maybe a better idea would be to wrap the intake tubes.
Concentrating more heat in the exhasaust should improve performance but
negatively impact safety margin in my opinion.
Disclaimer: I have no direct experience with this stuff in any application.
Richard Bibb
RV-4 N144KT - mounting empennage and wings during rebuild from '98 Crash
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | DAVAWALKER(at)aol.com |
I wonder if we should be reaming the new prepunched parts rather than
drilling? Should provide a smoother hole with less burr to remove.
D. Walker RV7
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
>
>Deburring, does, in fact enlarge the hole slightly, but that's what it
>is actually supposed to do.
Not if done correctly.
>When you drill, you leave very small ridges,
>tears, and sharp pointed edges in the inside edges of the hole. A
>deburring cutter actually shaves these away, for the most part, so that
>there will not later be stress cracks spidering out from the hole.
Look closely and you will see similar sharp edges etc made by the deburr
cutter. Maybe even worse. Sharp tools help prevent this.
> Even
>though they are small, and you probably couldn't see them without a
>magnifying glass, they are there, and you should do whatever you can to
>alleviate them.
No matter the cost? Should we polish the holes some way? "Two years now
and I'm on my third hole!"
>You shouldn't have to "push" or tap or otherwise force a rivet into the
>hole. It should slide in easily or "drop right in" from above.
References please. Where do you find this information?
>I absolutely cannot imagine setting rivets in holes that are
>underdrilled, nor can I fathom why anyone would set a rivet in a
>non-deburred hole, when so much collective wisdom over the years
>dictates otherwise.
Except it doesn't.
>The textbook process works great, provides strength and safety, and
Which textbook?
> Follow the instructions.
Show me one RV where the instructions were followed at all times and I'll
show you one that is unfinished. You won't learn much just blindly
following the instructions and you certainly won't be experimenting. When
you get to the canopy, following the instructions will make you crazy.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
820 Jackson Drive
Paso Robles, CA 93446-1812
805.239.8112
805.674.5140 Cell
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple |
(was:New Builder introduction)
>
>
>That said.... Yep, these corners have been cut, and these not-built-to-spec
>planes are not exactly falling out of the sky (or are they?). This is
>probably
>just a matter of over-engineering covering up for poor construction practices.
One of the clearest things an engineer learns is that everything is a trade
off. For a space ship to carry humans to the moon, greater precision is
worth the cost. Precision costs. Perfection is a goal that is
unobtainable in the real world. Just as distance between rivets is
measured and has tolerances (or should), hole diameters do also. Hole
shape should, in the ideal world, be a circle but it never is a 'perfect
circle'. Reaming makes more nearly round holes. Observed thru a powerful
enough microscope, all things look jagged and rough.
We work with specifications without tolerances. That means that each
builder has to learn what is commonly accepted practice and then develop
his own standards and tolerances.
I get agitated by the emails from perfectionists , not because I hate their
results but because I believe that it is a major cause of uncompleted
airplanes. I'll take a flying airplane with smoking rivets over a half
finished project gathering dust any day.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Williams" <frate.dawg(at)attglobal.net> |
| Subject: | RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
Marcus: While I commend your intellectual curiosity and willingness to
do a research project, understand that you are only re-inventing the
wheel once again. All of this research was done in the '30s and early
'40s by people who discovered how to build airplanes out of metal (tin
or aluminum). The current process is the result of thousands of hours
of research and trial and error, to find out what works, what doesn't,
and what works BEST. It was accomplished by the likes of Howard Hughes,
William Boeing, Jack Northrup, Glenn L. Martin, the Ryans, Donald
Douglas, et al, and the information was shared throughout the industry.
Rosie (the Riveter) knew it, too. She got exactly one hour of
instruction before going on the "line" to rivet wing skins. The girls
who formed the exquisite belly scoops and inlets on the P-51s got a
whole six hours of instruction on how to form the compound curves in
those assemblies, prepare them for riveting, and then finish the job.
Take a close look at one, sometime. It's a work of art, made by a GIRL,
with less than one day's training!
The point is, the accepted process works, and works great! The end
products are world-renowned for strength, durability, and longevity in
often extremely hostile environments. The stories of airplanes returning
from missions with unbelievable battle damage are legion; numerous
airplanes returning without major portions of wings, missing engines,
fire burn-throughs, missing large parts of their empennages, and in one
case, the entire tail. Grummans returning to their carriers after
murderous pounding by as many as eight enemy figters at one time, so
shot up they were "totaled" and pushed over the side.
The process, though labor-intensive, even lends itself to assembly line
production, which is why every 54 minutes, a brand new B-24 Liberator
rolled out at GM's Ypsilanti plant, was fueled, and was flown away by
ferry pilots within 30 minutes to an hour to begin a very hard life. The
scene was repeated 24 hours a day at dozens of plants all over America.
Again, the process works, has been thoroughly experimented with, and
deemed to be the best system yet devised for building good, strong,
lightweight aluminum airplanes. I suspect that the designers of
airplanes also count on the manufacturers of airplanes to use this
process for assembly in order to achieve the strength that they are
designing into the airframe, and to not compromise this strength by
cutting corners in the fabrication process.
So, have at it. You are to be commended. Just be sure to share your
findings with the rest of us, as the founding fathers and heros of this
industry did so graciously, so many years ago. Good luck, John
Williams
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marcus Ward
Subject: Re: RV-List: RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple
(was:New Builder introduction)
--> RV9-List message posted by: "Marcus Ward" <marcus@f-64.org>
Can someone get a piece of rib (like we all have these laying around) or
some scrap and do 5 the right way and 5 the 'wrong' way and then drill
two
of each out and tell us what they find? Also put a couple drilled and
dimpled and a couple dimpled but not drilled with no rivet inside it to
check for problems before the rivet even goes in. Be careful when you
drill
so you don't damage the hole and obscure the evidence. If nobody has
the
equipment you can send it to me and I'll take it over to one of our
science
depts and check it under a high power microscope and post the results.
Pictures too, probably.
I see a lot of speculating and reasoning but I like to see tests. Many
times the thing that we reason to be true turns out to not be the case.
Marcus Ward
New to list.
No airplane.
No kit.
Working on license.
Lots of dreams.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Galati" <rick07x(at)earthlink.net> |
Recent threads are indicating hole quality as the popular topic of the
moment. Here's a surprising if nit-picking fact about hole
quality that is sure to raise some eyebrows. Even the very best twist
drill bit is incapable of drilling a perfectly round hole. It matters not how
good you drill that hole with or without lubricant, be it by hand, drill press,
power feed, whatever. If you examined that carefully drilled hole with sensitive
and very expensive test equipment usually reserved for military contractors
(hint) you would find that hole to have 3 evenly spaced but quite distinct lobes
around its circumference. That is why in the most demanding situations, a reamer
is always used to bring the hole up to final size. This is a non-event for
holes filled with solid rivets, and most applications RV, but it is a definite
consideration for those areas in some very high performance aircraft
which exists a relatively thick stack-up of material, where sudden load
reversals generate a lot of localized stress and the utmost quality
is of paramount importance. What this probably means to homebuilders
is absolutely nothing but it does "raise the bar" so to speak. Another words,
build as much quality into your flying carpet as you possibly can. There
is always room for improvement.
--- Rick Galati
--- rick07x(at)earthlink.net
--- EarthLink: It's your Internet.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple |
(was:New Builder introduction)
>Personally, I used structural adhesive
>along with rivets. Why not spread the stress and vibration to 100% of the
>rib, rather than a few specific points?
Adhesive, huh? Which?
I built a house in Washington State and used adhesive and screws to fasten
exterior plywood to the studs. The added strength is unbelievable. I
wondered if adhesive on aluminum ribs wouldn't work the same way.
Of course, since I only lived there 15 years, the money and time spent on
adhesive was wasted. The people who bought the house were unwilling to pay
extra. :-)
Can you now do 10 Gs ultimate?
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jaye and Scott Jackson <jayeandscott(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
My dear , old father-in-law used to make the wings and engine nacelles for a
twin-turboprop, STOL aircraft manufacturer in Ontario.
He thought I was nuts to laboriously deburr each hole in my RV-6 and had
never seen a de-burring bit before.
They did deburr their holes-by running a block of wood across the back of
the holes to knock off the burrs without scratching the skin.
Scott in Vancouver
----- Original Message -----
From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: Re: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder
introduction)
>
> >
> >Deburring, does, in fact enlarge the hole slightly, but that's what it
> >is actually supposed to do.
>
> Not if done correctly.
>
> >When you drill, you leave very small ridges,
> >tears, and sharp pointed edges in the inside edges of the hole. A
> >deburring cutter actually shaves these away, for the most part, so that
> >there will not later be stress cracks spidering out from the hole.
>
> Look closely and you will see similar sharp edges etc made by the deburr
> cutter. Maybe even worse. Sharp tools help prevent this.
>
> > Even
> >though they are small, and you probably couldn't see them without a
> >magnifying glass, they are there, and you should do whatever you can to
> >alleviate them.
>
> No matter the cost? Should we polish the holes some way? "Two years now
> and I'm on my third hole!"
>
> >You shouldn't have to "push" or tap or otherwise force a rivet into the
> >hole. It should slide in easily or "drop right in" from above.
>
> References please. Where do you find this information?
>
> >I absolutely cannot imagine setting rivets in holes that are
> >underdrilled, nor can I fathom why anyone would set a rivet in a
> >non-deburred hole, when so much collective wisdom over the years
> >dictates otherwise.
>
> Except it doesn't.
>
> >The textbook process works great, provides strength and safety, and
>
> Which textbook?
>
> > Follow the instructions.
>
> Show me one RV where the instructions were followed at all times and I'll
> show you one that is unfinished. You won't learn much just blindly
> following the instructions and you certainly won't be experimenting. When
> you get to the canopy, following the instructions will make you crazy.
>
> K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
> 820 Jackson Drive
> Paso Robles, CA 93446-1812
> 805.239.8112
> 805.674.5140 Cell
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
For what it is worth...
I got a email advertisement from Harbor Freight and they have a Rivnut tool
on sale
for $12.99. You can't beat the price if your only going to use it a couple
of times.
Don't buy them all before I order mine !! :
)
Ed Cole
RV6A N2169D Flying
RV6A N648RV Finishing
Maxim Home Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com
Products Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
New Products:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
Datasheets:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
The information contained in this message is confidential
and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "3 rotor" <rv8r300(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
I used a 3M adhesive, DP190. Hopefully it takes any doubts out of my
countersunk skin rivets.
We could extend this conversation to construction stds too, but I won't
go beyond mentioning that drywall screws are not rated for sheer wall
construction, they are brittle and break quite easily, as perhaps in an
earthquake. Codes state you must use 8p nails, hand nailed, not machine
nailed, with 4" spacing and set so as not to pierce the top layer of the
plywood, which must be a certified grade. Extensive steel atrapping is now
required to actually tie the floors together.
You and I know that the walls you built aren't about to fall down. I
brought this up to show some similarities to the passionate riveting
arguments and how uninformed opinions can go wrong despite good intentions.
kevin
> I built a house in Washington State and used adhesive and screws to fasten
> exterior plywood to the studs. The added strength is unbelievable. I
> wondered if adhesive
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "3 rotor" <rv8r300(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
the preunched holes ar 1/1000th undersized
----- Original Message -----
From: "Marcus Ward" <marcus@f-64.org>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New
Builder introduction)
>
> I realize it doesn't address load and stress cycles. I was just going to
> look for minute cracks that result from dimpling and riveting without
> drilling. Some data is better than no data - then you're making educated
> guesses and not complete guesses. I am sure I could set up something to
> duplicate loading cycles without too much difficulty. I work for a
> university with a rather extensive aviation program and part of the
program
> is a class on testing methods for aviation.
>
> How big are the prepunched holes before drilling?
>
> Thanks,
> Marcus
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Al Mojzisik" <prober(at)iwaynet.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple
(was:New
> Builder introduction)
>
>
> >
> > Markus,
> >
> > With all do respect to your idea, I would suggest you add about 1000
hours
> > of varying vibration frequencies and some varying lateral stress to your
> > samples to get a closer idea of what the outcome of such methods might
> > be. There are a whole lot of variables in this equation so I wouldn't
be
> > too definitive with your results. A simple "pull" test would not really
> > address the problems of stress risers that has been presented in some of
> > the theories here. Just something to think about before the big
November
> > RV-List fund raiser starts.............groan....... ;-( AL
> >
> > >
> > >Can someone get a piece of rib (like we all have these laying around)
or
> > >some scrap and do 5 the right way and 5 the 'wrong' way and then drill
> two
> > >of each out and tell us what they find? Also put a couple drilled and
> > >dimpled and a couple dimpled but not drilled with no rivet inside it to
> > >check for problems before the rivet even goes in. Be careful when you
> drill
> > >so you don't damage the hole and obscure the evidence. If nobody has
the
> > >equipment you can send it to me and I'll take it over to one of our
> science
> > >depts and check it under a high power microscope and post the results.
> > >Pictures too, probably.
> > >
> > >I see a lot of speculating and reasoning but I like to see tests. Many
> > >times the thing that we reason to be true turns out to not be the case.
> > >
> > >Marcus Ward
> > >
> > >New to list.
> > >No airplane.
> > >No kit.
> > >Working on license.
> > >Lots of dreams.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "3 rotor" <rv8r300(at)attbi.com> |
Geez, someone better tell Van that this ISN'T the way airplanes are built!
OK what do we argue about now? hmmm, primers, no, dimpling, no, circuit
breakers vs fuses, no, magnetos.......:-) kevin
> My wifes cousins sister-in-laws uncle is head product development engineer
for
> the company supplying tooling for Van's NC punch machines and tells me Van
is
> tooling up for RV-10 production and has ordered special punches with the
> appropriate sized dimple dies integral to the punches- specially coated
with
> unobtanium for punching through pre-primed 2024 T-3 without scratching the
> sides of the hole...
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "3 rotor" <rv8r300(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder introduction) |
this is what Mark Fredricks (F-1 Rocket) showed me once. kevin
> They did deburr their holes-by running a block of wood across the back of
> the holes to knock off the burrs without scratching the skin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rob Prior <rv7(at)b4.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
kempthornes wrote:
>>Deburring, does, in fact enlarge the hole slightly, but that's what it
>>is actually supposed to do.
>
> Not if done correctly.
With the tools the average homebuilder buys from ABC (Avery, Brown,
Cleveland), it is not physically possible to dimple a hole without
enlarging the hole at the same time. The geometry of the dies ensures
that the material being dimpled is pushed from the lip of the hole, but
supported at the outside rim of the opposing die, well back from the
hole edge. With this tool geometry, it's not possible to not stretch
the hole opening.
There may be tools available that would support the entire dimpled
surface while the dimpling is occurring, and stretch the material so the
hole size doesn't change, but i'm willing to bet that we homebuilders
can't afford such specialized equipment...
-RB4
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV4" <VansRV4GRVMJ(at)btinternet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder introduction) |
> >You shouldn't have to "push" or tap or otherwise force a rivet into the
> >hole. It should slide in easily or "drop right in" from above.
I was watching a documentary on Discovery channel about the Boeing 777, the
series is called 21st Century jet, it showed one of the Boeing employees
hammering the dome head rivets in the lid, just above the
flightdeck.............
Marcel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV4" <VansRV4GRVMJ(at)btinternet.com> |
> So how do you store a 3 bladed wood prop so they stay in balance?
Store the prop horizontally?
Marcel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV4" <VansRV4GRVMJ(at)btinternet.com> |
> I have to ask why in the world you'd put a fixed-pitch prop on a 200hp
In the UK experimental aircraft are subject to notice 75 in the same manner
as C of A aircraft.
Marcel
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jaye and Scott Jackson <jayeandscott(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
I forgot that one RV builder here in the Vancouver are told me that was all
he did..
Scott
----- Original Message -----
From: "3 rotor" <rv8r300(at)attbi.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder
introduction)
>
> this is what Mark Fredricks (F-1 Rocket) showed me once. kevin
>
> > They did deburr their holes-by running a block of wood across the back
of
> > the holes to knock off the burrs without scratching the skin.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rob ray <smokyray(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV4-List: ivo propeller |
Very Interesting...A Hartzell rep told me it took them
30 years to perfect the two and 3 blade hubs they use
today...
I will testify to the excellent properties of the
Composite Catto FP prop, smooth and efficient.
RR
--- LessDragProd(at)aol.com wrote:
> --> RV4-List message posted by: LessDragProd(at)aol.com
>
> If the Warp Drive Company is selling their prop for
> Lycoming's, then they
> must have fixed their problem.
> They weren't selling their prop to any four cylinder
> four cycle engine, at
> one time.
>
> Jim Ayers
>
>
>
> Contributions of
> any other form
>
> latest messages.
> other List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/search
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | Ceramic Coating of Exhaust... WAS: Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
All,
I've been sent a dozen or more questions (off line) regarding Ceramic
coatings of the exhaust. I've responded to several individually, but I'm
getting tired... so here are more details to the group.
1) This can be done in any decent size city these days. There is a national
company JetCoat that had a great reputation, but you have to box it up and
mail it to them. I didn't want to do this. They also quoted a price of $280.
I found a place locally that did it for $80. I dropped it off one day, and
picked it up the next. Many places that do powder coating also do ceramic
coating. Its a very similar process, just different materials are used.
2) To get the true benefit, both the inside and the outside of the exhaust
needs to be done. It's only a couple of thousandths of an inch think, but
it is applied to both the inside and outside of the exhaust. This is
standard practice and the place that does this for you will be well versed
in this. When you go there, you will see exhaust systems all over the
place...yours won't be the first one!
3) When the engine is running they still get plenty hot to run a heat-muff.
You may need to put a spring or other metal object inside the muff to help
absorb heat within the muff. I live in FLA, so its not an issue for me
(yet?).
4) I had mine done before they were put on the engine...it was a new
Vetterman exhaust. However, it is claimed that you can do this to any
exhaust system regardless of the shape it is in. Look at the JetCoat web
site and this is described for you. http://jetcoat.com/customer/index3.html
5) It looks better than standard gray stainless pipes.
6) It is expected to produce a 2% increase in HP--standard for all types of
internal combustion engines. (I figure an extra 4 HP will help overcome my
heavy leather interior!).
7) with regards to being able to see the pipes, seeing cracks, etc. This
has no effect on this at all, except that it may make it easier to see
cracks. I am writing with regards to ceramic coating the exhaust, (and
possibly wrapping the INTAKE tubes with "exhaust wrap"). I am not advocating
wrapping the exhaust with exhaust wrap.
8) Finally, I've discussed this with Larry Vetterman about 1.5 years ago. At
that time he had not had much experience with it so was not going to
comment. I will not comment for him now.
9) There is not a race car (or high performance street car) around these
days that has not done this. It makes the exhaust look 200% better, keeps
the under-hood area cooler, allows work on the engine much sooner after
shut-down, and provides more HP.
Jim
Tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Perry" <eperry(at)san.rr.com> |
I got one of these to play with it, and it is a piece of JUNK. The arbor
pulls thru without doing the swaging. Unless I was using it wrong and
somebody else had success I would skip this purchase for use on metal. I
learned that the correct tool cuts a keyhole in the metal and that is what
keeps the rivnut from turning. This tool does not do that.
Ed Perry
eperry(at)san.rr.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com>
Subject: RV-List: Rivnut tool
>
> For what it is worth...
>
> I got a email advertisement from Harbor Freight and they have a Rivnut
tool
> on sale
> for $12.99. You can't beat the price if your only going to use it a couple
> of times.
> Don't buy them all before I order mine !! :
> )
>
> Ed Cole
> RV6A N2169D Flying
> RV6A N648RV Finishing
>
>
> Maxim Home Page:
> http://www.maxim-ic.com
> Products Page:
> http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
> New Products:
> http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
> Datasheets:
> http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
> The information contained in this message is confidential
> and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
> solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
> recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
> or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
> If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
> by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New |
Builder introduction)
>
>kempthornes wrote:
> >>Deburring, does, in fact enlarge the hole slightly, but that's what it
> >>is actually supposed to do.
> >
> > Not if done correctly.
>
>With the tools the average homebuilder buys from ABC (Avery, Brown,
>Cleveland), it is not physically possible to dimple a hole without
>enlarging the hole at the same time.
Probably. But John was saying that deburring (not dimpling) enlarges the
hole. I say it doesn't if done right. I may have a few in my plane where
deburring did enlarge the hole. I apologize and will let y'all know when
it falls out of the sky.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chuck" <chuck(at)chuckdirect.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Re: [RV-9A] cleco's |
I agree. I purchased Wedge-Locs because someone had loaned me some very
old Wedge-Locs and they were great. The new ones are trash. I'd say 20% of
my new Wedge-Locs broke.
Chuck
> Browns sells Kwik-Loc brand. Vans sells Wedge-Loc which break too easy.
Your
> numbers confirm this quite well.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "flyseaplane" <flyseaplane(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | Somebody on the RV list is sending me a virus |
Someone from the RV list has been sending me the W32Klez@mm virus for a few
days now.
The W32.Bugbear@mm just came through today. This must be a new one.
Folks, If you don't have Norton Anti-Virus, I strongly suggest you get it.
(it's only $20 from numerous places online)
I don't want to hear one person come back and say "Well, I have McAfee...."
McAfee does not work like Norton Symantec does. I had McAfee installed on my
Hewlitt-Packard when I bought it brand new, and the computer slowly began
acting up. I installed Norton and it immediately found 28 viruses on my
computer. So much for McAfee. Never again!
Anyways, I just wanted you to know that my Norton system has been nabbing
these viruses from the RV list, so you all might want to go ahead and run a
virus scan. I am going to send this same message to the Harmon Rocket list,
because it might be coming from there, I haven't determined which list is
sending me the virus.
Take care all, and happy building!
Linc
-------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "flyseaplane" <flyseaplane(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | Someone from the RV list is sending me a virus... |
Someone from the RV list has been sending me the W32Klez@mm virus for a few
days now.
The W32.Bugbear@mm just came through today. This must be a new one.
Folks, If you don't have Norton Anti-Virus, I strongly suggest you get it.
(it's only $20 from numerous places online)
I don't want to hear one person come back and say "Well, I have McAfee...."
McAfee does not work like Norton Symantec does. I had McAfee installed on my
Hewlitt-Packard when I bought it brand new, and the computer slowly began
acting up. I installed Norton and it immediately found 28 viruses on my
computer. So much for McAfee. Never again!
Anyways, I just wanted you to know that my Norton system has been nabbing
these viruses from the RV list, so you all might want to go ahead and run a
virus scan.
I am going to send this same message to the Harmon Rocket list, because it
might be coming from there, I haven't determined which list is sending me
the virus.
Take care all, and happy building!
Linc
-------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com> |
| Subject: | Ceramic Coating of Exhaust... WAS: Exhaust Pipe Wrap |
...
Someone mentioned the Skydynamics website yesterday
(http://www.skydynamics.com/ )
as a source for magnesium sumps. I noticed under the exhaust systems they
sold that
their warranty was void if you coated their very expensive exhaust systems.
Maybe they
would share the reasons with you if you made the call.
As for wrapping the intake runners, I have a couple of questions/comments;
1) With the sump being very warm from the oil and the cylinder heads
running over 350 degrees F, how much less heat would the intake air
see if the intake tubes were wrapped ? I would also think that the
physical
attachment of the intake runner to the cylinder head would allow the
tube
to reach the same temp as the head and the wrapping would only serve to
keep the heat
contained.
2) At the speed at which the intake air is traveling through the carburetor
and
induction tubes, how much warming is actually taking place ?
I have also noted in the past that builders sometimes aim blast tubes
at the magnetos. Again, since the mags are bolted to the large mass of
heated
engine cases, I don't believe that a localized blast of cool air can cool of
the mags
to any significant degree.
Any Thermodynamics Engineers out there want to respond??
Ed Cole
RV6A N2169D Flying
RV6A N648RV Finishing
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jim Norman [SMTP:jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com]
> Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 12:09 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Ceramic Coating of Exhaust... WAS: Exhaust Pipe
> Wrap...
>
>
> All,
> I've been sent a dozen or more questions (off line) regarding Ceramic
> coatings of the exhaust. I've responded to several individually, but I'm
> getting tired... so here are more details to the group.
>
Maxim Home Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com
Products Page:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
New Products:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
Datasheets:
http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
The information contained in this message is confidential
and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bill VonDane" <n8wv(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Ceramic Coating of Exhaust... WAS: Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
Jim...
How does the coating work on the vetterman exhaust where the ball joints
are?
-Bill VonDane
RV-8A ~ 71 hours
www.vondane.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com>
Subject: RV-List: Ceramic Coating of Exhaust... WAS: Exhaust Pipe Wrap...
All,
I've been sent a dozen or more questions (off line) regarding Ceramic
coatings of the exhaust. I've responded to several individually, but I'm
getting tired... so here are more details to the group.
1) This can be done in any decent size city these days. There is a national
company JetCoat that had a great reputation, but you have to box it up and
mail it to them. I didn't want to do this. They also quoted a price of $280.
I found a place locally that did it for $80. I dropped it off one day, and
picked it up the next. Many places that do powder coating also do ceramic
coating. Its a very similar process, just different materials are used.
2) To get the true benefit, both the inside and the outside of the exhaust
needs to be done. It's only a couple of thousandths of an inch think, but
it is applied to both the inside and outside of the exhaust. This is
standard practice and the place that does this for you will be well versed
in this. When you go there, you will see exhaust systems all over the
place...yours won't be the first one!
3) When the engine is running they still get plenty hot to run a heat-muff.
You may need to put a spring or other metal object inside the muff to help
absorb heat within the muff. I live in FLA, so its not an issue for me
(yet?).
4) I had mine done before they were put on the engine...it was a new
Vetterman exhaust. However, it is claimed that you can do this to any
exhaust system regardless of the shape it is in. Look at the JetCoat web
site and this is described for you. http://jetcoat.com/customer/index3.html
5) It looks better than standard gray stainless pipes.
6) It is expected to produce a 2% increase in HP--standard for all types of
internal combustion engines. (I figure an extra 4 HP will help overcome my
heavy leather interior!).
7) with regards to being able to see the pipes, seeing cracks, etc. This
has no effect on this at all, except that it may make it easier to see
cracks. I am writing with regards to ceramic coating the exhaust, (and
possibly wrapping the INTAKE tubes with "exhaust wrap"). I am not advocating
wrapping the exhaust with exhaust wrap.
8) Finally, I've discussed this with Larry Vetterman about 1.5 years ago. At
that time he had not had much experience with it so was not going to
comment. I will not comment for him now.
9) There is not a race car (or high performance street car) around these
days that has not done this. It makes the exhaust look 200% better, keeps
the under-hood area cooler, allows work on the engine much sooner after
shut-down, and provides more HP.
Jim
Tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "flyseaplane" <flyseaplane(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | I found the source of the Virus.... |
I found the source of the virus.....
It came from someone called "Sally and George" that posted to the RV-8 list
about floor heat.
I sent them an e-mail asking them to perform a virus scan.
Take care, and Happy building.
Linc
-------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Camille Hawthorne" <cammie(at)sunvalley.net> |
| Subject: | The value of drilling, deburring, and dimpling |
Hasn't anyone noticed how therapeutic it is to mindlessly perform these
tasks?
Cammie
RV7 wings
CFII with lots of spare time in the winter
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
ON the Airplane, or do you have to remove after each flight?
----- Original Message -----
From: "RV4" <VansRV4GRVMJ(at)btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: RV7 prop
>
> > So how do you store a 3 bladed wood prop so they stay in balance?
>
> Store the prop horizontally?
>
> Marcel
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | Ceramic Coating of Exhaust... WAS: Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
Bill, I put the pipes on the motor and positioned the bends as needed. I
then took the pipes to the coating company trying not to move the joints
much. They coated the pipes and then I put them back on the engine. I had
to move each of the ball joints a bit and you can see a small area that was
not coated. Bottom line, the coating is so thin that it doesn't make much
difference. It made them a bit harder to swivel at the ball, but not by
much. I think that keeping them in their "near correct" position prior to
coating was probably important to keeping the ball joint working well post
coating. I would not get them coated without positioning them first... you
may have to muscle them a bit afterwords.
jim
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bill VonDane
Subject: Re: RV-List: Ceramic Coating of Exhaust... WAS: Exhaust Pipe
Wrap...
Jim...
How does the coating work on the vetterman exhaust where the ball joints
are?
-Bill VonDane
RV-8A ~ 71 hours
www.vondane.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com>
Subject: RV-List: Ceramic Coating of Exhaust... WAS: Exhaust Pipe Wrap...
All,
I've been sent a dozen or more questions (off line) regarding Ceramic
coatings of the exhaust. I've responded to several individually, but I'm
getting tired... so here are more details to the group.
1) This can be done in any decent size city these days. There is a national
company JetCoat that had a great reputation, but you have to box it up and
mail it to them. I didn't want to do this. They also quoted a price of $280.
I found a place locally that did it for $80. I dropped it off one day, and
picked it up the next. Many places that do powder coating also do ceramic
coating. Its a very similar process, just different materials are used.
2) To get the true benefit, both the inside and the outside of the exhaust
needs to be done. It's only a couple of thousandths of an inch think, but
it is applied to both the inside and outside of the exhaust. This is
standard practice and the place that does this for you will be well versed
in this. When you go there, you will see exhaust systems all over the
place...yours won't be the first one!
3) When the engine is running they still get plenty hot to run a heat-muff.
You may need to put a spring or other metal object inside the muff to help
absorb heat within the muff. I live in FLA, so its not an issue for me
(yet?).
4) I had mine done before they were put on the engine...it was a new
Vetterman exhaust. However, it is claimed that you can do this to any
exhaust system regardless of the shape it is in. Look at the JetCoat web
site and this is described for you. http://jetcoat.com/customer/index3.html
5) It looks better than standard gray stainless pipes.
6) It is expected to produce a 2% increase in HP--standard for all types of
internal combustion engines. (I figure an extra 4 HP will help overcome my
heavy leather interior!).
7) with regards to being able to see the pipes, seeing cracks, etc. This
has no effect on this at all, except that it may make it easier to see
cracks. I am writing with regards to ceramic coating the exhaust, (and
possibly wrapping the INTAKE tubes with "exhaust wrap"). I am not advocating
wrapping the exhaust with exhaust wrap.
8) Finally, I've discussed this with Larry Vetterman about 1.5 years ago. At
that time he had not had much experience with it so was not going to
comment. I will not comment for him now.
9) There is not a race car (or high performance street car) around these
days that has not done this. It makes the exhaust look 200% better, keeps
the under-hood area cooler, allows work on the engine much sooner after
shut-down, and provides more HP.
Jim
Tampa
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rob Prior <rv7(at)b4.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
kempthornes wrote:
>>With the tools the average homebuilder buys from ABC (Avery, Brown,
>>Cleveland), it is not physically possible to dimple a hole without
>>enlarging the hole at the same time.
>
> Probably. But John was saying that deburring (not dimpling) enlarges the
> hole. I say it doesn't if done right. I may have a few in my plane where
> deburring did enlarge the hole. I apologize and will let y'all know when
> it falls out of the sky.
Doh! My mistake. My brain was so focussed on the dimpling thread that
I missed that he said "deburring" instead. Arrgh.
You're right, deburring shouldn't enlarge the hole if done properly.
-RB4
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
There are TWO versions of rivnuts; keyed and non-keyed.
I personally do not like either but I understand the keyed version will work
some what better. When you upset the rivnut to hold it in 3 things can
happen. Two of the 3 are bad. If you don't pull hard enough, they will spin.
Maybe not the first time, but when you want to remove as a little corrosion
(dissimilar metals) binds the screw to the rivnut and it spins. If you pull
too hard, the threads are ruined. Plus the aluminum is so soft that there
really isn't much strength. Nut plates are a much better solution. There is
also a product called nutserts in which the threaded portion is steel.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Perry" <eperry(at)san.rr.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Rivnut tool
>
> I got one of these to play with it, and it is a piece of JUNK. The arbor
> pulls thru without doing the swaging. Unless I was using it wrong and
> somebody else had success I would skip this purchase for use on metal. I
> learned that the correct tool cuts a keyhole in the metal and that is what
> keeps the rivnut from turning. This tool does not do that.
> Ed Perry
> eperry(at)san.rr.com
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Cole, Ed" <Ed_Cole(at)maximhq.com>
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: Rivnut tool
>
>
> >
> > For what it is worth...
> >
> > I got a email advertisement from Harbor Freight and they have a Rivnut
> tool
> > on sale
> > for $12.99. You can't beat the price if your only going to use it a
couple
> > of times.
> > Don't buy them all before I order mine !! :
> > )
> >
> > Ed Cole
> > RV6A N2169D Flying
> > RV6A N648RV Finishing
> >
> >
> > Maxim Home Page:
> > http://www.maxim-ic.com
> > Products Page:
> > http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
> > New Products:
> > http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
> > Datasheets:
> > http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
> > The information contained in this message is confidential
> > and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
> > solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
> > recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
> > or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
> > If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
> > by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Will Cretsinger <cretsinger(at)ticnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tip up gas struts |
Jeff, I had one of my struts die a premature death too. I sent it back
to Vans and they replaced it at no charge. The replacement has enjoyed
a long life.
Will Cretsinger, Arlington, Texas
-6A flying past 530 hours
Jeff Point wrote:
>
>
> Here's a question often asked, but never answered, in the archives:
>
> Does anyone know of a local source (Autozone etc) for the RV-6 tip up gas
> struts? One of mine died (canopy not even finished yet!) and a trip to one
> local autoparts store was no luck.
>
> Jeff Point
> RV-6 finish kit
> Milwaukee WI
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Will Cretsinger <cretsinger(at)ticnet.com> |
"C. W. Crane"
| Subject: | Re: Tip up gas struts |
Jeff, I had one of my struts die a premature death too. I sent it back
to Vans and they replaced it at no charge. The replacement has enjoyed
a long life.
Will Cretsinger, Arlington, Texas
-6A flying past 530 hours
Jeff Point wrote:
>
>
> Here's a question often asked, but never answered, in the archives:
>
> Does anyone know of a local source (Autozone etc) for the RV-6 tip up gas
> struts? One of mine died (canopy not even finished yet!) and a trip to one
> local autoparts store was no luck.
>
> Jeff Point
> RV-6 finish kit
> Milwaukee WI
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Patrick Kelley" <webmaster(at)flion.com> |
| Subject: | Somebody on the RV list is sending me a virus |
Speaking as a consultant (www.flion.com) and as the webmaster for UofChi
Anesthesia for the past few years (until I moved in July), McAfee works
great. It is what the entire UofChi uses. Typically, I had to remove
Norton from Dell machines we purchased because it would cause
progressive system errors (note - this is not a problem with Norton but
rather with the install done by Dell; they have been working on it but
it may stem from their proprietary hardware) and then I would install a
base install of McAfee. Very important (with any AV software)!: Update
both the software and AV info often. Also periodically check
www.nai.com for both hoaxes and fixes for the viruses that do get
through. Finally, lobby with your ISP to put AV filtering on their mail
servers. Many today are doing just that.
Patrick Kelley - RV-6A - Looking for a painter in or near Flagstaff
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of flyseaplane
Subject: RV-List: Somebody on the RV list is sending me a virus
Someone from the RV list has been sending me the W32Klez@mm virus for a
few days now.
The W32.Bugbear@mm just came through today. This must be a new one.
Folks, If you don't have Norton Anti-Virus, I strongly suggest you get
it. (it's only $20 from numerous places online)
I don't want to hear one person come back and say "Well, I have
McAfee...."
McAfee does not work like Norton Symantec does. I had McAfee installed
on my Hewlitt-Packard when I bought it brand new, and the computer
slowly began acting up. I installed Norton and it immediately found 28
viruses on my computer. So much for McAfee. Never again!
Anyways, I just wanted you to know that my Norton system has been
nabbing these viruses from the RV list, so you all might want to go
ahead and run a virus scan. I am going to send this same message to the
Harmon Rocket list, because it might be coming from there, I haven't
determined which list is sending me the virus.
Take care all, and happy building!
Linc
-------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Drill and Dimple verses just Drill |
Hi guys & gals:
The two RV's I have built were from kits both prior to the pre-punching. I have
not seen the new builders manual supplied with the pre-punched kits from Van's.
Is it not spelled out in the new manuals what the riveting process should
be?
I am a great believer in following the instructions and drawings supplied with
the kits, I know that Van's top priority is safety and I am sure that what is
in the manual has his blessing. I have to admit that the earlier manuals left
some room for improvement but any questions were quickly resolved with a phone
call.Van is the designer and engineer and is many times more qualified than I
so I have to rely on what he has put in the manual.
On the subject of DC 3's (C47) I have flown them thousands of hours and some with
airframe times as high as 15000 hours plus and never have seen a sign of loose
rivets or cracking. However we are talking about two different types of rivets,
the three's were all round head rivets.
The governor of Montana was killed in a DC3 many years ago near Helena in severe
turbulence when a wing separated from the center section. This resulted in a
AD to strengthen the attach angles that join the outer wing to the center section.
This was not a case of rivet failure but a catastrophic structural failure
were the skins were literally torn apart. This never happened again to my knowledge.
Eustace Bowhay Blind Bay, B.C.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kysh <vans-dragon(at)lapdragon.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Somebody on the RV list is sending me a virus |
As Patrick Kelley was saying:
> through. Finally, lobby with your ISP to put AV filtering on their mail
> servers. Many today are doing just that.
At the risk of being blatantly offtopic, the only thing that should be filtered
at the ISP is spam, and that on a site-wide basis, not a case-by-case basis.
ISPs have no business filtering anything, and customers have no business asking
for it.
-Kysh
--
| 'Life begins at 120kias' - http://www.lapdragon.org/flying |
| CBR-F4 streetbike - http://www.lapdragon.org/cbr |
| 1968 Mustang fastback - http://www.lapdragon.org/mustang |
| Got 'nix? - http://www.unix-vs-nt.org/ |
| KG6FOB - http://www.lapdragon.org/ham |
"If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts."
-- Albert Einstein
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ray Dorf" <rdorf(at)motion.net> |
| Subject: | Re: For sale - Lycoming O-320E2D |
A note to request more details and price for this engine.
THANKS
RAY DORF
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mitch Robbins" <robm(at)am2.com>
Subject: RV-List: For sale - Lycoming O-320E2D
>
> I'm planning a move and am cleaning up some of the toys and extras. I
have an O-320E2D for sale. It's 2nd run about 350 hours since major
overhaul. It is already converted for a fuel pump and includes all other
accessories. Outright sale - no core required. It's located near
Minneapolis. Please email me off list if you're interested. Thanks.
>
> Mitch Robbins
> robm(at)am2.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us> |
Well,
I have the heat wrap and it keeps things very cool, about as cool as New
Mexico is right now.
What's worse is it is supposed to be hard rain in So. Cal this Saturday,
which is when I get to leave for LOE. Doesn't God know it never rains in
California!!! Heck, even the Beach Boys knew that much.
Wouldn't be so bad but we have these little mountains between here and parts
east that like to tickle the bottoms of the white puffies.
On the Wrap, I used the stuff from Spruce, on a Vetterman system, used
double wound .040" saftey wire to secure in numerous places and the
recommended spray that didn't seem to do much; overall it seems to work and
stay on after 300 hours.
I have also thought about putting vans "foil" around my intake tubes as it
does a wonderful number on keeping the cowl cool.
Who does a good job on the ceramic coatings. How do they prevent the joints
from getting coated, how much$$$, inside vs outside, tell us more.
W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
I have had Exhaust Wrap from Aircraft Spruce on my High Country Cross Over
exhaust pipes since about 40 or 50 hours. I do not have any welds, ball
joints, or expansion joints wrapped. If the exhaust only lasted 500 hours
with the exhaust wrap on, it is worth it in my opinion.
Frank had exhaust wrap on his Allen Tolle exhaust pipes before he sold the
IO-360 powered RV-3. There were over 1,600 hours on this installation. It
cracked a few times with the exhaust wrap on and you could always tell where
it was as the wrap would blow away around the break. The last time I saw,
the RV-3 that he purchased was up for sale again at Santa Maria. It is the
RV-3 that did 222 mph in the Sun-N-Fun race back in the mid 90's before
Tracy Saylor got serious.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,198 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.rvproject.com
----Original Message Follows----
From: "Richard Bibb" <richard.bibb(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Exhaust Pipe Wrap...
Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:50:40 -0400
I'd be concerned about effecting the life of the exhaust pipes and not being
able to see any deterioation until it was too late. A crack in an exhaust
pipe can start a fire quickly. Since the pipes would not be able to be
inspected I'd worry about knowing their status. Also, wouldn't the wrap
absorb oil, etc. and over time become a fire hazard just from that alone?
Maybe a better idea would be to wrap the intake tubes.
Concentrating more heat in the exhasaust should improve performance but
negatively impact safety margin in my opinion.
Disclaimer: I have no direct experience with this stuff in any application.
Richard Bibb
RV-4 N144KT - mounting empennage and wings during rebuild from '98 Crash
http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "fcs(at)jlc.net" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | RE: RV9-List: Drill and dimple vs just dimple (was:New Builder |
introduction)
Well put. Having personally earned my ticket working at the Willow Run
bomber plant, side by side with some of the best metalsmiths in the world,
I take their advice and techniques seriously. No need for me to second
guess their wisdom...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gert <gert(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: I found the source of the Virus.... |
I just hope you are absolutely one hundred percent sure about that
accusation as the virus changes a lot of stuff around in the email
header, INCLUDING the first 'received' hidden in the header.
That's not the one showing up in the visible 'from' header or the 'reply
to' header. Some of them now also mess with the message ID hidden.
I too have received plenty viruses as you described, and yes NAV caught
all of them (as far as I can tell ;-). I have traced many a virus back
to the originating infected computer. One thing I do know, 99.9 percent
of *all* viruses I received during my time as IT manager came from
Outlook or Outlook express. Now I am not saying that these programs are
neccesary bad, just more open out-of-the-box.
I can only remember one which came from a Netscape 4.X program. I guess
that is because the Outlook address book is easier to access....I
probably should say 'was' here as netscape is changing too.
Anyway, I'll get of the horse here just saying, be carefull who you
accuse publicly on the RV list, If you are certain, why don't you inform
the person in private, if it is true, he or she is probably embarashed
enough having caused you problems......
Gert
flyseaplane wrote:
>
> I found the source of the virus.....
>
> It came from someone called "Sally and George" that posted to the RV-8 list
> about floor heat.
>
> I sent them an e-mail asking them to perform a virus scan.
>
> Take care, and Happy building.
>
> Linc
>
>
> -------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: I found the source of the Virus.... |
flyseaplane wrote:
>
>
> I found the source of the virus.....
>
> It came from someone called "Sally and George" that posted to the RV-8 list
> about floor heat.
>
> I sent them an e-mail asking them to perform a virus scan.
>
> Take care, and Happy building.
>
> Linc
>
Just curious how you found who was sending it? I really doubt it was from
them. Unless they run a scan and actually find a virus you can't tell who
it is from. Very seldom nowdays does a virus come from the return address listed.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaskuss(at)bellsouth.net> |
Ed,
Search on EBay for rivnut tools. I purchased both the installer and notch cutting
tool (for "keyed" rivnuts) for about $50 for both tools last year.
Charlie Kuss
PS I just stopped by the new Harbor Freight store in Lake Worth, Florida yesterday.
I saw their "rivnut tool". I don't think you'd like it.
>
>For what it is worth...
>
>I got a email advertisement from Harbor Freight and they have a Rivnut tool
>on sale
>for $12.99. You can't beat the price if your only going to use it a couple
>of times.
>Don't buy them all before I order mine !! :
>)
>
>Ed Cole
>RV6A N2169D Flying
>RV6A N648RV Finishing
>
>
>Maxim Home Page:
>http://www.maxim-ic.com
>Products Page:
>http://www.maxim-ic.com/MaximProducts/products.htm
>New Products:
>http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/new_products.cfm
>Datasheets:
>http://dbserv.maxim-ic.com/l_datasheet3.cfm
>The information contained in this message is confidential
>and may be legally privileged. The message is intended
>solely for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended
>recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
>or reproduction is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
>If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender
>by return e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene Smith" <esmith6(at)satx.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV4-List: Someone from the RV list is sending me a virus... |
Linc,
"Bugbear Virus" came from the RV-8 list......I got it this a.m...You
are right about the Norton system, it expunged it
immediately......CHEERS!!!...It seems to be a good
system......CHEERS!!!!!!..........Gene Smith.
----- Original Message -----
From: "flyseaplane" <flyseaplane(at)netzero.net>
Subject: RV4-List: Someone from the RV list is sending me a virus...
> --> RV4-List message posted by: "flyseaplane"
>
> Someone from the RV list has been sending me the W32Klez@mm virus for a
few
> days now.
>
> The W32.Bugbear@mm just came through today. This must be a new one.
>
> Folks, If you don't have Norton Anti-Virus, I strongly suggest you get it.
> (it's only $20 from numerous places online)
>
> I don't want to hear one person come back and say "Well, I have
McAfee...."
>
> McAfee does not work like Norton Symantec does. I had McAfee installed on
my
> Hewlitt-Packard when I bought it brand new, and the computer slowly began
> acting up. I installed Norton and it immediately found 28 viruses on my
> computer. So much for McAfee. Never again!
>
> Anyways, I just wanted you to know that my Norton system has been nabbing
> these viruses from the RV list, so you all might want to go ahead and run
a
> virus scan.
> I am going to send this same message to the Harmon Rocket list, because it
> might be coming from there, I haven't determined which list is sending me
> the virus.
>
> Take care all, and happy building!
> Linc
>
> -------------------------------------------
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rob W M Shipley" <Rob(at)RobsGlass.com> |
| Subject: | Match drilling etc. |
"Gary" | From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 10/24/2002 2:16:34 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
cgalley(at)qcbc.org writes:
> There are TWO versions of rivnuts; keyed and non-keyed.
Cy-
There are steel rivnuts (maybe Olander has them) that work much better than
the aluminum ones that are carried by ACS.
-GV (RV-6A N1GV 572hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Match drilling etc. |
> I was led to understand that one of the purposes of match drilling was to stress
relieve the hole after punching.
I was told by an engineer from Van's that punching work hardens the material
around the hole, and match drilling is necessary to removed the work hardened
material so that the part has acceptable fatigue life. He said Van's had
consistently found fatigue cracks when they stress tested parts that had been
assembled withouth match drilling the holes.
Tedd McHenry
RV-6 wings
Surrey, BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Match drilling etc. |
Finally some common sense in the answer and approach! This is basically
my thoughts and why I asked the question in the first place. Thanks.
Dick Tasker, 90573
Rob W M Shipley wrote:
>--> RV9-List message posted by: "Rob W M Shipley"
>
>"Gary" Why do you guys want to second-guess the experts in sheet metal aircraft construction,
and the tool and die makers? Van's has made itself clear on this point
in the manual. The proceedures and fit are the way they are for good reasons,
which have been discussed (beat to death) on the list. Check the archives.
>If it is too much work for you to match drill, I dont see how you will get very
far in the construction of an RV.
>There was another long thread on the RV list about skipping deburring. It amazes
me. Why not just do it right? It is not difficult.
>
>This is a little simplistic and follows the just do it this way and it'll be allright
philosophy. It's true that planes have been built this way for a very
long time and the results are inarguably satisfactory. A little research, however
will tell you that mil spec requirements do not allow more than .003 oversize
for the hole to be riveted. A little more checking will show that the method
suggested by Vans (and others) gives a hole with about .008 to .012 oversize
depending upon the gauge of metal used.
>I am well aware that many builders and indeed I believe that Vans also have tried
the dimple without drilling approach. Vans will not approve this since an
adequate period of time hasn't passed since this practice has become common practice.
In other words the long term results aren't known.
>Since no one makes a dimple die in #41 or perhaps #42 the enlargement of the hole
beyond the mil spec recommendation has to continue. A compromise that I have
used is to match drill with a #41 drill this will reduce the slop to .005
- .008.
>Two further points. 1) I was led to understand that one of the purposes of match
drilling was to stress relieve the hole after punching. Close examination
of the hole with a high power lens after drilling might give cause for more thought
regarding this. 2) The rivet will expand to fill the hole so some degree
of slop will be taken care of. No need to be too anal!
>I suspect without any proof that simply deburring and dimpling the thin parts
is OK. (This is not an endorsement of the practice. You decide). I am fairly
sure, again without proof that using a #41 drill for the match drilling will
get you closer to mil spec. (This is not an endorsement of the practice. You
decide). Further if you do it the recommended way even if this isn't mil spec
it's going to work.
>Do some tests. Talk to everyone you can. Make your own evaluation
>I wish lots of luck with your project. Try and do something each day and you
WILL FINISH AND HAVE YOUR OWN PLANE.
>Fly safe.
>Rob
>Rob W M Shipley.
>RV9A fuselage. N919RV resvd.
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "flyseaplane" <flyseaplane(at)netzero.net> |
| Subject: | Bugbear virus came from RV-8 list... |
Hello Gene Smith,
Yes, I did determine the Bugbear virus came from the RV-8 list as well. The
sender was "Sally and George" about cabin heat. I tried to send them an
e-mail - it came back as undeliverable. It was an Australian e-mail address.
YAY for Norton!! I can't believe how well it works!
Later all,
Linc
-------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | riveting discussion |
Guys-
As I was reading through yet another day's worth of discussion on drilling or
not drilling for rivets, it occurred to me yet again how much I LOVE this
list!
Thank You, Matt Dralle, for providing a discussion group for all of us
geniuses and knotheads with our competing knot-headed and brilliant ideas and
theories to air these things out together!
This has been the best, and the best-mannered, thread on the list in a while!
Keep going group! I know we'll NEVER agree, but we sure will air it out!
Ed (nobody's daisy!) Winne
RV9A
Hershey PA
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | riveting discussion |
Guys-
As I was reading through yet another day's worth of discussion on drilling or
not drilling for rivets, it occurred to me yet again how much I LOVE this
list!
Thank You, Matt Dralle, for providing a discussion group for all of us
geniuses and knotheads with our competing knot-headed and brilliant ideas and
theories to air these things out together!
This has been the best, and the best-mannered, thread on the list in a while!
Keep going group! I know we'll NEVER agree, but we sure will air it out!
Ed (nobody's daisy!) Winne
RV9A
Hershey PA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steve Semenuk <shsrv6a(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Digital Elec. Intl. Instruments for Sale |
In need of cash and a simpler panel, I am selling at a
loss the following. Brand new, never
installed or used, still in original boxes (opened
only to inventory) Electronics International
instruments as a package only. Purchased from Vans
earlier this year. All necessary sensors and
transducers, wires, etc. are included.
First $3550 and they're yours, including shipping. You
won't find them for less anywhere:
1) UBG-16 CHT/EGT bar graph including 4 cht/4egt
probes and 1 OAT probe. Room for
7 other temperature/parameter readings.
2) FP-5L Fuel flow and pressure with GPS interface to
calculate fuel necessary to destination
3) R-1 RPM including flight time
4) OPT-1 Oil pressure and temp
5) M-1 Manifold pressure
6) VA-1 Volt/Amp with 50 Amp external shunt
7) FL-2 Dual fuel level for resistance (standard
float) senders
Steve Semenuk
shsrv6a(at)yahoo.com
RV-6A finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <etech(at)ucnsb.net> |
| Subject: | Free Panel Layout, No Obligation |
Hello Everyone!!
We here at Electronic Technologies in New Smyrna Beach Florida would like to offer you a free panel layout with no obligations at all. We can show you what your panel could or will look like. All ready have a panel and just need some equipment? We can sell you radios and other equipment at great prices because we are OEM with many manufacturers including Garmin, UPS Aviation Technologies/Apollo, BF Goodrich, Bose, Vision Microsystems, Electronics International, Chelton Flight Systems, TruTrak Flight Systems, PS Engineering, Kelly Manufacturing, Mid Continent, United Instruments and many others. We are also providing Four Winds Aircraft ( www.fourwindsaircraft.com ) with all of their panels, including their prototype panel. Just need a radio stack built? We can do that to!!! Want to build it yourself? We can provide you with all the wire, labels, equipment, wiring diagrams or anything else you need. Please visit our website, www.electronictechnologies.net , or email us at etech(at)ucnsb.net . You can also give us a call at the number below. Thanks a lot
Rick Case
Electronic Technologies
1501 Airway Circle
New Smyrna Beach, FL32168
(386) 426-1213
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
Didn't know that there were steel rivnuts! Maybe that's good to know. I am
just biased and like nut plates. I would think it would take a rather husky
tool to pull a steel rivnut.
Cy Galley, TC - Chair, Emergency Aircraft Repair, Oshkosh
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
Always looking for articles for the Experimenter
----- Original Message -----
From: <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Rivnut tool
>
> In a message dated 10/24/2002 2:16:34 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
> cgalley(at)qcbc.org writes:
>
> > There are TWO versions of rivnuts; keyed and non-keyed.
>
> Cy-
>
> There are steel rivnuts (maybe Olander has them) that work much better
than
> the aluminum ones that are carried by ACS.
>
> -GV (RV-6A N1GV 572hrs)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Bugbear virus came from RV-8 list... |
Bottom line is that you CAN NOT tell where the virus came from! That's part
of what it does is create a from address. See below from the McAffee site:
==========================
W32/Bugbear@MM Help Center
W32/Bugbear@MM is rated as MEDIUM RISK FOR HOME AND CORPORATE USERS. This
mass-mailing worm attempts to send itself to email addresses found on an
infected system. It also spreads through open network shares and has the
ability to send print jobs to printers found on an infected network.
Once the virus is run, it will attempt to disable various security products,
including many forms of anti-virus and personal firewall software. It will
also attempt to install a backdoor trojan that will allow a hacker access to
the infected PC.
Update 10/07/2002
W32/Bugbear@MM does not contain a bear icon, but rather a generic icon
typically associated with EXE files, as shown on the left.
A new version of the JDBGMGR.EXE hoax is circulating, which is tricking
users into deleting a file that uses a bear icon. This file, JDBGMGR.EXE, is
not related to the W32/Bugbear@MM virus.
PAYLOAD - What can this virus do?
This virus spreads via email and via network shares. It makes use of the
Incorrect MIME Header Can Cause IE to Execute E-mail Attachment
vulnerability in Microsoft Internet Explorer (v 5.01 or 5.5 without SP2).
Simply opening or previewing an infected message in a vulnerable email
reader can result in infection.
This virus can "spoof" the "from" field, by combining random elements to
form a fake "from" address.
Possible message subject lines include the following (however, other random
subject lines are also possible):
Found
150 FREE Bonus!
25 merchants and rising
Announcement
bad news
CALL FOR INFORMATION!
click on this!
Correction of errors
Cows
Daily Email Reminder
empty account
fantastic
free shipping!
Get 8 FREE issues - no risk!
Get a FREE gift!
Greets!
Hello!
history screen
hotmail.
I need help about script
Interesting
Introduction
its easy
Just a reminder
Lost
Market Update Report
Membership Confirmation
My eBay ads
New bonus in your cash account
New Contests
new reading
News
Payment notices
Please Help
Report
SCAM alert
Sponsors needed
Stats
Today Only
Tools For Your Online Business
update
various
Warning!
Your Gift
Your News Alert
The message body varies widely. It is likely that the virus takes material
from infected systems and places it within the message.
The attachment name also varies. It is common for the attachment name to
contain a double-extension (ie. .doc.pif), but this may not display on all
systems.
Once the machine is infected, the worm will attempt to disable security
software, including many types of anti-virus and firewall protection. It
will also try to install a backdoor trojan that can capture what the user
types, including sensitive information such as passwords. The trojan will
also allow an attacker to upload files from the infected system, download
files onto the system, run executable files and stop processes from running.
Infected systems may send print jobs to all network printers.
Click here for further details and information.
DETECTION AND REMOVAL - How can I detect and remove this virus?
AVERT has released a removal tool to assist infected users with this virus.
Users should check for updates now.
Additional Windows ME/XP removal considerations
Current McAfee.com VirusScan and Clinic users, update your virus protection.
New McAfee.com VirusScan Online users, subscribe to VirusScan Online.
Retail McAfee VirusScan users, get the latest DAT file to detect and clean
this virus.
Evaluate your PC's security vulnerability with the McAfee.com
SecurityCenter, a free set of must-have security services that allows
simplified access to McAfee.com's world-class managed security products.
Download SecurityCenter now.
==========================
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of flyseaplane
Subject: RV-List: Bugbear virus came from RV-8 list...
Hello Gene Smith,
Yes, I did determine the Bugbear virus came from the RV-8 list as well. The
sender was "Sally and George" about cabin heat. I tried to send them an
e-mail - it came back as undeliverable. It was an Australian e-mail address.
YAY for Norton!! I can't believe how well it works!
Later all,
Linc
-------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Brown" <nightmare(at)adelphia.net> |
Hi Gang!
I recently purchased an RV-6 and it came with a very battered POH that was for
a RV-6A. Does anyone have a website that I could download a RV-6 handbook? If
not a website, then maybe a copy of someone's -6 POH. I'm about ready to do an
annual.
Thanks
Paul
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wiethe, Philip (P.J.)" <pwiethe(at)ford.com> |
| Subject: | Match drilling Etc. |
> I was led to understand that one of the purposes of match drilling was to stress
relieve the hole after punching. I was told by an engineer from Van's that
punching work hardens the material around the hole, and match drilling is necessary
to removed the work hardened material so that the part has acceptable fatigue
life. He said Van's had consistently found fatigue cracks when they stress
tested parts that had been assembled withouth match drilling the holes.
I'm don't think this really holds much weight, as the dimpling process itself results
in a much greater plastic deformation
of the aluminum around the rivet hole than the punching process does. This means
the dimpled metal will have been
work hardened to a greater extent than the small area around the circumference
of the hole.
Phil
8A wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Whitman" <wyvern1(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV4-List: Bugbear virus came from RV-8 list... |
This may be of interest
Chuck,
You've swallowed one of the better hoaxes pulled off recently (although it
is
quite old by now).
Before you do anything, check out the following website:
http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/jdbgmgr.exe.file.hoax.html
----- Original Message -----
From: "flyseaplane" <flyseaplane(at)netzero.net>
Subject: RV4-List: Bugbear virus came from RV-8 list...
> --> RV4-List message posted by: "flyseaplane"
>
> Hello Gene Smith,
>
> Yes, I did determine the Bugbear virus came from the RV-8 list as well.
The
> sender was "Sally and George" about cabin heat. I tried to send them an
> e-mail - it came back as undeliverable. It was an Australian e-mail
address.
>
> YAY for Norton!! I can't believe how well it works!
>
> Later all,
> Linc
>
>
> -------------------------------------------
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Whitman" <wyvern1(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV4-List: Someone from the RV list is sending me a virus... |
FYI from another source
Chuck,
You've swallowed one of the better hoaxes pulled off recently (although it
is
quite old by now).
Before you do anything, check out the following website:
http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/jdbgmgr.exe.file.hoax.html
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene Smith" <esmith6(at)satx.rr.com>
Subject: Re: RV4-List: Someone from the RV list is sending me a virus...
> --> RV4-List message posted by: "Gene Smith"
>
> Linc,
> "Bugbear Virus" came from the RV-8 list......I got it this a.m...You
> are right about the Norton system, it expunged it
> immediately......CHEERS!!!...It seems to be a good
> system......CHEERS!!!!!!..........Gene Smith.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "flyseaplane" <flyseaplane(at)netzero.net>
> To:
> Subject: RV4-List: Someone from the RV list is sending me a virus...
>
>
> > --> RV4-List message posted by: "flyseaplane"
> >
> > Someone from the RV list has been sending me the W32Klez@mm virus for a
> few
> > days now.
> >
> > The W32.Bugbear@mm just came through today. This must be a new one.
> >
> > Folks, If you don't have Norton Anti-Virus, I strongly suggest you get
it.
> > (it's only $20 from numerous places online)
> >
> > I don't want to hear one person come back and say "Well, I have
> McAfee...."
> >
> > McAfee does not work like Norton Symantec does. I had McAfee installed
on
> my
> > Hewlitt-Packard when I bought it brand new, and the computer slowly
began
> > acting up. I installed Norton and it immediately found 28 viruses on my
> > computer. So much for McAfee. Never again!
> >
> > Anyways, I just wanted you to know that my Norton system has been
nabbing
> > these viruses from the RV list, so you all might want to go ahead and
run
> a
> > virus scan.
> > I am going to send this same message to the Harmon Rocket list, because
it
> > might be coming from there, I haven't determined which list is sending
me
> > the virus.
> >
> > Take care all, and happy building!
> > Linc
> >
> > -------------------------------------------
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Burton" <dburton(at)nwlink.com> |
| Subject: | Re: turn coordinator overhaul |
> Does anyone know what's involved in overhauling an electric turn
> coordinator, or just replacing the bearings? Is it a difficult thing
> requiring special tools or could some yokel who built himself a plane do
it?
Hi Randall,
I've worked on a lot of Chinese equipment. Some of it good, some of it bad.
They use terrible lubricants that dry out and get sticky in short order. We
don't even want to talk about their electronics.... I've had to completely
disassemble brand new Chinese made equipment to strip and relubricate it to
make it functional. I'd look at that for starters. For a fine light
lubricant use Super-Lube. It's the best thing available that I know of.
http://www.super-lube.com/index.html
For fine tools at reasonable prices and a source of Super-Lube go to:
http://www.micro-tools.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=SFNT&Store_Code=MT
Dave Burton,
RV6, wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
| From: | "Bob Japundza" <Bob.Japundza(at)realmed.com> |
FWIW, a few local RV guys here in Indy have had their pipes coated with Jet Hot,
and here's what they've told me. Two problems with doing this: your cylinder
temps will rise, and you'll get less heat from the heat muff. Other than that
they could not quantify any increase in performance, as this was done after
they were already flying. Remember, the exhaust pipes act as a heat sink for
the cylinders so if you effectively insulate them, then it is a no-brainer that
your cylinders will run hotter. Larry Vetterman vehemently recommends against
coating the exhaust pipes. A few guys have their intake pipes wrapped, and
I have a roll of wrap waiting to be installed when I get around to it. Wrapping
your induction tubes can't hurt anything. I've flown at night in a turbo'ed
Twin Comanche and you could see the exhaust pipes glow through the cowl louvres.
I imagine the pipes on our normally-aspirated engines get just as hot.
The sooty color the exhaust pipes turn after a few hours of flying sure supports
this.
About the only advantages I see to the coatings are they keep the pipes looking
pretty and they reduce cowl temperatures, at the expense of cylinder temps.
Yes, there may be many race cars etc. with coated pipes but their cylinders are
watercooled, so the ability/effectiveness of the exhaust system to carry heat
away from the cylinders is a completely different animal when it comes to air-cooled
aircraft engines.
Bob Japundza
RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying 400 hours
F1 QB under const.
House on airport under const. too.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Norman" <jnorman(at)intermapsystems.com> |
| Subject: | Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
With all due respect to Bob, not all that is said here is necessarily true.
The assumption that our non-turbo exhausts get as hot as a turbo'd exhaust
is wrong by aprox 500 degrees. Fact, not opinion. Second, the "no-brainer"
assumption that cylinders will run hotter on an engine that has ceramic
coated exhausts because the heat sink has been removed is also not exactly
true. It may "seem" to make sense, but you have to remember that the
coating is also inside the pipes. The AIR that comes out of ceramic coated
pipes is significantly hotter than the air that comes out of non-coated
pipes. This has been studied extensively over the past decade and MUCH has
been written about it. I will however, grant Bob one point... the heat
dynamics of our air-cooled engines is not the same as that seen in
water-cooled engines, and thus all that has been learned from race car
applications does not necessarily apply to Lynosours. Finally, as stated
yesterday, when I spoke to Larry Vetterman about this topic, he was NOT
opposed... just didn't have enough data to make a recommendation. Again, I
am not speaking for him, just relaying my conversation with him.
Mine are coated, and I'll bet that everybody's will be in 10 years... as
more is learned with this technology in our applications. Many RV builders
will not want to "experiment" with their experimental airplane, which of
course is the beauty of our hobby! We all can pick and choose which way to
stray from the mainstream!
jim
(with lots of opinions) in Tampa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bob Japundza
Subject: RE: RV-List: Exhaust Pipe Wrap...
FWIW, a few local RV guys here in Indy have had their pipes coated with Jet
Hot, and here's what they've told me. Two problems with doing this: your
cylinder temps will rise, and you'll get less heat from the heat muff.
Other than that they could not quantify any increase in performance, as this
was done after they were already flying. Remember, the exhaust pipes act as
a heat sink for the cylinders so if you effectively insulate them, then it
is a no-brainer that your cylinders will run hotter. Larry Vetterman
vehemently recommends against coating the exhaust pipes. A few guys have
their intake pipes wrapped, and I have a roll of wrap waiting to be
installed when I get around to it. Wrapping your induction tubes can't hurt
anything. I've flown at night in a turbo'ed Twin Comanche and you could see
the exhaust pipes glow through the cowl louvres. I imagine the pipes on our
normally-aspirated engines get just as hot. The sooty color the exhaust
pipes turn after a few!
hours of flying sure supports this.
About the only advantages I see to the coatings are they keep the pipes
looking pretty and they reduce cowl temperatures, at the expense of cylinder
temps. Yes, there may be many race cars etc. with coated pipes but their
cylinders are watercooled, so the ability/effectiveness of the exhaust
system to carry heat away from the cylinders is a completely different
animal when it comes to air-cooled aircraft engines.
Bob Japundza
RV-6 N244BJ O-360C/S flying 400 hours
F1 QB under const.
House on airport under const. too.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene Smith" <esmith6(at)satx.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV4-List: Someone from the RV list is sending me a virus... |
Hello Tim Whitman,
I don't think Linc, Chuck or myself swallowed anything in regard to
this "Bugbear" so called "hoax." The updated Norton system I have (Norton
System Works 2003), recognized that msg. from the RV-8 list as a threat, and
automatically flew all the warning flags, did the bells and whistles, and
etc., and advised me to delete the msg. immediately. In my case all I did
was delete the RV-8 msg., and the "jdbgmgr.exe" file never entered the
picture, and is still intact. I assume everyone else did the same, and
surely no one would ignore those indicators about a problem, hoax or not.
Another good source of hoax info is......Search the Web: "hoaxbusters.com"
I'm still a novice at this PC thing, but learning every day.
We appreciate your info and the Website you suggested, it was very
informative......We all have to stick together, it seems anymore we are
being attacked from every direction we turn, from cowardly jerks trying to
destroy our PC's to snipers and 757/767 missile attacks on our buildings.
We are losing our freedoms rapidly. If you have flown lately, just look at
all the TFR's we have to put up with that pop-up daily......I apologize for
the length of this
"dittie."....................CHEERS!!!!!..............Gene Smith
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Whitman" <wyvern1(at)attbi.com>
Subject: Re: RV4-List: Someone from the RV list is sending me a virus...
> --> RV4-List message posted by: "Tim Whitman"
>
> FYI from another source
>
>
> Chuck,
> You've swallowed one of the better hoaxes pulled off recently (although it
> is
> quite old by now).
> Before you do anything, check out the following website:
> http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/jdbgmgr.exe.file.hoax.html
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gene Smith" <esmith6(at)satx.rr.com>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV4-List: Someone from the RV list is sending me a virus...
>
>
> > --> RV4-List message posted by: "Gene Smith"
> >
> > Linc,
> > "Bugbear Virus" came from the RV-8 list......I got it this
a.m...You
> > are right about the Norton system, it expunged it
> > immediately......CHEERS!!!...It seems to be a good
> > system......CHEERS!!!!!!..........Gene Smith.
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "flyseaplane" <flyseaplane(at)netzero.net>
> > To:
> > Subject: RV4-List: Someone from the RV list is sending me a virus...
> >
> >
> > > --> RV4-List message posted by: "flyseaplane"
> > >
> > > Someone from the RV list has been sending me the W32Klez@mm virus for
a
> > few
> > > days now.
> > >
> > > The W32.Bugbear@mm just came through today. This must be a new one.
> > >
> > > Folks, If you don't have Norton Anti-Virus, I strongly suggest you get
> it.
> > > (it's only $20 from numerous places online)
> > >
> > > I don't want to hear one person come back and say "Well, I have
> > McAfee...."
> > >
> > > McAfee does not work like Norton Symantec does. I had McAfee installed
> on
> > my
> > > Hewlitt-Packard when I bought it brand new, and the computer slowly
> began
> > > acting up. I installed Norton and it immediately found 28 viruses on
my
> > > computer. So much for McAfee. Never again!
> > >
> > > Anyways, I just wanted you to know that my Norton system has been
> nabbing
> > > these viruses from the RV list, so you all might want to go ahead and
> run
> > a
> > > virus scan.
> > > I am going to send this same message to the Harmon Rocket list,
because
> it
> > > might be coming from there, I haven't determined which list is sending
> me
> > > the virus.
> > >
> > > Take care all, and happy building!
> > > Linc
> > >
> > > -------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Brown" <nightmare(at)adelphia.net> |
Me again!
Since I bought my airplane, I didn't get to paint the plane the colors that I wanted.
Does anybody have any thoughts as to repainting an airplane? I assume that
I would have to strip the airplane. I think I would prefer not to use chemical
strippers. I understand that you can use high pressure water as a stripper.
Does anyone know of a good painter in the south Florida area? Esp. one that is
not too expensive.
Paul
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "flamini2" <flamini2(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel injection problem |
Assuming you have looked into a possible blockage of the airflow, bird or mouse
sucked into servo intermittently (don't laugh, i have seen both) there isn't
much to go wrong with the Bendix servo. There are only 2 diaphrams in it, 1 air
and 1 fuel. i had cooked the fuel diaphram when preheating and had a similar
problem, fuel was bypassing the ball to the injectors and coming out the 4 impact
tubes and sucked into the intake pipes but even then it ran ok leaned out
to compensate for the leak. i sent it to D&G in Niles, MI (616-684-4440) and
had it rebuilt for about $1000. The parts must cost about $10 and labor about
$200 and the rest goes to the lawyers!!!
Dennis and Fran in Chicago.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RE: Exhaust Pipe Wrap... |
| From: | "Bob Japundza" <Bob.Japundza(at)realmed.com> |
vis wrong by aprox 500 degrees. Fact, not opinion. Second, the "no-brainer"
>assumption that cylinders will run hotter on an engine that has ceramic
>coated exhausts because the heat sink has been removed is also not exactly
>true.
Jim, explain to me: if two guys I fly with regulary say their cylinder head temps
went up AFTER having their pipes coated, why then did their cylinder temps
go up, if the assumption is not true?
I guarantee the upper portion of my exhaust gets red hot, because of the amount
of oxidation that is on the outside of the pipes. I've had people who I consider
engine experts tell me that they get red hot. I can also grab the exhaust
pipe ends with my bare hands 30 or so sec. after shutdown, and they're not
terribly hot. But the ends don't show any oxidation on the outside compared to
the areas just below the cylinders.
It may "seem" to make sense, but you have to remember that the
>coating is also inside the pipes. The AIR that comes out of ceramic coated
>pipes is significantly hotter than the air that comes out of non-coated
>pipes. This has been studied extensively over the past decade and MUCH has
>been written about it. I will however, grant Bob one point... the heat
>dynamics of our air-cooled engines is not the same as that seen in
>water-cooled engines, and thus all that has been learned from race car
>applications does not necessarily apply to Lynosours. Finally, as stated
>yesterday, when I spoke to Larry Vetterman about this topic, he was NOT
>opposed... just didn't have enough data to make a recommendation. Again, I
>am not speaking for him, just relaying my conversation with him.
When I talked to Larry about this a year and a half ago, he was very adament about
not having the pipes coated. His words were more to the effect of "DO NOT,
I REPEAT, DO NOT have your pipes coated." I don't know if he's changed his
opinion since then, but what he told you is very different from what he told me.
He also told me that if they were coated, repairability is an issue if one
had to TIG weld cracks. Being fairly experienced in TIG welding myself, I didn't
necessarily agree with him on this point since the coating could be sanded
off, but he is correct, it could introduce some contamination of the weld if
you didn't do a good job cleaning the coating off. But that's entirely another
subject.
>Mine are coated, and I'll bet that everybody's will be in 10 years... as
That's a bold statement to make. Not everything you read is true or unbiased.
>more is learned with this technology in our applications. Many RV builders
>will not want to "experiment" with their experimental airplane, which of
>course is the beauty of our hobby! We all can pick and choose which way to
>stray from the mainstream!
Couldn't agree more with you. While I tend to experiement, when others that have
"been there, done that" tell me it isn't worth it, I tend to listen to them.
I also had a friend show me the exhaust pipes on his RV-6 (which was being worked
on at the time) and commenting that eventually the coating burns off and you
end up with just what you started out with. And this gentleman had both the
inside and outside of the pipe coated. I'm just passing on the experiences of
some flying RVers with this stuff, and they're the ones that have told me not
to waste my money on the coatings. Not making this stuff up. At one time I
was wanting to do it myself, and have thought about doing it on the F1, still
would like to do it on the F1, but unless someone comes up with some data that
justifies the expense or an increase in engine performance (not data from someone
like Jet Hot) then I would possibly change my opinion. IMO I'd rather let
the cowl get hot than burn up an exhaust valve. But is sounds like it doesn't
matter long-term, since the stuff will eventually burn off.
I'll get some more data from these guys and report back, find out if this was the
2000 degree coating, etc.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Jory" <rickjory(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Ready-to-install Spinner |
I polished the side rails on my 8A and they are beautiful . . . I would
think polishing the spinner goof is doable. I went to an Ace Hardware . . .
they got me the right polishing compound and buffing wheel. Used these via
my die grinder. Again, this was for my canopy rails, but if they can take a
scuffed up pair of ugly pieces of aluminum and make them shine, should work
on the spinner. Good luck.
Rick Jory
----- Original Message -----
From: Randy Compton <rdcompton(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Ready-to-install Spinner
>
> > Randy, don't trash the spinner yet! Use 320 grit wet/dry paper with
> > water to sand out the trail. Once the trail is sanded out (I assume the
> > "trail" is largely cosmetic and not deep enough to create structural
> > problems) follow the 320 with 600, then 1200, then a buffing wheel with
> > polishing compound.
> >
> > Sam Buchanan
>
> No, I've still got it. I was so bummed that I didn't think about any
> "salvage" work. The marring is not very deep, so I don't think there is a
> structural problem. I'll go ahead and give sanding/scotchbriting a try.
>
> Thanks for tip!
>
> Randy Compton
> N84VF
> RV-3A
> Gulf Breeze, FL
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard Bibb" <richard.bibb(at)verizon.net> |
Ok I screwed up.
In trying to get my brake mounting flange installed on the axle in my RV-4 I
managed to damage the threads slightly. But slightly is enough as the
aluminum axle nut threads aren't very tolerent and begin to strip if I try
to get it started.
How do you fix this? I assume you need a die to clean up the threads on the
axle and a tap to clean up the threads on the nut but where do you find a 1
1/4 - 16 NEF size Tap and Die?
Any other ideas?
Richard Bibb
N144KT RV-4
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
Paul:
We don't have a -6 POH, but we do have a couple of -6A POHs on our web site.
You can download them in MS Word format at modify as required.
http://www.vansairforce.org/POH/
---
Tedd McHenry
Van's Air Force
Western Canada Wing
tedd(at)vansairforce.org
www.vansairforce.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Match drilling Etc. |
> I'm don't think this really holds much weight, as the dimpling process itself
results in a much greater plastic deformation
> of the aluminum around the rivet hole than the punching process does. This means
the dimpled metal will have been
> work hardened to a greater extent than the small area around the circumference
of the hole.
Phil:
There are two problems with this opinion. First, Van's empirical evidence
refutes it. Van's specifically found that not match drilling the holes
resulted in much, much lower fatigue life, for both dimpled and non-dimpled
holes. Second, since work hardening is very much a function of plastic
deformation, and since punching involves a lot more plastic deformation than
dimpling (deformation to the point of rupture, in fact), there is also every
analytical reason to expect more work hardening with punching than with
dimpling.
Tedd McHenry
-6 wings
Surrey, BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross A. Scroggs" <rscroggs(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Axle Problem |
Richard,
Have you ever heard of a "Thread File"? they can be purchased from
several of the tool manufactures
and probably a Pep Boys or two. It is a square shaft about 1/2" square with
different thread cutters
on each side and end. Take this tool and align it with the threads on you
axle and gently slide it back
and forth. It will remove the bad thread and can harm the good ones as well
if your not careful. Just
take your time and the axle nut may thread back on.
I've had one in my tool box for years and it has saved me plenty of
times.
Ross Scroggs
Conyers, Ga.
RV-4 #3911 Tanks.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Bibb" <richard.bibb(at)verizon.net>
Subject: RV-List: Axle Problem
>
> Ok I screwed up.
>
> In trying to get my brake mounting flange installed on the axle in my RV-4
I
> managed to damage the threads slightly. But slightly is enough as the
> aluminum axle nut threads aren't very tolerent and begin to strip if I try
> to get it started.
>
> How do you fix this? I assume you need a die to clean up the threads on
the
> axle and a tap to clean up the threads on the nut but where do you find a
1
> 1/4 - 16 NEF size Tap and Die?
>
> Any other ideas?
>
> Richard Bibb
> N144KT RV-4
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sally and George" <aeronut58(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Name taken in vain...viruses |
I've seen our name taken in vain several times as the originators of a
Bugbear virus on the RV-8 list.
Please know that: (1) my computer is protected by Norton and is swept clean
frequently. (2) I sent a legitimate message re: cabin heat quite some time
ago. Based on several people's comments, this message may have been
forwarded or redirected with extraneous content. (3) My computer is not
now infected with any virus or worm, according to both Norton and McAfee.
George Kilishek
N888GK
>From: "Tim Whitman" <wyvern1(at)attbi.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: Re: RV4-List: Bugbear virus came from RV-8 list...
>Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 10:23:54 -0400
>
>
>This may be of interest
>
>Chuck,
>You've swallowed one of the better hoaxes pulled off recently (although it
>is
>quite old by now).
>Before you do anything, check out the following website:
>http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/jdbgmgr.exe.file.hoax.html
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "flyseaplane" <flyseaplane(at)netzero.net>
>To:
>Subject: RV4-List: Bugbear virus came from RV-8 list...
>
>
> > --> RV4-List message posted by: "flyseaplane"
> >
> > Hello Gene Smith,
> >
> > Yes, I did determine the Bugbear virus came from the RV-8 list as well.
>The
> > sender was "Sally and George" about cabin heat. I tried to send them an
> > e-mail - it came back as undeliverable. It was an Australian e-mail
>address.
> >
> > YAY for Norton!! I can't believe how well it works!
> >
> > Later all,
> > Linc
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------
> >
> >
>
>
Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN!
http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Point" <jpoint(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Tip up gas struts- the final word |
I contacted Vans about the struts. The bad news is, they don't know of any local
(autoparts) source. The good news is they agreed to send me a replacement
for free. Based on the responses I got and the archives, these struts seem to
have a high infant mortality rate, perhaps Vans got a bad batch, or they have
been sitting too long.
Jeff Point
The bottom line is, there isn't much of a price difference even if you could
find them.
Good luck. If you do come up with a part number, let us know.
Van's part number is C-690 $$22.86
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gert <gert(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Name taken in vain...viruses |
George
for what it is worth, very few people believe it was from your computer.
And yes, I got an infected email with your credentials, however, a quick
look and search showed no correlation between your email address, your
ISP and the forwarders in the infected message. They were totally
different eliminating your email address as the originator in about 10
seconds flat !!
personally, I believe throwing your, or anybody elses name, out like
this is about as low as sending deliberate viruses around. This tends to
be done by people who have no clue what they are talking about but want
to appear important.
we all know how frustrating it is to keep viruses out, but the fact
remains that if you are connected to the internet you run the chance of
catching something. Let's face it, *all* anti virus programs are retro
active. I.E.: there first needs to be an infection before an anti virus
can be made for it.
As I.T. Manager I used to track the originator if possible and would,
*privately*, inform the sender about this fact. To me that's just so
much better, and safer, in case, like here, I am wrong.
Gert
Sally and George wrote:
>
> I've seen our name taken in vain several times as the originators of a
> Bugbear virus on the RV-8 list.
>
> Please know that: (1) my computer is protected by Norton and is swept clean
> frequently. (2) I sent a legitimate message re: cabin heat quite some time
> ago. Based on several people's comments, this message may have been
> forwarded or redirected with extraneous content. (3) My computer is not
> now infected with any virus or worm, according to both Norton and McAfee.
>
> George Kilishek
> N888GK
>
>
>
>>From: "Tim Whitman" <wyvern1(at)attbi.com>
>>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>>To:
>>Subject: RV-List: Re: RV4-List: Bugbear virus came from RV-8 list...
>>Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 10:23:54 -0400
>>
>>
>>This may be of interest
>>
>>Chuck,
>>You've swallowed one of the better hoaxes pulled off recently (although it
>>is
>>quite old by now).
>>Before you do anything, check out the following website:
>>http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/jdbgmgr.exe.file.hoax.html
>>
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "flyseaplane" <flyseaplane(at)netzero.net>
>>To:
>>Subject: RV4-List: Bugbear virus came from RV-8 list...
>>
>>
>>
>>>--> RV4-List message posted by: "flyseaplane"
>>>
>>>Hello Gene Smith,
>>>
>>>Yes, I did determine the Bugbear virus came from the RV-8 list as well.
>>>
>>The
>>
>>>sender was "Sally and George" about cabin heat. I tried to send them an
>>>e-mail - it came back as undeliverable. It was an Australian e-mail
>>>
>>address.
>>
>>>YAY for Norton!! I can't believe how well it works!
>>>
>>>Later all,
>>>Linc
>>>
>>>
>>>-------------------------------------------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
> Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN!
> http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary & Carolyn Zilik <zilik(at)direcpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Axle Problem |
A small triangular file and lots of patience will fix those threads.
Gary
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
Hi Richard,
To avoid trying to find a die that big, pull out your set of jewelers files
and start filing! Easy fix, just time consuming. With a little patience
and the right miniature file, you should be able to make the threads look
brand new!
Cheers,
Stein Bruch, RV6 Minneapolis.
Grounded with the bad weather (see Paul Wellstone for what happens when
flying in this weather)!
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Richard Bibb
Subject: RV-List: Axle Problem
Ok I screwed up.
In trying to get my brake mounting flange installed on the axle in my RV-4 I
managed to damage the threads slightly. But slightly is enough as the
aluminum axle nut threads aren't very tolerent and begin to strip if I try
to get it started.
How do you fix this? I assume you need a die to clean up the threads on the
axle and a tap to clean up the threads on the nut but where do you find a 1
1/4 - 16 NEF size Tap and Die?
Any other ideas?
Richard Bibb
N144KT RV-4
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Name taken in vain...viruses |
Ditto!
I sent my email to try and educate folks that the virus had no correlation
to you and in fact probably just made the from line up.
Usually newbie's don't understand or don't know where to look to learn the
truth.
No biggie! Good luck and please keep us posted!!!!!!!!!!!
Bob Hassel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Gert
Subject: Re: RV-List: Name taken in vain...viruses
George
for what it is worth, very few people believe it was from your computer.
And yes, I got an infected email with your credentials, however, a quick
look and search showed no correlation between your email address, your
ISP and the forwarders in the infected message. They were totally
different eliminating your email address as the originator in about 10
seconds flat !!
personally, I believe throwing your, or anybody elses name, out like
this is about as low as sending deliberate viruses around. This tends to
be done by people who have no clue what they are talking about but want
to appear important.
we all know how frustrating it is to keep viruses out, but the fact
remains that if you are connected to the internet you run the chance of
catching something. Let's face it, *all* anti virus programs are retro
active. I.E.: there first needs to be an infection before an anti virus
can be made for it.
As I.T. Manager I used to track the originator if possible and would,
*privately*, inform the sender about this fact. To me that's just so
much better, and safer, in case, like here, I am wrong.
Gert
Sally and George wrote:
>
> I've seen our name taken in vain several times as the originators of a
> Bugbear virus on the RV-8 list.
>
> Please know that: (1) my computer is protected by Norton and is swept
clean
> frequently. (2) I sent a legitimate message re: cabin heat quite some
time
> ago. Based on several people's comments, this message may have been
> forwarded or redirected with extraneous content. (3) My computer is not
> now infected with any virus or worm, according to both Norton and McAfee.
>
> George Kilishek
> N888GK
>
>
>>From: "Tim Whitman" <wyvern1(at)attbi.com>
>>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>>To:
>>Subject: RV-List: Re: RV4-List: Bugbear virus came from RV-8 list...
>>Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 10:23:54 -0400
>>
>>
>>This may be of interest
>>
>>Chuck,
>>You've swallowed one of the better hoaxes pulled off recently (although it
>>is
>>quite old by now).
>>Before you do anything, check out the following website:
>>http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/jdbgmgr.exe.file.hoax.html
>>
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "flyseaplane" <flyseaplane(at)netzero.net>
>>To:
>>Subject: RV4-List: Bugbear virus came from RV-8 list...
>>
>>
>>
>>>--> RV4-List message posted by: "flyseaplane"
>>>
>>>Hello Gene Smith,
>>>
>>>Yes, I did determine the Bugbear virus came from the RV-8 list as well.
>>>
>>The
>>
>>>sender was "Sally and George" about cabin heat. I tried to send them an
>>>e-mail - it came back as undeliverable. It was an Australian e-mail
>>>
>>address.
>>
>>>YAY for Norton!! I can't believe how well it works!
>>>
>>>Later all,
>>>Linc
>>>
>>>
>>>-------------------------------------------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
> Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN!
> http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp
>
>
--
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "sdavis12" <sdavis12(at)midsouth.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Fuel Cap Engraving UPDATE |
Listers,
Most of the CAPS shipped today there were a few that didn't make the
shipping table but will be out on Monday. Thanks
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Struyk" <rv8striker(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: Fuel Cap Engraving
>
> I've been in the archives looking at the string on engraved caps. It seems
> to dead end with the loss of the individual who was doing the engraving.
> Anybody out there know where to get one's caps engraved?
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Steve Struyk, RV-8
> St. Charles MO
> N842S (Res.)
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tom Schad" <schad(at)cooke.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV8-List: RV-8 Wing
>
>
> > --> RV8-List message posted by: "Tom Schad"
> >
> > Some kind of plastic pipe is handy but I ran the wires through the wing
in
> > mine. Used some more of those plastic inserts that come with the kit.
> You
> > can get them in different sizes from Spruce. I mounted the individual
> power
> > supplies to the outside of the end rib. Cessna does the same thing with
> > their strobe power supplies. You can secure them with nuts or rivnuts.
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "by way of Matronics Technical Support <support(at)matronics.com>"
> >
> > To:
> > Subject: RV8-List: RV-8 Wing
> >
> >
> > > --> RV8-List message posted by: JamesTSherry(at)cs.com (by way of
Matronics
> > Technical Support )
> > >
> > > Hey Guys, I am installing a strobe power supply unit on each wingtip.
> Has
> > > anyone done this and where did you physically locate it(fore or aft)?
> 2nd
> > > .I would like to run a conduit through the wing. Van has located the
> hole
> > > too close to the fwd flange and also the bellcrank. I need lines for
a
> > > heated pitot tube , a landing lite and the strobe unit . Are the 2
> stock
> > > holes adequate? Thanks, Jim Sherry Boulder CO
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | riveting rudder stops |
RV-7 tailwheel tip-up. Got a question about riveting the rudder stops onto
the aft fuselage...
There are four AN426AD4 rivets on each stop, two for the front half of
F-712, two for the aft half. The aft rivets can be squeezed no
problem...plenty of access from behind. The forward rivets, however...how
have you guys set those? There's not really enough room on the stop to get
the flush rivet set (I have the swivel flush set).
I have a set that came with my C-frame which has a flat end...I could use
that with the gun in this application, I guess. Is that what most people do
in spots like this? I can't believe I haven't bumped into another riveting
situation like this, but I'm curious how you guys have done this. Probably
something ridiculously simple I'm forgetting about. 8
)
Thanks in advance,
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D (fuselage)
http://www.rvproject.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
| Subject: | Inverted oil system |
> Most of the maneuver's you'll be doing in the RV are positive anyway (Loops,
> rolls, etc..). BTW, rolls are a blast!
One thing I've often wondered about is pressure accumulators (Accu-sumps).
They used to be used on race cars, but they seem to be less common now that dry
sump systems are so common. I've long thought they'd be good for airplanes,
since they give you oil pressure during momentary pickup losses, such as you
can easily get doing aeros. Does anyone here have experience using pressure
accumulators on airplanes?
Tedd McHenry
-6 wing
Surrey, BC
________________________________________________________________________________
rv7-list(at)matronics.com, rv8-list(at)matronics.com, rv9-list(at)matronics.com,
rv10-list(at)matronics.com
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...) |
Hey RV Listers,
Okay, so I really don't mean to drag this out, but unbelievably, we have a
dead heat between "Forward" votes and "Don't Forward" votes! I had no idea
the opinion would run so close!! I've gotten a little over 100 votes so
far and it is literally a 50/50 split to the vote on which way to go. Over
the last week or so, each day I've gotten a couple of votes to Forward,
then a couple of votes to Not Forward - back and forth. With this many
people on both sides of the fence, no matter which way wins, there's gonna
be a lot of disappointed people! And I thought this vote would make it
easy for me to decide...
I'm going to keep the polls open until Sunday afternoon at 5pm pst, and
just go with the method that has the most votes - even if its just 1 or 2
votes. This is just like the Bush/Gore election; I'm down to counting
chad... You guys from Florida get your votes in! :-)
Here's how to vote - follow closely to make it easiest for me to count:
-- To Vote FORWARD --
* This means that you would like to have any messages posted to the
RV-specific lists automatically forwarded to the main RV-List.
Send an email message to: dralle(at)matronics.com
Make the SUBJECT line: "Forward"
-- To Vote DON'T FORWARD --
* This means that you don't want messages posted to the RV-specific lists
automatically forwarded to the main RV-List.
Send an email message to: dralle(at)matronics.com
Make the SUBJECT line: "Don't Forward"
If you care, here's your chance to make a difference! Get your vote in
before Sunday at 5pm pst. I'll announce the winner Sunday night...
Hey - and there's only voting one time, you guys! You know who you are... :-)
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
=============================================================================
Thanks Scott! The votes are still trickling in and its a REALLY, REALLY
close race. If you have a preference and haven't yet voted, it so close
that one or two votes could actually make the difference. PLEASE only vote
once, though! To be fair, multiple votes from the same email address will
not be counted.
Matt
At 07:07 AM 10/19/2002 Saturday, you wrote:
>
>Matt,
>
>You're doing a great job managing this.
>
>Chris
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com>
>Subject: RV-List: Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...)
>
>
> > --> RV10-List message posted by: dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle)
> >
> >
> > Kevin's right, except for the RV7, RV9, and RV10 Lists. The way its
> > been set up is when someone posts to the RV3, RV4, RV6, and RV8 Lists
> > a copy is automatically sent to the RV-List too. For some reason, the
> > 7/9/10 lists weren't configured that way; probably because I added
> > them later and forgot that about the forwarding.
> >
> > In anycase, for now I've added the forward feature the 7/9/10 Lists to
>keep
> > everything consistant.
> >
> > However, I don't have a stong preference either way, actually. I can
> > see pros and cons to each. Would people prefer the not-forwarding
> > operation? Sounds like it they might...
> >
> > So let's vote! Drop me an email at:
> >
> > dralle(at)matronics.com
> >
> > with a simple:
> >
> > "Forward"
> > or
> > "Don't Forward"
> >
> > in the Subject Line. I'll added up the votes in a couple of days and
> > announce the new method.
> >
> >
> > Matt Dralle
> > List Admin.
> >
> >
> > >--------------
> > >
> > >Gary,
> > >
> > >Sorry, I have to respectfully disagree here. I am a member of Matt's
> > >RV8-list and the RV-list. If I post a message to the RV8-list, I get
> > >two copies - one that comes from the RV8-list, and a copy that comes
> > >across on the main RV-list.
> > >
> > >I just checked my Out Box - my message to Steve was sent to the
> > >RV4-List only. The copy you replied too seems to have come from the
> > >main RV-List.
> > >
> > >Search the RV-List archives for the text " New Specific RV Lists Auto
> > >Forwarded to RV-List" (don't include the quote marks. You'll find
> > >Matt's description of how the system works. I believe it causes
> > >confusion, because a lot of people on the main RV-List don't
> > >understand that they need study the original message to see where it
> > >originated, and send their response to the message to the correct
> > >list. Otherwise, the original poster may not see the response. But,
> > >Matt likes it the way it is, and these are his lists.
> > >
> > >Kevin
> > >
> > >>
> > >>Kevin.....actually, messages posted to model-specific Matronics
> > >>lists do not automatically post to the RV list. You can post to any
> > >>list or combination of lists you like, but you have to send it to
> > >>the ones you want it to show up on.
> > >>
> > >>Gary
> > >>
> > >>From: Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com>
> > >>Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: RV4-List: Bleeding Brakes
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>Steve,
> > >>
> > >>.................. Any message posted to one of the RV model specific
> > >>list also gets posted to the main RV List. Any responses to the copy
> > >>of the message that goes to the main RV List only go to the main RV
> > >>List - they don't go back to the RV model specific list, ...............
> > >
> > >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Haywire" <haywire(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Torx Head Screws |
Back in July I bought 500 Torx 100 degree, flat head, T-20 screws from
MicroFastners. These were manufactured at the request of RV-listers. I'm
very happy with them, however tests by another list member showed that due
to the superior grip of the drive it was possible to over torque the screw
until the head snapped off. I don't feel this to be an issue as his same
tests showed them to also be of superior strength to the Phillips screws. A
little common sense when installing these, precludes any chance of over
torquing them.
However, John Fleischer of Micro Fasteners has automatically sent 500
replacement screws with the smaller T-15 head. He has verified that it is
not possible to torque this smaller drive to failure. While I didn't feel
that it was necessary, I was quite pleased to find these in my mailbox this
afternoon. As before, I feel that they look real sharp and will make future
maintenance much easier (no more fussing with them #?!@??!!#! Phillips).
Since I have them I will use the new T-15's in all structural applications,
but will use the T-20's for non-structural applications.
I'd just like to recommend Micro Fasteners to anybody who is considering
upgrading their screws. Customer service like this deserves our support.
S. Todd Bartrim
Turbo 13B rotary powered
RV-9endurance (FWF)
C-FSTB
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Karie Daniel" <karied4(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Rivet measuring question |
I would like to make sure that I'm using the shop head rivet gage set correctly
and I'm hoping someone can help. I just started riveting the hz stabilizer for
my RV-7A and the plans call for using a AN470AD4-6 to rivet HS-600PP to the
HS-603PP.
Someone might assume that you would use the blue -6 gage but I know that if you
pounded a AN470AD4-6 rivet to the size of the -6 blue gage you basically wouldn't
have a shop it, you would have a pancake. It looks more like the gold -4
gage is the correct gage to measure a AN470AD4-6 rivet.
According to the rivet gage instructions the shop head should "fit" in the hole
(some rivets just do and some are slightly larger) using the -4 gauge and this
is what looks correct. The depth should be the same as the notched end of the
gauge. Most are at are under the notch meaning the notch will just slide over
the rivet. Am I using the correct gauge here?
Why this is confusing is that the HS-413PP hinge brackets call for a AN470AD4-5
rivet. It looks like this would be measured with the red -5 gauge.
I took a very valuable builders class a few weeks ago but we were given gauges
that were made by the instructor and we really didn't get into using these types
of gauges (the ones you get from Avery or other tool distributors).
Karie Daniel
Maple Valley, WA.
RV-7A (empennage)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Michael J. Veth" <vethm(at)vsrtechnology.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet measuring question |
Karie,
The gauge size is based on the width of the rivet. With the RV kits, you'll only
every see the AD3 and AD4 sizes, so you only need to use the silver and gold
rivet gauge. The way I use the gauge is as follows: the shop head of the rivet
should just barely NOT fit into the hole and the height should just be barely
higher that the depth on the gauge. Don't
worry too much if it's not exactly right, folks on the list have done strength
tests with slightly overdriven and slightly underdriven rivets and you don't lose
much strength at all. I think (although others may / will disagree) that
unless the rivet is REALLY bad, it is probably more harmful to try drilling it
out -- sometimes that can make your problems
worse. Of course, that's what makes homebuilding cool -- you get to make the ultimate
decision!
Also, there is another rivet gauge to help you determine the proper length. It
looks like a little square with notches in the corner. Pick the rivet diameter
(AD3 / AD4) etc, put in your rivet and the amount sticking out of the hole
should match with the length of the notch on the gauge.
I also made a little cheatsheet that I use.
Good luck.
Mike
RV-8A Wings
Dayton, OH
Karie Daniel wrote:
>
> I would like to make sure that I'm using the shop head rivet gage set correctly
and I'm hoping someone can help. I just started riveting the hz stabilizer
for my RV-7A and the plans call for using a AN470AD4-6 to rivet HS-600PP to the
HS-603PP.
>
> Someone might assume that you would use the blue -6 gage but I know that if you
pounded a AN470AD4-6 rivet to the size of the -6 blue gage you basically wouldn't
have a shop it, you would have a pancake. It looks more like the gold -4
gage is the correct gage to measure a AN470AD4-6 rivet.
>
> According to the rivet gage instructions the shop head should "fit" in the hole
(some rivets just do and some are slightly larger) using the -4 gauge and this
is what looks correct. The depth should be the same as the notched end of
the gauge. Most are at are under the notch meaning the notch will just slide over
the rivet. Am I using the correct gauge here?
>
> Why this is confusing is that the HS-413PP hinge brackets call for a AN470AD4-5
rivet. It looks like this would be measured with the red -5 gauge.
>
> I took a very valuable builders class a few weeks ago but we were given gauges
that were made by the instructor and we really didn't get into using these types
of gauges (the ones you get from Avery or other tool distributors).
>
> Karie Daniel
> Maple Valley, WA.
> RV-7A (empennage)
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Ford" <dford(at)michweb.net> |
| Subject: | wiring & exhaust temps |
I'm wondering what a minimum safe distance would be for wiring that is close to
the exhaust crossover. For example alternator B lead, field wire. But I also
have a sensor on my throttle body with wiring that ends up 1" away from the
exhaust. Should I wrap with heat wrap? Install heat shield & clamp? Actually
that would put heat shield right next to wiring and heat transfer through shield
would bring some heat to wiring.
Dave Ford
RV6
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Jordan" <jrjordan(at)mn.rr.com> |
forward
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Dudley <rhdudley(at)att.net> |
Matt Dralle wrote:
>
> --> RV6-List message posted by: Matt Dralle
>
> Hey RV Listers,
>
> Okay, so I really don't mean to drag this out, but unbelievably, we have a
> dead heat between "Forward" votes and "Don't Forward" votes! I had no idea
> the opinion would run so close!! I've gotten a little over 100 votes so
> far and it is literally a 50/50 split to the vote on which way to go. Over
> the last week or so, each day I've gotten a couple of votes to Forward,
> then a couple of votes to Not Forward - back and forth. With this many
> people on both sides of the fence, no matter which way wins, there's gonna
> be a lot of disappointed people! And I thought this vote would make it
> easy for me to decide...
>
> I'm going to keep the polls open until Sunday afternoon at 5pm pst, and
> just go with the method that has the most votes - even if its just 1 or 2
> votes. This is just like the Bush/Gore election; I'm down to counting
> chad... You guys from Florida get your votes in! :-)
>
> Here's how to vote - follow closely to make it easiest for me to count:
>
> -- To Vote FORWARD --
>
> * This means that you would like to have any messages posted to the
> RV-specific lists automatically forwarded to the main RV-List.
>
> Send an email message to: dralle(at)matronics.com
>
> Make the SUBJECT line: "Forward"
>
> -- To Vote DON'T FORWARD --
>
> * This means that you don't want messages posted to the RV-specific lists
> automatically forwarded to the main RV-List.
>
> Send an email message to: dralle(at)matronics.com
>
> Make the SUBJECT line: "Don't Forward"
>
> If you care, here's your chance to make a difference! Get your vote in
> before Sunday at 5pm pst. I'll announce the winner Sunday night...
>
> Hey - and there's only voting one time, you guys! You know who you are... :-)
>
> Matt Dralle
> Email List Admin.
>
> =============================================================================
>
> Thanks Scott! The votes are still trickling in and its a REALLY, REALLY
> close race. If you have a preference and haven't yet voted, it so close
> that one or two votes could actually make the difference. PLEASE only vote
> once, though! To be fair, multiple votes from the same email address will
> not be counted.
>
> Matt
>
> At 07:07 AM 10/19/2002 Saturday, you wrote:
> >
> >Matt,
> >
> >You're doing a great job managing this.
> >
> >Chris
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com>
> >Subject: RV-List: Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...)
> >
> >
> > > --> RV10-List message posted by: dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle)
> > >
> > >
> > > Kevin's right, except for the RV7, RV9, and RV10 Lists. The way its
> > > been set up is when someone posts to the RV3, RV4, RV6, and RV8 Lists
> > > a copy is automatically sent to the RV-List too. For some reason, the
> > > 7/9/10 lists weren't configured that way; probably because I added
> > > them later and forgot that about the forwarding.
> > >
> > > In anycase, for now I've added the forward feature the 7/9/10 Lists to
> >keep
> > > everything consistant.
> > >
> > > However, I don't have a stong preference either way, actually. I can
> > > see pros and cons to each. Would people prefer the not-forwarding
> > > operation? Sounds like it they might...
> > >
> > > So let's vote! Drop me an email at:
> > >
> > > dralle(at)matronics.com
> > >
> > > with a simple:
> > >
> > > "Forward"
> > > or
> > > "Don't Forward"
> > >
> > > in the Subject Line. I'll added up the votes in a couple of days and
> > > announce the new method.
> > >
> > >
> > > Matt Dralle
> > > List Admin.
> > >
> > >
> > > >--------------
> > > >
> > > >Gary,
> > > >
> > > >Sorry, I have to respectfully disagree here. I am a member of Matt's
> > > >RV8-list and the RV-list. If I post a message to the RV8-list, I get
> > > >two copies - one that comes from the RV8-list, and a copy that comes
> > > >across on the main RV-list.
> > > >
> > > >I just checked my Out Box - my message to Steve was sent to the
> > > >RV4-List only. The copy you replied too seems to have come from the
> > > >main RV-List.
> > > >
> > > >Search the RV-List archives for the text " New Specific RV Lists Auto
> > > >Forwarded to RV-List" (don't include the quote marks. You'll find
> > > >Matt's description of how the system works. I believe it causes
> > > >confusion, because a lot of people on the main RV-List don't
> > > >understand that they need study the original message to see where it
> > > >originated, and send their response to the message to the correct
> > > >list. Otherwise, the original poster may not see the response. But,
> > > >Matt likes it the way it is, and these are his lists.
> > > >
> > > >Kevin
> > > >
> > > >>
> > > >>Kevin.....actually, messages posted to model-specific Matronics
> > > >>lists do not automatically post to the RV list. You can post to any
> > > >>list or combination of lists you like, but you have to send it to
> > > >>the ones you want it to show up on.
> > > >>
> > > >>Gary
> > > >>
> > > >>From: Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com>
> > > >>Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: RV4-List: Bleeding Brakes
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>Steve,
> > > >>
> > > >>.................. Any message posted to one of the RV model specific
> > > >>list also gets posted to the main RV List. Any responses to the copy
> > > >>of the message that goes to the main RV List only go to the main RV
> > > >>List - they don't go back to the RV model specific list, ...............
> > > >
> > > >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | barry pote <barrypote(at)comcast.net> |
Richard Dudley wrote:
>
>
> Matt Dralle wrote:
> >
> > --> RV6-List message posted by: Matt Dralle
> >
> > Hey RV Listers,
> >
> > Okay, so I really don't mean to drag this out, but unbelievably, we have a
> > dead heat between "Forward" votes and "Don't Forward" votes! I had no idea
> > the opinion would run so close!! I've gotten a little over 100 votes so
> > far and it is literally a 50/50 split to the vote on which way to go. Over
> > the last week or so, each day I've gotten a couple of votes to Forward,
> > then a couple of votes to Not Forward - back and forth. With this many
> > people on both sides of the fence, no matter which way wins, there's gonna
> > be a lot of disappointed people! And I thought this vote would make it
> > easy for me to decide...
> >
> > I'm going to keep the polls open until Sunday afternoon at 5pm pst, and
> > just go with the method that has the most votes - even if its just 1 or 2
> > votes. This is just like the Bush/Gore election; I'm down to counting
> > chad... You guys from Florida get your votes in! :-)
> >
> > Here's how to vote - follow closely to make it easiest for me to count:
> >
> > -- To Vote FORWARD --
> >
> > * This means that you would like to have any messages posted to the
> > RV-specific lists automatically forwarded to the main RV-List.
> >
> > Send an email message to: dralle(at)matronics.com
> >
> > Make the SUBJECT line: "Forward"
> >
> > -- To Vote DON'T FORWARD --
> >
> > * This means that you don't want messages posted to the RV-specific lists
> > automatically forwarded to the main RV-List.
> >
> > Send an email message to: dralle(at)matronics.com
> >
> > Make the SUBJECT line: "Don't Forward"
> >
> > If you care, here's your chance to make a difference! Get your vote in
> > before Sunday at 5pm pst. I'll announce the winner Sunday night...
> >
> > Hey - and there's only voting one time, you guys! You know who you are...
:-)
> >
> > Matt Dralle
> > Email List Admin.
> >
> > =============================================================================
> >
> > Thanks Scott! The votes are still trickling in and its a REALLY, REALLY
> > close race. If you have a preference and haven't yet voted, it so close
> > that one or two votes could actually make the difference. PLEASE only vote
> > once, though! To be fair, multiple votes from the same email address will
> > not be counted.
> >
> > Matt
> >
> > At 07:07 AM 10/19/2002 Saturday, you wrote:
> > >
> > >Matt,
> > >
> > >You're doing a great job managing this.
> > >
> > >Chris
> > >----- Original Message -----
> > >From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com>
> > >Subject: RV-List: Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...)
> > >
> > >
> > > > --> RV10-List message posted by: dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Kevin's right, except for the RV7, RV9, and RV10 Lists. The way its
> > > > been set up is when someone posts to the RV3, RV4, RV6, and RV8 Lists
> > > > a copy is automatically sent to the RV-List too. For some reason, the
> > > > 7/9/10 lists weren't configured that way; probably because I added
> > > > them later and forgot that about the forwarding.
> > > >
> > > > In anycase, for now I've added the forward feature the 7/9/10 Lists to
> > >keep
> > > > everything consistant.
> > > >
> > > > However, I don't have a stong preference either way, actually. I can
> > > > see pros and cons to each. Would people prefer the not-forwarding
> > > > operation? Sounds like it they might...
> > > >
> > > > So let's vote! Drop me an email at:
> > > >
> > > > dralle(at)matronics.com
> > > >
> > > > with a simple:
> > > >
> > > > "Forward"
> > > > or
> > > > "Don't Forward"
> > > >
> > > > in the Subject Line. I'll added up the votes in a couple of days and
> > > > announce the new method.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Matt Dralle
> > > > List Admin.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >--------------
> > > > >
> > > > >Gary,
> > > > >
> > > > >Sorry, I have to respectfully disagree here. I am a member of Matt's
> > > > >RV8-list and the RV-list. If I post a message to the RV8-list, I get
> > > > >two copies - one that comes from the RV8-list, and a copy that comes
> > > > >across on the main RV-list.
> > > > >
> > > > >I just checked my Out Box - my message to Steve was sent to the
> > > > >RV4-List only. The copy you replied too seems to have come from the
> > > > >main RV-List.
> > > > >
> > > > >Search the RV-List archives for the text " New Specific RV Lists Auto
> > > > >Forwarded to RV-List" (don't include the quote marks. You'll find
> > > > >Matt's description of how the system works. I believe it causes
> > > > >confusion, because a lot of people on the main RV-List don't
> > > > >understand that they need study the original message to see where it
> > > > >originated, and send their response to the message to the correct
> > > > >list. Otherwise, the original poster may not see the response. But,
> > > > >Matt likes it the way it is, and these are his lists.
> > > > >
> > > > >Kevin
> > > > >
> > > > >>
> > > > >>Kevin.....actually, messages posted to model-specific Matronics
> > > > >>lists do not automatically post to the RV list. You can post to any
> > > > >>list or combination of lists you like, but you have to send it to
> > > > >>the ones you want it to show up on.
> > > > >>
> > > > >>Gary
> > > > >>
> > > > >>From: Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com>
> > > > >>Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: RV4-List: Bleeding Brakes
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>Steve,
> > > > >>
> > > > >>.................. Any message posted to one of the RV model specific
> > > > >>list also gets posted to the main RV List. Any responses to the copy
> > > > >>of the message that goes to the main RV List only go to the main RV
> > > > >>List - they don't go back to the RV model specific list, ...............
> > > > >
> > > > >
> >
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Torx Head Screws |
I also receive replacement #8 screws recently. Just FYI, they now offer
numbers 4, 6 & 10 screws too.
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Haywire
> Sent: Saturday, October 26, 2002 1:28 AM
> To: Rv9-List@Matronics. Com
> Subject: RV-List: Torx Head Screws
>
>
>
> Back in July I bought 500 Torx 100 degree, flat head,
> T-20 screws from MicroFastners. These were manufactured at
> the request of RV-listers. I'm very happy with them, however
> tests by another list member showed that due to the superior
> grip of the drive it was possible to over torque the screw
> until the head snapped off. I don't feel this to be an issue
> as his same tests showed them to also be of superior strength
> to the Phillips screws. A little common sense when installing
> these, precludes any chance of over torquing them.
> However, John Fleischer of Micro Fasteners has
> automatically sent 500 replacement screws with the smaller
> T-15 head. He has verified that it is not possible to torque
> this smaller drive to failure. While I didn't feel that it
> was necessary, I was quite pleased to find these in my
> mailbox this afternoon. As before, I feel that they look real
> sharp and will make future maintenance much easier (no more
> fussing with them #?!@??!!#! Phillips). Since I have them I
> will use the new T-15's in all structural applications, but
> will use the T-20's for non-structural applications.
> I'd just like to recommend Micro Fasteners to anybody
> who is considering upgrading their screws. Customer service
> like this deserves our support.
>
> S. Todd Bartrim
> Turbo 13B rotary powered
> RV-9endurance (FWF)
> C-FSTB
> http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RE: RV9-List: Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...) |
I vote Not to forward. I belong to both lists as well and don't like the
double messages...
Bob Hassel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv9-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Matt Dralle
rv6-list(at)matronics.com; rv7-list(at)matronics.com; rv8-list(at)matronics.com;
rv9-list(at)matronics.com; rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RV9-List: Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...)
--> RV9-List message posted by: Matt Dralle
Hey RV Listers,
Okay, so I really don't mean to drag this out, but unbelievably, we have a
dead heat between "Forward" votes and "Don't Forward" votes! I had no idea
the opinion would run so close!! I've gotten a little over 100 votes so
far and it is literally a 50/50 split to the vote on which way to go. Over
the last week or so, each day I've gotten a couple of votes to Forward,
then a couple of votes to Not Forward - back and forth. With this many
people on both sides of the fence, no matter which way wins, there's gonna
be a lot of disappointed people! And I thought this vote would make it
easy for me to decide...
I'm going to keep the polls open until Sunday afternoon at 5pm pst, and
just go with the method that has the most votes - even if its just 1 or 2
votes. This is just like the Bush/Gore election; I'm down to counting
chad... You guys from Florida get your votes in! :-)
Here's how to vote - follow closely to make it easiest for me to count:
-- To Vote FORWARD --
* This means that you would like to have any messages posted to the
RV-specific lists automatically forwarded to the main RV-List.
Send an email message to: dralle(at)matronics.com
Make the SUBJECT line: "Forward"
-- To Vote DON'T FORWARD --
* This means that you don't want messages posted to the RV-specific lists
automatically forwarded to the main RV-List.
Send an email message to: dralle(at)matronics.com
Make the SUBJECT line: "Don't Forward"
If you care, here's your chance to make a difference! Get your vote in
before Sunday at 5pm pst. I'll announce the winner Sunday night...
Hey - and there's only voting one time, you guys! You know who you are...
:-)
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
===========================================================================
=
Thanks Scott! The votes are still trickling in and its a REALLY, REALLY
close race. If you have a preference and haven't yet voted, it so close
that one or two votes could actually make the difference. PLEASE only vote
once, though! To be fair, multiple votes from the same email address will
not be counted.
Matt
At 07:07 AM 10/19/2002 Saturday, you wrote:
>
>Matt,
>
>You're doing a great job managing this.
>
>Chris
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com>
>Subject: RV-List: Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...)
>
>
> > --> RV10-List message posted by: dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle)
> >
> >
> > Kevin's right, except for the RV7, RV9, and RV10 Lists. The way its
> > been set up is when someone posts to the RV3, RV4, RV6, and RV8 Lists
> > a copy is automatically sent to the RV-List too. For some reason, the
> > 7/9/10 lists weren't configured that way; probably because I added
> > them later and forgot that about the forwarding.
> >
> > In anycase, for now I've added the forward feature the 7/9/10 Lists to
>keep
> > everything consistant.
> >
> > However, I don't have a stong preference either way, actually. I can
> > see pros and cons to each. Would people prefer the not-forwarding
> > operation? Sounds like it they might...
> >
> > So let's vote! Drop me an email at:
> >
> > dralle(at)matronics.com
> >
> > with a simple:
> >
> > "Forward"
> > or
> > "Don't Forward"
> >
> > in the Subject Line. I'll added up the votes in a couple of days and
> > announce the new method.
> >
> >
> > Matt Dralle
> > List Admin.
> >
> >
> > >--------------
> > >
> > >Gary,
> > >
> > >Sorry, I have to respectfully disagree here. I am a member of Matt's
> > >RV8-list and the RV-list. If I post a message to the RV8-list, I get
> > >two copies - one that comes from the RV8-list, and a copy that comes
> > >across on the main RV-list.
> > >
> > >I just checked my Out Box - my message to Steve was sent to the
> > >RV4-List only. The copy you replied too seems to have come from the
> > >main RV-List.
> > >
> > >Search the RV-List archives for the text " New Specific RV Lists Auto
> > >Forwarded to RV-List" (don't include the quote marks. You'll find
> > >Matt's description of how the system works. I believe it causes
> > >confusion, because a lot of people on the main RV-List don't
> > >understand that they need study the original message to see where it
> > >originated, and send their response to the message to the correct
> > >list. Otherwise, the original poster may not see the response. But,
> > >Matt likes it the way it is, and these are his lists.
> > >
> > >Kevin
> > >
> > >>
> > >>Kevin.....actually, messages posted to model-specific Matronics
> > >>lists do not automatically post to the RV list. You can post to any
> > >>list or combination of lists you like, but you have to send it to
> > >>the ones you want it to show up on.
> > >>
> > >>Gary
> > >>
> > >>From: Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com>
> > >>Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: RV4-List: Bleeding Brakes
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>Steve,
> > >>
> > >>.................. Any message posted to one of the RV model specific
> > >>list also gets posted to the main RV List. Any responses to the copy
> > >>of the message that goes to the main RV List only go to the main RV
> > >>List - they don't go back to the RV model specific list,
...............
> > >
> > >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Oke <wjoke(at)shaw.ca> |
Just finishing up the exhaust & cowling installation.
I have a small roll of the Vans "heat protection tape" for the inside of the cowling.
Any recommendations on where and how (ie., size & shape of pieces) it should
be applied? Lyc O-320 with a Vetterman exhaust, BTW.
Jim Oke
RV-6A
Winnipeg, MB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tom & Cathy Ervin" <tcervin(at)valkyrie.net> |
| Subject: | Re: riveting rudder stops |
Dan, On my RV6A-QB I used Cherry Max Rivets per Vans. On the Quick Build
you couldn't get to either rivet very easily and still do a good job.
I have come to respect the strength of Cherry Max Rivets in tight
spots during the course of building my RV6A-QB.
Tom in Ohio (Fiberglass City)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
Subject: RV-List: riveting rudder stops
>
> RV-7 tailwheel tip-up. Got a question about riveting the rudder stops
onto
> the aft fuselage...
>
> There are four AN426AD4 rivets on each stop, two for the front half of
> F-712, two for the aft half. The aft rivets can be squeezed no
> problem...plenty of access from behind. The forward rivets, however...how
> have you guys set those? There's not really enough room on the stop to
get
> the flush rivet set (I have the swivel flush set).
>
> I have a set that came with my C-frame which has a flat end...I could use
> that with the gun in this application, I guess. Is that what most people
do
> in spots like this? I can't believe I haven't bumped into another
riveting
> situation like this, but I'm curious how you guys have done this.
Probably
> something ridiculously simple I'm forgetting about. 8
> )
>
> Thanks in advance,
> )_( Dan
> RV-7 N714D (fuselage)
> http://www.rvproject.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Marlow <smarlow6(at)insightbb.com> |
I'm looking for a finishing kit for my RV6, maybe even a 6A kit would
work. Fuselage is next, could use a good jig.
Thanks,
Sam
wing construction
--
Visit my home page at
http://home.insightbb.com/~smarlow6/index.html
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wiethe, Philip (P.J.)" <pwiethe(at)ford.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Match drilling etc. |
Tedd,
My only problem with this is the fact that the cutting of the metal with a drill
or deburring bit which is deforming the metal enough to shear pieces of it
off is also work hardening the edge that it leaves behind. I don't see how the
punched edge is significantly worse than this. In both cases, there is a small
amount of work hardened metal localized around the hole. Since the punched
hole does leave a smooth surface, even though there may be some local
hardening, there aren't any stress concentration points from which a crack
could propagate. With either case, the load carried by the metal here is spread
farther out to the the diameter of the flush head or shop head of the rivet, so
the small hardened circumference is not having to carry the entire load. I think
we are splitting hairs here. Being an engineer, I realize that sometimes we
go a little overboard in striving for perfection.
Phil
8A wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert McCallum <robert.mccallum2(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: wiring & exhaust temps |
Dave Ford wrote:
>
>
Install heat shield & clamp? Actually that would put heat shield right next to
wiring and heat
transfer through shield would bring some heat to wiring.
>
> Dave Ford
> RV6
What about a piece of small diameter firesleeve?? If you chose a size that approximated
the wire
size and extended it a few inches each side of the hot area then secured each end
to the wires with
the appropriate clamps you could get a neat looking installation which should prevent
the
possibility of melted wiring. (Assuming re-routing the wire isn't an option of
course.)
--
Bob McC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Robert McCallum <robert.mccallum2(at)sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet measuring question |
Karie Daniel wrote:
>
>
> I would like to make sure that I'm using the shop head rivet gage set correctly
and I'm hoping someone can help. I just started riveting the hz stabilizer
for my RV-7A and the plans call for using a AN470AD4-6 to rivet HS-600PP to the
HS-603PP.
>
> Someone might assume that you would use the blue -6 gage but I know that if you
pounded a AN470AD4-6 rivet to the size of the -6 blue gage you basically wouldn't
have a shop it, you would have a pancake. It looks more like the gold -4
gage is the correct gage to measure a AN470AD4-6 rivet.
It is.
>
> According to the rivet gage instructions the shop head should "fit" in the hole
(some rivets just do and some are slightly larger) using the -4 gauge and this
is what looks correct. The depth should be the same as the notched end of
the gauge. Most are at are under the notch meaning the notch will just slide over
the rivet. Am I using the correct gauge here?
Yes.
>
> Why this is confusing is that the HS-413PP hinge brackets call for a AN470AD4-5
rivet. It looks like this would be measured with the red -5 gauge.
No. This is a "size" 4 rivet just like the ones you mention above.
>
> I took a very valuable builders class a few weeks ago but we were given gauges
that were made by the instructor and we really didn't get into using these types
of gauges (the ones you get from Avery or other tool distributors).
>
> Karie Daniel
> Maple Valley, WA.
> RV-7A (empennage)
All of the rivets you mention are "size" 4 rivets. The gauge size refers to the
rivet diameter not
the length. It would be unreasonable to assume that each length of rivet had a
different head size
spec. The dash number on the end of the part number which you seem to be using
to reference the
gauge size is specifying the rivet length. You need to match the gauge to the "size"
not the length.
All of the rivets you quote would use the gold -4 gauge. These numbers can be rather
confusing until
you get used to what the various parts of the number mean.
--
Bob McC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gert <gert(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Inverted oil system |
Maybe start by looking at some of the pre-oiler systems for airplanes on
the market, some of them work with accumulators, it'll give you atleast
most of the h.w.
Tedd McHenry wrote:
>
>>Most of the maneuver's you'll be doing in the RV are positive anyway (Loops,
>>rolls, etc..). BTW, rolls are a blast!
>>
>
> One thing I've often wondered about is pressure accumulators (Accu-sumps).
> They used to be used on race cars, but they seem to be less common now that dry
> sump systems are so common. I've long thought they'd be good for airplanes,
> since they give you oil pressure during momentary pickup losses, such as you
> can easily get doing aeros. Does anyone here have experience using pressure
> accumulators on airplanes?
>
> Tedd McHenry
> -6 wing
> Surrey, BC
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
is subject to a download and archival fee in the amount of $500
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eugene Williams" <Ewill177(at)hotmail.com> |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary Newsted" <fcs(at)jlc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Match drilling etc. |
> Finally some common sense in the answer and approach!
Common Sense? Or just someone else who leans your way?
It seems to me, that the "standard" falls on the side of common sense and
shortcutting it does not.
If you want to experiment with different drill bit sizes with the intent of
adhering to the precise mil-spec standard that's admirable, but ramming a die
through a too-small hole and skipping drilling entirely is not sensible in any
sense of the word.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don/Marcia Piermattei" <dlpier(at)lamar.colostate.edu> |
| Subject: | Torx head screws |
From: "Haywire" <haywire(at)telus.net>
Subject: RV9-List: Torx Head Screws
What is the contact info for the manufacturer?
Don Piermattei
90411 N192DP
Donald L. Piermattei DVM, PhD
5000 E County Rd 92
Carr, CO 80612
970/568-9047
Fax 970/568-7279
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Match drilling etc. |
Gary Newsted wrote:
>
>
> > Finally some common sense in the answer and approach!
> Common Sense? Or just someone else who leans your way?
>
> It seems to me, that the "standard" falls on the side of common sense and
> shortcutting it does not.
> If you want to experiment with different drill bit sizes with the intent of
> adhering to the precise mil-spec standard that's admirable, but ramming a die
> through a too-small hole and skipping drilling entirely is not sensible in any
> sense of the word.
I tell ya what *really* doesn't sound sensible:
Taking a small piece of metal, sticking it into a couple of holes in
thin aluminum stock, and smashing the living daylights out of it with a
pneumatic hammer until one end of the little piece of metal is mashed
flat............and expecting that barbaric way of fastening metal
sheets together to keep our hides safe while we are several thousand
feet above the ground.
Now THAT doesn't sound sensible!!
Obviously, the "sounding sensible" test is not a valid way to determine
acceptable building procedures. :-)
Sam Buchanan (RV-6 with thousands of little bitty smashed pieces of
metal holding together very thin sheets of lightweight and flimsy
aluminum)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "KostaLewis" <mikel(at)dimensional.com> |
| Subject: | Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...) |
>Here's how to vote - follow closely to make it easiest for me to count:
>-- To Vote FORWARD --
>Send an email message to: dralle(at)matronics.com
> Make the SUBJECT line: "Forward"
>-- To Vote DON'T FORWARD --
>Send an email message to: dralle(at)matronics.com
> Make the SUBJECT line: "Don't Forward"
NOTE: the address to send your vote to is NOT THE LIST. DO NOT SEND YOUR
VOTE TO THE LIST; which is to say, don't just hit reply and vote. Sent
it to Matt at the above address.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | riveting rudder stops |
I used the back-rivet set to drive the forward rivets in mine. I only
used two rivets per stop.
Also, I think I placed them a little higher than the plans show to avoid
rudder cable interference. Ie, when full left rudder, the right-hand
cable hits the stop, and vise-versa.
All this took place round the time of SNF (or OSH, don't remember), so I
looked at all the RV rudder stops at the show. There was a suprising
amount of variation in design and technique. No two planes that I saw
had the same stops.
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dan Checkoway
> Sent: Friday, October 25, 2002 11:03 PM
> To: RV7and7A(at)yahoogroups.com; rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: riveting rudder stops
>
>
>
> RV-7 tailwheel tip-up. Got a question about riveting the
> rudder stops onto the aft fuselage...
>
> There are four AN426AD4 rivets on each stop, two for the
> front half of F-712, two for the aft half. The aft rivets
> can be squeezed no problem...plenty of access from behind.
> The forward rivets, however...how have you guys set those?
> There's not really enough room on the stop to get the flush
> rivet set (I have the swivel flush set).
>
> I have a set that came with my C-frame which has a flat
> end...I could use that with the gun in this application, I
> guess. Is that what most people do in spots like this? I
> can't believe I haven't bumped into another riveting
> situation like this, but I'm curious how you guys have done
> this. Probably something ridiculously simple I'm forgetting about. 8
> )
>
> Thanks in advance,
> )_( Dan
> RV-7 N714D (fuselage)
> http://www.rvproject.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Point <jpoint(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet measuring question |
Those little colored rivet gauges are handy, but don't take them as
gospel. If you measure the holes/ notches in them, and compare them to
the Mil-spec on riveting, you will find that the gauges are quite a bit
oversized, ie. the holes are around .015 bigger than they need to be,
and the notches an equal amount deeper. In other words, a shop head
could be both too short and too small diameter (according to the gauge)
and still fall within the acceptable range. Get yourself a dial
calipers with .001 resolution, and get a copy of the Mil-spec at
http://www.flash.net/~gila/rivet_spec/rivet_a.htm. It's a little
mundane but very informative. When I started building, I drilled out
some rivets which were actually acceptable, just because the gauges said
they were not, so use them, but with a grain of salt.
Jeff Point
RV-6 finish kit
Milwaukee WI
>I would like to make sure that I'm using the shop head rivet gage set correctly
and I'm hoping someone can help. I just started riveting the hz stabilizer for
my RV-7A and the plans call for using a AN470AD4-6 to rivet HS-600PP to the
HS-603PP.
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Bowen" <Larry(at)bowenaero.com> |
| Subject: | Torx head screws |
http://www.microfasteners.com/
-
Larry Bowen
Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://BowenAero.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Don/Marcia Piermattei
> Sent: Saturday, October 26, 2002 11:06 AM
> To: RV9-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: RV-List: Torx head screws
>
>
> -->
>
> From: "Haywire" <haywire(at)telus.net>
> Subject: RV9-List: Torx Head Screws
>
> What is the contact info for the manufacturer?
> Don Piermattei
> 90411 N192DP
>
> Donald L. Piermattei DVM, PhD
> 5000 E County Rd 92
> Carr, CO 80612
> 970/568-9047
> Fax 970/568-7279
>
>
> ==========
> ==========
> ==========
> ==========
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steve Semenuk <shsrv6a(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Lower price on new Elect. Intl. engine monitoring |
In need of cash and a simpler panel, I am selling at a
loss the following. First $3250 and they're yours,
including shipping. That's
$600 less than you'll find anywhere and it includes a
fuel level gauge that is not included in most engine
monitors:
Brand new, never
installed or used, still in original boxes (opened
only to inventory) Electronics International
instruments as a package only. Purchased from Vans
earlier this year. All necessary sensors and
transducers, wires, etc. are
included.
1) UBG-16 CHT/EGT bar graph including 4 cht/4egt
probes and 1 OAT probe. Room for
7 other temperature/parameter readings.
2) FP-5L Fuel flow and pressure with GPS interface to
calculate time to empty
3) R-1 RPM including flight time
4) OPT-1 Oil pressure and temp
5) M-1 Manifold pressure
6) VA-1 Volt/Amp with 50 Amp external shunt
7) FL-2 Dual fuel level for resistance (standard
float) senders
Steve Semenuk
shsrv6a(at)yahoo.com
RV-6A finishing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cowling Tape |
> I have a small roll of the Vans "heat protection tape" for the inside of
the
> cowling. Any recommendations on where and how (ie., size & shape of
> pieces) it should be applied? Lyc O-320 with a Vetterman exhaust, BTW.
In general I'd say just put it where the exhaust pipes are closest to the
cowl, with priority on the forward-most (i.e. hotter) sections.
For a more detailed (albiet a bit wordy) description, a look at my article
at http://www.edt.com/homewing/rhproject/maintenance.html.
I did get some more of the stickyback AL sheet recently, and the next
chance I get I'm going to cover a larger area. Its light, and even if it
isn't strictly needed outside the "hot spots" I'm sure it will help make the
cowl last longer overall.
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~400 hrs)
Portland, OR
www.vanshomewing.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Geoffkimbrough(at)aol.com |
I am aware of some discussions regarding utilizing different model of master brake
cylinders than the one's Van's sends with the kits. I understand that this
change makes it possible to eliminate the separate remote fluid reservoir, and
thereby eliminate some of the lines under the Instrument panel and baggage
compartment (lines between the master cylinder and the reservoir).
The ACS catalog shows a Matco MC-5 and a Cleveland Model 10-35, both of which appear
to be designed to operate without the remote reservoir.
Does anyone have any experience with either of these, or am I just having a "senior
moment" remembering this issue being discussed? I have searched the archives
without success.
Geoff Kimbrough
Katy, Texas
-8, fuse
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Karie Daniel" <karied4(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rivet measuring question |
Thanks to all the great replies regarding my rivet measuring questions. The
good news is that all the AN470AD4-6 to rivets HS-600PP to the HS-603PP are
right and measured correctly. The bad news is that I will have to work one
of the HS-413PP hinge brackets ( I did only one before sending the question
to this list).
I just hope the holes to the brackets are OK after working the rivets.
Karie Daniel
Maple Valley, WA.
RV-7A (empennage)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Karie Daniel" <karied4(at)attbi.com>
Subject: RV-List: Rivet measuring question
>
> I would like to make sure that I'm using the shop head rivet gage set
correctly and I'm hoping someone can help. I just started riveting the hz
stabilizer for my RV-7A and the plans call for using a AN470AD4-6 to rivet
HS-600PP to the HS-603PP.
>
> Someone might assume that you would use the blue -6 gage but I know that
if you pounded a AN470AD4-6 rivet to the size of the -6 blue gage you
basically wouldn't have a shop it, you would have a pancake. It looks more
like the gold -4 gage is the correct gage to measure a AN470AD4-6 rivet.
>
> According to the rivet gage instructions the shop head should "fit" in the
hole (some rivets just do and some are slightly larger) using the -4 gauge
and this is what looks correct. The depth should be the same as the notched
end of the gauge. Most are at are under the notch meaning the notch will
just slide over the rivet. Am I using the correct gauge here?
>
> Why this is confusing is that the HS-413PP hinge brackets call for a
AN470AD4-5 rivet. It looks like this would be measured with the red -5
gauge.
>
> I took a very valuable builders class a few weeks ago but we were given
gauges that were made by the instructor and we really didn't get into using
these types of gauges (the ones you get from Avery or other tool
distributors).
>
> Karie Daniel
> Maple Valley, WA.
> RV-7A (empennage)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Brake system |
You don't need to change the master cylinders, just buy the A-600 reservoirs
and screw them in directly. Pictures and story...
http://www.rv-8.com/IdeasProducts.htm
Randy Lervold
RV-8, 273 hrs
----- Original Message -----
From: <Geoffkimbrough(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Brake system
>
> I am aware of some discussions regarding utilizing different model of
master brake cylinders than the one's Van's sends with the kits. I
understand that this change makes it possible to eliminate the separate
remote fluid reservoir, and thereby eliminate some of the lines under the
Instrument panel and baggage compartment (lines between the master cylinder
and the reservoir).
>
> The ACS catalog shows a Matco MC-5 and a Cleveland Model 10-35, both of
which appear to be designed to operate without the remote reservoir.
>
> Does anyone have any experience with either of these, or am I just having
a "senior moment" remembering this issue being discussed? I have searched
the archives without success.
>
> Geoff Kimbrough
> Katy, Texas
> -8, fuse
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Rivet measuring question |
In a message dated 10/26/02 1:28:11 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
karied4(at)attbi.com writes:
<< It looks more like the gold -4 gage is the correct gage to measure a
AN470AD4-6 rivet. >>
Yes!
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, electrical stuff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Patrick Kelley" <webmaster(at)flion.com> |
| Subject: | Rivet measuring question |
To expound on this, the gage "dash" numbers refer to the rivet diameter,
not the length. The rivet "dash" number is the length. So, for your
example rivet, you would use the -4 gage, not the -6.
Patrick Kelley - RV-6A - Fuselage in progress and looking for painter
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of HCRV6(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Rivet measuring question
In a message dated 10/26/02 1:28:11 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
karied4(at)attbi.com writes:
<< It looks more like the gold -4 gage is the correct gage to measure a
AN470AD4-6 rivet. >>
Yes!
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, electrical stuff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Haywire" <haywire(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | RE: RV9-List: Torx head screws |
>
> What is the contact info for the manufacturer?
> Don Piermattei
> 90411 N192DP
>
>
Hi Don;
You can go direct to them and buy at;
http://www.microfasteners.com/catalog/products/SSCFCMXS.cfm
FCMXS0408 100 4-40 x 1/2 $ 8.50
FCMXS0810 100 8-32 x 5/8 $ 14.50
FCMXS1112 100 10-32 x 3/4 $ 15.80
S. Todd Bartrim
Turbo 13B rotary powered
RV-9endurance (FWF)
C-FSTB
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Tedd McHenry <tedd(at)vansairforce.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Match drilling etc. |
At the risk of beating this to death, I want to re-emphasize that I was told by
an engineer from Van's that--according to their tests--the punching process
they use work-hardens the aluminum around the hole and results in unacceptably
low fatigue life. It is necessary to drill away the work-hardened material
around the hole to get acceptable fatigue life.
Perhaps it is possible to post-punch the hole and achieve the same result. I'm
not prepared to offer an opinion on that. But my personal choice is to follow
Van's recommendation, which is based on testing.
Tedd McHenry
-6 wing
Surrey, BC
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | PittsS1D(at)aol.com |
Can anyone tell me of websites or other listings where I might find completed
or near completed RV's for sale? Thank you. Chuck
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | RAMTHAXTON(at)aol.com |
I'm trying to fit the slider canopy frame to the fuselage with little
success. If I get the rear bow set at 1/8" lower at the slide track, the gap
gets progressively wider as I work towards the sides, appreciate advice from
someone who has a completed their slider canopy.
Thanks
ramthaxton@aol
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Gary K. ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Gary K.
Subject: Mini Connector Pictures
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/flyink@efortress.com.10.26.2002/index.html
--------------------------------------------
o EMAIL LIST PHOTO SHARE
Share your files and photos with other List members simply by
emailing the files to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
Please view the typical Share above and include the Description Text
Fields as shown along with your submission of files and photos.
o Main Photo Share Index:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
--------------------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Younie" <rv6capt(at)pacificcoast.net> |
I have a 0-360-A3A in the overhaul shop right now and would like to sell it when
it is done. Anyone interested?
Working on the instrument panel right now.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
>
>I'm trying to fit the slider canopy frame to the fuselage with little
>success.
First, be sure to check the archives.
Be sure that the steel framework is complete and fits perfectly before
attempting to do anything to the plastic.
I tried to fit both plastic and steel at the same time and it is a **VERY**
difficult way to go.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "T Bronson" <bipetype(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Fwd: Those blasted TFR's.... |
Hi Folks,
Rob Ray wrote:
>If you have traveled abroad, you know how
>rare this is and how great it is to enjoy the freedoms
>we share here. The cost is RESPONSIBILITY on our part
>right now to follow the rules, ask questions, give
>constructive criticism and not give the FAA any
>ammunition to shut us down, permanently. Common sense
>still rules and yes, it's a hassle sometimes.
>The alternative I can assure you is gloomy...
Amen! Consider that gun ownership is under attack every day, and it is a
constitutional right. Flying is a privilege that can disappear in a hurry,
as we have seen. Don't expect any support from John Q. Citizen, either. He
doesn't give a rip about rifles or airplanes if it doesn't affect him.
It is up to us to police ourselves (or someone else will) and operate
responsibly (ignorance is no excuse). It sure wouldn't hurt to support EAA
and AOPA (send them the equivalent of a tank of gas every once in a while).
Back to lurking.
Tim
Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN!
http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gene Smith" <esmith6(at)satx.rr.com> |
Hello Rob Ray,
You are doing a wonderful job, and we are all very proud of you, and thank
you so much for protecting us...We share your frustrations and stress related
to this whole mess we are living this day and time, you are obviously closer
to it all than we are. If you remember our email discussions about crosswinds
and the 360 degree tail wheels, I mentioned I did the same thing you are doing
for 22 years, so I know from your end of the stick.
Yes, you are right, some of the GA pilots really need to clean up their act,
or we might have further restrictions to our privilege to fly. It really doesn't
take much effort to find out the rules to go with the situation before
we get airborne.
Sorry I missed you at Scott Field west of Waco at the last fly-in......I look
forward to meeting you and swapping lies over a brew or two!
Take care of yourself, and don't try to be a too much of a hero......remember
the old Fighter Pilot adage, "one pass, haul ass," and "tomorrow is another
day." I'm sure you recite that each time you "roll-in." Thanks again for "putting
it on the line" for all of us, we do care and appreciate you!............CHEERS!!!!!!............Gene
Smith
PS......To all my other RV Comrades out there, I apologize for taking your space
and time, but I felt this needed to be said. Rob is right, like building these
machines, let's do it right and respect the rules.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John & Rose" <altocu(at)logantele.com> |
This link will take you to lots of information about rivets.
http://www.taf.textron.com/html/support/tech/rivet.htm
John D.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | rob ray <smokyray(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV4-List: Thanks Rob Ray |
Thank you sir! We don't get to hear that very much.
--- Gene Smith wrote:
> --> RV4-List message posted by: "Gene Smith"
>
>
> Hello Rob Ray,
> You are doing a wonderful job, and we are all
> very proud of you, and thank you so much for
> protecting us...We share your frustrations and
> stress related to this whole mess we are living this
> day and time, you are obviously closer to it all
> than we are. If you remember our email discussions
> about crosswinds and the 360 degree tail wheels, I
> mentioned I did the same thing you are doing for 22
> years, so I know from your end of the stick.
> Yes, you are right, some of the GA pilots
> really need to clean up their act, or we might have
> further restrictions to our privilege to fly. It
> really doesn't take much effort to find out the
> rules to go with the situation before we get
> airborne.
> Sorry I missed you at Scott Field west of Waco
> at the last fly-in......I look forward to meeting
> you and swapping lies over a brew or two!
> Take care of yourself, and don't try to be a
> too much of a hero......remember the old Fighter
> Pilot adage, "one pass, haul ass," and "tomorrow is
> another day." I'm sure you recite that each time
> you "roll-in." Thanks again for "putting it on the
> line" for all of us, we do care and appreciate
> you!............CHEERS!!!!!!............Gene Smith
>
> PS......To all my other RV Comrades out there, I
> apologize for taking your space and time, but I felt
> this needed to be said. Rob is right, like building
> these machines, let's do it right and respect the
> rules.
>
>
>
> Contributions of
> any other form
>
> latest messages.
> other List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/search
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rick Galati" <rick07x(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Those blasted TFR's |
I reject any attempt to characterize my flying as a "privilege"
as defined by meddlers, elected or otherwise who would point out to me the
lack of this "privilege" by persons in other countries. This is not another
country. This is the USA. I for one do not breathe a grateful
sigh of relief because this "privilege" is extended to me by a benevolent
bureaucrat for one more day. It is very disturbing to me that the FAA's
historic authority to oversee the nation's airspace was vaporized in an
instant by forces who would essentially declare martial law on a small
segment of our society. You are right to suppose that John Q.
Idiot could care less about small airplanes and those rich fat cats that
fly them. The fact is, we are hopelessly outnumbered and I don't think general
aviation can overcome that perception and bias in our lifetime. I mean
look at the media. To them, there are only two types of airplanes.
It is either in the Piper Cub class or a Boeing Heavy. The day may come
when the sport flier is grounded for national security reasons that atrophy into
a permanent status of sorts. The day might well arrive when an F-16
(equipped naturally with a UHF radio) will shoot down an errant civil aviator
for no other reason than disorientation. Of course a carefully orchestrated
chorus of "official" and media voices will convince ol' John Q. that the hapless
pilot had it coming. I wonder out loud if those pilots who still embrace
the wisdom of a loving government that only has our best interests at
heart will still happily cozy up to a "privileged" warm fire on a cold night,
when that firewood, of course has finally passed to his hands with the U.S.
government stamp of approval on it. --- Rick Galati
--- rick07x(at)earthlink.net
--- EarthLink: It's your Internet.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <terry(at)tcwatson.com> |
| Subject: | Jon's seats and canopy handle |
I finally got around to setting putting Jon's seats in place with the canopy
installed, only to discover that there is a serious interference with the
canopy latch handle and the seats, both front and rear. The nice wide
shoulders of the seat get in the way of the handle, and it's not by just a
little. One solution would be to saw maybe 2" off the side of the
upholstered seat - not a good solution. Another would be to eliminate the
entire D handle of the latch. I don't like that idea either. It doesn't
look like raising or lower the seats is an answer either.
Has anyone else solved this problem? How did you do it?
Thanks,
Terry
RV-8A #80729
Seattle
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Those blasted TFR's. |
| From: | John Veld <jcveld(at)mac.com> |
Gene Smith,
Thanks for the words of Sage Advice to all.
As for those idiotic TFR's, be thankful you don't live in Waco, TX like I
do.
With G.W. Bush at his Crawford ranch, This place is effectively Class B
airspace with a 30 nm radius TFR!!
I just hope GW doesnt decide to go to OSHKOSH!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vincent Welch" <welchvincent(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Axle Problem |
I had the same problem with my RV-8A. A couple of passes with a thread file
cleaned it right up.
Vince Welch
>From: "Richard Bibb" <richard.bibb(at)verizon.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To:
>Subject: RV-List: Axle Problem
>Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 17:07:31 -0400
>
>
>Ok I screwed up.
>
>In trying to get my brake mounting flange installed on the axle in my RV-4
>I
>managed to damage the threads slightly. But slightly is enough as the
>aluminum axle nut threads aren't very tolerent and begin to strip if I try
>to get it started.
>
>How do you fix this? I assume you need a die to clean up the threads on
>the
>axle and a tap to clean up the threads on the nut but where do you find a 1
>1/4 - 16 NEF size Tap and Die?
>
>Any other ideas?
>
>Richard Bibb
>N144KT RV-4
>
>
I
http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | riveting rudder stops |
Dan.........this sounds like the one on my RV-9A. I anticipated that, and used
a universal head rivet on those spots. If you have already countersunk those
holes, you have a couple of options for a small-diameter flush set:
1. You can use a squeezer set if you have the set for your gun that has a hole
in the end to accept it.
2. As you say, you can use the long shaft set that came with your C-frame. Put
it in the gun (be careful.......no spring.....don't shoot it across the room!)
In either case, it will tend to skate if you don't hold it securely. Hold the end
with your other hand up against the part. Get 'Rosie the Riveter' to buck
it for you.
Another option..........good old Pop rivets.
Gary
From: "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com>
Subject: RV-List: riveting rudder stops
RV-7 tailwheel tip-up. Got a question about riveting the rudder stops onto
the aft fuselage...
There are four AN426AD4 rivets on each stop, two for the front half of
F-712, two for the aft half. The aft rivets can be squeezed no
problem...plenty of access from behind. The forward rivets, however...how
have you guys set those? There's not really enough room on the stop to get
the flush rivet set (I have the swivel flush set).
I have a set that came with my C-frame which has a flat end...I could use
that with the gun in this application, I guess. Is that what most people do
in spots like this? I can't believe I haven't bumped into another riveting
situation like this, but I'm curious how you guys have done this. Probably
something ridiculously simple I'm forgetting about. 8
)
Thanks in advance,
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D (fuselage)
http://www.rvproject.com
---
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman" <nhunger(at)sprint.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: RV9-List: Re: [RV-9A] cleco's |
> I knew I was saving these little buggers for a reason ! Of my broken
Clecos : 8 were Cleco brand
> 22 were Kwik Lok, and 104 were Wedge Lock. I know I got some from ATS
while at Oshkosh in '99 and some from Vans'. What brand does Brown Tool Co.
sell Gary ? I will order the next ones from them.
I've got at around 400 clecos as I built both wings at the same time. All
are from Avery and not one is broken.
Norman Hunger
RV6A Finishing kit and beyond
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Peter H. Blake" <pblake(at)epix.net> |
| Subject: | Match drilling etc. |
Does anyone know what manufacturing practices are used in building the
quick-build kits? Do they drill, deburr, dimple, then rivet? Or do they
just dimple and rivet? Whatever they do, I'd be comfortable doing on my
plane (if I were lucky enough to have predrilled parts!!!).
Peter Blake
RV6
New O-360 mounted!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Torx head screws |
| From: | cecilth(at)juno.com |
I go there and search for torx head screws and they are not there.
writes:
>
> http://www.microfasteners.com/
Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today
Only $9.95 per month!
Visit www.juno.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Oke <wjoke(at)shaw.ca> |
Unfortunately, there seems to be no "silver bullet" method of fitting the
canopy frame to the fuselage opening. I did this about 18 months ago and
recall several days spent in fitting - tweaking (ie, adjusting the bend in
the aft curved tube) - refitting - re-tweaking and so on.
A few suggestions:
- Set a suitably sized cross bar across the aft ends of the slider rails
such that the thickness of the bar keeps the canopy side rails at the right
spacing (but parallel) to the slider rails each time you fit the canopy
frame.
- Work from the center of the aft tube outwards and downwards towards the
side rails.
- Keep bend adjustments small and "in plane" with the area being adjusted.
- Don't be surprised if an adjustment lower down causes some change in an
area previously adjusted. The lower rails are quite stiff compared to the
aft tube and hold the lower end of the smaller tube fixed in place so a
change in the middle of the smaller tube can affect things elsewhere too.
- Keep the thickness of the canopy plexiglass in mind when fitting the
frame.
- Leaving the plexiglass a little above the fuse skin is a lot easier to
deal with when fitting the canopy skirt than getting it too low. (Guess how
I know!)
- Consider adding a reasonable amount of shim material between the tube and
the plexiglass vice endless tweaking for the perfect fit - when the canopy
plexiglass is fitted there will likely be some subtle changes in any case.
- Make up some temporary wood blocks to use instead of the UHMW plastic
blocks on the canopy rail when fitting the canopy. Later on when the canopy
is all done, drill and fit your real UHMW blocks. (Guess how I know!)
That's about it - good luck, go slow, and be patient are about all that can
be said.
Jim Oke
RV-6A (slider O-320, putting seats in today)
Winnipeg, MB
----- Original Message -----
From: <ramthaxton(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: RV-7QB
>
> I'm trying to fit the slider canopy frame to the fuselage with little
> success. If I get the rear bow set at 1/8" lower at the slide track, the
gap
> gets progressively wider as I work towards the sides, appreciate advice
from
> someone who has a completed their slider canopy.
>
> Thanks
> ramthaxton@aol
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy Compton" <rdcompton(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | TFR's, HP mods, and DON"T BUY LIGHTSPEED IGNITION |
> I also do not think armed F16's should be patroling NO-FLY zones inside
the
> United States---EVER. We know who the bad guys are, let's go get them and
> leave our freedoms intact, this is a very bad precedent. I hate to see a
> "Kent State" type shoot down of a family in their 172 lost over a stadium
in
> poor visibility.
Amen. All of this anti-GA stuff is a bunch of hype and a power-grab. Yeah,
boy, my RV-3 can bring down a sky-scraper. Yeah, right. Be nothing more
than a large bug going splat against the wall. Further, no way am I going
to be "grateful" to some worthless poltical-appointee FAA bureaucrat, most
likely a non-pilot, bestowing upon me from on high the privilege to fly. By
the way, I've got 1900 F-14 hours and 1200 as an adversary pilot...so I'm a
bit familiar with fighter stuff, for what it's worth (probably not much,
seeing as how the only people impressed by fighter pilots are little boys
and other fighter pilots.)
> I have been in the process of purchasing a new engine, now I am reading
about
> these new cool air induction systems and their possible 10 horsepower
> increase. If one sits down and adds up the claimed horsepower increases
from
> various of these accessories one could see a 210 horsepower at 2700 RPM
I0360
> (parrallel valve) that weighs much less than the angle valve IO360 and is
> cheaper by a bit. Thing is if one device claims to add 8 horsepower, EI
> ignition for example, and another 10 horsepower, the cool air manifold,
and
> porting another 4 or 6 and so on (one place claimed 4 horses per
> cylinder)---I do not believe it would be cumulative. Aircraft engines have
> been around so long and no one ever seems to put them on a dyno. My hotrod
> friends have many more resources including chassis dynos to tune their
> engines. Does anyone have any real experinece mildly hotrodding these
engines
> that is backed up by a dyno
Don't waste your money on the Lightspeed Ignition. Yes, my engine runs
smoothly on the right side (I have a mag on the left), and in "both", but
that's about all I've noticed. No big jump in performance or anything. The
electrical connections seem cheesy, and certainly not what one would expect
of aviation-quality connections intended to be mechanically strong and
vibration resistant.
Further, support from this Klaus guy is abslolutely abysmal, if that good.
Here's the story:
I was having trouble getting the hookup for the tach output to work. I
bought an Electronics International tach that was configured to accept the
Lightspeed square-wave on the right side. I first discovered that Klaus, in
his infinite wisdom, chose not to pre-wire the plug with an output wire for
the tach pick-up, so disassembly of his plug was required. There,
solder-type pins were found, requiring a bit of delicate work to wire-up the
output. I had an avionics technician buddy come out to my hangar and help
with the wiring.
Then, the tach wouldn't read anything but zero's on the right side. So, my
buddy came back out to my hangar with an O-scope to trouble shoot. He
needed some info about just what he should seeing to verify a good
square-wave, so my buddy called the number printed on the side of the
Lightspeed box. Mr. Klaus, rather than take 30 sec and provide a bit of
engineering data, instructed us to go to "the web" and get it there. (I've
called the all-knowing Klaus before, and I should have known that his
response would be "it's on the web.")
Well sports fans, I don't know about you, but my hangar isn't equipped with
a computer terminal and access to "the web." Frankly, I was embarassed with
Klaus' brush-off of my buddy. I suppose engineer-supreme Klaus' time is
just too valuable to waste on common folk.
So, we called the folks at Electronics Int'l. They could not have been more
helpful. My buddy worked with their engineer. Apparently Lightspeed had
made a change, unbeknownst to EI, to the square-wave . So, EI took my tach
back, reworked it, and now all is well.
It was a superb demonstration of the extremes of customer service. After
all this, you won't get me to buy even a piece of heat shrink tubing from
Klaus Savior/Sauvior/Sauvier, or however you spell his name.
Randy Compton
N84VF RV-3A
Gulf Breeze, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com> |
| Subject: | Don't Buy Lightspeed Ignition |
I have dual Lightspeed ignition systems on my RV6A and totally disagree with
the first poster regarding both the performace of the units, the customer
response of the company, and the integrity of Klaus both as a person and as
an engineer.
Different strokes for different folks I guess.
John at Salida, CO
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <karpinski(at)baldcom.net> |
| Subject: | HS Hinges in the wrong place: @%%&@! |
I have been just been so humbled !! AGAIN !!
*******************************
So finished the Horizontal Stabilizer..
Skin is on ..
Everything came out perfect.. NOT ! NOT ! NOT !!
So I just realized I have placed two of the four elevator hinges in the
wrong place.
Given the hinges are used for Elevator attachment..
Pop rivetting the hinges in the correct position are out of the question ...
(??)
So .. is it a call to Vans for a new HS kit?
Signed !
One Stupid Stupid Man !
Al
RV-8
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry2DT(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 10/26/02 10:54:35 PM, rv7-list-digest(at)matronics.com writes:
<<
I'm trying to fit the slider canopy frame to the fuselage with little
success. If I get the rear bow set at 1/8" lower at the slide track, the gap
gets progressively wider as I work towards the sides, appreciate advice from
someone who has a completed their slider canopy.
>>
Beg, borrow or steal the current "RVator" It has an extensive article by
Scott McDaniel from Van's on the nuances of building the slider. Wish I had
seen it 6 months ago when I was doing mine, would have saved hours of work
and speculation. Bottom line on the slider frame is that you must bend it to
fit your airplane. It's not that hard to bend once you figure out how to do
it. Helps if you know how to make wooden jigs to hold it while you tweak it.
Seriously, if you don't subscribe to the RVator, now is a good time to call
Van's. $20 a year is way more than worth it. Also buy the "21 years of the
RVator" In my mind, has so much good tech advice should be included with
every kit. Hope this helps.
Jerry Cochran
RV6a/Finish kit
Wilsonville,OR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson(at)mcleodusa.net> |
| Subject: | Re: TFR's, HP mods, and DON"T BUY LIGHTSPEED IGNITION |
Randy Compton wrote:
>
> > I have been in the process of purchasing a new engine, now I am reading
> about
> > these new cool air induction systems and their possible 10 horsepower
> > increase. If one sits down and adds up the claimed horsepower increases
> from
> > various of these accessories one could see a 210 horsepower at 2700 RPM
> I0360
> > (parrallel valve) that weighs much less than the angle valve IO360 and is
> > cheaper by a bit. Thing is if one device claims to add 8 horsepower, EI
> > ignition for example, and another 10 horsepower, the cool air manifold,
> and
> > porting another 4 or 6 and so on (one place claimed 4 horses per
> > cylinder)---I do not believe it would be cumulative. Aircraft engines have
> > been around so long and no one ever seems to put them on a dyno. My hotrod
> > friends have many more resources including chassis dynos to tune their
> > engines. Does anyone have any real experinece mildly hotrodding these
> engines
> > that is backed up by a dyno
>
> Don't waste your money on the Lightspeed Ignition. Yes, my engine runs
> smoothly on the right side (I have a mag on the left), and in "both", but
> that's about all I've noticed. No big jump in performance or anything. The
> electrical connections seem cheesy, and certainly not what one would expect
> of aviation-quality connections intended to be mechanically strong and
> vibration resistant.
>
> Further, support from this Klaus guy is abslolutely abysmal, if that good.
> Here's the story:
>
> I was having trouble getting the hookup for the tach output to work. I
> bought an Electronics International tach that was configured to accept the
> Lightspeed square-wave on the right side. I first discovered that Klaus, in
> his infinite wisdom, chose not to pre-wire the plug with an output wire for
> the tach pick-up, so disassembly of his plug was required. There,
> solder-type pins were found, requiring a bit of delicate work to wire-up the
> output. I had an avionics technician buddy come out to my hangar and help
> with the wiring.
>
> Then, the tach wouldn't read anything but zero's on the right side. So, my
> buddy came back out to my hangar with an O-scope to trouble shoot. He
> needed some info about just what he should seeing to verify a good
> square-wave, so my buddy called the number printed on the side of the
> Lightspeed box. Mr. Klaus, rather than take 30 sec and provide a bit of
> engineering data, instructed us to go to "the web" and get it there. (I've
> called the all-knowing Klaus before, and I should have known that his
> response would be "it's on the web.")
>
> Well sports fans, I don't know about you, but my hangar isn't equipped with
> a computer terminal and access to "the web." Frankly, I was embarassed with
> Klaus' brush-off of my buddy. I suppose engineer-supreme Klaus' time is
> just too valuable to waste on common folk.
>
> So, we called the folks at Electronics Int'l. They could not have been more
> helpful. My buddy worked with their engineer. Apparently Lightspeed had
> made a change, unbeknownst to EI, to the square-wave . So, EI took my tach
> back, reworked it, and now all is well.
>
> It was a superb demonstration of the extremes of customer service. After
> all this, you won't get me to buy even a piece of heat shrink tubing from
> Klaus Savior/Sauvior/Sauvier, or however you spell his name.
>
> Randy Compton
> N84VF RV-3A
> Gulf Breeze, FL
>
Thanks for the info Randy. That is interesting for me. I have been thinking of
an electronic ignition on one side.
I like the one from Chattanooga better because it has a machined part to go in
the mag hole instead of the way Light Speed does it. It looks a little more
"designed".
Then when I weigh everything, a trusty old mag, new out of the box is about half
price of one of the electronic thingy's. They are pretty reliable for a couple
thousand hours... Hard to beat.
Phil
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Norman Younie" <rv6capt(at)pacificcoast.net> |
I have an 0-360 A3A in the engine shop being overhauled . Anybody interested.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jeff Orear" <jorear(at)new.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: HS Hinges in the wrong place: @%%&@! |
Stupid Man...er..Al :)
This is a good time to get the hang of drilling out rivets. Drill out those
toward the TE on the bottom of the HS just enough far forward to allow you
to get a hand and a bucking bar to the forward surface of your rear spar.
You will be able to peel the skin back just enough to get in there.
Whatever you do, don't poprivet the hinges on.
Minor setback, not requiring you to mount said parts on a "wall of shame"
and start over!
Regards,
Jeff Orear
RV6A
fuselage coming outta the fixture this week
Peshtigo, WI
----- Original Message -----
From: <karpinski(at)baldcom.net>
Subject: RV-List: HS Hinges in the wrong place: @%%&@!
>
>
> I have been just been so humbled !! AGAIN !!
>
> *******************************
>
> So finished the Horizontal Stabilizer..
>
> Skin is on ..
>
> Everything came out perfect.. NOT ! NOT ! NOT !!
>
> So I just realized I have placed two of the four elevator hinges in the
> wrong place.
>
> Given the hinges are used for Elevator attachment..
>
> Pop rivetting the hinges in the correct position are out of the question
...
> (??)
>
> So .. is it a call to Vans for a new HS kit?
>
>
> Signed !
>
> One Stupid Stupid Man !
>
>
> Al
>
> RV-8
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randall Henderson" <randallh(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: HS Hinges in the wrong place: @%%&@! |
> So I just realized I have placed two of the four elevator hinges
> in the wrong place.
[snip]
> So .. is it a call to Vans for a new HS kit?
Just get a new spar. Jeez I had 3 junked rudder spars sitting in the corner
of my garage by the time I was done.... Look at it this way -- when you
need some .040 angle or channel somewhere else down the line, you'll be
grateful for that junked spar.
Randall Henderson, RV-6 N6R (~400 hrs)
Portland, OR
www.vanshomewing.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <karpinski(at)baldcom.net> |
| Subject: | HS Hinges in the wrong place: @%%&@! YES !! |
THANKS !!
Yes !! of course...
I will drill out the skin rivets on the bottom side of the HS..
I will be able to "Gently" bend back the skin..
Rivet brackets in the correct place...
And close up the skin.. (and no one will ever know.. !!)
And just think.. I will be having fun while doing it !
Kind of makes you want to do everything wrong.. So you can do it over !! :>
Thanks again...
Stupid Man...er.. AKA .... Al :)
This is a good time to get the hang of drilling out rivets. Drill out those
toward the TE on the bottom of the HS just enough far forward to allow you
to get a hand and a bucking bar to the forward surface of your rear spar.
You will be able to peel the skin back just enough to get in there.
Whatever you do, don't poprivet the hinges on.
Minor setback, not requiring you to mount said parts on a "wall of shame"
and start over!
Regards,
Jeff Orear
RV6A
fuselage coming outta the fixture this week
Peshtigo, WI
----- Original Message -----
From: <karpinski(at)baldcom.net>
Subject: RV-List: HS Hinges in the wrong place: @%%&@!
>
>
> I have been just been so humbled !! AGAIN !!
>
> *******************************
>
> So finished the Horizontal Stabilizer..
>
> Skin is on ..
>
> Everything came out perfect.. NOT ! NOT ! NOT !!
>
> So I just realized I have placed two of the four elevator hinges in the
> wrong place.
>
> Given the hinges are used for Elevator attachment..
>
> Pop rivetting the hinges in the correct position are out of the question
...
> (??)
>
> So .. is it a call to Vans for a new HS kit?
>
>
> Signed !
>
> One Stupid Stupid Man !
>
>
> Al
>
> RV-8
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: HS Hinges in the wrong place: @%%&@! |
In a message dated 10/27/02 9:14:02 AM Pacific Standard Time,
karpinski(at)baldcom.net writes:
<< So I just realized I have placed two of the four elevator hinges in the
wrong place. >>
Hi Al, don't be so hard on yourself, I did the same thing when I built my
stabilizer, only in my case I had all four hinges misplaced by, as I recall,
about a half inch. After I finished with the weeping and gnashing of teeth I
called Van's. The upshot was to simply locate the hinges on the elevators to
match and move on. Whatever you do, check with Van's first.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, electrical stuff
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bartrim, Todd" <sbartrim(at)mail.canfor.ca> |
| Subject: | Torx head screws |
You can go direct to them at
http://www.microfasteners.com/catalog/products/SSCFCMXS.cfm
They are listed as 6 lobe drive screws, but are Torx. I suspect it has
something to do with avoiding royalty payments for using the trademarked
name "Torx".
S. Todd Bartrim
Turbo 13B rotary powered
RX-9endurance (FWF)
C-FSTB (reserved)
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
> -----Original Message-----
> From: cecilth(at)juno.com [SMTP:cecilth(at)juno.com]
> Sent: Saturday, October 26, 2002 5:47 PM
> To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Subject: Re: RV-List: Torx head screws
>
>
> I go there and search for torx head screws and they are not there.
>
>
> writes:
> >
> > http://www.microfasteners.com/
>
>
> Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today
> Only $9.95 per month!
> Visit www.juno.com
>
>
>
>
>
RE: RV-List: Torx head screws
You can go direct to them at http://www.microfasteners.com/catalog/products/SSCFCMXS.cfm
They are listed as 6 lobe drive screws, but are Torx. I suspect it has something
to do with avoiding royalty payments for using the trademarked name Torx.
S. Todd Bartrim
Turbo 13B rotary powered
RX-9endurance (FWF)
C-FSTB (reserved)
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm
-----Original Message-----
From: cecilth(at)juno.com [SMTP:cecilth(at)juno.com]
Subject: Re: RV-List: Torx head screws
-- RV-List message posted by: cecilth(at)juno.com
I go there and search for torx head screws and they are not there.
writes:
-- RV-List message posted by: Larry Bowen Larry(at)BowenAero.com
http://www.microfasteners.com/
Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today
Only $9.95 per month!
Visit www.juno.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary & Carolyn Zilik <zilik(at)direcpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: TFR's, HP mods, and DON"T BUY LIGHTSPEED IGNITION |
go to http://www.cafefoundation.org/research.htm and scroll down the page to
ingnition dynamics I, II and III. While this does not test the Lightspeed
ignition (Electroair is tested) it does give valuble info that we all can
benifit from. Basically below 10000' the EI does not show much improved
performance. Get to 12500 and above and the EI shines compared to MAGS.
Gary
> Don't waste your money on the Lightspeed Ignition. Yes, my engine runs
> smoothly on the right side (I have a mag on the left), and in "both", but
> that's about all I've noticed. No big jump in performance or anything. The
> electrical connections seem cheesy, and certainly not what one would expect
> of aviation-quality connections intended to be mechanically strong and
> vibration resistant.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <karpinski(at)baldcom.net> |
| Subject: | FIXED !! : HS Hinges WERE in the wrong place !! :>! |
Per your question Building a RV8..
Hinge I mount incorrectly were the HS412PP's
****************************
45 Minutes per side..... Fixed!!
**********************************************************************
Pre-punch 26 Rivet heads on bottom side skin !! (Just to be sure no
wandering)
Drill out using 3 drill sizes.. (Just to be sure.. Take your time... )
Skin peels right back... OK..
Use the 4" Yoke from Avery.. (That I purchased .. Just know in would need it
some day ::>))
Set the hinges in the correct location!
*************************
26 Rivets closesup the skin again !!!
Could never tell...
(Big Smile... take break.. do other side after dinner !)
*********************
THANKS GUYS !!
AL
_________________________
Al Karpinski
Hey Al,
First let me say that I can relate as can almost all the builders that
follow the RV-list. That &
$@ sinking feeling is hard to forget. In the long
run it tends to make us a bit more cautious though.
You've got me stumped, Which aircraft kit are you building?
which two of the elevator mounts are placed wrong?!
How are they placed?
It was a few years back, my memory tells me that the HS was pre-punched for
these mounts.
The AN riveting system as designed has does have leeway built in to allow
for 'repeated' repairs.
If you are correct in your judgment as to wrong positioning you should be
able to repair the stab. You might have to order some parts but you should
be able to minimize the parts order list. Peeling skins back to effect
repairs is done in the industry all the time. It's a pain in the butt, it is
all part a parcel of this game.
If you have not yet had to drill out rivets you should do a time out and
practice on some scrap materials.
For longer rivets larger than 3/32" diameter:
Find the center of the rivet head, using light pressure drill into the head
only to the depth of the thickness of the rivet head.
insert the butt end of a drill shank of the same size drill into the drilled
head and twist the head off. On rivets larger than 3/32" I use an under
sized drill and center drill into the remaining shank being careful to stay
on center. I drill only part of the way, about 2/3 of depth into the shank,
this allows the shank to relax as it is driven out.
Insert a small diameter punch into the partially drilled rivet shank and tap
with small hammer.
For 3/32" flush rivets I generally drill off the factory head and after
disassembly pick off the shop heads with some flush side cutters that can be
bought at any electrical supply outlet. If need be, support thinner
materials from behind if punching out rivets.
Avoid drilling right through rivets to remove them doing so in practice will
tend to oversize some average number of the holes and often ends with
background structure damage. Not to mention the surface area around the
rivet hole that can be caused by the drill chuck.
I use a variable speed electric drill for these procedures. For me the speed
control gives better results.
Sorry to hear of your frustration. I hope this helps
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: <karpinski(at)baldcom.net>
Subject: RV-List: HS Hinges in the wrong place: @%%&@!
>
>
> I have been just been so humbled !! AGAIN !!
>
> *******************************
>
> So finished the Horizontal Stabilizer..
>
> Skin is on ..
>
> Everything came out perfect.. NOT ! NOT ! NOT !!
>
> So I just realized I have placed two of the four elevator hinges in the
> wrong place.
>
> Given the hinges are used for Elevator attachment..
>
> Pop rivetting the hinges in the correct position are out of the question
...
> (??)
>
> So .. is it a call to Vans for a new HS kit?
>
>
> Signed !
>
> One Stupid Stupid Man !
>
>
> Al
>
> RV-8
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: HS Hinges in the wrong place: @%%&@! |
>
>So I just realized I have placed two of the four elevator hinges in the
>wrong place.
I wonder what wrong place you mean...did you put the hinges on the wings or
what???
Don't automatically reject blind (pop) rivets, some are stronger than
driven ones.
I wonder if nuts and bolts are an answer??
Van's engineers might have other suggestions.
In any case, remember that control surfaces are very critical components.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK flying!
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JRWillJR(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: . and engine horsepower mods. |
Stein, not meant to be argumentative but the RV7 has a 235 MPH VNE. I am not
sure why Van would build it so if he did not intend it to be used. The angle
valve engine makes 200 horses but is heavy compared to the 0-360 parallel
valve engine. If one can without excessive cost get 200ish horses from that
engine a significant performance increase should be expected. Since aviation
engines are something much talked about but rarely actually put on a dyno
therefore my question. Yes, I agree the increases cannot be cummulative. I
cannot see that messing around with the engine makes all bets off with a Vans
RV7 either. The Superior XP360 is already experimental and likely a better
engine than the Lycoming with several neat improvements. Superior will also
soon release their cold air induction system. I was planning on Lightspeed
Plasma II not so much for horsepower but for the ability to adjust timing for
auto fuel and the smoothness and the use of auto sparkplugs. What electronic
unit would be more acceptable if the Lightspeed is thought poorely off? Do
Not Archive. Take care. JR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy Compton" <rdcompton(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Lightspeed Ignition...you can't complain about the customer support; |
there is none
> Thanks for the info Randy. That is interesting for me. I have been
thinking of
> an electronic ignition on one side.
> I like the one from Chattanooga better because it has a machined part to
go in
> the mag hole instead of the way Light Speed does it. It looks a little
more
> "designed".
>
> Then when I weigh everything, a trusty old mag, new out of the box is
about half
> price of one of the electronic thingy's. They are pretty reliable for a
couple
> thousand hours... Hard to beat.
>
> Phil
As you can see, some folks have a great experience with Lightspeed and it's
owner. Mine has been otherwise. I installed the Lightspeed as part of a
major overhaul. If I had it do over, I'd have gone with mags on both sides.
Since I don't routinely fly above 7500 feet msl, I haven't observed any
quantifiable pereformance gain.
And I still stand by my observation that Lightspeed's customer support
stinks. Twice I tried to obtain a smidgen of info from them; both times the
response was "go to the web." Ain't practical when one is hanging over the
edge of the airplane tinkering with the innards. Probably took him longer
to tout the virtues of the web than it would to have just answered my
question.
Randy Compton
RV-3A N84VF
Gulf Breeze, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
Listers,
Just got back from LOE2. Those that were able to attend, had a great time!
That crappy scud that grounded our eastern brethren was truly noticeable.
Last year, the ramp was packed with RV's all the way down towards the east
end where Col. Borman's hangar sits. This year, just a few rows of
airplanes made it. Most came from the west, New Mexico (myself, Larry
Pardue, Norm Schippers and Charles Fink) and a few squeeked in through IMC
from Texas and yes, even Alabama. An intrepid RV6A driver braved the wx and
made it....IFR for quite a ways so he told me. He's a corporate pilot so
he's obviously quite IFR current. He also won a craftsmanship award and
longest distance flown award. Well done!
The Van's guys were there with the RV-9 (yes, the taildragger version) and
the RV-7. That -9 is SWEEEET folks. Both were flying constantly. The RV
dreamers and builders probably outnumbered the fliers this year by quite a
margin. I gave a couple of rides myself, and Paul Rosales was continually
airborne delivering RV grins. We managed a four-ship formation flight, with
yours truly in the lead. Man, I sure hacked my way through it, but
evidently it looked good from the ground. The SoCal wing guys did all the
hard work flying off my wings and tail.
The wx was really quite nice, with scattered puffies most of the time. More
serious looking shower activity showed up Saturday late day and several of
us scurried our airplanes over to the sunshade for hail protection...which
didn't show up. The banquet that night was great of course, with Red Marron
doing his usual bangup job as master of ceremonies. Good food, groovy
mariachis, and great RV friends. All was well, but we missed our eastern
friends! Next year folks...next year.
What really made this one special for me was my son, Skyler. He made his
first cross country trip in the RV! He did just great, sitting on Debbie's
lap, strapped down to her lap belt with a padded belt I found at Baby's R
Us. He slept the whole way down and back home as well. That Lycosaur drone
does wonders. "Hon, Skyler won't fall asleep. Gotta go fly. Be right
back." Hehe. That could come in handy! We placed plugs in his ears for
hearing protection. He just won't tolerate a headset, nor will they fit at
only 10 months of age. He was quite the hit at the fly-in. I think his
hugs and kisses quota is quite satisfied for this month.
Fly safely folks.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
312 hrs.
http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)qcbc.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Lightspeed Ignition...you can't complain about the customer |
support; there is none
Bohanan went to 43,000 with Ordinary Slick Mags. A world's record.
Cy Galley
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randy Compton" <rdcompton(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: Lightspeed Ignition...you can't complain about the
customer support; there is none
>
> > Thanks for the info Randy. That is interesting for me. I have been
> thinking of
> > an electronic ignition on one side.
> > I like the one from Chattanooga better because it has a machined part to
> go in
> > the mag hole instead of the way Light Speed does it. It looks a little
> more
> > "designed".
> >
> > Then when I weigh everything, a trusty old mag, new out of the box is
> about half
> > price of one of the electronic thingy's. They are pretty reliable for a
> couple
> > thousand hours... Hard to beat.
> >
> > Phil
>
> As you can see, some folks have a great experience with Lightspeed and
it's
> owner. Mine has been otherwise. I installed the Lightspeed as part of a
> major overhaul. If I had it do over, I'd have gone with mags on both
sides.
> Since I don't routinely fly above 7500 feet msl, I haven't observed any
> quantifiable pereformance gain.
>
> And I still stand by my observation that Lightspeed's customer support
> stinks. Twice I tried to obtain a smidgen of info from them; both times
the
> response was "go to the web." Ain't practical when one is hanging over
the
> edge of the airplane tinkering with the innards. Probably took him longer
> to tout the virtues of the web than it would to have just answered my
> question.
>
> Randy Compton
> RV-3A N84VF
> Gulf Breeze, FL
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
Brian Denk wrote:
>
>
> Listers,
>
> Just got back from LOE2. Those that were able to attend, had a great time!
> That crappy scud that grounded our eastern brethren was truly noticeable.
> Last year, the ramp was packed with RV's all the way down towards the east
> end where Col. Borman's hangar sits. This year, just a few rows of
> airplanes made it. Most came from the west, New Mexico (myself, Larry
> Pardue, Norm Schippers and Charles Fink) and a few squeeked in through IMC
> from Texas and yes, even Alabama. An intrepid RV6A driver braved the wx and
> made it....IFR for quite a ways so he told me. He's a corporate pilot so
> he's obviously quite IFR current. He also won a craftsmanship award and
> longest distance flown award. Well done!
Brian, thanks for the report! This makes us ground-bounders
feel......well.......we still feel rotten because we SO wanted to make
the trip to LOE! We had fifteen planes in a gaggle all ready to go.
Glad to hear our TVRVBG team of Glen and Phyllis Plugge did us proud by
slogging through solid IFR until Midland in the RV-6A, then arriving
safely in LRU to claim the "Longest Distance" and a craftsmanship award.
If that pile of junk Glen was driving got an award, I can't wait until
we can get the nice planes out there next year!!!!!! ;-) (the hard
time Glen will receive from the TVRVBG has already started......)
Glad you had a good trip; (actually, we wish it had rained on
you.......MAN! we are still stinging from getting knocked out of that
trip........!)
Did I say we hated not being able to make the trip? Maybe next year.
Sam Buchanan (still bummed out)
Tennessee Valley RV Builders Group http://www.tvrvbg.org
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: N910LL Flies !! |
List:
Couldn't wait to get to the computer to announce that RV-8A N910LL made its
maiden voyage today. Flight lasted approx 15 minutes with Larry Bowen on the
ground on his handheld and Wayne Williams in his 8A flying chase.
Heavy left wing, map gauge not working, both airspeed indicators not working
correctly. Landing was a greaser !!!
Len Leggette, RV-8A
Greensboro, NC
N910LL - Flying !!
________________________________________________________________________________
rv7-list(at)matronics.com, rv8-list(at)matronics.com, rv9-list(at)matronics.com,
rv10-list(at)matronics.com, rv-list(at)matronics.com
| From: | Matt Dralle <dralle(at)matronics.com> |
| Subject: | Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...) (The Final VOTE!) |
Dear RV Listers,
Okay, its after 5pm pst on Sunday and as promised, I've closed the
polls. I've counted the votes and recounted the votes, and even double
checked all of the Chad and the totals keep coming up the same. Are you
ready for this spread? Here is the official vote count:
95 votes: Forward
96 votes: Don't Forward
Unbelievable, I know. The totals ran within 1 to 2 votes of each other the
entire voting period. I couldn't believe it either. How could the split
be so close? Perhaps I should have turned to the Electoral College for
assistance... Or maybe Florida... :-) Much to Gore's delight, the popular
vote really did count!
So, the people have spoken and as of 5:19pm pst I have disabled the auto
forwarding from the RV-specific Lists to the main RV-List. As I mentioned
earlier, I really was on the fence about the right way, so thanks to
everyone for helping with the decision!
Isn't democracy great!
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
Hey RV Listers,
Okay, so I really don't mean to drag this out, but unbelievably, we have a
dead heat between "Forward" votes and "Don't Forward" votes! I had no idea
the opinion would run so close!! I've gotten a little over 100 votes so
far and it is literally a 50/50 split to the vote on which way to go. Over
the last week or so, each day I've gotten a couple of votes to Forward,
then a couple of votes to Not Forward - back and forth. With this many
people on both sides of the fence, no matter which way wins, there's gonna
be a lot of disappointed people! And I thought this vote would make it
easy for me to decide...
I'm going to keep the polls open until Sunday afternoon at 5pm pst, and
just go with the method that has the most votes - even if its just 1 or 2
votes. This is just like the Bush/Gore election; I'm down to counting
chad... You guys from Florida get your votes in! :-)
Here's how to vote - follow closely to make it easiest for me to count:
-- To Vote FORWARD --
* This means that you would like to have any messages posted to the
RV-specific lists automatically forwarded to the main RV-List.
Send an email message to: dralle(at)matronics.com
Make the SUBJECT line: "Forward"
-- To Vote DON'T FORWARD --
* This means that you don't want messages posted to the RV-specific lists
automatically forwarded to the main RV-List.
Send an email message to: dralle(at)matronics.com
Make the SUBJECT line: "Don't Forward"
If you care, here's your chance to make a difference! Get your vote in
before Sunday at 5pm pst. I'll announce the winner Sunday night...
Hey - and there's only voting one time, you guys! You know who you are... :-)
Matt Dralle
Email List Admin.
=============================================================================
Thanks Scott! The votes are still trickling in and its a REALLY, REALLY
close race. If you have a preference and haven't yet voted, it so close
that one or two votes could actually make the difference. PLEASE only vote
once, though! To be fair, multiple votes from the same email address will
not be counted.
Matt
At 07:07 AM 10/19/2002 Saturday, you wrote:
>
>Matt,
>
>You're doing a great job managing this.
>
>Chris
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Matt Dralle" <dralle(at)matronics.com>
>Subject: RV-List: Re: posting (To Forward or Not to Forward...)
>
>
> > --> RV10-List message posted by: dralle(at)matronics.com (Matt Dralle)
> >
> >
> > Kevin's right, except for the RV7, RV9, and RV10 Lists. The way its
> > been set up is when someone posts to the RV3, RV4, RV6, and RV8 Lists
> > a copy is automatically sent to the RV-List too. For some reason, the
> > 7/9/10 lists weren't configured that way; probably because I added
> > them later and forgot that about the forwarding.
> >
> > In anycase, for now I've added the forward feature the 7/9/10 Lists to
>keep
> > everything consistant.
> >
> > However, I don't have a stong preference either way, actually. I can
> > see pros and cons to each. Would people prefer the not-forwarding
> > operation? Sounds like it they might...
> >
> > So let's vote! Drop me an email at:
> >
> > dralle(at)matronics.com
> >
> > with a simple:
> >
> > "Forward"
> > or
> > "Don't Forward"
> >
> > in the Subject Line. I'll added up the votes in a couple of days and
> > announce the new method.
> >
> >
> > Matt Dralle
> > List Admin.
> >
> >
> > >--------------
> > >
> > >Gary,
> > >
> > >Sorry, I have to respectfully disagree here. I am a member of Matt's
> > >RV8-list and the RV-list. If I post a message to the RV8-list, I get
> > >two copies - one that comes from the RV8-list, and a copy that comes
> > >across on the main RV-list.
> > >
> > >I just checked my Out Box - my message to Steve was sent to the
> > >RV4-List only. The copy you replied too seems to have come from the
> > >main RV-List.
> > >
> > >Search the RV-List archives for the text " New Specific RV Lists Auto
> > >Forwarded to RV-List" (don't include the quote marks. You'll find
> > >Matt's description of how the system works. I believe it causes
> > >confusion, because a lot of people on the main RV-List don't
> > >understand that they need study the original message to see where it
> > >originated, and send their response to the message to the correct
> > >list. Otherwise, the original poster may not see the response. But,
> > >Matt likes it the way it is, and these are his lists.
> > >
> > >Kevin
> > >
> > >>
> > >>Kevin.....actually, messages posted to model-specific Matronics
> > >>lists do not automatically post to the RV list. You can post to any
> > >>list or combination of lists you like, but you have to send it to
> > >>the ones you want it to show up on.
> > >>
> > >>Gary
> > >>
> > >>From: Kevin Horton <khorto1537(at)rogers.com>
> > >>Subject: Re: RV-List: Re: RV4-List: Bleeding Brakes
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>Steve,
> > >>
> > >>.................. Any message posted to one of the RV model specific
> > >>list also gets posted to the main RV List. Any responses to the copy
> > >>of the message that goes to the main RV List only go to the main RV
> > >>List - they don't go back to the RV model specific list, ...............
> > >
> > >
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LOE2 report: more wacky ramblings |
>If that pile of junk Glen was driving got an award, I can't wait until
>we can get the nice planes out there next year!!!!!! ;-) (the hard
>time Glen will receive from the TVRVBG has already started......)
HAH! Evidently, Colonel Borman thought it was a nicely assembled pile!
Glen's plane was parked right next to me. When I first heard his southern
drawl, I thought, "Oh hell, there goes the neighborhood." Silly me. His was
the nicest trailer in the park! (Deb and I watched "Joe Dirt" on the TV at
the hotel room. Seems appropriate right now.) Hehe. *snort*
>
>Glad you had a good trip; (actually, we wish it had rained on
>you.......MAN! we are still stinging from getting knocked out of that
>trip........!)
It did rain on me...very slightly, as I walked outside the hangar during the
banquet...beer in hand. Whoa is me...whoa is me...
>
>Did I say we hated not being able to make the trip? Maybe next year.
Uh yeah....I reckon you did. Missed you guys. We really did. Oh, Doug
Reeves received HUGE kudos from Red during the banquet. Ya did a great job,
Doug!!
And on a lighter note, there was a report of a toilet papering, bestowed
upon Laird "Fowling Piece" Owens' RV-6 after receiving the much coveted,
lauded and lusted after Grand Champion award. Witnesses were interviewed,
interrogated and bought off as necessary to find the most likely suspect,
who goes by the name of "NORDO ROSIE".
More news at eleven. :)
Brian "don't let him lead or #4 will end up in the dirt" Denk
RV8 N94BD
http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Konrad Werner" <Connywerner(at)wans.net> |
| Subject: | Re: N910LL Flies !! |
Dear Len,
Congratulations on that first flight!! Good job.
But please troubleshoot & fix your Airspeed Indicators ASAP so we don't have
another casualty. Have a safe flight!!
Konrad Werner / ABQ
> Couldn't wait to get to the computer to announce that RV-8A N910LL made
its
> maiden voyage today. Flight lasted approx 15 minutes with Larry Bowen on
the
> ground on his handheld and Wayne Williams in his 8A flying chase.
>
> Heavy left wing, map gauge not working, both airspeed indicators not
working
> correctly. Landing was a greaser !!!
>
> Len Leggette, RV-8A
> Greensboro, NC
> N910LL - Flying !!
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kyle Boatright" <kyle.boatright(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Leftover Paint & Solvents |
As you may note from the new e-mail address, things are changing in my life. Not
only do I have a new cable modem and e-mail account, I also have a new house
(complete with 1200 SF workshop). What I would have given to have that workshop
as I built N46KB!
Anyway, as I began moving stuff out of the old house, I came across several gallons
of leftover solvent, primer (had to get that in there), etc., plus numerous
rattle cans of paint. I really don't want to move this stuff, because I can't
see using it in the next several years. So, what in the heck do I do with
all this stuff? Pouring the entire mess into my neighbor's garbage can at
3:00 AM just seems wrong...
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net> |
Listers:
Brian Denk has already reported on it, but I add a few snapshots. If
interested,
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/LOE2.htm
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Ahearn" <dahearn(at)attbi.com> |
| Subject: | Project tracking software |
Greetings all.
After 10 years of daydreaming I just ordered my RV-7 preview plans.
I expect to begin work in January.
I'm in the tool building and shop prep time mode until year end.
I downloaded a copy of Kitlog Pro. It looks pretty useful as a
builders log. Can anyone offer any comments>
Regards
Dan
Highland Village TX
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken Stribling" <ken(at)soundsuckers.com> |
| Subject: | Alternative Engine |
I am considering putting a Subaru engine in my 6a from Eggenfellner and
would like to get a opinion from some one flying one now. and preferable
someone who has changed out there Lycoming to Subaru so I will be able to
know what I will be looking at as far as how long my plane will be down.
If I decide to go this way I will have a high a 2000 hr firewall forward
0-320, Prop and cowling for sale.
Thanks Ken S. 60 hours and still loving it .
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Terry Watson" <terry(at)tcwatson.com> |
| Subject: | Those blasted TFR's.... |
Those who don't know the difference between a right and a privilege put them
both at risk for all of us. Fortunately, those brave and thoughtful men who
wrote our constitution did know the difference.
Terry
Dear Jerry,
I really doesn't matter what each individual call's it for himself, but
rather how anyone personally treats it: As a Privilege earned, or a Right
given!
I do not know how long ago you first got your ticket(s), but I earned mine
just this summer, and I would like to keep my privilege to fly for as long
as possible.
So why doesn't some "Pro-Right" pilot prove it for all of us, and fly
through the TFR @ G.W.'s Ranch when he and the first Lady are present, and
then please brief us on the outcome on trying to defend your "Right to Fly".
(Note: Scape Goat's of any kind are always in demand.)
No offense to anyone please!
Konrad Werner
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Terry Burks <tburks2(at)knology.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Leftover Paint & Solvents |
Kyle,
See if your local sanitation department has a Hazardous Waste program. Here in
Huntsville, you can drop off paints, solvents, acids, household cleaners, chemicals,
etc. at the land fill one Saturday morning a month.
Terry Burks
Huntsville, AL
RV-8 QB, empennage
"Kyle Boatright" wrote:
>
> As you may note from the new e-mail address, things are changing in my life.
Not only do I have a new cable modem and e-mail account, I also have a new house
(complete with 1200 SF workshop). What I would have given to have that workshop
as I built N46KB!
>
> Anyway, as I began moving stuff out of the old house, I came across several gallons
of leftover solvent, primer (had to get that in there), etc., plus numerous
rattle cans of paint. I really don't want to move this stuff, because I
can't see using it in the next several years. So, what in the heck do I do with
all this stuff? Pouring the entire mess into my neighbor's garbage can at
3:00 AM just seems wrong...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ken Simmons" <ken(at)truckstop.com> |
| Subject: | Project tracking software |
I've been using the Kitlog Pro for my RV-8 project (just starting on the
wing). I think it's a great product and Paul provides great support
including email announcements of updates. Definitely worth the money.
Ken
>
>
> Greetings all.
>
> After 10 years of daydreaming I just ordered my RV-7 preview plans.
> I expect to begin work in January.
>
> I'm in the tool building and shop prep time mode until year end.
>
> I downloaded a copy of Kitlog Pro. It looks pretty useful as a
> builders log. Can anyone offer any comments>
>
> Regards
>
> Dan
> Highland Village TX
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Denis Walsh <deniswalsh(at)earthlink.net> |
Larry, a marvelous coverage of the fly in. Well done and thank you.
> From: "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net>
> Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 20:29:33 -0700
> To:
> Subject: RV-List: LOE2
>
>
> Listers:
>
> Brian Denk has already reported on it, but I add a few snapshots. If
> interested,
>
> http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/LOE2.htm
>
> Larry Pardue
> Carlsbad, NM
>
> RV-6 N441LP Flying
> http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "RV6 Flyer" <rv6_flyer(at)hotmail.com> |
Have around 80 images to forward to Doug Reeves for him to post.
To see a few of the photos till he posts them, point your browsers to:
Brian Denk's formation:
http://members3.clubphoto.com/socal230330/974181/owner-9b41.phtml
The Banquet:
http://members3.clubphoto.com/socal230330/974105/owner-9b41.phtml
The Awards:
http://members3.clubphoto.com/socal230330/974070/owner-9b41.phtml
Also got a couple of photos of the airplanes that got pushed in hangars when
the National Weather Service issued a SERVE THUNDERSTORM watch Saturday
evenining.
http://members3.clubphoto.com/socal230330/974272/owner-9b41.phtml
All the SoCAL RV'ers sure did miss all the Texas, Colorado, Kansas, and East
Coast RVs. We had SoCAL RV'ers that flew commercial into El Paso so that
they could attend.
Gary A. Sobek
"My Sanity" RV-6 N157GS O-320 Hartzell,
1,209 + Flying Hours So. CA, USA
http://SoCAL_WVAF.rvproject.com
----Original Message Follows----
From: "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)carlsbad.net>
Subject: RV-List: LOE2
Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 20:29:33 -0700
Listers:
Brian Denk has already reported on it, but I add a few snapshots. If
interested,
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/LOE2.htm
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://www.carlsbadnm.com/n5lp/index.htm
http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Al Mojzisik <prober(at)iwaynet.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Project tracking software |
Dan,
I shared a booth with Paul and Steve at Oshkosh this year and heard and saw
him demonstrating the KitLog Pro Software many times. It is a very good
program! Support is great and the EAA is very excited about the program. I
think that they figure this software will help standardize a whole lot of
the record keeping and make it a lot easier for builders and
inspectors. You can keep your written builders log, expenses, and
photographic log in one place and well organized. At any given time you
can burn it onto a CD if you have the capability or print it out and have a
hard copy. Paul knows from experience how important it is to keep a
back-up-able record since he lost a lot of his builders (cyber) log before
he became involved with KitLog Pro. I really think the software is a big
winner! (Especially for the price!) AL
>
>Greetings all.
>
>After 10 years of daydreaming I just ordered my RV-7 preview plans.
>I expect to begin work in January.
>
>I'm in the tool building and shop prep time mode until year end.
>
>I downloaded a copy of Kitlog Pro. It looks pretty useful as a
>builders log. Can anyone offer any comments>
>
>Regards
>
>Dan
>Highland Village TX
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Robin Hunt" <robinrmh(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | RE: RV-List Digest: 52 Msgs - 10/27/02 |
I must say something about Klause and lightspeed ignitions. I started
out with a single lightspeed I ignition. At around 200 hours I had a
brand new Slick mag fail. This past summer I installed a second
lightspeed ignition in place of the mag. Klause has been very helpful
with my installation. Just this past Friday I called him and he
graciously answered some question I had. I could not be more satisfied
with the service or the product.
I cannot tell what performance increase if any there is, but I can tell
you that there was a substantial rpm decrease when switched from the
electronic ignition to the mag, but no decrease when running only on the
electronic.
The electrical connections seem to be quite adequate also.
I highly recommend Klause and lightspeed.
Robin Hunt
RV-8 350 hours
________
From: "Randy Compton" <rdcompton(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: TFR's, HP mods, and DON"T BUY LIGHTSPEED IGNITION
Don't waste your money on the Lightspeed Ignition. Yes, my engine runs
smoothly on the right side (I have a mag on the left), and in "both",
but
that's about all I've noticed. No big jump in performance or anything.
The
electrical connections seem cheesy, and certainly not what one would
expect
of aviation-quality connections intended to be mechanically strong and
vibration resistant.
Further, support from this Klaus guy is abslolutely abysmal, if that
good.
Here's the story:
It was a superb demonstration of the extremes of customer service.
After
all this, you won't get me to buy even a piece of heat shrink tubing
from
Klaus Savior/Sauvior/Sauvier, or however you spell his name.
Randy Compton
N84VF RV-3A
Gulf Breeze, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Parker Thomas <me(at)parkerthomas.com> |
| Subject: | electrical questions |
to all the electronic gurus out there -
i just started my RV8's IO 360 for the first time yesterday after a much needed
overhaul. i have two electronic squawks i can't figure out. my tachometer is
jumping around all over the place from around 700 at idle to up to 3500 at half
throttle. the needle is jumpy. using van's guage and sender. any thoughts?
second, my voltmeter actually goes down when the engine gets faster, ultimately
activating a low voltage warning light on the panel when the engine is at half
throttle. using van's 60 amp alternator with a built in regulator. starts at
around 14 volts at idle and heads down to 12 volts at half throttle. again,
using van's guages.
thanks!
parker thomas
rv8 626CT almost ready for
inspection
---------------------------------------------
Visit http://www.webcountry.net
For total Internet solutions.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Andres" <tim2542(at)charter.net> |
| Subject: | Re: electrical questions |
Make sure all tour grounds are reconnected and secure....then check em again
----- Original Message -----
From: "Parker Thomas" <me(at)parkerthomas.com>
Subject: RV-List: electrical questions
>
> to all the electronic gurus out there -
>
> i just started my RV8's IO 360 for the first time yesterday after a much
needed
> overhaul. i have two electronic squawks i can't figure out. my
tachometer is
> jumping around all over the place from around 700 at idle to up to 3500 at
half
> throttle. the needle is jumpy. using van's guage and sender. any
thoughts?
>
> second, my voltmeter actually goes down when the engine gets faster,
ultimately
> activating a low voltage warning light on the panel when the engine is at
half
> throttle. using van's 60 amp alternator with a built in regulator. starts
at
> around 14 volts at idle and heads down to 12 volts at half throttle.
again,
> using van's guages.
>
> thanks!
>
> parker thomas
> rv8 626CT almost ready for
> inspection
>
> ---------------------------------------------
> Visit http://www.webcountry.net
> For total Internet solutions.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Knicholas2(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | thermocoupler options for micromonitor |
I built a RMI micromonitor for my 0-320 and now have the options for CHT
sensors. The manufacturer sells the bayonet type thermocoupler but the also
approve a washer type thermocoupler made by Westach. Any opinions? (...I
guess that is a dumb question on THIS list, there are LOTS of opinions
here....) Any recommendations?
Kim Nicholas
RV9A
Seattle
(trying to keep up with Andy....)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | John Decuir <dacure(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Pre-purchase inspection |
I am looking at purchasing a 98% complete RV-8 in the southern WA area
(Kelso), and would like to find an experienced builder or A&E with RV
background to look it over. If you know somebody ( maybe in the Porland
area) that could provide this service for a nominal fee, email at
dacure(at)earthlink.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | MeangreenRV4(at)aol.com |
This is somthing that has started in the last month or so. My engine is a IO
360 A1B Angle Valve 200 + hp. On take off my # 1 cycinder goes to 1400
degrees. # 2 1375 degrees. # 3 & 4 1275 degrees. the problem is it never went
past 1300 degrees in the first 200 hrs. Once I climb out, level off
everything seems fine. Something has cause the EGT' on # 1 to go higher.
My problem is I don't understand why.
Things that I have done;
1. Cleaned the injectors
2. Look at and make sure that all hoses & fittings were tight
3. Cleaned all screens
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: N910LL Flies !! |
Len,
CONGRATULATIONS & WELL DONE !!!!
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A
>From: Lenleg(at)aol.com
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: Re: N910LL Flies !!
>Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 19:22:38 EST
>
>
>List:
>
>Couldn't wait to get to the computer to announce that RV-8A N910LL made its
>maiden voyage today. Flight lasted approx 15 minutes with Larry Bowen on
>the
>ground on his handheld and Wayne Williams in his 8A flying chase.
>
>Heavy left wing, map gauge not working, both airspeed indicators not
>working
>correctly. Landing was a greaser !!!
>
>Len Leggette, RV-8A
>Greensboro, NC
>N910LL - Flying !!
>
>
Internet access plans that fit your lifestyle -- join MSN.
http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hal Rozema <hartist1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Project tracking software |
Fantastic. I use a digital camera daily and keep it all on KL. I'm about
half way (10%) on my Zenith CH701 VSTOL kit, wings and tail all complete and
starting fuselage.
Hal Rozema
theplanefolks.net
Dan Ahearn wrote:
>
> Greetings all.
>
> After 10 years of daydreaming I just ordered my RV-7 preview plans.
> I expect to begin work in January.
>
> I'm in the tool building and shop prep time mode until year end.
>
> I downloaded a copy of Kitlog Pro. It looks pretty useful as a
> builders log. Can anyone offer any comments>
>
> Regards
>
> Dan
> Highland Village TX
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: thermocoupler options for micromonitor |
Hi Kim,
I went with the bayonet type. I'm still on the ground for a while.
Did you try looking in the archives yet? There was a number of inputs on the
subject a couple of years ago.
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: <Knicholas2(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: thermocoupler options for micromonitor
>
> I built a RMI micromonitor for my 0-320 and now have the options for CHT
> sensors. The manufacturer sells the bayonet type thermocoupler but the
also
> approve a washer type thermocoupler made by Westach. Any opinions? (...I
> guess that is a dumb question on THIS list, there are LOTS of opinions
> here....) Any recommendations?
>
> Kim Nicholas
> RV9A
> Seattle
> (trying to keep up with Andy....)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Gary" <rv9er(at)3rivers.net> |
| Subject: | drill and dimple crap |
I was told by Van's that they do everything on the quick-builds that they tell
us to do.....Match drill, deburr, dimple, yada yada.
October 23, 2002 - October 28, 2002
RV-Archive.digest.vol-nr