RV-Archive.digest.vol-oq
December 15, 2003 - December 27, 2003
$60K. Interested in your experiences regarding prices, customer service,
etc...
>
> I checked the archives but found nothing real recent and assume that the
market, and thus prices are probably somewhat volatile, so would like
current info.
>
> I understand that there are are only a couple of underwriters (maybe only
one?) so once I've asked an agent for a quote I'm locked into that agent and
quote for 60 days. Is this info correct? If so, I would sure like to know
where the best deal is before asking for a quote.
>
> The current owner has the airplane insured with the VanGuard program.
>
> Mike Wills
> RV-4 (perpetually under construction)
> RV-6A (almost!)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Cracked Canopy |
Dane,
I cracked the canopy on my six during installation. The crack eminated from a
screw hole on the frame and was 3/4 of an inch long. I stop drilled it with
3/32nd plexiglass drill bit and filled the hole with epoxy. 12 years and 800
hours later it still looks like the day I finished it.
Good Luck
Bill Mahoney
Sherman, CT
RV-6 N747W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fiveonepw(at)aol.com |
Yes I've perused the archives, but I'd appreciate the latest and greatest on
what is a good choice on a generic automotive fuel filter with AN-3 or -4 NPT
fittings....
No, not getting into a gascolator vs. filter fight!!!
From The PossumWorks in TN
Mark - -6A, starting to look like an airplane!!!!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: fuel filters |
| From: | Boyd Braem <bcbraem(at)comcast.net> |
You're lucky--I'd whip your butt if you got a (hot start retarding
device) gascolator. There are several fuel filter brands out
there--look for clear plastic barrel, 120 (?) micron filter (cleanable
and re-useable) and a max fuel flow of about twice what you think your
engine will use.
Jeez, I really miss that "ripsteel" handle.
Love,
Boyd.
On Monday, December 15, 2003, at 08:40 PM, Fiveonepw(at)aol.com wrote:
>
> Yes I've perused the archives, but I'd appreciate the latest and
> greatest on
> what is a good choice on a generic automotive fuel filter with AN-3 or
> -4 NPT
> fittings....
>
> No, not getting into a gascolator vs. filter fight!!!
>
> From The PossumWorks in TN
> Mark - -6A, starting to look like an airplane!!!!!!
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: fuel filters |
| From: | Boyd Braem <bcbraem(at)comcast.net> |
Jeez, what was I thinking, probably the best one out there is from Air
Flow Performance.
On Monday, December 15, 2003, at 09:33 PM, Boyd Braem wrote:
>
> You're lucky--I'd whip your butt if you got a (hot start retarding
> device) gascolator. There are several fuel filter brands out
> there--look for clear plastic barrel, 120 (?) micron filter (cleanable
> and re-useable) and a max fuel flow of about twice what you think your
> engine will use.
>
> Jeez, I really miss that "ripsteel" handle.
>
> Love,
>
> Boyd.
>
>
> On Monday, December 15, 2003, at 08:40 PM, Fiveonepw(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>>
>> Yes I've perused the archives, but I'd appreciate the latest and
>> greatest on
>> what is a good choice on a generic automotive fuel filter with AN-3 or
>> -4 NPT
>> fittings....
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Cracked Canopy |
Weldon-5 and a syringe will do the trick nicely.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (RV-10 soon)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dane Sheahen" <dane(at)mutualace.com>
Subject: RV-List: Cracked Canopy
>
>
> I am looking for advice on what to do with a carked canopy. First off I
> have already drilled a small hole to stop the crack.
> This is the second winter for my RV8a. I flew the plane last week and I
> came back this week and there is the crack. The RV is in an unheated
hangar
> and the temperature got down to 10 degrees the other night. First real
cold
> day of the season, so I am assuming that had something to do with it.
Last
> winter we had periods of cold weather that were colder and for longer
> periods of time.
> The crack starts at the skirt and goes up about 1 1/2 inches.
> Any suggestions?
>
> Dane Sheahen
> RV8a driver
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Karie Daniel" <karie4(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: AOPA Airport Database... |
It's available if you are an Anywheremap subscriber.
Karie Daniel
Sammamish, WA
RV-7A QB
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill VonDane" <bill(at)vondane.com>
Subject: RV-List: AOPA Airport Database...
>
> Anyone know where you can get the AOPA Airport Database for the iPAQ? I
found it for the Palm...
>
> I recently bought Airport Insight for my iPAQ and it is very nice; has all
the info, and is updated regularly for only $40 a year, but I wanted to see
about the AOPA database...
>
> Thanks!
>
> -Bill VonDane
> EAA Tech Counselor
> RV-8A ~ N8WV
> www.vondane.com
> www.creativair.com
> www.epanelbuilder.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jack Lockamy" <jacklockamy(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | Copper Stock tip.... |
To those interested;
My RV-7/9 plans sheet 31A calls for two (2) .063 x 2-7/8" copper strips to be manufactured
by the builder to connect the master contactor and starter contactor
on the firewall. (The copper stock is NOT supplied in the kit.) Rather than
hunt for the stock and purchase a mere 6" of material.....I found a solution.
I took a 2-7/8" piece of 3/8" copper tube I had laying around, put it in my vice,
and squeezed the crap out of it! Came out perfect! 1/2" wide x 2-7/8" long.....
.190 thickness (plans call for 2 pieces of .063 so I am a few thousands
over....).
Jack Lockamy
Camarillo, CA
RV-7A QB
N174JL reserved
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "lucky macy" <luckymacy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ? |
Thanks Sam. Just what I was looking for.
Now my new question of the day.
Anyone have a strong opinion on using the IK-2000 vs Rocky Mountain Engine
monitor vs the Grand Rapids EIS? Any other brand I left out? I don't want
to spend $4k+ for engine info so I've been looking at these systems without
a clear winner coming up.
At first glance the RMI doesn't show all 4 cylinders at once for leaning
purposes, right? The Grand Rapid seems to require too much pilot
interaction to get to the page you want and to read the tiny bar graphs.
The IK-2000 goes the other way to me. Uses too much panel space for the 8
and paying for backup instruments I don't want from that system...
lucky
>From: Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
>Reply-To: vansairforce(at)yahoogroups.com
>To: vansairforce(at)yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [VAF Mailing List] labels
>Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2003 12:15:00 -0600
>
>lucky macy wrote:
>
> > Doug,
> > Do you have a link to a discussion on labeling panels? Labeling sounds
> > trivial but as I start to look into label makers I see a wide range in
>price
> > and types. Is there a *best* type of label for our purposes? A
>recommended
> > font type or size? Any technique that works better than others for
>ensuring
> > the labels stay on past the first month? etc.
>
>
>I'm not Doug but here is one option:
>
>http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal/panel2.html
>
>Scroll down to the bottom of the page. These labels still look
>good-as-new after four years and 525 flight hrs. Matter of fact, I have
>"No Step" on the flaps and they still look great after being on the
>exterior of the plane.
>
>Sam Buchanan
>http://thervjournal.com
>
>==================
>
>
Shop online for kids toys by age group, price range, and toy category at
MSN Shopping. No waiting for a clerk to help you! http://shopping.msn.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ? |
Hi Lucky,
We have the RMI Monitor and encoder. Both were easy to build and the support
from RMI was great.
(e.g. when I finished the encoder it would completely run thru it's state-up
routine. I call RMI and they asked me to send it to them, which I did. I had
it back in 5 days. They said I had forgot to trim off three leads - which
they did plus calibrated the unit for me - No Charge).
Regarding the ability to see all four cyl at the same time - true. But we
bought their four position switch and it's very high quality. You quickly
find out which cyl peaks first and thats where I generally have it
positioned. Then you simply cyclic through all cyls every so often.
We also have the audio alarm output wired directly to the pilot's headset
jack, so if we get an alarm (have set both high and low alarm values) we get
an audible alarm in addition to the visual alarm.
The RMI is not the most sofisicated system but it's simple (we have EGT and
CHT for all cyl on the monitor) and it's been 100% reliable and is very cost
effective. Will use both the MOnitor and encoder in our next RV.
Hope this helps and happy Holidays - Fly Safe,
Chuck & Dave Rowbotham
RV-8A
>From: "lucky macy" <luckymacy(at)hotmail.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: vansairforce(at)yahoogroups.com, rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: RV-List: IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ?
>Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 07:10:49 -0500
>
>
>Thanks Sam. Just what I was looking for.
>
>Now my new question of the day.
>
>Anyone have a strong opinion on using the IK-2000 vs Rocky Mountain Engine
>monitor vs the Grand Rapids EIS? Any other brand I left out? I don't want
>to spend $4k+ for engine info so I've been looking at these systems without
>a clear winner coming up.
>
>At first glance the RMI doesn't show all 4 cylinders at once for leaning
>purposes, right? The Grand Rapid seems to require too much pilot
>interaction to get to the page you want and to read the tiny bar graphs.
>The IK-2000 goes the other way to me. Uses too much panel space for the 8
>and paying for backup instruments I don't want from that system...
>
>lucky
>
>
> >From: Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
> >Reply-To: vansairforce(at)yahoogroups.com
> >To: vansairforce(at)yahoogroups.com
> >Subject: [VAF Mailing List] labels
> >Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2003 12:15:00 -0600
> >
> >lucky macy wrote:
> >
> > > Doug,
> > > Do you have a link to a discussion on labeling panels? Labeling
>sounds
> > > trivial but as I start to look into label makers I see a wide range in
> >price
> > > and types. Is there a *best* type of label for our purposes? A
> >recommended
> > > font type or size? Any technique that works better than others for
> >ensuring
> > > the labels stay on past the first month? etc.
> >
> >
> >I'm not Doug but here is one option:
> >
> >http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal/panel2.html
> >
> >Scroll down to the bottom of the page. These labels still look
> >good-as-new after four years and 525 flight hrs. Matter of fact, I have
> >"No Step" on the flaps and they still look great after being on the
> >exterior of the plane.
> >
> >Sam Buchanan
> >http://thervjournal.com
> >
> >==================
> >
> >
>
>Shop online for kids toys by age group, price range, and toy category at
>MSN Shopping. No waiting for a clerk to help you! http://shopping.msn.com
>
>
Tired of slow downloads and busy signals? Get a high-speed Internet
connection! Comparison-shop your local high-speed providers here.
https://broadband.msn.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net> |
| Subject: | IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ? |
> Anyone have a strong opinion on using the IK-2000 vs Rocky
> Mountain Engine
> monitor vs the Grand Rapids EIS? Any other brand I left out?
> I don't want
> to spend $4k+ for engine info so I've been looking at these
> systems without
> a clear winner coming up.
>
> At first glance the RMI doesn't show all 4 cylinders at once
> for leaning
> purposes, right? The Grand Rapid seems to require too much pilot
> interaction to get to the page you want and to read the tiny
> bar graphs.
> The IK-2000 goes the other way to me. Uses too much panel
> space for the 8
> and paying for backup instruments I don't want from that system...
>
I have the RMI, and I really like everything about it EXCEPT only one
CHT/EGT. I would probably pay up next time and get something showing
all four. If one is chugging along, and a valve starts to go, a four
channel EGT would notify you immediately.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 423 hours
www.usfamily.net/web/alexpeterson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Michael D. Crowe" <tripacer(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | interior fabric testing |
All,
Does anyone know of a shop that can test and certify fabric to be used in
a certified aircraft?
Mike Crowe
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com> |
| Subject: | Re: IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ? |
That's the beauty of the EIS... Monitor all 4 for less $ than the RMI... I
have one in my -8A and love it... Would definitely use one again...
-Bill VonDane
EAA Tech Counselor
RV-8A ~ N8WV
www.vondane.com
www.creativair.com
www.epanelbuilder.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ?
I have the RMI, and I really like everything about it EXCEPT only one
CHT/EGT. I would probably pay up next time and get something showing
all four. If one is chugging along, and a valve starts to go, a four
channel EGT would notify you immediately.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 423 hours
www.usfamily.net/web/alexpeterson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andy" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Night Vision Goggle Observations (Long) |
Paul,
The value I see in night vision goggles (no pun intended) is as an emergency device
in the event of a night time power failure.
The fan quits at night over rural area. It is too dark to discerne a suitable
landing area. So you reach into a compartment, pull out the goggles, and bingo
- you have a reasonable ability to select a landing site with at least the confidence
of being able to walk away.
From 3-4000' altitude, I'd want to be able to distinguish mountains from valleys,
open fields, wooded areas, ponds and rivers, dirt roads, unlit buildings, and
other major obstructions. As I got lower, I'd want to see powerlines, fences,
train tracks, ground slope, large berms, and perhaps some clues to ground
texture - (for example the direction of the furrows on a plowed field)
I'd also need to be able to see some instruments, at least airspeed or an AOA.
From your experience, (even at the $5,000 level) is this yet a reasonable expectation?
Andy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com> |
| Subject: | Re: AOPA Airport Database... |
vansairforce
Oh yeah, I forgot the link to the Airport Insight software I bought, it's pretty
cool!
http://www.notamd.com/
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill VonDane
Subject: AOPA Airport Database...
Anyone know where you can get the AOPA Airport Database for the iPAQ? I found
it for the Palm...
I recently bought Airport Insight for my iPAQ and it is very nice; has all the
info, and is updated regularly for only $40 a year, but I wanted to see about
the AOPA database...
Thanks!
-Bill VonDane
EAA Tech Counselor
RV-8A ~ N8WV
www.vondane.com
www.creativair.com
www.epanelbuilder.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Dube <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: Copper Stock tip.... |
>
>To those interested;
>
>My RV-7/9 plans sheet 31A calls for two (2) .063 x 2-7/8" copper strips to
>be manufactured by the builder to connect the master contactor and starter
>contactor on the firewall. (The copper stock is NOT supplied in the
>kit.) Rather than hunt for the stock and purchase a mere 6" of
>material.....I found a solution.
Here are a couple of pictures of the style of connection that some
of the top EV drag racing folks use:
http://68.111.220.234:81/ghiamonster/images/batteryconnectors.jpg
and
http://www.killacycle.com/kcclose2.jpg
In EV drag racing, you are striving for light weight, maximum
conductivity per pound, reliability, vibration immunity, and reasonable
cost. This is exactly what you are looking for on an airplane.
These straps are made with 3/4" or 1" copper braid and short
sections of 1/2 inch (trade size) copper pipe. You use multiple layers of
braid to create "thicker" conductors as needed. To handle 500 amps or so,
you would use about three layers of 3/4" braid.
You insert the braid into the short sections of copper pipe and
then pound the pipe flat with a hammer or a hydraulic press. You then make
a hole in the flattened pipe to form a "terminal". If you have the tool
available, it is best to punch this hole using a sheet metal punch, instead
of drilling it. While drilling works, punching the hole helps to bind the
wire strands to the terminal a bit better.
The main advantage of this style of strap is its flexibility. It
puts no stress on the connections and allows movement and vibration without
loosening the connections. The flattened pipe terminals have some "spring"
and thus keep tension on the contacts even if the bolts are not fully
tightened or have loosened slightly over time.
I've routinely pushed over 1100 amps through the straps on the
bike. I have occasionally pushed up to 1400 amps through them when setting
records. These are made with three layers of 3/4" braid. I have never had a
problem or a failure with these style straps on the bike. Conversely, I had
nothing but troubles with other connection methods.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG> |
| Subject: | Re: interior fabric testing |
I believe that most aviation interior shops do this in house as it is a
rather simple flame test. Apply flame until the fabric flames, remove flame
and flame must auto-extinguish in a certain time frame. You will find the
procedure at...
APPENDIX F TO PART 23 - TEST PROCEDURE
Acceptable test procedure for self-extinguishing materials for showing
compliance with 23.853, 23.855 and 23.1359.
Cy Galley
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael D. Crowe" <tripacer(at)bellsouth.net>
Subject: RV-List: interior fabric testing
>
> All,
>
> Does anyone know of a shop that can test and certify fabric to be used
in
> a certified aircraft?
>
> Mike Crowe
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ? |
> Anyone have a strong opinion on using the IK-2000 vs Rocky Mountain Engine
> monitor vs the Grand Rapids EIS? Any other brand I left out? I don't
want
> to spend $4k+ for engine info so I've been looking at these systems
without
> a clear winner coming up.
I went witht e GRT based on value/features. One thing you need to determine
is how involved you want to be in monitoring your engine systems. Steam
gauges show you everything at once and require you to scan them on a regular
basis to determine if anything is out-of-whack. Large display solid state
units let you scan everything at a glace and add the warning feature. I
decided early on that I wanted the engine monitor to do the scaning for me
and warn me when something is amiss and I wanted to minimize panel space.
The GRT 4000 fits the bill. It automatically goes to the appropriate page
when something is out of range. The customizable first two pages allow you
to pick those items you are most interested in seeing right away. My home
page shows rpm/MP, oil temp and pressure, fuel flow, fuel pressure and
highest EGT. I have a switch on my Infinity grip that forwards and reverses
the pages on the monitor. These two features, customizable pages and stick
controlled paging, make the unit extremely efficient to meet my needs.
Ross Mickey
RV6A
N9PT
18 hours and counting
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
Greetings all:
Weather permitting (big if!!), my wife and I are planning to fly my RV-4 to
the LA area around Jan 1st. Our final destination will be around the
Carson, CA area. A couple days later the plan is to fly down to San Diego
for a couple days and then back home via Tucson.
Can anyone recommend a GA airport in this local LA area? I have been in to
LAX a zillion times, but I don't think it's a real good RV airport!!!
Thanks
Doug Weiler
Hudson, WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Copper Stock tip.... |
>I took a 2-7/8" piece of 3/8" copper tube I had laying around, put it in my
vice, and squeezed the crap out of >it! Came out perfect! 1/2" wide x
2-7/8" long..... .190 thickness (plans call for 2 pieces of .063 so I am a
few >thousands over....).
I did all my firewall forward and wiring stuff, on my -6A, a few years ago
when a F-F kit was probably a gleam in Van's eye. I mounted my master and
starter solenoids side-by-side on the on a bracket just above the battery
box. I too, decided to connect the master to starter solenoids using a
copper strap wide enough to be able to be drilled to fit the solenoid's
contact studs. I took a piece of 1/2" copper water pipe, sawed it down the
center on my band-saw, pounded the two pieces flat and after edge clean-up
put them together and shaped them into a semi-circle to fit to the
solenoid's studs. Prior to final installation, I fitted two layers of
shrink-tubing on the straps. Makes an easy installation and has more copper
cross-section than a #2 wire.
You all, may be interested in an event that happened on my 1972 Mercury
station wagon: I went to start it one day and got no response other than an
unusual sounding "click"! Investigation revealed that the starter solenoid
(which was mounted on the right-front fender well housing) was not
contacting from the battery to the starter. So I took it apart and found
that the circular contact disc had come away from the solenoid plunger
(broken rivet) and had jammed between the battery terminal and the case of
the solenoid. Now, if that had been a metal case instead of plastic, I would
have had a hellova fire to contend with!
So when I bought Van's solenoids, I was pleased to see that the starter one
was plastic cased, (in fact just like my Ford one), BUT-- I was not happy to
see the Master solenoid was all metal! Thinking what would happen if the
same scenario happened on this solenoid as what happened on the Ford one, I
mounted it on a piece of fiberglass PC board material and insulating washers
on the mounting screws, effectively insulating the case from the
airframe.---Just a precaution!
BTW, In an early RVator, the late Bill Benedict had a great tip, especially
good for acro drivers that pull a lot of positive G's: Mount the starter
solenoid upside down, so that the solenoid actuating mass does not get
deflected by the +G's to the point it may engage the starter! Not a happy
occurrence! (maybe this is covered in the newer kit plans?--Dunno)
Cheers!!----Henry Hore
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
Go fly tomorrow! Whether you subscribe to the Wrights being truly the first
to fly a powered, controlled flight or not, it was a magical day indeed.
Get out and burn some avgas folks. I understand the EAA website will have a
"post your flight" log of some sort to note your flight. I'm heading over
to Falcon Field (Mesa, Az) to visit my dad and celebrate the day...as well
as his birthday! I plan to be RV grinnin' at 0835 local.
Here's to you, Orv and Wil.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
Albuquerque, NM
Take advantage of our best MSN Dial-up offer of the year six months
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ? |
Thanks Mickey. I didn't know the page was traversable via grip switch. How
difficult is it to tailor the info on each page and the actual pages you
wantto see? How does the leaning function actually work in practice?
thx,
lucky
In a message dated 12/16/2003 1:13:31 PM Eastern Standard Time,
rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com writes:
> Anyone have a strong opinion on using the IK-2000 vs Rocky Mountain Engine
> monitor vs the Grand Rapids EIS? Any other brand I left out? I don't
want
> to spend $4k+ for engine info so I've been looking at these systems
without
> a clear winner coming up.
I went witht e GRT based on value/features. One thing you need to determine
is how involved you want to be in monitoring your engine systems. Steam
gauges show you everything at once and require you to scan them on a regular
basis to determine if anything is out-of-whack. Large display solid state
units let you scan everything at a glace and add the warning feature. I
decided early on that I wanted the engine monitor to do the scaning for me
and warn me when something is amiss and I wanted to minimize panel space.
The GRT 4000 fits the bill. It automatically goes to the appropriate page
when something is out of range. The customizable first two pages allow you
to pick those items you are most interested in seeing right away. My home
page shows rpm/MP, oil temp and pressure, fuel flow, fuel pressure and
highest EGT. I have a switch on my Infinity grip that forwards and reverses
the pages on the monitor. These two features, customizable pages and stick
controlled paging, make the unit extremely efficient to meet my needs.
Ross Mickey
RV6A
N9PT
18 hours and counting
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Laird Owens <owens(at)aerovironment.com> |
| Subject: | Re: LA GA Airports |
Hi Doug,
TOA (Zamperini Field, or Torrance, as it used to be called) is very
close to Carson, and is GA friendly. It's just South of LAX and you
can get in from the East without getting into LAX's class B.
It's pretty complex airspace, so a little preplanning and a VFR
terminal chart is highly recommended.
You might stop at Chino (CNO) for some site seeing at the Planes of
Fame museum, if you have the time.
I can put you in touch with an RV-8 pilot who flies out of TOA if you
want to talk to a local.
Feel free to email me personally if you need more info.
Laird RV-6 Whiteman (near Burbank)
SoCal
owens(at)aerovironment.com
>
>Greetings all:
>
>Weather permitting (big if!!), my wife and I are planning to fly my RV-4 to
>the LA area around Jan 1st. Our final destination will be around the
>Carson, CA area. A couple days later the plan is to fly down to San Diego
>for a couple days and then back home via Tucson.
>
>Can anyone recommend a GA airport in this local LA area? I have been in to
>LAX a zillion times, but I don't think it's a real good RV airport!!!
>
>Thanks
>
>Doug Weiler
>Hudson, WI
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
>
> Go fly tomorrow! Whether you subscribe to the Wrights being truly the
first
> to fly a powered, controlled flight or not, it was a magical day indeed.
>
> Get out and burn some avgas folks. I understand the EAA website will have
a
> "post your flight" log of some sort to note your flight. I'm heading over
> to Falcon Field (Mesa, Az) to visit my dad and celebrate the day...as well
> as his birthday! I plan to be RV grinnin' at 0835 local.
>
> Here's to you, Orv and Wil.
>
> Brian Denk
> RV8 N94BD
> Albuquerque, NM
Great suggestion Brian. I'll be holding down the right seat of a NWA 757
from Portland to Minneapolis at the appointed hour tomorrow instead of
celebrating in my -4. But I'll toast their memory and the future of
aviation with an extra bag of pretzels.
Doug Weiler
Hudson, WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "van Bladeren, Ron" <rwv(at)nwnatural.com> |
I would suggest Fullerton Airport. It's close to Disneyland and Knots, and
pretty easy to get in and out of and they love GA (especially RV's!).
http://www.ci.fullerton.ca.us/airport/
Ron.
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Weiler [mailto:dougweil(at)pressenter.com]
Subject: RV-List: LA GA Airports
Greetings all:
Weather permitting (big if!!), my wife and I are planning to fly my RV-4 to
the LA area around Jan 1st. Our final destination will be around the
Carson, CA area. A couple days later the plan is to fly down to San Diego
for a couple days and then back home via Tucson.
Can anyone recommend a GA airport in this local LA area? I have been in to
LAX a zillion times, but I don't think it's a real good RV airport!!!
Thanks
Doug Weiler
Hudson, WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
Jon is safely back in Australia.
Eustace Bowhay
________________________________________________________________________________
Anyone know a good place to rent a cessna on Oahu?
Pat Allender
RV-4
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson(at)consolidated.net> |
Brian Denk wrote:
>
> Go fly tomorrow! Whether you subscribe to the Wrights being truly the first
> to fly a powered, controlled flight or not, it was a magical day indeed.
>
> Get out and burn some avgas folks. I understand the EAA website will have a
> "post your flight" log of some sort to note your flight. I'm heading over
> to Falcon Field (Mesa, Az) to visit my dad and celebrate the day...as well
> as his birthday! I plan to be RV grinnin' at 0835 local.
>
> Here's to you, Orv and Wil.
>
> Brian Denk
> RV8 N94BD
> Albuquerque, NM
People at 3LF-Litchfield, IL will start festivities in late morning and
hopefully carry on into the late evening.
An RV-3, Pitt's, Luscombe 8a, Cessna 140, will be out of their hangars and
whatever/whoever straggles in.... sure would like to see a Curtiss biplane or a
Stearman come over the trees and wave or land.
I also say, here's to you Orv and Wil.......
Phil in Litchfield, IL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Burton" <dburton(at)nwlink.com> |
Hi Pat,
I rented Moore Air's Cardinal a couple of years ago:
http://www.mooreair.com/
You can check the planes and their schedule using Schedule Master before you
go. They were nice folks to deal with and I got a nice "tour" on my
checkout with lots of sights pointed out. Busy airport, I was delayed
getting back down one time with an F-15 emergency landing blocking the
runway... he pulled about a mile of arresting cable down the runway with
him. Safe landing though. (the F-18 :-)
I really recommend renting a plane while you are there. Flying around gives
you a great view of the whole island.
Watch those trade winds and remember that you are in IFR conditions on a
severe clear day if you go between the islands.
Have fun!
Dave Burton
RV6, wings
________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 12/16/03 4:12:34 PM Pacific Standard Time,
dburton(at)nwlink.com writes:
<< remember that you are in IFR conditions on a severe clear day if you go
between the islands. >>
I'm a low timer, please explain the above.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, firewall forward
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Jon Johanson |
Thanks Eustace;
I had been watching for more news about Jon's return.
Bob Olds A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
RV-4 , N1191X , Flying Now
Charleston, Arkansas
"Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Insurance Questions |
I got a quote from the EAA insurance out fit and then found Avemco got me the
same liability for about half the premium for my RV-4. No hull coverage.
Bob Olds A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
RV-4 , N1191X , Flying Now
Charleston, Arkansas
"Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Burton" <dburton(at)nwlink.com> |
Hi Harry,
The distance between some of the islands is great enough that you are
completely out of sight of land. The air is filled with salt and humidity
and the sea just fades into the sky. You can't tell up from down, even if
it's a clear day. Weird feeling!
Beautiful though.
Dave Burton
Hawaiian Native
I don't tan now, I rust...
(Seattle)
----- Original Message -----
From: <HCRV6(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Hawaii
>
> In a message dated 12/16/03 4:12:34 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> dburton(at)nwlink.com writes:
>
> << remember that you are in IFR conditions on a severe clear day if you go
> between the islands. >>
>
> I'm a low timer, please explain the above.
>
> Harry Crosby
> Pleasanton, California
> RV-6, firewall forward
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tracy Crook" <lors01(at)msn.com> |
| Subject: | Re: IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ? |
Excuse the shameless promotion, but its worth checking out the EM2 engine monitor
which is finally in production. It's about 1/4th the cost of the $4k systems
and has the same (or more) functionality. I agree with the comments made by
others about the importance of keeping the really important engine info visible
when viewing alternate pages. I went with a 4 line display so that all the
main parameters could stay in place on the top & bottom lines all the time.
You can check it out at www.rotaryaviation.com The water cooled (rotary engine) version is shown but a Lycoming version is also available.
Tracy Crook
In a message dated 12/16/2003 1:13:31 PM Eastern Standard Time,
rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com writes:
> Anyone have a strong opinion on using the IK-2000 vs Rocky Mountain Engine
> monitor vs the Grand Rapids EIS? Any other brand I left out? I don't
want
> to spend $4k+ for engine info so I've been looking at these systems
without
> a clear winner coming up.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | To Cork or not to Cork? |
I am ready to secure the plates in the root rib and need to get some feedback on
whether to use the cork gaskets or not. The archives were not friendly on this
search.
Any thoughts?
Darwin N. Barrie
Chandler AZ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)warpdriveonline.com> |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Boyd Braem" <bcbraem(at)comcast.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Dec 17.
>
> Keith--
>
> Who was the veteran test pilot that did an aileron-roll over Seattle
> when they rolled out the -747? I believe he was fired and then hired
> back the next day
>
Tex Johnston. Boeing Dash 80. Quite a bit before the 747. My old buddy
Ned Wilson had the cockpit photo on his den wall.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
http://n5lp.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: To Cork or not to Cork? |
| From: | Patty & Dan Krueger <pndkrueg(at)mchsi.com> |
>
> I am ready to secure the plates in the root rib and need to get some
> feedback on whether to use the cork gaskets or not. The archives were
> not friendly on this search.
>
I used the cork with liberal but not excessive amounts of proseal on
both sides of the cork plus a filet of proseal around the plates and
the socket screws I used to secure the plates. Before prosealing
around the screws, I stubbed out a ground wire for the fuel quantity
sender - historically most fuel gage problems have been with the
ground. Two years with no leaks and no ground prob.
Dan Krueger
RV6A N926DK Flying
________________________________________________________________________________
The Discovery Wings channel shows video of the Dash 80 during that manuver.
It is one of their Historical moments and they show it quite frequently.
Usually show one or the other at the end of each session. Very impressive!
Paul LeDoux
RV8-QB
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
Eustace,
Thanks for the update.
Chuck
>From: "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: "rv list"
>Subject: RV-List: Jon Johanson
>Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 12:46:02 -0800
>
>
>Jon is safely back in Australia.
>
>Eustace Bowhay
>
>
Grab our best dial-up Internet access offer: 6 months @$9.95/month.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John Helms" <jhelms(at)i1.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Insurance Questions |
Beware the difference between per person (what AVEMCO offers... limits
anyone's bodily injury to $100,000) vs what all other companies offer (per
passenger.... person's outside the plane who are injured aren't limited to
$100,000).
Also, beware that AVEMCO sublimits family members of yours to 25% of that
sublimit.
JT
----- Original Message -----
From: <Oldsfolks(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Re: Insurance Questions
I got a quote from the EAA insurance out fit and then found Avemco got me
the
same liability for about half the premium for my RV-4. No hull coverage.
Bob Olds A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
RV-4 , N1191X , Flying Now
Charleston, Arkansas
"Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ronnie Brown" <romott(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ? |
I agree - the GRT EIS 4000 is a great value, takes up very little panel
space (mine is at the bottom of the radio stack), alarms limits can be set
on about any input, and support is great! The display is very visible in
any light and the character size is large enough for my old eyes to read
easily,
I use mine like an educated idiot light. I don't have to scan any engine
instruments - the EIS lets me know if anything is out of limits. After 110
hours of flying with it, I haven't found ANYTHING I don't like about it. It
is easily customizable, alarms are easily set, and it has an RS232 output
for recording engine data to a laptop. I just used it to do the GAMI fuel
injector balance test. It worked perfectly.
The engine leaning functions are described at
http://hometown.aol.com/enginfosys/leanpage.htm . The digital leaning page
are easier to read and understand than the fancy bar graphs IMHO.
I had planned on the VM-1000 but glad I didn't pay the additional bucks and
take up the additional limited panel space. My understanding is he VM has
very limited to non existent user customizing available. What see you get
is what you get.
Ronnie Brown
From: RV8ter(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ?
Thanks Mickey. I didn't know the page was traversable via grip switch. How
difficult is it to tailor the info on each page and the actual pages you
wantto see? How does the leaning function actually work in practice?
thx,
lucky
In a message dated 12/16/2003 1:13:31 PM Eastern Standard Time,
rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com writes:
> Anyone have a strong opinion on using the IK-2000 vs Rocky Mountain Engine
> monitor vs the Grand Rapids EIS? Any other brand I left out? I don't
want
> to spend $4k+ for engine info so I've been looking at these systems
without
> a clear winner coming up.
I went witht e GRT based on value/features. One thing you need to determine
is how involved you want to be in monitoring your engine systems. Steam
gauges show you everything at once and require you to scan them on a regular
basis to determine if anything is out-of-whack. Large display solid state
units let you scan everything at a glace and add the warning feature. I
decided early on that I wanted the engine monitor to do the scaning for me
and warn me when something is amiss and I wanted to minimize panel space.
The GRT 4000 fits the bill. It automatically goes to the appropriate page
when something is out of range. The customizable first two pages allow you
to pick those items you are most interested in seeing right away. My home
page shows rpm/MP, oil temp and pressure, fuel flow, fuel pressure and
highest EGT. I have a switch on my Infinity grip that forwards and reverses
the pages on the monitor. These two features, customizable pages and stick
controlled paging, make the unit extremely efficient to meet my needs.
Ross Mickey
RV6A
N9PT
18 hours and counting
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Aircraft Technical Book Company" <winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com> |
| Subject: | Re: To Cork or not to Cork? |
I've yet to use a cork gasket that didn't eventually leak. Forget the cork.
Just pro-seal the access plates onto the tank using a few sealing rivets or
platenuts to cinch it down. If you ever need to remove the cover plates,
just take a small propane torch and lightly heat the pro-seal. The plate
will come right off.
Andy
Builder's Bookstore
www.buildersbooks.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Charlie Kuss <chaskuss(at)bellsouth.net> to Cork? |
| Subject: | Re: Fuel tank access cover sealing was To Cork or not |
to Cork?
Darwin,
I used the cork gaskets without any sealer on my fuel tank access plates. I have
no leaks. I've even removed and reused the cork gaskets several times with
out leakage. HOWEVER, I built my tanks using NAS1473-A08 fuel tank nutplates (available
at Wicks Aircraft).
http://www.wicksaircraft.com/gotopage.php?page=88
If you use the standard K1000 nutplates supplied by Vans, you should consider
either applying a sealer to the gasket, using ProSeal to replace the gasket, or
obtaining a set of #8 self sealing screws. These screws have a sealing O-ring
under the head of the screw. They are available from McMaster-Carr.
You will need:
8-32 x 1/2" Part # 90825A816
If you prefer to use a 3/4" long unit they are Part # 90825A819
http://www.mcmaster.com/
Please note that if you decide to use these screws, they come with silicone rubber
o-rings. You will need to request a change to Viton rubber o-rings. The silicone
rubber does not hold up to gasoline. Ask them to substitute Viton O-rings
for the Silicone ones or simply purchase a bag of the appropriate size Viton
O-rings (they sell them as well)
Charlie Kuss
RV-8A instrument panel
Boca Raton, Fl.
PS I changed the subject line to make archive searching easier.
>
>I am ready to secure the plates in the root rib and need to get some feedback
on whether to use the cork gaskets or not. The archives were not friendly on this
search.
>
>Any thoughts?
>
>Darwin N. Barrie
>Chandler AZ
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Steven Eberhart <newtech(at)newtech.com> |
| Subject: | pouring rain at Kitty Hawk |
Just turned on C-Span and it is pouring down rain at Kitty Hawk :-(
Bush is speaking and they haven't said yet what the plans are for the
flight.
Steve Eberhart
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: pouring rain at Kitty Hawk |
| From: | "Jamie D. Painter" <rvbuilder(at)earthlink.net> |
For those of us stuck in the office today, you can watch the activities
on-line at c-span.org.
On Wed, 2003-12-17 at 09:49, Steven Eberhart wrote:
>
> Just turned on C-Span and it is pouring down rain at Kitty Hawk :-(
> Bush is speaking and they haven't said yet what the plans are for the
> flight.
>
> Steve Eberhart
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: pouring rain at Kitty Hawk |
| From: | "Jamie D. Painter" <rvbuilder(at)earthlink.net> |
For those of us stuck in the office today, you can watch the activities
on-line at c-span.org.
On Wed, 2003-12-17 at 09:49, Steven Eberhart wrote:
>
> Just turned on C-Span and it is pouring down rain at Kitty Hawk :-(
> Bush is speaking and they haven't said yet what the plans are for the
> flight.
>
> Steve Eberhart
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leesafur(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: To Cork or not to Cork? |
"just take a small propane torch"
If your going to do that PLEASE MAKE SURE THE TANK IS DEAD such as steamed
out or blown down with air till the tank is vapor free
Just a thought has anyone machined the access cover for O-ring's?
Lee
Anoka MN
RV-3 wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net> |
| Subject: | Vacuum shut off valve mcmaster carr |
>
> Help, recently someone posted a McMaster-Carr valve to use as
> a vacuum shut off for aerobatics. Does anyone have the part
> number handy. I couldnt find it in the archives.
>
> Jeff Dowling
> 1.5 hours 6a
>
Jeff, go to
http://www.usfamily.net/web/alexpeterson/misc.htm
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 424 hours
www.usfamily.net/web/alexpeterson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kosta Lewis" <mikel(at)dimensional.com> |
| Subject: | The Wright Stuff |
Following the history of the Wright brothers and the methods of
discovery and of trial and error they undertook to accomplish what they
did 100 years ago today makes me proud and amazed. It probably should
never have happened. But it did. It is their gift to us flyers, now a
century later, putting together our own flying machines and breaking the
bonds that held man to earth for tens of thousands of years before the
first flight. If that doesn't inspire you to get back out into your
garage/hanger and get to work, you just ain't paying attention.
The wind is blowing here today but you can bet I am going to celebrate
this amazing century of flight with a flight of my own. It is a great
honor and privilege to be able to just walk out to the airplane and go
flying. The wonderful machine Van gave us, the talent I had to put it
together, the skill I was taught to fly it, the country we have to fly
in....lots to be thankful for.
Way to go, Orville and Wilber. Thanks.
Michael
RV-4 232 Suzie Q
Tuned in to CNN, waiting. Doesn't look good for weather today
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Craig Warner" <cwarner(at)twcny.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: pouring rain at Kitty Hawk |
They are going to try again at 2:00 pm eastern time.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven Eberhart" <newtech(at)newtech.com>
Subject: RV-List: pouring rain at Kitty Hawk
>
> Just turned on C-Span and it is pouring down rain at Kitty Hawk :-(
> Bush is speaking and they haven't said yet what the plans are for the
> flight.
>
> Steve Eberhart
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: pouring rain at Kitty Hawk |
I'm on CSpan.org, but i'm getting a call in open forum. No Kitty Hawk
coverage.
Paul Besing
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jamie D. Painter" <rvbuilder(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: pouring rain at Kitty Hawk
>
> For those of us stuck in the office today, you can watch the activities
> on-line at c-span.org.
>
> On Wed, 2003-12-17 at 09:49, Steven Eberhart wrote:
> >
> > Just turned on C-Span and it is pouring down rain at Kitty Hawk :-(
> > Bush is speaking and they haven't said yet what the plans are for the
> > flight.
> >
> > Steve Eberhart
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: pouring rain at Kitty Hawk |
| From: | "Jamie D. Painter" <rvbuilder(at)earthlink.net> |
Yeah, they were doing live video feeds from Kitty Hawk but cut away
after the flight was scrubbed. They said they'll be back to the NC feed
at 2:00 p.m. I'm going to try to find some more feeds.
On Wed, 2003-12-17 at 11:05, Paul Besing wrote:
>
> I'm on CSpan.org, but i'm getting a call in open forum. No Kitty Hawk
> coverage.
>
> Paul Besing
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jamie D. Painter" <rvbuilder(at)earthlink.net>
> To:
> Subject: Re: RV-List: pouring rain at Kitty Hawk
>
>
>
> >
> > For those of us stuck in the office today, you can watch the activities
> > on-line at c-span.org.
> >
> > On Wed, 2003-12-17 at 09:49, Steven Eberhart wrote:
> > >
> > > Just turned on C-Span and it is pouring down rain at Kitty Hawk :-(
> > > Bush is speaking and they haven't said yet what the plans are for the
> > > flight.
> > >
> > > Steve Eberhart
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Hal Rozema <hartist1(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: The Wright Stuff |
I wish the Wright followers well. It's a lot of fun.
Also read, http://www.deepsky.com/~firstflight/
Hal Rozema
theplanefolks.net
Kosta Lewis wrote:
>
> Following the history of the Wright brothers and the methods of
> discovery and of trial and error they undertook to accomplish what they
> did 100 years ago today makes me proud and amazed. It probably should
> never have happened. But it did. It is their gift to us flyers, now a
> century later, putting together our own flying machines and breaking the
> bonds that held man to earth for tens of thousands of years before the
> first flight. If that doesn't inspire you to get back out into your
> garage/hanger and get to work, you just ain't paying attention.
>
> The wind is blowing here today but you can bet I am going to celebrate
> this amazing century of flight with a flight of my own. It is a great
> honor and privilege to be able to just walk out to the airplane and go
> flying. The wonderful machine Van gave us, the talent I had to put it
> together, the skill I was taught to fly it, the country we have to fly
> in....lots to be thankful for.
>
> Way to go, Orville and Wilber. Thanks.
>
> Michael
> RV-4 232 Suzie Q
>
> Tuned in to CNN, waiting. Doesn't look good for weather today
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | vortex generators |
| From: | glenn.williams(at)businessacft.bombardier.com |
12/17/2003 12:27:20 PM
I need to be educated. I do not see how vortex generators cancel out
adverse yaw. I understand how the generators keep the airflow attached in
slow flight and lower stall speed. I do not however see that they make the
tail "bigger". Is it possible that the v shape induces a stability
augmentation over the wings to aid in this? i.e. making the wings track
straighter due to the v shape glued on the wings and assisting in the
adverse yaw problem?
thanks
Glenn Williams
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mark Antenbring <mantenbring(at)pangaeainc.com> |
| Subject: | RV7 Electric elevator trim |
So far the empennage instructions provide a lot of detail and hand-holding,
but when I get to the electric elevator trim, it's a big mystery. I've had
to make a lot of assumptions in that area so far. The next assumption I have
to make is that I have to cut the threaded bolt (trim push rod) to a proper
length, unless I want the trim tab sticking up full time. That would cause
some forward stick pressure eh? Has any one got an accurate method to cut
this push rod to length? Is a hacksaw ok to use on this rod?
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV7 Electric elevator trim |
I used the Gretz relocation kit for my 6A. I might suggest that it
eliminates a lot of the issues that I had with both the manual and stock
electric trim systems.
my .02...
Ralph Capen
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Antenbring" <mantenbring(at)pangaeainc.com>
Subject: RV-List: RV7 Electric elevator trim
>
> So far the empennage instructions provide a lot of detail and
hand-holding,
> but when I get to the electric elevator trim, it's a big mystery. I've had
> to make a lot of assumptions in that area so far. The next assumption I
have
> to make is that I have to cut the threaded bolt (trim push rod) to a
proper
> length, unless I want the trim tab sticking up full time. That would cause
> some forward stick pressure eh? Has any one got an accurate method to cut
> this push rod to length? Is a hacksaw ok to use on this rod?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com> |
| Subject: | Re: vortex generators |
I have no idea why it SEEMS to make some difference in yaw reduction. The
whole thing is a subjective feeling. The only rough and ready 'test' I could
concieve of is to have to fairly identical RV's fly together in the same
conditions and see what difference there is. Unfortunately it isn't
practical to fly the single plane with the vortex generators and then
without in the same conditions...to awkward and conditions change too fast.
Someone else had suggested they noticed a yaw reduction with their vortex
generators; I had rather forgoten about it until I was getting kicked around
so much today, and it occured to me how the yaw that I used to see just
wasn't there. Obviously one flight does not a conclusion make, but there's
something going on.
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Vern Darley,II" <vern(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Remembrance of 100th anniversary of flight |
It's been a reflective sort of day as I've done something most unusual for me-I
pinned various aviation pins on my tie and wore them all day.( I normally am
'Mr. Decorum' and avoid tacky when I can. )
I've been shocked at how many folks in the office and out at lunch had no appreciation
for the 100th Anniv.celebration nor aviation in general. To them,it might
as well have been National John Deer Tractor day or something.
But, considering the impact of aviation on our economy,our transportation,our defense,our
mobility, and our recreation, it has apparently lost much of its mystique
and appeal to this generation.
Any ideas about what we can do to help motivate the next generation so they will
someday celebrate the 200th anniverary??
Today, my pins represented the facets of aviation I've enjoyed in the 50 + years
since I took my first ride in a J-3 all those years ago. Almost no one even
noticed the odd tie decorations. No one asked what any of them meant to me. So,
I'll share some of their meaning with you,my RV family.
One pin represents my first solo at age 16. Another working at the FBO 40-60 hours
a week all thru college. Another is my USAF wings earned at age 22 and those
wonderful young days on active duty. Oh, to be a young Lt. again with orders
to 'go put some time on that airplane' again! You never appreciate what you
have until you no longer have it, do you?
One pin represented the tumultuous times of airline deregulation and stress at
Eastern AIrlines, once the proudest and free world's largest air carrier. Another
pin represented the wonderful AF Reserve duties. Caribou's and 130's ! Ground
school and flying with the late Charlie Burnett. The Citation pin representing
the corporate flying days with their busyness.
And the best pin of all, now representing the newest phase of life,where aviation
has once again come full circle for me no longer as a 'job', but as fun as
I've become part of the RV world. Pure and simple fun!
To my pilot father and uncle,to all the instructors, war-story tellers, hanger-flyers,mechanics
and lineboys, schedulers,ground school and simulator guys, and
airport bums who have put up with me all these years-Thanks!
Congratulations on making my 50 years in aviation so wonderful!
Vern
P.S. I still look up when I hear a plane pass overhead like I did as a toddler.
Guess I always will!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com> |
| Subject: | Re: vortex generators |
Oh, I didn't read Glenn's message too closely...he asked about ADVERSE yaw -
well the RV has so little that it is never a consideration...I was speaking
of inadvertent yaw caused by flying in turbulence...that's where the
difference seemed to come in....turning in a 'spam can' where you need
rudder/aileron coordination to handle adverse yaw is something I don't see
in my RV. Heavy atmospheric turbulence would normally twist the RV around
fairly heavily.
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: vortex generators |
| From: | Boyd Braem <bcbraem(at)comcast.net> |
The RV series (at least the -3, -4, -6) have very little adverse yaw
(and the wings on the Super 6 are clipped 7 inches)--in fact, if you
were not a perfectionist you could just keep your feet on the floor.
Best way to fly with adverse yaw is to fly a glider--swing that tail
around.
On Wednesday, December 17, 2003, at 05:12 PM, John wrote:
>
> Oh, I didn't read Glenn's message too closely...he asked about ADVERSE
> yaw -
> well the RV has so little that it is never a consideration...I was
> speaking
> of inadvertent yaw caused by flying in turbulence...that's where the
> difference seemed to come in....turning in a 'spam can' where you need
> rudder/aileron coordination to handle adverse yaw is something I don't
> see
> in my RV. Heavy atmospheric turbulence would normally twist the RV
> around
> fairly heavily.
>
> John
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Dube <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov> |
I've seen pictures of floats on an RV, but has anyone tried Tundra tires
on an RV? (I didn't find anything in the archives.)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Trampas" <tstern(at)nc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ? |
Of course I think that www.sterntech.com has the best, but I designed it.
Regards,
Trampas
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ronnie Brown
Subject: Re: RV-List: IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ?
I agree - the GRT EIS 4000 is a great value, takes up very little panel
space (mine is at the bottom of the radio stack), alarms limits can be set
on about any input, and support is great! The display is very visible in
any light and the character size is large enough for my old eyes to read
easily,
I use mine like an educated idiot light. I don't have to scan any engine
instruments - the EIS lets me know if anything is out of limits. After 110
hours of flying with it, I haven't found ANYTHING I don't like about it. It
is easily customizable, alarms are easily set, and it has an RS232 output
for recording engine data to a laptop. I just used it to do the GAMI fuel
injector balance test. It worked perfectly.
The engine leaning functions are described at
http://hometown.aol.com/enginfosys/leanpage.htm . The digital leaning page
are easier to read and understand than the fancy bar graphs IMHO.
I had planned on the VM-1000 but glad I didn't pay the additional bucks and
take up the additional limited panel space. My understanding is he VM has
very limited to non existent user customizing available. What see you get
is what you get.
Ronnie Brown
From: RV8ter(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ?
Thanks Mickey. I didn't know the page was traversable via grip switch. How
difficult is it to tailor the info on each page and the actual pages you
wantto see? How does the leaning function actually work in practice?
thx,
lucky
In a message dated 12/16/2003 1:13:31 PM Eastern Standard Time,
rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com writes:
> Anyone have a strong opinion on using the IK-2000 vs Rocky Mountain Engine
> monitor vs the Grand Rapids EIS? Any other brand I left out? I don't
want
> to spend $4k+ for engine info so I've been looking at these systems
without
> a clear winner coming up.
I went witht e GRT based on value/features. One thing you need to determine
is how involved you want to be in monitoring your engine systems. Steam
gauges show you everything at once and require you to scan them on a regular
basis to determine if anything is out-of-whack. Large display solid state
units let you scan everything at a glace and add the warning feature. I
decided early on that I wanted the engine monitor to do the scaning for me
and warn me when something is amiss and I wanted to minimize panel space.
The GRT 4000 fits the bill. It automatically goes to the appropriate page
when something is out of range. The customizable first two pages allow you
to pick those items you are most interested in seeing right away. My home
page shows rpm/MP, oil temp and pressure, fuel flow, fuel pressure and
highest EGT. I have a switch on my Infinity grip that forwards and reverses
the pages on the monitor. These two features, customizable pages and stick
controlled paging, make the unit extremely efficient to meet my needs.
Ross Mickey
RV6A
N9PT
18 hours and counting
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Gandy" <s.gandy(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | RV-4 Kit for Sale |
Hi RV List
Some time back I planned to build a RV-4, purchased the wing and
empennage kit. I started building the horizontal stabilizer, then got
busy at work and didn't work on it for a couple of years. In 2001 I
lost my medical, and after more than 2 years of fighting with the FAA I
got it back in October, but only for 6 months. It has become very
costly too much trouble to pursue, so I will be applying for the new
Sport Pilot license. The bottom line is, I need to sell my RV-4 wing
and empennage kit. The wing kit is the standard RV-4 wing and is
unopened. The empennage kit is the standard empennage kit with the
heavy skins and the only work that has been done is on the horizontal
stabilizer. The skins are drilled, not dimpled. I want to sell the
wing and empennage kit together and I am asking $4,000 for them. I am
located in Fresno, CA.
Steve Gandy
s.gandy(at)comcast.net
Aeronca L-3C N48540
Kitfox 6 N540KF (Building)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Randy Compton" <thecomptons(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Dec 17th 2003 100 Years / What did you do today to celebrate? |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Eaves" <doneaves(at)midsouth.rr.com>
Subject: RV-List: Dec 17th 2003 100 Years / What did you do today to
celebrate?
> What did you do today to celebrate 100 years of powered flight?
>
> Don Eaves
> doneaves(at)midsouth.rr.com
> RV 6 Flying 200 + Hrs.
Like others on the "List", I flew today...but I had to settle on flying the
Cub. The exhaust pipe on my #4 cylinder broke off at the flange at the
cylinder head while flying yesterday.
What a picture-perfect day here! Severe VFR with 18 knots of post-cold
front wind right down the runway. Tower caught on to what I was up to when
I hung out in the hold-short for a while before calling for takeoff
really were on to me. At 1035 I gave the Cub about half throttle - with the
good wind straight on the beak it was in the air VERY quickly - I flew down
the runway about 20 feet or so in the air, and after counting 12 seconds I
eased it back down and taxied back in. Made for a great logbook entry.
So, while I didn't get to fly my RV, I rationalized it away by at least
knowing I was flying a plane only a few steps improved over the Flyer.
That's what I did today to celebrate 100 years of powered flight...that, and
also give thanks to God that this incredible invention has allowed me to
earn a pretty darn good living all the while having fun doing it!
Randy Compton
RV-3 N148CW
Gulf Breeze, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us> |
Well,
today was a great day to celebrate 100 years of powered flight by flying
around Southern California. I did have one incident though. At about 40 kts
taking off from Big Bear the canpoy latch popped open. It didn't unlatch but
the overcenter was un-overcentered.
The interesting thing was that it made loud pop noise, then things got
abnormally windy. I saw the handle and went to reclose it, but the plane was
still taking off, so I readjusted my priorities and aborted the take-off as
I really have no idea, nor any interest in finding out what it would do if I
didn't get it re-latched tight.
I apparently didn't get the handle twisted all the way over center when
closing it, because I could find nothing wrong with it, and it worked fine
for the rest of the day. It is nice to know that it will talk to you right
about the time you are thinking about pulling back on the stick.
W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Karie Daniel" <karie4(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV7 Electric elevator trim |
I jacked around with this thing for a couple of hours myself trying to
figure out full up then full down trim and the correct size to cut the rod.
I ultimately moved on but it's on my TO DO list of things I need to come
back and wrap up. Please share any info you get.
Karie Daniel
RV-7A
Sammamish, WA
(jacking around with the wings now) :-)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Antenbring" <mantenbring(at)pangaeainc.com>
Subject: RV-List: RV7 Electric elevator trim
>
> So far the empennage instructions provide a lot of detail and
hand-holding,
> but when I get to the electric elevator trim, it's a big mystery. I've had
> to make a lot of assumptions in that area so far. The next assumption I
have
> to make is that I have to cut the threaded bolt (trim push rod) to a
proper
> length, unless I want the trim tab sticking up full time. That would cause
> some forward stick pressure eh? Has any one got an accurate method to cut
> this push rod to length? Is a hacksaw ok to use on this rod?
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | [ Jim Jewell ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
| From: | Email List Photo Shares <pictures(at)matronics.com> |
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: Jim Jewell
Subject: Homemade Baffle Pass Through Fitting
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/jjewell@telus.net.12.17.2003/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures(at)matronics.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: IK-2000 vs RMI vs GR EIS vs ? |
----- Original Message -----
From: <RV8ter(at)aol.com>
> How difficult is it to tailor the info on each page and the actual pages
you
> want to see?
Not difficult. Greg provides a worksheet that makes it easy to lay out what
you want and input into the unit.
> How does the leaning function actually work in practice?
Very well. I can either monitor the actual temp of the hottest cylinder
that is displayed on my home page or I can go to the leaning page. On the
first, you have to see what the peak temp is then enrichen till you are
50-100 from peak. On the leaning page, the actual temperature changes to
degrees from peak once the cylinder reaches peak. Makes it a bit easier.
The unit has other functions to help when you change altitudes and peak may
change. I don't use the bar graph function.
Ross
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cammie Patch" <cammie(at)sunvalley.net> |
| Subject: | What did you do today to celebrate? |
I celebrated the 100 years by giving flight instruction as I do most days.
Two flights in Cessnas, one in an Archer. The local Boise NBC affiliate came
down and interviewed me for my thoughts on aviation and the new licenses.
They asked me if the new format would in any way discourage terrorists. I
told them that you don't need any piece of paper (or plastic) to buy and fly
an aircraft. Fortunately that was edited out, some people might take it
wrong. It was hard to put into words just what flying means to me without
getting choked up a little and looking like a dork. Oh well.
I get to fly around all day in little airplanes. Even after 3 years of full
time instructing, it's still a thrill to fling a little airplane around the
sky, and especially to share the joy of someone elses first flight, first
solo, and checkride.
Cammie Patch
RV7a ailerons
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bruce Swayze <swayze(at)europa.com> |
| Subject: | Redimple The Skin? |
Speaking of the DRDT-1, have any of you guys had any experience with
it? I'm putting my shop tools together, and I'm considering one of these
tools instead of a C-frame. Any comments or input?
Thanks!
>
>This thread makes me really excited about my DRDT-1 frame that's on the back
>of a Fed Ex truck headed my way ( http://www.experimentalaero.com/ )!
>
>I've done most of my emp using the standard Avery frame. While it wasn't
>mounted I did have really straight skins and fairly consistent results -
>mostly my arms just wore out :o)
>
>Hence the new dimpling frame.
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Re: Remembrance of 100th anniversary of flight |
>...
>I've been shocked at how many folks in the office and out at lunch had no appreciation
for the 100th Anniv.celebration nor aviation in general. To them,it might
as well have been National John Deer Tractor day or something.
>
>But, considering the impact of aviation on our economy,our transportation,our
defense,our mobility, and our recreation, it has apparently lost much of its mystique
and appeal to this generation.
>
>Any ideas about what we can do to help motivate the next generation so they will
someday celebrate the 200th anniverary??
Hi Vern,
Actually, this is nothing more than a sign of the incredible
success that aviation enjoys. Those of us in the software
world strive to make systems that the users don't even know
or care are there. We have not gotten there yet, but we've
only been at it for 60 years or so, not 100!
I celebrated the 100th with a nice flight in our club
Cherokee over the Jura mountains here in western Switzerland.
Plenty of snow and cross country skiers to look at,
bright sunshine, and totally smooth air. Looking forward to
a little night VFR this evening!
--
Mickey Coggins
GSM: +41-79-210-3762
FAX: +41-86-079-210-3762
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007
Empennage complete, waiting for wings to arrive
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil N" <pnewlon(at)toosan.com> |
| Subject: | Redimple The Skin? |
Thanks to all of you guys that responded to my query. I thought that
there would be a definitive answer to my question, but alas that was not
to be. This could easily become the next "primer war" as there were
evenly split sides as to the structural integriy of a countersunk .032
skin. :-)
I just wanted to relay what I've learned from this.
- Whatever hammer you use, wear hearing protection. It may sound odd,
but I found I was hitting the dimpler softer when I didn't wear
protection - I guess subconsciously I was not liking the loud bang.
- I bought a dead blow plastic hammer (28oz). This solves the noise
problem, you still have to make sure your dimple is sharp (well formed)
though!
- Van's said that there "shouldn't be any problem structurally" with the
partially dimpled/finished with a deburring tool holes. I drilled out
the rivets that stood a little too proud and re-did them so that I
didn't have to shave them, the rest I left as they were.
- I used the Avery pop rivet dimpling tool to improve the dimples on the
ones that I could.
- The second skin will be completely redimpled and re-primed. Lesson
learned.
Phil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil N" <pnewlon(at)toosan.com> |
| Subject: | Avery "flat" rivet set problem |
I was having the WORST time with getting the shop head of my squeezed
rivets to not cleat as I squeezed them. I ended up using a gun on quite
a few rivets that should have been done with my rather expensive
squeezer. I finally called Avery and had a discussion with them about
it. It turns out that they had a run of flat sets that the guy who was
doing the finish polishing got a little aggressive about his duty. The
set, instead of being flat had a significant crown to it - thus if you
didn't get the rivet PERFECTLY in the center it would run down the hill
on the set. Let's just say that I am damn good at drilling out rivets
at this point in my RV career!
If you are having trouble that may sound like this, take the flat set
out of your squeezer, hold it up to the light and put the edge of a
steel scale on it. You will see a really bad crown to the set, instead
of it being flat.
Three days after my call, I had a brand new set - problem solved.
Phil
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Slider unlatched in flight |
| From: | "GreenoL" <GreenoL(at)roberts.edu> |
The other day I took off with my RV-6A canopy unlatched despite using the check-list.
Dumb, but it happened. The canopy was closed but not latched. It took
a few seconds to translate the cold air (New York State) draftiness to the problem.
Short strip; too late to cancel the takeoff. I immediately attempted
to close the canopy as second priority to flying the airplane at all costs.
I had a lot of concern that the canopy would tend to slide rearward and create
more problems. Once at altitude I attempted to slow the aircraft sufficient
to relieve pressure and close the canopy, to no avail. I continued in the pattern
and landed, only releasing a hold on the canopy handle when over the threshold.
No damage other than my pride. Doubt if it will happen again (once is
enough!), but figured other builder/flyers would appreciate the input. I cannot
say enough positive about the aircraft under these circumstances; flew beautifully,
the main challenge being flying with the right hand holding the canopy
latch handle. I felt no tendancy for the canopy to move rearward, despite my
concern that it would. Hope this helps!
Larry Greeno
N446A #24495
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob U." <rv3(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Slider unlatched in flight |
GreenoL wrote:
>
>The other day I took off with my RV-6A canopy unlatched despite using the check-list.
Dumb, but it happened. The canopy was closed but not latched. It took
a few seconds to translate the cold air (New York State) draftiness to the
problem. Short strip; too late to cancel the takeoff. I immediately attempted
to close the canopy as second priority to flying the airplane at all costs.
I had a lot of concern that the canopy would tend to slide rearward and create
more problems. Once at altitude I attempted to slow the aircraft sufficient
to relieve pressure and close the canopy, to no avail. I continued in the pattern
and landed, only releasing a hold on the canopy handle when over the threshold.
No damage other than my pride. Doubt if it will happen again (once is
enough!), but figured other builder/flyers would appreciate the input. I cannot
say enough positive about the aircraft under these circumstances; flew beautifully,
the main challenge being flying with the r!
>ight hand holding the canopy latch handle. I felt no tendancy for the canopy to
move rearward, despite my concern that it would. Hope this helps!
>
>Larry Greeno
>N446A #24495
>
==============================================
FWIW....
In flight pressure forces my RV-3 slider canopy nearly CLOSED.
Cannot open it more than an inch or two in flight.
Perhaps you have a similar condition or situation?
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com> |
vansairforce
Just an opinion...
I had the opportunity to fly with a friend of mine yesterday and wear one of the
new Lightspeed 3G headsets... I'm sorry to say that I didn't like them at all...
The weren't that comfortable and the noise canceling was disappointing...
The aircraft was a BD4 with a 180 C/S, It's a pretty loud aircraft, and the
noise canceling DID work, but it was still very loud...
I have a set of LS QFR Cross Country's and LOVE them! I should have taken a set
in the plane to compare, but didn't think about it... I have had other LS head
sets as well, and still don't think anything compares to the Cross Country's.
I think I am going to upgrade mine to the new CC2's pretty soon... my plane
is so quiet to me that I don't eve think about it, and have had many comments
from pax about how quiet it is...
For the money you cant beat them!
Lightspeed G3: $460
Lightspeed CC2: $275
-Bill VonDane
EAA Tech Counselor
RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
www.vondane.com
www.creativair.com
www.epanelbuilder.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David E. Nelson" <david.nelson(at)pobox.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dec 17th 2003 100 Years / What did you do today to |
celebrate?
Myself and another flying buddy took a day off from work and rented two Pipers
from Gergetown, TX (KGTU) and flew over to Burnet, TX (KBMQ) to visit the
flying museum and make a donation. Great day to fly!!
/\/elson
Austin, TX
RV-7A - Emp
Don Eaves wrote:
> What did you do today to celebrate 100 years of powered flight?
--
~~ ** ~~ If you didn't learn anything when you broke it the 1st ~~ ** ~~
time, then break it again.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Chris Good" <chrisjgood(at)lycos.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dec 17th 2003 100 Years / What did you do today tocelebrate? |
> What did you do today to celebrate 100 years of powered flight?
Took the day off work to celebrate. Got to the airport at 8am. First task was
to scrape a couple of inches of snow from in front of the hangar. Decided the
wheel pants needed to come off (another 'snow' thing).
ceiling was 1200. So switched to Plan B & timed our departure so that we lifted
off at exactly 9:35.
Flew a friend, Bruce, 110 miles northwest to Wausau to pick up the Cessna Cardinal
he had been forced to leave there at the weekend. Stayed VFR at 1000-1500
AGL - it's a good job Wisconsin is flat! Minimal braking effect on ice at Wausau.
The taildraggers were having a tough time taxiing, but no problem for the
6A.
Tops were reported at 3500-4500 with mixed reports of ice & no ice. Decided to
return IFR. After a couple of minutes in the clouds, broke out on top with a
clear blue sky & bright sunshine. Tailwind enabled 180 Kts ground speed at 65%
power at 7000 ft. Not bad without wheel pants. It doesn't get much better.
Both Minneapolis & Chicago Centers were particularly jovial. Vectored into
the clouds for the VOR 13 approach at West Bend & picked up a trace of ice -
maybe 1/8" on the leading edges. Broke out at 1200 AGL, circled to land 31.
By the time Bruce landed, the coffee was brewed. Our final task was to hang the
1/6 scale Wright Flyer model in our Chapter building. A group of us put in
more than 500 hrs constructing this model earlier in the year. It's been on display,
but we wanted to hang it on the centennial anniversary.
We've come long way in 100 years.
Chris Good, http://rv.supermatrix.com
West Bend, WI
RV-6A N86CG, 640 hrs in 3.5 yrs
Free Poetry Contest. Win $10,000. Submit your poem @ Poetry.com!
http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;6750922;3807821;l?http://www.poetry.com/contest/contest.asp?Suite=A59101
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Slider unlatched in flight |
I had a similar experience with the "Tilt Up" canopy. Shortly after
lift-off there was a pop followed by a tremendous increase in noise level -
seat cushion severely distored. Quickly recognized what the problem was at
approx 110 MPH on climbout. Recalling the many admonizments to "fly the
aircraft" as first priority, I slowed to 85 MPH but continued to 3000 MSL.
There at around 75 mph, I attempted to pull the canopy shut (it was open
approx 3-4" at the roll bar end), even putting my full weight on the canopy
handle I could not quite get it down far enough for the Latch to engage.
Recalling a similar reported incident, I pull full flaps and sure enough it
releived sufficent pressure for me to get the canopy down and latched.
Lesson is the RV-6A will fly quite fine with the canopy open despite the
increased noise level. So as many before have stated, don't worry about the
canopy until you are at a safe altitude to worry about it or simply come
back around and land. I think if you keep the airspeed under 100 MPH and
keep a little increased pad for approach and landing speeds in case the air
distrubance does affect flow over the tail surfaces and you should be just
fine.
Ed Anderson
RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC
eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com
----- Original Message -----
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Matt Jurotich <mjurotich(at)hst.nasa.gov> |
| Subject: | Re: vortex generators |
Very interesting. Every VG kit I've been able to find just supplies wing
VGs. How does the increased elevator authority affect trim sensitivity
during landing? Any increase in elevator authority during cruise? Did you
use a kit or roll your own? Do you also have vertical stab VGs?
Thanks
<blanton(at)alaska.net>
VG's on both sides of the VS may affect yaw qualities ... they may
create an effect like a "virtually" larger VS. I know the VG's on the
underside of my HS dramatically increased elevator authority as if the
HS and elevator were larger.
B.
Matthew M. Jurotich
NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center
Swales contractor to the
JWST ISIM Systems Engineer
m/c : 443
e-mail mail to:
phone : 301-286-5919
fax : 301-286-1736
JWST URL: <http://ngst1.gsfc.nasa.gov
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.cc.ca.us> |
| Subject: | Futher Reflections |
I just wanted to add a few more reflections on my thoughts while my canopy
was flapping open in the breeze.
My first instinct when it happened was there is a problem, indentify it and
fix it. I immediately saw the canopy latch was repositioned so I went to
relatch it, and it hit me that now was not the time to be fully diagnosing
the problem when I still had the option to not fly. Since not flying was the
more conservative choice I redjusted my focus and aborted, while notifying
the guy behind me of the change in plans.
This goes back to the discussion of why we make choices. I often make
choices without really considering the criteria of why I made the choice.
This is normal and is often called an autonoimic decision. It saves huge
amounts of time. But in aviation one really must have a criteria for making
most of our choices. For me most things are a binary choice, either this or
that option. Sometimes there are more options in a given choice, but my
criteria is always, which is the most conservative, or safe of the group.
And I have found that I always know which is the safest of the options if I
take the time to study/think about the criteria.
By keeping this simple is was only a short second for me to realize that
aborting the take off was the safer option rather then trying to do
something else while taking off even though that was contrary to my
instincts once I thought I had indentified the problem.
Anyways food for thought.
W
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | TruTrak DFC Tray's |
I have been troubleshooting an intermittent problem with my TruTrak DFC250
autopilot. It is the one in the standard avionics tray. In talking with
Jim Yonkin, I found out that two years ago they determined that the trays
they were using were very slightly to long which could lead to the contacts
not fully seating. This is the first I had heard about it and pass it along
for any of you with older DFC trays.
Ross Mickey
N9PT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Greg Milner" <tldrgred(at)execpc.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dec. 17th 2003 100 years / What did you do today tocelebrate? |
>taidraggers were having a tough time taxiing but the 6a had no problem<
I`ve been flying taildraggers in the midwest for 6yrs. and don`t see noserollers
having any advantage. What do they fly in Alaska? Taildraggers rule there.
Greg Milner
RV-4 79KM
Waukesha,Wi. UES
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Oke <wjoke(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: vortex generators |
When landing a conventionally configured aircraft, especially with the wing
flaps extended, a lot of "aft stick" is needed to overcome the nose down
pitching moment that slow flight requires plus even more to rotate the nose
upwards to flare the aircraft before touchdown.
Aft stick means the trailing edge of the elevator moves up so the tail
surface becomes a curved, cambered surface producing lift in the downwards
sense. (Think of an upside down wing with the flaps extended.) Anything that
can be done to improve the lifting characteristics of the tailplane-elevator
combination, such as turbulators that will help keep the airflow attached on
the underside of the tail, will provide more downward lift which the pilot
sees as more "nose up" pitch authority when landing.
Turbulators are one method. I recall seeing some aircraft with a reverse
slotted horizontal tail leading edge in the past (one of the higher
performance Cessna singles possibly) that accomplish the same thing. A
British aircraft called the Buccaneer used blowing boundary layer control on
the tailplane to get acceptable landing characteristics for aircraft carrier
use at the cost of considerable plumbing complexity but it worked.
Similar theory would apply to vertical stab turbulators that should provide
better lift characteristics to the fin-rudder combination that provide
restoring forces to yawing motions and so (perhaps) better yaw stability to
the aircraft.
Lots more pilot oriented aerodynamics at http://www.av8n.com/how/
Jim Oke
Wpg., MB
RV-3
RV-6A
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Jurotich" <mjurotich(at)hst.nasa.gov>
Subject: Re: RV-List: vortex generators
>
>
> Very interesting. Every VG kit I've been able to find just supplies wing
> VGs. How does the increased elevator authority affect trim sensitivity
> during landing? Any increase in elevator authority during cruise? Did
you
> use a kit or roll your own? Do you also have vertical stab VGs?
>
> Thanks
>
> <blanton(at)alaska.net>
>
> VG's on both sides of the VS may affect yaw qualities ... they may
> create an effect like a "virtually" larger VS. I know the VG's on
the
> underside of my HS dramatically increased elevator authority as if
the
> HS and elevator were larger.
>
> B.
>
>
> Matthew M. Jurotich
>
> NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center
> Swales contractor to the
> JWST ISIM Systems Engineer
>
> m/c : 443
> e-mail mail to:
> phone : 301-286-5919
> fax : 301-286-1736
>
>
> JWST URL: <http://ngst1.gsfc.nasa.gov
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Futher Reflections (canopy pops) |
I was reading just yesterday but I forgot the acronym already. What I took
away from it was a four step routine when problems arise. I think it went
like this:
Continue to fly the airplane
Analyze the situation
Take action
Land
They made the obvious but apparently often overlooked point that it is
easier and safer to resolve problems while on the ground.
AOPA Pilot I believe. With some strange (erroneous?) pie charts.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK - Three trips to OSH now.
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bob <panamared2(at)brier.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Slider unlatched in flight |
I too have flown without latching the slider canopy. No problem, flew once
for about 10 minutes to get to a better airfield for landing.
I could not get the canopy latched in flight, but I wonder, can it be
opened in flight for the purpose of bailing out? Using a parachute for
acrobatics is of little use, If I can not get the canopy open. Any
experiences out there?
Bob
RV6 NightFighter
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> celebrate? |
| Subject: | Re: The next 100 years? WAS: What did you do today to |
celebrate?
Hi Chris and all,
>We've come long way in 100 years.
You are right about that.
I flew my Debonair which I seem unable to sell. My Rv6a has no panel as it
is getting updated for IFR.
As I prepare to order my Dynon EFIS and a Trio autopilot, I wonder just how
far will we go in the next 100 years?
I suppose it is inevitable - the pilot will be a chip. We will get in,
touch in our destination and go. The Plasmatron engine will whisk us along
at several times the speed of sound.
Today we are free - while some men travel to the moon, others ride horses
for the fun of it.
I landed just before a beautiful sunset.
The Debonair is for sale see it at www.moonrovers.com
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK - Three trips to OSH now.
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com> |
| Subject: | more on: Cockpit "Audio out" to videocamera |
vansairforce
I'm back on this subject... Earlier in the year I bought a HI8 video
camera. A Sony TRV318... It's a nice camera, and had all the features I
wanted (or thought I wanted), including a good price...but I see that it
doesn't have an audio in jack!
Can anyone tell me about any cameras that do have this feature? I am
probably going to get a new one and then sell mine...
Thanks!!
-Bill VonDane
EAA Tech Counselor
RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
www.vondane.com
www.creativair.com
www.epanelbuilder.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
Bill,
The best deal I have found on these is at Avionicswest.com for $270 and
11.67 shipping. Do you have a better source?
Ross Mickey
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill VonDane" <bill(at)vondane.com>
Subject: RV-List: Headsets
>
> Just an opinion...
>
> I had the opportunity to fly with a friend of mine yesterday and wear one
of the new Lightspeed 3G headsets... I'm sorry to say that I didn't like
them at all... The weren't that comfortable and the noise canceling was
disappointing... The aircraft was a BD4 with a 180 C/S, It's a pretty loud
aircraft, and the noise canceling DID work, but it was still very loud...
>
> I have a set of LS QFR Cross Country's and LOVE them! I should have taken
a set in the plane to compare, but didn't think about it... I have had
other LS head sets as well, and still don't think anything compares to the
Cross Country's. I think I am going to upgrade mine to the new CC2's pretty
soon... my plane is so quiet to me that I don't eve think about it, and
have had many comments from pax about how quiet it is...
>
> For the money you cant beat them!
>
> Lightspeed G3: $460
> Lightspeed CC2: $275
>
> -Bill VonDane
> EAA Tech Counselor
> RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
> www.vondane.com
> www.creativair.com
> www.epanelbuilder.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve&Anita Nyman" <nyman(at)bellsouth.net> |
| Subject: | RV7 Electric elevator trim |
It's been awhile since I installed the trim motor and I can't remember exactly
how came up with the length of the rod. My rod is 2 1/8" plus the distance on
each end that it is screwed in to the clevis. Hope that helps.
Steve Nyman
RV7QB
MEM
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Liming <gary(at)liming.org> |
| Subject: | Re: more on: Cockpit "Audio out" to videocamera |
>
>I'm back on this subject... Earlier in the year I bought a HI8 video
>camera. A Sony TRV318... It's a nice camera, and had all the features I
>wanted (or thought I wanted), including a good price...but I see that it
>doesn't have an audio in jack!
>
>Can anyone tell me about any cameras that do have this feature? I am
>probably going to get a new one and then sell mine...
>
>Thanks!!
Hi Bill,
Many of these cameras (don't know specifically about yours) use the same
audio and video out jacks for audio and video in during recording. Check
the camera manual or their website before going to something different. In
fact, almost zero cameras have a separate audio in jack that I've been able
to find.
Gary Liming
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Don Harker" <dpharker(at)worldnet.att.net> |
Working on RV-7 Wings with a Gertz heated pitot tube (one bay outboard tie
down) and plan on installing a DigiTrack autopilot (servo gets in way). All
this requires running the pitot tubes (static/dynamic) some other way. I am
thinking about "pie-panning" (covering up) for lack of a better word, the
second lightening holes aft of the spar to hold the snap bushings for the
pitot tubes. Anyone done this or have a better suggestion?
Thanks. Happy Holidays
Don Harker
Gurnee ,IL
RV-7A Wings
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RV-6 / 6a kit for sale |
| From: | "Kuebler, Scott" <skuebler(at)CANNONDESIGN.COM> |
RV-6 / 6a kit for sale.
Empennage: Complete except for fiberglass tips. Includes electric elevator trim
kit. All parts are alodined and primed with Marhyde primer.
Wings & Phlogiston Spar: Both skeletons assembled. All skins drilled to both
wings, ready for final riveting. Flaps and ailerons complete, but not fitted.
Both tanks are complete and sealed. Includes electric aileron trim kit. All
parts are alodined and primed with Deft epoxy primer (Mil-P-23377G).
Both kits are the pre-punched versions purchased in 1997 & 1998 by myself. Construction
is excellent. Preview plans and Orndorff videos are included for both
kits.
Price: $4750
If all items were purchased separately the price would be more than $6500 for unassembled
kits. The tools are not for sale; I will be keeping them to guarantee
that I will build another RV in the near future!
Happy Holidays,
Scott Kuebler
Buffalo, NY
716-695-1987 home
716-510-0318 cell
skuebler(at)cannondesign.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David E. Nelson" <david.nelson(at)pobox.com> |
Hi Ross,
$269.95 w/ free shipping from:
http://www.flightessentials.net/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=548
I just purchased a Lightspeed 20XL2 w/ free shipping from these folks and it
showed up three days later in Austin, TX.
Regards,
/\/elson
Austin, TX
RV-7A - Emp
On Thu, 18 Dec 2003, Ross Mickey wrote:
>
> Bill,
>
> The best deal I have found on these is at Avionicswest.com for $270 and
> 11.67 shipping. Do you have a better source?
>
> Ross Mickey
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bill VonDane" <bill(at)vondane.com>
> To: ; ; "vansairforce"
>
> Subject: RV-List: Headsets
>
>
> >
> > Just an opinion...
> >
> > I had the opportunity to fly with a friend of mine yesterday and wear one
> of the new Lightspeed 3G headsets... I'm sorry to say that I didn't like
> them at all... The weren't that comfortable and the noise canceling was
> disappointing... The aircraft was a BD4 with a 180 C/S, It's a pretty loud
> aircraft, and the noise canceling DID work, but it was still very loud...
> >
> > I have a set of LS QFR Cross Country's and LOVE them! I should have taken
> a set in the plane to compare, but didn't think about it... I have had
> other LS head sets as well, and still don't think anything compares to the
> Cross Country's. I think I am going to upgrade mine to the new CC2's pretty
> soon... my plane is so quiet to me that I don't eve think about it, and
> have had many comments from pax about how quiet it is...
> >
> > For the money you cant beat them!
> >
> > Lightspeed G3: $460
> > Lightspeed CC2: $275
> >
> > -Bill VonDane
> > EAA Tech Counselor
> > RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
> > www.vondane.com
> > www.creativair.com
> > www.epanelbuilder.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
~~ ** ~~ If you didn't learn anything when you broke it the 1st ~~ ** ~~
time, then break it again.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Harker" <dpharker(at)worldnet.att.net>
> Working on RV-7 Wings with a Gertz heated pitot tube (one bay outboard tie
> down) and plan on installing a DigiTrack autopilot (servo gets in way).
All
> this requires running the pitot tubes (static/dynamic) some other way. I
am
> thinking about "pie-panning" (covering up) for lack of a better word, the
> second lightening holes aft of the spar to hold the snap bushings for the
> pitot tubes. Anyone done this or have a better suggestion?
> Thanks. Happy Holidays
I installed a Piper style P/S just outboard of the access panel and was also
able to install the TruTrak servo. The P/S is aft of the servo. I cut a
new access panel behind the servo so I could access the D sub connector
without removing the servo.
Ross Mickey
RV6A
N9PT
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: To Cork or not to Cork? |
In a message dated 12/17/03 6:22:15 AM Pacific Standard Time,
winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com writes:
<< If you ever need to remove the cover plates, just take a small propane
torch and lightly heat the pro-seal. >>
No flame intended, but having witnessed several "empty" fuel tank explosions,
this seems pretty high risk to me.
Harry Crosby
Pleasanton, California
RV-6, firewall forward
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Andrew Barker" <Andrew(at)trutrakap.com> |
The TruTrak servo can be mounted in either wing, so that you do not have to
worry about it getting in the way.
Andrew Barker
TruTrak Flight Systems
479-751-0250
www.trutrakap.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Pitot Tubes
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Don Harker" <dpharker(at)worldnet.att.net>
> > Working on RV-7 Wings with a Gertz heated pitot tube (one bay outboard
tie
> > down) and plan on installing a DigiTrack autopilot (servo gets in way).
> All
> > this requires running the pitot tubes (static/dynamic) some other way.
I
> am
> > thinking about "pie-panning" (covering up) for lack of a better word,
the
> > second lightening holes aft of the spar to hold the snap bushings for
the
> > pitot tubes. Anyone done this or have a better suggestion?
> > Thanks. Happy Holidays
>
> I installed a Piper style P/S just outboard of the access panel and was
also
> able to install the TruTrak servo. The P/S is aft of the servo. I cut a
> new access panel behind the servo so I could access the D sub connector
> without removing the servo.
>
> Ross Mickey
> RV6A
> N9PT
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: vortex generators |
| From: | Boyd Braem <bcbraem(at)comcast.net> |
The Buccaneer S.2B is an unusual plane. I got some time in one from 12
Squadron, RAF Lossiemouth after spending a bunch of time putting the
pilot's fingers back together when his GIB closed the canopy on his
hand--those silly Scots. Tho, they throw some great parties.
Boyd.
On Thursday, December 18, 2003, at 12:12 PM, Jim Oke wrote:
>
> A
> British aircraft called the Buccaneer used blowing boundary layer
> control on
> the tailplane to get acceptable landing characteristics for aircraft
> carrier
> use at the cost of considerable plumbing complexity but it worked.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cammie Patch" <cammie(at)sunvalley.net> |
| Subject: | more on: Cockpit "Audio out" to videocamera |
I've spent a lot of time researching cameras lately. My final choice is the
Canon Optura 300, but it sell for around $1000. I really like the Canon line
though, and the ZR70 also looks like a great camera. I believe they all have
an audio out, but double check first.
cammie
do no archive
-----Original Message-----
I'm back on this subject... Earlier in the year I bought a HI8 video
camera. A Sony TRV318... It's a nice camera, and had all the features I
wanted (or thought I wanted), including a good price...but I see that it
doesn't have an audio in jack!
Can anyone tell me about any cameras that do have this feature? I am
probably going to get a new one and then sell mine...
Thanks!!
-Bill VonDane
EAA Tech Counselor
RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
www.vondane.com
www.creativair.com
www.epanelbuilder.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dec 17th 2003 100 Years / What did you do today to celebrate? |
>Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:24:27 -0800
>
>celebrate?
>
>The SoCal group had a good day. We got 10 RV's together, formed two
>flights of four, and two solos trailing. We did flyovers at 10
>airports. Got some nice comments from controllers (and one not so
>nice...)
>
>We ended up at Mojave. We got there too late to see Rutan's rocket,
>but Burt was in the Cafe, all smiles.
>
>One of our RVer's (Trish) is a school teacher and arranged to have us
>overflew her school in the Lake Arrowhead area (very close to the
>recent forest fires). You could hear the kids screaming in the
>background when she was transmitting to us from the ground. The even
>announced it over the school PA, so we had something like 400 kids
>watching us go over. Hopefully that will spark some of them.
>
>The day started with a take off at 7:30, and a roll at 7:35. The day
>ended up at Trish's hangar for a BBQ. Think I put 4 hours on the RV
>:-)
>
>It was a Good Day.
>
>Happy Holidays, everyone.
>
>Laird RV-6
>SoCal
Birdman,
You SoCal cats sure know how to party! I went solo, but also had a really
sweet centennial flight. My dad's birthday is also Dec 17. So, off I went
in 94BD to Mesa. Az to say HI, have lunch, and apply an RV grin to "da
kid's" face. As I walked out to my plane after the obligatory pee and swig
of coffee, I saw a local Pitt's driver buddy warming up his Lycosaur. "Are
you here for the same reason I am?" He asked. "Hell yeah! 0835 we take Rwy
22 and salute the boys from Dayton" was my reply.
We did so. Off we went, and formed up on upwind. Man, you have to throttle
Waaaaaaay back to stay tight on a fixed pitch S1S! After a wing wag and a
snappy salute, he rolled over and split-s'ed back towards the airport as I
throttled up for cruise to Mesa. What a glorious day...severe clear, syrupy
smooth air, and showing 195mph groundspeed. Nirvana folks, NIRVANA. An
hour and 45 and I was rolling out on rwy 4R at Falcon Field. Parked at
Anzios restaurant (very nice place I might add) and waited for Pop to show
up. He did, we ate, we laughed, we took pics, then we went to the CAF
Arizona Wing museum. Awesome! The B-17G "Sentimental Journey" was
undergoing year-end refurb and overhaul. I refreshed my memory banks from my
flight in her back in '95. I'll never forget it...especially the time in
the left seat.
The grey haired CAF'ers were doing their usual fabulous job of tweaking,
cleaning, wrenching and polishing. (What WILL WE DO when they're gone?) In
the background was heard Glenn Miller tunes to add to the scene. The SNJ5
was stripped for rewire and gear work. The B-25 is looking great and should
be airworthy soon. I almost wish I could jump ahead to retirement so I can
do this kind of work for free, and immerse myself in "the greatest
generation".
All this I owe to two dreamers from Ohio, and grampa Van. You see, I have
adopted him as my grandpa. Our first born was not my son Skyler, but my
RV8! The next addition to the family will be the RV10. True to form these
days, babies just keep getting bigger!
Peace, folks. Go fly, share your love of flight with others, and don't
forget what it took to make this all possible.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 51
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Stuart B McCurdy <sturdy(at)att.net> |
| Subject: | 100th Anniversary of Fitst Flight |
Dec 17 started out cold (below freezing) in the Austin area, but quickly
began to warm, actually and figuratively, with bright blue skies and
nearly calm winds. After telephone and email coordinating with about 25
formation takeoff, making a radio call "Falcon Flight is taking off to
celebrate the 100th year of the Wright Bros first flight".
After takeoff, we joined up with three others coming from the north,
rendezvoused with another pilot over another field, and proceeded as a
7-ship to San Marcos. After TV interviews planeside, I briefed the 25
pilots gathered to participate in the flyover. We started engines on a
time hack and taxied out as Centennial Flight consisting of Falcon
Flight of 12, Bonanza Flight of 6, Warbird Flight of 4, Singles Flight
of 4 in trail, and a photo aircraft. After formation takeoffs and a
large circular overhead joinup, Centennial Flight proceeded on course
with Austin Approach monitoring.
Falcon Flight of 12 (10 RVs, a Mustang II, and a T-18) configured into
the shape of a canard airplane to represent the Wright Flyer (see
picture), Bonanza Flight of 6 took a mile spacing and fell into a Delta
configuration, Warbird Flight of 4 (a T-6, T-34, and 2 Yaks) took a
Diamond shape, and Singles Flight (C-177, Skybolt, L-4, and L-5)
followed in a spaced out trail. The Arrow photo airplane flew along
side with the TV videographer.
Centennial Flight flew to the IP and then the Capitol, making the 1235
TOT exactly. A crowd of government officials, TV station and newspaper
photographers, families, and the public viewed the flyover and it made
all 4 TV station evening news broadcasts and the morning Austin
American-Statesman front page, second section. Centennial Flight
proceeded north for another 10 miles before splitting up and heading
back to our home dromes with a sense that we had well celebrated the
100th Anniversary of the first flight. An email debrief of the
formation followed.
Stu McCurdy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Tasker <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Avery "flat" rivet set problem |
What is a "significant crown"? My flat sets are not flat. I thought
that they had to have some crown or there would be a significant chance
of marking the skin with the edge of the die.
Dick Tasker, 90573
Fuselage
Phil N wrote:
>
>I was having the WORST time with getting the shop head of my squeezed
>rivets to not cleat as I squeezed them. I ended up using a gun on quite
>a few rivets that should have been done with my rather expensive
>squeezer. I finally called Avery and had a discussion with them about
>it. It turns out that they had a run of flat sets that the guy who was
>doing the finish polishing got a little aggressive about his duty. The
>set, instead of being flat had a significant crown to it - thus if you
>didn't get the rivet PERFECTLY in the center it would run down the hill
>on the set. Let's just say that I am damn good at drilling out rivets
>at this point in my RV career!
>
>If you are having trouble that may sound like this, take the flat set
>out of your squeezer, hold it up to the light and put the edge of a
>steel scale on it. You will see a really bad crown to the set, instead
>of it being flat.
>
>Three days after my call, I had a brand new set - problem solved.
>
>Phil
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Joe Forbes <joefrb59(at)netscape.net> |
| Subject: | Re: To Cork or not to Cork? |
No flame taken. Why not use a heat gun?
HCRV6(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>In a message dated 12/17/03 6:22:15 AM Pacific Standard Time,
>winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com writes:
>
><< If you ever need to remove the cover plates, just take a small propane
>torch and lightly heat the pro-seal. >>
>
>No flame intended, but having witnessed several "empty" fuel tank explosions,
>this seems pretty high risk to me.
>
>Harry Crosby
>Pleasanton, California
>RV-6, firewall forward
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Oke <wjoke(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Futher Reflections (canopy pops) |
The Canadian glider pilot instruction manual uses the word S.O.A.R. which
stands for:
Situation - recognize what's wrong and what the likely result will be if no
action is taken.
Options - look for practical options to correct what's wrong and select the
best one
Action - put the selected course of action into effect
Reassess - to see if the situation is getting better, if yes continue what
you're doing, if no go back to S and repeat the process.
SOAR is a nice catchy word for glider pilots but the basic philosophy seems
sound for most segments of aviation.
Jim Oke
Wpg, MB
RV-3, RV-6A, ASW-20
----- Original Message -----
From: "kempthornes" <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Futher Reflections (canopy pops)
>
> I was reading just yesterday but I forgot the acronym already. What I
took
> away from it was a four step routine when problems arise. I think it went
> like this:
>
> Continue to fly the airplane
>
> Analyze the situation
>
> Take action
>
> Land
>
> They made the obvious but apparently often overlooked point that it is
> easier and safer to resolve problems while on the ground.
>
> AOPA Pilot I believe. With some strange (erroneous?) pie charts.
>
>
> K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
> RV6-a N7HK - Three trips to OSH now.
> PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Blanton Fortson <blanton(at)alaska.net> |
| Subject: | Re: vortex generators |
Matthew, you may by now have noted Jim's eloquent post of this
morning:
From: Jim Oke <wjoke(at)shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: RV-List: vortex generators
Date: December 18, 2003 8:12:30 AM AST
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
(Jim's notes copied to bottom of page here)
He put it down quite well.
In my experience, the VG "kit's" most worth their salt are of the sort
which Chuck White of Micro-Aero sells. These are test-flown & STC'd but
one could certainly learn from observing and "roll one's own". It may
be that for production/STC's stuff that Mr. White may have a patent on
the wings, HS, VS bit, but in my view that's the way to go. VG's may
not be as prevalent in your neighborhood as up here in Alaska but if
you can find a few AC wearing them, do look closely. Some kits have the
wing VG's nearer to or further back from the leading edge. Once again,
I'd try to emulate the "Micro-Aero" recipe.
http://www.microaero.com/
Regards, Blanton
http://homepage.mac.com/blanton
1051V: wing: Robertson STOL, Sportsman STOL, Wing-X STOL, Deemer's
tips, Micro-Aero VG's on wing, VS, HS (underside, of course) (40'2"
span vs. 36' for most Cessnas, plus significantly increased depth of
chord span-wide due to the Sportsman airfoil being carried through the
custom Wing-X extensions and Deemers tips. Almost forgot the Precise
Flight speed brakes.
"The wing is the thing".
On Dec 18, 2003, at 7:11 AM, Matt Jurotich wrote:
>
>
> Very interesting. Every VG kit I've been able to find just supplies
> wing
> VGs. How does the increased elevator authority affect trim sensitivity
> during landing? Any increase in elevator authority during cruise?
> Did you
> use a kit or roll your own? Do you also have vertical stab VGs?
>
> Thanks
>
> <blanton(at)alaska.net>
>
> VG's on both sides of the VS may affect yaw qualities ... they
> may
> create an effect like a "virtually" larger VS. I know the VG's
> on the
> underside of my HS dramatically increased elevator authority as
> if the
> HS and elevator were larger.
>
> B.
>
>
> Matthew M. Jurotich
>
> NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center
> Swales contractor to the
> JWST ISIM Systems Engineer
>
> m/c : 443
> e-mail mail to:
> phone : 301-286-5919
> fax : 301-286-1736
>
>
> JWST URL: <http://ngst1.gsfc.nasa.gov
>
>
........................................................................
........................................................................
...........................................
When landing a conventionally configured aircraft, especially with the
wing
flaps extended, a lot of "aft stick" is needed to overcome the nose down
pitching moment that slow flight requires plus even more to rotate the
nose
upwards to flare the aircraft before touchdown.
Aft stick means the trailing edge of the elevator moves up so the tail
surface becomes a curved, cambered surface producing lift in the
downwards
sense. (Think of an upside down wing with the flaps extended.) Anything
that
can be done to improve the lifting characteristics of the
tailplane-elevator
combination, such as turbulators that will help keep the airflow
attached on
the underside of the tail, will provide more downward lift which the
pilot
sees as more "nose up" pitch authority when landing.
Turbulators are one method. I recall seeing some aircraft with a reverse
slotted horizontal tail leading edge in the past (one of the higher
performance Cessna singles possibly) that accomplish the same thing. A
British aircraft called the Buccaneer used blowing boundary layer
control on
the tailplane to get acceptable landing characteristics for aircraft
carrier
use at the cost of considerable plumbing complexity but it worked.
Similar theory would apply to vertical stab turbulators that should
provide
better lift characteristics to the fin-rudder combination that provide
restoring forces to yawing motions and so (perhaps) better yaw
stability to
the aircraft.
Lots more pilot oriented aerodynamics at http://www.av8n.com/how/
Jim Oke
Wpg., MB
RV-3
RV-6A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: To Cork or not to Cork? |
>
> If you ever need to remove the cover plates,
>just take a small propane torch and lightly heat the pro-seal. The plate
>will come right off.
An even quicker way to get that plate off is to use a big torch and stick
it in the filler hole!
do not do this
hal
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Blanton Fortson <blanton(at)alaska.net> tocelebrate? |
| Subject: | Re: Dec. 17th 2003 100 years / What did you do today |
tocelebrate?
>>What do they fly in Alaska? Taildraggers rule there.<<
HEY, both my Alaska bushplanes have been nose-draggers, with the big
Landis fork (and an 8.50x6 nose tire, at least) (Landis PA28/C206 nose
fork for 7.00x6 and larger tires)
On both the 172xp and the 206 (http://homepage.mac.com/blanton) I flew
24" mains and the largest tire I could fit in that big Piper nose fork.
On Dec 18, 2003, at 8:15 AM, Greg Milner wrote:
>
>> taidraggers were having a tough time taxiing but the 6a had no
>> problem<
>
> I`ve been flying taildraggers in the midwest for 6yrs. and don`t see
> noserollers having any advantage. What do they fly in Alaska?
> Taildraggers rule there.
>
> Greg Milner
> RV-4 79KM
> Waukesha,Wi. UES
>
>
> _-
> ======================================================================
> _-> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Dec 17th 2003 100 Years / What did you do today to celebrate? |
| From: | Michael D Hilger <rvsixer(at)juno.com> |
> What did you do today to celebrate 100 years of powered flight?
The weather here in So.St.Paul, MN was great, temps in the 20's, and
I had the day off.
So out came the -6, and away I flew down Mark Twain's Mississippi past
LaCrosse, WI to
Prairie du Chien. The walls of the FBO are covered with photos of
visiting aircraft (Michael -
Susie-Q was there!) and I had a nice time visiting with the locals and
reflecting on the last
100 years of flight. Then off toward home to start the SECOND 100
years...
Mike Hilger
RV-6, N207AM, 500 hrs
So.St.Paul, Minnesota (SGS)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leesafur(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: To Cork or not to Cork? |
"No flame intended"
That's such a fitting phrase for this topic :-) But on a serious note the
industry standard for the flash point on gas is -25 to -35 degree witch means
that the gas will flash from the heat source from your heat gun or the spark from
the brushes in your hair dryer will ignite the vapor.
I clean gas tanks for a living and granted were talking about a 30 gal tank
and not a 3 million gal tank but the rules are the same. I=E2=80=99ve heard more
stories than you can shake a stick at and would hate to hear another one from the
RV
community.
Lee
Anoka MN
RV-3 Wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill Dube <bdube(at)al.noaa.gov> |
| Subject: | Gas tank explosion hazard (Was: To Cork or not to Cork?) |
>
>In a message dated 12/17/03 6:22:15 AM Pacific Standard Time,
>winterland(at)rkymtnhi.com writes:
>
><< If you ever need to remove the cover plates, just take a small propane
>torch and lightly heat the pro-seal. >>
>
>No flame intended, but having witnessed several "empty" fuel tank explosions,
>this seems pretty high risk to me.
The best way I have ever heard to reduce the risk of fire and
explosion is to toss a few cups of dry ice pellets in the tank about twenty
minutes before you begin work.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LeastDrag93066(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: more on: Cockpit "Audio out" to videocamera |
Video camera "MIC" jack? Audio IN.
My past experience with the "MIC" input to a video camera has been the camera
automatic gain control. If there is no outside noise, the automatic gain
increases to a level that it has noise (static). Probably not a problem with the
engine running, though.
Jim Ayers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Rozendaal" <dougr(at)petroblend.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Dec 17th 2003 100 Years / What did you do today to celebrate? |
> What did you do today to celebrate 100 years of powered flight?
I stood in the pouring rain, soaked to the skin and listened to the
President.
I watched the EAA first flight clock count down to Zero standing right
beside the replica flyer sitting inside Ford/EAA tent while it poured rain
outside.
I flew my new RV-4 over the Wright Brothers Memorial at Kill Devil Hill.
Wow!
"What I did not do" was fly the Corsair (as advertised here) because it did
not get out of North Dakota. But that is OK, I did fly the Mustang with the
Hornet during Monday's show and it was pretty cool!
On Wednesday they scrubbed all the afternoon flying and then the WX broke.
At the airport they told us, "anybody who wanted to to go fly, go fly down
the runway at First Flight Airport! It was incredible!
In retrospect, we should have organized a group of RVs to do a flyover.
20/20 hindsight......
Tailwinds,
Doug Rozendaal
The trip home today from MQI to MCW was a fun one.....7 hours of Ifr, Ice, &
30 to 50 kt headwinds.... I climbed to 12,000 ft to get on top. Still
climbing 600 fpm @ 100 Kias with a half an inch of mixed ice, mostly
clear.... Boy am I glad I don't have a Glasair or a Lancair!!!!
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wayne Reese" <waynereese(at)qwest.net> |
I put the Trutrak servo in the right wing with Trutrak's right wing kit,
as they suggested.
Wayne
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ross Mickey
Subject: Re: RV-List: Pitot Tubes
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Harker" <dpharker(at)worldnet.att.net>
> Working on RV-7 Wings with a Gertz heated pitot tube (one bay outboard
tie
> down) and plan on installing a DigiTrack autopilot (servo gets in
way).
All
> this requires running the pitot tubes (static/dynamic) some other way.
I
am
> thinking about "pie-panning" (covering up) for lack of a better word,
the
> second lightening holes aft of the spar to hold the snap bushings for
the
> pitot tubes. Anyone done this or have a better suggestion?
> Thanks. Happy Holidays
I installed a Piper style P/S just outboard of the access panel and was
also
able to install the TruTrak servo. The P/S is aft of the servo. I cut
a
new access panel behind the servo so I could access the D sub connector
without removing the servo.
Ross Mickey
RV6A
N9PT
=
=
=
=
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mickey & Paula" <mimartin(at)sweetwaterhsa.com> |
mimartin(at)sweetwaterhsa.com
307-382-5621
Dear Sir:
I am writing to you express my concerns with what seems to business as usual with
government agencies. My husband is a private pilot, on February 10, 2003 he
had his physical to renew his medical certificate. He waited several months to
hear from the F.A.A. Then he asked the Experimental Aircraft Association representative
Susan Sedlachek to see if she could find out what was happening. She
told him that F.A.A. wanted additional information which my husband and the
F.A.A. approved physician provided. He then waited another few months until July
24th before he heard that he was being rejected because of hypertension, type
II diabetes and some incorrect information sent by his personal physician.
He wrote a letter with additional information and his personal physician also
wrote a letter explaining errors in original information. He sent this packet
with delivery confirmation request by U.S. Postal Service. The F.A.A. signed
this delivery confirmation card on Sept 19, 2003. This packet of information was
ignored?, misplaced? Now on December 11th he spoke with Susan Sedlachek who
again contacted F.A.A. and they had no record of the information sent in September.
He made copies of everything and resubmitted the packet by fax. We still
have no answer. If this isn't bad enough we know other pilots who have experienced
the same sort of delays and problems. There are businesses who offer to
take your paperwork from desk to desk at the F.A.A. to expedite the process.
Professional pilots have no recourse but to pay this added expense to be sure
they receive the necessary certificate to remain current. Few private pilots can
justify the expense.
In the same way the F.A.A. has now taken over 2 years to decide what rules will
apply to the new 'Sport' pilot classification. The final rule has been delayed
and delayed again, the final rule has yet to be made public.
This is not the only government agency that operates in the same manner. We have
a friend who has paid a lawyer several thousands of dollars to expedite his
application for papers to work and stay in the United States. This lawyer is to
help them understand the forms for the Immigration & Naturalization Service
and to again carry the papers from desk to desk at I.N.S.
This all seems to me very like stories I have read of third world countries where
nothing gets done without a little something the grease the hand. What is becoming
of our country?
RV6 Builder
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Reimer" <cgreimer(at)mb.sympatico.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Dec 17th 2003 100 Years / What did you do today to celebrate? |
I didn't have a chance to take a flight in my RV-6 on the 17th due to the
fact that she is all fueled up and ready to launch tomorrow (Friday) morning
for the trip of a lifetime. From Winnipeg, MB Canada I will be heading
southwest though the Dakotas, Nebraska, Kansas, etc. to Tucumcari, NM for
the night, then onto Mesa (FFZ) on Saturday, wx permitting, for Christmas
with my folks. 85 hrs on the bird so far, and this will be my first flight
into the U.S., my first really long cross country and my first encounter
with mountains, although I am planning on flying the "low" route via TCS and
DMN.
Man, am I pumped! Thanks Orville and Wilbur!
Curt
RV-6 C-GACR
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "David Carter" <dcarter(at)datarecall.net> |
| Subject: | Re: more on: Cockpit "Audio out" to videocamera |
We just discussed this a week ago - you need a Radio Shack 42-2142A
"Attenuating Audio Cable" (1/8 mono jacks on each end) plus a 274-325
mono-to-mono Audio Adapter (accepts 1/2" mono phone plug, fits 1/4" mono
phone jack)" It is always the case that aircraft intercom and radio audio
amplitude is too great to be handled by an audio or video recorder which
causes distortion, not static. You have to reduce the amplitude. The cited
attenuating cable has a resister inside that cuts the amplitude going into
the recorder. I just flight tested mine last week and it worked.
David
----- Original Message -----
From: <LeastDrag93066(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: more on: Cockpit "Audio out" to videocamera
>
> Video camera "MIC" jack? Audio IN.
>
> My past experience with the "MIC" input to a video camera has been the
camera
> automatic gain control. If there is no outside noise, the automatic gain
> increases to a level that it has noise (static). Probably not a problem
with the
> engine running, though.
>
> Jim Ayers
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Warren W Hurd <warren(at)ahyup.com> |
| Subject: | Dec 17th - The RV grin |
I celebrated Dec 17th by getting in a RV for the first time.
Seen plenty of RV's but have never been in one. Gave myself a good grin.
See me in a RV at http://ahyup.com/beta/
Warren
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Blanton Fortson <blanton(at)alaska.net> |
| Subject: | Flight test reviews |
Has anyone out there got an article in electronic form on an RV-9
flight test or flight review? Or perhaps a pointer to such?
Thanks.
Blanton Fortson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Thomas Lukasczyk" <Lukasczyk(at)gmx.net> |
Hello RV-Builders
I put on the Wingtips last summer and I thought I would never have to worry
about them ever again. There are people telling about wingtips becoming
loose
and eventually falling off due to the rivets pulling out of the fiberglass.
I decided against the option of being able to take the aileron-pushrods out
without removing the wings and riveted them on using the supplied
pop-rivets.
The plans were asking for reinforcement aluminum-strips and I have seen
builders using epoxy, screws or proseal to put the fiberglass parts on. I
watched
the edge-distance clearances and even the remaining thickness after
countersinking the fiberglass looked ok to me. I do work with fiberglass a
lot and I
just cant see those rivets pulling out.
So there are no aluminum strips on my wingtips. Instead I used a heavy duty
sealing-adhesive to "glue" the fiberglass parts on while pulling the pop
rivets.
No doupt that an additional strip would have made a stronger attachement but
unfortunately my wing has already been finished and painted.
Is there anyone out there who is flying a RV without the strips and both
wingtips still on the plane? Do they really become loose after a while. Do I
have a to saw the tips off again in order to add the strips or something
else?
Thank you for your answer
Thomas, RV-4, just about to start the engine
--
+++ GMX - die erste Adresse fr Mail, Message, More +++
Neu: Preissenkung fr MMS und FreeMMS! http://www.gmx.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Looking for Bret Marquis |
| From: | "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart(at)iss.net> |
Does anyone have his current contact information?
He is a very old list member. Early 90's.
Thanks
Michael Stewart
Quality Assurance
404.236.3363
GO ISS!
"Why is it doing that and how do I make it stop?"
What an old pilot said while learning a new computerized cockpit
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Dudley <rhdudley(at)att.net> |
Listers,
Since I'm in the last stages of building, I do not need many of my 3/32
clecoes. I'd be glad to sell a couple of hundred for 2/3 of the going
price. I will cover shipping.
You can't have too many clecoes.
Please contact me off list.
Richard Dudley
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frazier, Vincent A" <VFrazier(at)usi.edu> |
SNIP It turns out that they had a run of flat sets that the guy who was
doing the finish polishing got a little aggressive about his duty. The
set, instead of being flat had a significant crown to it - SNIP
Don't be shy about taking your dies over to the belt sander and sanding them flat.
The rough surface will help keep the rivet from sliding around and clinching.
Sand blasting the face of the flat set also works well.
I have a few untouched (nice and shiny) flat sets for use on the skin side of the
work, but for the shop head side I always grab the flat sets with the coarse
finish.
Take it FWIW, I drilled out hundreds of rivets on my first RV. On the Rocket I
almost never drilled any out.
Vince Frazier
1946 Stinson, NC97535, FOR SALE
F-1H Rocket, N540VF, Crazy Horse
<http://www.usi.edu/science/chemistry/vfrazier/page1.html>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | P M Condon <pcondon(at)mitre.org> |
| Subject: | Gas tank explosion hazard (Was: To Cork or not to Cork?) |
Another way to (somewhat) safely heat up a gas tank is to plumb the
exhaust from your car into the the tank. Use the shopvac plastic hose,
attach tightly to car exhause, start car, shove other end into tank
opening with a lot of gap so you don't over pressure the tank. Go make
some coffee. By the time you return, the atmosphere in the tank will be
moist and flooded with exhaust that will not ignite. Be sure all the
tank bays are flooded with the exhaust and be sure you don't get a
static spark from shoving the plastic hose in. From here you could apply
heat with a heat gun....but I am still chicken to take a torch or open
flame to a tank. Other folks do, the old timer who showed me this trick
has done it for years...he said its a old farmers trick used to repair
and soulder fuel tanks on tractors. I've seen car repair stations do
this too. You may want to consider cutting (fly cut) some new access
holes. This heat thing in a fuel tank dosen't sound safe.......oh well,
back to juggling running chain saws.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dave Sundberg" <dfsund(at)aol.com> |
There has been some great prop. comparison testing done recently, but
unfortunately it did not include the new "Blended Airfoil" c.s.
Hartzell. Van's is now offering this prop. in both 72" and 74" models
for the 7A. Any thoughts as to what the performance difference would be
between the two on an O-360? TIA for the info and I hope you all have a
great and safe holiday.
Dave
7A Wiring
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Oke <wjoke(at)shaw.ca> |
Thomas;
I think this is one of those "why worry" situations. The very worst that
could happen is that after years of use you might see a few of those
pop-rivets getting loose and wobbly - not "likely" just "might". Anyway,
the actual in-flight stresses on the typical RV wingtips must be quite small
and these things are hardly a critical item (safe where they might interfer
with aileron travel). Thus any "wingtip falling off" problem should be
easily spotted in plenty of time to do a fix. Might be a bit of work fixing
up the paint, but that's years off into the future if ever.
FWIW, I pop-riveted my RV-3 tips on about 15 years ago (I think I used a
backing strip but its been a long time now) and I see not a hint of any
stress or problem with the poprivets. This despite a lot of outdoor storage
in some extreme climate conditions such as +35 C to -35 C every year.
In short, there are better things to worry about. Press on and go flying and
see what happens.
Jim Oke
RV-3, RV-6A
Winnipeg, MB
----- Original Message -----
From: "Thomas Lukasczyk" <Lukasczyk(at)gmx.net>
Subject: RV-List: Wingtips
>
> Hello RV-Builders
>
>
> I put on the Wingtips last summer and I thought I would never have to
worry
> about them ever again. There are people telling about wingtips becoming
> loose
> and eventually falling off due to the rivets pulling out of the
fiberglass.
> I decided against the option of being able to take the aileron-pushrods
out
> without removing the wings and riveted them on using the supplied
> pop-rivets.
> The plans were asking for reinforcement aluminum-strips and I have seen
> builders using epoxy, screws or proseal to put the fiberglass parts on. I
> watched
> the edge-distance clearances and even the remaining thickness after
> countersinking the fiberglass looked ok to me. I do work with fiberglass a
> lot and I
> just cant see those rivets pulling out.
> So there are no aluminum strips on my wingtips. Instead I used a heavy
duty
> sealing-adhesive to "glue" the fiberglass parts on while pulling the pop
> rivets.
> No doupt that an additional strip would have made a stronger attachement
but
> unfortunately my wing has already been finished and painted.
> Is there anyone out there who is flying a RV without the strips and both
> wingtips still on the plane? Do they really become loose after a while. Do
I
> have a to saw the tips off again in order to add the strips or something
> else?
>
> Thank you for your answer
>
>
> Thomas, RV-4, just about to start the engine
>
> --
> +++ GMX - die erste Adresse fr Mail, Message, More +++
> Neu: Preissenkung fr MMS und FreeMMS! http://www.gmx.net
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Dudley <rhdudley(at)att.net> |
Listers,
I have a pair of 3/32" tank dimpling dies that I no longer need. I built
my -6A tanks with them. They were purchased from Cleaveland. You can
have them for $20.
Please reply off line.
Richard Dudley
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Bill VonDane <bill(at)vondane.com> |
| Subject: | Transition Training... |
vansairforce
Anyone doing RV tailwheel training in the neighborhood of Colorado Springs, CO?
-Bill VonDane
EAA Tech Counselor
RV-8A ~ N8WV ~ Colorado Springs
www.vondane.com
www.creativair.com
www.epanelbuilder.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "LML Klingmuller" <l_klingmuller(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Free Steamboat Condo../ or Marble, Colorado. |
Hey Bill, Count me in when you open up your doors next year!!! I will beer
and a sleeping bag.
I am getting bored flying to Front Range (Colorado) airports.
For those who want to do some mountain flying, the Colorado Pilots Association (www.ColoradoPilott.org) has a yearly flying to Marble. It is a private grass strip on the other side of Aspen. Flying there does require mountain flying experiment. You may consider participate in a one day course the CPA puts on once a year. Anyhow, I was surprised that the owner never saw an RV there, so lets show those Wichita AP makers there are other planes flying.
LML Klingmuller
l_klingmuller(at)earthlink.net
Why Wait? Move to EarthLink.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Brasch" <gbrasch(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Flying with Bob Archer Com Antennas? |
Can any of you out there flying with these antennas advise on their performance?
Thanks in advance.
Glenn in Tucson, -9A Wings, Fuselage ordered.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Laird Owens <owens(at)aerovironment.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flying with Bob Archer Com Antennas? |
I've got his VOR antenna in the wingtip and it works fine....
Laird RV6
SoCal
>
>Can any of you out there flying with these antennas advise on their
>performance? Thanks in advance.
>
>Glenn in Tucson, -9A Wings, Fuselage ordered.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Glenn Brasch" <gbrasch(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Flying with Bob Archer Com Antennas? |
I have heard the VOR/Nav antennas are fine, but there has been problems with
the Com, any feedback on Com antennas specifically would be appreciated.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Laird Owens" <owens(at)aerovironment.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Flying with Bob Archer Com Antennas?
>
> I've got his VOR antenna in the wingtip and it works fine....
>
> Laird RV6
> SoCal
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flying with Bob Archer Com Antennas? |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Laird Owens" <owens(at)aerovironment.com>
> I've got his VOR antenna in the wingtip and it works fine....
Laird,
Could you describe how yours is positioned? Mine is as vertical as I could
get it right at the end of the aluminum wing where it meets the tip. My
reception is quite abit lower than my standard comm antenna mounted on my
belly.
Ross
RV6A N9PT
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Laird Owens <owens(at)aerovironment.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flying with Bob Archer Com Antennas? |
Ross,
It sounds like your confusing the VOR antenna I have and the COM
antenna. I've heard the COM antenna doesn't work well in the
wingtip, but I've also 2 local friends that like theirs.
Anyway, in case you did mean the VOR antenna, mine is mounted on the
upper surface of the old style wingtips, just as the instructions say.
I think Sam has some pictures and a review on his web site, the RV journal.
Good luck.
Laird
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Laird Owens" <owens(at)aerovironment.com>
>> I've got his VOR antenna in the wingtip and it works fine....
>
>Laird,
>
>Could you describe how yours is positioned? Mine is as vertical as I could
>get it right at the end of the aluminum wing where it meets the tip. My
>reception is quite abit lower than my standard comm antenna mounted on my
>belly.
>
>Ross
>RV6A N9PT
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RV-7A kit for sale |
| From: | windsaloft(at)rmisp.com |
This is one of those "Holy Toledo" posts ----
I will be leaving Lander, Wyoming for just south of Jacksonville, FL on
January 7 to start a new job on Jan.12
I either have to sell my RV-7A project lickity split, or figure out how to
transport it and store it for about 6 months..........
I have an empennage kit, completed except for fiberglass. It has the
older rudder, but I have the new rudder kit from vans still in the box.
I have a wing kit, 1st wing started, in the midst of sealing tanks -- 2d
wing untouched. Flaps and ailerons about 85% done.
I have a QB fuselage kit that I have opened and inventoried but not done
anything to.
When I add up the invoices, it exceeds $19,000 in parts. If you came to
Lander, WY and used a U Haul or truck to drive away with it, I'd help you
load it and let it all go for $15,000. I can guarantee (in writing) that
all the parts are there. Need to hear from you before Jan. 3
No tools to be sold -- I hope to start anew someday...........and I also
have a flying RV-6A that I have to maintain!
Terri Watson
N1977D flying
N8862T reserved
windsaloft(at)rmisp.com
________________________________________________________________________________
Dave,
If maximum performance is what you're after various bits of data I've seen
would indicate the 74" is the choice. It will have a higher tip speed at a
given rpm however and will therefore be a little bit noisier. Of course the
1" greater radius puts you that much closer to gravel etc. also. Because you
have a nosewheel, and because any performance improvement will be very
small, I'd use the 72" with any -A model.
FWIW,
Randy Lervold
www.rv-8.com
>
> There has been some great prop. comparison testing done recently, but
> unfortunately it did not include the new "Blended Airfoil" c.s.
> Hartzell. Van's is now offering this prop. in both 72" and 74" models
> for the 7A. Any thoughts as to what the performance difference would be
> between the two on an O-360? TIA for the info and I hope you all have a
> great and safe holiday.
>
> Dave
> 7A Wiring
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kosta Lewis" <mikel(at)dimensional.com> |
| Subject: | Antenna/radio reception |
>Last weekend I heard a radio call from an airport 100 miles away. Is it
>normal to have this kind of reception. I never had this happen with
rental
>planes.
I was headed to OSH one year and was on 123.00 for the next field I had
to listen to, which is also home frequency. I was 86nm out and heard
someone announce left downwind for 15. I thought what the hell and
called back that pattern for 15 was right pattern. "Oh, OK. Right
pattern? OK." He called back. I have a belly mounted fiberglass (Dorne &
Margolin) antennae and ICOM A200 radio. FBO radio man a while back said
he always knows it's me because the radio broadcast is so loud. Gotta
love it.
Michael
RV-4 N232 Suzie Q
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Leesafur(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 12/19/2003 1:22:06 PM Central Standard Time,
Fiveonepw(at)aol.com writes:
Something y'all might want to consider is using hinges just like the cowling
sides- I recently did sheared tips this way and am very pleased with the
results- no ugly screws and they can be on/off in minutes- make that less
than a
minute when I get all the epoxy cleaned out of the holes and don't need to
grab
the drill...
Hay that's a good idea but how do you fasten the hinge pin?
Lee
Anoka MN
RV-3 wing
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Doug Gray <dgra1233(at)bigpond.net.au> |
| Subject: | Re: Dec 17th 2003 100 Years / What did you do today tocelebrate? |
>What did you do today to celebrate 100 years of powered flight?
I had nothing planned, off to work as usual, not a peep about the
special day on national radio or in the one Sydney daily newspaper I saw.
The journalists either slept through the event or just found it a little
ho hum to bother with.
3pm... tap tap tap on the outside office window, security door blocks
marketing staff access, she's waving some form of ticket.
"GD can't make it, someone suggested you might like to go..6:45 for 7pm
start tonight ... do you want the ticket?"
The ticket - for the Royal Aeronautical Society - Sydney branch -
Centenary of Flight Dinner - venue the Powerhouse Museum - Turbine
Gallery (lots of aircraft hanging on wires from the ceiling).
Manner from Heaven, how could I not go.....
This was the big end of town event - Qantas, Virgin, Boeing,
Rolls-Royce, Emirates and a number of the minors who have operated
locally, CEOs and chairmen of these significant organisations or their
representatives in Australia.
Guest speakers were two aviation journalists (Jeff Watson and Tom
Ballantyne) plus Max Hazelton, founder of a significant local
(Australian that is) airline.
I had first met Max Hazelton, at the time was chairman and CEO of
Hazelton Airlines, he was in the left hand seat flying single pilot RPT
flight from Cudal to Sydney Airport (NSW). I had talked my way into the
RH seat. The flight was a full on IFR approach to very close to the
minimums - Max Hazelton language of choice was 'pilotage'.
The journalists spoke well and presented a video made to commemorate the
event and presented news of another Wright Flyer replica built in South
Australia, due of course to be flown that day. Pioneer Aussie Aviators
were either present or spoken about. Lawrence Hargraves, in particular
since he was acknowledged by the Wright bros to have contributed to
their effort to attain powered flight. (No mention of Jon Johanson tho...)
I had a wow of a time with all these aviation enthusiasts and even
though they were from the other end of town, not the sport aircraft
people I normally associate with, the excitement and appreciation of
sharing the celebration together in the environment was a great privilege.
Various item of memorabilia were auctioned off raising an inordinate
amount of money in support of the Royal Flying Doctor Service. ....
$4500 for an RR Olympus turbine blade...can you believe it?
To top it all off I won one of the door prizes, a glider flight. I
think I'll enjoy that...
The 17th turned out to be a most memorable day for me, a fitting way to
celebrate the centenary of powered flight.
Doug Gray
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | RV-List Prop Bolts |
| From: | smoothweasel(at)juno.com |
Hey Girls(or Guys),
I was in the process of installing my prop tonight and it seems that the
set of studs that i have here with the motor are about 1/8" to long. They
protrude through the prop flange and hit the hub housing before the
flange tightens on the flywheel assembly. So guess I need shorter studs
to solve the problem. I checked Aircraft Spruce and didn't see any studs
listed. Is there some sort of spec. for this stud (i.e. 125000 or 160000
psi ) that I can use to locate something locally or do I need to contact
Hartsel? Oh by the way it's a 0-320 with a Hartsel C/S.
Weasel Graber
-4 wanting to start engine!!!
Brooksville MS
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Baffle Measurements.... |
I believe if you look at the directions, the airseal is 1.5" above and below
the aluminum (3" wide strips). As far as rivet spacing, I think I used about
1.5" between rivets, but varied it to ensure it all laid down flat. I used a
posterboard and laid it up next to the baffles and traced around the top where
the airseal rivets. I then offset the lines up and down by 1.5" each and cut
them out for templates. I also used soft aluminum rivets and aluminum
washers instead of the pull rivets, I thought it gave a more professional look
and I
had the supplies handy. Be sure to make all the templates of the seals and
lay them out on the airseal first, so you know you will have enough material to
finish the job. On my RV-4 I had very little to spare even after meticulously
laying out the patterns.
Don't forget to at least cleco in the fiberglass inlet ducts in the upper
cowl and cut the baffles down for clearance in this area before installing the
airseal. I learned this trick from experience.....
Hope this helps!
-Mike Kraus
N223RV Flying RV-4
N213RV building RV-10
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Cork or not to Cork? |
Thanks to everyone that provided their experiences. I got about a 50-50 response
on corking vs. not corking. The biggest issue seemed to be that cork would be
easier to open up again should the need arise. I decided to use the cork and
the task is done. I used 8x32 stainless socket head screws. They worked great.
Wings installed today.
On a final note, I don't care if I ever see Proseal again in this life time!!!!!!!
Anyone know how long this stuff will be on my hands?
Darwin N. Barrie
Chandler AZ
Crossflow Subaru
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Tim Bryan" <Tim(at)bryantechnology.com> |
| Subject: | For Sale - RV-6 Almost done with a panel to die for |
Listers,
My RV-6 is for sale. It is almost done.
Sheet metal work is pretty much done, Canopy is pretty much done except for
fiberglass.
Cowling is cut and fitted but hinges not on permanent, Engine is installed,
baffles are fitted and installed but no chaffe rubber yet, panel installed
complete, wiring done, wings test fitted.
0-360A1A Lycoming from Aerosport, New Constant Speed prop from Vans
I have everything to finish this airplane except the paint.
Serious buyers contact me off list for further details.
Tim Bryan
tim(at)bryantechnology.com
Redmond, Oregon
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | kempthornes <kempthornes(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Note from Dynon on OAT |
>
>
>One of my upsets with the Dynon was the lack of availability or OAT, and
>hence, true airspeed. A very very valuable tool when flying above
>sealevel.
Hi Mike,
I have done nothing since flight training days more than estimate TAS using
the 2% per 1000 feet thing. I didn't even use that when I was flying below
sea level and I suffered no pain! Especially with GPS, is seems to me of
little value.
I tried to find how/why to use TAS in several flying books to no
avail. Please say what value you see in knowing the TAS.
I'm rebuilding my panel - tying up loose wiring etc!! Probably Dynon and Trio.
K. H. (Hal) Kempthorne
RV6-a N7HK - Three trips to OSH now.
PRB (El Paso de Robles, CA)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-List Prop Bolts |
smoothweasel(at)juno.com wrote:
>
> Hey Girls(or Guys),
>I was in the process of installing my prop tonight and it seems that the
>set of studs that i have here with the motor are about 1/8" to long. They
>protrude through the prop flange and hit the hub housing before the
>flange tightens on the flywheel assembly.
>
Something is definitely amiss. The prop flange bushings do come in
different lengths depending on their use (FP Vs. CS), but unless the
engine has been converted, it shouldn't matter. One bushing is a little
larger dia than the others, and that's what indexes the flywheel to the
crank. You may not have the flywheel indexed correctly. Take out #1
plug and rotate crank to the compression stroke and place the piston at
TDC (Top Dead Center). Now fit the flywheel up on the crank with the 0
at the top. The 0 on the backside of the flywheel should align itself
with the case parting line. and should fit flush with the flange. Metal
props are counterbored to take the extended length of the bushings, if
there are any. I'm not sure of wood props are counterbored or not. The
other way to get around changing the bushings (they ain't cheap) would
be to get a prop spacer and add it to the stack. Problem is, that'll
push the prop forward and you'll have a larger gap between spinner and
cowl. Nothing's simple, is it???? Good luck.
Linn
> So guess I need shorter studs
>to solve the problem. I checked Aircraft Spruce and didn't see any studs
>listed. Is there some sort of spec. for this stud (i.e. 125000 or 160000
>psi ) that I can use to locate something locally or do I need to contact
>Hartsel? Oh by the way it's a 0-320 with a Hartsel C/S.
>
>
>
>
>Weasel Graber
>-4 wanting to start engine!!!
>Brooksville MS
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "jerry" <jerry(at)mc.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-7A kit for sale |
Hi Terri ...
I'm interested and can pick it up with my Dakota pickup and a trailer, real
soon. I'd have a certified check for you when I arrive. Send your phone
number and I'll call you. Or you can call me 847-669-0939 ... your option.
I'm in Northern Illinois, retired, and need something to build and fly.
Looking forward to your reply.
Jerry Grimmonpre jerry(at)mc.net
----- Original Message -----
From: <windsaloft(at)rmisp.com>
Subject: RV-List: RV-7A kit for sale
>
> This is one of those "Holy Toledo" posts ----
>
> I will be leaving Lander, Wyoming for just south of Jacksonville, FL on
> January 7 to start a new job on Jan.12
>
> I either have to sell my RV-7A project lickity split, or figure out how to
> transport it and store it for about 6 months..........
>
> I have an empennage kit, completed except for fiberglass. It has the
> older rudder, but I have the new rudder kit from vans still in the box.
>
> I have a wing kit, 1st wing started, in the midst of sealing tanks -- 2d
> wing untouched. Flaps and ailerons about 85% done.
>
> I have a QB fuselage kit that I have opened and inventoried but not done
> anything to.
>
> When I add up the invoices, it exceeds $19,000 in parts. If you came to
> Lander, WY and used a U Haul or truck to drive away with it, I'd help you
> load it and let it all go for $15,000. I can guarantee (in writing) that
> all the parts are there. Need to hear from you before Jan. 3
>
> No tools to be sold -- I hope to start anew someday...........and I also
> have a flying RV-6A that I have to maintain!
>
> Terri Watson
> N1977D flying
> N8862T reserved
> windsaloft(at)rmisp.com
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Larry Pardue" <n5lp(at)warpdriveonline.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Note from Dynon on OAT |
>
>
> I tried to find how/why to use TAS in several flying books to no
> avail. Please say what value you see in knowing the TAS.
>
I find the TAS display on my Rocky Mountain MicroEncoder very useful for
picking cruising altitudes. By making a quick comparison of TAS and GS
during the climb I can instantly see the head or tailwind component.
In cruise it is interesting, but not essential information, to see the
effects of lift and sink on speed. Sometimes you can see you are in gentle
down wave that is killing your speed. Remedied by altering course one way
or the other.
It is also a quick and dirty way of seeing if I am running about the cruise
power I want to. I know I normally cruise around 165 knots. If it is
something different I figure out why.
Approaching the airport I can see whether to expect wind shear. If I am
showing a 30 knot headwind at a thousand feet but the surface wind is 5
knots, watch out. This happened a week ago to me.
There are enough nice things about TAS display that I would hate to give it
up.
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
http://n5lp.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fiveonepw(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 12/19/03 7:34:06 PM Central Standard Time,
Leesafur(at)aol.com writes:
> Hay that's a good idea but how do you fasten the hinge pin?
>
The will clip to the inside of the rib that installs in the rear of the tip.
There is about a one inch offset from the pin line and the surface of the
rib. Haven't done it yet, but the plan is to install a platenut in the outboard
side of the rib, about 3" from the rear, then make a little nylon block with a
couple of holes drilled through it fore/aft for the pins, and one through the
block for a #8 screw into the platenut.
Best wishes and happy holidaze from The PossumWorks
Mark - plumbing the depths of the cockpit...........
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gil Alexander <gilalex(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: RV-List Prop Bolts |
Weasel(?),
All you ever wanted to know about prop bushing on Lycoming
engines is here....
http://www.lycoming.textron.com/support/publications/maintenancePublications/serviceInstructions/SI1098G.pdf
good luck .... gil in Tucson
>
>smoothweasel(at)juno.com wrote:
>
> >
> > Hey Girls(or Guys),
> >I was in the process of installing my prop tonight and it seems that the
> >set of studs that i have here with the motor are about 1/8" to long. They
> >protrude through the prop flange and hit the hub housing before the
> >flange tightens on the flywheel assembly.
> >
>Something is definitely amiss. The prop flange bushings do come in
>different lengths depending on their use (FP Vs. CS), but unless the
>engine has been converted, it shouldn't matter. One bushing is a little
>larger dia than the others, and that's what indexes the flywheel to the
>crank. You may not have the flywheel indexed correctly. Take out #1
>plug and rotate crank to the compression stroke and place the piston at
>TDC (Top Dead Center). Now fit the flywheel up on the crank with the 0
>at the top. The 0 on the backside of the flywheel should align itself
>with the case parting line. and should fit flush with the flange. Metal
>props are counterbored to take the extended length of the bushings, if
>there are any. I'm not sure of wood props are counterbored or not. The
>other way to get around changing the bushings (they ain't cheap) would
>be to get a prop spacer and add it to the stack. Problem is, that'll
>push the prop forward and you'll have a larger gap between spinner and
>cowl. Nothing's simple, is it???? Good luck.
>Linn
>
> > So guess I need shorter studs
> >to solve the problem. I checked Aircraft Spruce and didn't see any studs
> >listed. Is there some sort of spec. for this stud (i.e. 125000 or 160000
> >psi ) that I can use to locate something locally or do I need to contact
> >Hartsel? Oh by the way it's a 0-320 with a Hartsel C/S.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Weasel Graber
> >-4 wanting to start engine!!!
> >Brooksville MS
> >
> >
> >
>
>
RV-6A, #20701 .. fitting out firewall...
77 Tiger N28478 at 57AZ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
I'm actually curious more about how the hinges rivet to the wing. On the
RV-7 the wingtip tucks inside the wing skin, so there wouldn't be much room
for hinges.
On yours did you chop off the wingtip flange so it butts up against the wing
skin edge, and then you've got half the hinge on the wing skin, half the
hinge on the wingtip? Something like that?
Just curious how you've made it work...photos would be great, too.
Thanks,
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <Fiveonepw(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Wingtips
>
> In a message dated 12/19/03 7:34:06 PM Central Standard Time,
> Leesafur(at)aol.com writes:
>
> > Hay that's a good idea but how do you fasten the hinge pin?
> >
>
> The will clip to the inside of the rib that installs in the rear of the
tip.
> There is about a one inch offset from the pin line and the surface of the
> rib. Haven't done it yet, but the plan is to install a platenut in the
outboard
> side of the rib, about 3" from the rear, then make a little nylon block
with a
> couple of holes drilled through it fore/aft for the pins, and one through
the
> block for a #8 screw into the platenut.
>
> Best wishes and happy holidaze from The PossumWorks
> Mark - plumbing the depths of the cockpit...........
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Oldsfolks(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re:Cork or not to Cork? |
The pro-seal will grow off your hands in a month or two !
Bob Olds A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
RV-4 , N1191X , Flying Now
Charleston, Arkansas
"Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers"
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fiveonepw(at)aol.com |
In a message dated 12/20/03 10:02:22 AM Central Standard Time,
dan(at)rvproject.com writes:
> I'm actually curious more about how the hinges rivet to the wing. On the
> RV-7 the wingtip tucks inside the wing skin, so there wouldn't be much room
> for hinges.
>
> On yours did you chop off the wingtip flange so it butts up against the wing
> skin edge, and then you've got half the hinge on the wing skin, half the
> hinge on the wingtip? Something like that?
>
> Just curious how you've made it work...photos would be great, too.
>
Hi Dan-
The hinge attaches to the wing skin with a strip of .040 spacer to offset the
thickness of the glass. It's the same size hinge as used on the cowling and
just fits the skin extension with the eyes sticking out past the edge. (I'm
assuming the -7 has the 1/2" extra skin past the outer rib? I got one of them
obsolete -6A's) Yes, the flange on the tips is removed except for the front 5"
on the top and about 3" on the bottom. This sits inside the wing skin and
holds the front in position and the majority of the hinge is fairly straight
for easy removal/insertion.
A couple of other notes: Install the hinge to the wing first, install the
outer half of the hinge with holes pre-drilled for the rivets, insert a foam
airfoil rib to hold the tips shape, duct-tape the tip firmly in position, then
drill through the glass and the holes in the hinge, doin' the cleko thing as you
go. You have to have a light inside the wingtip to do this- I have small
access panels in the bottom of my wing in the last bay that I could insert the
light with, but I would imagine you could rig a light attached to a rod that
extends through a hole drilled in the front of the tip (easy repair) to
manipulate a light- (any RV builder can do this- you installed a canopy, right?!)
I
also sanded most of the gel coat off the tip along the hinge line to allow more
light to shine through the holes. I've got a so-so fo-to I'll send ya...
I also drilled 1/4" holes in the hinges between the rivet holes for "flox
rivets" - (probably overkill), and installed the rear 2/3 of the foam rib with
fiberglass about 2" outboard of the hinges to help hold the shape of the tip-
I'd probably do this regardless of how you stick 'em on. I spent more time
trying to massage the damn warps out of the tips than installing the hinges
anyway!!
I can't say if this was more trouble than screws as I've never done one that
way, but I do like the way it looks and the easy access to strobes, Navaid
servo, wire conduit, antennas etc.- another advantage to removable tips is access
for removing aileron pushtubes if necessary... I remember a story on the
list years ago about a builder who rivetted on the tips, then installed the wings
only to see the pushtubes leaning against the workbench- uh-oh!!!
I just bolted on my wings, so I know what he went through, but I also now
know there is ONE advantage to a taildragger! But ONLY one!! 8
)
Have fun & good luck- good work on the diary!
Mark
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DAVID DAVENPORT" <ddavenport5(at)nc.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
How are you guys jacking up RV-6 gear legs for wheel maintenance when you've done
the gear stiffening modification. I've seen the attachment that can go onto
the gear leg that Van's sells, but the u-bolt in that arrangement would seem
to crush the wood in the stiffener. Any flashes of brilliance would be appreciated.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: RV-List Prop Bolts |
| From: | smoothweasel(at)juno.com |
I think I am being misinterpreted......I am talking about the studs that
hold the prop on. Not the alignment bushings.
thanx weasel
>
> Hey Girls(or Guys),
>I was in the process of installing my prop tonight and it seems that the
>set of studs that i have here with the motor are about 1/8" to long.
They
>protrude through the prop flange and hit the hub housing before the
>flange tightens on the flywheel assembly.
>
Something is definitely amiss. The prop flange bushings do come in
different lengths depending on their use (FP Vs. CS), but unless the
engine has been converted, it shouldn't matter. One bushing is a little
larger dia than the others, and that's what indexes the flywheel to the
crank. You may not have the flywheel indexed correctly. Take out #1
plug and rotate crank to the compression stroke and place the piston at
TDC (Top Dead Center). Now fit the flywheel up on the crank with the 0
at the top. The 0 on the backside of the flywheel should align itself
with the case parting line. and should fit flush with the flange. Metal
props are counterbored to take the extended length of the bushings, if
there are any. I'm not sure of wood props are counterbored or not. The
other way to get around changing the bushings (they ain't cheap) would
be to get a prop spacer and add it to the stack. Problem is, that'll
push the prop forward and you'll have a larger gap between spinner and
cowl. Nothing's simple, is it???? Good luck.
Linn
> So guess I need shorter studs
>to solve the problem. I checked Aircraft Spruce and didn't see any
studs
>listed. Is there some sort of spec. for this stud (i.e. 125000 or 160000
>psi ) that I can use to locate something locally or do I need to contact
>Hartsel? Oh by the way it's a 0-320 with a Hartsel C/S.
>
>
>
>
>Weasel Graber
>-4 wanting to start engine!!!
>Brooksville MS
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Evan and Megan Johnson" <evmeg(at)snowcrest.net> |
| Subject: | Re:Cork or not to Cork? |
rub some baby oil into your hands....it helps a bunch....trust me.
Evan
----- Original Message -----
From: <Oldsfolks(at)aol.com>
Subject: RV-List: Re:Cork or not to Cork?
>
> The pro-seal will grow off your hands in a month or two !
>
>
> Bob Olds A&P , EAA Tech. Counselor
> RV-4 , N1191X , Flying Now
> Charleston, Arkansas
> "Real Aviators Fly Taildraggers"
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
Go for the Avery jack kit. No doubt!!!
It's incredibly simple, very safe, and it doesn't require any sort of
clamping. It jacks the plane up from the wheel, where balance is not as big
of an issue.
http://www.averytools.com/showoneitem.cfm?primarykey=618&cat=0&kit=0
For 35 bucks you can't go wrong. It only takes a few hours to modify the
axle nut and then you're done.
If you want photos showing the jack stand and axle nut modification, here
they are:
http://www.rvproject.com/20030411.html (scroll halfway down the page and
you can't miss it)
Best of luck,
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "DAVID DAVENPORT" <ddavenport5(at)nc.rr.com>
Subject: RV-List: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce.
>
> How are you guys jacking up RV-6 gear legs for wheel maintenance when
you've done the gear stiffening modification. I've seen the attachment that
can go onto the gear leg that Van's sells, but the u-bolt in that
arrangement would seem to crush the wood in the stiffener. Any flashes of
brilliance would be appreciated.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Gary Zilik <zilik(at)direcpc.com> |
| Subject: | Propeller Performance |
Netscape/7.1 (ax)
Listers.
A couple of weeks ago the hot topic on the list was about how the
hartzell sweet spot is around 2600 rpm. I have flown umpteen times since
then and the air has been too rough for any flight tests. Well this
morning it was smooth. I now post some results.
DA = 8205' MSL (I blew my calculations)
OAT 63 Deg F
RPM MAP IAS TAS
2600 24.0 188 207
2500 24.0 185 203
Two runs for each and averaged. Manifold and RPM are from mechanical
gauges. For some reason she just would not spin up to 2700 this morning.
Later this afternoon after it was good and hot I could get 2650 but no
more. I need to adjust the governor.
I plan on doing more when I get the chance.
Happy holidays to all
Gary Zilik
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net> |
| Subject: | Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
> How are you guys jacking up RV-6 gear legs for wheel
> maintenance when you've done the gear stiffening
> modification. I've seen the attachment that can go onto the
> gear leg that Van's sells, but the u-bolt in that arrangement
> would seem to crush the wood in the stiffener. Any flashes of
> brilliance would be appreciated.
>
There are certainly many ways, but I use an inexpensive little floor
jack supported on a few concrete blocks to lift the desired wing. I
screw in a cast iron eye bolt into the tie down, and jack against that.
I orient the floor jack laterally so that as I lift, the wheels of the
floor jack allow it to move laterally. It seems that a couple 12"
concrete blocks and some strips of plywood do the trick.
BTW, this also allows for periodic removal of the gear leg for
inspection. After about 350 hours and two years I did just this, and
found that most of the grease I had put in at installation had
disappeared, with some galled areas.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 424 hours
www.usfamily.net/web/alexpeterson
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
| From: | "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart(at)iss.net> |
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Fw: Thank you from Jon Johanson |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jon Johanson" <jonj(at)senet.com.au>
Subject: Thank you from Jon Johanson
> Hi,
> There are so many people I want to say thanks to. I hope the attached will
> help to do that and to provide some interesting facts.
>
> Please feel free to forward the attached letter to anyone you think may be
> interested.
>
> Season's greetings and regards,
>
>
> Jon Johanson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "DAVID REEL" <dreel(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
Perhaps I'm missing something. How can you get a wheel off to change a tire or
grease a bearing when jack and jack point are inserted in the axle from outside
the wheel? Please enlighten.
Dave Reel - RV8A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kyle Boatright" <kyle.boatright(at)adelphia.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
I wondered that myself once upon a time. Anyway, here's how you do it...
1) Jack up the wheel using the jack fixture that inserts into the axle.
2) Slide the wheel outboard.
3) Put a wood block under the axle so the axle rests on it when you lower
the jack. This block must be tall enough to prevent the wheel from touching
the ground.
4) Lower the jack and remove the jack fixture.
5) Pull the wheel off.
6) Reverse the procedure to remount the wheel.
KB
----- Original Message -----
From: "DAVID REEL" <dreel(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce.
>
> Perhaps I'm missing something. How can you get a wheel off to change a
tire or grease a bearing when jack and jack point are inserted in the axle
from outside the wheel? Please enlighten.
>
> Dave Reel - RV8A
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "John" <n1cxo320(at)salidaco.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
A word of caution about using the tie down point and a jack to raise the
wing to remove the wheels. I have done this using a bolt welded onto a pipe
cap that fit over the head of a bottle jack...prevents any chance of
slipping...BUT there seems to be some pressures on the fuel tank, because
after doing this I found a small fuel leak that was not present before using
the tie-down point to jack up the wing...might just have been a coincidence,
but I bought the axle jack and feel better about using it....removing fuel
tanks and fixing leaks is not as much fun as you might expect.
John
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Dan Checkoway" <dan(at)rvproject.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
- jack it up
- loosen axle nut
- slide wheel over on the shaft
- lower jack, lowering axle onto blocks
- pull jack stand out of axle
- wheel is free
)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "DAVID REEL" <dreel(at)cox.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce.
>
> Perhaps I'm missing something. How can you get a wheel off to change a
tire or grease a bearing when jack and jack point are inserted in the axle
from outside the wheel? Please enlighten.
>
> Dave Reel - RV8A
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Eustace Bowhay" <ebowhay(at)jetstream.net> |
| Subject: | Jon Johanson's Thank you Letter |
The following is a attachment that was part of Jon's thank you letter. I tried
to forward it to the list but realize this didn't work so will send it as a post
by myself. It is long but I think it is something that all RVer's would be
interested in.
Eustace Bowhay
Dear friends:
Since returning to Adelaide last Tuesday afternoon I haven't had time to think,
let alone work out what day it is. I am only just becoming aware of the tremendous
amount of help that so many offered to the "mission control" team in Adelaide
over the past eleven days - A mission control like no other, as so many
people around the world have discovered.
Thank you does not seem to cover my gratitude adequately, still all I can say is
thank you, thank you, thank you.
What an amazing couple of weeks it has been. On the 17th of December the 100th
anniversary of the first powered flight - achieved by a couple of home builders
in their experimental aircraft, the Wright Flyer. On the 8th of December, almost
100 years later, it was another home built, experimental aircraft that was
flown solo over the South Pole. RV-4TE VH-NOJ, the first aircraft to be flown
solo to the South Pole. It is all a bit hard to believe.
Despite the years of planning and knowing that we could do this safely, it has
happened quickly enough for me to be tempted to feel that it is all a dream.
Over the eleven days we were away, VH-NOJ carried me 8,282 nautical miles (15,338
km) in 61 hours and 15 minutes at an average speed of 135 knots (250 kph).
The years of planning to conquer the South Pole safely have paid off with even
the bureaucrats getting their moment in the sun. In time the bureaucracy will
be forgotten, as it should be, and only the achievement will be remembered.
Something that should never be forgotten though, is the generosity of one adventurous
spirit to another - Polly Vacher and her team's selfless generosity in
allowing me to use some of the fuel to safely complete my polar flight. How disappointing
it must have been for Polly not to be able to reach her goal, but
how typical of a team who have dedicated their time to helping disabled people
gain their ultimate freedom through FLYING SCHOLARSHIPS FOR THE DISABLED ww.reachforthesky(at)btinternet.com
May I again say thank you to everyone and wish you season's greetings and a happy
prosperous new year.
Kind Regards
Jon Johanson
An ordinary Australian doing extraordinary things.
Pilot: Jon Johanson
License: Australian Air Transport License (ATPL) with command multi engine instrument
rating (CIR).
Total flying experience: 5.890 hrs.
Total time on type (RV 4) 3,242 hrs.
Previous Polar experience: Northern Canada flight in company with Eustace Bowhay
who has a life time of arctic experience, Yellowknife to the Northern Canadian
coast, 1998. Trans -Polar flight, CYZF (Yellowknife) - CYEU (Eureka) - ENSB
(Longyear, Spitsbergen) 2000.
Aircraft: RV 4TE VH-NOJ
Engine: AERO SPORT POWER (I0-360 M1B6) 180 HP. Turbo normalized, 5.8 litre four
cylinder horizontally opposed, air cooled with programmable ignition.
Fuel: Avgas/Mogas
Fuel burn: Average 30 litres per hour, (Uses 10 litres per 100km, slightly better
than a V6 Toyota Camry).
Speed: Average 162kts (300 kph)
Range: Still air average - 5,832 nm (10,800km)
Endurance: Average - 36 hours non stop.
Safety Equipment:
EMERGENCY CHEST PACK
Singe place life raft
Life Jacket
406 satellite/GPS emergency locator beacon
121.5/243 emergency locator beacon
Emergency flares
Desalination unit
Emergency rations (7 days)
Water
Sun Block
Signaling mirror
Anti emetic medicine
General first aid equipment
Safety Knife
POLAR SURVIVAL PACK
Polar, down sleeping bag
Space blanket
Thermal protection mattress
Polar bivvy (sleeping bag tent)
Backpackers pillow
Electrically heated jacket, pants, socks and gloves
Freezer over-suit
Thermal underwear
Nomex fire resistant flying suit
Leather extreme weather hiking boots
Sponsors:
Aero Sport Power - Engine building
Air BP/Castrol - Fuel and oil
Andair - Quality fuel selectors etc.
Aviaquip - Aircraft part supplies
Bennet Built - Carbon fiber wheel spats
Custom Aero - Custom aircraft rebuild, engine/turbo fit and tune
Dayton Signs - Sign writing
Fairydown - Discount polar survival equipment
Garmin - GPS technology
Good Year - Aircraft tyres
JPinstruments - Engine monitoring instruments
Lightspeed Engineering - electronic ignition
Micro Aerodynamics Inc. - Vortex generators
MT Propeller - Custom built, three blade constant speed propeller
QBE Aviation - Insurance
Riverina Airmotive- Engine tuning and consultancy
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ross Mickey" <rmickey(at)ix.netcom.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Flying with Bob Archer Com Antennas? |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Laird Owens" <owens(at)aerovironment.com>
> Ross,
> It sounds like your confusing the VOR antenna I have and the COM
> antenna. I've heard the COM antenna doesn't work well in the
> wingtip, but I've also 2 local friends that like theirs.
> Laird
You are right. I have the Com antenna and find it very weak compared to my
belly mounted standard com antenna. Since my Apollo GX 60 GPS/COM has a
monitoring function, I am only using the Nav/Com as a backup and will
probably leave it as is. If there are folks who are satisfied with tier Com
wingtip installations, I would like to know how they installed them.
Ross Mickey
N9PT
20 hours....almost there
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Garry Legare <versadek(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
Dave,
I hate to even mention this, but hey I've got a really good delete key,
so hear goes. What I've done many times is crouch under the wing with my
shoulder blades against the wing spar and just lift it up. I have a
piece of foam between my back and the underside of the wing. I have the
axle nut loose, the brake caliper apart. and a appropriate sized block
of wood or auto jack stand ready to put in place. An assistant just
undoes the axle nut the rest of the way, slides the wheel assembly off
and sets the stand under the axle.
Of coarse all the caveats about hurting your back etc. do apply. Also
it's a lot easier if you have no fuel in the tanks.
If you use both the jacking/ tie down point on a tail dragger at the
same time they will fall on their nose.
Casper
Have a great holiday season.
DAVID DAVENPORT wrote:
>
>How are you guys jacking up RV-6 gear legs for wheel maintenance when you've done
the gear stiffening modification. I've seen the attachment that can go onto
the gear leg that Van's sells, but the u-bolt in that arrangement would seem
to crush the wood in the stiffener. Any flashes of brilliance would be appreciated.
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Point <jpoint(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Rod end bearing length |
While doing the final fit of my elevators and pushrods, I found that the
rear pushrod is a bit too short, maybe 3/16 inch. Each rod end bearing
has about 3/16 inch less than the required 1/2 of the threads screwed
in. It occured to me that by using more than one jamb nut (essentially
double-nutting the jamb nuts) I could reduce the length of exposed
thread so that the bearings could not back out at either end. Is this
acceptable practice?
Jeff Point
RV-6 at airport, final assembly
Milwaukee WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Richard E. Tasker" <retasker(at)optonline.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
You should ask Vans, but my I believe that it is not the fact that the
thread is "exposed" but the fact there is not enough thread length that
is screwed into the end fitting. Adding jam nuts will not affect that.
For example, if we carried your solution to the extreme we could end up
with only one thread in the fitting and the rest "covered" by jam nuts -
not likely very airworthy :-) !
just my $0.02
Dick Tasker, RV9A 90573
Jeff Point wrote:
>
>While doing the final fit of my elevators and pushrods, I found that the
>rear pushrod is a bit too short, maybe 3/16 inch. Each rod end bearing
>has about 3/16 inch less than the required 1/2 of the threads screwed
>in. It occured to me that by using more than one jamb nut (essentially
>double-nutting the jamb nuts) I could reduce the length of exposed
>thread so that the bearings could not back out at either end. Is this
>acceptable practice?
>
>Jeff Point
>RV-6 at airport, final assembly
>Milwaukee WI
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
Or, just attach a screw clamp to the gear leg just below the fairing and
use any floor or scissors jack. The clamp can be turned and left on the
gear leg.
If you use a "jack fixture" then you'll have to cart it around with you
unless you have some other way of jacking the airplane.
Dave -6, So Cal
Kyle Boatright wrote:
>
>I wondered that myself once upon a time. Anyway, here's how you do it...
>
>1) Jack up the wheel using the jack fixture that inserts into the axle.
>
>2) Slide the wheel outboard.
>
>3) Put a wood block under the axle so the axle rests on it when you lower
>the jack. This block must be tall enough to prevent the wheel from touching
>the ground.
>
>4) Lower the jack and remove the jack fixture.
>
>5) Pull the wheel off.
>
>6) Reverse the procedure to remount the wheel.
>
>KB
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "DAVID REEL" <dreel(at)cox.net>
>To: "rvlist"
>Subject: Re: RV-List: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce.
>
>
>
>
>>
>>Perhaps I'm missing something. How can you get a wheel off to change a
>>
>>
>tire or grease a bearing when jack and jack point are inserted in the axle
>from outside the wheel? Please enlighten.
>
>
>>Dave Reel - RV8A
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
Jeff Point wrote:
>
> While doing the final fit of my elevators and pushrods, I found that the
> rear pushrod is a bit too short, maybe 3/16 inch. Each rod end bearing
> has about 3/16 inch less than the required 1/2 of the threads screwed
> in. It occured to me that by using more than one jamb nut (essentially
> double-nutting the jamb nuts) I could reduce the length of exposed
> thread so that the bearings could not back out at either end. Is this
> acceptable practice?
>
> Jeff Point
> RV-6 at airport, final assembly
> Milwaukee WI
>
Jeff, using an additional nut should work fine as long as you are
satisfied that enough thread is engaged in the pushrod to insure safety.
I have also seen spacers installed between the nut and bearing to
prevent the rod from rotating and "unscrewing" one of the bearings. Your
suggestion accomplishes the same objective.
Sam Buchanan
http://thervjournal.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Mickey & Paula" <mimartin(at)sweetwaterhsa.com> |
| Subject: | Camloc Fasteners RV6 |
Is there any dis-advantage to using the camloc fasteners for the cowling rather
than the hinges used in the plans?
It looks like the hinge pins would be a nuisance.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Alex Peterson" <alexpeterson(at)usjet.net> |
| Subject: | Rod end bearing length |
> > While doing the final fit of my elevators and pushrods, I
> found that
> > the
> > rear pushrod is a bit too short, maybe 3/16 inch. Each rod
> end bearing
> > has about 3/16 inch less than the required 1/2 of the
> threads screwed
> > in. It occured to me that by using more than one jamb nut
> (essentially
> > double-nutting the jamb nuts) I could reduce the length of exposed
> > thread so that the bearings could not back out at either
> end. Is this
> > acceptable practice?
> >
> > Jeff Point
> > RV-6 at airport, final assembly
> > Milwaukee WI
> >
>
> Jeff, using an additional nut should work fine as long as you are
> satisfied that enough thread is engaged in the pushrod to
> insure safety.
> I have also seen spacers installed between the nut and bearing to
> prevent the rod from rotating and "unscrewing" one of the
> bearings. Your
> suggestion accomplishes the same objective.
>
> Sam Buchanan
> http://thervjournal.com
I would agree, but an additional requirement is that enough threads are
captured EVEN if the whole thing rotates all the way towards one end.
If there is any doubt, buy a new tube and rebuild the thing. Otherwise,
you will lie awake wondering about it, as you should.
Alex Peterson
Maple Grove, MN
RV6-A N66AP 424 hours
www.usfamily.net/web/alexpeterson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Paul Besing" <azpilot(at)extremezone.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Camloc Fasteners RV6 |
The hinges are a nuisance for some people. I had problems, and used Skybolt
fasteners along the top and bottom. I kept the hinges on the sides, which
seemed to provide a better grip along the sides.
Paul Besing
RV-6A Sold (RV-10 Soon)
http://www.lacodeworks.com/besing
Kitlog Builder's Log Software
http://www.kitlog.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mickey & Paula" <mimartin(at)sweetwaterhsa.com>
Subject: RV-List: Camloc Fasteners RV6
>
> Is there any dis-advantage to using the camloc fasteners for the cowling
rather than the hinges used in the plans?
> It looks like the hinge pins would be a nuisance.
>
>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mickey & Paula" <mimartin(at)sweetwaterhsa.com>
Subject: RV-List: Camloc Fasteners RV6
>
> Is there any dis-advantage to using the camloc fasteners for the cowling
rather than the hinges used in the plans?
> It looks like the hinge pins would be a nuisance.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
Jeff,
I'd be concerned about WHY it's too short - something is amiss
somewhere. Have you checked the front pushrod to see if it's adjusted
too short? Or is the rear tube actually cut too short? I'd want to
correct the cause of the problem, not just fix the symptom.
Dave Bristol -6 So Cal,
EAA Technical counselor
Jeff Point wrote:
>
>While doing the final fit of my elevators and pushrods, I found that the
>rear pushrod is a bit too short, maybe 3/16 inch. Each rod end bearing
>has about 3/16 inch less than the required 1/2 of the threads screwed
>in. It occured to me that by using more than one jamb nut (essentially
>double-nutting the jamb nuts) I could reduce the length of exposed
>thread so that the bearings could not back out at either end. Is this
>acceptable practice?
>
>Jeff Point
>RV-6 at airport, final assembly
>Milwaukee WI
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
Alex Peterson wrote:
>
>
>>>While doing the final fit of my elevators and pushrods, I
>>
>>found that
>>
>>>the
>>>rear pushrod is a bit too short, maybe 3/16 inch. Each rod
>>
>>end bearing
>>
>>>has about 3/16 inch less than the required 1/2 of the
>>
>>threads screwed
>>
>>>in. It occured to me that by using more than one jamb nut
>>
>>(essentially
>>
>>>double-nutting the jamb nuts) I could reduce the length of exposed
>>>thread so that the bearings could not back out at either
>>
>>end. Is this
>>
>>>acceptable practice?
>>>
>>>Jeff Point
>>>RV-6 at airport, final assembly
>>>Milwaukee WI
>>>
>>
>>Jeff, using an additional nut should work fine as long as you are
>>satisfied that enough thread is engaged in the pushrod to
>>insure safety.
>>I have also seen spacers installed between the nut and bearing to
>>prevent the rod from rotating and "unscrewing" one of the
>>bearings. Your
>>suggestion accomplishes the same objective.
>>
>>Sam Buchanan
>>http://thervjournal.com
>
>
> I would agree, but an additional requirement is that enough threads are
> captured EVEN if the whole thing rotates all the way towards one end.
> If there is any doubt, buy a new tube and rebuild the thing. Otherwise,
> you will lie awake wondering about it, as you should.
>
> Alex Peterson
> Maple Grove, MN
> RV6-A N66AP 424 hours
> www.usfamily.net/web/alexpeterson
I am assisting the builders of a Pitts S-1 as their EAA Tech Counselor.
We discussed the remote possibility of having an aileron pushrod rotate
enough to disconnect a rod end bearing if the bearings aren't installed
properly; one idea we pursued (even after insuring adequate threads were
inside the pushrod) was to put a length of rubber hose on the rod end
bearings to prevent a bearing from unscrewing more than a turn or so
even if the lock nut was completely loose. After studying this setup, I
think it will be included in all rod end bearing installations I make
from now on.
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
>... one idea we pursued (even after insuring adequate threads were
>inside the pushrod) was to put a length of rubber hose on the rod end
>bearings to prevent a bearing from unscrewing more than a turn or so
>even if the lock nut was completely loose. ...
Hi Sam,
I'm having a bit of trouble understanding how this would
work. Perhaps my morning cup of caffeine has not yet gotten
into the bloodstream. Do you have any pictures of this you
can point me to?
Thanks,
Mickey
--
Mickey Coggins
GSM: +41-79-210-3762
FAX: +41-86-079-210-3762
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007
Empennage complete, waiting for wings to arrive
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Point <jpoint(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Camloc Fasteners RV6 |
The major disadvantage is cost, about $450 from Skybolt. They usually
have a 30% off sale around the major airshows, I bought mine last year
during Sun and Fun (not at the show) and saved a bundle. They make cowl
removal a snap, I highly recommend them.
Jeff Point
Mickey & Paula wrote:
>
>Is there any dis-advantage to using the camloc fasteners for the cowling rather
than the hinges used in the plans?
>It looks like the hinge pins would be a nuisance.
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Point <jpoint(at)mindspring.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
Thanks to all who responded about the rod ends. In the end, I remade
the forward tube by shortening it about 3/4 inch (it was too long, even
with the bearings screwed in all the way) which solved the problem with
the rear pushrod. I tested both by rotating them to both extremes and
the rod ends remain intact.
On a related note, someone mentioned the minimum thread engagement.
What is the minimum thread engagement for a rod end bearing? For
example, the elevator and rudder bearings, where the bearing rotating
out is not an issue. While getting everything ready for final assmebly,
I removed and inspected the bearings. I was surprised to find that some
of them were only engaged into the nutplates about 5 threads (as shown
by the wear marks on the threads.) This is using the proper dimensions
for the elevator/ HS gap. Is this normal?
There sure is a lot to this "final assembly" stuff...
Jeff Point
RV-6 final assembly
Milwaukee, WI
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson(at)consolidated.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
Jeff Point wrote:
>
> Thanks to all who responded about the rod ends. In the end, I remade
> the forward tube by shortening it about 3/4 inch (it was too long, even
> with the bearings screwed in all the way) which solved the problem with
> the rear pushrod. I tested both by rotating them to both extremes and
> the rod ends remain intact.
>
> On a related note, someone mentioned the minimum thread engagement.
> What is the minimum thread engagement for a rod end bearing? For
> example, the elevator and rudder bearings, where the bearing rotating
> out is not an issue. While getting everything ready for final assmebly,
> I removed and inspected the bearings. I was surprised to find that some
> of them were only engaged into the nutplates about 5 threads (as shown
> by the wear marks on the threads.) This is using the proper dimensions
> for the elevator/ HS gap. Is this normal?
>
> There sure is a lot to this "final assembly" stuff...
>
> Jeff Point
> RV-6 final assembly
> Milwaukee, WI
Jeff, a rule of thumb that an aircraft bolt salesman told me a long time ago
was " the grip of the threads should be at least the diameter of the bolt."
He said anything less is not enough thread grip. He said anything more is ok
but the grip becomes less and less with the threads that are farther in. This
is what I have used over the years and it seems to work out OK. I feel that
one Jam nut is sufficient. If I were concerned about the Jam nut coming loose,
I would dab some epoxy on it, after it is TIGHT. Just a small dab where
threads meet the nut.
Phil
Phil
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Fiveonepw(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
In a message dated 12/22/03 12:51:43 AM Central Standard Time,
mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch writes:
> I'm having a bit of trouble understanding how this would
> work. Perhaps my morning cup of caffeine has not yet gotten
> into the bloodstream. Do you have any pictures of this you
> can point me to?
>
My caffeine may have started to work- for the rod to rotate, both jam nuts
must be loose. One bearing MUST screw INTO the rod. If you have the hose
covering all the threads on both ends, it ain't going far before it hits that
rubber cushion. Same for other forms of spacers- pretty slick, Sam-
On a related note: It there any reason NOT to use lock washers on these jam
nuts, such as an internal-tooth washer?
From The PossumWorks
Mark - rigging controls next couple of daze- how timely!! 8
)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
Mickey Coggins wrote:
>
>
>>... one idea we pursued (even after insuring adequate threads were
>>inside the pushrod) was to put a length of rubber hose on the rod end
>>bearings to prevent a bearing from unscrewing more than a turn or so
>>even if the lock nut was completely loose. ...
>
>
> Hi Sam,
>
> I'm having a bit of trouble understanding how this would
> work. Perhaps my morning cup of caffeine has not yet gotten
> into the bloodstream. Do you have any pictures of this you
> can point me to?
>
> Thanks,
> Mickey
>
Mickey, the caffeine is probably fine; the pushrod setup is a little
confusing it you haven't gotten to that point in your project.
The pushrods under consideration are those that have rod end bearings on
both ends. If the locknuts on both bearings loosened, the rod could
rotate even though the bearings are still trapped by the bellcranks. The
bearings have opposing threads; one is right-hand, the other is
left-hand. So, if the rod rotates, one bearing will be screwed into the
rod as the other is being screwed out of the rod. The discussion has
been about how to stop the rotation of the rod before one of the
bearings is screwed all the way out of the rod. There are three ways to
prevent this from happening:
1) Mechanically secure one of the bearings to the pushrod via a cotter
key, safety wire, peening the threads, welding, etc.
2) Be sure enough threads are engaged in the rod so the bearing being
screwed into the rod bottoms out before the opposing bearing can be
screwed completely out of the rod. If at least half of the threads of
each bearing is in the rod when fitted, this will prevent the bearings
from disconnecting from the rod even though there may be minimal threads
engaged if the rod rotates all the way.
3) As a belt and suspenders method, the spacer can be used to prevent
one of the bearings from screwing into the rod which would also prevent
the opposing bearing from detaching from the rod.
Whew! This whole situation is addressed because each bearing has
opposing threads which is often overlooked by builders who haven't
thought through this process. Obviously, if a pushrod is trapped by a
non-rotating fastener on one end, this whole scenario is not possible.
Hope this doesn't require an additional dose of caffeine! :-)
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Canyon <steve.canyon(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
Sam Buchanan wrote:
>This whole situation is addressed because each bearing has
>opposing threads which is often overlooked by builders who haven't
>thought through this process.
---
Sam, I just have to ask -- why use opposing thread pitch
anyway? Wouldn't it be better to just use identical rod ends? I must
be missing something else here...
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Rod end bearing length |
Minor correction - the threads are the same rotation on both ends. When the
rod rotates about the rod ends the length does not change. Turnbuckles
(cables? How quaint!) have right and left hand threads so they can be
shortened or lengthened. The accepted way to protect the turnbuckle from
backing out is with safety wire. Sam doesn't often mis-speak - nice to know
he's human.
Greg
>
>
> Mickey, the caffeine is probably fine; the pushrod setup is a little
> confusing it you haven't gotten to that point in your project.
>
> The pushrods under consideration are those that have rod end
> bearings on
> both ends. If the locknuts on both bearings loosened, the rod could
> rotate even though the bearings are still trapped by the
> bellcranks. The
> bearings have opposing threads; one is right-hand, the other is
> left-hand. So, if the rod rotates, one bearing will be
> screwed into the
> rod as the other is being screwed out of the rod. The discussion has
> been about how to stop the rotation of the rod before one of the
> bearings is screwed all the way out of the rod. There are
> three ways to
> prevent this from happening:
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Shemp" <shempdowling(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Camloc Fasteners RV6 |
I have both on my 6 and if I had to do it all over again, I would
absolutely, positively, without question....... use the cam locks. Im sure
the pins will get a lot easier after some more use but the camlocks are
great. If you dont mind using both, I would suggest using hinge pins to
hold the top and bottom cowls together and camlocks to secure it to the
fuse. Its easy making the backing plates and attaching them to the fuse and
there's plenty of room. Attaching them to the fiberglass takes more work
and there's little room. Besides, the pins holding the halves together are
pretty easy to remove/install.
Good luck
Jeff Dowling
A whole 1.5
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mickey & Paula" <mimartin(at)sweetwaterhsa.com>
Subject: RV-List: Camloc Fasteners RV6
>
> Is there any dis-advantage to using the camloc fasteners for the cowling
rather than the hinges used in the plans?
> It looks like the hinge pins would be a nuisance.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "van Bladeren, Ron" <rwv(at)nwnatural.com> |
I have the 74" blended airfoil prop on my 8A and have 11.5" tip to ground
clearance. I have to taxi on an unimproved dirt/sod taxiway to get to my
runway and have not had any problems so far. Even found grass fragments
stuck in the castering nut but the prop tip was clean. Not sure if the 7A
has a shorter nose strut or not but one thing is sure, the prop tip on both
models will take some hits as time goes on and while the 74" can be cleaned
up and cut back to a 72", the 72" may end up being scrap.
Ron.
-----Original Message-----
From: Randy Lervold [mailto:randy@rv-8.com]
Subject: Re: RV-List: Propellers
Dave,
If maximum performance is what you're after various bits of data I've seen
would indicate the 74" is the choice. It will have a higher tip speed at a
given rpm however and will therefore be a little bit noisier. Of course the
1" greater radius puts you that much closer to gravel etc. also. Because you
have a nosewheel, and because any performance improvement will be very
small, I'd use the 72" with any -A model.
FWIW,
Randy Lervold
www.rv-8.com
>
> There has been some great prop. comparison testing done recently, but
> unfortunately it did not include the new "Blended Airfoil" c.s.
> Hartzell. Van's is now offering this prop. in both 72" and 74" models
> for the 7A. Any thoughts as to what the performance difference would be
> between the two on an O-360? TIA for the info and I hope you all have a
> great and safe holiday.
>
> Dave
> 7A Wiring
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
Greg Young wrote:
>
> Minor correction - the threads are the same rotation on both ends. When the
> rod rotates about the rod ends the length does not change. Turnbuckles
> (cables? How quaint!) have right and left hand threads so they can be
> shortened or lengthened. The accepted way to protect the turnbuckle from
> backing out is with safety wire. Sam doesn't often mis-speak - nice to know
> he's human.
>
> Greg
Thank you Greg! I guess I needed the caffeine shot!!
You are indeed correct; however, my mistake doesn't change the fact that
the rod CAN come apart if it rotates enough to unscrew one of the
bearings. I got the thread thing confused with turnbuckles.
Thanks for the catch. :-)
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Sam Buchanan <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
Canyon wrote:
>
> Sam Buchanan wrote:
>
>>This whole situation is addressed because each bearing has
>>opposing threads which is often overlooked by builders who haven't
>>thought through this process.
>
> ---
> Sam, I just have to ask -- why use opposing thread pitch
> anyway? Wouldn't it be better to just use identical rod ends? I must
> be missing something else here...
>
> Steve
Steve, you are correct; I screwed up by stating the bearings have
opposing threads. What I was trying to say was that as one bearing is
being turned into the rod, the other one will be turning out of the rod.
The control rod can come apart if it rotates far enough to unscrew one
of the bearings from the rod. The rubber hose spacer prevents this from
happening.
Wow...........I need a big cup of coffee........
Sam Buchanan
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Canyon <steve.canyon(at)verizon.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
Sam Buchanan wrote:
>Steve, you are correct; I screwed up by stating the bearings have
>opposing threads. What I was trying to say was that as one bearing is
>being turned into the rod, the other one will be turning out of the rod.
---
Sam,
Hey, no problem -- I'm getting some more coffee myself. Too early
Monday for me to be thrashing my way through details anyway. :-)
Regards,
Steve
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | MAC trim servo malfunction: field report |
Last week I had a failure of my elevator trim servo afer landing at a friend's
airstrip. The servo would not return to takeoff trim from the landing trim position.
Wiggling the wires and closely inspecting the mechanism didn't help,
and it looked like I was facing a brief flight home while holding a lot of forward
stick pressure in cruise. Finally, at the last minute, the buttons seemed
to come alive again and I was able to dial in the correct trim for takeoff.
The trim responded normally for in-cruise adjustments, but seemed to quit working
again as I was setting up final approach trim.
Back in the hangar, I confirmed that the trim module seemed electrically dead and
the tab itself was able to move freely when disconnected from the servo. A
9v battery and clip leads applied directly to the MAC servo did not move the
motor, so the problem had to be in there and not in the ship's wiring or switches.
I pulled the servo from the elevator and immediately saw evidence of mud dauber
wasp activity in the area. There were several mud nests between the servo housing
and the mounting bracket. I opened the servo housing and found just a few
specks of dirt inside, but it was enough to cause the malfunction. As soon
as I cleaned that out, the servo worked normally on the 9v battery. I deduced
that the grit that had entered the housing was interfering with the limit switch
follower that is designed to be activated by the servo rod only at the extremes
of travel. Any friction between these two mating parts will cause premature
activation of the micro-switches and shut down the servo just as if the
travel limit has been reached. Dirt particles cause the slide to be carried along
by the servo rod and can produce erratic behavior in the limit switch mechanism.
The final nagging question was how the wasp's dirt could have gotten inside such
a well-designed and sealed unit. It turns out there is an Achilles heel: the
square-section, gear-driven plastic rod that attaches to the clevis has a groove
in the outer part of its length, and the wasp had filled that with mud, too.
When the rod is half in and half out of the servo housing, the channel or
longitudinal groove in the rod allows access to the inside of the housing. When
the rod is fully extended or retracted, the rod fully fills the square hole
in the housing and the unit remains impenetrable.
These little wasp critters are quite resourceful! I hope the silicone sealant
I have placed in this groove will prevent a return of the problem, as there is
no way to escape the onslaught of these insects in the summer months, and they
work very quickly. Listers might want to check your MAC trim servo installations
for existing damage and then fill this groove with some kind of sealant.
Just be sure whatever you use won't mechaniclaly bind the servo if it should
come loose.
-Bill Boyd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | SportAV8R(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | propeller indexing and engine smoothness |
Over the weekend I had to pull the cowl and prop to make repairs on a broken aluminum
alternator tension arm, and thought while I had the prop off anyway I would
try a suggestion I had read about in the Sky Ranch Engineering Manual. It
says that a flat four engine will run more smoothly if the prop is indexed to
be in the same plane as the crank pins, meaning it is horizontal when the pistons
are at top or bottom dead center. This orientation is 60 degrees away from
the indexing that is traditional for Lycomings, which is a concession to ease
of hand-propping.
Well, I tried it and it works. The difference in smoothness was noticable from
very first startup, and the engine is (subjectively) smoother at all rpm ranges.
The prop now stops at about 1 o'clock position viewed from the front, as
opposed to the traditional 10 o'clock position. The compression stroke is felt
much lower down in the swing, making it indeed very awkward and dangerous to
hand prop as you have to bend way over to pull it through. But since I never
hand prop my plane, I consider it worth the trade off. I'm going to take a wild
guess and say the vibration level is about half what it was before. I find
myself now wondering if the dynamic balance I was considering before would even
be worth the cost and effort. Now, if only we could solve the exhaust pulse
floor vibration as easily ;-)
-Bill Boyd
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com> |
| Subject: | Camloc Fasteners RV6 |
The only downside is the cost, but I think it's well worth it. I have one
of each, my first RV6 has the pins, the 2nd has the Skybolt fasteners.
Several huge advantages to me.
#1) They were quicker and easier to install.
#2) You can get the cowling off in a matter of seconds with no cussing,
scraped or burnt hands, etc..
#3) I think they look good. I was nervous about how they would look
compared to my pin installation, but it looks quite nice.
Anyway, if you can afford it, I would at least use them for the top and
bottoms of the cowl. Sides are optional, but I like having them all the way
around.
Just my 2 cents!
Cheers,
Stein Bruch
RV6's, Minneapolis.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mickey & Paula
Subject: RV-List: Camloc Fasteners RV6
Is there any dis-advantage to using the camloc fasteners for the cowling
rather than the hinges used in the plans?
It looks like the hinge pins would be a nuisance.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Sam Mourning" <sammourning(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | For Sale RV-9A Tail, Wings, Fuse, Engine, Tools, Extras |
For Sale: RV-9A Tail (finished), Wings (finished) Fuse (nearing quickbuild
stage), Tool set (including pneumatic squeezer and 3 yokes), Engine
O-320-H2AD (first run), and extras. $21,000. Would prefer not to separate.
Details at http://www.vondane.com/forsale/rv9a/
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jim Oke <wjoke(at)shaw.ca> |
| Subject: | Re: Rod end bearing length |
I suggest there are two issues of concern here:
1) that the pushrod should not be allowed to rotate sufficiently that one
end actually comes loose (yes, that's a no-brainer !);
2) that enough threads stay engaged at both rodend bearings to withstand the
max push/pull force that is expected, (a bit more complicated to analyse).
IOW, a couple of threads only may not be enough to carry the loads and cause
a failure which would have the same effect as one end coming completely
unscrewed.
The rubber tubing idea would help both situations if the starting config was
OK and the length of the tube was selected properly keeping in mind that
this is a belt and suspenders add-on to the jam nuts with/or without
locktite.
Jim Oke
RV-3, RV-6A
Winnipeg, MB
----- Original Message -----
From: "Sam Buchanan" <sbuc(at)hiwaay.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Rod end bearing length
>
> Canyon wrote:
>
> >
> > Sam Buchanan wrote:
> >
> >>This whole situation is addressed because each bearing has
> >>opposing threads which is often overlooked by builders who haven't
> >>thought through this process.
> >
> > ---
> > Sam, I just have to ask -- why use opposing thread pitch
> > anyway? Wouldn't it be better to just use identical rod ends? I must
> > be missing something else here...
> >
> > Steve
>
>
> Steve, you are correct; I screwed up by stating the bearings have
> opposing threads. What I was trying to say was that as one bearing is
> being turned into the rod, the other one will be turning out of the rod.
>
> The control rod can come apart if it rotates far enough to unscrew one
> of the bearings from the rod. The rubber hose spacer prevents this from
> happening.
>
> Wow...........I need a big cup of coffee........
>
> Sam Buchanan
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Rick Galati <rick6a(at)yahoo.com> |
| Subject: | Re:Camloc Fasteners RV6 |
Subject:
Camloc Fasteners RV6
From:
Mickey & Paula (mimartin(at)sweetwaterhsa.com)
Date:
Sun Dec 21 - 5:04 PM
Is there any dis-advantage to using the camloc fasteners
for the cowling rather than the hinges used in the plans?
It looks like the hinge pins would be a nuisance.
Mick,
Cost may be among the considerations here. Camloc kits can get relatively
expensive. You do have a couple of options though. As an inexpensive
alternative, I installed the hinges per plans except where the (curved) upper
cowl ties into the firewall flange. I fabricated a .050 strap similar in concept
to
what you would fab up if installing camloc receptacles but instead, installed a
total of 24 #8 floating nutplates around the perimeter using tooling (a nutplate
jig)
to assure quality and repeatability.
See http://www.eaa32.org/MembersProjects/Galati/galati.htm to see the strap.
The upper cowl is attached with #8 SS screws and stainless Tinnerman
washers. This arrangement has worked very well on my spam can and countless
other airplanes out there and in 14 years, I have not had to replace a single
nutplate. Cosmetically, the screws are no better or worse looking than camlocs
for less overall cost. Worn screws are a simple matter to discard and replace.
Admittedly if seconds count, in a head to head race with a camlock fitted cowl,
it will
take you a bit longer to remove using a power screw driver. That said, in a speed
race, both fastening systems would lose out to exceptionally installed hinges.
I'm not
absolutely certain, and I'm sure someone will offer up a dutiful correction if
I'm
wrong, but I *think* the EAA's Young Eagle RV-6As use screws and nutplates to
attach the entire cowl. In the end, you do have a couple of viable options.
Rick Galati RV-6A Finishing
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JDaniel343(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
i WNET TO THE LOCAL STEEL YARD, BOUGHT A 7/8" ROUND STEEL BAR 2FT LONG. PLUGS INTO
THE AXLE WITH ENOUGH ROOM UNDERNEATH TO SLIDE A FLOOR JACK.
jOHN dANIELSON
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | more comfy tools |
Listers,
In the never ending quest to make sheet metal work more pleasant, I bought a
can of "Plasti-dip" at Harbor Freight and coated the handles of my cleco
pliers. Neat stuff! Sometimes just the thought of handling ice cold metal
tools during a wintertime building session is enough to make you want to
stay on the couch.
It took three dips to get a good thickness on the handles. I also bought a
can of the stuff in aerosol can to spray the grip of my air drill and maybe
the rivet gun too. A 14 oz can of the dip is $7, and I found it in red,
yellow, black and clear.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 51
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
John,
That should work great in the shop but how about when you have a problem
in the middle of Oklahoma? That's a lot of extra weight to carry around
in the baggage compartment.
Dave
JDaniel343(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>i WNET TO THE LOCAL STEEL YARD, BOUGHT A 7/8" ROUND STEEL BAR 2FT LONG. PLUGS
INTO THE AXLE WITH ENOUGH ROOM UNDERNEATH TO SLIDE A FLOOR JACK.
>jOHN dANIELSON
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | JDaniel343(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
I really only use this in the shop, but I don't think it weighs any more than the
thing Avery sells.
John Danielson
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Jewell" <jjewell(at)telus.net> |
| Subject: | Re: more comfy tools |
High Brian,
Another option for comfy tools:
Early on in my quest to build my 6A (horizontal stab) I encountered severe
pain in my hand that radiated up my into arm when using the bare handled
cleco pliers. I also noted that the bare handles where cold and tended to
slip out of my grasp. because of the potential for damaging skins etc. I
chose to cut lengths of the glue filled heat shrink and apply them to the
cleco plier handles.
After doing this I noticed the pains went away, the pliers where warmer to
the hand and they stayed in hand better reducing the likelihood of dropped
tool damage a bit.
I had a screwdriver that seemed to hit the same nerve and the heat shrink
improved that situation as well.
The best of the season to all!,
Jim in Kelowna
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RV-List: more comfy tools
>
> Listers,
>
> In the never ending quest to make sheet metal work more pleasant, I bought
a
> can of "Plasti-dip" at Harbor Freight and coated the handles of my cleco
> pliers. Neat stuff! Sometimes just the thought of handling ice cold
metal
> tools during a wintertime building session is enough to make you want to
> stay on the couch.
>
> It took three dips to get a good thickness on the handles. I also bought
a
> can of the stuff in aerosol can to spray the grip of my air drill and
maybe
> the rivet gun too. A 14 oz can of the dip is $7, and I found it in red,
> yellow, black and clear.
>
> Brian Denk
> RV8 N94BD
> RV10 51
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1
(ax)
| Subject: | Re: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce. |
I wasn't knocking your idea John, in fact I agree - why buy something
fancy when something simple will suffice. My point was why carry a
special tool when a clamp that weighs only a couple of ounces, fastened
to the gear leg, will work perfectly with almost any jack, in the shop
or in the middle of Oklahoma.
Dave
JDaniel343(at)aol.com wrote:
>
>I really only use this in the shop, but I don't think it weighs any more than
the thing Avery sells.
>John Danielson
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LeastDrag93066(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Bob Archer, the antenna expert. |
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Hi All,
If any of you have a concern about the installation of your antenna(s),
please give Bob Archer a call. He is very willing to discuss whatever antenna
installation you have, or would like to have.
Bob's phone number is (310) 316-8796.
You may get an answering machine. Just leave your name and number, so he can
call you back.
There are more ways to install an antenna wrong, than there are correct ways.
It's too frustration for me to even think of all the antenna problems friends
of mine have created for themselves over the years.
At least by talking to Bob, you'll have a good chance of creating a good
antenna installation.
Jim Ayers
PS I have more stories about antennas than I have heard about Ivoprop.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net> |
I'm looking for a source for 4-40 plate nuts. These are the same ones that Cleveland
uses in the wingtip attach kit. I have sent them an email to see if I can
just buy the plate nuts. ACS smallest version is 6-32.
Anyone know of another source?
Darwin N. Barrie
Chandler AZ
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | 4-40 plate nuts (disregard) |
ACS hard catalog doesn't have them, the online version does and it finally came
back on line!!
Thanks,
Darwin
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LeastDrag93066(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Bob Archer, the antenna expert. |
Hi All,
If any of you have a concern about the installation of your antenna(s),
please give Bob Archer a call. He is very willing to discuss whatever antenna
installation you have, or would like to have.
Bob's phone number is (310) 316-8796.
You may get an answering machine. Just leave your name and number, so he can
call you back.
There are more ways to install an antenna wrong, than there are correct ways.
It's too frustration for me to even think of all the antenna problems friends
of mine have created for themselves over the years.
At least by talking to Bob, you'll have a good chance of creating a good
antenna installation.
Jim Ayers
PS I have more stories about antennas than I have heard about Ivoprop. :-)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LeastDrag93066(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Bob Archer, the antenna expert. |
Sorry about the multiple postings.
I'm using AOL 9.0.
Sometimes it sends the message and says so.
Sometimes it sends the message, and doesn't say so.
Sometimes it doesn't send the message.
Sometimes it just lock up my computer.
For this message, I had all of the above happen.
Sorry.
Jim Ayers
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Howell <jehowell(at)tampabay.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Riveting wing leading edge ribs...anyone use pop rivets? |
I'm having the expected trouble riveting the leading edge ribs on my
RV-7 wings....the list archives spell out various techniques involving
grinding down offset rivet sets, use of hockey tape, manufacturing
special bucking bars to enable back riveting etc. It occurs to me that
it would be extremely simple to just use pop rivets. Has anyone done
this? Would there be reduced structural integrity? Is there any
reason not to, other than one's sense of aesthetics? Is there a
recommended pop-rivet spec to use?
Thanks,
Jerry
RV-7A
Wings
Tampa, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Kosta Lewis" <mikel(at)dimensional.com> |
>>>I'm looking for a source for 4-40 plate nuts. These are the same ones
that Cleveland uses in the wingtip attach kit.
When you get the screws that attach the wing tips, get twice the number
you think you will need as they are easy to strip out and you'll wind up
needing extra. IMHO.
Michael
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Vanremog(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: 4-40 plate nuts |
In a message dated 12/23/2003 8:29:29 PM Pacific Standard Time,
ktlkrn(at)cox.net writes:
I'm looking for a source for 4-40 plate nuts. These are the same ones that
Cleveland uses in the wingtip attach kit. I have sent them an email to see if I
can just buy the plate nuts.
How many do you need. I have some of the floating type that I would be glad
to send you.
GV (RV-6A flying 675 hrs)
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Bower" <rvbuilder(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | F-631 cabin frame |
I am proceeding very cautiously with the F-631 cabin frame (roll bar) for my
RV-6A tip-up. The plans call out a nominal width measurement and what seems
to be a strict height measurement. My fuselage is slightly wider at the
F-605 bulkhead than normal, but I set up the F-631 width to compensate for
that. To do this, I attached blocks to my work surface that define the
width and height.
The problem is this: As expected, there is a gap at the top center
(shouldn't be a problem), but at the bottom, the inboard corners are about
1/8" higher than the outboard corners, which prevents the F-631 from lying
flat on the structure.
Should I trim this angle so the entire bottom of the F-631 sits flat? If I
do, the overall height measurement will be a little lower than is called
out. Am I worried too much?
Thanks in advance for the help, and I want to wish everybody a Merry
Christmas (or whatever you celebrate this time of year), and a Happy New
Year.
Jim Bower
St. Louis
RV-6A N143DJ
Expand your wine savvy and get some great new recipes at MSN Wine.
http://wine.msn.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Richard Meske <rmeske@gcfn.org> (SquirrelMail authenticated user rmeske) by www.gcfn.org with HTTP; Wed, |
24 Dec 2003 13:26:41.-0500(at)matronics.com (EST)
| Subject: | Re: 4-40 plate nuts |
If you check the Matronics archives, there was a guy that purchased a batch
earlier from Wicks on a special order. Just read it today.
Rich
Aircraft Extras, Inc.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 4-40 plate nuts |
.Thanks
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Meske (SquirrelMail authenticated user rmeske) by
www.gcfn.org with HTTP" <rmeske@gcfn.org>; ; <24 Dec 2003
13:26:41.-0500(at)matronics.com (EST)>
Subject: Re: RV-List: 4-40 plate nuts
>
> If you check the Matronics archives, there was a guy that purchased a
batch
> earlier from Wicks on a special order. Just read it today.
>
> Rich
> Aircraft Extras, Inc.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
| From: | Jeff Peltier <jeffpeltier(at)BRSparachutes.com> |
Hello RV owners,
Due to the very high interest exhibited by Vans owners over the years, we've
currently entered into the design phase regarding the installation of BRS
ballistic emergency parachute systems to Vans RV-6,-7 and -9. We have
purchased a new fuselage for the purpose of static structural pull tests,
and may be interested in acquiring other fuselages or parts for the various
tests required of this effort. We are also open to any questions or
comments that you may have regarding parachute installation on Vans
aircraft. Any input will be appreciated. We would really like to hear from
you.
Jeff Peltier
Design Engineer
BRS INC.
(651)457-7491
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 4-40 plate nuts |
I need almost 80. I think I found them at ACS. They were listed in the
on-line catalog but not the hard copy.
Darwin
----- Original Message -----
From: <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: 4-40 plate nuts
>
> In a message dated 12/23/2003 8:29:29 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> ktlkrn(at)cox.net writes:
> I'm looking for a source for 4-40 plate nuts. These are the same ones that
> Cleveland uses in the wingtip attach kit. I have sent them an email to see
if I
> can just buy the plate nuts.
> How many do you need. I have some of the floating type that I would be
glad
> to send you.
>
>
> GV (RV-6A flying 675 hrs)
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Darwin N. Barrie" <ktlkrn(at)cox.net> |
| Subject: | Re: 4-40 plate nuts |
I have gotten in the habit of "seasoning" all nut plates by using a steel
socket head screw and some Boelube. Seems to loosen them up for easier final
installation.
Darwin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kosta Lewis" <mikel(at)dimensional.com>
Subject: RE: RV-List: 4-40 plate nuts
>
> >>>I'm looking for a source for 4-40 plate nuts. These are the same ones
> that Cleveland uses in the wingtip attach kit.
>
> When you get the screws that attach the wing tips, get twice the number
> you think you will need as they are easy to strip out and you'll wind up
> needing extra. IMHO.
>
> Michael
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
Very few accidents in RVs are such that a ballistic a chute would have
helped. I realize that there were a
couple structure failures that would have MAYBE saved a pilot but over
all you are wasting your time.
IMO!!!
Jerry
Jeff Peltier wrote:
>
>Hello RV owners,
>Due to the very high interest exhibited by Vans owners over the years, we've
>currently entered into the design phase regarding the installation of BRS
>ballistic emergency parachute systems to Vans RV-6,-7 and -9. We have
>purchased a new fuselage for the purpose of static structural pull tests,
>and may be interested in acquiring other fuselages or parts for the various
>tests required of this effort. We are also open to any questions or
>comments that you may have regarding parachute installation on Vans
>aircraft. Any input will be appreciated. We would really like to hear from
>you.
>
>
>Jeff Peltier
>Design Engineer
>BRS INC.
>(651)457-7491
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
Hi Jeff,
Great news. I'll bite.
How about the RV8?
Can this be installed as a retrofit?
Mickey
>Hello RV owners,
>Due to the very high interest exhibited by Vans owners over the years, we've
>currently entered into the design phase regarding the installation of BRS
>ballistic emergency parachute systems to Vans RV-6,-7 and -9. We have
>purchased a new fuselage for the purpose of static structural pull tests,
>and may be interested in acquiring other fuselages or parts for the various
>tests required of this effort. We are also open to any questions or
>comments that you may have regarding parachute installation on Vans
>aircraft. Any input will be appreciated. We would really like to hear from
>you.
>
>
>Jeff Peltier
>Design Engineer
>BRS INC.
>(651)457-7491
--
Mickey Coggins
GSM: +41-79-210-3762
FAX: +41-86-079-210-3762
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007
Empennage complete, waiting for wings to arrive
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ralph E. Capen" <recapen(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
I would think the -10 would give you the best potential for customers - but
I have a friend that would fly in my 6A if I had one of those chutes.....
my .02
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Peltier" <jeffpeltier(at)BRSparachutes.com>
Subject: RV-List: Ballistic parachutes on RVs
>
> Hello RV owners,
> Due to the very high interest exhibited by Vans owners over the years,
we've
> currently entered into the design phase regarding the installation of BRS
> ballistic emergency parachute systems to Vans RV-6,-7 and -9. We have
> purchased a new fuselage for the purpose of static structural pull tests,
> and may be interested in acquiring other fuselages or parts for the
various
> tests required of this effort. We are also open to any questions or
> comments that you may have regarding parachute installation on Vans
> aircraft. Any input will be appreciated. We would really like to hear
from
> you.
>
>
> Jeff Peltier
> Design Engineer
> BRS INC.
> (651)457-7491
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
Jerry,
What about the flights into IMC that we seem
to have too often? Wouldn't a chute work in
that situation, assuming of course the pilot
realized that s/he was in trouble?
Mickey
>Very few accidents in RVs are such that a ballistic a chute would have
>helped. I realize that there were a
>couple structure failures that would have MAYBE saved a pilot but over
>all you are wasting your time.
>IMO!!!
>
>Jerry
--
Mickey Coggins
GSM: +41-79-210-3762
FAX: +41-86-079-210-3762
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007
Empennage complete, waiting for wings to arrive
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "van Bladeren, Ron" <rwv(at)nwnatural.com> |
| Subject: | Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
It would seem reasonable to me to have an agency such as the EAA petition
the FAA to allow aircraft with BRS installed to perform aerobatics WITHOUT
it's occupants having to wear parachutes!!!
Now THAT would be a great deal!
Ron.
-----Original Message-----
From: Mickey Coggins [mailto:mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch]
Subject: Re: RV-List: Ballistic parachutes on RVs
Jerry,
What about the flights into IMC that we seem
to have too often? Wouldn't a chute work in
that situation, assuming of course the pilot
realized that s/he was in trouble?
Mickey
>Very few accidents in RVs are such that a ballistic a chute would have
>helped. I realize that there were a
>couple structure failures that would have MAYBE saved a pilot but over
>all you are wasting your time.
>IMO!!!
>
>Jerry
--
Mickey Coggins
GSM: +41-79-210-3762
FAX: +41-86-079-210-3762
http://www.rv8.ch/
#82007
Empennage complete, waiting for wings to arrive
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dcarter(at)datarecall.net |
| Subject: | Re: F-631 cabin frame |
Jim, does your plans say position the brace 1/4 inch below top center of roll
bar? If so, then Van's has again ignored "free support" from builders who
point out errors in their drawings. If it shows 13/16ths or something on that
order, then they have fixed the error.
I used Intellicad to create a the side view of fuselage in that area and the
roll bar and brace, etc. Sent it to Van's - never a response.
I'm away from home for Christmas until the following Sat, Sun, or Mon so don't
have my exact measurement.
You are on the right track laying out a pattern on the workbench and putting
in physical blocks to hold the width dimension for the two "feet". You need a
line and block at top center, with a line below to show the height "from feet
to top" - which you have to calculate with trig since they don't show that
dimension in the plane of the roll bar.
Mine is finished and fits perfectly on the fuselage.
Give me a call on my cell phone 409-718-8518 or at my son's home 512-266-6955.
David Carter
RV-6 tip-up
Nederland, Texas
>
> I am proceeding very cautiously with the F-631 cabin frame (roll bar) for my
> RV-6A tip-up. The plans call out a nominal width measurement and what seems
> to be a strict height measurement. My fuselage is slightly wider at the
> F-605 bulkhead than normal, but I set up the F-631 width to compensate for
> that. To do this, I attached blocks to my work surface that define the
> width and height.
>
> The problem is this: As expected, there is a gap at the top center
> (shouldn't be a problem), but at the bottom, the inboard corners are about
> 1/8" higher than the outboard corners, which prevents the F-631 from lying
> flat on the structure.
>
> Should I trim this angle so the entire bottom of the F-631 sits flat? If I
> do, the overall height measurement will be a little lower than is called
> out. Am I worried too much?
>
> Thanks in advance for the help, and I want to wish everybody a Merry
> Christmas (or whatever you celebrate this time of year), and a Happy New
> Year.
>
> Jim Bower
> St. Louis
> RV-6A N143DJ
---------------------------------------------
This message was sent using EXP Webmail.
http://www.exp.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Ed Anderson" <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: RV and Ballastic Chute |
> Hi Jeff,
>
> I don't know if the RV crowd is that good a market for the ballistic
> chute. I have a total of 12 minutes glider time in an RV over two
> occasions all resulting in a safe, no-damage touch-down. One after a 12
> Miles glide from 9500 MSL. I personally, would not have been tempted to
use
> the ballistic chute, had one been installed.
>
> However, I can imagine scenarios where they might be more appealing.
> Certainly, if I found myself in IFR conditions and on verge of losing
> control the chute would undoubtedly have appeal as a "last chance". I
think
> that perhaps the RV-10 might be a more likely market for the chute.
Nothing
> against the chute, I know it has saved a number of lives. But, its just
not
> for me in an RV-6. I suspect that should I ever really want it that I
would
> be in a situation that it would be outside a reliable deployment envelope.
>
> FW
>
> Sincerely
>
> Ed Anderson
>
>
> Ed Anderson
> RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
> Matthews, NC
> eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Karie Daniel" <karie4(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
If a BRS wasn't cost or weight prohibitive I would be interested. It's
already proven to save lives, I curious if it would lower insurance premiums
also? It could pay for it's self over a few years if so.
Karie Daniel
RV-7A QB
Sammamish, WA.
Merry Christmas All!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Peltier" <jeffpeltier(at)BRSparachutes.com>
Subject: RV-List: Ballistic parachutes on RVs
>
> Hello RV owners,
> Due to the very high interest exhibited by Vans owners over the years,
we've
> currently entered into the design phase regarding the installation of BRS
> ballistic emergency parachute systems to Vans RV-6,-7 and -9. We have
> purchased a new fuselage for the purpose of static structural pull tests,
> and may be interested in acquiring other fuselages or parts for the
various
> tests required of this effort. We are also open to any questions or
> comments that you may have regarding parachute installation on Vans
> aircraft. Any input will be appreciated. We would really like to hear
from
> you.
>
>
> Jeff Peltier
> Design Engineer
> BRS INC.
> (651)457-7491
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: F-631 cabin frame |
| From: | Genev E Reed <genevreed(at)juno.com> |
Jim: The hight of your roll bar critical. Don't drill the roll bar in
untill you are sure of the height. Also make sure the angle is correct.
The bottom will take care of itself. I've built two RVs with tip-up
canopy's and both could have been better.
Doyle RV7A 160hrs 180 Cspeed what an awsome airplane.
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Pneumatic rivet squeezer |
Hi All,
Looking to purchase a Pneumatic rivet squeezer.
Anyone wanting to sell, please email at -
plaurence@the-beach.net
thanks
peter
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "jack eckdahl" <eckdahl(at)dellmail.com> |
| Subject: | Ballistic parachutes |
I have heard of two Cirrus aircraft where the parachutes saved the life of it's
occupant. One was clear VFR test flight after maintenance when a part (aileron)
fell off (I think). Many other small experimentals also. Seems like a good
idea to provide another measure of safety and another escape route for something
unexpected. Why not! Jack RV9A
--
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Rich Crosley" <dirtrider(at)qnet.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Jacking up gear legs for wheel mtnce |
The axles that came with my finish kit from Van's for my "8" are solid
axles. They only have a 3/4 dia. hole 3/4" deep. Not enough area to pick
up 1/2 an airplane, I wouldn't think. You must have drilled axles. If
you are using a 7/8" bar down the center of a 1.25 axle, I think I'd be a
little concerned about the axle wall thickness. I know on Cessna 170's you
check to see if the airplane has solid or drilled axles. A broken axle on
landing will ruin your day .
Rich Crosley
RV-8, engine, Palmdale, CA
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cammie Patch" <cammie(at)sunvalley.net> |
| Subject: | Riveting wing leading edge ribs...anyone use pop rivets? |
On the leading edge installation, I used solid rivets where I could get a
good one, and pop rivets where the quality of my blind rivet installation
would be in doubt. The way I see it, a good blind rivet (as long as it's
structurally ok) is better than a badly installed solid rivet. I am more
interested in a good strong airframe than a champion aircraft.
Cammie
I'm having the expected trouble riveting the leading edge ribs on my
RV-7 wings....the list archives spell out various techniques involving
grinding down offset rivet sets, use of hockey tape, manufacturing
special bucking bars to enable back riveting etc. It occurs to me that
it would be extremely simple to just use pop rivets. Has anyone done
this? Would there be reduced structural integrity? Is there any
reason not to, other than one's sense of aesthetics? Is there a
recommended pop-rivet spec to use?
Thanks,
Jerry
RV-7A
Wings
Tampa, FL
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Bower" <rvbuilder(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: F-631 cabin frame |
David,
Thanks for the help! After reading the replies to my post, and doing a
little more thinking, I reached the following conclusion:
I am going to jig those parts so as to eliminate the gap at top center. In
so doing, the height dimension is exactly 1/4" shorter than called on the
plans. HOWEVER, the plans show the F-631 dimension from the top of the
F-605 to the top of the F-631 (measured on a slant). This means that if the
631 itself is shorter, no big deal. Just compensate by moving it up on the
feet until the correct distance has been achieved.
As to the 1/4" distance from the roll bar top to the top of the brace...my
plans still have 1/4" called out. I have seen various treatments of that
topic, from 0 to the full 1/4". If I am not mistaken, that gap is really
meaningless as the top of that brace does not contact anything, right? (Or
wrong?)
Happy new year
Jim
>From: dcarter(at)datarecall.net
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: F-631 cabin frame
>Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2003 00:51:41 GMT
>
>
>Jim, does your plans say position the brace 1/4 inch below top center of
>roll
>bar? If so, then Van's has again ignored "free support" from builders who
>point out errors in their drawings. If it shows 13/16ths or something on
>that
>order, then they have fixed the error.
>
>I used Intellicad to create a the side view of fuselage in that area and
>the
>roll bar and brace, etc. Sent it to Van's - never a response.
>
>I'm away from home for Christmas until the following Sat, Sun, or Mon so
>don't
>have my exact measurement.
>
>You are on the right track laying out a pattern on the workbench and
>putting
>in physical blocks to hold the width dimension for the two "feet". You
>need a
>line and block at top center, with a line below to show the height "from
>feet
>to top" - which you have to calculate with trig since they don't show that
>dimension in the plane of the roll bar.
>
>Mine is finished and fits perfectly on the fuselage.
>
>Give me a call on my cell phone 409-718-8518 or at my son's home
>512-266-6955.
>
>David Carter
>RV-6 tip-up
>Nederland, Texas
>
> >
> > I am proceeding very cautiously with the F-631 cabin frame (roll bar)
>for my
> > RV-6A tip-up. The plans call out a nominal width measurement and what
>seems
> > to be a strict height measurement. My fuselage is slightly wider at the
> > F-605 bulkhead than normal, but I set up the F-631 width to compensate
>for
> > that. To do this, I attached blocks to my work surface that define the
> > width and height.
> >
> > The problem is this: As expected, there is a gap at the top center
> > (shouldn't be a problem), but at the bottom, the inboard corners are
>about
> > 1/8" higher than the outboard corners, which prevents the F-631 from
>lying
> > flat on the structure.
> >
> > Should I trim this angle so the entire bottom of the F-631 sits flat?
>If I
> > do, the overall height measurement will be a little lower than is called
> > out. Am I worried too much?
> >
> > Thanks in advance for the help, and I want to wish everybody a Merry
> > Christmas (or whatever you celebrate this time of year), and a Happy New
> > Year.
> >
> > Jim Bower
> > St. Louis
> > RV-6A N143DJ
>
>
>---------------------------------------------
>This message was sent using EXP Webmail.
>http://www.exp.net
>
>
Get reliable dial-up Internet access now with our limited-time introductory
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Elevator bolt ?s / Misc. |
| From: | "Radomir Zaric" <radomirz(at)vitez.net> |
Here are the first two:
* bolt/nut part number that attaches elevator c-weight (new style)
AN509-10R24 screw
AN960-10 washer
AN365-1032 nut
(two of each per elevator)
* bolt/nut that attaches elevator to HS
AN3-7A bolt
AN960-10 washer
AN365-1032 nut
(also 2 of each per elevator).
HTH.
Radomir
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | dcarter(at)datarecall.net |
| Subject: | Re: F-631 cabin frame |
Jim,
1. Gap at top center is not a "strength" issue. Can have a gap - the 2
plates that connect the halves provide 100% of the strength. Butting the ends
together adds nothing, so don't worry about the gap, if you should find, on
reflection (about things to follow), that you might need a bit of a gap.
2. About the top brace distance down from top: It is true that is has
nothing to do with the canopy material. However, it really is quite a big
deal in getting the brace to hit the right spot on the baggage bulkhead and
for the bottoms of the 631 roll bar to be positioned correctly for-aft so as
to be CENTERED over the seat back AND some piece under it that you have to
find on the drawings - otherwise, edge distances are if'y (luck or not).
- I went to a flyin and observed a flying RV-6 with the feet about 3/4
inch too far forward and therefore the bolts coming straight up thru seat back
stuff was NOT through all the structural stuff - it was only through a single
piece of sheet. (wish I had the drawing in front of me)
- From the drawings, I drew the underlying stuff on top of the seat back
to show the boundaries of where the feet could go and drew a centerline, then
drew the shape of the roll bar feet angles in that area to help me position
the roll bar correctly. Then all kind of convoluted measuring to check ht -
the seat back brace sags in the middle where the ht dimention is supposed to
be checked, so I shimmed and. . . . . .
- If you wait until I get home Sat or Mon I can tell you exactly what the
dimension is for brace down from top. Use that and then trim bottoms if
needed and everything fits fine - in the areas you have drawn.
- In any case, you may have to trim off part of the inner edge of the
bottoms of the roll bar to get the height dimension correct. There really is
no way from the plans to get all this stuff right - jigging like you are doing
is the key - plus don't shy away from the simple trig to get the height
dimension the plans don't give you.
3. Just a word of caution about "moving the roll bar bottoms up on the feet
(angles)" to get the height dimension called out in the plans: There is the
normal issue of edge distance at top of feet/angles and bottom of roll bar
ends that will impose some degree of limit on how much you can trim the feet.
David
ph away from home = 512-266-6955 & cell 409-718-8518
>
> David,
>
> Thanks for the help! After reading the replies to my post, and doing a
> little more thinking, I reached the following conclusion:
>
> I am going to jig those parts so as to eliminate the gap at top center. In
> so doing, the height dimension is exactly 1/4" shorter than called on the
> plans. HOWEVER, the plans show the F-631 dimension from the top of the
> F-605 to the top of the F-631 (measured on a slant). This means that if the
> 631 itself is shorter, no big deal. Just compensate by moving it up on the
> feet until the correct distance has been achieved.
>
> As to the 1/4" distance from the roll bar top to the top of the brace...my
> plans still have 1/4" called out. I have seen various treatments of that
> topic, from 0 to the full 1/4". If I am not mistaken, that gap is really
> meaningless as the top of that brace does not contact anything, right? (Or
> wrong?)
>
> Happy new year
>
> Jim
---------------------------------------------
This message was sent using EXP Webmail.
http://www.exp.net
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Ballistic parachutes tests |
| From: | "Frank van der Hulst (Staff WG)" <F.vanderHulst(at)ucol.ac.nz> |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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Kysh <vans-dragon(at)lapdragon.org> |
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic parachutes |
As rv6tc was saying:
>
> Weight, cost, complexity.
And a false sense of security...
-Kysh
--
| 'Life begins at 120kias' - http://www.lapdragon.org/flying |
| CBR-F4 streetbike - http://www.lapdragon.org/cbr |
| 1968 Mustang fastback - http://www.lapdragon.org/mustang |
| Got 'nix? - http://www.infrastructure.org/ |
| KG6FOB - http://www.lapdragon.org/ham |
| Give blood: Play Hockey! http://www.unixdragon.com/ |
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
>From what I remember from flying a Cirrus with a BRS, the descent rate is
>around 1500 fpm on impact with the ground. Cirrus occupants have the
>benefit
>of seats that are designed to "crumple" from the vertical load this descent
>causes. Also, the only approved spin recovery in a Cirrus is the deployment
>of the BRS, I don't think the RV series has a record of getting into
>unrecoverable spins that would need a BRS. What appears to be a necessary
>safety feature in a Cirrus might not in demand in the RV world.
>Cammie
>RV7a
>Ailerons
Say WHAAAT?!? The only way to recover a Cirrus from a spin is to blow the
chute? Egads. How do such airplanes get sold, and more to the point, who
would buy one?
I'm striking the Cirrus from my "would like to fly someday" list.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 51 headed my way.
Make your home warm and cozy this winter with tips from MSN House & Home.
http://special.msn.com/home/warmhome.armx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Phil Sisson, Litchfield Aerobatic Club" <sisson(at)consolidated.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
Personally, I would use a personal chute pack if I were wanting to come
down in a chute.
There is a little bit of control available. I dont think there is any
control in the BRS.
Then on the other hand, you can just go fly it.. And have fun..............
Cost for two good used packs.... $800 to 1600, new ones about 1100 or
1200 each.
cost to repack both of them.... about $300 per year
>Just an oppinion, Phil
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "austin" <austin(at)uniserve.com> |
Hi Listers ,
And a merry Christmas and even better New Year to you
all.
Another Christmas.
And where are we with the RV, our timeline, and mission statement ..flying
wise ?
A mystical day, in a sense, Christmas before the frenzy of driving, dinner,
family, kids, job, time,...more time we need to get to where we want to
be...RV wise, we don't talk about it much, we just have this goal....
Finish it and fly it...consummation......
And for those fortunate to be done, time on our side and finished, the
hangar door is our holy grail...
In my part of the world, rain was forecast, but as usual, they are only 50 %
right...Expert weather man that I am, I am batting just as good an average
as the TV weather man, in that my forecast says that the weather today will
be much like it was yesterday...and my average is pretty good.
Yes, there is a cloudbase about 3,000...but light and pink underneath and
lightwind.
A good day to fly when so many others have other things to do and agendas of
far more import.
Do you secretly sense a kind of thrill when you unlock the hangar door and
see your RV spinner the first to greet you and tell you that all the work
and time and money and lies and budget fudging are standing here, waiting
for you to open the doors all the way and let me out and start the engine
and listen to nothing else but the prop and exhaust and the monotone of ATIS
and finally lift your gaze to clear taxi ?
Even though I try each time to stay straight on the painted line as
throttle up pulls me along, I always stagger a bit and before I can feel I
have command enough to make this horse track straight...the wheels are no
longer exacting any drag for they are free of the tarmac and we are rising
swiftly.
It is as easy as that !
I don't even mind the noise, and it drowns everything else, but I have
things to do, and enjoying the falling away landscape seems to be the
uppermost ..
Turn off the boost pump, trim a bit, throttle the noise back, get a smug
smile at what the GPS is saying and look around.....ain't this a special way
to spend part of a Christmas day ?...
Later, at the table, with family dear, and kids and spouses and
in-laws....this is a special time of get together and values, but an RV
pilot has already had their " religious experience " this day...
Ever been to a stadium out of season ? when all the seats are empty
and the crowd and noise are but a memory ?
Weird.
Well, landing at a normally busy field on Christmas day to find it empty,
the coffee shop closed and dark and no other sounds of airplanes starting up
or taxiing in is equally weird....
Are we the only airplane guys in the sky today ?
Heading home with the wind at our backs and GPS telling amazing stories,
home field appears at 10 o'clock and nobody else is talking to the
tower...at first, I wonder if the radio is working....no voices....
But good old radio does work and a voice bids " straight in " from 6 miles
out....or more....
My landings are never the same as to how far out I get serious, but finally
I quit looking at the airspeed and just how high or low the nose seems to be
from the paint lines and somehow the RV finds her own glidepath and the
tires kiss the blacktop.......now rolling out is something else again
because I think I am a lousy pilot and I get a shimmy and try to kil it by
back pressure, and it works..for a while.....by this time...it is time to
clear active and why I have to monitor ground beats me as there is no other
life around..but home we go and put her away and before closing the doors,
my hand on the cowling feels the warmth of life and I sense the wonder of
all these parts that bore me up once more for my " fix "....
I believe I am addicted....
At locking up, my thoughts turn to those I have known or read about who no
longer have a Christmas for whatever reason and those who made it safe for
me to enjoy what others paid the ultimate price for me to savour.
God bless you all, and those forever young..
Austin.
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Doug Weiler" <dougweil(at)pressenter.com> |
| Subject: | RV-6 wings for sale |
Fellow Listers:
A quick re-posting of this for a local friend here in Minneapolis:
RV-6 wings from partially completed kit. The wings are 90% finished and
includes center section components. Price reduced to $3000
Contact me off list and I'll forward your inquiry.
Thanks
Doug Weiler
Hudson, WI
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
| From: | Genev E Reed <genevreed(at)juno.com> |
Paul: Don't do aerobatics your butt can't cash. ? What does that mean.
Doyle RV7A
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Mickey Coggins <mick-matronics(at)rv8.ch> |
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
>Question is......
>Will you feel the same if/when the NTSB reports document
>that the BRS chute is not nearly the panacea many envision.
>
>Unfounded confidence seems to be the rule rather then the
>exception in today's technical world and hype is the life blood
>of the folks in marketing.
Hi Bob,
I could not agree more. If the reports show that the BRS
does not increase safety, then I won't consider it further.
I guess if you went back to the Matronics archives from
the 30's :-) you would find the same debate about aircraft
ejection seats. Not much debate any longer on that topic!
Happy Boxing Day!
--
Mickey
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Bower" <rvbuilder(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: F-631 cabin frame |
David,
I will give you a call either Saturday or Monday to get your measurements on
this. Meanwhile, I think I will put this part on hold and work on something
else...there's never a shortage of side jobs to do! I will also draw this
on the computer in CorelDraw. Believe it or not, this handles measurements
very well and I can get a lot of information from it. Trig never was one of
my strong subjects, and it's been about 35 years since I had it, so I think
I'll let the electrons do my calculations for me.
Jim
>From: dcarter(at)datarecall.net
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>Subject: Re: RV-List: F-631 cabin frame
>Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2003 20:11:35 GMT
>
>
>Jim,
>
>1. Gap at top center is not a "strength" issue. Can have a gap - the 2
>plates that connect the halves provide 100% of the strength. Butting the
>ends
>together adds nothing, so don't worry about the gap, if you should find, on
>reflection (about things to follow), that you might need a bit of a gap.
>
>2. About the top brace distance down from top: It is true that is has
>nothing to do with the canopy material. However, it really is quite a big
>deal in getting the brace to hit the right spot on the baggage bulkhead and
>for the bottoms of the 631 roll bar to be positioned correctly for-aft so
>as
>to be CENTERED over the seat back AND some piece under it that you have to
>find on the drawings - otherwise, edge distances are if'y (luck or not).
> - I went to a flyin and observed a flying RV-6 with the feet about 3/4
>inch too far forward and therefore the bolts coming straight up thru seat
>back
>stuff was NOT through all the structural stuff - it was only through a
>single
>piece of sheet. (wish I had the drawing in front of me)
> - From the drawings, I drew the underlying stuff on top of the seat
>back
>to show the boundaries of where the feet could go and drew a centerline,
>then
>drew the shape of the roll bar feet angles in that area to help me position
>the roll bar correctly. Then all kind of convoluted measuring to check ht
>-
>the seat back brace sags in the middle where the ht dimention is supposed
>to
>be checked, so I shimmed and. . . . . .
> - If you wait until I get home Sat or Mon I can tell you exactly what
>the
>dimension is for brace down from top. Use that and then trim bottoms if
>needed and everything fits fine - in the areas you have drawn.
> - In any case, you may have to trim off part of the inner edge of
>the
>bottoms of the roll bar to get the height dimension correct. There really
>is
>no way from the plans to get all this stuff right - jigging like you are
>doing
>is the key - plus don't shy away from the simple trig to get the height
>dimension the plans don't give you.
>
>3. Just a word of caution about "moving the roll bar bottoms up on the feet
>(angles)" to get the height dimension called out in the plans: There is
>the
>normal issue of edge distance at top of feet/angles and bottom of roll bar
>ends that will impose some degree of limit on how much you can trim the
>feet.
>
>David
> ph away from home = 512-266-6955 & cell 409-718-8518
>
> >
> > David,
> >
> > Thanks for the help! After reading the replies to my post, and doing a
> > little more thinking, I reached the following conclusion:
> >
> > I am going to jig those parts so as to eliminate the gap at top center.
>In
> > so doing, the height dimension is exactly 1/4" shorter than called on
>the
> > plans. HOWEVER, the plans show the F-631 dimension from the top of the
> > F-605 to the top of the F-631 (measured on a slant). This means that if
>the
> > 631 itself is shorter, no big deal. Just compensate by moving it up on
>the
> > feet until the correct distance has been achieved.
> >
> > As to the 1/4" distance from the roll bar top to the top of the
>brace...my
> > plans still have 1/4" called out. I have seen various treatments of
>that
> > topic, from 0 to the full 1/4". If I am not mistaken, that gap is
>really
> > meaningless as the top of that brace does not contact anything, right?
>(Or
> > wrong?)
> >
> > Happy new year
> >
> > Jim
>
>
>---------------------------------------------
>This message was sent using EXP Webmail.
>http://www.exp.net
>
>
Enjoy a special introductory offer for dial-up Internet access limited
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Riveting wing leading edge ribs...anyone use pop rivets? |
With two people all the leading edge rivets are reachable with a little
effort. I had discussed all the techniques with Vans and they said you could
substitute a few pops in there, but give it a try first. With another
builder on the gun, I was able to use my normal bucking bar to get them all.
I did not make up the special bar although I said I would if necessary. My
bar, which I think I got from Avery is about 3" x 1" x 2" with a taper on
one end and rounded on the other end. Fits nicely in the palm of the hand
and I can get it virtually anywhere. I use this bar a lot. With the taper on
one end the sort of pointy end gets into the corners nicely.
We started with all the ones we could easily see and do and used the same
bar so we got into a rhythem on how long to hit the rivets. Then moved on to
the ones we couldn't see while we were doing it where we would just go by
the same amount of time to hit. Once you get in the rhythem it seems to go
easier then it looks when you are trying to figure out how to get at some of
them. You are bucking in the blind on a few but that's not a problem. I used
a small mirror on a stem to check the shop heads but we could pretty much
tell how they were by feel.
My reco- get an experienced person on the gun and you hold the bar and go
for it. Feels good when done.
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings done for now- working on tail
Quick build fuselage now in basement
Piper Cherokee N5320W
1974 TR6
HD Road King Classic
(Maybe I need a boat too)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cammie Patch" <cammie(at)sunvalley.net>
Subject: RE: RV-List: Riveting wing leading edge ribs...anyone use pop
rivets?
>
> On the leading edge installation, I used solid rivets where I could get a
> good one, and pop rivets where the quality of my blind rivet installation
> would be in doubt. The way I see it, a good blind rivet (as long as it's
> structurally ok) is better than a badly installed solid rivet. I am more
> interested in a good strong airframe than a champion aircraft.
> Cammie
>
>
> I'm having the expected trouble riveting the leading edge ribs on my
> RV-7 wings....the list archives spell out various techniques involving
> grinding down offset rivet sets, use of hockey tape, manufacturing
> special bucking bars to enable back riveting etc. It occurs to me that
> it would be extremely simple to just use pop rivets. Has anyone done
> this? Would there be reduced structural integrity? Is there any
> reason not to, other than one's sense of aesthetics? Is there a
> recommended pop-rivet spec to use?
>
> Thanks,
> Jerry
> RV-7A
> Wings
> Tampa, FL
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Jim Nolan" <jamespnolan(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Ballistic Chutes |
Questions to ponder when building an RV
1. Do I need a backup Radio if I intend to fly IFR----No, because the one I
have is the best on the market.
2. Do I need a dedicated Carb heat muff-----No, because the Lycomings have
the carb sitting on the hot oil pan and that will keep ice from forming.
3. Do I need a Heated pitot------No, because I'm not going to be dumb enough
to fly in those conditions.
4. Do I need a backup electrical system-----No, because I haven't got a lot
of extra power consuming crap like radios, heated pitots and gauges that a
good pilot doesn't need.
5. Do I need more training----No, because the training I have has made me
proficient up to this point.
6. Do I think I'd ever need a Ballistic Chute if it were available for my
RV------ YOU ADD YOUR REASON
Have a happy Holiday everyone.
Jim Nolan
N444JN
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Cy Galley" <cgalley(at)QCBC.ORG> |
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic Chutes |
I disagree with at least two of your premises...
The heat muff as although the Lycoming location reduces, it doesn't
eliminate carb icing.
The other is the pitot heat as you say you are going to fly IFR. Maybe you
have heard needle, ball and airspeed in emergency. Pitot heat gives you the
chance to still have airspeed when in a cloud under freezing conditions.
Cy Galley
Editor, EAA Safety Programs
cgalley(at)qcbc.org or experimenter(at)eaa.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Nolan" <jamespnolan(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: RV-List: Ballistic Chutes
>
> Questions to ponder when building an RV
> 1. Do I need a backup Radio if I intend to fly IFR----No, because the one
I
> have is the best on the market.
> 2. Do I need a dedicated Carb heat muff-----No, because the Lycomings have
> the carb sitting on the hot oil pan and that will keep ice from forming.
> 3. Do I need a Heated pitot------No, because I'm not going to be dumb
enough
> to fly in those conditions.
> 4. Do I need a backup electrical system-----No, because I haven't got a
lot
> of extra power consuming crap like radios, heated pitots and gauges that a
> good pilot doesn't need.
> 5. Do I need more training----No, because the training I have has made me
> proficient up to this point.
> 6. Do I think I'd ever need a Ballistic Chute if it were available for my
> RV------ YOU ADD YOUR REASON
> Have a happy Holiday everyone.
> Jim Nolan
> N444JN
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | LeastDrag93066(at)aol.com |
| Subject: | Re: Riveting wing leading edge ribs...anyone use pop rivets? |
In a message dated 12/26/2003 4:26:04 AM Pacific Standard Time,
choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com writes:
I used
a small mirror on a stem to check the shop heads but we could pretty much
tell how they were by feel.
Braille rivet inspection.
If you press on the formed head with your finger, it will leave an impression
of the formed rivet head on your finger, briefly. You can then "see" the
formed rivet head without needing a mirror.
Jim Ayers
RV-3
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Wayne Pedersen" <wayne(at)pedersentransport.com> |
My youngest daughter gave me a Van's calendar for Christmas. While I was
flipping through it I was describing each plane. I got to the RV10 and my
wife asked "Is that the new four seater ?" I did the best to answer her
questions on it and then she said "You are going to build that once you are
done your -7a aren't you?" To which I responded "That's another big time and
resource commitment" "Doesn't matter", she said "I think you better build it
and I will help"
Hmmmmm looks like I am in a tough spot people. I have to look forward to
building another RV !!!!
Merry Christmas
Wayne
S.Alberta
RV 7-a working on panel
P.S.
My wife is working on her private license and YES she does have a sister !
---
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
Mickey Coggins wrote:
>
>
>
>
>>Question is......
>>Will you feel the same if/when the NTSB reports document
>>that the BRS chute is not nearly the panacea many envision.
>>
>>Unfounded confidence seems to be the rule rather then the
>>exception in today's technical world and hype is the life blood
>>of the folks in marketing.
>>
>>
>
>Hi Bob,
>
>I could not agree more. If the reports show that the BRS
>does not increase safety, then I won't consider it further.
>
>I guess if you went back to the Matronics archives from
>the 30's :-) you would find the same debate about aircraft
>ejection seats. Not much debate any longer on that topic!
>
>Happy Boxing Day!
>
>--
>Mickey
>
>
>
You are right I never see a debate about ejection seats from Piper,
Cessna, Beech or any other non military manufacturered aircraft. :-)
Jerry
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
>Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2003 09:06:24 -0700
>
>
>
>My youngest daughter gave me a Van's calendar for Christmas. While I was
>flipping through it I was describing each plane. I got to the RV10 and my
>wife asked "Is that the new four seater ?" I did the best to answer her
>questions on it and then she said "You are going to build that once you are
>done your -7a aren't you?" To which I responded "That's another big time
>and
>resource commitment" "Doesn't matter", she said "I think you better build
>it
>and I will help"
>
>Hmmmmm looks like I am in a tough spot people. I have to look forward to
>building another RV !!!!
>
>Merry Christmas
>
>Wayne
>S.Alberta
>RV 7-a working on panel
>
>P.S.
>
>My wife is working on her private license and YES she does have a sister !
Oh yes indeed, you're lucky! My wife let me build my RV8, then probably
figured it was out of my blood...which it WAS, as attested by four years of
RV grins and almost no sheet metal work. But then, along came our little
boy, and the need for more seats. Then, Van works his magic and the -10 is
born. After Deb tried on the -10 at LOE3, she was positively jazzed, and
wanted me to get started NOW! I had already placed my empecone order at OSH
(courtesy of my fine friends from the SoCal RV squadron). So, it was just a
matter of playing the waiting game. My -10 kit is somewhere enroute to my
shop as I write this. Santa must have run out of gross weight margin on his
sleigh so Roadway Trucking had to help out.
I'm reaaallly looking forward to building again, but am also scared half to
death. Oh well, great things never happen until you cry, sweat and bleed a
little, and we're not just talking financially here. :)
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
RV10 51
Expand your wine savvy and get some great new recipes at MSN Wine.
http://wine.msn.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jeff Peltier <jeffpeltier(at)BRSparachutes.com> |
Dear RV enthusiasts,
Thanks for the speedy replies! I always find it fascinating how fast people
are willing to throw in their 2 cents. And of course, the opinions usually
run to each side of the spectrum. The folks without a strong opinion- one
way or the other- don't bother to write.
Based on some of the responses, I'd like to dispel a few myths and maybe
educate a few people on what we do.
At BRS, we are the FIRST to advise that the parachute IS NOT the "panacea"
that some would think we believe it is. It is never an excuse for poor
building practices, maintenance, training or piloting skills. Our manuals
state that clearly. It is primarily for those occasions when all other means
of problem solving have been expended.
As of the first part of December, BRS have saved the lives of at least 159
individuals (we don't always get reports of all saves). A deployment on a
Cirrus aircraft in late 2002 was our first save on a CERTIFIED aircraft.
That aircraft is now flying again, by the way.
In business for 22 years, over 17,000 units delivered. Nearly 1% of all
units delivered have been used in real, life-saving events! In comparison,
airbags in cars have saved (?) 1 person for every 50,000 units. These
government mandated safety devices have killed at least 80 children under
the age of 12. Ballistic parachutes have never actually KILLED anyone, that
we are aware of. I'm all for airbags, however. Used correctly, save lives!
Parachutes are not a mysterious device which sometimes open and sometimes
don't. It is not a matter of luck or special dispensation from God which
makes a parachute deploy. It is the same phenomenon which makes your wing
create lift. The air passing over the outside of the parachute as its towed
by its payload, creates a low pressure area on the outside- literally
causing it to be "sucked" open by the atmosphere around it! (In fact, the
purpose of the patented Slider on BRS parachutes is to keep the 'chute from
opening TOO fast).
"George in Langley" shared a concern about dangers of deploying over water.
I have a couple comments about that.
- Ditching an airplane, especially a low wing fixed gear airplane is extreme
bad news. The airplane WILL be very violently thrown on its back. If the
canopy doesnt shatter, it will probably remain secured in place against the
external pressures caused by the surrounding water and the weight of the
sinking aircraft. You're upside down in a bowl filling with very cold and
debris filled water, trying to extract yourself and your panicking, flailing
armed 14 year old neighbor kid (his first Young Eagle ride) from this mess
that YOU, as PIC and manufacturer of the aircraft, are responsible for.
- It is not the fault of the parachute system that you may have been over
water in the event you have to use it- it is the event itself.
- It would be infinitely safer to contact the water in a controlled vertical
descent, that would more than likely leave you right side up. Descent under
parachute gives you the time to plan your escape.
"Phil from Litchfield Aerobatic club" would rather use a personal chute pack
system.
- At this time, its still the requirement for aerobatic flight- there is no
provision for waiver with ballistic chute.
- Having just rode in an RV-6 2 days ago, I would have to surmise that you
would have to be a very tiny individual to fit in the aircraft with a
parachute on AND still be able to get out of it when you need to.
- An experienced skydiver would most likely need to be out and clear of the
aircraft at least 1,500' agl. This would be quite a stretch for most pilots
and passengers, especially seeing that most people tend to stay with the
aircraft far too long.
- 100% useless at traffic pattern alt or less.
In ending, every pilot flies with his own unique circumstances. We must
weigh the risks each time we take-off. We will take-off (hopefully) only
when we have assured ourselves that the benefits of this particular flight
are greater than the probability of experiencing the worst possible outcome.
As PICs, we tend to accept that risk for the joy and satisfaction our hobby
gives us. Your passengers generally don't share your exact outlook. When
they fly with you they place their lives in your competence, skill and
decision making abilities.
I'm in engineering, not the sales department. This is meant to spawn a bit
more thinking into the matter. Can't wait to read the replies after this
one.
Jeff Peltier
Design Engineer
BRS INC
jeffpeltier(at)BRSparachutes.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Charles Rowbotham" <crowbotham(at)hotmail.com> |
Austin,
As I've said many time before - THANKS.
Take Care and best wishes for a great New Year,
Chuck Rowbotham
RV-8A
>From: "austin" <austin(at)uniserve.com>
>Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
>To: "rv-list rv-list"
>Subject: RV-List: Rv Christmas
>Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2003 13:49:32 -0800
>
>
>Hi Listers ,
> And a merry Christmas and even better New Year to you
>all.
>Another Christmas.
>And where are we with the RV, our timeline, and mission statement ..flying
>wise ?
>A mystical day, in a sense, Christmas before the frenzy of driving, dinner,
>family, kids, job, time,...more time we need to get to where we want to
>be...RV wise, we don't talk about it much, we just have this goal....
>Finish it and fly it...consummation......
>And for those fortunate to be done, time on our side and finished, the
>hangar door is our holy grail...
>In my part of the world, rain was forecast, but as usual, they are only 50
>%
>right...Expert weather man that I am, I am batting just as good an average
>as the TV weather man, in that my forecast says that the weather today will
>be much like it was yesterday...and my average is pretty good.
>Yes, there is a cloudbase about 3,000...but light and pink underneath and
>lightwind.
>A good day to fly when so many others have other things to do and agendas
>of
>far more import.
>Do you secretly sense a kind of thrill when you unlock the hangar door and
>see your RV spinner the first to greet you and tell you that all the work
>and time and money and lies and budget fudging are standing here, waiting
>for you to open the doors all the way and let me out and start the engine
>and listen to nothing else but the prop and exhaust and the monotone of
>ATIS
>and finally lift your gaze to clear taxi ?
> Even though I try each time to stay straight on the painted line as
>throttle up pulls me along, I always stagger a bit and before I can feel I
>have command enough to make this horse track straight...the wheels are no
>longer exacting any drag for they are free of the tarmac and we are rising
>swiftly.
>It is as easy as that !
> I don't even mind the noise, and it drowns everything else, but I
>have
>things to do, and enjoying the falling away landscape seems to be the
>uppermost ..
>Turn off the boost pump, trim a bit, throttle the noise back, get a smug
>smile at what the GPS is saying and look around.....ain't this a special
>way
>to spend part of a Christmas day ?...
>Later, at the table, with family dear, and kids and spouses and
>in-laws....this is a special time of get together and values, but an RV
>pilot has already had their " religious experience " this day...
> Ever been to a stadium out of season ? when all the seats are
>empty
>and the crowd and noise are but a memory ?
> Weird.
>Well, landing at a normally busy field on Christmas day to find it empty,
>the coffee shop closed and dark and no other sounds of airplanes starting
>up
>or taxiing in is equally weird....
>Are we the only airplane guys in the sky today ?
>Heading home with the wind at our backs and GPS telling amazing stories,
>home field appears at 10 o'clock and nobody else is talking to the
>tower...at first, I wonder if the radio is working....no voices....
>But good old radio does work and a voice bids " straight in " from 6 miles
>out....or more....
>My landings are never the same as to how far out I get serious, but finally
>I quit looking at the airspeed and just how high or low the nose seems to
>be
>from the paint lines and somehow the RV finds her own glidepath and the
>tires kiss the blacktop.......now rolling out is something else again
>because I think I am a lousy pilot and I get a shimmy and try to kil it by
>back pressure, and it works..for a while.....by this time...it is time to
>clear active and why I have to monitor ground beats me as there is no other
>life around..but home we go and put her away and before closing the doors,
>my hand on the cowling feels the warmth of life and I sense the wonder of
>all these parts that bore me up once more for my " fix "....
>I believe I am addicted....
>At locking up, my thoughts turn to those I have known or read about who no
>longer have a Christmas for whatever reason and those who made it safe for
>me to enjoy what others paid the ultimate price for me to savour.
>God bless you all, and those forever young..
>Austin.
>
>
Working moms: Find helpful tips here on managing kids, home, work and
yourself. http://special.msn.com/msnbc/workingmom.armx
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Brian Denk" <akroguy(at)hotmail.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic parachutes on RVs |
>Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2003 22:43:08 -0600
>
>
>Paul: Don't do aerobatics your butt can't cash. ? What does that mean.
>Doyle RV7A
To me it means, don't get into something you can't finish....don't start a
loop too slow and not be prepared to deal with a spin at the top.
Brian Denk
RV8 N94BD
another "wannabe pilot" but learning more every time I fly.
Enjoy a special introductory offer for dial-up Internet access limited
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Steve Glasgow" <willfly(at)carolina.rr.com> |
Sometimes you guys remind me of my grandchildren! Offer them candy and they may
say "no I don't like that", only because they have never tried it. I say let
the engineers work on it, show us what they come up with and how it might help
us, then maybe we can make an intelligent decision.
Till then I'm keeping an open mind!
Later,
Steve Glasgow
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
| Subject: | Shoulder harness |
Listers,
I finally found the document that talks about shoulder belt attachment
points and the rule says, less than 30 deg. above the shoulders and no
more than 5 deg below the shoulders.
The document is AC-21-34 and can be found at:
http://www2.faa.gov/avr/afs/safety/harness/AC%2021-34.pdf
It will tell you more than you ever wanted to know about seat belt and
shoulder harness installation!
Dave -6, So Cal
EAA Technical Counselor
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Dave Bristol <bj034(at)lafn.org> |
I just looked at the BRS website and it looks like an appropriate system
for an RV6 would be about $11,000.00. (More than a third of the cost of
my airplane) I personally think that eleven thousand dollars could be
better spent on ratings and equipment. Yes, I do believe that it would
add a measure of safety but the cost, both in dollars and in weight will
most likely never be in my budget. If I ever get that paranoid about
flying my own airplane, I'll buy an airline ticket.
Dave
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | linn walters <lwalters2(at)cfl.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: -7 tail kit for sale |
New, unopened RV-7 tail kit for sale. Located in Tampa FL. $1200
delivered in FL. Plus shipping elsewhere.
email Mark Conner (Not Linn) @ mconner7(at)tampabay.rr.com
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Stewart, Michael (ISS Atlanta)" <mstewart(at)iss.net> |
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Frank van der Hulst (Staff WG)" <F.vanderHulst(at)ucol.ac.nz> |
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________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob U." <rv3(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Chutes for RVs |
Jerry Springer wrote:
>
>Here is my reply, after reading yours I want a BRS even less than
>before. You use scare tactics and untruths
>to try to justify your chute on an RV. Using an example of a young
>eagle, (scare tactic) saying you have to be a tiny
>person to exit an RV-6. (untrue) I am 6'3" 210 lb. and would not have a
>problem getting out. Yes I have jumped out of
>airplanes before still do not see a need for ballistics in an RV. BRS
>were originally designed for ultralights that were having
>structural failures in the early stages. I believe that is still the
>best use of ballistic chutes after reading your saves and all the
> malfunctions on the airplanes they are installed on.
>BTW tell us what Van thinks of using ballistic chutes on his design? You
>say it is not an excuse for poor building
>practices, well I doubt very much that anyone is going to build their
>airplane poorly and say to him/herself I well just use a
>a BRS. So I guess I am still waiting for the myths you are going to
>dispel. By your 2 cent comment seems like you
>are not happy with the comments that don't agree with yours. BTW I
>noticed in your saves list only one Cirrus
>listed wasn't there another one where the chute did not deploy
>correctly? March 2002 I believe.
>Of course this is all my opinions and others should do as they feel best
>for them.
>Jerry
>
Jerry,
I agree with most your assessment above and would like to add my two
cents worth.
1. I read that the Cirrus that is back flying was a FREAK SAVE. The
report I read stated that tree branches or some such broke the fall of
the aircraft sufficiently before it hit the ground - if it even hit the
ground, allowing the airframe to be reused at practical costs. Other
Cirrus deployments were not so 'press-worthy' , it seems.
2. I believe the scenario describing a low wing plane ditching over
water is probably the best and safest use of a ballistic chute since my
luck would have me landing directly on a flag pole, in busy rush hour
traffic, the Indy 500 or being bounced down a mountain slope in 30 knot
winds.... provided the seat in an RV can be modified to prevent the
occupants from breaking their backs on impact. Using the standard pan
used in my RV would be a killer. Dunno if three inches of TEMP-R-FOAM
or some such can save my delicate spine and vertebrae so I might swim to
shore. [Yes, good judgment would minimize flying outside of gliding
distance to shore in the first place, but ya never know what kind of
superior fool will fool a foolproof airplane.] ;-)
3. YMMV
P.S.
Anybody know how the famous Jim Handbury died? I was told his death was
caused by a test parachute that tangled in the control surfaces of the
aircraft.he was piloting.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob U." <rv3(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Chutes for RVs |
>Jerry,
>
>I agree with most your assessment above and would like to add my two
>cents worth.
>
>1. I read that the Cirrus that is back flying was a FREAK SAVE. The
>report I read stated that tree branches or some such broke the fall of
>the aircraft sufficiently before it hit the ground - if it even hit the
>ground, allowing the airframe to be reused at practical costs. Other
>Cirrus deployments were not so 'press-worthy' , it seems.
>
>2. I believe the scenario describing a low wing plane ditching over
>water is probably the best and safest use of a ballistic chute since my
>luck would have me landing directly on a flag pole, in busy rush hour
>traffic, the Indy 500 or being bounced down a mountain slope in 30 knot
>winds.... provided the seat in an RV can be modified to prevent the
>occupants from breaking their backs on impact. Using the standard pan
>used in my RV would be a killer. Dunno if three inches of TEMP-R-FOAM
>or some such can save my delicate spine and vertebrae so I might swim to
>shore. [Yes, good judgment would minimize flying outside of gliding
>distance to shore in the first place, but ya never know what kind of
>superior fool will fool a foolproof airplane.] ;-)
>
>3. YMMV
>
>P.S.
>Anybody know how the famous Jim Handbury died? I was told his death was
>caused by a test parachute that tangled in the control surfaces of the
>aircraft.he was piloting.
>
I forgot to add --
The above only applies if, BIG IF....
if the ballistic chute can be made to deploy properly and repeatedly in
the first place. This is hardly a 'given' at this point and I'd hate to
assume anything that would jeopardize my next 50 years of successful
flight. :-)
Bob - over 50 years of successful flight
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <jimmy(at)jhill.biz> |
Based upon note I have seen here, I recently bought an Odessey 580 battery for
my RV8A, with an IO-360 (200HP) Lyc. The batt is much thinner than the old G-25.
So thin that I wonder if it has enough capacity to handle this engine??
What are your experiences with it??
Thanks.
Jimmy Hill
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | Jerry Springer <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net> |
Don't know about a 580, but I know the 680 spins my O-360 much better
than the Concorde RGB I had before.
Jerry
jimmy(at)jhill.biz wrote:
>
>Based upon note I have seen here, I recently bought an Odessey 580 battery for
my RV8A, with an IO-360 (200HP) Lyc. The batt is much thinner than the old
G-25.
>
>
>So thin that I wonder if it has enough capacity to handle this engine??
>What are your experiences with it??
>
>Thanks.
>
>Jimmy Hill
>
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | michael michael <top_gun_toronto(at)yahoo.ca> |
| Subject: | Chutes for RVs...Captain going down with the ship...;) |
Dear Pilots...
There was once a time that parachutes were not given out to pilots, because it
was seen as promoting cowardice,....
I think the jury is out...I do think that we will all watch the 1st RV planes equipped
with this device very carefully(wether you like the idea or not, your
interest is peaked)..... But I can tell you one thing... If the BRS does work.....If
it saves the life of one sorry ass pilot then the debate was worth it.....There
has never been a time when a revolutionary idea was not met with resistance(regarless
if you like the messenger or not)..... I feel there is allot
of the "Captain going down with the ship"...mentality floating around. ....
One of 2 things are going to happen.....This system will begin to save lives.....or
it wont.....I beg the question...why not see if it does save lives ....the
benefits far outweigh the loss.....I say to the dis believers....hold your tongue.....you
can always do the "I told you so" later & show us all, how enlighten
you are....but until then...lets let this play out.....give them enough rope.....lets
see what happens.....This has me riveted....we could be at a major
junction in aviation...This could be one of those....I remember when stories,
unfolding before your eyes..
Michael In Toronto
---------------------------------
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Curt Hoffman" <choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com> |
| Subject: | Re: Riveting wing leading edge ribs...anyone use pop rivets? |
Good idea. I have done something similar by accidently kneeling on a rivet
and leaving an impression in my knee : )
Curt Hoffman
RV-9A wings done for now- working on tail
Quick build fuselage now in basement
Piper Cherokee N5320W
1974 TR6
HD Road King Classic
(Maybe I need a boat too)
----- Original Message -----
From: <LeastDrag93066(at)aol.com>
Subject: Re: RV-List: Riveting wing leading edge ribs...anyone use pop
rivets?
>
> In a message dated 12/26/2003 4:26:04 AM Pacific Standard Time,
> choffman9(at)cinci.rr.com writes:
> I used
> a small mirror on a stem to check the shop heads but we could pretty much
> tell how they were by feel.
> Braille rivet inspection.
>
> If you press on the formed head with your finger, it will leave an
impression
> of the formed rivet head on your finger, briefly. You can then "see" the
> formed rivet head without needing a mirror.
>
> Jim Ayers
> RV-3
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "thomas a. sargent" <sarg314(at)earthlink.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Ballistic parachutes on RVs - getting out |
Bryan:
I have often wondered about getting out in flight. I am building a
tip-up. How do you get the thing open in flight short of smashing the
plexiglass? I've always heard that neither the tip-up nor the slider
can be opened in flight because aerodynamic forces exert too much
pressure. I've built the emergency release mechanism into my plane, but
the canopy would still be held in by the gas struts. (I installed the
emergency release to make it easier to remove the canopy for
maintainance purposes.) Or can I install removable pins in the mounts
for the gas struts?
--
Tom Sargent - RV-6A
RV_8 Pilot wrote:
>
>Re. opening a canopy in flight.
>
>I feel very confident saying I could easily get a canopy open in almost all
>cases with two of the RV configurations (that would be the slider and tip
>over). But, *getting out* of a spinning, damaged airplane is another story
>entirely.
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | <jimmy(at)jhill.biz> |
Jerry:
Thanks. I was mistaken; what I have is the 680. Guess I just need to
install it.
Jimmy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerry Springer" <jsflyrv(at)earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: RV-List: battery
>
> Don't know about a 580, but I know the 680 spins my O-360 much better
> than the Concorde RGB I had before.
>
> Jerry
>
> jimmy(at)jhill.biz wrote:
>
> >
> >Based upon note I have seen here, I recently bought an Odessey 580
battery for my RV8A, with an IO-360 (200HP) Lyc. The batt is much thinner
than the old G-25.
> >
> >
> >So thin that I wonder if it has enough capacity to handle this engine??
> >What are your experiences with it??
> >
> >Thanks.
> >
> >Jimmy Hill
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________________
| From: | "Bob U." <rv3(at)comcast.net> |
| Subject: | Re: Chutes for RVs |
Michael D Hilger wrote:
>
>
>
>
>>Of course this is all my opinions and others should do as they feel
>>best
>>for them.
>>Jerry
>>
>>
>
>
> Jerry,
>
> How about if you and Bob U both take a pill and let those who are
>interested
>BE interested...
>
> Mike Hilger
> RV-6 N207AM 500 hrs
>
Sorry that you feel this way, Mike...
But, I'm not obliged to write what pleases you or be silent.
That's not what a freedom of speech is about.
If you find my comments not to your liking, control yourself
by not reading what I post, rather than attempting to police
or control me. It's the adult thing to do.
Bob
________________________________________________________________________________
| Subject: | Re: Chutes for RVs |
| From: | Jeff Peltier <jeffpeltier(at)BRSparachutes.com> |
On 12/27/03 5:39 AM, "Bob U." wrote:
>
>
>> Jerry,
>>
>> I agree with most your assessment above and would like to add my two
>> cents worth.
>>
>> 1. I read that the Cirrus that is back flying was a FREAK SAVE. The
>> report I read stated that tree branches or some such broke the fall of
>> the aircraft sufficiently before it hit the ground - if it even hit the
>> ground, allowing the airframe to be reused at practical costs. Other
>> Cirrus deployments were not so 'press-worthy' , it seems.
>>
>> 2. I believe the scenario describing a low wing plane ditching over
>> water is probably the best and safest use of a ballistic chute since my
>> luck would have me landing directly on a flag pole, in busy rush hour
>> traffic, the Indy 500 or being bounced down a mountain slope in 30 knot
>> winds.... provided the seat in an RV can be modified to prevent the
>> occupants from breaking their backs on impact. Using the standard pan
>> used in my RV would be a killer. Dunno if three inches of TEMP-R-FOAM
>> or some such can save my delicate spine and vertebrae so I might swim to
>> shore. [Yes, good judgment would minimize flying outside of gliding
>> distance to shore in the first place, but ya never know what kind of
>> superior fool will fool a foolproof airplane.] ;-)
>>
>> 3. YMMV
>>
>> P.S.
>> Anybody know how the famous Jim Handbury died? I was told his death was
>> caused by a test parachute that tangled in the control surfaces of the
>> aircraft.he was piloting.
>>
> I forgot to add --
> The above only applies if, BIG IF....
> if the ballistic chute can be made to deploy properly and repeatedly in
> the first place. This is hardly a 'given' at this point and I'd hate to
> assume anything that would jeopardize my next 50 years of successful
> flight. :-)
>
> Bob - over 50 years of successful flight
>
>
>
>
>
>
Hi Bob,
The Cirrus save you mention is not considered a "freak" save by any means.
When airplanes are drop tested to determine spinal loads on the occupants,
its done on very hard concrete-virtually anything else is gravy to us. The
trees in that incident also served to pitch the aircraft forward just prior
to touchdown, forcing the nose assembly to absorb virtually all the impact,
not the mains as designed. The fact is that when an in-flight emergency
occurs you can't always dictate where you'll be. What we do know is that
emergencies will occur whether you have a way out or not.
Jim Handbury died while tossing small parachutes out the door of his C150
not while testing ballistic chutes. One of the chutes got hung-up on his
horizontal stabilizer and he was no longer able to control it. He was
wearing a personal safety chute, but didn't quite make it out of the
airplane.
Jeff Peltier
________________________________________________________________________________
December 15, 2003 - December 27, 2003
RV-Archive.digest.vol-oq